# She wants rough sex?



## OldManMage (Jun 6, 2017)

So I'm a good guy. Always have been. Definitely beta material in our relationship. When someone asks if I'm available to do something on a given day I usually joke "I let DW run my life, it's safer that way" and then check my schedule with her.

Been married 27 years. Had a recent dry spell (about 5 years of sex just on holidays, followed by a couple of years of not even that, I gave up initiating about a year ago to see if she ever would. She wouldn't.) 

I had an incident with a prescribed drug that made me suicidal but very communicative of my needs and long story short we have tried to reignite our love life in the past two months. At first she said "We need to improve but I don't think we need sex three times a week" but after a couple of weeks of warming up now she's insatiable. We recently had sex (a couple one-sided) 8 times in one week. Yes, twice on two days that week - morning and night.

In doing research since on our dry spell I keep running into all of this advice that says many women want occasional rough sex. Honestly I think this has been an unspoken need in our relationship. I've tried directing her and she really seems to get into it but I don't do it very well and about 5 minutes into it I lose the desire to direct or use her for my own pleasure.

Even when I've used restraints on her recently I realize it's still about me pleasing her and not about rough or selfish sex. Personally I'd like being married to a dominatrix I think. I'm a very successful business executive and I intimidate my employees without even realizing it. When I'm home though it's a complete 180 - I like to be dominated and I like to please. I bought a cheap restraint system a few weeks ago and I can tell you the two times she used it on me was out of this world, but the other way around was less than stellar. I tried using them on her last night and believe it or not even with a Hitachi couldn't bring her to orgasm. I finally gave up, untied her and went to bed. I could tell I was going the wrong direction with it, even though she protested that she "enjoyed it."

So, how do I help to fulfill this need of hers? I have no idea where to begin. All the advice I've seen online, the books I've read or skimmed recently basically don't give any real details and since this is so outside my personality any details I've seen suggested just feel wrong. It doesn't help that she's on antidepressants and half the time I can't get her to orgasm and that makes me over try I think.


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

OldManMage said:


> So I'm a good guy. Always have been. Definitely beta material in our relationship. When someone asks if I'm available to do something on a given day I usually joke "I let DW run my life, it's safer that way" and then check my schedule with her.
> 
> Been married 27 years. Had a recent dry spell (about 5 years of sex just on holidays, followed by a couple of years of not even that, I gave up initiating about a year ago to see if she ever would. She wouldn't.)
> 
> ...


I think you two are a power mismatch. You are both submissive, each needing a dominant. 

Can you just accept the mismatch and enjoy the rest of the relationship?


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Not ALL women want to be dominated. Some do. And some want it some of the time but not all the time. Every woman is different. 

Talk to her.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

@OldManMage I enjoy very rough sex and have never dated a man who didn't happen to be naturally dominant in bed. I have played around with a guy who had explored his submissive side and allowed me to dominate him. He was so submissive, I couldn't imagine him trying to dominate someone in bed. 

I'm not sure how to explain how you can be more rough in bed if you have a hard time emphasizing with her need for dominance. Hmm perhaps you should skip the toys. The toys can make it a little more awkward as it is not a natural part of sex. I enjoy leashes and I had tried to introduce it very early on but my current partner had a hard time getting comfortable using it in the beginning. We put it away and focused on me communicating as much as possible about the way I wanted to be sexed. 

When you become more comfortable being dominant, then you can slowly introduce toys. You're going to have to figure out how to get her to tell you what she wants. I find that I'm more open to talking about what I want right after sex. He'll ask specifics about my different responses, how something felt, if I wanted more/less of something, if I wanted something done differently etc etc. 

I guess baseline things to try out are light spanking, hair grabbing, lightly holding her around the neck (especially from behind or on top) and highlighting your strength by pinning her down when possible while being very attentive to her responses. All rough sex is not created equal hence communication is your best friend on this one. 

I think your wife's tolerance level is likely not that high otherwise her need would have been greater and she would've communicated her dissatisfaction more strongly. So I don't think you're going to have to do anything extreme in bed with her. Just more assertiveness and control from your end.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

You need to talk to her to find out what she wants, and you can tell her what you want. 

Not everyone is in to dominance, and those that are may be into very different things. Does she want to be dominated at all? Does that mean she wants you to call her nasty names? Spank her? Have rough sex? Order her to sexually service you? Some people like all or some of these things, and dislike others.

Same for you. Does she know what part of being restrained you like?

It can be difficult but this needs to be a conversation.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Rough sex, if your woman is open to it, is only going to be welcome if she ALREADY trusts and respects you. It sounds like the foundation is too weak to try, unless you're open to the risk of getting a response you don't want.

Have you asked her what she enjoys? Can you both openly communicate comfortably about your sexual needs? If not, a sex therapist might be a good idea.


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## Remee81 (May 24, 2017)

U may find some insight in what people responded to my post on this topic. It's from the other perspective, but people have really helped me communicate my needs to DH, and suggested books that helped a lot too. They r right, communication is key. I'm still learning that!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## musicftw07 (Jun 23, 2016)

bandit.45 said:


> Not ALL women want to be dominated. Some do. And some want it some of the time but not all the time. Every woman is different.
> 
> Talk to her.


1000x this.

My GF is the very definition of a strong, independent woman. She'll own you in the boardroom.

But she wants to be owned in the bedroom. (As a general rule.) Yes, she loves rough sex. It's one of her biggest stress relievers.

Sometimes she wants sweet or tender sex to feel connected; or, she may want to get on top of me and dominate me for a bit. So there are additional flavors. But predominately, she is submissive. I've just learned to read non-verbal cues from her to know what she wants.

But mostly, we've talked about it. A lot. We know each other's likes, preferences, and tendencies.

(And I tend to think that any woman who says she doesn't like rough sex every now and then lies.)


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

musicftw07 said:


> (And I tend to think that any woman who says she doesn't like rough sex every now and then lies.)


Used to think this too till I came across some female posters on TAM declaring zero interest in that style of sex and being unable to comprehend why other women would want that.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

Keke24 said:


> Used to think this too till I came across some female posters on TAM declaring zero interest in that style of sex and being unable to comprehend why other women would want that.


Indeed. 
My wife is 100% into gentle. She is physically (as well as emotionally) very sensitive. A slightly misplaced digit or just a little too much pressure just about anywhere, and things dissipate in a hurry. She does occasionally want to skip all the lovey dovey stuff and just go hard and fast, but I still wouldn't call that "rough sex."


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## Anastasia6 (May 28, 2017)

I guess I'm having trouble with the term rough sex and the description the OP is giving. She might like the restraints for entirely different reasons.

I know when my DH tried restraints on me I liked from the mental aspect. Men complain about starfish but it is nice to be restrained and be able to focus on the sensations and feelings then what should I be doing with my hand? I found a blindfold helps too. I don't consider that rough sex.

OP says he like to be submissive and please her but when I'm tied up that is what it is about. Him pleasing me and it's his issue to find his pleasure and mine. In a way seems like the not tied up is the submissive. Of course I understand there are other ways to play that.

You really need some communication. We find that we change it up more now that we have increased our frequency. Maybe she just wants some variety. Try girl on top, cowgirl, anal (but read up on this first) restrain each other. Get a safe word that way if something is over stimulating or painful you know it.

And I agree with the poster that said I'm more open to talking right after sex.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

OldManMage said:


> So I'm a good guy. Always have been. Definitely beta material in our relationship. When someone asks if I'm available to do something on a given day I usually joke "I let DW run my life, it's safer that way" and then check my schedule with her.


1. Isn't a good guy also someone who tends toward selfless acts? Wouldn't a person who is interested in ensuring another's happiness be okay with stepping out of his comfort zone in order to make their spouse happy?

2. Stop being dependent on your wife to run your life. A woman who digs domination dislikes passivity.




> Been married 27 years. Had a recent dry spell (about 5 years of sex just on holidays, followed by a couple of years of not even that, I gave up initiating about a year ago to see if she ever would. She wouldn't.)


