# addiction, spending



## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

i've read a lot here about spouses with spending problems. Most are about huge debt loads. I'm in a much lower income scale. We've been married 41 years and are 67 yrs old. My wife has $1400 each month to spend as she wishes to include personal items, gas, fast food and anything else. I have a good retirement and pay all the bills and spend little money on myself.
I'm the saver, she's the spender in our home. She returned from a trip to israel 2 1/2 years ago with $1000 debt that she would quickly pay off. I've kept after her and now she has about $6-7000 in credit card debt and nothing to show for it but stuffed closets and stuff everywhere. We have no other debt. She wants to pay it off with money from a 401k that she has.
She's in poor health and thinks she'll die in a few years and don't want to leave it to me to spend on some women. We are going to marriage counseling but it doesn't seem to be helping. 
I'm concerned she will continue spending more than she gets each month from social security. I'm concerned she will empty her 401 once she cracks it open. She wants to go on more vacations and not worry about keeping the money. I say that we have a long way to go and don't know how much we'll need as we get older. Of course I want to spend some but with her wanted everything I become more conservative. Now we go at it everynight, fighting over money.. At 67 you'd think we'd have it figured out. Shoud we spend all our savings since we have no debt. Help please.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

You say that you have a good retirement. So I assume that you don't need any of her assets if she dies before you.

If she dies with $6K/$7K in debt, it will have to be paid either our of her estate or by you. So it does make a difference how much she runs up the bill and if she blows her 401K.

Do you have any children together? I'm wondering if your kids, if there are any, could help you talk to her about pacing her spending to last tell she's at least 85. I've read that if a woman lives to 65, she will most likely live to 85. So she has a few years left. 

To me it sounds like she's getting the feeling that life is almost over so she should spend it all so that she can enjoy the end of her life.


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## Bob Davis (Nov 5, 2014)

Sounds like some problems. With her or with marriage.

It's not right that she wants to leave you nothing. Especially when she puts it that "you'll just spend it on some women". WTF? Imagine what the response would be if a man said he was going to spend all the money before he died and then leave his widow a pauper. My response would be "what a d!ck".

You guys have got communal marital assets and they should be planned as such, for a retirement as you expect...for BOTH spouses. What if she spends all "her" money now, "yours" and "ours" later, then you guys live another 25 years? Being poor when you're young is hard; it's much harder when you're old.

Maybe she needs to be checked for physical problems. The onset of dementia is often expressed as surly anger, which sounds like your wife.

Glad that you're going to counseling. I can't image her breaking up a marriage after over 40 years.


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

I have two children from my first marriage that live out of state. She has two from her first marriage. One lives out of state and one lives w/us due to a mental health issue. He supports himself. He sees his mothers overspending too but tries to stay out of our business. I explained to her that she will want money to spend in her last year as well. She's tired of my hording money and wants to live for today. I think she's is trying to fill a hole with money that can only be filled with something else. What is that? I don't know. At this pace she will be broke and unhappy. I seems exactly like alcoholism.
Shouldn't we always have savings? More than a $1000? I don't care what happens to our assets if I die but she wants to spend them now. She said that if we pay off her cc debt she won't overspend again. I just cannot see how anyone who overspent on nothing once will recover by paying of debt and not overspend again. There must be a change. What do you think?
Also, she seems overwhelmed by the cluther. She can't organize her things to make anymore room. So things are more and more being left out. That makes it harder to do regular cleaning. She won't ever clean off her dresser, commode, chest of drawers, bathroom sink or dining room table. I can't clean because it's like trying to cleanup a dump. Everything belongs to her and everything is precious. I dare not throw anything away except trash. We are christians. She tells me that GOD is helping her and I know He is but He is helping everyone. I doubt He is going to tell he how to clean the house.
I built an out building, 12 x 24ft so that I can clean the garage and we can use it as it should be used. She's mad of me for wasting money on the building, eventhough I used much used material and some that I saved from jobs I worked on. I took some money from savings to pay for the rest. She sees the building as my selfishness. So now she wants some from savings to spend as she wants.
I know this is long but living in a house where I'm an outcast leaves me needing to vent. Thanks for being here.


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## Bob Davis (Nov 5, 2014)

ouch. that all sounds pretty awful to have to live with.

