# Does it really come down to that the sex was better?



## staystrong (Sep 15, 2012)

Is it that simple? Will they leave you for that? She says they're "in love". 

Doesn't having kids and a history together mean anything anymore to the WS?


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

staystrong said:


> Is it that simple? Will they leave you for that? She says they're "in love".
> 
> Doesn't having kids and a history together mean anything anymore to the WS?


I'm sorry (because you've started a number of threads) so you may have answered this question before.

Have you looked at the symptoms of Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) and how they line up with your wife? Just curious.

Narcissistic personality disorder - PubMed Health

Here's just a few items from that list:


> •Have unreasonable expectations of favorable treatment
> 
> •Need constant attention and admiration
> 
> ...


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## Paladin (Oct 15, 2011)

I did not read your other threads, but your question has two answers. Yes, it really is all about the sex/rush/secrecy/excitement/attention of something new and shiny. Like with any drug that triggers a mass release of dopamine an affair feels damn good to the person in the fog cause their pleasure centers are being stimulated.

All that being said, like with any addict of any drug, the proper intervention will allow them to see the error in judgement/perception they are making, and allow them to return to a normal life (kids, history etc..)


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## ATC529R (Oct 31, 2012)

Maybe the sex is better......it was probably better for you and her in the beginning....you were in love etc....


It's just so sad some people do not see that this stuff dies out over time....and can be rekindled and should be.

thats why i think marriage is about helping and accepting one another.... a lifes journey if you will.

the thing about women is they are controlled by their emotions and RARELY see the forest through the trees.


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## staystrong (Sep 15, 2012)

> Have you looked at the symptoms of Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) and how they line up with your wife? Just curious.


Yes, I have looked into this before and I definitely think she's much further up on the NPD spectrum than most people. How far is hard to say, though, without seeing a professional. We may tend to ascribe significance where there is none, but I'm not the only one who has noticed her issues. 

By the way, what made you suggest this? I'm very curious.


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## staystrong (Sep 15, 2012)

ATC529R

I agree completely with everything you said. I also believe that when women cheat it is especially dangerous for the family. They are more likely to emotionally bond with the OM and thus de-couple from H and want nothing more to do with him. It's biological.


Paladin

Yes, she was like a coke fiend and that's why our attempt at R shortly crashed and burned. "I have to be with him. There's no way I can't be with him". Is that _intensity_ or _intimacy_?


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

staystrong said:


> Yes, I have looked into this before and I definitely think she's further up on the NPD spectrum than most people. How far is hard to say, though, without seeing a professional. We may tend to ascribe significance where there is none, but I'm not the only one who has noticed her issues.
> 
> By the way, what made you suggest this? I'm very curious.


Oh, I don't know, maybe the fact that when you were at your most vulnerable (new to her country) and despite the fact that you have (I think) two young children, she dumped you for a cheater, and seems to have pretty much moved on without looking back.

As I said in another one of your many threads (it's really better if you just stick to ONE, you get better advice and people will follow your situation more), you want reassurance from us, strangers on the Internet, that she didn't do this to you because YOU are deficient.

Again, you need to start practicing emotional detachment. Dwelling on whether their sex was "better" does not lead to emotional detachment. Who gives a sh*t about that? The point isn't whether the sex was better. The point is, she's an extremely selfish person who doesn't DESERVE your time or attention, much less love or devotion.

I know it's tough because you're connected with the kids. One thing others have done is to find a trusted intermediary to hand off the children between you. That way you do not see her. You need to think like that--how do you limit any time spent near her (even via video) so that number equals zero.

Another idea I want to share (again hard with kids): the best revenge isn't anger. It's indifference. It's okay to mourn the dream of what you thought she was. She wasn't what you thought she was, however. She doesn't deserve your time or attention.


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## staystrong (Sep 15, 2012)

Damn fine post iheartlife. Thanks for being direct.

Roger that on the multiple threads.


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## staystrong (Sep 15, 2012)

iheartlife,

Is mine a special case or do you tend to see NPD in many cases of cheating?

I feel that the women leave much easier these days. There's a sense of entitlement, of unmet needs, etc., and with the stigma of divorce fading, they are more inclined to swap men if it suits them. I find it really troubling the way many women respond on boards (not so much TAM, but places like LoveShack).


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## staystrong (Sep 15, 2012)

What I'm getting at is.. Women, your husband wants to f*ck you and made love to the way you want to be f*cked and made love to. Trust me! Let them know your fantasies. Don't hold stuff back and then claim he wasn't the intimate one.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

staystrong said:


> iheartlife,
> 
> Is mine a special case or do you tend to see NPD in many cases of cheating?
> 
> I feel that the women leave much easier these days. There's a sense of entitlement, of unmet needs, etc., and with the stigma of divorce fading, they are more inclined to swap men if it suits them. I find it really troubling the way many women respond on boards (not so much TAM, but places like LoveShack).


I am far from an expert, but the reading I've done indicates that some significant percentage of the time, cheaters show more narcissistic traits than the average member of the population. You have to be careful with this information, because you might jump to the conclusion that all cheaters are narcissists. That is not the case--human beings are motivated to cheat for various reasons. For example, people with a lot of self-hatred, who do a variety of self-destructive activities, also show up as cheaters more often than average. These people are self-focused and self-centered, but not in a narcissistic ("I am terrific") way.

