# Can't touch her if it's not sex



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

When my wife and I were still living together that's what she pretty much said to me - that I shouldn't even touch her and should leave her alone if I wasn't interested in sex. Granted, she's taken it back since seperation but...

Tell me ladies, when your husband flirts/teases/romances you - do you expect sex? And let's say when it turns out he was just mucking around, fun-flirting, and/or just being nice... would you get angry/disappointed/annoyed? Would you feel led on? Just curious... just thinking outloud and reflecting.

I'm curious if I'm as much a culprit in her frustration when it comes to my style and playful habits.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

My wife can always tell when I want sex. My chest rises and falls.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Lol

Unfortunately for my wife I'm not that easy to get going, I like the buildup too much...


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> When my wife and I were still living together that's what she pretty much said to me - that I shouldn't even touch her and should leave her alone if I wasn't interested in sex. Granted, she's taken it back since seperation but...
> 
> *Tell me ladies, when your husband flirts/teases/romances you - do you expect sex? And let's say when it turns out he was just mucking around, fun-flirting, and/or just being nice... would you get angry/disappointed/annoyed? Would you feel led on? J*ust curious... just thinking outloud and reflecting.
> 
> I'm curious if I'm as much a culprit in her frustration when it comes to my style and playful habits.


No. And I am sure you know this is not a balanced dynamic. 
If a couple cannot play and touch without a tantrum by one over no sex then that is an issue. 

SO and I are daily rabbits but we can play fight, touch, flirt and all that without a demand for sex from either. This is being connected and enjoying each others company. We are both very touchy, feely people, wow if we were to have sex each time we were mucking around I would no longer be able to walk.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Thanks, now I don't feel so evil lol

I just hope my wife is coming to understand this, she is so far but I can't tell if she's just faking it till she makes it or if she's truly come to appreciate physical touch and flirts and mucking around without tying it to sex.


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

Is she is any counselling RD?


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Yes she is, her own initiative really. She's better now, I'm just concerned about MY part to play in all this I guess. As this is our last shot at this I do want to try to cover all the angles before we're ready to move back together.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

I think it's healthy to have the sort of affection/flirting that doesn't lead to sex in a relationship. I actually think that it's more common for men to get bent out of shape if it doesn't turn into sex than for women.

In your particular case, though, you should be careful because your W has a special issue with sex. Ideally, you would want to get her to the point where she's happy for all types of playing and affection. Also ideally, you'd be able to discuss this with her (?).


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Yeah, I guess we'll have open up this discussion in more depth eventually. Due to the sensitive nature of sex at present as our marriage was pretty much damaged due to it and the addiction to it, it's something I'm very careful with when it comes to open discussions.

I don't know when we should though. Guess when my gut tells me it's time? Heh


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

This is just another problem/issue you two have as a couple to add to the list of problems you already have. Are you sure you want to stick around with her? Is it worth it? I can't see how a large majority of your relationship could ever be considered "healthy". 

Personally, I wouldn't expect sex just from my husband being flirtatious with me. We are very touchy and love to tease each other from time to time. There is no reason to throw a fit just because sex did not follow a mucking around.


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## curlysue321 (Jul 30, 2012)

All interaction with my husband is welcome and not just interactions that lead to sex. I love it when he jokes with me, holds my hand, teases me. Any touch is welcome.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Thanks guys, I feel alot better now about it, looks like I don't have to feel guilty over being touchy feely no more.

@Anonymous

Well, the minute we stop working as a team - then fk it.

But for now, we're seeing how far we can get. We're seeing our marriage through the end for good or ill, if it's impossible to reconcile then we'll go our seperate ways but we'll always be friends. But we need this last shot.


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

There is no glamour in divorce RD, if you think you guys can make it work then good on you for giving it your all.

One thing that does stand out in your posts is that you seem to often question yourself even when it comes to pretty basic concepts such as the one this thread is about. Do you really not know what is normal behaviour or interactions? Why do you question your behaviour so much and not that of your wifes?
Common sense says that it is not normal for all contact to have to lead to sex or a tantrum will be throw. Can you see this or do you feel so undermined that you cannot see common sense?


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

It's just that my wife has messed up my impressions of what is normal and what isn't over the last four years. So I don't even know what a marriage is even meant to look like so I ask stupid questions because quite frankly I'm very confused. In this case, I'm ruling out things that I can change and things that I don't have to change.