I'm not a professional (nor even an amateur) but it sounds like she has some mental health issues: anger, selfishness, that hoarder mentality, inability to see the clutter, lack of empathy. She really needs to see a primary care physician to check for organic causes. If the marriage counselor isn't helping, fire them and find someone else.

Yes, you should have more than $1000 savings. I assume you two have Social Security (assuming you live in the USA, or something similar otherwise, okay, you have 401K, so that's USA), and perhaps a pension. And there's at least 'her' 401K (remember, you have to start withdrawing minimum amounts from that account by age 70-1/2). So perhaps this monthly regular income will at least keep you from the poor house and free from starvation. But people always need some liquid savings in the event of emergency. She can't run joint your assets down to "0". Believe me, you two are not "old" yet. You're only 67. That's the start of retirement. There could be a long cold winter of being paupers.

The way to fight her claim that you're stingy is to develop a formal plan. A statement of assets. A budget. A plan for spending money as well as saving it. If she resists when presented with "the facts" then either she's got some problems or else there are fundamental philosophical differences.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Ask her if she can support herself on $1400 a month. She doesn't have the right to drive you into debt & leave you holding the bag when she kicks the bucket. Doesn't she even want to provide for the son with the mental issues? Or does she expect you to do that, too? Consult with an attorney regarding a legal separation to protect your assets & retirement. You don't have to go through with the divorce. Maybe the 'come to Jesus' convo will allow her to see the light.


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

I wonder how completly I can block her from her credit cards. Of course I can get to them and cut them up. But she can go to online banking and paypal and order new cards and order direct on ebay. I believe her overspending represents a personality disorder of somekind. That must be addressed to solve the root cause. I'm not qualified to do that. But I can restrict her from her cards. Will that be effective or would I be peeing up a rope.


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## Bob Davis (Nov 5, 2014)

This worries me some. It sounds quasi-illegal...cancelling her credit cards, etc.

On the other hand, in many or most jurisdictions both spouses would be responsible for debts incurred during marriage. Then again, in a divorce those debts might ("might") be apportioned based on who ran them up.

You need to investigate how to limit your liability if your wife runs up extreme debts. And this might entail formal separation or even divorce.

She really needs to have a come to Jesus moment about racking up debt.

In all honesty, I hope your wife doesn't post here next week about her controlling husband who won't let her spend a cent. I have to take what you're saying at face value, but we're not hearing the other side either. Good luck.




bravenewoldman said:


> I wonder how completly I can block her from her credit cards. Of course I can get to them and cut them up. But she can go to online banking and paypal and order new cards and order direct on ebay. I believe her overspending represents a personality disorder of somekind. That must be addressed to solve the root cause. I'm not qualified to do that. But I can restrict her from her cards. Will that be effective or would I be peeing up a rope.


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

bob, of course you're right. there is much you don't know and can reply to only what i've told you. whatever advice i receive is only as good as the accuracy of what i tell you. if i lie about things your advice would be useless. 
we had a nice day yesterday. she prepared a nice meal and gave me a cute fathers day gift. then i took the dogs for a while. when i came back she was very upset. she had gotten on the online banking site and became convinced that i had spent $8,000 and wanted to know where it went. she thought i had either spent it or hidden it. it was all i could do to get her to let it go until today so i could go to bed at midnight. near 2AM she woke me up and apolizied for her mistake. she went over all the records and found that she had been wrong about a balance. at this point i've don't nothing sneaky with our money and i'm the most frugal person around, yet she accuses me of underhandedness. i think she's has somekind of borderline personality disorder.


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## Bob Davis (Nov 5, 2014)

The best remedy for this is your own good records. Keep a paper checkbook register for each account (savings, checking, etc). Or keep an electronic record of this. One can get as fancy as they want to or need to. You could get software to keep track of your finances: Quicken, YNAB, Mint, etc. (some are installed locally on your computer, others are "web-based"). My dad used a "Register" book from the stationary store 50 years ago, those still work and are cheap and easy.

Then all your wife and you need to do is review the information. Looking strictly at an on-line account record does not portray the whole story, and doesn't show outstanding checks, etc. It is incomplete information.

If she wants to make up wacky stuff then? ...then deal with it then, with a shrink, lawyer, etc.

