# Anti-materialism experiment



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Just curious really folks, I noticed I had quite a few quality dates last year, but none of them were in a position to prove to me their non-materialism the way that my soon to be ex-wife did. So I'm thinking of a little experiment, buying an old car, and lying about personal income. I already live in an apartment since seperation, so that's a bonus.

Only problem would probably be breaking the news of my success. Knowing my STBX, she would have been p-ssed at the break of trust regardless of my earnings. So I don't know what I'm supposed to do... do I have really no choice but go back to STBX?

What you guys think of such tests/experiments?

As for STBX and I, I don't know, she dated 1 guy despite many offers it seems, while I've dated 3, kissed two, and fked one. She's no longer open for reconciliation but I don't know, we're stuck being unable to stop seeing each other due to our daughter.


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

Just curious ~

Are you financially independent? Why do women have to prove this to you?


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Cause I'm paranoid about gold-diggers obviously, reason why I kept last 3 quality dates at arms length.

When I met STBX, one quality she has proven is non-materialism, I was non career-minded at that age nor had many opportunities. This is one quality that is making it difficult for me to move on from considering I can't trust any woman I meet/date to appreciate me for me, when STBX was the one who was there, right in the beginning, when I was nothing.


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

I would think that a person would reveal themselves over time, no? The more comfortable they feel around you, the more likely they'll just be themselves - for better or worse.

Your paranoia and distance probably causes more discomfort than your 'poverty'.

I used to be fairly open about my finances, but I didn't realize people saw it so differently than me.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

RandomDude said:


> Just curious really folks, I noticed I had quite a few quality dates last year, but none of them were in a position to prove to me their non-materialism the way that my soon to be ex-wife did. So I'm thinking of a little experiment, buying an old car, and lying about personal income. I already live in an apartment since seperation, so that's a bonus.
> 
> So I don't know what I'm supposed to do... do I have really no choice but go back to STBX?
> 
> What you guys think of such tests/experiments?


I think they are stupid. 

If you have to buy an old car just to "test" a woman, I say you have bigger problems. 

As far as what you "should" do--what do you WANT to do? You have choices, you know? 

Also, stop comparing anyone knew to your stbx. You are not over her, no matter what you say and until you stop doing this, you are going to keep shooting yourself in the foot.


*Story time: My ex did something similar to what you are thinking about doing--showed up to our first date in an old work truck. On our next date, he showed up in a shiny beamer. He said he wanted to know if I would "care" about what he drove/materialistic things. 

As time went on though, it was clear, he was the materialistic one. You see, he prided himself on THINGS. What THINGS he could have, what THINGS meant for status to him, and he thought since he could buy me THINGS and have THINGS and gift me THINGS, that I should just be happy. He was a THINGS guy. Cared way more about that stuff than I did. Funny that. 

Turns out he was a lot more materialistic than me. 

I left him.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

@MinimalME

But how? Unless (God forbid) some calamity comes to my business and industry, and gives a woman opportunity to prove herself, how?

Of course they were comfortable, abit nervous and insecure at times thinking I'm out of their league however... STBX, she didn't give a sh-t. Marrying me and having a child with me was pivotal to my success. I can never forget that, it's something I find hard to move on from.

As for being open about my finances, I lived a humble life prior to marriage and fatherhood. So I know both worlds and how a proper mindset meant everything in terms of financial capability. But how can a man forget a woman who loved him when he was an ex-crim working casual dead-end jobs?

*sigh* If anything this is one that is stopping me from filing these papers.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

RandomDude said:


> But how? Unless (God forbid) some calamity comes to my business and industry, and gives a woman opportunity to prove herself, how?
> 
> however... STBX, she didn't give a sh-t. Marrying me and having a child with me was pivotal to my success. I can never forget that, it's something I find hard to move on from.
> 
> But how can a man forget a woman who loved him when he was an ex-crim working casual dead-end jobs?


You really don't need to be dating, RD. You have a LOT of issues to work through. 

Also, it's sad that you think everyone needs to "prove" themself to you. How about you prove yourself to them while you are at?

Games are for children.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

There are plenty of non-materialistic women. With some, it's pretty clear up front, and with others, it can take some time to know their true attitudes. But, dating is about taking that time to know someone, and presumably there's no rush to marriage, so if a red flag is raised down the road, you can still end it and try again.

Responsible use of money, ability to pay all bills incurred, appropriate levels and types of debt, and ability to save, plan, and budget are factors I took into account.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Jellybeans said:


> I think they are stupid.
> 
> If you have to buy an old car just to "test" a woman, I say you have bigger problems.
> 
> As far as what you "should" do--what do you WANT to do? You have choices, you know?


I just want someone who I can trust, but I can't seem to find a way for them to prove their trust to me.



> Also, stop comparing anyone knew to your stbx. You are not over her, no matter what you say and until you stop doing this, you are going to keep shooting yourself in the foot.


Yeah well, she's not exactly an easy woman to get over



> *Story time: My ex did something similar to what you are thinking about doing--showed up to our first date in an old work truck. On our next date, he showed up in a shiny beamer. He said he wanted to know if I would "care" about what he drove/materialistic things.
> 
> As time went on though, it was clear, he was the materialistic one. You see, he prided himself on THINGS. What THINGS he could have, what THINGS meant for status to him, and he thought since he could buy me THINGS and have THINGS and gift me THINGS, that I should just be happy. He was a THINGS guy. Cared way more about that stuff than I did. Funny that.
> 
> ...


Errr, actually I'm not like that. Even throughout my marriage I bought a house in the Western suburbs due to its affordability (and just to stick a finger up at in-laws), and I still drive a humble Maxima.

I suffered a big loss in personal capital due to financial arrangements keeping STBX off my business which is my lifeblood, however, I'm FAR from materialistic. STBX... the same.

So WTF can I do?


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Jellybeans said:


> You really don't need to be dating, RD. You have a LOT of issues to work through.
> 
> Also, it's sad that you think everyone needs to "prove" themself to you. *How about you prove yourself to them while you are at?*
> 
> Games are for children.


Well I did, and they loved me. But I can't fking trust them!



Married but Happy said:


> *There are plenty of non-materialistic women*. With some, it's pretty clear up front, and with others, it can take some time to know their true attitudes. But, dating is about taking that time to know someone, and presumably there's no rush to marriage, so if a red flag is raised down the road, you can still end it and try again.
> 
> Responsible use of money, ability to pay all bills incurred, appropriate levels and types of debt, and ability to save, plan, and budget are factors I took into account.


:scratchhead:

I live in materialism capital of Australia and I can NOT move due to:
1) My business and inability to delegate a GM role
2) My daughter


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

What do you WANT to do?

You don't seem to know that.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

I just want companionship that I can trust to be genuine.

Meh


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## minimalME (Jan 3, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> I can't fking trust them!


I struggle with trust, so I do understand, but this is more about you than them. 

No one is 100% trustworthy. People hide intentions and motives - even in the smallest ways. It's human. Everyone shades the truth to protect themselves and/or to make themselves look better in the eyes of others.

If your concern is about being loved for you, and not your money, then you'll have to be willing to spend time with someone. But it's no guarantee. There is no certainty.

Observe more than interrogate. 

What's their house like? What car do they drive? How do they talk about money? How do they use money? Do they have debt? What's the income level of the people they spend time around? Do they donate?

What's their basic character like? Do they follow through and keep their word? Do they gossip and malign others? 

If they are being deceitful, people can only pretend for so long. And arrogant people often don't even try.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> I just want companionship that I can trust to be genuine.
> 
> Meh


Well, lying to them about your income means you aren't being genuine and are untrustworthy and a liar. You can't expect to attract genuine people when you yourself aren't being genuine OR honest. 

You're still into your wife, and you are NEVER going to find anyone else suitable as long as that is the case.

Volunteer for a charity you believe in, a pet shelter or building playgrounds for kids, anything that is meaningful to you. The people you meet there will generally be thoughtful and likely not gold diggers. True gold diggers have no time to give of themselves to help others.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

> What's their house like? What car do they drive? How do they talk about money? How do they use money? Do they have debt? What's the income level of the people they spend time around? Do they donate?
> 
> What's their basic character like? Do they follow through and keep their word? Do they gossip and malign others?


Interesting, what other questions like this do you have? I'm taking note of this

However, I'm sure an experienced gold-digger will know exactly what to say and how to act. I just thought of my test because despite my success - I know I didn't do it alone, and I am a humble man at heart. I just reckon a woman who can accept that, will be worth my time. 

Not to mention the challenge! When I wasn't established it was so much more fun, and the love I had I knew was real! STBX was great just... we had our issues. Still, I don't want to end up one day being used like a wallet.

I would never have imagined I would have this problem when I was in my early 20s, I guess marriage and fatherhood changes you, and gives you motivation to succeed. But now with divorce... I don't want some gold-digger to inherit my success when she doesn't deserve it.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

If you don't want anyone to inherit your riches, then don't get married again or write a will leaving everything to your daughter. Problem solved.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

norajane said:


> Well, lying to them about your income means you aren't being genuine and are untrustworthy and a liar. You can't expect to attract genuine people when you yourself aren't being genuine OR honest.


=/



> You're still into your wife, and you are NEVER going to find anyone else suitable as long as that is the case.


Yeah well I can get rid of everything else but the fact that she was with me when I was at my most humble point kinda sticks out like a pain in the... (uhum), sticks out like a "hemorrhoid"

*sigh*



> Volunteer for a charity you believe in, a pet shelter or building playgrounds for kids, anything that is meaningful to you. The people you meet there will generally be thoughtful and likely not gold diggers. True gold diggers have no time to give of themselves to help others.


