# Well I was wrong to forgive about the ea and it ending. Found A hidden phone.



## LOSTfan

Some of you have seen my thread about my wife caught texting with a co worker. Thought i solved the, problem. Nope, she took it under ground. They've been texting and at least making out for the last month. Don't know what to do. I'm In shock.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## iheartlife

How did you find out?


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## keko

Damn. Do not confront her yet.

Im sure the move to miami(next her other ex) is no longer an option?


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## Numb in Ohio

Sorry to hear you have to go through this again...


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## jh52

I know one thing you shouldn't do is move to south Florida with her at the moment !!


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## TRy

LOSTfan said:


> Some of you have seen my thread about my wife caught texting with a co worker. Thought i solved the, problem. Nope, she took it under ground. They've been texting and at least making out for the last month. Don't know what to do. I'm In shock.


 Your concern in an earlier thread of yours about your wife calling you "smothering and controlling" was unfounded, as she was only wanting more freedom to cheat. You can say the same about your concern about your wife being allowed to see her ex-lovers. You were warned. Now you know.

I am truly sorry for your loss. You do not deserve this. Do not let her blame shift this to you. She will try to hold you to a standard of perfection in pointing out how it is your fault, while not holding herself to the same standard. You cannot win this game because as the self appointed judge and jury she does not want you to win. She wants you to be wrong so that she can blame shift fault to you. Do not buy into it for one second.


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## thesunwillcomeout

Oh, so sorry!!


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## Acabado

I'm very sorry, man.
Talk to a lawyer ASAP. Exposure?, filing directly?


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## Complexity

So.........what's the plan of action?


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## LOSTfan

My wife said, this isn't justification. She sobbed and said how wrong she was. But what she says is "thers always a reason that somebody cheats. It doesn't make it right. But a wife who is getting beat, a wife who is dealing with constant jealousy when at the time it is unfounded." Or even, and I think is is her main point, the fact that she saw I sexted 9 months ago. Wigth a couple different women. Everything that I said was emotionless and was after I tried countless times to do with her. Once she found out I stopped for good. Now fast forward to may, she flirts with this co worker, and I find out. She says its done. I act extremely jealous for a week or two. 

Now I find that instead of telling him its done like she said she did. It was a convo that went something like this.. "this isn't worth it. We can't text anymore. He's jealous........" two days later, he goes to her asking if he can still communicate any other way besides the phone I know of." She then says "if he's going to be jealous while we aren't doing anything, we may as well make it true". And then begins him giving her a phone for them to communicate.

So now I've read every text sent through this secret phone. It was a lot of sexual innuendos, meet ups to make out and talk. And kind of evolved into I miss yous, I want yous, let's finally have sex, we are great together, you make me so happy.... and the killer.... " you are the best thing in my life"

So she says it was emotional, she was caught up in the moment. She wanted to get away from my smothering and jealousy, so she could have an outlet. Now that I've caught her, she thinks of him in disgust. She says all they did was make out. And that shed never ever leave me for him. She says if I never found out, she would still continue it with him. She says she was hoping that she would eventually get sick of him.. even in the texts, he was talking to her less and less (claiming it was because he was out of town) and she even askedd him. "Are you over this?" And she says she was hoping he would be.


She wants to stay with me but she doesn't and I don't understand how we move on from this...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

Oh By the way, she thinks I should do the same thing with another girl to make it even. She thinks I don't want to because I want to have the upper hand if we stay together... I said I don't want to because I am actually in love with her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Paladin

I dont think she can ask you to trust any of her words. Only her actions will matter for the time being. Total transparency is now critical. Every dime of money, and every minute of her time must be accounted for, freely, and with the understanding of why she needs to do this for you. 

Do you even feel like giving her a chance?

edit: The fact that she wants you to do it should say it all. Her perception of what a marriage is supposed to be is way skewed, and her desire to have an "even" playing field is most probably a sign that she is not ready to own her terrible behavior. Even if you did do "it" with someone else, it would still not be behind her back with a secret phone. I'm sorry you are dealing with this. Good Luck.


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## keko

Lost, don't fool yourself. Nobody buys their lover a secret phone to only get a kiss. Didn't you said OMs place was in the same building as their work? You can be 150% sure it was much more then a kiss, and I have mentioned this in your earlier thread.

As for moving on, don't forget not only did she cheated on you with this guy but she was also openly asking permission to hang out with the other ex.

She's a serial cheater my friend and you've only caught one small part of it. Don't be surprised if you find out all those extra hours of work were being spent on different places. Sorry if I offended you but that's the cold hard reality for you.


Edit:


LOSTfan said:


> Oh By the way, she thinks I should do the same thing with another girl to make it even. She thinks I don't want to because I want to have the upper hand if we stay together... I said I don't want to because I am actually in love with her.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:slap:

Don't do it. This attitude shows she has a few more dirt to unload but wants to equal things out before confessing them.


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## Paladin

double post removed


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## cantthinkstraight

LOSTfan said:


> Oh By the way, she thinks I should do the same thing with another girl to make it even. She thinks I don't want to because I want to have the upper hand if we stay together... I said I don't want to because I am actually in love with her.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think your wife and my wife need to get together and go bowling...


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## Maricha75

LOSTfan said:


> My wife said, this isn't justification. She sobbed and said how wrong she was. But what she says is "thers always a reason that somebody cheats. It doesn't make it right. But a wife who is getting beat, a wife who is dealing with constant jealousy when at the time it is unfounded." Or even, and I think is is her main point, the fact that she saw I sexted 9 months ago. Wigth a couple different women. Everything that I said was emotionless and was after I tried countless times to do with her. Once she found out I stopped for good. Now fast forward to may, she flirts with this co worker, and I find out. She says its done. I act extremely jealous for a week or two.
> 
> Now I find that instead of telling him its done like she said she did. It was a convo that went something like this.. "this isn't worth it. We can't text anymore. He's jealous........" two days later, he goes to her asking if he can still communicate any other way besides the phone I know of." She then says "if he's going to be jealous while we aren't doing anything, we may as well make it true". And then begins him giving her a phone for them to communicate.
> 
> So now I've read every text sent through this secret phone. It was a lot of sexual innuendos, meet ups to make out and talk. And kind of evolved into I miss yous, I want yous, let's finally have sex, we are great together, you make me so happy.... and the killer.... " you are the best thing in my life"
> 
> So she says it was emotional, she was caught up in the moment. She wanted to get away from my smothering and jealousy, so she could have an outlet. Now that I've caught her, she thinks of him in disgust. She says all they did was make out. And that shed never ever leave me for him. S*he says if I never found out, she would still continue it with him.* She says she was hoping that she would eventually get sick of him.. even in the texts, he was talking to her less and less (claiming it was because he was out of town) and she even askedd him. "Are you over this?" And she says she was hoping he would be.
> 
> 
> She wants to stay with me but she doesn't and I don't understand how we move on from this...
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


She isn't sorry... that right there says she isn't. Well, let me rephrase that... she IS sorry... she's sorry she got CAUGHT!


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## warlock07

Don't trust one word she says, atleast for a while. Get her and you tested for STDs

Now she says you can do the same with the other girl? She is already in the gutter and wants to drag you down to her level and so that you cannot hold this over her head. If she hasn't contacted this other guy yet, confront him and try to get more details(Why the f*ck did you cheat with my wife?). It is most likely a full blown affair. Affair phone speaks about a lot of intent. Contact the HR if you can.


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## iheartlife

LOSTfan said:


> Oh By the way, she thinks I should do the same thing with another girl to make it even. She thinks I don't want to because I want to have the upper hand if we stay together... _Posted via Mobile Device_


This just chills me to the bone. She has some _very_ serious issues.


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## LOSTfan

Now she has admitted they did have sex once, 3 weeks ago. Claiming it was awful, and that because she had that a,5 minute sexual bad exp that it wasn't a sexual thing. Only a, liking of the way he made her feel.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

Once again, you're only seeing only the tip of the iceberg. Cheaters will only confess what you can prove, nothing more.


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## anonymouskitty

Dude my advice LEAVE HER, 

1) She has absolutely no remorse
2) She wants you to cheat to make it even , meaning next time she cheats, you have permission to cheat again, what kind of a relationship is that?
3) So bad sex means the affair wasn't sexual, who the **** is she kidding?
4) These type of cheaters are what we call CAKE EATERS, they're the worst kind and more often than not are serial cheaters and hardly ever change even with extensive therapy


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## Jibril

LOSTfan said:


> Now she has admitted they did have sex once, 3 weeks ago. Claiming it was awful, and that because she had that a,5 minute sexual bad exp that it wasn't a sexual thing. Only a, liking of the way he made her feel.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


She's trickling truths now. It's going to get worse. 

Here are the facts, Lostfan - _she's a bloody liar_.

What do you want from a marriage with a liar who has an affair and denies it to your face?

I'll tell you what you should want - a divorce. So get one.


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## Machiavelli

On "cools", the affair sex is the greatest sex ever; on here, the affair sex the worst sex ever. The only time it's not the worse sex is when the OM can't get it up. Funny how all these OM's are impotent and/or inept, but the WWs keep going back.


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## kenmoore14217

Can you say ..... EXPOSURE !!


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## lordmayhem

Machiavelli said:


> On "cools", the affair sex is the greatest sex ever; on here, the affair sex the worst sex ever. The only time it's not the worse sex is when the OM can't get it up. *Funny how all these OM's are impotent and/or inept, but the WWs keep going back*.


IKR? Strange isn't it?


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## Kallan Pavithran

LOSTfan said:


> Now she has admitted they did have sex once, 3 weeks ago. Claiming it was awful, and that because she had that a,5 minute sexual bad exp that it wasn't a sexual thing. Only a, liking of the way he made her feel.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_




You caught her earlier, gave her a chance but she thrown your forgiveness on your face and took it underground, and took it to another level PA. Now she want to even the field, because she dont want you to have an upper hand in the marriage due to her cheating what kind of women she is? She is terrible liar, dont believe a word she says.

She told you it was only make outs she even admitted it because you have proof, Now its one time sex that too most awful quikie, then later you are going to find that it was more time with more pleasure than with you. She know you will find it so she want to even the playing field so that she need not feel guilty any more.

What kind of a lady you are married to? How many chances are you ready to give her? Once it is shame on you second its shame on.......

She is not remorseful and want you to get over it. Issue her with D papers as soon as possible. Else you are going to come here again and again .............


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## jnj express

Everyone here--is telling you the way it needs to be

You cheated, the 2 of you worked thru it, it stopped, and that was it

Now she cheats, you get it stopped, and then what happens---she starts up again---So you really can't believe anything she says----I promise you those makeout sessions, some of them, were not limited to lip locking---she admits to one time of spreading the legs----That's a large lie.

She says your stifling her---that is nothing more than her using the alleged jealousy, as justification, for her to resume, her A.

She knew you were gonna moniter her, what did she expect

You tell us---what do you really have for a wife, she is a real piece of work, isn't she---she is one very SELFISH woman.---she now wants you to lower yourself and cheat to even the score----does she have any kind of morals at all---I wonder what you both see when you look at her in the mirror

I will tell you why you are getting all this sobbing, and doing what she thinks is needed to stay in the mge

Cuz she is scared sh*tless that you will D, her, and she will be forced to face the big bad world on her own---and you better believe, that is not something she wants to face----she has her nice little life/H./family/mge, and life may not be great, but its OK-----If you D., her that all dissapears------so then that begs the question, what are her motives, for staying

If she loved you at all, which I don't see how that could be, if she is out screwing another man, but if there was some love there for you, when you caught her, and gave her your gift---THE SECOND CHANCE, what did she do---she justified, your hurt/pain/suffering/checking, into a reason to go and cheat again

A cheating spouse that is truly serious, would be doing everything/anything possible no matter what to make a R., work------what does this woman you are married to do---wants you to cheat, and she continues her A., and states, if you hadn't caught her, she would still be screwing her lover

WHAT DO YOU THINK OUGHT TO BE DONE????????
If someone came to you, and presented this to you, as their problem, what would YOUR advice be to them??????


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## KittyKat

jnj express said:


> Everyone here--is telling you the way it needs to be
> 
> You cheated, the 2 of you worked thru it, it stopped, and that was it
> 
> Now she cheats, you get it stopped, and then what happens---she starts up again---So you really can't believe anything she says----I promise you those makeout sessions, some of them, were not limited to lip locking---she admits to one time of spreading the legs----That's a large lie.
> 
> She says your stifling her---that is nothing more than her using the alleged jealousy, as justification, for her to resume, her A.
> 
> She knew you were gonna moniter her, what did she expect
> 
> You tell us---what do you really have for a wife, she is a real piece of work, isn't she---she is one very SELFISH woman.---she now wants you to lower yourself and cheat to even the score----does she have any kind of morals at all---I wonder what you both see when you look at her in the mirror
> 
> I will tell you why you are getting all this sobbing, and doing what she thinks is needed to stay in the mge
> 
> Cuz she is scared sh*tless that you will D, her, and she will be forced to face the big bad world on her own---and you better believe, that is not something she wants to face----she has her nice little life/H./family/mge, and life may not be great, but its OK-----If you D., her that all dissapears------so then that begs the question, what are her motives, for staying
> 
> If she loved you at all, which I don't see how that could be, if she is out screwing another man, but if there was some love there for you, when you caught her, and gave her your gift---THE SECOND CHANCE, what did she do---she justified, your hurt/pain/suffering/checking, into a reason to go and cheat again
> 
> A cheating spouse that is truly serious, would be doing everything/anything possible no matter what to make a R., work------what does this woman you are married to do---wants you to cheat, and she continues her A., and states, if you hadn't caught her, she would still be screwing her lover
> 
> WHAT DO YOU THINK OUGHT TO BE DONE????????
> If someone came to you, and presented this to you, as their problem, what would YOUR advice be to them??????


:iagree::iagree::iagree:

You've both cheated on each other. You say you are in love with her. Funny how I just responded to other posters response to your other thread regarding why you have a problem w/ her hanging with her ex's. And my response was correct. You cheated and therefore feared she would cheat. And she did. Both of you got caught. She's in it much deeper than you.

