# Just starting out on the child-sharing and already...



## grays (Jun 24, 2014)

... ex is being a nightmare!!! :frown2:

For the last year we have been living together but separated. It was terrible in terms of having to be around each other but it was great in terms of kid stuff. I was a stay at home mom before the break up (still am actually, but really needing to start work) so I had them 90+% of the time and then around bedtime I'd go out several nights a week because he'd just be there in the house to make sure they were taken care of. But then I moved out July 1 and now I see that this is going to be awful!!!

In the couple of months leading up to my move, I had been feeling like I really wanted to get on with this bc I was wanting to see what the new normal was. And also because I felt like me moving out was going to be a big hump to get over. I wanted for both me and the kids to get on with learning to be in our new post break up life. But then like a week before I moved out, he springs it on me that he and OW are going to Paris for the last two weeks of July. (I hate this man, in the 11 1/2 years since my older was born we had exactly ONE date night, but they are kid free, so why not go to Paris?!!!) Soooo, I say to him I think we all need to get to our new normal and this is a really bad time and I think it would be easier for me, but especially for the kids if we could get in some sort of rhythm first, would be better if he went in november or something... He says I'm just trying to throw up road blocks and he doesn't see it that way. 

And then I say... I think for him and I the really bad stuff happened way back when I found out about OW and was heartbroken and all that. But for the kids this move is gonna be the really shocking break part. And I think its a really bad time for one of their parents to just run off for an extended period of time (he never travels, or didn't with ME anyhow, they're not used to him being away at all). This is a juncture where they need to feel like both of their parents is there for them. They're going to be feeling weird about it all and they need to feel secure and like they are being held up and valued by both of us. And he says, no, I'm basically just raining on his parade and he should get to do this bc he's had to put up with living with me for the last year. 

So, he's in Paris now. And I'm starting to talk to a couple of the people I've been dating about various plans for after he gets back and realize I don't really know what our schedule is. In mediation, we agreed to start with a 5-2-2-5 arrangement and then tweak it as needed. We didn't want to have anything written bc we wanted to try it out and see if it worked for us and feel free to make changes. So, I send him a proposal by text. I say, I'd like for him to always have them mon/tues and for me to have them wed/thurs and for us to trade off the weekends and then I proposed that he get the first weekend, yada, yada. And he sends me a text back saying that he doesn't think we should do it that way because he'd like to always have at least one weekend night with them and one weekend night off. :surprise: WTF???? And on top of that, he wants to be able to cover his work nights by having them with me those nights and he's not sure which nights he's teaching this semester yet. It will either be mon/wed or tues/thurs. There is no way to work a 5-2-2-5 schedule around that. And my understanding was that the nice thing about 5-2-2-5 was that you could have the same weekdays every week and get every other weekend and the kids would have more stability than if they were switching more. So basically he saying now he just doesn't want to do the 5-2-2-5.

20 days into this new life I realize that he is going to be freaking impossible. And I am really dreading the rest of my freaking parenting life. When I saw his text today I felt like I had been kicked in the stomach. I'm not sure what to do. I don't want to always be caving to his whims whether or not its good or bad for me. I want to do the f'ing 5-2-2-5 thing mostly because it seems like we could get into a rhythm with it. I just want to feel normal and like everything's not up in the air all the time. But then I think, maybe I should try to work with him on it, because I think if I give him what he wants when I can maybe he'll do the same for me. But now I'm so scared it will just always be that he wants, wants, wants. 

About the Paris thing he kept saying "someday you'll wanna go away for two weeks and you'll be able to." But the thing is that I WON"T!!! I don't wanna go away for two weeks. I have a freaking six year old and I don't wanna be away from him for that long. I don't wanna be away from my older one, either, but I do think he's very close to the age where it'd be fine for him (he'll be 12 in sept). But I just don't. Even if it was freaking Paris. I would love to go to Paris, for maybe like a week. But really, two weeks away from my kids does not sound okay to me. And certainly not two weeks away from them at a time when they are likely to be worrying about how this whole change is going to affect their relationships with their parents. 

