# Exposing to O/m's wife after all these months



## working_together

Ok, so my husband wants to expose my affair with O/m to his wife. The affair has been over since Feb. 15, 2010. Not sure how effective this is going to be after so long, and due to the fact the affair is long over. I want to respect his decision, but on the other hand is it worth it? She knew he had an affair with me, yet did nothing about it, she even posted it on her FB at the time it was going on.

What would be the reason to do it at this point?????


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## Hope1964

OK, so she already knows, yet he wants to expose?!?! Makes no sense to me.


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## Jellybeans

If he does, he does and there is nothing you can do to stop him.

It's clear it still hurts him and this may be a bit of closure he needs.


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## Eli-Zor

As a BS he wants the truth , the only current source of this is you. Exposing to the OM's wife is what he wants and he may want to compare notes , you should willingly support him. If the OM's wife knew of the affair and did not tell your husband then shame on her . Experience often says the OM may have told his wife a very different story.

If your husband was here we would encourage him to contact the OM's wife. No insult to you intended by the following, waywards are known to lie even under the utmost duress. You husband has his reasons, I suspect he wants to make sure the OM's wife knows and he may want verification you have been telling the truth and maintaining NC.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## calif_hope

Your betrayal, his broken heart! His decision (healing/closure), you to support and not question.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Locard

Please tell us all why you care? Really, what drove you to post this question?


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## Shaggy

Do you intend to really R and stay with him?

If you do then don't question this. In fact help in any way he asks.

You betrayed him with the OM, at least now you can honor his wishes.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lazarus

Your husband needs to reveal your affair because it allows him to tackle this head on himself. Doesn't matter if it was one week or 5 years ago. 

Going to the other person's house, workplace or speaking to the affair person's spouse on the phone gives your husband a chance of a) seeing the other cheater's home and b) hearing the other LS voice and the all important personal experience to discuss with the other innocent party the terrible violation that has happened.

In your case your husband is still around... for how long who knows. A year is nothing to recover from the pain of infidelity. 

You have to walk in the shoes of the BS to understand that it will take many years to work through and the violation will always be there. 

It seems amazing that you think it is long over.


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## CH

working_together said:


> and due to the fact the affair is long over.
> What would be the reason to do it at this point?????


To your husband the affair is never over. It can be forgiven but it will never end for him until he's 6 feet under and finally away from you and the pain.

14 years since D-day, my wife has forgiven but not forgotten. She doesn't throw it in my face all of the time, only when I get her really pissed then once in a while it comes rushing all out. 

BTW, have him cheat on you and then come back and see if you can say it's already over and what's the point.


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## Jellybeans

You ae both right (the 2 posters above).
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## working_together

The decision has been made. We are exposing the affair to OM's wife. She had suspicions, and in fact knew something was up with her husband. But she now needs to know every detail, and she will. I agree this has to be done, I know he gas lighted her big time, he had been doing that during our affair when she would question him about his whereabouts. He made her out to be a crazy drunk.

I'm sure once she hears all the details she will kick his ass to the curb. Part of me feels guilty that his kids will get dragged into this especially during the holidays, but on the other hand he did this to her knowing full well what the consequences would be.

Hubby feels like even after all these months it will feel like some sort of closure, and reclaiming his manhood that he lost after D-day.

He will be sending her an email, then following up with a phone call letting her know if she has any questions she can speak to me.

Uncomfortable? yes. But I realize that I owe that much to my husband for the heartache I have caused him. He's told me several times that I have no idea the pain he is still suffering, and will never know....I agree.

The other aspect of the situation is that OM was doing construction work (how we met) in our basement, and actually did not finish the job. We figure he should "pay" for this as well, so we will take legal action for his lack of work as well. We will give him a choice, pay a portion of the money back to us, or he can deal with the courts.

We'll see what happens.

The exposure should occur sometime this week, I'll let people know the results.


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## working_together

Locard said:


> Please tell us all why you care? Really, what drove you to post this question?


Why do I care??

I want to do anything I can to make my husband understand that I love him, and want our marriage to recover, even though I know it's a long road a head for us. I want him to know that I will support any decision he makes it terms of his pain and suffering. I want him to feel as though he has closure to a horrible situation. Part of me also felt that the affair is long over, but now realize that for him it will never be over, he will never forget what happened. In the end he may even chose to leave me, it's the chance I took when engaging in my selfish behavior.


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## working_together

Eli-Zor said:


> As a BS he wants the truth , the only current source of this is you. Exposing to the OM's wife is what he wants and he may want to compare notes , you should willingly support him. If the OM's wife knew of the affair and did not tell your husband then shame on her . Experience often says the OM may have told his wife a very different story.
> 
> If your husband was here we would encourage him to contact the OM's wife. No insult to you intended by the following, waywards are known to lie even under the utmost duress. You husband has his reasons, I suspect he wants to make sure the OM's wife knows and he may want verification you have been telling the truth and maintaining NC.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


His wife never had any evidence, so she never came forth with the information to my husband. I'm not sure it's to compare notes, but rather for her to know that she was right with her suspicions, and in fact not crazy at all. It's also to reclaim his manhood and feel that he does have some control of the situation. He also wants to show the OM that he has to suffer the consequences of his affair, as his has not thus far.


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## JustaJerk

> Hubby feels like even after all these months it will feel like some sort of closure, and reclaiming his manhood that he lost after D-day.


This is ALL he's looking for- *CLOSURE*.



> OM was doing construction work (how we met) in our basement


I swear... you couldn't make this sh!t up. I guess its situations like these that make for T.V. dramas. Good God.


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## Shaggy

Hubby should also go on message boards that rate contactors and warn other men that this guy will prey on their wives.

what a slime ball to get hired into someone's home, and to turn around and prey upon your wife and marriage. 

the guy not only deserves to have his holidays messed up, he deserves to loose his business as well.

I wonder how many other lonely housewives he's done this with, and how many marriages he's hurt or killed.


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## working_together

morituri said:


> Good job.
> 
> 
> 
> Good luck. Oh and decline any offer of his that involves him personally finishing the job. The last thing you want is for that weasel to set foot in your home again.


No kidding...he will never step foot in our home. He will pay us the 2500 he owes us because he was too lazy to finish the job. The question will be if his wife wants us to take legal action and have their reputation ruined, or just hand over the money that he swindled my handicapped mother. I had a lot of difficulty facing my mom after all this, yet she has forgiven me. I think I will get some peace out of all this afterall.


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## working_together

Shaggy said:


> Hubby should also go on message boards that rate contactors and warn other men that this guy will prey on their wives.
> 
> what a slime ball to get hired into someone's home, and to turn around and prey upon your wife and marriage.
> 
> the guy not only deserves to have his holidays messed up, he deserves to loose his business as well.
> 
> I wonder how many other lonely housewives he's done this with, and how many marriages he's hurt or killed.


yeah, he wants to do this, ruin his career, but I feel like his marriage will be ruined, and **** like that trickles down to every aspect of a person's life. The worse part is that he is not registered grrrr, not sure how to go about that really. He lives in a small community..hmmm


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## working_together

Shaggy said:


> Hubby should also go on message boards that rate contactors and warn other men that this guy will prey on their wives.
> 
> what a slime ball to get hired into someone's home, and to turn around and prey upon your wife and marriage.
> 
> the guy not only deserves to have his holidays messed up, he deserves to loose his business as well.
> 
> I wonder how many other lonely housewives he's done this with, and how many marriages he's hurt or killed.


This is a man who has had multiple affairs, his wife knows of one previous one, and has kept him on a tight leash ever since, she even made him take his face Book site down because he "was chatting to too many woman". They were never exposed, and it might come as a surprise to her to know that he told another woman he "loved her" and never loved his wife yada yada yada. Would he be able to sleep with two eyes closed at night? don't think so.


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## working_together

Tonight the **** storm is going to hit his family, I used to feel bad about it, but now feel like his wife needs to know the truth once and for all. She needs to know what a cheat and liar he is, and that he may have exposed her to STD's.

I'm nervous about the backlash, but willing to take it I guess.


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## Jellybeans

working_together said:


> yeah, he wants to do this, ruin his career, but I feel like his marriage will be ruined, and **** like that trickles down to every aspect of a person's life.


You do see the irony of how your own marriage was ruined by your actions, right? 

Oh and by not wanting your husband to "expose" you are going against your husband. Whoever posted "If you're not with him, you're against him" was spot on.


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## warlock07

I still feel you are defending the OM to some extent. Maybe feelings leftover because you dumped him out of the blue ?


Note: You said that you did not do it in your house when you separated. He is married and obviously cannot do it at his house. I don't think you went to hotels regularly. Are you a troll or are you lying?


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## Jellybeans

I don't get a troll vibe from her at all.


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## JustaJerk

> Hubby should also go on message boards that rate contactors and warn other men that this guy will prey on their wives.
> 
> what a slime ball to get hired into someone's home, and to turn around and prey upon your wife and marriage.


C'mon now, she wasn't innocent in all this... she could've said *NO*!



> *This is a man who has had multiple affairs*, his wife knows of one previous one, and has kept him on a tight leash ever since, she even made him take his face Book site down because he "was chatting to too many woman". They were never exposed, and it might come as a surprise to her to know that he told another woman he "loved her" and never loved his wife yada yada yada.


And knowing ALL this, you still decided to jump with both feet in.:scratchhead: Sorry to say, but you're just another notch on his tool belt.



> Whoever posted "If you're not with him, you're against him" was spot on.


That be me, Ms. Beans. I call em' how I see em'.


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## Badblood

Working, it's about time you did something to prove where your loyalties lie, and support your husband. But you realize that this isn't nearly enough. You should support your husband ALWAYS. That is what a real marriage is, a mutually supportive group.


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## Arnold

It seems, well, rahter crazy , to expres concern over this guy's family. That is totally inconsistent with your having hed sex with him. Obviously, his family is not a big concern for you.
His wife has now been exposed to your sexual history and needs to be tested for STDs.


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## Jellybeans

She doesn't want her husband to expose for fear of the fallout/consequences. She acknowledged that somewhere in this or her other thread. So she's not denying that. It's not about "protecting the OM's family." It's more about her. That is normal for someone in her situation.


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## working_together

warlock07 said:


> I still feel you are defending the OM to some extent. Maybe feelings leftover because you dumped him out of the blue ?
> 
> 
> Note: You said that you did not do it in your house when you separated. He is married and obviously cannot do it at his house. I don't think you went to hotels regularly. Are you a troll or are you lying?


Sheesh, here it goes again.....

ok, actually we did go to motels, we weren't having sex every day, it was once a week to two weeks. There was a lack of oprotuanity on his part since his wife wouldn't let him out of the house because of her suspicions and his past infidility. 

I no longer feel like I'm defending OM, yes, at the beginning I was, I was still in the fog. Whatever my husband is asking from me I am willing to give him, including exposing OM.


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## working_together

Jellybeans said:


> She doesn't want her husband to expose for fear of the fallout/consequences. She acknowledged that somewhere in this or her other thread. So she's not denying that. It's not about "protecting the OM's family." It's more about her. That is normal for someone in her situation.


Up until recently I didn't want his kids to suffer because of his stupidity, and I didn't want some crazy lady knocking on my door.

But.....I see it differently now.


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## working_together

Badblood said:


> Working, it's about time you did something to prove where your loyalties lie, and support your husband. But you realize that this isn't nearly enough. You should support your husband ALWAYS. That is what a real marriage is, a mutually supportive group.


You're right, I haven't been as supportive as I should have, not before the affair, not during, or after. I always felt like he was a strong man, and could just handle everything.

lots of work there.


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## warlock07

How do you plan to tell her? A letter or a phone call or talk to her face to face?


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## Lazarus

-Working together- wants to be a part of her husband's life, so she's making the effort to be in it. 

Why would her husband want to reserve a place in his heart for a wife that doesn't want to make the effort to stay? 

Making the effort has just begun and it will be a long road fraught with pitfalls but at least she is bracing herself to take that journey. 

Only then will she really underrstand the difference between guilt and remorse. 

Sticking around to witness that journey should allow her to fully see her husband's pain. Only then will she really understand the difference between guilt and remorse. 

Some betrayed spouses endure that painful journey on their owm. 

Every disloyal person should witness the train wreck of infidelity. If they are not man or women enough to stick around for their own spouse's journey they should (at the very least) be exposed to a film showing the devastation that is often left behind.


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## Shaggy

There is cheaters.com if he just wants to warn others about him. If they google his name it'll show up. There is also angeslist, but they might not allow such a report.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## oaksthorne

working_together said:


> You're right, I haven't been as supportive as I should have, not before the affair, not during, or after. I always felt like he was a strong man, and could just handle everything.
> 
> lots of work there.


 but on the other hand he did this to her knowing full well what the consequences would be.

You don't seem to realize that you did it to her too. Why did you involve yourself with another woman's H,? Was it competition? My H told me that he thought if I found out about his A, I would " get mad, but you would get over it". I did neither. I was destroyed and I will never get over it. It leaves a perminent scar on your soul. She, ( the OW ) told me that she didn't care about me or my family, what a big surprise! Affairs are very selfish things that people do to their own families and those of other people. Try to put yourself in the other person's place, if you can learn how to do that, you will benefit and so will every one around you. The more you can teach yourself to empathize with the betrayed spouces the more you can help with the healing process


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## working_together

warlock07 said:


> How do you plan to tell her? A letter or a phone call or talk to her face to face?


Hubby is going to hand deliver the letter with all the details of the affair.....he's going tomorrow.


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## working_together

So the letter is written, we wrote it together last night, big triggers for both of us. I felt sick to hear all the details, I really didn't want him to relive the pain of what I did, but that won't go away, I know that.

He will be delivering her to her home tomorrow morning, we're hoping that OM is not home, but since he barely works, he will be for sure, and I envision lots of lies, but I'm ok with that, I've told the complete truth, and I couldn't lie about what was written in the letter. She'll be angry, not want to believe it, but once it sinks in.....

I told hubby to bring a friend as a witness since OM has a hunting gun in his home, no one can predict what the outcome will be. Yes, I'm afraid, but there is no other way for her to receive the letter. She never answers her phone, he always steps in to answer knowing full well it could be hubby.

Unfortunately, she has a daycare business in her home, she may very well have to close after this info. comes out. I feel bad about that, but on the other hand as some posters have said, I didn't think of her during the affair. I need to worry about my husband now, and she needs to know that her suspicions were right, and that she isn't crazy as he made her out to be.

I will come back tomorrow and let people know what happened. I'm hoping this allows hubby the closure he needs at this point. He seems to feel a bit better since writing the letter, more calm. He told me that now it's up to me to do the heavy lifting, and show him that I am willing to work on the marriage. He said either way, he will be fine.


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## warlock07

Great!! I don't like the sound of it but I hope it ends well. Maybe you husband should carry a weapon himself. 

Question: Does the WS have triggers too? Isn't it just a gift to the BS


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## Almostrecovered

my wife has triggers yes, if one has true remorse then I think that triggers would also set them off in negative ways

post dday, I once called her "kiddo" and apparently OM called her that and she got very upset (not because she missed him but it reminded her of how stupid she was), so I will never call her that again


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## Badblood

Working, I hope you realize what a big (huge) step this is, and appreciate that it is a good sign that your husband wants to work on the marriage. If he had "checked out", then he wouldn't be so confrontational with the OM and OM's W. You are the one who mangled his pride, so you must be the one to help him regain it. Can you lose some of your own, to do this?


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## Arnold

I'm perplexed(there's a shock). You are the one that cheated, yet your H is the one taking the risk re the OM with a weapon. Shouldn't it be you going?


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## Jellybeans

Arnold said:


> I'm perplexed(there's a shock). You are the one that cheated, yet your H is the one taking the risk re the OM with a weapon. Shouldn't it be you going?


I completely disagree about the delivery. Her husband should be the one exposing/giving the letter. I don't think the betrayed party should ever, ever  be told about the affair by the affair partner. It's like throwing acid in a wounded person's face. Like, "It wasn't bad enough that you f-cked my husband, but here you are telling me all about it." It's cold. 

And no offense, Arnold & BadBlood, but some of your posts to the OPs come across as really mean/angry. The OP did a bad thing, has acknowledged it and is seeking help/advice. When TAMers bash them further, it doesn't help at all.

Another thread (Person91) was like that yesterday. There are other posters above as well who were doing the same thing a lot yesterday.


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## Arnold

Well, maybe they come across as a little mean(but remember, she kicked her hurting husband out of the marital home when he was hurting big time. Tough to be terribly sympathetic toward that kind of cruelty). But, seriously, if someone is going to risk bodily harm, shouldn't it be the person who caused all this. Her husband has already been injured emotionally. Why should he risk being hurt by the affair partner?
And, as a BS, from my perspective, I would much rather have the chance to confront the person that did me harm vs his spouse. In no way would that feel like acid in the face to me.


