# Son's Graduation - what should I do?



## stressed1951 (Jan 12, 2010)

My wife and I have been living apart now since the beginning of 2015 after 25 years of marriage. The plan is to file for divorce after our youngest son graduates high school and thus there are no longer any 'minors' involved and thus should be relatively easy to accomplish. Relations between had become fractious toward the end and my mind and emotions were all over the place when we split. I still have good days and bad days, but do feel to be in a 'better place' than I was toward the end of the time together. Whilst there is no out and out hate between us (largely because we tend to communicate by text), at times relations can get quite frosty, especially when she gets on her hobby horse of money.

In May, my youngest son graduates and it is likely to be a repeat of his elder brothers graduation 3 years earlier. When that happened her parents and her brother flew over from the UK and stayed with us, her brother for 1 week and the parents for 3 weeks. Despite the fact that we had a 3 bed house, with 3 singles and 2 couples having to sleep, these sleeping arrangements caused the biggest problems as well as the 'I'll make myself at home and do nothing but drink beer' attitude of her brother at the time. What should have happened was they should have rented accommodations elsewhere for their stay. As it was, my 2 sons were turfed out of their rooms for the duration of HER family's stay. That did not go down well with me, but as ever she never discussed it with me and in her eyes her family is perfection. In my my eyes it was a 'mob takeover by her family'.

At the graduation ceremony we all sat together and my wife invited several of her 'cronies' to come and spectate. Afterwards everyone came back to the house for a smallish celebration. We later all went out as family for a meal to celebrate the lads graduation (and her parents wedding anniversary and her mother's birthday).

This time things are somewhat different and here's why....

Since separating, HER family have dropped me like a ton of bricks. There has been no contact from them whatsoever, no reaching out or anything. My 25 year marriage to their daughter appears to have counted for nothing. Apparently they ask HER I'm doing, but never make contact with me! Of course they only know what she tells them and certainly her infidelity will still be her secret. Her brother never has contacted me, even though with his marriage #2 his wife cheated on him. So he should know how I feel. The problem is she (my wife/his sister) will not have told him about HER cheating. In May, when the youngest graduates, they are all coming over again for round 2! Since the last graduation, HER brother has remarried and will bringing wife #3 to meet my 'wife'/his sister. Her parents were also coming but that changed somewhat last week when her mum died suddenly. BUT her father says he is still coming. Brother and wife staying for 1 week, Dad staying for 3 weeks, as before. The stay and sleeping arrangement problems do not bother me now as I'm not in the house. However the actual Graduation and post events have me in an emotional quandary.

When we get the Graduation tickets, we can sit anywhere in the stadium where it's held. *Should I sit with my 'wife' and all her cronies and family (the latter who dropped me like a bad smell) or should I simply take my ticket and sit elsewhere?
*
After the ceremony, it appears that my 'wife' has stage managed everything again (I learn this from my son, not from her) and there is to be the smallish back at the house celebration again with HER 'cronies' and HER family. As was the case with his elder brother, graduation photos of him and both his parents were taken at that time. My initial thought was just not to go back to her house this time, but my son has said 'he wants photo's of him with BOTH his parents, like his elder brother rather than one of him with mum and one with him and dad. *In that case should I go back, get the photo's out the way and politely leave?* I know if I go, besides my sons gets his wish on the photo's, the downside is I will no doubt have to be introduced to the brother #3 wife and will have to small talk with her dad post losing his wife. Whilst I have great sympathy for his loss, when I needed a 'reaching out' from them after me and her split, they were no where to be seen. *What should I do?*

*It is giving me some sleepless night trying to work out what in gods name to do. I do not want to let down my son; I want to be there for him. I don't want to be there for them.
*
My other dilemma concerns the youngest son and his college.

When the eldest son was sorting out college 3 years ago, much to my upset and annoyance his mother and him would closet themselves in his bedroom with door closed to go over colleges and I was pretty much cut out. When it came to establishing the federal account, she set it up, created the password and to this day will not share that with me. On the initial college visits, the pair of them did them and again I was shut out for the most part, although I was able to go to 2 college visits when all 4 of us went.

