# Quiet, unaffectionate wife



## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Hi, I'm a new member, and I searched for a place to help me understand what is going on. To explain my situation, I will try to keep things as short and to the point as possible.

First off, I love my wife, but i dont understand her. We have been together for 6-1/2 years. She rarely talks to me. It's been that way from the start. She doesn't talk about her feelings, thoughts, emotions or anything. Her vocabulary is basically casual conversation. What is for dinner, do you need anything from the store, I washed the car...etc. It's like she wont let me in. I know she talks to her mom and sister, but not me. I ask her what she is thinking and she says "nothing". Clearly her mind is somewhere else, but I don't know where.

Also, I will touch her arm or hand or leg, just a little "I love you" touch. But she never reciprocates. I wondered if she knew why I always touched her, so I finally asked one day if she knew why. She said "you are telling me that you love me". So, she knows what it means, but she has never touched me. 

And she stays engrossed in her phone almost constantly. Games, Facebook, Instagram, snapchat, texting her mom and/or sister. 

Without TMI, in the bedroom it is more of the same. She doesn't put any effort or affection into it. She doesn't talk, or make a sound. She doesn't touch me unless I tell her to. 

She doesn't work, and no kids. So it's not anything like that. I really really dont think she is cheating. An online affair may be possible, but doubtful. 

I guess what bothers me is how closed off she is. I just dont understand.

Sorry if this post was too long.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

How did you meet? What drew you to each other? Has she changed since then? If so, is there anything that happened at the time she changed?


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

As in cooking when you reduce a sauce, reduce this relationship to a core question - are you prepared to live this way for the rest of your life. Know yourself. What are your limits and terms? If you are, ultimately, prepared to live everyday hungering for human connection and being denied and shut out, then you have nothing to lose by trying to make it better and accepting defeat.

However, if this is not something you are prepared to accept for the remaining days of your life, then you have a secondary question you need to find an answer to. How much longer will you invest in this relationship? Every day you invest in this unfulfilling relationship is a day that you're stealing from a future fulfilling relationship with your new wife. These are not black and white choices, they're kind of fuzzy, meaning you do have some time to salvage this relationship and you're not going to meet a new wife tomorrow, but you will one day.

You need to know whether she has it within her to change, to open herself to you, to be the wife you need. You can try a heartfelt discussion asking her if she thinks you're happy with the marriage with her being closed off to you. Maybe that will penetrate her shell, but probably not.

Have you ever seen real surgery done a person? The surgeons cut you open, root around in your innards. Then they sew you back up. Then they leave you to heal. A pretty traumatic experience. Well, if your wife cannot force herself to change in response to a heartfelt plea from you, AND you still want to give her a shot, THEN you might need to resort to shock therapy. If you say you're leaving and file divorce papers and have her served, she'll get the message right between her eyes, you are serious about not wasting your life in an emotionless marriage and she really does need to change and open up. MAYBE the shock is enough and if it works, then you can cancel the divorce process. If the shock is not enough, then you resign yourself to what must be done in order to free you up so that you can find that woman who can offer you an emotionally enriched life.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Thank you for responding. We met at work. I saw her and was immediately attracted to her. I asked a few of the other employees about her, and found out she had been in a relationship where her boyfriend had cheated and that they had recently broken up. I waited a little while then asked her if she would like to go to dinner. She refused. We began talking during breaks, just casual stuff. A few weeks later I asked again. She still refused, saying she was torn up from the breakup and not ready. Six or eight weeks went by, and I asked again. This time, she said yes. We then started spending lots of time together. She was talkative, but not deep. As expected for new relationships. She had this..."glow". She looked like happiness was beaming from her.

About 3 years ago, she decided to quit and start up a home business selling arts and crafts. I made enough to allow that to happen. She basically had a hobby that made a little bit here and there. After a year or so, she gave it up. I guess that is when she started disappearing into her phone. I also noticed that the "glow" was faded.

To be clear, she has never really talked about emotions or feelings. She has never really been touchy/feel-y with me. I have told her multiple times that I need input from her. I would like to have her touch me like I touch her. I would like to know what she is thinking and feeling.


Lance Mannion said:


> As in cooking when you reduce a sauce, reduce this relationship to a core question - are you prepared to live this way for the rest of your life. Know yourself. What are your limits and terms? If you are, ultimately, prepared to live everyday hungering for human connection and being denied and shut out, then you have nothing to lose by trying to make it better and accepting defeat.
> 
> However, if this is not something you are prepared to accept for the remaining days of your life, then you have a secondary question you need to find an answer to. How much longer will you invest in this relationship? Every day you invest in this unfulfilling relationship is a day that you're stealing from a future fulfilling relationship with your new wife. These are not black and white choices, they're kind of fuzzy, meaning you do have some time to salvage this relationship and you're not going to meet a new wife tomorrow, but you will one day.
> 
> ...


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

I often wonder if she actually knows how to love. I am her first really serious relationship. She had boyfriends in the past, but from what little I can glean, they were not extremely serious. She mentioned once that they were not marriage material. But didn't elaborate.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> I often wonder if she actually knows how to love. I am her first really serious relationship. She had boyfriends in the past, but from what little I can glean, they were not extremely serious. She mentioned once that they were not marriage material. But didn't elaborate.


How sure are you that she really is into you? What you wrote about your courtship made it seem kind of warm and fuzzy, but not really consuming and hot and connected.

What's clear from your testimony is that you are providing her with a life, you're supporting her after her business failed. It's one thing if she is a mother to your children, but she's just a wife at this point. What does she do all day? Does her life have a purpose?

I want to add a critical point to my first comment, regarding the divorce action. If she is not responsive to a heartfelt discussion with you, don't talk about divorce, never mention it. The point here is to DO IT. Remember, you're still trying to blast through her armor and logic and pleas have not worked, so you need some heavier artillery. Surprise is essential. If you read some of the stories in the archive you'll come across episodes where the wives are down on their knees, grabbing their husband's legs as they're walking out the door, balling their eyes out, snot flowing out of their noses, their souls are torn open. I'm going to take a wild guess that you've never seen your wife in that condition. Maybe that's what it takes. I don't know, and you probably don't know either. What I do know is that if you bring up divorce and talk about it with her, you reduce the shock value of it, you take the edge off. Know your mind, make your plan, establish your limits, and then do what you must do.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

I feel like you are right. At this point, I feel used. I mean, she does do little things, like bringing me a drink at work without being prompted, or cooking a special meal for birthday or anniversary. She frequently gets me little things that are "extras" such as my favorite sauce or knickknacks that I am interested in.

