# Hurt my wife because of me getting a lap dance



## lostworld

Hi
Am new here, have joined the forum because I have put my sweet wife in such a tough situation.

We have just completed a month of our wedding, at this stage both of us are staying in different countries while i am waiting for her to come over.

Last weekend, i visited a strip club with a friend. She knew about it and she was fine with it. At the strip club I ended up getting a lap dance, and then left the place immediately.

Why did i do it? Because i was too curious, i had never seen a lapdance, in fact it was the 2nd time i had been to a strip joint. And my buddy got one and said its no big deal. But it was a very awkward experience for me. I do not want to experience it again.

I returned, told my sweetie everything upfront on phone. Afterall i had always maintained that i would be transparent.

The poor girl has not been able to talk to me properly ever since. She says she keeps on picturing this woman over me and she will not be able to move past.

I feel terrible, i have hurt the person i value the most in life. I do not know how to move past this. I wish i could go back in time and undo it, but i cannot.

What do i do to make things right.


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## DawnD

You admit you made a selfish choice and were not thinking of how it would hurt her. You then promise to talk about boundaries with your wife. You both agree to some boundaries and move forward. I doubt she is gonna be okay with you going back to a strip club for a while though.


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## GreenEyes

DawnD said:


> You admit you made a selfish choice and were not thinking of how it would hurt her. You then promise to talk about boundaries with your wife. You both agree to some boundaries and move forward. I doubt she is gonna be okay with you going back to a strip club for a while though.


:iagree:


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## lostworld

DawnD said:


> You admit you made a selfish choice and were not thinking of how it would hurt her. You then promise to talk about boundaries with your wife. You both agree to some boundaries and move forward. I doubt she is gonna be okay with you going back to a strip club for a while though.


I am not interested in visiting the place again. It was morbid curiousity that caught me, they have nothing more to offer.
But, i want her to feel okay, it feels terrible to have hurt her. I don't know how to make her feel better :-(


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## GreenEyes

lostworld said:


> I am not interested in visiting the place again. It was morbid curiousity that caught me, they have nothing more to offer.
> But, i want her to feel okay, it feels terrible to have hurt her. I don't know how to make her feel better :-(


Time....it's just going to take time. There really is no quick fix for something like this because what has happened cannot be undone.


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## DawnD

lostworld said:


> I am not interested in visiting the place again. It was morbid curiousity that caught me, they have nothing more to offer.
> But, i want her to feel okay, it feels terrible to have hurt her. I don't know how to make her feel better :-(


You can't MAKE her feel better. You can do your best to ensure that you are both on the same page with boundaries with members of the opposite sex. 

You might want to address WHY you thought it was okay to have another woman rubbing herself all over you so soon after you took your marriage vows. THAT is going to be what she wants to know, and "curiosity" isn't going to settle the issue for her.


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## CandieGirl

Maybe in the future, you should not do things that you know will hurt your wife?

Seems like basic common sense - we all know our limits, IMO.


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## lostworld

DawnD said:


> You can't MAKE her feel better. You can do your best to ensure that you are both on the same page with boundaries with members of the opposite sex.
> 
> You might want to address WHY you thought it was okay to have another woman rubbing herself all over you so soon after you took your marriage vows. THAT is going to be what she wants to know, and "curiosity" isn't going to settle the issue for her.


I am clear about being on the same page.
I really do not have any answer about why i did it except what i said. Indeed it was a foolish thing, my buddy telling me its no big deal also didn't help either.


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## Sultry

Time heals all,well almost all.I had some pretty crappy things done to me too.All I can say is I'll never forget but I will forgive..Seems like I'm always on guard now


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## Hope1964

You need to get down on your knees and beg your wife to forgive you 1000x. Tell her all the time how sorry you are and that it will NEVER happen again. 

You also need to come up with a better answer as to why you did it than "I don't know". Maybe go to a couple of individual counseling sessions and figure it out.


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## FrankKissel

Allow me to play the insensitive oaf here:

1. Your wife's reaction seems an overreaction. She had no problem with you going to a strip club. So she apparently could readily accept you ogling naked women from a short distance. But ogling a naked woman from your lap is something she can't get past? Hmmm.

2. Unless she specifically told you she didn't want you getting a lap dance, and you specifically agreed to respect that wish, you've done nothing wrong. A lap dance is a common part of the strip club experience. She

3. What happens in strip clubs stays in strip clubs. I only mean that half-jokingly. It's admirable of you to be honest with your wife about going to one. It's foolish to detail everything that occurs within. Again, you didn't do anything wrong. You didn't cheat. You didn't disrespect her wishes. You didn't act inappropriately (by the low standards of a strip club at least). You had nothing to confess. So don't act as if you're guilty of some great sin. You're not.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## nice777guy

Short of never going there again - I think you've done about all you can do.

Honestly - I never thought of it as "cheating" before I'd read the reactions of some of the female users on this site. And aparrently your wife is one of those women who thinks its a very serious breach of boundaries.


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## KanDo

Well,
Since she knew you were going to the strip club, was there an understanding of what was going to be ok and what wasn't? I see the whole strip club thing as kind of silly in my mind.

"ok, you can go to a strip club but don't look" or

"you can go to a club but only look at the ones that are less cute than me"... or

"ok, you can go and look, but no lap dances" or

"ok, you can go and have a lap dance but only for 1 song" (there was a recent post about an inappropriate lap dance duration...)

You see where I am going with this?

I believe the best policy is not to go to sexually oriented businesses, unless accompanied by your wife at her request.

As far as your situation, I would simply apologize and tell her it won't happen again and make sure it doesn't.


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## lostworld

FrankKissel said:


> Allow me to play the insensitive oaf here:
> 
> 1. Your wife's reaction seems an overreaction. She had no problem with you going to a strip club. So she apparently could readily accept you ogling naked women from a short distance. But ogling a naked woman from your lap is something she can't get past? Hmmm.
> 
> 2. Unless she specifically told you she didn't want you getting a lap dance, and you specifically agreed to respect that wish, you've done nothing wrong. A lap dance is a common part of the strip club experience. She
> 
> 3. What happens in strip clubs stays in strip clubs. I only mean that half-jokingly. It's admirable of you to be honest with your wife about going to one. It's foolish to detail everything that occurs within. Again, you didn't do anything wrong. You didn't cheat. You didn't disrespect her wishes. You didn't act inappropriately (by the low standards of a strip club at least). You had nothing to confess. So don't act as if you're guilty of some great sin. You're not.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


1. Yes, she was okay. If she weren't i wouldn't have gone. We were frank about it.
2. No, we didn't discuss the lap dance. 
3. I didn't detail everything but i told her that i got the lap dance. 
I do feel guilty about it.


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## FrankKissel

Hope1964 said:


> You need to get down on your knees and beg your wife to forgive you 1000x. Tell her all the time how sorry you are and that it will NEVER happen again.
> 
> You also need to come up with a better answer as to why you did it than "I don't know". Maybe go to a couple of individual counseling sessions and figure it out.


On his knees begging forgiveness? Counseling? Over a lap dance?
Good Lord ....
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CandieGirl

FrankKissel said:


> On his knees begging forgiveness? Counseling? Over a lap dance?
> Good Lord ....
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


FK - If it's causing this much of a problem, then yes, counseling...I've read several of your posts/replies before - and you seem ahem...a little argumentative at times. It's a little insulting to those who come here looking for answers to their problems. No one likes to be made to look a fool.

OP - I say do what you have to do to get your wife to forgive you. It'll take time, but I'm sure she will - your offence is relatively minor compared to some.


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## lostworld

CandieGirl said:


> FK - If it's causing this much of a problem, then yes, counseling...I've read several of your posts/replies before - and you seem ahem...a little argumentative at times. It's a little insulting to those who come here looking for answers to their problems. No one likes to be made to look a fool.
> 
> OP - I say do what you have to do to get your wife to forgive you. It'll take time, but I'm sure she will - your offence is relatively minor compared to some.


Thanks. 
Maybe it needs time, i just need to be patient. I know for some it is a no big deal but for her it isn't and that's what matters to me.


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## FrankKissel

CandieGirl said:


> FK - If it's causing this much of a problem, then yes, counseling...I've read several of your posts/replies before - and you seem ahem...a little argumentative at times. It's a little insulting to those who come here looking for answers to their problems. No one likes to be made to look a fool.
> 
> OP - I say do what you have to do to get your wife to forgive you. It'll take time, but I'm sure she will - your offence is relatively minor compared to some.


Not argumentative, just injecting some common sense into some occasionally over-the-top responses.
No one needs to go see a psychologist or a counselor to find out why he got a single lap dance. That suggestion is absurd. If saying so is insulting to someone, that's not my intent, but I can live with it.

Even you describe it as a minor offense. I say it's no offense because there was never an indication beforehand that she disapproved, or any agreement that he wouldn't partake. To the contrary, she was 'fine' with him going to a strip club, a place where lap dances are a matter of routine. It's like telling one's wife to take the credit card to her favorite store then getting upset when she returns home with packages. (Yeah, that may be a bit of a stereotype, but the point stands).
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Therealbrighteyes

FrankKissel said:


> Not argumentative, just injecting some common sense into some occasionally over-the-top responses.
> No one needs to go see a psychologist or a counselor to find out why he got a single lap dance. That suggestion is absurd. If saying so is insulting to someone, that's not my intent, but I can live with it.
> Even you describe it as a minor offense. I say it's no offense because there was never an indication beforehand that she disapproved, or any agreement that he wouldn't partake. To the contrary, she was 'fine' with him going to a strip club, a place where lap dances are a matter of routine. It's like telling one's wife to take the credit card to her favorite store than getting upset when she returns home with packages. (Yeah, that may be a bit of a stereotype, but the point stands).
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Perhaps she was under the impression he would "look but not touch". I think lap dances cross the line personally in to cheating territory for a married person. I mean they literally grind on you with nothing but your pants/her thong separating genitals. In many case, the man ejaculates. So yes, I do view it as more than a minor offense. If she said "Bye honey have a great time having Crystal grind on you" and then got upset that he did, that's a different story. If she was under the impression that Crystal was 30 feet away, she has every right to feel cheated on.


