False Reconciliation without all the Facts - Page 3 - Talk About Marriage
Reconciliation This forum is for those focused on reconciliation and success stories from people who have been through separation and reconciled successfully.

User Tag List

 56Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread
post #31 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-25-2016, 11:17 AM Thread Starter
Member
 
MAJDEATH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: USA
Posts: 1,022
Quote:
Originally Posted by TAMAT View Post
MAJDEATH,

You wrote, I talked to my W about this last night. She is adamant that based on what she has studied/analyzed/learned, the WS should never provide details of the A, that it cannot help and will only hurt the chances of a successful R. She regrets that she ever told me.

From what I believe I understand about your recovery, you would have gotten a divorce had there not been relatively full disclosure. So does your wife feel that Given the choice of divorce or disclosure, she would choose divorce.

Tamat
I believe she would say that it's not that simple. Full disclosure would most likely end in D, say 90%, especially if done soon after the A. If a BS asks for full disclosure, and you don't provide it (or wait several years/TT), there is a moderate chance of D, say 50%.
So based on this analogy, if you cheated but want to try save your marriage, besides admitting to the A, asking for forgiveness, and demonstrating genuine remorse, you should not disclose full details for a greater chance at avoiding D.

MAJDEATH is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #32 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-25-2016, 11:34 AM Thread Starter
Member
 
MAJDEATH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: USA
Posts: 1,022
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConanHub View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by MAJDEATH View Post
I talked to my W about this last night. She is adamant that based on what she has studied/analyzed/learned, the WS should never provide details of the A, that it cannot help and will only hurt the chances of a successful R. She regrets that she ever told me.
You're wife has shown herself a tremendous fool on far more than one occasion.

I would never take advice from her about infidelity or marriage.
Posted via Mobile Device
5 other couples (dealing with infidelity) within our extended family have received counseling from her, and all were able to successfully R. 2 of them were in divorce court when they initially contacted her. Granted, this is a small sample.
She believes that it is imperative to "give back" the knowledge and experience she has gained in these matters, with the goal of saving marriages. She asks them up front, "do you want to save your marriage?". If the answer is no, she cannot help them.
MAJDEATH is offline  
post #33 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-25-2016, 11:43 AM
Member
 
ConanHub's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Abroad. Currently Arizona.
Posts: 7,584
Re: False Reconciliation without all the Facts

Quote:
Originally Posted by MAJDEATH View Post
5 other couples (dealing with infidelity) within our extended family have received counseling from her, and all were able to successfully R. 2 of them were in divorce court when they initially contacted her. Granted, this is a small sample.
She believes that it is imperative to "give back" the knowledge and experience she has gained in these matters, with the goal of saving marriages. She asks them up front, "do you want to save your marriage?". If the answer is no, she cannot help them.
I have been doing this for nearly twenty years.

Your wife has more than one screw loose.
Posted via Mobile Device
ConanHub is offline  
 
post #34 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-25-2016, 01:49 PM Thread Starter
Member
 
MAJDEATH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: USA
Posts: 1,022
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConanHub View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by MAJDEATH View Post
5 other couples (dealing with infidelity) within our extended family have received counseling from her, and all were able to successfully R. 2 of them were in divorce court when they initially contacted her. Granted, this is a small sample.
She believes that it is imperative to "give back" the knowledge and experience she has gained in these matters, with the goal of saving marriages. She asks them up front, "do you want to save your marriage?". If the answer is no, she cannot help them.
I have been doing this for nearly twenty years.

Your wife has more than one screw loose.
Posted via Mobile Device
ConanHub I don't remember, but aren't you a divorced man? I guess you needed more help than just your experience/knowledge.
MAJDEATH is offline  
post #35 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-25-2016, 08:34 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 912
Re: False Reconciliation without all the Facts

MAJDEATH,

You wrote, 5 other couples (dealing with infidelity) within our extended family have received counseling from her

And did she advise them not to disclose details?

I guess that's an issue with me, because I had a very serious illness about 10 years ago. It looked like I would die soon, my W broke down and another woman comforted her.

My W told me that, the OW confessed that when her own husband was also sick she had an affair. What do you think the probability is that she told my W to NEVER confess or tell any details.? I find it very difficult to believe that this woman confessed to my W without my W confessing to her. For my W this was an enormous revelation btw, it is a family trait.

There is also the problem of someone else knowing more about your marriage than you do.

