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I love sex...just not with her...

11K views 86 replies 26 participants last post by  brownmale 
#1 ·
I told my story on another thread. Briefly, I am the HD in the all too common HD/LD mismatch. Married 26 years. My frustration surfaced 5 months ago. Had the "talk" with my wife. Overwhelmed her with my revelation. Demanded some change. Learned a lot about sex. Came to understand that she does not need sex like I do. Understand that she does not desire me. That physical appearance is not important to her as it is to me.

Over the past 5 months, I progressed from

I THOUGHT I wanted sex more often. We had it a little more often. That didn't satisfy me.

I THOUGHT it was because it wasn't sexy; it was stale. We bought a toy. That didn't satisfy me.

I THOUGHT it was because she didn't desire sex. I asked her to consider this and look into how to improve her mood, decrease her stress, increase her libido. She was prescribed an SSRI. She took it one week and stopped. Still not satisfied.

I now THINK that I don't DESIRE HER. I am realizing through all of this that I don't find her attractive. I no longer crave to have sex with her. I do so because it is my only option. But, I am obsessed with the idea of having sex with someone who does crave sex.

I wonder if before we had the talk, when I was routinely rejected 29 out of 30 days, if I craved her more because I knew it was a rare event.

What can I do to try to become "Shallow Hal" and convince myself that she is desirable?

(From what I am learning on these boards, the alternatives to that are far more devastating, life changing and hurtful to more than me).
 
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#10 ·
I don't find her physically attractive. She doesn't work at herself. She has never regularly exercised or dieted. She gained weight with pregnancy and has never lost it (20 years later). She won't wear makeup or perfume. She has low energy. She falls asleep at 8pm. I could go on, but I think that's part of the problem...I am looking for reasons.
 
#3 ·
I now THINK that I don't DESIRE HER. I am realizing through all of this that I don't find her attractive. I no longer crave to have sex with her. I do so because it is my only option. But, I am obsessed with the idea of having sex with someone who does crave sex.

I wonder if before we had the talk, when I was routinely rejected 29 out of 30 days, if I craved her more because I knew it was a rare event.
.
The bolded is the real problem. If your wife could show desire for you, your attraction to her would most likely return. You've spent years being rejected and having your feelings go unreturned. Love cannot exist in a vacuum, it must be fed.

And now you're angry, which is probably not the best approach.
 
#6 ·
While this may or may not be relevant to this thread you should be aware that women in professional porn "appear" to have a high desire for sex because:

  • They are getting paid!
  • They have a fetish for being exhibitionistic.
  • They crave attention from men.

In the case of amateur porn most women "appear" to have a desire for sex because:

  • They do so to please thier lovers.
  • They may not be aware the video will be publicly shared and are putting on an act for the camera in private to be playful for their lovers.
  • They have a fetish for being exihibitionistic.
  • The content is created to facilitate a husband breaking a bad porn habit, so that he can instead watch videos of his spouse and not porn. The wife in this case is imitating what she has seen in porn videos.

NONE OF THE ABOVE are situations in which a women actually has a high desire for sex. While there are probably some exceptions, the above seem to be the most common.

Otherwise I could go get in a van and women walking along the street would be ready to jump in at a moments notice and straddle me. I would find out that they were not even wearing any underwear because somehow they knew I would be driving by! :scratchhead:

Probably the only situation in which a random woman has high desire is in a rebound and she is just using sex to dull the pain from a recent breakup.

I would advise you to take some time to explore how to make your wife's desire respond to yours. Doing so will require time and patience, as well as taking the focus off of arousal and more towards an emotional connection during love making.

Badsanta
 
#8 ·
...Married 26 years.

...Had the "talk" with my wife. Overwhelmed her with my revelation. Demanded some change. Learned a lot about sex. Came to understand that she does not need sex like I do. Understand that she does not desire me. That physical appearance is not important to her as it is to me.

Over the past 5 months, I progressed from

I THOUGHT I wanted sex more often. We had it a little more often. That didn't satisfy me.

I THOUGHT it was because it wasn't sexy; it was stale. We bought a toy. That didn't satisfy me.

I THOUGHT it was because she didn't desire sex. I asked her to consider this and look into how to improve her mood, decrease her stress, increase her libido. She was prescribed an SSRI. She took it one week and stopped. Still not satisfied.

