# Scabs from oral sex?



## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

I haven't posted in a while, because everyone just told me to leave him. And I don't want to hear it. I know I should, and I see it happening if this behavior persists. I feel so much hurt and pain, and my heart feels broken. I'm sick to my stomach.

Backstory: Found out my H had a yahoo account. Found emails to other girls including two of his ex girlfriends and strangers. He is denying that he ever sent emails to his ex girlfriend, but admitting to sending all of the other emails. His excuse was that it was a shared account, and someone else had sent the emails to his ex girlfriend.  Whatever. So up to date:
I've asked him if he's made a new yahoo account. He always says no. He always gets mad that I keep bringing it up (well wtf, you broke my heart). The other night he went outside for a cigarette and I looked out the window where I had clear view of his phone. I saw him using yahoo on his phone. My heart broke and I nearly vomited in my mouth. 
I asked him again if he was using yahoo; the answer was still no.
So the other day I decided to tell him I think he's still using yahoo, and I think he sent the emails to his ex girlfriend and he's lying about it. I told him I don't believe he would tell me because it would hurt me.
You know what he said? "I don't have to make an email account with a different name to talk to her. I could just call her and she'd be happy to hear from me. Or I could go see her and you wouldn't even know" .......wow that's comforting baby. 
Last night we were doing the deed.... I felt scabs on his d!ck. Ever given/received oral which involved some teeth action, resulting in scabs? Yup. It's not herpes. Last time I gave him head was like 3 weeks ago. And he's claiming that it's the same scabs, and they've never healed due to masturbating frequently.

I personally don't believe it takes 3 weeks to heal scabs... 
I am going to make an appointment for my annual gyno check up and make sure I have no STDs. 
Is it possible it takes three weeks?
SERIOUSLY???!!!!!!!
i F*CKING HATE HIM.


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## cabin fever (Feb 9, 2012)

sick. said:


> I haven't posted in a while, because everyone just told me to leave him. And I don't want to hear it. .


Not sure there is much more that needs to be said. Good luck.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

That seems like the only advice I get. I don't know what makes my situation different from anyone else's. I'm being hurt and lied to, and others get advice. The only thing I get is 'why are you still with him?' Which is a very logical, rational question...... but that's not what I need right now. 
Is it because he is so blatantly never going to tell me the truth? How do I get it out of him? All he does is tell me I'm going crazy!!!!! I AM! He's driving me there! I need to weasel it out of him once and for all.


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## MrDude (Jun 21, 2010)

sick. said:


> II know I should, and I see it happening if this behavior persists.
> 
> I personally don't believe it takes 3 weeks to heal scabs...
> I am going to make an appointment for my annual gyno check up and make sure I have no STDs.
> ...


I know you don't want to hear it, but how much is enough for you? You basically caught him in a lie, he told you he can do what he wants and you would never know, he has no respect for you at all.

Three weeks seems a little long to me, even with all the masturbating, unless he is doing it 10 times a day.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

Scabs on d!ck? From oral? First I have ever heard of that. EVER.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

You've been given all the advice we can give someone who insists on continuing to subject themselves to the emotional abuse you seem determined to subject yourself to.

This man is a toxic psychopath and you will believe everything he tells you because you have zero self esteem.

He has scabs on his **** now, and you seem to want us to help you explain them away? And you are still having sex with him? Sorry, not gonna happen.


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## MrDude (Jun 21, 2010)

sick. said:


> Is it because he is so blatantly never going to tell me the truth?


Most likely, Sometimes we cannot see the forest for the trees and those outside our circle can see it easily.



sick. said:


> How do I get it out of him? All he does is tell me I'm going crazy!!!!! I AM! He's driving me there! I need to weasel it out of him once and for all.


IMHO you never will.  If you have physical proof he would probably still deny it. Use keyloggers, hire a private detective, anything to get the answers if you really need them, but you will not get them from him.


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## Complexity (Dec 31, 2011)

You would have to bite him _really_ hard to cause significant scarring and then a scab. Even if that was the case, how could he "frequently" masturbate? wouldn't it hurt?

You need to get tested for STDs ASAP. Herpes is incurable.

And I agree with the rest, you were given advice but you wilfully chose to ignore it.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

sick. said:


> That seems like the only advice I get. I don't know what makes my situation different from anyone else's. I'm being hurt and lied to, and others get advice. The only thing I get is 'why are you still with him?' Which is a very logical, rational question...... but that's not what I need right now.
> Is it because he is so blatantly never going to tell me the truth? How do I get it out of him? All he does is tell me I'm going crazy!!!!! I AM! He's driving me there! I need to weasel it out of him once and for all.


I am going to give you the advice you are asking for, but you won't like it. My advice to you is to leave this man. He is lying to you and hurting you. Don't bother asking WHY. That's something that only HE can tell you and it seems quite obvious that he has no intention of doing so or of stopping!

I don't know what your whole situation is, but if you can pack up and leave, do so without a word, while he's out. Leave no forwarding info. The other option is to kick him out, and have the locks changed. Do not let him back in.

Please don't tell me that you can't or that you're stuck. Once you've hit YOUR rock bottom with all of this, you will find your way out of it. Until then, you will continue on putting up with being mistreated.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

sick. said:


> Is it because he is so blatantly never going to tell me the truth?


that and he doesn't show a drop of remorse and is now flaunting it in your face, personally I see his behavior as downright abuse

you can't make someone do anything, you can only control what you do and by taking divorce off the table, he will continue to eat all the cake he can eat


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## Pit-of-my-stomach (Nov 2, 2010)

Scabs DO NOT happen from oral sex. Ever. It's almost physically impossible. Teeth are not sharp enough, and the force it would take for someone to puncture the skin on your junk would be unbelievable.

It's most likely from friction. That commonly happens from dry humping. That or an STD.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

not even going to touch the obvious answer to your issues.

so i will say,I've heard it's possible for men to rub themselves raw from masturbating too much.


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## cabin fever (Feb 9, 2012)

You only want us to tell you what you want to hear. NOT THE TRUTH. 


Your husband is lying, and always has been. 

scabs don't just appear on your dong from oral sex. He would have to be wacking off with a weedeater to make em appear. (psst, he is lieing to you)


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## Pit-of-my-stomach (Nov 2, 2010)

ScarletBegonias said:


> not even going to touch the obvious answer to your issues.
> 
> so i will say,I've heard it's possible for men to rub themselves raw from masturbating too much.


Raw or irritated, yes. It's possible. But *raw* doesnt cause scabs. It causes a *burn* of sorts, very painful and shallow abrasions... but not scabs. The friction needed to take off that amount of skin does not happen *fapping*... 

think about it, fairly soft skin on your hands against soft skin on your junk... How aggresively would you have to beat that thing to cause enough damage to cause a scab?!? Even using a sock or some other *aid* it would still take an epic session of self abuse to cause scabbing... I won't even bring up what could possible cause a man to be so horned up that he would continue fapping despite extremely painful sores on his junk...

The whole scenario is absurd.

He's dry humping some tart or he's got the herp.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

Pit-of-my-stomach said:


> Raw or irritated, yes. It's possible. But *raw* doesnt cause scabs. It causes a *burn* of sorts, very painful and shallow abrasions... but not scabs. The friction needed to take off that amount of skin does not happen *fapping*...
> 
> think about it, fairly soft skin on your hands against soft skin on your junk... How aggresively would you have to beat that thing to cause enough damage to cause a scab?!? Even using a sock or some other *aid* it would still take an epic session of self abuse to cause scabbing... I won't even bring up what could possible cause a man to be so horned up that he would continue fapping despite extremely painful sores on his junk...
> 
> ...


doesn't matter what we say.she is in denial and unreachable.nothing is going to penetrate that wall,well nothing other than finding the herp on her face one of these days.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

ScarletBegonias said:


> not even going to touch the obvious answer to your issues.
> 
> so i will say,I've heard it's possible for men to rub themselves raw from masturbating too much.


