# USA - child marriages



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

This is weird. But it's in the NYT so I think it's real. WTH?

*11 Years Old, a Mom, and Pushed to Marry Her Rapist in Florida*

When she was a scrawny 11-year-old, Sherry Johnson found out one day that she was about to be married to a 20-year-old member of her church who had raped her.

“It was forced on me,” she recalls. She had become pregnant, she says, and child welfare authorities were investigating — so her family and church officials decided the simplest way to avoid a messy criminal case was to organize a wedding.

“My mom asked me if I wanted to get married, and I said, ‘I don’t know, what is marriage, how do I act like a wife?’” Johnson remembers today, many years later. “She said, ‘Well, I guess you’re just going to get married.’”

So she was. A government clerk in Tampa, Fla., refused to marry an 11-year-old, even though this was legal in the state, so the wedding party went to nearby Pinellas County, where the clerk issued a marriage license. The license (which I’ve examined) lists her birth date, so officials were aware of her age.

Not surprisingly, the marriage didn’t work out — two-thirds of marriages of underage girls don’t last, one study found — but it did interrupt Johnson’s attendance at elementary school. Today she is campaigning for a state law to curb underage marriages, part of a nationwide movement to end child marriage in America. Meanwhile, children 16 and under are still being married in Florida at a rate of one every few days.

*and more from the article*

You’re thinking: “Child marriage? That’s what happens in Bangladesh or Tanzania, not America!”

more than 167,000 young people age 17 and under married in 38 states between 2000 and 2010, according to a search of available marriage license data by a group called Unchained at Last, which aims to ban child marriage. The search turned up cases of 12-year-old girls married in Alaska, Louisiana and South Carolina, while other states simply had categories of “14 and younger.”

Unchained at Last was not able to get data for the other states. But it extrapolated that in the entire country, there were almost 250,000 child marriages between 2000 and 2010. Some backing for that estimate comes from the U.S. Census Bureau, which says that at least 57,800 Americans age 15 to 17 reported being in marriages in 2014.

Among the states with the highest rates of child marriages were Arkansas, Idaho and Kentucky. The number of child marriages has been falling, but every state in America still allows underage girls to marry, typically with the consent of parents, a judge or both. 

Twenty-seven states do not even set a minimum age by statute, according to the Tahirih Justice Center’s Forced Marriage Initiative.
A great majority of the child marriages involve girls and adult men. Such a sexual relationship would often violate statutory rape laws, but marriage sometimes makes it legal.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/26/...2017-06&subid=JuneMC48&ad-keywords=AudDevGate


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

There are a lot of hard nosed religious people in our country. I have seen in a couple of places that young girls are allowed to marry with the permission of their parents. Maybe this is a law that states need to take off their books.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

I would like to see the minimum marriage age be the same as the age of consent. 18 may be too high, maybe 16 is more reasonable. Or maybe 18, but possible for those as young as 16 to be treated as adults after some formal education / counseling / testing. 

Child marriage is an abomination. 

The existing laws seem based on an archaic and offensive idea of ensuring that young girls need to maintain their value (eg virginity) until they have been married off. So parents can marry off a young girl but its illegal for her to consent to sex on her own.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

NextTimeAround said:


> There are a lot of hard nosed religious people in our country. I have seen in a couple of places that young girls are allowed to marry with the permission of their parents. Maybe this is a law that states need to take off their books.


I agree. The idea that a parent can sign off on a child marrying is beyond ridiculous in this day and age. It should be taken off the books in every state.

Human rights organizations consider child marriage a form of slavery since the child is conscripted into a form of servitude that they had no choice in. The only good thing here in the USA is that when the child gets old enough, they can divorce the abuser.

I just had no idea that child marriage was so common in the USA.


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## anonmd (Oct 23, 2014)

It's complicated, the 11 year old case is obviously ludicrous. Marrying an under age girl to avoid a rape charge is insane that that is allowed. On the other hand, <18 year olds get pregnant all the time and I don't have any particular objection to them marrying if the two of them are roughly peers age wise.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

anonmd said:


> It's complicated, the 11 year old case is obviously ludicrous. Marrying an under age girl to avoid a rape charge is insane that that is allowed. On the other hand, <18 year olds get pregnant all the time and I don't have any particular objection to them marrying if the two of them are roughly peers age wise.


A lot of the marriages that the article talked about is older men marrying underaged girls.

When it comes to the <18 bunch, I still think that marriage is more likely not a good idea since most of those marriages will never make it for very long. Not in today's world.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

Florida.


smh.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

That whole concept is positively maddening. 

How the H3LL can someone be legally too young to consent to sex, but then able to marry??? Holy crap! That is possibly the worst, most insane, contradiction I've ever seen!!! The age differences exacerbate an already incomprehensible idea. These guys need to be removed from society. Put them all on an island and let them f*** each other. Hayzoos effing Christo on a skateboard!

I actually became aware of the less egregious, but altogether too common version of this phenomenon when I was in college. My junior year, I roomed with a friend from high school who was two years my junior (schoolwise, we were within a few months of each other agewise), he a new freshman. He was from a very strict Southern Baptist family, although he himself was fully rebellious and hardly devout or practicing. 

