# This is bad (update)



## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

Most know by now my case.

To date, here I am.

NC since beginning of month. That I have been able to verify viewing phone records. No calls, email or text.

NC letter - refused
Delete pics - refused
Delete FB email msg - refused
Stop using FB - refuse. Used once with any notification. W say, I'm sorry, it won't happen again. I say, yeah right. W says. people are asking why I'm not on it. 
1st MC - excuse, could not attend because work schedule. Rescheduled for next week. I have to see what happen. At least I went.

This means that feeling are still there for OM. 

Consult legal advise - The ball is rolling.

The only thing going for her at this moment is no contact. Tick-tock, if any contact is made without me know it. I must make the next move. Since time has gone by, I know I'm ready to make the right decision for me. I'm not waiting for the Fog to go away or Bubble to break. That could happen after I'm gone, then W can see what she has lost. 

At this time, I'm going to continue doing what I have been doing. Spending as much time with the kids as possible. Take them to the park. Doing homework. Running at least 3 miles every other day. Working out at the gym hard, until everything hurts. I go with W by the way. Trying to eat right. Since D-day, which was a month from today, I've lost 20 to 25 lbs. It was not the right way. 

About that 180, I'm too tired, seems like too much work. I'm not say it's not worth it. W will stay or go. Her choice, I'm not going to force to do anything she doesn't want to. I care about her for this is too much for me to handle. Fog or not, I'm not waiting for 6 or 12 months to get out of this funk. At this point I'm ready to leave all this behind me. I have to see some real change in the next month, that will make me change my mind. B-day and anniversary is coming up. Who know what will happen.


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## Grayson (Oct 28, 2010)

Sounds like you're keeping your head about you. Very good.

Nothing more to add from me right now but an anecdote.



> Stop using FB - refuse. Used once with any notification. W say, I'm sorry, it won't happen again. I say, yeah right. W says. people are asking why I'm not on it.


Several years ago, I was a manager at a tech support call center. We had a "business use only" Internet policy. I had a new tech in my group that I busted using a chat room while on calls. Later that night, he was in the chat room again. So, I wrote him up for it. He said, "The second time, I was just letting everyone know that I'd gotten in trouble for charting at work, and wouldn't be in there anymore."

I told him, "You can do that from home."

"But I don't have Internet at home."

"Then you just disappear and they have to live with wondering what happened to you."

Within the next two weeks, he was sitting in my boss' office with my boss, our HR manager and me as we fired him for continued violation of the Internet policy, along with a few other violations of our technology policies.

Sounds like there's the possibility of a similar outcome in your situation.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

That's basically how I put it. Once I get the, I don't care attitude, it'll really be over. Like most have said, heavy lifting has to be done from her side. I haven't seen much of that lately.


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

Things have been the same for the last 10 days. We don't talk about what happened. Things are like the way they were before. We have a MC in 2 days. First for wife, second for me. W has an appt that may conflict with out meeting. W may use it was an excuse to not make it. I'll have to wait and see. 

I still feel like [email protected] about the whole thing. Been working on the 180. No contact from me thoughout the day. I may get a call but I make it short. At home I'm on the opposite side of the house. W ask how I'm feeling multiple times per day. I just reply good, fine. If I were to express what I feel at that time, who knows what I might say. I sometimes have all much rage that I'm afraid I might loose control and say everything I have in my mind. She like to continue to have sex but I can't find it in me to say no. That is the only part off our current relationship that I like. but once its over, those bad feelings come back. She is still affectionate but feels fake. The only thing we do together is go to the gym and maybe a late night bite. I spend most of the time at home with the kids. homework, some days we go to the park. But talking and hanging out with them makes my day. Those negative thought go away during that time. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Thanks for the update. Hoping and praying for you family.


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## southern wife (Jul 22, 2011)

this is bad said:


> At home I'm on the opposite side of the house. W ask how I'm feeling multiple times per day. I just reply good, fine. If I were to express what I feel at that time, who knows what I might say. I sometimes have all much rage that I'm afraid I might loose control and say everything I have in my mind. She like to continue to have sex but I can't find it in me to say no. That is the only part off our current relationship that I like. but once its over, those bad feelings come back. She is still affectionate but feels fake. The only thing we do together is go to the gym and maybe a late night bite. I spend most of the time at home with the kids. homework, some days we go to the park. But talking and hanging out with them makes my day. Those negative thought go away during that time.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


So, you're separated but still living together? And STILL HAVING SEX? :scratchhead: That does not sound good at all. No wonder you're in such a rage.


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

We're still living together. While in the house, W doing her thing, I'm doing mine. At the end of the day, we'll go out to eat. Talk about everything except Dday. Anniversary and bday is coming up. W wants to do something, I'm not so much in the mood. I'm looking forward to MC to see what happens. I'm hopeful something positive somes out of it. W is worried about what she may have to say or talks about how embarrassing. I just tell her to not think about and wait until we are there together.


