# custody, visitation out of state, abuse



## Freud (Dec 4, 2015)

So my ex-husband has visitation rights. I live in another state and am supposed to bring my 4yo boy two weekend per month to see him. But when my boy returns he is withdrawn, hostile, cries a lot, etc. My ex was convicted on a domestic violence charge agains me at one point. He has abuse in his own past. I am afraid there is abuse in this situation but there are no marks.

Is it possible to just not bring my boy to see the ex? How difficult is it to enforce the visitation arrangement when I am in another state? The ex lives in the original state and I got permission to leave. My lawyer said any changes would have to go through my new state...


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

if what you say is true why did the court not mandate a supervision guardian for your son?


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## Freud (Dec 4, 2015)

I was undocumented at the time. I was scared he could get me deported. So I did not fight the arrangement in the divorce three years ago which was half custody. I had a restraining order and he threatened me with ICE at the time. I am a citizen now. He is a citizen, btw.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

My ex was also physically abusive, so I understand your concern. However, there could be other causes that would explain your sons upset. It could be as simple as he gets off his routine and ends up feeling exhausted and insecure because routine is important for kids. Could be that his father lets him run wild, eating whatever he wants and staying up late watching horror flicks, so by he time he gets home he's exhausted and mentally taxed. Could even be your ex says some things that make him feel negatively about going back home with you.

Before violating court orders, I think you should get a psychologist involved to get to the bottom of what's going on.


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## Miss Independent (Mar 24, 2014)

Freud said:


> I was undocumented at the time. I was scared he could get me deported. So I did not fight the arrangement in the divorce three years ago which was half custody. I had a restraining order and he threatened me with ICE at the time. I am a citizen now. He is a citizen, btw.



You were undocumented 3 years ago and now you're a citizen? 




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Xenote said:


> if what you say is true why did the court not mandate a supervision guardian for your son?


After we separated, my ex lived in the home for a little over a month. He was living in the basement and planning to move soon. He left the house in handcuffs after trying to choke me to death on the stairs. The neighbors heard the struggle and called the police for me.

I got a visit the next day from social services explaining to me that if I took him back into the house, which wasn't happening anyway, they would remove my children from my care.

I also had documentation from other incidents and my ex has a criminal record for petty crud a mile long.

When I asked for supervised visitation, I was told that there has never been an indication he is violent toward children, which is true, and my request was denied. 

Apparently, you can nearly kill your kids mother and that's just fine as long as you don't touch the kids.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

MJJEAN said:


> After we separated, my ex lived in the home for a little over a month. He was living in the basement and planning to move soon. He left the house in handcuffs after trying to choke me to death on the stairs. The neighbors heard the struggle and called the police for me.
> 
> I got a visit the next day from social services explaining to me that if I took him back into the house, which wasn't happening anyway, they would remove my children from my care.
> 
> ...


We are seriously messed....i am truly sorry to hear that Jean.
at this point i would document everything and i would video tape the exchange so show any behavioral changes in your son.


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## Freud (Dec 4, 2015)

MJJEAN said:


> After we separated, my ex lived in the home for a little over a month. He was living in the basement and planning to move soon. He left the house in handcuffs after trying to choke me to death on the stairs. The neighbors heard the struggle and called the police for me.
> 
> I got a visit the next day from social services explaining to me that if I took him back into the house, which wasn't happening anyway, they would remove my children from my care.
> 
> ...


ugh. This is just awful.



3leafclover said:


> And it is not difficult for them to enforce custody orders over state lines. For instance, if your ex went to court and was given primary custody because you had violated the order repeatedly without having it changed, that would definitely be valid in your current state


I live in a very large city, I wonder if the cops would even get involved in a case like this. Since he would have to travel here for the court dates it would be difficult for him. Plus the money involved. He does not have much to spend on yet another court case. I do not want my boy to be abused or to learn to abuse others. It might not be physical...he yells and intimidates. I would like to find a way to get around it all, but maybe there is no hope...


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Freud said:


> ugh. This is just awful.
> 
> 
> 
> I live in a very large city, I wonder if the cops would even get involved in a case like this. Since he would have to travel here for the court dates it would be difficult for him. Plus the money involved. He does not have much to spend on yet another court case. I do not want my boy to be abused or to learn to abuse others. It might not be physical...he yells and intimidates. I would like to find a way to get around it all, but maybe there is no hope...


When I married my step children's father, he had 100% custody and his ex had visitation. He moved from Maryland to New Mexico.

