Common Core - Page 10 - Talk About Marriage
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post #136 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:00 AM Thread Starter
jld
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Re: Common Core

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The kids from your childhood area are most likely being bused 60 to 90 minutes each way to attend a school that have larger classes and well, taken all together allows the state to spend less money on education.
I don't think the district has changed. The farthest kids out may have had a 45 minute bus ride, but that was it.

I was in school 30 years ago, and I really don't know what the class sizes are now. I doubt they are much bigger, though, as the area does not seem to have increased in population. One of my teachers just retired in the last few years, iirc.

I could ask my best friend from high school, though. She still lives in the area.

You know, neither she nor I send our kids to school. She does the online public school, and I homeschool. I tried to convince her to homeschool, but she did not trust herself. She also wanted the free tuition that comes from her state's universities if a kid does a certain amount of time in the online school.

We were also both teachers. I taught high school and she taught elementary school. Interesting when former teachers do not want to send their kids to school.


One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #137 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:11 AM
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Re: Common Core

I'm uncomfortable with online and home schooling. I've read examples in which they become a shield for child abuse. And parents using their older children as little adults to take care of the younger children.
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post #138 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:18 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Common Core

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It's cheap and efficient because we don't consider our own opportunity costs - I could have Dr. J2 stay home and homeschool the girls and they'd be math wizards in a hurry. At the cost of losing her earning potential and the educational opportunities those earnings buy down the road.
I bet she would be a lot closer to her kids if she had homeschooled, john. They may have been able to avoid the difficulties they have had. When you spend so much time with your kids, you just have to work things out in a way you both can live with. Ime, anyway.

Yes, we lost my income because of my being home. And I am not particularly skilled, either. Over 20 years since I have taught. And no desire to return to the classroom, if I would even be hired at my age.

I am so glad we have done it, though. I am so glad Dug had that vision. As long as we can make it financially, I think I always will be. And maybe even if we can't.

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I'm not sceptical of "the government". I'm not trusting them blind either. Common Core is the least of this country's education concerns and the fight about CC is simply a ruse.
It might not be the biggest concern, but I doubt it will be what its supporters expect.

Please elaborate on the "ruse".

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Everything in life is a compromise. I choose to live in an expensive house because that buys the best schools in the state and top 0.3% in the country. I could move 20 miles away and live in a rural area, pay little in taxes, and have awful schools. I'm blessed with enough money to not fret over the decision. But others aren't as lucky.
Again, I just do not have that confidence in the schools.

We are very close to an IB school. We were also not too far away from a Spanish immersion elementary school. Those opportunities did cross my mind.

But ultimately the advantages of homeschooling won out.

And my daughter has done better in college than anyone we personally know. And I am telling you that as honestly and humbly as I can. All without IB, without AP, without being an NMS. Just with our cheap little homeschool.

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CC, national curriculums, and the like are simply ways to level the playing field. My older daughter is a graduate teaching assistant and her students' lack of command of English is startling. That's why you need harder schools and more effort to improve. Your kids and mine will be fine, but a college junior who writes at 8th grade level at best is not a pretty sight.
I don't know that school reforms will level the playing field to the degree you may expect. Economic opportunities for parents might, though. Universal healthcare might. Safer communities might.

That is probably the conversation we should be having if we want to help kids, john.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #139 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:20 AM
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Re: Common Core

Our school has less than 100 kids per grade. My son is in a class of about 60 kids. A few years behind him, there's only 40. State and federal money is based on enrollment. So not only do rural schools not get much in property taxes due to low population, they also don't get much in government funding for the same reason. A teacher in our school district takes years to reach the same salary that a teacher in the Ithaca City school district, just 40 miles away, gets their first year. Or they can go work in the very wealthy town of Skaneateles, 40 miles in another direction, where some of the district employees are making 6 figures. Which would you choose?

All the standardized testing in the world is never going to equalize or overcome the money gap.

The road goes ever ever on, down from the door where it began... JRR Tolkien
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post #140 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:22 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Common Core

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I'm uncomfortable with online and home schooling. I've read examples in which they become a shield for child abuse. And parents using their older children as little adults to take care of the younger children.
My sister was horrifically sexually abused by the music teacher at our public school. Has never really recovered from it.

And when the school found out, he was dismissed. And hired by another district.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #141 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:23 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Common Core

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Originally Posted by Hellomynameis View Post
Our school has less than 100 kids per grade. My son is in a class of about 60 kids. A few years behind him, there's only 40. State and federal money is based on enrollment. So not only do rural schools not get much in property taxes due to low population, they also don't get much in government funding for the same reason. A teacher in our school district takes years to reach the same salary that a teacher in the Ithaca City school district, just 40 miles away, gets their first year. Or they can go work in the very wealthy town of Skaneateles, 40 miles in another direction, where some of the district employees are making 6 figures. Which would you choose?

All the standardized testing in the world is never going to equalize or overcome the money gap.
People place so much trust in standardized testing. Such a desire to control, to quantify.

