# 2 years later, still struggling. My story.



## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

First of all, for all the people who've shared their stories on this forum, thank you. I've read through many and it's so helpful to know that I am not alone in the way I feel and what I've been through. Second, I just want to put my story out there too, and get it off my chest.

My Story:

I married my wife in 2005. We are parents to two wonderful children. We've been together for about 10 years now. We both work in the public policy realm, the kind of not-for-profit advocacy work on issues that we are fairly passionate about. 

I come from an extremely strong family background. Grew up with two of the most amazing, thoughtful, kind, and loving parents that any child could have. My childhood was idealistic, a kind of Brady Bunch upbringing that may be a fantasy to many but was a reality for me. 

Her childhood was marked by trauma, divorce, a mother who was institutionalized and a father who was and remains emotionally aloof. She had struggled with co-dependency as an adult (her two previous boyfriends included a serious alcoholic and someone who greatly struggled with depression). I'm a more introverted person, who remains fairly guarded around people I don't know. She is more extroverted and especially works to build relationships and be kind to people who are damaged or in need in some way, as well as people who are passionate about similar issue public policy work. 

Despite these differences in our backgrounds, we had a pretty good marriage and relationship for the first 8 years we were together. Things got less passionate after kids, but I feel like that's par for the course. 

About three years ago, we definitely started to drift apart a bit, but still had a solid relationship. We rarely fought and never in front of the kids. They, like me, have had and continue to have, a warm and idyllic upbringing. 

About two years ago she went away for a weekend conference with other people doing similar work, including many people she was working closely with at the time. About a week after she got back from this conference, a friend said to her, in front of me, that a woman at the conference was spreading a rumor that she was having an affair with someone else from the weekend, someone who she works with closely. 

Here's regret number 1 (a moment I play over and over in my head): I immediately interjected and said that the woman spreading the rumor just doesn't know my wife because she just kind of loves everyone in a way that makes them feel special. And this is totally true. Of course, this time it was actually different. 

And what I realized later is that at that moment, my comment was as if I'd just given her a pass and a way to justify the affair that likely began that weekend. How I want that moment back...how I want to react differently, how i wish I'd have asked just the right questions and in just the right tone. But that's placing the blame on me, and that's not where it belongs.

More to come.


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## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

About a month later, she said she had to go to an event and that she would be home late. It wasn't out of the ordinary. 

What was out of the ordinary was that she came home at 2am. I woke when she got in bed and looked at the clock and commented about the hour. She said that they went out for drinks and that she'd had too much and gotten a ride home from the man who's name came up the previous month. 

I'm not an idiot. That's when I knew. But without proof, at 2am, I wasn't about to start making accusations. The next day she was extremely happy, something else that is hard to erase from my mind. Knowing now why she was so happy and remembering that when we first starting dating, it was the kind of happiness she oozed because of our relationship. That's tough to write even now.

The next few days I watched her closely and occasionally picked up her cell phone (which it had dawned on me, she'd be using a LOT all of a sudden to text, and she's normally not a texting type of person). There were plenty of texts there but none that were to this man. At the time, I KNOW THIS SOUNDS RIDICULOUS NOW, but I was relieved and thought maybe my suspicions were off and it was just a series of coincidences. 

We were in the car, with the kids, traveling to see my parents for Christmas and she puts in a CD burned with songs (she would never make her own CD of burned music). I asked about it and she said it was a given to her by him (who I'll now refer to as OM). It almost immediately occurred to me that she'd been deleting the texts and emails to him. Again, I said nothing as I wanted proof before confrontation. At the same time, hope remains that I'm badly mistaken.


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## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

It was Christmas day at my parents house, a special day for me as it has always been a day filled with family get-togethers and special family traditions. I don't get to see my parents and siblings as much as I'd like anymore, so it's very special to me to be with them and have my children be with aunts, uncles, cousins, and grandparents. 

I had been checking her phone for days whenever I could. Part of me didn't want to check it on Christmas day, didn't want to discover anything while at my parents home. But it just happened that I passed her phone as it blinked with a new message. I looked quickly and from that moment in my parents home on that cold Christmas morning, I've never been truly the same person. 

It was from him and it was love poetry. Lines and lines and lines of it. I ran to the bathroom and locked the door. I remember the room spinning and kind of rocking back and forth and having just this tunnel vision to what I was reading on the phone. I thought for a moment I might have a heart attack the way my heart felt to be pounding to so hard I could feel it against my ribs. 

I composed myself. I don't do drama and decided that I'd not confront her on Christmas day. That I'd just act normal until I knew more. Except, I couldn't look at her and I couldn't talk to her. The day went on like that and at one point she asked, why aren't you talking to me? I just mumbled, it's nothing and walked off. She probably knew at that point that I knew. 

I still to this day fantasize about that day and of packing her bag and calling her a cab and telling her to go home and get her stuff and leave us for good. Instead I stayed up late, drinking beers and everyone went to bed except the two of us. I looked at the clock and it was past midnight and so since this day was done I knew it was time to confront her. 

I walked in the room and asked her what's going on with her and OM. Like many posts here, the WS was defensive and lying, saying that they were just friends. Eventually, she admitted that it was more than just friendship. Our children were asleep at the foot of our bed as we discussed this, my parents and siblings just rooms away. It was surreal to say the least. She swore it was not a physical affair, and continues to say that to this day. I'm not so sure. But she admitted she was in love with him. 

So here's where it gets weird.


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## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

It certainly appears she is betraying you. A few thoughts...

1) Confront her directly. Look right into her eyes and see what she says.

2) You need to read those texts and see what they really contain. 

3) Place a VAR in her car under the seat and anywhere in the house that may snag calls. 

4) Place a keylogger on her computer and see what you get.

5) Find out who the other POS is and see what he has to say. Many people don't like that but I think it can yield dividends.


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## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

Oops. I posted before you were done.


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## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

even though she admits that she's in love with OM, she acts as if this shouldn't be threatening to me or change anything with us. She says that she's made it clear that this can't be physical with OM (who is also married). 

I'm kind of incredulous at this line of thinking. The co-dependency issues she's struggled with all of a sudden hit me and I realize that he's another lost soul she's trying to save. This is later on abundantly clear when she tells me that he's bi-polar and struggles with depression. 

I eventually tell her "you can't have both, you can't have me - the stable dad-husband and this exciting flame on the side." I tell her she needs to make a decision what and who she wants. We go to sleep and I have probably the worst 3-4 hours of sleep in my life.

The next day she says it will end, that of course she wants to be with me. I remember telling her, ok, but this is going to take a while to get over. Here I am, more than 2 years later and probably think about this EA (possibly PA) almost daily, or at least weekly. 

I could never find proof that it become a PA, but I suspect it did and have told her I just assume it was. She to this day says not - but have told her it doesn't really matter because EA is much worse to me. 

The next 6 months there was progress and setbacks, including a second very similar confrontation two months later when I discovered that they were still having inappropriate communications. We had quite the conversation that night and she seemed truly ashamed ans remorseful, and I was very ready to leave. 

The next day I did what should have been done the day after Christmas. I called and confronted the OM (without telling my wife) and asked what his intentions were with her. He stammered and said I didn't understand, it wasn't a physical thing. Then I started quoting texts he'd sent her and he realized I really knew what he'd been writing her. Then I dropped the bomb, told him he better tell his wife tonight because I'd be sending her texts and emails he'd sent my wife. This obviously freaked him out. I dropped some F bombs on him and hung up. 

Things have been different since that day. Although it pains me greatly that the relationship only appears to have truly stopped when she was informed (and she definitely was because she called and confronted my wife), not after I knew apparently. 

So where are we at today? It's complicated.


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## arked (Mar 2, 2013)

Sorry you are here. Sounds like you were blindsided by all of this. I tell folks at the time my STBXW affair was going on I never saw it coming. Now after almost 7 months at TAM when I look back I see the red flags I missed. Not that I think being able to see everything would have made a difference in my case. There are others coming who will be able to help much more that myself.


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

Schedule a poly.


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## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

We're still together. We've mostly moved on. I certainly do monitor her phone and email from time to time (without her knowing) and it appears that she's not communicating with the OM. We've had our good days and bad. 

But still today, over two years later, I feel such an emotional hole in my life. On one hand I want this to work. On the other, being really honest, I'm mostly here for the kids. 

And it just sucks. I don't know how to get the happiness back in life as long as I'm partnered with someone who I don't trust. For two years now I've been waiting for time to heal this wound. And it just hasn't. Today, I just started crying in my office as I read other stories on TAM similar to mine. 

So that's my story to this point. I hope there's a happy ending for me, and for you, but I'm struggling to find it right now. The fact that it's been years now and it still feels so recent, so real, so visceral - it's just...hard. 

But it feels good to write this because I haven't been able to confide in many people (two to this point). I write this for my own catharsis and to do what many of you have done sharing your stories, to let others know that there are other folks going through similar situations and you are not alone.


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

How could you possibly recover if you do not know the truth? She gaslight you and trickled truth-ed you. Their affair was physical. There is more to this affair than you know.


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## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

I assume it was physical and have told her I don't care what she says, I will always believe it was because there's no way to know if she's telling the truth. An EA and PA are the same to me.


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

If she is not honest with you who are you married to? A liar actually. That would eat anyone alive. That emotional hole is not going to go away while she maintains the lies.


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

I am very sorry for you. Please look at the facts:
1. People spreading rumors she is having an affair at this conference.
2. The constant communications between them for a long period of time. Love poetry from him to her.
3. She tells her husband she is in love with him.
4. Comes out late and drunk and happy.
All of this but she looks you in the eye and says it was not physical. It is embarrassing that she thinks that you are a fool to believe this. She had to be laughing inside that anybody could believe this.

A married woman does not say to her OM and her husband that she loves the OM if it has not been physical. I am sorry but she has really played you. You know she is a liar. She had a lover and a husband who she still refuses to tell the truth. She is still disrespecting you horribly.

I would strongly suggest the following.
1. Absolutely insist on a polygraph. Just her response to this will tell you a great deal.
2. Contact the OM's wife.
3. Contact the OM and tell him that your wife confessed that it was physical and now you want his side. (This is optional)
4. Insist the both of you get tested for STD's.
5. See an attorney just to understand your options.

If the roles had been reversed do you honestly think that your wife would have been so accepting and forgiving as you have been. I am sorry but your wife clearly has not respect for you. If you do not respect yourself then who will?

It also strikes me that you are a very very nice guy. Do you think your wife felt that even if she got caught having sex with another man and admitting it that she fell in love with him; that you her husband would forgive her anyway? Do you think if she knew point blank that you would have divorced her immediately if she ever screwed around that should would have done this? I doubt it.

I am sorry but she is still playing you by refusing to be honest with you. You deserve better. It is shame that apparently that you do not think so. Good luck.


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## thatbpguy (Dec 24, 2012)

She is an addict.

12 Warning Signs That It’s Emotional Infidelity – And Not ‘Just Friendship’ | Neuroscience and Relationships

I hate to say this but it's either live with this or let it continue in various ways.


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## Suspecting (Jan 8, 2013)

Is she still working with him?


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

Trust
Respect
Love (commitment)
Communication

The cornerstones of a marriage like your parents have. Like the marriage you wanted. Does your marriage have them?

Can you honestly say you have those 4 qualities? Does she?


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

This is terrible for you. There are many stories here where one would say that the BS reconciled but never had closure because he/she did not get the truth. (One woman suffered serious PTSD 30 years after her husband had had a 3-year affair. He had stonewalled her and rugswept and it had literally driven her crazy. She finally insisted on a poly to get the truth. She and her H are in their late 60's.)

Perhaps the happy ending for you is without your W. There's no law that says you have to suffer in a lifelong marriage. Really, no law.

What does your W say about your feelings? If she is acting like you 'need to get over it,' then she is making your feelings exponentially worse.


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## Nat07 (Jun 6, 2013)

This is probably not what you want to hear, but run while you still can. I am certain she will do it again, because she did it "once" and it had no consequences. Do not waste your best years next to someone who doesn't deserve you. Time is something you can never get back. Please admit you chose the wrong person, and start from scratch. God has a better plan for you!!!


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## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

Broken_in_Brooklyn said:


> If she is not honest with you who are you married to? A liar actually. That would eat anyone alive. That emotional hole is not going to go away while she maintains the lies.


Yeah, that's probably right and what's eating away at me here two years later. I just thought time would heal and I would forgive and move on.


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## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

alte Dame said:


> This is terrible for you. There are many stories here where one would say that the BS reconciled but never had closure because he/she did not get the truth. (One woman suffered serious PTSD 30 years after her husband had had a 3-year affair. He had stonewalled her and rugswept and it had literally driven her crazy. She finally insisted on a poly to get the truth. She and her H are in their late 60's.)
> 
> Perhaps the happy ending for you is without your W. There's no law that says you have to suffer in a lifelong marriage. Really, no law.
> 
> What does your W say about your feelings? If she is acting like you 'need to get over it,' then she is making your feelings exponentially worse.


At different times she's expressed different things - but no, not really to "get over it." As time has passed, she's been more apologetic and remorseful. 

As I've been thinking today, which has been a really hard day emotionally for some reason, I've been thinking about this issue of closure and that I never have really had it because I don't know every detail. I guess I've been telling myself that I don't need to know, because I know the big picture. But maybe it is the not knowing and the wondering that gnaws away at me. Maybe counseling would bring that out...?


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## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

walkonmars said:


> Trust
> Respect
> Love (commitment)
> Communication
> ...


I don't know that i'll ever fully trust her again. I care about her and I think she loves me. Really, I'm not sure I believe in love anymore....boy, that sounds pathetic. But I can't imagine ever letting my guard down again.

We respect each other and have fair communication. We are kind to each other and rarely fight. It's complicated for sure. 

I want this to work, for me, for us, and especially for the kids. I can't move past what happened, so I guess something has to change. Counseling, more communication...something.


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## Mr Blunt (Jul 18, 2012)

Becauseisaidso

Your wife is an emotional weakling

*If you want to try and make your relationship better for the immediate future you should both have IC and MC by a competent therapist.* This I think can make a significant difference. I think it is a good sign that she is remorseful. If she will not go then I do not know of any other measure that could make your marriage better right now.

You could just ride this out and see what happens in the next 10 years. If she does not show or repeat anymore betrayals and you can forgive then you can be better than now. 
That maybe too hard on you so only you know that answer.

If you are able to last another 10 years and you are still in the state you are now then you can leave. You will have given your children 20 years of support and nourishment by a father. I would suggest that you make a long range plan for your exit. If things work out you can scrap the plan if not you will be strong enough to make the exit and build another life.

*You wife’s childhood and young life experiences are significant factors in her behaviors but can be improved upon.* If you are both willing to get help and do the work then you can recover to a high degree. You probably will never have that one special admiration for your wife but you can gain in other special areas

Your wife maybe a good woman but she is weak in certain arras. *It is up to her if she wants to get better or live with her weaknesses.*


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## Dyokemm (Apr 24, 2013)

People will tell you it takes several years to recover normality after an A even with full transparency knowledge of details, and true remorse.

The reason you are feeling you have made no progress and stuck is because you do not have these things at all.

How can you begin to forgive and rebuild when you have no idea what you are really forgiving?

How can she be truly remorseful when she denies you full information about your own life and relationship?

I think you should talk to her and honestly tell her you do not know if you can continue your M without closure on this issue because it is tearing you up as a person.

Ask her to do a poly to put the affair to rest forever in your mind so you can begin to heal and rebuild with her. 

If she wants the M, she should be willing to do this simple task to out this incident behind you two. If she refuses or gets angry, then not only do you have your answers but you will also see her lack of commitment to reconciliation.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

It goes like this..

People knew she was having an affair, so she didn't a pretty bad job of trying to hide it. Late nights are also a huge red flag, those are the nights you know of, let alone the possible meetings during the day, lunch, after work, weekends etc.
The fact even after being busted (apart from the fact she admitted being in love) they still communicated is also major. He was willing to jeopardize his marriage (before you contacted him) for her...99.9% you'd only do that with someone you had sex with.

So how can you move on..

You haven't been told the truth. You can't move on, two years, three or ten. She's most likely been lying so there is no progress..and what if she has been lying, is that a deal breaker?

Book a poly and tell her you're both going.. if she stalls and isn't immediately willing, you may know then for sure it was physical, whatever the case it may flush out the truth.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

becauseisaidso said:


> I don't know that i'll ever fully trust her again. I care about her and I think she loves me. Really, I'm not sure I believe in love anymore....boy, that sounds pathetic. But I can't imagine ever letting my guard down again.
> 
> We respect each other and have fair communication. We are kind to each other and rarely fight. It's complicated for sure.
> 
> I want this to work, for me, for us, and especially for the kids. I can't move past what happened, so I guess something has to change. Counseling, more communication...something.


Welcome to the club. Being cheated on is like innocence stolen, you're never the same again. It sucks


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

becauseisaidso said:


> Yeah, that's probably right and what's eating away at me here two years later. I just thought time would heal and I would forgive and move on.


Now you know time does not heal in your case. Perhaps it's time to not be afraid of breaking up the marriage. Given the anguish state you're in constantly, you are not in the place yet where you can move on.

Tell your wife you need closure. Tell your wife to tell the truth now. Tell her you are taking her to for a polygraph test. And do it. She may confess before taking the actual test.

If you havent done so, do the full panel of STD test. Make her do the same. This shows her you are still seriously doubting her.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Suspecting said:


> Is she still working with him?


:iagree:

That's what I want to know too. becauseisaidso said that she worked closely with the OM. It would be very easy to take the affair further underground despite his monitoring. Just merely looking at known email accounts and monitoring the phone bill would not give the whole story. A polygraph, or key logger and VAR would have to be employed. There may also be a burner phone.


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## Rollin (May 18, 2013)

What the hell? You honestly don't think it was a physical affair? 

She is lying.

POLYGRAPH.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

becauseisaidso said:


> So where are we at today? It's complicated.


You are in false R today. Sorry that you have to go through this.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

It is your sub--conscious, that is causing you, this pain-----it doesn't have any specific answers, it can do no better than guess, what actually happened, as he drove her home, that night, or as they were together at the conference, where their conduct must have been enuff to cause another woman, to state that your wife was having an A.-----

You don't have the actual facts of what happened, during these and other dubious instances, so your sub--conscious is filling in, and this is causing you even greater hurt, and pain----YOU DO NOT HAVE A SPECIFIC STORY TO DEAL WITH, AND GET CLOSURE FROM.

This is not gonna end anytime soon----you either continue hurting, or you handle it.-----Polygraph, will help, possibly, if that is your desire, go to the local police station, they will help you with a reliable operator, etc., etc.

As is said above, does your wife work with this guy, or come into contact with him via work events---if so, she still has contact, you know it, your sub--conscious knows it---and you still have problems----she needs to be done with him, in all ways/shapes/forms.

How serious is your wife about her R, is she heavily contrite/repentant/remorseful---is she accountable---does she show that she has her own shame, and guilt------does she try to help you thru your pain, when you trigger---or are you dealing with this yourself, inwardly

As I said above your--sub--conscious is basing what happened, on your imagination, cuz it has no factual story to work from----you really need to get all the facts-----IF YOU ARE TO HEAL


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## VFW (Oct 24, 2012)

Unfortunately time does not heal all wounds, it is what you do with that time that allows you to heal. It seems that a major part of your hesitation is that you don't think that she is telling you the truth. If truth is still an issue then a polygraph would be highly successful in establishing if she has had sex with him or anyone else. 

That is only part of the answer though. Once you know if she did or didn't, now what do you do with that information. She can apologize and be remorseful, but it is up to you to decide if you can go on with the relationship. Not all people react to this the same way, so the fact that one of us gets back to normal, does not mean that you will. Some relationships have to end before the person can move on with life.

I know that you want a normal relationship again. It is no fun thinking that you always have to be checking on someone and no one wants to always be under a microscope. I know that it takes time to build trust, but you can't live at DEFCON 2 all the time. If you have not started counselling then you need to start. Get the answers that you need and get yourself in a better place with or without her.


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## ubercoolpanda (Sep 11, 2012)

The reason it's eating away at you is because you do NOT have closure on this subject. You don't know for SURE whether this was an EA or PA.

You need to find this information out by getting her to take a polygraph test. It's the only way you'll know for sure because you can't trust her so you don't know if she's telling the truth or not. 

You said she is showing remorse.. HOW? Do you have all her passwords? Email, Facebook, phone lock etc? 

Is she still working with this man? You NEED to tell his wife about this too. 

I think you should tell this OM that your wife has admitted the affair went physical, (don't tell her this) and see how he reacts. He might give in and tell you everything. 

Important question: are you in love with your wife?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Why should she tell you the complete truth and make herself look worse ? 

You are trying to fool yourself that in context of the big picture, the details are not important, but they very much are important. You need to know how deep the cut is. We have a plethora of threads here about this. Most of the BS here have a need to know about this. 

The WS will need to face their actions and what they did when telling this to the BS. It will give them a more honest look at their actions and the devastation they did to the family and the heart of someone they claimed to lovee.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

Is she still working with him?


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

What have been her consequences?


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

You say you regretted not confronting and taking a hard line, packing up all her clothes and sending her packing when you first found out.

You still have a chance to get your closure.

Tell her you need all of the facts. The TRUTH. You KNOW it was physical, so she shouldn't lie. Tell her to write down the entire timeline of the affair as best she remembers it. Tell her she WILL be going for a polygraph afterward, so she shouldn't lie anymore.

Tell her you are still struggling with this TWO YEARS later because her lying, cheating @ss hasn't had the COMPASSION to tell you the truth and instead has been GASLIGHTING you with some NONSENSICAL lie that doesn't make a bit of sense. Tell her she supposedly has so much passion and compassion for every one else in the world, but not for you, the person she took vows with and who should be the person she cares about most.

For you, if a story doesn't make sense, it is a lie. Her story doesn't make sense.

Of course, she should get rid of any clothes she wore on any of those late nights or conferences, if she still has them. She should give you anything from that time period related to other man so you can have a bonfire in the backyard.

To say that you have been overly understanding in putting up with her lies these past two years would be a huge understatement.

If she's still working with him, that must end. All contact whatsoever with him must end. THIS IS FOR YOUR PEACE OF MIND. If she isn't COMPASSIONATE ENOUGH to help you get over this, after what she's done to you, let her at least SAY IT directly instead of perpetuating some lie that she loves you.

If she LOVES you, she WILL do what you need. If she doesn't do what you need, and you want to stay married for the kids, that's fine, but at least you won't have to go through life under the weight of her continued lies.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

By the way, ask anyone who got divorced after their spouse cheated on them, it wasn't the cheating that caused the divorce, it was the lying afterward.

The lying after the affair is what kills the marriage, not the cheating.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

It's the cheating then the persistent lying that kills the marriage. For some, the cheating by itself is enough to kill the marriage.


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## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

Thanks all for your replies and insight. 

I really don't feel that what's eating away at me is not knowing whether it was PA. Again, I assume it is but to me an EA is as bad if not worse, particularly that she told him that she loved him. 

But many of you may be right that not knowing all the details has left my brain working and wondering. Again, I very much assume there was a physical side to it and have told her as much. 

They don't work together anymore but did for about 1 year after D-day. Now, she volunteers with a group in which he provides support for. So from what we've talked about, she may send emails to a group listserve in which he is on, but not communicate with each other one on one. 

I've been ok with this and I KNOW what you're going to say and you're probably right. Damn it. I've been reading the other posts here enough to know that I'm a spineless ass for allowing there to be any communication at all. I think part of me just hates having to say it, what I really want is for her to make the choice on her own without an ultimatum. 

I was very close to leaving her twice (without her knowledge) and in both cases there will health scares and issues that brought us closer together. I'm strongly considering asking for a trial separation. 

I guess the question I'm struggling with is, what do I want? Do I want to reconcile and rebuild and grow old with her, or do I want a separate life. For the past two years I've jsut been trying to hang on and focus on the kids and try to give them the sweet little life I had growing up.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

becauseisaidso said:


> First of all, for all the people who've shared their stories on this forum, thank you. I've read through many and it's so helpful to know that I am not alone in the way I feel and what I've been through. Second, I just want to put my story out there too, and get it off my chest.
> 
> My Story:
> 
> ...


Errr... no. You gave her the opportunity to be the good, honest person she should have been.
Not your fault she wasted it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Read Malcolm38's thread. When he posted the self loathing, the guilt, the lack of a proper closure , they were all there just like you do. Maybe his thread will help you. His thread took a turn for the worse(His wife is a serial cheater and a narcissist) but it also tells you that one can become blind to their SO's obvious faults out of love(So did awake1 and Cabsy). Read their threads and learn from their experience. Your wife can be different from theirs, but their experience can help you.\

One of the more under-looked aspect of infidelity. Time and over again, this seems to be the case in most cases.


> I come from an extremely strong family background. Grew up with two of the most amazing, thoughtful, kind, and loving parents that any child could have. My childhood was idealistic, a kind of Brady Bunch upbringing that may be a fantasy to many but was a reality for me.
> 
> Her childhood was marked by trauma, divorce, a mother who was institutionalized and a father who was and remains emotionally aloof. She had struggled with co-dependency as an adult (her two previous boyfriends included a serious alcoholic and someone who greatly struggled with depression).


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

becauseisaidso said:


> I guess the question I'm struggling with is, what do I want? Do I want to reconcile and rebuild and grow old with her, or do I want a separate life. For the past two years I've jsut been trying to hang on and focus on the kids and* try to give them the sweet little life I had growing up*.



That sweet life requires 2 adults with the same goal. Her goal did/does not sync with yours.

A trial separation might do you well. It'll allow you to test the water and show you're serious, and for your wife to tell you the truth if she wants to keep the marriage. Though, I dont know if you would stay if she confess to the physical part.


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

You can't make her love you. She has to decide that. If you don't put your foot down she will perceive you as weak, as a beta. By giving her 'time' to decide you are letting her have the best of two worlds, two lovers. She will string you along all the way to the grave. There is no consequence for her not to to decide. You must show her a consequence. You show this consequence by performing an action, i.e. file for divorce. Her actions then tell you whether you will finish the divorce. She must show by actions how she values her marriage to you. 

The only other option is to accept that she cuckolded you and will probably do it again.


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## workindad (May 7, 2011)

I know what it is like to want to believe that your wife was not physical with another man. Unfortunately wanting to believe something does not make it true. 

I would be stunned if your wife was not banging om. Does OM's wife have any new information that she would share with you? 

Ask about a polygraph and judge her reaction. Hopefully you were not exposed to any STDs. 

FWIW. You can still be a great dad and be divorced. You can also find happiness post divorce. Do you really want to stay with a wife who is in love with another man? Does that sound like a healthy environment and example for your children? 

In the end the decision to r or d is yours to make. 

Good luck
WD
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

Will_Kane said:


> By the way, ask anyone who got divorced after their spouse cheated on them, it wasn't the cheating that caused the divorce, it was the lying afterward.
> 
> The lying after the affair is what kills the marriage, not the cheating.


Yeah, so true for me. The looking me in my eyes and lying to me about a question that I know the answer too. That haunts me. Hard to get past that. 

I went to counseling for a while (about 6 months after dday) as depression set in. It was nice to have someone to talk with but it really just isn't my thing. I've thought about couples counseling...maybe it's time.


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## Davelli0331 (Apr 29, 2011)

I'm gonna go against the conventional wisdom here. 

You sound to me like you're pretty far along the BS journey. You've accepted that your W will likely never tell the truth unless you threaten her with a polygraph, and maybe not even then. She seems remorseful, but you've realized that all the genuine remorse in the world doesn't give you back what you thought you had.

Imo it sounds like you're at the point where you're genuinely trying to decide if you want to stick with this woman or bail. I bet you wonder if this is what marriage is supposed to be like, and I bet your further wonder what it must be like to be in a marriage where your W has integrity.

This is a perfectly normal spot to be in as a BS. It's actually very empowering, because whichever decision you make, it's your decision. You're making life happen instead of life happening to you.

It's up to you to decide. You've done your part, you've carried your load. You've tried to stick it out. That makes you a hell of a man in my book. You aren't beholden to this cheater, but perhaps she could actually transform herself into a wife worth having.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

becauseisaidso said:


> Yeah, so true for me. The looking me in my eyes and lying to me about a question that I know the answer too. That haunts me. Hard to get past that.
> 
> I went to counseling for a while (about 6 months after dday) as depression set in. It was nice to have someone to talk with but it really just isn't my thing. I've thought about couples counseling...maybe it's time.



Couples counseling just doesn't work if one side is holding back or pretending. If the intention or remorse is not there, then it's a total waste of money.


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

becauseisaidso said:


> At different times she's expressed different things - but no, not really to "get over it." As time has passed, she's been more apologetic and remorseful.
> 
> As I've been thinking today, which has been a really hard day emotionally for some reason, I've been thinking about this issue of closure and that I never have really had it because I don't know every detail. I guess I've been telling myself that I don't need to know, because I know the big picture. But maybe it is the not knowing and the wondering that gnaws away at me. Maybe counseling would bring that out...?


Wow Because. I truly feel for you.

Here's what is happening. You haven't gotten over it, you rug swept. The problem is the pain and betrayal has festered under that rug. You're going to be worse next year, and worse the year after that. Sorry to tell you that.

You can't move forward, because you don't actually know where you've been. To move in a direction, you have to actually know where you are on the map. The way this whole thing went down, you never got the chance to truly know where you were so you've been aimlessly walking around....lost.

The idea that "I don't need to know the details because I have the big picture" is actually false logic.

You don't know the big picture UNLESS you have ALL of the details. Think of looking at a mural of a seaside landscape. All you know is what she's told you and the VERY small amount you found. You saw a lighthouse and your wife told you about the rocky shore in front of it. That's only 20% of the "BIG PICTURE" though. THAT is exactly what is tearing you apart...You DON'T know the big picture (which we can relabel as the WHOLE PICTURE). It is those details that you don't have that make up the WHOLE PICTURE.

Reconciliation isn't off the table, but you really can't have one until you can heal. You can't heal until you know what wound you have. 

Schedule a poly. Explain to your wife that you've been suffering for the past 2 years due to this fear of the unknown. You can't believe her about it because she's the one who lied and betrayed in the first point. To be able to move forward, you need to know the full story. Don't convince yourself that if it was physical, that won't have a big impact on you, even if you've "come to believe it is anyway". That's even worse because you believe it was and she says it wasn't....Translation, in your mind she's still lying to you.

I feel for you. You need to full picture.


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## Rollin (May 18, 2013)

Trial separation sounds good, get some time away from her, she seems to be a daily trigger for you.

But you MUST polygraph, she is lying, without a doubt.


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## badcompany (Aug 4, 2010)

Pretend everything is ok while you go full out data collection on her.
VAR and GPS the car
Keylogger on the PC
Check phone records and cross check #'s
Time card vs. time she got home from work if available

This should give you enough info to know if it's over or not, and if your done with her or not.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

becauseisaidso said:


> I guess the question I'm struggling with is, what do I want? Do I want to reconcile and rebuild and grow old with her, or do I want a separate life. For the past two years I've jsut been trying to hang on and focus on the kids and try to give them the sweet little life I had growing up.


Perhaps what you want is to build a life with someone who isn't a liar. A cynic would tell us that many of us are living with and loving people who are liars; we just don't know it. Fair enough, but you actually know for a fact that your wife is a liar.

Your W lied to you about the affair, but then didn't lie when she hurt you by telling you she was in love with him. She says it wasn't physical, but you don't believe her. You think in your heart of hearts that she is lying.

You really do deserve more than this. Tell yourself that and do it with conviction.

You could insist on truth from here on out as a condition that the marriage go forward. You could try a separation, as you suggest. You could file. Any of these decisions would move you forward, which must be better than the status quo as your open-ended future.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

alte Dame said:


> You could insist on truth from here on out as a condition that the marriage go forward. You could try a separation, as you suggest. You could file. Any of these decisions would move you forward, which must be better than the status quo as your open-ended future.



Beware of the boiling frog syndrome in a status quo situation. Your soul slowly dies and you wont know it till much has been lost.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

I'd like to suggest that your difficulty stems from singular hindsight. The regret for not dispensing the proper consequences you now realize she deserved. The regret for not giving her a full test of how remorseful she is. Things that mostly can't be undone now that this much time has passed.

Throw in her likelihood of lying about the PA, and you've got yourself doubting if she is truly remorseful rather than just settling for you after being caught. And because of that, you never get full closure.

When your mental state is such, R is a far off light at the end of the tunnel that you never seem to get closer to. Believe me, I know the feeling.

I don't really have any cogent advice;other than things may get better over time if your wife will tell you the truth and follow that with a demonstration of consistent, long-term, genuine remorse. That's what you should be looking for if you want to leave the purgatory of limbo living and half commitment.


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## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

badmemory said:


> I'd like to suggest that your difficulty stems from singular hindsight. The regret for not dispensing the proper consequences you now realize she deserved. The regret for not giving her a full test of how remorseful she is. Things that mostly can't be undone now that this much time has passed.
> 
> Throw in her likelihood of lying about the PA, and you've got yourself doubting if she is truly remorseful rather than just settling for you after being caught. And because of that, you never get full closure.
> 
> ...


thanks, I think you're spot on. I read that term in another post last night, that I'm in limbo, and it really struck a chord with me. Not being reconciled completely and also still together. I've held a lot in, because, that's just what I do. Sharing here as been a relief.


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## Lovemytruck (Jul 3, 2012)

IMHO limbo is worse than D. It seems that most of us that have chosen D would agree. It doesn't seem that you are in true R.


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

becauseisaidso said:


> thanks, I think you're spot on. I read that term in another post last night, that I'm in limbo, and it really struck a chord with me. Not being reconciled completely and also still together. I've held a lot in, because, that's just what I do. Sharing here as been a relief.


I was where you're at a while back. I just couldn't get past the regret for not handling things perfectly after Dday. I didn't find TAM until 8 months later. But over the last few months, things have improved for me because my wife continues to do the heavy lifting - or mostly.

Our R certainly is still a work in progress, as I see it. I'm not to the point where I feel certainty about our future and I still have a few chips on my shoulder. But things are steadily improving.

If you want to R, open up to your wife and tell her what you need. See if she responds. If so, you have a foundation to work from. If not or not entirely, improve yourself physically, put your finances in order and prepare yourself mentally - for the right time to call it quits; then you'll be ready to move on with your life.

I'll borrow some words (paraphrased) from "theguy"; when you're ready to move toward something else, not just run away from where you're at - you'll know that's the right time.


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## CEL (May 7, 2013)

Well I am going to agree with the others that have said you never really got the closure you wanted. You are still in that room hearing the news that you wife you loved more than anything was in love with another man. You never moved on. At that moment a switch went off in your mind and you disconnected from her, your heart did a turtle and said "We can't trust her we need to protect ourselves this person is dangerous." You never got past that moment these past 2 years have no meaning because you never moved on from that moment. You never were in R, and you never moved toward D. I am going to go through somethings I think you did wrong please don't feel I am attacking you. By wrong I mean things that should of been done to heal the damage to you regardless of the relationship.

1. You should of told her NC at all. You needed to communicate this to her instead of hoping she would get it. The problem is that people do not know what we want we have to tell them. You did not and because of this are hurt by it.

2. You don't know that she was truthful about everything so you think the worst in addition to the worst you also have uncertainty your heart is never going to come out until you have what YOU believe is the truth. Somewhere inside you is great reluctance to build a foundation on lose sand and that is what building on an affair is if you don't get all the truth. 

Actions to take regardless whether you R or D

1. You sit down with her and tell her you have never moved on and you let her know because of that you have thought of leaving. Be honest and let her know the dates tell her how you feel and let her know you want to be with her but you need her help. That for the past years you have been slowly bleeding to death.

2. No Contact from her toward the guy she leaves her volunteer so she has no contact. Understand this is for you.

3. Timeline of what happened the entire truth, then you go through with the poly. Many people decide not to go through with the poly for you because of the time and your mindset I would say this is the most important thing so that you finally know all the truth this will let you know what kind of foundation you can build on.

4. MC for you and her. You both have problems communicating and you need help if you are going to have any kind of relationship with anyone you are going to have to learn how to tell your SO how you feel and what you need. Again all these steps are to help you finally HEAL just leaving will not change the damage done. You will instead carry it into other relationships that you have.


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## Horizon (Apr 4, 2013)

Davelli0331 said:


> I'm gonna go against the conventional wisdom here.
> 
> You sound to me like you're pretty far along the BS journey. You've accepted that your W will likely never tell the truth unless you threaten her with a polygraph, and maybe not even then. She seems remorseful, but you've realized that all the genuine remorse in the world doesn't give you back what you thought you had.
> 
> ...


Spot on Dave 

I'm very much in your position "becauseisaidso" even though it bugs me to see how much time has passed for you. Two years! - then again you read other people's threads and it's been a lot longer.

It seems the truth is you never really get used to it but after time depending on your situation and personal factors you find a way to cope. I hate the idea of that as well. The fact is we are now in the undiscovered country with the previous world forever gone and an uncertain path ahead. 

I have been given much generous advice and guidance here - I know what I have to do for me. It is a day to day proposition with my WDP18 (wayard defacto partner of 18 years) - attraction and revulsion in equal measure. I still give it 50 50.

It's only been 9 weeks for me since DDay - I hope what ever decisions you make for you and your family are done with your own well being very much in mind. 

I have learnt that I am a nice guy who like to please people - I even remember one of my first girlirends sister, more than 30 years ago, saying to me "you are always trying to please me' It was true but I didn't process the truth about myself then, I was too immature, I just bought it down to the fact that I was crazy about her as well.

Look where my servitude has lead me. Zeppelin's "Trampled Under Foot" comes to mind.


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## BWBill (Jan 30, 2013)

Leave her. Don't just tell her, actually do it.

See how she responds immediately, and how she responds over time.

Only then you will know if she actually loves you and if you have something worth saving.


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## becauseisaidso (Jun 6, 2013)

CEL said:


> Actions to take regardless whether you R or D
> 
> 1. You sit down with her and tell her you have never moved on and you let her know because of that you have thought of leaving. Be honest and let her know the dates tell her how you feel and let her know you want to be with her but you need her help. That for the past years you have been slowly bleeding to death.
> 
> ...


Appreciate the advice. Lots to think about, but these four steps are very similar to what I've been feeling is the plan for me. I _have _slowly been bleeding to death. It's horrible.

More than anything, it's been about the kids. Feel pretty sure that I would not be here, hell she'd probably not be here, if not for these wonderful kids who have a nice, wholesome, safe life.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

becauseisaidso said:


> Appreciate the advice. Lots to think about, but these four steps are very similar to what I've been feeling is the plan for me. I _have _slowly been bleeding to death. It's horrible.
> 
> More than anything, it's been about the kids. Feel pretty sure that I would not be here, hell she'd probably not be here, if not for these wonderful kids who have a nice, wholesome, safe life.


You say you don't care about PA and you think EA is even worse, but that's not the point - IT'S THE LIES. Which translate into a lack of love, a lack of care ABOUT YOU as a person, a lack of respect. 

Doesn't matter PA or EA, but you would like to have her look you in the eye and tell you the truth. That would make you feel like you have a connection with her that's real, not a lie. And you know whenever you talk about the affair - how she acts, how she talks, her mannerisms - all scream liar. I know this as do most of us here - and as do you.

Have the talk about not getting over this, thinking about leaving, no contact, needing truth, polygraph. Before you do, though, buy a couple of voice-activated recorders and some heavy-duty velcro, put one in her car and one in your house where she is likely to talk on the phone when you're not around. Monitor for about three weeks. Just to see what she's up to. Also, put a gps on the car. 

If she still is talking to him on a listserv, is she knows where he works, then they still could be in contact. She could call in sick, go in late, leave early, meet for lunch, etc. She could limit calls to work, she could have a burner phone, she could have a secret email.

VAR might pick her up confiding in one of her friends saying how much she loves you and regrets what happened. Or it could pick her up talking to other man. Either of these would help you with your decision, push you one way or the other.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

OK---lets stop with all the psycho--babble, big words, phrases---all that crap

This all boils down to the following

You get one trip thru life on this planet---one trip ONLY---do you understand that----you can continue the way you are in misery---and you definitely are in misery---no trust, no peace of mind, no carefree days----they may be gone forever---but as long as you lay next to this woman---she is gonna trigger you, and the misery continues

I don't know that leaving her is gonna make anything any better---but what you are in right now sure as he*l ain't working

As to the kids---stop with your knight in shining armour, do everything for the kids---that is crap, and you know it----there are thousands of D's, for many reasons, and millions of kids in split homes---THAT ARE REASONABLY HAPPY CUZ THEY ARE SPLIT----and they don't face parents who are in misery day in and day out

Kids in your home, are not in the best of environments,
and whether you think so or not---your misery and attitude, along with your wife's are spilling out, no matter how hard you try to hide it.

You do what you need to do---but today is gone, and you will never see it again----tomorrow is coming, will it be a miserable day for you---the way you are going probably---and then tomorrow will be gone---another day, never to be lived again

Its time to make some attempt, at having a decent try, at a good trip thru life, for whatever time you have left, on this planet.----Its all on you---no one else----YOU


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## barbados (Aug 30, 2012)

becauseisaidso said:


> I married my wife in 2005. We are parents to two wonderful children. We've been together for about 10 years now. We both work in the public policy realm, the kind of not-for-profit advocacy work on issues that we are fairly passionate about.
> 
> I come from an extremely strong family background. Grew up with two of the most amazing, thoughtful, kind, and loving parents that any child could have. My childhood was idealistic, *a kind of Brady Bunch upbringing* that may be a fantasy to many but was a reality for me.
> 
> Her childhood was marked by trauma, divorce, a mother who was institutionalized and a father who was and remains emotionally aloof. She had struggled with co-dependency as an adult (her two previous boyfriends included a serious alcoholic and someone who greatly struggled with depression). I'm a more introverted person, who remains fairly guarded around people I don't know. She is more extroverted and especially works to build relationships and be kind to people who are damaged or in need in some way, as well as people who are passionate about similar issue public policy work.


Yes, but unlike fictitious TV shows, in real life, when you marry broken people, they usually stay broken. You have/had that knight in shining armor thing going with her and some part of you wanted to "save" her.

Find yourself a woman who comes from a similar background and stable family as you and learn to be happy again.


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## dogman (Jul 24, 2012)

It's never too late to react the way you should have from the start. 

You have the RIGHT to have a delayed reaction of whatever magnitude you choose. 

Truthfully you will never sleep normal again unless you do.

Taking the high road and staying calm are overrated when it comes to this sort of thing.

I have a similar thing that's my wife's EA with denial of a PA, while there was definite opportunity for the PA. I always operated under the assumption it went PA. This was almost 7 years ago and I'm still bothered.

Good luck.


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