# Reconciling - Rug Sweeping



## flustered (Nov 25, 2013)

Hi, 

this is my first post here. 

I am a WS and I am concerned about that after my disclosure (the affair has been over for a number of months now) my wife may be trying to rug sweep the whole thing.

On the one hand that works out great for me, but that's not what I want. I want to be able fully address all the failings I have, and the issues in my marriage, so that we can move on and I can try and rebuild trust.

I've been open with the questions that she asked but there are more questions where I would uncomfortable with giving the answers, although I will.

In short I want to get all of the disclosure out of the way so there are no perceived surprises later on.

How do I do this in a sensitive way without giving the impression I am rubbing it in?

Secondly, I'm beginning to develop some animosity toward the OW. We have stopped contact but after my confession I am now irked that she's not given her H the full story. My latest knowledge is that her husband was told that we had a close personal relationship. I guess being joined together at stages was close.

How do I handle that?


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

flustered said:


> Hi,
> 
> this is my first post here.
> 
> ...


Get professional help from a counsellor.

Be wary about confessing all to her husband, this can lead to harassment orders against you.

You could do a "reverse ferret" manoeuvre and out yourself and the other woman on Cheaterville. And send hubby the link. :smthumbup:

By the way, be wary of the animosity to the OW. You could be -unconsciously- doing a bit of guilt transfer.

After all, if she was good enough for you to make the beast with two backs with at least several times, isn't starting to feel animosity toward her a bit superfluous at this juncture?


----------



## harrybrown (May 22, 2013)

Does your wife want a timeline of your affair?

You could write one for her, if she wants it.

You could ask her if she wants marriage counseling and IC for the both of you.


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

harrybrown said:


> Does your wife want a timeline of your affair?
> 
> You could write one for her, if she wants it.
> 
> You could ask her if she wants marriage counseling and IC for the both of you.


By the way, I wanted absolutely *no* details of what my wife and her lover did.

Had she insisted on giving me any details, that would have broken my heart and I don't think I could have coped, to be honest.

Just knowing about her affair was more than enough for me to deal with, thank you very much!


----------



## flustered (Nov 25, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> By the way, I wanted absolutely *no* details of what my wife and her lover did.
> 
> Had she insisted on giving me any details, that would have broken my heart and I don't think I could have coped, to be honest.
> 
> Just knowing about her affair was more than enough for me to deal with, thank you very much!


I'm sorry you had to come to a place like this because of jerks like me, but thank you - I had never thought of this. Generally, it seems like BS want to know every excruciating detail; watching a car crash unfold.

Like I said, she has some of the details. If she doesn't wish to know more than I'd bottle up over the OWH in case more came out.


----------



## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

Not all BS'ers want all the details.


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

flustered said:


> I'm sorry you had to come to a place like this because of jerks like me, but thank you - I had never thought of this. Generally, it seems like BS want to know every excruciating detail; watching a car crash unfold.
> 
> Like I said, she has some of the details. If she doesn't wish to know more than I'd bottle up over the OWH in case more came out.


OWH, he might not want to know the details, either. Difficult to know what to do for the best, really.


----------



## flustered (Nov 25, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> OWH, he might not want to know the details, either. Difficult to know what to do for the best, really.


To be honest, I have a general sense of regret about the whole thing and I really want to apologise. There is an element of guilt transfer as you say but there's also sense of someone getting off scot-free that doesn't sit well with me.

Generally I'm satisfying myself with the idea that chickens eventually come home to roost. I couldn't reconnect with my wife after the affair because of the guilt. I felt the only way out was to give truth.


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

flustered said:


> To be honest, I have a general sense of regret about the whole thing and I really want to apologise. There is an element of guilt transfer as you say but there's also sense of someone getting off scot-free that doesn't sit well with me.
> 
> Generally I'm satisfying myself with the idea that chickens eventually come home to roost. I couldn't reconnect with my wife after the affair because of the guilt. I felt the only way out was to give truth.


But only as much as she wants.


----------



## nogutsnoglory (Jan 17, 2013)

flustered said:


> To be honest, I have a general sense of regret about the whole thing and I really want to apologise. There is an element of guilt transfer as you say but there's also sense of someone getting off scot-free that doesn't sit well with me.
> 
> Generally I'm satisfying myself with the idea that chickens eventually come home to roost. I couldn't reconnect with my wife after the affair because of the guilt. I felt the only way out was to give truth.


