# Almost sexless marriage



## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

Hi guys and guls 
I've just turned 40 and ive been in a nearly sexless marriage for nearly 15 years, I found this forum yesterday as I looked for somewhere to voice my concerns over my marriage. 
When we first started dating nearly 21 years ago it was great we had sex pretty much every night, untill she went to collage she made new friends and as it was a agricultural collage she made alot of male friends, one in particuler she got close to, i was in the reserves army and working shift work and she would see him "as a friend" whilst I was away training or working, i really didn't like this as I didn't think men and women could be close friends and not get intimate she would say how they would watch movies together and would say nothing happened but I just couldnt handle it and I ended up seeing a hypnotherapist to help with my jealousy and it did work after i didnt care if she was with him and thats how it went on until we bought our first house together, the sex was still great but the excuses started to come, we got married shortly after and had our first son then it went down hill from then on she was never in the mood or to tired.
(Funnily as soon as we had out first son her best "friend" disappeared until the invention of Facebook, where he's now married and lives 200 miles away).
Which I respected as we had a baby to care for, we took it in turns to do the night feeds and it worked out well.
We moved to a bigger house and we had our daughter, after then it was as though someone had flicked a switch to her libido to off, I tried everything whilst working full time doing 60hrs a week, housework, flowers you name it i did it and still do though not the flowers as she says it's a waste of money, I even had a vasectomy so to take away the worry of getting pregnant and that didn't work(I really thought that would work).
Skip forward to now and it's still the same though now I work 9-5 and I'm home every night and weekends, I cook every meal get the kids school lunches ready most mornings before work.
I normally go to bed at around 10pm but she normally stays up later and watches TV when she does come to bed with me I try it on she just shrugs me off and says she not in the mood or tired and then looks at facebook on her phone for the next hour, normally till I pass out.
Now I've made it sound as though she an ogre but she is a loving wife and mother, she works hard,working full time and keeps the house lovely.
But it's just when it comes to me she says she has no energy but she has the energy to ride our horses pretty much every day.
I have thought about having an affair I've had the chance about 4 times now with 4 different women but I don't as I love my wife and always will.
I need sex to feel loved and when she turns me down constantly it makes me feel unloved unwanted and unappreciated. 
I don't know what to do I don't want a divorce for the kids we don't fight and we do act all lovey dovy most of the time.
Thanks for listening.

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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Have you ever sat down and had a serious talk about how you can't deal with this sexless marriage any more? Of what the effects of it may be? The temptations that you face?


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

You did your duty as a sperm donor. Now you're an ATM.

Seriously.


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## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

Diana7 said:


> Have you ever sat down and had a serious talk about how you can't deal with this sexless marriage any more? Of what the effects of it may be? The temptations that you face?


No not a serious talk, I have said to her that I would like more sex in our marriage but she just says (is that all I think about).



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## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

Malaise said:


> You did your duty as a sperm donor. Now you're an ATM.
> 
> Seriously.


An atm that does the dishes also...

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## cc48kel (Apr 5, 2017)

Why not suggest counseling? And when you set up an appointment make sure it's someone like a sex therapist. If she refuses then you know where you stand in the relationship.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Why do YOU act all lovey dovey, as you said, with a woman who refuses to have sex with you??

I'd start there in analysis of the situation.


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## C3156 (Jun 13, 2012)

Lonelygent1977 said:


> I need sex to feel loved and when she turns me down constantly it makes me feel unloved, unwanted, and unappreciated.
> I don't know what to do I don't want a divorce for the kids we don't fight and we do act all lovey dovy most of the time.


Have you mention how you feel to your wife? (like you listed above?) It is surprising how many women don't understand that intimacy for a man is more about the physical aspect, as opposed to women, who get more from the emotional aspect. 

If she tells you that you are full of it, ask her to go with you to a counselor (or two). They may be able to help her see how her withholding is affecting you emotionally.


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## 23cm (Dec 3, 2016)

Believe me, I know how hard it is to talk with wife about these matters. I'm a poster-child for bad communication. 

Intellectually, I know that if you keep doing what you've always done, you'll keep getting what you've always gotten. Advice on TAM and elsewhere usually is to "Alpha-up." 

So, I'm on that route. My wife's defense is never to say "no." Probably because her mother told her that if "you deny your husband, he'll get it somewhere else." Yes, another time. 

So, she doesn't deny, she just puts out chore sex, deadfish sex, and when I'm lucky, vanilla sex--hey! at least vanilla is a flavor. 

Oh, she also pretends to be asleep. Hides on the other side of a body pillow, Comes to bed late if I'm in bed, and/or bails out early in the morning. There's the great "playing possum" routine and of course the always wonderful UTI and lower back pain. 

So, the take away from my little screed; you're younger than me. Gather your guts together and have the definitive talk. There's a reddit forum on deadbedrooms that has lots of useful info...also painful stories.


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## Noble1 (Oct 25, 2013)

Is the "friend" still in the picture somehow?


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Lonelygent1977 said:


> No not a serious talk, I have said to her that I would like more sex in our marriage but she just says (is that all I think about).
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


Well being that you haven't had sex for years its hardly all you think about is it. if it was, you would have left long ago.

I think you have to sit her down and tell her exactly how deeply it is affecting you, the depth of your unhappiness, the temptations you are facing, how important sex is for a marriage etc. Maybe even write it down if its easier. 
Its just cruel for a husband or wife to deprive their spouse of sex for months or even years.