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## lostworld

Guys, 
Its okay. I don't want you to get into an argument with each other. I value everyone's opinion. I know some of them seem over the top too...but its okay, it does help me.
All i have been looking for is a hope that its not the end of the world and she'll be okay. 
We are a young couple and atleast one of us (me) is not as mature too!


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## nice777guy

lostworld said:


> Guys,
> Its okay. I don't want you to get into an argument with each other.


Don't worry - some of them enjoy the arguments! Keeps the place lively!


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## Therealbrighteyes

Nobody's arguing. It's a discussion of opinions and that's what makes this place awesome.


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## CandieGirl

lostworld said:


> Guys,
> Its okay. I don't want you to get into an argument with each other. I value everyone's opinion. I know some of them seem over the top too...but its okay, it does help me.
> All i have been looking for is a hope that its not the end of the world and she'll be okay.
> We are a young couple and atleast one of us (me) is not as mature too!


You're young, and you will both learn...I never imagined myself (in my 20s) telling a man what I would / would not accept. Things such as a trip to strip clubs, lap dances, whatEVER would take place, and I would just suck it up and live with it. But sometimes, those things eat you up over time. I think this is what may be happening to your wife. The point is, now, I am comfortable with being upfront about what I will and will not accept.

And at the risk of brewing up another sh!tstorm, I would not be comfortable with the whole lap dance thing - but I will tell my husband, not let him go merrily ahead, only to crucify him when he gets back.


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## lostworld

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Nobody's arguing. It's a discussion of opinions and that's what makes this place awesome.


Alright.
Well we never discussed the lap dance, and probably that is where i goofed up. Moreover I had not gone there with the mission that I would be getting one. By the way, my experience was not touchy the way you mentioned there (but that is no justification).


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## Hope1964

Maybe if some people got counseling when they didn't think they needed it, they wouldn't feel the need to, for example, go out and get a lap dance and then wonder why they did it. I suggested counseling in case he really doesn't know why he did it and wants to figure it out. A good talk with a buddy might give the same result, depending on the buddy. Counseling certainly isn't going to hurt anything, and I think it would get him some brownie points at this stage of the game. Show her he's really serious here.

Just an FYI lostworld, but you may want to work on your impulse control a bit. And maybe not drink (if that was involved) when your wife isn't around.

Strip clubs are like porn in that many wives have a problem with it and husbands don't understand why. My opinion is that, husbands, you don't need to understand it, you just need to know we have a problem with it and act accordingly.


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## CandieGirl

Hope1964 said:


> Maybe if some people got counseling when they didn't think they needed it, they wouldn't feel the need to, for example, go out and get a lap dance and then wonder why they did it. I suggested counseling in case he really doesn't know why he did it and wants to figure it out. A good talk with a buddy might give the same result, depending on the buddy. Counseling certainly isn't going to hurt anything, and I think it would get him some brownie points at this stage of the game. Show her he's really serious here.
> 
> Just an FYI lostworld, but you may want to work on your impulse control a bit. And maybe not drink (if that was involved) when your wife isn't around.
> 
> Strip clubs are like porn in that many wives have a problem with it and husbands don't understand why. My opinion is that, husbands, you don't need to understand it, you just need to know we have a problem with it and act accordingly.


:iagree:


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## sigma1299

I have to chime in on Frank's side here. I've been to my share of strip clubs over the years and I'm not sure I've ever had a lap dance but I've seen friends of mine get them - always looked like an awkward experience to me. But cheating?? Maybe if he was going repeatedly but as a one off event that wasn't discussed in advance I don't see it. Going forward since he now clearly knows it bothers her he obviously shouldn't do it, and if he does it's a different issue. For this one though, I think she has some duty to apply some common sense and call it a miscommunication.


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## KI0159

_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hope1964

sigma1299 said:


> I have to chime in on Frank's side here. I've been to my share of strip clubs over the years and I'm not sure I've ever had a lap dance but I've seen friends of mine get them - always looked like an awkward experience to me. But cheating?? Maybe if he was going repeatedly but as a one off event that wasn't discussed in advance I don't see it. Going forward since he now clearly knows it bothers her he obviously shouldn't do it, and if he does it's a different issue. For this one though, I think she has some duty to apply some common sense and call it a miscommunication.





Hope1964 said:


> Strip clubs are like porn in that many wives have a problem with it and husbands don't understand why. My opinion is that, husbands, you don't need to understand it, you just need to know we have a problem with it and act accordingly.


Doesn't matter what actually happens there. It's what she thinks happened that matters. If my husband got a lap dance, yer durned right he'd be cheating in my mind.


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## Therealbrighteyes

sigma1299 said:


> I have to chime in on Frank's side here. I've been to my share of strip clubs over the years and I'm not sure I've ever had a lap dance but I've seen friends of mine get them - always looked like an awkward experience to me. But cheating?? Maybe if he was going repeatedly but as a one off event that wasn't discussed in advance I don't see it. Going forward since he now clearly knows it bothers her he obviously shouldn't do it, and if he does it's a different issue. For this one though, I think she has some duty to apply some common sense and call it a miscommunication.


So it would be okay for some male dancer to grind all over your wife and you not be aware in advance? Yes?


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## Jellybeans

lostworld said:


> Guys,
> Its okay. I don't want you to get into an argument with each other.





nice777guy said:


> Don't worry - some of them enjoy the arguments! Keeps the place lively!



:rofl: True




Therealbrighteyes said:


> Nobody's arguing. It's a discussion of opinions and that's what makes this place awesome.


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## KI0159

My husband went to a strip club with his friends ( think they've all been a few times), going to the strip club didn't bother me but when my husband said he got a lap dance, well that didn't go down to well. I don't actually remember it but husband said I wasn't happy. The thing I do remember is asking why he did it, he said because his friends were laughing and telling him to get one - so if your friend tells you to jump in a fire do you do it? I think it was more the fact that his friends thoughts were more important than mine that would have got me mad.
Like you my husband was honest and told me the next day, I appreciated that but just because your honest doesn't mean your gonna get a pat on the back. Plus it annoyed me that my husband then told me not to tell his friends that he told me....wtf!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## FrankKissel

Hope1964 said:


> I suggested counseling in case he really doesn't know why he did it and wants to figure it out. A good talk with a buddy might give the same result, depending on the buddy.


Of course he knows why he did it. Guys like looking at attractive women. Guys really like looking at attractive women naked. And guys really like looking at attractive women naked and on your lap. There's no mystery here. (And please, no retorts about how your husbands are different. They're not. They just don't admit it to you. And this thread is why.) 





> My opinion is that, husbands, you don't need to understand it, you just need to know we have a problem with it and act accordingly.


Oh my. Can you imagine the furor if some guy here wrote "Wives, you don't have to understand why we husbands want oral sex, you just need to know that we do and you should act accordingly."
Pretty sure that would go over like a lead balloon (as it should).
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CandieGirl

Oh my. Can you imagine the furor if some guy here wrote "Wives, you don't have to understand why we husbands want oral sex, you just need to know that we do and you should act accordingly."
Pretty sure that would go over like a lead balloon (as it should).
_Posted via Mobile Device_[/QUOTE]

Husband: You don't need to understand why I need to be screwed and screwed often, in many different positions and I'll take some oral sex with that, too... You just need to know I need this, and act accordingly!

If life were like that, I wouldnt' need TAM...

:lol: :rofl: :lol:


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## CandieGirl

KI0159 said:


> My husband went to a strip club with his friends ( think they've all been a few times), going to the strip club didn't bother me but when my husband said he got a lap dance, well that didn't go down to well. I don't actually remember it but husband said I wasn't happy. The thing I do remember is asking why he did it, he said because his friends were laughing and telling him to get one - so if your friend tells you to jump in a fire do you do it? I think it was more the fact that his friends thoughts were more important than mine that would have got me mad.
> Like you my husband was honest and told me the next day, I appreciated that but just because your honest doesn't mean your gonna get a pat on the back. Plus it annoyed me that my husband then told me not to tell his friends that he told me....wtf!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_




Men just wanna look cool in front of the guys...

But MY husband is different! 

:lol:


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## Therealbrighteyes

FrankKissel said:


> Oh my. Can you imagine the furor if some guy here wrote "Wives, you don't have to understand why we husbands want oral sex, you just need to know that we do and you should act accordingly."
> Pretty sure that would go over like a lead balloon (as it should).
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I've seen 4 posts of this inside of 1 month. NONE fell over like a lead balloon and all went past 6 pages. Next.


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## sigma1299

Therealbrighteyes said:


> So it would be okay for some male dancer to grind all over your wife and you not be aware in advance? Yes?


