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post #61 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-22-2013, 11:49 AM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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Paedophiles are not all rapists, they're just sexually attracted to children. And sometimes, these children too 'consent' to
do you really mean that?


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post #62 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-22-2013, 12:01 PM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

Da Saint, proverbs 22:6 is supposed to be a cure for homosexuality? Wow, things are simple in your world.
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post #63 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-22-2013, 12:45 PM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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do you really mean that?
DaSaint, I think you better clarify your sentence before it gets misconstrued..........

Any child under 18 is a minor and even if they consent, it doesn't matter. The law protects them, hence there is no consensual sex and it is rape.

This is in the States, are you in another country?
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post #64 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-22-2013, 02:08 PM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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DaSaint, I think you better clarify your sentence before it gets misconstrued..........

Any child under 18 is a minor and even if they consent, it doesn't matter. The law protects them, hence there is no consensual sex and it is rape.

This is in the States, are you in another country?

I hope not to be misconstrued.

As you rightly said, the law protects them (does not permit such r/ships)...even if the 'offender' claims that his/her sexual orientation is paedophilia or the minor claims to consent/be responsible for the act. Using the same tactics used by "gay" rights
activists, pedophiles have begun to seek
similar status, arguing their desire for children
is a sexual orientation no different than
heterosexuals or homosexuals. They have thesame logic as homosexuals, so should they be given legal rights too?
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post #65 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-22-2013, 02:22 PM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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Da Saint, proverbs 22:6 is supposed to be a cure for homosexuality? Wow, things are simple in your world.

Yes Wazza!
Things can be that simple. Train a child in the way of the truth & life. If you don't the society, media, etc will do the training in a perverse way.
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post #66 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-22-2013, 10:30 PM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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Yes Wazza!
Things can be that simple. Train a child in the way of the truth & life. If you don't the society, media, etc will do the training in a perverse way.
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How many gay people do you actually know well enough to know their stories. I know many examples that refute what you are saying.

Theological question here. Taking your slant on the proverbs verse, is it possible to train someone never to sin?
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post #67 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-22-2013, 10:35 PM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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Yes Wazza!
Things can be that simple. Train a child in the way of the truth & life. If you don't the society, media, etc will do the training in a perverse way.
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Didn't the Mormons try to "reprogram" their gay members through therapy (I don't think they do that anymore, but I'm not sure)? I assume the Mormons "trained" their children not to be gay, yet it happened anyway. Was that the media training their children?
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post #68 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-22-2013, 10:35 PM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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I hope not to be misconstrued.

As you rightly said, the law protects them (does not permit such r/ships)...even if the 'offender' claims that his/her sexual orientation is paedophilia or the minor claims to consent/be responsible for the act. Using the same tactics used by "gay" rights
activists, pedophiles have begun to seek
similar status, arguing their desire for children
is a sexual orientation no different than
heterosexuals or homosexuals. They have thesame logic as homosexuals, so should they be given legal rights too?
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It is not the same logic, the notion of consent is different. This is why, for example, I regard rape as wrong, even when it is heterosexual. And why sex with a thirteen year old girl is one matter if the partner is her fourteen year old boyfriend and another if the parter is her teacher, or her uncle...

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post #69 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-22-2013, 10:40 PM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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Didn't the Mormons try to "reprogram" their gay members through therapy (I don't think they do that anymore, but I'm not sure)? I assume the Mormons "trained" their children not to be gay, yet it happened anyway. Was that the media training their children?
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Not Mormon, but same idea.
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post #70 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-23-2013, 02:50 AM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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Theological question here. Taking your slant on the proverbs verse, is it possible to train someone never to sin?

The Message bible puts it this way...

'point your kids in the right direction-when they're old, they won't be lost.'

As an adult, have you ever lied? My modest guess is yes. It was probably a tight situation, a little lie and it didn't hurt anyone. Did your conscience prick you saying ''wazza, you lied'', and did you wish things had turned out in such a way that telling the absolute truth would have been easier? If yes, it means that you were taught that it is wrong to tell lies and you should always be truthful no matter what. However, as we journey through life, every good virtue we hold to be true is constantly being challenged by situations & circumstances. If those virtues are not deeply rooted in an individual through repentance and God's word, they're easily blown away when they're challenged by the 'world's system.
IMO prov 22:6 is saying after training a child in the way he should go, when he gets old, no matter the challenges he faces, or what is the popular belief, he knows right from wrong...he is not lost/confused. Now its up to him to DO what he knows to be right or do what he knows to be wrong (because it is easier or everyone's doing it or it 'feels' right or its legalised).
In the context of this thread, if a CHILD is taught that ONLY male-female unions were instituted and made perfect by God, and that homosexuality is deemed as detestable/abhorrent by God, when s/he grows up, even if s/he feels/indulges such strange passions, s/he KNOWS it is wrong.
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post #71 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-23-2013, 03:25 AM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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It is not the same logic, the notion of consent is different. This is why, for example, I regard rape as wrong, even when it is heterosexual. And why sex with a thirteen year old girl is one matter if the partner is her fourteen year old boyfriend and another if the parter is her teacher, or her uncle...