I do know that her dad basically does everything for her mom. She is disabled and cant do much. He works, cleans house, cooks, grocery shops.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> I feel like you are right. At this point, I feel used. I mean, she does do little things, like bringing me a drink at work without being prompted, or cooking a special meal for birthday or anniversary. She frequently gets me little things that are "extras" such as my favorite sauce or knickknacks that I am interested in.
> 
> I do know that her dad basically does everything for her mom. She is disabled and cant do much. He works, cleans house, cooks, grocery shops.


Oh brother. Wait for some women to come to this thread and tell you whether your wife is spoiling you with those little extras. Sheesh. You are massively deprived of normal, loving gestures.

How she's behaving with you though is a distraction, the core issue is how she feels about you, why she is shutting you out of her inner life and how she physically interacts with you.

Your first order of business is for YOU to figure out what you want, what your limits are. Know yourself.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

About a month ago, she did something new. She rejected me in bed, twice in a week. I tried to initiate, and she stopped me and said she just took a shower and didn't want to get all messy down there. I said ok, and asked her to use her hand. She complained that it made her hand cramp. She also complained about giving me oral. 

She has never really been active in bed, but she has never never refused me. 

I did get ahold of her phone that night after she went to sleep and I checked everything that I could, as best as I could, and didnt find anything suspicious at all. I mean, it is possible that she could be messaging someone inside of a game, but I doubt she is due to her reaction of being cheated on by ex boyfriend.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> About a month ago, she did something new. She rejected me in bed, twice in a week. I tried to initiate, and she stopped me and said she just took a shower and didn't want to get all messy down there. I said ok, and asked her to use her hand. She complained that it made her hand cramp. She also complained about giving me oral.
> 
> She has never really been active in bed, but she has never never refused me.
> 
> I did get ahold of her phone that night after she went to sleep and I checked everything that I could, as best as I could, and didnt find anything suspicious at all. I mean, it is possible that she could be messaging someone inside of a game, but I doubt she is due to her reaction of being cheated on by ex boyfriend.


Something new and it's not good news.

Again, first order of business is to figure out what you want. If you're prepared to stay with this woman, then your next order of business is to see whether there is another man. 

If you're not prepared to stay, then pull the plug and get on with your life.

Let's recap. Always emotionally closed off, not too loving with everyday life, now beginning to shut down in the bedroom. What are you clinging to? The more you write, the more daunting becomes the "We can rebuild her" effort. At this point I suspect she's shown you who she is, there is no rebuilding, she's just not into you and so lacks any motivation to open up to you. You're just a brother-figure who funds her life of leisure.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Basically that's why I'm here. I gotta figure this out. Talking to her is basically useless, because she just wont open up. There are times when she gets mad about something that I have apparently done, but I dont have a freaking idea what it is. I ask her what is wrong, and I get silence. She has gone as long as 3 weeks without saying a single word to me. I got pissed at that point and said say something or we are done! She said "what do you want me to say?" I said "any f**king thing, silence doesn't punish me, it pisses me off!"


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Since she rejected me, I've been pretty depressed. I have pretty much shut down. I haven't given her the "I love you" touches, I have barely spoken to her. I cant seem to tell that she has even noticed. I will say that she did initiate sex about a week ago and I did accept, but I wasn't into it. I did my duty and went to sleep. There wasnt any of my normal foreplay. Just hit it and went to sleep.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

This is getting worse and worse the more you reveal. Gone for 3 weeks? You mean she actually has emotions? You're being a doormat, she's using you, she's NOT INVESTED in you other than as a guy funding her life. There are way better women out there. I know it's a hard decision, but really, what redeeming qualities of hers are you clinging to, other than your familiarity with her?


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> Since she rejected me, I've been pretty depressed. I have pretty much shut down. I haven't given her the "I love you" touches, I have barely spoken to her. I cant seem to tell that she has even noticed. I will say that she did initiate sex about a week ago and I did accept, but I wasn't into it. I did my duty and went to sleep. There wasnt any of my normal foreplay. Just hit it and went to sleep.


A woman who is invested in her man is highly attuned to his moods, if your wife can't tell what is going on with you, then she's focused on her life, her interests, her dreams, and you're an intrusion on that life, just keep the money coming in, keep her sheltered and fed.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

I keep asking myself. I am emotionally connected to her and I am devoted to her. I guess it is a reverse relationship. Usually n posts that I've read, it's the woman who is emotionally needy and clingy and the guy who is closed off.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> I keep asking myself. I am emotionally connected to her and I am devoted to her. I guess it is a reverse relationship. Usually n posts that I've read, it's the woman who is emotionally needy and clingy and the guy who is closed off.


Maybe you are needy and clingy but if she's a closed-off iceberg then you might just be a normal guy with normal needs for emotional connection.

Why are you connected to her? Inertia? Why are you devoted to her? Inertia? Marriages are a "What have you done for me lately?" kind of deal, they have to be kept alive, tended to, invested in, so what has she done lately that makes you devoted to her, keeps you connected to her?

You need to face the very real possibility that if you're not there meeting her emotional and sexual needs, that they're being met by another man and she has all day, every day, at her disposal to engage with that man while you are at work.

Tell us why you want to salvage this marriage? If you can't convince yourself, then start the 180 and get mentally prepared fo a new life with a woman who IS INTO YOU and shows you she is into you. That's a huge prize waiting for you after you extricate yourself from this relationship, you'll feel alive again.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

I think she may be struggling with depression, but I dont know. Maybe a mental illness? 

