Deejo

You do this thing and use it as a gauge. If it becomes apparent the wife you love is perfectly comfortable without any demonstration or reciprocation of love that is meaningful to you, then it is time to consider if this is the person you want as a wife.

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"I figured out they were serious eventually but was thinking it was ridiculous. I wanted to kick them in the balls." - Trenton

This is me

I could have wrote this! I am with you 100%, extremely frustrating. Love is the root of the relationship and having to shut down the expressions of love just to keep it alive for the cold one.

Could this be the opposites attract (hot/cold) and we are just on the extremes of the temps?

This is me

For me this is throwing away 17 years. I remember back to the days when she was the one asking me to say ILY and kiss her straight on the lips. The tables have completely flipped. How did that happen?

Deejo

Depends. Is that where your relationship started?

Odds are there was a catalyst event. Either she came up to your temp to seal the deal, or your need to express love exceeded hers as the relationship progressed. Something in your relationship dynamic shifted, thus shifting her level of engagement, interest in, or attraction to you.

__________________
"I figured out they were serious eventually but was thinking it was ridiculous. I wanted to kick them in the balls." - Trenton

Deejo

You over-delivered and/or under-performed. When is the last time your spouse articulated what she 'needs' from you?

This generally comes about because somehow you feel your spouse slipping away and thus pursue her more ... only to have her pull away even further.

Or ...

You haven't been paying attention to what she has been telling you she needs from her partner. In other words, you haven't been a great husband.

I'm not accusing of one or the other, but those scenarios are generally where the cycle begins.

__________________
"I figured out they were serious eventually but was thinking it was ridiculous. I wanted to kick them in the balls." - Trenton

Deejo

You want things to change? She needs to believe that you are willing to let it go. If she thinks you aren't going anywhere ... why would or should she need to think about her behavior?

This is why the change engine needs to be you. If you expect it to be her ... nothing at all will happen.

__________________
"I figured out they were serious eventually but was thinking it was ridiculous. I wanted to kick them in the balls." - Trenton

AFEH

I think it’s at this point when we begin to turn our love for our wife off. By giving our love, help, support etc. not only aren’t we getting anything positive back we get a whole bundle of pain as well. It’s a double whammy. It is the beginning of the end.

This is me

I think you are on it here. Some of what you said seems to be what has been said and where she is at now. She does not communicate well and I likely do not listen well or pick-up on the signs. She told our MC she was giving me signs, and the MC told her that I am not a mind reader.

The big question is what needs does she have and how can I get her to communicate them to me, so I can understand. She is likely telling everyone but me.

This is me

I have started the 180 this week as stated in other threads. Funny how she wanted to do lunch yesterday and spoon this morning, after I started. Two things she would not have done in months.

Question is what is the balancing act of when to respond and when not to respond to her acts of initiation to make this a good change?

AFEH

You keep doing the 180 until you are certain your are not your wife's Plan B and that you are her Plan A.

This is me

Your words here hit the mark. Before she called for divorce and I started to pick-up on the signs she had changed her role, I directely used the words that "she was not engaged in our marriage" and asked her why. I never got an answer that registered. Now she has very little attraction to me. She would prefer not to have sex, but has. No interest in anything but letting me get some. Does not feel the way it should.

In another thread I talk about this guy she works with that came into the picture last year, who I know she does lunch and coffee with regularly. I am not blaming him as the reason things changed, but she is definitely interested in him by what I have learned. Much taller, over 10 years younger, ex pro-baseball player. She still emails him to do lunch even while we are going to a MC. This will be addressed next week.

This is me

How do I know if I am A or B?

Do I sound like an idiot or what??

This is me

Got it. I think I am understanding this better. I read the list several times a day to remind myself.

This is me

This has been me and I am learning to turn down the heat. The thought of not being with her after all these years is a hard pill to swallow when thinking of being OK without, because that would be not only a painful process, but years of pain after. Not getting any younger.

AFEH

You don’t sound like an idiot, I think you are doing well. I’ve read a little of your story re the coach at lunchtimes? And your wife talking about you and your marriage in negative terms to her sister? That could make the coach your wife’s Plan A and you her Plan B.

If that is the case then your wife will try and keep you on the hook as her Plan B BACKUP.

And it could be that she puts out “stuff” to you like spooning JUST TO KEEP YOU ONSIDE AS HER PLAN B!!! In case her Plan A coach doesn’t work out.

So if you are in 180 you don’t go there with reciprocation UNTIL YOU ARE CERTAIN YOU ARE HER PLAN A.

And of course you tell her that’s exactly what you are doing. In essence, getting on with your life until she’s made her mind up if you are her Plan A or not.