# Can Anyone be Unfaithfull?



## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

I have posted on another thread about my wifes behavior and whether it could be attributed to PMS. I spoke of a catalyst and what that was is that two people on her recreational soccer team started to have an affair and it caused disharmony on the team that has led to some people leaving. My wife is close to the woman in the affair and feels sympathetic towards her as certain people are rejecting this woman due to moral opposition to her behavior.

My wife and I have been together for 13 years and the whole time she has been a staunch advocate of fidelity. Her mantra has always been "once a cheater, always a cheater" and often said if you want to cheat on me, PLEASE just break up with me first. This mindset has always been very comforting to me because I feel the same way.

After her friend was outed, her attitude toward infedelity has changed (somewhat). When she spoke with me about it she found ways to justify her friends behavior. This among how she was treating me (during the PMS time) made me very suspicious so I checked phone records and such to see if there was evidense of her own possible infedelities (even though I didn't sense it was happening I needed to check). Basically how she was treating me + her new attitude = red flags.

I found nothing and all of her time is accounted for. But, tonight she said something interesting tom me in a conversation about her friend that took me by surprise. She said "I have known XXXXXXXX for a long time and NEVER thought she would cheat. For her to do so makes me think that everyone has a cheating gene and that anyone given the right situation can cheat". I pushed her as to whether she would cheat and she said "I don't think I would ever cheat but I can't say for sure after what happenned".

This statement made me visibly disturbed. She sensed it and called me out on it and I played it off as "no, we're cool". 

Now I am over thinking everything. Is there a hidden message to be found. Should I be hypervigilente?

I can't stand cheating and will not tolerate a moment of it. I'm not sue if there is something proactive I should do or if I am just tripping.

Please ask what you need for me to help clarify things. I really want the advise.


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## Complexity (Dec 31, 2011)

PMS or no PMS, this would be a MASSIVE red flag for me. Certainly something I'd never want to hear from my wife whether she's trying to be philosophical about it or not. I wonder what her reaction would be if your best friend cheated on his wife and you came to her with the same statement. Oh and nobody has a "cheating gene" what people do have is the concious decision to betray their spouse as her friend did.


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## Oregondaddy (Feb 10, 2012)

No I would not acutally be overly concerned about her statement. Finding out a friend, who you thought you knew, behaving in a manner you would never expect can be shocking. You think you know someone then bam, you find out something completely different. It's normal for that to work in your brain for a bit and cause some self doubt. I think it would be more bothersome for someone not to think that way. Sometimes trauma in a friends life can have a ripple effect...


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

Paulination said:


> I have posted on another thread about my wifes behavior and whether it could be attributed to PMS. I spoke of a catalyst and what that was is that two people on her recreational soccer team started to have an affair and it caused disharmony on the team that has led to some people leaving. My wife is close to the woman in the affair and feels sympathetic towards her as certain people are rejecting this woman due to moral opposition to her behavior.
> 
> My wife and I have been together for 13 years and the whole time she has been a staunch advocate of fidelity. Her mantra has always been "once a cheater, always a cheater" and often said if you want to cheat on me, PLEASE just break up with me first. This mindset has always been very comforting to me because I feel the same way.
> 
> ...


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

Paulination said:


> I have posted on another thread about my wifes behavior and whether it could be attributed to PMS. I spoke of a catalyst and what that was is that two people on her recreational soccer team started to have an affair and it caused disharmony on the team that has led to some people leaving. My wife is close to the woman in the affair and feels sympathetic towards her as certain people are rejecting this woman due to moral opposition to her behavior.
> 
> My wife and I have been together for 13 years and the whole time she has been a staunch advocate of fidelity. Her mantra has always been "once a cheater, always a cheater" and often said if you want to cheat on me, PLEASE just break up with me first. This mindset has always been very comforting to me because I feel the same way.
> 
> ...


*Do not be to put off. When I was younger and newly married I would be shocked when I would find out that people I knew were cheating. In some circumstances I was shaken to the core. then I realized what your wife discovered. Given the right circumstances the vast majority of us are capable of cheating. It is about timing, chemistry and all of those things that go into creating the "fog" that everyone mentions on this site.

In the first 15 years of our marriage (which were a bit more enjoyable than they are today) I think I could have easily fallen having been in the wrong place with the wrong person but I took steps to make sure that would not happen. Ten years later as bad as things are at times I just want to make things work with my wife. Julieanne Moore (sigh) could not get me off track.

I think your wife had an epiphany and it shocked her. I suggest you take some quiet time with her soon, let her know how much you love her and how the scenario of her going astray would devastate you for life. Done gently and framed correctly I think it could be a very intimate moment.*

Sorry for the double post. I am not quite sure what I did to the first one.


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## lascarx (Dec 24, 2011)

Paulination said:


> Her mantra has always been "once a cheater, always a cheater" and often said if you want to cheat on me, PLEASE just break up with me first. This mindset has always been very comforting to me because I feel the same way.


It would actually be the past more than the present that would bug me. Having a philosophy in general is one thing, but saying stuff like that about it all the time, when there shouldn't be any cause to, is another. Reminds me of these politicians and TV preachers who can't quit ranting about the evils of queerness, and then one by one it turns out they themselves are the ones with the taste for the tallywhacker.

I say you should tell her that pulling an about-face like she's suddenly done, after all these years of needlessly preaching the opposite to a man who was already of the same mind anyway, makes you suspicious. Mid-life crisis, needing validation, it could be anything, but you tell her that you now suspect that she's toying with her own boundaries and she'd better come clean about what's bothering her.

Look at it as if you were working in a bank. One of the cashiers just drones on and on like a broken record about how he would NEVER stick his hand in the till. Then some other guy, who's always been quiet as a mouse, suddenly steals a million and runs off to Bermuda. All of a sudden Mr. Honest starts getting introspective and saying, you know, under the right circumstances I could see myself doing that too. He's clearly been wrestling with his boundaries since day one and as his weaknesses get prodded directly, he starts to give up the fight. I'd have no problem with telling him that I'd report him just for looking cross-eyed at a roll of nickels.


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## daisygirl 41 (Aug 5, 2011)

Yes I do believe that anyone is possible of cheating.
For 17 years I had a devoted, faithful H. Someone who absolutely despised cheating in any form. Always took the moral high ground and swore he wld never hurt me like that. Rewind to 9 months ago and he had a very intense 6 week EA with a co worker. He despises himself and what he has done to me and despite me wanting to save our marriage we have seperated.
Even when all the signs were there, staring me in the face, it didn't even cross my mind that he was cheating on me. So yes, I truly believe anything is possible.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Honestly, her statements could be interpreted either way. She's a loyal spouse who doesn't want to abandon her disloyal friend, or she's a disloyal spouse who is dropping hints to you that she's on the way out of the marriage.

