# I think my wife MIGHT be having affair…



## TroyN

I think my wife MIGHT be having affair…she’s asleep right now and I’m looking for some thoughts...

So here’s my story and few things that have happened to me in my brief marriage.

Met my wife three years ago, instant mutual attraction, off the charts sex, and we were engaged 10 months later. She is 27, I’m 30. Wonderful wedding day, good honeymoon - but immediately afterwards things went sour and I’m not sure why. We are approaching the third year of marriage.

Some notes:

1. I worked a lot of long hours in our first year of marriage. Like 10-12 hour days. She did not like this, but I was a manager and we working against some tight deadlines. 

2. After the honeymoon was over, it took us three months to have sex again. Then another two months afterwards to have sex again.

3. After our first year of marriage, she gained a ton of weight, at least 35 lbs. She has been seeing a counselor, and has been on Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. She was on another drug that I forget the name of. She has went through bouts of depression her entire life.

4. I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer. 

5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.

6. We went on a trip for our second anniversary and she refused to sleep with me, and she gave me a dirty look when I tried to initiate sex. I would say that we maybe have had sex 10-15 times in our entire marriage (2 years, 9 months total)

7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.

8. This past December, we went to her companies Holiday party together and her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.

9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women. 

10. We are in marriage counseling. Our marriage counselor once asked her if she thought would be OK if I had my needs met by another woman. She really didn’t have a response.

11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.

Obviously, my marriage is in shambles, I have been thinking about divorce since Christmas. But I love this woman so much…I just feel like something is up.

Thoughts?


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## tom67

You might want to put a voice activated recorder in her car and see what you get.
Personally I would bail on this marriage and quit the mc and find someone who will respect you.
If you don't respect yourself who will?


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## HarryDoyle

Actually, and I hate to say this, a possible affair is the least of your worries.


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## TheCatfish

I'm thinking you may want to bring these things up in marriage counseling and if you are and they are not getting addressed then you may want to choose a different counselor. She may just have a very low sex drive, too.


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## TroyN

TheCatfish said:


> I'm thinking you may want to bring these things up in marriage counseling and if you are and they are not getting addressed then you may want to choose a different counselor. She may just have a very low sex drive, too.


I'm embarrassed to say that we are on our second marriage counselor. The first one sided with me on almost everything, so my wife wanted to find someone new.

I am so confused. Lost and sad. Who I was engaged to is not even the same person I married. 

We have no children. But she wants to have kids. I told her I don't want them until we are at a better place.


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## tom67

Ugh...
Can't have kids if you don't have sex.
Dude she berates you you hardly have sex what is there to save.
Oh and God knows what she is doing and saying about you at work.
Just think about it please.


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## manfromlamancha

While I can see that you have problems in your marriage, what makes you think that she is having an affair ? I can't see it from what you have said.


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## TroyN

manfromlamancha said:


> While I can see that you have problems in your marriage, what makes you think that she is having an affair ? I can't see it from what you have said.


Her physically pulling away every time I try to even embrace her makes me think her needs are being met somewhere else.


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## tom67

TroyN said:


> Her physically pulling away every time I try to even embrace her makes me think her needs are being met somewhere else.


It could be that's why you should put a good sony VAR in her car and one in the house.
Have you checked her cell phone records.
Whether she is cheating or not the level of disrespect would be having me packing her sh!t and wishing here luck.


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## tom67

I would make a surprise visit to her office for lunch.
Hey you have nothing to lose.


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## manticore

TroyN said:


> Her physically pulling away every time I try to even embrace her makes me think her needs are being met somewhere else.


yes man that actually sounds like that is the case, voice recorder is not a bad idea, also check the phone records to see if there is a specific number with lost of texts or phone calls, key logger in the computer to have Access to her social media .


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## ThePheonix

Troy my man, cheating is a two step process. First she loses interest in you. Second she cheats. Her physically pulling away every time you try to even embrace her doesn't necessarily mean she's cheating. What it does mean is that she is repelled by you. Whether she is cheating or not, she has clearly lost interest in you. It will most likely never return. 
Forget MC and reconciliation, declare your relationship dead and make plans accordingly. The quicker you can free yourself from this tomb, the better off you'll be.


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## the guy

Dude you need to go James Bond on her @ss!

You diserve to protect your self from any deceit or betrayal. Damn it son she has given you cuz so spy on this women and protect your self from any more abuse and get to the bottom of this huge degree of disrespect from someone that should be your best friend.

I have been here long enough to know something ain't right and asking your old
Lady ain't going to get you anywhere .

So please do your own investigation and get the intel that will justify your next course of action. Right now
You in a guessing game and that sh!t ain't going to get you o were.

Hell bro get some intel and confront her with actual facts.... It will get you further along then the conjecture you have now.

Come on ...you need to know what your up against so go find out......no matter how painful it is to do this crap to someone you love.

Face it she is not being honest with you so find out what the phucked is up with her.

You diserve to protect your self from any betrayal no matter who it's coming from.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ne9907

i don't think she is cheating on you, I do think she has a problem.
I don't want to come out and say she is mentally unstable, but she might suffer from some sort of mental disease ( I cant think of the word so I can be politically correct.
You mentioned that she totally changed as soon as you two got married, she gained weight, and has been on medication.
Could it be possible that she was sexually abused as a child, and now that you are married, she sees you as an aggressor?
My mind is not working right, I am not being too correct.
She is not cheating, I can almost guaranteed it.
I think she needs individual counseling, at the very least.

Gosh, Wish I could think of the name of the thread where the wife was acting much like yours.
Turns out, she was sexually abused by a family member and once the boyfriend became the husband she began to disengaged because she believed she could not trust her family to keep her safe and love her.

I hope someone else sheds some light on this issue.


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## the guy

Trust your gut and find out for your self
What's really going on
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Malaise

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...=HtPcNa5qrAxX9of5RCku_Q&bvm=bv.59930103,d.eW0

OP check this out. The author has a few others that may be interesting. Links at the bottom.

Good Luck


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## martyc47

manfromlamancha said:


> While I can see that you have problems in your marriage, what makes you think that she is having an affair ? I can't see it from what you have said.


What? there are so many red flags and situations in the story that seem to pop up all the time in cheating threads here.


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## phillybeffandswiss

TroyN said:


> We have no children. But she wants to have kids. I told her I don't want them until we are at a better place.


Smart.

It won't save the marriage and don't let anyone convince you of anything different.


martyc47 said:


> What? there are so many red flags and situations in the story that seem to pop up all the time in cheating threads here.


 I can think of at least 3 other similar scenarios, that pop up in threads, that have nothing to do with cheating.


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## Will_Kane

It doesn't sound like cheating to me. Or if it is, that's the least of your problems. It sounds like she has psychological problems. Winces when you kiss her on the cheek, but then says she wants children with you? What did the marriage counselor say?

Cheaters are involved in cheating. I don't see any sign of that with what you posted. Typical signs of cheating would be guarding the phone, deleting messages, going out with friends you never met. Your wife sounds like she is deeply depressed.

It sounds like the people at work didn't know she was married. How was your wife at that party? Did she seem like she was social and friendly with her co-workers? Aside from her apparent recent dislike and distaste for you, has her personality changed? It sounds like it has, and drastically.

If you want to rule out cheating, get a voice-activated recorder and put it in her car for a couple of weeks. If nothing turns up, I would assume she isn't cheating and that she has other issues that are causing her to act this way.

You bring up working long hours the first year you were married. It is not unusual to read on here of deep-seated feelings and resentments that spring up over misunderstandings. Is it possible that your wife still is resentful of how much time you spent, or are spending, at work? Is that a big change from the time you two were dating?


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## snap

It sounds more like she just generally hates you.

Could you ask her what was the reason she married you if she despises you so much?


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## LongWalk

Her dramatic weight gain tells you a lot. She put on weight to repulse you sexually. She wants you to be a sperm donor.

Whether or not she is cheating is almost irrelevant. You need to get out of this unhealthy relationship. Staying in it will condemn you misery for decades.


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## TheCatfish

She is obviously not meeting your needs. Do you want to spend the rest of your like not getting YOUR needs met? Move on. Sorry to see you going through this but you're among the right friends. We all have our stories and we've been through quite a bit.


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## russell28

TroyN said:


> I think my wife MIGHT be having affair…she’s asleep right now and I’m looking for some thoughts...
> 
> So here’s my story and few things that have happened to me in my brief marriage.
> 
> Met my wife three years ago, instant mutual attraction, off the charts sex, and we were engaged 10 months later. She is 27, I’m 30. Wonderful wedding day, good honeymoon - but immediately afterwards things went sour and I’m not sure why. We are approaching the third year of marriage.
> 
> Some notes:
> 
> 1. I worked a lot of long hours in our first year of marriage. Like 10-12 hour days. She did not like this, but I was a manager and we working against some tight deadlines.
> 
> 2. After the honeymoon was over, it took us three months to have sex again. Then another two months afterwards to have sex again.
> 
> 3. After our first year of marriage, she gained a ton of weight, at least 35 lbs. She has been seeing a counselor, and has been on Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. She was on another drug that I forget the name of. She has went through bouts of depression her entire life.
> 
> 4. I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer.
> 
> 5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.
> 
> 6. We went on a trip for our second anniversary and she refused to sleep with me, and she gave me a dirty look when I tried to initiate sex. I would say that we maybe have had sex 10-15 times in our entire marriage (2 years, 9 months total)
> 
> 7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.
> 
> 8. This past December, we went to her companies Holiday party together and her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.
> 
> 9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women.
> 
> 10. We are in marriage counseling. Our marriage counselor once asked her if she thought would be OK if I had my needs met by another woman. She really didn’t have a response.
> 
> 11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.
> 
> Obviously, my marriage is in shambles, I have been thinking about divorce since Christmas. But I love this woman so much…I just feel like something is up.
> 
> Thoughts?


Before you married her, sex was awesome, she was thin and didn't abuse you and beat you down emotionally.. 

Next time she tells you about the married women at work flirting with the married men, ask who the guy is that she 'flirts' with, then tell her that if she wants to be single again so she can flirt, you'll be happy to start the divorce proceedings. Then she can start to treat you nice again, like she did when you weren't married to her.

As for having kids.. please don't do that until you're sure she's mentally stable and no longer abusing you.

She makes you feel bad about your weight, your job, your sexuality.. Does she do anything good for you since you've been married? Cook? Clean? 

You're young.. no kids.. If you love her, let her go.. if she really loves you, she'll come back to you minus the abuse... You shouldn't have to spend your life without sex, love and caring.. you deserve to have those things. If she can't give them to you, go find someone that will. Let her find a doormat she can wipe her feet on, that seems to be what she wants out of marriage, not love or friendship, but a whipping boy. Let her go marry her work 'friend'.. and with-hold sex from him and make him feel less than attractive..

Work place affairs are difficult to find out... they meet in work, talk all day, have time to plan and sneak.. take lunch breaks together, meet before work, after work, take days off together... Check her phone records, pay stubs... but in your case, I'm not sure I'd even want to find out, I'd just go right to the divorce, because cheating or not, she needs a slap across the face with divorce papers...


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## thummper

From what you've described here I would say you don't have a "marriage." I'm not sure how to classify it, but it seems to be an emotional wasteland for you. Constant arguments, resentment, no affection, no sexual contact. Why are you staying in this?  She may or may not be having an affair, but the point is you aren't getting *anything* out of this relationship. I think it's time to bail out and start over with someone who can really offer you what you want in a marriage.


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## Rottdad42

Cheating maybe, detaching, for sure. Her self esteem is out of whack, wince kissing. That right their would get my attention. You shouldn't do that when someone is showing affection. Crap feeling, believe me. She is behaving in a way you see different. Three years of marriage and two marriage counselors is not good. No kids, besides loving her, what else is their to keep you wanting this marriage. This will only get worse. Sorry you are in this man. Good luck.


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## lifeistooshort

TroyN said:


> Her physically pulling away every time I try to even embrace her makes me think her needs are being met somewhere else.



Not necessarily. I pulled away from my first hb all the time because I didn't want them met by him. They weren't being met anywhere else. In fact, it's possible that part of the reason she's so cranky is that her needs aren't being met at all and she doesn't feel well. Lots of drugs, extra weight, etc. Not that it's your fault, if she won't let you meet them.
I'd be wary of any counselor that sides with one party too. You can't possibly be perfect.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## workindad

OP she may be cheating. Then Again she may not be. 

Either way you need to gtfo of the situation you are in. She cut off sex immediately after your honeymoon. You have no kids and she didn't like the mc who tried to honestly address your marital issues. 

She's not vested in your marriage and you are in for years and years of pain if you stick this out. 

Follow your gut. Get the divorce done. 

If she's not having an affair and I am not certain she is. Then she has a boat load of issues with a big one being that she just doesn't like you at all. Forget about love.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ThePheonix

This chick sounds too much like my ex-wife and that marriage was the impetus that caused me to be what I never wanted to be. Nevertheless, certain anti depression drugs can cause weight gain and loss of sex drive, (especially the selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors). But what the hey, marriage in a lot of cases seem to cause that to.


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## F-102

It could be that:

A) All those drugs are messing with her mind, making her irritated and wanting to lash out at all she sees, but she can't afford to do that at work, so you get the full benefit of it when she gets home.

B) She simply HATES sex, and only gave it to you in order to get you to marry her, then gave you some more on your honeymoon as a "reward" for stepping up to the plate and marrying her. But now that she's "safely" married, why would she HAVE to give you anything again? SHE'S SAFE!!!

C) She's NOT cheating, but she sees all these other ambitious studs at work, and is disappointed in you for not measuring up.

D) She IS having an affair.

I'm leaning towards A and B.


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## Graywolf2

You love the woman you married. Unfortunately, you’re not married to that woman any longer.

Short marriage, you both have jobs and no kids. The only reason to catch her in an affair would be to provide impetuous for divorce which you should do anyway.

It might be fun to snoop, but divorce her no matter what you find. If she suddenly comes on strong for sex, refrain or use a condom. Do not get her pregnant.


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## Malaise

F-102 said:


> It could be that:
> 
> A) All those drugs are messing with her mind, making her irritated and wanting to lash out at all she sees, but she can't afford to do that at work, so you get the full benefit of it when she gets home.
> 
> B) She simply HATES sex, and only gave it to you in order to get you to marry her, then gave you some more on your honeymoon as a "reward" for stepping up to the plate and marrying her. But now that she's "safely" married, why would she HAVE to give you anything again? SHE'S SAFE!!!
> 
> C) She's NOT cheating, but she sees all these other ambitious studs at work, and is disappointed in you for not measuring up.
> 
> D) She IS having an affair.
> 
> I'm leaning towards A and B.


:iagree: I lean towards B , but A is a possibility.

Check out that link I posted above.


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## F-102

Oh, and as for that work party situation, is it possible that she's SEVERELY bad-mouthing you behind your back? Trust me on this one, my mother and sister would do this all the time!


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## Hicks

Why do you need to verify cheating.

She is already cheating. She's cheating you out of a decent marriage. What more informaiton do you need at this point to know she is a bad wife who will by defintion be a bad mother?


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## F-102

Malaise said:


> :iagree: I lean towards B , but A is a possibility.
> 
> Check out that link I posted above.


Sorta like the Eddie Murphy "cracker" skit!

"Mmmm...that was a Ritz!"


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## tulsy

TroyN said:


> ...., I have been thinking about divorce since Christmas. *But I love this woman so much*…I just feel like something is up.
> 
> Thoughts?


What's to love about her?

I'm not sure you know what love really is...there's nothing lovable about her. It's not even ACCEPTABLE.

She sounds like a fricken nightmare. Get a divorce and find a *partner*. A partner has your back and supports you, they don't put you down when you are working hard...do not stay with this woman, because if she gets pregnant it's gonna get a lot worse.

File for divorce, pull a 180, sell the house, split your assets and cut her out of your life completely. You're working all those hours and getting told it's not enough, your constantly being berated and yelled at, there's no sex, she's obviously not attracted to you...why would you want to stay with someone like that?

You got engaged and married way too soon. The person you thought she is; she is not! 

People often have layers to them, and only show you the shiny outside at first....then as time passes they peel off the layers to reveal a rotten core with parasites. You are married to a rotten core.


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## lordmayhem

You are not paranoid, and these are the red flags I see.



TroyN said:


> 4. *I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason*. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer.


The verbal abuse and picking fights for no reason is a red flag when combined with the others below. This is her making you the bad guy to justify in her mind what she's doing. In the midst of my wife's affair, my fWW was doing the same exact thing. All of a sudden she's yelling at me all the time, picking fights for now reason. I was like "WTF is going on here?". I would do even more things in an attempt to please her, and it was never enough. She would come home and yell that I wasn't cleaning the house good enough for her. I find out later its because she was having an EA.



TroyN said:


> 5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and *she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot*. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.


She travels for her job AND complains you don't make enough compared to her male coworkers. This is a red flag of a coworker affair. She's comparing you to OM, who probably makes more than you do and is her coworker.



TroyN said:


> 6. We went on a trip for our second anniversary and she refused to sleep with me, and she gave me a dirty look when I tried to initiate sex. I would say that we maybe have had sex 10-15 times in our entire marriage (2 years, 9 months total)
> 
> 7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.


Being sexually repulsed by you is a red flag when combined with the other ones. If she's banging her coworker, she would become sexually faithful to him. 



TroyN said:


> 8. This past December, we went to her companies Holiday party together and *her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away*. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.


Yet another red flag of a possible workplace affair. This is common from what I've read about workplace affairs. The workers are uncomfortable around you for a reason: They see your wife with the OM all the time and their relationship is no secret in the office.



TroyN said:


> 9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women.


Another red flag. This is now projecting and a subtle hint about what she might be doing. This is just like a WW who complains about the OM at work that bugs her all the time.



TroyN said:


> 10. We are in marriage counseling. Our marriage counselor once asked her if she thought would be OK if I had my needs met by another woman. She really didn’t have a response.


Yes, yet another red flag. Because she doesn't care to have sex with you. If she weren't having an affair, she should be outraged by the question. 



TroyN said:


> 11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.


It doesn't matter if this is a workplace affair. They can have lunches, they can take time off and go somewhere. She can even take vacation time or call in sick, and then pretend to go to work. I've seen this in real life. I had a coworker who went on leave, and then his wife called work wanting to talk to him. And here we thought he went on vacation with his family! Found out he had some girl on the side.

I'm not yet ready to say that she's cheating, because you have found no actual proof. But the red flags here strongly suggest a workplace affair. You need to investigate to make sure. That means VARs, keyloggers on the computer, and checking cell phone records. You may have to drop in unexpectedly during lunch hour with the excuse that you want to take her out for lunch to work on your marriage. That kind of thing. But yes, her behavior definitely warrants further investigation.


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## TroyN

Just a few other notes. 

My wife was heavy when we met, but lost a lot of weight in order to seduce or secure our relationship. Now that she is married, it seems like just working to manage her weight. Her weight is not an issue for me, I'm still very attracted to her, but it makes me think that she has just given up for no reason at all.

Her co-workers know that she is married. She has photos of us on her desk at work and of course she wears her ring at all times. 

Her goal in life is to have kids. I want kids too. I told her in order to have kids we need to be intimate. Again, I get this blank stare.

It is frustrating. I don't know what she wants. I have done my part. I work hard, I get home at reasonable hours, I'm in top physical shape, her parents and family friends seem to love me. 

I know it's largely her issues. It's not to say I'm perfect. I'm not the best communicator but it's hard to WANT TO communicate with someone who is just a genuinely difficult and is always so miserable. I just don't know what I have done...I feel like the expectations are just unreasonable. 

I don't fantasize about being with other women either. But it's hard when I've got friends who are girls who think I'm really good looking. When they comment on a Facebook photo of me, and compliment me, she gets jealous and questions me. So basically, I've got other women validating me and she doesn't even see that she has a really good man in her own presence. 

I don't want to leave her, but what can I do? 

A) She seems to have given up.
B) She is getting her needs met somewhere else and her better judgement tells her to stay because I'm a good guy, but she's depressed because she desires someone else and feels trapped by our marriage. 

:scratchhead:


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## Acabado

> Originally *Posted by F-102* View Post
> It could be that:
> 
> A) All those drugs are messing with her mind, making her irritated and wanting to lash out at all she sees, but she can't afford to do that at work, so you get the full benefit of it when she gets home.
> 
> B) She simply HATES sex, and only gave it to you in order to get you to marry her, then gave you some more on your honeymoon as a "reward" for stepping up to the plate and marrying her. But now that she's "safely" married, why would she HAVE to give you anything again? SHE'S SAFE!!!
> 
> C) She's NOT cheating, but she sees all these other ambitious studs at work, and is disappointed in you for not measuring up.
> 
> D) She IS having an affair.


A+B+D.
Plus she's messed up, maybe ILs are perfectly aware and they are checking you up to guess when they are going to take care ogher once again. Not mutual exclusive with the obvious act she's badmouthing you since the honeymoon as her only friend is her mom (which is already worrisome to beging with).
Get a VAR and you will realize of the need ot getting your doks in line and divorce her whether she's cheating or not.


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## MrK

To me, you are the luckiest man alive. Finding out at 30 that your wife doesn't love you instead of 50 with three kids about to enter college. You get a do-over. You are a GOD to me. 

You get exactly ONE shot at life. Don't blow it by staying with this monster.


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## lordmayhem

MrK said:


> To me, you are the luckiest man alive. Finding out at 30 that your wife doesn't love you instead of 50 with three kids about to enter college. You get a do-over. You are a GOD to me.
> 
> You get exactly ONE shot at life. Don't blow it by staying with this monster.


:iagree:

Whether she's cheating or not, she's not marriage material. 

Married less than three years? No kids? = run. run away fast.

And I would be very wary about the kids thing. She's desperately wanting kids, yet doesn't want sex with you? You probably might not be the father if she does get pregnant.


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## 6301

Here's what you do. Instead of sitting there and taking the verbal abuse, open you mouth and let her know that your not her personal punching bag. 

If this is what you have to come home to every night then what's the sense in being there. Let her know that your up to your ears with her chronic bad mouthing and if she isn't happy she more than free to haul ass out of there.

She's complaining about your weight when she's 35 pound over weight. You should let her know that when it comes to that, then people that live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. 

Your making this monster in your house more powerful every day by sitting there and taking the abuse. Let her know in a way that she understands that your not putting up with her bad mouthing any longer and that she can leave and find some other patsy to pick on. 

It's your choice. Either sit there and take it or put a stop to it. Maybe if she sees that your not going to take any more insults any longer, she'll grow up and act like an adult. If not then point to the door and tell her that's the exit to her new life and once she leaves, don't come back because you wont take her back. Put it in her lap and let her deal with it.


----------



## TroyN

6301 said:


> Here's what you do. Instead of sitting there and taking the verbal abuse, open you mouth and let her know that your not her personal punching bag.
> 
> If this is what you have to come home to every night then what's the sense in being there. Let her know that your up to your ears with her chronic bad mouthing and if she isn't happy she more than free to haul ass out of there.
> 
> She's complaining about your weight when she's 35 pound over weight. You should let her know that when it comes to that, then people that live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
> 
> Your making this monster in your house more powerful every day by sitting there and taking the abuse. Let her know in a way that she understands that your not putting up with her bad mouthing any longer and that she can leave and find some other patsy to pick on.
> 
> It's your choice. Either sit there and take it or put a stop to it. Maybe if she sees that your not going to take any more insults any longer, she'll grow up and act like an adult. If not then point to the door and tell her that's the exit to her new life and once she leaves, don't come back because you wont take her back. Put it in her lap and let her deal with it.


This is sound advice. But when I have fought back, it pushes her further away from me. Like the disrespect gets increased and she begins to internalize the more we fight, the worse our relationship is and sadder she gets. 

It's like this terrible of cycle of control. She wants to control me, but obviously doesn't love me, so what is the control for? 

I honestly think if I went out and screwed one of our interns, she wouldn't even give a crap.

I look at photos of our wedding, then the person I come home to, and it's like two completely different people. She also has seen me look at our photos, and she gets mad at me for doing so and once said "I don't want to look at those, because I was thinner there and I'm fatter now".

WTF.


----------



## anchorwatch

BPD?

This is another member's thread. Is this familiar?
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/physical-mental-health-issues/95401-bpd-wife.html


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## bandit.45

Well you cannot keep living this way. You are 30 and still young, but the years will fly by, and before it you're 46 and halfway to the grave. 

Is this the person you want to spend your whole life with? What has she shown you? Other than selfishnes and contempt?

She is not into you; she never was into you and never will be. She married you because her clock was ticking, she was anxious and had low self esteem, and you were the only guy who would accept her. 

She's frozen in a catch 22: she is not attracted to you enough to have sex with you, but at the same time she is scared as hell you will leave her, because she thinks she won't be able to score another man.

Yeah... she's messed up. But that is her problem, not yours. All you can do is live for you and do what is best for you.


----------



## tom67

bandit.45 said:


> Well you cannot keep living this way. You are 30 and still young, but the years will fly by, and before it you're 46 and halfway to the grave.
> 
> Is this the person you want to spend your whole life with? What has she shown you? Other than selfishnes and contempt?
> 
> She is not into you; she never was into you and never will be. She married you because her clock was ticking, she was anxious and had low self esteem, and you were the only guy who would accept her.
> 
> She's frozen in a catch 22: she is not attracted to you enough to have sex with you, but at the same time she is scared as hell you will leave her, because she thinks she won't be able to score another man.
> 
> Yeah... she's messed up. But that is her problem, not yours. All you can do is live for you and do what is best for you.


It's time to get out of this m and find someone better cheating or not.


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## Graywolf2

TroyN said:


> I look at photos of our wedding, then the person I come home to, and it's like two completely different people. She also has seen me look at our photos, and she gets mad at me for doing so and once said "I don't want to look at those, because I was thinner there and I'm fatter now".
> WTF.


She put on a full court press to transform herself into the woman in that photo. That woman liked sex and you married her. She is jealous of that woman now because that is who you love.


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## bandit.45

Graywolf2 said:


> She put on a full court press to transform herself into the woman in that photo. That woman liked sex and you married her. *She is jealous of that woman now because that is who you love*.


Interesting way of looking at it.


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## lordmayhem

*Re: Re: I think my wife MIGHT be having affair…*



TroyN said:


> I look at photos of our wedding, then the person I come home to, and it's like two completely different people. She also has seen me look at our photos, and she gets mad at me for doing so and once said "I don't want to look at those, because I was thinner there and I'm fatter now".
> 
> WTF.


Because thats not who she really is. The woman you fell in love with was just a fantasy. Time to bail.


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## TroyN

Graywolf2 said:


> She put on a full court press to transform herself into the woman in that photo. That woman liked sex and you married her. She is jealous of that woman now because that is who you love.



Wow. A lot of truth to this.


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## cool12

what an unfortunate series of events.
i'm not convinced that she's cheating but your marriage is definitely on the rocks. if she doesn't want to focus on improving your situation i think i'd consider separating. maybe that would shake some sense into her.


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## alte Dame

You sound trapped only because you still feel yourself in love with her. You don't want to be in love with someone who is contemptuous of you, though, do you?

You are young and physically attractive and by all rights should have a partner who appreciates you. The love you feel isn't healthy for you. Try to detach so that you can see your situation from a more neutral position. Although the 180 is recommended for different situations, you might benefit from it. You certainly need to be able to free yourself emotionally so that you can make the right decision for yourself.


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## ne9907

Graywolf2 said:


> She put on a full court press to transform herself into the woman in that photo. That woman liked sex and you married her. She is jealous of that woman now because that is who you love.


wow, this is such an eye opener.
OP I think it is time to let go of the fantasy your marriage is. I am so sorry


----------



## weightlifter

Lets go thru this line by line:
Numerical rating 1-10 10 being highest affair red flag. Note this is affair related not other related.

1. I worked a lot of long hours in our first year of marriage. Like 10-12 hour days. She did not like this, but I was a manager and we working against some tight deadlines.
3/10 Welcome to being an adult
2. After the honeymoon was over, it took us three months to have sex again. Then another two months afterwards to have sex again.
3/10 BAD BAD juju but not necessarily affair related
3. After our first year of marriage, she gained a ton of weight, at least 35 lbs. She has been seeing a counselor, and has been on Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. She was on another drug that I forget the name of. She has went through bouts of depression her entire life.
2/10 This one leads me a bit away from affair and toward WAW
4. I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer.
6/10 biggie for affair. 
5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.
8/10 HUGE ref poster Russ/John and a bunch of others
6. We went on a trip for our second anniversary and she refused to sleep with me, and she gave me a dirty look when I tried to initiate sex. I would say that we maybe have had sex 10-15 times in our entire marriage (2 years, 9 months total)
3/10 still many causes
7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.
6/10 she aint into you
8. This past December, we went to her companies Holiday party together and her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.
8/10 Yikes. Reference Samdew
9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women.
?/10 Ya know i just dont get a gut feel on this one.
10. We are in marriage counseling. Our marriage counselor once asked her if she thought would be OK if I had my needs met by another woman. She really didn’t have a response.
5/10 could be any but she sure aint into you!
11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.
1/10 neither here nor there.


----------



## weightlifter

My standard 007 post. I will lay out probabilities given the facts you present:

EA 50%/Pre-PA 75% (she is on the build up toward it)
PA 40%

If she was thin and now is in the 160 lbs range @ say 5'5" she is still doable for many men. 

NUMBER ONE THING. DO NOT bring up your suspicions!!!!!!!! Quietly observe.

Standard post cut paste

Your wife is acting funny. Her phone and email suddenly have passwords you don't know. She shuts down phone apps or changes windows on the computer whenever you enter the room. She is suddenly staying out until 2 to 5 in the morning. She has new single friends. She has lost weight and is dressing hotter to boot. Her ex contacted her 3 weeks ago and she wants “to meet to catch up at some public place” Any of this sound familiar? 

If you are reading this your gut is going crazy. “Relax”, in that there is a high liklihood that you are not crazy at least. “Your gut” is your basic instinct from the caveman period. There is something up with your mate. It is part of your mind built into you and in your DNA. You probably cant sleep. You are losing weight like crazy and are not hungry. Well if you are reading this and that is 90% of you reading this if its your first time... You are embarking on what is probably going to be the worst time of your life.

Chin up, yes I know it is damn near impossible to believe now, but I and the people at TAM here have taken dozens of men through this process. Some reconcile, most dont in the long run so be aware. Most of us hang around this grim grim place for a sense of “pay it forward” and “getting at the truth” Even in divorce, the long run the majority find love again... yes really. Often selecting a far far better future companion. Read poster BFF for a thread of disaster, divorce, recovery, and a new wonderful woman in his life. Younger and hotter, yes, but also one with better boundaries, often a far far better personality match. Oh and they get to go through that first time with her after the first I love you's have been exchanged. Just know, that for the majority, even if the marriage crashes, in six months, a year, maybe two you will wonder how you got so far so fast and how great your new life is. You will also be MUCH MUCH stronger as a person.

So. Here are your instructions. Do this now. I dont mean next week. I mean make something up within the next day and GET IT DONE! Not looking will only prolong your agony.
Rule 1 for this.
SHUT UP. Eyes open. YOUR mouth closed. confronting only makes them better at hiding. 
Rule 2 for this.
SHUT UP. Eyes open. YOUR mouth closed. confronting only makes them better at hiding. 
Rule 3 for this.
SHUT UP. Eyes open. YOUR mouth closed. confronting only makes them better at hiding. 

NO MORE CONFRONTS!! Play dumb husband for a bit. Dont drive her further underground! Soft confronts RARELY WORK AND ONLY MAKE GETTING AT THE TRUTH HARDER!!! THIS PROLONGS YOUR AGONY! NEVER give up you get your intel from the VAR. You tell her, you always got your info from a PI or someone saw them. Hard confronts with overwhelming evidence to crush all resistance are the name of the game.

Buy 2 sony ICDPX312 or ICDPX333 voice activated recorders. Best Buy sells them for like 50 bucks. DO NOT BUY THE cheapies. USE LITHIUM batteries. We have examples of 25 hour recordings using them on these sony recorders. My icon IS a Sony ICDPX312. No I do not have stock in nor work for Sony.

Setup instructions are on page 19. Also good stuff on page 31.
Use 44K bit rate for balancing file size vs quality DO NOT USE 8K!!!!! Simply put. The higher the quality the better the sound and 8K sucks. ALSO. The higher the quality the more you can manipulate the mp3 in Audacity.
Set VOR "on" see page 38
See page 40 for adding memory if necessary
Play with it yourself to get familiar. TEST IT OUT 
Turn off the beep feature. Its on one of the menus. You can even play prevent defense by going to a dollar store, buying uber-cheapie earbuds, cut off the buds but put in the jack which will actually disable the speaker for additional protection.

Go to Walmart and buy heavy duty velcro.
This is one item: Velcro Heavy-Duty Hook and Loop Fastener VEK90117: Office : Walmart.com
also
Purchase VELCRO Hook and Loop Fasteners, Sticky-Back, for less at Walmart.com. Save money. Live better.
The velcro is usually in the fabric section or less often in the aisle with the fasteners like screws. The velcro pack is mostly blue with a yellow top. Clear pack shows the vecro color which is black or white. 

Use the velcro to attach the var under her seat UP INSIDE. SECURE IT WELL!!!!!! So well even a big bump wont knock it off. attach one side HD velcro from Walmart to back. USE BIG PIECE
attach other side HD velcro again UP INSIDE car seat. 

ATTACH THE CRAP out of it. It needs to stay put going over big potholes or railroad tracks.
I recommend exporting the sound files to your comp. The recorder is very cumbersome for playback.

Put the second VAR in whatever room she uses to talk in when you are not around. If you are a typical man, use your size advantage to put it someplace she cant reach, even on a chair. Beware spring cleaning season if she does it.

Amazon has a pen VAR that can be placed in a purse or other small place to get remote conversations. Yes the pen works.

Usual warning. If you hear another man and perhaps a little kissing or... STOP Listening and have a trusted friend listen and tell you what went on. Knowing she is a cheat will kill you. Hearing her moan while another man is inside her will murder you to your very soul!!!!!! You are not strong enough to hear that. Dont try it. I know what I am talking about in this.

If you need clean up the recordings get Audacity. Its free from the internet. I have used it on var work for others here to remove things like engine noise. If needed, I have done var work for four men here. RDMU is the only one who has released some of the confidentiality. Read his second thread for my reliability and confidentiality. 

Lets be very clear about what the VAR is for and is not for. It will not be court admissible evidence. It is not for the confrontation. IT IS TO GET YOU AHEAD OF THE AFFAIR so you can gain other real evidence by knowing the who and when. NEVER MENTION YOUR VAR EVIDENCE. As far as the cheater is concerned, they were seen by a PI or something NOT your VAR!!

If your wife comes home from an alone time does she immediately change liners, change panties possibly even immediately laundering them?, shower? This can be an after the fact clean up. Amazon sells a semen detection kit called checkmate.

The ezoom GPS has been found to be easy to buy at Radio shack and useful. There is even a locator webpage you can track with.

Look for a burner phone. This is a second phone from a prepay service just used for cheating communications. That is often why wives let the husband "see their phone" The dont use their main phone for cheating purposes.

There is an app out there called teensafe. Its for both Iphone and Android. It monitors texts, GPS and facebook. Needs no jailbreak. Not perfect and delayed but no jailbreak required.

Look for apps on her phone like words with friends. It has a non traceable texting feature.
Here is a list 25 Apps to Help You Cheat On Your Girlfriend | Complex

If he uses chrome or firefox, there is probably a list of saved passwords you can look at. Even if his email isn't saved there, people usually only use a couple of different passwords, so one from the list might work. 

For firefox it's Tools -> Options -> Security -> Saved Passwords

For Chrome it's the little box with three bars in the top right -> Settings - Show advanced settings -> Managed saved passwords

If paternity is in doubt, (gredit graywolf2) SNP Microarray: Unlike amniocentesis, a non-invasive prenatal paternity test does not require a needle inserted into the mother’s womb. The SNP microarray procedure uses new technology that involves preserving and analyzing the baby’s DNA found naturally in the mother’s bloodstream. The test is accurate, 99.9%, using a tiny quantity of DNA — as little as found in a single cell. 

Credit john1068 01-09-2014
Is her internet browsers set up to use Google as the default search engine? And does she use a gmail account? If so, she can delete here browser history all she wants, that only deletes the history that is localbin the browser itself...

On ANY computer, navigate to https://google.com/history. Log in using her gmail credentials and you'll have all history right there. Cant be deleted unless your wife logs in this same way...she'd only be deleting Chrome, IE, or Firefox history, not the Google history when deleting within the browser itself. 

01172014 1033A

There does not appear to be a function within the Android OS that allows the recall of deleted info as is found on IOS. However, even on Android, When a text is deleted, the OS simply "loses" the address to where it is on the memory chip, but it's still there. 

Go to your computer and navigate to Dr. Fone for Android @ Dr.Fone for Android - Android Phone & Tablet Data Recovery SoftwareAndroid Phone Data Recovery.

You can download a trial version if you're operating system is XP/Vista/Win 7/Win 8 all on either 32 or 64 bit.

Download the program to your computer, open it, connect the Android phone to the computer via the micro USB cable and follow the instructions on the Dr. Fone program. You can recover deleted SMS, MMS, photos (yes, this includes SnapChats), vids, and documents.

Not everything is recoverable because the operating system continues to overwrite the data so if you don't recover this data on a regular basis, you may miss some pieces...

But there are also many Android apps that store deleted files and texts, even some that allow you to download and HID the app (ex. ). 

They are also in her Spotlight Search...don't even need to connect to a computer. All deleted texts are still held onto. Type in the contact TELEPHONE number and every text, even the deleted ones, will show up in the search.

IOS 7 from any home screen put your finger in the middle of the screen and swipe downward. Enter the telephone number and start reading the hits.

IOS 6 from the first home screen, swipe left, enter the telephone number and start reading the hits. 

Credit rodphoto 01162014 
After researching the web for countless hours about software to find deleted messages on my wife's iphone I figured out this super easy method.

From the home screen swipe left to right until the spotlight page appears. Its a screen with the key board at bottom and a box at the top that says "search iphone" type your typical search words, anything sexual etc... All past messeges containing the search word will appear on a list, deleted or not. You'll only get the first line but that is usually enough. Just busted my wife again doing this a few days ago!

Rugs: swipe left on your first page of the main menu.

"spotlight search" under settings -> general -> spotlight search has to show "messages" as ticked. 

Right here, right now: Taking screenshots on iOS devices -> hold down home button and press sleep button. The screenshot will be placed under your photo album.

Also there is an app to "stitch" messages like a panoramic photo, but only for iPad. go to app store and search "stitch". Damn it's 4 am. i need to go to bed. 

Note that this applies only to Spotlight Search in IOS 6 and lower. For IOS 7 running on Iphone 4 and 5, put your finger in the middle of any of the home screens and swipe downward. 

Type in the search string you want (telephone number, contact name, keyword, etc) and it will search every instance in the iPhone where that appears. 

You may FIRST want to go into the Settings>General>Spotlight Search and then check or uncheck the areas that you want to search - make certain that "messages" and "mail" are CHECKED or else your search will not look into these areas. 

The same info is on the spot light on the ipad too ! If the settings isnt checked off, you can find all the same history!


----------



## PhillyGuy13

It sounds like shes just not into you. Maybe she thought she loved you when you were engaged and married, but it sounds like she suddenly had big regrets after the honeymoon. Sex twice a year is unacceptable, let alone in the first year of marriage. 

It just sounds like she immediately regretted getting married. Sorry man.


----------



## russell28

weightlifter said:


> Lets go thru this line by line:
> Numerical rating 1-10 10 being highest affair red flag. Note this is affair related not other related.
> 
> 1. I worked a lot of long hours in our first year of marriage. Like 10-12 hour days. She did not like this, but I was a manager and we working against some tight deadlines.
> 3/10 Welcome to being an adult
> 2. After the honeymoon was over, it took us three months to have sex again. Then another two months afterwards to have sex again.
> 3/10 BAD BAD juju but not necessarily affair related
> 3. After our first year of marriage, she gained a ton of weight, at least 35 lbs. She has been seeing a counselor, and has been on Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. She was on another drug that I forget the name of. She has went through bouts of depression her entire life.
> 2/10 This one leads me a bit away from affair and toward WAW
> 4. I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer.
> 6/10 biggie for affair.
> 5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.
> 8/10 HUGE ref poster Russ/John and a bunch of others
> 6. We went on a trip for our second anniversary and she refused to sleep with me, and she gave me a dirty look when I tried to initiate sex. I would say that we maybe have had sex 10-15 times in our entire marriage (2 years, 9 months total)
> 3/10 still many causes
> 7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.
> 6/10 she aint into you
> 8. This past December, we went to her companies Holiday party together and her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.
> 8/10 Yikes. Reference Samdew
> *9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women.
> ?/10 Ya know i just dont get a gut feel on this one.*
> 10. We are in marriage counseling. Our marriage counselor once asked her if she thought would be OK if I had my needs met by another woman. She really didn’t have a response.
> 5/10 could be any but she sure aint into you!
> 11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.
> 1/10 neither here nor there.