If y'all don't get some serious counseling, you may as well file the paperwork now.


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## LOSTfan

What I did was dirty talk with a couple girls from out of state. Cause, unfortunately thats what turns me on. Nothing Physical, I admit to that being an ea. But The fiat ea she had with this guy last month was "you make me smile" crap. The problem was he lived where they work.(hotel). After confronting that, i thought it was over. Until I find a phone confirming this was underground. It was a month of I miss you babes, we need to have sex soon, to I'm lucky youre I'm my life. I am told it was just make outs. That I caused this because of my jealousy. And then I'm told it was just sex once. So hows this in anyway the same thing.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

Sorry. That last post was idiotic on my part. Aside from being hurt, i had no reason to go off here like that. so I apologize
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## warlock07

I think it was more than make outs. You don't have an affair phone if it was unplanned make outs. maybe more than one guy? What kind of phone is this? Get the account records for this phone if possible.



> let's finally have sex,


Why do you think sex never happened if they have this text?


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## sinnister

Sorry man. The writing was on the wall. And now on top of it she's blaming you for being "jealous". Give me a break.

And no. Don't let anybody tell you that sexting a few random women is an EA. It is not. People here get so caught up in that term they forget the definition. For you there was zero emotion involved. None. That is not the definition of an emotional affair. What you did was cyber cheated. It's wrong but gravity of the act is important here. Your WIFE decided it would be cool to talk to multiple ex's, invest deeply in an emotional way with a coworker and then more than likely have sex with him (more than once I'm betting).

Now you have a choice to make. It's going to be hard probably the most difficult decision you've ever made, but believe me when I tell you what you decide here is important for your healing process. I'm not going to tell you to leave since you cheated (cyber) too. But the 2 acts are very different.


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## keko

You're putting too much emphasis on this one guy, given how she wanted to justify your jealousy then wanted you to cheat to equal things out don't be surprised if you find a few more quickies to random customers. Start preparing yourself emotionally.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## warlock07

> She then says "if he's going to be jealous while we aren't doing anything, we may as well make it true".


This is the most appalling statement of them all. She does not respect you one bit. That is not how you talk about the person you care about or respect.


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## lovelygirl

LOSTfan said:


> Oh By the way, she thinks I should do the same thing with another girl to make it even. She thinks I don't want to because I want to have the upper hand if we stay together... I said I don't want to because I am actually in love with her.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Ridiculous!!!

And it's funny how *out of the blue* she thinks the OM is disgusting. 

Nobody buys it. 

I don't see what's the point of staying with her anymore. 
Judging from this and your other threads, you should let her go. She's doesn't love/respect you. Why keep her?


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## Will_Kane

I don't see this as her having two separate incidents with this guy. It was a continuous relationship and it never stopped. They worked in the same place and didn't have to text each other, but they still did. The day in the bar when you had a beer with this guy and he and your wife texted while you were there was a sign that something was terribly wrong. His reaction to your confronting him was a good indication that this wasn't ending.

He may have initiated contact, but she never backe him off it one bit and she actually pursued it. Even if you never expressed an ounce of jealousy towards this guy, she intended to have an affair with this guy. Now, you're jealous nature in general, over an extended period of time, that may have made you very weak and unattractive to your wife.

Your wife's pay is based more on her ability to flirt with men than it actually is based on her ability to serve them drinks. YOUR WIFE'S JOB IS TO FLIRT WITH MEN. This is a recipe for disaster in your marriage.

Some men are unreasonably jealous. Their wife goes out to get the mail, a car passes by, and they accuse their wife of flirting with the driver - that's unreasonable. You are jealous, but you have a pretty good reason, which is that your wife's job is to flirt with other men, how well she does it determines how much money she makes, and some of those guys are wealthy, young, good-looking, funny, etc. She is bound to find some of them attractive. The problem is, your jealousy does make you unattractive.

However, no one cheats because they were accused of it, saying we might as well do it if we're going to be accused anyway. She cheated because she liked this guy and wanted to cheat, she just used your accusation as a justification after the fact.


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## Machiavelli

keko said:


> She's a serial cheater my friend and *you've only caught one small part of it.* .


Cucktail Waitress = Tail for c0cks X 50 (vegas multiplier)


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## Machiavelli

This even-the-score business is to try to work you into an open marriage deal. After you do it, she'll be like "see, we're adults. We can handle having others." She's looking to replace you, but for whatever reason, she's not quite ready to move out yet. She's been having an open marriage since she started flirting for tips. I wouldn't let my wife be a cucktail waitress under any circumstances.


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## Will_Kane

I think before you move forward in your marriage you need to know what's been going on. You can't make decisions about your future without more information about where you stand. 

Unfortunately, you cannot believe your wife. She went from you catching her and her telling you that it was friendly texting to telling you it was harmless flirting to telling you she would stop doing it to you catching her with a burner phone to her telling you they just kissed once to her telling you they had sex once, with her telling him he was the best thing in her life to her telling you it's over and he is disgusting. Does this story make sense to you? It doesn't make sense because it's a lie. 

If it was going on for a month and his apartment is where she works, she could have been clocking out early and screwing him every night. It probably wasn't just once if she texted him "you're the best thing in my life." Also, he must have had sex with her many times for her to actually think he was ending it with her. He had his fill and was losing interest after just one time having sex with her? Not likely.

As far as her having cheated with others besides this guy, random quickies or whatever, I have no idea and neither do you. She lied to you about this guy and continued lying when you first caught her and still is lying now.

Ask your wife to take a polygraph. See if you can get the truth that way.

In the meantime, *she should write a "no contact" letter to the other man and quit her job immediately*. She would rather let you fool around on her and you meanwhile let her keep her job (and keep seeing the other man). Maybe she wants to have an open marriage with you and figures her getting you to have an affair is the first step.


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## Chaparral

Whats the divorce rate in Las Vegas? Isn't this the third thread from LV in the last three months?


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## iheartlife

LOSTfan said:


> What I did was dirty talk with a couple girls from out of state. Cause, unfortunately thats what turns me on. Nothing Physical, I admit to that being an ea. But The fiat ea she had with this guy last month was "you make me smile" crap. The problem was he lived where they work.(hotel). After confronting that, i thought it was over. Until I find a phone confirming this was underground. It was a month of I miss you babes, we need to have sex soon, to I'm lucky youre I'm my life. I am told it was just make outs. That I caused this because of my jealousy. And then I'm told it was just sex once. So hows this in anyway the same thing.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_





LOSTfan said:


> Sorry. That last post was idiotic on my part. Aside from being hurt, i had no reason to go off here like that. so I apologize
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Let's compare these two posts of yours. You are conflicted. The one side (post #1) sees this for what it is and is outraged.

Your other side (post #2) is in deep denial and wants to stuff down the emotions. You don't "deserve" to feel anger toward her.

Except that you do.

Why would a long list of random people on the Internet see this for what it is, and you don't? It's because you don't want to believe she would betray you so profoundly. But she did.

She is very, very good at gaslighting. Gaslighting is where you fake out your spouse. You make them think THEY are the crazy ones. It comes from an old movie where the husband would dim the gaslights and then tell his wife she was losing her mind. It is a way to control and manipulate the non-cheating spouse into thinking THEY just have lively imaginations so they won't investigate further and discover the full truth.

You see how much you found on your own. She didn't share this with you voluntarily. You are peeling back an onion and you keep finding more lies.


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## tacoma

LOSTfan said:


> .
> 
> She wants to stay with me but she doesn't and I don't understand how we move on from this...
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


She's blameshifting & bull****ting, you don't moves on from this until she owns it.

If she can't you leave her & move on
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Ben Connedfussed

chapparal said:


> Whats the divorce rate in Las Vegas? Isn't this the third thread from LV in the last three months?


My friends... well friend now, got divorced after they moved to Las Vegas. They need to rename... Lost Vegas. And the idea that she believes you should go do it with someone to make up for her wrongdoing??? 

That won't help!
She has done more that she has let on.
Sorry for the situation.
Too much mistrust!
Get together.
Get counseling to determine statuses of relationship.
Get yourself some help! Take care!


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## Chaparral

Los Vegas=Lost Wages


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## Cyber Cheating Stinks

LOSTfan said:


> Some of you have seen my thread about my wife caught texting with a co worker. Thought i solved the, problem. Nope, she took it under ground. They've been texting and at least making out for the last month. Don't know what to do. I'm In shock.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Been there. He promised to have no contact at all with her, but they continued to email. I sent her an email telling her to leave my husband and family alone. I drove copies of all the emails and texts to the OP's husband to peruse. Now I have a copy of the post by Sweatpea, http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...ded-rebuild-trust-dss-honesty.html#post208407 It helps me know my rights as a BW and gives me focus. I really feel your pain. It has been 6 months since my discovery, and we are seeing a marriage counselor (2nd session tonight). Here's hoping and you are now in my prayers for recovery, no matter what you choose.


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## Aristotle

LOSTfan said:


> The problem was he lived where they work.(hotel). After confronting that, i thought it was over. Until I find a phone confirming this was underground. It was a month of I miss you babes, we need to have sex soon.


At first I felt it was possible that they could have only gotten together once, but they work at a hotel and he "lives" there? Seriously man, they have been hooking up non stop if that's the case. They are co-workers at a hotel that he actually lives in?!?

Could that be any worse?

Maybe I just misunderstood, but if they work at a hotel and he actually lives there, your wife is flat out lying when she says once. They can hook up on breaks, before work, after work, during work, non stop. She has no remorse and is giving your obvious partial truths seeing if it will be enough to "satisfy" your need to "hear everything". That number will grow forever, until you realise their whole relationship was sexual. I wouldn't be surprised if after the truth comes out (if it ever does), she ends up saying it was purely sexual and she would have never left you for him. You are her everything, he was just some fling at work. The exact opposite of what she is saying now.


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## Machiavelli

chapparal said:


> Whats the divorce rate in Las Vegas? Isn't this the third thread from LV in the last three months?


Yeah, and they're all cucktail waitresses or bottle girls.


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## LOSTfan

Well we are going to marriage counseling asap. But how do I deal with the short term. She has work tomorrow where he lives. She has agreed to not work there anymore, but she has to find a new job first. Which makes sense, we cant make it financially unless she is working as well.

But I think we all know that while shes at work, i will slowly lose my mind with anger, resentment, worry, and sadness.

How do I get through while shes at work? Shes writing the NC letter today, but I tell myself she could easily write it out and either claim she gave it to him or gives it to him but tells him its all bs to quiet me. She claims that the thought of him now disgusts her, because she is out of the fog now. And thinking about him and how it damn near ruined our marriage makes her sick.

I dont know if thats just bs or not. Ugh so confused....


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## snap

I'm sorry but for it to have any credibility, she should quit this job cold turkey. Effective immediately. Financial hardships be damned.

Otherwise he is still going to poke her every lunchbreak and her job hunt will last forever.


----------



## anonymouskitty

Oh and I'd inform the HR department, that oughta spice things up for OM and your wife


----------



## keko

LOSTfan said:


> She claims that the thought of him now disgusts her, because she is out of the fog now. And thinking about him and how it damn near ruined our marriage makes her sick.


Your marriage is already ruined, I think she meant to say OM nearly had her a$$ kicked to the curb by you.


----------



## keko

MC is no magic cure to fix a marriage. Same for NC. In fact its a waste of money if she's still working in the same joint. You can be sure she'll offer him a goodbye fvck.


----------



## morituri

LOSTfan demand that she tell you who he is and the number where can be reached so that you can give him a call to him that if he continues pursuing your wife, that you are going to make it your mission in life to make his own life a living hell. This should destroy any illusions he may have that he can continue to pursue your wife without you being aware of anything.


----------



## LOSTfan

morituri said:


> LOSTfan demand that she tell you who he is and the number where can be reached so that you can give him a call to him that if he continues pursuing your wife, that you are going to make it your mission in life to make his own life a living hell. This should destroy any illusions he may have that he can continue to pursue your wife without you being aware of anything.


I already know who he is. I worked with him at this place last year. Thats how my wife works here, I got her the job. I already know he is too much of a coward to take my phone call.


----------



## Gabriel

LOSTfan said:


> Well we are going to marriage counseling asap. But how do I deal with the short term. She has work tomorrow where he lives. She has agreed to not work there anymore, but she has to find a new job first. Which makes sense, we cant make it financially unless she is working as well.
> 
> But I think we all know that while shes at work, i will slowly lose my mind with anger, resentment, worry, and sadness.
> 
> How do I get through while shes at work? Shes writing the NC letter today, but I tell myself she could easily write it out and either claim she gave it to him or gives it to him but tells him its all bs to quiet me. She claims that the thought of him now disgusts her, because she is out of the fog now. And thinking about him and how it damn near ruined our marriage makes her sick.
> 
> I dont know if thats just bs or not. Ugh so confused....


It might be BS - it might not. Right now you can't believe anything she says. Just watch her. Closely. This is still way too new.


----------



## Thorburn

The NC letter should be written by her and approved by you and sent by you and by certified mail.


----------



## LOSTfan

He doesn't have a mailbox. He lives in one of the hotel rooms. Its going to be near impossible for her to have nc when she works with him
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## keko

LOSTfan said:


> He doesn't have a mailbox. He lives in one of the hotel rooms. Its going to be near impossible for her to have nc when she works with him
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


If that is the case then any further attempt to kill the affair is useless. If you are set on reconciling with her, she needs to quit that job asap and find another work.


----------



## baldmale

...and as long as there is contact you should consider the affair active. 

Marriages can survive financial hardships, but not continuing affairs. Your decision to make together. Marriage or money.

And forget MC as a cure, most do more harm than good. She cheated because of poor boundaries plus time plus opportunity.

Save your money. Ending the contact will do more good than any amount of MC'ing. 

And you KNOW it was more than sex once, right? Unless of course you are the exception to every other poster here on TAM.


