# Fiance vs. Mother



## falcons10 (Feb 19, 2013)

My mother and fiance have argued time and again regarding wedding planning. It has recently gotten to the point where my fiance called my mother and they exchanged nasty words, and they are now not on speaking terms. This is such a painful place for me to be, as I love them both. My father, my fiance, and my fiance's family think I need to tell my mother to back out and set boundaries regarding getting involved in my relationship with my fiance. If you want to read all of this lengthy post, please go ahead. If not, here's the question I'm struggling with: Do I take my wife's side? or my mother's side? 



Some background: my mother and father are divorced. My mother has had conflicts with her own brothers and sisters, to the point where she hadn't spoken to most of them in years. She is the kind of person who relentlessly tries to make you see her side of an argument, and will twist your words and manipulate your feelings to make you see things her way. One thing is for sure, where she goes, conflicts always seem to follow. While I don't want to say she causes everything, the history seems to paint a picture of her being involved in so so many conflicts.

As for my fiance and mother, things started out great. They had a very good relationship. While being two very different people, they enjoyed their time spent together. After I proposed to my fiance, and the planning of the wedding began, the issues began to spring up. First, there was the issue of my mother wanting to invite her friends to the wedding, when the list was unfortunately almost full. She is not contributing money to the wedding, and my finance's parents are paying for 90% of it. She refused to offer to pay for her friends she wanted there, saying that since she is the mother of the groom she should be important. This caused more hard feelings, and the phrase "your mother is making this all about her" which continues to resurface.

I initially tried to stay out of the middle of these arguments. When I point out the possible errors in my fiance's ways, she feels hurt, unloved, and that I don't take her side. When I try to point out the errors in my mother's ways, she always talks me out of my viewpoint and gets me to feel for her. I guess its a mother thing. Once I set up mediation over a three way phone call and got a temporary truce. But the conflicts continue, and the hard feelings were all still held on to.

My mother always wanted to be included. This definitely comes from her past with her own family excluding her. As a result she seems to try to get involved with parts of the wedding that may or may not have included the groom's mother, such as the wedding dress shopping. When my mother was not included, she got more upset. 

Now there was the issue of the bridal shower. My fiance's mother planned it, my mother wanted to be involved in the planning, but it didn't happen that way. The invitations got sent out, and when my mother saw the date, she raised an issue, saying that she might have another obligation to another wedding's rehearsal dinner that day. That, and the two hour drive is too far for her and some of her family. My mother tried to offer a second bridal shower which she would throw for the people who couldn't come to the initial one. This resulted in my fiance's mother getting extremely insulted, words were exchanged, and they are not talking. My fiance then decided she had to tell my mother how she felt and basically told her she didn't appreciate any of this, she doesn't want to talk about it, and please back out. Here's the wedding date, please be there. Nasty words got exchanged, they aren't talking, and this is where I'm left. 

Please offer any insight, your experiences, or what is right to do. I really appreciate it.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Your mother is overstepping. You and your fiancee are supposed to be a team. Don't let your mother get between you unless you want to remain single for the rest of your life because your mother just won't quit - as you've seen her feud with all the other members of your family.

Stand up for your fiancee and draw some firm boundaries with your mother.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

> My father, my fiance, and my fiance's family think I need to tell my mother to back out and set boundaries regarding getting involved in my relationship with my fiance.
> 
> Do I take my wife's side? or my mother's side?


As a general rule you take your wife's side. I'm aware there are times when an exception is necessary.



> My mother has had conflicts with her own brothers and sisters, to the point where she hadn't spoken to most of them in years. She is the kind of person who relentlessly tries to make you see her side of an argument, and will twist your words and manipulate your feelings to make you see things her way.


