# Do all husbands "joke" like this?



## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

Husbands, do you joke like this with male friends? Is this just normal male chatter? The following is a chat between my husband and a buddy:

Husband: How am i supposed to concentrate with this hotty asian chick flipping her hair around in my study room?

Friend: Maybe she is giving you a sign ha ha. 

Friend: I gotta get up there and see this.

Husband: No way man. I got this!

Also, lets say you would joke like this. If you made a mistake in the past that had to do with crossing a boundary with a female and you wanted your wife to believe you to be loyal and respectful, would you continue to joke this way?


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## turkish (Jun 24, 2012)

If my OH knew half the things like that that I have said over the years, I would be long gone.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## dormant (Apr 3, 2012)

Just normal chatter


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Pretty much "Buddy Banter". Don't sweat it.


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## Mistys dad (Dec 2, 2011)

That would be way too "PG" for my buddies.


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

Is it wrong to be upset about it if he has done worse things in the past? As far as crossing boundaries? Given his past, it is difficult for me to take things like this lightly. If he had never screwed up before I feel like this would be a minor annoyance but not so upsetting.


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## Downtrodden (Jul 3, 2012)

I'd say the majority of us chew the fat with those same teeth. 

Though I might be more careful about toeing that particular line if I'd found myself on the wrong side of it once before. 

Keep in mind, it _is_ just joking.


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## BeachGuy (Jul 6, 2011)

Did he do this in front of you? How did you hear it? That's rather untasteful if he said it while you were in the room.


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

BeachGuy said:


> Did he do this in front of you? How did you hear it? That's rather untasteful if he said it while you were in the room.


Not in front of me. It's an online chat.


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

That's just stupid guy crap...I do it. If he was really going to make a move on the hottie, he probably wouldn't be chatting about it with his bud.


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## MooseAndSquirrel (Jun 7, 2012)

I say meaningless stuff like that to my guy friends without a second thought, but not in front of my SO. Are you spying on him?


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

That's what makes us men, and what makes women feel sexy.
They know we're talking about and looking at them.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Sounds like regular guy banter.


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## C123 (Jun 20, 2012)

I've said way worse things and never even come close to acting on them. 

That said, the context in which this happened and how you found out about it is sort of important to give you a good answer. Also, what boundary did he previously cross? Did he cheat?

Your description of what happened is sort of mysterious. I'd like to know more about it and how you came to know about it.


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

C123 said:


> I've said way worse things and never even come close to acting on them.
> 
> That said, the context in which this happened and how you found out about it is sort of important to give you a good answer. Also, what boundary did he previously cross? Did he cheat?
> 
> Your description of what happened is sort of mysterious. I'd like to know more about it and how you came to know about it.


He didn't cheat as far as I know. He asked an ex to send him naked pictures all while telling me that he would never do anything to hurt me and that he was worthy of utmost trust. 

I found out because I look in his phone on occasion (wrong, I know). For the record I would allow him to see my phone at any moment and he could have passwords to my emails and facebook anytime. The person he says he is and the way he acts just seem like two different people to me. I feel disrespected.

If we didn't have issues: A) I would have never seen this and B) I would probably have a sense of humor about it. Boys will be boys. 

I think he is just walking too far to the line that he has crossed before. He has a tendency to do and say things that make me feel like I am not good enough for him and then get annoyed with me for being insecure. 

If I had betrayed his trust, I would be proving myself every which way until I felt like he could be confident in me and my actions.


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

I just don't think it's the way to act if you are proving yourself trustworthy, no?


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## SA's husband (Apr 9, 2012)

I don't talk like that because it can get carried away and become in bad taste, if it didn't get carried away, it might not be too bad. Some of the guys I work with can be really ignorant, that's just how guys are.


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## Mistys dad (Dec 2, 2011)

lotsoflove said:


> I just don't think it's the way to act if you are proving yourself trustworthy, no?


If you eavesdrop on a private conversation, you have no right to complain about what is said.

You looked in his phone. You are basing your feelings on something that was meant to be private, not for you to see, and sent in a context you don't know.


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

Mistys dad said:


> If you eavesdrop on a private conversation, you have no right to complain about what is said.
> 
> You looked in his phone. You are basing your feelings on something that was meant to be private, not for you to see, and sent in a context you don't know.


So then what we do in private should have no effect on our spouse? I think what we do in private when certain people aren't looking can give a great insight into someones character. 

I know the context. He was in a private study room, she asked to share the room and this conversation is what followed.

So, am I to understand that I have no right to be upset about anything he says or does if it is not meant to be seen or heard by me? Sounds like an awfully slipper slope. What if the friend told me what was said? Would I be allowed to be upset about it then?

Edit to add: I KNOW snooping is wrong. I feel guilty about it and I never tried to hide the fact that I did it. I am open to sharing everything on my phone/accounts. I have nothing to hide or nothing that would even remotely upset him. I am unwaveringly loyal and want the same in return.


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## Accipiter777 (Jul 22, 2011)

Guy talk.... I know my wife "Girl Talks". it's a just banter.


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

Accipiter777 said:


> Guy talk.... I know my wife "Girl Talks". it's a just banter.


I should add, I get that it's "guy talk". But should a guy who has crossed lines in the past perhaps take a break on the "guy talk" until he has proven himself loyal? It is hard to have a sense of humor about it when in his past he went beyond "guy talk" and crossed a boundary.


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## Accipiter777 (Jul 22, 2011)

lotsoflove said:


> I should add, I get that it's "guy talk". But should a guy who has crossed lines in the past perhaps take a break on the "guy talk" until he has proven himself loyal? It is hard to have a sense of humor about it when in his past he went beyond "guy talk" and crossed a boundary.


Sorry sweetie... I looked back and read more carefully... will have to ponder...


