# Spin off of “minor things slide” thread. The relationship between sexual and annoyance?



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

I have been thinking about how a couple’s sexual compatibility/chemistry and how much they irritate and annoy each are interrelated. 

@Ragnar Ragnasson’s thread touches on that but I wonder if it goes much deeper and how it effects BOTH genders. 

Conventional wisdom kind of holds that as a couple spend more and more time together men start to annoy and irritate women with their belching and farting and scratching their crotches and their tendency to not scrub the house 16 hours a day to her satisfaction and as the resentment and disdain builds, her attraction and desire for him declines.

Meanwhile as she keeps bringing home more and more cats and keeps inviting over her goofy friends and relatives without discussing it with him, and as she rejects him more and more frequently, he too begins to become more short and irritable with her until his desire for her begins to wane as well. 

But might we have this backwards? Is it possible that the decline of sexual chemistry and sexual energy with the fading of New Relationship Energy (NRE) the actual precipitating event that starts to make annoyances and irritations less tolerable and more problematic?

An even bigger question is sexual compatibility and chemistry the elixir and insulation that allows us to tolerate each other and live together long enough to bear and nurture children together under the same roof?

From the other thread it is clear most men will not kick Kate Mara out of bed for eating crackers provided she is laying him like tile. 

But is there any reason to believe that if some gal is starting to get with Ryan Reynolds or Alex Rodriguez that she would have an issue with him leaving his socks on the floor? 

I don’t see this as a gender specific issue. If there is a gender disparity, it is that female spontaneous desire tends to fade quicker in a long term relationship on average as compared to men. 

Is it once that NRE fades and her sexual desire fades that Ryan Reynolds better start picking up his socks or else?

It often seems that in greater society an underlying theme is that sexual chemistry and compatibility should be a more sacrificial and expendable commodity in leu of other common interests and other factors. 

But is sexuality actually the buffer that keeps our natural annoying habits and characteristics from making us hate each other? 

Do MC and therapy have it backwards in that instead of trying to get people to resolve their annoying habits and Housekeeping grievances in hopes this will allow some sexual activity to resume.

Would their efforts be more productive to address the sexual chemistry and then socks on the floor and another cat will become more tolerable?


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

A great thread topic. All good questions, I'm a firm believer in your last three paragraphs.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

I just tell my husband I’m bringing home another cat and he better not expect me to have sex with him just to look the other way because me and the cat are already bonded and there’s nothing he can do about it.

Well, I did that with my 2 rescue goats.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I just tell my husband I’m bringing home another cat and he better not expect me to have sex with him just to look the other way because me and the cat are already bonded and there’s nothing he can do about it.
> 
> Well, I did that with my 2 rescue goats.


I told myself no goat jokes, in good taste I have to stick with that. 🤣🙂


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> I told myself no goat jokes, in good taste I have to stick with that. 🤣🙂


Respectfully, thanks.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

How’s that goat milk taste? Just saying…..


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Respectfully, thanks.


It's a team effort 👍👍!


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Mr.Married said:


> How’s that goat milk taste? Just saying…..


And we're off!


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> And we're off!


It's Naaaaaaaaasty!!!


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Numb26 said:


> It's Naaaaaaaaasty!!!


Better than any human male semen I’ve tasted.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Better than any human male semen I’ve tasted.


I think you missed the joke 🤣🤣🤣🤣


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Better than any human male semen I’ve tasted.


One question I was going to ask....and where do the goats sleep?


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Numb26 said:


> I think you missed the joke 🤣🤣🤣🤣


No, she's just addressing head on.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> One question I was going to ask....and where do the goats sleep?


In my bed with me, of course. I make my husband sleep on the couch.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> In my bed with me, of course. I make my husband sleep on the couch.


….just kidding.

They have their own little setup outside. They are mini goats. Very cute. I’ve only had them for about 8 months.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> In my bed with me, of course. I make my husband sleep on the couch.


That it takes two goats is important! 🙂👍


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Better than any human male semen I’ve tasted.


That would imply that in your mouth you have had nasty sticky thick gooey……..goat’s milk


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> ….just kidding.
> 
> They have their own little setup outside. They are mini goats. Very cute. I’ve only had them for about 8 months.


Maybe now isn't a good time to share goats make tasty bbq. Although they do. 🙄🤣🤣


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Mr.Married said:


> That would imply that in your mouth you have had nasty sticky thick gooey……..goat’s milk


It would imply that indeed wouldn’t it?


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> That it takes two goats is important! 🙂👍


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I just tell my husband I’m bringing home another cat and he better not expect me to have sex with him just to look the other way because me and the cat are already bonded and there’s nothing he can do about it.
> 
> Well, I did that with my 2 rescue goats.


Scenario # 1. Wife hasn’t touched me for 6 months, says she’s bringing home another cat and not to expect any more sex.

Me = “that’s fine, enjoy all your cats and your celibacy in your new home. I just need you to sign these papers here, here and here. And initial here, here and here and I will drop off at the lawyers office in the morning. 

Scenario #2: Wife screws me senseless night after night. Tells me she’s bringing home another cat and then says I need to have a hearty meal and drink lots of water because one of her hot girlfriends is coming over to screw me senseless while she watches. 

Me = “ Nice Kitty Kitty.” 🐈 😃 💕


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Mr.Married said:


> View attachment 88769


Looks like Snoop Goat 🤣🤣🤣


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I just tell my husband I’m bringing home another cat and he better not expect me to have sex with him just to look the other way because me and the cat are already bonded and there’s nothing he can do about it.
> 
> Well, I did that with my 2 rescue goats.


Please start a thread so I can ask you about your goats. 🐐🐐🐐🐐🐐


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

I apologize to @oldshirt for the temp TJ.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I just tell my husband I’m bringing home another cat and he better not expect me to have sex with him just to look the other way because me and the cat are already bonded and there’s nothing he can do about it.
> 
> Well, I did that with my 2 rescue goats.


A good German Shepherd will take care of those demon felines.👹 Have had a couple of neighborhood cats commit suicide in my yard lately. The even killed a 🐿 and I saw another missing a tail. 🤣


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

People who are just roommates don't seem to need the "sexual elixer." They just need someone who is roughly compatible about hours, rowdiness and housework expectations and will pay their half on time. That said, it is hard to find a tolerable roommate, too.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

oldshirt said:


> Scenario # 1. Wife hasn’t touched me for 6 months, says she’s bringing home another cat and not to expect any more sex.
> 
> Me = “that’s fine, enjoy all your cats and your celibacy in your new home. I just need you to sign these papers here, here and here. And initial here, here and here and I will drop off at the lawyers office in the morning.
> 
> ...


You really do just let your penis make all the decisions for you, don't you? 😆


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

DownByTheRiver said:


> You really do just let your penis make all the decisions for you, don't you? 😆


Right? “If she’ll let me f other women I don’t care what she does.” Pertinent question is, if he wants out that badly why is he still there?


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Please start a thread so I can ask you about your goats. 🐐🐐🐐🐐🐐


Well, since my other thread was deleted at my request….

I doubt I’ll feel guilty about anything I post about my goats.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Well, since my other thread was deleted at my request….
> 
> I doubt I’ll feel guilty about anything I post about my goats.


Do it! I would love to have goats.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> People who are just roommates don't seem to need the "sexual elixer." They just need someone who is roughly compatible about hours, rowdiness and housework expectations and will pay their half on time. That said, it is hard to find a tolerable roommate, too.


The point is great sex would make the roommate a whole lot more tolerable.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Right? “If she’ll let me f other women I don’t care what she does.” Pertinent question is, if he wants out that badly why is he still there?


The whole point went over your head.

If the sex is nonexistent or really bad, socks on the floor become an unforgivable offense or another cat can be the straw that breaks the camels back.

If the sex is great, people typically do not want out regardless if there are socks on the floor or if someone is bringing home another cat.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

I don't know, OS, there are a lot of people who divorce or break up regardless that the sex was great. But great sex isn't enough.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> The whole point went over your head.
> 
> If the sex is nonexistent or really bad, socks on the floor become an unforgivable offense or another cat can be the straw that breaks the camels back.
> 
> If the sex is great, people typically do not want out regardless if there are socks on the floor or if someone is bringing home another cat.


I didn’t miss the point. If the man can fool around on her, he doesn’t care what else she does or who she is. Why get married? Just have anonymous sex.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I don't know, OS, there are a lot of people who divorce or break up regardless that the sex was great. But great sex isn't enough.


Great sex isn’t what he wants. Sex with any other woman than his wife is what it takes.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

TexasMom1216 said:


> I didn’t miss the point. If the man can fool around on her, he doesn’t care what else she does or who she is. Why get married? Just have anonymous sex.


@oldshirt didn't say the guy could fool around on W, just that socks on the floor and such becomes less irritating if the couple regularly rock each others world.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

oldshirt said:


> or another cat can be the straw that breaks the camels back.


Now that I’ve said that, i have an real life example of this withguy that I used to work with.

Typical Nice Guy. He was with some train wreck single mother that moved in with him with her toddler from some deadbeat. 

She laid him like tile first number of weeks they were together. He thinks she’s “The One” because she touched his pee pee and everything. 

Her lease is coming to an end so he moves her and her rugrat in with him. Within days she always has a headache or upset stomach or she is anxious or she is upset that her cousin isn’t coming to the reunion etc etc etc etc and the sex basically stops cold.

Then she gets upset with her boss or coworkers and walks out of her job so now he’s the sole breadwinner supporting her. 

About year goes by of unending headaches, stomachaches, menstrual cramps 3 1/2 weeks out of the month and she’s upset with that cousin the remaining half of the week. 

Every annoying and irritating habit she has is grating on him and “The One” is now the one that’s killing his soul. 

One day he comes home from work and there is a puppy in the apartment that doesn’t allow pets. He asks what the hell this puppy is doing there. 

She was all excited and overjoyed and said a friend of a friend couldn’t keep it so let her have it for FREE! And that her daughter needed a pet and isn’t it just the cutest. 

About that time the puppy pees on the carpet. 

The straw that broke the camel’s back.

He said the puppy had to go that night. He didn’t care where, how or with who. 

Then he gave her to the end of the month. 

She threatened to take him to court for child support and some kind of domestic partner support but didn’t have the gumption to follow through with actually doing any paperwork.

She simply found another simp instead. 

Moral of the story - bring home another critter while not taking care of business in the bedroom can be the final straw. 

Maybe all Washing Hair needs to do to get rid of Hubby is bring home another goat.


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## Numb26 (Sep 11, 2019)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I don't know, OS, there are a lot of people who divorce or break up regardless that the sex was great. But great sex isn't enough.


"Raises hand"


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

TexasMom1216 said:


> I didn’t miss the point. If the man can fool around on her, he doesn’t care what else she does or who she is. Why get married? Just have anonymous sex.


Once again you are talking about things way outside the scope of the topic that no one has even mentioned.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> Once again you are talking about things way outside the scope of the topic that no one has even mentioned.





oldshirt said:


> Scenario #2: Wife screws me senseless night after night. Tells me she’s bringing home another cat and then says I need to have a hearty meal and drink lots of water because *one of her hot girlfriends is coming over to screw me senseless while she watches*.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> @oldshirt didn't say the guy could fool around on W, just that socks on the floor and such becomes less irritating if the couple regularly rock each others world.


I've certainly known a woman or two who thought their first husband was good in bed but actually did divorce him because of the expanded version of socks on the floor. 

One old friend of mine said, "Sex was always good," but he was too controlling. It's not enough for any sane person.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I don't know, OS, there are a lot of people who divorce or break up regardless that the sex was great. But great sex isn't enough.


A lot??? 

Just how many people are sitting in divorce court or in the MC's office reeling from all the hot monkey sex they've been having night after night?

Are there a few outlier couples out there who may have some fundamental flaw in their ability to live together as a married couple but still have a working sex life? Yeah, I imagine it happens now and then. 

But compared to the couples splitting up or grasping at straws in the MC's office that haven't had a good sex life in years, that number is likely very negligible.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

oldshirt said:


> A lot???
> 
> Just how many people are sitting in divorce court or in the MC's office reeling from all the hot monkey sex they've been having night after night?
> 
> ...


It happens a lot. Good sex alone isn't enough for most people.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

You and everyone else knows what I meant by that. 

And you and everyone else knows that it was not at all pertaining to fooling around or anonymous sex.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

oldshirt said:


> Maybe all Washing Hair needs to do to get rid of Hubby is bring home another goat.


Nah, he loves the goats now. 

Plus I think he really likes having somebody to cook his meals and wash his dirty underwear.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

I've never heard anyone I knew who divorced that said their ex was bad in bed. That was never the issue. That's people I know, not randos. I'm sure there's a bunch of people I don't know who are bad in bed but still managed to get married.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> It happens a lot. Good sex alone isn't enough for most people.


Good sex alone may not be enough to hold together a fundamentally flawed relationship that is broken down in many other domains. 

But for the majority of broken down marriages, by the time the D Word is being thrown out there, the sex has broken down too. 

My theoretical question of the thread is of chicken vs the egg. Does sex break down as people start to get on each other's nerves and start to irritate and annoy each other? 

