# I have been cold, neglectful, and now my wife needs space



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

Hi all, just looking for some advice.

My wife and I are in our mid 20s, been together for approx 7-8 years and married for nearly 1 year. She recently told me she wasnt happy and just wanted to go out with her friends and have fun while I figure out what I want. She was in another state at the time and my first instinct overcame me and I flipped out on her, mainly through fear and pain. 

The fear set in that since I had been so emotionally unavailable to her that there may be someone else. I dont think she would go out to cheat on me as such, but more that someone may have stumbled in to her life and made her smile again. So in the peak of my fears I asked if there was anyone else and she said no and was furious that I would even consider it.

The lead up to this was all my fault. I have been cold and isolated myself from her for a long time now, due to my own issues and insecurities. I have not done any work around the house, or the yard, or wanted to go out much etc. She has her own issues also, loved ones in her life have passed away and she is still dealing with it, though she is seeing a counsellor about it. Also she is busy with work/study. I know now how much she needed me to lighten the load and I wasnt there for her.

I know more than ever we need each other to lean on for support but right now she has told me just to leave her alone and give her the space she needs to decide what she wants. Of course I was panic stricken and just wanted to express how I feel, so I bought her flowers the next day and wrote a short loving note on them, tried talking to her and txting her a few times things like 'hope your having a good day, i love you' etc etc. Of course I got no replies and when I try talking to her she says if I keep pushing and dont give her space then she will end it right now, that she already has thoughts of ending it but is trying to talk herself out of it.

She is quite busy with work and study, and then spends all of her time going out to bbqs, clubs, etc. with friends. I assume this is part of getting the space that she cant really get at home with me sitting down the other end of the house.

The first 4-5 days I was a real mess randomly bursting in to tears when I thought I was just getting a hold of myself so I took some time off work and got stuck in around the house/yard, signed up to a gym. It has been about a week now since it boiled over and with all the time to reflect on myself Im actually in a much better mental state overall. I have never had such a wake up call in all my life but I think it may be too late. Her main way of coping with pain in her life is to shut out and cut off the people involved and just move on. I think she knows this is not the healthy way to cope with things but I also know how her overall unhappiness may overrule everything.

I read somewhere about the '180' and although I do not agree with it entirely in this case (since my distance caused it) I did take some good points away from it about self improvement etc.

I have read so many posts on various forums and have found some info to make me understand some of this but would like to hear some peoples oppinions. I just want her to be happy again. I know if given the chance I can make our lives as good as they can be. I love her more than anything in the world and I know she still loves me too but is so hurt/angry/scared that she may not let me back in.

Im back at work now and I work late so at least she can have the space to herself in the evenings and I wont bother her when I come home. I know the best case scenario now is for her just to calm down a bit and decide that if we put the work in that we can survive this because i know we are stronger than this, though the reality is that I think she will realise that with all this space and going out that she can be completely happy without me.

I am ready to give her complete space but my instincts keep telling me to leave a note or a small reminder around the house to make her remember what we have, even though its been screwed up for a while.

I may have rambled a bit through this post but everything is just pouring out of me. To recap, I see that everything that has happened has been my doing even though unintentional. Hoping that we can talk and convince her to see a MC together. 

If anyone can give me any tips to help her and help us it would be much appreciated.


----------



## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> Hi all, just looking for some advice.
> 
> My wife and I are in our mid 20s, been together for approx 7-8 years and married for nearly 1 year. She recently told me she wasnt happy and just wanted to go out with her friends and have fun while I figure out what I want. She was in another state at the time and my first instinct overcame me and I flipped out on her, mainly through fear and pain.
> 
> ...


Hi Broken and welcome.

First of all, it is not all your fault that this has happened. You even admit that she has some issues of her own, and that she is working and studying on top of them. She is seeing a counsellor, which is good. What about you? Are you dealing with whatever was making you cold and neglectful? 

Please don't leave text her or her notes, etc. She has made it clear that she wants space. Be respectful and give her that. Focus on yourself. Don't sit at the other end of the house. Go out with your friends. Don't let her cake walk, that is, live like a single woman knowing she has you to fall back on as planB. You deserve better than that.

Lastly, don't try to tell her, rather show her that you have changed.

Good luck.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

my plan is exactly that. It took me a few days and a lot of thinking to accept that i dont have any input in her decision. The only thing i can do now is to show her how much of a wake up call this is for me and exactly what she will be giving up. And if she still decides that she doesnt want to make it work at least i will be heading in the right direction for myself.

I havent ever talked to anyone about my own issues, would have many times liked to ask her for help or just to listen but she carries so much weight on her shoulders already. This is the first time i have ever really had to stare myself in the face and already i know i have grown from it.

So many things i would like to say to her but i know right now she wont care. Just have to keep on the right path and hope she wants to stick around. 

Just wish there was a way to shed the anxiety of waiting around for her decision.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

btw, in the same discussion as telling me she needed space, she also said she was not going to be a push over anymore and she was going to do whatever she wants whenever she wants to. I said i didnt understand because ive always encouraged her to go out and i have never stopped her doing anything at all. This doesnt sound like her and makes me think someone has been in her ear saying things like this, or maybe shes just blowing off steam. Any thoughts?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## TBT (Dec 20, 2011)

brokenman2012 said:


> she was going to do whatever she wants whenever she wants to. _Posted via Mobile Device_


Someone could be whispering in her ear,and even though they are just words in a post I can almost picture a petulant child saying something like that,no offense intended.Not very realistic in marriage as you both bring your own needs and expectations to the relationship.People need to compromise in marriage for sure,but there should be some firm boundaries so that you're on the same page in ensuring your marriage stays strong and healthy.Though your wife may not be having an affair now,her unhappiness in your marriage and her gravitating to the fun,single lifestyle can place her on the so-called "slippery slope" that leads to an EA and/or a PA.You may find the book "His Needs,Her Needs" helpful.Written by Dr.W.Harley and you can find more information on the marriagebuilders website.It basically deals with building a strong and healthy marriage.Hope you find the help you need here.Take care.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

well all i can do for now is keep improving on myself and my quality of life and hopefully she agrees to give it another shot.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

> I am ready to give her complete space but my instincts keep telling me to leave a note or a small reminder around the house to make her remember what we have, even though its been screwed up for a while.


Yeah, DON'T LISTEN TO THOSE INSTINCTS...the same ones that caused you to get into this mess in the first place (from YOUR perspective, she caused her own share of the mess as well.)