When men stop initiating to get their wives to initiate more...it never ever ends well.




> I had an incident with a prescribed drug that made me suicidal but very communicative of my needs and long story short we have tried to reignite our love life in the past two months. At first she said "We need to improve but I don't think we need sex three times a week" but after a couple of weeks of warming up now she's insatiable. We recently had sex (a couple one-sided) 8 times in one week. Yes, twice on two days that week - morning and night.


Glad you're healthy now and cowabunga on an insatiable wife! Enjoy it because once full menopause kicks in she may not have such a killer sex drive. But the patterns developing now, as a result of her killer sex drive, will carry into menopause so it's not a death sentence.




> In doing research since on our dry spell I keep running into all of this advice that says many women want occasional rough sex. Honestly I think this has been an unspoken need in our relationship. I've tried directing her and she really seems to get into it but I don't do it very well and about 5 minutes into it I lose the desire to direct or use her for my own pleasure.


Tender sensual sex is great, but after 25 years it's time to spice it up and let the raging passion come to the fore!

It's not really about roughness, it's about uncontrollable passion. It's about wanting her so bad you rip her clothes to get her naked. It's about pushing her up against wall for a neck nibble and an ass grabe because you saw her bend over to load the dishwasher. Uncontrolled lust! That tends to appear rough but in reality it doesn't have to be rough.




> Even when I've used restraints


 YES PLEASE!


> on her recently I realize it's still about me pleasing her and not about rough or selfish sex. Personally I'd like being married to a dominatrix I think. I'm a very successful business executive and I intimidate my employees without even realizing it. When I'm home though it's a complete 180 - I like to be dominated and I like to please. I bought a cheap restraint system a few weeks ago and I can tell you the two times she used it on me was out of this world, but the other way around was less than stellar. I tried using them on her last night and believe it or not even with a Hitachi couldn't bring her to orgasm. I finally gave up, untied her and went to bed. I could tell I was going the wrong direction with it, even though she protested that she "enjoyed it."


Oh boy. 

As she goes through perimenopause and full menopause it is likely that her hormones will sometimes NOT cooperate and allow her to orgasm. This is neither her fault, so don't make her feel like a failure for not flooding the bed in orgasms, nor your fault, so don't feel like a failure.

You went into this scene attached to the outcome, that you'd make her orgasm. But darling, this is about the process and not the outcome. I know it's hard for some men to wrap their brains around process oriented sex rather than goal oriented sex. The process is YOU enjoying the hell out of her body and her enjoying you enjoying the hell out of her body...please refer back to passion vs tender. If you had been enjoying the hell out of her body you would have continued to play with her body until you couldn't take it any more and mounted her like a prize bull.



> So, how do I help to fulfill this need of hers? I have no idea where to begin. All the advice I've seen online, the books I've read or skimmed recently basically don't give any real details and since this is so outside my personality any details I've seen suggested just feel wrong. It doesn't help that she's on antidepressants and half the time I can't get her to orgasm and that makes me over try I think.



She's on antidepressants half the time? They should be taken daily, not sometimes. They are wholly ineffective if not taken daily. Either she stops taking them or she starts taking them daily.

How do you do this?
1. Understand this is more about passion and fun than outcome and performance.
2. Go to www.husdom.com to learn how a husband dominates a wife.


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## musicftw07 (Jun 23, 2016)

Keke24 said:


> musicftw07 said:
> 
> 
> > (And I tend to think that any woman who says she doesn't like rough sex every now and then lies.)
> ...


Really? That seems counter-intuitive, but I'm not disagreeing with you. Just surprised at this new information.

I wonder if that disparity is generational.


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## james5588 (Mar 22, 2017)

I would suggest experimenting but at a different 'venue' (a different bedroom or even a hotel) so that you can more easily compartmentalize if needed. You'll need to have few different scenarios in mind and visualize them playing out before hand so that you yourself can be comfortable and ultimately project that confidence as you proceed with her. 

Think of it as playing 'jazz'.

You know her better than anyone else. Challenge some of her boundaries but keep it playful (know her cues). See where it takes you. You are limited only by your imagination...

Then, when you are back at home and she brings up your adventures, playfully act like you have no idea what she is talking about (what, you must have dreamt that, my love). That way you maintain control of the discourse and not just the intimacy. One fun approach (as long as it stays playful) is to open an alter ego email account and communicate that way when not 'in character'...

good luck


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

Anon Pink said:


> Isn't a good guy also someone who tends toward selfless acts? Wouldn't a person who is interested in ensuring another's happiness be okay with stepping out of his comfort zone in order to make their spouse happy?


Read and heed the above. Truer words were never spoken. 



Anon Pink said:


> When men stop initiating to get their wives to initiate more...it never ever ends well.


Yep. Yes. Yeah. QFT. Bingo. As many men on this board could tell you from experience. This be true to the core. 



Anon Pink said:


> It's not really about roughness, it's about uncontrollable passion. It's about wanting her so bad you rip her clothes to get her naked. It's about pushing her up against wall for a neck nibble and an ass grabe because you saw her bend over to load the dishwasher. Uncontrolled lust! That tends to appear rough but in reality it doesn't have to be rough.


Again, BINGO! 




Anon Pink said:


> You went into this scene attached to the outcome, that you'd make her orgasm. But darling, this is about the process and not the outcome. I know it's hard for some men to wrap their brains around process oriented sex rather than goal oriented sex. The process is YOU enjoying the hell out of her body and her enjoying you enjoying the hell out of her body...


Batting 1.000 here. Gotta' love the process. When I focus on the doing rather than the going, it always works better. When I relish in what I'm doing to her, that is to say when I simply and completely engrossed in the act without concern for the outcome, that is paradoxically when the outcome is best. For both of us. 

AnonPink--congratulations on a stellar post from start to finish. 
OP--again, read and heed, there is much wisdom here. 
The rest of us--always good to have a reminder once in a while!


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

musicftw07 said:


> Really? That seems counter-intuitive, but I'm not disagreeing with you. Just surprised at this new information.
> 
> I wonder if that disparity is generational.


Age has nothing to do with it.

Some women dig it, others do not. There is no reason why. It just is.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

musicftw07 said:


> Really? That seems counter-intuitive, but I'm not disagreeing with you. Just surprised at this new information.
> 
> I wonder if that disparity is generational.


Counter-intuitive to what and in what way? Generational? How could that possibly be?


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## OldManMage (Jun 6, 2017)

Anon Pink said:


> Glad you're healthy now and cowabunga on an insatiable wife! Enjoy it because once full menopause kicks in she may not have such a killer sex drive. But the patterns developing now, as a result of her killer sex drive, will carry into menopause so it's not a death sentence.


Well I wouldn't say healthy - but better. Still having bad days. I might mention she's also had a total hysterectomy, ovaries included, so menopause kicked in many years ago.



Anon Pink said:


> You went into this scene attached to the outcome, that you'd make her orgasm. But darling, this is about the process and not the outcome. I know it's hard for some men to wrap their brains around process oriented sex rather than goal oriented sex. The process is YOU enjoying the hell out of her body and her enjoying you enjoying the hell out of her body...please refer back to passion vs tender. If you had been enjoying the hell out of her body you would have continued to play with her body until you couldn't take it any more and mounted her like a prize bull.


Yes, I definitely DID go into this scene with the intent to make her orgasm. With my own anxiety issues I've been dealing with since my incident a few weeks ago, I never even got an erection, and once I realized it wasn't working for her I realized I wasn't going to be able to so that's when I stopped. If I'd been capable, I would have mounted her like a prize bull, as you say. It just wasn't going to happen.





Anon Pink said:


> She's on antidepressants half the time? They should be taken daily, not sometimes. They are wholly ineffective if not taken daily. Either she stops taking them or she starts taking them daily.


You misread - I said she's on antidepressents SO half the time I can't bring her to orgasm.



Anon Pink said:


> 1. Understand this is more about passion and fun than outcome and performance.
> 2. Go to www.husdom.com to learn how a husband dominates a wife.