The talking about people in work that are cheating, is a red flag. After discovery, I got lots of x and y are cheating, I think z cheated on w... It's part of the justification, the 'everybody is doing it, it's normal and acceptable behavior'.

They can also be envious of the cheaters, because affairs are all rainbows and unicorns, they might see the co-workers having fun lunch breaks and sneaking off... how romantic it must be... Just like a romance novel.

Before discovery I got jealous when my wife posted to a friend from work on FB about how jealous she was... of her affair with one of the delivery guys. I wasn't happy, told her that I don't appreciate her making me look like a fool.. how stupid to type something like that when you're married, and she got all defensive as if I was checking her facebook.. I had to point out that her activity shows up on other peoples pages, that's how the site works... (she has no FB now)


----------



## Lostinthought61

the last thing you want with your wife at this moment is a child, then she will truly have you....also another thing, this happen to a friend a mine...his wife was not interested in sex with him and in fact went out of the way to come up with ideas to have sex with him where he never came inside her...then suddenly out of the blue, she wants to have sex with him every day for a week, you guessed several weeks later she was pregnant, when eh told me this, my radar went up and i immediately told him that the baby was not his....that she did it to cover her track....so in front of her, i told him and her, in fact i was looking at her, i told him to have the baby DNA and she looked horrified and told me to get out. guess whose baby it wasn't...she broke down before the baby was born. i am not suggesting she is having an affair or she will do this but keep that in the back of your mind if she comes on too you out of the blue. I'm with the other guys...take a Mulligan, its a stroke penalty but trust me you'll be happy in the long run...this is one round you don't want to finish.


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## Fenix

Anti-depressants also play havoc with sex drives. Her behavior is not tipping me off to an affair but it does tell me that she has psychological issues that need to be dealt with by a therapist (and not nec a MFT). She sounds very unhappy and she sounds like she is taking it out on you. Many women have a sort of fairytale attitude about marriage and when it doesn't live up to it (and how can it?), start acting out. An affair in the future is a definite threat. She needs the therapy, not the marriage. After that, maybe marital therapy would help. Maybe.


----------



## TroyN

One final note - before I leave and go home.

The last few times, when we have had sex, she wants me to finish quickly. She says it hurts and she wants me to stop. Lies. I am well endowed, but that never bothered her when we dated. 

I am infuriated by this. We go to places in public and I always see women making eye contact with me. I dress really well, I'm tall, very lean, and I've had women tell me my whole life how attractive I am. I would post a picture to prove everything, but I really shouldn't. Why is that my own wife doesn't even want to hold me hand. 

Anyways - she has also asked that I not wear a condom, but I do anyways because I do not want her to get pregnant at this time.


----------



## Fenix

holymoly, I just read all of the replies. Some of y'all flabbergast me. Troy, she needs therapy. She is unhappy and taking it out on you. If I were you, I would risk an ultimatum and say go see a therapist for your issues or I am out of here. I can't take the abuse anymore. That is if you love her. If not, walk away.

Btw, the desire for kids is a desperate cry to make herself feel better.

And really, it doesn't matter how you look. Forget that ****. You could be star material and the situation wouldn't be any different.


----------



## sinnister

I dont think she's cheating. But she doesnt want you anymore. When a woman repells at the thought of you touching her you it's done. You'll here all sorts of recommendations of books and counselors to see etc. But women dont change their mind once they decide your not who they want to have sex with.


----------



## cdbaker

I'm not convinced one way or the other that this is an affair. There are several good pieces of evidence to suggest it, along with some equally strong evidence that makes it seem less plausible.

Your wife reminds me of mine however, and my wife is not cheating. She is dealing with a lot of past betrayal in her life from the various men she has trusted, her lovers and her father. She struggles to allow herself to be vulnerable and thus tries to avoid any form of contact that might remotely lead me to believe that sexual activity is a possibility. (Like kissing, touching, cuddling, etc.) So my wife isn't getting her needs met elsewhere, she just either has no needs or is suppressing them very well out of fear.


----------



## cdbaker

Regarding her saying that it hurts and wants you to hurry...

Remember that it's not just about your size. If she is tense, not sexually excited herself, stressed, or otherwise feels extreme pressure to give in to the sex for your sake alone, then it may very well be painful for her. Don't assume that just because she's been ok with it in the past that she should always be physically comfortable with it now.


----------



## Fenix

sinnister said:


> I dont think she's cheating. But she doesnt want you anymore. When a woman repells at the thought of you touching her you it's done. You'll here all sorts of recommendations of books and counselors to see etc. But women dont change their mind once they decide your not who they want to have sex with.


Not true. AT all.


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## heartbroken0426

I don't understand why so many people jump to "your relationship is dead....you need to divorce". That's what's wrong with out society. Divorce is like returning a shirt to the store. No...divorce is not a decision you should make lightly. If you can give up on your marriage that quickly, then why did you get married to begin with?

I don't think she's cheating on you....unless she cheated while on the honeymoon. You said you guys used to have incredible sex but after the honeymoon everything went sour. Did something happen on the honeymoon that would make her change her feelings about you? If she was cheating on your....she wouldn't have gained so much weight. When someone is cheating, they do the opposite....lose weight.

I think something happened when you guys got married. You moved rather quickly (getting engaged 10 months later).....how quick did you get married? 

I think POTENTIALLY what happened was that she already has depression issues (which you mentioned she struggled with her entire life) and she may have gotten caught up in the bliss of dating you, great sex, moving quickly etc that when she came home from the honeymoon and it was everyday life....it all changed for her. She went into a sudden depression because of that. Think about when you go on a great vacation and then you come home to going back to work. It's depressing to a degree but you move on. For her....maybe it brought up depression for her and she hasn't gotten out of that cycle yet. The fact that she gained so much weight is a huge sign. Then she yells at you, makes fun of you, seems repelled by you is probably because she's disgusted with herself and she sees how you're still the same guy she retaliates. 

Regarding her co-workers looking at you differently...I bet she's bad mouthing you at work because she needs some excuse as to why she's gained so much weight and probably wants sympathy and tells people bad stuff about you so they support her. She hates herself so she hates you.

I think you need to send her to therapy by herself. She may not be able to be honest with a therapist and get control of her own depression with you there. If she's not ok with herself...she won't be ok in a marriage. Give her time with IC and then go to MC together. Don't just give up on her and throw her out. I hope you married her for good intentions and not just for sex. If so...then show your support.


----------



## Thorburn

Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. I suspect bi-polar. In any case some of these meds can cause the behaviors you are seeing in your wife.

In typical bi-polar disease we see the onset between the ages of 18 and 24. How old is your wife?

Also, some of these meds can cause weight gain.

I don't see cheating, per se, but definetly a severe behavoral disorder.

She is not the person you thought she was and she isn't. The mood swings, etc are all typical of BP or other mental disorders. 

Don't have children with this woman.

She needs help and your life is going to be h*ll. This is not your fault and typically we never see these things coming.

Find out what her diagnosis is and why she is taking these meds. You will get your answer. BP is often times misdiagnosed and there are other things she could have that are very similar. 

Keep in mind that even with meds things may not get better, they may get worse or she might become stable. It is always a crap shoot.


----------



## 6301

TroyN said:


> It's like this terrible of cycle of control. She wants to control me, but obviously doesn't love me, so what is the control for?
> WTF.


 Then why are you there? She's not the same woman you married and she's proven that fact, which brings me back to the question, why are you still there?

That's the question you should be asking yourself and when you decide to answer, don't lie to yourself. 

There isn't any reason to be there. You love her. Fat lot of good that does when she doesn't love you. It's like kissing your sister.


----------



## TroyN

Thanks for all of the responses.

She is 29 now.

We were officially married 7 months after engagement. I saw only two occasions of poor behavior in the entire time prior to us tying the knot. One was when she got into a verbal argument with her brother within the first 20 minutes of our visit to her parent's home. The fight just stemmed from nothing. The other time my phone died my last day of a trip - I wasn't able to communicate with her and she went NUTS. I knew something was up, but sort of ignored it.

She has had a good upbringing. Her relationship with her father is strained - but he's a good guy. Her longest relationship with any guy besides me has been about a year tops, then she dumps them. When I arrived, I met was met with a ton of praise from her family and relatives. They were delighted when I came into her life. Then, a switch went off and I'm not sure why. 

I think a rush of a nice exciting relationship was really what made her happy, and then reality sunk in, and it she was back where she was before she met me. It's like she used me to improve her life, then when I could meet all of her needs (impossible for ANYONE), then I was basically seen as a loser.

One more note I need to add - in the very beginning of our relationship, I actually dumped her because I wasn't really sure about her and her how quickly she wanted to get into a relationship with me. She sort of stalked me, found me FB and wrote me a few messages. Anyways, two days after I dumped her, she apparently went out with a few friends and made out with some guy at a bar. One of my friends happened to see it all unfold. Long story...don't feel like telling it.

She seems to be OK today, no conflict in the past couple of days.


----------



## Tobyboy

Borderline? Bi-Polar?

Drugs don't seem to work....if I had to guess....Borderline. 

I'd hate to be in your shoes. Good luck, cuz you gonna need it!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Will_Kane

Fenix said:


> holymoly, I just read all of the replies. Some of y'all flabbergast me. Troy, she needs therapy. She is unhappy and taking it out on you. If I were you, I would risk an ultimatum and say go see a therapist for your issues or I am out of here. I can't take the abuse anymore. That is if you love her. If not, walk away.
> 
> Btw, the desire for kids is a desperate cry to make herself feel better.
> 
> And really, it doesn't matter how you look. Forget that ****. You could be star material and the situation wouldn't be any different.


I agree with this, but I would hedge my bets by still using a VAR.

She sounds extremely depressed, not happy with herself, probably very upset with her weight gain, especially after having lost a lot of it before. People who feel bad about themselves like this, especially women, sometimes don't feel like having sex, no matter how sexy the guy. I don't know a lot, but I have heard that hormones can play a large part in mood swings with women as well. I would focus in more on her issues about herself, see if she will go to a physician to check for anything physical or hormonal, and also go see a counselor for her individual issues.

I also think you should still use a VAR for a few weeks just to ease your mind about her cheating.


----------



## MattMatt

TroyN said:


> Her physically pulling away every time I try to even embrace her makes me think her needs are being met somewhere else.


Or she doesn't like being touched? People with autistic-spectrum disorders often can't cope with being touched.

Or people who were sexually abused as children.

There's clearly something wrong. But it might not be an affair.


----------



## Plan 9 from OS

TroyN said:


> One more note I need to add - in the very beginning of our relationship, I actually dumped her because I wasn't really sure about her and her how quickly she wanted to get into a relationship with me. She sort of stalked me, found me FB and wrote me a few messages. Anyways, two days after I dumped her, she apparently went out with a few friends and made out with some guy at a bar. One of my friends happened to see it all unfold. Long story...don't feel like telling it.
> 
> She seems to be OK today, no conflict in the past couple of days.


You dumped her and she made out with a guy 2 days afterwards. Don't see anything wrong there TBH. Out of curiosity, what does this incident mean to you?


----------



## funfred

It sounds like she is being treated for bipolar disorder based on the medications she is taking. My wife is bipolar and finding the right meds can be very hard and take a long time. But I know what you are going thru. My wife acted the same way your wife does before we found the right meds.
If you want to give it one more shot, you need to tell her in no uncertain terms that you love her and want to help her but you will not stand by and watch her life keep going like it is. Let her know you will help her, and you together can try to work thru this.
First step is readjusting meds, or finding another Psychiatrist. Be prepared for the bad days and just remember that it is a disease and its not your fault. Make sure she takes her meds too. BP's get to feeling good and think they are cured and stop taking them.


----------



## 86857

Here is my take on it and do remember that I'm no expert. Some is the same as what others have said. 
You seem to deeply love her and I am very sad for you. I feel there is far more to it than a potential EA/PA. Further I have personal experience of your situation which is why I have taken the time to write such a long post and I'm sorry it's so long. 
Also I am NOT a psych. 
- you never saw her in a depression before marriage, it's likely she is in a bad one, possibly a bipolar depression which are more extreme than unipolar
- depressed people are almost impossible to live with 
- in her eyes having a baby will 'fix' her and she is probably resentful of you not agreeing to it and is 'making you pay'
- they see EVERYTHING in a negative light and look at others with envy thinking how wonderful their life is compared to their own, hence complaining about you being thin and not earning enough. 
- they are incredibly irritable ALL the time (a typical symptom) especially with their loved ones as they can't behave like that at work. 
- pretending they are OK to colleagues and the world at large exhausts them emotionally which is why when they get home they 'let it all out' . 
- the amount of time she spends with her Mum is unusual. She is likely running 'home to Mum' feels 'safe' there and she has probably always done that when depressed. I don't think she's running into the arms of an OM.
- I therefore feel you need to discuss all this with her Mum privately to gain insight into her and her previous depressions.
- her previous relationships may have broken down in the way yours has - people with mental illness/depression have a very bad record with relationships - either they or their partner bail once a depression sets in.
- she is 'functioning' in that she is holding down a job which will be a superhuman effort for her
- they have ZERO sex drive and in fact are repulsed by sex
- they have NO self-confidence, made worse by her weight gain and women complimenting you on FB - personally if it were my H, I would think they were interested in him and they likely are and he was entertaining it - I wouldn't like it either!!! Just be mindful of that. You also rejected her once early on - no blame of course - but it doesn't help her mindset. Does she ever mention it?
- depressed people try to sabotage. The psychological explanation is too complex to go into here. She is trying to drive you away although deep down she almost certainly doesn't want to. 
- part of trying to drive you away is talking about colleagues flirting with each other - it's like a veiled threat that she will do the same which is part of her trying to sabotage.
- she may have already tried to flirt at work but nobody took the bait and so she feels resentful of colleagues who are successfully doing it. People who are envious are always talking and thinking about what others have that they don't and her failure at doing it might further erode her self-confidence. 
- if she was having an EA/PA at work I think the last thing she would do is tell you that others at her work were flirting/having affairs
- if she is trying to flirt with colleagues it may explain why they were uncomfortable with you. 
- she may be also bad-mouthing you to them because she resents you. I know she shouldn't resent you - that's her twisted thinking right now 
- the general population don't understand that people who are in a major depression are not sane as such, their thinking is distorted and their mind is seriously broken. Think of having a broken leg and trying to walk. They have a broken mind and are trying to function normally which they are incapable of. It's as if they have been made to let go of the steering wheel of their emotions and have lost control and the power of rational thinking. I am not exaggerating - the irritability is a good example - they can't stop themselves.
- I'm not a psychiatrist but I strongly suspect she has bipolar. She had depression all of her life and she is only 27 - a red flag for BPD.
- I have a few friends who have BPD. Drugs may or may not work and some of them have tried dozens of meds and combinations of meds before they got something that would work.
- my bipolar friends when they are 'up' are the most amazing people to be around and in fact others are drawn to them like magnets. When something good happens it triggers them into an 'up'. When she met you it probably triggered her into an up. Also when they are up, their sex drive is off the scale. You mentioned how it was early on.
- when something negative happens it triggers them into a down. My friends are like different people when they are in a downer. As soon as the honeymoon was over you worked long hours. Suddenly her fairytale seemed over and she probably felt abandoned - you said she didn't like it. Most people would be able to cope and would even encourage it to save money but bipolar people are overly sensitive to negative or positive things happening and it acts as a trigger putting them into an upward or downward spiral. She was home alone and had time to dwell on how life had changed. What you described happening seems to fit this picture.
- lamictal, one of her meds is a first line med for bipolar. Do you go with her to her psych? It might be a good idea to go or to at least try to talk to him/her in confidence. 
- also remember that bipolars are often incorrectly diagnosed as just having depression & some depression meds can actually make the BPD worse, make sure to see a psych who knows how to check for bipolar - this is critical.

*If I'm right about all this you are in effect her carer for now, think of it as if she had broken her leg or was diagnosed with a disease. *

In conclusion I believe she loves you - she was intensely upset when you broke it up early on (I wouldn't worry about her getting with a guy after your breakup. The rebound is a common reaction to a breakup), she was very loving in the beginning, she didn't like you being away from her, she is jealous of other women's FB comments about you and she wants you to be the father of her child. The fact that she wants a baby when your relationship is this bad shows just how distorted her thinking is and how at some deep level she thinks it will fix her. 

I will likely get stomped on because posters may say I am excusing all of her behaviour on depression but frankly her behaviour is typical of it. Also she has a long history of depression and is on meds so there is no doubt she is suffering from it. And frankly I don't see much evidence of an EA/PA. Only you will know if what I am saying is the case. 

I do think you need to know whether she is having an EA/PA for many reasons, the main one being that if she has gone to that point it may be a dealbreaker for you. Snoop as much as you can, emails, texts, VAR, phone bills. 
Talk to her Mum and tell her you are very worried about her and try to find out what she says to her Mum to gain insight. Try to find out if she was abused because her behaviour suggests she may have been and it may be that rather than a mental illness. 

You need to then decide if you will stay and try to help her get better. It won't be easy but it will be worth it if you get back the girl you married and there is every chance you will if her depression is causing all this. 

If you decide to stay I think you really need to be a more active part of the treatment she is already undergoing. You need to buy a book for spouses living with partners who have depression & check out Google. 
You need to talk to her - not about whether she loves you and why she is acting like that towards you. Rather you have to take you out of the equation and focus on her mental state. Show empathy and tell her you don't know what it's like to be depressed but could she try and explain it to you because then you will be in a position to help her. Tell her it must be horrible to have to go through it. 
Basically try to get her to open up about it and read books or talk to her shrink privately as well as going there with her - a good psych will usually ask the partner to come to at least some visits. 
Forget about sex for now but try to hug her and cuddle her. When you can feel her soften and relaxing into a hug it will be a sign that the girl you married is still there and you are getting somewhere. Tell her that you want her to be well again and when she is you can certainly look at having a baby so that she doesn't feel that you will never agree to it - that is if you feel that way. 
Do bring yourself into it, but not too soon and use the 'I feel hurt' and not the accusatory 'you hurt me'. Tell her that her behaviour is hurting you and making you miserable and you want to help her get back on track to the wonderful relationship you had before. Also reassure her that thousands and thousands of people who have BPD or depression/mental illness have been treated successfully and are leading normal lives. If she is BPD encourage her to go to a local support group. My BPD friends say that it really helped them as they didn't have to explain how they were feeling because they all understood what each other were going through. 

I will stress again that I am not a psych and I may not be reading the situation correctly but everything that you mentioned seemed to fit in with what I thought about it when I first read your post. I sympathise greatly and I hope TAM will help you work though it whatever happens. You could also join a forum for those who are dealing with partners who have BPD/mental illness.

Take care of yourself too and lean on close friends/family and on TAM for support. 
**********


----------



## john117

If the answer to the following two questions is a resounding yes then I would wager BPD more than plain depression or bipolar:

1 - can she regulate her emotions at the level expected of a 29 year old professional woman or does she become unglued at the first opportunity?

2 - does she behave like she despises you yet always needs to talk or interact with you?

If BPD is in the list of options a PA/EA would not be ruled out but I doubt it.


----------



## TroyN

********** said:


> Here is my take on it and do remember that I'm no expert. Some is the same as what others have said.
> You seem to deeply love her and I am very sad for you. I feel there is far more to it than a potential EA/PA. Further I have personal experience of your situation which is why I have taken the time to write such a long post and I'm sorry it's so long.
> Also I am NOT a psych.
> - you never saw her in a depression before marriage, it's likely she is in a bad one, possibly a bipolar depression which are more extreme than unipolar
> - depressed people are almost impossible to live with
> - in her eyes having a baby will 'fix' her and she is probably resentful of you not agreeing to it and is 'making you pay'
> - they see EVERYTHING in a negative light and look at others with envy thinking how wonderful their life is compared to their own, hence complaining about you being thin and not earning enough.
> - they are incredibly irritable ALL the time (a typical symptom) especially with their loved ones as they can't behave like that at work.
> - pretending they are OK to colleagues and the world at large exhausts them emotionally which is why when they get home they 'let it all out' .
> - the amount of time she spends with her Mum is unusual. She is likely running 'home to Mum' feels 'safe' there and she has probably always done that when depressed. I don't think she's running into the arms of an OM.
> - I therefore feel you need to discuss all this with her Mum privately to gain insight into her and her previous depressions.
> - her previous relationships may have broken down in the way yours has - people with mental illness/depression have a very bad record with relationships - either they or their partner bail once a depression sets in.
> - she is 'functioning' in that she is holding down a job which will be a superhuman effort for her
> - they have ZERO sex drive and in fact are repulsed by sex
> - they have NO self-confidence, made worse by her weight gain and women complimenting you on FB - personally if it were my H, I would think they were interested in him and they likely are and he was entertaining it - I wouldn't like it either!!! Just be mindful of that. You also rejected her once early on - no blame of course - but it doesn't help her mindset. Does she ever mention it?
> - depressed people try to sabotage. The psychological explanation is too complex to go into here. She is trying to drive you away although deep down she almost certainly doesn't want to.
> - part of trying to drive you away is talking about colleagues flirting with each other - it's like a veiled threat that she will do the same which is part of her trying to sabotage.
> - she may have already tried to flirt at work but nobody took the bait and so she feels resentful of colleagues who are successfully doing it. People who are envious are always talking and thinking about what others have that they don't and her failure at doing it might further erode her self-confidence.
> - if she was having an EA/PA at work I think the last thing she would do is tell you that others at her work were flirting/having affairs
> - if she is trying to flirt with colleagues it may explain why they were uncomfortable with you.
> - she may be also bad-mouthing you to them because she resents you. I know she shouldn't resent you - that's her twisted thinking right now
> - the general population don't understand that people who are in a major depression are not sane as such, their thinking is distorted and their mind is seriously broken. Think of having a broken leg and trying to walk. They have a broken mind and are trying to function normally which they are incapable of. It's as if they have been made to let go of the steering wheel of their emotions and have lost control and the power of rational thinking. I am not exaggerating - the irritability is a good example - they can't stop themselves.
> - I'm not a psychiatrist but I strongly suspect she has bipolar. She had depression all of her life and she is only 27 - a red flag for BPD.
> - I have a few friends who have BPD. Drugs may or may not work and some of them have tried dozens of meds and combinations of meds before they got something that would work.
> - my bipolar friends when they are 'up' are the most amazing people to be around and in fact others are drawn to them like magnets. When something good happens it triggers them into an 'up'. When she met you it probably triggered her into an up. Also when they are up, their sex drive is off the scale. You mentioned how it was early on.
> - when something negative happens it triggers them into a down. My friends are like different people when they are in a downer. As soon as the honeymoon was over you worked long hours. Suddenly her fairytale seemed over and she probably felt abandoned - you said she didn't like it. Most people would be able to cope and would even encourage it to save money but bipolar people are overly sensitive to negative or positive things happening and it acts as a trigger putting them into an upward or downward spiral. She was home alone and had time to dwell on how life had changed. What you described happening seems to fit this picture.
> - lamictal, one of her meds is a first line med for bipolar. Do you go with her to her psych? It might be a good idea to go or to at least try to talk to him/her in confidence.
> - also remember that bipolars are often incorrectly diagnosed as just having depression & some depression meds can actually make the BPD worse, make sure to see a psych who knows how to check for bipolar - this is critical.
> 
> *If I'm right about all this you are in effect her carer for now, think of it as if she had broken her leg or was diagnosed with a disease. *
> 
> In conclusion I believe she loves you - she was intensely upset when you broke it up early on (I wouldn't worry about her getting with a guy after your breakup. The rebound is a common reaction to a breakup), she was very loving in the beginning, she didn't like you being away from her, she is jealous of other women's FB comments about you and she wants you to be the father of her child. The fact that she wants a baby when your relationship is this bad shows just how distorted her thinking is and how at some deep level she thinks it will fix her.
> 
> I will likely get stomped on because posters may say I am excusing all of her behaviour on depression but frankly her behaviour is typical of it. Also she has a long history of depression and is on meds so there is no doubt she is suffering from it. And frankly I don't see much evidence of an EA/PA. Only you will know if what I am saying is the case.
> 
> I do think you need to know whether she is having an EA/PA for many reasons, the main one being that if she has gone to that point it may be a dealbreaker for you. Snoop as much as you can, emails, texts, VAR, phone bills.
> Talk to her Mum and tell her you are very worried about her and try to find out what she says to her Mum to gain insight. Try to find out if she was abused because her behaviour suggests she may have been and it may be that rather than a mental illness.
> 
> You need to then decide if you will stay and try to help her get better. It won't be easy but it will be worth it if you get back the girl you married and there is every chance you will if her depression is causing all this.
> 
> If you decide to stay I think you really need to be a more active part of the treatment she is already undergoing. You need to buy a book for spouses living with partners who have depression & check out Google.
> You need to talk to her - not about whether she loves you and why she is acting like that towards you. Rather you have to take you out of the equation and focus on her mental state. Show empathy and tell her you don't know what it's like to be depressed but could she try and explain it to you because then you will be in a position to help her. Tell her it must be horrible to have to go through it.
> Basically try to get her to open up about it and read books or talk to her shrink privately as well as going there with her - a good psych will usually ask the partner to come to at least some visits.
> Forget about sex for now but try to hug her and cuddle her. When you can feel her soften and relaxing into a hug it will be a sign that the girl you married is still there and you are getting somewhere. Tell her that you want her to be well again and when she is you can certainly look at having a baby so that she doesn't feel that you will never agree to it - that is if you feel that way.
> Do bring yourself into it, but not too soon and use the 'I feel hurt' and not the accusatory 'you hurt me'. Tell her that her behaviour is hurting you and making you miserable and you want to help her get back on track to the wonderful relationship you had before. Also reassure her that thousands and thousands of people who have BPD or depression/mental illness have been treated successfully and are leading normal lives. If she is BPD encourage her to go to a local support group. My BPD friends say that it really helped them as they didn't have to explain how they were feeling because they all understood what each other were going through.
> 
> I will stress again that I am not a psych and I may not be reading the situation correctly but everything that you mentioned seemed to fit in with what I thought about it when I first read your post. I sympathise greatly and I hope TAM will help you work though it whatever happens. You could also join a forum for those who are dealing with partners who have BPD/mental illness.
> 
> Take care of yourself too and lean on close friends/family and on TAM for support.
> **********


This was incredibly insightful and really does describe my wife to T. Thank you so much for writing this.

She mentioned a particular situation in college where she did suffer some abuse. Apparently, she was a heavy drinker in college and she went to a party and completely blacked out. Some random guy did take advantage of her of sexually. She luckily was able to escape in the middle of this happening.

It was also in college where she began counseling for depression.

But she has always had problems with behavior - she used to fight with her mother extensively as teen, but her relationship got better with time.

She holds a professional job. She works in human resources and deals with new hires and has the most bubbly of personalities. I've watched her. Then, at home, she is a beast. 

I do feel helpless at times. I think if I try to help her, she then begins to think that I think that she's a mess and gets even more depressed with the situation. 

I also need to realize that this is a adult. Some of the things that she has said to me would turn anyone's stomach. Do you blame this on her depression/bi polar disorder, or do you reprimand her as normally functioning human being and watch her explode on me and further push her away. 

My parents know something is up with her. They see that I've changed and, in their words, I looked like a "whipped dog".

Thanks for all of the responses.


----------



## Malaise

Have you read up on BPD?


----------



## TroyN

john117 said:


> If the answer to the following two questions is a resounding yes then I would wager BPD more than plain depression or bipolar:
> 
> 1 - can she regulate her emotions at the level expected of a 29 year old professional woman or does she become unglued at the first opportunity?


Unglued whenever I disagree with anything she says. I have to always pacify. The only way I can get in a word edge wise is when I talk with her over the phone while we are both at work. That way, her co-workers won't see her blow up. 



john117 said:


> 2 - does she behave like she despises you yet always needs to talk or interact with you?


Yes. But it's more about how we don't have enough money (for her), or how someone is doing something better than we are. It's like she can't find anything positive in ANYTHING we do. I've never been treated like this in my entire life. I once told her "I feel like all you do is yell at me."


----------



## weightlifter

@86857 post was materful.

Disagree on the EA PA part. The coworkers looking at you funny is really hitting my gut. Either she is doinking someone, trying to doink someone, or she said you beat her or something.


----------



## TroyN

Malaise said:


> Have you read up on BPD?


Yes, she seems to meet all the criteria. But part of me wonders if she is just a huge ***** or really disordered. I mean, she does seek counseling on her own so she knows something is up. But individual counseling and marriage counseling have done nothing for her. We'll come out marriage counseling and she'll just verbally beat the crap out of me later that night and forget everything the counselor said. 

It's beyond frustrating.


----------



## Fenix

Loved **********'s response and rec to speak to her mother.


----------



## melw74

I agree with the PP, I believe its stories shes Probably been telling her co workers, I was going to say shes been telling them stuff about you, cant say what sort of things, but by what you have said by the people looking at you, Maybe they're checking you out trying to picture the things she has said, Maybe.

I cant say if shes having affair, from what you have said things had started to change as soon as the honeymoon period was over, so a bit quick.

Not liking the way shes treating you at all to be honest, what with her wincing when you kissed her on the CHEEK, this is the part that gets me thinking there is somebody else, as when my ex cheated he acted weird when i tried to touch him...

And the no sex.......... I feel for you.


----------



## weightlifter

Moonshadows post was masterful.

Disagree on her take on the EA PA part. The coworkers looking at you funny is really hitting my gut. Either she is doinking someone, trying to doink someone, or she said you beat her or something. ALL are bad.

I can identify with the parents thing. My parents want me to divorce and have as I found out recently for years not the months I thought. That one came as a shocker. Then when I told my dad I had to stay married because of career limbo so she will move with me if necessary he told me to get me "a NICE girlfriend." The emphasis was NOT on sex it was on nice meaning someone who treats you well. I explained I cant break my vows and cheat. He admired that in one way then told me I have a hard road. Tell me about it. Then again I read about thebadguy and well it COULD be worse.


----------



## TroyN

weightlifter said:


> Moonshadows post was materful.
> 
> Disagree on the EA PA part. The coworkers looking at you funny is really hitting my gut. Either she is doinking someone, trying to doink someone, or she said you beat her or something.


What I'm thinking is that she is not cheating, but she is probably wondering if she can get a better deal since I'm so "awful" - which is a joke. I agree that if she was actually cheating, she would have lost a lot of weight to get with someone. She did not have a boyfriend when she met me, but she did lose weight in order to seduce me. I would be thinking this would be happening right now if another guy is in picture.


----------



## Malaise

TroyN said:


> What I'm thinking is that she is not cheating, but she is probably wondering if she can get a better deal since I'm so "awful" - which is a joke. I agree that if she was actually cheating, she would have lost a lot of weight to get with someone. She did not have a boyfriend when she met me, but she did lose weight in order to seduce me. *I would be thinking this would be happening right now if another guy is in picture*.


Understand that a lot of guys would not care about her weight , they would just want to use her and move on.


----------



## tom67

TroyN said:


> What I'm thinking is that she is not cheating, but she is probably wondering if she can get a better deal since I'm so "awful" - which is a joke. I agree that if she was actually cheating, she would have lost a lot of weight to get with someone. She did not have a boyfriend when she met me, but she did lose weight in order to seduce me. I would be thinking this would be happening right now if another guy is in picture.


Cheating or not do you want to live like this?
Of course not.
She will only do to you what you allow her.
so start respecting yourself and change this dynamic.


----------



## Malaise

tom67 said:


> Cheating or not do you want to live like this?
> Of course not.
> *She will only do to you what you allow her.*
> so start respecting yourself and change this dynamic.


Trust me on this.


----------



## john117

Given the confirmation of two obvious traits of BPD I would say start looking for that direction. I would not worry about affairs at this point, likely what you see is attention seeking. 

The curious looks from her coworkers could be due to the way she's painting you to them on office chit chat.

Read up on BPD and maybe other disorders like NPD and you will get a better feel if the symptoms and typical behaviors chime with what you're experiencing.


----------



## cdbaker

Plan 9 from OS said:


> You dumped her and she made out with a guy 2 days afterwards. Don't see anything wrong there TBH. Out of curiosity, what does this incident mean to you?


She was in her early twenties and had just been dumped. I dont' think it's unreasonable/wrong/terribly ****ty for any young woman to go out (or be taken out) with her girlfriends for a quick rebound make-out session with some guy at a bar. Guys do the same thing all the time. I'm not saying she doesn't have issues but I think it's hardly fair to judge her for this.


----------



## cdbaker

I'm inclined to think that she has shared her frustrations with her co-workers and that might be why they are looking at you funny. There is also the chance that your concern about a possible EA/PA made you overly sensitive to them and maybe they weren't looking at you funny at all, but you felt like they were because you were looking for just such a reaction? Just saying it's a possibility.

Ultimately you've just got to get her mental issue figured out. What the diagnosis is, what the right meds are, etc. and see if you can love the person who emerges, if she is willing to get to that point at all...


----------



## Farmer_J

TroyN said:


> What I'm thinking is that she is not cheating, but she is probably wondering if she can get a better deal since I'm so "awful" - which is a joke. I agree that if she was actually cheating, she would have lost a lot of weight to get with someone. She did not have a boyfriend when she met me, but she did lose weight in order to seduce me. I would be thinking this would be happening right now if another guy is in picture.


I wouldn't exactly say that she would have to lose weight for her to find someone......Women have that advantage, that most men don't.

My wife was 250 & found a guy she knew via facebook.....then found more guy on an dating site (specifically for bigger women).

So, I wouldn't rule out her cheating totally. 
Look at what she does on her phone....
She could be using her computer at work....


----------



## ecotime47

Dude, is there any chance you could get your wife to read "The Respect Dare" by Nina Roesner? It's about how she realized she was sabotaging her own marriage and what she did to change her attitude. I heard her talking about it on a radio show this morning. It sounds like it would be perfect for her. The Power of Unconditional Respect in Marriage (Part 1 of 2) | Focus on the Family

Good luck!


----------



## Chaparral

TroyN said:


> What I'm thinking is that she is not cheating, but she is probably wondering if she can get a better deal since I'm so "awful" - which is a joke. I agree that if she was actually cheating, she would have lost a lot of weight to get with someone. She did not have a boyfriend when she met me, but she did lose weight in order to seduce me. I would be thinking this would be happening right now if another guy is in picture.


The weight loss, extra makeup, going to the gym are very common with the cheating wives we see here.

One thing that may be confusing, on this site BPD stand for Borderline Personality Disorder I'm fairly certain. Many cheaters here have that. You can IM pidge to get info about that hopefully. Bipolar is a completely different disorder.

Unfortunately we see a lot of people with bipolar cheating here too.

I agree it doesn't look that way too. I think you should get one var and record some of her abusive remarks and play them for her IC and MC.

Put a var in her car, even if she is not cheating you may get a lot of info helpful to you both.


----------



## lordmayhem

john117 said:


> If the answer to the following two questions is a resounding yes then I would wager BPD more than plain depression or bipolar:
> 
> 1 - can she regulate her emotions at the level expected of a 29 year old professional woman or does she become unglued at the first opportunity?
> 
> 2 - does she behave like she despises you yet always needs to talk or interact with you?
> 
> If BPD is in the list of options a PA/EA would not be ruled out but I doubt it.


There have been quite a few stories here where the WW was BPD and also cheating. Therefore, an affair cannot be ruled out. Berilo's story clearly stands out.


Berilo's Thread

Distressed

And here is a VERY VERY similar story, damn near a carbon copy of this one. Complete with losing weight and incredible sex while dating. Then the sex stops right after getting married. He later finds out that she was indeed cheating on him.

Do you think my wife cheated on me?


----------



## poida

it sounds to me like your wife may have some serious self-esteem issues that go WAY back that she needs to deal with before she can be in a relationship. I agree with some other posters. I think your marriage is the least of her issues. Sorry you had to hear that. I know what it is like to love someone so involved in themselves.
Cut her loose and move on with your life. This sounds like a life nobody deserves.


----------



## TroyN

OK - so were are basically just existing as a couple right now. It’s the same old, same old. 

The thing is that I have a pretty full life outside of our relationship - but she seems to hate my hobbies and doesn’t like most of my friends. I am pretty happy with everything in my life, except my wife, and she is not happy in her personal life and our marriage.

Here’s the thing, when we do go out, she likes to talk crap about whoever was at the party or social gathering we just attended. So, on the car ride home she’ll will just complain about how the food wasn’t good, she was annoyed by a few of the people, etc. I’m just trying to help, but she just is doing the glass half empty thing.

We both have Facebook accounts but I don’t use mine very often. Last night I looked at her page and she had a few updates from the past couple of months. A lot of "woe is me" type stuff. "Only sunshine after the rain” was a post last month, and another was “Life…is this really it?” 

So, obviously my wife is just miserable - maybe just too miserable to even cheat.

So I questioned her on those posts and she really didn’t say anything. She gave me a blank stare and kept watching TV. 

Naturally, I got pissed off and I asked her why she wrote those things and her response was “why does this have to be so hard, I feel like our relationship is going nowhere.” 

So, we are in a tough place. I am really close to ending it. I feel like I am no longer accountable for her happiness and that she needs to take charge of her own life. 

Maybe she’s feels like she is getting a raw deal with me - but I can’t explain why she should feel this way. Like I stated earlier, we are well off, no debt, really nice house, no kids, two cats. I feel like I’ve done my part to make her life easy and good and she has done absolutely nothing for me personally. 

Does she really feel like she can get a better deal? I feel like I’ve always measured up pretty well.

I don’t deserve this treatment.


----------



## Janky

TroyN said:


> OK - so were are basically just existing as a couple right now. It’s the same old, same old.
> 
> The thing is that I have a pretty full life outside of our relationship - but she seems to hate my hobbies and doesn’t like most of my friends. I am pretty happy with everything in my life, except my wife, and she is not happy in her personal life and our marriage.
> 
> Here’s the thing, when we do go out, she likes to talk crap about whoever was at the party or social gathering we just attended. So, on the car ride home she’ll will just complain about how the food wasn’t good, she was annoyed by a few of the people, etc. I’m just trying to help, but she just is doing the glass half empty thing.
> 
> We both have Facebook accounts but I don’t use mine very often. Last night I looked at her page and she had a few updates from the past couple of months. A lot of "woe is me" type stuff. "Only sunshine after the rain” was a post last month, and another was “Life…is this really it?”
> 
> So, obviously my wife is just miserable - maybe just too miserable to even cheat.
> 
> So I questioned her on those posts and she really didn’t say anything. She gave me a blank stare and kept watching TV.
> 
> Naturally, I got pissed off and I asked her why she wrote those things and her response was “why does this have to be so hard, I feel like our relationship is going nowhere.”
> 
> So, we are in a tough place. I am really close to ending it. I feel like I am no longer accountable for her happiness and that she needs to take charge of her own life.
> 
> Maybe she’s feels like she is getting a raw deal with me - but I can’t explain why she should feel this way. Like I stated earlier, we are well off, no debt, really nice house, no kids, two cats. I feel like I’ve done my part to make her life easy and good and she has done absolutely nothing for me personally.
> 
> Does she really feel like she can get a better deal? I feel like I’ve always measured up pretty well.
> 
> I don’t deserve this treatment.


She sounds like a coward who would rather treat you like dirt and make you end it rather than do it herself.

I really dont see the point in spying on her at all.


----------



## just got it 55

TroyN said:


> Yes, she seems to meet all the criteria. But part of me wonders if she is just a huge ***** or really disordered. I mean, she does seek counseling on her own so she knows something is up. But individual counseling and marriage counseling have done nothing for her. We'll come out marriage counseling and she'll just verbally beat the crap out of me later that night and forget everything the counselor said.
> 
> It's beyond frustrating.