> leave a note or a small reminder around the house to make her remember what we have


DON'T DO THIS! I understand your thinking, but as a woman I have to say WE HATE THIS! It is PUSHY!! It is making it (once more) ALL ABOUT YOU! 'Leave me alone' means 'LEAVE ME ALONE.' 



> make her remember what we have


Do you HONESTLY think she doesn't remember what you had? If she didn't remember the good times, then you can be sure she would have RUN OUT OF THIS MARRIAGE a long time ago! The only thing keeping her "in" right now is remembering what you USED to have and wondering if THAT (and the possibility of rekindling it) will be enough to keep her going in the future. Rest assured, she HASN'T forgotten -- thus, her indecisiveness.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

Thanks for your input. I wont be leaving any more notes/gifts etc around the house I was just mentioning that its a recurring feeling. She made it quite clear when i bought her the flowers that even though they were nice that it was a form of smothering and just needs to be left alone. I have never been pushy or controlling in the slightest with her and this is definately not the time to become that kind of person.

your third point brings me a great deal of comfort, I agree with you that if she didnt remember the good times we had that she would have already told me that we're done. 

She has been out with friends the whole weekend and with the few words exchanged when i got home from work (just hi basically) i can tell she still sounds quite down in spirit but not as angry as she has been. maybe she will be ready to have an actual conversation with me in the not too distant future, but I wont be forcing that out of her. she will talk to me when she is ready.

thanks a lot for your input, its comforting and insightful to get a females perspective.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

just a quick one, wondering if I should get rid of the flowers i bought, they are still where i left them. but would she take this as a negative sign or more that i have backed off?

any thoughts?

thanks again for all the feedback


----------



## bribrius (Jun 29, 2012)

so your wife tells you not to leave notes, or flowers, and not to talk to her.

And this is any better than what you were doing?

And while you are sitting there moping around, "waiting her decision" she is going out clubbing? And possibly going to someone else anyway? If she isnt getting the emotional support from you SHE IS GETTING IT FROM SOMEWHERE ELSE. Which will lead to , if not already, a physical affair.

My man. say it just isnt so. That you are really doing this?

Do yourself a favor, get your wife back under control. Give her a flat out ultimatum. Come back to marriage reality, or file. Give her those choices.
i think just on the grounds she doesnt want you to give her flowers it is enough for a ultimatum. Tell her you need a woman with you that you can have sex with and talk to and she just isnt quite cutting it.
why are you dealing with this again, why?????
she is being no better than what you did, in fact probably worse.


----------



## bribrius (Jun 29, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> just a quick one, wondering if I should get rid of the flowers i bought, they are still where i left them. but would she take this as a negative sign or more that i have backed off?
> 
> any thoughts?
> 
> thanks again for all the feedback


yeah, i got some thoughts. But they involve telling her where she can put the flowers.......


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

no im not just sitting around, did for a few days just feeling pretty busted up but now going out etc. I cant jut sit around and wait while she lives a single girls lifestyle so it might be time to give her at least a time frame. Something makes me quite sure she has made at least an emotional connection somewhere else and im not at all comfortable with it
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

just an update. seems there is much more to the picture than i was allowed to know until now. At this point she has been consumed by her OCD and there is absolutely nothing i can do to help other than just stay out of her way and leave her be.

I do appreciate everyones feedback and comments, not really sure where our relationship is heading but my only priority at the moment is her health.


----------



## Dewayne76 (Sep 26, 2012)

Broken, please keep in touch! let us know how things are going. Get on the forums and talk, read... sometimes it helps... sometimes it helps a LOT. 

Hope things get better for you. 

Dewayne


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

ill keep back with any update, im really at a loss. bottom line is she wants space to think, so ill give her the space. best case scenario here is that she agrees to see a counsellor together i think. but things are leaning more toward an actual separation at the moment


----------



## Schofield25 (Oct 10, 2012)

Any thoughts?


----------



## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

What do you mean she is consumed by her OCD? Is she getting help for it?


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

yes she is getting help for it. honestly i am at my wits end and tired of everything. right now she is out for dinner and drinks with friends while i have to top up the mortgage account which she has dipped in to so that she can have a fun night then come home and ignore me.

im cutting her off as of right now.


----------



## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> yes she is getting help for it. honestly i am at my wits end and tired of everything. right now she is out for dinner and drinks with friends while i have to top up the mortgage account which she has dipped in to so that she can have a fun night then come home and ignore me.
> 
> im cutting her off as of right now.


You might want to protect yourself and separate all your finances. This would also send a message to her that a) what she is doing has consequences; b) this is serious; c) she can't have her cake and eat it too and d) you may not be around should she decide that plan B (you) are a better deal than plan A (party time).


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

my thoughts exactly. i will be taking over full control of my finances and limiting her control over the joint finance (mortgage). i will still be taking a week away, just as much for myself as it is for her. that will give her nearly 2 weeks by herself to think and if she hasnt made a decision by then i will be preparing our house to sell and that will at least put some time frame on it, although realistically it may take months to sell there will be a deadline in place that she cannot ignore.

i am completely confused now as to whether it is our relationship or her own issues or both that are driving her to need space and time to think. all i know at this point is that i cant just hang around on the end of a string waiting for her to decide if she still loves me and wants to make it work. 

i have told her i am willing to do whatever it takes to get us back on track and my actions around home demonstrate that. i have told her if she needs someone to talk to i am only a phone call away and ill always answer. she seems completely uninterested.

even though i have been a crappy husband most of the time i still have more respect for myself than that and need to at least start preparing to move on with my life and its her decision if she wants to be a part of it.

i think i can safely say i have experienced every emotion related to this type of event and now completely drained and working purely on myself from now on.

all the comments on my thread are greatly appreciated and have helped me a great deal during this so thank you very much to everyone.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

well today it boiled over. i questioned her as to why she was using our mortgage account as a daily spending account and that i would not be putting any extra funds in there just so she could run around pretending shes single and then come home and stick her hand out for more money just so she could go on ignoring me.

she of course called it mistrust but at this point i am only protecting the $250,000 investment that used to be home. she said that she had had enough and it was over and i said its entirely your choice. i told her i how much i loved her and how i have given her every chance to make it right again but i cant make a marriage work on my own, its a partnership.

it has been weeks of her partying and clubbing with anyone else but me while she dangles me on the end of a string and i am not waiting around anymore. its time to legitimately move on with my life and it seems she has no interest in coming along.

i will post with the updates of our 'final' discussion today but i simply could not be bothered waiting around for someone to decide if they still love me and willing to put in any effort.