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

lotsoflove said:


> So then what we do in private should have no effect on our spouse? I think what we do in private when certain people aren't looking can give a great insight into someones character.
> 
> I know the context. He was in a private study room, she asked to share the room and this conversation is what followed.
> 
> ...


first off, i dont think there should be any 'snooping'.
i think things should be open and available to your spouse in the first place, especially getting caught doing what he did the first time.
i do think it was just normal male banter most likely.


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

Sounds to me like pea****s talking.


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## Mistys dad (Dec 2, 2011)

lotsoflove said:


> So then what we do in private should have no effect on our spouse? I think what we do in private when certain people aren't looking can give a great insight into someones character.
> 
> I know the context. He was in a private study room, *she* asked to share the room and this conversation is what followed.
> 
> ...


What someone does in private is in that context, private. People express themselves differently to different groups of people. People express themselves differently when the have the expectation of privacy.


You wouldn't talk to your therapist the same if you knew your husband was recording it.
You wouldn't talk to your boss like you talk to your children.
You wouldn't talk to your spouse like you talk to subordinates.
You wouldn't talk to your family the way you talk to your spouse.
You don't talk to your buddies the way you talk to anybody else, that's why they are your buddies.

So what if you are open to complete search. Just because you would lend your car to somebody at any time, doesn't mean its not stealing if you take theirs without asking. If you and your husband did not make an agreement in advance about "complete access" then you have breached his privacy.

Here is the bottom line. Either you trust him or you don't.

If you do, then you should either stop violating his privacy or tell him that you will be prying into his personal stuff, again.

If you don't, then you should decide if he is the one you want to be with in the first place.

Here is the next question. Why the trickle truth? Suddenly, he is alone with a woman in his private study. See, you neglected to mention that up front. So if you are going to leave those details out, how do you expect an accurate answer from anybody?


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## Accipiter777 (Jul 22, 2011)

Mistys dad said:


> Here is the next question. Why the trickle truth? *Suddenly, he is alone with a woman in his private study.* See, you neglected to mention that up front. So if you are going to leave those details out, how do you expect an accurate answer from anybody?


Makes ALL the difference...

What is said in group conversation and said in private is different.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Asking an ex to send naked pics? And you don't consider that a betrayal? You're worried that snooping through his phone is wrong? Time to take off those rose-tinted shades...


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## Mistys dad (Dec 2, 2011)

Where did I say that wasn't a betrayal?

See that is part of the trickle truth of this poster's unfolding story.

There was no mention of ex's naked pictures until the bottom of the first page.

Then all the sudden, he isn't alone, he is with a woman while texting.

What's next?

And yes, snooping in his phone is wrong. Period. 

If they didn't make an agreement ahead of time for "full access" then she is violating his privacy.

That doesn't excuse anything he did. That just means she is doing something wrong. His actions do not in any way excuse hers.

Rose colored glases? Maybe you missed this part.

_Here is the bottom line. Either you trust him or you don't.

If you do, then you should either stop violating his privacy or tell him that you will be prying into his personal stuff, again.

If you don't, then you should decide if he is the one you want to be with in the first place._


If he violated her trust that bad, it does not give her the right to violate his. The answer is to file and move on and find somebody who won't violate her trust.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Mistys dad said:


> Where did I say that wasn't a betrayal?
> 
> See that is part of the trickle truth of this poster's unfolding story.
> 
> ...


I was addressing the OP, not you. I didn't even bother to read your post, sorry.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

lotsoflove said:


> He didn't cheat as far as I know. He asked an ex to send him naked pictures all while telling me that he would never do anything to hurt me and that he was worthy of utmost trust.
> 
> I found out because I look in his phone on occasion (wrong, I know). For the record I would allow him to see my phone at any moment and he could have passwords to my emails and facebook anytime. The person he says he is and the way he acts just seem like two different people to me. I feel disrespected.
> 
> ...


Asking an ex to send naked pics? And you don't consider that a betrayal? You're worried that snooping through his phone is wrong? Time to take off those rose-tinted shades... 

Double posting so as not to ruffle MD's feathers anymore than they already are.

You're married to this guy, right? He has betrayed you? Then 'snoop' away. He's lost any and all right to privact, IMHO.


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

Mistys dad said:


> What someone does in private is in that context, private. People express themselves differently to different groups of people. People express themselves differently when the have the expectation of privacy.
> 
> 
> You wouldn't talk to your therapist the same if you knew your husband was recording it.
> ...


I guess I only mentioned it later because I was more concerned about what he said than the fact that we was in a room with her. 

I understand that people express themselves differently in different contexts. I guess what I feel like is my husband crossed a line before and now he continues to walk awfully close to that line. 

My actions and expressions in private match the way I present myself to my husband.


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## SoWhat (Jan 7, 2012)

Does the fact that he said something to his friend bother you?
Or the fact that he looked at her?
Or the fact that he found her attractive? 

Guys talk like this.


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

CandieGirl said:


> Asking an ex to send naked pics? And you don't consider that a betrayal? You're worried that snooping through his phone is wrong? Time to take off those rose-tinted shades...


I did see it as a betrayal and it hurt me deeply. We were in a long distance situation at the time and it he was telling me all the time not to worry and that he would never hurt me, wanted to spend his life with me and was worthy of my trust. 

I am worried that snooping is wrong because it makes me feel guilty. I consider it a lesser "crime" than what he has done, but wrong nonetheless. I don't want to live my life feeling like a need to look to get the truth. 

I have asked for full transparency and have read that many couples do it and counselors recommend it for people in situations like these. 

I asked what he thought about exchanging passwords, but he flat out refused. He says he has a right to privacy and he does, but in relationships I feel like we should be more open, especially when there has been a betrayal in the past. Personal computers, email addresses, cell phones, facebooks etc, make things far more complicated. 

I think we should be held accountable for our actions, private or not.


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

SoWhat said:


> Does the fact that he said something to his friend bother you?
> Or the fact that he looked at her?
> Or the fact that he found her attractive?
> 
> Guys talk like this.