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## Lily_B (Jul 28, 2011)

How do you feel about the "not talking about it". I have a difficult time with that, he goes on as if all is going to be good again...meanwhile, I am breaking apart inside myself


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

Lily_B said:


> How do you feel about the "not talking about it". I have a difficult time with that, he goes on as if all is going to be good again...meanwhile, I am breaking apart inside myself


We are in the same boat. That's what my H always does. He talkative about it s first but only if I have questions. And after a while it tapers off and all is right with the world with him and he does not want to answer ant more and I was slowly dying. For me its a lose lose.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

Not talking about it is eating me up inside. In our relationship, I was the one talking, communicating. Making sure we were on the same page. We would not even go to sleep angry or upset until we were able to talk about whatever issue we had at the moment. Now I don't even want to talk. W is always asking to say something, talk about anything. I just tell her, I want to listen now, it's your turn to talk. In moments everything goes quite. She ha s nothing to say. The deal breaker will come today. We have MC and I will make one final request un front of MC.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 2xloser (May 8, 2011)

I can't see how not talking about it is helping at all. 
Every time I go to a MC session, I find it's over (45 min) before the real in-depth discussion has even gotten started. So my advice is to make sure you use that sessoin to its fullest; be fully prepared for what you want to hear/talk about; take control. Don't even allow the uncomfortable initial silence to get started; jump right in. Good luck to you.


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## disbelief (Oct 31, 2010)

I agree there 2x be prepared as well as use good wording of statements NLP style.
In regards to the not talking about it and being seperated in the same house I have read that the inhouse seperation has a better chance of surviving than out. If you create the emotion u want you are more likely to get the results you want. Read in another newsletter about infidelity survival that based on years of practice a councillor has determined greater succes in marriage recovery when emotions are allowed to heal and then the A and marriage issues are discussed.

I am sure there are opposite opinions but there's my .02
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

You are at complete loose ends---You can't profess you are about to end this mge., or seperate, or do a 180, or whatever it is you wanna do---and still have sex

Its either all or nothing---either let her know by boundaries, and consequences, that she has messed up, and needs to do everything to get back into the family, or just sweep it under the rug, continue to have sex, and say--its all fine---I don't mind going, where the other man has been


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

30 days more or less have passed. No change on W part. I've had 3 IC. 2 were ones she missed one was with a one on one MCoach, than she went to. W didn't like what she was told. Wants to try MC which was missed. At this point she is heavy in the fog. I will not wait for months for her to get out. I will move on for my happiness. Even with all the work that it will take for her to get out. Chances are high that it will happen again. If this OM doesn't work out she might look for someone else to scratch the itch. I deserve someone better. 18 years and this happens. Bday and anny are on the same day,coming up soon. I'm out after that. This will be the last get together with the kids. She can get mad or upset and beg and pled all she wants. I'm out. She can realize the damaged made when she gets out of the fog. Like the MC said to W, you better work on getting your head straigh, he's not just going to wait for you to figure this out. That feeling of loosing her that I had in the pit of my stomach and chest is gone. I don't even want to be here any more. It might be sick but I might as well enjoy the sex while I can. 

I'll provide another update in about one week.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

Take care of yourself. Your kids and your sanity require it.


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

Been to 2 MC sessions. W was told to be transparent. W indicates to MC she told me everything. She's not hiding anything. All was out in the open. I asked how this happened, answer, it's like when a man wants to get a womans attention. She didn't realize it until it was too late. 

We spoke for hours, covered everything and W indicated what do you want. I said clearly without hesitation. D... it got quite. Started to cry, I'm very sorry for the pain I have caused. I'm willing to continue MC. Give me a chance to prove to you that your the only one. What I did was a very big mistake. If you want to D, just give me a chance and if your still not convince that I truly love you then go ahead and D. It was the first time that she spoke to me that way. I'm not sure how to take it. Is she just acting or really means it. She said, we'll talk some more today. But never the less, I'm ready for D. All I have to day is go... I only pause at this moment because this is a side that has not been shown before. Perhaps W is getting out of the fog... Time will tell.


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

> NC letter - refused
> Delete pics - refused
> Delete FB email msg - refused
> Stop using FB - refuse. Used once with any notification. W say, I'm sorry, it won't happen again. I say, yeah right. W says. people are asking why I'm not on it.


Is she still refusing the above?

If she is sincere then she does all the above and a letter acknowledging her affair including an apology to her parents and yours is a good start to evidence she is committed to fight for your marriage.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

Words and tears are worthless.
Has she fixed any of this?



this is bad said:


> NC since beginning of month. That I have been able to verify viewing phone records. No calls, email or text.
> 
> NC letter - refused
> Delete pics - refused
> ...


What "actions" has she taken to fix this ****?


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

lol at Eli-Zor... great minds.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

File your D., and see how really serious she is----you can always stay the proceedings if she really, seriously, shows true remorse, contriteness, and does all the heavy lifting to get back into the mge.

As is your want, she MUST show she is serious by NC, and coming off ALL SOCIAL WEBSITES---it doesn't matter what others think, others do not provide for her, and are not married to her, and do not have to stand for her BS

If what she has done to you, and it most definitely was not a mistake, it was planned, with deceit, cunning, and lies, but if you can't stand her anymore, then do go thru with the D., and start a new life, where you will not be miserable, and the woman you once thought was your sun, moon, and stars, now does nothing but trigger visions of horror, walk away from that, if you need to.

