# Would you be comfortable dating a girl who has a past fling in her social circle?



## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Would you be comfortable? If not, what would you do? Set boundaries? If so, what kind of boundaries?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

No. I wouldn't be uncomfortable because I wouldn't date her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

cyclone said:


> Would you be comfortable? If not, what would you do? Set boundaries? If so, what kind of boundaries?


Of course.

There are worse things than dating the girl who has a past fling in her social circle. Dating one who doesn't immediately comes to mind.

If you were a woman, would you date a man who has a past fling in his social circle? How many good men would you be willing to pass up ? If it's that important to you, what great benefit do you see yourself gaining?


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## ReidWright (May 15, 2014)

what do you mean by 'fling'? as in infidelity? (a small, few weeks affair behind a husband or BF's back)

or just a short dating period (sex assumed) but fizzled out and just returned to being friends only?

if the first case, no way...'a little' cheating is still too much

if the second, then perhaps, but the same boundaries that would be in place for any ex-flame (no solo outings, no excessive texting, etc). There was enough attraction for a horizontal mambo between them, and probably still is


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

Define fling and define where this person fits in their social circle?


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

ReidWright said:


> what do you mean by 'fling'? as in infidelity? (a small, few weeks affair behind a husband or BF's back)
> 
> or just a short dating period (sex assumed) but fizzled out and just returned to being friends only?
> 
> ...


She dances salsa...big group of people. I don't know the details, definitely not infidelity. She framed it as a fling. 

These salsa folks have lots of events and he may or may not be at them.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

cyclone said:


> She dances salsa...big group of people. I don't know the details, definitely not infidelity. She framed it as a fling.
> 
> These salsa folks have lots of events and he may or may not be at them.


Are you hoping to be the next fling in line, and you're just not comfortable with not being the only one? Please tell me this isn't a huge hypocrisy question.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Cletus said:


> Are you hoping to be the next fling in line, and you're just not comfortable with not being the only one? Please tell me this isn't a huge hypocrisy question.


We're in a relationship...heading towards 6 months. We both have great insecurities we are dealing with from being burned in the past.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

cyclone said:


> She dances salsa...big group of people. I don't know the details, definitely not infidelity. She framed it as a fling.
> 
> These salsa folks have lots of events and he may or may not be at them.


Non-issue.

I'd just set a boundary that she avoid dancing with him.


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## jb02157 (Apr 16, 2014)

I wouldn't date someone like that. If he remains in her social circle, she's not done with him. She wants to keeps things going with him, while dating you. No deal. If she wants to date you, you should make it clear he comes OFF her social circle.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

marduk said:


> Non-issue.
> 
> I'd just set a boundary that she avoid dancing with him.


Thanks. That's the boundary that has been set.


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## ReidWright (May 15, 2014)

cyclone said:


> She dances salsa...big group of people. I don't know the details, definitely not infidelity. She framed it as a fling.
> 
> These salsa folks have lots of events and he may or may not be at them.


doesn't seem to be a problem, unless like I mentioned, she wants to hang out solo with this guy (date type stuff), has an unusual amount or level of contact with him. Or if you can tell this guy is inappropriate with her,etc.

Also if she lied about it before she admitted their level of interaction...I'd say that's a red flag (did she 'oh, he's just a friend'! you?)


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

ReidWright said:


> doesn't seem to be a problem, unless like I mentioned, she wants to hang out solo with this guy (date type stuff), has an usual amount or level of contact with him. Or if you can tell this guy is inappropriate with her,etc.
> 
> Also if she lied about it before she admitted their level of interaction...I'd say that's a red flag (did she 'oh, he's just a friend'! you?)


Thanks.

No, she has been very honest and upfront. It just makes me uncomfortable because the past is quite extensive...

He's probably 15 years older. He used to teach her parents (now divorced) martial arts. So he knew her when she was like 10 years old. Also, there's always the possibility that her mother slept with him. The mother speaks very highly of him because this man trained her many years ago. That's initially how I learned about him.

Outside of the weird back story and her piggy backing on his netflix account early in our relationship (she removed herself from it). There has been no contact. She promises to let me know if there are any text or Facebook messages.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

jb02157 said:


> I wouldn't date someone like that. If he remains in her social circle, she's not done with him. She wants to keeps things going with him, while dating you. No deal. If she wants to date you, you should make it clear he comes OFF her social circle.


That's absurd!

The question here is exactly what Cletus said, complete hypocrisy. 

The questions you need to ask are:

1. How long ago?
2. How long did they date?
3. What were the circumstances of the break up? IOW, who broke up with who?
4. How did she feel just after the break up during the times when they were together among their friend group? Did she feel awkward? Annoyed? Embarrassed? Angry? 

The answers to these questions might, MIGHT, help you put her past relationship with this guy into a realistic perspective.

Being insecure is not an excuse to be a d!ck.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Actually, I would be more concerned about where her head was at having sex with a man that was involved with her parents when she was 10 and with whom her mother may have had sex as well.

Far more health issues their than just an ex that is healthily separated from her, in the same social circle and not really a friend anymore.

How much contact does she have with this guy anymore?

I'm not suggesting cheating at all but she was still close enough to be using his Netflix.

I'm not really sure much is healthy about this guy at all.

There are healthy ex relationships and then there are those that need cut out and the people avoided because of very bad and unhealthy choices.

This guy has a bad aroma to him.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> Actually, I would be more concerned about where her head was at having sex with a man that was involved with her parents when she was 10 and with whom her mother may have had sex as well.
> 
> Far more health issues their than just an ex that is healthily separated from her, in the same social circle and not really a friend anymore.
> 
> ...


You really nailed it for me. This isn't so cut and dry as a past fling. The background of this story just makes me so uneasy. And he has slept with several women in this social circle.

Contact-wise? There shouldn't be any. The only time she would have contact with him is if he's at a salsa event or some other outing. These folks are very social so they do plan a lot of get togethers.

I don't like to think of anyone's past partners. So, for me, every event is going to be uncomfortable. Her past is always going to come to the forefront.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

cyclone said:


> You really nailed it for me. This isn't so cut and dry as a past fling. The background of this story just makes me so uneasy. And he has slept with several women in this social circle.
> 
> Contact-wise? There shouldn't be any. The only time she would have contact with him is if he's at a salsa event or some other outing. These folks are very social so they do plan a lot of get togethers.
> 
> I don't like to think of anyone's past partners. So, for me, every event is going to be uncomfortable. Her past is always going to come to the forefront.



Dude, you need to get a handle on your insecurity! 

