A Personal Epiphany
 Talk About Marriage
  The Marriage Advice and Relationship Help Forums
  right
Forums - Online Counseling - For Therapists - Link to Us - Advertise  

    A Public Forum Provided by The Family & Marriage Counseling Directory
Register FAQ Community Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

The Men's Clubhouse Talk about life's dilemmas.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-23-2011, 05:42 PM   #1 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 19,938
Default A Personal Epiphany

Greetings all,

As you may remember, we're in the reconciliation process. And, we're doing well. We continue to navigate uncharted water in terms of off-limit subjects (that are now routinely discussable) and overall non-hijacked communication.

AFEH speaks often of passive aggression. I've known for a long time that I get a certain amount of pleasure from the suffering of perceived enemies. The German term for this is schadenfreude. Yet, I didn't realize how deep this passive aggression can run... and what sort of acting out results from it.

Then I read MEM's post about the "yes man hubby" who for 18 years was "perfect" for his wife. We all know the profile now. Goes to work everyday. Good father. Sexless marriage. Basically dominated by his wife - dotes on her.

One day, she looks out the window and here he comes on his brand new motorcycle, decked out in leather, a couple of tattoos and a hard-looking biker ***** on the rumble seat.

He flips his wife the bird and hits the road.

She "never knew what happened".

When I read that post, I realized MEM was describing me in my first marriage. Since we don't change all that much without effort, I started looking at myself a bit harder in that area.

Most - if not all - of the angry outbursts I initiate are with someone close to me who I perceive has "taken advantage".

But, realize this, we're talking about one transaction at a time.

I've had the tendency to extend myself, extend myself, and further extend myself to get the "desired outcome" in relationships. Pretty soon, it's unrecognizable in form and I'm basically miserable - and hopping mad.

This is a really interesting type of thing to study in yourself. It becomes "easy" to start saying no where the answer was always "yes' before - because you you realize the ultimate price to be paid by communicating an endless array of yes's.

Believe me, the person asking does NOT want me to take the ball all the way to the one-yard line by myself. Because, at that point the reciprocity I'm hoping for must materialize or the middle finger gets twitchy - if you know what I mean.
Conrad is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 09-23-2011, 05:53 PM   #2 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,725
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

Geesh more than ten words
AFEH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 05:57 PM   #3 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 19,938
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

Quote:
Originally Posted by AFEH View Post
Geesh more than ten words
Had to drag it up from my toes.
Conrad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 06:01 PM   #4 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,725
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

Quote:
Originally Posted by Conrad View Post
Had to drag it up from my toes.
Go for it. Really go for it.
AFEH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 06:01 PM   #5 (permalink)
Forum Supporter
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 5,816
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

Invoke his name and the genie appears.

Turns out there are amplifiers and reducers in this dynamic.

The amplifiers come from being with someone who rapidly and crazily escalates conflict. Because that dynamic looks something like this.
BPD: Does something that is offensive but not gigantic in magnitude
PA: Quietly thinks - I don't like this - and I also do not want WW3 right now. Grits their teeth and says nothing.

Cycle repeats until PA is so angry that they don't care what reaction they get.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Conrad View Post
Greetings all,

As you may remember, we're in the reconciliation process. And, we're doing well. We continue to navigate uncharted water in terms of off-limit subjects (that are now routinely discussable) and overall non-hijacked communication.

AFEH speaks often of passive aggression. I've known for a long time that I get a certain amount of pleasure from the suffering of perceived enemies. The German term for this is schadenfreude. Yet, I didn't realize how deep this passive aggression can run... and what sort of acting out results from it.

Then I read MEM's post about the "yes man hubby" who for 18 years was "perfect" for his wife. We all know the profile now. Goes to work everyday. Good father. Sexless marriage. Basically dominated by his wife - dotes on her.

One day, she looks out the window and here he comes on his brand new motorcycle, decked out in leather, a couple of tattoos and a hard-looking biker ***** on the rumble seat.

He flips his wife the bird and hits the road.

She "never knew what happened".

When I read that post, I realized MEM was describing me in my first marriage. Since we don't change all that much without effort, I started looking at myself a bit harder in that area.

Most - if not all - of the angry outbursts I initiate are with someone close to me who I perceive has "taken advantage".

But, realize this, we're talking about one transaction at a time.

I've had the tendency to extend myself, extend myself, and further extend myself to get the "desired outcome" in relationships. Pretty soon, it's unrecognizable in form and I'm basically miserable - and hopping mad.

This is a really interesting type of thing to study in yourself. It becomes "easy" to start saying no where the answer was always "yes' before - because you you realize the ultimate price to be paid by communicating an endless array of yes's.

