# just realised i am in abusive relationship



## lillu (Nov 27, 2013)

I need some wise thoughts on the subject.
Just realised today that I am in abusive relationship.
My husband few times has shoved me and pushed me and held down with my face in the pillow and all his body weight on me so I couldn't move. 
We've been together for 7 years and married for over a year.
2 years in our relationship we had serious issues, lots of violent fights, very often after alcohol and then there was abuse as well but I was provoking him by throwing some punches and pushing him while we argued.
We went to the therapy and I went through my share of sessions on my own. Changed my ways and am in good shape.
Now whenever we fight I always back down, say sorry when I don't have to and avoid opened discussions not to provoke any rage.
Last night, after few beers I told him something he didnt like, I just tried to explained how I felt and what I meant, asked him to stop being mad just tried to listen. Usually I don't even start topics like this but I did this time. (we were out and some girl from his work was very clingy towards him and I felt uncomfortable, I just told him that) He got furious, mad that I am accusing him of being unfaithful etc. and I kept trying to explain myself, made it all worse as he got soo angry he pushed me and showed me as he usually does.
What just dawned on me today is that this reactions happened before when we were sober. He is getting so absolutely worked up whenever I am criticising him it is impossible to have a conversation with him. He is normal when topic is something outside our relation and not about him.
I read lots today about violence in relationships and what I am experiencing is abuse. 
He is otherwise normal, grumpy at times but nothing far from normal...
Am bending my head today around the question what to do.
I cannot allow him to do it to me again but how to work around it and help him see it???
please wise ladies let me know your thoughts
thanks


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## MayFlowers (Nov 27, 2013)

Honestly, he's never going to see it. Abusive people never stop being abusive. I know you don't want to hear this, but packing your things up while he's gone and leaving without ever turning back is probably the best thing you can do for yourself. You learning to say sorry just to get him to stop is the saddest thing... get a therapist, start your life over, and be happy for you. No one deserves to be in an unhealthy relationship and you don't deserve to be abused.


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## lillu (Nov 27, 2013)

thanks for reply May
leaving its hard without trying to save it but it is an option for me I know and worse comes to worse I wont hesitate.
the other thing I am just shocked to think about how normal it was for me. I didnt even question his behaviour before...
I was abused and not even realised that...


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## MissFroggie (Sep 3, 2013)

lillu said:


> thanks for reply May
> leaving its hard without trying to save it but it is an option for me I know and *worse comes to worse I wont hesitate*.


Honey, why wait for worse? Worse could have you just a statistic in this stuff! I like May's reply - too many people advise MC and being patient...it's nonsense. He has already done this multiple times and manipulated and controlled you enough that you avoid topics, put up with his behaviour and say sorry just to avoid conflict. He won't change. He definitely won't change while he has you. He has already given himself permission to treat you this way and that's not going to change. Please, make your plan and get out as safely and as best you can. This is not acceptable on any level and you are not there to fix him - he is already unfixable and you can't change that anyway. I was taught patience and forgiveness - you know what it got me? 4 abusive relationships, a tonne of bruises and fear, low self-esteem, depression, anxiety.... It is a lie we are taught from early days, when in an abusive relationship the ONLY option is to GET OUT! So sorry you are in this position honey. Please make your plans and leave xx



lillu said:


> the other thing I am just shocked to think about how normal it was for me. I didnt even question his behaviour before...
> I was abused and not even realised that...


This is typical - they do it so gradually and so manipulatively that you don't even see it creeping up on you. This is grooming and it is a very effective way to control others. Give yourself credit for recognising it, never question yourself for why you didn't see it sooner, you have seen it and now you are empowered. Please get out. x


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## lillu (Nov 27, 2013)

Miss Frogie, thanks for answer, it's so sad... am shaken but it's good I can see clearly my relationship now
I didn't mentioned in the first post - I come from family where my dad was beating up me and my sister, he stopped when I was 7-8. I think that even though I knew it was wrong of him but because I grew up around abuse and violence it felt normal when it happened to me....
as you said, I won't blame myself, just need to plan way out


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

Go to the police to file a complaint. Seek help, go to a councilor. Maybe together, else alone.

