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post #16 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:04 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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Originally Posted by uhtred View Post
Many many other options out there.

I don't know if there is a god, I have not yet seen any convincing evidence. If there is a god, and his actions are accurately represented by the bible, then I believe he is evil, and I will not follow him.

There are a billion Hindus who believe in multiple gods.

There are 2 billion Christians and 1.5 billion Muslims who believe in the same god, but frequently view the other religion as incorrect, and even evil.

There are at least 70,000 people who identify their religion as Jedi.
Some claim that Jews, Christians and Muslims believe in the same God.

In the Qur'an it states that Judaism and Christianity are false and distorted by men. And that is why God passed on the covenant to Islam.

All three of these religions view the other two as wrong.


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post #17 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:08 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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Originally Posted by uhtred View Post
Many many other options out there.

I don't know if there is a god, I have not yet seen any convincing evidence. If there is a god, and his actions are accurately represented by the bible, then I believe he is evil, and I will not follow him.

There are a billion Hindus who believe in multiple gods.

There are 2 billion Christians and 1.5 billion Muslims who believe in the same god, but frequently view the other religion as incorrect, and even evil.


There are at least 70,000 people who identify their religion as Jedi.
More on the bolded part. I believe that any belief and/or faith is evil if it's teachings state that the followers have the right to fight others simply to try to force them to convert and to spread their religion and their political control over others.

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post #18 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:14 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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I thought humans were supposed to have been created after his image in which case wouldn't we also be perfect? Or is it only referring to the looks.
I don't think this refers to looks at all. God is not a human-like in appearance.

IMO, it means that it refers to intellect, emotions, will, etc.*

And 'image' is different from a 'clone'. We are not exactly like God in that we are not 'clones'.

But instead have some attributes (like intellect, emotions, will). An image of something only shows part of what that thing is.

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post #19 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:17 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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I don't think this refers to looks at all. God is not a human-like in appearance.



IMO, it means that it refers to intellect, emotions, will, etc.*



And 'image' is different from a 'clone'. We are not exactly like God in that we are not 'clones'.



But instead have some attributes (like intellect, emotions, will). An image of something only shows part of what that thing is.


Or possibly we invented god in the way we have evolved these same neurological (brain chemistry driven) attributes.


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post #20 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:19 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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I don't think this refers to looks at all. God is not a human-like in appearance.

IMO, it means that it refers to intellect, emotions, will, etc.*

And 'image' is different from a 'clone'. We are not exactly like God in that we are not 'clones'.

But instead have some attributes (like intellect, emotions, will). An image of something only shows part of what that thing is.
So we're supposedly created in god's image, what "He" thinks is an ideal being. How do you explain all the people on death row who have raped, murdered, disfigured, etc?

Were they Satan's batch or something?

I'm just trying to learn.
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post #21 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:24 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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In his image, which means if Jesus were alive today, he would not be able to travel to America due to a potential travel ban. He looking more of his Palestinian origin than the bearded European looking guy we typically see painted in so many misrepresentations.
The travel ban on the countries Libya, Sudan, Somalia, Yemen, Iran, Syria and not the areas where Jesus was born and lived.

It has nothing to do with what a person looks like.

People world wide tend to paint Jesus to look like themselves. For example in most Coptic paintings of Jesus, he is black. In Japan he looks Japanese. In the middle eastern Christian/Catholics churches the paintings reflect the local appearance of the local population.

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post #22 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:24 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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Originally Posted by UMP View Post
God did create Adam and Eve in perfection.

They freely chose to sin against God. Given that we are all descendants of Adam and Eve, we now carry that same sinful nature and we all die because of it.
I think if you believe the bible (I don't) we are more directly related to Noah and his three sons. God wiped the earth clean with his great flood and chose Moses as the purist of humanity to start mankind over again. Or something like that.


I had to come back and correct this, I had put Moses instead of Noah, my bad.

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post #23 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:26 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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Originally Posted by Ikaika View Post
Or possibly we invented god in the way we have evolved these same neurological (brain chemistry driven) attributes.
Who knows?

I was explaining how the statement of "in God's image" is discussed in religious terms.

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post #24 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:26 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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The travel ban on the countries Libya, Sudan, Somalia, Yemen, Iran, Syria and not the areas where Jesus was born and lived.



It has nothing to do with what a person looks like.



People world wide tend to paint Jesus to look like themselves. For example in most Coptic paintings of Jesus, he is black. In Japan he looks Japanese. In the middle eastern Christian/Catholics churches the paintings reflect the local appearance of the local population.


So, Palestinians can gain a visa to the US with no problem? But, to be historically correct, Jesus looked more like a Palestinian.


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post #25 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:30 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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Originally Posted by EleGirl View Post
Who knows?



I was explaining how the statement of "in God's image" is discussed in religious terms.


I understand. When asked if I believe in god, I answer no. But if asked if god exist, I typically answer yes. The cognitive dissonance can be thought it terms of who God is. If two or more people believe in a god, he/she exist. It requires no evidence other than the shared subjective belief. I nor anyone else can question that belief and as such that is fine by me.


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post #26 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:34 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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Originally Posted by browser View Post
@inmyprime



I totally get what you're trying to do, and I respect that and I respect you.



However all you're going to get from the Bible thumpers is more nonsensical scripture. Your logical, pointed, rational questions are (to them) nothing more than an excuse to to keep right on preaching.


