# confused - secret lunches?



## psychman (Jul 2, 2010)

Hellllllp. I am very anxious and entirely unsure of myself. I am prepared to leave my 26 year marriage, but fear that I am over-reacting. If it were not for my 16 yo son, I am pretty sure I would leave.

My wife has a history of making close friends with men. I never had a problem with it until a situation arose where she spent nearly all of her free time with a male co-worker who then, at a party with friends, extremely humiliated me with personal information he heard from her. My wife responded by laughing. I let her know I was hurt and later told my wife to choose between myself and her friend. She then restricted most contact with him to their work hours.

Since then she has worked hard to keep all her male friendships a secret, despite my attempts to reassure her that I don’t mind if she has men friends. She has always found at least one male co-worker to become close “secret” friends with. Over time I would typically find out through friends and her coworkers about the relationship (offhand comments) and I would try to influence her to be more open by again reassuring her I really don’t mind her men friends. She insisted that I had no need to be concerned and continued being quite secretive.

Then in 2001 I came upon her behaving unusually outside a restaurant (like she was trying to hide her presence) and I watched her go in with a manager with whom she works. That evening she lied about where she had been and when I confronted her with what I had seen, she apologized and admitted that they had become good friends at a recent conference. She insisted that they had never done anything but talk for hours. She promised no more secret meetings with him and to keep the relationship professional.

A year later I found out (from others) that she had continued to secretly meet him regularly at least for lunches. In fact I know she continued meeting him at least for secret restaurant lunches once or twice a month. In fact I could predict when they had lunch or would be in a meeting together because for a couple days before it she would treat me badly (distant and cold, very demeaning remarks, contempt). Then be very nice to me afterwards. 

I have never told her what I know in order to keep the family (we have 3 kids) together and her response is to refuse to talk about these situations and simply become more secretive and sneaky. Plus, all I am aware of is secret lunches (and lots of guy chasing behaviors when away with other women).

In January 2009 the relationship apparently came to an end and she became much more caring and seemingly invested in our relationship. I became much more hopeful about our future.
Then, a couple months ago, I found out that she snuck out to a bar with her male boss while I was on a business trip. She had sent me several demeaning texts that evening and she had lied about where she had been. I have gradually found out that they have started driving each other places and also meeting for secret lunches. All of which my wife hides or lies about. Again she has started being cold on those days and nice during the days following. I thought, “same old pattern”

Then, two days ago I found the following interaction in the “sent” file (erased from the inbox) of the email account primarily used by my wife:

My Wife: Where are you, you slacker?

Her boss: looking over your shoulder like always

My wife: Is that what is breathing down the back of my neck 

Her boss: nope, just looking

My wife: You're peeking again

Her Boss: Nope, A good supervisor keeps the superlative traits of his employees in front of him as he assesses their capcity and best attributes.

My wife: A good employee makes sure her supervisor maintains all exaggerated thoughts in the correct perspective.

Her Boss: That is why team activities are so important to successful interactions between team members. If employees are not forthcoming with their supervisors or embrace their goals related to team building/interactions, enthusiasm can quickly wilt.

My wife: I prefer one on one activities over team activities but I can certainly be a team player in order to keep enthusiasm on the upswing. Supervisors need to be forthcoming with their employees about what goals they would like to see pursued, related to team building/interactions (of course).

Her Boss: We should consider scheduling a retreat. Being outside the office affords folks an opportunity to discuss issues they don't feel comfortable addressing in the work place. As team leader, your input would have to be the most forthcoming.

Note: they had just had the annual team retreat the week before.

My wife: I have to go to a meeting now. Have fun with your family and I will see you at work in a few days.

This suggests more than a secret lunch or drink to me. How do others read it? This would be the first real evidence that my wife is doing something more than eating or talking with her secret male friends. 

I am worn out by the wondering and sneakiness. Am I over-reacting to it? What do others think?


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Repost this on the coping with infidelity forum. It looks bad to me - you are not exaggerating. Question is, do you want to try to save your marriage or just get divorced and move along.

The people who post in the infidelity thread can help you validate what I think you aleady know. They can also give you an idea of how to save this if that's what you really want.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Also, send this e-mail to her employer's HR department. That's just wrong in so many ways - especially as its supervisor/employee - they'll see it (correctly) as a lawsuit in the making. They'll stamp out the office part of the affair, but you'll still need to deal with the rest of the pieces.

What if they go through a layoff process like so many other companies have been forced to do? 

1. If they "break up" and your wife gets lost in the flood, SHE could sue them - claiming it was some kind of retaliation; 
2.If she keeps her job, but other people in the office know about their "friendship" (bet someone does), other people could sue, claiming they were kicked to the curb just because they weren't sleeping with the boss like your wife;


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

I agree - nothing like "de-romanticizing" an affair to throw a bucket of cold water onto them.

Do it.

Send the evidence over and expose make public their affair. Do it in a matter-of-factly way.