Do what is best for you---her now all of a sudden, I love You---where was that as she gave herself to her lover


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

Go ahead with the D. You can always R until the finalization papers are signed.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

I would give her the chance. I think this is the first time that you have shown her that you're serious. Saying, "I want you to stop using Facebook, or I'll be upset" isn't much of a threat. Using the D word is a threat. You got her attention.

Let's see if she carries through.


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## useable (Aug 31, 2011)

jnj express said:


> File your D., and see how really serious she is----you can always stay the proceedings if she really, seriously, shows true remorse, contriteness, and does all the heavy lifting to get back into the mge.
> 
> As is your want, she MUST show she is serious by NC, and coming off ALL SOCIAL WEBSITES---it doesn't matter what others think, others do not provide for her, and are not married to her, and do not have to stand for her BS
> 
> ...


agree:smthumbup:


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## ArmyofJuan (Dec 29, 2010)

F-102 said:


> Go ahead with the D. You can always R until the finalization papers are signed.


I concur, she may have had a knee-jerk reaction to you saying you wanted the D but may go back to her old behavior if you waffle on it. You have time to see if she starts acting like she is serious and not just telling you what she thinks you want to hear.


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

Status report..

Love you guys on this forum. Been great help.

I have been ready to move on for about 2 weeks or so. Had a lawyer to start the paper work. I explained that in order for me to begin Trust all over again she would need to sign an agreement. I had one with some assistance from L. It indicated child support, shared custody and so on. On Monday when I presented these paper, W read it and said she would not signed because they were number I came up with. She would sign if they were number from the court.

I said fine, you want that. I'm going to see a lawyer and get you an official document. I would get all the offical numbers and fine detail. Then W could get her own laywer and have them review it. Our agreement is 50/50 with the kids. Fair, down the middle. No one trying to take advantage over the other. She agreed. I explained it would take more than this document for me to stay. She would have to do all the work. 

I indicated if you don't want to follow thru with this and the boundries I first layed out. I thank you for the wonderful 18 years we had together. They were great. It's time for me to move on.

Next day, she was still making remarks. That amount on you present agreement won't help me make rent in an apartment and pay the rest of the utilities. I said, who is the one that has put me in this situation. Reality struck again.

Now W agreed to the letter of NC, stop FB all together, delete pics(that was done 2 weeks ago, delete past email notification, continue MC and even IC if needed, give up all credit cards, continue transparency, and if OM contacts you, I better know about it asap. If I find out 10 min, 2 hrs later, one week later, whatever, I've out.

Now it's wait and see how things go. W could be saying what needs to be said. May want to get in contact in the future.

Time will tell.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

and to be perfectly honest, time will also tell on your end as well

bear in mind you may discover you may not want her back


I hope she does follow through and has the self-discovery of what she did was so very wrong and will comply not just because she afraid of D but she wants to help you heal and repair the marriage


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## Why Not Be Happy? (Apr 16, 2010)

hope it works for you!


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

If she is sincere then the next step is to change the marriage, there has to be a reason for her to wander even if it is a slight reason. Go to the marriagebuilders site and download the emotional needs questionair , both of you fill them out and identify the missings in your marriage.

The NC letter should be handwritten.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

Sounds like a good battle plan-but, as you said, only time will tell. She may be truly remorseful and really want to work on the M...

...or, she is just saying what you want to hear to stall you until she thinks of something.


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## max1234 (Sep 14, 2011)

this is bad said:


> We're still living together. While in the house, W doing her thing, I'm doing mine. At the end of the day, we'll go out to eat. Talk about everything except Dday. Anniversary and bday is coming up. W wants to do something, I'm not so much in the mood. I'm looking forward to MC to see what happens. I'm hopeful something positive somes out of it. W is worried about what she may have to say or talks about how embarrassing. I just tell her to not think about and wait until we are there together.


your story reflects mine - except that i am still at the stage where i just drop everything to do something she needs.... may be the optimist in me does believe that love will come back...i pay her college fees, her shopping bills, let her go out with her girlfriends... once in a fit of anger she told me that she wants to be a lesbian....


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

max1234 said:


> your story reflects mine - except that i am still at the stage where i just drop everything to do something she needs.... may be the optimist in me does believe that love will come back...i pay her college fees, her shopping bills, let her go out with her girlfriends... once in a fit of anger she told me that she wants to be a lesbian....


It's unclear whether you cheated, or she did. If you cheated, then yeah, you've got to lick her boots for a while. If she did, you're going about things all wrong.


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

I've made it very clear. NO-to any one of my request. It's over. If she gets the feeling that I'm controlling. Feels like it like a jail. Too bad. She has has to do the heavy lifting and if this is too much to handle. Why try and work it out. I've explained again today. The written agreement between us is for me not to go through this nightmare again. I will no stand for this a second time. And as Almost indicated, I may be the on that might not want to stay. 

By the way, that letter will be hand written. Any resistance to writting-its over. She gets the message. An it will not be a good bye letter either. 

Once again, time will tell. 


Max - I use to be that way also but it took a lot of time for me to snap out of it. This forum and others I've spoken to have helped me a lot. If it wasn't for that, I would have just gone on like nothing ever happened. A wimp, a doormat. No more my friend.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

Booya baby!!