I donate but have no time to volunteer =/


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

norajane said:


> If you don't want anyone to inherit your riches, then don't get married again or write a will leaving everything to your daughter. Problem solved.


Wealth and financial stability means sh-t when I don't even have what I want in the end.

My daughter already has enough to get her through whatever she wishes for in life. It's already achieved. It's part of my STBX and I's financial arrangements.


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

RandomDude said:


> Just curious really folks, I noticed I had quite a few quality dates last year, but none of them were in a position to prove to me their non-materialism the way that my soon to be ex-wife did. So I'm thinking of a little experiment, buying an old car, and lying about personal income. I already live in an apartment since seperation, so that's a bonus.
> 
> What you guys think of such tests/experiments?


_Great idea. _

Been there, done that !

Men just are not intelligent enough to tell when a woman really likes him for his personal qualities, or for his finances.
So you really _have to _do it this way.

You don't have to lie about personal income, or your job, you don't have to share this anyway. Just as long as you can say you work full-time and have your own place, the rest is irrelevant to someone who wants to get to know you as a person.

You'll find a massively depleted pool of applicants. 

Sometimes I have played games to see what happens. 

If I go east and pretend to be a wealthy foreigner, it's revolting how people act ...

If I play the game the other way and pretend I'm just as poor as they are... people treat me better, like one of the family, but! voop! much less interest from the younger women... 

but the ones who are left are simply wonderful - diamonds in the rough and all that... some of them even have a sense of humour and can entertain you - it's like going through the looking-glass. 

but if you pretend poverty, you must then cope with the stark realisation, that whoever is left is judging you on you... you may not like that... 

I did OK... but sometimes, well it was a little disheartening to carry on the experiment... dressing down and staying in Hostels (for example), far fewer people will notice you. You start taking it a bit personally. Then you open your wallet and dress well, suddenly people are volunteering their contact details.

Worth doing definitely!! But treat it as a Game 

Edit: Your quote: "Wealth and financial stability means sh-t when I don't even have what I want in the end"

Is wisdom!


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> Wealth and financial stability means sh-t when I don't even have what I want in the end.
> 
> My daughter already has enough to get her through whatever she wishes for in life. It's already achieved. It's part of my STBX and I's financial arrangements.


So you have to be married to have what you want in the end? Married didn't work out so well the first time, why the rush to marry again, especially when you are still in love with your wife?


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

@Sandfly



> Just as long as you can say you work full-time and have your own place, the rest is irrelevant to someone who wants to get to know you as a person.


=/

Hmmm... guess that's the most balanced option.



> You'll find a massively depleted pool of applicants.


:rofl:
Would be an interesting change of pace



> If I play the game the other way and pretend I'm just as poor as they are... people treat me better, like one of the family, but! voop! much less interest from the younger women...
> 
> but the ones who are left are simply wonderful - diamonds in the rough and all that... some of them even have a sense of humour and can entertain you - it's like going through the looking-glass.
> 
> ...


Lol... Lololololol!

Guess one just has to do what one has to do ey?
I'm glad at least one person understands my situation and endorses this


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

norajane said:


> So you have to be married to have what you want in the end? Married didn't work out so well the first time, why the rush to marry again, especially when you are still in love with your wife?


Love? Pffft

I'm more pissed she's the only one who proved capable of earning my trust and has sufficiently robbed me of future options due to the standard she has instilled in my heart.

But regardless, I want better


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

RandomDude said:


> Guess one just has to do what one has to do ey?
> I'm glad at least one person understands my situation and endorses this


I normally read through all the other comments before chipping in, but this time I didn't - so the others don't endorse it huh?

That's no surprise. Don't forget that we're all told that wearing the right aftershave, driving the right car, and moving up the ladder will get you the stunning girl.

But what is the right girl? Perhaps we should do a quick test -

Is she funny?
Happy?
Caring and considerate, well-mannered?

Fewer are, as consumer culture goes on, but...

If she has these qualities, chances are she has developed them in the absence of:

-men who clown around for her, on command (=no need to develop a sense of humour)
-dozens of failed romances (read: ONS) (= no need to develop emotional maturity)
-having her own way all the time. (=no need to consider others, develop manners)

The less she sees money as the cause of, and the solution to, all her problems, the better a personality she is likely to have.

You should avoid daddy's girls, just as women would do well to avoid a mummy's boy... manipulators... not even worth a second glance.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

> I normally read through all the other comments before chipping in, but this time I didn't - so the others don't endorse it huh?
> 
> That's no surprise. Don't forget that we're all told that wearing the right aftershave, driving the right car, and moving up the ladder will get you the girl.


Lol! We're told that because its fking true. I've seen both worlds... and quite frankly, it saddens and utterly disgusts me. I don't see these women as anything more than *****s (and ironic considering my own wife/STBX was once an escort in her youth before I met her)



> But what is the right girl? Perhaps we should do a quick test -
> 
> Is she funny?
> Happy?
> ...


Hmmm, this may be a problem I only go for 8/10 or above in terms of attractiveness.



> The less she sees money as the cause of, and the solution to, all her problems, the better a personality she is likely to have.
> 
> You should avoid daddy's girls, just as women would do well to avoid a mummy's boy... they are incorrigible manipulators...


=/ My daughter's a daddy's girl OMG

:rofl:


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Did you know that you can date a woman without "giving" her anything material?

I don't get what the "fear" of dating a gold digger would be, if you simply don't give her (or anyone you date) any money or gifts.

Problem solved.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Just date, for crying out loud. You don't have to get married after three dates, you know? And if you're such a poor judge of character that you can't read someone after a year or two of dating (like you probably should be doing before you REALLY commit), you should work at that before you start dating. 

And if you have time to date, you have time to volunteer. Just sayin'

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Faithful Wife said:


> Did you know that you can date a woman without "giving" her anything material?
> 
> I don't get what the "fear" of dating a gold digger would be, if you simply don't give her (or anyone you date) any money or gifts.
> 
> Problem solved.


You know how many women pass the "dining cost sharing test"? 2.5%
So I abandoned it, I excluded too many women

I need to be realistic yet enforce my standards

Gold diggers can want immediate wealth, or look towards "potential". I want a woman who desires love and neither. STBX... she never once gave a flying fk, all the way through to our post-nup financial arrangements - SHE DOESN'T FKING CARE

I can't fking move on from this quality of hers and it's been ONE YEAR AND THREE QUALITY FKING WOMEN


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

PBear said:


> Just date, for crying out loud. You don't have to get married after three dates, you know? And if you're such a poor judge of character that you can't read someone after a year or two of dating (like you probably should be doing before you REALLY commit), you should work at that before you start dating.


A year is a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG time mate =/

Time = money mate, I'm trying to be economical



> And if you have time to date, you have time to volunteer. Just sayin'
> 
> C
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The opportunities for dating are outside my hours for work unlike volunteer activities mate.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Maybe you should just buy a bride who meets your criteria... Or maybe you need to adjust your priorities...

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

I could but that would defeat the whole purpose of my intentions wouldn't it?


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

I see, I see!

Well, I've had a read of what the women on the thread were saying, and they were reacting to the idea of 'deceiving' and playing a game.

But... if you begin with the assumption, tried and proven by billions of men throughout history, that men just can't pick up on the signs of manipulation, then you don't have the luxury of hoping, waiting, like the women are suggesting.

And BTW, is not the 'hoping and waiting' tactic a form of manipulating the situation artificially? Putting the brakes on, is this not a form of testing? Aha.

Because you know what a golddigger would do in such a situation? 

GD: "Nice car. That was a nice Hotel. I had a wonderful weekend.... I love you! Let's get married." 

Meh: "Not right now, we should spend a couple of years getting to know each other".

Three months later-

GD: "I love you! Let's go to Bali and get married!"
Meh: "Not right now... etc etc"
GD: "I'm pregnant!"

No, no, no listen to me!  You need to eliminate them in the first few dates, which means for a start, not picking up the whole tab on any of these dates. Not going to luxury places, but fun interactive places instead, with maybe an outdoors component preferably - Golddiggers never want to make their own entertainment, they are by nature lazy and expect to be entertained by others. Beware - in the past, I have even had GDs go out for me and offer to pay for both of us... but I knew this was a double-bluff ha ha. 

But I sorted them out by their unwillingness to do things that are actively about making your own fun. Also by paying attention... they always ask about careers and jobs and ambitions very early on. Men aren't thick, so much as deaf.

As for always going for the 8/10 or above: you'll have to bear with me on this one. I've only met one natural ten in my whole life, and she was Ukrainian, expensively educated and an aristocrat. She was not 'like' a princess, she was a real-life swan-lake royal, with grace and fluidity. I don't think you've ever met a ten - I lived in Oz for six months - mate, they don't live there, I'm sorry!

The rest are all wearing make-up and flattering clothes. You think you're going for 8's, you're probably picking up 6's with good moisturising regimes and who colour their grey roots religiously. You do realise, I mean do you? That most women in their thirties have some grey hairs - but you'd never know! They're too smart for us, man!

A woman's true beauty is how much she loves you. As long as you are basically attracted to her when she is only wearing mascara, and she has good manners, give her a chance.

I remember one neighbour of mine in Europe, a blonde woman, not much to look at, basically healthy, OK-attractive and funny, used to come round with her fiancée to my flat. I was very comfortable around them. Well, one evening she came round straight after work, where she was in her expensive clothes, mascara, lipstick, hair done up - I was stunned. Suddenly she was a 9. Needless to say, she met her fiancée at work (ha ha) and she controls him and puts him down (boo!).

