# Can a separation really save a marriage?



## TemperToo (Apr 23, 2011)

I'm beginning to struggle with my decision. I knew I would.

Very abridged story: Married nearly 12 years, 4 kids (his, mine, ours....all legally adopted and ours full time,) emotional abuse to me and the kids throughout the marriage, some borderline physical abuse to the kids (seen as "discipline.") I decided to leave about 3 weeks ago. Done MC, both of us seeing individual counselors now. 

He is being VERY nice at the moment. He's spending time with the kids, they are enjoying him! He's actually communicating with me. Things are actually great right now (with the exception of him not really giving me anything emotionally.....i.e. no love.) He says he doesn't want me to go.

I KNOW it's not going to last. It never has. Which is why I decided to leave in the first place. My HEAD knows I have to leave. My heart isn't wanting to.  I suppose I just need re-assurance that I'm doing the right thing. I know that "only I can make that decision," but I'm scared to death to lose my marriage. I'm moving 6 hours away in with my best friend until I can get a job and get on my feet. Neither of us are wanting to divorce, but have agreed to take things one day at a time. 

Is it really possible for a separation to save a marriage? I don't want to lose it, but I'm tired of all the pain inflicted on me and the kids. If it was continuous pain, it would be a no-brainer......but he definitely has good qualities about him. Which is why I still love him.


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## TemperToo (Apr 23, 2011)

Am I not asking the right questions? Or asking wrong way?


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## anx (Nov 30, 2010)

> I KNOW it's not going to last. It never has. Which is why I decided to leave in the first place.


 This is the biggest lie people tell themselves. Its total BS. 

People get so convinced that someone can never change despite every action they are doing the opposite of that.

I'm a man going through this and my story is in my profile. I can truly tell you that people do change.

It takes hard work. It takes learning a lot. In my own story, my wife didn't tell me how she felt and was quietly unhappy for years. She internalized issues and told herself that she was the problem not me. I couldn't become a better husband without feedback.

Not many people post between 11:30pm - 8am when your post went up.


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## credamdóchasgra (Sep 24, 2010)

I read your post a few times and started to reply, but stopped because I lack the experience to know about your question.

BUT...my two cents anyway...

In your post, you answer some other questions, in a sense:
he was emotionally abusive.
Nearly physically abusive with your kids
your mind knows, but your heart hurts.

It's clear how much of a painful struggle this is for you, and I feel for you.

To answer your question, can a separation save a marriage?

I think it depends on 2 things:
1. The extent to which HE heals and overcomes HIS abusive tendencies through individual counseling 
2. The extent to which YOU heal the pain of your emotional attachment to him, and become able to build a happy and full life without him, FREE---also through individual counseling.

I would recommend you spend the time in separation focusing on love for yourself, love for your children, and filling each day with joy, without wondering about him.
Then down the road, if reconciliation comes up, you'll be in a better position to make a grounded and solid decision about it, from a place of inner strength.
It won't be something he does for you, or something that happens to you. It'll be your choice.

Look at separation as an opportunity to freely give yourself what you haven't been able to during your marriage.
Go out with friends, exercise, read and watch whatever you want, get to know each of your kids in new and special ways, garden, picnic with your kids...

Let each passing day help you find the clarity you're looking for.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## credamdóchasgra (Sep 24, 2010)

Also----why do you think he's behaving the way he is right now?

1. Giving you "no love"
2. Great with the kids
3. Says he doesn't want you to go

Possibly because the turmoil inside you right now could send you chasing him and telling him you changed your mind.

No. This was likely a long time coming. He probably played a role in what led you to this place.
It could be a longer path to healing it than 2 days of fun with the kids in your line of vision.
Let time do what time may do----for each of you.
Let him feel the consequences just as deeply as you are, if he's able.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## magnoliagal (Mar 30, 2011)

It's a mind game that abusers play. They abuse you, realize they screwed up so they play nice for while making you think they've changed only to do it again. The dance continues until someone stops it. That's where you are. You are stopping the abuse. You are doing the right thing.

