# What is going on?



## Doktorn

I've posted a couple of times on this forum to ask for advice and it has been helpful in gaining some perspective.

To cut a long story short, my wife asked me for a divorce in the autumn of 2014, sent the papers in march 2015, moved our separate ways at the end of the summer of 2015 and went through a no contact period for a while in the new year.

We had a compassionate divorce and it was completed with a minimum of fuss and disturbance. I even helped her find a new apartment and did some refurbishment. For a time, life continued as usual except with no sex and living in separate abodes.

Our problems can be summarised as her not respecting me and me not appreciating what she does for me (The Flag Page with Laugh Your Way) and this disconnect has poisoned our relationship for the last ten years at least.

After the period of no contact, we reached out tentatively to each other and began to have respectful interaction again. Not long ago, there was a situation arising from her inability to respect me which upset me. She did eventually admit to being at fault and we made peace again.

Now to the current situation. Recently, we have been seeing a lot of each other and we have enjoyed our time together. No mention of reconciliation, but it felt like the good old times, albeit more respectful and careful.

1) She helped me put up the trampoline and spent a weekend afternoon with me.
2) She invited herself and her parents to dinner at my place for a national holiday. Brought the food and cleaned up afterwards. 
3) We had lunch at her apartment on a weekday. No nooner, but pleasant conversation.
4) We watched a movie together with the kids and snuggled on the couch, having had dinner before. She even cleaned the kitchen afterwards. 
5) She invited me for dinner when I dropped off the kids. She had bought food that she knows I like, but she doesn't particularly care for it.
6) She tells me she is looking forward to seeing me.
7) We have been doing much the same things at the weekend, independently of each other. It is very weird!

I don't know what to think.

A couple of red flags.
1) She received a text while we were having dinner, looked at it and shielded it quite quickly. I don't have any claim on her seeing as we are divorced and have been for half a year, but it was an odd gesture.

2) We still have communication problems. We talked about me getting clothes for our daughter which I am quite certain I agreed to do, only to find that she had done this weekend. This is the kind of thing that went on a LOT in our marriage and it bugs the hell out of me. She tells me she did it because she did not know if I had committed to it. I think she could have easily rung me to find out.

3) She still makes decisions on things that directly affect me without thinking to consult me. For example, telling my son he can play computer when he gets to my place, resulting in a big fight with my son when I tell him he has to do his homework first before he can play. Easily avoided by telling my son that he should consult me when he gets to my house. In fact, there is a lot of these types of things and often relating to TV and PC use. I am more strict and she is not. 

4)

So the questions to the forum are:

What do you think is going on? What would you do?


Do I want a reconciliation?
Yes, I think I do. I miss her and I have been thinking about her a lot. I love her. We would have to seriously work on the dynamics of our relationship as they were clearly not healthy.

Are we ready for a reconciliation?
I really don't know. She seems to be doing well. She told me that we are bound together forever as co-owners of this family, although there will be new partners joining us at some point. I think I have not processed all the grief and am trying to become a better person as a result of all of this, but haven't made much headway!

Sorry about the long post, it has been bubbling up and I don't really know what to do or how I feel or even how I should feel!


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## chillymorn

seems like she still wants a plan B!

start avoiding her. and dating.


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## Doktorn

By plan B you mean having me in reserve in case her new found freedom doesn't pan out? 

Maybe. 

But how does one tell if there is a reconciliation on the cards if one avoids the other?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Doktorn

My XW and I have continued to maintain a friendly, if somewhat distant relationship. I don't really know what is going through her mind, she sometimes tells me very personal things, and other times is very distant. 

For example, she told me she had started a new semi-permanent form of birth control because she had realised she was in a period of her life that she did not want more children. Assured me not that it was not for dating, but because she wanted to make a statement about what kind of future she wanted and because it would stabilise her periods. Why she felt the need to share, I don't know. At the time, we broke up I did say that she would meet a man who would want to start a family, but I could not do the same with a women ever again after the choice we had made about birthcontrol. 

She's shared about her work, but switches off when I talk about mine. 

I read a lot about relationships and sent her a link (Find out how good you are at being in a relationship | Life and style | The Guardian), telling her that based on these results, I was not a very good partner while she was.

Her reply:

From her perspective, I more than compensated my low score with my other qualities: kindness, bravery, sense of humour, excellent lover, intelligence, fantasy, etc, etc, but at the end of the day was the feeling of loneliness when she needed most. She went on to write that it might her as much her own problem as it was mine and that while I am not the most organised person, I am absolutely wonderful.