When we split, I was 100% honest about the split with my sons (my wife's infidelity). The eldest who was by now at college and took the attitude of 'I'm not at home anymore and whatever makes you 2 happy attitude'. The youngest however, witnessed first hand how ****tily she treated me and we shed many a tear as the split took place. When we talked about his college, he said 'he would not do what his brother had done with his mum and I would be included in everything'. However, a couple of months ago, as we returned home from visiting his brother at college, he said to me in the car, that 'this is my college experience and as me and mum did not like being together, he would focus on 'his college'. As a consequence, he has done exactly the same as his brother and closeted himself with his mum and more to the point have done ALL the college visits together with NO invitation to me whatsoever. I bite my tongue on exclusion, but it has upset me greatly. I know that behind this is his mother who I have found to be by her nature manipulative and a control freak. As he lives at 'home' with her, no doubt he dances to her tune as did his elder brother. 

I know that soon he will make his decision on a college and I know that in August or thereabouts it will be his 'leaving for college weekend' and as with his brother my truck serves as the moving van and it becomes somewhat of a family affair. As a parent I was immensely proud of his elder brother going to college and it was that 'flying the nest' point in his life. Whilst I had not been 100% involved I was nonetheless involved in a few college visits, etc and was happy/sad to take him and his worldly belongings to college. I'm also the one who has to move him back home when college year and everything has to be moved out of dorms. With my youngest, whilst he tells me what he's done, etc viz college, when he comes for a meal at my house, I have been totally excluded on the college prep. Only last week we were all sat in my truck and they were talking about him having to go back to one College for a special day and his mother remarked that parents were breakfasting all the day. I hurt that clearly the college will see him as a child of a single parent, when the reality is not so, because they have chosen to exclude me. *So my dilemma is when it comes time for him to leave for his college, should I once again bite my tongue and go with flow or risk shunning him by simply not being involved in that weekend when he moves into college?
*
*I know it is so easy to make a decision and then spend a lifetime regretting it, but should I stand up and tell him now that I will not be involved in his college or go with the flow, even though I have been excluded? All this starting to tear me up inside again.
*
I look at how life is so screwed up at times for the whole family, all because of her infidelity and breaking the trust of marriage. She seem oblivious or doesn't care about the knock on damage she has inflicted on the whole family, but what is done, is done and cannot be undone.

Any suggestions or advice would be most welcome.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Sit wherever the hell you want! It is your comfort that is foremost here!

Since she is soon to be nothing more than an unpleasant reflection in your rear view mirror, and given that her "clan" is treating you greatly like a putrefied piece of defecation, I absolutely wouldn't give two hoots in hell what any of them thought about it!

As far as you're concerned, this is all about you and your sons very special day!*


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## 225985 (Dec 29, 2015)

You sit separately from the WS during the ceremony 

You take the "with parents " pictures at the ceremony venue, not at the house. 

You don't go back to the house. 

You do go out for the meal at the restaurant. 

Have an additional small ceremony for your son with YOUR family at a later date. W not invited.

Did you expose her cheating to her family? She may have told them something different, ie you abused her, hit her etc. That may be why they dropped you.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Agreed, sit where you darn well please. You are the father and the day is about your son. Be there for your son. The rest of it(your W family) takes back seat.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

I would be tempted to ask your BIL how HE dealt with his then wife's infidelity as you are now going through the same situation now his sister cheated on you.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

MattMatt said:


> I would be tempted to ask your BIL how HE dealt with his then wife's infidelity as you are now going through the same situation now his sister cheated on you.


Do not just be tempted. Do it. What do you have to lose? Why nothing. But you have a lot to gain. Like someone from her family in your corner.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

MattMatt said:


> *I would be tempted to ask your BIL how HE dealt with his then wife's infidelity as you are now going through the same situation now his sister cheated on you.*


*Touché!*


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Take one or more people from your own family, or one or more friends, and sit with them. In the UK photos are usually taken at the venue, so you can get one taken of you both with him there, and then you wont need to go back to her home. 
Arrange a meal out a day or two later with you and you son, or with you, him and your family. 

