# when do you trust again?



## nappilymarried (Jun 25, 2008)

to anyone who can give advice;

I have been married for two years now to a man that i truly love and have exclusively been with for almost 7 years now. i recently found out that he has been flirtling with other women since we have been married, (most likely before then)...but what made me first suspicious was the fact that he locks his phone. (he got the new iphone a few months ago)when i asked him about it he said that he does it for the guys at work. he said it was too much trouble to lock and unlock it everyday when he got home. thing is i never even realized it was locked till a fews weeks ago. cause i've never use it. i also saw a phone bill of his that has several unfamiliar numbers and a whole lot of text messages.although a lot of these number were long distance, i was suspicious about the consistancy of them. when i confronted him about the bill, he said that the numbers on there were all friends. but how I really found out was one day when he left his email up on the computer. i saw a text message that read "I know you miss my **** up in there" when i confronted him about it he said it was just a friend and they just talk s#%! like that. Well of corse i didnt take this lightly, and now we are going to counseling. he still denies ever sleeping with her but recently admited that they dated a long time ago. after a couple of counseling sessions he also admitted also there was another woman that he had been talking to for 2 years. turns out that she didnt even know he was married. i know because i talked to her myself. my husband has claimed to have cut all ties with these women. but i still wonder sometimes if hes talking to them or someone else even.he no longer leaves his phone on lock, so i guess that is one good thing. but on the other hand he hasnt checked his email on the computer since all of this has happened. he checks it on his phone now. so now im wondering what could be lurking in that email account. im not sure what to do?i want to trust my husband again, but i just dont. someone please help.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

He is the one who must earn your trust back. While no hard evidence was found that he physically cheated on you he did step out of the bounds of marriage with the sex talk And it could have lead to something more. He has been deceitful with you and needs to be an open book. What has the counselor said about him opening up all his communication means to you? Until he does that you will always have questions. Trust can come back slowly but he must earn it. Unfortunately in today’s world of disposable phones, personal web pages and multiple email addresses it can be very easy to hide these kinds of relationships. Continue your counseling and be sure the two of you communicate well on what is acceptable and unacceptable in the marriage. You will have questions for some time to come I’m afraid, but if he cooperates and honors his promises things will get easier for you. I’ve been down your path and I have complete trust in my wife again. Good luck


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Amp is right your husband is the one that needs to earn your trust and his only road is to lead a transparent life so you can see he has nothing to hide. As long as things remain locked and unable for you to access you will always have doubts.

draconis


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## justean (May 28, 2008)

reading your email. i have been there b 4. he is a liar at that.
decietful and dishonest. he has said and done exactly what both my husbands did. its my mates. i did not really say that etc. 
believe that and you will believe n e thing. 
i give you my little story.
1st hubby was at this type of thing all the time. ended up with affairs all the time, when i actually found out, i divorced him asap. he still sleeps around now and thats 13 years later.
ok my 2nd hubby, egged on by mate and drink had a one night stand. april 8 08.
the txt message of his mate was " did you **** her last night"
and go for it m8, i will cover for you.
the next day i confronted the mate, telling me i was reading to much it to it. he was only only joking.
it wasnt a joke it was real.
this same mate also told me , id never do that to a mate, ive never had an affair, i have found out so much about this mate, that he is not popular in our area. oh and the girl he married he was actually having an affair with her. they used to go out with another couple. thats how he met her and then the affair started.
believe me the **** txt is true.
i bet my life on it.


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## nappilymarried (Jun 25, 2008)

hey justean, i was thinking the same thing that you were about the text message. i do beleive that at some point, my husband did sleep with this woman. i hope that it was before we even met, cause my mind and heart wont allow me to think otherwise. i know that the the fact it was a long distane number don't mean very much especially since they knew each other as kids. but i feel a little bit of relief thinking that she is far away. although i dont think we have heard the last of her. she seemed pretty upset my husband cut her off. i read her response text message) and i think she will continue to try to contact him. in the meantime i suggested that my husband and i both get tested for any stds, just to be safe. he agreed. i know it wont prove that he didnt cheat but i will feel more at ease.we havent gotten the results back yet but, im praying that everything turns out ok. i just want this nightmare to end.