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

I just get excited when people stand up for themselves


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## CH (May 18, 2010)

Almostrecovered said:


> I just get excited when people stand up for themselves


Kind of like Stu at the end of Hangover when he finally stands up to his GF.


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

Thanks. 
It took long enough for me. First panic. Then pain, confusion, why me, how come. Perfect marriage till now. How can this be. Anger, crying through out. Why again. Handled it all wrong in the beginning. Lots of sleepless nights. 

Once the all that went away. And that weird feeling in my chest went away. I felt better. I had finally accepted that I was ready to move on. Like I read somewhere, don't remember. I WILL MAKE IT!!!!

Worked out like crazy at the gym and started to get bigger. She noticed this and it was complements all the time. She noticed I was doing it for me, not her. My attittude started to change. That's why if I stay its because I want to give it a chance, not because I'm a door mat. And if we D, I'm looking forward to a great future and I know on day I'll me someone who will appreciate me. 

I loved it when she was in that thick FOG and someone told her. By the time you realize that damage you cause, he will be gone. That is went you will know that you lost a great person.

Is she still in the fog, maybe. Is she getting out of it, maybe. Do I know what she is thinking, no. What she is feeling no. 

That doesn't matter. I know what I'm feeling and thinking. And any decision I make is for me. Because it feels good. 

Time will tell.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

Right, TIB-you can't tell her what to do, but you can definitely tell YOU what to do, and you're doing it!

Good job!


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

Can you believe, that even after telling the W if I don't get the letter of NC, I'm go to file. W says I'll get if on Wed. I tell her, then it'll be Wed of next week, next month. Who nows when. She said its hard to write it. She still has some feeling for the OM. Not feeling of being with them but feelings. Yeah right. 

She said it wouldn't work out anyways. OM doesn't make much money. WW is not willing to move in with OM, who lives 3hrs away. Leave her job to be with the OM. W says I don't want to be with that person. I want to be with you. I love you, I've made a grave mistake. It was wrong of me for putting you through all of this. I want to R with you. 

I said, if I don't get the letter. Don't bother. I'm going to file. 

How can someone here that and still not write the letter? She must think I won't go through with it. Maybe I'm bluffing.

We talked last night for a while. WW didn't want to talk but I said I do. I cannot go on living like nothing happen. WW says that I'm torturing her. Bring up the past to cause her pain. What. Are you kidding me. Then she acts upset and mad. Trying to flip the script. I explained, that's not going to work on me. You screwed up and if you can't take it, too bad. You were able to cheat, you had no problem with that. 

WW said, do you think he's the only on I can get. There is an lot of other people out there. I'm sure I can get whoever I want, if I wanted to. I don't need to chase anyone. They would have to chase me. 

I explained the same in reverse honey. But I had to stop her. Why would she say things like this if she really want to R? 

She continues to ask why is it so important. What's the big deal. Why can I can't take her word that she will not make contact ever. The OM may not take it serious. If the OM trys to make contact, I will ingnore it and tell you right away. 

I make it a big deal because it displays her commitment to me and our marriage. The letter is not for her or for the OM. It's for me. So I can see that she's wants and is willing to work on this marriage.

Please let me know if I got this right.

Here's my analogy. 
(I had to use examples of different kinds of work I've done around the house to make it clear. So she can understand better.)

Without the letter of NC, the OM doesn't know your intensions. He thinks that perhaps after a few month or maybe a year, he or you can continue communications. She'll start to miss him and might make contact to see how he's doing. The same in return. The Door is still open to future communication, no matter how small.

I explained to my WW what the NC letter means to me. The Door is closed forever. First sheetrock, then concrete block than a thick piece of steel welded. The Door could never be opened again. That is what the NC letter means to me.


I though the last week was going in the right direction and in a heart beat, we are back to the beginning. 

This weekend we spent working around the house. All weekend long. Had family over. Went out to dinner. It felt like we were bonding again. Maybe I'm going about it the wrong way. Over analyzing everything. I see the remorse but I'm stuck big time on that letter. That is make of break for me. If she can show me that she's willing to write the letter and sent it. Then I know she's willing to R this marriage. 

I hope I got this right. Do you guys think I'm going about this the wrong way?



How can she think that she'll be able to fix this on her own. Doesn't really want to do MC. She ashamed to take about this to strangers. I explained this is part of doing whatever it takes.


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

Your negotiating with a wayward , so how long are you prepared to wait for a hand written nc letter? As far as i know this is not on her time yet you are taling about days to come maybe weeks because she has feelings for a preditor on you marraige, what happened to feelings for you, they must be on hold while she considers her options. At this stage her option is drag tbis out while she and he make plans.

Go in today and file, you never negotiate with a wayward , she will never keep to the boudaries because she knows you dilute them .
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

That's what I'm doing today. It's like she still doesn't get it. She will now... I'm not waiting for her to change her love from him to me. Times up, I don't feel like waiting.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

this is bad said:


> That's what I'm doing today. It's like she still doesn't get it. She will now... I'm not waiting for her to change her love from him to me. Times up, I don't feel like waiting.