----------



## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> well today it boiled over. i questioned her as to why she was using our mortgage account as a daily spending account and that i would not be putting any extra funds in there just so she could run around pretending shes single and then come home and stick her hand out for more money just so she could go on ignoring me.
> 
> she of course called it mistrust but at this point i am only protecting the $250,000 investment that used to be home. she said that she had had enough and it was over and i said its entirely your choice. i told her i how much i loved her and how i have given her every chance to make it right again but i cant make a marriage work on my own, its a partnership.
> 
> ...


I'm sorry, Broken. But you're right, it seems like it is time to move on. 

Speak to a lawyer and find out what your rights are. Keep coming here for support. And, most of all, take care of yourself.


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Late to the party.

I have no understanding of the OCD thing and how it affects things, but if I ignore that everything else you have said looks reasonably simple. Husband is distant, wife starts to check out of marriage, husband responds by seeking to cut access to what is actually a joint asset.

I don't see mention of how you had the conversation. We're you attacking? Was it a fight? Or a firm but reasonable discussion? 

I would be trying to say to her, that both of you need to lift your game in the marriage and therefore that you need counselling. You are giving up awfully easy.

You hurt her by your own admission. She is supposed to forget that in an instant? She is in counselling for OCD and you say it has bearing on the problem, yet that is all supposed to go away?

When my wife had her affair it took about six months to get her to end it, and years to rebuild the marriage. Based on what you have told us, if you love her I would actually advise you to think and try a bit more and seek help before ending it. And you can't make her try but you should tell her you want to.

Or is there more significant detail you haven't told us? What am I missing?

Edit : The other thing is to say..while there's not enough info to be definite, what is happening to you may be pretty text book. Together seven or eight years, and at an age where your wife's hormones are ramping up. That was my wife. She told me everything wrong with the marriage was my fault, as she went out with her toxic friends including OM. It hurts bad. But here it is 22 years later we are still together.

So please, post more detail and let's see if you don't have more options than what you are currently doing.


----------



## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

After reading Wazza's post, I realized that I may have been too hasty in encouraging you to move on. He is absolutely right. Give it everything you've got before you throw in the towel. 

The only thing that worries me is that she is cake eating. She's out partying with her friends like a single person, but has none of the drawbacks of being single. Perhaps she should be paying rent, hydro, phone in her own place so that she gets a better taste of what life will be like if she continues. Not that she should stay with you simply to avoid all that, but it would show her that what she is doing to the marriage is serious and possibly permanent. 

I'm wondering how she sees you right now. You are enabling her to walk all over you. Let her know that, if she continues with her single lifestyle, she will be looking for somewhere else to live. But, follow Wazza's advice first. Try again to let her know that you love her and want to try. Suggest MC. If she still treats you the way she has been, one of you needs to find somewhere else to live. That doesn't mean its over. Perhaps absence will make the heart grow fonder.

Thanks, for the wake up call, Wazza 

By the way, Broken, I have OCD and it does not affect my marriage in any way. If your wife's is that serious, she needs more than just therapy. She needs meds. OCD is a neurological condition. Do you know what type of therapy she is getting? Cognitive behavior therapy, combined with meds, may help, but talk-based 'Freudian-type' therapy won't have much effect. 

Its also possible there is more going on than just OCD. There is a high incidence of comorbidity with other conditions such as depression. In your wife's case, have you considered that her behavior could be manic and that she could possibly be bi-polar?


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

hi wazza.
im not actually cutting any of her access to the joint asset. my action here is to stop my weekly transfer to the account and just do it as a lump sum monthly so there is not a big chunk of money sitting there for her to spend freely week by week. she has her own job and can manage her own finances.

i was calm in the conversation about it. i asked her why i needed to put so much money in there again and she said it was in case she needed anything throughout the week. i told her that i from the start it was never supposed to be a daily spending account, simply a joint account for our mortgage and a few direct payments and that i had transferred enough money in there just to make the mortgage payment. this is when she lost her temper saying how i told her if she needed anything to just ask, which i did say but after some thinking and seeing exactly where all the money was going i have since changed my mind.

i have told her i am willing to do whatever it takes to fix this but until she gives me some sign of hope im not going to support her living the single life.

frostflower,
i think your right and she is cake eating. our arrangement has always been that i pay the mortgage and she picks up the rest of the bills around the house.

i think she does have the feeling that she can do whatever she likes then come home at the last minute if she changes her mind. i strongly feel she has already checked out and has no intention of putting any effort in, if she did then i would at least have seen a glimmer of hope and i would hang in there.

i have a few places to stay if things get too bad around here but im not going to play that card until i have to.

i will be having a conversation with her tonight and tell her she can have it the way she wants it. if she wants the single lifestyle she can do it all by herself and i wont be supporting her in any way on that venture. i will again tell her how much i love her and how i would do anything to fix this but i cant fix a marriage all by myself so the ball is in her court.


----------



## zookeeper (Oct 2, 2012)

Wazza said:


> She told me everything wrong with the marriage was my fault, as she went out with her toxic friends including OM.


This can't be stressed enough. Your wife has been hurt and is probably pretty vulnerable right now. She probably trusts her friends more than you. If they are sowing the seeds of discontent, you may not stand a chance.

I am amazed at how some so-called "friends" like to stir things up. My wife has had a few. Miserable women who are clearly unhappy in their lives. They can't stand to see someone else happy and do their best to be a negative influence. Fortunately for me, my wife has become better at identifying "frienemies" and will cut contact once they show their hands. If your wife has friends whispering in her ear about how bad you are, ghow she deserves better, she should do this, that and the other thing...you may very well have to proceed with your plan B.

Good luck with your struggle.


----------



## SCondeck (Oct 5, 2012)

Zookeeper is absolutely right about "The friends". My wife takes her marriage advice from 22 yr old recent college grads who sleep with guys whos names they don't know in sheds (no joke). These lovely ladies plus a bitter, man-hating mother plus counselors who are paid to say "you should just be happy" have definately stacked the odds against me. However, it's the wife's choice to listen to them over her husband so this is in no way an excuse for her behavior.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

im pretty sure i have the same situation. over the past months she has spent an increasing amout of time with new friends from work. then she tells me how all her friends keep telling her 'if your not happy just pick up and leave'. I do not know these new friends of hers but as we grew up around all the same people i know that the friends we have in common would not be saying such black and white things.

its her choice if she wants to listen to her friends instead of doing what she wants to do. 

Right now i am in the process of cutting my losses and in the event that she decides that she wants to try to make it work i honestly dont know what i would do. all of this is not normal and definately not healthy for any relationship.