As a parent, I just do not think it works that way.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #142 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:30 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Common Core

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Originally Posted by Hellomynameis View Post
Our school has less than 100 kids per grade. My son is in a class of about 60 kids. A few years behind him, there's only 40. State and federal money is based on enrollment. So not only do rural schools not get much in property taxes due to low population, they also don't get much in government funding for the same reason. A teacher in our school district takes years to reach the same salary that a teacher in the Ithaca City school district, just 40 miles away, gets their first year. Or they can go work in the very wealthy town of Skaneateles, 40 miles in another direction, where some of the district employees are making 6 figures. Which would you choose?

All the standardized testing in the world is never going to equalize or overcome the money gap.
Just thinking about this some more, I don't think it will ever overcome the devotion gap. Devoted parents, more than anything. We are our children's best advocates.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #143 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:40 AM
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Re: Common Core

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My sister was horrifically sexually abused by the music teacher at our public school. Has never really recovered from it.

And when the school found out, he was dismissed. And hired by another district.
The USA Today did a story around Christmas time on how teachers like the one mentioned are able to move from one district to another. this suggests to me that maybe the market for teachers isn't as rich as policymakers like for us to believe ie "We're going to get rid of those bad teachers......." Oh really, and replace with them with what.

I'm sorry to read about your sister's horrific experience. Yet, the biggest relationship betrayal is the one between parent and child. A child that is never allowed outdoors and has no reason to leave the home...... what hope in hell would anyone have an opportunity to intervene in good time.
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post #144 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:41 AM
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Re: Common Core

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My sister was horrifically sexually abused by the music teacher at our public school. Has never really recovered from it.

And when the school found out, he was dismissed. And hired by another district.
Well, if this is the case, our public schools could teach my cat to score a perfect SAT and it wouldn't change your mind about public education...

Likewise, with a very small sample size you assume that what works for you could work for everyone. That's rarely the case.

Public education, with all due respect, is to enable people to look past their own experiences and into a world much larger, in every sense, than they ever experienced.
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post #145 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:43 AM
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Re: Common Core

was this a long time ago or recently. I thought abuse was being taken much more seriously these days, but I migth be wrong.

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My sister was horrifically sexually abused by the music teacher at our public school. Has never really recovered from it.

And when the school found out, he was dismissed. And hired by another district.


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post #146 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:44 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Common Core

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The USA Today did a story around Christmas time on how teachers like the one mentioned are able to move from one district to another. this suggests to me that maybe the market for teachers isn't as rich as policymakers like for us to believe ie "We're going to get rid of those bad teachers......." Oh really, and replace with them with what.

I'm sorry to read about your sister's horrific experience. Yet, the biggest relationship betrayal is the one between parent and child. A child that is never allowed outdoors and has no reason to leave the home...... what hope in hell would anyone have an opportunity to intervene in good time.
I appreciate the concern. We all want kids to be safe.

Our state organization has said it is important to follow the child abuse laws. In our state, anyone can report a concern to Children's Services. I am pretty sure they have to follow up on it.

It is also possible to speak to people of influence around anyone you suspect may be abusing their child. And of course, being kind and loving with those people may help their kids most of all.

What a sad subject.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #147 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:49 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Common Core

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Well, if this is the case, our public schools could teach my cat to score a perfect SAT and it wouldn't change your mind about public education...

Likewise, with a very small sample size you assume that what works for you could work for everyone. That's rarely the case.

Public education, with all due respect, is to enable people to look past their own experiences and into a world much larger, in every sense, than they ever experience.
And a public library can enable that, too.

Look, I know what you are saying. Kids get exposed to things at school, to people, that they might not otherwise.

I guess it is a matter of control, and how far it should be taken. Should we require people in rural areas to live a part of their lives in cities, so they understand that experience better? Should people from one region be forced to spend time in other regions?

Exposure can definitely expand our views. The question, again, is should it be forced.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #148 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 11:50 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Common Core

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was this a long time ago or recently. I thought abuse was being taken much more seriously these days, but I migth be wrong.
It is still happening:

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Originally Posted by NextTimeAround View Post
The USA Today did a story around Christmas time on how teachers like the one mentioned are able to move from one district to another. this suggests to me that maybe the market for teachers isn't as rich as policymakers like for us to believe ie "We're going to get rid of those bad teachers......." Oh really, and replace with them with what.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #149 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 12:00 PM
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Re: Common Core

I've been a teacher for 20 years. I hate the common core. The premise isn't bad, it's teachable, learnable stuff, but the parameters suck. That a viable and sustainable curriculum fits every student in this country? Ah no. Let us have more local control over what and how we teach.

And I'm a democrat who despises Betsy DeVos.
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post #150 of 198 (permalink) Old 01-25-2017, 12:05 PM
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Re: Common Core

I think common core is mostly good but is not a magic bullet. I think there needs to be some sort of standard to measure both students AND teachers but they all shouldn't be forced into the same box.

As far as home schooling.... we/the company I am part of kind of avoid them - but it does depend on the position and its' needs/requirements. It is something we look at on the resume - where their education was done. Our experience is home schooled people often have poor interaction and team skills. Especially in Engineers, sales, project management, and any area where there is significant people interaction. We have found they usually are not good fits because of the wide variety of personalities/types/opinions/ideas that generally they are less experienced with working/dealing with. We have a cost accountant that was home schooled - and she is excellent.

I do think education methods differing is a good thing - it results in wider human experiences and contributions which IMO benefits all.
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