# Husband wants to visit my in-laws without me



## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

Hello. Without going into too much detail, my relationship with my in-laws is strained. It's been this way for a few years. My husband and I reconciled after a brief separation around the first of the year. My parents have welcomed my husband back into their lives. They are of the opinion that's it my life and my husband and children are part of it. My husband's parents and sister, on the other hand, are not as understanding. My husband has gotten in the habit of bringing our children to see his parents, sister and cousins without me. After coming back together, we had been on the road to reconciliation, we even met at a local park. This all changed about 2 months ago. My husbands mother who worked at a bank for 20 years was terminated due to a breach of security. Apparently, she put stop payments on my husbands bank account while he and I were separated. My husband left our home and felt he shouldn't have to pay the marital home expenses since he was living with his family. His mother went into his account and made sure the marital home expenses were not paid. As a result of his mother's actions, she and another employee were fired for breaking the bank's code of ethics. 

I feel I'm being blamed for her actions. My husband just would like to continue on without me seeing his family. He wants our children to see them, but without me. The other night I finally put my foot down after he informed me he'd be bringing the children again to his parents house, while I would stay home. I told him that moving forward, we'd all have to be welcome. After all, we are a family. My children are now asking me why I never see their grandparents. We are in marital therapy and the therapist is urging my husband to discuss reconciliation with his parents. It seems my husband just wants to continue with the current setup indefinitely. His parents have such a strong influence over him. I don't want to make him choose, but I feel we're heading in that direction unless something changes.

Should I make him choose? 

Thanks.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

sarahkj2009 said:


> Should I make him choose?


Yup.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

I say yes too. He either supports you and the family, or he doesn't. His choice. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ReidWright (May 15, 2014)

this can't go on forever, but two months might not be long enough for the MIL to cool her jets over the bank situation (which clearly wasn't your fault anyways).

can you do a toe-in-the-water approach? have him take the kids for most of the visit, then you show up for the last hour or for a meal or activity? or are they too far away?

that way you could get some time with the whole family, but the chance for a conflict is minimized. it would also demonstrate that you aren't going to be banished permanently.

good luck, it's a toughy


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

sarahkj2009 said:


> I feel I'm being blamed for her actions.


Ummm.... NO! You had NOTHING to do with your MIL's poor decision to commit *bank fraud.* That's ALL on her.

And h*ll to the yes, you should make him choose! He is choosing his family of origin over YOU. Dead wrong in a marriage.


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## cons (Aug 13, 2013)

Yuck! I 'm so sorry you are in this situation.

If you and your husband are reconciling then your decisions and actions for both of you should reflect this. Your husband and you need to stand united as a couple. He's taking care of his family's feelings above yours....this can be very damaging to a marriage.

He needs to choose you.


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## murphy5 (May 1, 2014)

in this separation, were you messing around with another man? if so, all bets are off, you are in apologetic do anything he wants mode.

If HE screwed around, then he has no moral high ground and needs to grovel to your every wish.

If you two are blameless in the separation, and just trying to get back together, point out to him that he is not really trying all that hard if he is leaving you behind.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

I agree with everyone else - if you're truly reconciling, he needs to be all-in, 100%. He's not all-in if he allows his family to ostracize you. 

His family will take their cues from him. If he insists they welcome you, and he and the kids won't be visiting them if they don't, his family will have to make an effort to be civil and get over themselves.


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## GA HEART (Oct 18, 2011)

Ditto to everyone.


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

murphy5 said:


> in this separation, were you messing around with another man? if so, all bets are off, you are in apologetic do anything he wants mode.
> 
> If HE screwed around, then he has no moral high ground and needs to grovel to your every wish.
> 
> If you two are blameless in the separation, and just trying to get back together, point out to him that he is not really trying all that hard if he is leaving you behind.


Absolutely no messing around for either of us. I was unhappy and depressed. I was drinking while he was at work. Happy to report Ill be celebrating 1 year in August. Our marriage is stronger than it's ever been, except his need to put the feelings of his family over line. This has been our number 1 issue since day 1. Our marriage therapist is really helpful. My husband has come a long way, but his family is still very much a force in his life.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

happy as a clam said:


> Ummm.... NO! You had NOTHING to do with your MIL's poor decision to commit *bank fraud.* That's ALL on her.
> 
> And h*ll to the yes, you should make him choose! He is choosing his family of origin over YOU. Dead wrong in a marriage.


Yes. But I can't help feeling if we had not separated, she wouldn't have had to do what she did. She injected herself into her son's marriage to the point where she couldn't stay professional even at work. It's just so incredibly ugly now. They have to sell their home because of the termination. It's not my fault, but it kind of is.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

It's not your fault at all. Your husband had all kinds of options to protect himself without her meddling if he wanted to. Her decision was entirely hers. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

I don't care about any of them. I just want to stop looking like a wussy who stays home while he visits. My new mantra: it's either all of us or none of us. They are the type of people who hold serious grudges, obviously. My convo with my husband always resolves around the same question which is why are they torn up over OUR issues? I mean they are not married to us, we are married to each other. If we're good, then they should be good. I have had to deal with their passive aggressiveness since day 1. Anyway, thank you for your input.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

sarahkj2009 said:


> Yes. But I can't help feeling if we had not separated, she wouldn't have had to do what she did. She injected herself into her son's marriage to the point where she couldn't stay professional even at work. It's just so incredibly ugly now. They have to sell their home because of the termination. It's not my fault, but it kind of is.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


She didn't have to do what she did. SHE made a choice to stick her nose into business where it didn't belong. It goes beyond nosey and interfereing to her deciding what is right/wrong legally in a separation and making a unilateral ILLEGAL decision. 