OP I don't need to write a novel here

I don't think she is cheating

I do think she has "issues"

55


----------



## SF-FAN

TroyN said:


> OK - so were are basically just existing as a couple right now. It’s the same old, same old.
> 
> The thing is that I have a pretty full life outside of our relationship - but she seems to hate my hobbies and doesn’t like most of my friends. I am pretty happy with everything in my life, except my wife, and she is not happy in her personal life and our marriage.
> 
> *Here’s the thing, when we do go out, she likes to talk crap about whoever was at the party or social gathering we just attended. So, on the car ride home she’ll will just complain about how the food wasn’t good, she was annoyed by a few of the people, etc. I’m just trying to help, but she just is doing the glass half empty thing.*
> 
> We both have Facebook accounts but I don’t use mine very often. Last night I looked at her page and she had a few updates from the past couple of months. A lot of "woe is me" type stuff. "Only sunshine after the rain” was a post last month, and another was “Life…is this really it?”
> 
> So, obviously my wife is just miserable - maybe just too miserable to even cheat.
> 
> So I questioned her on those posts and she really didn’t say anything. She gave me a blank stare and kept watching TV.
> 
> Naturally, I got pissed off and I asked her why she wrote those things and her response was “why does this have to be so hard, I feel like our relationship is going nowhere.”
> 
> So, we are in a tough place. I am really close to ending it. I feel like I am no longer accountable for her happiness and that she needs to take charge of her own life.
> 
> Maybe she’s feels like she is getting a raw deal with me - but I can’t explain why she should feel this way. Like I stated earlier, we are well off, no debt, really nice house, no kids, two cats. I feel like I’ve done my part to make her life easy and good and she has done absolutely nothing for me personally.
> 
> Does she really feel like she can get a better deal? I feel like I’ve always measured up pretty well.
> 
> I don’t deserve this treatment.


Sorry that you are going through this. My wife did cheat on me and so I am dealing with that but I do want to point out one thing that my WW has in common with yours. My WW also likes to talk bad about others (pretty much everyone and everything), it's hard for her to have a normal clean conversation unless it's talking bad about someone or complaining about something. I wonder if they share a similar disorder. My WW is attractive but is ugly inside and says she doesn't feel attractive because during her childhood she was verbally abused?


----------



## F-102

Janky said:


> She sounds like a coward who would rather treat you like dirt and make you end it rather than do it herself.
> 
> I really dont see the point in spying on her at all.


Fix things herself? Nah...it's so much EASIER to b*tch and complain, and expect someone else to fix it for you.

This is why I haven't talked to my own sister in such a long time; she is the same way: B*TCH, B*TCH, B*ITCH!!!


----------



## bandit.45

Maybe she needs to find Jesus....

Seriously though, she just sounds like an unhappy person. Some people are just born unhappy, with a hole right through their middle, and nothing you can do or offer or give or share will fill that void. 

I would say you need to D and move on. There is really nothing for you in this marriage other than circular codependency. You feed off her negativity and she feeds off your wanting to help her. 

Doesn't work.


----------



## TroyN

Well - she is religious (Catholic) - so that is part of the reason for her wanting to stay in our marriage. 

So, just an observation. I caught a glimpse of her naked body getting out of the shower this morning and noticed her pubic area is not shaved. We have not had sex since early October. So, if I'm thinking if another guy is in picture, this area would have been cleaned up like it was when we were sexually active. 

In our counseling meeting last night, we talked about "love languages" and how she likes praise and I, of course, like physical affection. I'm not talking sex per se, but just hugs, cuddling on the couch, back rubs/scratches. She goes on to say that she hates clinginess, PDA, because she never grew up with that type of affection. Her father never liked hugging her, praised her, etc. So she just expecting that all men are like her dad.

She then went on to say that I remind her way too much of her dad - driven, cold at times, good social standing with others. This might be why our relationship is strained, but on the flip side, she despised an ex-boyfriend for being too warm, cheesy, and try to show too much affection to her. 

So, what exact route do I take? (other than packing up my belongings and moving into an apartment).


----------



## happyman64

TroyN said:


> Well - she is religious (Catholic) - so that is part of the reason for her wanting to stay in our marriage.
> 
> So, just an observation. I caught a glimpse of her naked body getting out of the shower this morning and noticed her pubic area is not shaved. We have not had sex since early October. So, if I'm thinking if another guy is in picture, this area would have been cleaned up like it was when we were sexually active.
> 
> In our counseling meeting last night, we talked about "love languages" and how she likes praise and I, of course, like physical affection. I'm not talking sex per se, but just hugs, cuddling on the couch, back rubs/scratches. She goes on to say that she hates clinginess, PDA, because she never grew up with that type of affection. Her father never liked hugging her, praised her, etc. So she just expecting that all men are like her dad.
> 
> She then went on to say that I remind her way too much of her dad - driven, cold at times, good social standing with others. This might be why our relationship is strained, but on the flip side, she despised an ex-boyfriend for being too warm, cheesy, and try to show too much affection to her.
> 
> So, what exact route do I take? (other than packing up my belongings and moving into an apartment).


Why not take her to church this Sunday and ask her if she truly wants to be married to you? Ask her if she still loves you as much as the day she took her vows?

Tell her that God wants to know.


HM


----------



## jorgegene

TroyN wife sounds my ex who was BPD. 

The constant put downs and could never do anything right even getting swansons frozen peas was a problem.

Frigid, past sexual abuse. wincing at my advances. 

constant blow ups and critisizing. never happy. constant lying and game playing. gaslighting and fogging.

went from adoring me to loathing me.


----------



## MrHappyHat

TroyN said:


> So, what exact route do I take? (other than packing up my belongings and moving into an apartment).



Whatever route you want.

Your wife is a 'Debbie Downer.' (Athol Kay would describe her as an 'Energy Vampire') Her normal mode of operation is to ***** and gripe.

Your wife has described you negatively, in minute detail, in every instance that you've been brought up in conversations with her coworkers. (Which is daily, btw.)

They gave you weird looks because you didn't come off as the disgustingly ugly Son of Satan they've heard about. That caused a bit of a cognitive dissonance on their part as they tried to resolve what they were seeing vs what they'd heard about you.

Your wife doesn't respect you. You're not going to get any play until you fix that. You fix that by fixing yourself.

I recommend reading The Mindful Attraction Plan by Athol Kay. 

There's also the Married Man Sex Life (MMSL) blog and forums.


----------



## MrHappyHat

jorgegene said:


> TroyN wife sounds my ex who was BPD.
> 
> The constant put downs and could never do anything right even getting swansons frozen peas was a problem.
> 
> Frigid, past sexual abuse. wincing at my advances.
> 
> constant blow ups and critisizing. never happy. constant lying and game playing. gaslighting and fogging.
> 
> went from adoring me to loathing me.



She could also just not respect him. My wife was a poster-child for BPD when we were having our problems. I went down the checklist of symptoms just saying to myself, "Yup... yup... that one too.... yup...."

Once I got my act together, she's done a 180 and is lovey-dovey.


Though, if you wife does have BPD... run. Just run.


----------



## DarkHoly

OP I feel like you just walked up to me with your entire body on fire and a lobster hanging from your nose, and asked me

"Do I have any pimples on my face?"


----------



## TroyN

MrHappyHat said:


> Though, if you wife does have BPD... run. Just run.


This is what I'm dealing with, I think, and I she might be a lost cause. I think she was always really bad to begin with but wanted to be married so badly and validated by others that she pulled out all the stops to get with me. That included losing like 40 lbs to appear more attractive, bombing me with emails, stalking me on Facebook, etc.

What I don't understand why, if they are capable of doing all these things and if these feeling are honest, then why is she not capable of doing it again for me? It's like she just gave up on me after the honeymoon and it's something that I can't ask for her to do again. Based on what I'm reading, I've been "painted black" by my own wife. 

I'm not sure even arguing with her or using all of those tactics discussed in the "married man sex life" will even be able to work on her. I feel like the more I show respect for myself and put boundaries into the place, the more infuriated and hateful she gets. 

So my final question is this. If I divorce her - she will likely find another guy really fast, right? And she will repeat this cycle with him, correct? 

I'm not perfect, and I think she needs someone like me in her life and I feel like I'm good guy, but at what point is it enough?


----------



## bandit.45

TroyN said:


> I'm not perfect, and *I think she needs someone like me in her life *and I feel like I'm good guy, but at what point is it enough?


This is called White Knight Syndrome. You think it is your job to save her. 

This is half your problem.


----------



## F-102

She got you... HER job is done.


----------



## GROUNDPOUNDER

Just a thought...


----------



## BobSimmons

TroyN said:


> This is what I'm dealing with, I think, and I she might be a lost cause. I think she was always really bad to begin with but wanted to be married so badly and validated by others that she pulled out all the stops to get with me. That included losing like 40 lbs to appear more attractive, bombing me with emails, stalking me on Facebook, etc.
> 
> What I don't understand why, if they are capable of doing all these things and if these feeling are honest, then why is she not capable of doing it again for me? It's like she just gave up on me after the honeymoon and it's something that I can't ask for her to do again. Based on what I'm reading, I've been "painted black" by my own wife.
> 
> I'm not sure even arguing with her or using all of those tactics discussed in the "married man sex life" will even be able to work on her. I feel like the more I show respect for myself and put boundaries into the place, the more infuriated and hateful she gets.
> 
> So my final question is this. If I divorce her - *she will likely find another guy really fast, right? And she will repeat this cycle with him, correct? *
> 
> I'm not perfect, and *I think she needs someone like me in her life* and I feel like I'm good guy, but at what point is it enough?


Haha well done. So in essence you're saving other guys from going through what you went through? Is that correct?

Well all the potential men out there will be sure to thank you. Very selfless indeed. 

Who knows you might have divorced and I met her...by staying you're saving me potential heartache!


----------



## TroyN

So - I'm back.

So, Valentines Day went by a few days back and there was no sex or even a kiss. I had flowers delivered to her work earlier that day, and booked a nice dinner for us. By the time we get to bed, she says her back is sore, puts on her pajamas and goes to sleep. I remember staring at the back of her head in complete disgust and almost calling her out on the fact that we haven't been intimate since early October...but it wouldn't have mattered anyways.

We had a pretty bad fight tonight. I went to visit with an old college roommate earlier this evening who is visiting the area. She (my wife) wasn't feeling good (stomach ache is the usual excuse) and decided to not come out so I went alone. I was an hour late getting home and she ripped into me for leaving her all alone tonight on "our day off" (keep in mind I was home every night this week at 6:00pm, so she had my undivided attention all week).

She started on me by giving me silent treatment, and once I inquired why, she tore into me, which resulted in me leaving the house and going back to my office. Upon leaving, I told her that I'm done arguing and I'm not coming back until tomorrow. 

I spoke to family tonight and for the first time I disclosed that my marriage is basically dead and has been since late 2011. They then disclosed that they do not like my wife and know that "she has A LOT of problems" but were afraid to tell me.

They want me to come this weekend and talk about things.


----------



## weightlifter

Family and friends.

If it were not for them. I would have already lost my mind. Lean on them.


----------



## Philat

TroyN said:


> I spoke to family tonight and for the first time I disclosed that my marriage is basically dead and has been since late 2011.


I dunno, man, sounds like it might be time to give it a decent burial.


----------



## happyman64

So Troy what is your next step?


----------



## badmemory

TroyN, I think you have two options.

One - Tell her that unless she get's into counseling, unless she completely changes her attitude toward you, unless she becomes sexually open to you again - and all of this immediately; that you will be divorcing her. Then do so, if she doesn't fully capitulate. At least you can say you gave her a final opportunity.

Two - Divorce her immediately.

I'd lean toward number two, but don't continue to waste your life on a broken woman.


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

badmemory said:


> I'd lean toward number two, but don't continue to waste your life on a broken woman.


I agree. She no longer deserves a "this is the final time after the last time before the time since that one." He's gotta stop being a white night and put his foot down IMO. Now, he'll have to explain what they talk about in counseling, but he said they have gone to counseling and nothing has changed. There is a point where you junk something, instead of continually throwing money at the problem.

Before someone takes that wrong, they have been in and out of marriage counseling. She has been in and out of individual counseling and neither type has fixed anything. At this point, if he tries again he is throwing more money at the problem.


----------



## WhiteRaven

Best solution for your marriage- R.I.P.

She loved the idea of getting married with you, never you. She got what she wanted, now she wants to move on. Letting her would save you.


----------



## badmemory

phillybeffandswiss said:


> I agree. She no longer deserves a "this is the final time after the last time before the time since that one." He's gotta stop being a white night and put his foot down IMO. Now, he'll have to explain what they talk about in counseling, but he said they have gone to counseling and nothing has changed. There is a point where you junk something, instead of continually throwing money at the problem.
> 
> Before someone takes that wrong, *they have been in and out of marriage counseling. She has been in and out of individual counseling and neither type has fixed anything.* At this point, if he tries again he is throwing more money at the problem.


If that's true Philly, then I completely agree with you.


----------



## Tron

Sadly, it may be 'separation' time.

See if you can find another place to live for a month. Tell her you will be moving out on X date and that you will be taking a month off to evaluate whether you really want to be in this marriage any more.


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

badmemory said:


> If that's true Philly, then I completely agree with you.


His own words BdM.



TroyN said:


> Yes, she seems to meet all the criteria. But part of me wonders if she is just a huge ***** or really disordered. *I mean, she does seek counseling on her own so she knows something is up. But individual counseling and marriage counseling have done nothing for her. We'll come out marriage counseling and she'll just verbally beat the crap out of me later that night and forget everything the counselor said. *
> 
> It's beyond frustrating.


The same day? No way, that's ridiculous in my book, it is time to go.


----------



## southernsurf

TroyN said:


> This is what I'm dealing with, I think, and I she might be a lost cause. I think she was always really bad to begin with but wanted to be married so badly and validated by others that she pulled out all the stops to get with me. That included losing like 40 lbs to appear more attractive, bombing me with emails, stalking me on Facebook, etc.
> 
> What I don't understand why, if they are capable of doing all these things and if these feeling are honest, then why is she not capable of doing it again for me? It's like she just gave up on me after the honeymoon and it's something that I can't ask for her to do again. Based on what I'm reading, I've been "painted black" by my own wife.
> 
> 
> So my final question is this. If I divorce her - she will likely find another guy really fast, right? And she will repeat this cycle with him, correct?
> 
> I'm not perfect, and I think she needs someone like me in her life and I feel like I'm good guy, but at what point is it enough?


I can't answer for everyone here but in my case I had a BPDer and it was a living hell. Yes she will do it to the next guy. I caught mine cheating and ended it no second chance because I had enough. I would classify mine as an extreme BPD. I found out later when we got together she was actually cheating on a guy that she had a lived with to me with me. But that is another story and doesn’t matter. Like most BPDer she was always looking for a better deal. Poor guy was in the wrong place at the wrong time, she immediately dumped him. Hardest thing I ever did was putting her and her BS in the rearview mirror and not looking back. She put up a fight and begged for another chance for over a year; 6 months after I ended it she married a guy with my same first name, and our birthdays were 5 days apart. Coincidence – maybe, but unlikely. She knew that guy 8 months when they got married, great sex but he never knew what hit him. Like I said she was nuts, in her mind she found the better me with same name. She was never going to find a replacement for me with the honesty and life style I provide, plus I can go all night, sex wise she was spoiled. So they separated after 1 1/2 years, got back together, separated 2 more times then she finally divorced him. I heard he didn’t make much money – well too bad. Next guy she married they separated after 2 years, heard he got tired of her. In total she has been D 3 more times and is currently living with her mother in an apartment. She deserved everything she got. So the answer is, yes I believe if she is BPD she did it again several more times. Get out now, its hard but you have no choice.


----------



## TroyN

So, we decided to meet for lunch today since I did not come home this morning, preferring to shower at our office and sleep on my office floor last night. 

I told her that I want her to get out and get hobbies and contribute to this relationship in some way. She essentially works, complains about life, eats dinner, calls her mom, then lays on the couch every night. I told her that she relies on me for her happiness and that IS NOT fair to me because that is not in my skill set (nor is it anyone's for that matter).

I then told her that I'm fed up with the lack of intimacy and we are not having a child until that issue is resolved. I asked her why she doesn't feel like having sex and _she doesn't know why_, but she thinks it's her depression meds. 

Finally, I told her that I loved her a lot but I'm done living in misery. Her attitude sucks and I'm fed up with it. 

Throughout lunch, she told me that I'm insensitive and did a lot of "wow, really nice" in a sarcastic tone. She did a lot a "glaring" at me, and wrinkling up her nose. Typical "b!tch" reactions to being called out on the truth. She then criticized me for leaving last night and not staying and "working it out" with her when I got home. 

So, unbeknownst to her, I've made a personal decision to leave her IF she doesn't get her act together by at least April.


----------



## TroyN

southernsurf said:


> I can't answer for everyone here but in my case I had a BPDer and it was a living hell. Yes she will do it to the next guy. I caught mine cheating and ended it no second chance because I had enough. I would classify mine as an extreme BPD. I found out later when we got together she was actually cheating on a guy that she had a lived with to me with me. But that is another story and doesn’t matter. Like most BPDer she was always looking for a better deal. Poor guy was in the wrong place at the wrong time, she immediately dumped him. Hardest thing I ever did was putting her and her BS in the rearview mirror and not looking back. She put up a fight and begged for another chance for over a year; 6 months after I ended it she married a guy with my same first name, and our birthdays were 5 days apart. Coincidence – maybe, but unlikely. She knew that guy 8 months when they got married, great sex but he never knew what hit him. Like I said she was nuts, in her mind she found the better me with same name. She was never going to find a replacement for me with the honesty and life style I provide, plus I can go all night, sex wise she was spoiled. So they separated after 1 1/2 years, got back together, separated 2 more times then she finally divorced him. I heard he didn’t make much money – well too bad. Next guy she married they separated after 2 years, heard he got tired of her. In total she has been D 3 more times and is currently living with her mother in an apartment. She deserved everything she got. So the answer is, yes I believe if she is BPD she did it again several more times. Get out now, its hard but you have no choice.


Thank you for sharing! 

I've read lot of BPD and it's just so painfully obvious she has it.

What kind of stuff did she say to you? Did she complain that everyone "has it made" and you guys didn't? When you guys split, how did she treat you? I have a feeling she'll not even give a crap...


----------



## RClawson

TroyN said:


> So, we decided to meet for lunch today since I did not come home this morning, preferring to shower at our office and sleep on my office floor last night.
> 
> I told her that I want her to get out and get hobbies and contribute to this relationship in some way. She essentially works, complains about life, eats dinner, calls her mom, then lays on the couch every night. I told her that she relies on me for her happiness and that IS NOT fair to me because that is not in my skill set (nor is it anyone's for that matter).
> 
> I then told her that I'm fed up with the lack of intimacy and we are not having a child until that issue is resolved. I asked her why she doesn't feel like having sex and _she doesn't know why_, but she thinks it's her depression meds.
> 
> Finally, I told her that I loved her a lot but I'm done living in misery. Her attitude sucks and I'm fed up with it.
> 
> Throughout lunch, she told me that I'm insensitive and did a lot of "wow, really nice" in a sarcastic tone. She did a lot a "glaring" at me, and wrinkling up her nose. Typical "b!tch" reactions to being called out on the truth. She then criticized me for leaving last night and not staying and "working it out" with her when I got home.
> 
> So, unbeknownst to her, I've made a personal decision to leave her IF she doesn't get her act together by at least April.


April = Too long.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

Do not under any circumstances impregnate this woman. A child never solves marriage issues (I think you know that)

This woman just doesn't seem to give a damn. EVERYTHING is always your fault. You didn't stay to work things out, like if you did problems would be solved. She's in counseling, she's on meds. No improvement. I don't know, I'd cut bait at this point. Wish her a happy life.

Agree with above- don't wait til April.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## TroyN

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Do not under any circumstances impregnate this woman. A child never solves marriage issues (I think you know that)
> 
> This woman just doesn't seem to give a damn. EVERYTHING is always your fault. You didn't stay to work things out, like if you did problems would be solved. She's in counseling, she's on meds. No improvement. I don't know, I'd cut bait at this point. Wish her a happy life.
> 
> Agree with above- don't wait til April.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Well, here's the thing. I don't want to have a child with her at all at this point. The constant berating gives me no confidence, among other things, that she wouldn't be a good mother. Impatient, moody, and probably or sex life would be non-existent _again_.

UGH. What the F*** is wrong with this woman!!!?


----------



## missthelove2013

This is why you dont propose to a woman youve dated for 10 months...no offense but its easy to hide "crazy" in that small amount of time

Even if she was NOT cheating, she sounds like a loon who hid all her baggage/true self from you long enough to get you to marry her and afterwards unleashed the true "her"...do you want to spend the rest of your long life with a loon who betrayed you by misrepresenting herself to get you to marry her??

Id be GONE


----------



## stevehowefan

Let me say this in y'all's favor: depression medication or anything that alters your hormones can be a death sentence for intimacy. 15 months ago, my wife was on Yaz. She was on it for seven years. Well, for those seven years she wanted to have nothing to do with me. She was void of emotion. She was indifferent about EVERYTHING. Bra, it sounds JUST LIKE the medication is altering her. She's not the same. It took my wife about six months of not taking medication to start coming alive again. Now we're great. I really think if she came off the medicine, you'd notice a difference after a while. To battle depression, I've immersed myself in the gym. I've bounced from Insanity to Crossfit to the gym to P90x and now the gym again. It helps, especially when those endorphins are released. Now, I am no doctor, but it may very well be the medicine. I'd be willing to bet a lot of money on it.


----------



## badmemory

TroyN said:


> So, unbeknownst to her, I've made a personal decision to leave her IF she doesn't get her act together by at least April.


Two things TroyN:

1- This should be "beknownst" to her.

2- April is too long. It needs to be immediately or not at all.

Stop re-drawing your line in the sand. She's playing you.


----------



## southernsurf

TroyN said:


> Well, here's the thing. I don't want to have a child with her at all at this point. The constant berating gives me no confidence, among other things, that she wouldn't be a good mother. Impatient, moody, and probably or sex life would be non-existent _again_.
> 
> UGH. What the F*** is wrong with this woman!!!?


The constant berating is standard. A trend about BPD is the short time from romance to marriage. In my case it was 5 months from when I knew her to when I got the talk from her father about us getting married and me taking care of her. She and I didnt talk about it and I had only met him 3 times. It went that fast I couldn’t slow thing down. My ex left someone she was living with for me. I was finishing college, she worked, she super hot, sex was off the radar, and I thought I met my one and only solemate. My ex repeated this behavior 3 more times. When you first meet a BPD woman the sex will be off the charts. She will tell you that she has never been treated the way you treat her, you are the best thing that ever happened to her etc etc. They will change everything about their personality and dress to mirror you to a T and make you feel you are truly sole mates. Things move very fast. 6-10 months into a relationship the sex will slow down or come to a halt. The black – white thinking comes into play. They can’t hide it. You will be Jesus one day and Satan the next. There are 2 characteristics in a BPD relationship – they can’t handle confinement and abandonment - these are polar opposites. Once they are in a marriage or close relationship they feel locked in, suffocating. You become the enemy and everyone that hits on them becomes the KSA. This is the phase they usually start cheating, a new someone will get the sex of his life, and thinks that he is there to protect her from YOU. Now you can talk to her all you want at this phase but it doesn’t register in their heads. You are public enemy #1. When you come to the point that you can’t take it anymore, where its so bad that dumping her and walking away is your only option, at that point the abandonment fear kicks in, she will panic and want you back like you are the best and only love of her life. She probably is cheating and her life will crumble. This happened to me 2x. She will return for a short while to normal, but that period is only temporary. The evil side will return, that’s why when you reach this point you feel now, you have to get out or it will destroy every aspect of your life and career. Also most (not all) BPD women cheat, especially if they are pretty and get hit on a lot, because they love the attention and it accelerates the black / white thinking that someone out there can give them a better deal. Obviously it rarely is the case and their lives will spiral. You will blame yourself at first but then realize there’s nothing you can do, so get out because its not a normal life and you will spend a lot of time in the corner as Satan. So think about it, you have only known this person for 3 years and it’s a living hell and it will not stop. I bet it started in the 6-12 month time frame.


----------



## TroyN

badmemory said:


> Two things TroyN:
> 
> 1- This should be "beknownst" to her.


lol. Sorry.


----------



## Lovemytruck

southernsurf said:


> The constant berating is standard. A trend about BPD is the short time from romance to marriage. In my case it was 5 months from when I knew her to when I got the talk from her father about us getting married and me taking care of her. She and I didnt talk about it and I had only met him 3 times. It went that fast I couldn’t slow thing down. My ex left someone she was living with for me. I was finishing college, she worked, she super hot, sex was off the radar, and I thought I met my one and only solemate. My ex repeated this behavior 3 more times. When you first meet a BPD woman the sex will be off the charts. She will tell you that she has never been treated the way you treat her, you are the best thing that ever happened to her etc etc. They will change everything about their personality and dress to mirror you to a T and make you feel you are truly sole mates. Things move very fast. 6-10 months into a relationship the sex will slow down or come to a halt. The black – white thinking comes into play. They can’t hide it. You will be Jesus one day and Satan the next. There are 2 characteristics in a BPD relationship – they can’t handle confinement and abandonment - these are polar opposites. Once they are in a marriage or close relationship they feel locked in, suffocating. You become the enemy and everyone that hits on them becomes the KSA. This is the phase they usually start cheating, a new someone will get the sex of his life, and thinks that he is there to protect her from YOU. Now you can talk to her all you want at this phase but it doesn’t register in their heads. You are public enemy #1. When you come to the point that you can’t take it anymore, where its so bad that dumping her and walking away is your only option, at that point the abandonment fear kicks in, she will panic and want you back like you are the best and only love of her life. She probably is cheating and her life will crumble. This happened to me 2x. She will return for a short while to normal, but that period is only temporary. The evil side will return, that’s why when you reach this point you feel now, you have to get out or it will destroy every aspect of your life and career. Also most (not all) BPD women cheat, especially if they are pretty and get hit on a lot, because they love the attention and it accelerates the black / white thinking that someone out there can give them a better deal. Obviously it rarely is the case and their lives will spiral. You will blame yourself at first but then realize there’s nothing you can do, so get out because its not a normal life and you will spend a lot of time in the corner as Satan. So think about it, you have only known this person for 3 years and it’s a living hell and it will not stop. I bet it started in the 6-12 month time frame.


:iagree::iagree::iagree:


----------



## TroyN

southernsurf said:


> The constant berating is standard. A trend about BPD is the short time from romance to marriage. In my case it was 5 months from when I knew her to when I got the talk from her father about us getting married and me taking care of her. She and I didnt talk about it and I had only met him 3 times. It went that fast I couldn’t slow thing down. My ex left someone she was living with for me. I was finishing college, she worked, she super hot, sex was off the radar, and I thought I met my one and only solemate. My ex repeated this behavior 3 more times. When you first meet a BPD woman the sex will be off the charts. She will tell you that she has never been treated the way you treat her, you are the best thing that ever happened to her etc etc. They will change everything about their personality and dress to mirror you to a T and make you feel you are truly sole mates. Things move very fast. 6-10 months into a relationship the sex will slow down or come to a halt. The black – white thinking comes into play. They can’t hide it. You will be Jesus one day and Satan the next. There are 2 characteristics in a BPD relationship – they can’t handle confinement and abandonment - these are polar opposites. Once they are in a marriage or close relationship they feel locked in, suffocating. You become the enemy and everyone that hits on them becomes the KSA. This is the phase they usually start cheating, a new someone will get the sex of his life, and thinks that he is there to protect her from YOU. Now you can talk to her all you want at this phase but it doesn’t register in their heads. You are public enemy #1. When you come to the point that you can’t take it anymore, where its so bad that dumping her and walking away is your only option, at that point the abandonment fear kicks in, she will panic and want you back like you are the best and only love of her life. She probably is cheating and her life will crumble. This happened to me 2x. She will return for a short while to normal, but that period is only temporary. The evil side will return, that’s why when you reach this point you feel now, you have to get out or it will destroy every aspect of your life and career. Also most (not all) BPD women cheat, especially if they are pretty and get hit on a lot, because they love the attention and it accelerates the black / white thinking that someone out there can give them a better deal. Obviously it rarely is the case and their lives will spiral. You will blame yourself at first but then realize there’s nothing you can do, so get out because its not a normal life and you will spend a lot of time in the corner as Satan. So think about it, you have only known this person for 3 years and it’s a living hell and it will not stop. I bet it started in the 6-12 month time frame.



This really does describe it to a T. In fact, while we were dating, and I dumped her briefly (I just had some weird gut feeling and felt like I could do better - she was also sort of clingy), and she hooked up with some random dude at the bar 4 days later. This was after two months of dating where she told me she was falling in love with me. So basically, you are in love with someone, but you can shut off those feelings immediately and get with some stranger. That should have been a warning in itself. I know we are different, but I don't rebound with some random individual to make myself feel better.

As far as intimacy, you are right, once I proposed it slowly dwindled. 

I just want to say that I have not been a perfect individual in this relationship. Many times, out of frustration, I have fought back when she got out of line and started picking the fights. The big thing is that SHE CAN'T CONTROL me, which gets her angry and possibly depressed. It's like as soon as I stood my ground she became this completely different person. Is this a BPD trait?


----------



## Lovemytruck

TroyN said:


> Is this a BPD trait?


Yes.

Look into some of the posts by Uptown on BPD. He has said much.

I believe it is a thing that can help us make sense of irrational behavior. The label itself can be harmful, so it is not something we should take lightly. We are not professionals, and we certainly don't know your WW.

With that said, if you see these traits, act accordingly. I found that being neutral in my words, and firm in my actions helped. It is best to move away from her socially, emotionally, and then physically.

Do not become entangled in her drama. She will work to suck you in, so she can spit you out.

Her value to you is in the things you learned about broken people. I hope you learned how to see it in future partners. Life will seem easy when you move on and into a relationship based on healthy principles.


----------



## Foghorn

> I just want to say that I have not been a perfect individual in this relationship. Many times, out of frustration, I have fought back when she got out of line and started picking the fights. The big thing is that SHE CAN'T CONTROL me, which gets her angry and possibly depressed. It's like as soon as I stood my ground she became this completely different person. Is this a BPD trait?


Troy, you should download and read this:

http://iostopensando2.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/levenmeteenborderliner.pdf

"Stop walking on eggshells" describes almost all of the traits you've described in your wife.

FWIW, I know a guy, a really good guy (Army Ranger, honorable to the core) who DIDN'T divorce his BPD wife, he instead stuck around and tried to fix her and make her happy. 19 years later, he has two teenage daughters who are starting to take after their mother in personality and work ethic, she has had an affair on him and acts as crazy as ever. Everything, EVERYTHING wrong with their relationship, her life, her health, their finances, is his fault (she says). Everything. Well of course it isn't but that's what she says. He feels trapped because he doesn't want to leave the kids alone with her. She is just a miserable person and he doesn't know how to leave. It's horrible.

Please read the .pdf and take some time with it, let it soak in.

My opinion is that of many others here - let her go and get your life back. You can't fix her and you can't make her happy. She needs to fix herself.

Best,
FH


----------



## Lovemytruck

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/33734-my-list-hell.html#post473522

Read this too.


----------



## DoktorFun

Lovemytruck said:


> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/33734-my-list-hell.html#post473522
> 
> Read this too.


Just WOW! Incredible post.


----------



## Lovemytruck

An oldie but still gold. I read it at the time I was trying to understand my ExWW and my own sanity. Uptown is brilliant.


----------



## bandit.45

TroyN said:


> UGH. What the F*** is wrong with this woman!!!?


She's broken. That's what's wrong.


----------



## carmen ohio

TroyN said:


> Well, here's the thing. I don't want to have a child with her at all at this point. The constant berating gives me no confidence, among other things, that she wouldn't be a good mother. Impatient, moody, and probably or sex life would be non-existent _again_.
> 
> *UGH. What the F*** is wrong with this woman!!!?*


TroyN, you should ask yourself, _"what the F*** is wrong with me that I am still with this woman!!!?"_


----------



## TroyN

Well - I ended it last night.

I had enough. 

She picked her last fight with me. She called me a loser and a something else...I don't remember...it's all a blur. Anyways I blew a gasket, told her I wanted a divorce, and I went to stay at friend's house. I'm still here now, we are watching hockey, and he told me to talk with him when I feel like it.

She is currently at our house and is crying. She is trying to talk with me via text and I'm not answering anything. Lot's of voicemails. 

She is going to go home to her parent's house.

I'm just numb right now. I know I'm making the right move, but I'm in love with her. My parents have been informed my dad said the following:

"It's about time, son." 

So they knew all the long....


----------



## The Middleman

You are doing the right thing.


----------



## lenzi

Stay the course.

It won't be easy.


----------



## Noble1

Sorry to hear about your situation.

From the sounds of things its the best course of action for you.

It won't be easy to move on but you will be better for it.

Good luck.


----------



## TroyN

The Middleman said:


> You are doing the right thing.


Man, I hope so. This feels like someone died. I actually cried for the first time in many years. It was this incredible emotional release that had been pent up for three years.

I knew this wasn't going to end well - but I believed in this woman. My heart still beats a little quicker when I see her. That attraction is still there.

I even hugged her last night after our fight.

She keeps asking "what am I going to do! what am I going to do!" 

I told her "the way you treat me, I can't do this anymore. You just treat me so bad. You don't even love me."


----------



## happyman64

"What am I going to do"

Answer her.

Tell her this"

We are going to handle this divorce like adults. Fairly without any more nonsense.

You are not happy. I am no longer happy so I have decided it is time to cut our losses.

I will file for divorce and then we can sit down and figure how we are going to dissolve our relationship."

Have her try that on......


----------



## PhillyGuy13

Im sorry to hear this Troy. You gave her every possible chance, I commend you for that. Don't be afraid to vent here if you need to.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

TroyN said:


> I'm embarrassed to say that we are on our second marriage counselor. The first one sided with me on almost everything, so my wife wanted to find someone new.
> 
> I am so confused. Lost and sad. Who I was engaged to is not even the same person I married.
> 
> We have no children. But she wants to have kids. I told her I don't want them until we are at a better place.


Get Out Immediately.

Really thank the Lord for having no kids here.

The possibility of her having an affair is really of no issue. Leave Now.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

TroyN said:


> Man, I hope so. This feels like someone died. I actually cried for the first time in many years. It was this incredible emotional release that had been pent up for three years.
> 
> I knew this wasn't going to end well - but I believed in this woman. My heart still beats a little quicker when I see her. That attraction is still there.
> 
> I even hugged her last night after our fight.
> 
> She keeps asking "what am I going to do! what am I going to do!"
> 
> I told her "the way you treat me, I can't do this anymore. You just treat me so bad. You don't even love me."


There is something wrong with you loving the horrible woman. 
I would suggest you seek IC for yourself to find out what this is about.


----------



## weightlifter

TroyN;8475401}and I went to stay at friend's house. I'm still here now said:


> Weird. Similar situation for me. My dad told me to have an affair! His emphasis was on "There are women who can treat a man nicely" not sex tho I am sure that was in his background. Two friends have told me to do the same thing. Damn I find that odd. What is wrong with people!? (No I will not be having an affair.)


----------



## WhiteRaven

TroyN said:


> She keeps asking "what am I going to do! what am I going to do!"


It's still about her. It was always about her.


----------



## TroyN

WhiteRaven said:


> It's still about her. It was always about her.


It has always been about her - I know that.

I did everything perfect for her. The huge diamonds, the perfect engagement photos, the wedding day, the honeymoon, the perfect house

......everything but a baby. That was her final checkpoint that she did not cross with me.

I feel completely and totally used. She attained everything she wanted and it just quit on me. I was pissed at her last night - and I literally said out loud “what a spoiled f_cking brat” while I tried to fall asleep on my friend’s couch. Nothing was ever good enough.

I came back to my house this morning, and moved some clothes into the guest room because I’m going to stay at my house tonight. As I went into our bedroom, I heard her crying in the shower. She has made no attempt to patch things up since Sunday night and has not told me she loves me.

I talked to my mother this morning and she said “I just had this gut feeling about her, even on your wedding day. It was odd. It was like she was celebrating herself as opposed to your union. It made me sad for you, but we couldn’t say anything to you about it because you loved her.” and then my mom started crying.

So, this is not going well at all. I feel tremendous guilt and I hate to see my loved ones upset. But I realize that my soon to be ex-wife’s love is not real and never was.


----------



## Malaise

You can't change her, you can't control her.

You can only change how you act . You can only control you.

Learned through experience.


----------



## Malaise

You feel guilt because you care about the marriage.

She doesn't. As was said, she cares about how this affects her. Not ' you and her '. There is no 'you and her '. 

It seems that from the first there was only ' her' and how you could help her.


----------



## the guy

She had a chance back in Feb. to keep you around and blow it. Now its well bast April...what the hell did she expect?

In the last few month she had to of seen it coming.


----------



## WhiteRaven

TroyN said:


> I talked to my mother this morning and she said “I just had this gut feeling about her, even on your wedding day. ”


My mom had gave me the same line when I announced I wanted to D. 

Stay strong.


----------



## Marduk

TroyN said:


> It has always been about her - I know that.
> 
> I did everything perfect for her. The huge diamonds, the perfect engagement photos, the wedding day, the honeymoon, the perfect house
> 
> ......everything but a baby. That was her final checkpoint that she did not cross with me.
> 
> I feel completely and totally used. She attained everything she wanted and it just quit on me. I was pissed at her last night - and I literally said out loud “what a spoiled f_cking brat” while I tried to fall asleep on my friend’s couch. Nothing was ever good enough.
> 
> I came back to my house this morning, and moved some clothes into the guest room because I’m going to stay at my house tonight. As I went into our bedroom, I heard her crying in the shower. She has made no attempt to patch things up since Sunday night and has not told me she loves me.
> 
> I talked to my mother this morning and she said “I just had this gut feeling about her, even on your wedding day. It was odd. It was like she was celebrating herself as opposed to your union. It made me sad for you, but we couldn’t say anything to you about it because you loved her.” and then my mom started crying.
> 
> So, this is not going well at all. I feel tremendous guilt and I hate to see my loved ones upset. But I realize that my soon to be ex-wife’s love is not real and never was.


Sorry to hear dude.

I went through similar things at a similar age. Gave her everything. Got nothing but insults and abuse in return.

Finally said we need to fix things and went to counselling. I got a ton of stuff to work on... she got nothing. After a few sessions I pointed this out, that she has stuff to work on too.

I got "I'm leaving you" in response.

Once it sunk in what that meant to HER, then I got the "poor me" treatment from her.

Years later I discovered mental health issues run in her family. Very similar pattern. 

I now have a relatively stable marriage, great kids, great job, great friends... a great life. My ex is still single and childless (she always wanted kids).

What you have to realize is that you've been given another shot at life. You get a do-over. You learned a lot, and learned how to be a great catch while not letting yourself be walked on.

And you learned to always follow your gut, and that mate selection is key.

Some people are broken and can't be fixed. Fixing them is not your job. It's their job.

And your life doesn't have to be broken and unhappy because they are broken and unhappy.

You get one life. Don't let yourself be sucked back into her black hole of despair and misery.

Close the door on this relationship, mourn, learn, and get back on the horse. Someone is waiting for you.

You may feel like your life is ending, and what I'm here to tell you is that it's your old life that's ending, and your new life that's beginning. Make of it what you will.


----------



## mahike

I saw your post about still being in love. This was hard for me to learn, I am very thick headed. You are in love with what you thought she was and what you wanted your marriage to be. I have always been a big fan of R but......

Yes now that you made the choice even if she cannot act like and adult you can always be an adult. It will help you in the long run.


----------



## ricky15100

Troyn you need to have your wits about you now, you're going to start remembering the good times and blurring the bad, and she is about to turn on the hoover, this is the time when you need to be strong and have strictly nc


----------



## southernsurf

TroyN said:


> I *feel completely and totally used*. She attained everything she wanted and it just quit on me. I was pissed at her last night - and I literally said out loud “what a spoiled f_cking brat” while I tried to fall asleep on my friend’s couch. Nothing was ever good enough.
> 
> I came back to my house this morning, and moved some clothes into the guest room because I’m going to stay at my house tonight. As I went into our bedroom, *I heard her crying in the shower. * *She has made no attempt to patch things up since Sunday night and has not told me she loves me*.
> 
> So, this is not going well at all. I feel tremendous guilt and I hate to see my loved ones upset. But I realize that my soon to be ex-wife’s love is not real and never was.


All this is standard behavior, she is trying to gain control of you back....you have to just let her cry. What ever you do, be sure not to coddle or apologize, never promise her a chance. It’s a game to her, man I went through all this….several times until it almost destroyed me. All she is trying to do is turn the pity back on herself, don’t do it. So when is the last time you actually had sex (October?) and have you confirmed she was cheating?


----------



## JerryB

TroyN said:


> I talked to my mother this morning and she said “I just had this gut feeling about her, even on your wedding day. It was odd. It was like she was celebrating herself as opposed to your union. It made me sad for you, but we couldn’t say anything to you about it because you loved her.” and then my mom started crying.
> 
> So, this is not going well at all. I feel tremendous guilt and I hate to see my loved ones upset. But I realize that my soon to be ex-wife’s love is not real and never was.