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## Jellybeans

Yeah it's hard to have sympathy for someone who has committed one of the worst acts of betrayal, but bashing them when they are trying to seek out help/answers is counter-productive.

I still stand by what I said--her husband should be the one exposing to the OMW. Not the OP. Why? Because the OP will no doubt minimize the affair.


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## Arnold

Well, maybe they should both go , then. Her H could make sure she is forthcoming and she could act as a human shield if things get physical. And, as an added benefit, she could see how much pain she caused the man's wife. Might help her develop more empathy.


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## Jellybeans

Arnold said:


> Well, maybe they should both go , then.


Maybe they should do whatever her husband wants to do. He is the betrayed so he gets to decide how to handle this marital situation.


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## Almostrecovered

Jellybeans said:


> Maybe they should do whatever her husband wants to do. He is the betrayed so he gets to decide how to handle this marital situation.



:iagree:


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## Arnold

Let's hope he is uninjured(physically).


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## Almostrecovered

Arnold said:


> Let's hope he is uninjured(physically).



of course

which is why I always recommend sending registered mail or UPS sign only


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## Jellybeans

You're a riot, AR. LOL


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## Almostrecovered

Jellybeans said:


> You're a riot, AR. LOL



not sure what I said that was funny this time...:scratchhead:


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## Jellybeans

The "registered mail or UPS sign only" comment gave me a chuckle.


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## working_together

Arnold said:


> I'm perplexed(there's a shock). You are the one that cheated, yet your H is the one taking the risk re the OM with a weapon. Shouldn't it be you going?


I think it's more effective if he goes, I would go if he asked me to accompany him.


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## working_together

I'm not sure if what I'm feeling is normal. I'm going through major anxiety at the moment, I'm usually very in control of my emotions, I'm a "stuffer". But at the moment, I'm shaking, on the verge of tears, and don't want to call my husband and have him deal with my ****. He has enough to deal with. But on the other hand, if he kknows how I feel right now, he can know that I'm feeling horrible for what I have done, and what I have put him through.

I don't want to break down. Everything is racing through my head in terms of all the horrible things I did to him. All the memories are coming back, all the stuff OM and I said to each other during the affair, and it makes me so sick that I cannot eat. Major triggering going on. I feel like I've put him in a horrible position that he now has to see that idiot and relive all the memories himself. I know the guy is a coward, and will not use his gun. I don't have the strength to go with him tomorrow, I feel I would break down and it would appear that I would be crying for OM which is the furthest from the truth. He needs to get everything that he deserves, he needs to suffer as we have, everyone has paid the price except him.

Sorry for the rambling, but I don't want to burden anyone in my life.

And yeah, I have to start leaning on my husband more, showing I need him and I love him. I can no longer pretend to be so strong and independent.

thanks for listening


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## working_together

Almostrecovered said:


> of course
> 
> which is why I always recommend sending registered mail or UPS sign only


the problem with that is the guy is always home, and he would sign for it and read it, and then trash it. We've tried calling the home, he always answers. There's really no other way.

If people have other ideas I'd love to hear them.


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## Almostrecovered

pay one of those guys that deliver subpoenas?


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## Jellybeans

How you feel is normal. You are anxious because of what's about to happen. Everything is coming full circle now. The truth is about to to be exposed.

_But this isn'ta bout vengeance: He needs to get everything that he deserves, he needs to suffer as we have, everyone has paid the price except him._

This way of thinking is skewed. It's not about vengeance or "payback." This is about the fact that OM's wife deserves and has the right to know the truth about her marriage.


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## Shaggy

Have someone call him and arrange to meet him say for a new job, coud be a house or coffee shop across town. No one actually needs to meet him there, you just need to know when he will be gone.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jellybeans

working_together said:


> the problem with that is the guy is always home, and he would sign for it and read it, and then trash it. We've tried calling the home, he always answers. There's really no other way.
> 
> If people have other ideas I'd love to hear them.


The only "idea" that matters is your husband's. How he chooses to handle this is up to him. You should respect whatever choice he makes. 

It's not up to you.


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## strugglinghusband

working_together said:


> the problem with that is the guy is always home, and he would sign for it and read it, and then trash it. We've tried calling the home, he always answers. There's really no other way.
> 
> If people have other ideas I'd love to hear them.


As a recently betrayed husband (e/a 2 months out) I can say if my wife were on board they way you are, I would deff feel better about R with her..

PS. if you know he has a gun (coward or not)and someone shows up to your door with info that may ruin your life, how do you KNOW (not think) that he may not go postal...the guy has already proven he has no concern for others., why take the chance, if things get ugly, what then? dead people possibly for what????


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## working_together

Almostrecovered said:


> pay one of those guys that deliver subpoenas?


How much does that cost?


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## working_together

Jellybeans said:


> How you feel is normal. You are anxious because of what's about to happen. Everything is coming full circle now. The truth is about to to be exposed.
> 
> _But this isn'ta bout vengeance: He needs to get everything that he deserves, he needs to suffer as we have, everyone has paid the price except him._
> 
> This way of thinking is skewed. It's not about vengeance or "payback." This is about the fact that OM's wife deserves and has the right to know the truth about her marriage.


I know that it's not about vengeance, I was venting a bit. We just want the wife to know the truth, but honestly it's not easy to not have a little relief that he will suffer as well.


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## working_together

Shaggy said:


> Have someone call him and arrange to meet him say for a new job, coud be a house or coffee shop across town. No one actually needs to meet him there, you just need to know when he will be gone.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I like this idea, but it's a little short notice i think.


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## working_together

I called a friend so I feel better now. Everyone knows, so not sure why I didn't want to call anyone, I guess it just brings up my shame.


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## working_together

Thanks for the message Bad, I appreciate it.


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## Shaggy

working_together said:


> I like this idea, but it's a little short notice i think.


Not at all,in fact the short time gives him less time to think about it.

"hi, I heard you do xxx work, I've got a job at 1313 yyyy that needs that. Can you meet me there at 3 today to look it over?"
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Almostrecovered

working_together said:


> How much does that cost?


no idea

but I figure if it's 200 bucks it would be worth it over risking injury


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## Arnold

Costs about $160 to serve process in MN.


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## Badblood

working_together said:


> Thanks for the message Bad, I appreciate it.


You are very welcome. Now what you should do is, tomorrow after your husband gets back, show him how much you love him. Just say, what ever he wants, you will do. He has felt low for too long, make him feel like a hero.


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## working_together

What are the odds that OM will deny the affair right in front of my husband and his wife????


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## Almostrecovered

pretty good


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## JustaJerk

> What are the odds that OM will deny the affair right in front of my husband and his wife????


Of course he's gonna deny it, but if your husband has proof(e-mails, phone records, texts), there's no way he can discount those.

I'd even say "_Merry Christmas [email protected]#$ER_," as a parting shot.


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## Beowulf

JustaJerk said:


> Of course he's gonna deny it, but if your husband has proof(e-mails, phone records, texts), there's no way he can discount those.
> 
> I'd even say "_Merry Christmas [email protected]#$ER_," as a parting shot.


Does the OM have any tattoos, moles, birthmarks or scars that only you and his wife would know about? If so you could include that in the letter as proof of the affair and maybe that would go a long way toward showing your H that you are truly behind him and willing to make restitution for your actions.


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## working_together

Hubby is on his way to OM's house as I write this.

I can't breathe.


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## warlock07

Don't worry. Everything will turn out great.


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## Pit-of-my-stomach

working_together said:


> Hubby is on his way to OM's house as I write this.
> 
> I can't breathe.


Your H is really great.


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## Badblood

working_together said:


> Hubby is on his way to OM's house as I write this.
> 
> I can't breathe.


TRUST your husband, Working. He is doing this to repair your marriage and speaks volumes about his feelings for you. I know you are nervous, but this is his way of taking back his manhood. Like I said, treat him like a hero, when he gets home.


----------



## Badblood

working_together said:


> What are the odds that OM will deny the affair right in front of my husband and his wife????


He probably will, but if he does, he is only digging himself deeper in the sh*t. This way his wife will be under no illusions.


----------



## working_together

I just wish he'd call me.


----------



## working_together

Just heard from my husband. I'm really proud of how he handled this.

OM was not home, I was afraid of this.

Hubby said he went up to the door, asked if she was so and so, after she said yes, she then responded "this doesn't look good". He asked her to step outside as he had some information that she needed to hear about her husband. Hubby said he was calm but shaking inside. He handed her the letter, and told her that her husband had an affair with his wife. She responded very calmly, but had tears in her eyes. She thanked him, and asked if she could call him. He then told her he saved some of the emails I had sent OM, and if she wanted them she could have copies. He also told her the legal issue of the unfinished work in the basement was at the end of the letter. She was speechless.

He then left the home. She called him back 5 min. later and said she wanted the emails.

So it's done.


----------



## working_together

working_together said:


> Just heard from my husband. I'm really proud of how he handled this.
> 
> OM was not home, I was afraid of this.
> 
> Hubby said he went up to the door, asked if she was so and so, after she said yes, she then responded "this doesn't look good". He asked her to step outside as he had some information that she needed to hear about her husband. Hubby said he was calm but shaking inside. He handed her the letter, and told her that her husband had an affair with his wife. She responded very calmly, but had tears in her eyes. She thanked him, and asked if she could call him. He then told her he saved some of the emails I had sent OM, and if she wanted them she could have copies. He also told her the legal issue of the unfinished work in the basement was at the end of the letter. She was speechless.
> 
> He then left the home. She called him back 5 min. later and said she wanted the emails.
> 
> So it's done.


I want to thank everyone for making me see how imp. this was to my marriage.

Now the real work on our marriage will occur.


----------



## warlock07

Great. End of story. You can move on


----------



## warlock07

OP, I'm apologize if this question was asked previously. But you said you had lot of triggers when writing the letter. What was your intention when you asked your husband to move out. Separate from husband? Marry the OM when he divorces the wife? Remain single and keep seeing the OM?


----------



## JustaJerk

I have to commend you for the work you've put in toward reconciling your marriage. Not only did you come out the other side of this with a bright future ahead, but you really showed a lot of people here that there _are_ WS's who are truly remorseful and want to redeem themselves by starting anew with their spouse. Congratulations and good luck because as you said- "_Now the REAL work begins_."


----------



## working_together

warlock07 said:


> OP, I'm apologize if this question was asked previously. But you said you had lot of triggers when writing the letter. What was your intention when you asked your husband to move out. Separate from husband? Marry the OM when he divorces the wife? Remain single and keep seeing the OM?


I don't know what I was thinking when I asked my husband t0 leave, as stupid a's this may sound, I felt guilty for cheating on him while we were still together and felt like if he left I could further justify my acts. I could no longer look at him while engaging in the affair. I know it sounds ridiculous, but that was where my thinking was at the time.


----------



## Almostrecovered

Do know as hard it this was, that the OMW has been done a huge service. She has been operating in a marriage without all of the information required to make proper decisions.


----------



## Almostrecovered

working_together said:


> I don't know what I was thinking when I asked my husband t0 leave, as stupid a's this may sound, I felt guilty for cheating on him while we were still together and felt like if he left I could further justify my acts. I could no longer look at him while engaging in the affair. I know it sounds ridiculous, but that was where my thinking was at the time.



IOW you didn't want the reminder of your sins near you


----------



## warlock07

I guess it was the "I am not cheating when we are separated" logic..


----------



## Badblood

Working, I want to tell you that I think you, at last, are coming out of the fog, and really showing true remorse. Yes, the real work begins, but you have come a long way towards proving your level of commitment. Your support for your husband during this crisis will go a long way to helping him regain his self-respect and trust in you. I wish you the best of luck with your NEW, HONEST, MARRIAGE!!!


----------



## Almostrecovered

also recognize that there will be a temporary power shift in the dynamic of your marriage.

as he heals the power shifts back to a more equal footing

this natural and imo required

this doesn't mean he can be physically abusive or extremely verbally abusive but do know that he needs to feel in control


----------



## collegemom

working_together said:


> His wife never had any evidence, so she never came forth with the information to my husband. I'm not sure it's to compare notes, but rather for her to know that she was right with her suspicions, and in fact not crazy at all. It's also to reclaim his manhood and feel that he does have some control of the situation. He also wants to show the OM that he has to suffer the consequences of his affair, as his has not thus far.


I'm confused why telling anyone is a benefit. Maybe I'm a private person and I want to work thru things on my own, but telling another spouse and their family seems horribly selfish to me. My business is my spouse and if I wish to stay with a cheater. But to ruin another family for the purpose of mines's screwed and yours should be, just seems petty and vindictive.


----------



## Badblood

Collegemom, the other family isn't in any better shame than the OP's. Why should one cheater get off and the other one suffer? Did you read Workings posts?


----------



## Almostrecovered

collegemom said:


> I'm confused why telling anyone is a benefit. Maybe I'm a private person and I want to work thru things on my own, but telling another spouse and their family seems horribly selfish to me. My business is my spouse and if I wish to stay with a cheater. But to ruin another family for the purpose of mines's screwed and yours should be, just seems petty and vindictive.


Because the unknowing betrayed spouse is operating under false pretenses, the deserve to know to make their own informed decisions
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Almostrecovered

BTW- you arent destroying a marriage by informing them of infidelity, the infidelity already destroyed it


----------



## madwoman

working_together, I just want to commend you. 

I could totally understand your anguish. I couldn't imagine how hard it is to face what you have done to your husband. But, you are. When you said you can't breathe, it made me cry for you and your husband. 

Show him this site. It may help him to if nothing else, read the stories of R, and communicate privately with people like almost recovered who have made it through the gauntlet. 

I hope everthing works out as it should for your marriage.


----------



## Beowulf

morituri said:


> working_together please consider that when your husband has lashed out at you with some hurtful things, it was the pain in his soul that was crying out to you. Your remorseful tears in front of him can have the power to help him heal.
> 
> Also be extremely vigilant on when you see your husband experiencing a trigger and be ready to hug him tightly against you. A pain shared is a pain halved.
> 
> Lastly I would hope that your husband reconsiders seeking professional counseling for himself in order to help him process his personal recovery in a healthy fashion. For his sake as well as yours.
> 
> God bless.


"A pain shared is a pain halved"

I have never heard it stated better. IMO the pain of a BS has no equal.


----------



## collegemom

I would never do that to another family. I know I wouldn't. Not trying to sound holier than thou, but it just seems cruel.


----------



## Almostrecovered

geeze, why am I always the shining example?

poor Lord Mayhem, sigma, Entropy and others


----------



## Almostrecovered

collegemom said:


> I would never do that to another family. I know I wouldn't. Not trying to sound holier than thou, but it just seems cruel.


But YOU aren't doing that to another family, it was already done


I've seen MANY stories where the OMW or OWH was VERY grateful for the info as they had NO idea what was wrong in their marriage


----------



## WhereAmI

collegemom said:


> I would never do that to another family. I know I wouldn't. Not trying to sound holier than thou, but it just seems cruel.


I think it's cruel to withhold information that could help prevent further mental anguish (gaslighting cheaters often make their spouses feel crazy) and possibly prevent the spread of STDs. I would tell.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Kobo

collegemom said:


> I'm confused why telling anyone is a benefit. Maybe I'm a private person and I want to work thru things on my own, but telling another spouse and their family seems horribly selfish to me. My business is my spouse and if I wish to stay with a cheater. But to ruin another family for the purpose of mines's screwed and yours should be, just seems petty and vindictive.


So you wouldn't want to know if you're husband is cheating on you? You don't mind him possibly bringing desease to your body? You don't mind that he is giving his affection to someone else while you clean up after him, cook for him, pay bills with him, etc?


----------



## Badblood

Almostrecovered said:


> geeze, why am I always the shining example?
> 
> poor Lord Mayhem, sigma, Entropy and others


You are a beacon of hope to us all, AR. But that means that you can't do anything wrong........ever!


----------



## JustaJerk

I really don't know what to say about *collegemom*'s posts????


----------



## Beowulf

Almostrecovered said:


> But YOU aren't doing that to another family, it was already done
> 
> 
> I've seen MANY stories where the OMW or OWH was VERY grateful for the info as they had NO idea what was wrong in their marriage


Many years ago my W cheated on me. I had no idea. Thankfully she realized that she was headed down a dead end and ended the affair shortly after it had begun. She told me about it and we R. If she had hidden it we wouldn't be married now.


----------



## working_together

This shi*t couldn't be made up, but it seems like a movie to me.

ok, so here's the kicker.....

OM calls my husband (he still had the number from construction days)and tells hubby that he really has a "way with words" referring to the letter written to his wife. He wanted to speak about the legal issues concerning the construction job he failed to complete. He basically said he is not repaying any of the money that he owes my handicapped mother who he took advantage of, (she lives below us in our duplex). At first when hubby told me, I was like, ok, maybe we should forget about it, then I thought, why the hell should he get off with more stuff. He did a terrible job, and others need to know this. Not sure what the next step is. 