HER ACTIONS were her failing. NOT YOURS. You contributed to the marital issues and seems you have taken responsibility and have worked on that with your husband. 

HER ACTIONS resulted in HER termination and now in losing the house. First off, a mortgage shouldn't be such a large percentage of their income that losing her job should cause foreclosure - if they are old enough to be grandparents they should have enough liquid savings to cover all living expenses for 6 months. It's the financial golden rule. And she was in banking! She should KNOW this! Their failure to properly plan for a job loss is THEIR failure. She could have had a health issue and not been able to work and the result would still be the same.

I wonder if he is a bit too close and tells them a bit too much. Perhaps you should ask him exactly what he has told them. If he discussed the marital issues, your drinking, etc. he shouldn't have. That should stay between you two and your MC. A man and a woman leave home and form a new family which is now the main unit. He's acting as if his family is the main unit. It cannot be. 

Talk to him about what they know. Ask him to back you. Leave the kids with a sitter and you two go over there. Tell her that you want to have a good relationship but in order to do so, you have to forgive her for interfering in your private affairs between you and your husband and ask if she will forgive you for any hurt your actions may have caused her son. And ask her if you can all put it behind you because you'd like peace in the family and tell them how happy you two are now that you are working through your problems.

If they are reasonable (which I'm wondering about) they will. If they aren't, your husband will have to choose.


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

EnjoliWoman said:


> She didn't have to do what she did. SHE made a choice to stick her nose into business where it didn't belong. It goes beyond nosey and interfereing to her deciding what is right/wrong legally in a separation and making a unilateral ILLEGAL decision.
> 
> HER ACTIONS were her failing. NOT YOURS. You contributed to the marital issues and seems you have taken responsibility and have worked on that with your husband.
> 
> ...


He shared everything with her while we were separated. I read emails and text messages where he revealed so many personal things. Since we both filed for divorce he shared all of the legal documents with her and even wrote notes about the case with her. I have always felt my MIL was the other woman in my marriage. She truly is her husband's soulmate. He refuses to hurt her or even acknowledge her short comings. He told me he believes she never should have been terminated since she was just providing "good customer service". She was sneaky enough to ask a subordinate to check her son's account, but it still was traced back to her someway.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

ReidWright said:


> this can't go on forever, but two months might not be long enough for the MIL to cool her jets over the bank situation (which clearly wasn't your fault anyways).
> 
> can you do a toe-in-the-water approach? have him take the kids for most of the visit, then you show up for the last hour or for a meal or activity? or are they too far away?
> 
> ...


Thanks. I like your idea. They are five minutes from us, just as my parents are. We're in NJ. Very densely populated, everything and everyone is about 5-10 minutes away. Unfortunately for me, my in laws are as well, so my husband can and wants to visit often w/o me of course.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

Is your husband willing to set up a meeting, public, with you and his mother to talk this out?


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

Wolf1974 said:


> Is your husband willing to set up a meeting, public, with you and his mother to talk this out?


He was (and he did). We actually met in a park many months ago. Then the firing happened. He says he wants clear boundaries now. I honestly think he's humiliated for his mom and is protecting her. I only found out about the termination by reading his text messages. I don't think he had any intention of telling me. I confronted the issue in marital. He said it was none of my business ???
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

Just curious .... Were you involved in her firing? As in, did you call the bank and complain about her?

Not that it really matters, as she is the one that committed the fraud and deserved to be fired.

I can just see any reconciliation taking longer if you were involved in her firing.

He needs to tell his parents that he is only going to be visiting if his entire family is welcome.


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

SadSamIAm said:


> Just curious .... Were you involved in her firing? As in, did you call the bank and complain about her?
> 
> Not that it really matters, as she is the one that committed the fraud and deserved to be fired.
> 
> ...


No I wasn't. But someone sent a letter to my superintendent claiming I was an alcoholic and mentally unstable. I was not fired, but was called into the super's office. I know, I know, you 're probably thinking this us crazy. I think his mother is responsible for the letter that went to my super. Of course it was anonymous so there's no way to know for sure.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Peachie (Jul 10, 2014)

Are you sure you really want to be a part of that family? Your husband puts his parents above you and allows interference in your marriage? 

I'd stay home. In fact, I'd stay home and insist my children stay as well. And pack a bag for that husband of yours too! You deserve better.


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## staarz21 (Feb 6, 2013)

Yeah, I wouldn't be letting my children go over there until she can act like an adult. Poor examples of human beings that can't even get along for a few hours for the kids. 

The MIL needs to back out of your marriage

You H needs to back out of his mother's butt and stand up for his family

I don't think either of those things is going to happen any time soon. You have to be the one to set new boundaries. Either you all go and play nice or no one goes. The end.


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## Omego (Apr 17, 2013)

sarahkj2009 said:


> I have always felt my MIL was the other woman in my marriage.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


If you feel that way, you are probably right. I agree with those who are saying that your H needs to put you first. He shouldn't be sharing your personal information with his mother. 

The whole dynamic is wrong. He is a mama's boy. This problem needs to be solved immediately.

I'm afraid you are going to have to ask the therapist what the best way is to get your H to understand that his mother should not be his first priority.


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## Omego (Apr 17, 2013)

staarz21 said:


> I don't think either of those things is going to happen any time soon. You have to be the one to set new boundaries. Either you all go and play nice or no one goes. The end.


