# What gives?



## wyatterp (Jul 30, 2012)

I have been blessed to have met the man of my dreams and we married three years ago. I have long time girlfriends that I meet with on occasion for dinner and drinks. When my now husband and I first started dating I went out with one of my dearest friends. I must admit I had more drink than food. She was designated driver. He met us at my house afterwards and was beside himself that I was as drunk as I was and a fight ensued. This was 8 years ago and he still brings it up.Anytime I say that I am meeting one of my friends for dinner he goes into a strange type of panic attack. He says that he's afraid that something is going to happen to me. I tend to not set up these dates with friends because of what he goes through. I have often thought of just lying to him so he doesn't "go there". He is not much of a drinker nor am I. We go out once a week for dinner and drinks are involved as well.Usually 2 or 3 at the most. Sometimes we go out and drinks are not involved at all. I have alienated myself from my friends because of this problem he has.He has had a problem when I am going to visit a friend and we're just going shopping. There have been times when he has had a few drinks and he starts arguments. This last weekend the argument went from that to a huge fight. He was mean and accusatory. I think HE might have a problem physically with alcohol. I also think that there is some sort of control issue as well. These arguments usually happen when he has had 3 drinks but not when he has 1 or 2. We have had conversations about this problem. I have told him that I intend to go out whenever I want. I fear that this problem is going to end our marriage. I feel like I should be able to go out with my friends and have friendships outside of our relationship. Any thoughts would be helpful. Thank you.


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## Davelli0331 (Apr 29, 2011)

wyatterp said:


> I have been blessed to have met the man of my dreams and we married three years ago. I have long time girlfriends that I meet with on occasion for dinner and drinks. When my now husband and I first started dating I went out with one of my dearest friends. I must admit I had more drink than food. She was designated driver. He met us at my house afterwards and was beside himself that I was as drunk as I was and a fight ensued. This was 8 years ago and he still brings it up.Anytime I say that I am meeting one of my friends for dinner he goes into a strange type of panic attack. He says that he's afraid that something is going to happen to me. I tend to not set up these dates with friends because of what he goes through. I have often thought of just lying to him so he doesn't "go there". He is not much of a drinker nor am I. We go out once a week for dinner and drinks are involved as well.Usually 2 or 3 at the most. Sometimes we go out and drinks are not involved at all. I have alienated myself from my friends because of this problem he has.He has had a problem when I am going to visit a friend and we're just going shopping. There have been times when he has had a few drinks and he starts arguments. This last weekend the argument went from that to a huge fight. He was mean and accusatory. I think HE might have a problem physically with alcohol. I also think that there is some sort of control issue as well. These arguments usually happen when he has had 3 drinks but not when he has 1 or 2. We have had conversations about this problem. I have told him that I intend to go out whenever I want. I fear that this problem is going to end our marriage. I feel like I should be able to go out with my friends and have friendships outside of our relationship. Any thoughts would be helpful. Thank you.


Before the inevitable deluge of anti-GNO posts that will follow, allow me to say that I think your H is maybe being a bit controlling. While I agree that _*some *_marriages can't handle GNOs, there are many healthy marriages where both partners spend time away from each other and with their friends in a responsible, marriage-friendly way. Having dinner and drinks with your friends doesn't sound too terrible to me.

Sounds like you guys don't handle alcohol well. You guys might want to think about laying off the sauce for a while until you guys can handle it responsibly. I don't mean that condescendingly, my W and I are big drinkers and we've had to hit pause on the alcohol a few times in our relationship for similar reasons.

Considering lying to your husband about these GNOs is a bad idea. If he finds out what's what you're doing (and he will), then he's going to assume you're cheating when all you did was go out and enjoy dinner and drinks with friends.

Telling him that you intend to go out whenever you want no matter what -- does that help your marriage, or harm it? I understand he may not be being overly helpful to the marriage, but you can't control him, only yourself. Was there maybe a less demanding, confrontational way to state that? If not, then you guys need to learn how to discuss instead of argue, and the ways to de-escalate these things from turning into full blow-outs (laying off the drink will help in that dept).

