# Don't love my wife anymore and feel "done"



## WhatASituation

Been married for 15 years, have three kids who are 15, 13 and 11. We got married pretty quickly as you can see from the data above. When I met my wife, I fell in love with her. We shared the same interests, the sex was amazing, the connection was real. We met in September, married in January, and had our first child that June. It was really quick!

So our first child is born, which was the most amazing day of my life and we were happy.Very broke, but really happy and home, really felt like home. New wife, new baby, what more could a man want? Well months go by and sex stops. I figured with having a child, she needed to heal and probably wasn't in the mood as she put on the usual baby weight. Well more months go by and still no sex. It started to become an issue. She kept on telling me that I married her only because I got her pregnant. Ok I admit, it sped the process up, but I really was in love with her. I worshipped the ground she walked on! Months turn into years, we do end up having two more children but I am still being beat up with, "You married me because of our first child."

I thought I would show her that I really love her, not just tell her, but really SHOW her. I would do little things, notes, little mini-vacations, just her and I to show her that I wanted to be with her and enjoyed her company. The conversations were solely about the kids. I tried to make it about us, but it always turned into a planning session of all the stuff we have to do with the kids for the coming week.

Sex was a problem now. When we were dating, she was almost insatiable and she turned into the polar opposite! Well, I turned to porn to satiate myself but not to the point where that's all I did all day long. I did not want to cheat on her and totally mess up my marriage and put all that in jeopardy. After all, I was in my late 20's to 30's and still had a high sex drive. 

After our last child was born, I got a vasectomy as I knew we didn't want to have anymore children. This is really as an aside story only to demonstrate a point, because they needed a sample to make sure there were no "swimmers" left. I had a really hard time with providing one and asked my wife if she could "help me out". She told me that was disgusting and I had to fend for myself. She also told me she would be ok with not having sex for the rest of her life. Remember, this is on top of being told I married her only because of our first child.

Fast forward about 13 years into the marriage. We have a couple of drinks one night and I discover she had quite the active sex life in college. Now, I don't care what people do in their pasts especially being young and maybe even "dumb". But here's the kicker, she told me she did those things because she had been date raped (which I knew about a long time ago, so no surprise there) and just "didn't care anymore". So, after years of this battle with her, a huge question popped into my head. Why couldn't she do things with me, once in a while, that maybe she really didn't want to do? After all, I am her husband and not a "frat brother". I mean she had threesomes, did certain things to the frat brothers, all that sort of stuff but wouldn't touch me with a 10 foot pole? I was just totally bewildered and angered by this.

So in about year 14, I just had enough. I felt, after 14 years of rejection, all the sexual problems, her doing things with others before me but not doing things for me, I just felt extremely rejected. For me, I felt if I had become incapacitated in that regard, and she still had desire, I would do things for her as my wife. There were also some bad financial decisions she made but didn't really want to get into all that right now.

I am now at the point where I am just not in love with her anymore and I don't even really find her all that attractive now. I don't hate her either as we can still have good conversations, but it's not "us conversations", it's more about say politics, or current events or news of how our friends and family are doing. The last year and a half has been filled with huge fights, resentment and turmoil. We've become great roommates, but that's not what marriage is all about. I just feel dead inside, frustrated, trapped, rejected and not knowing what to do really. I am seriously thinking about leaving her, she can't be happy either. Any advice would be appreciated! Thanks for reading!


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## waiwera

Sorry you've arrived where you are whatasituation.

What you have described is what happens when a spouse (male or female) is rejected over and over again. No-one can take that for years on end and be unchanged. We see your story on these boards too often

It's horrible and soul destroying.

So...yes.... the question is what now?


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## *LittleDeer*

Questions?
Does your wife nag you?
Do you do more then your fair share?
Does she give you other affection, hugs, hand holding etc?
Have you begged or bargained for sex?

I think you can get the passion back, but it would take effort from both of you.
You need to let your wife know exactly what you are thinking and what you need. 
And let her know it is normal and natural to have sex and important to a healthy marriage to have a lot of love and affection.

She needs individual counseling badly. You also need individual counseling. And marital counseling. These should be a non negotiable part of you staying in the marraige.

You need to get some good boundaries, and let your wife know that she has been neglecting you and it's no longer OK. 
Let your wife know you are finished if she won't agree to fixing this with you (and no half assed attempts either) and stick with it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DTO

Cut that loser wife of yours loose.

You got played buddy. You likely were the guy seen as "good enough". I don't know what her trip is, but if you were that deficient she would not have popped out two more kids with you.


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## waiwera

DTO said:


> Cut that loser wife of yours loose.
> 
> You got played buddy. You likely were the guy seen as "good enough". I don't know what her trip is, but if you were that deficient she would not have popped out two more kids with you.


:iagree:

I am totally pro marriage but when someone has said " I do not love my spouse anymore' .....what is left? 

This is a long term chronic problem... I'm sure marriages CAN recover from this but I imagine it takes a huge amount of effort and commitment.

How sad!


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## WhatASituation

*LittleDeer* said:


> Questions?
> Does your wife nag you?
> Do you do more then your fair share?
> Does she give you other affection, hugs, hand holding etc?
> Have you begged or bargained for sex?
> 
> I think you can get the passion back, but it would take effort from both of you.
> You need to let your wife know exactly what you are thinking and what you need.
> And let her know it is normal and natural to have sex and important to a healthy marriage to have a lot of love and affection.
> 
> She needs individual counseling badly. You also need individual counseling. And marital counseling. These should be a non negotiable part of you staying in the marraige.
> 
> You need to get some good boundaries, and let your wife know that she has been neglecting you and it's no longer OK.
> Let your wife know you are finished if she won't agree to fixing this with you (and no half assed attempts either) and stick with it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The answers to your questions is this: no, she doesn't nag me,not only do I run my own business, but I also clean the bathrooms, take the kids here and there, etc., I do more than my fair share, no affection (I think a lot of this is me because I don't even want it anymore), never bargained or begged for sex, but nearly always initiated it and frequently turned down. 

Now all of a sudden she's open to have sex whenever. A little too late now and we've had sex 3 times in the past week. I'm not going to lie, it's been so long it felt great but it wasn't "making love". Hell, after we're done, we both just get up and roll over to our sides of the bed and go to sleep afterwards. 

She also has contacted MC's and wants me to go. I don't even care or want to do it. I feel like I am just "done" and this is beyond repair.


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## southern wife

Then it sounds like it's time to move on.


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## Hicks

Why is she having so much sex with you this last week.
Did you tell her you were thinking of leaving?


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## Jason439

I feel almost the same as you. "Done". The only reason I'm sticking it out is for my children. 

My circumstance is different, but my feeling of being done is the same. It's almost as if I can't be bothered to exert the energy to try anymore. 

Sorry I can't offer any advice, but there's a ton of great people here on TAM that have been where you are and will have more to offer.


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## WhatASituation

Hicks said:


> Why is she having so much sex with you this last week.
> Did you tell her you were thinking of leaving?


No, but we had this one huge blowout last weeks where she asked what I wanted. I couldn't answer her at that point. She gets SO emotional, SO angry, I can't really just reason with her. I don't even have the energy to fight with her anymore, I don't even get mad like I used to. I almost feel like I want to get "clinical" and just tell her I am done. But I know the moment I start entering this area, she gets out of control and I can't even talk.


