# A Good Marriage



## Kitt

I have often said that being married to my spouse has been the easiest thing I've ever done. It is my easiest relationship and my easiest commitment. I've been told by numerous people this can't possibly be true since marriage only has a fifty percent success rate, or whatever the rate is today. I suppose I am a special snowflake but I don't think that is it....how has your marriage been overall if you have been together ten or more years? Has it been harder than your other relationships? Do you still respect your spouse? Do you stay for the kids? I thought it would be good for young married people to see some of the stuff that comes up so they can be prepared.

For me, the single biggest challenge has been learning how to be an authentic, well rounded person....independent and in pursuit of my own hopes and dreams. I could have easily given my entire self to him, but I'm glad that we both have worked to be interesting people with our own stories. We have upheld our sense of selves while also being interconnected. I know where he begins and I stop. I like that I learn something new about him and that he has his own friends and interests outside of me. I have more to share with him than if I only concentrated on him. 

Please feel free to share your challenges and successes.


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## SecondTime'Round

I think this is a great thread. I wonder if my marriage would have turned out differently if I'd took "advice" like this seriously at age 22 (20 years ago). We did have 12 weeks of pre-marital counseling, but we still ended in catastrophe.


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## Kitt

SecondTime'Round said:


> I think this is a great thread. I wonder if my marriage would have turned out differently if I'd took "advice" like this seriously at age 22 (20 years ago). We did have 12 weeks of pre-marital counseling, but we still ended in catastrophe.


Thank you. That is a good question. You know, I think it really has to do with intention. I like to think, though some here have odd agendas, that this forum being about differing aspects of marriage that the intention is to have ones that are good for both people. Sometimes I think even with the best intentions, two people have so much internal conflicts and ego conflicts that they just can't receive advice at the moment it is given. I'm sure now you would receive it differently.


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## Kitt

I was also thinking people could add things to affair proof their marriage too since a good marriage thread doesn't seem to peak interest.


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## meson

We've been married for over 25 years and the majority of it has been really good. For a few years we drifted apart but we never lost resect for each other. We worked through communication issues and our marriage has been great ever since. 

My other relationships pale by comparison. We each had had a major relationship prior to ours that involved infidelity and as a result we had both grown to know who we were and what we wanted out of marriage. Even though our romance was swift we really did explore if we were actually suitable for one another. 

Ironically during the time we drifted apart I had not been doing some of the things I enjoyed most and when I got back into them I was more fulfilled and I became more of the person she married again.

The best way to affair proof your marriage is to never stop investing in your relationship. Communication was the key for us because then we could address needs that were unmet instead of letting them fester. Transparency and good boundaries are essential for this as well. Because our relationship was so strong it was able to survive the start of an EA on my part.

We are now working towards the next phase of our lives being empty nesters. We have connected with a new hobby which is keeping us involved and happy.


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## Married but Happy

My first marriage was very difficult, as we really weren't compatible. This one is incredibly easy - there's no effort involved for either of us (except very rarely when we disagree). We brought the same attitudes to our former marriages, but they weren't reciprocated.


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## tech-novelist

We have been together for almost 20 years, and married for 18.
Is it the easiest thing I've ever done? No, it does take work.
However, it is one of the *best* things I've ever done.
I will say that if I didn't know what I do about the differences between men and women, it wouldn't be nearly as good at this point as it is...


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## Kitt

technovelist said:


> We have been together for almost 20 years, and married for 18.
> Is it the easiest thing I've ever done? No, it does take work.
> However, it is one of the *best* things I've ever done.
> I will say that if I didn't know what I do about the differences between men and women, it wouldn't be nearly as good at this point as it is...


What are some examples of these differences? How does this make a good marriage? Thanks for expounding.


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## tech-novelist

Kitt said:


> What are some examples of these differences? How does this make a good marriage? Thanks for expounding.


This is probably going to stir up some controversy, but here goes.

