# Q for those who were married for many years..



## grays (Jun 24, 2014)

Is it my imagination or are people (on average) physically different than they were the last time I was single? I got together with the ex in 1989, when I was 19 years old. Nobody I dated or even knew had a six pack and most guys weren't all big and muscly and cut. I feel like every guy I get into a flirtation with is some kind of crazy athlete, and I really don't go for that type. I had a date recently with a guy who was took second place in the world judo championship and looked like it. And then another guy I've been hanging out with and have a crush on, really nice guy, just think the world of him -- just told me that he was a professional soccer player for three years before he started college. My FWB, who I'm having a great time with is 51 years old, but when he takes his clothes off, he looks like he's 22. He tells me he has 8% body fat. WTF???

I am frumpy and saggy! I work out like a mad woman and I'm proud of my fitness gains, but I don't wanna be with someone who is all about that stuff. I want just a normal guy who I can be normal with. I thought I found one (guy with just a normal body, lol) and then I googled him and it turns out that he's just a bad dresser bc I found a shirtless video of him and OMG. :roll eyes:

Anyhow, I know there are worse problems a woman could have but I am feeling out of my element on this. I think part of the problem is that I look pretty promising with my clothes on. :rofl: But underneath my clothes is a middle aged mom of two. 

I'm just wondering if others who were married for a long time have also been surprised once they get single to see what's out there and , also, what the expectations are now. Pretty sure this also applies to women because the other day I was standing around with four of my female friends, I realized that three of them have fake boobs and all four of them were practically barbie doll shaped.


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## lonelyhusband321 (Feb 18, 2014)

I don't think people are physically different - I think the likes and dislikes of our culture swing almost wildly. Nowadays a person has to be something different than "we" used to be.

When I was a young man, women like Raquel Welch were (and still are to me) smoking HOT. Now, any woman who has a bottom larger than 30 inches is "fat". Back them, men were defined by who they were - not what their abs looked like. Charles Bronson really never was a six pack guy, but he was a MAN. Same with Clint Eastwood and John Wayne.

Just a few weeks back, there was a beauty contestant that took heat for being "large", when in actuality she had a body that SHOULD have made her competition cry!

People haven't changed - the pendulum has swung (and not for the better, in my opinion).


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## movealong (Aug 9, 2013)

I chatted with a lady on line last night. On her profile she mentioned having curves and a "few" extra pounds. Very damn few in my opinion. She had a classic Marilyn Monroe body with curves in the right places. She was not some Barbie Doll type, and she was very attractive. 

There is a pop song out right now (I know this because I have an 11 year old daughter) called "All About That Bass". I love the self confidence in that video. My favorite line is "I'm bringing bootie back, go ahead and tell them skinny b*tches that". LOL!

From what I see in my area there is not a fitness craze for the women. Which doesn't bother me at all. I look at height/weight proportional women.


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## Fenix (Jul 2, 2013)

People who are too concerned about that are all rather boring, imo. Be fit, be active and be fun.  That's enough.


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

You know I'm all about that bass, 'bout that bass, 'bout that bass! No treble! 

Grays, I find myself encountering the same thing. I'm what the modern dating world seems to consider fat, flat-chested, and disfigured. I'm a 5'8" 37 year old mother who wears a size 10 and a 34C bra, with loose belly skin and stretch marks from pregnancy. But, apparently, everyone else in the dating pool has had her breasts augmented and lifted, her tummy tucked and lasered to remove stretch marks, eats about once a week, has every hair below her eyebrows removed on a regular basis, tans routinely, and generally looks like Malibu Barbie. 

It's a little daunting to be in the dating pool.


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## clipclop2 (Aug 16, 2013)

doesn't where you hang out have a lot to do with who you meet?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## movealong (Aug 9, 2013)

Rowan said:


> You know I'm all about that bass, 'bout that bass, 'bout that bass! No treble!
> 
> I'm a 5'8" 37 year old mother who wears a size 10 and a 34C bra, with loose belly skin and stretch marks from pregnancy.


That song is catchy! 

Those are not stretch marks, they're tiger stripes of a Mama Cat! Perhaps it is my background (first job in the Navy was working Neonatal, L&D, and PostPartum), but I never considered stretch marks to be anything other than an outward sign of an inward love; love enough to go through child birth. Yes, I know, most men don't see it that way.


