# So Now we have Another to Contend With: Instagram!!



## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

Just read the press release late yesterday about how Instagram has now added the private message capability to their applications. Isn't it bad enough that there are several others that allow the hidden and secret exchange of information without making yet another member of that club?

Who else is tired of this enablement, as it seems every application out there is trying to top the social media ladder and the only way that they know how is to create new and hidden features that allow for the secretive interaction of people. It is getting to the point where they will all have it and there'll be no possibility of full transparency and monitoring.

I know it is in bad taste, and I really shouldn't which it upon anyone, but I almost wish that the spouses of some of these CEO's for these companies would get cheated on through the use of their applications and then maybe they would find some sort of social responsibility to not build and foster an environment that seems to promote those activities.

What's other's take on this recent development/ change?


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## How am I Going to Surviv (Sep 12, 2013)

My take:

Those inclined to engage in an activity will find a way to do so - with or without enabling technology. Much as you shouldn't blame matches for the arsonist's crime, you shouldn't blame Instagram, Facebook or even A.M. for a wayward's choices.

The availability of technology is NOT the cause. It may make the activity more efficient but it will not make it more likely. The world has always been and will always be full of temptations, excuses and bad decisions. 

I try to place the blame where it belongs: on an individual's decisions.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Yes, let's roll back the clock! Ban electricity, too. Electricity eliminated much of the time needed to accomplish housework, providing more time for women to pursue other men and read romance novels. Take away the telephone, too! Obviously that's a tool of Satan. May as well eliminate automobiles - especially with back seats - as they make meeting a lover so much faster!


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## Philat (Sep 12, 2013)

How am I Going to Surviv said:


> My take:
> 
> Those inclined to engage in an activity will find a way to do so - with or without enabling technology. Much as you shouldn't blame matches for the arsonist's crime, you shouldn't blame Instagram, Facebook or even A.M. for a wayward's choices.
> 
> ...


I agree with this in general, but I also take OP's point: many of these apps seem deliberately targeted to meet a user demand for stealth (secrecy) as opposed to privacy (just look at the advertising that touts ways to circumvent "prying girlfriends" etc.). This can be interpreted, IMO, as not simply the inevitable march of technology but the deliberate application of technology for nefarious purposes.


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## littlesweetling (Feb 16, 2013)

How am I Going to Surviv said:


> My take:
> 
> Those inclined to engage in an activity will find a way to do so - with or without enabling technology. Much as you shouldn't blame matches for the arsonist's crime, you shouldn't blame Instagram, Facebook or even A.M. for a wayward's choices.
> 
> ...


:iagree: If someone is going to cheat, they are going to no matter how many road blocks or safeguards you put in their way. I learned this the hard way over many years. You can't be with someone every waking minute of the day, they have to be able to police themselves. I had to accept that unitl he finally took ownership for his actions, he would most likely screw up again.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

Philat said:


> I agree with this in general, but I also take OP's point: many of these apps seem deliberately targeted to meet a user demand for stealth (secrecy) as opposed to privacy (just look at the advertising that touts ways to circumvent "prying girlfriends" etc.). This can be interpreted, IMO, as not simply the inevitable march of technology but the deliberate application of technology for nefarious purposes.


Thanks for seeing what I mean, Phil. Instagram is already at the top of the list, so why the need to make an entirely "secret" and "hidden" section. That is exactly how they are advertising it as well. "So photos can be shared and discussed in a 'secretive' and 'hidden' nature." How does this not sound like it is aimed at a certain usage??

The other examples given by the other responders are just ways that people have found to circumvent the original intended usage of something and this will always happen. People have been able to do this with Instagram already by creating different accounts and only sharing with the few they wanted to, much the same as having a FB account under a different name. 

By adding this "secret" functionality, it is as though they are advertising for nefarious uses. I am not sure if they deserve credit for this announcement, as they are warning people that it is now possible, or if they are drumming up more business by adding the feature??


To those that think technology doesn't play a part, better than ⅔ of all divorces this day cite FB and social media as the underlying cause for the breakup of the marriage. Yes it is an excuse, but how many of these A's were facilitated through FB, by reconnecting lovers from the past over untold distances? Would the A have occurred naturally without them? We don't know, but we do know that social media has enabled it to further grow and exist. Most of the people using technology like email and phone only were able to use these media through the facilitation of the connections created/ established by FB.


