# Guess what ladies? It works both ways!



## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

I was reading the "Why would a woman get married" thread. The whole women getting older losing their looks thing makes me truly sick. NEWSFLASH: Men lose their looks too! Dpending on the man or woman... some people still look great as the age... and shoudlnt it be about more than that anyway???

A few examples. 1) Not long ago I was approached by a guy at a club. We talked for a bit and a male friend of mine sat next to me and we started talking also. The guy asked "Oh are you two together?" I said "Oh he's just one of my boyfriends" with a very straight face. He looked at me with completel open-eyed awe. "You have more than one? he asked. "Yeah" I said "Well you know... I get tired of looking at the same face day-after-day" The guy that I was being completely serious and looked highly insulted (and harassed me about ti later :roll eyes: )

2) I was hanging out with some guy friends and we were talking about infidelity. One mentioned that even though he has had affairs if he ever found his wife did he would drop her immediately.. and he has no idea where this hypocrisy comes from. I think men have been given the idea for so long they are entitled when it comes to women and many still think of them as propoerty.. or as one guy said: when another guy takes your only woman, its like they have taken your entire country. Great.. so some view us as land. :roll eyes : 

3) I mentioned I have a crush on a guy who is quite a bit younger than me to some guy friends who are a bit older than me. I went on to tell them how younger guys are just so much more attractive... with their younger bodies and no baggage. They both freaked and gave me attitude. But also both said they've dated younger women but it always comes down to compatibility in the end and are both with women their age currently.

4) Knew a guy who divorced his wife because she left herself go. He married a new woman about 1.5 years later who was 17 years younger than him and physically attractive to him. Well 2 years later and she has driven him absolutely crazy. They are divorcing in a few months.

So dont be fooled ladies (and guys). Everyone wants to be loved and accepted! WOMEN NEED TO STOP JUDGING THEMSELVES SO DAMN HARD and letting the STUPID MEDIA MAKE them SO INSECURE!!! THERE IS MUCH MORE TO LIFE AND LOVE THAN APPEARANCE!!!!!!!


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

That part about the "land" made me laugh!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

Me too.. when I reminisced on it. Guy who said it is the same ass in my other post (if you read it)


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## meson (May 19, 2011)

lotuslove said:


> So dont be fooled ladies (and guys). Everyone wants to be loved and accepted! WOMEN NEED TO STOP JUDGING THEMSELVES SO DAMN HARD and letting the STUPID MEDIA MAKE them SO INSECURE!!! THERE IS MUCH MORE TO LIFE AND LOVE THAN APPEARANCE!!!!!!!


:iagree::iagree::iagree:

Yes, I am one of those that think the typical media view of beauty is not. Most of what a person is is defined by their actions (of loving and acceptance) not their outward appearance.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

I am the person who made the post. I want to make sure you understand that I in no way said women loose their looks, more so than a man. In fact, of the women I know, they look better than their husbands. 
There is this myth that men get better with age. Why? It is because they can score a younger woman for a relationship. However, on closer inspection, what is that relationship really about? It is about a power imbalance. A 20 something is with a 40 year old man because of his resources. Is she with him because he is just so darn sexy? Nope. Would she be with him if he made $30k a year? Not a chance. The man on the other hand gets adoration at a price. He gets his ego stroked and his self esteem boosted. Again, at a price. He also gets to feel important and rarely challenged. It isn't a sustained relationship. Once the money runs out or he looses his looks even more, she moves on to her next mark. 
This isn't my opinion either. This is from numerous articles explaining the allure of younger women. Psychology Today being one of them. They tend to know what they are talking about.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

lotuslove said:


> Great.. so some view us as land.


Go secede and be Kosovo or Biafra or something. I'll make you a flag.


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> I am the person who made the post. I want to make sure you understand that I in no way said women loose their looks, more so than a man. In fact, of the women I know, they look better than their husbands.
> There is this myth that men get better with age. Why? It is because they can score a younger woman for a relationship. However, on closer inspection, what is that relationship really about? It is about a power imbalance. A 20 something is with a 40 year old man because of his resources. Is she with him because he is just so darn sexy? Nope. Would she be with him if he made $30k a year? Not a chance. The man on the other hand gets adoration at a price. He gets his ego stroked and his self esteem boosted. Again, at a price. He also gets to feel important and rarely challenged. It isn't a sustained relationship. Once the money runs out or he looses his looks even more, she moves on to her next mark.
> This isn't my opinion either. This is from numerous articles explaining the allure of younger women. Psychology Today being one of them. They tend to know what they are talking about.


Maybe in "typical" summer/winter relationships that's the case... but I went with a much older man for quite a while who did not have $.. lived in a 1-brdm apartment. Ironically, latelty I've been interested in a much younger man. Comes aruond goes around I guess.

Funny you mention how most older women look better than their same-age partners. I was at a festival once and a guy with a big beer belly and bald was crticizing his thin same-age female partner about some stupid little thing. I wanted to turn to him and say "why dont you lose some weight and get a hair transplant??"


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

lotuslove said:


> Maybe in "typical" summer/winter relationships that's the case... but I went with a much older man for quite a while who did not have $.. lived in a 1-brdm apartment. Ironically, latelty I've been interested in a much younger man. Comes aruond goes around I guess.
> 
> Funny you mention how most older women look better than their same-age partners. I was at a festival once and a guy with a big beer belly and bald was crticizing his thin same-age female partner about some stupid little thing. I wanted to turn to him and say "why dont you lose some weight and get a hair transplant??"


When some men say that they typically age better, the references I've seen are often by men who tended to be more involved in sports, hiking, running etc, while it used to be more common for women to avoid physical fitness. This dynamic doesn't seem to exist any more, I don't think. There used to be a very common thread about men who felt that their wives were unable to do things with them anymore. I do think that it is less common these days. More women choose fitness. My wife usually avoids extreme physical fitness, even though we own our own gym, and I think this is why many people ask her if I am her oldest son, except when she gets her hair colored. Her hair has thinned a bit, but mine hasn't. 

For ten year, my wife and I have been forced to vacation apart when I want to take the children on a vacation that includes hiking or swimming. My older brother and I often just go together, with our kids.

Now, it seems that men are far more likely to choose activities that are much more sedentary. I think this is the key for men and women.


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

john9 said:


> Nothing special.


?


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Whther someone ages better has to do with genes and diet and exercise. That's it. I've seen some men and women who are older and look hot as hell, even better than they did when younger. Just as I've seen young people who loook old as hell of both genders.

Re: the infidelity thing--I do think women who cheat get dogged a lot more than men, or rather, it's more socially acceptable for men/infidelity than women, if that makes sense.


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## SockPuppet (May 16, 2011)

Sure,

Weak tactics used by pathetic men can be used by women. By why would you want to emulate this behaviour, kind of misses the point, IMO.

I know Ill take **** for saying this, but, case in point, women are women's worst enemy.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

What "weak tactics" are you talking about?


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Jellybeans said:


> Re: the infidelity thing--I do think women who cheat get dogged a lot more than men, or rather, it's more socially acceptable for men/infidelity than women, if that makes sense.


I read an article written by Rabbi Botech about infidelity. Normally I agree with virtually everything he writes but this article left my jaw hanging down. He wrote that when a woman cheats, it is worse than when a man cheats. He cited that women cheat for emotional reasons and men for physical ones and he ended his article with "and that is why it's worse when a woman cheats". Huh?

He essentially said that a man who cheats can be "excused" if you will where as a woman cannot because she cheated with her "heart". He then trucked out the typical "biology" statement with regards to men as their reason for being unfaithful. 

After reading the article I felt like I needed a shower. If a man cheats it is because you got fat, didn't have sex enough, weren't pretty anymore, he needed variety, etc. When a woman cheats, it's because she is morally devoid, never took her vows seriously and was looking for validation from men/had psch issues. Bottom line: man cheats=womans fault. Woman cheats=womans fault. Um, yeah.

FWIW, of the people who I know who have cheated or been cheated on, most of the women did it for the "thrill" where as the men did it because they felt unneeded or unloved. So the Rabbi's theory gets tossed out, at least from the people I have known. 

Also, one isn't worse than the other. BOTH are awful and destroy marriages but according to the good Rabbi, the women deserve more scorn. Nathaniel Hawthorne would be so proud. His fictional book is alive and well in real modern society.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Real, both my exH and I cheated. (Total disaster, btw).

I forgave him. He told me he would NEVER forgive me.

Later he told me he was "just being a guy" --that what I did was much worse.