The only way to break this habit is decisive action.


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## MayFlowers (Nov 27, 2013)

My mother was with an abusive guy for ten years. She didn't really realize it at first either. Don't be upset with yourself for being in the spot you're in; be confident in yourself to get out and have a happier, better life for you. 

Waiting for it to get worse is like sitting in a kettle of water over a fire and waiting for it to burn you before you decide to get out.


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## lillu (Nov 27, 2013)

thank you all so much for your replies - really great help
xxx


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

Double post


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

lillu said:


> *He is otherwise normal, grumpy at times but nothing far from normal...*
> Am bending my head today around the question what to do.
> I cannot allow him to do it to me again but how to work around it and help him see it???
> please wise ladies let me know your thoughts
> thanks


Not sure why you are asking the ladies how to get into the head of an abusive husband. Did you really expect anything other than "Leave the bastard! Abusers will NEVER CHANGE!!"

I just want you to understand that he has NO CLUE that this is bothering you to the point that you are about to leave him (see bold above). He knows what his issue is, and he feels terrible every time he does it. But he knows you know he has issues and your marriage is stronger than this. He see's his outbursts as aberrations to his normal behavior. He does not realize you live with the fear of it 24-7. One thing I can guarantee is that he will be SHOCKED when you tell him you are leaving him.

And leave this abusive relationship you must. But that doesn't seem to be your main question. Your main question seems to be "..but how to work around it and help him see it???"

If you really want any help to fix him (yes, he can be fixed. I am living proof), then leave him you must. When he gets that SHOCK (I call it a kick to the gut; that's what it was for me when I realized my wife checked out because of my abuse), he will realized not only that he has lost you, but that it was HIS FAULT. You think that won't wake him up?

But it starts with leaving him like all the gals are saying. It's what I say too. But if you REALLY want to try to save him, save your marriage, yo can do it. But he needs to think he has lost everything. Yo need to destroy your marriage to fix it. You can rebuild it with him in it.

If he doesn't come around, just keep walking. And you may find that you will never be able to trust him again. My wife was already gone when I received the kick. No amount of changing was going to sway her. It may be that way for you as well. He WILL have relapses. He's not a god. But those relapses kept sending my wife back to square one until she gave up. If you don't want to, you don't have to.


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## TiggyBlue (Jul 29, 2012)

He won't see what he's doing as wrong unless he want's to, don't wait around to wait for the off chance he does while the dynamics in the relationship stay the same.


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## MissFroggie (Sep 3, 2013)

lillu said:


> Miss Frogie, thanks for answer, it's so sad... am shaken but it's good I can see clearly my relationship now
> I didn't mentioned in the first post - I come from family where my dad was beating up me and my sister, he stopped when I was 7-8. I think that even though I knew it was wrong of him but because I grew up around abuse and violence it felt normal when it happened to me....
> as you said, I won't blame myself, just need to plan way out


I am glad you won't blame yourself - that's really important. Planning how and when to leave is important too so it is as low-risk as possible and there is no time for him to sugar-coat things and manipulate you into giving him more chances. Especially because you have had abusive experiences in your past, during the time you were learning and developing your core values, it is important not to go back. No more chances. He can manipulate you more easily than someone who has never experienced abuse because they tend to see it more clearly and make less excuses/ accept less bs than those of us who have been abused before. Be strong hon and keep going. You deserve better and you will find better x


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

lillu, if you are changing your behavior to avoid provoking him then you are afraid and he is abusive. Remember any feeling of fear with a SO comes from emotional, verbal or physical abuse.

You can try Mr. K's route and give him a wake-up call IF YOU STILL LOVE HIM and think you can get to a place where you can be honest without fear. BUT if you don't think, even with counseling, that you two will ever get that trust and love back, then cut your losses and move forward.