If you're over the age of 21 most of the women you come in contact with will have past lovers. If you can't put that into proper perspective you should be searching for a virgin, and if this virgin is also over the age of 21 chances are excellent that this virgin either has NO sex drive at all or has serious baggage that will interfere with a normal healthy sex life.

How many women have YOU slept with?


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

cyclone said:


> I don't like to think of anyone's past partners. So, for me, every event is going to be uncomfortable. Her past is always going to come to the forefront.


Icky past lover aside, this is the heart of the issue. 

Have a look at some of the retroactive jealousy threads from the past 'round these parts and see how this problem wrecks relationships.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Anon Pink said:


> Dude, you need to get a handle on your insecurity!
> 
> If you're over the age of 21 most of the women you come in contact with will have past lovers. If you can't put that into proper perspective you should be searching for a virgin, and if this virgin is also over the age of 21 chances are excellent that this virgin either has NO sex drive at all or has serious baggage that will interfere with a normal healthy sex life.
> 
> How many women have YOU slept with?


I understand. Everyone has past partners. I just don't like that I have to see the past partner


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Cletus said:


> Icky past lover aside, this is the heart of the issue.
> 
> Have a look at some of the retroactive jealousy threads from the past 'round these parts and see how this problem wrecks relationships.


Oh, I believe it. She has her own similar insecurities that are affecting a particular friendship of mine. But I can only worry about myself right now and try to deal with my issues. I know I have to fix this.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

cyclone said:


> You really nailed it for me. This isn't so cut and dry as a past fling. The background of this story just makes me so uneasy. And he has slept with several women in this social circle.
> 
> Contact-wise? There shouldn't be any. The only time she would have contact with him is if he's at a salsa event or some other outing. These folks are very social so they do plan a lot of get togethers.
> 
> I don't like to think of anyone's past partners. So, for me, every event is going to be uncomfortable. Her past is always going to come to the forefront.


This guy is bad news. He sounds like a creep. Not doing anything against the law but his ethics sound really off.

Doesn't sound like a healthy group.

Your lady could have been taken in by him and probably was. I sincerely doubt the relationship balance was even close to equal.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

BTW. I would be ok with Mrs. Conan being in a situation like this but the ex would have to be a good man and we have well over two decades of faithful relationship behind us.

My radar would be up about this guy.

You two are just starting out as well and don't really need exes in your space until you have established a strong foundation. This guy should never be around. He isn't conducive to healthy relationships. I hope you don't deal with RJ?

I don't but I would not want this particular guy around.

Is he possibly a factor in her parents divorce?

Needless to say, anyone who doesn't have a healthy outlook on your relationship should not be friends with you two and anyone who is toxic or otherwise very unhealthy to sound relationships should just be avoided.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

cyclone said:


> I understand. Everyone has past partners. I just don't like that I have to see the past partner


But you don't have to see him. Didn't you say ....



> contact-wise? There shouldn't be any. The only time she would have contact with him is if he's at a salsa event or some other outing. These folks are very social so they do plan a lot of get togethers.


So the only time this guy would be present would be at an event in which there are several other people also present. 

ConanHub is warning you that this guy is probably a sexual predator and maybe he is. What you might not see is that the vast majority of women over the age of 21 have dealt with lotharios a few times. Some have learned through experience of being burned by one, and some have learned through the experience of others. What's important to remember is that your GF now sees this guy for what he is and what he is, is not what she wants. 

Stop shooting yourself in the foot by worrying about this guy.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> BTW. I would be ok with Mrs. Conan being in a situation like this but the ex would have to be a good man and we have well over two decades of faithful relationship behind us.
> 
> My radar would be up about this guy.
> 
> ...


Thanks.

What is RJ?

She really is in love with me and I do believe that she is trustworthy, but you're right about timing and foundation. 

I think he's a good distance away...for now. It took me a few months to sort out where I was at with this dynamic between them. I still need more time to sort this out. Heck, the second time she took me to a salsa event he grabbed her hand and pulled her out to the dance floor. And since her mom has a past with this man in terms of martial arts training (as far as we know), she always talks very highly of him. I think he's more of a nuisance on my conscience than anything else right now. I hope that proves to be the case as time wears on.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Anon Pink said:


> But you don't have to see him. Didn't you say ....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks.

Funny you said "sexual predator". She had said he was not. She's very quick to defend him.

Outside of the lingering Netflix account, I guess I don't have much to say...well something is up! I just have to get out of my own head.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Salsa is incredibly sexual as well. She needs to see this guy in a not so positive light.

How old are you two, when was her relationship with this guy and for how long?

How long were they broken up before she started with you?

Did they have a fwb relationship?

Did they have any sex after the breakup?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

RJ=retroactive jealousy.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

cyclone said:


> Thanks. That's the boundary that has been set.


How does she feel about that?

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> Salsa is incredibly sexual as well. She needs to see this guy in a not so positive light.
> 
> How old are you two, when was her relationship with this guy and for how long?
> 
> ...


I am 36 and she is 31. They had a FWB relationship. I really didn't dig deeper into it...I kind of dismissed it initially in the first month or two. But then the Netflix account incident, and her mother having ties to him, etc. I started to peel the layers back and didn't like the sound of it.

Could of been a fantasy for her...who knows. She seems to be drawn to older men. Her last relationship was with a 40 something.

Part of me wants to know how many times and the timeframe of their last sexual encounter. The other part doesn't and just wants to try and let this topic die.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

farsidejunky said:


> How does she feel about that?
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


She is VERY good with it. She has not given me any grief and understands that this is a process for the both of us.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

This relationship is troublesome and worth finding out about.

Do you know if she was ever abused?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

ConanHub said:


> This relationship is troublesome and worth finding out about.
> 
> Do you know if she was ever abused?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


She was sexually abused by her first husband. Daddy issues as well.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

cyclone said:


> She is VERY good with it. She has not given me any grief and understands that this is a process for the both of us.


Then I am failing to see where the problem lies. You stated your boundary, she accepted it and is going out of her way to accommodate it. What more can you ask for?

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## JohnA (Jun 24, 2015)

Whoa, hold on. First husband sexually abused by first husband and "daddy issues"? What is the basis of her daddy issues. Look if she experienced CSA this will linger and you must be aware of her tiggers and work at creating an environment she can prosper in. See @Uptowns posts. To be clear I am not saying run. I am saying be prepared, aware, and comminted.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

JohnA said:


> Whoa, hold on. First husband sexually abused by first husband and "daddy issues"? What is the basis of her daddy issues. Look if she experienced CSA this will linger and you must be aware of her tiggers and work at creating an environment she can prosper in. See @Uptowns posts. To be clear I am not saying run. I am saying be prepared, aware, and comminted.