:iagree::iagree::iagree:


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

You married a boy. You had children with a boy. You reconciled with a boy. Why hold him to the standard of being a man now? It's not who he is.


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## WolverineFan (Nov 26, 2013)

This is not simply an easy black and white choice. I mean, have you considered what "making him choose" even means? For instance, does that mean he can never see his parents? Does that mean he can never take your children to see his parents without you? You said that you are still in the process of therapy and his therapist is talking to him about this issue. What do you think about letting the process have a little more time?


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

WolverineFan said:


> This is not simply an easy black and white choice. I mean, have you considered what "making him choose" even means? For instance, does that mean he can never see his parents? Does that mean he can never take your children to see his parents without you? You said that you are still in the process of therapy and his therapist is talking to him about this issue. What do you think about letting the process have a little more time?


Well, therapy has helped. The therapist said it is not acceptable to attend birthday parties, etc. if I'm not invited. My SIL only invited my husband and sons to her daughter's bday party and my husband was encouraged to not attend by the therapist since I was not invited. That was a huge step for my husband and a very difficult decision.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

Well, if I had a CHOiCE to either go to the in-laws or stay home, I'd clearly stay home in a heartbeat!

But being TOLD to stay home makes me want to go over there just to be a thorn in their side.

And this whole firing thing sounds fishy to me. Seems your husband WANTED to stiff you. He had to have signed stop payment forms. On the other hand, bank protocol states you cannot transact on a relatives account. That's probably what did her in.


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

Revamped said:


> Well, if I had a CHOiCE to either go to the in-laws or stay home, I'd clearly stay home in a heartbeat!
> 
> But being TOLD to stay home makes me want to go over there just to be a thorn in their side.
> 
> And this whole firing thing sounds fishy to me. Seems your husband WANTED to stiff you. He had to have signed stop payment forms. On the other hand, bank protocol states you cannot transact on a relatives account. That's probably what did her in.


She had a subordinate check my husband's account. He had scheduled payments for the month such as mortgage, taxes, heat, etc, she then had her subordinate stop the bank from processing, I suppose she could because of her access to the bank system. She and the subordinate were terminated. I have no clue how the bank found out. It was actually pretty cruel considering I was a stay at home mom and had money. My parents paid the house bills..
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

sarahkj2009 said:


> She had a subordinate check my husband's account. He had scheduled payments for the month such as mortgage, taxes, heat, etc, she then had her subordinate stop the bank from processing, I suppose she could because of her access to the bank system. She and the subordinate were terminated. I have no clue how the bank found out. It was actually pretty cruel considering I was a stay at home mom and had money. My parents paid the house bills..
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


My husband and his mother worked together to stop the payments, he didn't want things to get paid so she worked it on her end to make sure they weren't paid , to help her son. He told me he didn't want to pay.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

It is not OK, in my opinion, for your husband to be taking your children to see his family without you. If they want to exclude you, then he should be going on his own. If they want to see YOUR children, then you must be welcome as well. If the two of you were separated or divorced, this would, of course, be quite different. As it is, your children should not be put in the middle of this drama.


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## staarz21 (Feb 6, 2013)

sarahkj2009 said:


> My husband and his mother worked together to stop the payments, he didn't want things to get paid so she worked it on her end to make sure they weren't paid , to help her son. He told me he didn't want to pay.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



That's disturbing.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

You were a SAHM with no money and he decided he just didn't want to pay the bills to keep his family afloat and his mom fixed it so the money didn't come out of the account? Unbelievable. Both he and his mom should be grateful you're such a forgiving person.


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## NWCooper (Feb 19, 2013)

sarahkj2009 said:


> No I wasn't. But someone sent a letter to my superintendent claiming I was an alcoholic and mentally unstable. I was not fired, but was called into the super's office. I know, I know, you 're probably thinking this us crazy. I think his mother is responsible for the letter that went to my super. Of course it was anonymous so there's no way to know for sure.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I thought you were a SAHM? Is this a recent job that she is trying to get you fired from? And why will your husband discuss everything with his mom, and yet things are none of your business? What does your husband think of the letter that went to your supervisor and who else could possibly have written it?


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## finding-a-path (May 1, 2014)

Your MIL is a danger to your family.why? She stopped bank transfers to make you suffer. So imagine what she might be telling your kids to turn them against you? She clearly enjoys making you suffer.so she must be planning things. I think in an ideal situation a husband/wife should not go to places where the spouse is not welcome. But it is theirs to decide. So if he wants to go where u are not welcome,he shall go.but he shall not take the kids. This same problem was the reason for my brother in law's divorce. He was not welcome at wife's home,he told her not to take the kids there,she did.and they divorced. I think if they want to meet the kids they shall agree to meet them in the park,with you. Limited access to grandkids because they dont welcome you. Btw, my husband's mother fought with me when i said visit us later after my exam (she wanted to stay for a month) and said 'dont come to my home ever' and invited my husband to her place,he went without me. You can read details on my thread. i didnt felt good about him going where i am not welcome.. So i know how you must be feeling. Your situation is even more serious because kids are involved.. talk about this in therapy. I think it is better that you dont have them in your life. So i suggest you arrange the kids to meet them in common grounds with you (say once a month for 5 hours in the park.your -and your husband's-kids your rules.not their rules)and let your husband decide how he will deal with his parents.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

NWCooper said:


> I thought you were a SAHM? Is this a recent job that she is trying to get you fired from? And why will your husband discuss everything with his mom, and yet things are none of your business? What does your husband think of the letter that went to your supervisor and who else could possibly have written it?