I don't want to admit it, but I've done this before. Masturbating too long/vigorously without lube.

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

I've heard of scabs from head before. It's what happens with rough head, teeth scrape against it. I suppose that frequent masturbating would prevent it from healing correctly. But the whole situation is weird. . . . If I said it to him he would just make me out to be totally crazy.
He says he's worried about me. That I'm going crazy.
I have had *dreams* about things, like apps on his phone. I went and got into his google account, and found infact he did have apps on his phone. A few weeks prior to finding his email address/other websites, I had a very similar dream to what I found.
One time I even had a dream that I walked in on him f*ckin some bimbo, which strange enough, looked pretty similar to his ex, but she was skinny. His ex is fat... 
I am definitely going crazy. But I'm not paranoid for no reason.


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

Sorry sick...I won't say what you don't want to hear.

I will say that I would advise you to show some strength with him. It will catch him off guard and he may admit to what he's done. Something like "I know what you've been doing, and if you think I'm going to put up with it you're insane". And then just guage his reaction. Change the way you interact with him. Don't play games...but don't go out of your way to make him feel good.

And please stop being intimate with him. You don't get scabs on your junk from oral. The only other way to get scabs on your junk other than taking a razor blade to it is from an STI.

Sorry.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

PBear said:


> I don't want to admit it, but I've done this before. Masturbating too long/vigorously without lube.
> 
> C
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thank you. I really don't think it's herpes. But I have an appointment for my gyno coming up. I just scheduled one.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

sick. said:


> I've heard of scabs from head before. It's what happens with rough head, teeth scrape against it. I suppose that frequent masturbating would prevent it from healing correctly. But the whole situation is weird. . . . If I said it to him he would just make me out to be totally crazy.
> He says he's worried about me. That I'm going crazy.
> I have had *dreams* about things, like apps on his phone. I went and got into his google account, and found infact he did have apps on his phone. A few weeks prior to finding his email address/other websites, I had a very similar dream to what I found.
> One time I even had a dream that I walked in on him f*ckin some bimbo, which strange enough, looked pretty similar to his ex, but she was skinny. His ex is fat...
> I am definitely going crazy. But I'm not paranoid for no reason.



i get that you're hurting but it feels like catching him has become an obsession.you won't leave him and protect yourself but you are bent on catching him with hardcore proof.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

ScarletBegonias said:


> i get that you're hurting but it feels like catching him has become an obsession.you won't leave him and protect yourself but you are bent on catching him with hardcore proof.


He said once it almost seems like I want to find something.
I really do. I want to hack into all his sh!t. I am truly hell bent on finding it. Whatever it is. However much crap I've taken from him, only time will tell... I will find it. I told him not to lie to me, because one day I will find out.
He got all "sad", like 'I can't believe you!!!'
(That's what he always does when he's lying and denying it.)


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

sick. said:


> He said once it almost seems like I want to find something.
> I really do. I want to hack into all his sh!t. I am truly hell bent on finding it. Whatever it is. However much crap I've taken from him, only time will tell... I will find it. I told him not to lie to me, because one day I will find out.
> He got all "sad", like 'I can't believe you!!!'
> (That's what he always does when he's lying and denying it.)


but what will you do when you find it?I stayed with a guy who used to toy with me daring me to find evidence.It took 2 long years but I finally caught him.
It did nothing for me except waste 2 years of my life and make me better at computer stuff.


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## KanDo (Jun 15, 2011)

You don't want to hear, so I am not going to say it (but you can fill in the blank space:




No one here can help you if you won't help yourself.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

sick. said:


> He said once it almost seems like I want to find something.
> I really do. I want to hack into all his sh!t. I am truly hell bent on finding it. Whatever it is. However much crap I've taken from him, only time will tell... I will find it. I told him not to lie to me, because one day I will find out.
> He got all "sad", like 'I can't believe you!!!'
> (That's what he always does when he's lying and denying it.)


Why the bleep are you DOING this to yourself?!?!

I think it's because until you find the smoking gun, you don't feel like you have your own permission to leave the [email protected]

Are you seeing a therapist of any kind?


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

sick. said:


> Thank you. I really don't think it's herpes. But I have an appointment for my gyno coming up. I just scheduled one.


Might not be herpes, but it could be HPV (genital warts). Make sure your gyno runs a full STD panel to be sure.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

ScarletBegonias said:


> but what will you do when you find it?I stayed with a guy who used to toy with me daring me to find evidence.It took 2 long years but I finally caught him.
> It did nothing for me except waste 2 years of my life and make me better at computer stuff.


How'd you find it/what'd you find??


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

sick. said:


> How'd you find it/what'd you find??


Did you see the part where she said she wasted two years of her life????????


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

Hope1964 said:


> Did you see the part where she said she wasted two years of her life????????


Yeah, I saw that part. The more assistance i get the sooner I can get out.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Holy crap. You are never going to get it are you?

I give up.


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## Miss Taken (Aug 18, 2012)

sick. said:


> He said once it almost seems like I want to find something.
> I really do. I want to hack into all his sh!t. I am truly hell bent on finding it. Whatever it is. However much crap I've taken from him, only time will tell... I will find it. I told him not to lie to me, because one day I will find out.
> He got all "sad", like 'I can't believe you!!!'
> (That's what he always does when he's lying and denying it.)


Ask yourself - for what purpose? What will it serve? You already know that he's cheating. You've caught him. Why do you insist on torturing yourself to get more proof? You're not doing anything about it so what's the point and what need is this meeting in your life? You're getting some kind of pay off from being betrayed, looking for and finding evidence and then not doing anything about it but I don't understand what it is. :scratchhead: Do you?

He doesn't care and he's not going to stop cheating. Your only chances of making him stop is if you refuse to let him walk on you anymore but you won't do that. You are losing years here Sick and from the outside looking in, it doesn't make any sense. You might get another tomorrow but you'll never get back today once it's gone.


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## Samus (Aug 28, 2012)

Why are you still having sex with this guy? Stop now and get out. Run and take your baby with you.

Don't you have family? Go stay with them until you can get your head straight. This is total Bull****. I can't believe you can tolerate this?

Stop having sex with this POS. People here are trying to help you. Get out now.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Btw, I'll also add that any scabs that did occur healed very rapidly (good blood flow to the area, you know). Like days, definitely not weeks. And if ever you did get teeth involved enough to case a scab, you'd be sure to know that damage has been done. The scream would have given it away. 

FWIW, I agree with the others. He's not remorseful, and is hurtful and cruel. He will likely not change until he has to. There's no apparent consequences to his actions. And I say this as the one who cheated in my marriage.

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lifeisnotsogood (Jun 11, 2012)

sick. said:


> I haven't posted in a while, because everyone just told me to leave him. And I don't want to hear it. I know I should, and I see it happening if this behavior persists. I feel so much hurt and pain, and my heart feels broken. I'm sick to my stomach.
> 
> Backstory: Found out my H had a yahoo account. Found emails to other girls including two of his ex girlfriends and strangers. He is denying that he ever sent emails to his ex girlfriend, but admitting to sending all of the other emails. His excuse was that it was a shared account, and someone else had sent the emails to his ex girlfriend.  Whatever. So up to date:
> I've asked him if he's made a new yahoo account. He always says no. He always gets mad that I keep bringing it up (well wtf, you broke my heart). The other night he went outside for a cigarette and I looked out the window where I had clear view of his phone. I saw him using yahoo on his phone. My heart broke and I nearly vomited in my mouth.
> ...


