Sex in MarriageSexual problems are common in many relationships. This section is for discussions about sexuality. Please limit discussions to those asking for help with a problem and those offering advice. Any other threads may be deleted.
God knows what got into my H, but he said let's go to church Sunday AM. This is a sex forum not a spiritual forum. Let's just say I grew up in a Christian family but am currently in my own phase of trying to establish my own spiritual tie without too much HUMAN input. My H grew up in his communist country and never went to church. Anyways...
The topic today was "discipline" or "self-control", and the pastor started with an anecdotal story about a newly wed couple, when they kissed he proudly told the congregation "this is their ACTUAL first kiss (and they had dated 6 years), let's hear it for the blessed couple!" And everyone clapped and cheered.
I was like "OMG", are you serious?
I used to think that way. I did not have sex with my H (even though we lived together for almost 2 yrs!) until shortly before wedding. We were both virgins.
20 yrs later, if you ask me now, I would DEFINITELY say that is not the way to go. I am not advocating Chamberlain style, I am saying people should assess sexual compatibility before marriage. Well, of course divorce is not a big deal in our country, but once the kids are here, things get really screwy.
The sermon got worse...the pastor started going on about "discipline", actually he was talking about "saving all for the person you love/will love the most" (WOW), and my H said to me "see, you've got to have more control, wanting too much sex is lack of self-control".
The ultimate attack on HD from LD, backed up by holy authority.
Well, sex certaintly can show a lack of self-control if the only reason for a person's want of it is mostly to satisfy their own gratification with not so much thought for their partner and what they may need. In otherwords, if the basis of it rises from a well of utter selfishness. As well, a person who ridigly 'maintains control' also without regard to their partner's needs is being just as selfish.
Marriage is the ultimate in self-sacrifice ... and in learning how to dismantle the manacles of selfishness that we bind oursevles with daily ... giving of ourselves, our very bodies, for that of our spouse. When you can do that, sex can be a truly beautiful, spiritual thing that can transcend most of the earthly pleasures and treasures we all seem to crave.
Do not let the 'veil' of man-made religion shield or turn your eyes from the very real message and spiritual meaning that being truly giving in a marriage can have in your life.
There's no verse in the bible that says: Thou shalt not kiss.
I grew up in the church, and never heard that churches pushed that type of restrictions to dating (until recently when I talked to a few folks here at TAM).
In my church it was just: don't have sex.
That was pretty much it.
I dated my wife for a little over a year before I proposed... and we kissed on our first real date. We kissed on every date after that, and I've never felt the slightest bit guilty about it.
Oh and let me tell you our kisses were VERY VERY long and exciting... and we did it a LOT most of the time we dated and during our engagement.
At the time it had great potential (undriven before me)....slightly racey exhaust, turbo,flappy paddle gear change, had sport/off road/economy settings, no 0-69 time but I thought with time once the engine had settled in etc that 0-69 could be done in just afew seconds.
Sadly over time the engine management unit got erased, so its now stuck in economy mode, it has never been anywhere close to 69, isn't interested in being serviced....and never goes off road.
Not very economic either come to think of it....and the tyres (sorry - 'tires'!!) are a bit thicker and chunkier. I really ought to trade it in for a newer, different more sporty model....I'd be happier...
There's no verse in the bible that says: Thou shalt not kiss.
I grew up in the church, and never heard that churches pushed that type of restrictions to dating (until recently when I talked to a few folks here at TAM).
In my church it was just: don't have sex.
That was pretty much it.
I dated my wife for a little over a year before I proposed... and we kissed on our first real date. We kissed on every date after that, and I've never felt the slightest bit guilty about it.
Oh and let me tell you our kisses were VERY VERY long and exciting... and we did it a LOT most of the time we dated and during our engagement.
Like Brownie, maybe I've been fortunate to have been raised up as a Christian in a church that rarely tries to codify sexual relations other than "don't do it" and "if you must do it, be greatly prepared to take responsibility for your actions."
My particular church is not one of those prying, chaperoning, types of institutions that willingly tries to push its theology and political agenda on its parishoners. It does not revile sex as some illicit activity but rather as an act of love between two caring and loving people. The churches job, conversely, is to try its level best to create and foster a personal, special, bond between each parishoner and the Heavenly Father.
That is why people universally find the presence of God in all different places, church and non-church alike. The church is only a vehicle to help foster that! I encourage each and everyone to try to find a church that richly identifies with your belief systems, meaning that if you go to one that you cannot identify with, to keep on trying.
Trust me! God is out there and is waiting for you find Him!
Meh, worked for us. We're both spiritual people, I was at least long before we got together. I consult God on every detail of my life, and wait for a prompting in the spirit. I adore the Lord. I knew, in my spirit, that he was telling me this was going to be my wife years before we got together, ever went on a single date, and almost a decade before we actually tied the knot. When he first told me this my(now)wife couldn't even fathom being in a relationship with me at all, because we were best friends, and she saw me like a brother. He also told me how our marriage would look, and what radical changes my wife would undergo, and right now she, and our marriage, look exactly like he whispered to me all those years ago. It's rather amazing when I recall that.