But seriously, having your own good records, showing where your household is now, where it has been, and where it is going, all "financially-speaking", is empowering.

By making a budget, an income/spending plan, a cash flow projection, you can assure that you have funds to meet all your expenses and bills, have a modest emergency fund for any emergencies, and planned spending on "fun stuff" so that your wife doesn't view you strictly as a cheapskate.





bravenewoldman said:


> ...she was very upset. she had gotten on the online banking site and became convinced that i had spent $8,000 and wanted to know where it went. she thought i had either spent it or hidden it. it was all i could do to get her to let it go until today so i could go to bed at midnight. near 2AM she woke me up and apolizied for her mistake. she went over all the records and found that she had been wrong about a balance. at this point i've don't nothing sneaky with our money and i'm the most frugal person around, yet she accuses me of underhandedness. i think she's has somekind of borderline personality disorder.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

bravenewoldman said:


> I believe her overspending represents a personality disorder of some kind.... I'm not qualified to do that.... i think she's has some kind of *borderline personality disorder.*


OldMan, my BPDer exW exhibited many of the same behaviors you describe. She would run up $5,000 debt (twice!) on secret credit cards to acquire stuff that would give her a sense of identity (e.g., sewing machines and fabric). In that way, she became the "clothing designer" in her own mind. But she wouldn't use the equipment or throw it away (i.e., she was a hoarder because she received an "identity" from having those items). In 15 years, she managed to sew one vest, one dress, a blouse, and a cat collar. That's what $6,000 of sewing machines and $5,000 of fabric bought us. And she used a $3,500 piano a total of five times in three years -- giving herself the false self identity of being a pianist.

Yet, if your W is exhibiting a strong pattern of BPD traits, you should be seeing more red flags than her lack of impulse control and hoarding. I therefore suggest you take a quick look at my list of _*18 BPD Warning Signs*_. If most of them sound very familiar, I would suggest you read my more detailed description of them at my posts in _*Maybe's Thread*_. If that description rings any bells, I would be glad to join the other respondents in discussing them with you. 

Significantly, learning to spot these warning signs will NOT enable you to diagnose your W's issues. Only a professional can do that. Hence, the main reason for learning these red flags -- like learning warning signs for stroke and heart attack -- is to help you protect yourself and help you decide whether there is sufficient reason to spend $150 hour to seek a professional opinion. Take care, OldMan.


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

i suspected that she might have bpd and mentioned it to our counsilor. he didn't seem to take it and run. the problem is, even if she does have bpd, at 67 yrs old, and 41 yrs of marriage, is divorce an option? both of us would live in poverty. it's too late to start over though we could end differently. I'm a christian and divorce, except for sexual infidelity, is out of the question. i'm just trying to know how to protect myself, our estate and to cope. i wonder how bad she would have to be to be declared incompetent?


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## pb76no (Nov 1, 2012)

Braven, there are a number of issues and concerns you've raised. I'm only going to address the financial part. You should check out a forum called bogleheads (hope that's not violating policy). There is tons of good information and good advice about anything financial.

If you've never done any retirement planning, you might also check out firecalc. It is a calculator that helps answer the question, "do I have enough to last the rest of my life?". It helps if you know how much you are spending each month, how much your SS benefits are, how much you have in savings/retirement accounts. Then either firecalc or bogleheads can help you answer those questions.


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

thanks pb76no. i 'll check out the two sites.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

bravenewoldman said:


> i suspected that she might have bpd and mentioned it to our counsilor. he didn't seem to take it and run.


OldMan, even if she has full-blown BPD, it's unlikely your counselor would tell her -- much less tell you. Generally, therapists are loath to tell a BPDer (i.e., person having strong traits) the name of her pattern of behavior because it usually is not in her best interests to be told. One reason is that a high functioning BPDer almost certainly will terminate therapy on hearing such a diagnosis. Another reason is that the insurance company likely will refuse to cover treatment costs. If you're interested in a more detailed explanation, please see my post at Loath to Diagnose. 

Hence, you best chance at obtaining a candid professional opinion about your W's issues is to see YOUR OWN psychologist -- for a visit or two all by yourself. That way, you are seeing a professional who is ethically bound to protect YOUR best interests, not hers.



> i wonder how bad she would have to be to be declared incompetent?


