# Past denial...



## Riven (May 4, 2012)

How long were you in the anger stage? I went through some anger, into denial, then back into anger... 

Please tell me doesn't go on forever... certainly there has to be an end somewhere.


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## sunshinetoday (Mar 7, 2012)

It's been 4 years and I can still get angry about his affair on the rare occasion. But I manage it. And then I think about how much better our marriage is today. And I let it go.


_-- Sent from my Palm Pixi using Forums_


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

It depends what happened and how much you work on the anger and what kind of steps you take to have personal retribution (moving on productively using anger as energy/motivation) without feeding into the anger cycle. Then there might be other stuff that triggers your anger. Being vulnerable stinks, it leads to more instances of being angry, because you're vulnerable and it's easier to have your expectations even though they seem reasonable, dashed to pieces by how people treat you when they're just well, acting like their normal selves and you might not have noticed otherwise.

If you are angry, you need to attack the root causes. It's an all out battle. Be ready for it each and every day for a long long while. Because it you're not, then eventually you'll just end up being angry about being angry. lol, but not really lol.

I personally am working on a lot of anger. I'm surprised how much, and honestly if you knew me irl unless I leveled with you like I have with one good friend, you would seriously not have a clue.


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## blueskies30 (Jan 27, 2010)

I found out for sure about my husbands affair like Dec 12 or 13th and it has not gotten easier for me, but then I'm going through a lot of hard times right now, so for me I think having very hard times makes it feel worse.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Ben Connedfussed (May 4, 2012)

Riven said:


> How long were you in the anger stage? I went through some anger, into denial, then back into anger...
> 
> Please tell me doesn't go on forever... certainly there has to be an end somewhere.


Friend, it would seem to the aspect of human nature that we almost always follow these paths. This be with death or ending... finalization. The heart loves, and therefore suffers the consequences as are, whether it be the end of school year, friendship with someone, loss of loved ones through death or the end of a love relationship. You know this already!

The stages are denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance. You are aware of this.

In this case we are dealing with infidelity. But it has it's own little makeup, not as simple as actually death of someone we love. 

We get tossed to and fro between the stages of this 'hurt' and grasp for solid ground. The so called fog we experience with a loved one and infidelity makes this much harder to attain. 

It is hard to move forward. The denial and anger swiftly compete, and the bargaining sets in. He/she loves me, etc. 

Get past the bargaining stage by making a decision.
Do I love this person and does he/she love me...

It is gong to hurt more...the depression sets in.

The acceptance will depend upon your strengths and support from those around you. Get support... it is needed in most cases... loss of a loved one is devastating. 
Feel no guilt...
Acceptance of the fact of what has happen and deciding how to move forward is a big choice.
Leave and learn to love again...
Stay and learn to love again...

Big decisions. But in cases where the dishonest spouse leaves, work to get through the depression. Accept and learn to love again. 

I want to thank those here who have taught me so much as of late.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

I think some anger is going to be there at the beginning. 

I find that certain particular thoughts invoke anger in me--is that the case for you?

If I want to be instantly angry, I recollect that my husband had a couple of playdates with our children (ages 2 and 3 at the time) and the AP's similarly-aged boy. He even took them to the AP's son's birthday party.

Just imagining the AP talking to my kids makes my blood pressure rise. (I confronted her after DD#2, and she said to me, your kids are so great, they are really well-behaved, etc. I didn't change my expression, but I wanted to pop her one.)

Another source of anger is when I think of my husband as being a coward for solving the problems in our marriage by confiding in someone else.

But I had a big role in making our marriage vulnerable to an affair in the first place. Did you? Because I have this theory, that the less that a spouse can honestly say that they helped make the marriage vulnerable, the more likely they are to be furious at their betrayal--and rightfully so.

Here is how I've learned to bring anger and other unpleasant emotions under (some) control. I think of anger as a wave. I have learned to notice emotions--that is, when I feel an emotion, I label it. So I say, 'this is anger' and I experience it as if I was standing outside of myself. I feel the wave of anger crash over. If you do this enough, you will notice that the emotion itself quickly reaches a peak and then dissipates. When people speak of "feeding" their anger, they don't engage in observation of the emotion; instead, they think additional thoughts that make them even angrier. You cannot control your emotions, it doesn't work that way. But you can learn, over the course of your life, not to let them control you.

Another thing that feeds anger is dwelling on the past. When you've had a huge loss or betrayal, you are naturally going to spend a LOT of time pondering the past. This is mainly because you were being fooled in the past, and you need to reconcile what you thought was the truth with actual reality. 

If you find that this leads to sensations of anger, try thinking about the present moment. Not today--but literally, right now. You return to the present by first, noticing your own body--you are sitting, the chair presses against you, you feel your breath rise and fall. You gaze in front of you and notice what you see, etc. You don't control your thoughts, you let them drift, but if they drift into the past or future you bring them back to noticing the present moment. Try to contemplate something beautiful or interesting in the present moment. Focusing on the current moment isn't a substitute for processing the past, but it can give you some relief from obsessively thinking about an affair, even if just briefly.