I wouldn't be happy about it, no. But I wouldn't call it cheating. I'd establish some clear communication on it and define our mutual expectations and then expect us both to abide by them. Unless this was a different type of "lap dance" than I'm familiar with I stand by my previous post. Of course there are all types of strip clubs and what can and can't go on varies by jurisdiction so it's entirely possible that we're talking about two different ends of the same stick. Can it get that far in the right club and right conditions - I assume so but I've never seen it. Based on my understanding of what the standard "lap dance" is IMO it just doesn't rise to the level of cheating - and remember I'm not even a fan of them - I think they look awkward and uncomfortable. 

I understand that his wife doesn't like it - who would? But I'm not sure her reaction is proportionate to the act.


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## Hope1964

FrankKissel said:


> Of course he knows why he did it. Guys like looking at attractive women. Guys really like looking at attractive women naked. And guys really like looking at attractive women naked and on your lap. There's no mystery here. (And please, no retorts about how your husbands are different. They're not. They just don't admit it to you. And this thread is why.)
> 
> Oh my. Can you imagine the furor if some guy here wrote "Wives, you don't have to understand why we husbands want oral sex, you just need to know that we do and you should act accordingly."
> Pretty sure that would go over like a lead balloon (as it should).
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Women DON'T have to understand why husbands want oral sex, and we SHOULD just need to know that they do and act accordingly. I'll agree with that. Before I found out my husband hired a hooker for a BJ, I was enthusiastically learning how to give better ones. 

And he's the one who said he didn't know why he did it, not me. If he needs counseling in order to admit why, then he should get counseling. You obviously don't need counseling though


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## DawnD

OP, 

I don't consider lap dances cheating. I have gotten one with my hubby in the room with me. Maybe because I am a woman she was more upfront, but everything was rubbed on me, she was peeking at my thong by looking up my skirt, and kissed me at the end. It was pretty........amazingly inappropriate LMAO. I don't think that anyone would really consider that appropriate without the spouses knowledge of it happening. 

I don't think you should beg or plead. I think you should stick to my original statement. Apologize, tell her why ( even if its "I'm a follower and wanted to look cool in front of my buddy") and suggest a solution. Solution = we set boundaries in our marriage, and I don't put my relationship with my friends above my marriage to you. 

This shouldn't be a relationship killer, only because neither of you set any boundaries beforehand. Its now a learning experience. Girl waving her snatch in your face= not cool with the wife LOL.


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## that_girl

Anyone, other than the spouse, grinding on someone is cheating in my eyes.

But that's a boundary my husband and I discussed. Thankfully he thinks stripclubs are silly. 

His wife has every right to be upset. I have been to strip clubs...years ago when a friend in college was a dancer  and you can just sit there and NOT have a lap dance. Maybe his wife just thought he was going with the guys. Maybe she wasn't ok with it but didn't want to be "controlling". 

Sounds like a conversation about boundaries is in order, OP. Time to know what is and isn't ok in your marriage between you and your wife.


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## lostworld

that_girl said:


> Anyone, other than the spouse, grinding on someone is cheating in my eyes.
> 
> But that's a boundary my husband and I discussed. Thankfully he thinks stripclubs are silly.
> 
> His wife has every right to be upset. I have been to strip clubs...years ago when a friend in college was a dancer  and you can just sit there and NOT have a lap dance. Maybe his wife just thought he was going with the guys. Maybe she wasn't ok with it but didn't want to be "controlling".
> 
> Sounds like a conversation about boundaries is in order, OP. Time to know what is and isn't ok in your marriage between you and your wife.


I understand the conversation about boundaries, and indeed i have understood it the hard way. But right now i see her hardly talking to me, its been 4 days...and it is scaring me a lot. 

A lot of the posts are on why and there wherefores. All i have to say is, the deed is done, and there shall be no more of it. I am just worried how to get her to understand how deeply sorry i am. I am just plain worried about her, because i know she is probably fixated at it.


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## SimplyAmorous

I think being early married, these things can hurt and burn alot more. Although it was a mistake, one you probably shouldn't have done, I don't feel you are a monster either, as she gave you the go -ahead in visiting. 

I have no problem with my husband getting lap dances at a strip club, I've even paid for them - but we were married for 19 yrs before we experienced that, if the dance was an AIR dance, there is no rubbing at all, simply some visual pleasure. 

Women are very very sensitive about a man only wanting them. I am no different really -but I know my husband can experience this, enjoy it delightfully and still only want ME at the end of the day .... so it works for us, I like & enjoy porn, we have 100% transparency. 

While some may feel this is a form of cheating, this should never be a judgement to all. ANd if his wife feels this and others are telling her this, well- how much harder this will be to overcome. 

But I see this is your dilemma...this is what YOUR wife FEELS, she feels you betrayed her in the deepest way, it is good you are not belittling her in this respect, that would only cause further harm and a divide. 

I feel it was very good of you to be honest with her- in your regret, even sorrow for the curiosity. I hope she can come to understand how very very valuable this is in a marraige- even if the honesty has seared her in this -for a time. It is a foundation that should be laid in all marraiges. Do not regret this part. It should speak your character even. So many men would have just not said NOTHING -to avoid the fallout. 



> A lot of the posts are on why and there wherefores. All i have to say is, the deed is done, and there shall be no more of it. I am just worried how to get her to understand how deeply sorry i am. I am just plain worried about her, because i know she is probably fixated at.


I would ask her what you can do to make this up to her, that you are prepared to do anything in this world , you love her that deeply, you love that strongly. Ask her outright if she can forgive you -you need her forgiveness, you don't want this to come between the 2 of you forever, It is ripping you up inside that you hurt her in this way, you are at her mercy, she is all you ever wanted or will ever need. You learned a very hard lesson here, but please -what can you do . 

This is what I would do if I hurt my spouse .....and walk in it - eventually she will come around, give it some time. I just hope she is not talking to a bunch of women how are encouraging her to put this on a par of cheating. 

The ability to forgive is paramount in a marriage, if she can not get past this -when your heart is bleeding, vulnerable to her willing to do anything ....then this is a sign of harships to come, even in smaller things. Passive aggressiveness, unforgiving. None of us are perfect.

What is important is the heart - that we learn from our mistakes, you are so willing to give her that, I hope she does not trample it.


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## lostworld

Everything is okay!
I had mailed her today morning (we are in different timezones) about the situation. I just said that its now in her hands, and whatever she will do will be fine by me. Basically at this time i had become really worried about what will happen.

A few hours later she pinged me on the phone, told me that she will never leave me and then said that she'd kill me. At this stage i just felt better, strange that a death threat could make someone feel good. She then proceeded to ask me again about my actions, and that she could have given a dance and that she'd kill the bimbo who gave me the dance. To cut to the chase, she told me its okay but if i dare goof off she'd not be able to take it. Finally she sent me the smileys which make all the difference to me ( :-* )

With this it got over, i am so glad, life is good again and i know i won't ever go near the boundaries! I got her a present, am sure she'll love it.

Thanks everyone. 
I have learnt a few lessons here,
[1] Know the boundaries and protect them
[2] Be honest. It may hurt but if you are through you have a clear conscience
[3] Lap dances are over hyped
[4] Don't trust if others say its okay specially if you are in doubt, its probably not okay.


----------



## Unhappy2011

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Perhaps she was under the impression he would "look but not touch". I think lap dances cross the line personally in to cheating territory for a married person. I mean they literally grind on you with nothing but your pants/her thong separating genitals. *In many case, the man ejaculates.* So yes, I do view it as more than a minor offense. If she said "Bye honey have a great time having Crystal grind on you" and then got upset that he did, that's a different story. If she was under the impression that Crystal was 30 feet away, she has every right to feel cheated on.


In many cases, the man ejaculates? You really think that?

uhh....no.


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## sinnister

It was a lap dance for crying out loud. 

I dont deliberately like to diminsih peoples feelings...but let's get some perspective here. It was a lap dance...a business transaction. You dont love the stripper and she dont love you. You didnt exchange bodily fluids so it's all good.


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## sinnister

Do women really think men jizz there pants from a lapdance?

It takes WAY WAY more than that for any male over the age of 18.


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## Hope1964

sinnister said:


> It was a lap dance for crying out loud.
> 
> I dont deliberately like to diminsih peoples feelings...but let's get some perspective here. It was a lap dance...a business transaction. You dont love the stripper and she dont love you. You didnt exchange bodily fluids so it's all good.


By this definition then you would have no problem with your wife or girlfriend dry humping another guy on the dance floor? Or sending naked pictures of herself to someone? Or hiring a male masseuse for an erotic massage?


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## tacoma

sinnister said:


> Do women really think men jizz there pants from a lapdance?
> 
> It takes WAY WAY more than that for any male over the age of 18.


Yes they do.
I hear it all the time when this subject is brought up.

I`m sure some do but it`s not at all the norm.
I couldn`t even imagine it ever happening.

I`m with Frank on this one, the whole "won`t speak to you over this" is an over reaction.

Counseling to understand his desire for a lap dance is even more of an over reaction.


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## tacoma

Hope1964 said:


> By this definition then you would have no problem with your wife or girlfriend dry humping another guy on the dance floor? Or sending naked pictures of herself to someone? Or hiring a male masseuse for an erotic massage?


You do realize only one of your examples is even close to an equitable comparison.


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## Hope1964

tacoma said:


> You do realize only one of your examples is even close to an equitable comparison.


They all involve 'no exchange of bodily fluids' though. Yeah, I know only one of them is close but you get my drift.


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## Hope1964

Oh, and I only suggested counseling because it would earn him brownie points with her. Not because I actually think he needs it. I know I said that somewhere.