When people are as controlling as your H, IMO it's because of a lack of trust. He may be afraid that you'll get into a wreck, get pulled over, get mugged, or that you'll get into a physical/sexual situation that you might later regret. Those may be completely outlandish fears, but you have to help him realize that. I know these are GNOs, but maybe invite him a couple times just so he can see how responsible you guys are?


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## wyatterp (Jul 30, 2012)

Thanks for your reply Davelli331.When I have my GNO I may have a few drinks. I do not get in fights with anyone.We get silly and have girl talk. I have invited him along but there is always the chance that he might gets condescending about the evening and ruin the fun. We have also been out together with my friends and have a lovely time. Ya just don't know when it's going to hit. Don't get me wrong here either...he is a lot of fun to be with drinks or no drinks. We girls always have a designated driver and we stick to that without exceptions. Just to clarify: in the last 8 years I have been out with friends 6 times without him and only 3 of those times have included alcohol. It really seems to me that the problem arrises when HE has a few. We actually have been out together when arguing is not an issue. He goes on and on about how he doesn't understand the "drinking" thing, yet in the next time we're out he's drinking. Again, these are NOT all night binges...just a few, literally 2-3 drinks. I don't know if it's to "fit in" or what. 

In terms of lying to him, that has only ever been a thought. I love him and I won't lie to him. Your right though that would be a big breach of trust.

I guess my phrase that I'm going out no matter what sounded pretty harsh. I really haven't said it that way to his face I have only thought it. I do say it in a matter of fact way. He and I have been talking about this issue for 8 years now. He has seen a therapist and that didn't do much good. He knows that he is being unrealistic and he agrees that I should have time with my friends. I am a very social person and need to have interaction with other people other than him. I do not feel that I should have to give up people that have been in my life for at least 30 years and are a part of me and my time with them has shaped me into the person I am today. The person that he fell in love with.

His father had quite a drinking habit when my H was young and his dad got mean when he drank. I saw this in my H this past friday night and it scared me. He had had 3 drinks with food.

He left my house to go to his (long story there) and I have not seen him or spoken to him since.


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## Davelli0331 (Apr 29, 2011)

wyatterp said:


> Thanks for your reply Davelli331.When I have my GNO I may have a few drinks. I do not get in fights with anyone.We get silly and have girl talk. I have invited him along but there is always the chance that he might gets condescending about the evening and ruin the fun. We have also been out together with my friends and have a lovely time. Ya just don't know when it's going to hit. Don't get me wrong here either...he is a lot of fun to be with drinks or no drinks. We girls always have a designated driver and we stick to that without exceptions. Just to clarify: in the last 8 years I have been out with friends 6 times without him and only 3 of those times have included alcohol. It really seems to me that the problem arrises when HE has a few. We actually have been out together when arguing is not an issue. He goes on and on about how he doesn't understand the "drinking" thing, yet in the next time we're out he's drinking. Again, these are NOT all night binges...just a few, literally 2-3 drinks. I don't know if it's to "fit in" or what.
> 
> In terms of lying to him, that has only ever been a thought. I love him and I won't lie to him. Your right though that would be a big breach of trust.
> 
> ...


Have you ever asked your husband specifically what it is about going out with your friends that he doesn't like? As in, what specifically is he so afraid might happen that he has a panic attack? And do you mean an actual panic attack or do you just mean that he flies off the handle?

When you say that therapy "didn't work", do you mean that he failed to find out anything about himself, or that even after therapy he still didn't come around to your way of thinking?

Is there anything about his past that would cause him to have such a strong reaction to your having a GNO, or that something might happen to you during one? Has he ever been cheated on by a girlfriend, did something happen when he was a child, did his parents cheat on each other? Other than that first drunken GNO, has anything else every happened on one of your GNOs that would cause this kind of reaction? Is he a military, police, or firefighting veteran, or has something happened in his life to cause PTSD?

And what about this huge blowout fight drove him to go stay with his father? Was the subject of the fight these GNOs?

Lastly, have you guys gone through MC?


