# She's Cheating.... now what??????



## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

i found out through her email that she was having an affair with a co-worker. At one point i feel like this is my fault, i was dealing with a "depressive" state for a while and became distant from her. on the other hand she made no real attempt to tell me how she was feeling at any time, so i wasnt aware how bad things were getting.

i dont kno what to do now, it seems looking at her email has been the only way to get the truth from her, so if i tell her i kno about the affair, i might not find out if it really ends. And, of course she gets phone calls on her cell, some of them right in front of me, but the conversation is limited.

Weve been together for 8 yrs now, i hope shes only been doing this for a couple months (no, we're not actually married), but i dont know.

I keep wanting to believe that if i try to be the "better man", she might end this affair, without me ever having to tell her i kno whats going on. Saying something could easily end everything, but im willing to "go the extra mile" to make things better. I really do love her and i feel she is the best thing that has happened to my life. 

If it goes on too long, i'll have to say something, i kno. 

Weve actually been discussing out relationship lately, and she says she wants me to be with her, and to feel positive about "US".

the company shes working for is closing down at the end of March, and the coworker lives well far away from our area (i kno who he is, and that hes Married, i have his addy, phone # and everything). so it "could" be impossible to complete thier tryst after the plant shuts down.

do i wait? do i make a statement?

am i just being naive?


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Make a call from a payphone to his wife. That would surely end things.

draconis


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

draconis said:


> Make a call from a payphone to his wife. That would surely end things.
> 
> draconis


I like that idea for style...

But your idea to see if the company closing down put an end to it sounds interesting. While you are waiting you could work on being more enticing, and also by not telling her you know, you will be able to keep spying on her - if that's what you want.

In general, I hate the whole spying thing - I would hate it done to me. Having said that my wife knows all my passwords - I have little to hide. Your wife is hiding something, so perhaps you have good reason. 

At least if she ends it, you will get to know for sure, rather than having to take her word for it.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

i cant stand the spying... i dont wanna have to live like this, but (like it or not) i just want some truth...and right now, this seems to b the only way to get it. its like a knife in my heart everytime i see her on her laptop...


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

the only problem i have with calling his wife, is that if she leaves him for it.....he'll b free to do what he wants....including my GF


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3-

You seem to be level headed, which gives you more options.


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## java (Jan 15, 2009)

Keep her so busy with you that she doesn't have time to step out.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

java said:


> Keep her so busy with you that she doesn't have time to step out.


so far, thats been the plan, including just trying to be the "better man"


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## humpty dumpty (Nov 26, 2008)

Go that extra mile in making things great between you. comunicate take her out and have fun
I think Dracs idea of phoning his wife is a good idea.. It might leave the door open for him but i doubt it


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

OMG wow I just cant believe that you wouldnt tell her you know. I think that you should tell her even if its not that you seen the email just tell her you know that there is someone else that you can tell in her actions. I think that alot of people dont know the damage until it gets in the open.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

sunflower said:


> OMG wow I just cant believe that you wouldnt tell her you know. I think that you should tell her even if its not that you seen the email just tell her you know that there is someone else that you can tell in her actions. I think that alot of people dont know the damage until it gets in the open.


from my perspective, as soon as i say to her that "i kno", without "showing her the proof", she'll just keep denying it and nothing will get resolved...

but i will say something if it goes too long...im just trying to "wait this out" as long as possible


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

You are a strong man really I would blow up! but you know your relationship do's and dont's so I am sure you know what you are doing!


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

sunflower said:


> You are a strong man really I would blow up! but you know your relationship do's and dont's so I am sure you know what you are doing!


i question myself everyday if i kno what i am doing... theres only 2 things i do kno....ive lost 15lbs so far....and i love her enough to try to survive this...


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

I did to I was 120 Pounds when I went through a makeout cheat I lost 10 pounds Ya it was sick but its all coming back now! Time is amazing for yourself really! you will see but you have to get the issue out not carry it on yourself. DONT DO THAT.


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## onlylonelyone (Jan 26, 2009)

I hope you two use protection, since you "KNOW" she is sleeping elsewhere. If you have to spy on anyone, Whats the point? Get rid of her, move on, find someone deserving of you. Yes, I would tell his wife for her benefit. You sound scared of losing her, which is sad, but I get the feeling you are going to stay if "she will have you". Good luck, you have a long long road ahead of you.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

onlylonelyone said:


> You sound scared of losing her, which is sad, but...


am i sad for still tryin to fix whats left of our relationship? or am i sad for "being an idiot for trying to fix this"?


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

I think every relationship deserves a try, so you are not an idiot however, I would send those emails to your account. Archieve your emails sent to you from her account and erase that you sent them.

draconis


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

but yeah...i admit it....im scared...i care enough still, to try


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

WELL THEN TELL HER YOU KNOW. Its not right that you are going to hide that and burden all of it. She should own up for her mistake.


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## onlylonelyone (Jan 26, 2009)

torn3 said:


> am i sad for still tryin to fix whats left of our relationship? or am i sad for "being an idiot for trying to fix this"?



No, not sad for trying. Until you confront her your only ignoring and waiting for her to change it. The real trying will come once she and you talk about it and decide together to stay together. I just got the feeling in your writing you are going to stay either way. It seems you are leaving it up to her and your just going along for the ride thats all. You sound like such a sweet guy I can't help feeling your settling for something less than you deserve. I know love is a strong emotion, but the fact is you still aren't married and for better or worse is marriage and then some. If you think she is cheating because of some depression issues you have had in the past how can she be there for the long haul? Her cheating is her problem, and her fault, she had a choice. Please don't blame yourself for something she did behind your back. Don't fall into that trap, and destroy your self esteem and self worth.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

sunflower said:


> OMG wow I just cant believe that you wouldnt tell her you know. I think that you should tell her even if its not that you seen the email just tell her you know that there is someone else that you can tell in her actions. I think that alot of people dont know the damage until it gets in the open.


He is not a "hot head". He is taking the time to decide what's best.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

first off...i really wanna thank everyone for their support! Im gonna try to say something to her this weekend, though i kno it will probably just kill our relationship. but i cant stand it anymore, she emailed him again yesterday tellin him she wants to get a Hotel room with him around their birthdays (next week) and how she misses holding him and kissing him. God, i cant beleive this is happening. 

Any suggestions on how i should approach her with this?


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

Your passive attitude is really troubling. It's like you are blaming yourself for the affair. You obviously have very low self esteem. You should confront her with your proof. But I would call the OMs wife first, anonymously. Let her know who he is having an affair with. Let her chew on his ass. She will keep him busy. You wanted an idea of how to tell her, here it is. *Wait a day or two for your gf to confess. Valentines day would actually be the perfect day to out her. Why? Because she will be emotional and sentimental. Buy her two dozen roses, really go all out Saturday. Send her to a day spa. Fix her a romantic dinner. Right her a card of how much you love her and that you would never want her to leave you. Then at the bottom of the writing before you write your name, in big black letters write "I KNOW EVERYTHING ABOUT YOU AND SO AND SO! I believe unless she is a cold bit*h, She will confess everything. Right now you are thinking like a doormat. If you don't respect yourself how will she ever respect you? I am not saying leave her, I am saying rock her world. If you love her you better start showing some passion about this.*


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

unfortunatly ive nvr been an overly aggressive individual, so yeah i guess i do have a low self esteem. (i guess i should find a forum for help with that too, huh? lol)


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

Initfortheduration said:


> Your passive attitude is really troubling. It's like you are blaming yourself for the affair. You obviously have very low self esteem. You should confront her with your proof. But I would call the OMs wife first, anonymously. Let her know who he is having an affair with....[/B]


thats a bold plan....i wish i could think like that more often. its just so confusing right now. but i guess theres no easy way to do this, is there? i love her soo much and dont want her to go but at the same time, why would i want a relationship with someone who wont stand by me....