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## Noel1987

If you are really true then God knows and time will heal this don't let the lady go through show your extreme love to her with all care, that is only thing what i think and i am sure about it  after al it is your fault


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## Tall Average Guy

My concern is her not defining her boundaries and then going nuclear when he did not guess them. 

He got the go ahead to go to the strip club, but no mention was made of a lap dance. I don't think it is reasonable, after giving this permission, for her to just assume that he automatically knows not to get one. It is not fair to make him guess, then punish him when he does so incorrectly. There is nothing wrong with a boundary that says no lap dances (my wife made this clear to me and I agree with it), but that needs to be communicated under these circumstances. 

If I have a bounday, it is my responsibility to communicate it to my spouse. I hope this leads the OP and his wife to have this type of discussion in this and other areas.


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## Hope1964

How could ANY guy POSSIBLY think it's OK to get a lap dance?!?! That boggles my mind. Saying it's the womans responsibility to tell him not to, otherwise permission is implicit, is bullsheet. Do we have to also specify that you shouldn't be emailing other women pictures of your naked penis? I never SPECIFICALLY told my husband not to do that, yet he did. So is that my fault?


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## Tall Average Guy

Hope1964 said:


> How could ANY guy POSSIBLY think it's OK to get a lap dance?!?! That boggles my mind. Saying it's the womans responsibility to tell him not to, otherwise permission is implicit, is bullsheet. Do we have to also specify that you shouldn't be emailing other women pictures of your naked penis? I never SPECIFICALLY told my husband not to do that, yet he did. So is that my fault?


Not at all, but I don't see how that situation applies here.

Here, the OP's wife said she was fine with him going to the strip club. There is no indication that anything else was discussed. Assuming that is correct, why would she assume that he knows what activities in the strip club she would find appropriate and what shoud would not? There are a lot of different things at a strip club, from watching from afar to being right at the stage, to placing a tip in the woman's g-string to having the girl sit with the group and talk to getting a lap dance. Where is the boundary, and why would he necessarily know that her boundary is there? The problem is that she assumed he knew her boundaries. Unless they talk about it, he may not because of the permission she gave. 

I went to a strip club for a friends bachelor party, about two years after I was first married. My wife was very clear - no lap dance. I then asked some questions and we further agreed to no touching and no real conversations with the strippers. Realistically, had she just said okay to the strip club visit with no other comment, I would not have though the other two were a boundary.

I am also not saying that he should not apologize. But I do think that after giving permission to go to the strip club in the first place, for her to be unable to even talk to him for weeks afterward seems over the top.


----------



## Hope1964

I totally agree that they should have discussed the boundaries if there was a potential issue. But I really cannot understand how any guy in a monogamous relationship could possibly think that getting a lap dance was OK. Can you honestly tell me that a guy, at a strip club, who has the opportunity for a lap dance but who has never talked to his SO about it, is going to assume she thinks it's ok and go into it with a clear conscience? I bet no. They'll do it and then hope she never finds out, and if she does and freaks on them, they'll try to say she should have told him specifically that lap dances were verboten. 

Even though you don't like my email comparison I'm going to use it again. My husband had my 'permission' if you want to call it that, to use email. Should I have gone over everything that can possibly be done over the email with him, and said sure you can email your mother but you can't email women you're trying to sleep with? 

Expecting your partner to have specified everything that isn't OK beforehand is placing them in an impossible situation. It's up to YOU when placed in a situation where you have NOT discussed something ahead of time and has the potential to be a problem, to err on the side of caution and decline to take part in said activity.


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## Tall Average Guy

Hope1964 said:


> I totally agree that they should have discussed the boundaries if there was a potential issue. But I really cannot understand how any guy in a monogamous relationship could possibly think that getting a lap dance was OK. Can you honestly tell me that a guy, at a strip club, who has the opportunity for a lap dance but who has never talked to his SO about it, is going to assume she thinks it's ok and go into it with a clear conscience? I bet no. They'll do it and then hope she never finds out, and if she does and freaks on them, they'll try to say she should have told him specifically that lap dances were verboten.
> 
> Even though you don't like my email comparison I'm going to use it again. My husband had my 'permission' if you want to call it that, to use email. Should I have gone over everything that can possibly be done over the email with him, and said sure you can email your mother but you can't email women you're trying to sleep with?
> 
> Expecting your partner to have specified everything that isn't OK beforehand is placing them in an impossible situation. It's up to YOU when placed in a situation where you have NOT discussed something ahead of time and has the potential to be a problem, to err on the side of caution and decline to take part in said activity.


Your analagy still does not work because getting a lap dance is pretty dang common in a strip club, while the vast majority of email is not concerned with sending naked pictures. If a man goes to a strip club, is it foreseeable that they would get a lap dance? Absolutely, so if you give him permission to go, it is best to set out the basic ground rules. As I noted before, my wife did that. Out of the conversation, we agreed on what was okay and what was not. We did not cover every specific, but I got enough information to know that when the stripper came up behind me to try and rub my shoulders, I put a stop to it right away. 

A better example may be opposite sex friends. Many couples have a strict no flirting with others policy. But if you allow it, I would make sure that each knows the line. Is it just at work, distant friends, only friends as couples, or close friends. What is appropriate to share with that friend. You need to make clear what you think is too far so that you partner can act accordingly. And if you generically say opposite sex friends are okay, you run the very real risk that a boundary will be broken.

I have no problem with advising the guy to be conservative if he finds himself in a position they have not covered in discussions. But for her to be sobbing after sending him there is a bit much. The disconnect between telling him he could go to the strip club and yet being virtually inconsolable that he got a lap dance tells me that she needs to be clear on her boundaries. If it is that important, then it is too important to just assume that he knows.


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## Hope1964

Why is it foreseeable that a guy going to a strip club would get a lap dance? And why does the fact it has not been discussed default to permission being implicit? That's a sure way to get yourself into trouble, to think that way.

Angel5112, the fact that everyone has a different opinion supports my view. The fact it had not been discussed between them meant that he should have never gone there until they had. If he'd said no to the lap dance, then gone home and talked to her about what she thought, this whole situation could have been avoided.

It's no wonder guys are always in trouble with their wives, if this is the way they think!!!!!! "Well, my wife never said I can't, so I guess it's fine to go for lunch with my sexy co worker, just the two of us". "Well, my wife never said I can't, so she should be OK with us going to dinner too". "Since my wife didn't tell me not to, I'll just send this sexually suggestive text to her too and see how much of a sense of humor she has"


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## Tall Average Guy

Angel5112 said:


> That logic makes no sense. It's kind of like saying "if we allow people of the same sex to marry, next thing they be asking to marry a dog"...there is no direct correlation.
> 
> If I was to say to my H, "sure honey go to the strip club, I don't care" and then get angry when he came home and told me that he had a lap dance at the urging of a friend and it made him uncomfortable, I feel like that would make me a hypocrite. What do you think happens in strip clubs? The guys stand around drinking NOT looking at the naked women? So that fact that everyone has different opinions doesn't support your view or my view.  It supports the fact that everyone has different opinions and that these opinions need to be discussed...especially if you have told your H that it is okay to attend the strip club in the first place. You can't have your cake and eat it too.


I think this sums it up quite well. A strip club is all about sexual titilation, in one form of another. That is the whole point. There are just different gradations, from merely looking to a lap dance. If one end is acceptable, but the other is enough to go nuclear, then you should darn well make sure your partner knows where your boundary is, otherwise you are liable to get really hurt.

My wife wants to go by a dress and I say okay. It is difficult for me to go ballistic if she comes back with a really expensive dress. I can be irratated and tell her that we need to discuss purchases of these types and monetary amounts. Perhaps if this is an ongoing issue that has been discussed repeatedly but that she still ignores, then a stronger reaction is necessary. But to be unable to speak to her for a week or more after the first transgression would not be reasonable to me.


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## nice777guy

Tall Average Guy said:


> My wife wants to go by a dress and I say okay. It is difficult for me to go ballistic if she comes back with a really expensive dress.


And of course matching purse and shoes too. Unless you were specific about the "accessories."

Lap dances are a fairly common part of going to a strip club.

Now that he knows this bothers her - he can choose to respect her boundary in the future.

I sure hope the OP and his wife have moved on already!


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## ScaredandUnsure

I see both sides. On one hand, if a man or woman goes to a strip club, stuff like this should be brought up and discussed before the person in question goes. But then again, is it only okay for a mostly naked person to grind all over you because you're paying them? Or because it's in a strip club? I do think the wife is overreacting, but I do understand that if it's not okay in general for a half naked person to rub themselves all over you or your spouse, why would going to a strip club be any different?


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## applelemon

@frankkissel 
wow what terrible advice, are you even being serious?
1. I'm certain that she had enough trust in her husband, that he would not make choices at the club that would negatively affect their marriage. Clearly this was not the outcome unfortunately.
2. Any sensible, and mildly intelligent husband should know that a lap dance is probably not acceptable. This was also not the case.
3. What happens at the strip club stays at the stripclub? Are you a trolling on this forum? Marriage requires trust. If he slipped a few dollar bills in a dancer's bra, okay, but a lap dance? Not in my book 

My suggestion would be admit your wrong, ask for her forgiveness and earn back her trust once again. She will need time to heal and you have to be understanding. Obvioulsy, you will need to refrain from the activities you got yourself into in the first place,


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## Tall Average Guy

ScaredandUnsure said:


> I see both sides. On one hand, if a man or woman goes to a strip club, stuff like this should be brought up and discussed before the person in question goes. But then again, is it only okay for a mostly naked person to grind all over you because you're paying them? Or because it's in a strip club? I do think the wife is overreacting, but I do understand that if it's not okay in general for a half naked person to rub themselves all over you or your spouse, why would going to a strip club be any different?