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## Samcro (Feb 12, 2012)

Dave has some good thoughts and I want to add some of my own.
Has you he done anything involving drinking that might warrant this behavior? Like flirting with guys with the girls or any cheating by with of you in the past? There is either a serious trust issue, a drinking issue, or an underlying mental issue like abuse. If his father was abusive when he drank it could haven passed on to your H. I would suggest counciling for the both of you to go to get to the root of the issue together. It doesn't seem that you not being heavy drinkers is an issue. But there is something fueling this rage..
You need to find it and fix it so it doesn't take over the marriage and spell disaster,


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## Bellavista (May 29, 2012)

I grew up in a family of alchoholics. My father, his mother (who lived with us), his brother, his father. I saw enough to scare me.
When my H drinks it makes me go a bit crazy. It really scares me. He does not drink often & when we do go somewhere he might drink, we agree before hand how much he will have. If there is a function that might have a lot of people drinking to excess, I just don't go. If hubby does drink a lot & come home drunk, I get so angry that I could easily say things I might regret later.
Your H grew up with an alcholic father, he may have fears of turning out like his father or being married to an alchoholic. Sometimes these fears are not warranted, but they just come up. Maybe some therapy would help him address this problem.


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## wyatterp (Jul 30, 2012)

ok a little more background on H. His father drank when H was young. Apparently a mean drunk. H's father does not drink anymore and is a delightful man. H's ex wife liked to go out. She drank but I am not sure how much as I only have my H's view on how much that was. H says that he would sometimes go with and did not have fun then either. He was designated driver. Nasty woman at any rate though. Towards the end of their marriage she would leave and not come home for days. Seems she has a habit of having another man before she dumped the one she was married to. (has done it twice) So H tells me that he is afraid that he'll get a call that I have been arrested or that I have been in a terrible accident. Again I have limited my girls days and nights out because I don't want to put him in a bad place.I also do not drink a lot when we go out and there's always a driver. When out shopping with a friend he calls repeatedly. It's just embarrassing. Gratefully I was with a friend who understands. When I say a panic attack I mean a full blown real attack. Heart racing, palpitations, can't sleep, can't go to work the next day. He has been prescribed xanax for this and other stresses that put him in a bad place. The therapist that he saw called him Piglet..you know always worrying.The guy said that there was nothing that he could do for my H. Not a very good therapist I'd say. I do intend to get us to a marriage counselor. He does have a history of being an EMT and he saw a lot of things that were not pretty. He didn't leave to go stay with his father. He went to our other house. He was getting very mean and I have never seen that before so I asked him to leave because I was afraid of things escalating. I do not flirt when we go out except with him. We both engage in conversations with other people around us, but it's a together conversation.I also do not flirt with anyone when I am out with the girls. Truly, we see each other so infrequently that we really just want to be with each other. We are all married. We don't cheat and do not have that in mind. I have not suspected this before the other night because his behavior has not escalated to the real mean before this, but i think he may have an inherited gene from his father and I suspect that his fear of being like his dad has kept him from drinking. He as always stayed away from drinking even as a teen when many were experimenting. He and I talked today and I asked him why he drinks at all if he doesn't like it. He says so he can feel like he fits in. He has only had 3 hours of sleep for 3 days. He was going to try to get some sleep and we will talk again tomorrow. Thank you all so very much for your input.


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## Davelli0331 (Apr 29, 2011)

wyatterp said:


> ok a little more background on H. His father drank when H was young. Apparently a mean drunk. H's father does not drink anymore and is a delightful man. H's ex wife liked to go out. She drank but I am not sure how much as I only have my H's view on how much that was. H says that he would sometimes go with and did not have fun then either. He was designated driver. Nasty woman at any rate though. Towards the end of their marriage she would leave and not come home for days. Seems she has a habit of having another man before she dumped the one she was married to. (has done it twice) So H tells me that he is afraid that he'll get a call that I have been arrested or that I have been in a terrible accident. Again I have limited my girls days and nights out because I don't want to put him in a bad place.I also do not drink a lot when we go out and there's always a driver. When out shopping with a friend he calls repeatedly. It's just embarrassing. Gratefully I was with a friend who understands. When I say a panic attack I mean a full blown real attack. Heart racing, palpitations, can't sleep, can't go to work the next day. He has been prescribed xanax for this and other stresses that put him in a bad place. The therapist that he saw called him Piglet..you know always worrying.The guy said that there was nothing that he could do for my H. Not a very good therapist I'd say. I do intend to get us to a marriage counselor. He does have a history of being an EMT and he saw a lot of things that were not pretty. He didn't leave to go stay with his father. He went to our other house. He was getting very mean and I have never seen that before so I asked him to leave because I was afraid of things escalating. I do not flirt when we go out except with him. We both engage in conversations with other people around us, but it's a together conversation.I also do not flirt with anyone when I am out with the girls. Truly, we see each other so infrequently that we really just want to be with each other. We are all married. We don't cheat and do not have that in mind. I have not suspected this before the other night because his behavior has not escalated to the real mean before this, but i think he may have an inherited gene from his father and I suspect that his fear of being like his dad has kept him from drinking. He as always stayed away from drinking even as a teen when many were experimenting. He and I talked today and I asked him why he drinks at all if he doesn't like it. He says so he can feel like he fits in. He has only had 3 hours of sleep for 3 days. He was going to try to get some sleep and we will talk again tomorrow. Thank you all so very much for your input.


Thanks for the clarification. A few observations:

- If your H's ex-wife cheated on him and found the next man while going out on her GNOs, then I hope you see where part of his anxiety comes from. What his ex-W did was a devastating thing to do to someone.

- Those are definitely full-blown panic attacks. It sounds like your H may have an anxiety disorder, and I wonder if it might be related to things he saw as an EMT. I have combat-related PTSD, and a very common side-effect of that is an irrational fear that you or someone you love may be suddenly killed. For my W and me, it's riding motorcycles. When we ride together, I'm OK, but when my wife goes out on her own, I worry about her a lot, to the point that it produces a lot of anxiety in me.

- The therapist you describe was terrible. Calling him names and telling him there was nothing he could do was far worse than no therapy at all. He definitely needs some IC, but try to ask around for good recommendations, or check Angie's List or something like that.

- It sounds like your husband had some rough times: His ex-W would would go on GNOs that would last days at a time, she cheated on him, found the next man and they divorced, his father was a mean drunk when your H was a child, your H was an EMT that probably saw some pretty awful things, and he seems to have an anxiety disorder, not to mention a possible problem with alcohol. Have you tried to help him through any of these issues? All I'm hearing from your posts is how these issues keep you from going out with your friends. Have you tried a more sympathetic approach, maybe just letting him spill his guts about all these things? Just listening without judgment or defense, without thinking about how what he's saying affects you, but just really and truly listening? MC is really good for that, and I think it might really help you guys a lot.

Your H lashing out is obviously unacceptable, but lashing out usually has some underlying issues. Maybe if you try getting to the bottom of those issues you guys might have a better idea fo what's going on.


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## wyatterp (Jul 30, 2012)

Hi and thanks for your reply.
Please allow me to clarify why I am here.I love my H with all of my heart. We are trying to work on all of our issues together. My husband's health and happiness is my only concern, if it were not I would not be here and he and I would not still be together. This is not about me being able to feel free to go out with my friends. I am a caring and sympathetic person. The going out with friends thing is just one of the things that puts him in a bad place. I absolutely understand why he is the way he is. His life experiences have been awful. The reason I am here writing in this forum is to try to figure out where we go from here. I apologize if my writings appeared as if my wants were my only concern. If they were then I would just do as I please. Sometimes emails, texts and the written word looses something in the context. He and I do spend time discussing our problems, I do not judge or get defensive, and I am truly a good listener.Thank you for your observations, but me not being supportive is not the issue, nor is it just about me wanting to go out.That was just what was going on at the time that urged me to seek help. I am new here and I as a supportive wife am looking for answers to some problems. You have been very helpful with your insights and I thank you for that.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Maybe both of you should just not drink, ever. Also he perhaps could use some IC to delve into his own issues.


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## Jimena (May 28, 2012)

IMO, it seems as though your husband is putting his childhood issues onto you. He needs to stop drinking all together and get a new therapist.


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