Yes, recent. I started in September. Breakup occurred in August. My husband discusses nothing with me about his family because he says I hate them, so I have no need to know anything. He says he has no idea who wrote it. Said it possibly was a social worker who interviewed me when I went to the hospital due to a breakdown. He claims his mother did not write it. I believe she did or someone very close to her that she told things to did. My husband would not destroy my career. His kids would suffer financially.


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

I think you should let it ride- FOR NOW.

In an attempt to smooth over hard feelings, they can visit alone but major holidays and celebrations HAVE to include you.

Face it, she hates you. That's not gonna change. But, for holidays, she MUST set those feelings aside for a few hours.

Maybe it's a compromise all can live with.


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## finding-a-path (May 1, 2014)

why does she hate you? Did you do anything?/didnt do what she wanted? Or is it just because of the separation?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

sarahkj2009 said:


> Yes. But I can't help feeling if we had not separated, she wouldn't have had to do what she did. She injected herself into her son's marriage to the point where she couldn't stay professional even at work. It's just so incredibly ugly now. They have to sell their home because of the termination. It's not my fault, but it kind of is.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


NO NO NO NO NO!!!!!!!!!!!

Your MIL is in the position she's in now, because of choices that SHE made.

YOU ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR HER SITUATION IN ANY WAY *wags finger at OP for emphasis*

xx


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

sarahkj2009 said:


> My husband and his mother worked together to stop the payments, he didn't want things to get paid so she worked it on her end to make sure they weren't paid , to help her son. He told me he didn't want to pay.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Oh sweetie, those are the actions of a scumbag husband. He didn't want his children to eat? Have heating? A home? Ffs!!! What an a hole!!!

It is NOT acceptable for you not to be invited, and you should not wait this out. This is BS. Absolute BS. 

I'll also be very clear - the problem is not your MIL, but your husband. He is pee weak and needs to grow a pair and tell his mother to back off and mind her own business.

If he won't do that, I don't see much hope for your reconciliation.


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## Omego (Apr 17, 2013)

Revamped said:


> I think you should let it ride- FOR NOW.
> 
> In an attempt to smooth over hard feelings, they can visit alone but major holidays and celebrations HAVE to include you.
> 
> ...


:iagree: Yet another toxic MIL situation.


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## Omego (Apr 17, 2013)

sarahkj2009 said:


> Yes, recent. I started in September. Breakup occurred in August. My husband discusses nothing with me about his family because he says I hate them, so I have no need to know anything.


Maybe you should start by discussing this point with him. It sounds more like his mother started the whole thing. Perhaps you could simply point out some facts which support your position. 

You could also tell him that his relationship with his mother makes you feel like you are his second choice, as though she is the main woman in his life.

If he cannot understand this, I'm seriously questioning the future of your marriage....


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## CarlaRose (Jul 6, 2014)

You give your counselor a lot of credit, but s/he is pretty bad in my opinion. You're not receiving the proper advice or the proper therapy. You like the therapist so much because s/he takes your side, tells your husband how wrong he is, and asks him to do things for your sake. But that's not what marriage counseling is supposed to be.

Your therapists should be helping you both understand the principles and concepts of marriage, what it means to have a wife/husband, conflict resolution, and other goal-oriented ways to help you both work out your differences, as well as how to avoid/prevent the problems that make you each unhappy.

It appears he's come a long way because he does what she asks him to do, but that doesn't mean he understands, nor does it mean he has changed. It only means he is obedient because a professional is telling him what he should do. The decisions and change in behaviors should be of his own initiative based on his understanding of being a good husband. That's why you're still having this problem with him and his family. He doesn't cut ties with them because he doesn't understand his marriage comes first forsaking all others. He doesn't understand any ties that cause dissension/derision in the marriage are supposed to be broken. Just like he expects you to just accept that he goes to see them without you, he should more importantly resolve that they have to accept you as his wife. But he doesn't see it from a marriage/united as one point of view. That's because your therapist is not doing his/her job.

Additionally, you say he told her everything during the separation, but you also say you've had trouble with his family from the beginning. He didn't begin during the separation. He's been talking unkindly about you all the long. And, you've probably never thought about it, but I bet he's never told them that he loves you. Just the contrary, I'm betting he's told them things like "I can't stand her" or "she gets on my nerves" or "she doesn't keep the house clean" or "she doesn't take care of the kids" or similar things. He has been bad-mouthing you to them. The only way I am wrong about that is if you, yourself, did/said things to make them dislike you. Otherwise, they would not dislike you without reason. He gives them plenty of reasons and always has.

Lastly, I only read 1.5 of the pages, so I don't know if this was addressed. I'm wondering if you called the bank to inquire of the checks bouncing because I can't figure out how the bank became involved with investigating your husband's account unless someone called to complain. What was the catalyst of her firing? Did you call to report it?


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## CarlaRose (Jul 6, 2014)

frusdil said:


> Oh sweetie, those are the actions of a scumbag husband. He didn't want his children to eat? Have heating? A home? Ffs!!! What an a hole!!!
> 
> It is NOT acceptable for you not to be invited, and you should not wait this out. This is BS. Absolute BS.
> 
> ...


Exactly!!!

You're blaming his family/mom, but like I said, your husband is the one fueling their fire and telling them inflammatory things about you. You really made a mistake choosing this man and making another one by wanting to hold on to him. He cares little of nothing about you, and the idea of him recruiting his mother to starve his family and get you and the children in the cold/heat and dark and possibly evicted is appalling.