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## nappilymarried (Jun 25, 2008)

thank u for responding. i know that it is my husband'sresponsilility to build back up that trust. he's trying. i will give him that. he's going to counseling, and has unlocked his phone. but i dont feel like hes giving 100%, like checking email on his phone,instead of the computer, even when hes right there at the computer, doing something else. and i know a few things he said in counseling werent true. i havent said anything to him about it. but i plan to bring it up in couseling in our next session. its suppose to be a session where we met together then seperately. i think thats a good idea, so the counselor can hear where both of us are coming from at this point.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

It might take him some time to come around fully, and there maybe time when he is more open and honest then you give him credit for. Stay with the counciling it seems to really be helping.

draconis


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## justean (May 28, 2008)

getting tested for the stds, and hopefully the results are negative, are important to forgiving. its because its a start of a new beginning.
as for his little lies in counselling, why does he do it, but atleast through your sessions, you dont seem scared to tackle it.
my suggestion is though , if you think hes lieing straightaway, tackle it there and then.
if you leave it a week , he has the excuse to forget.
another tip for you to think about.
my brother and yes he is awful for doing this, but he is in an unhappy place in his life. 
but he does have a second phone that i promise missus knows nothing about. even i had to have a chat with my hubby, all of a sudden 3 phone appeared. i admit i do go through them, but it gives me peace of mind. and i get my hubby to tell me where he is and what time hes back.
to be honest given a bit of persuasion , he does not mind. then again i wouldnot let him mind.
i told him , his act has made me what i am doing now and atleast though countless ear sessions, he does see that i was not like this b 4. now he knows he has to earn his trust. this was not easy to deal with at the start.
and i believe its because of what he did , he had his own issues. 
also attending a clinic, men dont tend to want to discuss those things, everything has to be forgottn. 
but it does seem your hubby is trying.


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## nappilymarried (Jun 25, 2008)

well i got my results, and all tests were negative. i dont know my husbands results yet though.......... im not sure why he's lying in counseling, maybe to make the counselor think hes not that bad, or the problem isnt that bad. im not so sure he's taking it seriously.i agree with you about tackleing it right away if i think he's lying. the couselor gave the same advice. and i have been trying to do that.im just so tired of being upset with him and i hate to start arguments.plus im even more tired of the lies. its hurts so much when he lies, especially when i know the truth.and when i try to check him on the lies, he comes up with yet another lie.........i dont think my husband has a second phone because his phone is in my name. he is still new to the country and trying to establish his credit. but who know knows he probably has a prepaid one. im findng out more and more how i really dont know him, or at least i never knew of some of the things he is capable of. it's kind of scary cause ive known him for almost 7 years now..... also i recently found out that he added one of the girls he was calling back to his contacts on his messenger after i watched him delete them. (not the one he sent the vulgar text to) but the one that didnt know he was married. this girl was in love with him and still might be. and he might have feelings for her too. i plan to bring this up in counseling.i think this will be too difficult for him to lie his way out of and he will have to come clean.


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## believer (Apr 22, 2008)

Unless he can admit there is a problem - his lies, or his unhappiness - whatever it might be - it will be not be resolved until he acknowledges there is a problem. And unfortunately with a liar, they often justify their lies some how. Maybe you didn't ask the right question to get the answer you were hoping for, maybe they give the 1/2 truth, or they lie & say they didn't want to hurt you - all as a justification for thier lies. 
And once they start lying - it snowballs - they usually have to tell more lies on top of the original lie to keep it all going. It is a very frustrating situation to be in - when you are there asking your husband for the truth ( especially in a counseling session) - and he continues to lie to you & the therapist. How are you going to get to the bottom or the issue or move forward if the lies continue? It is impossible because then anything moving forward is built on more lies. 
Maybe your husband fears what will happen to "him" or you 2 as a "couple" if he comes clean? Maybe he is afraid of the consequence? Maybe he should be afraid but if he didn't do what he did - then there would be on consequence to face. If he doesn't give you the truth, it is not fair because if he isn't giving you a chance to make an educated decision based on facts.