Her mother and father divorced when she was around 8 I think. She lived with her father full time but he mostly ignored her for the new woman in his life. She felt alone most of the time. She always feels as if nobody chooses her in life. She doesn't feel special...

Still talks to her father on the phone. So they have a relationship, just not very close. No physical abuse that I know of from her father.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

My remaining question is what are you doing with that one relationship that makes her insecure? If you think that isn't your problem, you've got another think coming.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Mr. Nail said:


> My remaining question is what are you doing with that one relationship that makes her insecure? If you think that isn't your problem, you've got another think coming.


I do martial arts. We train with men and women. One of the girls in particular is a friend of mine who I was texting here and there during the course of a week. I'm no longer allowed to text her and if my training partner (the girl) texts me, I am to tell my girlfriend.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Nicely executed boundary. Seems equivalent to hers. I'm also happy to hear you are studying martial arts.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

Cyclone,

This OM that you GF had a "fling" with uses his status as an instructor to pick up women, this is not what professional teachers do. 

Collect intelligence on who this guy has cheated with, and bust his butt to the betrayed spouses and so's.

Sounds like a narcissistic a hole, who is able to create the illusion that he is a great person. This creates a very powerful addiction in his victims. 

People in committed relationships do not maintain contact with ex'es.

Tamat


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

TAMAT said:


> Cyclone,
> 
> This OM that you GF had a "fling" with uses his status as an instructor to pick up women, this is not what professional teachers do.
> 
> ...


I agree that on the surface this guy does not look good. Thanks.


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## jdawg2015 (Feb 12, 2015)

Going give you my advice. She knows he's an ex. When a woman is into a guy typically the past and/suitors disappear on auto pilot. 

Even without the backstory, the fact she has a bf and she allowed him to grab her and start dancing would have been an issue for me. That's a line you don't cross. Not surprised if he did just make you jealous but she could have easily told him no thanks.

I personally would never accept a women who keeps her past around. 

Do you trust her? 

This is one of those cases where the backstory makes me wonder why she would not go out of her way to avoid him. Because in healthy relationships that's usually how it goes.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

cyclone said:


> Heck, the second time she took me to a salsa event he grabbed her hand and pulled her out to the dance floor.


This is exactly what it looks like!

He still considers her an option, and he staked his claim.

He will make a move on her under the right circumstances.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

cyclone said:


> Thanks.
> 
> No, she has been very honest and upfront. It just makes me uncomfortable because the past is quite extensive...
> 
> ...


*Well, at least Mom and daughter "kept" it all in the family!

Hope that there wasn't any jealousy issues!*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Ok, I personally would reject a woman for long term if she had a "fwb" relationship that she admitted to. I think that shows low character.

This "instructor" is just a ladies man that enjoys preying on his students. 

His grabbing her was nothing more than feeling you out and seeing if you would allow that. 
Definitely showing you who the so-called "alpha male" was.

I would not want my lady dancing closely with any other men, but that's just me. 

I think you should reconsider her as a longterm possibility.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

This is an unusual situation in that it's not immediately clear what is actually going on. The contact *may *be completely innocent on her part, although obviously not on his.

But it has to end anyway, because it is just too risky to allow to continue.


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## jdawg2015 (Feb 12, 2015)

That's the thing. Typically (whatever that means to me...), if a woman sees a man as "her guy", she won't put a guy in such a predicament. It's a true **** test.

The easiest way is to just avoid mixing past and present.

I can't imagine having a gf and then hanging around a place my ex would be at with high degree of certainty. Having trust doesn't mean she's needs to test it.

OP, your lack of comfort won't go away as this is definitely a messed up situation. And you are not insecure for feeling they way you do. 

I would ask the gf if there is a way to find another place or a way to avoid the guy. Be upfront. Now is the time you will see how important you are to her. 

"babe, I have been rethinking the whole dancing dumbass thing and I'm not really too comfortable having to be around your past. Can we find away to just avoid it?"

Her answer will tell you how solid she is (or not).

I speak as an American guy with a ton of male friends. Not one of them would accept what you are doing. Not one. 

An ex bf dancing with your gf? You must be kidding..... The minute she accepted his hand and danced I would have given her the middle finger and walked out the door. 



technovelist said:


> This is an unusual situation in that it's not immediately clear what is actually going on. The contact *may *be completely innocent on her part, although obviously not on his.
> 
> But it has to end anyway, because it is just too risky to allow to continue.


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## DoneWithHurting (Feb 4, 2015)

Martial arts teachers like this guy should be kicked out of the art.

He is a predator of the worst kind. teachers of MA are supposed to have "martial Virtue" which means "dont screw students.

He will take her when he feels like it.
Tell her to find another salsa group or take up a new hobby.


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

Maybe it's just the mood I'm in today, but I'm finding a lot of these responses to be a little harsh.

While I do agree that the situation is not pretty (and one that I wouldn't be okay with, either), there's a lot of conclusion-jumping going on here.

For starters, it's apparently an automatic that this guy is a predator of some sort AND that she was taken advantage of. That MAY be the case, but hey - two adults can also have a consensual sexual relationship if they so choose. I don't get the impression from OP that his girlfriend feels like she was taken advantage of, or that she has any regrets (other than the strife this has apparently caused now).

Many people have had sexual relationships, or even marriages, with people who they, at some point, wish they could erase. I kick myself at my lack of judgement over my first marriage, as well as a past girlfriend or two. Hindsight is 20/20.

In this case, the person is in her social activity circle, which is unfortunate - but happens. This doesn't sound to me like a close group of friends, but rather a group of people who share a hobby/activity/passion.

There are accepted boundaries between the two, and they appear to be honoured. She also told OP about it in the first place, which is good. No big secret.

OP simply has to decide whether he can accept that she had a "fling" with somebody she's still in contact with, or not. It's that simple. It doesn't sound like the two of them spend any time with each other alone, or doing anything other than their mutual activity.

How HE feels about the matter is his prerogative, and I think he's justified either way - there's no wrong answer.

However, to make assumptions that she'll somehow be sucked back into this guys bed, or that he's a sexual predator, or that she's somehow "broken" or their fling never really ended, etc etc etc. is crazy talk, IMO. And it's also highly insulting to a woman none of us know.