So there's that. Yeah.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Jellybeans said:


> Real, both my exH and I cheated. (Total disaster, btw).
> 
> I forgave him. He told me he would NEVER forgive me.
> 
> ...


Actually, you were "just being a woman". Women on a biological level need to have offspring by multiple men. Survival of the fittest. 
It blows me away that (some) men rely on biology for bad behavior but never allow a woman to do the same. The good Rabbi sure didn't and it appears your ex didn't either but both sure excused it with regards to the male sex. Amazing and where is my double standard vomit bag?


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Actually, you were "just being a woman". Women on a biological level need to have offspring by multiple men. Survival of the fittest.


Ah, yes. Of course.


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## SockPuppet (May 16, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> What "weak tactics" are you talking about?


The kind of tactics, which, if I described in great detail would have you swooning after me like a love sick puppy

However, after re-reading the thread I realise Im totally off topic, hanging out in left field all by my lonesome. I dont really know what Im talking about... 



> He essentially said that a man who cheats can be "excused" if you will where as a woman cannot because she cheated with her "heart". He then trucked out the typical "biology" statement with regards to men as their reason for being unfaithful.


I think from a logical standpoint it makes sence, he is just differentiating between male and female context. But just because something makes logical sence doesnt make it right.

In TAM there have been many short lived debates on which is worse, PA's or EA's. People quickly come to consensus that EA's are worse. I know Article is all about PA, but giving your heart and body is worse than just your body... But Im just splitting hairs now, its all bad.

But maybe this takes us full circle back to my arguement for logic. Again, Im saying I disagree with the Rabbi conclusion, just trying to provide insight as to why he would say such things. Then again I could be totally off mark, Its going to be a long day.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

SockPuppet said:


> The kind of tactics, which, if I described in great detail would have you swooning after me like a love sick puppy
> 
> However, after re-reading the thread I realise Im totally off topic, hanging out in left field all by my lonesome. I dont really know what Im talking about...
> 
> ...


Biologically though, a woman is predisposed to cheat due to the need to have as much sperm in her and the "race to the egg' if you will. Survival of the fittest. So why would it be excused for a man to cheat and not for a woman. Both are terrible choices. One shouldn't get a pass where as the other gets crucified for the same action.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

SockPuppet said:


> The kind of tactics, which, if I described in great detail would have you swooning after me like a love sick puppy


Oh lawd. :rofl:



Therealbrighteyes said:


> Biologically though, a woman is predisposed to cheat due to the need to have as much sperm in her and the "race to the egg' if you will.


 You are cracking me up today!


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Jellybeans said:


> Oh lawd. :rofl:
> 
> 
> 
> You are cracking me up today!


It's actually true though. Hey, maybe I should rely MORE on biology and throw away restraint, rational thought and evolution. Hey, I would never have to shop for groceries again. I'm a gatherer after all. I could just jack people coming out of a store.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

SockPuppet said:


> The kind of tactics, which, if I described in great detail would have you swooning after me like a love sick puppy
> 
> However, after re-reading the thread I realise Im totally off topic, hanging out in left field all by my lonesome. I dont really know what Im talking about...
> 
> ...


There is nothing wrong with left field. Some of the best plays at the plate come from left field. And this is about getting past 3rd base and scoring at home.

Our biology pre-disposes us to certain urges. It does not excuse poor behavior. It is not a black and white world. We live in the shades of grey. Behaviors are judged by society.

There was a tribe some freaking place that on a yearly basis women were expected to have sex all night long with the men coming of age. I remember a documentary on this where they focused on one husband and wife. It was early morning and she was in a fenzy and had had sex with twenty plus guys. Her husband finally intervened against the accepted behavior of the tribe. He physically did not hurt his wife, but told her it was enough. he ran teh other guys off. He took her hand and brought her home. She was very upset. He obviously was insecure and jealous. Her family protested and said that as a woman she had every right and duty to copulate as she saw fit. That this was a special day for her each year which she cherished and thoroughly enjoyed. All in good fun.

Now the purpose of this had to do with the survival of the tribe. The husband was expected to care for any children that the wife had. The child she had would have been the result of sperm competition. So a very fit child. 

I think there are some men on this forum who would opt for this scenario because their wife would only be having one GNO a year.


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

As to the rabbi and the guy who said "I was just being a guy"... BULL****! I know plenty of women who have had affairs just for sex... and like poster above said... women are just as suscpetible sexually and biologically speaking.

Another great example of religious sexual hypocrisy. if a priest impregnated a nun.. she would be forced to have an abortion and could not continnue with her nun practice.. whereas the priest could continue his.


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## SockPuppet (May 16, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Biologically though, a woman is predisposed to cheat due to the need to have as much sperm in her and the "race to the egg' if you will. Survival of the fittest. So why would it be excused for a man to cheat and not for a woman. Both are terrible choices. One shouldn't get a pass where as the other gets crucified for the same action.


This I have not considered... Until now, DUN DUN DUUUUUUUN.

The Rabbi starts off saying physical reasons vs. emotional reasons. But then he pulls out the biology card and applies it only to men.

I think thats a mannish thing to do. The old switcheroo. Start the premise comparing apples to apples, then, when your partially clothed big breasted assistant comes out, swap the lady apple for an orange to create an unfair playing field. 

I certainly fell for it.




> There is nothing wrong with left field. Some of the best plays at the plate come from left field. And this is about getting past 3rd base and scoring at home.


Im going to take that as a compliment whether it was intended that way or not. But left field feels an awful lot like Plato's depiction of the "just man"... Left field is very lonely.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Biologically though, a woman is predisposed to cheat due to the need to have as much sperm in her and the "race to the egg' if you will. Survival of the fittest. So why would it be excused for a man to cheat and not for a woman. Both are terrible choices. One shouldn't get a pass where as the other gets crucified for the same action.


Are you forgetting the genetic imperative to propagate with the most able and fit men of the species?


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

SockPuppet said:


> This I have not considered... Until now, DUN DUN DUUUUUUUN.
> 
> The Rabbi starts off saying physical reasons vs. emotional reasons. But then he pulls out the biology card and applies it only to men.
> 
> ...


I have actually read Plato's Republic. That puts me in left field too. My point is that left field has its purpose. We all bring things to the table. I am sorry if you find it lonely. I was in no way poking fun at you.

But I get your point.

I guess my ego is so big, I could care less what lesser men do. That said I have found that I am not superman either and need to be aware of my wired in biology as well as the next person. But I do not have to be slave to it. I should however, live in concert with it. Make it work for me and not against.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Entropy3000 said:


> There is nothing wrong with left field. Some of the best plays at the plate come from left field. And this is about getting past 3rd base and scoring at home.
> 
> Our biology pre-disposes us to certain urges. It does not excuse poor behavior. It is not a black and white world. We live in the shades of grey. Behaviors are judged by society.
> 
> ...


I think that tribe is my sister. 

Are you ever going to give GNO a rest, ever? 
We aren't all shreeking violets ya know. Some of us are capable of saying "no", "I'm married", "thanks but no thanks", "go away", "I have mace", "I have a stun gun" and "I carry a Glock". 
Just food for thought Ent. Here's another food for thought. If a person wants to cheat they will do so no matter the surroundings. Workplaces come to mind and alcohol doesn't play a factor there yet is the NUMBER ONE place a married person finds their cheater partner. So let's ban working the same way you want to "outlaw" GNO.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Halien said:


> Are you forgetting the genetic imperative to propagate with the most able and fit men of the species?


Not forgetting at all. 
Women can have children in to their late 40's. Not the ideal but they can. 
So if we are talking purely biology here, why would she choose to stay with her aging husband whose sperm isn't nearly as healthy as his younger counterparts? 
How many women do you know who dumped their husbands because they got old? I don't know any. I know plenty who got divorced because of other reasons, age wasn't part of the equation.
Consequently, how many men do you know who dumped their wives because they got old? It's a tale as old as time. I know three and they all cited their "wiring" despite none of them wanting more children.
Again, using biology as some lame excuse for crappy behavior is just that. A lame excuse.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> I think that tribe is my sister.
> 
> Are you ever going to give GNO a rest, ever?
> We aren't all shreeking violets ya know. Some of us are capable of saying "no", "I'm married", "thanks but no thanks", "go away", "I have mace", "I have a stun gun" and "I carry a Glock".
> Just food for thought Ent. Here's another food for thought. If a person wants to cheat they will do so no matter the surroundings. Workplaces come to mind and alcohol doesn't play a factor there yet is the NUMBER ONE place a married person finds their cheater partner. So let's ban working the same way you want to "outlaw" GNO.


