Seppuku

Hi everyone. I'm a new poster who has been reading the boards for several weeks now, and everyone seems so open and honest (and non-judgemental) that I feel comfortable enough posting, any advice would be greatly appreciated. (My apologies for the super long post.)

Our problem is twofold, but I'm not sure one can be separated from the other just yet - hopefully it will be clear by the end of my post.

Problem 1: Lovemaking is way too infrequent for me. My wife doesn't think it's a "big deal."

Problem 2: I don't believe she has ever had an orgasm, although she tells me she had one (!) on our honeymoon.

Let me preface it by saying that we were both virgins when we got married, and we were very inexperienced. I could barely last through a few minutes of intercourse. Now we have been married going on seven years.

With that said, our sex life has never been stellar, and of late it has been declining. Two times in one month is a good month. So for some reason, quite some time ago I got it in my head that if she at least had orgasm(s) then just MAYBE she would get more satisfaction from it and want it more. She always says (and maintains to this day) that it's OK, it's not a big deal, she's likes it anyway, she doesn't need that.

Needless to say, her never having had an orgasm is very upsetting to me, so I have been working on my performance and researching the topic for some time, hoping that me being better would help her. Most of what I was always doing during foreplay apparently works very well for a lot of women (from massage and caressing to oral and fingers). It would get to a point where she was literally begging for intercourse. So I thought maybe I wasn't lasting long enough or she wasn't getting the right kind of stimulation, so I practiced and got better at lasting longer. I even bought several toys (that she picked out) to try to help. *sigh*

I don't doubt that she is capable of orgasm. She has remarked that she has the strong urge to urinate during intercourse, so we stop while she goes, and guess what: nothing comes out (and we don't continue after she returns). A few months ago I found out that this sensation is a precursor to a g-spot orgasm, so I told her about it. I've tried the same things that got her to that point, and she insists that she has to urinate and goes to the bathroom, even with me reassuring her that she doesn't. Somehow she just can't get past it.

I don't know about most guys, but I certainly don't enjoy spending 30 minutes of foreplay and 30 minutes of intercourse and then suddenly being stopped and told that I should "go finish in the bathroom." If that's all I wanted I can do that myself and never ask for sex. This (plus the infrequency of the act) is honestly why giving up on sex with my wife seems like the best option for me right now. For every time we do it, there were 20 times where she's not in the mood, not thinking about that right now, etc.

I send her articles and she sighs. I try to talk to her about it and she is dismissive. She tells me that I'm "making a big deal over nothing."

In the end I feel unwanted and resentful, I don't even want to touch her or look at her because I'll just get aroused and that just leads to disappointment. We had both gained weight since getting married, and when we recently started losing weight my libido seems to have jumped significantly, which only adds to my frustration. I'm actually holding my weight where it is because I already want it every day and I'm afraid that if I lose more weight then I'll want it more than that.

Since she said she didn't like the vibrators that we bought, I was thinking maybe a dildo that is similar to my size and girth would help, but in recent days I feel like I'd be wasting money and that she wouldn't even want more sex, even if she did have orgasms.

I should add that she has a stressful job and a long commute, which I try to mitigate by doing nearly all of the housework (cooking, cleaning, etc.), and taking care of our daughter, and working full time 10+ hours per day. I am awake and busy for the same number of hours as she is. When we do make love, I am (I think) extremely attentive and she genuinely enjoys it, until something stops us. [I hope to avoid being too explicit, but for example: one day a few weeks ago she was stimulating me manually. The phone by the bed rings - it's our bank. After one ring the phone on the nightstand dies, so she stops abruptly, jumps up and runs to the other room for the phone, and she still missed the call. When she returned some minutes later I was told that I could go finish in the bathroom.] I don't know what else to do; she thinks everything is fine and nothing needs to be changed.

Has anyone had such an issue and been able to work past it? I am out of ideas and almost out of rope.

Sara Ann

I would feel so hurt and rejected. I would be crying by now. I would feel undesired, unloved. So, what to do?

I recommend marriage counseling. She is avoiding sex. I wonder if there is any religious upbringing that taught her orgasms are bad or masturbating is bad. I only ask because you mentioned you both were virgins at marriage. Why is she avoiding sex and not allowing herself to enjoy it? This may be hard for her to verbalize. Would either of you consider marriage counseling?

I'm wondering - does she masturbate? If not, that is a huge red flag. I am thinking of O'Donnell, senator candidate from Delaware, who once in a religious phase believed masturbation was bad. How many religious people are taught this?

