# Could use some support today



## Acorn (Dec 16, 2010)

This weekend I will be signing a lease and starting the process of separating. I have been holding out hope that there would be some miracle at the final hour to stop this, but it isn't going to happen.

My wife's attachment style is very avoidant, so every attempt I have made to try to fix things usually just crowds her, and over time I make her crazy. She is independent and has an incredibly busy lifestyle, juggling various priorities.

This morning on the phone, I asked her what she was up to this weekend, and she enthusiastically listed all her family obligations and girl dates and playdates for the kids, most of which I am either excluded from or things meant more just for her anyway. She will be busy almost every hour of the weekend except Saturday night. "I guess I don't have anything then", she said, "even though I though I managed to book full up."

I reminded her that Saturday night she said she'd go out to eat with me. "Oh yeah", she said, "I forgot. Do you mind if we do something low key? I'm going to be really tired with everything going on."

She heard the disappointment in my voice. "You confuse me. If you want me to do more, tell me and I will." Now, I can't win. I'm the controlling husband if I ask that she saves her energy for me, and if I give in, I will walk away knowing that everyone else gets my wife's all except me. I say it's ok, low key is fine. I'm tired of fighting. She says, "What else?".

I just shake my head. What is the point of "manning up" and stepping up the cleaning and such if all I'm going to be doing is cleaning and getting in shape while she's out having her fun? Don't most couples have some weekend days with nothing on the calendar so they can just get up and enjoy the day and do whatever they want to do together?

I am tired of doing battle with an avoidant partner, and she is probably tired of fending me off of coming up with things like date nights to try to bring us closer. I love my wife but I am not in love with her. She will say, "I just want to enjoy your company and laugh." I will say, "You do not have time in your day for us to do things." She will say, "True love is shown in between the events." I do not understand that.

I also do not understand why, if she loves me, she would not try to show it more. If she doesn't love me, why not just have the courage to say it? When I told her that this weekend was the weekend to sign the lease, she said, "If that's what you need to do...". So cold. She saw the disappointment in my face, teared up, and whispered that she hoped I'd stay. That one little glimpse of the wife I used to know. I told her I absolutely would stay if we could work on meeting each others needs, and told her some things I'd love to do with her, like take trips together. Her emotionless face returned and she said, "If I don't make you happy, you should leave." Very take it or leave it.

I am tired and depressed, and yet, I still search for an answer that will keep me and my family together and happy. I will not find one. Hopefully I will be able to keep my chin up and sign this lease and move out. I worry I will see some scrap of love from her and abort everything and be back at square one.

It does seem logical, though, that me just taking a break from all this would benefit me in that I could find out what I would do with those empty weekends without her. I don't really know! I'm so used to waiting around the house for scraps of her time that I imagine I'd be pretty bored. Along with that, she'd have a break from me trying to compete for her time. I have read that avoidant people do miss their partners when they aren't around, so who knows, maybe she will miss me. I have, as they say, always been there.

No real questions here, but would sure like to hear any thoughts or support. I can't remember ever feeling this bad before.


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## In_The_Wind (Feb 17, 2012)

Have yall considered MC ? I feel its kinda hard to work on yr marriage if your living apart. This normally leads to D. I feel that you should get busy with your own things like exercising, deveoling new hobbies etc From what you have shared about your spouse she sounds like she isnt going to change which means you either except it or move on. What did yall do when you first started going out ?? was she like this then ?? and you just ignored it or did these avoidance behaviors start sometime in the marriage ?? 

what do you want in a spouse ?? make a pro and con list about your current spouse 

Good Luck


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

First off, I'm sorry you're going through this. Really I am. Doing this sounds like the equivalent of cutting off your own limb. 

She just doesn't understand that your relationship should be at the top of the list, not somewhere around #8 or #9 on the list. A calendar between husband and wife should never be so full as to exclude one another from events, and it doesn't sound to me like she even wants to try. She's disconnected from you thanks to all her business.

