# please, this is good news, right



## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

for those who have been following this soap opera, thank you.

my wife separated from me on june 20th, due to my stupidity, alcohol, use, (probably) insecurities, lack of "being there, i think she was emotionally drained from caring for me all our married life, then after my stroke she really did work hard. she has said all the typical things, i hated you, why did you do this to us, etc.

now, since we've been separated, i've been trying like a mad man to make up for lost time. dating, seeing each other more than we ever did when we were together. it's been good/encouraging. i've been seeing a clinical psychologist for individual therapy and attending AA, am sober since may 19th, and i'm looking for a ray of light.

my original therapist has since taken a job with the school district, so i was referred to the guy who founded the clinic. he and his wife conduct couples therapy. and beth has agreed to join me next monday for a session with them.

i desperately want reconciliation. i think i am a changed man, although i understand my wife may need time to see/believe the changes.

consider this: i've made errors in our relationship in the past. i've always been able to convince her that i'd make things better. unfortunatly (or fortunately) this time, there's no amount of words from me that are going to heal this wound.

her deciding to go to my session on monday, in addition to the dates, time spent together, etc. that's good news, right? i don't know why, but i'm terrified that she's going to use that time to drop a bomb on me. y'know in the comfort of my doctor's office. that's my raw insecurity i figure, but...

thank you in advance for you input.


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## Leahdorus (Jul 28, 2008)

It sounds like good news to me. If she was totally done with you, I doubt she'd be willing to go to this session with you. But I do understand your uneasiness. I feel the same way - sometime I dread the joint counseling because I don't know if he's going to use the time to tell me something I don't want to hear, because it's in a "safe" environment. Go with an open mind. My gut says it's good news that she's going though. :smthumbup: Keep doing what you're doing.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

I think the first thing you ned to do is shelf the fear. Often people create their own doom by the mood they create for themselves.

draconis


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## blind (Jan 17, 2008)

I think it is probably normal for you to have this concern. You are facing one of your biggest fears, divorce and losing your wife. One can't help but analyze the hell out of everything that happens. I know that is what I've been doing for the past 10 months or so. But, I think (and hope) your first impression is probably right. This is a good thing.

In short, I understand your concerns, and noone can predict the future, but I still believe this is a good thing for you and the marriage.

Best of luck on Monday. Keep us posted on how it goes. Take care and try to have a good weekend.

Blind


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

leadorus,
you say:

>>>sometime I dread the joint counseling because I don't know if he's going to use the time to tell me something I don't want to hear, because it's in a "safe" environment<<<

has that happened to you?


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

My husband says I'm a very negative person. This is one of the reasons he gave for leaving. With this being said, I even think the new development is a positive move. Just continue with what you've been doing to win her back and look forward to your appointment.


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

ok, 4 votes for "this is good news" and zero for "this is a catastraphy waiting to happen." i'll take it....

BUT...

question 827aug...

if YOU were the wife going to mondays session and i were the husband...would YOU be using the safety of the dr's office to drop a bomb (you being the negative one and all)?


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

That's an interesting question...I wouldn't use the doctor's office to "drop the bomb". Never! I'm curious; why do you ask? Infact, the old me would never have waited to tell anyone anything. With therapy I'm learning to be a little less direct and more patient though.


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

well, i asked because i think my wife is a pretty negative person. i wondered if negative people would hold it in then drop the bomb in therapy.


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

Oh, I see. I will say this though. Negative people are usually skeptical and unsure about what the future holds. We tend to be waiting for disaster to strike. That tells me more about your situation. From what I've read in your posts, your wife has some grounds for her negative thoughts. Therefore, perhaps she is going to your counseling appointment for reassurances. That would be a "safe place" for her to get the honest truth you are changing for the better. I say it's a good thing. I hope so anyway.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Hey any word?

draconis


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

drac/swedish/justean/827/leah/blind,
here's the latest:

i just got home from maybe the funnest time i've had with beth in a looonnnggg time. we put together my waterbed, laughing all the way, pretty funny talk about her and i and our old tennis rivalry (i WAS better than her, but whatever), she invited me to a jim gaffigan comedy show this saturday (and i'm thinking about doing a limo for the show) and we had dynamite small talk tonight over dinner at the park with the kids. 

i couldn't have had a better night. the nice part is that we went to see "mamma mia" at the drive in theater last night and enjoyed each other's company. so it's two nights in a row. that really feels good.

i swear to God i'm falling in love again. i never want to hurt her again. i never want to be hurt again. she is so perfect, i swear. she deserves the best, and i am trying so hard. she knows that, i know she does. she'll never have to make an effort again, everything is going to be easy for her. she's worked so damned hard for me, her family has never made it easy for her either. i'm gona be the knight in shining armor. i was before, i will again.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

It sounds like you are a better man now. Let us know how tomorrow goes.