I can tell you when I'm in the middle of it with my H, I am only into him, I don't even hear the TV or the phone ring, and if the kids come to the door I tell them to get lost. So in her case, she probably welcomes the phone - it's an excuse to get out of an uncomfortable situation. Is it mental - she thinks sex is bad? She feels guilty for enjoying it. Was she ever sexually abused?

76Trombones

If she's not really into sex then I doubt having orgasms would make her want it more. Maybe you should look more into why she has a low libido and work on that. Orgasms aren't a magical cure, contrary to popular belief.

friendly

Quote: She tells me that I'm "making a big deal over nothing

Quote: In the end I feel unwanted and resentful, I don't even want to touch her or look at her because I'll just get aroused and that just leads to disappointment. We had both gained weight since getting married, and when we recently started losing weight my libido seems to have jumped significantly, which only adds to my frustration. I'm actually holding my weight where it is because I already want it every day and I'm afraid that if I lose more weight then I'll want it more than that.

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I hope she would put lots of effort in healing your wound... keep communicating with your wife until she realized the importance.

Seppuku

We are Christian but I don't believe she was ever taught that orgasms or masturbating are bad, I wasn't. I don't think she's not allowing herself to enjoy it, but it seems like it's up to a certain point. She is really into it when we do make love, it's just not as often as I'd like.

I would consider marriage counseling but I'm sure she would say that it's absurd to go to counseling just because I want more sex.

I am not sure if I am making too much of it or maybe there are some other unresolved trust issues that need to be addressed. I try talking to her and it seems that everything is OK but she's always thinking about work and only wants to cuddle up to me at night. Of course this makes me uncomfortable because after even a few days without making love the slightest touch makes me super aroused and just lying there with an erection becomes painful after a while. When I tell her playfully "now look at what you've done!" and have her feel it she usually either has no reaction or a negative one.

No, she doesn't. I encourage her to, but she says she feels weird doing it by herself; I offer to help and do it for her (and this is actually a big part of our foreplay) but after a while she just wants intercourse. She refuses to let me bring her to orgasm using oral or fingers (or a combination of both). She really loves it but I guess intercourse feels better to her, to the point where she's begging for it.

I asked to choose some toys, she doesn't like the rabbit (says it doesn't do anything for her) so I picked out a dildo that she might like, but now I think buying it would just be a waste of money.

At one point I felt like maybe she did masturbate at some point before we got married and maybe ejaculated during orgasm and she's afraid of that happening again. I told her I would LOVE that (i would!) and tried to be as reassuring as possible. I still hold out hope that she does but at this point I just think she refuses to fully relax and enjoy it.

She used to go down on me often but I've had maybe one BJ in the past 18-24 months. During our most recent session was the first time she put her mouth down there in that long (for just a few moments), it was a little surprising to me.

Of course, if I mention any of this she either thinks I making too much of it by "keeping track" or gets annoyed and it turns into an argument.

No, she wasn't. And to be clear, we weren't having intercourse, she was just giving me a hand job. It just felt like as soon as the phone rang she almost jumped off the bed; she always says she likes doing it but that made me think twice, and I hope I'm wrong but I just can't tell with her.

I've asked her about the BJ thing and she used to tell me that she likes doing it because I like it. When I asked her who she hasn't done it recently she says that she "hasn't really thought about it." I don't really understand this because I love giving and want to do it every time we are together.

I'm thinking maybe there is something going on with her or the stress at work or something else, but she insists that it's not a problem, not caring that it's a problem for ME.

We've gone on week long vacations and made love once the entire time. We have another one coming up in about 5 weeks so we'll see what happens then, but honestly at this point I'm tired of asking and getting excuses; I plan romantic evenings out without the baby and then when we get home it's straight to sleep. When we do make love I try not to pressure her or rush anything, I try to make her feel comfortable and do everything she likes, and still I feel like there is distance, like she is holding back orgasm on purpose.

I am tired of bringing it up too, because half the time it gets twisted into an argument about her needs and the other half of the time she just sighs and dismisses me. I feel that the difference between me and her is that when she complains about me I listen and make and effort to be better. Sometimes I am not successful but I try.

She told me that on average she comes home from work horny two times per week but if there is "something that has to be done" around the house (like dirty dishes, laundry, etc.) she gets preoccupied and focuses on this, and that if I was more focused on getting things done then we would be more sexually "in tune."

I try my best but like I said, I also work and get the baby ready for day care (preparing her meals, getting her cleaned and dressed), clean the kitchen, do the laundry, mow the lawn, clean the pool, etc. Personally I don't see any difference when the house is spotless or there are a few dishes in the sink; so I've just been focusing my energy on doing those kinds of things and not looking for any additional affection. I almost don't care anymore. Maybe when I stop caring completely then it won't hurt so much?

