# First time poster, straite to the point, Male 28.



## ParaStatic (Aug 2, 2013)

Hello all, the past year or so it would seem my marriage has been declining at a ever rapid rate. My wife and I have been married for nearly two years, and together for almost 5. We have one daughter who is 11 months old. We met through friends at social outgoings, and quickly got the crush, lovie dovie feel. Fast forward a few years, struggling with bills, life, nice places to live, but NEVER with the relationship. We have always worked together very well, we never even had real augments for 4+ years, we did once and it was about not fighting. Well 6 months ago she told me she isn't happy, I don't help enough around the house and it stresses her out coming home from work and having to do things. It came off her unhappiness was due to the fact she had to go to work, and come home to do house work at the time. I have tried really hard to change my routine to accommodate what has been asked of me, there really is not a whole lot of things to do around the house on a daily basis. I have gotten behind on laundry a bit, but I just haven't felt like doing it as I have been depressed lately. I am a pretty passive person, I fold easy and will generally give in and not complain about much. 

Now two weeks ago or so she told me she still is not happy with me. She said I do not provide emotionally any more, no forehead kisses, don't hold hands, we do not do things together as much as we use to, I don't say how I feel and apparently everything I do annoys her. And some of it is true, but I feel like she has shut me out long before, we have slept in separate spots for over a year. I normally get the bed as the pack and play is in the room and I get up with our daughter, and she sleeps on the couch. It would seem every time we talk about 'us' it ends worse then before it started. A few days ago she threw the words "Trial Separation" at me, and from what I read it is just the cornerstone to divorce. 

I may not be the best communicator and I recognize that, I had a pretty troubled youth and it reflects on me to this day with how I express emotions. I am pretty good with happy feelings and joy etc etc, but I have a horrid habit of suppressing sadness, anger, spite. When ever we talk about how she feels, I just basically suck at life and can never make her happy any more, my brain locks up and I tend to stonewall her. It is not something I try to do and recently I asked her to address each issue one at a time so I can better 'process' it and give her a real response. We tried that, and now when I tell her how I feel about things it just fuels her fire even more, I am stuck in a catch 22. If I don't say anything it gets worse, if I do speak up it also gets worse. These last two days on her way to work she just leaves and hasn't even said goodbye, or anything. We didn't even talk to each other last night. She wants the Trial Separation to start on Saturday.

This whole time I felt we were doing good and this was all a surprise to me really. I always figured that having a daughter you would expect things to change between you. All the free time we once had is gone. I guess I was wrong somehow, I would really like to understand exactly what I can do to make things better. It is really hard to connect with someone who thinks everything you do is annoying, I can never say or do anything right apparently. 

Last weekend she went out with her sisters, and at bar close told me she was going to a after bar, and only told me the town this after bar was in. I was upset with her, for the lack of information, if something came up how would I get a hold of her. If there was an emergency where would I pick her up? She told me her phone was nearly dead and she went to a place with strangers she never met before and just her sisters. After I addressed these reasons for being upset she said I do not trust her, and I think she is cheating on me, and pretty much discredited my feelings and turned them around on me. And we have volleyball on Wednesday nights and after our games she just kinda does her own thing. I brought this up and told her that with everything combined it feels like I am being phased out of this relationship. And once again she said "I" think she is unfaithful, and continues to revert my feelings back against me. I do not know what to do any-more! I love her very much and really want things to be how they use to be, but I do not know what to do any-more.

This last week after the volleyball game, we had a few beers, and I guess I got wound up enough with all of what has been going on. She wanted to go out and did invite me, but I heard mentioning of "finding guys to pay for our drinks again", I did get angry. I said I was going home to watch our daughter, (our sitter was only supposed to be for the game and a little while after it). I probably did say it snaky, I was upset. Then it all came out, maybe it was having a little liquid courage in me that did it, but I told her how I felt about the lack of information again, and how I feel about little red flags popping up. She got very upset again and redirected my feelings to me not having faith and trusting her, and making it to be I am a horrid person for having such thoughts.

