Sexual Relationships 2017 Style - Page 5 - Talk About Marriage
Sex in Marriage Sexual problems are common in many relationships. This section is for discussions about sexuality. Please limit discussions to those asking for help with a problem and those offering advice. Any other threads may be deleted.

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post #61 of 111 (permalink) Old 01-31-2017, 07:56 PM
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Re: Sexual Relationships 2017 Style

Ok women if you're going to go on and on about this then please help me out.

Reading the other penis threads here and looking at the links, I was very surprised by the statistics.

The average length is something like 5-1/4 or 5-1/2 inches, and the standard deviation isn't really that great. That means most men are pretty close to that size.

So when you say size matters what do you actually mean? Are you saying Mr Average +- some preferred range? Are you saying it matters all the time or it matters only when someone falls outside the normal range by a little? ... or a lot?

I'm a data analyst and this sh*t drives me nuts because it is completely unclear what you're saying @faithfulwife even though you've said it MANY times

Second: and this vexes the SH*T out of me... what about girth? The statistics indicate a 6" girth penis is in the 93rd percentile which shocked me. I was shocked because the average is about 4" plus change I think (sorry I don't recall). Again - can you really feel that difference? Is it that big a deal? I ask because I'm aware you guys telescope that vajayjay out the more aroused you get so I'm wondering how you gauge those d1cks over time? I mean it seems the more aroused the smaller he seems. If he totally turns you off he'd feel HUGE because you'd be closed up like a nun!

Ok that's something to work with school me


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post #62 of 111 (permalink) Old 01-31-2017, 08:17 PM
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Re: Sexual Relationships 2017 Style

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Ok women if you're going to go on and on about this then please help me out.

Reading the other penis threads here and looking at the links, I was very surprised by the statistics.

The average length is something like 5-1/4 or 5-1/2 inches, and the standard deviation isn't really that great. That means most men are pretty close to that size.

So when you say size matters what do you actually mean? Are you saying Mr Average +- some preferred range? Are you saying it matters all the time or it matters only when someone falls outside the normal range by a little? ... or a lot?

I'm a data analyst and this sh*t drives me nuts because it is completely unclear what you're saying @faithfulwife even though you've said it MANY times

Second: and this vexes the SH*T out of me... what about girth? The statistics indicate a 6" girth penis is in the 93rd percentile which shocked me. I was shocked because the average is about 4" plus change I think (sorry I don't recall). Again - can you really feel that difference? Is it that big a deal? I ask because I'm aware you guys telescope that vajayjay out the more aroused you get so I'm wondering how you gauge those d1cks over time? I mean it seems the more aroused the smaller he seems. If he totally turns you off he'd feel HUGE because you'd be closed up like a nun!

Ok that's something to work with school me
It depends on the woman. The more girth a man has, the tighter the fit. Nerve endings extend only about 1" into the vagina, so you can't feel the difference in length in that respect, unless he's long enough to bump the cervix, which some women like, but many find uncomfortable. However, a longer penis will result in longer strokes, and vice versa.

And you're not totally correct in the telescope of the vag--the folds loosen to allow for penetration, but they also become engorged with blood to make it feel good. And the strength of her pelvic muscles will make a difference as well.

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post #63 of 111 (permalink) Old 01-31-2017, 08:21 PM
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Re: Sexual Relationships 2017 Style

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It's really not harsh treatment I've received, it is about the bulls*t double standards that some men have (many who don't even realize it). Most women have been groomed to never ever step on a man's fragile sexual ego. Which is a double standard too because men typically don't bother to try to tip toe around our egos (when speaking generally). Most men will explain loud and clear to anyone who will listen that they have this or that (female body part or type) preference and how good it is, but that this or that (too fat, too skinny, no ass, too much ass, no boobs, waist too big, fat legs, skinny legs, ugly face, etc on and on) is horrible, hideous, unf*ckable, etc.

I've just never adopted the attitude that I should protect men's egos since I don't see men going out of their way to protect mine. I don't mean in a romantic relationship, I mean just bantering with who ever. Men just can't wait to tell you how much SIZE MATTERS in every part of a woman's body.