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## Suspicious1 (Nov 19, 2017)

C3156 said:


> Have you mention how you feel to your wife? (like you listed above?) It is surprising how many women don't understand that intimacy for a man is more about the physical aspect, as opposed to women, who get more from the emotional aspect.
> 
> If she tells you that you are full of it, ask her to go with you to a counselor (or two). They may be able to help her see how her withholding is affecting you emotionally.


Agree 100%

I just said this to my wife , and pretty much told her our sex has been in the dumps lately.

I don't think she understood the depth of what I was saying, there's certainly a disconnect and what it means when men ask for sex. Socially speaking punch line and laugh tracks is to be usually expected.

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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Start with reading MW Davis Sex Starved Marriage and Glover's No More Mr. Nice Guy. Then read Chapman's 5 Languages of Love to get an overview.

Remember you can't change your wife, you can only change yourself and what you will accept. That may or may not cause her to change in a positive way.

Have you tried talking to her? Have you tried to change yourself in a way that makes you a more loving husband and a less codependent husband? 

Marriage Counseling with a sex therapist is also a plus.

Good luck


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

OP I went thru a similar situation as you. Unfortunately the issue was not resolved amiably and we are now divorced. Like you I had approached my wife any number of times with my concerns. Like you I was similarly rebuffed. In fact, I was told that my concerns were stupid and besides how dare I keep track. I was made to feel like some kind of sex maniac simply because I thought that perhaps more than once every other week or so would be nice. It caused me severe trauma. I was made to feel like a sex fiend, yet I knew that all over the world people risked life, limb and treasure over it. Nations went to war over it. It made no sense to me.
After my divorce, I came to the conclusion that, I had allowed my life to get to that point. I had not advocated for myself and had such low self esteem that when I was faced with the wrath of my wife I would crater rather than stand tall and defend my thoughts.
So I decided that from now until I die, I will never back down, when it comes to my needs ever again. That does not mean I will force anyone to fill them. But should they choose not to, I feel well within my rights to pursue them elsewhere. I will no longer allow my needs to go unmet. If someone is not willing to make an effort, they have proven to me they are not worthy of my own.
So sit your wife down. Tell her exactly how you feel. Tell her what you want. If she decides you aren't worth the effort, you will know that neither is she.


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## GreenOrb (Feb 14, 2018)

Ynot said:


> OP I went thru a similar situation as you. Unfortunately the issue was not resolved amiably and we are now divorced. Like you I had approached my wife any number of times with my concerns. Like you I was similarly rebuffed. In fact, I was told that my concerns were stupid and besides how dare I keep track. I was made to feel like some kind of sex maniac simply because I thought that perhaps more than once every other week or so would be nice. It caused me severe trauma. I was made to feel like a sex fiend, yet I knew that all over the world people risked life, limb and treasure over it. Nations went to war over it. It made no sense to me.
> After my divorce, I came to the conclusion that, I had allowed my life to get to that point. I had not advocated for myself and had such low self esteem that when I was faced with the wrath of my wife I would crater rather than stand tall and defend my thoughts.
> So I decided that from now until I die, I will never back down, when it comes to my needs ever again. That does not mean I will force anyone to fill them. But should they choose not to, I feel well within my rights to pursue them elsewhere. I will no longer allow my needs to go unmet. If someone is not willing to make an effort, they have proven to me they are not worthy of my own.
> So sit your wife down. Tell her exactly how you feel. Tell her what you want. If she decides you aren't worth the effort, you will know that neither is she.


I'd strongly echo these sentiments.

OP, I'm in a similar situation to you with my wife, however maybe a step or two ahead in terms of trying to resolve it. The first thing that helped me was realising that I was well within my rights to want sex in my life and my marriage. Just like you I was being made to feel like I was some kind of perv for wanting sex, but this is wrong. Many men get their primary feelings of love in a relationship from being physically close with their wife, however women often appreciate other things, e.g., doing the dishes, presents, cooking a good meal, etc. So you need to have a conversation with your wife and get this message across.

The 5 Love Languages has been recommended above and is a good book which may help you understand what the things are that make your wife feel loved by you. It may be that despite all the things you are doing in the marriage (of which it sounds like there are a lot) you may not be doing the things that actually make your wife feel loved, and therefore she doesn't feel motivated to do anything that might make you feel good. Get her to do the 5 Love Languages test and see what they are.


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## Tatsuhiko (Jun 21, 2016)

As Dan Rather's friends would ask, "What is the frequency, Kenneth?" I mean how often are you having sex? Once a week? Once a month? Once a year? Frankly, I'd be miffed if my wife had enough time to ride horses but didn't have time to make me feel loved.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

From what your wrote I feel that her relationship with this OM was at least an EA, likely a PA perhaps once or twice.

She may view the OM as the love of her life while you are just the man she married. She fell out of love with your when she fell in love with him. He may remain a fantasy of hers.

DNA you kids, unless they look exactly like you.

Get your Vasectomy reversed if you can, get your bullets back, if she doesn't like it tough.

Quietly snoop on your W, if she's not cheating fine, if she is cheating then no amount of housework, affection, money or thoughtfulness will make a difference. It will help you decide if you want to waste more years with a woman who has no desire for you, but gives no believable reasons.

Tamat


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## Townes (Jan 31, 2018)

I had this problem with my significant other early in our relationship. I eventually just had to say if we don't have more sex, I'm ending the relationship. I meant it too. Whenever it started slipping back into our old pattern I would tell her again. It took about 3 or 4 times of that but it hasn't been a problem in the 4 years or so since then. What if you just spelled it out for her like that and made those the only two options? If your wife would rather get divorced than have sex with you, do you really have much of a marriage to begin with? I mean think about that. It would be better for your wife to get divorced than have sex with you. At some point it's just a matter of having some dignity as a man. If she doesn't have to change she won't. Why would she? You have to quit making it optional.