No I know that. These conversations are unlikely to produce anything new/revelatory. I was just venting at my own frustration of not being able to follow this thinking or missing a religious gene or something...Imagine the comfort living in a world in which you don't have to worry about your loved ones really dying* or living a life looking forward to an afterlife of eternal bliss..If that was true one could forgive some of the other horrors religions have done to this world.
Otherwise we just have to live this life as if it's our last one.

*'cos they'll be taken care of and you reunite with them again, supposedly


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post #27 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:38 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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So we're supposedly created in god's image, what "He" thinks is an ideal being. How do you explain all the people on death row who have raped, murdered, disfigured, etc?

Were they Satan's batch or something?

I'm just trying to learn.
(For argument's sake)

I don't think that God was creating an ideal being. I think that if God exists and He created humans He created humans to have some attributes of such as intelligence, free will, etc.

Shoot, if we believe that God created everything, then He also created the laws of physics, etc. that govern the entire universe, to include the earth and all the plants, animals (which includes humans), etc. Humans would then be the one creature that He created to have more of his attributes. Not perfect at all. Humans are, as we know very flawed.

Some people seem to think that God is some dude in the sky that is playing a game like chess with humans and the world. I don't see it that way. Instead the way I see it (if He exists) He started the process a long time ago (Big Bang?) and the entire thing is just doing what the laws of physics, etc. determine.

The universe is a harsh place. Humans are a very small part of that. Does God favor us? Don't know. The way the Bible describes it, our bodies are hosts for souls (spirits) that have a lesson to learn by living a life on earth in a human body.

Satan? The Bible talks about Satan... a fallen angel who has challenged God and is playing with us to show God that he's not such a hot shot after all.

What I do know is that evil exists in that there are people who purposely do horribly evil things and even enjoy doing evil. Is Satan involved? Don't know. I think that the Bible tries to explain why evil exists and that there seems to be a constant fight between good and evil in the nature of humans.

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post #28 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:42 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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Imagine the comfort living in a world in which you don't have to worry about your loved ones really dying* or living a life looking forward to an afterlife of eternal bliss..If that was true one could forgive some of the other horrors religions have done to this world.
Otherwise we just have to live this life as if it's our last one.
I feel EXACTLY the same way. The god fearing religious folks have a distinct advantage over the rest of us. They don't care if they screw up this life, there's always another one right around the corner. If a 5 year old girl is abducted, raped, and murdered, it's "gods plan" and her family will join her when they get to the other side. 3 million people wiped out in a natural disaster? Those people wiped out in the church massacre by some psychopath? They obviously didn't pray enough.

And what's really nice about it, is that nobody's going to ever be able to prove them wrong. If you don't agree it's because 'you can't see it' like they can.

I picture a bunch of dinosaurs obediently being led into a big wooden boat by a man and a couple of boys and I laugh. But then I almost cry. Because people BELIEVE this nonsense.

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post #29 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 02:50 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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I understand. When asked if I believe in god, I answer no. But if asked if god exist, I typically answer yes. The cognitive dissonance can be thought it terms of who God is.
I do think that there is one intelligence that is our entire universe. It's what started the whole thing and what keeps it going.

I think that most religions are an attempt to make sense of this and to set some moral standards for human behavior based on the culture’s understanding of the bigger picture (the creator(s) of the world that they live in.)

Pagan religious look at individual sources of power, and not so much the big picture.

Mono-theistic religious look to understand the one power that started and controls all things.

Both provide flawed views because the human ability to understand and see all is very flawed.

I think that the monotheistic is more in line with the way I think about things… the big picture.

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If two or more people believe in a god, he/she exist. It requires no evidence other than the shared subjective belief. I nor anyone else can question that belief and as such that is fine by me.
I’m ok with people believing any darn thing they want to as long as they do not harm others based on the beliefs and try to impose control over others based on their beliefs.

To me for example, the entire Communist (capital “C” intended) movements that lead to Red China, the Soviet Union, etc. are very really a form of religion that follow a dogma. They have done as much evil on this earth as any religion.

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Last edited by EleGirl; 03-14-2017 at 03:43 PM.
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post #30 of 777 (permalink) Old 03-14-2017, 03:09 PM
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Re: God: Summing it up

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I do think that there is one intelligence that is our entire universe. It's what started the whole thing and what keeps it going.



I think that most religions are an attempt to make sense of this and to set some moral standards for human behavior based on the culture’s understanding of the bigger picture (the creator(s) of the world that they live in.)



Pagan religious look at individual sources of power, and not so much the big picture.



Mono-theistic religious look to understand the one power that started and controls all things.



Both provide flawed views because the human ability to understand and see all is very flawed.



I think that the monotheistic is more in line with the way I think about things… the big picture.







I’m ok with people believing any darn thing they want to as long as they do not harm others based on the beliefs and try to impose control over others based on their beliefs.



To me for example, the entire Communist (capital “C” intended) movements that lead to Red China, the Soviet Union, etc. are very really a form of religion that follow a dogma. They have done as much evil on this earth as any religion.


I agree that a religion that suppresses as do some current ones just as Christianity did back in medieval Europe, are examples of unacceptable beliefs.

As for me, the characteristics built around the natural physical and chemical. chaos along genetic randomness helps to explain things better than an intelligent being.


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Last edited by EleGirl; 03-14-2017 at 03:38 PM. Reason: removed name of eye drops I need to ask for from my quote
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