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Old 12-09-2011, 10:45 AM   #106 (permalink)
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Ouch. A step back for sure. In a cool and calm tone, ask her why she is changing what you as a couple agreed upon, then let her talk. When she is done, I would say "I am disappointed that you changed our agreement without even talking to me about it. I will need to think about this." Then walk away and think about it. This will give you time to process what she said and decide how to react. It will also give her time to process the your statement.
Do you think it was unreasonable? After all we did have sex this week. The schedule is loosely based on the idea of sex once a week.

But we did put the heart on Thursday after hinting that we would have sex Tuesday, so surly there was some understanding that it would still happen. She said she didn't realized that that was how it was going to be.

In hindsight, I wish I hadn't said anything. I should have just taken her. That was the point. No suggesting or hinting just doing it. If I come back now and talk to her about it, it seems like it will come across as needy and pathetic.

She came to bed with her bathrobe on (not a sexy robe, I mean an old, thick bathrobe) so it's not like she was sending signals that she really wanted me to be aggressive.

Last edited by BALANCE; 12-09-2011 at 11:03 AM.
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Old 12-09-2011, 10:55 AM   #107 (permalink)
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So here is where the "Nice Guy" thinking starts to hit me.

I feel hurt and disappointed that we just crossed off one of our sex nights.

But tonight is date night, so maybe if we have some wine, maybe do some figure drawing, listen to the music she likes etc. She'll want to have sex tonight.

I like doing those things too and setting the mood can't hurt but in the end I think it would be better to talk to her instead of just hoping if I do the right things tonight she will automatically want to meet my needs.

Geez, I'm such a freaking screw-up!

Last edited by BALANCE; 12-09-2011 at 10:59 AM.
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Old 12-09-2011, 11:20 AM   #108 (permalink)
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Do you think it was unreasonable? After all we did have sex this week. The schedule is loosely based on the idea of sex once a week.

But we did put the heart on Thursday after hinting that we would have sex Tuesday, so surly there was some understanding that it would still happen. She said she didn't realized that that was how it was going to be.
I tend not to believe her. If she felt that, why did she put that heart up in the first place, or why not cross it out right away. I suspect she did not want to have sex and is rationalizing her way there. I think you are reasonable to call her on implying one thing then changing in mid-stream.

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In hindsight, I wish I hadn't said anything. I should have just taken her. That was the point. No suggesting or hinting just doing it. If I come back now and talk to her about it, it seems like it will come across as needy and pathetic.
This probably would have been the best tactic. But you didn't, so work from where you are. I suggested raising it as I did because it was short, clearly indicated where you were coming from, and let her do the talking. You ask her a question, state your concern, then walk away. No begging pleading etc. In a normal relationship, you disengage a bit, but I am not sure that is best for you. You probably need to make that determination.

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She came to bed with her bathrobe on (not a sexy robe, I mean an old, thick bathrobe) so it's not like she was sending signals that she really wanted me to be aggressive.
Perhaps. Or maybe she was testing to make you pursue her. As I noted, you need to pursue her before you get to the bedroom.
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Old 12-09-2011, 11:25 AM   #109 (permalink)
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So here is where the "Nice Guy" thinking starts to hit me.

I feel hurt and disappointed that we just crossed off one of our sex nights.

But tonight is date night, so maybe if we have some wine, maybe do some figure drawing, listen to the music she likes etc. She'll want to have sex tonight.

I like doing those things too and setting the mood can't hurt but in the end I think it would be better to talk to her instead of just hoping if I do the right things tonight she will automatically want to meet my needs.

Geez, I'm such a freaking screw-up!
You are doing fine until the last thought. Go into date night assuming that you will not have sex. Then go and have fun. Practice flirting with her, touching her, trying to turn her on. Check out the indicators of interest and figure out what works on her and what does not. Pay attention to her, but assume that nothing will happen. You will be much more confident when you are not concerned over how things are progressing.
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Old 12-12-2011, 11:25 AM   #110 (permalink)
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I have attached an article for you entitled "when a Woman Isn't In the Mood". Let you wife read this. I think it does a good job laying out the reason sex is a need for men.
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File Type: doc When a Woman Isn't In The Mood.doc (41.5 KB, 174 views)
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Old 12-12-2011, 01:28 PM   #111 (permalink)
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I have attached an article for you entitled "when a Woman Isn't In the Mood". Let you wife read this. I think it does a good job laying out the reason sex is a need for men.
Thank you. It is a very easy, straightforward read. Unfortunately I doubt my wife would take it to heart. It's, basically, just another guy saying how important sex is. She's heard that song before.

