# How do you deal with a chronic victim?



## Diesel_Bomber (Mar 17, 2013)

I've posted previously in the considering divorce forums but I decided to see where counseling takes us. The first session we had both agreed to quit fighting every day, break the cycle, and call it a truce. 

That lasted a whole week. She outright accused me of doing something and I put the proof that I didn't right in front of her face. So I get a weak little apology and I'm realizing this will always be a toxic marriage, and its time to find a lawyer.

There will never be any change in her, she will be high drama high conflict until the day she dies. Something I don't want a part of. 

But she goes into victim mode saying that I'm not trying and she's the only one trying to fix this :rofl:


I've managed to not pick any fights and not let any of her flaws irritate me to the point that a storm's a brewin on the horizon.

Any of you run into a person who in any situation they go into victim mode instead of taking some personal reflection away from it?


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Sorry, guy, but I think you're being unfair in some ways. 


You succeeded 6 out of 7 days. When she lapses and a too-familiar behavior comes out, you respond by jumping to the conclusion that she will *never* change, even though she did make an effort at an apology. 

You are not exactly superior here, and you aren't a victim either.


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## married tech (Jan 18, 2014)

You're not alone. My wife goes through regular mood cycles where some days all she wants is dramatic conflict and confrontation regardless of it validity or logic. 

Two weeks ago I lived with an irrational confrontational witch. Anything and everything was a reason or excuse for her to blow up. I however kept myself control and pointed out the inconsistencies of her actions and expectations. She hated me for it but at the same time wishes she had the self control I have. 

This week I am living with the woman I married who understands that the self control I have didn't just happen in one day. I have worked my whole adult life to master it.. 

I just chalk it up to same body but different person driving her emotional bus this week.


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## Diesel_Bomber (Mar 17, 2013)

KathyBatesel said:


> Sorry, guy, but I think you're being unfair in some ways.
> 
> 
> You succeeded 6 out of 7 days. When she lapses and a too-familiar behavior comes out, you respond by jumping to the conclusion that she will *never* change, even though she did make an effort at an apology.
> ...


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## Diesel_Bomber (Mar 17, 2013)

married tech said:


> You're not alone. My wife goes through regular mood cycles where some days all she wants is dramatic conflict and confrontation regardless of it validity or logic.
> 
> Two weeks ago I lived with an irrational confrontational witch. Anything and everything was a reason or excuse for her to blow up. I however kept myself control and pointed out the inconsistencies of her actions and expectations. She hated me for it but at the same time wishes she had the self control I have.
> 
> ...


How do you tolerate it? I cannot stand the rollercoaster ride. I never know who I'm going to get.....Mrs. Hyde or Dr. Jeckyll. Would you define it as walking on eggshells all the time because you have no idea what's going to trigger her to go off the deep end? First time I met her mother I noted how critical her mother was of her step dad, he was simply cooking supper, and I warned her that if she's like that at all, this is not going to work.

Dr. put me on high blood pressure meds because of the never ending combat. The MC even said that she had to quit because I have enough stress and home is supposed to be a calm relaxing place, not a war zone.


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## married tech (Jan 18, 2014)

> How do you tolerate it? I cannot stand the rollercoaster ride. I never know who I'm going to get.....Mrs. Hyde or Dr. Jeckyll. Would you define it as walking on eggshells all the time because you have no idea what's going to trigger her to go off the deep end?


Depends on the day. Some days when I have had too many other things to deal with I tread lightly. Most days I stomp around as I please. 

Her issues are largely mental and physical health related (she feels she does not need to take care of either) so I take that into account. Her perceptions of what are rational and important and what is not tend to get very skewed when she is having a bad week. 
Dark colored sock lint on the old light colored rug is damn near worth divorce, because I am an uncaring slob, but her 200/140 blood pressure and the fact she can't focus well enough to remember to turn the stovetop off is fine in her mind. 