Hopefully, this will be the straw that brings your wife back to her senses and you all can move into a genuine reconciliation. Be calm,cool and collected. She has to respect you above all. Tell her your sorry but you have to do what is best.

Let her know that you just don't believe she cares enough about her family's future together. 

Will be praying for your family. Good luck.

Chap


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

Added somemore details to my previous post.

I had to remind her. I cannot control you and what you want to do. But I can control me and what I want to do. She just stared. 

She continues with, I will not make any contact. It has been 1.5mths. I has to explain, I still need that letter.

Even with or without the letter. I have a hard time knowing if she's with me because she's comfortable. Or because she really loves me. That's also tough. I can only go by her actions. 

For those that have R, was the letter the most important part to reconcile?


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

It seems clear you're not going to get the NC letter from her until she sees some real consequences like initiating the D and realizes what she has to lose. She's definitely still in the fog and OM is in her head/heart. You see this all the time in this forum.


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

She must be. She tears up when I say things about him. How is it that 1.5mths those feeling can still be there? I wonder how long before they go away? Or does it ever? I guess she will have to be the one to make them go away forever.

Her assurance that he will never make contact is because the OM doesn't want to be the one who caused the D. OM would prefer if she divorce me for him. That is something she will not do.

She thinks that I want to D to get back at her for the pain she has caused. Like revenge.

Just being with someone who gave there heart to someone else, stings. I'm continue to ask my self, What the Hell?

Call has been made.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

You are correct that the NC letter is for you. The fact is, if she were truly remorseful, she would be willing to hop on one foot and sing, "I'm a Little Teapot" if that would make you more comfortable about R.

The fact that she won't write the letter means she's not 100% committed to you over the OM. Maybe she's 90% committed to you, or maybe only 51%. Even if she writes the letter, it could be a smoke screen. But the fact is, if she were at 100%, she would write the letter with no hesitation.


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

When you file don't rush to the end date, drag it out giving her enough time to clear the fog . Continue to state you love her but will not be a backup plan , tell her the nc letter is for both of you and is an important step in recovering the trust and marriage . Be consistant with your messages and assurance of her love. What she should see is a man who loves her but is not prepared to share her .
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SoHO (Sep 19, 2011)

Eli-Zor said:


> When you file don't rush to the end date, drag it out giving her enough time to clear the fog . Continue to state you love her but will not be a backup plan , tell her the nc letter is for both of you and is an important step in recovering the trust and marriage . Be consistant with your messages and assurance of her love. What she should see is a man who loves her but is not prepared to share her .
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



I agree with you.:smthumbup:
I wonder if you went through all of this to get her back why don't you want to wait for her to get out of the Fog. It will woth it. Please don't give up on her and your 18 y of MG.


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

I'm going to figure out that part. How long can or does the process take. She'll have a chance but it's all her at that point. Like she was told at the last MC session, if you want to R, there will be hell to pay. It's up to you. 

For some reason she didn't hear that part.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

She wants you to forgive her and take her back-but on HER terms. And-she still wants to keep things smooth with the OM.

Of course, she may still be dragging her feet about the NC so that she can warn the OM about the letter that you are forcing her to write, in other words: "you'll be getting a letter, but don't take it seriously-I'll think of something and we can stay in touch."


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

Like you said F-102, seems to be on her terms. 

Sorry for blabbering on so much. This is the only place I can vent.

This entire situration is still tough for me. Guess I'm still in denial.

Behavior towards me during the EA never changed. Didn't act different or strange. Didn't seem sad or unhappy. Was loving the whole time. We played often, that never changed. I say no changes in her.

How did I find out? I asked, what's up with OM, why you guys send messages on FB(I saw them and they didn't seem inappropriate) and text so much (those were being deleted, red flag. Stupid me, I had total trust at that moment) she told me. No trickle truth, it was detailed step by step. She's never lied to me before. And didn't lie about her EA. It was very hard for her to tell me. I could see it in her face.

That's when I thought the world was going to end. I thought, how could this be.

Before all this crazyness. She's always been were she says. Never-ever went out with co-workers, they are her only friends. More like acquaintances. She doesn't talk to them after work. Never gets phone call from them. Doesn't talk to anyone on the cell after hours, only family. Any parties she was invited to, I went. When she goes out to the store, mall, shopping it was always with her mom or kids or me. 


She's done all I've requested (with resistance at the beginning) except for the NC letter. 

I sometimes bring up the EA but nothing else needs to be covered. It was explained the week of d-day. Every piece of detail. The week after, things got crazy. I spoke to OM, since then he's been MIA. That was 1.5mths ago. I believe that if he would not have started NC, she might still be in contact with him. That's why I get the feeling of being the backup. If she would have been the one to initiate NC, it would for some reason feel better. 

That's when I was in shock and followed the script to the letter just about. Did 180, exposed it to both parents and told her I'm ready for D at 2 wks after d-day.

To this day, there has been NC via text, email, phone, FB. She has be transparent. Access to cell phone, FB, email, cell account, all user names and passwords. I still have key logging and text logging running. She's doing some heavy lifting. Letting me know were she's at---always. Telling me how sorry she feels for giving her heart to another man. How wrong it was. Being affectionate. It is fake? Maybe. 