Then at the end of the conversation he tells my hubby that his wife is now divorcing, as if he's going to get any sympathy.

Really?


----------



## Almostrecovered

ahhhh, the fog is definitely lifting

you are starting to hate your OM and see him for what he really is


(just like my wife)


----------



## Jellybeans

Take him to small claims court


----------



## working_together

Hubby and I are going out for dinner tonight, we need to feel as though we can work on our marriage, and spend some time together.


----------



## JustaJerk

I think you mentioned he wasn't licensed. You could report him to the city about him doing work without a business license.

As for taking him to small-claims, you'd need receipts and/or a contract on the work being done. Usually the client gives an advance for the initial stages of the job, with regular intallments after the phases of a project are completed. These phases need approval from building inspectors who come in and approve of the work in order for it to progress. So if you paid him all of it up-front, you're going to have a tough time recovering it if there is no contract or reciepts for the work or building materials. Construction put me through college, and gave me much needed skills in when renovating my own home. From blue-collar to white-collar... the best of _both_ worlds.


----------



## working_together

JustaJerk said:


> I think you mentioned he wasn't licensed. You could report him to the city about him doing work without a business license.
> 
> As for taking him to small-claims, you'd need receipts and/or a contract on the work being done. Usually the client gives an advance for the initial stages of the job, with regular intallments after the phases of a project are completed. These phases need approval from building inspectors who come in and approve of the work in order for it to progress. So if you paid him all of it up-front, you're going to have a tough time recovering it if there is no contract or reciepts for the work or building materials. Construction put me through college, and gave me much needed skills in when renovating my own home. From blue-collar to white-collar... the best of _both_ worlds.


My mom gave him installments, personal cheques with his name on it, totaling about 10,000, he'd have a hard time explaining that at small claims court. i have all the receipts still in an envolpe.


----------



## JustaJerk

Reciepts are all you need then. Take him to court. Take pictures of the work in question, and what he failed to accomplish.


----------



## Arnold

collegemom said:


> I would never do that to another family. I know I wouldn't. Not trying to sound holier than thou, but it just seems cruel.


This attitude is immoral and cruel, IMO. What possible justification can anyone have that allows him or her to stand by and watch as some poor soul is betrayed and deceived. I know of no BS that was not glad to have been informed.
WTF? ever heard of STDs. This woman needs to be tested as does her husband as she has been exposed to working's entire sexual history.


----------



## working_together

JustaJerk said:


> Reciepts are all you need then. Take him to court. Take pictures of the work in question, and what he failed to accomplish.


I personally paid someone else to finish the job out of my own money because I felt like crap about it, I could bring that person to court I guess as a witness. Things are looking very good now.


----------



## madwoman

Arnold said:


> WTF? ever heard of STDs. This woman needs to be tested as does her husband as she has been exposed to working's entire sexual history.


Well, now she knows, it's up to her. Guess we'll see her on here at some point.


----------



## working_together

And when my mom comes into court with her walker slowly walking up the aisle, let's see who gets sympathy then.


----------



## working_together

Thanks for the message Just.


----------



## JustaJerk

> I personally paid someone else to finish the job out of my own money because I felt like crap about it, I could bring that person to court I guess as a witness.


Even better. 



> Thanks for the message Just.


No problem. You owned your sh!t from the get-go. You deserve some support... even from a jerk like me.


----------



## working_together

Strugglinghusband, where is your thread????


----------



## Badblood

Good job, working. Remember to give him a wifely "attaboy", he's earned it. If you two can reconcile, you must realize how lucky you will be to have such a stand-up man.


----------



## warlock07

I Husband is an easy target to the OM now. He has nothing to lose. He can taunt him how easily he did xxxx with you or what a [email protected]## you were in bed. Or it might remind him how you never did xxxx with your husband but did it for the OM(did you?). I would suggest blocking his number from both your phones.


----------



## Badblood

warlock07 said:


> I Husband is an easy target to the OM now. He has nothing to lose. He can taunt him how easily he did xxxx with you or what a [email protected]## you were in bed. Or it might remind him how you never did xxxx with your husband but did it for the OM(did you?). I would suggest blocking his number from both your phones.


Warlock, I think that the OM is too chickensh*t to do this. He basically hid from Working's husband the last time , when Hubby threw his crap on the porch.


----------



## warlock07

But then he had his family to loose. now he does not.


----------



## Badblood

Well, he might, but I think he would get a major beatdown by Working's hubby, if he did.


----------



## working_together

warlock07 said:


> I Husband is an easy target to the OM now. He has nothing to lose. He can taunt him how easily he did xxxx with you or what a [email protected]## you were in bed. Or it might remind him how you never did xxxx with your husband but did it for the OM(did you?). I would suggest blocking his number from both your phones.


Exactly what we thought might happen, hubby said the exact words "he's got nothing to lose".

My husband knows ALL the details. There's nothing that ass could do to hurt us, and hubby even said it's not about all the details, it's the fact of what happened.


----------



## Almostrecovered

good for your hubby, I wish he was here as he sounds like he would be a worthy addidtion


----------



## working_together

Hubby received an email from OM's W yesterday after he sent an email I had sent to OM's during the affair.

Her first email said she wanted proof that I had sent it to him, meaning that it in fact was sent by email, as we had copied and pasted it, and could not forward it. I was like really, the exposure letter wasn't enough?

Then a couple of hours later she sent another email saying never mind, he has told the truth. However she had some very nice things to say about me.....not. She told hubby that I'll never change, that I'm a low life, etc.

Sounds like projecting to me.

Obviously I'm not responding.


----------



## Almostrecovered

she has every right to despise you, just stay out of her way and life


----------



## WhereAmI

working_together said:


> Hubby received an email from OM's W yesterday after he sent an email I had sent to OM's during the affair.
> 
> Her first email said she wanted proof that I had sent it to him, meaning that it in fact was sent by email, as we had copied and pasted it, and could not forward it. I was like really, the exposure letter wasn't enough?
> 
> Then a couple of hours later she sent another email saying never mind, he has told the truth. However she had some very nice things to say about me.....not. She told hubby that I'll never change, that I'm a low life, etc.
> 
> Sounds like projecting to me.
> 
> Obviously I'm not responding.


I'm sure you'd think the same thing of your H's affair partner, if he had one. At that point in your life you were not someone to be admired, to say the least. You have to remember her pain is fresh. She's not thinking about this situation in past tense, her emotions are all very raw. 

As for you not being able to change, her opinion shouldn't matter. You're on the road to becoming a better wife. Hopefully you keep heading in the right direction while having compassion for those you've wounded, including OMW.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## working_together

Almostrecovered said:


> she has every right to despise you, just stay out of her way and life


I know, and I am lucky that I did not accompany him when he went to their home. She told hubby that she would have clobbered me. I'm 5'3 and 110lbs, yeah, she would have beaten the **** out of me for sure.


----------



## oaksthorne

working_together said:


> Hubby received an email from OM's W yesterday after he sent an email I had sent to OM's during the affair.
> 
> Her first email said she wanted proof that I had sent it to him, meaning that it in fact was sent by email, as we had copied and pasted it, and could not forward it. I was like really, the exposure letter wasn't enough?
> 
> Then a couple of hours later she sent another email saying never mind, he has told the truth. However she had some very nice things to say about me.....not. She told hubby that I'll never change, that I'm a low life, etc.
> 
> Sounds like projecting to me.
> 
> Obviously I'm not responding.


Did you expect a thank you note? You knew he was married when you got involved, and she knows that you knew that. She has every right to despise you. What exactly is she projecting? Has she been involved with another woman's H herself ? Keep working on that empathy thing.


----------



## JustaJerk

> However she had some very nice things to say about me.....not. She told hubby that I'll never change, that I'm a low life, etc.
> 
> She told hubby that she would have clobbered me. I'm 5'3 and 110lbs, yeah, she would have beaten the **** out of me for sure.


And rightfully so. At the time, you _were_ a low-life... now you just have to prove to hubby that you're not that person anymore.


----------



## Voiceofreason

Regarding the unfinished construction work, you might consider reporting him to the state contractors license board. If he is licensed they will investigate and his license will be in peril if he doesn't make good on the claim. If he is unlicensed, that is a crime and they may turn it over to the DA.


----------



## strugglinghusband

If you took him to court and the guy stated " hey I didnt finish the work because I was invloved in a affair with this woman etc etc" possible? who knows?? all the more people that would learn of the affiar..I would deff consult a lawyer and see what could possibly happen..
Is it the money or are you trying to make a point?


----------



## working_together

oaksthorne said:


> Did you expect a thank you note? You knew he was married when you got involved, and she knows that you knew that. She has every right to despise you. What exactly is she projecting? Has she been involved with another woman's H herself ? Keep working on that empathy thing.


because her husband has had multiple affairs, and she knows HE won't change.


----------



## warlock07

> Sounds like projecting to me.


Why do mean by that?


----------



## Arnold

Almostrecovered said:


> she has every right to despise you, just stay out of her way and life


Agree. YOu acted like a low life. Accept that to her, you will always be one.


----------



## warlock07

working_together said:


> because her husband has had multiple affairs, and she knows HE won't change.



But you have an equal share of the blame. You were not an innocent teenager.


----------



## Arnold

working_together said:


> I know, and I am lucky that I did not accompany him when he went to their home. She told hubby that she would have clobbered me. I'm 5'3 and 110lbs, yeah, she would have beaten the **** out of me for sure.




Well, in reality, you participated in beating the crap out of her, already. I know I would have much preferred a physical beating to this(in the unlikely event someone could be found that is capable of it ).


----------



## working_together

morituri said:


> Could you share with us the details of what happened when your husband got to the OM's home?


My husband walked up to the door of her daycare knowing she would answer the door. He knocked on the door and asked if she was so and so. She responded with "this doesn't sound good". He told her that her husband and his wife had an affair that started last November, and lasted until Feb. She was in complete shock, and started to shake, but apparently she was trying to control her emotions (she had a tear in her eye). She then asked him if he was doing this to cause her the same pain he had. He told her that she needed the information in the letter in order to realize that her suspicions were correct,and that she wasn't the crazy person she thought she was. She started to say "but you and your wife are still together". He told her that this was not about his marriage any longer, it was about hers, and how she chooses to deal with it is up to her. But for him through therapy, he needed to do this as to regain some manhood, and also for closure. He furthered this with, "my wife has dealt with the consequences, and yes we are still together, but she kicked me out for your husband, and I spent X-mas last year knowing that I would be a part-time dad". He then went on that her husband referred to her as a "fall down drunk", and when she had serious medical issues, he had called her a "drama queen". My husband told her he felt bad about that, and asked her if she remembers that he had even called her and asked how she was doing. She remembered (they had one conversation back then given that OM wanted to be friends with hubby).

He didn't want to say much else since all the details of the affair were in the letter, dates, motels etc. And he was starting to feel guilty about doing this at X-mas time.

So that's pretty much it, I think what surprised her, was that my husband said he had suffered tremendously and hoped that their marriage could be repaired, but that she needed to know the truth. He then said he was sorry for pain this will cause, and hoped it wouldn't be 1/4 of what he felt when he found out about his wife's affair.

and he left.


----------



## working_together

I told my husband today that I love him, and haven't loved him this much in a long time. I told him that things will get better....I promise.


----------



## working_together

Arnold said:


> Well, in reality, you participated in beating the crap out of her, already. I know I would have much preferred a physical beating to this(in the unlikely event someone could be found that is capable of it ).


I know I would have deserved a beating. Part of me wants to write her a letter of apology for everything I have done to her. The other part of me knows full well that I could never say sorry enough for what I did, and she would take it as an insult.


----------



## JustaJerk

> I know I would have deserved a beating. Part of me wants to write her a letter of apology for everything I have done to her. The other part of me knows full well that I could never say sorry enough for what I did, and she would take it as an insult.


I think your best bet is to let it go for now. She just got hit with this yesterday. Whatever you do right now will seem as just that- an insult.


----------



## Arnold

working_together said:


> I told my husband today that I love him, and haven't loved him this much in a long time. I told him that things will get better....I promise.


You banked a pretty pleasurable experience. Maybe your Hubby could get something he likes, maybe a dog or a Harley, at your expense(somethin morally acceptable).
Restitution helps the betrayed and the cheater. It is a very well accepted practice. Judaism, in particular, seems big on it. What are you willing to do to pay back your debt?


----------



## Jellybeans

While buying a Harley is nice, it's not going to get to the meat of the issue.

Working, keep up the good work and continue to show your husband through actions that you are willing to work on your marriage and you are committed through it.

Have you guys discussed marriage counselling? It's a good idea, IMO.


----------



## working_together

warlock07 said:


> But you have an equal share of the blame. You were not an innocent teenager.


Yeah, her words stung a lot, and it was hard to read them. Yes, I was equally responsible for the affair, but I guess I didn't want to hear that I was a ***** and a low life, and that I don't go around screwing other people's husbands as a habit. But, I know full well, it doesn't matter what the circumstances are, I slept with her husband, and that doesn't change a damn thing. 

In the back of my mind I still considered myself a "good girl" and the fact that I was a virgin until I met my husband, and was faithful for 24 years. So now I have to live with myself knowing what I did, and what a piece of scum I am. I have to deal with that the rest of my life.


----------



## Arnold

It is , actually, a pretty well accepted way of demonstrating remorse, well founded in a lot of philosophies and mentioned in writngs on forgiveness.
It is a gesture, a tangible sign, of remorse and an attempt to level the field. It releives some of the betrayed's resentment and also alleviates a bit of the guilt the offender has. 
Our legal system recognizes restitution as a way of making amends as do many religions.


----------



## working_together

Arnold said:


> You banked a pretty pleasurable experience. Maybe your Hubby could get something he likes, maybe a dog or a Harley, at your expense(somethin morally acceptable).
> Restitution helps the betrayed and the cheater. It is a very well accepted practice. Judaism, in particular, seems big on it. What are you willing to do to pay back your debt?


Don't think I'll be getting hubby a dog, I consider myself "the crazy cat lady", we have 5 cats.

But, I get your point. I bought him a special x-mas gift that will have great meaning for him.

I'm still working on restitution.


----------



## Jellybeans

Working, individual counselling is a good idea for you too. 

Everything his wife said to you is to be expected from a wayward. I know it hurt to read those things, but like you said, she was justified because of what you and he did.


----------



## Arnold

working_together said:


> Yeah, her words stung a lot, and it was hard to read them. Yes, I was equally responsible for the affair, but I guess I didn't want to hear that I was a ***** and a low life, and that I don't go around screwing other people's husbands as a habit. But, I know full well, it doesn't matter what the circumstances are, I slept with her husband, and that doesn't change a damn thing.
> 
> In the back of my mind I still considered myself a "good girl" and the fact that I was a virgin until I met my husband, and was faithful for 24 years. So now I have to live with myself knowing what I did, and what a piece of scum I am. I have to deal with that the rest of my life.


Lots of folks have to deal with the reality of what they are capable of. I have done a load of things of which I am ashamed. But, what seperates halfway decent people from disordered a-holes is that they feel remorse and change.
MY XW will never change. She cheated on her affair partner within a year and is now on to another unsuspecting , naive guy.


----------



## JustaJerk

By reading... do you mean she sent you a letter or something?


----------



## Jellybeans

Working, his wife is not "projecting." His wife is totally in the right to be angry with you...so it's not projection...What it is, is her calling you on helping betray her marriage. 



Arnold said:


> Agree. YOu acted like a low life. Accept that to her, you will always be one.


No, working will not "always be one." Working did a sh!tty thing, has owned it and is working to better herself and her marriage. Unfortunately, she cannot change the past. All she can do is learn from her mistakes and not repeat them. 

When you know better, you do better.


----------



## Arnold

working_together said:


> Don't think I'll be getting hubby a dog, I consider myself "the crazy cat lady", we have 5 cats.
> 
> But, I get your point. I bought him a special x-mas gift that will have great meaning for him.
> 
> I'm still working on restitution.


Excellent. The thing about mentioning restitution in these forums, is that , sometimes, folks view it as petty. Or, some folks like Jelly, seem to feel it may be mutually exclusive of doing the other work needed to fix things. 
It is ,pretty clearly, something that can be done in addition to addressing the issues within oneself.
I am not trying to be facetious or vindictive in bringing up the need for restituion. I have been involved in the criminal justice system , as well as civil litigation. Restitution does promote healing.


----------



## Arnold

Jellybeans said:


> Working, his wife is not "projecting." His wife is totally in the right to be angry with you...so it's not projection...What it is, is her calling you on helping betray her marriage.
> 
> 
> 
> No, working will not "always be one." Working did a sh!tty thing, has owned it and is working to better herself and her marriage. Unfortunately, she cannot change the past. All she can do is learn from her mistakes and not repeat them.
> 
> When you know better, you do better.


I meant to the wife of her OM. I beleive I put that qualifier in there.
But, maybe she won't.