Nevertheless, be began attending the local Southern Baptist Church and ended up dating the minister's 15 year old daughter. They soon got engaged, and as of the date of the wedding, he would be 19 and she, 16. Egad!!! (and I was to be Best Man!!!)

One weekend, we were back home and I was talking to his parents and couldn't help but express my concern that a union forged by two people so young and inexperienced could be problematic. His mother very sternly explained to me that when you meet the right one, you need to act no matter what the age. 

That’s when I had my light bulb moment and fully came to understand the twisted rationale of these people. It was feared these two were on their way to carnal activity and something had to be done, and quick. God forbid they should play hide the salami before a properly ordained minister could declare them man and wife! Far better take a chance on condemning them to a life of misery together with a brood of equally miserable children, than to take a chance they might fornicate! 

I understand, and respect, people’s attachment to their faith, but even with that in mind, what’s the lesser of the two evils … really? What are you doing to your children?!?

I’ll never forget the day her parents came to our apartment with a home cooked southern meal for him. They went to put something in the refrigerator and saw my beer in there. They held nothing back in chastising me, after all this was the home of their future son-in-law and how dare I bring such evil into the house! I wanted to scream “You’re about to marry off your 15 year old daughter to an immature teenager who has had carnal relations with multiple women, got one of them pregnant and paid for her ABORTION (isn’t that the ultimate sin to you?)! But hey, he came back to the church and confessed his sins, and was re baptized in your church, so I guess that means all that past history is no longer a red flag for future behavior, eh? “ It took a great deal of restraint just to step away and not march his loving parents-in-law-to-be right into his room and expose the rather voluminous porn stash in his closet!


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

> It was feared these two were on their way to carnal activity and something had to be done, and quick.


So this is why some people believe that --at any age --- if you profess to be waiting until marriage to have sex that the courtship will shorten and that the prize / marriage comes real quick.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

anonmd said:


> It's complicated, the 11 year old case is obviously ludicrous. Marrying an under age girl to avoid a rape charge is insane that that is allowed. On the other hand, <18 year olds get pregnant all the time and I don't have any particular objection to them marrying if the two of them are roughly peers age wise.


Exactly what happened to my daughter's ex-boyfriend. After he dumped my daughter he got a 15-year old pregnant (he was 22 at the time) and married her to avoid the statutory rape charge. She had the baby, he split and ended up in prison for attempted murder (but that's another story).


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Chris Taylor said:


> Exactly what happened to my daughter's ex-boyfriend. After he dumped my daughter he got a 15-year old pregnant (he was 22 at the time) and married her to avoid the statutory rape charge. She had the baby, he split and ended up in prison for attempted murder (but that's another story).


Geez. 

Did the 15 year old girl consent, in as much as a 15 year old can?

There are a lot of these cases in which it was forcible rape. And the parents still force the marriage. I believe that the case of the 11 year old was forcible rape.

Neither is ok. I'm just sitting here shaking my head that this still goes on.

But then, I know someone who was a very messed up 12 year old. Her mother allowed her to live with a 35 year old man. The 12 year old thought that this was like marriage and was so much in love. That is until she got to be too old for him when she turned 16 and he threw her out. This was in the 1990's.


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## twoofus (Jun 16, 2017)

In England, a couple can get married if they over 16 but if under 18 then the parents consent is required. However, if they wish to circumvent parents lack of consent, they can make their way to Scotland where the parential consent is not required. Gretna Green is the traditional place for such marriages since it is just over the border.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

EleGirl said:


> Geez.
> 
> Did the 15 year old girl consent, in as much as a 15 year old can?
> 
> ...


It was supposedly consensual. There was also the question of a green card for the girl and her mother.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

This is far from a new thing. Well if you are a rock-n-roll star with money.....

Great Balls of Scandal: How Jerry Lee Lewis' marriage to a 13-year-old wrecked his career | Daily Mail Online


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Young at Heart said:


> This is far from a new thing. Well if you are a rock-n-roll star with money.....
> 
> Great Balls of Scandal: How Jerry Lee Lewis' marriage to a 13-year-old wrecked his career | Daily Mail Online


That was 60 some ears ago in the 1950's. The age of consent and consent for marriage has changed since then in most states. But I guess a lot of states up still left loopholes.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)




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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

The few child marriages I personally know of were teen girls who got pregnant by older men. The idea wasn't to avoid statutory charges, but to avoid welfare. I can't say I approve, but I can't say I disapprove of parents marrying to provide for mother and baby, either.

These were all consensual relationships, though, and the marriages weren't instigated by the parents. 
One of them had to be approved by the court as the parents refused to sign. They're still married. The other two aren't.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

uhtred said:


> I would like to see the minimum marriage age be the same as the age of consent. 18 may be too high, maybe 16 is more reasonable. Or maybe 18, but possible for those as young as 16 to be treated as adults after some formal education / counseling / testing.
> 
> Child marriage is an abomination.
> 
> The existing laws seem based on an archaic and offensive idea of ensuring that young girls need to maintain their value (eg virginity) until they have been married off. So parents can marry off a young girl but its illegal for her to consent to sex on her own.