We are always routing for you.

draconis


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

session went well as i told you in pm. beth asked friday about doing couples sessions every week. i scheduled them that way (different day of the week to accomodate her work schedule) then she starts asking me why she has to attend. i tell her she doesn't HAVE to, they're gonna be communication builders. aparently i'm not such a good communicator. so after a little hemmin' and hawin' she says "yep" pick me up from work and i'll go. why i sense "the bomb" is beyond me. she hasn't done it yet, but...

i don't know. i'm gonna go do some more work in the self-esteem workbook.


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

Keep in mind that she is juggling work and kids right now, so you may have caught her at a stressful time where she was thinking of the reality of fitting this into her week. Forget that "bomb" thinking...everything up to this point has indicated she loves you. 

Come back after you work on your workbook and give us some positive news


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

i took my own advice and "put a lie" to "the bomb" thinking and you are right swedish, there is no "bomb," i just have self esteem issues, maybe related to my thoughts that i am "lucky" (read "shouldn't," without beth's help) to be alive right now. so much of my being alive is related to the humility that i probably wouldn't be here to take my children to school or play on the swingset, without that wonderful woman who saved my life. she is going to be a part of me forever, regardless of how this turns out, so it is hard to focus on "me." i woke up today so calm and clear. i have more than a week to "work out" any feelings of "the bomb" and, as i said, there is no evidence of impending doom. it's just me, i gotta figure it out. thanks swedish, maybe after this i won't need any ego boosts or rah-rah's, i hope.


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

If you can honestly look at yourself and say your self-esteem issues stem from the past...your drinking, that you weren't there for your family as you should have been, etc...fine, because you learned the hard lesson from your past...learn from it but don't dwell on it...focus on the man you are today...sober and completely focused on making amends and doing the right things for your family. With all of the stress of the separation, I really hope you can look in the mirror and be proud of the man you see...You have made leaps and bounds in a short time and not only does she see it, but you should be proud of that too.


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

funny, but our session was about communication. she just called me to "*****" about something that happened at work. so i didn't try to fix it for her, at the end of the conversation, she just said "thanks for listening to me b13ch" and we hung up. it felt pretty good that she called me to confide and chat about it. so i passed the communication test by just listening!


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

swedish,
like most guys, i'm too busy trying to "fix" myself to be proud of my progress. i'll admit this, it has been stressful, but gratifying. i've been able to let go of some of my petty jealousy issues, not that you'd notice, but i've kept my mouth shut or been complimentary when in the past i would have shot my mouth off. once, i'm positive she noticed my difference in attitude. also, i think the independence thing is completely clear to me; i don't know if there's ever going to be enough adjustment to ever amend for my past in that category, and i want to encourage her to grow. she recently let me know she wants to go back to school to be a nurse. i said "good for you" enthusiastically and let it lay. 

anyway, i'm trying like a madman. you're witness to that. i'm just a little anxious that there's not enough time to repair everything.


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

i'm on pins and needles...since the last post, we've had our very first "fight" since the separation. i put it in quotes because i refuse to fight. i took the kids to dinner a couple of nights ago, and beth said that i could have "easily got several meals at the grocery store for what i spent on dinner." in addition she says "if you can't see what i see about the kids putting on weight..." and then didn't finish the sentence. she is concerned about my two younger daughters' weight. background: i have struggled with a weight issue all my life. my current weight might be the lowest she's known me at. the girls both play competetive soccer and their lack of stamina is hurting them right now. anyway...
so last night we sit down to watch a dvd of "get smart" episodes and i just interject how "i truly am sorry but i didn't have any groceries and they were hungry so i took the out and i totally agree with you about the health issue of excess weight and..." she seemed to warm up and accept my apology. i then used the moment to invite her to a trans-siberia orchestra concert (kinda rock-orchestral holiday music) and she accepted. then we watched a couple of episodes of "get smart" (a long-time favorite of both of ours) and i went home.

the self-esteem workbook is getting pretty hard. the excercises are difficult to understand, but i'm still working it. my hbp meds keep me pretty tired so it's hard to keep my attention on iot, and i suspect a bit of depression is not helping that. i try real hard not to show the depression (helped by cymbalta) 'cause i want beth to know i'm holding together ok, but it's tough. we're going to the drive in again this weekend (3 weekend in a row) so that's something to look forward to. we also have counseling next wednesday. i hope to God that is not a poor decision.