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Have a read of this and see if you can recognise your situation in it. If so, is it worth sharing it with your wife?

Infidelity, Cheating Wives - Women's Infidelity


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

had a good read through it twice. seems very insightful and even more accurate. even if shes not cheating (which i do really have my suspicions about) just the thought of it will make it even easier for me letting her go.


----------



## SCondeck (Oct 5, 2012)

My wife shows all the signs from that infidelity link. Best of luck to her and the poor fella she's latched onto.


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> had a good read through it twice. seems very insightful and even more accurate. even if shes not cheating (which i do really have my suspicions about) just the thought of it will make it even easier for me letting her go.


Well ok if that is your choice.

Or share it with her and give her a chance to understand the road she's heading down and maybe pull back before it is too late.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

until she actually wants to talk i wont be sharing any more feelings or thoughts with her. any time i tell her we need to have a chat i get 'why? i couldnt be bothered having another conversation that goes round in circles'. its actually her that steers the conversation around in circles over the same old topics, so until she has something to say im not initiating and more of our little chats.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

just an update on the situation, appreciate any feedback.

she continues to go out most nights of the week. when she returns home she seems happy and may even initiate a small conversation. however, this quickly turns in to the same short angry tone that has become all too familiar.

i am still waiting to get nearly $2000 that she owes me since she spent this months mortgage payment on partying and whatever. so at the moment i am just holding out for that before i cut financial ties.

another point: she still wears her wedding ring all the time (that i know of) but in my opinion it is just to stop people asking questions and because she likes the rings too i suppose. any thoughts on this?

the only communication i have been initiating is about when i am going to get my money back, which she has acknowledged as a loan and is intending to pay back but gets angry when i keep at her about it.

due to some rough family issues in her life i have not had the conversation about how we are going to proceed from here, and i think i will wait until she has paid back my money since i dont want her holding it as a ransom against me. picking up the financial burden behind her to make the mortgage payment has put me significantly behind in my budget.

does anyone have any thoughts on all of this?


----------



## Frostflower (Jul 22, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> ill keep back with any update, im really at a loss. bottom line is she wants space to think, so ill give her the space. best case scenario here is that she agrees to see a counsellor together i think. but things are leaning more toward an actual separation at the moment


Right now your wife has it pretty good. She is enjoying the single living in a house partially paid for by you. She has had, and probably believes she will continue to have, access to a pot of money. She has you to talk to or ignore as she pleases.

I'm glad to hear you will dealing with the finances. But how long will go on living under the same roof and allowing her to treat you like a doormat? You can't even effectively enact the 180 as the two of you are in such close proximity. If the $2000 is that important, get her to sign an IOU.

I'm not trying to push you toward separation, just asking a question I think you need to consider


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

update:

we finally had a bit of a talk last night. i was asking her when i am going to receive my money since she was not sticking to the timeline she had originally given me. she then started saying that i didnt deserve it back after all the money she has spent on me over the years. i said if since she had acknowledged it as a loan and given me a timeframe in which i would receive it back that i wouldnt be putting any money toward the mortgage until i received what was owed to me (which is approx 1 full month mortgage payment) or she could pay the mortgage this month. she also stated that her original plan was to pay me back in cash withdrawn from the mortgage account that i had put in there! and was quite unhappy that i had stopped putting any money into the account.

after some back and forth i asked her what we are going to do from here. she said she will make a list of everything we own and we can decide who takes what. i said that to get divorced we will need a certificate from a MC stating that there is no hope of getting back together, this is a legal requirement since we have been married for less that 2 years. she said she would not be talking to a MC and we would remain separated for 12 months and then file. im not comfortable with this at all, if she really wants out then i want to do it promptly and get it all over with without this hanging over my head for another year.

she says she doesnt want a family or anyone else in her life and just wants to do whatever she wants whenever she wants and answer to no one.

personally i think she is just angry and is pushing everything away and taking the easy way out. she has never been good at dealing with any major problem in life and this is no different.

so im left wondering why: 
1) she will not initiate divorce for at least another year.

2) she still wears her rings and sees no problem with it.

3) she is angry that i am not supporting her financially anymore since she wants nothing from anyone.

4) she will not talk about how we ended up in this position or why she never discussed any of her feelings about it until it was too late. she had these thoughts for a while apparently.

5) she can just throw everything from our past and our future away like its nothing.

some female feedback would be greatly appreciated, though i will take all the info i can get from anyone right now.


----------



## HiRoad (Oct 22, 2012)

Brokeman I am going through a similar situation my W is 30, we marriead when she was 24. She has her "frenemies" talking to her on a daily basis, they are all single and 1 just called of her wedding incidently beofre my W filed for D. 

IMO you need to take care of you, I know you read this alot on this forum, but it really works. Start to go out, as hard as it may be, do it. It shows you not co-dependent on her. Also, make yourself attractive to the market. This will make her see what she is missing. 

Myself, i used to work out alot before i got married, i gained some marriage weight over the last 4yrs. i have dropped almost 20lbs in a a month. The more i take care of myself the more she notices. I know she is extremely attrated to me. My plan is that if i am happy, successful, physically fit, and independent it will make it very hard for her to go through w/ the D. 

I hope this helps. 

Good luck.


----------



## deejov (Sep 24, 2011)

brokenman2012 said:


> update:
> 
> we finally had a bit of a talk last night. i was asking her when i am going to receive my money since she was not sticking to the timeline she had originally given me. she then started saying that i didnt deserve it back after all the money she has spent on me over the years. i said if since she had acknowledged it as a loan and given me a timeframe in which i would receive it back that i wouldnt be putting any money toward the mortgage until i received what was owed to me (which is approx 1 full month mortgage payment) or she could pay the mortgage this month. she also stated that her original plan was to pay me back in cash withdrawn from the mortgage account that i had put in there! and was quite unhappy that i had stopped putting any money into the account.
> 
> ...


I"m so sorry she has done this.
IMO, she maybe does owe you some respect here.

Anger? Comes from resentment. She seems to be really pissed about how you have behaved in the past. Getting back at you.

That doesn't change an important part. She's decided to end the marriage instead of going to counselling, and she is NOT giving you the opportunity to work on your part in the relationship. She's playing "done".

I know that might be hard to hear, I'm sorry.

However, since she wants out, she gets to write up a separation agreement, figure it all out, and she can move out and live her single life. 

She is being disrepectful of your relationship, which is NOT yet over. 