I would keep investigating. Not only phone records, but a keylogger. Maybe a voice-activated recorder in her car.

Hopefully, you find nothing. If you do find something, hopefully it's in the very early stages where you can put a stop to it before your marriage is irreparably harmed.

Good luck.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

Yes, anyone can cheat given the right circumstances.

You have no reason to be suspicious of your wife merely because she's come to this understanding.
In fact I'd say you're better off because of it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## river rat (Jan 20, 2012)

You know, I believe that many people can cheat, whom you'd least suspect. My wife did, and that behavior was totally out of character for her. No one who knows her would believe it. But there were things about her that I did not realize, things to do with her upbringing and past experience. Seen in that context, I can understand it; but not condone it. I think that because of her shame, we were never able to address the issue directly. I've lived with rug sweeping for a decade. In subsequent years, we would occasionally have conversations about infidelity in the abstract or about infidelity involving people we knew. Somewhere in the conversations, I would realize that we were actually talking about us, and that she was trying to explain herself. If your wife raises this issue, be alert, but not necessarily suspicious. Engage her and find out what she's actually thinking. Unless you see other red flags, I'd not be too paranoid about this.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

Paul, she was startled by witnessing something that didn't fit her truth, and is willing to talk about it with you, she is trying to be honest with herself and within her relationship. I would not be worried if I were you, just the opposite I would have a lot of confidence that she trusts me enough to confide some pretty touchy subjects. It is ok that you feathers are ruffled too, just realize that she is trying to reconcile the cognitive dissonance of her friendship with this cheater, but it sounds to me like she has really good morals and hasn't done anything herself to go against them, merely the actions of those close to her have affected her perceptions of relationships, just as spending time on this website is affecting your perceptions of relationships.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

I commend your wife for opening to you and sharing one of her deepest thoughts but you should also return the favor and share with her you deepest thoughts on the subject, something which you have so far only done with a bunch of strangers on the internet. It's called intimacy and it should be a two way street.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

Interesting question!

I thought my H. would never do that as he was always a family kind of guy who liked spending time with us, etc. However as our marriage deteriorated thru the years..(and I admit I had a lot to do with that) ....he happened to meet someone on a fluke and there you go! This person was flattering, appreciative, etc. all th things that I wasn't. Not excusing what happened but I guess being married isn't easy plus it is hard to talk about things and then things fester and build up which is not good. 

From my experience, I have come to realize that marriage takes work and nothing can be taken for granted. I know for men I have realized that men need to feel like their woman appreciates and loves them.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

highwood said:


> Interesting question!
> 
> I thought my H. would never do that as he was always a family kind of guy who liked spending time with us, etc. However as our marriage deteriorated thru the years..(and I admit I had a lot to do with that) ....he happened to meet someone on a fluke and there you go! This person was flattering, appreciative, etc. all th things that I wasn't. Not excusing what happened but I guess being married isn't easy plus it is hard to talk about things and then things fester and build up which is not good.
> 
> From my experience, I have come to realize that marriage takes work and nothing can be taken for granted. I know for men I have realized that men need to feel like their woman appreciates and loves them.


It doesn't matter what your contribution or lack of to the marriage were, the fact is that your husband CHOSE to cross marital boundaries that led to him having an affair. You could have been close to being a perfect wife and yet your husband could have still had his affair.


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

I talk a lot about other married couples who I worked with over the years that have affairs or relationship issues. Some of the issues my wife and I have are the same. Over 20 years now, I know that I have mentioned many times that I am not sure if given the right circumstance, the right willing women, the right chemistry, the right environment, and if nobody will find out, I am not sure if I could avoid cheating… She also knows that if I did cheat or have an affair, there would be no way for me to hide it. My face would be a dead giveaway. 

I believe anybody could cheat if given the right opportunity. It doesn’t mean they will. My mind goes there all the time and my wife knows it. I don’t hide my feeling too much. I does allow for conversation. I just don’t know if it makes her feel bad or not. She keeps it all in. I think by talking about it makes it less likely that it will happen. It’s the ones that never talk about it seems to be the ones who cheat.


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## Lionelhutz (Feb 2, 2012)

I simply don't believe anyone's "I would never" statements. 

As others have noted, "virtue never tested is no virtue at all."

I have known too many people and read too many stories of people who when placed in difficult or unusual situation act in ways they could have never imagined.

I am suspicious of the wisdom, imagination, life experience or honesty of people who easily pass judgment on others while implicitly being self-congratulatory.


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## TCx (Dec 15, 2011)

Paulination said:


> Now I am over thinking everything. Is there a hidden message to be found. Should I be hypervigilente?
> 
> I can't stand cheating and will not tolerate a moment of it. I'm not sue if there is something proactive I should do or if I am just tripping.
> 
> Please ask what you need for me to help clarify things. I really want the advise.


Not in a million years did I ever think that I could have an EA with someone. I told my wife that I would never sleep with another woman (and, granted, I haven't but I sure wanted to). I was better than that. 

Apparently, I'm not.

This has shaken the very foundation of who I am and who I perceive myself to be and it's pretty scary.

Your wife thought she knew this person and she respected this person and she's probably heard the reasons that this friend gave for cheating in the first place and those reasons probably sound reasonable.

It's just shaken your wife's foundations a bit. Don't read too much into it. 

Just restate that as far as you are concerned, cheating is not okay in YOUR marriage. Remind her, though I'm guessing it's probably unnecessary if she's privy to all of the pain that this other couple are going through.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

It's all about boundaries. If we cross them then we have put ourselves on the slippery slope that can cause us to fall into an affair.


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## anna garret 01 (Jan 22, 2012)

I have been married 20 years and yes, I do believe any one can be unfaithful. Even in happy marriages friends or coworkers can get to close. One ALWAYS has to have a hedge of protection up. Innocent flirts, texts, hugs, lunches, out for a drink can start the ball rolling to an affair. As a couple you have to establish boundaries. Talk about what is and isn't acceptable, such as ,some of my friends husbands always greet me with a hug and some of them with a kiss on the lips. My husband and I don't mind a hug, but agree the kiss on the lips is a bit much. My husband will say, well he kisses everyone on the lips, and I said, but what if I like his kisses more than yours? He then thought about it and agreed. Every couple will have their own rules. Like my DH knows I talk to men on this site, but he asked me never to personallly email or accept email from them and I will listen to him.
No one is exempt from cheating. If you believe you are then your not taking steps to prevent it.


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

Wow everyone, thanks for the input. What struck me odd about her "epiphany" was the timing of her disclosing it. If you want to know my circumstances at the moment, look in the "depresion" thread.