But some of the same men crumble to the ground when we say penis size matters....and height matters....and biceps size matters....and tight asses matter....on and on. Whatever we say matters, some man somewhere freaks the f*ck out about how they don't have whatever we said matters.

Get over it. It all matters.

(not you, Conan)


I sooooo wish you were whispering this in m ear while I was growing up! Can't tell you how many boys/men would be just CRUEL when it came to my flatchestedness. When I was 17, I ask my mother when I would get boobs. She told me, "Don't worry. They'll come." I'm 59 years old and I'm still waiting, lol!

And the attitude you described didn't end at teenage years. I'm still meeting men who will be standing next to me and say something like, "Nice rack!" about another woman.

But that wasn't the worst...

I had a live-in b/f for a few years, when I was in my late 20's. At one point I realized that he was heavily into big boobs. Now, it's not like I wore clothing that would hide my smallish size. So he knew what he was getting BEFORE asking me out. Later on I found out how 'disappointed' he was that he didn't have a girlfriend (me) who sported a couple of 36DD's. Jeez dude. If that's what you want, what the hell are doing with ME?!??

Turned out that I was "available" (sexually). Pretty much better than nothing. Better than using his own hand while he looked for the 'woman of his dreams'. (as if he's really going to find 'her' in the porn magazine "Jugs"). In his mind, at least he was getting laid.

I can't tell you how LOW I felt at that moment.

Thank you, FW, for being my 'voice'.
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post #64 of 111 (permalink) Old 01-31-2017, 08:35 PM
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One question in particular I am not sure I completely believe how indicative the survey is (aside from the fact that 27.7% would be closer to 1 in 4 women versus 1 in 3 women):
Math is hard!

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post #65 of 111 (permalink) Old 01-31-2017, 10:46 PM
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It depends on the woman. The more girth a man has, the tighter the fit. Nerve endings extend only about 1" into the vagina, so you can't feel the difference in length in that respect, unless he's long enough to bump the cervix, which some women like, but many find uncomfortable. However, a longer penis will result in longer strokes, and vice versa.



And you're not totally correct in the telescope of the vag--the folds loosen to allow for penetration, but they also become engorged with blood to make it feel good. And the strength of her pelvic muscles will make a difference as well.


Ahhhhh! Finally something that makes sense. I always assumed the long dong thing was a guy fantasy - with the ridiculous porn out there - and because I was aware of the problem and discomfort of a cervix being pounded. Also I was aware of the limited length of the (typical) woman's nerve endings, implying that "size doesn't matter". BUT you've connected the dots a bit with the "stroke length" factor. Ha that should be part of the d1ck measurement bruhaha. That actually makes sense. Add "average stroke length" to the stats!

The telescoping comment came from a sex therapist I saw - I may have misunderstood - but I believe the cervix and uterus ascend during arousal to lengthen the vagina to accommodate the length of the penis.


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post #66 of 111 (permalink) Old 01-31-2017, 11:20 PM
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Thank you, FW, for being my 'voice'.
My pleasure, sister!

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post #67 of 111 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 12:01 AM
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So when you say size matters what do you actually mean? Are you saying Mr Average +- some preferred range? Are you saying it matters all the time or it matters only when someone falls outside the normal range by a little? ... or a lot?
.....

Second: and this vexes the SH*T out of me... what about girth? The statistics indicate a 6" girth penis is in the 93rd percentile which shocked me. I was shocked because the average is about 4" plus change I think (sorry I don't recall). Again - can you really feel that difference? Is it that big a deal?
To the first bolded....it is more than just about length. There is also the overall look, color, shape, contour, circumcised or not, etc. I think some penises are beautiful, others just ok, others not so much. I will not bother to describe it down much further because it is kind of irrelevant since every woman (for whom this matters) will have their different preferences, but when my girls and I are locker room talkin', we talk about more than length and girth. The look of the thing matters to us, but we don't always agree on what it should be lookin' like.

