# Feeling frustrated and sad



## Ninja500 (Apr 16, 2013)

I don't even know where to start other than I saw the red flags and knowingly closed my eyes and walked into this relationship. After a few years of dating, living together, supporting him when he went through a very serious surgery, I walked out. Tired of the verbal and emotional abuse. I blindsided him and he called crying for me to take him back. 

Stupidly, I did after a 3 month break. We dated for another year and got engaged. The minute I moved back in, his old behaviors started again and I stayed. Stupidly thinking it'll get better when we get married. It's been 2 years and I've been miserable. I started lying to him many times which he found out about and went bullistic. He had every right to get angry with me about lying, but he will never admit or say sorry for calling me names. He throws things at me when he's angry, has broken some of our things during his temper tantrums and has pushed me or shoved me out of the way. 

He says that I won't open up emotionally to him. I want to, but when he goes through these moments, it frightens me. When I tell him this, I get blamed for his outbursts and tantrums.

I've suggested going to counseling many times, and he said we don't need to because we know what our problems are.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

Ninja500 said:


> I've suggested going to counseling many times, and he said we don't need to because we know what our problems are.


Then go alone. You will figure out (a) ho to change him, (b) how to live with him the way he is or (c) figure out how to move on without him.

But based on his assaults on you, I think (c) is your best plan.


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## IrishGirlVA (Aug 27, 2012)

I agree and disagree with Chris Taylor. Yes, plan C is the best option but I don't think you going to counseling alone will give you pointers on how to change him. You can't. And I'm sure you have tried many times. The only person he is able to change is himself and that 3 month break was not enough time to undo what has already been done. Meaning, that part of his personality that has been developed over years and years. It's not a lightswitch that can be flipped to off. It doesn't even appear that he is even acknowleging he has a problem. So where does that leave you? No where except in a very unhappy, unhealthy and abusive relationship. I get that he *thinks* he knows what your problems are but that doesn't mean he has the tools to fix them. Whatever he has tried so far isn't working, is it? 

In your post you did not mention having children with this man. If that is the case, then THANK YOUR LUCKY STARS! 

How did you feel when you left him and had those 3 months on your own? Did you feel relieved that you finally had some peace in your life and started to feel like yourself again? I think you need to channel that time of your life and remember what it was like to come home and walk on your carpet as opposed to the eggshells that are under your feet right now. 

Time to plan your exit.


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## Cora28 (Apr 30, 2013)

Anyone who is violent, whether physically or psychologically, needs help. You aren´t his punching bag and you shouldn´t have to deal with this. I think you could use counselling to help you take steps with how to deal with this situation as it just can´t continue. If he won´t help himself, then you have to help yourself. Pack a bag and go and stay with someone who you feel safe with and who can protect you if he comes knocking at the door.

I agree with IrishGirlVA, it´s time to plan your exit.


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## Urban (Mar 29, 2013)

OP, please don't go to marriage counseling with him. I dragged my abusive H into MC and the entire process did nothing more than to give him more ways to blame-shift. What a mistake.

Can I ask - do you feel like half your days are wasted because you're so distracted by this nonsense? I sometimes get angry because of the sheer amount of time I have toiled and toiled trying to "figure it out." It's draining.

I have to learn how to stop spinning my wheels over a relationship that I know is utter crap and start focusing on myself and moving forward. Easier said than done, I know.

Good luck!


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## Keeponrollin (May 14, 2013)

I have to agree, you cannot drag anyone to counselling its a joint decision because you both want to make the relationship work. 
The minute he was abusive to you physically its time to leave, A push becomes a slap, a slap becomes a punch, a punch become ..... 

Its time to leave, there is too much to life to be in this situation


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## IsGirl3 (Nov 13, 2012)

just because you made the mistake of marrying him, doesn't mean you have to live with this mistake. your marriage is dysfunctional, he is abusive, and you are miserable. you don't win any prizes staying married to this guy. you may be hanging onto that very tiny part of him that you fell in love with, but it's not enough. you deserve better than this. you should not be sentenced to this kind of marriage. get out. plan your exit and when you finally do, you will be deciding that there's a chance at happiness and peace in this life. don't settle and accept that this is your fate. please move on.