Am I being crazy to think he's being selfish? Is it just my twisted betrayed spouse thinking? That's his explanation and I don't think it's true, but I also feel like I cannot believe that the man I was married to would be doing this if it's as bad as it looks to me.


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## Hardtohandle (Jan 10, 2013)

Are you getting child support ? 
It sounds like a 50/50 split. I know the higher income pays support even in a 50/50 split, at least in NYC they do..

I agree with you the kids need a system and steady days.. They have enough issues they don't need to be changing days every other week or each semester.. But beyond that he would get every other weekend off instead of just one day.. 

But I just recently went to family court with the ExGF on her divorce and the judge pretty much told her what do you want me to do ? If he works weekends he can't have the kids every other weekend.. You will have to work it out.. I can't tell him not to work.. The next thing you will be here is about no child support because he doesn't work.. You have to make your choices..

So again I don't know how the judge will look at his request to your suggestion..

But look I feel your pain.. I have 2 boys 10 and 15.. The 15 year old is with me 7 days a week and his mom hasn't spoken to him in over 2 and 1/2 years.. The 10 year old is with his mom on Monday and Tuesday.. Mind you my Ex wife works Either Monday or Tuesday.. So he is with me until she gets out of work.. So if she works early she can get him by noon.. But if she works late she will get him around 5 to 7 PM... 

Of course as you can see she has her whole weekend free to be with the other man.. 

What I would suggest is keep them as much as you can and then once the pattern is set, request more support because the first agreement was based on whatever was agreed upon which was a 50/50 split.. Again I know in NYS there is case law that basically states less time with kids means more support.. 

That being said you do sound a bit bitter.. The fact that you didn't do anything with your husband was part of your problem.. Again I know because it was one of my Ex wife gripes.. We didn't do anything either without the kids and we should have.. We should have made time for each other because I realize that *NOW* that was and is important for a husband and wife.. 

For me though what she griped about not going away or doing anything is oddly humorous because she is gone since April 2012 and she hasn't done anything and she never will.. Me on the other hand will be doing something with my kids each year from now on and I will be going away with someone as well.. When I find that someone that is.. I will not repeat the mistakes of my past.. I will have date night with my future wife along with short stay motels and sex in the car. Because that is needed in a relationship..


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

It sounds almost as if you are still dealing with the split. I get it. Its one thing to know what he's done, and another to have to deal with the logistics of the separation/divorce. There is no way around it, being a single parent is hard. The support (such as it was) before is gone. Choices you never would have made or now given as ultimatums and there's nothing you can do.

First, understand and accept, you cannot and should not control, suggest, nag, object to what your ex is doing-with the singular exception of health and safety issues. His travel plans are his issues. Your first concern is your children. His is ..... something else. If you could change his mind about this, you likely would not have gotten divorced.

Second, fight for a routine for the kids, it will help. He will quickly discover that splitting weekends won't work very well. Kids have sports, clubs, sleepovers that only get more complicated as they get older. So I personally hate the idea of splitting the weekend, but having one week night isn't a bad idea-but maybe it should be dinner and not a sleepover visit. Provided you work out the logistics of school and homework. Keep a journal of the kids comings and goings and school. If things start going off the track then you have a journal you can show the court or the mediator to support your argument that things need to change.


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

I understand how you feel about the Paris trip, but just drop it. You can't change it, and once he comes home and you get into a routine, it won't matter anymore. Unless of course he keeps doing this.....then you should go to court and make child support official! 

As far as the schedule, I don't think you will have one person on this board agree with your ex. Especially on the M/W or T/Th thing. It is unacceptable to make the kids go back and forth every other day during the week! And the weekend thing sucks too....what if you want to go away for the weekend, with or without kids? 