Yeah, well outcome and performance are still important though. I can't imagine not having an orgasm 3 out of 5 times I had sex. It would make me not want it anymore. The back of my mind makes me wonder if that's why she lost interest in sex.

And on husdom.com - been there but all the posts are behind a pay wall.

Thanks for the feedback.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

OldManMage said:


> Well I wouldn't say healthy - but better. Still having bad days. I might mention she's also had a total hysterectomy, ovaries included, so menopause kicked in many years ago.
> 
> 
> Yes, I definitely DID go into this scene with the intent to make her orgasm. With my own anxiety issues I've been dealing with since my incident a few weeks ago, I never even got an erection, and once I realized it wasn't working for her I realized I wasn't going to be able to so that's when I stopped. If I'd been capable, I would have mounted her like a prize bull, as you say. It just wasn't going to happen.
> ...



Bolded: Latest stats say women orgasm 66% of the time while men orgasm 90 (something in the 90's) This means that while men experience sex from their very first encounter as ending with ejaculation, women do not. In fact, from an informal survey amount about 10-15 women I know, only one had an orgasm the first time she had sex. Everyone else in the 20 and two of us well into our 30's. That's years and years of having sex without experiencing an orgasm. That teaches us that, among other things, sex feels good because of the closeness and intimacy. Perhaps this is why some women like sex a bit less than men? 

But your wife is experiencing a rebound in her sex drive, even though she isn't experiencing more orgasms. What, in light of what I just wrote, does that tell you? It tells me she wants YOU. She wants YOU to be happy and she wants closeness and intimacy with YOU.

I didn't know husdom switched to a fee for entrance? I thought you just had to be a registered member. Well thanks for letting me know.

LOL, I clearly did misread. Sorry about that chief. Is she open to switching antidepressants with less sexual side effects?


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## musicftw07 (Jun 23, 2016)

Keke24 said:


> musicftw07 said:
> 
> 
> > Really? That seems counter-intuitive, but I'm not disagreeing with you. Just surprised at this new information.
> ...


Counter-intuitive to my personal experience.

One of my job functions is data analytics. It's in my nature to search for patterns in to things. No need to read into it any more than that.


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## DayOne (Sep 19, 2014)

OldManMage said:


> And on husdom.com - been there but all the posts are behind a pay wall.


There is a 'premium' membership, but you can sign up for free.

Here's a link to the free sign up option.

https://husdom.com/membership-checkout/?level=4


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

musicftw07 said:


> Counter-intuitive to my personal experience.
> 
> One of my job functions is data analytics. It's in my nature to search for patterns in to things. No need to read into it any more than that.


I would love to know if you do find a pattern among women who are into being dominated and like a bit of slap and tickle with their pickle.


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## musicftw07 (Jun 23, 2016)

Anon Pink said:


> musicftw07 said:
> 
> 
> > Counter-intuitive to my personal experience.
> ...


Best. Post. EVER.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

musicftw07 said:


> Best. Post. EVER.


Did I win the Internet?


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## musicftw07 (Jun 23, 2016)

Anon Pink said:


> musicftw07 said:
> 
> 
> > Best. Post. EVER.
> ...


I'd say you won ten internets.


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## OldManMage (Jun 6, 2017)

musicftw07 said:


> I'd say you won ten internets.


I have to agree.


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## OldManMage (Jun 6, 2017)

Anon Pink said:


> In fact, from an informal survey amount about 10-15 women I know, only one had an orgasm the first time she had sex. Everyone else in the 20 and two of us well into our 30's. That's years and years of having sex without experiencing an orgasm. That teaches us that, among other things, sex feels good because of the closeness and intimacy. Perhaps this is why some women like sex a bit less than men?


Yeah, we aren't talking about first time fumbling teen sex here. We're 5 kids and a hysterectomy down the road.



Anon Pink said:


> But your wife is experiencing a rebound in her sex drive, even though she isn't experiencing more orgasms. What, in light of what I just wrote, does that tell you? It tells me she wants YOU. She wants YOU to be happy and she wants closeness and intimacy with YOU.


Or worse - she's taking pity on me because of my recent issues. I've worried about that actually considering some time later she asked me if my sex drive was finally going back down "closer to hers" which for the past few years has been every other month at best if I begged for it. One of my initial symptoms was my sex drive went off the charts for about a week before the depression and anxiety really hit. I do think I've had a lot of pity sex. Then again, I've been having anxiety and depression for 7 weeks now so I don't even really know what's real anymore, and I keep trying to remind myself of that. One minute I'm carefree and enjoying the new sex, the next minute I think it's some sort of an evil plot. Next I think it's just because she feels sorry for me.

Sucks to be in my head right now. But all of this is really off topic. 

How the hell do I kick it up a notch with domination in the bedroom? In the past 7 weeks I've bared my soul multiple times - mostly because I felt if I didn't confide I'd jump off a bridge. Literally. Again, OT. 
She's learned all of my repressed sexual fantasies that I never would have mentioned without the imbalance in my head, and in exchange all I got from her was "I don't have any fantasies."

But, I still saw the way she perked up when I did a bit of bossyness one night. I'm just having a hard time figuring out where to take that.

And I just browsed through husdom a bit more after registering. It did unlock most of the posts but not the two that looked most helpful of course. Honestly though most of what he talks about turns my stomach.


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## genabee (Nov 26, 2016)

My husband is the NICEST, most caring guy in the world and we have had some problems when I initially wanted some domination. 

I occasionally like to be tied down or have my arms held down and "taken" forcefully. When we first started playing he kept stopping and saying "is this too much?", "am I hurting you?", "am I being too crude?", etc. and it totally ruined the mood. He wanted to give up and said that he just couldn't be sexually aroused with this type of play, even though I wanted it. We just slowly started playing around more and more until it got to the point where now he knows that I like it and trusts me enough to know that I will tell him if he's hurting me or upsetting me. It probably took 6 months or more of occasionally playing around with domination until he got comfortable enough.

We had a similar issue with facials. He likes giving them to me and I don't mind whatsoever (unless it gets in my eye) but he feels so guilty about it afterwards that it totally diminished the experience for him and he would apologize for a half hour after sex and tell me he's not disrespecting me. I finally had to just tell him that I don't care what "stigma" there is with facials and I know he loves me and respects me and I am a strong enough woman that I wouldn't let him do it to me if I felt degraded.

A guess my point is that it is great that you are a nice guy but sometimes women want our men to be "not so nice" or a bit kinky. It is all part of the fun of a healthy sex life.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

OldManMage said:


> Yeah, we aren't talking about first time fumbling teen sex here. We're 5 kids and a hysterectomy down the road.


I think you missed what I was trying to say. Women are used to sex meaning closeness and intimacy without orgasms. It's how we learned sex, how we experienced sex, some of us for years. So as your anxiety drives you to consider yourself a failure because she doesn't always orgasm, stop it! If orgasms were the most important thing to her she would let you know.

This is a classic example of a man taking ownship of a woman's intent to orgasm. You only own the how, not the intent. She enjoys the how regardless of the outcome. Trust her!




> Or worse - she's taking pity on me because of my recent issues. I've worried about that actually considering some time later she asked me if my sex drive was finally going back down "closer to hers" which for the past few years has been every other month at best if I begged for it. One of my initial symptoms was my sex drive went off the charts for about a week before the depression and anxiety really hit. I do think I've had a lot of pity sex. Then again, I've been having anxiety and depression for 7 weeks now so I don't even really know what's real anymore, and I keep trying to remind myself of that. One minute I'm carefree and enjoying the new sex, the next minute I think it's some sort of an evil plot. Next I think it's just because she feels sorry for me.
> 
> Sucks to be in my head right now. But all of this is really off topic.



Damn, she can't win no matter how much sex she wants? If she doesn't want sex you feel rejected. If she wants sex you feel manipulated.

No evil plot except the evil plot in your head doing its best to rob you of some ****ing awesome sex!




