# My story, sorry this is so long



## Burned

Finally had the guts to post, been “Lurking” for a couple of years. 

Wife (37) and I (38) met in high school, Married a couple years after graduating and have three beautiful girls. Through the first 10 years we struggled financially but we were able to have my wife stay at home while I worked to provide for our family. Our marriage was strong; she was my best friend and the love of my life. Around our 10 year anniversary her mother became ill with breast cancer; they had a rough relationship through the years after she was diagnosed. Tough childhood, her mom would leave her with most anybody while she went out and partied and she had some sexual abuse at the hands of some of the men her mom would bring home. 

When her mom passed away I tried to be there for her in the way’s I knew how. Come home after work, help her with anything that needed to be done around the house, dinner etc. One evening I noticed a journal on her nightstand and read it, not really sure why as I trusted her and hadn’t had any issues. The first couple of pages were about her mom but came to page 3. Started out about a guy on a motorcycle while she was riding on the back, thinking this was fantasy writing until I noticed similarities to the guy we had working on re-doing our bathroom. It ended with her crying when he would leave the house and she didn’t know why. I confronted her about this and she was purely upset that I had snooped in reading her journal and that this was just her way to release her thoughts. I was hurt as I thought I would be the guy she would write about but did get over this without much problem. 

The next few months were rough as she would tell me I wasn’t there for her emotionally when her mom passed. Wasn’t long after she re-connected to an old boyfriend and the only way I knew was that we had gotten new cell phones so I had set up our online account and was looking through the call records and noticed 2-3 hour phone calls late at night after we had gone to bed. I confronted again and she denied at first then confessed that they had been talking but it was nothing. 

Day’s later I had been uploading some family pic’s to the computer and came across 2 pictures of a naked woman, looking closer I couldn’t believe it was my wife and these pictures weren’t anything she had sent to me. I was livid, but needed a little more info so I looked for her e-mail password and logged in to see more answers to the questions I had. Letter’s to him telling him if her husband found out about her boyfriend things wouldn’t be good and how the messing around on the phone would be so much better in person. 

I was crushed again and shut down completely, she asked me for a divorce and I couldn’t even look her in the eye. I was a mess, crying and lonely. I left for a couple of hours and came back to her in bed and laid next to her and put my arm on her, I’ll never forget what she said next, she rolled over to me and said “Don’t do this to yourself” and rolled back over and went to sleep. At this point I should have figured out that this woman I married and fell in love with didn’t love me and wasn’t my friend at all. 

I’m a gluten for punishment I suppose and after we separated for 6 months we tried to reconcile, I established the boundaries of N/C with the old boyfriend which didn’t last. I didn’t do anything about it either. I would find out she called him and would just be angry and sad at the same time. I didn’t say anything to her but would treat her with the same cold shoulder I was getting. I know now that wasn’t good for me and should have left and not looked back. After all our family was together which is all I wanted. I could tell she didn’t love me, wasn’t proud to be my wife by her actions. I kept taking her back and letting her walk all over me. 

Which brings me to today; three weeks ago she went camping with my family, my mom, dad, sister and another family which were friends of my mom and their adult son’s. I get a call yesterday from my dad saying he had to tell me something, and that it has been eating at him for a few days. My wife ended up drinking moonshine with one of the guys down there and was all over him, My wife has a drinking problem and it’s one where she doesn’t drink everyday but when she does drink she doesn’t know when to stop, usually ends up passing out. The next day my dad was making a run to the store and the guy came out and asked if he could go as well. The guy began to tell him how she was all over him kissing him and wanting him to go back to her tent. And that he was sorry and didn’t want any trouble from my dad or me. 

Once my dad told me again I confronted and these were her exact words to me “I don’t know what you heard but as far as I know nothing happened with him, I said she should try and talk to him to find out what they did and her response was “I don’t have his number and I’m scared because I f****** don’t remember, I’m sorry if I did but I swear on my mom I don’t remember”
I told her she needs to move out of the house ASAP and she had until the end of the month to get her stuff. I have my girls to focus on and that helps but they are a mess as well. I put so much into this relationship but I’m left wondering how could someone do this to another? I wasn’t a bad guy; I was the father of her children. Why couldn’t she of just left without doing so much damage to me? Sorry for such a long post, feel a touch better letting some of this out. Embarrassed that I let her do this to me again.


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## badmemory

Burned,

If you had come on this forum after the first time she cheated on you, you would have received advice on how to handle the situation. It would have included giving her strong consequences for her actions to judge her remorse.

If you had followed the advice, you would probably have wound up divorcing her. Not as much for for the cheating, as for the lack of remorse you describe. 

As betrayed spouses, most of us have made mistakes. You learned the hard way what we try to tell BS's every day.

CS's must receive and accept significant consequences if there is a "chance" for successful R. Your wife didn't, but it might not have mattered anyway. Sounds like she was destined to be a serial cheater. But you might have spared yourself years of false R.

I'm sorry you are here; but I hope you'll share your story with other newly betrayed spouses who often can't see the forest for the trees.

Move on with your life and digest this lesson. You deserve far better than her.


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## lovewins

First, I am very sorry for your pain.

Who knows what the future may hold -- but right now, it doesn't matter, you need to leave her. 

You are doing the right thing by separating yourself from her. 
Do not be a victim of the circumstances -- be the survivor you are more then capable of being -- for yourself, and your children.

With remorse, I would say that you need to learn the whole truth before you begin the healing process. However, in this case it doesn't sound like she has remorse, isn't trying, is a serial cheater, and doesn't care about you. She probably doesn't know the whole truth because she is drunk. But she has plenty of lies and deceit that you simply don't know about.

For yourself, you need to forgive her. In this case, you need to work with the plenty of information you have, forgive her AND get her out of your life as as soon as possible (kids make that more complicated obviously).

You need to do this for you. Not as a favor to her, but as a favor to yourself. No thought leaves the mind of the thinker. The thoughts you must be having are toxic and do not help you. 

Heal yourself without her, then find someone new, and go live the happy life you and your beautiful children deserve.


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## Burned

Badmemory,
Thank you and I know you are right. I thought my story would be different as I'm sure most do. This site has helped me get through some very dark days. 
Michzz,
Yes they do, I just loved someone who could give a rat's [email protected]@ about me. Learned the hard way. I just want to be stronger for my girls and find happiness in my heart.


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## redtulips

i just wanted to say i'm glad you are reaching out here and i agree you deserve so much better!


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## Burned

Lovewinns-How do I forgive her? I have this hatred for her but can't stop thinking about her. Even though I know she isn't good for me, I have mind movies constantly and then rage then a hollow emptiness and back to rage.


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## lovewins

Burned said:


> Lovewinns-How do I forgive her? I have this hatred for her but can't stop thinking about her. Even though I know she isn't good for me, I have mind movies constantly and then rage then a hollow emptiness and back to rage.


I know it will be difficult, but this is what I found that changed my life on the specific aspect of forgiveness. There is an MP3 audio self-help session at a website called goasksuzie.com. The specific title is *Forgiving Infidelity and Releasing Pain*. Forgiving her has nothing to do with wanting to be with her in the future -- it's all about you.

If you were considering R (you shouldn't be!!), the other recordings might also be useful. If you buy this particular session, don't waste your time with the infidelity worksheet -- you're not getting back together, you're off to go start the new happier life you deserve.


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## lovewins

lovewins said:


> *Forgiving Infidelity and Releasing Pain*


It is worth every penny of the $40 to help you heal. You deserve it.

NOTE: I have linked the above text to the site and specific content.


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## Burned

Lovewinns-Thank you for the website, I will check it out tonight. I'm not considering R, I have to many times. The last time I lasted 6 months before she tried what I call attention suicide and spent 6 days in lockdown in the hospital, got out and wanted me back. I'm her "Rock" she say's. I want to be my rock not hers! No R in my future. Just need to get out of this pain and misery. Heart races like I just ran a marathon while laying in bed.


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## KanDo

So sorry you are here; but, glad you are getting the support you need to move on. Have you contacted your attorney and filed yet? That should be your first priority.


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn

Burned said:


> Lovewinns-Thank you for the website, I will check it out tonight. I'm not considering R, I have to many times. The last time I lasted 6 months before she tried what I call attention suicide and spent 6 days in lockdown in the hospital, got out and wanted me back.* I'm her "Rock" she say's*. I want to be my rock not hers! No R in my future. Just need to get out of this pain and misery. Heart races like I just ran a marathon while laying in bed.


She treats you more like her doormat. Enough is enough. You know what you have to do to protect yourself and your family.


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## lifeistooshort

You might keep in mind that legally you can't kick her out, she is your wife. If she agrees to leave then great. If she refuses to leave you might need to take the legal route.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Acabado

Burned said:


> I was a mess, crying and lonely. I left for a couple of hours and came back to her in bed and laid next to her and put my arm on her, I’ll never forget what she said next, she rolled over to me and said *“Don’t do this to yourself” *and rolled back over and went to sleep. At this point I should have figured out that this woman I married and fell in love with didn’t love me and wasn’t my friend at all.


Yeah, that was the moment she lost any inch respect she could have and it was very little by then (not for nothing you did).

The fact she had the nerve of throwing herself to this man in front of your entire family tells you she's just totally gone. There's no way back from this. Too damaged, way far from the normal range of recoverable people.

I'm glad you finnaly reached the point of no return. 
Start living the 180 full force and put the ball rolling.
Simply reject any hoovering maneuver including suicide treats; call the ER and leave and use it for custody issues. Period.
Not a single conversation about the past and present, practical things as children schedules and logistics.

Feel how the burden disipates. Healing thoughts your way.


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## Yessongs72

Burned said:


> she rolled over to me and said “Don’t do this to yourself” and rolled back over and went to sleep


 B1tch, major blame-shifting b1tch. She's got some nads.


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## MattMatt

She is very badly damaged. The evil her mother inflicted on her? Her mother vicariously inflicted that same evil on you, via her daughter, your wife.

You wife needs deep, expert counselling. This might not help your relationship but it might help her not to implode totally.


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## warlock07

Your wife is the perpetual victim. Do you think she cheated on you physically with her old bf and the bike guy? (Getting tested for STDs)


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## Will_Kane

She is the mother of your children, so you should try to get her some help.

Women who don't deal with childhood sexual abuse often have lifelong relationship problems similar to what your wife is having.

Has your wife ever gone through any therapy for her abuse?

I'm not saying you should reconcile and I know you have your own pain to deal with, but somewhere down the line give this some thought.


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## 6301

Burned

You gave her the chance and she spit it back into your face. It's not like you just threw her out in the street when this mess first started. You can look in the mirror and say that you gave it your best and it was her lack of judgement that wrecked that marriage not yours. Your young enough to start over and your the one your kids will look to your guidance. You'll get over this and do not let her back in your life because you'll be back here again and these same people will be telling you the we told you so. Good luck in the future and don't look back.


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## alte Dame

It's obvious that your WW has very serious issues - in addition to the infidelity, she gets blackout drunk when she drinks.

It sounds like you truly see the writing on the wall now, so I'm hoping that you will seriously follow the 180 to gain some strength for you and your daughters. Their mother is damaged and self-destructive. They need you more than ever now.


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## thatbpguy

Clearly, your wife has some serious issues. Being sexually abused, drinking and not remembering... 

If you want to try and salvage the marriage I'd get her into some very serious PhD type shrink ASAP. Not a dopey counselor, but someone who really knows what they're doing. Her problems are deep seated.


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## Headspin

She exhibits a few of the behavioral patterns of borderline personality disorder BPD and maybe a mix of a few others too.

I'd check this stuff out if I were you 

I had more or less everything in your opening post and as somebody already highlighted she is the perpetual victim but actually shows little or nil remorse. Other men is seeking 'value' 'esteem' etc etc is like an addiction 

This is an unbeatable toxic potion - you can not ever beat it. EVER

It took me 15 yrs to realize that, forever forgiving supporting etc etc but to cut a long story short you will never get there with a person like this - they consume you. They also, being a victim, close off all avenues as most of your friends family end up thinking _you_ are at fault after her toxic explanations 

With all these disorders there are no cures, just a 'have to deal with it' general answer mostly through some medicinal treatments but fact is clinically if you have this stuff it's not going away - ever

You will find this hard but time is to let go. You will soon come to realize you have been effectively, emotionally eaten alive, that you have lived a lie for many years.