Most people who go astray do not do so on purpose. They have needs that are not getting met. It happens over time.

Work places and the internet cause much of this. Adding alcohol to this is a catalyst. We agree to disagree on this.

That type of GNO, is a red flag to husbands. Don't shoot the messanger.

My GNO reference was expediant to the story.


I think a woman who carries a Glock is freakin hot.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> *I think that tribe is my sister. *
> 
> Are you ever going to give GNO a rest, ever?
> We aren't all shreeking violets ya know. Some of us are capable of saying "no", "I'm married", "thanks but no thanks", "go away", "I have mace", "I have a stun gun" and "I carry a Glock".
> Just food for thought Ent. Here's another food for thought. If a person wants to cheat they will do so no matter the surroundings. Workplaces come to mind and alcohol doesn't play a factor there yet is the NUMBER ONE place a married person finds their cheater partner. So let's ban working the same way you want to "outlaw" GNO.


You crack me up. :rofl:

We have to work. We don't have to go to do the other.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Entropy3000 said:


> You crack me up. :rofl:
> 
> We have to work. We don't have to go to do the other.


No, you don't actually have to work. You could rely on biology and kill off the competition and thus steal his things for survival.
Wait, what? That isn't an option?
Relying on biology for sh!tty behavior is just that, sh!tty behavior.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> No, you don't actually have to work. You could rely on biology and kill off the competition and thus steal his things for survival.
> Wait, what? That isn't an option?
> Relying on biology for sh!tty behavior is just that, sh!tty behavior.


I agree that thinking below the waist for men can only hurt the team.

I don't think biology is an excuse.

My spin on it for people is that they realize the biology and make sure they do not rely on it for their behavior. Just because it feels ok, does not make it ok.

But go on.


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## NotaGoodSlave (Jul 29, 2011)

Women are like cars - they quickly depreciate in value over time. The depreciation of a woman's value to a man occurs for two primary reasons:
1. A woman's appearance fades very quickly after 30.
2. The sex becomes routine. Males are hard-wired for variety.

Women desire men for financial security. A man's ability to provide financial security tends to increase over time. This is why you see the wealthy older man with the much younger second wife.


Back to the car analogy:
You are a very well used 2006 rental car with 265,000 miles on the odometer sitting on a used car lot looking for a buyer (a commitment). The used car sales rep. is telling the perspective male buyer that all of those many miles on you do not mean a thing, nor does your worn out "tail pipe", and that all of those many different drivers who have carelessly slamed you into speed bumps or into curbs because you were just a rental car for the evening did not reduce your value in the least. And that old stained seat......well not an issue.......you won't see the stain when you are sitting on it afterall ..............then the male buyer walks away, shaking his head, heading towards the new car lot to buy a car (make a committment to) that has value to him.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

NotaGoodSlave said:


> Women are like cars - they quickly depreciate in value over time. The depreciation of a woman's value to a man occurs for two primary reasons:
> 1. A woman's appearance fades very quickly after 30.
> 2. The sex becomes routine. Males are hard-wired for variety.
> 
> ...


:rofl::rofl:

The 20th and 21st century must have knocked you on your a$$.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Slave...seriously? Women are used cars? Just wow...
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> :rofl::rofl:
> 
> The 20th and 21st century must have knocked you on your a$$.


So this is all you have for this. Yet you beat on me for what I say!!

:rofl::rofl:

OMG

I don't know why this reminds me but I put a blower on my Cobra. 

I was looking for a vanity plate and B L O W N was available. 

My wife just told me NO. I chose wisely I think and opted for something else.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> Slave...seriously? Women are used cars? Just wow...
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think he is F'd up but also realize some of us men love our cars.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Jellybeans said:


> Slave...seriously? Women are used cars? Just wow...
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Better that he sticks with a newer automatic. They're a dime a dozen and virtually the only thing on the lot. It's much easier, no shifting required and often times comes with GPS and back up sensors to tell you if you are about to run over something.

Standards are much more difficult to drive. Sure you can force it from gear to gear but it takes training to get it from 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th, without blowing out the clutch. The rewards for driving a standard are feeling the rush when you push down your foot and take it in to 5th gear, going over 90 mph. The shifting and the sheer ecstasy. No sensors needed. 

There's a reason the best and most expensive sports cars in the world are antiques and standards. 

Slave, stick with your new Corolla. I'll stick with my Austin Healey.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

I owned a 356 Porsche Carrera 2 with a type 547/587 2000CS engine. You had to drop the engine to change the spark plugs (8 on a 4 cyl engine). The dual Weber 3-barrel carbs had to be tuned to the ALTITUDE I drove at. It wouldn't run right unless I used 104 octane aviation fuel since I had it running a shade over 9.5:1. It had dual Allison magnetos that were nearly impossible to synch right and could be controlled seperately. The Fuhrmann-Wankel Quad-OHC 'tinker-toy' assembly was nightmarishly complicated even by racing engine standards. The brakes were heavily. It had a 5 speed manual no synchro on 1st or 2nd. 1st gear was mushy and hard to find. It used an outboard drysump oil pan which seriously needed to be warmed up for 10 minutes before running the car at normal stress. There was no governor to limit freewheeling when downshifting which is a big deal for an engine that can routinely run at 7k rpm. 

But I had it running at a steady 165hp with a very flat power band from 4k-7k rpm and gobs of torque. For a car that barely weighed 1800lbs having almost a single digit weight to power ratio meant I could blow the doors off most anything. 

Fun car to drive. Absolute horror show to own. Glad I got rid of it.


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

NotaGoodSlave said:


> Women are like cars - they quickly depreciate in value over time. The depreciation of a woman's value to a man occurs for two primary reasons:
> 1. A woman's appearance fades very quickly after 30.
> 2. The sex becomes routine. Males are hard-wired for variety.
> 
> ...


Um.. yeah. Currentrly I know 3 women in marriages who are very bored with their sex life. One is about to meet a guy 12 years younger than her she met on Facebook (I'm not condoning cheating btw)

Many men also lose their appearance after 40 and become IMPOTENT (been with two men with this)

Nothing wrong with people wanting to drive many cars... there also lots of other people who also like to play the field. Why can't people spare the drama and do it honestly though? just so long as people do it honestly. Its' called polygamy and swinging where two married people are involved.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Entropy3000 said:


> I think he is F'd up but also realize some of us men love out cars.


Well, going through his posts, I agree that he's got a funny way of thinking, very anti-women and claims to have never been married (suprise!). In fact, his postings are very similar to this one troll who was banned before, can't remember his name though...will have to check...same style of writing, anti-women, claimed he had never been married.... hmmm...


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

if women are like cars then I like low maitance cars ............


no car payment and something I get to tune up every so often.

you know check the oil with my dip stick and give it a good polish once in a while . Oh and don't forget a lube jobs very important for good gas miliage and lots of miles.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Runs like Dog said:


> I owned a 356 Porsche Carrera 2 with a type 547/587 2000CS engine. Y*ou had to drop the engine to change the spark plugs (8 on a 4 cyl engine).* The dual Weber 3-barrel carbs had to be tuned to the ALTITUDE I drove at. It wouldn't run right unless I used 104 octane aviation fuel since I had it running a shade over 9.5:1. It had dual Allison magnetos that were nearly impossible to synch right and could be controlled seperately. The Fuhrmann-Wankel Quad-OHC 'tinker-toy' assembly was nightmarishly complicated even by racing engine standards. The brakes were heavily. It had a 5 speed manual no synchro on 1st or 2nd. 1st gear was mushy and hard to find. It used an outboard drysump oil pan which seriously needed to be warmed up for 10 minutes before running the car at normal stress. There was no governor to limit freewheeling when downshifting which is a big deal for an engine that can routinely run at 7k rpm.
> 
> But I had it running at a steady 165hp with a very flat power band from 4k-7k rpm and gobs of torque. For a car that barely weighed 1800lbs having almost a single digit weight to power ratio meant I could blow the doors off most anything.
> 
> *Fun car to drive. Absolute horror show to own. Glad I got rid of it.*


Some women are this way as well. Not that one would own another person.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

lotuslove said:


> Um.. yeah. Currentrly I know 3 women in marriages who are very bored with their sex life. One is about to meet a guy 12 years younger than her she met on Facebook (I'm not condoning cheating btw)
> 
> Many men also lose their appearance after 40 and become IMPOTENT (been with two men with this)
> 
> Nothing wrong with people wanting to drive many cars... there also lots of other people who also like to play the field. Why can't people spare the drama and do it honestly though? just so long as people do it honestly. Its' called polygamy and swinging where two married people are involved.