Just go have sex with his friend. It won't make you feel better, but it will piss him off.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

PBear said:


> Btw, I'll also add that any scabs that did occur healed very rapidly (good blood flow to the area, you know). Like days, definitely not weeks. And if ever you did get teeth involved enough to case a scab, you'd be sure to know that damage has been done. The scream would have given it away.
> 
> FWIW, I agree with the others. He's not remorseful, and is hurtful and cruel. He will likely not change until he has to. There's no apparent consequences to his actions. And I say this as the one who cheated in my marriage.
> 
> ...


Its true, scabs heal rather quickly and form rather easily too. Its sensitive skin and the scab falls off easily because there is a lot of contracting and expanding of the skin. Scabs can come from anything from masturbation, oral, removing skin tags, etc etc

Trust your gut, think with your head when you are not emotional (angry, sad, happy) pull a 180.


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## WhereAmI (Nov 3, 2010)

Have you installed a keylogger? Have you put a VAR in his car? Have you combed through phone bills? 

If the only way you're willing to walk away from this man is by finding more cheating you're going to have to be proactive instead of waiting on him to fumble. He's aware that you're on to him so he's going to be covering his tracks. If you insist on staying, and I don't think you should, you need to pretend to believe his stories and start investigating.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

She has WAY more than enough evidence that this guy is a liar and a cheat. WAY more than enough. She isn't going to leave him no matter what she finds I don't think. This is the third time we've all told her the same thing and she just keeps coming back and posting more of the same and doesn't do anything about it. It really makes me sad.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

I have been going along with his stories. He's come up with multiple excuses for the things I've found. And says 'What more do you have, I bet I can prove you're wrong.' The truth is though, it's not even proof. It's just a damn excuse. 

He will guilt trip me. When we were having an argument one time, and divorce came up, he said something about seeing our son. He said he doesn't want to be out of his life, and that I know what it's like to not have a dad around. He gets manipulative.
Almost every time we fight about his lies, he turns it around on me, like I have things to hide. He flips it around, and then makes me feel like sh!t. As time goes on I'm caring even less. I have been very tempted to pack his stuff for him, and let him leave. He will be the one to leave. And he will see our son..... one way or another. Because I think his father should be in his life. 
Hope, I promise I will leave him. I swear to it. And when I post about it, you will tell me I should've listened and left sooner. Even though I haven't left him yet, it will happen. I think about it and I'm preparing myself for this day.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

WhereAmI said:


> Have you installed a keylogger? Have you put a VAR in his car? Have you combed through phone bills?
> 
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Do you know of a free/undetectable PC keylogger?
Do you know how to hack someone's AT&T account with out knowing the password to their account?


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

What is a 180??


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## Kasler (Jul 20, 2012)

Seems to me your expecting to find him with his hand in the cookie jar and say "Aha! I caught you!" 

At which point you will expect him to scream that he is vanquished and fall to the ground and foam at the mouth at little.

Reality 

You caught him cheating before, hes cheating now, and if you do catch him again, he won't give a sh!t, just like he didn't the first time. You can compile all the evidence you want, hes just gonna turn it around on you and some fashion and go back to his yahoo chicks. 

Don't waste your time. When someone's cheating you don't need proof, you just need to know. 

You're probably not going to heed this though, you're currently in one of the hugest betrayed spouse fogs I've ever seen.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

sick. said:


> Hope, I promise I will leave him. I swear to it. And when I post about it, you will tell me I should've listened and left sooner. Even though I haven't left him yet, it will happen. I think about it and I'm preparing myself for this day.


If you ever do, I promise I will not say it should have been sooner. I will just post a huge WHOOOPEEEEE!!!!!!!

Do you have a timeline in mind??


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## MrDude (Jun 21, 2010)

Here are a couple. If you can scrape together $100 dollars (possibly less) it would be better.

http://www.ilovefreesoftware.com/18/windows/5-best-free-keyloggers.html

A bit of warning. It is easy to get obsessed with these. I had one and was checking it constantly. Even had screen captures of skype......oh the images


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## StrangerThanFiction (Jul 19, 2011)

sick. said:


> His excuse was that it was a shared account, and someone else had sent the emails to his ex girlfriend.


Before long you'll catch him red-handed having sex in your bed with an ex-girlfriend, and he'll claim it was actually his friend, not him. And it sounds like you'll believe him.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

sick. said:


> What is a 180??


The 180 is when you do opposite of what you are doing now. You stop having sex with him, you stop interrogating him, you stop chasing him, you stop talking to him unless its necessary and you only speak about the relationship unless he brings it up. This is in response to the seriousness of his offense, to bring him to reality with the effect/consequences of his decision to act waywardly and that you state you will have none of it, tolerate none of it and you can go living without him, moving on with out him, not needing him emotionally, setting a strong, controlled and composed front.

Do it now, start today, keep doing it even if he blows up, until he agrees to go NC and stop his nonsense fantasy wayward ways.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

MrDude said:


> Here are a couple. If you can scrape together $100 dollars (possibly less) it would be better.
> 
> 5 Best Free Keyloggers || Free Software
> 
> A bit of warning. It is easy to get obsessed with these. I had one and was checking it constantly. Even had screen captures of skype......oh the images


Oh, I don't even want to imagine!!!


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

Kasler said:


> Seems to me your expecting to find him with his hand in the cookie jar and say "Aha! I caught you!"
> 
> At which point you will expect him to scream that he is vanquished and fall to the ground and foam at the mouth at little.
> 
> ...


He doesn't consider masturbating to girls from the internet cheating. When I found all the dating site apps on his account, he denied he ever installed them (what?) and told me 'and even if I did install them, it's none of your business what i get off to' (ummm whaaaat??? what what? hello, moron you're _interacting_ with other women) Supposedly it didn't matter because he was posing as someone else and didn't give them his real identity. 
What I need is to find his new account. Slam him with the proof.
Who am I kidding, what I need to do is kick his ass to the curb and tell him to get lost. 

I'm starting to think he's a narcissist. He thinks he's so wonderful. But there's a whole other side to him that's very dark and scary.
I think I'm afraid of him.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

sick. said:


> Who am I kidding, what I need to do is kick his ass to the curb and tell him to get lost.


:iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree: :iagree:


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

CleanJerkSnatch said:


> The 180 is when you do opposite of what you are doing now. You stop having sex with him, you stop interrogating him, you stop chasing him, you stop talking to him unless its necessary and you only speak about the relationship unless he brings it up. This is in response to the seriousness of his offense, to bring him to reality with the effect/consequences of his decision to act waywardly and that you state you will have none of it, tolerate none of it and you can go living without him, moving on with out him, not needing him emotionally, setting a strong, controlled and composed front.
> 
> Do it now, start today, keep doing it even if he blows up, until he agrees to go NC and stop his nonsense fantasy wayward ways.


Really? Somedays I act like I could care less if he's by me or not. And then in my head I'm thinking, oh crap this is just going to make him go cheat some more. What is wrong with me? Sometimes he asks me if I even care about our relationship anymore. All this lying crap has pushed me away. He told me it feels like we're roomates. 
But if I give him love/sex he doesn't want all that either.
He's always got somethin to ***** about.