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## Omego (Apr 17, 2013)

CarlaRose said:


> Exactly!!!
> 
> You're blaming his family/mom, but like I said, your husband is the one fueling their fire and telling them inflammatory things about you. You really made a mistake choosing this man and making another one by wanting to hold on to him. He cares little of nothing about you, and the idea of him recruiting his mother to starve his family and get you and the children in the cold/heat and dark and possibly evicted is appalling.


This is true. The MIL is also probably manipulating him, however.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

I really feel for you. That's not how things are supposed to be. It's unnatural imo, and speaks of an unhealthy mother-son relationship. The umbilical cord should've been detached by now.

When my MIL turned on me and tried to come between my DH and I, he cut her off. There is no middle ground. I would've accepted it if he wanted to visit her still. Probably would've eventually had problems with the kids still seeing her though. It never came up though because he didn't marry her, he married me, and when she made it a her or me situation, there was no doubt about who he would pick. I was surprised she didn't realise that.

I guess when doubt enters a marriage though, things can change. When you have no guarantees that it's forever, you start clinging to what you know *will* be forever, such as a parent always being a parent.

I would say that maybe he will start to let go of the apron strings once you are both feeling as if your marriage is rock solid, but he sounds too attached to ever have a normal relationship with his mother; I think it's way too warped.

BTW, the money thing shows he has little to no integrity. This man should never have had a family of his own.


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

I should have been more clear. He had my sons. He was living with his parents with them so he didn't turn off the heat on them, just me, haha. I had a breakdown around August and he said he'd take the kids to his mom's while I received treatment. His mom got him a lawyer and he had a consent order written up giving him temporary custody. It was pretty outrageous though (it cut me out completely) so the judge didn't sign it. Custody during the separation was pretty much a 50/50 split. What concerned me though was his ( and his mom's) attempt to just erase me. I actually hacked into his email and Verizon online account during the separation. What I read was truly disturbing. She worked him over, so did his sister. With him home, she fell back into the mothering role. He would send texts to her that thanked her for buttering his bread and mentioning I never did that. While I was in treatment, his mother walked into our home and took my engagement ring! My husband insisted she was just holding it for safekeeping. In the end, a bunch of letters had to be written between the lawyers just to get it returned. They just wanted me erased. 

As far as her job, yes, someone notified the bank of her illegal activity. This woman is so manipulative. She'll kiss me on the cheek and play nice.


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

finding-a-path said:


> why does she hate you? Did you do anything?/didnt do what she wanted? Or is it just because of the separation?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think she hates me because I hurt her son. My breakdown hurt him. She probably also thinks I had something to do with her firing. Someone notified the bank about the fraud or their auditors picked it up. I have no idea.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

You cannot erase the last 20-30 years of damage this woman has done to her son. You may be able to find ways to deal with his issues, but I doubt he'll ever be capable of understanding what has been done to him.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

Oh dear, I am so sorry for all of this. Let's try & break it down:

Do you want to stay married to this man & his toxic family?

If so, then you must demand marriage counseling. This situation is too dysfunctional to go on w/o professional help. I'm mainly thinking of your children.

It is better for YOUR mental health to not be around toxic in-laws. As long as toxic in-laws are not abusive (emotional) to your children, I would let it go during marriage counseling & let the counselor advise. Your husband 's refusal to discuss toxic in-laws right now is actually better for your mental health.

The above advice is only given if YOU want to stay married & improve your marriage.

Personally, I would not stay with a man that puts a thieving, lying, manipulative Mother on a pedestal & treats me the way he treats you. I would file for divorce & go live with my nice parents (like yours) until I could become financially independent.


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## ScrewedEverything (May 14, 2013)

Since it sounds like both you and your husband would like to have a normal relationship with his parents and would be happy to visit them as a couple, this isn't really a situation of you forcing your husband to choose between you and his parents. This is really about his parents forcing him to make a choice. 

The question your husband should be asking is whether it's right for his parents to be placing conditions on their willingness to have a relationship with him. He's chosen to couple with you and if they aren't willing to have a relationship with him on those terms, then that's a choice THEY are making, not one you are forcing your husband to make.


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## inquizitivemind (Jul 16, 2013)

:iagree: And to add to that, here are my thoughts:

Your husband is not being a good husband or father. I know you had a breakdown and I am sure things were said between you and your husband that may have hurt him. However, those were supposed to stay confidential within the marriage. I often feel like people want to justify a separation to their family because they feel like a failure, and they say things about their spouse that further turns their family against them. This is not the right thing to do, but it seems is what you have discovered your husband has done. Your MIL and family seem to want you erased, seemingly to the point of you not seeing your children. What that says to me is that they don't have the best interest of anyone of you in mind, you, your husband, or the kids. 

In your therapy, you need to bring these issues up and talk openly about the situation. If your husband is unwilling to include you in his "business", such as his mother's firing, then you need to move on without him. You are his wife. You should be the person he tells everything to and can trust that you will listen with an open mind. If he places his mother in that position, then tell him he can marry her. As others have said, wife comes first!


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Any man worth his salt would not want his mother or wife buttering his bread, WTH?

Bank's have strict safe guards in place for Stop Payments. Your MIL should have known that after twenty years of experience. Her being fired is on her only. 

Wish I could offer you some advice but frankly I don't understand why you want to be around his family. Also, I don't understand why you want your husband but that's neither here nor there.


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## CoralReef (Jul 1, 2014)

sarahkj2009 said:


> Yes, recent. I started in September. Breakup occurred in August. My husband discusses nothing with me about his family because he says I hate them, so I have no need to know anything. He says he has no idea who wrote it. Said it possibly was a social worker who interviewed me when I went to the hospital due to a breakdown. He claims his mother did not write it. I believe she did or someone very close to her that she told things to did. My husband would not destroy my career. His kids would suffer financially.