I stopped reading at this point. It's obvious your mother has some serious control issues and you will have to step in on behalf of your wife to resolve this. What I'd suggest you do is read up on how to handle controlling parents calmly and directly as you can. There is a book Toxic Parents and others I'm sure. I've read plenty of them.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

Your mother needs to back off. And you need to tell her to do so. Your fiance shouldn't have to.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

falcons10 said:


> My mother has had conflicts with her own brothers and sisters, to the point where she hadn't spoken to most of them in years. She is the kind of person who relentlessly tries to make you see her side of an argument, and will twist your words and manipulate your feelings to make you see things her way.
> 
> When I try to point out the errors in my mother's ways, she always talks me out of my viewpoint and gets me to feel for her.
> 
> ...


I pulled the parts of your post that really stood out to me. To begin with, your mother doesn't speak to most of her own family due to "conflicts." I imagine her own family got sick of her manipulating behavior. You, however, seem to be one family member she can still successfully manipulate. She can only talk you out of your viewpoint because you allow it. Sounds like everyone else dropped her like a hot rock years ago. Thus, you are the "lucky" one with whom she can get her way ... at least some of the time.

I call total B.S. on your mother saying she might have to attend some other wedding rehearsal dinner. From my experience, guests at rehearsal dinners are the wedding party and family members of the bride and groom. So, mom might be going to some rehearsal dinner for some no-name couple. C'mon, are you buying that? Plus it's a two-hour drive for her and "her family" to attend the bridal shower? WHAT FAMILY?? It sounds as if the family has cut her out. Did your fiance's mom invite other family members from your side besides your mom? So what if it's two hours? Can't she grab a ride with another invited family member?

You are marrying your fiance, not your mother. And it would bode well if you decided right now to have your fiance's back. I imagine if you stood your ground with your mother, you would be added to her do-not-talk-to list. 

Yes, your mother is manipulative. But you are an adult. You see it for what it is. She might want to be included in the wedding and shower planning, but she wants things on her terms. This type of attitude can drive a wedge between you and your fiance once you get married.


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## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

I agree with Hope, you need to step in and be more assertive. This is suppose to be a happy time in your lives and your Mom is making it about her. Sit her down, try to have a rational conversation with her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Your wedding day is not about your mother. Make sure she knows this in no uncertain terms. 

All her persuasive arguments do not change this fact.


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## happysnappy (Jan 8, 2013)

Your mother, your responsibility. You need to tell her to back off. Your fiancée should not have to do that or compete with her ever. Step up


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

In general, I think your mom needs to back off, and you need to stand up to her. If you don't stand with your fiancée and protect her, I predict an uncomfortable future for you. 

But... You did say that by the time your mom got to invite some friends, the guest list was almost full. Forgetting who paid for what, can you honestly say that your mom was given an equal opportunity as your dad and fiancée's parents? If you broke things down, what are the numbers for "parent's friends"?

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## dblkman (Jul 14, 2010)

One of the hardest things to do is to put your own mother in her place but if you do not set boundaries now she will attempt to push her way into your marriage for years to come.


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## CantePe (Oct 5, 2011)

I had to tell my mother to butt the flick out and mind her own damn business when it came to my wedding. She tried to have me "uninvite" my father because they are bitterly divorced and not walk me down the aisle or give me away.

Mind you I said it in much less nicer terms.

As for your mother - tell her to flick off and keep her nose out of it. Not her day, not her way. She complains, tried to manipulate... Tell her don't come to the wedding. It's either she behaves or she gets cut off.

As another said - you are marrying your fiance, not your mother.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Question for you....which one of these lovely ladies to you plan on sleeping with over the next 50 years?


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby (Nov 7, 2011)

When it comes to YOUR side of the family. ALWAYS step up and defend your finance. Stand up to your mother and get in the MIDDLE of it!!!!

Seriously, if my fiancé did this to me, I'd call off the wedding. My husband always stands up for me!!! My husband protects my children and most of all... Me! He would never put me in that situation ever. If anyone ever has anything negative to say about my husband, you bet I'd stand up for him too!