What?
No, no no.

Quit being such a people-pleasing nice guy (NG).
Your mom is crying because she is sad that YOU are hurting.

Things are going "well". Your parents are on your side (as any loving parents would be). You ARE doing the right thing, but sometimes the right thing hurts for a little bit.

Which is better than postponing pain, like we tend to do by ignoring the truth...and living slow life of pain & regret.

Another reason this hurts so much is being when you truly give yourself in a marriage, it requires you to be vulnerable, giving all your trust, etc. And it was betrayed.


----------



## TroyN

southernsurf said:


> So when is the last time you actually had sex (October?) and have you confirmed she was cheating?


We have not had sex since last October. We haven't even kissed on the lips since Valentine's day(?). 

I have watched her closely over the past two months. I've been lurking on this site and trying to pick up clues based on what has happened to people on this board. 

I can say with about 90% certainty that she is not cheating. I have not checked her phone, a Blackberry, but I do watch her leave every morning and I'm home from work every night at a reasonable hour. She had no real friends, so she lays on the couch every night (unless I force her to go out with her co-workers, which she doesn't even like to do).

She is completely out-of-shape (she's 5-2 about 170lbs right now) and depressed, so I doubt anything is happening. There have been no changes in behavior since last summer that tell me something is going on behind the scenes.

I think it really comes down to three things.

1. BPD/Depression/Meds

2. Rushed engagement, marriage without really knowing her.

3. Me not making enough money, while a good majority of the people she works with pull $80K+ per year. So I seem like less of man because I make $56K. Yes, she's that materialistic.

She texted me and told me she's taking the rest of week off and going to her parents house. So, I'm coming home to an empty house tonight.


----------



## southernsurf

TroyN said:


> We have not had sex since last October. We haven't even kissed on the lips since Valentine's day(?).
> 
> 3. Me not making enough money, while a good majority of the people she works with pull $80K+ per year. So I seem like less of man because I make $56K. Yes, she's that materialistic.
> .


You’re young, only 30, it takes time to build a career. Who knows where you’ll be at 40 if you work hard and have a good woman behind you…..Tell her that. This would piss me off if my woman said that to me,


----------



## bandit.45

It took me 20 years.....

20 years... To break six figures. Nothing wrong at all with you being only. 30 and making 50k. Nothing wrong at all. Your WW is a lazy slug, on top of her other fine attributes. 

How dare she?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## WyshIknew

bandit.45 said:


> It took me 20 years.....
> 
> 20 years... To break six figures. Nothing wrong at all with you being only. 30 and making 50k. Nothing wrong at all. Your WW is a lazy slug, on top of her other fine attributes.
> 
> How dare she?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Same here.

Besides which money should not define your worth as a man. I've seen many men on high salaries who I would hesitate to call a man.


----------



## southernsurf

Its called hypergamy - when a woman uses her money maker V and leaves a man for one with better money. Karma always catches up with this type woman……


----------



## Fordsvt

I be read all the poss here. I really have to commend you. You gave it lots of time. 
You don't have kids. You need to file. Trust me. Do it and file. You will be happier in the end.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## TroyN

Fordsvt said:


> I be read all the poss here. I really have to commend you. You gave it lots of time.
> You don't have kids. You need to file. Trust me. Do it and file. You will be happier in the end.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thank you. 

She made it back to her parents house tonight. I texted her and asked her to text me as soon as she arrived. I wanted to make sure she made it there safely. 

I called her about a half hour ago, and she was still sobbing.

She said that every place she passed on the way home reminded her of me.

She also said she is "in hell". I just told her "I am sorry but i know you don't love me anymore and haven't for awhile now and that it's best that I disappear from your life."

She has told her mom and her mom keeps asking her "is he sure?"

My wife keeps asking why am I not even upset, and that I need to go home and see my family too, but for me, I am just too numb. The pain she inflicted has made virtually dead, sex starved, and sad. I don't feel any pain at all really at this moment, just in this weird suspended state.

I'm asking myself if this was right from the beginning. Her only duty was just to love me. A simple hug would have been fine.


----------



## bandit.45

She's not capable of being a wife to you or any man. She's too broken. Maybe losing you will be the impetus for her to take a long hard look at herself and change for the better. You may have done her the biggest favor of her life.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## TroyN

bandit.45 said:


> She's not capable of being a wife to you or any man. She's too broken. Maybe losing you will be the impetus for her to take a long hard look at herself and change for the better. You may have done her the biggest favor of her life.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


And here's the problem. I know precisely how this is going to play out. As soon as I'm gone she'll miraculously get her act together and become the woman I want her to be and get with some other dude. I know this will happen. I'm not supposed to be this woman's teacher or mentor. She's a grown adult. 

I will have served as a guy who merely kept the seat warm and this is not fair at all. Why can't she get her act together now? 

I don't think I've ever loved and hated someone before. is this normal feel this way?


----------



## Vulcan2013

TroyN said:


> And here's the problem. I know precisely how this is going to play out. As soon as I'm gone she'll miraculously get her act together and become the woman I want her to be and get with some other dude. I know this will happen. I'm not supposed to be this woman's teacher or mentor. She's a grown adult.
> 
> I will have served as a guy who merely kept the seat warm and this is not fair at all. Why can't she get her act together now?
> 
> I don't think I've ever loved and hated someone before. is this normal feel this way?


She won't learn. Cleaning up and acting sane are how she won you. 

Make yourself a set of bullet points to remind yourself why you are leaving. She will never give you love on anything other than a narcissistic basis.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Malaise

Vulcan2013 said:


> She won't learn.* Cleaning up and acting sane are how she won you. *
> Make yourself a set of bullet points to remind yourself why you are leaving. She will never give you love on anything other than a narcissistic basis.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


And maybe the next guy will be someone who will put up with her crap longer. Someone with no self respect.

That's what she'll be looking for, consciously or not.

She's disappointed that you eventually woke up and demanded a normal wife. Someone she couldn't be.

Stay on course. Let her cry. She's not crying for you, or the marriage.


----------



## soccermom2three

TroyN said:


> And here's the problem. I know precisely how this is going to play out. As soon as I'm gone she'll miraculously get her act together and become the woman I want her to be and get with some other dude. I know this will happen. I'm not supposed to be this woman's teacher or mentor. She's a grown adult.
> 
> I will have served as a guy who merely kept the seat warm and this is not fair at all. Why can't she get her act together now?
> 
> I don't think I've ever loved and hated someone before. is this normal feel this way?



Troy, she may get her act together for a while to trap another man but she won't be able to maintain it. Unless she goes through intensive therapy she's just going to repeat herself. Hopefully the next man is smart like you and gets out before he gets her pregnant.


----------



## weightlifter

TroyN said:


> I will have served as a guy who merely kept the seat warm and this is not fair at all. Why can't she get her act together now?


And the act will likely last the same place as yours. 

Has she started the weight loss yet?


----------



## TroyN

weightlifter said:


> And the act will likely last the same place as yours.
> 
> Has she started the weight loss yet?


Hey. She hasn't changed. 

No, the big weight gain started roughly a year after we were married. Her weight exploded last summer in year two of our marriage. She doesn't even look like the person I was married to. 

I will be on the lookout for weight loss, which probably indicates she's making the moves on someone using BPD logic.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Thorburn

TroyN said:


> And here's the problem. I know precisely how this is going to play out. As soon as I'm gone she'll miraculously get her act together and become the woman I want her to be and get with some other dude. I know this will happen. I'm not supposed to be this woman's teacher or mentor. She's a grown adult.
> 
> I will have served as a guy who merely kept the seat warm and this is not fair at all. Why can't she get her act together now?
> 
> I don't think I've ever loved and hated someone before. is this normal feel this way?


It is called "ambivalence", having hating and loving feelings for the same person and yes it is common.

Please stop with what she may become. You have to look at the past and the present. My youngest son was in love with a nutjob for over 5 years. He was talking about her this past weekend, about how beutiful she was, etc. I talked to my wife about this and we still don't get how he was head over heels with the GF from h*ll. She had an eating disorder, got nasty drunk and violent, was mean, and was very frumpy. I would say she was somewhat cute, but not very pretty. My son still has a distored view of his ex GF and it makes no sense to me.

When you have someone in your life with a mental/behavioral issue, it makes the relationship very wierd.

It is a tough row to hoe and you will always be plucking out weeds and the crop's yield will be minimal.


----------



## pidge70

TroyN said:


> Hey. She hasn't changed.
> 
> No, the big weight gain started roughly a year after we were married. Her weight exploded last summer in year two of our marriage. She doesn't even look like the person I was married to.
> 
> I will be on the lookout for weight loss, which probably indicates she's making the moves on someone using BPD logic.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Has your W even been diagnosed with BPD?


----------



## TroyN

pidge70 said:


> Has your W even been diagnosed with BPD?


Going into marriage, my wife had her own psychiatrist.

We had two marriage counselors during our marriage.

The first was a sex/relationship therapist. My wife didn't like her, because she ripped into my wife a lot, so we picked up a new one.

The second one was more traditional. This counselor urged us to meet with her together and then with me separately, while my ex continued to meet with her own psychiatrist on the side.

In my meeting, our marriage counselor told me that she is most likely bi-polar based on her interactions with her. The meds she takes are to combat to those mood swings. I went and read more about bi-polar disorders, and stumbled upon BPD and NPD. 

At that point, I brought a BPD checklist back to our counselor in my private session. And she just said "yep". She just sort of wished me the best...


----------



## pidge70

If your W is a BPD'er, I feel for you. I am a BPD'er and quite frankly, it is disheartening when people are told things like your counselor told you. A BPD'er has to get help on their own, of that their is no doubt.


----------



## Marduk

TroyN said:


> And here's the problem. I know precisely how this is going to play out. As soon as I'm gone she'll miraculously get her act together and become the woman I want her to be and get with some other dude. I know this will happen. I'm not supposed to be this woman's teacher or mentor. She's a grown adult.
> 
> I will have served as a guy who merely kept the seat warm and this is not fair at all. Why can't she get her act together now?
> 
> I don't think I've ever loved and hated someone before. is this normal feel this way?


That's not the way the game works, so you need to stop thinking this way.

Yes, she MAY become the woman of your dreams for another dude. Or she may not. What is likely is that she will TEMPORARILY get her crap together to snare another dude, and then pull the same rug out there, too.

Either way, who gives a crap?

You need to think about you. I virtually guarantee that in a year or 2 or 3 down the road you will be happier and better off.

And isn't that what this is about? About your happiness now?

I wouldn't go back and try to fix my first marriage for the world. The best it would ever be is mediocre. My current wife just rocked my world again last night. I never, ever would have gotten that from my ex. Just breadcrumbs.

You deserve more.


----------



## TroyN

Just back from the bar and broke the news to a friend and his girlfriend.

I told her some of the things of that have happened. I didn't reveal too much, because it's still sort of raw, and not fair to my wife.

Last summer, she carefully observed my wife while at a wedding reception and she could tell something was wrong with her. She said that she seemed "disconnected". She didn't want to say too much, but admitted that she also found her really "moody" and "picky" about everything. 

I was not born yesterday. They were hiding what they really felt about her, and I could the look of disgust that they were trying hide from me. I guess it's pretty universal in our social circle that she isn't well liked. 

No calls from the wife at all today. I guess that says a lot, right?

She returns Sunday night...I'm not sure what I'm in for. 

Thank you for all of the responses. I'll try to post an update next week if something happens.


----------



## Marduk

TroyN said:


> Just back from the bar and broke the news to a friend and his girlfriend.
> 
> I told her some of the things of that have happened. I didn't reveal too much, because it's still sort of raw, and not fair to my wife.
> 
> Last summer, she carefully observed my wife while at a wedding reception and she could tell something was wrong with her. She said that she seemed "disconnected". She didn't want to say too much, but admitted that she also found her really "moody" and "picky" about everything.
> 
> I was not born yesterday. They were hiding what they really felt about her, and I could the look of disgust that they were trying hide from me. I guess it's pretty universal in our social circle that she isn't well liked.
> 
> No calls from the wife at all today. I guess that says a lot, right?
> 
> She returns Sunday night...I'm not sure what I'm in for.
> 
> Thank you for all of the responses. I'll try to post an update next week if something happens.


If she's like my ex, she'll go dark on her friends and family, and when pushed she'll spin some BS story.

I had a few of her family members approach me because they were actually concerned for my mental health -- she had them convinced I was crazy.

Within 6 months it was clear who had their crap together and who didn't.

The truth comes out in time; my recommendation is to be open and honest without going into verbal diarrhoea with the gory details and make it clear to friends and family that they don't have to pick sides. That alone engendered a lot of support.


----------



## TroyN

She returned last night.

I managed to ignore her until just before bed, when she corners me and in this b!tchy-tone asks me how I’ve felt since she’s been away and I tell her, “To be honest, it’s been far less stressful with you gone.”

She says “well, that about says it all.” She disappears and goes back into her room.

You know, if she would have came back and tried to be friendly with me (I was ready to be good to her and listen), I might have reconsidered reconciliation. But every interaction with her has been bad since our big blowout. She is just about the least tactful person I’ve ever met. I don’t even understand her approach. At least attempt to be enduring to give me a reason to reconsider!

I know she doesn’t love me, but wants to stay married because she doesn’t want the social stigma or to be seen as a failure. She’s such a phony.

We have contacted a real estate agent to put our house on the market. I have no plans of leaving our house until it sells.


----------



## WhiteRaven

TroyN said:


> She returned last night.
> 
> I managed to ignore her until just before bed, when she corners me and in this b!tchy-tone asks me how I’ve felt since she’s been away and I tell her, “To be honest, it’s been far less stressful with you gone.”
> 
> She says “well, that about says it all.” She disappears and goes back into her room.
> 
> You know, if she would have came back and tried to be friendly with me (I was ready to be good to her and listen), I might have reconsidered reconciliation. But every interaction with her has been bad since our big blowout. She is just about the least tactful person I’ve ever met. I don’t even understand her approach. At least attempt to be enduring to give me a reason to reconsider!
> 
> I know she doesn’t love me, but wants to stay married because she doesn’t want the social stigma or to be seen as a failure. She’s such a phony.
> 
> We have contacted a real estate agent to put our house on the market. I have no plans of leaving our house until it sells.


Good riddance.

You deserve better.


----------



## TroyN

WhiteRaven said:


> Good riddance.
> 
> You deserve better.


I know. I'm really pissed at her. I'm on the fence of whether or not I should try to get a peek at her phone. 

She hasn't been going out at all now that we are separated, and I figured she would be every night to get away from me and get with another man if she DID have something going on the side. 

I'm still watching her - not sure if it matters anymore.


----------



## WhiteRaven

TroyN said:


> I know. I'm really pissed at her. I'm on the fence of whether or not I should try to get a peek at her phone.
> 
> She hasn't been going out at all now that we are separated, and I figured she would be every night to get away from me and get with another man if she DID have something going on the side.
> 
> I'm still watching her - not sure if it matters anymore.


Think about how you'll re-build your life, not how she is running hers. Exercise, friends, family, hobbies, your job- focus on them now.


----------



## 86857

I think like many on here Troy, including myself, you have forgotten what it's like to be in love and to be loved. 

In fact I know you have. 

This strange vortex we get caught up in as a result of rejection and/or betrayal is actually as far from love as we can get. 

Have a look at a couple you know who love each other, are happy and content together, are faithful to each other, care and look out for each other, have fun together. 

That's love. 

Then look at what you have had. 

*Make it a clean break. 
*
No texting to see how she is, checking if she's OK and so on. 

It's tough to do. 

If after you split you still look out for her, go down memory lane about how wonderful it was and hold on to a faint little hope that you will somehow work it out, then you might as well just stay. 

My son is going through what you are now - with his girlfriend of 12 months. It wasn't as bad but it was heading that way. I told him 2 weeks ago to call/text me when he feels like phoning her. He has been doing that. Enlist a friend or your Mum and do the same. Resist the urge because it will take ALL your strength. 

I told him that because the hold such people have on us is very powerful - intense even - because we have forgotten how the real world operates - the loving world that is. 

Sure you can think she will now meet a guy and turn into an amazing woman. Yeah right. Even if she does I can tell you it will have a similar trajectory. If you spend time thinking like that you might as well stay with her too.

Also be mindful that she will likely beg you to stay and be ready for that too.

Get out of the vortex Troy. Now!

Think of it like this - what is your alternative.


----------



## TroyN

OK Guys - some updates. 

We are still living under the same roof. Not saying much to each other. I'm sleeping in the guest room. We have pets and we take turns babysitting them on the weekend. She'll go out with a friend, or go home to her parents. I'll do basically the same thing.

We are still Facebook friends.

Things have been pretty quiet. I'm talking to my friend who is a lawyer and he's guiding me through paperwork, educating me, etc. He's drafting up some paperwork for me to serve her the papers. She has also consulted a lawyer. 

At this point. We have agreed to split everything in half. Half of our checking, joint savings, she'll take one car, I'll take the other. Our house is on the market and we are getting some good interest and a few offers. I've started to look for apartments.

Two things out of curiousity have happened.

1. I was eating dinner one night at our kitchen table. I was feeling pretty bad about everything. She noticed my expression and said "What is going on? Why do you look that way." I said "This is really really hard." She got angry and half-scolded me "If you want to stay in this you need to let me know". I looked at her and thought to myself "You know, if you would have phrased it differently with some compassion, I would reconsider just a little bit." 

So, obviously, she doesn't want it to end. But treats me poorly. 

2. Her weight loss has started. Her clothes are starting to hang on her. We had to meet with a real estate agent and my wife would not even look me in the eye at the meeting. Seemed very avoidant. That night I creeped her Facebook page and didn't see anything suspicious. She is not going out on the weekdays...but I'm noticing something is off. Like she is firmly detaching from me and treats me like stranger. It is like a switch has gone off.

I'll keep ya'll posted.


----------



## jerry123

Stop checking her FB. De-friend her. 

Start working on yourself. Lift weights in your room. Get plenty of sleep. Start becoming the man a new woman would want. 

Next chapter of your life is just ahead.

Oh and read up about sticking to and doing the "180". 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## happyman64

Troy

Listen to Jerry123.

Do the 180. Get the divorce.

Because your wife has deep issues my friend. 

And you cannot fix them. Only she can.

Stay strong. Focus on you. Be happy about your future.

Your wife will turn out to be just someone that you used to know.

HM


PS
Her anger is her guilt showing.


----------



## Malaise

happyman64 said:


> Troy
> 
> Listen to Jerry123.
> 
> Do the 180. Get the divorce.
> 
> Because your wife has deep issues my friend.
> 
> And you cannot fix them. Only she can.
> 
> Stay strong. Focus on you. Be happy about your future.
> 
> Your wife will turn out to be just someone that you used to know.
> 
> HM
> 
> 
> PS
> Her anger is her guilt showing.


:iagree:

You're not a villain if you leave. And staying doesn't make you a hero.

It will only make you resentful and angry. Angry at her and you, for wasting precious years. You can't get those years back.


----------



## TroyN

happyman64 said:


> PS
> Her anger is her guilt showing.


She's such an entitled b!tch. I don't she believes anything is wrong with her. She's not guilty about anything - she's just pissed because she won't be married anymore. It has nothing to do with losing me. I was a prop through the whole thing. She didn't think she ever would get married and I filled that void. 

She treats everyone this way. None of her bridesmaids even talk to her. Her dad doesn't like talking with her and ignores her and same can be said for her brother. Her co-workers don't want to hang out with her. All she has is her mother. Notice a trend here? 

Now...she's lost me, the house, her diamonds, and a marriage. 

I'm sorry. She deserved this.


----------



## GusPolinski

Have you asked her to read this thread?


----------



## Clay2013

No reason for your to be sorry. She caused it. You just responded to what she did. I would just get away from her as soon as possible if I were you. 


Move on with your life and find a better woman to spend your time with. 

Clay


----------



## happyman64

TROY

She does deserve this.....

HM


----------



## michzz

just a suggestion, having gone through such a thing recently.


Remove exactly half of all checking and savings account funds and take them to a financial institution she is not a member at or controls.

And stop any automatic deposits replenishing those accounts.

If she gets a bad attitude one day she could drain 100% of the funds off.

If she gets mad that you did it, just remind her that you two agreed to split the funds.

While you're at it, cancel all credit cards that are jointly in your names together.

You'll save yourself a world of grief.


----------



## tom67

michzz said:


> just a suggestion, having gone through such a thing recently.
> 
> 
> Remove exactly half of all checking and savings account funds and take them to a financial institution she is not a member at or control.
> 
> And stop any automatic deposits replenishing those accounts.
> 
> If she gets a bad attitude one day she could drain 100% of the funds off.
> 
> If she gets mad that you did it, just remind her that you two agreed to split the funds.
> 
> While you're at it, cancel all credit cards that are jointly in your names together.
> 
> You'll save yourself a world of grief.


Like starting TODAY!!!:iagree:


----------



## CASE_Sensitive

My advice is to try and let go of the anger (yes, easier said then done). You will be starting fresh soon, a whole life ahead of you, free of her. She'll be in your past and dealing with the mess that is her life. You are on to bigger and better things. You're in for some exciting times.


----------



## BashfulB

Your wife sounds like she has some sort of mental illness, something worse than bipolar.


----------



## See_Listen_Love

jerry123 said:


> Stop checking her FB. De-friend her.
> 
> Start working on yourself. Lift weights in your room. Get plenty of sleep. Start becoming the man a new woman would want.
> 
> Next chapter of your life is just ahead.
> 
> Oh and read up about sticking to and doing the "180".
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Troy, this above is what you need to do.

You still have NO clue about yourself, you NEED to do this life-make over for yourself.

This is the Last Call man!


----------



## TroyN

BashfulBull said:


> Your wife sounds like she has some sort of mental illness, something worse than bipolar.


I think it's Borderline Personality Disorder. 

A pervasive pattern of instability of interpersonal relationships, self-image, and affects, and marked impulsivity beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated *by five (or more) of the following*: 


1. Frantic efforts to avoid real or imagined abandonment. Note: Do not include suicidal or self-mutilating behavior covered in Criterion 5. *Not Sure*

2. A pattern of unstable and intense interpersonal relationships characterized by alternating between extremes of idealization and devaluation. *Check*

3. Identity disturbance: markedly and persistently unstable self-image or sense of self. *Check*

4. Impulsivity in at least two areas that are potentially self-damaging (e.g., spending, sex, substance abuse, reckless driving, binge eating). Note: Do not include suicidal or self-mutilating behavior covered in Criterion 5. *Check - binge eating and sex.*

5. Recurrent suicidal behavior, gestures, or threats, or self-mutilating behavior. *Check. She once said "I wish I was dead!"*

6. Affective instability due to a marked reactivity of mood (e.g., intense episodic dysphoria, irritability, or anxiety usually lasting a few hours and only rarely more than a few days). *Big Check. I never know what kind of attitude I'm going to get whenever I come home from work.*

7. Chronic feelings of emptiness. *Possibly.*

8. Inappropriate, intense anger or difficulty controlling anger (e.g., frequent displays of temper, constant anger, recurrent physical fights) *Check. See number 6 above.*

9. Transient, stress-related paranoid ideation or severe dissociative symptoms. *No. Don't know.*


----------



## BashfulB

Binge eating and sex. Is she having sex with you?


----------



## TroyN

BashfulBull said:


> Binge eating and sex. Is she having sex with you?


No. 

We had crazy sex the first 8 or 9 months of dating. It was at least 4 or 5 times a week. She’s Catholic, and once I proposed, she decided to “wait until marriage” for us to have sex again. Why I agreed to this, I don’t know. Shame on me. So once she got the ring, she basically quit being intimate. We then went about 6 months without sex prior to the marriage. We then married, had sex the night of our wedding, then on the honeymoon a few times. We got back from the honeymoon and she cut off sex for another 3 months. That was late 2011. Since that fall of 2011, we’ve had sex maybe 10-15 times. That’s it. Every time we did, she wanted me to stop or finish quick because it hurt. She also wanted me to stop using a condom, which I said “no” to because I felt like we weren’t ready to have kids and she was acting like someone I really didn't want to have kids with (no patience, too emotional, picking fights).

I began to think a few things:

1. She’s not attracted to me at all. (probably)
2. She’s with another guy and it feels like she’s cheating on him with me. (not sure)
3. She’s not into sex because she’s depressed. (yes)


*Binge Eating*
Whenever she feels bad about her life, she binge eats. She was heavy prior to meeting me, and lost weight when I appeared in her life. Whenever something good happens, she loses weight. She is now losing weight…so I’m thinking something is up.


----------



## BobSimmons

TroyN said:


> No.
> 
> We had crazy sex the first 8 or 9 months of dating. It was at least 4 or 5 times a week. She’s Catholic, and once I proposed, she decided to “wait until marriage” for us to have sex again. Why I agreed to this, I don’t know. Shame on me. So once she got the ring, she basically quit being intimate. We then went about 6 months without sex prior to the marriage. We then married, had sex the night of our wedding, then on the honeymoon a few times. We got back from the honeymoon and she cut off sex for another 3 months. That was late 2011. Since that fall of 2011, we’ve had sex maybe 10-15 times. That’s it. Every time we did, she wanted me to stop or finish quick because it hurt. She also wanted me to stop using a condom, which I said “no” to because I felt like we weren’t ready to have kids and she was acting like someone I really didn't want to have kids with (no patience, too emotional, picking fights).
> 
> I began to think a few things:
> 
> 1. She’s not attracted to me at all. (probably)
> 2. She’s with another guy and it feels like she’s cheating on him with me. (not sure)
> 3. She’s not into sex because she’s depressed. (yes)
> 
> 
> *Binge Eating*
> Whenever she feels bad about her life, she binge eats. She was heavy prior to meeting me, and lost weight when I appeared in her life. *Whenever something good happens, she loses weight. She is now losing weight…so I’m thinking something is up.*


I wouldn't put too much stock in that. She seems to have troughs, with peaks and valleys. When she feeling bad she eats and gains weight, when she feels good she loses it.
My weight yoyos like hell, I have periods where I get off my ass, eat right and work out..then there are periods when I don't.


----------



## Malaise

Don't worry if something is up or not. Get the divorce and it won't matter.


----------



## Graywolf2

TroyN said:


> Her weight loss has started. Her clothes are starting to hang on her.


You were an Olympic gold metal and she won you. Now she realizes that she has to get back in training.


----------



## tulsy

TroyN said:


> We had crazy sex the first 8 or 9 months of dating. It was at least 4 or 5 times a week. She’s Catholic, and once I proposed, she decided to “wait until marriage” for us to have sex again. *Why I agreed to this, I don’t know*. Shame on me. So once she got the ring, she basically quit being intimate. We then went about 6 months without sex prior to the marriage. We then married, had sex the night of our wedding, then on the honeymoon a few times. We got back from the honeymoon and she cut off sex for another 3 months. That was late 2011. Since that fall of 2011, we’ve had sex maybe 10-15 times. That’s it. Every time we did, she wanted me to stop or finish quick because it hurt. She also wanted me to stop using a condom, which I said “no” to because I felt like we weren’t ready to have kids and she was acting like someone I really didn't want to have kids with (no patience, too emotional, picking fights)...


Ya, that's insane. You were already having crazy amounts of sex, so WTF? Because she was Catholic?! Makes no sense.

Sorry this happened to you. Don't fall for that one again.

Good luck buddy.


----------



## treyvion

TroyN said:


> She's such an entitled b!tch. I don't she believes anything is wrong with her. She's not guilty about anything - she's just pissed because she won't be married anymore. It has nothing to do with losing me. I was a prop through the whole thing. She didn't think she ever would get married and I filled that void.
> 
> She treats everyone this way. None of her bridesmaids even talk to her. Her dad doesn't like talking with her and ignores her and same can be said for her brother. Her co-workers don't want to hang out with her. All she has is her mother. Notice a trend here?
> 
> Now...she's lost me, the house, her diamonds, and a marriage.
> 
> I'm sorry. She deserved this.


In many cases we were just props, it's why they cheat on it and neglect it so easily.


----------



## Malaise

tulsy said:


> Ya, that's insane. You were already having crazy amounts of sex, so WTF? Because she was Catholic?! Makes no sense.
> 
> Sorry this happened to you. Don't fall for that one again.
> 
> Good luck buddy.


The sex was to hook him. Once hooked, it was reduced, then, eliminated.


----------



## treyvion

TroyN said:


> No.
> 
> We had crazy sex the first 8 or 9 months of dating. It was at least 4 or 5 times a week. She’s Catholic, and once I proposed, she decided to “wait until marriage” for us to have sex again.


An ex of mine was a virgin when I got her. I wasn't playing around with her and we got married. I think when we were getting married, she made sure we had a month or two sexless. Didn't kill me, and she was happy to oblige me that night. Never held herself from me, that was my wife... 

But I know the situation your talking about, hooked you, then turns off sex and says wants to wait till married.



TroyN said:


> Why I agreed to this, I don’t know. Shame on me. So once she got the ring, she basically quit being intimate. We then went about 6 months without sex prior to the marriage. We then married,


For some religious people, they may have guilt which propose them to do this.



TroyN said:


> had sex the night of our wedding, then on the honeymoon a few times. We got back from the honeymoon and she cut off sex for another 3 months.


Not a good sign.



TroyN said:


> That was late 2011. Since that fall of 2011, we’ve had sex maybe 10-15 times. That’s it.


This is a terrible sign. It should've been at least 10-15 times per month.



TroyN said:


> Every time we did, she wanted me to stop or finish quick because it hurt.


Did it hurt because you have a very large girth or did it hurt because her body really didn't want you inside of her?


TroyN said:


> She also wanted me to stop using a condom, which I said “no” to because I felt like we weren’t ready to have kids and she was acting like someone I really didn't want to have kids with (no patience, too emotional, picking fights).


Looking back, you might see that she was trying to hook you and then put a kid on you.



TroyN said:


> I began to think a few things:
> 
> 1. She’s not attracted to me at all. (probably)
> 2. She’s with another guy and it feels like she’s cheating on him with me. (not sure)
> 3. She’s not into sex because she’s depressed. (yes)


If they have another, many times they will not have sex or affections with the husband because they don't want to cheat on the OM.



TroyN said:


> *Binge Eating*
> Whenever she feels bad about her life, she binge eats. She was heavy prior to meeting me, and lost weight when I appeared in her life. Whenever something good happens, she loses weight. She is now losing weight…so I’m thinking something is up.


Funny that you have known her long enough to observe this pattern.


----------



## lenzi

treyvion I don't understand your post.



treyvion said:


> An ex of mine was a virgin when I got her. I wasn't playing around with her and we got married.


What do you mean you weren't playing around with her and you got married? 



treyvion said:


> I think when we were getting married, she made sure we had a month or two sexless.


You "think" she made sure you had a month or two sexless? How can you be any less than certain about whether or not you had sex with her for 1 or two months? Why would she make sure you didn't have any sex while you were getting married? 



treyvion said:


> Didn't kill me, and she was happy to oblige me that night.


Obviously it didn't kill you since you are still here posting. She was happy to oblige you that night? Which night?




treyvion said:


> Never held herself from me, that was my wife...


Who didn't hold herself from you? Sounds like the woman you have been referring to held herself from you for at least the better part of 2 months.

Perhaps you can elaborate


----------



## TroyN

treyvion said:


> This is a terrible sign. It should've been at least 10-15 times per month.


Tell me about it. I desire my wife physically. Do you know how hard is to be SUPPOSED to having sex with your wife and she never wants it? I'm pissed. I've seen all of her ex-boyfriends and I'm by far the best looking of all of them. I know this comes off as arrogant - but I'm angry! 



treyvion said:


> Did it hurt because you have a very large girth or did it hurt because her body really didn't want you inside of her?


She had no problems getting physical when we were dating. Then all of sudden, we go months without doing anything and now it "hurts?" I call BS. I think she doesn't want to be intimate with me and is not attracted to me.



treyvion said:


> Looking back, you might see that she was trying to hook you and then put a kid on you.


Yes. That is her goal in life. But lousy behavior doesn't get you a kid, it get's you divorced.



treyvion said:


> If they have another, many times they will not have sex or affections with the husband because they don't want to cheat on the OM.


I don't even know. Maybe? She's losing weight now and really cold to me. She's like a different person. I sense that something is up. Her body looks different and it "feels" like she's getting her needs met somewhere else. The feeling is like she's been had by another guy or "tainted" or she seems dirty to me.


----------



## happy as a clam

TroyN said:


> She's losing weight now and really cold to me. She's like a different person. I sense that something is up. Her body looks different and it "feels" like she's getting her needs met somewhere else. The feeling is like she's been had by another guy or "tainted" or she seems dirty to me.


Troy, your radar is up for a reason. Do some investigating. Figure out what is going on with her and then make a decision. I would advise you not to drag this out for months and months, tormenting yourself with "what ifs?" You've been dealing with this since Christmas of last year, and actually a lot longer when you look at the totality of your marriage. Seven months is long enough to get your ducks in a row and make some tough choices.

Figure it out before she gets preggers. The last thing you need is a kid getting dragged into this mess, whether it is your kid or someone else's


----------



## Plan 9 from OS

TroyN said:


> I don't even know. Maybe? She's losing weight now and really cold to me. She's like a different person. I sense that something is up. Her body looks different and it "feels" like she's getting her needs met somewhere else. *The feeling is like she's been had by another guy or "tainted" or she seems dirty to me.*


I assume you mean that this feeling is based on the red flags and her disconnecting from you as opposed to literally being able to tell she was with another man thru physical detection.

Assuming you are referring to an emotional feeling, what you are feeling is that your wife took her heart away from you and gave it to someone (or something) else. She may be getting her ducks in a row in preparation for a divorce and dating afterwards as opposed to cheating on you now. Were you ever able to find a male (or female) that she is suddenly connected to via phone records review, e-mails, etc.? I haven't kept up with your thread lately (sorry).


----------



## TroyN

Plan 9 from OS said:


> I assume you mean that this feeling is based on the red flags and her disconnecting from you as opposed to literally being able to tell she was with another man thru physical detection.
> 
> Assuming you are referring to an emotional feeling, what you are feeling is that your wife took her heart away from you and gave it to someone (or something) else. She may be getting her ducks in a row in preparation for a divorce and dating afterwards as opposed to cheating on you now. Were you ever able to find a male (or female) that she is suddenly connected to via phone records review, e-mails, etc.? I haven't kept up with your thread lately (sorry).


She’s just “off”. Won’t make eye contact. Ignores me. Seems peppy on the phone and walks with more swagger and more confidence. Her posture is more upright. About a month back she was looking terrible and very quiet, with no energy. So, something has happened or she’s locked into someone and focusing her energy on him. I have not snooped her email or looked at her phone. 

Meanwhile, our house has sold. We have split our phone bills and checking accounts. We are still in the same house at the moment and I’m scheduled to move into my new apartment in August - so it’s over. Divorce hearing is probably going to be in the fall.


----------



## Malaise

I know you're curious if it's an OM. That's only natural.

But, after August, who cares? Who cares now?

Just be thankful you're pulling the plug now and not living a miserable life for years.


----------



## Q tip

Don't get her pregnant.

IMHO, You can snoop emails and phones. People often confuse privacy and secrecy in marriage. Privacy - closing the door and using the toilet. Secrecy - never. Not in marriage. Both should have unfettered access to the others emails, phone, accounts, whatever. There is no snooping. Does not exist. If one is defensive over this, one should not be married. 

You open your hearts but password your phone???? WTF...


----------



## lordmayhem

TroyN said:


> She’s just “off”. Won’t make eye contact. Ignores me. Seems peppy on the phone and walks with more swagger and more confidence. Her posture is more upright. About a month back she was looking terrible and very quiet, with no energy. So, something has happened or she’s locked into someone and focusing her energy on him. I have not snooped her email or looked at her phone.
> 
> Meanwhile, our house has sold. We have split our phone bills and checking accounts. We are still in the same house at the moment and I’m scheduled to move into my new apartment in August - so it’s over. Divorce hearing is probably going to be in the fall.


Good. Count yourself lucky. Years down the road when you have a family and kids with a woman that really loves you, you will look back on this and realize just how lucky you were to have dodged the bullet on this one. Seriously.

As for her locking onto someone else? I know it hurts, but think of it this way: She's going to be someone else's headache from now on. She will put the weight back on after she's hooked this new guy. And then the cycle will repeat. Only the new guy won't be so smart and get her pregnant. Again, you will be so thankful that you didn't get her prego.


----------



## Plan 9 from OS

TroyN said:


> She’s just “off”. Won’t make eye contact. Ignores me. Seems peppy on the phone and walks with more swagger and more confidence. Her posture is more upright. About a month back she was looking terrible and very quiet, with no energy. So, something has happened or she’s locked into someone and focusing her energy on him. *I have not snooped her email or looked at her phone. *
> 
> Meanwhile, our house has sold. We have split our phone bills and checking accounts. We are still in the same house at the moment and I’m scheduled to move into my new apartment in August - so it’s over. Divorce hearing is probably going to be in the fall.


I'm going to assume that this means you haven't snooped lately given that you two decided to untangle assets and separate with the plan to divorce. If you never snooped since you first posted back in January, then why not? You may have saved your marriage if you would have snooped (if you never did).


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

Plan 9 from OS said:


> You may have saved your marriage if you would have snooped (if you never did).


I disagree. Individual counseling, marriage counseling, familial talks and fights didn't work with this woman, snooping wouldn't have saved anything. He'd just know why she was treating him poorly. That's if he found anything legit.

Remeber this Troy?


> The thing is that I have a pretty full life outside of our relationship - but she seems to hate my hobbies and doesn’t like most of my friends. I am pretty happy with everything in my life, *except my wife*, and she is not happy in her personal life and our marriage.


Personally, I'm glad you are moving on. The marriage was broken back in January. I think you are now looking for a reason to justify the divorce. Dude, no sex, insults, verbal abuse and the fact you want kids, but won't have them, is reason enough to leave this marriage.


----------



## bandit.45

TroyN said:


> Tell me about it. I desire my wife physically. Do you know how hard is to be SUPPOSED to having sex with your wife and she never wants it? I'm pissed. I've seen all of her ex-boyfriends and I'm by far the best looking of all of them. I know this comes off as arrogant - but I'm angry!
> 
> *How good you look isn't the reason. She's scum, so she looks for scummy men to make her feel at home.*
> 
> She had no problems getting physical when we were dating. Then all of sudden, we go months without doing anything and now it "hurts?" I call BS. I think she doesn't want to be intimate with me and is not attracted to me.
> 
> *Yeah, she saw you as a good sucker to provide for her. Once she had you roped in and corralled, there was no reason to keep up the hard work of pleasing you.*
> 
> 
> Yes. That is her goal in life. But lousy behavior doesn't get you a kid, it get's you divorced.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't even know. Maybe? She's losing weight now and really cold to me. She's like a different person. I sense that something is up. Her body looks different and it "feels" like she's getting her needs met somewhere else. The feeling is like she's been had by another guy or "tainted" or she seems dirty to me.
> 
> *She has been planning this all along. You were a temporary meal ticket. An ATM with legs. She is getting in shape for her new sugar daddy, and she will do the same to him as she has done to you.
> 
> You got used bud. Don't sweat it. It happens to the best and brightest. *


----------



## Plan 9 from OS

phillybeffandswiss said:


> I disagree. *Individual counseling, marriage counseling, familial talks and fights didn't work with this woman, snooping wouldn't have saved anything. *He'd just know why she was treating him poorly. That's if he found anything legit.
> 
> Remeber this Troy?
> 
> 
> Personally, I'm glad you are moving on. The marriage was broken back in January. I think you are now looking for a reason to justify the divorce. Dude, no sex, insults, verbal abuse and the fact you want kids, but won't have them, is reason enough to leave this marriage.


I'm not so sure. It seems like discovery and broadcasting activities has a way of snapping someone out of an affair (if his wife is having one, which is still unknown as of this time). That has played out time and time again on a slew of threads. If there was someone else, then of course the MC, IC and talks would do nothing when the OP is competing against a fantasy man. 

I'm not saying it is ironclad. My point is that if she was cheating since January, and he's never snooped on her, it allowed her to deepen a relationship that could have been derailed much sooner if caught early enough. 

We still don't know if she ever cheated or not, so who knows at this point.


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

Plan 9 from OS said:


> I'm not so sure. It seems like discovery and broadcasting activities has a way of snapping someone out of an affair (if his wife is having one, which is still unknown as of this time).


 Yes, this is the mantra, but people forget to add what it does is force a choice when you follow through. 



> That has played out time and time again on a slew of threads.