Nevermind. I thought you said IMPORTANT.

My only comments on open marriages are: Just not anything I would be interested in. If my wife wanted that I would let her go on her own and terminate our marriage.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

chillymorn said:


> if women are like cars then I like low maitance cars ............
> 
> 
> no car payment and something I get to tune up every so often.
> ...


I need performance along with good reliability. Not looking for high maintenance but for good performance you need to provide faithful attention. A good care will take care of you if you take care of it.

It is kind of like a garden .... ( oops Chauncy Gadner )


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Entropy3000 said:


> Some women are this way as well. Not that one would own another person.


I want a bumpersticker that says "My other wife is an MGB, the only thing it swallows is valves"


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Entropy3000 said:


> My only comments on open marriages are: Just not anything I would be interested in. If my wife wanted that I would let her go on her own and terminate our marriage.


Sigh. Now if only someone could get that through to Walt & Emb...


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Runs like Dog said:


> I want a bumpersticker that says "My other wife is an MGB, the only thing it swallows is valves"


:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:


----------



## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> Sigh. Now if only someone could get that through to Walt & Emb...


You have to have some boundaries.

:iagree:


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## CLucas976 (Jun 27, 2010)

you know what this made me think of? Cadillacs.

I was part of a caddy forum a while back when I owned Suzie. (My BELOVED eldorado)

a poster said something like "I drive cars for my bosses constantly, I have driven everything, porche, bmw, mercedees, etc [I can't remember the full list] and then I look out into the drive way at my cadillac. It's old, the bumper is hanging, it has stains, rips, quirks, but there is nothing better than getting into that car and taking it for a drive, I can't help but love every inch"

something along those lines anyways. But, Cadillac lovers are just that, there is no other car period. I know, take me to an old car show and I will swoon over the rust bucket with ripped up seats and huge fins that magically still runs and no one knows why.

lol, so thinking about it, I would guess I'm the female version of a caddy. I might be unkempt, have quirks, couple scratches and dents, but overly reliable, a powerhouse for an engine, total comfort, and versatile. but when you break it, it's not always a cheap fix. 

it's kind of funny looking at it that way, because on those standards I know both porches and Minivans too haha!


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## NotaGoodSlave (Jul 29, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Better that he sticks with a newer automatic. They're a dime a dozen and virtually the only thing on the lot. It's much easier, no shifting required and often times comes with GPS and back up sensors to tell you if you are about to run over something.
> 
> Standards are much more difficult to drive. Sure you can force it from gear to gear but it takes training to get it from 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th, without blowing out the clutch. The rewards for driving a standard are feeling the rush when you push down your foot and take it in to 5th gear, going over 90 mph. The shifting and the sheer ecstasy. No sensors needed.
> 
> ...


Actually my car is a 2011 Porshe Carrera S.
I can afford a $105,000 car because I never married.


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## NotaGoodSlave (Jul 29, 2011)

lotuslove said:


> Um.. yeah. Currentrly I know 3 women in marriages who are very bored with their sex life. One is about to meet a guy 12 years younger than her she met on Facebook (I'm not condoning cheating btw)
> 
> Many men also lose their appearance after 40 and become IMPOTENT (been with two men with this)
> 
> Nothing wrong with people wanting to drive many cars... there also lots of other people who also like to play the field. Why can't people spare the drama and do it honestly though? just so long as people do it honestly. Its' called polygamy and swinging where two married people are involved.


"yeah. Currentrly I know 3 women in marriages who are very bored with their sex life. One is about to meet a guy 12 years younger than her she met on Facebook "

You have made my overall point. Marriage is a mistake for men. Did the unfortunate husbands of these "bored" women, and one soon to be chearter, make a wise decision about signing a marriage contract with these women.....NO they clearly did not - they will soon be cheated on, or sued for divorce and wiped out, or both.

The husbands of these "bored" women would have been much better off from a financial perspective and from sexual variety perspective if they would have choosen to remain single.


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## NotaGoodSlave (Jul 29, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> Well, going through his posts, I agree that he's got a funny way of thinking, very anti-women and claims to have never been married (suprise!). In fact, his postings are very similar to this one troll who was banned before, can't remember his name though...will have to check...same style of writing, anti-women, claimed he had never been married.... hmmm...


I am not "anti-woman" nor am I a misogynist. A number of my closest personal friends are women and I have every confidence that the women I work with would vouch for my integrity. I have sex with women on a regular basis and enjoy their company very much from both a sexual and nonsexual perspective. But I would never marry any of them.

In my view marriage is simply a raw deal for men - there is no "upside" but there is huge "downside" risk in marraige for a man - namely the risk of financial ruin. The fact is that a man can obtain everything he needs from a woman without entering into a contract of marriage with her.

Now of course my "car analogy" was made with some humorous intent. I obvously understand that women are not cars. My point is that a woman's ability to attract a quality man, and hold his interest, depreciates very quickly after she reaches a certain age, just as a car's value depreciates when it is driven off of the lot. A denial of this analogy is simply a denial of reality.

I found this website by accident while doing a web search for yet another male friend who was being sued for divorce by his wife. My "funny thinking" viewpoints are foreign to you because you have a vested interest in believing the fallacy that the signing a contract of marriage is as good a deal for men as it is for women...........


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

NotaGoodSlave said:


> Actually my car is a 2011 Porshe Carrera S.
> I can afford a $105,000 car because I never married.


Sure it is, that's why you spelled Porsche incorrectly.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

NotaGoodSlave said:


> Actually my car is a 2011 Porshe Carrera S.
> I can afford a $105,000 car because I never married.





Therealbrighteyes said:


> Sure it is, that's why you spelled Porsche incorrectly.


:lol::lol::lol::lol:


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## NotaGoodSlave (Jul 29, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Sure it is, that's why you spelled Porsche incorrectly.


A simple typo error late at night after a long day at the office.........take that for what you will. I also have the PDK dual clutch as an option.............hence the 6 fixgure cost.

I choose to argue my point that marriage is a raw deal for men with facts and observations.......not by spotting for typo errors.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

NotaGoodSlave said:


> A simple typo error late at night after a long day at the office.........take that for what you will. I also have the PDK dual clutch as an option.............hence the 6 fixgure cost.
> 
> I choose to argue my point that marriage is a raw deal for men with facts and observations.......not by spotting for typo errors.



Or by being accurate. 

Are men stupid, easily led, or easy to brainwash?? 

I really think that you are smarter and more independent of mind than the average man, why don't you write a book, start a movement? Too busy with that high powered profession? Understandable. 

You could be the male Bella Abzug of the modern age. Free men from the servitude to women. You are certainly better than that old broad, being the cream of the human crop with your pick of the hottest youngest women. She was a congresswoman while she led the movement for woman for goodness sake. 

If the movement really takes off, there will not be enough hot 20 yr olds to go around or, not enough willing hot 20 yo's for old men to get new models. Got to watch that it dose not turn into a Warren Jeffs type of thing. Young boys being be tossed out of the movement so they don't compete for the young girls. Girls being forced to be with old guys. 

You have credibility. You are a living example of what a man's life could be like if he follows you.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

My husband drives a 12 yr old Toyota Camry. I hope he does not see this. He could have a his dream car a 1955 Ford Crown Victoria 272. A fully restored one is over $100,000. 

He is saddled with me, for the time being, and two kids. Who knows thought, in 10 years or less, I will be way past my prime, the kids will be almost in college and he may make his move for freedom. 

:woohoo::woohoo::woohoo:


He can get his muscle car and do chicks 2X2 and live happily ever after


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

NotaGoodSlave said:


> "yeah. Currentrly I know 3 women in marriages who are very bored with their sex life. One is about to meet a guy 12 years younger than her she met on Facebook "
> 
> You have made my overall point. Marriage is a mistake for men. Did the unfortunate husbands of these "bored" women, and one soon to be chearter, make a wise decision about signing a marriage contract with these women.....NO they clearly did not - they will soon be cheated on, or sued for divorce and wiped out, or both.
> 
> The husbands of these "bored" women would have been much better off from a financial perspective and from sexual variety perspective if they would have choosen to remain single.


Let me elaborate. She is bored with him because he does nothing romantic, doesnt take care of himself physically and never wants to do anything with her (no shared interests, no vacations). It may be the SHE would have been better off from a sexual variety aspect as well as she has several potentially nterested lovers. Do you think marriage can be a mistake for some women too?

The point I was really trying to make though is it's not just guys who lose interest in their same-age partners and turn to younger ones.