They will say they 'love' you but it's the kind of love frankly when you are out of it you realize you can do without. It's not love as most of us understand and know 

Good luck to you


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## Burned

KanDo said:


> So sorry you are here; but, glad you are getting the support you need to move on. Have you contacted your attorney and filed yet? That should be your first priority.


I haven't yet. I'm in a no fault state so basically we will have to go to mediation if we can't agree on Child support, alimony (Hate that) and household items. We have filed three times and I have been the fool each time. I fight the mind vs heart battle. I have lost each time.


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## Burned

lifeistooshort said:


> You might keep in mind that legally you can't kick her out, she is your wife. If she agrees to leave then great. If she refuses to leave you might need to take the legal route.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Agreed, I may have some issues with this. I told her she had until the end of the month to get out, she packed some clothes and left that day. The history is I left the marital house the other three times and figure this time she should have to figure out on her own what to do. Fingers crossed she doesn't move back in


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## Burned

warlock07 said:


> Your wife is the perpetual victim. Do you think she cheated on you physically with her old bf and the bike guy? (Getting tested for STDs)


Yes I do Warlock. He lives out of state and we flew to our hometown for my grandfathers funeral. I flew home due to work and she stayed a few more weeks. I don't have solid proof, but short frequent phone calls after I had flew home. The bike guy was just a fantasy I believe, just based on the fact our kids were very little at that time and we had three running around the house. Her journal read it more like she would ride on the back of the bike and they would pull over and well...


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## Burned

thatbpguy said:


> Clearly, your wife has some serious issues. Being sexually abused, drinking and not remembering...
> 
> If you want to try and salvage the marriage I'd get her into some very serious PhD type shrink ASAP. Not a dopey counselor, but someone who really knows what they're doing. Her problems are deep seated.


Agreed, they locked her up for a week in the hospital and she went to 2 counselor's for a month, got on antidepressants which I'm not sure she is even taking. How can you and drink the amount of alcohol she would? I could guess she isn't and by that the drinking is alot more fun.


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## Burned

Will_Kane said:


> She is the mother of your children, so you should try to get her some help.
> 
> Women who don't deal with childhood sexual abuse often have lifelong relationship problems similar to what your wife is having.
> 
> Has your wife ever gone through any therapy for her abuse?
> 
> I'm not saying you should reconcile and I know you have your own pain to deal with, but somewhere down the line give this some thought.


She has not Will_Kane. I struggle with giving her forgiveness let alone help but also know that is the right thing to do. I'm working on getting the hurt and anger gone before I deal with her in any way other than our children.


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## Burned

6301 You'll get over this and do not let her back in your life because you'll be back here again and these same people will be telling you the we told you so. Good luck in the future and don't look back.
-----
It's my 4th time through this, I have told myself "I told you so"!!!!! Along with banging my head against the wall.


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## Burned

Trying to be strong, but having a hard time today. The battle of mind vs heart and I have a front row seat. Struggling to be decent to my wife, she is trying being cordial with me but I'm very short with her. Can't seem to get this eveil woman out of my mind even though I know she is toxic to me.


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## phillybeffandswiss

IF we had a penny jar for every "I drank and do not remember" comment, we could end world hunger.

Sorry you are here.


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## Thound

How are you doing Burned?


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## Burned

Thound said:


> How are you doing Burned?


I think I'm doing better Thound, I started working out a couple of weeks ago and that has helped with less anger. Hard to get motivated at first but I sure feel so much better when I finish. 

I do still think about her an awful lot, and she texts me everyday, sometimes about the kids and sometimes about us. I only answer about the kids in short and sweet answers but no response when it's about anything other than us. She asked if we could be friends and my response was I will be friendly but I would never have friends in my life that would do the types of things she did to me. 

The hardest part is coming home to a dark empty house where my family once was. She had the girls last night and I found myself walking around the house in a daze. Then worked out for an hour and walked around some more. Maybe it's shock or I'm just going through normal pains. I have removed all her pictures from the wall but her stuff is still at the house as she comes by to switch clothes and what not while I'm at work. I take an inventory of anything she may have taken while taking my walk. So it's a day by day process but thank you very much for asking.


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## inquizitivemind

Really sorry to read about everything that has happened to you. As a woman who was cheated on in a previous marriage and divorced, you will have some rough days ahead. A lot of lonely nights, but just remember this. It really helped me at least. She doesn't actually want you back. She only wants to feel like you want her and can't have her completely. Every time I would think about this, I would never answer my ex. He really destroyed a big part of me, and it took some time and a new marriage to get everything back to ok. Some wounds will take a long time to heal, and cheating is one of them.


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## Thound

Burned said:


> I think I'm doing better Thound, I started working out a couple of weeks ago and that has helped with less anger. Hard to get motivated at first but I sure feel so much better when I finish.
> 
> I do still think about her an awful lot, and she texts me everyday, sometimes about the kids and sometimes about us. I only answer about the kids in short and sweet answers but no response when it's about anything other than us. She asked if we could be friends and my response was I will be friendly but I would never have friends in my life that would do the types of things she did to me.
> 
> The hardest part is coming home to a dark empty house where my family once was. She had the girls last night and I found myself walking around the house in a daze. Then worked out for an hour and walked around some more. Maybe it's shock or I'm just going through normal pains. I have removed all her pictures from the wall but her stuff is still at the house as she comes by to switch clothes and what not while I'm at work. I take an inventory of anything she may have taken while taking my walk. So it's a day by day process but thank you very much for asking.


Keep on working on you. You deserve a happy life. I have read it takes 1 Monty for every year you were together to get any better. I don't know if that is true or not, but I bet in the long run you are going to be fine. Hang in there buddy.


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## Burned

inquizitivemind said:


> Really sorry to read about everything that has happened to you. As a woman who was cheated on in a previous marriage and divorced, you will have some rough days ahead. A lot of lonely nights, but just remember this. It really helped me at least. She doesn't actually want you back. She only wants to feel like you want her and can't have her completely. Every time I would think about this, I would never answer my ex. He really destroyed a big part of me, and it took some time and a new marriage to get everything back to ok. Some wounds will take a long time to heal, and cheating is one of them.


Still stings to think that a person I have known for 20 years wouldn't have the respect enough to say 'I don't love you" instead of showing the world first. I agree with you regarding she doesn't want me back, more so that she hasn't loved me or respected me in years. She only wanted the lifestyle I afforded her while she went to Yoga class and hiking and sleeping in. I know I have my faults and I'm 50% to blame for the failure of my marriage but I earned the respect enough for her to be honest with me.


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## AngryandUsed

Burns,

Sorry for your pains.

This phase will pass and you will emerge much stronger.

Stay.


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## jnj express

I don't think you contributed much to the marital failure---your wife probably had major problems due to FOO issues---and they eventually manifested themselves

You tried---you gave her multiple chances---you can only kick someone so many times, and they finally bite back

As to coming home to the empty house----which is worse---loneliness, or misery----the loneliness you can do something about----the misery you can't, if you stay with her, and she keeps hurting you-----

--this last episode of straying, as has already been said---just shows she does not care one bit about you, whatsoever---

-who goes and drinks and tries to seduce another man, in front of her H's family, and friends-----your wife------my mis-statement---this woman is not anything near to being a wife----the woman you previously shared a home with---is not someone for you------even be talking to--if you can help it----stay your course---there are lots of other good, and wonderful women out there----after a while you will discover that life can be good


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## Wideopn Dave

Burned said:


> Lovewinns-Thank you for the website, I will check it out tonight. I'm not considering R, I have to many times. The last time I lasted 6 months *before she tried what I call attention suicide and spent 6 days in lockdown in the hospital, got out and wanted me back. I'm her "Rock" she say's.* I want to be my rock not hers! No R in my future. Just need to get out of this pain and misery. Heart races like I just ran a marathon while laying in bed.


Burned, I could be reading my own current story here!!! FFS what is it with these women??? My STBXW said 80% of our relationship was "perfect"......yet she stepped out 6 times for the 20% "missing emotional connection" instead of seeking IC and trying to understand why she did what she did.

I enabled my own final betrayal through taking her back 5 times instead of getting out.

I have one beautiful 17 yr old "positive" from my marriage. My daughter who has been subjected to the most despicable betrayal but has remained dignified and pure.


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## Burned

jnj express said:


> I don't think you contributed much to the marital failure---your wife probably had major problems due to FOO issues---and they eventually manifested themselves


I would be naive to think I didn't contribute to the failure of my marriage, I know I have faults as we all do. I'm not responsible for her actions of cheating. She does have FOO issues that she hasn't dealt with among other things. BPD is another issue she has. 
-----------
As to coming home to the empty house----which is worse---loneliness, or misery----the loneliness you can do something about----the misery you can't, if you stay with her, and she keeps hurting you-----

You are correct, It's almost as if I have her poison flowing through my system and it' slowly dissipating. I do know this to be true. 
----------------
-who goes and drinks and tries to seduce another man, in front of her H's family, and friends-----your wife------my mis-statement---this woman is not anything near to being a wife----the woman you previously shared a home with---is not someone for you------even be talking to--if you can help it----stay your course---there are lots of other good, and wonderful women out there----after a while you will discover that life can be good 

Someone with major problems, problems I can't help with. Thank you for the positive words of encouragement.


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## Burned

Wideopn Dave said:


> Burned, I could be reading my own current story here!!! FFS what is it with these women??? My STBXW said 80% of our relationship was "perfect"......yet she stepped out 6 times for the 20% "missing emotional connection" instead of seeking IC and trying to understand why she did what she did.
> 
> I enabled my own final betrayal through taking her back 5 times instead of getting out.
> 
> I have one beautiful 17 yr old "positive" from my marriage. My daughter who has been subjected to the most despicable betrayal but has remained dignified and pure.


Sorry you're going through this Wideopn Dave, I wouldn't wish this on anyone. I know my wife would rather blame me for her unhappiness than take the responsibility for her actions. She was alway's one to base her happiness on materialistic things, I'm afraid she will be chasing happiness the rest of her life. 

One last thought: My wife had gotten this "Live everyday like it's your last" motto and I really struggled with that as I'm the guy who had to pay for that type of thinking, I knew I had to plan for the next day. Am I wrong in thinking that type of thought isn't healthy?


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## Acabado

Burned said:


> One last thought: My wife had gotten this "Live everyday like it's your last" motto and I really struggled with that as I'm the guy who had to pay for that type of thinking, I knew I had to plan for the next day. Am I wrong in thinking that type of thought isn't healthy?


Of course it isnt. 

What are your current living arrangements? What is the plan about custody?


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## Burned

Acabado said:


> Of course it isnt.
> 
> What are your current living arrangements? What is the plan about custody?


On the day I found out she had been back in contact with the "Old boyfriend" I asked her to move out by the end of this month. She packed a few clothes that same day and moved in with her brother in a 1 bedroom apt. downtown(Just the lifestyle she needs). He has lost his job so I think that is temporary. I'm in the rental house we moved into when we R and I'm close to my girls school. She is still on the lease so technically I have no right to make her move, she just decided it was best. 

In the past we have always shared custody with one week with me and one week with her. With the very tight living quarters she is in I have had the girls most everynight with her taking them here and there. I think she is looking for an apt. close to where I'm currently living which will give us the same option of week on and week off but if she can't get into something close then I assume I will take the girls full time while she gets weekends. I don't plan on filing right away as I need her to at least make the attempt to support herself and not depend on "Alimony" which I will fight. I'm thinking I can use her attempted suicide to get what I think is fair in a settlement. She is a good mother just a horrible wife so I'm torn on some of those issues. Can't do much until she figures out where she is going to live.


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## Burned

Wideopn Dave said:


> I enabled my own final betrayal through taking her back 5 times instead of getting out.


I feel you there, I have been to embarrassed to say much to friends and family. The "I told you so" doesn't bother me as much as the I knew better and still let her back in. Does that make me a maccacist?


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## the guy

I don't give a damn what it makes you. From were I'm sitting its all about were the phuck you are going from here on out!

Sorry dude but this sh!t sucks and me and you have to dust our @sses off and get back in the saddle.

Its not what knocks us down that matters, its how we get back up that counts.

I'm pissed cuz you are letting theis women define you and brother let me tell you one thing here and that is we all diserve good things.

When I was going thru this crap the one thing that kept the bad thoughts away was this simple saying " I diserve good things"...repeated this to my self a million time a day!

Just be careful..I said it out loud once and poeple stared at me...LOL

Phuck her bro she ain't worth a second thought, next time you see her, smile, thank her, wish her the best, and say to your self " I diserve good things".........


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## the guy

You can only give so many chances...