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## Ninja500 (Apr 16, 2013)

Since the latest outburst on Monday (in front of his father), I haven't been very productive at work. I've been seeing a therapist to try and learn how to live with him. I just don't know if I can do this anymore. I always get blamed for why he's upset, why he calls me names, yet I'm the one who has the mental problems and needs help.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

Look up 'gaslighting'. It will explain what he's doing to you. He's tearing you down to feel better about himself. You might also want to read "The Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans. It opened my eyes.


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## Ninja500 (Apr 16, 2013)

Yes, I know what gaslighting is. I actually made him watch the movie with me many months ago and told him he does this to me.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

Ninja500 said:


> Yes, I know what gaslighting is. I actually made him watch the movie with me many months ago and told him he does this to me.


Well how did that conversation go afterwards??


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## Ninja500 (Apr 16, 2013)

"I'm joking with you, you're being too serious..." The thing is I never know when he's serious or joking around because of the times he's gone bullistic about the craziest things and I've told him this countless times. 

I saw my therapist today and told her how he was throwing stuff around monday night and shoved me out of the way walking past me. She wants me to make an appt with a therapist for the both of us and go.

Just a few weeks ago he noticed his pile of paperwork I put in the closet (it had been sitting in our bedroom for at least 6 months) He turned the subject on me, walked me to our other closet and pointed to my things and then picked them up and threw them against the closet wall and kicked a few of my things too. I'm about to cry.


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## A Bit Much (Sep 14, 2011)

Ninja500 said:


> *"I'm joking with you, you're being too serious..."* The thing is I never know when he's serious or joking around because of the times he's gone bullistic about the craziest things and I've told him this countless times.
> 
> I saw my therapist today and told her how he was throwing stuff around monday night and shoved me out of the way walking past me. She wants me to make an appt with a therapist for the both of us and go.
> 
> Just a few weeks ago he noticed his pile of paperwork I put in the closet (it had been sitting in our bedroom for at least 6 months) He turned the subject on me, walked me to our other closet and pointed to my things and then picked them up and threw them against the closet wall and kicked a few of my things too. I'm about to cry.


Abusers use that bolded line ALL THE TIME. They aren't joking. Not at all. They mean everything they say and do, and that line is just another manipulation tool they like to pull out of the box when you catch onto them.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

Ninja500 said:


> I don't even know where to start other than I saw the red flags and knowingly closed my eyes and walked into this relationship. *This is the first thing you need to work on. You can't change him. If he isn't interested in seeking counseling, then it won't work for your relationship. However, you knowingly denied your own perceptions. This is a big signal of low self-esteem or codependence, maybe both. *After a few years of dating, living together, supporting him when he went through a very serious surgery, I walked out. Tired of the verbal and emotional abuse. I blindsided him and he called crying for me to take him back.
> 
> Stupidly, I did after a 3 month break. *You did the same thing again when you went back to him.* We dated for another year and got engaged. The minute I moved back in, his old behaviors started again and I stayed. Stupidly thinking it'll get better when we get married. It's been 2 years and I've been miserable. I started lying to him many times which he found out about and went bullistic. He had every right to get angry with me about lying, but he will never admit or say sorry for calling me names. He throws things at me when he's angry, has broken some of our things during his temper tantrums and has pushed me or shoved me out of the way.
> 
> ...


*The longer you stay, the more you'll learn that lying is a good way to protect your interests and values. This is NOT healthy for you or anyone you interact with.

His throwing, yelling, and name-calling are all designed to intimidate you and give him control. Instead of lying to him, I would encourage you to be honest, and when he responds like this, remind yourself that YOU are making a choice to keep that behavior in your life. 

Please consider reading these two articles as you try to figure out what to do: 

Top 3 Mistakes Women Make in Relationships

Signs and Symptoms of Emotional Abuse

*


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## Ninja500 (Apr 16, 2013)

I made an appt. with a marriage counselor for us next Monday. I told him I did this in a good setting and before a friend was coming over for dinner. I knew this would be a good time since having the friend over would diffuse any angry/hostile feelings. He said like he's said before when I've brought up going to mc, that "we know what our problems are" In his mind, the problems are all mine. He will not take responsibility for name calling or any of his physical abuse (pushing me out of the way, shoving me down on the couch) 

The only thing I am hopeful for right now, is that maybe going to mc will be what we need to see if this marriage will make it or if it's time for us to part ways. But deep down, if he is unable to admit his part then there is no way this is going to work out. Feeling so sad right now.


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## Blonde (Jan 7, 2013)

I don't think MC is going to work.