----------



## JustaJerk

I think *working* has owned her sh!t, taken her lumps, and is on a positive road to healing and reconciliation. I'll leave it at that.


----------



## strugglinghusband

The restitution, what ever that may be, if any, should be determined by her husband and the OMW. isnt owning up to it and facing your accusers and the consequences part of that?


----------



## Jellybeans

strugglinghusband said:


> The restitution, what ever that may be, if any, should be determined by her husband and the OMW. isnt owning up to it and facing your accusers and the consequences part of that?


Exactly. Whatever her HUSBAND, the guy she is married to, and she decide-- should be the path set for them in the marital recovery. We are just bunch of people on the internet. (Though we are a "cool" bunch of people on the internet). 

Arnold, if you have something to say to me you can just come out and say it instead of pvssyfooting around. It's obvious you take issue with a lot of things I post or have a problem with it. You seem to add a lot of things to what I write or make all or nothing assumptions about what I write.


----------



## JustaJerk

^Damn... this is getting personal.


----------



## warlock07

working_together said:


> Yeah, her words stung a lot, and it was hard to read them. Yes, I was equally responsible for the affair, but I guess I didn't want to hear that I was a ***** and a low life, and that I don't go around screwing other people's husbands as a habit. But, I know full well, it doesn't matter what the circumstances are, I slept with her husband, and that doesn't change a damn thing.
> 
> In the back of my mind I still considered myself a "good girl" and the fact that I was a virgin until I met my husband, and was faithful for 24 years. So now I have to live with myself knowing what I did, and what a piece of scum I am. I have to deal with that the rest of my life.


Don't Beat Yourself Up, Unnecessarily. It stings to read about your remorse actually. I can only wonder how bad you are actually feeling


----------



## COguy

working_together said:


> Yeah, her words stung a lot, and it was hard to read them. Yes, I was equally responsible for the affair, but I guess I didn't want to hear that I was a ***** and a low life, and that I don't go around screwing other people's husbands as a habit. But, I know full well, it doesn't matter what the circumstances are, I slept with her husband, and that doesn't change a damn thing.
> 
> In the back of my mind I still considered myself a "good girl" and the fact that I was a virgin until I met my husband, and was faithful for 24 years. So now I have to live with myself knowing what I did, and what a piece of scum I am. I have to deal with that the rest of my life.


You know the pain you caused and you are remorseful for it. I believe you would not let it happen again knowing the consequences.

Know that it takes a strong person to face a situation that will cause you intense pain, and work through it. We all make mistakes, sometimes we make really really bad ones. What makes you a good person is not a lack of mistakes, it is how you deal with them. In your case, you were strong and faced your issue head on. That makes you a good person, and you should hold your head up high.

Dealing with your issues respectfully like you did, it is a healing force for your husband. Be proud of yourself, I know your husband is of you.


----------



## working_together

JustaJerk said:


> By reading... do you mean she sent you a letter or something?


She sent an email to my husband saying some nasty things about me, I felt like I needed to send her an apology, but I don't think the time is right.


----------



## working_together

Arnold said:


> Excellent. The thing about mentioning restitution in these forums, is that , sometimes, folks view it as petty. Or, some folks like Jelly, seem to feel it may be mutually exclusive of doing the other work needed to fix things.
> It is ,pretty clearly, something that can be done in addition to addressing the issues within oneself.
> I am not trying to be facetious or vindictive in bringing up the need for restituion. I have been involved in the criminal justice system , as well as civil litigation. Restitution does promote healing.


I know what you mean by "restitution", I worked in the legal system, and yes it can be effective.


----------



## JustaJerk

Oh... wow. Yeah, I don't think she sent it in order to exchange dinner reservations.

You did well *working*.


----------



## Arnold

Jellybeans said:


> Exactly. Whatever her HUSBAND, the guy she is married to, and she decide-- should be the path set for them in the marital recovery. We are just bunch of people on the internet. (Though we are a "cool" bunch of people on the internet).
> 
> Arnold, if you have something to say to me you can just come out and say it instead of pvssyfooting around. It's obvious you take issue with a lot of things I post or have a problem with it. You seem to add a lot of things to what I write or make all or nothing assumptions about what I write.


No, I like most of what you say, Jelly. Just every once in a while you are off, IMO.
That "everything" comment to the other guy seemed insensitive and blaming. So, I called you on it.
And on this restituion issue, I disagree that simply going to the OM's wife is enough. I think her husband desrves to be paid back in some acceptable, moral form, for the damage she caused him.
The fact that I disagree with you, on occassion means nothing personal. I try cases against some of my best friends and we are cool with each other.


----------



## Jellybeans

Arnold said:


> No, I like most of what you say, Jelly. Just every once in a while you are off, IMO.
> The fact that I disagree with you, on occassion means nothing personal. I try cases against some of my best friends and we are cool with each other.


It's not your disagreeing with me that is disconcerting. It's the fact that you blatantly have taken what I've said and have tried to drivel up and make something out of it of which is _not_ what I meant/say. 

Disagreements don't bother me at all. Not everyone agrees with everything everyone says. That is what makes life beautiful. That's what makes TAM beautiful. I just don't like when someone takes something I say and tries to make something TOTALLY different out of it. 



Arnold said:


> Case in point:
> That "everything" comment to the other guy *seemed insensitive and blaming*. So, I called you on it.
> And on this restituion issue, I disagree that simply going to the OM's wife is enough. I think her husband desrves to be paid back in some acceptable, moral form, for the damage she caused him.


Where in my post did I "blame" him for his wife cheating on him? Where was I "insensitive" in my post to him? You haven't called me out on anything except for what YOU perceive I mean to say. So you're not even calling me out for the right thing. 

Not to belabor the point, but where in my post did I say he should have been "_led to believe she was cheating on him?"_ Or shifted the blame onto him for his wife to cheat on him and so callously bring the OM to her home to help her as she moved out? I also never said that "Simply going to the OM's wife is enough." Nowhere in my post did I write those words. Once again, those are your words. 

I'm not going to hi-jack this thread further so you and I can back and forth about which of my words you've misinterpreted or or outright accusing me of saying things that I did not or implying that I meant something other than what I've said. As previously stated, I don't appreciate people putting words in my mouth and trying to say I meant something that I clearly do not.


----------



## Arnold

I feel that telling some guy that is having recriminations about , perhaps, not having picked up on his wife's cheating earlier, that the lack of sex should have told him everything is unkind. It is right there on the page.


----------



## working_together

Thanks for your words Jelly.


----------



## Jellybeans

Arnold said:


> I feel that *telling some guy that is having recriminations about , perhaps, not having picked up on his wife's cheating earlier*, that the lack of sex should have told him everything is unkind. It is right there on the page.


*Where *in my post to him does it say he's _"having recriminations about, perhaps, not having picked up on his wife's *cheating* earlier?"_

Where in my post does it say he should have _*"been led to believe she was cheating on him?"* _ Where is the word *cheating* that you continue to bring up over and over again with regards to the statement I made?

Where? Please copy/paste it for everyone to see. Cause you continue to accuse me of saying something I did not. Don't try to put your words into my sentence. It's pretty ridiculous actually. 

Once again, if you are happier discounting what I've said and keep wanting to twist my words/meaning into something that *you* want it to be, then go right ahead. 

This entire conversation is boring me. :sleeping:



working_together said:


> Thanks for your words Jelly.


No problem


----------



## pidge70

Jellybeans said:


> *Where *in my post to him does it say he's "having recriminations about, perhaps, not having picked up on his wife's *cheating* earlier?"
> 
> Where in my post does it say he should have *"been led to believe she was cheating on him?"* Where is the word *cheating* that you continue to bring up over and over again?
> 
> Where? Please copy/paste it for everyone to see. Cause you continue to accuse me of saying things I didn't. It's pretty ridiculous actually. Especially when you have nothing to back it up with.
> 
> 
> 
> No problem


I think he is referring to a different thread.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Badblood

Jellybeans and Arnold, why don't you take this to private messaging? This is Working together's thread and you two are thread-jacking, bigtime.


----------



## Badblood

Working, I do think that the idea of restitution is a good one, but to continue to prove your love and complete devotion is even better. Ask him what he feels will help. The most important issue you face is the trust issue, right? Perhaps you could volunteer to take a Polygraph every six months or so, just to reassure him. I know, that on the face of it, it might seem insulting to you, but you must remember that you are not a good person.......yet. For you to swallow some of your pride and submit to this, will show him 1. that you are being honest 2. that you are doing it because of your concern for his wellbeing 3. Your determination to remake your marriage on a footing of love and integrity. 4. Your willingness to be submissive. I know that when my wife took it (poly) it was enough for me to agree to reconciliation, because, at the time, she proved her words. She later resumed contact, once, and it was against the rules I had set, so then I chose divorce but if she had been fathful to my rules, her last tragic episode would not have happened. Polygraphs are not that expensive and isn't it worth the expense to have your husband trust you again?


----------



## warlock07

Polygraph is an overkill at this point IMO


----------



## JustaJerk

Guys... she said she's going to try and make it up to him as best as she can... isn't that enough already. Whatever she plans, or has planned, that's her business. Damn.


----------



## Badblood

Warlock, there is no such thing as overkill when trying to recover from an affair. In fact, overkill is just what is needed in Working's situation, BECAUSE she chose the om over her husband once. She needs to go to the wall for him, until HE is satisfied, not her, not us, not anyone else.


----------



## Badblood

Justajerk, Working came here for advice and that's what she is getting. She is perfectly free to adopt it or not as she chooses.


----------



## JustaJerk

Yeah... I get it Bad, but aren't we harpin' on this a bit.


----------



## Badblood

Working, it's not about what you want, think, or feel, right now. It's all about your husband. Simply put, Whatever he wants you to do, you do. As long as it's legal and not dangerous. Obviously, this will not be a permanent situation. Once he begins to trust you and your actions again, then with constant communication, respect and love, you can look to a brighter future. You WILL be the woman you want to be. Good luck !!! To BOTH of you, and keep us posted!!!


----------



## Badblood

Nope, JAJ, I don't think so. Working is remorseful, but sometimes her pride gets in the way. It isn't harping to remind her of this.


----------



## Arnold

Jellybeans said:


> *Where *in my post to him does it say he's _"having recriminations about, perhaps, not having picked up on his wife's *cheating* earlier?"_
> 
> Where in my post does it say he should have _*"been led to believe she was cheating on him?"* _ Where is the word *cheating* that you continue to bring up over and over again with regards to the statement I made?
> 
> Where? Please copy/paste it for everyone to see. Cause you continue to accuse me of saying something I did not. Don't try to put your words into my sentence. It's pretty ridiculous actually.
> 
> Once again, if you are happier discounting what I've said and keep wanting to twist my words/meaning into something that *you* want it to be, then go right ahead.
> 
> This entire conversation is boring me. :sleeping:
> 
> 
> 
> No problem


You are blowing my high, man .


----------



## Jellybeans

Badblood said:


> Jellybeans and Arnold, why don't you take this to private messaging? This is Working together's thread and you two are thread-jacking, bigtime.


The PMing suggestion isn't be necessary as I am not repeating myself again. 

And I agree this thread got hi-jaked and for that, I apologize, Working.

Back on topic!


----------



## oaksthorne

working_together said:


> because her husband has had multiple affairs, and she knows HE won't change.


And this is her fault, how?:scratchhead: That does not absolve you and it does not mean that she is at fault because she has bought his crap, You did. She does need to wake up. Hope can be such a trap with a man like this. Projecting is seeing your own fault in another person. I think that you might actually be doing that to her. It is pretty common for the OW to look down on the wife. I know that the sneaky little B who moved in on my marriage thought she was a much better catch then I. I notice however that as soon as I became aware of her existence my H immediately fired off a NC e-mail to her before I was completely informed about the true nature of their relationship. She was absolutely gob smacked that he could drop her like a dirty diaper. She tried for months to get him to change his mind. Getting involved with another woman's H is usually playing a very hurtful game of king of the mountain at the wife's expense. I would like to know why there are so many women who have no honor towards other women in such situations. If more females would play fair with each other, there would be very few affairs and broken homes.


----------



## morituri

There are so many openings for a predatory man to weave his way to a vulnerable married woman that it is frightening. Would you agree?


----------



## oaksthorne

morituri said:


> There are so many openings for a predatory man to weave his way to a vulnerable married woman that it is frightening. Would you agree?


I think the woman makes herself vulnerable. Unless she is developmentally disabled, she still knows that an A is hurtful and unacceptable behavior. I was married before, and it was an abusive relationship. I was emotionally starved. I had several opportunities the cheat if I had been able to sell that to myself as an acceptable way to handle my frustration, but I knew it was selfish and destructive. I chose to leave that relationship with honor. What is frightening to me is the staggering selfishness and dishonesty of any cheater, man or woman. They lie to everyone, including themselves, and the results of their selfish behaviors resounds through the generations that come after them. My H's A has hurt everyone it has touched. The Ow hurt her family and her career.


----------



## working_together

Badblood said:


> Working, it's not about what you want, think, or feel, right now. It's all about your husband. Simply put, Whatever he wants you to do, you do. As long as it's legal and not dangerous. Obviously, this will not be a permanent situation. Once he begins to trust you and your actions again, then with constant communication, respect and love, you can look to a brighter future. You WILL be the woman you want to be. Good luck !!! To BOTH of you, and keep us posted!!!


thanks for your words Bad, again, although I haven't always agreed on everything you have said, I respect your comments, and have always taken them into consideration.


----------



## working_together

Badblood said:


> Nope, JAJ, I don't think so. Working is remorseful, but sometimes her pride gets in the way. It isn't harping to remind her of this.


Spot on


----------



## working_together

oaksthorne said:


> And this is her fault, how?:scratchhead: That does not absolve you and it does not mean that she is at fault because she has bought his crap, You did. She does need to wake up. Hope can be such a trap with a man like this. Projecting is seeing your own fault in another person. I think that you might actually be doing that to her. It is pretty common for the OW to look down on the wife. I know that the sneaky little B who moved in on my marriage thought she was a much better catch then I. I notice however that as soon as I became aware of her existence my H immediately fired off a NC e-mail to her before I was completely informed about the true nature of their relationship. She was absolutely gob smacked that he could drop her like a dirty diaper. She tried for months to get him to change his mind. Getting involved with another woman's H is usually playing a very hurtful game of king of the mountain at the wife's expense. I would like to know why there are so many women who have no honor towards other women in such situations. If more females would play fair with each other, there would be very few affairs and broken homes.


maybe it didn't come across correctly. I have been really stressed the last couple of days with the exposure, and was angry that she called me a wh0re, really stung hard.

What I meant about the "projecting" was that she was lashing out at us because she knows her husband will never change, and was trying to get my husband to see the same in me, like he should suffer even more. I obviously get she is pain, as I have seen this in my husband for 9 months now.

I understand what you say about feeling that as an OW you see yourself as a "better catch", I totally had those feelings, I used to think that he "upgraded" to a classy and more educated woman. Yeah, really I thought that, part of the justification, I certainly wasn't classy during the affair.


----------



## working_together

morituri said:


> There are so many openings for a predatory man to weave his way to a vulnerable married woman that it is frightening. Would you agree?


I totally agree with this. I see things so differently now, I'm very different with the opposite sex now (not that I ever flirted much in the past). I think my affair really opened my eyes to how easy it is to get caught up when people make comments that are innapropriate. My boundaries are very clear, and I'm always on guard. And it's the way it should have always been.


----------



## SadSamIAm

working_together said:


> maybe it didn't come across correctly. I have been really stressed the last couple of days with the exposure, and was angry that she called me a wh0re, really stung hard.
> 
> What I meant about the "projecting" was that she was lashing out at us because she knows her husband will never change, and was trying to get my husband to see the same in me, like he should suffer even more. I obviously get she is pain, as I have seen this in my husband for 9 months now.
> 
> I understand what you say about feeling that as an OW you see yourself as a "better catch", I totally had those feelings, I used to think that he "upgraded" to a classy and more educated woman. Yeah, really I thought that, part of the justification, I certainly wasn't classy during the affair.


I think this is true that you would feel like you are better than the wife because he chose you over her. That he upgraded.

But the problem with relationships with cheaters (why only 3% make it) is that once the fog lifts, the people involved realized they actually downgraded because they left a faithful partner and are now with a cheater.


----------



## Jellybeans

SadSamIAm said:


> I think this is true that you would feel like you are better than the wife because he chose you over her. That he upgraded.
> 
> But the problem with relationships with cheaters (why only 3% make it) is that once the fog lifts, the people involved realized they actually downgraded because they left a faithful partner and are now with a cheater.


I think a lot of OW feel like "Oh I must be better since he cheated with me." Until they realize, the partnered person that cheated with them isn't that great of a catch if at the time he cheated and was unfaithful to his lady. He loses his credibility and any honor that he may have had because of that. What does that say about him? Did he really find an upgrade in the OW? It's more like the cheating spouse and the OW are now both downgraded because of what they did. And unfortunately, it's not something either of them can wash away.