But yes to be honest I started seeing a counselor last week (turns out I am really okay and the stable one) and I have her scheduled for a visit next week. After that we both will go. 

Personally I am really hoping she is having one of her bad days when she goes.


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## deejov (Sep 24, 2011)

That lasted a whole week. *She outright accused me of doing something and I put the proof that I didn't right in front of her face. *So I get a weak little apology and I'm realizing this will always be a toxic marriage, and its time to find a lawyer.

The bold sentence... it's not pleasant for anyone to be proven wrong. It is the CAUSE of defensive action to be right instead of calling a truce. 

It's not what she says or does, it how you react to it. 

Can you explain your boundaries a bit? Your reactions to her are key to ensuring it's a boundary or not. 

I point this out because....it all ties back to you simply cannot control how someone else behaves. If it means calling a lawyer because she just will NOT do exactly how \ what you say... you may end up in the rinse \ repeat cycle. 

Yup, it's maybe possible to find someone who matches exactly what you want, but life WILL change, and so will they. So how does one "handle" the bad days?

Are they just bad days... or time to call it done?

And.. I wanted to say.. I feel for you. Been there. Done that. You cannot win. You will just wear yourself out.


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## Diesel_Bomber (Mar 17, 2013)

After reading No More Mr. Nicy guy, my boundaries are putting my needs first from now on. I don't like to be talked to like my mother did when I was 5 and got caught with my hand in the cookie jar.

She used to bully me until I grew a spine and stood up for myself. She didn't like that. One. Single. Bit. 

Anything that starts to chip away at who I am, my own self respect, or like a doormat....count me out. Instead of asking a simple question, I was outright accused..like if I had gone up to her and said you're f*cking your boss aren't you? Just out of the blue for no real reason. 

And I agree with you, you cannot control how a person reacts but I gotta ask you this, if someone in your life was a constant source of toxicity and caused abundant amounts of stress would you remove them? 

I read a few responses to where others tolerate a bad day every now and again, which I wouldn't have any objections over. 

But we fight every damn day. We go to the counselor, he tells her to back off. Her dad corners me and says "she's just a little stubborn."

No you raised a bullying control freak victim who LOVES the drama rollercoaster.

She was itching to start things before this happened. Two days before this she said "I'm afraid to act a certain way or say anything."

I am around her maybe 2 hours a day and we made it almost 2 weeks without the downhill swing of the dramacoaster.

I REALLY REALLY want her to just move out so I don't have to endure war in my own house....I can relax.....no more worrying about what grenade is she going to lob next when I least expect it.

I'm exhausted from trying so hard and getting kicked in the teeth over and over again for my efforts.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

My MIL is a chronic victim. Everything that's ever happened to her is everyone else's fault. People like this seem to be so wrapped up in their own misery that life becomes ALL about them. You get pulled into the whirlpool of their life which is a never ending series of events that is all about what is being done to them. They never take responsibility for anything that has happened in their life. In their own minds they are pure as the driven snow, but end up being the most toxic people you could ever encounter.

Some of these people could be described as narcissists. My MIL certainly is one. ONLY option I've seen to deal with this is to stay the hell away from them.

Add to that, she recently, out of the blue, made insane accusations about me, and is continuing to make out like she's a victim in it all, when I've done nothing to her, just made me see some similarities there. I am starting to wonder if it's because too much time had passed since her last catastrophe and she needed some new drama to whinge about to everyone.


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

Diesel_Bomber said:


> A
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Or instead of wanting and waiting for her move out, you could be the one to move out and away from what you no longer want to tolerate.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

Diesel_Bomber said:


> After reading No More Mr. Nicy guy, my boundaries are putting my needs first from now on.


So, you've decided being selfish is the solution?

I question whether the "chronic victim" accusation is projection?

What Makes Marriage Work?


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## jld (Dec 1, 2013)

That is a good article, Blonde. Thanks for linking it.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

married tech said:


> Two weeks ago I lived with an irrational confrontational witch. Anything and everything was a reason or excuse for her to blow up.