Or does the sex dwindle down and so things that they used to overlook or simply tolerate now start to be more problematic and less tolerable?


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

oldshirt said:


> My theoretical question of the thread is of chicken vs the egg. Does sex break down as people start to get on each other's nerves and start to irritate and annoy each other?
> 
> Or does the sex dwindle down and so things that they used to overlook or simply tolerate now start to be more problematic and less tolerable?


I think both scenarios can and do happen. For some people great sex is enough to overlook some annoyances. For others, annoyances outside of the bedroom get in the way of good sex. For some people they probably do have good sex with their partner and it makes them feel no better or worse about the annoying things their partner does.


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## DownButNotOut (Apr 9, 2009)

OS, aren't you really just restating the secret to a happy husband? Keep his belly full and his b**ls empty.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> You really do just let your penis make all the decisions for you, don't you? 😆


I know you said that just to get digs on me, but unfortunately for you in so doing, you actually raise a valid point.

It's not a matter of people's penis or vagina making decisions for them. 

But people can and do make decisions based on the state of the sexual contentment and well being vs their dissatisfaction and frustration. 

People can and will factor in the state of their sexual well being in their decisions or whether to remain in a relationship/marriage or not. 

It's not their genitals that is making the decisions. They are making conscious choices with their sexual status as a factor. 
Disregard your partner's sexual well being at your own risk. How well they tolerate your socks on the floor or you inviting your Aunt Petunia to stay for a week, may be at stake.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownButNotOut said:


> OS, aren't you really just restating the secret to a happy husband? Keep his belly full and his b**ls empty.


I'm looking at this from more of a gender equality and equal opportunity aspect. 

Shouldn't the real question here be is the secret to a happy wife giving her good lovins?


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

oldshirt said:


> Good sex alone may not be enough to hold together a fundamentally flawed relationship that is broken down in many other domains.
> 
> But for the majority of broken down marriages, by the time the D Word is being thrown out there, the sex has broken down too.
> 
> ...


No, that's not been what I've heard from people I know. Sex was good, but despite that, there was some dealbreaker. I've had two men who were divorcing tell me, "I can't imagine never having sex with (ex) again." Women's dealbreakers were either socks on the floor or in one case, wouldn't help pay for auto insurance because "I don't have a car. It's your car." And she was driving him 20 miles to work every day. And then also, he had no ambition and didn't mind being a fry cook the rest of his life. But sex was good. 

With the two men, both had married right out of high school. One had a hot sex life with her, but she got jealous of him and then started coming on to friends of his. The other, it was her idea to divorce. I think she outgrew him, but I'll never know. Most people don't put up with crap just because sex is good. 

Most people don't choose someone to marry just because sex is good either, men or women.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

If the secret to a happy husband is to keep his belly full and his balls empty 🤮
then what is the secret to a happy wife? 

Keep her ***** wet and her face dry? And don’t throw your socks on the floor.


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## DownButNotOut (Apr 9, 2009)

oldshirt said:


> I'm looking at this from more of a gender equality and equal opportunity aspect.
> 
> Shouldn't the real question here be is the secret to a happy wife giving her good lovins?


Yeah. Um. Men and women are a little different.

A man will happily overlook things for the next 20 years if the sex is good.
A woman, not so much.

(generalities people)


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## DownButNotOut (Apr 9, 2009)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> If the secret to a happy husband is to keep his belly full and his balls empty 🤮
> then what is the secret to a happy wife?
> 
> Keep her *** wet and her face dry? And don’t throw your socks on the floor.


Happy wife?

Now that is one of the unsolved mysteries of the universe


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownButNotOut said:


> A man will happily overlook things for the next 20 years if the sex is good.
> A woman, not so much.
> 
> (generalities people)


But I'm posing the whole thread as a mental exercise so let's challenge that notion on a number of different fronts. 

Is the woman actually having good sex for her? Is he keeping her sexual fires burning and are wants and needs being met? 

Is it really his socks on the floor that are dampening her sexual energies or is he slacking between the sheets so now his socks on the floor are becoming problematic? 

Yes, if he is a lazy slug that sits on the couch playing video games all the time and leaving his socks and underwear laying all over and stacking his beer cans all over the coffee table, it's going to be a problem but we also have to take into account that if he is sitting infront of the tv drinking beer all night, he's not exactly being Mr Stud either. 

If he was getting her motor running and making her eyes roll up in her head, he wouldn't be having time Grand Theft Auto. He may not be getting his socks picked up right away, but if she's trying to catch her breath and waiting for her head to stop spinning, she's probably not too concerned about the socks at that moment. 

Does that mean if a guy can make his partner's toes curl up into her backside that he never has to pick up his socks or his underwear? No, of course not. We all need to be adults here. 

But what I am getting at is if the sex life can stay alive and satisfactory for both, does that provide some buffer and insulation against the petty annoyances and irritating habits and mannerisms that we all have? 

If we as men or women, allow our sex life to dwindle and atrophy, are we putting ourselves at risk of our own personal mannerisms becoming intolerable for our partner??


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## DownButNotOut (Apr 9, 2009)

oldshirt said:


> But I'm posing the whole thread as a mental exercise so let's challenge that notion on a number of different fronts.
> 
> Is the woman actually having good sex for her? Is he keeping her sexual fires burning and are wants and needs being met?
> 
> ...


Solipsism. You're approaching the question as a man. The mistake is thinking the importance of sexual satisfaction is symmetrical. It isn't. Good ole T takes care of that.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

DownButNotOut said:


> Yeah. Um. Men and women are a little different.
> 
> A man will happily overlook things for the next 20 years if the sex is good.
> A woman, not so much.
> ...


I saw a lot of men date women who were sexy but then choose to marry one who wasn't because of the double standard. Ho hum.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Not much to add but good sex does help. It has kept people in relationships that shouldn't have gone on and I believe it sustains and nurtures good relationships and keeps functional, if not great, relationships going.

P.S. I am a rank amateur compared to Mrs. Conan when it comes to flatulence.😋


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownButNotOut said:


> The mistake is thinking the importance of sexual satisfaction is symmetrical. It isn't.


Not symmetrical does not mean not influential. 

Just because things are not the same does not mean there won't be an impact. 

Sometimes you need to look at things in simple terms - regardless if one is male or female, don't you think things in general will be better all around if they both have a healthy attraction and desire for each other vs if they don't??


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

I don't think these things can be reduced to a simplistic bumper-sticker approach.

It's a sum of a lot of things. Including one's own personality style. Batman does often leave his socks near the front door. It doesn't phase me at all. On occasion, I collect them to do laundry or just part of tidying (admittedly, particularly if someone is visiting), or rare occasion I might ask him to move the socks (and he does), but more so, I just leave them and know he'll get to taking them to the linen basket. No big deal. While I enjoy a clean home and aside from just responsibility stuff, do view my input as demonstrating care to us and our home, however, I'm not fastidious with such things; and hence, socks by the front door isn't an annoyance to me. I don't know if the socks would annoy me if he was a right bastard, even if the sex was great, as I wouldn't be with someone like that anyway. To add, it's also super cute when one of the dogs get excited when hearing the word 'walk' and grabs one of the socks and runs around with it in his mouth until he's told to drop it and leash goes on.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

From his perspective, there's nothing I do that is annoying 😇

Ahem.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Divinely Favored said:


> A good German Shepherd will take care of those demon felines.👹 Have had a couple of neighborhood cats commit suicide in my yard lately. The even killed a 🐿 and I saw another missing a tail. 🤣





oldshirt said:


> Once again you are talking about things way outside the scope of the topic that no one has even mentioned.


They don't care as long as they get to man bash. End justifies the means.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I saw a lot of men date women who were sexy but then choose to marry one who wasn't because of the double standard. Ho hum.


What double standard is that?


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

DownButNotOut said:


> Yeah. Um. Men and women are a little different.
> 
> A man will happily overlook things for the next 20 years if the sex is good.
> A woman, not so much.
> ...


I agree that sex in general matters more to men, but in my ex-marriage it was the opposite. Sex gave me "orgasm goggles", so that I couldn't see the bad things about him that made him a bad partner for me. 

When he took sex completely away, I suddenly saw HIM, and couldn't believe that I had actually been in love with him. Without the orgasm goggles, I lost ALL respect and admiration for him.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

LisaDiane said:


> I agree that sex in general matters more to men, but in my ex-marriage it was the opposite. Sex gave me "orgasm goggles", so that I couldn't see the bad things about him that made him a bad partner for me.
> 
> When he took sex completely away, I suddenly saw HIM, and couldn't believe that I had actually been in love with him. Without the orgasm goggles, I lost ALL respect and admiration for him.


Did you ever manage to find out why he took sex away?


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> ….just kidding.
> 
> They have their own little setup outside. They are mini goats. Very cute. I’ve only had them for about 8 months.


Be aware of parasites they can be victimized by. Intestinal worms can kill thim in short order. They need regular worming to avoid problems


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Rus47 said:


> Be aware of parasites they can be victimized by. Intestinal worms can kill thim in short order. They need regular worming to avoid problems


Don’t tell me you have experience with goats?! 

Don’t worry, they get dewormed and vaccinated and they receive full vet care just as a dog or cat would. I knew nothing about caring for goats before I got them but I am learning.


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## Rus47 (Apr 1, 2021)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Don’t tell me you have experience with goats?!


We raised them and rabbits and chickens when I was a child


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Did you ever manage to find out why he took sex away?


Oh yes, it was his utter and complete selfishness. It's a whole long story, but I don't want to continue the thread jacks on here by explaining more. If you are more than mildly curious about it, you can always PM me.

To bring it back to the topic of the thread, my point was that for days after we had sex, I would do all kinds of things for him that should have been annoying (like doing his laundry and dishes, making phone calls for him, making him special food, etc), but I would walk around with a stupid grin on my face and heart emojis floating out of my eyes.

And he could even be in a bad mood with me, and I could handle it and not take it personally, and be patient and understanding, and want to help him feel better. I was the same way with my first husband...so I'm sure I will be that way with the next guy I'm with. It's really pathetic, but I can't control it.

By about the 4th day or so without sex, my attitude would start to change and he would start to annoy me, and it would get worse and worse. But once we had sex again, the orgasm goggles were back, and I thought he was Mr. Sexy and Wonderful again.

I always thought, SEX was the grease that kept my love and admiration for him flowing smoothly and easily between us. When it was gone, our relationship seized up and was ruined.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> If the secret to a happy husband is to keep his belly full and his balls empty 🤮
> then what is the secret to a happy wife?
> 
> Keep her *** wet and her face dry? And don’t throw your socks on the floor.


I don't know.....keeping us wet isn't so easy so a guy who can do it is pretty valuable.

As long as he's not otherwise an ass or a bum.
😁


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> If the secret to a happy husband is to keep his belly full and his balls empty
> then what is the secret to a happy wife?
> 
> Keep her *** wet and her face dry? And don’t throw your socks on the floor.


What keeps a wife happy?

That is a moving target that not only changes from day to day, but occasionally from hour to hour...

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk


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## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> Do MC and therapy have it backwards in that instead of trying to get people to resolve their annoying habits and Housekeeping grievances in hopes this will allow some sexual activity to resume.
> 
> Would their efforts be more productive to address the sexual chemistry and then socks on the floor and another cat will become more tolerable?


I think so, because it involves more than just chemistry. If intimacy (connection) is missing then everything else will suffer (including but not limited to sex). 



oldshirt said:


> My theoretical question of the thread is of chicken vs the egg. Does sex break down as people start to get on each other's nerves and start to irritate and annoy each other?
> 
> Or does the sex dwindle down and so things that they used to overlook or simply tolerate now start to be more problematic and less tolerable?


Here, it's the latter. I get annoyed much easier when we haven't had as much alone time as we'd like, and he seems to as well.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

farsidejunky said:


> What keeps a wife happy?
> 
> That is a moving target that not only changes from day to day, but occasionally from hour to hour...
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk


For ME, I pretty much am always happy, so a better question for my partner would be, what will spoil the happiness that I already feel. As long as he doesn't do that, I'm pretty easy to be with!! 

And if you disagree I will get angry!!!! Lol!!  
Just kidding!


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## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

farsidejunky said:


> What keeps a wife happy?
> 
> That is a moving target that not only changes from day to day, but occasionally from hour to hour...


Haha, we feel the same way about husbands sometimes. 

Women really aren't that difficult to figure out for the most part. We will tell you everything you need to know, if only you'll listen.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

theloveofmylife said:


> Haha, we feel the same way about husbands sometimes.
> 
> Women really aren't that difficult to figure out for the most part. We will tell you everything you need to know, if only you'll listen.


Yeah, I get that the comments about a wife being difficult to please or keep happy are being said in jest, but you hear these sorts of comments and stereotyping about women/wives all the time and it really annoys me. Like, we need to keep his belly full and his balls empty (this saying makes me want to vomit), but because we aren’t as simplistic and primal as the male species it’s our fault that men can’t EVER please us.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Serious question though…does anyone think it’s weird that their partner could have major flaws that really annoy them, more than the every day minor things, like flaws that make them really dislike the person, but they are completely blinded to that and walking around with orgasm goggles on for days afterwards just because they had great sex 2 days before? Like, if sex makes you that hot and cold over somebody that quickly, that seems a bit extreme to me.