It's called war-paint for a reason - You are the target!

Anyway... if they're wearing make-up, mark them down three points and you've got your true number - so give the more ordinary girls a chance to show their superior personalities.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

> GD: "Nice car. That was a nice Hotel. I had a wonderful weekend.... I love you! Let's get married."
> 
> Meh: "Not right now, we should spend a couple of years getting to know each other".
> 
> ...


:rofl:



> No, no, no listen to me! You need to eliminate them in the first few dates, which means for a start, not picking up the whole tab on any of these dates. Not going to luxury places, but fun interactive places instead, with maybe an outdoors component preferably - Golddiggers never want to make their own entertainment, they are by nature lazy and expect to be entertained by others. Beware - in the past, I have even had GDs go out for me and offer to pay for both of us... but I knew this was a double-bluff ha ha.
> 
> But I sorted them out by their unwillingness to do things that are actively about making your own fun. Also by paying attention... they always ask about careers and jobs and ambitions very early on. Men aren't thick, so much as deaf.


Problem is that I'm hot + established, I get attention where-ever the fk I go and I'm not just avoiding GDs but avoiding ANY woman who is attracted towards me for my success.



> As for always going for the 8/10 or above: you'll have to bear with me on this one. I've only met one natural ten in my whole life, and she was Ukrainian, expensively educated and an aristocrat.
> 
> The rest are all wearing make-up and flattering clothes. You think you're going for 8's, you're probably picking up 6's with good moisturising regimes and who colour their grey roots religiously. You do realise, I mean do you? That most women in their thirties have some grey hairs - but you'd never know! They're too smart for us, man!


I only go for naturals actually, which makes my options even more specific. She doesn't have to be super beautiful naturally but I agree that if she's at least easy on the eye (and beauty is in the eye of the beholder mind you) and has a heart I can fall for - she's in.



> Anyway... if they're wearing make-up, mark them down three points and you've got your true number - so give the more ordinary girls a chance to show their superior personalities.


Problem; No physical attractivess = No chance =/
I can't deny my own desires


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

RandomDude said:


> You know how many women pass the "dining cost sharing test"? 2.5%
> So I abandoned it, I excluded too many women
> 
> I need to be realistic yet enforce my standards
> ...


I get this. Do you know why parting from her is hard? Because lots of other guys can write off their Ex's as money grabbers and schemers, but you can't. So it's more personal.

That's why I added the warning about how this experiment could mess with your ego. 

You said only 2.5% would pass the equality test - well, that's what I meant about 'severely depleted' interest. But, maybe it would help your ego on this issue, if you just remember that it's not personal, the goldminers would act just the same on a date with anyone else.

In fact, that's the whole point: to the ambitious woman, any wealthy man for a husband will do, so long as she can still see her boyfriends on the quiet.


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

RandomDude said:


> Problem; No physical attractivess = No chance =/
> I can't deny my own desires


No, you should be attracted, of course!

Just that in the final analysis, remember that after a couple of years she'll not be wearing lipstick anymore, and she'll wander the house in slippers and loose pyjamas.

How does your attraction function work, by the way. Have you ever gradually become attracted to a woman as you've gotten to know her? This is a key question I think.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Yeah, you're right, it'll play on my ego, especially considering how much attention I've had since marriage... I've forgotten what it's like so many years ago.

Would definitely make things interesting though, especially if I get ditched lol

I would be like :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:



> No, you should be attracted, of course!
> 
> Just that in the final analysis, remember that after a couple of years she'll not be wearing lipstick anymore, and she'll wander the house in slippers and loose pyjamas.
> 
> How does your attraction function work, by the way. Have you ever gradually become attracted to a woman as you've gotten to know her? This is a key question I think.


The eyes / facial features is enough for me, + legs

Once I seen her natural beauty at her best it will be hers to keep in my heart for the rest of time


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

RandomDude said:


> Yeah, you're right, it'll play on my ego, especially considering how much attention I've had since marriage... I've forgotten what it's like so many years ago.
> 
> Would definitely make things interesting though, especially if I get ditched lol


That's the thing. You will get ditched, many many times. 

It doesn't matter how good you look. If you don't at first glance appear to have finances, that'll just get them willing to talk to you, no more. 

For some women, if you don't appear to have the cash, they'll drop you, I guarantee it. But this is what an old girlfriend of mine would say:

"You dodged a bullet."

It's a positive thing, disguised as a negative. Better sooner than later, not so?

Maybe I'm not an impartial voice on this. I have a natural paranoia to rival Stalin, and I get predictive 'gut feelings' much more than the average bloke. 

I'll wait and see what others say now.

Best of luck!!


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Why not just date a woman who has as much money as you have...or do you not think such a woman would date you?


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Married but Happy said:


> *There are plenty of non-materialistic women. With some, it's pretty clear up front, and with others, it can take some time to know their true attitudes. But, dating is about taking that time to know someone, and presumably there's no rush to marriage, so if a red flag is raised down the road, you can still end it and try again.
> 
> Responsible use of money, ability to pay all bills incurred, appropriate levels and types of debt, and ability to save, plan, and budget are factors I took into account*.










....Really... just opening up about your lives as you date, you will gauge how a woman uses money, if she has a new purse on every date... has 75 pairs of shoes & goes shopping every weekend...if she makes subtle comments about poor people.... if when you take her out to eat, she orders the most expensive dish on the menu & doesn't blink an eye...

How about when you meet someone...start out at lower end restaurants...do some dates cooking in....take nature walks...ride bikes...do things that don't cost money...this will weed them out.. she'll either love you for you or start thinking you are too cheap & she can do better.. 

I was like your STBX... M husband worked in a Grocery store...It was all about how he treated me, not what he made....I even made more $$ than him when we married.... he can never say I dated or married him for his potential or ...we always enjoyed the simplier things in life...while we felt good saving for our future...and those were Great times....

You learn so much about each other...when you don't have all the extra thrills & high cost amusements to cloud your thinking...

Take the lead and be a *Simple Man* at the start...and see how she handles that...will her enthusiasm still be there... just hanging out with you , nights watching a movie... if she starts backing away thinking you aren't treating her to the royal treatment she deserves ... then I guess this will give you a clue. 

Here is some ideas >>

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/long-t...ings-do-your-wife-husband-wont-cost-dime.html


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## treyvion (Apr 29, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> Why not just date a woman who has as much money as you have...or do you not think such a woman would date you?


Date one with more if you can. A generous and kind friend of a lady.:smthumbup:


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

What's the rush, dude? You haven't even cleaned up this mess, and you're looking to get locked in with your next ex? Bit of a glutton for punishment ( or drama), I'd say. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

SimplyAmorous said:


> do some dates cooking in....take nature walks...ride bikes...do things that don't cost money...this will weed them out.. she'll either love you for you or start thinking you are too cheap & she can do better..
> 
> I was like your STBX... M husband worked in a Grocery store...It was all about how he treated me, not what he made....I even made more $$ than him when we married....
> 
> ...


Nice post SA. Ha ha SA, in Spanish it _sounds like_ I'm saying "ese" meaning disrespect to the person I'm talking to: "that one, you there, what's your face".

No disrespect though, SA  Maybe I'll say "Sam" instead.

Good post, Sam!


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

I think you should just live according to how you like to live. If you're not materialistic, it's not as though the money is going to jump out of your pocket! You have to reach in and pull it out. If you're like me you don't really need to spend big to be happy. 

That guy from DC, one reason I invited him to visit my place vs. asking him to stay at a hotel is because I want him to see how I live on a day to day basis. I don't want anyone thinking I'm going to be interested in staying in a hotel (I'm not, don't like them, I like hostels, and camping) or eating in a fancy restaurant (please, no, unless the food is really something to write home about or when traveling or for business, not romance or day to day needs...) or even jewelry (where would I wear it, and why, something I need to worry about losing....if it's sentimental okay, I might consider it, but it needs to be in line with how I am, not something that looks like I stole it, lol.) If someone isn't interested in my company and where I feel most comfortable on a day to day basis, with my everyday habits that I feel most comfortable with) then I don't want to be with them, and they shouldn't be with me either. I can hold my own anywhere, so it's a matter of preference and when I am called upon to present myself for work or whatever at a nice place, I make an effort to participate. But would usually rather not. 

If you're thinking you will play it poor while curtailing your day to day habits of living more nicely, that's a mistake. Instead, find someone who respects your financial boundaries. You don't have to test someone because you're not going to set anyone up to have a hand in your wallet or part of your assets. You're going to be savvy about that legally, right? You only need to spend as much money as you like on a date, if your budget is $50 then you tell the lady, look, I have a set budget of $50 for a date, so if you really want to do something fancy then we have to make up for it the week before by doing something that will provide for the $100 date. It is okay to have budgets and to communicate them. You don't need to apologize. In fact, if you state a budget for dates and the woman walks away, you've done yourself a favor. Better yet, find someone who will go Dutch/splits, make it clear that you go Dutch up front and talk about where you are willing to go. That way you can be sure that the companionship is real, and also viable. 

So, say your budget really is $50, if you end up spending only $15 or whatever, put the difference in an account, and every so often just say you have a surplus in your entertainment budget and go for a splurge. But there's no need to be deceitful about your finances, there is no rule that if you are better off then you need to live a certain way in order to be 'honest' or that you need to disclose your wealth in order to be honest. Wealthy people have choices in how to spend their money, they also have a choice about their privacy. Same as those who are not well off. 