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## missthelove2013 (Sep 23, 2013)

cheaters will always find a way...dont blame the tool, blame the cheater


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

well it should make you feel better that the new iphone version won't let you individually delete texts from a thread.You have to delete the entire thread now.An empty message box is always a red flag whereas before you could just delete the few inappropriate comments and leave the innocent part of the thread there.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

Married but Happy said:


> Yes, let's roll back the clock! Ban electricity, too. Electricity eliminated much of the time needed to accomplish housework, providing more time for women to pursue other men and read romance novels. Take away the telephone, too! Obviously that's a tool of Satan. May as well eliminate automobiles - especially with back seats - as they make meeting a lover so much faster!


 So you are saying that technology such as the internet is not responsible for people acting like a$$es? It is just their natural disposition and character coming out? It in no way harbors anonymity that allows people to be condescending and insulting and allows them to say things that they would never have the strength to say to a person's face exactly as they state it from behind the safety of their keyboard (as that would be socially unacceptable behavior to do in person)?

No one ever mentioned the word ban. The context of the posting was just that it seems that all app producers are pushing the need to be secretive and harboring the ability to hide things, and for what purpose? Your examples didn't have specifically added capabilities to harbor the activities, it is just that people found the way to use them to do so. I was not posting about how people were using the original design of Instagram to carry out these activities but how Instagram has added this capability?


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## Philat (Sep 12, 2013)

missthelove2013 said:


> cheaters will always find a way...dont blame the tool, blame the cheater


Unless the tool is deliberately intended to facilitate cheating. Cheaters will find a way to hook up via the Internet, but does this mean that the A***** M****** website doesn't deserve censure?


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## lostmyreligion (Oct 18, 2013)

Secrecy and the danger of getting caught seem to be a huge part of the appeal in a lot of affairs. WS's like to imagine that they're James Bond. You know - better looking, more suave and debonaire and especially _smarter_ than the villains they generally make their BS's out to be.

So I guess you could look at the developers of features like secret messaging as 'Q branch'. 

"Yes 007, you could use it for that but _please_ be responsible." (said with disapproving grimace)

Seriously though, it just seems like a case of the market driving product development. 

From an Adam Smith point of view and given the stats, seems like a rational direction to take it. 

Still comes down to the often-not-so rational decisions of the individual(s) using the feature.


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## wranglerman (May 12, 2013)

I find it amazes me still how easy it is with internet access to "hook up" with a girl.

But I also find it disturbing that some people have such low self esteem as to behave in such a fashion.

No I do not blame technology for being so advanced as to allow EAs to come to fruition so easily, but I do blame my spouse for her actions when she misused the technology, I don't blame FB for allowing them to contact each other, but I do blame her for over stepping the mark in her acknowledging him as a friend(ex's are not allowed.).

You see the problem is not the media, it is the people using the media, to me it is no different to a GNO or a BNO where he/she is banging/ getting banged in the alley behind the club.

Sorry but I see your point, just doesn't hold validity with me.

*CHEATERS WILL CHEAT, ALL THEY NEED IS OPPORTUNITY.*


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

wranglerman said:


> Sorry but I see your point, just doesn't hold validity with me.
> 
> *CHEATERS WILL CHEAT, ALL THEY NEED IS OPPORTUNITY.*



I agree on this, but do we need to make everything become that *easily available opportunity*???? 

Instagram had a working and successful model and was setting the standards. Now that they have taken to the "hidden and secret" road, more will need to go that way to be and remain competitive. It just seems to me that their innovation could have come in the form of developing other areas besides the secretive route. I guess sex sells and drives the market and they are going to prove it. It is just sad.


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## wranglerman (May 12, 2013)

That is true, but where do you draw the line with your spouse? Does there have to be a certain amount of guidance or control over these things before they escalate? Password sharing etc???

But I suppose we really need to ask about the morality lessons that are taught to our youth in America? I mean, for me there should be some serious consequences as far as adultery within marriage goes and none of this no fault carp either, either they did it or they didn't, assets etc, adultery you get squat, amicable split then find a stump to hump (thanks Chapparal, will never tire of that line  )


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

wranglerman said:


> But I suppose we really need to ask about the morality lessons that are taught to our youth in America? I mean, for me there should be some serious consequences as far as adultery within marriage goes and none of this no fault carp either, either they did it or they didn't, assets etc, adultery you get squat, amicable split then find a stump to hump (thanks Chapparal, will never tire of that line  )


Agreed, but the problem is that the court systems don't feel this way as don't the majority of people. Even if we have legal documents in place to limit assets and compensations after D, the courts always seem to see it differently and find some way to over rule the papers in place (won't even talk about the issues in custody). Gone are the good old days where it was frowned upon by all. Now. like "coming out of the closet", adultery is viewed as some sort of achievement level or right of passage to be obtained and coveted (or so the media and public opinion would like us to believe).