We've been spending more time together. We watch TV together, hang out, go to the gym. This week she got ball game box tickets for us and my son. All of us enjoyed the game. 

Perhaps I want instant results. I'm not giving myself time to think things through. Like I read on a post here some time ago. 

She is a person of words, I am a person of action.


But what I want most and have made it clear is that letter of NC. Becasue of her resistance to it, I want it done even more. 

I explained, although I do not have OM address. If she would have been willing to write it immediately. That would have shown her commitment to me and the marriage. But this resistance only displays that she still has emotions for the OM and does not want to hurt his feeling or leave the door open for future contact. 

It will be too bad and sad if after getting paperwork of D. She still refused to write the letter. I will display that she still want to be with OM in the future. And if not him, someone else. 

If it's true that her intentions are to R, it would be sad to see if she is willing to D than to sent the letter. I will know at that very moment it's time to move on.

If it's sent, then we might have something to work on. Who knows with time, I may not want to be with her anyways. It's hard to be with WW knowing there heart and love is with someone else. Even though some time has passed. 

She saids that her emotions cannot be turned off like a like switch but she's doing what she can to get over it and move on with her like with me and the family. I just reply, actions not words will convince me.






Let me know if this is normal.

Questions I ask myself. 1.5mths later.
Do I hate her? No. 
Do I love her? Yes. Just not the same.
Am I hurt for what she has done? Very much so. 
Do I trust her? No. At least not at this moment.
What will it take for me to move forward with her? Her commitment to this marriage. 
If I don't see or feel that, why continue. We'll be like roommates, friends with benefits. I could do that with anyone.
I ask myself, why would I want to be with a person that has the ability to do this to me? I just think about the person she use to be. The person she was before all of this.
Can she go back to that person? I'm not sure.
Is there still contact and I don't know about? Maybe. It would have to be underground and hidden very well.
Am I ready to move on? Yes


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

Tomorrow is Wednesday , call her out place the nc template , pen and paper and politely request she hand writes the letter there and then . Do not tell her you don't have his address , be confident , lay the items out and go off the make coffee . The message from you to her then is very clear , if she does write she must not dilute the words. You can then scan in the letter and email it to him with a warning that if he contacts ber in any way she will be charging him with harassment.

If she declines or asks for delay you have your answer , say nothing but continue with your plan .
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

It feels like I have to force her to write it...

But she is very clear where I stand...


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## FirstYearDown (Sep 15, 2011)

this is bad said:


> Can you believe, that even after telling the W if I don't get the letter of NC, I'm go to file. W says I'll get if on Wed. I tell her, then it'll be Wed of next week, next month. Who nows when. She said its hard to write it. She still has some feeling for the OM. Not feeling of being with them but feelings. Yeah right.
> 
> *She said it wouldn't work out anyways. OM doesn't make much money. WW is not willing to move in with OM, who lives 3hrs away. Leave her job to be with the OM. W says I don't want to be with that person. I want to be with you. I love you, I've made a grave mistake. It was wrong of me for putting you through all of this. I want to R with you. *
> 
> ...


She wants to reconcile and have her man on the side too. *That *is how she can say such things.

If she wanted the marriage to work, she would be willing to write that letter and go to therapy.


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

File the D papers and show her the copies-show her you mean business. Then see if she'll get off her a** and write the NC letter.


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## Wanabeelee (Sep 6, 2011)

this is bad said:


> She saids that her emotions cannot be turned off like a like switch but she's doing what she can to get over it and move on with her like with me and the family. I just reply, actions not words will convince me.


I could not stay away, and just had to reply to this one. The funny thing is that is exactly what my wife did. She turned off her love for me like a switch. Day before D-day she sent me a msg saying how much she wanted me and could not wait for me to get home. Day before that she sent a pic of her and my daughter smiling saying how much my girls loved me. But on D-Day she was done, and had been done for some time. After D-day she was back in love with me. She was able to turn it off just like a switch when a hotter, younger, built man showed interest in her. She says he made her feel good about herself... That someone like him would want someone like her. The switch was off and she didn't even see that someone like me has wanted her for the last 19 years. After she found out what sex was like with another man and what she lost her switch went right back on for me and the kids.

If your wife cant see that as well then sounds like she has a switch off its just not his switch. Who knows, she may have a dimmer instead.

Let her know that if you are what she really wants then it needs to be just like a switch. It seems it can be done.

Best of luck to you. I will remember you in my prayers.


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

Like it was suggested. I will give her a paper and pen, then leave. When I return, I hope it is written. 

Good point on what she really wants. I never asked that question. I was filling in the blanks.

It was alway, "Do you want to continue the marriage?" "Are you willing to do whatever it takes?" 

But that letter boy, I tell you. I've never seen how so simple as a letter mean so much.

After seeing the L, and getting the process started. L is waiting for me to provide information. All kinds of stuff, it feels like I'm trying to get a home loan.

If she refuses, I will present to forms to her to assist in filling them out. 

That will surely get her attention. And if not, she will be served.

Thanks again for all the advise here. I sometime feel I get better results than counseling.

Keep me and the family in your prayers.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I agrree, counseling, it seems just doesn't have the prespectives and the large amount of experience from so many people at one place like TAM has.