Marriage is a mistake for people who dont belong together or believe in it. Franky, I doubt I will ever marry because I dont really believe in the legality of it... but I know quite a few couples who really are with the right person and have amazing truly loving marriages.


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

NotaGoodSlave said:


> I am not "anti-woman" nor am I a misogynist. A number of my closest personal friends are women and I have every confidence that the women I work with would vouch for my integrity. I have sex with women on a regular basis and enjoy their company very much from both a sexual and nonsexual perspective. But I would never marry any of them.
> 
> In my view marriage is simply a raw deal for men - there is no "upside" but there is huge "downside" risk in marraige for a man - namely the risk of financial ruin. The fact is that a man can obtain everything he needs from a woman without entering into a contract of marriage with her.
> 
> ...


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

BTW.. Notagoodslave.. what must you think of older women like Demi Moore with young studs?


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

lotuslove said:


> BTW.. Notagoodslave.. what must you think of older women like Demi Moore with young studs?


I know what I think................Lucky young studs!!! and she has money too boot


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

He's rich too though.. and could have any young woman even a rich YOUNG starlet.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

she also has some clout and power in the inddustry and I'm sure it didn't hurt his status.

and she pretty damn hott


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

True... and I've often wondered if he was using her for that... but I think he was a pretty big star already when they met. They look genuine and genuienly happy when you see them together too though.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

I don't think it will last. big stars that marry don't usually last for some reason.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

Even though I found that typo hilarious, I do believe that for a man not intending to have children, that marriage is not worth it most of the time.

But for a man with children? I feel as though it is an obligation to those children to rear them in a stable household with as many advantages as possible. Marriage kind of bundles most of the major ones.

Marriage has never been strictly about romantic love. It is both an affectionate union and an economic one.

And yes, for a woman it holds more economic enhancements than for a man--but less so than in the past.

And that is the recent past.

My parents raised children from the 50s-80s, large family. He was a physician. She quit working after putting him through medical school.

In the 1950s they actually gave out honorary certificates, framed, to wives who worked while their husbands earned their right to practice medicine.

It was considered an honor to be so recognized.

The certificate essentially said "For putting Hubby through school".

In the early 1950s that was considered both normal and a good.

Now, even my mom who got one of those is kind of appalled. My dad never was, he saw it as the normal way of things, that a wife did what she could to enhance her husband's earning power so then she could concentrate on the business at hand: rearing a family and keeping a nice home.

So if you now fast forward to the present, almost nobody can relate to such a way of life. Both spouses have to work to keep a household going, especially with kids and cost of education.

The old middle class goals that my folks tried to live has largely died out.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

NotaGoodSlave said:


> In my view marriage is simply a raw deal for men - there is no "upside" but there is huge "downside" risk in marraige for a man - namely the risk of financial ruin. The fact is that a man can obtain everything he needs from a woman without entering into a contract of marriage with her.


And yet men get married every day. Always have. Always will. And nobody is sticking a gun to their head. 



NotaGoodSlave said:


> My point is that a woman's ability to attract a quality man, and hold his interest, depreciates very quickly after she reaches a certain age, just as a car's value depreciates when it is driven off of the lot. A denial of this analogy is simply a denial of reality.


Yes, because women "depreciate" and have less value. You may say you aren't a misogynist or anti-women but your posts point in a different direction.... "women lose their value, marriage is evil for men, I would never marry a woman..."



NotaGoodSlave said:


> My "funny thinking" viewpoints are foreign to you because you have a vested interest in believing the fallacy that the signing a contract of marriage is as good a deal for men as it is for women...........


Wrong. I am not married nor do I care to be. Generalizations are so boring.



lotuslove said:


> True... and I've often wondered if he was using her for that... but I think he was a pretty big star already when they met. They look genuine and genuienly happy when you see them together too though.


I don't think he used her for fame or $. He already had that. 



chillymorn said:


> I don't think it will last. big stars that marry don't usually last for some reason


True. That's Hollyweird for you.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

michzz said:


> Even though I found that typo hilarious, I do believe that for a man not intending to have children, that marriage is not worth it most of the time.
> 
> But for a man with children? I feel as though it is an obligation to those children to rear them in a stable household with as many advantages as possible. Marriage kind of bundles most of the major ones.
> 
> ...


Ahem, my dear, what incentive would a woman have to get married, if children were not a goal?
The Economist just had an article in this months issue about Asian women and how they have zero desire to marry because while they work, they come home to 30 or more hours of housework to the husbands 4 hours. 
If I am to take that article to heart, there is virtually no benefit for a woman to marry if children aren't a priority and every reason for a man to marry. Cook, housekeeper, sex partner AND full time worker. There is no downside for those men and PLENTY for the women.
That trend is creeping across the pond here too. There are more women in college than men today. There isn't the stigma there once was for not having children, there isn't the stigma there once was for women having a sex life and women are recognizing that they don't have the same financial safety net being a SAHM as they did 20 years ago. Many are saying "why bother?".
Interesting dynamic.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Oh noes. Notagooslave was banned? You don't say!

I swear he is the same person that poster was who was ALL anti-women all the time an got banned and the same one that came on here trolling and was banned within days. The one who told WR to learn how to read. LOL. I think it's the same poster.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Jellybeans said:


> Oh noes. Notagooslave was banned? You don't say!
> 
> I swear he is the same person that poster was who was ALL anti-women all the time an got banned and the same one that came on here trolling and was banned within days. The one who told WR to learn how to rad. LOL. I think it's the same poster.


He got banned last night. He posted something really disgusting about OP that he redacted. 
Well at least he has more time now to be the corporate juggernaut that he claims to be and of course drive around in his $105k "Porshe". Maybe that's the knockoff version of Porsche. You know, kind of like "Luis" Vuitton.


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

michzz said:


> Even though I found that typo hilarious, I do believe that for a man not intending to have children, that marriage is not worth it most of the time.


Same can and is said for women too. As a matter of fact I read an article a while ago that marriage is much more for a man's benefit. Regardless of generalizations... it ultimately comes down to each indivual. What's good for some gooses is not good for ganders and vice versa.



michzz said:


> Marriage has never been strictly about romantic love. It is both an affectionate union and an economic one.


 Something else I read an article on the other day... people's priorities for choosing mates have changed and more people are marrying for love than in the past (YAAAY!)


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Ahem, my dear, what incentive would a woman have to get married, if children were not a goal?
> The Economist just had an article in this months issue about Asian women and how they have zero desire to marry because while they work, they come home to 30 or more hours of housework to the husbands 4 hours.
> If I am to take that article to heart, there is virtually no benefit for a woman to marry if children aren't a priority and every reason for a man to marry. Cook, housekeeper, sex partner AND full time worker. There is no downside for those men and PLENTY for the women.
> That trend is creeping across the pond here too. There are more women in college than men today. There isn't the stigma there once was for not having children, there isn't the stigma there once was for women having a sex life and women are recognizing that they don't have the same financial safety net being a SAHM as they did 20 years ago. Many are saying "why bother?".
> Interesting dynamic.


Happened to read an article on Asian coupling the other day too ironically. Many Asian women are turning to American men because American men treat them better. There are lots of oldy-timey double-standards in Asia worse than here. One is a woman is not considered worthy or marriage unless she's a virgin (regardless of age).. and if she has a child... FORGET IT! WORTHLESS!

Double-standard "****" stigma in Asia still also. Chinese women also dont like Chinese men because they are not hygenic enough compared to the women.


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> He got banned last night. He posted something really disgusting about OP that he redacted.
> p


Ooooh!!! Oooh! Do tell! I love pissing off corporate *******s!!!!! Please do tell!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> There is no downside for those men and PLENTY for the women.
> That trend is creeping across the pond here too. There are more women in college than men today. There isn't the stigma there once was for not having children, there isn't the stigma there once was for women having a sex life and women are recognizing that they don't have the same financial safety net being a SAHM as they did 20 years ago. Many are saying "why bother?".
> Interesting dynamic.


There is a downside for men, absolutely!

The laws regarding spousal support are stuck in the 1950s. Not reflective of current employment prospects for women and men.

But I agree, the largest incentive for marriage is about children.


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

But didn't a woman on this board just mention she got screwed badly financially in her divorce?


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> He got banned last night. He posted something really disgusting about OP that he redacted.


What did he say? LOL about the Porshe. Remember he said he could afford it cause he'd never been married.


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> What did he say? LOL about the Porshe. Remember he said he could afford it cause he'd never been married.


Sounds like it was something else.. and directed toward me (am I the OP of this thread? forget what that means)

Plus whatever it was he retracted it.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

^ Op means Original Poster.


