Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness. - Page 3 - Talk About Marriage
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post #31 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:08 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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Thoughts on Howard Cuttingham? I wonder what Gary Marshall (writer producer of Happy Days) early life and marriage was as compared to Bill Cosby. We all know who he turned out to be. Someone pointed this out and it's interesting that Cliff was a gynecologist who had is exam room in the basement of his house. Think about that for a moment in the context of what we know now. So creepy.
He also had a routine about doping girls unknowingly. Spanish Fly?
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post #32 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:14 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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so whose fault is it? Is it parents fault for not teaching their boys better. Is it men's fault for not knowing. Or is it women's fault for lowering expectations and continuing the "boys will be boys", not holding them responsible.

The problem is... it's like supple and demand. You can hold a man accountable, he may get sick and tired of your unhappiness and "nagging" and go be with another women who expects much less from him and be happy while no one will ever met our expectations and we will forever be unhappy.

I have the viewpoint right now of... married. It is what it is. I gotta except things the way they are not the way I want them to be. I will never find peace if I don't. However, when I have kids... I will teach them to be better.
We teach and lead by example. I wonder about the parental example of folks here. What did they have to learn from their parents. Lessons can be positive and negative. As in... I want to be like that or I never want to be like that. Compound that by 2 parents.
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post #33 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:20 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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Originally Posted by lifeistooshort View Post
One thing that I've noticed is that in places where women have the least power there are also the lowest standards of behavior for men. In some of these very patriarchal Muslim or African countries men can't be expected to control themselves around 8 years old girls, and don't really have to do much at all besides take.

Where women have power standards of behavior for men are higher, and once those standards are culturally accepted men will tend to hold other men accountable.

But there are men who resent these higher standards and blame feminism. I can't help but ask why? How is it unfair to ask more than the bare minimum of providing? Particularly when a lot of women are providing as well? If the answer isn't laziness or selfishness then what is it?

The fact is that expectations have changed on both ends. The same men who will complain about feminism and look for the good old days conveniently forget that the porn sex they often want didn't exist in the good old days. It was pretty unthinkable to ask your wife for oral or anal.

And you sure as **** didn't divorce your wife over a lack of a satisfying sex life, as guys on TAM are advised to do all the time.

There are many examples.....it's just important for men and women to keep in mind all the things they'd actually be giving up if the could go back to the good old days. I think many men imagine it would be the same as it is now except they'd control everything and their wife would do as she's told.

Not the case.....many things would be different.
It does seem that one of the first things that a sex does with power is rid itself of responsibility and responsibility and power being in different places never ends well.

I live now in what is by global standards a very feminist nation compared to the UK, but here it breaks down. I hear women talk about their role in relationships going wrong and it is not unusual for women to even organize proper birthday parties for their men. I am afraid the men seem rather worse for it and the women rather better. I suspect it is a general correlation, but not too strict.

Generally, the men who want to go back to the old days are pathetic examples of manhood.

Last edited by Mr The Other; 03-23-2017 at 05:27 PM.
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post #34 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:22 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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I will never forget my pop telling me -if you think you're old enough to have sex with your

g/f, then by schit you're old enough to raise a kid when you get her pregnant.- Sure put a damper

on our next few dates. -Don't expect to stay at home, move her in. I ain't running no GD hotel.

By the way.... you best enjoy all the sex you can now if you get her pregnant. After a kid or two, your

days of endless sex will be over.- VERY eye opening....
Interesting...... how is that advice working out for you?
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post #35 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:23 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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I agree..... what higher expectations do you have?


Let me preface this... this is my believe for what I think works for me and the type of marriage I want. I don't apply this To all men and women!

I expect men to be the head of the house. I expect him to work hard and put the family first. I expect him to be the moral hierarchy. The person to go to for the best advice, the most moral advice. I expect him to live a moral ethical life in the way he speaks, and in his actions. He should respect his wife. He should see things in terms of us and we. He should see the house as our house, and if he sees something needs to be done... I.e. The laundry, he does it because he sees these things as items that need to get done, and nothing else. He is aware that he is a man, bigger and stronger than his wife, therefore he should treat her so, like carry heavy items, be protective of her. And he does all these things because it's who he is, not because his wife is good to him.

I am huge about people doing what they should do because it's the right thing to do. Not because their spouse is good to them but because of who they are. Because they are a good person with good character. If that makes sense.