A lot of you have decided this guy is gross (and he may be) and that she's a risk to have another fling with him, like he has some sort of spell over her, or that she's not capable of making good decisions. All because she had sex with him a few times. A lot of you have taken the information OP outlined and decided she's of low moral character simply by having a sexual relationship with a guy who's not portrayed in the best of light. Everybody's assuming HE bedded HER. That she was somehow coerced into it. He's being vilified for being a Lothario, and she's being vilified for being taken advantage of. And what's worse is there's an assumption that she'll "fall for it" again. How condescending is that?


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

It is what it is--- friends with benefits. He is what he is--- an "instructor that sleeps with students (moms and daughters)."

And, he's grabbing her by the hand with her new bf and jerking her onto the dance floor-- which she allowed.

Just not what I call long-term material based on what I've read.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

jdawg2015 said:


> That's the thing. Typically (whatever that means to me...), if a woman sees a man as "her guy", she won't put a guy in such a predicament. It's a true **** test.
> 
> The easiest way is to just avoid mixing past and present.
> 
> ...


Thank you.

When that dance took place it was 1.5 months into the relationship. I still wasn't sure where I was with everything but at ~6 months in I am now in-tune with how I feel. And I don't like it. And she knows it.

The boundary has been set - no dancing, no texting of any sort, etc. She has been very willing to comply with these boundaries that have been set. Time will tell.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

cyclone said:


> Would you be comfortable? If not, what would you do? Set boundaries? If so, what kind of boundaries?


Nope. I would move on.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Honestly,
If you're having to set boundaries this early in a relationship----- that's a red flag to me.
You know what people do with boundaries? Push them. You've got a woman that will likely push boundaries constantly. 
It's up to you. The friends with benefits thing tells me what kind of person she is. I think that's not the kind of woman I'd want. You may have different standards, and that's reasonable.
I just don't go for that stuff. I wouldn't even do that, myself. If I'm having sex with a woman, it's because I think there's long-term potential or I break it off.
Just my observation


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

alexm said:


> Maybe it's just the mood I'm in today, but I'm finding a lot of these responses to be a little harsh.
> 
> While I do agree that the situation is not pretty (and one that I wouldn't be okay with, either), there's a lot of conclusion-jumping going on here.
> 
> ...


I'll bet you a brew this guy is scum. Another one that Cyclone's gf did not have her head on straight to be having this guy as a fvck buddy and a third that having this guy around is not a good idea for the future.

I agree with your other points. No real indication that she will cheat based on information available.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

It depends on her relationship with this person. I am not a fan of having my spouse/SO be close friends with someone she has had sex with. But, if he just shows up occasionally at an event and she hasn't show any interest in him at all, I'd be okay with it.


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## knobcreek (Nov 18, 2015)

I wouldn't get serious with any woman who kept in close contact or maintained friendships with past sexual partners/boyfriends. If it was a casual relationship, I wouldn't care.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

I wanted to drop in for an update.

The topic of this man came up and I boiled over...again. The girlfriend and I eventually came to terms with it and made amends.

She sent him a 'good bye' text. Just a friendly - "Thanks but I'm in love and please don't contact me". She showed me his response which was a melodramatic novel. That set off alarms in my head along with her body language...she was down in the dumps. After reading his response, I knew they had a stronger bond than I first thought.

His response caused me to snoop the following morning. I know it's wrong and it's a product of being cheated on in my marriage but I did it anyway. I didn't find any deal breakers...cheating or anything like that. But I did find many past Facebook messages between the two to confirm their solid "friendship". Invites to cancun, saying "Love you", him asking her permission if he could date one of her friends. It was all a bit much for me.

So now what? Heh, at 6 months she suggested couples therapy. Seems crazy, but that's what we're doing. I don't know where that will lead.

Oh, and one last thing - in his text response he said she could unfriend him on Facebook. Guess what? She's still friends with him on Facebook. Way to leave the backdoor open.

I guess what I've taken from opening this thread here is that I do suffer from retroactive jealousy. I got a book on it and I'm learning more. But while I do suffer from RJ, I don't obsess about her other past lovers because, well, they are in the past. I just feel uneasy about a FWB which seems to never go away.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

OMG, your blaming yourself for your feelings as RJ? Seriously??

Read Marduk's threads, the friend keeps re-appearing every few years, while she builds resentment and starts pushing boundaries again.

Couples counseling? She is feeding you shyt as a re-direction, but if thats how you want to live??? Maybe its an aquired taste.

(Edited to correct name.)


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Decorum said:


> OMG, your blaming yourself for your feelings as RJ? Seriously??
> 
> Read Murdock's threads, the friend keeps re-appearing every few years, while she builds resentment and starts pushing boundaries again.
> 
> ...


Can you kindly point me to the threads you are referring to? I would like to read them. Thanks.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

cyclone said:


> Can you kindly point me to the threads you are referring to? I would like to read them. Thanks.


Sorry I misspelled his name its Marduk

Latest thread...

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/private-members-section/225402-need-honest-advice-am-i-crazy.html

And

From 2011 after he thought he had it fixed..

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/27426-what-ive-learned-past-year-good-news-story.html

Should cover it.



marduk said:


> Tag for Marduk.


 Maybe he will stop by.


He is one of the most grounded and spot on posters here. Good luck!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

cyclone said:


> I wanted to drop in for an update.
> 
> The topic of this man came up and I boiled over...again. The girlfriend and I eventually came to terms with it and made amends.
> 
> ...


Basically what you have here is an on-going EA, and that's not okay.

It's him that's continually pushing the boundaries, and her who is, for lack of a better term, wrapped around his little finger. There's something about him that makes her feel important, and she can't let go, and that's unfortunate.

She probably doesn't feel that what she is doing is "wrong", per se. No doubt she loves you, recognizes her relationship with you, etc. She HAS prioritized you over him, however that's not really how these things are supposed to work, are they? One's spouse isn't supposed to be solely a "priority", they are supposed to be the ONLY one, and she can't seem to get to that point.

What's more disturbing is that she requires this outside interest at all. Don't blame yourself for that in the slightest. Some people have such low self-esteem that they readily accept virtually any attention paid to them from others, including when inappropriate.

My thought is that your girlfriend needs to seek individual counselling for this destructive behaviour, rather than drag you along for couples sessions.

I speak from experience. My ex wife never did this until she lost some weight and got fit. Then the outside attention ramped up, and for reasons she actually believed. Prior to her fitness obsession, she automatically assumed guys hit on her because she had big boobs and nothing else. Afterwards, it was constant attention from guys who she thought were previously "out of her league".