 Half the story. In those same "slew" quite a few come back for divorce, Dday 2+ or their cheating spouse filed first. It's why I'm saying I disagree.



> I'm not saying it is ironclad. My point is that if she was cheating since January, and he's never snooped on her, it allowed her to deepen a relationship that could have been derailed much sooner if caught early enough.


Cool and even with that scenario, I don't agree he may have saved the marriage. They way she reacts to everything negative, she was and is miserable regardless of an affair or not.


----------



## Plan 9 from OS

phillybeffandswiss said:


> Yes, this is the mantra, but people forget to add what it does is force a choice when you follow through.
> 
> Half the story. In those same "slew" quite a few come back for divorce, Dday 2+ or their cheating spouse filed first. It's why I'm saying I disagree.
> 
> Cool and even with that scenario, I don't agree he may have saved the marriage. They way she reacts to everything negative, she was and is miserable regardless of an affair or not.


I agree with your points. But the bottom line is that if he would have investigated and exposed what he found, then he would have forced that choice awhile ago. It could have forced the hand and the divorce would have been decided on months ago. However, the WW could have also went the other way and went NC and tried to work on the marriage. IF he never snooped and did the investigation, we'll never know if he could have or not. Regardless, I stand by what I wrote in that he could have saved it, or more accurately had a chance to save it. By doing nothing (if he didn't investigate at all), the marriage was doomed to fail.


----------



## weightlifter

IF YOU want help in finding the OM Troy. I'm a PM away. 

IF you want it.

I'm reading this two ways. One is PA the other is she is in the targeting phase and the target may not yet know he is about to get lucky. I didn't see any so called hard red flags but D is imminent.


----------



## happyman64

IMO why would he care now.....

He is almost free of this mess and the crazy one.

I mean his wife.


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

Plan 9 from OS said:


> I agree with your points. But the bottom line is that if he would have investigated and exposed what he found, then he would have forced that choice awhile ago. It could have forced the hand and the divorce would have been decided on months ago. However, the WW could have also went the other way and went NC and tried to work on the marriage. IF he never snooped and did the investigation, we'll never know if he could have or not. Regardless, I stand by what I wrote in that he could have saved it, or more accurately had a chance to save it. By doing nothing (if he didn't investigate at all), the marriage was doomed to fail.


No, there is no guarantee and the rest is irrelevant to helping him. So, we disagree, you can tell me how wrong I am and you'll have the last word.

Don't worry about what could've been Troy, just do what you can now to make your life better.


----------



## TroyN

Plan 9 from OS said:


> I agree with your points. But the bottom line is that if he would have investigated and exposed what he found, then he would have forced that choice awhile ago. It could have forced the hand and the divorce would have been decided on months ago. However, the WW could have also went the other way and went NC and tried to work on the marriage. IF he never snooped and did the investigation, we'll never know if he could have or not. Regardless, I stand by what I wrote in that he could have saved it, or more accurately had a chance to save it. By doing nothing (if he didn't investigate at all), the marriage was doomed to fail.


If my wife had sex with another man prior to us splitting up, under no circumstances would I ever want to work it out. That is the most insulting thing you can ever do to someone you "love". 

So, right now she's getting back to her wedding weight again. She is looking thinner every week. Avoiding me. I definitely sense something is going on and she's working on finding a new guy or whatever. Whatever the case is, I do not feel comfortable inquiring about what is going on. Her response recently, when asked I about our marriage, she just said "it just wasn't right". 

That has been her only excuse or answer.

My response, which I've never told her is:

"You know it's right and I’ve given you everything. So things are perfect for you, but they’ve never been good for me because you’ve given me NOTHING but lousy behavior and pain. For you to say “it just isn’t right” is probably the most hurtful thing you could ever say - you ungrateful b!tch."


----------



## Clay2013

When are you done with her? When will she move out or you will? 

The longer you are around her she will just cause you more grief.


----------



## GusPolinski

TroyN said:


> If my wife had sex with another man prior to us splitting up, under no circumstances would I ever want to work it out. That is the most insulting thing you can ever do to someone you "love".
> 
> So, right now she's getting back to her wedding weight again. She is looking thinner every week. Avoiding me. I definitely sense something is going on and she's working on finding a new guy or whatever. Whatever the case is, I do not feel comfortable inquiring about what is going on. Her response recently, when asked I about our marriage, she just said "it just wasn't right".
> 
> That has been her only excuse or answer.
> 
> My response, which I've never told her is:
> 
> "You know it's right and I’ve given you everything. So things are perfect for you, but they’ve never been good for me because you’ve given me NOTHING but lousy behavior and pain. For you to say “it just isn’t right” is probably the most hurtful thing you could ever say - you ungrateful b!tch."


Why not tell her ^this?

Have you filed at all?


----------



## alexm

TroyN said:


> And here's the problem. I know precisely how this is going to play out. As soon as I'm gone she'll miraculously get her act together and become the woman I want her to be and get with some other dude. I know this will happen. I'm not supposed to be this woman's teacher or mentor. She's a grown adult.
> 
> I will have served as a guy who merely kept the seat warm and this is not fair at all. Why can't she get her act together now?
> 
> I don't think I've ever loved and hated someone before. is this normal feel this way?


*Oh man, this is exactly what I went through with my ex. She was awful to me, and my friends and family (and my own mother!) were all relieved that she was gone.

She spouted lies and other garbage to anyone who would listen, and painted ME as the bad guy. Your wife will do the same thing, I promise. It's a low self-esteem thing. It's covering up an embarrassment. Blame it on the other person.

I spent a couple of YEARS still dealing with the repercussions of the crap she had said to others.

Also, she totally and completely was another person entirely when she was with the OM. There was no way he treated him like she was treating me. So yes, it happens, and you can count on it.

What's the saying? A leopard never changes it's spots? It's been about 6 years now that my ex has been with the OM. If he hasn't seen the real her by now, it's coming, and he's in for a treat.*



marduk said:


> If she's like my ex, she'll go dark on her friends and family, and when pushed she'll spin some BS story.
> 
> I had a few of her family members approach me because they were actually concerned for my mental health -- she had them convinced I was crazy.
> 
> Within 6 months it was clear who had their crap together and who didn't.
> 
> The truth comes out in time; my recommendation is to be open and honest without going into verbal diarrhoea with the gory details and make it clear to friends and family that they don't have to pick sides. That alone engendered a lot of support.


:iagree:

Protect yourself to those who matter. I lost a fair amount of friends during that period because my ex got to them first and made it seem like *I* was at fault. But in the end, it comes down to your ego. If these people are going with her version of events (no matter how made up) without conferring with you, then you don't need them around, anyway.

I have to say, the only people that I lost out of this who mattered were her parents, especially her dad. I lost my dad when I was in my early 20's, not long after we had started dating. Her dad took me under his wing and we developed a very good relationship. Not ultra-close or anything, but definitely to the point where I viewed him as a father.

He was still very friendly with me after hearing that we were splitting up (but as unbiased as he could be, of course). Then it just stopped, ostensibly because she had got to him with lies and BS. The last few times I heard from him were in regards to the divorce and lawyers, and he was short and vaguely threatening. This happened practically overnight.

And that really, really hurt me. I wasn't expecting an ongoing relationship with him afterwards, of course, but I was hoping it was going to end well.

I heard from him one more time many weeks later in regards to hurrying up the sale of the house so that my ex wife could move on. I blasted him for even being involved in this (his daughter was 31 or 32 for cripes sakes!) and proceeded to tell him that I strongly suspected he had heard very wrong information about what happened. I made sure to fill him in on exactly what the story was, and also included many other things he should have known about his daughter (like how when she was 15 she was involved with a married man in his early 20's). Never heard from him again.


----------



## bandit.45

I would tell her exactly what you wrote. Exactly.


----------



## Marduk

TroyN said:


> If my wife had sex with another man prior to us splitting up, under no circumstances would I ever want to work it out. That is the most insulting thing you can ever do to someone you "love".
> 
> So, right now she's getting back to her wedding weight again. She is looking thinner every week. Avoiding me. I definitely sense something is going on and she's working on finding a new guy or whatever. Whatever the case is, I do not feel comfortable inquiring about what is going on. Her response recently, when asked I about our marriage, she just said "it just wasn't right".
> 
> That has been her only excuse or answer.
> 
> My response, which I've never told her is:
> 
> "You know it's right and I’ve given you everything. So things are perfect for you, but they’ve never been good for me because you’ve given me NOTHING but lousy behavior and pain. For you to say “it just isn’t right” is probably the most hurtful thing you could ever say - you ungrateful b!tch."


Insulting her will give you nothing but make this more difficult for you.

Shoving words -- even if they describe reality -- into her face will give you nothing but make this more difficult for you.

Doing anything except making yourself ready to re-enter non-married life and showing her that you're awesome and will continue to be awesome with or without you will give you everything.

In short, go dark, be independent, and don't let her see that you give a crap what she does.

She's acting single. I recommend doing the same (minus the sleeping with other people part).

Let her see what she's losing and you may see some changes. And if not, you'll be ready for single life.


----------



## TroyN

So I moved out officially last night. It was rough. I had a majority of my things moved the previous weekend because the tenant of my apartment had moved already. The last of my stuff I was able to stuff into my car. Everything has been divided and she's asking for no alimony or any type of support. 

She was standing in the doorway watching me move my stuff. When I carried out the last box, and got into my car, I looked at her and she was crying her eyes out. I went up and gave her a hug and told her "goodbye".

I drove off and cried for about an hour straight. I slept for about 10 hours and said I'd be late for work. 

As for another guy in the picture, I still don't know, probably never will. I just don't understand how she cold be so frigid and mean to me. I'll never understand why she just couldn't give me a hug once in awhile or tell me how much she cared about me. I was, afterall, her husband. 

It's like I never really got to know this person. It's true when they say when person you marry and the person you divorce are never the same person. I see almost a stranger now. This is so much harder than I thought.


----------



## weightlifter

You will get through bud. Time is what you need. Vent away. Thats what CWI is for.


----------



## Lovemytruck

I was just looking back through your thread and remembering what you have gone through.

Take a few minutes sometime and re-read your thread. It will remind you of the correct choices you had to make.

It is tough. Leaving and being lonely are part of the hurdles you will face in the short term. My emotional healing was helped when I did not talk or contact my exWW. The BPD traits will probably have her being very sweet and sounding sincere. She may even plead or try to lure you in. Don't look back.

You are around 30. You are just hitting your stride for good things to come. It WILL get better!!!


----------



## bandit.45

I know it hurts, but look at yesterday as the day of your rebirth. You are leaving behind a dysfunctional person, who never had your back, behind you. You now have your whole life ahead of you and an opportunity to steer your destiny in a different direction. 

Don't dwell on your mistakes. Learn from them, remember what you learned, and don't make the same mistakes again.


----------



## happyman64

Troy

Congratulations.

You returned the booby prize.

Sure it hurts.

But sit back, take a deep breath and enjoy the peace.

Then on Monday start picking up the pieces and enjoy living your new life.

HM


----------



## workindad

Stay with your plan. You are moving in the right direction. You will find happiness again. Life is too short to waste any more years on this kind of crap.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## lordmayhem

TroyN said:


> My response, which I've never told her is:
> 
> "You know it's right and I’ve given you everything. So things are perfect for you, but they’ve never been good for me because you’ve given me NOTHING but lousy behavior and pain. For you to say “it just isn’t right” is probably the most hurtful thing you could ever say - you ungrateful b!tch."


I wouldn't send this. It sounds needy and butt hurt. And I would stop asking her about the marriage. Yes, it hurts to she that she's moving on and doesn't care about you.

Your response should be the same: That she's dead to you and doesn't exist. You should show that you're happy and moving on with your life. They HATE that. She expects you to be fully pining for her and upset. Sending that message would be validation for her. Don't do it.


----------



## lenzi

lordmayhem said:


> I wouldn't send this. It sounds needy and butt hurt. And I would stop asking her about the marriage.


^This.

It does sound like you're bitter and needy. She's not going to listen to you and think or say "oh, you're so right, I'm so sorry".

Just let it go. Let HER go.


----------



## Chaparral

This comes under the "don't throw pearls before swine" rule. There is nothing you can say that will have an effect on her. Don't waste any more energy than you have to on a broken woman. It is sad but you were not born to fix others.


----------



## helolover

Troy, your wife sounds like a textbook borderline personality disorder (BPD):

-the gangbuster sex at the start of the relationship
- the diminishing of sex as the relationship progresses
- her blame, shaming and anger towards you
- her isolation of you


Just all of it reeks of BPD. 

Be very careful of how you interact with your STBX. BPDrs are hardwired differently and things can become extreme.

-HL


----------



## Entropy3000

TroyN said:


> I think my wife MIGHT be having affair…she’s asleep right now and I’m looking for some thoughts...
> 
> So here’s my story and few things that have happened to me in my brief marriage.
> 
> Met my wife three years ago, instant mutual attraction, off the charts sex, and we were engaged 10 months later. She is 27, I’m 30. Wonderful wedding day, good honeymoon - but immediately afterwards things went sour and I’m not sure why. We are approaching the third year of marriage.
> 
> Some notes:
> 
> 1. I worked a lot of long hours in our first year of marriage. Like 10-12 hour days. She did not like this, but I was a manager and we working against some tight deadlines.
> 
> 2. After the honeymoon was over, it took us three months to have sex again. Then another two months afterwards to have sex again.
> 
> 3. After our first year of marriage, she gained a ton of weight, at least 35 lbs. She has been seeing a counselor, and has been on Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. She was on another drug that I forget the name of. She has went through bouts of depression her entire life.
> 
> 4. I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer.
> 
> 5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.
> 
> 6. We went on a trip for our second anniversary and she refused to sleep with me, and she gave me a dirty look when I tried to initiate sex. I would say that we maybe have had sex 10-15 times in our entire marriage (2 years, 9 months total)
> 
> 7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.
> 
> 8. This past December, we went to her companies Holiday party together and her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.
> 
> 9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women.
> 
> 10. We are in marriage counseling. Our marriage counselor once asked her if she thought would be OK if I had my needs met by another woman. She really didn’t have a response.
> 
> 11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.
> 
> Obviously, my marriage is in shambles, I have been thinking about divorce since Christmas. But I love this woman so much…I just feel like something is up.
> 
> Thoughts?


If there are no children I think you have found you are really not compatible. Could you work on this? I suppose, but it sounds like not only is she not the wife you were looking for but you are not the husband she wants either.

Having an affair? Idunno. Maybe but in many ways this is a bait and switch. Some women are more into sex pre-marriage. It may be more exciting and so on. 

Does she make more money than you?

----


Silly me. An old thread. I guess I will skim it over.


----------



## TroyN

Entropy3000 said:


> If there are no children I think you have found you are really not compatible.
> 
> Does she make more money than you?


She does not make more money than me. She makes $37K per year. I make $55K-60K. It varies because I pick up freelance work. She was always on me because she worked with a bunch of guys who made like $90K-100K per year and was pissed I didn't make more. We used to work together at the place she works at now but I was underpaid there and worked for a real jerk, so I left. I've been trying to get a new job, but there are not a lot of opportunities in the town we live in. But whatever, it's done now.

The real issue here is that she judges me and others so much, she isn't good for ANYONE. She was dating a guy before me who made $80K working his own boat rental business and had his winters off. She wasn't happy with him either. But I do know she's really into material things. Big houses, diamonds, crap like that which is all surface garbage. 

I will tell you one last story. I remember, after our wedding, that she wanted to upgrade her wedding ring to a bigger size and I let her do it with some of the money we had in savings. At the time, it made her happy, but looking back, I find it completely superficial, high maintenence, and ugly. I regret doing that for her. 

I haven't heard from her at all since I moved out. Not single, call, email, or text. 

Thanks for everyone who responded. I do have to meet her a couple more times before our divorce is finalized - not sure how it's going to go. 

Do I think she has BPD? Almost 95% positive she has it. All those meds, even the timeline of her behavior matches that posted by HELOLOVER. I think all over her relationships have ended because of this...


----------



## weightlifter

Dont get the new job until after d is final. Judges look at difference of incomes from today back to 3 to 5 years.

An example from when i almost divorced. Alimony =difference. Div by 3.


----------



## TroyN

We officially divorced yesterday. She was very cold to me, clinical, and wouldn’t look me in the eyes at all. Her parting words “just to let you know, I’m de-friending you on Facebook as well as your family members.” I sort of laughed at her and said “OK.” I guess of everything that could be said, this is what she chose to say to me as her parting message.

I also got the feeling that she’s seeing someone. Something about her body language and smell told me something was going on there. I felt something in the pit of my stomach. Is this heartbreak?

My co-worker took me out for lunch right afterwards and I asked me about my marriage. He once told me, based on my phone conversations with her during my lunch breaks and his brief interactions with her at my after work functions, that she was the typical “nagging wife” and he could tell that I was miserable. So it seemed like everyone sort of new that it was heading this way, but nobody felt comfortable saying anything - which is completely understandable. 

So life is pretty weird these days. I’m trying to find who I am again after 3 years of suffering. I think it’s going to be awhile. 

Thanks.


----------



## Malaise

Just feel sorry for whoever she's seeing now.

You'll adjust fine. Enjoy not walking on the eggshells.


----------



## bandit.45

I don't envy the guy who she is dating. 

Shake the dust off your sandals and move on. Your life is going to be so much better without her. Fvck her and her FB. You should be posting how happy you are now that you are free again, all the things you will be doing and experiencing without a dysfunctional person dragging you down. 

Man, you should be doing cartwheels...not worrying about who she's dating.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

Troy, I'm sorry, congratulations, and good luck!

The parting shot about defriending you on Facebook tells you all you need to know about her maturity and mindset, as if Facebook is the be all - end all in life. Teenagers use defriending friends on Facebook as a tactic to jab someone.

Good luck to you man and enjoy the next phase of your life!


----------



## bandit.45

PhillyGuy13 said:


> Troy, I'm sorry, congratulations, and good luck!
> 
> The parting shot about defriending you on Facebook tells you all you need to know about her maturity and mindset, as if Facebook is the be all - end all in life. Teenagers use defriending friends on Facebook as a tactic to jab someone.
> 
> Good luck to you man and enjoy the next phase of your life!


Absolutely true. The woman is an infant. How shallow can a person get?


----------



## happy as a clam

Congrats Troy. You shed the dead-weight. It's all good from here on out...


----------



## Clay2013

Congrats on your divorce. I would spend every day enjoying your new life. I remember right after my divorce one of the first things I really enjoyed was being able to pass out on the couch and not have someone screaming at me. I know it sounds so simple and almost pathetic but there was something so comforting in knowing I never have to worry about her treating me bad again. 

I think you will find those things in your life that are far better without her.


----------



## weightlifter

Malaise said:


> Just feel sorry for whoever she's seeing now.
> 
> You'll adjust fine. Enjoy not walking on the eggshells.


Dont feel bad for him now. Read post 1. Hes in the sex like rabbits stage. Now once things become official...

Bait and switch


----------



## TroyN

weightlifter said:


> Hes in the sex like rabbits stage.


Ugh. I don't like thinking about this. So, she can turn it on for someone else? But not for her husband?


----------



## farsidejunky

*Re: Re: I think my wife MIGHT be having affair…*



TroyN said:


> Ugh. I don't like thinking about this. So, she can turn it on for someone else? But not for her husband?


Troy:

It is not something that she deliberately set about doing. It is an emotional response so ingrained in her psyche that it has become second nature. She is unable to stop it much in the same manner that she is unable to stop her own heart from beating.

Please, bro... For your sanity... Detach. Find yourself and what makes you happy being by yourself again. Once you do that, a better Mrs. Troy will come when you least expect it.


----------



## workindad

Op congratulations on this positive step in your life. I don't intend this in a bad way but I actually laughed at the part about her I friending you on Facebook. She sounds very immature with that one. 

You are better off without her. 

Make the most of this opportunity
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## GusPolinski

TroyN said:


> We officially divorced yesterday. She was very cold to me, clinical, and wouldn’t look me in the eyes at all. *Her parting words “just to let you know, I’m de-friending you on Facebook as well as your family members.”* I sort of laughed at her and said “OK.” I guess of everything that could be said, this is what she chose to say to me as her parting message.


I'd beat her to the punch and de-friend/BLOCK her.

As for a response...

"Well, that's TWO good things that happened to me today! I'm gonna go buy a lottery ticket... with luck like this, I can't lose!!!"

...with a HUGE smile on your face. :smthumbup:

Did you wind up having to pay any sort of alimony/spousal support?


----------



## Graywolf2

TroyN said:


> Met my wife three years ago, instant mutual attraction, off the charts sex, and we were engaged 10 months later. Wonderful wedding day, good honeymoon - but immediately afterwards things went sour and I’m not sure why.





TroyN said:


> Ugh. I don't like thinking about this. So, she can turn it on for someone else? But not for her husband?


*She can turn it on for her NEW husband just like she did for you. Poor bastard. You are so lucky that you didn't have kids.*


----------



## PhillyGuy13

GusPolinski said:


> I'd beat her to the punch and de-friend/BLOCK her.


Great point. BLOCK HER. Cuz you know dam well she will still be checking up on you, even after she defriends you. It will go up her butt sideways.


----------



## GusPolinski

Graywolf2 said:


> *She can turn it on for her NEW husband just like she did for you. Poor bastard. You are so lucky that you didn't have kids.*


This post deserves a "Like" from every single damn one of us.


----------



## LongWalk

Her social IQ is not high.

She was "defending you"? That's pretty off the wall. Shows how bizarre her thoughts have been. Probably she cooked up some explanation of the divorce that painted you as a monster, an abusive sex maniac who never lifted a finger to clean the pee off the toilet seat.

She is going to put another guy through the wringer.


----------



## Graywolf2

TroyN said:


> My co-worker took me out for lunch right afterwards and I asked me about my marriage. He once told me, based on my phone conversations with her during my lunch breaks and his brief interactions with her at my after work functions, that *she was the typical “nagging wife” and he could tell that I was miserable. *
> 
> Her parting words “just to let you know, I’m de-friending you on Facebook as well as your family members.” I sort of laughed at her and said “OK.”


You should have said: "I'm sure they will be heartbroken."


----------



## TroyN

GusPolinski said:


> Did you wind up having to pay any sort of alimony/spousal support?


None. I talk a little bit about it in this thread. We only had sex like 10-15 times in the entire 3 year marriage. I wanted kids with her, but her treatment of me was bad and she was proving over and over again that she was not emotional mature enough to handle a child. So I held off on kids until her/we/us could work this through. But she made no improvements, so I bailed, and she filed.

So no kids. No child support. No alimony/spousal support because she worked full-time and didn't even ask for it.


----------



## PhillyGuy13

Face it Tiger you just hit the jackpot!

in all seriousness I'm sorry you had to go through all this. Take time for you and enjoy doing what you enjoy doing. Date, don't date. The best is yet to come.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## murphy5

TroyN said:


> None. I talk a little bit about it in this thread. We only had sex like 10-15 times in the entire 3 year marriage. I wanted kids with her, but her treatment of me was bad and she was proving over and over again that she was not emotional mature enough to handle a child. So I held off on kids until her/we/us could work this through. But she made no improvements, so I bailed, and she filed.
> 
> So no kids. No child support. No alimony/spousal support because she worked full-time and didn't even ask for it.


OMG, you were soooo brilliant to spot that, even back then. So many other guys are on here saying how they were suckered into having kids, and then the sex shut off. Enjoy your new AND better life.


----------



## TroyN

murphy5 said:


> OMG, you were soooo brilliant to spot that, even back then. So many other guys are on here saying how they were suckered into having kids, and then the sex shut off. Enjoy your new AND better life.


Thanks. I knew it was going to get worse. Here were my options:

1. Divorce her, find someone better.

2. Have kids with her, she shuts off sex completely, misery for everyone including the child, divorce, mega amounts of child support and alimony, her being tied to me for life.

I know she wasn't going to get better. But I am still tremendously hurt but I need to tell myself that she isn't good for anyone. No matter who she is with, it will be the same old crap. If she's in relationship now, which I'm thinking is a possibility based on how she looked, she did NOTHING to fix her issues. So, essentially, it's another crash and burn.


----------



## happyman64

You owe it to yourself to bE happy Troy. 

So focus on you and only you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## bandit.45

Stop worrying about what could have been. She's a lost cause. Maybe one day she will come to her senses, but you don't need to worry about that. Just worry about taking care of yourself and being the best person you can be.


----------



## TroyN

Well - my suspicions are confirmed regarding my wife's drastic weight loss. She has a boyfriend and it's a co-worker. 

I was told last night by someone who works with her who I'm somewhat friends with. 

I'm beyond devastated and I'm crying my eyes out. This is by far the worst thing that has ever happened to me.


----------



## tom67

TroyN said:


> Well - my suspicions are confirmed regarding my wife's drastic weight loss. She has a boyfriend and it's a co-worker.
> 
> I was told last night by someone who works with her who I'm somewhat friends with.
> 
> I'm beyond devastated and I'm crying my eyes out. This is by far the worst thing that has ever happened to me.


Troy so sorry.
But in time you will realize you dodged having to deal with this nut case.
Bro it gets better.


----------



## GusPolinski

So sorry to hear that, Troy. Any idea w/ regard to how long it's been going on?


----------



## TroyN

TroyN said:


> Well - my suspicions are confirmed regarding my wife's drastic weight loss. She has a boyfriend and it's a co-worker.
> 
> I was told last night by someone who works with her who I'm somewhat friends with.
> 
> I'm beyond devastated and I'm crying my eyes out. This is by far the worst thing that has ever happened to me.


I just don't know what to do. This just explains everything...but I have so many questions that I want answered.

How long was this guy in the picture? 

Was it before we separated? During our separation? Or after? 

I feel like throwing up. I found out who the guy is and he's already Facebook friends with my ex's MOM!!!!! WTF.


----------



## happyman64

Troy

Stop crying. Your wife is f'd up. 

You knew it. We knew it.

Just let her keep on making mistake after mistake.

And if her Mom knew then your marriage was really doomed.

Stop looking for answers. She will only lie more.

Focus on you. Dry your eyes. Move forward.

HM


----------



## davecarter

TroyN said:


> I just don't know what to do. This just explains everything...but I have so many questions that I want answered.
> 
> How long was this guy in the picture?


Sounds like this guy's done you a _massive _favor.


----------



## tom67

davecarter said:


> Sounds like this guy's done you a _massive _favor.


:iagree::iagree:


----------



## LongWalk

You are rid of a troublesome person.


----------



## davecarter

F*cking hell, Troy - I'd _die _to be in your shoes now: 30 - your entire life ahead of you, chances to improve and get your sh!t together and explore what life's got out there...

Take it and own it.


----------



## GusPolinski

davecarter said:


> F*cking hell, Troy - I'd _die _to be in your shoes now: 30 - your entire life ahead of you, chances to improve and get your sh!t together and explore what life's got out there...
> 
> Take it and own it.


Word. And Troy, you're especially lucky that you were able to divorce your ex w/o having to pay any alimony.


----------



## ArmyofJuan

TroyN said:


> Well - my suspicions are confirmed regarding my wife's drastic weight loss. She has a boyfriend and it's a co-worker.
> 
> I was told last night by someone who works with her who I'm somewhat friends with.
> 
> I'm beyond devastated and I'm crying my eyes out. This is by far the worst thing that has ever happened to me.


It's a big blow to the ego for sure, I had this exact same thing happen but with a gf. I made the mistake of trying to get back with her after I found out (even though I was happy to have her gone initially). I was young and dumb and in hindsight never should have dated her to begin with.

Bottom line, your exW was a horrible person.

You are hurt BUT know this, the OM isn't better than you (she didn't upgrade so don't think its your fault or you could have done anything about it) and odds are this has been going on for some time. Best thing to do is let it go, the only real revenge you could do that would have any impact on her is to show that your life is better without her (a hotter, younger chic couldn't help). Let me tell you something, there's nothing worse than dumping someone and finding out they do better and move on afterwards. Her ego tells her that she was the best thing you had, you have to show her she is wrong. 

Also, don't be shocked in a few months when their relationship fizzles out (rebound/affair relationships have a statistically high failure rate) that she comes snooping around your door for another chance. That just how these things tend to play out. Hopefully you'll have someone new and will tell her to fvck off when she does.

You'll hurt for a while but the pain won't last forever, its a psychosomatic response to perceived rejection. Once you get you confidence back it will go away.


----------



## dental

My brother was in the same situation as you. Same dynamic. Same pattern. BPD is a *****. Let me tell you, you are so totally lucky that you have no ties anymore to your xww. Living with a borderline is hellraiser. Create a nice life for yourself. Make your house in order. Find peace. Don't feel negative about your XWW though. Forgive her for the pain you're feeling now. She can't help making the choices she's making. You can't hold her accountable for her actions and behavior. She's just sick. That enormous empty hole inside of her will never be filled. Ever. The next guy will find that out the hard way. And the next. And the next. And the next. And that's actually sad.


----------



## Ceegee

dental said:


> My brother was in the same situation as you. Same dynamic. Same pattern. BPD is a *****. Let me tell you, you are so totally lucky that you have no ties anymore to your xww. Living with a borderline is hellraiser. Create a nice life for yourself. Make your house in order. Find peace. Don't feel negative about your XWW though. Forgive her for the pain you're feeling now. She can't help making the choices she's making. You can't hold her accountable for her actions and behavior. She's just sick. That enormous empty hole inside of her will never be filled. Ever. The next guy will find that out the hard way. And the next. And the next. And the next. And that's actually sad.



Nice sentiment but disordered people are still accountable for their actions. 

The rest is true. She has a hole that can't be filled. She will look for someone to fill that void in her but it will never happen. (Keep the puns to yourself, not the time or place). 

Trust me when I say, OP, that it does get better. 

Sure, you'll feel pain going forward but you'll feel joy as well. Soon the joy will out way the pain. 

There will be parts of you that still love her indefinitely. Love those parts and accept them. Nurture the rest of you that strives to move forward.


----------



## tom67

Ceegee said:


> Nice sentiment but disordered people are still accountable for their actions.
> 
> The rest is true. She has a hole that can't be filled. She will look for someone to fill that void in her but it will never happen. (Keep the puns to yourself, not the time or place).
> 
> Trust me when I say, OP, that it does get better.
> 
> Sure, you'll feel pain going forward but you'll feel joy as well. Soon the joy will out way the pain.
> 
> There will be parts of you that still love her indefinitely. Love those parts and accept them. Nurture the rest of you that strives to move forward.


You loved what you thought she was not what she really is.


----------



## GusPolinski

Ceegee said:


> *Nice sentiment but disordered people are still accountable for their actions.*
> 
> The rest is true. She has a hole that can't be filled. She will look for someone to fill that void in her but it will never happen. (Keep the puns to yourself, not the time or place).
> 
> Trust me when I say, OP, that it does get better.
> 
> Sure, you'll feel pain going forward but you'll feel joy as well. Soon the joy will out way the pain.
> 
> There will be parts of you that still love her indefinitely. Love those parts and accept them. Nurture the rest of you that strives to move forward.


:iagree:


----------



## bandit.45

Sorry you're in pain Troy. You just have to give it time. But in a few months you will feel line a new man, without all that dead weight dragging you down.

The other man really did do you a favor.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## chillymorn

I'm crying my eye out because I'm envious!

still young no kids,,,,,,,,,,life lesson learned. 

lucky dog!


----------



## cool12

sorry you are upset. you 2 haven't been happy together in a long time. get your cry out and live the life you want.


----------



## just got it 55

TroyN

The best thing God ever made was another day

I remember my first car.I wanted that car sooooo bad

I worked just for that car and the ins,repairs,ect

I loved driving that car,

Trouble was I pushed the b!tch more than I drove it

get the analogy ?

You got off easy.

I know it doesn't fell that way now But you will

Soon as that next new car comes along

55


----------



## davecarter

TroyN said:


> I just don't know what to do. This just explains everything...but I have so many questions that I want answered.
> 
> How long was this guy in the picture?
> 
> Was it before we separated? During our separation? Or after?


Asked myself exact same questions back in 2013: how long before wife separated from me was she 'seeing' her OM?

And it's horrible when you don't get the answer(s)


----------



## Forest

I'm sure its rough when you think about her shutting you down, but now she's back on the market. After reading this thread, I have to say I'm not the least bit surprised. It has nothing to do with you or the marriage, its simply a pattern of behavior, to be expected.

Its as plain as day that this is just the start of another cycle with her. It will be like the others. You haven't "missed out" on anything or failed to do something that would have restored the "old" her to you. That was never an option.

Its like washing a car, or making the bed. Wow, does that look good. In short order it will be all messed up, dirty, rumpled, and no longer have that shine.

Face it, she doesn't really have what you want. For now, she can shine herself up and gold-dig. That will all wear off like her makeup. Your long term prospects are far better.


----------



## chillymorn

years from now when you look back you will think Wow life is crazy kinda glad it happened.

unless you haven't learned what to look for.


----------



## bandit.45

chillymorn said:


> years from now when you look back you will think Wow life is crazy kinda glad it happened.
> 
> unless you haven't learned what to look for.


Years from now you will look back and think "...how the hell did I ever love that broken, sorry excuse for a woman? Who was that guy? I wish I could go back in time and shake some sense into him!"
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## GusPolinski

I wish I could buy Troy a beer and give him a hug.

A manly hug. A "bro-hug", if you will.

(Oddly enough, I recall saying something similar in one of WhiteRaven's threads a few months back...)


----------



## PhillyGuy13

You could buy him a hug and give him a beer, but those establishments are usually a little costlier.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## GusPolinski

PhillyGuy13 said:


> You could buy him a hug and give him a beer, but those establishments are usually a little costlier.


:lol:


----------



## weightlifter

If you want bro, Give me a timeline of everything like when the weight loss started and other red flags...

I am SCARY good at the logistical timing thing. I see patterns others don't and have had access to dozens of affairs inside info.

Again only if you want, but if it will ease your mind. I will help.

Btw did you ask this coworker when they noticed it?


----------



## TroyN

You can see earlier in my thread that she started losing tons of weight just prior to me moving out. So she was lining this guy up probably weeks after I asked to separate. 

It is eerily similar to how our relationship started. She was overweight when we met, drastic weightloss to seduce me. 

I am so depressed. I loved this woman so much and she just kicked the crap out of me.

What's worse is that the guy she's dating is overweight and not good looking at all. I'm sorry, but he's ugly. I am being judgmental but I'm hurt because she was ridiculously hard on me about everything and had such high standards. This is so f**cked.


----------



## GusPolinski

You're just going to have to accept that she's broken, man. All of this sh*t is in her f*cked up nature.

I know it's hard right now, but at some point you'll realize how lucky you were to get out of your marriage with as little baggage as possible.


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

Don't beat yourself up. I think I've read 4-5 threads where the cheater "affaired up." Most of the threads I have read, the people affair way down. Drug dealers, living with mother, obese, older, unemployed, lazy, abusers, etc and it is amazing how low some people will go to have their supposed unmet "needs" fulfilled.


----------



## davecarter

TroyN said:


> What's worse is that the guy she's dating is overweight and not good looking at all. I'm sorry, but he's ugly. I am being judgmental but I'm hurt because she was ridiculously hard on me about everything and had such high standards. This is so f**cked.


True...but you have to look at things like: _"He must have something...or she wouldn't have blown up our marriage"_

If he was tall, physically fit, chiseled-looks, good salary, driving a BMW and did parachuting at 10,000ft for fun...would you feel any worse...or would it be 'fair game'?


----------



## MattMatt

TroyN said:


> You can see earlier in my thread that she started losing tons of weight just prior to me moving out. So she was lining this guy up probably weeks after I asked to separate.
> 
> It is eerily similar to how our relationship started. She was overweight when we met, drastic weightloss to seduce me.
> 
> I am so depressed. I loved this woman so much and she just kicked the crap out of me.
> 
> What's worse is that the guy she's dating is overweight and not good looking at all. I'm sorry, but he's ugly. I am being judgmental but I'm hurt because she was ridiculously hard on me about everything and had such high standards. This is so f**cked.


Maybe she is tired of living up to your standards so needs to loosen up a little?:scratchhead:


----------



## GusPolinski

Troy, she's probably just angling for someone around/with whom she'd feel more comfortable letting herself go. Think about it -- she was always putting you down for being "too skinny". Right now she's losing weight herself because she's learned that that's what she has to do in order to attract a mate. Once she's fooled this poor sap into meeting her at the alter, she'll start packing the pounds back on, and it'll be the same BS all over again. However, Fugly McFatty is probably much less likely to tell her to hit the bricks. That's how she sees things anyway, even if only subconsciously.

Make sense?


----------



## Rugs

She's not having an affair, you're divorced. 

I just read all 20 pages of this thread and I still haven't heard why Troy is so in love with this woman. 

Yes, she needs help but probably won't get it but.......

Troy, you need some serious individual counseling to be so "in love" with this woman even after 3 years of what sounds like complete hell. 

You're not listening to anyone here about being grateful to be out of this situation and free with no kids. 

I fear you may end up with someone just like her if you don't get to the bottom of your own want of this kind of woman. 

Please consider individual counseling for yourself.


----------



## weightlifter

IF you want help in figuring timing. If not just say no thanks. I am harder than hell to offend but you seemed to want to figure 
out the timing.

3. After our first year of marriage, she gained a ton of weight, at least 35 lbs. She has been seeing a counselor, and has been on Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. She was on another drug that I forget the name of. She has went through bouts of depression her entire life.

When did this reverse? (Mo/year)

4. I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer.

When did that start? (Mo/Year)

5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.

Does Jabba the Hut (OM) make more than you and by what factor?

7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.

approx when did this start and when did it become hardcore?

8. This past December, we went to her companies Holiday party together and her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.

This is huge

9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women.

Did she stop reporting this at any point?

11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.

Did this change from post 1 to now besides OM?


----------



## manfromlamancha

weightlifter said:


> IF you want help in figuring timing. If not just say no thanks. I am harder than hell to offend but you seemed to want to figure
> out the timing.
> 
> 3. After our first year of marriage, she gained a ton of weight, at least 35 lbs. She has been seeing a counselor, and has been on Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. She was on another drug that I forget the name of. She has went through bouts of depression her entire life.
> 
> When did this reverse? (Mo/year)
> 
> 4. I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer.
> 
> When did that start? (Mo/Year)
> 
> 5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.
> 
> Does Jabba the Hut (OM) make more than you and by what factor?
> 
> 7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.
> 
> approx when did this start and when did it become hardcore?
> 
> 8. This past December, we went to her companies Holiday party together and her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.
> 
> This is huge
> 
> 9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women.
> 
> Did she stop reporting this at any point?
> 
> 11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.
> 
> Did this change from post 1 to now besides OM?



Wow! WL, you are good man! Hat off to you and much respect!


----------



## TroyN

weightlifter said:


> IF you want help in figuring timing. If not just say no thanks. I am harder than hell to offend but you seemed to want to figure
> out the timing.
> 
> 3. After our first year of marriage, she gained a ton of weight, at least 35 lbs. She has been seeing a counselor, and has been on Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. She was on another drug that I forget the name of. She has went through bouts of depression her entire life.
> 
> When did this reverse? (Mo/year)
> 
> *She started losing weight like a month before I moved out. *
> 
> 4. I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer.
> 
> When did that start? (Mo/Year)
> 
> *Last December (2013) we were ready to go to a party, I was dressed really well, and I asked her that. But, as far as the yelling, pretty much after we got married two plus years ago. We got married in the summer and that summer she would give me crap almost everyday after work.*
> 
> 5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.
> 
> Does Jabba the Hut (OM) make more than you and by what factor?
> 
> *I imagine he does. I have resisted the urge to google him. The people at her company are well paid. The funny thing is that I did work with the guy briefly many years ago because we all worked at the same company but didn't know who he was. The OM would walk by my desk on the way to the bathroom, but I never met him.
> 
> My ex-wife chased me around the office until we finally started dating, so the OM is the second guy from this company that she has dated.*
> 
> 7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.
> 
> approx when did this start and when did it become hardcore?
> *
> Last summer, 2013. But sex pretty much died after marriage. *
> 
> 8. This past December, we went to her companies Holiday party together and her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.
> 
> This is huge
> 
> 9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women.
> 
> Did she stop reporting this at any point?
> 
> *Earlier this year, but I remember these conversations started last summer.*
> 
> 11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.
> 
> Did this change from post 1 to now besides OM?


*This never stopped. She would still come home every day at 5:15pm when we separated. My guess is that as soon as it came out that she was single/separated, they hooked up - or - this was going on for a long time and I didn't know. Whatever. That company was ripe with a lot of affairs and inter-office dating when I worked there. I hated that place, hated my boss, that's why I left. 