She admits that I have been there for her when she needed me whilst we were getting divorced and ever since then. 

So while I know I am her plan B, I find it difficult to move on. Tried dating, but I come across as needy as I struggle with a need for intimacy and don't really feel that it is fair to play with the emotions of a woman when my heart isn't in it. 

If I wanted to win the heart of my wife, I need to become more organised and become someone she respects and with whom she feels secure. Except, I am not that person who 
a)pays attention to detail
b) gets chores done straightaway
c) likes order
d) follows a schedule
e) ensures that you are always well-prepared

I am not the calm and collected, mature man that she needs me to be, but neither am I that man she describes above.

I am not saying that I don't want to be that kind of man. Who wouldn't want to be??? But I am saying that it is not me. Who knows, maybe the natural step for me.

What I do need is to commit to winning her back or commit to moving on. I hate this shell of a man I have become (which I don't show to her, always a brave front when she is a around). 

Anyway, we've been talking and she finally took ownership of some of the issues that she's blamed me for ruining the relationship. She has issues with trust and put all the burden of carrying the family on her shoulders instead of sharing with me. Of course, me not being as organised and structured as her made it difficult to let me take care of things my way, even if in the end the results were always the same. She didn't have three children, she had two and a man she never trusted enough to take care of things. It's on me that I didn't show her I could, it's on her that she never gave me the chance to do so.

I realise that my inability to move on is less about her and more about me not taking ownership of my own life issues. För instance, I feel of value mostly when I am with my family. My motivation to do things disappears when I am on my own. I really need to work on that.

My head is tellling me to simply let her go enjoy the eat, pray, love period of her life, but my emotions want to eat, pray and love by her side.

Like many people on this site, I am very conflicted, sad, and, I suspect, depressed.


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## 225985

Doktorn said:


> But how does one tell if there is a reconciliation on the cards if one avoids the other?


Remember "my wife asked me for a divorce".

If she wants to reconcile, she will tell you. But don't wait for that to happen. 

I am doing the waiting thing. I am waiting to win the Powerball lottery. Probably not going to happen but I am still waiting.


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## EunuchMonk

> A couple of red flags.
> 1) She received a text while we were having dinner, looked at it and shielded it quite quickly. I don't have any claim on her seeing as we are divorced and have been for half a year, but it was an odd gesture.





> For example, she told me she had started a new semi-permanent form of birth control because she had realised she was in a period of her life that she did not want more children. Assured me not that it was not for dating, but because she wanted to make a statement about what kind of future she wanted and because it would stabilise her periods. Why she felt the need to share, I don't know. At the time, we broke up I did say that she would meet a man who would want to start a family, but I could not do the same with a women ever again after the choice we had made about birthcontrol.


I'm calling it. She has another man. Since you two are divorced I guess it isn't your business but let there be no doubt in your mind. The birth-control-just-to-make-a-statement excuse sounded hilariously untrue.

Anyhow, I think you're doing the right thing focusing on improving yourself. Where I think you are going wrong is filling your head with thoughts of reconciliation. Fill your head with enjoying being you. Go out. Go on a date. Get out of your comfort zone. Focus on the young'uns. Doing this might change your perspective on a lot of things.


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## 225985

EunuchMonk said:


> The birth control excuse sounded hilariously untrue.


Agree. She was sending the message that she is with someone, still on the market, willing to **** the right guy when he comes along, still desireable etc. One or more of these excuses. Stabilizing the period - No.


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## MJJEAN

blueinbr said:


> Stabilizing the period - No.


You are clearly not female :smile2:

I had my tubal ligation when my son was born 15 years ago. Around age 35 or so, my periods went wonky and have been fairly miserable ever since. Intense cramping, obvious bloating, really emotional (angry or in tears, pick one), exhaustion, migraines, an erratic schedule (meaning I have no idea when or where I'll be when..OH NO!), extremely heavy flow, sometimes days of spotting after.

I was offered BCP or even a hormone based IUD to help with the symptoms and regulate my periods. I declined because I had another doctor who suspected that my problem was actually my thyroid. Turns out, that guy was right. My immune system is attacking and killing my thyroid, which is causing havoc on my system, including my cycle.

Anyways, the point is that prescribing a hormone based method of BC to treat horrible periods is very common.


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## 225985

MJJEAN said:


> You are clearly not female :smile2:


My comment was in reference to the WHY she was telling him, not that BC isn't used for period stability. IMO she was conveying a message MORE than just period stability.


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## MJJEAN

blueinbr said:


> My comment was in reference to the WHY she was telling him, not that BC isn't used for period stability. IMO she was conveying a message MORE than just period stability.