Until they realize their too dumb to see it...

Your old lady.... well....you just can't fix stupid!


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## Burned

The Guy- I am going on a backpack camping trip to unplug from the world for a couple day's. That's where I know I'm going and I'm excited about it. 

I don't think my stbxw and I had a chance to know who we were to really define anything (We met at age 17). I was weak I will admit but I was also my own person. I'm confident this woman will not define me, I'm defined by my character and morals. I just need to know why I was weak when I needed to be a [email protected]@hole.

I appreciate your words and your resolve sounds very strong.


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## hope4family

Burned said:


> The Guy- I am going on a backpack camping trip to unplug from the world for a couple day's. That's where I know I'm going and I'm excited about it.
> 
> I don't think my stbxw and I had a chance to know who we were to really define anything (We met at age 17). I was weak I will admit but I was also my own person. I'm confident this woman will not define me, I'm defined by my character and morals. I just need to know *why I was weak when I needed to be a [email protected]@hole.*
> 
> I appreciate your words and your resolve sounds very strong.


You do not need to see this as black and white. 

It was never about you being an *******. You needed to be firm, cool, calm, and dispassionate. If you believe that makes you an *******. Then you need to change how you confront situations in your life.


----------



## Burned

I do need to change how I confront situations with her, sure trying to be Indifferent and release the feelings I still have. I'm a "nice" guy and need to change that as well. This site has so so much info that my head spins at times.


----------



## hope4family

Burned said:


> I do need to change how confront situations with her, sure trying to be Indifferent and release the feelings I still have. I'm a "nice" guy and need to change that as well. This site has so so much info that my head spins at times.


If you really feel like you are a nice guy. 

Go hit a gym, plan an outdoor event, make some new guy friends, and reaffirm your childhood friends. 

Or in other words. Start doing things for you that would make you happy. If you don't have any ideas. You are from Colorado. Man could make a good living from all the great outdoor hobby's up in the Rockies.


----------



## Burned

hope4family said:


> If you really feel like you are a nice guy.
> 
> Go hit a gym, plan an outdoor event, make some new guy friends, and reaffirm your childhood friends.
> 
> Or in other words. Start doing things for you that would make you happy. If you don't have any ideas. You are from Colorado. Man could make a good living from all the great outdoor hobby's up in the Rockies.


- I am going on a backpack camping trip to unplug from the world for a couple day's. That's where I know I'm going and I'm excited about it. 

-Working out (2 weeks now)

-Fishing/hiking/camping (Doing these this weekend)

I'm very excited to get out of town for the weekend.


----------



## Burned

It was very nice to get away from everything for a few day's and unplug from all this crap in my life. Coming back was hard as my stbxw moved most of her stuff out (Along with some of my stuff). 

I'm left with the thought this would be easier if she had just told me she didnt' love me like a wife should before she destroyed any respect I had for her. Mind movies suck!


----------



## Lovemytruck

Burned said:


> I'm left with the thought this would be easier if she had just told me she didnt' love me like a wife should before she destroyed any respect I had for her. Mind movies suck!


Those are the exact words I spoke to my exWW when I found out.

My mind movies are well past me now. It takes a couple years sometimes. You will heal as you move forward in detaching, divorcing, and dating. Move at your own pace. It is strange, but as you date again you might find yourself comparing the ex with the current women. I found that the ex didn't hold a candle them in most aspects.

I re-read you first post. You are progressing very well. It is a long journey, so be patient with yourself.


----------



## Burned

Thank you Lovemytruck! Seems like the pain runs in hours now and not day's. Still not sure how to release the pent up anger I have and that worries me. I completely cut her off and wont talk with her about what she did, that might come back to haunt me but I really dont' want to deal with this woman at the moment.


----------



## Lovemytruck

It is okay to remove yourself from the situation when you don't feel in control. I would do that whenever you feel overly angry or vunerable. Try not to let her actions make you react in an emotional way. Be cool. Stay away and the sense of dependency diminishes too.

I was a bit of a "nice" guy. Not as bad as some, but it was a tendency. You don't have to become a total bad azz, but learn to do what YOU feel like doing. Not what others always want from you.

BPD traits make it more difficult. I found that my exWW had many of those too. Separation is VITAL in breaking it off with those types. You also were 17 when you started with her. Give yourself a chance to re-invent your social life as a single. It was one of the best things that happened to me when I moved out.

Tell yourself every time you feel down that this is a step in the right direction. You don't have to accomplish anything big everyday, just endure it. Don't slide into the trap of being charmed by her. Most of these types will try all sorts of angles to get what THEY want. The time will come when the hurt is not so disabling. You will tolerate it first, then overcome it eventually.

In a few months, go back and reflect how far you have come. It will be easy to do using your posts as mile-markers. Go back in 4-5 months and re-read your op.

I really enjoy seeing some of our "regular' posters progress. Go read the first threads started by them. You will notice that they were much the same as us when they first went through this. We are all kind of similar in how we move toward healing. I really think those that move on to a D heal faster. Limbo is what grinds many into pieces. 

You will be ok, I can tell by the things you say.


----------



## Burned

I lost that round, she texted me about needing money, I lost it. I said if you had helped me by getting a job this past summer like you said you were going to you wouldn't need my money. 

"Well I didn't and there's no sense in living in the past" was her response. Blood is boiling right now!! Ahhhhhh!


----------



## Burned

Lovemytruck said:


> It is okay to remove yourself from the situation when you don't feel in control. I would do that whenever you feel overly angry or vunerable. Try not to let her actions make you react in an emotional way. Be cool. Stay away and the sense of dependency diminishes too.
> 
> I was a bit of a "nice" guy. Not as bad as some, but it was a tendency. You don't have to become a total bad azz, but learn to do what YOU feel like doing. Not what others always want from you.
> 
> BPD traits make it more difficult. I found that my exWW had many of those too. Separation is VITAL in breaking it off with those types. You also were 17 when you started with her. Give yourself a chance to re-invent your social life as a single. It was one of the best things that happened to me when I moved out.
> 
> Tell yourself every time you feel down that this is a step in the right direction. You don't have to accomplish anything big everyday, just endure it. Don't slide into the trap of being charmed by her. Most of these types will try all sorts of angles to get what THEY want. The time will come when the hurt is not so disabling. You will tolerate it first, then overcome it eventually.
> 
> In a few months, go back and reflect how far you have come. It will be easy to do using your posts as mile-markers. Go back in 4-5 months and re-read your op.
> 
> I really enjoy seeing some of our "regular' posters progress. Go read the first threads started by them. You will notice that they were much the same as us when they first went through this. We are all kind of similar in how we move toward healing. I really think those that move on to a D heal faster. Limbo is what grinds many into pieces.
> 
> You will be ok, I can tell by the things you say.


I need to be stronger, having a very hard time with that. I understand this woman knows how to press my buttons but geesh I wish she would just go away.


----------



## badmemory

Burned said:


> I lost that round, she texted me about needing money, I lost it. I said if you had helped me by getting a job this past summer like you said you were going to you wouldn't need my money.
> 
> "Well I didn't and there's no sense in living in the past" was her response. Blood is boiling right now!! Ahhhhhh!


Response:

"And particularly not your past".


----------



## Lovemytruck

Burned said:


> I lost that round, she texted me about* needing money*, I lost it. I said if you had helped me by getting a job this past summer like you said you were going to you wouldn't need my money.
> 
> *"Well I didn't and there's no sense in living in the past" was her response.* Blood is boiling right now!! Ahhhhhh!


Bold parts are those traits you talked about earlier. She is entitled and displaces her problems by blaming you. The victim role is probably her strongest suit for a rescuer like you. If she is like my ex, she will also be sweet as pie sometime down the road. Distance and time are your allies.

Just remind yourself that she only is worrying about what she wants, and you are a source of her security.

It is okay to lose it now and then. You will get better at it as the emotions simmer down over the next few weeks.

Are you working on a social network of friends, family, and stuff? It usually is our (men) weakness. We need to build up new networks or revive old ones. It will help. TAM is good to get input, but you need a few people to have FUN with. Adults that you can enjoy.

When you start to focus your efforts on new people, the old sh!tty ones fade away.


----------



## hope4family

Lovemytruck said:


> Bold parts are those traits you talked about earlier. She is entitled and displaces her problems by blaming you. The victim role is probably her strongest suit for a rescuer like you. If she is like my ex, she will also be sweet as pie sometime down the road. Distance and time are your allies.
> 
> Just remind yourself that she only is worrying about what she wants, and you are a source of her security.
> 
> It is okay to lose it now and then. You will get better at it as the emotions simmer down over the next few weeks.
> 
> Are you working on a social network of friends, family, and stuff? It usually is our (men) weakness. We need to build up new networks or revive old ones. It will help. TAM is good to get input, but you need a few people to have FUN with. Adults that you can enjoy.
> 
> When you start to focus your efforts on new people, the old sh!tty ones fade away.


Bingo. 

Look at it this way fellow rescue. Time to rescue the most important person on earth. You. 

Once you rescue yourself, you will find that taking care of those you love (your daughters) will come as second nature. You must see yourself as the greatest person in need of rescuing.


----------



## Burned

Lovemytruck said:


> Bold parts are those traits you talked about earlier. She is entitled and displaces her problems by blaming you. The victim role is probably her strongest suit for a rescuer like you. If she is like my ex, she will also be sweet as pie sometime down the road. Distance and time are your allies.
> 
> Just remind yourself that she only is worrying about what she wants, and you are a source of her security.
> 
> It is okay to lose it now and then. You will get better at it as the emotions simmer down over the next few weeks.
> 
> Are you working on a social network of friends, family, and stuff? It usually is our (men) weakness. We need to build up new networks or revive old ones. It will help. TAM is good to get input, but you need a few people to have FUN with. Adults that you can enjoy.
> 
> When you start to focus your efforts on new people, the old sh!tty ones fade away.



She displays many BPD traits and blaming me for her problems has been an issue for a long time. Chasing happiness is going to be her downfall. I can see that coming as it has in the past.

I'm trying to take things slow, process my feelings and deal with them head on. It gets lonely at times but I have an issue with codependency that I want to explore and get rid of.


----------



## Burned

hope4family said:


> Bingo.
> 
> Look at it this way fellow rescue. Time to rescue the most important person on earth. You.
> 
> Once you rescue yourself, you will find that taking care of those you love (your daughters) will come as second nature. You must see yourself as the greatest person in need of rescuing.


Well said! I surely want to rescue myself and become a stronger person. If I can't be right then how do I expect my daughters to be?

Still very strange to me that after being together for 20 years that she can treat me like her worst enemy.


----------



## Lovemytruck

I could have written your story 2 1/2 years ago. These tend to be so familiar for so many of us.

Codependency? Lonely? Those are a couple of things many of us need to work on when it ends. I would assume you are primarily a "giver" by nature. Same here.

You will do well. It is evident in your self-analysis. You are looking and posting your issues. You are probably being very honest in your assessment. I am not an expert, but I have gone through these things too.

Codependency will mellow as you live on your own. You may also find future dates/girlfriends that will be much more "giving" than you have experienced. The realization that you do too much is half the battle. When you start new relationships, make a concerted effort to allow them to give to you. It is their way of sharing their love. Don't deny them opportunities to serve you. You can do nice things in return, but focus on meeting them in the middle.

Lonely? I hated that too. You will find that the lonely goes away for most middle-aged single men that have decent qualities. The social scene becomes less of a problem as you find new friends, neighbors, churches, clubs, etc. I remember MANY people all of a sudden wanting to line me up with dates and things to do. Make a point to get out and try new things. I would even advise you to try a little on-line dating. It is okay to at least LOOK and see what kinds of women are in your area. I am sure it will give you hope.

Your new adventures begin here. 

Good luck my friend. You will be ok. Give it time.