Even my current wife readily accepted outside attention early on in our relationship until I had some conversations about it. There are numerous posts on TAM about this sort of thing, and "how far is too far" for this type of behaviour.

Once my wife started to understand that I could provide all/most of what she requires she changed her tune about outside attention paid to her and how it affects a relationship.

Your girlfriend isn't there yet, even though she's basically been hit over the head with it. Maybe she's a lost cause.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

alexm said:


> Basically what you have here is an on-going EA, and that's not okay.
> 
> It's him that's continually pushing the boundaries, and her who is, for lack of a better term, wrapped around his little finger. There's something about him that makes her feel important, and she can't let go, and that's unfortunate.
> 
> ...


Thanks for your thoughtful response. You did a great job of summing up my feelings on this situation. It's really too bad that she isn't getting the point. I know she loves me but she just won't let go of this man and it's evident by keeping him as a FB friend. It's clear to me that she still wants to, at the very least, keep tabs on him and his life. At the very worst, a backup plan for when/if this relationship falls through. Sad indeed.

What's ironic is that when we started dating she asked me if I had any loose ends. I told her no. When I enter a relationship, I cut ties with my past. Obviously not the case for her.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*This guy seems to have a penchant for keeping his pants down more than he keeps them up ... and I don't think that it's really from a case of chronic incontinence!

Let's just say that I'd be greatly concerned that your W might be contracting his malady!*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

arbitrator said:


> *This guy seems to have a penchant for keeping his pants down more than he keeps them up ... and I don't think that it's really from a case of chronic incontinence!
> 
> Let's just say that I'd be greatly concerned that your W might be contracting his malady!*
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I agree and I even know that he does. I asked my girlfriend why no relationship? Why just a "hook up" (for about a month...which to me is not a hook up as she characterized it, but whatever). One of the reasons she mentioned is because he is addicted to sex. No ****, he ****s everyone in your salsa circle and you knew that but you still did it. 

The Facebook thing is really lingering for me now. Burning in my stomach. I just love the fact how he said: "You can unfriend me from Facebook". Why not just take her off? Because he wants her to do it...put the ball in her court to make that final decision. And she failed to do it. I'm sad.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Oh, and another thing he put in his good bye text message. He will remain friends with her mother. He laid the guilt on real thick.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Decorum said:


> Sorry I misspelled his name its Marduk
> 
> Latest thread...
> 
> ...


He is on vacation. He will likely be back around next week.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

cyclone said:


> I agree and I even know that he does. I asked my girlfriend why no relationship? Why just a "hook up" (for about a month...which to me is not a hook up as she characterized it, but whatever). One of the reasons she mentioned is because he is addicted to sex. No ****, he ****s everyone in your salsa circle and you knew that but you still did it.
> 
> The Facebook thing is really lingering for me now. Burning in my stomach. I just love the fact how he said: "You can unfriend me from Facebook". Why not just take her off? Because he wants her to do it...put the ball in her court to make that final decision. And she failed to do it. I'm sad.


*For what it is worth, a noted combination of FB and my ignorance of it(veiled as an unwavering trust of her) summarily doomed my marriage with my RSXW!

As a precautionary aside, if I were you, I would have myself immediately tested for the presence of STD's!*
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## rzmpf (Mar 11, 2016)

The guy knows how to play and she with her daddy issues is an easy prey. She will seek validation from older men and this guy will linger around and will know about her life, through the events, through other people in her circle, maybe through her mother, a surprise visit when she is at her mother's, through underground or reestablished open communication etc. She needs to get herself in better mental shape, IC is necessary or else she/he will turn to him/her when you have your first low in your relationship (and he will know about that). The train isn't wrecked yet but she has to put the brakes in or it's to late.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

rzmpf said:


> The guy knows how to play and she with her daddy issues is an easy prey. She will seek validation from older men and this guy will linger around and will know about her life, through the events, through other people in her circle, maybe through her mother, a surprise visit when she is at her mother's, through underground or reestablished open communication etc. She needs to get herself in better mental shape, IC is necessary or else she/he will turn to him/her when you have your first low in your relationship (and he will know about that). The train isn't wrecked yet but she has to put the brakes in or it's to late.


100% agree. She feels she is a damaged girl with her past. She is easy prey and that is my greatest fear...when the relationship is down she will be ripe for the picking. She claims we need to be strong as to not let anyone in but she is the one who is keeping this man alive through social media. Makes me sick that she doesn't go the extra mile to make sure he is out of the picture. I shouldn't have to tell her to do this.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

What do you intend to do, Cyclone?

It is pretty clear what is happening. 

What are you prepared to live with?

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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

farsidejunky said:


> What do you intend to do, Cyclone?
> 
> It is pretty clear what is happening.
> 
> ...


I guess at this point I plan on following through with at least on session of therapy. I think that session will be the time for me to express my latest worries about Facebook and not cutting him off 100%. I don't feel that I can do it before because it will likely spiral out of control and leave me feeling like the bad guy.

I'm a weak man in some ways. I always try to downplay my feelings. Sometimes I try to look at things objectively and think that perhaps I am the crazy one.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Can I point out something incredibly simple?

You said to cut off contact 100%. What was the stick for her choosing not to?

This is why the FB problem is bothering you so badly. You clearly spelled it out. She clearly chose to test it. And you are caving. 

Why should she listen to your boundaries when you are not willing to follow through?

I am not saying you have to "dump the *****" or other nonsense, but think about it. A boundary is only as effective as your willingness to enforce it.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## ReidWright (May 15, 2014)

cyclone said:


> The Facebook thing is really lingering for me now. Burning in my stomach. I just love the fact how he said: "You can unfriend me from Facebook". Why not just take her off? Because he wants her to do it...put the ball in her court to make that final decision. And she failed to do it. I'm sad.


eh, I don't know. Some people have EVERYONE they've ever met for two minutes as a friend on facebook. It's free, so why not?

Unless you've specifically asked her to unfriend him, or she lied about it, I wouldn't take a link on facebook as evidence of anything too deep.

good looking women will always have some guys orbiting around, watching for an opportunity, it's just a fact of life. It's how they deal with them that is important.

I think it's great that she suggested couples therapy. It really shows that she's willing to put out the effort to make your relationship work.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

farsidejunky said:


> Can I point out something incredibly simple?
> 
> You said to cut off contact 100%. What was the stick for her choosing not to?
> 
> ...


Good question. I don't why she chooses to. And I guess that's the question that will remain in my back pocket until therapy next week. 

I feel like broaching that subject now will cause a blow up. I'm not sure. I'm confused.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

What are you confused about?