Learn Her Cycle And Adjust Your Approach | Married Man Sex Life


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## deejov (Sep 24, 2011)

OP,
Good. Don't let anyone treat you like a doormat.
although I will add something.
As much as you FEEL that she talks to you like a 5 year old, the hard truth is... that's argueable. That's an opinion.
Because you have some history between you, it is (possible) that you interpret HOW she says things as a personal attack. But it is most likely that she is being dis respectful. 

What is the purpose of a boundary? To help you protect your sense of self worth. Until you are able to objectively dismiss UNTRUE statements about yourself.

Is it true? 
Did she talk to you like a 5 year old or did you "take" it that way because of past \ sensitive issues?

Even if it's true... what's a good way to handle it?

Does it make sense to LOWER your behavior to the offenders, or does one stay true to their own internal morals on how to treat people?

Does one LEAD in how to treat other people, or does one enforce it with a hammer? both will work... but one will rob you of your peace.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

> So what you're saying to continue to put up with bad behavior, not have any consequences for violation of boundaries, and sacrificing my self respect.....I couldn't disagree more with this. Everybody has their own personal limits with what they will and will not tolerate. Would you voluntarily stay with someone that beats you to a pulp every day? Pretty sure I know the answer to that.
> 
> You are not exactly superior here, and you aren't a victim either.
> 
> Don't see anywhere that I did say I was the victim.


This didn't quote right... sorry! 

DB, you are correct that you did not SAY you're a victim, but your original post shows that you feel like one. 

Similarly, I didn't say you or anyone should "continue" to put up with bad behavior or not induce consequences as appropriate. BUT... if you say you're "going to work on things" then want to use the FIRST slip up as proof positive that NOTHING will EVER change, that the relationship will ALWAYS be toxic, then you are being unfair. 

Either you have some magical idea that "working on it" = being perfect forevermore, or you were just trying to make yourself look good while you waited to pounce. You either should have left when you reached that limit, or you should be honest when you say "I'm willing to try." You did neither of these things, and therefore, I think you're being unfair.

You made progress for a week, but that was not good enough.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

Diesel_Bomber said:


> How do you tolerate it? I cannot stand the rollercoaster ride. I never know who I'm going to get.....Mrs. Hyde or Dr. Jeckyll. Would you define it as walking on eggshells all the time because you have no idea what's going to trigger her to go off the deep end? First time I met her mother I noted how critical her mother was of her step dad, he was simply cooking supper, and I warned her that if she's like that at all, this is not going to work.
> 
> Dr. put me on high blood pressure meds because of the never ending combat. The MC even said that she had to quit because I have enough stress and home is supposed to be a calm relaxing place, not a war zone.


You don't. You do the best you can and then you ignore unsubstantiated foolishness and drama for drama's sake. People do what works for them. If she is persistently giving you grief, you are persistently rewarding her in some way. If she gets pissed off, the world will still turn. You weren't put on this earth to blow powder sugar up anyone's backside, to cure all their ills, to meet all their expectations. She can saw her end of the log and accept the best you have to give, or she can hit the road. She can find herself in a magical place where she is master of all she surveys (nothing). 
Why would you walk on egg shells? What's she gonna do to you? Leave? If she's a miserable sad sack who won't partner you're better off without her. She gonna kill you? She can only do that once. I am not cruel, I am not indifferent, but I'm not walking on egg shells or catering to a drama queen. I choose to be happy. If my wife chooses to be miserable, she is welcome to be miserable...alone. I'm not leaping through constantly moving flaming hoops to try to put a grin on a miserable woman's face.


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## Diesel_Bomber (Mar 17, 2013)

Jamison said:


> Or instead of wanting and waiting for her move out, you could be the one to move out and away from what you no longer want to tolerate.


Yeah I don't think so. 6 years of working 12 hour days to save up for my house and only my name s on it. She's not getting more freebies from me so she can spit in my face some more.