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## SamuraiJack (May 30, 2014)

When I was dating actively, coming off a 15 year marriage, I saw a lot of variety in folks. I noticed there were generally two categories. One was people who “had just sort of let themselves go” and the other were people who realized that they needed to compete a little. I tended to go with the competitive ones because they were more attractive to me. It also seemed that they were more likely to have done some psych work too…although this was never truly the case with some. 
There were people out there who just prettied up the outside and never did a lick of work on the inside. 
I found those to be the biggest disappointments.

In my age group I knew ahead of time that I was going to encounter some folks who had a bit more mileage on them than others and that is fine by me.
Beauty can be a subjective thing. All I know is I would rather buy a well-kept Volkswagen than a Ferrari that doesn’t start half the time.


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

grays said:


> .... My FWB, who I'm having a great time with is 51 years old, but when he takes his clothes off, he looks like he's 22. He tells me he has 8% body fat. WTF???
> 
> I am frumpy and saggy! I work out like a mad woman and I'm proud of my fitness gains, but I don't wanna be with someone who is all about that stuff. I want just a normal guy who I can be normal with. I thought I found one (guy with just a normal body, lol) and then I googled him and it turns out that he's just a bad dresser bc I found a shirtless video of him and OMG. :roll eyes:....


So you want someone who has let himself go.

I don't understand why you would have such a negative reaction to people who take care of themselves, but I imagine it has to do with your own opinion of yourself. 

Is it that you don't want to HAVE to stay in shape? 
Do you want to be able to "let yourself go" and not feel obligated to hit the gym, because of a partner who values his health?
Do you not want the pressure to keep in shape?

I guess it's pretty simple them...pursue men who have let themselves go and don't value a healthy lifestyle. 

I would recommend that you find men who are into the same things as you. If you like camping, find a guy into that, etc.


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## Cooper (Apr 18, 2008)

In this day and age we are so much more aware of living a healthy lifestyle and the long term benefits than we were 20 years ago. It's all about living longer and quality of life, and finding a balance in your life.

I think you sound a bit insecure about yourself, and that's to be expected when finding yourself back out in the dating world after a long term marriage. Understand you are you, don't try to keep up with anyone else, don't become fake about your philosophies. You are now in a position to pick and choose who you want in your life, it's really that easy. If you don't think a certain type is a good match for you than just accept that, it's not wrong or right, after all we are all different.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

You must hang out with a hotter than average crowd, OP. The majority of people are overweight or obese versus years ago. Perhaps you attract fitter guys because you are above average for your age cohort, otherwise you are either lucky or doing something else right!

When I got back into dating after 24 years, there was the obvious impact of age on my dating prospects, and a very wide range of physical attractiveness and personality. It took a lot of effort - and luck - to find someone who was a good match in all the things that mattered to me.


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## grays (Jun 24, 2014)

Rowan said:


> Grays, I find myself encountering the same thing. I'm what the modern dating world seems to consider fat, flat-chested, and disfigured. I'm a 5'8" 37 year old mother who wears a size 10 and a 34C bra, with loose belly skin and stretch marks from pregnancy. But, apparently, everyone else in the dating pool has had her breasts augmented and lifted, her tummy tucked and lasered to remove stretch marks, eats about once a week, has every hair below her eyebrows removed on a regular basis, tans routinely, and generally looks like Malibu Barbie.
> 
> It's a little daunting to be in the dating pool.


OMG, don't get me started on the body hair! :roll eyes: When I got together w ex, it was 1989, everyone had a bush. lol I was FINE with that and so was he. I hear it's coming back though. 

And I cannot believe how common cosmetic surgery is these days. There is probably more of it among the people I know bc my kids go to a crazy expensive private school (we are a financial aid case, no money for new boobs here, if I were to want them, which I don't think I would). But they are everywhere here, it seems, mommy make overs everywhere you look. 



clipclop2 said:


> doesn't where you hang out have a lot to do with who you meet?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yes. I'm sure that's part of the problem. As soon as I saw things with the ex going south, I ran out and started salsa dancing and I LOVE it. It has really made this transition so much easier to have some community and something I love to do and, it is so weird to me, but loneliness has not been an issue at all. When he started losing his mind, I was so scared of being alone. But I kinda like it. And I think that's in large part bc of salsa. So... I don't wanna give it up or even cut back on it, but it is where I've met all of the guys I've had interest in. I guess I'm a little surprised at who goes salsa dancing. I would have thought it'd be more diverse in this respect.



movealong said:


> Those are not stretch marks, they're tiger stripes of a Mama Cat! Perhaps it is my background (first job in the Navy was working Neonatal, L&D, and PostPartum), but I never considered stretch marks to be anything other than an outward sign of an inward love; love enough to go through child birth. Yes, I know, most men don't see it that way.