To be clear, I have no issue with that boundary. It was my wife's boundary and I respect it (it is my boundary too). We have discussed it and made it clear to each other.

My point is that when something is reasonably forseeable, it is important for each partner to make their boundaries clear to other. And when they don't, and a mistake is made, refusing to even talk to them is not a reasonable response. Handling those mistakes is something that the OP and his wife need to discuss as well.


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## Hope1964

Angel5112 said:


> everyone has different opinions and that these opinions need to be discussed.


This is exactly my point though. They hadn't discussed it, therefore he should have *never* gotten a lap dance.

I am in agreement that she over reacted. But I do not agree that it's up to the partner giving permission to foresee these things and make sure they're laid out on the table beforehand. This is an impossible expectation! It may be a given to some that lap dances at strip clubs are a possibility, but making an assumption like that of one's spouse is just asking for trouble. As we see here. She was guilty of assuming her husband was trustworthy, not for failing to predict what he was going to do and heading it off.


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## Noel1987

applelemon said:


> @frankkissel
> wow what terrible advice, are you even being serious?
> 1. I'm certain that she had enough trust in her husband, that he would not make choices at the club that would negatively affect their marriage. Clearly this was not the outcome unfortunately.
> 2. Any sensible, and mildly intelligent husband should know that a lap dance is probably not acceptable. This was also not the case.
> 3. What happens at the strip club stays at the stripclub? Are you a trolling on this forum? Marriage requires trust. If he slipped a few dollar bills in a dancer's bra, okay, but a lap dance? Not in my book
> 
> My suggestion would be admit your wrong, ask for her forgiveness and earn back her trust once again. She will need time to heal and you have to be understanding. Obvioulsy, you will need to refrain from the activities you got yourself into in the first place,


Thats what i advised the guy :iagree:


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## nice777guy

Tall Average Guy said:


> My point is that when something is reasonably forseeable, it is important for each partner to make their boundaries clear to other. And when they don't, and a mistake is made, refusing to even talk to them is not a reasonable response. Handling those mistakes is something that the OP and his wife need to discuss as well.


:iagree:


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## Tall Average Guy

Hope1964 said:


> I am in agreement that she over reacted. But I do not agree that it's up to the partner giving permission to foresee these things and make sure they're laid out on the table beforehand. This is an impossible expectation! It may be a given to some that lap dances at strip clubs are a possibility, but making an assumption like that of one's spouse is just asking for trouble. As we see here. She was guilty of assuming her husband was trustworthy, not for failing to predict what he was going to do and heading it off.


At this point, we are probably just quibbling, but I still fail to see how a lap dance is not forseeable in this environment. It may not be automatic, or even likely, but it is not one of some infinite universe of possibilities. A strip club is a sexually charged place with lots of opportunities to make a wrong step. If a spouse is giving permission to attend, I think they also need to set out the boundaries they have, if any. Angel makes my point, in that all people (men and women) do not have the same boundaries. To assume that your spouse has all of yours without any prior discussion is neither fair nor reasonable. It also does not make them untrustworthy (which is supported by the OP telling his spouse about it right away).

On a side note to the OP (in case you are still listening) - do not let this experience make you think that you should not be honest with your wife. Do not use this as an excuse to hide things from her to "protect her feelings." That will cause you big problems down the road.


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## Hope1964

Tall Average Guy said:


> On a side note to the OP (in case you are still listening) - do not let this experience make you think that you should not be honest with your wife. Do not use this as an excuse to hide things from her to "protect her feelings." That will cause you big problems down the road.


:iagree::iagree::iagree:


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## Tall Average Guy

Hope1964 said:


> :iagree::iagree::iagree:


I am glad we can agree on something.:smthumbup:


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## Hope1964

Tall Average Guy said:


> I am glad we can agree on something.:smthumbup:


Yep!


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## sharonND

KanDo said:


> Well,
> Since she knew you were going to the strip club, was there an understanding of what was going to be ok and what wasn't? I see the whole strip club thing as kind of silly in my mind.
> 
> "ok, you can go to a strip club but don't look" or
> 
> "you can go to a club but only look at the ones that are less cute than me"... or
> 
> "ok, you can go and look, but no lap dances" or
> 
> "ok, you can go and have a lap dance but only for 1 song" (there was a recent post about an inappropriate lap dance duration...)
> 
> You see where I am going with this?
> 
> I believe the best policy is not to go to sexually oriented businesses, unless accompanied by your wife at her request.
> 
> As far as your situation, I would simply apologize and tell her it won't happen again and make sure it doesn't.


Kando, the duration person was me. Thanks for thinking of me. My husband is a jerk. It still bothers me to this day what he did. I had told him no lap dances and I was there and I allowed him to get the lap dances, I just didnt know he would take it so far into the land of disrespect. I don't know how long it will take for me to get over it but we have went to 2 more since that occurred because he wanted to prove to me that he could behave and he can, now.

I have been telling women that i meet that if they are going to allow their men to go to strip clubs, they better go for themself and see what they are agreeing to. 

The real issue I have found among women is they are completely out of touch with reality on how sordid and dangerous those places can be and think that their husband is honest and trustworthy and wont do anything that she wont approve of and as we see, that is not always the case and no woman should make that type of assumption.


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## sisters359

It's just silly to say she should have anticipated what he would do at the club--and naive to assume that everyone knows lap dances are common at strip clubs. He was the one going--he could have disclosed the possibility to her, rather than assuming it, because it involved a sexual encounter of a "milder" sort. He also knows whether or not she's been to one--if she hasn't, how the heck would she even know how common lap dances might be (and probably she would need more experience with strip joints to gauge how he might behave). I suspect that the OP had to have known that guys urge other guys to have lap dances when their wives aren't around, but his wife wouldn't necessarily know this. Maybe I'm wrong. But he seems to have realized she would be surprised by the fact that he did it, and seems only to have been surprised by the depth of her reaction--as in, he knew she wouldn't like it, but he didn't know she'd be THAT upset. So he wasn't innocent--he did it against his better judgment (maybe b/c alcohol was involved, maybe b/c his friends urged him), and he felt guilty enough to immediately assume she was "right" to be so hurt (he didn't try to put any of the blame of her reaction on her). So I suspect he knew darn well that it could happen--not that he was planning it. He had the knowledge; he should have disclosed. 

OP, I also think you must be a pretty good guy--because I believe you didn't tell her b/c you never thought you'd do it. So yeah, if you can't handle peer pressure and/or alcohol, don't put yourself in that situation again. I think you handled it wll and she knows you well enough to know you are really disappointed in yourself, too. I don't think she was giving you the "silent treatment," either; I think she was genuinely too upset to talk and didn't want to say something she'd later regret. But watch out for the cold shoulder, silent treatment--that which is meant to punish. It is one thing when someone is still too hurt and upset to talk and another when they want YOU to hurt.


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## SoWhat

Also, never look at any woman ever again. You may find her attractive and your wife might not approve of that.

This whole thing is insane. 

Him: "I give you permission to go to the latest forgettable Romantic Comedy."

Her: " It was great. George Clooney's charact..."

Him: "I gave you permission to watch the movie, not to look at George Clooney on screen!"

Strip clubs are places where lap dances happen. Not everyone in the club will get one, but most will. If you want to stipulate out of that, you have to do it explicitly - otherwise, how in the heck is anyone supposed to know?


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## Catherine602

I profess ignorance. Will someone who has actually gotten a lap dance tell exactly what is done? 

I assumed I knew what it was - lap dance - woman's ass on mans lap - wiggle wiggle. 

When I read that there are men who think that it is no big deal for a man on a committed relationship to partake, I began to doubt that I knew what it was. If this is not cheating and no big deal then I hope that it is equally ok for their wives to give a young stud a lap dance for fun on a GNO. Maybe that's why men have problems with GNO, they know women are so like them. 

It is uncomfortable being placed in a position where one partner expresses the joy of fresh sexual experiences with an attractive member of the opitsite sex. This is usually not considered with the "men will be men so deal with it women" type thing is expresed. 

Substitute people for men and then decide what level of behavior you deem acceptable for your self and expect the same from your partner. I think if more more men realized that they are as likely to have to deal with their spouses yeilding to the temptation, they will suddenly impose a more controlled code of behavior on themselves. There is nothIng like a dose of your own medicine to cure a sense of entitlement.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Tall Average Guy

Catherine602 said:


> I profess ignorance. Will someone who has actually gotten a lap dance tell exactly what is done?
> 
> I assumed I knew what it was - lap dance - woman's ass on mans lap - wiggle wiggle.
> 
> When I read that there are men who think that it is no big deal for a man on a committed relationship to partake, I began to doubt that I knew what it was. If this is not cheating and no big deal then I hope that it is equally ok for their wives to give a young stud a lap dance for fun on a GNO. Maybe that's why men have problems with GNO, they know women are so like them.
> 
> It is uncomfortable being placed in a position where one partner expresses the joy of fresh sexual experiences with an attractive member of the opitsite sex. This is usually not considered with the "men will be men so deal with it women" type thing is expresed.
> 
> Substitute people for men and then decide what level of behavior you deem acceptable for your self and expect the same from your partner. I think if more more men realized that they are as likely to have to deal with their spouses yeilding to the temptation, they will suddenly impose a more controlled code of behavior on themselves. There is nothIng like a dose of your own medicine to cure a sense of entitlement.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You have a pretty decent understanding of the lap dances I have seen. I am curious - are there any woman who really don't know that a lap dances can occur at a strip club? I see that possibility noted, but I it seems unlikely to me. My wife has never been in a strip club, but when I was invited to one for a bachelor party, her first words were "No lap dances."