At a time in our marriage when I have expressed my dismay at the way things are going doesn't seem like the moment to spring this on me. It almost felt like a manipulation to keep me on edge and to get me to work even harder on the relationship. 

She's a stay at home mom and depends on me entirely which always gave me a sense of extra security since her exposure to co-workers was non-existent. Mind you her staying at home was what she wanted and I supported it because I thought it was best for the kids.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

What is stopping you from sharing your concerns with her? Fear?


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

morituri said:


> What is stopping you from sharing your concerns with her? Fear?


I have but my wife and I are in a strange place right now. I don't know where we stand on many levels. She says she is "unhappy" but can't articulate anything specific.

I have given this women everything she has asked for (her mom suggests this is actually the problem) and yet she has been treating me with such disdain lately and can't say why. The problems with the soccer team she built hit her real hard since she created the team from scratch and it has been successful but now on the verge of collapse due to the infedelity of the members.

I know she is very angry about and I think she is merely re-directing it at me because there really is no outlet to do it within the team. Ironically, the one she views as the victim is this is the adulterer because the other members are judging her so harshly and have adopted an "either she goes or we go" stance.

I'm not trying skirt responsibility and trust me I have been agonizing and introspecting all week on this (this is how I found the forum) but our life is really not bad. No abuse, great kids, good job, she has her hobbies which I fully pay for and support, she has her league, season tickets to her favorite indoor professional team etc, etc, etc...

I'm about to the point where I need to check out of this thing because I have spent so much time this week thinking anout this a research marital problems that I have been totally unproductive professionally.


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

Paulination said:


> Wow everyone, thanks for the input. What struck me odd about her "epiphany" was the timing of her disclosing it. If you want to know my circumstances at the moment, look in the "depresion" thread.
> 
> At a time in our marriage when I have expressed my dismay at the way things are going doesn't seem like the moment to spring this on me. It almost felt like a manipulation to keep me on edge and to get me to work even harder on the relationship.


I was going to ask why specifically it is bothering you. The content of what she said was not suspicious, but you felt something was off.

The timing seems suspect to you. You feel she is maybe manipulating you. Those are the things I would look at more closely than the content. The content is that she has learned the world is not so black and white, and that this friend's behavior has violated your wife's previous belief system.

My wife said years ago about Bill Clinton's lie (wagging his finger in a national address on tv "I did not have sexual relations with that woman, Monica Lewinsky") that it was only a lie about sex, and everybody lies about sex.

The content of her comment was shocking to me because it went against what I believed about her. I should have paid attention to that one!!!

But your wife has not said she wants to cheat or even believes she could cheat.

Look at why you pushed her to answer if she thought she could cheat, and why you think this may be a manipulation of you.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Have you asked her what makes her 'adulteress' friend so worthy of her simpathy considering how she has in the past expressed zero tolerance for cheating? Ask her if you would be worthy of her sympathy if it was you the 'adulterer'.


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

morituri said:


> Have you asked her what makes her 'adulteress' friend so worthy of her simpathy considering how she has in the past expressed zero tolerance for cheating?


Her freind is 32, her husband is 50, her lover is 38. Her husband is allegedly controlling, doesn't want her to play soccer, makes her check in often, only married her because she was pregnant etc.....
In otherwords, there were mitigating circumstances present and though she might not have cheated, she understands.

This is where the idea of manipulation comes to my mind. It is like my wife is putting me on notice that this is a posibility with us if things aren't perfect. She hasn'r said that, but I try to read between the lines and the content of a coment, and the timing says alot in my mind.

My wife is 33, and I'm 42. So there is an age factor. I like my wife to call me when her game is over so I'll know approximately when she'll be home. This represents control(ironically I do this for her safety reasons and/ or to make sure dinner will be timed properly). Coincidentally the Saturday before she turned down sex because she didn't feel good and apparently I sulked, same thing her friends husband did.

My wife kind of went out of her way to draw these comparisons between her situation and her friends. I pointed out how entirely different they were and she acknowledged that and said "I shouldn't have done that, this conversation wasn't supposed to be about us".

So I feel like I am being intentionally kept insecure as a way to somehow change a perceived flaw or else this could happen to us. Wether or not thats true, who knows at this point.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Why don't return the favor by stating to your wife that she can do as she pleases but that the moment you discover she's been cheating on you, like her friend, you'll file for divorce with no possibility of reconciliation. That should be a sobering reminder to her that you won't be an unsuspecting cuckold, like her friend's husband.


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## Complexity (Dec 31, 2011)

Paulination said:


> This is where the idea of manipulation comes to my mind. *It is like my wife is putting me on notice that this is a posibility with us if things aren't perfect*.


This is exactly it, I just didn't know how to articulate it hence why I said it should be a big red flag for you. This is beyond confiding her deep inner thoughts to you, this is a thinly veiled threat coming from someone whom until recently would've been completely out of character to think this.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

Paulination said:


> Her freind is 32, her husband is 50, her lover is 38. *Her husband is allegedly controlling, doesn't want her to play soccer, makes her check in often, only married her because she was pregnant etc.....*In otherwords, there were mitigating circumstances present and though she might not have cheated, she understands.
> 
> This is where the idea of manipulation comes to my mind. It is like my wife is putting me on notice that this is a posibility with us if things aren't perfect. She hasn'r said that, but I try to read between the lines and the content of a coment, and the timing says alot in my mind.
> 
> ...


Her husband is going to allegedly be a LOT of really bad things (that's the kind of BS garbage a cheater starts inventing/embellishing on to justify their own behavior)

As to the "control" issues, is that something she has said, or is this something you are fabricating as a possible but as-of-yet nonexistent factor? 

As to comparisons, if this is a big deal to your wife there may be a lot of empathetic types of behaviors... it could be her trying to get into a different mindset. I'm not in the room with you so can't tell if there is some gutworthy issues at work, but the logic of what your W is telling you seems to hold water with me, it very like wasn't meant at all to be a conversation about you, just her friend's situation which obviously has made an impact on her.

If you genuinely are sensing something insincere in her then remain vigilent, but just because your W may be going through a little trauma right now is no reason to go inventing problems, it seems as the basis for communication is really strong so I don't know why you are looking to undermine it.

Your W isn't condoning the affair, is she? Just being a friend willing to be there for her friend no matter what her friend's flaws?


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## 4821 (Nov 3, 2011)

she is sharing her thoughts with you. She is talking about a friend that she thought would never. So she is expressing her doubts. Don't be upset. Admire the fact that she is sharing her thoughts, and you can both discuss how it could have happened with the friend. You can discuss how to keep it happening with you both as a couple. it is a great opening up from her heart to share with you. She trusts you enough to tell you what she is thinking. She isn't thinking of cheating, she is wondering about how it could have happened. She is also relating that I thought it would never happen to X, so I can no longer say it would never happen to me. I think she is kind of in shock. Good luck and keep talking kindly and openly.