We have a 5-2-2-5 schedule and it's what works best for the kids. It's definitely more fluid during the summer, and my kids are older (12 and 14) so it's not a big deal, but during the school year structure is very important and going back and forth to different houses is stressful, so keeping CHUNKS of time is better. Is your son old enough to watch your daughter when their dad is teaching at night?


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## Tango in Triple Time (Jul 14, 2015)

Lots of me me me in your post. 

I understand you are still upset and bitter about your situation. I don't understand if this has been going on for a year, why you aren't working yet? Maybe finances are no concern, which would be nice. 

Your STBX is going on a vacation. So what! Let it go. You gain nothing by holding onto your anger and resentment. Just because going to Paris for two weeks doesn't interest you, it has no bearing on what your STBX does. 

It seems he cheated on you? And you two decided to continue living together for the past year - why? Seems that's a great way to peel the band aid off real dang s-l-0-w. 

About the custody, you said "We didn't want to have anything written bc we wanted to try it out and see if it worked for us and feel free to make changes." Just because he didn't agree with you doesn't mean he is being impossible. He wants to see what his work schedule will be so you, the children's mother, will have them those days. He is trying to make this work for everyone it seems to me. 

Yes I think you are being selfish based on what you have written in your post.


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## grays (Jun 24, 2014)

Hardtohandle said:


> But I just recently went to family court with the ExGF on her divorce and the judge pretty much told her what do you want me to do ? If he works weekends he can't have the kids every other weekend.. You will have to work it out.. I can't tell him not to work.. The next thing you will be here is about no child support because he doesn't work.. You have to make your choices..


Yikes! This kinda freaks me out. It's been hard for me to put any time at all into getting a job this summer because I've had very little kid free time. In July, our 50/50 has turned into me having them for 22 days, and most of my time without them was spent on moving. I understand that he needs childcare, but I don't want to be the babysitter right now. I feel like it's quite possible that once I have a job, I could handle them more than 50% or maybe even tailor my time to his work needs. But I don't know what that job will be or how flexible or how hard it will be to get it. And it scares me to think that his job will take precedence until I'm actually on a payroll. 



Hardtohandle said:


> That being said you do sound a bit bitter.


I am. lol I feel ashamed of how angry I am at him. We were married for 25 years and you must know how it is, there are just soooo many things I look back at now and ugh. I had his back for all those years and he has some mental illness issues that were always front and center in our marriage so that many of the years that we were together felt like they were just about keeping him afloat. I never thought about whether I was happy with him because I (erroneously?) was thinking I'd rather stick it out with this person I loved than try to be happy without him. And then in the last couple of years we were together all of the sudden everything turned around, the mental illness stuff just faded away (it's back, btw) and I was so crazy about him, like I'd fallen in love all over again. And then when I found out about OW I said, wow, I thought we were happy, and he said, yeah I've been feeling really happy for the first time and it made me wonder if I could be even happier. And the crazy part is that I have been so much happier without him. Of course I have (I feel like such an idiot for not feeling like my happiness was important before)! I used to wonder how it could be that my teenage years were the happiest time of my life and I thought I had just lost that part of myself, but I totally have it back and it's awesome. I think I'm actually a naturally happy positive person, believe it or not. But somehow that doesn't do anything (or at least not enough) to assuage my anger and bitterness towards him. Most of the time it's not an issue, my mind is on other things, I'm busy and have a full and pretty fun life. But when he does something that pricks me rage just flows in. I don't know if this is normal or not, or how I should be feeling or if a year is plenty of time that I should have gotten over it, or if ten years from now I'll still be seething or if I really am working through it and will get through the other side. 



Pluto2 said:


> It sounds almost as if you are still dealing with the split. I get it. Its one thing to know what he's done, and another to have to deal with the logistics of the separation/divorce. There is no way around it, being a single parent is hard. The support (such as it was) before is gone. Choices you never would have made or now given as ultimatums and there's nothing you can do.
> 
> First, understand and accept, you cannot and should not control, suggest, nag, object to what your ex is doing-with the singular exception of health and safety issues. His travel plans are his issues. Your first concern is your children. His is ..... something else. If you could change his mind about this, you likely would not have gotten divorced.