But, I'll let her read and see what she thinks about it. Are there any women on here that have read this article? Did it mean anything to you or change your perspective any?
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Old 12-12-2011, 01:48 PM   #112 (permalink)
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BALANCE - Is giving up on the table for you yet?

From what I see, you are in this death cycle where you try to make change happen, get agreements from her she has on intention of keeping, and get a sh*t load of hope invested in getting laid, when you and I both know the chance of sex, especial sex that she's excited and fully present for, even when scheduled, is very low.

Why keep pushing it? She's doesn't want to be sexual with you. Personally, I'd just stop trying and prepare to move on. The path you are on does not work. Sorry.
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Old 12-12-2011, 02:09 PM   #113 (permalink)
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BALANCE - Is giving up on the table for you yet?

From what I see, you are in this death cycle where you try to make change happen, get agreements from her she has on intention of keeping, and get a sh*t load of hope invested in getting laid, when you and I both know the chance of sex, especial sex that she's excited and fully present for, even when scheduled, is very low.

Why keep pushing it? She's doesn't want to be sexual with you. Personally, I'd just stop trying and prepare to move on. The path you are on does not work. Sorry.
I tend to agree about the schedule stuff. I took the approach of putting the whole thing in my wife's lap. I told her I am not acceptable to a sexless marriage and when she is ready I'd love to have sex with her. I told her I would "try" once per week so that all other times she can relax and just enjoy my non-sexual touch. My wife is responding really well to this arrangement it in essence puts her in charge of changing her mind and falling back in love with me.. I told her if she cannot create a normal healthy sexual marriage with me she needs to divorce me or I will eventually totally disconnect from her and we will both waste many of our best years in the process... I told her to set a date in her mind to work it out. Its all on her..she disconnected not me.

So far she has been buying new artwork for our house and re-decorating I think I know what decision she made . Soon her and I will have sex when she is ready. She is willingly accepting any and all non-sexual touch. She is laughing and giggling. Your wife is probably building new resentment in your schedule arrangement you might want to re-think it.

Last edited by Trying2figureitout; 12-12-2011 at 02:15 PM.
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Old 12-12-2011, 02:12 PM   #114 (permalink)
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Thank you. It is a very easy, straightforward read. Unfortunately I doubt my wife would take it to heart. It's, basically, just another guy saying how important sex is. She's heard that song before.

But, I'll let her read and see what she thinks about it. Are there any women on here that have read this article? Did it mean anything to you or change your perspective any?
I'd be surprised if a jaded woman read it and changed her mind, even if most men would agree with it. I can't see how that wouldn't make sex feel like an obligation, like you would feel if your wife nagged you to do some asinine chore she deemed important. Maybe you'll get sex that way but it probably won't be intimate.

I want my wife to WANT to have sex with me, it's not enjoyable for me otherwise. I want my wife to do it because she's interested in meeting my needs and is looking for a show of intimacy.
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Old 12-12-2011, 03:24 PM   #115 (permalink)
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I want my wife to WANT to have sex with me, it's not enjoyable for me otherwise. I want my wife to do it because she's interested in meeting my needs and is looking for a show of intimacy.
Yeah, I doubt handing her an article about why sex is important to men will have any real affect on her. I don't think that scheduled sex is the best long term solution either but it's a tool to help us reconnect regularly.

I can't force her to want me, I can't force her to love me. Once that's gone is it gone for good?
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Old 12-12-2011, 03:56 PM   #116 (permalink)
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I want my wife to WANT to have sex with me, it's not enjoyable for me otherwise. I want my wife to do it because she's interested in meeting my needs and is looking for a show of intimacy.
Sure I want my wife to want me, and she does, but there are times that she is not thinking about wanting me sexually until I start. She may not even feel like having an orgasm, but nine times out of ten, she ends up into it and having one. I have no doubt that she starts out of "duty" and ends out of "horny". After reading MMSL I have decided not to wait on her being in the mood. I am going to initiate. If she wants an orgasm, great. If she wants to let me go ahead, I'll take it.
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The marriage bed must be a place of mutuality—the husband seeking to satisfy his wife, the wife seeking to satisfy her husband. Marriage is not a place to "stand up for your rights." Marriage is a decision to serve the other, whether in bed or out. 1 Corinthians 7:2 (The Message)
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Old 12-12-2011, 04:11 PM   #117 (permalink)
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Yeah, I doubt handing her an article about why sex is important to men will have any real affect on her. I don't think that scheduled sex is the best long term solution either but it's a tool to help us reconnect regularly.

I can't force her to want me, I can't force her to love me. Once that's gone is it gone for good?
I am proof that the answer to that is a "Hell NO!"

