Logically how can love exist? - Page 3 - Talk About Marriage
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post #31 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-09-2017, 01:23 PM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

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It's when he KNOWS she is getting in deep and wants what he is not sure he wants.. he should come forth with honesty.. I always KNEW I wanted the marrying type.. if a guy wasn't this. I would not want to waste my time.. but true.. today, fewer & fewer women care.
Or maybe they do not think they can get it?

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #32 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-09-2017, 01:27 PM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

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Or maybe they do not think they can get it?
Get what ?? not following...
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post #33 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-09-2017, 01:31 PM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

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Get what ?? not following...
Get a family man, someone who will prioritize her and the children.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #34 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-09-2017, 01:31 PM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

Based on what you said, I would suggest not being together with your girl friend. Women want security and it looks like this is not where you're headed. You want to live your passions at the expense of a job a financial security. You're lucky, I wish I could do the same. I'm sick of working and would so much like to quit and no longer worry about having to make money. If your hobbies and passions are enough for you, I'm not sure a woman would fit in. She would constantly be looking for security you don't want to give.

"I've paid double for every transgression I've ever made and that motel and that boat are little to ask for"
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post #35 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-09-2017, 01:50 PM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

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It's when he KNOWS she is getting in deep and wants what he is not sure he wants.. he should come forth with honesty.. I always KNEW I wanted the marrying type.. if a guy wasn't this. I would not want to waste my time.. but true.. today, fewer & fewer women care.


I don't think they necessarily don't care, it's just that one can make all kinds of promises, in order to get whatever one wants and then not keep them...or vice versa. We often change our minds as well. I think the "take it easy & see how it goes" is not the worst approach when it comes to relationships and it's easy on everyone. It's also fairly easy to figure out quite soon into the relationship what you are dealing with.
Also some women like to be "the one" to get their man to drop all their life's ambitions and hobbies just for them...If he tells her, who says she won't find it sexy?


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post #36 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-09-2017, 02:11 PM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

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True, guess I also doubt her "non-materialism", all I have is words and some action at the moment and although she has earned some benefit of the doubt, trust is not fully established. It's going to be ups and downs, even my first business didn't come without cost to my marriage, 84 hour work weeks and I didn't have time for her, and the only time I could squeeze was for our daughter. I don't know what the future will hold but I'm certain of sacrifices. She's a very simple lady, and she has been sheltered, so I question her strength as well.

My plan Bs are to sustain the downtimes of plan A, but not to sustain myself long-term and definitely not to provide for a family again, I don't have unlimited properties to sell. I'm willing to risk going broke and bankrupt to pursue my dreams, but for that... well, I guess that's another reason why girlfriend feels like a burden to me.
My impression is that you are projecting all of your own doubts and insecurities onto your gf. If you don't want a gf, fine, don't have one. If you want to push the one you have away because she isn't going to pass every ridiculous test you throw at her, then by all means, push her away.

But all this "woe is me because I have to be an x, y, z type of man in order to have a relationship" is all absolutely your own baggage, not hers.
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post #37 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-09-2017, 02:48 PM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

RD, why for the love of God WHY???? do you keep torturing yourself like this????

You have been looking for reasons to break up with this woman almost as soon as you went from FWB or whatever it was, to boyfriend/girlfriend, despite the fact that she's managed to pass all of your crazy "tests." She sounds like an amazing woman, a woman of character. But you know she wants kids, and you don't want any more kids. Have you talked to her about THAT yet? That's a much bigger problem, Dude.

She's a good woman who has passed your materialistic tests. So she won't care that your income is reduced. A good woman will want your love, time, and attention. Notice how money isn't on that list? She will support you if this is really your dream and your ambition. You're young. Your income level will catch up again, after your education and a few years into your new career. (BTW, I think it's AWESOME that you want to go back to school. Seriously, I am super proud of you.) Even if you can't spend as MUCH time with her as she would like, as long as it is quality time, she will be understanding of that because that is what it means to support you in this new venture.

If you can't appreciate the love and support of a really good woman, and instead view her as a burden, then you need to let her go. Because she's not the one for you, no matter how amazing she is. If you are going to view her as a burden, rather than the joy and respite from the world that a partner should be, then you don't deserve her. Yeah, I said it.

You. Don't. Deserve. Her.

Why? Because YOUR choice, if you stay in a relationship with this woman, means that SHE will have to make sacrifices of her own in order to make sure that YOU get to live out your dreams and goals. You didn't factor her into the decision making process. It sounds like you didn't consult her. You decided that this is what you want and this is what you are going to do. But your decisions affect her, because she is your girlfriend. But you didn't really think about that. All you're thinking of is how much of a BURDEN she will be while you are trying to live our your dreams.

If you really loved this woman, if you have any real intentions of having a future with her, you would have factored her into the decision making process. You would have asked her opinion. She would have a place in your dreams for the future. But that wasn't the case. If you don't see her as a part of your dreams for your life, if you don't see her as a part of your future, you need to let her go, because she deserves a man and partner who will look at her and think, this is the woman I want by my side as I work towards my goals, the woman who will catch me if I fail or falter in my steps, the woman with whom I want to share the fruits of my labor.

Let this poor woman go, so she has a chance to find a man who's deserving of her. If you don't want to let her go, then you need to start being the type of many who deserves a woman like her.

