# Best adivice from the ladies to help this man out!



## FlyingFish (May 24, 2011)

Okay ladies, perhaps you can help me out here. General background: I’m 36 and my wife is 37. We’ve been married 12 years and my wife and I have two kiddos, 4 and 6. I work a professional technical job and also own my own very small business, but it does very well. Prior to having kids my wife worked, but as agreed after we had kids she stays home. My wife loves being a mom and she is a great cook. She loves staying home with the kids. We have zero money stress and both my wife and I are financially responsible. At some point over the last few years my wife has stopped doing almost any housework around the house other than cook. I take care of the yard, cars, vacuum the floors 1-2 times a week, do all of the laundry (wash, dry, fold, put away for both us and the kids 4-5 loads a week), clean the kitchen (yes, really clean), clean the toilets, pay the bills, manage finances, fix anything around the house that needs it, and work both jobs. When I get home we have dinner and as soon as dinner is over I watch the kids until their bedtime, get them ready for bed (do baths, etc), read them stories and put them to bed. I clip their fingernails. She doesn’t even pick up after herself anymore. We also have a housekeeper that comes once a month. With a few exceptions after dinner my wife checks Facebook, does emails, goes to the gym, and lays in bed watching TV. Unless we are out doing something on the weekends she does the same thing then: Facebook, email, bed/TV. Me: I am smart, funny, educated, fit, attractive, I don’t yell, I’m good with our kids, I’m loving to my wife. I try and spend time with her at watch her shows, but all she does then is Facebook and games on her phone when I’m with her. Basically I’m feeling ignored and like I’m doing all of my work and her work. The kids are in preschool part of the week. I fully support anything she does and am happy to stay home so she can go out and hang with her friends, go to the gym, or anything else. I kick her out of the house and MAKE her have a night out with her friends when she is stressed. She says she misses me, but when I spend time with her she just ignores me. And no sex life. The only time my wife shows affection to me is if we’re in public someplace. When it’s just us, nothing. In the evenings I occasionally have to run out to do things for my small biz, usually short errands that take about an hour. AFAIK, she isn’t cheating on me, and I’m not cheating on her, nor have I ever wanted to. So that’s a snapshot of us. Maybe you can help me now with some questions I have and give me feedback. FYI, I do fully live in this century and don’t expect her to do everything around the house. You will never hear me say “Get back in the kitchen and get me a sandwich!” to my wife. I LOVE getting a chance to do something for her to lighten her load, but at this point it’s all MY load. Basically by the time I get everything done every night it’s 10pm and I’d like a chance to relax.

Oh, and I'm adding this: I'm not perfect. I don't think I am perfect, and I don't pretend to be perfect. I have faults but I don't have any giant personal, family, or emotional problems.

1)	How can I approach her to get her to take up some of the chores around the house and in general share responsibility?
a.	I’ve considered asking her to pick 1-2 things and make them hers. Good approach?
b.	If I’m home during the day I can manage to take care of the kids, get chores done, AND have fun with the kids. Why can’t she?

2)	Sex. Yeah, but listen: my wife has issues with pain during intercourse. But she has never, ever, shown interest in doing any other intimate things with me. None. Yes, not that thing or that either. I have been told flat out “It’s just not worth the effort.” (in regards to trying something else). And sorry, but I hear that as “You’re just not worth the effort.” I have completely shown over the years that I can be intimate without sex, but even then: no intimacy. There is basically no physical (or verbal) affection from her at all. To be clear, I’m very attracted to my wife and I make sure she understands this. Neither one of us has any physical problems other than mentioned above. Any thoughts on what I can do to improve the situation?
a.	I’ve seen there is a Love Buster questionnaire somewhere on this site. I was going to give it to her framed in the context of what can I do to improve things. Good idea? Got any better ideas?
b.	I was then going to give her the Emotional Needs questionnaire. Good idea?


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

Go to the Men's Clubhouse and read the sticky on manning up/nice guy: http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/18181-man-up-nice-guy-reference.html

Also read the thread there on the "thermostat": http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/21278-thermostat-ultimate-barometer-your-r.html

It sounds like your wife has been able to take advantage of you because you let her.

Has your wife been to the doctor for her pain during intercourse?


