Browncoat

Well said Mary35! You clearly understand both sides of the coin and that's rare, thanks for sharing your story.

Later tonight my wife and I are going to read it over together, thanks a lot for taking time to write that. I know testimonies like yours help both my wife and I understand our situation better.

phantomfan

Actually I think the opposite is true. An LD person needs understanding from HD types not their spouse more than they need camaraderie from LD sympathizers. One LD person might better appreciate how they feel but the problem is a lack of understanding from the other side that an LD person needs. The light needs to go on. Having some person identify with them doesn't make lights go on, it re-inforces that their POV is ok. It is unless its a problem in the marriage. Chances are being here and talking about it, the LD/HD mismatch is a problem.

I see LD spouses say the same things mine does. I get it, I do. I'm a bipolar HD ATM. I have drive but not necessarily aimed at my wife. I want my LD wife to be my one stop shop for all needs but her refusal to understand my POV or do right by me in and out of the bedroom kills my desire to be with her at all. I understand the LD POV but I won't justify it or excuse it anymore than I will excuse an alcoholic's choice to drink. Love is a choice. You choose to love your partner and do loving things regardless of your feelings or you choose not to. The biggest mistake I think that comes from the LD side of the house is that feelings should dictate your sex life. IMHO, that is a dysfunctional way to relate to the world. If that were the case, no one would serve their communities, spouses, countries, et al. There are times when I'm very angry at my children or I don't like them very much. I still do right by them and do my best to take care of them. Love is a verb, not an adjective!

MEM11363

Mary,
This is perha

UOTE=mary35;687736]I am going to take a stab at this, cause I can relate to MarieJa. I was a LD for more than 20 years of my married life. However, I have also experienced the HD for the past several years so I can also relate to the HD side of this topic.

MarieJa, I think I understand what you are describing and what you mean when you talk about your feelings about your body, because I felt the same way. Most of the time this was my thought process (unless like you said, I happened to be horny too - which was not often). "Why do you need my body for the sex part. Use your hands or do whatever to take care of this need. For now, just leave me out of that very small part of what is in every other way a very good marriage." Does that resonate with you MarieJa?

Most of what I have to say has already been said, but in rephrasing it, I hope someone it helps.

1. MarieJa - It is hard for a LD and a HD to understand each other unless they walk in each others shoes. The others thinking process is like a foreign language and is incomprehensible to the one who does not know it. However, just because you don't understand it and it does not make sense to you, does not mean what they say is not real. You may never understand how a HD male feels or thinks, no matter how hard they try to explain it, in the same way they may never understand how you feel. However, because you are married, it is very important that BOTH spouses TRY to understand and take at face value what the other SAYS they feel and need. And then try to work together so that BOTH spouses feelings are accepted and needs are met. This takes communication, hard work, love, compromise, and forgiveness.

2. If you are resenting something, you should stop doing it! Period! However, if stopping something now causes your partners needs to not be met thus causing resentment on his part - you still have a problem in the marriage. You need to try to figure out what is causing the resentment on your part and figure out a way to not have resentment but still meet his needs. And the same goes for him. This is where the communication, hard work, love, compromise, and forgiveness comes in!

3. Usually, as human beings we will do something for others because 1. it benefits us - or 2. there is a consequence for not doing it. Right now I believe you are having sex because you are worried he will leave you if you don't. In other words you fear a consequence. And you are feeling no benefits from having sex. You don't want it, you don't need it, you don't care about an orgasm on your part, its a lot of work to fake it, and your relationship is good anyways. So whats the point? After all - he can still have an orgasm and take care of this "need" with out you being involved. Does that describe how you feel MarieJa? There are benefits, but you just don't recognize them or see them as a benefit yet. I thought my marriage was good in the earlier years when we didn't have sex often. But now that I see what it is like when we do have it often, I have realized how wrong i was. Our marriage was not good - and it wasn't really a marriage. We co-existed, we co-parented, and we were friends. But at the time I was happy with that. MY needs were being met! His needs were not,. I didn't really understand that - just like you don't. In fact, I didn't really even see sex as a real need for him. I felt it was a want - and a selfish want at that because it made me do something I didn't want to do.

This takes us back to what i said about not understanding how the other feels - but accepting it is so if they say it is. I didn't buy into what my husband expressed to me about his sexual needs. My husband stuck it out with me in my LD state. However - it did cause resentment on his part and it did affect our relationship in so many ways. Hind site is 20/20.

In the past several years I have experienced the HD on my part and times where hubby was LD. I now fully understand the hurt, the feelings of rejection and self esteem issues, and of course the resentment I cause him for so many years, because I have now experienced it first hand. It is real and it is very very painful.