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> ^ Op means Original Poster.


Cool! So what did he say??? PM me if necessary!


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## Syrum (Feb 22, 2011)

michzz said:


> There is a downside for men, absolutely!
> 
> The laws regarding spousal support are stuck in the 1950s. Not reflective of current employment prospects for women and men.
> 
> But I agree, the largest incentive for marriage is about children.


I disagree and I don't believe the laws have fully even caught up. When you look at financial prospects after marriage for a woman who has children, we see that women after divorce are far more likely to live in poverty then men.

Having children is still a bigger sacrifice for women. And men who really understand the unique differences between men and women will understand that women have more to lose from a bad marriage then men do.

It is imperative that if women marry they choose a good man.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

michzz said:


> There is a downside for men, absolutely!
> 
> The laws regarding spousal support are stuck in the 1950s. Not reflective of current employment prospects for women and men.
> 
> But I agree, the largest incentive for marriage is about children.


Where you live, spousal support exists. In a vast majority of states, that is not the case though.


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## Kricket (May 10, 2011)

There have been many studies that have proven that those people that marry (even those who go through bad divorces) tend to have longer happier lives than those who chose to never marry at all. 

So I guess it is better to have loved and lost than to never have loved at all


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

Kricket said:


> There have been many studies that have proven that those people that marry (even those who go through bad divorces) tend to have longer happier lives than those who chose to never marry at all.
> 
> So I guess it is better to have loved and lost than to never have loved at all


Agreed.. but for those who don't want kids... why not just live toegther? I mean if a piece of paper is the only thing holding you to someone (and indeed not the case anymore today)

Will be very interesting to see how the just live-toegther couples have faired 20 years from now.

Also read the other day younger people consider it a rebellikous move to get married now-a-days. Wow


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## Kricket (May 10, 2011)

lotuslove said:


> Agreed.. but for those who don't want kids... why not just live toegther? I mean if a piece of paper is the only thing holding you to someone (and indeed not the case anymore today)
> 
> Will be very interesting to see how the just live-toegther couples have faired 20 years from now.
> 
> Also read the other day younger people consider it a rebellikous move to get married now-a-days. Wow


I would like to see those statistics too on those who just live together and never marry. I do know that those who live together for a few years and then get married tend to have a higher divorce rate. 

It seems backwards, but I think it is just a change in one's mindset. 

That is funny about the rebellious thing. I believe it though. It seems less and less couples are getting married. I don't want to get political, but some I know don't get married for financial assistance sake.


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

Yeah that is really weird that couples who marry after living together get divorced somtimes really fast after. What does that mean? Nothing was really there to begin with.. or maybe just too big a status change?

Kricket.. did you mean to say some DO get married for finuancial assistance (meaning health benefits etc....?)


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## Kricket (May 10, 2011)

I did mean don't get married. Some find that you can get more assistance for school and other things if you are not married. The ones I know are not getting married to claim as single mother status for school, medical and financial assistance.

I can't say I blame them too much. When I first got married, I applied for financial assistance for school was was turned down. I called and asked why and I was told that if I was not married I would qualify.
Crazy.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

lotuslove said:


> Yeah that is really weird that couples who marry after living together get divorced somtimes really fast after. What does that mean? Nothing was really there to begin with.. or maybe just too big a status change?


It is interesting to me how some couples are together forever and get married and that's it--it ends. And how some are barely together, get married and it lasts. And then there are all of the in-betweens. Fascinating stuff.


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## Soccerfan73 (Jul 30, 2011)

Marriage is the best institution in the world. Except when it's not.


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## lotuslove (Aug 10, 2011)

Kricket said:


> I did mean don't get married. Some find that you can get more assistance for school and other things if you are not married. The ones I know are not getting married to claim as single mother status for school, medical and financial assistance.
> 
> I can't say I blame them too much. When I first got married, I applied for financial assistance for school was was turned down. I called and asked why and I was told that if I was not married I would qualify.
> Crazy.


Oy!


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## Kricket (May 10, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> It is interesting to me how some couples are together forever and get married and that's it--it ends. And how some are barely together, get married and it lasts. And then there are all of the in-betweens. Fascinating stuff.


What fascinates me is how arranged marriages take place and last in the US, but many do.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Where you live, spousal support exists. In a vast majority of states, that is not the case though.


Maybe so, but I only have my experience to go on. And by the way, I'm strictly talking about spousal support---not child support.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

michzz said:


> Maybe so, but I only have my experience to go on. And by the way, I'm strictly talking about spousal support---not child support.


I think that with regards to spousal support, it has caught up from the 1950's. In many many states, a SAHM who say put her husband through law school would get virtually no spousal support and if she did, we are talking a few years tops. And capped at 20%
It is HARDLY the windfall that (some) men make it out to be. 
Now, I know CA has lifetime and yeah, that's insane. It's equally insane to leave a wife/mother high and dry because the family choice was she stay home and take care of the kids and further limit her earning ability. 
I still have no idea why any woman would choose to be a SAHM. You are playing Russian Roulette with your financial future.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

It works all _three_ ways, in theory. If you know what I mean.


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## NotaGooodSlave (Sep 3, 2011)

lotuslove said:


> BTW.. Notagoodslave.. what must you think of older women like Demi Moore with young studs?


I was apparently banned for making a "sexist post" - just found out since I am not a regular poster. Easy work around by adding an "o"......It is actually very unfortunate that some are so hyper-senstive about a harmless post which fostered quite a great deal of follow up discussion. It is the PC crowd at work again...........I probably should have stuck in some random positive comments about "ethnic diversity" or " gay marriage rights" into the post -I probably would not have been banned.

To address your question - this is a "Hollywood" marriage. If Demi Moore has the capability of suckering in a younger man into signing a marriage contact then good for her. We all know where this marriage will end up, they are both very wealthy, and they will both continue to be very wealthy after the marriage ends. Let's be honest here.......this is not a typical couple by any means.

We all know that as she ages he will lose interest in her. His lack of interest in her aging body will only be accelerated by the constant proximity of much younger, very attractive actresses to him. These young ladies know that getting into his pants would be a good career move. 

The marriage will end.


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## NotaGooodSlave (Sep 3, 2011)

Syrum said:


> I disagree and I don't believe the laws have fully even caught up. When you look at financial prospects after marriage for a woman who has children, we see that women after divorce are far more likely to live in poverty then men.
> 
> Having children is still a bigger sacrifice for women. And men who really understand the unique differences between men and women will understand that women have more to lose from a bad marriage then men do.
> 
> It is imperative that if women marry they choose a good man.


I will repeat my statement. There is no benefit to a man to sign a marriage contract. A man can get anything he wants, or needs, from a woman without doing so.

The condtion you speak of, which in itself is debateable, is of a post-marriage condition. My point is that men should never get married in the first place, it is simply not in their own best interest.

Condition #1: (Your likely definition of a "Bad Man")
If a man, who is a high income earner, is dating a woman, who is a low income earner, over a long length of time decides to end the relationship there is no financial penality in his doing so. His assets, property, investments, and retirement savings are his and his alone. She, the dumped lover, has no claim on these assets. She will have received no return on her investment of time into the relationship.


Condition #2: (Your likely definition of a "Good Man")
If a man, who is a high income earner, is MARRIED to a woman, who is a low income earner, over a long length of time and he decides to end the relationship she can claim ownership over his assets, property, investments, and retirement savings even though she contributed little to none in obtaining those assets. She will receive a very high return on her investment of time into the relationship.

The fact is ladies is that there is no benefit to a man to marry you but you have a very strong incentive to get him to sign a marriage contract with you - you want a high return on your investment of time into the realtionship. 

Marriage is a transaction that is all risk with no potential for gain for the male half of the equation and little risk with huge potential gain for the female half of the equation.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Ooooohhhh i am scared of you - please go away, don't convince men of these truisms. I am glad my enslaved husband has not gotten wind of this. I am saving for plastic surgery but I do feel rather hopeless. I may have 5 or if I am lucky 10 more years and then those 20 yrs olds will become irresistible and I am out on the heap of old women. I'm feeing depressed already. 

I just hope there are enough young women who want old men to go around. I am concerned about what young men are going to do - the competition will be heated. I wonder if there will be gangs of 50yr old men battling young men for access to hot young chicks. When the revolution come, the men looking for fresh women will have to neutralize young men to knock out the strong competition. 

Then they have to lure the young woman to have sex with them. We will witness a return to a less civilized times i think - men will run rampant having non-stop porn sex, racking up 100's of woman in a lifetime. I hope I come back as a man in my next incarnation. 