I now THINK that I don't DESIRE HER. I am realizing through all of this that I don't find her attractive. I no longer crave to have sex with her. I do so because it is my only option. But, I am obsessed with the idea of having sex with someone who does crave sex.

I wonder if before we had the talk, when I was routinely rejected 29 out of 30 days, if I craved her more because I knew it was a rare event.

What can I do to try to become "Shallow Hal" and convince myself that she is desirable?

(From what I am learning on these boards, the alternatives to that are far more devastating, life changing and hurtful to more than me).
A few thoughts. I was in a Sex Starved Marriage and my wife and I worked our way into a more loving relationship. You need to decide how much you value your marriage. If you value it and your vows to your wife you will at least try to fix things. You may or may not succeed but you should probably try.

Now as to specifics. From what I have read and experienced, it takes TWO to wreck or fix a marriage. It is usually not something that is done in total isolation by one partner. It is usually a joint responsibility.

You have been sexually rejected, a lot. That hurts. You are probably angry about that at either a subconscious or conscious level. If you want your marriage to succeed, you need to drop the anger; forgive your wife and above all forgive yourself for doing things that hurt her. She is your wife. She can tell by body language, by tone of voice, by facian exprressions when you are angry with her. She doesn't want to have sex with someone who is angrey with her. Think about that for a while.

Your wife has put up with a lot. He have overwhelmed her, demanded changes, and made her get medications. She has at least briefly complied with your requests. If you were training a puppy, you would probably praise the poor creature when it did what you wanted so that it would feel comfortable in doing it again and maybe doing more for you. Have you praised your wife for all that she has tried and the little changes she has made?

What can I do to try to become "Shallow Hal" and convince myself that she is desirable?
In my opinion to convince yourself that she is desirable, you first need to loose your attitude, loose your feeling of entitlement to her affection, and build up her feeling of confidence and self-worth.

For me in curing my SSM, I had to first realize that I was a big part of the problem. I had to first for many many months supply my wife with unconditional love and make her feel loved and cherrished for each day. This was all without any sex or her providing any emotional love to me. Ultimately, with the help of a great sex therapist, my wife finaly understood that if she wanted to remain married and wanted to have a happy marriage, she needed to engage in regular sex with her husband as that was an important part of marriage.

I also learned that I can not force my wife to love me, she is the only one who can decide if she wants to emotionally love me or not.


Good luck.
 
#16 ·
A few thoughts. I was in a Sex Starved Marriage and my wife and I worked our way into a more loving relationship. You need to decide how much you value your marriage. If you value it and your vows to your wife you will at least try to fix things. You may or may not succeed but you should probably try.

Now as to specifics. From what I have read and experienced, it takes TWO to wreck or fix a marriage. It is usually not something that is done in total isolation by one partner. It is usually a joint responsibility.

You have been sexually rejected, a lot. That hurts. You are probably angry about that at either a subconscious or conscious level. If you want your marriage to succeed, you need to drop the anger; forgive your wife and above all forgive yourself for doing things that hurt her. She is your wife. She can tell by body language, by tone of voice, by facian exprressions when you are angry with her. She doesn't want to have sex with someone who is angrey with her. Think about that for a while.

Your wife has put up with a lot. He have overwhelmed her, demanded changes, and made her get medications. She has at least briefly complied with your requests. If you were training a puppy, you would probably praise the poor creature when it did what you wanted so that it would feel comfortable in doing it again and maybe doing more for you. Have you praised your wife for all that she has tried and the little changes she has made?



In my opinion to convince yourself that she is desirable, you first need to loose your attitude, loose your feeling of entitlement to her affection, and build up her feeling of confidence and self-worth.

For me in curing my SSM, I had to first realize that I was a big part of the problem. I had to first for many many months supply my wife with unconditional love and make her feel loved and cherrished for each day. This was all without any sex or her providing any emotional love to me. Ultimately, with the help of a great sex therapist, my wife finaly understood that if she wanted to remain married and wanted to have a happy marriage, she needed to engage in regular sex with her husband as that was an important part of marriage.

I also learned that I can not force my wife to love me, she is the only one who can decide if she wants to emotionally love me or not.


Good luck.
I appreciate the response. I feel that what you are suggesting I do, is what I have been doing for 26 years. Unconditional love. I have not complained about the little sex. I have not told her I was dissatisfied with her or with her body or with anything. I have loved her, supported her, cared for her, raised a family with her, dreamed with her.