> How the hell do I kick it up a notch with domination in the bedroom? In the past 7 weeks I've bared my soul multiple times - mostly because I felt if I didn't confide I'd jump off a bridge. Literally. Again, OT.
> She's learned all of my repressed sexual fantasies that I never would have mentioned without the imbalance in my head, and in exchange all I got from her was "I don't have any fantasies."


Are your repressed fantasies involving any sort of domination games? 

She does have fantasies. If she digs domination she fantasizes about it. She's too ashamed to admit it. If she has any idea that you feel totally out of your depth and completely uncomfortable with domination she will continue to clam up. 

So pick one. Be at ease with staying in your comfort zone and having her clam up about sex, or meet her half way and tease her fantasies out of her.





> But, I still saw the way she perked up when I did a bit of bossyness one night. I'm just having a hard time figuring out where to take that.
> 
> And I just browsed through husdom a bit more after registering. It did unlock most of the posts but not the two that looked most helpful of course. Honestly though most of what he talks about turns my stomach.


Domination games are not like anything else. Not like baking a cake and only using the ingredients you have on hand, not like building some book shelves and only using glue because that's all your comfortable with, not like reading a book and understanding by only reading the chapter titles. But that's what domination games are like. You get to play domination games using only the ingredients you have, only the tools you're comfortable with, and only the understanding you have at that moment in time. 

You do not have to be a chest beating knuckle dragger bad boy.
You do not have to be a suit wearing mega billionaire sadist.
You don't even have to be a sailor who knows how to tie knots (although it does come in handy!)

You're over thinking yourself right out of the fun.

This is FUN! 
Not a test.
Fun.


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

The only knots I tie are to hold the restraints. Personally I think using ropes around body parts is asking for trouble. It's too easy for them to tighten up no matter how good you are at knots.

Mary used to struggle against her restraints with a lot of force. It's amazing how much force. Sometimes I thought a big part of it was to give her something to strain against, so she could get more muscles involved as she responded. 

We had to stop using nylon because it left very visible abrasions on her wrists the first time I put them on her.

We were in a huge horrible fight when I discovered Mary liked being Dominated in the bedroom. One day I was so furious with her I grabbed her by the hair, drug her into the bedroom, stripped her, and spanked her. I used just my hand, but I wasn't gentle.

Mary was insatiable after that. She wanted sex. Desperately. I had never seen her so turned on.

Next day I ordered the cuffs. When they arrived and I opened the box in front of her she was shocked but held out her arms for me to put them on. Nothing said by either of us.

The first day I put those cuffs on her was the day I learned Mary can have multiple orgasms. 

I knew Mary was submissive but I hadn't known how submissive she was. She never told me anything. Everything I learned I had to learn by experimentation. Hair pulling, spankings, wrist cuffs, hickies, gentle bites and pinches, hot candle wax. And yes, being verbally degraded. 

I have studied this phenomenon in the psychological literature off and on for just shy of four decades now. I have my own specimen to study. I don't have any other specimen though. The literature is all over the place.

Yes, Anon Pink wins the internet.


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## KrisAmiss (May 1, 2017)

Confidence is simply yum. My kinkiest lover would work on me, no matter my mood, ignoring whatever I was saying or doing, until he got me where he wanted me. I never thought of it in terms of dom/sub, but that's what it was. He would "control" me and take me out of reality. I never felt like I could do the same for him. I could never initiate with much success. He always seemed in control. But I see now that we were a perfect match in that way. He was getting exactly what he wanted and so was I. If I could've spent my life in the bedroom, he would've been a great partner.

My DH seems confident outside the bedroom but is easily deflated within. My recent find that he's into BSDM continues to puzzle me. I would love to see how "wicked" he could get. I'm quite sure I could stop him at any time. He assumed I wouldn't be into that. idk why. My above lover experimented and I did tell him once, don't ever do *that* again. No harm, no foul. We laughed about it. There were many other things he tried that I quite liked.

My point is confidence is the sexiest thing around. Go forth and have great sex.


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## introvert (May 30, 2016)

I think the title of the OP's thread is misleading. For the life of me, I can't find where his wife has actually asked for or otherwise indicated that she would like rough sex. OP has "heard" that women enjoy it, has tried restraints on her, with not good results. 

OP, can you just come out and ask your wife if she fantasizes about rough sex? If she answers in the affirmative, it's not rocket science to find suggestions online for these activities. 

It sounds like you are the one who wants to be dominated in the sack. Talk with her about this!

Good luck to both of you.


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## OldManMage (Jun 6, 2017)

Anon Pink said:


> Damn, she can't win no matter how much sex she wants? If she doesn't want sex you feel rejected. If she wants sex you feel manipulated.
> No evil plot except the evil plot in your head doing its best to rob you of some ****ing awesome sex!


Well even I know it's screwed up - like I said I know it's mostly all in my head. I'm not real balanced at the moment and it's been almost 8 weeks and I'm starting to wonder if I'm ever going to be again. That is what scares me more than anything.

Case in point: Last night she was out late into the evening with some of her volunteer work. I expected her home no later than 8 so sometime around 8:45 my anxiety started kicking in so I called her to see what was up and hear her voice. We chatted a minute and she asked me if I "had anything on tap for tonight" to which I responded "it depends on how long it takes you to get home." She knows I've been taking benadryl to help me get to sleep, so she responds with "You better not take any meds before I get there. I'm about to leave."

That of course got me all excited. I made a few preparations. At 10:00 I got frustrated and undid the preparations and went to bed. She finally got home at 10:30 and by then I was feeling extremely hurt and rejected, and it got worse when she basically just got ready for bed and announced our daughter had a friend staying over who would be here in a few minutes.

I had to consciously calm myself down and got up to grab my benadryl and simply said "Don't tease me with sex and then not come home. That's not cool." But inside I was seething. I had made plans, was intending to attempt a bit of dominance from my "studies" and had what I think was a pretty good plan. And I watched it all unravel. If I hadn't had the mental issues, I would have gone on with my plan at that point, but instead I just wanted to lay there and rot in my own pity.

My loving wife then ripped my clothes off and gave me an avocado oil rub down followed by a quickie with her on top. When I tried to stop her by saying she'd had a long day and don't worry about it she glared at me with "Don't tell me how to feel," and continued.

So yeah, even at the time I knew my reaction was stupid, but it didn't change the fact that I was feeling it. Rather than forcefully stopping her I honestly hoped that I wouldn't even be able to get an erection (the anxiety has been causing that off and on) but generally when I'm on my back like I was that's not a problem.

Yeah, I'm screwed up. I know. So believe me I know exactly what you're saying and I'm constantly trying to convince myself of that. My head keeps getting in the way though.



Anon Pink said:


> Are your repressed fantasies involving any sort of domination games?


Well one of them, although I guess you could say they're related or at least in the same overall genre. I've never been a porn watcher so I guess by most accounts they're probably pretty tame, but yeah I like to be dominated. Really it boiled down to two fantasies, one she already basically helped me out with and it was awesome though I think it freaked her out a bit. The other is something I'll never actually do - just a fantasy and it needs to remain as such.

And there's why I started the thread - I need to try flipping the tables and dominate her. Instead it's turned into a psychotherapy session for me, which is helpful too.  I've started wondering if you have a degree in psychology or do sex counseling full time because you rock. 


Anon Pink said:


> She does have fantasies. If she digs domination she fantasizes about it. She's too ashamed to admit it. If she has any idea that you feel totally out of your depth and completely uncomfortable with domination she will continue to clam up.
> 
> So pick one. Be at ease with staying in your comfort zone and having her clam up about sex, or meet her half way and tease her fantasies out of her.