To the second bolded....I can absolutely feel the difference in girth. It makes a huge difference (he he).

When I was young and first sexually active, I did not feel much inside of me. The thrusting was nice, but even that would get boring pretty quick. I was still into sex for the whole experience, the passion, the lust, the intimacy, the fun. But the actual feeling of the P inside my V....wasn't that much on my radar (though my body always responded appropriately with wetness).

Then after I had a baby and had to do my kegels before and after birth....after about, oh maybe a year of doing them regularly....I all of a sudden (I remember the very first time it happened) could feel EVERYTHING in there. Not at the bottom out point, like FIP said, unless he's bumping my cervix or something. But at the entry point and that one inch or so in that FIP was talking about....OMG....I can feel EVERYTHING. It feels like much more than one inch, but that's probably just because the feeling is so intense.

Think of putting your finger in your mouth. Inside your cheeks, your tongue, even the roof of your mouth. If you close your mouth down and suck on your finger, you can feel your finger with your mouth and tongue, right? If your finger was hot, or if it had a blister, or if it was cold, or if the skin was rough and worn like a piece of dried fruit...you would be able to determine all of this with the inside of your mouth. The tiniest movement your finger made, not even in and out just any slight movement at all, you would feel with the inside of your mouth.

That's the only way I can describe what it feels like to have a beautiful penis inside of me....only much more vivid and intense. I could just lay completely still with it inside of me with no movement and no thrusting, and could just focus on those feelings inside and be in heaven just from that alone. When I'm in that zone, there is nothing in the world better. This is why I love sex so much! I can feel EVERYTHING, every movement, every ridge, every vein....the blood pumping.......goddamn, YUMM! It feels like the penis has electricity running through it! I can feel it pulse and pump and twitch when he ejaculates. This always makes me start twitching inside too in response.

The more girth the better for this feeling, too (not including Red Bull cans). The length, as pointed out already, means there is a longer thrust....just more wonderful feelings for me.

Now if we move on to getting pounded....that is a whole different feeling. I can't focus down on the feelings at the opening as much, because I'm getting this whole other amazing type of feeling from it. Length is more important than girth for pounding, for me, because to REALLY pound me, you're going to have to be back from me more than just a few inches to really slam back into me.

I have had this discussion with girlfriends, and a lot of them say they don't really feel much inside of them, not even at the opening. I have had to assume it is because they aren't doing their kegels but I don't really know.

Keep in mind, I do not O from PIV alone. It isn't about O's to me. I love intercourse. I love f*cking. I love making love. I love having a lovely P inside of me in anyway. (A lovely P meaning, one that I have already picked and know and love very well )

I also love touching my man's penis, I love giving oral, I love just hanging out with it. I love watching the various stages it goes through. I love taking a bath with a man and watch what appears to be a sea creature come alive between his legs and go wandering around in the water of its own accord (only as far as it can go, of course). I love fondling it when it is soft, kissing it, petting it, and the testicles too. I love having my face slapped with a beautiful erection, not necessarily roughly. Just a nice smack, smack, smack against my cheek, and I can hear it inside my mouth and head as it slaps my cheeks against my teeth. I love feeling the weight of it while doing this.

I have O's but they come from other means. I would love to have O's from PIV, but I actually feel no loss since it is something I've never had or worried about. I have too much fun having sex to even wish for an O. When I need O's, I get them and they rock. Not as much as sex rocks, though.....which is tough to explain, there's some other technical stuff going on for me with that.

Now to get realistic...and possibly shatter the idea that I'm a size queen. I'm really not. I'd do just fine with a 5 or 6 incher, as long as there is at least adequate girth and the man it is attached to is a good lover (for me) in all other respects. Since I love everything from just having it inside me without even moving to getting pounded into the wall, I'm a pretty happy woman when I'm in love with a man and his penis and we are rocking the house down regularly. But the look of it, again, super important....not just size but how it looks.

