# Can't figure her out! Help!



## Cgreene21 (Feb 11, 2010)

A few weeks ago, a young woman went well out of her way to contact me through a dating site. We talked almost continuously for a week, and meet up that weekend. We seemed to click well, I made her laugh and I was smitten. She stayed the night with me, but nothing intimate happened. The following week, same thing, talked constantly, and she seemed to really be into me. I went out to see her that weekend, we went out, and at the end of the evening she kissed me and cuddled up with me to sleep. The following morning we were going to go out for breakfast, but as she was getting ready she claimed she got a phone call from her mother and had to go visit her. My first thought was she was trying to get rid of me, so I got my stuff together and left. On my way out, she kissed me several more times, and texted me a few minutes after I left to let her know I got home safely. I talked to her that night, and asked her if she wanted to get together the following weekend. She said yes, she did.

So this week I know she started classes again, and has two daughters to take care of, so she is busy. and I really hope that's why we haven't been talking as much. Monday we talked a little, she had some minor surgery so didn't feel well. And was assigned a bunch of classwork. Tuesday, same, little talking, still not feeling great. Wednesday, she was very quiet but said I didn't do anything wrong, she was just busy. I asked if she wanted to still get together, she said she wasn't sure, had a lot of work to do. Yesterday I sent her flowers and waited all day to hear something from her. I called her around 5:30 last night, and she said she was on her way to the mall and her phone was dying, that she couldn't talk. I said ok, make sure you check your front door when you get home. She said she'd call me when she got home, if I didn't hear from her to call around 11. So I waited, no call. I called her, no answer. No text saying she got the flowers...nothing 

I'm still very sensitive from the divorce, and the last few women I have seen did not exactly treat me well...so I am sort of hesitant and easily spooked...I really thought that this girl was into me, but now I wonder. She made all the first moves, could she be making the first move to get away? Would it be wrong of me to straight out ask her if she likes me or not? I don't want to be toyed with anymore by anyone, and I hate this feeling of uncertainty. 

Guess I'm just really confused. Anyone? :scratchhead:


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## greeneyeddolphin (May 31, 2010)

It's hard to say if she's pulling back or not. She has some very legitimate reasons for not talking to you a whole lot. I have 2 kids, and I can tell you, that alone can make finding time to talk impossible. If it weren't for the fact that my boyfriend doesn't mind listening to me help with homework or telling the kids to stop doing whatever, we'd never talk. lol Add to that being in school, and possibly working, etc., I'm sure she's super busy and pretty tired too. And having surgery takes a lot out of you, and I know when I had surgery, I had to take the painkillers and they made me pretty quiet. 

At the same time, she could be pulling back as well. Sending a quick text that says, "got the flowers, thanks. tired, so heading to bed" wouldn't have taken more than a few seconds, and would have let you know both that she got the flowers but that she wasn't going to call, and given a good reason for it. 

The thing is, this soon anything you say about if she likes you or where this is going, could easily be taken as desperation or pushiness. I think, instead of asking questions like that, playing it cool could work better. When my boyfriend and I were first talking (we met through a dating site, too and he travels for work), we talked every night for a few nights and then there were two nights he didn't have internet. I didn't know that, so I wasn't sure if he was avoiding me or something. So, I sent him a message and just said that I thought he was pretty cool and if he wanted to talk again to just let me know. The next time he had internet, he sent me a message back telling me he thought I was really cool and he wasn't avoiding me, that he loved talking to me. He then explained that he sometimes didn't have internet, and so on, and we then had an understanding that if I didn't hear from him, it wasn't lack of interest, it was lack of internet/cell signal. Perhaps try something like that with her. She'll either get back to you to tell you she likes you so you don't disappear, or she'll be honest and tell you she's not into you. If she doesn't respond at all, then that'll tell you, too.


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

Yeah, I had a similiar thing happen to me.

Dont sweat it.