Or she was letting him know that she is A) having difficulty with her cycle B) what meds she is on in case of emergency and/or C) that her being on BC ISN'T in order to have sex with other men and is solely for medical reasons, because we all know a story about a guy in process of divorce who got the insurance statement and lost his mind.

Not saying she isn't sexually active with other men, just saying there are many reasons to mention this to her legal next of kin.


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## 225985

MJJEAN said:


> Or she was letting him know that she is A) having difficulty with her cycle B) what meds she is on in case of emergency and/or C) that her being on BC ISN'T in order to have sex with other men and is solely for medical reasons, because we all know a story about a guy in process of divorce who got the insurance statement and lost his mind.
> 
> Not saying she isn't sexually active with other men, just saying there are many reasons to mention this to her legal next of kin.


Hence the "IMO". I was addressing the OP with my opinion on her motives since he asked "What is going on?".

Also, IMO he is no longer "her legal next of kin". I know little about divorce (never been through it) but I doubt he was any legal status with her. She divorced him, at her requirement, remember? She could wear a medical alert bracelet. OP, are you assuming medical next of kin status for her? Do you have a medical power of attorney for her? 

OP, please see my comments above as my comments only.  Other may have different and just as valid opinion. 

And I hope you dropped her from all your insurance, including health and life insurance unless specified in the divorce decree. Check any investments to make sure that she is not listed as your primary beneficiary. Make sure your kids are listed, or their legal representative should something happen to you.


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## Marc878

Make your own life. If anything developes and you want to pursue it fine but waiting around on a hope and prayer is foolish.


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## Evinrude58

Do you have any idea that what you described is probably true of 95% of men in the universe and that she should have worked on the marriage instead of working toward divorce? 

I think you should move on. She will always find an excuse why you're not good enough and she's not happy.

And yeah, you're plan b and she's doing other men. Don't buy her bc crap. If she wanted you, she's tell you. She hasn't. You're being cruelly played, sir.

She knows what she's doing. She's keeping you dangling while she looks for a replacement. Thing is, you're hard to replace. You take it all and still love her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## farsidejunky

As long as you try to find your strength through someone else rather than from yourself, you will always be plan B for her, and experience the exact same thing in your future relationships. 

And yes, she is definitely seeing someone else. How do you expect her to respect you enough to make you plan A when she watches you accept the scraps she has left over from the current plan A.

Let her go. Get into counseling. Find your strength. Then a year from now, maybe you will be ready to date. Maybe.



Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


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## SunCMars

Evinrude58 said:


> Do you have any idea that what you described is probably true of 95% of men in the universe and that she should have worked on the marriage instead of working toward divorce?
> 
> I think you should move on. She will always find an excuse why you're not good enough and she's not happy.
> 
> And yeah, you're plan b and she's doing other men. Don't buy her bc crap. If she wanted you, she's tell you. She hasn't. You're being cruelly played, sir.
> 
> She knows what she's doing. She's keeping you dangling while she looks for a replacement. Thing is, you're hard to replace. You take it all and still love her.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


This is spot on.

In an earlier Doktor post the XW told him she wanted a divorce and that she would not re-marry. She said [basically] when she gets horny she will find a man to take care of the itch...and then send him on his way. She is not interested in finding a new husband.

Why should she? Doktor is still fulfilling that part for her.

She feels guilty about using her XH this way....but does not stop her catting around.

She will come back to him when her sexual desire is no longer important....or after plowing through ten or twenty men and she is sated.

She left the marriage so she can have sex with other men.

This is OK. She was upfront [in the other post] about it.

What is NOT OK is stringing her XH along. It is killing him.

What a selfish user. 

But, OP is allowing this and whining to us to help him.


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## Catherine602

Let me help you decode her actions. She is telling you very clearly what she wants from you but you are not interpreting her indirect communication accurately. 

You are not plan B, she has no future plans with you in mind. She enjoys your company as one would a valued friend but not a love interest. Your description of her behavior is consistent with treating you like a comfortable gf that she uses to vent, chat, relieve boredom and to share entertainment. On her part, there seems to be zero sexual tension, romantic love or desire for reconciliation now or in the future. 

If there was a strong sexual attraction, she would have made the moves on you way before now. She does not see you in that way. You are her FWB of a nonsexual nature. She is no doubt sexually active and she told you as much. The BC conversation decoded. 