----------



## Burned

Lovemytruck said:


> I could have written your story 2 1/2 years ago. These tend to be so familiar for so many of us.
> 
> Codependency? Lonely? Those are a couple of things many of us need to work on when it ends. I would assume you are primarily a "giver" by nature. Same here.
> *Most definitely a giver and rescuer. It helps hearing that as I find it comforting to know my story isn't as crazy as it is in my head. *
> 
> You will do well. It is evident in your self-analysis. You are looking and posting your issues. You are probably being very honest in your assessment. I am not an expert, but I have gone through these things too.
> 
> *I'm trying to be as honest as I can, I do understand there's my side, her side and then the truth. I have plenty of issues (But none that I can directly think of that would have caused her to do this to me)*
> 
> Codependency will mellow as you live on your own. You may also find future dates/girlfriends that will be much more "giving" than you have experienced. The realization that you do too much is half the battle. When you start new relationships, make a concerted effort to allow them to give to you. It is their way of sharing their love. Don't deny them opportunities to serve you. You can do nice things in return, but focus on meeting them in the middle.
> 
> *Great advice! I do tend to be very giving and need to learn how to compromise. Getting my confidence up is another thing for me to work on. *
> 
> Lonely? I hated that too. You will find that the lonely goes away for most middle-aged single men that have decent qualities. The social scene becomes less of a problem as you find new friends, neighbors, churches, clubs, etc. I remember MANY people all of a sudden wanting to line me up with dates and things to do. Make a point to get out and try new things. I would even advise you to try a little on-line dating. It is okay to at least LOOK and see what kinds of women are in your area. I am sure it will give you hope.
> 
> Your new adventures begin here.
> 
> Good luck my friend. You will be ok. Give it time.


*It doesn' t seem to be as lonely as I felt the first couple of weeks but longing for adult conversation and interaction. Hanging out with friends has been nice but I try and not talk about what I'm going through as I feel it brings people down. The on-line dating might be nice, More time is needed for me, I don't want to be the broken guy out dating. Thank you again Lovemytruck! Your positive words are so very needed. *


----------



## Lovemytruck

You are welcome! It is good to know that you are doing better. The pain is one of the worst. Helping others reminds me of the help I received. Keep us posted!


----------



## Chuck71

Burned you are holding up well

she will use CS and alimony as a tool for income from you

the guy she was all over....she intended to get caught

she had done it before and you took her back

now she is on the prowl for anyone

after you faced her with consequences

Stay focused, when you meet to swap kids

smile, be happy, 'fake it till you can make it'

her vicious cycle will continue 

give defiant people what they want

it never turns out how they expected it to


----------



## Burned

Burned said:


> She displays many BPD traits and blaming me for her problems has been an issue for a long time. Chasing happiness is going to be her downfall. I can see that coming as it has in the past.QUOTE]
> 
> This comment has bugged me since I typed it. After reading some other forums in here that talked about BPD I know I'm not an expert at diagnosing BPD and so I shouldn't be diagnosing my stbxw. After all she could be the "Normal" one and I could have the problems.
> 
> I will say it's been 2 day's since she last contacted me and I feel so much better, distance for now is the key.


----------



## wcd6891

Im an soooo sorry for your pain. Its not the norm that this happens to a man but when it doesn't it seems to be much worse. You've put your all into this and she doesn't appreciate it. People, not even a man or a woman, but us in general feel like the grass is greener on the other side but to realize that is was turf all along and it wasn't really. You get that divorce finalized and you find a wife that wants to receive the love that you have deep inside. Please don't become bitter because that's what happen to most men when they have been done wrong by a man. Be the man you know you can be.


----------



## Burned

wcd6891 said:


> Im an soooo sorry for your pain. Its not the norm that this happens to a man but when it doesn't it seems to be much worse. You've put your all into this and she doesn't appreciate it. People, not even a man or a woman, but us in general feel like the grass is greener on the other side but to realize that is was turf all along and it wasn't really. You get that divorce finalized and you find a wife that wants to receive the love that you have deep inside. Please don't become bitter because that's what happen to most men when they have been done wrong by a man. Be the man you know you can be.


Thank you wcd, I'm a happy person by nature meaning that I don't need materialistic items to be happy. Once the pain and anger subside I have faith I will be that happy go lucky person again and not be bitter. I do understand not everybody is unfaithful and I believe I will find that "somebody" someday. 

The divorce will take a while as I'm in no hurry to start that process for the third time. I'm going to let her get settled into her new life and once my anger diminishes I can make some clear cut decisions.


----------



## Burned

So I have been thinking about this "Affair fog" that WS's seem to be in, is it possible the BS goes through this as well? Been 22 day's since my dday and I think my "fog" is lifting a bit. Like I'm taking a step back from my marriage and seeing it for what it really was, a mirage.


----------



## badmemory

Burned said:


> So I have been thinking about this "Affair fog" that WS's seem to be in, is it possible the BS goes through this as well? Been 22 day's since my dday and I think my "fog" is lifting a bit. Like I'm taking a step back from my marriage and seeing it for what it really was, a mirage.


My friend, the BS fog is what you have been in for the last 20 years. What you're going through now is just the withdrawal symptoms.


----------



## Burned

badmemory said:


> My friend, the BS fog is what you have been in for the last 20 years. What you're going through now is just the withdrawal symptoms.


When the fog lifts a bit I feel confidence, happiness and relief. The fog settles in and I feel sadness, alone and of the good times I had with her. I want a huge fan to blow the fog away for good. Clarity will be my rainbow.


----------



## TDSC60

Burned

You appear to be handling this fairly well but there are two things you should consider.

First your comment about not talking to friends about your situation because you feel it brings them down. You need to talk this over with someone. Be it a friend, a family member, or a counselor. Do NOT hold these feelings of anger and confusion inside. They need to be expressed to someone for you to proceed to recover. I don't remember if you are in IC. If not, you should be. Find a counselor who is familiar with Post Traumatic Stress. Most of the feelings you are having seem to fit.

Second, it appears your wife is still controlling you even though you don't see it. You said you are not pushing the divorce because you are waiting for her "living arrangements" to be finalized. WHY ARE YOU WAITING? Because you are still trying to solve her problems. Because you are still trying to take care of her. Because you are still comfortable being her doormat. You need to do this for you. Forget about her. She has made her choice. Concentrate on yourself. DO WHAT YOU NEED. Now is the time for you to be the selfish one for once.

Good luck to you.


----------



## hope4family

TDSC60 said:


> Second, it appears your wife is still controlling you even though you don't see it. You said you are not pushing the divorce because you are waiting for her "living arrangements" to be finalized. WHY ARE YOU WAITING? Because you are still trying to solve her problems. Because you are still trying to take care of her. Because you are still comfortable being her doormat. You need to do this for you. Forget about her. She has made her choice. Concentrate on yourself. DO WHAT YOU NEED. Now is the time for you to be the selfish one for once.


I have to say this is true. A court isn't going to look at you and say. "Gee I guess you owe her less alimony because you have made sure she is on her own two feet." 

That is unlikely, and possibly dependent on a lot of factors. 

In a large way. When my ex wanted to leave. I believe my response of "there is the door, why haven't you already left" was the correct response.


----------



## Burned

TDSC60 said:


> Burned
> 
> You appear to be handling this fairly well but there are two things you should consider.
> 
> First your comment about not talking to friends about your situation because you feel it brings them down. You need to talk this over with someone. Be it a friend, a family member, or a counselor. Do NOT hold these feelings of anger and confusion inside. They need to be expressed to someone for you to proceed to recover. I don't remember if you are in IC. If not, you should be. Find a counselor who is familiar with Post Traumatic Stress. Most of the feelings you are having seem to fit.
> 
> *I say that TD based on my friends and family have been through this with me now three times, I have leaned on them everytime but after a while I can tell it wears on them as well. After all what can they tell me this time that they haven't in the past? I'm not in IC and don't plan on it at this time, maybe more for my kids although they have been in IC the last time we went through this.*
> 
> Second, it appears your wife is still controlling you even though you don't see it. You said you are not pushing the divorce because you are waiting for her "living arrangements" to be finalized. WHY ARE YOU WAITING? Because you are still trying to solve her problems. Because you are still trying to take care of her. Because you are still comfortable being her doormat. You need to do this for you. Forget about her. She has made her choice. Concentrate on yourself. DO WHAT YOU NEED. Now is the time for you to be the selfish one for once.
> 
> *Here is where my thinking is on this, please tell me if I'm wrong with any of my thought process. I have filed for divorce twice in the past, both times I paid for it and went as far as going to a mediator both times. I know how she is and what she wants, money and more money. We have always agreed on 50% parent time which helps with the child support and alimony calculations. When we reconciled this past time I knew I wanted some change to my life so we moved into a house that is much closer to my work and much further from her's (She has had summer's off) so she had a little relief from the long drive. I'm waiting for her to choose a place to live that will prevent her from being able to take 50% of the parenting time and make it maybe 25% her and 75% me.. That will also help me with the child support and alimony calculations. I don't want to bury her I just want her to make the effort to support herself which she refused to do while being with me. So I guess my reasoning is selfish but I don't know if it's right. Also right now there is no court order to pay her anything which I'm not doing, she moved out and I have the kids fulltime, pay for their school suplies, clothes etc. I'm fine with this as I'm not supporting her in any financial way. Would love feedback on this.*
> Good luck to you.


----------



## Burned

hope4family said:


> I have to say this is true. A court isn't going to look at you and say. "Gee I guess you owe her less alimony because you have made sure she is on her own two feet."
> 
> That is unlikely, and possibly dependent on a lot of factors.
> 
> In a large way. When my ex wanted to leave. I believe my response of "there is the door, why haven't you already left" was the correct response.


It all comes down to calculations of income and length of marriage and parenting time here in Colorado. I don't care if the courts think I owe her or don't owe her, there is no court order at this time so I pay her nothing. If I can get her thinking the best way is for me to keep the kids on a 75% parenting plan then that helps me tremendously on having to pay. I make in the 50 ish range and with three kids and a house payment that doesn't go very far.


----------



## Burned

Woke up to an honest text from stbxw.

"(Me) I wanted you to know that this has nothing to do with OM, Yes I was very confused and care about you both. How can I tell you that I love you both?!. I can't be with either of you and I need help with my drinking and mental state. I am truly sorry for hurting you and the 20 years we have been together I am greatful for. I wasn't mature enough to tell you how I felt and was scared. I know you will find someone who will love you and treat you right. You deserve it. I really prayed that I was that person but I am not. You are a good person and a great father. We aren't good for each other. We did make three beautiful girl's though and I'm so blessed that you are their daddy."

At least it seems damn honest to me. Wish I had gotten this text before the EA's and PA. I know this woman doesn't love me and can tell by her actions. Feeling relieved a little but also sad that I didn't get the honesty earlier.


----------



## Acabado

I imagine it provides some relief, the you can unburden yourself from making this work anymore.
Hope she put those words into actions and get help for her issues, at least to be the mother your kids deserve.

BTW, does that mean she was still involved with a EA-PA OM different from the last one at the camp?


----------



## Burned

Acabado said:


> I imagine it provides some relief, the you can unburden yourself from making this work anymore.
> Hope she put those words into actions and get help for her issues, at least to be the mother your kids deserve.
> 
> BTW, does that mean she was still involved with a EA-PA OM different from the last one at the camp?



Yeah, The camp guy was a random dude that she got drunk with. The old boyfriend is the one she loves along with me but can't be with either. He lives in another state, and doesn't have the same feeling's for her as she does for him (Thank's to keylogger for that info)

Then there was another random dude from the same state as old boyfriend that she had a serious EA with for 3 months. 

Not sure why it hurts more than I thought it did, I will chalk it up to needing more time to heal. Why does this suck when I know I will be better off for it?


----------



## CEL

The heart and the mind do not always talk.


----------



## TDSC60

Burned said:


> Woke up to an honest text from stbxw.
> 
> "(Me) I wanted you to know that this has nothing to do with OM, Yes I was very confused and care about you both. How can I tell you that I love you both?!. I can't be with either of you and I need help with my drinking and mental state. I am truly sorry for hurting you and the 20 years we have been together I am greatful for. I wasn't mature enough to tell you how I felt and was scared. I know you will find someone who will love you and treat you right. You deserve it. I really prayed that I was that person but I am not. You are a good person and a great father. We aren't good for each other. We did make three beautiful girl's though and I'm so blessed that you are their daddy."
> 
> At least it seems damn honest to me. Wish I had gotten this text before the EA's and PA. I know this woman doesn't love me and can tell by her actions. Feeling relieved a little but also sad that I didn't get the honesty earlier.


Sounds honest to me. Now accept it and move forward. All your feelings about the whole situation are normal and even common if you ask me. Regret, sadness, anger, confusion, even failure - all to be expected and normal. Just don't let those feelings take over your life as you move on.

Take care of yourself and your kids. WW is no longer your responsibility (problem). She made her choices and she has chosen her path. Now you have to do the same FOR YOURSELF and your daughters.

I know you cannot turn off your feelings for her after 20 years and three kids. Just do not let her be the first, second, third, or even fourth thing you consider as you move forward.


