# Update, brothers



## joshbjoshb (Jul 11, 2011)

So.

Last night I slept at the couch.

In the morning I got a very angry email from my wife, with the words "sorry" and "pain" enough times over there - which made me happy. But basically she is saying I have to apologize.

I replied that I have no problem apologizing, but she has to realize that she is to blame not less then me.

She got home. We spoke. She claims that she so much lost interest in our marriage that I have to initiate and then maybe it will create a desire in her.

I said well if you are not interested in working it out let me know. I am not investing myself into something that you are just going to run away from.

How do I move on from here? Any good advice?

I need a clear plan of action.

For example, I demanded that she start talking with respect and not yelling or cursing me out.

How do I implement?


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## Married&Confused (Jan 19, 2011)

you implement that by not engaging her when she speaks to you that way. when she does, you get up, tell her you'll talk to her when she speaks to you with respect and walk away.

you have to do this each time. any time she speaks to you without respect and you stay and listen, you teach her that is acceptable.

make sure that your side of the discussion is equally respectful.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

josh,

It depends.

What does she respond to?

What was her childhood like?

How did her parents behave towards her?




joshbjoshb said:


> So.
> 
> Last night I slept at the couch.
> 
> ...


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## joshbjoshb (Jul 11, 2011)

Hi Conrad,

Her mother is not a bad lady, just a lady who has very poor with dealing with her emotions... she uses a lot of rejection words such as "go away from me I don't want to see you" or "I don't want to be your mother." I know that many mothers are using those words but she doesn't know how to connect emotionally to any of her children... a lot of fear, a lot of anger, major lack of self worth (well they are all coming from the same place).

When I was going out with my wife, her uncle told me something. He said that she has an inferiority complex but with the right support she will be better. For the first years of our marriage I didn't understand what he is talking about - she seems so strong and always wants to be in control! Only when I got her I understood that they were all signs of weakness on her part.

Anyways, her mother is major negative, I don't think that she has a good marriage at all although they are married for almost 30 years. Doesn't really respect her husband but he is so stubborn that she has to follow whatever he is demanding (not really asking or anything). My wife is saying that her father used to be so nice and never like that, and I think that this is a classic example of a nice guy turning into a a$$holl.

The past few days were very nice. She spoke respectuflly and showed much of affection toward me.

But she still has so much negativity into her that its crazy. This morning as I come back home from the gym she starts to jump on me with a list of what I did wrong last night and why did I leave the lights on etc. etc. I got so mad, I just yelled at her that she is not going to start my day with these type of comments, and for the first 30 minutes I am back home (I get up before her) I will not take any of negative comments. You know, just drives me crazy to walk home and start my day this way - I am sure many of the comments are correct.

She got upset and I got even more upset.

I know I should always be in control. But I believe that part of the nice guy rehab is to let yourself scream whenever you are just pushed too much. I think it's a healthy sign, as long as its being used rarely.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Never scream.

It shows you are out of control.

Much more effective to say in a very controlled tone, "You would never allow me to address you in that manner" - and then stop talking.

Nothing more needs to be said until you hear the words, "I'm sorry".

Be prepared for it to take awhile.

If she starts in on something else, you merely look at her and calmly say, "I don't like what happened yesterday/last night/etc." and continue on in stony silence.


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## IanIronwood (Jan 7, 2011)

Conrad said:


> Never scream.
> 
> It shows you are out of control.
> 
> ...


I concur. In the very few cases where my wife has gone over the top and been disrespectful to me, I fix her with an icy glare, tell her that when she is able to communicate with me as a respectful adult I might be interested in listening to her . . . and then I leave her to her thoughts. Any attempt to repeat the tirade (only happened once) is met with me leaving the house to let her think about things and cool off.

But never, ever let her disrespect you. And don't scream. 

Growl. It's more manly.


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

I concur with the concurrence. This is great advise. After a while, you don seem to get so worked up about anything. Everything is manageable and under your control.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ren (Aug 1, 2011)

joshbjoshb said:


> How do I move on from here? Any good advice?
> 
> I need a clear plan of action.
> 
> ...


I think you should be the change you want to see. Draw a line and stand on the other side of it. Talk to her with respect and you are in the best position to lead her there, let your respectfulness become the basis of your respectability. I know it's hard as hell sometimes, you get caught up in the moment and start crossing the line, but you can recognize that and acknowledge it and take a step back when it happens. You stand on the right side of that line as much as you can and point to it whenever either of you is on the wrong side, eventually she will learn to join you there or it will become evident that she is unwilling to help repair your relationship.


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## jayde (Jun 17, 2011)

IanIronwood said:


> Growl. It's more manly.


I think some of the best advice I've read on here!

Grrrr.


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## joshbjoshb (Jul 11, 2011)

Guys, thanks so much for your advice. I now understand that yelling isn't the best way to deal with things... I used to be the nicest guy in the world, never yelling, always talking with respect to my wife. But you know, many years of her disrespect and yelling on her side just get to you at some point... then you can easily turn into an a$$hole which I don't really want to be.

