Are we just uncompatible in bed?

Anancletos · 05-07-2010, 02:54 AM

Hi guys,

I'm 34 years old and I've been married for 5 years now, and have 2 lovely kids. Now, the marriage has been a bit odd. When we just got to know each other and were freshly in love we were having some fun in bed. Gradually, it all migrated to doing the same thing over and over again. My wife just does not seem to be interested in doing anything else but the same old position. After some talks, I found out that she does not really seem to enjoy oral sex (with her being on the receiving part, that is), whereas I abolutely like this and don't see what could possibly be wrong with that. She also told me, she never masturbated before. She hates porn and she finds the sight of another man's penis disgusting. Hmmm :-/ Strange indeed...

Now, I have the feeling that ever since we got married, she had the impression of having me for good now and sex was promptly reduced to a boring heap of misery. And now, we are at a point where we didn't have sex for months. She keeps finding excuses, not being in the mood and other things. Maybe her sexdrive is very low, I have no idea and can respect it as well. She is just not really into all this sex thing apparently. I am more and more getting the idea that she does not really enjoy it.

She is also a very choleric person who can go from totally normal to extremely mad in about 0.2 seconds. She starts yelling and yapping, and as sudden as it came, it is gone as well. This is not really something that improves my feelings towards her. I do not want to say I am a perfect husband or even anything remotely close to that, but I am really investing time and efforts here. I am doing so many things for her. And she does not seem to notice all that.

When I point her out that there are limits, and that certain chores I will not do because I have a job to do, she gets mad. I have the feeling she wants to play the little princess and let others serve her. This behaviour also cost her a lot of friendships. Now, this is not totally irrelevant in this "sex in marriage" part of the forum. Because she gets mad so easily, I have to counter things. Sometimes be on the verge of being rude because I really cannot do some silly thing right now because I am doing my work, which is keeping us alive. The latest thing is that she starts telling me that I can forget about sex for a long time now. It seems to be her newest weapon. I don't care any more, since we were not having any sex anyway. And if we do, it is just plain boring.

The problem is, I feel totally frustrated now. And I notice some girls flirting with me and some of them clearly want more. I am tempted, but don't think I would end up having an affair. I guess I am too scared it might really destroy the last things we have left. But I notice I am having fantasies of other women. Maybe this is a normal thing, maybe not, I have no idea. That is where I would like your feedback. :-)

And are there other people who really like to experiment and discover things in bed, but their partner does not want to? How do you cope? Has any of you ever sought the help of "outsourced sex"? Any bright ideas?

Thanks in advance for your comments.

HappyHer · 05-07-2010, 06:34 AM

It sounds like your wife has some definite issues. Never masturbates, doesn't watch porn, hates the look of penis? All typical of some deep sexual shame. She needs to get over that, in counseling more than likely.

Withholding sex from a partner is a form of emotional abuse.

Regardless of whether she gets angry or not, it's time to sit down and talk things out. I would suggest having a professional on hand for this as it doesn't sound as if she handles situations in a mature enough manner.

My suggestion is to insist on counseling. Don't get into an affair, that will just add to the problem, not resolve it. It's simply unfair to you and your children to live in a home that everyone's happiness is not valued and worked towards.

Anancletos · 05-07-2010, 07:32 AM

Thanks HappyHer. I really appreciate your feedback. It gives me strength to seek some form of professional help. The problem now will be on how to drag my wife along. But that's my problem :-)

I have been going back and forth between the idea of me being the problem or her having a problem. That is why I was looking for some feedback from others. I have no clear view on the situation any more.

As far as her having a sexual shame, I do have an idea where it might come from. The first time she had sex, she virtually got raped by her ex boyfriend while she was passed out from being drunk. I've talked to her about this, but she insists that it was a bad experience, but it does not influence her. I cannot file charges either, since it is over 10 years ago and legally we have no options.

