# Breadwinner mom and stay at home dad



## Mama2016 (Jun 20, 2016)

Three kids and another one on the way, working FT with a phd while husband stays home with baby#3 . This arrangement has been a great source of tension for us. His friends make fun of him for being home and takes it out on me sometimes, by calling me stupid. My counselor has said he is projecting his feelings of stupidness on to me. Yet he can't seem to get his butt off the couch and apply for a job. His friends have caution him about me leaving him because I'm more educated and he's unemployed so I think he feels insecure but at the same time, he's not appreciative of me for doing what I can to keep this family together financially. I have assured him that I do not have plans to leave him, but his behaviors (e.g., putting me down, looking at inappropriate websites, and among other things) have made me thinking that maybe I need an exit plan. 

Do u think his lack of masculinity has anything to do with his lack of sexual interest in me? Or his ability to cum (he's 40)? 

If your husband is a stay at home dad, have u notice any relational or sexual problems?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

A SAHD w 3 kids shouldn't have time to look at inappropriate websites. 3 kids plus housecleaning, errands, grocery shopping, cooking, wrangling any pets you may have, laundry, sports, playdates, etc. should be keeping him too busy to surf the web for porn. I was SAHM to 3 kids and I was lucky to get a shower, much less hit up inappropriate websites.

I, personally, don't buy that a man is emasculated by staying at home and caring for the house and kids. I think a man is emasculated when he isn't feeling productive and necessary. 

Is counseling an option?


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## Manchester (Oct 7, 2016)

He can't cum and he can't work. 

What good qualities does he have?


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## Mama2016 (Jun 20, 2016)

Manchester, exactly. He spends my money, that's what he does. I'm beginning to question what value he brings to me or my marriage. Perhaps I've just been too nice.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Manchester (Oct 7, 2016)

Sounds like it.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Mama2016 said:


> Manchester, exactly. He spends my money, that's what he does. I'm beginning to question what value he brings to me or my marriage. Perhaps I've just been too nice.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Does he do all the household chores, get the kids to school, doctors, sports and activities, etc? Does he run all the errands and do the shopping? Does he do repairs or arrange for someone to do the repairs?

Basically, what does he do all day?

If he's actually doing the SAHP bit, with 3 kids he should be fairly busy. If he's not, there is a serious problem and you're being too nice.


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## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

Mama2016 said:


> I have assured him that I do not have plans to leave him,


You don't "PLAN" to leave him but you eventually will. We see this time and time again here. 

He is emasculated. He won't look for work. He is abusive to you. He does porn. You deserve better. When you find someone better, you will leave him. And you will pay alimony unless he works.

Stop having kids with him.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Did you get your PhD before or after you married him?


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## Mama2016 (Jun 20, 2016)

I received the degree during our marriage. I understand the implications of leaving the marriage-alimony/spousal support. Just awful isn't it? That is why I'm trying to work on our issues but it is difficult. Thanks
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

You have your other thread in CWI talking about him cheating on you before you married him.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/353273-cheating-before-marriage.html

At this point, you are probably better off if you leave him.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

Meh. I'm old school and find it horrifically unappealing when a man is ok with staying home and changing diapers while his highly successful wife supports him. JMHO, of course.

I think you would have been much better off marrying someone in your own intellectual league because he clearly resents that you're so much more successful and productive than he is. Just the fact that he calls you 'stupid' - while he's completely unproductive and is too damned lazy to find himself an actual job - is pretty indicative of the completely different levels you're both at in life. He sounds like an ignorant 15 year old teenage boy.

Make sure he has a job first before you put any exit plans into motion. Otherwise you'll be supporting his lazy ass for the next few years.


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

With everything you describe, he sounds like a real prize.

He must be - you keep making babies with him.


_Posted via Mobile Device_
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

He sounds like a loser. What made you want to marry him to begin with? It's not even the stay at home dad (I hate the double standard society employs regarding that). But the lack of effort, the sophomoric verbal attacks. What was the original turn on?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Mr.StrongMan (Feb 10, 2016)

Mama2016 said:


> Three kids and another one on the way, working FT with a phd while husband stays home with baby#3 . This arrangement has been a great source of tension for us. *His friends make fun of him for being home and takes it out on me sometimes, by calling me stupid.* My counselor has said he is projecting his feelings of stupidness on to me. Yet he can't seem to get his butt off the couch and apply for a job. *His friends have caution him about me leaving him because I'm more educated and he's unemployed *so I think he feels insecure but at the same time, he's not appreciative of me for doing what I can to keep this family together financially. I have assured him that I do not have plans to leave him, but his behaviors (e.g., putting me down, looking at inappropriate websites, and among other things) have made me thinking that maybe I need an exit plan.
> 
> Do u think his lack of masculinity has anything to do with his lack of sexual interest in me? Or his ability to cum (he's 40)?
> 
> ...