Its nice if one (some?) does! I appreciated my stretch marks and extra skin before the break up, and most of the time I think I still do. My ex was completely fine with it, but it was a project we did together. I never felt worried about it with him. I assume that I will end up with someone eventually who appreciates it, too. 



tulsy said:


> So you want someone who has let himself go.
> 
> I don't understand why you would have such a negative reaction to people who take care of themselves, but I imagine it has to do with your own opinion of yourself.
> 
> ...


I am actually very fit, if I may say so myself.  I've been working out like crazy and loving it and feel great about how I look and feel for the most part. The only issues I have w my body are ones that I really can't do anything about. It's all about the baby related skin issues -- and my skin did not do well with it. Imagine what breasts look like when they spend seven years as DD and then drop back to a C.  I still have enough skin, I think to accommodate double D's. Sigh... Actually, even there tho, I'm not horribly negative about it. I kind of like them to tell you the god's honest truth. lol

But, as a general rule I spend very little time working on my looks. I work out a lot but that's because I have type I diabetes and I really, really want to have a normal life span, at least. I also like it (I think especially now that ex is out of the picture) because it makes me feel powerful and healthy and capable. I would totally appreciate someone else feeling that way. But I don't dig a huge focus on appearance. It feels boring and shallow and, actually a little offensive to me. 

And if I were to gain a few pounds or whatever... I sure would not feel okay about my partner acting like I had made myself unloveable. I have no plans or fantasies about letting myself go, but I don't really want to be w someone whose love is contingent on me being buff.



Married but Happy said:


> You must hang out with a hotter than average crowd, OP. The majority of people are overweight or obese versus years ago. Perhaps you attract fitter guys because you are above average for your age cohort, otherwise you are either lucky or doing something else right!
> 
> When I got back into dating after 24 years, there was the obvious impact of age on my dating prospects, and a very wide range of physical attractiveness and personality. It took a lot of effort - and luck - to find someone who was a good match in all the things that mattered to me.


Ya know, I'm not sure if I'm doing anything else right... but I have been really happy and am naturally kind of gregarious, at least when I'm happy. I feel like that's the thing that at least some of these guys are responding to. Also, it appears that there are pretty much no single guys my age out there. I have met exactly three of them so far. One is my 8% body fat man. lol But I seem to be ending up hanging out with these YOUNG men, mostly mostly around 30. I'm 44. :scratchhead: I never saw this coming at all. I would much rather be with someone my age. But I must admit that I am really enjoying spending time with a 27 year old who is wise beyond his years. lol Not to mention adorable, and buff. Sigh...


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## gulfwarvet (Jan 7, 2013)

I would have to say things are different from 1989. 
Seems like people are either fat or there not doesn't seem to be so much in between.
Given the modest amount the population has grown in my area we have way more athletic clubs per capita.
There are a lot fewer smokers around it seems.
And yeah breasts have ballooned.


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## Fenix (Jul 2, 2013)

tulsy said:


> So you want someone who has let himself go.
> 
> I don't understand why you would have such a negative reaction to people who take care of themselves, but I imagine it has to do with your own opinion of yourself.
> 
> ...


Often, it isn't about health, it's about narcissism. My ex was all into that. I steer clear of guys who have a laundry list of physical requirements that their gf/fb/fwb etc must have. Because, you know what? That says a lot about them.

And, frankly, I do not want to be involved with a guy who sees my flaws (which aren't many!  ) AND has that much energy invested on my outside and not by inside.

People have changed in the last 2 decades, standards have shifted...and not in a positive way. It is not about health, it is about look at me. Yuck.


