Wondering - Talk About Marriage
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post #1 of 7 (permalink) Old 09-05-2016, 05:42 AM Thread Starter
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Wondering

Still going to marriage therapy for reconciliation and so far so good.
I am very busy with work and so is he but touch base when he is not travelling, spend weekends together going to movie, etc

The other day talking about one of his company trips which took place in July as he is planning another one for another group of staff. I asked what would the itinerary be like and he said there wouldn't be much time to do anything as they had conference all day plus dinners in the evening.
I asked was there no partying at all at the last one, and he said no. He said the hotel was a family place with entertainment for families. I asked was there no live band, he said no.
I know he lied to both questions.

How do I know? I have access to his colleagues FB. This colleague posts photos and videos of events including the staff trip. I saw a video of them all dancing like crazy including my H! He was not doing anything inappropriate. The video has been removed also (strangely). There where also photos of the certain staff relaxing at the pool drinking beer and going on treks into the woods. None included my H though he had said he hung out with these specific people.

I do not know whether my mind is working over time ( I have gotten the wrong end of the stick before and don't want to jump to any conclusions) but why lie? My H has never been very straight up with information and had lied or been sparse with the truth before. This has set me back in my willingness to be open to him.

He has noticed and asked why I was so withdrawn, I side stepped this as I don't want him to know what i know. I also don't want him to know my source.
He left on another work/golfing trip this morning and was very affectionate with me before leaving.

Perhaps it is time for my radar to go into action again. I still don't trust him, will I ever?

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post #2 of 7 (permalink) Old 09-05-2016, 05:54 AM
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Cool Re: Wondering

After all of that controverting evidence, @aine ~ let's just say that your trust in him should be totally shot by now!
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post #3 of 7 (permalink) Old 09-05-2016, 07:09 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Wondering

My trust in him was shot years ago, was trying to work to bring it back, but right don't know what to think. Maybe I am thinking too much.
He has given up the drink now for over 7-8 months, that's a great thing. There is no evidence he is lying or pulling the wool over my eyes on that one. I would know (years of experience).
I have to keep my head down and observe. He has never really been a man of real integrity so what am I expecting?
Ironically, he has planned for us to go away this coming weekend to a nice resort.
Now I do not want to go. I am not good at playing chess though looks like I ought to and go.

He is overseas and trying to call me, I'm not answering, I need my space today.

I'm not sad or angry, just confused which I guess is an improvement for me. The emotional upheavals have reduced substantially. Back to work.
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post #4 of 7 (permalink) Old 09-05-2016, 03:13 PM
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Re: Wondering

@aine,

This is easy, actually. You actually DO trust him--you trust him to be DISHONEST. What you are actually struggling with is TRUSTING HIS HONESTY.

You don't trust his honesty because he is not being trustworthy. In order to build trust in his honesty, he would start by having his words and actions match. He would be where he says he is. He would be doing what he says he's doing. He would be with who he says he is with. In other words, he would be honest on the "little things."

Right now, he is not being honest about the "little things" and if someone can not be honest about the "little things" then obviously you can not depend on their honesty for "the big things."

Now my guess is that he feels/thinks that if he tells you there was dancing at the last event, that you'd "get mad" or something to that effect. He wants to dance AND have you be okay with him being wild! And rather than be an honest partner, he is avoiding facing the consequence of his choice to be dishonest!

So this isn't about you at all--not in the least. You trust him 100%--to lie to you.

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post #5 of 7 (permalink) Old 09-05-2016, 04:00 PM
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Re: Wondering

Aine, it might be best to lead him in honesty and tell him what you know and how you know it... that takes your out of the game you hate playing. To me, people lie out of fear or lack of respect... there is very little else one would risk forfeiting their very self over, and be honest with him in his cause and effect world for this upcoming trip.

"Husband, when you tell me these untruths I feel I am worthless and disrespected in your eyes and do not understand why you would want to spend a weekend with me in this resort if you truly see me as such".

Assuming that in the end, if he really had a fear of your reaction, a true fear that you would not approve and his actions would be a boundary that would solicit grief, then he would stand on his own merit by letting others know that his is not the best thing for him at this time or he would simply remove fear and seek permission from you to do this activity and not forgiveness... but he is not even seeking that, he would rather bury himself in a lie.

If it is disrespect for you, I doubt from what you share he will own up so continue to place yourself so that when the truth is one again skirted, you have a door available to for your self-sanctuary... you know what corners look like, keep yourself out of them as you have been but in the end, you will have to build on something more, or something else, than what you are finding.

Stay mindful my friend...

Last edited by Emerging Buddhist; 09-05-2016 at 05:43 PM. Reason: mindful grammer...
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post #6 of 7 (permalink) Old 09-05-2016, 04:26 PM
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Re: Wondering

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emerging Buddhist View Post
Aine, it might be best to lead him in honesty and tell him what you know and how you know it... that takes you out of the game you hate playing. To me, people lie out of fear or lack of respect... there is very little else one would risk forfeiting their very self over, and be honest with him in his cause and effect world for this upcoming trip.

"Husband, when you tell me these untruths I feel I am worthless and disrespected in your eyes and do not understand why you would want to spend a weekend with me in this resort if you truly see me as such".

Assuming that in the end, if he really had a fear of your reaction, a true fear that you would not approve and his actions would be a boundary that would solicit grief, then he would stand on his own merit by letting others know that his is not the best thing for him at this time or he would simply remove fear and seek permission from you to do this activity and not forgiveness... but he is not even seeking that, he would rather bury himself in a lie.

If it is disrespect for you, I doubt from what you share he will own up so continue place yourself so that when the truth is one again skirted, you have a door available to for your self-sanctuary... you know what corners look like, keep yourself out of them as you have been but in the end, you will have to build on something more, or something else, than what you are finding.

Stay mindful my friend...
According to NMMNG, people lie out of fear...fear of not getting what they want, fear of the repercussions, fear of disapproval, etc.

Has your H read NMMNG? It could help him figure himself out, and if he does that, improve his side of the marriage and build trust.
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post #7 of 7 (permalink) Old 09-06-2016, 04:00 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Wondering

Thank you to affaircare, Above rubies and E Buddhist, for your very insightful and thoughtful replies

1. AC, you are right, I have lived so long with the let downs, the broken promises etc, I have no trust. He is dealing with this in IC and has acknowledged integrity is an issue . He evades or lies to avoid unpleasantness, being called out, etc. I am quite confrontational so maybe he does not feel safe?
I called him about this and he said he felt that if he said he was partying I would be upset. His idea of partying is getting drunk, my idea of partying is just dancing and having a laugh with or without drink. I can understand what he is saying but feel that he really knows how to split hairs. I know he was not drinking.

2. EB, he already guessed my source! and threw in the person's name when we spoke. I didn't confirm or deny. He is so used to being 'accused', afraid of what the other party needs or wants to know that he lives in fear. A lot of this is tied up with his childhood and his default position is to whitewash. I know that he bends the narrative to suit the person or circumstances, sometimes I will call him out, other times I let it go.

3. Fear is an important feature of his actions, but it is unwarranted fear. Maybe he doesn't feel safe with me, hasn't for a long time as I am confrontational esp in the last few years. I am tired of the old way of doing things, I want an authentic life.

Anyway, he'll be back soon, I will see where this leads, if he brings it up at all, if not, I will let it be. It is enough that he knows that this is not OK with me. Not the partying per se but the blatant lying.
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