I think she felt she "had" me until I moved out, noticed I wasn't budging on the my decision to divorce, and quickly started the weightloss to pull this guy in. I remember her crying when I moved out, but she needs to SURVIVE and the only way she can do this is dropping her panties to her co-workers (including me).
*


----------



## turnera

Only two years? Consider it your learning experience. Date for a good two years before marrying your next wife, to get to know them in good times and bad, so you can see the unhealthy patterns and decide if they're a dealbreaker.


----------



## TroyN

Rugs said:


> She's not having an affair, you're divorced.
> 
> I just read all 20 pages of this thread and I still haven't heard why Troy is so in love with this woman.
> 
> Yes, she needs help but probably won't get it but.......
> 
> Troy, you need some serious individual counseling to be so "in love" with this woman even after 3 years of what sounds like complete hell.
> 
> You're not listening to anyone here about being grateful to be out of this situation and free with no kids.
> 
> I fear you may end up with someone just like her if you don't get to the bottom of your own want of this kind of woman.
> 
> Please consider individual counseling for yourself.


I agree with a lot of what you are saying. I do. But I made a vow to love my wife, and I tried everything. I put in a lot of emotional effort and I married her with the intentions of starting a family. I just don't understand the behavior. It's obvious she doesn't love me and probably never did. 

I am not ready to date anyone at this time. I'm a little too shaken to contribute to a new relationship. 

As to why I loved her. She was beautiful, and very sweet and nice in the beginning. Very eager to spend all of her time with me and even though I was good about giving us a good amount of space between dates (I sort of pushed her away and tried to not move so fast), I think I felt confident we could make it.

I was wrong. It was a Jekyll/Hyde scenario. She had an agenda, and still does. This has nothing to do with me, it always about her. My love was real, her's never was apparently, because if she really did, she would have never behaved this way and wouldn't have jumped into a relationship this quickly.


----------



## bandit.45

Troy you picked a lemon man. Your ego has taken a hit and you feel like a sucker. 

Well, don't feel that way. Your ex is a consummate game player and manipulator. She will burn through men for the rest of her life until she ends up alone in a house full of cats. Have faith in karma.


----------



## Marduk

TroyN said:


> I agree with a lot of what you are saying. I do. But I made a vow to love my wife, and I tried everything. I put in a lot of emotional effort and I married her with the intentions of starting a family. I just don't understand the behavior. It's obvious she doesn't love me and probably never did.
> 
> I am not ready to date anyone at this time. I'm a little too shaken to contribute to a new relationship.
> 
> As to why I loved her. She was beautiful, and very sweet and nice in the beginning. Very eager to spend all of her time with me and even though I was good about giving us a good amount of space between dates (I sort of pushed her away and tried to not move so fast), I think I felt confident we could make it.
> 
> I was wrong. It was a Jekyll/Hyde scenario. She had an agenda, and still does. This has nothing to do with me, it always about her. My love was real, her's never was apparently, because if she really did, she would have never behaved this way and wouldn't have jumped into a relationship this quickly.


Learn, man!

What have you learned?

#1 the depths to which you are able to love. This is amazing. Someone will cherish this about you.

#2 that people can have agendas. Look out for this.

#3 better mate selection. 

You will rise again. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but soon.

Eat. Good food. Work out. Be around positive, supportive people. Do hobbies that make you happy.


----------



## weightlifter

Okay now I will start pulling this mess apart for you. I can only go by statistics but I rock at them.

A) Get some LOW level meds for anxiety. Tell your doc you just found out your stbx was having an affair while married and it is affecting you. Low level meds wont kill the pain but will have the effect of dulling it. IE you may wake up but instead of 2AM and lying awake it will be 5AM.
B) This marriage appears doomed from the start.

>3. After our first year of marriage, she gained a ton of weight, at least 35 lbs. She has been seeing a counselor, and has been on Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. She was on another drug that I forget the name of. She has went through bouts of depression her entire life.

When did this reverse? (Mo/year)

She started losing weight like a month before I moved out.<

I think this was not her trying to attract but rather to keep him. This is a bit atypical but fits the rest of my timeline.

4. I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer.

When did that start? (Mo/Year)

Last December (2013) we were ready to go to a party, I was dressed really well, and I asked her that. But, as far as the yelling, pretty much after we got married two plus years ago. We got married in the summer and that summer she would give me crap almost everyday after work.

They were AT LEAST at the inappropriate and they know it stage. This enhances it and see below.

5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.

Does Jabba the Hut (OM) make more than you and by what factor?

I imagine he does. I have resisted the urge to google him. The people at her company are well paid. The funny thing is that I did work with the guy briefly many years ago because we all worked at the same company but didn't know who he was. The OM would walk by my desk on the way to the bathroom, but I never met him.

My ex-wife chased me around the office until we finally started dating, so the OM is the second guy from this company that she has dated.

Pattern

7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.

approx when did this start and when did it become hardcore?

Last summer, 2013. But sex pretty much died after marriage.

8. This past December, we went to her companies Holiday party together and her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.

This is huge

At least the inappropriate and known stage. Likely physical by this time. I get the impression of a fast flare up likely around Thanksgiving.

CAN YOU REMEMBER ANY INCIDENTS FROM LABOR DAY THRU SAY DEC 15?


9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women.

Did she stop reporting this at any point?

Earlier this year, but I remember these conversations started last summer.

She was at the innocent but talking stage in 2013 summer and likely sexting or dirty email/ calls at least by Thanksgiving. By spring 2014 it was serious enough she finally shut up because she was guilty.

11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.

Did this change from post 1 to now besides OM?
This never stopped. She would still come home every day at 5:15pm when we separated. My guess is that as soon as it came out that she was single/separated, they hooked up - or - this was going on for a long time and I didn't know. Whatever. That company was ripe with a lot of affairs and inter-office dating when I worked there. I hated that place, hated my boss, that's why I left.

Dont be surprised. Long lunches. Unreported days off etc. Been there seen that.

I think she felt she "had" me until I moved out, noticed I wasn't budging on the my decision to divorce, and quickly started the weightloss to pull this guy in. I remember her crying when I moved out, but she needs to SURVIVE and the only way she can do this is dropping her panties to her co-workers (including me).

Disagree just a bit. I read the weight loss as her holding him not the initially attracting him.

Here is a bombshell for you. Do NOT be surprised if something happened right around your honeymoon. Perhaps at the bachelorette party. Do NOT be surprised if you learn Jabba is OM #2.

Ive seen ~4 threads with the same pre-post honeymoon disconnect and like three of them were affairs and IIRC two of them were 'accidental' ONS. This explains not only the drop in sex, but also the drop in attitude.


----------



## turnera

marduk said:


> #3 better mate selection.


in the meantime, read this book to figure out why you picked the wrong person (and how not to do it again). It says it's for couples, but the first half of the book explains our mate selection.


----------



## TroyN

This is all great Weightlifter, but why was she crying when I left? 

I wasn't even close to tears when I left.


----------



## bandit.45

TroyN said:


> This is all great Weightlifter, but why was she crying when I left?
> 
> I wasn't even close to tears when I left.


Half the rent just walked out. That's why.


----------



## weightlifter

Sorry. Troy. I don't pull punches. You seem to want closure and to figure it out. You are not my first thread. Hell you aint my hundredth. I have inside timing info never published.

I bet if you think you will find an incident in the timeframe I mentioned.

GET THOSE MEDS! It wont kill the pain. It WILL make it bearable.


----------



## weightlifter

Why was she crying. She 'loved' you still in some ways. Her sex was aimed at someone else.

I know of DOZENS of wives who loved the OM and cried as their husbands left or at the final divorce hearing. Part of her died and a chapter of her life was closed and she knew it. It does NOT mean you were wrong.


----------



## weightlifter

Out for the rest of the day. Got stuff to do.

Chin up BRO

We WILL get you thru.


----------



## Marduk

TroyN said:


> This is all great Weightlifter, but why was she crying when I left?
> 
> I wasn't even close to tears when I left.


Think about it, Troy. Put away all _your_ feelings about it, and think about things from her perspective.

She just went from having two guys adore, love, and support her insanity, to (in all likelihood) _zero_ guys adoring, loving, and supporting her insanity.

So that's kind of a bummer, right? Because she'll have to deal with her **** herself?

Also, what do female human beings often do to guys when they don't get what they want, or want to change the rules?

That's right. The tears start flowing.

It's been shown that female tears drop male's testosterone, and increase their drive to protect and nurture.

Use your cortex and not your limbic system.


----------



## TroyN

marduk said:


> Also, what do female human beings often do to guys when they don't get what they want, or want to change the rules?
> 
> That's right. The tears start flowing.


You know what's funny? I remember her yelling at me and "crying" one day. She was behaving in such a crazy way that I wasn't even phased by it and not even engaging her in the fight. I looked at her face, and though it appeared she was crying, I saw no real tears. After I called her out on it the fact that I saw no tears, her attitude changed in seconds. It was bizarre.

I'm coming around today. 

I did snoop on the guy a little bit last night and found that he had a pretty good position in the company, so that must have been the draw. I estimate he makes maybe double my salary. Not sure. I found a couple photos of him last night and I'm shocked that she would actually go for someone so unattractive. I'm so pissed, I want to post a picture of this guy. 

For someone so judgemental about looks - I'm not understanding this choice. She would even tell me there were "no attractive guys at work"...

...and the whole Facebook thing...I can't believe he's already met her family. The ink doesn't even dry on our papers!

I'm taking this Friday off - going home for awhile. This is nuts.


----------



## bandit.45

Disengage Troy. Disengage. Quit looking at Fvckbook, quit wondering where you went wrong, quit wondering why she did this. 

She's a cheat and a liar. That's all you need to know about her. Move on.


----------



## Malaise

Money makes everyone better looking.


----------



## TroyN

Malaise said:


> Money makes everyone better looking.


Man, I guess so.


----------



## 3putt

Malaise said:


> Money makes everyone better looking.


But only for a while.


----------



## changedbeliefs

You have to take a minute and SERIOUSLY think to yourself, "what was I getting out of her?" Seriously......what?!?! Here's what I think the issue is, and frankly, I think it's an inherent problem with a LOT of relationships, and especially marriages: somehow, you were getting "validation of yourself" from her, or from being married, or being attached, whatever. And that's wrong. And it's dangerous.

The bottom line is, you are letting this wreck your self-esteem. D NOT mistake that for, something is now missing from your life BECAUSE she is gone. Your wife is 99% likely BPD, which is serious, and 100% treated you like dog s**t. It happens, bro, trust me, I know: my sister is also highly likely to be BPD, and has a WAKE of ex-boyfriends (and, finally, after a desperate attempt to find happiness, an ex-husband and four ex-stepkids!) behind her. But even if it wasn't BPD...hey, it didn't work. Relationships, and moreso marriages, are freakin' hard, if not impossible at times. You are FREE AND CLEAR, with all of your income still belonging to you, and no little people to take care of. Embrace the possibilities, my man, you have a long life ahead of you!


----------



## just got it 55

3putt said:


> But only for a while.


I could be a millionaire if I had the money

And would be a handsome guy if it wasn't for my face



55


----------



## thummper

TroyN said:


> You know what's funny? I remember her yelling at me and "crying" one day. She was behaving in such a crazy way that I wasn't even phased by it and not even engaging her in the fight. I looked at her face, and though it appeared she was crying, I saw no real tears. After I called her out on it the fact that I saw no tears, her attitude changed in seconds. It was bizarre.
> 
> I'm coming around today.
> 
> I did snoop on the guy a little bit last night and found that he had a pretty good position in the company, so that must have been the draw. I estimate he makes maybe double my salary. Not sure. I found a couple photos of him last night and I'm shocked that she would actually go for someone so unattractive. I'm so pissed, I want to post a picture of this guy.
> 
> *For someone so judgemental about looks - I'm not understanding this choice. * She would even tell me there were "no attractive guys at work"...
> 
> ...and the whole Facebook thing...I can't believe he's already met her family. The ink doesn't even dry on our papers!
> 
> I'm taking this Friday off - going home for awhile. This is nuts.


Money, my friend. Money can turn the homeliest, most disgusting guy into Brad Pitt or George Clooney.  Everybody looks the same with the lights out anyway. My best to you. Move on, find somebody great, and never look back. She'll keep scheming and cheating starting over until she's lost her looks and her figure and couldn't attract a bowery bum. Rest assured in the knowledge that it'll all catch up with her one day.


----------



## TroyN

Just threw out a bunch of our wedding photos tonight. And...started crying again. I thought about her all day today and I'm getting these terrible mind movies about the two of them together. I was doing OK until I found everything out, I really was. I would have been fine if a year from now I found out she was with someone but the wounds are still way too fresh.

I've never felt so betrayed. I just don't understand it. I wonder how her co-workers view her. It's embarrassing. 

I'm trying to do all the right things in order to move on.


----------



## bandit.45

Throwing out the pics is a good start. But you need to see a grief counselor ASAP. M
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## tom67

TroyN said:


> Just threw out a bunch of our wedding photos tonight. And...started crying again. I thought about her all day today and I'm getting these terrible mind movies about the two of them together. I was doing OK until I found everything out, I really was. I would have been fine if a year from now I found out she was with someone but the wounds are still way too fresh.
> 
> I've never felt so betrayed. I just don't understand it. I wonder how her co-workers view her. It's embarrassing.
> 
> I'm trying to do all the right things in order to move on.


Troy PM 3putt he's on the east coast so he may reply on Wed.
Dude it hurts but when he tells you his story...I think it would help others if he put it here again but I don't want to trigger him.
His is much worse than yours.
Like some say in AA you are not alone and you are not special.
PM 3putt!!!
Tell him I sent you I'll take the blame.


----------



## davecarter

Malaise said:


> Money makes every man better looking...


...to a woman's eyes.


----------



## changedbeliefs

Troy - you have to listen closely. *You are turning the way she treated you, the way she acted in your marriage and now the subsequent positives you THINK she's experiencing without you, without the marriage, into: "I was not good enough, this other guy IS," and you are romanticizing her as someone desirable and worth being with.*

I am not going to take personal digs at your wife, because BPD is some crazy ****, but suffice it to say: she is not mentally healthy, she is not equipped to be in a relationship with someone, let alone a long-term one. Even IF this other relationship lasts, it's going to be because he's bringing some other dysfunction to the table and the two of them are going to make symbiotic crazy work.

The point is: do not make this about YOU. Honestly, don't even make it about her. The two of you - regardless of reason - simply do not, will not, work. There's twenty million other people in the world you couldn't manage to have a marriage with, now there's twenty million and one. Good news! There's like, ya know, BILLIONS of people in the world, so your options are still plenty!


----------



## bandit.45

changedbeliefs said:


> Troy - you have to listen closely. *You are turning the way she treated you, the way she acted in your marriage and now the subsequent positives you THINK she's experiencing without you, without the marriage, into: "I was not good enough, this other guy IS," and you are romanticizing her as someone desirable and worth being with.*
> 
> I am not going to take personal digs at your wife, because BPD is some crazy ****, but suffice it to say: she is not mentally healthy, she is not equipped to be in a relationship with someone, let alone a long-term one. Even IF this other relationship lasts, it's going to be because he's bringing some other dysfunction to the table and the two of them are going to make symbiotic crazy work.
> 
> The point is: do not make this about YOU. Honestly, don't even make it about her. The two of you - regardless of reason - simply do not, will not, work. There's twenty million other people in the world you couldn't manage to have a marriage with, now there's twenty million and one. Good news! There's like, ya know, BILLIONS of people in the world, so your options are still plenty!



:iagree: wholeheartedly


Troy take this post, print it out and stick it in your bathroom mirror. Read it every morning and every night.


----------



## TroyN

changedbeliefs said:


> _You are turning the way she treated you, the way she acted in your marriage and now the subsequent positives you THINK she's experiencing without you, without the marriage, into: "I was not good enough, this other guy IS," and you are romanticizing her as someone desirable and worth being with._[/B]


There is a lot of truth to this and it's ruining me. She always complained about how we didn't have this or that. People made more money, they had babies, they had fancy cars - all of this crap. 

I'm working my butt off and doing great at my job, even though I'm underpaid, my work is winning these awards and I'm respected in my position. I'm 6-2, 165 lbs, 7% bodyfat, full head of hair, and I'm always getting looks from girls when we'd go grocery shopping, go to the movies, etc. One of her co-workers even hit on me at a party. I'm sorry for coming off arrogant. I worked hard for myself, AND for her. I treated her really well. I wanted to be someone she was proud of. 

But every flaw is brought up. We were living this 80/20 rule. 

Then, this GUY shows up and she uproots everything. I want to post a picture of this prick who most likely had a big role in ruining my marriage. I want to email her to let her know that I KNOW EVERYTHING. I feel like she is getting away with murder here, like she was rewarded for divorcing me. 

I go from rage, to sadness, to depression...


----------



## turnera

Have you posted him on Cheaterville?


----------



## Tobyboy

TroyN said:


> Then, this GUY shows up and she uproots everything. I want to post a picture of this prick who most likely had a big role in ruining my marriage.


No. What you do is find this guy, walk up to him, shake his hand and tell him "Thank you" and "Good luck".


----------



## OpenEnded

Troy,

if your ex wife was indeed BPD then you have serious problem. 
Try to not feel guilty. You can and will heal yourself.

I'd suggest for you to read the posts of the user Uptown
.

Also check the Shrink4men website.
There is a special section for those with BPD wifes.

Have great day!


----------



## happy as a clam

Tobyboy said:


> No. What you do is find this guy, walk up to him, shake his hand and tell him "Thank you" and "Good luck".


Troy, you CANNOT reason with unreasonable people. Your ex-wife is *cRaZy!!* 

Why can't you grasp that and let her go?

It doesn't matter how good you look, how hard you worked for the marriage, how much you love her -- she is a bucket of nuts and it's time to move on.


----------



## TroyN

So I got a text from her yesterday...we have to meet to take care of some stuff from the sale of our house/financial crap. I haven't responded yet. I'm dreading this - but I want to rip her to shreds and tell her what a POS she is. 

I thinking I might be able to get away with not seeing her and trying to handle the financial stuff over the phone.

Doing a little bit better this week. I've booked a vacation to Nova Scotia the first week of October. I just told my boss I have to get out for awhile for personal reasons, as he's aware of my divorce. The price was not cheap, but I don't care.

I was in tough shape last week. I just don't understand it sometimes. I hate her so much, then love her so much.


----------



## turnera

Part of that 'love' you feel is your inner lizard reacting to having choice ripped from you.


----------



## TroyN

turnera said:


> Part of that 'love' you feel is your inner lizard reacting to having choice ripped from you.


I'm sorry, can you explain this?


----------



## turnera

We get married, we move along in blissful ignorance, taking our spouses for granted more and more the longer we're married. We blissfully believe this is it, this is 'our' marriage. Until the whole thing is upset by our spouse cheating or leaving - without our permission. Wait a minute, you can't do that! This is MY life you're messing with! I'm gonna get you back (even if I really didn't even care that much in the first place). I've seen many men cheated on who were even planning on leaving, but when the wife cheated, it was suddenly oh no, I lurve her! I can't lose her! But it often has less to do with real love as much as losing control over your situation. It's hard to separate all the thoughts and feelings in your brain, hard to tell if what you're feeling really IS love, or just panic, or hating to lose control over your own destiny, or even simply not wanting to lose. Fight or flight and all that. Which is why we usually advise not to make decisions swiftly. Give your brain time to breathe, time to think, so you can separate rash feelings from real feelings. So you'll know what you really want to do.


----------



## TroyN

turnera said:


> We get married, we move along in blissful ignorance, taking our spouses for granted more and more the longer we're married. We blissfully believe this is it, this is 'our' marriage. Until the whole thing is upset by our spouse cheating or leaving - without our permission. Wait a minute, you can't do that! This is MY life you're messing with! I'm gonna get you back (even if I really didn't even care that much in the first place). I've seen many men cheated on who were even planning on leaving, but when the wife cheated, it was suddenly oh no, I lurve her! I can't lose her! But it often has less to do with real love as much as losing control over your situation. It's hard to separate all the thoughts and feelings in your brain, hard to tell if what you're feeling really IS love, or just panic, or hating to lose control over your own destiny, or even simply not wanting to lose. Fight or flight and all that. Which is why we usually advise not to make decisions swiftly. Give your brain time to breathe, time to think, so you can separate rash feelings from real feelings. So you'll know what you really want to do.


Very well said, thank you.


----------



## Decorum

turnera said:


> Part of that 'love' you feel is your inner lizard reacting to having choice ripped from you.


Your inner lizard, ha ha ha so true! :rofl:


----------



## turnera

Decorum said:


> Your inner lizard, ha ha ha so true! :rofl:


For clarification:
Safety and The Lizard: The Essay | Al Turtle's Relationship Wisdom


----------



## SamuraiJack

turnera said:


> For clarification:
> Safety and The Lizard: The Essay | Al Turtle's Relationship Wisdom


Good article.
Explains many key beliefs I hold.
Worth a read.


----------



## farsidejunky

*Re: Re: I think my wife MIGHT be having affair…*



turnera said:


> For clarification:
> Safety and The Lizard: The Essay | Al Turtle's Relationship Wisdom


Great link, T. Thanks.


----------



## turnera

Y'all are welcome. I urge everyone to read all his stuff. He is really amazing. He posts on MA sometimes, too, to help people directly. Great guy.


----------



## TroyN

I'm back from my trip and beginning to feel better each passing day.

I got a little more intel on what has happened from various sources, mainly how thoroughly emeshed they are already. I guess one of our old mutual friends saw them together somewhere and she had no idea they were together. She knows both my ex-wife and her boyfriend as she works with both of them. It's sort of confusing story, but essentially my ex-wife wouldn't even say hello to my friend. 

Tried not to think about what has happened and I'm working on trying to get a new job and move out of the town I live in. I don't want to be around her and her new boyfriend or bump into them. I'm wanting to wipe the slate clean and start over with my life.

The hurt is still pretty bad, though. I just don't understand how someone can move on that fast.

Unfortunately, I need to see her in two weeks. We have some real estate paper work that needs to be taken care of.


----------



## happyman64

TroyN

Glad you are back from your trip and that each day you are getting over your Ex.

And everytime you feel hurt or sad that you go back to your very first post and reread it.

It will serve as a reminder why you are better off without "her" in your life.

In fact print out that very first post, tape to your mirror or refrigerator door until you only think about your brighter, happier future.

HM


----------



## Malaise

TroyN said:


> I'm back from my trip and beginning to feel better each passing day.
> 
> I got a little more intel on what has happened from various sources, mainly how thoroughly emeshed they are already. I guess one of our old mutual friends saw them together somewhere and she had no idea they were together. She knows both my ex-wife and her boyfriend as she works with both of them. It's sort of confusing story, but essentially my ex-wife wouldn't even say hello to my friend.
> 
> Tried not to think about what has happened and I'm working on trying to get a new job and move out of the town I live in. I don't want to be around her and her new boyfriend or bump into them. I'm wanting to wipe the slate clean and start over with my life.
> 
> *The hurt is still pretty bad, though. I just don't understand how someone can move on that fast.*
> Unfortunately, I need to see her in two weeks. We have some real estate paper work that needs to be taken care of.


Because, she wasn't that attached in the first place.


----------



## TroyN

Malaise said:


> Because, she wasn't that attached in the first place.


And she's really that in love with her new guy? I don't know how she can be possibly different to him than she was to me.


----------



## Chaparral

Too bad you can't warn him.


----------



## LongWalk

Troy,

Her boyfriend may well show up on TAM or some other forum and describe how he watched a colleague of his balloon up in weight and then become attractive again after she separated from her loser husband. Once he realized she was interested they became inseparable, having exhausting sex. But then after getting married, she started trying to change him, undermining his sense of self.

Of course, she won the power struggle. And the sex ended after the honeymoon. Her explanation is that the H1 (you) traumatized her and he is not empathetic enough about the suffering she experienced in her first marriage.

He feels that he is guilty for what you did but he is not you and wonders if he is losing his sanity.

Stay in your town and within 5 years, you'll run into him and you'll see a tortured look in his eyes.

Too bad Mavash isn't here, she'd have explained everything with stunning accuracy. Don't run away unless you really need to leave the area for objective reasons.

She'll probably save momentos of her first marriage that will drive him wild. The wedding pictures, the ring, whatever.

Man count your blessings that you did not have child with her. Your selfish gene instinct is top notch.


----------



## Malaise

TroyN said:


> *And she's really that in love with her new guy? *I don't know how she can be possibly different to him than she was to me.


I'd be surprised if she wasn't. After all, she's trying her best to hook him. You know what happens after that.


----------



## Decorum

Malaise said:


> I'd be surprised if she wasn't. After all, she's trying her best to hook him. You know what happens after that.


You can gut and scale or I prefer filleting the thing and frying it with a nice corn meal breading. "She's a man eater"
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## ArmyofJuan

TroyN said:


> Tried not to think about what has happened and I'm working on trying to get a new job and move out of the town I live in. I don't want to be around her and her new boyfriend or bump into them. I'm wanting to wipe the slate clean and start over with my life.


The irony is they may be broken up by the time you move, these relationships tend to have a short life out in the open. Once the honeymoon stage is over its going to be who dumps who first.



> The hurt is still pretty bad, though. I just don't understand how someone can move on that fast.


It wasn't fast for her, she probably detached months before you had a clue and hid it from you. 

When you do see her, make it out like your life is much better that she is gone. The WS's ego can't stand it if the BS prospers without them. You being better off would be a slap to her face.

See, they think they can do better but you can't, that they were doing you a favor by staying with you. You prove them wrong and it messes with their head and makes them second guess themselves.


----------



## donny64

TroyN said:


> I'm back from my trip and beginning to feel better each passing day.
> 
> I got a little more intel on what has happened from various sources, mainly how thoroughly emeshed they are already. I guess one of our old mutual friends saw them together somewhere and she had no idea they were together. She knows both my ex-wife and her boyfriend as she works with both of them. It's sort of confusing story, but essentially my ex-wife wouldn't even say hello to my friend.
> 
> Tried not to think about what has happened and I'm working on trying to get a new job and move out of the town I live in. I don't want to be around her and her new boyfriend or bump into them. I'm wanting to wipe the slate clean and start over with my life.
> 
> The hurt is still pretty bad, though. I just don't understand how someone can move on that fast.
> 
> Unfortunately, I need to see her in two weeks. We have some real estate paper work that needs to be taken care of.


I just spent my lunch hour reading through the entire thread. I've got this to say:


The two BEST choices you've made were divorcing her, and sticking to your guns and wearing condoms with her. 

You're going to have to understand that the woman you fell in love with was a "front". A show. An illusion she created. It wasn't real. She was NEVER happy, and likely never in love....she was HIDING her unhappiness with herself, you, and life...only so long as it took to get her hooks in you. Once that was accomplished, she let the curtain down.

Now she's raising the curtain again, polishing herself up for the show she's about to put on for some unsuspecting sap again. Her weight loss and polishing up has ZERO to do with her now being happy, or having a love interest. It has everything to do with creating an illusion, a trap, for her next victim. She knows exactly what she's doing, and it's with a goal in mind....not happiness. 

Don't fret not one second about this "new guy", or how she could move on so easily and quickly. Doesn't matter. With this type of personality, ANY MAN will do. And when her real side starts to show and he dumps her, the process will repeat. And repeat. And repeat.

Good job getting out (especially without kids). Now move forward and ENJOY your life, and learn to ENJOY women and their company again. This time as a much smarter and more educated man!


----------



## TroyN

donny64 said:


> I just spent my lunch hour reading through the entire thread. I've got this to say:
> 
> 
> The two BEST choices you've made were divorcing her, and sticking to your guns and wearing condoms with her.
> 
> You're going to have to understand that the woman you fell in love with was a "front". A show. An illusion she created. It wasn't real. She was NEVER happy, and likely never in love....she was HIDING her unhappiness with herself, you, and life...only so long as it took to get her hooks in you. Once that was accomplished, she let the curtain down.
> 
> Now she's raising the curtain again, polishing herself up for the show she's about to put on for some unsuspecting sap again. Her weight loss and polishing up has ZERO to do with her now being happy, or having a love interest. It has everything to do with creating an illusion, a trap, for her next victim. She knows exactly what she's doing, and it's with a goal in mind....not happiness.
> 
> Don't fret not one second about this "new guy", or how she could move on so easily and quickly. Doesn't matter. With this type of personality, ANY MAN will do. And when her real side starts to show and he dumps her, the process will repeat. And repeat. And repeat.
> 
> Good job getting out (especially without kids). Now move forward and ENJOY your life, and learn to ENJOY women and their company again. This time as a much smarter and more educated man!


This is so true. I'm trying to figure out what she sees in this guy. I just can't understand why I was under so much scrutiny, and then she turns around starts dating this guy. I guess there is a reason why she won't post Facebook photos of them together (I can't see her wall, but my friends tell me everything). 

But it was pretty much a big farce, right from the start. You don't shut down a marriage three months in and behave this way. 

I have to let go, and chalk it up to her craziness.


----------



## LongWalk

So you now conclude she was cheating before separation but kept it concealed from you?


----------



## TroyN

LongWalk said:


> So you now conclude she was cheating before separation but kept it concealed from you?


I truly don't know. My belief is that as soon as I pulled the plug, she began looking for a new husband right away. Or she always had a thing for him and couldn't do much about it because she was married. 

Many pages back, after I called it off, she ran away for a week and went to her parent's house. She was crying from their house and was passively pleading. She kept asking "are you sure?" and told me "my life is over" 

But that was the extent of her trying to get me back. *She never* came to me directly and said "I love you and I want us to be together." 

We lived together for a couple months after this and she would just stew in our bedroom and watch TV in the living and not do anything. She didn't even care.

I did some research on the guy and he has been with that company for almost 10 years. So they've been around each other on a pretty consistent basis for a long time. He makes pretty decent money, so I believe that was the appeal, because he is pretty ugly.

Based on her timing and weight loss, he for sure was in the picture before it was finalized. I had moved out and pretty much he was right in. She prettied herself up to get this guy.


----------



## bandit.45

It's over.

Let her go. Move on. 

You will never get the answers you seek. Just know that the answers lie in her issues and not anything you did or didn't do.


----------



## BobSimmons

TroyN said:


> This is so true. * I'm trying to figure out what she sees in this guy. * I just can't understand why I was under so much scrutiny, and then she turns around starts dating this guy. I guess there is a reason why she won't post Facebook photos of them together (I can't see her wall, but my friends tell me everything).
> 
> But it was pretty much a big farce, right from the start. You don't shut down a marriage three months in and behave this way.
> 
> I have to let go, and chalk it up to her craziness.


Yeah, stop trying to figure it out. It's a nice guy syndrome to compare, dude maybe a total douche but he's not you. You could be the nicest, most sincere, caring guy in the world and she went for Mr Douche, no figuring it out.


----------



## happyman64

What good reasons could possibly come out of her crazy head. 

None. 

Move on. Troy.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Marduk

bandit.45 said:


> It's over.
> 
> Let her go. Move on.
> 
> You will never get the answers you seek. Just know that the answers lie in her issues and not anything you did or didn't do.


From a guy that's been there...

One day you will wake up and just not care what the reason was that made her do the things she did.

And one day, perhaps long after that day, it will come to you why.

In my first marriage, my wife acted very similarly. I was devastated. It took six months of questioning that was literally driving me insane. Six months of hell. Six months of being stuck.

And then one day, I just didn't care.

For me, that day coincided with me starting to date someone I was really into. You might be different, I dunno.

And now as I look back I know exactly why she cheated. I know the things I did that enabled it, I know the mistakes I made. And I know that she's a deeply flawed and "surface" person who just doesn't form deep relationships with others.

Some people are just like this. They're like a bucket with a hole in the bottom. You can keep shoving stuff in the top, but it just keeps draining away. So they're always empty inside. And I know she's still there, still single, still wondering why she's empty.

Objectivity man. You're not there yet.

But you will be.


----------



## donny64

Was thinking about this the other day, and my own experience with a perpetually unhappy woman. Tried to save that relationship. Tried harder than I should have. What a nightmare my life was. Not as bad as OP's, but pretty close. Only reason I stayed as long as I did was our child. I was stuck to some degree. Would have bailed much earlier had it not been for that. 

Anyway, bad enough it turned me off of dating for a lot of years, and I remained single with no interest in a relationship with a woman. For a long time.

Were I to have "saved" that relationship, I'd have never met my present W. Sitting there the other night looking at her, and thinking just how damned lucky I am, and how PEACEFUL and ENJOYABLE my life is now, and how comfortable and good we are together. No drama. No arguments. Virtually never a disagreement, and when there is it is discussed. No need to "win" an argument. No name calling, ever, not once. No resentment. She loves sex with me. No craziness. Just a couple people enjoying being together. Just day in and day out contentment and happiness. So completely polar opposite of my first W. Our "bad days" are such an anomaly with us, it's hard to remember the last time we got truly bent out of shape at each other. 

Someday, you will get to this same place, and look back on your present situation and wonder what the hell was wrong with you that you tried to save this. Trust me. *Next time, just be sure to date long enough that you have an opportunity to see the bad / hidden traits before you marry. Anyone can "stand on their head" and put on a good front for a year or two.* Give it a few years at least, and you'll have a much better idea what you'll be dealing with in marriage.


----------



## happy as a clam

Troy...

It's time to MOVE ON!!!!

No kids, no long marriage, she is damaged, LET IT GO!!!!

In time you will find someone who exceeds your wildest expectations... 

Keep reading books and continue (or start) therapy for yourself. NEVER sell yourself short again.

You have a lot to offer a partner. Sadly, your wife is warped and could not recognize this...


----------



## TroyN

Well, I need to see her next week. She emailed me today to confirm our meet up at the bank to split a check that needs my signature. So, this is probably the last time I'll ever see her in person. I want to rip her apart but that's allowing her to win. 

Applied for a few new jobs this week which are in a town about 3 hours away and one of them has actually called me already. So, I'll be literally "moving on" if this works out. 

Also, my co-worker friend is trying to set me up with his girlfriend's friend. She is decent looking - not my type - but I'm thinking about giving it a shot. She saw my FB profile and some of my pics from Nova Scotia and thought I was "really hot" so that's nice to hear. 

However, I still feel pretty broken and empty. I think I need some counseling to be honest as to why I still care about this person. I hate this feeling. 

Thanks for support, TAM people.


----------



## bandit.45

You do need counseling brother. Badly.


----------



## Cinema79

Just read this whole thread. Holy sh**.

Counseling will help to an extent but the OP needs to make some changes on his own. 

First off, what were you thinking dating a girl for only a year and then proposing to her? This is on you man. You thought you might have known her, but you can hide the crazy in that short amount of time. You date someone for at least 2-3 years before making this type of commitment. If they balk at this then they are clearly only in the relationship for self-serving reasons and don't care about you. In fact, they should respect your decisions.

Secondly, if my wife were shut off intimacy that quickly after marriage I would have gotten an annulment. You should have bolted after four months dude! 

Lastly - your ex-wife is complete cluster-B whack job. She never loved you. This is why she is able to bang her co-worker that quickly after you to were over. 

You were nothing but an acquisition to her. Your "ugly" replacement is in for a similar ride because she does not love him either. This is how cluster-B's work. People are just objects to her, and *all of their relationships are failures. *

She was near thirty, her clock was ticking, and she put on a full court press to drag you to the altar and she'll do the same to this guy.

I'm not sure why you are envious of this guy because he's going to end up in the same place you are in about 5 years. Only I'm willing to bet he won't be as lucky because he'll probably be stuck with her after being foolish enough to get her pregnant. But I guess he deserves it, afterall, because this is what you get when sleeping with a separated woman. His fat bank account won't be so fat anymore after alimony, support, etc.

*Move on, dude!!!!* Do better the next time around. When she gets word via social media or some other source that you are banging someone hotter it will ruin her. Cluster B's have huge egos, and can't stand it when you make an upgrade!

God bless!


----------



## Cinema79

Oh and I gotta add that when you see her in a week, do not try to interact with her in any way. Act upbeat and confident. Ignore her and when she asks you any questions by dismissive and short with her. Try to get out of that meeting as fast as possible. 

If you waver or get soft and try to have some sort of meaningful conversation with her, she will be a huge b*tch to you and try to hurt you. This is what BPD women do. They find weak points and try to exploit them. I could go into long details about why they do this but the jist of it is that they hate themselves and want you to suffer like they do on the weekly basis.


----------



## happy as a clam

Cinema79 said:


> Lastly - your ex-wife is complete cluster-B whack job. She never loved you. This is why she is able to bang her co-worker that quickly after you to were over.
> 
> You were nothing but an acquisition to her. Your "ugly" replacement is in for a similar ride because she does not love him either. This is how cluster-B's work. People are just objects to her, and *all of their relationships are failures. *


:iagree::iagree:


----------



## TroyN

So I did something last night which I shouldn't have done, but a lot of people do. I went and dug through the guy's Facebook page and clicked on a few profiles of my ex-wife's and his mutual friends and family. I was in a lousy mood - angry about life, etc. 

It sickens me how thoroughly integrated they already are. Even some of photos are comments from her co-workers like "you guys look so happy!!" I feel like the biggest fool, it's like that entire company was in on relationship and I didn't even have a clue. It makes me wonder what kind of smear campaign she was on. Like I was somehow responsible for all of her depression and self-loathing.

But what really got to me the most was a particular photo of the guy. He bares strong resemblance to an ex-boyfriend of hers from college that she desperately wanted a relationship with but he wouldn't give in to her. Her ex boyfriend and this new guy are both overweight, short, stocky, with military style haircuts and light brown/blonde hair. Neither were good looking. 

I'm the exact opposite of both of these guys! lean, 6-2, dark brown hair, narrower face, medium length hair. 

It solidifies that I never really was her type, that this is what she wanted. I wonder why she even came after me in the first place. FML!


----------



## farsidejunky

Just frigging stop. The more you post the more it becomes clear that she was not the only unhealthy one in this relationship. 

How can a wound heal properly if you keep picking at it?


----------



## happyman64

Troy

There comes a time when you say to yourself "It is time to move on".

And then you make a conscious effort to do so.

SO start today. Throw the damn computer right out the window. Or restrict facebook.

Then get out and meet new people. Or go to group therapy.

The key to moving on is putting yourself out there. New people, new hobbies and new goals.

Stop getting angry over a person that was clearly not good for you and unhappy with herself.

You deserve better so go find it Troy.

No time like now my friend.

HM


----------



## TroyN

farsidejunky said:


> Just frigging stop. The more you post the more it becomes clear that she was not the only unhealthy one in this relationship.
> 
> How can a wound heal properly if you keep picking at it?


I know, I'm becoming her. I hate this. I was in a good place after we split. Really, I was. I felt relief. I was actually a pretty mentally healthy guy during our marriage but she was beating me down so much but I would bounce back. I never had depression, I never took meds, I never hated myself. It's like I absorbed this woman's pain.


----------



## bandit.45

What do you mean you are becoming her?:scratchhead:

She's moved on. You haven't!!!


----------



## Cinema79

bandit.45 said:


> What do you mean you are becoming her?:scratchhead:
> 
> She's moved on. You haven't!!!


I think what he means is that he is adopting some of her "obsessive traits". When BPD women get into a relationship, they build their partner up to be such an awesome person and brag to everyone about how awesome they are. They compliment, love, and care intensely about the partner but it's all really a mirage and not real. It's just used to control that person and get them to do things for him.

So the OP is used to placating and walking on eggshells and doing everything that she wanted and he's totally involved in "fixing" her and being a white knight. Then, they tear that person down. 

The OP is still in love with her. I can totally related but Dude, give yourself a break, you've only been divorced for maybe a few months and these things take awhile to get over. 

Like I said earlier, she will do all the same stuff to this guy that she did to you. Not even a marriage could keep her on her best behavior. Don't worry the other guy, he's just the new you and all the stuff she said to you, she'll say about this guy...then tear him down.

We've been through the same stuff here and you'll get a lot of solid advice. PM me if you need to talk.


----------



## SamuraiJack

TroyN said:


> So I did something last night which I shouldn't have done, but a lot of people do. I went and dug through the guy's Facebook page and clicked on a few profiles of my ex-wife's and his mutual friends and family. I was in a lousy mood - angry about life, etc.
> 
> It sickens me how thoroughly integrated they already are. Even some of photos are comments from her co-workers like "you guys look so happy!!" I feel like the biggest fool, it's like that entire company was in on relationship and I didn't even have a clue. It makes me wonder what kind of smear campaign she was on. Like I was somehow responsible for all of her depression and self-loathing.
> 
> But what really got to me the most was a particular photo of the guy. He bares strong resemblance to an ex-boyfriend of hers from college that she desperately wanted a relationship with but he wouldn't give in to her. Her ex boyfriend and this new guy are both overweight, short, stocky, with military style haircuts and light brown/blonde hair. Neither were good looking.
> 
> I'm the exact opposite of both of these guys! lean, 6-2, dark brown hair, narrower face, medium length hair.
> 
> It solidifies that I never really was her type, that this is what she wanted. I wonder why she even came after me in the first place. FML!


