The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R - Page 6 - Talk About Marriage
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post #76 of 194 (permalink) Old 05-26-2011, 12:53 PM
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

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I am right there with you brother. I am guilty of thinking I can't live without my spouse. I am working hard on changing that thinking. Living with this thought makes us weak and makes us put our spouse on a pedestal, which we should not do.
She certainly does not deserve to be on a pedestal. Just need to get my head straight, my courage up and hold true. I am with you!
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post #77 of 194 (permalink) Old 05-26-2011, 12:56 PM
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

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You donít sound like an idiot, I think you are doing well. Iíve read a little of your story re the coach at lunchtimes? And your wife talking about you and your marriage in negative terms to her sister? That could make the coach your wifeís Plan A and you her Plan B.

If that is the case then your wife will try and keep you on the hook as her Plan B BACKUP.

And it could be that she puts out ďstuffĒ to you like spooning JUST TO KEEP YOU ONSIDE AS HER PLAN B!!! In case her Plan A coach doesnít work out.

So if you are in 180 you donít go there with reciprocation UNTIL YOU ARE CERTAIN YOU ARE HER PLAN A.

And of course you tell her thatís exactly what you are doing. In essence, getting on with your life until sheís made her mind up if you are her Plan A or not.

This is helpful. The talk will happen next week. Our MC said he would help me with how to approach this and like you point out, if I am not plan A, than time for me to make a change to my plan A.
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post #78 of 194 (permalink) Old 05-28-2011, 10:58 AM
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

Wow - Quoted For Truth


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You continue to miss the entire point of the exercise. It is exactly about seeing your wife as just a woman ... instead of a perfect woman.

By your own statements, your husband does not love you the way you want to be loved ... for years. You are the hotter partner in your relationship. You experience the same kind of frustration felt by many men that want to love their wives, the way you want to be loved.

It's disheartening to read that you claim to understand this one day, and utterly dismiss it as crap the next.

Everything ISN'T a fitness test. This thread isn't even so much about fitness testing. The irony is ... this thread is for you.
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post #79 of 194 (permalink) Old 06-13-2011, 12:19 AM
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

Wow, what a great thread! Well, it's a great observation about "real" married life. Thanks for the suggestion MEM2020!

I'm hot and my wife is cool. So to make our marriage better (e.g. happier, more fulfilling, more satisfying, more passionate, etc etc), I need to cool down immediately, right? Is there a good guideline for how long I should try this approach? For the last couple of years, I have felt like I'm the only one who's trying to save this marriage. I go out of my way to do whatever it takes to make her realize that I'm a great guy and an even better husband. Why is that in order for us hot ones to win this game, that we have to be so cold with our SO? Why is it that if I cool down that she'll probably snap out of her coolness and come back to me?

I hate this game, but am going to give it a try. I might not play it to a tee, but can definitely give it a shot.

One thing that did happen for me recently. My wife & I have been fighting quite a bit, and she pissed me off really bad the other night. We then had to take my son to his tee-ball game, and I gave her the cold shoulder during the entire thing. I didn't talk to her unless she spoke to me, I didn't look at her, and I gave her no affection whatsoever (hand-holding, mild kisses, etc). I'll tell you that she kept trying to get my attention and then apologized later that night for being a jerk to me. We're still in a very bad rut, but after reading this I realized that this approach may work.

Just not sure how long or how hard I have to play the cold approach with her.
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post #80 of 194 (permalink) Old 06-13-2011, 01:47 AM
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

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Just not sure how long or how hard I have to play the cold approach with her.
I supose that depends on whether
a) she does all the psychological calculations and works out that you're "turning down the temperature" for MEM's reasons; or
b) thinks you're just an uncommunicative f*ckwit.
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post #81 of 194 (permalink) Old 08-09-2011, 09:21 PM
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

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You do this thing and use it as a gauge. If it becomes apparent the wife you love is perfectly comfortable without any demonstration or reciprocation of love that is meaningful to you, then it is time to consider if this is the person you want as a wife.
Nice quote. If it is apparent that one is perfectly happy with a relationship that doesn't involve sexual (meaningful) demonstrations of love, are the only two options really reconsider marriage or an involuntary vow of celibacy?

On another note, what if the H and W are both the cool type, tending to run on the low side of the temp scale? Any good examples of how that might work?
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post #82 of 194 (permalink) Old 08-09-2011, 10:04 PM Thread Starter
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

Just curious - how often do you say "i love you" first? How often does she say it first?