That would be a good question to ask your own psychologist when you go for that second opinion. Also ask an attorney. My experience here in the USA is that, if she actually is a high functioning BPDer, it would be extremely difficult to obtain such a declaration, as I explain at the post linked above. 

The vast majority of BPDers (I would guess two-thirds based on study results) are high functioning, which means they typically get along fine with business associates, casual friends, and total strangers. The reason is that none of those folks draw close enough emotionally to pose a threat to the BPDer's fears of abandonment and engulfment.



> the problem is, even if she does have bpd, at 67 yrs old, and 41 yrs of marriage, is divorce an option? both of us would live in poverty.


That's got to be a tough decision. I know because I divorced at 62. One issue, of course, is how awful her behavior is. Another issue is whether she can destroy all your savings -- in uncontrolled spending binges -- even if you do remain married to her.



> I'm just trying to know how to protect myself, our estate and to cope.


If your W's BPD traits are only moderate and not too strong, there are validation techniques you can use to reduce the conflict between you two. If her traits are strong, however, I doubt you would see any substantial improvement because she will be so distrustful she won't believe whatever it is you are saying. 

Some of these techniques are discussed in popular BPD books such as _Stop Walking on Eggshells._ You may also want to look at three online resources. One is a psychiatric nurse's blog providing 20 tips to nurses on how they can best deal with obstinate BPDer patients. It is located at Borderline Personality Disorder on the Behavioral Unit - Psychiatric Nursing. 

A second resource is BPDfamily's list of tools for reducing the conflict with a BPDer family member. Those tools are described at Decision Making Guidelines. 

A third online resource is The Non Dilemma by Kathi Stringer, who explains why it is important to avoid picking up "fleas" (e.g., black-white thinking) when living with a BPDer. IME, my exW's BPD traits were so strong that none of these techniques made a real difference. I am hopeful that this is not the case with you and your W.


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

I went to counseling yesterday, alone. my wife refused to go because she believes the counselor doesn't like her and believes everything I say. He suggested I have her declared incompetent. We discussed how I could go about doing so. after having crossed that bridge I felt bad for my wife and was reluctant to go forward with it. I wondered how I could live with her and myself. So I decided to wait and think more seriously about it. So now i've learned that she hide the passwords to her 401k. She said that she can't trust me. Today she spent much time criticising me and going over our history, a history only she knows about. I really can't recall so many details. At the time I was doing what I and we thought was best. I don't recall ever hiding money or sneaking money or otherwise being dishonest. I told her that unless I have complete access to all accounts I can't go forward with any plans. She wants to install a walkin bath. I'm opposed to it until her debts are paid. It would cost something $10,000 to have installed. I've read up on them and many say they are not all they are touted to be. Besides, there will be something else that she will want soon afterwards.
Thank you for all your advice. I hope you will stay with me for a while.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

bravenewoldman said:


> She hide the passwords to her 401k. She said that she can't trust me.


OldMan, if she has strong BPD traits as you suspect, she likely is capable of trusting you for short periods but not for several days. This means that, no matter how many hoops you jump through to prove your love -- and no matter how many sh!t tests you pass -- she is incapable of trusting you for more than a few days. A BPDer may temporarily believe you truly love her but will live in fear that, as soon as you discover how hollow she is on the inside, you will abandon her. 

On top of that, a BPDer's ego is so fragile that the last thing she wants to find -- or admit to herself -- is one more thing to add to the long list of things she hates about herself. Her subconscious mind therefore will protect her from seeing too much of reality. It accomplishes this by subconsciously projecting all hurtful feelings and bad thoughts onto her spouse. 

Because this projection occurs entirely at the subconscious level, she will consciously be convinced that all the outrageous accusations coming out of her mouth are true. And, a week later when she is believing the exact opposite, she will be just as convinced that it is the truth also. This is why BPDers are notorious for "rewriting history" in their own minds.



> Besides, there will be something else that she will want soon afterwards.


Yes, if she has strong BPD traits, you can count on that. It will be impossible to satisfy her bottomless pit of need. Trying to do so is as futile as trying to fill up the Grand Canyon with a squirt gun.


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## LisaKane (Jun 26, 2015)

This is exactly like an episode of Hoarders I saw recently. Her spending and hoarding will only get worse...blowing through money at your ages is absolutely reckless. People live well into their eighties and nineties now. Time to get your finances back and curb her addiction to stuff and spending.