Can he change? Absolutely. Is he likely to do it with where you are right now? Probably not and you know that or you wouldn't be leaving.


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## anx (Nov 30, 2010)

I usually really like the posts magnoliagal makes, but I have to disagree on this one.

You are probably feeling a range of hurt, confused, angry, resentment, contempt, overwhelmed, and thats all totally normal.

Not being there isn't what fixes this. What fixes it is hard work in MC, IC, book, talking about it, and changing the dynamic on your side while he changes his side. Separation can make the feeling of overwhelmed and hurt go away, but it doesn't change the rest of this.



> They abuse you, realize they screwed up so they play nice for while making you think they've changed only to do it again. The dance continues until someone stops it.


 Emotional abuse is a dance. Sometimes its totally the abuser doing all the work, but much of the time its a weird combination and dynamic between two people. Neither of them understands how the other person feels or why they act the way they do. 



> Can he change? Absolutely. Is he likely to do it with where you are right now? Probably not and you know that or you wouldn't be leaving.


 I have to disagree on this one. Whether you are in another bedroom or another state, the same work needs to be done to fix this. Separation will make the feelings on your side easier to deal with but won't fix the problem.


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## lostdad (Apr 2, 2011)

People can change, I believe that. Sometimes it takes a hell of a powerful catalyst to get people there, have you ever left before? It could be that your actions have rocked him to the core and caused a change. Or maybe not. If you think you love him and you think it's possible that he has changed, maybe it's worth finding out. But if you do, keep the front door open so to speak, and if he starts showing even a hint of his old self walk right out it and don't look back. Ultimately you have to do what you feel is right in your heart, but I for one think people can change. I mean I know they can, I have a good friend who had a lot of problems for a lot of years and he woke up one day and he was basically a new man he got his life together and it's been well over 5 years now I think it's safe to say the change is permanent.


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## TemperToo (Apr 23, 2011)

Thank you all for your replies. They mean so very much to me!!!

I most certainly do think people can change. The problem here is that he has admitted he's not sure he wants to. His counselor told him he has multiple issues that he needs to work through, but he is happy with who he is, at least that's what he says. 

I have never left before.


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## MandyLou (May 6, 2011)

People can change. That being said, statistically speaking, they usually don't. I would have a serious talk with a counsellor before making any decisions regarding moving back. In abusive relationships you are in the "honeymoon stage". This means he is going to be everything you want for a while.... then all of a sudden he isn't again. It's a cycle, and neither you nor he seem to be able to break it on your own. Get some help or you will both fall back into something that will be unhealthy for both you and the children you are setting such a bad example for.


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## magnoliagal (Mar 30, 2011)

anx said:


> I usually really like the posts magnoliagal makes, but I have to disagree on this one.


I went back and reread the op and I didn't notice that they are both in counseling already. My mistake.

I agree that leaving isn't what fixes this it's hard work on both parties to stop the dance. If you are both committed (him on stopping the abuse and you by not taking it) then yes there is a lot of hope for your marriage. Leaving alone just takes you out of the fire so to speak so you or your kids aren't in harms way and that I think is a good thing.


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## anx (Nov 30, 2010)

> The problem here is that he has admitted he's not sure he wants to. His counselor told him he has multiple issues that he needs to work through, but he is happy with who he is, at least that's what he says.


 Oh, thats not a good thing. It sounded from your first post that he was willing and changing, but I may have just assumed that.

You need to ask him about this. If is he UNWILLING to change, thats a bad sign. If he was willing to change, then I would strongly suggest against separation, but its still your choice and my be the best move. 

He might need to chose either the hard work to learn to be a better husband or losing you.