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## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

It's a chemical thing. Oxytocin is the "bonding chemical" and makes you feel closer to someone (a rocking orgasm or three doesn't hurt anything on its own either haha).


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

theloveofmylife said:


> It's a chemical thing. Oxytocin is the "bonding chemical" and makes you feel closer to someone (a rocking orgasm or three doesn't hurt anything on its own either haha).


Yes, but for your spouse to possess qualities you can’t stand and then to be blinded to them for days after sex? That’s different then just being able to overlook some socks on the floor or some sort of annoying little habit that normally drives you crazy.


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## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

Yes, but it's pretty strong stuff. It makes a new mom bond with the infant that just literally tore her insides inside-out.

I do get what you're saying though. The best sex ever still wouldn't make me like someone who I inherently dislike.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

theloveofmylife said:


> Yes, but it's pretty strong stuff. It makes a new mom bond with the infant that just literally tore her insides inside-out.
> 
> I do get what you're saying though. The best sex ever still wouldn't make me like someone who I inherently dislike.


Not saying sex doesn’t crease oxytocin and make you like somebody more. I’m talking about when your spouse has qualities and/or behaviors that you absolutely cannot stand, that might make you question why you’re even with them, but you ignore that for days after a great orgasm with them. So that if sex dries up it’s not just the lack of sex that makes you leave your spouse but you leave your spouse because the lack of sex has made you realize all of these things about them that cause you to ask “How was I ever attracted to them in the first place?”


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Yeah, I get that the comments about a wife being difficult to please or keep happy are being said in jest, but you hear these sorts of comments and stereotyping about women/wives all the time and it really annoys me. Like, we need to keep his belly full and his balls empty (this saying makes me want to vomit), but because we aren’t as simplistic and primal as the male species it’s our fault that men can’t EVER please us.


It’s easier to blame us than to try. Society has supported this notion for always, that the burden of a happy marriage is completely on the wife and the man existing is enough for him to deserve worship.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

TexasMom1216 said:


> It’s easier to blame us than to try. Society has supported this notion for always, that the burden of a happy marriage is completely on the wife and the man existing is enough for him to deserve worship.
> View attachment 88793


You know I complained about my husband plenty but when I told him about the line “belly full and balls empty” his reaction was “ew gross.” Yes there are quite a few reasons why I remain married to him even if people cannot comprehend.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Yeah, I get that the comments about a wife being difficult to please or keep happy are being said in jest, but you hear these sorts of comments and stereotyping about women/wives all the time and it really annoys me. Like, we need to keep his belly full and his balls empty (this saying makes me want to vomit), but because we aren’t as simplistic and primal as the male species it’s our fault that men can’t EVER please us.


Keep in mind that my post was mostly in jest.

That said, there's legitimate variability based on where many women I have dated in the past have been in their monthly cycles.

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> You know I complained about my husband plenty but when I told him about the line “belly full and balls empty” his reaction was “ew gross.” Yes there are quite a few reasons why I remain married to him even if people cannot comprehend.


My husband was both disgusted and insulted. The implication that men are basically animals is as bad as the implication that women are irrational morons. Many men are fully formed beings capable of reason. They are not, in fact, all blinded by sexual desires. Sex is as intellectual an enterprise for many men as it is for many women. Most of us are complex, interesting creatures capable of empathy and reason. There are of course exceptions, as there always are to any generalization.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

farsidejunky said:


> That said, there's legitimate variability based on where many women I have dated in the past have been in their monthly cycles.


Speaking from personal experience, the cyclical hormonal fluctuations do in fact make some of us mayors of crazytown. Whenever I get really mad about something, I stop and count the days. Often when I feel myself flying off the handle, sure enough, we are a few days prior to Aunt Flo's arrival. This is fair, and there have been jokes forever about men not listening or women being crazy that are funny. I tell them myself. Some people, however, use it as an excuse.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Yes, but for your spouse to possess qualities you can’t stand and then to be blinded to them for days after sex? That’s different then just being able to overlook some socks on the floor or some sort of annoying little habit that normally drives you crazy.


You should not be with someone that has qualities you can’t stand.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

theloveofmylife said:


> I do get what you're saying though. The best sex ever still wouldn't make me like someone who I inherently dislike.


People should not have sex with someone they inherently dislike.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

TexasMom1216 said:


> My husband was both disgusted and insulted. The implication that men are basically animals is as bad as the implication that women are irrational morons. Many men are fully formed beings capable of reason. They are not, in fact, all blinded by sexual desires. Sex is as intellectual an enterprise for many men as it is for many women. Most of us are complex, interesting creatures capable of empathy and reason. There are of course exceptions, as there always are to any generalization.


Not to spill the beans but it's almost impossible your H hasn't heard that phrase before in his life. It's in the 99.999% of surety range.

He apparently did a good job providing the look of surprise and horror expected of him when you told him the phrase.
When you ask him if he's heard before, he'll maintain that of course not position. If he doesn't he deserves what he gets.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Not to spill the beans but it's almost impossible your H hasn't heard that phrase before in his life. It's in the 99.999% of surety range.
> 
> He apparently did a good job providing the look of surprise and horror expected of him when you told him the phrase.
> When you ask him if he's heard before, he'll maintain that of course not position. If he doesn't he deserves what he gets.


Are you saying all men are animals? Cause I get in trouble when I say stuff like that... 😉 🤪 🤭😂

I'm kidding. Maybe that is what he did. The truth is my whole marriage is probably a lie and I'm just too clueless to realize it.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Not to spill the beans but it's almost impossible your H hasn't heard that phrase before in his life. It's in the 99.999% of surety range.
> 
> He apparently did a good job providing the look of surprise and horror expected of him when you told him the phrase.
> When you ask him if he's heard before, he'll maintain that of course not position. If he doesn't he deserves what he gets.


My husband had never heard that phrase and I don’t think he was lying at all. Then again my husband hasn’t heard of a lot of things normal men have. He doesn’t have male buddies he hangs around with and he doesn’t go to man places online. He didn’t react with shock and horror but thought it was gross. I hadn’t heard it either until I saw it in TAM. 

He said he didn’t actually think I was that bad at it though. I said I was bad at it and if that’s really the secret then I definitely am the worst wife on earth. He said “you aren’t that bad.” Can you believe it?


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Are you saying all men are animals? Cause I get in trouble when I say stuff like that... 😉 🤪 🤭😂
> 
> I'm kidding. Maybe that is what he did. The truth is my whole marriage is probably a lie and I'm just too clueless to realize it.


Nope, all men aren't animals but a set of rules that includes sayings, thoughts, expectations, etc has been placed upon men by society. That just is.
The best guys and more normal guys will discard and ignore what isn't suitable, and should. 
Other sayings still hold bits of truth.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> My husband had never heard that phrase and I don’t think he was lying at all. Then again my husband hasn’t heard of a lot of things normal men have. He doesn’t have male buddies he hangs around with and he doesn’t go to man places online. He didn’t react with shock and horror but thought it was gross. I hadn’t heard it either until I saw it in TAM.
> 
> He said he didn’t actually think I was that bad at it though. I said I was bad at it and if that’s really the secret then I definitely am the worst wife on earth. He said “you aren’t that bad.” Can you believe it?


If he said no, I agree that's gross, that's ok, you're not that bad, he's avoiding the topic.

Which may be bad and harmful itself, he could be more honest in evaluating the M sexual relationship, should be if things are hoped to get better.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> If he said no, I agree that's gross, that's ok, you're not that bad, he's avoiding the topic.
> 
> Which may be bad and harmful itself, he could be more honest in evaluating the M sexual relationship, should be if things are hoped to get better.


Well your assumption based on him probably being a more normal man/husband like yourself is that he’s avoiding the topic. Maybe in general he just doesn’t think I’m a horrible wife. Like I said in my deleted thread, he generally has never seemed very concerned or focused on sex, probably due to all of his own mental issues.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Yes, but for your spouse to possess qualities you can’t stand and then to be blinded to them for days after sex? That’s different then just being able to overlook some socks on the floor or some sort of annoying little habit that normally drives you crazy.


Are you referring specifically to ME...? Because the "orgasm goggles" weren't keeping me from seeing things I couldn't stand about him...they were masking things about him that were red flags and should have been more serious to me. 

However, you are someone who cannot possibly understand what sex means to someone like me. We are total opposites, so my ways of thinking and feeling when it comes to sex are always going to seem "weird" and "extreme" to you.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

LisaDiane said:


> Are you referring specifically to ME...? Because the "orgasm goggles" weren't keeping me from seeing things I couldn't stand about him...they were masking things about him that were red flags and should have been more serious to me.
> 
> However, you are someone who cannot possibly understand what sex means to someone like me. We are total opposites, so my ways of thinking and feeling when it comes to sex are always going to seem "weird" and "extreme" to you.


Well, I’m asking for anyone in general but yes your post prompted me to ask the question.

I apologize that I used the incorrect words though. Major annoyances and red flags can be different things, in which case I believe that sex masking red flags for days may be even more extreme than masking major annoyances about the person. For a few hits maybe. But days? You REALLY live sex. That’s fine no judgement. I just can’t understand. Was he that good in bed before he started being stingy? 

You’re right that I will probably never be able to understand how sex could have that extreme of an effect. We can agree on that.


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## DownButNotOut (Apr 9, 2009)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> If he said no, I agree that's gross, that's ok, you're not that bad, he's avoiding the topic.
> 
> Which may be bad and harmful itself, he could be more honest in evaluating the M sexual relationship, should be if things are hoped to get better.


Yeah. He's lying. The man is trapped in a sexless marriage. Would he honestly admit something that will only be used as ammunition against him later? I doubt it.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

DownButNotOut said:


> Yeah. He's lying. The man is trapped in a sexless marriage. Would he honestly admit something that will only be used as ammunition against him later? I doubt it.


He’s not “trapped” as he could leave at any time. He also has other personal issues going on that may actually make him less concerned about sex than maybe the typical adult male on this site. 

Sure, we had very little sex for about. 5 month period but I have been saying yes every time he asks lately and also initiating which isn’t something I usually do. He turned me down twice this week, so if he’s truly trapped in a sexless marriage and has decided that I have ruined all future confidence and desire he may have regarding everything having sex with me again then he can leave. I’m trying on the sex front.


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## Quad73 (May 10, 2021)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Nope, all men aren't animals but a set of rules that includes sayings, thoughts, expectations, etc has been placed upon men by society. That just is.
> The best guys and more normal guys will discard and ignore what isn't suitable, and should.
> Other sayings still hold bits of truth.


My W likes the belly / balls saying; for her it's like a condensed version of a happy husband guide, a sort of quick reference in the back of her mind. I'm not put off by it because I'm fairly secure about my intelligence (or maybe lack of it ) and what I bring outside of those "maintenance" needs.

As for oldshirt's Q, sex makes me less short tempered. I suffer from chronic pain, and sex and music are two of the remaining pleasures in my life. When I have those in my life, I'm a lot easier to live with no doubt. I can be a loving patient spouse despite the pain of living. I'm not sure my W would want to be around me as much as she is if the sex wasn't there to reset my pain/pleasure mix. Working on our sex life a couple of years ago gave me a reason to go on, despite the fact that it was a tough process. The rewards have been great for both of us. She often says we f like teenagers, and then I remind her that we both got zero action as teenagers.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Dr Laura Schlesinger addressed the issue of keeping a man happy and content vs keeping a woman happy and content in her book, “The Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands.”

I’m paraphrasing but she essentially said that women CAN’T be placated and completely content and satisfied and that they will always be anxious and will always be critical and dissatisfied and will always want ‘more.’

However since men are so much more simple and straightforward and have such fewer needs and much less complexities, that if a woman can be cute and attractive (to him), pleasant and take care of his sexual needs, he will be happy and pleasant and cooperative and will at least give his sincere efforts to try to keep her as happy as possible and that is often good enough and the relationship will at least be functional. 

However when a man’s few needs are not being met, then he too will become irritable and cranky and much less prone to try to put in the effort and the whole marriage machine will be prone to break down.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

oldshirt said:


> Dr Laura Schlesinger addressed the issue of keeping a man happy and content vs keeping a woman happy and content in her book, “The Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands.”
> 
> I’m paraphrasing but she essentially said that women CAN’T be placated and completely content and satisfied and that they will always be anxious and will always be critical and dissatisfied and will always want ‘more.’
> 
> ...


But as with so many other things, this is a generalization and while this information might be true for many or most husbands and wives, it will not be true for all.

I wonder if she would maintain that the same holds true for gay men or is this only applicable for straight men?