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3-
Out of interest, what is the frequency of sex between you two at the moment?


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

draconis said:


> I think every relationship deserves a try, so you are not an idiot however, I would send those emails to your account. Archieve your emails sent to you from her account and erase that you sent them.
> 
> draconis


Drac...

Do you work for the CIA?


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

actually since i found out about all this 2 months ago... weve been having sex quite often, mostly at my behest, cause i figured that more sex was some of the attention she was lookin for and i thought maybe if we had more sex she wouldnt want to be with him anymore.
but one day right after we had sex... she emailed him to let him kno her "sex drive was back" and was lookin forward to seeing him again....so i guess more sex isnt going to help


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

i feel so torn...my head is tellin me to move on, but my heart is screaming for another chance to have what we lost


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

Btw Drac...i have pdf copies of all the emails....


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3 said:


> actually since i found out about all this 2 months ago... weve been having sex quite often, mostly at my behest,


Interesting. how was it before that. who initiated, how often etc...?


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

before that sex was rare...sometime she would initiate, sometimes me...but it was only happening roughly twice a month...mostly because of the depression i was dealing with, i just wasnt very in the mood....which is why i feel like i drove her to this


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

Is she responsive now?


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

yeah...


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

Torn, the only way to take your life back as I see it, is to out her. Think about that. Show her someone she has never seen. Assertive, confident, angry. Do the valentines day scenario. Get all her e-mails. If she tries to shift blame. Get up in her grill and tell her, "WTF do you think I'm stupid. Do you think I wouldn't know that the woman I love is screwing someone else"? Tell her you outed the man to his wife.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

OK, even more interesting. And is she being nicer than ever? are you getting on well, (considering)...


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

we've been doing fine these days...having sex, holding hands when we go out places, being cutsie with each other... but its been soo difficult to keep this up knowing what i kno. 

yesterday she came home on time, and about an hour later asked if it would b a distraction (i work from home these days and was working from the bed cause my back has been hurting) if she came in and masturbated next to me. I said it would, (with a sly smile) but i wouldnt mind if she did. so then she left the room, emailed her BF about how horny she was and how much she misses him....then after i finished workin i started kissing her and saying "lets Go" but she said she wasnt horny anymore....

That was one of the things that always bothered me... i love havin sex with her, we (did) have an awfull lot of fun, and it was a great time...but she always tried to "pick" the most in-opportune times for me, to want to have sex... then acts like my job is more important than sex with her. i only wanted her to wait 20 min....was that wrong???


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3 said:


> That was one of the things that always bothered me... i love havin sex with her, we (did) have an awfull lot of fun, and it was a great time...but she always tried to "pick" the most in-opportune times for me, to want to have sex... then acts like my job is more important than sex with her. i only wanted her to wait 20 min....was that wrong???


With some people you have to seize the moment. That's where you went wrong. Food don't keep warm without a lid on. Anyway, I think you are doing exactly the right thing at the moment. Play for time. Work on being a better BF and lover. 

I realise my view is not standard, but I am not the jealous type. It's not virtue, it's just how I was born. One thing to bear in mind is that she is getting a sexual kick out of sandwiching you - and you are presumably finding it "interesting".

What is this guy and his wife like. Do you know them?


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

i never met him or his wife, i just know that he works w/my gf, but since the plant is closing down, they passed a list throughout the company of names addresses and phone numbers of everyone there so ppl could have a list of references to use. thats how i got his addy and No#...


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

what do u mean by sandwiching?


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3 said:


> what do u mean by sandwiching?


A metaphor for alternating sex with you and him.

Are you familiar with quantum mechanics and in particular, Schrödinger's cat? and the collapse of the wave function? I feel another metaphor coming on...


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

im afraid my quantum mechanics skills are a little rusty lol


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3 said:


> im afraid my quantum mechanics skills are a little rusty lol


Are you familiar with the concepts?


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

lol...somewhat


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

Hey if you can't fix your relationships. You might as well ponder string theory.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

lmao


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

Cool 

In my warped mind, I see women as more quantum mechanical, and men as deterministic.

In a quantum mechanical system, you can have what is called a superposition of states. That means that several states are effectively in operation at the same time. Whereas a deterministic system can be in only one state at a time.

According to the Copenhagen Interpretation, when we decide to take a measurement of a quantum mechanical system, the wave function collapses to a finite state, and the system is forced to "choose" one of the superimposed states to crystallise into.

So in your example, your wife may entertain "states" or feelings of wanting to: love you, dislike you, like you, be bored by you, be interested in you, want to grow old with you, leave you next week. As well as cheat on you, not cheat on you, and who knows what else.

And all these states can quite happily coexist in a the female mind without so much as a hiccough!

However, if you come along and say, I've caught you in a lie - you're cheating... by effectively taking a measurement, you will force the wave function to collapse, and you will force her to give you one single answer. It could be:


I'm sorry, I will end the affair now.
You are so boring, I am done with you.
I'll think about it.
I need space.

So sometimes, it is better to let the experiment run, and observe "weakly". - Weak interactions are said to not disturb a quantum system to the point of collapse. Of course they will still have some effect. The fact that you know something and are keeping it secret from her is having a subtle effect already. But nowhere near as dramatic as would be the case if you confronted her with it.

See: Schrodinger's cat comes into view - physicsworld.com


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

Initfortheduration said:


> Hey if you can't fix your relationships. You might as well ponder string theory.


Only *Swedish* is clever enough to use string theory in this situation. My maths is not up to it  In any case, being Scandinavian, she would probably stick with the Copenhagen Interpretation


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

im not enjoying this at all...her masturbating is not new its one of the things we openly do in front of each other....she may be enjoying the deception, idk, but tearing her head off just wont solve the problem, id feel better , but it wouldnt b the right course of action...yet.


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## Mommybean (Jan 22, 2009)

Just a woman's opinion here, and I could be off base, because sometimes I think WAY outside the box...but it sounds like she is getting off on having a life she is assuming is secret from you. It does not necessarily sound like she has an emotional attachment to him, but she is gettting a big turn on from having sex with him, him knowing about you, and hiding the affair from you. 
Myself, I think I would have more respect for my partner if he confronted me from the get go, rather than let it play out. In her fantasy world, it could be that she is hoping you will find out and take control of the situation. Maybe she wants you to fight for her, and you sitting back will actually have the opposite effect of what you are hoping.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

thank you Mommy! thats just the kind of perspective i was looking for...i just hope its the right one....ive been thinking that way for a while but i was hoping i could get some sort of inclination out of her that that's what she wants, which is one of the reasons i was "sitting back" for a while. i am willing to fight for her, i just want to make sure im "fighting the right battle" (if that makes sense)


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

sonny...i can assure u....im only cool on the outside


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

Well I agree with sonny and mommybean, she is getting a kick out of this. That is what I meant by sandwich. 

But it is not all bad. All these aspects of human nature are within most people, it's just that not everybody gets to act them out.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

Sonny-

It would not be such a huge problem for me. I would not want it to go on for ever, but it could be...