Not sure how you would do this ( maybe the therapist could help?) or even if you would want to? but to make your husband feel "safe" in telling you the truth- maybe he is too afraid of the consequence - that he feels he need to lie in fear of how you might react? Maybe you say something like- "Honey, I know (think?) that you are trying to protect me by not telling me some things but maybe I will react differntly than you think. Please tell me what is going on with you & give me the chance to decide based on truthful information." Tell him, that if he is lying, you will most likely find out eventually ( maybe from a 3rd party) & that will be even more hurtful to you than him telling it straight to your face.. Encourage him to open up & not fear consequence & maybe see if he is willing to come clean? 

In my situation, if my husband would have come clean & been truthful in the beginning I really think we could have been a success story & the affair could have made us stronger. We could have worked on what was lacking in our marriage & started with a clean slate. I was willing to forgive (despite the affair) & move forward & attempted to do just that. 
However, being leery of his previuos lies, I still continued trying to work on us & improve the things we felt brought him/us to that point. I have since found out that the lies have continued, he did not keep his word,etc. So now I am to the point, that even if he did tell me the truth - I don't think I could believe it. I would now feel like I need to verify & prove it is true before I believe what he says. 
It has taken me 2.5 yrs to finally come to this conclusion, I have finally realized that I can't trust what he says- even if he is telling the truth. And the based on that conclusion, I am trying to deal with the realization that my marriage is "truly" broken. 

I really hope that you & your husband do not get to that point. And that he can learn to be truthful & forthcoming to make it easier on you. And to give your marriage a fighting chance but from this day forward it has to be built on truth for it to work.
Best of luck!!!!!!!


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## cao428 (Jun 26, 2008)

_"And once they start lying - it snowballs - they usually have to tell more lies on top of the original lie to keep it all going. It is a very frustrating situation to be in - when you are there asking your husband for the truth ( especially in a counseling session) - and he continues to lie to you & the therapist. How are you going to get to the bottom or the issue or move forward if the lies continue? It is impossible because then anything moving forward is built on more lies."_:iagree:

I am in the same situation, and have heard my husband tell more lies to "cover up" the previous ones. He has twisted the truth and exaggerated in past therapy to the point it becomes a lie, and I was horrified. I think my husband, as much as I love him doesn't bat an eye when he tells a lie...and when you come to a crisis in the marriage, it makes it difficult if not impossible to work things out.

(I cannot get the multi quote button to work)

_"In my situation, if my husband would have come clean & been truthful in the beginning I really think we could have been a success story & the affair could have made us stronger. We could have worked on what was lacking in our marriage & started with a clean slate. I was willing to forgive (despite the affair) & move forward & attempted to do just that.
However, being leery of his previuos lies, I still continued trying to work on us & improve the things we felt brought him/us to that point. I have since found out that the lies have continued, he did not keep his word,etc. So now I am to the point, that even if he did tell me the truth - I don't think I could believe it. I would now feel like I need to verify & prove it is true before I believe what he says.
It has taken me 2.5 yrs to finally come to this conclusion, I have finally realized that I can't trust what he says- even if he is telling the truth. And the based on that conclusion, I am trying to deal with the realization that my marriage is "truly" broken."
_

believer, I took special note on this writing, as I am so in the same place but have not spent the 2.5 years and come to that conclusion yet. I fear I might...so sorry to hear that for you.

nappilymarried, we are both in a difficult situation. I am hoping mine has stopped the affair, but with the lies, it's so hard to know which end is up and what to believe. I wish there was someone out there that has been through something similar that has been successful, and could give us their story. 

I thought of giving mine an ultimatum to become completely transparent "or else", but through reading and research I decided this won't work. Mine is working away at present and he left me with a lie on the way to the airport, and this was after we both made a pact to start fresh and be better spouses to each other. I was devastated as I caught him in the lie, and it hit me like a ton of bricks that the deceit continues. 

I am flying out to visit with him in a week, and have decided to approach him in a non-attacking way when we have time alone about the recent lies. I am going to use a tool I read about "I don't want..." So I am going to say something like "I love you and I know we agreed to start fresh and be better spouses to each other. I don't want to have to worry about being subjected to deception in our marriage.....and I feel afraid the marriage might not improve as a result. What can we do about this?"