Tamat
TAMAT is online now  
post #36 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-26-2016, 10:21 AM Thread Starter
Member
 
MAJDEATH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: USA
Posts: 1,022
Quote:
Originally Posted by MAJDEATH View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by TAMAT View Post
MAJDEATH,

You wrote, I talked to my W about this last night. She is adamant that based on what she has studied/analyzed/learned, the WS should never provide details of the A, that it cannot help and will only hurt the chances of a successful R. She regrets that she ever told me.

From what I believe I understand about your recovery, you would have gotten a divorce had there not been relatively full disclosure. So does your wife feel that Given the choice of divorce or disclosure, she would choose divorce.

Tamat
I believe she would say that it's not that simple. Full disclosure would most likely end in D, say 90%, especially if done soon after the A. If a BS asks for full disclosure, and you don't provide it (or wait several years/TT), there is a moderate chance of D, say 50%.
So based on this analogy, if you cheated but want to try save your marriage, besides admitting to the A, asking for forgiveness, and demonstrating genuine remorse, you should not disclose full details for a greater chance at avoiding D.
She advised all 5 to not reveal details of infidelity if they were truly seeking R. If they didn't care or were seeking a D, she could neither assist them nor tell them to keep the details to themselves. In fact, she would say that if you want to drive your spouse to D faster, tell them all the details about your infidelities, especially the sexual comparisons!
MAJDEATH is offline  
post #37 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-26-2016, 10:26 AM Thread Starter
Member
 
MAJDEATH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: USA
Posts: 1,022
Quote:
Originally Posted by TAMAT View Post
MAJDEATH,

You wrote, 5 other couples (dealing with infidelity) within our extended family have received counseling from her

And did she advise them not to disclose details?

I guess that's an issue with me, because I had a very serious illness about 10 years ago. It looked like I would die soon, my W broke down and another woman comforted her.

My W told me that, the OW confessed that when her own husband was also sick she had an affair. What do you think the probability is that she told my W to NEVER confess or tell any details.? I find it very difficult to believe that this woman confessed to my W without my W confessing to her. For my W this was an enormous revelation btw, it is a family trait.

There is also the problem of someone else knowing more about your marriage than you do.

Tamat
Personally, I hate it when someone else knows more about my personal business than I do, and my W knows this. We don't talk about finances, kids, sexual practices, etc. with others. That's what trusted, long-term counselors and covenant spouses are for.
MAJDEATH is offline  
post #38 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-26-2016, 10:31 AM
Member
 
ConanHub's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Abroad. Currently Arizona.
Posts: 7,584
Re: False Reconciliation without all the Facts

Quote:
Originally Posted by MAJDEATH View Post
She advised all 5 to not reveal details of infidelity if they were truly seeking R. If they didn't care or were seeking a D, she could neither assist them nor tell them to keep the details to themselves. In fact, she would say that if you want to drive your spouse to D faster, tell them all the details about your infidelities, especially the sexual comparisons!
If a BS wants details a WS gives details or is not remorseful and still trying to manipulate the situation and their BS for an outcome desirable to them. Unhealthy in the extreme to start a new foundation on more bvllshyt.

I've seen near miraculous results with the exact opposite applied.

Your wife believes lying, manipulation and deceit to keep a marriage is a desirable outcome and that speaks worlds about her extremely unhealthy thought process about what a marriage even is.

She is still a cheater at heart.
Posted via Mobile Device
ConanHub is offline  
post #39 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-29-2016, 01:53 PM Thread Starter
Member
 
MAJDEATH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: USA
Posts: 1,022
Quote:
Originally Posted by ConanHub View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by MAJDEATH View Post
She advised all 5 to not reveal details of infidelity if they were truly seeking R. If they didn't care or were seeking a D, she could neither assist them nor tell them to keep the details to themselves. In fact, she would say that if you want to drive your spouse to D faster, tell them all the details about your infidelities, especially the sexual comparisons!
If a BS wants details a WS gives details or is not remorseful and still trying to manipulate the situation and their BS for an outcome desirable to them. Unhealthy in the extreme to start a new foundation on more bvllshyt.

I've seen near miraculous results with the exact opposite applied.

Your wife believes lying, manipulation and deceit to keep a marriage is a desirable outcome and that speaks worlds about her extremely unhealthy thought process about what a marriage even is.