I agree on the boundaries. Couples absolutely need to discuss them, particularly in a scenario like this (or the GNO), as sex is such a charged issue in a marriage. My whole issue is the idea of going nuclear (not being able to talk properly for a week) because she gave permission to go, but did not explain her boundaries.

I do like the idea of flipping it around. If the OP had given his wife permission to go out with the girls, and said nothing more, should he flip out if she dances with a guy? To me, that is certainly a possibility, so I would definitely have a discussion with my wife about what dancing, if any, was appropriate. If we did not have that discussion, and she crossed a boundary, I would be mad, but much of the anger would have been directed at myself for not making my boundary clear.


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## Catherine602

SoWhat said:


> Also, never look at any woman ever again. You may find her attractive and your wife might not approve of that.
> 
> This whole thing is insane.
> 
> Him: "I give you permission to go to the latest forgettable Romantic Comedy."
> 
> Her: " It was great. George Clooney's charact..."
> 
> Him: "I gave you permission to watch the movie, not to look at George Clooney on screen!"
> 
> Strip clubs are places where lap dances happen. Not everyone in the club will get one, but most will. If you want to stipulate out of that, you have to do it explicitly - otherwise, how in the heck is anyone supposed to know?


Ok but how would your frigile ego be effected by your wife's expression of enjoyment of real live 20 something yo men at the hieght of their masculinity? 

We are smart enough to know that if our partner knew we found other men attractive, it might effect the reliability of their plumbing. You seem much less concerned about our feelings and ignorant of the the possible role of these declarations on your own sex life. 

Smart and empathetic men are more careful not to evoke insecurity in a women they expect to have sex with. I think men who feel it neccesary to voice the "men must be men" thing do so to put women in their place and out of insecurity about their masculinity. We do have feelings. . What type of man would jeopardize his own sexual relationship!!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602

Why would you think it unlikely that a women who has never been to a strip club would assume their is anything but stripping going on? The name strip club seems descriptive enough. I have never been to one. 

Like many women, I am not consumed by the idea of seeing naked women gyrate. Why would I waste time finding out what else goes on there? Some men make the error of assumIng that women are like men. 

I am certain that knowing the difference would help improve the quality of relationships with women.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Tall Average Guy

Catherine602 said:


> Why would you think it unlikely that a women who has never been to a strip club would assume their is anything but stripping going on? The name strip club seems descriptive enough. I have never been to one.
> 
> Like many women, I am not consumed by the idea of seeing naked women gyrate. Why would I waste time finding out what else goes on there? Some men make the error of assumIng that women are like men.
> 
> I am certain that knowing the difference would help improve the quality of relationships with women.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


So do you know many woman who do not know that lap dances occur at a strip club? I honestly want to know because I personally am not aware of such a woman (though I admittedly do not ask every woman I converse with about this), and every woman here seems to know about them.

As for why you would waste time finding out what goes on there, why not if you are giving your husband permission to go. You would not ask him what will be there and what he plans to do while he was there? If not, why on earth not? I certainly would if my wife was going to go to a men's strip club, just as she did when I went to one.

I agree that some men mistakenly assume that women think like men. I suspect that some women mistakenly assume that men think like women.


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## sinnister

I think an important point to note here is that lapdance by and large are design to be "tease" shows but end up being a collosal waste of money for the guy. Some guys (like me) have a hard time giving away good money for a momentary sight of boob and a young girl who's clearly not nearly as attractive as my wife sitting on my lap while moving awkwardly to music, and me thinking the whole time how I'm going to get the smell of stripper perfume off my clothes....

No thanks.


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## SoWhat

Catherine602 said:


> Ok but how would your frigile ego be effected by your wife's expression of enjoyment of real live 20 something yo men at the hieght of their masculinity?
> 
> We are smart enough to know that if our partner knew we found other men attractive, it might effect the reliability of their plumbing. You seem much less concerned about our feelings and ignorant of the the possible role of these declarations on your own sex life.
> 
> Smart and empathetic men are more careful not to evoke insecurity in a women they expect to have sex with. I think men who feel it neccesary to voice the "men must be men" thing do so to put women in their place and out of insecurity about their masculinity. We do have feelings. . What type of man would jeopardize his own sexual relationship!!!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think the GF finds other men attractive. My plumbing is not affected by the fact that she has a pulse. I assume most men are like me; they think their women have some level of attraction to fit, handsome men. 

And that's beyond the scope of what I was saying: lap dances are part of strip clubs. If you don't want your partner getting one, say it! This is just such a "gotcha" thing that I find it totally crazy.


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## sharonND

well someone asked about a lap dance, the one my hubby had while i was next to him involved the stripper licking her nipps, rubbing her twat with her fingers, shaking her butt in his face, rubbing her breasts on his face, rubbing her vagina (no undies) on his lap, rubbing butt on lap, laying on floor opening legs and putting on a show touching herself. 

Way more than a lap dance if you ask me.


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## SoWhat

...but, for some reason, the average child has seen 8000 murders on television by the time he has finished elementary school...

At least adults don't get to see nipples. Priorities! 

(Not shooting the messenger, Angel5112. That's just so crazy to hear!)


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## Catherine602

Tall Average Guy said:


> So do you know many woman who do not know that lap dances occur at a strip club? I honestly want to know because I personally am not aware of such a woman (though I admittedly do not ask every woman I converse with about this), and every woman here seems to know about them.
> 
> As for why you would waste time finding out what goes on there, why not if you are giving your husband permission to go. You would not ask him what will be there and what he plans to do while he was there? If not, why on earth not? I certainly would if my wife was going to go to a men's strip club, just as she did when I went to one.
> 
> I agree that some men mistakenly assume that women think like men. I suspect that some women mistakenly assume that men think like women.


Ummm my husband does not ask me for premission to do anything actually. He is my husband not my child. He has been to strip clubs I am sure, I don't think he has since his brother got married a few yrs ago but I don't know.

Now I'm concerned - is it normal for wives to require their husband to get permission? I will ask Mr C if he thinks this is something i should do. That should be a good discussion. ;8}. 

. He is a fairly sensible adult though. 

I don't understand why you think that there are many women who don't know lap dances are common practice at strip clubs. What makes you think that the average women has that as a conversation topic? 

I have never had a convo with any woman I have ever spoken to about strip clubs. It is just not on my radar or that of women I know. It seems so low brow and useless. 

There are so many substantive and stimulating things going on in the world, are strip clubs so important that people discuss what goes on in them? 

They seem kind of sad sleazy places. I feel sorry for the women who work there and more sorry for the men who go there. 

Now I think about it, how can you drink anything in a place with so much STD laden mucosa swinging around? How can you let a woman touch you who probably has had encounters with maybe 30 men before you? 

Do you go home and kiss your wife and kids after or do you sanitize yourself? It may be no big deal to you but it is potentially a big deal to anyone you have contact with. Sex makes some people stupid and careless. 

If they confined there carelessness to endangering themselves it would be no problem. That is seldom the case, there is not enough compassion or empathy for their partners when sex is involved. 

Dubbizle - I edited after your post. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## dubbizle

FrankKissel-

Every thing the poster above said.


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## Tall Average Guy

Catherine602 said:


> Ummm my husband does not ask me for premission to do anything actually. He is my husband not my child. He has been to strip clubs I am sure, I don't think he has since his brother got married a few yrs ago but I don't know.
> 
> Now I'm concerned - is it normal for wives to require their husband to get permission? I will ask Mr C if he thinks this is something i should do. That should be a good discussion. ;8}.
> 
> . He is a fairly sensible adult though.
> 
> I don't understand why you think that there are many women who don't know lap dances are common practice at strip clubs. What makes you think that the average women has that as a conversation topic?
> 
> I have never had a convo with any woman I have ever spoken to about strip clubs. It is just not on my radar or that of women I know. It seems so low brow and useless.
> 
> There are so many substantive and stimulating things going on in the world, are strip clubs so important that people discuss what goes on in them?
> 
> They seem kind of sad sleazy places. I feel sorry for the women who work there and more sorry for the men who go there.
> 
> Now I think about it, how can you drink anything in a place with so much STD laden mucosa swinging around? How can you let a woman touch you who probably has had encounters with maybe 30 men before you?
> 
> Do you go home and kiss your wife and kids after or do you sanitize yourself? It may be no big deal to you but it is potentially a big deal to anyone you have contact with. Sex makes some people stupid and careless.
> 
> If they confined there carelessness to endangering themselves it would be no problem. That is seldom the case, there is not enough compassion or empathy for their partners when sex is involved.
> 
> Dubbizle - I edited after your post.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I thought we were having a serious conversation about reasonable boundaries and expectations, setting them and how we react when things go sideways. I guess I was wrong.


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## ScaredandUnsure

You can get HPV and HSV from skin to skin contact.


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## nice777guy

sharonND said:


> well someone asked about a lap dance, the one my hubby had while i was next to him involved the stripper licking her nipps, rubbing her twat with her fingers, shaking her butt in his face, rubbing her breasts on his face, rubbing her vagina (no undies) on his lap, rubbing butt on lap, laying on floor opening legs and putting on a show touching herself.
> 
> Way more than a lap dance if you ask me.