I/we did say: "to have and to hold from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health, to love and to cherish, till death do us part"


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> I think she may be struggling with depression, but I dont know. Maybe a mental illness?
> 
> I/we did say: "to have and to hold from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health, to love and to cherish, till death do us part"


You need answers about her and you need answers about you, are you prepared to live with this status quo for the rest of your life.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

As far as during the day, while I am at work, i suspected that she could be doing something. BUT, we have surveillance cameras all around our house. She doesn't leave and nobody shows up. I have been checking the cameras daily. If she does leave, I check the time she is gone and it is within 5 minutes of what is expected to take for the reason she leaves. For example, grocery run, or pharmacy, etc. I see grocery bags in her hands, or pharmacy bags or fast food. And they match up with bank account. She NEVER uses cash, only debit card.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Its obvious that the status quo isn't what I want. I want the girl I dated and married. That's why I'm here trying to find anything that can help. I want to be with her, I love her. But, I have to either get her undivided attention or I gotta get away. This is tearing me up inside. My head spins trying to think. I dont sleep.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

I also am questioning hormones. She was on depo shots for 5-ish years. I/we decided to get a vasectomy 2-ish years ago. We did discuss kids and it was very very clear we didn't want any. (We both grew up basically raising younger siblings). I've read that the depo shots can screw up hormones with long term use.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> Its obvious that the status quo isn't what I want. I want the girl I dated and married. That's why I'm here trying to find anything that can help. I want to be with her, I love her. But, I have to either get her undivided attention or I gotta get away. This is tearing me up inside. My head spins trying to think. I dont sleep.


Who was that girl you married? Was she emotionally open and giving back then or were you still deep in the infatuation fog and saw her as you wanted to see her? There could be an important clue here, can she be an emotionally open person because she once was, or has she always been that way?


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

That's a good question. I'm not sure if I was seeing her differently because I was in the fog of infatuation or what. You know, we were newly "in love" and we did alot more things together. We texted almost constantly. She was more sexually open. She tried a few new things. To be honest, I had a little bit of a hard time keeping up with her in bed. Gradually that tapered down, but was regular. 

Did she just get complacent because the new wore off? Was she planning on a dumb, emotional, devoted schmuck to come along and support her? Is she trying to turn me into her dad and her into her mom?


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## Mezman (Dec 12, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> Its obvious that the status quo isn't what I want. I want the girl I dated and married. That's why I'm here trying to find anything that can help. I want to be with her, I love her. But, I have to either get her undivided attention or I gotta get away. This is tearing me up inside. My head spins trying to think. I dont sleep.


Dude, i just signed up so I could reply to you, I have a wife who is maybe a lot like yours.

We have been together for 16 years, in the beginning I was enamoured with her and she stood by me through some personal losses and illness. 

She never cried in front of me nor asked how I felt. She never really initiated sex much or told me she loved me with out me saying it first.
We had two kids at my insistence and that gave me the physical bonds that I need. However she never rely changed and I often felt like if I was to disappear, she wouldn't notice provided the bills got paid.

So why am I telling you this? Because the kids got older and they didn't need or want daddy hugs anymore. My sex life was mechanical and was never tender. My wife refused to kiss during and had to be shamed into it most of the time.

Fast forward to now. I am ashamed to admit it but I had an EA, the guilt broke me and I was left suffering depression. 

I needed space so I left my wife, she couldn't believe id done it, o top of that I got a girlfriend. My wife was devastated! She cried a lot more than I'd ever seen in the previous years. 

The point im trying to make is, you're allowing her to treat you in a way that doesn't meet your needs. If she can't or won't meet those relationship needs. You owe it to yourself to get out.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Mezman said:


> Dude, i just signed up so I could reply to you, I have a wife who is maybe a lot like yours.
> 
> We have been together for 16 years, in the beginning I was enamoured with her and she stood by me through some personal losses and illness.
> 
> ...


Thank you for joining just to reply. 

I cant understand the way my wife and yours are. I really dont want to abandon her or hurt her. But things have to change. 

I once read a meme that said 25% of American women are on medication for mood disorders, the other 75% are running around untreated.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Mezman said:


> I needed space so I left my wife, she couldn't believe id done it, o top of that I got a girlfriend. My wife was devastated! She cried a lot more than I'd ever seen in the previous years.


Welcome dude! 

Coffee1980, pay attention to the quote above. When Mezman left his wife, he cracked her armor. People need to hit rock-bottom sometimes.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Yeah, Mezman, she never says "I love you" anymore. It's always "I love you, too"...after I say it. I always tell her how beautiful she is. But thinking back, I cant say that she has ever said I was handsome. She did say that she doesn't like me to be clean shaven, so I grew a beard just for her. She doesn't comment about the beard, unless I say something about shaving it or trimming it short, then she says that "I don't look right" and tells me to keep it.


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## Mezman (Dec 12, 2020)

In my wife's case, she lacks confidence, I am out going and gregarious, enough for both of us. She became lazy at life, stopped making an effort to grow and lived life mechanically. 

She cares out me in her way, but her needs are so different to mine. Just to give you the full picture, we are back together now but with a commitment to work toward meeting my needs. 

Me leaving her was the kick up the bum she needed. Some here might say she's doing whats required to keep the gravy train going. But as I'm not the thought police I can only judge her by her actions, which up to now have been good.

Please dont let this fester, tackle it now or the resentment will build and you'll end up having an affair when someone pours water on your dried up oasis of needs.

And we all know how cheaters get treated o this forum


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> But thinking back, I cant say that she has ever said I was handsome.


Don't sweat this point though, that's just women.

I've brought this point up at a number of mixed-sex gatherings, ask women when was the last time they were complemented, many say a "few hours ago" or "yesterday" or even "just last week" and then when you ask the men the same question you hear "2004" and "1990" like years and decades between complements and the women are shocked and saddened.


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## Mezman (Dec 12, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> Yeah, Mezman, she never says "I love you" anymore. It's always "I love you, too"...after I say it. I always tell her how beautiful she is. But thinking back, I cant say that she has ever said I was handsome. She did say that she doesn't like me to be clean shaven, so I grew a beard just for her. She doesn't comment about the beard, unless I say something about shaving it or trimming it short, then she says that "I don't look right" and tells me to keep it.


Its like we married tbe same gal, just seemingly 15 years apart


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Lance Mannion said:


> Welcome dude!
> 
> Coffee1980, pay attention to the quote above. When Mezman left his wife, he cracked her armor. People need to hit rock-bottom sometimes.