Of course wazza, rape is totally wrong!

Talking about consented sex where one party is a minor, how will you react to the adult's claim to being born 'that way' (having a sexual preference for children)?
While a sexual r/ship between a 19yr old and a 45yr old might not be 'wrong' in and of itself, doesn't it make you say 'eewwww'? Remind me why these terms exist - sugar daddy, cougar, toyboy, etc.
Don't get me wrong wazza, i'm not advocating for paedophiles in anyway. I am only pointing out to you that paedophilia is as equally twisted as homosexuality.
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post #72 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-23-2013, 04:04 AM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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Of course wazza, rape is totally wrong!

Talking about consented sex where one party is a minor, how will you react to the adult's claim to being born 'that way' (having a sexual preference for children)?
While a sexual r/ship between a 19yr old and a 45yr old might not be 'wrong' in and of itself, doesn't it make you say 'eewwww'? Remind me why these terms exist - sugar daddy, cougar, toyboy, etc.
Don't get me wrong wazza, i'm not advocating for paedophiles in anyway. I am only pointing out to you that paedophilia is as equally twisted as homosexuality.
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The line I draw is that God gave people free will. Western society is essentially secular, with separation between church and state.

So, with pedophiles, I will argue the state has a duty to intercede. I feel sorry for then pedophiles, but the greater good is to stop them.

Homosexuality is different. If I see in need to do other than allow personal choice.
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post #73 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-23-2013, 05:10 AM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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The line I draw is that God gave people free will. Western society is essentially secular, with separation between church and state.


Once again i agree with you that God gave us free will, BUT our choices have consequences (God's judgement). And despite the free will, God WILL NOT change his standards.


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So, with pedophiles, I will argue the state has a duty to intercede. I feel sorry for then pedophiles, but the greater good is to stop them.
Once again, i agree with you. I could as well say thesame thing regarding homosexuals. I also wonder why the outcry and blacklisting of sovereign states (countries) that have legislation against homosexuals. Must the eastern, nothern & southern soceities (lol) accept homosexuality simply because our western society accepts it?
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post #74 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-23-2013, 05:20 AM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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Once again i agree with you that God gave us free will, BUT our choices have consequences (God's judgement). And despite the free will, God WILL NOT change his standards.




Once again, i agree with you. I could as well say thesame thing regarding homosexuals. I also wonder why the outcry and blacklisting of sovereign states (countries) that have legislation against homosexuals. Must the eastern, nothern & southern soceities (lol) accept homosexuality simply because our western society accepts it?
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If you put pedophiles on the same plane as gays, then we do not agree at all. The comparison is obscene by my standards.
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post #75 of 220 (permalink) Old 12-23-2013, 08:33 AM
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Re: What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view?

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Actually it's not about what we THINK or FEEL but what God says in His Holy Scripture.

...who can argue with the Holy Word of God?

Uh, would that be the KJV? or the Roman Catholic Bible? or the Talmud? or the Qu'uron? or one of the HUNDREDS of translations of the Christian Bible into English alone (not to mention all the other world languages)?

The original question is 'What do you feel about homosexuality in a religious view' and my answer would have to be that I try very hard NOT to hold 'religious' views!

There could be a God, or gods, or a race of gods...I don't know. Unless s/he/they tap me on the shoulder and start speaking DIRECTLY TO ME, I'm going to continue to believe that everything written down on his/her/their behalf is errant human interpretation or what some errant human(s) believe(s).

I am going to continue to exercise my human intellect (which is what is supposed to put us above other 'animals') and decide for myself what makes sense logically and lovingly. If it turns out I'm wrong, God will, no doubt, have free reign to smite me as s/he/they see fit!

My belief is that I should use my own intelligence, inquisitiveness, humanness to try to understand, support, increase the good in myself and others. If that means I do not follow the dictates of others, then so be it.

Others are, OF COURSE, free as well to do as they see fit!
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