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## missthelove2013 (Sep 23, 2013)

Philat said:


> Unless the tool is deliberately intended to facilitate cheating. Cheaters will find a way to hook up via the Internet, but does this mean that the A***** M****** website doesn't deserve censure?


Isnt there a current lawsuit against the A***** M****** site...someone admitted to creating hundreds of fake accounts...all these drooling men thinking the place is full of out of control married nymphos wanting quick meaningless hookups, and its ALL a giant fake...LOL...

word to the not-so-apparently-wise...if its TOO good to be true, then its bull s*** LOL...

That A M site isnt there to help horny men bone married slvts...it just uses that as a lure...the men pay their membership, and the site makes money...

how many men have actually hooked up using A***** M****** (hence forth to be known as AM)??
Women DO NOT NEED an internet forum to get laid, unless they are escorts and looking for high volume...a married woman who is even remotely attractive (or even just moderately repulsive) can walk into a laundremat or grocery store and hook up in 10 minutes if she wanted to...

I cant believe men actually think thousands of beautiful horny married women are clawing over each other to get in their bald fat hairy pants...LMAO!!!


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

How am I Going to Surviv said:


> The availability of technology is NOT the cause.
> 
> It may make the activity more efficient but *it will not make it more likely.*


Agree with your first statement.

Ummmmm.....not so sure about the second one.


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## OhGeesh (Jan 5, 2010)

Squeakr said:


> Just read the press release late yesterday about how Instagram has now added the private message capability to their applications. Isn't it bad enough that there are several others that allow the hidden and secret exchange of information without making yet another member of that club?
> 
> Who else is tired of this enablement, as it seems every application out there is trying to top the social media ladder and the only way that they know how is to create new and hidden features that allow for the secretive interaction of people. It is getting to the point where they will all have it and there'll be no possibility of full transparency and monitoring.
> 
> ...


The apps don't cause people to cheat!! There are literally 100's of voip based sms apps you cannot stop them all. If someone wants to cheat they can and will find a way.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

OhGeesh said:


> The apps don't cause people to cheat!! There are literally 100's of voip based sms apps you cannot stop them all. If someone wants to cheat they can and will find a way.


I am not blaming them and have never said they are the cause, just that they make it easier. So why do we need to have more that facilitate it to contend with? That is the question. I am not excusing the cheating because of the apps, just that it is now even easier than before with more apps allowing the "secrecy". It's getting to the point where cheating will take no effort on anyones point in the future.


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## wranglerman (May 12, 2013)

Sorry, had a think about this whilst driving.

I suppose there is something in the whole "fear of getting caught" issue, if these apps make the chance of getting caught getting a bit on the side less risky then I suppose there is something to worry about, but I also think it shows a need to make your marriage more affair proof than ever, and that is where boundaries come into play but also it is about being careful not to become possessive or overbearing on issues such as social media.

But all of us here know how keylogging works and how good this is, I think if there is a shadow of a doubt then it is better to stay quiet and verify using this method, yes it does say something about insecurities but also allows you to monitor your spouse to see if your concerns have substance or not.

You can do this on many android and smart phones too so the whole mobile communications issue need not be daunting either, it just takes that first step to address the monitoring issue then the pieces of the puzzle come into place easily.

But don't wait around for the flags to be high in the sky before monitoring, the monitoring can be a means of allowing you to address potential threats and problems long before they escalate to bumping uglies.


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## missthelove2013 (Sep 23, 2013)

with todays technology it is easier to have an affair
with todays technology it is easier to GET CAUGHT or catch someone having an affair...


I personally think its HARDER to have an affair these days...oh it might be easier to FIND a willing AP...but keeping it on the down low...good luck with that!!!


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## Baseballmom6 (Aug 15, 2012)

Reminds me of my Ex-MIL's comment. My ex was retired so was home a lot. She said "I just don't understand how he cheated, he was home every night." To which I said "Well, it doesn't have to be night time to have sex." He was meeting the skanky bar fly at her house during the day! Geez! 

In her defense she is 86 and very naive. LOL.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

I guess this all stems from the fact that what used to be apps that were "safe" are now entering the realm of the cheating apps, and after a while it is going to get to be impossible to know which ones are safe and which are not. Pretty much we all now know which are safe, but as more go with this hidden and secrecy route, we will never know which can be trusted.

After D-Day, my WW gave up all the apps that had anything hidden or secret, such as FB (she and I no longer have accounts), her social media she used to cheat is gone as well. It just now rubs me the wrong way that something as innocent as Pinterest (no secret messaging there, yet) could feel the need to institute this after the Instagram announcement (she doesn't have Instagram so no worries there either) and then I would have to start the constant checking all over again. Now I can see what apps she has on her phone and know she is not using them like before (as none have the capability, but how long before they add it).