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## DownButNotOut (Apr 9, 2009)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> He’s not “trapped” as he could leave at any time. He also has other personal issues going on that may actually make him less concerned about sex than maybe the typical adult male on this site.
> 
> Sure, we had very little sex for about. 5 month period but I have been saying yes every time he asks lately and also initiating which isn’t something I usually do. He turned me down twice this week, so if he’s truly trapped in a sexless marriage and has decided that I have ruined all future confidence and desire he may have regarding everything having sex with me again then he can leave. I’m trying on the sex front.


Good. Keep it up. I'd expect it could take quite a while before he trusts that its a long term change, and not just Lucy with the football.

Trapped is what I meant. The tightest chains are those you can't see. The male psyche is the way it is, and men do not easily give up on anything. We're trained at a young age to suck it up and push on through. It's no different in marriage. Wives tend to not see it because men are also taught at a young age to stop whining and push on through. So husbands tend to not talk about what's bothering them until it has become a very big issue. You're right that he could walk at any time, but if he thinks like most men he won't. He'll suck it up and soldier on.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> But as with so many other things, this is a generalization and while this information might be true for many or most husbands and wives, it will not be true for all.
> 
> I wonder if she would maintain that the same holds true for gay men or is this only applicable for straight men?


She's a monster. She made millions telling men they owed women zero in marriage and telling women that groveling, begging, demeaning themselves and basically never expecting anything but abuse and misery needed to be enough for them. That the only "happiness" women deserve is the knowledge that they spent their lives making someone who doesn't care about them at all happy. She preached this nonsense about women never having a single interest outside serving their husband, to the exclusion of themselves, their families and their children, all while going on long speaking engagements and "writing" books about how worthless and awful women are. It's basically MGTOW, NMMNG, incel, Proverbs wife porn. It's really gross and awful. Decent men recognize that she's a snake oil salesmen.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

TexasMom1216 said:


> She's a monster. She made millions telling men they owed women zero in marriage and telling women that groveling, begging, demeaning themselves and basically never expecting anything but abuse and misery needed to be enough for them. That the only "happiness" women deserve is the knowledge that they spent their lives making someone who doesn't care about them at all happy. She preached this nonsense about women never having a single interest outside serving their husband, to the exclusion of themselves, their families and their children, all while going on long speaking engagements and "writing" books about how worthless and awful women are. It's basically MGTOW, NMMNG, incel, Proverbs wife porn. It's really gross and awful. Decent men recognize that she's a snake oil salesmen.


I’ve never heard of her before. Good to know.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

DownButNotOut said:


> Good. Keep it up. I'd expect it could take quite a while before he trusts that its a long term change, and not just Lucy with the football.
> 
> Trapped is what I meant. The tightest chains are those you can't see. The male psyche is the way it is, and men do not easily give up on anything. We're trained at a young age to suck it up and push on through. It's no different in marriage. Wives tend to not see it because men are also taught at a young age to stop whining and push on through. So husbands tend to not talk about what's bothering them until it has become a very big issue. You're right that he could walk at any time, but if he thinks like most men he won't. He'll suck it up and soldier on.


He complains about a lot, just not sex too often.


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## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> I’m paraphrasing but she essentially said that women CAN’T be placated and completely content and satisfied and that they will always be anxious and will always be critical and dissatisfied and will always want ‘more.’
> 
> However since men are so much more simple and straightforward and have such fewer needs and much less complexities, that if a woman can be cute and attractive (to him), pleasant and take care of his sexual needs, he will be happy and pleasant and cooperative and will at least give his sincere efforts to try to keep her as happy as possible and that is often good enough and the relationship will at least be functional.


Wow, really?

I find this insulting to both men and women. And, talk about painting with a broad brush. 

Yeah, stereotypes exist for a reason, but they don't fit everyone. 

Eek.


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## DownButNotOut (Apr 9, 2009)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> But as with so many other things, this is a generalization and while this information might be true for many or most husbands and wives, it will not be true for all.
> 
> I wonder if she would maintain that the same holds true for gay men or is this only applicable for straight men?


Why? are you planning on marrying a gay man?
(edit for punctuation)


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Well, I’m asking for anyone in general but yes your post prompted me to ask the question.
> 
> I apologize that I used the incorrect words though. Major annoyances and red flags can be different things, in which case I believe that sex masking red flags for days may be even more extreme than masking major annoyances about the person. For a few hits maybe. But days? You REALLY live sex. That’s fine no judgement. I just can’t understand. Was he that good in bed before he started being stingy?
> 
> You’re right that I will probably never be able to understand how sex could have that extreme of an effect. We can agree on that.


No need to apologize, the reason I asked you was so I could understand what you were saying.

YES, I REALLY love sex. It's the main reason for being in a relationship for me and my favorite thing about being a woman. I don't really know how to define "good in bed" for you, because you and I have VERY different definitions about what that means, but I can say that he never really cared about having sex with me or meeting my needs. 

That didn't matter to me though, because when I was in love with him, my desire for him burned hot and continuously, and I kept HOPING I would find the magic formula to get him to fully engage with me sexually (and he kept telling me there was one, I just wasn't doing it right...which was another LIE).


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## DownButNotOut (Apr 9, 2009)

theloveofmylife said:


> Wow, really?
> 
> I find this insulting to both men and women. And, talk about painting with a broad brush.
> 
> ...


I don't feel insulted. I am simple. Give me respect, companionship, and sex and I'm a happy happy man.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

DownButNotOut said:


> Why? are you planning on marrying a gay man?
> (edit for punctuation)


I’ve considered I could be a good beard if somebody needed one, but I’m not sure there’s really need for such things in 2022.

But really I was just curious.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

theloveofmylife said:


> Haha, we feel the same way about husbands sometimes.
> 
> Women really aren't that difficult to figure out for the most part. We will tell you everything you need to know, if only you'll listen.


But you can only believe half of it. Many times the actions do not match the words. Believe the actions first.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

LisaDiane said:


> No need to apologize, the reason I asked you was so I could understand what you were saying.
> 
> YES, I REALLY love sex. It's the main reason for being in a relationship for me and my favorite thing about being a woman. I don't really know how to define "good in bed" for you, because you and I have VERY different definitions about what that means, but I can say that he never really cared about having sex with me or meeting my needs.
> 
> That didn't matter to me though, because when I was in love with him, my desire for him burned hot and continuously, and I kept HOPING I would find the magic formula to get him to fully engage with me sexually (and he kept telling me there was one, I just wasn't doing it right...which was another LIE).


Despite the things I’ve said about sex being gross and so on, please know in this case when I say “I can’t understand,” I’m saying that just as a fact not with judgment. I can’t understand what that feels like to enjoy sex that much and that’s just the truth. 

I guess when I ask if he was really good in bed I meant by your standards was he really good, did he make your toes curl, was it just like fireworks? Because if it wasn’t then I really don’t understand how it could be so good as to give you orgasm goggles. If it was like the best sex of your life, which I still can’t understand what that feels like, I can imagine how that might cloud your vision. 

Your second paragraph sort of answers a bit of my question though. So if you feel really in love with a guy can it make just so so sex seem much better than it probably is in reality? Asking from your perspective, not to generalize for all women or people. 

Did he have a “normal” sex drive but just intentionally withheld it from you or did he have an aversion to sec for other reasons?


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Yes, but for your spouse to possess qualities you can’t stand and then to be blinded to them for days after sex? That’s different then just being able to overlook some socks on the floor or some sort of annoying little habit that normally drives you crazy.


You can't understand it because sex does to mean anything to you.


----------



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

DownButNotOut said:


> Why? are you planning on marrying a gay man?
> (edit for punctuation)


LoL! Seriously!😋


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> You can't understand it because sex does to mean anything to you.


I do not understand what it feels like to be blinded by sex, but what is the harm in me asking questions to try to understand in a way that I can without having experienced it myself?


----------



## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

DownButNotOut said:


> I don't feel insulted. I am simple. Give me respect, companionship, and sex and I'm a happy happy man.


Well, glad you're not insulted. I still am. I guess I missed the part where she even mentioned respect or companionship. I saw "be cute, give sex." I'm just saying, most men I know have a bit more to them (and think more of the women they're with) than "be cute, give sex."

And, plenty of women are happy, content, etc. not just greedy, always wanting more.


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> You know I complained about my husband plenty but when I told him about the line “belly full and balls empty” his reaction was “ew gross.” Yes there are quite a few reasons why I remain married to him even if people cannot comprehend.


🤔 Odd for a man to not like good food and alot of sex.


----------



## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I do not understand what it feels like to be blinded by sex, but what is the harm in me asking questions to try to understand in a way that I can without having experienced it myself?


Nothing wrong in asking, but I'm curious... have you ever had fantastic, mind-blowing, rock your world, sex?


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

TexasMom1216 said:


> She's a monster. She made millions telling men they owed women zero in marriage and telling women that groveling, begging, demeaning themselves and basically never expecting anything but abuse and misery needed to be enough for them. That the only "happiness" women deserve is the knowledge that they spent their lives making someone who doesn't care about them at all happy. She preached this nonsense about women never having a single interest outside serving their husband, to the exclusion of themselves, their families and their children, all while going on long speaking engagements and "writing" books about how worthless and awful women are. It's basically MGTOW, NMMNG, incel, Proverbs wife porn. It's really gross and awful. Decent men recognize that she's a snake oil salesmen.


Wow, you are way off!

I listed to her radio talk show on my commute home every evening for several years and she never once said ANY of those things. 

She would call out women on their own BS and hold them accountable for their own predicaments, which was very shocking for many women as they had not have anyone tell it to them straight before, so I’m sure she did ruffle some princess feathers at times.

But she held men and women accountable and responsible for their their own shyt because it is only through one’s own accountability and responsibility for themselves that they can ultimately have agency and empowerment. 

Yes she had what we would consider conservative values today. She she in no way ever advocated women being powerless and subjugated.


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> My husband had never heard that phrase and I don’t think he was lying at all. Then again my husband hasn’t heard of a lot of things normal men have. He doesn’t have male buddies he hangs around with and he doesn’t go to man places online. He didn’t react with shock and horror but thought it was gross. I hadn’t heard it either until I saw it in TAM.
> 
> He said he didn’t actually think I was that bad at it though. I said I was bad at it and if that’s really the secret then I definitely am the worst wife on earth. He said “you aren’t that bad.” Can you believe it?


Not that bad at sex or cooking or both?


----------



## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> But she held men and women accountable and responsible for their their own shyt because it is only through one’s own accountability and responsibility for themselves that they can ultimately have agency and empowerment.


That sounds a lot more reasonable than what you posted earlier.



Divinely Favored said:


> But you can only believe half of it. Many times the actions do not match the words. Believe the actions first.


Yeah, well that applies to everybody, if you ask me.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’ve never heard of her before. Good to know.


Everything Texas said was false.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

theloveofmylife said:


> Well, glad you're not insulted. I still am. I guess I missed the part where she even mentioned respect or companionship. I saw "be cute, give sex." I'm just saying, most men I know have a bit more to them (and think more of the women they're with) than "be cute, give sex."
> 
> And, plenty of women are happy, content, etc. not just greedy, always wanting more.


Well and she basically says that marriage is when two people commit to spending their lives to make the man happy. The woman literally does not matter. You cannot have an opinion, your needs don’t matter, and anything and everything that is wrong is your fault and the man is always blameless. She wrote those books for men to either use to bully their wives into submission or as justification for cheating. I mean there’s obviously a market for this, she has a huge fan base on this forum for sure. But her advice makes women’s lives miserable.


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

oldshirt said:


> Wow, you are way off!
> 
> I listed to her radio talk show on my commute home every evening for several years and she never once said ANY of those things.
> 
> ...


Exactly! I think it pissed off the femnst because she used to be one, until after her son was born then saw the errors in the movement and changed her stance.


----------



## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> She wrote those books for men to either use to bully their wives into submission or as justification for cheating. I mean there’s obviously a market for this, she has a huge fan base on this forum for sure. But her advice makes women’s lives miserable.


Oh, damn. I'll have to look her up. I know I've heard of her, but I've never read her books. 

Again, eek.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> Everything Texas said was false.


Whatever. That is what you say to everything I post. I read her crap as part of my “training.” I was dragged to her lectures to hear what she said. Her idea of marriage is that a man and a woman should commit for life to making the man happy.

She also supported men sleeping around on their wives.


----------



## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> She also supported men sleeping around on their wives.


Seriously? What kind of "marriage advice" is that supposed to be? What the actual hell?

On topic, Yes to good sex helping married people get along better (but NO to anyone who "advises" people to cheat).


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

theloveofmylife said:


> Oh, damn. I'll have to look her up. I know I've heard of her, but I've never read her books.
> 
> Again, eek.


Look up multiple sources for her. As you can see, she has a TON of internet support because of the MGTOW, NMMNG, submissive wife crowd. She supports repealing the 19th amendment, not allowing women to work without their husband's permission, not allowing "no fault" divorce (basically men control divorce). She's not really pro-man or pro-woman, she pro-Laura, because if men treat women the way she recommends, no decent woman is going to want them. She's poison.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

theloveofmylife said:


> Seriously? What kind of "marriage advice" is that supposed to be? What the actual hell?


