# Cyber Cheating



## mrdeets (Dec 23, 2011)

Hello,

So Ive been married for 3 years now, and a year ago my wife caught me watching porn, something I had struggled with for many years before. I have tried so hard to stop watching it becuase she (and myself) consider it adultry and a breaking of our marriage vows.

After the original time a year ago I went to a sex therapist for a while and thought I had it under control. Recently I slipped up again and wachd some more, and she figured it out.

She's devastated and left to stay at a hotel room last night...what do I do? She the love of my life and I dont want to loose her...


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

What you can do is talk to her about why you did it, how you feel, and that you want her to come home and set a plan to work on your marriage together.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Handle your porn habit the same way adultery is handled. 
Give your wife the password to every one of your accounts.
Agree to let her put a key stroke logger on every computer in the house. 

Tell her she can check up on what you are doing any time she wants.
Find something off the computer to do. The two of you should spend at least 15 hours a week together doing things that are date like. 

You need to do things to show her that you have stopped this activity and that you can be trusted. It will take a long time for her to trust you again. So be completely transparent with her.


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## mrdeets (Dec 23, 2011)

Thanks guys!

Any advise on how to start the process of rebuilding trust, besides her seeing me divorce myself from the activity and set up blocks...when she first confrnted me stupidly I lied about it and wasnt honest with her...

That seems to have hurt her just as much as the actual action


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Porn is not cheating unless it affects how you treat your wife.

And clean your history


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## HerToo (Oct 3, 2011)

It could be seen as a form of emotional cheating if the porn is being used as the primary source for creating sexual desire versus the spouse as the source.

But it is strictly a personal decision on interpretation.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

warlock07 said:


> Porn is not cheating unless it affects how you treat your wife.
> 
> And clean your history


Yeah, I think learning how to wipe your cache and history is the best way to handle it.


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## Sindo (Oct 29, 2011)

warlock07 said:


> Porn is not cheating unless it affects how you treat your wife.
> 
> And clean your history


I wouldn't necessarily agree. It can be a grey area, but I'm of the view that if your wife and yourself both consider this cheating, then it's cheating. This was a clear boundary for both OP and his wife, and he violated it.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Yeah, if you both agree it's cheating then it's cheating.

I don't agree, but that doesn't matter here.

You say you saw a sex therapist. What was their take on you watching porn if I may ask?

As for rebuilding trust, you do need to approach it the same way as if you had cheated with someone physically. You could even do a no contact letter of some kind - like a promise letter to your wife or something.

Good luck to you. I hope you aren't just stifling things for your wifes sake and doing something that deep down you don't really agree with.


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## mrdeets (Dec 23, 2011)

No I do consider it cheating so thats that.

Anyone have some actual advise beyond clear my history (like the no contact contract) or other things to rebuild trust and help us reconcile.

and the sexual therapist I went to was under the belief that if I thought it was cheating, than thats how we would treat it.


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## GreenEyes (Jan 27, 2011)

It will take some willpower on your part, when you feel like you want to do it, try to figure out something else that you can do that will take your mind off of it and after a while of doing that it becomes easier and easier to put it out of your mind....The only thing is just because that worked for some people I know, doesn't mean it's your cup of tea and that may not work for you. You could have your wife set a password block on your computer for those sites too, of course sometimes that will block sites that aren't porn and it makes surfing a little difficult....


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

Hey deets-----Stop giving us this line of baloney---about how you love your wife---IF YOU LOVED YOUR WIFE, AND YOU TRULY WANTED TO KEEP HER---THE PORN WOULD BE GONE PERMANENTLY----so how much do you really truly love your wife, when you keep going back to the porn.

All you are doing is looking at others having sex, and or female/male bodies---is that crap such a turn on to you, that you are willing to give up your wife?????

You can do anything you wanna do---you just have to wanna do it bad enuff---obviously you don't wanna have your wife---or this kind of crap would have ended.

If your wife threatens D., and it will cost you some bucks, when it is all over and done with---you think maybe that will wean you off the porn

We all do what we wanna do---what do you wanna do??????


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## mr.miketastic (Aug 5, 2010)

jnj express said:


> Hey deets-----Stop giving us this line of baloney---about how you love your wife---IF YOU LOVED YOUR WIFE, AND YOU TRULY WANTED TO KEEP HER---THE PORN WOULD BE GONE PERMANENTLY----so how much do you really truly love your wife, when you keep going back to the porn.
> 
> All you are doing is looking at others having sex, and or female/male bodies---is that crap such a turn on to you, that you are willing to give up your wife?????
> 
> ...