I am not naive enough to believe that people who are married are never attracted to other people or that they might not mention it to a buddy. Not in the least. 

What bothers me is that he has crossed a line before and I feel like he walks on that same line. 

Let me be clear that if he had never crossed a boundary in the past, I would probably see this as a minor annoyance not even worthy of mentioning "boys will be boys". It is hard for me to have a sense of humor about it given our situation. 

Is this unfair of me?


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

Mistys dad said:


> Here is the next question. Why the trickle truth? Suddenly, he is alone with a woman in his private study. See, you neglected to mention that up front. So if you are going to leave those details out, how do you expect an accurate answer from anybody?


If I mentioned from the get go that he was in a room with her, would your response have been different?

I wasn't trying to trickle the truth. I was just trying to provide the details of what really bothered me to keep it short and sweet. 

It doesn't bother me that he was in a room with a girl.

It doesn't bother me that he found her attractive.

It bothers me that his message implies that he doesn't want his buddy to come in the room: "no way man" "I got this".

And it bothers me because he has crossed lines in the past. 

I respect your opinion and am truly here to try and gain understanding. 

Let me ask you a question. If you were guilty of his past transgression and wanted to be forgiven, seen as trustworthy, respectful and loyal and wanted your relationship to move forward would you act this way?


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

Mistys dad said:


> You wouldn't talk to your therapist the same if you knew your husband was recording it.
> You wouldn't talk to your boss like you talk to your children.
> You wouldn't talk to your spouse like you talk to subordinates.
> You wouldn't talk to your family the way you talk to your spouse.
> You don't talk to your buddies the way you talk to anybody else, that's why they are your buddies.


1. I WOULD talk to my therapist the same way if my husband were to be able to hear all of it. I have nothing to hide from him. I am all in, so to speak.
2. & 3. Of course I wouldn't.
4. I would, expect for the fighting. I don't have anything to fight with them about. 
5. When I chat with girlfriends, I might say, "Ryan Gosling is freaking hot" and I would say it in front of my husband as well. 

Not only that, but my husband will freely speak of my transgressions (jealousy, insecurity) to friends and family but admits he has never mentioned what he has done. 

I have confided only in my mother and with no specifics and have told her freely of my role in it as well (not being able to let go, having a hard time trusting etc.).


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## SoWhat (Jan 7, 2012)

lotsoflove said:


> I am not naive enough to believe that people who are married are never attracted to other people or that they might not mention it to a buddy. Not in the least.
> 
> What bothers me is that he has crossed a line before and I feel like he walks on that same line.
> 
> ...


But how is he walking on a line here? 
I don't understand. 
He wasn't saying these things to cause pain to you; he didn't know you were listening/reading at all. 

He found someone else attractive. He told his buddy about it. What line is he walking on? 

If he was just *thinking* it, would that be line crossing?


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## costa200 (Jun 27, 2012)

SoWhat said:


> But how is he walking on a line here?
> I don't understand.
> He wasn't saying these things to cause pain to you; he didn't know you were listening/reading at all.
> 
> ...


I believe she is talking about a previous event.


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## GhostRydr (Jun 2, 2012)

lotsoflove said:


> Husbands, do you joke like this with male friends? Is this just normal male chatter? The following is a chat between my husband and a buddy:
> 
> Husband: How am i supposed to concentrate with this hotty asian chick flipping her hair around in my study room?
> 
> ...


Only if she werent around to hear it.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

> I am worried that snooping is wrong because it makes me feel guilty. I consider it a lesser "crime" than what he has done, but wrong nonetheless. I don't want to live my life feeling like a need to look to get the truth.


 I feel strongly , before one marries...they need to have some foundation of transparency, there needs to be a "willingness" and an "approachableness" on both sides.... when 2 become one, there should be no secrets..... this automatically breeds mistrust...when one slaps the hand to such things. 



> I have asked for full transparency and have read that many couples do it and counselors recommend it for people in situations like these.


 I agree ..... most especially after something like this happens, the one who hurt needs to step up , go that extra mile to reassure their hurting spouse that...yes, they are remoreful, Yes, they want you to feel secure, loved... they willingly open thier lives up to ALL - to prove they are on the up & up....to rebuild TRUST... Anything less is not OK. 

I did a rather long winded thread on this issue- some good links at the bottom of my opening post ....... http://talkaboutmarriage.com/genera...parency-what-means-our-marraige-what-you.html

.


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## lotsoflove (Jun 11, 2012)

SoWhat said:


> But how is he walking on a line here?
> I don't understand.
> He wasn't saying these things to cause pain to you; he didn't know you were listening/reading at all.
> 
> ...


I feel like it is walking a line because his text is suggesting that he doesn't want his friend to come in because he's "got this", like he intends to do something. 

I don't care that he found her attractive or told his buddy about it. I feel like joking about cheating on me when he had asked an ex for naked pictures in the past is walking on a line which had been previously crossed.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

lotsoflove said:


> I did see it as a betrayal and it hurt me deeply. We were in a long distance situation at the time and it he was telling me all the time not to worry and that he would never hurt me, wanted to spend his life with me and was worthy of my trust.
> 
> I am worried that snooping is wrong because it makes me feel guilty. I consider it a lesser "crime" than what he has done, but wrong nonetheless. I don't want to live my life feeling like a need to look to get the truth.
> 
> ...


lotsoflove, While I am one who thinks what was stated was only young men's banter. I think the only privacy there should be in a marriage is in the bathroom. 
It's not wrong to snoop. It's wrong to conceal things. You are right to ask for his passwords. You have a problem, he's still acting like a single immature young man. Or should I say, he has a problem. Your going to have issues until he grows up. How much can you put up with and how long can you wait till then?