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

4821 said:


> she is sharing her thoughts with you. She is talking about a friend that she thought would never. So she is expressing her doubts. Don't be upset. Admire the fact that she is sharing her thoughts, and you can both discuss how it could have happened with the friend. You can discuss how to keep it happening with you both as a couple. it is a great opening up from her heart to share with you. She trusts you enough to tell you what she is thinking. She isn't thinking of cheating, she is wondering about how it could have happened. She is also relating that I thought it would never happen to X, so I can no longer say it would never happen to me. I think she is kind of in shock. Good luck and keep talking kindly and openly.


:iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:

Paul, your wife has been in a bit of a cocoon and I am not saying that it is bad it is just the conscious choice that you both made together.

As the above poster mentioned this has rocked her world a bit and the things that she took for granted. Maybe you having her call after the game is a bit controlling, Maybe you should ask her if there are any other issues she has. Maybe a bit of counseling would help. 

At any rate this all seems really fresh and you need to take advantage of this opportunity now because it is an opportunity to strengthen your relationship.


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## Saffron (Mar 7, 2010)

Hmmmm, I may need to read your other thread to formulate a better opinion. But if your wife is saying she's unhappy and is a SHAM who is finding herself sympathetic to a friend/cheater, I don't think your anxiety is unfounded. I doubt she's already cheating or even planning to, but she sounds like she might be vulnerable to tempation if the right opportunity presented itself. Not to mention her cheating friend might be encouraging her to question your marriage.

You could ask your wife if she feels you need MC to work on your marriage to make it stronger against infidelity. If you could find a good MC (some are really bad so be careful), they can be useful in mediating these kinds of difficult discussions.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Your wife just matured a little bit and realized that unfaithfullness can happen with anyone if the circumstances are right for that to happen with that person. Many folks want to deny this but I believe it to be true. I did not always believe this. Lifes experiences can teach us lessons.


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

RClawson;584615 Maybe you having her call after the game is a bit controlling said:


> I have already made up my mind to stop monitoring her in that way. She used to look at it as me caring which is how it is ment, but now sees it differently. I'm using the 180 approach on certain things. Just listening to what bothers her even if she doesn't tell me directly and then try to do the opposite.


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## anna garret 01 (Jan 22, 2012)

Paulination said:


> Wow everyone, thanks for the input. What struck me odd about her "epiphany" was the timing of her disclosing it. If you want to know my circumstances at the moment, look in the "depresion" thread.
> 
> At a time in our marriage when I have expressed my dismay at the way things are going doesn't seem like the moment to spring this on me. It almost felt like a manipulation to keep me on edge and to get me to work even harder on the relationship.
> 
> She's a stay at home mom and depends on me entirely which always gave me a sense of extra security since her exposure to co-workers was non-existent. Mind you her staying at home was what she wanted and I supported it because I thought it was best for the kids.


be careful though, I was a stay at home for 13 years, and we look to our DH for all our manly network.. This can backfire if she gets lonely and starts to fantasize about other men...any male attention can turn her on, not that it will but it might


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## KittyKat (May 11, 2008)

morituri said:


> Why don't return the favor by stating to your wife that she can do as she pleases but that the moment you discover she's been cheating on you, like her friend, you'll file for divorce with no possibility of reconciliation. That should be a sobering reminder to her that you won't be an unsuspecting cuckold, like her friend's husband.


:iagree::iagree::iagree:

And yes, given the proper situation, anyone can cheat. Whether physically or emotionally.

It's really up to your character as to whether you take the bait.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Paulination said:


> She's a stay at home mom and depends on me entirely which always gave me a sense of extra security since her exposure to co-workers was non-existent. Mind you her staying at home was what she wanted and I supported it because I thought it was best for the kids.


If you thought that her being a SAHM would make her less likely to cheat, think again. There are literally dozens of stories here of SAHMs cheating. It's the boredom factor.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

"I'm not trying skirt responsibility and trust me I have been agonizing and introspecting all week on this (this is how I found the forum) but our life is really not bad. No abuse, great kids, good job, she has her hobbies which I fully pay for and support, she has her league, season tickets to her favorite indoor professional team etc, etc, etc..."

This is almost a verbatim quote from some counselors on a radio program I was listening to this afternoon. This is what a man thinks a woman would see as his love for her. You, according to these counselors, are not showing your wife affection in terms of how a woman thinks. What surprises me is you are researching this and have not come across this info. Women seek affection ,though not the way you think of affection, like men need sex. You need to turn your search in that direction. There are many resources to do that.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Haven't read your other thread yet but I fear your marriage is in deep trouble. If your wife is telling you she is unhappy, multiply what your thinking by 100.

Immediately buy "His Needs Her Needs" . IMHO you don't have a lot of time. She needs your support nad that doesn't mean you need to try and fix all her problems. I'll try and get a source on the broadcast, it may help.

Hasn't anyone told her friends husband whats going on? No wonder he's controling/paranoid. Bless his heart.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

The program I was listening to was a Focus On the Family Program.

Here is a link to one of the pageson their website that might help.

Indications Your Marriage Needs Help - Focus on the Family


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## NatashaYurino (Jan 2, 2012)

PHTlump said:


> *Honestly, her statements could be interpreted either way. She's a loyal spouse who doesn't want to abandon her disloyal friend, or she's a disloyal spouse who is dropping hints to you that she's on the way out of the marriage.*
> 
> I would keep investigating. Not only phone records, but a keylogger. Maybe a voice-activated recorder in her car.
> 
> ...


I kind of agree with this. 

Don't get me wrong as I do not want to turn this into a "men vs women thing". But you see, many (and I mean MANY) men have friends who cheat on their SOs/spouses and they remain loyal to those friends. At times I get concerned too about having a SO who behaves like this. It makes me wonder if he thinks cheating is okay and it's only a matter of time before he starts doing the same thing. But the problem is: what can WE do???

If we tell them to end the friendship they might get super upset with us, and in some rare cases they might want to get rid of _US_. For thinking we are too controlling, telling them whom to to be friends with. 

It's really tough, but you have to remain calm and just keep an eye out. Good Luck!


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

As a general address to all of the wonderful responses including the ones with I really didn't want to hear, let me put it out the like this:

Me: I am a professional who devotes everything I am, and have to my wife and kids (two small ones, a little girl age 3, and a boy age 6). My wife has certain hobbies and I enable her completely to invest in those hobbies 100%. I do this because she enjoys it and I realize that she is isolated from the world of big people. On top of that I do all of the shopping, the dishes, some of the cleaning and I take care of child specific chores like baths. 