Why are you afraid of a blow up?

Why are you afraid at all?

Are our best decisions made out of fear? Or out of principle? 

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

ReidWright said:


> eh, I don't know. Some people have EVERYONE they've ever met for two minutes as a friend on facebook. It's free, so why not?
> 
> Unless you've specifically asked her to unfriend him, or she lied about it, I wouldn't take a link on facebook as evidence of anything too deep.
> 
> ...


And this really nails my internal conflict...I see both sides of the coin.

On one hand, she hasn't reached out to him in anyway. He contacted her. She cut him off with the goodbye text. She suggested couples therapy. What a caring and thoughtful girlfriend. What is wrong with me?

And then the other side...

Why won't see do 100% and cut him completely off? She knows it bothers me. He said she could unfriend him...why not do it? Why keep him around? Why is it ok that she can recommend therapy after telling me a few months ago that my recommendation of the 5 love languages book was for couples in turmoil. But therapy is ok? Why do I have to cut off talking to a girl friend...with no romantic past? The list goes on and on.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

farsidejunky said:


> What are you confused about?
> 
> Why are you afraid of a blow up?
> 
> ...


See my last response for source of confusion.

I'm afraid because I feel embarrassed and ashamed it's gone this far. Our fights start because of my insecurities. We JUST got over this last fight and agreed to therapy next week, so I don't want to start another...we might not make it to therapy next week if I do.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

Cyclone,

You need to visit OM and make it known you will not allow his trespassing on your turf, doesn't matter if you break up or not. If you have any dirt on OM with married women make sure you pass it on to their H's perhaps they will take out his knee caps for you.

Tamat


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

TAMAT said:


> Cyclone,
> 
> You need to visit OM and make it known you will not allow his trespassing on your turf, doesn't matter if you break up or not. If you have any dirt on OM with married women make sure you pass it on to their H's perhaps they will take out his knee caps for you.
> 
> Tamat


THIS^^^ no direct threats though :wink2:

Like Arb said get tested and read this... https://7chan.org/lit/src/Robert_Glover_-_No_More_Mr_Nice_Guy.pdf

And I suggest ic for yourself forget couples therapy.
If you aren't calling it quits, get a var and leave it in her car for a week.
I would bail after she kept in contact with him but that is just me.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

cyclone said:


> See my last response for source of confusion.
> 
> I'm afraid because I feel embarrassed and ashamed it's gone this far. Our fights start because of my insecurities. We JUST got over this last fight and agreed to therapy next week, so I don't want to start another...we might not make it to therapy next week if I do.


If you don't make it, it won't be because of your commitment level, right?

So what would that tell you.

Now, you must consider this first. For my rationale to be effective, you must communicate clearly, calmly, and WITHOUT EMOTION. She blows up? 

"I am not okay with yelling" followed by calmly stating your boundary. 

She tries to rationalize, negotiate or other way to not close the door on this guy? 

"I am not okay with him being connected to you in any way" followed by calmly stating your boundary.

She continues? 

"It is clear that you keeping this person in your life is important to you. I love you enough to not make you do something against your will. I also love myself enough to not make me do something against my will."

Either this is important enough to end the relationship over, or it is not. If it is, communicate it as such. If it is not, accept it and stop complaining.

Your need to seek out a counselor to communicate this is akin to a referee to try to tell your wife what you are too scared to say.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

cyclone said:


> I guess at this point I plan on following through with at least on session of therapy. I think that session will be the time for me to express my latest worries about Facebook and not cutting him off 100%. I don't feel that I can do it before because it will likely spiral out of control and leave me feeling like the bad guy.
> 
> I'm a weak man in some ways. I always try to downplay my feelings. Sometimes I try to look at things objectively and think that perhaps I am the crazy one.


This is your girlfriend, right?

Who after six months of dating, you're going to couples therapy and she won't let go of a guy who is clearly her plan B and hoping to be upgraded to her plan A?

Dump her.

Seriously.

My wife and I had problems with the guy that later became her EA when we were dating. Of course he came back after we were married. And I would have avoided all of them by breaking up with her.

We now have kids, a marriage, a mortgage. And when her EA came back (because they often do)... I couldn't just walk away then. THEN was the point for couple's therapy and a lot of hard work. 

That could have been avoided, along with the pain and anxiety of having to look over your shoulder all the time and worry she's cheating...

If I would have just broken up with her when we were dating.

So do it. Dump her. Or be really, really prepared to have a lifetime of this kind of behaviour from her.


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## Whip Morgan (May 26, 2011)

Hi Cyclone,

This is more than just a fling in her social circle. Unfortunately he seems much more rooted to her history than just a fling. And apparently, others in this social circle as well.

To answer your question, no I would not be comfortable with just a fling, to answer your topic question. Your situation is deeper than that, I would absolutely not be comfortable if I were in your shoes. 

If you read some threads here at TAM or SI, you'll see that many affairs start with seemingly minor interactions or connections, and things can snowball from there. I'm not saying its a lock to happen with your girlfriend, but there are enough red flags to me that would make me realize that ultimately this will be a problem. I can easily see where this current road could lead her with this guy. I think you've seen enough cues from her that she considers him more than just a fling.

I suspect this is a dealbreaker for you, which is ultimately why you're posting here about it. I also commend her desire to seek couples therapy to help you both communicate. Its really an unfortunate situation, but her boundaries (or lack of) clearly don't coincide with yours. Good luck to you both.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

marduk said:


> This is your girlfriend, right?
> 
> Who after six months of dating, you're going to couples therapy and she won't let go of a guy who is clearly her plan B and hoping to be upgraded to her plan A?
> 
> ...


Thanks. 

I'm such a sucker...as soon as my heart is involved I try to downplay things. I mean, she definitely talks a good game and I know she loves me. But I would be lying to myself if I say the future looks bright, especially if this man lingers in the picture, which I assume he will.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Whip Morgan said:


> Hi Cyclone,
> 
> This is more than just a fling in her social circle. Unfortunately he seems much more rooted to her history than just a fling. And apparently, others in this social circle as well.
> 
> ...


Yeah...the therapy seems commendable on her part. I want to believe and have hope. But then she fails miserably by keeping him around as a Facebook friend. Ugh. Well, thanks for the feedback.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

cyclone said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I'm such a sucker...as soon as my heart is involved I try to downplay things. I mean, she definitely talks a good game and I know she loves me. But I would be lying to myself if I say the future looks bright, especially if this man lingers in the picture, which I assume he will.


Here's what you do. 