If I am considering a long term relationship with someone, and I get to the goods and discover it just isn't going to something I can fall in love with....I would end it, yes. I doubt I would ever say this is why, but if I was forced to or if it really mattered to the man that he knew the actual truth, I would say it. I am glad I've never been in this position, it would be a tough call, but I would still make it. Sex is so important to me that I just wouldn't allow myself to end up in a place that I didn't love his penis. He would deserve a woman who does love it, so setting him free would be best for both of us.

As I already answered in another thread, about 7.5 inches long and 5.5 or so inches thick would be ideal if I could design my own perfect penis. But honestly....that's just an ideal and I've never stopped and thought "gee I wish he was 7.5 inches and a little thicker" when I've been getting my brains f*cked silly. I'm just loving every minute of it and that's all I'm focused on.

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post #68 of 111 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 12:18 AM
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Re: Sexual Relationships 2017 Style

TAM ladies rock!

Best source for female insight I have ever encountered outside of my wife!

Thank you all!
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post #69 of 111 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 06:42 AM
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Re: Sexual Relationships 2017 Style

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I think there is a very high and strong desire by men to HEAR "not that much" after they hear it DOES matter. If they also hear "but not that much" then they can get rid of the fear that theirs isn't good enough (until the next time they hear size matters....)

I've read all the same threads you have, and I've not come away with the idea that it doesn't matter "that much"....on the contrary, I've read that it does matter "that much".

I've read plenty of women honestly saying it doesn't matter or that it doesn't matter that much to them....but they were not the majority of the responses.
I don't think we're on the same page, FW!

It DOES matter, and honestly, for good reason. What I meant was, for the sake of men everywhere who think a 9inch dong is necessary to be a good lover - it ain't. Average size is fine, even ideal, and some women would prefer a little bigger than average, so the fit is nice and snug. So from that perspective, yes, size matters.

My point, as usual in these silly discussions that I always seem to a part of (penis size threads... ugh!) is that the vast majority of men are just fine for the vast majority of women, and there's very little to worry about on either side, and that worrying about it is futile anyway. There's a match for just about everyone. I was too big for my ex wife, and way too big for a former gf, and I'm not packing anything monstrous down there.

But when presented with a choice, most women would go with average+. Just as we men would prefer tight+ vajayjays. If the person you love happens to fall within that ideal range, bonus! If they don't, there's not a lot of women (or men) who are ending their relationship because of it. However, if you're in the casual relationship stage of your life (like I imagine most of the survey respondents are), then you're unlikely for a repeat encounter with 'Mr Smaller than Average'.

In short, size matters, but not the same way for men as it does for women. We men seem to think we need a 9inch dong. You women simply want something that, for lack of a better term, fills you up. For many, that could very well be done by an every day normal average willy. For some, something slightly larger/thicker. For a rare few, the monster dong is required.

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post #70 of 111 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 07:27 AM
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I know and accept that not only does size matter in that way to men, but size also matters in the rest of our bodies. Men desire a healthy woman of a certain size (a large variation here but in each man's eye he has his own size limit). Men desire breasts of a certain size (each has his own preference, his preference may be for smaller but that is still a size). Men desire a waist of a certain size, a booty of a certain size, a height of a certain size.

After typing it nine times in one paragraph, it just struck me that the word size is kind of an odd word!

Anyway....long ago as a teenager, I fully accepted that ALL MEN feel size matters....size of every part of our bodies. I knew this didn't mean that all women had to be swim suit models because lots of men prefer "meat on bones" or "cushion for pushin". Yet they still have a size limit in this regard.

It made perfect sense to me and never bothered me because size matters to me, too. The size of his penis yes, but also the size of his hands and fingers, how tall he is, the size of his shoulders and biceps, his ass, how thick his legs are, the size of his belly....it all matters to me.

I think this is natural and normal. Animals, including humans, have the innate ability to detect good health in a potential partner. For us this is mostly coming from the visual (but there are other cues we are not always aware of). Nature makes us strongly attracted to people we sense are healthy, and then chemistry comes in (also from nature) to tell us if we are a good match or not, beyond just being healthy.
I'm not disagreeing with you at all with this, but I do think penis size doesn't compare to any of the above mentioned items.