----------



## warlock07

@Working 

I have a question. Do you identify the person who did the stuff you did during the affair? Or did you disown that person? Is it a coping mechanism? Obviously there should still be a part that identifies with what you did and justifies it however small it is. So do you still find that person in you? 

Even the statement you said about him upgrading, it was obviously you who did that. How do you deny that you are still that person? Is it that the affair that changed you or was it you all along? 

Sorry, I'm having difficulty putting this question into words.


----------



## Badblood

Warlock, I can't get this question ? My wife told me that she has a real hard time identifying the thought processes that lead up to the affair, as hers. She said," that she seemed to be a different person, not herself". Is that what you mean?


----------



## warlock07

Something similar. I finding it hard to put in words. Even if she is different person, it was still her. Your mind does not change over night. You still have your moral compass, ethics, ideals. They can be slightly misdirected but you don't become a different person, do you?


----------



## Badblood

working_together said:


> I totally agree with this. I see things so differently now, I'm very different with the opposite sex now (not that I ever flirted much in the past). I think my affair really opened my eyes to how easy it is to get caught up when people make comments that are innapropriate. My boundaries are very clear, and I'm always on guard. And it's the way it should have always been.


This is real good, Working Very mature. But remember, YOU are the only one who can enforce these boundaries. Attractive women are alwys going to be "hit on", it's the woman's job to insure that those boundaries are respected. The OM didn't force himself on you, you let him in. You must also guard against your own pride and selfishness and never get complaiscent. You seem to realize that you are not as good a person, as you have always thought you were, and this is very healthy. A good dose of humility makes us all better people.


----------



## Badblood

No, Warlock, but you feel afterwards as if you were. My wife said that when we were together, she could not understand why she was cheating, because all of her feelings for me were there and the only thing she thought about the affair was how to end it, and how guilty it made her feel. When she went to Atlanta, after she would talk to the OM, she felt totally different.


----------



## working_together

SadSamIAm said:


> I think this is true that you would feel like you are better than the wife because he chose you over her. That he upgraded.
> 
> But the problem with relationships with cheaters (why only 3% make it) is that once the fog lifts, the people involved realized they actually downgraded because they left a faithful partner and are now with a cheater.


I don't feel that way now, but remember thinking that way during the thick of it. yep, messed up.


----------



## Arnold

working_together said:


> I totally agree with this. I see things so differently now, I'm very different with the opposite sex now (not that I ever flirted much in the past). I think my affair really opened my eyes to how easy it is to get caught up when people make comments that are innapropriate. My boundaries are very clear, and I'm always on guard. And it's the way it should have always been.




I do not think it is easy to get caught up in an affair, if you have decent morals. On the contrary, an ethical person easily resists.
I got hit on all the time by married women when I was younger and just blew them off.


----------



## working_together

warlock07 said:


> Something similar. I finding it hard to put in words. Even if she is different person, it was still her. Your mind does not change over night. You still have your moral compass, ethics, ideals. They can be slightly misdirected but you don't become a different person, do you?


You know what, I don't really think I was ever that type of person, I'll give you an example of what happened to me 6 years prior that destroyed a 15 year friendship.

A former good friend of mine was having an affair, she didn't tell me at first, but later told me all the details. This was a woman who in the past complained about her husband to the point i got fed up of hearing about it, I used to tell her to leave if she felt this way. So she has the affair, and asks me if she could use my house as a place she was going to tell her husband she was staying so she could meet up with OM. I told her NO, I do not want to partake in her [email protected] She went a head and did it anyway, and what ended up happening was her husband called my house after he found out, and dragged me into, and then said some lies because he was pissed. I was furious that she did this and told hubby we are going to his home and confronting this head on to let him know that I was in no way involved and in fact told her to leave if she was unhappy.

I then called her and ended the friendship.....yeah, I had morals back then, but somewhere during my affair they got screwed up, I will not be that type of person again.


----------



## cb45

Badblood said:


> No, Warlock, but you feel afterwards as if you were. My wife said that when we were together, she could not understand why she was cheating, because all of her feelings for me were there and the only thing she thought about the affair was how to end it, and how guilty it made her feel. When she went to Atlanta, after she would talk to the OM, she felt totally different.


Her/your answer lies in the spiritual realm, not so much the physical.

but u keep searching....do, do, keep searching yeladeem.

:sleeping:


----------



## Arnold

Badblood said:


> Warlock, I can't get this question ? My wife told me that she has a real hard time identifying the thought processes that lead up to the affair, as hers. She said," that she seemed to be a different person, not herself". Is that what you mean?


I think the thought process is very primitive, something like:" Me want to be boned. Me like be boned.":smthumbup:


----------



## working_together

Arnold said:


> I do not think it is easy to get caught up in an affair, if you have decent morals. On the contrary, an ethical person easily resists.
> I got hit on all the time by married women when I was younger and just blew them off.


I was in a very bad place at the time, I was vulnerable in many ways. During my 25 year marriage I was hit on numerous times, and most of the time I was not even aware of it, my husband would always say "did you see what that guy was doing" etc. Yeah, I "blew them off" as well. But something happened to me prior to my affair whereby I allowed myself to go down that road.

I really don't think morals has everything to do with it, I lost sight of a lot of things, but I'm getting it back now, and I'm never going to allow myself to feel that way again. NEVER


----------



## JustaJerk

I think I missed it somewhere in your thread, but how long did this go on?


----------



## working_together

JustaJerk said:


> I think I missed it somewhere in your thread, but how long did this go on?


It went on from Nov. of last year, until Feb of this year.


----------



## Badblood

Arnold said:


> I do not think it is easy to get caught up in an affair, if you have decent morals. On the contrary, an ethical person easily resists.
> I got hit on all the time by married women when I was younger and just blew them off.


On the contrary, Arnold, a prideful person will easily fall prey to compliments and flattery. A person with a good sense of self-worth will not. And there is a HUGE difference between the two.


----------



## Arnold

Badblood said:


> On the contrary, Arnold, a prideful person will easily fall prey to compliments and flattery. A person with a good sense of self-worth will not. And there is a HUGE difference between the two.


Yeah, but I said ethical not prideful.


----------



## Badblood

Arnold said:


> I think the thought process is very primitive, something like:" Me want to be boned. Me like be boned.":smthumbup:


I don't think this was true , at all. When she took the polygraph, some of the questions were about the sex between them. When asked if she enjoyed the sex, she said no, and she was telling the truth. When asked if she initiated sex between them, she said no, and again, she was proven truthful. When asked , however , if she had strong feelings for the OM, she said yes. So, she was obviously getting something from him, emotionally.


----------



## JustaJerk

> On the contrary, Arnold, a prideful person will easily fall prey to compliments and flattery. A person with a good sense of self-worth will not. And there is a HUGE difference between the two.





> Yeah, but I said ethical not prideful.


^Here we go again.


----------



## Jellybeans

^ :rofl:


----------



## Badblood

Arnold said:


> Yeah, but I said ethical not prideful.


Ethics and pride are both a part of our self-image. "I'm beautiful, so I can get away with cheating, because I can always find somebody to love me". See what I mean?


----------



## Badblood

Oh, Jeez, I complained about thread-jacking, and here I am doing it myself. Duh!!! Sorry, Working. I have egg all over my face.


----------



## Arnold

:scratchhead::scratchhead:


Badblood said:


> Ethics and pride are both a part of our self-image. "I'm beautiful, so I can get away with cheating, because I can always find somebody to love me". See what I mean?


----------



## working_together

Badblood said:


> On the contrary, Arnold, a prideful person will easily fall prey to compliments and flattery. A person with a good sense of self-worth will not. And there is a HUGE difference between the two.


Like I have said previously...actually many times, I did not feel great about myself at the time. A person can be the most beautiful person on the outside, but down deep, dealing with many issues. I'm not sure where it comes from, I could say that during my marriage my husband was very critical of me, somewhat controling at times, or, I could say I grew up in a cold family where I didn't feel I was ever good enough, or that I was never praised for the good I did. Only during I/C will I get to the bottom of my issues.


----------



## Badblood

I hope you find the answers you seek, Working. I hope my wife does too. It's too late to save our marriage, but I want her to be happy in the future.


----------



## warlock07

badblood, has talking to working make you reconsider the stance on your marriage?


----------



## Badblood

warlock07 said:


> badblood, has talking to working make you reconsider the stance on your marriage?


Not really, Warlock. My wife's suicide attempt and hospitalization did, at first, but since then I'm pretty sure that when she has recovered enough to handle the stress and remorse of it, we will still divorce. I know all of the things posters (and family and friends) have said, and that it never was about sex or her feelings for me, per se, but her childhood and parental issues and the nature of her relationship with the OM (more like a pedophile father and daughter....pretty sick, huh?) but in the final analysis, I have to imagine what our future would be like, and it doesn't look too good to me. I think for BOTH of our sakes, divorce is the best answer.


----------



## warlock07

I won't thread jack further but what is your wife's race(ethnicity)?


----------



## Badblood

WE are both mixed. I'm Hispanic AFro-American (Cuban)/ white, and she is Black and Oriental (Korean). IDK what that has to do with anything?


----------



## warlock07

The pedophile father daughter thing made me think she was Asian some how. Don't ask me why.


----------



## Badblood

Well, her dad is 1/2 black and 1/2 Korean and her mom is all Korean. her Dad was terribly abusive, but not sexually abusive (at least not that I know of).


----------



## oaksthorne

working_together said:


> maybe it didn't come across correctly. I have been really stressed the last couple of days with the exposure, and was angry that she called me a wh0re, really stung hard.
> 
> What I meant about the "projecting" was that she was lashing out at us because she knows her husband will never change, and was trying to get my husband to see the same in me, like he should suffer even more. I obviously get she is pain, as I have seen this in my husband for 9 months now.
> 
> I understand what you say about feeling that as an OW you see yourself as a "better catch", I totally had those feelings, I used to think that he "upgraded" to a classy and more educated woman. Yeah, really I thought that, part of the justification, I certainly wasn't classy during the affair.


My H's OW is young enough to be my daughter( pretty unfair competition there), even recently he told me that he couldn't pass up the chance" to have a woman like that". It is the pain that just keeps on giving. The result is a marriage that is basically dead. I don't deserve this, I never did. I now know that my H prefers women, younger, thinner, shorter, sexier and a lot less honorable than I am, and no matter how often he tells me that he loves me, I just can't afford to believe him anymore. I am the default wife, the one he settled for when the good stuff was no longer safe to have. So I ask myself daily" Why are you still here", and the answer is that financially, I have to be . He knows this and it hurts him very much. It's no longer a relationship of which I am proud, and It will never be the same. The OW felt that she was better than I was. She went after my H to prove to me that she could get him ( even though I didn't know she existed) and she has proven that she could . She has proven to me that my Marriage was never what I thought it was. For my faithfulness and my love I was rewarded with betrayal and humiliation. A marriage I treasured has turned to ashes, so she could prove her prowess. She will go on to involve herself with other married men I am sure. She will continue to compete with older women ( she hates her mom and was abandoned by her dad). She probably will continue to feel superior to her victims. If she were hit by a bus tomorrow, the world would be a better place. There are far too many women out there who feel they are better than the unsuspecting wife. I am glad you are beginning to understand the damage that this attitude causes. Every contact with you will be hurtful to her, and she won't believe that you are at all sorry, no matter what you say. I wish you the best with your R.


----------



## sadcalifornian

warlock07 said:


> The pedophile father daughter thing made me think she was Asian some how. Don't ask me why.


The sad thing is that there was this report that 60% of adopted asian children are at one point or another sexually abused by their step parents. I personally suspect quite a few of them actually adopted them with the intent of abusing them from the beginning.


----------



## working_together

oaksthorne said:


> My H's OW is young enough to be my daughter( pretty unfair competition there), even recently he told me that he couldn't pass up the chance" to have a woman like that". It is the pain that just keeps on giving. The result is a marriage that is basically dead. I don't deserve this, I never did. I now know that my H prefers women, younger, thinner, shorter, sexier and a lot less honorable than I am, and no matter how often he tells me that he loves me, I just can't afford to believe him anymore. I am the default wife, the one he settled for when the good stuff was no longer safe to have. So I ask myself daily" Why are you still here", and the answer is that financially, I have to be . He knows this and it hurts him very much. It's no longer a relationship of which I am proud, and It will never be the same. The OW felt that she was better than I was. She went after my H to prove to me that she could get him ( even though I didn't know she existed) and she has proven that she could . She has proven to me that my Marriage was never what I thought it was. For my faithfulness and my love I was rewarded with betrayal and humiliation. A marriage I treasured has turned to ashes, so she could prove her prowess. She will go on to involve herself with other married men I am sure. She will continue to compete with older women ( she hates her mom and was abandoned by her dad). She probably will continue to feel superior to her victims. If she were hit by a bus tomorrow, the world would be a better place. There are far too many women out there who feel they are better than the unsuspecting wife. I am glad you are beginning to understand the damage that this attitude causes. Every contact with you will be hurtful to her, and she won't believe that you are at all sorry, no matter what you say. I wish you the best with your R.


I know that this won't help, but I'm sorry this happened to you, and I can hear the pain you are experiencing.

all the best


----------



## working_together

My husband warned me that this would happen after exposure. I feel like this will never end.

OM called me yesterday, I was so taken back I didn't know how to react, and I dealt with it poorly.

He called to say he was sorry for what he did. I should have just hung up, but on the other hand I wanted him to know that through our behavior with the affair that it caused such destruction to my husband. I told him that this was not about revenge (letter), that with therapy he needed to feel some sort of closure. That his wife needed to know the truth. He then said "your husband has a way with words", I said B. it was all the truth, and you knew it was going to have to come out eventually. At the end I asked him "what did you learn from all this?" It made me sick that he laughed and said " not to get caught". I knew he was "fishing" and so when he said that his marriage was over, and that after x-mas he was leaving, I said to him that since she hasn't kicked him out, it was time to work on his marriage, and repair the damage he has caused.

I know I should have not engaged in this conversation, and told hubby about the whole incident. He was angry, but said he knew he was going to call. I was shaking and crying and told him that I am not in contact with him, and could not believe that he would call after all these months. He told me he believed me, but also said part of him doesn't since I had lied so much during the affair. He then called the police, and explained that he felt like OM was harassing us. They told us there was nothing they could do at this point, and keep a record of the calls, and when it reaches about 50 calls a week, then they could issue a RO. I knew nothing was going to come from it when the officer asked my husband "why did you send his wife a letter", at that point it was a lost cause.

So today his wife will get another email from my husband telling her that her husband is still trying to contact me.

I feel like this is a setback to the work we are trying to do, hopefully we can get past this and continue to move forward.


----------



## working_together

Hubby told me that I have to deal with this and continue to feel shame, and the work will only happen when I take full responsibility for my actions. I agreed.


----------



## Almostrecovered

Definite no no working, as good as your intentions may have been, just ignore all attempts of contact by OM and inform your husband when he does
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## working_together

In retrospect, I think he called because he wanted to manipulate me into telling my husband to drop the legal case, and the fact that he had manipulated me in the past justified his reason for calling. I told him I would not discuss the issue. I don't think it was about "fishing", it was about getting sympathy, and I did not fall for that crap. But I should have hung up, and will in the future.

Done


----------



## Shaggy

working_together said:


> In retrospect, I think he called because he wanted to manipulate me into telling my husband to drop the legal case, and the fact that he had manipulated me in the past justified his reason for calling. I told him I would not discuss the issue. I don't think it was about "fishing", it was about getting sympathy, and I did not fall for that crap. But I should have hung up, and will in the future.
> 
> Done


He was also showing you and your husband that he won't listen to your asking him to stop contacting you. He was showing he does what he wants and that he can whenever he wants contact you and get you to respond.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Thor

working_together said:


> I feel like this is a setback to the work we are trying to do, hopefully we can get past this and continue to move forward.


I think it is part of the process. Your husband's reaction to you talking on the phone is not unexpected, but I would say don't beat yourself up too much. It sounds like you stayed on the phone with an honest intent, though now you interpret OM's motives as fishing.

What do you think about approaching your husband about you writing another NC letter? IDK, but perhaps this is a chance for some teambuilding with the two of you working together to get OM to stay away. It sounds like your husband is manning the guard towers alone, and perhaps he sees it as his mission to do so.


----------



## Badblood

Needless to say, Working, you must be very, very careful with this contact. If it continues, your husband is probably going to think the worst. After all , you DID sleep with this guy, right? Do you have caller ID? If it happens again, you let your husband answer it, if he isn't there, you don't answer it AT ALL. You must start to think in terms of the OM as the enemy. For example; What would you do if the OM came to your home while your husband was away? This OM is being very cunning, he is trying to wreck your marriage in the same way you wrecked his. By getting your husband to have doubts about your renewed faithfulness, and showing that you still choose to have contact with him. In essence, saying that you are choosing him (OM) over your husband just like you did before.