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## WhatASituation

Jason439 said:


> I feel almost the same as you. "Done". The only reason I'm sticking it out is for my children.
> 
> My circumstance is different, but my feeling of being done is the same. It's almost as if I can't be bothered to exert the energy to try anymore.
> 
> Sorry I can't offer any advice, but there's a ton of great people here on TAM that have been where you are and will have more to offer.


Me too Jason, and that's not a good reason to stay in the marriage either. I hope you guys are getting along well and the kids really don't know. My kids know something is going on and I don't think it's healthy for them to see us fighting nor live in such stress and negative energy you could cut it with a knife!


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## A Bit Much

WhatASituation said:


> No, but we had this one huge blowout last weeks where she asked what I wanted. I couldn't answer her at that point. She gets SO emotional, SO angry, I can't really just reason with her. I don't even have the energy to fight with her anymore, I don't even get mad like I used to. I almost feel like I want to get "clinical" and just tell her I am done. But I know the moment I start entering this area, she gets out of control and I can't even talk.


I wonder where all that emotion and anger in her comes from. Being so disconnected from you, you'd think she would be more ambivalent... like you.


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## C3156

WhatASituation said:


> Now all of a sudden she's open to have sex whenever. A little too late now and we've had sex 3 times in the past week. I'm not going to lie, it's been so long it felt great but it wasn't "making love". Hell, after we're done, we both just get up and roll over to our sides of the bed and go to sleep afterwards.
> 
> She also has contacted MC's and wants me to go. I don't even care or want to do it. I feel like I am just "done" and this is beyond repair.


She has realized that you are serious and her world is about to change. She is now grasping at straws hoping to keep her status quo.

I realize that the marriage is dead for you, but before you jump the gun and file paperwork, have you planned out your exit strategy? If you do not have your ducks in a row, this could get very costly and ugly for you if you are not careful. 

My advice, if you are truly done, play the game with her for a while about 'working' on things. On the side, learn your state statutes with regard to divorce law and family court, the internet is a great thing. Get your documents and financials in order. Get a consult with a lawyer. Figure out what you want from a divorce (material things, custody, ect), develop a plan to get what you want, and then execute your plan.

Don't take to long as she may be planning as well now that cat is out of the bag.


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## Plan 9 from OS

OP, I feel sorry for the point you've reached right now. Assuming there is no infidelity on either side contributing to the issues here, if your wife started to make all of the changes that you desired and she received the counseling that would help her to become a better spouse, would you be willing to stick with her? It sucks that you have so many wasted years, but if the two of you can make a clean start and both recommit to the marriage I think you have a great chance to make it. Your appears to get it that you are highly upset over the years of wasted opportunities and I think she is trying to save the marriage now. Maybe instead of thinking "too little, too late" that you may look at it as perhaps your wife does love you after all. I would try to have a heart to heart talk with your wife so that the two of you can lay your cards on the table. I would also preface the discussion by stating that neither of you are allowed to raise your voices and start a fight. Both of you need to communicate and to see what each of you like about the marriage and what must be fixed.


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## WhatASituation

C3156 said:


> She has realized that you are serious and her world is about to change. She is now grasping at straws hoping to keep her status quo.
> 
> I realize that the marriage is dead for you, but before you jump the gun and file paperwork, have you planned out your exit strategy? If you do not have your ducks in a row, this could get very costly and ugly for you if you are not careful.
> 
> My advice, if you are truly done, play the game with her for a while about 'working' on things. On the side, learn your state statutes with regard to divorce law and family court, the internet is a great thing. Get your documents and financials in order. Get a consult with a lawyer. Figure out what you want from a divorce (material things, custody, ect), develop a plan to get what you want, and then execute your plan.
> 
> Don't take to long as she may be planning as well now that cat is out of the bag.


I think that's exactly what is going on. She feels it's only a matter of time. I've been planning on my exit strategy already, looking at different places to live to separate first initially. She's said in the past she's open to a mediation process to not have this long dragged out judicial process that is not only expensive, but also hard on the kids. She's not an evil witch, so I think she could be reasonable. I do feel I need this buffer zone which is the moving out to my own place. I've already looked at my laws here in my state as far as what would be expected of me. I don't care about the material things, she can have it all. I've started over many times in my life and could easily do it again.


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## WhatASituation

Plan 9 from OS said:


> OP, I feel sorry for the point you've reached right now. Assuming there is no infidelity on either side contributing to the issues here, if your wife started to make all of the changes that you desired and she received the counseling that would help her to become a better spouse, would you be willing to stick with her? It sucks that you have so many wasted years, but if the two of you can make a clean start and both recommit to the marriage I think you have a great chance to make it. Your appears to get it that you are highly upset over the years of wasted opportunities and I think she is trying to save the marriage now. Maybe instead of thinking "too little, too late" that you may look at it as perhaps your wife does love you after all. I would try to have a heart to heart talk with your wife so that the two of you can lay your cards on the table. I would also preface the discussion by stating that neither of you are allowed to raise your voices and start a fight. Both of you need to communicate and to see what each of you like about the marriage and what must be fixed.


Thanks Plan, I appreciate your thoughts on this. I've done a lot of soul searching for the past several months. I've gone from, "no, let's give this a try AGAIN", to "I just want out". I can with all honesty, just say, "I am done" with no anger and no regret. I do not want to get to the point where I resent her and feel bitter towards the wasted years. This woman did give me three amazing kids so I will always be "attached" to her forever in some way or another. I think I will always care about here, no matter what. I need to make sure we can be friendly from now on but separate.


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## Jason439

WhatASituation said:


> Me too Jason, and that's not a good reason to stay in the marriage either. I hope you guys are getting along well and the kids really don't know. My kids know something is going on and I don't think it's healthy for them to see us fighting nor live in such stress and negative energy you could cut it with a knife!


We're not fighting. We've agreed to stay amicable. We only discuss the kids, house, etc. 

It's not the best situation for the kids, but right now I see no other option for the short term.


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## Hicks

Your wife was insecure (as almost everyone is) and when she said you only married her b/c she was pregnant, she was really saying, I need reassurance in this moment that you love me. The need to be reassured and loved is not a one time event, but an ongoing need she has.

The fact that she was never sexual with you really means that even though you have tried, you have not succeeded in assuring her that you love her. Now, this is not your fault becuase you tried very hard according to your post. But, for whatever reason the things you did were barking up the wrong tree.

Only you can decide that you are done , finished of whatever. It's no shame to decide that you have not had your emotional needs met, have tried very hard to meet hers, she never really tried to meet yours, and at this point you are better off starting over.

But, you may want to converse with her about these concepts.... Trying to find out a few things from her (you want her to verbalize this)... Does she know what your emotional needs are? Does she understand your sexual needs as a man and what it means at an emotional level? Does she know what her own needs are? Does she feel you meet her emotional needs? Does she have needs that you don't meet? Does she feel you are meeting her needs and admit that she never felt a need to meet yours?