I'm trying! I just wish we'd rekindled things when I wasn't bat**** crazy in the head. I've never had issues with anxiety or depression, or at least not this constantly or severely and this is really tearing me apart. And before someone jumps on that with "see a doctor," I've seen two plus a phone call with a psychologist friend of mine. I'm 95% sure it's withdrawal from a steroid nasal spray I was prescribed for two years. The doctors who got me hooked on it originally, when I saw them about my withdrawal symptoms then suggested I take Cymbalta, which I tried. No. I saw another doctor who changed the dose. No. It increased my desire and ability, but made sex hurt and took away all possibility of orgasm. That was torture for me though I'm pretty sure she appreciated the 2 hour rock hard session we had with her three orgasms - it completely removed the possibility of premature ejaculation! Not to mention the other 20 side effects like migraine, vomiting and complete sleeplessness. So I've been self treating with St. John's Wort and B5 which has kept me from being a total blubbering idiot. I still have my moments though. My biggest fear is that if this doesn't get better in a few weeks I'm going to have to start the Cymbalta again, and honestly I'd rather jump off a bridge. I think things seem to be slowly getting better for me - I'm finally productive at work again, for about 3 weeks all I did was lay on my couch and read, then go home and take a 3 hour nap, then go back to work and browse the Internet before leaving early for the day. I know, sucks to be me.



Anon Pink said:


> This is FUN!
> Not a test.
> Fun.


Let's hope it gets to that point, shall we?


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

OldManMage said:


> That of course got me all excited. I made a few preparations. At 10:00 I got frustrated and undid the preparations and went to bed. She finally got home at 10:30 and by then I was feeling extremely hurt and rejected, and it got worse when she basically just got ready for bed and announced our daughter had a friend staying over who would be here in a few minutes.
> 
> I had to consciously calm myself down and got up to grab my benadryl and simply said "Don't tease me with sex and then not come home. That's not cool." But inside I was seething. I had made plans, was intending to attempt a bit of dominance from my "studies" and had what I think was a pretty good plan. And I watched it all unravel. *If I hadn't had the mental issues, I would have gone on with my plan at that point, but instead I just wanted to lay there and rot in my own pity.*


You shouldn't have just gone on with your plan but you should've used your anger to your benefit and redirect it into more assertive energy.

Every now and then I use situations like this to spice things up with my partner. By now he figures it out and we laugh about it afterwards or he makes me pay with some more extreme sexplay. No complaints from me either way. And certainly none from him. In the beginning he would do exactly what you did, get pissed off and just sulk in bed and I'd have to initiate. LAME. I had to tell him off one time to get him to stop wallowing and take what he want.


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## OldManMage (Jun 6, 2017)

introvert said:


> I think the title of the OP's thread is misleading. For the life of me, I can't find where his wife has actually asked for or otherwise indicated that she would like rough sex. OP has "heard" that women enjoy it, has tried restraints on her, with not good results.
> 
> OP, can you just come out and ask your wife if she fantasizes about rough sex? If she answers in the affirmative, it's not rocket science to find suggestions online for these activities.
> 
> ...


So, back to the original conversation - It started partly because yes, I read several articles about it. Then I tried to give direction one night and she really seemed to respond to it. That night I also grabbed her hair and afterwards asked how she liked it and she said she did. After sex lately I've been trying to instigate a "how did it go" discussion so one of us doesn't throw in something new that the other hates.

Example: I asked her one afternoon if she were up to being tied up that night. She hesitated, started to say no and then knowing I've been out of my mind lately and not wanting to hurt my feelings she said "yes, I'll say yes." During that I said nothing, just waited for an answer. So, I made a makeshift soft restraints that really required her to just hold onto them and blindfolded her. She seemed to love it but we didn't really talk about it. 

A few days later we were at a flea market and she found some handcuffs and held them up grinning and said we should get them. We laughed at the time and I commented they looked painful. Later on I found a restraint system on Amazon and showed it to her and she said she wanted it. I commented that she didn't really seem like she was interested before but after the handcuffs comment I thought I'd ask and she replied that she really did enjoy it. Then she commented she didn't want one with a flogger because "you just want to spank me." She seemed pretty adamant that she didn't want spanking involved.

I ordered the one with the flogger anyway and when it came in and we were looking at it I hit my own leg a couple of times and laughed and slapped her across the butt with it once and we laughed. Once we had both used it in a session she started talking about ordering a crop. I guess the flogging worked for her.

So yeah, everything seems to be pointing that she's enjoying the exploration and I don't think it's just that she's trying to tolerate a fantasy of mine.


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## introvert (May 30, 2016)

OldManMage said:


> So, back to the original conversation - It started partly because yes, I read several articles about it. Then I tried to give direction one night and she really seemed to respond to it. That night I also grabbed her hair and afterwards asked how she liked it and she said she did. After sex lately I've been trying to instigate a "how did it go" discussion so one of us doesn't throw in something new that the other hates.
> 
> Example: I asked her one afternoon if she were up to being tied up that night. She hesitated, started to say no and then knowing I've been out of my mind lately and not wanting to hurt my feelings she said "yes, I'll say yes." During that I said nothing, just waited for an answer. So, I made a makeshift soft restraints that really required her to just hold onto them and blindfolded her. She seemed to love it but we didn't really talk about it.
> 
> ...


I'm all for exploration, and I'm a devoted kinkster. How about you just come out and tell her you would like her to use the flogger on you? Honestly, it doesn't sound like she's into being flogged, but you purchased the flogger anyway...you want it, right? There's nothing wrong with a man wanting to be dominated.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

This is where discussion and safe words can help. 

Some people use safe words just for rare emergencies, but I think they are better used as needed to stop things you don't like. They you can tell him "if I don't say "red", it means I'm enjoying it, no matter how much I'm struggling". That way he knows its OK and doesn't need to ask. 

For things like facials, you just need to tell him that you are fine with them. 


One key though - you have to be HONEST. If he ever finds out that you have been doing something for him that you hate, he won't be able to trust that you are enjoying other things. Its OK to say that there is something you don't enjoy much but are willing to do for him, but don't pretend to like things that you don't. 




genabee said:


> My husband is the NICEST, most caring guy in the world and we have had some problems when I initially wanted some domination.
> 
> I occasionally like to be tied down or have my arms held down and "taken" forcefully. When we first started playing he kept stopping and saying "is this too much?", "am I hurting you?", "am I being too crude?", etc. and it totally ruined the mood. He wanted to give up and said that he just couldn't be sexually aroused with this type of play, even though I wanted it. We just slowly started playing around more and more until it got to the point where now he knows that I like it and trusts me enough to know that I will tell him if he's hurting me or upsetting me. It probably took 6 months or more of occasionally playing around with domination until he got comfortable enough.
> 
> ...


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## introvert (May 30, 2016)

I know that online purchasing is popular, but sometimes you need to actually touch/handle/feel floggers and what-not to determine the quality, how the handle is weighted, etc. Do you have any biker/leather shops in your area?


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

@OldManMage

After reading your latest reply I had two thoughts. One was that anyone would angry and hurt if their spouse led them to believe they would be home soon, expecting some wild sex and then nearly two hours later they walk in the door and act like it's no big deal. The other thought was that you shoulda told her to strip, slowly, and bend over the bed for a spanking because she was so late. Now you say she's not into spanking and that's okay but the domination of telling her to do that, putting her in place and leaving her to stew in place as you obviously stare at her....that's damn hot! You would not have to actually spank her, just grab her ass and...

And then I read Keke's post.... >






Keke24 said:


> You shouldn't have just gone on with your plan but you should've used your anger to your benefit and redirect it into more assertive energy.
> 
> Every now and then *I use situations like this to spice things up with my partner.* By now he figures it out and we laugh about it afterwards or he *makes me pay with some more extreme sexplay.* No complaints from me either way. And certainly none from him. In the beginning he would do exactly what you did, get pissed off and just sulk in bed and I'd have to initiate. LAME. I *had to tell him off one time to get him to stop wallowing and take what he want*.


Keke's post explains conflict resolution in a couple comfortable with domination games and sex play. Excellent!

But you're at a disadvantage because you're unable to preplan some of these things with your wife. And right now, your anxiety is killing your ability to accurately read her.