----------



## warlock07

Have you confronted him?


----------



## MattMatt

LOSTfan said:


> Oh By the way, she thinks I should do the same thing with another girl to make it even. She thinks I don't want to because I want to have the upper hand if we stay together... I said I don't want to because I am actually in love with her.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


No! Don't. I did and I ended up feeling I had betrayed not only my wife, but myself. Finding out that I could do that made me feel disgust with myself. I think it actually gave me a minor breakdown. Which, ironically, my wife -a trained psychologist- helped me through.


----------



## LOSTfan

I'm not going to sleep with another woman. I keep asking if it was more than once. But sheet keeps saying no. she didn't have to admit she slept with him. So I think she may be telling the truth about that.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## skip76

LOSTfan said:


> Well we are going to marriage counseling asap. But how do I deal with the short term. She has work tomorrow where he lives. She has agreed to not work there anymore, but she has to find a new job first. Which makes sense, we cant make it financially unless she is working as well.
> 
> But I think we all know that while shes at work, i will slowly lose my mind with anger, resentment, worry, and sadness.
> 
> How do I get through while shes at work? Shes writing the NC letter today, but I tell myself she could easily write it out and either claim she gave it to him or gives it to him but tells him its all bs to quiet me. She claims that the thought of him now disgusts her, because she is out of the fog now. And thinking about him and how it damn near ruined our marriage makes her sick.
> 
> I dont know if thats just bs or not. Ugh so confused....


fool me once shame on you fool me twice your ass gets divorced. Now she is disgusted, give me a break. You need to quit talking to her because she uses that time as manipulation and training her puppy not to run away. Show her a side of you she has never seen before. You might not have seen it either, find it.


----------



## LOSTfan

Honestly, I just feel dead inside. I'm walking around the house like a zombie.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## jh52

LOSTfan said:


> Honestly, I just feel dead inside. I'm walking around the house like a zombie.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Sorry you are going through this crap. Maybe she can move to her home town in south Florida and become friends with he ex like she wanted and accused you of being controlling !!

One day at a time Lost ----

Take care of yourself -- eat, exrecise, sleep, etc. You need to remain strong -- and keep healthy as well.


----------



## warlock07

LOSTfan said:


> I'm not going to sleep with another woman. I keep asking if it was more than once. But sheet keeps saying no. she didn't have to admit she slept with him. So I think she may be telling the truth about that.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


So she slept with him?




> He doesn't have a mailbox. He lives in one of the hotel rooms. Its going to be near impossible for her to have nc when she works with him


Damn!!!


----------



## MattMatt

LOSTfan said:


> Now she has admitted they did have sex once, 3 weeks ago. Claiming it was awful, and that because she had that a,5 minute sexual bad exp that it wasn't a sexual thing. Only a, liking of the way he made her feel.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes, it was just awful.

Actually, it might have been. Is it possible that her fantasy of cheating might have smashed into the reality of actually being a sexual cheater?


----------



## warlock07

I missed that post!!!

Of course they had sex. It was more than once. And he is smaller than you right? And she did not enjoy it? Bull****. It was going on for quite sometime. They did not even need a phone. If you can retrieve texts from the affair phone, do it..

No kids, bail out. Infidelity should a deal breaker if it isn't for the kids. It wasn't a drunken ONS !! She had affair phone and she hooked up repeatedly in his room. have no doubts about that. most importantly, you caught her. She did not confess.


----------



## keko

LOSTfan said:


> Honestly, I just feel dead inside. I'm walking around the house like a zombie.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Its normal. Just take care of yourself till you're back to usual. Do you have any friend/relative that you can hang out with? Not for drinks but just to talk.


----------



## LOSTfan

My best friend said he wouldn't be my friend if I even thought about taking her back. So i really don't have anyone to talk to about. Probably why I'm on here posting. I just feel like my happy go lucky soul has been ripped away from me, and it was replaced with pure nothingness. I don't know what to believe anymore, I don't know how I'm supposed to handle her at work now. We need to pay bills, and in vegas its 24% unemployment. So while she works on finding a new job, I have to deal with now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## keko

LOSTfan said:


> My best friend said he wouldn't be my friend if I even thought about taking her back. So i really don't have anyone to talk to about. Probably why I'm on here posting. I just feel like my happy go lucky soul has been ripped away from me, and it was replaced with pure nothingness. I don't know what to believe anymore, I don't know how I'm supposed to handle her at work now. We need to pay bills, and in vegas its 24% unemployment. So while she works on finding a new job, I have to deal with now.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Your friends position is understandable. Try to be indifferent to her for a while, till you are in a better mental state to weigh your options of what to do, when to do, how to do, etc.

In the mean time here's another users thread from vegas, you will find some similarities between yours. Its worth to look through. http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/44599-should-i-worried.html


----------



## morituri

Emotional detachment will serve you well in order to make an informed and rational decision as to the fate of your marriage.. Start by implementing the principles in *http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/24796-just-let-them-go.html#post306559* and *The 180 degree rules* so that you can attain the emotional detachment that will help you to move on with or without her.


----------



## The Middleman

LOSTFan:
Just stop being a mope and take charge of the situation. Like The Godfather said " You Can Act Like A Man"!

You got a lot of good advice here and you seen to keep shooting it down. What you have to do is clear.
1. Stop listening to her bullsh1t, it's all lies.
2. If she wants to stay with you, she quits her job tomorrow. There is no reason not to.
3. You confront this a$$hole and tell him that if he so much as looks in the direction of your wife, you'll rip his throat out with your bear hands. Then you can send a NC letter.
4. Contact your wife's company and let them know why she is quitting.
5. Expose the affair to everyone. Let her family know she changed her profession to "sperm bank".
6. If you are serious about R, bout of you to MC right away. She has accused you of being controlling, show her what that really means!
7. She doesn't agree to any of this, throw her a$$ into the street and tell her to take her sorry ass to Ft. Lauderdale.

If you don't start taking action, then stop complaining. Don't let life happen to you, SHAPE IT!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## LOSTfan

I'm going to implement the 180 right away. I have a question though... one of the rules stated don't talk about tthe marriage unless the w brings it up first. My w is already bringing it up. I want to talk about it, but seems to go agains the 180. Plus it said no dates, she mentioned wanting to go out to dinner tonight to talk about everything and hopefully start a clean start.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## morituri

LOSTfan said:


> I'm going to implement the 180 right away. I have a question though... one of the rules stated don't talk about tthe marriage unless the w brings it up first. My w is already bringing it up. I want to talk about it, but seems to go agains the 180. Plus it said no dates, she mentioned wanting to go out to dinner tonight to talk about everything and hopefully start a clean start.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Inform her that until there is absolutely NC (no contact) in any way shape or form, that you consider that the affair is still going and thus the marriage is headed towards divorce. And as far as dates are concerned, that also should be put on hold until NC is established and *verified through her actions of willingly adopting a policy of total transparency and honesty to start rebuilding the trust you had in her and she destroyed.*


----------



## LOSTfan

Middle, what advice am I directly ignoring? I'm doing the 180, working on me for me, ive confronted the om via text. I can't do it in person because he's in security at this hotel/club. Hell just get me kicked out. W is working on the nc letter as we speak. I got let go from my job instead of getting a promised promotion, so my w can't quit tomorrow. I hope you guys can understand that.

I am being mopey with you guys, but thats because I view you incredible people as my only outlet. I'm not doing that in front of her
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## keko

LOSTfan said:


> I'm going to implement the 180 right away. I have a question though... one of the rules stated don't talk about tthe marriage unless the w brings it up first. My w is already bringing it up. I want to talk about it, but seems to go agains the 180. Plus it said no dates, she mentioned wanting to go out to dinner tonight to talk about everything and hopefully start a clean start.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


A date? Come on LOST, you know better. Just ignore her for now, if she starts talking about how she's sorry, how she was going to stop, shed a few crocodile tears, just get up and go to a different room. Minimize your physical contact with her.

Have a look at the links moriture posted.


----------



## The Middleman

Sorry LOSTFan, I didn't know about your Job.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## keko

LOSTfan said:


> Middle, what advice am I directly ignoring? I'm doing the 180, working on me for me, ive confronted the om via text. I can't do it in person because he's in security at this hotel/club. Hell just get me kicked out. W is working on the nc letter as we speak. I got let go from my job instead of getting a promised promotion, so my w can't quit tomorrow. I hope you guys can understand that.
> 
> I am being mopey with you guys, but thats because I view you incredible people as my only outlet. I'm not doing that in front of her
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Don't bother with the NC letter. It will NOT work as long as she's working in the same place as OM. But the need for her to keep the job just complicates things. Have you looked for other/better jobs for yourself yet? Are you able to do minor jobs on the side? Can you sell a few things you don't really need, car, furniture, electronics, etc.?


----------



## Paladin

She should still do the NC letter, it will be a concrete way to hold her accountable for her actions. Once he is back on his feet financially, she can leave the job. 

She can also lodge a complaint with HR if he tries to talk to her after she does NC. Sexual harassment gets taken seriously by most companies.


----------



## Will_Kane

_*My best friend said he wouldn't be my friend if I even thought about taking her back.* So i really don't have anyone to talk to about. Probably why I'm on here posting. I just feel like my happy go lucky soul has been ripped away from me, and it was replaced with pure nothingness. I don't know what to believe anymore, I don't know how I'm supposed to handle her at work now. We need to pay bills, and in vegas its 24% unemployment. So while she works on finding a new job, I have to deal with now._

*Why would your best friend take such a hard line? What's his impression of your wife?*

Sending a no contact letter, when they actually still will be having contact every day, with you having no way to monitor their contact, will be minimally effective, but still worth doing. She writes it, you read it to make sure it says what it's supposed to say, then you have it delivered.

*You definitely, without a doubt, will get over any financial hardship that results from her leaving her job*. There is a good chance your marriage will not survive if she continue to work there.

*Focus on the important things in life*. What is more important, your marriage that you will have for the rest of your life or your temporary financial well-being? *Choose your marriage. Ask her to leave the job immediately*.

*Many cheaters "test the waters" with their lies.* She told you it was only kissing, you didn't get too upset, but you didn't buy it, she tried telling you it was sex only once, you got too upset, now she won't tell you it was more than that. 

*It's theoretically possible that she only had sex once, but it's not believable*, especially given that she works where other man lives and you can't account for what time she gets off work, what time she takes breaks, etc. By your own account, wife was worried that other man was going to dump her. He wouldn't do that after only one time having sex. She told him he was the best thing in her life - why would she limit sex to only one time if she felt this way? She lied to you about the initial nature of their relationship, she got a secret phone after she promised no more contact, then she had sex with him. She lied to you that she did it because you accused her, so she might as well, but then you find that she was in love with the other man, the best thing in her life, so obviously it wasn't just something she did to spite you.

She has lied to you many times already, with her words, with her actions, and with her omissions.

Describe all these circumstances to your wife, ask her if she can understand why you might have some doubt about her story, besides the fact that she confessed a kiss only and then having sex once, and then *ask her if she will take a polygraph to help you get over the doubt*.


----------



## LOSTfan

Will_Kane said:


> _*My best friend said he wouldn't be my friend if I even thought about taking her back.* So i really don't have anyone to talk to about. Probably why I'm on here posting. I just feel like my happy go lucky soul has been ripped away from me, and it was replaced with pure nothingness. I don't know what to believe anymore, I don't know how I'm supposed to handle her at work now. We need to pay bills, and in vegas its 24% unemployment. So while she works on finding a new job, I have to deal with now._
> 
> *Why would your best friend take such a hard line? What's his impression of your wife?*
> 
> Sending a no contact letter, when they actually still will be having contact every day, with you having no way to monitor their contact, will be minimally effective, but still worth doing. She writes it, you read it to make sure it says what it's supposed to say, then you have it delivered.
> 
> *You definitely, without a doubt, will get over any financial hardship that results from her leaving her job*. There is a good chance your marriage will not survive if she continue to work there.
> 
> *Focus on the important things in life*. What is more important, your marriage that you will have for the rest of your life or your temporary financial well-being? *Choose your marriage. Ask her to leave the job immediately*.
> 
> *Many cheaters "test the waters" with their lies.* She told you it was only kissing, you didn't get too upset, but you didn't buy it, she tried telling you it was sex only once, you got too upset, now she won't tell you it was more than that.
> 
> *It's theoretically possible that she only had sex once, but it's not believable*, especially given that she works where other man lives and you can't account for what time she gets off work, what time she takes breaks, etc. By your own account, wife was worried that other man was going to dump her. He wouldn't do that after only one time having sex. She told him he was the best thing in her life - why would she limit sex to only one time if she felt this way? She lied to you about the initial nature of their relationship, she got a secret phone after she promised no more contact, then she had sex with him. She lied to you that she did it because you accused her, so she might as well, but then you find that she was in love with the other man, the best thing in her life, so obviously it wasn't just something she did to spite you.
> 
> She has lied to you many times already, with her words, with her actions, and with her omissions.
> 
> Describe all these circumstances to your wife, ask her if she can understand why you might have some doubt about her story, besides the fact that she confessed a kiss only and then having sex once, and then *ask her if she will take a polygraph to help you get over the doubt*.


I think my best friend has suspected something was up. And just takes a hardline on cheating.

I agree we'll get over it. But we honestly have just enough to cover rent and every bill. On top of that we may have 20 extra bucks unless she keeps getting tips.

She never claimed she was in love with him. She tells me that word was never even uttered between them, and it certainly wasn't mentioned in the hidden phone. Her explanation of why she told him he was the best thing in her life was " i was caught up in the moment, you and I both hate vegas, i hate my job, i hate that you were getting mad at me for everything possible and smothering me, it drove me to this, I wouldn't of had the affair if you didn't get so jealous of it" Now I call bull**** on the last part, but if that's her explanation of the 'best' line, ok, whatever. But I'm not falling for the predictable "you drove me to this" crap.

She has stated that she will gladly take a polygraph test. Im thinking of calling that possible bluff. I would love for her to pass it.