With all due respect, this entire post has DOORMAT written all over it. On one hand you opening admit that your husband moved out and didn't want to pay any bills to help you AND THE CHILDREN. And the fact that he was not living there means nothing. What did he think was going to happen when he stopped paying all the bills?

In the same thread you post that you're husband would not destroy your career.

Your husband knows that he can do whatever he wants because you won't call him out. Your mother in law considers herself the main woman in her son's life and views YOU as the other woman. Your husband also considers you to be the other woman who he only spends time with when its convenient. His mom is his main squeeze. Are you okay with this? If not, how do you intend to change this dynamic?


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## CoralReef (Jul 1, 2014)

She came into your house while you were in treatment to get the engagement because she wished he had given it to her all along. I would bet seven million internet dollars that she may have smiled when he proposed but on the inside she was dying of jealousy.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

CoralReef said:


> She came into your house while you were in treatment to get the engagement because she wished he had given it to her all along. I would bet seven million internet dollars that she may have smiled when he proposed but on the inside she was dying of jealousy.


That's so sick but unfortunately probably true.


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## imtamnew (May 13, 2013)

Have some pride sister and kick this fool and his mother.

Your mil wanted grandkids. Your role in that family its over so you are not needed anymore.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Omego (Apr 17, 2013)

CoralReef said:


> She came into your house while you were in treatment to get the engagement because she wished he had given it to her all along. I would bet seven million internet dollars that she may have smiled when he proposed but on the inside she was dying of jealousy.


YES YES and YES. This really makes me angry and I'm tempted to use language to describe this woman which would get me banned, so I'll refrain.

My MIL looked absolutely miserable during our wedding. My parents even noticed it....


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

CoralReef said:


> She came into your house while you were in treatment to get the engagement because she wished he had given it to her all along. I would bet seven million internet dollars that she may have smiled when he proposed but on the inside she was dying of jealousy.


Yes, I agree. I think my husband wanted to propose to her! So, twenty minutes ago, he told me he wanted the kids to see his parents. That was at 9:00 a.m.. He said he'll return around noon. Of course, I wasn't invited. I don't really mind today. I'm going to meet a friend for coffee and hit an AA meeting. I mentioned I was going to a meeting and he saw it as an opportunity to go to parents. I think that's how he'll get around this. Take them there when I have something else going on rather than just say, "you stay home". It's the same thing but looks a little better this way. I love how he wakes up and thinks about how he wants to see his mother. My 3 and 5 year old wake up and call for me. My 33 year old husband pretty much does the same thing. Oh my gosh! I'm screwed! We have therapy on Monday night.

What would be good to say to marriage therapist? Thx!


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

1) your husband had no concern for your welfare during your split. So much so that his mother did something illegal in order to cut off any financial support when he could've just talked to you about it and sorted it out amicably. Since you both got back together, this doesn't make a lot of sense, does it. Maybe he could explain that to you.

2) Your engagement ring was your property and his family committed theft. Could he explain why he wants his children to have this example in their lives of how to behave?

3) His family have attempted to cause both you, him and your children hardship through writing letters to your supervisor to try get you fired. How does he not see that as an attack against him? How does he not see that he is not protecting his family?

Maybe these are things you could ask him at your next therapy session.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

breeze said:


> 1) your husband had no concern for your welfare during your split. So much so that his mother did something illegal in order to cut off any financial support when he could've just talked to you about it and sorted it out amicably. Since you both got back together, this doesn't make a lot of sense, does it. Maybe he could explain that to you.
> 
> 2) Your engagement ring was your property and his family committed theft. Could he explain why he wants his children to have this example in their lives of how to behave?
> 
> ...


I'd suggest she ask herself questions about her husband instead. HE is right there in the middle of all of it, ALL of it. Her problems with his family are solely because of her's husband and his own choices and behaviors.

OP, is this the kind of man you really want to spend your life with? He's already shown you who he is. You have no reason to believe he will stop being _this _man. Do you really want _this _man in your life?


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

Wow. Thanks for all of insight and advise. I'm thinking about just keeping my legs closed until he gives what I deserve.

Think this would be an effective tactic?


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

Ah, troll post, ya got me.


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

breeze said:


> Ah, troll post, ya got me.


No, no, no. Not at all. I was just really disgusted when I wrote that. I'm at such a loss.


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

Yeah,

Your mil probably didn't get canned for issuing a stop payment request. That wouldn't by itself raise a financial flag. She probably tried to reverse a clearing ledger after one or more payments got missed by her and the system tried to process it, thinking if she stopped it there, the system wouldn't clear it the next day.

Unfortunately for her, the dozens of reports spit out by the system to the bean counters wouldn't match up and would immediately start an investigation.

Yeah. She did stupid. Banks don't like when the systems don't match themselves up. It creates a lot of work for a lot of people.


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

Everyone is really jumping on the bandwagon against the husband here. I'd like to offer up a different opinion.

On page 1, OP states that August was her pivotal period when her marriage breaks down. She has a mental breakdown that requires treatment. She states that she drank while her husband was at work. What kind of treatment program was it? A 30 day sobriety program?... She says that her one year of sobriety will be in August. Consider that...

So...how effectively was she caring for a 4 & 2 yr old at the time?

One page 3, OP states her husband left the marital home with the minor children. How bad does it have to get before a husband takes two children out of her care and move in with his parents? Pretty bad, I imagine. He petitions the Court for temp custody. And WINS. Just not the sole custody he asked for, but this proves she isn't exactly as innocent in this as she's portraying.