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## heavensangel (Feb 12, 2012)

anchorwatch said:


> I think the only privacy there should be in a marriage is in the bathroom. /QUOTE]
> 
> 
> This is absolutely true! During your wedding ceremony, the two of you became ONE - this means what's his is yours; what's yours is his and it includes communications, relationships, etc., etc. If he wouldn't say/write it in front of you, then he shouldn't be doing it, period!! There should be NO secrets. The fact that he refuses to share his passwords/access makes me very uncomfortable. IF he has nothing to hide, there's NO reason you shouldn't have access!! Honestly, him making comments to anyone of that nature shows to his friends, colleagues, whoever, a TOTAL lack of respect for you and his marriage.


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## CantePe (Oct 5, 2011)

Mistys dad said:


> If you eavesdrop on a private conversation, you have no right to complain about what is said.
> 
> You looked in his phone. You are basing your feelings on something that was meant to be private, not for you to see, and sent in a context you don't know.


There is no privacy in a marriage, especially one where the spouse illicited (or tried to) naked pictures from an ex spouse.


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## HopelesslyJaded (Aug 14, 2012)

Some of you act like this is not a husband and wife here. Is there really a such thing as "private" when your married. 

Also him saying thing like this because she wasn't suppose to see or hear it makes it ok? How funny. So acting innapropriate and saying inapropriate things are ALL ok as long as it is done in secret. Pulease.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

My wife and I always banter about hot ladies we see (she's bisexual I swear!!!), all except for one particular ethnic of ladies which she is rather insecure about

It's normal methinks


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## HopelesslyJaded (Aug 14, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> My wife and I always banter about hot ladies we see (she's bisexual I swear!!!), all except for one particular ethnic of ladies which she is rather insecure about
> 
> It's normal methinks


I agree it is for some. But this is something that you and your wife would do even in front of each other and know it's ok with each other. I think if you've crossed boundaries before and/or know this behaviour is hurtful to your spouse then you might would think twice. I think dudes are just scared of losing their "man card" if they don't participate in this type of bantor.


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## stoney1215 (Jun 18, 2012)

the truth is ..... yes all men do joke like this with their friends ..... some more than other , but we all have done it ...... 

what men say and joke about when were around our friends is usually juvenile , sexual , sexist , bravado , and humor that is part of male bonding . 

the things us guys say and joke about quite frankly would more often than not offend most women . 

it is no different than when women joke with their girlfriends about what they would do to so and so hot guy when men are not around ... times 100 ........

do not take what your husband said jokingly with his friend as anything other than that , something said jokingly to his friend..


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

lotsoflove said:


> Husbands, do you joke like this with male friends? Is this just normal male chatter? The following is a chat between my husband and a buddy:
> 
> Husband: How am i supposed to concentrate with this hotty asian chick flipping her hair around in my study room?
> 
> ...


This is generic brand tapioca pudding compared to some of the stuff two of my best friends and I say in conversation.


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## jnyu44 (Feb 13, 2012)

some guys joke like that, some don't. You married someone who does joke like that (most American guys do). You should be very clear what you can and can't tolerate and let him know that. However, asking him to completely change on this end is something you have to ask yourself if it's worth fighting for. Maybe it's ok to you for him to joke around like that as long as he's loyal (which is where the real battle should be fought and you let him know there's no way flirting is ok, etc.). After all, joking with his buddies and actually acting on it are two very different things. It's tasteless, but as long as it's just really joking, it's fairly harmless. 

At least in my one nightmare of a marriage, there are far more pressing matters in marriage (and in life), that I do give into her on a lot of things. The downside is that I am very resentful, but because getting through grad school and getting a good job afterwards (which I did!), I bottle these feelings up inside and will do so until my program ends (in a month). Once I've got my grad degree and career started, while I don't plan on revenge or just throwing her out, you d**n right I'm going to voice how I feel. I just hope I can work through my resentment and that those feelings have subsided when the time comes.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

With our bros, we men talk BS, it's just how it is, don't take it seriously


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## Amyd (Nov 12, 2012)

lotsoflove said:


> Husbands, do you joke like this with male friends? Is this just normal male chatter? The following is a chat between my husband and a buddy:
> 
> Husband: How am i supposed to concentrate with this hotty asian chick flipping her hair around in my study room?
> 
> ...


I think you probably shouldn't have married a fourteen year old.


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## stoney1215 (Jun 18, 2012)

Amyd said:


> I think you probably shouldn't have married a fourteen year old.




when we are around our friends and it is just the guys . we are all 14 .... at least we try to be ........ it is a welcomed break from our ever day lives as parents , adults , husbands , and role models .......


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## sweaty teddy (Nov 13, 2012)

yea I bang her like a screen door!

sounds normal to me.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Amyd said:


> I think you probably shouldn't have married a fourteen year old.


Which basically means she probably shouldn't have married a man.

Hate to tell you this, but a lot of us relish being carefree, and young, with our buddies no matter how old we are chronologically.


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## stoney1215 (Jun 18, 2012)

lotsoflove said:


> I did see it as a betrayal and it hurt me deeply. We were in a long distance situation at the time and it he was telling me all the time not to worry and that he would never hurt me, wanted to spend his life with me and was worthy of my trust.
> 
> I am worried that snooping is wrong because it makes me feel guilty. I consider it a lesser "crime" than what he has done, but wrong nonetheless. I don't want to live my life feeling like a need to look to get the truth.
> 
> ...



him having naked pics of his ex on his phone was wrong . you snooping in his phone was wrong . 

that being said what was the outcome of it all ? did you forgive him for having the pics ? did you lose trust in him ? did he forgive you for snooping in his phone ? did he lose trust in you ? 

if you forgave him then you can no longer hold it against him . if you lost trust in him then you need to tell him how he can rebuild the trust you lost . if he does not know how what you need him to do to rebuild your trust then he will not be able to rebuild it ... 