I question if it would bother her. Last summer I got tired of the silent treatment, got up, opened the door, walked out slamming it behind me. I got in my truck and squalled the tires as I left. I was gone almost all day. I never got a text, call, nothing. Finally came back home and we talked. Argued. But I never saw a tear from her. For a few days, things did get a little better, but it gradually went right back to same old, same old.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Mezman said:


> In my wife's case, she lacks confidence, I am out going and gregarious, enough for both of us. She became lazy at life, stopped making an effort to grow and lived life mechanically.
> 
> She cares out me in her way, but her needs are so different to mine. Just to give you the full picture, we are back together now but with a commitment to work toward meeting my needs.
> 
> ...


I hope people spare you the 2x4s. Your insight has been valuable. Besides, you're not the topic of this thread.


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## Mezman (Dec 12, 2020)

Lance Mannion said:


> Don't sweat this point though, that's just women.
> 
> I've brought this point up at a number of mixed-sex gatherings, ask women when was the last time they were complemented, many say a "few hours ago" or "yesterday" or even "just last week" and then when you ask the men the same question you hear "2004" and "1990" like years and decades between complements and the women are shocked and saddened.


Respectfully disagree with you there, if hear compliments is your love language, why shouldn't your partner make the small effort to meet your need


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Mezman said:


> Respectfully disagree with you there, if hear compliments is your love language, why shouldn't your partner make the small effort to meet your need


I agree, but now you've consciously brought this to the forefront. What I was talking about was cultural behavior. Men seem to go long periods without receiving complements as a natural part of social interaction.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Mezman said:


> In my wife's case, she lacks confidence, I am out going and gregarious, enough for both of us. She became lazy at life, stopped making an effort to grow and lived life mechanically.


THIS IS MY WIFE! Mechanical! That description fits.


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## Mezman (Dec 12, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> I question if it would bother her. Last summer I got tired of the silent treatment, got up, opened the door, walked out slamming it behind me. I got in my truck and squalled the tires as I left. I was gone almost all day. I never got a text, call, nothing. Finally came back home and we talked. Argued. But I never saw a tear from her. For a few days, things did get a little better, but it gradually went right back to same old, same
> 
> 
> Coffee1980 said:
> ...


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Thinking back, I'm now questioning the money funding her life of leisure comment that Lance made. I remember she said that all she would have had with her ex was a run down trailer house, if she had married him.

Was that a bad thing or a good thing? Makes me wonder if she married the guy with an actual house?


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

My mind spins and thoughts swim. I worry that I blow things out of proportion by over thinking, by my not knowing. I just wish she would unlock her emotions and just freaking talk to me! I dont want to make decisions based on thoughts that grow and grow and feed off each other.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> Thinking back, I'm now questioning the money funding her life of leisure comment that Lance made. I remember she said that all she would have had with her ex was a run down trailer house, if she had married him.
> 
> Was that a bad thing or a good thing? Makes me wonder if she married the guy with an actual house?


You're still looking at her and trying to understand her. Stop that! Right now you need to figure out what you want in your life, will you put up with her as she is presently and put up for the rest of your life? If not, then you have to come to terms with being prepared to walk. This is the first order of business. You. Your needs. What you're prepared to do to get your needs fulfilled. How far will you go? Once you know your mind then you can assess what is going on with your wife and what you're prepare to do with her or about her.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> My mind spins and thoughts swim. I worry that I blow things out of proportion by over thinking, by my not knowing.* I just wish she would unlock her emotions and just freaking talk to me! *I dont want to make decisions based on thoughts that grow and grow and feed off each other.


You're being reactive here, living your life in response to hers. That's no way to live. You have your needs, make decisions for your own welfare. Then see if there is room in that for her to enter your frame, your journey.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Ok, so what I'm understanding is that she and I need to have a serious serious heart to heart and she either changes, or I call it quits?


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## Mezman (Dec 12, 2020)

Lance is speaking sense here, you know your not happy with the status quo. So decide what your willing to do about it and act. 

I took too long, heed my warning, tackle this now, or you will resent yourself as well as your wife later down the line


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> Ok, so what I'm understanding is that she and I need to have a serious serious heart to heart and she either changes, or I call it quits?


That's later. It's like a business negotiation, you know your bottom line before you begin the negotiation. You have a vision of what you're trying to shape. If you go into that negotiation and start negotiating on the fly, you'll get eaten alive.

Figure out what you want in your life, will you live this way forever? Then what are you prepared to do. If you are prepared to divorce, don't bluff, do not bluff. You can start and then stop the divorce, but you do need to file if that is the road you're going to take.

Once you know what you want, then your first move with her is to have a talk. Don't use the stick of divorce as a threat, that stick is just empty words, it will have little shock value. The shock value comes for the doing, her being served and you going incommunicado. Let the tension build for her. If there is no tension for her, then you have your answer, and you proceed with the divorce. Don't buckle at that point because if you cave from weakness, then you've consigned yourself to a life of living next to a stone.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Lance, Mezman, I appreciate you guys spending your time talking about this with me. It really has helped me to get it out of my head. This weekend is going to be a tough one, but it's time for it.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> Lance, Mezman, I appreciate you guys spending your time talking about this with me. It really has helped me to get it out of my head. This weekend is going to be a tough one, but it's time for it.


Don't jump the gun. There is no rush. Figure yourself out. If you're prepared to live a life without her, possibly with some future woman, mull this thing over for a while. Have a vision, make a plan, execute that plan when it is best for you, be it mentally best, financially best, or some other factor.

If divorce could be in the cards, go talk to a lawyer. Don't be a "Leeroy Jenkins" and rush into battle. Slow down, think all this through, know yourself, build up some resolve. Don't make this weekend a desperation play.


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## Mezman (Dec 12, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> Lance, Mezman, I appreciate you guys spending your time talking about this with me. It really has helped me to get it out of my head. This weekend is going to be a tough one, but it's time for it.


Good luck brother, I hope it works out in a way that is best for you both


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Also, wait for other members to arrive to this now active thread and give you their opinion. All you've been reading is two guys. Other people will have a fresh perspective to offer you. Don't rush and think about your life and what YOU want.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Lance Mannion said:


> Also, wait for other members to arrive to this now active thread and give you their opinion. All you've been reading is two guys. Other people will have a fresh perspective to offer you. Don't rush and think about your life and what YOU want.