Now, after 26 years, I am at my limits and looking for change. I don't want to go back to unconditional love. I want conditional love. I will love you, if you meet my conditions. I do feel entitled. Entitled to someone who understands what I want, and wants that too. I want to fix it.

But, other than on these boards, most advice seems to leave it up to the man to fix it.
 
#19 ·
Thanks to advice from the previous thread, I recognize the inappropriateness of the obsession with the coworker and have been working to eliminate it.

The point of this thread is that I have come to realize that my lack of desire for my wife is perhaps the origin of my problem, not the result. I now suspect that I have not found her desirable for a long time.

It hurts me to write this. How do I tell her that I don't find her desirable?

I have been wondering, lately, if that is why some guys cheat. No, not because they don't find their wife desirable. That's too obvious. I mean, do they cheat because then they would be the bad guy. If a husband told his wife he didn't find her desirable, that would crush her self-esteem. If he cheated, then she could keep her pride knowing he was the one that did something wrong.
 
#21 ·
If I were you, I would try to put the co-worker thing to the side at this point. You've (1) told your wife about it and (2) have resolved to figure out a way to manage the co-worker and stop the inappropriate interactions. You screwed up, but you are fixing it and that is all you can do at this point. So try to move on.

Regarding your wife, I think you have to decide if you even want to want her again. What is the point of resurrecting this desire you've lost? There might be a great reason, but I think you need a reason.

Until you decide this preliminary question, thinking about other women is a total waste of energy.

Believe me, I know it's an awesome fantasy (when you're in the situation you are in now) to look at other women and think, damn, that would be nice.

But you know what? You can LIVE that reality right now if that is what you want to do.

Why sit here and fantasize about it if that is what you really want?
 
#29 ·
Look... take my word for it. You're done. You've checked out. She no longer "floats your boat" and likely never will.

Don't drag this out any longer than it needs to be. People waste 5, 10 years trying to "fix" things that are unfixable.

God knows, I did. What a waste of a decade (or two).
 
#42 ·
Good evening
One part: When you love someone they are attractive to you. I still lust after my wife. She is in her 50s. One breast had a partial mastectomy. Graying hair. By a rational standard, not especially attractive. To me - very attractive. I don't mean that I put up with her appearance, I mean that I am very strongly physically attracted to her.

You no longer desire your wife, and perhaps no longer love her.

Another part: This younger fantasy woman. It is easy to get infatuated with someone if you are not careful. Its not just that she is young, but she is relatively unknown - your mind can fill in all the blanks with what you most desire. You end up with a fantasy to compare with the real world. To her, you may be the same.

Which is cause and effect? Its difficult to tell. I expect that you can't rationally think about how you feel about your wife while there is this fantasy woman in your mind.

So, what are your options:

1) Stay with your wife. Only do this if you can fall in love with her again. You will need to avoid the other woman.

2) Divorce. Tell her you have fallen out of love. Then pursue other interests.

3) Affair. Maybe you will discover you really are meant for each other. Maybe you will find that the reality is not nearly as appealing as the fantasy. Maybe you can keep it hidden, maybe not. Only you know how you feel about it morally.
 
#43 ·
If OP is not attracted to his wife, he's not attracted.

It doesn't matter if he "should" be attracted to her. He's not. It's not a choice.

Let's just take OPs statements at face value for a minute. His wife doesn't watch her diet, she doesn't exercise at all and she doesn't dress well.

If this is true, to me this means she puts ZERO effort into her appearance.

Who cares if 5'2"/140lbs is "normal" (which in itself is questionable outside of obese America)?

Do you want your spouse to say, well, she's normal!

Or do you want your spouse to think you're hot and lust after you?

The answer is obvious!
 
#53 ·
Who cares if 5'2"/140lbs is "normal" (which in itself is questionable outside of obese America)?
:iagree:

Your wife falls into a normal weight range. She is not even considered to be overweight.
Sorry, but I disagree.

At 5'2", I would say 140 pounds is definitely packing a few extra pounds.

Just for reference, ladies clothing is all "vanity" sized now just to make overweight women feel better about themselves and buy more clothes. Today's size 6 is our mothers' generation size 10 :eek:.
 
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#45 ·
CDF-- lest you think I am wholly on your team, please do not start harping on your wife to lose weight right now!