 Couples' Counseling & Marriage Counseling Does NOT Work in Abusive Relationships!

Read this


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## IrishGirlVA (Aug 27, 2012)

He's either going to have his "lightbulb moment" or he won't. 

One of three things will happen on Monday when you see the MC: 
1) He will continue blaming you for his behavior 
2) He will pacify you and the MC by saying he could change but really has no plan to do so
3) He will see how his behavior verbally and physically is abusive and will take the steps he needs to to change. 

Like Dr. Phil says -- you can't change what you don't acknowledge. 

I do hope the best for you on Monday. Just remain cautiously optomistic. If you find that when you leave the MC's office and he just talks about how it is all just a bunch of rubbish then you know his heart is not into saving the marriage. 

Come back and let us know how it goes. And if for some reason he bails at the last minute I strongly encourage you to go alone. 

Good luck.


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## Ninja500 (Apr 16, 2013)

It's been about 3 months of counseling and things were improving a bit, but then we went on vacation and he had two blowups that were completely crazy. He asked me to grab something from our hotel room and I forgot when I got back to the car. Then it started, I was being selfish, thinking I was single again and some name calling. All over forgetting to bring a book down from the hotel room. Then when we got back from vaca, I didn't put away his folded laundry and it was the same tantrum.

He forgot our appt with the mc last week, so I told the mc what had happend. Over 3 months of mc, it's been what in my family history makes me the way I am. I've been patient with the mc and I think he finally got it - my H is verbally abusive and has an anger management problem. 

So last night at our appt, I brought up the whole book thing and his reaction. He didn't remember saying a few things and when the mc asked what it was that upset him he made no sense. He said,I was taught you do things for other people. How the hell does that equate with me forgetting to bring a book down from the hotel room??? The session ended without any understanding where his rage comes from, and as we walked out he said that he hates me sometimes and he didn't think that would ever go away with counseling.

None of this makes any sense to me - other than this is how is father behaved with his mom, his grandfather with his grandma. But I'm the one with the problem. I guess that Dr. Phil quote is right and this marriage is not going to improve with him feeling justified in treating me like crap whenever I do something he doesn't like.

Feeling sad, hopeless and helpless.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Why stay with someone who hates you?


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## easy_e (Sep 11, 2013)

You need to get your self worth up, and I don't think that is possible around an emotional and physical abusive person. You are worth more than to allow someone to treat you this way.

I guarantee you that unless you are willing to walk, he will never change. Do not allow him to treat you this way any longer, you are letting him control you. You need to start with boundaries, and the first one of those boundaries is: Do not speak to me like that, throw things, or put your hands on me, it is never ok and will never be ok for you to do that, I will leave.

Do not defend, elaborate, or explain this. It is your personal boundary.

If it happens.....LEAVE.

You are better off at a hotel or even a tent than you are staying with an abuser. Do you have friends or family you can stay with? Prepare yourself to be able to enforce your boundary once you've set it.

If you decide to go back to him after some time.....he will need to acknowledge and own his behavior and be willing to work on that, otherwise you will be in the same boat.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Once you realize that you will be just fine - if not IMMENSELY BETTER - without him, his childish rants and abuse won't faze you as much; you'll merely be counting the days until you leave.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Why Does He Do That? Inside The Minds Of Angry And Controlling Men, by Bancroft


> Bancroft, the former codirector of Emerge, the nation's first program for abusive men, has specialized in domestic violence for 15 years, and his understanding of his subject and audience is apparent on every page. "One of the prevalent features of life with an angry or controlling partner is that he frequently tells you what you should think and tries to get you to doubt or devalue your own perceptions and beliefs," he writes.


Why Does He Do That?: Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men: Lundy Bancroft: 9780425191651: Amazon.com: Books


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## Uptown (Mar 27, 2010)

Ninja500 said:


> None of this makes any sense to me*....*


Ninja, his behavior makes a lot of sense if he has strong traits of BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder), which my exW has. The behaviors you describe -- i.e., temper tantrums, verbal and physical abuse, lack of impulse control, gaslighting, and rapid flips between loving you and hating you -- are classic traits of BPD.

Of course, you are not capable of _diagnosing_ your H's issues. You nonetheless are very capable of protecting yourself by learning how to _spot the warning signs_ for BPD. That's why hundreds of hospitals and mental health institutions educate the public by posting the symptoms of BPD on their websites.