Excellent point. Thank you! That's what I was saying earlier. My thoughts get blown up. My mind and heart are a tangled mess.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> Excellent point. Thank you! That's what I was saying earlier. My thoughts get blown up. My mind and heart are a tangled mess.


Right, and that's why there is no rush for some confrontation this weekend. Cool as a cucumber. Take time to think. Take time to plan. See a lawyer. Understand what the future looks like if you walk down one path and for that other path picture yourself living emotionally cut-off from your wife for another 20 or 40 or more years.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Nobody has mentioned mental issues. My wife is exactly like that. After 10 year together, she mentioned that she was suffering from repetitive, harmful, invasive and negative thoughts. She started taking anti-depressants. She would be isolating herself, often trying to concentrate on something and not talking to me at all. I later found out she was trying to keep those thoughts out of her mind by concentrating on other activities and ignoring everything else. She was battling an invisible demon. It's a form of OCD, called "pure O", were the person doesn't act on the disturbing thoughts. She would get in her head this image of all the children dying in a car accident, for example. Unfortunately, since she didn't involve me in this, didn't talk to me about it, I failed to support her and became angry, then isolated myself. But I didn't know the extent of it. She would say to me that she was "fine". But it was the nature of her illness, the inability to talk about it. I would look into this. Your wife's behaviour is not "normal", but maybe it's due to some mental issues...


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> Ok, so what I'm understanding is that she and I need to have a serious serious heart to heart and she either changes, or I call it quits?


Reading this thread, yes.

Once I snapped out of the fog I was in with my wife (different problem) I immediately initiated a talk where my wife figured out I would seriously end it if we continued as-is. She used language like, “Well I don’t want a divorce.”

So I offered to change some things but ultimately since I was the one who would leave it was clear to her she needed to make big moves towards what I wanted otherwise that’s it. If last night is any indicator it’s still working...

Note also that you need to be willing to actually do it. My wife knows I always do what I say so everything was communicated from my end perfectly. From her end not so much. Took a couple follow up talks over the next week for me to understand what she was actually trying to communicate.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

@Coffee1980 Welcome to the world of being married to a high functioning Asperger's.

She seems like my wife.

Has she been diagnosed as ASD?


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## Luckylucky (Dec 11, 2020)

Can I please ask why you are watching her every move on the camera all the time, timing how long she’s gone etc and checking bank statements? This is concerning to me. I hope I haven’t missed something.


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## pastasauce79 (Mar 21, 2018)

My dad is very unaffectionate, very stiff, rude. He's in his 70's and I wonder if he's in the spectrum. I don't know how my mom has lived without affection from him for over 45 years. 

Growing up with someone who doesn't show affection, it has been hard for me to show affection. It's funny but I need a lot of it, little touches, holding hands, kisses, hugs, etc. and it feels weird to initiate those actions. Since I didn't have a good balance at home, I always second guess if I'm being too dry or too syrupy around my husband, it has been hard to figure out when it's too little or too much. I'm not sure if I make sense. 

Maybe your wife doesn't know how to show affection or emotions? If she grew up in a cold environment she might not know what is a balanced, healthy relationship. I had to learn how to have a good and balanced relationship. 

Maybe you both need a counselor who can dig deep inside her mind and help both of you figure things out. Ask her what's her idea of a good relationship? 

I also think she should go back to work. Leaving the house and being active helps with the moods.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Coffee1980 said:


> My mind spins and thoughts swim. I worry that I blow things out of proportion by over thinking, by my not knowing. I just wish she would unlock her emotions and just freaking talk to me! I dont want to make decisions based on thoughts that grow and grow and feed off each other.


You are definitely over-thinking things, and allowing your unchecked thoughts to spin out of control...which is something I completely understand, but you need to help yourself out and keep things in perspective!

From how you describe your wife, I don't think she will EVER "unlock her emotions" with you -- it's just not HER way. And it sounds like you married her knowing she was like this (although maybe less so than now), so something about her personality being that way must have appealed to you. 

I don't think she is using you at all, and I believe that she does love you. If you are unhappy with her becoming more detached, maybe you should think about how she has changed and what concerns you about that, and then TALK to her specifically about it. 

But you need to realize that you are NOT going to be able to change her into a more expressive person than she naturally is. If she has never been emotional and physically affectionate, and you married her that way, it's not fair of you to expect her to change - that would be like her asking you to stop being emotional and affectionate. You wouldn't be able to do that and be happy.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Luckylucky said:


> Can I please ask why you are watching her every move on the camera all the time, timing how long she’s gone etc and checking bank statements? This is concerning to me. I hope I haven’t missed something.


This is normal advice for someone who is checking if their partner is having an affair...it's not as concerning as it sounds.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

Coffee1980 said:


> To be clear, she has never really talked about emotions or feelings. She has never really been touchy/feel-y with me. I have told her multiple times that I need input from her. I would like to have her touch me like I touch her. I would like to know what she is thinking and feeling.


So she's *never* been affectionate or emotional with you, yet you married her *anyway*, KNOWING this?

And now, years later, you claim you feel like you're being "used" by her because - *surprise* - she's STILL basically the same person she always was and is not affectionate with you?

What am I missing here?

Did you think she was just going to magically change into someone else if you married her?

I don't mean to sound snarky, but you can't cry foul now just because _you_ foolishly chose to marry someone you clearly already knew wasn't giving you what you need.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

In Absentia said:


> Nobody has mentioned mental issues. My wife is exactly like that. After 10 year together, she mentioned that she was suffering from repetitive, harmful, invasive and negative thoughts. She started taking anti-depressants. She would be isolating herself, often trying to concentrate on something and not talking to me at all. I later found out she was trying to keep those thoughts out of her mind by concentrating on other activities and ignoring everything else. She was battling an invisible demon. It's a form of OCD, called "pure O", were the person doesn't act on the disturbing thoughts. She would get in her head this image of all the children dying in a car accident, for example. Unfortunately, since she didn't involve me in this, didn't talk to me about it, I failed to support her and became angry, then isolated myself. But I didn't know the extent of it. She would say to me that she was "fine". But it was the nature of her illness, the inability to talk about it. I would look into this. Your wife's behaviour is not "normal", but maybe it's due to some mental issues...


How were you able to find out? This could be her.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

Luckylucky said:


> Can I please ask why you are watching her every move on the camera all the time, timing how long she’s gone etc and checking bank statements? This is concerning to me. I hope I haven’t missed something.


