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post #46 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 08:15 AM Thread Starter
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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Since you asked me a question, my answer is "No." There are 535 congresspersons and you will get a different spin based on their party and their agenda. Even then, there are many bills that might be proposed, each with different content, and many amendments will be proposed. Ultimately it comes down to ONE signature, that of the President.

So it is not more informative to hear what congress is saying.

Specifically what positions of his campaign are beginning to wave? And cite you sources.

If anything, Trump seems to be keeping to his earlier position.

That he may not "lock her up" is a gracious gesture on his part that was expected.

Immigration Executive Orders: President Trump Keeps His Campaign Promises and Commences the ?Fix? on US Immigration | The National Law Review

https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/i...aign-promises/
"The 141 stances Donald Trump took during his White House bid"

https://www.google.com/amp/www.nbcne...?client=safari


One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #47 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 08:17 AM
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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From my readings a lot of ACA will remain. Pre-existing conditions being one of them. The ACA is not going away. It is being hopefully overhauled into a workable program. In it's current state it is failing.
How is it failing...... especially in view of that fact that certain key parts are hoped to be retained.
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post #48 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 08:20 AM
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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I skipped a lot of those visits, too, SA.

But you definitely want care available when it is needed.
I had blood work this past year.. it's been a while so I opted for it..

IF we didn't have health insurance.. just sucking my blood , getting a CBC , cholesterol readings.. this lab work was a whopping $800 ...

Can you even imagine NOT having insurance ?? I cry for these people.. if they own anything & come down with something that needs surgery, or a stay in the hospital , God forbid... they are F***ed.
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post #49 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 08:21 AM
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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Me personally... I want to live in a state that allows us the "right to die" -with dignity...can't see why the hell this is fought against Republicans.. makes no sense to me, then they want all these babies to live -while at the same time don't give a da** whether they suffer & die since health care is not their problem..
What you are probably referring to is assisted suicide, which is legal in the states of California, Colorado, Oregon, Vermont, and Washington; its status is disputed in Montana. Those are only 6 states out of 50. It is not just a "Republican: issue, since they do not control the other 44 states.

New York is run by the Democrats, as are many other blue states. They have not signed off on this either.

You always have the right to die. It is in every state. You can decline food or medical services at any time. We did this for my father in New York.

Tell me what babies are dying and suffering. Health care is nearly universal already. It is health "insurance" that is the issue. The poor have Medicaid and other State provided resources. I live in a poor backward state. Our babies are not dying like you described.
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post #50 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 08:24 AM
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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But on the other hand, the rest of us are paying her costs.

The problem with health care is that everyone wants someone else to pay their bills. There is no bottomless well of money. If everyone wants unlimited coverage, then the country goes bankrupt.

The only way to provide universal, government paid health care is if it is rationed.
Even before the ACA, healthcare was being rationed......... the rationing was just based on different principles.
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post #51 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 08:26 AM Thread Starter
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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Originally Posted by SimplyAmorous View Post
I had blood work this past year.. it's been a while so I opted for it..

IF we didn't have health insurance.. just sucking my blood , getting a CBC , cholesterol readings.. this lab work was a whopping $800 ...

Can you even imagine NOT having insurance ?? I cry for these people.. if they own anything & come down with something that needs surgery, or a stay in the hospital , God forbid... they are F***ed.
We stopped in France on the way home from India and had ds's blood checked. Test cost me $8.

A few weeks later we had to have the same one done in America. $200.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #52 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 08:42 AM
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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Even before the ACA, healthcare was being rationed......... the rationing was just based on different principles.
Back up what you are saying. In what way? We have Medicaid for the poor (I'm not going back 50 years).
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post #53 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 08:43 AM
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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Originally Posted by blueinbr View Post
What you are probably referring to is assisted suicide, which is legal in the states of California, Colorado, Oregon, Vermont, and Washington; its status is disputed in Montana. Those are only 6 states out of 50. It is not just a "Republican: issue, since they do not control the other 44 states.

New York is run by the Democrats, as are many other blue states. They have not signed off on this either.

You always have the right to die. It is in every state. You can decline food or medical services at any time. We did this for my father in New York.