To me... there is nothing better than a respectable man. I am all about character.
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post #36 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:27 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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There is a type of benevolent sexism that I think is not actually unhealthy. We can accept our partner as they, but sometimes this is just not possible, so we have to excuse them. An easy way of doing this is to say, "Men are rubbish like this...." or "Women are impossible like that....", it means we can use their sex to excuse our partner. I approve. Really.

.


Sounds like cognitive dissonance. I don't know if it's good or bad, but it's a way to deal with conflicting ideals.
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post #37 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:31 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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Interesting...... how is that advice working out for you?
Should have asked me that back in 1989.
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post #38 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:31 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

This thread is a complete SNAFU. As I've read it I've had several comments to make, but as soon as I think of one the topic shifts to something else. So in a foolish and vain attempt to catch up, I'm going to ask some questions that truthfully I don't expect satisfactory answers to.
- What is emotional intelligence? How is it measured? How do you test it? How and where is it taught?
- Why is it considered inadequate to make decisions based on numbers rather than on feelings?
- If men are the same as women, what is the big deal with same sex relationships? Cross dressing?
- And Why am I only attracted to one sort?
- It's Cunningham, not Cuttingham.
- How does @lifeistooshort 's model fit with Jamaica?

Good luck!
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post #39 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:32 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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Originally Posted by lifeistooshort View Post
One thing that I've noticed is that in places where women have the least power there are also the lowest standards of behavior for men. In some of these very patriarchal Muslim or African countries men can't be expected to control themselves around 8 years old girls, and don't really have to do much at all besides take.



Where women have power standards of behavior for men are higher, and once those standards are culturally accepted men will tend to hold other men accountable.



But there are men who resent these higher standards and blame feminism. I can't help but ask why? How is it unfair to ask more than the bare minimum of providing? Particularly when a lot of women are providing as well? If the answer isn't laziness or selfishness then what is it?



The fact is that expectations have changed on both ends. The same men who will complain about feminism and look for the good old days conveniently forget that the porn sex they often want didn't exist in the good old days. It was pretty unthinkable to ask your wife for oral or anal.



And you sure as **** didn't divorce your wife over a lack of a satisfying sex life, as guys on TAM are advised to do all the time.



There are many examples.....it's just important for men and women to keep in mind all the things they'd actually be giving up if the could go back to the good old days. I think many men imagine it would be the same as it is now except they'd control everything and their wife would do as she's told.



Not the case.....many things would be different.


I agree 100%. But I think men had it easier back in the day. At least that's what I think. Back then all they had to do is really work and come home. And those days families were able to be supported on one income. They were more conservative with their money, and times were simple.
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post #40 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:34 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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Originally Posted by katiecrna View Post
Let me preface this... this is my believe for what I think works for me and the type of marriage I want. I don't apply this To all men and women!

.

I am huge about people doing what they should do because it's the right thing to do. Not because their spouse is good to them but because of who they are. Because they are a good person with good character. If that makes sense.

To me... there is nothing better than a respectable man. I am all about character.
and bugs. He has to be able kill bugs.
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post #41 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:34 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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We teach and lead by example. I wonder about the parental example of folks here. What did they have to learn from their parents. Lessons can be positive and negative. As in... I want to be like that or I never want to be like that. Compound that by 2 parents.


Yes!! I think it's so important to look at our own parents parenting style and pick up what we like so we can do it, and what we didn't so we can avoid it.
Some people have a hard time saying anything negative about their parents because they think it's disrespectful. My husband to this day will never say anything bad about them, or critique them.
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post #42 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:35 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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I agree 100%. But I think men had it easier back in the day. At least that's what I think. Back then all they had to do is really work and come home. And those days families were able to be supported on one income. They were more conservative with their money, and times were simple.
Distance (in time or miles) makes things easy. People make things difficult.
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post #43 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:35 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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and bugs. He has to be able kill bugs.


And he has to grill.
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post #44 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:36 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

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Should have asked me that back in 1989.
Can you remember 89? It was a serious question. Your dad gave you advice. How does it work in practice?
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post #45 of 92 (permalink) Old 03-23-2017, 05:38 PM
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Re: Tired of failings being blamed on Maleness.

As a man with 7 grand daughters I have a vested interest in the future of women. I believe we are entering the age of women.
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