# Is it wrong to want equality in a marriage?



## needguidance (Aug 17, 2012)

New dilemma. I hate when I hear about lop-sided marriages and Im not sure if thats the turn mine is going to take. I've been recently discussing things I want equal the marriage with my wife. It seems like she is either selfish to the fact or she is just not getting it. Ive posted about couples benefitting from a "no turn down" policy for sex unless its something extreme. I have one, my wife doesn't and she says can't promise that she ever will have one. Then she says if I remove mine and one day she initiates sex, she will shutdown for who knows how long when I initiate it. Mind you the times she has, Ive NEVER turned her down. So when I say equality Im telling her she should either honor my policy and maintain one too or I remove mine so that we make it an even playing. Somehow it becomes a catch 22, we both can't win and it angers me. Im sure there are situations but isn't it logical to have equality in a marriage. If my needs aren't being and I continue to meets your in hope that you will change to start meeting my needs, why should I continue to meet hers? Let me guess, "lead by example". Well follow my lead then!


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Equality is a goal and it's not always achievable


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

needguidance said:


> If my needs aren't being and I continue to meets your in hope that you will change to start meeting my needs


This never works. I have a general rule that I don't give a whole lot more than what I'm getting. The logic of I'll keep meeting your needs in the hope that you'll magically meet mine is just nuts.


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## Ina (Dec 3, 2012)

i can see where this would bother you, but then thing is not everyone has the same comfort level with sex. It seems like she needs the safety net of your policy to initiate, because she can't deal with what rejection means to her. She may feel that since you are the one that always is up for sex, if you reject her, that means there is something wrong with her and that will shut down her courage for the future. Her issues probably have more to do with her comfort than with you. She may need more control than you do for sex. I don't think things are ever equal, though you can work towards that goal. But is that really what you want? "equality"? or do you just want a more open relationship when it comes to sex with your W? Figure out what you really want and what you BOTH need to get there . . .


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## Shoto1984 (Apr 11, 2009)

Who is the cleaner person in the marriage? I mean who is it that goes crazy first when the bathroom is a mess etc? If its her maybe you have something to negotiate with.....there's a little humor here but you never know. Its always the way that the person who cares about something more then the other is the looser. You could be going crazy and she might not have a clue as to why anything would be wrong.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Simple rule of thumb when it comes to sex: The one with the lower libido generally controls the frequency of sexual encounters. Sure, compromises can be made to increase frequency to improve the satisfaction of the HD person, but it's a compromise. 

In my situation, I'm more HD than my wife. I'm significantly higher than my wife. As such, it would be stupid of me to NOT have a "no turn down policy". Why would I ever consider it? 

OP, I assume you are the one with the higher sex drive. If my assumption is correct, why would you consider getting into a game of chicken with your wife over sex? This is not a battle worth fighting, because it sounds like you are considering turning her down for sex to prove a point. It's not worth it.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

needguidance said:


> I've been recently discussing things I want equal the marriage with my wife.


This is a pipe dream that will never succeed. Your wife cares about some things much more than you ever will. And you care about sex much more than your wife. You can't debate her into desiring you. It's time to try a different approach.



needguidance said:


> It seems like she is either selfish to the fact or she is just not getting it.


She understands just fine. You're the one who doesn't get it. Her policy is that you meet all her needs and she will consider meeting some of yours. If you can swing it, that's a great policy to have. I would love to have that policy with my wife. But my wife won't accept it. I try to meet most of her needs and she tries to meet most of mine. It's an equality of effort.

You have three options. First, you can accept the status quo. You get sex when she is willing to give it up and you try to be happy. Second, you can match her level of effort. If she is meeting your primary need (sex) with a 50% success rate, then you meet her primary need, whatever it is, with a 50% success rate. That will get her attention. Third, you can work on yourself. Run a little dread game on her. Your wife is probably treating you like this because she believes you would never, ever leave her or cheat on her. If you undermine that belief, just slightly, she may step up her game to keep you hooked.

Good luck.


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## zookeeper (Oct 2, 2012)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> In my situation, I'm more HD than my wife. I'm significantly higher than my wife. As such, it would be stupid of me to NOT have a "no turn down policy". Why would I ever consider it?


It actually sounds like a manipulative tactic to me. Imagine walking into a bank and announcing you have a "no turn down" policy on receiving free money? This was offered in order to pressure his wife into giving him the same, which is what he really wants. 

Pressuring her for sex when she doesn't want it will accomplish the opposite in the long-term. If they are having regular sex but she refuses every so often, the OP needs to grow up and accept that he has a higher drive than she does. If they are at the once a month, missionary-only, she grits her teeth and counts the seconds until it's over stage, MC is needed.