All right, I need to throttle back and say this differently. She never outright says "men should cheat," the way I worded that was overemotional and dishonest. I apologize for that, I'm having personal issues and get carried away by these men and the horrible things they say about women and their wives. What she says is that "if you're a good enough wife, he won't cheat." Basically, if he cheats it's her fault. And a woman should NEVER leave a man for cheating. She should beg his forgiveness for being such a terrible wife that he wanted to cheat and then follow him around naked begging for sex and apologizing and sucking up in the hopes that he won't cheat. But if he does, it's her fault because she's not trying hard enough.


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Well and she basically says that marriage is when two people commit to spending their lives to make the man happy. The woman literally does not matter. You cannot have an opinion, your needs don’t matter, and anything and everything that is wrong is your fault and the man is always blameless. She wrote those books for men to either use to bully their wives into submission or as justification for cheating. I mean there’s obviously a market for this, she has a huge fan base on this forum for sure. But her advice makes women’s lives miserable.


You are not even in the ballpark.

The books are for women to help them understand men. That women are basically control of the relationship and men are so simple, like puppies basically, that we react to how we are treated by our wives. 

For the most part yes!


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> 🤔 Odd for a man to not like good food and alot of sex.


Didn’t say my husband didn’t like good food or enjoy sex but he’s never been HD. He has a lot of personal and mental issues that affect his enjoyment of a lot of things.


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

theloveofmylife said:


> Nothing wrong in asking, but I'm curious... have you ever had fantastic, mind-blowing, rock your world, sex?


With my vibrator I sure have, but with an actual human being no. I don’t walk around with heart emojis in my eyes for the vibrator for days afterwards. That’s just be weird.


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> Not that bad at sex or cooking or both?


He said I wasn’t too bad at “either of those things.”


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Whatever. That is what you say to everything I post. I read her crap as part of my “training.” I was dragged to her lectures to hear what she said. Her idea of marriage is that a man and a woman should commit for life to making the man happy.
> 
> She also supported men sleeping around on their wives.


No.


----------



## DownButNotOut (Apr 9, 2009)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Didn’t say my husband didn’t like good food or enjoy sex but he’s never been HD. He has a lot of personal and mental issues that affect his enjoyment of a lot of things.


Um. You do realize that the belly full / balls empty saying means well fed and sexually satisfied right? If he's getting enough of both to suit him ... job's done.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

oldshirt said:


> The reason I posted the other spin off thread is because I don’t think it is just a male issue.
> 
> I think the principle applies to both.
> 
> If some chick is having hot monkey sex with some hunk that is leaving her breathless, I don’t think she’s gonna get too wrapped around the axle if he leaves his socks on the floor.


I have to agree, and I do wonder if I gave my ex what she kept wanting - hot, passionate, wild sex - we would still be together. Other issues would come into play sure, but sex is a big checkbox.

Also why I'm no longer making any compromises on what triggers me sexually. I HAVE to be sexually attracted, otherwise forget it, I'm not good enough for her, someone else would be.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

TexasMom1216 said:


> She also supported men sleeping around on their wives.


Once again, if you are going to make outlandish and nonsensical claims, you are going to need to cite sources and documentation.

Please cite the publication and page where an internationally known PhD clinical psychologist and licensed marriage and family therapist said that it was ok for people to cheat on their spouse.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> Once again, if you are going to make outlandish and nonsensical claims, you are going to need to cite sources and documentation.
> 
> Please cite the publication and page where an internationally known PhD clinical psychologist and licensed marriage and family therapist said that it was ok for people to cheat on their spouse.


She isn't a real doctor. She's an entertainer. Also, I have to correct myself (as I did in an answer to another poster).* My claim was inaccurate and an emotional response, whatever I’m going through shouldn’t come through on here or I’ll have to do what I have to do now, which is apologize for making irrational statements. *

She of course doesn’t specifically say men should cheat. She says it’s the woman’s fault when he does. 

"When the wife does not focus in on the needs and the feelings, sexually, personally, to make him feel like a man, to make him feel like a success, to make him feel like her hero, he’s very susceptible to the charm of some other woman making him feel what he needs.” Her advice is that if he cheats, you need to debase yourself and hope you can humiliate yourself enough to satisfy him so he doesn’t cheat. The man is not at fault for cheating, the woman is.

BUT, my post was wrong, so attack, insult, report away. I sat for hours listening to her. I know what her message is, and it’s that men don’t cheat on “good” wives, only “bad” ones.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

TexasMom1216 said:


> She isn't a real doctor. She's an entertainer. Also, I have to correct myself (as I did in an answer to another poster).* My claim was inaccurate and an emotional response, whatever I’m going through shouldn’t come through on here or I’ll have to do what I have to do now, which is apologize for making irrational statements. *
> 
> She of course doesn’t specifically say men should cheat. She says it’s the woman’s fault when he does.
> 
> ...


I can see your implications.

It's like saying it's a man's fault when the wife cheats, hence the message that the wife is entitled to cheat on their "bad" husbands.


----------



## Quad73 (May 10, 2021)

theloveofmylife said:


> Well, glad you're not insulted. I still am. I guess I missed the part where she even mentioned respect or companionship. I saw "be cute, give sex." I'm just saying, most men I know have a bit more to them (and think more of the women they're with) than "be cute, give sex."
> 
> And, plenty of women are happy, content, etc. not just greedy, always wanting more.


My wife does it this way: she's super cute & gives great sex generously - in bed. Outside of the bedroom she's a no-bs independent business woman who enjoys inventory control and knows how to get paid in advance for most everything she does. I respect her immensely and often ask for her advice. The bedroom is our fantasy space. We've learned how to switch between those two worlds after work is over.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

RandomDude said:


> I can see your implications.
> 
> It's like saying it's a man's fault when the wife cheats, hence the message that the wife is entitled to cheat on their "bad" husbands.


No. She NEVER says anything like that. Women are NEVER allowed to cheat. Or complain. Or expect anything. But if men cheat, it's the wife's fault, because they weren't good enough and so the man had to find what he "needed" outside the marriage.

It tracks here though. I've about accepted it. I'm trying to find a way to get my H in swinger's parties and orgies so we can end our sexual relationship. Since men aren't attracted to women my age and no woman can ever be enough for one man. It's only fair that I release him. Then once the boy leaves home I will take around 1/4 of our combined property and disappear. I lash out at @oldshirt but he's right. I'm stupid to expect more.


----------



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Well and she basically says that marriage is when two people commit to spending their lives to make the man happy. The woman literally does not matter. You cannot have an opinion, your needs don’t matter, and anything and everything that is wrong is your fault and the man is always blameless. She wrote those books for men to either use to bully their wives into submission or as justification for cheating. I mean there’s obviously a market for this, she has a huge fan base on this forum for sure. But her advice makes women’s lives miserable.


Good grief. This is as revisionist as it gets. LoL!

I heard her more than once being brutal with men.

I think she was probably too harsh with everyone on occasion but she is hardly as you are portraying her.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

TexasMom1216 said:


> She isn't a real doctor. She's an entertainer. Also, I have to correct myself (as I did in an answer to another poster).* My claim was inaccurate and an emotional response, whatever I’m going through shouldn’t come through on here or I’ll have to do what I have to do now, which is apologize for making irrational statements. *
> 
> She of course doesn’t specifically say men should cheat. She says it’s the woman’s fault when he does.
> 
> "When the wife does not focus in on the needs and the feelings, sexually, personally, to make him feel like a man, to make him feel like a success, to make him feel like her hero, he’s very susceptible to the charm of some other woman making him feel what he needs.” Her advice is that if he cheats, you need to debase yourself and hope you can humiliate yourself enough to satisfy him so he doesn’t cheat. The man is not at fault for cheating, the woman is.


She's not a medical doctor (MD) nor has she ever claimed to be. She holds masters and PhD in psychology and is a licensed marital and family therapist, so the professional title of "Dr" is appropriate. 

But anyway, I do appreciate your candor in admitting your outburst and I greatly appreciate your direct quote. While I cannot cite the quote you mention above, I will publicly claim that I do not dispute it's authenticity and I believe that the quote is actual. And if it is not actual, I do believe it is within the spirit of what she would infact say. 

So this give us something to work with and discuss the context of it's meaning. 

First off however we must differentiate between social/political agenda vs reality in real life application. 

The portion of her statement that you quoted *IS *a reality of the human condition. 

Your personal commentary in the following sentence is your own agenda driven interpretation. You need to learn to distinguish between the two. 

Neither Dr Laura Schlesinger nor really any other authority on infidelity has ever said that anyone male or female should debase or humiliate themselves to keep someone from cheating nor does anyone lay blame upon the BS. What the WS does with their genitalia is by their own choice. Period. 

So let's look at your quoted state objectively and in the spirit for which it was intended. 

It may be wrong. It may be immoral. It may be unethical, it is certainly destructive when someone cheats. And it is by conscious choice of the WS and *NOT THE FAULT *of the BS. 

However, it is an uncomfortable reality that if someone consistently and chronically rejects and denies their partner, an environment and conditions are created where it is not an unpredictable chance that the rejected party may have an increased susceptibility to develop or even seek connection with someone else. That *IS *a reality. 

It's not an excuse or license to cheat. But it can create an environment and vulnerability where someone may have an increase susceptibility to make that choice. 

The more you reject your partner, the higher the risk they may get their needs met elsewhere. 

That is not an agenda. 

That is a reality of the human condition.


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

TexasMom1216 said:


> No. She NEVER says anything like that. Women are NEVER allowed to cheat. Or complain. Or expect anything. But if men cheat, it's the wife's fault, because they weren't good enough and so the man had to find what he "needed" outside the marriage.


Again, you are stating falsehoods about not only the spirit, but the actual words of Dr Laura Schlesinger. 

She does *NOT *under any circumstances condone, excuse or downplay the destructiveness of male infidelity. She holds the individual accountable and calls them out and points out their failing and harmfulness of their actions regardless of gender.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> She's not a medical doctor (MD) nor has she ever claimed to be. She holds masters and PhD in psychology and is a licensed marital and family therapist, so the professional title of "Dr" is appropriate.
> 
> But anyway, I do appreciate your candor in admitting your outburst and I greatly appreciate your direct quote. While I cannot cite the quote you mention above, I will publicly claim that I do not dispute it's authenticity and I believe that the quote is actual. And if it is not actual, I do believe it is within the spirit of what she would infact say.
> 
> ...


You would love my father. Peas in a pod. Enjoy.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> Again, you are stating falsehoods about not only the spirit, but the actual words of Dr Laura Schlesinger.
> 
> She does *NOT *under any circumstances condone, excuse or downplay the destructiveness of male infidelity. She holds the individual accountable and calls them out and points out their failing and harmfulness of their actions regardless of gender.


Provably false. But it doesn’t matter. Women do not matter. She did this for money and women suffered.


----------



## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

TexasMom1216 said:


> No. She NEVER says anything like that. Women are NEVER allowed to cheat. Or complain. Or expect anything. But if men cheat, it's the wife's fault, because they weren't good enough and so the man had to find what he "needed" outside the marriage.
> 
> It tracks here though. I've about accepted it. I'm trying to find a way to get my H in swinger's parties and orgies so we can end our sexual relationship. Since men aren't attracted to women my age and no woman can ever be enough for one man. It's only fair that I release him. Then once the boy leaves home I will take around 1/4 of our combined property and disappear. I lash out at @oldshirt but he's right. I'm stupid to expect more.


Wait, what?

Are you being serious about your husband?


----------



## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Provably false. But it doesn’t matter. Women do not matter. She did this for money and women suffered.


You're within your right to not like someone or to think that they are promoting something you do not agree with in principle. You are entitled to your personal opinion and feelings about someone. 

What you do not have a right to do is to say that they are saying or promoting something that they are not. You do not have the right to lie or spread falsehoods to promote your own agendas.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> You're within your right to not like someone or to think that they are promoting something you do not agree with in principle. You are entitled to your personal opinion and feelings about someone.
> 
> What you do not have a right to do is to say that they are saying or promoting something that they are not. You do not have the right to lie or spread falsehoods to promote your own agendas.


I’m not promoting an agenda, you’re saying that to silence me. I was forced (by my father) to study her. I know what she teaches. You are choosing to believe what you like, which makes sense because what she teaches advantages you. You won’t be able to understand how her and your views affect others.


----------



## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

oldshirt said:


> People should not have sex with someone they inherently dislike.


I can't even comprehend it.

Then again, according to a different thread, I haven't been with the 'right' number


----------



## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

TexasMom1216 said:


> I mean there’s obviously a market for this, she has a huge fan base on this forum for sure. But her advice makes women’s lives miserable.


I'd challenge the view that she has a 'huge' fan base on this forum.

I looked her up, and certainly she's not for me. The small bits I heard from her were ridiculously reductive. I didn't spend much time on listening to her as it's obvious from naming the title of a clip, 'These days, most women are pigs' that I'm not the intended audience and evokes in me that this is someone of click-bait level. And then there's...
_
'Now, the last question, “Why didn't you write a book about the proper care and feeding of wives?” That would be one page. I wouldn't get paid much for it. All it would say is, “Yes, dear.”'_

And which kind of sums up exactly why I wouldn't bother paying much attention to her. Still, she be making that money.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

heartsbeating said:


> I'd challenge the view that she has a 'huge' fan base on this forum.
> 
> I looked her up, and certainly she's not for me. The small bits I heard from her were ridiculously reductive. I didn't spend much time on listening to her as it's obvious from naming the title of a clip, 'These days, most women are pigs' that I'm not the intended audience and evokes in me that this is someone of click-bait level. And then there's...
> 
> ...