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## Cooper (Apr 18, 2008)

Fenix said:


> Often, it isn't about health, it's about narcissism. My ex was all into that. I steer clear of guys who have a laundry list of physical requirements that their gf/fb/fwb etc must have. Because, you know what? That says a lot about them.
> 
> And, frankly, I do not want to be involved with a guy who sees my flaws (which aren't many!  ) AND has that much energy invested on my outside and not by inside.
> 
> People have changed in the last 2 decades, standards have shifted...and not in a positive way. It is not about health, it is about look at me. Yuck.


 You are certainly correct about the narcissism and the fact that many are not into it about being healthy but about the "wow" factor of look at me. Personally I categorize those people very different then those "living a healthy lifestyle". Frankly people who over train their bodies and have cosmetic surgeries are the complete opposite of living healthy, long term they are doing harm to themselves. It becomes an obsession for some and they just don't know where to stop, many end up just looking scary freaky.

I like to give women what I call the garden hose test (though none actually let me do the test, I don't get that) For me to be attracted to a woman I need to know what the stripped down version looks like, I'm not attracted to Barbie skinny, fake boobs and lips, giant teased and dyed hair, 15 layers of makeup...that's all yuk to me. I like a woman who is natural and healthy...so my approach is to stand them in the yard and wash away all the fake stuff with the hose, then I can see what they really look like. 

And if I ever find a woman who will let me do the garden hose test on her she gets 100 extra points for being such a good sport! lol


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## Rowan (Apr 3, 2012)

Cooper, you need to be looking for women who needn't be hosed down in the yard to see what they look like under all the fake stuff. Find one who isn't under any fake stuff. We're out there. 

And, yes, I've hosed off in the yard before. Find a woman who has and would do it again if needed. Then you won't have to do it yourself to tell what she looks like underneath. Because she'll look pretty much like she does right at the surface.


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## Fenix (Jul 2, 2013)

Cooper said:


> You are certainly correct about the narcissism and the fact that many are not into it about being healthy but about the "wow" factor of look at me. Personally I categorize those people very different then those "living a healthy lifestyle". Frankly people who over train their bodies and have cosmetic surgeries are the complete opposite of living healthy, long term they are doing harm to themselves. It becomes an obsession for some and they just don't know where to stop, many end up just looking scary freaky.



Agree on the healthy lifestyle.

I think society has played a nasty game on women. The objectification that goes on has a lot to do with why some are paranoid about how they are viewed.

Meh. I could get on my soapbox all afternoon about this.


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## speeedbump (Mar 12, 2013)

Maybe it's because those of us who are stuck in sexless marriages have all been told to hit the gym so our wives find us more attractive. So we do it, and they still don't give us a second glance.:scratchhead:

When we finally realize nothing works and it's time to get out, we're buff from putting all of our frustration into the gym.


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## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

I had a Life Coach for awhile.

She had me poll my friends and family to ask what kind of breed dog I am.

Overwhelming, it came back Labrador Retriever.

Labs are loyal, affectionate, dopey, and intelligent.

They are also messy, exasperating, and sometimes destructive.

Labs also have an athletic build and are strong swimmers (I do 100 laps in a workout sometimes), but like a lab, I have a veracious appetite and a layer of fat over the muscle, prone to weight gain if I don't watch my diet strictly. Labs are always hungry vs. a breed like a chow who can walk away from the bowl. The elephant in the room when distance open water swimmers get together is, "Um, we look different than other athletes" (like body builders - 5% fat). Um, yeah, we're kinda fat.

Black labs are the most surrendered dog (and alas the ex had to surrender me).

Anyway, moral of the story - for some reason, you are hooking up with greyhounds.  Maybe that's for the best. Labs are exasperating like I said.


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

lonelyhusband321 said:


> When I was a young man, women like Raquel Welch were (and still are to me) smoking HOT. Now, any woman who has a bottom larger than 30 inches is "fat". Back them, men were defined by who they were - not what their abs looked like. Charles Bronson really never was a six pack guy, but he was a MAN. Same with Clint Eastwood and John Wayne.


Ah, the good old days, and three of my favorite movie stars. I believe this is true. Burt Reynolds and Tom Selleck were never the muscle type either, but were big sex symbols of the 70s and 80s, and remember J.R. Ewing played by Larry Hagman? He didn't have a six pack either, but quite the ladies man of his time. 

Things have certainly changed.