In my very limited experience - not all lap dances are the same.

Never seen anything quite like the poster is describing above.

I've had one in a 'higher end' club where the girl never laid a hand on me. She basically danced directly in front of me like she did on the stage. I think this establishment called it a "chair" or "table" dance.


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## mikeydread1982

Apparently many women here have never watched a show that had a strip club scene. Anyway, the judgmental tone towards men that go to strip clubs to have a few drinks with their friends is awesome. I go on a few occasions, when buddies are leaving for a deployment or going to a different base, we have a last hoorah. Like, why go to bars and see girls with their clothes on thinking they're hot stuff, even though you're not there for that, but just their behavior is obnoxious. at a strip club, you are more catered to by the staff, and it's a masculine environment. Not all the sleazy stuff described(by people who have never been mind you). It's a place where regular women don't frequent, the guys can talk, see something that you probably don't at home. Have you seen some of the tricks these girls do on the pole, it's like art. Besides, I can liken it to women going to a spa getting massaged by some young guy. Can't your husband do that for you? Anyway, not everyone goes to strip clubs for sex, it's one more place to get away from wives like some of the ones here. Oh, and for the men that ask for "permission" to go anywhere or do anything, grow a pair. You tell you're woman you're going somewhere out of reapect, but permission? It's sickening just saying the word.


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## ScaredandUnsure

Angel5112 said:


> "HPV is spread by skin-to-skin contact — usually during vaginal, anal, or oral sex play." <-- This is a direct quote from planned parenthoods website.
> 
> I somehow doubt you are going to get HPV from the girl rubbing on your jeans and most strip clubs won't allow you to touch the girl with your hands while she is giving you the dance. Of course there are exceptions to that rule.
> 
> HSV-1 is "typically spread simply by the kind of social kiss that a relative gives a child, because children have no prior infection with any HSV type, they have no immune defense against the virus.", but about 50% of the population have HSV-1 antibodies by the time they are teenagers or adults, and by the time they are over the age of 50 that percentage jumps to 80%-90%.
> 
> So while I am sure that everyone is real worried about getting a cold sore from going to the strip club and possible drinking out the same glass as a horribly infected disgusting stripper , the odds are that if you don't already have HSV-1 and are old enough to attend a strip club then you aren't going to get it.
> 
> HSV-2 on the other had is only contracted by sexual skin to skin contact. Generally by mouth to genitalia, or genitalia to genitalia. So again, I highly doubt you are going to contract HSV-2 from the girl rubbing on your jeans.


I don't think strippers are horrible, I was one many years ago. I was just making a statement that there are skin to skin std's out there. If a man has HPV and uses a condom, it doesn't stop it from spreading to the exposed skin. I've seen my share of exposed penises in the strip clubs, more often than not. And I worked in a higher end "Gentleman's Club" I wasn't saying anything about rubbing on jeans.


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## Catherine602

Angel5112 said:


> Wow. That is REALLY offensive. You are making a judgment based off of a person’s occupation. Do you walk into McDonald's and say "gee, you must be a retard because you work a minimum wage job that consists of asking, would you like fries with that"?
> 
> My sister had her son when she was 17 and got a job as a stripper not to soon after. I can assure you she had no STD's and hasn't even had as many sex partners as I myself have had.
> 
> You know what? At least they have a job and work for their own money. I sincerely apologize that not everyone can be as "highbrow" as you seem to be.
> 
> Also, even though I'm sure you are aware of this, you can't actually contract an STD (other than crabs) from touching. It must be through an exchange of bodily fluids. Just to clarify, so you don't get confused, I don't mean saliva.


Maybe you find the fact that I pointed it out offensive? Pardon my confusion, I didn't realize that strip joints had taken on a status of a typical American eatery of which no evil should be spoken. BTW, are there any drive up strip joint and mini lap dances?

I regularly insult kids working at McD's. I thought I was giving them an incentive to keep working their way through college. 

Maybe you are showing your biases - most of the kids I talk to who are working at fast food places and waiting tables are putting themselves though school. 

You should talk to them and not assume that a humble position means anything about the person. Actually, most of these folks could look down on the cliental, if they were so inclined. 

I can understand your sensitivity to any negative statements about strip joints since you had a family member who worked there. But come on - find something more lofty to get worked up about. 

A place that makes millions for a disgusting sleazy few who manipulate men into parting with their hard earned cash and women to debase themselves is hardly worth defending.


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## Therealbrighteyes

mikeydread1982 said:


> Apparently many women here have never watched a show that had a strip club scene. Anyway, the judgmental tone towards men that go to strip clubs to have a few drinks with their friends is awesome. I go on a few occasions, when buddies are leaving for a deployment or going to a different base, we have a last hoorah. Like, why go to bars and see girls with their clothes on thinking they're hot stuff, even though you're not there for that, but just their behavior is obnoxious. at a strip club, you are more catered to by the staff, and it's a masculine environment. Not all the sleazy stuff described(by people who have never been mind you). It's a place where regular women don't frequent, the guys can talk, see something that you probably don't at home. Have you seen some of the tricks these girls do on the pole, it's like art. Besides, I can liken it to women going to a spa getting massaged by some young guy. Can't your husband do that for you? Anyway, not everyone goes to strip clubs for sex, it's one more place to get away from wives like some of the ones here. Oh, and for the men that ask for "permission" to go anywhere or do anything, grow a pair. You tell you're woman you're going somewhere out of reapect, but permission? It's sickening just saying the word.


As long as your wife can go out with her buddies for drinks and grinding on dudes at a club. She's just getting away from you afterall.


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## Catherine602

mikeydread1982 said:


> Apparently many women here have never watched a show that had a strip club scene. Anyway, the judgmental tone towards men that go to strip clubs to have a few drinks with their friends is awesome.
> It's a place where regular women don't frequent, the guys can talk, see something that you probably don't at home. Have you seen some of the tricks these girls do on the pole, it's like art.


:rofl: :rofl:
Go to the gym and lift weights with your buddies, bring some bottled water.

I dont see any judgment, I think there is a lot of defensiveness and shame on the part of men. 

It seems that some men think women are trying to take their strip joints, porn and right to masturbation away. I don't understand theses things but I accept them as normal. 

I think I detect a hint of - "if my wife would only leave me alone and entertain me with tricks and lap dances, I wouldn't need to go to strip joints". That to me is a way of offloading shame. 

If you like theses things, then do them like a man, no excuses. It is what it is. Don't try to make women responsible for your need to run from them, grab a $20 bottle of beer and watch a naked woman perform like a trained seal.


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## sharonND

mikeydread1982 said:


> Apparently many women here have never watched a show that had a strip club scene. Anyway, the judgmental tone towards men that go to strip clubs to have a few drinks with their friends is awesome. I go on a few occasions, when buddies are leaving for a deployment or going to a different base, we have a last hoorah. Like, why go to bars and see girls with their clothes on thinking they're hot stuff, even though you're not there for that, but just their behavior is obnoxious. at a strip club, you are more catered to by the staff, and it's a masculine environment. Not all the sleazy stuff described(by people who have never been mind you). It's a place where regular women don't frequent, the guys can talk, see something that you probably don't at home. Have you seen some of the tricks these girls do on the pole, it's like art. Besides, I can liken it to women going to a spa getting massaged by some young guy. Can't your husband do that for you? Anyway, not everyone goes to strip clubs for sex, it's one more place to get away from wives like some of the ones here. Oh, and for the men that ask for "permission" to go anywhere or do anything, grow a pair. You tell you're woman you're going somewhere out of reapect, but permission? It's sickening just saying the word.


Milkydread, I have never been massaged by a guy and I dont see how that relates to men going to strip clubs. I have been to strip clubs with my man and I know how sleazy they can be. I have been to upscale "no touching" clubs and free for all where anything goes. If a married man needs to constantly go to a highly sexualized place without his wife, there is something wrong, something he is missing. And, my husband doesnt "tell me" hes going anywhere. What kind of relationship do you have where you tell someone what you're going to do? I would run circles around you buddy. In a relationship there has to be mutual understanding and each person should avoid activities that would undermine the relationship (like strip clubs alone)


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## ScaredandUnsure

mikeydread1982 said:


> Apparently many women here have never watched a show that had a strip club scene. Anyway, the judgmental tone towards men that go to strip clubs to have a few drinks with their friends is awesome. I go on a few occasions, when buddies are leaving for a deployment or going to a different base, we have a last hoorah. Like, why go to bars and see girls with their clothes on thinking they're hot stuff, even though you're not there for that, but just their behavior is obnoxious. at a strip club, you are more catered to by the staff, and it's a masculine environment. Not all the sleazy stuff described(by people who have never been mind you). It's a place where regular women don't frequent, the guys can talk, see something that you probably don't at home. Have you seen some of the tricks these girls do on the pole, it's like art. Besides, I can liken it to women going to a spa getting massaged by some young guy. Can't your husband do that for you? Anyway, not everyone goes to strip clubs for sex, it's one more place to get away from wives like some of the ones here. Oh, and for the men that ask for "permission" to go anywhere or do anything, grow a pair. You tell you're woman you're going somewhere out of reapect, but permission? It's sickening just saying the word.


So if your wife TOLD you she was going to be a stripper, what would you say? Since it's just all harmless fun, and nothing bad ever happens, plus she can grind her naked butt all over other men. To get away from you, you know?