Okay Troy
Time to listen up. 
I’m going to tell you something that you aren’t going to like but you NEED to understand.

The people in a BPD’s life aren’t really “people” as much as they are “objects that represent something”.
You were her “I’m normal” object. The crown jewel of her collection. “Look! I have a marriage and a husband and I’m doing it all by the numbers! I’m normal!!!”

The problem comes when she realizes that she hates having to prove she is normal because of her inherent deficiency which is self-generating. BPD people are ALL about how other people view them because they have no concrete view of themselves. Their view of themselves has EVERYTHING to do with what people say about them. They are sensitive to words and that’s why they can tear you up so expertly with them.
The object space you occupied both gave her joy because it showed she was lovable…and caused her pain because she knew she needed it to be normal.
That’s why you got so much abuse….especially in private.

She lost the crown jewel and her “normal” status. 
The need for her to replace your object was made even more pathological in that not only did she need a normal symbol, but now her collection also included a divorce object…a symbol of commonality in her mind.

She HAD to replace you as fast as she could. 
It had nothing to do with “you” but rather what you represented to everybody else.
She didn’t need another Hamilton G1186-HyperX Deluxe Mixer….all she needed was a mixer.

Don’t worry though. Every new mixer she gets will have to work 20% harder to compete with all the previous entrants…and she WILL let them know about them. 
Feel sorry for the men she will chew through in the next few years. Each new relationship she gets into will be progressively more painful and destructive to both him and her.
It will continue until she either implodes or wakes up.

She SEDUCED you…big time. 
She sold you the idealized package of what you thought you wanted in the beginning.
That’s why you are having a tough time shaking this.
That’s VERY normal for BPD survivors.

I wish I could convey to you the amount of pain and misery you have just sidestepped.
In simple terms you had a few burgers worth of BPD meat.
Some men are fed the whole cow.

Now, go do some physical stuff, improve yourself and try to get it through your head that you were deliberately played into the position of “wonderful husband/Normal object” by a virtual expert on manipulation.
You may be mad, sad, relived or even grief stricken.
It’s ALL normal.


----------



## BobSimmons

TroyN said:


> I know, I'm becoming her. I hate this. I was in a good place after we split. Really, I was. I felt relief. I was actually a pretty mentally healthy guy during our marriage but she was beating me down so much but I would bounce back. I never had depression, I never took meds, I never hated myself. It's like I absorbed this woman's pain.


Isn't it insane how we let one person dictate our lives and almost destroy us? No doubt you've given advice to others on moving on after a bad relationship, if you read everything you wrote about your ex and imagined it was someone else, what would you tell them?

You're going to let this one chick screw you up so bad while she laughs and moves on with her life?

Yes getting played hurts, yes getting rejected hurts. You're looking at her pictures while she's in the bloom of a new relationship and it hurts bruh, but things will settle down and their lives will be normal and her issues will still be there. Her type or not, she has issues and hasn't dealt with them, so don't worry about her..

Anyone can front and smile for a camera shot, write lovey dovey stuff on walls, stop torturing yourself and stop stalking them man!

Go and live your life. Haven't you had enough? You're not even with her and she's controlling your life.


----------



## Cinema79

Listen to Samurai!!!!! He speaks some truth. 

My prediction? 

She will marry this guy........and make his life a living hell.

You will get through this. It might be 2 more months or maybe two years. But when you do get through this you will be so incredibly happy and thankful you got out. Read the first post man...she was a B!TCH. Whether she was mental or not - the point is that she was BAD.


----------



## LongWalk

One great thing about a forum that serves as a diary, you can go back and re-read. Often there is amazing stuff recorded. For example, your first post:


TroyN said:


> I think my wife MIGHT be having affair…she’s asleep right now and I’m looking for some thoughts...
> 
> *Now it looks like your gut feeling was right on the mark. It would be sad, but read on and reconsider:*
> 
> So here’s my story and few things that have happened to me in my brief marriage.
> 
> Met my wife three years ago, instant mutual attraction, off the charts sex, and we were engaged 10 months later. She is 27, I’m 30. Wonderful wedding day, good honeymoon - but *immediately afterwards things went sour *and I’m not sure why. *Now you know she BPD or something is wrong.S She was not healthy then.*We are approaching the third year of marriage.
> 
> *How did you stick it out so long?*
> 
> Some notes:
> 
> 1. I worked a lot of long hours in our first year of marriage. Like 10-12 hour days. She did not like this, but I was a manager and we working against some tight deadlines.
> 
> 2. After the honeymoon was over, it took us three months to have sex again. Then another two months afterwards to have sex again.
> 
> *Should have divorced then.*
> 
> 3. After our first year of marriage, she gained a ton of weight, at least 35 lbs. She has been seeing a counselor, and has been on Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. She was on another drug that I forget the name of. She has went through bouts of depression her entire life.
> 
> *Hid that from you, until you were married and then she dumped on you.*
> 
> 4. I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer.
> 
> *OM is watching TV with her now. How's that going for him?*
> 
> 5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.
> 
> *You made a living. If OM has more, she'll still wish he made more.*
> 
> 6. We went on a trip for our second anniversary and she refused to sleep with me, and she gave me a dirty look when I tried to initiate sex. I would say that we maybe have had sex 10-15 times in our entire marriage (2 years, 9 months total)
> 
> *What a fvcking nightmare. Thank God, it's over. I am an atheist but here there is no substitute for divine intervention.*
> 
> 7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.
> 
> *She last comment again. Substitute God with Buddha, Jesus or some other power.*
> 
> 8. This past December, we went to her company's Holiday party together and her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.
> 
> *They felt sorry for you because they knew about her double nature.*
> 
> 9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women.
> 
> *So-called toxic friends. Good riddance.*
> 
> 10. We are in marriage counseling. Our marriage counselor once asked her if she thought would be OK if I had my needs met by another woman. She really didn’t have a response.
> 
> *Zero empathy.*
> 
> 11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.
> 
> *FOO issues. Mom is the only one trusts.*
> 
> Obviously, my marriage is in shambles, I have been thinking about divorce since Christmas. But I love this woman so much…I just feel like something is up.
> 
> *You are free, dude! Now you can begin living. You only had sex 15 times in three years. What a rip off. She humped like she was in the heat and then cut your off. Disturbed woman. Don't hate her. Laugh. You made a mistake. You won't do it again.
> 
> You can meet someone who is loving. Be careful dating.*
> 
> Thoughts?


----------



## happy as a clam

Troy,

Why are you doing this to yourself? It's very sad that she has had such an effect on you that you cannot and will not move on.

Accidentally bumping into her in public would be one thing; deliberately going on to her and the OM's Facebook pages is just torturing yourself needlessly .

It has become obvious to me that SHE is not the only one in this relationship with significant emotional problems. You are codependent and would benefit from intense therapy to break this unhealthy connection.

You keep saying you are going to stop all this ruminating, rehashing, reminiscing; and then you don't :scratchhead:. 

I've been following your thread since the very beginning, but I am checking out now. It is truly too painful to keep reading.

I wish you the very best.


----------



## Forest

Given the circumstances, I'd say there's nothing like some female company to perk you up. You're at the age now where some of the best looking single women are after a guy like you. Stable, still have hair, not fat.

If you're feeling screwed over, imagine each of your lives in 10 years. From what I read of her, she'll be a hateful, slovenly mess, and look terrible. You will hold up fine. 

There's some balm for the ego.


----------



## Cinema79

Troy - get off this board for awhile and get out there. Meet some new women. No kids? Decent job? Good looks? Dude, you should be slaying. 

You said your co-worker tried to hook you up with a girl who thought you were good looking? Shoot, your psycho wife didn't think twice about getting on some dude before the ink was dry so you should get out there and start tearing it up. Quit being a pvssy.

You should post back once you nailed a new woman. Until then, get some fresh air.


----------



## Marduk

I remember this time in my first marriage.

I would wonder what she was up to, be very angry that she moved on so easily... ask around, try to find out things, etc...

And then, one fine day, I got laid.

And I just didn't give a **** any more, because I got laid more that weekend than I did the last year of my marriage.

And then more. And more. Still more. And not only did I not care, I was freaking THANKFUL she left... I was having so much damn fun with hot women. 

I'm not saying go and sleep around... but damn. It worked for me.


----------



## nanofaan

Troy I been keeping up with your posts, how you feelings?


----------



## TroyN

nanofaan said:


> Troy I been keeping up with your posts, how you feelings?


Hey. I'm not bad. I had a decent weekend. I joined a soccer team a couple weeks back and we've been playing two games a week. I have things to look forward to now. Thanks for asking.

Quick question. Is it normal to feel this empty? What is exactly is that feeling in my chest? It feels like broken heart but it's like a very ominous dark cloud that sort of follows me around. I don't think I've ever had these feelings before. Depression maybe?

I'm not crying as badly as I was last week. I just started watching the show "The League" and it's gotten me out of the dumps. Still, I wake up every morning and think about her. I don't want to. 

I guess I'm shellshocked. I can't turn off love that quickly like she could. I'm also dealing with ego issues because this crazy witch seems to think this guy is so much better than me. 

So, I've been reading a lot of Cluster-B and Borderlines lately and I see her hitting all the checkmarks. I think she might be high-functioning borderline because she isn't into cutting, drug-abuse, or some of the other crazy behaviors. 

Sorry so long. But yes, I trying to get out as much as I can, stay off this board, trying to forget, etc.


----------



## SamuraiJack

It WILL get better....promise!


----------



## Forest

Yeah, just get out there. Don't overthink everything. I knew a funny coach that used these type lines:

Hey, let's get out there and make some mistakes!

If you're not making mistakes, you're quitting!

Less worry, more effort!

I think - you play.


----------



## TroyN

So I have to see her tonight. The plan is to ignore. 

But...I had a major revelation last night. 

*I’m done caring.* 

I’m just done with her and I realize how apathetic I’ve come in regards to everything that has happened in the past couple of days. I’m mentally exhausted and don’t need this pain in my life anymore. I don’t have the energy to maintain this thought process that just beats me up day in day out.

I need to get on with my life and walk away. I had a trigger this morning in which I remember how miserable she was and how she badly she treated me. It was something on a morning talk show, a DJ, whose nagging voice sounded like hers. I was disgusted.

I realized right then that I’m missing nothing by being with her. I know that I can do better. 

I think I might chime in later to let you know how it goes tonight. After tonight, I’m going to take a break from these boards. The more I dwell and talk about it, the more involved and invested I become. Not a good thing.


----------



## TroyN

So I saw her. 

I just got back home from the accountant's office. Long story as to why I had to do this, so i won't get into it.

She was about 5 minutes late, appeared in knee high boots, tight jeans, lots of makeup on. This seemed odd to me, since it was 5:30pm when we had to meet and her clothing was not work appropriate.

So either she was trying to impress me, or her new boyfriend. Whatever the case may be....

She was incredibly dismissive, rude, and cold. Texting the whole time. I had to ask her a question about our house due to tax purposes, namely the date we sold it and she said to me in really *****y tone "why do you need to know that?" 

When working with our accountant, she was bubbly and friendly and extremely confident. Whenever I had to interact with her she went really cold and acted holier than thou. 

I did my best to avoid her, and left the offices without saying goodbye. 

I was in such rage on the way home that I stopped at a bar, and I normally don't do this alone, and had about three draft beers to cut my edge off. So, she won, and she got to me.

The rage comes from all the reasons stated in this thread, but it also feels she is getting rewarded for treating me like garbage, for filing for divorce, and banging this guy in my house while we were separated.

I'm TRYING not to care. But I feel awful right now. I know exactly what she is doing and whose place she is going to tonight. I hate this woman.


----------



## turnera

Oh no! Not three beers! lol

Seriously, you did fine.

fwiw, she did that for YOU. She dressed to the nines because she wanted to affect you.


----------



## TroyN

turnera said:


> Oh no! Not three beers! lol
> 
> Seriously, you did fine.
> 
> fwiw, she did that for YOU. She dressed to the nines because she wanted to affect you.


lol - yeah those beers went down well. Seriously though, tonight sucked royally. I wanted to really give her a verbal beatdown but I know it wouldn't have done any good.


----------



## ThePheonix

TroyN said:


> So I saw her.
> 
> So, she won, and she got to me.



You don't understand womanese my man. Anytime a chick has to play special dressup and behave in a condescending manner, it means she doesn't have the wherewithal to deal with you on a level playing field. Do you think Zoe Cruz, Co-President of Morgan Stanley would need to present herself in such a manner? You played the hand right by not showing it was getting to you. (and it shouldn't get to you )
Next time just laugh when blurts out a pizzy remark. Remember, her breath sinks in the morning just like anybody elses.


----------



## Cinema79

She thinks she's above you because you she's with Mr. Money Bags now. Good, now he can deal with her sh_tty behavior. Her condescending tone reeks of entitlement. 

She dressed up (for a meeting with an accountant?) to make you want her again. She's not over you, and she's pissed because you called off the marriage. If she was over you, she would have treated you like a stranger and shown up in her work attire. It's looks like she made the effort to go home, change, put makeup on, etc. SHE'S NOT OVER YOU. 

Good riddance to this mental case! Now, you'll never have to see her again.


----------



## bandit.45

I'm thinking that's why she dressed up. She's not over you in that...she can't get over the fact that you filed for D before she did. You beat her to the punch and she can't stand it. 

So she dresses up then treats you mean. 

:nono: Never gonna get it, never gonna get it... Never gonna get it, never gonna get it.... Woo woo woo woo....


----------



## Q tip

When you Meet again, be extremely positive and beyond happy. You'll damage her big time. Keep looking at your watch like you gotta be somewhere else. She'll read that body language in a big way.

Have a GF/buddy call you. Or just fake a call to a lady while she's there. Two can play that game. Just sayin have some fun with this. It'll drive her batty. Be strong, confident and knowing. You are yah know!


----------



## awake1

TroyN said:


> So I saw her.
> 
> I just got back home from the accountant's office. Long story as to why I had to do this, so i won't get into it.
> 
> She was about 5 minutes late, appeared in knee high boots, tight jeans, lots of makeup on. This seemed odd to me, since it was 5:30pm when we had to meet and her clothing was not work appropriate.
> 
> So either she was trying to impress me, or her new boyfriend. Whatever the case may be....
> 
> She was incredibly dismissive, rude, and cold. Texting the whole time. I had to ask her a question about our house due to tax purposes, namely the date we sold it and she said to me in really *****y tone "why do you need to know that?"
> 
> When working with our accountant, she was bubbly and friendly and extremely confident. Whenever I had to interact with her she went really cold and acted holier than thou.
> 
> I did my best to avoid her, and left the offices without saying goodbye.
> 
> I was in such rage on the way home that I stopped at a bar, and I normally don't do this alone, and had about three draft beers to cut my edge off. So, she won, and she got to me.
> 
> The rage comes from all the reasons stated in this thread, but it also feels she is getting rewarded for treating me like garbage, for filing for divorce, and banging this guy in my house while we were separated.
> 
> I'm TRYING not to care. But I feel awful right now. I know exactly what she is doing and whose place she is going to tonight. I hate this woman.


Do you have guy friends you can hang out with? 

And hey, long as you didn't show her she was getting to you, you won. Even if you broke down after.


----------



## mr.bunbury

Just ride this out, no need to change jobs or anything. In the long run the fact that you live in close proximity to your ex isn't going to be your problem but it will make it more itchy for her and her husband.


----------



## TroyN

To answer a few questions. I have plenty of guy friends, but I've been neglecting them for the past three years. Now I know why, maybe they didn't like my wife? I take the blame here too. 

Since I'm on the other side of town, I have an opportunity to make some new friends. I'm already hanging out with my soccer team.

Come to think of it, she doesn't have any real friends that she hangs out with. Nobody calls her, or texts her. Just her mom. Heck, none of her bridesmaids even speak with her. They all sort of disappeared. I can understand, in some strange way, why she has a boyfriend now and it's a co-worker. She doesn't have the ability to go outside of her job to meet people. I was her only social outlet outside of that job.

Now I understand her need to replace me so quickly. Someone mentioned earlier in this thread something about how they need this to even function. I feel bad for her. 

So what happens next? She probably gets married to this guy, a co-worker, then stays at this job that she hates because he still works there, and lives in a town that she finds boring, and doesn't really do anything to improve herself. I should not care, but how is this a good thing? 

I don't know. That's why I want to leave. I'm given a chance to get out and move to a different place and meet someone new. I'm now longer chained to this woman and I want to experience something new.


----------



## farsidejunky

Troy:

I know you indicated you might take a hiatus from TAM. I think you need to stick around. You have a ton of healing yet to do and you are clearly going to need the occasional 2x4 to keep you straight.

Take the time to heal before you put yourself out there.


----------



## turnera

TroyN said:


> So what happens next? She probably gets married to this guy, a co-worker, then stays at this job that she hates because he still works there, and lives in a town that she finds boring, and doesn't really do anything to improve herself. *And cheats again.*


----------



## bfree

*Re: Re: I think my wife MIGHT be having affair…*

And that's exactly what WILL happen.

Troy, she affected you. But by dressing and acting as she did you are constantly affecting her. Get out with friends, find a new girl, detach from this mess. You are better. You might be the only one that doesn't truly know that.


----------



## Q tip

Go out and date gorgeous women. Most guys will look and wish. Don't be that guy. Don't ogle, strike up a chat. If they're available (actually, many are for that reason) - they'll enjoy the talk. 

*hint* Be interested, not interesting. It's an open secret, but don't tell anyone. 

Heal yourself. Small steps. No such thing as strangers, just friends you haven't met.


----------



## bandit.45

TroyN said:


> So what happens next? She probably gets married to this guy, a co-worker, then stays at this job that she hates because he still works there, and lives in a town that she finds boring, and doesn't really do anything to improve herself. I should not care, but how is this a good thing?
> 
> I don't know. That's why I want to leave. I'm given a chance to get out and move to a different place and meet someone new. I'm now longer chained to this woman and I want to experience something new.


Like someone said before, she will eventually cheat on her new man too. 

If you want to change your life and move somewhere else then quit talking and start making it happen. You get one life...


----------



## ThePheonix

farsidejunky said:


> Take the time to heal before you put yourself out there.


From my observation, other women that treats you like you hung the moon are like healing ointment on an abrasion.


----------



## Cinema79

She will not be able to sustain a relationship with your replacement. Why can't you see that? Everyone on this thread has experience with this. 

Sure, she's in a great place now because she found a new victim. But she won't be able to sustain it. She's acting out a role right now and then the curtain will drop.

She'll eventually get tired of everything again and take everything out on your replacement. She's an idiot and did NOTHING to change herself. She'll be stuck at her same lousy job with her husband who works are the same job in the same lousy house and EVERYTHING will implode down the road. Dude, seriously!

I like that you are taking charge and trying to move. Tremendously growth will come of this and you'll find yourself an awesome woman.


----------



## RV9

Move on friend. Only thing that's holding you back is you. I believe you don't even realize how lucky you are- you don't have children with her.


----------



## mr.bunbury

You're not going to find peace trying to find out what happened to her. She might cheat again, she might not, she might be most unhappy but since she's going to keep up appearances you will just be guessing yourself to death.

these kind of things are normal, i used to be obsessed about an x-gf as well id google her and check her fb for a whole year and she looked like she was having a lot of fun and i was feeling bad. We used to talk about getting married and i used to admit to her that she could do better than me (financially) if she choose to.

Then when i forgot all about it i learned that she's married to some guy she had friendzoned for years, they knew each other before she knew me! He even followed her all the way to Paris but i was the one who was rocking her world on those holidays! So you see, some things happen when it doesn't matter anymore.

Also, you're going to feel pretty silly if you god a good job right now and you chuck it away for an inferior offer just because you want to get away from your ex.


----------



## verpin zal

Here's a list of reasons why you should think about your *ex*-wife, and what you should do about them:

1-
2-
3-
4-
5-
6-
7-
8-
.
.
.


----------



## GROUNDPOUNDER

TroyN, plenty of us have been right where you are now. You'll drive yourself crazy trying to make sense of why she would leave you and end up with the slug she's with now.

I think what's happened is that she had moved on from you long ago. She just never bothered to tell you so. It's what happened to me also.

Leaving who and what she had, for who she's with and what she doesn't have now will never make sense to you. What makes it worse is that she had months/years to detach from you. You've only more recently started the process.

I know you don't believe it right now, but there will come a day when you realize that this is finally behind you. It's just tough right now because all you can think about is the past. I hard to even imagine the future.

The past is the past and will always be what it is. The funny think about the future is it's a clean slate. A blank canvas.

An artist may, for a while, morn his/her works that were lost in a fire. Then they pick up that brush again and before you know it - The walls will be covered with new impressions, abstracts and mosaics.

There's highs and lows. Right now, you are at the lowest of lows. To you the next high looks like a mountain that you don't have the energy, or desire to even attempt to climb.

But it's not a mountain, it's a wave. You're only drifting between the crests. The time will come when you're ready to swim again. And instead of avoiding that wave, you swim directly for it.

Chopping your way to the top and riding it in to better shores.

Hang in there. Don't end up being your own worse enemy. If you find yourself sitting at home and rehashing what has happened over and over in your mind, LEAVE. Go somewhere else. Anywhere else. If you busy your body with other things, your mind will soon follow.


----------



## carmen ohio

TroyN, get yourself into IC. You need it, badly.


----------



## TroyN

Did really well this weekend. I attended a wedding for one of my office mates and met a few single ladies there. Slow danced with one. Felt awkward, of course, for a lot of reasons. It was the first event I attended as a solo guy and it was tough going home alone. 

On Sunday I joined a friend for a run. We met a few of his friends afterwards at a bar and this girl (a friend of friend), VERY PRETTY, started talking to me and we seemed to hit it off and we exchanged numbers.

I did not call her or text her....but she texted me this morning to see what I was up to this Thursday. So I'm back at it!


----------



## TDSC60

Troy

You are trying to apply normal logical behavior to to an abnormal illogical person. You will never understand why or how she could act the way she does. You are a normal, caring human being - she is not. You will never get answers that make sense because she changes with the weather.

If you step way back and look at the current situation from a distance you will see that she is repeating the pattern of the early relationship she had with you and the results will be the same unless this new guy is a whimp and gives into every little thing she wants. And this most likely weighed heavily into her choice to replace you. She thinks that Mr. Ugly will never question her behavior for fear of losing her no matter how nasty she treats him. She is incapable of love (only loves herself).

Count your blessings and get to a point of indifference with her. That is the best thing you can do for yourself.


----------



## SamuraiJack

TroyN said:


> Did really well this weekend. I attended a wedding for one of my office mates and met a few single ladies there. Slow danced with one. Felt awkward, of course, for a lot of reasons. It was the first event I attended as a solo guy and it was tough going home alone.
> 
> On Sunday I joined a friend for a run. We met a few of his friends afterwards at a bar and this girl (a friend of friend), VERY PRETTY, started talking to me and we seemed to hit it off and we exchanged numbers.
> 
> I did not call her or text her....but she texted me this morning to see what I was up to this Thursday. So I'm back at it!


Never underestimate the healing and helping power of simply talking to a person who doesnt have an agenda.

Just go cautiously and remain true to yourself.
Above all else, be honest with her so you dont mislead her.


----------



## Cinema79

TroyN said:


> I did not call her or text her....but she texted me this morning to see what I was up to this Thursday. So I'm back at it!


Good for you! Here's a tip though, definitely take it easy this time around. You are no hurry here and I think you've learned lessons the hard way in your past. 

You can avoid these by taking some personal accountability here. 

What steps can you take to screen properly? You should not submit yourself to depressed, pill-popping, cluster-b witches.

Can you put the breaks on lousy behavior and remove these types from your life in the early stages to avoid such heartbreak early on? You receive hardships if you can't find a way to protect yourself from them. 

Can you be better at spotting women with agendas? There a lot of selfish people out there who want to be respected for practically doing nothing. Your ex was one of them.

Your divorce was the best education you'll probably ever receive. I think you've learned a lot more from it than your ex has, which was essentially rug-sweeping her issues and lining up a replacement instead of taking some personal inventory. Because, you know, she probably thinks you were the problem in your marriage. 

So proceed with caution with this new girl, get some more numbers, and figure out what you want in your next partner. You'll thank me later!


----------



## bandit.45

TroyN said:


> Did really well this weekend. I attended a wedding for one of my office mates and met a few single ladies there. Slow danced with one. Felt awkward, of course, for a lot of reasons. It was the first event I attended as a solo guy and it was tough going home alone.
> 
> On Sunday I joined a friend for a run. We met a few of his friends afterwards at a bar and this girl (a friend of friend), VERY PRETTY, started talking to me and we seemed to hit it off and we exchanged numbers.
> 
> I did not call her or text her....but she texted me this morning to see what I was up to this Thursday. So I'm back at it!


Player...


----------



## TroyN

Thanks for all of the support on this site. It's really helped me understand her (as much as anyone possibly could) and understand what role I played in all of this. Namely, not screening an individual long enough and really getting to know them. I guess, in the beginning, she was the world's greatest actor.

I read some snippets of this thread this afternoon and this link from a previous post put things into perspective and shed light on her illness:


"An emotionally abusive NPD/BPD woman is incapable of empathy. She’s incapable of seeing any viewpoint other than her own and only cares about her needs and feelings. She’d rather stick bamboo splinters under her fingernails than feel vulnerable and she cannot, cannot tolerate emotional and psychological intimacy."

and....

"She likes the idea of having a boyfriend or husband in the abstract, but the reality of being in a relationship is filled with frustration and disappointment for her because you’re not “perfect” or “good enough” for her highly inflated false sense of self. She soon grows to resent you and then the covert and overt abuse and rage attacks begin. Conversely, you try to hold her accountable and point out her imperfections. She can’t have that."

*This was my wife in a nutshell*!


----------



## bandit.45

And now you know what to avoid. 


Next time, slow down and date a woman a couple years before marrying her.


----------



## happyman64

bandit.45 said:


> And now you know what to avoid.
> 
> 
> Next time, slow down and date a woman a couple years before marrying her.


Or marry her right away and never stop dating her. 

😁
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## TroyN

Date went pretty well last night. Went to a winery, got some beers afterwards, and then coffee. She stayed at my place until 1am. Kissed at the winery, and at then for an hour or so at my place.

She dressed very well (make up, hair as well) quite different then what she looked like on Sunday. She looked spectacular.

She apparently googled me and Facebook stalked me for the past week trying to figure out more about me. She also talked to a girl who knew me (I partially know her), and the girls reaction was "yeah, he's ridiculously hot - I didn't know he was divorced" So I'm being validated by other women, which is interesting. I guess I'm perceived in a different way than I thought.

She also found photos of my ex-wife too and asked about my divorce. She also found photos of my ex-wife's new boyfriend. She was certainly doing her homework on me. I tried to be positive and not talk to much about my past, but I told her my wife had a lot of issues and I had to leave her. 

After a few glasses of wine, she half disclosed "well, your wife married up" meaning that I was essentially the better looking of the two of us and her new boyfriend was "frumpy". I like this woman! lol.

We have plans Saturday. 

Meanwhile, I still have mutual friends of my ex-wife still on Facebook. They were people I knew before I met her. Anyways, she's "liking" their recent photos. I also stumbled upon a post/graphic she publicly shared that said "Embrace Life, Whatever happened this year was meant to be." Seriously? So banging an executive co-worker and blowing up a marriage was all a part of your future plans? :scratchhead:


----------



## farsidejunky

Take things slow. Smell the roses. Be clear with her where you are and what you want, even if you have to tell her you don't know.

Enjoy this time, brother.


----------



## happyman64

> Seriously? So banging an executive co-worker and blowing up a marriage was all a part of your future plans?


What a shame you wouldn't post this on her wall for all to see.

It would certainly show how dumb she is.


----------



## bfree

*Re: Re: I think my wife MIGHT be having affair…*



happyman64 said:


> What a shame you wouldn't post this on her wall for all to see.
> 
> It would certainly show how dumb she is.


Actually I would just "like" her post. It would certainly get her hamster going wouldn't it?


----------



## GROUNDPOUNDER

bfree said:


> Actually I would just "like" her post. It would certainly get her hamster going wouldn't it?


Yes, but it would also let her know that he's been checking her posts out. If I were in his place I would never let her see that I've had a second thought about her.

Me, personally might even start posting photos of me with my "girlfriend of the week". Once she saw the 1st woman had been replaced by the next, she would be checking out my account all the time.

Then I'd have some real fun with it...


----------



## loyallad

TroyN said:


> I also stumbled upon a post/graphic she publicly shared that said "Embrace Life, Whatever happened this year was meant to be." Seriously? So banging an executive co-worker and blowing up a marriage was all a part of your future plans? :scratchhead:


Troy,
Don't waste your time on what your ex says or does. When you let stuff like that bother you then you are giving power back to her. You have broke free of her, LET IT GO. Enjoy what you have and what is to come in the future. I know there's some hurt that will just take time to get over. When you let the things your ex does or stuff she post on facebook get to you it's like ripping the bandaid off a cut that hasn't healed. Let it go. You have said yourself she has issues and that's putting it mildly. Some people are blinded by whatever, or careless or just too stupid to see how bad they have screwed up things. People like that leave a lot of collateral damage and just don't care. You can only control you. Now go make the best of today and all the future tomorrows.


----------



## Cinema79

The way to get her hamster going is to simply vanish. People always wonder about what ISN'T there. 

You will be even more mysterious to her over time. Writing about how great your life is and posting photos or your new girl are cries for attention. She'll know that she still has some control over you which, based on how you've described this c_nt, she loves to hurt you. 

Curiosity will eventually get the best of her if you disappear. She'll either ask around, or do some heavy Facebook/google stalking. 

If your new girl is really pretty, and prettier than your ex-wife (like you say she is), that will be the best revenge. Knowing that you rebounded to something better will be the ultimate blow to your b_tchy ex-wife's bloated ego.


----------



## TroyN

Cinema79 said:


> If your new girl is really pretty, and prettier than your ex-wife (like you say she is), that will be the best revenge. Knowing that you rebounded to something better will be the ultimate blow to your b_tchy ex-wife's bloated ego.


Maybe so! Had a great weekend with the new girl - and did what my older brother calls "sealed the deal." Things are getting better...still some residual pain to be honest, having the company of a new woman who seems to really care about me has been a tremendous help. She seems to understand my situation, but I talk about it only when she brings it up.

In other news, I threw my wedding band (the price...drumroll...$85!!!) into the river at a restaurant where my ex-wife and I had our official last "date" together. I stopped there on my way home from work and gave it a pretty good toss. And yes, I cried a little.  This marriage was so [email protected]#cked.

It was the last item I had from her. I deleted my photos of her from a few external hard drives I had and trashed some clothing her parents gave to me as gifts a few weeks ago. 

It's hard to believe this all happened and I'll probably never see her again. So weird. It sometimes feels like this person never really existed.


----------



## bandit.45

Purge her from your life Troy. 

Strike her name off the monuments, off the obelisks...

It shall be as if she were never born. 

So let it be written. 

So let it be done.


----------



## cool12

happy to read you are moving on. best of luck to you!


----------



## TroyN

Well folks - I knew this was going to happen sooner than later. 

*She's engaged* and living with him already. 

I have him and her blocked on Facebook so I've been out of the loop, but this is beyond crazy.

I play on a soccer team with two of her co-workers, and after a few beers one of them broke the news to me. 

So, another setback...but I know I'll be fine.

The bright side is that I'm still with the girl I met a few weeks back...she's really been awesome and nice addition to my life. Taking it slow, and we've been pretty happy.


----------



## Forest

I know you've got lots of emotions from this whole deal, but I really think you're going to do great.

Obviously a marriage is tough to lose, but your ex sounds like someone you better off without. Reading your story, it seems obvious to me that you're better off already. Enjoy the time with the new girl, that's great medicine.


----------



## happyman64

TroyN said:


> Well folks - I knew this was going to happen sooner than later.
> 
> *She's engaged* and living with him already.
> 
> I have him and her blocked on Facebook so I've been out of the loop, but this is beyond crazy.
> 
> I play on a soccer team with two of her co-workers, and after a few beers one of them broke the news to me.
> 
> So, another setback...but I know I'll be fine.
> 
> The bright side is that I'm still with the girl I met a few weeks back...she's really been awesome and nice addition to my life. Taking it slow, and we've been pretty happy.


Troy

It is not a setback. Count your blessings she is gone and never coming back.

Read your very post. You practically listed all the reasons why you should not be married to her.

Your ExW should not be married. She is nuts!

SO IMO it is not a setback but a blessing. 

Enjoy your life today. Live for tomorrow and enjoy your GF who is with you now.....

And smile. Because the whack job is out of your life.

HM


----------



## oneMOreguy

I feel so sorry for the new guy.....he probably has no idea what he is in for.....

and I bet she has kids with him quickly so he cannot escape as easily and quickly as you did.....sucks for him.


----------



## john117

oneMOreguy said:


> I feel so sorry for the new guy.....he probably has no idea what he is in for.....
> 
> 
> 
> and I bet she has kids with him quickly so he cannot escape as easily and quickly as you did.....sucks for him.



Nothing like due diligence to start a relationship on the right path.

I think I would keep up on the "lucky couple" from a morbid curiosity / train accident point of view, esp. if you have common friends and can get info. It's part of the "healing process". 

There's always a chance they will be singing The Sounds of Music and have eight kids and all that but hey, that's because humans are complicated creatures. Sometimes things work too well or not at all.


----------



## oneMOreguy

john117 said:


> Nothing like due diligence to start a relationship on the right path.
> 
> I think I would keep up on the "lucky couple" from a morbid curiosity / train accident point of view, esp. if you have common friends and can get info. It's part of the "healing process".
> 
> There's always a chance they will be singing The Sounds of Music and have eight kids and all that but hey, that's because humans are complicated creatures. Sometimes things work too well or not at all.


you never know.....the new guy might like no sex and being emotionally abused. remember how she reeled in the OP early in the relationship, and then changed once things settled in. The best predictor of future actions is past actions.


----------



## GROUNDPOUNDER

TroyN said:


> So, another setback...but I know I'll be fine.


Yes, but this is the kind of setback is like when someone doesn't make it to the airport in time to catch their flight to a once in a life time vacation.

Then they find out 4 hours later that the plane they missed went down in flames, then sank to the bottom of the sea.

Some setbacks are actually just good luck, with great timing.

In the years to come, I believe that you'll realize this was all a case of one door closing and another one opening up for you.


What was that game show in the 70's with door number 1, 2 and 3?... Lets Make A Deal, I think...

"What's behind door number 2 Johnny?! Let's show 'em what he's won!"

"A sweet and honest young lady. With a heart of gold and truer than the day is long. A women that in ten years will have you pinching yourself to see if your dreaming."

"And what does our runner up get Johnny?. A women that turns off the love and effection, before the ink is even dry on the marriage certificate. But worry not Mr. Runnerup, she'll most likely leave you before you can even bat an eye."

I know that you're still hurting, but trust me, this will change.


----------



## Malaise

In a couple of years these same co-workers will be telling you how she's getting divorced.

That's how she is.


----------



## lordmayhem

Malaise said:


> In a couple of years these same co-workers will be telling you how she's getting divorced.
> 
> That's how she is.


:iagree:


----------



## Ceegee

Malaise said:


> In a couple of years these same co-workers will be telling you how she's getting divorced.
> 
> 
> 
> That's how she is.



My XW recently broke up with her AP because it turns out he's, wait for it, a liar. 

Really, the fact he cheated on his wife with you for 3 years didn't clue you in?

Just a month ago she was saying how sad she was that she couldn't give him a child (tubes tied). Now they're broken up. 

Be grateful OP. The medicine tastes bad going down but it will cure you.


----------



## SamuraiJack

The germans have a specific word for it...

Schadenfreude 


"Schadenfreude is pleasure derived from the misfortunes of others. This word is taken from German and literally means 'harm-joy.' It is the feeling of joy or pleasure when one sees another fail or suffer misfortune. It is also borrowed by some other languages."


Just sit back and watch as her world implodes...
Its a VERY satisfying feeling.


----------



## TroyN

Some thoughts...

1. I’m the only one I’ve known who has gotten a divorce and had a spouse get engaged that quickly. I don’t know who I can talk to other than the people here and maybe my parents who have been a tremendous help. I can’t thank you guys enough.


2. Her and her co-worker/soon-to-be-husband are just another casualty of her toxic work environment. Her’s included, I can count 5 other couples who have met through that company who were previously married. Cheating and affairs are rampant there. It is almost a part of that culture. I chalk it up to boredom, laziness, and the fact everyone looks great at work but they don’t really know that person in the confines of their homes. My wife doesn’t see what kind of office champ I am, and I made less them him. I had absolutely *NO SHOT* against this guy, who makes roughly $70K more per year than me and has climbed the corporate ladder each year. From what I’ve heard, he’s very chummy with the big-wigs of the company. So my wife liked the idea of getting some sort of status with this guy. Based on his looks, and I wish I could post his photo here but I won’t, she is NOT with him for his appearance. 

3. The guy lives in a **** hole of a house. The house my wife and I had was better, bigger, more stylish, and new. And get this, his sick dad lives with them. WTF.

4. I am not that upset about losing her, or her getting remarried. She was awful to me and my stress levels are a lot lower now that she is gone. I’m upset that she could not value what I gave to our relationship, and that the fat ugly guy at work is somehow worthy enough in her eyes to have sex with. I wanted, desperately, to be intimate with my wife and got shunned repeatedly. So, she can just magically turn on her sex drive to a guy with clearly inferior looks? This is BS.

5. I’m getting stalked on Linkedin by people who have once worked with my wife and probably wonder what happened to us. 

6. My new girl is clearly better looking than my wife. My mother, who had dinner with us last night, could not get over how pretty she is. My brother saw a photo of her and said “nice upgrade” - so it looks as if my new girl is getting some pretty good feedback from the family.


----------



## Ceegee

TroyN said:


> Some thoughts...
> 
> 1. I’m the only one I’ve known who has gotten a divorce and had a spouse get engaged that quickly. I don’t know who I can talk to other than the people here and maybe my parents who have been a tremendous help. I can’t thank you guys enough.
> 
> 
> 2. Her and her co-worker/soon-to-be-husband are just another casualty of her toxic work environment. Her’s included, I can count 5 other couples who have met through that company who were previously married. Cheating and affairs are rampant there. It is almost a part of that culture. I chalk it up to boredom, laziness, and the fact everyone looks great at work but they don’t really know that person in the confines of their homes. My wife doesn’t see what kind of office champ I am, and I made less them him. I had absolutely *NO SHOT* against this guy, who makes roughly $70K more per year than me and has climbed the corporate ladder each year. From what I’ve heard, he’s very chummy with the big-wigs of the company. So my wife liked the idea of getting some sort of status with this guy. Based on his looks, and I wish I could post his photo here but I won’t, she is NOT with him for his appearance.
> 
> 3. The guy lives in a **** hole of a house. The house my wife and I had was better, bigger, more stylish, and new. And get this, his sick dad lives with them. WTF.
> 
> 4. I am not that upset about losing her, or her getting remarried. She was awful to me and my stress levels are a lot lower now that she is gone. I’m upset that she could not value what I gave to our relationship, and that the fat ugly guy at work is somehow worthy enough in her eyes to have sex with. I wanted, desperately, to be intimate with my wife and got shunned repeatedly. So, she can just magically turn on her sex drive to a guy with clearly inferior looks? This is BS.
> 
> 5. I’m getting stalked on Linkedin by people who have once worked with my wife and probably wonder what happened to us.
> 
> 6. My new girl is clearly better looking than my wife. My mother, who had dinner with us last night, could not get over how pretty she is. My brother saw a photo of her and said “nice upgrade” - so it looks as if my new girl is getting some pretty good feedback from the family.


I could have written 2-6 myself.

Wouldn't be an insurance company they work for would it?


----------



## SamuraiJack

TroyN said:


> Some thoughts...
> 
> 1. I’m the only one I’ve known who has gotten a divorce and had a spouse get engaged that quickly. I don’t know who I can talk to other than the people here and maybe my parents who have been a tremendous help. I can’t thank you guys enough.


