CandieGirl

So do I and I think I'm getting very close to having that very same conversation myself.

MEM11363

Phantom,
Does the post below resonate with you?


The thermostat - the ultimate barometer of your R

phantomfan

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phantomfan

Other than the general hot and cold, no. About 1/2 apply to me on each hot and cold.
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Enchantment

Then... you need to make yourself in to a man that is worth fighting for...because right now with her having a sarcastic and indifferent attitude - that indicates she does not feel like you are a man worth fighting for.

Go to the Men's Clubhouse sub-forum and start reading the man up/nice guy sticky thread at the top - not as a means to manipulate your wife, but as means to become a better man, the best man that you can be - that any women would want to be with - and do it for YOURSELF.

Learn how to deflect the sarcasm and bad attitudes that she throws your way to generate respect (see the 'fitness test' thread in the man-up thread).

You can't change your wife, but you can change YOU...and maybe she'll like what she sees. But even if she doesn't, YOU will like what you see in yourself.

Best wishes.

__________________

Enter these enchanted woods, You who dare. ~ George Meredith

MEM11363

Well the "mix" kind of matters and there is a reason for that. What areas are you "hot" in and which is SHE "hot" in?

It really does matter. If you want her to "value" your contribution, you have to steadily ramp DOWN in the areas that matter to her. Because it sure sounds like your response to being de-prioritized by her has been to chase her more intensely with trips, and other stuff. And that is a huge mistake as it inadvertently rewards her bad behavior.

phantomfan

Actually I think its better said at this point is that her coldness and inattentiveness in the bedroom has turned me off completely and I've taken cold to a new level for me. Cold, angry and resentful is exactly where I am. I'm stuck between needing her to show me that I matter by her actions. I have no desire to give her what she needs when I'm not getting what I need. She wants me to be warm, and touchy but not give back. She tells me she hates the distance that I've put in place but that coldness hasn't yet resulted in her taking an active role in making things right. She says she's "interested" and shows me interest. Her idea of interest is putting one hand half hearted on my chest 30 seconds before she rolls over and goes to sleep. That's apathy and I'm not going to give that lack of effort the time of day. Depending on the time of day, ill go from depressed to livid to detached. I know I deserve better and I'm not giving better until that happens. I've been the one trying, its time she try back. Like top gun, she needs to take me to bed like a woman who gives a damn or lose me forever.
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deejov

Sorry to hear you have jumped on the resentment train.
It's not a pleasant ride, it's a cold hard ball of apathy that rattles around in your chest. while you are putting all of your energy into the wall, no one else is able to get in. Especially not your wife.

Someone has to make the first move. You are here, so you must care? You obviously want her love and attention.

On the other hand, if you have given up and no longer love your wife, and cannot get past everything you have done in the past (and she has not responded) then there is no point in trying.

At that point it would be fair to divorce her.
No one is going to approach you when you have closed the door.

phantomfan

Yes my doors are closed but not locked with the locks changed, yet. From my point of view, my spouses actions over the last few years shut them. I have opened the door to my heart many times, only to have it slammed shut in my face. I can't open the doors anymore. She has the power to open them in a heartbeat if she chooses to. That's what I want, but it doesn't seem that she either knows or cares to.

I'm not sure how I'm going to approach this yet. Divorce is still not the option I am willing to consider for many reasons. I think it would be a waste. I don't like making ultimatums or threats either but I know that I do need to warn her that it's really this serious. I don't like the cheating option either, but if it happens maybe that low will be what turns things around or blows things up, probably the latter. Being on another continent on a business trip for the next 10 days, I will consider myself lucky if something bad doesn't happen. Being on the edge of this cliff sucks. It's so completely unnecessary which is the most frustrating and saddest thing to me.

warlock07

Tell us about your infidelity suspicions...you said you noticed some symptoms

Jeff74

I am a husband in a sexless marriage with a toddler. Like you there is no way I would get divorced because of sex. Being a divorced parent means less time with my child and no amount of sex with anyone could possibly offset that loss. Although it took some time, I am in a happier place in life (i also donot have a high sex drive.) Some people here would call a marriage without sex a roommate situation but I am much closer to my wife than any roommate I have had in the past!

Don't let your wife's actions or inactions control your happiness. I let that happen for a period of time and was very unhappy. Take control of the things you can, do the things that make you happy and you will be happy. Not easy but it can be done and I am living proof! It may sound crazy but my wife and I get along great...and our marriage is sexless.
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phantomfan

For some people sexless is fine. Thats not me and it's never going to be. I'm a HD person who needs the emotional/physical aspect in a marriage. It is not something I can be without from my partner.
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Jeff74

Ok that is fine to feel that way. Since that is something that you cannot be without from your partner, I guess you have only 2 options then (without cheating that is)

1. Change your wife into a higher sex drive partner to meet your needs
2. Get divorced and try to find a new partner that will meet your sexual needs

For me, neither of these were an option so I worked on being happy with other parts of my life. Being with my son is first priority for me..and being with my son while being happy with life was also a priority for me. I have done what I needed to do to accomplish both.

I respect how you feel though and wish you the best of luck in solving your dilemma.
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phantomfan

I'm not sure the solution I want is possible. I realize that I can't make me happy by sacrifice my own happiness. I've been trying to please her hoping that she will return the favor. That isn't working out. It's not just sex in our relationship that's missing.

Either way, I've decided to move forward. I'm going 180 and I'm chasing happiness/fulfillment wherever that leads. If she comes after me and things get better, it was meant to be. I'm not being a good father by wollowing in misery and being a shell of my former self. I don't want a divorce and I don't want to cheat. One or both may happen. Its a scary road that could blow up in my face or work out just like I hope. Time will tell.
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MEM11363

That is a very honest response. I believe that overt anger is typically perceived as "I am REALLY angry that you don't love me enough to make an effort to please me".

Where as indifference - that is a much scarier reaction. So if you can manage to radiate real indifference to her - to her reactions to you and to her needs - you will be conveying that the marriage is unravelling before her eyes.

At some point - IF she raises the subject the conversation should be VERY brief and it goes like this:
- In a good/great marriage each person goes out of their way to make the effort to ensure that their partners needs are so well met that their spouse is very happy with them and feels highly valued.
- In an "ok" marriage each person goes out of their way to make AT LEAST enough effort to avoid causing their partner distress.

It isn't good if your "band" is very narrow. Meaning if daily sex makes you very happy but sex every three days makes you very unhappy. That isn't "wrong" it simply puts her in a difficult situation in terms of trying to find a compromise. If however your band is reasonably wide, and she can't be bothered to avoid causing you distress, THAT is a big problem.

My Wife absolutely takes her responsibility to keep me satisfied every bit as seriously as I take my commitment to be monogamous. I would NOT be ok if she believed that MY commitment was absolute, and her sexual responsibilities began and ended with doing or "not doing" whatever she felt like at any point in time.

And the happy balance is that I don't press her to connect when I know she is tired/upset/sad. And she happily makes the effort when I say "I miss you" with a smile and a shrug.