And a little added info to go with the story, I got laid off in March, and have been off of work this summer so far, I do get UI. She works seasonal and went to work about the time I got laid off so it worked out kind of as we do not have to pay for daycare. However she is also upset that our daughter became a Daddy's Girl. However we have been managing to get by on our incomes, thank goodness.

Someone point me in the right direction, I can not afford counselling. I haven't even had any insurance on myself in over 6 years.

Sincerely,
Lost


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## ParaStatic (Aug 2, 2013)

I would like to add this was all written with my daughter all over me, if there are typographical errors I missed I am sorry. And I also apologize if sentences kind of jump around as it is hard to concentrate.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

For starters put a voice activated recorder in her car you may get some answers that way or even a pen var in her purse jmo.


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## Stonewall (Jul 5, 2011)

This will probably need to be moved to CWI.


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

Parastatic,

I hate to say this but having a spouse who's unhappy, but can't specifically say what she's unhappy about, first it's you don't do enough, then when you start doing "enough", it turns into emotional support, and if you gave her enough emotional support, it'd become "you're controlling" or "I've lost my identity" or "I love you but I'm not in love with you", this is 90% of the time the script of a cheater. She's defensive. She's going out to single hook up places and being very obtuse about it.

I'm truly sorry to say that but actions speak loudly and she's put up the biggest of the red flags.

Also a specific date to start a trial separation...hmmmm that's not a red flag at all.........

Does she do more girls nights out? Has her appearance changed at all. Has your sex dried up?

Your wife's responses indicate she IS cheating on you.

If there's issues with a marriage, wouldn't you think of counseling first.

Here's my recommendation. Say no to a separation. Either you're IN this marriage or your out. Call her on that and don't be surprised if you get "well then I want a divorce". Tell her you want to go to counseling first.

She's in "the fog". right now.

Oh and while you're in counseling. Look into how you can monitor her actions, like VARs, cell phone information, keyloggers etc. There's a few threads on here on how to do this.

PS I'd ask to have this moved to CWI section.


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## ParaStatic (Aug 2, 2013)

At the moment we can not afford professional help, and she has stated that if we do not do a trial separation she would want a divorce. I know there are red flags, call me optimistic but I do not feel she would cheat on me. If she did she knows it would be over instantly and that was a point I made a long time ago as that is how my last relationship ended. Maybe I just make a really good door mat I do not know. That was her only real girls night out in forever, I just did not like the lack of communication.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

No matter what you do it doesn't help? You're right! You're being phased out for something new, if there isn't someone already.

What is she doing besides complaining she's not happy? Going out with friends, while you're a babysitter for her? You're her husband, not the maid and nanny! Cleaning and tending to children won't get you intimacy.

She's got you where she wants you, chasing something you can catch. The more you do it the more you look pathetic and weak. Do you think she'll look twice at a man like that? Why is she deciding what's going to happen? When are you going to say what's gong to happen?

The good news is that you can change you and how you'll allow her to treat you. 

Here is some reading that will help you put things in perspective and let you chose a plan of action. Get moving, you're way behind the curve. 

No More Mr Nice Guy

Married Man Sex Life | How to have the marriage you thought you were going to have.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/18181-man-up-nice-guy-reference.html

180 List - No More Mr. Nice Guy Online Support Group

This is a thread from a fellow member that followed these steps. 

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/27426-what-ive-learned-past-year-good-news-story.html

Do the snooping the others recommended too! Do not hesitate!


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## tryingtobebetter (Aug 6, 2012)

Think about the advice you have already been given. 

However, if you want to work at your marriage, tell your wife that and read His Needs Her Needs and the Five Love Languages. Ask her to read them too. At present she is giving up on marriage far too easily,

Adjusting to life with a small child is not easy. What was/is your wife's parents' marriage like? iIs she following a pattern set in her own childhood? Could she be suffering from post-natal depression?

Good luck.


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## LoveAtDaisys (Jul 3, 2013)

You say she wouldn't cheat because she knows that that would end your relationship.

Isn't that enough incentive for her to hide if she is cheating?


