Thoughts on this - Page 102 - Talk About Marriage
Sex in Marriage Sexual problems are common in many relationships. This section is for discussions about sexuality. Please limit discussions to those asking for help with a problem and those offering advice. Any other threads may be deleted.

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post #1516 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-25-2017, 04:04 PM
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Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by GettingIt_2 View Post
Sorry @inmyprime, I just saw your questions to me. It's a long story; I think my original thread is probably around here somewhere. But yes I did have a very sudden revelation that changed my whole perspective on things. Basically, I accidentally found TAM and finally "got it" when I read so many men saying the same things about intimacy and sex in their marriage. My sexual attraction for him literally came crashing back in an instant. We were able to rebuild our marriage on so many levels once the sex was back in play. Turns out we both need it as a foundation.


I will try to find your thread. Would you say it was guilt that powered up your sex drive/compassion back again? How long ago was it? I hope it stays that way in any case.
It's interesting that it takes other men to say it, for a partner to understand what their husband is going through. I guess your husband must also not have found it easy to communicate this.
For me (and possibly other men too), it is difficult to relate to the mindset of sexual attraction appearing/disappearing and then reappearing again. I can say with certainty than mine was pretty much constant. No matter how many problems/disagreements we had. I think this creates an extra layer of insecurity for a man (like questioning whether my wife finds me attractive in the first place, if she needed to make herself feel guilty about our relationship).
Hence why I mentioned hyper bonding. Of course if it then can become a permanent state, then great.


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Last edited by inmyprime; 04-25-2017 at 04:11 PM.
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post #1517 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-25-2017, 05:30 PM
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Re: Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by alexm View Post
Maybe, probably. But I don't care. That's the difference. I'm not looking for, or expecting anything. If it happens - great! If it doesn't - oh well, it's not going to bother me. I grabbed her butt a dozen times because I wanted to, not to get a rise out of her, or to indicate I wanted to have sex with her.

That's what I've been doing the last few weeks, and there's already been a difference in my own perception. I think there has been one in hers, as well.

As said, it's sexual self confidence.
If you want to take your self confidence up a notch, start grabbing your own butt ...
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post #1518 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-25-2017, 09:04 PM
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Re: Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by GettingIt_2 View Post

I think a good place to start is to remember that, while you have a sex life WITH you partner, you are still a sexual being as an individual, with certain needs, predilections, desires, kinks, fantasies, whatever. And your partner has a sexuality that is completely theirs, separate from your own. The sexual relationship that you have WITH your partner doesn't negate your individual sexuality, but it also might not totally satisfy it, either. But trying to get satisfaction for your own sexuality by trying to guess at hers and changing your behavior accordingly just mucks things up.

Don't apologize for your sexuality, and don't hide it from your partner. Approach sex from who YOU are, not from who you *think* SHE is. Sure, you have to be aware of her limits, but if you initiate sex thinking "how am I going to please her," then, IMO, she's going to feel that pressure.

Approach sex from how YOU like it, and so she can respond to YOU instead of responding to *your version* of her sexuality.

That seems to be the track you are on now, and I think it's a good one.
Yes, this strikes me as extra smart advice. Especially since it really seems that there's a whole lot of assuming about what is going on in the mind of the wife, and women generally, for that matter, about what we like and want and think. And a lot of it strikes me as quite off base. At least if I read it through my own lens of experience.
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post #1519 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-26-2017, 07:16 AM
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Re: Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by peacem View Post
Don't stop having sex! Especially when you say its good. I would use her schedule as an opportunity to have sex 'differently' to make it less boring and routine. So you could try doing something different each week so it would give you something to look forward to and excite you.



I know scheduled sex can seem a bit boring, but actually the alternative to never knowing whether you are going to get it is far worse and frustrating. You definitely need to add flirtation and romance into your scheduled day to make it special....


This may be the only response I have seen that makes total sense to me!


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post #1520 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-26-2017, 07:29 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by wild jade View Post
Yes, this strikes me as extra smart advice. Especially since it really seems that there's a whole lot of assuming about what is going on in the mind of the wife, and women generally, for that matter, about what we like and want and think. And a lot of it strikes me as quite off base. At least if I read it through my own lens of experience.
There tends to be a lot of assuming going on because some people just don't communicate what they actually want.

In my case, I tried. Over and over again. I tried to get my wife to open up to me, tell me what she really likes and wants, to no avail. I fostered a relationship of trust, of non-judgement, of being safe, of being able to communicate.

Assuming is never good, but when it's all you have.. it's all you have.

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post #1521 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-26-2017, 07:53 AM
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Re: Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by alexm View Post

Assuming is never good, but when it's all you have.. it's all you have.
Can't argue with that!