Get her to do something fun and active with you (biking, playing tennis, whatever).

Volunteer to do the grocery shopping and get only healthy food.

There are lots of ways to gently encourage better health.

She is going to think you're an ogre if you start talking about how her weight is the issue.
 
#46 ·
OP,
You must consider that your quest for advice may be futile. You have asked for someone here to, in essence, give you a magic potion. A potion that can make someone love (desire) you and/or you them. If such a concoction existed it would be marketed and be the hottest selling commodity in existence. The old adage, you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it drink, is not only quite accurate but also very applicable to your situation. Consequently, I believe your waning attraction for your wife is due in large part to her lack of interest in you and in her disregard for your desire and subsequent lack of presentation. If she truly relished your desire for her then she would be highly motivated to present irresistible as opposed to blase and you would respond in kind.

To that end, you are limited to implementing whatever physical improvements you are able to do along with offering your wife whatever psychological manipulation you can present. Beyond that, you are powerless to effect change. Sadly, the severity of your desire to do so is inconsequential save for whatever motivation it may provide you. I know whereof I speak and, like you, I simply have too much invested in a thirty plus year marriage to discard it and attempt another relationship. I haven't the desire nor the inclination.

Many here will advocate divorcing your wife and seeking your happiness and that is certainly your prerogative. However, for me at least, happiness is inexorably tied to too many other aspects of life in an intricate interplay of experiences and not limited to the act of sex alone, life is simply far too multifaceted for me to realize such a concept. I find that my frustration mounts as I exaggeratedly contemplate my misfortune so I force my mind elsewhere. That is the only advice I have found to work for me.

Lastly, I can tell you this with certainty. If your wife does not come to the place on her own where she desires you then it will always seem unrealistic and premeditated as opposed to natural and effortless, which is what you desire it to be.I wish you and all those in your predicament good fortune.
 
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#49 ·
I agree with everything you said.
But I don't think being a "people pleaser" is a problem. We all make sacrifices for each other. I think that is an admirable quality in people.

I am considering this a "phase", a mid-life crisis, empty nest syndrome. I do think I am hypersensitive to this issue, right now. I realize that to quench my thirst, I have to change my thought path. I see no other option. That's what I am trying to do. That's what I think is the best choice for me (and those I love).

The consistent morally appropriate and thoughtful responses from TAM are helping remind me of whom I am.
 
#47 ·
Some here have managed to turn their marriages around. Many have not. Of those who have not, some have eventually ended the marriage while others have stayed. At some point, you'll have to decide where you stand. In the meantime, while you can encourage your wife to lose weight obviously you can't make her do it. It's her choice and many women at some point give the struggle up. It doesn't matter what she weighed 30 years ago because she very likely wouldn't look the same at that weight now. The look of youth lasts for a brief time and if you are very thin at 49 you'll likely be carrying a lot more wrinkles than you did at 19. Many women prefer a little extra weight to wrinkles. She may be happy as she is. Or, if not happy, at least resigned at this point and it's possible nothing you say will make much of a difference. Then it comes down to leave or stay. And you're the only one who knows what is best for your situation. So you can try to motivate her (if her weight is truly the real problem). Just be prepared in case it doesn't work.
 
#55 ·
Regarding the weight thing. Being someone that has struggled with her weight through the years, its not as easy as just losing it. His wife probably knows, like me that shes put it on... but its doing something about it that is hard.

I think losing weight and keeping it off is one of the hardest things there is. I think it would be really hurtful knowing deep down that your partner does not find you attractive anymore and thinks your overweight and frumpy... even if you are.

I am really grateful for the fact that even when i was a size 18-20 my husband still loved me the same as he did when he first met me as a 12-14. He never changed towards me in anyway.

I have often asked him how he still found me attractive and still wanted me when i was overweight.... he just told me he never really noticed that i put it on... It was only from a photo when i was at my heaviest that he saw just how big i got.... I still have that photo:smthumbup:...

But he says i was still me, I was still the same person, the same person he took his vows with and he always loved me and always will.... That is true love for you, well its what i think anyway..... I count myself lucky.

Not going to deny tho that i am happy now being a size 10-12... because i am, but it does get really hard for me.


All i am saying is its not easy losing it all, people fall into a rut, I know i did.... I just hope OP does not give up on her, as his wife could be battling her own personal demons.. Like me.
 