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## LoriC (Feb 18, 2013)

If you want a successful marriage you had better put your fiance first now. Wait until kids arrive, it will get much worse! Putting your mother before your wife will end in a nasty divorce. 

I have a very manipulative, critical, over stepping her boundaries mother in law for almost 22 years. I am sure the only reason I am still married is because my husband NEVER took his mothers side even if I was wrong about something. That for me is a deal breaker! 

Be very careful and good luck!


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## Soifon (Oct 5, 2012)

I'm going to go against the grain here. Are you an only child or only have brothers? It sounds to me like your mother is wanting to be as involved as the mother of the bride would be, possibly feeling left out of things she will never get to experience. While I somewhat agree with what everyone is saying that you need to take your fiances side of things I also think that once you decide to have the traditional big wedding you are automatically making the day about _family_. If it were only to be about the two of you then you should have just eloped. It isn't exactly the right thing to do to include and care about everyone except your mother just because she has social issues.

I think there has to be some sort of compromise in this situation that isn't cutting your mother off. Do you really want to lose her? Because in all honesty with the rate of divorce I wouldn't want to be cutting my family off for a spouse. I would suggest that any communication regarding the wedding goes through you, you deal with your mother and save your fiance from that headache. But don't just send her the date and be there if you want, unless you really dislike your mother that is just hurtful.


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## Aunt Ava (Jan 24, 2013)

falcons10 said:


> My father, my fiance, and my fiance's family think I need to tell my mother to back out and set boundaries regarding getting involved in my relationship with my fiance. . They are right.
> 
> If you want to read all of this lengthy post, please go ahead. If not, here's the question I'm struggling with: Do I take my wife's side? or my mother's side? That's a silly question, the wedding is always about the bride (and groom).
> 
> ...


 You have to support your fiancée, and in light of what you have said about your mother's other relationships I urge you to be firm and set strong boundaries now. Best of luck to you and your fiancée.


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## falcons10 (Feb 19, 2013)

Re: Aunt Ava... thank you so much for taking the time to dissect this piece by piece. 

I'm getting a common message... to stand by my fiance, and set a boundary with my mother. I know some sides were right and some were wrong but this is about my fiance and I.

Can you guys please help me figure out what exactly the 'boundary' should be? What it would mean? And where we can go from here?

Thanks again for the overwhelming support so quickly.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

We can't tell you what your boundary should be. That's between you and your wife. Do you know what we mean by 'boundary'?

First thing you need to do is apologize to your wife for your mothers behaviour, and for not standing up for your wife as much as you should have.

Then work together with your wife and decide what you are going to say to your mother, how you're going to say it (in person, on the phone, email, whatever), when you're going to say it, and what will happen when your mother ignores what you've told her (because you KNOW she will).


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## falcons10 (Feb 19, 2013)

I guess I'm not really sure what boundaries are... or can be... Please help me figure out what this would mean.


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## BFGuru (Jan 28, 2013)

The first three boundaries are back off. 

1. This is MY wedding not yours,
2. This is the day my wife will look back on for decades and I do not want it tainted with bad memories.
3. Unless you are willing to foot the bill, we make the decisions for the guest list. Not you.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Soifon said:


> I'm going to go against the grain here. Are you an only child or only have brothers? It sounds to me like your mother is wanting to be as involved as the mother of the bride would be, possibly feeling left out of things she will never get to experience. While I somewhat agree with what everyone is saying that you need to take your fiances side of things I also think that once you decide to have the traditional big wedding you are automatically making the day about _family_. If it were only to be about the two of you then you should have just eloped. It isn't exactly the right thing to do to include and care about everyone except your mother just because she has social issues.
> 
> I think there has to be some sort of compromise in this situation that isn't cutting your mother off. Do you really want to lose her? Because in all honesty with the rate of divorce I wouldn't want to be cutting my family off for a spouse. I would suggest that any communication regarding the wedding goes through you, you deal with your mother and save your fiance from that headache. But don't just send her the date and be there if you want, unless you really dislike your mother that is just hurtful.