How often do you initiate physical contact? How often does she?

Just as a point of reference. A temperature of zero means NOT doing things that are loving.

This does NOT mean being a jerk, being deliberately inconsiderate or sarcastic. It is not the "presence" of bad behavior. Simply the total absence of loving behavior.

If I did that, and it didn't cause my W acute distress, I would quickly and calmly file. Because I DO need a certain amount of love. I am not needy, but I have needs. And being with someone who is wholly indifferent to my love for them is not acceptable to me. That said, I/She only go into deep freeze mode with each other when we are in the midst of severe conflict which is thankfully rare.

And when we come out of the deep freeze there is always a lot of heat right afterwards. Emotional and sexual. Normal stuff from what I have observed of standard human wiring.

You might want to try some playful friction. I have a LOT of posts on different games my W and I play that escalate to a type of wrestling and that DOES turn her on. Turns her on A LOT. As does a mildly rough, dominant type of sex. She is not into leather or odd clothing/stuff like that. But she doesn't especially like soft gentle sex and I think she is very common in that regard.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Erudite30 View Post
Nice quote. If it is apparent that one is perfectly happy with a relationship that doesn't involve sexual (meaningful) demonstrations of love, are the only two options really reconsider marriage or an involuntary vow of celibacy?

On another note, what if the H and W are both the cool type, tending to run on the low side of the temp scale? Any good examples of how that might work?
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post #83 of 194 (permalink) Old 08-09-2011, 10:13 PM
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

Oh wow...I'm the warm one. he's the cold one.

Although he did say "I love you" last week (I haven't said it since he moved out 5 weeks ago). I was shocked.

He also apologized last week. Strange behaviour.
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post #84 of 194 (permalink) Old 08-11-2011, 08:54 PM
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

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Originally Posted by MEM2020 View Post
Just curious - how often do you say "i love you" first? How often does she say it first?

How often do you initiate physical contact? How often does she?

Just as a point of reference. A temperature of zero means NOT doing things that are loving.

This does NOT mean being a jerk, being deliberately inconsiderate or sarcastic. It is not the "presence" of bad behavior. Simply the total absence of loving behavior.

If I did that, and it didn't cause my W acute distress, I would quickly and calmly file. Because I DO need a certain amount of love. I am not needy, but I have needs. And being with someone who is wholly indifferent to my love for them is not acceptable to me. That said, I/She only go into deep freeze mode with each other when we are in the midst of severe conflict which is thankfully rare.

And when we come out of the deep freeze there is always a lot of heat right afterwards. Emotional and sexual. Normal stuff from what I have observed of standard human wiring.

You might want to try some playful friction. I have a LOT of posts on different games my W and I play that escalate to a type of wrestling and that DOES turn her on. Turns her on A LOT. As does a mildly rough, dominant type of sex. She is not into leather or odd clothing/stuff like that. But she doesn't especially like soft gentle sex and I think she is very common in that regard.
Playful friction sounds like the ticket here.

We both say the "I love you" line first about equally, with her probably initiating it more when in general conversation, such as on the phone, and myself initiating it more when I do something mischievous (cunning pranks, not crossing boundaries). I would say that we are not a temp of zero, rather a temp near 45 F (or approx 7 C), which is slightly higher than a refrigerator.

I definitely initiate physical contact more often, without doubt, but I consciously try to do so without any pressure to go further. A hug here, a slight brush of the hair there. If she responds, then great, if not, then I back off. I have even tried to not initiate touching her for a whole day to see if she will be motivated to demonstrate affection and take initiative. That usually fails to generate the desired outcome.

If and when we ever get to the point of sex... which at this point has not happened since early May, she likes very mild rough sex and generally expects that I will be dominant. I wish there was a lot of heat or passion after we come out of a deep freeze. It is more like, meh, let's try this sex thing and see how it goes. I like to please her and I try to elicit feedback so that I can make adjustments or improvements, but personally I don't think she knows herself well enough to provide decent feedback. How can the sex be "great" if someone doesn't want any?
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post #85 of 194 (permalink) Old 08-11-2011, 09:39 PM Thread Starter
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

True love means:
- I WANT to make you happy, largely because doing so makes ME happy
- I actively avoid doing things that make you unhappy because I feel bad when I cause you distress through my own actions or inaction
- I accept that to LOVE me, you have to respect me and that means I earn respect by (fill in the blank) and DEMAND respect when you are testing my strength of resolve and pushing my boundaries.