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## Hope1964

I think I'll go home and tell my hubby that I am going to go out tonight with my buddies to drink expensive booze at a gentlewomans club that caters to horny women. I am going to pay a male stripper to gyrate his crotch all over me, show me his penis and maybe let me touch it, and rub himself sexily all over my body while I may or may not sit on my hands. There's no way he can say anything to me, since it's all going to be just a business transaction anyway.


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## nice777guy

Hope1964 said:


> I think I'll go home and tell my hubby that I am going to go out tonight with my buddies to drink expensive booze at a gentlewomans club that caters to horny women. I am going to pay a male stripper to gyrate his crotch all over me, show me his penis and maybe let me touch it, and rub himself sexily all over my body while I may or may not sit on my hands. There's no way he can say anything to me, since it's all going to be just a business transaction anyway.


Have you had a tetanus shot recently?


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## that_girl

"Now THAT's how to get pinkeye."

From Knocked Up while a friend was getting a lapdance and the chick had her butt on his nose.

Yea. Nassssty.


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## that_girl

Hope1964 said:


> I think I'll go home and tell my hubby that I am going to go out tonight with my buddies to drink expensive booze at a gentlewomans club that caters to horny women. I am going to pay a male stripper to gyrate his crotch all over me, show me his penis and maybe let me touch it, and rub himself sexily all over my body while I may or may not sit on my hands. There's no way he can say anything to me, since it's all going to be just a business transaction anyway.


Male strippers make me laugh.

I find nothing sexy about a man in a small undie gyrating and dancing to music.

lolll gross.


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## NatashaYurino

mikeydread1982 said:


> Apparently many women here have never watched a show that had a strip club scene. Anyway, the judgmental tone towards men that go to strip clubs to have a few drinks with their friends is awesome. I go on a few occasions, when buddies are leaving for a deployment or going to a different base, we have a last hoorah. Like, why go to bars and see girls with their clothes on thinking they're hot stuff, even though you're not there for that, but just their behavior is obnoxious. at a strip club, you are more catered to by the staff, and it's a masculine environment. Not all the sleazy stuff described(by people who have never been mind you). It's a place where regular women don't frequent, the guys can talk, see something that you probably don't at home. Have you seen some of the tricks these girls do on the pole, it's like art. Besides, I can liken it to women going to a spa getting massaged by some young guy. Can't your husband do that for you? Anyway, not everyone goes to strip clubs for sex, it's one more place to get away from wives like some of the ones here. Oh, and for the men that ask for "permission" to go anywhere or do anything, grow a pair. You tell you're woman you're going somewhere out of reapect, but permission? It's sickening just saying the word.


I get what you are trying to say here. But have you ever stopped to think about the fact that MANY men also believe their wives/SOs need their PERMISSION to do certain things? 

For instance, you mentioned getting massages from a young man. My bf hates the idea of me getting a full body massage by a man and I hate the idea of him going to strip clubs. But did we believe the other needed our PERMISSON to do any of those things? NO.

We did however talked about it. And we both freely came to the agreedment that I should not be getting massages from a man and that he should not be going to strip clubs. We respect how the other feels about these activities.

I just want say that a lot of men also believe their women need their permissions, yet when the tables turn they get mad and act as if his girl is trying to boss him around. That's not fair!


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## mikeydread1982

Therealbrighteyes said:


> As long as your wife can go out with her buddies for drinks and grinding on dudes at a club. She's just getting away from you afterall.


She's an adult and can do as she pleases. I'm not controlling. Its up to her whether she wishes to push those boundaries.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mikeydread1982

Catherine602 said:


> :rofl: :rofl:
> Go to the gym and lift weights with your buddies, bring some bottled water.
> 
> I dont see any judgment, I think there is a lot of defensiveness and shame on the part of men.
> 
> It seems that some men think women are trying to take their strip joints, porn and right to masturbation away. I don't understand theses things but I accept them as normal.
> 
> I think I detect a hint of - "if my wife would only leave me alone and entertain me with tricks and lap dances, I wouldn't need to go to strip joints". That to me is a way of offloading shame.
> 
> If you like theses things, then do them like a man, no excuses. It is what it is. Don't try to make women responsible for your need to run from them, grab a $20 bottle of beer and watch a naked woman perform like a trained seal.


Obviously misinformed. $20, not even close. There is no shame in it either, its people like you that may make a lesser man feel shame. Trained seals, gosh, God forbid a woman close to you has to resort to that line of work. And being as judgmental as you are, I can only imagine how uptight you are in the bedroom so your man probably does these things you loathe. You don't understand masturbation? I rest my case.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mikeydread1982

sharonND said:


> Milkydread, I have never been massaged by a guy and I dont see how that relates to men going to strip clubs. I have been to strip clubs with my man and I know how sleazy they can be. I have been to upscale "no touching" clubs and free for all where anything goes. If a married man needs to constantly go to a highly sexualized place without his wife, there is something wrong, something he is missing. And, my husband doesnt "tell me" hes going anywhere. What kind of relationship do you have where you tell someone what you're going to do? I would run circles around you buddy. In a relationship there has to be mutual understanding and each person should avoid activities that would undermine the relationship (like strip clubs alone)


Well, anything done in excess is a problem. I don't do sleazy clubs or get dances, for.my own reasons. As for your husband asking permission, give that man his balls back. You're telling immediately if he says, "hey, I'm making a run down the street, I'll be back" you'll be all in his a s s, right? Someone has insecurities they need to sort out. You couldn't keep up to run cirlcles, I'm an adult and you don't control my movement. Not everything requires a huge discussion, if it doesn't affect anything, I don't need to explain myself. I already showed you respect by letting you know I'm stepping out, you want an itinerary as well? Get over yourself. Lol
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mikeydread1982

ScaredandUnsure said:


> So if your wife TOLD you she was going to be a stripper, what would you say? Since it's just all harmless fun, and nothing bad ever happens, plus she can grind her naked butt all over other men. To get away from you, you know?


She can go be a stripper, she just couldn't come back to where we live. And who says nothing bad ever happens? You're just as likely to have something bad happen to you at home as you do at a strip club. I really wonder what people think goes on there. Lol. Wall to wall orgies and coke and debauchery? Settle down people. Educate yourselves, just go once, solely to understand it. As we all know, people fear what they don't understand.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mikeydread1982

NatashaYurino said:


> I get what you are trying to say here. But have you ever stopped to think about the fact that MANY men also believe their wives/SOs need their PERMISSION to do certain things?
> 
> For instance, you mentioned getting massages from a young man. My bf hates the idea of me getting a full body massage by a man and I hate the idea of him going to strip clubs. But did we believe the other needed our PERMISSON to do any of those things? NO.
> 
> We did however talked about it. And we both freely came to the agreedment that I should not be getting massages from a man and that he should not be going to strip clubs. We respect how the other feels about these activities.
> 
> I just want say that a lot of men also believe their women need their permissions, yet when the tables turn they get mad and act as if his girl is trying to boss him around. That's not fair!


I agree, good for the goose, good for the gander, I can respect that. I would never force anyone I'm with against their will. Any man that tries to tell his woman what to do and can't take it is weak and cowardly, and vice versa. If my wife says, "hey, going to the salon", or "going to run errands be right back". Who am I to say "did I give you permission to?" Like another poster alluded to doing.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602

mikeydread1982 said:


> Obviously misinformed. $20, not even close. There is no shame in it either, its people like you that may make a lesser man feel shame. Trained seals, gosh, God forbid a woman close to you has to resort to that line of work. And being as judgmental as you are, I can only imagine how uptight you are in the bedroom so your man probably does these things you loathe. You don't understand masturbation? I rest my case.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Don't rest your case quite yet councilor, you may not know what you are talking about. It's probably not the first time you have heard that and it might be true. 

You seem to have a zeal to do as you please and to hell with what women think. That is a common stance. Why do you think any discussion by women is an attempt to control. Why do you assume that any opposition by women is an attack?

I don't know your story but I have a feeling that your attitude is a problem in your relationship. 

My husband is a dominant, self-driven man. I can't control him, he just not that kind of man. However, if he does things that trigger feelings of insecurity in me and it is within reason, he changes. 

I respect him as man all the more. Apparently, he is secure enough in his masculinity to make changes that help me feel more secure. I thought that's what men do.


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## ScaredandUnsure

mikeydread1982 said:


> She can go be a stripper, she just couldn't come back to where we live. And who says nothing bad ever happens? You're just as likely to have something bad happen to you at home as you do at a strip club. I really wonder what people think goes on there. Lol. Wall to wall orgies and coke and debauchery? Settle down people. Educate yourselves, just go once, solely to understand it. As we all know, people fear what they don't understand.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think you missed the part where I said I worked in one, as a stripper many years ago. And don't tell me bad things didn't happen. Every girl there had 5-10 horror stories of exposed penises, groping hands, one girl smashed a guys head into a mirror because he couldn't keep his fingers out of her anus. I was propositioned, asked to do private parties, etc. The girls fought with knives in our dressing room. A few girls OD'd. Not to mention the several rapes and many more cases of sexual harassment. And I worked in a higher end club, one of the betters in the area. And another few girls ended up pregnant between the rapes and the prostitution. Just because it doesn't happen to you, doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Since I've stopped working there, I don't get harassed and the odds of me being raped are a LOT lower.


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## Mrs. T

that_girl said:


> Male strippers make me laugh.
> 
> I find nothing sexy about a man in a small undie gyrating and dancing to music.
> 
> lolll gross.


 :iagree: YUK!


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