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

missthelove2013 said:


> Isnt there a current lawsuit against the A***** M****** site...someone admitted to creating hundreds of fake accounts...all these drooling men thinking the place is full of out of control married nymphos wanting quick meaningless hookups, and its ALL a giant fake...LOL...
> 
> word to the not-so-apparently-wise...if its TOO good to be true, then its bull s*** LOL...
> 
> ...


I've used it, and Adult Friend Finder. Met my current SO on AFF, for that matter. And the one woman I met on AM was quite a public person. She was an locally known actress and a member of a number of community boards, and a few years later, I was very surprised to see that she had election signs up for a provincial election. 

But yes, there's lots of fake uses/profiles as well. But they were easy to pick out and ignore. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## BradWesley (May 24, 2013)

The following is a list showing the rank of certain websites on the internet. This information is provided by Alexa Internet, a subsidiary of Amazon.com which provides commercial web data.

A link is provided to their website.

#1 Google

#58 Craigs

#497 AFF

#2884 AM

#48,954 TAM

I think these numbers speak for themselves

Alexa - The Web Information Company


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

Ummm... something to keep in mind;
Every single forum I've ever seen or been a part of has a PM feature. I don't care what your interest is... PM's are possible anywhere.


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## InlandTXMM (Feb 15, 2013)

For every Instagram Private Message service there is a "Where's my Iphone?" app.

My wife texted her OM but the phone bill logs gave her away.

I agree with some of the posters here. Yes, technology may enable cheaters but everything online is logged, traced, and tracked.


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## missthelove2013 (Sep 23, 2013)

Racer said:


> Ummm... something to keep in mind;
> Every single forum I've ever seen or been a part of has a PM feature. I don't care what your interest is... PM's are possible anywhere.


ooohh....PM me and tell me about it...purrrrr! 
:rofl:


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## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

Why would a married couple need separate instagram accounts? Share the account and nothing bad could come of it.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

InlandTXMM said:


> For every Instagram Private Message service there is a "Where's my Iphone?" app.
> 
> My wife texted her OM but the phone bill logs gave her away.
> 
> I agree with some of the posters here. Yes, technology may enable cheaters but everything online is logged, traced, and tracked.


So not true. Certain providers don't even log text information. Good luck finding out whom they've been texting (Straight talk is wine that doesn't log texts in or out). Also, just because you can tell that data was used in copious amounts, you have nothing other than the information about the data being moved, nothing proving what was happening (and if you are on wifi, unless logging every connection, and not all routers allow that, good luck finding out that they were even doing anything in the first place). You can only get so much out of the log files on smartphones also, unless you have the every expensive programs that can pick through them (the basic ones won't reveal all).


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

richie33 said:


> Why would a married couple need separate instagram accounts? Share the account and nothing bad could come of it.


That is one option, but then you could say the same thing for everything. Why more than 1 FB account, or any given social media. It is an option, but not one that most would openly and easily accept (that is how we worked for email as well, and then she started new email accounts, thanks gmail and yahoo, so just because you maintain a shared doesn't mean it is going to stay that way. If they want it, they are going to take it.


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## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

Then the issue is more about trust not the tool they use to break it. Every day you read on this site you read about a spouse saying to the other I don't want you drinking or looking at porn. This should be no different. We share accounts or we both deactivate our social media.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

richie33 said:


> Then the issue is more about trust not the tool they use to break it. Every day you read on this site you read about a spouse saying to the other I don't want you drinking or looking at porn. This should be no different. We share accounts or we both deactivate our social media.


Agreed, but all the trust in the world doesn't stop them from doing it in private (just like drinking and porn). It is a sad society that we live in when deception is what most think about. My Aunt was showing my mother a post on her daughters FB account. When my Mom commented that the person's account they were viewing wasn't the name of her daughter, she stated, "yeah, that is how they do it these days so that none of it can be traced back and used against them in classes, schooling, and jobs". So it isn't just about trust, it is about skirting the system and our kids are learning to do it early these days. It sucks big time, as we can't even stop them with all the pleading and good upbringing, they still have a mind of their own.


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## radrobe (Jun 17, 2013)

I don't think the ability to private message is even relevant. If you want secret communication you can use secret gchat accounts, secret gmail accounts, facebook, words with friends, secret google voice accounts, a work phone, a burner phone, work email, secret skype accounts, any number of clandestine texting services.

The list goes on and on. You will not stop a motivated cheater. I cheated on my ex and she cheated on me. 