Atkins, Yi, Baucom, and Christensen (2005) found a correlation between narcissism and infidelity in marriage
http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/fam/19/3/470/

or google

Buss Shackelford infidelity 

and you'll pull up their 1997 study, 
Susceptibility to Infidelity in the First Year of Marriage 


> Personality factors most strongly linked to susceptibility to infidelity were low Conscientiousness, high Narcissism, and high Psychoticism


Again, no one should jump to the conclusions that cheater = narcissist. Narcissism is at an extreme of a continuum. 

If you agree that your wife has narcissistic traits, it doesn't really matter whether she'd get a full blown NPD diagnosis if dragged to a doctor. Doesn't her extreme, hurtful selfishness speak enough by itself?


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## Paladin (Oct 15, 2011)

There is no reason to generalize and stereotype women here, men cheat too, and are every bit as selfish when the do it. Dont go sniffing up the personality disorder tree too hard, many times, when a cheater is in the fog of an affair, they display traits and behaviors that can often overlap with those of personality disorders. There is a strong link between depression and cheating, there is a strong link between personality disorders and cheating, hell you can find all kinds of correlations when you look hard enough.

As far as your comparison to a "coke fiend" and the whole "I can't be without im" bullcrap that she is spouting, it is spot on. In her mind, which a the moment is under the influence of very strong neural chemicals, she probably feels that she really can't be without him. She is addicted to the affair and by extension the piece of sht other man (POSOM). Is the situation bleak? Most probably, yes. Is it hopeless? No, it is not. Addiction cycles can be broken, and a person can recover. Most of the time it takes the addict hitting rock bottom and still having a support network at that moment to recover (very rare, despite what people might think, as the addict tends to alienate those around him/her)

So again, without knowing your details it is hard to give you advice, and forgive me for not looking through your other threads, if you want, feel free to fill me in via PM, or recap here.


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## staystrong (Sep 15, 2012)

> You have to be careful with this information, because you might jump to the conclusion that all cheaters are narcissists.


Agreed. I was curious about how you made a distinction yourself. 




> If you agree that your wife has narcissistic traits, it doesn't really matter whether she'd get a full blown NPD diagnosis if dragged to a doctor. Doesn't her extreme, hurtful selfishness speak enough by itself?


Yes, her selfishness does speak for itself. 

I'm also thinking in reference to our children. I read posts sometimes from people with narcissistic mothers and how it has affected their lives. 

The prob is also see the sweet, caring, affectionate side of my wife and I think how could this person be far up the NPD continuum? This is when I start to blame myself, but then I stop because it's ridiculous. No more of that. I'm not perfect but I was a good husband and father. Apparently my wife does not know how to really communicate her needs and felt trapped by marriage.


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## staystrong (Sep 15, 2012)

Paladin said:


> There is no reason to generalize and stereotype women here, men cheat too, and are every bit as selfish when the do it.


Agreed. But I've found that men tend to leave their spouses less and not break up the family. Granted, people still get hurt but at least there are greater opps for R, which can make a world of difference for the kids (if you can patch things up). "Men have obligations; women have choices" it seems is the case when it comes to affairs and separation. 




Paladin said:


> As far as your comparison to a "coke fiend" and the whole "I can't be without im" bullcrap that she is spouting, it is spot on. In her mind, which a the moment is under the influence of very strong neural chemicals, she probably feels that she really can't be without him.


Some would argue it's the same thing as falling in love, no? Just that it in unfavorable circumstances, i.e. she's already married.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

The fact she showed OM down your childrens throught so early on after the split screams symphonies. Narcisism.
You may be in luuurv but you don't move in your new BF home with your childrens so quickly. When did it happen, about a week after she informed them about her new BF (she did it to burn any bridge back to the marriage that's why she still texts "it's too late now I'm living with him").


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## Rihanna (Jun 5, 2012)

ATC529R said:


> Maybe the sex is better......it was probably better for you and her in the beginning....you were in love etc....
> 
> 
> It's just so sad some people do not see that this stuff dies out over time....and can be rekindled and should be.
> ...


Seriously, only women are like this?


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## staystrong (Sep 15, 2012)

Rihanna said:


> Seriously, only women are like this?


No, of course not. Sorry to all the women out there if it seems like we are generalizing. I think it's that we are witnessing a major social trend of women leaving men, one piece of evidence being that women initiate most of the divorces.


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## staystrong (Sep 15, 2012)

Acabado said:


> The fact she showed OM down your childrens throught so early on after the split screams symphonies. Narcisism.
> You may be in luuurv but you don't move in your new BF home with your childrens so quickly. When did it happen, about a week after she informed them about her new BF (she did it to burn any bridge back to the marriage that's why she still texts "it's too late now I'm living with him").


Yes, this to me is outrageous. It's something I never thought she would do as a woman and mother. She claims they won't see him much because he often performs concerts at night. He should have his own apartment. At first, she was was nervous - it was weird having him there in OUR place - but I guess they "smoothed it out". 

There have been a couple of months since separation and this move-in. We had been sharing the apartment, rotating who stayed with kids.

I just don't know what this is going to teach our daughters. Now she is showing physical affection towards him in front of him? And I left the apartment the weekend before he moved in? It's such disrespect for me and for my children. Her focus should be on THEM. Let there be a transition, let them feel that THEY come first.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

I don't mean to alarm you, but boyfriends do not have good track records where nonbiological children are concerned. What background does this man have? Does he have any sort of criminal record?

If you were in the US, I would have recommended a custody agreement with a morality clause that would forbid moving in with the OM. These are granted quite often in the US because of the damage you're concerned about.

I agree that there are a lot of stupid things that people do because of the fun escape of the affair. But plucking out the dad and replacing him in the home? That's as selfish as it gets.

What are your legal rights to this property?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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