Yeah, obviously I still am dealing with the split and the betrayal stuff, and I do think the logistics that I'm just running up against for the first time now feel so harsh and undeserved to me. (They may be fully deserved for all I know, it just *feels* like I was going about my business being an imperfect but loving partner and then, wham!)

I think though it is good for me to hear what you're saying about accepting and not trying to control him. I don't want to roll over for him. But yeah, I think I need to just figure out what I'm dealing with here and deal with it and work my life around it for the most part. It looks like, if anything, I'm going to get the kids more than I expected, which in the long run I am pretty sure I'll be really happy for. It just feels hard now while I'm trying to get myself together. 



SecondTime'Round said:


> I understand how you feel about the Paris trip, but just drop it. You can't change it, and once he comes home and you get into a routine, it won't matter anymore. Unless of course he keeps doing this.....then you should go to court and make child support official!


Yes! I clearly haven't dropped it in my head, but actually after our first conversation about it, I haven't brought it up to him at all. And he's there now, will be back a week from tomorrow. I don't think there'll be any reason for me to want to bring it up unless it really does become a pattern and I'm bringing it up to a judge as an item on a long list. 



SecondTime'Round said:


> Is your son old enough to watch your daughter when their dad is teaching at night?


I'm really not sure how I or he would feel about this. My older one will be 12 in september and younger is six. We have and do leave them alone for short errands, picking up the dry cleaning or something, or working out close by. I suppose that when it's on his time, it's his call. My little guy is like a tornado and I always feel scared that he'll get hurt while I'm away (so when I work out near home, I make sure I am never more than a five minute run away, lol), but I am pretty sure that he's like my dogs, jumping around like crazy till I close the door and then he sits on the couch all calm and sleepy as soon as he thinks I'm gone. 



Tango in Triple Time said:


> Lots of me me me in your post.


I'm trying not to feel defensive about this and let it in, really consider it. My gut reaction is that there is a lot of me, me, me but it's because I'm so bruised and feeling like I need to patrol my borders and make sure I don't get kicked any more. But maybe that's just a warped perspective. Maybe he's just going about his life and I should be going about mine and let it all roll off my back. Hopefully that will be how it is before too long. 




Tango in Triple Time said:


> About the custody, you said "We didn't want to have anything written bc we wanted to try it out and see if it worked for us and feel free to make changes." Just because he didn't agree with you doesn't mean he is being impossible. He wants to see what his work schedule will be so you, the children's mother, will have them those days. He is trying to make this work for everyone it seems to me.


I think I find it really frustrating that we did have an agreement which was to start with the 5-2-2-5 and give it a chance and then tweak it if it wasn't working. And now it seems like he's not willing to even try 5-2-2-5. We didn't put it in writing because we wanted to be able to make changes, but we talked it all out with the mediator and agreed that 5-2-2-5 was the starting point and we'd be flexible. I didn't expect that I'd had to be so flexible as to completely skip the 5-2-2-5 and let him decide what he wants to do and just accept that. If I'd gotten a vibe that it was gonna be that way, I would have pushed for something in writing. Now I feel like he knew all along that he was gonna do the 5-2-2-5 and was happy to not have it in writing, agreed to it easily just to keep it out.[/QUOTE]



Tango in Triple Time said:


> Yes I think you are being selfish based on what you have written in your post.


