coping with male infertility - Page 3 - Talk About Marriage
Physical & Mental Health Issues Marriage and relationships are difficult by themselves, but coping with physical or mental health problems can make things even more difficult.

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post #31 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:28 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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I think there is more than that though.

First is the fact that women never have had to worry about misattributed parenthood. As a gender, they haven't been fooled and still can't be. There is a strong biological reason for a man to mate guard, and little reason for women to.
Jewish people trace their ancestry through the mother for this reason.

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The second is that even when a donor egg is used, it still grows inside her. Her body nourishes that egg into a baby.

The real comparison would be using a surrogate.
Totally true and probably why an egg donor wouldn't bother me at all because I would still give birth to it.

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post #32 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:29 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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I think there is more than that though.

First is the fact that women never have had to worry about misattributed parenthood. As a gender, they haven't been fooled and still can't be. There is a strong biological reason for a man to mate guard, and little reason for women to.

The second is that even when a donor egg is used, it still grows inside her. Her body nourishes that egg into a baby.

The real comparison would be using a surrogate.
Still, that's such an unnatural thing that there's probably not a strongly-developed instinct to guard against it.

I dunno... ladies?

Virginia: "Why can't you kids leave well enough alone? Everything was fine until you started digging around."

Burt: "You sound like a Scooby Doo villain."
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post #33 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:30 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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Plus I'd expect anyone to naturally favor their own children over those of someone else. If that weren't the case, adoption would be much more common than it is.
I have to give my maternal grandmother lots of props in this regard.

Several of my uncles had step kids. When I was a teenager we talked extensively about how important it was to treat all kids as just more kids. Playing favorites hurts kids more than we realize.

I'm not sure where her insight came from, but she explained it very well about how important it was and I'm not doing her explanation justice. It did really stick with me since. I don't have step kids, but I do have other step relations and I've stuck with her advice since. I've had more than one parent thank my wife and I for the way we treated their kids and how much it meant to them.

I have noted that looking at the kids that way does frame my view of those kids differently. They're just a part of the family, no matter how they became part of the family. I have NO doubts I'd be able to treat an adopted kid just like my own.
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post #34 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:31 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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Uhhh... FWIW, some of us aren't. Your abusive assh*le types that wind up beating the sh*t out of their step-children (or worse)? I'd bet money that they're wrestling internally w/ exactly that issue. Because those guys have a much less-developed id/ego/super-ego balance, though, they're not able to get a handle on it.

And of course there's also the story of the Roman soldier returning home after years of being away at war... and promptly killing and burying his wife's infant child.

It happens.
Or the kids have similar traits to the biological fathers. One of my nephews sees his dad about twice a year but he is the spittin' image of him both physically and behaviorally.
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post #35 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:33 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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Or the kids have similar traits to the biological fathers. One of my nephews sees his dad about twice a year but he is the spittin' image of him both physically and behaviorally.
I'd imagine that this would be less of an issue when the biological father is never anything other than a stranger.

Virginia: "Why can't you kids leave well enough alone? Everything was fine until you started digging around."

Burt: "You sound like a Scooby Doo villain."
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post #36 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:33 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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Oh, come on now, a sperm bank cant be that expensive. They're all over the place.
This isn't just the turkey baster process.

My last child cost $68K, $9.3K wasn't covered by insurance. Then I'm out what, $200K until she's 18?
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post #37 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:33 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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Still, that's such an unnatural thing that there's probably not a strongly-developed instinct to guard against it.

I dunno... ladies?
Whose egg is the surrogate carrying?
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post #38 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:34 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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I'd imagine that this would be less of an issue when the biological father is never anything other than a stranger.
He is basically a stranger.
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post #39 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:36 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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This isn't just the turkey baster process.

My last child cost $68K, $9.3K wasn't covered by insurance. Then I'm out what, $200K until she's 18?
Then you are viewing it as you raising someone else's child and not your own.
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post #40 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:39 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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But it's not infidelity or cuckoldry, it's five seconds with a turkey baster. The wife would probably even be willing to let you watch and have a go before and after she uses it.
It's not technically cuckoldry when the husband is aware of it.

Feels very similar, though.

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Women can feel like that too, did you see the thread about the guy whose wife wouldn't consider donor eggs or adoption because it would make her feel like a failure? It's not just a 'man' issue.
Fair enough. And, honestly, I was quite surprised at my wife's reaction.

We've talked about it since, though, and she said that she realized that the only way that she was ever going to be able to be pregnant, carry a baby, etc was to use donor eggs. She's always wanted that experience.

Still, I think that women -- generally speaking -- are far more accepting of this than men.

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Oh, come on now, a sperm bank cant be that expensive. They're all over the place.
That's not the expensive part. I don't know but yeah... that's probably relatively affordable, if not downright cheap. Well... unless you're using celebrity swimmers or something like that.

The expense has to do w/ the actual medical procedure itself, plus the medications (HOLY CRAP!!!), and obviously all of the money that's already been put into travel, tests, etc up to that point.


Virginia: "Why can't you kids leave well enough alone? Everything was fine until you started digging around."

Burt: "You sound like a Scooby Doo villain."
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post #41 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:41 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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Whose egg is the surrogate carrying?
I can see how that would make a difference.

Still, I think that women -- again, generally speaking -- are far more accepting of this than men.

Virginia: "Why can't you kids leave well enough alone? Everything was fine until you started digging around."

Burt: "You sound like a Scooby Doo villain."
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post #42 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:46 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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Whose egg is the surrogate carrying?
You beat me to the question.

It matters, doesn't it?
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post #43 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:50 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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Then you are viewing it as you raising someone else's child and not your own.


How do you get that? I have no reason in the slightest to doubt the paternity of my children. My 2nd and last are certain beyond any possible doubt as we were tracking the cycle and planned to be alone together for the entire fertility window.
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post #44 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 12:54 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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How do you get that? I have no reason in the slightest to doubt the paternity of my children. My 2nd and last are certain beyond any possible doubt as we were tracking the cycle and planned to be alone together for the entire fertility window.
Damn.

That's hardcore.

Pun intended.


Virginia: "Why can't you kids leave well enough alone? Everything was fine until you started digging around."

Burt: "You sound like a Scooby Doo villain."
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post #45 of 59 (permalink) Old 06-06-2016, 01:00 AM
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Re: coping with male infertility

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How do you get that? I have no reason in the slightest to doubt the paternity of my children. My 2nd and last are certain beyond any possible doubt as we were tracking the cycle and planned to be alone together for the entire fertility window.
I wasn't impugning your wife's honor, I was pointing out that when it's your kid, you don't count the cost, but if it was not your biological kid, you were looking at the financial cost of it all.
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