Exactly. Those who are fans of hers choose to not listen to the awful things she’s saying about women. Or, more likely, they agree. She says terrible things about women and those men just nod along. Her target audience is men who believe women need to shut up and do as they’re told, who don’t believe women CAN be happy and even if they could it’s more important that men be happy (and women don’t matter at all). I have yet to see someone’s posting history and be surprised when they’re a fan of hers.

Her blaming the betrayed wife makes even more sense when you learn that her second husband was married with children when she started dating him. He left his “bad” wife and children for her. So of course the fault lies with anyone but her or the man who dumped his family for her.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Who is this bad bad woman anyway that men are supposedly listening to? And what makes her special?



Livvie said:


> Wait, what?
> 
> Are you being serious about your husband?


@TexasMom1216 

Yes, what's going on there?


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

TexasMom1216 said:


> She isn't a real doctor. She's an entertainer. Also, I have to correct myself (as I did in an answer to another poster).* My claim was inaccurate and an emotional response, whatever I’m going through shouldn’t come through on here or I’ll have to do what I have to do now, which is apologize for making irrational statements. *
> 
> She of course doesn’t specifically say men should cheat. She says it’s the woman’s fault when he does.
> 
> ...


I hope whatever you're going through gets better just in general. Hang in there.


----------



## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Despite the things I’ve said about sex being gross and so on, please know in this case when I say “I can’t understand,” I’m saying that just as a fact not with judgment. I can’t understand what that feels like to enjoy sex that much and that’s just the truth.
> 
> I guess when I ask if he was really good in bed I meant by your standards was he really good, did he make your toes curl, was it just like fireworks? Because if it wasn’t then I really don’t understand how it could be so good as to give you orgasm goggles. If it was like the best sex of your life, which I still can’t understand what that feels like, I can imagine how that might cloud your vision.
> 
> ...


I don't know how to answer your question, except to say, I don't have "sexual standards" the way you do. I don't have a list of needs and demands (I'm not judging you for that either!)...I need and want and enjoy sex for different reasons than you do. My emotional response to his desire gave me physical feelings and an urge to explore those feelings physically.

So my "toes curled" when I felt sexually desired by him...and selfishly, he was determined to withhold even that from me.

He was only my second sex partner (the other one was my first husband), so I don't know if this matters at all to my feelings about sex, but I've never ever had sex that was meaningless or purely physical...it's always been a full expression of MY love and desire for the men I was in love with. I also never fantasized about anyone else, because all I could think about was them (even after 14+yrs together).

So for ME, I've never had "so so sex". Did it always feel great, or satisfy me, or make me feel good about myself...?? NO. But that didn't ruin the experience for me...it just made me want more.

Like eating a piece of chocolate cake -- just because I only get two or three bites doesn't make me hate cake or only want to eat it if I get to have the entire piece. I LOVE the few bites I get to have, and I wish I could have more...and I wait and hope that I get more again soon.

As for his sex drive...I guess it was pretty normal...he just had NO interest in sharing it with ME. He preferred porn (fantasy) and masturbation to a warm, real woman who would have done anything to his body to please him.
In that way, I guess we can say that YOU are very much like he was.

The huge difference with you is that you have been honest, if not at first, at least lately...he NEVER was. He lied, blame-shifted, and did everything to hurt and confuse me so he didn't have to admit the truth. I had to figure it out on my own, which was confusing and lonely and hurtful for me, and kept me with him for years longer than I should have been...so I guess it worked to his advantage.


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

DownButNotOut said:


> Um. You do realize that the belly full / balls empty saying means well fed and sexually satisfied right? If he's getting enough of both to suit him ... job's done.


Did not understand why they thought it was gross unless both just do not like eating or sex.


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

theloveofmylife said:


> Oh, damn. I'll have to look her up. I know I've heard of her, but I've never read her books.
> 
> Again, eek.


On her radio show she does not put up with crap. She rips men and women alike.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Whatever. That is what you say to everything I post. I read her crap as part of my “training.” I was dragged to her lectures to hear what she said. Her idea of marriage is that a man and a woman should commit for life to making the man happy.
> 
> She also supported men sleeping around on their wives.


Been listening to her for years and never heard her say anything of the like. She rips cheaters and disdain for them is apparent.


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## DownButNotOut (Apr 9, 2009)

Divinely Favored said:


> Did not understand why they thought it was gross unless both just do not like eating or sex.


My guess is he said that because he figured that was the response she expected from him.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

TexasMom1216 said:


> She isn't a real doctor. She's an entertainer. Also, I have to correct myself (as I did in an answer to another poster).* My claim was inaccurate and an emotional response, whatever I’m going through shouldn’t come through on here or I’ll have to do what I have to do now, which is apologize for making irrational statements. *
> 
> She of course doesn’t specifically say men should cheat. She says it’s the woman’s fault when he does.
> 
> ...


What she talks about is basically when one is not happy in their marriage, it opens door for temptation.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Very entertaining thread, with all the outbursts, sprinkled by some delightful nonsense and stereotypes.. a classic TAM thread!


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

In terms of keeping men and women happy reducing it to a page is a tad simplistic.

For example, I think crazy sex with otherwise abusive behavior would be tolerable for a short time but in the long run no.

Other than the NRE stage you do not live in a vacuum and being “happy” on a daily basis is a complex formula for men and women.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

My wife very much agrees with her. My wife takes care of me and I take very good care of her. 

Dr Laura is a proponent of mother being a mother and staying with and raising the children until they go to school. Dad hopefully being able to support the family so she can do that. She is a family therapist...the family takes priority over her career until the kids are school age.

Children who have a mom home during childhood are better developed that those who have to be raised by daycare workers.

I have seen many come from families that others basically raised them during childhood. I had many on my caseload the last 23 years when they got out of prison. Most were pretty screwed up in their thought process and we're not as developed in their emotional bonds with others, especially spouses, baby mommas and family. If more mother's would stay home and raise there children I think there would be a reduction in crime stats with the upcoming generations.

Dr Laura is about a mom being a mom during the crucial developmental times of a child's life. If that is offensive to the femnst and their delicate psychic, I'm sorry. I agree with her on that. 

My mom was a controlling person that had screwed up ideas about life. She very much wanted to rule the roost, her way or no way. Mom started working before I was in KG. We do not have a close relationship.

When a woman has children her 1st priority should be family unit, not getting a job to make herself feel better about herself because society at large tells women they are nothing unless they are busting their ass in the workforce like a man. Women who would rather do their own thing than be there and be the mother their children need are going to be revolted at Dr. Laura's ideas. 

I understand there are circumstances that would not allow one parent to remain home with child. She also advocates for staggered work hours where one parent is home with kids so they do not have to go to a daycare. Or find a home type job one can do, but be there for the children.

This is things Dr. Laura champions.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Personally, I could not live with great sex and big annoyances. Small annoyances and great sex, yes. Small annoyances and little sex, no.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

In Absentia said:


> Personally, I could not live with great sex and big annoyances. Small annoyances and great sex, yes. Small annoyances and little sex, no.


That's a critical point. Small annoyances and great sex, yes.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

As Dr Laura says in her radio show, my wife does the proper care and feeding of this husband(I wag my tail accordingly too). If you listen to the women who follow her teachings, they call back and their marriages have turned around and they are so much happier than they were before they were putting her teaching to practice. 

But when she speaks of a husband that would swim across shark infested waters to bring his wife a glass of ice water, I likewise would go back for the little umbrella if they forgot it. My wife treats me like her 👑 and because of it, I treat her like my 👸, I will conquer 🗡 the land and give her the keys to the Kingdom and ensure her orders are followed by our minions.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

LisaDiane said:


> I don't know how to answer your question, except to say, I don't have "sexual standards" the way you do. I don't have a list of needs and demands (I'm not judging you for that either!)...I need and want and enjoy sex for different reasons than you do. My emotional response to his desire gave me physical feelings and an urge to explore those feelings physically.
> 
> So my "toes curled" when I felt sexually desired by him...and selfishly, he was determined to withhold even that from me.
> 
> ...


Well, while you might not have “”standards” like I do, I was really just asking if the sex was really great or not. I thought most people could tell if sex with a given person was absolutely amazing or just alright. 

I think for most people just because you really love sex and you really love the person you’re with, it won’t automatically result in an amazing sexual experience. Your partner could be very bad in bed and despite how much you love them and you love sex, the sex with them is lackluster.

I get the feeling that your ex wasn’t attracted to you. Or maybe you weren’t as good in bed and at pleasuring him physically as you thought you were. Or maybe he just became addicted to porn. I mean, just because you happened to be a warm female body that loved him doesn’t automatically mean that sex with you is desirable or more pleasurable that jacking off to porn, if he didn’t find your warm body attractive or he just really didn’t like you at all. 

There are different reasons that people “withhold” sex. Sometimes it’s a straight up “withholding” that you’re doing to intentionally hurt the other person. You almost get off on torturing the person. It seems that you believe everybody that stops having sex with their partners fall into that camp. That we are all doing it intentionally.

Sometimes it’s more of an aversion that’s developed in yourself regarding sex and you aren’t intentionally trying to hurt your partner but you just have developed an aversion and dislike for sex. 

Then there are the situations where our sex drives are just fine but we simply do not want sex with our partner because we aren’t attracted to them anymore or we dislike them for some reason or maybe they’re horrible in bed and no amount of love can change that part. Granted, in these cases we should just be honest with our partners and tell them we don’t want to have sex with them anymore because we simply don’t like them or don’t find them attractive or they are horrible in bed, etc. and then divorce them, not string them along forever. 

It was wrong of your ex to string you along like he did and he should have just divorced you or maybe never even married you in the first place so that you’d be free. 

I think it’s amazing that you never fantasized about anyone else during those relationships. I’ve never felt being so into a person, so full of love that they are the only person I can fantasize about sexually for years.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> That's a critical point. Small annoyances and great sex, yes.


I think over they years you learn how to compartmentalise and live with small annoyances. No marriage is perfect. But no great sex will convince me to stay in marriage were sex is the only thing I look forward to... let's not even mention big annoyances and bad sex...


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> My wife very much agrees with her. My wife takes care of me and I take very good care of her.
> 
> Dr Laura is a proponent of mother being a mother and staying with and raising the children until they go to school. Dad hopefully being able to support the family so she can do that. She is a family therapist...the family takes priority over her career until the kids are school age.
> 
> ...


WOW! “If more mothers stayed home…” Sure, in an ideal world where families of 3+ can get by on one person’s salary. And that’s only the tip of the iceberg on this topic. What world are you living in? 

It’s also not as easy for people to find “staggered jobs” or good paying work from home jobs (newsflash, to actually have a job where you work from home it’s very difficult to also watch a baby or child the entire time you’re supposed to be working and in fact many companies prohibit, maybe not during COVID shutdowns but under normal circumstances). Even these days with more companies offering work from home, it’s difficult to find a good paying work from home job unless you have certain qualifications that most average people tend not to have. For somebody like me, the only work from home jobs I can find are customer service phone jobs and related paying about 13 an hour average. You can’t work a customer service phone job and have a baby to care for at the same time. 

We live in a world now where most children do not have stay at home moms. The majority of children aren’t growing up to become criminals and being imprisoned because of it.

If I had a child I’d want to be able to be home with them the first 5 years but it would not be possible at this time. I have nothing against stay at home moms, it’s just not realistic or doable for many families and to shame women for that is wrong. Also, I don’t believe a woman who could stay home but chooses to work should be condemned either. I think many men have a hard time understanding a woman’s experience in this world. Many of us don’t want to feel dependent on another person, another person who could die or leave us for a younger hotter model or who could lose their job. 

I’d love to see a thread on this but I’d get way too worked up and have a heart attack.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Almost no one has a partner who does not have some annoying traits, and usually those will never change. If you can't accept them or at least overlook them, it will surely harm the relationship. IMO, good sex certainly can and does mitigate those annoyances, because consistent good experiences far outweigh the minor irritations.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Married but Happy said:


> Almost no one has a partner who does not have some annoying traits, and usually those will never change. If you can't accept them or at least overlook them, it will surely harm the relationship. IMO, good sex certainly can and does mitigate those annoyances, because consistent good experiences far outweigh the minor irritations.