----------



## Acabado

Marriage is ''Dead'' until:
1; She erases OM from her life.
2; She agrees ALL rules.
Marriage is on probation untilL
3; She start fixing herself and you can see consistents efforts abourt how she's learning about boundaires, searching her soul, examining her actions and though process cross checking with healthy ones.
There's tons of books out there, online sources... She's the one to find info on how to fix this mess and implement it.
You back off. You are sick of being is police/father. She screwed up her marriage big time.
No dates.
No MC. Better she get into IC.
Hard 180.


----------



## Acabado

> i hate that you were getting mad at me for everything possible and smothering me, it drove me to this, I wouldn't of had the affair if you didn't get so jealous of it"


Total blameshifter!!. She knows well she wouldn't accept ever this behavior from you. It's not jelousy, it's called boundaires, i'ts called respect your self and your spouse, it's called to honor her vows. Don't accept ahy inch of the blame. She historicaly has showed horrible boundaires.
Got up in the moment? She's lying her as...
She was busted, again, she went underground, she got an affair phone she f0cked OM... It's typical cheating. She's no special nor unique.

Unless she start taking reponsability and is done with bull****ing you you should move on. I Have little hope.


----------



## morituri

Her blame shifting is more worthy of a rebellious teenage girl than a adult woman. Tell her to grow up and own up to her actions for *nobody put a gun to her head and forced her to have an affair with the OM.*


----------



## keko

LOSTfan said:


> She has stated that she will gladly take a polygraph test. Im thinking of calling that possible bluff. I would love for her to pass it.


Have her take the test soon. Prepare the questions now and make sure to ask a few if she had other affairs.

It seems you have already forgiven her and wanting to R. If you want it to last a long time you have to make her suffer hard consequence's now so in the future she'll know she used up her chances and will not be forgiven again.


----------



## LOSTfan

Aside From nc with the om, and doing anything to let me be comfortable again, what are good realistic hard consequences? 

Right now I feel like I'm bi polar, one minute I'm enraged with her and the situation. And the, next minute I'm hoping she takes all the necessary steps to allow us to be the happy loving couple we were 2 months ago
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Will_Kane

*you were getting mad at me for everything possible and smothering me, it drove me to this, I wouldn't of had the affair if you didn't get so jealous of it" Now I call bull**** on the last part, but if that's her explanation of the 'best' line, ok, whatever.* 

If you don't believe her about being driven to have the affair by her actions, aren't you concerned about what the real reason for the affair is?

If she is willing to get the polygraph, do so as soon as possible. Find out about the frequency of the sex and how many other affairs she has had. Why spend more time in limbo wondering about the truth than you have to?

Out here in cyberspace, we have seen many cheating spouses seem to say and do all the right things, unfortunately, cheaters lie. You can't believe their words until it is supported by actions. Because your wife works with the other man, you will have no peace. You will not know if she tells him to ignore the no contact letter, you will not know if they are talking, you will not know they are having sex. She already had sex with him at least once, at work, now she has to work with him every day until she finds a new job in a city with a high unemployment rate where pretty waitresses are a dime a dozen. Add to that, your wife is blaming you for her actions, she didn't want to cheat, but you made her. That shows that she is not out of the affair mindset, what many refer to as "the fog."

She told other man he was the best thing in her life - she has not told him otherwise yet. She told you he was disgusting. That's quite a swing, from being the best thing in her life to being disgusting. Add that to the list of things about her story that don't make sense. *When a story doesn't make sense, it usually is a lie.* Your apparent willingness to accept the lies and just want to get past it and back to where you (thought you) were two months ago shows that you are in a bit of a fog yourself.

*She says all they did was make out.*

You posted that lie less than 24 hours ago.

There is a term called "trickle truth," meaning just what it sounds like, and about 100% of cheaters do it. Your wife has done it already. Is she done with the trickle truth, or do you think there is more?


----------



## Will_Kane

Consequences:

Have her handwrite a no contact letter stating how horribly ashamed she is of her behavior, how terrible she feels for risking losing her husband, who she loves more than anything in the world, and stating that if other man contacts her again in any way, shape or form, other than strictly business, she will file harassment charges against him both with human resources and the police.

She begins looking for another job immediately. Has she started looking yet? While you are looking for a job, you can help her look, too.

Expose the affair to the other man's girlfriend or wife if he has one. Don't tell your wife you are doing this.

She handwrites a timeline of the affair for you. First contact, when she decided to kiss, first kiss, when she decided to make it sexual, first sexual encounter, dates and times of all significant events of the affair.

Polygraph as soon as possible.

Get tested for STDs - her and you. Pregnancy test for her. Not that a condom prevents all STDs, but I assume they didn't use one.

She throws away all of her phones and gets a new one with a new phone number. She gives you the phone to block the other man. Also block on Facebook or any other social media she has.

She gives you access to all communication devices and accounts. She lets you know her whereabouts 24/7 until she earns back trust.

She throws away any lingerie she wore for the other man or any other items that trigger you.

She said she felt "smothered" before. How is she going to feel now that you KNOW she was cheating, you jealousy was justified, and you have to check up on her every move until she earns your trust back?


----------



## jnj express

Have your wife, call in sick, for a few days---I know, you arn't gonna solve your financial problems that way---but the 2 of you can try and figure out where your future is

Is the hotel she works at, part of a chain---if so, can she transfer to another hotel---many of the hotel ownership groups have 2 to 3 hotels in vegas

If you are gonna stay and R, then she has to go NC, and leave the job---its just the way it has to be---she obviously has no resolve, or firm boundaries, and he being in security, can move around as he pleases, and just stay on top of her---you, yourself, will have no chance---so money or no money---she's gotta leave

If you don't want to stay in this mge, then she keeps her job.

You, yourself, for you, have to decide, what you want for a future

You probably won't get anywhere complaining to HR---the vegas hotels, are mostly part of big corporations, whose bottom line is the greenback dollar, and they don't really care about their employees

What has she been doing if anything, to help this mge--

- I got to tell you, you got blinders on, if you think she only had sex, once----she works right in the bldg, where he has an apt.---and they get at least a half hour for lunch---Draw your own conclusions


----------



## turnera

LOSTfan said:


> She has stated that she will gladly take a polygraph test. Im thinking of calling that possible bluff. I would love for her to pass it.


Oh for God's sake - just SCHEDULE the damn polygraph already!


----------



## bandit.45

He doesn't have the money for a poly. He needs to boot her cheating a*s out. She can go be a live in wh+re for the OM. He doesn't need to worry about finding her a place to stay.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## lovelygirl

LOSTfan said:


> I think my best friend has suspected something was up. And just takes a hardline on cheating.
> 
> .


I think your friend reacted over the top. 
You need him in this difficult moment. If he's not by your side then why is he a best friend then. 

Fine, he said he "wouldn't talk" to you unless you divorce her but he should NOT really mean it.


----------



## morituri

I've found that the worse thing you can do to a cheating spouse is not to have a RA but to simply leave them - even if it breaks your heart to do so.


----------



## LOSTfan

Now I've begun to get obsessed with wanting to know every detail about what happened to them.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## warlock07

LOSTfan said:


> Now I've begun to get obsessed with wanting to know every detail about what happened to them.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It would have been more odd if you did not want to know the details. You know the rules right?


----------



## morituri

LOSTfan said:


> Now I've begun to get obsessed with wanting to know every detail about what happened to them.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


That is your anger and bitterness taking advantage of your weakened emotional state. Do not give in for it doesn't matter whether or not your divorce her or not, but whether you can be freed of those two toxic twins. If you don't confront them head on, they will rule your life until you die.


----------



## LOSTfan

Well The only way we could come up with me knowing she actually ended it with om is for me to stay and spy . But then id be doing that for 9 hours, I think id shoot myself.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Machiavelli

LOSTfan said:


> Well The only way we could come up with me knowing she actually ended it with om is for me to stay and spy . But then id be doing that for 9 hours, I think id shoot myself.


If you aren't willing to monitor, divorce is definitely called for. You'll drive yourself nuts wondering what she's doing.


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## anonymouskitty

Remember Rhett Butler?

"Frankly my dear, I don't give a damn" and then he's out(now if that ain't alpha I don't know what is)

Lost, at this point YOU need to do something rather than just sit as a mute observer


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## Kallan Pavithran

Put the marriage under suspension till you sort this out and decide what you want R or D. Inform this to her. She wanted you to get over thi soon, so she is planning dates and need assurance from you that you want R so she want to talk about the marriage. She may be scared that you will D.

Dont hesitate to take the poly, her offer may be a bluff. Proceed with that, you may get more details like more encounters at the last moment. So tell her you are proceeding with her offer and see her reaction,

Dont allow her to manipulate you again.


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## LOSTfan

So heres my plan for today. Since I look at it as being a very important crossroad day. He was out of town this week, so he is either finding out the gig is up today, or found out yesterday and was waiting for W to go to work before he made his next move. 

W has said she will not talk to him today, even if its because OM wants to talk. She will only take breaks in public places and thats that. She will avoid him like this until another job is found and then the NC letter will be given to him.


Well today, I'm going to put it to the test. I am taking her to work, and I'm going to make it seem that I'm going home to worry and wonder. But in fact, I have the ipod charging, because my ass is going to by spying all day long today. She's working the pool today, and since I used to work there, I know exactly where I can hide and watch. Its gonna be 8 hours in the miserable sun, but whatever. Its time to save my marriage. Or its time to kick it off the cliff. So if spending 8 hours in the sun sweating my ass off, watching nothing is what it takes, so be it. But I need to test everything. I need to see for myself that she doesn't talk to him.


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## LOSTfan

You guys are going to have to entertain me lol. Ill be giving updates throughout the day. Should I make a new thread? or just add to this one?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## anonymouskitty

Thats the way Lost old chum, proof is better than blindly trusting


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## tacoma

Keep it in this one, that way those who have been following can stay informed more easily
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tacoma

What is his job title at the hotel?

The om


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

So plan is already in action. I got all dolled up. Styled my hair, Im wearing an outfit that I know she thinks I look hot in. And she thinks Im meeting someone . So I neither confirmed nor denied her thoughts. She deserves to wonder for a little bit. And if that wonder turns into jealousy, which then makes her decide f it and goes to the OM, fine with me, Ill get to see how weak she is first hand.


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## LOSTfan

tacoma said:


> What is his job title at the hotel?
> 
> The om
> 
> 
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



Hes a security/host front door guy when the hotel turns into a club. So he's not on until 10pm tonight. So he'll have plenty of free time today to pay a visit to the hotel pool. (which is where she works today)


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## Acabado

No way to find out without PI, no money for PI, you become the PI. After all we all do this more or less. Take care amd don't forget the water!!


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## keko

If you do see them talking don't approach them right away, take a few pictures then go home and calm down a bit. If you see them walking up to his room, go back home change the locks and put her crap on the front lawn.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

Keko. That Will be the plan of action. I'm now parked, hidden away waiting for rd 1. she sounded so convincing and remorseful. we'll see if it was all bs or not in a, minute
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## anonymouskitty

Don't blow up and don't try to act as c0ck block now, just take the pics as keko suggested and go home and change locks


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## LOSTfan

So, 1 hour in, not much action. Dropped her off, waited 15 minutes. First parked the car away hidden. Then I went in through the lobby. First went to the pool area, saw her setting things up. Went back in, waited 15 minwent back to pool, couldn't see her, but there are a couple areas I didn't have a view of. So I went to spots I knew they met up at and she wasn't there. Then I risked getting caught, and saw her in the bar finishing set up. So all good 1 hour in. Just killing time for 15 min or so before I head back in. Anyone live in vegas,and want to help out??
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

Be patient, give it some time. If they are doing something you'll catch it before the day ends.


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## turnera

Is there someone at the hotel who knows both of you? If they see you, they're liable to say something to her.


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## LOSTfan

I'm staying away from anyone who knows me. Theres certain places i can walk where I stay out of the way.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NewM

What is her schedule,do you plan on catching them while he comes to pool party or while he is working too?

If she started working at 11am and he only starts working at 10pm,will she still be working when he starts his shift?


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## LOSTfan

her shift ends at 8 but since he lives here, times really don't matter
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NewM

Ah yeah I forgot that he lives there.Are you careful that he doesn't notice you,watch for him too because if he notices you he probably wont do anything.


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## LOSTfan

oh I'm definitely on the look out for him too. 2 and a half hours in, so far so good.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chaparral

Any news? How do you like PI work?Maybe you have found a new calling. From what we have been hearing here, Vegas needs plenty of PIs.LOL

Good luck on finding nothing amiss.


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## LOSTfan

5 hours in everything still all good. I'm beginning to think she is either telling the truth finally, or he's not here at the moment
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NewM

I think for you to be sure you will have to see him trying to talk to her and her not wanting to talk to him,if he doesn't even approach her you might just picked wrong day when he doesn't feel like talking to her or is with another girl,or he somehow saw you.


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## LOSTfan

Yea I agree. One thing im thinking with all this time to myself is.... She says that catching her and her seeing the destruction it was causing, made her instantly see him in a different light. This person who she thought was so sweet was knowingly persuing a friends wife. No sweet person does that. She says honestly the thought of, him now repulses her....


Was this change her coming out of the fog?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

Watch her actions not her words.

Does the OM have a car? Do you know what brand it is?


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## LOSTfan

Keko, yes but all I know its a lexus, theres a couple lexuses parked
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

LOSTfan said:


> Keko, yes but all I know its a lexus, theres a couple lexuses parked
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You could take a little break, you'll drop by towards the end of her shift.

Did she tell you exactly what time she'll be out? Or will she stay for a little overtime as usual?


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## LOSTfan

She said 7 but her boss called her last night and said to stay an hour longer. I verified this with her call log.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

Ah, at 530 I got caught. Well kinda, she saw the car and asked me on the phone, I said I stopped by to say hi.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NewM

How did she see the car if you parked it away hidden?
Maybe OM saw it or she was extra careful.