What you would be trying to do is discern the problem... Is it that you were missing the mark in what you tried, or ultimatley is she just a selfish person who did not care about your needs. You are on the verge of divorce, what's the harm? You will learn alot.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser

Hard to say for sure, but I THINK this whole 'you only married me because of our first-born' is ALL ABOUT HER and NOTHING ABOUT YOU.

Sounds as though she's never forgiven herself for getting pregnant before marriage. She's never forgiven herself for being date-raped (even though it wasn't HER fault).

I, too, think she sees the writing on the wall and is uncomfortable with the coming changes (the impact on the kids, where everyone is going to live, changing financials, etc.)

I'm sorry so many years have gone by, but try NOT to think of them as wasted. Try to forgive yourself for not leaving sooner. Now that you see there is NO POINT in remaining, you are moving on. You are learning lessons and there is VALUE in that!

I left my STBXH after 19 yrs of marriage earlier this year. I am HAPPY for the first time in years. The possibilities that lay before me are as awe-inspiring as when I was in my 20s and ALL THINGS SEEMED possible!

Hope you find HAPPINESS and peace and FUN in your new life!


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## WhatASituation

SlowlyGettingWiser said:


> Hard to say for sure, but I THINK this whole 'you only married me because of our first-born' is ALL ABOUT HER and NOTHING ABOUT YOU.
> 
> Sounds as though she's never forgiven herself for getting pregnant before marriage. She's never forgiven herself for being date-raped (even though it wasn't HER fault).
> 
> I, too, think she sees the writing on the wall and is uncomfortable with the coming changes (the impact on the kids, where everyone is going to live, changing financials, etc.)
> 
> I'm sorry so many years have gone by, but try NOT to think of them as wasted. Try to forgive yourself for not leaving sooner. Now that you see there is NO POINT in remaining, you are moving on. You are learning lessons and there is VALUE in that!
> 
> I left my STBXH after 19 yrs of marriage earlier this year. I am HAPPY for the first time in years. The possibilities that lay before me are as awe-inspiring as when I was in my 20s and ALL THINGS SEEMED possible!
> 
> Hope you find HAPPINESS and peace and FUN in your new life!


Thank you, at least it feels like there could be a glimmer of hope through all this. I choose not to be mad at her, or at myself. These weren't wasted years as this woman gave me three amazing kids whom I love with all my heart. I can choose to be bitter or I can choose to handle this as a life transition.


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## DTO

WhatASituation said:


> No, but we had this one huge blowout last weeks where she asked what I wanted. I couldn't answer her at that point. She gets SO emotional, SO angry, I can't really just reason with her.


Hint: you are not supposed to answer her rhetorical question. The translation is "I am angry because you have expectations and hold me accountable. Your needs are shaking up my comfy life. I simply don't see you in a sexual way; take care of your kids and leave me alone.

IOW, she intends to be that emotional and angry. She wants to be offputting. Why do that? Possibly because she feels you are getting fed up. She likes her life, but cannot bear to work on herself sexually and if push came to shove she would leave rather than meet your need. So, she is being nasty and hoping you will back down.


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## DTO

A Bit Much said:


> I wonder where all that emotion and anger in her comes from. Being so disconnected from you, you'd think she would be more ambivalent... like you.


She's running scared. She possibly sees quite clearly "I'm about to be a single woman partly responsible for three kids, and I have serious sexual baggage. If I lose this I'm likely to recover."


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## DTO

Hicks said:


> The fact that she was never sexual with you really means that even though you have tried, you have not succeeded in assuring her that you love her.


Wow, this is seriously off the mark.

First of all, if she doubted his love for her, why would she have married him in the first place?

Second, she was not _never_ sexual with him. She was sexual with him after marriage when it benefitted _her_ - namely, when having their second and third children.

Third, your statement assumes she possesses a certain type of sexual response - "if I love you and feel safe with you then I will want to be sexual with you". While that may be true of a well-adjusted person you cannot assume this type of response.

You need to read back a ways, noting that the wife here was (1) date-raped and (2) very promiscuous afterwards - I believe the OP mentioned threesomes and such. To me, this is a person that may have serious sexual issues.

My ex was a sex abuse survivor. I can tell you that she did not have that reaction. Feeling loved generally did not stimulate sexual desire. In fact, her underlying assumption is that sex was not a loving act, so a man that would make sex a priority was _inherently_ unloving. Thus, it was _impossible_ to make her loved enough to desire me on a consistent basis. And if by some chance she did agree to try, flashbacks and subsequent shame were always around the corner.

Everything I've read and everyone with whom I've communicated indicates that these reactions are far from unusual in sex abuse survivors, particularly those that do not get therapy.

To the OP: I do agree with Hicks that you have nothing to lose by trying. But, trying does not mean ask her how she feels (which would lead to a pointless exchange). She has asked you to go to marriage counseling. I would agree to go if she agrees to simultaneously go to individual counseling and frankly explore how her past abuse is hindering her ability to relate to you.


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## Hicks

You could be right.

The fact that she was sexual at one point says to me that date rape is not a factor... IN other words she has it in her to be sexual under the right conditions. A good starting point is making her feel loved and safe, especially when she is clearly throwing down the test "You never loved me"... That is certainly a cry for him to prove it... And proving that is not a one shot deal but an ongoing daily thing. But that's why I ended with needeing to get underneath her attidude... Does she care and not know? Does she know and not care? Does she have some kind of trauma that is stoppoing her? Each of these things are actionable in their own way.


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## Jason439

WhatASituation said:


> Thank you, at least it feels like there could be a glimmer of hope through all this. I choose not to be mad at her, or at myself. These weren't wasted years as this woman gave me three amazing kids whom I love with all my heart. I can choose to be bitter or I can choose to handle this as a life transition.


That is exactly the same thoughts i have and I'm doing the same things. 

Life is too short to fill your head with thoughts of anger and hatred. I do sometimes have these thoughts, but I don't dwell on them. They pass.


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## WhatASituation

The more I think about being by myself, the happier I get. I am actually looking forward to it and am not scared to make that jump any longer. Kids are resilient and I will ALWAYS make sure they are taken care of, not just financially but emotionally too. I look forward to the rest of my life again, the first time I have felt this since my 20's!


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## Frankiez

Im happy for you WhatASituation...

You deserve happiness! All these years of trying....at least you will always know that you did everything you could to find happiness with in your marriage. 
Now is your time my friend =)


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## WhatASituation

I've posted earlier that I discovered my wife had these texts from some guy she knew in high school and when I confronted her, it all stopped the very next day. Her iPhone uses wi-fi and having been an IT guy, the router keeps logs of websites visited. Her iPhone is using TextNow and not only can you text with it, but you can also have voice calls on it. She's on it quite a bit so I guess she's figured out another way on how to communicate with whomever. 

Here's the kicker, I don't even care! I think several years ago I would've marched upstairs and confront her but I almost find this as a "pass" to continue with my plans of leaving her. I really don't know who this woman is I married!


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## CanadianGuy

WhatASituation said:


> The more I think about being by myself, the happier I get. I am actually looking forward to it and am not scared to make that jump any longer. Kids are resilient and I will ALWAYS make sure they are taken care of, not just financially but emotionally too. I look forward to the rest of my life again, the first time I have felt this since my 20's!