My wife sometimes gets upset about seemingly unimportant issues, usually with contradictory complaints about the same event. For example, we had a guest over this past weekend, and she complained that we didn't include her in our discussions. So I said, "We didn't exclude you", to which she answered "You were discussing things I'm not interested in". So I said "You are interested in cosmology", to which she answered "I didn't have anything to contribute". Then when he suggested interrupting her phone call to her sister, which is something she does every Saturday, I told him not to. She said, "I didn't want to be interrupted but at least he was trying to include me".

So basically, whatever I did was wrong.

I could have said "Yes, dear, whatever you say".

But that would have been the wrong response. I know that women have an instinctual need to test their men to make sure they are strong enough to protect them (the women), and acting wimpy would NOT make her feel any better, but just get her madder.

So instead, I said "That doesn't make sense" and explained why. I refused to accept blame for not being able to read her mind, and pointed out that her criticism was self-contradictory. She didn't like it much, but I stood my ground and there was no negative fallout later.


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## Kitt

technovelist said:


> This is probably going to stir up some controversy, but here goes.
> 
> My wife sometimes gets upset about seemingly unimportant issues, usually with contradictory complaints about the same event. For example, we had a guest over this past weekend, and she complained that we didn't include her in our discussions. So I said, "We didn't exclude you", to which she answered "You were discussing things I'm not interested in". So I said "You are interested in cosmology", to which she answered "I didn't have anything to contribute". Then when he suggested interrupting her phone call to her sister, which is something she does every Saturday, I told him not to. She said, "I didn't want to be interrupted but at least he was trying to include me".
> 
> So basically, whatever I did was wrong.
> 
> I could have said "Yes, dear, whatever you say".
> 
> But that would have been the wrong response. I know that women have an instinctual need to test their men to make sure they are strong enough to protect them (the women), and acting wimpy would NOT make her feel any better, but just get her madder.
> 
> So instead, I said "That doesn't make sense" and explained why. I refused to accept blame for not being able to read her mind, and pointed out that her criticism was self-contradictory. She didn't like it much, but I stood my ground and there was no negative fallout later.


We do not need you to protect us anymore. This is not the practice or expectation anymore. There is no controversy because most grown women make it throughout their day without a man. Please get an education or hang around grown women or stay completely away from them if you are MRA. Your personal experience is about communication and your disrespect and sexism issues, not gender issues. Thanks.


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## Betrayedone

Kitt said:


> We do not need you to protect us anymore. This is not the practice or expectation anymore. There is no controversy because most grown women make it throughout their day without a man. Please get an education or hang around grown women or stay completely away from them if you are MRA. Your personal experience is about communication and your disrespect and sexism issues, not gender issues. Thanks.


......you sound like a real peach....always negative


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## tech-novelist

Kitt said:


> We do not need you to protect us anymore. This is not the practice or expectation anymore. There is no controversy because most grown women make it throughout their day without a man. Please get an education or hang around grown women or stay completely away from them if you are MRA. Your personal experience is about communication and your disrespect and sexism issues, not gender issues. Thanks.


Women who don't want a man around are of course welcome to that situation. However, those who do want a man around have to deal with intersexual issues, as do the men in question.

In my case, I already have gotten my education and we have been happily married for almost 20 years.

Hope that helps.


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## Lila

I've been married to my H for 16 years and been with him for 20 years. Overall, we've had a good marriage with many good attributes. The issues we've experienced were few and far between.

Two things that have really helped us in our journey is our mutual respect towards each other and the ability to compromise. We're both intelligent adults capable of communicating our desires, wants, and needs. We don't disrespect or brush each other off by assuming our behavior is somehow attributable to male/female stereotypes. We have also chosen not to have a traditional marriage which means "leadership" is fluid and topic/issue specific. Neither one of us tries to force our desires and expectations on each other. We discuss things, make our arguments for or against, and if we can't come to 100% agreement we compromise. It sounds a lot more complicated on paper than it is in real life. We've established a "Need" and "Want" strategy to issues. A want is something that would be appreciated but not necessary for the continued success of the relationship. A need is a must have. For example, "I want you to help me with dinner tonight" - it would be appreciated but if H is busy with something else, I'm okay with making dinner on my own - vs. "I need you to listen to me" - Dude, this is freaking important to me so pay attention.