you can not hold the conversations he has with his friends as part of your betrayal . especially since you have once again went behind his back and invaded his privacy ... what he jokes about with the guys has absolutely nothing to do with the mistake that he made . especially when the conversation he was having was in private . you on the other hand have once again betrayed his trust by invading his privacy ..... that to me is a much bigger issue this time around .... to your knowledge he has not remade the same mistake , nor has he cheated on you in any way ... you on the other hand did the same exact thing you previously did . also he has expressed to you that his email is private . which you purposely ignored . 

in this instance , you are the only one who has done anything wrong


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## stoney1215 (Jun 18, 2012)

HopelesslyJaded said:


> Some of you act like this is not a husband and wife here. Is there really a such thing as "private" when your married.
> 
> Also him saying thing like this because she wasn't suppose to see or hear it makes it ok? How funny. So acting innapropriate and saying inapropriate things are ALL ok as long as it is done in secret. Pulease.




there most certainly is , and should be a such thing as privacy between husband and wife .... just because you married someone does not mean you are no longer entitled to have privacy . it also does not mean that your spouse has the right to invade your privacy . 

him saying things like that is ok because : 1. it was said to his friend . when in a private conversation , both men and women say things to their friends that they would not or could not say to their spouses . both men and women exaggerate and joke differently with their friends than they do their spouse . 2. what he said has absolutely nothing to do with what he did to betray her . she on the other hand invaded his privacy once again .. 3. it is not cheating or doing anything wrong when you are fantasizing about , and looking at other people . 

what men say when we are with our friends , having private conversations , away from our wives is often juvenile , braggadocios , crude , offensive , sexual , and vulgar , and would offend most women . that is why we say it in private to our friends , not around women . if you snoop in our private messages , emails , or phone calls to our friends you are not only wrong for doing so , but you can not complain about or take offense to what we say . it is none of your business to begin with ... 

she needs to stop invading his privacy . she is definitely the one who is wrong in this instance ...not him !


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Men like boast, make jokes, and compare **** sizes
This is who we are! lol

How we are with men is unlike how we are with women. It's just trash talk and normal male behaviour


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

RandomDude said:


> Men like boast, make jokes, and compare **** sizes
> This is who we are! lol
> 
> How we are with men is unlike how we are with women. It's just trash talk and normal male behaviour


I tend to think the more vocally aggressive crude Joking males vs the tamer / a little more morality focused males are different in this.....

My husband is NOT like alot of the comments here... He appreciates the Transparency in our marriage....

He is also not braggish, vulgar, nor offensive by his nature...... Frankly I wish he'd be more *sexually crude* with me at home... I'm worse than him! .... so I know he ain't spouting it with the guys at work.... 

He tells me all about how they go on ....more so when I ask, he's said before "you don't even want to know" ...But I do! ......one goes to a website called UselessJunk.com ...they joke how he is close to a child molester... he is a sick Mother...(his Catholic wife I am sure has no idea he acts like this & talks like that at work ~ she would be horrified & he'd be in the dog house for a very long time)..... 

Yeah...it's true.... many men ARE naturally LIKE this...through & through DIRTY DOGS ... 

To me, Boys will be Boys -when they get around THE BOYS.

Yet I am thankful mine is a bit toned down in comparison to the majority.....If he spouted all this privacy BS like Stoney up there...this would be a contention in our marriage, I can handle the reality of MEN & "their talk" - so long as "faithfulness" is also his nature.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

OP:

As a woman, *I* think you ARE making a mountain out of a molehill.

I think you have TWO problems here. 

1.) Is what he did wrong? NO. Is it wrong given his previous behavior of asking for an ex-gf's naked pix while he was in a long-distance relationship with you? NO.

He saw a pretty girl, he commented to his buddy, his buddy wink/nudged him back, and like that... Then YOU went snooping, found the exchange and are HIGHLY offended that your H (who is presumably still in possession of his male equipment...I mean you're not hiding his jewels in your purse, are you?) ACTED LIKE A GUY with his buddy! 

2.) The whole NAKED PIX incident happened BEFORE you were married, and YET you married him anyway! You made a conscious decision to marry THAT guy...

And NOW you don't trust him...
Now you are tormented every time he acts like a typical guy...

If you are expecting him to change his personality BECAUSE you don't trust him, you're going to be very disappointed.

If you are expecting him to become a monk and NEVER notice or comment on, or be attracted to other women, you're going to be very disappointed. You married a guy with an eye, and it makes YOU very insecure. NO, YOU make yourself very insecure.

Look: You either trust him or you don't! It sounds like you don't.
*If you don't have trust in your S.O., then you don't have ANYTHING.*

He is NEVER going to be the kind of guy who doesn't look, or doesn't comment to his buddies, or doesn't appreciate. He IS who he IS. You either can accept it and feel that he VALUES YOU, or you can't accept it and you drive yourself (and him and everyone else) crazy with your suspicions, your insecurities, your wonderings, your sleepless nights, etc.

You can ONLY control YOU. Stop being so dependent on your H to validate your worth, your sexiness, your desirability, etc. If you feel that he doesn't value you enough (thus he may be tempted to 'stray'), then LEAVE and find someone else who DOES (in YOUR opinion) value you enough to never stray.


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## stoney1215 (Jun 18, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I tend to think the more vocally aggressive crude Joking males vs the tamer / a little more morality focused males are different in this.....
> 
> My husband is NOT like alot of the comments here... He appreciates the Transparency in our marriage....
> 
> ...




having personal privacy is in no way BS . how could anyone possibly think having privacy is BS ? what is it about being married that makes you think your husband is no longer entitled to privacy ? why do you think that being married means you yourself are not allowed to have privacy ? 

being married does not give anyone the right to invade your spouses email , phone messages , mail , etc..... to say it does is just plain ridiculous..


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

I guess the way *I* feel about it is: you either trust me, or you don't. I either trust you, or I don't. If we don't have trust, then it's PAST TIME to pull the plug.