If kids were resilient there would not be so many screwed up adults.


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## anchorwatch

WhatASituation said:


> I've posted earlier that I discovered my wife had these texts from some guy she knew in high school and when I confronted her, it all stopped the very next day. Her iPhone uses wi-fi and having been an IT guy, the router keeps logs of websites visited. Her iPhone is using TextNow and not only can you text with it, but you can also have voice calls on it. She's on it quite a bit so I guess she's figured out another way on how to communicate with whomever.
> 
> Here's the kicker, I don't even care! I think several years ago I would've marched upstairs and confront her but I almost find this as a "pass" to continue with my plans of leaving her. I really don't know who this woman is I married!


Then what are you waiting for? Sit down together and tell her you know that she's communicating with her XBF and that you both must feel the same way about the marriage. Start the conversation. No?


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## Jason439

anchorwatch said:


> Then what are you waiting for? Sit down together and tell her you know that she's communicating with her XBF and that you both must feel the same way about the marriage. Start the conversation. No?


This is good advice. I will be doing the same after thanksgiving (this weekend in Canada). 

I plan to lay my cards on the table so to speak and see where the conversation goes. It can't continue in Limbo forever. I've been starting to feel a bit suffocated lately. It's hard keeping the emotions in check, but I have been able to so far.


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## chillymorn

stick a fork in it your done!


start the next chapter of your life.


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## WhatASituation

Jason439 said:


> This is good advice. I will be doing the same after thanksgiving (this weekend in Canada).
> 
> I plan to lay my cards on the table so to speak and see where the conversation goes. It can't continue in Limbo forever. I've been starting to feel a bit suffocated lately. It's hard keeping the emotions in check, but I have been able to so far.


Good luck with that Jason!


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## Jason439

WhatASituation said:


> Good luck with that Jason!


Thanks, not sure how it will go, but there are things that need to be said in order to move forward. Either staying together or D. I'm ready for either option.


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## WhatASituation

Question for you guys...I'm still moving ahead with the plan for divorce but am scratching my head on something. My STBXW is using a free texting app on her iPhone to text a person or persons ferociously. I mean, it starts as soon as she wakes up and is all day long going strong and has been for days. I had a friend of mine suggest it could be a female friend trying to console her, but why keep it secret and what friend texts ALL day long like this? Here's the question, she has actually scheduled a MC session for next Thursday (I really don't want to go). Why schedule it?! Clearly, she's done and I know she knows I am, so why on earth do this? I'm curious what you guys think.


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## Emerald

WhatASituation said:


> Question for you guys...I'm still moving ahead with the plan for divorce but am scratching my head on something. My STBXW is using a free texting app on her iPhone to text a person or persons ferociously. I mean, it starts as soon as she wakes up and is all day long going strong and has been for days. I had a friend of mine suggest it could be a female friend trying to console her, but why keep it secret and what friend texts ALL day long like this? Here's the question, she has actually scheduled a MC session for next Thursday (I really don't want to go). Why schedule it?! Clearly, she's done and I know she knows I am, so why on earth do this? I'm curious what you guys think.


I think you should go to MC to discuss your feelings. It won't hurt & maybe provide some good advice on disolving the marriage peacefully. Yes bring up the secret texting. Do you think she has a boyfriend on the side?


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## anchorwatch

1) She is looking to continue the marriage.

2) The MC session could be for her to judge your position and get a third party opinion. 

3) For for counsel on how to end things. 

4) To tell you she found someone else in a safe setting. 

Have you sat down and told her you not going to continue the marriage? That would eliminate some of the guess work. You could also spy on her phone, for answers to her thinking. Or just go and see what she wants. No?


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## Jason439

anchorwatch said:


> 1) She is looking to continue the marriage.
> 
> 2) The MC session could be for her to judge your position and get a third party opinion.
> 
> 3) For for counsel on how to end things.
> 
> 4) To tell you she found someone else in a safe setting.
> 
> Have you sat down and told her you not going to continue the marriage? That would eliminate some of the guess work. You could also spy on her phone, for answers to her thinking. Or just go and see what she wants. No?


All very good points. 

The constant texting is bothersome to say the least. Could be to her friends for advice or a new interest. 

I think MC might be worth at least one visit just to get your W's opinion/thoughts on the table.


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## WhatASituation

All good thoughts but she's texting like my teenaged daughters. I have pages of router logs showing the number of times she's used this application. She literally disappears into the bedroom to do the majority of this texting. It's got to be an interest beyond friendship but I don't have transcripts of conversations so I can't say that 100%. Her mood swings have gotten worse. One minute she's high as a kite the next minute she's ready to rip someone's head off. Seems consistent with an interest she has that's beyond friendship to me.

I'm SO ready to move on it isn't funny. I look forward to being alone, I really do!


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## anchorwatch

You know she's giving someone else her affections. You don't want them. So what's you intent? Sit around and wait for her to put you out of your misery, so she can take the blame? Why don't you both take responsibility and just end it.


----------



## thunderstruck

WhatASituation said:


> I'm SO ready to move on it isn't funny. I look forward to being alone, I really do!


If that's true, you shouldn't waste a bit of your energy on finding out who she is texting. Let her have at it, while you make your exit plans. 

I'm sorry you're going through this rough time. I can relate to a lot of what you wrote.


----------



## WhatASituation

thunderstruck said:


> If that's true, you shouldn't waste a bit of your energy on finding out who she is texting. Let her have at it, while you make your exit plans.
> 
> I'm sorry you're going through this rough time. I can relate to a lot of what you wrote.


I'm only gathering evidence at this point in case she gets squirrely on me. My plans are moving forward. Took the kids and her out to dinner tonight, she was in good spirits. Got home, went upstairs like she usually does to text, and WOW, what a 180! She was ready to kill someone. Can't take this anymore!


----------



## WhatASituation

anchorwatch said:


> You know she's giving someone else her affections. You don't want them. So what's you intent? Sit around and wait for her to put you out of your misery, so she can take the blame? Why don't you both take responsibility and just end it.


I am working on exiting right now. I just need a couple more weeks to get things squared away. Just gather ing evidence at this point and biding my time. Thank God I am going out of town for a week tomorrow, that distance from her will be nice. I just hate being away from the kids though.


----------



## MEM2020

WAS,
I don't know for sure why she is requesting MC other than to delay the bad financial outcome that divorce represents. 

If it was me I would sit her down and run this script:
Me: What is your goal in MC? 
Her: long incomprehensible response with lots of maybes
Me: OK. So if you wish me to attend, I need to be CERTAIN there are ONLY two people in our marriage. (be silent here and wait until she responds)
Her: Angry/combative/hurt/etc What do you mean by that?
Me: given where we are, I need total transparency right now which will start with a discussion of your text pal and depending what I hear, may culminate in me reading a sample of your messages
Her: Angry/combative "if you don't trust me we should just end it now"
Me: I don't. Your behavior is following a textbook "cheating" pattern. If I am wrong tell me. 
1. Who is it?
2. What is your relationship with them?
3. If it is HARMLESS - given how bad things are I need you to show me if we are to HAVE ANY HOPE OF REPAIRING THIS MARRIAGE 
Her: You are controlling/invading my privacy/awful/hateful/etc. 