So MarieJa - what does all this mean for you? I think you already recognize the problem your different sex drives can cause in your marriage - otherwise you would not be here. I think you love your husband dearly and really want to work this area of your life out so that both of you are happy and your marriage stays good. However, I think there is a part of you that really wishes the answer could be that your husband meet his needs without your help or participation if possible. I know I felt that way for years. But alas, experience, my own and others, tells me that it really won't work out that way. You are going to have to work with your husband - communicate, listen, and make compromises. Thats just how it works in a marriage.

BTW - There is invaluable information in many of the above posts.
Read them - reread them - and read them again. Read them with your husband and use them as discussion openers. Mem11363's posts are especially pertinent to your situation. I think his wife posts on here so you may want to pm her directly (correct me if wrong Mem). She is definitely one who has found a good way to handle her LD and his HD issues. You can tell by the way he adores her!!!!

Good Luck![/QUOTE]
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lovesherman

Did you read all of Mary's post? She said was was LD for 20 years, but she came to understand the HD viewpoint, and was sorry for all the time that she neglected to meet her husband's needs.

mary35

Phantom Fan - I am not sure if you read my post or not. I really feel your anger though and do understand it 100%. I also agree with much of your above quote - especially that Love is a verbm not an adjective.

You seem to be an example of what happens when a spouse's needs and feelings are ignored and not validated for an extended period of time. If true your anger is understandable! I am sorry you are in the place you find yourself in your marriage. I know that does not help you though.

If you are not comfortable with your MC - look for another one. If I were you though, I would look for a good sex therapist instead. Google AASECT for resourses in your area. The reason I suggest this avenue is that they have all the same training as a MC, but also EXTRA training in the sexual field. They do the same kind of counseling technigues, and will cover the whole marrital relationship, however they have more expertise to get into the sexual part of the relationship and since you feel that is a big problem, you may want that additional training.

Anyways - my 2 cents!

phantomfan

Yes I did. I don't think what I said in response was in anyway disagreeing with her. She has an understanding of both sides. I agree it really helps to gain perspective. Its good to have someone reach out that says I know both sides. While I understand it feels better to know you're not alone (LD/HD, whatever), it doesn't fix the problem. I love meeting men/women on this board who know what I'm going through. It means a lot but does little to solve the problem.

I believe you can work to fix the problem without fully understanding the other point of view. Even though I know what its like to be an HD/LD male, I don't and will never know fully what it's like to be a HD/LD female. No one knows what its like to be me and I don't know what its like to be anyone else. You don't need to fully understand to empathize. You just need to open your heart and mind to the possibilities. You don't need 100 percent understanding of the intricacies of the issue to comprehend the gravity of the situation.

I think the two things needed to address any relationship issue is, understanding what is happening to your marriage as a result of your choices or what you choose not to do. The other is making the conscious choice to change a behavior that will have a positive impact on the relationship. If you are willing to make the investment, call it compromise, call it a 180, call it what you wish then your relationship can be salvaged. 90 percent of the battle is over when you make the choice and change what you do.

Thomas Edison said innovation 10 percent inspiration, 90 percent perspiration. I think that holds true for relationships. A sexually unsatisfying marriage is like the iceberg that sunk the titanic. 90 percent of the problem was below the surface and it took down an unsinkable ship due to a lack of respect for how serious the situation was. The lack of sex is not a problem because one partner is physically incapable of orgasm or physical release themselves. The lack of sexual satisfaction is a problem because it represents a breakdown of the bond/intimacy in the relationship. It has, it can and it will sink the best of relationships. Every effort needs to be made to turn the wheel and change course before you hit the berg that no one saw and sink.

phantomfan

Thanks. The therapist discomfort is not on my side of the football. It's not the first time we have been to a counselor for other issues. My wife tends to go from zero to defensive faster than a speeding bullet. She hasn't met a counselor yet who she liked, once they challenged her on anything of consequence. She wants a counselor who will 100 percent validate her. That's not what ANY therapist on the planet is going to do.

She accused me of being sexually conservative in therapy. While its true I prefer passion, slow and tantric style connecting more than porn star sex, I can and do have a lot of things in the quiver to draw from. The truth is I have done/initiated just about every "technique", idea and position known to man in our sexual relationship. Anything she's asked for, sex in public places, you name it short of involving other people, or rape-fantasies, I've done or tried. I'd love to discuss the intricate details with a sex therapist at some point but sex is a symptom of the problem. Until the horse decides to drink and not just swish water and spit it back out, there's not much else I can do. I'm more hurt than angry, more frustrated and feeling hopeless than anything. When I'm angry I go to the gym and lift until I can't lift my arms anymore.

mary35

Tall Average Guy

No, but when such a poster validates advice given by others, it can be that much more powerful. That someone who was gone through something similar is telling you to try something, I think the natural reaction is to give that more weight. That is what Mary35 did, and why I think it was such a valuable post.