Sometimes my kids will tell me that their friends say they are poor. I tell them, let your friends think that. 

For me, I don't care how much moolah the guy has, if he's not willing to live in a place like the one I live in right now, share 1 bathroom, and cook and clean up after ourselves and even go to the laundromat if necessary for the bedding (small stuff I have an apartment sized washer) and ride around in what me and my kids use (perfectly safe and well maintained) he's definitely not the guy for me. In a financial crisis such as a job loss or whatever, he'd be toast. So I tell those types that would look down on the common life, go away, and take your pretentiousness and greedy I need to live better than most of the people in the world attitude with you. 

I draw the line at cheap beer though. Ewwww, nasty.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

Sandfly said:


> Nice post SA. Ha ha SA, in Spanish it _sounds like_ I'm saying "ese" meaning disrespect to the person I'm talking to: "that one, you there, what's your face".
> 
> No disrespect though, SA  Maybe I'll say "Sam" instead.
> 
> Good post, Sam!


OMG no, "Ese" is someone who is your close pal, the people you hang out with who are so much a part of you that you just refer to them as an indefinite particle. If you are an Ese, you are IN. 

Had no idea it's used as derogatory in other countries/cities :-o


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

Homemaker_Numero_Uno said:


> OMG no, "Ese" is someone who is your close pal, the people you hang out with who are so much a part of you that you just refer to them as an indefinite particle. If you are an Ese, you are IN.
> 
> Had no idea it's used as derogatory in other countries/cities :-o


That's weird!! Really?

If someone called me 'Ese' in Spain, well OK, there's a chance they've picked it up from an English-speaking movie, but...

Well, I would assume they were calling me "whassyourname" to my face!!

You just saved me a shooting in downtown Compton!


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

Sandfly said:


> That's weird!! Really?
> 
> If someone called me 'Ese' in Spain, well OK, there's a chance they've picked it up from an English-speaking movie, but...
> 
> ...


No, it means you are okay, no problem. Ese, buddy. 
But be sure to read the facial expression. They might just want you to let your guard down so they can take your wallet. Or they like your girl. :rofl:


Urban dictionary gives some guidelines, yes if you are white then please don't say Ese, awwwwwkward. If you are obviously white and someone calls you Ese, pretend you don't understand, you are better off unless you have actually been drinking with them or surfing with them for a while already. The it's okay, but again, don't use the term back to them. 

It's only a guy term, too. Don't use for women, unless maybe in high school in certain situations.


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

Homemaker_Numero_Uno said:


> No, it means you are okay, no problem. Ese, buddy.
> But be sure to read the facial expression. They might just want you to let your guard down so they can take your wallet. Or they like your girl. :rofl:


So, safety off, no matter what? Got it 

I have to be frank - as soon as I saw the bandanas, I would avoid interaction.

It's funny you know, because some south americans I know say 

Pico, Culo and Paquero as bad words, and yet in Spain

Pico means like 'mountain top', Culo is used by grandma, mum as a sort-of normal colloquial word, and instead of paquero they say Gili, or Gilipollas.

I don't even know what I would say instead of Culo, is Trasero OK? Doesn't sound right.

I once said perezoso, and south americans didn't understand me. And they keep saying allá and acá, which to mean sounds very old fashioned.

Anyway - have you got any other Spanish-american words I should know?


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

How to avoid a gold-digger:

1) Keep driving your Maxima

2) Around the 4th date, bring up the subject of a pre-nuptial contract

3)Ask them to provide you with a financial statement prepared by their accountant. Don't be surprised if they request the same from you.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

Sandfly said:


> So, safety off, no matter what? Got it
> 
> I have to be frank - as soon as I saw the bandanas, I would avoid interaction.
> 
> ...


You're on your own. Spanish is a gender-specific language when it comes to slang, for the most part. I only answer to "Baby" (or not.) Or loud phrases or complete sentences describing my assets and what could be done with them (or to them, or where they should go, and with whom.) 

Too funny about the bandanas. I see bandanas and I think, oh good, protection, if anything goes bad on this corner, I'm covered. I also get covered when crossing the street or riding the public transport, or getting the courtesy discount or seat in a crowded restaurant.


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

Have skimmed, my apologies.

But honestly RD you need help, cannot believe you are still weighing yourself down with this stuff.

Make a clear decision about your ex.
Do some work on yourself.
Stop dating.
Forget all about immature, idiotic games.
Grow as a man.

Then go out and find a more financially equal woman. Don't start on the "there aren't any in my town" crap that you say, this just is not true.

TBH I think you are scared of finding an equal.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Having financial standards? Won't that make me a hypocrite? lol

Good pointers though, I don't know... like I was quite cheap with previous dates, but they all knew about me. So despite what they say or what they prove (hence I still do consider them all quality women), I still can't trust them. STBX was there when I was nothing.

In the end though I don't know, maybe I'm just not over my ex, and need some time alone and stop all this dating.


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## not recognizable (Mar 19, 2011)

"Hmmm, this may be a problem I only go for 8/10 or above in terms of attractiveness."

LOL!! And you're worried about gold diggers? Sounds like you deserve one!


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> Having financial standards? Won't that make me a hypocrite? lol
> 
> Good pointers though, I don't know... like I was quite cheap with previous dates, but they all knew about me. So despite what they say or what they prove *(hence I still do consider them all quality women), I still can't trust them. STBX was there when I was nothing.*
> 
> In the end though I don't know, maybe I'm just not over my ex, and need some time alone and stop all this dating.


There were some other things that you absolutely could NOT trust your ex on, so don't go painting her as a paragon of all virtues in your head.

You need more time - not dating - before you can date and before you stop comparing everyone to your ex. You have more trust issues than you can handle to date now. Your head is not in the right place for it.

My 2 cents.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

not recognizable said:


> "Hmmm, this may be a problem I only go for 8/10 or above in terms of attractiveness."
> 
> LOL!! And you're worried about gold diggers? Sounds like you deserve one!


Beauty is in the eye of the beholder; a 5 could be an 9 to me yet a "9" for someone else could be a 5 to me, why should I lead someone on who I'm not attracted to?



> There were some other things that you absolutely could NOT trust your ex on, so don't go painting her as a paragon of all virtues in your head.
> 
> You need more time - not dating - before you can date and before you stop comparing everyone to your ex. You have more trust issues than you can handle to date now. Your head is not in the right place for it.
> 
> My 2 cents.


True... alright, I'll hold off the dating. I think I had enough fun since seperation anyway.


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> Having financial standards? Won't that make me a hypocrite? lol
> 
> Good pointers though, I don't know... like I was quite cheap with previous dates, but they all knew about me. So despite what they say or what they prove (hence I still do consider them all quality women), I still can't trust them. STBX was there when I was nothing.
> 
> In the end though I don't know, maybe I'm just not over my ex, and need some time alone and stop all this dating.


Why would having financial standards make you a hypocrite? 

Look I know you are younger than me but we are both divorced and have wealth. 
When people are younger and get married most do it with the intent to build their asset pool together, either both working out of the home or one at paid work and one unpaid work.
So it all ends and life changes.

Second time around you are older and have had time to build wealth. Kids are often involved and most have many financial responsibilities.
IMHO this stage is one where it is very important for people with wealth to be with a financial equal. 

It is also very easy to get a binding financial agreement so what is yours is yours, what is hers is hers. Simple.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> *STBX was there when I was nothing.*


Thinking about this some more, maybe your angst isn't really _all_ about the money. No one else can ever know you like that - the guy you were when you were nothing - the way your ex did. She was at your side while you turned it into something. That makes it hard for anyone new to hold the same place in your heart, your memories, your life. 

So now you need the right woman at your side for who you are today and who you see yourself in the future. Take your time. You have to be open to it.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Exactly! As despite everything else she's made it extremely difficult for me to appreciate and trust someone else!

*sigh*

If anything I consider these experiments a way to give someone the opportunity to earn my trust the same way STBX did. How else are they to prove themselves?


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Prove themselves? Lol. Find the kind that doesn't have to prove sh*t to you or to anyone else, because she's already got it all together. You just might need to prove something to her - that you can trust someone enough to let her in. You are damaged goods right now for that kind of woman - you're unable to trust or give of yourself freely.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

I don't know why you throw out the idea of a "old car" when all it would take to run off a gold digger is presenting the front of a middle class guy.

Drive a reasonable car, taken care of. Go someplace reasonable, and don't dump gifts on her. Plenty of loaded people live that way. For them the security of having a safe, comfortable life without money worries is more important to them than 'stuff' is. 

Living like that and showing it seems much less like deceit that playing poor.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Years ago when STBX met me I was a lower-class, I had enough networks to ensure employment and income but all blue-collar. I was not considered long-term material due to having no career. STBX married me despite this. It wasn't even until the baby bells that I started taking my financial responsibility to my family seriously.

The last three dates had goals, dreams, and self-motivation in their lives. Sure, perhaps they indeed don't care for men with wealth, independent and such, but take away my wealth - can I trust them to give a sh-t? The same way STBX gave a sh-t once upon a time?

I can't just turn a blind eye and just choose to trust someone. Trust like respect for me has to be earned and I can't provide the opportunity to earn my trust if I remain transparent and honest. Even if I do turn a blind eye STBX will continue to be a ghost (who I have to see weekly anyway due to my daughter) in any future relationship due to the non-materialistic trust she has earned.


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## FormerSelf (Apr 21, 2013)

Gold-diggers in my mind, are pretty easy to spot. They usually come on fairly aggressive, and are MAJOR ego strokers...whatever it takes to set the hook in a guy. I know it feels good for a guy to be pursued in such a way, but this is the stage where he has to think: Okay, if I didn't have money, would they be acting this way?