This is the typical script of a cheater in the fog. Prepare for it and stay calm. 

If you won't show me RIGHT NOW I am: 
1. CONFIDENT something inappropriate is happening and 
2. CERTAIN that you are continuing to show zero concern for MY feelings and my fear of being vulnerable to you and my very reasonable concern that your obsession gives me much more than reasonable cause to feel concern





WhatASituation said:


> Question for you guys...I'm still moving ahead with the plan for divorce but am scratching my head on something. My STBXW is using a free texting app on her iPhone to text a person or persons ferociously. I mean, it starts as soon as she wakes up and is all day long going strong and has been for days. I had a friend of mine suggest it could be a female friend trying to console her, but why keep it secret and what friend texts ALL day long like this? Here's the question, she has actually scheduled a MC session for next Thursday (I really don't want to go). Why schedule it?! Clearly, she's done and I know she knows I am, so why on earth do this? I'm curious what you guys think.


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## Goldmember357

1) she has major issues
2) she had major issues before you
3) she has major issues still
4) how did you not see this?
5) you rushed into things
6) YOU NEED TO LEAVE

best of luck man.

Its up to you alone to change your luck and life. You can be happy easily she sounds miserable you may have feelings of anger but realize if you can achieve happiness all will be well. You do not need her to be happy. Happiness is something you start NOW she is lost and has always been lost it seems she has no control over herself or what she does its sad because she is likely to be like this for a LONG time and grow old being miserable. She will destroy herself! also this is why i advice people to KNOW everything about a persons past! she is destroying herself and will suffer at the expense of her own actions.

you got used as she saw you as "good enough"

you also rushed into things

please leave man you deserve better don't you think?


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## DTO

WhatASituation said:


> Question for you guys...I'm still moving ahead with the plan for divorce but am scratching my head on something. My STBXW is using a free texting app on her iPhone to text a person or persons ferociously. I mean, it starts as soon as she wakes up and is all day long going strong and has been for days. I had a friend of mine suggest it could be a female friend trying to console her, but why keep it secret and what friend texts ALL day long like this? Here's the question, she has actually scheduled a MC session for next Thursday (I really don't want to go). Why schedule it?! Clearly, she's done and I know she knows I am, so why on earth do this? I'm curious what you guys think.


Maybe she just doesn't want to pay the per-message fee that comes along with plans not having unlimited texting?

At the end of the day, who cares? She's done and you're done. What you each do no longer matters, so long as the children are not adversely impacted.


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## almostsingle30

I say go to one last MC session. It won't hurt and you have a lot of history with your wife and no matter what she will be in your life since you have 3 kids. It is always worth one last session. At least you can say you didn't try...I hope it works out for you either way...


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## WhatASituation

Well it looks like she's stepped up her reaching out to other men. She's on a site called Skout which you can link to your FB account. She hasn't so that's a secret too. The texting has picked up even more so I suppose she's contacting these people using the TextNow application. Is she just trying to get someone as a "backup" because she sees the writing on the wall? Just curious of your thoughts.


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## Emerald

WhatASituation said:


> Well it looks like she's stepped up her reaching out to other men. She's on a site called Skout which you can link to your FB account. She hasn't so that's a secret too. The texting has picked up even more so I suppose she's contacting these people using the TextNow application. Is she just trying to get someone as a "backup" because she sees the writing on the wall? Just curious of your thoughts.


I guess she feels the marriage is over so she is free to date other men. I would keep an eye on this because I wouldn't want random men around my children.


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## WhatASituation

Emerald said:


> I guess she feels the marriage is over so she is free to date other men. I would keep an eye on this because I wouldn't want random men around my children.


Which is exactly the reason I continue to monitor this and not say a word just yet! It's unbelievable to me!!!


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## anchorwatch

WhatASituation said:


> Well it looks like she's stepped up her reaching out to other men. She's on a site called Skout which you can link to your FB account. She hasn't so that's a secret too. The texting has picked up even more so I suppose she's contacting these people using the TextNow application. Is she just trying to get someone as a "backup" because she sees the writing on the wall? Just curious of your thoughts.


My thoughts? This marriage is done, stick a fork in it done. It's been dead quite a while. Your fault , her fault, who cares at this point. Since your story is no different than many others, just to be fair, I'd say 50/50. That means half on you. You're spending your time waiting to make your move. She's making her move. Why are you even wondering what she's doing? You're either not interested in or capable of repairing this marriage. This situation is ridiculous. You both know it's over and neither one of you will admit it to the other and just end it. So sit back and continue to watch it destroy itself, and then you can both find plenty of blame to go around. Sorry, I'm not one that thinks you'll live happily ever after.


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## WhatASituation

I'm going to stick a fork in it very soon. This is ridiculous and it needs to end to mitigate the bitterness as much as possible. I'm ready to keep it amicable, friendly and be a good parent in a tough situation. I'm afraid she's not, and that concerns me greatly.


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## almostsingle30

Just be mentally prepared for her to not be amicable...I feel horrible, but if my husband decides to quit this relationship I will be a *****. I would never ever do anythign in front of my children and never say a bad word about their dad to them, but divorce is ugly...

BUT, I see your point and you and your wife are at a very bad point...and there is probably no return...


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## WhatASituation

almostsingle30 said:


> Just be mentally prepared for her to not be amicable...I feel horrible, but if my husband decides to quit this relationship I will be a *****. I would never ever do anythign in front of my children and never say a bad word about their dad to them, but divorce is ugly...
> 
> BUT, I see your point and you and your wife are at a very bad point...and there is probably no return...


Interesting you use the terms "their dad" and "my children". I think you're done too as I catch myself using the same terminology.


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## almostsingle30

I dont mean to talk badly, just reality...my husband and i are in mc and so far things are going well...it hasnt been hard and he has said aome hurtful but true things, but for us mc is a last resort...


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## WhatASituation

I've been out of the country for a week now, and have to extend it one more week due to business. Now the texting activity runs into the wee hours of the morning. I think we can confirm it's not some consoling girlfriend. I'm still gathering evidence in the meantime. I hope to go to mediation later this month or early November.


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## anchorwatch

Why are you bothering gathering evidence? Most jurisdictions are no fault and infidelity plays no role in custody or the division of assets. Even if you live where it is considered, what would you say? "She is communicating a lot with someone else". The laws consider infidelity as a physical act, not talking to someone long distance. I think you're still waiting for the right time to act. Just like you did while your marriage was dying, waiting for the right time to act.


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## A Bit Much

WhatASituation said:


> I've been out of the country for a week now, and have to extend it one more week due to business. Now the texting activity runs into the wee hours of the morning. I think we can confirm it's not some consoling girlfriend. I'm still gathering evidence in the meantime. I hope to go to mediation later this month or early November.


I thought you were done like months ago...