One thing. if you are separated then why not divorce now? It wont change anything if you do.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

stressed1951 said:


> My wife and I have been living apart now since the beginning of 2015 after 25 years of marriage. The plan is to file for divorce after our youngest son graduates high school and thus there are no longer any 'minors' involved and thus should be relatively easy to accomplish. Relations between had become fractious toward the end and my mind and emotions were all over the place when we split. I still have good days and bad days, but do feel to be in a 'better place' than I was toward the end of the time together. Whilst there is no out and out hate between us (largely because we tend to communicate by text), at times relations can get quite frosty, especially when she gets on her hobby horse of money.
> 
> In May, my youngest son graduates and it is likely to be a repeat of his elder brothers graduation 3 years earlier. When that happened her parents and her brother flew over from the UK and stayed with us, her brother for 1 week and the parents for 3 weeks. Despite the fact that we had a 3 bed house, with 3 singles and 2 couples having to sleep, these sleeping arrangements caused the biggest problems as well as the 'I'll make myself at home and do nothing but drink beer' attitude of her brother at the time. What should have happened was they should have rented accommodations elsewhere for their stay. As it was, my 2 sons were turfed out of their rooms for the duration of HER family's stay. That did not go down well with me, but as ever she never discussed it with me and in her eyes her family is perfection. In my my eyes it was a 'mob takeover by her family'.
> 
> ...


Bring a date. That's a joke. Just be the bigger person. Show here you don't care. As far as my son goes, I would say, look you are shutting me out, is there something I did that is making you do this? Your son is old enough to do the right thing. Look my sisters did that after my Dad divorced. Today they are sad they don't have the relationship I do with him. I remind them it was their choice. I like the idea of having your own party with him. I am sorry you got such a raw deal. Sadly you married a bad person.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

do you boys know that their mother cheated on you....that is something they should be aware of (definitely old enough) ...but i agree others here i would remind her brother why you are divorcing his sister.


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## stressed1951 (Jan 12, 2010)

Thank you all for your replies.

When we split because of her cheating and the trust issue (also she refused to do counseling or even try at reconciliation so her mind was made up) I explained the truth to both my son's as I felt they were old enough and mature enough to know who in the pair caused the break-up. As far as telling her brother about her cheating, that has gone through my mind on the basis that he should know exactly how I feel after finding out your wife has cheated on you (his wife #2 did exactly that to him and me and the wife were their to pick up the pieces). They always say blood is thinker than water, and whether she had cheated or even worse I am convinced her family would take her side for the simple reason she is 'family'.

On the Graduation Day, my initial thoughts were to get my ticket and go sit on my own. They always say initial gut reactions are the most accurate ones.

When we came to the US from the UK, it was just the 4 of us, so we have NO family besides us here in the US. Her family has traveled from the UK simply because they are much younger than my family. My family are all in their late 70's/80's, so flying is no-no and my parents are both dead.

With the post graduation photo's, I had said to my son that I would not come back to her house, but he was insistent he wanted his photo's with his mum & dad like his brother before him and not just photo's of him with me and another with her. I can understand what that means to him. I never want my kids to suffer as a result of actions by their parents when marriages go south. The graduation takes place at a local stadium arena, so there is space outside to take photo's. I will still have to be 'with' her family/friends as they will all be congregating in the same place as they wait for my son to arrive back from where he sits in the stadium.

I had planned on taking him (and his brother) out for a post graduation meal later, but I know I will be fighting her family taking up my son's time.

I don't want his Graduation to play out as a face off between me and her/her family. That would be dumb on my part and possibly cause longer term relationship issues with my son's. I feel they have been damaged enough as it is.