We also chose to be celibate for many years, for spiritual reasons (true celibacy, not "everything but vaginal penetration"). We kissed, made out, but that was the extent of it. We didn't sleep together until we wed. I didn't worry about our sexual compatibility because I talk to God frankly about sex, he knows me, knows how important it is to me, and wouldn't be directing me toward a cold fish, or a sexual mismatch. And after our very first kiss we didn't have a single doubt about our sexual chemistry. That moment was like worlds colliding, the stuff they write novels about. To this day my jimmy shoots up just kissing her for a couple seconds.
Do I think it would have been "wrong" if we'd broken our celibacy before? Not necessarily, no. We both knew, in every fiber of our being, we were meant to be together. After a few years of our celibacy, we both recognized that it was likely pointless in waiting. We didn't feel spiritually "wrong" about breaking it, but to be honest after putting in so many years of abstaining, we said we might as well go ahead and finish the challenge. We did.
And it worked. We have far more sex than any of our friends, all of which had plenty of sex prior to marriage. Our chemistry still astounds us, we are extraordinarily compatible in drive, and sexual outlook, and our bodies crave one another.
I can not speak to anyone else's convictions. I don't run around shouting to anybody about celibacy, abstinence, or waiting till marriage. It was a far, far easier feat to pull off in centuries past, and even in some modern non-Western cultures, because people routinely wed considerably earlier than we do, much closer to their sexual awakening. What my wife and I did was almost superhuman, very unusual, and most people would find that damn near impossible.
But when you walk in the spirit, you tend to look usual, and do unusual things. I trusted God back when there were no signs, or evidence, that what he was telling me was true. He honored that faith, and I am so, so glad he did.
From a strictly Christian, biblical perspective, it doesn't matter whether your partner "likes" sex or not. According to scriptures, sex is something a spouse does in service for their partner. A husband surrenders his body to his wife and his wife surrenders her's to her husband. A husband doesn't have to worry about what he is or isn't getting, sexually. His job is to make sure his wife's needs are met. Her job is to attend to his. As designed, the more we give, the more we would get.
The funny thing about scripture is that several times frequent sex is advised. Scripture tells men to be ravished by the breasts of the wife of your youth, and to not abstain from sex unless for very specific reasons.
From a strictly Christian, biblical perspective, it doesn't matter whether your partner "likes" sex or not. According to scriptures, sex is something a spouse does in service for their partner. A husband surrenders his body to his wife and his wife surrenders her's to her husband. A husband doesn't have to worry about what he is or isn't getting, sexually. His job is to make sure his wife's needs are met. Her job is to attend to his. As designed, the more we give, the more we would get.
Have you read Song of Solomon? It doesn't sound like you have, or at least understood it. Not trying to be confrontational, but that book oozes the sexual excitement that husband and wife had for each other. They wanted not just sex, but ultra passionate sex where they enjoyed every part of each other and adored each other. It wasn't out of service at all.
I found the exact verses where it says that husbands and wives are commanded to meet their spouses sexual needs:
1 Corinthians 7:3-5
The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband. The wife’s body does not belong to her alone but also to her husband. In the same way, the husband’s body does not belong to him alone but also to his wife. Do not deprive each other except by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.
Drop those on your husband and see how he reacts. The answer to a lack of control is MORE SEX.
Have you read Song of Solomon? It doesn't sound like you have, or at least understood it. Not trying to be confrontational, but that book oozes the sexual excitement that husband and wife had for each other. They wanted not just sex, but ultra passionate sex where they enjoyed every part of each other and adored each other. It wasn't out of service at all.
I've read it but I don't read any selfish motives in it. Both Solomon and his beloved are praising and adoring each other. I also have to remember that Solomon had a whole slew of wives and concubines, so his situation isn't quite the same as what we would call "marriage".
I've read it but I don't read any selfish motives in it. Both Solomon and his beloved are praising and adoring each other. I also have to remember that Solomon had a whole slew of wives and concubines, so his situation isn't quite the same as what we would call "marriage".
You are right on that front for certain. He was a polygamist... and probably the biggest polygamist in the bible. He had more wives and concubines than he could shake a stick at... crazy numbers for sure. Not trying to justify that at all, because frankly I don't care how sexual you are... no one *needs* that many partners.
Still, and I'm sure you got my point, was that the bible doesn't say: don't be passionate that sex is only for procreation. It doesn't say that sex is only a duty and nothing more.
If you love someone and you have a deep connection with them, sexual compatibility follows, it's inevitable. You don't need to test drive to find out.
My husband and I never had sex before we were married. We barely even kissed except for maybe a quick peck as to not start a fire we couldn't put out. The desire was there, but we chose to wait because we knew that ours was special and we wanted that first night together to be something to remember. And not spoil it by spoiling the surprise...kinda like christmas I suppose*lol* Not to mention we're both believers so we believed in waiting. He had too much respect for me and I for him, and for God to not wait.
14 years later and we're still going strong so no, a test drive is not necessary in a relationship. Many confuse lust with love.
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Re: Gimme a break...sorry I am so not spiritual 
so no, a test drive is not necessary in a relationship. Many confuse lust with love.