I think our situation here is a complex set of different things and I have been wanting my wife to go to a psychologist, but she sees it totally different. She thinks a psychologist is for "crazy" people.

Nevertheless, thanks a lot for sharing your views. It brings me back on the right track.

HappyHer · 05-07-2010, 07:44 AM

You're welcome. Set some appointments with several different people, see if they do "mini" sessions in order for both you and your wife to feel if they are a good fit. It's very important to find someone that you are both comfortable with. If they do mini sessions, you can touch on the situation and get feedback without having the full investment until you find someone you both feel good about working with. This is not going to be a one session situation.

In every relationship, both people have a part. So, I can't say it's you or it's her as I'm sure there are changes you'll both need to be willing to make to accommodate each other.

I'm sorry to hear of her experience. It is obvious that there is some issues going on for her that inhibit her from being able to open up and fully enjoy sexual expression. I really hope she will attend to those to the best of her ability.

Psychologists aren't for crazy people by any means. They are for people that have challenges in life and we all have those.

Keep posting and let us know how you are doing.

VeryShyGirl · 05-07-2010, 10:56 AM

Speaking from experience I can tell you that sexual shame does not always stem from a bad experience. I had an awesome (fairly religious) upbringing and have never had a damaging sexual encounter in my life. But up until 6 months ago I was like your wife. Sex 1x per month, same position, boring, I could really care less. Then one day it all started to click... I realized I had been thinking about sex all wrong and I was very surprised and upset that I'd been so wrong for so long. Idiot! With some time and effort I've been able to change how I view sex: its no longer something taboo and shady but rather an incredible means of expressing love.

Best of luck to you and your wife in finding what will awaken her. Be patient and loving and remember that her aversion to sex could very well have little to do with you. She can't understand how its hurting you; she doesn't see sex the way you do. I was horrified when I truly grasped how my behavior had been hurting my husband.

Hetfield · 05-07-2010, 07:32 PM

I can relate wholeheartedly on this one. My wife and I have been married for almost 5 years and have known each other since high school (I'm 39, she's 37) but we were apart from the time I was 17 until 7 years ago.

When we first got back together, it was a matter of a couple of "dates" and we were in the sack together. I love giving oral and she seemed shocked (afterwards, she said "what the H was that? omg"). She never gave me anything back but I didn't worry about it at the time. She basically is a get on a go girl and usually only lasts 10 minutes before orgasm. This leaves me getting on top of her to finish up all the while she yawns and tells me to "hurry up, I'm falling asleep".

Over time, our sex life hasn't changed much, except for the odd adventure into the living room, a little game play with dice and cards and a little shower fun. Most of the time, she just climbs aboard and goes until she is done...leaving me to pick up the pieces afterwards.

She does have a sexual past and has admitted to being with what she terms as her "fair share of guys" and says "my past isn't something to be proud of". She was also date raped by her boyfriend of 3 days at a party she was passed out at. She often makes excuses about how tired she is to have sex (housework, yoga, sewing club, working out, yardwork, watching our son, work, etc.) and has stated directly to me "do not expect me to get busy with you during the week, I'm just too tired and have too many things on the go".

She denies the date rape had any effect on her (it was her first time BTW) but does not want to discuss it and simply wants to leave it buried in her past. I know from personal experience that traumatic events like this do not ever go away and there's no point in trying to "bury" them. Subconsciously, events like this will always be there and I think it's one of the reasons she makes the excuses and will not be too adventurous sexually.

I am a sexually energized person who needs sex more than 2 or 3 times a month and more than just on the odd Friday or Saturday night. Morning sex is no good...she's up at 5 to go to the gym. Afternoon sex is no good...she and I both work. Evening sex is no good...our son doesn't go to bed until 8 p.m. (sometimes he's awake til 9). By 9:30-10:00, she's in bed snoring.

Like you Anancletos, I am very frustrated and to the point I have also noticed some women making mental notes and taking interest in me. I'm fairly attractive, in shape, well groomed, I dress well and operate a successful business, so it goes without saying I have a little magnetism. I don't however want to go "shopping" for a little fun on the side to replace what I'm not getting at home.