Last night I had such a "wow" moment.

I am a big reader, and used to leave my books all over the place. It always bothered my wife and I am trying to put things back more often than not. Anyways, out of 2 books that were out I left one. We had an okay day but when she saw the book she started her all usual route. "I hate when you leave your books, you always leave your books out there, I have to clean after your s**t, I am just going to take the book and leave it outside."

I replied that I won't argue with her and that if she leaves the book outside and it gets stolen or anything, it is our money that was wasted and I will be getting a new one.

She got even more upset, then at some point in the conversation (more like argument) she said "If this doesn't work I can never change you. What will take for me to able to change you?"

Wow. Yes. This is what she is after from day one - changing me. I know that. She is trying to control and make me what she wants me to be - as if that will make her happy (nothing will unless she decides to be happy and not complain on every stupid thing with me or anyone else!)

So I replied very calmly that yes, I know she wants to change me and no, she didn't find a way to do it and she is for sure on a wrong path. If you want, you can only inspire change by positive re-enforcement but def. not the way she is doing it since day one in our marriage: yelling, threatening, manipulating...

She got herself the book "the surrendered wife". I read some of it and was so impressed by the ideas. The problem with my wife is that she UNDERSTANDS that she is wrong, but her emotions are so crazy that she doesn't know how to deal with them. She really needs to seek outside professional help which she refuses.

Till then, I'd be the one who has to suffer, to be always in control of my emotions, be ahead of the game, and always think how to lead myself - and, I guess - her - out of this pit.

Its a bit sad. I know few women who are the ones that inspire change and bring positive environment in the home. That was my dream girl. Instead I always have to be the one who is always positive, and always have to deal with my wife negative feelings and emotions which are non-stop.

I know I am doing great progress, but still far from seeing the light - which I hope it will happen soon.

Sex. Women think that this is all what men wants. Little do they know how unattractive is a women who is always yelling and criticizng you. You'd rather skip sex for weeks at time and not have sex with her.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Josh,

You're almost there...this close.

But, for God's sake, stop with the victim speak.

If you really feel like you're her victim, get out.

Here's the thing.

She is out of control. You hear that her mother was out of control. Her father didn't stand up to her mother, he pussed out. Her mother was domineering and matriarchal - and your wife was miserable in that environment.

BUT, IT'S THE ONLY ENVIRONMENT SHE KNOWS.

It is up to YOU... yes joshb - to show her something different.

And, I'm extremely glad to see you are standing up to her now. Deep down, it's what she really craves. And, trust me on this, her subconscious gets this, even if her conscious brain is too cluttered to process it.

The more you stand up to her, calmly, dispassionately, but resolutely - the more attractive you become to her - on a primal level.

If you continue with this, you can expect the dam to break and a torrent of passion will head your way from her like you have never experienced.

You're almost there.

Stop with the victim stuff. This is a game you can win - big time. Carry yourself confidently. She's damned lucky to have you as her man, and you know how to show her.


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

Yes. Your not a victim. Your the Captain of your ship! Act like it. Expect periods of near mutiny while you force changes in the relationship dynamics, but eventually, you will reach calmer waters.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## joshbjoshb (Jul 11, 2011)

I don't feel a victim for a second.

I do find myself wondering what if I would've ended up with an emotional stable wife (is there such a thing???) that instead of having to be SUPPORTED 100% of the time, could have been SUPPORTIVE 25% of the time. That's enough for me.

I also grew up in a home with bad marriage... that's why I made a decision to lead a healthy life and healthy marriage. Problem is she didn't make the decision and so she continues all of the bad behavior she saw at home.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Josh,

Who wrote this line:

>>Till then, I'd be the one who has to suffer, to be always in control of my emotions, be ahead of the game, and always think how to lead myself - and, I guess - her - out of this pit.<<

Sounds like a victim to me.

Believe me, she is suffering more than you. She hates herself.


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## joshbjoshb (Jul 11, 2011)

Okay guys. I like to use this thread as a place to update you  it give me much support to see more people reading and understanding what I am going through.

The road is still rough, no doubt. I hope it will get mainly better.

But today she told me something that made me happy. "You are such a man" (she said it in a bad way), "why do you have to be so manly?"

Well, here we go. I am very happy she feels this way.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Yeah ... keep being a man. A smart one.

Sounds like you are doing a great job.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

joshbjoshb said:


> But today she told me something that made me happy. "You are such a man" (she said it in a bad way), "why do you have to be so manly?"



Been growling?


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## joshbjoshb (Jul 11, 2011)

aug said:


> Been growling?


LOL. I don't think so. But something came up and I took full charge of the situation and lead without blinking... well I love to lead. The mistake so many of people of my type make is they think they'd be better off not leading.


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