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

I'm seriously considering kicking the hornets nest. Have any of you taken your spouses credit cards to stop the charges? How well did it work. I know I can get her credit cards and debit card. If I do would it be wise to just hold them and let her use them on an as needed basis? If I destroy them I can imagine she's going to go crazy. But even if I do she can get replacement cards by accessing her online banking. So I would have to get her laptop and secure my desktop. She can still go to the bank but that would be more trouble. So it seems I can't plug all the leaks.


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

OldMan, if she is a BPDer like my exW, she likely has the emotional development of a four year old and thus has little impulse control. She therefore is likely to destroy your finances if she decides to obtain secret credit cards -- or if her credit card company allows her to obtain "virtual" temporary credit card numbers online. Hence, if you are determined not to divorce her, I suggest you speak with an attorney about obtaining a legal separation that isolates your finances from hers. Technically, you would still be married and could still live together.


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

I am the wife he is talking about. I do not have dementia etc. but he worked until he was 52 or 54 and retired his 401k is $37,000. He told me I had to keep working. I was an RN. I worked until I was 61, then i started health problems but i saved in a 401 k approx. 9 yrs while he was retired, I told him I would save so we would have money to do some traveling with. Until my health failed the only trips we went on I saved & paid for, He said if I wanted to go I had to save the money. he really never wanted to go anywhere. I was in denial I thought if iI saved in the 401k we would travel. the last 2 trips I saved & paid for was $8,000.00 plus spending approx. $1-2000.00 Now he says we will go at about 80 yrs old give me a break! I had saved $39,000 in my 401k in 9 yrs he saved in 30-40yrs. Our house is paid for we have or had $19,000 in reg savings.The last 2 trips were to Israel on pigrimages He is at presently using our money tobuild a very bid bldg out back he uses our saving he says he knows best! I had no say in the money he has tus far spent using up the savings. I drove a 2003 grand pre he totaled and had to buy me a car the one i want I was blessed with it is anbuick lecerne 2008 with only 17000 miles on it. He took no money out of savings to pay for it. He paid $500.00 a month until paid for it was $15,500. Now tell me who has the problems. He calls me a hoarder but who is hoarding the money. Oh, I just saw his checking acc he made a dep. of over $3000.00. The dep. is pending but I think it may has some thing to do with his 401 k but I am not sure. The other side of the coin


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

If he starts this I will start my own legal action. I am not incompenent only very foolish has he told any of you how he built a very bidg. behind our house. We had $19,000 in our savings. now it has gone down did he tell you he retired at 52 yrs old. I worked until I was 61 Our home is paid for. I am so very hurt bu all this. He is very quiet and I get loud since I had a cardiac arrest 5 yrs ago I have a hard time with speech but not writing. He uses this to his advantage. I am still reeling over what he said. I am a very Christian person. I do not look at money the way he or that counselor does. My 401 k has $39,000.00 I saved in 9yrs his has $37,000.00 he saved in 30 yrs. we had $19,000. in our savings he is spending on a bldg. he built in the back yard our home is paid for. What is my incompenent spending? He wants to save it all for WHAT? he says we will take trips when we are 80! Give me a break! He cant take it with him he has 2 children froma previous marriage who have nothing to do with him, also his ex wife say nothing good about him on facebook. Who is the person who really needs help? I spend to on a charge card because he says i cant have any of the money for myself' I have excellent credit & I have just recieved an approved credit card from BOA which is like an express card. Let him try to prove I am incompetent, I will let them see my credit rating He makes $4000.00 a month our home is paid for our cars are paid for where does his money go? H egets to spend all our savings on what he wants so i Charge what I want since I cant spend any of the savings he does? Tell me where is this fair? I came back from my last trip I saved for for a pilgrimage to Israel with my son. I had to save all of it my son saved some. but he doesnt make much. but i had to save He would NOT LET ME TAKE A PENNY FROM OUR (HA!ha!) please tell me where thats fair? also i bought my own lap top. I pay for the gas in my car, he uses. i pay for most of my meds. I wesr wigs because I have very thin hair onthe top. He has 5 dogs he pays for their Drs. etc. I have to ask or wine, beg him to take me out he doesnt like to go out to restuarants and the cheaper the better. He talks more to his dogs then me. He has a very bad temper, I'll bet he did not tell the counselor about. I cry & yell he tells me cant do anything right, if I do anything he never give me words of encouragement I do have a problem with my brain, it was deprieved of oxygen. then I had my aortic valve & mitrial valve replaced 2yrs ago. I do bring up He did as little as possible. the last 3 prior yrs.to my valvesbeing replaced they could not find the problem, inbetween I had my knees replaced one twice. I went 18 mos on a bad knee job and of course I was a lying about the constent leg pain. now I am trying to play catch up all my "wifely" things and now I get to worry about finding out what i have to do to stop an incompency hearing. I know God will help me, how do you think I found this site? Now I am going to pray, and cry in that order,