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## Count of Monte Cristo (Mar 21, 2012)

This:


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

sick. said:


> He doesn't consider masturbating to girls from the internet cheating. When I found all the dating site apps on his account, he denied he ever installed them (what?) and told me 'and even if I did install them, it's none of your business what i get off to' (ummm whaaaat??? what what? hello, moron you're _interacting_ with other women) Supposedly it didn't matter because he was posing as someone else and didn't give them his real identity.
> What I need is to find his new account. Slam him with the proof.
> Who am I kidding, what I need to do is kick his ass to the curb and tell him to get lost.
> 
> ...


A narcissist and perhaps a sex addict. 

I recently read that a large percentage of cheating spouses are sex addicts, addicted to internet porn. 

Internet porn is making divorce attorneys rich in the last ten years. 

Please stop having sex with him, and keep reading here until you get fed up enough to leave him. 

A Pathological narcissist can not be cured, only managed.

Some times it takes time for a BS to come out of the fog.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

sick. said:


> Really? Somedays I act like I could care less if he's by me or not. And then in my head I'm thinking, oh crap this is just going to make him go cheat some more. What is wrong with me? Sometimes he asks me if I even care about our relationship anymore. All this lying crap has pushed me away. He told me it feels like we're roomates.
> But if I give him love/sex he doesn't want all that either.
> He's always got somethin to ***** about.


You need to speak facts, in a most composed, calm and unemotional manner. All BS will gaslight, blameshift, justify, etc etc

"I know you are doing XYZ123. I've seen you, your excuses are ridiculous. I've seen enough evidence and I'm not here to argue, no matter how much you deny, I have it set in my mind already that I will not tolerate this or any of your gas lighting or telling me I am delusional, or exaggerating. You will/must end all contact with OW (other woman/women), stop jacking off to your fantasies, candyland, unicorns, stop lying, and realize that this is tearing our marriage because you are addicted to your cheating and have to pay women to get off on, ultimately you are selfish! Go look the word up in the dictionary and learn about yourself!"

I meant in the most calm, firm, concrete manner. I guess the " ! " meant where you need to emphasize seriousness.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

Sara8 said:


> *Some times it takes time for a BS to come out of the fog*.



It always does


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## Writer (Aug 3, 2012)

I'm sorry, but I am going to add my voice to the rest saying leave him. I've been known to give toothy oral. However, when I did, it didn't result in scabs. 

To me, this sounds like an STD. Get yourself checked out. Herpes is incurable. 

And, stop sleeping with him. Don't risk your own health because you love this man. He is disrespecting you.

Get everything in order. File for divorce. Leave.


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## Kasler (Jul 20, 2012)

sick. said:


> *Who am I kidding, what I need to do is kick his ass to the curb and tell him to get lost. *


Most definitely. You're obsessed with finding proof, but its meaningless. Also slam him proof? That kind of ideal confrontation where hes hanging his head down in defeat isn't going to happen. If anything he'll get pissed your pressuring and annoying him and will just abuse you some more and say your proof doesn't mean sh!t. 

Leave him. 

You may not want to hear it from us all like its an echo, but its the same thing you'll be hearing if you make a new post 3-4 months from now detailing his latest methods of abuse while still staying with him.


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## Pit-of-my-stomach (Nov 2, 2010)

Research the narcissist / codependant relationship or the 'inverted narcissist'.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Did I read somewhere that too much masturbation can result in scabs/wounds? Or not?


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

Sick, if you need help in the computer department contact badbane.

Read his thread

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...one-interested-evidence-gathering-thread.html


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

Thorburn said:


> Sick, if you need help in the computer department contact badbane.
> 
> Read his thread
> 
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...one-interested-evidence-gathering-thread.html


I've consulted this forum many times for several questions. So far no luck... I don't have access to his phone which is what I need the most. He recently got a new phone, about two months ago. His old phone was sitting around, and when I was looking for it to plug it into the computer to see if I could find anything that way, I realized he had taken it. 
And then... he lied about that......


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## dormant (Apr 3, 2012)

Sick,

1) You know he has lied to you, and gives you lame excuses
2) You know he is still lying to you
3) You know what has to be done, but you are looking for someone on here to tell you differently
4) You deserve better, but afraid to step up and do the right thing

My question to you....

What will be different between where you are now and where you will be if you have concrete proof (btw: you already have concrete proof)

You know you have to end this marriage or at least get both of you to therapy. JUST DO IT!!


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

I'm frustrated with you at all the things you refuse to see but I feel sorry for you at the same time bc I was you.I know how important it is for your peace of mind to find solid proof.But sometimes these cheaters make a career out of cheating and covering their tracks.They get a kick out of it.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

Sick:

I am sorry some here are sounding harsh toward you. 

But they are really only trying to wake you up to reality. 

It is so much easier to see the obvious from the outside looking in and when free from the BS fog.

The fog is powerful. You need help to fight your way through it to clear air.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

It feels like there's no way out. It feels like there's no oxygen to breathe. I feel as though I can't put a stop to this until I find him in the act of actually talking to her... I am preparing myself. I am obviously in denial. I think I'm repeating myself, I think I'm insane. 
Even if I leave him now, I will be second guessing myself, as in "was he really telling the truth? have I -RUINED- my family forever?"
He always tells me I've ruined the family when I accuse him. 
He makes me feel so bad.

I'm only really with him right now for our son. I need FREE keylogger to put on my pc so that when I'm gone I can come home, see what he's done, and kick his ass *OUT.*
I haven't told anyone in my family yet. No one knows. I know they'd all say the same thing you are all saying.
And actually, I still live with my father. I'm almost 21 years old, in college waiting to move out until I find myself a job. I graduate next year. I don't want him to know what's happening to me. I don't want anyone to know.


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## dormant (Apr 3, 2012)

I have some ocean front property in Kentucky I'd like to sell you


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## Writer (Aug 3, 2012)

sick. said:


> It feels like there's no way out. It feels like there's no oxygen to breathe. I feel as though I can't put a stop to this until I find him in the act of actually talking to her... I am preparing myself. I am obviously in denial. I think I'm repeating myself, I think I'm insane.
> Even if I leave him now, I will be second guessing myself, as in "was he really telling the truth? have I -RUINED- my family forever?"
> He always tells me I've ruined the family when I accuse him.
> He makes me feel so bad.


Sick, it is normal to second guess yourself in a time like this. I don't think any BS seen what WS does until that gut feeling comes. It's the gut that you need to trust. Those feelings are the body's warning system.

If there are so many red flags, then it is time to evaluate the relationship for yourself and the children. He is telling you that you ruin your family to shift the blame off of what he is doing. You are not a bad person for being suspicious and listening to your instincts.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

sick. said:


> It feels like there's no way out. It feels like there's no oxygen to breathe. I feel as though I can't put a stop to this until I find him in the act of actually talking to her... I am preparing myself. I am obviously in denial. I think I'm repeating myself, I think I'm insane.
> Even if I leave him now, I will be second guessing myself, as in "was he really telling the truth? have I -RUINED- my family forever?"
> He always tells me I've ruined the family when I accuse him.
> He makes me feel so bad.


It's called "crazy-making". He turns things around and makes you start thinking you didn't see, say, etc. the things you KNOW you did. This way he can make you start second-guessing yourself enough that you do feel crazy. Then you start doubting yourself and he has control of the situation. 

My ex wasn't cheating but he was controlling, abusive (mostly verbally) and narcissistic (diagnosed finally by court order). After reading "The Verbally Abusive Relationship" I realized he would do this so he could blame me for nearly anything vs. taking responsibility for whatever it was. 