I do this because I am trying to make her life as pleasurable as possible. She has basically been on vacation the last 6 years. She begged me to be a SAHM and I had to make some sacrifices to accomplish that.

I try to show her the kind of affection a women needs not just sex which I don't even pusue accept for maybe once a week. I'm fit and a fairly decent looking guy.

Still, it seems the afair drama has her intrigued maybe not so much as if she envied the circumstances, but in a soap opera car crash kind of way.

The problem I'm having is I am being neglected in the process and I am powerless it seems to communicate that. She seems to create the negativety of the situation into our marriage by drawing unfair parrallels. I'm so frustrated with this. I know the mind works in strange ways but I can't help but feel betrayed that she would overlook the fact that I do so much to make her life pleasant so she can enjoy a similar drama at home at my expense.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Paulination said:


> The problem I'm having is I am being neglected in the process and I am powerless it seems to communicate that. She seems to create the negativity of the situation into our marriage by drawing unfair parallels. I'm so frustrated with this. I know the mind works in strange ways but I can't help but feel betrayed that she would overlook the fact that I do so much to make her life pleasant so she can enjoy a similar drama at home at my expense.



Please don't take this the wrong way but you need to grow a pair and express to your wife that you are not afraid of ending the marriage and mean it if she is contemplating or is having an affair. Wives being women, do not respect husbands who allow themselves to be treated like doormats. If your wife perceives you that you're going to be fine whether the marriage survives or not, she will be more likely to feel the need to keep you interested in her for fear of you leaving her.

Unfortunately your wife has just learned a lesson from her cheating friend that wives can demonize their husbands to justify their cheating - the word controlling is an all time favorite classic of cheating wives. Your job is to blow any possible belief she may have acquired that you are going to be just like her friend's cuckold husband.

If you've read the stories on this forum, you will see that the husbands who are successful at a chance at reconciliation, are the ones who make the choice to end their marriages after they discover their wives affair. With the exception of wives in exit affairs, the majority of unfaithful wives end up in a panic, dump their OM, and beg their betrayed husbands to not leave them.

If you haven't done so, read and absorb the principles embodied in *http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/24796-just-let-them-go.html#post306559* and *The 180 degree rules*. Hopefully you won't need to implement them but just like a gun in the house, it is nice to know that whatever happens you can protect yourself emotionally and eventually come out of ahead no matter if the marriage continues or ends.

I leave you with an inspirational post which may help your situation - Bullet point #3 should be of special interest.



marduk said:


> I happened to be thinking today about the past year of my marriage. Everyone on these forums were so instrumental in my being in the great place I am today I thought I would post a note about where I was, where I am, and what I’ve learned.
> 
> A year ago my marriage was a mess. After 3 kids my stay at home wife spontaneously decided to start going out with her girlfriends again, including a “girls trip” to Vegas. She started a crazy fitness routine, including marathon running and triathalons. She started leaving me at home with the kids 2-3 evenings a week. A rough summer. I was insecure, controlling, alone, and afraid.
> 
> ...


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## couple (Nov 6, 2010)

Long term relationships can vary greatly over time. We often talk about 'can someone cheat' like it's a static yes or no thing. Having sexual and non-sexual emotional relationships is a strong human drive. Obviously they are only 'cheating' if you follow this strong drive while in another relationship. Therefore, the ability to cheat or not is very much dependent on the state of your relationship at any given point in time. 

I think that very few long term relationships are impervious to cheating at all points along the way. The right combination of a poor state of a relationship and opportunity for a sexual and/or emotional relationship can drive almost anyone to cheat.

I too used to be shocked when i saw other couples having affairs when i was younger. I guess you learn more about the realities in the world as you get older.


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## AngryandUsed (Jun 23, 2011)

Continue monitoring, advised earlier. Observe....


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Paulination said:


> As a general address to all of the wonderful responses including the ones with I really didn't want to hear, let me put it out the like this:
> 
> Me: I am a professional who devotes everything I am, and have to my wife and kids (two small ones, a little girl age 3, and a boy age 6). My wife has certain hobbies and I enable her completely to invest in those hobbies 100%. I do this because she enjoys it and I realize that she is isolated from the world of big people. On top of that I do all of the shopping, the dishes, some of the cleaning and I take care of child specific chores like baths.
> 
> ...


It looks like you are carrying the whole load. What does your wife do? You really need to go here:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/18181-man-up-nice-guy-reference.html

And here:

Married Man Sex Life


And here:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read-3.html


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

couple said:


> Long term relationships can vary greatly over time. We often talk about 'can someone cheat' like it's a static yes or no thing. Having sexual and non-sexual emotional relationships is a strong human drive. Obviously they are only 'cheating' if you follow this strong drive while in another relationship. Therefore, the ability to cheat or not is very much dependent on the state of your relationship at any given point in time.
> 
> I think that very few long term relationships are impervious to cheating at all points along the way. The right combination of a poor state of a relationship and opportunity for a sexual and/or emotional relationship can drive almost anyone to cheat.


Even people who view themselves as happily married can/have affairs. The state of the marriage can help create an emotional environment that can help the unfaithful spouse to justify his/her marital betrayal, but it takes the conscious choice of violating marital boundaries for that to happen.


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## Kimberley17 (Oct 10, 2011)

Am I the only one who views this as suspicious? I think she is contemplating an affair. IMO any woman who is unhappy and says she can't articulate it doesn't want to crush you with the truth. She is questioning her love and/or attraction towards you. Since her friend is doing it and is most likely in the "fog" it might just seem like an appealing option to her. If she was happy and all was going well I wouldn't see this as a red flag at all but the fact that she's unhappy says a lot. I used to be one of those people who despised cheaters until my marriage became unhappy...


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## SadLovingHusband (Apr 21, 2011)

I think Kimberley is correct. This sounds very similar to my situation. My W did pretty much exactly as Kimberley wrote: she was unhappy, couldn't explain to me why (when in reality she was blaming ME but just couldn't or wouldn't tell me this), she was back and forth with wanting to make our marriage work, and had a friend that had separated from her H and was sleeping with multiple guys. My W saw how happy her friend was supposedly, and thought the answer to all her problems was to be with someone other than me. On the surface it was, "I'm unhappy but I don't know why", but in reality it was her blaming me for her unhappiness and seeking out multiple OM to cheat on me with. Be very wary.


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## TCx (Dec 15, 2011)

Kimberley17 said:


> Am I the only one who views this as suspicious? I think she is contemplating an affair. IMO any woman who is unhappy and says she can't articulate it doesn't want to crush you with the truth. She is questioning her love and/or attraction towards you. Since her friend is doing it and is most likely in the "fog" it might just seem like an appealing option to her. If she was happy and all was going well I wouldn't see this as a red flag at all but the fact that she's unhappy says a lot. I used to be one of those people who despised cheaters until my marriage became unhappy...