Anyway you got busted so its gonna be harder to catch them and if you never came by to just say hi she will probably think something is up,if you plan on doing this again you gotta park your car really far away.

Or you could just repark your car today and continue spying


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## keko

Oh well.. from now on if there is anything it'll either stop temporarily or go deeper underground.


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## LOSTfan

Well, I moved it and got lazy and thought I parked it well, but forgot it was in line of sight to the back gate where employees take smoke breaks. So I went home, talked to her from the house to confirm in her mind I was home.heading back right now. I don't see how it'll go deeper underground when she's job hunting tomorrow. She's writing the NC letter tonight and wanted me to ask you guys how those are supposed to go. Besides the obvious, any structure to them that's standard ?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

She knows you're on this site?


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## Chaparral

LOSTfan said:


> Ah, at 530 I got caught. Well kinda, she saw the car and asked me on the phone, I said I stopped by to say hi.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Epic fail Maxwell Smart :rofl:LOL


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## LOSTfan

she know im on a site. Nothing in particular.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

LOSTfan said:


> she know im on a site. Nothing in particular.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Message one of the moderator's to move this to the private section. Your title is pretty obvious.


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## Will_Kane

No contact letter - I like this:

Date

Other Man First Name Last Name:

I am horribly ashamed of my behavior. I feel terrible for risking losing my marriage and husband, who I love more than anything in the world. Do not ever attempt to contact me again in any way, shape, or form other than strictly for business. If you ever try to contact me again other than strictly for business, I will file harassment charges against you both with human resources and the police.

Signed,

Wife First Name Last Name


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## Chaparral

Will_Kane said:


> No contact letter - I like this:
> 
> Date
> 
> Other Man First Name Last Name:
> 
> I am horribly ashamed of my behavior. I feel terrible for risking losing my marriage and husband, who I love more than anything in the world. Do not ever attempt to contact me again in any way, shape, or form other than strictly for business. If you ever try to contact me again other than strictly for business, I will file harassment charges against you both with human resources and the police.
> 
> Signed,
> 
> Wife First Name Last Name


I think there is one in the newbies thread also.


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## ferndog

LOSTfan said:


> Aside From nc with the om, and doing anything to let me be comfortable again, what are good realistic hard consequences?
> 
> Right now I feel like I'm bi polar, one minute I'm enraged with her and the situation. And the, next minute I'm hoping she takes all the necessary steps to allow us to be the happy loving couple we were 2 months ago
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Maybe you were happy 2 months ago but she's been carrying on for a whole so she sure wasn't. Marriage is beautiful but it takes two to believe in it. Time will tell if she does or doesn't. And time will tell if your heart will forgive. Either way both of you need soul searching. Why did you Marry each other? Because you love each other? Because all the little things each does adds up to happiness inside the heart? Because you knew they may not be perfect but with the imperfections they were perfect for you? You married a partner a best friend. Someone who believes in you. Someone that would stand by your side no matter what battles come.

Or maybe not. Only you both know
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## The Middleman

I really like what your doing tonight!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

Well, she did great. And I know he's here. I just have to stay away, I saw him from afar, and the feeling in my stomach is something words cannot describe
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

I'm At a loss.... Once home, I tried to have my wife read the thread for new membersi thought it had a lot of great information on how to start the rebuilding process. All she did was huff and puff and act like I was torturing her. Once I got her to sit down with me and read it, she, only could complain there were too many acronyms and it was stupid. I just said fine f it , walked outside and posted this. Does She really not care....
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## anonymouskitty

She's clearly not remorseful. You can't change someone for the better when they're hell bent on their own destruction http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/24796-just-let-them-go.html#post306559

and start doing The Healing Heart: The 180

Unless of course you're a glutton for punishment


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## Will_Kane

*I'm At a loss.... Once home, I tried to have my wife read the thread for new membersi thought it had a lot of great information on how to start the rebuilding process. All she did was huff and puff and act like I was torturing her. Once I got her to sit down with me and read it, she, only could complain there were too many acronyms and it was stupid. I just said fine f it , walked outside and posted this. Does She really not care....*

Affair is over. Let's get back to normal. Just get over it. Stop acting like I'm a cheater. You made me cheat, I didn't want to. Now you're going to make me read boring stuff?

This is called rug sweeping.

Looks like your wife feels like she is giving you a gift because she ended the affair, not that you are giving her a gift by not divorcing her for her adulterous affair.


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## LOSTfan

Well she did end up reading it with me. And, it looked, like she, really tried. And it actually showed like she cares a little., we'll see. She did say that it was nice to read about how I'm acting and put a, name to it. One concern she has brought up is my constant questioning. I keep, asking for details of everything. From the sex to conversations they had. And,i will ask these same questions over and over
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

Excuse the commas, on my slide phone, it automatically puts them in and I don't notice when I'm typing fast
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lordmayhem

LOSTfan said:


> I'm At a loss.... Once home, I tried to have my wife read the thread for new membersi thought it had a lot of great information on how to start the rebuilding process. All she did was huff and puff and act like I was torturing her. Once I got her to sit down with me and read it, she, only could complain there were too many acronyms and it was stupid. I just said fine f it , walked outside and posted this. Does She really not care....
> _Posted via Mobile Device_












Why do many of the newly betrayed think that by bringing their *unremorseful WS* here to read the stories and links that will suddenly snap them out of the fog? 

The only thing it accomplishes is that it ruins your safe place to vent AND allows them to take the affair farther underground because we post advice about investigation techniques here.

Look LOSTfan, you can't make her remorseful. You can't make her come out of the fog. She has to want to save the marriage.


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## ing

> Look LOSTfan, you can't make her remorseful. You can't make her come out of the fog. She has to want to save the marriage.


This is really hard to accept but sometimes they just want out and catching them just makes it easier for them.


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## LOSTfan

Well She came home today and immediatelty wrote the nc letter without me saying anything. Shes Writing it inside now as I'm replaxing outside watching the sunset
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## morituri

LOSTfan, convey to your wife that until further notice that the marriage is on probationary status and whether it survives or not will depend greatly on her actions or lack of. Why? because she will know that despite any attempts on her part to rugsweep her affair, that it won't fly with you. She must be made to understand that you have one foot out the marriage and that if she is truly serious about regaining your trust, that she will have to prove it to you by deeds and not words.


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## LOSTfan

how do i convey that now. I don't think I've said we're made up or its back to normal in anyway. I wrote a letter today that gave her my list of what I wouldn't tolerate if she wants any chance of me back.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

Note to add, she is always adamant I wear my ring. She Knows and has mentioned how i haven't put it on since dday. I think to her we aren't back together until I put it on. And I'm not doing that until actions prove her remorse
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## morituri

LOSTfan said:


> Note to add, she is always adamant I wear my ring. She Knows and has mentioned how i haven't put it on since dday. I think to her we aren't back together until I put it on. And I'm not doing that until actions prove her remorse
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes. This is one of the ways to convey to her that the marriage is on probation. Good job, keep it up.


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## LOSTfan

Thanks. She Sees it on my night stand just sitting there. And she makes sure to wear hers every minute regardless
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## morituri

Print the following and give it to your wife to read:



> *"How to Rebuild Your Spouse's Trust After an Affair"*
> 
> *#1 Stop lying or making excuses for your actions.* If the victim spouse presents evidence of the affair, own up to it. You need to understand that the worst thing that could happen has already occurred. You were dishonest and unfaithful. Therefore, continuing to lie, twist, or deny is simply adding insult to injury. If you are looking your spouse in the eye and claiming to want the marriage to work then you cannot continue to lie about various odds and ends. You have been lying to your spouse for the entire duration of the affair; therefore, if you continue to lie now, it sets the reconciliation process way back. ''The victim spouse likely knows the answers to the questions they are asking, or can usually find out, so if you are interested in rebuilding trust in the relationship, '''STOP LYING'''.'' If your spouse discovers later - either on purpose or by accident - that you have lied about or left out salient details, they will likely never trust you again. Your only hope of regaining their trust is to give them the truth wholesale, and thus demonstrate your commitment to being honest with them, even about things that might hurt them. You are kidding yourself if you think you are protecting your spouse by "omitting" certain truths. If you had wanted to protect your spouse, you never would have allowed them to get hurt in the first place.
> 
> *#2 Be around*. While emotional availability in the days, weeks, and even months following the discovery of your affair is of the '''utmost importance''', keep in mind that ''you can only be emotionally available when you're around.'' Understand that, left alone, your spouse's thoughts will begin to eat away at them - they will have questions you are not there to answer, torment themselves with images you cannot dispel, and invent suspicions your absence will only worsen. ''Paranoia is only natural during this time''; in fact, it can hardly be called paranoia, as '''they are right to mistrust you - you have betrayed them deeply'''. Being around to answer their questions and soothe their thoughts will keep them from building up and causing future explosions down the road. If it is possible, this may be a good time to take some time away from your normal "alone" activities to spend with your spouse. If you can't be with them physically, keep your phone on whenever possible to answer their calls, and allow them as much access to you as they need. Depending on your spouse's temperament, you may need to respect their desire for time alone, but you need to keep ''yourself'' available to ''them.''
> 
> *#3 DO NOT get defensive or assign blame.* This is not the time to employ the old adage of “the best defense is a good offense.” This is the time to be contrite/regretful, remorseful, empathetic, compassionate, honest, and emotionally available. Do not say anything which will give the impression that the victim spouse drove you to cheat, or in any way contributed to your behavior. There will be plenty of time to pass the blame around later on during counseling sessions, or during times of productive conversation with your mate. Additionally, DO NOT waste time blaming the affair on anyone or anything else. DO NOT point the finger toward temptation, being under the influence or falling prey to a stalker or that he/she was someone that you came in contact with at work or via a friend. '''You should have no room for excuses anymore.''' Telling your spouse you did not realize what was happening is not only bogus, it devalues the victim spouse. The victim spouse will see right through these excuses and will view this as another attempt to keep them in the dark while you continue playing them for a fool. The best way to effectively deal with your spouse's anger, and start the process of rebuilding trust, is to ''take complete and full ownership of your own selfishness, immaturity, or basic destructive marital behavior.'' '''Remind yourself that it is quite possible that the victim spouse was enduring similar feelings of unhappiness or frustration, but instead made a conscious decision not to betray you.''
> 
> *#4 Treat your spouse as if they are the very center of your world.* While you should do this anyway, it is of ''monumental importance'' that you focus on this IMMEDIATELY following the discovery of the affair. This is a critical time in the recovery of your relationship; '''dedicate yourself to it.''' Being cheated on will make your spouse feel rejected, unimportant, and decidedly less than "special." Regardless of your reasons or given situation, your spouse will be under the rightful impression that you have chosen someone over them, which is a difficult thing for them to face after years of thinking they were the most important person in your life.'This is especially true if you were involved in a long term relationship.'Giving your spouse your full attention during this time will help them to regain the feelings of importance in your life, and will go a long way towards convincing them that you are unlikely to choose somebody over them again.'' If you can, also show and tell to other people and the world even more how much you care or love your spouse in order to help the victim spouse overcome all the humiliation and hurt this burden may have caused.
> 
> *#5 CUT any and ALL possible ties with the other man/woman.* Keeping a person in your life with whom you have had an affair is like trying to put toothpaste back into the tube. Not only is this a confusing message to the other person, ''it is also EXTREMELY DISRESPECTFUL to your spouse.'' It does not matter if you have known this other man/woman since kindergarten, or have to see this person at work. It is time to break those ties. '''Do what you must to avoid any contact.''' Convincing yourself that you need to talk to them to 'break it off' only communicates that their feelings, not your spouse's, are what you are most concerned about. Once you have allowed another individual to permeate, invade or undermine your marital union, there is no place for this person in your life. ''You simply cannot expect your victim spouse to move past the affair as long as you continue communicating with, seeing, or having any type of relationship with this other man/woman.'' '''It is in fact an insult''' to the intelligence of your current spouse for you to say that you can maintain a professional, platonic, or otherwise innocent relationship with this ''destructive individual''. Furthermore, '''because this person had an affair with a married man/woman, most likely they have absolutely NO RESPECT for your marriage.''' Continuing to work with, hang out with, email or chat with this person is probably the single worst possible thing to do if you are wanting to repair your marriage.
> 
> *#6 Your life MUST be an open book.* ''You no longer have the '''luxury''' of coming and going as you please.'' Once you have ''abused'' that privilege, ''it takes a while and a whole lot of effort to get it back.'' Therefore, if you will be late coming home from work, or have had a change in plans, inform your spouse. Every time you leave the house your spouse is now wondering if you are going where you say you are going. The best way to ease their insecurities is to check in throughout the day. Invite your spouse places you usually go alone like to the game, the gym or the mall. Let your spouse know that you have nothing to hide. Additionally, do not hide your cell phone or set the ringer on silent. If your spouse requests, give them your email and voice mail pass codes. In fact, if you have nothing to hide then offer your spouse the codes without them having to ask. Don't lock your cell phone, call log or address book. Offer to let your spouse see your phone bills, and keep the credit card or bank statements in plain view on the kitchen table. ''Although your spouse may never choose to check these things, the simple fact that you made them available for his/her perusal will be a HUGE step in regaining their trust.'' Although you may feel as though some of these are a violation of your privacy, you need to know that these steps are absolutely NECESSARY if you are trying to rebuild trust. Saying that you are on the straight and narrow while continuing to hide your cell phone or spending is counterproductive to your stated goal of wanting to rebuild your marriage.
> 
> *#7 Be prepared to answer any and all questions about information that your spouse has a legitimate right to know.* Your spouse is going to want lots of details and ask questions about things you may not want to answer, but too bad. Your spouse is going to cross reference your prior stories and ask you to confirm if “this” or “that” was a lie. You simply need to fess up. ''The worse thing you can do is to conceal information because you don't want to hurt your spouse.'' Remember, they have already been '''hurt beyond belief''', so continuing to withhold additional information gives the appearance of an attempt to continue the ''deception''. Your spouse needs to get a general understanding of how intense the relationship was, and how long it lasted. Although this may be one of the most difficult steps in the process, it is one of the most important. It is extremely difficult for a betrayed spouse to know that there is another man/woman in the world who has more information about their marriage then themselves. That there are people that know about that relationship and may be talking about your marriage. Therefore, asking multiple questions helps the betrayed spouse get up to speed, thus obtaining necessary information to deal with feelings of being in the dark while their spouse was gallivanting or mooching around with their lover/relationship.
> 
> *#8 '''Do not ever''' attempt to dictate the length of time the victim spouses recovery should take.* You are the one who brought the outsider into the marriage, and therefore, '''you are in no position to dictate when the victim spouse should be “over it”.''' The truth of the matter is, the victim spouse will never fully be “over it”, but may simply learn how to mentally move past the affair. When a person is hurting, they typically share their pain with the closest person to them. As their spouse, you are the one they will vent to, even though it is you that caused the pain. Additionally, you may feel as though since you've confessed, apologized and vowed to remain faithful, things should now return to normal. That is simply NOT the case. '''One of the worst things that can happen is for the adulterous spouse to begin acting as though its “business as usual”.''' Deciding to remain in a relationship after your spouse has cheated is a '''Major decision''' and one which can be both '''very humiliating and enormously stressful.''' ''DO NOT downplay the GREAT MAGNITUDE of that decision by behaving as though nothing happened.'' '''For the next few years''', the adulterous spouse '''needs''' to periodically wrap their arms around their mate, kiss them, and THANK them for another chance. Additionally, 'acknowledge' how much you hurt your spouse, how difficult it must be for them to get over the pain, and '''vow to do whatever necessary to make things better…forever.''' Although it may seem as though such actions will revive the pain, that is simply not the case. ''Acknowledging the degree of pain you put your spouse through, and expressing appreciation for another chance'', gives the victim spouse the impression that you not only are mindful of their pain, but that as long as you are aware of their struggle to overcome the ordeal, you will be less likely to make such awful choices again in the future.
> 
> *#9 Choose your battles wisely.* Keep in mind that now is not necessarily the time to pick fights over certain topics, particularly those related to privacy and possessiveness. Your spouse is feeling betrayed and frightened; it is only natural for them in this state to project those fears onto situations that bear (in their mind) any resemblance to your affair. If a random stranger flirts with you, or buys you a drink at a bar, and your spouse becomes agitated, remember that your spouse has an '''understandable right''' to this possessiveness; you have shaken their feelings of security in the relationship, and it is openness and understanding that will gain this back, not combativeness and arguments. ''Rather than angrily asserting your rights, you will do much better to gain their trust by assuring them of their importance to you and soothing their bruised ego and wounded heart with compliments and understanding.''
> 
> *#10 '''Do not''' behave inappropriately or create future problems.* Don't put yourself in situations which will cause your victim spouse undue stress. Putting your friends before your spouse, joining singles website, spending time with friends of opposite sex, or available singles, and forming relationships with them, is certainly not wise. Even with work relationships keep the conversations to a minimum, remember that this is how relationships begin or cross messages are sent. ''It is extremely selfish and disrespectful to your spouse.'' Additionally, make your spouse aware when you anticipate coming into contact with the other man/woman. If you suspect the other man/woman might be at the holiday party, let your spouse know in advance. Also, if you run into, or have contact with, the other man/woman unexpectedly, let your spouse know as soon as possible. Nothing is worse than finding out about contact with the other man/woman that the victim spouse did not know about. It gives the impression of further secrecy and deception. Trust me, it won't hurt your spouse to know the other man/woman is contacting you as much as it will hurt them to discover you hid that information. ''Believe me, during this time of broken trust, full disclosure is always the best route.''
> 
> *#11 Use this '''opportunity''' to create a new relationship with your spouse.* Be open to opportunities to bring each other closer together. Remember that your spouse now views your relationship as broken, and they're right to think so. The key, then, is to forge a new relationship in as many ways as possible. '' Finding new places to spend time and share activities together will help this.'' Make sure that he or she and everyone around you (i.e.family, friends, children) can see that your spouse means the world to you and is NOW being put first in your life. '''Speak highly of your spouse in a genuine way, being careful to protect their reputation when you speak to others'''--talking badly about them behind their backs is ''not only a BIG MISTAKE but also BAD BEHAVIOR'' (it may also reflect badly on you as their spouse). You and your spouse (and your children) are one family that must always protect, support, and lift each other up all the time especially from strangers and NOT the other way around. This may even be an opportunity, in the fullness of time and once the recovery process is very well on its way, to renew your wedding vows. Help your partner to see that you have created something new, stronger, and therefore not threatened by the sins of your past or the likelihood of future infidelities.
> 
> Stephanie Anderson
> Editor-in-Chief
> Marriage Sherpa