Only the last couple of weeks. Big red flag was her rejecting me in bed. I immediately assumed she was cheating. Absolutely no evidence of cheating anywhere.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Coffee1980 said:


> How were you able to find out? This could be her.


She told me she was having those thoughts. At the beginning I was selfish, I didn't understand it and I was only worried about our sex life (because of the anti-depressants). When I didn't get anywhere talking, I felt rejected, I started withdrawing, I isolated myself and became difficult to live with. We nearly divorced over it. Then we agreed to make it work. We had to schedule sex, but it was ok. She told me she was going to therapy, but then back-tracked. When the last daughter left for uni last year, she cut off our sex life and told me she did it to keep the family together. She lied to me for 10 years. I started researching the matter and everything clicked. But it was too late. She had detached. We are still together but like brother and sister and we will be separating when this stupid Covid thing is over. I can't live like this.

What I'm trying to say: don't get sad, depressed or angry etc. She is probably not doing this on purpose. It's too blatant. Investigate and be patient.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

She'sStillGotIt said:


> So she's *never* been affectionate or emotional with you, yet you married her *anyway*, KNOWING this?
> 
> And now, years later, you claim you feel like you're being "used" by her because - *surprise* - she's STILL basically the same person she always was and is not affectionate with you?
> 
> ...


When things were fresh and new, she did show some affection. I assumed she was shy and it would grow. 6 years later it has died instead of grow. If that makes sense. There used to be a spark, an ember. But it went out. I've had a few serious relationships in the past, but I've never experienced someone like her. So closed off.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

In Absentia said:


> She told me she was having those thoughts. At the beginning I was selfish, I didn't understand it and I was only worried about our sex life (because of the anti-depressants). When I didn't get anywhere talking, I felt rejected, I started withdrawing, I isolated myself and became difficult to live with. We nearly divorce over it. Then we agreed to make it work. We had to schedule sex, but it was ok. She told me she was going to therapy, but then back-tracked. When the last daughter left for uni last year, she cut off our sex life and told me she did it to keep the family together. She lied to me for 10 years. I started researching the matter and everything clicked. But it was too late. She had detached. We are still together but like brother and sister and we will be separating when this stupid Covid thing is over. I can't live like this.
> 
> What I'm trying to say: don't get sad, depressed or angry etc. She is probably not doing it on purpose. Investigate and be patient.


There could be something to this. I had mentioned in an earlier post that I was wondering if she could be depressed or have mental issues. Her answers are always "nothing is wrong" or "I'm fine" when I ask. I know those are female code for "something is wrong" and "I'm not fine" but she wont tell me.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Coffee1980 said:


> There could be something to this. I had mentioned in an earlier post that I was wondering if she could be depressed or have mental issues. Her answers are always "nothing is wrong" or "I'm fine" when I ask. I know those are female code for "something is wrong" and "I'm not fine" but she wont tell me.


Sounds very familiar... we are speculating, obviously, but my wife changed immensely when she started having these thoughts. She's always been rather reserved and private, but I could tell she was happy with me and that she loved me. Then, 10 years into our marriage things changed. With the thoughts, her job and the children, there was no capacity left for me. Something had to give. I know now, but it's been a rather painful journey. I understood lots of "weird" behaviours. We haven't really talked directly about this recently, but she was gracious enough to split the blame 50/50...


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

In Absentia said:


> Sounds very familiar... we are speculating, obviously, but my wife changed immensely when she started having these thoughts. She's always been rather reserved and private, but I could tell she was happy with me and that she loved me. Then, 10 years into our marriage things changed. With the thoughts, her job and the children, there was no capacity left for me. Something had to give. I know now, but it's been a rather painful journey. We haven't really talked directly about this recently, but she was gracious enough to split the blame 50/50...


This sounds more and more like her. I described her "glow". It was a happy glow. Quiet, but happy. That glow has faded away. And it is dragging me down too. You hit the nail on the head about what it is doing to me. I'm shutting down and closing off too. I've crawled inside my head and that makes things worse for me.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> Hi, I'm a new member, and I searched for a place to help me understand what is going on. To explain my situation, I will try to keep things as short and to the point as possible.
> 
> First off, I love my wife, but i dont understand her. We have been together for 6-1/2 years. She rarely talks to me. It's been that way from the start. She doesn't talk about her feelings, thoughts, emotions or anything. Her vocabulary is basically casual conversation. What is for dinner, do you need anything from the store, I washed the car...etc. It's like she wont let me in. I know she talks to her mom and sister, but not me. I ask her what she is thinking and she says "nothing". Clearly her mind is somewhere else, but I don't know where.
> 
> ...


How old is she? Is she of the internet generation, some of whom never learned to socialize, maybe? 

Also, why did you marry her? 

While it sounds like she's always been this way, it's worth asking if you have developed a parental role over her, become a father figure or brother figure. The only reason I ask is because the way she says "nothing" is reminiscent of every teenager on earth who doesn't want to talk to their parent. Taking on a familiar role will certainly destroy romance. Not saying that's it, but it just came to mine. Why did you marry her??


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Coffee1980 said:


> This sounds more and more like her. I described her "glow". It was a happy glow. Quiet, but happy. That glow has faded away. And it is dragging me down too. You hit the nail on the head about what it is doing to me. I'm shutting down and closing off too. I've crawled inside my head and that makes things worse for me.


The difficult bit is that they don't want to talk to you, everything is fine, so you have no idea what to do. All I can say, do not get angry with her. This is what I did and made things 100% worse. Be gentle and maybe she will open up to you. It's also possible she is in the spectrum, as Matt Matt said...


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Lance Mannion said:


> A woman who is invested in her man is highly attuned to his moods, if your wife can't tell what is going on with you, then she's focused on her life, her interests, her dreams, and you're an intrusion on that life, just keep the money coming in, keep her sheltered and fed.


Are we leaving no room for mental health issues, are saying that it doesn't matter? They're both fairly young; there's no massive rolling rock of momentum to try and stop. 

