I attended a recent therapy session with my wife. We started weekly counseling months ago, but after three sessions, the therapist said that she really needed to work one on one with my wife for a while.
So, I went to this session because I had called the therapist, asking for some time. She brought up an article describing how, from a man's POV, its critical for men to be treated as a close friend of their wife if the marriage is able to survive. That was news to my wife, and it was a light-bulb moment for me.
Keep in mind, I'm not talking about the sex life (which is okay), affirmation, praise, etc. I'm talking about someone who treats you like a friend. Think about it. Friendship in marriage means: Wants to see you succeed independently of the marriage. Would get up early to cook a special breakfast just to surprise you. Prefers time with you on a regular basis for talking, laughing, etc - not just to have her needs met. Treats you with kindness when you are sick. Just wants to enjoy time together, outside of feeling like the time together is completely devoted to having her needs met. I realized that I've always gone overboard in this sense, hoping my wife would catch on. Yes, we've done the love languages and needs sessions about half a dozen times through the years. My wife really means well, but she is incredibly insecure. She realizes that she had many resentment issues in the past, but said that she wanted to fix these issues that led up to us almost divorcing. We've been married 24 years.
I'm curious about how important other men consider this to be? Do you think you have this type of relationship, as a man? What are your additional thoughts about what is important in the friendship side of the relationship? I understand that some people are in a situation where sex is a bigger unmet need, so maybe it will be hard to seperate the two issues. The therapist wants to pursue it in depth in later sessions, but I realize that for some reason, I can barely put the whole concept into words (as you can probably tell).
I can tell you wife and are best friends yet the sex is the issue. My wife has no really good close friends.... neither do I. So by default we are each others best friend. Our friendship makes sexlessness less horrible.
I believe that the friendship part of our marriage is important.
We talk, we listen, we laugh, we have fun, and we enjoy each other’s company. That to me is friendship.
But it does not complete our marriage. I also desire a wife/partner.
That part of our marriage comes down to wanting her to respect me, admire me, build me up in place of tearing me down, cherish me and our marriage, love me, and support me through thick and thin.
It comes down to our wedding vows. Love, honor, cherish, in sickness and in health, through good times and bad. You get the idea!
I have found that the best way for me to receive these things from my wife, is to first, give them!
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Re: Friendship - How Important?
Friendship was a big part of our reconciliation. While there were many issues, the EA, trust, no sex and emotional walls... my wife and I remained good friends. This friendship quickly redeveloped after D-Day and was part of what held us together during the very rough patches we were about to face. Today we are still fast friends and greatly enjoy each other's company, sense of humors and just hanging out. She enjoys watching football with me just as I enjoy watching Iron Chef with her. We pal around and have developed common interests. While friendship is important in the relationship, we can't let it supersede the romance, passion, empathy, trust and all the there aspects that make up the glue of the marriage.
I believe that the friendship part of our marriage is important.
We talk, we listen, we laugh, we have fun, and we enjoy each other’s company. That to me is friendship.
But it does not complete our marriage. I also desire a wife/partner.
That part of our marriage comes down to wanting her to respect me, admire me, build me up in place of tearing me down, cherish me and our marriage, love me, and support me through thick and thin.
It comes down to our wedding vows. Love, honor, cherish, in sickness and in health, through good times and bad. You get the idea!
I have found that the best way for me to receive these things from my wife, is to first, give them!
Thats my thought?
Thanks for explaining it so well. Unfortunately, she even acknowledges that part of the problem was that I was pretty extreme in treating her this way, so she just more or less came to take it for granted. In her mindset, the man carries most of the responsibility for engaging. Now, she's more open to the idea of sharing reponsibility, but thinks she'll just fail.
Friendship was a big part of our reconciliation. While there were many issues, the EA, trust, no sex and emotional walls... my wife and I remained good friends. This friendship quickly redeveloped after D-Day and was part of what held us together during the very rough patches we were about to face. Today we are still fast friends and greatly enjoy each other's company, sense of humors and just hanging out. She enjoys watching football with me just as I enjoy watching Iron Chef with her. We pal around and have developed common interests. While friendship is important in the relationship, we can't let it supersede the romance, passion, empathy, trust and all the there aspects that make up the glue of the marriage.
Good thread to start H.
Amp, this is the type of relationship I really crave. Thanks for sharing. Its hard to explain, but she told the therapist that she feels like a failure in so many things that she just accepted failure. I was good in the cheerleading side, I think, but not in pressing mutual accountablity. Its hard to blame her when I didn't make the needs very clear, and her mom always told her that men only needed sex.
You want to understand him and you want him to understand you. And you feel wonderful if he understands you!
You feel comfortable around him. In front of him, you are transparent. You want to spend time with him together, because time with him is enjoyable.
I view my husband the only one who can understand me. And I know that my husband only trusts me.
People might think that a couple who are like close friends may not have good sex life. I don't understand where that comes from. My husband and I have wonderful sex life. He is the only person I want to have sex with. I don't confuse him with a friend. To me, he is my husband, and he is my friend.
Wow - this has been a great thread to read. THe friendship bit is extremely important. In my marriage, the sex has been fine, but the friendship part has gone away completely. I'm discovering that she has some true narcissitic tendencies (her father is full blow) and that the building up, doing small things just to be nice, etc are non-existent. Duty-type stuff is there (dinner for the kids) - but none of just plain ole fun. Nada! Trust has been eroded too for various reasons. I'll be reading this thread closely. Thanks for raising the topic.
You want to understand him and you want him to understand you. And you feel wonderful if he understands you!