----------



## morituri

Oh and here's something for you to read as well:



marduk said:


> I happened to be thinking today about the past year of my marriage. Everyone on these forums were so instrumental in my being in the great place I am today I thought I would post a note about where I was, where I am, and what I’ve learned.
> 
> A year ago my marriage was a mess. After 3 kids my stay at home wife spontaneously decided to start going out with her girlfriends again, including a “girls trip” to Vegas. She started a crazy fitness routine, including marathon running and triathalons. She started leaving me at home with the kids 2-3 evenings a week. A rough summer. I was insecure, controlling, alone, and afraid.
> 
> Thanks in part to the folks on this forum, life is much better now. My wife only goes out with her friends maybe once a month, and the last time she did, she came home early, threw her arms around me, and told me she’s so happy she gets to come home to me. She goes to the gym maybe once or twice a week for an hour or so in the early evening. When she does leave on races out of town the whole family will go on a camping trip together so we can be there for her at the finish line. The stress level in the house is much lower, and our happiness and respect for each other is much higher. Are things perfect? No – we still fight, have conflict, and disagree. But they’re shorter-lived, not has hostile, and just plain don’t seem to hurt so much. What’s changed?_ Me._ Here’s what I learned:
> 
> *1.	Let her go.* You can fight, hold her back, be controlling… and you’ll just look petty, insecure, and weak. Be cool, act secure, give her a kiss and say “have fun.” If she’s going to cheat or leave, she’s going to cheat or leave. It’s better if it happens sooner rather than later in my book. A marriage is a choice, a decision that’s made one day at a time. You’re in or out. This was really, really hard. But I've learned that nothing lasts forever, life is change. We can grow together or apart. I can't force her to decide to want to be with me.
> 
> *2.	Set boundaries, and then stick to them.* I found in my marriage that it wasn’t ok to say “I don’t want you to do that” but it was ok to say “would you be ok with me doing that?” And then hold her to it. 9 times out of 10 the behaviour would go away on its own if I stuck to it. For example: if it was ok for her to be gone 2-3 nights a week so would I. After a couple of weeks she was dying to sit on the couch and watch a movie after we spent the evening with the kids together. Conversely, if it's within your boundaries, be cool with it. I started to let her off the hook for minor annoyances a lot more which cooled the stress levels.
> 
> *3.	Be ok with losing her.* Seriously. After one of our last bad fights before things got better, I reconciled myself to thinking this might be it. The end of our marriage and little family. I thought out how things would be living on my own, sharing custody of the kids, etc. And as tough as it would be, made peace with it. It wouldn’t kill me, it wouldn’t kill my kids. Very negative experience and one I’d like to avoid at all costs, but we would survive. This changed my attitude and clinginess significantly… and to be blunt scared the hell out of my wife. Just last month she told me “I think you’d be more ok without me than I’d be without you.” And for our marriage, that balance of neediness works. I think it’s an alpha male thing, not sure but it seems to work.
> 
> *4.	Do my own thing.* I’m out at least once or twice a week doing martial arts, yoga, weights, cross-fit, trail running, hanging with buddies… you name it. Gives me perspective and gives my wife time to miss me. And I’m in kick ass shape compared to last year, and now instead of me worrying about my wife getting hit on I’m having to deal with having her be upset because other women check me out when we go out. I’m going on a weekend martial arts training camp… and my wife couldn’t say a word after going to Vegas last year. Another thing: I make sure I either do something fun with the kids when she goes out (she’ll have to decide if it’s more important to miss out on family fun or friend fun) or I have fun while she’s out. Even something stupid like a scotch and cigar in the back yard when the kids go to bed so I can kick back and listen to the complete lack of complaining about the cigar stink. Ahh…
> 
> *5.	Be a father to our children.* Not just “quality” time but real time. Conversations, walks in the park, helping with homework, taking them to soccer, etc. all seemed to help big time. Not just with my wife, but with all of us. And I also found my “father voice,” the voice of discipline and reason in the family. My kids listen to me a lot more, not in fear, but they know they have to listen. Now my wife comes to me when the kids don’t listen to her, not the other way around.
> 
> *6.	Get some buddies.* Guys need close guy friends to do guy stuff. Complain about their wives. Be stupid and macho. Whatever that means to you, it worked wonders for me.
> 
> *7.	Fight different.* Walk away rather than blow up. Mean what you say and stand up to it. For example, if I threaten that if she keeps doing x that means I'll do y, then I bloody well do y if she does x. This had two effects: I thought about what I said more, and so did my wife. I think my wife has a need to be able to hold me at my word, even if that’s a bad thing. Not sure why. Using few words in a fight, slowly and quietly while looking her directly in the eye seems to also work. Once it’s said, don’t repeat it. It is what it is.
> 
> *8.	Act from a place of strength.* I don’t think my wife wants a weakling. She may say that she’ll want me to be more intimate, vulnerable, etc… I think that’s actually BS. Or at least that she doesn’t mean weak or actually vulnerable. If you have flaws or weaknesses either accept it and move on or fix it. I don’t let my wife try to fix my flaws any more. If she brings something up and tries to fix it I’ll ask her to mind her own business (gently). Not a behaviour that impacts her, those I’ll always try to listen to her on. But I don't let her judge me or try to live up to her expectations any more. I define myself, I don't let her do that for me.
> 
> *9.	Be decisive.* Again I think this is an alpha male thing. Make plans. I planned a few date nights, and didn’t ask what she wanted to do. Instead I planned stuff I thought might be fun for us, and asked if she was having a good time. She was, especially if it was stuff she didn’t normally like to do (one time we went to a tattoo expo – I have one small tattoo and she has none – but got us out of our element and we had a blast!) Now if she asks me “what do you want to do” I answer with what I want. Works in bed too – I just made sure she felt comfortable in saying “no.” Don’t bully, be decisive and adaptable.
> 
> *10.	Know what I want from life.* This is hard in today’s world. I had to pull my head out of my ass and figure out that I don’t want to sit on the couch every night and watch TV. So now I don’t. At least not every night.
> 
> *11.	Do more macho stuff.* Fix something around the house. Dig a big hole in the back yard and plant a tree. Fixing her car, for example, seemed to turn a light bulb on in my wife’s head that reminded me that I’m a _man _ and not one of her girlfriends.
> 
> So that’s my list. Hope it helps some of the guys out there. Your mileage may vary, and my marriage may still fail, but I’m in a much better spot in the past year than I have been in a long, long time.
> 
> Thanks for everything!


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## LOSTfan

Printed Both out. she and I actually stumbled on this last night. She asked me to read it out loud. But considering yesterday was forced. And today is totally different, it may have more impact tonight
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bandit.45

LOSTfan said:


> Note to add, she is always adamant I wear my ring. She Knows and has mentioned how i haven't put it on since dday. I think to her we aren't back together until I put it on. And I'm not doing that until actions prove her remorse
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Ask her if she wore hers when she was sleeping with the OM. Hypocrite.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

Oh believe me I did.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

I'm thinking of getting a different one for her (on her dime of course ) if we do manage to R
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

Ugh, I was having a good night with her until I thought of that. Now every time I look at her hand and see the ring; all I see is how she either was so disrespectful that she didn't care if it was on or not, or that I meant so little that she forgot about it.


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## morituri

Get yourself into counseling with a professional with experience in helping victims of infidelity and PTSD. I did, so did bandit.45, and it was well worth it.

Also, read the following:

*http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/40190-feeding-affair-image-beast.html#post593486*
*Erase Obsessive Affair Images (in 30 Minutes)*

*Mistake*: An act committed without any knowledge of a possible negative outcome.

*Bad Choice*: An act committed with awareness of the possible negative outcome but deciding to ignore it or hoping for the best.


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## anonymouskitty

Just so you know I flushed mine down the toilet, bought another 2 1/2 years later.

Dunno if its still in the trap couldn't care less anyhow

She took it hard though, I didn't regret it till about an year later.


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## LOSTfan

Found out the date that it happened. Turns out she wasn't wearing the ring. She claimed that she couldn't remember the night it happened calendar wise all through this ordeal. Well Tonight i demanded knowing and figuring it out. Once we did, I looked back at my texts, and I noticed that I texted her earlier in the night that she forgot to wear it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

Ok so I want to know if this is a good idea, I want to text this om, and tell him kind of about the nc letter. In the texts, she told him if I ever found out, shed be with him that night. Well she didn't fo that. And I asked her about that. And she told me because she said that while caught up in this crazy emotion that wasn't real. Whatevr, the point is he thinks she was going to leave me for him. She didn't, and now my alpha wants to shove that in his face a little. I wanna send him a text saying "I know you're too scared to respond to me, but I want you to know my wife is writing you a letter that I didn't even tell her to do. And it basically says that she wants nothing to do with you and that you mean nothing to her. You lose". Is that not a good idea?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NickCampbell

LOSTfan said:


> Ok so I want to know if this is a good idea, I want to text this om, and tell him kind of about the nc letter. In the texts, she told him if I ever found out, shed be with him that night. Well she didn't fo that. And I asked her about that. And she told me because she said that while caught up in this crazy emotion that wasn't real. Whatevr, the point is he thinks she was going to leave me for him. She didn't, and now my alpha wants to shove that in his face a little. I wanna send him a text saying "I know you're too scared to respond to me, but I want you to know my wife is writing you a letter that I didn't even tell her to do. And it basically says that she wants nothing to do with you and that you mean nothing to her. You lose". Is that not a good idea?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Only if you're okay with it progressing and hearing him brag about bagging your wife..