"Listen. It's obvious that there's unresolved feelings and issues between you two. I don't want to get in the way of that. How about you go figure that out without me around to stop you from whatever you have to do?"

And then don't do what I did - let her talk you out of that.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

marduk said:


> Here's what you do.
> 
> "Listen. It's obvious that there's unresolved feelings and issues between you two. I don't want to get in the way of that. How about you go figure that out without me around to stop you from whatever you have to do?"
> 
> ...


Well, if she agreed to do that, I would walk. Was that the point of your exercise?


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

cyclone said:


> Well, if she agreed to do that, I would walk. Was that the point of your exercise?


My point was for you to dump her and tell her why. In a way that is specifically you getting out of the way of her and the other guy. 

Why?

Because she's not going to go back to the other guy. But she might pull her head out of her ass for the next guy that comes along, and she might cut the apron strings with the problematic guy. 

And you should leave them better than you found them. 

But you should leave her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

marduk said:


> My point was for you to dump her and tell her why. In a way that is specifically you getting out of the way of her and the other guy.
> 
> Why?
> 
> ...


Very interesting. I understand your point.

Well, our first session is Thursday. My plan is to bring up the Facebook friends as that is now a lingering issue for me. There is also part of me that wants to confront her about it beforehand and see if I can spare myself the $20 session lol. My gut tells me that she would just remove him without conflict. But does that really make things better? I don't want to have to tell her every step of the way. I feel like these are things she should just know to do.

/end rant


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

cyclone said:


> Very interesting. I understand your point.
> 
> Well, our first session is Thursday. My plan is to bring up the Facebook friends as that is now a lingering issue for me. There is also part of me that wants to confront her about it beforehand and see if I can spare myself the $20 session lol. My gut tells me that she would just remove him without conflict. But does that really make things better? I don't want to have to tell her every step of the way. I feel like these are things she should just know to do.
> 
> /end rant


Do not go to the session. 

Those things are for married people. 

Dating is a trial run for being married. She failed. Tell her today and move on.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

Cyclone,

Just going through the mechanical details, removing OM from facebook, not talking with friends of OM, removing his contact. etc, does not mean that she understands your pain caused by her keeping him around as a plan B.

What is your GFs current stated opinion of OM?

Tamat


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Update:

I told her I'm nervous about Thursday. She asked why and I told her there is still some residual stuff. I told her that him lingering as a Facebook friend is bothering me. Her response and action was quick.

"Oh. You want me to delete him there too?"
"Okay."
"Whatever helps."

And he has been removed. What bothers me is that I have to spell out everything for her. How is it even a question at this point? We're going to therapy because of this guy.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

You are being bothered, because your gf is playing you like a fiddle.
You are already feeling insecure because she is not breaking ties with this guy and gas lighting you into thinking you're insecure. She is not longterm gf material. She is likely an attention-monger, and needs constant validation from men. You shouldn't be having this discussion 6 months into the relationship. You should be able to say xyz, and not worry about it. You're considering couples therapy in a 6 month relationship. Yes, the problem lies with both of you. But if she was taking care of business getting past "flings" completely out of her life, you wouldn't have this problem.
But it would manifest itself in other ways. You've got to develop some self confidence. Tell her what your problem with her is. If she doesn't take care of it to your satisfaction, tell her again. Of not then, move on. 
You got her-- you can get another. There's lots of em our there. 
I would let this one go. Sounds like a gamer to me. F games.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

cyclone said:


> Update:
> 
> I told her I'm nervous about Thursday. She asked why and I told her there is still some residual stuff. I told her that him lingering as a Facebook friend is bothering me. Her response and action was quick.
> 
> ...


Wrong. You are going to therapy because of both of your boundaries. 

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

So last night was another conversation about things ahead of our first therapy session today.

I knew she had cheated in her marriage. According to her, her husband sexually abused her. She fell in love...with a married man with kids and chased him for two years.

But then I play it down because she was 19. 

I then brought up the Facebook friends with her FWB. She honestly did not see a problem with it. I couldn't believe that she could be so stupid. She's a smart girl so it's hard to fathom she would think I'd be okay with that. Then she said to believe her and that this is the first time so now she understands.

This afternoon is our first therapy session.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Run.

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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

cyclone said:


> Update:
> 
> I told her I'm nervous about Thursday. She asked why and I told her there is still some residual stuff. I told her that him lingering as a Facebook friend is bothering me. Her response and action was quick.
> 
> ...


She's either talking the talk and not walking the walk, or she's just that plain naive about it all. You'll get either point of view, depending on which TAMer is giving it.

Like others here have said, I'd be done with her. It's gone on too long, it's too much, and you're the one doing all the work for her.

That said, I have two very different takes on this, based on my own experiences.

Ex wife took her stuff underground. I actually never was really suspicious of her from the get-go, but I do recall making a few comments here and there in regards to what wound up being her AP. I must have said something along the lines of "you're talking to that guy an awful lot" - but I wasn't actually suspicious or concerned, the guy lived in Europe, I'm in NA. After that point, she hid her contact with this guy.

Current wife, I believe 100%, was naive. She would have handled your situation much like your girlfriend has/is. But because I had already gone through that BS once before, I was having none of it. A series of discussions in regards to how certain men talked to her and her inability or unwillingness to shut them down (ie. boundaries), and she got it. It took a bit of work, but she got it.

She never hid anything, just like your girlfriend, was always quite open about it, but it was inappropriate nonetheless. Often (but not always) people engage in boundary-straddling behaviour without there being a real, actual ulterior motive. My wife wasn't looking to cheat, nor do I believe she would have. But she was leaving that door open in the eyes of other people, and that's not okay.

Your girlfriend may or may not be doing the same thing my wife did at the beginning of our relationship. She may be done with that guy, in that way, and have no interest in him, even as a conscious Plan B.

As far as my wife was concerned, I believe it was a combination of subconscious Plan B's as well as a real fear of confrontation. You may call me naive, but. I am the first relationship she's had that's made it past the 3 year mark, and all of them have ended because of something the guy did, so 100% commitment is difficult to come by. And the fear of confrontation is a real thing for many people. Sometimes it's viewed as easier to just go along with something rather than say something like "hey, look, I'm not interested, back off." especially when it has to be said to somebody who you're friendly with or is nice to you.

So what you need to figure out is if this guy is a conscious or subconscious Plan B AND if she's not putting her foot down about this because she's somehow afraid of confrontation and/or ruining what she may view as a friendship.