Hopefully if he really cares he will respond. It seems like a crap shoot. Wish I could be more helpful.


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## nappilymarried (Jun 25, 2008)

my husband got a call from a girl but when i asked him who called he said he didnt know who it was. i also recently saw some inapprppriate comments on one of his pages that was left a couple of months ago. i asked him when was the last time on that site. he lied and said he wasnt on there. but turns out he was. but he says he didnt know there were comments on there......... well i tried talking to my husband about his lying. i was calm, and tried to make him feel that it was safe to tell me the truth.......well he took it the wrong way and it didnt go well. he got so defensive and even ,punched a hole in the wall then went to sleep in the car. he was out there about an hour before i went out there to get him. we talked and talked and he kept saying that he hasnt slept with anyone, and that now he doesnt talk to anyone. but that wasnt even the point. i never believed in my heart that he slept with someone while we were married. and ive never accused him of still talking to those women. all i wanted to know was why he lies to me about simple things. i came to a conclusion that my husband actully belives the lies he tells me until i prove them to be lies , then he totally dismisses them and pretends like now thats its out then everything is ok. he never really addresses the fact that it was a lie or apologize for doing so. i feel like if he acknowledges that it is wrong to lie and it hurts me more when he does it.then maybe he will think twice before he does it again......im just drained. all i want to do is trust my husband.....now i think he may have a problem and i dont know how to help him. what do i do now?


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Careful with your husband "punching a hole" in the wall. It is a form of control used with/as verbal abuse. 

draconis


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## nappilymarried (Jun 25, 2008)

well my husband somewhat apologized for punching a hole in the wall. he said that he was frustrated and fed up. i told him that i understand that and i was fed up too.he was upset because he felt that i was accusing him of continuing to talk to other women. and i was fed up because i felt he was lying to me about things that he didnt have to lie about. we had a heartfelt talk and I had thought id finally reached him ,only to find out the next day he lied agian, and he had added one of the women back to his freind list after I watched him delete it 2 weeks ago. i even called one of his friends that i know he confies in, just to see where his head was at. she tried to help and not be bias but i dont think she knews exactly where i was coming from. after talking to the counselor, i finally came to a conclusion that at this time my husband can not tell me the whole truth about everything for whatever reason.( maybe afraid of my reaction) but in order for our relationship to heal im going to have to "move on" from this.im taking that into consideration and im trying his suggestions. one thing that is obvious is that both of us need to improve our communication skills with each other. i am willing to do whatever it takes to help our relationship. and im looking forward to being able to build back up that trust.


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## nappilymarried (Jun 25, 2008)

well my husband deleted the woman off his messenger list a couple of weeks ago. i hope its off for good. i even spoke to her and she apologized to me. she told me again that she didnt know he was married. i asked her was she in love with my husband and she told me that she never took him seriously. i really dont beleive that because i saw emails from her saying that she loved him and she referred to him as baby or dear. if she didnt love him, there was certainly something there. i never told my husband that i spoke with her because i really didnt want to bring it up again. im hoping all this is behind us. my whole thing is how do i prevent all this from happening again. i know its very likey that it will. if its not with the same women then it could be other women. im not sure what to do. i dont mean to be pessimistic. but i just dont want it to be another 2 years before i know something else is going on.


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## nappilymarried (Jun 25, 2008)