I believe that at a certain point in your life, you're not going to put up with someone's nonsense if you're not getting orgasms out of it. 🤭


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> WOW! “If more mothers stayed home…” Sure, in an ideal world where families of 3+ can get by on one person’s salary. And that’s only the tip of the iceberg on this topic. What world are you living in?
> 
> It’s also not as easy for people to find “staggered jobs” or good paying work from home jobs (newsflash, to actually have a job where you work from home it’s very difficult to also watch a baby or child the entire time you’re supposed to be working and in fact many companies prohibit, maybe not during COVID shutdowns but under normal circumstances). Even these days with more companies offering work from home, it’s difficult to find a good paying work from home job unless you have certain qualifications that most average people tend not to have. For somebody like me, the only work from home jobs I can find are customer service phone jobs and related paying about 13 an hour average. You can’t work a customer service phone job and have a baby to care for at the same time.
> 
> ...


No body is shaming no one. No need to get all butt hurt. I said if it is possible. Just like with a single parent, it is not possible. It would be ideal for the child's sake, but not always do able.

There are also alot of people who want alot of stuff, big house, play toys, expensive cars. That is not conducive to being there for your kids like would be good, and would require a second income. Many people choose lifestyle over family time, it is the child that will suffer for it in the meantime. At the same time, if the parents are abusive...getting away from them would be beneficial to the child.

My mom was a beautician and owned a shop, had 3 other employees. It was a place for her to socialize. Was a tax write off that they could count as loss each year, pretty much a break even scenario that gave her something to do, don't forget the carpel tunnel surgery and back issues now from standing all the time. In trade sister and I got to spend maybe 3 hours a day in the presence of a parent. During that time she was cooking dinner or doing the laundry from hair salon or we were taking baths and getting ready for bed. So maybe 1.5 hr a day actually spent with parent. And one wonders why I am not really close to mom.

Not everyone is becoming a criminal, but the vast majority of the antisocial criminals I have dealt with come from that background where the mom was not in the house full time or just wanted the kids out of her hair somewhere else.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> No body is shaming no one. No need to get all butt hurt. I said if it is possible. Just like with a single parent, it is not possible. It would be ideal for the child's sake, but not always do able.
> 
> There are also alot of people who want alot of stuff, big house, play toys, expensive cars. That is not conducive to being there for your kids like would be good, and would require a second income. Many people choose lifestyle over family time, it is the child that will suffer for it in the meantime. At the same time, if the parents are abusive...getting away from them would be beneficial to the child.
> 
> My mom was a beautician and owned a shop, had 3 other employees. It was a place for her to socialize. Was a tax write off that they could count as loss each year, pretty much a break even scenario that gave her something to do, don't forget the carpel tunnel surgery and back issues now from standing all the time. In trade sister and I got to spend maybe 3 hours a day in the presence of a parent. During that time she was cooking dinner or doing the laundry from hair salon or we were taking baths and getting ready for bed. So maybe 1.5 hr a day actually spent with parent. And one wonders why I am not really close to mom.


True, some people want more or bigger material possessions than are necessary, but at the same time some families need 2 incomes just to get by or to provide a relatively normal, stable life for their children without any extravagances involved.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> True, some people want more or bigger material possessions than are necessary, but at the same time some families need 2 incomes just to get by or to provide a relatively normal, stable life for their children without any extravagances involved.


Many do, no doubt. But it's ok to say it's beneficial if Mom can stay home, too. Shouldn't assume everyone who says that is anti-woman because that's not true either.

Our family was blessed, W able to stay home while kids were young. Later her choice to return to work.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Many do, no doubt. But it's ok to say it's beneficial if Mom can stay home, too. Shouldn't assume everyone who says that is anti-woman because that's not true either.
> 
> Our family was blessed, W able to stay home while kids were young. Later her choice to return to work.


My wife is sad that she was not able to stay home with our kids, during those years before school age. I was very involved also, I would do drop off at school(17 miles away) and wife was there when they got out. She was in outside sales(commission) so she had very flexible schedule. Other than that we were both VERY involved in their time outside school hours. If they had game, etc. during school hours, we took off work to be there.

I know several women with home based businesses to stay with the kids. One raises milk goats and sells milk and makes goat milk soap. Another is a barrel racer and she has a horse feed/tack shop. Another makes things for sale on internet websites.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Divinely Favored said:


> My wife is sad that she was not able to stay home with our kids, during those years before school age.


Pretty sure my wife wanted to stay at home during the first years. Shame she dragged her husband from another country and wanted kids pretty quickly, so not giving the husband a chance to build his own career first. I think, somehow, she still resents me for that...


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> My wife is sad that she was not able to stay home with our kids, during those years before school age. I was very involved also, I would do drop off at school(17 miles away) and wife was there when they got out. She was in outside sales(commission) so she had very flexible schedule. Other than that we were both VERY involved in their time outside school hours. If they had game, etc. during school hours, we took off work to be there.
> 
> I know several women with home based businesses to stay with the kids. One raises milk goats and sells milk and makes goat milk soap. Another is a barrel racer and she has a horse feed/tack shop. Another makes things for sale on internet websites.


Goats? Well, there’s my solution!


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Goats? Well, there’s my solution!


Could be!😁 Especially during the formula shortage. Easier on the stomach that cow milk. Been given to babies for thousands of years.

That goat milk soap is expensive


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## ah_sorandy (Jul 19, 2018)

Quad73 said:


> My W likes the belly / balls saying; for her it's like a condensed version of a happy husband guide, a sort of quick reference in the back of her mind. I'm not put off by it because I'm fairly secure about my intelligence (or maybe lack of it ) and what I bring outside of those "maintenance" needs.
> 
> As for oldshirt's Q, *sex makes me less short tempered. I suffer from chronic pain, and sex and music are two of the remaining pleasures in my life. When I have those in my life, I'm a lot easier to live with no doubt. I can be a loving patient spouse despite the pain of living. *I'm not sure my W would want to be around me as much as she is if the sex wasn't there to reset my pain/pleasure mix. Working on our sex life a couple of years ago gave me a reason to go on, despite the fact that it was a tough process. The rewards have been great for both of us. She often says we f like teenagers, and then I remind her that we both got zero action as teenagers.


Yep, I can relate to this as well. Other than getting little to no sex for the last few decades, at least the chronic pain has been reduced by getting the correct medical treatment for a condition I have had since I was a kid.

And yes, with the right woman giving me plenty of her sexuality on a regular basis, I would be a devoted and patient partner! I have a lot of 'love' to give to the right woman too!


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

TexasMom1216 said:


> I believe that at a certain point in your life, you're not going to put up with someone's nonsense if you're not getting orgasms out of it. 🤭


Well, there are people who are asexual or not attracted to their spouse and a lot of them stay for the finances and comfort and perks of marriage. They put up with nonsense because of THOSE perks.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Right.


Livvie said:


> Well, there are people who are asexual or not attracted to their spouse and a lot of them stay for the finances and comfort and perks of marriage. They put up with nonsense because of THOSE perks.


Just like there are women married to philandering Dr. that do not want to have sex and know he is screwing whoever but is ok with that because of the lifestyle perks.


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## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

Divinely Favored said:


> Not that bad at sex or cooking or both?


Judging from some of the more...um... personal posts, I'd say her husband is bad at at least one of those...



Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I think it’s amazing that you never fantasized about anyone else during those relationships. I’ve never felt being so into a person, so full of love that they are the only person I can fantasize about sexually for years.


I don't think so. I adore my husband to the point that I don't want anyone else. I don't want to bring anyone else into our sex life either, not even in my mind.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

theloveofmylife said:


> Judging from some of the more...um... personal posts, I'd say her husband is bad at at least one of those..


She was referring to herself in the comment. I was trying to understand the yuk comment from both of them. 

Me thinks she misunderstood the full belly and empty balls as her draining his balls by way of alot of swallowing. 

Not cooking hubby a good meal and having sex. She missed the point of it is his full belly, not her filling hers buy emptying his balls.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Divinely Favored said:


> She was referring to herself in the comment. I was trying to understand the yuk comment from both of them.
> 
> Me thinks she misunderstood the full belly and empty balls as her draining his balls by way of alot of swallowing.
> 
> Not cooking hubby a good meal and having sex. She missed the point of it is his full belly, not her filling hers buy emptying his balls.


Ew kinda a gross visual there.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Well, while you might not have “”standards” like I do, I was really just asking if the sex was really great or not. I thought most people could tell if sex with a given person was absolutely amazing or just alright.
> 
> I think for most people just because you really love sex and you really love the person you’re with, it won’t automatically result in an amazing sexual experience. Your partner could be very bad in bed and despite how much you love them and you love sex, the sex with them is lackluster.
> 
> ...


Don't you have to have sex to have standards?


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Don't you have to have sex to have standards?


I wasn’t even saying I have “standards.” LisaDiane just said that she doesn’t have the same sort of “standards” that I do. If I do have any standards then I don’t think anyone can argue that my standards and LisaDiane’s standards would probably not be the same. 

I had sex many times before marrying my husband. I had sex with my husband probably an average of twice a week for most of our marriage. Sometimes it was only once a week I admit. It’s not like I’ve never had sex. 

When I mentioned standards in the first place it was when asking her if the sex with her ex was really great according to whatever was “really great” to her. I’m sure people have differing opinions in what makes sex “really great” to them. What could be pretty good sex to one person might be amazing to another or really boring to somebody else, depending on what gets them going or maybe depending on what previous experiences they’ve had with other people. Arguably, sex comes in many different varieties and levels of quality. I was just wondering if one of the reasons the sex and orgasms were so great and gave her orgasm goggles for days was because he was really that amazing in bed, like super skilled and rocked her world every time or if she just loved him and loves sex so much that maybe his skill wasn’t the number one factor.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Livvie said:


> Ew kinda a gross visual there.


lol… yes…


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Divinely Favored said:


> She was referring to herself in the comment. I was trying to understand the yuk comment from both of them.
> 
> Me thinks she misunderstood the full belly and empty balls as her draining his balls by way of alot of swallowing.
> 
> Not cooking hubby a good meal and having sex. She missed the point of it is his full belly, not her filling hers buy emptying his balls.


I understand the saying just fine. Keep your husband fed and have sex with him regularly/keep him sexually satisfied. Of course swallowing semen could play into that but no I didn’t think the saying referred to women swallowing semen.

I think I just think the term/idea of “emptying balls” is gross. I suppose I also resent the idea that as a woman I’m just expected to keep my husband fed and his balls empty. It just sounds a bit old fashioned and crude to me. I think my husband didn’t like it because he resented the idea that all it takes to make a husband happy is good and sex. He also doesn’t like the term “balls empty.” I think the visuals are just off putting. Balls aren’t attractive at all and the image of them emptying makes me shudder.


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## DownButNotOut (Apr 9, 2009)

Divinely Favored said:


> She was referring to herself in the comment. I was trying to understand the yuk comment from both of them.
> 
> Me thinks she misunderstood the full belly and empty balls as her draining his balls by way of alot of swallowing.
> 
> Not cooking hubby a good meal and having sex. She missed the point of it is his full belly, not her filling hers buy emptying his balls.


Who would interpret it that way?? I can't even.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Livvie said:


> Well, there are people who are asexual or not attracted to their spouse and a lot of them stay for the finances and comfort and perks of marriage. They put up with nonsense because of THOSE perks.


Never asked you to feel sorry for me, Livvie. There are actually things about my husband that I like. At the end of the day, I don’t want to get divorced at this time and neither does he, so we each equally put up with each other’s nonsense because whatever it is that we get from our marriage that we do like and value are things we don’t want to lose.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Never asked you to feel sorry for me, Livvie. There are actually things about my husband that I like. At the end of the day, I don’t want to get divorced at this time and neither does he, so we each equally put up with each other’s nonsense because whatever it is that we get from our marriage that we do like and value are things we don’t want to lose.


Well, I wasn't replying to you when I wrote this, and I wasn't even thinking of you, so... 

But for the record, I don’t feel sorry for you.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I understand the saying just fine. Keep your husband fed and have sex with him regularly/keep him sexually satisfied. Of course swallowing semen could play into that but no I didn’t think the saying referred to women swallowing semen.
> 
> I think I just think the term/idea of “emptying balls” is gross. I suppose I also resent the idea that as a woman I’m just expected to keep my husband fed and his balls empty. It just sounds a bit old fashioned and crude to me. I think my husband didn’t like it because he resented the idea that all it takes to make a husband happy is good and sex. He also doesn’t like the term “balls empty.” I think the visuals are just off putting. Balls aren’t attractive at all and the image of them emptying makes me shudder.


Some balls are attractive. Say, a Titleist, 12 inches away from the hole after the drive on a par 3. Looks durn good!

Other balls can be too. 😉


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Some balls are attractive. Say, a Titleist, 12 inches away from the hole after the drive on a par 3. Looks durn good!
> 
> Other balls can be too. 😉


I’m not into sports, if you can even call golf that 🤣

Neither is my husband.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m not into sports, if you can even call golf that 🤣
> 
> Neither is my husband.


I admit I gave up real football and basketball unless with the grandsons. Yes, I was a jock in school. Now at almost 60yrs, bones are sore longer if broken.

But the grands tackle Paw Paw all the time playing football. What fun! Of course they're 6 and 4. 🤣🤣🤣🤣


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Seems like a strong coincidence, so…
> 
> For the record, I know you don’t feel sorry for me. It appeared that based on a post in my now deleted thread that you thought I expected you to.
> 
> You seem like a very sour person, Livvie. What brings you to this forum? What do you get out of it?