It won't go away after you give her all the details. It might unload the nervousness you have in anticipation if having to give the truth in full later if she asks. If not you get to wonder when and that feeling gets to suck you dry. It's part of your consequences.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## X-B (Jul 25, 2013)

I would fear the OW husband knowing too much. He may think like me.


----------



## sammy3 (Jun 5, 2011)

Do you want to R with your wife? Does she with you? 

~sammy


----------



## flustered (Nov 25, 2013)

sammy3 said:


> Do you want to R with your wife? Does she with you?
> 
> ~sammy


That's an interesting question. I hope she does. I do. I'm still processing some of those post-affair emotions - see my second point in my OP, but I remember how good things were before the affair and before I ruined everything.

I got caught up in the chemicals of attraction and made some pretty silly choices. Repeatedly.

We still are talking about the future and long term plans but in the back of my mind I wonder whether she's drawing me back in simply to let me go again. She tells me she's stunned about what happened which is a slight improvement on sad and a little better than the pasting I got a few days ago. I deserve all of it.

Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.


----------



## cantthinkstraight (May 6, 2012)

flustered said:


> Hi,
> 
> this is my first post here.
> 
> I am a WS and I am concerned about that after my disclosure (the affair has been over for a number of months now) my wife may be trying to rug sweep the whole thing.


I don't think BS's can rugsweep. Instead, I think what you're witnessing is her way of coping with the most devastating pain one can feel from their cheating spouse. Every BS deals with it differently.



flustered said:


> On the one hand that works out great for me, but that's not what I want. I want to be able fully address all the failings I have, and the issues in my marriage, so that we can move on and I can try and rebuild trust.


Work out great for you? I'm sorry, but that statement doesn't sit well with me. As a BS myself, I find that comment insulting. I know what you meant by it, but it shows that you're still worried most about your own well being when you should be attending to the heart you broke. 

You are the WS, you do not get to make that determination.
After all, it was your wants that got you into this mess.
Take a back seat to your feelings and instead, ask her how you can help HER heal from what you've done.



flustered said:


> I've been open with the questions that she asked but there are more questions where I would uncomfortable with giving the answers, although I will.


Answer everything... honestly, and at her pace. Don't think for a minute that 
this will just go away. This will take years to heal from and even
then, still won't fully just go away. Cheating is forever.



flustered said:


> In short I want to get all of the disclosure out of the way so there are no perceived surprises later on.


You need to share that with her. Then again, as a WS, you don't get
to set a time limit as to when the questions should just stop, because in reality, they won't. Even when she doesn't mention it, it will be on her mind, when you least expect it. Forever.



flustered said:


> How do I do this in a sensitive way without giving the impression I am rubbing it in?


Tell her your concerns, and find a good MC to let her know you're serious about doing whatever it will take to help you two heal from the mistakes you made.



flustered said:


> Secondly, I'm beginning to develop some animosity toward the OW. We have stopped contact but after my confession I am now irked that she's not given her H the full story. My latest knowledge is that her husband was told that we had a close personal relationship. I guess being joined together at stages was close.
> 
> How do I handle that?


My XW did the same thing. Don't worry about the OW. You've got bigger fish to fry.... repairing/saving YOUR relationship.
If you didn't break NC, how do you know about what she did or didn't tell her H?

Point being, leave it alone. Any attention you give to the OW will be viewed as loving attention by your BS. Just don't even go there, I'm telling you this now.

Been there, done that.


----------



## flustered (Nov 25, 2013)

cantthinkstraight,

I appreciate what I said doesn't sit well with you. 'work out great for me' was not the best turn of phrase and I apologise to you.

What I'm trying to say is that I caused this mess and I need to fix it.

I do also appreciate your guidance re moving at my wife's pace. I totally get that. But what if there are no more questions, and what if the reality is she is holding it in? That's not helpful but I don't want to incite a reaction when she's not ready for it either. That's really my dilemma.

as to NC. There have have been a couple of bouts of it. This last one is the final one as far as I'm concerned. We work in the same office block and we've caught eyes twice since, but no conversation, email or messaging. It's done. In the interim she explained how she and her H handled it. Or more like, how she managed the information flow to make it seem like his problem. Yes I should let it go. I feel sorry for the guy now.


----------



## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

flustered said:


> in the back of my mind I wonder whether she's drawing me back in simply to let me go again.