Tell me what babies are dying and suffering. Health care is nearly universal already. It is health "insurance" that is the issue. The poor have Medicaid and other State provided resources. I live in a poor backward state. Our babies are not dying like you described.
I just explained how a family like mine could fall through these cracks.. so sure.. if you are dirt poor.. everything is covered.. unfortunately IF YOU WORK, always had a job, then find yourself on hard times after a lay off.. Jobs that offer benefits are going the way of the dinosaur .. and these Marketplaces options sound like a situation where I might as well hold up a sign saying "Will work for health care for my family".. as it could cost like $2,000 a month when we might be strapped making $45,000 a year... then some horrendous deducible like $10,000 a year on top of that.. It's just not reasonable, feasible..

I just mean it's generally conservative Republicans who are against Abortion.. but also Against universal Health care.. I know enough Conservative Christians in my area -Church is filled with Republicans.. if you're not one.. better not open your mouth, or they'll set you straight.. but yeah. they would shudder to hear I was for "Assisted Suicide"...

I mean.. sure we can all just take a bottle of pills.. I guess It's those who can't even do that.. paralyzed from the neck down.. I feel for them.. they have the right... I have a few books on these issues... Final Exit: The Practicalities of Self-Deliverance and Assisted Suicide for the Dying,...." A Merciful End"... and "Last rights, the struggle over the right to die"..

The babies.. I guess we do have "CHIP" right now in this country.. a friend & me were talking about it the other day... it's till age 19 I guess... and it's income guidelines are much higher than those for the parents... so thank God for this.. babies should be OK...

The truth is.. I really don't trust ANYONE who has an attitude of "It's not my concern, don't touch my taxes...if you find yourself down on your luck.. it's your own fault".. there is clearly a mentality there that blames the lower income for their predicament, we're all lumped together..... so with enough of these leading our Government.. I do not trust that CHIP won't be chipped away also...
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post #54 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 08:48 AM
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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Originally Posted by jld View Post
We stopped in France on the way home from India and had ds's blood checked. Test cost me $8.

A few weeks later we had to have the same one done in America. $200.
Two things

1) The French pay for their healthcare through other means - high taxation for example. If you paid only $8 then you were a foreigner who did not pay fair share for the services you received and therefore were subsidized by the French taxpayer.

2) What blood work costs $200? Mrs. Blue has this done all the time and the "true" charge is never $200. Are you referring to the retail cost or the actual network insurance paid charge. For example, provider bills for $35. Insurance pays $3.50 and the provider accepts that as payment in full.

BTW, if you can afford to be travelling in France and India, shouldn't you be paying your fair share of your families health costs?
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post #55 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 08:51 AM Thread Starter
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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Originally Posted by SimplyAmorous View Post
I just explained how a family like mine could fall through these cracks.. so sure.. if you are dirt poor.. everything is covered.. unfortunately IF YOU WORK, always had a job, then find yourself on hard times after a lay off.. Jobs that offer benefits are going the way of the dinosaur .. and these Marketplaces options sound like a situation where I might as well hold up a sign saying "Will work for health care for my family".. as it could cost like $2,000 a month when we might be strapped making $45,000 a year... then some horrendous deducible like $10,000 a year on top of that.. It's just not reasonable, feasible..

I just mean it's generally conservative Republicans who are against Abortion.. but also Against universal Health care.. I know enough Conservative Christians in my area -Church is filled with Republicans.. if you're not one.. better not open your mouth, or they'll set you straight.. but yeah. they would shudder to hear I was for "Assisted Suicide"...

I mean.. sure we can all just take a bottle of pills.. I guess It's those who can't even do that.. paralyzed from the neck down.. I feel for them.. they have the right... I have a few books on these issues... Final Exit: The Practicalities of Self-Deliverance and Assisted Suicide for the Dying,...." A Merciful End"... and "Last rights, the struggle over the right to die"..

The babies.. I guess we do have "CHIP" right now in this country.. a friend & me were talking about it the other day... it's till age 19 I guess... and it's income guidelines are much higher than those for the parents... so thank God for this.. babies should be OK...