Catherine602

You know - I think this thread is the best yet on this topic.

I hope it becomes a sticky or at lest a reference thread.

__________________
"Hey some guys need a book to find the G-spot. It was intuitive for me. Some take the road less travelled." Enthropy 3000

Catherine602

Ocotillo I think a simple no I'm not in the mood will do. That's what people usually say when they don't feel like doing something.

Going with your analogy- The litany you recited is the interpretation of the answer by the person making the request.

The interpretation is probably inaccurate. The best way of making an accurate interpretation is to ask in a non judgmental way.

__________________
"Hey some guys need a book to find the G-spot. It was intuitive for me. Some take the road less travelled." Enthropy 3000

ocotillo

Yes, in context the hypothetical I gave was absurd to the point of being hyperbole. But any answer, including, "I'm not in the mood" has reasons behind it and the litany contained the ones that have heretofore been given. Let's hope they're inaccurate.

The purpose of the illustration was to show that norajane's proposal would be servicing (admitted) resentment, not a need.

And that's what I'm having a hard time comprehending. In the scenario I gave, "Not in the mood" is not even acceptable as far as I'm concerned. It would take an injury to both hands before I would even consider refusing a request of that nature from my wife.

t_hopper_2012

MJ,

You have certainly grasped what seems to be the heart of the matter and what to do about it: the resentment that is building is harmful to your marriage and it is best to talk to your husband about it.

From your previous conversations, he already knows you have a low sex drive. If you frame the conversation in that way, I'm sure you'll be able to protect the fragile male ego that so many other people have commented on.

If he's as sensitive as you say, he should be very open to the types of compromises that have been mentioned here: backrubs for you, BJ/HJ etc. for him. You should be ready to answer questions about just how infrequent sex needs to be for you before it becomes a source of resentment (does any more than once per lunar cycle mean that you'll be resenting him?). You should also be prepared for him to wonder (whether he states it or not) when your desire quotient will drop from 1/month to even lower - and when it might go to zero.

You seem to be sensitive to comments that imply that your very low drive means that you are in some way "broken." I wouldn't say that. However, you do seem to be pretty far out on the low end of the spectrum of sexual drives. Is this something that you've ever discussed with a medical professional?

Good luck in your conversation. You seem to be ready to approach it with love and from a desire to improve your marriage. That seems to be the best way to go.

hookares

I'm left to wonder just why two people would remain married to each other if one of them wishes to live in the same house as their spouse's brother or sister? At the same time just how can a HL spouse continue to stay if they KNOW their spouse will never change?
Lastly, when does a low libido person come to realize their status and if they are aware of it before matrimony, what motivated them to marry their complete opposite?

Catherine602

This is powerful. I don't think you can avoid cringing!! I hope you don't take this for condescension but this made tears come to my eyes.

This is not about a LD partner, this is about one person being cruel and nasty to someone they think they have in bondage. There is no compassion, no empathy and no love here. That's what I see.

It would be better if she said nothing but to go through the trouble to let that escape her mouth is astounding. I don't think she would get away with that cruelty with a stranger.

That is what I cannot begin to understand. It is one thing to refuse and make an excuse but quite another to go out of her way to humiliate. The question is, what is the message she gives? I remember in another thread that men felt woman think they have moral superiority.

Could this be what they are talking about? By her actions, his wife is saying, his need for sex is trivial and something she "gives" him when when she is in the mood to humiliate him. Sex is for men and they are contemptible for wanting it.

This is perverse, no? If she were single and looking she would be getting dolled up to attract a man. Here she has a man who knows her and still desires her living right in her home. What would it take for her to see the irony in that? Maybe when he gets a chance to walk away, has an affair, stops wanting to have sex with her?

Marie what do you think of this? You are not being contemptuous of your husband overtly. It may be covert though. You can get aroused, if you want but it annoys you so you control it. What is wrong with sexual arousal?

Could you be contemptuous of people like your husband who seems to enjoy sex? He actively seeks sexual arousal for himself and you. Is your resentment mixed with contempt and a feeling of superiority that you are not conscious of?

I am speculating wildly here - a stream of consciousness in response to Phantom's post. The feeling came tumbling out.

I'd like to hear what LD people think about what Phantom described. How does it make you feel? If you are doing the same, this is a chance to look at yourself - this is very ugly indeed. If this is you, I think you will reap what you sow.

__________________
"Hey some guys need a book to find the G-spot. It was intuitive for me. Some take the road less travelled." Enthropy 3000