You're in mourning. This is going to be very difficult, but you know you NEED to do this because continuing on the way you are is going to end up killing you. Don't let it. Your kids need you... they need a healthy parent in you with everything that's going on. Give that to them. Lean on your family and friends for support... you could even take a class! Take care of yourself. Be kind to yourself. If she notices, great... but don't hold your breath over it. And don't offer yourself up to her the way you have in the past. Make her EARN your time and love back.


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## Acorn (Dec 16, 2010)

In_The_Wind said:


> Have yall considered MC ? I feel its kinda hard to work on yr marriage if your living apart. This normally leads to D. I feel that you should get busy with your own things like exercising, deveoling new hobbies etc From what you have shared about your spouse she sounds like she isnt going to change which means you either except it or move on. What did yall do when you first started going out ?? was she like this then ?? and you just ignored it or did these avoidance behaviors start sometime in the marriage ??
> 
> what do you want in a spouse ?? make a pro and con list about your current spouse
> 
> Good Luck


Thanks for the response, MC didn't work. The closest we got was the MC pointing out my wife needed to be more vulnerable and open. That is not something that comes easy to her. She feels her independence is threatened if I get too close.

When we first were going out, things were a lot different. It was a lot more relaxed and fun. My wife has learned to enjoy the chaos of adding more and more responsibilities to her life, but sadly she does not see the things that get left behind - the husband, the kids, the housework.

Really I just want a spouse that wants to spend time with me, and when an event comes along, we decide together if it's worth our time. I hear so many nice stories of couples on TAM that say things like, "I would have liked to have gone on that overnight party for my work, but I've been so busy lately that I wanted to spend the time with my family instead." I want that.


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## Acorn (Dec 16, 2010)

A Bit Much said:


> You're in mourning. This is going to be very difficult, but you know you NEED to do this because continuing on the way you are is going to end up killing you. Don't let it. Your kids need you... they need a healthy parent in you with everything that's going on. Give that to them. Lean on your family and friends for support... you could even take a class! Take care of yourself. Be kind to yourself. If she notices, great... but don't hold your breath over it. And don't offer yourself up to her the way you have in the past. Make her EARN your time and love back.


Thank you. You are right, I need to do this. If she wants me, she will find her way back to me. If she doesn't, I shouldn't want her. I should have more respect for myself and deserve more than this.

Damn codependency. Argh.


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## Beowulf (Dec 7, 2011)

Acorn said:


> Thanks for the response, MC didn't work. The closest we got was the MC pointing out my wife needed to be more vulnerable and open. That is not something that comes easy to her. She feels her independence is threatened if I get too close.
> 
> When we first were going out, things were a lot different. It was a lot more relaxed and fun. My wife has learned to enjoy the chaos of adding more and more responsibilities to her life, but sadly she does not see the things that get left behind - the husband, the kids, the housework.
> 
> Really I just want a spouse that wants to spend time with me, and when an event comes along, we decide together if it's worth our time. I hear so many nice stories of couples on TAM that say things like, "I would have liked to have gone on that overnight party for my work, but I've been so busy lately that I wanted to spend the time with my family instead." I want that.


You want that but she obviously does not. You can only control yourself. Sometimes regrettably you have to let go. You should read "Just Let Them Go" I think its in the newbies post in the CWI section.


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## In_The_Wind (Feb 17, 2012)

Do you think she could develop these traits if she worked on it ?? or is she just obsessive about things she feels are important to her ? sounds a little self - centered. If you want to R your relationship I would stop putting pressure on her and focus on your self let her wonder what your doing for a change. During this period work on your self if this means going to IC then do it. I would imagine as a independent woman she isnt going to change much.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

Acorn said:


> Thank you. You are right, I need to do this. If she wants me, she will find her way back to me. If she doesn't, I shouldn't want her. I should have more respect for myself and deserve more than this.
> 
> Damn codependency. Argh.


I know it's tough.