There used to be an online site where each person in a couple could log in, make their sexual interest choices (a check list of sexual activities you want, are curious about, maybe, or no) and then when the other partner completed the form any items in which they BOTH expressed some positive interest would be shared to both. It seemed like the least threatening way to share things you might be interested in doing but too timid to come right out and say it. Can't find it but found this instead

http://www.thatotherpaper.com/files/Yes_No_Maybe.pdf

Essentially you'd print two copies and both you and your wife would complete the checklist indicating activities as a yes, no or maybe. But you als get to express your interest level which I think is helpful because it's one thing to say I love handcuffs but I'm not too sure about being gagged so the handcuffs would get a 5 and the gag would get a 1. 

This might be helpful for you and your wife to communicate and understand each other better.

I was the driver in bringing kink into the bedroom. My husband would never have done any of this on his own unless he knew without a doubt that I wanted it. 

I think a lot of men are a bit blind sided to discover after 20 or more years together your wife has a touch of kink. I don't think what you're going through is uncommon. Before 50 Shades of Grey not one of my friends would admit to being kinky, I was the only one. After 50 Shades...several admitted it seemed sexy. And 50 Shades wasn't even that kinky! Like BDSM Light.

It's not about being a billionaire or having a closet full of floggers for most women. It's about being dominated and being dominated is about passion and after 25 years it's time to get out of the comfort zone and try all those things you never thought you would.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

Anon Pink said:


> [MENTION=293714]There used to be an online site where each person in a couple could log in, make their sexual interest choices (a check list of sexual activities you want, are curious about, maybe, or no) and then when the other partner completed the form any items in which they BOTH expressed some positive interest would be shared to both. It seemed like the least threatening way to share things you might be interested in doing but too timid to come right out and say it. Can't find it but found this instead
> 
> http://www.thatotherpaper.com/files/Yes_No_Maybe.pdf


Yes! Here it is: Interactive Sex Questionnaire for Couples | Mojo Upgrade

It's extremely helpful for the reasons AP stated above. If you like something that you find slightly embarrassing to admit, your partner won't know unless it's something they're actually interested in as well.


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

Mary is a sick little girl. She has been diagnosed as a pathological liar by two psychiatrists and a psychologist, all of whom specialized in that type of issue. So she is perhaps not a good sample, even though she is very submissive and is a masochist.

But over the years one thing has come up several times. She thinks any man who asks is weak. 

I watched once as a guy in front of her asked her if he could open a door for her, into a building we were going into. She started yelling at him, about didn't he think she could open her own damned doors, and on and on. I just hung back and watched. It was fascinating.

Some other day I mentioned that I open doors for her all the time. I mentioned I found it interesting that she got upset with that guy who offered to open the door for her. 

Mary laughed, and said I never asked her if I could. That guy asked. She said any guy who needs to ask is just a spineless nobody who should just go away.

From my reading, this is a common theme. I've been reading up on this stuff since 1979. I just wish I knew more.

Engineering makes more sense, because there's not nearly as much contradictory information.

Good luck.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

BDSM play with someone who won't communicate just doesn't work. They have to make it clear what is and isn't OK, otherwise you can end up with real rather than play abuse. 

If someone wants to be thrown on the bed and forced - that's fine as a game, but they can't just expect you to do it if it isn't negotiated first. Same for spankings etc. There is just too much risk of a misunderstanding.


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

By the way, I discovered Mary is kinky in 1979 because she was getting bored with me after we had been married for 4 years, just short of our fifth anniversary, and she screwed up. The subsequent hell lasted 18 months. I learned a lot during that time.

I suppose it didn't take long for us to get there because Mary is pretty far out there. And maybe because I am pretty Dominant by nature, although I wasn't domineering.

So Mary says asking questions any time is a downer. So that after sex discussion stuff has got to go. She says just judge by her response while you're having sex. Screw all that talk stuff. It just makes you seem weak and unable to see her gifts to you.

Mary is pretty edge. And we have a huge amount of time for me to work on judging her response. So whatever.


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## Keke24 (Sep 2, 2016)

WilliamM said:


> *So Mary says asking questions any time is a downer. So that after sex discussion stuff has got to go. She says just judge by her response while you're having sex. Screw all that talk stuff. It just makes you seem weak and unable to see her gifts to you.*
> 
> Mary is pretty edge. And we have a huge amount of time for me to work on judging her response. So whatever.


That may seem weak to Mary because she's so submissive. The OP's wife doesn't come across as being anywhere close to that level of submissiveness. If OP's wife is open to planning submissive/dominant play beforehand, it's likely she'll be open to talking about the experience after until OP can figure his way around. 

My guess is Mary would see you asking her if she wanted to get handcuffs, if she wanted to be restrained etc. as extremely weak. She'd prefer you to just do the damn thing. Thus far, OP's wife has responded positively to that communication from him. That suggests to me she'd be open to talking about what she liked etc. after the act.


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

Communication can be non verbal. Mary is a special snowflake, yes, but from my reading she's not that unusual in wanting a man to just do, and never talk.

In 38 years I've never asked her what she wants. I've never asked her permission. I've never discussed any of it with her.

The first pair of wrist cuffs I pulled out in front of her shocked her, then she put her head down, her hands out against my chest with her wrists crossed, and waited. We did not talk about it.

At some point I assigned her a safe word. I did learn she actually remembered it, about 15 years later. She pulled so hard against her custom made padded wrist cuffs she sprained her wrist. 

I have learned over the years the expectation is you need to take it as far as you can and trust your submissive to use her safe word if it's too far. 

In our case Mary's needs and what I am willing to do are very closely matched. That's because I have learned how to serve her better over the years. Her response certainly pleases me.

We've never talked about it.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

For typical sex, that works. You can judge by your partners reactions what they enjoy and don't enjoy. 

BDSM is *completely* different. There you are often pretending to do things that your partner is pretending to not want. Whether its spankings or bondage or rape play - you are forcing them in some way. Without a clear discussion, there is no way you can be *sure* when they are pretending to object and when they really object. 

Its too easy to end of forcing them into something that they *really* don't want, to unintentionally turn play into real rape. Tragic when it happens because the harm is severe and real, even though it was never intended. 


Rough play is great, but I would never engage in any sort of rough play with someone who didn't make their interests clear. 




WilliamM said:


> snip
> 
> So Mary says asking questions any time is a downer. So that after sex discussion stuff has got to go. She says just judge by her response while you're having sex. Screw all that talk stuff. It just makes you seem weak and unable to see her gifts to you.
> 
> Mary is pretty edge. And we have a huge amount of time for me to work on judging her response. So whatever.


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## OldManMage (Jun 6, 2017)

Anon Pink said:


> @OldManMageThe other thought was that you shoulda told her to strip, slowly, and bend over the bed for a spanking because she was so late.


See now you got me excited. 



Anon Pink said:


> Now you say she's not into spanking and that's okay but


Wait, now two of you got the wrong idea. She initially said she wasn't into spanking, then she got spanked (and so did I) and she liked it. She's the one who afterwards suggested buying a riding crop to kick it up a notch. So yes, I teased that new experience out of her and it seemed to be a winner.


Anon Pink said:


> But you're at a disadvantage because you're unable to preplan some of these things with your wife. And right now, your anxiety is killing your ability to accurately read her.


So true. 

We've been tossing emails back and forth about every other day. When I'm calm and collected I write something either just to arouse her, or to discuss the direction things are going or should go. Today I emailed her and specifically asked if she wants me to be more dominant and aggressive and asked what some of her fantasies were (I've asked before but she's never responded.) This time I got a bit of different reaction. First was that she would take more time with responding later but she suggested a scene of her restraining me, but then that she definitely prefers to be submissive. Her choice of words.


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

Your submissive has a safe word. As long as she does not use her safe word you know whatever you are doing is acceptable.

There is no guessing. 

If you don't understand the use of a safe word you know nothing about BDSM. 

My wife wants realism. She wants to be afraid. There were years she claimed she couldn't remember her safe word right after I reminded her, because she wanted to be totally at my mercy. But I knew she knew it.