Overall though, the most important factor I credit with our success is that we did it our way. In other words, we've never tried to meet other people's accepted standard. We feel that our way of maintaining the relationship is perfect for us and as long as it's working, we're going to continue to march to the beat of our own drum.


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## Yeswecan

My W and I have been married for 21 years. It has had it's bump in the roads. The bumps though were created by me for not completely being in the marriage. In other words, I had the finances covered. I had the good dad covered. But the third thing was bungled by me. That was keep on dating and romancing my W. She was vocal about it and keep on course praying I would "get it". I finally did. The marriage is now full circle, familiar and wonderful. 

The lesson here is always keep dating each other, connect and stay connected. Make each other first always. Many will say kids first. What I find is spouses first make for a happy home and kids will follow. Kids need stability. If the marriage is not stable it resonates through the home. Never lose sight of each other due to day to day grind. Always keep each other first. Always spend many many hours together each week.


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## DayOne

I have heard that regular BJ's on every.single.holiday help...


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## Yeswecan

DayOne said:


> I have heard that regular BJ's on every.single.holiday help...


Let us know how that works out for you.


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## DayOne

Yeswecan said:


> Let us know how that works out for you.


Injoke, YWC. You had to have been there.


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## happy as a clam

Kitt said:


> *We do not need you to protect us anymore. *This is not the practice or expectation anymore. There is no controversy because most grown women make it throughout their day without a man. *Please get an education* or hang around grown women or stay completely away from them if you are MRA. Your personal experience is about communication and your disrespect and sexism issues, not gender issues. Thanks.


WTH??? Seriously?

Totally confused by this response. 

tech, I appreciate your response.


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## FeministInPink

Kitt said:


> technovelist said:
> 
> 
> 
> This is probably going to stir up some controversy, but here goes.
> 
> My wife sometimes gets upset about seemingly unimportant issues, usually with contradictory complaints about the same event. For example, we had a guest over this past weekend, and she complained that we didn't include her in our discussions. So I said, "We didn't exclude you", to which she answered "You were discussing things I'm not interested in". So I said "You are interested in cosmology", to which she answered "I didn't have anything to contribute". Then when he suggested interrupting her phone call to her sister, which is something she does every Saturday, I told him not to. She said, "I didn't want to be interrupted but at least he was trying to include me".
> 
> So basically, whatever I did was wrong.
> 
> I could have said "Yes, dear, whatever you say".
> 
> But that would have been the wrong response. I know that women have an instinctual need to test their men to make sure they are strong enough to protect them (the women), and acting wimpy would NOT make her feel any better, but just get her madder.
> 
> So instead, I said "That doesn't make sense" and explained why. I refused to accept blame for not being able to read her mind, and pointed out that her criticism was self-contradictory. She didn't like it much, but I stood my ground and there was no negative fallout later.
> 
> 
> 
> We do not need you to protect us anymore. This is not the practice or expectation anymore. There is no controversy because most grown women make it throughout their day without a man. Please get an education or hang around grown women or stay completely away from them if you are MRA. Your personal experience is about communication and your disrespect and sexism issues, not gender issues. Thanks.
Click to expand...

 @Kitt--you completely missed the point of technovelist's comment.


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## Bugged

I think Kitt was banned??
I agree with her anyway...excluding someone from a conversation talking about things completely alien to them is flat out rude...one doesn t need to read minds but only have manners...I also agree concepts like women want men to protect them is archaic..physical strenght doesn t matter much anymore thanks to machines (weapons are machines)..the old adagio women are irrational is trite and boring...


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## tech-novelist

happy as a clam said:


> WTH??? Seriously?
> 
> Totally confused by this response.
> 
> tech, I appreciate your response.


Thank you.


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## FeministInPink

Oh, Kitt IS banned, but who knows if it is temporary or not?

The point is that technovelist DIDN'T exclude his wife, she excluded herself; the topic WAS one that his wife was knowledgeable about, and she chose not to participate, but then blamed him for excluding her. He asked their guest NOT to interrupt his wife's call with the sister, out of respect for her, and again she blamed him for excluding her.