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## alwaystrying123 (May 17, 2012)

Iheartlife - I have saved your comment on my computer and will read it daily, until i'm strong enough to make a decision. You are so helpful. Sorry, for butting in


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## 2xloser (May 8, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> I have this theory, that the less that a spouse can honestly say that they helped make the marriage vulnerable, the more likely they are to be furious at their betrayal--and rightfully so.


I never thought of it from this angle -- totally agree!!!

OP, the anger doesn't completely go away, but you do gradually start to learn to control it and manage it. The problem for me, however, is the anger started turning into indifference. That, I believe, is when you start to know it's over.

Like Homemaker said, it's an all out battle. I think it's one you don't win, you just fight not to lose...because in the beginning, you're losing and it is dominating you. That part WILL pass, with time and effort and attention to your own care and well-being.


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## AngryandUsed (Jun 23, 2011)

Riven said:


> How long were you in the anger stage? I went through some anger, into denial, then back into anger...
> 
> Please tell me doesn't go on forever... certainly there has to be an end somewhere.


In my case, anger erupts suddenly out of nowhere. I must also say, the frequency is much less now. 

Look, anger eruption depends on the triggers, and your reactions. Over time, I am now almost 16 months past D-Day, anger subsides.


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## Riven (May 4, 2012)

"I have this theory, that the less that a spouse can honestly say that they helped make the marriage vulnerable, the more likely they are to be furious at their betrayal--and rightfully so."

Okay, this here I agree with. The "cause" of the ONS was he was too drunk to think logically. I can't accept this, but we have a counselor who is drug certified an all of that, so I guess this is something I'm going to have to take at face value. I'm not a drinker, so I don't know. She even said that even if I got drunk off my rear I wouldn't get to black out phase because a person has to have such a high tolerance. Before this happened we were very, very happy. Finances were in order, he was going to get a job at home, we get getting along great the whole works. He says it's not my fault, he doesn't know how he could do this to me, he has a bad husband even before this, he's never been there for me, he never realized how he took me for granted, I'm perfect, I'm wonderful, the most beautiful woman in the world... everything, everything I think I want to hear it's all there. And that ends up giving me nothing to blame this on... nothing. I wish I could have something like we didn't get along, our sex life was terrible, something... but I have nothing.

We're just about 8 weeks out from DDay which is the day of the ONS. He's trying, he's sincere... 

I went through 2 hrs in the bathroom screaming crying... he got home and my daughter said that I was crying for a long time and she thought Winston died ( that's my very old yorkie, lol ). Finally he came in and just held me, comforted me, let me know he was there and everything was okay. It was the worst yet other than the first week. It was anger, it was depression, and it was denial along with bargaining all in one giant burrito with extra crazy on the side. 

My logical side knows he's trying, he wants to be then man I deserve, it knows he's hurting too, he doesn't know how he could hurt me like this. I want this to work, but I'm scared that I'm never going to get past this. I know it's still early. But my emotional side says he's looking at that girl, how could he do this, why wasn't I enough, why didn't he love me more, he must have wanted to do this because I can tell you no matter how drunk you get me I'm NOT skydiving because I don't WANT to... (this isn't a do you think he knew what he was doing thread please don't make it that) what if he wanted to do this? What if it wasn't the first time and he was just so drunk he didn't remember? Would he have told me if I didn't find out on my own? 

Then my insecurities start in picking myself apart. Usually I'm good, usually I'm not super insecure or anything. I can walk through the store and turn heads, I can go to the bar with friends and get free drinks which is hilarious because I maybe drink once a year... but no matter what I can always find someone who has something better than I have... 

I've been trying to get on the treadmill when I get upset about things like that. The worst though is right before bed, my mind starts to wonder, then I get angry and I want him to hurt, I want him to hurt like he hurt me... 

The worst is when I just feel alone, like no one understand. This is why I love that I found this forum, I can know I'm not the only one. I want to make this work, but our MC is worried that if I keep "reliving" this I'm going to destroy what's left of our marriage. You guys understand right... I don't WANT to freak out, I wish I could not do it, I wish I could be happy, but I hurt... and it's the times when we're happy that it hits me hard, like we are so happy, how could he do this?


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## alwaystrying123 (May 17, 2012)

Riven said:


> "I have this theory, that the less that a spouse can honestly say that they helped make the marriage vulnerable, the more likely they are to be furious at their betrayal--and rightfully so."
> 
> Okay, this here I agree with. The "cause" of the ONS was he was too drunk to think logically. I can't accept this, but we have a counselor who is drug certified an all of that, so I guess this is something I'm going to have to take at face value. I'm not a drinker, so I don't know. She even said that even if I got drunk off my rear I wouldn't get to black out phase because a person has to have such a high tolerance. Before this happened we were very, very happy. Finances were in order, he was going to get a job at home, we get getting along great the whole works. He says it's not my fault, he doesn't know how he could do this to me, he has a bad husband even before this, he's never been there for me, he never realized how he took me for granted, I'm perfect, I'm wonderful, the most beautiful woman in the world... everything, everything I think I want to hear it's all there. And that ends up giving me nothing to blame this on... nothing. I wish I could have something like we didn't get along, our sex life was terrible, something... but I have nothing.
> 
> ...