But that little girl could take a lot more than I was willing to dish out, even when we were fighting. I suspect it often went beyond what she found pleasurable but she would never say anything in the first couple decades of our marriage. Now she will flinch. 

But she still won't use her safe word, except the time we sprained her wrist. She says it was my fault, and I just have to accept that.

The safe word. Know it. Use it. Never gag your girl. She needs to be able to get the word out between whimpering and gasping.


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## DayOne (Sep 19, 2014)

uhtred said:


> One key though - you have to be HONEST. If he ever finds out that you have been doing something for him that you hate, he won't be able to trust that you are enjoying other things. Its OK to say that there is something you don't enjoy much but are willing to do for him, but don't pretend to like things that you don't.


This. So much this.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

OP I can relate to your confusion if you want to call it that. When I was married my ex always warned me that I needed to be gentle. I was not allowed to touch her head when she was given head, she would push my hand away if I did. If I tried to spice things up even a little, something like putting her legs up on my shoulders, she would protest because she wasn't " a young girl anymore". Sex was sporadic during our marriage sometimes I went weeks without and she would get pissed that I was "keeping track". I was not really happy at all with our sex life. I felt there was a definite lack of intimacy. After 24 years we got divorced.

So I went from that, out into the world as healthy, fully functioning adult male. Along the way, every women I have met has expressed a desire for all sorts of sex. When we discuss our pasts, these women are totally shocked that any woman would act like my ex had. I take all that with a grain of salt. But I have found that these women love sex. They want oral, they give oral (both of which my ex abhorred), they want anal (something s totally off limits with my ex) they love vaginal from below, behind, on top, doggy, name it. They like changing positions (another thing my ex would complain about - I took to long?). Needless to say when I first encountered that I was totally taken off guard. It was like showing up for a rugby match ready to play ping pong. I was totally unprepared for that.

So I have just started riding that train for as long as I can. As I said the women are about being told what to do, how to do it, being "taken", manhandled, spanked, bitten, hair pulled etc. It has required me to have a complete change in how I view sex. In the past I had to concoct a fantasy in my mind while having sex with my ex. It centered around her relucatance to have sex. Now I have to push that out of my head. It has taken me a while but I am now enjoying sex very much. Enjoy it while you can, because in the end it was never enough


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## introvert (May 30, 2016)

OldManMage said:


> See now you got me excited.
> 
> 
> Wait, now two of you got the wrong idea. She initially said she wasn't into spanking, then she got spanked (and so did I) and she liked it. She's the one who afterwards suggested buying a riding crop to kick it up a notch. So yes, I teased that new experience out of her and it seemed to be a winner.


I'm glad she's into it. I love using the crop! 

Make sure you find some videos to help you understand where not to hit, if you two start exploring a bit more forcefully. Kidney area should be avoided, for example.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

OldManMage said:


> We've been tossing emails back and forth about every other day. When I'm calm and collected I write something either just to arouse her, or to discuss the direction things are going or should go. Today I emailed her and specifically asked if she wants me to be more dominant and aggressive and asked what some of her fantasies were (I've asked before but she's never responded.) This time I got a bit of different reaction. First was that she would take more time with responding later but she suggested a scene of her restraining me, but then that she definitely prefers to be submissive. Her choice of words.



This is excellent. You two are well on your way!

I would pay particular attention to how she tops you because that would probably be very close to how she wants you to top her...except for the physical man handling because that is simply not something the average woman could even attempt. 

Like William and Mary, you two must have a safe word!





WilliamM said:


> Your submissive has a safe word. As long as she does not use her safe word you know whatever you are doing is acceptable.
> 
> There is no guessing.
> 
> ...


I've told this story before about safewords... we have a vinyl lined pool that had a hole in the bottom of the 9' deep end. I had to place a patch over it and press down on the patch for 15-30 second so the adhesive would spread and stick but I couldn't press down AND keep myself from floating back to the top. I asked my husband to use the vacuum pole and press me down so I could keep pressure on the patch but he kept releasing me within a few seconds. Finally I realized his anxiety at pushing his wife underwater and holding her down would not allow him to do so no matter how much I yelled at him to keep pushing me under! So I got a floaty toy and told him to only let me go when I released the floaty toy. 

He had to trust me to release the floaty toy so that he could do something he would find abhorrent under normal circumstances.

The dominant must be able to trust that the submissive will safeword when it's needed because the dominant is being asked to do something that under normal circumstances he would find abhorrent. 





uhtred said:


> For typical sex, that works. You can judge by your partners reactions what they enjoy and don't enjoy.
> 
> BDSM is *completely* different. There you are often pretending to do things that your partner is pretending to not want. Whether its spankings or bondage or rape play - you are forcing them in some way. Without a clear discussion, there is no way you can be *sure* when they are pretending to object and when they really object.
> 
> ...


Yes and no. Finite details don't have to be discussed ahead of time. Is rough play a yes? Is forced sex a yes? Is rape play a yes? Stranger rape play? Outside the bedroom? In the car? Out of doors? These are scenarios that can be agreed upon but a fine discussion on whether he should hide in the closet and surprise her when she thinks he's still at work, or blindfold and cuff her, or take her on the kitchen floor aren't specifically necessary because if they HAVE a safeword and they trust each other to use it the rape play can work extremely well. 

Being forced is different from rape play because being forced is a scenario that starts normal, coming home from dinner, and ends by being forced across the hood of the car in the garage... 

There should be no harm if safewords are agreed upon and they trust each other to use them and respect them.

But don't engage in any of this if either of you have been drinking!!!!!!!!!


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

In general I agree, but some care is needed about "details" if the sub has some things that they find particularly disturbing that otherwise might seem part of normal rough play. 

Mostly safe words fix the great majority of problems - as long as the sub is willing to use them. I get concerned when I hear some BDSM players treat using a safe word as some sort of failure. 

Once a couple has played together a number of times, there is much less need for any specific negotiation unless something way out of the ordinary is planned. 



Anon Pink said:


> Yes and no. Finite details don't have to be discussed ahead of time. Is rough play a yes? Is forced sex a yes? Is rape play a yes? Stranger rape play? Outside the bedroom? In the car? Out of doors? These are scenarios that can be agreed upon but a fine discussion on whether he should hide in the closet and surprise her when she thinks he's still at work, or blindfold and cuff her, or take her on the kitchen floor aren't specifically necessary because if they HAVE a safeword and they trust each other to use it the rape play can work extremely well.
> 
> Being forced is different from rape play because being forced is a scenario that starts normal, coming home from dinner, and ends by being forced across the hood of the car in the garage...
> 
> ...


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

Anon Pink said:


> I've told this story before about safewords... we have a vinyl lined pool that had a hole in the bottom of the 9' deep end. I had to place a patch over it and press down on the patch for 15-30 second so the adhesive would spread and stick but I couldn't press down AND keep myself from floating back to the top. I asked my husband to use the vacuum pole and press me down so I could keep pressure on the patch but he kept releasing me within a few seconds. Finally I realized his anxiety at pushing his wife underwater and holding her down would not allow him to do so no matter how much I yelled at him to keep pushing me under! So I got a floaty toy and told him to only let me go when I released the floaty toy.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Very good thinking.

And yes, drinking and this type of play don't mix.

The rest of the post is good, too. I just quote a snip so you know what post I reference.

Have fun!

Oh, and I've said lots of times the submissive has a lot more power in the relationship than people seem to think. In reality I, the very Dominant one, my wife's Lord and Master, really am just her play thing.


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## OldManMage (Jun 6, 2017)

Anon Pink said:


> I would pay particular attention to how she tops you because that would probably be very close to how she wants you to top her...except for the physical man handling because that is simply not something the average woman could even attempt.


Well to be honest she could kick my a$$. I have no chance of forcefully pinning her down unless she decided to play along, and I don't have the upper body strength to toss her around.  


Anon Pink said:


> So I got a floaty toy and told him to only let me go when I released the floaty toy.


 We actually talked about a tennis ball today for if a gag is used. Otherwise at this point a simple "Stop, no, ouch" works for us since we aren't trying to do any roll play that would involve those words or any sort of forcing play.