#59 ·
I haven't read the whole thread - but would your wife be willing to try to make herself more desirable to you by actually desiring to have sex with you more often? Would that turn you on if she were coming up to you all hot and horny?

I ask because I am in a 16 year marriage where, although I love my husband, I don't have that desire for sex anymore. When I realized how unloved he was feeling about my lack of initiation in the sex department (as well as the overall lack of sex) I decided to start edging during the day periodically. I heard about it from a kinky friend and decided to give it a shot.

I edge almost to the point of orgasm several times a day, and keep that up for a couple or few days and my libido rises dramatically. I'm in a constant state of arousal. Not so much that I can't concentrate to get my house chores done, but enough so that my husband can come home and get me immediately ready for sex just by stroking my tit or ass.

It's really saved us. I rarely have an orgasm, which is fine with me, because when I do have one, my sex drive dies way down and I get into another cold spell unless I immediately start up the edging again.

Anyway, all this is contingent upon your wife actually wanting to try this. It may take a bit to get started, but who wouldn't enjoy going up and just worshipping their body a few times a day? LOL Heck, even once or twice a day would probably dramatically improve things.
 
#60 ·
Just as a side point - and believe me, I see a lot more issues that need to be addressed - but SSRIs are for PSYCHOLOGICAL depression problems, not for creating desire - and in fact, most SSRIs have a strong side effect of INHIBITING libido. If con earned with lighting a fire, throwing buckets of water on it isn't going to help much!
 
#67 ·
Forgive me if this has been addressed, but I just quickly skimmed this thread.

Perhaps the problem is with your technique? I mean, are you a good lover, do you take your time to stimulate her and get her aroused. Perhaps she's not experienced good sex with you or anyone for that matter and therefore is not interested.

I do know though that pressuring her to lose weight and give you more sex isn't going to magically make her crave and desire your body.

For women, generally, wanting sex starts in the mind. She has to feel loved and desired and safe. Telling her she's not attractive does not make her feel safe and wanted.
 
#74 ·
Forgive me if this has been addressed, but I just quickly skimmed this thread.

Perhaps the problem is with your technique? I mean, are you a good lover, do you take your time to stimulate her and get her aroused. Perhaps she's not experienced good sex with you or anyone for that matter and therefore is not interested.
I don't know if I am a good lover. She and I met as virgins.
I do take time to relax her and stimulate her. Always. There is no other way for her. We have never had a "quickie". She needs everything to be just right. That's often a big problem. Things are rarely "just right". When they are, she does O through oral stimulation.

I do know though that pressuring her to lose weight and give you more sex isn't going to magically make her crave and desire your body.
Yes, I understand this. At times, I do think I have made her feel pressured. I certainly try to avoid this. But, based on our talks of late, she not only doesn't desire my body, she doesn't DESIRE any BODY.

For women, generally, wanting sex starts in the mind. She has to feel loved and desired and safe. Telling her she's not attractive does not make her feel safe and wanted.
I have initiated sex through her mind for decades. That's a big part of this. But, I am now learning that not all women are that way.
Part of my recent discovery is that I am just so tired of making her feel loved, desired and safe. I am ready for her to make me feel loved, desired and sexed.
 
#68 ·
Conceal...

I'm glad you're still here, as evidenced by your responses today. *Phew*... was afraid we (or ME) might have driven you off.

Buddy (and I am a woman), trust me, I have walked a mile (or a hundred, or a thousand miles) in your shoes.

I know what it means to be stuck in a mismatch marriage for DECADES.

Please keep posting, be honest, keep an open mind, and I promise, you will find some direction here.

:)
 
#72 ·
Yup. Still here. Not scared away, yet.
It is difficult to fully explain my position. I understand why I am criticized by some.

I wish this were easy. I have said before, I wish I could just be Shallow Hal and see only her as the beautiful person she truly is. But, I have opened a Pandora's Box. I am now analyzing, evaluating and thinking about many things.

I don't know if my lessened desires for her are my fault or hers. Whether it's physical or mental. Temporary or permanent. Fixable or not.
 
#69 ·
It's not a gender thing. I would call a man out for being a slob too.

I get it that women are particularly sensitive about the weight thing.

Men are particularly sensitive about other stuff.

But just because someone doesn't want to face his/her own insecurities does not mean that the world stops caring about this stuff.

People can't really help who they are attracted to. It's not a decision.
 
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