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

*Re: Best advice from the guys to help this man out!*

Just from what you describe, I'd suspect she might be suffering from depression. Lack of interest in sex could be the result of some problem she thinks she has with you but not picking up after herself and showing interest in only passive activities looks more like depression to me. Does she seem indifferent and unengaged with the kids, too? Did she have close friends or family members? Has her interaction with them changed over the same period? 
My wife also suffers from depression and bi-polar and she "tunes out" to just about everything other than Farmville and TV, too. When she's feeling well enough, we ride motorcycles or work in the yard and she forgets all about watching TV or playing her computer game. I'm convinced she turns to these diversions as an escape from the depression. When she's in one of these "tuned out" moods, if I try to talk to her about it, she gets instantly snappy and hostile. Just a thought.


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## TotoWeRNotInKansasAnymore (Apr 7, 2011)

You just described the same situation a friend of mine had for many years. She has three kids, her youngest being 10 yrs old now. Her marriage was starting to show serious strain over the same issues you have mentioned. A few years ago she started going to counseling and later admitted she'd been depressed for several years. She is doing so much better now. Her and her husband seem to be much happier and affectionate also.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Would you mind going back and editing your thread into paragraphs? I just can't read big blocks of text like that.

Thanks!


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

*Re: Best advice from the guys to help this man out!*

How long has it been like this? What was it like when it wasn't like this?

Has she expressed anything about what she wants from her life for herself, or with you?


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## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

Hi FlyingFish I have a few questions so that I will be able to offer better advice in your situation.

Can I ask you what it is you do love about your wife? 

What she does that you admire and when you started to see the changes from a partnership to an unequal partnership manifest?

I'd also be curious to know how your wife behaves around you and why you think she allows you to do so much while not doing enough?

Does or has she ever complained to you and if she has/does what are her complaints?


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## ladypomegranate (May 15, 2011)

Some of this behavior does sound as though it might be from depression. It's hard to bring that up to your wife though. "I think you're depressed" generally doesn't go over well. So, you'll have to tread lightly there; without actually knowing your wife I can't help you on approaching her on that subject.

On to the issue of her lack of assistance around the house, I look at it this way. I moved with my husband halfway across the country so he could relocate for his job. I quit my job but took my retirement out and paid off my car and all of my outstanding bills. We knew that it would take time for me to get work because of this economy but we're able to live comfortably on his salary so it wasn't that big a deal.

Now, I'm a modern woman, a feminist even, but I accepted that if he went out and worked that I would take care of the home. Pretty much all I ask him to do is take the trash out. We don't have kids so running our household isn't that big of a chore anyway, so no big deal. However, now that I'm working again, he's going to have to learn how to share the responsibilities. This is how a relationship works- you share the load. Right now, your wife has decided that she doesn't have to do anything. Whatever the reason, and again, without knowing you both I can only guess, she no longer feels like she has any responsibility in your household. However, if you give her "chores" she's going to resent it. So, if you can stand it, just do the bare minimum. Feed the kids, do enough laundry for you and the kids, etc. Just enough so that you don't get miserable but not enough that the house doesn't start to get cluttered. It's a bit passive-aggressive but either she'll get the message and start to help or she won't and you'll have to change tactics. It could just be that you've taken so much of the load on to yourself that she figures she doesn't have to help.

In reference to the facebook/internet/TV obsession, my husband does this sometimes and it drives me nuts. We can't even go out to dinner sometimes without him sticking his nose in his iPhone and not coming out until the food shows up. In those instances, I let him do it but then tell him that the next time we go out, no phones are allowed. This will usually get him to stop for a while. He gets into his computer at home the same way. Eventually, I just sit and stare at him until he gets the hint. It's hard to get some face time with your spouse with all these electronic distractions, but you just have to force your spouse to put them away and socialize with the real world.

Lastly, the sex issue is a hard one. If she truly experiences pain then that's a tough hurdle. My husband has pain w/ intercourse and it makes it hard for me to initiate sex because I don't want to cause him pain. We've had discussions and he actually does want to do it, he just has a lower libido because he's avoided sex in the past. This could be part of your wife's problem, but what I find suspicious is that she's not willing to engage in other activities. This behavior leads me to believe that she has a very negative view about sex; whether this is just her personality or stems from some sort of abuse is something you need to discover. It might be good for her to try some kind of therapy that can assist her with this aversion to sexual acts. 

I hope this advice helps a little. Really, it's hard to give great advice without actually knowing you both, so if some of this doesn't sound like it applies to your situation then just ignore it. But don't let yourself continue to be used and ignored by your wife. That's not healthy. No spouse should be charged with carrying the whole relationship and household.