He plays nasty and refuses to pay the marital bills. Having been divorced, I can attest this is pretty damn common. She admits the children were NOT with her. They were living at the in-laws. She finally gets a job in September ATFER the bills weren't getting paid.

Now OP is fighting about her husband taking the kids to the in-laws without her. In same place where they LIVED. There's speculation on how MIL got fired from her banking job. A lot of bad blood on both sides here.

Now that she's clean, her husband is trying to re-establish his marriage. Yes, he made mistakes too and trying to move forward. And it's hard. It's very hard to establish Trust again to a recovering alcoholic.

I think some of these facts are getting pushed to the back burner. I just don't think I'll be jumping on the bashing-of-the-husband bandwagon.


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

Revamped said:


> Everyone is really jumping on the bandwagon against the husband here. I'd like to offer up a different opinion.
> 
> On page 1, OP states that August was her pivotal period when her marriage breaks down. She has a mental breakdown that requires treatment. She states that she drank while her husband was at work. What kind of treatment program was it? A 30 day sobriety program?... She says that her one year of sobriety will be in August. Consider that...
> 
> ...


Kids spent more time with me. I had custody from 7:00 a.m. To 7:00 p.m. Judge let them sleep there for four months, that's it. MIL told children this was their new home. It became so dysfunctional that they began calling me by my first name rather than mommy. That was horrible. 

Just to update, my husband admitted yesterday that he had a conversation with his mom and she told him she's not ready to have a relationship with me. She's in the process of selling her home, she has health issues. My husband told me point blank yesterday that he chooses me. He then went to his parent's home and informed them that they cannot see the children without both of us present. MIL didn't budge. My husband is unbelievably hurt. He was sulking all last night and asking why his parents will not bend. He blamed me at one point, but I just insisted that I'm prepared to reconcile, to have them in OUR lives. She doesn't want this, however. She tried to erase me when we were separated and continues to want this to happen.

My husband was crying last night. I feel terribly bad for him. He said he NEEDs as his mother and he's not sure he will be able to follow through with making a break. Their relationship is very twisted and I believe she's playing the victim. I just keep asking him WHY SHE cares so much. She is NOT part of our marriage. The wedge that's she driven between us is unconsciousable. Everyone has moved on (me, my husband and parents) yet she refuses to. The bottom line is she can take or leave the grand kids, she' always favored her grandchildren that her daughter produced. The bond with my children is just not strong enough to make her change. If she really loved them, she'd just go with it. I sincerely believe she just does not want our marriage to survive. So unbelievably sad, this all is. 

She is not in our marriage. Why is she doing this?


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

You are being awfully cavelier about being a recovering alcoholic. 

You mentioned AA, what step are you on? You don't even have a one year chip but are demanding that everybody put the devastation you caused in the past.

It simply doesn't work that way. It takes time and healing and, yes, retribution for the pain and suffering YOU have caused.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

sarahkj2009 said:


> She is not in our marriage. Why is she doing this?


She would prefer to have her son to herself. She was probably hoping he'd divorce you so she could have him back.


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

You gotta own your sh!t, Sarah.

Not ONCE have you've said anything about YOUR part in all this. You go on about your MIL but don't take ownership of your actions. You blamed your husband about leaving you but yet to fess up to the AMOUNT of drinking you did while being a caretaker to TWO children. Or is AA just a big joke to you...

Where's the "I" statements, Sarah? What did you do to cause such a mess of your own life?

Until you realize YOU caused the breakup of your family, you have NO right to blame others on how they feel about you.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

To be fair, Sarah has said she is willing to reconcile with his mother. While she's not going into detail on her own actions, this is a big step for someone who was treated that way. Maybe her own guilt or acknowledgement of her own part to play is showing through in this.

Personally, she's doing better than I am in regards to that. My MIL tried to come between DH and I and I'm not going to forgive and forget, call me a monster, but I'll be in the grave before that woman comes near me again.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Revamped said:


> You gotta own your sh!t, Sarah.
> 
> Not ONCE have you've said anything about YOUR part in all this. You go on about your MIL but don't take ownership of your actions. You blamed your husband about leaving you but yet to fess up to the AMOUNT of drinking you did while being a caretaker to TWO children. Or is AA just a big joke to you...
> 
> ...


The fact remains that Sarah's MIL had NO business stopping the payments from the bank, or entering Sarah's house and taking her engagement ring.

She doesn't have to like Sarah, but she DOES have to treat her with respect as a human being and the mother of her grandchildren. If she loved her grandchildren she would at the very least, be cordial to their mother.


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

breeze said:


> To be fair, Sarah has said she is willing to reconcile with his mother. While she's not going into detail on her own actions, this is a big step for someone who was treated that way. Maybe her own guilt or acknowledgement of her own part to play is showing through in this.
> 
> Personally, she's doing better than I am in regards to that. My MIL tried to come between DH and I and I'm not going to forgive and forget, call me a monster, but I'll be in the grave before that woman comes near me again.


False. In the case of retribution, admitting guilt and accepting defeat IS the aim of the step forward. It's not that Sarah needs to be forgiven, it's the fact she ASKS for forgiveness for her shortcomings is the purpose.


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

frusdil said:


> The fact remains that Sarah's MIL had NO business stopping the payments from the bank, or entering Sarah's house and taking her engagement ring.
> 
> She doesn't have to like Sarah, but she DOES have to treat her with respect as a human being and the mother of her grandchildren. If she loved her grandchildren she would at the very least, be cordial to their mother.