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

I never said I was going to spend all of my 401k $39,000.00 I made while he retired at 52 yrs Witha 401k of $37,000.00 he made in 30 yrs. He did not say how he spends our (ha!) savings. And he never ask my permission. I retired at 61 because of health issues. Any vacation or anything big ex. bedrm suite I had to save for and buy.


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

I was a RN forced in to retirement at 61, the last 9 yrs I made my own 401k $39,000.00 thinking we could do some traveling. He retired at 52 with $37,000.00 our house is paid for he akes $4000.00 monthly. I do not & never will spend.


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

I am the wife my bedroom & spare bed room have alot of junk . I spent the last 5-6 yrs in very bad health I had cardiac stand till due to a medicaion, then bad heart finally found out I had bad valves I hd open heart surgery 2 years ago. Both knees replaced one 2 time due to a very bad MD. Our house is paid for no bills, & he spends our savings on what he wants. I am so very tired of this, I can write but I am very bad at talking I get frustrated and then sound even worse(the frustrated I get the louder & worse). I am a Christian, this is what I am holding on to. I have faith & our Father is changing me but it is His pace not mine. When I first found out about this site, I felt betrayed. Anything I get I have to pay for, vacations for both of us bedroom furniture etc. I am tired of saving my money for anything big I want. The last 2 trips were pilgrimages to Israel,he had to go but I saved the money over 8000.00 &only thru Christ If you think that sounds crazy then hear this Christ invited me when I went my heart was <40% & when I returned it was >50% I could have surgery. first he went then my son the last was 2 yrs ago. I believe & have faith with all my heart. I never knew he felt the way he does about God...but I have my own problems I dont get involved with others or gossiping. I am trying to get through this & I know God is with me, He is the only One Who will not betray or let us down God is good, all the time, all the time God is good.


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## dignityhonorpride (Jan 2, 2014)

Whoa. With the figures you, wife, are quoting, none of you should be spending on travel or renovations - what on earth will you do if you live 15, 25, 30, 35 more years???? How will you finance that? Please go speak with a CPA who specializes in individuals / estate planning. For your own sake.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Mrs. bravenewoldman,

Please consider making your own account. That way we can tell more easily which of you is posting.

Having both sides of a story really helps. Glad you are here.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Mrs. bravenewoldman said:


> now I am trying to play catch up all my "wifely" things and now I get to worry about finding out what i have to do to stop an incompency hearing. I know God will help me, how do you think I found this site? Now I am going to pray, and cry in that order,


Don't worry about that. It is very hard to prove anyone incompetent. You are obviously not incompetent.

You might want to create a health care power of attorney and a health care directive that names your son as your agent. I would.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Mr. & Mrs. bravenewoldman, it sounds to me like you two need to sit down and actually talk to each other.

bravenewoldman, with your income and savings.. why did you build a building on your property? What's the purpose? What did you spend on it?


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## bravenewoldman (Jun 19, 2015)

now that my wife has found this place i must stop posting. i can not possibly explain in full detail everything i want to write. of course there are many facets of relationships and lives that have endured for 41 years and all cannot be made known to everyone here. i tried to get enough details to permit you to make informed opinions. i would be a fool or crazy to mislead you in anyway if i also expected to receive any help. it should be obvious that coming were was/is nearly an act of desperation. i think you for all your responses.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

You say you are both Christians, then perhaps you should approach your pastor and church counselors to help you as they would also know both of you better. 

If you do not want to then perhaps you can post here under separate names and separate threads.


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