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## WhatASituation

I thought I'd provide an update. So we've been to MC for several sessions now and I've found myself to be the one who has been doing most of the talking and participating. My goal for the MC was to figure out how to talk to my W without it turning into a screaming match. I told the counselor at this point this is what I would like to have happen and we can go from there. My W agreed. So as part of an exercise, we went out on a "date night" this past Saturday night to discuss our lives from 0-3, 4-6, and onwards recounting our memories from when we were kids. There were actually new things that came to light but you know what, it actually made things worse for me. First of all, I then realized how F'd up she really is and it confirms how anger is an emotion she is most comfortable with. This woman will literally charge at me in anger when she wants to talk about something. This is an aspect of her I have never liked at all. So, I think I can say I've tried MC and though we are not fighting as much anymore and are more amicable towards each other, it now just confirms how I feel about her. Have any of you gone to MC, done a real analysis of the situation and due to the MC, it actually drove you more towards getting a D? Sometimes I look at my kids, and then I feel horribly guilty for wanting to D their mom. Any thoughts please?


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## anony2

Why do you want to stay with your wife if you do not LOVE her?


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## Jason439

I struggled over the guilt about my kids. I did IC and realized that it will be tough on the kids in the short term, but over time they will be ok. Better to see Dad happy in his own and Mom happy on her own. Everyone will end up happy in the end. 

All kids can sense something is not right between their parents. They pick up on the tension and it doesn't do them any good. I don't want them to mirror the poor marriage that I'm in now when they grow up. 

I agree, why stay with your wife if you both don't love each other? Life is too short to live unhappy and in prison. 

It's a bitter pill to swallow, but as each day passes it gets easier to accept that we are separating. I'm actually looking forward to the new chapter of my life.


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## Prodigal

I read every post in this thread. You've received some good advice. At this point, I get the feeling you are seeking validation or permission to leave the marriage. Nobody can do that for you.

I feel you need to work on yourself. Perhaps IC? Maybe guilt is holding you back from leaving, but I can't understand why, almost three months after your OP, you are still living with a woman you don't love.

Divorce is never easy for anyone, but this marriage sounds like it's been over for quite awhile. But your still living together. Your children WILL survive, and you have made it clear you would be happier living elsewhere. 

There's this feeling I get that you are dragging your feet for another reason than just feeling guilty about leaving your children. I could be wrong, but I wonder why you would stay in a dead marriage. For the sake of the kids? They sense, or outright know, your marriage is kaput. Maybe they would be happier too if you and the wife moved on.


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## WhatASituation

Jason439 said:


> I struggled over the guilt about my kids. I did IC and realized that it will be tough on the kids in the short term, but over time they will be ok. Better to see Dad happy in his own and Mom happy on her own. Everyone will end up happy in the end.
> 
> All kids can sense something is not right between their parents. They pick up on the tension and it doesn't do them any good. I don't want them to mirror the poor marriage that I'm in now when they grow up.
> 
> I agree, why stay with your wife if you both don't love each other? Life is too short to live unhappy and in prison.
> 
> It's a bitter pill to swallow, but as each day passes it gets easier to accept that we are separating. I'm actually looking forward to the new chapter of my life.


It's the guilt that is killing me on how the kids will cope with it. My two oldest (going to be 16 and 14) will probably accept it more easily than my youngest who will be 12. Also, their Mom is just an angry person, this is the easiest emotion for her as she's admitted it to me in the MC session. This just sucks but I do look forward to that new chapter you've mentioned!


----------



## WhatASituation

Prodigal said:


> I read every post in this thread. You've received some good advice. At this point, I get the feeling you are seeking validation or permission to leave the marriage. Nobody can do that for you.
> 
> I feel you need to work on yourself. Perhaps IC? Maybe guilt is holding you back from leaving, but I can't understand why, almost three months after your OP, you are still living with a woman you don't love.
> 
> Divorce is never easy for anyone, but this marriage sounds like it's been over for quite awhile. But your still living together. Your children WILL survive, and you have made it clear you would be happier living elsewhere.
> 
> There's this feeling I get that you are dragging your feet for another reason than just feeling guilty about leaving your children. I could be wrong, but I wonder why you would stay in a dead marriage. For the sake of the kids? They sense, or outright know, your marriage is kaput. Maybe they would be happier too if you and the wife moved on.


Thanks Prodigal. Yes, the guilt is holding me back but the W is SUCH an angry and unstable person. I want her "cooperation" in a way so she doesn't act on her emotions, do stupid things, and all that does is drain both of us financially and emotionally. I guess I am trying to be smart about this but I suppose there's just no easy way to do it. I am trying to proceed with the least amount of damage possible to all of us. This woman is highly manipulative and uses emotional blackmail anytime it benefits her. She's almost dangerous to be very honest. You would never know if you met her for the first time!


----------



## Prodigal

WhatASituation said:


> the W is SUCH an angry and unstable person. I want her "cooperation" in a way so she doesn't act on her emotions, do stupid things, and all that does is drain both of us financially and emotionally.
> 
> She's almost dangerous to be very honest.


This is why you get a darned good family law attorney to assess your situation from a financial and emotional standpoint.

You are waiting for everything to fall into place just the way you want it before you leave. This is an imperfect world. In such a world, nobody would get anywhere if we waited for everything to pan out just as we imagine it.

You are stuck with a case of the what-if's. The tragedy of this is you may very well be on here posting months from now about the same stinky situation. 

Okay, your wife is a potentially dangerous person. Has she ever hit the children? Screamed at them? Used threats, profanity, or other fear tactics? Document it. Discuss it with an attorney. Go for custody.

Yes, divorce costs money. It takes an emotional toll on all involved. But right now your kids are living in a home with parents who aren't role models for what a healthy marriage should be. You aren't doing them or yourself any favors by remaining stuck.

I'd sh!t or get off the pot. But it's not my life. Your life. Your choices.


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## DTO

WhatASituation said:


> It's the guilt that is killing me on how the kids will cope with it. My two oldest (going to be 16 and 14) will probably accept it more easily than my youngest who will be 12. Also, their Mom is just an angry person, this is the easiest emotion for her as she's admitted it to me in the MC session. This just sucks but I do look forward to that new chapter you've mentioned!


If your concern is that your kids won't cope well with their mother, understand that your kids are well old enough to tell you if they are being less than optimally. The older two might be old enough to have a say in where they live and how often they see each of you.

My advice is that this issue should not prevent your divorce if you really are that unhappy and that is the only issue preventing your departure. I would, however, send a strong signal by requesting (and fighting like hell to get) as much custody as you can. You might also want to consider having an evaluation done where a qualified psychologist will evaluate you and your wife, and listen to your kids' concerns, before making recommendations regarding custody, visitation, schedules, ongoing therapy and counseling for the kids, etc.

ETA: My ex is not emotionally healthy, but generally stable on a day-to-day basis. Her issue is mainly that she does not have the enthusiasm necessary to be a really good single parent on a consistent basis; as a result, my child is subjected to treatment not in her best interest with disturbing regularity.

So, my advice might not help your situation, but I've found that keeping in regular contact with my child (I bought a cell phone) during my non-custody time, along with timely interventions by my attorney when necessary, makes my ex try a lot harder to stay on the straight and narrow.


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## The Cro-Magnon

She thinks sex with you is disgusting, for 14 years of marriage, yet is prepared to court other men on some internet app dating site BEFORE YOU ARE EVEN DIVORCED. 

I'm willing to bet she'll be happy to do anything and everything for some new man she meets off the internet too, like some "miraculous" rediscovery of her libido. But she couldn't for you.