----------



## Burned

TDSC60 said:


> Sounds honest to me. Now accept it and move forward. All your feelings about the whole situation are normal and even common if you ask me. Regret, sadness, anger, confusion, even failure - all to be expected and normal. Just don't let those feelings take over your life as you move on.
> 
> Take care of yourself and your kids. WW is no longer your responsibility (problem). She made her choices and she has chosen her path. Now you have to do the same FOR YOURSELF and your daughters.
> 
> I know you cannot turn off your feelings for her after 20 years and three kids. Just do not let her be the first, second, third, or even fourth thing you consider as you move forward.


Thank you TD. I will work on taking care of myself and children. I can't tell all of you enough how much your support through this time of hell has ment to me. Thank all of you for the great advice, I will keep all of you updated on my progress to the new me. 

Going out tonight with some good friends and I'm excited about getting out and socalize.


----------



## life101

All the best in your new adventure. Never forget, happiness is a cheating spouse on the rearview mirror.


----------



## Chuck71

Forgiving her will do more for yourself than anything

She admitted to her troubles with the bottle and mental issues

The mental aspect aids the drinking

Admitting to something is a start but

taking action to correct it is another

No she should not seek help for you

but the three children

The odds are good she suffered something in her childhood

she needs to realize, the daughters are seeing all this

the last thing they need is to grow up in constant chaos

or they may end up doing similar things like their mom

you can't fake 20 years, don't care how good someone can act

but Burnt don't blame yourself, she is very upset with herself

and does not know what to do about it


----------



## Headspin

Burned said:


> Not sure why it hurts more than I thought it did, I will chalk it up to needing more time to heal. Why does this suck when I know I will be better off for it?


This is simplistic but it is how I view it

All human endeavour is built this way. In anything if you give it the full 100% - your best shot and you lose you still feel a satisfaction even though you lost and are disappointed maybe hurt.

In a relationship you give it everything and if the other partner cannot reciprocate your feelings and they are honest, they will end it. It will hurt but you will always respect their honesty for not wanting to hurt you any more 

However if in any endeavor there is cheating involved, even in a game, you're cheated, you're betrayed, there is treachery and it is a thousand % unfair and you can not feel any respect for the other party just the same as in a marriage break up that involves infidelity.

When you have given everything in any situation and been cheated out of a fair result we can never imo be comfortable with it.


----------



## treyvion

Burned said:


> Yeah, The camp guy was a random dude that she got drunk with. The old boyfriend is the one she loves along with me but can't be with either. He lives in another state, and doesn't have the same feeling's for her as she does for him (Thank's to keylogger for that info)
> 
> Then there was another random dude from the same state as old boyfriend that she had a serious EA with for 3 months.
> 
> Not sure why it hurts more than I thought it did, I will chalk it up to needing more time to heal. Why does this suck when I know I will be better off for it?


Keyloggers, what other forms of monitoring where you using in this situation?


----------



## Burned

treyvion said:


> Keyloggers, what other forms of monitoring where you using in this situation?


Once I had the keylogger set up I had access to everything she had. She is a technophobe, to the point where she couldn't send the naked pictures to OM by herself, he had to walk her through the process. And with a note from her at the bottom that said enjoy these! (That just made me mad as hell) 



I suppose I monitored body language and how she treated me, subtle stuff.

A few months back I did consider using a VAR as she was going to GNO more often but didn't need to. I had told myself that if she called OM again I was done, I had told myself this in the past but never did anything about it. This time I did and asked to her leave as soon as I found out she made that call. A few day's later I find out she had a ONS while drunk and while camping with my family. Ughhh! I though the rage was moving on but I guess I just pushed it further down the depths of my soul. Feeling angry now.


----------



## Lovemytruck

Just re-reading your story, and catching up on your current posts.

Very good! I know you are still in that vicious cycle of emotions. The posts you have made here and to others show how well you are progressing.

I agree with the recent posts about your text from the STBXW. She is having a moment of honesty, and knows that she is not at your level for being married. My exWW use to say that she loved me enough to let me go.  Kind of the same mentality.

The mood will probably change for her as the D settlement begins. Their greed has a nasty way of coming back to the surface. You will be the bad guy again. BPD traits will likely show as you are now evil in her eyes. She will jump back into the victim role. If not, count your blessings and move through it the best you can.

Keep us posted! Good to see you are now helping others with great insights!


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

Burned said:


> Woke up to an honest text from stbxw.
> 
> "(Me) I wanted you to know that this has nothing to do with OM, Yes I was very confused and care about you both. How can I tell you that I love you both?!. I can't be with either of you and I need help with my drinking and mental state. I am truly sorry for hurting you and the 20 years we have been together I am greatful for. I wasn't mature enough to tell you how I felt and was scared. I know you will find someone who will love you and treat you right. You deserve it. I really prayed that I was that person but I am not. You are a good person and a great father. We aren't good for each other. We did make three beautiful girl's though and I'm so blessed that you are their daddy."


It doesn't make up for 20 years, but you have something many BSs don't,you do have an apology.

Take it at face value and move on.

Good luck.


----------



## the guy

Cheer up, football season started today...well preseason any way!

Are you a Bronco's fan?


----------



## Burned

the guy said:


> Cheer up, football season started today...well preseason any way!
> 
> Are you a Bronco's fan?


Charger fan in Bronco land. I heard they lost big time last night. Well at least we have a former Bronco as our coach.


----------



## Chuck71

Lovemytruck said:


> Just re-reading your story, and catching up on your current posts.
> 
> Very good! I know you are still in that vicious cycle of emotions. The posts you have made here and to others show how well you are progressing.
> 
> I agree with the recent posts about your text from the STBXW. She is having a moment of honesty, and knows that she is not at your level for being married. My exWW use to say that she loved me enough to let me go.  Kind of the same mentality.
> 
> The mood will probably change for her as the D settlement begins. Their greed has a nasty way of coming back to the surface. You will be the bad guy again. BPD traits will likely show as you are now evil in her eyes. She will jump back into the victim role. If not, count your blessings and move through it the best you can.
> 
> Keep us posted! Good to see you are now helping others with great insights!


:iagree:


----------



## Chuck71

Burned said:


> Charger fan in Bronco land. I heard they lost big time last night. Well at least we have a former Bronco as our coach.


I think I saw on NFL Network, the 1981 San Diego v. Miami game

thriller, 41-38coming on next week....

Foults, Winslow, Chandler, Muncie

ok....they had no D


----------



## Burned

So stbxw calls and has to drop a bed off at the house, one she found but needs a place to store it. I say sure you can put it in the shed. Pull's up with new guy who helped her load the bed into the shed, as they are walking back to the truck he grabs her ass. 

This bothered me, my question is, should it have? I felt really good all week, good communication about the kids, hadn't seen her in two or three weeks. I had heard this before about my stbxw, she is like Tarzan, she will swing vine to vine but won't let go of either vine until she has the next one secure. Thought that analogy was funny but maybe it has some truth.


----------



## LostViking

I'm sorry you had to see that. She is one cold hearted beotch.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## BjornFree

It would bother anyone but you need to force yourself to act as normally as you can when you're around her. 

And stop doing her favors. If she wants place to store her new bed she can use her boyfriend's place, if he has one that is. Call her up and tell her that she needs to get the bed in the next two days or you're giving it off to charity.

Right now she considers You her little helper b!tch. Put her straight.


----------



## Dyokemm

Burned,

Just caught up on your thread and read your STBxW's apology.

Personally, I find it rather ridiculous that she said she never intended to hurt you.

I call that bs. She chose to cheat on you while lying to you about her true feelings and intentions. It didn't just happen by accident.

She was using you until she had a safe place to land. This isn't the action of a person who doesn't want to hurt you, not to mention the fact that she basically rubbed her cheating in your and your entire family's face during the camping trip.

The rest of her blather about how you aren't right for each other , but she cherishes you being the father of her children, you will find someone who truly loves you, blah, blah,blah...is nothing more that a nice sounding sop that serves to justify her cheating and make it sound like a good thing under the circumstances.

She hasn't got a real ounce of remorse or care for you in the world.

I would have told her to stick her apology where the sun don't shine.

Don't accept such drivel which is meant to make her feel better as a person and assuage her guilt.


----------



## Chaparral

BjornFree said:


> It would bother anyone but you need to force yourself to act as normally as you can when you're around her.
> 
> And stop doing her favors. If she wants place to store her new bed she can use her boyfriend's place, if he has one that is. Call her up and tell her that she needs to get the bed in the next two days or you're giving it off to charity.
> 
> Right now she considers You her little helper b!tch. Put her straight.


And tell her why. Tell her to not even think of bringing that kind of trash around your house or daughters again. If I were you I would do every thing possible to keep him away from my daughters. Try to limit custody.


----------



## Chaparral

See if you can force her to have a psychiatric evaluation.


----------



## warlock07

Burned said:


> So stbxw calls and has to drop a bed off at the house, one she found but needs a place to store it. I say sure you can put it in the shed. Pull's up with new guy who helped her load the bed into the shed, as they are walking back to the truck he grabs her ass.
> 
> This bothered me, my question is, should it have? I felt really good all week, good communication about the kids, hadn't seen her in two or three weeks. I had heard this before about my stbxw, she is like Tarzan, she will swing vine to vine but won't let go of either vine until she has the next one secure. Thought that analogy was funny but maybe it has some truth.



forward her the apology she sent you


----------



## manfromlamancha

I cannot believe that she showed up at your place with a guy! Yet another one at that! You should get rid of the bed.


----------



## Burned

So today I come home from getting a few things at the store and pull up with her car at the house. Thinking she is picking up our daughter I don't say much and start putting the groceries away but no sign of her. I had some laundry going so I went down to grab the clothes and still no sign of her. Go to my daughters room and there she is sleeping in her bed. WTF?!?!? 


I know I needed to tread lightly with her but really? It's still her house and I legally can't kick her out but she has been out of the house 1 month today. I'm sure it was a great night for her.


----------



## Chaparral

Check with your lawyer. I remember one thread where the wayward moved out and was not entitled to move back in.

You should have already changed the locks sop.


----------



## the guy

Why did't she use the bed in the shed?


----------



## DavidWYoung

OK, I am going to try and do this. I was you, twenty five years ago. I made all the same mistakes that you have made but I have had twenty five years to learn from this.Here is what I think I learned.

1. You are you, you are not man and wife, you are just you!

2. Com paired to the rest of the world, you are super duper, even if your STBXW says you are not. You, Super Duper, Her, Not So Much!

3. You must not let her set the standard in your life, you set the standard in YOUR life. This is very important!

4. Your life is a gift, everyday is important and to be enjoyed. Even if it is watching the wind in the trees or two butterflies chasing each other it is a gift that has a short time line.

5. Stop concerning your self on your wife's actions, that is her life, and her choice and she is going to do what she wants. She has NO HONOR. She is not someone you should stay married to.

6. Ask for some help on getting your head on straight ( But not from me because I am crazy and I know it. ) and starting a new life because it is coming weather you want it or not!

7. Forgive yourself and your STBXW. Never speak to her again and learn from this mistake. Good luck David


----------



## Burned

Instead of asking her to leave I went out and mowed the lawn. 3 hours later while I was watering she came out and asked where she could leave some money she had (She said it was 1/2 of the school registration) I said she could have it, and she had this look like she wanted me to say something more, she looked like she was going to cry. I turned around and continued watering never turning around again. 

I feel pretty good, I danced with the devil and don't feel worse for wear. It's almost like she wanted me to come in and talk with her. I had dinner laying out thawing, fresh watermelon for my girls, house was cleaned, laundry was going. Maybe for a split second she missed the family lifestyle, Not sure but I feel pretty good.


----------



## LostViking

I think you handled that well. Detach.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## phillybeffandswiss

Burned said:


> Maybe for a split second she missed the family lifestyle, Not sure but I feel pretty good.


There isn't a maybe, you know that's what happened. She took a nap, woke up, there was no fight, saw food ready, you were doing yard work and you talked about school for the kids. 

That sounds like a typical family day and your actions were like a slap in the face.


----------



## Chuck71

Burned said:


> So stbxw calls and has to drop a bed off at the house, one she found but needs a place to store it. I say sure you can put it in the shed. Pull's up with new guy who helped her load the bed into the shed, as they are walking back to the truck he grabs her ass.
> 
> This bothered me, my question is, should it have? I felt really good all week, good communication about the kids, hadn't seen her in two or three weeks. I had heard this before about my stbxw, she is like Tarzan, she will swing vine to vine but won't let go of either vine until she has the next one secure. Thought that analogy was funny but maybe it has some truth.


that was very uncalled for. very classless

what was she thinking? "oohhh look at my man

he can guzzle liquor faster than I can."