You feel comfortable around him. In front of him, you are transparent. You want to spend time with him together, because time with him is enjoyable.
I view my husband the only one who can understand me. And I know that my husband only trusts me.
People might think that a couple who are like close friends may not have good sex life. I don't understand where that comes from. My husband and I have wonderful sex life. He is the only person I want to have sex with. I don't confuse him with a friend. To me, he is my husband, and he is my friend.
You bring up a really good point, GP. See, I think the issue that affects me is that my wife would agree with what you wrote, but wasn't comfortable in 'treating' me like a friend. Its about the things you say and do. I don't want people to think she's a bad person. She has a very serious bipolar depression disorder, and tends to feel like a failure much of the time. Through the years, experimenting with antidepressents tips her into a suicidal thought mode. This spectrum disorder can't be treated with these meds, apparently. So, instead of expecting her to be mature and responsible, I always just 'put it off'. She tentatively just waits until she is 100% comfortable in going out on a limb, so to speak, but it never comes. For some reason, she's able to completely open up with siblings and parents, even some friends. I made a mistake in pretending to be a person with no needs. She and her family call me a force of nature, but I'm just a guy. Hope that makes sense.
Thanks for explaining it so well. Unfortunately, she even acknowledges that part of the problem was that I was pretty extreme in treating her this way, so she just more or less came to take it for granted. In her mindset, the man carries most of the responsibility for engaging. Now, she's more open to the idea of sharing reponsibility, but thinks she'll just fail.
I hear ya!
That comes down to boundries, expectations, and communication. A desire for MUTUAL happiness.
If you have given all of these things and she has taken them for granted, there is nothing wrong with comming back and expressing that they are not free, they are earned.
She may fear failure, but that is where you as a husband can show "leadership", You support her, you guide her, you give her strength through yours, and you praise her every small step forward.
For example: Look at the bright side, she is going to MC, that is a step in the right direction, it's an effort, its a sign that she is open to change. Appriciate it, let her know that although you both have work to do, you appriciate that she is willing to try.
...I will answer for my husband... I know when we met, I quickly became his BEST friend in this world , and he mine. Many may feel that takes away from the Passion & butterflys somehow, and maybe it does?? ....but every word you uttered here...
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Friendship in marriage means: Wants to see you succeed independently of the marriage. Would get up early to cook a special breakfast just to surprise you. Prefers time with you on a regular basis for talking, laughing, etc - not just to have her needs met. Treats you with kindness when you are sick. Just wants to enjoy time together, outside of feeling like the time together is completely devoted to having her needs met......
How very TRUE all of that IS. The stuff about "wanting" to spend time together, just doing anything, even nothing -that is how we are. It is all about -just enjoying being together. Makes every trip worthwhile.
Friendship is essential, I can not even imagine a marraige without your spouse being your very closest dearest friend, the one we think of 1st, who we run too too with every care, every hurt, every overflowing excitement. I can't even imagine a marraige without that happening, it would make little sense to me. It would bother me tremendously if that was NOT the case, I would climb a mountain to get that back......it would seem more like a "partnership" somehow.
Love what GreenPearl said - 100% agree !
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I made a mistake in pretending to be a person with no needs
...Yes, a mistake, many women LIKE to feel NEEDED. I am like that .... I don't think there is anything wrong with that, we ALL want to feel we can "DO" for our husbands, this gives us delight. If you take this away from us, we likely will feel MORE NEEDY against your strong independent bronze demeaner...
Your wife has Bipolar , this throws a monkey wrench into the normal flow of things though. I wonder if those friends /family she "opens" up too - I wonder if they too are looked upon as more "needy" souls , I guess a needy soul will be more able to open up to another needy soul.... it helps them relate. I think that might make sense. If I felt someone had it "all together" and was near perfect, I would be much less likely to spill my guts , my faults & struggles at their feet.
Halien, maybe think on this for a while. You mention your wife is resentful (she wants to get through it, good). Embittered, resentful people persecute and punish by way of getting their revenge. That’s what they do. So your wife could not (and cannot) be your friend while at the same time persecute and punish you because that’s not what friends do.
Halien, maybe think on this for a while. You mention your wife is resentful (she wants to get through it, good). Embittered, resentful people persecute and punish by way of getting their revenge. That’s what they do. So your wife could not (and cannot) be your friend while at the same time persecute and punish you because that’s not what friends do.
I hear you. This is exactly why I keep coming back to the issue of friendship since it came up. On the one hand, my wife is pouring her heart into therapy - reading books and studying. But on the other, she says that she thinks she will fail unless I first treat her like I did in the past first. Through some PMs, TRBE has offered feedback on how to put some of this in perspective on how a woman might struggle through these conflicting emotions (thank you, TRBE!), but I still sometimes wonder if I make the whole thing of friendship into a bigger deal than some guys would. Our mariage therapist offered validation that maybe I wasn't just being abnormal in wanting this.
Thats what happens in my marriage too. Exactly the same things, except my wife is not bipolar. We been together 14 years married 4. Before we got married everything was great, we were really good friends, she would express interests in my hobbies, and I would do what ever makes her happy. Her parents call me force of nature too. We just finished reading 5 languages of love, His Needs Her Needs.
My primary love language is Quality Time. Since our son was born 4 years ago we haven't been on any vacation just two us. We didn't even spend weekend just two of us. She doesn't want to do anything with my hobbies anymore, at the same time I still do what makes her happy. I think friendship is very important. The way I see it: Friendship leads to intimate/physical touch and that leads to great sex. Without that, sex is meanness to me at least now, because she refuse to talk to me for over a month.
Friendship - How Important? 
