Alot has been said here how it is the downfall for the last 40 years, the end of a family unit, the cause of divorce, etc. It seems that much of that has been blamed on feminism, at least from reading around here. So I would like to take the time to explain what the movement was all about and the vast misinterpretation that it is now, in my opinion.
It started with a group of women who wanted equality. Equality in life in that their life meant as much as a mans. They didn't want to be viewed as the "little lady" or less than. They wanted to be valued the same and wanted to be seen as equal for their contributions to society. They didn't hate men, they just didn't devalue themselves anymore. They finally rose up in droves and said enough. They marched, protested and brought about the equal rights amendment, one that not only helped women, but other minorities, both men and women.
Back then, it was about going to their job and having the law behind them when their boss patted them on the a$$ and called them sexretary. Back then, it was about being able to work side by side at a plant knowing that they finally earned the same wages as the guy doing the same work standing next to them. Back then it was about being able to control of their reproductive rights and not forced to have children they didn't want. Back then it was about a woman being accepted to a university because she was just as smart as a man. Back then, it was about a woman having the same rights to owning property as a man.
THAT is what my sisters fought for. That was the intent of the movement. That is why millions marched for years to ensure their daughters had a better life.
That is what feminism was all about. It has been twisted and turned and what "feminism" is about now isn't even close to what the root was. It is some sick amalgam of a great idea and "feminism" now gets the blame.
Case in point. My husband and I were out last night at a very upscale restaurant. I watched as two young women made out with each other in front of their dates. They headed off to the restroom and I followed. I asked "Can I join in?". They looked at me horrified and said "Huh, we are just doing this to turn our boyfriends on. We are modern women....you know, feminists".
My brain nearly exploded and I just smiled at them and said "Oh honey, get a f@cking clue".
I think TAM should have a forum for Feminism. It is massive in Married Life as well as in public life. As for feminism itself, sure it was born of exceedingly good intent. What man now for example could consider women not having the vote. Except of course for those in Saudi Arabia. And it amazes me at times to think my father was born six years before women got the vote in England.
But the original intents of feminism have been bastardised and is used for all forms of bad behaviour and as excuses for not taking personal responsibility.
So let’s see a separate forum for Feminism in TAM where these things can be discussed and those in the know can educate. And hopefully that will have the positive side effect of removing feminism in all its forms from the Men’s Clubhouse because it will be “off topic”. And then the men and women can again work together as a team just like when women got the vote to make the world a better place for both men and women to live in instead of being “at” one another.
A person should not believe in an "ism", he should believe in himself. I quote John Lennon: "I don't believe in Beatles, I just believe in me." Good point there. After all, he was the Walrus. I could be the Walrus. I'd still have to bum rides off of people.
In the 1960s, men vastly outnumbered women in college. Today, the ratio is virtually flipped. I think feminism was a huge boost to evening out the gap and giving women equal standing in college.
I truly want to believe that feminism can be good for society even today, but with the ratios completely reversed now in favor of women and study after study showing that boys really do need some help for various reasons to even this gap out, it is impossible not to notice the complete silence of feminists. Just seems like, as time goes on, it has become less about equality, and more about "let's see what else we can get".
This is of course just one handpicked example and just my opinion. I really do wish there was a gender-neutral version of feminism, though.
Feminism took away the things that are special about both sexes. Yes, we are of equal value, but we are different and those differences are what make us amazing and sexy.
A person should not believe in an "ism", he should believe in himself. I quote John Lennon: "I don't believe in Beatles, I just believe in me." Good point there. After all, he was the Walrus. I could be the Walrus. I'd still have to bum rides off of people.
Ferris Bueller
Two of my favorites people...well, a person and a character.
I think that "gender neutral feminism" is a bit of an oxymoron. However, I think that like most other movements, there's a pendulum and we're starting to see another kind of shift. More and more literature is appearing not just about differences in how girls are treated in the classroom, but about how boys need different instructional styles as well. The disparity in enrollment rates for men in higher education overall has been noted and is being researched to create interventions.
At the same time though, with the overall demise of affirmative action policies, I personally see less and less of the "what else can we get" sort of attitude that you mention. If anything, what I find interesting is the trend within the feminist community rejecting the "getting" that has been so predominant as women have worked to gain equality in the legal system, education, workplace and what have you and instead focusing on the legitimacy of choosing the more traditional roles.