First and foremost, your husband has to find new friends!!!!! If this is the way they talk to him then they have no respect for him and your situation! I find it disgusting that his friends have the gawl to talk to your husband this way!! He has to find new friends! No one should be talked to that way!!! 

Look, I'm conservative. I believe a man's place is to be the breadwinner. But I too was in your husband's situation. My wife makes double what I make. Yet, I was a stay at home dad for years. I wanted to work but could not find work. So my wife and I made the best out of sad situation. 
Yet, that "sad situation" turned out to be a blessing because I was able to be home to raise our child. And why are your friends mocking your husband for staying home when it's clear that many husbands are staying home to raise the kids when wives work. Almost all of the guys I know have wives who make more money than they do. Society has changed. This is why I laugh when I hear politicians continuing the rhetoric about women making as much as men. It's my personal opinion that women are the winners in today's work place. But I can only speak from what I see in my own life.

My wife had a friend who would talk down about our situation of her working and me staying home. She was insulted and found the benefit behind it. Did I want to work? You better believe I did. And I eventually did get back on track. But who is supposed to watch your children? Of course there is day care and school. Not everyone has other family members to help. We don't.

Of course, your husband projecting his insecurity and anger on to you is wrong. We all do it. Perhaps some IC is in order. By calling you "stupid" when you have a PHD sound to me like he might be threatened by you.

But back to my original point. If this is the way your husband's friends talk to him, then it's time to find more enlightened friends! Not everything works out the way our preconceived ideals on life want to. You married your husband for a reason; just like my wife married me for a reason. Coming to terms with that is important before making any decisions of an exit out of your marriage, especially when children are involved.


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## Relationship Teacher (Jan 3, 2016)

Mama2016 said:


> Three kids and another one on the way, working FT with a phd while husband stays home with baby#3 . This arrangement has been a great source of tension for us. His friends make fun of him for being home and takes it out on me sometimes, by calling me stupid. My counselor has said he is projecting his feelings of stupidness on to me. Yet he can't seem to get his butt off the couch and apply for a job. His friends have caution him about me leaving him because I'm more educated and he's unemployed so I think he feels insecure but at the same time, he's not appreciative of me for doing what I can to keep this family together financially. I have assured him that I do not have plans to leave him, but his behaviors (e.g., putting me down, looking at inappropriate websites, and among other things) have made me thinking that maybe I need an exit plan.
> 
> Do u think his lack of masculinity has anything to do with his lack of sexual interest in me? Or his ability to cum (he's 40)?
> 
> ...


I call that type of behavior "reaching". It can carry a lot of labels, but this one explains it the best. Said behavior is intended to get a response from you. Individuals can "reach" by throwing insults or by running and playing victim. Either way, it is a game meant to get you to feed his esteem. His main problem is a total lack of personal responsibility. The first move probably shouldn't be along the lines of separation or divorce, but stern (and you mean it) conversations. A powerful way to have them go well is to still offer your love. Don't resort to negativity in response to his. He has games already up his sleeves.

Best of luck.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

@She'sStillGotIt

At this point, him being unemployed for a time and Baby#4 on the way, it might not make sense for him to work. Depending on what he is qualified to do and the average income he can expect to make, he may not be able to make enough money to justify daycare and latch key costs for 4 kids. 

Of course he does have the option of working opposite shifts.

Just curious, were all 4 of the kids planned by BOTH of you? In other words, does he not want sex with you and turn to porn instead because he resents you for continuously getting pregnant? Do you think he may feel trapped and hopeless?

I don't share this much, but...

My first marriage was a disaster. We weren't right for each other and married because I got pregnant due to a birth control fail. I wasn't happy and I wanted out. Since I wasn't working, I was making plans to get someone to watch my oldest so I could get a part time job, take classes, and get a full time job so that I could afford to leave. I had a different method of birth control fail and got pregnant with my second child.

I spent 3 days solid just crying on the couch. I felt my "sentence" had just been extended by years and I'd never be able to leave with 2 kids, one young and one infant. I just gave up. I did the bare minimum cleaning and cooking and played nice while seething with resentment and hate. I wasn't all that attracted to him in the first place, but associating sex with the babies that kept me trapped made me even less able to stomach it.