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

ParaStatic said:


> At the moment we can not afford professional help, and she has stated that if we do not do a trial separation she would want a divorce. I know there are red flags, call me optimistic but I do not feel she would cheat on me. If she did she knows it would be over instantly and that was a point I made a long time ago as that is how my last relationship ended. Maybe I just make a really good door mat I do not know. That was her only real girls night out in forever, I just did not like the lack of communication.


Parastatic. you seem like you're a logical guy so I feel like I can be blunt.

You're not being optimistic, you're responding like all BS's do.

Here's what my guess is. Your wife has been in an EA (emotional affair) for a while. Probably something after your child was born. And she's now looking to take it physical.

If a woman doesn't have something else lined up, they generally work hard to save whatever situation they're in.


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## ParaStatic (Aug 2, 2013)

After some reading, it would appear I am a 'nice guy'. Maybe it is all my fault.

And thank you for the input everyone, I will address some of things that have been brought up.


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

ParaStatic said:


> At the moment we can not afford professional help, and she has stated that if we do not do a trial separation she would want a divorce. I know there are red flags, call me optimistic but I do not feel she would cheat on me. If she did she knows it would be over instantly and that was a point I made a long time ago as that is how my last relationship ended. Maybe I just make a really good door mat I do not know. That was her only real girls night out in forever, I just did not like the lack of communication.


Go read about 100 posts in the CW section. Many betrayed spouses over and over state "I know she would not cheat on me" to discover they have been lied to. Has she sworn on the children lives, god and the bible yet that nothing happened? Hate to tell you what that means. Read CWI threads for yourself. I read your thread and all I see is classic cheater script. Like the 1000th one on this web site. 

Brother, Her trial separation is a license to go bang her affair partner while she decides whether or how or when she is going to leave you. If you agree to that separation your marriage as you now know it will be effectively over. If you do not proactively start gathering intel right now by the time you figure out what is really going on she will be long gone. If you wait for her to fill you in on what is really going on it will be too late. She will only be informing you to clear her conscious with a million pathetic excuses for why she did not tell you. Cheaters do that over and over.

Move this thread to CWI. Listen to the posters. Place VARS in your auto, bedroom and a room in the house you think she may be making calls from when you are not home. Install a keylogger on the home PC. Heed the advice of the posters. If she is not in a EA or PA you then you can still save your marriage as you now know it. If there is someone else at least you will be in a position to know what you are facing and can act accordingly. You have everything to lose if you wait.


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## PreRaphaelite (Dec 15, 2012)

ParaStatic said:


> At the moment we can not afford professional help, and she has stated that if we do not do a trial separation she would want a divorce. I know there are red flags, call me optimistic but I do not feel she would cheat on me. If she did she knows it would be over instantly and that was a point I made a long time ago as that is how my last relationship ended. Maybe I just make a really good door mat I do not know. That was her only real girls night out in forever, I just did not like the lack of communication.


That's a huge red flag right there. She wants to get you out of the way so she can do what she wants, and this happens just about the time that she starts going out to pick-up bars?

She is shutting you out and she's threatening divorce. Yes you ARE being a doormat and you are relying on false hopes. How do you know she's not cheating? Just read the posts of BS's here and find out how many have said, "I just feel my wife would not cheat on me." You are COMPLETELY wrong. You don't know her now. She's not the woman you knew, and you're throwing blinders on to keep the sobering truth from you.

You need to check up on her fast and do *not* tell her that you are. VAR your car, check her cell phones, emails, etc. 

If she is seriously threatening divorce over this, then that means she's already checked out of the relationship, most probably because she in the affair fog--she's either in one or is about to enter one and is just waiting for the time when she can be permanently away from you.

THis is not optimism my friend, it's denial. Frankly, if my wife made that kind of threat I would tell her straight to her face, "then go ahead and file" and she would do the same to me. Want to know why? Because such a threat is extremely disrespectful of the other spouse's feeling and it sends the message that they are not interested in working things out. Your wife wants to have her cake and eat it too. If she doesn't want to be in the marriage then tell her she can leave it. It's a hard thing to do but otherwise she is going to play you for a fool and an idiot.

Time to wake up.