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

needguidance said:


> New dilemma. I hate when I hear about lop-sided marriages and Im not sure if thats the turn mine is going to take. I've been recently discussing things I want equal the marriage with my wife. It seems like she is either selfish to the fact or she is just not getting it. Ive posted about couples benefitting from a "no turn down" policy for sex unless its something extreme. I have one, my wife doesn't and she says can't promise that she ever will have one. Then she says if I remove mine and one day she initiates sex, she will shutdown for who knows how long when I initiate it. Mind you the times she has, Ive NEVER turned her down. So when I say equality Im telling her she should either honor my policy and maintain one too or I remove mine so that we make it an even playing. Somehow it becomes a catch 22, we both can't win and it angers me. Im sure there are situations but isn't it logical to have equality in a marriage. If my needs aren't being and I continue to meets your in hope that you will change to start meeting my needs, why should I continue to meet hers? Let me guess, "lead by example". Well follow my lead then!


It seems a bit sad that you and your wife are treating each other like rivals at an international summit meeting. You talk about 'removing' and 'maintaining' your 'policy'. 

Don't you think you ought to seduce her rather than lock her into a contract?


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## sharkeey (Apr 27, 2012)

You love her, right?

She doesn't want to have sex sometimes.

So make it about what she wants not what you want.

This isn't about equality it's about not being selfish.

Besides, if you force someone to have sex with you it becomes a chore, akin to putting out the garbage on a cold winter night. They're going to resent you for it and rather than things getting better they will get worse.

"You're going to f-uck me right now even though you don't want to because it's my policy!"

don't you see something wrong there?


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## Middle of Everything (Feb 19, 2012)

no


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## needguidance (Aug 17, 2012)

There is no wrong or right answer to this subject. I'm not a spiteful person and I hate the tit for tat game. What I am not understanding is she wants me to never, ever turn her down for sex. Yet if I ever do then I'm the bad guy and she will shutdown never to initiate again. If I asked her for the same in terms a level playing ground then she's says its unrealistic. Because I'm HD I'm penalized? Wtf are you guys talking about? You're just like her. Same sad logic. I haven't been one to be in a bad situation and just accept it. I swear marriage and employment show similar struggles. Its like why would I stay at a job that I'm unhappy with? Why would stay at a job that I love that I'm being paid less than what I should be paid? I have to accept this situation because of my own drive? If I'm going out of my way, the extra mile for, why the hell wouldn't she go the extra mile for me? In that instance to the rest of you that may be going the extra mile for your spouses, wouldn't you want the same in return? Yeah I could have half *** my part of the marriage but been there done that. Ill give 110% and I want the same in return from her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## needguidance (Aug 17, 2012)

By the way, I'm not pressuring her to have the policy. I made a suggestion. Its hard to seduce someone who isn't very receptive. Check out the millions of post of the guy who went the extra mile daily for a consistent let down. If you're trying to meet all of your spouses needs and they can't meet your #1, then there's definitely a gap that's being created on purpose. That sounds selfish.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## johnnycomelately (Oct 30, 2010)

needguidance said:


> By the way, I'm not pressuring her to have the policy. I made a suggestion. Its hard to seduce someone who isn't very receptive. Check out the millions of post of the guy who went the extra mile daily for a consistent let down. If you're trying to meet all of your spouses needs and they can't meet your #1, then there's definitely a gap that's being created on purpose. That sounds selfish.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I don't think you sound selfish, but your language is more suited to the boardroom than the bedroom and you risk turning sex into a negotiation tool.

If you push her too hard she will either give you duty-sex or she will be put off altogether, that is why I think you have to be sly and approach it through seduction rather than negotiation.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

There is no equality in marriage. Sometimes you'll do the heavy lifting and sometimes she'll have to. It's not a matter of what's fair. That's just a place to ride the Merry-Go-Round. There's only that which you can live with. It requires commitment, patience and an attitude of service. There are no good guys or bad guys, no winners or losers. You both make it work or you don't. Using rationality to negotiate marital sex is pointless. It's like hitting the most home runs but wondering why you lost the football game.


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## needguidance (Aug 17, 2012)

Please explain to me why we both can't do the heavy lifting. Please go in to detail why it shouldn't be fair.
Please be more specific on why things have to be lop sided when you get married. Pretty damn even when
You're in a relationship.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sharkeey (Apr 27, 2012)

Simple.

People are selfish, it's just human nature.

Why do people fall in love and get into relationships? Because the other person makes them feel good so they respond by making the other person feel good.

Now that we've established that people are selfish, let's go to the next step.

People are different. They like different things, they prefer different foods, they don't have the same sex drive.

In your marriage, you have the higher sex drive, your wife has the lower sex drive, it's how you're wired, it's a physical thing, and/or your wife has lost attraction for you which is something you might want to look into but let's stay on topic for the moment.

So you want sex more than wife does. She isn't going to say to herself "I want to give him what he wants because I love him and it's fair", she's going to say to herself "I am so not into having sex with this guy, and he's just going to have to rub one out because I am more concerned about my own feelings than his".

Life isn't fair, being marriage doesn't mean things are equal, people are selfish.

That's it.