Troyn,
You aren’t the first. You won’t be the last. 
My ex had some guy in the wings and he made an appearance just weeks after the divorce was final. Pretty sure he was the “greener grass” she was hoping to get some of.
I heard a rumor that she wanted to engage, but he was off a bad divorce and put the brakes on.
She crowed all over about how she was in love etc etc… Then one day 9 months later, he announced that he was accepting a job in TX.
Two weeks later he was 1000 miles away and I haven’t heard a peep about him.

What your OM doesn’t realize is that (just like a cheater) she is MUCH more likely to short sight on him and jump another status level.
She has already developed the mindset that it’s easier to throw it away than to polish it up and fix it.
Once you have made that leap in thinking…it becomes MUCH easier to do it again. 
That’s why second, third and fourth marriages get progressively more likely to fail.

Most people are born with this attitude by virtue of seeing their parents’ divorce. 
That ALONE gives them a 15% more likely chance that even a healthy pairing will fail.

It also seems to mess with the amount of time that people spend in the honeymoon period. It’s anecdotal at this point, but second and third marriages seem to have significantly smaller limerance periods.
That also tends to breed desperation because they feel it fading and sometimes try to “jumpstart it” by getting married.

Greener grass attempts usually lead the person straight down the path of the downward spiral.
The interesting thing is that they usually surround themselves with toxic friends and deliberately spin things to be more favorable to themselves. The more they do this, the more they spin off the path of reality.
All because of that tiny little shift in thinking.

Just wait until you see where she is in a year.
She will do one of three things:
1.	20 % - She will succeed in her marriage.
2.	30 %- She will concede to social pressure and live out the “pretend it’s good” scenario. It’s a slow building pressure that will crush her inside of 15 years.
3.	50 % - Her world will burn down and she will run to another man to shelter her.

Your only duty at this point is to work on yourself and keep the ingredients ready to make popcorn.
Because eventually there is going to be a great show.
…and you get front row seats!
:lol:


----------



## Q tip

They'll both learn about each other.

You end up cheating on the one you cheat with. 

Cheaterville.com for the both of them


----------



## TroyN

Ceegee said:


> I could have written 2-6 myself.
> 
> Wouldn't be an insurance company they work for would it?


Yes, it is. I live in Texas. Where are you from?

I want to add that I have NO PROOF that she was cheating on me. I never got into her phone, followed her to work, cracked passwords, etc. After we separated, and about two weeks before I moved out, I noticed a significant amount of weight loss and very cold behavior from her. She went from being almost needy during separation, to a completely different person in the span of a few weeks. She wore her wedding ring up until a point in our separation, and then I noticed she took it off. When I left and moved out, she cried. So confusing.

My suspicion lies in the fact that she had been around this guy at work for YEARS. He's been with the company since 2005 and she started in 2007. They were Facebook friends prior to us divorcing. So they have know each other a long time. I think it's painful knowing they work together. If she would have been dating some random guy from the other side of town, I would feel a little more comfortable about everything. 

I have theory that she wanted to be with him for awhile or vice versa, but her better judgement overruled her desires. When I pulled the plug (and she knew I was moving out and not coming back) she went at the guy full throttle.


----------



## bfree

TroyN said:


> Some thoughts...
> 
> 1. I’m the only one I’ve known who has gotten a divorce and had a spouse get engaged that quickly. I don’t know who I can talk to other than the people here and maybe my parents who have been a tremendous help. I can’t thank you guys enough.
> 
> 
> 2. Her and her co-worker/soon-to-be-husband are just another casualty of her toxic work environment. Her’s included, I can count 5 other couples who have met through that company who were previously married. Cheating and affairs are rampant there. It is almost a part of that culture. I chalk it up to boredom, laziness, and the fact everyone looks great at work but they don’t really know that person in the confines of their homes. My wife doesn’t see what kind of office champ I am, and I made less them him. I had absolutely *NO SHOT* against this guy, who makes roughly $70K more per year than me and has climbed the corporate ladder each year. From what I’ve heard, he’s very chummy with the big-wigs of the company. So my wife liked the idea of getting some sort of status with this guy. Based on his looks, and I wish I could post his photo here but I won’t, she is NOT with him for his appearance.
> 
> 3. The guy lives in a **** hole of a house. The house my wife and I had was better, bigger, more stylish, and new. And get this, his sick dad lives with them. WTF.
> 
> 4. I am not that upset about losing her, or her getting remarried. She was awful to me and my stress levels are a lot lower now that she is gone. I’m upset that she could not value what I gave to our relationship, and that the fat ugly guy at work is somehow worthy enough in her eyes to have sex with. I wanted, desperately, to be intimate with my wife and got shunned repeatedly. So, she can just magically turn on her sex drive to a guy with clearly inferior looks? This is BS.
> 
> 5. I’m getting stalked on Linkedin by people who have once worked with my wife and probably wonder what happened to us.
> 
> 6. *My new girl is clearly better looking than my wife. My mother, who had dinner with us last night, could not get over how pretty she is. My brother saw a photo of her and said “nice upgrade” - so it looks as if my new girl is getting some pretty good feedback from the family.*


And remember this. You did it the right way. There is no guilt to complicate your feelings. There is no karma hanging over your head like the Sword of Damocles. There is no pressure to make this relationship work at all costs because of what you gave up to enter into it. You can be free to live and to love with no added baggage and no ulterior emotional entanglements getting in the way.


----------



## SamuraiJack

TroyN said:


> Yes, it is. I live in Texas. Where are you from?
> 
> I want to add that I have NO PROOF that she was cheating on me. I never got into her phone, followed her to work, cracked passwords, etc. After we separated, and about two weeks before I moved out, I noticed a significant amount of weight loss and very cold behavior from her. She went from being almost needy during separation, to a completely different person in the span of a few weeks. She wore her wedding ring up until a point in our separation, and then I noticed she took it off. When I left and moved out, she cried. So confusing.
> 
> My suspicion lies in the fact that she had been around this guy at work for YEARS. He's been with the company since 2005 and she started in 2007. They were Facebook friends prior to us divorcing. So they have know each other a long time. I think it's painful knowing they work together. If she would have been dating some random guy from the other side of town, I would feel a little more comfortable about everything.
> 
> I have theory that she wanted to be with him for awhile or vice versa, but her better judgement overruled her desires. When I pulled the plug (and she knew I was moving out and not coming back) she went at the guy full throttle.


Wow. This sounds just like my ex...maybe she has a long lost sister.


----------



## Q tip

Live well. Your revenge is living large while she wakes up. Too late.


----------



## Ceegee

TroyN said:


> Yes, it is. I live in Texas. Where are you from?
> 
> I want to add that I have NO PROOF that she was cheating on me. I never got into her phone, followed her to work, cracked passwords, etc. After we separated, and about two weeks before I moved out, I noticed a significant amount of weight loss and very cold behavior from her. She went from being almost needy during separation, to a completely different person in the span of a few weeks. She wore her wedding ring up until a point in our separation, and then I noticed she took it off. When I left and moved out, she cried. So confusing.
> 
> My suspicion lies in the fact that she had been around this guy at work for YEARS. He's been with the company since 2005 and she started in 2007. They were Facebook friends prior to us divorcing. So they have know each other a long time. I think it's painful knowing they work together. If she would have been dating some random guy from the other side of town, I would feel a little more comfortable about everything.
> 
> I have theory that she wanted to be with him for awhile or vice versa, but her better judgement overruled her desires. When I pulled the plug (and she knew I was moving out and not coming back) she went at the guy full throttle.



My story is almost exactly the same except for one important thing. 

She and this guy went to a restaurant where my best just happened to start working at. She was supposed to be at a friends house. 

Also, as soon as out divorce was final people from her office came to tell me that there was rumors that she was having an affair. She still doesn't believe this and still insists that she did not cheat. 

I tried to deny it myself up until others told me it was true. Oh, and when I began talking to his wife and compared timelines we discovered that it had been going on for two years prior to her filing for D. 

If your STBX works where I think she does you too may be getting similar calls. As a matter of fact, I know a lot of people there that love to gossip. If you want me to find out...

Edit: she cried because it's a difficult thing. My XW hates me but she cried the day mediation finalized our divorce. I noticed it just before a began skipping and kicking my heels as I walked out of the office.


----------



## TroyN

Ceegee said:


> My story is almost exactly the same except for one important thing.
> 
> She and this guy went to a restaurant where my best just happened to start working at. She was supposed to be at a friends house.
> 
> Also, as soon as out divorce was final people from her office came to tell me that there was rumors that she was having an affair. She still doesn't believe this and still insists that she did not cheat.
> 
> I tried to deny it myself up until others told me it was true. Oh, and when I began talking to his wife and compared timelines we discovered that it had been going on for two years prior to her filing for D.
> 
> If your STBX works where I think she does you too may be getting similar calls. As a matter of fact, I know a lot of people there that love to gossip. If you want me to find out...
> 
> Edit: she cried because it's a difficult thing. My XW hates me but she cried the day mediation finalized our divorce. I noticed it just before a began skipping and kicking my heels as I walked out of the office.


I just tried to send you a PM, but your inbox is full.


----------



## TroyN

It's been nearly two months and I'm feeling a lot better. I've been seeing my new girl for a couple months now - the difference between my ex and and my new girl is night and day. I'm much more aware of red flags and this new girl seems to be the real deal. 

I saw my ex-wife this past weekend at the mall. She was by herself. She said "hello" and nothing else. I said "hey" back and nothing else. 

She gained a lot of weight since I saw her at the divorce proceedings. I think she found out about my new girlfriend through social media as my new girlfriend has taken numerous pictures of her and I together. A lot my mutual friends are now friends with my new girl and it's all pretty public at this point. 

My ex-wife even hit my LinkedIn page the other day. So I'm sort of wondering why she still cares.

Maybe she ate her pain away? Maybe the pain of seeing me with my new girl got to her a little bit? My new girl is quite striking....and my ex-wife looked pretty rough. 

Even though it was hard to see her, I can safely say that the pain I once had many months ago has subsided and I've found some happiness again. I've been lifting weights about 4 days per week and reading lots of relationship help books (no more Mr. Nice Guy, Married Man Sex Primer) to prevent future disasters. 

For those in pain, it does get better. Work on yourself, forget about your exes. Reach out to family and travel. Write down your thoughts and save them in your email. These are just some of small things I did to feel better and help me recover from this mess.


----------



## lordmayhem

Good for you! 

Now, aren't you GLAD that you didn't make her pregnant like she wanted you to?


----------



## Malaise

lordmayhem said:


> Good for you!
> 
> Now, aren't you GLAD that you didn't make her pregnant like she wanted you to?


*shudder*


----------



## BobSimmons

TroyN said:


> It's been nearly two months and I'm feeling a lot better. I've been seeing my new girl for a couple months now - the difference between my ex and and my new girl is night and day. I'm much more aware of red flags and this new girl seems to be the real deal.
> 
> I saw my ex-wife this past weekend at the mall. She was by herself. She said "hello" and nothing else. I said "hey" back and nothing else.
> 
> She gained a lot of weight since I saw her at the divorce proceedings. I think she found out about my new girlfriend through social media as my new girlfriend has taken numerous pictures of her and I together. A lot my mutual friends are now friends with my new girl and it's all pretty public at this point.
> 
> My ex-wife even hit my LinkedIn page the other day. So I'm sort of wondering why she still cares.
> 
> Maybe she ate her pain away? Maybe the pain of seeing me with my new girl got to her a little bit? My new girl is quite striking....and my ex-wife looked pretty rough.
> 
> Even though it was hard to see her, I can safely say that the pain I once had many months ago has subsided and I've found some happiness again. I've been lifting weights about 4 days per week and reading lots of relationship help books (no more Mr. Nice Guy, Married Man Sex Primer) to prevent future disasters.
> 
> For those in pain, it does get better. Work on yourself, forget about your exes. Reach out to family and travel. Write down your thoughts and save them in your email. These are just some of small things I did to feel better and help me recover from this mess.


I keep advocating this but people rarely listen. Live your life and live it well, that is the ultimate revenge. They can disrespect you and treat you like trash but once they see what they've lost it's a bitter pill, even if they won't admit it.

Good on you and continue to enjoy the sweetness of life, because when you allow it, it really can be sweet..just not for your ex


----------



## lordmayhem

TroyN said:


> She gained a lot of weight since I saw her at the divorce proceedings. I think she found out about my new girlfriend through social media as my new girlfriend has taken numerous pictures of her and I together. A lot my mutual friends are now friends with my new girl and it's all pretty public at this point.
> 
> My ex-wife even hit my LinkedIn page the other day. So I'm sort of wondering why she still cares.
> 
> Maybe she ate her pain away? Maybe the pain of seeing me with my new girl got to her a little bit? My new girl is quite striking....and my ex-wife looked pretty rough.


You forgot about your own experience with her. Remember when you got engaged to her? That's when she cut off the sex and then started to gain the weight back. Using your own words, she prettied herself up for you. And thats what she did with the new guy. 

Or maybe the new guy dumped her as soon as she cut off the sex for him. Who knows, and who cares at this point? You dodged a major bullet there. You didn't have kids with her, would have tied you for life to her through the kids.

It does get better, I promise you that. I was fortunate I never bumped into my ex wife after the divorce, but my wife did.


----------



## Q tip

Keep dating hot, decent ladies. They're fun! Happiness is this mess in the rear view mirror!


----------



## TroyN

lordmayhem said:


> You forgot about your own experience with her. Remember when you got engaged to her? That's when she cut off the sex and then started to gain the weight back. Using your own words, she prettied herself up for you. And thats what she did with the new guy.
> 
> Or maybe the new guy dumped her as soon as she cut off the sex for him. Who knows, and who cares at this point? You dodged a major bullet there. You didn't have kids with her, would have tied you for life to her through the kids.


I know this is what she did, in terms of prettying herself up. What I didn't understand was her need to get with someone while we were technically married. It hurt that she shut off the sex with her own husband, but seemingly could turn it on for someone else. 

The sex thing hurt me the most. I am happier without her in my life because I know her true colors now and I don't even like her. I think she is a pig.

BTW, she is still engaged. I saw the ring on her finger.


----------



## happy as a clam

Troy, so glad to hear that you are doing much better.



TroyN said:


> BTW, she is still engaged. I saw the ring on her finger.


As for this comment, just remember her pattern -- engaged or not, it won't be long before she's cheating on him too. Leopards don't change their spots.


----------



## Clay2013

She is now your past. The great thing about that is you can always look back but most of the time you will be looking forward. 

As you are already seeing life is so much better without a cheater in your life. 

Keep smiling. Its going to be a great year  


Clay


----------



## lordmayhem

TroyN said:


> I know this is what she did, in terms of prettying herself up. What I didn't understand was her need to get with someone while we were technically married. It hurt that she shut off the sex with her own husband, but seemingly could turn it on for someone else.
> 
> The sex thing hurt me the most. I am happier without her in my life because I know her true colors now and I don't even like her. I think she is a pig.
> 
> BTW, she is still engaged. I saw the ring on her finger.


It's natural for you to be hurt, it's only been less than a year. Don't worry. Like we told you before, it will get better. You WILL reach the stage of Indifference eventually, especially with no kids involved. When you do reach that stage, you won't notice if there is a ring on her finger or not because you won't be scrutinizing her.


----------



## Forest

TroyN said:


> She gained a lot of weight since I saw her at the divorce proceedings.
> 
> Maybe she ate her pain away?





TroyN said:


> I think she is a pig.


Well, next time you bump into her give her an "oink" from me.


----------



## LongWalk

She ballooned because OM didn't deserve the top version. That is just for seduction mode.


----------



## LongWalk

Wonder how ReGroup is doing?


----------



## Augusto

I you do wish to merry this girl, make sure you show the ex what she's missing from the large rock on her finger to an elaborate trip to Hawaii and flaunt it.


----------



## TroyN

LongWalk said:


> She ballooned because OM didn't deserve the top version. That is just for seduction mode.


So sad. 

I try not to think about these things too much. Like everyone else I get triggers from songs or if I even see her company's logo. I'm just disgusted with everything. When I saw that she visited my linkedin page it was a bit of setback, because I really thought she forgot all about me. That is how I've felt lately. I was so easily discarded and replaced.

I'm close to reaching indifference, I'm not there yet but it will happened eventually.


----------



## BigTexDad

I only read your OP and have not read through the rest yet. But my initial impression is this is someone who has no interest in having a husband in the first place. There are "asexual" women out there....women who hate sex all the way around. A lot of times it is because of a sexual abuse event in their childhood. These asexual types want a family and some level of normalcy but don't really want to be married. Sounds like to me the wedding and honeymoon sex was because she was caught up in the moment. I knew a girl in college that I only regarded as a friend. She wanted to have sex with me but didn't want a relationship. I could have had my way with her 9 ways to Sunday but I saw her like a friend and I could not get past that. She eventually accepted that and relied on me for dating advice. She started dating some guy she hated and said she hated when he touched her but thought he would "make pretty babies". So she started poking holes in his condoms with a pin. She wanted to get pregnant by him thendump him. She had confided this in me and I felt I had an obligation to tell him so I did. She never got pregnant, never got married but today has 3 kids from3 different men. So it sounds to me like she was living to get married and have kids but once that is accomplished she may be done with you. Just my perception---not necessarily how it may really be.


----------



## GusPolinski

BigTexDad said:


> I only read your OP and have not read through the rest yet. But my initial impression is this is someone who has no interest in having a husband in the first place. There are "asexual" women out there....women who hate sex all the way around. A lot of times it is because of a sexual abuse event in their childhood. These asexual types want a family and some level of normalcy but don't really want to be married. Sounds like to me the wedding and honeymoon sex was because she was caught up in the moment. I knew a girl in college that I only regarded as a friend. She wanted to have sex with me but didn't want a relationship. I could have had my way with her 9 ways to Sunday but I saw her like a friend and I could not get past that. She eventually accepted that and relied on me for dating advice. She started dating some guy she hated and said she hated when he touched her but thought he would "make pretty babies". So she started poking holes in his condoms with a pin. She wanted to get pregnant by him thendump him. She had confided this in me and I felt I had an obligation to tell him so I did. She never got pregnant, never got married but today has 3 kids from3 different men. So it sounds to me like she was living to get married and have kids but once that is accomplished she may be done with you. Just my perception---not necessarily how it may really be.


Keep reading.


----------



## sidney2718

TroyN said:


> So sad.
> 
> I try not to think about these things too much. Like everyone else I get triggers from songs or if I even see her company's logo. I'm just disgusted with everything. When I saw that she visited my linkedin page it was a bit of setback, because I really thought she forgot all about me. That is how I've felt lately. I was so easily discarded and replaced.
> 
> I'm close to reaching indifference, I'm not there yet but it will happened eventually.


Troy: I've just read all the posts of yours in this thread, and a lot of the other folk's posts as well.

Congrats on your progress and forward motion. But your memory needs reinforcing. The OM had no real influence on your marriage. Your xW cut off sex with you right after your honeymoon. Sex just doesn't seem to mean much to her.

It doesn't matter when the OM came into the picture. Your marriage was doomed once you realized that there would be darned little sex. She is not married yet, possibly because he knows about some of the dynamics of your marriage to her. Right now they are engaged and it is likely that he's getting good sex. If he does know about your marriage, why would he get married and watch the good sex go away.

As for being discarded and replaced, that isn't true. You were never part of her life in any meaningful way. She's not well. It is likely that she can't be cured. She is in for a sad and possibly shortened life. And you are NOT RESPONSIBLE for her or what she does.

Good luck and a good and happy future!


----------



## KingwoodKev

This appears to be a classic case where she decided she doesn't want to be in the marriage. She gained the weight to be less attractive to you and is engaging in behavior she knows will sabotage the marriage. The ultimate passive aggressive cowardly way to end it. She's counting on you to end it so she won't have to.


----------



## GusPolinski

KingwoodKev said:


> This appears to be a classic case where she decided she doesn't want to be in the marriage. She gained the weight to be less attractive to you and is engaging in behavior she knows will sabotage the marriage. The ultimate passive aggressive cowardly way to end it. She's counting on you to end it so she won't have to.


Keep reading.


----------



## KingwoodKev

GusPolinski said:


> Keep reading.


Too long and painful. Can you give me a synopsis? It would be much appreciated.


----------



## GusPolinski

KingwoodKev said:


> Too long and painful. Can you give me a synopsis? It would be much appreciated.


OP's ex reeled him in w/ a slim figure, tons of sex, and a sweet disposition... and then -- before the wedding cake even touched her lips -- started changing her appearance, putting him down at every turn, and left him practically begging for every single scrap of affection that she could be bothered to throw his way.

She wanted to be married, and wanted children, but on her own terms. Additionally, given that she was engaged to her new sucker all of 5 minutes after the divorce papers were signed, that hasn't changed at all.


----------



## tom67

GusPolinski said:


> OP's ex reeled him in w/ a slim figure, tons and sex, and a sweet disposition... and then -- before the wedding cake even touched her lips -- started changing her appearance, putting him down at every turn, and left him practically begging for every single scrap of affection that she could be bothered to throw his way.
> 
> She wanted to be married, and wanted children, but on her own terms. Additionally, given that she was engaged to her new sucker all of 5 minutes after the divorce papers were signed, that hasn't changed at all.


Sad but dead on synopsis.


----------



## KingwoodKev

GusPolinski said:


> OP's ex reeled him in w/ a slim figure, tons and sex, and a sweet disposition... and then -- before the wedding cake even touched her lips -- started changing her appearance, putting him down at every turn, and left him practically begging for every single scrap of affection that she could be bothered to throw his way.
> 
> She wanted to be married, and wanted children, but on her own terms. Additionally, given that she was engaged to her new sucker all of 5 minutes after the divorce papers were signed, that hasn't changed at all.


Thanks for the update. The quick engagement after the divorce definitely proves that she was cheating for a while. A truly despicable person. People who betray their country are not as low as a person who would betray their spouse.


----------



## helolover

GusPolinski said:


> OP's ex reeled him in w/ a slim figure, tons and sex, and a sweet disposition... and then -- before the wedding cake even touched her lips -- started changing her appearance, putting him down at every turn, and left him practically begging for every single scrap of affection that she could be bothered to throw his way.
> 
> She wanted to be married, and wanted children, but on her own terms. Additionally, given that she was engaged to her new sucker all of 5 minutes after the divorce papers were signed, that hasn't changed at all.


Further distilled down: BPD.


----------



## TroyN

helolover said:


> Further distilled down: BPD.


I haven't been around here as much as I used to...

The longer I've been away from her, the more I realize it was probably BPD working it's witchcraft. Once someone brought it up on this thread, I literally went down the checklist and said "yep, yep, yep, yep, that's her". 

I been dating a new girl anyways for a while, and after seeing my ex at the mall a couple of months ago looking like she put on 20-30 lbs (keep in mind she dropped her weight to get the OM) I see that she's clearly repeating all the same behavior that she did to me when we dated. She looked like garbage. I'm sure more failure and misery will follow.

Meanwhile, I continue to up my value. I have a body-builder friend who gave me a workout plan and I'm lifting 4-days a week now. It has help my confidence and I'm focusing my energy on that instead of being bummed about what happened. I don't think I've ever had a more attractive physique and my girlfriend seems to approve! :smthumbup: 

Oh, and sex 4-5 times a week has probably made my life a lot better. It's a crazy to think I've had more sex in a week in a half than I did during my entire marriage.


----------



## Malaise

TroyN said:


> I haven't been around here as much as I used to...
> 
> The longer I've been away from her, the more I realize it was probably BPD working it's witchcraft. Once someone brought it up on this thread, I literally went down the checklist and said "yep, yep, yep, yep, that's her".
> 
> I been dating a new girl anyways for a while, and after seeing my ex at the mall a couple of months ago looking like she put on 20-30 lbs (keep in mind she dropped her weight to get the OM) I see that she's clearly repeating all the same behavior that she did to me when we dated. She looked like garbage. I'm sure more failure and misery will follow.
> 
> Meanwhile, I continue to up my value. I have a body-builder friend who gave me a workout plan and I'm lifting 4-days a week now. It has help my confidence and I'm focusing my energy on that instead of being bummed about what happened. I don't think I've ever had a more attractive physique and my girlfriend seems to approve! :smthumbup:
> 
> *Oh, and sex 4-5 times a week has probably made my life a lot better. It's a crazy to think I've had more sex in a week in a half than I did during my entire marriage*.


Totally believable.

Same with the BPD.


----------



## lordmayhem

TroyN said:


> I been dating a new girl anyways for a while, and after seeing my ex at the mall a couple of months ago looking like she put on 20-30 lbs (keep in mind she dropped her weight to get the OM) I see that she's clearly repeating all the same behavior that she did to me when we dated. She looked like garbage. I'm sure more failure and misery will follow.


She wasn't prepared to see you at the mall, remember this post of yours?



TroyN said:


> So I saw her.
> 
> I just got back home from the accountant's office. Long story as to why I had to do this, so i won't get into it.
> 
> She was about 5 minutes late, appeared in knee high boots, tight jeans, lots of makeup on. This seemed odd to me, since it was 5:30pm when we had to meet and her clothing was not work appropriate.
> 
> So either she was trying to impress me, or her new boyfriend. Whatever the case may be....
> 
> She was incredibly dismissive, rude, and cold. Texting the whole time. I had to ask her a question about our house due to tax purposes, namely the date we sold it and she said to me in really *****y tone "why do you need to know that?"


That was a faceoff, and she did everything to irk you. I hoped you also acted nochalantly and dismissive. Otherwise you lost the faceoff and she got under your skin.

You already know she can pretend to be nice and look attractive when she has her mind set on something. But that's not her real nature. Her true nature is what you saw when you got engaged and married with her and what you saw at the mall. Everything else was a facade, including the meeting at the accountants office.


----------



## Ceegee

The thing that sucks is she will seek you out to get her supply when she can't get it from new/current partner. 

Create boundaries and limit communication. 

Stay at 50k feet and don't take her bait.


----------



## TroyN

Ceegee said:


> The thing that sucks is she will seek you out to get her supply when she can't get it from new/current partner.
> 
> Create boundaries and limit communication.
> 
> Stay at 50k feet and don't take her bait.


Not sure this will ever happen. She was pretty awful to me post-divorce and a real brat during the separation. I think she harbors a lot of resentment towards me for ending *her marriage* (remember, it's all about her - not us) and ruining her social status that she's looking to re-attain (hence having her slob of a future husband on deck before the ink was dry).


----------



## GusPolinski

Ceegee said:


> The thing that sucks is she will seek you out to get her supply when she can't get it from new/current partner.
> 
> Create boundaries and limit communication.
> 
> Stay at 50k feet and don't take her bait.





TroyN said:


> *Not sure this will ever happen.* She was pretty awful to me post-divorce and a real brat during the separation. I think she harbors a lot of resentment towards me for ending *her marriage* (remember, it's all about her - not us) and ruining her social status that she's looking to re-attain (hence having her slob of a future husband on deck before the ink was dry).


Why not? You're divorced now, right? You've moved out and moved on, and you don't have any kids.

Look, you're entitled to be bitter about everything, but you don't have to interact w/ her at all anymore... right? That should go a long way in terms of helping you get to 50k, 75k, 100k, and beyond.


----------



## Ceegee

TroyN said:


> Not sure this will ever happen. She was pretty awful to me post-divorce and a real brat during the separation. I think she harbors a lot of resentment towards me for ending *her marriage* (remember, it's all about her - not us) and ruining her social status that she's looking to re-attain (hence having her slob of a future husband on deck before the ink was dry).



I hope you're right. I hope it doesn't happen. 

A lot of times people like her cannot self soothe. They need someone to dump their sh!t on. That person has been you for some time. She will want to be her best in front of others (to maintain her social status) and with you she has nothing to lose. 

Just be prepared for the "out of the blue" rant.


----------



## happy as a clam

GusPolinski said:


> Why not? You're divorced now, right? You've moved out and moved on, and you don't have any kids.
> 
> Look, you're entitled to be bitter about everything, but you don't have to interact w/ her at all anymore... right? That should go a long way in terms of helping you get to 50k, 75k, 100k, and beyond.


:iagree:

Troy, for your own well-being, let it go ! You're divorced. She's history.

Unless your agenda is to stir the pot.

Don't be passive/aggressive, Troy. Your ex cornered the market on all that. We're all rooting for you ...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## lordmayhem

TroyN said:


> Not sure this will ever happen. She was pretty awful to me post-divorce and a real brat during the separation. I think she harbors a lot of resentment towards me for ending *her marriage* (remember, it's all about her - not us) and ruining her social status that she's looking to re-attain (hence having her slob of a future husband on deck before the ink was dry).


Years from now you will look back on this and wonder what the heck you were thinking being with her. Seriously. You dodged the bullet. You have no kids with her! You have no ties to her at all! Think of it this way: You should be thanking your lucky stars and breathing a sigh of relief!

If you think you have it bad, look at Luvmyjava's thread in the private section. Your ex may have been a brat, but LMJ's STBXW is downright *evil*. 

So stop stewing about this because you now have the rest of your life ahead of you.


----------



## TroyN

Just want to thank all the people who helped me out on this thread. It's been awhile but I'm out of the fog.

I want to quickly give everyone a quick update.

1. I'm still going strong with my new girl. She is amazing, and everything I hoped for in relationship. For those struggling, there is hope and things do get better. My new girl showers me with praise, our sex life is amazing, and she beautiful to boot. My parents and my brother all seem to approve of her. They love having her around. 

2. I also got a new job and make a lot more money. I've also relocated to a new town, so I'll never see my ex-wife again, thankfully. I should write about this experience...maybe another time.

3. My ex-wife is now married to the guy she was with while we were technically still married, and she is now pregnant. This was hard to hear about at first, but I need to remind myself that she was an awful person who wouldn't have been a good partner to raise a child with anyways. I pity the OM who knocked her up that quickly after their marriage. 

Otherwise, I couldn't be happier. My woman and I are going to Cabo San Lucas in October...we need to the getaway.

I hope everyone is doing well.


----------



## GusPolinski

TroyN said:


> Just want to thank all the people who helped me out on this thread. It's been awhile but I'm out of the fog.
> 
> I want to quickly give everyone a quick update.
> 
> 1. I'm still going strong with my new girl. She is amazing, and everything I hoped for in relationship. For those struggling, there is hope and things do get better. My new girl showers me with praise, our sex life is amazing, and she beautiful to boot. My parents and my brother all seem to approve of her. They love having her around.
> 
> 2. I also got a new job and make a lot more money. I've also relocated to a new town, so I'll never see my ex-wife again, thankfully. I should write about this experience...maybe another time.
> 
> 3. My ex-wife is now married to the guy she was with while we were technically still married, and she is now pregnant. This was hard to hear about at first, but I need to remind myself that she was an awful person who wouldn't have been a good partner to raise a child with anyways. I pity the OM who knocked her up that quickly after their marriage.
> 
> Otherwise, I couldn't be happier. My woman and I are going to Cabo San Lucas in October...we need to the getaway.
> 
> I hope everyone is doing well.


Great news!

And don't worry about either your ex or her timetable for ruining her own life, her new sucker's life, or the life of what I'm sure will turn out to be an absolutely horrible child.

Onward and upward!


----------



## terrence4159

Ohhhh go fishing while you are in cabo.....I take my dad down there every year. Fishing is amazing that time if year....big blue marlin start moving in around that time.


----------



## bandit.45

TroyN said:


> I pity the OM who knocked her up that quickly after their marriage.



We all pity him.


----------



## Clay2013

TroyN said:


> Just want to thank all the people who helped me out on this thread. It's been awhile but I'm out of the fog.
> 
> I want to quickly give everyone a quick update.
> 
> 1. I'm still going strong with my new girl. She is amazing, and everything I hoped for in relationship. For those struggling, there is hope and things do get better. My new girl showers me with praise, our sex life is amazing, and she beautiful to boot. My parents and my brother all seem to approve of her. They love having her around.
> 
> 2. I also got a new job and make a lot more money. I've also relocated to a new town, so I'll never see my ex-wife again, thankfully. I should write about this experience...maybe another time.
> 
> 3. My ex-wife is now married to the guy she was with while we were technically still married, and she is now pregnant. This was hard to hear about at first, but I need to remind myself that she was an awful person who wouldn't have been a good partner to raise a child with anyways. I pity the OM who knocked her up that quickly after their marriage.
> 
> Otherwise, I couldn't be happier. My woman and I are going to Cabo San Lucas in October...we need to the getaway.
> 
> I hope everyone is doing well.


That is great news. The OM is going to love being with her. It will be his turn soon lol.

UM we just looked up pricing on Cabo San Lucas tickets last night lol. 

My boss has a timeshare there. He goes every year. Your going to love it. 

C


----------



## workindad

Troy, thanks for a great update. Glad you are doing well and that you are in a healthy relationship.

Enjoy the trip
WD


----------



## TroyN

workindad said:


> Glad you are doing well and that you are in a healthy relationship.


Thanks, me too. It's a been a long road.


----------



## happyman64

TroyN said:


> Thanks, me too. It's a been a long road.


But often the best road to get where you want to go to.

:grin2:


----------



## TroyN

I will also add one anecdote - hope I'm dragging this out too much...but 33 pages probably says otherwise.

A few months back, maybe late February, my ex-wife saw me with my new girl at a restaurant/cafe place. It looked like she was picking up something to take home, but she was by herself. She saw me and gave me a polite "hey Troy". 

A few months after that, in May I think, her wedding photo appeared as her profile pic and she had gained a lot more weight since the cafe run-in. So, a rather arrogant part of me thinks/or hopes that she ate her sorrows away after seeing me with a woman a lot prettier than her....but the reality is that I'm done with her which is a great blessing and she'll always be someone elses problem.


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## weightlifter

1) Most of us love seeing people on the upswing.
2) KEEP coming back to update.
3) You may be a future "BFF" thread we use. Crash-burn-rise again


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## LongWalk

TroyN said:


> I think my wife MIGHT be having affair…she’s asleep right now and I’m looking for some thoughts...
> 
> So here’s my story and few things that have happened to me in my brief marriage.
> 
> Met my wife three years ago, instant mutual attraction, off the charts sex, and we were engaged 10 months later. She is 27, I’m 30. Wonderful wedding day, good honeymoon - but immediately afterwards things went sour and I’m not sure why. We are approaching the third year of marriage.
> 
> Some notes:
> 
> 1. I worked a lot of long hours in our first year of marriage. Like 10-12 hour days. She did not like this, but I was a manager and we working against some tight deadlines.
> 
> 2. After the honeymoon was over, it took us three months to have sex again. Then another two months afterwards to have sex again.
> 
> 3. After our first year of marriage, she gained a ton of weight, at least 35 lbs. She has been seeing a counselor, and has been on Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. She was on another drug that I forget the name of. She has went through bouts of depression her entire life.
> 
> 4. I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer.
> 
> 5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.
> 
> 6. We went on a trip for our second anniversary and she refused to sleep with me, and she gave me a dirty look when I tried to initiate sex. I would say that we maybe have had sex 10-15 times in our entire marriage (2 years, 9 months total)
> 
> 7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.
> 
> 8. This past December, we went to her companies Holiday party together and her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.
> 
> 9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women.
> 
> 10. We are in marriage counseling. Our marriage counselor once asked her if she thought would be OK if I had my needs met by another woman. She really didn’t have a response.
> 
> 11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.
> 
> Obviously, my marriage is in shambles, I have been thinking about divorce since Christmas. But I love this woman so much…I just feel like something is up.
> 
> Thoughts?


Memorable first post. Thank the stars you free of her.


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## Forest

TroyN said:


> A few months after that, in May I think, her wedding photo appeared as her profile pic and she had gained a lot more weight since the cafe run-in.


Welcome to real life, you cheating heifer.

She's probably most upset she can't blame you for getting fat.


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## Ceegee

Forest said:


> Welcome to real life, you cheating heifer.
> 
> 
> 
> She's probably most upset she can't blame you for getting fat.



Yes she can. 

She'll find a way. 

They always find a way.


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## 3putt

Ceegee said:


> Yes she can.
> 
> She'll find a way.
> 
> They always find a way.


QFT!!


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## Marduk

TroyN said:


> I will also add one anecdote - hope I'm dragging this out too much...but 33 pages probably says otherwise.
> 
> A few months back, maybe late February, my ex-wife saw me with my new girl at a restaurant/cafe place. It looked like she was picking up something to take home, but she was by herself. She saw me and gave me a polite "hey Troy".
> 
> A few months after that, in May I think, her wedding photo appeared as her profile pic and she had gained a lot more weight since the cafe run-in. So, a rather arrogant part of me thinks/or hopes that she ate her sorrows away after seeing me with a woman a lot prettier than her....but the reality is that I'm done with her which is a great blessing and she'll always be someone elses problem.


Karma is what it is.

You're doing great, man.


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## weightlifter

In the end. Wasnt this one a no PA thread?


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## TroyN

weightlifter said:


> In the end. Wasnt this one a no PA thread?


I will never know, I will never get the answers either. 

To recap it, we all worked for the same company in 2007. He arrived in 2005, I was there in 2006, she was there in 2007. I left in 2008. He apparently had a girlfriend around the time we were married, but I'm not sure what happened there. 

They were in pretty close proximity of each other for a long time. He got promoted to manager in 2011, and with her working in HR, she had to go out on recruiting trips and jobs fairs and I'm pretty sure he tagged along on some of those business trips with her. 

Things aren't going well between us, he's making great money and she's materialistic, you can see what is happening here. However, I'll never really know the true extent of what happened because I found out *AFTER* I had moved out of our house. *She told me nothing.*

I guess I don't really know where to place the blame. Is it on her for not being a faithful, supportive wife? Or is it on him, for interfering with a marriage on the rocks? 

I'm just glad she's gone.


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## Ceegee

TroyN said:


> I guess I don't really know where to place the blame. Is it on her for not being a faithful, supportive wife? Or is it on him, for interfering with a marriage on the rocks?
> 
> 
> 
> I'm just glad she's gone.



That's easy. You blame her. 

She is the one that made the commitment to you. Not him.


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## Augusto

TroyN said:


> I think my wife MIGHT be having affair…she’s asleep right now and I’m looking for some thoughts...
> 
> So here’s my story and few things that have happened to me in my brief marriage.
> 
> Met my wife three years ago, instant mutual attraction, off the charts sex, and we were engaged 10 months later. She is 27, I’m 30. Wonderful wedding day, good honeymoon - but immediately afterwards things went sour and I’m not sure why. We are approaching the third year of marriage.
> 
> Some notes:
> 
> 1. I worked a lot of long hours in our first year of marriage. Like 10-12 hour days. She did not like this, but I was a manager and we working against some tight deadlines.
> 
> 2. After the honeymoon was over, it took us three months to have sex again. Then another two months afterwards to have sex again.
> 
> 3. After our first year of marriage, she gained a ton of weight, at least 35 lbs. She has been seeing a counselor, and has been on Strattera, Lamictal, and Cymbalta. She was on another drug that I forget the name of. She has went through bouts of depression her entire life.
> 
> 4. I am getting yelled at, ALL THE TIME. I will be sitting watching TV with her, and she will start picking a fight with me for no real reason. She picks on me for being too thin and it’s ruining myself esteem. I asked if she thought I was good looking and she did not answer.
> 
> 5. I am often told that I do not make enough money. She works at a company where a lot of guys are making great money and she has to travel for her job, so she is around other men a lot. I make a decent living, but we are not rich.
> 
> 6. We went on a trip for our second anniversary and she refused to sleep with me, and she gave me a dirty look when I tried to initiate sex. I would say that we maybe have had sex 10-15 times in our entire marriage (2 years, 9 months total)
> 
> 7. She does not like to be hugged by me at all. I tried kissing her on the cheek the other morning prior to us leaving for work and she winced.
> 
> 8. This past December, we went to her companies Holiday party together and her co-workers were acting kind of weird around me. They would stare at me for a long time and look confused, and look away. Maybe I’m being too paranoid.
> 
> 9. She talks, at least once a week, about her female co-workers flirting with other guys in the office. Married men going out to lunch with married women.
> 
> 10. We are in marriage counseling. Our marriage counselor once asked her if she thought would be OK if I had my needs met by another woman. She really didn’t have a response.
> 
> 11. My wife seems to have no friends, except her mom. She seems to get home everyday at 5:15pm. So, if she is with someone, it’s on her lunch breaks ONLY. She doesn’t leave my sight during the weekends.
> 
> Obviously, my marriage is in shambles, I have been thinking about divorce since Christmas. But I love this woman so much…I just feel like something is up.
> 
> Thoughts?


No kids?....keep it that way. At the rate you are headed.....no love in the home.


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## DayOne

Augusto said:


> No kids?....keep it that way. At the rate you are headed.....no love in the home.


Get tired after reading the first post? Or just too lazy to find out what happened in the 18 months since then?


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## eastsouth2000

since you've been going to the gym, have you posted your beach bod on your facebook or social media.


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