This is simply one of the consequences of being the WS. 

All BS's have their own way of dealing with the betrayal. Some want to know all the details, some don't (I did). I think the best thing you can do is let her know that you're available to talk to her about anything she wants, at any time. Then let her chose how she wants to handle it. 

You have to be patient, and consistently remorseful. Don't let your own anxiety about losing her be a burden to her.


----------



## sammy3 (Jun 5, 2011)

OP 
I know as the BS,part of my problem not being able to come to terms with what my husband had done to me and our marriage, was because of his insistance that I understand his feeling in all of this. He keep on & on about how he wanted me to understand where he was coming from. How it all came to be. So much to the point that it was like he was the victim! Everything seemed to flip!

We battled for almost two years over his feeling. It was so hurtful, so damaging, my psyche was, is, so vulnerable as it was, is, I couldnt deal his his emotions on top of mine. 

I dont know if this is what you wife is going thur, but this was my experience, & many times I just gave up and said "ok, its behind us"... But his feelings & pressure for me understand his world these past two years almost broke me. 

We are only now in mc 2.5 years later. 

~ sammy


----------



## flustered (Nov 25, 2013)

Thank you sammy3 for your insights:

She's been acting happy and upbeat during the day and around our kids, and even when we're alone to some extent, until the conversations start about the affair.

One thing I realised I was doing was talking about me and my faults and how I was planning to fix them for her, rather than empathising with her about the predicament I have put her in, so I will try and stop doing that, shut up and listen.

She's told me that she doesn't think she can love me anymore, and given the way I've treated her and our marriage I'm not surprised at all. I'm hoping that what is happening is part of the process of understanding what has happened and that she can see enough value in giving me a chance to re-establish trust and maybe open her heart to me again. However, I've been seeing counselling for the last 6 months to 'sort myself out'. Now it's clear that the reason I went was because I was trying to understand why I did what I did. Understandably, that has come across as another betrayal.

All I can do is act and respond in a loving and hopefully not overbearing way and see if she will warm to me.


----------



## manticore (Sep 3, 2013)

It seems to me that your wife is not Rug Sweeping but she is in a state called emotional withdrawal, there are BSs that react like this, she is protecting her feelings from you, she proabably feel numb and is traying to rationalize what happened, It is her fault?, could she have done something to prevent this?, how she did not noticed it before?, was she and your family not good enough for you to risk it all for a little thrill?, all this questions are being repeated once and again in her head.

If your marriage have problems that you feel you two should fix metion it, but not before aclaring that the affair is 100% your fault, problems in the marraige are on both of you, but the decission to step out of the marriage is 100% on you, she need to know that you take the responsability of it and you are not blameshifting.

If she is in fact is in emotional withdrawal she is in crucial state where she is deciding if your marriage is worth of saving or divorce is the best for her, at this point external influence could be a factor, have you expose yourself to family and friends?, have you apologized to her parents for betraying and hurting her daughter? are you giving her 100% transparency:

- acces to your cell phone
- phone records
- accest to your social media passwords: skype, email, FB, etc.
- communication when you are not at work.

full transparency gives the BS the assurance that you have no intetion of communicating with someone without her knowladge.

Now self exposure is healing and reassuring for some BSs but for others they feel is humiliating because is you telling everyone that you betrayed her, consult with her how she feel about it, but be humble, tell her you wanna do it to redemp yourself, and to apologize to hers and your family for hurting her a putting your family at risk.

If you do this properly you most likely will have the support of family and friends, her parents supports must be crucial to you, this may sound like manipulation, bu it is not, unless you are not as remorseful as you sound.

Now you said that you have no cantact anymore with OW, but you have to make it official, write a NC letter, there are a very good tamplates here in TAM, where you cut OW from your life and at the same time you tell her how selfish and unconsiderate your actions were, this when is done with honesty and sincerity give the Bs a little peace letting the BS know how she/he and your family are way more important to you than the OW (for you may be obvious but not for her).

Now, also offer her the to change jobs to stay away as far as possible from OW.

also read this thread, it may give you more information about reconcilation and what to expect for it (read at least the first 3 pages):

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...e-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html#post430739

we are giving you many tools that most WSs have no right to have after their selfish actions, because this can be used as manipulation, I sincerely hope you are not a repeated offender and you never take your wife for granted again.