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## needguidance (Aug 17, 2012)

The attraction part, probably and I'm willing to take the necessary steps to make myself better or atleast look as great as I did when I met her. Its guess realistically people fight those two odds once they settle. Either you're going to be the one who receives happiness or you're going to provide happiness. In a relationship its mutual but for some odd reason in a marriage it becomes one persons purpose. Its like that selfish saying I heard. "What's mine is mine's and what's yours is mine". It becomes what have you done for me lately instead of what can I do for you. Its bs. This is the type of bs that makes you want to be divorced and never want to get married again. Life is hard enough. Why does marriage end up catastrophe one time or another?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

NG,

You're in a difficult situation. You've both cheated. You've been separated. You were both more sexual with other people than you were with each other. You're basically only together because of you child. That's a lot of history to get over and you haven't given your wife much time.

I understand that you've committed to your marriage and you want it to be great. But women don't work that way. Women are like elephants. They never forget. Twenty years from now, you can get in a fight with your wife and she'll bring up the women you were banging while you were separated.

So it is not possible for your wife to just decide that the last year never happened and starting today you will have a great marriage with a great sex life. Having a great sex life will require and slow and methodical rebuilding of her attraction to you. And many things go into a wife's attraction to her husband.

Good luck.


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## needguidance (Aug 17, 2012)

Thanks. Everyday my resentment builds and I try to fight knowing that things can be better and will get better. Patience is the hardest thing I have ever had to maintain because I never had to use it. In the past I'd just walk away, case closed. I didn't fix things that I felt couldnt be fixed immediately. I wasn't mature enough to know that some things take time to fix but all things can be fixed. Just need patience. My W told me to have faith. She will come around but I have to understand whats going on and have faith in her. I try to explain to her that faith is doable along with patience. I wont smile in her face and be cheerful about this because thats not me. In time I will be able to put a real smile on my face but right now I have a lot of dust on my shoulders. It's hard to smile when you're not getting what you want. I told her yesterday (wrote in my log, she has one too. We exchange ours and read because sometimes its easier to write than speak on things) that I get tired of reaching out for love and getting my hand slapped. Trying to move forward two steps to be pushed back three. Eventually you start to clam up and thats where I am now. She wants to feel wanted and I need her to be more receptive. Give and take. I cant keep giving and she not give anything back? She told me to promise that once we are at a better place in our lives that I will not clam up. I told her I'll try. Just like she can't guarantee anything, niether can I. Just where the chips are right now.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Try not to run down such a rat hole as this discussion.

If your wife turns you down constantly, then you have to ask her what kind of wife she wanst to be and what kind of marriage she expects to have.

If you feel your wife is not sexual enough, and then she decides to work on this an initiate sex with you, it's a tremendous mistake to turn her down. If she initiates in such a way as she is teling you she is doing you a favor, does not want to really do it, is only doing it becuase she has to, then you must turn that down.


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## deejov (Sep 24, 2011)

You kinda answered your own question...

life becomes what have you done for me lately instead of what can you do for me.

Who started it? Maybe you. Is she following your lead? if so, turn it around. Really, that's your best bet. Focus on what you are doing for yourself, your family, your wife, your marriage.

Keeping score is for sports. If she comes around, great. If she never loses the scorecard, it's her loss to live with resentment instead of happiness.

It's hard to do, but scratch the past and start with today. Ask yourself what you've done today to make life better. That's all.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Guidance 
How 'out of shape' are you? 

How out of shape is your wife? 

My advice. Stop talking to her about sex, stop referencing it in your log, and start going to the gym every day. 

If she initiates, go for it. And have fun with her. And do not bring up the idea that you should be able to refuse. Just don't. 

Let me describe a healthy hd/ld dynamic. 
It actually starts with the hd spouse. The hd:
- finds a compromise frequency that works for their ld partner. It is not a hard, fixed number like 3 per week it is some number that represents average and factors in life. Some weeks will be more and some less
- eliminates love busters including groping
- suggests a way for the LD spouse to say 'not tonight' that isn't hurtful
- does not reject the LD spouse (sorry life isn't fair) 
The LD:
- does not tease and then forget or avoid sex. This teasing thing is not ok. 
- learns about their own responsive desire
- teaches their hd partner how to work with their responsive desire
- works hard to avoid rejecting their hd partner 

All that said the playing field isn't level so let's have no hd whining about that. Guess what, you don't mind that your partner is overweight but they really do mind that you are. Life isn't fair. 

That said, as the hd partner you need to prepare for certain types of standardized bad behavior. The most common is that you are responsible for creating the mythical stress free environment for your spouse. Do most or all the house work, etc. If you take on that job I can almost guarantee failure.


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## CuddleBug (Nov 26, 2012)

I am a high drive guy and my wife has a low drive due to her size which makes her insecure and don't touch me, pulls away, etc.

Marriage is supposed to be:

Husband in the mood, wife makes the time
Wife in the mood, husband makes the time
both in the mood, great
both not in the mood, great

It's not supposed to be:

Husband in the mood, wife says no, maybe later, still doesn't happen, days, weeks later........

If the hubby did that to his wife, we'll, hell hath no fury like a woman's scorn!!!

It's one sided and selfish to do this, which leads to un-faithfulness.


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