I don't think it would be fair for him to blindside his wife with a divorce out of the blue, no discussion at all. Even though it feels likely that she might feel like she made a mistake, dating him on the rebound too soon. I think discovering the "why" behind everything could be good for both. Whether there's anything worth saving here depends upon the "why" and what each party is willing to accept and what each is willing to change.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

She is 37. I dont think I have become a "father" to her, at least I dont feel like I have. She is into "younger culture" . Her taste in music and tv and such is what I'd say is geared toward 20-somethings, not late 
30-somethings. 

Why I married her? She was and is very beautiful to me. She has always cared for her appearance. We had and have similar interests in general. Our ideas of fun are similar. There is some kind of mental connection. It's strange that I can be thinking what I'd like for supper, then come home and voila, that's what we are having. I often comment to her how I was just thinking that about what she said or did.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

In Absentia said:


> The difficult bit is that they don't want to talk to you, everything is fine, so you have no idea what to do. All I can say, do not get angry with her. This is what I did and made things 100% worse. Be gentle and maybe she will open up to you. It's also possible she is in the spectrum, as Matt Matt said...


But by the time either you or I became "angry" with our spouses, there was so much momentum for things staying the same way (for our spouse) that it was probably an impossible task. For OP, that might not be the case yet. It's possible that now is the time for anger and visible disappointment, because there still might be a memory (for her) of when things were different. The momentum thing just rolls over and destroys those memories. They become part of someone else. What doesn't make sense after decades could be very useful after, say, less than 10 years. 

Guess I'm suggesting that people become hardened over time (kind of obvious?) and no longer see options, just more of the same. They become emotionally detached in a permanent way. Looking back, knowing what you know now, things could have been very different for me, probably for you, had I been more open about the issues, more willing to sacrifice everything to save everything.


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## Coffee1980 (Dec 12, 2020)

To be honest, I feel bad about talking like this, behind her back, so to speak. But I have to get my thoughts out of my head and sorted out. I dont want to lose her, but I dont want to live like this anymore. 

I have never done the serious talk of it will change or we are done. I have always tried to be less aggressive and tried to be as careful with her feelings as possible. 

Maybe a serious and unfiltered talk will help.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Sometimes we pick the wrong partner. Some will waste years trying to figure out what to do. I‘d re-evaluate, have a forthright discussion with her. If not you could be living this same scenario 5, 10, 15 or 20 years from now. Most will do anything to not make a needed decison.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> She is 37. I dont think I have become a "father" to her, at least I dont feel like I have. She is into "younger culture" . Her taste in music and tv and such is what I'd say is geared toward 20-somethings, not late
> 30-somethings.
> 
> Why I married her? She was and is very beautiful to me. She has always cared for her appearance. We had and have similar interests in general. Our ideas of fun are similar. There is some kind of mental connection. It's strange that I can be thinking what I'd like for supper, then come home and voila, that's what we are having. I often comment to her how I was just thinking that about what she said or did.


Well, if your ideas of fun are the same, try having more fun together. Maybe she's bored. I mean, you always knew she was quiet, right?


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Coffee1980 said:


> I think she may be struggling with depression, but I dont know. Maybe a mental illness?
> 
> I/we did say: "to have and to hold from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health, to love and to cherish, till death do us part"


I would add, but it is may be too early for this..

Could she be on-the-spectrum, suffering from high functioning Aspergers.

This aloofness, and coolness may have been the reason the former boyfriend cheated on her.
He wasn't getting what he wanted from her, so he cheated.

She knows she is flawed, knows she has issues, but may not be able to surmount them.
She feels the cucumber in a spicy pickle world.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

When young I had a red haired girlfriend, a solid 10.
After a year of dating, I called it quits.

She was a mute, would not discuss anything!

However, she was very, very HD. That kept me around for a year.

I have an urgent sense of humor and I could never get her to laugh.
So serious, was she. 

She was a good listener though, and loved the outdoors!

I would consider calling it quits with her.

It is either this, or is depression, or she still has a flame for her ex and she is not interested in you sexually.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Non-compatibility..... nothing more.....nothing less.

There is nothing “wrong” with either of you. You made a poor marriage decision because you were hot for her.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

Coffee1980 said:


> To be honest, I feel bad about talking like this, behind her back, so to speak. But I have to get my thoughts out of my head and sorted out. I dont want to lose her, but I dont want to live like this anymore.
> 
> I have never done the serious talk of it will change or we are done. I have always tried to be less aggressive and tried to be as careful with her feelings as possible.
> 
> Maybe a serious and unfiltered talk will help.


See, I told you you'd be getting good advice from others. I still hold that your first order of business if for you to ruminate on your possible paths forward, truly understand what it is that you want and what lengths you will go to get what you want. Talk to a lawyer and understand what is involved in moving on from her. Who knows, the more real that road becomes the more heartbreak you may feel and so abandon it and consign yourself to a life being lived as it is presently. This is what I mean about truly knowing what you need and want and will do, you don't want to be whipsawing back and forth after you set your plan in action.

First, know your mind, and heart, and then talk with her and work with her. Then evaluate.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

I could be wrong, but I see escapism. She seems things to take her mind off of something else. It is something my wife and I both do. 

How does she feel about her failed business venture? About quitting her job? 

Also, stop asking yes/no questions. If she can answer with yes/no/fine, you asked it incorrectly.

Instead of, "Are you okay?"

Try, "How do you feel about X?"

Then follow it up with either "In what way?" or "How so?"

I don't necessarily see an affair here, but rather someone who is introverted, and content to be so. 

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

My wife is much like this. When we were dating there were many times I was thinking that she was the most nonverbal, nonexpressive and noncommunicative woman I had ever been with. 

In some ways it was pleasant and refreshing since I wasn’t dealing with all the drama and chaos and insecurity all the time. 

But if you are a guy that needs a lot of high emotional energy and stimulation, then these women may not be for you. 

Hound dogs do not win dog races and bulldogs do not win those agility contests and rat terriers do not herd sheep.

Not all women are emotional just like not all men are logical and analytic. 

From what you have said here, I don’t see any kind of pathology (mental issues) nor do I see any malfeasance (cheating). 

I think this is just how she is. 

I don’t think she’s doing anything wrong nor do I think you’ve don’t anything wrong or necessarily anything to hurt or anger her to the point of losing attraction to you.

In essence, that kind of means there may be nothing to “fix” here. 