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## Escaflowne (Jan 27, 2014)

I agree with kathybatesl

If you have years of consistently performing the same bad habits on your resume, it's very difficult to change that in the short amount of time it seems like you gave her. Plus, you have to realize that it does take 2 to fight and I assuming from your post that you tend to take that "haha, told you so." stance. There was a thread I read on here talking about fighting and how so many people consider an argument with their spouse as either a win or a loss. It seems to be a game or competition or something. There seems to be something deeper in her that makes her feel like things are always happening to her. Is she depressed? Rubbing the obvious in her face isn't going to help her, I promise.

It doesn't sound like you're willing to try. It sounds like you gave it a shot, failed, and gave up. You have to remember that you both have bad habits, and those bad habits are so frequent now that they are just automatic reaction. It takes a lot of time to break a habit - A lot.


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## Diesel_Bomber (Mar 17, 2013)

Blonde said:


> So, you've decided being selfish is the solution?
> 
> I question whether the "chronic victim" accusation is projection?
> 
> What Makes Marriage Work?


 :lol:

The author talks about people like you who say things like this......please refrain from posting in my threads again...you don't know me at all nor have you been a fly on my wall for the last couple years.

K thanks.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

Diesel_Bomber said:


> :lol:
> 
> The author talks about people like you who say things like this......please refrain from posting in my threads again...you don't know me at all nor have you been a fly on my wall for the last couple years.
> 
> K thanks.


I rest my case

NMMNG creates a monster.

Unsubscribing (and feeling very sorry for his poor wife...)


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## Escaflowne (Jan 27, 2014)

Blonde said:


> I rest my case
> 
> NMMNG creates a monster.
> 
> Unsubscribing


?


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

Diesel_Bomber said:


> I've posted previously in the considering divorce forums but I decided to see where counseling takes us. The first session we had both agreed to quit fighting every day, break the cycle, and call it a truce.
> 
> That lasted a whole week. She outright accused me of doing something and I put the proof that I didn't right in front of her face. So I get a weak little apology and I'm realizing this will always be a toxic marriage, and its time to find a lawyer.
> 
> ...


If it's your relation partner and they play the victim you let em go.

If it's a friend, you show them the light to personal responsibility... Over time, they will get stronger.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

Escaflowne said:


> ?


 
When he says "the author" he is not referring to the article I quoted. 

He is referring to Glover(?) author of "No More Mr. Nice Guy" (NMMNG) a book which may help some but for others provides rationalizations for selfishness.


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## Diesel_Bomber (Mar 17, 2013)

For the ones with sincere replies....thank you.

Unbelievable: You've made some valid points here. I 
don't get mad anymore when she kicks me in the teeth. I find things to do (apparently taking care of my own needs is selfish to some posters) by going to the gym, hanging out in the garage, etc. When I do fight back, shes on the phone with her friends and family telling them what an a-hole I am. She fails to tell them that she poked the dog with a stick repeatedly. I see this pattern when I dig at her past relationships.

Kathy: Thanks for clearing up my confusion. I don't consider myself to have a victim mentality. I'm a doer. I know her tones quite well. At our last appointment with the counselor, her tone was very confrontational and militant when all he was doing was asking questions. I have a hard time believing she is motivated for a change. I think its too much at her core to be confrontational then go into victim mode when I put my foot down. There used to be a time when I was the best thing since running water. She pays nothing towards the house, gets some of the best healthcare possible, legal service at no charge, I take care of the vehicles, majority of the repairs on the house....she went from being grateful to a disrespectful entitled brat that throws temper tantrums when she doesn't get her way. Compromising isn't even an option. Its her way or she attempts to punish me. I pose this as a serious question, with no sarcasm intended....how am I being unfair? The past history has been nothing but confrontation with the sole motivation being nothing more than to dominate me into getting her way or be taken as belittling...