Which complaints/demands are reasonable/fair, and which is just utter BS and unreasonable. Like this one. My wife has hence taken it back but I wanted to examine if I have a part to play in this as well, hence the thread.

Better to ask stupid questions and look like a fool, then to not ask the question and become the fool in my opinion. I want to cover all the angles.


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

I'm sorry if you thought I meant you were asking stupid questions, I didn't mean that. Just asking if you know that some of these things are common sense or if you really thought the problem lay with you. 
As they say, there is no such thing as a silly question and I really do get the second guessing yourself thing.

Just don't take the blame for things that are not your doing. Take the blame for the things that are your doing. The issue in this thread is not yours, your wife needs to work out this boundary.


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

I think a lot of this comes from prior experience and the history in your relationship. If you have a lot of affection and physical contact without always leading to sex, this isn't teasing or cruelty it's just a part of the intimacy of the relationship. I love it when my husband comes up behind me and hugs me, rubs my shoulder or grabs my butt. I don't assume it has to lead to sex - but I don't object if it does!

I believe your posts indicate your wife has some issues in her past which create a physical contact = sex only path which will only be helped with serious counseling, mindset change and practice.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

@Holland

Thanks Holland, I guess I am relieved that I don't have to lose my natural flirty and playful side in fear of "leading her on". What she said really cut me I guess, and led to "that night"

@TCSRedhead

That makes sense, for four years it's been like this and I guess I didn't make it any easier for her to develop a healthier understanding of love and affection by giving in to her all the time. At least now we have boundaries despite the cost, looks like a long road ahead really. Old habits die hard.


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

RD I like to think of the flirty stuff, the fun playing as all day foreplay. That is not to say it leads to sex or is about sex at the time but what it does is build a solid connection between a couple, that in turn helps to create a healthy sex life.


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

I don't think divorce is great at all, but your relationship is so toxic that sometimes it's better to walk away. If you are not good for each other and only bring one another down, I don't see the point in staying and trying to work on it. You have one post after another about all of the problems you have and it hasn't gotten better. You don't even like that she is of another race, with not liking to stand out as an interracial couple. There is nothing she(or you) can do about that. Some relationships just are not meant to be. 

There is nothing wrong with being physical and playful without it leading to sex, but your wife has made you feel it is. It's not healthy.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

What do you expect me to do? She's been doing everything right by me and working with me through this. This is an excellent opportunity for us, if I give up on us now I know I will regret it forever.

As for race I'm OVER it. Her people won't be able to get along with mine, sure, that's fine, who cares. We still get stares, but fine, who cares! We're still two human beings who found each other, and for the record, I still love her, especially now since we've both finally stopped rocking the boat.

If I walk out of this marriage I want to know I gave it my best shot, and my wife has given me an opportunity to make things right and has also taken up the opportunity to work on her own issues. Many of the issues we had are still present but I don't expect overnight changes and if anything I'm glad that we're making ALOT more progress then what little progress we had when we were living together.

If she wasn't so serious, or if she shows me that she no longer really cares then sure, I can walk knowing I've done my best. But when someone is THAT in your face that she loves you, and when you know you feel it too, despite the toxicity of the marriage, when you're working together hand in hand to fix it, how can one just suddenly abandon the field and give up?

No, we're in this together now (finally really - after 5 years), I ain't going to quit while she ain't going to quit.


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## Serenity_Prayer (Oct 31, 2012)

Good luck to you. You have a better chance of fixing things than some of us. I had to carry all the burden in my marriage, and couldn't fix the toxicity or lack of passion on my own, so I ended it. My STBX was the same way, only showed any affection when it was time for sex, then could go platonic for days and days. I can't wait to be with a man who can flirt and show more than roommate-like affection on a regular basis.


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## goodwife4 (Jan 7, 2013)

before my hubby EA admission we used to touch each other all the time, a pat on the bottom or pinch as we walked past each other or a kiss, sometimes i would " accidently "( on purpose) touch the front of his jeans and say oh i am sorry then laugh, he loved it.

what i didnt like was that the moment i got into bed most nights within seconds my hubby would stick his hand down my pants, no kissing no gentle rubbing, no foreplay just lets have sex 

then complained that i didnt make moves on him ehough ??
i felt like he only wanted sex from me and even though before we did it 2 to 3 times a week he always wanted more 

made me feel like he only touched me because he wanted sex, nothing else. like a piece of meat


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