You are kind of getting to the 7-year-itch point where the initial passions and new relationship energy on are their natural decline and you do tend to kind of transition into companionate and domestic relationship rather than the passionate and high-emotion of a new relationship. 

As there’s really no bad behavior to correct or relationship issues to fix here, your choice is basically if this is good enough for you or not. And whether you choose to stay and accept it or not accept it and move on.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Now some of the posters have suggested you may see tears and pleas if you leave. 

There may be some truth to that, she may become emotional and upset if you throw in the towel - but is that what you really want? 

Are you going to have to pack bags and file every time you want to see some emotion out of her??? That would make you the drama queen. 

Bottom line here is this is who and what she is. Your choice is if you can live with that or not.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

oldshirt said:


> Now some of the posters have suggested you may see tears and pleas if you leave.
> 
> There may be some truth to that, she may become emotional and upset if you throw in the towel - but is that what you really want?
> 
> ...


I see that more as a "Hit Rock Bottom" event which allows the person to begin a process of self-reflection and change.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Lance Mannion said:


> I see that more as a "Hit Rock Bottom" event which allows the person to begin a process of self-reflection and change.


If you mean self-reflection and change FOR HER, I don't think you are being very fair -- "rock bottom" implies that she has behaviors that ought to be changed, and from what I've read, she is behaving honestly the way she IS...she has NO reason to change herself, especially because the OP married her knowing she was like this.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

LisaDiane said:


> If you mean self-reflection and change FOR HER, I don't think you are being very fair -- "rock bottom" implies that she has behaviors that ought to be changed, and from what I've read, she is behaving honestly the way she IS...she has NO reason to change herself, especially because the OP married her knowing she was like this.


I don't think we've actually established that this is how she is. He wrote about how she used to be early in the relationship and how she is different now. I question the OP on whether what he saw back in the early days was through rose-colored glasses, but he wasn't sure.

So, we're left with his impression that she used to have a spark and was more outgoing (clearly emotional enough not to ring alarm bells for him and so they got married) and now she's not.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Lance Mannion said:


> I don't think we've actually established that this is how she is. He wrote about how she used to be early in the relationship and how she is different now. I question the OP on whether what he saw back in the early days was through rose-colored glasses, but he wasn't sure.
> 
> So, we're left with his impression that she used to have a spark and was more outgoing (clearly emotional enough not to ring alarm bells for him and so they got married) and now she's not.


Hmm...well, I heard it more like, she was never very affectionate or emotional, but she was very attractive to him so he married her...and I'm NOT saying he's wrong for that, just pointing out what I read in his posts.


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## Mezman (Dec 12, 2020)

LisaDiane said:


> Hmm...well, I heard it more like, she was never very affectionate or emotional, but she was very attractive to him so he married her...and I'm NOT saying he's wrong for that, just pointing out what I read in his posts.


I think that what is clear is that there are needs going unmet in the marriage and this needs to be addressed. We have only heard one side of the story, but as lance pointed out, the OP needs to decide what he is willing to accept and proceed accordingly.

I joined this conversation because I saw some of my own experience in the OP and wanted to offer my experience in the hope he might benefit from not making the same mess I did. Regardless of how my situation has ended, it was not the experience I would have chosen for myself or my wife


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

LisaDiane said:


> Hmm...well, I heard it more like, she was never very affectionate or emotional, but she was very attractive to him so he married her...and I'm NOT saying he's wrong for that, just pointing out what I read in his posts.


Post #61 and also brought up earlier.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Lance Mannion said:


> Post #61 and also brought up earlier.


But dearest Lance, that's the exact post that I took to mean she was quiet and reserved, and he thought she was shy and would come out of it (ie: CHANGE)...and I did understand that she has become MORE detached (and I believe he should address THAT with her), but she was never emotional and expressive like what he is now saying he wants.


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## Lance Mannion (Nov 24, 2020)

LisaDiane said:


> But dearest Lance, that's the exact post that I took to mean she was quiet and reserved, and he thought she was shy and would come out of it (ie: CHANGE)...and I did understand that she has become MORE detached (and I believe he should address THAT with her), but she was never emotional and expressive like what he is now saying he wants.


Well, she was expressive enough for him to not be worried about marrying her and then she got less expressive. If he could get her back to the state of expression from their early relationship, would that be enough for him to be happy?


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## leftfield (Mar 29, 2016)

My wife has a lot of similarities with your wife, especially in regards to being quite and not expressing much of anything. I know it can be very challenging. 

You have received a lot of good ideas from people here. I just wanted to mention a few things that have not been well covered by others.

I think you are really dealing with more than one issue and you need to recognize this. The first issue you have is that your wife is not meeting your emotional needs. A second issue is that your wife is far to invested in her digital life and not invested enough in her real life. There may be a third or fourth issue as well, such as depression, etc. May I suggest that you try and figure out all of the issues that are causing problems in your marriage. Then you will have more knowledge to move forward with.


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## hamadryad (Aug 30, 2020)

I didn't read all the replies, but the jist I am getting is you test drove the car, heard the engine knocking, bought it anyway, and now you don't know why or how the engine seized up....

It's unlikely(Id even say very highly unlikely) that this will ever work to your satisfaction...If there are no kids involved, be thankful as it will be a lot easier, but my advice would be to plan an exit strategy...no way on earth would I or most men want to deal with that kind of a woman....It doesn't necessarily mean she is "bad" just that if you are describing it properly and accurately, she will be better off with someone else, maybe....and so would you...


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Coffee1980 said:


> Ok, so what I'm understanding is that she and I need to have a serious serious heart to heart and she either changes, or I call it quits?


Why don't you talk to her and say you both need to go to marriage counseling since the communication skills are non-existent and you don't want to live this way anymore. Have you heard what she talks to her mother and sister about?


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Can I ask a question?

Have you ever just confronted her about this?

You never touch me,
You hardly say you love me anymore,
And you never tell me how you are feeling,

Why?

i mean we can post a bunch of stuff but this is YOUR wife, ask her.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

LisaDiane said:


> Hmm...well, I heard it more like, she was never very affectionate or emotional, but she was very attractive to him so he married her...and I'm NOT saying he's wrong for that, just pointing out what I read in his posts.


I agree, and I think it would be great if people loved and accepted their husbands or wives as they are and not as they think they should be. It happens all the time here.


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