The user "JustGrinding" wrote this about emotional withdrawal, this may help you to see how your wife see you right now.

_"I no longer have intimate conversations with my wife. If there's a single lesson that's been driven home by this lunacy in my life, it's this: my wife cannot be trusted with my emotional care and well-being. Period.

I am so deep in emotional withdrawal -from everyone - that it will take a nuclear detonation to unearth me.

The very idea that I would make myself vulnerable to her again by exposing my feelings is outrageous."_

you will have to go through alot of work to win her back, and she deserve it.


----------



## flustered (Nov 25, 2013)

manticore,

Thank you for your advice, it is very much appreciated.

I understand about the transparency. After the shock of my confession, I sent her an email to tell her my life is an open book. Any questions, any access, any thing.

But given the way things are, I don't want to harp on it. It's there for her and if she wants it, it is hers.

re exposure. She has told a friend so she can talk about it to someone other than me. I said to her that I am more than prepared for her to disclose this to whoever she wants. However, I did ask her to think about who she would tell. Would that person help her make sense of this and be supportive of any decision she might make about us? I know there are some "burn at the stake people out there" and others at the other end of the spectrum.

I've been following through on all my commitments and responding instantly to her if she's trying to get me on the phone.

So my approach is a little different. I've answered all her questions truthfully. Even some tough ones. "I was only thinking of myself - I realise that now". I have left the choice about what she wishes to know to her which means I haven't volunteered anything. I'm a little uncomfortable with this and feel compelled to give her a timeline but I also think she should dictate the level of disclosure.

All I can do are the right deeds with right intentions, and try and create an environment where maybe, just maybe, she might think she might trust me again.


----------



## manticore (Sep 3, 2013)

flustered said:


> re exposure. She has told a friend so she can talk about it to someone other than me. I said to her that I am more than prepared for her to disclose this to whoever she wants. However, I did ask her to think about who she would tell. Would that person help her make sense of this and be supportive of any decision she might make about us? I know there are some "burn at the stake people out there" and others at the other end of the spectrum.


I can understand how you may have your doubts about exposing the affair to your friends, but exposing it to your and her parents is a must, the last thing you want is she being criticized by your parents if they see her acting cold or distant towards you in the holydays, also their support will be important to her, yes you will feel shame and fear about confessing them the affair, but that are part off the consequences of having an affair.

you should read thrads of some WS that are working towards reconcilation here in the forum (mr and mrs mathias, b1 and EI) 
is not easy to fully reconnect with your bs, they don't want to allow the WS to have the power again to hurt them, you have to put yourself vulnerable and this implys facing the consequences of your actions.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

flustered said:


> I said to her that *I am more than prepared* for her to disclose this to whoever she wants. However, *I did ask her to think about who she would tell*. Would that person help her make sense of this and be supportive of any decision she might make about us? I know there are some "burn at the stake people out there" and others at the other end of the spectrum.


Say what?

You're 'more than prepared,' but you want to have a say in who she tells? 

That was not a helpful thing to say. It was self-serving, whether you meant it to be or not.

She needs to see you willing to take ANY lumps. And IMO, she needs to see you going to her parents and telling them what you did and asking their forgiveness.


----------



## Philat (Sep 12, 2013)

Your wife ultimately might want more information than she is capable of absorbing right now--you need to be prepared to tell her anything she wants to know but on her timetable.


----------



## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Yep, you don't want her to tell anyone that might encourage her to dump you. Very self serving.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

It would be comforting to you if your BW could give you some sort of guarantee that your marriage will survive your betrayal, but she can't do that. I think you will have to accept that you have no control over her ultimate decisions regarding this now. If she doesn't want all the details, that is her right, in my opinion.

You had an affair. That was your choice to make. You want your BW to stay with you after your affair. That is not your choice to make. You have to follow her lead now.


----------



## flustered (Nov 25, 2013)

turnera said:


> Say what?
> 
> You're 'more than prepared,' but you want to have a say in who she tells?
> 
> ...


Hi ternera and lifeistooshort,

I left it entirely up to my wife. I don't get a choice in this. All I said is think about what you want to get from telling that particular person and whether they will respect any decision she makes in respect of me. I said if she wants to take out a full page in the paper to go for it.

You might call that self serving, I know I've done a terrible thing but I don't want someone who is going to be forever in her ear about me if she decided she did want to reconcile with me, because that's not helpful either. I guess in that sense it is self serving, but on the longer view.