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## 2xloser (May 8, 2011)

I say not even close to aggressive enough.
Make a list of 'things that have to get done to sustain the household", and tell her she can pick and choose her half -- but she *will* choose. 
Tell her you suspect she's either (a) on her way to depression, and/or (b) having an affair (emotional/facebook or otherwise)... and tell her WHY.
Tell her then that you are committed to your marriage and to her, and want to help and will do anything TO help -- but she's got to meet you halfway.
Make a therapy appointment, and take her. Support her. But do not be a doormat for her. She will do this for as long as you let her. She cannot do it if you don't allow it, plain & simple. Fast-forward 1,2,5, 10 years... you want this life? Does SHE? 

Take control; fix it. You can. She clearly can't.


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## Meerkat Hat (Jun 1, 2011)

It does sound like depression/anxiety. It is a medical condition, but it is no excuse for abusive comments like "It just isn't worth the effort." That's devastating and of course you hear "You're just not worth the effort. 

I recommend a book called The Proper Care and Feeding of Marriage for the two of you to read together. And it would be good if you got counseling for yourself and then invited her along. By you going first, you can make sure the therapist is objective and understanding to all her patients. Some therapists automatically blame the man. 

Also, you mentioned she has pain during intercourse. This could all be physical, too. My MIL had similar symptoms to what you're describing (not having the energy to do anything around the house). She had depression/anxiety and Parkinson's. She's a wonderful lady, but she gets very worn out very quickly and my FIL has to do much of the housework.


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## rayne60 (May 13, 2011)

Ive been like ur wife and unbeknown to me I was in a state depression. I have said the same thing to my husband about sex and Ive let house work go. I simply did not care much about anything. The depression was due to hormones. Maybe the pain she is experiencing during intercourse is from just the lack of desire which can be due to a hormonal change within her.

A friend of mine fell into a depression and lost all her desires(including sex) after having her children because she didnt like staying home. She enjoyed working and having her own. This made her feel guilty though, she felt like a bad Mom. Because of the guilt of not wanting to be a stay-at-home Mom led her into this depressed state. I agree with the person above...you start therapy first and then incorporate your wife after the fact. If the therapist sees that your wife could be experiencing depression then let him/her suggest it but clearly you cannot!!!


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## HolyCow (Mar 18, 2011)

Wow, aside from the nitty gritty details re: job/age of kids, etc., you could be talking about me. I had to log in to post. Please check out this article on burnout:

Preventing Burnout: Signs, Symptoms, Causes, and Coping Strategies

I self-diagnosed myself after stumbling across this article. I lost the ability to care about housework (never stays done anyway), cook (kids always complain), interact with my DH (his attention is never undivided for me anyway due to kids/work/stress), etc. After 10 years of being a SAHW/M and taking others' needs and wants in to account at ALL times, I've hit this wall.

I don't know what the answer is for you or your wife, but I can tell you about me, as it may help you gain some insight into your wife and give you food for thought and questions to ask your wife. For ME: All I really want right now is about 7 days to just be turned OFF. NO expectations from anyone, or responsibilities to anyone. Only talk, eat, sleep, get up whenever I want. No "are you okay?", no "Mom, can I....?", no "I'm hungry", no "what should we do this weekend?". Nothing. Just one week where the only decision I have to make is 100% about me.

After that, I want to get a job.

I suggest that you sit down and talk to your wife, ask questions, explore, and listen to her answers or non-answers. She may not know why she feels/acts the way she does. Ask her if she WANTS to stay at home with the kids. It took me hitting this burnout wall to realize that the decision DH and I made together over 10 years ago, prior to us even getting married and having a family really doesn't work for me or my personality. At the same time, I feel guilty for not enjoying this as much as I feel like I "should".

For me, spending too much time on the computer is searching for adult interaction, something to talk about besides kids or DH's job (which I hate), and/or on forums discussing things that do interest me, but can't have a meaningful or fulfilling conversation with my DH about it because it doesn't interest him.

Also, please try to notice anything that your wife does do. I know it's hard not to focus on what she doesn't do, but chances are she has felt unappreciated and taken for granted for some time, so things started to fall by the wayside, because "no one appreciated that they did get done, anyway." Did you ever give her a big kiss and giant Thank-you for having a clean toilet? Clean sheets? Fed kids? When we had "real" jobs, we were compensated in some way or another for the work we did - praise, paychecks, etc. When our "job" is 24/7 at home...not so much. It can wears a person down after awhile.

Well that's enough rambling/complaining from me. I just had to share that I am experiencing something that sounds very similar to your wife, so thought I might be able to give you a jumping off point to have some heartfelt talks to help get to the root of the issue.