Do you you want to tell us how badly those women kicked your aaazzz. Somebody got you good to make you so bitter and hateful. You must be a load of fun in a relationship. Money does overcome a great deal so keep working hard for it you need it. How do you manage to attract women? Ohh yea the car. That and money will lure in some women. Tell us how do you manage after they get to know you - the car and money are not enough to make up for a sour, humorless and cold man does it. You talk about old women losing the interest of men. Thou dost protest too much. 

I think you see the same thing don't you with women. You see those hot chick see dollar signs makes the old man body palatable for a while anyway. That is how it is right? I know, fragile male ego has you bragging about how many women want you. You don't like them whats the draw? Do you think that if you did not come across with money for those hot chicks that they would be interested? Do you drop them and move on to the next one before they get tired of you? How long would they put up with you really if you did not jump the gun.

I am curious - can a man who hates women be a good lover? I doubt it. I would think you imagine that being with you his reward enough. Does the fact that men fall in love and marry burn you. How about men who stay with old wives, must make you boil. I think men want to get married as much as women that what all of the research shows. But you being on the front lines know better I guess. Very few men hate women the way you have come to your unfortunate state. Men actually like women for the most part and many love their old wives. 

Do you have a woman who loves you and not your money? If not do you think love would thaw your heart because it must be difficult living in a world that goes so much against your dreams of woman being discarded. Look even old HH got jacked up badly poor old fool. You don't want to end up like him do you?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Just a word of encouragement for those poor men over 50.

Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rage at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Though wise men at their end know dark is right,
Because their words had forked no lightning they
Do not go gentle into that good night.

Good men, the last wave by, crying how bright
Their frail deeds might have danced in a green bay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Wild men who caught and sang the sun in flight,
And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way,
Do not go gentle into that good night.

Grave men, near death, who see with blinding sight
Blind eyes could blaze like meteors and be gay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

And you, my father, there on the sad height,
Curse, bless me now with your fierce tears, I pray.
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light. 

Yeah, Yeah, Yeah! Yeah, Yeah! Yeaah!
Yeah, Yeah, Yeah! Yeah, Yeah! Yeaah!

Up in the club with my homies, tryna get a lil' V-I, 
but keep it down on the low key, 'cause you know how it is.
I saw shorty she was checkin' up on me, 
from the game she was spittin' in my ear you would think that she knew me.
So we decided to chill

Conversation got heavy, she had me feelin' like she's ready to blow!
(Watch Out! Oh! Watch Out!)
She's saying "Come get me! Come get me",
So I got up and followed her to the floor, she said "Baby, let's go",
That's when I told her I said

Yeah (yeah) Shorty got down low and said come and get me
Yeah (yeah) I got so caught up I forgot she told me
Yeah (yeah) Her and my girl used to be the best of homies
Yeah (yeah) Next thing I knew she was all up on me screaming:

Yeah, Yeah, Yeah! Yeah, Yeah! Yeaah!
Yeah, Yeah, Yeah! Yeah, Yeah! Yeaah!

So she's all up in my head now, got me thinking that it might good idea to take her with me,
'Cause she's ready to leave (ready to leave)
But I gotta keep it real now, 'cause on a one to ten she's a certified twenty, but that just ain't me. Hey.

Because I don't know if I take that chance just where it's gonna lead,
But what I do know is the way she dance makes shorty alright with me.
The way she (get low!)
I'm like yeah, just work that out for me.
She asked for one more dance and I'm
Like yeah, how the hell am I supposed to leave?
And I said

Hey, Luda!

Watch out!
My outfit's ridiculous, in the club lookin' so conspicuous.
And Rowl! These women all on the prowl, if you hold the head steady I'm a milk the cow.
Forget about the game, I'm a spit the truth, I won't stop till I get 'em in they birthday suits.
So gimmie the rhythm and it'll be off with their clothes, then bend over to the front and touch your toes.
I left the Jag and I took the Rolls, if they aint cutting then I put em on foot patrol.
How you like me now, when my pinky's valued over three hundred thousand,
Lets drank you the one to please, Ludacris fill cups like double D's.
Me and Ursh once more and we leave 'em dead, we want a lady in the street but a freak in the bed to say

Take that and rewind it back, Lil' Jon got the beat to make ya booty go (clap)
Take that and rewind it back, Ursher got the voice to make ya booty go (clap)
Take that and rewind it back, Ludacris got the flow to make ya booty go (clap)
Take that and rewind it back, Lil' Jon got the beat to make ya booty go (clap) ​


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

Catherine602 said:


> Ooooohhhh i am scared of you - please go away, don't convince men of these truisms. I am glad my enslaved husband has not gotten wind of this. I am saving for plastic surgery but I do feel rather hopeless. I may have 5 or if I am lucky 10 more years and then those 20 yrs olds will become irresistible and I am out on the heap of old women. I'm feeing depressed already.
> 
> I just hope there are enough young women who want old men to go around. I am concerned about what young men are going to do - the competition will be heated. I wonder if there will be gangs of 50yr old men battling young men for access to hot young chicks. When the revolution come, the men looking for fresh women will have to neutralize young men to knock out the strong competition.
> 
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Always keeping it real, with eloquence and grace. Alas, though, he is but a minion in my ultimate devious plan [insert evil mad scientist laugh here]. When all of those men go after the young hotties, I'll have ripe pickings from the classy, street savvy women in their forties who are left behind if I find myself single again... [insert redundant mad scientist laugh]


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## Mckiwi (Jul 10, 2011)

I'm confused. Last time I looked around, I see women making a decent pay, being able to manage their homes, their bills. They don't really need men to fill these roles. So they don't get married for those reasons anymore. 
And for the men that moan and complain about their stay-at-home spouse, consider this: Thats what you asked for! You ask for someone to cook and clean up after you (since clearly that is just too much work) and I think sometimes a tiny male ego enjoys being the breadwinner and holding all the cards. Those women take care of you, as YOU asked. If that is not what you wanted, marry a woman on equal financial footing with you. I'm sure she won't get to take you down in the divorce. But wait, then who would have dinner on the table? Marriage isn't nearly as fun when you don't get to treat someone as inferior or something? Big man-balls do not like a woman that can bring in as much as them and thinks they should do their own laundry?


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

I wonder what is on the Lifetime channel now.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Mckiwi said:


> I'm confused. Last time I looked around, I see women making a decent pay, being able to manage their homes, their bills. They don't really need men to fill these roles. So they don't get married for those reasons anymore.
> And for the men that moan and complain about their stay-at-home spouse, consider this: Thats what you asked for! You ask for someone to cook and clean up after you (since clearly that is just too much work) and I think sometimes a tiny male ego enjoys being the breadwinner and holding all the cards. Those women take care of you, as YOU asked. If that is not what you wanted, marry a woman on equal financial footing with you. I'm sure she won't get to take you down in the divorce. But wait, then who would have dinner on the table? Marriage isn't nearly as fun when you don't get to treat someone as inferior or something? Big man-balls do not like a woman that can bring in as much as them and thinks they should do their own laundry?


Yup, read around here long enough and you see the trend. My wife doesn't work and "just" stays home with our 3 children spending "my" money. My wife works long hours and doesn't spend enough time with our 3 children, she only cares about money. You can't win.
Like I said in another post, why would any woman want to get married? Where's the benefit? More women attend college now than men and they are putting off marriage and children for their careers instead. Adoption available to successful women over 35 and limitless opportunities now for those who chose to stay single. Benefit again? 
If I had daughters I would tell them to think long and hard about whether they want to have to be super woman and then be ridiculed for their shortcomings by a husband who doesn't think she is doing enough. Heck, there is a guy here who complained that his wife's eyelashes were to short and that she works too many hours, meanwhile he has been unemployed for years. No thanks, I'll stay single in my next life.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Entropy3000 said:


> I wonder what is on the Lifetime channel now.


Put down your watered down whiskey and go check.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Entropy3000 said:


> I wonder what is on the Lifetime channel now.


That movie about that woman. You know the one..


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

Mckiwi said:


> Big man-balls do not like a woman that can bring in as much as them and thinks they should do their own laundry?


I had that frank discussion with my balls, and they say that they would be A-Ok with my wife making more, although they're still not really on speaking terms with me after the streaking incident in Sun Valley during a really cold winter night a few years ago. She makes more than most men just working part time. Alas, after the pink socks incident, I'm banned from doing laundry forever, but I do the floors.