She did say she had decided to stay this morning. That is a huge relief for me. Not because of the decision, because its early days and things could change, but it does tell me that she is at least imagining or giving thought to a future with this flawed man.

Every day I tell her I am glad and thankful I wake up and she is there. And I will continue to do that until I'm in a box.


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

If it's so clear to you that you had a great thing before your A, then why did you do it?

You must realize that your BW will question the integrity of all of her memories now. If she thought things were good and then you had an A with another woman, it's not just you she doesn't trust, but her own ability to judge things. 

I suspect she has a lot going on in her head that she is trying to work out. You need to let her do this without pressing your own agenda.


----------



## flustered (Nov 25, 2013)

alte Dame said:


> If it's so clear to you that you had a great thing before your A, then why did you do it?


Selfish, Low Self Esteem; need for constant validation. I was getting that validation from the wrong places and I have realised that now. And yes, I knew it then. I started new relationships, safe ones, which give me that validation now. The ultimate aim is to be satisfied with myself, but until then, baby steps, like everything else.



> You must realize that your BW will question the integrity of all of her memories now. If she thought things were good and then you had an A with another woman, it's not just you she doesn't trust, but her own ability to judge things.
> 
> I suspect she has a lot going on in her head that she is trying to work out. You need to let her do this without pressing your own agenda.


Yes I agree, and this is what I am trying to avoid. My heart is absolutely in the right place here. Here's a huge error in judgment that I made and I want to be fully accountable to that. She's asked for very little. I keep reading here and everywhere about full disclosure, and then I also read about taking things at her pace. I'm not going to sit her down and recite the entire history of the affair unsolicited, but at the same time I think there are aspects of it which need to come out - and which may make her change her mind about things.

But, at the same time I realise it's early days. This may be the eye of the storm and what she's heard hasn't really sunk in yet. I understand the very real possibility of this. Put it this way, I am bracing myself. This is far from settled. At least in my view.


----------



## livnlearn (Mar 5, 2012)

Well, you definitely know the right things to say in regard to how you think this needs to be handled. It is hard for some people to convey their feelings, especially in the written word, but when reading your responses you kind of come off as a bit emotionless about this...like you know HOW you should be acting and probably even WANT to be acting..but I wonder if you are really FEELING it. ??


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

flustered said:


> I'm not going to sit her down and recite the entire history of the affair unsolicited, but at the same time I think there are aspects of it which need to come out - and which may make her change her mind about things.


Have you told her explicitly that there are aspects of your cheating which could materially change her mind about reconciliation? In my opinion, she should at least be apprised of this. It is her right, I believe, to have whatever facts she wants, but knowing that some facts are especially pertinent is info that she should have in any case, I would think. Like who the A was with perhaps? A friend? Or something that any healthy person would be humiliated by being in the dark about?


----------



## flustered (Nov 25, 2013)

livnlearn said:


> Well, you definitely know the right things to say in regard to how you think this needs to be handled. It is hard for some people to convey their feelings, especially in the written word, but when reading your responses you kind of come off as a bit emotionless about this...like you know HOW you should be acting and probably even WANT to be acting..but I wonder if you are really FEELING it. ??


I think I'm deliberately trying to exclude emotions from this in trying to understand how things work. I am at the mercy of my wife and accountable to her only and I don't wish to expose my own feelings too much publicly because I might get defensive at the responses I might get.

If I were totally honest, there are still some residual emotions I am processing following the affair. It is interesting that you ask whether I am FEELING it because for a while I feel like I have been observing myself and taking notes almost as an outsider. That may also explain how I am expressing myself here.

There's nothing about the affair that is eye-popping. She knows who it was, how long it went for, how many times certain things happened and a number of other questions that she asked. I offered up the who and for how long to start the conversation, because after a few days of being told I had an affair she hadn't asked anything. That's why I came here, because I have been lurking around fora like this and almost to a post, the stories of BS were immediate questions of who, when, and so on, accompanies by a lot of rage.

Now I know that people do respond differently to such awful news and so I came here to ask about how to handle this. And I will say thank you to everyone who gave me advice, and criticism where I needed it.

Yes, I love my wife. No. I can't get back what we had, as much as I want to. I have two rings here which will remain in my drawer forever, a heart that will always rue the day I let my little head talk, and a partner in life whose dreams I shattered.

There IS feeling.


----------