Mine started off slowly like that and I DID give him an ultimatum and stuck it out for 3 more years after that. He'd slip up and I'd remind him, etc. but finally when there wasn't any change and by then a child was involved, I knew I had to live a different life and set a different example for my daughter.


Mr. K I know you are one of the few who changed his ways. I think there are cases of bad temper coupled with poor communication skills, low self esteem and fear of intimacy. Those men/marriages can be fixed with MC/therapy.

Most abusive men are mentally ill and there is no fixing it. The traits/feelings toward women are deeply ingrained. Only the OP knows if this is a man who can change/be saved.


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## Thound (Jan 20, 2013)

Please forgive me for saying this, but he ain't much of a man if he has to lay his hands on a lady. Just saying.


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

Thound said:


> Please forgive me for saying this, but he ain't much of a man if he has to lay his hands on a lady. Just saying.


I don't understand why we have such high tolerance for just about all mental illness, yet an abuser is branded a monster for life. You (collective "you", not targeting this poster) have no idea what this man's upbringing was like. Do you think he CHOSE to be an abuser?


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

MrK said:


> I don't understand why we have such high tolerance for just about all mental illness, yet an abuser is branded a monster for life. You (collective "you", not targeting this poster) have no idea what this man's upbringing was like. Do you think he CHOSE to be an abuser?


There is a level where all bad behavior is the same of character, a pattern of impulses programmed as outcome to a pattern of inputs in our brains.

But in real life we make differences as to where the person could have chosen to act different. With mental illness the often can't act otherwise.

With abusers we assume they could have. But maybe you are right and is the pattern in the abuser the same as in the mental ill, only with the difference that his' is a changeable behavior, by therapy of insight and willpower.

In court this distinction is also made with very different outcome for being responsible for one's acts or not.

You are right that upbringing, genetics and life in general can 'program' the wrong patterns in a person. Which is then like a hopefully temporally mental illness.


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## Thound (Jan 20, 2013)

MrK said:


> I don't understand why we have such high tolerance for just about all mental illness, yet an abuser is branded a monster for life. You (collective "you", not targeting this poster) have no idea what this man's upbringing was like. Do you think he CHOSE to be an abuser?[/
> 
> There is no excuse for any man to lay hands on a lady period.
> Maybe I'm old fashion and maybe obstinate. I don't care I am who I am.


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## TiggyBlue (Jul 29, 2012)

MrK said:


> I don't understand why we have such high tolerance for just about all mental illness, yet an abuser is branded a monster for life. You (collective "you", not targeting this poster) have no idea what this man's upbringing was like. Do you think he CHOSE to be an abuser?





MrK said:


> She's an abusive wife and she will not change until she see's serious consequences to her actions. Protect yourself and see a lawyer. Have her served with divorce papers. I don't know the laws in your country, but I'm suspecting there will be a timeframe where you can change your mind.
> 
> She WILL NOT CHANGE until she see's consequences. SERIOUS consequences. If you don't like walking on eggshells your whole life, do something about this monster.
> 
> ...


You seem to have very different responses about abusers depending on which thread you're on.


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## TiggyBlue (Jul 29, 2012)

See_Listen_Love said:


> There is a level where all bad behavior is the same of character, a pattern of impulses programmed as outcome to a pattern of inputs in our brains.
> *
> But in real life we make differences as to where the person could have chosen to act different. With mental illness the often can't act otherwise.*
> 
> ...


I agree with pretty much everything you say, but abusers don't abuse everyone (not even there partners for some time into the relationship a lot of the time, they pick their targets well).
While I agree the abusive behavior is a lot of the time derives from certain event's in their life (or witnessing them) they aren't total victims of their own actions.


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## whataboutthis? (Apr 5, 2013)

Lillu,

I have one question for you? Are you fearful? If his actions evoke any fear in you (verbal or physical) you need to leave and go somewhere he cannot find you.

Keep in mind I don't think there is ever an excuse to abuse someone (physically or verbally). However, when the abuse causes fear, it only takes one moment and you could become a statistic.