Maybe your H is just as unhappy and wants out, but cannot leave because he has no way to support himself and then there is the matter of 3 kids, soon to be 4.


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## katiecrna (Jan 29, 2016)

It takes a very secure man to handle being a SAHD. Most men can't and it's honestly against biology. He does resent you. Instead of this motivating him to do something with his life he looks at you as the enemy. I unfortunately don't see this working out unless he has an epiphany but he seems to immature to reach that conclusion. Instead it's easier to blame you for why he sucks at being a man. 

Another thing that scares me is that it's so important for a man to feel like a man. And I don't see how you can make him feel like a man without lowering yourself. And the fact that he has to resort to calling you stupid to feel like a man reflects this notion. Porn makes him feel like a man. And I'm sure he will eventually meet a stupid bimbo women that will be half the women you are and it will make him feel like a man and he will cheat on you. 
A damaged male ego and an emasculated man are why men treat women like ****, it's how they try to restore their manliness. I'm so sorry I don't know how you will be able to resolve this. But please do not lower yourself for him, and do not let him verbally abuse you. He needs to know that he needs to rise up and come to your level, not knock you down below his. I wish you luck.


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## Married27years (Jun 16, 2016)

Yes, he is cutting you down to try to make himself feel better. Same with looking at inappropriate websites. Makes him feel more of a man. Someone here called him lazy. He is not lazy, taking care of 3 children plus a newborn is a lot of work. This kind of reverse role can work well but it does take a secure man to be ok with his wife supporting the family. the divorce rate is higher and women in your situation are more likely to have affairs. It wouldn't make sense for him to get a job working the same hours as you as you would have to put you children in daycare which would eat up his salary and not be good for your children. He could work different hours but then you two would never see each other. Leaving him and being a working single Mom of four isn't a good idea for your children or you. You both planned this life so stick it out.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Mama2016 said:


> Manchester, exactly. He spends my money, that's what he does. I'm beginning to question what value he brings to me or my marriage. Perhaps I've just been too nice.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


He is really not spending your money is he? He is vital to the survival of your family and contributes equal to you. It is seldom one person who is responsible for marital problems. From what you have written, i think you may carry the bulk of the responsibility. 

You don't respect your husband, or value and appreciate his contribution to your life. You should because he does a great deal. Fix that first with actions and words. Treat him with respect, show him appreciation, recognize the value of the many gift he brings into your life. 

If you had to hire a nannie and housekeeper and look for companionship to replace your husband, how much better would life be for you and the 3 children? You have a lot to be thankful for not the lest of which are 3 healthy children, a husband who loves and is an involved father. You have a companion, potential friend, lover and source of support. 

BTW It's not your money. Without the hard work your husband does in the home and with your 3 children, you would not have the wherewithal to earn enough to support your family. He may not be suited to be a SAHD. right now his confidence is likely sapped because of the disrespect he is subjected to. 

He needs goals, challenges and success. Sounds like he needs help to get started. As a valuable member of your team, help him see that. It will go a long way towards preserving your family.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Mama2016 said:


> Three kids and another one on the way, working FT with a phd while husband stays home with baby#3 . This arrangement has been a great source of tension for us. His friends make fun of him for being home and takes it out on me sometimes, by calling me stupid. My counselor has said he is projecting his feelings of stupidness on to me. Yet he can't seem to get his butt off the couch and apply for a job. His friends have caution him about me leaving him because I'm more educated and he's unemployed so I think he feels insecure but at the same time, he's not appreciative of me for doing what I can to keep this family together financially. I have assured him that I do not have plans to leave him, but his behaviors (e.g., putting me down, looking at inappropriate websites, and among other things) have made me thinking that maybe I need an exit plan.
> 
> Do u think his lack of masculinity has anything to do with his lack of sexual interest in me? Or his ability to cum (he's 40)?
> 
> ...


Is he a genuine stay at home dad?

Or is he a jobless loser?

From your description I fear he may be the latter.

If he is *not* the latter, are you doing stuff that might make him feel emasculated? 

Someone is sabotaging your marriage, consciously or unconsciously.

Which one of you is it?