Again, false. No respect needs to be shown to an full blown alcoholic. That's EARNED, not gifted.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

If they were with you 12 hours a day then his refusal to pay for anything in the house did impact them. Why aren't you mad at him for that?


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

Revamped said:


> Again, false. No respect needs to be shown to an full blown alcoholic. That's EARNED, not gifted.


I'm feeling some history here with alcoholics. Personally I've had no experience in that area, so my antenna shifted when I read that but didn't shift my focus. Experience with ILs though, yes.

Maybe it's time the focus of this thread did shift a little.


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

Temp custody stipulates the amount of CS he pays. He paid what was ordered, not specifically the total amount that's need to pay the mortgage, gas, electric, water, garbage and phone service.

If she didn't pay her 50%, how is that HIS fault? Look up Title IV provisions...


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Revamped said:


> Again, false. No respect needs to be shown to an full blown alcoholic. That's EARNED, not gifted.


No, not false. Sometimes we have to swallow our feelings for the sake of the children. That's what grown ups do. That's what LOVING grandparents would do.

The children were with Sarah 12 hours a day - how can anyone argue that his stopping the payments didn't affect them?

Anyway, the point here is his mother was TOTALLY IN THE WRONG for interfering. If he wanted the payments stopped or altered, he should have used the proper channels. That was not his mother's choice to make.


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

You talk about what loving parents would do, but you conveniently skip over what a loving MOTHER would do.

The best thing a mother can do is to give them the BEST shot of a loving, nurturing home would be. And that isn't with OP. She hasn't come to grips with her alcoholism.

Instead of focusing on MIL, and the need to recover an engagement ring that SHOULD HAVE BEEN ON HER FINGER, the focus is on the MIL. Ass backwards. 

The first step of AA is to admit there is a problem with HER, NOT a MIL. That's secondary.

You seem to forget the two children that miss their mother. A main focus. But blind to the fighting over a Sunday afternoon...


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

The OP has admitted to her part in things. You're right that the issue isn't the MIL, but the husband. He should be saying to his mum that "we're trying to make a go of things, I need you to be civil to Sarah for my and the kids sakes". His mother should do that at a minimum.

You focus so much on Sarah's role - and yes, of course she has a big one in this. She had a breakdown for god sake, no one can blame her for that. Of course it hurt her husband and children. And if it happens again and finds herself divorced, she'll have no one to blame but herself.

You cannot argue with the fact that her MIL is WAY out of line with the bank fiasco and entering Sarah's home and stealing her property. Perhaps she was not allowed any jewellry in the hospital???


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

We'll, I'm rather skeptical that MIL did that. Or, if she did, it was because dear ole husband asked her to. How else would MIL get in (a key) and know where is was(he told her). A ring is very pawnable, btw. Preventative measures....

Again, the attention is shifted away from Sarah and on to her husband, and what HE needs to say to his mother to allow Sarah back into her life. I take exception to that. It is something Sarah needs to do for herself.

But that won't happen. Why? Cuz Sarah is still drinking. She's not recovering at all. She's NOT working her Steps, she's NOT atoning for the harm she's caused and she's NOT submitting to the idea that her Life has become unmanageable due to her drinking.

Any sponsor worth their chip would have told her that changes in attitude take time and effort to soothe over the damage she's caused.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Revamped said:


> But that won't happen. Why? *Cuz Sarah is still drinking.* She's not recovering at all. She's NOT working her Steps, she's NOT atoning for the harm she's caused and she's NOT submitting to the idea that her Life has become unmanageable due to her drinking.


Did I miss something in the thread? Where does OP say she is still drinking? I thought she was in "recovery."


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

Revamped said:


> Temp custody stipulates the amount of CS he pays. He paid what was ordered, not specifically the total amount that's need to pay the mortgage, gas, electric, water, garbage and phone service.
> 
> If she didn't pay her 50%, how is that HIS fault? Look up Title IV provisions...


Nope. Not true. He stopped paying EVERYTHING. The judge ripped his attorney a new one for that. You cannot just walk away from marital home expensed. His attorney claimed he "did not have control of his client." 

It didn't far enough to work out the fine details as far ax financed goes. We region silence before going down the Case Information Statement, which in NJ is pretty much who pays what.


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## sarahkj2009 (Jul 26, 2013)

Revamped said:


> We'll, I'm rather skeptical that MIL did that. Or, if she did, it was because dear ole husband asked her to. How else would MIL get in (a key) and know where is was(he told her). A ring is very pawnable, btw. Preventative measures....
> 
> Again, the attention is shifted away from Sarah and on to her husband, and what HE needs to say to his mother to allow Sarah back into her life. I take exception to that. It is something Sarah needs to do for herself.
> 
> ...


Wait, I'm not drinking. Working the program. Will have a year. You seem to forget his mom and I already met at the park a few months back and sort of said our peace, agreed to focus on the future. Since getting herself fired, she now no longer wants to move forward with the reconciliation.


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## Revamped (Jun 19, 2014)

So move on. You have spent more time accusing her of things that may or may not be true. 

Are you seriously working your Steps? From my point of view you haven't even hit Step One, let alone Step Four. What's your sponsor say? Are you even listening to him/her? How many meetings are you attending per week? 

All this fussing over what? Making your husband yet again have to choose between insanity with you or sanity without you? Cuz that's what it will boil down to if you can't get a grip and let this go.

Focus on your Steps, not your MIL and the perceived wrongdoings by her. It's counterproductive.


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