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## grays (Jun 24, 2014)

Fenix said:


> I think society has played a nasty game on women. The objectification that goes on has a lot to do with why some are paranoid about how they are viewed.


Agreed! I think it has spread to men, though. I think when I first noticed it, I thought, HA, serves them right. (Not really, but maybe just a little.) But now I've got two little boys and I don't want them going all anorexic or steroid crazy, or to feel bad about their bodies. 



speeedbump said:


> Maybe it's because those of us who are stuck in sexless marriages have all been told to hit the gym so our wives find us more attractive. So we do it, and they still don't give us a second glance.:scratchhead:
> 
> When we finally realize nothing works and it's time to get out, we're buff from putting all of our frustration into the gym.


Well, this I would have some serious sympathy for and would forgive the buffness.  When my marriage started going south, I worked out like crazy because it helped a lot with my anxiety and anger. I also lost about 25 pounds. It may be that a "better" body is a side effect of a marriage gone wrong.



Scannerguard said:


> Anyway, moral of the story - for some reason, you are hooking up with greyhounds.  Maybe that's for the best. Labs are exasperating like I said.


OMG, this totally cracks me up! I have always, always felt kinda revolted by the look of greyhounds. They just don't look natural to me, like they're from some other planet. And there is nothing cute or cuddly about them. (Sorry greyhound lovers!) But I swear to god, if my 8% body fat man was a dog... sigh... he would be a greyhound, both physically and personality-wise. Ugh. He's not cute and cuddly, either. I do like him, though, oddly enough, so I hope the next time I see him I can still see past his greyhoundness. 

As far as dogs are concerned my "type" is more border collie, but for men, totally lab! Kinda biggish, husky, though not necessarily tall -- substantial, I'd say. Hmmmmm.... I'm afraid that maybe greyhounds like me. I have been chasing after a couple of labs to no avail. :scratchhead:



southbound said:


> Ah, the good old days, and three of my favorite movie stars. I believe this is true. Burt Reynolds and Tom Selleck were never the muscle type either, but were big sex symbols of the 70s and 80s, and remember J.R. Ewing played by Larry Hagman? He didn't have a six pack either, but quite the ladies man of his time.
> 
> Things have certainly changed.


Yes! Yes! Yes! And none of the 80's heartthrobs were big muscle guys either -- Johnny Depp, James Spader, Keanu Reeves, Timothy Hutton, Matt Dillon.


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## clipclop2 (Aug 16, 2013)

I could never see those guys as heartthrobs. Too skinny. There is a movie with Rob Lowe and Patrick Swayze on the cover and I can't imagine any woman swooning. Gay guys, sure. Women? Uh uh.

I agree about John Wayne. He was simply masculine seemingly without effort. Tall, humorous, tough, great smile, walked quietly, carried a big stick. 

The dependence on big effects in movies means that actors have to look bigger and better so they are not overwhelmed. They have to stand out.

But all they are is comic book characters. They all look alike in the end.


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## VermisciousKnid (Dec 27, 2011)

A couple of decades ago the only people who were in to physique building were bodybuilders and they were definitely not mainstream. Plenty of people were into running, lifting and other sports for health and enjoyment, but building bigger muscles just because... Not so much. 

Back then you could get bodybuilding mags if you were into physique building. My friend and I were Frank Zane fans because he was the most normal looking bodybuilder. 

Now physique building is mainstream and a sport unto itself. You can find dozens of magazines telling you how to get six pack abs, etc. You can find dozens of infomercials for things like P90X which are basically for physique building. 

It kind of makes sense because if you're going to spend hours exercising you want to look like it. In the past it was enough that you felt better. 

The pendulum is swinging towards physiques. That isn't synonymous with health, though. You can be just as healthy without building your physique, but getting proper exercise and diet.


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## Fenix (Jul 2, 2013)

speeedbump said:


> Maybe it's because those of us who are stuck in sexless marriages have all been told to hit the gym so our wives find us more attractive. So we do it, and they still don't give us a second glance.:scratchhead:
> 
> When we finally realize nothing works and it's time to get out, we're buff from putting all of our frustration into the gym.


And that is such bogus advice. 

Anyway, that you have/had to put up with that makes me sad. Satisfying each other's needs is pretty much a basic requirement of marriage.


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