The point of technovelist's posts is that he maintains reasonable, firm boundaries with his wife, because he has respect for himself. It's not about showing that he's strong enough to protect her, it's showing that he's a strong, confident person in general, and deserving of respect. It isn't about him showing her that, "Grr! I am the man and I am in charge!" It's about him showing that we are equals and individuals each responsible for themselves.

Some may take issue with "_women have an instinctual need to test their men to make sure they are strong enough to protect them (the women)_." Maybe we don't NEED men to protect US anymore, but if we have offspring, I sure as hell would want to know that he can protect them. I don't want a man who is going to roll over like a dog and let me boss him around all the time, because it sucks having to be the only grown up in a relationship and the only one to take any responsibility, and because I want a PARTNER, not an indentured servant. And sometimes I'm wrong. I need someone to call me on my sh!t--but I'm also gonna call him on his, because nobody's perfect 100% of the time.


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## Mr. Nail

DayOne said:


> Injoke, YWC. You had to have been there.


Oh yes I was there, and have a fresh new secondary anal orifice to show for it. I find your baiting of Kitt to be in poor taste, especially as she has to suffer it in imposed silence. 

Kitt is a very new member here but she is no blushing teen. She has a unique set of experiences that may prove to be valuable to the group. Something triggered her and she is learning how to better control her temper.
MN


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## Betrayedone

........doesn't play well with others.........


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## FeministInPink

Bugged said:


> @FeministInPink if you can't see how condescending the tone of this post is...You should probably change your username >


Ha ha, I was more interested in the point of technovelist's post, not his tone. I can see how the tone might be perceived as condescending.

But I tend to overlook perception of tone when reading posts... most people are not professional writers, and so tone is frequently mis-communicated and mis-read in things like emails and comment thread. So I don't put too much stock into the "tone" of posts here on TAM. After all, how much of that "tone" is the writer, and how much is really a reflection of me and my state of mind at the time of reading? 

In regards to technovelist's post, it would be easy for his tone to overshadow the point he was trying to make.


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## FeministInPink

Bugged said:


> The point he was trying to make is that women are irrational beings and men must have the strenght to put up with their nonsense...>


Actually, I don't think that was his point. He certainly portrayed his wife as irrational in this anecdote, so it may have been a poor example to make his point.


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## tech-novelist

FeministInPink said:


> Actually, I don't think that was his point. He certainly portrayed his wife as irrational in this anecdote, so it may have been a poor example to make his point.


My wife is usually quite rational; in fact, she is an INTJ, which is one of the most highly rational MBTI types.

But even as rational as she is, she is still a woman, and thus I have to expect silly behavior common to most (if not all) women on occasion. The question is how I deal with such events, and I believe that part of the reason my marriage is good is that I deal with them effectively.


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## Maricha75

technovelist said:


> My wife is usually quite rational; in fact, she is an INTJ, which is one of the most highly rational MBTI types.
> 
> But even as rational as she is, she is still a woman, and thus I have to expect silly behavior common to most (if not all) women on occasion. The question is how I deal with such events, and I believe that part of the reason my marriage is good is that I deal with them effectively.


FWIW, tech, I didn't see what was so horrible about your post. In fact, while Bugged stressed the "unimportant", I read the "seemingly" as the stressed part... like, it didn't seem important, but she SEEMED to feel it was, even if how she explained it made no sense at all (her reasoning made no sense to me, either).


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## tech-novelist

Maricha75 said:


> FWIW, tech, I didn't see what was so horrible about your post. In fact, while Bugged stressed the "unimportant", I read the "seemingly" as the stressed part... like, it didn't seem important, but she SEEMED to feel it was, even if how she explained it made no sense at all (her reasoning made no sense to me, either).


Thank you. I'm happy to see that someone is understanding what I'm trying to convey!


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## SimplyAmorous

Raising my hand to also say.. didn't see anything wrong with your post Technovelist.. she could have jumped into the conversation .... I don't really get it. It didn't sound like you or the guest snubbed her.. did you? 