I actually _quoted_ TexasMom1216 in my post (I thought her post was cute) and the discussion was about orgasms keeping people in relationships and I added that there are other things keeping people in relationships, too. So what?

This feels now like you are baiting me, and I'm going to report your post. 

Haaa you think I'm sour??? Because of my thoughts about someone who complains and complains and complains about how much they hate their husband yet wants to stay in the marriage due to the benefits (information from your deleted thread since YOU brought it up). I think that stuff is hypocritical and it's a turn off to me but that doesn't make me bitter. 

Have you considered not everything people post is about you?

I'm going to refrain from engaging with you further, please stop making it out like I'm referencing you. I'll make it clear when I am.


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## Busy Washing My Hair (7 mo ago)

Livvie said:


> I actually _quoted_ TexasMom1216 in my post (I thought her post was cute) and the discussion was about orgasms keeping people in relationships and I added that there are other things keeping people in relationships, too. So what?
> 
> This feels now like you are baiting me, and I'm going to report your post.
> 
> ...


I’m not baiting you, but you are obviously free to report my post. I don’t care to waste my time baiting people. It’s my observation that you seem like a very serious, sour person who cannot handle banter or decipher when somebody is being sarcastic. The fact that you need to run and report my post for that remark is funny, especially when you sure can dish it out all under the guise of just being brutally honest and blunt. It’s an Internet forum and you should probably lighten up.

I will not make any comments directed at you from this point forward, ok? Just put me on ignore if need be.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Livvie said:


> I actually _quoted_ TexasMom1216 in my post (I thought her post was cute) and the discussion was about orgasms keeping people in relationships and I added that there are other things keeping people in relationships, too. So what?
> 
> This feels now like you are baiting me, and I'm going to report your post.
> 
> ...


You have been baited. 🙄


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m not baiting you, but you are obviously free to report my post. I don’t care to waste my time baiting people. It’s my observation that you seem like a very serious, sour person who cannot handle banter or decipher when somebody is being sarcastic. The fact that you need to run and report my post for that remark is funny, especially when you sure can dish it out all under the guise of just being brutally honest and blunt. It’s an Internet forum and you should probably lighten up.
> 
> I will not make any comments directed at you from this point forward, ok? Just put me on ignore if need be.


You have called me sour twice now, and accused me of talking about you twice now as well, when I am not. That's not you "bantering" or being "sarcastic" that's you baiting and making things up.

I'm not sour, I love my life. Which is more than you can say, eh?


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> *I think I just think the term/idea of “emptying balls” is gross. *I suppose I also resent the idea that as a woman I’m just expected to keep my husband fed and his balls empty. It just sounds a bit old fashioned and crude to me. I think my husband didn’t like it because he resented the idea that all it takes to make a husband happy is good and sex. He also doesn’t like the term “balls empty.” *I think the visuals are just off putting.* Balls aren’t attractive at all and the image of them emptying makes me shudder.


Really...? You think THAT sounds gross...because your description of sex in your deleted thread was much more gross than this expression. I believe you said, what's the big deal since sex is just some guy sticking a hard dong in a wet, stanky hole....which I found particularly disgusting. 

Interesting that the visuals that YOU made as disgusting as you could about that weren't "off putting" to you.


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## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

oldshirt said:


> If the sex is nonexistent or really bad, socks on the floor become an unforgivable offense or another cat can be the straw that breaks the camels back.
> 
> If the sex is great, people typically do not want out regardless if there are socks on the floor or if someone is bringing home another cat.


And you have just articulated an interesting effect on retroactive jealousy. If the sex is nonexistent, RJ is lethal. If the sex is great, the pain diminishes. There's a lot more to it, like trust, but the effect you mention is true.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Where's that popcorn gif?


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Sfort said:


> And you have just articulated an interesting effect on retroactive jealousy. If the sex is nonexistent, RJ is lethal. If the sex is great, the pain diminishes. There's a lot more to it, like trust, but the effect you mention is true.


Wow, what a fascinating point about RJ!!!!


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## Ragnar Ragnasson (Mar 4, 2018)

Sfort said:


> And you have just articulated an interesting effect on retroactive jealousy. If the sex is nonexistent, RJ is lethal. If the sex is great, the pain diminishes. There's a lot more to it, like trust, but the effect you mention is true.


I have to say, I never even heard of RJ until TAM.
I don't get it, but it seems you've made a valid point.
Once again, great and frequent sex helps!


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Sfort said:


> And you have just articulated an interesting effect on retroactive jealousy. If the sex is nonexistent, RJ is lethal. If the sex is great, the pain diminishes. There's a lot more to it, like trust, but the effect you mention is true.


I hadn't really thought of the RJ aspect either, but I do think you make a good point. 

RJ can have a number of different pathways and angles and the current level of desire and sexual energy can certainly impact that. 

While I never intended this topic to delve into RJ, the thing to keep in mind with sexual desire in long term relationships is that the passion and the energy do typically decline over time. If you have been with a woman for lets say 20 years and your passion has dwindled to a very routine, lackluster and dare I say it - dull level. It's not fair to picture her in your mind's eye having hot, wild, monkey sex with her college BF 20-some years ago because if she had ended up with him, they would be having routine, lackluster and dull sex now too,,, if they were still having sex at all anymore. 

And the actual reality is their relationship did not even survive their youth as it was. So while RJ is a curse for those that have it. It really is wasted anguish. 

But yes, I can see how keeping the fires burning as bright and hot as possible in the now, can be a force to help keep RJ at bay as much as possible.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

DownButNotOut said:


> Who would interpret it that way?? I can't even.


Hell I don't know, ask her. Her puking emoji, and then saying hubby said it was 🤢. 

Either sex and eating makes both I'll to think about or their wires are crossed.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Livvie said:


> Ew kinda a gross visual there.


That is why I am scratching my head to her and her hubby both saying the full belly/empty balls saying was gross. I see no issue what so ever in eating a nice meal and have sex.


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## Sfort (Sep 28, 2019)

oldshirt said:


> While I never intended this topic to delve into RJ, the thing to keep in mind with sexual desire in long term relationships is that the passion and the energy do typically decline over time. If you have been with a woman for lets say 20 years and your passion has dwindled to a very routine, lackluster and dare I say it - dull level. It's not fair to picture her in your mind's eye having hot, wild, monkey sex with her college BF 20-some years ago because if she had ended up with him, they would be having routine, lackluster and dull sex now too,,, if they were still having sex at all anymore.


I agree 99%. While the sex doesn't have to be like it was when they were in their twenties, it does need to be satisfying to the person with RJ. You have also nailed (at least part of) the reason that RJ raises its ugly head with couples who have been married for decades.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I understand the saying just fine. Keep your husband fed and have sex with him regularly/keep him sexually satisfied. Of course swallowing semen could play into that but no I didn’t think the saying referred to women swallowing semen.
> 
> I think I just think the term/idea of “emptying balls” is gross. I suppose I also resent the idea that as a woman I’m just expected to keep my husband fed and his balls empty. It just sounds a bit old fashioned and crude to me. I think my husband didn’t like it because he resented the idea that all it takes to make a husband happy is good and sex. He also doesn’t like the term “balls empty.” I think the visuals are just off putting. Balls aren’t attractive at all and the image of them emptying makes me shudder.


It implies that is all a woman is good for. It’s insulting that the only value we have on earth is as household help and basically a dumpster. If that’s all it takes it could be anyone, you could replace their wives with another woman and they wouldn’t care, if they noticed. Clearly there are those who feel that way and see it as a positive. The less they know their wives as people the better I guess.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m not baiting you, but you are obviously free to report my post. I don’t care to waste my time baiting people. It’s my observation that you seem like a very serious, sour person who cannot handle banter or decipher when somebody is being sarcastic. The fact that you need to run and report my post for that remark is funny, especially when you sure can dish it out all under the guise of just being brutally honest and blunt. It’s an Internet forum and you should probably lighten up.
> 
> I will not make any comments directed at you from this point forward, ok? Just put me on ignore if need be.


If you don't like what someone posts here, just block them. This way you will not see what they post.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

EleGirl said:


> If you don't like what someone posts here, just block them. This way you will not see what they post.


This is good advice. It keeps me out of trouble. Mostly. 😉


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

TexasMom1216 said:


> It implies that is all a woman is good for. It’s insulting that the only value we have on earth is as household help and basically a dumpster. If that’s all it takes it could be anyone, you could replace their wives with another woman and they wouldn’t care, if they noticed. Clearly there are those who feel that way and see it as a positive. The less they know their wives as people the better I guess.


That’s kind of a bitter, misandristic, feminist agenda driven narrative who’s purpose is to man bash. 

It’s not like that and it’s not what that means. 

Men’s needs are very simple and basic. They just simply don’t need a lot of things in life. Some of my happiest days were living in an old rental house with a few other guys and all had to name was a mattress on a floor, my great grandparents hand me down dresser and an old Chevy truck and the clothes on my back. Our living room consisted a tv on the floor with a beanbag chair in front of it and an old coach that one of the guys got from his GF’s parents. And I had an old cereal bowl I brought from my parents house that I used for everything from Cap’n Crunch to steak and baked potatoes.

Life was good. 😃 

It’s not that love and romance and sex is a woman’s only value or that it’s the only thing a man wants.

It’s that those are the only things a man can’t provide for himself or be provided by other men (unless he’s gay)

It’s nice if a woman can bait her own hook and likes to fish, but I have male fishing buddies.

It’s nice if a woman wants to go on a motorcycle ride with me but I have motorcycle buddies. 

I have good professionals that I work with of both genders but they are work buddies. 

I have friends and family and a good dog that can meet the majority of all my needs.
So I really don’t need for a woman to meet a lengthy checklist of needs.

But here is the critical part you are missing - the woman that does provide the love and affection and romance is my SPECIAL SOMEONE AND MY QUEEN. 

Love, romance and sexuality are not just a couple small ancillary tasks out of a long list of requirements. 

It’s what make our special someone special. It is what ELEVATES that special one above all others. It’s what makes that person our partner and our spouse and our mate.

YOU my dear lady are the one that degrading and minimizing and disregarding that special role and special status in a man’s heart and soul with your anti-sex and man bashing feminist rhetoric. 

A lover is an exhaulted position and status in a man’s heart and soul. Not a disenfranchised and degraded one.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Because nothing says “you’re special to me” like “I want to rail your hot friends.”

Pointing out misogyny is not misandry. You jump to that to call names. 

But maintain that narrative that if I see things as they are I’m “bitter.” That’s quite a bit of creative writing you’ve done there, you seem really invested in this particular tale. Despite the fact that there is zero “romance” or love in “stomach full, balls empty.” Under all your flowery words is “sex and housekeeping are the only things I can’t get from other men.” No companionship or love in that.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Good lord...how tiresome....


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Because nothing says “you’re special to me” like “I want to rail your hot friends.”
> 
> Pointing out misogyny is not misandry. You jump to that to call names.
> 
> But maintain that narrative that if I see things as they are I’m “bitter.” That’s quite a bit of creative writing you’ve done there, you seem really invested in this particular tale. Despite the fact that there is zero “romance” or love in “stomach full, balls empty.” Under all your flowery words is “sex and housekeeping are the only things I can’t get from other men.” No companionship or love in that.


I hope you find love.

I hope you find love and intimacy and passion with not only someone who takes your breath away, but someone who loses their breath when they get near you as well. 

I hope you find your king that you admire and desire and he treats you as his queen and special one regardless of whether the house is spotless or looks a dump because neither of you can peel yourselves away from each other to clean it. 

I hope you find that. 

The more people that achieve that, the better place the world will be because of it.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

oldshirt said:


> I hope you find love.
> 
> I hope you find love and intimacy and passion with not only someone who takes your breath away, but someone who loses their breath when they get near you as well.
> 
> ...


What a ridiculous thing to say. Especially considering the source. You obviously know nothing about me or my life to make such sweeping assumptions.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

My husband is the one who cooks. 

Given he's a savvy dude, there must be other stuff that I bring to the table (aside from my appetite).


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

TexasMom1216 said:


> What a ridiculous thing to say. Especially considering the source. You obviously know nothing about me or my life to make such sweeping assumptions.


There were no assumptions there at all, would you rather say the opposite?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m not baiting you, but you are obviously free to report my post. I don’t care to waste my time baiting people. It’s my observation that you seem like a very serious, sour person who cannot handle banter or decipher when somebody is being sarcastic. The fact that you need to run and report my post for that remark is funny, especially when you sure can dish it out all under the guise of just being brutally honest and blunt. It’s an Internet forum and you should probably lighten up.
> 
> I will not make any comments directed at you from this point forward, ok? Just put me on ignore if need be.


Good grief.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

heartsbeating said:


> My husband is the one who cooks.
> 
> Given he's a savvy dude, there must be other stuff that I bring to the table (aside from my appetite).


Cooks. Raises hand.😎


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## FloridaGuy1 (Nov 4, 2019)

ConanHub said:


> Cooks. Raises hand.😎


Eats...raises hand


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