*sigh* So the p0rn is evil? Umm no it's not. If you are not having normal relations with your spouse, then p0rn away. if it's keeping you from normal relations then get both you and your SO to the counselor to address the issue of why. She's not your mother, so be open about why you enjoy it and then invite her to watch something you both would like. Cheating is having an EA or PA with another person, not a video or picture. Sometimes one needs release that an SO is unwilling, or unable to provide...Don't force celibacy on someone who did not choose it.


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## GreenEyes (Jan 27, 2011)

mr.miketastic said:


> *sigh* So the p0rn is evil? Umm no it's not. If you are not having normal relations with your spouse, then p0rn away. if it's keeping you from normal relations then get both you and your SO to the counselor to address the issue of why. She's not your mother, so be open about why you enjoy it and then invite her to watch something you both would like. Cheating is having an EA or PA with another person, not a video or picture. Sometimes one needs release that an SO is unwilling, or unable to provide...Don't force celibacy on someone who did not choose it.


The OP straight up said he and his wife BOTH consider this cheating, so we are going off of his thoughts. He never said anything about the fact that he wasn't getting any, you're making assumptions that that's the only reason people look at porn, that their spouse is somehow to blame for withholding or not giving it enough and "guys need their release" (please!) I truly believe if the motivation for wanting to quit something is there, and you truly want to quit, you will do it however you can, you will figure out a way. When I have really wanted to quit something and I was 100% dedicated to quitting, believe me I quit. It's not fun, and it's hard as hell sometimes, but it is definitly doable....


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## mr.miketastic (Aug 5, 2010)

GreenEyes said:


> The OP straight up said he and his wife BOTH consider this cheating, so we are going off of his thoughts. He never said anything about the fact that he wasn't getting any, *you're making assumptions that that's the only reason people look at porn, that their spouse is somehow to blame for withholding or not giving it enough and "guys need their release" (please!)* I truly believe if the motivation for wanting to quit something is there, and you truly want to quit, you will do it however you can, you will figure out a way. When I have really wanted to quit something and I was 100% dedicated to quitting, believe me I quit.


*Sometimes* one needs release that an SO is unwilling, or unable to provide...Don't force celibacy on someone who did not choose it.


So tell me how sometimes turned into the only times? 
Your bolded statement borders on misogyny (See the generalization I just made?). The OP's opinion could also be due to his wife being the dominant partner, so, he is taking on some of her prejudices regarding the p0rn. Of course, that could just be an assumption and in no way is meant to describe everyone's particular situation. Thankfully this is only a message board, so other opinions can certainly be taken with a grain or 1000 of salt


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## Gottafixit (Dec 26, 2011)

I came here for help, but maybe I can give some too. I would suggest you never get on your computer unless she is present. That may seem impossible in your particular situation but maybe you could have HER set up the computer password so she has to type it in for you to log on. That will mean she has to be there, and you can't do it on your own.


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## GreenEyes (Jan 27, 2011)

I'm not forcing celibacy on anyone....with some exceptions I think everyone on this earth gets their release when they need it whether it be alone of with the SO....and sometimes that is done without the aid of porn, a lot of times really, and if you and your wife have set the boundaries of what is acceptable and you love your wife and do not want to gamble with your relationship then you do it with the mean available, like idk your imagination, fantasizing, something....

If you and your spouse *both* agree on certain boundaries in your relationship, and then you violate it he or she has every right to be mad at you. And if she is the "dominant partner" and he didn't have the guts to stand up to her in the beginning and say no I don't agree (which he has said more than once *he* also believes it's cheating), then that's his problem, in her eyes he still agreed, and he violated the agreement. My H watching porn behind my back was a huge deal with us, I didn't agree with him watching it, I felt like it was a mild form of cheating and it hurt my feelings...I told him I didn't want him watching it for those reasons anymore, he didn't agree, was I shocked or mad when I saw he had been watching it after that? Not really..upset? yes, but he never said he would stop, so really what did I expect?? Now if he agreed to stop and then I saw he was doing it again behind my back after saying he wouldn't, I would be p*ssed....People need to take responsibility for their own actions and quit pushing off the blame on someone else all the time....