Or... she can get over her anger and come to the table and work on both the marriage, and herself.

Why do people do this? Because sometimes they realise they have a part in it too. And they are too afraid to do the work they should do to tidy up their own mess.

Fixing this would mean a lot of work. By both of you.
A re-boot of how you treat each other, learning how to communicate your feelings, learning how to support each other, and also learning how to deal with your own issues.

Im not saying it cannot be done, dont know that for certain. 

I can only speak of what you wrote about yourself. You could do a similar thing.

Decide to work on your issues, find healthier ways to deal with stress, seek counselling, etc. Many books you could read as well.

There is no guarantee that she will still want to stay married after all that. But its not for her, anyways. Its for you. 

If you decide to work on yourself, you win. No matter what.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

deejov,

It CAN be done.

What we don't know if if people are willing.

So so often, when someone says, "I can't"... what they really mean is "I won't".


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

1)Her new boy friend may not work out and your would make a great plan B. Its to hard to take the steps to do things right, her new boyfriend doesn't care if she is married, your wife is telling him the marriage is over any way. Plus it makes her look like the bad guy to file 1st.


2)Her new boy friend doesn't care if she is married or not so its easier to just keep wearing it instead putting it on and off all the time. Leaving it on still makes her out to be the good guy in all of this.

3)Her boy friend is mooching off her and lack of funds make the affair inconvienent to continue now she has to pay for the affiar with more sex and your in the way.

4) Its to painful to talk about the affair, its shameful and wrong...its easier to pretend she was never in love with you in the 1st place, that way there is no guilt for her behavior.

5) Now that she has a new boyfriend, the only thing that matter is him. In her mind it was a bad marriage...again she avoids the guilt by rewriting history.


At the end of the day brother your wife wants you to shut up keeping paying the bills and when she sows her oats you will be waiting for her. Hell it may not even be with one specific guy, but several ONS....

Beside were do you think all that affection and sex that you guys had when you 1st met? Your not getting it so you think she just stopped? You have been replaced.

"I will do what I want, when I want" = I have a new boy friend and you are getting in the way.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

thanks again for all the input.

i agree with pretty much all of what was posted by all of you. part of me still wants to her to give it a chance, while another part of me is sure she is seeing someone else and wants to see her realise that she threw away everything for some random guy.

i have been going to the gym and taking care of everything for myself, separating my laundry from hers although she still washes my clothes sometimes. im looking after myself and know that i am already on the path to being a better person for myself and whoever ends up being a part of my life.

i will be sticking to my guns about the money i lent her, and if she doesnt pay it back then the mortgage doesnt get payed. either way i dont want to keep bailing her out and i cant afford it either. i have my own expenses and need my own funds to move on with my life.

her anger is her main problem and as usual she is taking the easy way out. whenever we had any problem, financial or whatever, her only way of dealing with it was to sit back and abuse me until i fixed it. and its no surprise that she is taking the easy way out again.

i would love to confirm that she is seeing someone else, although all the signs point towards it i have no physical proof. whats really funny is when i went to get a glass of water last night she was sleeping on the couch holding her phone in her hand. if thats not protecting information i dont know what is. i just want her to be truthful for once.

she has broken my heart but most of all i am just so disapointed in her. we made promises to each other even before we were married that we would make the effort for each other and she is willing to just throw it all away like its nothing. 

i will wait until the weekend to see if she has the list of what we are going to split up and if she hasnt then i dont know if i should give her more time or write the list myself. i think she has kept me dangling for long enough and i either want to work on things honestly and openly, or promptly split and get on with my life. 

enough is enough.


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

There isn't a right answer.

In my case I waited out the affair, but it hurt like hell, and I only did it because I accepted the marriage I had signed up for was gone and I was staying for the sake of the children. I could cope (just) because I had such low expectations.

I think in your shoes, and assuming you reconcile, I would be tempted to say to her "We are falling apart. It's not what I want, but I can't control it alone. I need you to do...." (whatever it is you think she needs to do) "...and if you won't do it then we need to separate. Step one, dividing up the assets. I would like to do it together, but if you won't I will have to do it alone. If you haven't done this by Saturday I will sit down and draw up a list"

Calm, firm, unyielding, but not aggressive or angry.

But who knows, I'm no expert. My wife copped plenty of anger from me during the affair...maybe it was a good thing.....


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

she sent me a list of house contents to divide up with her yesterday and we actually had a pretty calm chat about how we were going to proceed. she says she does care a great deal about me but our relationship is done and she has given up hope on love entirely. she doesnt want anyone in her life and accepts no responsibility for ending up where we are. i said one day you will realise that although i have not treated you the way you deserve you still allowed us to get to where we are without speaking at all about your feelings and im disappointed in that.

she said the only reason she is calling it a separation is because she cant afford the lawyer and costs of a divorce. she has found a place to move out to and is getting the money together to make that happen. so all that remains is to get our house neat and tidy and put it on the market.

when she says she doesnt want anyone in her life i actually believe her, but at the same time when she just wants to be out having fun i know there will come a time when she brings another man back to her place for more 'fun' and that is a painful thought.

i also asked her that if she changes her mind and does want to start seeing someone or meets someone by chance that she just let me know that she is moving on with her life as it would bring a great deal of closure to me. she said that was just wierd, any thoughts on that?


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

My stbxw laid the I just want to be alone thing on me.

A week later I decided to have a look into her email and phone records.

Bingo. Affair in full swing for two months that I could tell.

Do some digging.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

spun said:


> My stbxw laid the I just want to be alone thing on me.
> 
> A week later I decided to have a look into her email and phone records.
> 
> ...


"Time to be alone" (time to explore relationship with posOM)

"Discover myself" (time to explore relationship with posOM)

"I never got a chance to be young" (time to explore relationship with posOM)

Lather - rinse - repeat


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

Conrad said:


> "Time to be alone" (time to explore relationship with posOM)
> 
> "Discover myself" (time to explore relationship with posOM)
> 
> ...



You forgot "I need space".

One of the more popular phrases that means they have decided to move things into high gear with posOM.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

hmmm, maybe i should do some checking. it would certainly make things different if there was another man.


----------



## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> hmmm, maybe i should do some checking. it would certainly make things different if there was another man.


Have a friend follow her to where she goes at night.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

brokenman2012 said:


> hmmm, maybe i should do some checking. it would certainly make things different if there was another man.


Find out.


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> hmmm, maybe i should do some checking. it would certainly make things different if there was another man.


Yes. It changes the landscape considerably.