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

none of this is easy Sonny, not for me and not for ppl tryin to give the right advice. i greatly appreciate all the efforts and support you have all been trying to offer


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

at this stage im going to combine the advice ive been givin...im gonna show her a great time on Saturday, and then after dinner, in the car, i will give her a Vday gift, and a card. a card that will end with "i kno whats going on" and take it from there.


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## Mommybean (Jan 22, 2009)

Good luck Torn3! 
I heard a phrase on the radio today that I really liked: "Intertia is the killer of dreams". 
From my viewpoint, you having the knowledge of what is going on and NOT acting on it, puts your life in a holding pattern. You can not move forward in your relationship (if thats how it works out) or in your own life as an individual. I commend you for trying to be level headed about it, but I also commend you for finally deciding to take some sort of action!


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3 said:


> at this stage im going to combine the advice ive been givin...im gonna show her a great time on Saturday, and then after dinner, in the car, i will give her a Vday gift, and a card. a card that will end with "i kno whats going on" and take it from there.


Did my quantum stuff make sense?


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

Mommybean said:


> ...but I also commend you for finally deciding to take some sort of action!


i have u guys to thank for that, im so sry i didnt find this site sooner, to kno that there are ppl out there that i can talk to. lol...im gettin a little emotional already...ive been feelin so alone in all this, and my mind has been runnin on its own about everything goin on.

i really cant thank u guys enough for giving me someone to work this out with...


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

MarkTwain said:


> Did my quantum stuff make sense?


lol...a little, its been a while since i watched "down the rabbit hole" but i got ur point.... http://talkaboutmarriage.com/images/smilies/smthumbup.gif


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

stupid smiley didnt work...lol


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

Well, just remember... if you confront her, you will "force" her to make judgement on the state of the relationship. And once she makes it, her behaviour will change instantly. Specially in the area of sex.

PS: I am sending you a PM.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

i have to do something, one thing i HAVE learned here, is that i cant keep feelin like this any more, its driving me insane. if she wants me and only me great. if she doesnt love/care/or feel anything for me anymore...then i need to kno that too... and only she can answer that...


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Yup I agree I like I said before its not your burden to carry and its not fair to you.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3 said:


> i have to do something, one thing i HAVE learned here, is that i cant keep feelin like this any more, its driving me insane. if she wants me and only me great. if she doesnt love/care/or feel anything for me anymore...then i need to kno that too... and only she can answer that...


You are asking the impossible.

She is clearly enjoying feeding several aspects of her personality. Right now she wants it all. That is not a judgement of her either. If you want her to come down on one side or the other before she is ready, there will be fallout. 

Perhaps you need to consider if you can handle *her*. My belief is that a lot of women have this side to them, but keep it repressed for moral/religious reasons.

If you give it more time, AND you work on yourself, she may just let him go all by herself. Once you press the "button" there will be no going back. I'm not saying don't press it, I'm just saying it is wired to something BIG!

There is just no way, things will carry on the same (but with the one difference that the affair is over). It will be more like a before and after the button was pressed experience.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

but wouldnt it make sense then, that if i did "press the button", that BOTH of us learn our lesson and make whatever changes are necessary?


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3 said:


> but wouldnt it make sense then, that if i did "press the button", that BOTH of us learn our lesson and make whatever changes are necessary?


Yes, that would be a wonderful outcome 
But the point I am making is that there are several possible outcomes, and it is hard to predict which way it will go.

Which way do you think it would go? Give me the scenario, and time-frame.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

SO WHAT are you saying Marktwain just hold it all in???? that makes no sense.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

thats just it...i love her completely, but if she really doesnt want me anymore, then theres not a whole lot i can do...the other side is that she is willing to give him up....either way ....for better or worse, at least i/we get what matters most

the truth


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

she'll be home in a few minutes....will chat with u all tomorrow morning.... good luck out there!


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3 said:


> , but if she really doesnt want me anymore, then theres not a whole lot i can do...


But she does want you... and him at the moment. But he is married. It's only a fling - in her mind it's "safe".


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

sunflower said:


> SO WHAT are you saying Marktwain just hold it all in???? that makes no sense.


No I'm saying that delicate situations need to be handled... _delicately_. Confronting her will have an instant effect, but we don't know what that will be. just because you don't like a situation does not mean you should start jumping up and down. You have the right to jump up and down, but a better result may be gotten be being slow to anger, and considering the possibilities.


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## Mommybean (Jan 22, 2009)

Obviously, he is not into the game she is playing. If he was, I would say no harm no foul between consenting adults. Him continuing to keep his feelings unknown will just allow more resentment to grow, and I don't see how that would work for ANYONE in the long run.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Ya I think that you should think about it and bring it out in a certain way but he for sure should say something. EVEN if he loves her with all his heart. You cant and shouldnt be with someone you love and they dont love you back thats not fair. you know what I mean. I just have been played the fool before and its so wrong. SOOOO WRONG.


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## Grace Kerina (Feb 10, 2009)

torn,

I think you are very courageous to have shared here with such honesty and willingness to listen. I'm new to the forums here, but am impressed with generous and kind flavour of the discussions and this one is no exception.

What strikes me the most after reading these six pages of conversation among you all is that there is a thread of panic running through your messages, torn, and I can't help but be reminded of the idea of differentiation - the ability to consider ourselves separate from others close to us, separate in the healthiest of ways. Stop me if I'm telling you something you already know, but this concept has always been able to cut through issues about how the closest people to me can affect me so strongly.

The idea, as I've understood it, is that by understanding the two of us as different I can more easily see how to "unhook" my own fuctioning from whatever they are doing. I can reconnect with my own opinions and my own core rather than adopting a view of myself that stems from their view of me. Even in as tough a situation as you are dealing with right now, I keep wanting to ask you what you can do to calm down to a place where you know you are whole and fine, no matter how this turns out. Being in THAT place allows you to step back and lead less from fear or overwhelm and more from taking care of yourself.

The thing is, you ARE strong, and whole, and loveable, no matter how this turns out.

I'm rooting for you.


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## Mommybean (Jan 22, 2009)

I don't necesarily think its that she does not love him anymore. She has happened upon a situation that she finds extremely alluring...she is having her cake and eating it too and probably enjoying the ellicit nature of the affair. However, it is a situation he is obviously not comfortable with, so they need to discuss it, and either end the affair, break up, or find a way to encorporate her fantasy life (which is what it seems like) into their relationship in a way that they can BOTH be comfortable with.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

If you read the whole thread, you will see that it might be over in two months anyway. In 10 years time, it might just seem like a blip on the radar screen.


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## Mommybean (Jan 22, 2009)

Thats assuming they make it 10 more years if he represses his feelings about this. And, who's to say she just won't find another one once this one is gone?


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

I agree mommybean he needs to stand up. not supress!!!


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

It is alluring for her. That's why he has to come down like a ton of bricks. Not yelling but angry and very hurt, yet in control. The Valentines day date is the perfect setting. I believe that like the romantic fantasy she is in, you bring her back down to earth with what real love is, commitment. First he shows how much he loves her. Then he shines the light on her actions. And just how crushed he is by her betrayal.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

On v-day? I dont know about that I guess I am just more out there then you guys when I find out I explode I cant contain any emotion. I guess thats why I am on here to try to cope and not do it with him. But really if he is afraid to lost her then he will do what he will do people do anything for love. She is lucky to have someone like you.