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## Escaflowne (Jan 27, 2014)

Diesel_Bomber said:


> For the ones with sincere replies....thank you.
> 
> Unbelievable: You've made some valid points here. I
> don't get mad anymore when she kicks me in the teeth. I find things to do (apparently taking care of my own needs is selfish to some posters) by going to the gym, hanging out in the garage, etc. When I do fight back, shes on the phone with her friends and family telling them what an a-hole I am. She fails to tell them that she poked the dog with a stick repeatedly. I see this pattern when I dig at her past relationships.
> ...



So, you paint a very horrible picture of her. She sounds like a monster. Is she? She sounds like someone who drives all of her personality into thinking of ways to manipulate you. Does she? She actually sounds like an evil genius! No sarcasm here, either, but you paint the picture of the female villain we all see in movies. At least, that's the image that's popping into my head. Is your whole life with her filled with this hellish, swampy, putrid stink of an atmosphere because she's present? If she were to write a thread on here, what do you think it would say? Would you be painted as awful? What faults would she be typing out? 

I get the victim thing, I do. It runs in my family. In fact, I'm a little paranoid of having these traits rubbing off on me. *shudders*

But, the way you write about your wife....you sound like my dad. I am hearing his voice as I read your words. Sometimes I don't answer his phone calls because he likes to go on for 10 or 15 minutes about all the horrible things my sister does TO him or all the horrible things my mom did TO him when they were married. It's awful. Why don't you stop concentrating on all the things your wife is doing TO you and maybe think about some of the things you could do to help the situation. I doubt you're the merry maid that slaves away while your wife sits on her throne, toes freshly painted, telling you all of the horrible things you did to her....

That's just what I'm getting out of your posts. :/


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

Diesel_Bomber said:


> Yeah I don't think so. 6 years of working 12 hour days to save up for my house and only my name s on it. She's not getting more freebies from me so she can spit in my face some more.


Not sure what the laws are in your state, but the best thing to do then, is get a lawyer and find out what your rights are and proceed from there.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

*How do you deal with a chronic victim?*

You call them out on it and move on with your life.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Diesel_Bomber said:


> Kathy: Thanks for clearing up my confusion. I don't consider myself to have a victim mentality. I'm a doer. I know her tones quite well. At our last appointment with the counselor, her tone was very confrontational and militant when all he was doing was asking questions. I have a hard time believing she is motivated for a change. I think its too much at her core to be confrontational then go into victim mode when I put my foot down. There used to be a time when I was the best thing since running water. She pays nothing towards the house, gets some of the best healthcare possible, legal service at no charge, I take care of the vehicles, majority of the repairs on the house....she went from being grateful to a disrespectful entitled brat that throws temper tantrums when she doesn't get her way. Compromising isn't even an option. Its her way or she attempts to punish me. I pose this as a serious question, with no sarcasm intended....how am I being unfair? The past history has been nothing but confrontation with the sole motivation being nothing more than to dominate me into getting her way or be taken as belittling...


It sounds like you've been dealing with an intolerable situation for a long time. When I say you're being unfair, I am ONLY speaking of your stated intention to work on things and how you responded to her screw-up after seeing a week of what sounds like progress. 

I'm NOT saying that you have been treated fairly, or that you've been unfair in your relationship. I imagine that like most of us, you have reached a point where coping with the bad means rewriting your history with her so you can disengage to some degree as you prepare to leave, and now you're at that point where you want the relationship to end. The problem as I see it is that you are NOT ending it. Instead, you've made a half-hearted pledge to "work on things." You know full well that if you were suddenly to expected to completely change your way of doing something... change the way you laugh, for instance, you'd sometimes do it the way you "used to." If you cannot trust her to make those changes, stop pretending. Stop making empty promises. Go see an attorney and make your exit plans.

And if you WON'T do that, then consider taking a look at how YOU are guilty of doing the very things that you resent her doing, because you do sound like Escaflowne described her dad... like a "poor me, I'm not a victim but I am victimized."


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