Don't keep up this friendship because it will only cause you pain and delay the bright future that is ahead of you. Make a surgical cut now. Go through the pain once and for all and start building your new life. No rescues, dinners, meet-ups, NC except as it concerns your children. You don't need to hear about her life anymore, she is not your worry and you are not a convenient shoulder for her. 

I can guarantee you that the online test you took was wrong. She is no better at relationships than you, that's why you are D. You know your contribution to the failure of the marriage and you are working hard to be a better partner. She thinks it was all you. She will find out how wrong she is, eventually. 

If you make the cut from you ex, you will find that you can focus better on dating and have pleasant experiences. In fact, dating will help you to rebuild your self confidence and restore your faith in the future. 

You are recently D and healing and not looking to replace your ex with a new wife or LT commitment. You just need to make it clear to the women you meet. If you are honest and let your date decide if she wants to continue to see you on that basis then it's all good. 

Plan on dating many different women so that you sharpen your picker and decide what kind of partner works for you. Don't get serious with the first woman who is nice to you, there are lots of nice women. You want nice and right for you and that will take time to find after you have healed completely.


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## Doktorn

Catherine602 said:


> Let me help you decode her actions. She is telling you very clearly what she wants from you but you are not interpreting her indirect communication accurately.
> 
> You are not plan B, she has no future plans with you in mind. She enjoys your company as one would a valued friend but not a love interest. Your description of her behavior is consistent with treating you like a comfortable gf that she uses to vent, chat, relieve boredom and to share entertainment. On her part, there seems to be zero sexual tension, romantic love or desire for reconciliation now or in the future.
> 
> If there was a strong sexual attraction, she would have made the moves on you way before now. She does not see you in that way. You are her FWB of a nonsexual nature. She is no doubt sexually active and she told you as much. The BC conversation decoded.
> 
> Don't keep up this friendship because it will only cause you pain and delay the bright future that is ahead of you. Make a surgical cut now. Go through the pain once and for all and start building your new life. No rescues, dinners, meet-ups, NC except as it concerns your children. You don't need to hear about her life anymore, she is not your worry and you are not a convenient shoulder for her.
> 
> I can guarantee you that the online test you took was wrong. She is no better at relationships than you, that's why you are D. You know your contribution to the failure of the marriage and you are working hard to be a better partner. She thinks it was all you. She will find out how wrong she is, eventually.
> 
> If you make the cut from you ex, you will find that you can focus better on dating and have pleasant experiences. In fact, dating will help you to rebuild your self confidence and restore your faith in the future.
> 
> You are recently D and healing and not looking to replace your ex with a new wife or LT commitment. You just need to make it clear to the women you meet. If you are honest and let your date decide if she wants to continue to see you on that basis then it's all good.
> 
> Plan on dating many different women so that you sharpen your picker and decide what kind of partner works for you. Don't get serious with the first woman who is nice to you, there are lots of nice women. You want nice and right for you and that will take time to find after you have healed completely.



Thank you to this and all the replies on here.


I needed to hear them.

Move on, it is.:smile2: 

For the record, she is a fantastic woman, but perhaps not fantastic for me or me for her.


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## 225985

Friend, you will never be able to move on if you continue to believe she is fantastic. She is not as great as you think. Please go No Contact except for what is directed needed to discuss the kids. Only that, time, and maybe some IC will allow you to move on.


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## NoChoice

OP,
At about the same time you were typing your last post I too was typing one. The site logged me off and I lost it all so I went back to bed. Basically what I said was that in order for anything we say here to make any difference you must first come to know what you want based on what is possible.

You indicated that you wanted to R but one cannot R alone therefore that is not possible. If your wife had wanted to R she would have chosen to work on the marriage instead of D. So then, left with the possibilities, which outcome do you desire? If you can see yourself 5 years down the road in the same position you are in currently then proceed as you have been. If not, then you must decide to make a change.

To me it appears that your wife is giving you just enough to keep your interest piqued. She seems to be quite a cake eater, stringing you along as she "plays the field" looking for something better. Once found, you will find that her behavior towards you will leave no room for confusion as she will no longer need you to fill in the emotional gaps that her sexual escapades currently leave her with.

I feel that the only way to know for sure is to force the issue. If you stop responding to her "breadcrumbs" and truly decide to move on she will then be forced to deal with the new paradigm. She may offer a few more "crumbs" to lure you back in but anything short of wholehearted, determined persistence from her will prove her disinterest. And, since she is/has been the instigator in the relationship, it may frame you in a different light in her eyes. Whether she shows additional interest in you or not at least you are moving on.