Not sure if I said it in this thread but my wife during her affair mentioned to her EA partner and some friends that she was not physically attracted to me at all. The day after d-day she was telling me how sexy and irresistible I was and how dumb she had been for not realizing it.

Attraction for a female is a very emotional thing. If she's hating you, she's not attracted to you. If you're in her good graces, she'll want to jump you no matter how you look. I certainly didn't lose any weight or dress differently in the 48 hours she went from one extreme to the other.

You need to win her back, and I think you're on the right track. I'm going to assume that your little sex episode from earlier was legit from her end and she wanted you for that time. Proof that what you're doing is working and you just need some time to rekindle the passion.
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Old 12-12-2011, 04:21 PM   #118 (permalink)
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I am proof that the answer to that is a "Hell NO!"

Not sure if I said it in this thread but my wife during her affair mentioned to her EA partner and some friends that she was not physically attracted to me at all. The day after d-day she was telling me how sexy and irresistible I was and how dumb she had been for not realizing it.

Attraction for a female is a very emotional thing. If she's hating you, she's not attracted to you. If you're in her good graces, she'll want to jump you no matter how you look. I certainly didn't lose any weight or dress differently in the 48 hours she went from one extreme to the other.

You need to win her back, and I think you're on the right track. I'm going to assume that your little sex episode from earlier was legit from her end and she wanted you for that time. Proof that what you're doing is working and you just need some time to rekindle the passion.



It's ALL emotions with our wives... if they aren't seeing you as a positive the last thing they want is to have sex with you. I am thinking of my sexless period as one big freaking huge foreplay until she eventually wants to jump my bones again... everyday is a step closer. Every encounter a step closer. She is getting there because I'm courting her again.
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Old 12-14-2011, 09:26 AM   #119 (permalink)
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So we had our weakly talk last night. Maybe not as nice of a talk as the last two weeks but important things were shared.

First the good news.

She said that she would like to move past the bitterness and resentment and I don't think she was just saying that. I think she really might be letting that stuff go, at least to some extent.

She scheduled an appointment with the counselor for Thursday night.

She did some personal reading online about dealing with hurt and heartbrokenness (She has rarely shown this type of initiative.)

She is wearing her wedding ring again.

Now the "bad" news.

There does seem to be one major issue that she can't seem to deal with. And it does fit the timeline of when things started to go downhill for us.

When to have kids.

When we had our second child I talked about being done. She wanted more (This would have been around the time we started MC for the first time). The circumstances surrounding the birth of our second child were a little traumatic (as in, I "delivered" her in the backseat of our car) so it took me some time, but eventually I felt ready to have another baby.

Then once we had our third child I also talked about being done. (This would have been two years ago). Our relationship was still a little rocky and we didn't have the insurance for it so it seemed unwise. She said she just can't deal with me always talking about not wanting more kids only to change my mind later. It has, apparently, broken her heart.

Not really sure how to proceed with this. I don't really feel like I did anything ethically wrong. I can't change the things I said. We ended up with three beautiful children. But she is devastated. Where do I go from here?
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Old 12-14-2011, 09:31 AM   #120 (permalink)
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So we had our weakly talk last night. Maybe not as nice of a talk as the last two weeks but important things were shared.

First the good news.

She said that she would like to move past the bitterness and resentment and I don't think she was just saying that. I think she really might be letting that stuff go, at least to some extent.

She scheduled an appointment with the counselor for Thursday night.

She did some personal reading online about dealing with hurt and heartbrokenness (She has rarely shown this type of initiative.)

She is wearing her wedding ring again.

Now the "bad" news.

There does seem to be one major issue that she can't seem to deal with. And it does fit the timeline of when things started to go downhill for us.

When to have kids.

When we had our second child I talked about being done. She wanted more (This would have been around the time we started MC for the first time). The circumstances surrounding the birth of our second child were a little traumatic (as in, I "delivered" her in the backseat of our car) so it took me some time, but eventually I felt ready to have another baby.

Then once we had our third child I also talked about being done. (This would have been two years ago). Our relationship was still a little rocky and we didn't have the insurance for it so it seemed unwise. She said she just can't deal with me always talking about not wanting more kids only to change my mind later. It has, apparently, broken her heart.

Not really sure how to proceed with this. I don't really feel like I did anything ethically wrong. I can't change the things I said. We ended up with three beautiful children. But she is devastated. Where do I go from here?
Can you explain a bit more why she is devastated over your talking about being done with children? Does she want more? Think that means you don't love your third child? Think you are toying with her?

The rest of your discussion seems promising.
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