Well, I feel a little embarrassed about this actually, but I'm not even sure what it is that I'm doing that seems selfish. I do feel like I'm thinking about my self-interest and also that of the kids. And it is true that his needs/wants are not paramount to me at this point. I don't think I'm asking him for anything that's really beyond common decency or anything. I'm trying to screw him, the 5-2-2-5 thing is not a weapon I'm using to hurt him. And I haven't put my foot down with him about any of this (not that putting my foot down is exactly an option). I started this thread partly because I wanted to see if people thought that my wishes (i.e., sticking to the agreed upon schedule, not splitting up weekends, not having the kids go back and forth every night) were legitimate. I was a little concerned that some of it was coming from my bitterness rather than my/my kids' needs for a more normal stable schedule. I think maybe some of it is coming from my bitterness, but I'm not sure how to parse that out because I kinda think its also pretty legitimate. It may be that it really is all legitimate beefs I've got, but there's a little extra twist that comes from my bitterness. At any rate, I brought it here before communicating with him about it because I don't want to go to him freaking out in a way that's fueled by the old hurts. I do think it would be better all the way around to just come up with a schedule that works best independent of my bitterness.


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## Maneo (Dec 4, 2012)

it is early stages in life as a single parent and sharing custody and as others have stated in different words, it seems as if your wounds are still fresh and hurting and emotions are running near the surface. Then things like the paris trip can seem to loom larger than they really are in context.

You are divorced. He's moved out. You don't have anything in writing about custody. What you and he discussed verbally is changing. 25 years is a long time for any marriage, good, bad or indifferent so some things are hard to get used to in your new life but what choice do you have?

Take it a step at a time. Stand your ground but most would advise not to do so at the expense of the kids. You sound like someone to whom your kids mean a great deal. They do need stability. Take a breath. Prioritize what needs doing. Because of the kids you will continue to have a relationship with your ex but don't base that on what the past was like. New ballgame. You seem to know that intellectually but perhaps have yet to accept it emotionally.


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## Hardtohandle (Jan 10, 2013)

Just letting you know.. You are allowed to be pissed and bitter.. 

And the days of him doing what the fvck he wants and then telling you to adjust your life are over.. This is sh!t that happens when you get divorced.. There are reason why family court and law has so many if, ands and don'ts.. Because MANY, MANY people before us came along and answers all the bullsh!t issue that spouses tried to pull on each other.. 

So I do agree, he does NOT just say hey in 2 weeks I am going on vacation.. Take care of our kids for me..

NOW he has to ask you and in some instances in writing many several weeks in advance about taking a vacation with or without the kids.. 

I mean I know I have to tell my Ex wife 30s days in advance in writing if I am taking my kids out of state and she has to agree and approve it.. 

This is the Sh!T that happens when you get divorced.. Sorry for him..

Look.. I am decently well off.. It took my divorce to get a turn of luck.. I'm not rich by any stretch of the imagination. But I will be doing VERY well for me AND my kids within the next coming months.. If I have money problems between my pension and my new job, its because I am gambling it away or on drugs.. I collect child support from my Ex wife I don't even use NOW.. It just sits on the debit card.. I intend on never using except for maybe paying off some of my kids future college bills and maybe a first car.. 

But that being said.. She only pays me 200 a month.. She only works 10 hours a week.. She can clearly work more but refuses too.. Again I can let it go and just say fvck it.. I just don't need it.. But call me bitter or whatever.. When I was paying her when my son never even left my home.. She took that money gleefully.. Never said look, keep it it's not like he is living with me or anything.. But she never did.. 

So fvck her.. Karma is a *****.. Not only do I want 200, I want more and I am taking her to court.. Hopefully the judge will impute an amount on her to pay.. Impute is where they basically realize you don't want to work so they just calculate as if they are working and make her pay that amount.. Thus forcing her to work or be in contempt if she doesn't pay.. The last calculated value was 1350 a month.. I imagine I will have a very high balance 10 years from now on that debit card.. 

Some people say I should be the better man.. But she surely wasn't the better woman when I was asking not to go out and fvck this guy the minute I came home after work.. Or have zero empathy as I cried and begged for her to stay to make this a bit more decent for me before she left.. Anything.. 