well things were going good for a while. i thought counseling was really starting to help. we started talking more and even started having date night and were working on our finaces together. until i found out my husband was still communicating with the woman he sent the text to. he sent her a message on the computer. when i confronted him about it very calmly, he was upset that i was "investigating" again. i told him that im doing this because im in the dark with him. i really dont know where we stand as a couple. when i think things are going so good, i find out that underneath, not much has changed, (at least with his behavior) when i asked him why he wrote the girl ,he said he just said hi, and how you doing?..well i also asked him, why did he write her at all, and he responded, simply "because i just did" i told him that was not acceptable. and it doesnt make sence, especially when he told me that he would stop talking to her completely. i then asked him did he think that was wrong. he never did answer that question. im assuming he doesnt. then he started talking about hows hes not cheating on me. hes done std test and counseling. i told him that i never believed he was physically cheating, and still dont. {my heart and mind just wont let me.} but i well i feel we would have a probelm. i just wouldnt know about a lot of the things that are going on, like our marriage was before i found that text message on his email.i know we have a problem. his ability to lie so easily, our lack of communication with each other, and his flirtatious communication with other women is a problem. no matter how i come to him, hes not opening up to me and begin truthful about everything. i admit i have done things wrong too. i know that checking up on him is wrong, and i dont want to do it. but i feel i have no other options of finding out what hes thinking. he wont talk to me about his feelings.he even told me that i bring things on myself. that if i wasnt "snooping around", then we wouldnt have a problem. feel im doing everything in my power to help save our marriage. but i cant do it alone. ive gotten to the point where i think he is doing the counseling to pacify me. im not sure he feels that we have a problem. i know he wants to move on, and so do i. but i cant move on , knowing that hes continueing the same behavior that brought us to this point. something has to give. im not sure how much more i can take. if im not able to trust my husband again, then what does that mean for our marriage?


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Wow can he manipulate you. If he wasn't having an emotional affair you wouldn't feel like snooping to begin with.

draconis


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## blugirl2007 (Aug 24, 2008)

As terrible as it may sound, I am so glad that there are more people out there going through the same things. I have felt sooo lonely going through my issues, and It is nice to have this support....

Just know- I am wishing you all the best through your struggles and keep praying for me through mine.


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## American Arrogance (Sep 5, 2008)

Obviously he doesnt care so I say either leave him or deal with him....

I snooped on my husband for several months without him knowing collecting data. I used the pandora program...it works wonders but its called pandora for a reason. Be prepared to open her box. 

Even with the amountin evidence I had against my husnabd he still denied any wrongdoing and blamed it on computer glitches or (aliens) someone setting him up.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

blugirl2007 said:


> As terrible as it may sound, I am so glad that there are more people out there going through the same things. I have felt sooo lonely going through my issues, and It is nice to have this support....
> 
> Just know- I am wishing you all the best through your struggles and keep praying for me through mine.


Yes we are hee for you and I will be praying for you.

draconis


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## Loretta33 (Oct 3, 2008)

Dear nappilymarried....I feel your pain and can tell you that honestly, I have been through all that you have and then some. Mine is a ten year journey (ten years together and 4 years married) and I am still with my husband. 

First I think you need to stop denying the fact that he most likely has been sleeping with these women. Only a really psychotic woman would get anywhere near to the place that she would feel anything like love for a man that her only contact with is emails or phone calls. I know that's hard for you to face....but truly, whether he has slept with them or not is not the issue anymore, it is equally as hurtful to have what you know. Face the fact and stop denying it to yourself and to him because it allows him to see you as still gullable and to still manipulate the situation because he can basically say, "I didn't sleep with them so what's the big deal?" Truly, from the sounds of it, I think he has, and it's probably way worse than you know. His getting angry is just a dispacement technique to throw you off, it should tell you that you are right on track. His using your sense of responsibility and blaming you for looking is also just to throw you off track and should tell you that there is something to find. If there was nothing to hide, he wouldn't care if you looked. Ask yourself, even though you have not been unfaithful, would you mind if your husband checked your email or your phone bills? Probably not, because you love him and have nothing to hide. 

Your husband needs serious counseling and that might not even help. You have to go too to make sure that the truth is being told, because he will just lie and manipulate the counselor and it will make things worse. He may be a sexual addict or he may have psychological problems like narcissism or even bipolar. 

Basically, you have to get strong, stand up for yourself. make your demands to what you absolutely will not accept and then stand by it. If you feel that he is not capable of not screwing up and you aren't ready to say "if you do X, I will leave you!", then at the very least, make him know that you think he has a real problem, you are willing to work it out with him if he admits it by getting into counseling with you and being honest in there, that if he screws up, he has to tell you about it, immediately. That lying is worse than screwing up at this point, he has already hurt you more than you can possibly be hurt and really nothing that you find out now will make it much worse than it already is (even the sleeping with women). What destroys you and what will destroy your marriage is the lying. 