Divorce is never easy, but where there are NO kids, it matters not to either party if they ever lay eyes on their other half ever again BUT when you have kids, divorce or not you are still linked as their parents and in the longer term grandparents. However, the latter elements only exist IF the kids want that relationship. Someone said why not divorce her now. We looked into that but in the State of Florida, if there is a minor involved, the State gets involved via the court to look after the interest of the minor. An Attorney I spoke with confirmed that they cease to be a minor in Florida AFTER they have Graduated HS, even if they reach 18 before. So once graduation is past, divorce between the 2 of us becomes a simple divorce, with no children involved. She wants nothing from me and I want nothing from her. So unless one of us goes back on that understanding, it should be a relatively cheap, quick and painless affair.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

It is unfortunate that your youngest son has decided to exclude you from the College search and activities but I would suspect your wife had a major hand in it. I think you are better off in the long run putting your needs last in this situation. Just bite the bullet one last time for your son. Sit separate during the ceremony. Go take the picture with your son, tell him the two of you will celebrate together later, then leave. Make small talk if necessary, but don't stay long. 

You need to tell your son how much his excluding you hurt your feelings, but then wish him all the best in college and be there for him when he needs you. He needs to know that you WANTED to help him with college. But, again, be the adult here and don't make it into an issue. He will eventually grow up and realize what you did for him. 

Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

Be firm with your wife that you want 50% time with your sons. That means you get to take them out to dinner and spend time with them. She gets her time with them and can do whatever she wants.


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## FeministInPink (Sep 13, 2012)

TX-SC said:


> It is unfortunate that your youngest son has decided to exclude you from the College search and activities but I would suspect your wife had a major hand in it. I think you are better off in the long run putting your needs last in this situation. Just bite the bullet one last time for your son. Sit separate during the ceremony. Go take the picture with your son, tell him the two of you will celebrate together later, then leave. Make small talk if necessary, but don't stay long.
> 
> You need to tell your son how much his excluding you hurt your feelings, but then wish him all the best in college and be there for him when he needs you. He needs to know that you WANTED to help him with college. But, again, be the adult here and don't make it into an issue. He will eventually grow up and realize what you did for him.


Agree with this ^^^.

I bet your STBXW was responsible for keeping you out of the college search.

I also think that (agreeing with @sokillme) you should sit down with your son and have a talk. Ask him why he shut you out of the college selection process, when he explicitly told you he wouldn't? If you want to have a [healthy] relationship with your adult sons, you're going to have to make that happen, because I have a feeling that your STBXW is going to do what she can to prevent that. Your sons may be adults, but you're still older and wiser, and they need you to be their _dad_.


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## stressed1951 (Jan 12, 2010)

TX-SC said:


> It is unfortunate that your youngest son has decided to exclude you from the College search and activities but I would suspect your wife had a major hand in it. I think you are better off in the long run putting your needs last in this situation. Just bite the bullet one last time for your son. Sit separate during the ceremony. Go take the picture with your son, tell him the two of you will celebrate together later, then leave. Make small talk if necessary, but don't stay long.
> 
> You need to tell your son how much his excluding you hurt your feelings, but then wish him all the best in college and be there for him when he needs you. He needs to know that you WANTED to help him with college. But, again, be the adult here and don't make it into an issue. He will eventually grow up and realize what you did for him.
> 
> Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk


Of the 2 sons he was the one who saw more first hand my wife's 'attitude' toward me in the home. Even he said that she treated me horribly. As he lives at home with her (I see him probably once per week on a weekend evening when he comes round to mine for a meal and a movie). With him the thing that upset me the most was he saw how I was pretty much excluded from his elder brothers college visits, etc and he told me to my face he would not do that. YET, he does that by excluding me in all the visits he has done so far ALL with his mother. I have not said my piece to him about how much this has upset me; I have just bitten my tongue as I fairly certain that she is the control behind it. Prior to and after the split, I realized how much of a control freak she is. It's her way or no way most of the time!