Pop told me as a kid, "chit begots chit"

consider yourself lucky she can now be someone elses problem

But I know this bothered you...I wish you did not have to see it

The respectable thing for her to have done was her bring it

and you and her or just you put it in

My ex of February 2013, went from wanting me to spend the 

weekend with her in April (she wanted out, wanted freedom, 

space back in the Fall and I gave her exactly what she wanted)

to "in a relationhip" on FB about six weeks later. Fast forward

six more weeks and....they're engaged :rofl:

BUT.....not a nary pic of the two of them together.

Best thing about this......IDGAF

I will always love who she WAS not what she now IS


----------



## Chuck71

I agree, get rid of that bed. Give her 24 hours to come get it

or call Salvation Army to come get it. I should have waited to

post until I had caught up. But to a degree, this was done with 

intent to inflict pain on you. They probably never slept on it

but your mind movies will tell you they did. As for the sleeping over

....research your state laws, some states say if the other person 

abandons the property for more than two weeks, they forfeit their 

rights to it. A great attorney question. I will quote what my mom told me

between the time we filed for D and the D final....

"she did you a favor by setting you free" 

she did you a tremendous favor!


----------



## tulsy

Burned said:


> So today I come home from getting a few things at the store and pull up with her car at the house. Thinking she is picking up our daughter I don't say much and start putting the groceries away but no sign of her. I had some laundry going so I went down to grab the clothes and still no sign of her. Go to my daughters room and there she is sleeping in her bed. WTF?!?!?
> 
> 
> I know I needed to tread lightly with her but really? It's still her house and I legally can't kick her out but she has been out of the house 1 month today. I'm sure it was a great night for her.


Change the locks. What are you waiting for?

Tell her after she brought another man over, you are not comfortable with her having him in the house when you aren't there. She doesn't live there anymore...access no more.


----------



## Horizon

The effing hide of some people. they are either total heartless a-holes or just so dumb that they can't see what effect their actions have on people let alone so called nearest and dearest.

It really stings to see how some people evolve.


----------



## Horizon

....devolve....


----------



## Burned

I'm treading lightly here with my stbxw, we have three teenage girls so I will have to communicate with her, I have only done so by text at this point. School starts soon so I'm also sure that I will have to talk to her. 

I had asked her to leave her key and garage door opener at the house which she refused and said she wouldn't because most of her stuff is here. We haven't gone through any of our household items although being the third time through this we have a pretty good idea of what is her's and mine. Also thinking that she could come over to the house anytime while I'm at work as the girls would just let her in anyway and I will not put them in the middle of this and tell them to not let their mom in. 

No communication since the "Nap" day at "my house". Didn't like it but like my friend said "your trying to figuring out what she's doing when she doesn't even know". I would be lying if I said I didn't think about her often, I do try and close that feeling off but it comes back. 

I do think I will start the divorce paperwork, the self help center is awesome!!


----------



## Chuck71

my ex left a ton of stuff here............because she thought she was

coming back home soon. She learned I had a change of plans


----------



## Burned

I don't want to poke the bear. How did she react Chuck? I'm just starting the divorce process on my own, I figure her bringing over a guy to help load her bed was more my problem as I let it bother me, she doesn't care or even doesn't think about things before she does them. I'm really trying to not let her crap bother me as again it's my problem it bother me not her's.


----------



## Lovemytruck

Burned said:


> I don't want to poke the bear. How did she react Chuck? I'm just starting the divorce process on my own, I figure her bringing over a guy to help load her bed was more my problem as I let it bother me, she doesn't care or even doesn't think about things before she does them. I'm really trying to not let her crap bother me as again it's my problem it bother me not her's.


That has to be tough, but you are recognizing it for what it is...her being an arse.

The emotional stuff will be easier as you get the D finalized. I predict that it will also be better for you as you meet/date new women.

Living well will be your best revenge, IMO.


----------



## Burned

Lovemytruck said:


> That has to be tough, but you are recognizing it for what it is...her being an arse.
> 
> The emotional stuff will be easier as you get the D finalized. I predict that it will also be better for you as you meet/date new women.
> 
> Living well will be your best revenge, IMO.


Well said! The best part about her coming over last weekend with new guy and nap day, she has no idea how much that bothered me. She will never know that, I figure she can do what she wants, it's up to me to handle the reaction. I'm striving for indifference. 

I can't wait to start meeting woman. I have been sheltering myself but I do find my mind day dreaming of meeting a woman, I also know when I start looking I don't find much.


----------



## Chaparral

Many guys here have had reasons to not change the locks. It isn't funny reading later that their wayward wife came in while they were gone and got her stuff plus a whole lot of her husbands stuff. One took everything.

Of course your wife would not do that cause you can trust her now. Just kidding.


----------



## Burned

Chaparral said:


> Many guys here have had reasons to not change the locks. It isn't funny reading later that their wayward wife came in while they were gone and got her stuff plus a whole lot of her husbands stuff. One took everything.
> 
> Of course your wife would not do that cause you can trust her now. Just kidding.


I did struggle with that Chapparral, my problem is my girls would let her in anyway.Stbxw started her job this week, girls start school next week. Might be in a better position to change the locks but again all she will have to do is ask the girls to let her in and they will (As they should, it's their mom after all) I'm sure they would think it strange their mom loading all the houshold stuff while they sit there and say Ummm Mom, we need some stuff to. 

I did take a few steps to partly protect myself, I have some very very items that are dear to her heart from her mother and father. I have them in a safe place but if I see anything missing, even a freakin spoon I will let her know she needs to return such item until we can both go through them or she will never see said items again. (Thats pretty bad but I need protection)


----------



## CASE_Sensitive

Just wondering if you have a rule about not letting the OM step take a step on your property. I don't think I could stomach allowing that guy anywhere near my house.


----------



## Burned

CASE_Sensitive said:


> Just wondering if you have a rule about not letting the OM step take a step on your property. I don't think I could stomach allowing that guy anywhere near my house.


Funny you mention "rules"

During our second seperation we tried to cohabitate, set up rules where we wouldn't bring OP into our marital home, I had stated I couldn't take seeing or knowing she was with someone else at that point. She said it wouldn't bother her but she understood and wouldn't do it. Well one night around 2 am I come down to get a drink and find her having phone fun on our couch while the kids were sleeping upstairs. I moved out of the home the next day.

We don't have anything set up this time as I just told her she needed to leave and she did. I don't know who this guy is (I'm trying not to care) of course the worst thought is they are together which I don't even know. I heard the sound of a diesel truck coming and went to look outside and saw this big lifted truck with her riding shotgun and a bed in the back. She came in the house to get the key while I stayed in the living room waiting to see what was about to go down. She opened the shed and the back gate and they loaded the bed into the shed. As they walked to the front and got to the truck is where dude grabbed her [email protected]@. He never did set foot in my house and would have paid the price for entering my house.


----------



## Burned

Weird feelings today, driving to work I had this huge pit in my stomach and had a feeling like I'm living a lie. Putting on a happy face, constantly pushing thoughts of her into the depths of my brain to only have them resurface when I subconsciously think of other things only to have to push those thought's away again. 

A stage I'm not aware of? or parts of two stages that intertwine? Ughhh, why do I constantly try and put my feelings into a stage? 

People are strange when you're a stranger 
Faces look ugly when you're alone 
Women seem wicked when you're unwanted 
Streets are uneven when you're down


----------



## Headspin

Lovemytruck said:


> The mood will probably change for her as the D settlement begins. Their greed has a nasty way of coming back to the surface. You will be the bad guy again. BPD traits will likely show as you are now evil in her eyes. She will jump back into the victim role


A year and a half out from separation and imminent final divorce this is where I / we are now.

My BPD x has shown a side of herself I just never imagined was inside of her. Truly the devil incarnate. Every single aspect of our 15 years has been turned around 150% !

What ever did happen - did not happen! and the opposite black was white and blue was yellow - it's insane behavior and the kids, well God knows where they'd be but for me.

Even though I can prove beyond all doubt every single thing event scenario that has happened in our marriage

Her greed is incredible, trying every which way to get our home sold from under us, trying to disengage me as 'dad' from the kids (10/11 yrs old) trying to reintroduce an affair partner (married!)as a step dad. And of course portraying herself as this meek trouble victim still lying, still delusional etc etc . Not a single ounce of remorse.

She left agreeing giving me primary care of the kids but now that gives her less clout in a fight for money is trying to change all that legally 

When you have given so much to somebody it takes a long time to understand how you have to deal with them to fight back, to fight for your life 

As our settlement has approached she has cranked up the bitterness to a level I never knew could exist 

I never knew her at all 

I think a lot of it is about being stopped, being challenged for the first time in her life using all her charisma personality, looks, has not, for the first time, got her instantly what she wanted which she has always managed to do.

I realize now she expected to be in a new home, with her new man(married!) in her new life, with the kids me and old life just put in a box - which of course has not materialized!

He never left his wife, she's in a rented two bed terraced house, she has money problems, the kids don't respect her and prefer to be with me and she's behaving like the wronged person. Seriously.

Plus she now knows I will be in her face for the rest of her life no matter what happens, there will never be an ounce of amicability toward her after the way she has behaved especially since we split 

Yep I'm the bad guy!


----------



## Headspin

Burned said:


> Weird feelings today, driving to work I had this huge pit in my stomach and had a feeling like I'm living a lie. Putting on a happy face, constantly pushing thoughts of her into the depths of my brain to only have them resurface when I subconsciously think of other things only to have to push those thought's away again.
> 
> A stage I'm not aware of? or parts of two stages that intertwine? Ughhh, why do I constantly try and put my feelings into a stage?
> 
> People are strange when you're a stranger
> Faces look ugly when you're alone
> Women seem wicked when you're unwanted
> Streets are uneven when you're down


Truth is you are living a lie, cant see the wood for the trees, but that will improve, but you'll be shocked more so when you realize your life WITH her was also a lie too. 

Sadly it's a real rollercoaster - a real one.

You are early in it all burned, so you need to accept there is much more of this to come. When you do that it will a step to it being easier to deal with

Trouble is its easy to give advice but the reality is you get and understand more from experiencing the day to day living in the middle of this shvt than any advice (although it helps in other ways) 

My very stbx moved out and expected me to financially fold, sell the house, chop up the proceeds and voila - new happy life for her !! I got my ass together got more work held onto the house, the kids family home and vowed to keep it - for them

I was in danger of her moving back in but after she started renting (after about 2/3 months) knew she couldn't. I got the keys off her and gradually stopped her coming anywhere near our home. Took about a year before she finally got that in her head. 

Is your wife renting? Is she considered to be 'gone' from the family home burned?
What are your current access to kids arrangements? Who has what nights? 

These questions are key for later when it comes to custody houses finances etc etc


----------



## Burned

Headspin said:


> Truth is you are living a lie, cant see the wood for the trees, but that will improve, but you'll be shocked more so when you realize your life WITH her was also a lie too.
> 
> Sadly it's a real rollercoaster - a real one.
> 
> You are early in it all burned, so you need to accept there is much more of this to come. When you do that it will a step to it being easier to deal with
> 
> Trouble is its easy to give advice but the reality is you get and understand more from experiencing the day to day living in the middle of this shvt than any advice (although it helps in other ways)
> 
> My very stbx moved out and expected me to financially fold, sell the house, chop up the proceeds and voila - new happy life for her !! I got my ass together got more work held onto the house, the kids family home and vowed to keep it - for them
> 
> I was in danger of her moving back in but after she started renting (after about 2/3 months) knew she couldn't. I got the keys off her and gradually stopped her coming anywhere near our home. Took about a year before she finally got that in her head.
> 
> Is your wife renting? Is she considered to be 'gone' from the family home burned?
> What are your current access to kids arrangements? Who has what nights?
> 
> These questions are key for later when it comes to custody houses finances etc etc


Great advice Headspin! Stbxw is staying at her brothers house, has most of her clothes out while the furniture and such is still here. I consider her gone from the family home. She comes over to see the kids while I'm at work but is always gone before I get home. She won't leave me her key or garage door opener yet. 