We all have an amazing capacity to love and to forgive and none of us want our lives turned upside down and destroyed. Some of us are willing to go through alot more than others to avoid this and will stick it out alot longer. It is probably a weakness in us that keeps us in it, and most men know that, they knew it when they met us and married us. They don't know it consiously but they sense it internally and they know just how to twist and manipulate. 

I could go on, and on.....but I want to see if you are still on here....so post up and I'll keep going.....

Also, YOU ARE NOT ALONE! I know that is the worst feeling. I never tell my family or friends because I know they will hate him and never understand my staying and trying to stick it out. But sometimes I feel so alone I could just scream or die and I just want to know that someone out there feels me.....and I am not crazy, because sometimes, they make you feel like you are...


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## trixy01 (Nov 12, 2008)

This happened to me as well, TWICE. It happened a long time ago, forgave him already but cannnot fully trust him now. I guess this will stay like this forever. The second time he cheated, he even gave me an STD, WTF! I'm really a martyr partner and now a very insecure wife. Sometimes I think of cheating on him to get even, but that would just complicate things.


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## nappilymarried (Jun 25, 2008)

well several months have passed. things are better. we are no longer in counseling because i felt that its best if we just deal with it on our own. my husband has proven to be dishonest. even while talking to the coulselor. i have come to realize that i cant make him be an honest person. thats something he has to do on his own. im am also aware that this whole thing is very likely to happen again. and if it does, then i wont be as hurt or shocked. ill just know that thats the end of our marriage. i love him but i will be ok if we are not together, but as for now he is not showing the dishonest behaviors that he was before. and until he does, at least i can say i gave him a chance to correct his behavior.


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## aileen and andre (Nov 26, 2008)

I read all these posts and replies and think that I am not so bad off, but I have joined to talk about my husbands infidelity so I will share and hopefully you can all help me?
My husband thinks that he can flirt and goes as far as making suggestive remarks in public like 'show me your tits'. It is horrid, I am an attractive woman and he stops it for a while - say a month - then off he goes again. I know of ONE positive time he cheated on me, because I caught him with my Bestfriend.


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## nappilymarried (Jun 25, 2008)

well im not sure if you meant to post this on my thread but im sorry to hear that about your husband. i agree flirting with other women is bad and in front of you is horrid. obviously he either thinks its ok with you or he doesnt care. im sure you have told him how you feel about it. maybe you need to use stronger words. and really sit down and talk about how it makes you feel. mention the stopping for a while then starting back too, and how thats makes it seem like he is not taking you seriously. plus ive learned that there has to be a consiquence. you need to say if you do this again then ____ will happen. you would have to be the one to fill in the blank. i did this with my husband about talking to other women. and so far it has worked. (at least as far as i know) and if he is still flirting i will find out soon enough. i know all the signs now.now my husbands lying, im not sure how to handle it because i dont know whats the truth and what s a lie anymore. its very hard to trust what he says so ive been looking at what he does instead.


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## nappilymarried (Jun 25, 2008)

i know i havent posted in a while. i did start another post under another name concerning financial problems that my husband and i were having.but lately he has started back with some of his old behaviors. it started r after he came back from the islands beacuse the job there didn't work out.when he came back i noticed that he has several new freinds added to his facebook page.when i asked him about the women, he immedaitely got defensive and said that he wasn't sleeping with them. i told him that i did't ask that. i just wanted to know who they were, because i don't know any of them. i asked him to introdouce me to some of them. he agreed but did'nt actully do it until much later.well actually he sent one of them a message to add me to her messenger list. she did. and i sent her a message introducing myself. she has not written back. see i found out he has sent flirtatious messages onine to other women. he told one of them that he finds himself thinking of her and he misses her sexy chocolate. and misses her voice. and he told another woman that the was looking unmm ummm good the last time he saw her. when i confronted about these comment he said that he wasnt flirting and thats the way (people from the island's ) talk . he said i must have read those messages out of context. wtf? i also saw comments where he was lying to his friends about me telling them i accuse him of cheating and i whine and complain. but i dont those things. when i confronted him about these comment, he denies saying those things. now i see that no matter what i do, he is not going to tell the truth. hes out of the country now. "working" anyway im just trying to figure out what to do now. i know i do need to look out for myself and my best interest.im looking for strength in the Lord; through him i can do anything.


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