You deserve the truth. And since you can't trust her to give it to you, it's time for you to find out for yourself.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

As others have said needing space for a women is a term that appears quite frequent on these boards(coping with infidelity, considering divorce or in this section). It is another way of a women saying "I need to try out a few other guys and see if I can find something better if not I'll have the dumb hubby at home to go back to".

Without hinting at her start going through her text messages, emails, computer files, etc. Once you find out save as much as data possible and secure them off site.


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

I agree with investigating, and I agree maybe it might be an affair, but it's not proven.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

well i dont have access to her emails and she sleeps with her phone in her hand. that alone is not normal and almost evidence enough for me. though confirmation would be good


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

brokenman2012 said:


> well i dont have access to her emails and she sleeps with her phone in her hand. that alone is not normal and almost evidence enough for me. though confirmation would be good


There is itemized detail of calls and texts on the cell phone bill.

There is usually on-line access available to the account.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

and its all in her name and is handled online, which i dont have access to


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

brokenman2012 said:


> and its all in her name and is handled online, which i dont have access to


Put a keylogger on the computer.


----------



## spun (Jul 2, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> she sleeps with her phone in her hand.


Perfectly normal behavior for someone that has nothing to hide.

Check her cell and text records.

Keylog her computer.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

im just going to let it go, if shes seeing someone then it will come out sooner or later. meanwhile its time for me to enjoy my single life.

thanks to everyone who listened and gave me advice, it has been very much appreciated and got me through the toughest part of all of this so thank you very much!

just arranging the separation details now and cant wait to get out of here and get on with my life


----------



## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

I would suggest you try a little more, while you still have a good chance, to find who the OM is. For all you know it could be a family member or a close friend.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

keko said:


> I would suggest you try a little more, while you still have a good chance, to find who the OM is. For all you know it could be a family member or a close friend.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


she tends to keep herslf quite well protected and i will surely be caught if i try anything. Plus the more i dwell on this the longer it will take me to get on with my life
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> she tends to keep herslf quite well protected and i will surely be caught if i try anything. Plus the more i dwell on this the longer it will take me to get on with my life
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Very wise. Very wise indeed.


If you are going to move on, move on.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

Wazza said:


> Very wise. Very wise indeed.
> 
> 
> If you are going to move on, move on.


thanks mate, its going to take long enough to mend my heart without continuously searching for answers i may never find. We had a very civil talk yesterday where she outlined that she needs to get out on her own and know that she can stand on her own 2 feet and have fun instead of sitting around good feeling sad. She says she doesnt feel like she needs anyone in her life and doesnt want to give me box false hope but if she changes her mind i will be the first to know. 

This gives me hope of reconciliation but if she hooks up with another man, even just for a casual fling, and then decides that its me she wants in her life i will find it almost impossible to forgive. While at the same time i know what i want out of life and will be trying to find a woman that she knows what she wants and brings out the best in me.

I dont know if my logic is right, is this selfish or does anyone have any thoughts on this?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## duvaldad (Oct 30, 2012)

You know it's crazy. I was on here searching forever thinking I would not find someone that is going through the same thing as me but there are so many similarities it is scary.
Mid 20s, known each other 8 years (married 5), I got busy with work and neglected her, she says she's been unhappy for a while and wants a divorce (also wants space and to be independent) , I try to smother her, seems like there might be another man. You know the story. Only differences are we rent and don't have to worry about a mortgage but we have a 5 year old son.
It's been great reading your story and it has given me some advice but I am still not too sure where I'm going with things. I've been greatly thinking doing the 180 but I will not move away from my son and she is the kind of girl that I feel it will just push her away further (especially if there is another man).
Anyways, I wish I had some advice for you and sorry for the thread hijack. I am going to share my own story very soon and hopefully some good can come out of it for you.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

brokenman2012 said:


> she tends to keep herslf quite well protected and i will surely be caught if i try anything. Plus the more i dwell on this the longer it will take me to get on with my life
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You're afraid of her.

That's the root of your problems.

If you don't learn these lessons from her, the next relationship you have will be a bigger badder version of the same thing.

Good luck to you.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

duvaldad: i only hope this thread has shown you that you are not alone, it is hard to find a situation identical to your own on these forums but i can assure you that i have received great comfort and knowledge from other posts on here. our separation is going to continue, had a chat today where she told me that she had a little breakdown when packing things up and realising the gravity of what she had decided to do while at the same time knew that it was necessary for her and i think for me also. it will be good for both of us to know that we can stand on our own and think about whether we need each other in our lives or if we want each other in our lives.

i would love to hear the gritty details of your situation as it is very hard to find anything close to what i am going through.

conrad: its not that im afraid of her at all, its more that a big part of me wants to wait for her because she is the only woman i have ever loved and wanted to spend the rest of my days with. we both have a great amount of resentment for each other which will be the main obstacle in front of any reconciliation. the same part of me that loves her and will wait forever is telling me to cut my losses and move along trying to find a woman that wants the same out of life that i do.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

She sleeps with her phone in her hand and you are afraid to ask her to look at it.

C'mon dude.


----------



## Memento (Aug 23, 2012)

You are harvesting what you planted. You cant really expect to win your wife over with "I am sorry" and some flowers and expect her to conveniently forget you have been emotionally and physically unavailable to her.

Toughen up! Your wife needs you to be a husband, not a insecure 16 old girl.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

its not that im afraid to ask to look at it, more that its not my business anymore and she is free to do as she pleases.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

brokenman2012 said:


> its not that im afraid to ask to look at it, more that its not my business anymore and she is free to do as she pleases.


I hope you are preparing yourself for the exact same treatment (on steroids) in your next relationship.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

memento: i agree, a busted up needy bloke is not attractive at all and thats not who she fell in love with in the first place. 

im working on getting back to the old me and if its meant to be then it will be. if not then i will have won half the battle for myself anyway.

i do hope that she doesnt do anything silly in the meantime though.....


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

conrad: i have taken many lessons from this already, and im sure that more will dawn on me as time passes be it for reconciliation or a new relationship. rest assured i have learned more about relationships in the past month than i have my whole life...


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

brokenman2012 said:


> conrad: i have taken many lessons from this already, and im sure that more will dawn on me as time passes be it for reconciliation or a new relationship. rest assured i have learned more about relationships in the past month than i have my whole life...


I believe you will regret not working more on yourself through this process.

Part of working on yourself is standing up for yourself. It's unfortunate you are taking a pass.


----------



## Memento (Aug 23, 2012)

Then talk to her and be assertive! Women love confidence (but don't overdo it!)!