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

Hi voivod,

Here's another way to look at it...she is concerned about finances and your daughters' weight...typical mom concerns IMO...the key is, actions you took that she found upsetting to her she could have easily kept to herself (and possibly stacked a few cards against you) but she didn't do that...she was honest about how she felt and that is the only way you are given the opportunity to see how she feels and either agree with her, apologize, etc. and gain some points in the patient, understanding department or dismiss her concerns making her feel her opinions don't matter to you.

Kudos for once again taking the high road


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

swedish,
you have a way to show the silver lining, i'll tell you.
thank you. you could have easily co-written "ten days to self-esteem" and i mean it!
thanks,
chris


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## brad (Jul 31, 2008)

You should read the book or watch the video "the secret". It talks about how you attract the very things in life you want or not want. It's very revealing. Most of what you get in life is like a self fullfilling prophecy. Watch it with an open mind. 

I have read a lot of your posts and while you sound sincere you have so much anxiety and are always thinking about the worst scenario my feeling is your wife picks up on this energy.


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

brad-
you say:
>>> you have so much anxiety and are always thinking about the worst scenario my feeling is your wife picks up on this energy.<<<

you say that as though that is bad. can you expound/explain what you mean.
thanks


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Since you have done so well losing weight have you thought about sharing that with your girls? Go on walks together. Teach them to eat a piece of fruit before their meal. Maybe you can mentor them now and teach them a life time of good habits.

draconis


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

drac-
ha! my not drinking plus stroke therapy has directly resulted in my weight loss! i'll tell the kids to quit drinking, but...

that's the first laugh of today! thanks.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

voivod said:


> drac-
> ha! my not drinking plus stroke therapy has directly resulted in my weight loss! i'll tell the kids to quit drinking, but...
> 
> that's the first laugh of today! thanks.


LOL, I meant that good habits can be taught. You said that you had been exorcising. How about eating right? There are many ways to help them out. 

It is never to young to teach a kid what is wrong with drinking.

draconis


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

no buddy, i'm with ya...it's just the first read had me kinda chuckling. not mocking, i'm sorry!


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Hey if I got you a laugh today it was well worth it. I guess I will have to stumble over myself more.

draconis


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

brad said:


> I have read a lot of your posts and while you sound sincere you have so much anxiety and are always thinking about the worst scenario my feeling is your wife picks up on this energy.


Yes, she would have to be "brain dead" not to!


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

mt- 
i don't understand. should i be more of a bastard? less accomodating? what???


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## brad (Jul 31, 2008)

voivod said:


> brad-
> you say:
> >>> you have so much anxiety and are always thinking about the worst scenario my feeling is your wife picks up on this energy.<<<
> 
> ...


Subconsciously we send out signals that people pick up on their radar. Have you ever wondered why it's exhausting being with a person who is really scrambled, who talks way too much about nothing, or is negative? It's draining. It drives people away. And the irony is it's a self fullfilling prophecy: Let's say someone thinks their spouse doenst want them. They send out these signals to the other person. The other person breaks up with them. So it ended up being self fullfilling. 

Most people live on auto pilot and cant understand how their thoughts, feelings and attitude determine what kind of karma they will face in life.

You dont want to try holding on to another person. In order for another person to want to be there for you you first have to recognize and appreciate your own worth, your own value. 

A great being once said " you have to love and respect yourself in SPITE of what others say; you can never love and respect yourself BECAUSE of what others say.


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

brad-
what you say makes sense on the surface. what i can tell you is there has been progress. she volunteered to go to counseling with me, we've been "out" several times, she truly shows a "love" without acting on it, has made several comments that have been encouraging.

i'm trying to not appear as though i'm trying to "hold on" but she'd be "brain dead" to think otherwise.

self confidence has never been a problem for me. i don't know what's happening here.


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## brad (Jul 31, 2008)

voivod said:


> brad-
> what you say makes sense on the surface. what i can tell you is there has been progress. she volunteered to go to counseling with me, we've been "out" several times, she truly shows a "love" without acting on it, has made several comments that have been encouraging.
> 
> i'm trying to not appear as though i'm trying to "hold on" but she'd be "brain dead" to think otherwise.
> ...


To be frank with you while you undoutably are sincere you have sounded desperate and anxious on here. This is what mark and I are talking about. These feelings would in turn be conveyed to your wife.

Take any moment of the day. Is it spent on how you can win your wife back or working on yourself as an individual?

Keep in mind how you may be draining her with your "efforts".