Obviously just kidding on the above, but this sounds like tons of resentment and a generalization that most men would really never agree with. Being intimidated by a higher paying wife possibly applies to a certain cultural subsets of the population, but not the norm.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

When I was very small I lived on a ranch. I have castrated farm animals.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Halien said:


> I had that frank discussion with my balls, and they say that they would be A-Ok with my wife making more, although they're still not really on speaking terms with me after the streaking incident in Sun Valley during a really cold winter night a few years ago. She makes more than most men just working part time. Alas, after the pink socks incident, I'm banned from doing laundry forever, but I do the floors.


Halien, Halien, Halien, you aren't a real man, you know? You cannot possibly hold the dude card and be okay with your wife earning a large sum of money. Turn it in and slink away in shame. 
The size of your balls are measured based on how little your wife earns, as too much makes them shrink with every paycheck. 
That Sun Valley incident was no accident my friend. 
That was your balls saying you do not deserve them and they were trying to flee your body. What good is a nutsack if your wife earns a decent income? Think man, think!
If you want your frost bitten balls to regain sensation, you need to divorce your wife and find a woman who thinks Reykjavik is a brand of gardening equipment, ESPN stands for Evidently Shopping Pleases my Neurosis and the glass ceiling is a set of mirrors over a rotating bed. 
Unless you divorce her, you are on your own my friend. Avoid the Icy Hot and smear your balls with sweet cream and stick them over a box of puppies. That's your only hope and I am rooting for you.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

In general men could care less how much a woman makes.

Since women now have their own money and do not need a man for this any more can we take this burden off of the men to be the primary provider and have that stunning career? Or is that still a requirement for sexual attraction? 

I am not so sure it is the men having the difficulty with what the wife earns vs. the husband. Perhaps in many cases it is the wife that has the problem with a husband who makes less. Does she feel less attracted to him because of this? Maybe it is not the money. Maybe it is something else.

I am just thankful none of this is just a deep seeded resentment for people and the opportunity to bash someone to make them feel more significant. I really wish I had someone to blame my failures on, other than myself. But I don't and won't. When you get to that point ... that is liberation. Own it. Then you are free.

I learned this playing Halo ODST.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Halien, Halien, Halien, you aren't a real man, you know? You cannot possibly hold the dude card and be okay with your wife earning a large sum of money. Turn it in and slink away in shame. .


Manliness hides behind a door of practicality. I'll slink away, but to the bank. 

Besides, she still can't figure out how to use the remote on our new large screen LED entertainment system, so my domain is still sacrosanct.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Entropy3000 said:


> In general men could care less how much a woman makes.
> 
> Since women now have their own money and do not need a man for this any more can we take this burden off of the men to be the primary provider and have that stunning career? Or is that still a requirement for sexual attraction?
> 
> ...


Read here long enough and you see (some) men have a serious issue with their wife earning more, regardless of which account it goes in to. Blaming failures? Yup, pretty common. 
Halo you say? When are you playing multiplayer?


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Read here long enough and you see (some) men have a serious issue with their wife earning more, regardless of which account it goes in to. Blaming failures? Yup, pretty common.
> Halo you say? When are you playing multiplayer?


Yeah, well those men have small man-balls. Many women are all about how much status and money their husband has. 

But for some it is just a power thing, I guess.

For some it is truly about the couple. Their family. Their money. But mostly it is not about the money at all, but the time they share. I read that on a Hallmark Card I think. 

Times are changing but I wonder if there still exists the stigma that a man is less of a man if he is the main provider.

So if things have evolved to where this role is not required any more then one might expect what women find attractive in a man might change.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Entropy3000 said:


> Yeah, well those men have small man-balls. Many women are all about how much status and money their husband has.
> 
> But for some it is just a power thing, I guess.
> 
> ...


Oh Jesus. Seriously? Can we just be happy that we all make our own income and it isn't some affront to a specific gender and that we are all doing it for the common good? Just once, could a woman earning more than her husband be viewed as awesome and it all goes to support the family? 
If a man is so concerned that the woman in his life earns more than him, I would question his judgment. I would also question the size of his testicles. If a woman earning more than a man is that much of an issue, I would wonder what the hell else is going on with him. Small d!ck comes to mind. Also a "Porche"


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Oh Jesus. Seriously? Can we just be happy that we all make our own income and it isn't some affront to a specific gender and that we are all doing it for the common good? Just once, could a woman earning more than her husband be viewed as awesome and it all goes to support the family?
> If a man is so concerned that the woman in his life earns more than him, I would question his judgment. I would also question the size of his testicles. If a woman earning more than a man is that much of an issue, I would wonder what the hell else is going on with him. Small d!ck comes to mind. Also a "Porche"


I am fine with people making what they make and getting happiness any way they can. But I am thinking you avoided the question.

So am I hearing that his d!ck size is now more important than his wallet?  Or am I hearing it always was?

So you read Athol's book twice. Is he totally wrong about sex rank? I think he even questioned how changes in society just may impact a man's sex rank.

I like Audis so I wonder what that says about me .... Then again I have mostly owned Mustangs with forced induction so I am all messed up. And yes my wife also drives a Mustang but it is a chick car. 

Oh Lord won't you buy me ... a Mercedes Benz ... All my friends ....


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## AbsolutelyFree (Jan 28, 2011)

I'm not married. But if I was, and if my wife earned more money than me, it would...drive me crazy. I'm not saying it's bad for a woman to earn a lot, or that it's bad for a woman to earn more than her man.

But, I just know that I wouldn't be able to handle it.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Entropy3000 said:


> I am fine with people making what they make and getting happiness any way they can. But I am thinking you avoided the question.
> 
> .


I didn't miss anything. I didn't see any question whatsoever. Just a statement.
Usually when someone is asking a question, it comes with a question mark at the end. 
Yours had none. Would you like to repost your question and if you need me to help you out with punctuation, just let me know?.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> I didn't see any question whatsoever. Usually when someone is asking a question, it comes with a question mark at the end.
> Yours had none. Would you like to repost your question? (Notice the question mark).


Does a man's earning potential / income influence his sex rank to any significant degree?

Does a man's confidence influence his sex rank to any significant degree?


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Entropy3000 said:


> Does man's earning potential / income influence his sex rank to any significant degree?
> 
> Does a man's confidence influence his sex rank to any significant degree?


Love how you equate a man as the earner and the woman as some person who just fawns over his wealth.
Misogyny at midnight, check.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> Love how you equate a man as the earner and the woman as some person who just fawns over his wealth.
> Misogyny at midnight, check.


So I am hearing you telling me that a man's sex rank, his attractiveness to the female of the species, perhaps even his wife specifically is not significantly influenced by his earning potential / income. Is this an incorrect statement?

You did not address the question of confidence. I was going to let you relate the two questions, but I will do it.

Whether a woman desires a man more or less for his earning potential / income or not, most men obtain a sense of worth from their work in general. This is not always related to pure income but the value they see in what they do. Moreover I would contend that this directly relates to these same men's level of confidence in themselves. Therefore it at least influences their sex rank indirectly as it provides them a good portion of their confidence.

Now how this relates to their comparative sense of worth as it relates to their wife's income is another matter. I think a man can have a great sense of worth in what he achieves and still have a lesser income to the wife's. That is in his head. But it takes two. A compatible wife in this situation would also value what her husband acheives and not think less of him for having a lesser income.

Never been a fan of mahogany.

Anyway, I think in an ideal situation the couple sees value in what their partner brings to the marriage. I also see value in what a person contributes to society as well. Seriously. One of the partners may very well bring in a greater income but the other may be a teacher or in some capacity where what they contribute has real merit and worth of what they do more than the dollars they bring home. I value what my wife has done throughout her career. I respect what she does and honor the fact that she has touched many lives. I admire her for that. What she has done will live on.

It is very true that I have had a much larger income over the years. I will not apologize for that. I worked very hard for that and have kept up my education to do so. My family counted on it. I emphasize "my family". This should not be projected into anyone elses situation casually. 

I confess I have never given any real thought to the situation proposed about a wife making more than her husband. I suspect it does matter to many people for their own reasons. The premise as to this being in some proportion to part of their anatomy, I just do not know. I have not seen any studies on this. Many men have a compulsion to be the provider, even when the woman brings home more money.

Gosh do Alpha men make more money than Beta men? Which type would more likely have trouble with the wife earning more?

Support of a family is really a Beta thing, yet achievement in the competitive world is a combination of Alpha / Beta. An Alpha would have high self esteem no matter what but would be most comfortable in a dominant role. Some women make big bucks but like to be dominated in the bedroom. The entropy in this is amazing.


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