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

i dont know what more i can do for myself? i have acknowledged all my faults in detail and more with my wife and more that she has brought to light. none of these have been taken lightly i can tell you.

if i am missing something here i am happy to hear it...


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

brokenman2012 said:


> i dont know what more i can do for myself? i have acknowledged all my faults in detail and more with my wife and more that she has brought to light. none of these have been taken lightly i can tell you.
> 
> if i am missing something here i am happy to hear it...


Are you in counseling?


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

nope im not in counselling. and to be honest im not really interested in it unless it was MC with both of us attending so that we could get everything out on the table and move forward in whichever direction


----------



## Madman1 (Oct 24, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> nope im not in counselling. and to be honest im not really interested in it


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

i mean individual sessions, if we were to go together i would be all for it.

right now things are already in motion, she has found a place of her own and started packing her things. soon our house will be on the market and after that there will be no ties between us.

i think it will be good for both of us although i would never have been the one to take this step. my number 1 concern is that she is not separating to work on our relationship, but because she doesnt know what she wants. 

in doing this we will be able to get our own lives going in the direction that we each want and who knows what will happen down the track. all i can say is that if she does something silly while separated it will make my decision very easy.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

she did say yesterday that she almost had a breakdown when packing her things and realising the gravity of what she was doing but knows its something she has to do. also that she opted to only sign a 6 month lease on her new place since she didnt want to completely commit to a full year 'by herself'. things like this give me so many mixed emotions that i cant function properly. the sooner she is out and our house is sold the better i will be able to cope and move along with my life


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> i mean individual sessions, if we were to go together i would be all for it.
> 
> right now things are already in motion, she has found a place of her own and started packing her things. soon our house will be on the market and after that there will be no ties between us.
> 
> ...


If you haven't already, you should make that clear to her. Not fair to her otherwise.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

i did make this very clear to her. she responded very negatively towards it saying that i was 'telling her how it is' and controlling. i said thats not the case and if she wants to get out and date or hook up with someone else i would appreciate some honesty and transparency.

i was quite clear that once she makes that step i dont think i will ever be able to forgive her after telling me she needs time to herself and doesnt want anyone in her life.


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

brokenman2012 said:


> i did make this very clear to her. she responded very negatively towards it saying that i was 'telling her how it is' and controlling. i said thats not the case and if she wants to get out and date or hook up with someone else i would appreciate some honesty and transparency.
> 
> i was quite clear that once she makes that step i dont think i will ever be able to forgive her after telling me she needs time to herself and doesnt want anyone in her life.


I personally think that is reasonable. You are not controlling her, you are letting her know the way you will control yourself.

She is making the decision to leave you. You are making it clear that you don't promise to still be there if she wants to come back.

Hang in there....this stuff hurts, but all you can do is your best.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

yes it is both enfuriating and heart breaking to imagine my wife with another man but im trying not to think too much about that until it actually happens or i have proof that it already has.

i have made it clear that i think it will be healthy for her to have some time to herself and enjoy life with her frienemies and ive never stood in the way of anything she wanted before and im not going to start now. just as long as she knows that if theres another man then she might as well make the most of it because i wont be there after that.

on the positive side, soon i will have a lot more spare time for myself and more money to play with and go out etc. its opening doors for me that have been closed for a long time and im looking forward to enjoying it!


----------



## Madman1 (Oct 24, 2012)

You make a choice, and I make a choice, how is that controling, it is the essence of free will and the right of each person to chose thier own destny!


----------



## legiox (Sep 2, 2012)

Wow this sounds just like my STBXW. When I told her i didn't agree with what she was doing, she would always say "You act just like my dad." Then i would snap back and say "I'm not your damn dad, I'm a concerned Husband'!!!

My STBXW was very outgoing. Always wanted to go out and hang with her friends. The problem was 99.9% of her friends were single. I'm 29 and went through college. Got the T-shirt and done that. I wasn't in the mood to start living the single life like in college while married (I work alot). However, she would do it anyway and would on i know atleast 3 occasions, schedule "girls weekend out" on my weekend off from work. So i would never see her. Of course i brought this up several times, but she always told me she was going to do it anyway and didnt care.

I really believe she enjoyed the thought of being married, but didn't want to put the work and effort into it either.

This is exactly what she told me one time.

Question: Why did you always go out and party while we were married? Her Answer: because I'm in college and a student and that's what they do"

I am not lying...lol


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

madman1: exactly, it is free will. im not going to stand in the way of what she wants but i needed to tell her that theres only so much i will stand for.

legiox: sounds very similar in a lot of ways. my wife also enjoys being out most of the time and i also work a lot and late hours too. i never really raised the issue with her as i just wanted her to be happy doing whatever she wanted, and any other issues i raised were quickly met with things like 'i dont know why you feel that way, thats just stupid' or 'you dont have the right to feel that way' and thats pretty much where the discussions ended.


----------



## Dare to Change (Nov 8, 2012)

OK – just like ‘duvaldad’ mentioned earlier, I’m glad to have found a forum to which I can relate. Hope you guys are doing alright. I’m in a state of limbo myself. Please bear with me; here’s my situation:

•	My wife and I are in our 30s
•	Separated (not legally) and moved to an apartment
•	Married 12 years
•	3 daughters
•	Wife and daughters live in our house
•	We have successful careers that consume a lot of time
•	I am somewhat controlling, stubborn, and tidy. Basically, I like things my way
•	She is somewhat stubborn, outgoing, dangerously flirty with men, and very untidy
•	For the past 3 years, I’ve allowed myself to drift away from my main responsibility and priorities: My wife and daughters
•	For many years, my wife has gotten involved in a ton of fundraisers and community-volunteer activities 


Right now, we’ve been separated for 3 weeks. I’ve been in my apartment for less than one week. We’ve discussed our issues in depth, and she said she is unhappy, needs space, needs to find herself, and does not know if she want to continue our marriage. Sound familiar? She said she has felt for years that she has changed into a different person; she feels she is always stressed out and has worked too hard to make me happy, which has caused to her be a “different person.” We married in our early 20’s while she was in her last semester of college.

She is constantly busy. She spends most of her free time volunteering in community activities and fundraisers, surfing Facebook, or going out with friends. I spend too much time at work. Some of our biggest arguments have been over her dangerous flirtation with men. This is my point of view on that issue: She is an incredibly outgoing, smiley person – she poops rainbows and sees bubbles everywhere. She is in constant, planned contact with other men, regularly has lunch dates with other men (friends, co-workers) and spends hours a day texting other male “friends.” 