Example - Once I mentioned the car was almost out of gas and the next day he would come home pissed because I didn't tell him it was almost out of gas when I KNOW I did. Then I started wondering if my memory was wrong and second guessing myself. Since leaving I have realized my brain works just fine.

Trust yourself. You now he is lying to you, you SAW yahoo on his phone. He is not willing to give full access to you to prove you are wrong - he IS hiding something and manipulating you and the only way your marriage is going to work is if he gives you full access to any and all of his accounts and wants to work on the marriage. It does not appear he is willing to do this. 

Your child is better growing up with divorced parents who are HAPPY and involved in his life.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

He was verbally abusive in the beginning of our relationship. Sh!t hit the fan when I lied to him about some sexual crap I did when I was like 16, because we were only together for like a month and I didn't want to let him into that aspect of my life just yet. So instead of telling the truth, I lied about it. And he pretty much made it his job to make me hate myself. This was still going on when we found out I was pregnant. He stopped since then. But now, I'm just suspicious of his fidelity. 
Our relationship has pretty much always been crap. We've only been together for two years. Dated for one, married for one.


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## Writer (Aug 3, 2012)

I know that you lying about your sexual past is wrong, but him verbally abusing you is wrong too. There is never any excuse for abuse. It, also, should always be a deal breaker. That sounds easier to type than it actually is.

Don't you see what he did? He beat you down and killed your confidence. I think that is one of the reasons that you don't really want to leave him. 

And, if he does have an STD, he is still abusing you. By making love with your husband, you and he are playing Russian Roulette with your life.

You are so young, sick. You're almost 21. There is so much of your life left than to be spent with this abusive man. 

Also, you need to think of your son. He is growing up in this environment. I'm sure the tensions are high in your home, and children imprint what they see from the marital dynamics of their parents.

EDIT: As far as free keyloggers, I don't know any. I'm always wary of things like that that are free.


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## YellowRoses (Jun 2, 2012)

I haven't read your back story but I have just read that you're only 20 years old

Honey, you have a whole life ahead of you and time to go in any direction you choose. I understand why you don't want to but my advice is to tell your dad (and family) what you are going through. Confide and ask for their support in leaving him. You don't live with him, you have a home with family. Can't you turn to them to help you stop chasing the dream that your man will change ?

Start small, set yourself a fortnight with no contact. Ask for help and distractions from your family. Leave him alone. See what happens. It might help you start to detach.

You don't need proof, you have enough, more proof won't change your feelings BUT detachment and distance will.

IF there is any chance at all of an immature, greedy, immoral man-child growing up , it will be seeing you willing to walk away. Even IF he isn't cheating now, the way he is treating you is unacceptable anyway.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

Writer said:


> Sick, it is normal to second guess yourself in a time like this. I don't think any BS seen what WS does until that gut feeling comes. It's the gut that you need to trust. Those feelings are the body's warning system.
> 
> If there are so many red flags, then it is time to evaluate the relationship for yourself and the children. He is telling you that you ruin your family to shift the blame off of what he is doing. You are not a bad person for being suspicious and listening to your instincts.


I've had the feeling for like a year now. Discovered the 'evidence' about 5 months ago. Been hell bent on finding more ever since. 
My son is the only thing keeping me from totally falling apart. 
It makes me sad to think I shouldn't have had him with this guy. 
Everyone knows kids don't make the problem better, they don't heal the relationship. They might heal the depression and sadness but they don't fix the relationship problems.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

He's getting a blow job from another woman, who is leaving marks so you'll find out.

He KNOWS the marks are there, and yet doesn't stop you from seeing them, hence, he doesn't care if you know he had his penis sucked by another woman.

He says he could cheat on you and you'd never know it.

He says he could call her and she'd be happy to hear from it.

What advice do you want?

Leave him. I mean, what should people tell you? Stay and it will get better.....I don't think so.


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## Writer (Aug 3, 2012)

Oh, I can understand the need for more evidence. The simple truth though is the hunt for more evidence can become an obsession. You can discover 1 more text from her, he deleted his response, and you will want to find more. Where would it end?

I wouldn't think that you shouldn't have had your son with him. Your son is your gift so you do what you need to do to protect him. 

While a child does not fix a relationship, he is here now. So you need to do what is right by him.

Also, you might want to have IC because you do sound really depress to me. Maybe, get some antidepression medicine. 

You have been dealing with the feelings for over a year. Something has to give some time.


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## badbane (Jun 9, 2012)

sick. said:


> I've had the feeling for like a year now. Discovered the 'evidence' about 5 months ago. Been hell bent on finding more ever since.
> My son is the only thing keeping me from totally falling apart.
> It makes me sad to think I shouldn't have had him with this guy.
> Everyone knows kids don't make the problem better, they don't heal the relationship. They might heal the depression and sadness but they don't fix the relationship problems.


Okay you are hell bent of finding evidence. Now in order to do that it is time to work on self control. You need to go dark, pretend to be the loving caring wife, pretend all is well, and in reality it is ruse to get him to drop his guard. 

I bet he is using yahoo messenger. It doesn't leave a string of emails and is impossible to see on the phone bill. I think your biggest problem is acting too early. You know he's on yahoo well wait till you can get your hands on the phone and make copies/ or take pictures of the screen. if it is and I phone just pull the screens up hold the power button and the home button. it will take a screen shot. You can then send those screen shots of the convo to your email/smartphone/ computer. 

You are pulling the trigger too early and giving him plausible deny-ability. He will then turn it against you and gaslight you. Which from your stories is exactly what is happening. 

Right now you're and emotional wreck and I suggest you try and focus your hurt and anger into something. Pickup a hobby, something physical, kickboxing, zumba, or just working out. Pour all that frustration and hurt into those so you can approach the situation level headed. Also so you can start working on yourself. Getting your self esteem back up again. 

You won't get anywhere unless you start changing the way you are handling the situation. I am not being mean I am making an observation. You have attempted twice to at least to get the truth and he gaslighted you. 

Remember think of this as war. Everything you are doing is to either destroy an A, fight for your marriage, and/or fight for your happiness. I would almost suggest reading Sun Tzu the art of war. If you can take the principals of spying and apply them to yourself, you will be much more successful.

remember he brought this on, any actions you take now were brought on by his infidelity or lies. 
IMO step 1 pretend the world is right and everything is good.

Step 2 should be to get that phone and find yahoo messenger or go through his mail account. Remember sick with step one. If you find things and have the urge to go call him out. Make and excuse and go to the gym and work yourself out till you can't be mad anymore.(this does work)
step 2 on his computer google "find yahoo messenger transcripts locally". There will be an article pointing you to where the messenger transcripts are stored.

step 3 Gather enough evidence until there can be no way to lie or disprove infidelity. confront him, expose him to friends and family, expose to OWH / boyrfriend. Prepare a list of requirements he must reach before you consider R. Be prepared to make him leave or leave yourself. The follow through with the 180 which I have seen you around this board so I am assuming you are familiar with it. 

STEP 4 after leaving and giving youself some time decide on R or D.


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## Pit-of-my-stomach (Nov 2, 2010)

Just random thoughts...

I know you probably can't see the cycle that your trapped in... Your not ready to hear anything that your being told, your denial & rationalizing defenses are acting as a barrier to protect you.. I would bet deep down you are terrifed. 

Some of that is because you are a victim of abuse. Very serious mental and emotional abuse. Gaslighting is mental terrorism, its very serious stuff little one. You may not see the damage from the eye of the hurricane your inside of right now, but its clear and evident from this side of the computer screen...

It sounds like your partilially accepting some of what is being said to you now. But not using it for waht it's intended. To motivate you to take action. What it sounds like your beggining to do is use these comments to beat yourself up... 