She doesn't take the kids much, her brother lives in a 1 bedroom apt downtown so there isn't much room. She has taken them a handful of nights out of the 6 weeks we have been separated but does stop by and see them for an hour or so while I'm at work. She obviously still considers this her home as she stopped by to take a nap last Sunday. Still baffles me:scratchhead:


----------



## Chuck71

Burned said:


> I don't want to poke the bear. How did she react Chuck? I'm just starting the divorce process on my own, I figure her bringing over a guy to help load her bed was more my problem as I let it bother me, she doesn't care or even doesn't think about things before she does them. I'm really trying to not let her crap bother me as again it's my problem it bother me not her's.


I can assume she was surprised. The last time we met to 

switch out the dogs was late March, early April. She left 75%

of her things. She moved out a week after D was final.

Into a college studio, maybe 600 sq. ft. Things which were 

left were either trashed or claimed as mine...unless she wanted

to pay a storage fee monthly until they could be obtained....

lol she couldn't pay her cell bill much less that

she filed 13 as I predicted and I am 99% certain 7

she never could hold a job long, my guess is she is 

unemployed and wh0ring herself to anyone, as predicted

before D final. It was hard tossing her items in the trash

but it was her who left behind her child's baby pics, her 

mother's heirlooms, etc...but as I said, she had intentions on

coming back to the house at some point. It hurt at first

doing the 180 and not answering her emails but it got easier.

It would break my heart to open an email by her at first

a month or two later I was ignoring them completely

Eventually it became a running joke about the emails

It was funny, I was the more composed one at the D final

she was trying to act all sweet ..... nice try




If she does not work she will put a play on you for the house

or a false R for living space. Your ex does not think three days 

ahead so erratic behavior should be expected. Get the D done

ASAP, you have better leverage after it. I wish you were not

here....he!! I wish none of us were.


----------



## Burned

Manipulation at it's finest.

I texted stbxw and asked for her address (I'm filling out the divorce paperwork) she replied back "so you going to take full custody of the girls because I live with my brother while trying to get my own place? 

I responded with I have them 90% of the time why wouldn't I put that down? I'm not trying to be mean but being honest with what's going on.

This is the text that I didn't understand at first.

"You are one of the best people that I've had the blessing of having in my life. You are a great father and overall human being. I'm not worthy"

I won't lie, I looked for any hidden message in that text I could. First thought was If I'm all that then why the hell am I in this position? 

Got mad at myself for thinking that way. Then the lightbulb came on. I'm a ISFJ personality type and she is playing with my inner self. The Nurturer, I put other people's wants and needs in front of mine, she wants me to feel sorry for her, by nature my response would have been to tell her she was worthy and what a wonderful person she was. 

She isn't worthy of my love, respect, etc. So she was right and the best part about it, I can agree with her.


----------



## Lovemytruck

Burned said:


> Manipulation at it's finest.
> 
> I texted stbxw and asked for her address (I'm filling out the divorce paperwork) she replied back *"so you going to take full custody of the girls* because I live with my brother while trying to get my own place?
> 
> I responded with I have them 90% of the time why wouldn't I put that down? I'm not trying to be mean but being honest with what's going on.
> 
> This is the text that I didn't understand at first.
> 
> *"You are one of the best people that I've had the blessing of having in my life. You are a great father and overall human being. I'm not worthy"*I won't lie, I looked for any hidden message in that text I could. First thought was If I'm all that then why the hell am I in this position?
> 
> Got mad at myself for thinking that way. Then the lightbulb came on. I'm a ISFJ personality type and she is playing with my inner self. The Nurturer, I put other people's wants and needs in front of mine, *she wants me to feel sorry for her*, by nature my response would have been to tell her she was worthy and what a wonderful person she was.
> 
> She isn't worthy of my love, respect, etc. So she was right and the best part about it, I can agree with her.


Wild mood swings...you are probably right in your previous arm-chair assessment of her BPD like traits. Not that it makes any difference to her, you, or me.

She is a devil. Look at the way she tries to reason. First she assumes the worst of you, flatters you, then plays the victim again. I am glad you are able to see through it. Don't expect anything less from her. 

She is one of "those" types. Lol! 

Been there, done that too. Stay the course my friend. 

After the dust settles, just keep as much space as possible. 

It will be to your advantage if she finds a different sucker. I would bet she will flip when you find a new person.

Whew! I am feeling the triggers...


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## Burned

Just wanted to provide an update of my journey. Filed for divorce yesterday and will say it felt so good to get this process going. Like I truly started to walk in the direction of my new life. The path is long I know but I am now taking steps in the right direction. 

Also stbxw is coming to the realization that working full time and being a parent is very hard work, she said she couldn't afford her own place even working two jobs, wished life was easier. I think it's hitting her and hitting her hard. Maybe that's Karma but I say it's the path of her new life, she took her "married" life for granted and finally see's all that I had shielded her from, that was my job as her husband, it isn't my job anymore.


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## Sunflower_83

First of all I am really sorry for the mess, but sometimes I feel when it comes to infidelity and cheating, you have to allow yourself to try to make it work as much as possible even if we get burned or embarassed, just so at the end of the road you can turn around and say "hey I tried -- i put my 100% into it, and if it doesn't work tomorrow I won't cry over it." some situations are never in our control -- when you have children to think about you have to learn to lower yourself for the broader picture. 

I wish you the best of luck. Sometimes it's better to burned a few times and get the message then to be blinded by the burn and live in the pain of the burn.


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## Burned

Sunflower_83 said:


> First of all I am really sorry for the mess, but sometimes I feel when it comes to infidelity and cheating, you have to allow yourself to try to make it work as much as possible even if we get burned or embarassed, just so at the end of the road you can turn around and say "hey I tried -- i put my 100% into it, and if it doesn't work tomorrow I won't cry over it." some situations are never in our control -- when you have children to think about you have to learn to lower yourself for the broader picture.
> 
> I wish you the best of luck. Sometimes it's better to burned a few times and get the message then to be blinded by the burn and live in the pain of the burn.


You are right about trying, I will never look back and say I didn't give it my best, my best just wasn't good enough. My stbxw just didn't love me but couldn't tell me for whatever reason. 

My overall problem is why not be honest? I feel I deserved it, I know I deserved it. Why torch everything in the process? I may never know why I couldn't get honesty, the better part is I'm starting to not care. 

Thank you for the positive words.


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## Lovemytruck

Thanks for the update, and congratulations on moving into a new life!

The D thing can make you feel strong, and sometimes a little confused. So glad you did the R long enough to avoid feeling regrets. Now you can start working on re-building YOU.

Hope you have some good friends and/or family for company when you might need it. The D is best when you can discuss it with people that have been through it.

Once you feel stable and ready, I would think chasing some women would be fun. It really makes your ego come back when you know you are wanted. Just saying it isn't all bad! 

Keep us posted.


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## Burned

Lovemytruck said:


> Thanks for the update, and congratulations on moving into a new life!
> 
> The D thing can make you feel strong, and sometimes a little confused. So glad you did the R long enough to avoid feeling regrets. Now you can start working on re-building YOU.
> 
> Hope you have some good friends and/or family for company when you might need it. The D is best when you can discuss it with people that have been through it.
> 
> Once you feel stable and ready, I would think chasing some women would be fun. It really makes your ego come back when you know you are wanted. Just saying it isn't all bad!
> 
> Keep us posted.


I can't say enough about my friends and family, they have been with me now through three of these with stbxw and have stood by me the whole time, more than I can say about my stbxw. 

I hope to have a few woman chasing me this time.


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## bandit.45

You will. A year from now you will look back in utter disbelief that you ever loved that broken, useless person. You will have moved on and she will mean nothing to you. My ex could walk in front of a cement truck and I would run over to make sure the driver was okay.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lovemytruck

bandit.45 said:


> You will. A year from now you will look back in utter disbelief that you ever loved that broken, useless person. You will have moved on and she will mean nothing to you. My ex could walk in front of a cement truck and I would run over to make sure the driver was okay.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:lol:

Thanks for a great laugh! That is funny!!!


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## Burned

Just an update on my situation:

Sorry it's been so long, I had intentions of posting sooner but didn't feel like reading my story again. We have our final court hearing on Monday the 25th, it's been over 4 months now since my d-day and I have to say I feel so much better, almost indifferent to her. I don't think about her nearly as much and in fact when I do I don't get sad or mad, I get this feeling of relief, relief that I don't have to put up with a non loving marriage any longer. 

I also have been getting used to being alone, I was very uncomfortable with it at first but I actually prefer it now, I look forward to doing what I want to do when I want to do it. I have no desire to date which worries me a bit, but in time I'll figure that out. 

Again I want to thank the great people of TAM for getting me through the dark times. The advice is spot on and I would suggest to any new members, listen to these people, they know what they are talking about.


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## LostViking

Burned I'm happy for you man. I too am a live-alone divorcee and I'm happy as a clam. I go where I want, date whomever I want, and there are no shortage of women who keep me company.

Does it get lonely? Sure it does. When that happens I just go to my favorite pub and watch sports and socialize, or I go to the gym and work out. But the tradeoff between being alone and being with someone who does not care about me or have any real love for me is a no-brainer. 

And don't worry about the ladies. You look remarkably like Jeff Bridges with the shades and the goatee. You'll land a sweet little thing in no time.


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## Burned

This is Noshember Viking! Ha.


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## Thorburn

Find a sugar mama. JK. Hope things continue to go well for you.


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## Burned

I have realized I will always care for and love my stbxw, I truly do want the best for her. Didn't think I would feel that way but as time has passed I have been released of her poison and my true positive blood is flowing again. 

As far as her reality, it's real and it's real bad. She has had suicidal thoughts, depression etc. I do give her encouraging words, am caring, help her out whenever I can with money, food and whatever else she may need, hell I even offered to buy her tires for her car. In the end her life hasnt' turned out to be what she wanted, I tell her that life isn't about what's ment to be but about hard work and making your own luck. It's like she is waiting for good things to happen and when they dont' she gets all bent out of shape. 

I do care about her reality, but its her's and not mine.


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## Tall Average Guy

Burned said:


> As far as her reality, it's real and it's real bad. She has had suicidal thoughts, depression etc. I do give her encouraging words, am caring, help her out whenever I can with money, food and whatever else she may need, hell I even offered to buy her tires for her car.


Consider that you doing this is hurting her. You are enabling her poor behavior and preventing her from facing the true consequences of her actions. 

Read No More Mr. Nice Guy. It will do you a world of good.


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## Burned

Tall Average Guy said:


> Consider that you doing this is hurting her. You are enabling her poor behavior and preventing her from facing the true consequences of her actions.
> 
> Read No More Mr. Nice Guy. It will do you a world of good.


You are probably right, my reasoning is that I will most likely be responsible for child support of some kind to her, I'm making sure she has money for food, gas etc. I will most likely have to do that anyway and by screwing her I'm screwing my kids. 

We have court the 25th so I will know more about how much I will have to pay or not. 

I do have to read the book, it's been on my list. Thank you for the good points.


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## Tall Average Guy

Burned said:


> You are probably right, my reasoning is that I will most likely be responsible for child support of some kind to her, I'm making sure she has money for food, gas etc. I will most likely have to do that anyway and by screwing her I'm screwing my kids.


No, you are not. She is.

If you don't agree with that, then where does it end? If she takes all the money you give her for support, and uses it on her boyfriends, then comes to you for more money for the kids, are you still expected to give it to her? If you don't, are you screwing the kids then?



> I do have to read the book, it's been on my list. Thank you for the good points.


Read it now. I expect it will be an eye opener for you.


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## Burned

Tall Average Guy said:


> No, you are not. She is.
> 
> If you don't agree with that, then where does it end? If she takes all the money you give her for support, and uses it on her boyfriends, then comes to you for more money for the kids, are you still expected to give it to her? If you don't, are you screwing the kids then?
> 
> Read it now. I expect it will be an eye opener for you.



If she takes the money I give her for support and uses that on anything other than the kids (Which is a possibility) then that's on her. I do have to say the amount I'm giving her is in line with what the child support calculations say I would have to pay. What would the difference be if the court say's I must pay her $500 per month and she uses that money on everything else but the kids? My obligation is met by paying the $500, I wouldn't give her anymore at that point. When I have my girls I would still make sure they had what they needed. 


I'm sure you're correct and will get on that book as soon as I can. No, in fact I know you're correct.


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## Thorburn

Tall Average Guy said:


> No, you are not. She is.
> 
> If you don't agree with that, then where does it end? If she takes all the money you give her for support, and uses it on her boyfriends, then comes to you for more money for the kids, are you still expected to give it to her? If you don't, are you screwing the kids then?
> 
> 
> 
> Read it now. I expect it will be an eye opener for you.