Significantly, BPD is considered to be a "spectrum disorder," which means that everyone has the traits to some degree. At issue, then, is not whether your H has the traits. Of course he does. We all do.

Rather, at issue is whether he has most of the BPD traits at a strong and persistent level. Not having met him, I don't know the answer to that question. I nonetheless am confident you will be able to spot strong occurrences of BPD traits when you learn what red flags to look for. There is nothing subtle about traits such as temper tantrums, always being "The Victim," and verbal and physical abuse.


> Things were improving a bit, but then we went on vacation and he had two blowups that were completely crazy.


If your H has strong BPD traits, he likely will not handle vacations very well. Certainly, my BPDer exW did not. With BPDers, the very WORST fights generally follow immediately after the very BEST of times. The reason is that, although BPDers usually crave intimacy and closeness, they cannot handle it for very long. 

Due to their having a fragile self image, BPDers quickly start to feel suffocated and engulfed by their mate during intimacy and closeness. The result is that BPDers will often start a fight -- over absolutely nothing at all -- to push you away and give themselves breathing space. This, then, is why they typically will start fights -- out of thin air -- immediately after a great evening spent together. And, in my exW's case, we usually could not get past the third day of a vacation without her starting a fight.


> He forgot our appt with the mc last week.


If your H has strong BPD traits, MC likely will be a total waste of time until he has had several years of intensive IC to treat his more serious issues. A BPDer's issues go far beyond a simple lack of communication skills. I therefore agree with Urban and Blonde that MC is unlikely to be useful until he has learned how to manage his more serious issues.


> He said that he hates me sometimes and he didn't think that would ever go away with counseling.


If he has strong BPD traits, he is right about the rage and hatred not going away with MC. A BPDer (person with strong traits) carries an enormous amount of hurt and rage deep inside from early childhood. You therefore don't have to do or say anything to CREATE his anger. Rather, you only have to say or do some minor thing that TRIGGERS the anger that is always there right under the skin. 

This is why BPDers are capable of flipping -- in only a few seconds -- from adoring you to hating you, as may have occurred when your H exploded about your forgetting to bring the book to the car. Because this sudden release of rage occurs subconsciously, the BPDer truly believes -- at a conscious level -- that YOU are the cause of the rage. He therefore is unaware that the anger actually originated in childhood and is now being projected onto you by his subconscious mind (to protect his fragile ego from seeing too much of reality).


> This is how his father behaved with his mom, his grandfather with his grandma.


That transfer of abusive behaviors between successive generations is to be expected if your H has strong BPD traits. The psychiatric community believes the disorder is passed down from one generation to another through genes and early childhood treatment by the parents (e.g., abuse or abandonment).

If you would like to read about the BPD red flags, an easy place to start here on TAM is my description of them at My list of hell!. If that description rings a bell and the traits sound very familiar, I would be glad to discuss them with you. Take care, Ninja.


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## 2galsmom (Feb 14, 2013)

Let me just say this Uptown, I totally agree BUT, no way are my children being taught to act like their abusive father with BPD. Please note environment counts.

Ninja, if the physical abuse does not kill you, the gaslighting will. People with BPD take your mind and it takes a long time to get it back. It is almost a year after my divorce was final and only now, after almost two years of no contact am I finally deprogrammed of the poison that I was indoctrinated over a 15 year period.

I went into the BPD thread and I am not going back. Please, listen to the link Blonde posted. Counseling does not work with controlling individuals with BPD. I am 44, I wasted 7 years of my life, PRIME years trying to get my ex to operate in a grey world and not try to control everything in site as well as me. It became increasingly more abusive until the police had to be called. 

Love yourself, think for yourself and get away and place your efforts on building YOUR life and not trying to mold to his dysfunctional toxic life.


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## Ninja500 (Apr 16, 2013)

How do I tell him I am done? How do I come out and say I want a divorce? I can't seem to say it out loud to him.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Ninja500 said:


> How do I tell him I am done? How do I come out and say I want a divorce? I can't seem to say it out loud to him.


You don't say it, you serve him papers and take steps to remove yourself.

You are clearly struggling with communicating to him due to his abusive behavior (which is completely normal for someone in our position).

Take ACTION, see a lawyer > serve him papers.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Yep. Let the lawyer do it. Spend your time getting your stuff ready to move out and then leave and then have him served.


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