Over the years, I’ve had to confront her about the issue because I found that the other men would make comments to her that made me feel they were trying to “creep” over to her. Basically, she flirts enough that men in the past have likely felt they could have sex with her. Those feelings were validated after I confronted one of the men. She says this is not the case, that she is simply flirty with everyone, and that I should trust she would never let herself do anything with another man. She doesn’t think this should be an issue and to me feels like a lack of respect and loyalty to our marriage. 

Overall, she says we owe it to ourselves to see if “we” can be happy elsewhere, that we should spend time apart and date others. Here is the disturbing part: She does know if she is willing to go to couples counseling, does not know if she is willing to make some changes in the way she does things (flirt heavily with men – constant contact with other men), and does not want to stop the non-stop activities in which she’s involved.

I told her I am willing to make changes in the way I’ve done things and would like us to go to counseling so a neutral party could offer some suggestions. I checked on things. I know she’s been in constant contact with two men – even before I was out the door. One is a co-worker; the other is someone she has been friends with for years. When I say constant contact, I mean hundreds of texts each day – from early morning to late at night. More than likely an EA that could lead to a PA. She says this separation is tough on her, yet she has not confided heavily on close friends or family. 

I haven’t confronted her on this issue yet. I’m waiting patiently because I am extremely angry right now and don’t want to do or say something I’ll later regret. I’m biding my time for the right moment. I am in individual counseling with two different counselors and have set up a meeting with an attorney so that I can be prepared. 

We have separated our finances. We are debt-free other than her student loans she is paying. We have done a great job with the children and ensuring they are getting as much attention from us as possible.

LONG STORY short, I tired of the bull****. She says she needs time to herself, yet all of her time has been going to other men. I won’t be the guy that sits around waiting for her to make up her mind by “finding herself” while she is having an EA or possibly PA with someone else. Perhaps it is possible that she just needs some attention right now and is doing a lot of talking with these men for that much desired attention. It’s possible she is already emotionally attached to them. I don’t know. 

She told me she wants to date other men (“casual dates”) in order to give herself some clarity on how she feels about our relationship and that she will go “where her path leads” her. I feel that if she does date OM before trying to work on her/our issues, it will become extremely difficult, if not impossible, to reconcile. 

I’ve done a pretty good job staying busy – working out, spending time with the kiddos, friends, and other activities. I don’t have the desire to date others. I know what I want – to mend the relationship with my wife. But, right now I have no control over what she does and she doesn’t want me to “check up” on her because she said she has defined herself as a single person leading a life of her own. Sounds to me like she just wants her cake and to be able to eat it too. It’s taken a lot of patience in the past 3 weeks to not file for divorce. I’ll update you all as I can.


----------



## Dare to Change (Nov 8, 2012)

Forgot to mention this: She said the more I speak about us trying to put some parameters or expectations on our separation, the more it makes her feel I am trying to "control" everything. It puts too much pressure on her and she simply needs "space." I've seen those words on a lot of forums lately!

She wants to do what she wants, when she wants, and how she wants without any accountability. I can't force her to work with me on this issue, but she knows how I feel about her being "single" while still legally married. I won't take much for me be done with everything, as she knows I won't be plan C.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

When she mentions she "needs space", what it likely means is that she "needs space" to pursue her new relationship with posOM.

The "space" she requires is to do it out of your view.


----------



## Dare to Change (Nov 8, 2012)

That is very possible. I'm hanging on a delicate thread right now. I feel she is likely already involved in an EA based on the sheer amount of text messages between her and OM. IF it is her attempt to get some guidance from a friend, then I am OK with that. However, I can't prove anything at this point, and confronting her this early will cause problems. OH - forgot to mention this. She's made it to where she uses iMessage - I'm sure to hide who she's communicating with. She didn't have that function set on her phone beforehand.

It seems like a "if it walks like a duck" quote. I trust my intuition on this, but need proof before making a move.

It's hard not to confront the OM right now too. It is taking a lot of self-control. Luckily, my workouts are allowing me to blow off much needed steam. I'm sure many others have gone through the same thing. Right now, the hard part is wondering if I should file or be a little more patient with things. It's only been 3 weeks and I can't prove anything at this point.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

i know exactly how you feel mate, and although i have no evidence of an EA or PA im simply so certain of it that i dont even need the proof. there is nothing more gut wrenching and enfuriating as the thoughts of another mans hands on your wife.

if you need the proof to make your decision then i would start looking and not wait for the evidence to come to you, you are likely never to know the full story unless you find it yourself.

i presume having the evidence would make your decision easier? or would you still consider working through it with her if she committed to your relationship?


----------



## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

The words space and controlling mean she's in an affair and is trying to blame you and get you move out of the way so she can cheat.

Until the two of you are divorced, dating is cheating.

I'd suggest getting her phone and read the messages, I'd also suggest a var in her car.


----------



## brokenman2012 (Oct 6, 2012)

i agree completely, in my case this is how i translate some of the things she says:

'i dont know what i want'= i think the grass may be/is greener somewhere else. i know exactly what i want right now but dont have the balls to say it.

'i need time and space to think'= i need you to leave me alone to see if the grass actually is as green over there as it looks from here.

'i want to do what i want, when i want, and answer to no one'= well this one is fairly straight forward.

when i said that i wouldnt take her back if she decided to have even the most casual of flings with another man, i received 'there you go again, trying to control me and tell me how it is'
= if i want to see another man i will do what i want and you cant stop me.

even the smug look she got when i said i thought she was seeing someone else tells me that its already happening and shes so happy that i have no proof and she can run around without any fear of being caught.


----------



## Dare to Change (Nov 8, 2012)

What is VAR?


----------



## Dare to Change (Nov 8, 2012)

I have a lot of suggestive evidence at this point. I agree with you brokenman2012, and it sounds as if we are both dealing with the same load of crap from our estranged wives. I also agree that casual dating is cheating. Although my wife goes on "lunch dates" with other men (mostly business-related), I feel it is her intent while she is at the restaurant during lunch (if she knows the guy is interested in her then it is a date).


----------



## Dewayne76 (Sep 26, 2012)

VAR= Voice Activated Recorder. 

Beware of cheapbay's knock offs. I ordered 2 $15 ones and they suck bawls, one doesn't even work. 

Check your local WM / Electronic stores for them. That way you can take them back w/o hassle. Look for some velcro straps at walmart or harbor freight, lowe's etc. 

Be sure to think of where the mic will be when positioning it into cars. You want to test it if possible, if you have time.


----------