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## 2arebetter (May 3, 2016)

Bring it up and bring it up again. 

My wife (soon to be ex) DIDN'T bring it up and it all went downhill from there until a point things weren't able to be reconciled. Suggest counseling, reading a self help book together (take turns), try something new together to help break monotony. If I could go back before my marriage started trending down, I would do more to make my SO feel wanted or special. But, I didn't because I had a fragile ego. 

Talk it out before it becomes the wedge between you and her.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

She has no interest in sex because the guy she enjoyed sex with moved away. Unless your kid looks just like you, I would suggest DNA testing. Strange that it all ended with the affair partner at that moment.


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## As'laDain (Nov 27, 2011)

Lonelygent1977 said:


> An atm that does the dishes also...
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


stop doing the dishes. if you have a joint account, separate your money into your own. dont put her on the account. move money into whatever account the bills come out of. if she over draws that account, have the bills come out of your account instead and just dont move money over. 

stop doing chores, stop helping her out. stop cleaning, stop cooking, stop doing all of it. when she asks you what is up, tell her that you are preparing to move on because you refuse to waste any more effort in a marriage with a wife who simply refuses to speak your love language. tell her that you are so fed up with having your needs belittled and ignored that you don't even know if you want to be in the marriage anymore. tell her that she has thoroughly convinced you that she does not care about how YOU actually feel, so you are deciding to see how it would be if you were single and not acting like a servant. 

when she tells you that all you want is sex, tell her that all she wants is a servant and an ATM. but, since you aren't getting the fulfilling sex life, you aren't going to give her the cushy life that she does absolutely nothing to deserve. 

just, one caveat: don't bother if you don't have the stones to follow through and stick to your guns. she will try to convince you that you are somehow wrong. you aren't. right now, your words don't line up with your actions. you say you want sex, but it must not be that important to you because you haven't changed anything. if it really does mean something to you, then let her experience what it is like to be deprived of your partners love.

again, because this is important: don't even bother if you don't have the stones to follow through.


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## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

TAMAT said:


> From what your wrote I feel that her relationship with this OM was at least an EA, likely a PA perhaps once or twice.
> 
> She may view the OM as the love of her life while you are just the man she married. She fell out of love with your when she fell in love with him. He may remain a fantasy of hers.
> 
> ...


Yes you could be right , though could you tell me what om/ea/pm means please I'm new to this lol I'm guessing om stands for other man.
The kids are definitely mine they are the spitting image of me.
I doubt I'll get a reversal as it hurt like hell and I don't want any more kids.

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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

EA= emotional affair

PA= physical affair


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

Lonelygent1977 said:


> When we first started dating nearly 21 years ago it was great we had sex pretty much every night, untill she went to collage she made new friends and as it was a agricultural collage *she made alot of male friends, one in particuler she got close to,* i was in the reserves army and working shift work and *she would see him "as a friend" whilst I was away training or working,* i really didn't like this as I didn't think men and women could be close friends and not get intimate s*he would say how they would watch movies together and would say nothing happened* but I just couldnt handle it and I ended up seeing a hypnotherapist to help with my jealousy and it did work after i didnt care if she was with him and thats how it went on until we bought our first house together, the sex was still great but the excuses started to come, we got married shortly after and had our first son then it went down hill from then on she was never in the mood or to tired.
> (Funnily as soon as we had out first son her best "friend" disappeared until the invention of Facebook, where he's now married and lives 200 miles away).
> I have thought about having an affair I've had the chance about 4 times now with 4 different women but I don't as I love my wife and always will.
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
> ...



The above is where a PA could have happened.

The part in red was a fail. It wasn't jealousy, it was your gut telling you to protect your marriage.


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## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

23cm said:


> Believe me, I know how hard it is to talk with wife about these matters. I'm a poster-child for bad communication.
> 
> Intellectually, I know that if you keep doing what you've always done, you'll keep getting what you've always gotten. Advice on TAM and elsewhere usually is to "Alpha-up."
> 
> ...


Yes my wife is the same, it's always not tonight maybe tomorrow if I'm not to tired or you have to be up for work early in the morning.
And 9 times out of 10 when we do have sex it feels like pity sex and she lies there motionless like a shop mannequin, waiting for her choir to finish.

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## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

Noble1 said:


> Is the "friend" still in the picture somehow?


To my knowledge no he lives on the other side of the country where he's married and has kids.

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## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

Young at Heart said:


> Start with reading MW Davis Sex Starved Marriage and Glover's No More Mr. Nice Guy. Then read Chapman's 5 Languages of Love to get an overview.
> 
> Remember you can't change your wife, you can only change yourself and what you will accept. That may or may not cause her to change in a positive way.
> 
> ...


No we haven't talked my wife is like a closed book it's next to impossible to talk to her.

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## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

GreenOrb said:


> I'd strongly echo these sentiments.
> 
> OP, I'm in a similar situation to you with my wife, however maybe a step or two ahead in terms of trying to resolve it. The first thing that helped me was realising that I was well within my rights to want sex in my life and my marriage. Just like you I was being made to feel like I was some kind of perv for wanting sex, but this is wrong. Many men get their primary feelings of love in a relationship from being physically close with their wife, however women often appreciate other things, e.g., doing the dishes, presents, cooking a good meal, etc. So you need to have a conversation with your wife and get this message across.
> 
> The 5 Love Languages has been recommended above and is a good book which may help you understand what the things are that make your wife feel loved by you. It may be that despite all the things you are doing in the marriage (of which it sounds like there are a lot) you may not be doing the things that actually make your wife feel loved, and therefore she doesn't feel motivated to do anything that might make you feel good. Get her to do the 5 Love Languages test and see what they are.