She has treated you like crap, you are well within your rights to move on, and I wish you all the best with your new life.


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## Lovemytruck

WAS,

Just a thought. Did you ever consider borderline personality disorder?

I didn't read anything that indicated that you cheated. If you didn't, maybe when you feel the guilt of wanting out you can say to yourself, you didn't cheat.

You are the example of what a moral person does when they are faced with a bad relationship. You spared all of your families and her the pain of cheating. Divorce is tough, but if you chose that know that you did it in a dignified manner. As a BH, my hat is off to you for that.


----------



## WhatASituation

The Cro-Magnon said:


> She thinks sex with you is disgusting, for 14 years of marriage, yet is prepared to court other men on some internet app dating site BEFORE YOU ARE EVEN DIVORCED.
> 
> I'm willing to bet she'll be happy to do anything and everything for some new man she meets off the internet too, like some "miraculous" rediscovery of her libido. But she couldn't for you.
> 
> She has treated you like crap, you are well within your rights to move on, and I wish you all the best with your new life.


There's truth to this, Cro. I've seen some of her "flirts" with some of her FB "guy-friends". Let me just say she's never talked to me like that!!


----------



## WhatASituation

DTO said:


> If your concern is that your kids won't cope well with their mother, understand that your kids are well old enough to tell you if they are being less than optimally. The older two might be old enough to have a say in where they live and how often they see each of you.
> 
> My advice is that this issue should not prevent your divorce if you really are that unhappy and that is the only issue preventing your departure. I would, however, send a strong signal by requesting (and fighting like hell to get) as much custody as you can. You might also want to consider having an evaluation done where a qualified psychologist will evaluate you and your wife, and listen to your kids' concerns, before making recommendations regarding custody, visitation, schedules, ongoing therapy and counseling for the kids, etc.
> 
> ETA: My ex is not emotionally healthy, but generally stable on a day-to-day basis. Her issue is mainly that she does not have the enthusiasm necessary to be a really good single parent on a consistent basis; as a result, my child is subjected to treatment not in her best interest with disturbing regularity.
> 
> So, my advice might not help your situation, but I've found that keeping in regular contact with my child (I bought a cell phone) during my non-custody time, along with timely interventions by my attorney when necessary, makes my ex try a lot harder to stay on the straight and narrow.


I can't say she's "abusive" to the kids. She's actually a great mom so I am blessed as far as that aspect is concerned. She's not an emotionally healthy person, that's for sure. We talked over the weekend as part of an assignment given to us by our MC, and I found out her mother constantly told her to make sure "that they love you more than you love them". I also found out she's "put a wall up during the entire marriage." I don't think the counseling is really helping here!

All three of my kids have cellphones and when I am of town, we are in constant contact. I am sure they will adjust and be fine with the D, but I guess there's a part of me that is fearful they may not handle it well. I am sure my fears are unfounded. 

She acts on anger, and that's the disturbing part, which really concerns me on how she will handle the process. I can't say I've got plenty in reserves here, so I really can't afford a protracted legal battle with her. I don't really care about the money, but at the same time, I would like my kids to have something left after the D for crying out loud! She would be the type to wipe it all out and realize AFTER the dust settled of what the repercussions of her actions are.

Thanks for your viewpoints, I really appreciate it!


----------



## WhatASituation

Lovemytruck said:


> WAS,
> 
> Just a thought. Did you ever consider borderline personality disorder?
> 
> I didn't read anything that indicated that you cheated. If you didn't, maybe when you feel the guilt of wanting out you can say to yourself, you didn't cheat.
> 
> You are the example of what a moral person does when they are faced with a bad relationship. You spared all of your families and her the pain of cheating. Divorce is tough, but if you chose that know that you did it in a dignified manner. As a BH, my hat is off to you for that.


LMT, I do wonder if she has some sort of underlying disorder. She can be difficult to deal with even when you approach her in a very calm and logical manner.

Nope didn't cheat. I really don't want the kids to know that she did either to be honest. I would like us to bury the hatchet, be terrific co-parents and be able to communicate without animosity. Sadly, I don't know if she is capable of that. This is my hesitation to move forward with the D!


----------



## tryingtobebetter

Have you discussed the position with your children?

One of the things I still resent about how my parents behaved (and this is fifty years later) is how they discussed matters between themselves and always presented me with their decisions. I had no input or ability to influence decisions which had a direct effect on my life.


----------



## Uptown

WhatASituation said:


> I do wonder if she has some sort of underlying disorder.


WAS, I suggest you see an IC psychologist (not a MC) -- for a visit or two _on your own_ -- to obtain a candid professional opinion on what you and your children are dealing with. Further, if you're interested in exploring LMT's suggestion that you consider the possibility of BPD, I suggest you read my overview of BPD traits in Maybe's thread at http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/33734-my-list-hell.html#post473522. If that description rings many bells, I would be glad to discuss them with you and point you to good online resources. Take care, WAS.


----------



## WhatASituation

Uptown said:


> WAS, I suggest you see an IC psychologist (not a MC) -- for a visit or two _on your own_ -- to obtain a candid professional opinion on what you and your children are dealing with. Further, if you're interested in exploring LMT's suggestion that you consider the possibility of BPD, I suggest you read my overview of BPD traits in Maybe's thread at http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/33734-my-list-hell.html#post473522. If that description rings many bells, I would be glad to discuss them with you and point you to good online resources. Take care, WAS.


Uptown, I've read some of your other posts about BPD. I have to tell you some bells did go off. From her getting angry at the drop of a hat, often times at inappropriate times, to spending, to her feeling like a "victim". Just wow! Funny thing, I did have an IC session this morning (before seeing your response) and even the counselor felt she she may indeed have some possible traits that might indicate a disorder. She's also our MC and she said she will focus more on her to see if she can pick up on some of the traits.

I wonder if deep down inside I know she's "not well" and my contemplating D has made me feel guilty. I know I am the "caretaker" as described in your posts. But I can't live like this anymore either!

Thank you for your insight!


----------



## Bobnoone

I just saw your post anonymously and felt compelled to post. I know exactly what you are going through but like you I am a procrastinator. I do not love my wife anymore and yes I fell in love with a woman who just left her marriage in another country. All I have to say is do not keep analysing. Get some courage and jump. I am going to try do it tonight. Wish me luck as I am scared yes but I know its for the better. Its not good to not be in love with your wife and drag it all on .Its not healthy and life passess you by. Im scared but Im going to do it even though it seem my other woman is out of the picture. Better for me.Dont wait to be like me a married cheater leave


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## WhatASituation

So we've had several MC sessions (at least I am trying here) and honestly, it's made things worse. Things have been brought up and although I am sympathetic to her past, it still doesn't allow me to forgive what she's done to me. So here I am, waiting to be financially able to move out and seeing my kids and knowing what's on the way. It kills me, and it feels like because of her actions, soon I won't be able to see my kids on a daily basis, which feeds into resentment. Like my handle says: what a situation! I know I am not alone, but it still sucks!