I'm curious, though. Is that really all she will give you?

Certainly from what you've said, she seems a private person who is uncomfortable with revealing her deep darks. But it also seems she is free enough with some information. Is that not enough for you to work with?

(I get the impression that sometimes you simply don't believe her when she tells you how she is.)
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post #1522 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-26-2017, 11:45 AM
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Re: Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by alexm View Post
There tends to be a lot of assuming going on because some people just don't communicate what they actually want.

In my case, I tried. Over and over again. I tried to get my wife to open up to me, tell me what she really likes and wants, to no avail. I fostered a relationship of trust, of non-judgement, of being safe, of being able to communicate.

Assuming is never good, but when it's all you have.. it's all you have.
For women, it's often the case that they don't know exactly what they actually want.

Female sexuality is much more complex than male sexuality.

Women are more likely to have conflict between what actually drives their sexuality and what they think drives it.

So trying to get them to communicate their desires verbally is often a waste of effort.

There is no way my wife could have told me years ago what gets her hot today. She didn't know.

There's no way I could have guessed.
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post #1523 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-26-2017, 12:10 PM
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Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by Buddy400 View Post
For women, it's often the case that they don't know exactly what they actually want.



Female sexuality is much more complex than male sexuality.



Women are more likely to have conflict between what actually drives their sexuality and what they think drives it.



So trying to get them to communicate their desires verbally is often a waste of effort.



There is no way my wife could have told me years ago what gets her hot today. She didn't know.



There's no way I could have guessed.

It's funny you mention guessing. I managed to figure my wife's turns on out by trial and error. Lots of error....But got concerned that maybe something wasn't right or normal etc when I noticed the kind of stuff she was responsive to. I posted here on TAM (it's in my 'in this normal' thread). If I had read TAM previously I probably would have figured it out much sooner. I always thought I wasn't being gentle or caring enough etc but that was totally not the right direction to take...
I think Alexm is getting to that point now too. (It's also important to figure yourself out first).
Hopefully fulfilling/amazing sex life awaits! (That's not to say I finished figuring it out. It's never 'finished' and it can always be better.)


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Last edited by inmyprime; 04-26-2017 at 12:19 PM.
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post #1524 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-26-2017, 01:25 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by wild jade View Post
Can't argue with that!

I'm curious, though. Is that really all she will give you?

Certainly from what you've said, she seems a private person who is uncomfortable with revealing her deep darks. But it also seems she is free enough with some information. Is that not enough for you to work with?

(I get the impression that sometimes you simply don't believe her when she tells you how she is.)
Here I am assuming again...!

I think she's always been a little insecure about herself. She's had the normal amount of relationship pains (a-holes, cheaters, users, etc. Nothing out of the ordinary, I don't think). Couple that with a general inability to cope with things (she shuts down, effectively), you can start to see why she is the way she is.

I've only said this here once or twice before, but she and I were high school sweethearts, our first boyfriend/girlfriend. Almost 3 years together. Broke up at the end of high school. I dated (briefly) and then met my now ex-wife. She dated like any normal 18 year old would, then met a guy she stayed with. Our relationship, despite being 3 years long, was not super-serious. We were exclusive, but it was also more a learning experience than anything else. We talked about college, and living together, and marriage and kids, but I don't think either of us really believed we'd go that route.

I've also said that I think she was once capable of giving her all to somebody - and it seems as though it was her next serious relationship. That somebody took that trust and threw it away, causing great pain. Also lasted 3 years. She didn't have another serious relationship until 6 or 7 years later. He did the same thing. Ended at 3 years. And I came along about a year after that. And here I am.

Each of her previous LTR's lasted about 3 years. It's not a surprise that our relationship changed around this general period of time, too, I don't think. The first (her and I in high school) didn't end badly. We just went our separate ways after high school ended. She did break my heart, but whatever - teenage love, it's to be expected! The second, he started cheating. The third, he turned into a grade 'A' ******* after their child was born.

None of those LTR's ended for the same reason, nor did they really have anything to do with her sexuality, however, they did kind of all have a link to sex, in one way or another. With ours, it fizzled out, but we both also realized we wanted to test the waters and see what else was out there (she was just the one to say it first, hence the broken heart, lol!). With the second, he started cheating on her. Why, I don't know. They were like 20, and had just moved in together after like 2 1/2 years of dating. I don't get the impression she "drove him to it". Maybe he got scared. The third, she didn't "put out" quickly enough after giving birth, and as his previous marriage ended with his ex wife cheating, he obviously triggered and started down that road with her. Like within less than a month of having a c-section, she was "clearly getting it elsewhere" because he wasn't getting any True story. Jeckyl and Hyde, as she puts it.