----------



## Badblood

BTW, if the OM should show up at your door, you lock it, refuse to speak to him, and call the police, telling them that you have a trespasser. He will leave and yoiu will have shown your husband that the "visit", was not your idea.


----------



## warlock07

After all the stuff that you spoke about here, I am disappointed Working. Was it sympathy or was it nostalgia? If there ever is a relapse, you know where it started.




> I wanted him to know that through our behavior with the affair that it caused such destruction to my husband.



Some closure i suppose.

Edit: 
Some part makes me think that he wants to get back together and is trying to manipulate any resentment you feel towards you husband(after he made you write the letter) to his advantage. He is trying to get back with you.Notice how he laughed about not getting caught. He was fishing if you are up to it. He succeeded at some level because you talked to him for sometime. Soon you might be discussing how you might make up with your respective spouses.After all, you two were the wayward spouses. See where this is leading.

BadBlood: See the similarities?


----------



## morituri

The next time POSOM calls, DO NOT engage him in any kind of talk or any listening. Simply pass the phone over to your husband. If your husband is not there, HANG UP! immediately and then tell your husband that he called and that you hung up on him once you recognized his voice. This is important for your husband because if he knows that you are strong enough to resist any efforts on the OM's part to communicate with you, his trust in you will become greater.


----------



## JustaJerk

NC means NC, whatever the circumstances. Honestly, I'd be furious you took his call and engaged him in conversation- [email protected]#$CKING FURIOUS!!!


----------



## Arnold

oaksthorne, the ow in your case sounds a lot like my XW when she was single. She made a habit if going after married men.
FWIW, she was horrible to live with, fixated on her looks with not a brain cell in her skull.
Even now, in her 40's she tries to compete with the 20 somethings and looks ridiculous. These womem are truly pathetic and boring.


----------



## Arnold

Holy smokes!!You engaged in a conversation with this guy? Yet another betrayal.


----------



## working_together

Badblood said:


> BTW, if the OM should show up at your door, you lock it, refuse to speak to him, and call the police, telling them that you have a trespasser. He will leave and yoiu will have shown your husband that the "visit", was not your idea.


I'm really worried she's going to come after me, she's already threatened me with a law suit. However, I'm not worried legally as in the Province I live in does not have any fault or whatever legal process this would fall under, and threatening my employer is mute, given that I left my employment due to the guilt and shame, and realization that I could not perform my duties properly. I am afraid that she is going to physically cause me harm. 

My husband has told me that if she shows up at the door, do not engage in any physical (duh, I'm a wimp), and call the police.

As for OM, yeah, no more answering the phone, private number came up, and hubby has the same private catagory because of work..confidentiality. So I assumed it was my husband. I told my husband to text me first, then call me.

I never thought I would be involved in this mess, and yeah, it's really sinking in the gravity of my actions.


----------



## working_together

Arnold said:


> Holy smokes!!You engaged in a conversation with this guy? Yet another betrayal.


Yeah, hubby was furious that I even stayed on the phone, I got lashed out for that. It was dumb, but it caught me off guard, I in no way ever wanted to have contact with him ever again. I almost got to the point of regretting the exposure given the back lash it has created for us. But I had to think of my husband, and support his decision at this time.


----------



## working_together

warlock07 said:


> After all the stuff that you spoke about here, I am disappointed Working. Was it sympathy or was it nostalgia? If there ever is a relapse, you know where it started.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Some closure i suppose.
> 
> Edit:
> Some part makes me think that he wants to get back together and is trying to manipulate any resentment you feel towards you husband(after he made you write the letter) to his advantage. He is trying to get back with you.Notice how he laughed about not getting caught. He was fishing if you are up to it. He succeeded at some level because you talked to him for sometime. Soon you might be discussing how you might make up with your respective spouses.After all, you two were the wayward spouses. See where this is leading.
> 
> BadBlood: See the similarities?


Yeah, i see your point, but I came forward with this information and I knew my husband would be angry with me, I was willing to take it, at this point it can't get any worse for me.

I don't know how clear I need to be, but I will never engage with OM no matter what type of manipulation he tries. It's done, my husband knows I am done, but he still has difficulty trusting me, and believing the truth. I get that.

And maybe you're right OM succeeded on some level at manipulating me yet once again, I stayed on the phone and listened to his pathetic excuses, and lack of remorse. I guess I felt bad for his wife that he is in no way remorseful for his actiions, and I wanted him to know that he needs to work on this with her. As sick as this sounds, I had good intentions.


----------



## morituri

WT, it's probably a safe bet to say that the POSOM will again try to contact you again, you know what to do (and what not to do). Keep a log of all the times he tries to contact you and report them immediately to your H so that he sees that you are not hiding anything from him.

Trust takes time to rebuild. Your actions, and not your words, are what your H is taking a look at to rebuild it.

I wish you and your H much success.


----------



## JustaJerk

> his pathetic excuses, and *lack of remorse*.


This guy sounds like a TOTAL d**chebag. If I were your husband, I'd be going crazy trying to wrap my head around what you found so enticing in this creep.



> And maybe you're right OM succeeded on some level at manipulating me yet once again, I stayed on the phone and listened to his pathetic excuses, and lack of remorse. I guess I felt bad for his wife that he is in no way remorseful for his actiions, and I wanted him to know that he needs to work on this with her. As sick as this sounds, I had good intentions.


Clearly, you need a lot of work on those boundery issues.


----------



## Darth Vader

JustaJerk said:


> This guy sounds like a TOTAL d**chebag. If I were your husband, I'd be going crazy trying to wrap my head around what you found so enticing in this creep.
> 
> 
> 
> Clearly, you need a lot of work on those boundery issues.


If I were her husband, I'd kick her ass out! End of story!


----------



## JustaJerk

By the way... how did you know he had done this before?


----------



## Beowulf

JustaJerk said:


> This guy sounds like a TOTAL d**chebag. If I were your husband, I'd be going crazy trying to wrap my head around what you found so enticing in this creep.
> 
> 
> 
> Clearly, you need a lot of work on those boundery issues.


Working,

Justa is right on the boundary issue. My wife had difficulty as well right after she ended her affair and it was only because I saw her learn from each mistake and misstep that I realized she was working toward her stated goal of breaking off all ties. If you show your husband that you made a mistake and learned from it by not continuing contact he will realize that you are a work in progress and the effort is there. It will get better as long as you are trying and there is always honesty between you and your husband.


----------



## working_together

JustaJerk said:


> NC means NC, whatever the circumstances. Honestly, I'd be furious you took his call and engaged him in conversation- [email protected]#$CKING FURIOUS!!!


I know I made a mistake in taking the call. Last night was complete hell, we were up until 4 in the morning, and with police thing, just complete hell.

He's barely talking to me right now, he's pretty disgusted with me even if I did tell him OM called, he yelled at me "I told you that ass hole was going to call you, what's it going to take for you to believe what I say?"

At one point during my crying, I told him that I really don't deserve him, and that he should just start a new life. He didn't like this and said "what? now you're going to use the pitty card on me?"

I have no idea how this will end, the legal issues will drag on and mean that we will be dealing with this for a while.


----------



## Arnold

Darth Vader said:


> If I were her husband, I'd kick her ass out! End of story!


That is how Badblood handle it and he is right.

I guess some of us can wrap our brais around an affair, since you had not yet witnessed your H's pain. But, having a rather intimate discussion re feelings on the cheating is beyond unsensitive, IMO. It is indicative of a huge character issue,perhaps lack of both empathy and appreciation for what was done. Absolutely astonishing that the contact was received so openly.


----------



## working_together

JustaJerk said:


> This guy sounds like a TOTAL d**chebag. If I were your husband, I'd be going crazy trying to wrap my head around what you found so enticing in this creep.
> 
> 
> 
> Clearly, you need a lot of work on those boundery issues.


My boundaries my be better with strangers, but clearly I got roped into OM's **** to a certain exten.

And yeah, hubby is freaking crazy with disbelief that I chose this creep of a moron, and has said to me on many occasions "the least you could have done was ****@d a high class lawyer"


----------



## JustaJerk

I can only imagine. When I read that post, I was like- WTF?!?!?!


----------



## JustaJerk

> I have no idea how this will end, the legal issues will drag on and mean that we will be dealing with this for a while.


Geez, *working*... and you were doing so well. I have to admit, I'm a bit disappointed myself.


----------



## Darth Vader

working_together said:


> My boundaries my be better with strangers, but clearly I got roped into OM's **** to a certain exten.
> 
> And yeah, hubby is freaking crazy with disbelief that I chose this creep of a moron, and has said to me on many occasions "the least you could have done was ****@d a high class lawyer"


To a certain extent? To choose to straddle this POS OM and ride him like a bucking bronco while totally rejecting your husband to his face by asking him to leave the house, is a certain extent? That's a total extent! Of course your hubby's gonna be freaking out how you chose OM, it's his right!

It looks like you're still minimizing what you've done to your husband, and your children!


----------



## pidge70

Darth Vader said:


> To a certain extent? To choose to straddle this POS OM and ride him like a bucking bronco while totally rejecting your husband to his face by asking him to leave the house, is a certain extent? That's a total extent! Of course your hubby's gonna be freaking out how you chose OM, it's his right!
> 
> It looks like you're still minimizing what you've done to your husband, and your children!


Wow, really?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Darth Vader

pidge70 said:


> Wow, really?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Of course she wasn't screwing the OM at the time she rejected her husband by telling him to leave, but, yes, she told her husband to leave the house when he confronted her about having an affair.


----------



## pidge70

Darth Vader said:


> Of course she wasn't screwing the OM at the time she rejected her husband by telling him to leave, but, yes, she told her husband to leave the house when he confronted her about having an affair.


I was being sarcastic. She is actively trying for help in her situation. Your post was uncalled for.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Darth Vader

pidge70 said:


> I was being sarcastic. She is actively trying for help in her situation. Your post was uncalled for.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


She's still minimizing, she can't minimize her actions. It shows disrepect towards her husband. 

It's like calling an affair a mistake. Affairs are not mistakes, they are intensionally done. You can accidently hit someone in a car and kill them, you can accidently fall down a fight of stairs and break limbs, (need I go on)? But you can't accidently trip, fall and accidently have sex with someone else, not possible!

Perhaps my post is uncalled for, maybe, however, so is her minimizing her affair!


----------



## Shaggy

Darth Vader said:


> Of course she wasn't screwing the OM at the time she rejected her husband by telling him to leave, but, yes, she told her husband to leave the house when he confronted her about having an affair.


I thought she kicked him out, and continued on with the affair for a time.


----------



## Darth Vader

Shaggy said:


> I thought she kicked him out, and continued on with the affair for a time.


She did.


----------



## oaksthorne

working_together said:


> I know that this won't help, but I'm sorry this happened to you, and I can hear the pain you are experiencing.
> 
> all the best


Thank you Working . It is so hard to get beyond this kind of pain, you will have to be very patient with him.


----------



## adv

working_together said:


> My husband warned me that this would happen after exposure. I feel like this will never end.
> 
> OM called me yesterday, I was so taken back I didn't know how to react, and I dealt with it poorly.
> 
> He called to say he was sorry for what he did. I should have just hung up, but on the other hand I wanted him to know that through our behavior with the affair that it caused such destruction to my husband. I told him that this was not about revenge (letter), that with therapy he needed to feel some sort of closure. That his wife needed to know the truth. He then said "your husband has a way with words", I said B. it was all the truth, and you knew it was going to have to come out eventually. At the end I asked him "what did you learn from all this?" It made me sick that he laughed and said " not to get caught". I knew he was "fishing" and so when he said that his marriage was over, and that after x-mas he was leaving, I said to him that since she hasn't kicked him out, it was time to work on his marriage, and repair the damage he has caused.
> 
> I know I should have not engaged in this conversation, and told hubby about the whole incident. He was angry, but said he knew he was going to call. I was shaking and crying and told him that I am not in contact with him, and could not believe that he would call after all these months. He told me he believed me, but also said part of him doesn't since I had lied so much during the affair. He then called the police, and explained that he felt like OM was harassing us. They told us there was nothing they could do at this point, and keep a record of the calls, and when it reaches about 50 calls a week, then they could issue a RO. I knew nothing was going to come from it when the officer asked my husband "why did you send his wife a letter", at that point it was a lost cause.
> 
> So today his wife will get another email from my husband telling her that her husband is still trying to contact me.
> 
> I feel like this is a setback to the work we are trying to do, hopefully we can get past this and continue to move forward.


Please let his wife know that he called and his response to your question was "not to get caught". She deserves so much better.


----------



## oaksthorne

Arnold said:


> oaksthorne, the ow in your case sounds a lot like my XW when she was single. She made a habit if going after married men.
> FWIW, she was horrible to live with, fixated on her looks with not a brain cell in her skull.
> Even now, in her 40's she tries to compete with the 20 somethings and looks ridiculous. These womem are truly pathetic and boring.


This woman is married and started hitting on my H as soon as she got to know him, he wore a big fat wedding ring. He is a middle aged man and she is a fox. I didn't have a chance when my H decide that she was " a poor confused child" that needed his sympathy ( she was ranking on her H to him). For some mysterious reason he also decided not to tell me anything about her, or the fact the she was offering to pay for hotel rooms. She continued to chase him until about 6 months ago. He no longer wares that ring, I can't bare to look at it, I bought it for him. Women like this are all too common, and it seems that men think that if a woman looks like an angel, she is one. If I had my life to live again, I'd probably remain single.


----------



## Badblood

Working, I snicerely hope that you are telling the truth to your husband , and also to us (though I admit that it couldn't sound much worse as to your part in this mess) because I really want to help you and for you to truly understand what you have done and just maybe gain some empathy and integrity from it. Do you have any, I mean ANY feelings for the OM, NOW? We cannot give you good advice, if you are being deceitful.


----------



## Badblood

BTW, saying to your husband that,"he deserves better, and for him to start a new life". Is just a platitude and cop-out. What he HEARD, when you said it, was that you were being selfish again, and that you are unwilling to do the hard work it takes to reconcile. The pity card. Read my last few posts, to see how to handle if the OM tries to contact you again. LET YOUR HUSBAND HANDLE HIM FROM NOW ON. YOU STAY OUT OF IT. The more you are involved, the more your husband will think you still have feelings for the OM.


----------



## Arnold

oaksthorne said:


> This woman is married and started hitting on my H as soon as she got to know him, he wore a big fat wedding ring. He is a middle aged man and she is a fox. I didn't have a chance when my H decide that she was " a poor confused child" that needed his sympathy ( she was ranking on her H to him). For some mysterious reason he also decided not to tell me anything about her, or the fact the she was offering to pay for hotel rooms. She continued to chase him until about 6 months ago. He no longer wares that ring, I can't bare to look at it, I bought it for him. Women like this are all too common, and it seems that men think that if a woman looks like an angel, she is one. If I had my life to live again, I'd probably remain single.


Without a doubt, my XW's motivationwas the competition she felt with other women. She is very good looking, but, on some level she realizes how deficient she is as a human being, lacking common dcency and empathy.
So, my XW would pursue older, unavailable(supposedly) married men like your H. Beleive it or not, on some level she knew that she could not really compete with women her won age, despite her looks, as she was/is so ugly inside.


----------



## oaksthorne

Arnold said:


> Without a doubt, my XW's motivationwas the competition she felt with other women. She is very good looking, but, on some level she realizes how deficient she is as a human being, lacking common dcency and empathy.
> So, my XW would pursue older, unavailable(supposedly) married men like your H. Beleive it or not, on some level she knew that she could not really compete with women her won age, despite her looks, as she was/is so ugly inside.


This woman also complained to my H that other women didn't like her. jeeze, I wonder why? It's a a Joleen type of woman who gets a bang out of seducing married men. Us loyal dumb ass types who have complete faith in our husbands are sitting ducks for these predators, and for silly h****y H's who feel over the hill.


----------



## warlock07

I believe the husband was more pissed off at how easy it was for the OM to make you talk to him. You were giving him advice?

**FACEPALM**


----------



## working_together

So things have calmed down after a couple of rough days.

I have always told the truth during my posts, and I have listened to all the advice here, and taken most of it seriously. I came here as hard as it was to seek help.

My husband has read all the replys here from the beginning,and has always told me that the forum seems like a great place for me to get the support I need. My husband realizes that yes, I was caught off guard when OM called, but has told me that HE needs to deal with the situation now, and that I need to stay out of it. This means that when OM calls, I hang up, log the call, when he shows up at the door, I do not answer, but call police, then call him to let him know what is going on.

To answer any doubts of whether I have any lingering feelings for OM, the answer is NO, my answers to him on the phone were designed to let him know that I do not want him, he and I made a horrible choice to engage in an affair, and I am back with my husband and will remain committed to repairing my marriage.

I can see that It may have come accross that I may have had some left over feelings for him, but it was not my intention, and basically it was away for me to take back a bit of control that I did not have during our brief affair.