I guess the college thing will come to a head when he finally has his college picked and he heads of to college. he is focusing on colleges in Florida, so any journey to start college will be fairly short distance. Whichever way it goes, he will, like his brother be moving stuff with him to college. His mom has a small Hyundai Accent, I have a Suburban. So guess which is used as the removal truck? So I know that even if he totally excludes me from everything to do with college, he will want Dad to move his stuff to college. I would bet money on that. At that point I have to decide; do I bite my tongue one final time or say NO and find some other mug to take your stuff to college and then I would have to suffer the consequences because I would appear the 'bad dad'. 

I suppose in its finality I have either a) take a firm stand on it all and suffer any repercussions on my relationship with him that may be longer term or b) be diplomatic and decide on my responses at the time and how the circumstances present themselves.

None of us in this situation has an instruction book on how to deal with it and for the most part most folks will tend to 'make it up as they go along'. I find it difficult in how to deal with these situations; and I have to try and see it from his perspective as a 17 year old and his dealing with it. Marriage break up is such a horrible thing to happen, especially for the kids.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

stressed1951 said:


> Of the 2 sons he was the one who saw more first hand my wife's 'attitude' toward me in the home. Even he said that she treated me horribly. As he lives at home with her (I see him probably once per week on a weekend evening when he comes round to mine for a meal and a movie). With him the thing that upset me the most was he saw how I was pretty much excluded from his elder brothers college visits, etc and he told me to my face he would not do that. YET, he does that by excluding me in all the visits he has done so far ALL with his mother. I have not said my piece to him about how much this has upset me; I have just bitten my tongue as I fairly certain that she is the control behind it. Prior to and after the split, I realized how much of a control freak she is. It's her way or no way most of the time!
> 
> I guess the college thing will come to a head when he finally has his college picked and he heads of to college. he is focusing on colleges in Florida, so any journey to start college will be fairly short distance. Whichever way it goes, he will, like his brother be moving stuff with him to college. His mom has a small Hyundai Accent, I have a Suburban. So guess which is used as the removal truck? So I know that even if he totally excludes me from everything to do with college, he will want Dad to move his stuff to college. I would bet money on that. At that point I have to decide; do I bite my tongue one final time or say NO and find some other mug to take your stuff to college and then I would have to suffer the consequences because I would appear the 'bad dad'.
> 
> ...


I understand the dilemma. What really matters here is that you are willing to show your son that you have his best interest at heart at all times and you "have his back" as they say. Help your son and continue to grow that bond. People don't fully mature until their mid twenties. Even though he is considered an adult, he may not fully recognize your sacrifice until later. 

But, let's not get off track. As his father you want what's best for him. Our base instinct is to get our hackles up and protect our own interest. You should help your son because you love him. No other reason is necessary. We all know that being a parent is often a thankless task. 

Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Your life is what you make it. Go your own way. Living on everyone else terms. Why?

Your stbxw and her family are nothing to you.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

stressed1951 said:


> Of the 2 sons he was the one who saw more first hand my wife's 'attitude' toward me in the home. Even he said that she treated me horribly. As he lives at home with her (I see him probably once per week on a weekend evening when he comes round to mine for a meal and a movie). With him the thing that upset me the most was he saw how I was pretty much excluded from his elder brothers college visits, etc and he told me to my face he would not do that. YET, he does that by excluding me in all the visits he has done so far ALL with his mother. I have not said my piece to him about how much this has upset me; I have just bitten my tongue as I fairly certain that she is the control behind it. Prior to and after the split, I realized how much of a control freak she is. It's her way or no way most of the time!
> 
> I guess the college thing will come to a head when he finally has his college picked and he heads of to college. he is focusing on colleges in Florida, so any journey to start college will be fairly short distance. Whichever way it goes, he will, like his brother be moving stuff with him to college. His mom has a small Hyundai Accent, I have a Suburban. So guess which is used as the removal truck? So I know that even if he totally excludes me from everything to do with college, he will want Dad to move his stuff to college. I would bet money on that. At that point I have to decide; do I bite my tongue one final time or say NO and find some other mug to take your stuff to college and then I would have to suffer the consequences because I would appear the 'bad dad'.
> 
> ...