I don't need your email passwords, your phone lock #s, etc. Because I believe you are faithful to me. Once I no longer feel that way, we're DONE, end of discussion, I would NEVER reconcile with someone I couldn't trust.

I know others disagree. I know others have been burned (or nearly burned). I understand that.

With great civility, I agree to disagree with you.


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## stoney1215 (Jun 18, 2012)

SlowlyGettingWiser said:


> I guess the way *I* feel about it is: you either trust me, or you don't. I either trust you, or I don't. If we don't have trust, then it's PAST TIME to pull the plug.
> 
> I don't need your email passwords, your phone lock #s, etc. Because I believe you are faithful to me. Once I no longer feel that way, we're DONE, end of discussion, I would NEVER reconcile with someone I couldn't trust.
> 
> ...




i could not agree more .... 

i have said the same exact thing many times . i have believed this my whole life .


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Franchise said:


> In talking to my wife what I have also discovered is that when wives hang out together they tend to talk much more about details of their sex lives with each other than men do. For guys we are either talking about sports or the hot chick at the other side of the bar but very rarely about our sex lives. Only generic things like not getting enough or having just gotten some. But almost never specifics. Prob bc I don't want other guys thinking about what my wife likes or dislikes in bed. Guys are pretty much all down for most things sexual so women prob feel more comfortable sharing these things. Just a theory.....
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


This ain't me. At all.

I don't talk about specifics to everyone, absolutely not, but with two of my best friends? We talk in vivid detail about our sex lives, and sex in general.

There is no "generic talk" in my world.

Incidentally my wife is the same way; she's mum, or lite, on the topic with most, but with two of her best friends, especially her oldest friend, they all go into great, vivid detail about their sexual lives.



SlowlyGettingWiser said:


> I guess the way *I* feel about it is: you either trust me, or you don't. I either trust you, or I don't. If we don't have trust, then it's PAST TIME to pull the plug.
> 
> I don't need your email passwords, your phone lock #s, etc. Because I believe you are faithful to me. Once I no longer feel that way, we're DONE, end of discussion, I would NEVER reconcile with someone I couldn't trust.
> 
> ...


This is us, completely. You nailed it.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

> *stoney1215 said*: having personal privacy is in no way BS . how could anyone possibly think having privacy is BS ? what is it about being married that makes you think your husband is no longer entitled to privacy ? why do you think that being married means you yourself are not allowed to have privacy ?
> 
> being married does not give anyone the right to invade your spouses email , phone messages , mail , etc..... to say it does is just plain ridiculous..


 Stoney.. If you want to understand where I am coming from, please take 5 minutes and read my thread.. then give me your argument... 








http://talkaboutmarriage.com/genera...parency-what-means-our-marraige-what-you.html









I feel very strongly about how I feel.. just as YOU DO... and people should be very careful to marry like minded individuals on a variety of important issues.. this is another one of those WE don't see eye to eye on... very obviously. 

I would not be with a man who has *your attitude*... that's my prerogative, I wouldn't care if the man talked like a damn dog (I am not easily uptight or insecure) so long as he did all his licking at home...I'm good! 

People are different, I can handle the TRUTH in it's rarest forms...I like it RAW, I can be crude myself.... I don't put my husband in the dog house, there is no reason to hide things from a wife like myself. ....And I feel very blessed I have a man who WANTS me to be so open & forthcoming with him as well.. because I like to share all my







. 

Bottom line is this... A person who values *A WILLING Transparency*, not a hog tied forced version (which is what you are assuming here)....should be with a like minded person, this = harmony & builds lasting trust. 

To be honest, I never check his email -I only have a tracfone... nor does he check mine.. we don't need too, cause we talk about everything juicy there is to possibly say.. especially our conversations with others. I find this healthy and so does My man. 

To each their own, wouldn't you agree ?


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

> I'm just curious but do women also make jokes like this during let's say a GNO? Is there comments about how hot a guy is and/or what they would like to (hypothetically) do to them? *I know men are cruder and more vulgar in general *but it has to go the other way a little too right??


Oh, yeah, Franchise! Women DEFINITELY have plenty to say, and the bolded part actually made me laugh out loud (not at YOU, but in delight!) Trust me, with our best friends...we're EVERY BIT as vulgar & horny as you guys! Lucky bfs & hubbys get to take advantage of that when we get home!!!


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Franchise said:


> I'm just curious but do women also make jokes like this during let's say a GNO? Is there comments about how hot a guy is and/or what they would like to (hypothetically) do to them? I know men are cruder and more vulgar in general but it has to go the other way a little too right??


I don't go out with the girls too much, just not my thing...But yes.. women do talk like this... I went to see the Chippendales with 2 of my wilder GF's, one married, and one not, the married one -very vocally excited - she went up on stage with them, she was in her glory......my other GF grabbed my hand & made me touch the chest of the one standing in front of us.. SOME women are nuts when they get around some hot guys... I seen enough that night it kinda shocked me- how women behave, lots of crude. 

I may comment on looks & a passing







comment, but nothing so vulgar I wouldn't say in front of my own husband....The way I act away from him, he would not at all be shocked by my behavior...he'd say... "Yep, that's my wife!" ~ he's called me a "dirty old woman" with a  a # of times... he knows where my







is ~and this is what matters. 

He went to see Magic Mike with me, he's not uptight. He enjoyed the movie. He gets all the benefits if some thrill goes up & down my spine..it's not like any "emotional connection" is there with anyone else.....it's just not a threat. 

This is how we see such things ~both of us ~ as we've talked about it. Just cause we're married doesn't mean we are dead.


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## SadandAngry (Aug 24, 2012)

Downtrodden said:


> I'd say the majority of us chew the fat with those same teeth.
> 
> Though I might be more careful about toeing that particular line if I'd found myself on the wrong side of it once before.
> 
> Keep in mind, it _is_ just joking.


It's only joking, until it isn't joking. Joking is a way to safely push the boundaries, to put out feelers. Often enough, it isn't truly just joking.