This is me Riven...and it's been 6 days. So sorry


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## Riven (May 4, 2012)

Oh alwaystrying, you NAME sounds like me... always trying to be good enough for everyone that is. I'm so glad we have this forum. If you want to PM me we might be able to help each other with support...


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

It's true that reliving it reaches a point of unhealthiness. But when you go through a huge loss, it takes time to process it. A very long time. Not get over it--you're never going to get over it in the sense of forgetting it or going back to your old way of being--but process that it happened.

When you describe how the emotions intensified, even though time had passed--that is because the very first reaction is simply shock. Your body numbs you because if the full impact of the terror hits you at once, you might break down entirely and be unable to care for your child or yourself. So your body dampens you initially and mutes your reaction to protect you.

As days go by, your brain starts to fully grasp that this is not a nightmare, this is not something you imagined, this really, really, happened. And what's more, it didn't happen in your presence--you were not there. You learned about it. So you know certain things, but certain other things you will never know. And so you have to accept (in the sense of, it really happened) this awful event without being able to reconstruct it fully.

I know you know this--and yet it is still so hard to believe--but an event like this was not about you. It was soooo not about you. It hurts just as much or more to say this, but he didn't do this because you're not enough. The truth is, he wasn't thinking about you at all. Ask him, and he will tell you. This is also horrible to contemplate--but the important point is, he didn't make this stupid choice because you were deficient, he made this stupid choice because he made other selfish choices (i.e., drinking to such extreme excess in a place where there was someone around to have sex with).

Honestly, I would be very angry about the ONS, blindly angry in fact; but I would be MORE angry about the drinking. Drinking to blackout stage (I have known my fair share of friends who did this in college) is extremely dangerous behavior. One friend of mine was nearly raped while this drunk; another friend nearly died of alcohol poisoning; another friend nearly died by almost choking on her own vomit.

I would be fairly sure your husband will never have an ONS again. I don't know everything, just what you've said. But will he stop drinking? That seems doubtful. If he drinks this much, and it interferes with his life this way, that is something he needs to overcome and put behind him. He is more likely doomed to having ONSs due to drinking than any other reason, based on what you've told us.

Does he acknowledge a problem with alcohol? is he trying to change in that regard? (sorry if I don't know your full story from other threads).


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## Riven (May 4, 2012)

iheartlive... thank you so much. Your words have touched me to tears. They are honest and true, and that is better than any lies. 

He rarely drank at home. He took medical leave on account of what happened and is now working from home, he is home every night, has been doing outpatient rehab and hasn't had anything to drink. He has desired to, but said that his marriage and life with me is worth more. This was his "3rd strike", one time he blacked out and flooded a motel room in a 5 star resort passing out in the shower, the second he got a DUI doesn't remember driving really, remembers getting pulled over, doesn't remember anything else until he woke up in the morning, then this... I tried fruitlessly to get him to get help, to stop drinking. In his own words he didn't think he had a problem... until this happened. 

I wish there was some way to make the hurt go away... I wish I could control it better. I wish I could do something. I am that person who helps people, it's what I do for a job, it's what I do for my friends, I'm the one with all of the answers, the one who knows where things are, how they work, why that happens... and this. This has made me feel so helpless. It took this for me to learn how to say "I don't know"... MC asks what can you do to help get through this.. I don't know. What do you think will make that better. I don't know. What do you want him to do when this happens. I don't know... It's a phrase I didn't know how to say 8 weeks ago, I knew, or I found out. No matter how much I try, I can't find out. I won't know...


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Are you in a support group for spouses of alcoholics? Because they have truly heard it all. I suspected that this was not the most extreme of his antics--the ONS may have hurt you to the core, but a single drunk driver crossing the center lane can, in an instant, kill a lot of people. 

He clearly is putting his very life in danger, as well as the lives of others, in various ways, and the ONS was just the latest manifestation.

His core betrayal is drinking alcohol and then doing all manner of things that could get himself killed, kill other people, and endanger your life (via STDs). I pray for you that he's hit rock bottom and that he is prepared to do the hard work that recovery from alcoholism requires.


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## Riven (May 4, 2012)

I think that he really has. The counselor thinks that the drinking was primarily induced by the stress from working away from home all of the time. I even hit bottom one night and got drunk, he didn't touch what I had. He knows that it will only take one drink for me to leave. I will not go through this again. 

I've attended some Al Anon meetings, they're very nice there, I have the name and number of a gal who goes daily in case I need to call her. Her AH would go an escapades, woman's, spending the works... the group is 30 minutes away so I don't get to attend all of the time. But I do go when I can.


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