Fvck the better man.. I am going to take what is mine for me and my kids.. She abandoned not only me but OUR oldest son and I am gonna make her fvcking pay for that.. He surely doesn't deserve it.. 

So you don't need to be nice, just fair.. Be as fair as he was to you.. 
So WTF happens if you have to work nights on those days he listed ? Is it just too bad you're the woman so you have to deal with it ? 
Or is he gonna tell you, Well don't get a job that makes you work nights.. You know what I mean..


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

I get what living in limbo, together but separated, in the same house after DDay (and learning your H or W intends to leave you and your kids for that person) is. Did that. STBXH moved out in May. I thought it would be easier, and it's starting to be now, but at the time it was hard as nails.

I grossly underestimated how hard it would be - on my son and on me - so I was blindsided when the time came.

You're still in the grieving process. The trouble with limbo is it postpones some of that a bit. Like someone said, it's like peeling the Band-Aid off slowly. The move is when the rest of it gets ripped off. Now you're forced to look down the barrel of your future as a single parent. I don't think I've ever felt more terrified. And my STBX travels more than half the time for his job. His being gone for a few days at a time with a suitcase and his hiring a moving company to take all his stuff across town were two very different things, it turned out.

You're not being selfish to think he's being insensitive to his kids' needs. He is. But you have to let it go. He's free to do what he wants to do. And right now, he's only thinking about himself and what he wants.

Has he traditionally been a good father? If so, don't worry - he'll continue to be. I panicked when STBX first left and did some, I felt, wildly selfish, insensitive things. But he's always been a good Dad, and he got right back around to that once he got most of the nonsense out of his system. After a couple of rocky months, we've worked out a kind of new normal that seems to benefit our son the most, and that is for the most part, a balanced give and take. It's still a work in progress, but it's working so far.

Try to let the Paris thing go. It will eat you alive if you let it. There's nothing you can do to change it - he's made up his mind. Just keep swimming.


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## Tango in Triple Time (Jul 14, 2015)

*" And the crazy part is that I have been so much happier without him. " * Really glad to see that! It is more painful than you ever imagine it's going to be, especially with such a long term marriage. 

*"My gut reaction is that there is a lot of me, me, me but it's because I'm so bruised and feeling like I need to patrol my borders and make sure I don't get kicked any more. But maybe that's just a warped perspective. Maybe he's just going about his life and I should be going about mine and let it all roll off my back. Hopefully that will be how it is before too long." * Sometimes the me me me is warranted. It's hard to see him, the one you stood beside in the bad times, just move along seemingly fine, while your world has flamed out and you rebuild it. And HE seems to be fine. How is that fair, right? 

*"But when he does something that pricks me rage just flows in. I don't know if this is normal or not, or how I should be feeling or if a year is plenty of time that I should have gotten over it, or if ten years from now I'll still be seething or if I really am working through it and will get through the other side. "* It's a normal reaction to being hurt. Took me longer than a year to work thru all the hurt and anger and disappointment (and I was the spouse to leave, no infidelity). Betrayed by your spouse with affair, I can't imagine how difficult that must be. I'm sorry I must have missed that in your original post. 

I realized not long ago that I had absolutely no feeling for my ex. Nothing. No anger, no hostility, no love, no hate, no pity. Nothing. He just doesn't matter to me in any way. It took a very long time to get here. Sure is a lovely place.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

@grays, what you're going thru and how you're feeling are perfectly normal-pretty much all of us have been there at one time or another.

So, get an agreement in writing that addresses custody. Keep a journal, or online calendar of the days you have the kids to prove to a mediator or judge the amount of time you actually keep the kids, and do something you find insanely pampering for your soul. You need it!


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## Bananapeel (May 4, 2015)

Ask your lawyer for the name of a good mediator. You guys need to be focusing on the kids and what is best for them. With all the emotions involved it is going to be difficult to put aside your differences and negotiate, and a good mediator can help with that.


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