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## ThirdTimeACharm (Sep 1, 2011)

the guy said:


> I agrree, counseling, it seems just doesn't have the prespectives and the large amount of experience from so many people at one place like TAM has.


Guy, what are you doing still dealing with this cheating woman? She's got you on HER timetable. Once a cheater ALWAYS a cheater. Get out, get out, get out because you can NEVER trust her again and do you really want to live in a relationship which is damaged FOREVER? That is no way to live.

Flush the toilet and get rid of that floaty....man up and keep your self worth. There is life AFTER divorce.... You deserve to be with a younger honey that will sex you up, be loyal, and has earned your complete trust. To stay with your floaty is to show you have no balls. You have options....embrace them... Let the OM have your throwaway!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Older honeys can sex you up too  Just sayin'.


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## ThirdTimeACharm (Sep 1, 2011)

that_girl said:


> Older honeys can sex you up too  Just sayin'.


Very true thatgirl....and I would NEVER trade my 45 year old honey for ANY 20 or 30 something chick...i wrote that because id hope guy would someday show his floaty this thread...lol...I'm 51 and my girl keeps me feeling 17...lol but more importantly we trust each other 110%, and trust is the best spark, best afrodesiac one could ever have....you listening Guy?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ThirdTimeACharm (Sep 1, 2011)

ThirdTimeACharm said:


> Very true thatgirl....and I would NEVER trade my 45 year old honey for ANY 20 or 30 something chick...i wrote that because id hope guy would someday show his floaty this thread...lol...I'm 51 and my girl keeps me feeling 17...lol but more importantly we trust each other 110%, and trust is the best spark, best afrodesiac one could ever have....you listening Guy?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Oh one more thing! Guy, stop sleeping with the floaty....it dilutes your message and reinforces her belief that she still knows how to keep you in the game....use your hand and do it in front of her to show her that she has NO POWER over you any longer. Stop laying with a pig!!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I hope my messages aren't being duluted in the simply fact there is aways a way a marriage can be renewed, but it takes both spouses.

Keep in mind it takes both spouse to change and with that said I would leave in a heart beat if it was only me working on the marrage.

Just like I did 13 years ago it was so easy to walk away I actually enjoyed it, it was easier then being married. But the point is when you both walk away then both you can join back up, if *both* of you want it. that is the key...a very big key.

The important thing is its a joint effort, with out this joint effort you just have to let them go.

One more thing I never trusted anyone before I was married and I never trusted my wife while being married. So for me its easy not to have trust, trust is over rated......faith on the other hand is more my speed I guess...that and a pinch of hope.
The only trust I do have is in my self and the ablity to succeed with or with out a "floater".


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

Third- if that's for me. I hear you loud and clear.


Need some advise. 

As for the letter, for those who's WS wrote a letter. 

Did you make them write it on there own? Or did you provide a sample letter? 

I ask because my WW is not exactly sure what to write. I told her what is should say but she's forgotten by now. 

I prefer to see what she writes first, then provide the same if needed. 

Dump question. 

Does it matter either way?

Thanks.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

Provide the template 

No Contact Letter

Your wife will battle with the words in her partial foggy state, the above link provides robust wording. Print the whole page out , let her know this is required for you , her , the OM and the protection of the marriage . Should she write it , she must sign it as well. Do not reveal you don't have his address , scan and email it to him however you must track his address down in your own time and send a copy to him.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Here's a sample NC letter from Marriage Builders:



> Dear [put name here],
> 
> The relationship I had with you was thoughtless and cruel. It hurt many people, particularly my spouse, who did not deserve to be treated that way. I am committed to my marriage and determined to make up for all the hurt I've caused my family. I am going to work hard to be the best husband/wife that he/she deserves.
> 
> ...


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

I did copy and paste parts of different letters from that site.

But it's too many parts one sheet. I'll use the one you provided and add to it. I want to add stronger words...



I'll give this to her so there is no excuses...


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## ThirdTimeACharm (Sep 1, 2011)

this is bad said:


> Third- if that's for me. I hear you loud and clear.
> 
> 
> Need some advise.
> ...


TIB, if she does not know what to write then her heart is not into it. If you provide the words then it is your words and not hers. It gives her an out "hey it was his words, not mine, and he forced me to write it"...the fact that she does not know what to write is telling and speaks volumes. If she really wanted the marriage two things would've happened. First, the letter would e been written by now, and second, she would know exactly what to write, and third, she would give you a copy. It seems she wants you to do all the work. She is a loser and to stay with her is to be castrated.

She is buying time....she is in control and she has you by playing the sex card.

Both of you wanting it to work is the wrong metric. A better metric is:why would you want to work it out with a person of the lowest character? So you see, it's irrelevant how much she is willing to work with you. There are too many honeys with good character to have to put up with the drages, the tainted damaged goods.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

10-4 on that.

I will only provide the letter after she has put some thought into from herself. As for the sex, even though I'm in this situation, I'm a stupid sucker. Even after going through all of this, I have a hard time saying, No. No sex this week, its that time..