Also, you feel guilty for looking at his phone. You should not. There is a difference between privacy and secrecy. Privacy means closing the door when going to the bathroom. Secrecy is saying and doing things on your phone or whatever, that you would not do in front of your spouse. There should be privacy in marriage, but not secrecy. Check out the infidelity section if you disagree. Once you get married, you should be prepared to be an open book, and if you find yourself doing things contrary to that, that could be a big red flag to check yourself, before you do something you will really regret.

Yes, your husband is married, not dead, he will see women that are attractive to him. That isn't a license to disrespect them, or you. Apparently he has had problems with this in the past, and he then has noone to blame but himself for losing some latitude in what you find acceptable or not.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

A cheater is going to cheat. Period. It doesn't matter if they joke about it inappropriately, or not.

All this checking, rechecking, violating privacy, is nonsense. Why? Because if it's gotten to that point already, the trust is gone.

And if the trust is gone, what's left of your marriage? If I have to spend my days worrying about where my wife is, what she's doing, who she's talking to, what kind of jokes she's telling her friends, if my hours are filled with worrying, and speculating, about her potentially betraying me, than she doesn't need to be my wife anymore.

It's like people seem to forget that marriage is suppose to add to your life, not detract from it. A healthy marriage should uplift you, help ease life's burdens, and provide you with a dependable source of joy, FUN, pleasure, strength, and support.

The way I see marriage defined, especially around here, is something that needs to be endured and survived. I don't want to ever be married to somebody who I have to simply endure. I can do that alone!


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

jaquen said:


> And if the trust is gone, what's left of your marriage? If I have to spend my days worrying about where my wife is, what she's doing, who she's talking to, what kind of jokes she's telling her friends, if my hours are filled with worrying, and speculating, about her potentially betraying me, than she doesn't need to be my wife anymore.
> 
> It's like people seem to forget that marriage is suppose to add to your life, not detract from it. *A healthy marriage should uplift you, help ease life's burdens, and provide you with a dependable source of joy, FUN, pleasure, strength, and support.*


Your every word resonates with me as well....I feel the same. 



> *SadandAngry said*: Privacy means closing the door when going to the bathroom. Secrecy is saying and doing things on your phone or whatever, that you would not do in front of your spouse.
> 
> There should be privacy in marriage, but not secrecy. Check out the infidelity section if you disagree. Once you get married, you should be prepared to be an open book, and if you find yourself doing things contrary to that, that could be a big red flag to check yourself, before you do something you will really regret.


 I think I should have used the term "*Secrecy*" instead of *"Privacy*.....you explained the difference very well here.... :smthumbup:

We don't have any secrets at all... open books laid bare....some people say they need a little mystery to hold the flame...this is not our experience.....we revel in the sheer free flowing openness sharing our thoughts, feelings, and well... conversations. 

There is nothing my husband could do to invade my privacy though....that's never happened.... and other than me being in the bathroom while he is wiping his a$$.... he'd say the same about me. 
And yes ~ I've asked.


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## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

stoney1215, What if your spouse were displaying red flags of cheating, but denies it (as they all do) when confronted? Do you walk away from your family on a gut feeling, or do you snoop?

I agree with most that this particular event is just "guy talk", although my friends and I rarely take it to that level, especially in a written media. The naked pics is a much greater transgression, and the marriage is already on shaky ground due to that breach of trust.


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## TrustInUs (Sep 9, 2012)

I know my H has probably made jokes that I wouldn't want to hear, but it doesn't bother me. When he gets with a couplw of his childhood friends all bets are off. They are all married with kids, so who knows what they are talking about when they eacape us wives and kids LOL. We've talked about how we sometimes joke with our friends but he know he doesn't disrespect me, and I trust him. We both also know that we both have a few close friends that we probably tell more to and not others but I believe we both keep it respectful.

We do believe in transparency. We have passwords to phones and emails and stuff. I don't snoop, but he's asked me to check his email for something or other on occasion and vice versa. We use each others phone on occasion as well. I think the fact that we try to be open book about these things makes us both feel secure in our relationship with each other. For us, this wasn't an area that we fought over and neither of us had the feelings of giving up privacy, so fortunately this wasn't an issue for us.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Jaquen, you said: "Hate to tell you this, but a lot of us relish being carefree, and young, with our buddies no matter how old we are chronologically."

I get what you are saying, but are you also saying you'd have no problem with your wife commenting on a hot young man and saying "I got this" (in the context of the OP's original post)?


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Faithful Wife said:


> I get what you are saying, but are you also saying you'd have no problem with your wife commenting on a hot young man and saying "I got this" (in the context of the OP's original post)?


My wife wouldn't say that. If she did, it would be out of character, and I would be less bothered, and more floored. It would be a "WTF are you" moment. Had I married a woman who joked like that, and I knew how she was before the marriage, then no, I would not have a problem. It's all about the person you married, and whether something is in character for them, or not.

But I don't do what the OP does, even though I can get pretty raunchy and juvenile with two of my best friends. We'll comment more on women in the media, or porn, or just exchange convo openly about sex and women. My wife is well aware of this.

It's akin to my wife going to see a Broadway show with Blair Underwood with her best friend, and them swooning and fanning themselves at how hot they find him. I've got no problem with that.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Ok...well you confused me when you said: "This is generic brand tapioca pudding compared to some of the stuff two of my best friends and I say in conversation" after a copy of the OP's description of what was said. But now you are saying you "don't do what the OP does?" You can see the confusion, right?

I was confused by what you wrote, because you seem so happily married and in love with your wife.

Contrary to what you and others have said, there are men who simply don't engage in this type of stuff. Not that they haven't when they were younger...but we do reach an age where we stop trying to impress our friends at some point. 

Talking about other women as sexual objects is something that men can eventually grow out of...so please don't make a case that this is "impossible" or whatever. Many men are gentlemen and don't view women as purely "hot or not".