I think everything you've listed above is the same, regardless of gender, primarily because none of those items actually have much, if anything, to do with actual sexual pleasure - they're all purely visual, and therefore stimulate our minds, and our ability to become turned on or attracted to the person - initially. Important, of course, but not absolutely necessary for the ultimate goal of physical pleasure. Some of the best sexual encounters I've had have been with women who I wasn't attracted to right away.

When it comes right down to it, penis size can make or break your ability to enjoy sex with someone, FAR more than anything you, as a woman, can do, or have, in terms of a man achieving orgasm, or some sort of sexual satisfaction. Even a small penis in a large vagina will get enough stimulation for him to orgasm. The reverse is much less likely.

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post #71 of 111 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 07:42 AM
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To the first bolded....

To the second bolded....

I also love....
After reading your entire post, I could almost believe my wife had joined TAM and written it. These are the very things she tells me.

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post #72 of 111 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 08:03 AM
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!
The telescoping comment came from a sex therapist I saw - I may have misunderstood - but I believe the cervix and uterus ascend during arousal to lengthen the vagina to accommodate the length of the penis.
I see now what you mean by telescoping. Yes, this is completely accurate. The unaroused vagina is only a few inches in length, but when fully aroused is much longer.

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post #73 of 111 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 08:31 AM
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Sorry if you already mentioned it, I haven't been following these threads closely, but did you ever not see some again because of it?
I have stopped seeing men based on penis size. I have also stopped seeing men based on lack of skill. I don't fault the guy. He can't do anything about his size, it's just what God gave him to work with. I also don't fault a guy if he is an engaged lover, but his sexual style or skill doesn't match my preferences. That's just his way and nothing to be held against him.

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There is "small" and then there is SMALL <g>.

I am told my wife came across one that was pinky size which is what, 2.5" or so? She only saw that one once. I can't imagine that is exactly common, most women will not come across that extreme end of the size spectrum in a lifetime.
I have had the misfortune to encounter 4 "rinky dinky ****ies" in my time. However, I read somewhere that the average woman has something like 8 or 9 sex partners in her lifetime and I was somewhere around 31 or 32 when I met DH, so maybe I just have a bigger sample size.



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Men are not as skilled in the art of bull****, that's why. We are upfront. So having grown up with the Virgin-Mary persona that most women go out of their way to portray the "other side" is surprising. Not bad, just surprising.
I don't think it's bullsh*tting. It's more like a combination of sensitivity and societal programming.

First, women tend to be nurturers. We're sensitive the to feelings of others. From that POV, there is no reason to tell men that size matters because there isn't anything a man can do about his size, so why hurt his feelings unnecessarily. I never told the rinky dinky ****ie guys I was not going back for 2nds because of their size for just that reason.

Second, allegedly something like 75% of women DO NOT orgasm from vaginal stimulation alone. For those women, size really may not matter as much.

Third, we're still told that chemical sexual attraction and sexual satisfaction aren't that important when selecting a mate. It's largely considered shallow by many to end a relationship based on lack of sex or lack of sexual enjoyment. We're not supposed to notice or comment on penis size because...love...or some sh*t.


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Ok women if you're going to go on and on about this then please help me out.

Reading the other penis threads here and looking at the links, I was very surprised by the statistics.

The average length is something like 5-1/4 or 5-1/2 inches, and the standard deviation isn't really that great. That means most men are pretty close to that size.

Second: and this vexes the SH*T out of me... what about girth? The statistics indicate a 6" girth penis is in the 93rd percentile which shocked me. I was shocked because the average is about 4" plus change I think (sorry I don't recall). Again - can you really feel that difference? Is it that big a deal? I ask because I'm aware you guys telescope that vajayjay out the more aroused you get so I'm wondering how you gauge those d1cks over time? I mean it seems the more aroused the smaller he seems. If he totally turns you off he'd feel HUGE because you'd be closed up like a nun!