Perhaps something along the lines of " W, it has been 6 months now since our D and I do not see where this path is leading. At times I feel as though you have some interest in getting back together, then again not. It has left me confused as to how to proceed. I have therefore decided it is time to move ahead with my life. I cannot remain in this pseudo relationship any longer and must move on. I need to have a clear plan mapped out and work towards realizing that goal and that isn't possible with our current arrangement. I will continue to be the best co-parent I can be but as for you and I, I feel it is time to forge ahead with my life, it isn't healthy to remain where I am".

At least this way you will be conveying honesty and not be toying with her as she has you since the D. Of course this is all predicated on you actually wanting to move on. If you do not wish to then things will coast along as they have been until she finds the "better" that she seeks. I wish you strength and good fortune.


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## VladDracul

MJJEAN said:


> Or she was letting him know that she is A) having difficulty with her cycle B) what meds she is on in case of emergency and/or C) that her being on BC ISN'T in order to have sex with other men and is solely for medical reasons, because we all know a story about a guy in process of divorce who got the insurance statement and lost his mind.


MJ, you being female and all, you ought to at least give the old boy a heads up on the "womanese" she's likely using on him. Hence,

_"For example, she told me she had started a new semi-permanent form of birth control because she had realised she was in a period of her life that she did not want more children. Assured me not that it was not for dating, but because she wanted to make a statement about what kind of future she wanted and because it would stabilise her periods._

Talking about phrasing it to confuse him and give him false comfort but get it off her chest and say what she really means. I recommend Dokton PM me if he wants real guidance on getting his romantic life in order with her and other chicks. He's on the wrong path.


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## 225985

The same situation is playing out with Andy101. The kids, the breadcrumbs. The "mixed messages". In these two cases the women know exactly what they are doing. It is just mean. They are taking advantage of the love their ex-H's still have for them to fill their emotion needs until the right guy shows up. Both have said they do not plan to date again or marry again or some crap like that. Until the right guy shows up. Then they will stop with the breadcrumbs, leaving the men in shock again.


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## Evinrude58

I know how this stuff feels, and what this woman is doing to doktorn is probably one of the most evil, destructive, excruciating things a woman could do to a man. 

We all see it. He probably does but is helpless to stop it to an extent.

If I were him, I'd think about the fact that she told him she didn't want children and since he's fixed, what the heck she meant. 

Since he may not see it, I'll say that she's having sex with other men and doesn't want to get pregnant.

And that is ALL I would need to know to put me down the road. I was crushed when my wife wanted a divorce, but knowing she was at the very least sexting and sending nude pics of herself to other men, was all I needed to tell her to leave and file for divorce. 

Doktorn, she is clearly cake-eating and keeping you for emotional support. Just really a cruel person.

You still have her on a pedestal. You've got to kick her off or you will never get well.

Wishing you the best.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602

Gentlemen, don't get carried away with this one situation. There are as many threads by women in situations where they are being used by men. 

You forget that men openly advocate playing women for sex. There are websites, courses and practitioner's devoted to teaching the uninitiated man. I have never read one post expressing outrage. It's acceptable in this culture for men to deceive women for sex. It's not acceptable for women to deceive men for resources though. Both are abhorrent.

Besides, sewing distrust and demonizing women won't help Doktorn. If he plans on future relationships with women, he needs to trust his ability to detect a user or women who become users. That means there are actually women who are not users otherwise why would he need the ability to pick them out? 

** end of jack **


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## Catherine602

@Doktorn I think your love and appreciation is a reflection of your fine qualities and not those of your ex. In time, you will come to find that she is not as wonderful in key areas as you believe at present. 

I am certain she is not an evil person but she is not being honest with you at this time. She may justify her actions by telling herself that she wants to maintain a friendship. She knows on some level that it is not advantageous for you. 

She has no problem enjoying the benefits of your love without giving back. She has no problem dangling you on a string knowing that you have no reason to hope for R. If she is such a wonderful person, how can she feel so little empathy and compassion? When you break out of her sphere of influence, you will be able to judge her fairly. 

Right now, you ascribe to the false reality that she has created because you are still in a relationship with her. It's serving her not you. I hope reading these posts will help you see your ex, yourself and your life in a different light. One that is true and beneficial to you. NC is the only way to end your enslavement.


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## VladDracul

Catherine602 said:


> Right now, you ascribe to the false reality that she has created because you are still in a relationship with her. It's serving her not you. I hope reading these posts will help you see your ex, yourself and your life in a different light. One that is true and beneficial to you. NC is the only way to end your enslavement.


Doktorn, you really, really need to listen to Catherine. Do otherwise at your own peril.


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