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## crazycat25 (Mar 31, 2011)

Can you explain a little more about the emotional abuse and borderline physical ... You are referring to? How severe is his aggression? Has he acknowledged it?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TemperToo (Apr 23, 2011)

Thank you again for all your replies. I didn't get into it very long in the first post because I've found it makes things harder to read. 

He is not sure he is willing to change. He's said that to me in those exact words. As much as it hurts to think that he doesn't love me and the kids enough to try to work on himself, I have to admire his honesty. I don't want him to expect me to change....and he is feeling rather attacked. However, I WANT to change any aspect of myself that is less than admirable. I understand and fully accept that no one is perfect, but he seems to be very happy being miserable, if that makes sense....

CrazyCat, the emotional abuse is very subtle, but it is there. He has never come out and called me fat or lazy, but he definitely implies it. Also, he is controlling in the way that he "allows" me to do things, but "punishes" me for doing them with his attitude. He is completely anti-social, has no friends.....I am the exact opposite. I am a people person. He gets very aggravated at me when I go out with friends (which is VERY rare anyway.) He is always calling and checking on me, and if I am not home when he thinks I need to be, he gets irate. Then his attitude is crappy for pretty much an entire week afterwards. He takes things out on the kids too......we all walk on eggshells around him. The kids (15, 13, 13, and 7) literally flinch whenever he moves too fast around them when he's in these moods. He has snatched them around by their shirts, and about 3 weeks ago he shoved the 13 year old into the wall for no reason at all. He wasn't hurt, but he was SCARED. I jumped up and stopped it the second after it happened.

My husband admits to hurting me and the kids, admits that he bullies them, admits that he's a genuine @sshat. But still says he doesn't think he wants to change who he is. I honestly don't know how much more we can take.


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## credamdóchasgra (Sep 24, 2010)

I hope you get a chance to clear your head during your separation. It sounds like it hasn't been fun.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## grayhound (Jan 18, 2011)

He has to be the one to want to change. Nothing you can say or do will make him want that. He has to come up with it all by himself. 

From my very limited experience, I would say that you should tell him plainly and distinctly what you want, in writing, with little emotion. Then refrain from getting in touch with him. Let him figure things out on his own and all by himself. Men hate being alone, and perhaps it might be what he needs to wake up. He may have an epiphany, but ONLY if he is ready and willing.

Good luck... I hope you can find a safe haven with your friend, relax, regroup and I truly hope you two can work something out and save your marriage. Kudos for taking care of the kids and getting them out of that situation. I know it's hard, especially with a dozen years and kids between you... Stay strong, you are doing the right thing. It's in your husband's hands now.


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## anx (Nov 30, 2010)

I think your story sounds a lot like mine. My MC story is in my profile.

What made me work on is was for my wife to say that things need to change or the marriage would die soon.

I think my wife would describe our situation as subtle emotional abuse. 

I think you might greatly benefit from reading "the dance of intamacy", "the dance of anger" and "the dance of deception". subtle emotional abuse is hard. I never meant or tried to do the things that happened. A lot of it was how my wife would act too.

Its really hard as the person giving subtle emotional abuse to see it or hear it.


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## credamdóchasgra (Sep 24, 2010)

anx said:


> Its really hard as the person giving subtle emotional abuse to see it or hear it.


What made you finally see or hear it?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## anx (Nov 30, 2010)

credamdóchasgra said:


> What made you finally see or hear it?


 Hard work, time reading this site and 15-20 books, a dedication to my wife, my faith pressing towards repentance and keeping the marriage together, and my wife being clear that things needed to change or the marriage would die. 

I've never run away from something thats difficult and the choice to me was clear. I chose my wife.


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## credamdóchasgra (Sep 24, 2010)

anx said:


> Hard work, time reading this site and 15-20 books, a dedication to my wife, my faith pressing towards repentance and keeping the marriage together, and my wife being clear that things needed to change or the marriage would die.
> 
> I've never run away from something thats difficult and the choice to me was clear. I chose my wife.