Look ...I am MORE EMOTIONAL over my Husband ..It doesn't offend me when men suggest such things.. I see it play out that way in my own marriage.. (example below)...

On temperament tests... I am more of a THINKER/Logical over a FEELER in comparison to him ...I teeter in the middle... he is always a FEELER ...(just as Technovelist's wife is a INTJ...*T* for thinking/ logical)

..but I'm still a woman! 

When I get out of hand.. one thing good is.. if he calls me out - tells me I am being a bi*ch.. (Oh it's rare but it's happened)...I'll AGREE WITH HIM...on the spot ! 

We have a funny way.. if I get too pushy, a little bossy (gotta watch that!).. he will throw out the







to me.. he knows I HATE THAT.... as I do Care how he feels... I WANT US ON THE SAME PAGE, or I am bothered.. I'll give him a look, then go over...lightly pound on his chest saying ..."NO...NO... don't say that - darn it!"...he'll grab me.. and we'll banter it out a little.. *I want him to feel Respected.. he has earned it & then some!! *

I think so highly of my husband...that I KNOW if he has an opinion of me PUSHING LIMITS.. well.. I darn well AM ...and I better adjust my attitude! 

We have been together since dirt / he taught me to drive at age 16, he's always been there...through it all....he's brightened my life & has had more of a good influence on me & my outlook over any other...

I've always found being with him "easy".. "free flowing"... my comfort... my ROCK.... I love having a man beside me...he's the Best friend I've ever had... 

This past week.. we had a "stressed for time" situation .. getting ready for a family Vacation...(9 of us.. 6 hr drive)... could be the last time we all get together with 2nd son going off to college....planned on taking our Suburban (9 seat belts).. we haven't had it too long...been running perfectly...anyway..

He gets up to go to work on Sat morning... NO BRAKES...







we are leaving 5 am Monday.... he only had THAT NIGHT to change the brake line.. (he worked Sunday too).... *#1* no one is open but the airport to rent a car ... *#2 *would've had to rent one of those 12 seater vans, very hard to come by.. price for 4 days with collision $1,400! (I called)... 

Of course it had to start raining too... then while under there, it seemed we had a bad Transmission leak ... at this point.. I am freaking out.. (ME.. the woman, getting Emotional !)... telling him I am so sorry .... I should have rented a car...da** it ....I was FLUSTERED.. he was having difficulty with the brake line...having to run back to the store, had the wrong size, modifying things.. I just wanted to cancel the trip.. I started to cry.. too nervous about taking our 2 older cars, what if one of those broke down.. a minivan is too small for us......I was feeling so bad for him -all this work.. pressured for time....then we'd loose money...maybe a lot.. bla bla bla.... 

My dear husband.. I walk in the house, calling the resort .... telling them the "pickle" we're in with this many people & getting there....he comes in after me.. he doesn't want that... we'll make it work...the kids are looking forward to it.. if it takes him all night.. whatever... he just wouldn't let me do that -we were going! 

His love for the family, putting us FIRST.. it's ALWAYS ALWAYS been his way.. he worked on that from the moment he got home till 10:30 that night ...rolling out from under the car, had the wrong size line, back to the auto parts store.. mishaps here & there .. I was there with the umbrella..we were a sight... but he got it done ! And we made that trip.. had a wonderful time. 

That's my husband ! I felt this overwhelming *admiration* for him while he was laying under that truck, brake fluid squirting all over him.. for his determination, his attitude....his sheer will...*never complained*.. BUT I DID ! God bless him for putting up with me !!.... See I am the emotional woman.. 

I get more stressed /antsy when things go wrong... he is / has always been ...my calm breeze ...he always makes it right..


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## tech-novelist

SimplyAmorous said:


> Raising my hand to also say.. didn't see anything wrong with your post Technovelist.. she could have jumped into the conversation .... I don't really get it. It didn't sound like you or the guest snubbed her.. did you?


No, and she didn't claim that we did, just that we "excluded" her by discussing things that included at least one topic that she normally is interested in but didn't want to discuss at that moment.