Anon Pink said:


> But don't engage in any of this if either of you have been drinking!!!!!!!!!


We don't drink, so that's not a problem!

So she came up with a scene today where she dominates me - to be used in just over a week when we have more time, but I still haven't been able to get out of her what she wants if the tables are turned. She brought this up when I asked about her fantasies. Each time I ask it somehow turns to her dominating me. I don't know if this is just embarrassment, if she really wants to be the dom and hasn't fully realized it, or if she just thinks it's what I want. Doesn't matter which to me - we're having fun exploring.

When I pointed out that she said she wanted to be the more submissive in bed, but the only two fantasies she's mentioned were the opposite she kinda blushed and said "Well, you asked and that's what I've been thinking about lately." God I love this woman.

Talk about getting off topic from what I wanted this thread to originally be.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

nothing says you can't take turns being submissive if your both open to that.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Please define "rough sex" as opposed to "gentle sex!"*


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> *Please define "rough sex" as opposed to "gentle sex!"*


Rough sex: during fore play he can push her up against the wall and forcibly kiss and fondle her. He can throw her down on the bed then dive on top of her and hold her down with his weight and tell her he's going to take her NOW. During sex he can flip her over and take her from behind, he can hold her arms over her head, he can wrap her legs around him and then pick her up off the bed and then slam her back down again. He can grab all of her hair while behind and pull her head back while he tests how much of this she can take. He can shake her, grab her anywhere, maybe some slight slaps on her body or face (if consensual). He can put her on her knees and then push her head toward the bed while he pulls her hips up and then pound her.

Gentle sex: all energy during fore play and sex is smooth and loving, words are loving and intimate, the pace of sex is slow and more deliberately sensual, less raw.

Both are great with a talented lover!


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

OldManMage said:


> Yeah, we aren't talking about first time fumbling teen sex here. We're 5 kids and a hysterectomy down the road.
> 
> How the hell do I kick it up a notch with domination in the bedroom? In the past 7 weeks I've bared my soul multiple times - mostly because I felt if I didn't confide I'd jump off a bridge. Literally. Again, OT.
> She's learned all of my repressed sexual fantasies that I never would have mentioned without the imbalance in my head, and in exchange all I got from her was "I don't have any fantasies."
> ...





OldManMage said:


> So, back to the original conversation - It started partly because yes, I read several articles about it. Then I tried to give direction one night and she really seemed to respond to it. That night I also grabbed her hair and afterwards asked how she liked it and she said she did. After sex lately I've been trying to instigate a "how did it go" discussion so one of us doesn't throw in something new that the other hates.
> 
> Example: I asked her one afternoon if she were up to being tied up that night. She hesitated, started to say no and then knowing I've been out of my mind lately and not wanting to hurt my feelings she said "yes, I'll say yes." During that I said nothing, just waited for an answer. So, I made a makeshift soft restraints that really required her to just hold onto them and blindfolded her. She seemed to love it but we didn't really talk about it.
> 
> ...


My suggestion as it hasn't be explicitly stated yet is to sit her down and say that you want to do some role playing with her. Role playing allows to people to more comfortably assume roles or persona that they aren't normally comfortable with. A role playing session should be well scripted ahead of time. Yes, safe words are a great idea. However a script is an even better idea.

If you have a hard time being dominant, may I suggest a mask of some form in your role playing. Masks have huge psychological impact on people. The allow you to hide from the world and do things you normally might not be able to do. Work some kind of mask for you into your role playing. 

Now as to rough sex, make sure you know what you are doing! People can be strangled accidentally, crops and various floggers can do serious damage to joints, unprotected organs, tendons, etc. If you start with the butt and avoid the spine, tail bone, sides toward the hips, along with hamstrings, you might be OK. Then again you might loose it. A hand would be a better way to start.

A slightly different concept is extreme lust on your part as that is not rough sex, but can dominating and quite intoxicating to your wife. It can be the push her up against the wall, rip her panties off kind of sex you talked about. 

My suggestion is try role playing first with extreme lust sex and your playing a power role. Then later after you have studies and gotten your skills down, do the BDSM restraint rough sex.

Good luck. Enjoy.


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## WilliamM (Mar 14, 2017)

I definitely recommend against any kind of choking or gagging. Some people who have been doing BDSM a while claim they can do it safely, but I personally think it's never worth the risk.

Mary has gotten a lot of bruises. But she loves every one of her bruises, crazy girl. Her only real injury is her sprained wrist, which she popped again not long after the first time, so I don't rope up her restraints any more. We have broken several beds from landing on them when I toss her and land on her. I do that early on, because I want to make sure I am not hard when I do that. If I was, that could be really disastrous. 

We dented the hood of one our cars once, which I remembered when that car thing was mentioned. It wasn't in the garage though. It was a small car, and I threw myself forward when I came, and my hands made two good sized dents. Mary thought it was absolutely hilarious. She could not stop laughing.

When I spank Mary I just use my hand. I have used a crop and cat o nine tails, but I can't tell so well what I am doing, and it doesn't feel fun to me. The feel of her skin against my hand is very nice.

Whenever I growl at Mary that she needs a spanking for some nonsense she has done, she just smiles, grabs my hand, and tries to drag me to the bedroom. I tell you, it is hard to discipline her. Well, you know what I mean.


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## OldManMage (Jun 6, 2017)

Just an update. The culmination of an hour and a half last of sex last night was some pretty rough sex.

I did things I always thought were just degrading to the woman during sex. It never occurred to me in a quarter of a century of marriage that this was something she wanted.

Afterwards she commented "that was just the right amount of rough."


Moral of the story: communicate about sex with your spouse. Don't go decades because you are afraid to ask.


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## TaDor (Dec 20, 2015)

Rough sex and BDSM are not always the same thing. If someone is bound and is being tickled with a feather - is that "rough"?

It is common for someone who is in a position of power (a boss, a CEO, etc) that behind closed doors, wants to be spanked, dominated, etc. Its a RELEASE of responsibilities. To be the opposite of what you do in public.

If you like being on bottom and your wife on top, and she likes it too. Then no harm.

Check out books on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Bdsm-Basics-...s&ie=UTF8&qid=1498727601&sr=1-3&keywords=BDSM

When it comes to bondage hardware, you can get many items on Amazon. Most of it is cheap junk, will fall apart after a few uses. But for $20 - its a good for a starter to see if its something that warrents learning more about bondage.

Checkout a site called www.stockroom.com = (NSFW) / is a reputable bondage supply store... Usually mid-range~upper end stuff. Anything you can think of, they have it. Thinks you have never thought of, they have it. They have floggers in the $30~150 range. But very well made floogers will cost you about $125~400. I've broken one... 

You can also locate local BDSM support groups, which are helpful to learn about safety and ideas. People DO end up in the hospital with accidents.

Seems like you guys are finding what you like. No shame in her being the top. Also be open to switching, which is healthy - so you both know WHAT the other feels.


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

She wants Ruff sex?

See that other thread, doggy style...


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

TaDor said:


> Rough sex and BDSM are not always the same thing. If someone is bound and is being tickled with a feather - is that "rough"?
> .


Bondage is often a great way to start. It turns an ordinary sex session into a HYPER one, simply because she is bound, unable to free herself, and at your total mercy. It is a VERY powerful addition to the sex act, and many women find it causes huge orgasms. There might be some un-spoke of rape fantasy involved also.

Another thing that is fun, causing forced orgasms. If she is a one-and-done sort of woman, tie her up and have normal sex. THEN, as she expects you to release her, get her to cum again...and again....using your fingers, tongue, toys, vibrators...after five or so follow on orgasms, she might be in nirvana


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## TaDor (Dec 20, 2015)

Talker67 said:


> She wants Ruff sex?
> 
> See that other thread, doggy style...


This kind of doggy style?
https://www.amazon.com/YiFeng-Costu...qid=1498828683&sr=8-11&keywords=bdsm+dog+mask


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