Thats another trap, part of the dysfunctional dance your in. You beat yourself up and lower your already destroyed self esteem you feel even more unworthy and you cling even more desperately to this relationship which is somehow defining you... This is what happens in abusive relationships. As I understand it, its very common in narcissitic (sociopathic)/codependant relationships. As you mentioned, he has systematically broken you down from the start. This is also common. "tenderizing the meat". Do you know who YOU are anymore? Now you probably can't picture your life without him can you?

Again, these are just random thoughts. I hope you can begin to see this is a serious and toxic situation your in. I hope you find the strength to reach out and get some help. Good luck with your situation.

PS. I found this top 3 free-loggers you'll obviously want to do a little research on them if you choose to go that route.


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## Kathy Jackson (Aug 29, 2012)

I'm lost as to where the scabs came from? 

Did you cause the injuries, or are you thinking someone else did? 

That leads me to my next question, what kind of oral sex would leave scabs, and wouldn't masturbating be painful with sores there?

yikes


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## Pit-of-my-stomach (Nov 2, 2010)

Kathy Jackson said:


> wouldn't masturbating be painful with sores there?
> 
> yikes


Oh gawd yes. Ive had my fair share of friction burns. It hurts bigtime to flog the pony with any rode rash on it.


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

Just so you are aware most chancre sores from T. pallidum (syphilis) can last upwards of six weeks. You most certainly want to get this checked out with a Ob-Gyn and of course bring up the specific concerns, but do some reading on the topic at this source. 

The other concern is that more often than not multiple STDs are transmitted and one of particular concern is HPV which can go unnoticed in females. There are up to seven varieties of this virus and in particular two of them are high on the list for leading to cervical cancer. 

Please, what ever you do, get this checkout. I would recommend and I am sure your physician will recommend you stop all sexual contact for moment.

Not trying to scare you but you really can't wait on getting treatment if it is syphilis... Effective treatments are only good in stage 1. Once it goes to stage 2, it requires chemotherapy and stage 3 you go on hospice care.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

I am getting tested. I have an appointment. I know my doctor very well, I've been seeing her for five years. I don't even want to admit to her what the problem is, because she's worked with me through out my whole pregnancy and has even met my husband. I'm just going to ask her to test me for everything. For what it's worth, I had the Gardasil shot when I was sixteen, which prevents HPV. 

Also, thanks, Badbane and pit-of-my-stomach.
He did a lot of weird things to me in the beginning of our relationship. He wouldn't let me have friends, he'd cut me down verbally, make me feel terrible.
I have absolutely NO FRIENDS because he made me get rid of them all from the beginning.
What the hell was I thinking?
Before I got prego, I was set on getting him out of my life. Then I found out I was prego and he promised to be more mature. He tells me to go out and have friends now, but of course my situation in life prevents me from having friends. Not to mention I'm socially awkward. I don't even want them anymore. He's had me under his control since day 1.


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

sick. said:


> I am getting tested. I have an appointment. I know my doctor very well, I've been seeing her for five years. I don't even want to admit to her what the problem is, because she's worked with me through out my whole pregnancy and has even met my husband. I'm just going to ask her to test me for everything. For what it's worth, I had the Gardasil shot when I was sixteen, which prevents HPV.
> 
> Also, thanks, Badbane and pit-of-my-stomach.
> He did a lot of weird things to me in the beginning of our relationship. He wouldn't let me have friends, he'd cut me down verbally, make me feel terrible.
> ...


You have no choice... btw, doctors are obligated by the cdc and most local dept. of health agencies to ask for all potential partners. Be ready to turn over names and as much information as possible. Good, you had the vaccine. 

I really wish you the best.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

I also need to add I was mentally abused by my mother through out my childhood until I was about 12. I'm pretty sure that's built up my tolerance with it, & I sadly got used to it. I just recently cut her out of my life (when my baby was born).... That took me a loooong time.


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

sick. said:


> I also need to add I was mentally abused by my mother through out my childhood until I was about 12. I'm pretty sure that's built up my tolerance with it, & I sadly got used to it. I just recently cut her out of my life (when my baby was born).... That took me a loooong time.


I sorry for all you are going through... after you get your medical condition addressed, I hope you seek professional counseling from highly accredited person. 

No one builds up tolerance to abuse. We evolved as a tribal species to which our survival depends upon the safety of the group. As a tribe we thrive and survive as individuals we wither and die. You have too much life to be in the latter category. Please getting healing for both your body and mind.

As I am sure many have already told you that may be to extricate yourself from your living situation with your H.


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

I was in denial after D-day and it took TAM to get me out of it. Anyway I am glad you are hanging with us. I got mad at some posters but ignored some and listened to others. I wished I had listend to some I ignored because they were correct. Anyway, like badbane suggested back off on accusing and start getting more evidence. you need to be very careful here. Your WS knows you and you might feel like you are covering your tracks fairly well but he may be tracking you. Spy counter spy. Every system you have installed on your computer or phone can have a counter system that alerts the other person that it is being tampered with. I am not sure how savvy your husband is but do be careful. My wife would not reveal a damn thing unless I had the proof and even then she lied. It is the damnest thing. Why lie when you are exposed? It only makes it worse and they don't seem to care. We could spend a whole thread on self-protection, coping skills etc that our waywards do.

You have proof but you don't and I know you want the smoking gun. you may get it but back off and become smart in getting evidence. Again be careful of what you use.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

Thorburn said:


> I was in denial after D-day and it took TAM to get me out of it. Anyway I am glad you are hanging with us. I got mad at some posters but ignored some and listened to others. I wished I had listend to some I ignored because they were correct. Anyway, like badbane suggested back off on accusing and start getting more evidence. you need to be very careful here. Your WS knows you and you might feel like you are covering your tracks fairly well but he may be tracking you. Spy counter spy. Every system you have installed on your computer or phone can have a counter system that alerts the other person that it is being tampered with. I am not sure how savvy your husband is but do be careful. My wife would not reveal a damn thing unless I had the proof and even then she lied. It is the damnest thing. Why lie when you are exposed? It only makes it worse and they don't seem to care. We could spend a whole thread on self-protection, coping skills etc that our waywards do.
> 
> You have proof but you don't and I know you want the smoking gun. you may get it but back off and become smart in getting evidence. Again be careful of what you use.


I get really paranoid about this. What if he's watching me? What if he has a keylogger on the pc, my tablet, something on my phone, cameras in my house, etc? How messed up!!?


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

sick. said:


> I am getting tested. I have an appointment. I know my doctor very well, I've been seeing her for five years. I don't even want to admit to her what the problem is, because she's worked with me through out my whole pregnancy and has even met my husband. I'm just going to ask her to test me for everything. For what it's worth, I had the Gardasil shot when I was sixteen, which prevents HPV.


Just for the record, there are approximately 40 strains of HPV that can lead to warts and cervical cancer. Gardasil protects against 4 of them, the most common strains I believe, but still only 10% of potential virus strains. It's a good start toward self-protection and cancer prevention, but by no means is it a magic bullet.

Just a little public health announcement


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)




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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

sick. said:


>


Just get tested for your own sake. The sooner you tackle it the better.


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## Kasler (Jul 20, 2012)

^ 










What happened?


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

Nothing NEW happened. I'm just pissed off at this whole situation. My kid's napping now, maybe I'll go scream into a pillow until I lose my voice.


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## Falene (Dec 31, 2011)

While you are at it, smack yourself a good for me.

You want to stay with him? Have a happy.

What about your kids? They deserve more.