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## committed4ever (Nov 13, 2012)

Dad&Hubby said:


> Parastatic. you seem like you're a logical guy so I feel like I can be blunt.
> 
> You're not being optimistic, you're responding like all BS's do.
> 
> ...


Part in bold - so true. I believe even for men too. Most don't quit their job until they have another line up. She even gave you notice.


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## PreRaphaelite (Dec 15, 2012)

committed4ever said:


> Part in bold - so true. I believe even for men too. Most don't quit their job until they have another line up. She even gave you notice.


:iagree:

Exactly. She told you she wants out and threatened divorce. The "trial separation" is a not for the sake of her marriage, but for whomever she's about to shag.


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

ParaStatic said:


> She wants the Trial Separation to start on Saturday.


She knows right down to the minute when she's hopping up on his weiner Saturday.

The cheating spouse is always so ****-sure of themselves as long as they are in control. The affair is secret. She is calling all the shots and the husband is a step behind, reacting defensively.

So you have to wrest control. One component is the spy regime others have already mentioned. The other is not playing the "pick me" dance the cheating spouse demands out of the husband. If she moves out, file the papers.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

She should have been honest with you up front about the emotional distance being her real issue, not that you dont help around the house. That made you try to fix the wrong thing. If I were you, I would try to get a hold of her phone and check her call history, texts, etc, and check history on your computer as well. It does sound like she could have another man lined up.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Stay in your house and invite her to leave (women think they have a birthright to the marital home and chlidren).

Maintain and document your status as the primary caregiver of your child.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

ParaStatic said:


> After some reading, it would appear I am a 'nice guy'. Maybe it is all my fault.
> 
> And thank you for the input everyone, I will address some of things that have been brought up.


It's not your fault for her walking away from the marriage without working to fix it first. You honestly tried, she didn't. Don't feel sorry, feel angry and use it to get back control over what happens to you. 

If she is hell bent on separation happening, then you make it on your terms. 

Don't move out of the house and don't leave your children. If she wants out of the marriage, she can leave. 

Don't be her baby sitter while she plays the single life. You have a life to live too! Let her babysit for you.


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

ParaStatic said:


> Hello all, the past year or so it would seem my marriage has been declining at a ever rapid rate. My wife and I have been married for nearly two years, and dated for nearly 4.5 before we got married. We have one daughter who is 11 months old. We met through friends at social outgoings, and quickly got the crush, lovie dovie feel. Fast forward a few years, struggling with bills, life, nice places to live, but NEVER with the relationship. We have always worked together very well, we never even had real augments for 4+ years, we did once and it was about not fighting. Well 6 months ago she told me she isn't happy, I don't help enough around the house and it stresses her out coming home from work and having to do things. I changed my habits she has done dishes once since then maybe twice, laundry maybe once a month, picking up the house she does not really even help with. I am a pretty passive person, I fold easy and will generally give in and not complain about much.
> 
> Now two weeks ago or so she told me she still is not happy with me. She said I do not provide emotionally any more, no forehead kisses, don't hold hands, we do not do things together as much as we use to, I don't say how I feel and apparently everything I do annoys her. And some of it is true, but I feel like she has shut me out long before, we have slept in separate spots for about a year. I normally get the bed as the pack and play is in the room and I get up with our daughter, and she sleeps on the couch. It would seem every time we talk about 'us' it ends worse then before it started. A few days ago she threw the words "Trial Separation" at me, and from what I read it is just the cornerstone to divorce.
> 
> ...


I did not see this before. That is tomorrow. Time is of the essence. You have no real time to gather intel. If I where you I would tell her she walks out that door to expect divorce papers, that there will be no turning back and you will not be deterred. Tell her you will assume she is lining up another partner and you will not sit home with the child while she is out f**king someone else. If she expects you to move out say no, that you intend to work on your marriage. Tell her if she does not want to work on the marriage and wants out tell her to please move immediately and hand her divorce papers for her to sign. Print them out from the web. They don't have to be legal, it is just to prove a point how serious you are. When you have this conversation use your cell phone as a recorder. If she is in a EA/PA this conversation can and will get ugly fast.* Do not give her an excuse to get you kicked out of the house.*The recorder is to protect you. If you do not have a recorder have a trusted friend there as a witness.