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

Sunflower it all about putting the image of his love in her head, and her treachery. The worst possible case is she will never have another Valentines day without thinking of what she did to the man who loves her.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

Initfortheduration said:


> Sunflower it all about putting the image of his love in her head, and her treachery


The best way for someone to arrive at remorse is by themselves. If you foist guilt on someone, it will not make them become more romantic by way of a "sorry". 

Your sense of fairness is commendable, but life is not fair. Not over the short term anyway.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

ok...so i revised mt plan a little...im still gonna show her the best day i can on v-day, but im going to wait till sunday to tell her what i kno. i cant keep this to myself anymore, irregardless of the repercussions. im still mulling over HOW im gonna tell her....and my brain is in overdrive thinking about all the different ways she'll respond. Mostly, i think im just going to say "look, I know whats going on" and leave it there, no "make a choice right now!" or "i demand this ends now!" because i know her nature.. she can be extremely spiteful about things. I'll just tell her i kno and leave it at that.

its ironic actually, 9 years ago, a year before we met, her husband walked out on her and her kids for another woman. i cant help but wonder if this is some sort of "justification" for her. 

Her last email to him mention finding a hotel room in the next week or so, taking the day off from work. i was thinking of waiting and seeing if she pays for it or gas or something like that while shes out there (he lives about an hour away). and using the bank records as proof...but i dont kno if i can hang that long. not to mention just the fact that i kno where she is and what shes doin would just eat me alive.

idk....


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

OK,

So how do you think it will play?
You tell her on Sunday...
She says?
You say?
And then what?

I don't want to influence your final decision. I only want to make you think harder in between.


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

torn3 said:


> ok...so i revised mt plan a little...im still gonna show her the best day i can on v-day, but im going to wait till sunday to tell her what i kno. i cant keep this to myself anymore, irregardless of the repercussions. im still mulling over HOW im gonna tell her....and my brain is in overdrive thinking about all the different ways she'll respond. Mostly, i think im just going to say "look, I know whats going on" and leave it there, no "make a choice right now!" or "i demand this ends now!" because i know her nature.. she can be extremely spiteful about things. I'll just tell her i kno and leave it at that.
> 
> its ironic actually, 9 years ago, a year before we met, her husband walked out on her and her kids for another woman. i cant help but wonder if this is some sort of "justification" for her.
> 
> ...


Alright, if you don't want to take that tact, how about showing her that fantastic valentines day. The next morning, look into her eyes while you are in bed, ask her if she liked her valentines day? When she responds she loved it. Ask her if she loved it enough to stop breaking your heart with the affair she is having? And that if she would please not go through with getting the hotel this week and crushing you further by screwing him again? Direct, strong, but not needy or clingy.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

Initfortheduration said:


> Alright, if you don't want to take that tact, how about showing her that fantastic valentines day. The next morning, look into her eyes while you are in bed, ask her if she liked her valentines day? When she responds she loved it. Ask her if she loved it enough to stop breaking your heart with the affair she is having? And that if she would please not go through with getting the hotel this week and crushing you further by screwing him again? Direct, strong, but not needy or clingy.


Initfortheduration-

There seems to be an element of wanting to "win" in this idea. With something as important as this, all ego has to be removed. Anything done, must be done with only the end result in mind, nothing more, nothing less.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

Initfortheduration: thats where i was heading, but im not going to mention the Hotel....that would tip my hat as to how i kno whats goin on...and that ive seen her emails....i dont want her to kno that. just so IF shes says she'lll stop, i can see for my self if its true. make no mistakes, i hate this spying thing with a passion, but it seems to be the best way to get the truth.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3 said:


> but im not going to mention the Hotel....that would tip my hat as to how i kno whats goin on...and that ive seen her emails....i dont want her to kno that.


How will you prove you know, without revealing the source?


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

when i tell her that i know, im just gonna say "i know about u and *****" and that "im not going to get into all the He said/ She said" "i just know. I didnt just pick HIS name out of a hat, I know" If it really becomes necessary, I'll tell her bout the emails, but only as an absolute last resort, if i cant divert the conversation from there. which i can, with getting into the whole thing about her ex-husband leavin her, and how much shes hurting me....etc... (lol...not in that order)


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3 said:


> when i tell her that i know, im just gonna say "i know about u and *****" and that "im not going to get into all the He said/ She said" "i just know. I didnt just pick HIS name out of a hat, I know"


At that point, the biggest thing on her mind will be: "how did he find out?". You had better have a strong alibi worked out


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

wont need an alibi...just strong resolve to keep my sources a secret...unfortunately...keeping a secret is something im getting good at....


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

I dont think that you need any explination of how you know. You just do. And I think that you should just say to her that you are not playing games that she can deny it all she wants but you know. And leave her to think about it and let her come to you. And just say you know I never thought that you would do this because of how hurt you were with the last relationship and what he did to you.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

thats pretty much how im gonna go about it. 

Question: If I have the right to say something, If I deserve to have my feelings known and if I care about us soo much to try to resolve this.... why am I so scared about telling her? 

wtf is happening to me?


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## Mommybean (Jan 22, 2009)

You're scared because you have no control over her reaction. The only reaction you can control is your own. Whatever outcome, good or bad, will effect both of your lives, and thats scary. Obviously, you love her and do not want her to leave, but it's a possibility and you cannot control that.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Ya your scared because you know that you could lose her its a risk when someone cheats and its harder when something comes to a end and its not your choice in ending it. Not saying it will end but you may be scared of it coming to that point.


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## king1199 (Feb 11, 2009)

Hello to everyone,

I just want to let torn3 know that I went thru the same thing with my wife, My story is more or less like yours, I’ve been marry for 11 years now, have 2 beautiful kids and I thought everything was just fine and dandy.

Last year I went thru a 5 month depressing time, that I took it on her and the kids, Not physically but emotionally. For the past 2 years I did not behave like a husband or a father so I think my situation was coming from all this. Last year I left to work over seas, when she met this guy from work, when I found out that she was seeing somebody else (her friend told me) I could not hold it in, as soon her friend told me I called my wife and ask her about it. My wife reaction was shocking and how? I told her everything I knew. My wife was honest and told me why she did it and what her and the dude had, according to her, she just needed that person to listen to her and make her feel good, because of the situation we was going thru. She said it was only sex and talk. I felt the same way you did, I love my wife so much and I was willing to put everything in the past.

My advice to you is:

1.	I would tell her, God bless the guys that can hold it for so long and try to spy on them, I remember when her friend told me, the first thing she said to me was “don’t tell her and come home and catch her in the act” and I remember telling her that I could not wait that long. So if you can tell her now I would.

2.	If you do love her, stick by her, Talk to her, see what she has to say. In my case it was hard, my wife is a under the rug sweeper, it’s hard to communicate with her. I wish I had a person to sit down with and tell me what going on. So if you tell her and she’s welling to talk to you and she tells you why, that’s a good start.

3.	Depending on what she says, it’s going to be your actions. If you think she is telling you the truth and she is sorry them move on with your lives. Me and my wife are going to start counseling, that could be something to think about. Or if she seem like she does not love you anymore you should start getting ready to move on with your life, I know it’s not easy but that is life, so get use to it.

I know what you are going thru, it’s hard to find out that the person you love it’s with somebody else, but like I stated on top, that’s life, there is nothing we can do about it. Another thing I wasn’t good at was, giving her time. After everything it’s said and done, just give her time alone. If she feel sorry she will come to you. There is a quote by Kahlil Gibran that says “If you love somebody, let them go, for if they return, they were always yours. And if they don't, they never were. So give her time to get her self together, to think if she want to be with you or the other dude.