Not when she says that she's unhappy but can't say why, no. It's the "can't say why" that tells us that she doesn't want to tell you why because she doesn't feel that she can confide in you. She's probably been talking to her friend and found out that some of the things that 'made' her cheat sound familiar in her own marriage.

And please forgive me for this because I don't know you for a hole in the wall and don't want to seem judgmental when I have so little information to go on.

But I never believe anyone that says they 'do everything for their wife and kids". I believe that's how you perceive your role in your marriage but ask yourself if that's really true. Who wears the trousers in your family? You or your wife?

Also, are you relatively insecure or are you quite secure in your sense of self? I ask because you said, "It's been a whole week and I'm ready to just check out because I've not been productive at work".

I'm trying to pin down who you are as a person and that's nigh on impossible to do like this but this statement makes me wonder if you're somewhat needy and insecure. It could be that you are door mat, as others have implied or you could be over bearing. I really don't know.

But needy/insecure guys take a lot of attention effort and giving that attention constantly can be difficult. Same thing with insecure people too. Same thing with over bearing people; constantly trying to please them becomes difficult.

Do any of these sound familiar? Do you find that you have a lot of talks with your wife about your relationship? Who initiates them? You or her?


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

morituri said:


> Please don't take this the wrong way but you need to grow a pair and express to your wife that you are not afraid of ending the marriage and mean it if she is contemplating or is having an affair.


.

I think your right. I'm coming across as very insecure (which I am) and it is annoying to her. I have to somehow control my emotions and not act on them. With all of the sage advise I have recieved from you guys I still blew it this morning.

She was getting ready for soccer training this morning and closed the bathroom door to get ready, I questioned that. When she left I heard her in the other room say "I love you to the kids" but she didn't say that to me when she left the room I was in, I asked her about it.

I'm pathetic right now, and I'm embarrassed because of it.

I deserve a wife who will meet me half way in this marriage and instead I have someone who seems to look at me as simply the conduit to her livelyhood. I have spoken with her for hours about it and we always end up with we don't want to divorce or seperate and we will work on the marriage. The next day we are pleasent but the feelings inside of me start all over again with me being overly sensitive to every little observation I try to make into a little act of betrayal. I'm overly suspicious right now of everything and It seems to fuel my hurt.

If you knew me you would never think I was this kind of wimp behind closed doors.

I used to be the guy who said "if she doesn't want me, her loss" (meaning any relationship I might have been in at the moment).

I think I am going to scoop up the kids and take them somewhere this afternoon. Me and the kids not being here when she gets home waiting for her as usual can maybe be the start of me getting some independence and balls back.


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

TCx said:


> Not when she says that she's unhappy but can't say why, no. It's the "can't say why" that tells us that she doesn't want to tell you why because she doesn't feel that she can confide in you.


I get that but she can't say why to her mom either. Her mom and her are very close and her mom had her over and tried to get into her mind in a subtle way (her mom is good at that). Her mom and I don't normally talk about this stuff behind her daughters back but I felt the same way about the "I don't know why" as you describe.

I think my insecurity about infedelity is unfounded as there is no evidence of it (believe me I tried) which makes me even more annoying and pathetic. 

I think she simply takes me for granted and because I don't hold her accountable at any level, she feels no motivation to make me feel needed. The whole "I'm not happy" is more than likely a manipulation whether conscience or sub-conscience to keep me in line and going through the tramendous amount of effort I have to keep her comfortable.

If all of this is as I have described it, It should be fairly easy to turn around but it has to start with me getting my manliness back and making her a little insecure.

I hate games, why we can't just love each other instead of all the nonsense is beyond me.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Don't be so hard on yourself, it's rare that a good husband isn't afraid of losing his wife. Nevertheless, in order for a husband to come out ahead, he needs to conquer his fears. You can only control your actions and your happiness.

We've given you guidance on how to man-up and take control of your life, but only YOU can make the choice to follow it.


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## Kallan Pavithran (Jan 17, 2012)

morituri said:


> Don't be so hard on yourself, it's rare that a good husband isn't afraid of losing his wife. Nevertheless, in order for a husband to come out ahead, he needs to conquer his fears. You can only control your actions and your happiness.
> 
> We've given you guidance on how to man-up and take control of your life, but only YOU can make the choice to follow it.


:iagree::iagree::iagree:


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## FieryHairedLady (Mar 24, 2011)

_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

tacoma said:


> Yes, anyone can cheat given the right for circumstances.
> 
> You have no reason to be suspicious of your wife merely because she's come to this understanding.
> In fact I'd say you're better off because of it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree:


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

You're like a dog that keeps chasing its tail. You know what you need to do but chasing your tail is your default position. Every time you start acting like a whiney pu$$y say to your self "she's the girl I'm the man, she's the girl I'm the man". You sound a lot like the stay at home dads around here that have given their wives their pants.


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## Beowulf (Dec 7, 2011)

Paulination said:


> As a general address to all of the wonderful responses including the ones with I really didn't want to hear, let me put it out the like this:
> 
> Me: I am a professional who devotes everything I am, and have to my wife and kids (two small ones, a little girl age 3, and a boy age 6). My wife has certain hobbies and I enable her completely to invest in those hobbies 100%. I do this because she enjoys it and I realize that she is isolated from the world of big people. On top of that I do all of the shopping, the dishes, some of the cleaning and I take care of child specific chores like baths.
> 
> ...


Check out Athol Kay's blog Married Man Sex Life

You are too Beta


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## Goldmember357 (Jan 31, 2012)

Complexity said:


> PMS or no PMS, this would be a MASSIVE red flag for me. Certainly something I'd never want to hear from my wife whether she's trying to be philosophical about it or not. I wonder what her reaction would be if your best friend cheated on his wife and you came to her with the same statement. Oh and nobody has a "cheating gene" what people do have is the concious decision to betray their spouse as her friend did.


agreed


however to TS

No not everyone cheats it takes a special kind of person to cheat i do not want to write a ton or get to much into it on how there mind thinks. You can find many better psychological descriptions and read a lot more about it than i can tell you right here so you can understand the type of person who cheats. Basically i will say it like this you have people who will cheat without care, you have people who will justify cheating when in certain pressured and uncomfortable and unhappy positions in there life, and than you have those who will not cheat and never cheat because that is not the type of person they are. They are not the type of person to act or behave like that morally and overall they are not built like that and there mind does not work in such a manner to be that selfish or unfair there entire life and rather mind and to a degree personality points them away from doing such actions and thus they try to avoid situations like this and being with people who might be risky and cheat on them. 