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

brad-
i swear it's working, whatever i'm doing. maybe not, but she's giving all these positive signs: continued contact socially, repeat "dates," agreement to see counsellor with me after last week's session.

although- she did get pissed at me tonight for calling her too much. this anger really strikes at my self-esteem...i was just making arrangements to get tires put on my oldest daughters car. she kinda flipped out, sorta the same way as when she did when i had that beer (see first post headed "separated...killing me.") i surmised to myself then that she was suffering pms symptoms. it was around the same time of the month, no kidding. i've seen this pattern before with her and God knows i never told her that's what i thought.

so, i look forward to our session on wednesday, even though i'm scared to death she'll drop a bomb on me. then again, we've got a weekend outing with the kids planned, that's something to look forward to. we alway have fun together socially. always.


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

voivod,

You know your wife. We don't, so not every bit of advice we throw out there will work in your specific situation. I don't think you should change what you are doing if it's giving you positive results. 

I think what Brad and MT are saying is exactly what you said above about her getting annoyed with you calling too much. If you become overbearing it could push her away. She is a working mom, and although by her doing, adjusting to a new place on her own with the kids and by your own admission is tired. 

Your main focus should remain you...to keep working through counseling and outside of it on feeling good about yourself and getting/keeping your health on track. I would definitely still keep the dates going and help her out when you can, but don't push yourself on her...goes back to wanting her to absolutely know without a doubt that all you are doing in that regard is to make her life easier, not more hectic. 

You want her thinking, wow that was sweet of him to do x or y & now I can take that off my list vs. ok he wants to come by wed and go here, fri and go there and I still have x and y to get done by then...I need a break from all of this.

Don't stop the good stuff that is giving you good results. Just be mindful of whether you feel it's balanced and helping her or too much and becoming a burden. Base that on her reaction when you call, when you ask her to go out and slow down/speed up as needed.


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

And before counseling sessions, stop the 'bomb' thinking...Think about all the good stuff, how you are doing, the fun you are having together and the positive progress...the better your mindset is walking into the session the more likely it will take a more positive turn because when you speak it will come from a good place.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

voivod said:


> brad-
> i swear it's working, whatever i'm doing. maybe not, but she's giving all these positive signs: continued contact socially, repeat "dates," agreement to see counsellor with me after last week's session.
> 
> although- she did get pissed at me tonight for calling her too much. this anger really strikes at my self-esteem...i was just making arrangements to get tires put on my oldest daughters car. she kinda flipped out, sorta the same way as when she did when i had that beer (see first post headed "separated...killing me.") i surmised to myself then that she was suffering pms symptoms. it was around the same time of the month, no kidding. i've seen this pattern before with her and God knows i never told her that's what i thought.
> ...


I hope you pm me like always, how it goes on Wednesday. I am always here praying for you.

draconis


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

drac-
i'll let you know man. thanks. fyi-i'm praying for a miracle. i've seen one. i believe i'll see another. the work is working.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

I know not only from following your posts but also by all the pm's we have shared that you have put plenty of work into this to make ever wrong righted. You have come a long ways already and overcome many things in the way.

I know your wife has already seen the change. I know that her fear that you might go back is holding her back from falling for you, but she never stopped loving you and I believe soon she will see that you are indeed changed for the better and ready to handle life in the long run.

I wish you well, and you have me praying too.

draconis


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

prayer brought me this, drac. profound. i don't dare say them out loud, they're so powerful.

Hello, my dear I pray that one day you will come to me and ask 'what is more important, me or your life' I'll say my life & you'll walk away never knowing you are my life.

board, don't pity me. i am in love.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

voivod said:


> prayer brought me this, drac. profound. i don't dare say them out loud, they're so powerful.
> 
> Hello, my dear I pray that one day you will come to me and ask 'what is more important, me or your life' I'll say my life & you'll walk away never knowing you are my life.
> 
> board, don't pity me. i am in love.


Well it makes the other post a little more understandable now that I have read this. But why did you ask such a strange question attached to it?

draconis


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## voivod (Aug 7, 2008)

drac-
the co-dependency question? i figured somewhere along the way someone would toss that in. i wondered if feelings like that could really be considered codependant. so clinical this crap is...


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Co-dependant people tend to judge themselves based on their partner. If you felt bad about yourself, could not go on, can only live for....then sure I see it. I do have to say I see a bit of it. But part of a relationship is staying an individual, so that you can be strong for the other person when they need it.

It is one reason I love my wife. She can lead, follow or walk beside me at any time. That is the perfect relationship for me.

draconis


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