Good for you, that is very respectable.
I don't want to hijack tempertoo's thread, but I am gradually approaching the point where I will let my husband know what your wife let you know.
I may check out your story...I'm curious about what kinds of things were problems, and what you were able to change.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TemperToo (Apr 23, 2011)

Anx - You do give me hope. And i definitely have to admit that I am probably a part of this too. I HAVE been an enabler, if only because I've put up with it for so long. And I do allow him to hurt me emotionally. I am a little too sensitive and his words cut me. He IS a good person in there somewhere....I know he loves me and the kids. When things are good, they are great. But when he gets mad (which is very hard to predict,) he admits that he "goes for the kill." He tries to hurt intentionally. The subtle abuse that happens along the way he isn't trying to do, it's just who he is. 

But again, I don't think he wants to change. At least not enough. He's told me that he will think about it and take things day by day. I don't know if he really thinks I am serious about leaving. He says he doesn't blame me, he knows he's hurt me and he knows that the kids are better off with me. (The 7 year old is his pride and joy......the only one who is somewhat immune to his ranting.) It kills me to take my son away from his father. They all love him despite his faults. I do too. 

His childhood was not great, and his father is a VERY unforgiving, miserable person. He and his mother split due to some of the exact same issues. His father never even DATED again. Never saw another woman over 30 years later because he is THAT stubborn. He is living with his brother, miserable, alone, disabled (with the same disease my husband was diagnosed with 3 years ago) and pitiful. It's almost like my husband WANTS that life for himself. And unless he changes, I see it as a self fulfilling prophecy. It kills me to think he will end up like that....that he WANTS to end up like that!


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## Dedicated2Her (Nov 13, 2010)

credamdóchasgra said:


> What made you finally see or hear it?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Wow this was me.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## credamdóchasgra (Sep 24, 2010)

TemperToo said:


> . It's almost like my husband WANTS that life for himself. And unless he changes, I see it as a self fulfilling prophecy. It kills me to think he will end up like that....that he WANTS to end up like that!


This is the very tough part.

If he wants that life, there may come a point where you don't let it kill you, even though you hate that it'll "kill him."

I empathize---my husband seems to want to settle for the same dysfunctional patterns of his own parents; it's all he knows.
Like yours, he doesn't seem to want to change or grow; he can hang with a rancorous, competitive marriage. I can't.

But if you feel in your heart and gut that you were meant for something better, then let yourself have that better life.
You may feel that HE is meant for something better, but HE has to want it.

Please try to focus on yourself and your kids, and try not to "wait for him to get it."

Not because it's impossible---but because it's out of your control.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Dedicated2Her (Nov 13, 2010)

12 months ago I would have told you I didn't want to change. I didn't realize how miserable I was. My wife has prayed for me for years for this. Now that it has happened, I hope she just comes to a point where she accepts it and trusts it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

I don't see how a separation can save a marriage. My read on this is that is makes it easier for a cheater to tell themself the same stories that made them cheat while you were right next to them. With the added "benefit" of you not being right there, so they are free to hatch an affair or renew the last one. No spouse checking up on them.

If you want to separate, do it with the idea that it is to move on with your life.


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## Mrs.G (Nov 20, 2010)

magnoliagal said:


> It's a mind game that abusers play. They abuse you, realize they screwed up so they play nice for while making you think they've changed only to do it again. The dance continues until someone stops it. That's where you are. You are stopping the abuse. You are doing the right thing.
> 
> Can he change? Absolutely. Is he likely to do it with where you are right now? Probably not and you know that or you wouldn't be leaving.


:iagree: When I was making preparations to leave my parent's home, my abusive mother began to hug me and give me gifts. I wasn't going to fall for that crap and I told her so.

If you don't want to save the marriage, who cares if the separation would help? You are grieving the disappointment of a failed marriage and that is completely normal.

Some couples work out their marriages when they separate and reconcile. Unless this is what you want, keep making your plans and posting here.


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