I've tried to tell her that men need sex to feel loved but she just said as normal..is that all you think about.
I will look into that book and see if it can make a difference.

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## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

Tatsuhiko said:


> As Dan Rather's friends would ask, "What is the frequency, Kenneth?" I mean how often are you having sex? Once a week? Once a month? Once a year? Frankly, I'd be miffed if my wife had enough time to ride horses but didn't have time to make me feel loved.


I downloaded a app that's a sex diary and since Christmas we have had sex 4 times.

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## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

Malaise said:


> The above is where a PA could have happened.
> 
> The part in red was a fail. It wasn't jealousy, it was your gut telling you to protect your marriage.


Yes your right at the time it felt like I was the one with the problem that needed fixing , but looking back on it now I should have been stronger, I think I was worried she would leave me for him as he was much better off than me as his family owned a farm with plenty of land and I had nothing just the shirt on my back.

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## Cromer (Nov 25, 2016)

All I can say is read some of my thread. Skip to page 25 for the good part. http://talkaboutmarriage.com/considering-divorce-separation/378298-getting-ready-drop-news.html


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

Lonelygent1977 said:


> No not a serious talk, I have said to her that I would like more sex in our marriage but she just says (is that all I think about).
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


my friend *shaking my head* You had a cut in to ensure she doesn't get pregnant because you want sex that bad. I would say that is pretty serious.

If you don't want divorce then you better get comfortable with the way things are because that is the way things will stay. You're not going to convince her otherwise.

How bout you buy them realistic sex dolls, I'm sure your wife won't mind and it's better than having an affair.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

​


Lonelygent1977 said:


> I downloaded a app that's a sex diary and since Christmas we have had sex 4 times.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


No you've not had sex four times. You released four times and she just lay there *according to you* It's like masturbation with a live person.


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## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

BobSimmons said:


> ​
> No you've not had sex four times. You released four times and she just lay there *according to you* It's like masturbation with a live person.


Very true she used to be wild in bed doing everything but now she comes up with excuses like her hips hurt if she goes on top but yet can ride a horse for hours I'm not that wide lol ,it's just turned into vanilla sex now not very exciting at all.

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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

OP. What I see here is you following the same path as countless other men that end up in these forums asking for advice about what to do, and keep going, and going, and going trying whatever new advice, with the same result over and over: STILL NO SEX, and the years just roll and roll until 5,10, 15, 20 years laters you find yourself looking back on your life how it passed you by, and you're still in the same sexless, by now soulless relationship.

Why? Because you, just as most of the other men that post here asking for the same do not have the balls to do what needs to be done. Your weak, passive demands that have not teeth to them, just fly by your wife.

Guys like you are afraid (sometimes terrified) to man up, to react alpha and make no demands, but issue an ultimatum instead, and follow through. This is what you need to do. She's not going to change (they seldom do), your acceptance of the situation is what needs to change.

You have to choices: accept your situation and stop nagging and complaining or man up and accept that your marriage is toasted and get out if it. You will be divorcing your wife, not your kids, you go 50/50, and be the best co-parents you can be to your kids.

Whatever her reasons: she's not longer attracted to you, she's holding onto another man in her head, or just plainly, lost her libido, I doubt that there's much left for you to do. Probably the shock of being serve with divorce papers could be the catalyst to bring her back, but I doubt it.

When my first wife pulled that crap on me, I acted very decisive, and to the point: after three months of no sex I dump her and divorce her. To this day (been over two decades ago) she's sexless. Can you imagine me having remained a passive, weak, guy without the balls to confront, and being ready, and more than willing to lose the relationship? I would still be in a miserable, and sexless marriage. 

Bottom line man-up, be ready to lose your marriage if that's what it takes, and get to it. No more weak passive demands and waiting. There's so many willing, able, and available women out there looking for a good guy to have a life filled with intimacy, and plenty of sex.


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## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

Lonelygent1977 said:


> To my knowledge no he lives on the other side of the country where he's married and has kids.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


Though about a year ago I saw a Facebook msg from him pop up on her phone saying they should go out for a coffee when he's in town visiting his family.
I don't know if they ever did, I've never seen a txt since that one.

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## Lonelygent1977 (Feb 20, 2018)

Lonelygent1977 said:


> I downloaded a app that's a sex diary and since Christmas we have had sex 4 times.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


Make that 6 it was my birthday last week and we did it on the sofa when the kids were at school.

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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

I feel bad saying out loud, that if a person is worried enough he/she has to go through their SO's phone to make sure no one is hooking up outside marriage and a wife says no I'm too tired to be romantic but stays up in bed to surf FB or non-critical website, and this repetitively happens...in this case "she"...has to do without the husband/life she's rejecting.

Let her own it if she wants to be apart from you, your care, and your money.


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## Universal Wonder (Mar 18, 2015)

23cm said:


> Believe me, I know how hard it is to talk with wife about these matters. I'm a poster-child for bad communication.
> 
> Intellectually, I know that if you keep doing what you've always done, you'll keep getting what you've always gotten. Advice on TAM and elsewhere usually is to "Alpha-up."
> 
> ...


Well, If you have voiced your concerns and there is nothing in return it can become redundant. It just seems to me that she does put much importance into it, even if you to reciprocate correctly. I am sure if her girlfriend wanted he to plan a party or complete a certain task she would do it to the, "T" and with much vigor. Having sex with a corpse is a dead sex life even done frequently. But having a passionate lover creates that incredible bond. Walking through the door after work and saying the same thing everyday will not cut it, but to fully engage is the proper response. Why is sex so different? I'd rather be wanted or lusted after with passion, then make someone do something out of duty. I also am in a Sexless marriage, feel free to read my thread as well. Thanks...