Just thought I'd throw that at you to tell you that you are definitely not alone!

Anancletos · 05-08-2010, 03:34 AM

Thanks for the honest and open talks here. It really helps me to get my thoughts back into the right direction.

@VeryShyGirl : You are right. Not every form of sexual shame comes from a bad experience. It may very well be the way we were brought up, or other influences. It is indeed a revelation when people can break out of it and just enjoy the love and possibilities within a good marriage. Kudos to you!

@Hetfield : Our situations are very very similar. And just like you, I would have the possibility to get other women, but I just won't do it. The idea is tempting and the fantasy is sometimes maybe there out of sheer frustration, but that is as far as it goes. I hope that you can also find a solution to your problem. I will keep you posted if I can manage to find any good ideas on how to solve or improve the situation.

Honestly, I have to admit that I was getting a bit desperate. Then I found this forum and noticing the fact of not being alone with a problem sheds some light in the darkness. I have been on the verge of giving up but I see there is hope now. And it also takes away the insecurity of feeling guilty.

I've tried talking and everything, but it just does not work. I am convinced that we need external professional help. The next issue will be on how to make it clear to my wife that we have a problem and that we need to work on that. I don't want to hurt her feelings or make her sad, but it will most probably be inevitable.

Susan2010 · 05-08-2010, 03:11 PM

Anancletos, I'm inclined to think two different ways about your wife and situation, and yet both my thoughts are somewhat tied together. Let me try to express myself.

First, it seems your wife has some issue with how she deals with shame. That doesn't necessarily mean she has anything to be ashamed of but that she is embarrassed and feel that embarrassment to be shame. That's the only reason I can think she says she hates porn. I very much hate porn, but my reason is that I hate how it objectifies women. I don't expect she dislikes it for the same reason I dislike it. I think she says she hates it because she is embarrassed to watch it, and therefore correlates that with shame. I say this because of the other things you tell us she dislikes - masturbating she is too ashamed to touch herself, a man's penis she's too ashamed to look at, won't discuss her rape because it is too painful and shameful to admit she was violated, and so on. All of these are normal for most women. The problem for her (and for you) is most women get over them, but your wife has not.

Every last one of those are taboo subjects in most households, so you have to consider how she was brought up. This is also what VeryShyGirl is saying and shares with you that she got over it. However, I have to wonder what prompted VeryShyGirl's revelation. Normally, it is a good lover, their first orgasm, or maybe the imminent reality of losing their guy. It could be almost anything, but my point is that there is a stimulus, a defining moment.

Try to imagine how I (and maybe your wife) felt about sex being mainly for a man's pleasure. It is not a pleasant thought that there's nothing in it for you. That was the way I felt (and most women at some point in their life) until I learned differently. I didn't like receiving oral because it was shameful/embarrassing for me to lay there with my legs open. With a guy on top in missionary position, he can't actually see my legs open to him. After dating and breaking up with this boyfriend here and that one there, I met someone who not only knew what he was doing and how to do it, but also taught me about my body and my pleasure centers. He introduced me to pornography. After he made me comfortable enough to actually sit there and watch it, I was able to allow the psychological and physiological affects that watching porn has. Although he was a very, very well endowed man, he included toys in our love making. He taught me to masturbate.....and to increase my pleasure two-fold, he taught me to masturbate while he was inside me. He liked performing oral sex and always brought me to orgasm. And, even though he was neither physically fit nor as good looking as the guys I was accustomed to dating, I loved the feel of his body and couldn't keep my hands off his penis.

For the first time, I saw what sex and love making were all about, and all of the shame and inhibitions from my upbringing melted away. I became an eager participant in wanting to please him and wanting to be pleased. The only time(s) I ever didn't want sex regularly or gave excuses was when a guy mentally took me back to my early days of feeling sex was for the man and there's nothing in it for me. Otherwise, I am always a willing participant.