 In the UK its 16 with parents permission and 18 if not. I doubt many parents would give permission for their child to marry at 16, let alone 11 to a pheodopile.:frown2::frown2:


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## soccermom2three (Jan 4, 2013)

When I was in 10th or 11th grade there was a girl in one of my classes that was married. She wasn't pregnant, just got married at 16. This was the early 80's. I remember her showing us her professional wedding photographs so it wasn't a "let's run off and get married" thing. We all thought it was weird. I mean who gets married at 16 in Southern California, that stuff happens in the South, lol. Her husband looked older but then when you are 15 and 16, anyone older than 21 looks old, I guess.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Looks like just another way, I'm reckoning, that the GOP is working to steadfastly try to solidify, thus attempting to totally lock up the youth vote!

This practice in legality is beyond pathetic!!*


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

arbitrator said:


> *Looks like just another way, I'm reckoning, that the GOP is working to steadfastly try to solidify, thus attempting to totally lock up the youth vote!
> 
> This practice in legality is beyond pathetic!!*


I'm not sure why you are trying to blame this on the GOP.

The laws are made by both parties.

For example in California a child can get married with parental and judicial consent at any age.

Unlike most Western countries, half of the US states do not have a legal minimum age of marriage. While in most US states, individuals age 18 have a right to marriage (with two exceptions—Nebraska (19) and Mississippi (21)), all states allow minors to marry in certain circumstances, such as parental consent, judicial consent, pregnancy, or a combination of these situations.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_marriage_in_the_United_States


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> I'm not sure why you are trying to blame this on the GOP.
> 
> The laws are made by both parties.
> 
> ...


*Simply because the GOP has the vast majority of the state houses locked up, as well as the governorships, and, to wit, they refuse to do a damned thing about it! 

If you read the article, the esteemed GOP governor of New Jersey, vetoed a Democratic bill thus raising the age in that jurisdiction!

Let's call him as our first witness to ask why!*


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

arbitrator said:


> *Simply because the GOP has the vast majority of the state houses locked up, as well as the governorships, and, to wit, they refuse to do a damned thing about it!
> 
> If you read the article, the esteemed GOP governor of New Jersey, vetoed a Democratic bill thus raising the age in that jurisdiction!
> 
> Let's call him as our first witness to ask why!*


We don't have to call him as a witness as it's public record why he vetoed the bill. Below is from an article that quotes him.

Also note that there is no state in the USA that bans child marriage. Most states would allow a 1 year old to be married if the parents consent. Some would require a judge to also consent. Since these laws were put into place by people from all political parties, it's ridiculous to blame one party.

TRENTON -- Gov. Chris Christie on Thursday rejected a bill that would have barred all teenagers from getting married in New Jersey before they turn 18, suggesting instead that lawmakers tighten the state's current marriage restrictions on minors.

Christie's move prevents New Jersey from becoming the first state in the U.S. to outright ban marriage before age 18, without exceptions.

Supporters of the bill (A3091) say it was designed to protect girls from being forced into arranged marriages. 

In his veto message, Christie wrote that "protecting the well-being, dignity, and freedom of minors is vital, but the severe bar this bill creates is not necessary to address the concerns voiced by the bill's proponents and does not comport with the sensibilities and, in some cases, the religious customs, of the people of this state."

Instead, Christie suggested lawmakers amend the measure to bar anyone under 16 from getting married and require a judge to approve a marriage license for anyone 16 or 17.

"An exclusion without exceptions would violate the cultures and traditions of some communities in New Jersey based on religious traditions," the Republican governor wrote.
Under current New Jersey law, those who are 16 and 17 can obtain marriage licenses with the consent of their parents. Those under 16 need both parental consent and approval from a judge. 

Christie also said it's "disingenuous" that a 16-year-olds would be banned from marriage when they are allowed in New Jersey to consent to sex and obtain an abortion without parental knowledge.

Christie's veto is a conditional veto, meaning the state Legislature can choose to make his changes and send a new version of the bill to the governor's desk.

Christie rejects ban on marriage for N.J. teens under 18 | NJ.com​


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

soccermom2three said:


> When I was in 10th or 11th grade there was a girl in one of my classes that was married. She wasn't pregnant, just got married at 16. This was the early 80's. I remember her showing us her professional wedding photographs so it wasn't a "let's run off and get married" thing. We all thought it was weird. I mean who gets married at 16 in Southern California, that stuff happens in the South, lol. Her husband looked older but then when you are 15 and 16, anyone older than 21 looks old, I guess.


I know a couple in Texas who married when she was 16 and he 15. That was about 2 years ago.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> In the UK its 16 with parents permission and 18 if not. I doubt many parents would give permission for their child to marry at 16, let alone 11 to a pheodopile.:frown2::frown2:


 @Diana7, as @twoofus has previously pointed out in this thread, that's not the case in the UK, only England, Wales and NI, the situation is very different in Scotland where the legal age (parental consent or not) is 16.


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