Ok that's something to work with school me


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I read that the majority of internal vaginal nerves extend 3-4 inches inside. So, yeah, theoretically, a 3-4 inch penis is sufficient to stimulate. However, girth matters. I can absolutely feel the difference in both length and width.

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Ahhhhh! Finally something that makes sense. I always assumed the long dong thing was a guy fantasy - with the ridiculous porn out there - and because I was aware of the problem and discomfort of a cervix being pounded. Also I was aware of the limited length of the (typical) woman's nerve endings, implying that "size doesn't matter". BUT you've connected the dots a bit with the "stroke length" factor. Ha that should be part of the d1ck measurement bruhaha. That actually makes sense. Add "average stroke length" to the stats!


The telescoping comment came from a sex therapist I saw - I may have misunderstood - but I believe the cervix and uterus ascend during arousal to lengthen the vagina to accommodate the length of the penis.
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The unaroused vagina is shallow enough that a woman can insert her finger or fingers and probe her cervix. A lot of women who use Natural Family Planning check their cervical mucous and positioning daily to track signs of ovulation. Many others do it routinely to check birth control devices like IUD's or diaphragms or even menstrual cups. Obviously, the canal must extend to accommodate an erect penis. That's the "telescoping" your therapist was talking about.

The girth thing is more about clitoral stimulation. First, the clitoris is much larger than most people realize. The vast majority of the thing is unseen. During penile thrusting, the minor labia is pulled back and forth, tugging on the clitoris. If the girth of the penis isn't a good fit for the vagina, the tugging is going to be weak or non-existent. Then add in the stimulation of the vaginal walls, the internal G-spot, etc. and you can see how length and girth make a difference.

Also, not all women find cervical bumping uncomfortable or painful. I, personally, love it! I have had some seriously intense orgasms from cervical bumping.

Follow the evidence where it leads and question everything.
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post #74 of 111 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 08:49 AM
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Re: Sexual Relationships 2017 Style

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So you can't have a PIV O without a minimum size and shape?

That is interesting. I've been working on getting Mrs. Conan to be able to O during PIV. She is getting pretty damn close but she actually did O from one of my smaller fingers penetrating her hardly at all.
How small is small? If we're talking 2-4 inches, no. If we're talking 4.5 to 6 inches, I can. It just takes a lot of effort playing with angles and it isn't nearly as intense. A lot of work for little reward.

If you want my guess, your finger found her internal G-spot. Maybe try to figure out a way to stroke that same spot with your penis and see if that works?

@Faithful Wife

You've never had a PIV orgasm, if I read your post right? And your vaginal walls are very sensitive?

If so, there goes my theory.

PIV orgasms are the most intense and satisfying for me by a long shot. I also have very sensitive vaginal walls. I, too, can easily feel the length, girth, texture, and temperature of a penis. That's one of the reasons I generally only use dildos or vibrators as part of kink or to put on a show for DH. The feeling of plastic or rubber or whatever they make those things out of just feels so...off and unnatural. Same with condoms. I HATED having to use condoms back in my catting around days because they always felt so...fake.

Anyways, I figured that maybe women who couldn't orgasm from PIV alone were just wired with less sensitivity and that explained it. If you're sensitive and can't get there from PIV alone, my theory is probably incorrect.

Follow the evidence where it leads and question everything.
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post #75 of 111 (permalink) Old 02-01-2017, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by MJJEAN View Post
I have had the misfortune to encounter 4 "rinky dinky ****ies" in my time. However, I read somewhere that the average woman has something like 8 or 9 sex partners in her lifetime and I was somewhere around 31 or 32 when I met DH, so maybe I just have a bigger sample size.
Thanks, that's kind of what I was getting at. Not that I really care, but I always figured with her sample size (great term) she must have hit more than one.

Funny story about the one. Around 7 years into marriage we run into him getting off a plane in Frankfurt. They briefly greet each other. She could sense I, not usually jealous, wasn't thrilled. She whispered, that's the guy with the small dck (she had mentioned it sometime before). I was just not happy because he was coming out of first class to our mere business.



Sigh, my wife gives me the speaking treatment.
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