Protect yourself now. Please.


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## lillu (Nov 27, 2013)

whataboutthis? It is still ok, I dont fear for my life and I know that now he regrets his actions as MrK said, its like they say in all materials I read yesterday - classic honeymoon period - he is so absolutely sorry and now is making up for it. And yes MrK - he has no CLUE - he started up conversation after I got back from work and what he wanted to talk about was that I obviously dont trust him and when I pointed out that maybe we should talk about him being aggressive and abusive towards me, he just brushed it off... my jaw dropped again as it became clear to me that there is NOTHING I can do to fix him absolutely NOTHING, I can only get out of this relationship. He said that maybe he should go back to therapy but this I have heard before and he promised he wont be violent again - I absolutely dont believe him. As I said in my first post - I just discovered that I am in abusive relationship and I have to come to terms with this and deal with this in the best possible way for me.... but it is absolutely shocking that it took me so many years to actually see it.... wont blame myself for it as said before but any opinion I had about abusive relationship shifted and changed....


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

TiggyBlue said:


> You seem to have very different responses about abusers depending on which thread you're on.


Of course I do. Each situation is unique. 

But you are surely commenting on the fact that I was tougher with the chick. I will defend myself there (why do I have to defend myself?) only by saying that is one of the VERY rare times I've labeled a woman an abuser. People are afraid to. I'm afraid to. That woman needed the label. I'm hard on male abusers 20 times more than women.

Now go stalk someone else please.


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

lillu said:


> And yes MrK - he has no CLUE - he started up conversation after I got back from work and what he wanted to talk about was that I obviously dont trust him and when I pointed out that maybe we should talk about him being aggressive and abusive towards me, he just brushed it off... *my jaw dropped again as it became clear to me that there is NOTHING I can do to fix him absolutely NOTHING*,


Sorry. I misread your original post. I thought you wanted to fix this. It seems your question was whether or not you should leave him. Yes. By all means, just go. You don't owe him a thing. 

But allow me to threadjack here. Maybe you can help others. My big post here discussed the shock to the abusers system. I discussed in pretty great length what his problem is and how he can compartmentalize that into a minimal problem, not realizing you live in fear of it 24/7. That the only way you can fix him is to SCARE THE S.H.I.T out of him, and make DAMN SURE he knows he did it.

Yet your jaw dropped because you were shocked that THIS didn't fix him. I love this...I need to quote it directly:



lillu said:


> I pointed out that maybe we should talk about him being aggressive and abusive towards me, he just brushed it off...


She "pointed out" that MAYBE they should...here's my favorite part..."talk" about his abuse. OMFG. I don't know if this is the funniest thing I've ever read or the scariest. Are you kidding me?

We have a man who has a history...A HISTORY of abuse and doesn't know it's pushing his wife away. And we have an abused spouse that thinks that throwing up an offer to maybe talk about it some time equates to full communication about the issue.

This is physical abuse. An extreme example. But this scenario plays out in relationships with emotional abuse issues. Issues with controlling husbands. Any marriage where the wife is walking away for WHATEVER reason and the husband has NO CLUE it's happening. And a wife who has discussed it until she is "blue in the face". Like the OP her. Get what I mean.

I've been on these boards a long time. I'm not taking up all of your time because it is my issue. But because it is "my issue", I've read A LOT of WAW issues. They are all the same. And they all have MASSIVE communication breakdowns like this.

A billion posts on relationship forums over the decade and we are still this far off on communicating.


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

And the cycle continues. 



MissFroggie said:


> This man will never change because he doesn't see what he is doing as wrong.


He knows EXACTLY what he is doing is wrong. Why do you all want to fight me? And you've all determined he is unchangeable because she hinted that maybe they could talk about it some time in the future?

I wish I could write. I have so much to say, but nobody can hear me. Too bad.