I don't see anything wrong with disguising your financial worth, as that might keep the kooks away, but perhaps going a little too far down the ladder may have the reverse effect...where potential women, who do have expectations that a potential mate not be a slacker either. I like the commercial where the guy brings up a pie-chart and earning forcast as part of his marriage proposal...but honestly, partners SHOULD be doing that.

If you don't want a gold-digger...stay away from drinking establishments or places where people can notice how one guys is able to spend more than others. Also, you have to be willing to avoid the temptation of NOT trying to allure a hot little thing with your money too...if you start to get desperate.

I think the best way to avoid financial leeches are to seek company with those in organizations, groups, churches...or whatever where the values of conspicuous consumption is downplayed. There are lot of nice, centered, balanced women out there who are intelligent, independent, and creative who aren't desperately looking for a free ride because they don't have other options. I would be looking for matches with those who are business owners, or someone who has made their own money. Marrying a girl who grew up with money (and expectations of a certain lifestyle) is a mistake. I would look for someone involved in the community, has a passion or cause of worthy value, has a sense of personal identity.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

True, thinking of a balanced approach akin to the status of my youth, like I may assume titles that explain my work but refusing to discuss my earnings, and proclaiming that I enjoy my work, live within my means, provide for my daughter and have no aspirations to advance financially as I'm stable. Besides if they ask "how much" it's a red flag anyway.

I will provide the impression of a simple non-materialistic man, they'll see me as non financially motivated which will remove alot of prospects I'm sure. The problem is keeping this impression, as throughout the course of a relationship a woman may meet my friends, etc. I can't expect them to lie on my behalf nor can I expect them to keep their mouth shut in terms of my success. And trust will still have be earned over time as yet they may also decide they would prefer someone more established in their career later down the track - which would be a good laugh.

Then there's the prospect of after having a stable relationship - breaking the news of having owned my own business from day one. I would have to convince her that I didn't lie, I just didn't tell her the full truth, and wonder if she would accept that.



> I like the commercial where the guy brings up a pie-chart and earning forcast as part of his marriage proposal...but honestly, partners SHOULD be doing that.


Errr no way lol


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## moco82 (Jul 16, 2012)

Start a blog to document your experiments, though. You have an audience now.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Sure! I fully expect my prospects this year to reduce to zero!


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

I don't know about the car test. I wouldn't necessarily begrudge a woman that didn't want to ride in a beat up car. In all honesty it depends on how old the guy is. If he is a teenager or in college its acceptable. If he is grown man I can honestly see why it wouldn't be appealing. I wouldn't want my daughter dating an older guy with limited means. It sounds shallow but that's how I feel. Love isn't everything. You have to live too.


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

What kind of woman are you looking to date?

These all sound like high school games. You're almost 30 and you have a child. You SHOULD have a good job and a decent car. You're a grown up. If you're looking to bang 18-year old party girls, then yeah--you might have to worry about them being out for whatever they can get from you. If you're looking to date a competent adult woman, she's going to expect you to have your sh!t together just like she has her sh!t together. Because frankly, that's what most adults do. 

And really--all these comparisons to your ex as a paragon of financial virtue? From my point of view, she went from turning tricks as an escort to enjoying a SAHM lifestyle even after separation/divorce. How is that not cashing in on your relationship?


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

ReformedHubby said:


> I don't know about the car test. I wouldn't necessarily begrudge a woman that didn't want to ride in a beat up car. In all honesty it depends on how old the guy is. If he is a teenager or in college its acceptable. If he is grown man I can honestly see why it wouldn't be appealing. I wouldn't want my daughter dating an older guy with limited means. It sounds shallow but that's how I feel. Love isn't everything. You have to live too.


Waren Buffet drives an old car. I pride myself in being free of car payments and lower insurance premiums . I try to buy a car that have low miles but are on the older side. seems wise to me.


with that said if I ever got divorced I would not be too forthcomming about my earnings or investments. If she pushed I would just say is that all your after is my money. Then tell her (if I was rich like RD) listen I am doing very well fininacialy if we decide to marry you would have to sign a pree nup.

sorry but if thats not ok with you then see ya have a nice life.

I can understand how a father wants the best for his daughter but in todays world all bets are off. way too much to risk. half of all marriages fail and women are cheating as much as men nope I would protect myself to the fullest.


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## SpinDaddy (Nov 12, 2012)

So let’s see, you want to test women to see if they are deceitful and operating with ulterior motives by yourself being deceitful and harboring ulterior motives?

Sounds good.

Look, if you’re driving an AMG and wearing a Rolex that is a part of you and your advertising package. Don’t act incredulous and surprised when you get what you ask for.

As you’ve said yourself, “I will provide the impression of a simple non-materialistic man”.

Why not just be yourself and if you don’t like the caliber of people you attract . . . . *Change begins from within my Brother*!


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## moco82 (Jul 16, 2012)

So where is the line between a Rolex-wearing advertiser and a junker-driving fake? What would the ladies advise a middle-aged man to wear and drive without falling under either category?


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## moco82 (Jul 16, 2012)

COGypsy said:


> If you're looking to bang 18-year old party girls, then yeah


That sounds awful.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

ReformedHubby said:


> I don't know about the car test. I wouldn't necessarily begrudge a woman that didn't want to ride in a beat up car. In all honesty it depends on how old the guy is. If he is a teenager or in college its acceptable. If he is grown man I can honestly see why it wouldn't be appealing. I wouldn't want my daughter dating an older guy with limited means. It sounds shallow but that's how I feel. Love isn't everything. You have to live too.


I wouldn't mind my daughter dating someone she's happy with as long as he's not a deadbeat.



COGypsy said:


> What kind of woman are you looking to date?
> 
> These all sound like high school games. You're almost 30 and you have a child. You SHOULD have a good job and a decent car. You're a grown up. If you're looking to bang 18-year old party girls, then yeah--you might have to worry about them being out for whatever they can get from you. If you're looking to date a competent adult woman, she's going to expect you to have your sh!t together just like she has her sh!t together. Because frankly, that's what most adults do.


My pitch as I mentioned: "I may assume titles that explain my work but refusing to discuss my earnings, and proclaiming that I enjoy my work, live within my means, provide for my daughter and have no aspirations to advance financially as I'm stable." Which is true 



> And really--all these comparisons to your ex as a paragon of financial virtue? From my point of view, she went from turning tricks as an escort to enjoying a SAHM lifestyle even after separation/divorce. How is that not cashing in on your relationship?


Yes she's always had handouts, abit of a spoiled princess, but regardless she did love me for me. That alone is admirable.



SpinDaddy said:


> So let’s see, you want to test women to see if they are deceitful and operating with ulterior motives by yourself being deceitful and harboring ulterior motives?
> 
> Sounds good.
> 
> ...


How am I being decieving? I'm just not telling the whole truth


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## Wiltshireman (Jan 23, 2013)

RD,

I can understand your need to find a partner that you can trust to be with you for the person that you are not the wealth that you have.

IMHO you do still seem to have some issues with your STBX that you need to work through before you start your search but when you are ready I think that you should just try and be discrete about your financial position until you have taken the time to get to know each other as people. I do like the idea that was raised of meeting people through volunteering and I know that there are lots of options that could fit around a working schedule.

If you are not into volunteering then look for other places that you could meet a women with whom you share common interests and then just take it slowly, become friends before you start dating, date for a while before you ask for / give a commitment to a LTR. Do not hide your wealth but more importantly do not flaunt it.

There are many good and genuine single people out there I think it just needs us to be willing to take the time to see them for what they are inside, get past the prejudice of outward appearance or material possessions.


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## Mistyfied (Sep 27, 2013)

Seriously - just be yourself. A woman will reveal her colors soon enough. Maybe don't share income information but just be you. 

Examples of how I would reveal myself as a woman:
When I was dating my now husband, he had an income much more than I did due to the age difference between us. I still insisted on paying my way equally. 

If you dated me now, you would quickly see that your family values carry a lot more weight with me than what you earn. The kinds of dates I would want to go on don't require a lot of money (and I'd still want to pay my share. I'd be happy if we both shouted each other things at times though). You would see that spending quality time with you was much more important to me than money. 

I do think these sort of things would be obvious very early. 

The old car thing - I wouldn't take to that so well. I also value honesty, transparency and genuineness. Testing me or playing games with me will quickly put you out of the running with me.


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## omega (Aug 2, 2011)

I read the whole thread, and here's what I think...

You are so hung up on your ex having been there when you were "nothing," this clearly suggests (whether true or not, this is what other people see) that you think that a man who doesn't make a lot of money is nothing. That is a huge turn-off to the kind of women it sounds like you are looking for. I am the anti-gold-digger (I'm not going to go into details but suffice it to say I went for love in a studio apt) and if I got the vibe off a guy that he thought that he or someone else were "nothing" because of not being wealthy or a business owner or having a high-status job/possessions or being a homeowner or whatever - I would be GONE. That is really petty and jerky. There are many, many good men who are not wealthy and by suggesting that a person (even just in reference to yourself in the past) is a "nothing" until they are $$$$$ is just gross. 

Since you are already sending out this message that the value of a man is determined by how much $$$$ he has, it makes a great deal of sense to me that you would attract women who feel the same way.

