# Torn



## Doug951 (11 d ago)

Looking for confirmation of my feelings.
I’ve been married for almost 30 years. Kids are grown and out of the house. I’ve loved my wife immensely over the years but for at least the last 5 years or so I’ve slowly lost that intense love. I’ve always had issues with her anger. I can still recall when my kids were toddlers saying to myself that when they turn 18 I’m leaving her but I just dealt with her attitude over the years. My father has said to me he doesn’t like the way my wife talks to me. In arguments she is visibly angry and must ALWAYS have the last word to the point now I don’t even bother arguing my point of view. Her tone is one of belittling me, nothing is ever done right, my daughter recently confessed to me that she knows her brother is her mother’s favorite (which hurts my heart) as she talks to our daughter in the same way she talks to me, a tone of superiority.
Sex is almost non-existent. I’ve stopped initiating sex because the constant rejection hurts. I’ve spoken to her about this but it hasn’t changed.
She’s controlling and makes me feel like I need to always consider her in the things I do but she’s free to do as she wants. It feels like we are more friends and roommates than married. 
I could go on but I don’t want to make this thread too long. I’m ready to move on in life but fear I would miss her, be lonely and regret leaving.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

Life offers us no guarantees. I assume you have friends and family. I also assume you have interests and hobbies you could develop and pursue.

Bottom line: Remain with your wife and suck it up or leave. Your life. Your choice. Seriously.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

So I would suggest CHANGING how you deal with her. When she goes off on you, try this "**** you -- shut the **** up. I don't want to hear your ****". STOP worrying about her with the things YOU want to do.
If she wants to argue, just tell her go argue with someone who cares, because I don't anymore.
Just walk away, walk out of the house, go do something YOU want to do. Ignore her calls.

You have trained her to treat you that way and allowed her to get away with this for too long.


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

jlg07 said:


> When she goes off on you, try this "** you -- shut the ** up. I don't want to hear your ****".


I reported you.

You just told this man to verbally abuse his wife.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

minimalME said:


> I reported you.
> 
> You just told this man to verbally abuse his wife.


I told him to RESPOND to her because SHE is verbally abusing him -- did you read his post?
It is time HE fights back in my opinion and it is well overdue. I didn't tell him to start calling her names, belittling her, or anything of the sort WHICH SHE IS DOING.

Your solution is to just sit there and continue to take it? She is killing his love for her each time she does it.
Responding like that will give her pause to stop and think about what SHE is doing.

Sorry you feel that it is abuse -- it is not. Fighting back in an argument isn't abuse.


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

jlg07 said:


> I told him to RESPOND to her because SHE is verbally abusing him -- did you read his post?
> It is time HE fights back in my opinion and it is well overdue.
> Your solution is to just sit there and continue to take it? She is killing his love for her each time she does it.
> Responding like that will give her pause to stop and think about what SHE is doing.
> ...


No - it’s not me _feeling_ it’s abusive. It’s objectively abusive.

If you genuinely believe that telling someone to cuss out their spouse is appropriate and helpful advice, then you should take a break.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

minimalME said:


> No - it’s not me _feeling_ it’s abusive. It’s objectively abusive.
> 
> If you genuinely believe that telling someone to cuss out their spouse is appropriate and helpful advice, then you should take a break.


Sorry you were triggered -- I guess you never had a fight with an SO? You never cursed them out? If so, you are lucky.
MOST folks I know DO argue like that.

It is in no way OBJECTIVELY abusive. It is not belittling, it is not calling names, etc..

What SHE is doing is abuse -- and abuse to not only her spouse but her own daughter.
We will just have to disagree on this one MM.


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## karmagoround (Aug 27, 2021)

jlg07 said:


> So I would suggest CHANGING how you deal with her. When she goes off on you, try this "*** you -- shut the *** up. I don't want to hear your ****". STOP worrying about her with the things YOU want to do.
> If she wants to argue, just tell her go argue with someone who cares, because I don't anymore.
> Just walk away, walk out of the house, go do something YOU want to do. Ignore her calls.
> 
> You have trained her to treat you that way and allowed her to get away with this for too long.


My advise if to follow through with your plan was quickly as possible. Don't put it off or you may never get around to it. Life is great away from toxic people. 
But like jig suggests, if you want to try and get her to change, be consistent with, "you can't talk to me like that." Every time. Then when she doesn't change, make that lawyer appointment and see how much it will hurt you to file. Make her know that you are serious about leaving. It's really the only way to find out off she will change for you.


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## karmagoround (Aug 27, 2021)

minimalME said:


> I reported you.
> 
> You just told this man to verbally abuse his wife.


I'm pretty sure the OP tried the more mild versions... More than once. 
Sometime a person needs to be told to shut the f up, because there is no other solution.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Doug951 said:


> Looking for confirmation of my feelings.
> I’ve been married for almost 30 years. Kids are grown and out of the house. I’ve loved my wife immensely over the years but for at least the last 5 years or so I’ve slowly lost that intense love. I’ve always had issues with her anger. I can still recall when my kids were toddlers saying to myself that when they turn 18 I’m leaving her but I just dealt with her attitude over the years. My father has said to me he doesn’t like the way my wife talks to me. In arguments she is visibly angry and must ALWAYS have the last word to the point now I don’t even bother arguing my point of view. Her tone is one of belittling me, nothing is ever done right, my daughter recently confessed to me that she knows her brother is her mother’s favorite (which hurts my heart) as she talks to our daughter in the same way she talks to me, a tone of superiority.
> Sex is almost non-existent. I’ve stopped initiating sex because the constant rejection hurts. I’ve spoken to her about this but it hasn’t changed.
> She’s controlling and makes me feel like I need to always consider her in the things I do but she’s free to do as she wants. It feels like we are more friends and roommates than married.
> I could go on but I don’t want to make this thread too long. I’m ready to move on in life but fear I would miss her, be lonely and regret leaving.