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## FeministInPink

You can't expect people to be banned just because they write a comment you don't agree with. Free speech, man. Users are free to post their opinions, albeit in a respectful manner, and others are free to agree or disagree with them. 

Clearly, some TAMers appreciate technovelist's viewpoint, some do not. The same freedom that allows him to express his opinion is the same freedom that allows you to voice your dissent. 

You can't demand that someone be banned simply because they post something you disagree with. If a TAMer is abusive or bullying of other TAMers, if s/he posts graphic/explicit material, if s/he is trolling, etc, that is all basis for banning.

Feel free to review the forum posting guidelines if you need a refresher:
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/forum-guidelines/2-posting-guidelines-forum-rules.html

You may not agree with what technovelist posted, but he also hasn't posted anything that would warrant banning. So I would suggest that you drop it.


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## ConanHub

I think most women act a little silly on occasions. 

I know most men have silly idiosyncrasies that good wives learn how to navigate.

I think the best marriages happen when men and women learn the differences in each other.

I don't take being called silly on occasion as an insult.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ConanHub

Bugged said:


> FeministInPink
> Are you kidding me?
> First of all, you should really change your username.
> Second..substitute the word 'women' with 'black people' or 'gay people' and then tell me that ANYONE who would say something like that wouldn't be violating the forum rules.


You should start a thread. I am friends with a few gay folks, men, and they act silly more than occasionally. They admit it. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SimplyAmorous

Bugged said:


> you should be banned, not Kitt. *How DARE you*?
> 
> You can say people act silly on occasion but making that a gender issue..is *REVOLTING*.
> You are *SHAMEFUL*.


I kinda look at it this way.... Men get in a MOOD too sometimes.. and many a woman will say "MEN!!!...and add "___________".. (you can fill in your own blanks).. rarely would a Man care or make a deal out of it.... cause men are wonderful LIKE THAT !! 

Like not listening or seems they always want Sex.... just as women can have PMS ...and get overly emotional at times ... (







>> *not all women !*.. do we really need a disclaimer for every sentence we type... so it doesn't cause outrage?? 

Pulling into a Supermarket hrs ago... we heard some women yelling "What the F*** are you waiting for!!!"... Everyone in our car was like "WHOOOAAAA!!"... feeling bad to whom she was yelling at (Heck it's Fathers day!)..... I didn't see her -only heard it...was assuming she was yelling at her H or BF.. but I guess she was hanging out the window yelling at the car in front of her.. (a guy -- I don't know)...

It was so obnoxious.. yet you couldn't help but LAUGH .... Husband was commenting that's why men don't want to get married.. "Who'd want to marry that!.. then he said.. "Who needs to go to hell, whoever is married to that is already there !".. we're busting up...so was our daughter...

Oh goodness.. if we can't acknowledge that our own gender royally gets out of hand sometimes.. Please get me a ROOM [email protected]#$ ... Women F*** up too... we have our moments...if you never do... then God BLess you. your husband is a LUCKY MAN... But come on.. we all know some in our own gender can "loose it" sometimes.. 

Hopefully on both sides of the aisle.. we can laugh about these things.. like @ConanHub attitude.. "so what if you call me silly!"...I AM... It's all good ! 

We all have Bad moments.. who is immune here ??.... it helps tremendously if we apologize afterwards.. myself & husband always do this... it's like it's washed in the ocean...this goes a long way. :smile2:


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## Maricha75

Well, Bugged, the part you quoted also says to treat others with dignity and respect. I have seen numerous posts from you which gave done the opposite. I'd say that makes you as guilty. JMO

You seem to have a lot of anger pent up. And, it seems to be directed mostly at men. I saw nothing wrong with tech's post. In fact, I actually laughed a little at the part you find so *REVOLTING *. I found it amusing. Why? Because most of the women I do know ARE, in fact, like that. And I could easily substitute men, gay people... pick one. And I know others in each group. Lighten up, girl. Damn.


Bugged said:


> He's stating that women act silly BECAUSE they're women..he's not saying PEOPLE act silly on occasions (arguable)so since she' a human she acts silly ..he's saying that* SINCE she's a woman **she' s expected to act silly*.
> 
> 
> 
> Do you think I'm stupid or what?