I think it's really sad that you think you were "nothing" before you were wealthy / a business owner. You were actually the same person you are now, just younger, not as much experience, different place in your own personal evolution. You may have changed in different ways, we all do over time, but you were still a person capable of growth and change. You were "nothing" before you were born, but not since then. I think you need to change your own mind first about the value of a man if you expect women to value you for anything beyond the $$$ that you define yourself as.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

There's a difference between being rich and having wealth; wealth being self-perpetuating. Some of the wealthy people I've encountered, live fairly moderately... maybe it's just who they are as individuals... and without status anxiety. Perhaps it's even a way to remain relatable and, depending on industry, to those they're doing business with. Just a thought. 

If you currently drive a car that expresses a sign of your financial status, then so be it, if that's the car you enjoy driving for whatever reason. If you don't place value on the type of car you drive, then so be it too... just figure out who you are. 


How did your stbx assist with you owning and running your business?


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Ex didn't supported me at first, wanted us to become dependent on her family when the baby bells hit. I told her no way and worked my ass off instead - then she decided to whine about me not spending enough time with her, leading to the nymphomania/fights/insecurities and what not. 

Alright, sure, she's messed up herself. Meh, I don't know.

As for volunteering, I'll be there to do my job and help people not pick up! As for being "nothing" - I don't believe I've ever been, but STBX was the only one who loved me throughout those days. I don't know.


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## SpinDaddy (Nov 12, 2012)

moco82 said:


> So where is the line between a Rolex-wearing advertiser and a junker-driving fake? What would the ladies advise a middle-aged man to wear and drive without falling under either category?


Be yourself and be comfortable with what that is.

If you’re a Rolex wearing, Dolce & Gabbana kind of a guy who professes to eschew materialism well, it just doesn’t seem to make a lot of sense in my book.

Who’s to say, but I cannot reckon with displaying all the accoutrements of materialism and then acting surprised when that’s what you get.

It’s like fly-fishing in a trout stream and complaining that you’re not catching any catfish.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Cept in the case of seeking non-materialistic women, these fishes can see above water. In other words, they'll test the 'waters', gauge your financial potential etc. My ex never did, not once. Even though I've continued to live humbly despite my success, mentioning my business just makes the whole thing meh, especially as its success is easy to investigate.

So that's why I'm hoping to use the correct bait by not mentioning my business at all, not fully lying, but hiding it for at least six months to a year - timeframe depended on the individual in question.


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## omega (Aug 2, 2011)

I don't see why being a business owner means anything. I know business owners who are massively in debt, who are struggling to keep their business going, or who have been forced to close their business. Just last week I met a guy who was just hired as a school janitor after the business he owned for 20 years shut down. Owning a business means you have a lot of financial obligations, but it doesn't mean you're wealthy. You must be displaying your wealth in some other way. Are you ostentatious?


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

I deleted all my posts because this thread is surreal to me. For me, it's a point of PRIDE to provide for my wife, my children and even, God forbid, any potential girlfriends. It is part of the male role. She expects that and men do too.

So in some ways it sounds like cheating to me: "you Missie, get to provide for all my sexual snd emotional needs and I...will give you the crumbs from my table."

Whether she is materialistic or not, if I were the girl, I'd walk on principle. Because the default assumption seems to be she is shallow and/or a thief.


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## Mistyfied (Sep 27, 2013)

RandomDude said:


> Cept in the case of seeking non-materialistic women, these fishes can see above water. In other words, they'll test the 'waters', gauge your financial potential etc. My ex never did, not once. Even though I've continued to live humbly despite my success, mentioning my business just makes the whole thing meh, especially as its success is easy to investigate.
> 
> So that's why I'm hoping to use the correct bait by not mentioning my business at all, not fully lying, but hiding it for at least six months to a year - timeframe depended on the individual in question.


Businesses are fickle things. I don't know what your business is and how secure you are, etc, but commenting for me personally, if I hear someone is a business owner then I have an awareness that a business can boom one year, not do so well the next or even go bankrupt. I sincerely hope not for you but that is my awareness of business. It wouldn't be a factor for me in deciding whether to date you. Be with the person you want to be with because you never know when health issues, etc, will reduce income potential.


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

not recognizable said:


> "So in some ways it sounds like cheating to me: "you iMissie, get to provide for all my sexual snd emotional needs and I...will give you the crumbs from my table."
> 
> ---------------------------
> 
> No offense to the thoughtful gentlemen here, but that's the way of it for quite a few men I know.


Don't understand this, but I would like to. Who is it aimed at, and what does it mean?


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## SpinDaddy (Nov 12, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> . . .How am I being decieving? I'm just not telling the whole truth


*Seriously TAM needs a vomit avatar.

If that’s how you comport yourself . . . you are your own worst enemy.*


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

Sandfly said:


> Don't understand this, but I would like to. Who is it aimed at, and what does it mean?


I'm not offended at all.by what she is stating. Some people demand everything from their lover/spouse but offer little in return, male or female.


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

JCD said:


> I'm not offended at all.by what she is stating. Some people demand everything from their lover/spouse but offer little in return, male or female.


Well, can't argue with that.


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## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

omega said:


> I don't see why being a business owner means anything. I know business owners who are massively in debt, who are struggling to keep their business going, or who have been forced to close their business. Just last week I met a guy who was just hired as a school janitor after the business he owned for 20 years shut down. Owning a business means you have a lot of financial obligations, but it doesn't mean you're wealthy. You must be displaying your wealth in some other way. Are you ostentatious?


I'd think similarly - especially with small business owners who are also self-employed (compared to an investor/owner), it can often mean working many more hours than being employed and often (not always) earning less, particularly when considering the time invested. However it does take balls to give it a try, whether it succeeds financially or not. And I do think there are certain personalities more willing to take the risk and yearn to be their own boss over others. I wouldn't assume someone was minted if I learned they were a business owner though.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Jellybeans said:


> What do you WANT to do?
> 
> You don't seem to know that.


Nothing changes but the date.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

As for being ostentatious, past dates have asked about my business and when they do I was honest and even shared my advice for building their own and what I've learnt. I now bite my tongue in this however.



> if I hear someone is a business owner then I have an awareness that a business can boom one year, not do so well the next or even go bankrupt. I sincerely hope not for you but that is my awareness of business. It wouldn't be a factor for me in deciding whether to date you. Be with the person you want to be with because you never know when health issues, etc, will reduce income potential.


That's precisely the point, with my ex I was secure in knowing that no matter what happened to my business she'll always be there for me as she's proven to be able to love me prior to establishment.

As for debts I had alot upon ownership but by going the route of investment I expanded successfully without incuring more costs - which is a pain as well considering right now I'm having difficulty buying them out since financial loss to capital due to divorce.

It is due to this loss of power that I am considering giving up the reigns once I find a suitable candidate. I am no longer motivated to expand the business but I'm under substantial pressure to do so from my shareholders. As such, I may suffer a loss of income and would I be able to trust my future partners to stick with me through it? I'd rather test them first, then invest... rather than to invest early and suffer the consequences of my foolishness.

I don't know though, maybe all three past dates were indeed genuinely interested. Maybe I just can't get over how my ex was there before all this. I don't know


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

I know, on your behalf.

Your wife didn't intend it, but you were put in an awkward position of having to buy her out, and you don't want that again.

You found yourself being steered into conversations about business when you weren't interviewing for a business partner. That was your gut-feeling talking when this made you uncomfortable and stopped wanting to talk about it.

You talk about your shareholders thus:

"I'd rather test them first, then invest... rather than to invest early and suffer the consequences of my foolishness."

And you're talking about your dates this way also. It's not dissimilar as both involve a long-term commitment. It wouldn't matter after all, if you just wanted the bachelor life.

But perhaps some of the commitment-craving and investment-thinking in your dates is a transference of your business worries.

Maybe once you've sorted your business world, you'll have better clarity, more room to think objectively about other areas of your life.

Seeing as you're a business fellow, you should be paying me a consultant's fee.

Would $2000 Australian be acceptable to you  It comes with a six week follow up package, to see how you're getting on.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Haha too bad, you've already given me the package for free 

You have a point though, I'm probably just thinking too much because of the stress from work and my impending divorce.


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## Wiltshireman (Jan 23, 2013)

RandomDude said:


> Haha too bad, you've already given me the package for free
> 
> You have a point though, I'm probably just thinking too much because of the stress from work and my impending divorce.


RD, 

I am glad that you can see that you are under a high stress load ATM. Recognizing a problem is the first step to fixing it.

I would humbly suggest that you take a break from dating until you are in a better place emotionally.

All the best of luck to you.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Hard to say no to the opportunity to flirt when it presents itself =/
It makes me laugh and smile making them blush

But meh, oh well


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

How about an ugly and/or old woman? She will be so grateful for the attention, SHE will pay the bills.

Or how about a terminal patient? She can't take it with her, but she's happy to have a relationship. Money means nothing to her.

Let's see. Hide all your money and go Third World. Try Kyrgyzstan.

See...here is the disconnect: You want a hot looking, ameanable easy to get alone with woman, with a high sex drive who is young and single...and yet you don't want to pay for it. Excuse me...you want to totally discount one of your MAJOR SELLING POINTS.

You want her to love your amenable cute self. Let me clue you in: I could throw a rock out your window and hit a dozen cute amenable young men in their thirties. 

Plus you think you are SO famous that ALL the women in town know you are rich. Um...arrogant much?

Essentially, you want to walk onto a used car lot and find a Ferrari for $5000 that NO ONE has noticed before. You are seeking a very high quality girl and offering nothing back except cute amenability...oh...and a step daughter and a bitter ex.

You are running with one foot in a bucket of cement already! One of your MAJOR SELLING POINTS you want to HIDE?  