It was because of three things: 
(1) I was broken 
(2) She was broken 
(3) Our marriage was broken. 

If any of those three things are there, cheating can and will occur.


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## BradWesley (May 24, 2013)

Squeakr said:


> Agreed, but all the trust in the world doesn't stop them from doing it in private (just like drinking and porn). It is a sad society that we live in when deception is what most think about. My Aunt was showing my mother a post on her daughters FB account. When my Mom commented that the person's account they were viewing wasn't the name of her daughter, she stated, "yeah, that is how they do it these days so that none of it can be traced back and used against them in classes, schooling, and jobs". So it isn't just about trust, it is about skirting the system and our kids are learning to do it early these days. It sucks big time, as we can't even stop them with all the pleading and good upbringing, they still have a mind of their own.


You think its bad now, in the not too distant future, Facebook, Yahoo, Gmail, etc. will incorporate fingerprint technology to access accounts, eliminating the ability to snoop


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

BradWesley said:


> You think its bad now, in the not too distant future, Facebook, Yahoo, Gmail, etc. will incorporate fingerprint technology to access accounts, eliminating the ability to snoop


Sorry, but time to take off the tinfoil hat! That isn't happening for a long time if it ever even happens. Considering that most people and computers still don't have access to fingerprint readers and too many of the OS's don't have the technology in them to interpret it, means it is going to be a long time for this to take place (I have a sack of these readers but no drivers or software to utilize them since I no Longer use Windows XP and none were updated for anything Windows newer than XP or any of the Linux/ UNIX/ Mac flavors). Heck lots of OS's don't even allow touchscreen capability yet. Just because the latest iPhone has it (and Android is next) most computers don't have the capability. Until it is standard across the board, this will only be allowed as an option to the traditional sign on means.

I would sooner bet on retinal scans and facial recognition to happen before the fingerprint readers (as most computers have a way to access a camera to use these possibilities).


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## BradWesley (May 24, 2013)

Squeakr said:


> Sorry, but time to take off the tinfoil hat! That isn't happening for a long time if it ever even happens. Considering that most people and computers still don't have access to fingerprint readers and too many of the OS's don't have the technology in them to interpret it, means it is going to be a long time for this to take place (I have a sack of these readers but no drivers or software to utilize them since I no Longer use Windows XP and none were updated for anything Windows newer than XP or any of the Linux/ UNIX/ Mac flavors). Heck lots of OS's don't even allow touchscreen capability yet. Just because the latest iPhone has it (and Android is next) most computers don't have the capability. Until it is standard across the board, this will only be allowed as an option to the traditional sign on means.
> 
> I would sooner bet on retinal scans and facial recognition to happen before the fingerprint readers (as most computers have a way to access a camera to use these possibilities).


I understand what you're saying. By near future I'm not referring to next year or even 5 years. And yes, retinal scans are also a possibility.

If consumers demand it, it will be here.


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## wranglerman (May 12, 2013)

Squeakr said:


> So not true. Certain providers don't even log text information. Good luck finding out whom they've been texting (Straight talk is wine that doesn't log texts in or out). Also, just because you can tell that data was used in copious amounts, you have nothing other than the information about the data being moved, nothing proving what was happening (and if you are on wifi, unless logging every connection, and not all routers allow that, good luck finding out that they were even doing anything in the first place). You can only get so much out of the log files on smartphones also, unless you have the every expensive programs that can pick through them (the basic ones won't reveal all).


How very true but I think that there are fundamental flaws being overlooked here.

If suspicions are aroused then what do you need to do to get the information or at the very least a source of information???

CREATIVITY that's what!!!

For every new app, for every new secrecy and privacy possibility there are ways and means to get around them and to get to know what you are dealing with.

If there are such markets for products and services such as keylogging, downloads, texts etc, then there will be a guy out there who will write the app to be covertly installed to double backups to a separate email address.

If hackers can crack the FBI then they can do Apple easy 

There is and always will be a market for intelligence gathering from mobile devices, we just have to find the geek who is going to market them to us that feel we need to spy.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

Philat said:


> I agree with this in general, but I also take OP's point: many of these apps seem deliberately targeted to meet a user demand for stealth (secrecy) as opposed to privacy (just look at the advertising that touts ways to circumvent "prying girlfriends" etc.). This can be interpreted, IMO, as not simply the inevitable march of technology but the deliberate application of technology for nefarious purposes.


Sex sells, this is nothing new. Phones, pay phones, messages, answering services, snail mail, pagers, burner phones, text messages, post office boxes, classifieds, craigslist, 1-900, email, facebook, etc etc etc etc etc.

We can blame technology or just admit humans always find better ways to cheat.


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