You may even want to suggest to HR that you consulted an attorney and your attorney suggested that their company may be liable for damages in creating familial damage if they don't seek to have him fired.

(it's theoretically possible - their company could be liable for the break-up of your marriage if they don't ask - point is you want to spook them)


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## 2Daughters (May 13, 2010)

Tell all..she's screwing around you, but you already know it.


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## psychman (Jul 2, 2010)

Thanks very much. I have always suspected she was screwing around, but never had proof and didn't want to be too "creepy" (the feedback i got from friends) by following or spying on her. Also, part of my wants to know and part of me doesn't. 

If I understand correctly, all reponders believe that the "chat" between my wife and her boss was more than a quick innocent flirt or preparation for something that hasn't happened yet. It is likely that they are already having a physical affair. Also, I may be wrong, but I am wondering if my wife isn't initiating here, which I find really upsetting.


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## Atholk (Jul 25, 2009)

And get tested for STDs


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Do a little research to find out the NAME of the head of the HR department. When you send him/her this email exchance, make sure you make it VERY CLEAR that you are considering your options about whether you are going to sue this company for their allowing this to continue.

But I have to be honest. WTF are you still keeping her for? She's been cheating on you for your ENTIRE marriage.

For the kids? Great. You have just helped teach them TO CHEAT.


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## Atholk (Jul 25, 2009)

turnera said:


> Do a little research to find out the NAME of the head of the HR department. When you send him/her this email exchance, make sure you make it VERY CLEAR that you are considering your options about whether you are going to sue this company for their allowing this to continue.


How can the husband sue the company? He doesn't work for them.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

My husband worked for a major electronics company for over 20 years. Believe me, they will DO SOMETHING to avoid lawsuits. Even if they know they would win.


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## 2Daughters (May 13, 2010)

Not only the threat of a lawsuit, but the it's bad PR...in my case letting my wife know I would do it and in her line of work 'marketing' it is not good pub.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Also - looking for a little help here - but has anyone mentioned that you need to talk to your wife?

"I" think the first step is to talk to HR. THEN talk to your wife.

Normally you go first to your spouse and give them the chance to end it, but I think this is different since he is her BOSS. Plus if you go to her, she'll have a chance to talk you out of it, convince you that it will get her fired - fill your head with more confusing lies that you'll really want to believe.

Good luck.


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## DennisNLA (Jan 26, 2010)

I would also look into installing a program on her phone (flexispy??) to send you her text messages. You should install a voice activated recorder in her car plus a GPS unit to track where she is going. 

Once you have proof, kick her out of the house and be the best father you can to the children still living with you. If SHE IS HAVING an affair, she needs to leave as SHE is breaking up the family.


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## psychman (Jul 2, 2010)

I didn't mention this before because I didn't want to appear to creepy. I have to admit that I have been using a GPS device to track her car for several years. This is how I know about the secret lunches at restaurants that went on for years and her secret get-together with boss at a bar. But, she visits lots of places for her job and I can't tell if all of her stops were for the job or extracurricular activities. Also, I have the email exchange because I obtained her password and I also have looked at phone records. I looked at texts but she deletes the ones that come in from her boss.

So, I have tried to gather direct evidence of an actual physical affair I just don't know if the email exchange is enough. Otherwise I just haven't been sure.

Thank you everyone for all of your advice. I appreciate your time


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## BigB (Jul 4, 2010)

Psych~ in your mind you are sure that your wife has been more than friends with the men that she has been close to over the years. You are in denial and will be till such time as you keep thinking about the kids and not about the reality of this marriage.

With a 26 year old marriage I am guessing you are in your late 40s. It does not matter if she is cheating or not. What matters is that you are miserable. You have been publicly humiliated by your wife and are still with her. Your wife finds it no big deal to have "one on one sessions" with her boss and you are still with her. I have two suggestions for you and both are valid if you think about them with cool head. 

1. Keep on being a cuckold but instead of being in denial, accept it. There are many who allow their wife alternate life to keep sanity and peace at home and no one around you (especially at her office) will think any less of you. 

2. Accept the simple reality that at 16 your son is mature enough to understand that you are miserable and will not resent you if you decide to end the marriage.

I say again - it is not a matter of her infidelity, it is matter of your happiness.


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## D8zed (Mar 12, 2009)

Consider a Private Investigator if you really want proof. I believe you'll get it in spades.


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

Well, your wife has lied and you don't trust her. And you aren't happy in the marriage. So, do you want to save your marriage or get a divorce? Clearly your goals will dictate what evidence you collect and what you do with it. 

Now on to the e-mail question at hand.....I see things a little differently than the other posters. While the e-mail is inappropriate and suggestive, it doesn't prove infidelity. That e-mail is TAME compared to the ones I found on my estranged husband's computer. You are dealing with a liar (and quite possibly a cheater). You need rock solid proof when you confront her. Even with perfect evidence, many cheaters will deny the affairs. If she is cheating there will be plenty of undeniable evidence out there. It is just a matter of finding it.


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