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## mr.miketastic (Aug 5, 2010)

GreenEyes said:


> I'm not forcing celibacy on anyone....with some exceptions* I think everyone on this earth gets their release when they need it whether it be alone of with the SO*....and sometimes that is done without the aid of porn, a lot of times really, and if you and your wife have set the boundaries of what is acceptable and you love your wife and do not want to gamble with your relationship then *you do it with the mean available, like idk your imagination, fantasizing, something....*
> 
> If you and your spouse *both* agree on certain boundaries in your relationship, and then you violate it he or she has every right to be mad at you. And if she is the "dominant partner" and he didn't have the guts to stand up to her in the beginning and say no I don't agree (which he has said more than once *he* also believes it's cheating), then that's his problem, in her eyes he still agreed, and he violated the agreement. My H watching porn behind my back was a huge deal with us, I didn't agree with him watching it, I felt like it was a mild form of cheating and it hurt my feelings...I told him I didn't want him watching it for those reasons anymore, he didn't agree, was I shocked or mad when I saw he had been watching it after that? Not really..upset? yes, but he never said he would stop, so really what did I expect?? Now if he agreed to stop and then I saw he was doing it again behind my back after saying he wouldn't, I would be p*ssed....People need to take responsibility for their own actions and quit pushing off the blame on someone else all the time....



So what is the difference between viewing p0rn and fantasizing about someone while you rub one off? Technically, would that not also be cheating?


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## Santofimio (Oct 26, 2011)

mrdeets said:


> So Ive been married for 3 years now, and a year ago my wife caught me watching porn, something I had struggled with for many years before. I have tried so hard to stop watching it becuase she (and myself) consider it adultry and a breaking of our marriage vows.


Can you explain a little more about how often and for what purpose you were watching porn for? What do you mean by “struggled”? Did you prefer watching porn to having sex with your wife? Were you watching it constantly just to watch it instead of strictly using it to pleasure yourself here and there?
I understand why some people associate Porn with adultery. But it’s not cut and dry like an EA or PA is. If by struggling you mean you had an addiction, your addiction is just as much of a problem as what it is you’re addicted to is. I don’t think you’re cheating on your wife, I think you just have an addiction that she and you both agree is not good for the marriage.
But I personally see nothing wrong with using it sporadically. I thought it was always kind of a given in marriage with a “don’t ask don’t tell” policy. Unless she’s giving you BJ’s or HJ’s during her period, off nights, or even pregnancy, then I don’t see what the issue is.
I always thought porn for guys fell into the same category as look but don’t touch. Every married person, guy or girl, is guilty of at the very least “checking out” someone of the opposite sex. Porn in moderation is just another “boys will be boys” thing.


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## Santofimio (Oct 26, 2011)

GreenEyes said:


> If you and your spouse *both* agree on certain boundaries in your relationship, and then you violate it he or she has every right to be mad at you. And if she is the "dominant partner" and he didn't have the guts to stand up to her in the beginning and say no I don't agree (which he has said more than once *he* also believes it's cheating), then that's his problem, in her eyes he still agreed, and he violated the agreement.


Is this honestly something that needs to be agreed upon? Just don’t abuse it or be dumb and make it obvious. It’s no more insensitive getting caught looking at porn as it would be for my W to tell me she thinks a guy on TV is hot instead of just keeping it to herself. 


GreenEyes said:


> My H watching porn behind my back was a huge deal with us, I didn't agree with him watching it, I felt like it was a mild form of cheating and it hurt my feelings...I told him I didn't want him watching it for those reasons anymore, he didn't agree, was I shocked or mad when I saw he had been watching it after that? Not really..upset? yes, but he never said he would stop, so really what did I expect?? Now if he agreed to stop and then I saw he was doing it again behind my back after saying he wouldn't, I would be p*ssed....People need to take responsibility for their own actions and quit pushing off the blame on someone else all the time....


Can you honestly say you never fantasized about another man or at the least found them attractive? I think you should have just told your husband “look, I understand its human nature, I just don’t want to see or know about it”
Porn is a far far cry from going to get a massage with a happy ending, lap dance at a strip club, or worse a prostitute. In fact, I consider it a very safe, un-adulterous alternative, as long as it’s not used as a substitute for intimacy with your SO.


To the OP, if you want to stop cause you consider it cheating then stop. If its not an addiction, and you don't really agree that its cheating, then just be straight up with your W. Something like "I don't prefer porn to you, but sometimes I have the urge, and if you're unavailable for whatever reason, porn helps me fulfill a need. I don't obsess or fantasize about the other girls." If you're spending alot of time watching porn, not even for the purpose of just rubbing one out, then forget adultery, you have an addiction that's problematic to you, not just your wife.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

The major issue should be whether his use of porn is interferring with him having sex with his wife.