I hope everything works out for you God bless you, and stay strong…. If she wasn’t the one, you can find somebody better. There is so much fish in the sea.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

OMG I feel better reading that people deal with this all the time but then I dont its so sad to see that so many people struggle every single day with things like this. I HATE IT. There is no true love story no true romance Cinderella and beauty and the beast all the childrens love storys need to be re wrote and into reality! lol


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## king1199 (Feb 11, 2009)

I'm trying to make mine a true love story, a true romance Cinderella and beauty and the beast. I hope to stay in this marriage untill i'm 94 years old. If i could make it that long.
We been thru so much in our 11 years that if we can make it thru this, we are going to have a happy ending..


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

Gees mark, I present one way, you don't like. Change it and you still don't like it. I am just coming up with ideas here. I actually like the second one better. The win is affecting her enough to change her behavior. The whole point is to shock her. Especially after doing a wonderful valentines day. Torn has already said she can be extremely spiteful. He has to work on her inside. And he must be uncharacteristically strong. He needs to look in her eyes and tell her, and not look away. If it doesn't work then its follow them to the hotel. It doesn't matter that this guy is moving away. If she thinks she can get away with it, she could start up with someone else. He needs a GPS for her car and VAR so he can monitor her conversations. You may hate spying, but you are already doing it. Since you are, you might as well go all the way.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

Initfortheduration said:


> He has to work on her inside. And he must be *uncharacteristically *strong. He *needs *to look in her eyes and tell her, and not look away. If it doesn't work then its follow them to the hotel. It doesn't matter that this guy is moving away. If she thinks she can get away with it, she could start up with someone else. He *needs *a GPS for her car and VAR so he can monitor her conversations. You may hate spying, but you are already doing it. Since you are, you might as well go all the way.


(Emphasis mine)

He does not *need* to do anything. You talk like this is a game of chess. Women can outplay men every time at this particular game. It's impossible to make any predictions about the outcome. That's why I'm suggesting that gathering more information is as good as acting. 

The fact of the affair makes little difference. A lot of people have a desire to cheat built into their nature, and it's just a matter of time before the right trigger brings it out. According to the article on this site 60% of men/40% of women will cheat at some point. That equals 50% of all couples at a minimum, if the ven setts overlap, and up to 100% if they don't: http://talkaboutmarriage.com/articles/993-sex-lies-secrets-secrecy-destroying-your-marriage.html 

So I'm going with... 70% of all marriages will probably experience an affair. On that basis, if you decide that you simply can't live with a cheater, there is only a small pool of "good guys" to choose from.


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

I guess on certain aspects we will have to disagree. But it is his wife being plowed. And he will have to make the decision of confrontation based on what he can take. I know I could not take just intelligences gathering. But I was always more emotional then logical. So regarding string theory, my string is very short (other appendages are at least average).


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

YUP its sad and thats why I said that there is no fairy tale NONE. There is no such thing as the perfect marriage!


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

Hi torn3,

I've been away for a few days and notice you've received quite a few varied opinions on what do to here...my favorite type of thread because in the end it will be up to you, you know her best, but the more to think about the better prepared you will feel.

I've been in a similar situation and confronted my husband the same evening. I had a feeling something was going on for a few weeks, but had no idea the extent to what it was so I decided to confront it sooner rather than later. It was a good choice in the end because it hadn't developed into a full sexual affair at that point, but was on it's way.

I was physically shaking the entire day and much of it is related to the thought of the relationship ending is one possible outcome. What I did was asked if we could sit down and talk and just told him what I found. I asked that he please respect me enough to be honest with me and that the thoughts in my head could not possibly be worse than anything he could tell me. I also understood he was caught off guard so I was very patient and calm in talking and let things unfold in a way that he did not feel attacked, as that was not my intention. I really wanted to know what he wanted and also let him know that an open marriage wasn't something I would entertain. In the end, the most difficult part of the conversation was knowing I loved him enough to let him go if that's what he needed to be happy.

Much about that conversation is fuzzy at this point, but one thing will never leave my mind...There are very few times I have broken down and cried. He could see the tears in my eyes and the hurt and he has always been very gentle and sweet and he said almost in a laughing/shouting way "YOU CARE!" I think this stung more than any words I've ever heard because I've always cared, but it opened my eyes in a big way. He didn't see it. I was hiding behind my wall of protection to avoid getting hurt, but it was a self-fulfilling prophecy...it made me seem cold, uncaring.

Once we both talked and fortunately both decided we wanted our marriage to work, my big issue was trust and he has been very understanding of my feelings. That has allowed me to rebuild my trust in him and we also became much closer. Talking, dating, sex life...all better than ever before and we both smile a lot now 

So yes, mine was a happy ending, but I knew this could go either way. The only thing I kept telling myself was that I would not be Plan B or sharing my husband or anything that would keep me feeling horrible about my marriage but would commit fully to the marriage if he wanted to work things out.


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## Mommybean (Jan 22, 2009)

Sunflower, how would you think there COULD be such a thing as a "perfect" marriage, when humans are so very far from perfect to begin with? If someone goes into a marriage thinking its going to be perfect, or a "fairy tale"; they are setting themselves up for failure. Fairy tales are just that---they are tales...made up stories we grow up with, because kids have so VERY little time to retain their innocence before they get a a reality check. 
A marriage takes work. My marriage has been full of its ups and downs, but (especially since coming to this site) I have come to realize that if I choose to focus on the things my H has done wrong in the past, we will never grow past that. So, I have made a conscious decision to let the hurt I felt from his straying go....it's definitely not HELPING me to keep it hanging around. I chose to stay, he chose to stay, and while our marriage will still go thru its ups and downs, I have to trust he will not betray me in that way again. 
Torn and his wife will come to their own conclusion when her behavior comes to light. Either avenue it takes, they are in for some ups and downs,but i'm sure we will all be here for him no matter what the road they travel....


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Mommybean, 

I am not sure where I got this whole image in my head of what love is and what marriage is. And how I could be so selfish to think that he would never think of anyone but ME. I hate that and I hate the people who rub in my face that we look like losers or that they are better cause there husbands would NEVER. I have some pride issues sorry. BUT anyways. we are still young 26 and 27 got married at 22 and 23. baby at 21! its been a ride but I am not throwing in the towel. but you are right there is no such thing as a perfect person.


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

sunflower said:


> And how I could be so selfish to think that he would never think of anyone but ME. I hate that and I hate the people who rub in my face that we look like losers or that they are better cause there husbands would NEVER.


That is more of a personal issue (worrying about what other's think). I have been in the same spot as you with my husband and can smile knowing we have weathered that storm and made our marriage stronger...but I surround myself with people that want me to be happy...and we learn from one another...it's not a competition.

By the way Torn is handling his situation, he already knows that relationships aren't cookie cutter perfect, it's just figuring out how to get through these situations with a happy/strong relationship on the other end. It's hard when you are blind-sided to think clearly and know the right thing to do, which can vary from one couple to the next. Hopefully, this thread will help him sort that out.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Ya for sure I think that torn is more together with this and has his thoughts more together then most everyone I know in a situation like this. Its so hard. And I know its going to be hard and scary but I think that he will do great and he made the right choice by wanting to tell her and not keep it all in. THATS SO BAD FOR YOU.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

well i have decided to postpone telling her till next week, after her birthday (on the 17th) but i wont be keeping this in past that... i just want to be sure she knows that im making such a big deal out of Vday and her Bday, because i love her, Not becuase im trying to compete with anyone else....make sense?