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Married27years said:


> Yes, he is cutting you down to try to make himself feel better. Same with looking at inappropriate websites. Makes him feel more of a man. Someone here called him lazy. He is not lazy, taking care of 3 children plus a newborn is a lot of work. This kind of reverse role can work well but it does take a secure man to be ok with his wife supporting the family. the divorce rate is higher and women in your situation are more likely to have affairs. * It wouldn't make sense for him to get a job working the same hours as you as you would have to put you children in daycare which would eat up his salary and not be good for your children. He could work different hours but then you two would never see each other. Leaving him and being a working single Mom of four isn't a good idea for your children or you. You both planned this life so stick it out.*





Catherine602 said:


> He is really not spending your money is he? *He is vital to the survival of your family and contributes equal to you.* It is seldom one person who is responsible for marital problems. From what you have written, i think you may carry the bulk of the responsibility.
> 
> You don't respect your husband, or value and appreciate his contribution to your life. You should because he does a great deal. Fix that first with actions and words. Treat him with respect, show him appreciation, recognize the value of the many gift he brings into your life.
> 
> ...


Regarding the bolded in both posts, we actually don't know that. If he's sitting on the couch half-azzing it while occasionally going off to watch porn and masturbate, he's arguably worse than daycare and not a valuable contributor to the family. Depending on OP's income and how much he frivolously spends, it might actually be better for her to be a single mother with a nanny or relative watching the kids while she works than to stay married.

OP, could you clarify? Does your SAHD husband contribute by handling the childcare (including Dr appts, sports, playdates, school functions) as well as the household chores and errands or no?


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

@MJJEAN Thank you. You are right. I did not read carefully enough before offering an opinion. Sorry OP.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Catherine602 said:


> @MJJEAN Thank you. You are right. I did not read carefully enough before offering an option. Sorry OP.


You assumed a decent person/parent. Nothing wrong with that! I would have assumed the same, that the SAHP was a valuable contributor, until I was the breadwinner and exH was the SAHP. He did the bare minimum childcare and mean the bare minimum. He did zero household chores, but sure could leave a mess for me to clean up. He also did none of the cooking or grocery shopping and would only go to the store if he needed cigarettes or soda. He basically spent his time smoking, sucking down soda, and gaming.

No as to not be accused of man-bashing, I have also seen similar SAHM's. One of the ones I knew spent most of her time doing her nails and make-up while her kids ran around like heathens and her house was whole new definition of filthy.

Not all SAHP are equal. Some are very hardworking and save the family both money and stress and others are at the opposite end on the spectrum.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Mama2016 said:


> I received the degree during our marriage. I understand the implications of leaving the marriage-alimony/spousal support. Just awful isn't it? That is why I'm trying to work on our issues but it is difficult. Thanks
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Alimony is only awful when the woman has to pay it.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

bandit.45 said:


> Alimony is only awful when the woman has to pay it.


Alimony is awful when anyone has to pay it to a spouse that stayed at home against the wishes of the other spouse. The problem would be proving that there wasn't an agreement that one spouse stay home.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

And yet, if he is so dreadful a man, why make so many babies with him? :scratchhead:


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## tropicalbeachiwish (Jun 1, 2016)

MattMatt said:


> And yet, if he is so dreadful a man, why make so many babies with him? :scratchhead:


Exactly. Maybe that's why he's calling her stupid. (And no, I'm not saying that it's okay to say that).


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## katiecrna (Jan 29, 2016)

bandit.45 said:


> Alimony is only awful when the woman has to pay it.




Bc usually the women will end up with all the kids. Working full time, with primary custody of 4 kids, and she has to pay him Bc he was a "sahd" also known as unemployed not by choice in this particular situation.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

katiecrna said:


> Bc usually the women will end up with all the kids. Working full time, with primary custody of 4 kids, and she has to pay him Bc he was a "sahd" also known as unemployed not by choice in this particular situation.


Sigh...yep. Gender equality is a b!tch isn't it?


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

MattMatt said:


> And yet, if he is so dreadful a man, why make so many babies with him? :scratchhead:


Since there is such a stigma here to having multiple baby daddies, some women get pregnant by the same unsuitable man multiple times because they want a large family of children and do not want to have multiple baby daddies.

Women also seem to be very optimistic. They truly believe that a man will change for the better once the babies arrive. Some do. Most do not. I was guilty of a bit of this one myself! 

ExH and I were certainly incompatible, but since we had an accidental pregnancy and I couldn't bring myself to abort, we decided to "do the right thing". I knew exH and I couldn't possibly be a good match for many reasons, but one of my biggest issues with him was his general irresponsibility. He was, in a lot of ways, worse than having a toddler around and required about as much supervision. I was certain that he would grow up once the baby was born and he was a father. I was absolutely wrong! I had a 2nd birth control fail 5 years later, got pregnant with DD2, couldn't bring myself to abort, and held out hope that if he couldn't be a decent mate, perhaps the second child would hammer into his brain that he was a father and it was time to grow up. Again, I was absolutely wrong.