----------



## Prodigal

Hi, what. I just saw your thread pop back up, so I figured I'd put in my two cents. I re-read the entire thread, and here's what I came away with:

You are somewhat fixated on your wife's behaviors. Her eternal texting. Her rage. Her mood swings. I don't think it is relevant to figure out if she's BPD or any other possible diagnosis.

Now it's about YOU. Just you. You started this thread on September 26, 2012. Fast forward to almost four months later. You are still focused on her sh!t. And it keeps you stuck.

The opposite of love is NOT hate; it's indifference. If you were as indifferent as you claim to be, you wouldn't give a horse's patoot what she is doing and or with whom she is doing it.

You say you can't live like this anymore. Well, you are still living with her. Of course you can't forgive her at this point. She's still the main object on your radar screen. Forgiveness takes time. 

I am not trying to dispense legal advice, but I can tell you that many states are strictly no-fault. The court doesn't even recognize a situation in which a spouse walks in to find their partner in flagrante delicto ("in blazing offense"), a.k.a. "caught in the act." So all your evidence-gathering is all well and good if you want to get your wife to own up to whatever it is she's doing.

So, you are stuck because she seems emotionally unstable. You won't see your kids every day. You aren't in a financial position to leave. You feel guilty. All valid reasons. But sometimes our reasons become our excuses, and our excuses keep us from moving forward. 

Figure out why you are staying. Seriously. If you wanted out so badly, NOTHING would keep you from leaving. Nothing. Take it from someone who walked with no safety net. When the pain of staying exceeds the pain of leaving, you will go.


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## WhatASituation

Prodigal said:


> Hi, what. I just saw your thread pop back up, so I figured I'd put in my two cents. I re-read the entire thread, and here's what I came away with:
> 
> You are somewhat fixated on your wife's behaviors. Her eternal texting. Her rage. Her mood swings. I don't think it is relevant to figure out if she's BPD or any other possible diagnosis.
> 
> Now it's about YOU. Just you. You started this thread on September 26, 2012. Fast forward to almost four months later. You are still focused on her sh!t. And it keeps you stuck.
> 
> The opposite of love is NOT hate; it's indifference. If you were as indifferent as you claim to be, you wouldn't give a horse's patoot what she is doing and or with whom she is doing it.
> 
> You say you can't live like this anymore. Well, you are still living with her. Of course you can't forgive her at this point. She's still the main object on your radar screen. Forgiveness takes time.
> 
> I am not trying to dispense legal advice, but I can tell you that many states are strictly no-fault. The court doesn't even recognize a situation in which a spouse walks in to find their partner in flagrante delicto ("in blazing offense"), a.k.a. "caught in the act." So all your evidence-gathering is all well and good if you want to get your wife to own up to whatever it is she's doing.
> 
> So, you are stuck because she seems emotionally unstable. You won't see your kids every day. You aren't in a financial position to leave. You feel guilty. All valid reasons. But sometimes our reasons become our excuses, and our excuses keep us from moving forward.
> 
> Figure out why you are staying. Seriously. If you wanted out so badly, NOTHING would keep you from leaving. Nothing. Take it from someone who walked with no safety net. When the pain of staying exceeds the pain of leaving, you will go.


Hi Prodigal. At this point, I am no longer concerned with what she is doing. If she's still talking to OM's, more power to her! 

Long story short, on the financial side, my partners and I had to kick out another partner who was not doing right by the team. It really has set us all back unfortunately. Thankfully that will be changing next month with the acquisition of some new deals.

So what's stopping me? Well the financial concerns and the kids. She doesn't make much money and I do not want to put my kids in jeopardy financially. It changes in February and I can finally make my moves. Also, I've been preparing some things in that aspect making sure I have as much control as I legally can. 

As far as the "evidence", I don't care about it anymore. I know it won't do a thing in a court proceeding. I will however use it as "blackmail" if she doesn't agree to my terms. I'm sure her family members would be shocked to see it. She really wouldn't want that as they think she's an "angel".


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## turnera

It would help if you stick to one thread.


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## WhatASituation

turnera said:


> It would help if you stick to one thread.


Not sure how helpful that is, but ok.


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## Prodigal

I wish you well with your business. In these difficult economic times, I admire small-business owners; it ain't easy.

I think your children will be okay, financially speaking. You'll have to pay child support. As far as the wife goes, the court may recommend temporary spousal support. In other words, she gets some financial assistance from you, but it's up to her to find a job that generates more cash flow. 

You might want consider showing an attorney your terms before you present them to your wife. A good family law attorney will be able to assess if what you are asking for is reasonable. Don't show her your trump card. In fact, I think it would be in your best interests to show her nothing until you clear it with an attorney.

Best of luck, and keep us posted on how this situation progresses.


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## turnera

It's helpful because you start in on this new thread with a whole history behind you and start in talking about an ongoing situation that most people know nothing about, so we either have to hunt down all your old threads and try to piece together the history or just not get involved at all. Or give bad advice cos we don't know the story. If it's all in one thread, people can start at the beginning and read all the way through.


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## WhatASituation

turnera said:


> It's helpful because you start in on this new thread with a whole history behind you and start in talking about an ongoing situation that most people know nothing about, so we either have to hunt down all your old threads and try to piece together the history or just not get involved at all. Or give bad advice cos we don't know the story. If it's all in one thread, people can start at the beginning and read all the way through.


Um..this is MY one and only thread I have ever started since I've joined TAM. Look at page one, the OP is me. 

Am I not allowed to respond to other threads? Isn't that the point of a forum? People provide updates all the time. That's all I did.


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## turnera

I apologize. I was going off what Prodigal said, that he went back and reread your thread. I mistakenly assumed it was another one.


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## Jackdaniels

I noticed "talk to your wife" several times in some of these postings. LOL!!! I am going and have been going through the same thing and there is NO talking to my wife. Trust me!!! If I say "I feel like you do not love me", her reply will be "I feel the same way!!"
If I say "I am not happy in this marriage", her reply will be "I feel the same way!!". No matter what you say or do, you are wrong and she is right as she comes down with her harsh tones. You have no idea.
As far as sex [making love] I am lucky if it is once a year. Has been that way for almost 20 years.
Finally, there are statements as "move on". And where does he go? Once a man walks out the door, it is a whole different ballgame. She [the wife] gets everything and lives happily ever after. The man [husband] is out in the street with nothing. 
I would love to leave my wife, but she would get the house that I paid for and worked on over the years.


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## EleGirl

Jackdaniels said:


> I noticed "talk to your wife" several times in some of these postings. LOL!!! I am going and have been going through the same thing and there is NO talking to my wife. Trust me!!! If I say "I feel like you do not love me", her reply will be "I feel the same way!!"
> 
> If I say "I am not happy in this marriage", her reply will be "I feel the same way!!". No matter what you say or do, you are wrong and she is right as she comes down with her harsh tones. You have no idea.
> 
> As far as sex [making love] I am lucky if it is once a year. Has been that way for almost 20 years.
> 
> Finally, there are statements as "move on". And where does he go? Once a man walks out the door, it is a whole different ballgame. She [the wife] gets everything and lives happily ever after. The man [husband] is out in the street with nothing.
> I would love to leave my wife, but she would get the house that I paid for and worked on over the years.


Keep in mind that not every woman is your wife. 

And, in divorce the wife does not get everything. Geez


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