You want a marriage and she wants to be single. Everything you describe about her screams that she wants to be a single person... there's nothing wrong with being independant in a marriage. 

INTERdependance is what marriage is about and it doesn't exist for you two.


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## Hopefull363 (Feb 13, 2012)

I'm sorry Acorn. She doesn't realize what she has. I to have a spouse that doesn't make me a priority. We are trying though. I hope you find happiness.


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## LovesHerMan (Jul 28, 2011)

I am so sorry that you are going through this. I don't know why your wife disconnected from you, and she seems incredibly cold and cruel. I agree with the others, you have tried everything you could, and it is now time to let her go. Don't let her have any more power over you. Do not react to her emotions, or lack of them. You deserve better, and you must take action to protect yourself.


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## tokn (Sep 9, 2011)

Man that sucks, but sounds like you both want different things, and if that is the case, then it's never going to work.

One last push if its something you want to save is to just tell her.

"I want our marriage to work and for that to happen we need time together, but I can't do that if you keep filling your schedules with other priorities that isn't me. I respect your need for independence but as a husband I also have needs. If you choose those other priorities then I know where I stand with you."

If her other "priorities" are more important, then you know where you stand. Start focusing on you, call up old buddies or make new friends, go out meet people, start a hobby, find local groups to get involve with, work out, take this time to better yourself and eventually you will meet someone who will make time for you.


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## Acorn (Dec 16, 2010)

I am going to get the money order on my lunch break today. I think that will help me move past this in my head.

I will use the time away to learn to be comfortable by myself, continue to work out and see if I can get to my ideal weight, enjoy the time I have with the kids, and make new friendships. I will continue to re-kindle the old friendships that I have not tended to as well as I should, and reconnect with my family.

I will become a better person.

I suspect my wife will enjoy the space for the first few weeks, but after a month or so I should have my answer one way or another. I will pay attention to the answer but not let it sway me too much, one way or another. I will spend time trying to think of the must haves of my next relationship. One thing that I will absolutely look for is someone that wants to merge lives and not live independently. With that, I will work very hard on conquering the bad tendency I have to base myself too much on the other - I will be a better, whole partner for them and we will both be better off.

Oh, and lots of Ramen noodles I suppose.


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## Acorn (Dec 16, 2010)

tokn said:


> Start focusing on you, call up old buddies or make new friends, go out meet people, start a hobby, find local groups to get involve with, work out, take this time to better yourself and eventually you will meet someone who will make time for you.


Thanks Tokn, you beat me too it! This is exactly what I will do. With or without her, I will be a better person and much happier because of it.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

One foot in front of the other Acorn. Baby steps at first, but soon you'll be running.


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## synthetic (Jan 5, 2012)

Your wife lacks emotions and passion. That's quite a turn-off for most men. I can completely understand why you shook your head after she said "What else?". It feels like hitting rock-bottom.

A women's beauty, wisdom and sexual appeal can all vanish in a man's head if she shows no vulnerability. Every human needs to depict signs of vulnerability in order to be approachable. This is especially true in romance between 2 people. Men are initially turned on by a woman's confidence, but are eagerly in search of her vulnerable side to assure her that she's safe to confide in them despite her vulnerabilities. That's how men gain a woman's respect.

Sounds like your wife never wanted to give you the respect you deserved. It also sounds like she actually consciously "chose" to be like this despite getting professional advice that encouraged her to behave otherwise. That's a weak score for her in the marriage.

You deserve better.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

synthetic said:


> Your wife lacks emotions and passion. That's quite a turn-off for most men. I can completely understand why you shook your head after she said "What else?". It feels like hitting rock-bottom.
> 
> A women's beauty, wisdom and sexual appeal can all vanish in a man's head if she shows no vulnerability. Every human needs to depict signs of vulnerability in order to be approachable. This is especially true in romance between 2 people. Men are initially turned on by a woman's confidence, but are eagerly in search of her vulnerable side to assure her that she's safe to confide in them despite her vulnerabilities. That's how men gain a woman's respect.
> 
> ...