I realize you're only hearing my side of the story but when I try to communicate with her I feel like it's wasted breathe. Maybe I'm just venting here, I don't know.

Thanks for listening.

Seppuku

On the contrary, she's very into when all the planets are aligned and it actually happens.

I think at least she would sleep better if she had orgasms.

Sara Ann

Hmmm.. she doesn't masturbate, she doesn't want an orgasm, that is not normal.

Why are you minimizing your emotional pain, ie this is not important enough to warrant counseling? It sure is!!

Marriage counseling is a must. She has to look at why she is avoiding sex, and how to improve communication between the two of you.

Someone started a thread about what sex means to a man, written from a christian perspective. Many christian women feel a strong duty to have satisfying sex lives. My mormon friend tries to get her husband whenever she can, so he won't stray. My southern Baptist friend was a virgin at marriage, and with 4 young kids she says the best part of him working at home is she can jump him whenever she likes! I think Focus on the Family has some great info on this too - let her read it or listen to it - what does she think? I suspect her attitude about sex is negative - where did she learn that? Can she learn a healthy way to love her husband and enjoy herself?

joelmacdad

with Sara Ann above. Sounds like good old fashion marriage education and counseling is needed.

greenpearl

I used to be a witness, and so did my husband. We are taught that we have to fulfill each other's needs. Men are taught to respect and look after their women. Men are taught women are weak, so it is their duty to provide for us. Women are taught to respect their men and be submissive. We are also taught to keep our places clean. I learned a lot of things from attending their meetings. They are too extreme, I had to leave. But I like all the moral teachings from the Bible.

Witnesses have a book called The Secret of Family Happiness. It is also a great book for families. People can go to their website and read it.

Seppuku

I have encouraged her to do this, but she says that she'd feel weird do it by herself.

Seppuku

I would be open to counseling, my point was that she would not think it's worth it.

I sent this to her and when I mentioned that I email her an article she sighed. I asked her about it later in the day and she said she read "some of it."

When I ask her why she pushes me away or doesn't want to have an orgasm, she says that the sensation is "too intense" and it's her reaction to stop.

Now that I think about it, I think maybe while I am pleasing her orally / manually and she begs me for intercourse she may actually be close to orgasm but for some reason wants the little "breather" while I put on a condom, etc. She'll actually be writhing and moaning with pleasure and then suddenly push my head / hand away very firmly. Then we start having intercourse but after 20-30 minutes I can't hold it anymore. I offer to go down on her again afterwards or use my fingers but she always declines. The times where I did use my fingers after intercourse she says she "really has to pee." I say "no you don't, just relax" but she says "no, I had to pee before, I really do have to pee." Then she goes to the bathroom and comes back, and I know she didn't have to go. This is why I don't know what else to do, I'd rather not waste money on more toys if it won't help.

How else can I get her to relax and just let it happen? This is what makes me feel like she's had an orgasm before and didn't like what happened.

Ladies, has anyone had this problem (feeling like it's too intense / having to urinate) and gotten past it?

Seppuku

I try, and after a certain point she always begs for intercourse.

I've even told her beforehand "I don't want to have intercourse, I just want to please you." (The language is not so sterile of course, I've been sanitizing everything.) Without fail she gets worked up and feeling good and always wants intercourse.

I don't know if intercourse feels so much better or she just wants the break in-between to cool down.

It seems that she is more in control during sex; when I am going down on her, for instance, she seems to almost lose control at some points. That's usually when she asks.

Seppuku

I will try then next time, but honestly I don't feel like initiating at all any more.

Seppuku

This morning I emailed her and laid everything out there. Since for some reason I am unable to organize my thoughts verbally, I thought writing would be better and I wouldn't be interrupted with retorts.

Hopefully she'll read the whole thing and not just dismiss it as more "making a big deal over nothing."

Fingers crossed.

jmsclayton

Hi Seppuku

sharing

Some women ejaculate. And it can feel like they are going to the bathroom. The key is to go to the bathroom before hand. Then if she feels the feeling-it can be her own ejaculate or just the feeling like you said .. She can get past that barrier some of it is in the mind and how to handle it in the mind if that makes sense?.

Some women due to emotional pasts or -whatever-have a fear of losing control in sex -it may be her way of taking back that control and feeling safe in doing so. Have a man be a part of it and so on can be challenge to say the least. What is her background. SOme women dont realize how important sex is to the relationship. And why it is valuable. That can be a part of it too.

Judith



Judith