Those dozen other guys? Not rich, but also a) single and b) no entanglements and excess drama.

Girls RARELY marry ONLY for money, particularly Western women. Compared to Kyrgyzstan, they can be finicky. So yes, they will like the money BUT they will also like you.

Here is a fairness test: You can date and hide your money...and the girl gets to wear a mask and a sack dress during your dates. You can then get together PURELY on your personalities. Cause if it's fair for you to hide a huge selling point, why can't she? Or do you only love her for her looks?

See how stupid that is?


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Errr, no way would I allow a woman to take over the bills, too proud for that. As for 'fame and fortune', it just comes with an established business that has expanded for years and continually growing. And it's not like my brand has expanded to the four corners of the world.

I don't feel as if I'm better than anyone else bc of it, I treat everyone as equals. When I was still managing operations I also incorporated an open door policy of flat management. Cause I've been there; where they were.

As for being a huge selling point - why should it be? Why should I reward materialistic women? Why should I reward them the same way my mother was rewarded as she was very materialistic, married dad when he was wealthy, ditched him during the recession - in which he got a job the next week. I won't be like dad, I won't be like my current stepfather either. Why should I put forward this selling point? 

Especially when it had nothing to do with me when I was a poor man courting a rich woman who loved me for me? I trusted STBX enough to have a family with her, she EARNED my trust. A trust that I simply can't give others the benefit of doubt in when it comes to my present situation - unless I hide my so-called "selling point"

Why should I have to be better than other prospects bc I'm stable financially? I was there right at the bottom mopping floors. I'm still the same man, just have alot more to play with after years of hitting the pillows staying awake for 6 hrs stressed as fk before sleeping for 2, only to have to wake up for another 12 hour day -> that was how hectic it was.

And you know who was there the entire time? Yeah, my ex.
I just want to be able to trust a woman the same way I trusted her. That is all.


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

Your wife 'bought' you when you were 20+. Women of that age INVEST in a man. They HOPE he is successful and will work hard to help him achieve that. Because at that age, the man is an unknown.

Let me put it in business terms. A 20 year old guy is an IPO (Initial Public Offering). You aren't sure if the stock will make a bundle...or crap out. You do your homework and you pray. AND...at that age, men have MUCH FEWER PROSPECTS. Few people are running at any but the most promising IPOs at that age. To put it bluntly, few girls gave you the time of day if you are anything like the average guy.

At 30+, you are an ESTABLISHED STOCK. You have (or better have) a history of success! The meaning of success varies for every girl. BUT...if you are an Apple, or an IBM, you ALSO get a benefit: a lot of buyers willing to spend top dollar. 

Which means you no longer get to choose from whomever will give you the time of day; you get a MUCH WIDER SELECTION.

Except you want to pretend you are still that 20 year old boy. You. Are. Not. 

If a woman hid her face with a mask, or refused to tell you significant things about her past which you were interested in, or even hid HER financials, I'd bet you'd cross her name off the dating list.

And yet for some reason, you think this is 'okay' for you to do it.

One last thought. Your wife BUILT that trust one day at a time with you. In the early days it was passion and love and horniness which kept you together. But every day she built a little more trust in her.

You have a lot of time between date one and 'stealing your wallet'. But you are rejecting these girls wholesale for...not having the 'trust investment' your wife has? There is no way they can! She has TEN YEARS of hard times behind her. They have ten minutes.

This is frankly unrealistic.

Edited to add: You can WANT whatever the hell you want. Realism has nothing to do with 'wants'

I want a 25 year old nymphomaniac mute orphan who is gorgeous, independently wealthy and is addicted to me. 

Somehow I think it is on par with 'stranger I automatically trust with my life'


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> Why should I have to be better than other prospects bc I'm stable financially?


You need to prove you ARE stable. And most guys don't have a step daughter and an ex hanging around. 

Girls are skittish to drama. You need something to balance that out.


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

JCD is exaggerating slightly. Sure, you can throw a rock out the window and find a willing male. 

But you won't find a loyal male this way, and chances are you won't find an attractive, intelligent or mentally balanced one.

So women have the advantage when it comes to one night stands... they can keep it. 

I see it as a downside, because they have no way of knowing if the attraction will last beyond sex - more on this below.

I prefer the advantage that men have, which is once you've hooked a nice partner, it's much easier to keep them.

But back to women not being able to tell if _sexual attraction _will translate into loyalty... the whole point is that Meh won't be able to tell if _financial compatibility _will translate into loyalty.

Smart women carry out the 'waiting game' on men, to gauge their personalities, BEFORE they reveal fully reveal the extent of their sexual attraction. And that's considered virtuous! Mother brings them up, telling them that this is what they have to do, to get a good man and not a user.

How is it therefore unfair, if a man were to do the same with his finances, to carry out a version of the 'waiting game' to gauge personality - to avoid a user? What say mother and father now? Oh, now he's being superficial and ungrateful! 

No, he better accept what is given to him and hope for the best.

I wonder if the idea of a fellow doing the same thing as a woman does has pushed some kind of button here, similar to the reverse-jealousy button of a man who is looking elsewhere.


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

He can play whatever games he wants. But it would be a big whopping bite of karma if he hid his finances, met the girl of his dreams, one who fulfilled him, one who met all his expectations...and then revealed his portfolio...and had her BURNING FURIOUS and leave him...because he's deceitful. He wasn't honest. He was insultingly not trusting and UNtrustworthy.


That's the magic thing about trust. You got to give it to get it.


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## Sandfly (Dec 8, 2013)

JCD said:


> He can play whatever games he wants. But it would be a big whopping bite of karma if he hid his finances, met the girl of his dreams, one who fulfilled him, one who met all his expectations...and then revealed his portfolio...and had her BURNING FURIOUS and leave him...because he's deceitful. He wasn't honest. He was insultingly not trusting and UNtrustworthy.
> 
> 
> That's the magic thing about trust. You got to give it to get it.


OK well equally, 

we should therefore have no sympathy for the girl who decides to wait a month and loses the man she fancies 

because while she was playing the 'make him wait for sex' game that mother taught her, he hooked up with a first-date slapper.

Is this too, Karma?

Trouble is, I too would recommend waiting for a least a couple of weeks before giving it up to a man, just as I'm saying that buying flowers, dinner and all that jazz is a serious mistake.

That's not fraud - it's good practice to get rid of users early on.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

I don't know... I've considered what you guys mentioned hence planned a more balanced approach by simply mentioning my roles, putting forward "living within my means" and "not looking for more financial opportunities" and avoiding mentioning anything about past successes.

If anything once they find out, would they seriously consider me deceitful? It's simple half-truths and "lies" of omission. Or probably stingy (Just because I don't spend extravangantly)? Even if they were furious I can still just mention:

I am living within my means! And I'm not looking for further financial opportunities either! I just didn't mention my success because why should it be important?

If it's financial stability they are after they've got it - I've always been one to take responsibility for my own finances even since before ex met me. To hell with those who consider me attractive based on my success.


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## Mistyfied (Sep 27, 2013)

I don't know about considering you deceitful but, from what you write, I get the sense I would pick up on your lack of trust of my intentions and that would put me off greatly.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Ahahaha oh come on, I open my mouth and automatically they think I'm a player because I'm confident, charming, playful and flirty. Pffft lol

I put up with that, acknowledge that trust has to be earned for a variety of understandable reasons, so why should I be any less guarded?


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## Mistyfied (Sep 27, 2013)

I suppose I tend to trust people until they give me reason for it to be otherwise (within reason). But then again, in the same way that would might be reserved about sharing finances, I wouldn't sleep with you, for example, until I had established your values on that front and that they measured up to my own values. What I am trying to say is that I would be put off by anyone who felt I was a gold-digger until proven otherwise. I'd much rather a man who assumed the best and let things unfold knowing that it would become obvious in time if my values towards material things didn't gel with theirs. Maybe it's just that I wouldn't want to even try to start someone with a person who is starting from a negative point rather than a neutral or positive point. No-one knows where a new relationship is going to go so it's a risk for both people. 

And as I've said, I think you are making too much of your financial situation. For me, being in business = risk and I'd view your financial situation as more precarious than someone employed by another business/organization/industry. 

And ... a lot of women these days don't need a man to support them financially as they are capable of making a good living on their own so it's not a factor for them.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Hmmm, maybe I'll just say I'm struggling in my business (which is somewhat true, because I'm being pressured by shareholders to expand when I just don't want to!), and they might just go "OMG, too risky, going to go bankrupt soon..." *runs*

:rofl:


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

There is no 'automatic win' here. You got to take your chances just like the rest of us.

You could find a woman who pretends to be Amish and the moment you slip that ring on her finger: pfft! Suddenly that changes.

Be yourself, don't lie. "I have a business. We are doing okay. Some years are good and some years are bad. I have a house and a car. So, tell me about your mother."

That's it! It's all honest and forthright without any added details. Problem is, she might, through NATURAL curiosity ask what the name is. Maybe she wants to bring you lunch. Maybe she wants to bring you 'dessert'. Maybe she wants to check your financials. You can't know that, but you are automatically assuming the worst.

A DATE can't rip you off. A prenup takes care of the rest.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

If they ask about my business however, it's not exactly hard for them to figure out the rest even if I keep my own mouth shut. I could if I was a small sole trader but I don't have this luxury.

Looking back now the last two dates did ask about my finances out of "curiouscity", the first didn't - but then again the first already knew me from before and been over to our house. Hmmm, maybe I should use this as a guideline then no? A non-materialistic woman wouldn't even care, STBX didn't care how I made my money as long as its legit. She never once asked how much I made.

