# The lying hurts worse than the cheating...



## anonymous1978 (Dec 27, 2010)

my situation (which I described in a previous post) involves "minor" incidents of infidelity committed by my boyfriend of 7 years and was accompanied with a LOT of lying, hiding, and trickle truth...

all he is worried about is that I don't think that the incidents (sexting, a kiss, inappropriate flirting) were any more than what actually happened. I am *FAR* more hurt by the years of lying and betrayal and can't seem to get him to understand that only he knows the reality of the situations and that I can't take what he says to be the truth...

i'm just stuck...it's like hitting my head against a brick wall trying to get him to understand why trust is vital to a relationship and how I've reacted to having that taken away from me...


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## ing (Mar 26, 2011)

anonymous1978 said:


> I am *FAR* more hurt by the years of lying and betrayal and can't seem to get him to understand that only he knows the reality of the situations and that I can't take what he says to be the truth...
> 
> i'm just stuck...it's like hitting my head against a brick wall trying to get him to understand why trust is vital to a relationship and how I've reacted to having that taken away from me...


It is betrayal that hurts! This is the ongoing pain that people here understand. I have come to the conclusion that unless you have experienced it, you just can't imagine the pain it causes. 
I think that is why it is minimized by the DS . They just don't understand.


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## anonymous1978 (Dec 27, 2010)

thank you for the link! it has been difficult to find any words to share with him that express the feeling of being betrayed by the person you've devoted your life to...


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## ing (Mar 26, 2011)

anonymous1978 said:


> thank you for the link! it has been difficult to find any words to share with him that express the feeling of being betrayed by the person you've devoted your life to...


I took the link off because it was not quiet right, however it gives an approximation of the idea!

Your feelings are completely and absolutely valid. He is not taking responsibility for his actions and trying to blame you for not understanding him.,.


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## bobbie (Jun 1, 2011)

Yes - it's lying and betrayal that really matter. ‘Truth Games’ Truth Games: Amazon.co.uk: Bobbie Darbyshire: Books explores issues of infidelity in 1970s London UK, when the freedoms of the swinging 60s began to run into trouble. It’s the two blazing hot summers of 75 and 76, and a group of friends are getting way out of their depth in infidelity. It is the couple who are honest with each other who (with difficulty!) find their way through.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

I agree. It's the betrayal that hurts the most. THe covering up, the lying, the being oblivious to it all.

That is why I've always maintained that it is 200x worse if the BS discovers the cheating/affair by themself. It's bad no matter how you slice it but if the DS tells the BS directly, it's better instead of them finding out on their own.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Liars lie. That's what they do. They lie because they like to lie. It's normal for them. It has little to do with covering something up. It could be about something totally unimportant.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Runs like Dog said:


> It has little to do with covering something up.


I disagree. When someone lies about cheating, they lie to cover up the cheating. It has everything to do with concealing the truth.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Yeah except that so many of the stories here portray people who aren't even trying to hide it. And they lie when their halfassed lameness gets caught.

Really honey? 3 hrs to get a can a tunafish and you came back with your clothes on inside out? Was there a tsnumami?


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## anonymous1978 (Dec 27, 2010)

jellybeans, I completely agree with you about the difference in impact between the BS "discovering" the infidelity or being told by the DS.

I feel that (and I know hindsight is always 20/20) I would not have such an intense emotional reaction nor would my reaction be drawn out for so long if I was not concerned with the all the possibilities of what may have happened that he is still lying about...

it is the betrayal and subsequent lack of trust that will be the primary reason for ending my relationship.


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## oaksthorne (Mar 4, 2011)

anonymous1978 said:


> jellybeans, I completely agree with you about the difference in impact between the BS "discovering" the infidelity or being told by the DS.
> 
> I feel that (and I know hindsight is always 20/20) I would not have such an intense emotional reaction nor would my reaction be drawn out for so long if I was not concerned with the all the possibilities of what may have happened that he is still lying about...
> 
> it is the betrayal and subsequent lack of trust that will be the primary reason for ending my relationship.