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

be back tomorrow morning...she'lll be home soon


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## humpty dumpty (Nov 26, 2008)

yes it makes sence !!
People on here can only guide you , you know your wife more then any of us and only you can make the decision on what to do next.
I know how much your hurting inside, good luck


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

Well there probably wont be a lot of updates for now....she sees him everyday at work, so their not really doin any emailing to each other. Though after the middle of March when the plant closes, im sure they will pick up again. If things dont change after we talk.

I just dont understand the unwillingness of soo many ppl, to communicate with their spouses. I cant figure out why its so difficult to express feelings to the "one you love so much". It should be a no-brainer, if your not happy about something in a relationship, what could possibly be a reason not to discuss it? Im not necessarily talking about the situation im in, but even the simple stuff, the small things, that everyone considers to be sooo important in the long run. It just behooves me that we as a race have become so horrified to make any kind of statement, even to the ppl we SHOULD be able to say anything to. Isn't that the original point of a relationship? Someone we can confide in? To share things with? As a Realist, I cant fathom the point of being so closed minded to those around us. I know that the monogamy of the 40's and 50's has been dead for some time now, but we're losing our ability to make the simplest of statements now? Holding on to them like secrets, only to cry/whine/moan about them to other ppl, instead of who we should truly be discussing it with?

sry, a little moody today... lol. just needed a little vent...


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

I think there are a myriad of reasons people keep things to themselves within a marriage and many times it's because they worry about the reaction if they open up:


Spouse will get upset but nothing will change
Fear of spouses reaction (ie if they have a temper)
Trying to be understanding/strong if spouse is depressive
Fear of the relationship ending
Feeling guilty if they sweat the small stuff

Some of these may be in play right now for you in not talking to your wife yet...fear of the outcome & losing control of knowing what's going on...but there will be a sense of relief once you have that talk...and anxious times to follow if you decide to work on your marriage as she will need to regain your trust in her.

I hope that once this all comes out, if she still says she wants to be with you as she did recently, that she will be willing to end all contact with TOM and give you open access to her phone, email, whereabouts, etc. so you aren't constantly worrying if something's still going on.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

torn3 said:


> I just dont understand the unwillingness of soo many ppl, to communicate with their spouses. I cant figure out why its so difficult to express feelings to the "one you love so much". It should be a no-brainer, if your not happy about something in a relationship, what could possibly be a reason not to discuss it?


I tell my wife the instant I am not happy about something, whether she wants to discuss it or not! However, I have gradually got better at finding ways to express myself that are less incendiary than before. However, I sometimes blurt it out, and it can cause the odd firework. So what? I told her the other day that I enjoyed our last argument.

On face value, it looks like there was stuff going on "under the hood" that you guys were juts ignoring. However, working with other men where you are not present represents opportunity. And opportunity and feeling horny can go together to create havoc. This scenario has played out in many a marriage where there was no underlying problem to speak of. It's what's known as temptation.

In your case I think it was a bit of both. 

For me, what's sad is the deception angle. But everyone has their dark side. When it's under control it makes a person stronger. And when it's not, it creates chaos.


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## humpty dumpty (Nov 26, 2008)

I hold back things from my hubbie mainly because he works so hard and is stressed with running his buisness.
To be honest i vent to my friends because we know it goes no futher we all have a girly chat and its finished with.
I think the problems come when little things build up into big things because of the lack of communicating.
Dont get me wrong if i was really bothered about something i would tell him even if it meant a argument , but whilst he is so stressed i dont think its fair to burden him with my day to day borring vents !!


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

The truth is none of us know how she will take confrontation. I'd use VD as a way to show her his love, but then to blow the secret wide open. This week after VD day, she will make her arrangements and before to screw this guy again. Maybe on her birthday. What kind of carnage do you think this will leave? I am still for doing the morning after outing. Tell her how much you love her and what this is doing to you. If you need to expose the e-mails, do it. Tell her that a man deeply in love with his wife knows when she is being unfaithful. Tell her you already knew and that the e-mails were only printed to show you if you denied it. She may just breakdown. If it is only a sex thing and not an EA as well. As I have said, there is no guarantee here except for the fact that she will continue to destroy her marriage without a light being shined on it. This is dedicated to you torn.

YouTube - Torn by Johan Lippowitz with Natalie Imbruglia


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

humpty dumpty said:


> I hold back things from my hubbie mainly because he works so hard and is stressed with running his buisness.
> To be honest i vent to my friends because we know it goes no futher we all have a girly chat and its finished with.


I would hate to think that my wife was going behind my back and complaining to others who could not fix things, but only meddle with the situation. I don't mind her venting to her friends, *after *she finds she gets nowhere with telling me first.

However, I would be a fool to let things get that far out of hand. 

On the other side I would feel to ashamed to admit to others that I could not cope with some aspect of my wife's behaviour. Dissing one's spouse is tantamount to putting oneself down. I have zero respect for people who endlessly run down their spouse behind his or her back. It's different when people come to this forum for advice. I'm talking here about gossip and nastiness with no intention to resolve anything. I can count on two fingers the amount of times I've had a rant to someone else about her in 20 years. 

But we argued like cat and dog at one point. All our grievances were aired internally.


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## humpty dumpty (Nov 26, 2008)

MarkTwain said:


> I would hate to think that my wife was going behind my back and complaining to others who could not fix things, but only meddle with the situation. I don't mind her venting to her friends, *after *she finds she gets nowhere with telling me first.
> 
> However, I would be a fool to let things get that far out of hand.
> 
> ...



:iagree:
I dont and i have never put my husband down to my friends ..they all know how much i love him , i would never go out of my way to hurt him , Most woman have girly chats and they are harmless i would never put my marriage at risk. Just sometimes its easier to vent frustrations on situations with friends and get a different view on things .


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

humpty dumpty said:


> Just sometimes its easier to vent frustrations on situations with friends and get a different view on things .


I was in no way slamming you by the way. How could I when you are wearing such a cute hat! 

We are quite private people, I hardly even talk about us on _here_, even though it's anonymous (or at least it was until I put up that pic in my avatar). I would hate to think of others knowing about my faults before I do


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## humpty dumpty (Nov 26, 2008)

Everyone has there own way of venting !! 
Im the first to admit ive loads of faults !!!! lucky for me my hubbie loves most of them  im working on the others .


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

Hey, no hijacking the thread please. Open a new one.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

Initfortheduration said:


> Hey, no hijacking the thread please. Open a new one.


I feel we are still on topic. We are discussing the difference between taking your grievances to your spouse, and telling everyone *but *your spouse. 

I feel there may have been an element of that going on with *torn3*. except that in his case there was more than just, ahem... talking.


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## onlylonelyone (Jan 26, 2009)

humpty dumpty said:


> I hold back things from my hubbie mainly because he works so hard and is stressed with running his buisness.
> To be honest i vent to my friends because we know it goes no futher we all have a girly chat and its finished with.
> I think the problems come when little things build up into big things because of the lack of communicating.
> Dont get me wrong if i was really bothered about something i would tell him even if it meant a argument , but whilst he is so stressed i dont think its fair to burden him with my day to day borring vents !!


I agree with you on this. That is exactly how I deal with things as well. My hubby owns his own business too, so I know what you mean...My hubby never complains about anything, you would never know anything was worrying him. He is a sweet husband but I wish he would burden me so it wasn't all on him all the time. There are many reasons a spouse doesn't confide in the other, and then I think it becomes a really bad habit and then here you are one day with nothing to say....So Torn has a good point, a really good point.