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## ferndog

LOSTfan said:


> Ok so I want to know if this is a good idea, I want to text this om, and tell him kind of about the nc letter. In the texts, she told him if I ever found out, shed be with him that night. Well she didn't fo that. And I asked her about that. And she told me because she said that while caught up in this crazy emotion that wasn't real. Whatevr, the point is he thinks she was going to leave me for him. She didn't, and now my alpha wants to shove that in his face a little. I wanna send him a text saying "I know you're too scared to respond to me, but I want you to know my wife is writing you a letter that I didn't even tell her to do. And it basically says that she wants nothing to do with you and that you mean nothing to her. You lose". Is that not a good idea?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Before you can hold value to my opinion I must say my xwife never cheated on me (neither did i). 

So with that being said, I feel you are taking it as a competition but you are not in one. Let time dictate what your wife does. She cheated a month ago so for you to text the om about how your wife loves you etc isn't going to help. You are not trusting her and want to make it clear that you intend to hold your marriage together.

Your hurt and want a quick bandaid , it's not going to work. But with time, accepting your faults, forgiving hers, and working on them (both of you)will be the best medicine.

You'll be ok. That which does not kill you will only make you stronger. So in time you'll be ok

No do not contact that a hole. Show love to your wife not hate to another, 

Remember true love ALWAYS wins so your already winning. Don't get wrapped into the small things. 

Hope this helps.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Will_Kane

*Ok so I want to know if this is a good idea, I want to text this om, and tell him kind of about the nc letter. *

I think it's generally a bad idea to contact the affair partner, especially if the affair is over. If no contact has been established, better to keep it that way. 

Rarely does the affair partner react/respond they way you had hoped they would. 

If you really feel you want to, go ahead, but just be prepared for him not to see it the same way as you do, about YOU being the winner because your wife did choose to cheat on you wit him and had sex with him. 

What does your wife think of this idea? Is she afraid he will tell you the truth, that she had sex with him more than just once, or that she did things with him that she never did with you? Even if those are lies, what are you going to do if he responds to you with something like that? I think it's just easier to ignore him, this thing is your wife's fault.

*In the texts, she told him if I ever found out, shed be with him that night. Well she didn't fo that. And I asked her about that. And she told me because she said that while caught up in this crazy emotion that wasn't real. Whatevr, the point is he thinks she was going to leave me for him. She didn't, and now my alpha wants to shove that in his face a little. I wanna send him a text saying "I know you're too scared to respond to me, but I want you to know my wife is writing you a letter that I didn't even tell her to do. And it basically says that she wants nothing to do with you and that you mean nothing to her. You lose". Is that not a good idea?*

Your wife has to work with him every day. She's already basically telling him that with the no contact letter, that she chose you over him, he loses. He will be able to figure that out from your wife's no contact letter. Your contacting him just makes you look like he's really gotten under your skin, which softens the blow of your wife's rejection and let's him know he hurt your marriage. (He probably really has, but did you ever hear the expression, "never let them see you sweat"?) I see more downside than upside to you contacting other man. At least right now.

If I were in your place, I probably would never contact other man again. If I did anything for revenge, which I probably wouldn't, it would be something like the following: I would wait until my wife had found another job, then, after she left her old employer and was at her new employer for about a month, I would let the former employer (other man's employer) know via a letter that the real reason she left was that she felt uncomfortable working with the other man because she believed he was using his position of authority to influence her to have sex with him. That you felt he pursued your wife and was able to entice your wife into sexual relations that she might not otherwise have consented to if not for his position of authority. That he had used business time to pursue an extra-marital affair with your wife. *That you were considering a lawsuit against them* because they fostered a toxic workplace environment that fostered sexual relations between employees during work hours and you felt the other man was a predator who used his position of authority as a security guard and his employer-provided apartment for sexual liaisons with the female employees that you consider to be borderline sexual harassment. That you would let them know if you do decide to go ahead with the lawsuit. Then let other man deal with any fallout. 

I probably wouldn't do this, but if I did anything, it would be something like this, not contacting other man to tell him I won. In your case, with my wife having cheated, I don't think I would feel like too much of a winner and I wouldn't want the other man to respond back, gloating that he had had my wife.


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## LOSTfan

Fern, I want you to know how much that post meant to me and my wife.i read it out loud to her and she started to tear up and cry. Good words, go a long ways
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lovelygirl

lordmayhem said:


> The only thing it accomplishes is that it ruins your safe place to vent AND allows them to take the affair farther underground because we post advice about investigation techniques here.
> .


Exactly!!
It's still a surprise to me how a BS can introduce the WS this place. 
This should have been kept hidden and saved like a diamond. 
This place is your help!!


If I were you I would have deleted this site from the History on my PC, evertyime I was done posting for the day.


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## warlock07

LOSTfan said:


> Fern, I want you to know how much that post meant to me and my wife.i read it out loud to her and she started to tear up and cry. Good words, go a long ways
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Don't jump back into R like a trusting idiot. Take time. Observe. Your wife made the turn around a bit too fast, considering her texts when in the affair. Maybe she is reacting out of guilt and shame but she looked like some one who did not respect you at all when in the affair. Why did she lose respect for you ? How are you handling that?


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## turnera

LOSTfan said:


> Ok so I want to know if this is a good idea, I want to text this om, and tell him kind of about the nc letter.


 Lost, you know that's not a great move. Be the bigger man. Let your wife's actions prove to him that he lost out. Don't go down to his level and beat your chest.


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## Kallan Pavithran

I think he is too fast into R, Earlier also he did the same. Are you repeating the mistakes.

What are the consequences she faced for her most disrespect to your marriage and you other than she shedding some crocodile tears and some assurance.

Did you set her any boundaries?


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## anonymouskitty

You're still in a quasi denial mode, don't push for R till they show that they still possess a shred of loyalty.


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## NewM

LOSTfan said:


> Ok so I want to know if this is a good idea, I want to text this om, and tell him kind of about the nc letter. In the texts, she told him if I ever found out, shed be with him that night. Well she didn't fo that. And I asked her about that. And she told me because she said that while caught up in this crazy emotion that wasn't real. Whatevr, the point is he thinks she was going to leave me for him. She didn't, and now my alpha wants to shove that in his face a little. I wanna send him a text saying "I know you're too scared to respond to me, but I want you to know my wife is writing you a letter that I didn't even tell her to do. And it basically says that she wants nothing to do with you and that you mean nothing to her. You lose". Is that not a good idea?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You are focusing too much on OM,he is single and he wanted to have some fun,if it wasn't him it probably would be someone else,its 100% on her and you focusing on OM is just blame shifting from her to him when its all on her.


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## bandit.45

LOSTfan said:


> Found out the date that it happened. Turns out she wasn't wearing the ring. She claimed that she couldn't remember the night it happened calendar wise all through this ordeal. Well Tonight i demanded knowing and figuring it out. Once we did, I looked back at my texts, and I noticed that I texted her earlier in the night that she forgot to wear it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


How convenient. 

She planned it, planned the whole thing. 

I guess what you have to ask yourself now is whether or not you want top be a parole officer to her for the next two or three years. 

If I were you I would put my ring away. When she comes around and commits herself to being your wife, developes some personal boundaries, then tell her two or three years down the road you will consider putting the ring back on. Until that time your marriage is on hold.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bandit.45

You are moving on with your reconcilliation to quickly. Your wife has experienced no sanctions. You are letting her keep a job that will keep her in contact with the OM. She cries and you bend like a twig. She got to have hot sex (more than once) with the OM yet you allow her to go on with a normal life as if nothing has happened. 

If it were me I would ask her to move out for a period of time and have no contact other than attending marriage counseling together. If you did that I guarantee you she would show you her true self.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

We had a good night. Where did I say we were R?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

And I'm not letting her keep the job. shes job hunting now. She understands shes not going to be working there if she wants to R
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bandit.45

LOSTfan said:


> And I'm not letting her keep the job. shes job hunting now. She understands shes not going to be working there if she wants to R
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Good. You made it sound as if you were rugsweeping. That was my impression. Be that as it may, you need to concentrate on YOU. Get out and start working out, buy yourself some cool threads, start being more social. Show her a man who is attractive and who has options. I guarantee you she will change her attitude quickly and start putting extreme effort into helping you heal.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Acabado

And stop printing more stuff for her to read. Tell her, or better SHOW her, you are backing off for a while and focusing on YOU, instead of the marriage or her until you feel she's serious. If she wants to discuss the "how to" tell her she's not the first cheater in the world, that there's tons of books and online serious info about how to fix what she broke, tell her you only needed 15 min to find out the "scrip" you gave her. For now on she's the one to put the effort and show you she's serious about keeping YOU.

Detach and keep job hunting, man.


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## LOSTfan

Well The nc letter is sitting on the counter. We will see if she remembers to take it with her to work today... If she forgets this simple item, then she really doesn't care.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## anonymouskitty

LOST, you're still not understanding the meaning of the word detach.
You need to do it for your own good, reading your previous post one gets the feeling that you've currently invested so much into the NC being a big hit that if she doesn't stick to her word you'll end up hurting even more 
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/24796-just-let-them-go.html#post306559
Couple this with the 180 and you should be in a position where you can accept any outcome without falling to pieces


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## anonim

stop being passive aggressive, if you want her to take the note, tell her you want her to take the damned note. Its still her choice whether she does.

Though its all useless IMO. youre as emotionally involved in her affairs as she is. You tried recon, she cheated. It ends there. She's willing to cry n' lie, ad infinum, to get to screw her bf, while you hope and pray, for a reconciliation _ that's not gonna happen bro. _

Let her go.


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## LOSTfan

I wouldn't so much as say it would hurt more if she didn't follow through with the nc letter, but it would just show her true colors that she had no interest in real R. I could move from that and file divorce....
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

Anon, if I have to tell her to take it with her after we discussed what was supposed to happen, then thats useless..she needs to do it with out me having to remind her to show effort
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SadSamIAm

I thought NC letters were to be delivered by registered mail.

Even if she takes the NC letter, you will have no idea if she actually gave it to the OM. She could give it to him, but tell him, you made her do it.


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## lordmayhem

"I forgot" won't be an excuse either.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

LOSTfan said:


> I wouldn't so much as say it would hurt more if she didn't follow through with the nc letter, but it would just show her true colors that she had no interest in real R. I could move from that and file divorce....
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Just the nc letter will not be much telling of her views on R. For all you know she could send that letter today then bang the OM tonight. Just observe her actions for now, you'll get a basic understanding if she is truly remorseful or wants to rug-sweep.


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## Will_Kane

Even if she takes the letter with her, how are you going to know she gave it to him?


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## LOSTfan

Well She did take it without me saying anything. Now I need your help guys. With this unique situation of him living in a hotel room, I came up with two ways to ensure delivery. Either she takes it to his room herself , but she records the whole process with her phone from going in the elevator, walking down the hallway, slipping it in his door and walking back and back down the elevator or she does it with me when i come pick her up tonight
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

Stop by during her lunch break and slip it under his door yourself.


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## LOSTfan

So I told her we would do it together when I come pick her up at 6. And she had no issue with that. The only thing she brought up was what would I do if he were to walk out or happen to open the door while we were doing this. Good question, I know shes asking because she doesnt want me to do something to get myself arrested. But Im willing to take the chance. I trust myself not to do something stupid.


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## LOSTfan

So Ive read different threads about how if the WW does take the A deeper underground, are there usual methods of this to watch out for? I found a phone that unleashed all this, I doubt that will happen again if it went deeper underground. Aside from spying every day, are there any other detection techniques aside from the usual VAR's and such?


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## keko

Since the OM lives where she works there aren't much methods to catch them other then physical surveillance. Do you have any close/old buddies at her work that will 'spy' for you?


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## SadSamIAm

Make sure you know for sure what room he is in at the hotel. Don't take her word for it.


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## LOSTfan

Good point. But how do I do that? I know the room number she told me.. I could call it I suppose. I know they wont tell me at the front desk.They keep that kind of thing private. Esp if its an employee


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## NewM

What is the point of you giving it to him?He didn't care last time and won't care this time,your wife has to be the one who wants to stop all contact.If you can't trust her that she will give himletter then how can you trust that she won't just give him letter with you and continue talking like the letter never happened.He won't give a **** about NC letter if your wife is still willing to talk to him.


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## Monroe

LOSTfan said:


> So Ive read different threads about how if the WW does take the A deeper underground, are there usual methods of this to watch out for? I found a phone that unleashed all this, I doubt that will happen again if it went deeper underground. Aside from spying every day, are there any other detection techniques aside from the usual VAR's and such?


She needs to find a new job, ASAP. Spying on her is a waste of time and could be considered illegal (not sure of the laws in Vegas).


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## LOSTfan

I doubt showing up at her work 30 minutes before she thinks I'll be there is illegal. And she is finding a new job. This having to show up early to work thing just isnt going to take, I will not subject my mind to such torture.


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## LOSTfan

NewM said:


> What is the point of you giving it to him?He didn't care last time and won't care this time,your wife has to be the one who wants to stop all contact.If you can't trust her that she will give himletter then how can you trust that she won't just give him letter with you and continue talking like the letter never happened.He won't give a **** about NC letter if your wife is still willing to talk to him.


Im not giving it, shes putting under his door. And was more than willing to do it herself, but I feel like watching it happen. Its the firs step in a long process towards R, I get that, but I'd like to see the first step made for me.


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## LOSTfan

One thing Id like to ask is this lingering wondering of how many times it happened. You guys know the story, it was first just making out, but later in the convo she came out and said it was sex once. Now i know everyones opinion when a bh comes on here and says their ww said it only happened once. No one ever believes it and most of the time, it turns out to be more.

But Ive asked her now every day if it was more than once and she is just so adamant that it never happened more than once. I obviously get that she may be lying, but couldnt it just have only happened once? I dont even know what im asking right now, I guess Im just venting....


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## keko

Possible? Yes.