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Be sure and stop doing all the cooking and kids meals prep, and things "she knows you'll do". 

Re the starfish sex, just do what you want to do, keep moving her around, last as long as you want, and see what happens. This might push her one way or the other....towards you or may push her to tell you what's really going on. Do this every night, or as you desire.

Make a rule, tell her that the kids bedtime is (earlier than now..?) 8:30, or 8 every night and that's the time you're reserving for you and she to fool around. No TV or FB, etc is more important than together time. 

See what happens. Something has to change...


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## MaiChi (Jun 20, 2018)

I sometimes present at women's groups. I ask this questions, "Why is it that over 90% of prostitutes clients are married men?" and the reaction is always to look at each other as if to say "My husband is not one of those." A lot of husbands are frustrated by the phenomenon described here and they start by voicing their opinions but the end up straying. There are wives who get into depression after childbirth and actually lose libido, and some do not accept their condition, just like there are men who cannot get it up any more but refuse to get help. 

Yet again there are women who refuse to accept the needs of their husbands. I think the solution in most cases is to start your marriage with some agreed guidelines which both understand the same way. When you start to deviate from that you both know that you have deviated and it makes it easier to find out why. Your case seems to me to be that you now are so far from where you need to be that you need outside help. Your wife needs to hear you telling someone else how you feel. You need to hear your wife telling someone else how she feels. Then maybe you can work at a compromise.


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

Get a gym membership and download MMSP from Amazon. She doesn't want to have sex with an overweight beta, she wants a strong alpha. Then you will move ahead of her in SMV and she will want to work off the cellulite by having wild monkey sex. She wants to have sex, you know from pre-marriage, she just doesn't want to have sex with married you. Married you is boring and soft. Time to get some game. 

Wonder who this friend is, who is he? Is he really interested in just being her emotional tampon. Doubt it. I think I'd be suspicious of him too. Sounds like they might have had some FWB type thing going on previously. Might rekindle, but that's another issue.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Lonelygent1977 said:


> I downloaded a app that's a sex diary and since Christmas we have had sex 4 times.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk


A sexless marriage, by definition, is sex 10x or less in a year. You're probably there if you look back farther than Christmas.

I had a sexless marriage for over 2 decades. I tried everything, from talking to therapy, etc. I finally found a solution that worked: divorced her and met someone else who is into me, and into sex! The kids will do fine, if you remain an involved parent. Take care of yourself, too.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Married but Happy said:


> A sexless marriage, by definition, is sex 10x or less in a year. You're probably there if you look back farther than Christmas.
> 
> I had a sexless marriage for over 2 decades. I tried everything, from talking to therapy, etc. I finally found a solution that worked: divorced her and met someone else who is into me, and into sex! The kids will do fine, if you remain an involved parent. Take care of yourself, too.


A sex less marriage means a marriage with no sex. Sex once a month, while not being enough for most people, isn't sex less. 

Kids don't do fine when their parents divorce. They are devastated and deeply hurt.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Diana7 said:


> A sex less marriage means a marriage with no sex. Sex once a month, while not being enough for most people, isn't sex less.
> 
> Kids don't do fine when their parents divorce. They are devastated and deeply hurt.[/QUOT
> 
> Ignorance must be bliss. I gave the clinical definition of a sexless marriage. And kids do better with happy parents, not miserable ones who stay together "for them." It's great if the parents can solve their differences and create a truly happy home. But, _even you_ are divorced, so you know divorce is sometimes the only solution.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Married but Happy said:


> Diana7 said:
> 
> 
> > A sex less marriage means a marriage with no sex. Sex once a month, while not being enough for most people, isn't sex less.
> ...


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## Sbrown (Jul 29, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> Married but Happy said:
> 
> 
> > I wish I was ignorant when it came to divorce and the terrible effects it has on the children. Most of the marriages in my family ended in divorce. I saw what it did.
> ...


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Sbrown said:


> Diana7 said:
> 
> 
> > Sex may not be everything in YOUR marriage but to those of us that need it (yes I said need) then it's like oxygen. In my experience it's not a sexless marriage but a loveless one. Being a kid that was raised in a home with a loveless marriage is miserable every day. As a child the tension in the house was unbearable. I left that house at every opportunity, thankfully living on a farm there's no shortage of excuses to get out of the house. The divorce was a relief. I'm not sure who said it but I heard it said and believe it, "Children would rather be from a broken home than in one." I love my wife dearly and we were sexless for a couple years until I told her I wouldn't stay in a home that I was unloved in. It shocked her and drove home the seriousness of a healthy sex life. Sex is the one thing that seperates marriage from any other relationship.
> ...


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Personally, I would not leave my wife if she were ill and unable to have sex. (It's a fact that many people do leave, especially when they are younger. Age brings additional considerations.) We discussed this scenario before we married, and if either of us cannot have sex and the other still wants it, we have an open marriage agreement in place so we can get our NEEDS met elsewhere. Sex IS a need - you may not need it to _survive_, but many people DO NEED it to be happy. Trivializing a fundamental human need is disingenuous. While one person may be severely ill, there's no _need_ for two people to be miserable as a result.

(Added: Look up Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs - it's not a hierarchy of _wants_! Self-fulfillment and happiness are a central part of becoming a healthy individual.)


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## PaulB (Jun 26, 2018)

Livvie said:


> Why do YOU act all lovey dovey, as you said, with a woman who refuses to have sex with you??
> 
> I'd start there in analysis of the situation.




Seriously. Don't give her affection if you are not getting sex. Don't be an ass about it, just shrug away if she tries to hold your hand or lean against you on the couch or whatever. No kissing, or even worse, a simple kiss on the forehead or cheek. My wife will sometimes ask for a goodbye kiss on my way out the door, and if we've not had sex for awhile, I instead give her a playful punch on the shoulder and say "See you later buddy ol' pal" and walk away. It's kind of a joke we have, but she knows why I did it, and it makes a point.


And don't stop there. "I'm not in the mood" is a phrase men need to use more often with women. That answer is not reserved for just wives to use. Help with the dishes? "I'm not in the mood." Yard work? "I'm not in the mood." Pick up dry cleaning on the way home from work? "I'm not in the mood." Have dinner with that other couple tomorrow? Can't. "I love you, honey, but I'm just too tired to go out."


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Diana7 said:


> Sbrown said:
> 
> 
> > So if you wife gets ill and can no longer have sex you will leave her?
> ...


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## happyhusband0005 (May 4, 2018)

PaulB said:


> Seriously. Don't give her affection if you are not getting sex. Don't be an ass about it, just shrug away if she tries to hold your hand or lean against you on the couch or whatever. No kissing, or even worse, a simple kiss on the forehead or cheek. My wife will sometimes ask for a goodbye kiss on my way out the door, and if we've not had sex for awhile, I instead give her a playful punch on the shoulder and say "See you later buddy ol' pal" and walk away. It's kind of a joke we have, but she knows why I did it, and it makes a point.
> 
> 
> And don't stop there. "I'm not in the mood" is a phrase men need to use more often with women. That answer is not reserved for just wives to use. Help with the dishes? "I'm not in the mood." Yard work? "I'm not in the mood." Pick up dry cleaning on the way home from work? "I'm not in the mood." Have dinner with that other couple tomorrow? Can't. "I love you, honey, but I'm just too tired to go out."


I get the idea here, but I wonder if it is really something that would work in the end. I think what makes the sexless marriage thing so tough to get through is how complicated it can be. You have the person who wants sex usually also stating I don't feel loved and desired. By going with your suggestion your basically saying hey you just need to suck it up and do it, but when they do that it is going to be pity sex of obligation sex and your still not going to feel desired because the other person isn't going to be able fake being really into it. I think the issue typically is the person who doesn't want sex has no motivation or internal desire to fix the problem, they probably think the obligation sex is the best they can do. 

I think unfortunately the majority of marriages to become and remain sexless even with lots of good communication and talks and action can't survive as happy marriages if the uninterested person can't regain some level of desire.


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## Sbrown (Jul 29, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> Sbrown said:
> 
> 
> > So if you wife gets ill and can no longer have sex you will leave her?
> ...


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## MichelleThoughts (Jun 24, 2018)

I would agree with the ones who say that the OP is being too nice and affectionate in spite of her unwillingness. I don't think it's an unreasonable expectation at all that she provide this intimacy for him.

In my marriage, if we are having an argument, my husband might exclaim out of nowhere, "Great! another night where we won't have sex now." This doesn't happen often as we really do get along most of the time and I think we have a prerty decent amount of sex. But when that has happened I remember I felt really surprised. For one thing, in those cases I hadn't even noticed we were having less sex, for another thing it occurred to me that maybe this explained why he was being such a pissy and irritable person to be around in the first place, and for another thing I realized how much it bothered him that we not getting along and that his lack of sex was a big deal to him.

I also want to say, when I was pregnant with my second daughter, my sex drive plummetted so low I actually hated having sex. It was so bad, like on the rare occasion I agreed, I had to sort of brace myself through it. He pretty quickly stopped trying because it just sucked for both of us, and he was totally understanding about it because he knew it wasn't a personal rejection but a temporary hormonal issue.

So I'm not saying that men should be unreasonable in their expectations, but it IS reasonable to expect her to willingly give sex if there is no temporary or fixable physical issue. In the OP's case, I think he needs to show her how important this is to her.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Married but Happy said:


> Personally, I would not leave my wife if she were ill and unable to have sex. (It's a fact that many people do leave, especially when they are younger. Age brings additional considerations.) We discussed this scenario before we married, and if either of us cannot have sex and the other still wants it, we have an open marriage agreement in place so we can get our NEEDS met elsewhere. Sex IS a need - you may not need it to _survive_, but many people DO NEED it to be happy. Trivializing a fundamental human need is disingenuous. While one person may be severely ill, there's no _need_ for two people to be miserable as a result.
> 
> (Added: Look up Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs - it's not a hierarchy of _wants_! Self-fulfillment and happiness are a central part of becoming a healthy individual.)


 There is no way that we would commit adultery if one of us was unable to have sex. We made promises to be faithful and to put the other first, for better or for worse. 
We took vows. If my husband was ill, my energies would be spent caring for him and loving him, not running around having casual sex with someone else. 
Self control seems to be a lost art, as is faithfulness.


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## PaulB (Jun 26, 2018)

Diana7 said:


> Married but Happy said:
> 
> 
> > Our divorces were for unavoidable and very serious reasons, not just because one spouse wanted sex more or less than the other. That is not a reason to end a marriage and blow up the children's lives.
> ...


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

PaulB said:


> Diana7 said:
> 
> 
> > On the same note, why not tell the spouse who is uninterested in sex to take responsibility of helping hold the family together and have sex more often? Why is the burden supposed to all be placed on the person who is being deprived sex?
> ...


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## happyhusband0005 (May 4, 2018)

PaulB said:


> And what is so horrible about people having sex even if they aren't in the mood? (For those who seem to never be in the mood.)


There's nothing wrong with it, but in these situations of sexless marriage it isn't going to solve the problem. Any of the sexless marriage threads I have read, I often see the comment "when we do have sex it's just pity sex and she just lies there". The problem is that the need that sex satisfies is not helped by one partner just being there while the other orgasms, they don't just want the starfish sex they want good sex with passion and a sense that they are desired. If all they wanted was an orgasm their need would be met by masturbating.


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## PaulB (Jun 26, 2018)

Diana7 said:


> PaulB said:
> 
> 
> > Sometimes a compromise has to be reached. like in anything in marriage...
> ...


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

PaulB said:


> Diana7 said:
> 
> 
> > I agree with you 100%, and if there is an answer to the problem, this is it.
> ...


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## MichelleThoughts (Jun 24, 2018)

happyhusband0005 said:


> I get the idea here, but I wonder if it is really something that would work in the end. I think what makes the sexless marriage thing so tough to get through is how complicated it can be. You have the person who wants sex usually also stating I don't feel loved and desired. By going with your suggestion your basically saying hey you just need to suck it up and do it, but when they do that it is going to be pity sex of obligation sex and your still not going to feel desired because the other person isn't going to be able fake being really into it. I think the issue typically is the person who doesn't want sex has no motivation or internal desire to fix the problem, they probably think the obligation sex is the best they can do.
> 
> I think unfortunately the majority of marriages to become and remain sexless even with lots of good communication and talks and action can't survive as happy marriages if the uninterested person can't regain some level of desire.


Actually I think PaulB's suggestion makes sense. My husband hasn't pulled the "I'm not in the mood" -card with me, but I haven't been one to regularly reject him either. As a woman, I really don't understand why some wives do this. I see them as either just very selfish, or the husband is simply not communicating to her in a clear way that this is a BIG problem for him. I do think sex is very important in a relationship but I have met some women who don't see it as a priority in a marriage. My husband actually divorced his first wife primarily over this issue. Now she was also totally crazy, a chronic liar and a cheater, but the biggest problem he had with her was the repeated sexual rejection. 

I really don't understand why she would have done this as my husband is extremely attractive! Plus he is a very hard worker and helps out around the house a lot. So many people post here on sexless marriage threads saying that the wife just might not be attracted to him because maybe he's a slob, or out of shape, or just not a good husband overall. But sometimes I really don't see that as the case at all. I actually know some married couples in my husband's family where the husband is highly attractive and very hard working but I have found out through them going out drinking and revealing to my husband that they are becoming sex-starved. 

I will say too, that for me, having four children, we have had ups and downs understandably in our sex life. My sexual desire was okay with my first and fourth pregnancy, completely gone with my second pregnancy, and actually quite high with my third pregnancy (he was my only boy - maybe the testosterone really made a difference?). But with new babies and busy lifestyles to adjust to, we've had ups and downs with our sexual frequency when not pregnant as well. 

I've noticed that for me, the less often we have sex, the less often I want it. Isn't that strange? I start to not miss it. 
But the more often we have sex, the more often I want it. My husband has a higher sex drive than me, for sure. But having sex with him even if I'm not in the mood doesn't feel like "duty sex." I still quite enjoy it even if I might have preferred to go to sleep in the first place. I really think, just physiologically, it is way easier for women to agree to have sex if they are not quite in the mood than for men to do the same. It's just less work! lol And we still can find it quite enjoyable overall.

In my marriage, it really is sort of up to him to keep it going, partly by just letting me know if we are not having it often enough, but seriously I'm not kidding when I say, the more often we have it, the more often I want it. This may be a really weird analogy, but it's almost like eating healthy food. It's often the type of thing I don't want immediately, but afterwards I'm like, "wow, I feel so much better. I should eat that more often." Well, in a sort of strange but similar sense, after sex, I feel so much more bonded and connected to my husband that I'm like, "wow, I'm really glad I agreed to stay up to do that instead of just going to sleep."


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## happyhusband0005 (May 4, 2018)

MichelleThoughts said:


> I've noticed that for me, the less often we have sex, the less often I want it. Isn't that strange? I start to not miss it.
> But the more often we have sex, the more often I want it. My husband has a higher sex drive than me, for sure. But having sex with him even if I'm not in the mood doesn't feel like "duty sex." I still quite enjoy it even if I might have preferred to go to sleep in the first place. I really think, just physiologically, it is way easier for women to agree to have sex if they are not quite in the mood than for men to do the same. It's just less work! lol And we still can find it quite enjoyable overall.


I actually posted something about this a few days ago. I have had a lot of female friends say this. I also know that when things are crazy like with babies etc. and the frequency drops and your exhausted a lot of women say they weren't in the mood but really enjoyed it once it started. Thats why I always say keep some level of sexuality alive even if it's a quickie masturbation just to keep the juices flowing so to speak. 

The problem I have with some of the suggestions going directly to treat her the same she treats you is if you haven't discussed it seriously and openly you risking giving her a reason to not want to have sex with you that didn't exist before. After you've been knocking on the door for a while I get going that route but it really seems like the last option I would go with in that situation.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

IMHO there is no such thing as a person who "can't have sex." - only people who don't want to or don't desire their partners. 

Yes there are a variety of conditions that may make actual PIV penetration unlikely. but human sexuality and intimacy encompasses so much more than that. 

I could be completely paralized from neck down or ven just a head floating in a fishbowl and I would do everything I could to please my partner with whatever capabilities I still had.

Likewise, I would not leave someone that had a medical condition that prevented them from having PIV but still wanted to have a sex life with me and would enthusiastically do what was within their ability.

But if someone was fully capable but simply didn't want to or was not attracted to me at all, that would be a different story.


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## UpsideDownWorld11 (Feb 14, 2018)

MichelleThoughts said:


> I've noticed that for me, the less often we have sex, the less often I want it. Isn't that strange? I start to not miss it.
> But the more often we have sex, the more often I want it. My husband has a higher sex drive than me, for sure. But having sex with him even if I'm not in the mood doesn't feel like "duty sex." I still quite enjoy it even if I might have preferred to go to sleep in the first place. I really think, just physiologically, it is way easier for women to agree to have sex if they are not quite in the mood than for men to do the same. It's just less work! lol And we still can find it quite enjoyable overall.


Semen is full of many hormones, but one of them is testosterone. This drives sexual desire and enters a females blood stream after ejaculation. Meaning you have a higher sex drive. This can last for awhile since sperm can live up in their for a few days. There is also the pair bonding oxytocin which is released naturally after sex. If you aren't being 'topped off' by your husband regularly there is no wonder you would lose those sexual feelings.


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## Noble1 (Oct 25, 2013)

I was reading another message/question answer board and found a great post that I have included a part of below: Great points.


Sex is the direct equivalent for men to the feminine need for validation through conversation and processing. When I ask for sex, I am seeking connection with the love of my life. I am seeking confirmation that I am a good husband and fulfilling partner. I am seeking Validation that I am appreciated for all the hard work I do for our family and the things above that I do solely for her. I need to feel attractive and desirable too. And, most importantly, I am seeking the most effective and real way she can say, “I Love you, thank you.” When I ask for sex and the response is, “All you ever want from me is sex, I'm not your *****.” or “if you need sex so bad, hire a prostitute!” and how often have you heard, “Once a week is all I want and you need to be okay with it.” and our society backs her up by making this very crucial male need the one thing it is okay to deny in a relationship and derides men as perverted and simple minded for it.

If it was just about sex, we wouldn't have a problem, we could go see a prostitute and get what we need, but we can't. Just sex is unfulfilling, empty, and gives nothing. Plus, we need it from you, the person I gave my whole being to, the person I do so much for, asking only for a brief 20 to 30 minute moment of connection a few times a week in return. I wish wives understood what it really means to us and would make the same effort to provide it as we do for all the things they need.

When you need a sympathetic ear and ask for my time I will never say, “I have a headache, besides, we just talked last week how can you need to talk again so badly?” or, “I'm too busy to give you 30 min of my time without trying to solve your problem.” or the equivalent of what we are told, “All you ever want is for me to be a silent microphone is that all I am to you? If you need an ear so badly, just buy a recorder and leave me alone until you are done.” If we said any of those things we would be torn apart and rightfully so. Why not the other way? Why is it that we are expected to fulfil YOUR relationship needs in YOUR way and we are expected to have OUR needs fulfilled in YOUR way also?


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## Tatsuhiko (Jun 21, 2016)

Well said, @Noble. I always found this two-part article by Dennis Prager to be gold. If women want to understand how men think about sex, this is it: When a Woman Isn't in the Mood: Part I - The Dennis Prager Show


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Diana7 said:


> There is no way that we would commit adultery if one of us was unable to have sex. We made promises to be faithful and to put the other first, for better or for worse.
> We took vows. If my husband was ill, my energies would be spent caring for him and loving him, not running around having casual sex with someone else.
> Self control seems to be a lost art, as is faithfulness.


Well according to Jesus you are an adulterer. :rofl:

Luke 16:18 Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery.


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## Sbrown (Jul 29, 2012)

Personal said:


> Well according to Jesus you are an adulterer. :rofl:
> 
> Luke 16:18 Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery.


That looks like it's according to Luke to me.... 

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Personal said:


> Well according to Jesus you are an adulterer. :rofl:
> 
> Luke 16:18 Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery.


Neither of us 'put away' our spouses, they were the ones who broke the marriage. 
The Jews of that time had a practise of putting away their wives for small issues and getting another woman, but not giving their wives a certificate of divorce so that they could marry again. Without marriage they were usually destitute. Therefore the man was not free to marry again as he was still married to his wife, and was committing adultery with the new lady. That's what that verse is referring to.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Diana7 said:


> Neither of us 'put away' our spouses, they were the ones who broke the marriage.
> The Jews of that time had a practise of putting away their wives for small issues and getting another woman, but not giving their wives a certificate of divorce so that they could marry again. Without marriage they were usually destitute. Therefore the man was not free to marry again as he was still married to his wife, and was committing adultery with the new lady. That's what that verse is referring to.


NIV Matthew 5:32 But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for
marital unfaithfulness, causes her to become an adulteress, and
anyone who marries the divorced woman commits adultery.

I get it Diana7 that's the nice thing about Christianity, if one doesn't like the words in the bible they will choose to interpret it as befits their desires.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Personal said:


> NIV Matthew 5:32 But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for
> marital unfaithfulness, causes her to become an adulteress, and
> anyone who marries the divorced woman commits adultery.
> 
> I get it Diana7 that's the nice thing about Christianity, if one doesn't like the words in the bible they will choose to interpret it as befits their desires.


 
That word used for marital unfaithfulness here, is 'pornea', which means any type of sexual immorality. That fits both of our previous marriages. The word translated 'divorce' also means 'putting away' which is what I explained before. How about you actually look up the real meaning of the Greek and Hebrew words used before you judge and assume. 
Either way we both had biblical reasons to be divorced(pornea) therefore its irrelevant. 

I am passionate about the truth of Gods word, which is why I read it and study it. I never try and interpret it for my own desires.


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