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

The topic is torns relationship confrontation of his wife. You are stretching your string way to far here Mark.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Well bottom line he should tell her she needs to know regardless that he knows. He shouldnt hold something like that inside it hurts him more then her. And if she leaves him then it wasnt ment to be. Its bs that you guys are arguing over him telling her that SHE is cheating on him wth he has done nothing wrong she has.


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## humpty dumpty (Nov 26, 2008)

He needs to tell her he knows i agree hes only getting more hurt everyday by holding on.. at least is he told her he could start to try to save his relationship.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Exactly!!!


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## humpty dumpty (Nov 26, 2008)

then saying that if it was my husband and i thought i could work through and save my marriage with out telling him i knew !! im not sure if i would tell ...

Its the whole picture of them leaving there place of work ..will they stay in contact? i suppose time will tell.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

humpty dumpty said:


> then saying that if it was my husband and i thought i could work through and save my marriage with out telling him i knew !! im not sure if i would tell ...


At last, someone who can at least entertain my point of view


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Ok why would you stay with someone that you cant tell them you know THEY are cheating? Makes no sense to me even if you do love them that much if you are scared to tell them because they will leave you wow. no way.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

sunflower-
TOM is moving away in 4 or 5 weeks, so chances are it's going to peter out all by itself. It's all about getting the job done in the most efficient way. Also, by giving her enough rope, he can see how honourably she behaves, and whether she is worth hanging on to. They are not married and have no kids.

Plus... PLUS for some people the is something outrageously delicious about knowing something secret and seeing what the other person will do on their own without any prompting. He can also work on being so attractive and desirable that it never happens again.

Or he could just leave. Once he presses the "I know" button, his choices will diminish, and he will be waiting for her to make the next move, right now he has the power...


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## humpty dumpty (Nov 26, 2008)

sunflower said:


> Ok why would you stay with someone that you cant tell them you know THEY are cheating? Makes no sense to me even if you do love them that much if you are scared to tell them because they will leave you wow. no way.


It wouldnt be because i was scared they would leave , it would be to save my marriage and if it meant keeping things to myself until i had a bigger picture then its exactly what i would do.
Loads of marriages survive affairs id just want to get everything i possible could together before i desided what to do ..if that meant checking emails etc id do it..


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Ya well I would also want the affair to end not continue and keep it to myself.


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## humpty dumpty (Nov 26, 2008)

of course i would want the affair to end ...but id like to know what i was up against first and if that meant watching and waiting then id watch and wait


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Ya ok so you gather your proof and say k here you go what are you doing what do you want. I am not your second choice I am your spouse this isnt a open marriage this is about you and me.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

Well, I did it. i told her last night that i knew she was having an affair. i didnt tell her how i knew, or that i knew who he was. (it actually just didnt come up). she thinks that someone told me...which is fine for now. shes pissed as hell that i wont tell her how i know. but that doesnt bother me, what gets me is that there was no "denial", no tears, (on her part anyway  ). she said she was soo sorry and didnt want to hurt me and all that other stuff. 

All i really asked her was "what are your intentions ..." and she said she "didnt kno". but she did say that she wants me to stay. i didnt see her this morning before she left (for work i hope) so i'll have to wait for her to get home to see where we go from here.

its funny....i feel better and worse at the same time for finally saying something.

i'll b back....


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

torn3 said:


> All i really asked her was "what are your intentions ..." and she said she "didnt kno". but she did say that she wants me to stay. i didnt see her this morning before she left (for work i hope) so i'll have to wait for her to get home to see where we go from here.


No tears? No mascara and snot running confession. Well torn, what would trouble me as much as the affair is the fact that there is no contrition. She is sorry she hurt you? How about being sorry you screwed the guy.

In regards to leaving. The majority of the time they don't want you to leave. They want you to stay and they want to keep screwing the other guy too. You asked her what she wants to do. Why? Are you OK letting her decide how this ends for you? Like I said. What she wants is for you to stay. Pay the bills, have sex with her when she wants it. And she wants to screw the other guy too. How's that? 

In fact, why don't you ask her how that sounds to her? This way she can be happy and get everything she wants. Don't know how that's gonna work for you though. 

This is not a negotiation (if you want to keep your relationship and your sanity). This is you stop seeing him or get your ass out. But if you go back to your very first post and read it. You are virtually apologizing for her screwing some other guy. Now you ask her what she wants. I think its more important to find out what you want. Because if you don't man up the decision is going to made for you . She doesn't respect you. She may love you now, but it won't be for long. Well if your relationship isn't important enough to you to set boundaries in it. You should research the history on line here and at other sites, how successful a milquetoast response like yours goes over with cheating spouses. But its your life.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

Initfortheduration said:


> This is not a negotiation (if you want to keep your relationship and your sanity). This is you stop seeing him or get your ass out. But if you go back to your very first post and read it. You are virtually apologizing for her screwing some other guy. Now you ask her what she wants. I think its more important to find out what you want. Because if you don't man up the decision is going to made for you . She doesn't respect you. She may love you now, but it won't be for long. Well if your relationship isn't important enough to you to set boundaries in it. You should research the history on line here and at other sites, how successful a milquetoast response like yours goes over with cheating spouses. But its your life.


In:
on the contrary... this IS a negotiation. Making a demand always gets a spitefull or hasty response. I AM half responsible for her seeking comfort in another mans arms, because i wasnt there for her like i should have been. does that make her right for what she did? no. am i the only one at fault? no. 

But just like it takes 2 to create a relationship, it takes 2 to break it. Ppl who cheat on their spouses for no real reason at all, are very rare. Im tired of ppl thinking their relationships are one way streets, that the "dumpee" is just a hapless victim. that kind of thinking is just egotistical garbage. one person cheats on the other because the other either: stopped paying attention to them, or takes them for granted, etc, etc. no-one is completely innocent. 

a relationship is a team effort, period. you work on it together or you dont. does she respect me right now...obviously not. but i dont respect her right now either. but that doesnt mean it cant be re-built just like trust can. asking her what she wants to do isnt a milktoast response. she IS the one that has to decide if she wants to continue with me, trying to force her is just arrogant. She know how i feel about her, now she needs to find out for herself how she feels about "US". Telling her "leave him or get out is just stupid", thats just a way of forcing an easy way out for her. if shes cares about our relationship, then TOGETHER we can work on it. If not , then so be it.

I am not blind. i know there is a lot of work ahead for both of us, and i am keeping an eye on her for now. if she proves to me that she wants us to be together, i'll know. if not i'll know that too. but dont try to tell me that these things cant be worked out. ive been on both sides of this over and over. ive been the dumped and the dumpee. 

My reading in this forum has proven, these things can work out for the better. But being irrationally negative about the whole thing is pointless.

It always takes 2...


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## martino (May 12, 2008)

Torn,

I like your reply here and have been following your thread. It would bother me that she didn't cry over hurting you. Either way you have a great mind set. I admire that.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

ty....


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

She is a cheater and a cake eater. She will eat cake as long as you allow her to. So, can you point out those relationships on this board or others where your negotiation idea has worked? I would love to read them. In fact lets start a thread to ask how successful that method is.