His ex is a alcoholic, uses drugs and abused the children. At one point he went to court to try to make it so that she could not have the children for weeks in the summer.

Since the divorce was in Maryland, the New Mexico court asked Maryland to allow New Mexico to take over jurisdiction. (Their mother still lived in Maryland). The change of jurisdiction was allowed.

Their mother did fly out here for one court hearing. For the other court hearings she was allowed to be on the phone with a local lawyer representing her. If she had wanted to, she could have done all of the hearings via phone.

Dispite the fact that the children were the ones who talk us and the court evaluator of the abuse the mother was doing, of her passing out drunk, etc. the judge ordered that the children would spend the 6 weeks in the summer with their mother. Why? Because when their mother showed up that one time in court she was crying. I kid you not. The female judge said that showed how much she loved her children.

The judge also stipulated that the children had to be supervised by their mother 100% of the time so that they were not exposed to any alcohol or alcoholic.. but my then husband protested their mother is the alcoholic tha he was trying to protect them from and it was her alcohol that they were drinking as you kids when she was passed out.

The judge told him to shut up.

Basically, don't expect much from the courts. 

Do take your child to see a phychiatrist. Let the doc be the one who determines what's going on. Few judges will believe anything that a person says against their ex spouse.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Freud said:


> ugh. This is just awful.
> 
> 
> 
> I live in a very large city, I wonder if the cops would even get involved in a case like this. Since he would have to travel here for the court dates it would be difficult for him. Plus the money involved. He does not have much to spend on yet another court case. I do not want my boy to be abused or to learn to abuse others. It might not be physical...he yells and intimidates. I would like to find a way to get around it all, but maybe there is no hope...


There is hope if he actually is abusing or neglecting your son. You have to get independent 3rd parties involved so the court will take the issue seriously. And you have to document EVERYTHING.

If you truly suspect abuse, contact a psychiatrist and local social services to get them involved. If they can find evidence of abuse, their testimony could make all the difference if you have to go back to court.

Definitely contact the courts in your state and ask about changing jurisdiction. I know in my state, jurisdiction is given to the court where the parent with primary custody lives. It's just a matter of filing the paperwork to change jurisdiction and then begin filing whatever modifications you seek in the new jurisdiction.

I'd ask for the change in jurisdiction now, but I'd honestly hold off on applying for supervised visitation until after a shrink and social worker have gotten involved and determined whether they think seeing the father unsupervised is detrimental to the child. You need to give the court something to work with beyond your suspicions.


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## Malpheous (May 3, 2013)

It's not visitation. It's parenting time. It is enforceable. The court took the time to write an order that defines it and everything. Doesn't matter what state line is crossed. Perhaps he's withdrawn, etc, because of the minimal time the child spends with dad. What have you done to work with the father to try increasing that time or to further foster that relationship? I assume you don't speak ill of the father. Especially not around the child or in ways that could get back around to the child. 

Aside from the DV charge that didn't involve the child and your presumed information regarding your ex's past - what, other than being withdrawn and other generic behavioral queues that could fit many possible reasons, makes you feel there is abuse? To go down that road, you'll need something definitive.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

IMO, the most important thing you can do is take your son to a child therapist to whom you've shared your concerns, and ask the therapist to work with your son to help him understand what's normal and what's dangerous, and what to do in each situation, including informing you or others if something happens. Since you don't have any proof of abuse against your son, nobody's going to allow you to just stop letting his dad see him. And you don't know for sure anything's going on. NO kid likes to share two households, so that might be the cause of his withdrawal. But take him to a therapist who will be able to get to the truth and give him tools to deal with it.


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## Freud (Dec 4, 2015)

Yes I have a therapist scheduled for two weeks. He has been kicked out of three daycares in 6 weeks recently for violent behavior and erratic yelling (which happens a lot when he comes home from his tay at his fathers too...at first he is really withdrawn and will not talk, then he hits me and bites and such things). One day care owner said she thinks he is being abused, but she is not a psychologist.

Thanks for the thoughts on just not bringing him to the visitations with his father. 

I don't know about false accusations and the court...I know my ex denied everything too, said I married him for the papers and provoked him into hitting me. That was the story the court believed in the proceedings despite his conviction. So I don't know...it is despairing. But maybe the psychologist can help with whatever is happening.


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## rachaelm (Feb 4, 2016)

Lawyers and psychologists should be your new best friends.


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