She is still a cheater at heart.
Posted via Mobile Device
A counselor friend of mine suggested that the WS should only provide answers that will lead to the desired outcome of R, and they will know what information will be too detrimental for the BS to recover from. Is it deceit, yes. But for a positive purpose. Or they could simply say they had an A, but now it's over. The WS knows the level of deceit with the AP, and knows what it takes to get over it.
Isn't a marriage a desirable outcome for both parties, especially when children are involved?
MAJDEATH is offline  
post #40 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-29-2016, 01:58 PM
Member
 
marduk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 7,490
Re: False Reconciliation without all the Facts

Quote:
Originally Posted by MAJDEATH View Post
A counselor friend of mine suggested that the WS should only provide answers that will lead to the desired outcome of R, and they will know what information will be too detrimental for the BS to recover from. Is it deceit, yes. But for a positive purpose. Or they could simply say they had an A, but now it's over. The WS knows the level of deceit with the AP, and knows what it takes to get over it.
Isn't a marriage a desirable outcome for both parties, especially when children are involved?
Bull****.

A reconciliation based on lies is no reconciliation.

Tell your counsellor he's full of **** and should stop 'helping' people. Seriously. I have a great MC, and she says the exact opposite of your 'friend.'

marduk is offline  
post #41 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-29-2016, 02:17 PM
Member
 
Pluto2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,625
Re: False Reconciliation without all the Facts

Are you honestly suggesting that a spouse should lie for the good of a marriage? What do you think will happen if (and it has been shown it is much more likely to be when) the BS discovers the truth. What kind of marriage do you think will be the result then? Would it not be better and healthier to trust your spouse with the truth?

In youth it was a way I had, to do my best to please, And change, with every passing lad to suit his theories.
But now I know the things I know, and do the things I do; And if you do not like me so, To hell, my love, with you! --Dorothy Parker
Pluto2 is offline  
post #42 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-29-2016, 02:26 PM
Member
 
Steve1000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: The Big O / S-Hai
Posts: 1,029
Re: False Reconciliation without all the Facts

Quote:
Originally Posted by GusPolinski View Post
Nope.
Posted via Mobile Device
Virtually no one will ever have all the facts. If your point is that no one can ever have a true happy reconciliation, I might agree. I'm still undecided.
Steve1000 is online now  
post #43 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-29-2016, 02:32 PM
Member
 
marduk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 7,490
Re: False Reconciliation without all the Facts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve1000 View Post
Virtually no one will ever have all the facts. If your point is that no one can ever have a true happy reconciliation, I might agree. I'm still undecided.
No-one can have all the facts. But you can have enough facts.

For some it's knowing when, how, and what kind of sex they had while cheating. In minute details. For others, it's just knowing that they had sex. Or not. Everybody has their own amount of detail that will suffice.

Saying it wasn't physical when it was, or lying about any of it when asked... Or saying that they won't tell you...

All takes reconciliation off the table. Don't ask a betrayed spouse to do all the work to reconcile after your affair, and then not give them the facts. Or do what happens to some -- have it come out months or years later, and then have to go through it all over again.
marduk is offline  
post #44 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-29-2016, 02:33 PM
Member
 
Steve1000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: The Big O / S-Hai
Posts: 1,029
Re: False Reconciliation without all the Facts

Quote:
Originally Posted by MAJDEATH View Post
Smarter people than I have suggested making a list of all questions that you need answers to, prior to even considering a R. Then set a reasonable time line for completion of the Q&A sessions, with additional time for follow up and/or clarifications.
I wish I would have done this the first time (in 2006).
I did manage to do this, but the results still weren't that helpful. I found out much later that while most of her answers were truthful, it wasn't 100%. Also, as you can imagine, her answers lead to multiple more questions. The other big problem is that I didn't have enough information to know everything that I should be asking about.
Steve1000 is online now  
post #45 of 100 (permalink) Old 02-29-2016, 02:35 PM
Member
 
marduk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 7,490
Re: False Reconciliation without all the Facts

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve1000 View Post
I did manage to do this, but the results still weren't that helpful. I found out much later that while most of her answers were truthful, it wasn't 100%. Also, as you can imagine, her answers lead to multiple more questions. The other big problem is that I didn't have enough information to know everything that I should be asking about.
Then you should leave her and not look back.
marduk is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on Talk About Marriage, you must first register. Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

Important! Your username will be visible to the public next to anything you post and could show up in search engines like Google. If you are concerned about anonymity, PLEASE choose a username that will not be recognizable to anyone you know.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
reconciliation advice needed Wingman171 Reconciliation 4 01-26-2016 09:25 AM
Interesting Porn Facts EllisRedding Sex in Marriage 4 01-05-2016 10:26 AM
Brief EA, disconnection, and reconciliation. Lost Lady Coping with Infidelity 37 12-28-2015 05:41 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome