# How would you interpret this?



## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

I am VP of a local chapter of a larger volunteer organization. A committee is being formed to develop a chapter in a neighboring city.

The President of my chapter wrote me this in an e-mail:

"I'm pretty sure you'll be interested in helping with this outreach. Just give me the green light and I'll make sure you stay in the loop and can join us when we get to some concrete actions."

How would you interpret this?


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Simply that he/she expects that you will want to help out, and is mildly pressuring you to say yes. If not, now is the time to set the record straight.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

I am not sure of what the meaning is but I do know what my response would be:

_"At the end of the day it would be a no-brainer and involve us thinking completely outside the box in order to, going forward, achieve 110% a win-win situation and will be on my radar, flagging up at the close of play for me to touch base with you. Suffice it to say that the ensuing paradigm shift will have me beside myself, jumping out of my skin to square the circle, if you get my drift."_


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

Or … if I was in a more communicative mood, then:

_"Eh ???…"_


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## Phil Anders (Jun 24, 2015)

A. "I anticipate--and welcome--your interest; we're not quite organized yet, but let me get you on board right away."

B. "I anticipate--and dread--your involvement; let me put you off with superficial business-speak until we're safely past the stage where you could influence anything vital."

Flip a coin... I'd look to prior interactions with this person for context.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

NextTimeAround said:


> I am VP of a local chapter of a larger volunteer organization. A committee is being formed to develop a chapter in a neighboring city.
> 
> The President of my chapter wrote me this in an e-mail:
> 
> ...


As manipulation.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

marduk said:


> As manipulation.


Please elaborate.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

NextTimeAround said:


> Please elaborate.


Ever get one of those stupid pop ups that try to shame or insult you if you don't go for their "deal?"

Like this?










It's basically that. You look like a douche if you don't go for it, because it's so obviously good for you if you help them out.

confirmshaming


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

This is how I responded:

"You mention "I'll make sure you stay in the loop and can join us when we get to some concrete actions." Who is "we"? And does this mean my input is not welcomed on this matter? I would like to contribute to the planning in addition to carrying out the activities."

Would you say that my response was proportional or psycho?


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

I was hoping to get more attention....... 0


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Your response is appropriate. A little snippy, but I think justified given the situation.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

manfromlamancha said:


> I am not sure of what the meaning is but I do know what my response would be:
> 
> _"At the end of the day it would be a no-brainer and involve us thinking completely outside the box in order to, going forward, achieve 110% a win-win situation and will be on my radar, flagging up at the close of play for me to touch base with you. Suffice it to say that the ensuing paradigm shift will have me beside myself, jumping out of my skin to square the circle, if you get my drift."_


Can I plagiarize this?? Lmao
_Posted via Mobile 

There's got to be a time when I can use this in response to one of the ex's texts!!! &#55357;&#56833;
Device_


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Married but Happy said:


> Your response is appropriate. A little snippy, but I think justified given the situation.


Thanks for that. My husband said that it sounds accusatory and I should apologise. I told him I would do nothing of the sort.

Last fall, our chapter did 2 events, all on my effort. She tried to block my efforts by creating excuses like all 5 of the officers had to be able to attend; she wanted to choose the venue and then sat on the decision for 3 weeks and so on....... I hd to point out to her that from a regional seminar, chapters were expected to have at least one monthly activity....... so she loosened the reins.

Ergo, If I had not been here, the chapter would have had no activities. Our chapter is fairly new and while we have database of about 300, we had uncontested elections last spring.

She must be good friends with whomever is heading up this country committee.

she called me today and I called her back. Hopefully, we'll speak today. 

There are a couple of other things that we need to talk about, but of the above I think I'll say:

"I don't feel comfortable doing work for a committee that won't have me as member."

I actually think that the "offer" she made me was insulting and I wonder what went into that thought process.


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## VermisciousKnid (Dec 27, 2011)

She or someone in the group doesn't like you and therefore doesn't want you in on the planning meetings. But they will put you to work after the decisions have been made because it will be fun to give orders to you. 

I think your response was fine. 

As the VP why are there any activities going on without your knowledge?


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

VermisciousKnid said:


> She or someone in the group doesn't like you and therefore doesn't want you in on the planning meetings. But they will put you to work after the decisions have been made because it will be fun to give orders to you.
> 
> I think your response was fine.
> 
> *As the VP why are there any activities going on without your knowledge?*


Generally, it's a worldwide organization so there's a lot going at any one time. However, on this occasion since it does deal specifically with expanding the chapter / area that we are in, I do find it insulting that this is the offer "they" give me instead of giving me a seat at the table.

One thought I have is, why mention this at all. Why not plan stuff and then try to bring me in at the end to do the heavy lifting / stuff they don't want to do. 

If things don't improve on this matter, I may take this up to a higher level and ask whether this is the way this organization wants to treat their volunteers.


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## tech-novelist (May 15, 2014)

The wonderful thing about being a volunteer is that if they try to mistreat you, you can tell them to stick it where the sun doesn't shine, without having to worry about how you are going to pay your bills. Good job not letting them guilt you into anything!


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## VermisciousKnid (Dec 27, 2011)

My wife was elected president of our grade school PTO a number of years ago. The school had about 350 kids so there were a lot of people involved in the organization. Not all of them knew how to behave professionally, though most did. 

The prior president was such a lousy leader that the treasurer was able to embezzle over $20,000 under her nose over the course of a couple of years. 

All meetings should be open to all members. 
All books should be open to all members. 

A few years later, we joined the high school marching band parents organization. That was another clique of unprofessional parents running an organization for the benefit of their friends and family. 

It takes a strong president to run a good organization.


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## WonkyNinja (Feb 28, 2013)

NextTimeAround said:


> I am VP of a local chapter of a larger volunteer organization. A committee is being formed to develop a chapter in a neighboring city.
> 
> The President of my chapter wrote me this in an e-mail:
> 
> ...


She has either

a) read an encyclopedia of buzzwords or is using a random buzzword generation program.

and/or 

b) Just completed an online course on how to sound like a manager without really saying anything.

Either way that was passive aggressive and patronizing.

The way I read that is that she and others will set the boundaries and guidelines without any input from you and then inform you with a "make it so" kind of email so that it is entirely in your hands if problems occur and she can take the honors for the planning if it's a success.



NextTimeAround said:


> This is how I responded:
> 
> "You mention "I'll make sure you stay in the loop and can join us when we get to some concrete actions." Who is "we"? And does this mean my input is not welcomed on this matter? I would like to contribute to the planning in addition to carrying out the activities."
> 
> Would you say that my response was proportional or psycho?


I think that was pretty restrained considering. 

From your other post she sounds like the type of person that gets involved in volunteer work to take the glory rather than the altruistic reasons that genuine volunteer workers have.


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## Cooper (Apr 18, 2008)

With the additional back ground info you supplied my opinion is the VP is hoping to steer this current project herself or give someone else a chance to manage it and is including you in the loop as a courtesy because of your past contributions or because she is trying to gently let you know you won't be involved as deeply in this project as you have been with past projects. There's nothing wrong with an organization looking for fresh ideas and trying different options.

Frankly I'm not sure why you find offense with this, I think you are being overly sensitive. So what if they plan something without you being involved, that doesn't mean they're treating their volunteers badly. I think if you take this to a "higher level" it's just going to make you childish. If you still want to help the organization go with the flow and do what you can, otherwise just sit this one out.


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## MarriedDude (Jun 21, 2014)

NextTimeAround said:


> I am VP of a local chapter of a larger volunteer organization. A committee is being formed to develop a chapter in a neighboring city.
> 
> The President of my chapter wrote me this in an e-mail:
> 
> ...


Poorly worded and transparent directive. This person is attempting to give you what amounts to the illusion of choice in the matter of whether or not you join in the project. 

Alternatively...depending upon this person's past actions...it could be an attempt to get you to provide insight into what "concrete actions" should/could be done and how they might be implemented. This allows for your input without directly asking you to do their job. 

on another note..."pretty sure"...is weak-speak for "please"..."make sure you stay in the loop"...is an attempt to establish who is in charge...which was totally countered by the previous statement of "give me the green-light".....in the final analysis...poor leadership.

OR...if you really dig deep....what this person really meant was..."It rubs the lotion on its skin or else it gets the hose again"- AND "like me, like me, like me, like me...PLEASE"


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Cooper said:


> With the additional back ground info you supplied my opinion is the VP I'm the VP, she is the President. is hoping to steer this current project herself or give someone else a chance to manage it and is including you in the loop as a courtesy because of your past contributions or because she is trying to gently let you know you won't be involved as deeply in this project as you have been with past projects. There's nothing wrong with an organization looking for fresh ideas and trying different options. I only became VP last spring. So I'm pretty fresh myself. I would have thought that the Pres and VP works together and makes these kinds of decisions. Why would the Pres want to play me off other people. What's the point of having elections if the President treats the rest of the officers with same regard as nyone else off the street?
> 
> Frankly I'm not sure why you find offense with this, I think you are being overly sensitive. Maybe, because like most women I want to be loved for my mind (planning) as well as for my body (execution) So what if they plan something without you being involved, that doesn't mean they're treating their volunteers badly, if you still want to help the organization go with the flow if I wanted to just go with the flow, then I would not have run for an office. If and do what you can, otherwise just sit this one out.


See above.


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## Cooper (Apr 18, 2008)

NextTimeAround said:


> See above.


Sorry, my bad. I must have skimmed thru your first post too quickly, I thought you stated the VP had sent you the message and you were a volunteer.

So changing my answer....Yes as a VP you should be involved in any organizational planning for your area or chapter. I would guess the president feels an obligation to try and keep you in the loop because of your position but doesn't necessarily want to work with you and doesn't value your opinion. 

In that light I would say her email was both dismissive and condescending. 

Why not show up to all meetings? Don't wait to be invited, I'm sure you have other contacts in the organization to let you know when a meeting is taking place. You do have a right to be there unless something in the organizations bylaws gives the president absolute power to structure and direct the organization as she sees fit, and if that was the case why have elected officials other than the president.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Cooper said:


> Sorry, my bad. I must have skimmed thru your first post too quickly, I thought you stated the VP had sent you the message and you were a volunteer.
> 
> So changing my answer....Yes as a VP you should be involved in any organizational planning for your area or chapter. I would guess the president feels an obligation to try and keep you in the loop because of your position but doesn't necessarily want to work with you and doesn't value your opinion.
> 
> ...


Thanks for that Cooper.

My guess here is that some of the committee may be made of people at the Country level. 4 of which I have met. And judging from the entire e-mail that the President sent to me, this committee could be looking at not only our region in this country but a couple of others. Could the head of the committee only want one person per chapter officially involved?

Still, I want to know who is involved; regular updates; thought process of the members and so on.

And yes, I do find it insulting that they are happy to accept my donkey work but not accept any thoughts and input out in the planning.

We'll see what the President has to say. But without explicitly telling her (as I may change my mind), I could easily see myself turning down her summons to do some work. Imagine being asked to set up and close down (ie clean up.) No thanks.

I'm glad to ruminate here so that I can be very evenhanded when I speak with her.

So more comments please.........


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

Evinrude58 said:


> Can I plagiarize this?? Lmao
> _Posted via Mobile
> 
> There's got to be a time when I can use this in response to one of the ex's texts!!! ��
> Device_


Feel free - enjoy!


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## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

manfromlamancha said:


> I am not sure of what the meaning is but I do know what my response would be:
> 
> _"At the end of the day it would be a no-brainer and involve us thinking completely outside the box in order to, going forward, achieve 110% a win-win situation and will be on my radar, flagging up at the close of play for me to touch base with you. Suffice it to say that the ensuing paradigm shift will have me beside myself, jumping out of my skin to square the circle, if you get my drift."_


+1 for including "paradigm". More points if you could work in "synergistic".


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## pb76no (Nov 1, 2012)

We're you elected VP? Nominated or endorsed by the Pres?

Unfortunately, volunteer organizations can have internal politics, people with hidden agendas, personality conflicts, cliques, etc. All counterproductive to the actual mission of the org. 

You should decide if those "other" issues are worth it or whether you just want to contribute to the overall org's mission and ignore the rest. I've joined, also served as officer and/or board on a few and left some of those because I felt my time was more valuable than the BS required to serve - even though the org does good work.


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## JohnA (Jun 24, 2015)

I need more info on your relationship with this person. Do you have another thread ? My view is a horse is a house until it is a zebra. Questioning this is healthy just need more info to deciede.

I think your response was a good one.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

GTdad said:


> +1 for including "paradigm". More points if you could work in "synergistic".


Actually the meaningless/overused/frivolous phrases I am most proud of include:

At the end of the day…

No brainer…

Thinking outside the box…

Going forward…

Achieve 110%…

Win-win situation…

On my radar…

Flagging up…

Close of play…

Touch base…

Beside myself…

Jumping out of my skin…

Square the circle…

Get my drift...


in addition to paradigm shift. Must admit, synergistic should be in there too.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

@manfromlamancha,

in the message that I received from the Chapter President, what trigger words did you see there?


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

JohnA said:


> I need more info on your relationship with this person. Do you have another thread ? My view is a horse is a house until it is a zebra. Questioning this is healthy just need more info to deciede.
> 
> I think your response was a good one.


More information? Anything in particular? I've already given some background information, but maybe you could point me to additional aspects that I should consider.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

pb76no said:


> We're you elected VP? Nominated or endorsed by the Pres?


I was elected. All 5 of us officers ran uncontested.


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## manfromlamancha (Jul 4, 2013)

NextTimeAround said:


> @manfromlamancha,
> 
> in the message that I received from the Chapter President, what trigger words did you see there?


Really ?

"Helping with this _outreach_ …"

"Give me the _green light_ …"

"Make sure you_ stay in the loop_ …"

"When we get to some _concrete actions_ …"

Meaningless drivel.

I would like you to help me organise … 
Because … 
You need to know this information … 
We need to get this done by …. 
Let me know if you can help … 


would be easier to understand (maybe).


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Here's her response by e-mail. (we missed each by phone yesterday.)

"The "we" getting to concrete actions is the XXX ad hoc committee that I'm on. "jack" runs this committee." (I know the person she is referring to.)

This is a worldwide American organization that claims to be committed to diversity. I've been to a few regional meetings. There are few non white faces there.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Are you non-white?


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

turnera said:


> Are you non-white?


yes. I've been living in Europe for more than 20 years. I and a couple of other black Americans feel that the times that we have felt discriminated against has been at the hands of a fellow white American including this organization as I have been a long time member in another country. Usually the sin of dismissiveness.


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## rzmpf (Mar 11, 2016)

Sounds to me like they are trying to exclude you from the planning and only want to make use of you when they need you (hard work implementing the plan). She let's you decide (give green light) if you want to be informed about the plans so you cannot blame her for not informing you if you do not explicitly state your interest in being informed. 

When it comes to work to implement their plan they surely want to use you. Are you the only non-white person on this board? Are you basically the non-white poster child for your chapter of this "pro diversity" organisation? 

Nonetheless in this email full of BS went a lot of thought (pretty much nobody writes such nonsense off the cuff) so there is something up.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Sorry you are going through this @NextTimeAround. Take the high road. They can think what they like. You are better than them.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

The chapter President e-mailed me and said that my messages to her on this and other things sounded regularly accusatory. She said that she could go through her e-mails and show me examples when she has time. I didn't encourage her.

I was at a regional meeting a few months ago and one of the officers at the country level said briefly to me that she was happy that I was around because "these ladies don't really know what it takes to run a chapter." 

I am thinking contacting her tomorrow and see if we can have a chat. I don't see where there is an ombudsman.

One thing that does mystify me is that my husband does not see how insulting her original message about the committee and my proposed relationship to it is. But then my husband has been with the same employer for 15 years. I don't think he's ever had to deal with office politics.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

rzmpf said:


> *Sounds to me like they are trying to exclude you from the planning and only want to make use of you when they need you (hard work implementing the plan).* She let's you decide (give green light) if you want to be informed about the plans so you cannot blame her for not informing you if you do not explicitly state your interest in being informed.
> 
> When it comes to work to implement their plan they surely want to use you. Are you the only non-white person on this board? Are you basically the non-white poster child for your chapter of this "pro diversity" organisation?
> 
> Nonetheless in this email full of BS went a lot of thought (pretty much nobody writes such nonsense off the cuff) so there is something up.


That's the way I interpret it. 

I did not ask to join the committee at all so this info came to me unsolicited. But I suspect because I have been speaking with a couple of people in a nearby town, maybe both she and "Jack" decided that needed to have a word with me.

ETA: Yes, I am the only non white on the chapter board. I have met 2 others for the rest of the country. There are about 8 chapters.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

> One thing that does mystify me is that my husband does not see how insulting her original message about the committee and my proposed relationship to it is. But then my husband has been with the same employer for 15 years. I don't think he's ever had to deal with office politics.


He sees it. This type of thing happens from the top to the bottom. It's just a little different language at different levels and what is at stake is less as you go down the ladder. 

He is just picking his battles. He probably doesn't see a way you can win because he knows the pres has already approved this or the email wouldn't have been sent.


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## rzmpf (Mar 11, 2016)

NextTimeAround said:


> That's the way I interpret it.
> 
> I did not ask to join the committee at all so this info came to me unsolicited. But I suspect because I have been speaking with a couple of people in a nearby town, maybe both she and "Jack" decided that needed to have a word with me.
> 
> ETA: Yes, I am the only non white on the chapter board. I have met 2 others for the rest of the country. There are about 8 chapters.


Could it be that you rocked their boat too much with your 2 events? That they feel somehow threatened in their cosy positions where they only had to feel good about themselves for doing so much for diversity without doing anything?
That would be my explanation for this behaviour and because you are not white they have a hard time dealing with that and not look like total hypocrits (and thereby destroy their valued image). So they try to leave you at the sideline and only call you in to show you off when they seem fit.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

rzmpf said:


> Could it be that you rocked their boat too much with your 2 events? That they feel somehow threatened in their cosy positions where they only had to feel good about themselves for doing so much for diversity without doing anything?
> That would be my explanation for this behaviour and because you are not white they have a hard time dealing with that and not look like total hypocrits (and thereby destroy their valued image).


That is possible. But even "Jack" when he made a presentation at the regional meeting, he said at a chapter should have at least one activity a month. Because we are doing things on a shoestring, well, a Happy Hour is about all the we can manage until we get a more active membership that we can count on.

Just before Christmas, among the 5 of us, I lobbied for setting up dates for the happy hour for the next 6 months. My rationale was so that we could a rhtym together and so that we market not one but all of the "events" at once.

I was met with so many red herrings ie, grade school is on vaction for 2 weeks every other month, as if every family with kids goes away for a full 2 weeks every other month; as if we re only interested in attracting parents; the secretary, who is not very reliable complained since she has an 11 year old in French school; and also that he son had a concert on of the evenings tht we were planning to do one and so on.......

I finally wrote the President and told her excatly what I was going to do ie, which venue; hours dates and so on. If she did not approve of it in 48 hours (I gave a date), then I would take the matter to the country level.

She approved within one hour of receiving my e-mail.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

It may not even matter that she is nonwhite. It may be that her ideas were so different than what they were used to doing, even though they might be better, that they don't want to include her.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

This is precisely why I volunteer to serve at soup kitchens. None of the politics or drama, just hungry folks smiling and happy to get some chow.


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

happy as a clam said:


> This is precisely why I volunteer to serve at soup kitchens. None of the politics or drama, just hungry folks smiling and happy to get some chow.
> 
> 
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


That works if you are happy just showing up. I suppose I would not encounter these frustrations as well if all I did was pay my dues and attend events and maybe throw in some extra at a fundraiser.

But on this occasion in particular, I do believe that if I did do nothing, then nothing would happen.

I bet those who are charged with decisionmaking encounter a lot of politics among one another even in the adminstrtion of a soupl kitchen. People do use not for profit experiences for resume building.

Also, I find it interesting (and in a bad way) how much even charities spend time and money on "their brand." instead of just getting on with their (supposed) good works.


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## rzmpf (Mar 11, 2016)

NextTimeAround said:


> That is possible. But even "Jack" when he made a presentation at the regional meeting, he said at a chapter should have at least one activity a month. Because we are doing things on a shoestring, well, a Happy Hour is about all the we can manage until we get a more active membership that we can count on.
> 
> Just before Christmas, among the 5 of us, I lobbied for setting up dates for the happy hour for the next 6 months. My rationale was so that we could a rhtym together and so that we market not one but all of the "events" at once.
> 
> ...


Well that proves my point. You make them look bad because they are not really putting effort into this. It seems that "Jack" would think like you and keeping you apart in planning things makes it easier for them to keep this charitable activity as effortless as possible.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

> I finally wrote the President and told her excatly what I was going to do ie, which venue; hours dates and so on. If she did not approve of it in 48 hours (I gave a date), then I would take the matter to the country level.


This just threatened your boss. You better find another organization, or be ready to push her out, take over and be certain to win your case, cause she's going to be on your back for every minute detail until you quit or get impeached, if that's possible. All of those volunteers are likely going to back her, too. 

Not saying you are wrong, you just aren't "playing ball". It all starts with one person and then, if you can get the backing, you can make a better organization. It's very tough to do, though. Good luck. I mean that. I'm not being facetious.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

Mum used to say, "You can catch more flies with honey than with vinegar".


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

2ntnuf said:


> This just threatened your boss. You better find another organization, or be ready to push her out, take over and be certain to win your case, cause she's going to be on your back for every minute detail until you quit or get impeached, if that's possible. All of those volunteers are likely going to back her, too.
> 
> Not saying you are wrong, you just aren't "playing ball". It all starts with one person and then, if you can get the backing, you can make a better organization. It's very tough to do, though. Good luck. I mean that. I'm not being facetious.


I hope we don't have to be so pessimistic.

I am tired of being told at a time when it's not possible to do anything about something, that well, I could have done..... I just didn't try hard enough.

And the President does come across to me as someone who would say that. It seems as if she does things only after I say that I will do it myself. For example, trying to advertise our events at non competing groups. I was told that the TReasurer had contacts with a certain group. But then nothing was done. I asked about it again a few months later, oh yes, Treasurer thought he knew someone but they have left. So she contacted them herself. At something did get done.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

NextTimeAround said:


> I hope we don't have to be so pessimistic.
> 
> I am tired of being told at a time when it's not possible to do anything about something, that well, I could have done..... I just didn't try hard enough.
> 
> And the President does come across to me as someone who would say that. It seems as if she does things only after I say that I will do it myself. For example, trying to advertise our events at non competing groups. I was told that the TReasurer had contacts with a certain group. But then nothing was done. I asked about it again a few months later, oh yes, Treasurer thought he knew someone but they have left. So she contacted them herself. At something did get done.


Well, at least you knew what you did, but I don't understand why you didn't expect the type of reaction you got from the others?

Listen, I'm not saying what you are trying to do isn't good. I'm saying you can expect to be looked at as a trouble maker for a while. You'll have to get the opportunity or make the opportunity to prove yourself to get that president's job. I think you can do it, but you'll have to let this stuff roll off and do what you know is right. 

I think, if you spend too much time on the little things, you'll waste precious opportunities. 

So, get yourself going and take over that project. Get approval to do so. Get their plans and pick them apart, properly. Make improvements to their plan and present them to the boss above your's. Save them money and get more bang for the buck, dollar or euro, whatever. 

Then, get it done as you know you can. Or, play the game and live in peace. It's all up to you.


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## WhyMe66 (Mar 25, 2016)

NextTimeAround said:


> I am VP of a local chapter of a larger volunteer organization. A committee is being formed to develop a chapter in a neighboring city.
> 
> The President of my chapter wrote me this in an e-mail:
> 
> ...


That they want your input once they get some definite plans made to set this up, but do not want to include you without your permission.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

NextTimeAround said:


> I finally wrote the President and told her excatly what I was going to do ie, which venue; hours dates and so on. If she did not approve of it in 48 hours (I gave a date), then I would take the matter to the country level.
> 
> She approved within one hour of receiving my e-mail.


Oh, well, there you go then. 

You've been banned for insubordination. You can bet you've been the talk of many b*tch sessions. But they can't really ban you, so this is how they try to piss you off so much that you quit.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

turnera said:


> Oh, well, there you go then.
> 
> You've been banned for insubordination. You can bet you've been the talk of many b*tch sessions. But they can't really ban you, *so this is how they try to piss you off so much that you quit.*


all the more reason to take it up to the next level or above that even.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

WhyMe66 said:


> That they want your input once they get some definite plans made to set this up, but do not want to include you without your permission.



and do you think that this is a good thing?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

NextTimeAround said:


> all the more reason to take it up to the next level or above that even.


Well, you could do that...if you want to ensure that it's a battle to the death.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

NextTimeAround said:


> I am VP of a local chapter of a larger volunteer organization. A committee is being formed to develop a chapter in a neighboring city.
> 
> The President of my chapter wrote me this in an e-mail:
> 
> ...


He wants you to tell him you are interested.

He will ensure you are kept informed.

This is so you can be ready to join them when they take formal steps to start the new group.


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## WhyMe66 (Mar 25, 2016)

NextTimeAround said:


> and do you think that this is a good thing?


If they want to establish another chapter, and they want your input, that seems to me that they look at your chapter as a viable, effective chapter and should be modelled after. That would seem to be a good thing.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Here's another message that the President sent me today:

"There is a third way to interpret my question on whether or not you'd like to work on outreach to nearby city. As part of the xxx committee, when we started talking about outreach to nearby city you are the first person I thought of who might want to help. Interested in helping? Great! Not interested due to whatever reason? Well that's fine too. The xxx committee certainly doesn't lack transparency... there's been a report on it at the last 3 conference calls, all of which you've attended.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Ok, so she's 'saying' that she's being generous and openminded - so run with that. Respond in kind. "Great. I'd love to be involved. Please do include me."

And see what happens.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

I just went to a global conference for this group. 

The legal counsel for our country committee has taken a liking to me. And I noticed that other people are not afraid to speak of the snags incurred with personalities.

So the legal counsel told me that she wanted to see these e-mails that I mention. she seemed to be particularly exercised by the fact that the Pres of the chapter didn't care whether I was part of the monthly conference calls but then didn't bother to call me to proxy for her one month even though the country secretary wrote it that way in the minutes.

(If an officer misses 2 conference calls without a proxy in a 12 month period, then they lose the position).

And also, the requirements that the Pres tried to put on the events that I wanted to organise

ie. that all 5 local officers had to be able to attend; and that we needed to avoid grade school holidays (2 weeks at a time every other month in this country).

So maybe I was right all the time. We'll see how our (between me and the chapter Pres.) will be viewed by a third party.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

So I finally sent the legal counsel a letter.

a well documented 8 page letter (I included the supporting e-mails in a pdf)

10 days later, she's written me saying that she and the country Vice-Chair would like to conference call me.

The legal counsel also said in the e-mail (the country Vice-Chair has always been a fan of yours...... this is the same woman who said of chapter colleagues "those ladies don't really know what it takes to run a chapter......."


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