Likely? No.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

We're doing mc on tuesday... I did put in my list of things I wouldn't tolerate, "if I ever find out from someone other than you, through polygraph or the om, or anyone that it happened more than once, I'm done"
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tacoma

Have her take the poly


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## the guy

I did all the same crap you are doing. It was 2-1/2 years ago I would follow my fWW around the casino and watch her after work and follow her home.

Even though she would bring home her draw reciept which showed the time she cashed out at the vault versus the time she got home I still felt the need to investigate. Thats just how I dealt with it.

But at the end of the day it was my wifes actions that mattered, the constant accountability and remorse that got us thru.


As far as details I sure got them, all of the ugly details, sure it took time and we managed to get thru them....even learn from them...like never get a penis piercing. LOL
The details were a big part of what I also needed, and so there a b!tch to get, but you can get them.

But this crap has its stages and once the *both* of you get a new job and this infidelity crap is dealt with I hope the both of you can affair proof the marriage. Just remember in order to do that you both need to face this sh!t head on. The both of you need to become scholor's of infidelity so get the tools to have a healtier marriage.

Now that the both of you know the capacity that each of you have to cheat, you will be best served by acknowledging it and understanding how to prevent it.

As far as the OM goes follow him out of the employee entrance and inform him that your marriage is very important and lossing it means lossing everything and with that you have nothing else to lose. So it is in his best interest to stay away from your wife.

I'm sure you know damb well cameras are always on you so don't do anything stupid.

It would have been cool to be upstairs watching the monitors as you stalked around the hotel. LOL


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## morituri

LOSTfan said:


> We're doing mc on tuesday... I did put in my list of things I wouldn't tolerate, "if I ever find out from someone other than you, through polygraph or the om, or anyone that it happened more than once, I'm done"
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Just make sure that you follow through with this ultimatum otherwise you'll lose all credibility with her and she will also lose any fear of you leaving her thus making it easier for her to cheat on you again.


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## LOSTfan

the guy said:


> I did all the same crap you are doing. It was 2-1/2 years ago I would follow my fWW around the casino and watch her after work and follow her home.
> 
> Even though she would bring home her draw reciept which showed the time she cashed out at the vault versus the time she got home I still felt the need to investigate. Thats just how I dealt with it.
> 
> But at the end of the day it was my wifes actions that mattered, the constant accountability and remorse that got us thru.
> 
> 
> As far as details I sure got them, all of the ugly details, sure it took time and we managed to get thru them....even learn from them...like never get a penis piercing. LOL
> The details were a big part of what I also needed, and so there a b!tch to get, but you can get them.
> 
> But this crap has its stages and once the *both* of you get a new job and this infidelity crap is dealt with I hope the both of you can affair proof the marriage. Just remember in order to do that you both need to face this sh!t head on. The both of you need to become scholor's of infidelity so get the tools to have a healtier marriage.
> 
> Now that the both of you know the capacity that each of you have to cheat, you will be best served by acknowledging it and understanding how to prevent it.
> 
> As far as the OM goes follow him out of the employee entrance and inform him that your marriage is very important and lossing it means lossing everything and with that you have nothing else to lose. So it is in his best interest to stay away from your wife.
> 
> I'm sure you know damb well cameras are always on you so don't do anything stupid.
> 
> It would have been cool to be upstairs watching the monitors as you stalked around the hotel. LOL


Thanks guy, it feels good to read the encouraging words of a fbh. I honestly couldnt see the OM. If I were to come face to face with him, I'd give him one good right hook and never think about him again.


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## the guy

Affraid to do allitle time for asualt?

Then follow him as he leaves work and beat his butt...

Ya, I know bad advice and its your chick that has the issue, but..... confronting OM can be empowering, especially if you don't you will continue to think about him.

In all seriousness I am concerned with your appraoch and what your lady is doing to affair proof her marriage. The MC and the NC letter are great tools but there is always more that she can do to help you heal.

IMHO there is an atraction to OM that is greater then you think and on the other side of the coin here is if she looses you were does she go? Just keep you eyes out brother....this is still very raw for both of you and a corner could be turned at any time....lets just hope it the right corner for you.

Do you see any withdrawls form her affair or is just the "I'm disgusted with OM" story? It seems there should be a little depression in your WW for losing such a "good friend" if you know what I mean?


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## the guy

You need to do the VAR and the other crap to see if this is the real deal or is she setting you up b/c the timing isn't right.

Continue the investigation not to confirm an affair but to confirm a real commitment from your wife. It wouldn't supprise me if she's telling her friends its not the right time to leave you so she stops for now.

I could be wrong and there may be some real remorse, but it still needs to be confirmed independently.


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## LOSTfan

What do you mean by the timing isn't right? one thing about our marriage I never liked, was that she never took my last name. Well now, she said she wants to and show the world we are a unit. So to me that tells me its not about leaving at the right time or not. She could go if she wanted to, she and I both have plenty of outs.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ferndog

Write all your feelings. What would you tell her, him. Both. Write it here or on your own notebook. Let all of us read it. Or none of us. It is your health and mental stability that's important. Question your feelings. And get better. Time will make you heal either way. Go to the mall or other places just to walk around and unwind. Your going through a lot. Peace to you my brother
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ferndog

LOSTfan said:


> What do you mean by the timing isn't right? one thing about our marriage I never liked, was that she never took my last name. Well now, she said she wants to and show the world we are a unit. So to me that tells me its not about leaving at the right time or not. She could go if she wanted to, she and I both have plenty of outs.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


People put their experiences here. So his may be different than yours. Only you know all the details of your relationship. Only you know her ins and outs. You know her, we don't. And because you know and love her you want to work it out. A vacation somewhere down the road would be healthy for you both. Don't rush the progress . You both can become stronger and more loving but you must pass this first. And your friend (if he is a true friend) will come around. It's your relationship not his so why would he be so affected? Sure he wants the best for you. Of she makes you happy and you both fix this issue, then that's great.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chaparral

anonymouskitty said:


> LOST, you're still not understanding the meaning of the word detach.
> You need to do it for your own good, reading your previous post one gets the feeling that you've currently invested so much into the NC being a big hit that if she doesn't stick to her word you'll end up hurting even more
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/24796-just-let-them-go.html#post306559
> Couple this with the 180 and you should be in a position where you can accept any outcome without falling to pieces


The 180 is for when the wayward spouse is not trying to reconcile/keep the marriage. If she is putting forth the effort the 180 will likely kill that.


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## LOSTfan

Yea, I looked at the 180, and I decided not to implement it. Some things are good for my own health, but overall it's not appropriate when she is seemingly trying and remorseful
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chaparral

LOSTfan said:


> Yea, I looked at the 180, and I decided not to implement it. Some things are good for my own health, but overall it's not appropriate when she is seemingly trying and remorseful
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You really do need to get the books MMSL and NMMNG however. A light will go on in your head while reading them.


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## happyman64

And Lost,

Trust your Gut!

Especially now. If something smells fishy then it is fishy.....

And you know her capacity for lying so confirm, confirm, confirm.

The VAR is a good idea to future proof and confirm her stories.

Stay firm on your conditions to R.

HM64


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## warlock07

LOSTfan said:


> We're doing mc on tuesday... I did put in my list of things I wouldn't tolerate, "if I ever find out from someone other than you, through polygraph or the om, or anyone that it happened more than once, I'm done"
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Just tell her that you can put up with more details of the affair and now is the chance but not any more lies. Tell her to think about it tonight and discuss it with you tomorrow. Also, when you confront the OM, you don't want any new details to hit you in the face.


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## LOSTfan

Chap, I did pick up nmmng a few weeks ago actually. After the first ea was revealed. Believe me, lights def went off.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

I just want to take a moment and thank each of you guys. I honestly don't know what I would have done without you guys. Each and every one of you who have helped me through this ordeal has a place in my heart. Its not near over yet, and I'm sure ill have a million more comments and questions. I just wanted to make a post that wasn't about me and my problems and remind you guys how wonderful you all are.

All other betrayed husbands and wives, thank you for helping me see it may not be over and it certainly isn't the end of the world. You guys helped me to get the truth out through your past experiences.

All fws, while you guys have created an insane amount of hurt with what you did in your past, you learned from it, you grew, and you've become better people because of it. Thank you for helping me see the other side to this whole equation. Perspective is important, and its 100 percent her fault, but it takes the both of us to try this whole reconciliation process out. And without knowing what she may be going through, this process would be a million times more difficult.


Thank you to everyone
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

.


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## LOSTfan

Well talk about mood swings... I think I'm about to go off on my ww. I'm hitting a big anger stage right now. I was in love, had issues during a lul in the marriage, but I worked through them. I never cheated. Why? Because I was in love. She cheated. Why? Couldn't be because she was in love that's for sure. Thinking this now has me feeling like I'm fallin out of love with her. Every time I've looked at her tonight, I just feel betrayal and resentment.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera

She needs to hear that. How's it going this morning?


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## costa200

LOSTfan... You've shown your wife parts of this forum? You know it's really easy to find it out just googling a sentence don't you?


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## bandit.45

costa200 said:


> LOSTfan... You've shown your wife parts of this forum? You know it's really easy to find it out just googling a sentence don't you?


No no no! Costa he needs this place to himself. We don't need her knowing the moves he's making or what he is saying about her. TAM is HIS resource, a safe place for him.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## costa200

bandit.45 said:


> No no no! Costa he needs this place to himself. We don't need her knowing the moves he's making or what he is saying about her. TAM is HIS resource, a safe place for him.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


If you read what i asked carefully you will see that my concern was exactly that. He said that he was showing certain parts and texts of this forum. She can find this place very easily with that and keep tabs on his actions. 

We have a similar thinking it seems.


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## ArmyofJuan

LOSTfan said:


> Yea, I looked at the 180, and I decided not to implement it. Some things are good for my own health, but overall it's not appropriate when she is seemingly trying and remorseful
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Don't rug sweep or try to go back to your old ways or this WILL happen again. The 180 gives you strength and helps you by not becoming so dependent. I person that feels like they will be fine with or without a spouse rarely has to worry about it coming to that.

Don’t think this is over, 6 months from now she (or the OM) may reach out to each other again after the dust settles (it happened to me). You got a long way to go before you’ll know if you are not in a false R.


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## LOSTfan

Well I told her the polygraph was a must, her response via text was " You know everything, so ill feel better that it can be proven" i think that's a good response
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## costa200

LOSTfan said:


> Well I told her the polygraph was a must, her response via text was " You know everything, so ill feel better that it can be proven" i think that's a good response
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes it is. Specially if she wants you to drop it 

Don't shy from it. If you believe the test helps you then do it. You need to draw strength from everything you can right now.


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## turnera

Great! Get it scheduled for within the next 7 days.


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## LOSTfan

Well With money issues, it may be a couple weeks. The truth won't change in a couple weeks right?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## keko

LOSTfan said:


> Well With money issues, it may be a couple weeks. The truth won't change in a couple weeks right?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You'll be more likely to skip the poly the longer you wait.


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## turnera

And she will have time to regain her resolve, her backbone, and her skills to turn this back around on YOU so she can get to the point of saying F no, I WON'T take the test, you're a pig - like most cheaters do when faced with a polygraph.


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## LOSTfan

All fine and dandy, if she doesn't take it. I'm done. I will not lose that resolve. She's aware of how much that means to me. If she back out, then that's all I need to know
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera

Good. Best of luck.


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## ferndog

LOSTfan said:


> All fine and dandy, if she doesn't take it. I'm done. I will not lose that resolve. She's aware of how much that means to me. If she back out, then that's all I need to know
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Offer her a chance. Think of all the questions that will help you ask her for honesty. Let her know that this is part of your healing process and if she respects you and the marriage then she will answer them even if it's hurtful. Then you can compare them with the polygraph. 

If you love her and want to work on it it is also important not to torture her with same questions over and over. She will get tired of it also. And she will have a point as well because it may become obsessive/ mentally abusive. 

Heal get better and live happy. Forgive her or let her go but to really fix the issue the pain from your heart must leave or you won't be happy,

With time you may decide you no longer can see her the same or you might. It may even get better just reflect and be honest with yourself


Time will help both of you decide. I'm pulling for you. If you love her, show her.

Reread your marriage vow. Let her view them. Make a nice candle light dinner and talk about what you mean to each other. 
When the time is ready of course
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

Thank you fern, you've been a great voice of reason. Logical, yet still from the heart. I appreciate it more than you know.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ferndog

LOSTfan said:


> Thank you fern, you've been a great voice of reason. Logical, yet still from the heart. I appreciate it more than you know.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You got it brother. Only you know what your heart wants and that's what's important.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LOSTfan

We had a good day today. I went for a job interview at a non profit childrens foundation, and I think it went well so that was nice. I worked out in the gym... And The wife and I have just been watching seinfeld and locked up abroad, but mostly talking. Talked about my triggers, us, the future, she told me a story of when she got cheated on in college. Lots of laughs, some hugs, her cuddling and showing affection... Nice for my brain to have a good relaxed day
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ferndog

LOSTfan said:


> We had a good day today. I went for a job interview at a non profit childrens foundation, and I think it went well so that was nice. I worked out in the gym... And The wife and I have just been watching seinfeld and locked up abroad, but mostly talking. Talked about my triggers, us, the future, she told me a story of when she got cheated on in college. Lots of laughs, some hugs, her cuddling and showing affection... Nice for my brain to have a good relaxed day
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Sounds like you both love each other plenty. Good people make poor choices sometimes. I'm glad you both are facing this head on. Give it time day by day. Some will be great some won't. But little by little the romance and loving feelings will remain as long as both are commited
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy

How is it going? It's been 5 days since your last post.

I did want to say, that I'd be very suspicious of him continuing to pursue her and fish. They went very quickly to using a burner phone to hide from you, so obviously he's experienced in ways to avoid suspicious husbands.

I don't want to see you get complacent and get burned again. If her remorse is genuine, fantastic! But the way it went underground was just too quick for a simple EA and early PA. 

Watch her.


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