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## Maricha75

Bugged said:


> really? Find them and share them. I'll be here waiting...>
> 
> 
> 
> really? Find these posts and share them. I'll be here waiting...>


Anyone who wishes to check SecondTimeRound's thread regarding surnames would certainly see what I mean. But, they really don't even have to go there. All they have to do is look at how you have blasted @technovelist for his observation of a situation with his wife.

You have found sexism in almost every post in just these two threads thus far. And, those of us who see no issue with the ones who you are calling out, obviously, we have a problem. 





Bugged said:


> your problem>


I don't see it as a problem. 



Bugged said:


> really...it's really sad..you should choose your acquaintances better.I cant' stand people that act silly and I don't know a lot of them, thankfully...I mean anyone that's over 20...:surprise:


Oh, so now the condescending tone toward a woman. That's ok. I don't mind. There's nothing wrong with being silly at any age. It's a matter of knowing when it is or is not appropriate. In fsct, one such time was at the elementary school my children attend. The principal, age 35, let the children throw pies in his face. This was a reward for one of their fund raisers. He had so much fun, and was EXCEPTIONALLY silly. The other adults enjoyed it as well. That's my point. There is a time and a place to act silly. And to limit it to under the age of 20 would be rather dull. Even my 65 year old dad acts silly at times. I wouldn't have it any other way. There is nothing wrong with those I choose to spend time with. They know when to be serious and when to be silly. Thank you for your concern, though. I will give it the consideration I feel it deserves.


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## Maricha75

Bugged said:


> you're just a stalker.
> I'll put you on my ignore list.


A stalker? LMAO! No, I commented on a thread, two threads in fact, that you happen to be lambasting men in. But I am a stalker. Hahahahaha :rofl:

Ignore me... like that is supposed to upset me? :scratchhead: ok, then.


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## tech-novelist

Maricha75 said:


> A stalker? LMAO! No, I commented on a thread, two threads in fact, that you happen to be lambasting men in. But I am a stalker. Hahahahaha :rofl:
> 
> Ignore me... like that is supposed to upset me? :scratchhead: ok, then.


Can I get her to ignore me too? What's your secret? :smile2:


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## FeministInPink

Bugged said:


> FeministInPink
> Are you kidding me?
> First of all, you should really change your username.
> Second..substitute the word 'women' with 'black people' or 'gay people' and then tell me that ANYONE who would say something like that wouldn't be violating the forum rules.


Why? Because I am not a militant FemiNazi? Because I don't see sexism every post by a male TAMer? Who are you to take away my feminist card? If I choose to self-identify as a feminist, that's up to me and not you.

I am well-aware that there is systemic sexism in our society. It isn't all going to go away overnight. I pick and choose my battles, because one can't be on the defensive or attacking all the time. It's no way to live. And really, we're all just trying to understand one another. That's it. And I have no qualms about that. But you're getting all up in arms over _semantics in a chat room_.

Why are you so angry? From what I can tell, you spit fire at every poster on TAM who dares disagree with you. You're not open to civilized debate, you're on the attack all the time. Why? 

If you want to have some real fun and attack some TAMers for sexism and the like, go on over the the Men's Clubhouse and have at it. I'm sure you'll be very popular.


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## Maricha75

technovelist said:


> Can I get her to ignore me too? What's your secret? :smile2:


Idk, tech. All I did is call her out for calling others out. And actually having fresh reproaches from her own fingertips as proof. I have a fairly good memory, so it wasn't hard to find/remember what was posted in just the two threads. Like I said, idk what the secret is.


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## T&T

Bugged said:


> I cant' stand people that act silly and I don't know a lot of them, thankfully...I mean anyone that's over 20...:surprise:


Bugged,

What's wrong with acting silly? My wife does all the time (and she happens to be a woman) and it's one of the reasons I'm so attracted to her. She reminds me not to be "Mr. serious" all the time. 