JC man fight for your son! I don't know what your story is as far as your wife, but if you were as passive then as you are now with your sons then I am not surprised she treated you badly. That's not to say it's your fault, but your wife is still bullying you. Woman bully passive men. And she is bullying her son away from his father. You know how you stand up to bullies you punch them in the mouth. FIGHT G-DAMNIT! Passive people get run over. I am not saying fight her to her face. I am saying take your son out every single week, call him every single day. Call your other son, that is your job as his father. Get in his face until he chooses to fix your relationship. And if he asks you to stop tell him you won't because you love him and you are his father, and you are going to love him and be in his face until the day he dies. If you see you F-ed up tell him you are sorry but you love him. It will work. You may be the only decent adult in their life right now. Stop trying to see it from a 17-year-olds perspective, they are 17, you are an adult and presumably should know much better than them. They are depending on your wisdom. Your lack of actions is now not only affecting your life it's affecing them. First and formost commuincate with them. They need you!


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## Thor (Oct 31, 2011)

stressed1951 said:


> Of the 2 sons he was the one who saw more first hand my wife's 'attitude' toward me in the home. Even he said that she treated me horribly. As he lives at home with her (I see him probably once per week on a weekend evening when he comes round to mine for a meal and a movie). With him the thing that upset me the most was he saw how I was pretty much excluded from his elder brothers college visits, etc and he told me to my face he would not do that. YET, he does that by excluding me in all the visits he has done so far ALL with his mother. I have not said my piece to him about how much this has upset me; I have just bitten my tongue as I fairly certain that she is the control behind it. Prior to and after the split, I realized how much of a control freak she is. It's her way or no way most of the time!
> 
> I guess the college thing will come to a head when he finally has his college picked and he heads of to college. he is focusing on colleges in Florida, so any journey to start college will be fairly short distance. Whichever way it goes, he will, like his brother be moving stuff with him to college. His mom has a small Hyundai Accent, I have a Suburban. So guess which is used as the removal truck? So I know that even if he totally excludes me from everything to do with college, he will want Dad to move his stuff to college. I would bet money on that. At that point I have to decide; do I bite my tongue one final time or say NO and find some other mug to take your stuff to college and then I would have to suffer the consequences because I would appear the 'bad dad'.
> 
> ...


Uh, wrong. You need to stand up and be the Alpha Dog in your family! You're presuming his mother is at the helm of keeping you out of his college search, which is wrong-headed. Maybe she is, maybe she isn't, but you shouldn't just assume it. And you definitely should not just accept it! You need to put your foot down with her and with your son that you are to be included in this process. You're not just the moving-man, you're the father. You presumably are going to be footing a good portion of the costs. You love your son and want to provide him with guidance and opinion so that he can make good decisions. You are interested in his life, so you are interested in what is important to him, which currently is his college selection. All of this adds up to you rightfully being involved.

Your son may be waiting for you to grow a set of balls here.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Don't mean for this to sound overly harsh, however....

Your son may have witnessed your STBX's ill treatment of you, but did he also witness you bending over and taking it?

Because if he did, he learned that you won't stand up for yourself and that mom is the Overlord. Therefore, why should he stand up for you?


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

If your son is picking a college, and he expects you to to help pay for it, then he needs you to be part of the process. He is an adult now and no longer has a right to expect that he take your money while treating you like this. Although you intend to help pay for his college, do not allow it to be a requirement of the divorce, or your son will treat it like an entitlement that his mom got him. If he wants you to treat him like a son, he needs to treat you like a father and not as his mother's ex. If you proceed with the divorce after he is 18, it may be easier to not have his college be an issue in the divorce.


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Go online and read the free PDF download "No More Mr Nice Guy"

People treat you like you let them.

Sounds like your wife manipulated you a lot. Your son has learned from her and knows you'll kowtow.

You've put yourself in a bad spot here.
Change that


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