OP... how healthy is your sex life with your wife? Is she getting all the sex that she wants?


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## GreenEyes (Jan 27, 2011)

mr.miketastic said:


> So what is the difference between viewing p0rn and fantasizing about someone while you rub one off? Technically, would that not also be cheating?


As much as your SO might like to do so at times, they cannot control your thoughts or what goes on in your brain. 80% of the time when you are fantasizing it is usually of nobody in particular or an unobtainable person, and you can't take it a step further and contact ther person in your head....yes if you are fantasizing of someone you know then of course you can, but normally when you fantasize it's just for the moment and once you blow your load/get your release, whatever, you don't think much more of it.....If you do contact said person, that's a different forum altogether.


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## GreenEyes (Jan 27, 2011)

*Santofimio* No, this is not something that needs to be agreed upon, but if you read the OP this is something that they both agreed on therefore, in his particular case there was an agreement.

To address your second question, yes I have seen other men and thought they were attractive, I have fantasized about a few every once in a while...that sort of thing doesn't really get me going all the time. My H has fantasized about other women and said another woman was hot/pretty whatever in front of me, nbd. Me and my H watch porn together sometimes when the mood strikes us. What I don't like is hiding and lying. Me being 6 months pregnant and feeling gross enough already didn't really help the situation any either, and even though I said I didn't agree with him watching it without me, I told H to at least delete the history so I didnt know if he was watching it or not....I, at the time, felt like it was cheating, and my feelings were hurt, I am a little older now and not as sensitive, so by all means it would be fine, save for the fact that H carried on a relationship with someone online/over the phone, different forum though.

My whole point what I wrote is that if an agreement was made by both parties (which again OP said there was) you can't violate it and expect no repercussions from the SO, but if he hadn't agreed to it in the first place, she really couldn't have said anything because she knew he didn't agree with her. My sentence about the blame is that it's nobody's fault but his own that his wife got p*ssed and left, that was their agreement, he violated and she reacted, end of story. Now it's up to him to suck it up and decide that he (a) Isn't ever going to look at porn angain, and figure it out or (b) He's going to lay it down to his wife that, "Look I have my needs and sometimes you're not available to meet those needs", and then try to work through dealing with how she handles it, he has the problem, not her. If he lays it down and says he finds nothing wrong with watching it, and she is then faced with the decision to accept or not accept this, then it becomes her problem to deal with....but he needs to decide at this point what he wants more and what is more important


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

Hey Mr. Mike-----the differance in all this is---that the H. took a vow,---you know to love honor and obey---wife says she doesn't like porn----It is not unreasonable, for her to ask him not to view porn---he says he loves her, and if he loves her---he needs to honor his vows---IF PORN IS MORE IMPORTANT TO HIM THAN HIS WIFE---then he can get a D. and watch porn 24/7-------Do you understand that Mr. Mike??????


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## GreenEyes (Jan 27, 2011)

jnj express said:


> Hey Mr. Mike-----the differance in all this is---that the H. took a vow,---you know to love honor and obey---wife says she doesn't like porn----It is not unreasonable, for her to ask him not to view porn---he says he loves her, and if he loves her---he needs to honor his vows---IF PORN IS MORE IMPORTANT TO HIM THAN HIS WIFE---then he can get a D. and watch porn 24/7-------Do you understand that Mr. Mike??????


:iagree: Short and to the point, I like that :smthumbup:


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## Sindo (Oct 29, 2011)

OP, maybe you should make a thread in the Relationships & Addiction forum. This thread has been derailed into an argument on whether or not this count as cheating. While I believe in your case it is, you're not getting a lot of useful advice here.


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## GreenEyes (Jan 27, 2011)

Sindo said:


> OP, maybe you should make a thread in the Relationships & Addiction forum. This thread has been derailed into an argument on whether or not this count as cheating. While I believe in your case it is, you're not getting a lot of useful advice here.


Idk some of us have tried to give him advice, then people that want to turn it into an argument come in and make their comments and give their p.o.v. on what we tell the OP...I mean in this situation there isn't much that you can do besides restrict yourself from watching it and occupy yourself to keep your mind off of it, let your SO set a password on restricted sites so that you cannot view them, or tell her that you do not agree (now) that this is a form of cheating and deal with her reaction accordingly.....and if it's a problem and you know it's a problem, you know you *want* to quit but don't think you can, then get IC to try and overcome your addiction.....am I leaving something out?