:iagree:


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## Chuck71

Burned said:


> I have realized I will always care for and love my stbxw, I truly do want the best for her. Didn't think I would feel that way but as time has passed I have been released of her poison and my true positive blood is flowing again.
> 
> As far as her reality, it's real and it's real bad. She has had suicidal thoughts, depression etc. I do give her encouraging words, am caring, help her out whenever I can with money, food and whatever else she may need, hell I even offered to buy her tires for her car. In the end her life hasnt' turned out to be what she wanted, I tell her that life isn't about what's ment to be but about hard work and making your own luck. It's like she is waiting for good things to happen and when they dont' she gets all bent out of shape.
> 
> I do care about her reality, but its her's and not mine.



In a concrete way, it makes you almost give a danm

about how things turn out (for her)

but abstractly all you did was give her, her own chaos tub

you sound a lot like I did right after the D final

keep your guard up, she will try to play you

As for living alone.....it will be very healthy

learn about who you are

play air guitar in your underwear listening to

Led Zep at 3 AM....I did

I also thought I sang like Robert Plant...

after I downed a fifth LOL

my DDay was last November, filed 11/30, final 2/1

where you are going, I have been and where I was going

many on here had been...It is the journey

not the destination

High 5.....you have just about made the Walk


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## LostViking

Burned said:


> If she takes the money I give her for support and uses that on anything other than the kids (Which is a possibility) then that's on her. I do have to say the amount I'm giving her is in line with what the child support calculations say I would have to pay. What would the difference be if the court say's I must pay her $500 per month and she uses that money on everything else but the kids? My obligation is met by paying the $500, I wouldn't give her anymore at that point. When I have my girls I would still make sure they had what they needed.
> 
> 
> I'm sure you're correct and will get on that book as soon as I can. No, in fact I know you're correct.


I agree with everyone else about letting her rot in the pit of her own digging. 

However, I agree on you buying the tires for her. Bald tires are a safety hazard and I would not want my kids riding around in a car so equipped. 

Buy the tires for her, but make sure you add the bill to the divorce agreement for her to pay back. 

In fact, keep reciepts of everything you buy for her and give them to your lawyer. I think it will make you look good in the eyes of the Court if you can show you are not trying to slam the STBXWW revengefully.


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## happyman64

Burned

Glad you are doing ok. Let us know how you make out on the 25th.

Hope your girls are ok and their Mom is being a good mom.

Because she was a crappy wife.

Go find better.

You deserve it.

HM


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## Burned

Turned in all our paperwork yesterday for the divorce. Now I'm just waiting for the court's to call and dispute anything as stbxw and I have agreed upon everything. She took all the debt we occured during our marriage, aprox 30k and will file BK after the divorce is final. I gave her the tax deduction of all three kids, she also waived any right to alimony. I will pay minimal child support as we share custody 50% of the time. 

If the courts don't call and dispute any agreements we have made then we have one final court hearing then we are divorced.  

Will keep you all updated but it sure seems I see light at the end of this tunnel.


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## LostViking

Sounds like you got a hell of a deal.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chuck71

I don't mean to dampen things as you are in a great position

but...even if she takes all debt....if both of your names or just yours

is on the note.....the court can say all the crap they want

the leanholders will come after you, I spent 15 years in lending

I saw it all the time

just make sure.....your arse is covered

They will hound your X until she files 7....then will come after you


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## Burned

Chuck71 said:


> I don't mean to dampen things as you are in a great position
> 
> but...even if she takes all debt....if both of your names or just yours
> 
> is on the note.....the court can say all the crap they want
> 
> the leanholders will come after you, I spent 15 years in lending
> 
> I saw it all the time
> 
> just make sure.....your arse is covered
> 
> They will hound your X until she files 7....then will come after you


You're not dampening anything, I look at it like you're looking at it from all angles which is something I do. I appreciate it very much. The debt is in her name only, I'm not sure why really but my name isn't on any of it. 

I did get the call from the courts that our paperwork looked good and they set a final hearing for Jan. 21st. Now I really see the light at the end of the tunnel, my countdown starts now.


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## harrybrown

So will you have to file one more joint return with her, if the divorce is not final until next year? Or are you going to file married filing separate? 

Always so much to think about, glad you are almost there.


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## happyman64

I am glad that the end of this journey is near its end.

I look forward to hearing about the next stage of your life.

HM


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## Burned

harrybrown said:


> So will you have to file one more joint return with her, if the divorce is not final until next year? Or are you going to file married filing separate?
> 
> Always so much to think about, glad you are almost there.


We will file jointly for 2013 per our agreement, then will file single for 2014.


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## workindad

Awesome deal. Good for you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chuck71

GREAT! if her name only is on file... f' it

your D final date is within a week of mine this year

the sky will brighten so much after it is done

you will find out so much about yourself

you sailed the waters flawless High 5


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## Burned

I underestimated the Holiday's.

Ughh! First Holidays for me, and as tough as I know I am this hasn't been easy, in fact I can't ever remember feeling so, well it's hard to even explain my feelings. 

I guess my question is this, My family (Parents and siblings) have invited me to spend the night at their house Christmas eve so that I'm not alone Christmas morning. I want to be alone, I don't feel festive at all. I don't feel like putting on a fake smile for everyone or bring anyone else down. I want to get this over with in my own way, my first Christmas without my family. Is this normal to feel this way during the holiday's? I mean the holidays are about family and friends and all but I just have this sense of needing to do this on my own.


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## happyman64

Burned said:


> I underestimated the Holiday's.
> 
> Ughh! First Holidays for me, and as tough as I know I am this hasn't been easy, in fact I can't ever remember feeling so, well it's hard to even explain my feelings.
> 
> I guess my question is this, My family (Parents and siblings) have invited me to spend the night at their house Christmas eve so that I'm not alone Christmas morning. I want to be alone, I don't feel festive at all. I don't feel like putting on a fake smile for everyone or bring anyone else down. I want to get this over with in my own way, my first Christmas without my family. Is this normal to feel this way during the holiday's? I mean the holidays are about family and friends and all but I just have this sense of needing to do this on my own.


Wise is the man that knows he can do this on his own, but realizes he does not have to.......

Enjoy your family on the holidays.

And let them enjoy you.

HM


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## Chuck71

I felt same way last year, mom "made" me stay with her

I'm glad she did but I was like you, face it alone

all part of being man-up about it

keep in mind, the other party chose this to happen

you simply reacted....your mental state on 12/24

will most likely be much better than hers

Just because you miss someone doesn't mean 

you need them back in your life. 

Missing is just a part of moving on.


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## terrence4159

first of all burned im sorry for 3 things for you man first your wife that sucks been there done that 2nd being a chargers fan my god have you no self respect and living in broncos country (i dont live 2 far away from you)


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## Psych

Hope you spent the day with family. Fake it if you have to. Those noisy moments will let you forget, if a temporary respite, and you may even have some fun too. Alone leads your mind to go to places you don't want to be. 

Take care of you.


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## Burned

Thank you all for the words of wisdom, I survived the Holidays!! Actually felt so much better the day after Christmas, like a huge weight was lifted off my shoulders. 

I stayed by myself Christmas eve and Christmas morning, wierd for sure but then went to my parents for Christmas dinner. Felt pretty numb most of the day but woke up the next morning feeling great. 

A week away from our last court date and I'm feeling very excited to start this new chapter in my life, I'm the captain of my ship, I'm doing things for myself and children and not looking back.


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## Burned

terrence4159 said:


> first of all burned im sorry for 3 things for you man first your wife that sucks been there done that 2nd being a chargers fan my god have you no self respect and living in broncos country (i dont live 2 far away from you)



No need to feel sorry for me, My wife will be an ex very soon. 

Living in Bronco country as a Charger fan has been great! It's like I'm a honey badger and I get the bees all buzzing!! 

Of course the playoff game lined up for the first time here in Denver and I'll be there with my Rivers jersey on rooting for my favorite team! 

I have respect for you being a Bronco fan, you survived the "Tebow" (Sorry man, had too)


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## the guy

Keep your sun glasses on so I can find you. so if you look like your avitar you should be easy to spot.

This town is going nuts.

BTW my PR jersey was worn in the beginning of the season and look how that turned out.....I'll be keeping mine in the closet...have been for the last 5 games.


GO BOLTS!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Graywolf2

My son and I were at the Chargers game in Cincinnati. He had is Gates jersey on. Started raining second half but it was worth it. Cincinnati fans were very nice to us even after they lost.


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## Burned

the guy said:


> Keep your sun glasses on so I can find you. so if you look like your avitar you should be easy to spot.
> 
> This town is going nuts.
> 
> BTW my PR jersey was worn in the beginning of the season and look how that turned out.....I'll be keeping mine in the closet...have been for the last 5 games.
> 
> 
> GO BOLTS!!!!!!!!!!!


Love it!! I have the powder Blue out now, I put away the dark blue PR jersey after the Raider loss. But Powder Blue has done us right. I can't wait for Sunday!!


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## Burned

Graywolf2 said:


> My son and I were at the Chargers game in Cincinnati. He had is Gates jersey on. Started raining second half but it was worth it. Cincinnati fans were very nice to us even after they lost.


That's awesome Graywolf!!! Those will be great memories for you and your son forever!!! It's our destiny!!!!!!!

Go Bolt's!!!!


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## Chuck71

Graywolf2 said:


> My son and I were at the Chargers game in Cincinnati. He had is Gates jersey on. Started raining second half but it was worth it. Cincinnati fans were very nice to us even after they lost.


Cincinnati is conditioned to lose

last time they won a playoff game

Pawpaw Bush was in office

Bo (Jackson) knew Didley

the world wide web was...an idea .... until Al Gore invented it :rofl:


----------



## Burned

Chuck71 said:


> Cincinnati is conditioned to lose
> 
> last time they won a playoff game
> 
> Pawpaw Bush was in office
> 
> Bo (Jackson) knew Didley
> 
> the world wide web was...an idea .... until Al Gore invented it :rofl:


I'm wondering if the same can't be said for the Chargers. Our motto "There is always next year" Ughhh!!


----------



## the guy

I HATE FOOTBALL!!!!
I'M NEVER WATCHING FOOTBALL AGAIN...NEVER EVER!!


I feel like fighting, I'm just to dam old, and my heavy bag is all jacked up cuz the sand all settled to the bottom. I guess I could hang the dam thing upside down .:lol::lol:. and my speed bag has a hole in it.
And my anger management counselor's cell phone has been busy since Sunday night.

DAMN THOSE CHARGERS


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## Chuck71

my team, Steelers.... were cheated out of the #6 seed

BUT an 8-8 team, really shouldn't be allowed in playoffs

Steelers always give Bungels fits at "Riverfront"

but.....San Diego held with Denver a lot better than

Pittsburgh could have, our CB/DB can't cover a bed

very few teams hung with Denver Inc. 

San Diego did, hope for next year

Who do you think will take over for Ken W(hisenhunt)


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## phillybeffandswiss

Technically, all the teams that were in this year had a winning record LOL.


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## Burned

Chuck71 said:


> my team, Steelers.... were cheated out of the #6 seed
> 
> BUT an 8-8 team, really shouldn't be allowed in playoffs
> 
> Steelers always give Bungels fits at "Riverfront"
> 
> but.....San Diego held with Denver a lot better than
> 
> Pittsburgh could have, our CB/DB can't cover a bed
> 
> very few teams hung with Denver Inc.
> 
> San Diego did, hope for next year
> 
> Who do you think will take over for Ken W(hisenhunt)



The Chargers seem to play Manning tough no matter what team he is on. I'm happy they promoted Frank Reich, he and Rivers seem to get along well. 

Part of me is like "The guy" and part of me is used to this.


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## Burned

So, it's official!! After 6 of the longest months of my life, this is the first official day of the rest of my life. Court went as well as it could, Judge confirmed everything we agreed upon and we will have our Divorce decree by the end of the week. 

I want to thank you all for your support! There were times I wasn't sure if the pain would go away, it does and life moves on whether we are ready for it or not. I wasn't ready at first, felt like a sailboat with no sail going where ever the waves took me, now I have an inboard 454 and a grin on my face! Let's rock!

Thanks again!!


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## Chuck71

Chargers had Manning's number there for couple years

Glad you were at peace and x ray vision when the finish line appeared

you can't help people when neither you, nor them

know how they could be fixed

onward voyage......utilize your knowledge

if you post in La D, leave a link here

Congrats! and save a place for me.....I likes to fish


----------