My husband has seen me over the last week break down on several occasions, and has not felt sorry for me, but has told me that I need to face this in order for our marriage to work and be successful. Hubby told me only then the healing will begin.

My husband is not angry that I took the call, he's angry that he had told me that OM would call, yet I said I was caught off guard when he did call. That even though my conversation with OM was cold, it was that I had discussed with him to repair his own marriage, he said "you didn't give a sh*t about it before why do you care now".


----------



## working_together

Badblood said:


> Needless to say, Working, you must be very, very careful with this contact. If it continues, your husband is probably going to think the worst. After all , you DID sleep with this guy, right? Do you have caller ID? If it happens again, you let your husband answer it, if he isn't there, you don't answer it AT ALL. You must start to think in terms of the OM as the enemy. For example; What would you do if the OM came to your home while your husband was away? This OM is being very cunning, he is trying to wreck your marriage in the same way you wrecked his. By getting your husband to have doubts about your renewed faithfulness, and showing that you still choose to have contact with him. In essence, saying that you are choosing him (OM) over your husband just like you did before.


My husband read your comment and agrees completly and feels this way.


----------



## Almostrecovered

Your hubby is a smart man, if he ever posts here his name should be gotit_together
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## working_together

JustaJerk said:


> By the way... how did you know he had done this before?


He admitted it to my husband and I.


----------



## joe kidd

The OM tried to fish with Pidge last Jan. He texted her about hooking up again. She texted back F*CK OFF and changed her number. I guess he got the message. Hope it all works out for you WT.


----------



## working_together

Darth Vader said:


> She's still minimizing, she can't minimize her actions. It shows disrepect towards her husband.
> 
> It's like calling an affair a mistake. Affairs are not mistakes, they are intensionally done. You can accidently hit someone in a car and kill them, you can accidently fall down a fight of stairs and break limbs, (need I go on)? But you can't accidently trip, fall and accidently have sex with someone else, not possible!
> 
> Perhaps my post is uncalled for, maybe, however, so is her minimizing her affair!


My husband says the same thing, "you can't fall on someone multiple times and call it a mistake"


----------



## joe kidd

working_together said:


> My husband says the same thing, "you can't fall on someone multiple times and call it a mistake"


And he is right. No mistake... horrible decision? Yes. But no mistake.


----------



## working_together

Last night I took my older son out for dinner in order to spend some quality time with him, and apologized to him for all that I have done to him. He told me that it was hard for him during that time, he felt like he was in the middle of our problems. Again, I apologized. We have always had a great relationship, and I want to make amends to him now as well.


----------



## JustaJerk

> He admitted it to my husband and I.


I don't get it??? You mean he told you guys this free willingly. I suppose this was _after the fact_, right?

What was he hoping to get out of telling you guys this- a [email protected]#$ING medal.:scratchhead:


----------



## Badblood

working_together said:


> My husband read your comment and agrees completly and feels this way.


Contrary to the opinions of SOME posters, I frequently know what I'm talking about. I think that my main problem is my Marine background, I tend to be much more direct and factual, than emotional and moralistic. So I tell posters what my take on their story is, no holds barred. If you want sympathy, talk to the Chaplin, if you want concrete answers, I will do my best to help.


----------



## Badblood

working_together said:


> So things have calmed down after a couple of rough days.
> 
> I have always told the truth during my posts, and I have listened to all the advice here, and taken most of it seriously. I came here as hard as it was to seek help.
> 
> My husband has read all the replys here from the beginning,and has always told me that the forum seems like a great place for me to get the support I need. My husband realizes that yes, I was caught off guard when OM called, but has told me that HE needs to deal with the situation now, and that I need to stay out of it. This means that when OM calls, I hang up, log the call, when he shows up at the door, I do not answer, but call police, then call him to let him know what is going on.
> 
> To answer any doubts of whether I have any lingering feelings for OM, the answer is NO, my answers to him on the phone were designed to let him know that I do not want him, he and I made a horrible choice to engage in an affair, and I am back with my husband and will remain committed to repairing my marriage.
> 
> I can see that It may have come accross that I may have had some left over feelings for him, but it was not my intention, and basically it was away for me to take back a bit of control that I did not have during our brief affair.
> 
> My husband has seen me over the last week break down on several occasions, and has not felt sorry for me, but has told me that I need to face this in order for our marriage to work and be successful. Hubby told me only then the healing will begin.
> 
> My husband is not angry that I took the call, he's angry that he had told me that OM would call, yet I said I was caught off guard when he did call. That even though my conversation with OM was cold, it was that I had discussed with him to repair his own marriage, he said "you didn't give a sh*t about it before why do you care now".


Thanks, Working for the explanation. BTW, you really DO have a hero, in your husband, and I hope you realize it and cherish him like he deserves.


----------



## cb45

i tried to skim yer history Working_Together (the OP) but couldnt find the info i needed.

namely, how often were u with this guy, both sexually n o/wise?

what did this guy offer u, or give u yer H did not? both PA,
and EA-"wise"?

did u plan to leave yer H?

are u two in MC, IC, or other therapy now?

do u realize theres a good chance u wanted to get caught llike many a poor soul here who is "crying out inside desparately seeking to be heard?" this aspect must be dealt with if MC,
IC et al, is going to work out, long term.

Tks W_T!


----------



## Darth Vader

working_together said:


> My husband says the same thing, "you can't fall on someone multiple times and call it a mistake"


At least she's listening...... You realize lady, your husband could wake up one day and say forget the marriage and drop kick you out of the house? May happen tomorrow, or twenty years from now...... _Don't shake your head at this, it has happened._ Your husband always has that right! I can only imagine that this will never occur again! As there was no _excuse_ for it to happen in the first place! I sure your husband agrees!

To the husband, since he's reading: Realize you don't have to take this crap from your wife, it amazes me that you would even consider taking her back after her humiliating and disrespecting you as well as throwing you out of your own house so she could continue dumping on and hurting you and your family by screwing someone else who is a predator (doesn't matter if he was, he didn't act alone), personally, it'd be a complete deal beaker with me, and had it been me, I would've drop kicked her ass out long ago! That's me! Just Remember, you have no real obligation to what you call a marriage, you can drop her at any time, you do deserve a lot better than what's been dealt to you against your will. Your wife (for now) doesn't know what she's got!


----------



## working_together

My husband has told me that he needs to go back to I/C to deal with how he is managing his anger. I have been really listening to him the last couple of days, probably for the first time. He has been calm with few outbursts, and I can really hear what he is saying now. I've known my husband for 25 years, and know that when he demonstrates this type of anger it stems from his deep hurt, perhaps I was not seeing it as clearly as I should have, I should have not become defensive because I felt constantly attacked. It made a bad situation worse. With my defensiveness, he would only get more angry and lash out at me. I'm shutting up now, not interupting, not justifying, not blame shifting, the works.

He's fully expressing his pain, and hurt, and leaving out the attacks, and for that I am grateful. His real hurt stems from the fact that I was so willing to "throw him out" for someone else. How could I do that to him, he constantly wonders. He wonders if the OM would have been more mentally stable, successful etc. would I have wanted to R. He wonders if he's "second best", and for him this really stings. He wonders how I could lower myself to the point of caring about such a POS, when there was a great man right at home. In the end he felt and still feels like he doesn't matter.

With OM calling last week, it really set us back in terms of beginning to move forward. We're back to square one. My defensiveness and justification for even taking the call infuriated him, and I understand that better now. His reaction was "and now you're counseling this ass hole", for him it still showed that I had feelings for the other person, and was continuing to place him second, and it's true, it did look that way, I didn't see it then.

Sooooo, to end, I will say that my ACTIONS now are one of the most telling signs of how remorseful I really am, how much I really love him, and whether I want this marriage to survive after the horrific things I have done to him.

Time will tell.

ps. thanks to all who have shown me to "get over myself", and call me on my bull [email protected], it was very humbling.


----------



## COguy

Working, your attitude is awesome. So many times my wife gets upset that she thinks she's not doing the right things or that I think she's a screw up. The most important thing to me is that she has the right attitude. You know you screwed up, you're doing what it takes to make things right.

Humility, empathy, patience, self-reflection. You're husband is going to look back when the pain resides, and thank you for how you handled everything. As I said earlier, everyone makes mistakes, how you deal with them is more telling of your character.

Do not get discouraged by the setbacks, have hope in your marriage and pride in your character.


----------



## morituri

It's good that your husband has recognized that he needs help in order to healthily process the affair and to heal from it. I hope that he truly commits himself to the task of following his therapist's recommendations. I also hope that you will seek out a therapist to help you address and resolve the issues that made you weak in choosing to betray your husband.


----------



## oaksthorne

working_together said:


> My husband has told me that he needs to go back to I/C to deal with how he is managing his anger. I have been really listening to him the last couple of days, probably for the first time. He has been calm with few outbursts, and I can really hear what he is saying now. I've known my husband for 25 years, and know that when he demonstrates this type of anger it stems from his deep hurt, perhaps I was not seeing it as clearly as I should have, I should have not become defensive because I felt constantly attacked. It made a bad situation worse. With my defensiveness, he would only get more angry and lash out at me. I'm shutting up now, not interupting, not justifying, not blame shifting, the works.
> 
> He's fully expressing his pain, and hurt, and leaving out the attacks, and for that I am grateful. His real hurt stems from the fact that I was so willing to "throw him out" for someone else. How could I do that to him, he constantly wonders. He wonders if the OM would have been more mentally stable, successful etc. would I have wanted to R. He wonders if he's "second best", and for him this really stings. He wonders how I could lower myself to the point of caring about such a POS, when there was a great man right at home. In the end he felt and still feels like he doesn't matter.
> 
> With OM calling last week, it really set us back in terms of beginning to move forward. We're back to square one. My defensiveness and justification for even taking the call infuriated him, and I understand that better now. His reaction was "and now you're counseling this ass hole", for him it still showed that I had feelings for the other person, and was continuing to place him second, and it's true, it did look that way, I didn't see it then.
> 
> Sooooo, to end, I will say that my ACTIONS now are one of the most telling signs of how remorseful I really am, how much I really love him, and whether I want this marriage to survive after the horrific things I have done to him.
> 
> Time will tell.
> 
> ps. thanks to all who have shown me to "get over myself", and call me on my bull [email protected], it was very humbling.


My H has taken your view of things and it has made all the difference in our ability to work on a R. The hurt that the BS feels is the worst thing any of us are likely to deal with, short of a terminal illness and the pain of it must be expressed. Hang in there with him, he needs your help and patience. Again best wishes to you.


----------



## Badblood

working_together said:


> My husband has told me that he needs to go back to I/C to deal with how he is managing his anger. I have been really listening to him the last couple of days, probably for the first time. He has been calm with few outbursts, and I can really hear what he is saying now. I've known my husband for 25 years, and know that when he demonstrates this type of anger it stems from his deep hurt, perhaps I was not seeing it as clearly as I should have, I should have not become defensive because I felt constantly attacked. It made a bad situation worse. With my defensiveness, he would only get more angry and lash out at me. I'm shutting up now, not interupting, not justifying, not blame shifting, the works.
> 
> He's fully expressing his pain, and hurt, and leaving out the attacks, and for that I am grateful. His real hurt stems from the fact that I was so willing to "throw him out" for someone else. How could I do that to him, he constantly wonders. He wonders if the OM would have been more mentally stable, successful etc. would I have wanted to R. He wonders if he's "second best", and for him this really stings. He wonders how I could lower myself to the point of caring about such a POS, when there was a great man right at home. In the end he felt and still feels like he doesn't matter.
> 
> With OM calling last week, it really set us back in terms of beginning to move forward. We're back to square one. My defensiveness and justification for even taking the call infuriated him, and I understand that better now. His reaction was "and now you're counseling this ass hole", for him it still showed that I had feelings for the other person, and was continuing to place him second, and it's true, it did look that way, I didn't see it then.
> 
> Sooooo, to end, I will say that my ACTIONS now are one of the most telling signs of how remorseful I really am, how much I really love him, and whether I want this marriage to survive after the horrific things I have done to him.
> 
> Time will tell.
> 
> ps. thanks to all who have shown me to "get over myself", and call me on my bull [email protected], it was very humbling.


 So, Working, how do you feel about his questions? Is he "second best",? In your heart, in your mind, in your bed? And if he is FIRST now, then how do you explain making him second best, during the affair? This has always seemed to me to be the main problem you have. Lots of WS's have had affairs, but you actually chose the OM over your husband, and did it in a very humiliating way. I will be frank in saying that I could never in a million years, have anything like a good relationship, with a woman , who had done this to me. I do wish you the best, but I think you are going to have a HUGE struggle getting over this issue. I really wish your husband would come to TAM so I could try to understand his mindset. AT times , he will "man-up", like when he confronted the OM, but at other times he seems a bit of a doormat, like allowing you to kick him out of his own home.


----------



## warlock07

I think every question that he asked was touched upon in your thread in one form or the other. Remember that there will be more bad days when you feel like giving up. Just recognize them early on so that you can tackle them appropriately.


----------



## morituri

Badblood said:


> So, Working, how do you feel about his questions? Is he "second best",? In your heart, in your mind, in your bed? And if he is FIRST now, then how do you explain making him second best, during the affair? This has always seemed to me to be the main problem you have. Lots of WS's have had affairs, but you actually chose the OM over your husband, and did it in a very humiliating way. I will be frank in saying that I could never in a million years, have anything like a good relationship, with a woman , who had done this to me. I do wish you the best, but I think you are going to have a HUGE struggle getting over this issue. I really wish your husband would come to TAM so I could try to understand his mindset. AT times , he will "man-up", like when he confronted the OM, but at other times he seems a bit of a doormat, like allowing you to kick him out of his own home.


Didn't you say that she was a troll and that you would no longer post comments on her thread? :scratchhead:


----------



## Badblood

Didn't I apologize and am trying to be more constructive?


----------



## morituri

I knew that outside that tough marine exterior there was a softie


----------



## Badblood

Shut the eff up, Mori. LOL


----------



## Badblood

To be fair, I think that one of the things Working..Together has already done, will go a long way to proving to her husband that he, not the OM, is FIRST. By standing by, and submitting to her husband's handling of the OM and taking no part in it, she is SHOWING where her head is at, and maybe not now, but in the future, her husband will realize that. These are the kind of things she needs to be doing always, and weathering the storm.


----------



## working_together

morituri said:


> Didn't you say that she was a troll and that you would no longer post comments on her thread? :scratchhead:


So Bad? are we good now? truce?


----------



## working_together

Badblood said:


> Shut the eff up, Mori. LOL


----------



## working_together

Badblood said:


> So, Working, how do you feel about his questions? Is he "second best",? In your heart, in your mind, in your bed? And if he is FIRST now, then how do you explain making him second best, during the affair? This has always seemed to me to be the main problem you have. Lots of WS's have had affairs, but you actually chose the OM over your husband, and did it in a very humiliating way. I will be frank in saying that I could never in a million years, have anything like a good relationship, with a woman , who had done this to me. I do wish you the best, but I think you are going to have a HUGE struggle getting over this issue. I really wish your husband would come to TAM so I could try to understand his mindset. AT times , he will "man-up", like when he confronted the OM, but at other times he seems a bit of a doormat, like allowing you to kick him out of his own home.


Yeah, I'm working on why I made him "second best", and why the eff did I not care at all at the time. He asks me the same question all the time, and I can't answer it, honestly I don't know why he was second best at the time, I don't know why I chose so easily to give up on a 25 year relationship. I have to work through my issues to understand why I did that to a man I love. I agree that's my big struggle right now.

grrrr, you always get me with the hard questions.....lol


----------



## Badblood

working_together said:


> Yeah, I'm working on why I made him "second best", and why the eff did I not care at all at the time. He asks me the same question all the time, and I can't answer it, honestly I don't know why he was second best at the time, I don't know why I chose so easily to give up on a 25 year relationship. I have to work through my issues to understand why I did that to a man I love. I agree that's my big struggle right now.
> 
> grrrr, you always get me with the hard questions.....lol


I really don't mean to, but they are questions I have at the time. One thing. Was the OM better sexually? This could explain a lot, if true. If not true, then IDK........maybe we should just punt.:scratchhead:


----------



## Badblood

BTW, it's a question I asked my wife, and again during her Polygraph, and she emphatically said NO!!! both times and asked me how I could even think of such a thing. Well Duh!!


----------



## Badblood

working_together said:


> So Bad? are we good now? truce?


Of course we are, Working. Wanna smooch?


----------



## warlock07

I think her husband will mind a bit


----------



## working_together

Badblood said:


> I really don't mean to, but they are questions I have at the time. One thing. Was the OM better sexually? This could explain a lot, if true. If not true, then IDK........maybe we should just punt.:scratchhead:


Sexually speaking, the OM was not better, I was effed up with all the emotional stuff going on, and brought those feelings with me when we had sex. He was passive, while my husband was more the aggressive type of lover. It was a strange dynamic I had with OM, I was the one with the power, I asked for what I wanted, and he always felt like he couldn't satisfy me enough. 