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Faithful Wife said:


> Ok...well you confused me when you said: "This is generic brand tapioca pudding compared to some of the stuff two of my best friends and I say in conversation" after a copy of the OP's description of what was said. But now you are saying you "don't do what the OP does?" You can see the confusion, right?


I don't see the confusion, no. 

I never said that my best friend and I had the _exact _same exchange. I simply said that some of our raunchier conversations come across worse to me than the relatively tame exchange the OP wrote out.

That's akin to somebody coming on here and being upset that they caught their husband drinking a beer, and someone "saying if you think beer is bad, you should see some of the stuff I drink"! 




Faithful Wife said:


> I was confused by what you wrote, because you seem so happily married and in love with your wife.


I am happily married. But being happily married didn't come with a surgical removal of my masculinity and personality. I'm married, not dead. 



Faithful Wife said:


> Contrary to what you and others have said, there are men who simply don't engage in this type of stuff.


There is no contrary to what "I" said, as I never suggested all men joked like this. I specifically qualified with "a lot of us".



Faithful Wife said:


> Not that they haven't when they were younger...but we do reach an age where we stop trying to impress our friends at some point.


I don't consider people I feel pressured to impress friends, so I can't address that.



Faithful Wife said:


> Talking about other women as sexual objects is something that men can eventually grow out of...so please don't make a case that this is "impossible" or whatever. Many men are gentlemen and don't view women as purely "hot or not".


What this has to do with anything I typed in here is beyond me. Perhaps you meant to address someone actually challenging these notions?


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

The things you are relating that you share with your friends, are immature and impolite and have nothing to do with masculinity, jaquen. That's my opinion, not that it matters. But there are many men who do not share your view point, so I'm not sure how many you consider to be "a lot of us".

It is true that "boys will be boys"....but it is also true that many men grow out of this and become gentlemen.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Faithful Wife said:


> The things you are relating that you share with your friends, are immature and impolite and have nothing to do with masculinity, jaquen. That's my opinion, not that it matters. But there are many men who do not share your view point, so I'm not sure how many you consider to be "a lot of us".
> 
> It is true that "boys will be boys"....but it is also true that many men grow out of this and become gentlemen.


So are you seriously suggesting that sexualized talk about between male friends automatically disqualifies a man from being a "gentlemen"?

How, pray tell, did you arrive at that conclusion? And by what criteria do you judge what is "immature" and "impolite", especially considering that I never once disclosed the exact content of the banter my bests friends and I have.

You seem to be full of insight, and judgement, and I'm dying to know where you came by your authority.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Never said I had any authority....I said I had an OPINION.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Faithful Wife said:


> Never said I had any authority....I said I had an OPINION.


You have an opinion, a strong one at that, on the nature of a complete stranger's conversations, based on content you didn't even bother to ascertain before judging.

OK. Thanks for answering me. Everything is perfectly clear now.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

To the original poster...did you ask your husband about the messages you read, and did you get an answer you were satisfied with? I hope so, but I'm guessing you didn't (get an answer you were satisfied with).

I just want you to know that there are men who don't speak this way about other women when they are married.

Especially given that your H apparently had boundary issues in the past.


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

Personally if my OH spoke like that about women I'd be very upset. I personally wouldn't say something around others I wouldn't say in his presence. I expect him to give me the same courtesy and respect. 

I think he should be respectful of women at all times and not just when it suits. And I do the same.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

*LittleDeer* said:


> Personally if my OH spoke like that about women I'd be very upset.



That's why some conversations between men are not for their women to hear nor understand.
They simply wouldn't appreciate it.

Same thing with women. Some talk is simply girls talk not suited for men.

Everything should be taken in context.

Recently I was purchasing some fruits for my wife in the market.
The fruit vendor was a male. Apparently he saw this woman walking behind me,and he alerted me. I waited until she passed and looked at her. She was dressed in leggings and a fitted top. He commented on her assets and asked me what I thought.
I laughed and said she looked smoking hot.
Was I wrong to do that ?

If my wife was there with me, then we would not be having that conversation out of respect for her. 
When I'm with her, all my attention goes to her.
That doesn't mean that I don't see other women, if I'm by myself.
Commenting to another man about how another woman looks does not automatically equate lusting after her.

Its a fact of life.
Men look at women.
Women look at men.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

I'm beginning to think that some of the women around here would be much happier as lesbians.

Because some of you sure sound like you'd love to turn men into women. That is a very common theme I'm seeing around here. When describing the perfect man, pointing out what is considered "good", and what is "bad", the final description sounds eerily close to a woman with a strap on.


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## Rags (Aug 2, 2010)

jaquen said:


> I'm beginning to think that some of the women around here would be much happier as lesbians.
> 
> Because some of you sure sound like you'd love to turn men into women. That is a very common theme I'm seeing around here. When describing the perfect man, pointing out what is considered "good", and what is "bad", the final description sounds eerily close to a woman with a strap on.


There is a school of thought that suggests that there has been a social 'experiment' aimed at doing just that - feminising men, and it's thought to be partly tied to hardline feminist dogma.

Turns out that most women (no matter what some women might say, or think, or think they think) don't actually want a fem-man. They want a man, who is manly, but nice.

Of course there's a broad spectrum  and YMMV


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## Rags (Aug 2, 2010)

As for the original question, sounds like the sort of thing men say when there aren't any women around.

I believe most sensible, informed women would know about this, and not take it too seriously, provided it wasn't disrespectful towards them. My wife knows I notice other women - it's impossible not to for a healthy adult male. The rule is 'look, don't touch' and I'm generally fairly discrete if/when I look. More so if she's with me.
(I have a game I play while commuting - if I see a woman who looks attractive from behind, I'll try to overtake her - and glance as I go past to see if I was right - once. It helps make commuting less boring! - Wife knows and find the game amusing!)


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