Love this post...you do deserve better Acorn. This is the truth of all truths right here in this post...a marraige can never have passion without these things ....true Vulnerabity ...and respect for her man... his need for some time, attention, loving. 

I really believe many women do not know what they've got ....until it has walked out of thier lives & they suddenly feel the void....... if she comes back for you...make damn sure she is a changed woman, no more throwing marriage counseling to the wind...you hold the power from here in....

Or you know it......better to move on, not beating a dead horse of a relationship. 

Those Ramen Noodles will taste better than any fine homecooked meal -depending on who you might be sharing it with.... Plenty of women are looking for what you seem to have to offer.... emotional availability & passion.


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## Acorn (Dec 16, 2010)

Well, all the utilities are in my name and as of tomorrow morning the apartment is mine. After all the time it took to get the courage to do the first step, it is surprising how quickly everything can go from there.

I still love her. This hurts a lot. I will miss her hugs the most along with her smile.

I think you are right about the passion. I take ownership of the fact that I have a lot of growing up to do myself. Maybe we were both very broken to start. Maybe I killed hers. In any event, no one did anything to hurt the other intentionally. I would still give it another try if she could meet me in the middle... heck, even if she would just acknowledge that 5+ family events per month is a drain on us, I could probably work with that. 

I hate trying to explain how lonely I am with all these activities and just hear, "Well, that's who I am." as a justification. I could work with it. Just not like that.

Thank you for all your posts, I really needed them today. Thank you.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Acorn said:


> This morning on the phone, I asked her what she was up to this weekend, and she enthusiastically listed all her family obligations and girl dates and playdates for the kids, most of which I am either excluded from or things meant more just for her anyway. She will be busy almost every hour of the weekend except Saturday night. "I guess I don't have anything then", she said, "even though I though I managed to book full up."
> 
> I reminded her that Saturday night she said she'd go out to eat with me. "Oh yeah", she said, "I forgot. Do you mind if we do something low key? I'm going to be really tired with everything going on."
> 
> She heard the disappointment in my voice. "You confuse me. If you want me to do more, tell me and I will." Now, I can't win. I'm the controlling husband if I ask that she saves her energy for me, and if I give in, I will walk away knowing that everyone else gets my wife's all except me. I say it's ok, low key is fine. I'm tired of fighting. She says, "What else?".


For your own health, you need to stop setting her up in situations where she will hurt you. You asked an open ended question hoping that she would include you at or near the top of her list of things to do. You know she won't do that. Yet you still ask the question and are disappointed when she does exactly what she normally does? 

At some point, you need to quit getting upset at her, and start adjusting your expectations. Also, quit hinting around and be direct. If you want to have dinner with her after she agreed to do so, tell her you have made reservations at a certain time or place. Don't make it a quiz where she has to come up with the correct answer, because she will clearly fail every time.

I really think you need to detach and stay away from her. Live your life for yourself and get yourself in a healthy place.


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## Acorn (Dec 16, 2010)

TAG - hard to hear, but thank you, and you are right.

I was reading about attachment styles and mine is called preoccupied, since I am always trying to figure out where I stand in the relationship. With someone like her, I set myself up for failure and make us both miserable.

When I talked to my wife recently, I told her the biggest reason I needed to go was just that. At least one of us would have to get to a healthier place, because this spiral does not work. It may as well be me, since I'll be better for it either way.


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

Hi Acorn ~

I remember some of your earlier posts - you have come a long way. It may not seem like it sometimes, but you have made so much progress. I'm really proud of you. 

I think that people go through the steps of grief (the 5 steps of grieving) when their marriage starts to go south. Knowing that you go through those steps, and some of them you go through over again, might help you realize that you are going through a normal process.

At some point, there is the end stage of acceptance. You'll get there some day ... and I expect that there really will be a mighty oak standing there when you do. 

Best wishes.


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