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

Ohh, and tell her you intend to DNA test the kid. Tell her that her behavior since the birth of the child is starting to make you wonder. See how she reacts to that. Again, with a recorder or a friend present.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

Broken_in_Brooklyn said:


> I did not see this before. That is tomorrow. Time is of the essence. You have no real time to gather intel. If I where you I would tell her she walks out that door to expect divorce papers, that there will be no turning back and you will not be deterred. Tell her you will assume she is lining up another partner and you will not sit home with the child while she is out f**king someone else. If she expects you to move out say no, that you intend to work on your marriage. Tell her if she does not want to work on the marriage and wants out tell her to please move immediately and hand her divorce papers for her to sign. Print them out from the web. They don't have to be legal, it is just to prove a point how serious you are. When you have this conversation use your cell phone as a recorder. If she is in a EA/PA this conversation can and will get ugly fast.* Do not give her an excuse to get you kicked out of the house.*The recorder is to protect you. If you do not have a recorder have a trusted friend there as a witness.


Pay heed, this is sound advice!!! 

This should be your first action against her plans. 

Sorry, it's all happening so fast. 

Good luck.


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

She's gone. Tell her that once she walks out that door, it's over. Do not, I repeat: DO NOT expect her to stop walking when she gets that warning. She will still leave. It's over, man. Start dealing with it. And while dealing with it, think of MrK. Over 50, 3 teen kids, having to figure out for himself that his wife stopped loving him 20 years ago. My life is over. Yours is not. Let her go and start living again.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

I agree shes playing you. tell her if she wants a trial separation she can leave. but the daughter stays home with you. if she leaves change the locks and call a lawyer.

start looking for employment. or some retraining if your job skills are not up to snuff.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Para. Tell a mod to move this to coping with infidelity ASAP. This belongs there.

Im resident VAR goon but at work so i cant post my standard stuff. Ill copy paste it when i get home.

Just do me a favor AND BE READY to go to Best buy and Walmart tomorrow. My instructions will be very specific and very likely to catch her if she is cheating. Just follow my instructions. I am damn good at this part.

Trial separation often means= i want my own place to make hookups easier.

Sorry you are here

Must have missed how time isof the essence.

Best buy. Icdpx312 voice recorder
Walmart. Heavy duty velcro

DO THIS NOW!!! MOVE IT!

Further instructions to follow.


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

I'll bet she STILL never told you the name of the after bar, did she? AMAZING how much the "we're only having a little fun, you neanderthal moron" crowd gets away with.

Get on Facebook and go to these gals pages. They MAY not have been stupid enough to post pictures of your married wife with strange guys hanging all over her, but you should be able to see pictures of some of the men she partied with that night.

I hate to get in with the "she's cheating or thinking about it" crowd so early, but you need to spy. You need to find out what's going on in that head of hers. Get those VARS they've been talking about.

I actually envy you. Your wife will leave you while you have time to recover. You're WAY ahead of me.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Mr K. BRILLIANT on the fb thing.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

This sounds EXACTLY like my ex wife and me for that matter six months into her affair. I didn't find out about the affair until we were already well into separation, and on the virge of divorce. I didn't listen to the advice here because I knew she would never cheat on me. I wasted so much time...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Alright Im on my comp

Here are exact instructions
Buy 2 sony ICDPX312 voice activated recorders. Best Buy sells them for like 50 bucks. DO NOT BUY THE cheapies. USE LITHIUM batteries. We have examples of 25 hour recordings using them on these sony recorders. Set bit rate to 44K and sensitivity to very high or better. Turn off the beep feature. Its on one of the menus.

Go to Walmart and buy heavy duty velcro.

Use the velcro to attach the var under her seat UP INSIDE. SECURE IT WELL!!!!!! So well even a big bump wont knock it off.

Put the second in whatever room she uses to talk in when you are not around.

Usual warning. If you hear another man get in her car STOP Listening and have a trusted friend tell you what went on. Knowing she is a cheat will kill you. Hearing her moan while another man is inside her will murder you to your very soul!!!!!! You are not strong enough to hear that. Dont try it. I know what I am talking about in this.