Of course, there is always the possibility that OP has experienced multiple birth control failures and hasn't had so many children with this man on purpose. A lot of women are into using Fertility Awareness for religious reasons or because they do not want the health risks of hormonal methods. Fertility Awareness does work, but user error can be high due to multiple factors from a wonky cycle that is hard to track to simple lack of proper education.




tropicalbeachiwish said:


> Exactly. Maybe that's why he's calling her stupid. (And no, I'm not saying that it's okay to say that).


If the children were largely unplanned from his point of view due to miscommunication, he may indeed be calling her stupid for getting pregnant. No, it's not ok, but it is a possible explanation.



katiecrna said:


> Bc usually the women will end up with all the kids. Working full time, with primary custody of 4 kids, and she has to pay him Bc he was a "sahd" also known as unemployed not by choice in this particular situation.


In a plot twist, my uncle divorced a cheating SAHM wife and he got custody of the kids because his ex honestly didn't want the responsibility of raising them. Since they had been married over 10 years, she got alimony. She ended up making a deal with my uncle that she would sign off on the alimony if he would sign their house over to her. As soon as the paperwork was complete, he moved himself and the kids back to our home state, bought another house, and merrily went on with his life.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

MJJEAN said:


> Alimony is awful when anyone has to pay it to a spouse that stayed at home against the wishes of the other spouse. The problem would be proving that there wasn't an agreement that one spouse stay home.


The spouse making more money pays. That's just the way it is. The court doesn't give a rat's ass about "fair".


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Who was supporting the family while she went to graduate school? Was she bringing home the bacon AND going to school both? How was her schooling paid? 

Stuff I'd like to know before deeming her husband a deadbeat.


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## katiecrna (Jan 29, 2016)

bandit.45 said:


> Sigh...yep. Gender equality is a b!tch isn't it?




Gender equality is not the problem, the divorce courts and our justice system is the problem. Our divorce courts are so f*cked up.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

katiecrna said:


> Gender equality is not the problem, the divorce courts and our justice system is the problem.* Our divorce courts are so f*cked up.*


Only when it's the wife who has to pay alimony.


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## FustratedinCA (Oct 7, 2016)

oh man...I guess I'm not living this scenario alone. Mama2016-if there's any comfort, know that I'm going through the same sexless-jobless husband situation.


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## FustratedinCA (Oct 7, 2016)

@bandit.45 In my case (I also have a phd), my schooling was paid for by the program and I was given a stipend for living expense in exchange for my teaching and research work. So Mama2016 may be in similar situtation.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

FustratedinCA said:


> @bandit.45 In my case (I also have a phd), my schooling was paid for by the program and I was given a stipend for living expense in exchanging for my teaching and research work. So Mama2016 may be in similar situtation.


Yeah I understand fellowships and all that, but those stipends don't pay nearly enough for the upkeep of a house and kids, which is why I asked if she was also working at the time she was doing her dissertation...

If she was the main breadwinner supporting both her kids and husband AND working on her degree...then she needs to throw that lazy fvck out. If he was the one supporting the family during the four years or so that she was getting her Masters and PhD, then I'm holding off judging him until we get a clearer picture. 

I've seen so many instances where you have a husband who works to support the family while his wife is going to school full time, only to be out-salaried by her later on when she graduates. That usually ends badly because the wife sees him as expendable now. She got what she wanted from him and it is time to upgrade to a husband who is an equal earner. But when you have a case like this one where he loses his job and can't or won't get another one...well that makes the dynamics even worse. What I want to know is, did he get fired from his job, quit his job at her request, or did he get laid off? Why can he not find another job? Sometimes it has to do with changing demographics. Sometimes men with limited skill sets cannot find work when the trade they were working in goes belly up or gets outsourced. It's not always the husband's fault, especially when it is a trade or construction job he had.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

bandit.45 said:


> Yeah I understand fellowships and all that, but those stipends don't pay nearly enough for the upkeep of a house and kids, which is why I asked if she was also working at the time she was doing her dissertation...


Depends on where you live and your expenses. I've known families who've done it, but they got help from food stamps and state aid, bought their clothes from resale shops, and lived in not so great neighborhoods to do it.


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

Mama2016 said:


> Do u think his lack of masculinity has anything to do with his lack of sexual interest in me? Or his ability to cum (he's 40)?


Who cares if he cums (sounds like the porn he watches is taking care of that)? The real question is, "Is he making you cum?" :wink2:

Clearly this guy feels emasculated and depressed so he lashes out. He needs a job ASAP, some people are NOT cut out to be SAH parents....


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