Me personally i am great at reading people i swear i can tell you if someone will cheat lol at least that is how i feel after i talk with someone. Ive been right a few times and i can often pick up on it when i have met people who i know have cheated to much to explain but it takes a different kind of person however it is very common especially among men i must admit. 


Your wife's friend is likely the second type of person

1) person will cheat does not care but pretends they care (justifies it)

2) under extreme pressure, or unhappiness person will justifying cheating and breaking there "Character" (acting like they ever had any:rofl and than cheat and its "okay" to them often.

3) Person will never cheat it goes against their entire code, personality everything they do not think in such a manner they are rarely selfish they are truly good people.


I do not think all people have the cheating gene in them i think its all in the mind which it is but some people through the way life and their environment change them and there personality morphs them into one of 3.


Your wife is probably shocked because her friend was #2 and now your wife could possibly just saying not meaning to accuse is a #2 and is thinking about situations in which she wonders if she could ever justifying cheating. 


To be honest in the cases of abusive relationships i am talking massive abuse cheating is common from the woman even if she is a #3 because she often is trapped in many ways and has no outlet to love. However in majority of cases with cheating id say they are from #1 type people and in the lesser amount of cases #2 type people. #3 type people basically do not cheat unless they are in cases were there is no love at all for them and they are in helpless relationships were they are just an "animal" an object and not even viewed as an equal and do to constant hurting and lack of love they feel totally unappreciated and they are often trapped.


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## Goldmember357 (Jan 31, 2012)

RClawson said:


> *Do not be to put off. When I was younger and newly married I would be shocked when I would find out that people I knew were cheating. In some circumstances I was shaken to the core. then I realized what your wife discovered. Given the right circumstances the vast majority of us are capable of cheating. It is about timing, chemistry and all of those things that go into creating the "fog" that everyone mentions on this site.
> 
> In the first 15 years of our marriage (which were a bit more enjoyable than they are today) I think I could have easily fallen having been in the wrong place with the wrong person but I took steps to make sure that would not happen. Ten years later as bad as things are at times I just want to make things work with my wife. Julieanne Moore (sigh) could not get me off track.
> 
> ...





Paulination said:


> Her freind is 32, her husband is 50, her lover is 38. Her husband is allegedly controlling, doesn't want her to play soccer, makes her check in often, only married her because she was pregnant etc.....
> In otherwords, there were mitigating circumstances present and though she might not have cheated, she understands.
> 
> This is where the idea of manipulation comes to my mind. It is like my wife is putting me on notice that this is a posibility with us if things aren't perfect. She hasn'r said that, but I try to read between the lines and the content of a coment, and the timing says alot in my mind.
> ...


Her friend is either a #1 or what i said or a #2 likely a #2 and never had a consummate love.


Look people in Consummate loves with one another will not cheat

Triangular theory of love - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


^ read up trust me

people in Romantic loves, liking/friendships, non loves, infatuated and empty love can all cheat unless they are #3 type personalities.

People in compassionate, fatuous, or consummate loves will not cheat even if they are #2 personalities #1 type people do not get into those loves to begin with well they do in cases of compassionate love.

Identify which type of love of those several loves you think her friend and the husband have ask your wife show her the different types of love let her decide to. Than you try to figure out what type of love you honestly have with your wife and see if you really have (passion, romance, and commitment) if you do than you have a consummate love aka the (true love) and in that case than you will not have to worry about cheating assuming both of you are on par and in those scenario's and situations likely you are both #3 type people or one person may be a #2 however there is no or wont ever likely be a case in which they feel the need to justify their actions of cheating because there "demands" are being met. That is what YOU DO NOT WANT! you do not want to constantly give and give and you do not want to have a situation in which a person is never under pressure as that is what makes or breaks a personality and can show the true person.


You will know if your wife is a cheater if you truly in my opinion do enough reading and if you truly look inside yourself trust your gut and than look into your marriage and than be honest with god and yourself you will know. If you ignore signs if you ignore gut feelings if you do everything you can to try to hide the feelings of set thing ever being a possibility than you wont know.

It all shocks me when someone says " i cant believe so and so cheated" i can totally believe the world is filled with majority of #1-#2 type people. The world may not be entirely evil but its filled with people who live immoral lives and are constantly far removed from moral decisions its filled with people who think about themselves pleasure first and only themselves and think little of others. Its filled with all different types of personalities and the fact is most people marry someone who will cheat majority of time its the man. Now why do men cheat so often? a million other reasons to many for me to explain and not to mention some biological and evolutionary reasons tie a little into it however the conscious mind can decide against set actions but than we are back at square one and you find most people are #2 type or #1 and they will do what they want and not care about hurting set person because "its Justified" 


You often know who you get into a marriage with people just choose to ignore it or overlook it and not trust there gut. Now people cheating while you are dating is different as you have little time that you have known each other but marriages are way different.


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## Lionelhutz (Feb 2, 2012)

Goldmember

Here's one of the fundamental problems with your analysis



Goldmember357 said:


> I do not think all people have the cheating gene in them i think its all in the mind which it is but some people through the way life and their environment change them and there personality morphs them into one of 3.
> 
> .


I don't see how it is possible to make a meaningful distinction between genes, the environment and "the mind" as an explanation for someone's behaviour.

Are you saying the people with the "cheating gene" don't have that in their "mind"? Is there a "non-cheating" gene, and if someone happens to possess it, is it true that their decisions are controlled by morality?


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## Goldmember357 (Jan 31, 2012)

Lionelhutz said:


> Goldmember
> 
> Here's one of the fundamental problems with your analysis
> 
> ...


I think things like mental illnesses which you are born with and primarily your environment and than personality decide it. Basically i feel that there is a "non cheating gene" but its not really a gene rather they wont cheat because that is not how they are it goes against all what they stand for. So its issues of morality and other issues it ties into their upbringing along with there personality. Nature is genes and heredity so things like hormones and the amount you have are part of it and than mostly its nurture (family, friends, influences, mass media, peer groups, god or no good depends) mass media displays role models but i think it really comes down to how you thought growing up how you were as a child and in school id say that really who you are in high school is a huge indicator of your true personality although people change a lot after high school i think your true character is who you were as teenager people can change dramatically and go back from the "bad ways" but underneath it all that tenancy to want to say "rebel" exists while others never had that.


I feel parents and family and how you were raised as a baby/child maters a lot oh and when you were in the womb. I think society can only change you so much and that your peers are a huge influence but rather you gravitate to those you admire or feel are on your level and that comes from how you view yourself and what you are worth and that comes from parents. So parents and your upbringing are huge the peers only bring out what you truly are or might gravitate to. That is why honestly you should all hope that at some point your spouse has a chance to cheat but DOES NOT that would show they could of and say were asked to and under pressure but did not. What you would not want is for your spouse to never have to make that decision and never been in a pressuring situation.