She's taught me a LOT about just having fun and forgetting about the daily grind, which was a large weight on my shoulders being the sole bread winner most of our marriage...Being silly is pure fun! :grin2:

Occasionally, doing stupid sh*t is fun too. 0


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## T&T

Bugged said:


> this has got nothing to do with the following..sorry guys..distractions don't work


I was asking you why you thought people over 20 shouldn't act silly. Why do you feel that way?

It was an honest question and not an attempted distraction. I have no fight in this...


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## FeministInPink

Bugged said:


> I'm not angry, I'm logical...waiting until tomorrow to see if someone will make something about this SEXIST post...all the people on this 3d can go on AND on *trying to defend the indefensible*...if one states a specific behaviour is a *matter of GENDER that's sexism. Full stop*..that is NOT an opinion... that is a FACT.
> 
> If one said pubicly that most black people, because they're still black people, are *expected *to act silly on occasions...as opposed to people that are not black, otherwise one would not say black people, but people...well.*GOOD LUCK with that.*
> 
> Feminism has a prerequisite that you don't seem to have IMO.. the ability to spot a *SEXIST and condescending post*.


The last time I checked (which was about 30 seconds ago), the definition of feminism was about supporting/advocating social, political, and all other rights of women equal to those of men.

Funny, it didn't mention a prerequisite about chat rooms...

From what I can tell, technovelist's post didn't infringe on anyone's rights. It might be offensive. But it didn't actually tread on anyone's rights.

I'm just a reasonable feminist, rather than a militant, angry one.


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## T&T

Bugged said:


> silly as in fun is one thing
> silly as in annoying, self-contradictory, illogical, erratic..is another.
> We're not talking about fun here.


Okay, fair enough, but I didn't read his post as meaning irrational.

My wife is very rational but knows when/where to let her hair down and that's exactly how I read his post.


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## T&T

Bugged said:


> No? well..maybe you did not read the previous post that he was trying to clarify..


I had forgotten it but that sounds like my wife too, at times in our marriage. Now that I think about it, I could have acted the same way at times...

It depends on the situation and what's going on in our lives. 

It sounds to me like she was just feeling left out and didn't explain herself. Mind you, we men are a lil dense sometimes...You'd think women would get that by now.

See what I did there 0

Ducking for cover lol

J/K Hope I made you day a little brighter, Bugged.


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## SimplyAmorous

FeministInPink said:


> I'm just a reasonable *feminist*, rather than a militant, angry one.


The word itself causes many to conjure up things in our minds.. because it has been "muddied" by many within the movement. 

I've read too many posts/ articles that feel as "Bugged" does -when she said this *>>* "Feminism has a prerequisite that you don't seem to have IMO.. the ability to spot a SEXIST and condescending post."... 

It's true.. some seem to be there waiting like a vulture to swoop down *and correct* ...a misplaced word offends them.. a different view offends them.... my radar is always UP to see what camp they fall in & to what extreme...as then we must closely monitor every word that proceeds from our mouths as to not offend them.....I find this exasperating!

One can't have a sense of humor, one has to fit into what they DEFINE "as equal" & always ALWAYS praise the female... or expect to get reprimanded on our words, our thoughts, our views.. it shuts down honest dialog, it accuses, it destroys many decent threads even. Sad.


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## T&T

SA,

A feminist to me is someone striving for equal rights and justifiably so. 

I don't pay much attention to extremists.


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## ConanHub

Bugged. QUIT THREAD JACKING!!!

You obviously have an axe to grind so start your own thread!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl

technovelist said:


> My wife is usually quite rational; in fact, she is an INTJ, which is one of the most highly rational MBTI types.
> 
> But even as rational as she is, she is still a woman, and thus I have to expect silly behavior common to most (if not all) women on occasion. The question is how I deal with such events, and I believe that part of the reason my marriage is good is that I deal with them effectively.


I find this post funny because I have yet to meet a man and know him for long that he is not prone to silly behavior on occasion. Men can be just as irrational/silly as women can.


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## EleGirl

I'm locking this thread. When Kitt gets back, she can start a new thread on this topic if she chooses. And if she does, sticking to the topic and fights attacking each other will not be tolerated.


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