When I say I LOVE you - it is truly a compound statement. It means I love WHO you are (your humor and intelligence, honesty and determination, courage and resourcefullness) AND I love how you TREAT me.

If you are treating me poorly I stop saying ILY, because half of the statement is false. And love built on deception is destructive to both people.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Erudite30 View Post
Playful friction sounds like the ticket here.

We both say the "I love you" line first about equally, with her probably initiating it more when in general conversation, such as on the phone, and myself initiating it more when I do something mischievous (cunning pranks, not crossing boundaries). I would say that we are not a temp of zero, rather a temp near 45 F (or approx 7 C), which is slightly higher than a refrigerator.

I definitely initiate physical contact more often, without doubt, but I consciously try to do so without any pressure to go further. A hug here, a slight brush of the hair there. If she responds, then great, if not, then I back off. I have even tried to not initiate touching her for a whole day to see if she will be motivated to demonstrate affection and take initiative. That usually fails to generate the desired outcome.

If and when we ever get to the point of sex... which at this point has not happened since early May, she likes very mild rough sex and generally expects that I will be dominant. I wish there was a lot of heat or passion after we come out of a deep freeze. It is more like, meh, let's try this sex thing and see how it goes. I like to please her and I try to elicit feedback so that I can make adjustments or improvements, but personally I don't think she knows herself well enough to provide decent feedback. How can the sex be "great" if someone doesn't want any?
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post #86 of 194 (permalink) Old 08-12-2011, 07:34 AM
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

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Originally Posted by MEM2020 View Post
True love means:
- I WANT to make you happy, largely because doing so makes ME happy
- I actively avoid doing things that make you unhappy because I feel bad when I cause you distress through my own actions or inaction
- I accept that to LOVE me, you have to respect me and that means I earn respect by (fill in the blank) and DEMAND respect when you are testing my strength of resolve and pushing my boundaries.

When I say I LOVE you - it is truly a compound statement. It means I love WHO you are (your humor and intelligence, honesty and determination, courage and resourcefullness) AND I love how you TREAT me.

If you are treating me poorly I stop saying ILY, because half of the statement is false. And love built on deception is destructive to both people.
MEM2020, very, very well said.

Decide what to be, and go be it. -Avett Brothers.
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post #87 of 194 (permalink) Old 08-12-2011, 06:42 PM Thread Starter
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

Wolf,
It took me a long time to figure this out. You are truly a high functioning "bad boy". Or a "bad boy" with no "dysfunction". Basically makes for the "ideal" H. Your W is very lucky.


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MEM2020, very, very well said.
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post #88 of 194 (permalink) Old 08-12-2011, 07:04 PM
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

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Wolf,
It took me a long time to figure this out. You are truly a high functioning "bad boy". Or a "bad boy" with no "dysfunction". Basically makes for the "ideal" H. Your W is very lucky.
Years ago, I was poking fun concerning one of my wife's former "bad boy" boyfriends, she laughed at that assertion and proceeded to lay out a compelling case that without a doubt I was most notorious of all.


Decide what to be, and go be it. -Avett Brothers.
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post #89 of 194 (permalink) Old 08-13-2011, 01:00 PM
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

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Originally Posted by MEM2020 View Post
True love means:
- I WANT to make you happy, largely because doing so makes ME happy
- I actively avoid doing things that make you unhappy because I feel bad when I cause you distress through my own actions or inaction
- I accept that to LOVE me, you have to respect me and that means I earn respect by (fill in the blank) and DEMAND respect when you are testing my strength of resolve and pushing my boundaries.

When I say I LOVE you - it is truly a compound statement. It means I love WHO you are (your humor and intelligence, honesty and determination, courage and resourcefullness) AND I love how you TREAT me.

If you are treating me poorly I stop saying ILY, because half of the statement is false. And love built on deception is destructive to both people.
True Love?

At this point in time Iím more or less deciding that my stbxw ďhas my heartĒ. Thereís a few reasons. The fact that I feel kind of empty where my heart should be being not the least of them. So I reckon she has it and took it with her.

If thatís true then I either need to grow and look after my own heart, or find another one to adopt! If I do the former, then Iíll be like one of those fish that can take care of themselves. I reckon Iím on the lookout for a new heart. This time itíll be one thatís truly affectionate because I just love hugs and cuddles.
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post #90 of 194 (permalink) Old 08-13-2011, 02:12 PM
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Re: The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

Bob,

You're the prototypical alpha.

You love quite a bit more than the hugs and cuddles.
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