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Old 06-28-2012, 12:43 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Default Re: Sonofab***h.....Supreme Court upholds Obamacare

They are trying to do away with public education already! It's unreal.
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Old 06-28-2012, 12:49 PM   #47 (permalink)
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Default Re: Sonofab***h.....Supreme Court upholds Obamacare

Except of course for all the Medicare and Medicaid money that flows to hospitals...
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Old 06-28-2012, 12:51 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Default Re: Sonofab***h.....Supreme Court upholds Obamacare

Price controls.

They create shortages.

Competition creates abundance - as people struggle to lower their production costs into the realm where people can actually pay for it.

This health plan basically organizes doctors, nurses, and other healthcare professionals into de-facto unions. I'm sure that will keep costs down.

Yeah.
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:00 PM   #49 (permalink)
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Default Re: Sonofab***h.....Supreme Court upholds Obamacare

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Originally Posted by Unhappy2011 View Post
And what exactly is wrong with the Post Office?
they're about to go bankrupt
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:04 PM   #50 (permalink)
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How so?

I am not an expert on this thing, but I don't see anywhere how the Govt is going to actually run the hospitals and employ the Drs and other health care providers.

Those are still gonna be private enterprises right?

And the health insurance companies are still private enterprises? Right?

It just new regulations. Right?
Private health insurance companies will eventually be driven out of business. Whatever survives will be so pricey most won't be able to afford it. Choice, quality, accountabily, all will suffer. Don't believe me, study whAt really goes on in countries with socialist healthcare programs. We DID have the best healthcare in the world. (not perfect, it needs some reform, but not like this). Anyway, kiss it goodbye america
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:06 PM   #51 (permalink)
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Default Re: Sonofab***h.....Supreme Court upholds Obamacare

Amen!
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:09 PM   #52 (permalink)
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Default Re: Sonofab***h.....Supreme Court upholds Obamacare

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I would argue the solution is simply supply and demand.
.


And that's why the government should get their butt out of it.
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:10 PM   #53 (permalink)
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they're about to go bankrupt
Umm. Exactly. Does anyone here like how the government runs things? Really? Did you enjoy your last trip to the DMV? How about the social security office? Efficiency and service at its finest right? Sh&t I can't believe people are so naive
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:12 PM   #54 (permalink)
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Default Re: Sonofab***h.....Supreme Court upholds Obamacare

I just hope EVERYONE has to pay into it.

However, why should Joe Shmoe pay only $75 bucks a month but we have to pay $330 because we make more? Doesn't our care cost the same? Ohhh, I see how it goes. We'll pay more for the same care. Hm.
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:14 PM   #55 (permalink)
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Default Re: Sonofab***h.....Supreme Court upholds Obamacare

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so how is the government going to run the hospitals?
Poorly
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:14 PM   #56 (permalink)
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Default Re: Sonofab***h.....Supreme Court upholds Obamacare

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so how is the government going to run the hospitals?
Go to any county hospital and see for yourself IT'S HORRIFYING!
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:18 PM   #57 (permalink)
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Default Re: Sonofab***h.....Supreme Court upholds Obamacare

Here's 50 reasons for you....please take a moment to peruse them.


1) Pg 22 mandates that the Government will audit books of ALL EMPLOYERS that self insure. So every employer in the United States will be subjected to a health insurance audit just as all taxpayers are subject to audit. Of course, we will have to pay for an entire new bureaucracy to do this--the Internal Health Revenue Service?

2) Pg 30, Sec 123 states that there will be a government committee that decides what treatments you are allowed and what your overall benefits are.

3) Pg 29, lines 4-16 basically mandates the rationing of health care as is being done in Canada.

4) Pg 42 recognizes the power of the Health Choices Commissioner to determine your health benefits. You will have no choice.

5) PG 50, section 152 states that free, taxpayer-paid health care will be given to the 30 million non-citizens in the USA, even illegal aliens.

6) Pg 58 states that government will have possession of all your health care records & history including finances and you will have to have a National ID Healthcard.

7) Pg 59, lines 21-24 gives direct access to your banks accounts to compel you to pay any out-of-pocket or premium costs electronically without your previous consent.

8) PG 65, sec 164 provides for a political payoff from the Democrats and Obama; a special subsidized plan for retirees and their families in unions community groups like ACORN.

9) Pg 72, lines 8-14 creates a Health Care Exchange to bring private health insurance plans under government control. This part of the bill reveals Obama's lies about being able to keep your plan if you like it. Any health insurance plan which does not completely rework itself to conform to these regulations will be dropped from the exchange and those insured will have to pick one of the plans in the exchange. This is why the Congressional Budget Office determined that over 20 million will lose the coverage they are now enjoying if Obamacare is implemented.


10) PG 85, line 7 provides specifics for benefit levels for all health plans, giving government the right to ration everyone's healthcare.

11) PG 91, lines 4-7 mandates that doctor's offices, clinics and hospitals provide language-appropriate services, basically ordering them to hire translators at the expense of the American taxpayer.

12) Pg 95, lines 8-18 allows the government to hire non-profit community groups like ACORN and Americorps to sign up people for the government health plan.

13) PG 85, line 7 provides for specifics on benefit levels for Medicare recipients, basically rationing the care of every senior citizen I the United States.

14) PG 102, lines 12-18 mandates that all Medicaid eligible will be automatically enrolled in Medicaid based upon income and insurance status. No choice.

15) Pg 124, lines 24-25 states that no private company or individual can have the right to sue the federal government for medical price fixing, basically eliminating your right to seek redress in the courts regarding your medical care.