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## ThirdTimeACharm (Sep 1, 2011)

this is bad said:


> 10-4 on that.
> 
> I will only provide the letter after she has put some thought into from herself. As for the sex, even though I'm in this situation, I'm a stupid sucker. Even after going through all of this, I have a hard time saying, No. No sex this week, its that time..


Lol well I certainly understand the pull of sex. Still, I'd suggest you refrain...look at it this way....her dirty deeds have opened a door for you, a chance to find an awesome woman of high caliber...W's loss, your gain. At best I suppose you could reinvigorate your marriage but don't kid yourself....much of it will be dead for life....and your future plagued with distrust. Your call...we all hope you find a way to be happy...sustainably!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

this is bad said:


> 10-4 on that.
> 
> I will only provide the letter after she has put some thought into from herself. As for the sex, even though I'm in this situation, I'm a stupid sucker. Even after going through all of this, I have a hard time saying, No. No sex this week, its that time..


This is bad- give her the template , waiting for her to make up words is you playing games , if she has a template there is no misunderstanding . The words have been created by a professional in this field not by an anonymous poster . Don't try harden the words , as long as they are used and they are not diluted or modified to downgrade the message then you will be in a good place. It would a missed opportunity if she does not write the letter or if she cannot write a letter in a form of words that you currently desire, the template removes both those reasons and placed the burden of action on her . Her copying the letter alone is a huge step for you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_[/siz


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

The letter was written, with no resistance. She's the one that said, today is the day.

It was written in her own words. Close to the template but she has a hard time finding the right ones. I told her I will help provide her with words to assist completing it. It took her some time to write it. 

But it's done. 

Now I have to find the address and get that thing mailed. We have MC coming up next month. Hope she doesn't back out. 

Now wait and see how things go.


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

Holding my breath, TIB.


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

F-102, only time will tell if she's for real or not. Or if I even want to be with her any more.

For me, sadder that what was done to me is that we adopted a little boy with special needs from asia 3 yrs ago. You would think her priorites would be in the correct order. Now she's noticing how bad she screwed up. 

When I got all the bad news on d-day, for some reason our little boy came to my mind. Not just the fact that I was hurt, betrayed and so on. But our son would perhaps experience a divorce. Our 13yr boy, he would be able to cope better, I guess. The little one has surguries coming up in the future. Basically, several until he's 17ish or so.

At work I'm sometimes useless. Thinking about this entire madness all day. I'm like a probation officer, CSI detective. Checking if any contact has been made. I'm also on this forum a lot, checking for replies and reading other posts.

We text but only when it's about the house, kids or family. At times I'll start some small talk but hardly ever. When we are together, I'm not nasty or treat her like a jerk. But I'm don't act like everything has been forgotten either.



Part one: Writing the letter. (needs to be cleaned up but it's complete)

Part two: Sending it. Now that's going to be interesting.

She's why it should be sent. I've explained. She might have written it because I don't have the address yet. OM move to that area in March, not sure if it could be found yet. 

Anyone know of good sources to locate a person? I've tried a couple of sites free site but no luck. They only provide previous locations.

That's my next hurdle.


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## Dadof3 (Mar 14, 2011)

this is bad said:


> F-102, only time will tell if she's for real or not. Or if I even want to be with her any more.
> 
> For me, sadder that what was done to me is that we adopted a little boy with special needs from asia 3 yrs ago. You would think her priorites would be in the correct order. Now she's noticing how bad she screwed up.
> 
> ...


TIB: If I remember correctly, if you have a previous address (or even better the last previous address), I think there is an option at the post office that you can (for an extra fee?) not only have the mail forwarded to the NEW mail address, but they can send you a note with what the new mailing address is (I think its mail forwarding / correction).


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Looks like you have been given the second chance many on this site do not get. Hoping and praying that you have the strength, patience and love to bring your family back together again.

There are way too many bad endings on this website please make this a good one.

Good luck
Chap


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

I explained that although the letter is pretty good, it could be better. W used a translator tool and some of the word are not correct.

I said we'll change some and I'll give her some ideas on what should be written. W seems ok with the idea, at this time.

The challenge, will it be sent. 

(Currently looking for the address. Hope to locate it soon. If I'm not able to, then I'll have to ask his family)

That will be the real test.


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## this is bad (Aug 13, 2011)

At the present time. Things are going well. The revised letter was completed as promised. It is very clear as to what NC means. WW understands how important it is to send. 

question for everyone...

do you think I should go as far as having the marriage settlement agreement completed? It would need to signed by the both of us. WW would need to get a L to review it and make sure it fair for the both of us. something WW and I could agree on. 

at this time, she has done all i've asked for. Most of all NC. Seems remorseful. We spend lots of time together. At this point things look good. We feel the we can R. We both want to. 

I will continue to be extremely vigilant. Unless it goes deep underground, I should be able to spot any contact. I've also made it clear if contact is made I have to know right away. 


I think it maybe too much and not needed at this point. The agreement can always be submitted later. I don't want to make it seem that she has to be scared.. I want us to be together because we want and desire to be with each other. Not because she's afraid of the consequences. 


your thoughts on my current thinking?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

The marriage settlement is to protect you it is also a clear message of consequences if she should stray. If you told her this was one of your requirements then do it , don't waver , your indecisiveness will be seen as a weakness to be exploited later.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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