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## mr.miketastic (Aug 5, 2010)

jnj express said:


> Hey Mr. Mike-----the differance in all this is---that the H. took a vow,---you know to love honor and obey---wife says she doesn't like porn----It is not unreasonable, for her to ask him not to view porn---he says he loves her, and if he loves her---he needs to honor his vows---IF PORN IS MORE IMPORTANT TO HIM THAN HIS WIFE---then he can get a D. and watch porn 24/7-------Do you understand that Mr. Mike??????


So some of you accuse me of making generalizations, yet you make your own arguments with said generalizations. It certainly is not unreasonable for her to make a request...provided that she in fact is participating with him in a healthy sexual relationship. I have seen the argument made by some on this forum that the marriage vows don't guarantee a man sex from his wife, so I would posit to you that the vows do not specifically state a man can't use p0rnography to satisfy a need. Yes, for some men it's a need, and if you want to act superior and state "Well _I_ don't need it!" That's terrific. I am glad for you, but don't act high and mighty and condemn someone for using it. He still has not answered whether or not his wife is being intimate with him, so perhaps we should wait to see what he says?
Do _you_ understand jnj?

P.S. White knighting makes you look beta btw.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Debate about whether it's cheating aside, have you considered treating it as an addiction? My hubby has a sex addiction which includes porn and he belongs to a 12 step group that has helped him tremendously.


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## sirdano (Dec 30, 2011)

Get rid of the computer or only let her have password to log on. Get rid of phone if there is an internet connection on it.


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## mr.miketastic (Aug 5, 2010)

sirdano said:


> Get rid of the computer or only let her have password to log on. Get rid of phone if there is an internet connection on it.


That won't solve anything at all. That will only serve to make him beta-ized, and as well, he will then start to resent the "jailer" and that will cause all sorts of issues. It's just like trying to quit any other addiction. If you rely on someone else to watch over you like a hawk, distrustful and vigilant, that gives the addict a perfect excuse to blame the watcher for any backsliding. Also, it makes the p0rn much more illicit and enticing. The more, and harder you fight something like an addiction, or an inner demon, the harder it fights back. Learn to accept, forgive yourself, and then move on.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

My goodness mr mike---how you throw out the alpha and the beta----DO YOU EVEN KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT?????

You sure don't have much of a grasp on the language being used on this thread

deets has not bothered to talk about their sex life---cuz it doesn't come into play---what is it you don't understand about that

You are here trying to invent all these arguments about this, that and everything else

Why don't you try reading the original post, maybe have a dictionary handy with you so you can understand each word deets uses.

This is not about whether porn is good bad, evil or not---it is about a wife asking her H., NOT to use porn, and him complying

It is about a wife saying to her H, if you do not stop with the porn this mge may be doomed---and whether he can get himself to stop

That is what this is about, and NOTHING ELSE----mr mike---WHAT IS IT YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND ABOUT THAT??????


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## mr.miketastic (Aug 5, 2010)

jnj express said:


> My goodness mr mike---how you throw out the alpha and the beta----DO YOU EVEN KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT?????
> 
> You sure don't have much of a grasp on the language being used on this thread
> 
> ...


I seem to understand a bit more than you do. Look up argumentum ad hominem...Ok now that you have looked it up, realize that your attack on me does not invalidate what I wrote, and is a logical fallacy that does nothing to prove your case.
I would strongly suggest _you_ re-read the posts here. The level, or lack of, marital intimacy is a crucial variable here. If, indeed, his wife is willing to engage in connubial bliss, then of course Deets should get some help with his alleged addiction. If Mrs. Deets is somehow using the bliss in question as a weapon to punish or deny, then on top of that asking him to deny his sexuality, is abusive, ridiculous and plain wrong.
In any case, you can be as against the use of p0rnography as much as you want to. I am glad that you have found something you can revile, and as well, people you can judge for having to resort to it. I can take an awful lot of abuse without flinching, having been harassed, harried and abused by true masters of the art for many years, but what really gets to me is willful stupidity, which is why I chose to respond to your screed. Now, was that a good demonstration of language? I have much more language at my disposal, I assure you, but I think it deconstructive until we hear from the OP about the situation with his life-partner...BTW that's Mr. MikeTASTIC to you, now good day sir!


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