Play dumb husband for a bit. Dont drive her further underground! NO MORE CONFRONTS!! NEVER give up you get your intel from the VAR. You always got your info from a PI or someone saw them.

If you need clean up the recordings get Audacity. Its free from the internet. I have used it on var work for others here to remove things like engine noise. If needed, I have done var work for three men here. RDMU is the only one who has released some of the confidentiality. Read his second thread for my reliability and confidentiality. NEVER GIVE UP YOUR ELECTRONIC EVIDENCE. They were seen by a PI or something NOT your VAR!!

The ezoom GPS has been found to be easy to buy at Radio shack and useful. THis one may be VERY useful for you. It installs on the OBDII port and is damn near invisible.

Look for a burner phone. That is often why wives let the husband "see their phone"

Look for apps on her phone like words with friends. It has a non traceable texting feature.

TOMORROW NIGHT. Get a sitter in secret and follow in a friends car. Or have a friend follow her. Its gonna be ugly I can damn near guarantee. Tomorrow night is damn near certain a hook up. Sorry to bear that news. I do not have enough info from you to tell if its a first hookup tho guestimating not. I would guestimate last weekend was first hookup.


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## 6301 (May 11, 2013)

She told you she went to a strangers house with her sisters after bar hopping. That is not what a married woman should be doing. Not to mention that going out with friends and finding guys to buy her drinks? Dude she's half way out the door already and if it was me, I would push the other half out and tell her not to come back until she starts acting like a respectable wife with some sort of integrity 

Also a trial separation means that she can go do her thing under the guise of being single and she thinks that it will be her excuse. It will work if you let her do what she wants. This is a genuine cake eater and your slowly becoming the baker. 

You need to take a stand and go with the feeling that she's near or having an affair. The kind of mentality that you no longer will put up with her bull sh!t. She's putting all the blame on you and until you step up to the plate and let her know that the time for her silly half assed game are over. Best of luck


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

Do not let her have a separation---that just lets her be free to cheat, w/out you keeping tabs

As to trust---why would you trust her---she is out going to bars---when she has a H, and child at home----ask her if she knows the definition of mge---it does not include one of the spouses, going out to meat markets

Call her bluff---tell her if she leaves, then D, goes on the table immediately-------actually you can go online---and print out the D packet from your state's legal forms---print out a blank packet, and leave it laying around where she can see it---see if that has any effect on her

You do not need counseling-----the 2 of you need to sit down, and force yourself, to talk about everything---that is what you would do with a counselor---under their guidance

No holding back---get it all out----if she refuses---then go with the D packet, as a bluff---lets see how really serious she is

No matter what---no separation, and no more GNO's---she is if nothing else, a mother, and she needs to act like one, that includes not wrecking the life of her child


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

ParaStatic said:


> At the moment we can not afford professional help, and she has stated that if we do not do a trial separation she would want a divorce. I know there are red flags, call me optimistic but I do not feel she would cheat on me. If she did she knows it would be over instantly and that was a point I made a long time ago as that is how my last relationship ended. Maybe I just make a really good door mat I do not know. That was her only real girls night out in forever, I just did not like the lack of communication.


There are charitable bodies that offer free or reduced cost help. Local churches might have the details.

Please reach out, help is available.


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## jim123 (Sep 29, 2012)

Then go ahead with the D. They reason she wants the separation is to cheat on you and be able to say it was not cheating because you were separated.

You are plan B if the A does not work out. Take that off the table.


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## DavidWYoung (Feb 3, 2012)

You are getting 5 Star advice for free, the question is " Will you use it?" My guess is no, you will be her doormat and get you a## handed to you by her lawyer.

This is real life and you are in battle right now. Stop thinking that she would never cheat on you!

Stop thinking that she just had a baby and she would never do that to you!

Stop thinking that she said wedding vows just two years ago so she could not break them this soon!

Some women just turn evil, sorry but it is true. You are going to have to man up for this next battle. Just my 2 cents David


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

Remember, the marriage license you sign is just like an apartment lease. Both can be broken without a thought.


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