This sounds to me like saying everyone should get presents on your birthday because the get-together is about family instead of you.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

A boundary is to protect you. Your mother manipulates people to get her way. When that fails to work, she cuts them out of her life.

You set a boundary by acknowledging that planning a wedding is a stressful situation. You want her to attend your wedding, but her "help" in planning things have ended up insulting your wife-to-be and future MIL. You don't want to take sides. You don't want to referee another round of arguments between the parties concerned.

I think you know what will happen, because you mom has a standard M.O. She will start guilting you. She will argue her side ad nauseum. This is where you set a firm boundary. Tell her you don't want her to be hurt. You desire family unity. She can attend the wedding, dispense with the grudge-holding, or not attend.

You may end up joining the ranks of those family members to whom your mother no longer speaks. It boils down to manning up, putting your fiance ahead of mom, and being willing to take the consequences. And I think it may come down to your mom walking off in a huff and refusing to attend your wedding. Just my guess ... 

Are you willing to contend with that possible consequence? Just remember, you can't please all the people all the time.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

>>I stopped reading at this point.<<

I stopped reading at that point too.

It's clear what you have to do.


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## Soifon (Oct 5, 2012)

KathyBatesel said:


> This sounds to me like saying everyone should get presents on your birthday because the get-together is about family instead of you.


That's a stretch. Is it that hard to try to think about other people's feelings? I just find the, it's YOUR wedding day so do whatever YOU want to do, it's all about YOU to be really selfish. When you are having a traditional wedding, I'm sorry but you do need to think about the people invloved and their role. If you don't want to then elope.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Who is paying for the wedding?


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

Another boundary for your mother would be that SOME things are OFF-LIMITS for discussion. Period.

"Mother, the reception is being hosted and paid for by Mr. & Mrs. X. They are setting the number of guests; this is NOT negotiable."

"Mother, new-wife & I will decide WHEN we are having children. When we are pregnant, we will be SURE to let you know. Until then, this topic is NOT open for discussion. EVER."

If she INSISTS on bringing up topics that you have CLEARLY stated will NOT be discussed, you simply say, "Mother, this topic is not open for discussion." If she keeps pushing, you get your coats and say, "Come on, honey, we've got to get going." Then you calmly tell every one 'goodbye' and you LEAVE. Mom can only push you around if YOU ALLOW it.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

A boundary is something that you find unacceptable, something which, if someone steps over it, you go, "Whoa! Stop!". Yours are yours and won't be the same as mine, or your wife's. So for something like planning a wedding, you either agree to abide by your wife's boundaries, or you and she come up with mutual ones.

So you can decide that the two of you are going to decide on centerpieces, or flowers, or music, and you aren't going to discuss it with your mother. If your mother wants to discuss it, you simply tell her it's taken care of. If she intrudes, you tell her to back off. If she gets mad, you disengage. Your boundary is that you will not engage with anyone who tries to horn in on these decisions. If your mother freaks, then quit talking to her about anything to do with the wedding. Walk away, leave the room, drive home, whatever. Think of your mother as an unruly toddler who needs to be told NO because she's been spoiled too long.

It doesn't matter who is paying for the wedding. It isn't your mothers wedding.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Hope1964 said:


> It doesn't matter who is paying for the wedding. It isn't your mothers wedding.


I usually agree with Hope, but I'm sorry I do think it matters. If I'm paying, then I want some say in how my money is spent. Good or bad, money comes with strings. If it's not the mother's money then I have no problem at all telling her to pack sand. However, if I'm asking for mom to pay and then shutting her out of the decision making process I had better be prepared for the money tap to be closed in short order. 

I guess what I'm saying is, just because it's your wedding doesn't make you "entitled". Nobody "owes" you a dream wedding. That said, if you're paying yourself or if her parents are paying then your mom doesn't really have a horse in the race, does she.