With my husband, sex is completely different now than prior to my affair. I was passive, and now it is more equal. What I love now, is that my hubby is more eager to please me and make sure I am happy with out sex life. Hysterical bonding? probably a bit, afraid that if our sex life goes sour will I find someone new? a lot. But in the end I tell him that I am happy with that area of our life, and that it was NEVER the reason I sought out an affair.

I iniate most of the time now, where as before never. I know he is afraid I will reject him if he iniates, just like I did with my affair. We'll continue to work on this, and once he sees that I am placing him first in every aspect of my life, he will feel better iniating sex.

I think I did one of my rambling on not making sense messages. Hope I answered the question.


----------



## working_together

Badblood said:


> BTW, it's a question I asked my wife, and again during her Polygraph, and she emphatically said NO!!! both times and asked me how I could even think of such a thing. Well Duh!!


I don't think anyone will say that the sex was better with the affair partner, it's the feeling of being desired, adored,all the emotional stuff the person is feeding you that fools you into believing that.


----------



## working_together

Badblood said:


> Of course we are, Working. Wanna smooch?


How about a game of pool? I'll beat the crap out of you and you know it. lol


----------



## Dexter Morgan

working_together said:


> What would be the reason to do it at this point?????


Because the fact that you and the OM boned each other pissed him off. No other reason really. He wants payback.


----------



## Badblood

My grandad was Willie Mosconi, you haven't got a chance in hell. I'm lying.


----------



## Almostrecovered

My grandad was Minnesota Fats

okay he wasn't but he was fat


----------



## working_together

The last couple of days I have been thinking about if my husband has been a "doormat". He hasn't come out and said it, but yeah, he says he's felt like a total fool. He's been "tough" on me during R. and hasn't really let anything slip by, he calls me on my [email protected] when he thinks I'm explaining things away, or justifying behaviors. 

I don't see him as a doormat, my husband has always been the type of person who has a tough exterier, but has a great heart. He's in your face when he doesn't feel respected by others, but at the same time, he works with mentally ill patients every day, and has shown great compassion and patience to these people, and will go out of his way to help them. If he gets a suicide call, he's there in a flash, and is willing to risk his own life to save the person. 

My point is that he has been like that with me, he will do anything for me as long as it makes me happy, he says it's because of his love for me. I haven't always been there for him the same way. He has always put up with a lot of my crap, and now the difference is that he is NOT, and that for me is not a doormat. He's changed a lot through this affair, and I have to say I respect him a lot more now than prior to the affair.


----------



## Badblood

working_together said:


> The last couple of days I have been thinking about if my husband has been a "doormat". He hasn't come out and said it, but yeah, he says he's felt like a total fool. He's been "tough" on me during R. and hasn't really let anything slip by, he calls me on my [email protected] when he thinks I'm explaining things away, or justifying behaviors.
> 
> I don't see him as a doormat, my husband has always been the type of person who has a tough exterier, but has a great heart. He's in your face when he doesn't feel respected by others, but at the same time, he works with mentally ill patients every day, and has shown great compassion and patience to these people, and will go out of his way to help them. If he gets a suicide call, he's there in a flash, and is willing to risk his own life to save the person.
> 
> My point is that he has been like that with me, he will do anything for me as long as it makes me happy, he says it's because of his love for me. I haven't always been there for him the same way. He has always put up with a lot of my crap, and now the difference is that he is NOT, and that for me is not a doormat. He's changed a lot through this affair, and I have to say I respect him a lot more now than prior to the affair.


This is a very good thing, Working. It shows that you are beginning to try to understand and have respect for your husband and his position. In your first posts, you were completely self-absorbed, but now you seem to "get it". Maybe it was some leftover "fog", but you are really changed from those first posts. Your attitude is better, and your concern is much more apparant. Your husband is , by no means, a doormat. He has shown you that he can be strong AND loving, so if you show the same, I predict recovery.


----------



## Jellybeans

I haven't been reading your thread lately Working but am glad to see you and your husband working it out. Keep on with the keep on.


----------



## working_together

I have a question????

I was going to post a new thread, but it might be confusing, so leaving it here.

My former employer called yesterday and asked if I would be interested in picking up a few shifts. Sounded fine initially, but then realized that during my affair I used to text and talk to OM quite a bit while at work (over nights esp.). I also lied about going to work on two occasions in order to meet up with OM. 

I think I know the answer as this is a HUGE trigger for hubby, and I just don't want to eff things up anymore. Jobs are scarce, and yeah, we aren't rich, but we're surviving on his salary. At this point he doesn't really want me to work because of his trust issues with me and interacting with the opposite sex. On the other hand I need to feel productive and self-sufficient. 

Is it worth it? Should I just let things settle down for a while? then talk to him more about it?


----------



## Dadof3

I realize it would potentially be a huge trigger for him, however, I think he would appreciate more that you gave him a chance to consider it, even with all that has happened, and have some input on this. Be open about this news, and if he is willing to consider it, tell him your plan on how you will be transparent on the job. 

You are right. You need something to stay busy, and he doesn't want to have to feel like a prison warden either. I'm sure you both can negotiate this out.


----------



## Yardman

I think you should talk to him about it.


----------



## SadSamIAm

I would be pissed if my wife asked an internet forum something like this rather than talking to me about it.


----------



## Almostrecovered

SadSamIAm said:


> I would be pissed if my wife asked an internet forum something like this rather than talking to me about it.


??

She's asking other betrayed spouses as to how they would feel, how is this a bad thing?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## working_together

SadSamIAm said:


> I would be pissed if my wife asked an internet forum something like this rather than talking to me about it.


Of course i asked him last night. We didn't talk too much about it, as it kind of triggered him. We'll be discussing it again, I was just posting the question to see what BS's thought.


----------



## COguy

SadSamIAm said:


> I would be pissed if my wife asked an internet forum something like this rather than talking to me about it.


I'd be pissed if my WW did something insensitive. She's getting advice on how to approach, not rugsweeping.


----------



## SadSamIAm

Sorry, I didn't know you asked him. I would leave the decision up to him. I don't think that the 'triggers' would be the same for everyone. While one BS might be really bothered by this, another might not have an issue. Only your husband can tell you how big of a trigger this would be 'for him'.


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## Badblood

This is a toughie, no doubt. I can understand your need/desire to feel useful and productive, but at this point do you really want to present a self-sufficient persona to your husband? Remembering that it was selfishness and disconnection that got you into this mess, in the first place? I wouln't chance it, because of the triggers, UNLESS you can still be completely transparent (to your husband's satisfaction) while doing so. Would the risk of setting back your R be worth it?


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## working_together

So, we've had a few conversations about it, but it also has led to some arguements. I said to him that "no, I don't think it's a good idea right now, why don't we think about it in the new year, and focus on chistmas?" He responded that he does not feel good about the idea of me going back there, but also said "I'll have to eventually deal with you going back to work, and it will trigger me now, in 6 months, and probably in 5 years, no matter where you work", then added "do what you want to do, you always do anyway, take the shifts". Grrr, I was getting fed up with the "damn if you do, damn if you don't thinking", basically at this point there are way too many triggers going on, and we have to shelve the idea for a while, and I'm fine with it. Sometimes I just wish he'd say a definate "NO, I'm not ok with it right now", but all the other stuff comes into play, and we get testy with each other.

Good times.


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## working_together

I'm wondering how I am to be transparent at work? I would be away for a shift and how is he going to believe me that I am at work?

Yes, he can call me on my cell, text me, I would always answer, but is this enough? He's not really able to come by for a visit since it's a woman's shelter for DV.


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## Almostrecovered

Some employers hand out a schedule
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Almostrecovered

You can also activate a gps on your phone
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Beowulf

Almostrecovered said:


> You can also activate a gps on your phone
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


That is a great idea Almost.

BTW, your H's comment about you going to work THERE made me wonder if someone at work helped you cover up the A. If that is the case then I would NEVER consider going back to work there ever again. It certainly sounds like your former employer is a huge trigger for your H. You should respect his feelings about that.

As far as him saying "do what you want, you always do anyway." That makes me wonder HOW you approached him about this. Did you say "honey, my former employer called looking to see if I could work for them again. I know we could use the money but we've come so far in our R that I'm extremely worried about going back there. What do you think?"

Or did you say "my former employer called asking if I could come back to work. You know we need the money so I told him I would. Is that okay?"

If you said it more like the second way then it might have seemed to him that you were putting him on the spot. That isn't a very good approach IMO.


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## Badblood

Beowulf has a good point. Sometimes it's as much to do with the why you phrase something, as it is with the content. Maybe you should just change jobs? Is any job worth your marriage? Tell your husband that it isn't the job, by itself, but that you want to feel useful and helping the team.


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## working_together

Beowulf said:


> That is a great idea Almost.
> 
> BTW, your H's comment about you going to work THERE made me wonder if someone at work helped you cover up the A. If that is the case then I would NEVER consider going back to work there ever again. It certainly sounds like your former employer is a huge trigger for your H. You should respect his feelings about that.
> 
> As far as him saying "do what you want, you always do anyway." That makes me wonder HOW you approached him about this. Did you say "honey, my former employer called looking to see if I could work for them again. I know we could use the money but we've come so far in our R that I'm extremely worried about going back there. What do you think?"
> 
> Or did you say "my former employer called asking if I could come back to work. You know we need the money so I told him I would. Is that okay?"
> 
> If you said it more like the second way then it might have seemed to him that you were putting him on the spot. That isn't a very good approach IMO.


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## working_together

Beowulf said:


> That is a great idea Almost.
> 
> BTW, your H's comment about you going to work THERE made me wonder if someone at work helped you cover up the A. If that is the case then I would NEVER consider going back to work there ever again. It certainly sounds like your former employer is a huge trigger for your H. You should respect his feelings about that.
> 
> As far as him saying "do what you want, you always do anyway." That makes me wonder HOW you approached him about this. Did you say "honey, my former employer called looking to see if I could work for them again. I know we could use the money but we've come so far in our R that I'm extremely worried about going back there. What do you think?"
> 
> Or did you say "my former employer called asking if I could come back to work. You know we need the money so I told him I would. Is that okay?"
> 
> If you said it more like the second way then it might have seemed to him that you were putting him on the spot. That isn't a very good approach IMO.


Grrrr, I hate that you guys seem to know me now, ok, ok, it was more along the lines of the second one. I have a habit of doing that, asking him his opinion or his input, then go ahead and make my own decision.

You guys really keep me on track tho, appreciate that.


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## working_together

Almostrecovered said:


> You can also activate a gps on your phone
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I will do this.


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## working_together

Beowulf said:


> That is a great idea Almost.
> 
> BTW, your H's comment about you going to work THERE made me wonder if someone at work helped you cover up the A. If that is the case then I would NEVER consider going back to work there ever again. It certainly sounds like your former employer is a huge trigger for your H. You should respect his feelings about that.
> 
> As far as him saying "do what you want, you always do anyway." That makes me wonder HOW you approached him about this. Did you say "honey, my former employer called looking to see if I could work for them again. I know we could use the money but we've come so far in our R that I'm extremely worried about going back there. What do you think?"
> 
> Or did you say "my former employer called asking if I could come back to work. You know we need the money so I told him I would. Is that okay?"
> 
> If you said it more like the second way then it might have seemed to him that you were putting him on the spot. That isn't a very good approach IMO.


No one at my work knew of my affair, they knew I was having marriage troubles, I had cancelled a few shifts etc. No one knew of my affair except one person (while it was going on). I did not involved anyone. I had a bad situation with an ex-friend who lied to her husband of her whereabouts, and told him she was at my house....but she did not inform me....friendship was done. It's funny I had morals back then.


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## [email protected]

Im an amateur noetic scientist, and i've come to the conclusion, the only way your husband will regain his personality and strenght is true genuine love and desire, but not from you another woman or two. And if you can sit back relax and be patient while he test the waters, if he comes back, he's all yours. There is a reality within our consciusness when the one person who you believed in most destroys the one precious bond thats broken. And you yourself in a ll reality cant heal it alone, this does not mean you dont go all out trying but there is entrenched self value system thats changed to self loathing and unless he looks elsewhere, he will live with this wounded embattledness till death and it festers into stress and causes cancer and strokes and things.


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## pidge70

[email protected] said:


> Im an amateur noetic scientist, and i've come to the conclusion, the only way your husband will regain his personality and strenght is true genuine love and desire, but not from you another woman or two. And if you can sit back relax and be patient while he test the waters, if he comes back, he's all yours. There is a reality within our consciusness when the one person who you believed in most destroys the one precious bond thats broken. And you yourself in a ll reality cant heal it alone, this does not mean you dont go all out trying but there is entrenched self value system thats changed to self loathing and unless he looks elsewhere, he will live with this wounded embattledness till death and it festers into stress and causes cancer and strokes and things.


:scratchhead:
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Beowulf

[email protected] said:


> Im an amateur noetic scientist, and i've come to the conclusion, the only way your husband will regain his personality and strenght is true genuine love and desire, but not from you another woman or two. And if you can sit back relax and be patient while he test the waters, if he comes back, he's all yours. There is a reality within our consciusness when the one person who you believed in most destroys the one precious bond thats broken. And you yourself in a ll reality cant heal it alone, this does not mean you dont go all out trying but there is entrenched self value system thats changed to self loathing and unless he looks elsewhere, he will live with this wounded embattledness till death and it festers into stress and causes cancer and strokes and things.


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## COguy

[email protected] said:


> Im an amateur noetic scientist, and i've come to the conclusion, the only way your husband will regain his personality and strenght is true genuine love and desire, but not from you another woman or two. And if you can sit back relax and be patient while he test the waters, if he comes back, he's all yours. There is a reality within our consciusness when the one person who you believed in most destroys the one precious bond thats broken. And you yourself in a ll reality cant heal it alone, this does not mean you dont go all out trying but there is entrenched self value system thats changed to self loathing and unless he looks elsewhere, he will live with this wounded embattledness till death and it festers into stress and causes cancer and strokes and things.


From wikipedia: _In traditional philosophy, noëtics (from the Greek noētikos "mental" from noein "to perceive with the mind" and nous "mind, understanding, intellect")* is a branch of metaphysical philosophy* concerned with the study of mind and intellect. Noetic doctrines include the doctrine of the agent/patient intellect (Aristotle, Averroes)[1] and the *doctrine of the Divine Intellect* (Plotinus)._

So basically, you're not a scientist at all. Which is good, because what you said is retarded.


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## working_together

lol


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## Dadof3

I think it was same troll who had the witch doctor cast spells to fix their marriages!


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## Jellybeans

Oh I remember that troll! But at least that troll was entertaining. Un like the other ones that dribble the same bullsh!t or post just looking for validation or the ones that say "Is this dress too sexy" spammer trolls.


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## working_together

Dadof3 said:


> I think it was same troll who had the witch doctor cast spells to fix their marriages!


What? I guess that was before my time. Every now and then I read strange posts like that, and I'm like ok, whatever turns you on. 

I have to also admit when I read a post with God mentioned more than 3 times, I shut down, and leave. No offense to anyone.


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## aug

God? Oh God! I hope it's God's wish that you dont leave your own thread.


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## Almostrecovered

what happens during sex and your hubby keeps moaning "oh god!"


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## Dadof3

Almostrecovered said:


> what happens during sex and your hubby keeps moaning "oh god!"


:rofl::lol::rofl::lol:


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## Jane Doe

working_together said:


> It's funny I had morals back then.



this simple sentence resonated with me. i feel like my cheating is similar to murder in the way of once i've killed someone, i'll always be a murderer.... once i've cheated, i'll always be a cheater. how can i ever act like i had morals.... was it all a lie, a facade? or did i have a temporary lapse of sanity? i prided myself on my "morals"... my ability to deter attention.... but what bull. it's funny i thought i had morals at all.


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## morituri

Almostrecovered said:


> what happens during sex and your hubby keeps moaning "oh god!"


George Burns will appear in their bedroom asking them "Did someone call me?"


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## working_together

Almostrecovered said:


> what happens during sex and your hubby keeps moaning "oh god!"


In my house it's Jesus Christ.....I quickly nibbed that in the bud.:lol:


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## Shaggy

working_together said:


> No one at my work knew of my affair, they knew I was having marriage troubles, I had cancelled a few shifts etc. No one knew of my affair except one person (while it was going on). I did not involved anyone. I had a bad situation with an ex-friend who lied to her husband of her whereabouts, and told him she was at my house....but she did not inform me....friendship was done. It's funny I had morals back then.


Since you used cancelled shifts, you can also be super transparent about when you are working and show him the pay stub to verify you really did.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## working_together

Shaggy said:


> Since you used cancelled shifts, you can also be super transparent about when you are working and show him the pay stub to verify you really did.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


yeah, that's a good idea.


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