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## martino (May 12, 2008)

Infor you are right, torn is taking the high road and handling this with class, I admire that because I would probably go off. However Torn, don't let her throw blame on you...there still is no valid excuse other than her own selfish reasons.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

mommy22 said:


> It's tough to say what's going on in her head right now. It does bug me that she shows no outward signs of remorse. Did she show signs of shock? Was she speechless in the least? Did you get the impression that your knowledge of the affair had completely registered with her?


there was no denial, but yeah, when i finally spit it out that i knew, she was stuttering! her eyes got wide and she couldnt even look at me. it definitely registered, and was def. in shock that i knew.

and yeah, im gonna let her stew about not knowing how i found out for a long time....


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## martino (May 12, 2008)

If you tell her at all you for sure won't know next time. Tell her you hired a private eye.


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## MsStacy (Nov 11, 2008)

:iagree:


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## bikergasman (Feb 25, 2009)

Thats what I thought, I am in exactly the same position. However, through a great deal of talking, I have discovered that I am not "alpha" enough for my wife. She wants someone to control her, to take care of her. 
I am not criticising, but you seem to be the same. You were fearfull that exposing the affair will expose your marriage to strains that would break it. You are insecure in your marriage. 
Trust me in that IF you are going to save your marriage you need to take control. Do you think that just becuase you have exposed the affair that it is going to stop?
She will come out with the lines, something like "I am confused, I needed to know where I wanted to be" or "It was just that you were so distant / did not communicate/ it was partly your fault".
Even if it does stop, she will go through a grieving process for the affair, which she will blame you for.
If you are to save your marriage, take on a more dominant role. I don't mean shout at her, or hit her or anything like that. Make her feel as though she is SAFE with you, that you are in charge of YOUR life.
The rules have to be that she breaks of all contact with him, that she focuses on YOUR relationship, and agree to do fun things together with her.
The hardest part is forgiving. You may think thats easy now, but there will be certain things said or done that will bring it up. No recriminations or sarcastic tones, it won't help.
Tell her how you found out, start the new relationship on a firm, honest footing.
And when you think that the anguish and pain about her affair is going to break you, don't let it show. Kiss her on the cheek and tell her she is beautiful. Her guilt can break the marriage too.
It's going to be a long, hard road. I wish you well along the way


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## king1199 (Feb 11, 2009)

I agree 100% with bikergasman, I'm going thru the same situation and i thought it will be easy but it’s not, If you want to save your marriage you have to start from the beginning, It’s going to be a new relationship. 
With my wife I told her who told me, I wanted to be honest. I did not want to start playing he said/she said games. I’ve been with my wife 11 years and this is the first time she did this to me, I’m sure. And I do take the blame for it. In the last 2 years I was in my own world, and in the last year I decided to go work over seas when I did not need to. I know where I F**K up and I know what I have to do to make that up, if I’m not too late. In my case I think it’s worth saving the marriage, I know it’s going to be hard, but I want to give it a try. If it doesn’t work, a least I tried. 
I think torn has to think about this, if she it’s worth it, dude stay there, if she it’s not, Say Adios and move on. I know I’m sticking around, If I could get my old wife back then I’m happy. If she made up her mind on what she want and that choice it’s not me, then I know what to do “Move On”


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## COFLgirl (Oct 9, 2008)

king1199 said:


> And I do take the blame for it. In the last 2 years I was in my own world, and in the last year I decided to go work over seas when I did not need to. I know where I F**K up and I know what I have to do to make that up, if I’m not too late. In my case I think it’s worth saving the marriage, I know it’s going to be hard, but I want to give it a try. If it doesn’t work, a least I tried.


king1199

As someone who has also been there in this type of situation, I don't think you should take the blame for it, as least not 100%. No matter what you did (aside from being unfaithful yourself and even THAT is debatable, depending on who you ask), you didn't deserve to have an unfaithful spouse. IMO, if a partner in a marriage is so unhappy that they are going to cheat, they should either try to fix the marriage first, talk to their spouse, or simply leave and divorce. 

I am really curious why you say it is your fault because you decided to take a job overseas. Did you talk to your wife about it first or did you just decide to take the job? Do you think this directly contributed to her cheating?


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## DB in PA (Feb 25, 2009)

Do not confront her unless your motives are clear and thought out. Ask "do i want to win her back, and if so, will I ever trust her again?" or if you do confront her, she will see and turn it into your lack of trust by reading her e mails and then you loose anyway. 

I understand!!


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## king1199 (Feb 11, 2009)

COFLgirl said:


> king1199
> 
> As someone who has also been there in this type of situation, I don't think you should take the blame for it, as least not 100%. No matter what you did (aside from being unfaithful yourself and even THAT is debatable, depending on who you ask), you didn't deserve to have an unfaithful spouse. IMO, if a partner in a marriage is so unhappy that they are going to cheat, they should either try to fix the marriage first, talk to their spouse, or simply leave and divorce.
> 
> I am really curious why you say it is your fault because you decided to take a job overseas. Did you talk to your wife about it first or did you just decide to take the job? Do you think this directly contributed to her cheating?


In my case, there is a lot of thing that build up to this: 
1.	I was not the best romantic person in the world.
2.	I cheated twice before and she found out.
3.	I was depressed 5 months before I took the job.
4.	Yea I took the job and did not sit down with her and came to a agreement. 
5.	And me been away for 1 year and not been around.
I know I don’t take 100% blame, she has some to. But the bottom line is that now I know how I was and I realize what I had at home, and what I have to do to make this better, there’s a quote “You don’t know what you have until you lose it”. 
I haven’t yet, I know I’m close to, but I’m going to work hard to save this marriage


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## kate_spencer (Feb 20, 2009)

torn3 said:


> i found out through her email that she was having an affair with a co-worker. At one point i feel like this is my fault, i was dealing with a "depressive" state for a while and became distant from her. on the other hand she made no real attempt to tell me how she was feeling at any time, so i wasnt aware how bad things were getting.
> 
> i dont kno what to do now, it seems looking at her email has been the only way to get the truth from her, so if i tell her i kno about the affair, i might not find out if it really ends. And, of course she gets phone calls on her cell, some of them right in front of me, but the conversation is limited.
> 
> ...



Hi torn3,
I tried to follow the thread, but it's too long.. I stopped on the 5th.. :scratchhead:

Anyway, I agree with what they were suggesting.. let her know that you know what she's doing.. though it may lead your relationship to break up, which is what you're trying to avoid. Because I think if you'll just let her do that all the time.. you may lose your head and your respect to yourself. Talk to her about it and tell her that you're willing to change and fix everything and to hopefully work it out. 
I hope everything get better soon.. good luck!


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## martino (May 12, 2008)

Damn it quit beating yourselves up. Whatever your mistakes were, your spouses need to come up and say these things are bothering me...not start an affair. There's no excuse for it period.


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## torn3 (Feb 9, 2009)

we talked over the weekend.... she told me everything, at least i guess she did and apologized for her indiscretions (which i believe judging from the look on her face).

im not saying that i believe all of what we talked about, but the bottom line is i will keep an eye on things...

and we are staying together and going to try to put our lives back together...

this time, at least for now... everything is going to work out!

ty one and all for ur support!


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## king1199 (Feb 11, 2009)

Good luck, God bless you both.


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## sunflower (Dec 15, 2008)

Good luck! I know we all deal with things in our lives its hard and I hope that you guys will pull through it!


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## kate_spencer (Feb 20, 2009)

well, that's good to hear torn! 
my best of luck for both of you.


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## king1199 (Feb 11, 2009)

torn3? Please keep up posted with your situation. How is things at home?


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