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post #38 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-09-2017, 04:53 PM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

Have I missed a post where it was indicated that she needs to settle down with him & have a family together etc?
Why is there an assumption that every woman wants the same thing?
Many women are perfectly happy to be "just" girlfriends and share each others company.
Many men have also changed their attitudes over their life times (I met a few die-hard bachelors who later became caring and devoted husbands/fathers etc), depending on the circumstances and depending on the people they met.

I have a different question for the OP: where is the value in keeping all your experiences to yourself and grow old alone?
I am in my mid-thirties and I also made enough so that work is completely optional for me. (I continue working because I enjoy it and because I want to be a good role model for my kids but if I stopped working tomorrow, me and my family would still be taken care of, from the income generated from my investments). I would dread at the prospect of spending the rest of my life alone-ish, surrounded only with my "precious" hobbies. It might be suitable for some people, it would not be for me. I can see the attraction of "freedom" in principle: but I can guarantee the novelty of this will wear off very quickly and then what?
In my opinion the concept of freedom is partly an illusion and money can only buy some of it and up to a point. You need to have enough so that you are not miserable but after a certain point, the increase in happiness is not proportional anymore to the increase in wealth and there is MUCH more long-lasting value in the people you surround yourself with, rather than more material things.

From OP's post it's fairly clear that he met someone he wants to try and be with but for some reason, decided it is more "rational" not to, because he is afraid his freedom may be compromised. I don't really follow the logic and don't see why small steps at a time will compromise his new-found sense of freedom or contradict the goals that his gf may or may not have (of which we know nothing about).

Last edited by inmyprime; 01-09-2017 at 05:19 PM.
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post #39 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-09-2017, 05:29 PM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

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Guess I'm just cold as ice nowadays
Nope, you are in turmoil.

Your post history, including this thread, says the opposite. I know cold people, you aren't even in the same freezer.
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post #40 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-10-2017, 12:20 AM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

@inmyprime The OP has mentioned this girlfriend on other threads, FYI. That's where I'm pulling all this info from.

ETA Trust me, there's a lot more to this iceberg than what he's posted in the original post. He's not intentionally leaving info out, he just tends to compartmentalize when he should be connecting the dots.

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post #41 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-10-2017, 12:29 AM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

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Nope, you are in turmoil.

Your post history, including this thread, says the opposite. I know cold people, you aren't even in the same freezer.
Agree, agree, agree.

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post #42 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-10-2017, 04:43 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

Nope, you're right, I don't deserve her. Quite frankly I don't even know what I'm doing. Everyday... "what are you doing", "can I call?", "did you eat?", "thinking of you", "miss you", should be a good thing right? I used to appreciate it once, words of affirmation from a spouse, somehow I'm rotted to the core that it flies by me like I'm a ghost. I'm not like this with my daughter or my cat or my mates.

I want to start a new life, a new mountain to climb, even if I have to get down the first one, money means **** to me, it's always been a means to an end, and now I don't have to worry about it anymore - unless of course, I end up with a new family, and it's all going to happen again! No way! Argh! And she knows all this, she knows my reservations, I've never lied to her, I've also been completely transparent with her with my plans, my feelings (or lack of), and my thoughts, and she's holding on, she's following me everywhere. She admits she enjoys the challenge. And I am curious as to what she's going to try to pull - but I'm only taking a peek while she wants to pull me into the plunge.

But I don't like it. Why can't I like it? She's ticked every box, she makes me feel happy, she does everything I want bedside, and yet, I'm frustrated with her. Because of her long-term dreams, that when I asked her how I'm supposed to satisfy that, she says she hopes one day she can change my mind, and pulls the topic back to the present.

And buzz buzz... there we go, she texts me again. And instead of "weeee", I'm like... "what's my next excuse"

... I think I'm going to need some space
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post #43 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-10-2017, 07:28 AM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

It sounds like you feel like she's being a little clingy (those things in the first paragraph are said by her, not you, right?) and that may be what's frustrating you. Because she wants/needs more, and you're not sure if you want to give it to her. She's sensed your trepidation, and so she's seeking more emotional security from you, which makes you want to pull away more. It's a bad cycle.

It sounds like you might need some space from her to figure out how you really feel about her and what you really want from this. And she may need to learn how to chill out and recognize that you're on a different page than she is.

She's more focused on changing your mind than accepting where you are right now and what you're able to give to her. And that's no good. A woman who thinks she will be able to change a man is not a good thing, because for someone to really be able to love you, they need to accept you for who you are, not who they want you to be. And that is something that is giving you pause here, whether you realize it or not. It's a bad thing if you're thinking, "What's my next excuse?" That is a sign that you don't really want to be with this person, or that you need space and you don't feel safe enough emotionally to be honest with her about what you need.

That doesn't make you a bad person. It just means that you're not getting what you need--and neither is she.

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post #44 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-10-2017, 06:45 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

Yeah I don't even have a chance to miss her, since becoming bf/gf she's become stage 2, borderline stage 3... And she's a worrisome one when it comes to whether or not she accepts me or not, she accepts my goals (single freedom), yet her goals (marriage and kids) contradict mine, and she hasn't given me an answer of how that's going to work except for hoping she can "change my mind" and changing the topic and pulling our minds back to the present "enjoying what we have"

Bah!
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post #45 of 71 (permalink) Old 01-12-2017, 11:41 AM
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Re: Logically how can love exist?

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Tests?

Is that a word that should be used in building a healthy relationship?

.
Um, women test men all the time, especially in relationships.
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