Now admittedly, I'm a bit of a policy and theory geek, so I'm loving watching it all, but from a personal standpoint as well, I think that's a wonderful thing. A movement that started out with the goal of making choices available to women has ultimately created a generation of women that are educated and empowered to voice their choice to fill any of the roles that are available to women, in or out of the home and to present really spirited, well-founded discussion on the topic.
As we see a mellowing of the feminist, or at least women's advocacy, soften to accept that women are equal but not exactly like men, I think that what we're going to be seeing more of soon will be the next wave of "masculinism" as it were. It's a predictable cycle through history as one reacts to the other and new gaps and needs are revealed like the ones you mentioned, Acorn. My hope though, and I think that it's slowly happening, is that the trends are slowly beginning to show the appreciation for the differences and strengths of each sex, rather than trying to make a unisex society.
They marched, protested and brought about the equal rights amendment, one that not only helped women, but other minorities, both men and women.
The Equal Rights Amendment was never passed. Men and women do not actually have equal rights under the law in the USA.
Anyway, I'm not a feminist (I believe that to be one, one actually has to put some effort into it: be politically active, for example) but I am very grateful to the feminists of the past for everything they did for themselves and their metaphorical daughters.
I think of feminism as a movement in time - for many western societies, it may be time for a new movement, one that calls for generalized fairness and equality in society - with greater involvement from a variety of groups, not just women. Gay rights may be the next feminism - but I would like to see a general social justice movement that fights against discrimination, poverty, etc.
Of course there are still a number of societies in the world where feminism is desperately needed, and I hope that those women don't give up the fight - not just for basic human rights, but for FULL human rights.
But I'll admit I'm not too clear on the role of feminism in modern marriage. I can easily imagine what people THINK it is, but I'm not convinced that they're correct. I think the double-income family structure (which is not solely a result of feminism, it came from a number of factors) is more responsible for the changes that many would ascribe to 'feminism in marriage.'
I think that "gender neutral feminism" is a bit of an oxymoron. However, I think that like most other movements, there's a pendulum and we're starting to see another kind of shift. More and more literature is appearing not just about differences in how girls are treated in the classroom, but about how boys need different instructional styles as well. The disparity in enrollment rates for men in higher education overall has been noted and is being researched to create interventions.
As an educator, I work very hard in letting my boys be boys. They are not girls and I do not treat them as such. Ever wonder why teachers always complain about their male students? It's because they expect those boys to behave like girls! This is nonsense. Boys, more than girls, need to move and explore. I teach 5th grade. We do a lot of activity in this room. My boys and girls are engaged and it's very peaceful in here. The "problem" children (boys that other teachers said were "bad") are actually AWESOME kids!! They talk a lot, and move a lot but they are very well behaved and intelligent.
My girls are a bit more mature than my boys (shocker Lollll) and I give equal amount of attention to them in all subjects. They just don't need as much activity as my boys.
People can jump on me all they want about it, but it works and it's true. I've been doing this for 12 years. In this room, my kids learn and they aren't punished for being curious.
I think that "gender neutral feminism" is a bit of an oxymoron...As we see a mellowing of the feminist, or at least women's advocacy, soften to accept that women are equal but not exactly like men, I think that what we're going to be seeing more of soon will be the next wave of "masculinism" as it were. It's a predictable cycle through history as one reacts to the other and new gaps and needs are revealed like the ones you mentioned, Acorn. My hope though, and I think that it's slowly happening, is that the trends are slowly beginning to show the appreciation for the differences and strengths of each sex, rather than trying to make a unisex society.
The first definition listed in my dictionary for feminism is "the theory of the political, economic, and social equality of the sexes", while the second definition is "organized activity on behalf of women's rights and interests". The two are wildly different, at least to me, but I can see why it might sound like an oxymoron.
I do agree that the pendulum will swing at some point, but personally I'd rather do without feminism and "masculinism" and go for something that was simply based on relative/reasonable equality for both sexes.
And overall, I do think feminism has been more positive than negative. I just don't want to see a rise of the "National Organization of Men", for example, and I don't want there to be a need of masculinism to balance out the actions of feminists just to gain equality. We are all in this together, it's not supposed to be an arms race between men and women to achieve equality in schools (and other issues).
Feminism.... 
Two of my favorites people...well, a person and a character. 