I"m going to tell you what a good female friend here advised me - 

A. Play the field.
B. String your women along.
C. A + B = Diversification. 

Think of women like a financial portfolio. WOuld you put all of your emotional investment into a Silver Mining stock? Hey, if you do. . .you could hit the jackpot. Or your mine could come up empty and then your emotions are bankrupt and you are sitting home figuring out what's wrong with you.

(and that's what you are doing here, right?)

YOu are going to get these kind of profiles on dating sites with women, dude:

_
"I want to be with the whole package. I want a relationship and I don't want any games. [LOL - those are the ones often playing the games]. I want a man who will open doors for me and I want to be able to discover love again. I want a man not afraid to cuddle but who is also confident and strong. I like to go to clubs and dancing so if you aren't into that, you can move along." _

Well, you know what? Saying you are looking for a relationship on your profile and going on about that to me, is like me saying I am looking for sex and going on about that. 

That's what it's like from MY end as the guy.

It would be like me posting:

_ I am looking for a sexual relationship. I can usually have sex daily, but 2-3x/week is fine. I am open to any position but missionary and doggystyle are my favorites. I do oral and I expect oral.

Being overweight is fine, but if you are, I want big floppy boobs in my face bouncing to and fro'_

String them along, dude.

String them along.

Take everything, EVERYTHING a date says and does with a grain of salt.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Cgreene21 said:


> I hate this feeling of uncertainty.


Why?

I understand that you were very hurt with the affair and the divorce.

All the more reason I keep wondering why you are so eager to give your heart away, and why you can't just go with the flow?

I get the sense that you still tie your own value, to whether or not somebody wants you. If that's the case, you are being premature. This woman doesn't deserve your heart yet.

Seems pretty apparent to me that you have little difficulty meeting women. Why does it have to lead somewhere? Why does it have to 'be' something?

The moment you feel like you are 'chasing' ... don't.

I agree with Scanner, you should date around. Another bizarre truth about dating? The more women you're dating, the more interested women will be. Start building a 'ho posse'.

I've stated as much before, and got flack for it ... but I stand by my statement. IT IS A GAME. All of it. Even those who espouse they don't play games, are playing games. All of the women who claim they are tired of 'playing games'? Guess what?

They are tired of it because they consistently are attracted to the guy who knows how to play them. _That's the guy they keep gravitating to_

Knowing the rules doesn't make you a bastard. It makes you successful. The more successful you are at knowing who to date and who to dump, then you will invariably find that person worthy of giving the gift of your love. But if you flaunt the fact that you are looking to give love to whoever will take it ... to them, it looks cheap, and they lose interest.


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

Deejo:

Hi fi!!!

You are upgrading yourself if you become a guy who plays games. Because a needy, clingy guy is lower than a guy who plays games in the female book.

OP,

Diversify your portfolio.

Next month, I'd like to hear about how you are trying to juggle a couple of women and how to do that.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

Scannerguard said:


> Deejo:
> 
> Hi fi!!!
> 
> ...


What is the end game here? I totally agree that being needy is a total turn off. But what is the point of being standoffish? Or is playing the field the desired end game? It sounds like the OP is looking for a relationship.


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

Oh yeah, flowers often scare women. A lot of women really don't know how to handle that one - how to just accept a nice, chivalarous gesture for what is and nothing more.

A lot of women really don't know how to handle any kind of chivalry - holding doors, opening doors for them, standing up when the leave, putting your coat around them if they are cold, etc.

It may work in Europe or Asia (or may even be expected). . .but in the US. . .that's a real crapshoot.

Women tend to only want flowers after they've been married for 15 years, cooking, cleaning, doing homework, and working a job.

Now all of that being said, if she didn't at least thank you for the flowers you sent, there's no other way to summarize this in that she's definitely not worth it.