To this day I still struggle with the fact that everything had to be dragged out of him, and at first ( maybe still? ) it was inaccurate. A year and a half later she is still showing up, and I wonder why. He says that he is having nothing to do with her. I really want to believe him, and I try to, but he lied to me for so long that it's an uphill battle. It is hard enough for the BS to get beyond this assault on the soul, but when the DS keeps trying to cover up and distort, they are not believed when they actually do begin telling the truth. My H has made just about every mistake a DS can make and he wonders why R has been so difficult and long in coming.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

It’s not until trust is gone that you realise what a trust based relationship a marriage is. Wife has gone shopping, has she really? Husband is out playing golf, is he really? Every single minute they are away from us we trust they are doing the right things by us, but are they?

Then we begin to question everything. You love me? Do you really?

And then we start to look back on our marriage and we wonder what was true and authentic, what was real and what was deceits and a bunch of lies, what was unreal. And then we come to the conclusion that we’re never ever going to know what was real and what was lies throughout the whole of our marriage and then we have to come to terms with that.

We come to realise that we’ve been deluded, we’ve believed in things that are not real, so our life hasn’t been real. But they keep on lying and deceiving and we reach a point where we don’t believe a word that comes out of their mouth or a word they write down on paper unless we can independently verify it.

Then one day we wake up to it all and we become truly aware that we’re living with a person who has no credibility or integrity and they just don’t care about lying, it’s just a part of who they are and they’re never going to change. That’s when we decide to leave them as living any type of life is far superior to living a life with a liar.


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## Numb-badger (May 18, 2011)

If I'd have found out from a third party I would have grabbed my things and left that second. Even the kids would not have been able to convince me to talk to her.
When my wife burst into tears and told me what happened, she couldn't cope with the guilt and was willing to face the consequences. To find out from a 3rd party shows (to me at least) that they are NOT willing to face the consequences and are merely protecting their own arses and interests. JB is right, to find out from a 3rd is 200x worse. It is literally adding insult to injury.


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## reindeer (Mar 24, 2011)

I agree 100% that the lying part is awful, especially ifit has happened several times before. And i feel so humiliated after trying to cover up things , to make our marriage continue. even wanting to believe things that I knew an outsider would not, just because I could not be sure *and* foolishly I wanted to believe him. I know I will be ok I guess, but right now I am feeling what sort of person am I that he could value me so little to do this. My self worth is on the floor right now.


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## Numb-badger (May 18, 2011)

It's a very slow process Reindeer, but bit by bit you wil steadily put things back together for yourself.
Repair yourself and take your time. It's nearly 5 weeks from D-day for me and each week I'm a little more composed than the week before. Just a little mind you.


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## reindeer (Mar 24, 2011)

We have been separted for 5 weeks.I had big suspicions (conclusive to most people) so I asked him to leave. We had aranged after 2 weeeks apart to, meet weekly as we need to get along and wanted to. No prospect of reconcilliation. I wasthinking it would e nice,but if it was meant to be then it would happen-no engineering it. It was fairly brief meetings, but fine and enjoyable, also discussed our finances, arrangements etc. 

Was meant to meet this weekend, until I discovered he had been searching pvc leather trousers, and saving searches on e bay. i then went and found his car outside OW house 5.30 in mornig. Saw him confronted him, he has still denied it. Now I am so sad, all the work I had done on myself the last few weeks seems wasted as I feel back to square one, I have no good feeling towards him, have cut all contact with so many things unanswered, I have to start going through this whole process all over again.

I am glad to hear you are slowly feeling better.


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## Numb-badger (May 18, 2011)

Sorry to hear that, our wishes are with you Reindeer


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

AFEH said:


> It’s not until trust is gone that you realise what a trust based relationship a marriage is. Wife has gone shopping, has she really? Husband is out playing golf, is he really? Every single minute they are away from us we trust they are doing the right things by us, but are they?
> 
> Then we begin to question everything. You love me? Do you really?
> 
> ...


Wow. What a beautiful post. And it's spot on.