Believe it or not, sometimes people don't quite realize that somebody is only interested in them for one reason - which it certainly sounds like this guy is. Your girlfriend may like him, think of him as a friend, and not want to give that up, or hurt his feelings. But he has an angle, and that's to sleep with her. He could care less about being "friends", and perhaps she needs to wake up and see this.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

alexm said:


> She's either talking the talk and not walking the walk, or she's just that plain naive about it all. You'll get either point of view, depending on which TAMer is giving it.
> 
> Like others here have said, I'd be done with her. It's gone on too long, it's too much, and you're the one doing all the work for her.
> 
> ...


Thanks! I agree and believe she is naive. I also believe that it hurts to let go of the friendship, for her to have to make a choice. I told her directly - it's okay to want to continue that friendship, but it won't be with me. I'm okay with that. I'm not here to control anyone.


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## Whip Morgan (May 26, 2011)

Hi Cyclone,

Considering her past history...I think you're best move here is to cut ties and move on. I understand that she was young, and people do learn and change...But is this really what you want to be dealing with?


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

OMG!!!!! Please put your heart on hold here and use your head.

Common sense - so much drama, cheating, etc!!!! 

Why would anyone not run from this?

Cmon man.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

cyclone said:


> I couldn't believe that she could be so stupid. She's a smart girl so it's hard to fathom she would think I'd be okay with that..


Here's the deal. Her values and thought processes are quite different than yours. Believe her actions. What she has done in the past is what she believes is ok in romantic relationships. Unless she has a complete shift in her "ground rules" of how the world works, she isn't going to think differently or act differently.

You two simply have very different values and belief systems when it comes to relationships. She is as mystified by you as you are by her.


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## jdawg2015 (Feb 12, 2015)

OP, go read my very first thread on TAM. 

While dating my exFiance I ran into things very similar to you. We also went to a counsellor. The counsellor in my indidual session told me, "some of this is common sense". 

She knows it bothers you. You let this go too long. The first time something like this occurs is the one and only time to discuss it and make sure you align on values/boundaries.

A women keeping a man she has shagged in her FB friends. Do that make sense? It implies intent to stay in each other's lives.

She is NOT solid. This will linger in your head forever.

Listen to me and Marduk. Break up with her. You will save your self a lot of stress and anxiety.



marduk said:


> Do not go to the session.
> 
> Those things are for married people.
> 
> ...


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## jdawg2015 (Feb 12, 2015)

Once a cheater does it once, it becomes easier and easier with experience.

Women who are into their "man" definitely don't keep around men who they shagged. Nor do the have them actively posting to them while in FB while in a relationship with a boyfriend who's already complained about it. IF she really was into you 100% the first complaint about another guy like that would have been bye-bye.

Stop being weak. You let this go on too long.

But in the end she will eventually break your heart. Save yourself the misery.



cyclone said:


> So last night was another conversation about things ahead of our first therapy session today.
> 
> I knew she had cheated in her marriage. According to her, her husband sexually abused her. She fell in love...with a married man with kids and chased him for two years.
> 
> ...


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

jdawg2015 said:


> While dating my exFiance I ran into things very similar to you. We also went to a counsellor. The counsellor in my indidual session told me, "some of this is common sense".
> 
> She knows it bothers you. You let this go too long. The first time something like this occurs is the one and only time to discuss it and make sure you align on values/boundaries.


I won't post my story, but it is similar. We had issues before marriage with an ex-bf of hers. It is still a problem more than 30 yrs later! Her attitude hasn't changed. She still believes it is ok to have this person in her life, and she still believes I'm an idiot for having _discomfort_ over it.

Unless OP's gf has a total change in belief system, her behaviors aren't going to change.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

Naive? You are dating and she wants to keep contact with a guy she had sexual relations with in your social circle. She chased a married man around and keeps this guy in the wings. You are fixer aren't you? You feel guilty because she was abused by her ex-husband right?


You are the one who is naive, not her.


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

phillybeffandswiss said:


> Naive? You are dating and she wants to keep contact with a guy she had sexual relations with in your social circle. She chased a married man around and keeps this guy in the wings. You are fixer aren't you? You feel guilty because she was abused by her ex-husband right?
> 
> 
> You are the one who is naive, not her.


Unfortunately, you are probably correct.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

She's a cheater, AND has zero boundaries with other men.

You can be strong now, or you can be strong later, but you will be without this woman on your own or because she tells you to leave.

Which will it be?

You KNOW she's not long term material, and never will be.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Update:

We had an argument about finances tonight (not the first time). Last weekend we took a getaway and I spent $400. Tomorrow she wanted to meet her and her friends for brunch...and pay.

We argued for quite some time. We finally made up and decided that each person needs to be more explicit on expectations. Then she said she was going to go home.

I didn't understand. Why go home? We just worked through this together...let's sleep in the same bed as a unit. And then the straw that broke the camel's back...my son is here sleeping tonight...she said she wanted to go home to be in her bed and because she doesn't have a son yet. In other words, my son was going to disrupt her beauty sleep in the morning.

She is selfish and it has long been my belief in this relationship. I told her to leave and looked her dead in the eye and told her that she's a very selfish woman. I could tell that it hit her hard...she's probably heard that one before.

Ugh. This sucks. But it had to be done.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

The right thing is often hard.

Just like letting her go permanently.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## jdawg2015 (Feb 12, 2015)

I hope OP sees that she's not a good partner.

Keeping an ex BF around. It amazes me how people even remotely think this is going to set them up for a good relationship when the next person comes along. 





farsidejunky said:


> The right thing is often hard.
> 
> Just like letting her go permanently.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Update:

I came home from the gym last night to a box at my door step. Inside were several letters...she even wrote one for my son. Nothing in them were about asking me back but they definitely made me feel...guilty. She's a master at manipulation, I think.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Would you prefer to be with a manipulator or a woman that doesn't play mind games?


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

Satya said:


> Would you prefer to be with a manipulator or a woman that doesn't play mind games?


Agreed. I have to stay strong and not fold here. I don't want this...I just have to get over the pain short-term.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

cyclone said:


> Update:
> 
> We had an argument about finances tonight (not the first time). Last weekend we took a getaway and I spent $400. Tomorrow she wanted to meet her and her friends for brunch...and pay.
> 
> ...


So did you actually break up with her based on the quoted conversation? Perhaps I misunderstood, but I thought you just told her she was selfish.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## cyclone (Jul 7, 2014)

farsidejunky said:


> So did you actually break up with her based on the quoted conversation? Perhaps I misunderstood, but I thought you just told her she was selfish.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


Yeah, I broke up. I told her to leave, called her selfish and that it was over.


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