When you say that I don't believe her, that's not exactly true. When she self-identified as asexual several years ago (which was introduced to her by me, sigh) I thought it made sense. And at the time, it did. However, upon reflection (and over analyzation!) I don't believe that's really the case. I would not, and have not ever said that to her, however. But the more I (over) think about it, the more I see a pattern with her previous LTR's. The reality is that she was much more free, sexually, when casually dating, or single. When there was no chance of getting hurt. Follow what I mean?

Anyway, I hate analyzing her like that, it's not fair. It is what it is. I don't really want to revisit this particular topic

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post #1525 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-26-2017, 01:39 PM
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Re: Thoughts on this

Oh wow. We were also school sweethearts. Got together around 15. Except we stayed (we almost didn't manage). I did hurt her once or twice and she hurt me once. Nothing major, but we both developed distance and began drifting apart at one point.


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post #1526 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-26-2017, 02:34 PM
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Re: Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by inmyprime View Post
I will try to find your thread. Would you say it was guilt that powered up your sex drive/compassion back again? How long ago was it? I hope it stays that way in any case.
It's interesting that it takes other men to say it, for a partner to understand what their husband is going through. I guess your husband must also not have found it easy to communicate this.
For me (and possibly other men too), it is difficult to relate to the mindset of sexual attraction appearing/disappearing and then reappearing again. I can say with certainty than mine was pretty much constant. No matter how many problems/disagreements we had. I think this creates an extra layer of insecurity for a man (like questioning whether my wife finds me attractive in the first place, if she needed to make herself feel guilty about our relationship).
Hence why I mentioned hyper bonding. Of course if it then can become a permanent state, then great.


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I don't think it was guilt that brought it back; rather I realized how wrong I'd been in the assumptions I was making about why sex was important to him. I did feel overwhelming guilt when I realized how bad it must have been for him, and that he'd stood by me and our family and always did the honorable thing in trying to honestly communicate to me about it. He never cheated, he never tried to punish me. He just . . . coped the best he could.

It was four years ago. I'll search for the thread and PM you; I had a slightly different user name.
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post #1527 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-26-2017, 04:45 PM
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Re: Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by GettingIt_2 View Post
I don't think it was guilt that brought it back; rather I realized how wrong I'd been in the assumptions I was making about why sex was important to him. I did feel overwhelming guilt when I realized how bad it must have been for him, and that he'd stood by me and our family and always did the honorable thing in trying to honestly communicate to me about it. He never cheated, he never tried to punish me. He just . . . coped the best he could.

It was four years ago. I'll search for the thread and PM you; I had a slightly different user name.
Yes, that's what I meant when I wrote about guilt.
Amazing. I wish there was a way to make this change of mind into a pill. I guess these epiphanies are rare and far inbetween.
I still feel on occasion that my wife often thinks sex for me is just another hole to fill. I think this comes from misunderstanding what spontaneous desire means. It takes so much effort for me to convince her that it is her and then only one stupid joke from me to ruin it all again...
We used to argue about it a lot.
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post #1528 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-26-2017, 07:30 PM
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Re: Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by Buddy400 View Post
For women, it's often the case that they don't know exactly what they actually want.

Female sexuality is much more complex than male sexuality.

Women are more likely to have conflict between what actually drives their sexuality and what they think drives it.

So trying to get them to communicate their desires verbally is often a waste of effort.

There is no way my wife could have told me years ago what gets her hot today. She didn't know.

There's no way I could have guessed.
LOL. Women are no more complex and no less self aware than men are.

Just because you have easier access to your head than to your wife's doesn't make you any easier to understand or your perspective any simpler or easier to understand.
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post #1529 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-26-2017, 07:37 PM
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Re: Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by alexm View Post
Here I am assuming again...!
Thanks for sharing, Alex!

I think inference is okay, so is observation. Overanalysis, though, easily leads you down the road of wishful thinking rather than actual reality. The mind is a funny thing, and I get the impression it isn't actually your wife that's the most prone to overcomplicating things.

Like @GettingIt_2 said, though. Know yourself, be yourself, and she will be herself.

And hopefully things work out great for both of you!
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post #1530 of 1926 (permalink) Old 04-26-2017, 09:26 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Thoughts on this

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Originally Posted by wild jade View Post
Thanks for sharing, Alex!

I think inference is okay, so is observation. Overanalysis, though, easily leads you down the road of wishful thinking rather than actual reality. The mind is a funny thing, and I get the impression it isn't actually your wife that's the most prone to overcomplicating things.
You're absolutely right. If anything, she over-simplifies! We each could benefit from meeting in the middle, I think...

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