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## anonymous1978 (Dec 27, 2010)

I agree that AFEH's post explains it perfectly. The statement that resonates with me most is "so our life hasn't been real."

What is so difficult for me to understand is that he seriously CANNOT grasp that the loss of trust is the biggest issue. He still just keeps explaining that I have not made progress toward healing because I am not focused on the "minor infidelities" that actually happened but I am worried about all of these things that may have happened but are still being lied about.

he just doesn't understand how long-term betrayal by the person you've committed your life to affects your perception...


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

anonymous1978 said:


> I agree that AFEH's post explains it perfectly. The statement that resonates with me most is "so our life hasn't been real."
> 
> What is so difficult for me to understand is that he seriously CANNOT grasp that the loss of trust is the biggest issue. He still just keeps explaining that I have not made progress toward healing because I am not focused on the "minor infidelities" that actually happened but I am worried about all of these things that may have happened but are still being lied about.
> 
> he just doesn't understand how long-term betrayal by the person you've committed your life to affects your perception...


I think it all comes down what value a person places on their personal credibility and integrity. As to whether a person has been taught or has learned through experience that “honesty truly is the best policy”.

Take me for example. I spent a lot of my life as a sales person, big ticket stuff, multi million dollars. Basically at the outset I was selling a concept, an ideal a dream. And it would take some 12 months to put that dream into practical use and another12 months to make the dream a reality and see if it’s really working. If I’d ever been deceitful or told lies from the outset I’d never have got the multi-million dollar orders, I never would have got them. I always told the truth and I always, 100% got benefit from telling the truth. I had gold plated personal credibility and integrity and what’s more people knew that for a fact.

But why do people deceive and lie? Especially when they’ve been “caught”? There must be reasons for it. I think one of the reasons is because they are unforgiving people. I think if you had done the same things he did, he would never ever forgive you. So he continues to lie to you. He cannot possibly imagine that all you want is the truth and that you have the capacity within you to forgive him. He just cannot imagine that. So I think he thinks that by being truthful with you, you will kick him out and so he continues to lie.

Other reasons why he continues to lie could of course be because he is either a pathological, compulsive or habitual liar.

But at the end of the day does it really matter “why” he lies? Do the reasons really matter? Sometimes we can look for reasons and that becomes more important, that is the “why” becomes more important than the “what”. For me I decided I could not live with a liar and I dropped everything else my wife provided for me because truth is of such fundamental importance to me.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

AFEH said:


> I think if you had done the same things he did, he would never ever forgive you. So he continues to lie to you. He cannot possibly imagine that all you want is the truth and that you have the capacity within you to forgive him. He just cannot imagine that. So I think he thinks that by being truthful with you, you will kick him out and so he continues to lie.


This resonates with me. In my situation, we both cheated and confessed to eachother. I forgave him and one day he told me he would never forgive me for what I did. I had to accept that.



AFEH said:


> But at the end of the day does it really matter “why” he lies? Do the reasons really matter?


The "why" never matters. It's irrelevant. Because it changes nothing. The fact is, it was done and nothing will undo it.


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## DoveInTheMud (May 25, 2011)

When people lie to you, they are not 'real' with you. Do you want to live in reality or in a fairy take, a make-believe world?
Even if we choose the make-believe world, it does not change the fact that we ARE in the real world.
If you don't face reality, it'll come biting you in the rear, sooner or later.

I know you have invested a lot in a 7 year relationship with this man, but if he does not even understand how badly he is hurting you, he's not likely to change. 

Everybody has different views on marriage, but it does not change that you both are not legally bound together, and it sounds like you don't have children. 

My advice is to think about what changes do you feel you would need to see in him to have any assurance that he truly wants and WILL change his lying and hiding.

If he can't or won't, I'd say cut your losses. Loosing 7 years of your life on this man is better than ongoing agony and pain and then revisiting the same decision after having invested even more time.


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## anonymous1978 (Dec 27, 2010)

i sincerely appreciate the advice...he continues to show me that he cannot/will not change.

i know what I need to do, but it is so much easier said than done...


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