Even when I have been turned down, a good woman (and it can vary from the cashier to the PhD), will say, "I am really flattered. . .but. . .I don't think we are right for each other. I appreciate the interest." And I think some women really mean it - they ARE flattered. And that means a lot, to at least recognize your affections.

How old is this knucklehead? The reason I ask is women often under 28, who are clubbing and have all kinds of men chasing their tail. . .they don't have to show respect. They know they have the upper hand because they have what a lot of men want - a nice piece of tail. Guess what though? You hopefully have what a lot of women want - stability.

I'd be really surprised to hear that a woman over 30 and very suprised a woman over 40 got sent flowers and she didn't even say "Thank you but you are going too fast for me." or something. . .Just ignore you?

Sheeeeeeeet, dude. . .toss her back. There are plenty of over 30 and 40 women out there to put up with THAT.


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

End game: The relationship is the "chip" he holds. . .it's what women want. . .men want sex.

He's tossing that poker chip out onto the table too soon. 

Throw out a dating chip. She throws out one. He throws out a second date chip. First kiss chip. She throws out one. 

Sex and relationship chips should be thrown out into the pile in the game at nearly the same time. 

If he throws it out too soon, she will figure it's not worth much. It's sad. . .but that's the game. 

I am building my "ho posse" like he suggests; I am a little more mainstream I guess and call it my "Little black book", lol.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

Scannerguard said:


> End game: The relationship is the "chip" he holds. . .it's what women want. . .men want sex.


Ew. THAT explains the hard time I always had! Men expected me to want a relationship! Drat. Well at least for me, that ship has sailed.



> He's tossing that poker chip out onto the table too soon.
> 
> Throw out a dating chip. She throws out one. He throws out a second date chip. First kiss chip. She throws out one.
> 
> ...


I never played that game. Kind of a sick game, if you ask me.



> I am building my "ho posse" like he suggests; I am a little more mainstream I guess and call it my "Little black book", lol.


So you don't want a relationship? Not now? Not ever? Only if Miss Really Right comes along? I don't know where you are post marriage...


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

Scannerguard said:


> End game: The relationship is the "chip" he holds. . .it's what women want. . .men want sex.


One other thing that makes no sense. Why play games with chips when you can just find another person who wants sex? I mean, I DO remember the game a bit. It has been a LONG time for me. But there ARE women out there who also just want to watch football and screw. If that is what you want, why play relationship games?

I may be looking at this from an engineer point of view and missing the big picture. This is where my husband laughs at me and calls me android.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

vthomeschoolmom said:


> One other thing that makes no sense. Why play games with chips when you can just find another person who wants sex? I mean, I DO remember the game a bit. It has been a LONG time for me.* But there ARE women out there who also just want to watch football and screw. If that is what you want, why play relationship games*?
> 
> I may be looking at this from an engineer point of view and missing the big picture. This is where my husband laughs at me and calls me android.


You know? I tried that personal ad, "Wanted: avid sportsfan and sex-freak."

Care to guess what the response is to that kind of honesty?

Fact remains, you still have to meet, be attractive to, and bond with 'sports-fan-sex-freak-girl'. That doesn't just _happen_. Yes, you're right, those women are out there, but you still play the game to find them. They don't just show up if you blow a whistle ... much to my chagrin. 

From my point of view there is a world of difference between knowing the game and being a 'player'. I'm not a player. I'm certainly not encouraging anyone else to be a player ... but they should be aware of the game.

You discover that you have found sports-fan-sex-freak-girl once you have WON her over - whether either of you wants a relationship or not. That's game, and has nothing to do with being dishonest, manipulative, or evil.

Which is the point with CG. He does want a relationship, and if that is the vibe he is giving off to our imaginary sports-fan-sex-freak girl, then she isn't going to be interested - and that has nothing to do with the personal character of CG. They're playing the same game, but with different chips is all. However, if CG wants to attract sports-fan-sex-freak-girl, playing the 'relationship' chip is counter-productive. If he can enjoy the relationship for what is and wherever it's going to go without trying to cultivate a long-term partner, that isn't a bad thing. It doesn't mean that he isn't being true to himself. This was the hurdle I had to get over - and did. 