OP have you tried marriage counseling?

Your situation seems untenable but 30 years is a long time and there’s no abuse or infidelity. Is it really not ‘fixable’?

Bottom line is that I agree with @Prodigal, you are in a bad spot and the choices are few. You are now forced to choose. Remain with her and try to fix things, or end your misery.

Have you brought up your unhappiness and the idea of separation to her? How did she respond?


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Swearing and shouting at your wife would in all probability only make things worse. Ignore her, instead.

Google the grey rock method.


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## lmucamac (4 mo ago)

I’m guessing you e tried calmly talking to her about these issues. But it hasn’t worked

IMO you deserve to be happy, and you’re not happy in this relationship. So the choice is yours…
stay and be miserable 
stay and try to fix things, maybe marrraige counseling 
try a separation 
move on

Of course if you move on, you will miss her. You will be lonely. It’s not easy to start over, but in time you’ll discover what makes you happy, what your intests are, and you’ll make a differ life for yourself.


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## Diceplayer (Oct 12, 2019)

Doug951 said:


> I’m ready to move on in life but fear I would miss her, be lonely and regret leaving.


Yeah, I once had a bad tooth pulled. It left a hole but the pain was gone. Nobody gets everything that they want. So ask yourself this, between now and dead, is this the life that you want to live your life? Nobody here can make this decision for you. But do know this, she is not going to change. She will be this way until the day you die. So either suck it up and continue to live this way for the rest of your life without complaining about it, or leave. It's that simple.


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## ShatteredKat (Mar 23, 2016)

Doug951

Your wife has a few, or at least one, serious personality issue(s.)

Anger is generally a secondary emotion/reaction to some perceived deed, threat, or attitude.
Maybe other triggers?

For you to put up with it for 30 years - _methinks you have an issue also_.

Playing favorites with children? Piss-poor parenting. Playing favorites is a CHOICE.
Your daughter is permanently affected in her relation to "mom" who favors her brother.
Such a situation can also affect her relationship to her brother - maybe resentment also.

All the happy couples I have ever known, they have very few arguments. Differences are
bargained into an agreement.

30 years of a argumentative relation? Your relationship is seriously broken.

Are you staying in the marriage out of fear of moving on? Financial situation? Family or religious pressures? "Out of habit?" My first suggestion is to think over your own actions in your marriage. Get to a counselor of some sort (NOT marriage) and try and figure out why you have stayed in a 30 year marriage, brought forth into the world two children who have been raised in a toxic relationship marriage, and you have (or your post does not mention) essentially done nothing positive to resolve your relationship. 30 years is way to long to have lived the life you have pictured to us here.

I would get a copy of "No More Mr. Nice Guy" and read.
Investigate yourself. Are you physically out of decent shape? Mentally lazy? Sloppy with personal hygiene or appearance? Messy around the house? Don't do fair share of chores?

And an "ugh" - did you two marry but not really in love with each other? 

Family of origin issues? "FOO" - you or wife or both raised in similarly toxic family?

Have you perceived or thought about what friends and family think of your marriage?

Another suggestion, get yourself a small voice recorder and record your conversations with wife (and do not tell her you are so doing) and then later play back and listen to how you speak and the words you choose and how you respond to her words and statements.

Accusations? Do you two have an ongoing antagonistic bunch of items you bring up when speaking? 

and I've lectured a bit long - so leave this for last - Is it possible she or YOU have a mental health issue?

Seems to me you are the one that will have to initiate change for a better life.


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## Bulfrog1987 (Oct 8, 2021)

MattMatt said:


> Swearing and shouting at your wife would in all probability only make things worse. Ignore her, instead.
> 
> Google the grey rock method.


I grey rocked my husband last fall. Simply waiting for a turn around. I stopped responding to anything he did or said. Until behavior was address, I did not faulter. It did not work out for me, but I have a total different set of circumstances, that we’re not in my control at all. 

That doesn’t mean it couldn’t for you. But set that boundary and don’t back down.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

This is your wife's personality.

It's not gonna change.

You don't have a good relationship and it sounds like you haven't for decades. 

I'd leave. This is no way to live.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

karmagoround said:


> I'm pretty sure the OP tried the more mild versions... More than once.
> Sometime a person needs to be told to shut the f up, because there is no other solution.


The idea is to SHOCK her -- since he obviously never spoke to her like that -- so that SHE stops and thinks about what she is doing.


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## Doug951 (11 d ago)

Thank you all for your input. I have researched her personality traits and have come to the conclusion she is insecure. She’s a people pleaser and if anything negative is said about her or if she perceives someone has an issue with her she becomes very defensive, not with them but later when she vents to me. She’s the nicest person around others but with me and our daughter she’s different, she always tries to impress others with talk about herself. She’ll even repeat herself in a conversation if, in my opinion, she doesn’t get the response she was looking for, probably praise.
In response to some points and questions, we have been to counseling over the years, I have calmly talked with her and expressed my issues (only to have it deflected), but things get better for a short period. I have raised my voice and slammed plastic bowls together in the drawer when she had a problem with how I put them away. To give an example of how critical she is of me, she once had an issue with the way I hung her hand towel because the tag was in the front and not the back and that I hung my towel with the tag in the back.
I may not be perfect but I know most women would love a man like me. I’m in great shape, I’m not a slob, I do my share of cleaning, I wash my own clothes and dishes, I have great income, it’s come to the point where I ask nothing of my wife because I’m tired of hearing how she does everything.
It’s hard to make the decision to move on because when she behaves “normally” things are good but I know it’s temporary. We have had great times and a great sex life over the years but it has always come between fights and hurt feelings.


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