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

WorkingOnMe said:


> I usually agree with Hope, but I'm sorry I do think it matters. If I'm paying, then I want some say in how my money is spent. Good or bad, money comes with strings. If it's not the mother's money then I have no problem at all telling her to pack sand. However, if I'm asking for mom to pay and then shutting her out of the decision making process I had better be prepared for the money tap to be closed in short order.
> 
> I guess what I'm saying is, just because it's your wedding doesn't make you "entitled". Nobody "owes" you a dream wedding. That said, if you're paying yourself or if her parents are paying then your mom doesn't really have a horse in the race, does she.


It matters to a point, as in, they shouldn't just elope, but if a parent is offering to pay, that does not entitle them to dictate everything about the wedding. If a parent is offering to pay and then demanding this, they should keep their money.

People who assume they have a certain amount of say just because they put money into something should not assume anything. It really irks me when people think they their money entitles them to anything. If they're only paying for something so they can control it, they should just keep their money.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

The OP said:



> First, there was the issue of my mother wanting to invite her friends to the wedding, when the list was unfortunately almost full. *She is not contributing money to the wedding, and my finance's parents are paying for 90% of it. *She refused to offer to pay for her friends she wanted there, saying that since she is the mother of the groom she should be important. This caused more hard feelings, and the phrase "your mother is making this all about her" which continues to resurface.


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

falcons10 said:


> My mother and fiance have argued time and again regarding wedding planning. It has recently gotten to the point where my fiance called my mother and they exchanged nasty words, and they are now not on speaking terms. This is such a painful place for me to be, as I love them both. *My father*, my fiance, and my fiance's family think I need to tell my mother to back out and set boundaries regarding getting involved in my relationship with my fiance. If you want to read all of this lengthy post, please go ahead. If not, here's the question I'm struggling with: *Do I take my wife's side? or my mother's side?*


Nothing more needs to be said than what is here. I'll emphasize TWO things. 

1. So your own father sees the behavior of his wife as poor....This should tell you something.

2. Who are you going to be (or WANTING TO BE) sleeping with....Seriously. If you pick your mother..that's who you get. If you pick your wife...that's who you get. I think we both know the answer here. 

How would you feel if one of the most important days in your life contradicted with your fiance's father. And your fiance even WONDERED who she should choose? 

Okay, think about how important this wedding is to you. It's 100000000000000000000000000000000000000000 TIMES more important to your fiance. The best thing you can do is agree to everything your fiance wants, write checks and give mild input where asked, but never truly commit to anything. Let it be your fiance's day.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Dad&Hubby said:


> The best thing you can do is agree to everything your fiance wants, write checks and give mild input where asked, but never truly commit to anything. Let it be your fiance's day.


My father gave me that advice almost verbatim about 6 months before my wedding. Best advice he ever gave me.


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

falcons10 said:


> I guess I'm not really sure what boundaries are... or can be... Please help me figure out what this would mean.


Your boundary should be. if it's your life, your mother is welcome in it, but has no control over it. If she tries to control it, ask her to step out of your life until she's ready to come back in.

I took a three year "break" from my mother over the same type of issues. Eventually I reached out to her and we sat down and she was sorry for trying to control me, but had a "hard time giving up raising her 'baby'. " I can respect that being a father of 2 and 31 years old at the time LOL.

But it was the only way to get the message to my mother that, yes I love her, but I don't love her behaviors and if she acts certain ways, I will excuse her from my life. 

We have a GREAT relationship now and I wouldn't have changed anything I did. I had to take a strong stance to make sure she understood.

I'm not advocating you not have a relationship with your mother. But I'm letting you know the level you may have to go to get her to understand where your allegiances lie.

"A son is a son until he takes a wife. A daughter is a daughter for the rest of your life." 

It's a very old saying....there's a reason why it's lasted this long.


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