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## Paulination (Feb 6, 2012)

An update:

I mentioned that my wife has bad PMS and that mixed with the fact that her soccer team wa falling apart due to the infidelity seems to be what triggered this episode and I got caught at the bullet end of a gun that shouldn't have been aimed at me. Her period started a couple of days ago and she is once again her happy self and seems at peace (but not happy) about the state of her team. I am relieved at the fact the trouble in my marriage is not as bad as I thought BUT, thanks to you folks I will never look at it the same.

1) The fact that she could treat me the way she did and not look back at that now that she feels better and try to apologize or something is disturbing.

2) I definately think she takes me for granted and doesn't appreciate the life she has.

So, what now? I am going to take control of myself. I never ever want to feel the way I have for the past 2 weeks again. I was a suspicious paranoid pathetic shell of myself absorbed in this situation.

I finally got it through my head thanks to you guys that I can't control her, only myself. I can't stop her from cheating if thats what she wants to do. I have some things in my life that I have been meaning to start so I will do that now. I will position myself mentally, physically, financially and every other way to deal with whatever this marriage or life throws at me.

I am relieved that her personality is back and that all of snooping revealed not even the appearance of impropriety but I will not fall back into complacency and I will never giver her the power to make me feels so small again.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

That is a good mindset to have and I would recommend that you write it down and read it on a daily basis to continue giving you confidence.

Download a free copy of Dr Robert Glover's ebook *No More Mr Nice Guy*. It may open your eyes to the potential of bettering your life without fear.


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## mickotoo (Jan 19, 2012)

I have set the bar at which it is an affair; to not being told about whats going on, so even when i'm talking to my wife of 14 years i can say he's a good guy to **** You should try Him.She has at one time wanted to wander from the marriage.....pregnancy got in the way ....She has set the bar at general chat in public nothing one to one. I totaly agree with Her


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

> I have set the bar at which it is an affair; to not being told about whats going on, so even when i'm talking to my wife of 14 years i can say he's a good guy to **** You should try Him.She has at one time wanted to wander from the marriage.....pregnancy got in the way ....She has set the bar at general chat in public nothing one to one. I totaly agree with Her


WTF?:scratchhead:


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

bandit.45 said:


> WTF?:scratchhead:


Irish whiskey?


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## TCx (Dec 15, 2011)

mickotoo said:


> I have set the bar at which it is an affair; to not being told about whats going on, so even when i'm talking to my wife of 14 years i can say he's a good guy to **** You should try Him.She has at one time wanted to wander from the marriage.....pregnancy got in the way ....She has set the bar at general chat in public nothing one to one. I totaly agree with Her


Does not compute/parse. Can I rephrase your post to see if I understand it correctly?

You have set the boundary for your wife at, "if you talk to another man and don't tell me about it, I consider it cheating". Because she follows this rule, you trust her enough and feel comfortable enough to point out other men and joke about her "trying them on for size"?

Your wife has set your boundaries for you (and her?) at "you/we are allowed to talk to members of the opposite sex in public (and in general social settings) but never one-to-one"? And you think this is a good boundary?


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Cuckold freak.



mickotoo said:


> Am with my wife for nearly 14 years but i really get off on her flirting and being perved on by guys. My ultimate fantasy is to watch her having a night with another man.
> I've told her my fantasy and she's played along going to nudist beaches wearing sexy clothes but last year was the ultimate, she met a guy online and asked to have sex with him!!!! of course i said yes but in the lead up to it we got so horny and the sex got so good we ended up getting pregnant...
> Its not long since babe came along and she's embarressed of how he was made so the topic is not for discussion
> HOW DO I GET HER UP FOR IT AGAIN.
> I'm not forcing her she asked me and i know she wants a bit of strange


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## cloudwithleggs (Oct 13, 2011)

morituri said:


> Cuckold freak.


You say that my estranged husband ask me, when i was interested in this other guy last year about having sex with both of them, apparently it was a test which i failed because i pondered the thought and didn't say no.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Paulination said:


> I am relieved at the fact the trouble in my marriage is not as bad as I thought BUT, thanks to you folks I will never look at it the same.
> 
> 1) The fact that she could treat me the way she did and not look back at that now that she feels better and try to apologize or something is disturbing.
> 
> ...



Bumping this for the new arrivals



marduk said:


> I happened to be thinking today about the past year of my marriage. Everyone on these forums were so instrumental in my being in the great place I am today I thought I would post a note about where I was, where I am, and what I’ve learned.
> 
> A year ago my marriage was a mess. After 3 kids my stay at home wife spontaneously decided to start going out with her girlfriends again, including a “girls trip” to Vegas. She started a crazy fitness routine, including marathon running and triathalons. She started leaving me at home with the kids 2-3 evenings a week. A rough summer. I was insecure, controlling, alone, and afraid.
> 
> ...


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## mickotoo (Jan 19, 2012)

bet your happy morituri, call one person a freak and insult two... can your really be a supporter on a marriage forum with such a narrow mind????


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Yes I am narrow minded for calling people who want to turn their marriages into a mockery and their wives into sex toys for other men, freaks. And proudly say to you "guilty as charged".


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

morituri said:


> Yes I am narrow minded for calling people who want to turn their marriages into a mockery and their wives into sex toys for other men, freaks. And proudly say to you "guilty as charged".


Freak was mild. I was thinking pervert.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

Dirty old man


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## Goldmember357 (Jan 31, 2012)

The people in this thread make me laugh

if you are unfaithful you are corrupted and have let the devil take you over you are beyond help 9/10 times and you are a sick person filled with poison.

Not all people are unfaithful however i will say a great deal of our population is and thus already most of the time sealed their fate.


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## TCx (Dec 15, 2011)

Goldmember357 said:


> The people in this thread make me laugh
> 
> if you are unfaithful you are corrupted and have let the devil take you over you are beyond help 9/10 times and you are a sick person filled with poison.
> 
> Not all people are unfaithful however i will say a great deal of our population is and thus already most of the time sealed their fate.


Wow, thanks for this! I haven't laughed this hard in a long time.


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

Goldmember357 said:


> The people in this thread make me laugh
> 
> if you are unfaithful you are corrupted and have let the devil take you over you are beyond help 9/10 times and you are a sick person filled with poison.
> 
> Not all people are unfaithful however i will say a great deal of our population is and thus already most of the time sealed their fate.


Another non judgmental statement by one of Jesus' followers.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

RClawson said:


> Another non judgmental statement by one of Jesus' followers.


Whats your point?


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## RClawson (Sep 19, 2011)

chapparal said:


> Whats your point?


Shear sarcasm.


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