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## WasDecimated (Mar 23, 2011)

It sounds to me like he had some HPV warts removed. 

A friend of mine, many years ago, found out he had HPV warts. He went to his doctor and the doctor burned them off with some kind of hot surgical knife. He said this left scabs for about a week.

Has he been to a doctor lately?


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

Decimated said:


> It sounds to me like he had some HPV warts removed.
> 
> A friend of mine, many years ago, found out he had HPV warts. He went to his doctor and the doctor burned them off with some kind of hot surgical knife. He said this left scabs for about a week.
> 
> Has he been to a doctor lately?


If scabs from having warts removed last only a week, how the fluck could scabs from giving toothy oral last for 3....
He hasn't been to a doctor lately. But I am going to be going.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

sick. said:


> *I also need to add I was mentally abused by my mother through out my childhood until I was about 12. I'm pretty sure that's built up my tolerance with it, & I sadly got used to it. *I just recently cut her out of my life (when my baby was born).... That took me a loooong time.


Ok then.
From this perspective, I can now understand your story.
It is good that you can recognize it and take the first step in dealing with it!

Best wishes.


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

sick. said:


> If scabs from having warts removed last only a week, how the fluck could scabs from giving toothy oral last for 3....
> He hasn't been to a doctor lately. But I am going to be going.


Did you get tested? Please don't put it off... No one here can diagnose you... It is ok to inform yourself, but please just take all precautions necessary from a qualified professional. I wish you the best.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

badbane said:


> You won't get anywhere unless you start changing the way you are handling the situation. I am not being mean I am making an observation. You have attempted twice to at least to get the truth and he gaslighted you.
> 
> Remember think of this as war. Everything you are doing is to either destroy an A, fight for your marriage, and/or fight for your happiness. I would almost suggest reading Sun Tzu the art of war. If you can take the principals of spying and apply them to yourself, you will be much more successful.


Yes!

Remember, you are the one that decides how much evidence is enough. You are the one who sets a limit to how much evidence you need before making a decision. We cannot choose for you, but we can tell you that you have been doing it the wrong way.

1) 180
2) Stop having sex with him
3) STD/STI Test
4) Keep 180
5) Do not chase him, sweet talk him
6) Only talk to him about the relationship if HE brings it up and only talk about important things, such as children or schedules etc
7) Use leisure time to improve yourself, reading here on TAM or going for a walk/run, make yourself strong
8) Always speak calmly and in control of the conversation, end it if it gets out of hand, keep 180, just stop conversing if it escalates
9) Follow through with your word
10) Remember, he's going by script, by the book, if you know it, have read it, its just too scary predictable how cheaters act.

Put your foot down, you aren't teenagers, you aren't single, you can't live as if you were single, let that be clear. There is no more questions about anything regarding love for each other or dedication or questioning the marriage, you both married each other already, if he wants to live as a single person than he can do so on his own, and let that be clear. 

Whether you decide to R or D, I can tell you that you cannot R now because he is still cheating and in fog. It will be rug sweeping, he needs to have NC. Its COMMON SENSE he is being unfaithful, chatting away and being physical away from home, you've already caught him lying.

How much more will you tolerate?


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## underwater2010 (Jun 27, 2012)

I hate to be the one to tell you, but I have never heard of scabs from oral sex. Unless you count being exposed to a STD via oral sex. You need to get tested as does your SO.


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## badbane (Jun 9, 2012)

sick. said:


> I am getting tested. I have an appointment. I know my doctor very well, I've been seeing her for five years. I don't even want to admit to her what the problem is, because she's worked with me through out my whole pregnancy and has even met my husband. I'm just going to ask her to test me for everything. For what it's worth, I had the Gardasil shot when I was sixteen, which prevents HPV.
> 
> Also, thanks, Badbane and pit-of-my-stomach.
> He did a lot of weird things to me in the beginning of our relationship. He wouldn't let me have friends, he'd cut me down verbally, make me feel terrible.
> ...


Sweety it is only a matter of time before this turns into physical abuse. This man is isolating you and attempting to control you. You need to seek help immediately. IT doesn't matte at this point if he has cheated. He will continue this behavior. I bet he has started with the small buildup to physical abuse. Has he started pinching or intimidating you. 
You need to leave and forget about gathering evidence. You need to get out before he hurts you. This is the same **** my wife went through with her XH. 
Leave now and take your son with you. Start keeping a VAR on you at all times and record any and all verbal abuse. It will go a long way in handlind the divorce. This man is not in love with you. He just wants someone to control and do his bidding. Please leave and forget about the infidelity. Chances are if you get close to finding something he will get violent. Leave and contact your friends and family and tell them the truth. Stop covering up the abuse and putting on a fake smile for everyone. That is part of the control for him. The sooner you get out and the faster you go the better off you will be. Start documenting the abuse now. So when you leave you can expose him to the police. And yes verbal abuse is a crime.


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

I would like to think you, Sick, are still listening, but sadly have not heard from you since Saturday... I want to echo what was just said, leave and don't turn back.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

I'm still here, just reading the comments. I haven't much to say anymore. 
He doesn't inflict violence on me. He has threatened to hurt me before in arguments, but he's never done it and he doesn't seem like the type to hit a woman... but then again I never thought he was the type to even tell a lie. 
Isn't that narcissism? Sociopath? I don't know, but he was reeeeeeeeeeeallly charming at first, and then it all went to sh!t. 
Badbane suggested I do the 'man in the middle attack', and I am going to see if I can go through with it. 
I like to think about leaving. 
One of the rules of 180 is to not talk about the relationship, only talk about children and important matters as they are brought up... This is sort of what's happened naturally. Sometimes He'll tell me he's so happy to be married to me. Or we tell each other we love each other....... but most of our conversations are about our son/money/bills/work/school. 
He isn't verbally abusive anymore. I mean, sometimes he calls me stupid when we get into it- but I do the same thing by calling him an @$$hole.. But he is manipulating me by lying to me and everything.

I recall this one time, when we were dating, we got into a fight at his parent's house. He went out into the kitchen where his parents were, and they asked him what was wrong. he basically said 'nothing she's just fcking stupid',
and his parents said something like 'you do this to all your girlfriends' ............ Well that was a big red flag that I ignored. We should have ended so many times. 

I just want to track him. And when I get all the evidence I want/need, I am going to come here first for my support before I even confront him with it. Deal?? I will need the help and strength.... to pull me through.


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## Kasler (Jul 20, 2012)

sick. said:


> *I just want to track him. And when I get all the evidence I want/need, I am going to come here first for my support before I even confront him with it. Deal?? I will need the help and strength.... to pull me through.*


:slap:

I'm not surprised, like I stated earlier you're still in your fog so I expected this. 

Proof, evidence all meaningless. Whats he gonna do even if you do confront him? He'll turn it around on you, deny it with illogical excuses, make you feel like sh!t, and go back to doing what he was doing. 

Point is, hes been caught before, what makes you think this will be any different? 

He doesn't give a sh!t, and you need to understand what that entails. Please stop wasting days of your life on a futile course of action and just leave him already.

I really don't want to see you here 3-4 months later still posting about this, its really sad how you're doing this to yourself.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

I don't know how. 
Sometimes it's good, but when it's bad it's the worst.
I tell myself all the time the next time he threatens divorce that i'm going to make him do it.

but i can't.

The last time he threatened me with it, he threw in the fact that my parents were divorced and I "know what it's like to not have a father"

At this point I'm only staying for the kid, which I know is wrong.