16) Pg 127, lines 1-16 dictates doctors' payment and therefore income which will reduce what doctors earn and lead to greater shortages of doctors and more rationing of care.

17) Pg 145, line 15-17 any employer not currently insuring their employees must enroll employees into public plan option, with no choice of private insurance allowed.

18) Pg 126, lines 22-25 mandates that employers must pay for health insurance even for part-time workers and their families, which will certainly lead to massive layoffs.

19) Pg 149, lines 16-24 all employers with an annual payroll bigger than $400k who does not pay to enroll employees in public insurance option will pay an 8% tax on all payroll.

20) Pg 150, lines 9-13 mandates that employers with an annual payroll between $251K & $400K who does not pay to enroll employees in public insurance option will pay a 2-6% tax on all payroll.

21) Pg 167, lines 18-23 any individual who is self-employed and does not have health insurance will be taxed 2.5% of income and forced to accept public health insurance. So paying for health care out of pocket will be banned from the face of the earth.

22) Pg 170, lines 1-3 exempts non-resident aliens from the individual health care taxes, so Americans citizens will pay for these aliens, legal and illegal alike.

23) Pg 195 officers & employees of the new Health Care Administration will have access to all Americans personal financial records and accounts.

24) PG 203, line 14-15 actually says that "The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax." Yes, it says that.

25) Pg 239, line 14-24 mandates that available physician services will be reduced for Medicaid recipients. Many poor people including many seniors will be affected.

26) Pg 241, line 6-8 mandates that all doctors receive the same pay, regardless of specialty. This will vastly reduce the number of specialists available in the United States, a common problem where medicine is socialized like Canada.

27) PG 253, line 10-18 allows the federal government to set the value of doctor's time, professional judgment.

28) PG 265, Sec 1131 mandates and controls the productivity of all health care providers including surgeons!

29) PG 268, Sec 1141 regulates the rental & purchase of power driven wheelchairs.

30) PG 272, Sec. 1145 regulates the operation of certain types of cancer hospitals, again rationing the care of cancer patients.

31) Page 280, Sec 1151 allows the government to penalize hospitals for what is deemed to be preventable readmissions. So instead of being sued for malpractice, the government will be the punitive body when mistakes are made.

32) Pg 298, lines 9-11 mandates that if a doctor treats a patient during initial admission and that result in a re-admission, the doctor will be subject to federal penalties. Gee do you think that's going to drive up the cost of malpractice.

33) Pg 317, lines 13-20 will create prohibitions on ownership and investment in the health service industry for doctors.

34) Pg 317-318, lines 21-25, and 1-3 will prohibit the expansion of all hospitals.


35) pg 321, lines 2-13 allows hospitals apply for an exception to the expansion rule but they must seek community input first!

36) Pg335, lines 16-25, Pg 336-339 mandates the establishment of outcome based health care and insidious idea that actually limits the treatment choices made by patients with their doctors, based upon the patient's health and condition. This will result in the oldest, weakest and sickest patients being denied treatments simply because the statistics for success in their demographic category are poor! This is a form of health care rationing that will save money at the expense of seniors to help buy insurance for the uninsured, most of whom are young and healthy!

37) Pg 341, lines 3-9 allows the government to disqualify Medicare Advantage Plans and HMO forcing people into the government run public plan.

38) Pg 354, Sec 1177 will arbitrarily restrict the enrollment of special needs children and adults.

39) Pg 379, Sec 1191 mandates the creation of even more bureaucracy in the Telehealth Advisory Committee.

40) PG 425, lines 4-12 mandates "Advance Care Planning Consultation," another insidious vehicle to save money by encouraging seniors who are in poor health to be more accepting of death rather than fighting to stay alive and healthy and with their loved ones.

41) Pg 425, lines 17-19 mandates that all senior patients will be consulted regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney.

42) PG 425, lines 22-25, 426 lines 1-3 provides an approved list of end of life resources, to help guide seniors about the process of dying!

43) PG 427, lines 15 mandates program for orders on the end of life, actually giving the government a say in how your life ends!

44) Pg 429, lines 1-9 dictates the frequency with which an Advance Care Planning Consultant will have to meet with patients as their health deteriorates.

45) PG 429, lines 10-12 give an Advance Care Planning Consultant the power to order end of life plans for a patient.

46) Pg 429, lines 13-25 will only allow certain doctors, not necessarily your own physician, to write an end of life order.

47) PG 430, lines 11-15 allows the government to decide what level of treatment you will have at end of life.

48) Pg 469 mandates "Community Based Home Medical Services" through non profits like ACORN. (Happy yet that we elected a community organizer to the White House?)

49) PG 489, Sec 1308 forces taxpayers to pay for Marriage & Family therapy under the public insurance plan.

50) Pg 494-498 allows the government to define mental illnesses and what services will be allowed to treat, again rationing this care.
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:22 PM   #58 (permalink)
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Default Re: Sonofab***h.....Supreme Court upholds Obamacare

now everytime someone gets a headache they're gonna run to the ER or doctor "because it's FREEEEEE"
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:22 PM   #59 (permalink)
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so how is the government going to run the hospitals?
I think you like this idea because you think you're going to end up with more money in your pocket. Analyze further. It's just another vehicle with which to tax you. And you'll get lower quality healthcare and lose your power to choose to boot.
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Old 06-28-2012, 01:23 PM   #60 (permalink)
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Default Re: Sonofab***h.....Supreme Court upholds Obamacare

Yea that's all angering.

Why be a doctor and waste all that money for school and years in training when they won't get paid big bucks?

And wtf do they mean by "rationing" healthcare?

Like I said, the HMOs already suck...can't imagine anything lower.
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