I asked him how/where he learned how to make love. He told me he was taught by an older woman when he was 18-19 years old. He was 27 when I met him and I was 21 and began to jokingly refer to him as my guru. Since the time we broke up, other guys have told me they were taught by older women. One particular guy performed oral even better than guru guy, and he also was taught by someone older. I'm sure not all men have that advantage, but I noticed one guy read a book and boy was he ever good and in complete control of himself and his orgasms. He always held out for me and didn't cum until I indicated I was ready for him to "let me have it" (meaning his orgasm). He was a totally considerate lover and completely tuned in to me. He actually couldn't perform unless he knew I was enjoying him.

It seems to be, particularly by reading some of the men's complaints, that most men think that by virtue of it being sex and that sex is pleasurable, it is also pleasurable for the woman. If not, then something must be wrong with her, or she simply doesn't like sex. But nothing could be farther from the truth.

My point is, it cannot be concluded or taken for granted that the joy of sex is always so joyful for her. Women's bodies are much more complex than a man's. When you are inside her, it feels good to you, but your presence there doesn't necessarily feel good to her. You have to learn how to make it feel good to her. Otherwise, she feels, like my early days, that sex is for the man and there is nothing in it for her. Yeah, she just wants it over with, she gives excuses, she avoids sex at all cost. You might think you are a considerate lover because you go down on her, but perhaps you don't do it so well. There are techniques that work and plenty that are more than annoying. Think for me just a moment about what you said, "I found out that she does not really seem to enjoy oral sex" but does it really make sense that a person dislikes pleasure? Dislikes orgasm? Dislikes being driven wild with ecstasy? Reading your post, I expect you are an intelligent, thinking man. Does this really make sense to you?

Most often in cases like your wife, you can't ask a woman what she likes. If she's never masturbated and never really had her mind blown, how can she possibly answer? As a result, men say things like she has no sex drive, she doesn't like oral, she's not interested in sex, she gives excuses, and so on, and so on. You have to find a way to blow her mind, rock her world, and break down her barriers. Although you didn't get lucky enough to be schooled by an older woman, there are books galore. And what is even cheaper is this great invention by which we are now communicating called the internet. There are vast amounts of information and websites. I wish you well.

Anancletos · 05-10-2010, 05:30 AM

Hi Susan2010,

Thanks a lot for writing. Just like you say, sex should be something that is pleasureable for both parties. This is important to me as well. Now, I have had enough experience to have a general idea of what different possibilities one has to try to make sex feel good for one's partner. I have tried many different things already, and always try to get some feedback. Up till now, it is really difficult to get a clear view on what she likes and what she does not really like. I've worked my way through different techniques as described in a lot of books, articles and so on.

I do get your point about not liking porn as it depicts women as a mere object of lust. This is true for most of the porn out there. However, there are also a few productions that think out of the box and are actually a good turn-on for both parties. I can vividly remember my ex girlfriend liking those movies very much and it was one of those things that can get you into "kinky"-mode in no time.

I am giving it yet another try, to open up the topic. And I am not concentrating on sex here. I am wanting to improve the entire relationship, give her a very good and cozy feeling and then as one of the last points I will address the sex topic. I know that marriage is a game of adjusting different parameters and to take into consideration many wishes and situations.

I do hope, that somehow my wife can find a way to open up, forget about shame and just sit back, relax and enjoy. :-) I do think that, just like you say, part of the problem is to be found in the past. The way she was brought up. Her mother was a religion-teacher and my wife is also rather religious. It could very well be that somewhere the idea of sex being "dirty" could be rooted deep in her mind. I don't know. But I intend to find out and hope we can find a solution.

Having boring sex or no sex at all is not really a good thing in a relationship. It is something that belongs in there and something that is there to enjoy. I am sure that if no valid solution could be found, the relationship is doomed to be a bad one.