So maybe I'll just keep doing what I have been doing - maintaining honesty yet secrecy - and dump them as soon as they ask about my finances! Have cheap dates too! Nah, wont work

I'll have to feed them information to stop them from being inquisitive. Hence my original approach - eliminating my business from conversation.


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## Mistyfied (Sep 27, 2013)

I would most definitely ask you about your business for no other reason than being interested in who you are and what you do. I wouldn't ask about the financials unless it were directly relevant to the conversation and we knew each other quite well. Obviously you are managing to support yourself so your income must be adequate to do that. That's good enough for me. I only need enough to live. I expect you would also be interested in my professional life and outlook and we'd discuss that equally for the same reason - because you're interested in who I am and what I do.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

they don't have to ask to size me up if they do their research like any good investor, omitting ownership however will help... I dunno im done with dating for now, I'm just going to flirt around
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## always_alone (Dec 11, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> Looking back now the last two dates did ask about my finances out of "curiouscity", the first didn't - but then again the first already knew me from before and been over to our house. Hmmm, maybe I should use this as a guideline then no?


I'd never ask a guy about his financials on a first date, and would definitely see this as a tell-tale red flag about where their heads are at.

That said, I agree with other posters here that your presumption that women are all gold-diggers is a huge turn-off, and I surely wouldn't consider "earning your trust" a worthwhile activity.


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## Aspydad (Oct 17, 2013)

I have read through this thread and I am not a fan of the concept.

Here are my reasons:

**To hide ones success or profession is the same as basing a relationship on a lie.

**If one is truly at a healthy point in one’s life, then one realizes that to date is not a marriage proposal. Certainly one does not want to marry a gold digger but, it will take time anyway (not a week or a month) to get to know and fall in love with this person. If that time lasts longer than the deception, then once this person finds out (and is not a gold digger) they are going to be very turned off and most likely will dump you. Because if the person is worth anything, they will not want to be with someone who is that damaged.

**I guess it does depend on age how one would handle getting married. For me, at age 51 who has grown kids, I would definitely have a prenup - not to protect me, but to protect my kids as I do intend on leaving them a significant inheritance. There would be a clause in the prenup that would increase the percentage of my worth that would go to the new spouse according to the length of marriage.

I could go on here. My point though is that this experiment is pointless and unnecessary. What I see in the concept is someone who is trying to impress totally with his money which is NOT the basis for any healthy relationship - money or ability to make money is only one part of a person's worth - I actually think outstanding character is what one should look for when deciding on a spouse and the lying part of this concept truly points to lack of character.


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## JCD (Sep 2, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> they don't have to ask to size me up if they do their research like any good investor, omitting ownership however will help... I dunno im done with dating for now, I'm just going to flirt around
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Who cares about a woman? You have money. That seems more important.

Honestly, that is how you are coming off.


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

JCD said:


> Who cares about a woman? You have money. That seems more important.
> 
> Honestly, that is how you are coming off.


I was about to say this.

Jellybeans alluded to this earlier.

You have bigger issues OP. I tried to spell it out for you a very long time ago prior to your stbx even being a stbx.

I think you need to do some soul searching. Start with why you ended things with your ex wife. Hint: I don't think it had anything to do with her sex drive.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

what are you trying to suggest exactly? that I'm divorcing my wife bc of money? lol
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Waits4Mr.Right (Oct 29, 2011)

I told my boyfriend of 7 months, straight up that if we ever did decide to get married I wanted him to get a prenup. I never want him 2 question why I want 2 be with him. I'm more interested in what we can build 2gether, vs trying to take what he worked so hard to have be4 I ever came along. 
I truly like the guy for his ambition, generosity, his care for other people and plenty of other characteristics. His "stuff" is what I consider 2 be unstable. I want something that's concrete, that we Both can build on like friendship, love, respect. Those 'things ' I can count on.


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## GettingIt_2 (Apr 12, 2013)

RandomDude said:


> I just want companionship that I can trust to be genuine.
> 
> Meh


You want what you are loathe to give. 

You'll dig your own hole without any help from a "gold digger."


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## Enginerd (May 24, 2011)

Double blind studies are how things are proved in the medical world so why not? I believe its the same as a women having the right to keep her sexual past to herself.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

As I mentioned in my approach I'm not exactly lying, just hiding the details until she earns my trust like ex did.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

RandomDude said:


> As I mentioned in my approach I'm not exactly lying, just hiding the details until she earns my trust like ex did.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


That's lying, dude. And you know it.

C


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

So I guess not telling someone my entire life story is lying too? lol

It's just being careful in regards to when to share information is it not?


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

I don't think it is lying to not divulge the extent of your assets, TBH that is not someone else's business until you are in a serious relationship.
But putting on whole false persona, crappy car etc to trick a woman is a crappy act RD. I still think you need some help, your thinking seems very warped on this issue.
To even consider going back to your ex because of this issue is wrong. And you are still avoiding the issue of simply hooking up with a financial equal.

I have my own situation that is playing on my mind so be warned. Mr H is a very high income earner with assets. I have a very good asset base. Recently I was given the funds from my parents to buy a new house outright, it is family money and I have no issue with this.
Problem is that I have not told Mr H the truth, as far as he knows I have borrowed the money from my parents, I mean who gets to buy a new house with no debt? So now I have created a problem and not really sure what to do. We are in a very serious relationship but I feel bad about not divulging the truth.

Just be careful what you do, maybe get some IC around this issue of money and trust. Anyway in the end you can easily get a Binding Financial Agreement so what is the big deal?


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

True, besides I reckon my car is crappy enough, its just that I had crappier and my ex still fell for me. As for finding a financial equal nowadays I am considering it... it just seems so hypocritical of me to have financial standards when I wish to avoid women with financial standards at the same time. Not to mention it'll cut off alot of potentially great women.

As for BFAs sure but where does her heart lie? That's the important thing, regardless of what I do to protect myself. I don't know...


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

I guess it is harder for you being younger but in my age bracket everyone has already had at least one marriage so BFA's are standard. There is no emotion attached to it because really it is to protect each partners respective children.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

So, will you endorse my plan considering my circumstances?


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

RandomDude said:


> So I guess not telling someone my entire life story is lying too? lol
> 
> It's just being careful in regards to when to share information is it not?


As Holland states, it's one thing to not hand over a complete financial statement on the first date, and another thing entirely to pretend to be someone different than you are. 

Consider this as well... What's going to happen when you tell her one thing about who you are, and she Googles your name and finds out something different. You may want to investigate what information is floating around out there before you bother constructing your new self. I'd guess that your name is out there as the owner of your business already.

C


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Ha! I don't have post such details online. I know how to maintain confidentiality, unless they work at the ATO or can dig up my registrations... that's fking stalking - and a dealbreaker if anything too!

Anyways I'm not pretending to be someone different, just keeping everything about my work life secret no?


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> So, will you endorse my plan considering my circumstances?


No RD I still think it is a crappy plan. 

OK I was thinking about this in regard to a totally different issue but it applies. I think I am a fairly good judge of a person and would spot a gold digger a mile off. I can pick the jerks, PUA's etc easily.
Maybe it is a matter of honing in your people skills more. What you are suggesting is the opposite, you are OK to pick any woman but scared she is going to be a gold digger. What about fine tuning your people picking skills and steer clear of the crappy ones.
Start off in a positive place, not a place of trickery. Just bypass the ones that are not right for you.

Trust that there are plenty of good women out there.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Isn't this fine tuning? I'm not exactly lying, just testing. Everyone tests potential partners. I'm simply putting forward my humble side and going 'stealth mode' with gold diggers.

In the end it takes time to know a person and first impressions don't automatically mean they are correct. If first impressions are correct then I should be a player according to the impressions women have of me.


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

RandomDude said:


> Isn't this fine tuning? I'm not exactly lying, just testing. Everyone tests potential partners. I'm simply putting forward my humble side and going 'stealth mode' with gold diggers.
> 
> In the end it takes time to know a person and first impressions don't automatically mean they are correct. If first impressions are correct then I should be a player according to the impressions women have of me.


Fine tuning really, hey Dude you said 


> I'm thinking of a little experiment, buying an old car, and lying about personal income.


.

How about just being yourself, not divulging information about your financial situation and set your radar to fine tune mode? Don't make it any harder than it needs to be.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

That was my initial plan of approach, it has been revised:



> True, thinking of a balanced approach akin to the status of my youth, like I may assume titles that explain my work but refusing to discuss my earnings, and proclaiming that I enjoy my work, live within my means, provide for my daughter and have no aspirations to advance financially as I'm stable. Besides if they ask "how much" it's a red flag anyway.
> 
> I will provide the impression of a simple non-materialistic man, they'll see me as non financially motivated which will remove alot of prospects I'm sure. The problem is keeping this impression, as throughout the course of a relationship a woman may meet my friends, etc. I can't expect them to lie on my behalf nor can I expect them to keep their mouth shut in terms of my success. And trust will still have be earned over time as yet they may also decide they would prefer someone more established in their career later down the track - which would be a good laugh.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

I assume the like means endorsement?


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

Lol no it means I like that you are big enough to take the heat and think about the situation more.

There is a difference between lying about finances and not over sharing information. I tend to go with not over sharing especially when you have a better than average financial situation.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Well ok, how about this, if they ask what I do for a living, I'll just say I work part-time (which I do hehe) and nothing to boast about  If they ask which industry I'll just tell them, and also say that the industry doesn't pay its workers well (which is true unless you are owner  ) hehe

So not lying at all, just misdirection! Like magic!


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