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

sick. said:


> I don't know how.
> Sometimes it's good, but when it's bad it's the worst.
> I tell myself all the time the next time he threatens divorce that i'm going to make him do it.
> 
> ...


Simple Q, have been tested for any potential STDs?


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## Kasler (Jul 20, 2012)

It is wrong. That child is going to grow up with two parents who are only tolerating one another. The kid is gonna see that dysfunctional lifestyle as the norm. Many children from broken or turbulent homes usually end up self destructing their own relationships later in life because they feel things are going to good to be normal and its better to have the crap relationship the child witnessed from the parentals. These children will struggle to open up and be intimate with other people. This notion is compounded by anytime people ask how the parents get along he/she is gonna have to tell lies and from a young age.

If you want that possible future for your child, by all means stay, with your narcissistic husband and continue this farce of a marriage.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

My exam is next Thursday.

Also, we didn't have sex or anything, but I just grabbed it to feel it a few days ago. 
The scabs were gone.


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

sick. said:


> My exam is next Thursday.
> 
> Also, we didn't have sex or anything, but I just grabbed it to feel it a few days ago.
> The scabs were gone.


This good... You still need to take this precautionary measure. I wish you the best. 

Just so you are aware, verbal threars sometimes precede physical abuse... Just be careful.


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

sick. said:


> At this point I'm only staying for the kid, which I know is wrong.


Yep--our relationships teach our children how relationships are supposed to work. Staying teaches your son how to treat the women in his life. What lessons do you want him to learn about marriage and his relationships with women? 

Kids are smart and they often align themselves with the parent who seems to have more "power" in the house. That means that your son will also learn to treat YOU the way your husband does.

Whatever diagnostic label you want to put on your husband--he's abusive to you. You are certainly entitled to put up with whatever you want to tolerate, but your son doesn't have that choice.


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## moxy (Apr 2, 2012)

He is lying to you and he has no intention of changing. Instead, he belittles your pain do that you feel like his actions are okay. He's manipulating you. You keep hoping that your complaint will have some impact on him, will make him be monogamous, will make him treat you well, but it won't. 

People here don't see your relationship through the lens of hopes and wishes and can, therefore, be more objective of the problems. You want him to change. He doesn't want to change, just wants to get you off his back about this. You're married to a serial cheater who has zero respect for you who is isolating and controlling and gas-lighting you and your self-esteem will be shredded through his treatment of you at the very leeast. You're in pain. He is causing it. He is capable of treating you well, but he has no incentive to because you tolerate this and the only consequence is your complaining and badgering him to stop, which only makes him do it more to be spiteful and morse secretly to avoid being harassed by you about it. This isn't about love, it's about power.

I know you don't want to hear it, but he won't take your complaints seriously unless you leave him over them (and even then, matbe not). Otherwise, you're accepting his behavior and all it costs him is putting up with your grumbling.

If you don't have a good therapist, get one because you need to be able to talk to someone in your side who can help you figure out what you want to do, what you're willing to accept, and why you're settling for accepting such disregard and disrespect from this man.

Many if know what it is like to be married to a lying, serial cheater (a cake eater) and how hard it can be to accept and recognize psychological abuse from the inside. Try reading more threads and getting some emotional distance from your H to see clearly what you're going through. Read Lundy Bancrift's "Why Does He Do That?".

He doesn't want to change. You can accept it and find ways to cope, keep beating a dead horse in begging him to change while he loses more and more respect for you and worsens his behavior, or you can stop tolerating it -- give him an ultimatum: stop cheating and get counselling or lose the marriage. He might change when he sees you mean it and if he doesn't, at least you have the chance to find someone who will treat you better.


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## sick. (Jul 18, 2012)

He hardly even spends time with our son!! I'm a stay at home mom so naturally I do most of the work, but when he comes home from work he doesn't even make a frickin effort. He says he's too dirty. All he has to do is wash his hands\arms and change his shirt.... 
Pisses me off.
But then when we go to someone's house or if someone comes over, like family... because we don't have friends...
He's all over him. Can't get the kid away from him.
The only times he really comes home and goes straight to playing with him is if we argued while he was at work. 

I have to TELL him to play with him, and most of the time it's an excuse. Sometimes he turns it around and makes me feel bad like I'm calling him a bad father.

When I was in school, I came home early one day. He was looking at porn while our baby was in the other room, awake. He wasn't crying or sad or anything, but it just pissed me off that he was on the computer and not playing with our son, who he complains about not spending enough time with. 
He does nothing to help me.

This thread has a lot of venting unrelated to the title, but damn it feels good to finally get it out


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

sick. said:


> He hardly even spends time with our son!! I'm a stay at home mom so naturally I do most of the work, but when he comes home from work he doesn't even make a frickin effort. He says he's too dirty. All he has to do is wash his hands\arms and change his shirt....
> Pisses me off.
> But then when we go to someone's house or if someone comes over, like family... because we don't have friends...
> He's all over him. Can't get the kid away from him.
> ...


Be careful... he is what I call a "window dressing" person, wants everyone to believe he is something he is not. I want to say this again... and please, please, please just be careful... he is emerging as a potential abuser.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Sick this is not to put you down but

abusive relationship : Check
Married young : Check
Married because of pregnancy : Check

Lots of bad decisions. 

Do you have friends you can share your problems with ? You are so used to his behavior that you don't know how normal relationships can be. Make some close female friends. Or try getting IC.


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> Sick this is not to put you down but
> 
> abusive relationship : Check
> Married young : Check
> ...


:iagree: :iagree: :iagree:


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## Writer (Aug 3, 2012)

Cheating aside, this worries me.



sick. said:


> He doesn't inflict violence on me. He has threatened to hurt me before in arguments, but he's never done it and he doesn't seem like the type to hit a woman...


Abusers escalates their actions. For this novel that I am currently writing, I needed to research inside an abuser's mind (because my antagonist is one). 

It could start off with a "B*tch", then go to "I don't know why anyone would want to be with you." Followed by a gentle push. Then, a punch to the face. Finally, death. 

He doesn't seem like the type to hit a woman is irrelevant. He is hurting you with his words. I would leave and get help for this ASAP. 

Abuse is a volition action with a steep repeatable cycle. I hope that you get the help that you need. 

Save the money you need for a new life. Continue schooling. File for divorce.


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

sick. said:


> He doesn't inflict violence on me. He has threatened to hurt me before in arguments, but he's never done it and he doesn't seem like the type to hit a woman... but then again I never thought he was the type to even tell a lie.
> Isn't that narcissism? Sociopath? I don't know, but he was reeeeeeeeeeeallly charming at first, and then it all went to sh!t.


So what kind of "type" hits a woman?

The kind that will _threaten_ to hit a woman?

The kind that lies about talking to his ex girlfriends and who knows who else?

The kind that shares sex acts online with other women?

The kind that presumably brings home STD's?

The kind that turns everything he does back onto you, so that you're the one left feeling duped, guilty, crazy, etc....?

The kind who lies about even the little things....like where his old phone is?

The kind who you said "pretty much made it his job to make me hate myself"?

The kind that's run off all your friends and family?

The kind that ignores a crying baby unless someone else is there to see his Father of the Year performance?

The kind that trolls the web for girls using a second identity?

I'm just wondering exactly what the hitting "type" is, given every other red flag that's waving wildly in the breeze.....


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

Just as a side note,
Some STD take time to show up positive.

Sometimes it is recommended that you have regular screening every 6 - 8 weeks.


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## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

Caribbean Man said:


> Just as a side note,
> Some STD take time to show up positive.
> 
> Sometimes it is recommended that you have regular screening every 6 - 8 weeks.


This is good advice.


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