The truth is.. I really don't trust ANYONE who has an attitude of "It's not my concern, don't touch my taxes...if you find yourself down on your luck.. it's your own fault".. there is clearly a mentality there that blames the lower income for their predicament, we're all lumped together..... so with enough of these leading our Government.. I do not trust that CHIP won't be chipped away also...
From the opening post:

It means that if you are a struggling parent who is uninsured or under-insured, you will no longer be able to count on at least your kids getting the routine medical and dental care they need under the Children's Health Insurance Plan (CHIP). The Senate GOP voted that CHIP is not required to be protected by an eventual ACA replacement.


One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #56 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 09:05 AM
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Re: If ACA is repealed

Its simple. If they can keep everybody focused on health insurance, the medical industry avoids drawing attention to the cost/profits of medical delivery. The question of why medical cost per person is much higher in the U.S. than anywhere else needs to be answered with something other than, "because we have the best health care in the world". We all seem predisposed to believe the more something cost, the better is and the medical industry has applied it to their advantage. Hence, the $200 blood test in the U.S. is far superior than the $8 blood test in France.

If you don't embody controversy, what you say will become just another part of the media driven culture of stifling thought and debate about issues.
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post #57 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 09:16 AM Thread Starter
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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Originally Posted by blueinbr View Post
Two things

1) The French pay for their healthcare through other means - high taxation for example. If you paid only $8 then you were a foreigner who did not pay fair share for the services you received and therefore were subsidized by the French taxpayer.

2) What blood work costs $200? Mrs. Blue has this done all the time and the "true" charge is never $200. Are you referring to the retail cost or the actual network insurance paid charge. For example, provider bills for $35. Insurance pays $3.50 and the provider accepts that as payment in full.

BTW, if you can afford to be travelling in France and India, shouldn't you be paying your fair share of your families health costs?
We paid the full foreigner price--$8. For French taxpayers it would have been even less. Everyone benefits from a more organized system.

We used to live in France. The full foreigner price to
see our local doctor was between $30-40. No time limits, either. The French enrollees paid $1. They could not believe how expensive it was for us.

The $200 was the full charge before insurance paid.

We pay premiums and deductibles and any necessary co-pays here in America. It certainly is advantageous to be in countries where health care costs are lower, though.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #58 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 09:18 AM Thread Starter
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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Originally Posted by VladDracul View Post
Its simple. If they can keep everybody focused on health insurance, the medical industry avoids drawing attention to the cost/profits of medical delivery. The question of why medical cost per person is much higher in the U.S. than anywhere else needs to be answered with something other than, "because we have the best health care in the world". We all seem predisposed to believe the more something cost, the better is and the medical industry has applied it to their advantage. Hence, the $200 blood test in the U.S. is far superior than the $8 blood test in France.
It is just sad how easily Americans are duped into accepting ridiculously high costs for healthcare.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #59 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 09:19 AM
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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Originally Posted by lifeistooshort View Post
It's amazing to me that so many people seem to think that before the ACA they didn't pay for everyone else's health care.

News flash: your did. Until you refuse care and turn people away from the ER you're paying.

And health care is something we all eventually need, so it's in everyone's interest to contribute.

So the question is how best to manage the damages.

Besides, we all pay for others for lots of stuff. I have two kids and the family rate for me is the same as for people that choose to have 8 kids. Why should I subsidize that?

Maybe I'm morally opposed to paying for people who drink their liver to death or people who stuff their faces and get diabetes. Can I opt out of contributing?

Nope, because I'm part of society.

Because when you live in and participate in society you contribute to the greater good.

There's a little to much hooray for me and screw you going on in the Republican party.
I would expect an actuary to be more realistic about how insurance works. Should people who are actuarially likely to use more services not have to pay more for insurance?

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post #60 of 275 (permalink) Old 01-29-2017, 09:21 AM
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Re: If ACA is repealed

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Me personally.. I care FAR MORE to have a catastrophic policy over one that pays for a free screening every year..
That's the only type of health insurance that actually makes sense. Imagine how much car insurance would cost if it covered gas!

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