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## moonshadegold (May 13, 2011)

Ok *flexess fingers*

Let's start from square one: 

1) You guys do marriage counciling/individual counciling??

2) She cheating on you?? Any suspicion at all or just no possibility?

3) A stressed out wife means a no sex life! However sounds like she MIGHT be a little lazy and she sounds bored D: 

4) Yes I check facebook and text way too much myself. Its called an electronic addiction. Yes there is a term for that. Research more about it online...if she is indeed addicted...well there is help for that.

5) Is the sex boring when you guys had it? Like you ever do anything fun...now I know not everyone is into Kinky ness but hey a little magic shell chocolate syrup can make things really fun!  Or even some cheesy mood music, a mirror, a halloween cape and some face paint, handcuffs...etc....

6) Ever hidden her phone? lol Come on! DO IT! ! 

7) You guys sound bored! It happens! Boring begets behaviors like this. Its not like you all tried to get to this point...it probably just happened over time. Happens with daily routines and with kids makes the situation yes more common!

8) Yes sounds like burn out possibly!

9) Yawnnn ever tried doing something dorky? Like playing a board game and well you don't have to add alcohol to the mix but mms work or any favorite candy or popcorn. The point is get something fun going! Bring the "Fun" back!

10) Surprise her with sexy boxer shorts, a rose and something meal wise that she likes...preferably the kids would be with a baby sitter or family relative for the evening  And you guys wouldn't have work or school etc the next day.

11) If you have to take a space of a few days to spend time just with her and working on this do it! Its worth investing in the martial quality time!

12) Leave a cute note saying how much you love her in her lunch or purse! It really goes a long way! hehe text her a naughty pic if you dare...those are always fun well at least for me anyways... >.>

13) Be inventive and creative...just explore options in terms of bringing "the fun" back in the marriage. 

14) Ever watched Mr. Fluffy? The comedian or you could go with one you like if you don't like him! The Puppet dude is pretty funny but I know some people don't like him! Watch it together! And Laugh! Where's the laughs?!

15) Its called your equal shares! Why you being the maid for her?? She paying you?? Really where's the cash! Otherwise why you have to do all the chores, plus work, plus take care of the kids etc. She needs to pick up some of the chores. Tell her take the trash out. If she doesn't DONT PUT IT OUT! When it starts smelling she'll get upset yes but then when she starts doing the drama queen thing or complaining tell her "Gee you didn't put the can out??" Seriously, chores should be shared! 

You sound like a nice guy, who works hard and is a loving man. She should be very lucky to have you. Respectful, hard working guys are really hard to find! I should know been in a bad relationship! Just sounds like you guys are hitting a bit of a dry spot right now and with some work can get back up to normal.

Hope this helps. Good luck!

-Moonshadegold


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## wemogirl (May 31, 2011)

Flyingfish, your wife is acting the way I have acted in the past when my depression rears its ugly head. Maybe she can see her doctor about the pain during intercourse and the possible depression. 

HolyCow, I'm going to check out the link you mentioned. Plus, I'd love a week where I didn't have to take care of anyone or anything but me! Where the hardest decision to make would be what movie to watch or what book to read next. I don't think it will ever happen, though. Heck, at this point, I'd settle for a day of that!


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

How is it possible that I'm the only one that knows what's going on here? :scratchhead:

It's a very simple problem: She's just not into you any more. Just yesterday I posted this in a similar thread. The pain during intercourse has nothing to do with it. If I were told I could never have vaginal sex again in my life, but could do everything else, I'd be great with it. So would my partner. But nothing to replace it? Come on guys!

I don't know about the housework thing. It must be awful to know you are married to someone you don't love. That must be depressing. But that's the crux of it.

I recently discovered my wife of almost 20 years doesn't love me. Hasn't for a while. I'm still getting over it.

Now for the bad news. The love and attraction doesn't come back. Sorry. And I don't say that to scare you or be mean, I say that to prepare you.


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## wemogirl (May 31, 2011)

MrK said:


> How is it possible that I'm the only one that knows what's going on here? :scratchhead:
> 
> It's a very simple problem: She's just not into you any more. Just yesterday I posted this in a similar thread. The pain during intercourse has nothing to do with it. If I were told I could never have vaginal sex again in my life, but could do everything else, I'd be great with it. So would my partner. But nothing to replace it? Come on guys!
> 
> ...


You're right that she's not into him anymore. But it sounds like she's not into much of anything right now. He has to force her to go out with her friends. She really sounds just like I get when I'm in a funk. Hopefully she can get some help and get back to enjoying her husband.


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