That's the whole point. From an engineering perspective, think of it like a 'case' statement to account for different conditions.


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## moonangel (Jan 19, 2011)

I'll make it quick for you. She doesn't want you. Move on.

...but if you like her playing with your fragile heart...go ahead.


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

What Deejo said. . .

I would love to put out an ad too. . . I want the 4 S's. . .

Safe
Sane
Sexual
Single

And even the last one is optional with my lifestyle.

But sanity and sexuality seem to often run in opposition.

Just ask my psychiatrist.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

Deejo said:


> You know? I tried that personal ad, "Wanted: avid sportsfan and sex-freak."
> 
> Care to guess what the response is to that kind of honesty?
> 
> Fact remains, you still have to meet, be attractive to, and bond with 'sports-fan-sex-freak-girl'. That doesn't just _happen_. Yes, you're right, those women are out there, but you still play the game to find them. They don't just show up if you blow a whistle ... much to my chagrin.


Holy CRAP. I have new sympathy for the scene in which you find yourself. What a drag.


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

> Holy CRAP. I have new sympathy for the scene in which you find yourself.


Whereever you go, there you are.

LOL (always like that stupid joke)

Anyway, Deejo may want a sports-fan sex freak kind of gal. It's his right to be specific in his goal. 

I am less specific and just want the 3 S's with "Single" being the Powerball in the mating lottery.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Sympathy?
Don't know what dating and falling in love looks like in Vermont, but the fact remains it's a process. It's work ... fun work mostly. As an adult, it has none of the charm, innocence or simplicity of meeting 'the girl of your dreams' in high school.

Sports-fan-sex-freak-girl and my dating headline are parables.

Doesn't matter if it's sports-fan-sex-freak, or sweet-polly-pure-bread.

My point being that if CG wants to find love, the right love, be selfish, not selfless. In this particular case, given what little he posted about this woman, she sounds like a great Ms. Right Now, but certainly not Ms. Right.


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## Zammo (Aug 9, 2010)

I do the online dating thing a lot.

I am always corresponding with at least four women simultaneously. Women play "the game" instinctively. It's so instinctive that they don't even know that they are doing it.

So, I play the same game... not answering the phone, delayed responses to text messages, canceling dates at the last minute, making it clear that I'm busy with a tight schedule, etc.

Men simply must play equal or better game.

The overall problem with online dating is this:

Internet dating has been studied by sociologists and psychologists and it is addictive as it gives you a "false feeling" of abundance and that *makes us demand too much, reject too quickly, and ironically offer too little*.


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

Zammo,

I like that synopsis and it does bring a little balance to the "game" that is afoot with online dating.

I have to say. . .as a guy who is 42, willing to date women 28 to 48, I do seem to have a lot to choose from online. . .on a superficial examination - the odds favor me. But I am finding just because there is an "abundance", doesn't mean there isn't a false sense of abundance like you note.

It's like attorneys - there are lots of them. Try finding a good one or let's just say one that's a match for you - more difficult than it seems. 

I had a woman contact me from a 100 miles away saying what I wrote really spoke to her - I was puzzled though - at 100 miles away, what would she feel the nature of that kind of relationship would be? Fling? FWB's? I am not sure. I was very flattered she contacted me though - seriously.

But I like the last part with rejecting too quickly. . .that is true. . .let's face it - some compromise is in order. Compromise is a good thing, not a bad thing. It's how you do end up happy and in love. It's how healthcare laws are passed (well, those you can jam down the people's throats but that's another story, lol)

If you become so specific as to want a sports-loving-sex-freak, chances are you'll never find that, and die old, alone, shriveled up, pennyless and insane. . .wait. . .those last 2 are me. . .


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