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## lillu (Nov 27, 2013)

what i read from all of you (once again huge thanks) and from what I have read online... I just discovered that I am in abusive relationship two days ago!!!... so what I gathered is that each situation is unique and it is only simple to talk about it... the only thing you can do to help people in this situation you all just doing right now - responding to my post ... for me this is what I needed the most - the support, words of advices, thought, reflections on your own experiences, massive help... 
what I noticed was that even I wanted but I physically couldn't tell it to anyone around me, any of my friends, not even my sister, just couldn't... even though I knew I had to say it for myself to hear it... hope I am making some sense here


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## patrice84 (Nov 11, 2013)

Thound said:


> Please forgive me for saying this, but he ain't much of a man if he has to lay his hands on a lady. Just saying.


I agree, ewwwww


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

2galsmom said:


> Men who resort to laying their hands on women are weak. It is an effort of last resort to conform the woman to their will and make them submit as the he has not earned her respect or has no respect for himself.
> 
> You cannot fix him, this is an important realization. What's more, he more than likely does not want to be fixed. You don't fear for your life. Good. But you are just coming to realize that abuse is in play and have not read the statistics about the men who lay hands on woman and eventually kill them.
> 
> ...


Once again, we lay all the fault on a man. A man may have to restrain a woman or prevent her from striking him. It may be a corrupt lady who thought she would embellish and fill her cup through physical abuse, which she can blame on him. It happens at more than 1% in this country. The ladies who choose this path, attempt to get away with the most rediculous abuses. There are corrupt, and soulless and violent women just like there are men.


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## SunnyT (Jun 22, 2011)

I think I get what Mr. K is saying. 

First of all, you can't have a talk with the abuser using words like "maybe". IF you were to have a talk with him, you have to use stronger language, not be wishy-washy or leave it open to mis-interpretation. 

Second, I THINK Mr. K is also saying that you should talk with him, as he may be fixable IF he knows that the abuse will definitely kill the relationship. (this goes back to the weak communication) I THINK he is saying when you leave, tell him why in no uncertain terms. 

Third, I THINK Mr. K is saying that if you leave, and that is not a bad idea, there is a chance h could wake up and face his issues in order to work on his marriage, but it will take actual leaving for h to "get it". 

Seems like it is a Venus/Mars thing. No more "maybes" or "shoulda, woulda, couldas"! 

Sorry Mr. K, if I got it wrong. Just seemed like the women weren't understanding your words.


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

2galsmom said:


> Men who resort to laying their hands on women are weak. It is an effort of last resort to conform the woman to their will and make them submit as the he has not earned her respect or has no respect for himself.
> 
> You cannot fix him, this is an important realization. What's more, he more than likely does not want to be fixed. You don't fear for your life. Good. But you are just coming to realize that abuse is in play and have not read the statistics about the men who lay hands on woman and eventually kill them.
> 
> ...


This is stereotyping. And wrong. Nowadays we know that also women beatup their men in relationships.

And would you call those weak?? No. They use brutality to get reality to bend to their wishes. And women can very well resort to verbal abuse in that matter. It's no gender issue.

It's about bullying.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

While you're saving up the money to leave, get this book:
Why Does He Do That?: Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men: Lundy Bancroft: 9780425191651: Amazon.com: Books


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## tmbirdy (Jul 26, 2011)

turnera said:


> While you're saving up the money to leave, get this book:
> Why Does He Do That?: Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men: Lundy Bancroft: 9780425191651: Amazon.com: Books


That looks like a very good book. I just read the reviews and they are excellent. There is also one for verbal abuse which I may end up reading myself.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

WDHDT is the bible for victims of abusers. Patricia Evans' books are good, but they're kind of anti-male, so you have to sort through that.


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## Bushman1972 (Dec 30, 2013)

Not good Love. Not all men are like how you describe. Certainly not me. Good luck with finding a good man someday as we are all not pricks.


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## Thebes (Apr 10, 2013)

I would have to wonder why the subject of her being clingy towards him annoyed him so much. Has he given her a reason to think that behavior is okay.


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