Believe me, the person asking does NOT want me to take the ball all the way to the one-yard line by myself. Because, at that point the reciprocity I'm hoping for must materialize or the middle finger gets twitchy - if you know what I mean.
MEM11363 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 06:01 PM   #6 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,725
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

What on earth are you on about? I cannot understand where you are, what it is you are trying to communicate. Conrad buddy all and everyone of your previous posts Iíve understood (at the very least I thought I did). This one I havenít a clue.
AFEH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 06:04 PM   #7 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,725
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

Quote:
Originally Posted by MEM11363 View Post
Cycle repeats until PA is so angry that they don't care what reaction they get.
No. and No again. PA never ever gets that angry. Way too much in control. Like a psychopath.
AFEH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 06:04 PM   #8 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 19,938
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

I think - for guys - this is simply the most difficult part.

We want hot women. We simply do.

Yet, good looking women often learn they can GET you to swallow damned near anything just to get your turn at bat.

So, watch out what you wish for. Get a date with your dream girl - or launch an LTR with her.

One transaction at a time, she will grind you into sawdust.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MEM11363 View Post
Invoke his name and the genie appears.

Turns out there are amplifiers and reducers in this dynamic.

The amplifiers come from being with someone who rapidly and crazily escalates conflict. Because that dynamic looks something like this.
BPD: Does something that is offensive but not gigantic in magnitude
PA: Quietly thinks - I don't like this - and I also do not want WW3 right now. Grits their teeth and says nothing.

Cycle repeats until PA is so angry that they don't care what reaction they get.
Conrad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 06:06 PM   #9 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 19,938
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

MEM,

One last thing.

"PA doesn't care about the reaction he gets"

Damn skippy.

The meanest ugliest fights escalate way out of control once that self-governance goes out the window.

We all know where each other are vulnerable. With the right stimulus, we're capable of laying those soft places bare and ripping them with our teeth.
Conrad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 06:14 PM   #10 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,725
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

Quote:
Originally Posted by Conrad View Post
I've had the tendency to extend myself, extend myself, and further extend myself to get the "desired outcome" in relationships.
Heaven is where someone loves you for who you are. You can be in your own heaven. Love who you are. Everything else follows.
AFEH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 06:16 PM   #11 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 19,938
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

Quote:
Originally Posted by AFEH View Post
Heaven is where someone loves you for who you are. You can be in your own heaven. Love who you are. Everything else follows.
Unlike me, you are coming in loud and clear.

While we never extinguish our "tendencies", we do learn to manage them.

We can also learn to love the stuff about us that is unique and good.
Conrad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 06:18 PM   #12 (permalink)
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,725
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

Feck the PAs in the world.
AFEH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 06:21 PM   #13 (permalink)
Member
 
Therealbrighteyes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Texas
Posts: 6,538
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

I always wished you posted a response to my thread "What would your spouse say about you" or in your case, your ex. I think if you were able to understand the other side if you will, you could learn a lot about yourself. The anger would subside and real change would be made.
I asked my husband what he thought about me and it was eye opening. I have often believed I somehow got screwed but the reality is, I contributed to it but instead I pointed my finger at him as the sole cause. Gently here, I think you have a similar tendency. AFEH, I think you do as well. Again very gently here as I was/am in the same boat. It is somewhat cathartic to look within and see the things I need to change. If my marriage doesn't work out, at least I have a pretty clear idea of myself.
Feel free to flip me that twitchy finger.
Therealbrighteyes is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 06:22 PM   #14 (permalink)
Member
 
Enchantment's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 2,354
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

Quote:
Originally Posted by Conrad View Post
I think - for guys - this is simply the most difficult part.

We want hot women. We simply do.

Yet, good looking women often learn they can GET you to swallow damned near anything just to get your turn at bat.

So, watch out what you wish for. Get a date with your dream girl - or launch an LTR with her.

One transaction at a time, she will grind you into sawdust.
You are limiting yourself by not looking at the beauty WITHIN a person.

Beauty is not in the face; beauty is a light in the heart.” ~ Kahlil Gibran
__________________
Enter these enchanted woods, You who dare. ~ George Meredith
Enchantment is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2011, 06:24 PM   #15 (permalink)
Member
 
LovesHerMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,339
Default Re: A Personal Epiphany

Conrad:

I think I know exactly what you are saying. For years you did everything that you thought you should to get love and respect from your wife. But you were being the martyr and victim, and people cannot do that for very long without exploding.

Now you know that you should communicate your needs. Call her out when she does something that offends you. Work together to solve problems rather than do everything yourself.
LovesHerMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Epiphany slater Coping with Infidelity 5 05-08-2012 09:34 AM
Small Epiphany Traggy Going Through Divorce or Separation 5 03-09-2012 12:48 PM
Epiphany lastinline General Relationship Discussion 1 11-29-2009 01:27 PM
An Epiphany SaxonMan General Relationship Discussion 12 06-05-2009 07:35 PM

Member Area

Find a Therapist:


Sponsor Ads





Get The Family & Marriage Counseling Directory Help Guide via Email:
Name:
Email:




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:26 AM.



Copyright 2007 - 2013 © Talk About Marriage