# Can't be fixed, now what



## Bulfrog1987

New to this site. This is going to be a stupid long post. Fair warning. I'm a 34 year old woman, married to a 56 year old man for the last 14 years. Briefly I would like to clear a few things up. I don't have 'daddy' issues, I've always been more mature for my age and I know the age gap seems staggering for some, well maybe most.. With the exception of him having a 1950's mindset, it's never been a problem.

Even now, the age difference I don't believe is our issue but hell, we've got so many issues who knows.

When we first got married, my whole family was involved, no one tried to stop us or freak out over the age difference so that's also not been a barrier for us. We moved out of state for him to take a promotion in his career and were on the brink of bankruptcy when we got together after him going through a divorce. Looking back, being so young I'm not sure how I kept that from happening but it was one of the first things I remember majorly helping him with and learning as I went about finances. I've helped him advance in his jobs by writing reports for him (him dictating, me typing them up) as he has severe dyslexia and writing for him is difficult, which makes excelling in what he does for a living hard for him. 

I've worked so many different jobs to help support our household and his boys who moved with us back then. About a year after us marrying he began drinking a lot more. I'm not totally sure, but I don't remember him drinking bottles of whiskey each night when we first got together, a few beers maybe, but never what it rolled into after we got married. After three years and a second move to another state (another promotion) he was travelling a lot more. Which was fine, that was never an issue, I don't need constant attention or him by my side.. But when he would get home, unless I was on the way to the freezer, I wouldn't even get a hello. This went on for three years. He would come home, get the botte of SoCo out and work on it all evening. After I'd gone to bed, he'd come into our room simply to wake me up, get his rocks off and then leave immediately to finish that bottle. Night after night this was my life.

I don't know why I didn't leave then. His sons had moved back in with their mom, as he was just not someone they wanted to be around, they also had more freedom at their moms. So I no longer had them keeping me there. But instead, I took up receiving and giving attention to a man I would see from time to time at my place of work. Worst decision I ever made, maybe apart from my marriage being #1.. I know this brands me immediately for most, I take that like it is. Anyhow, after about 3 months my husband caught on and found a note this other man had written to me. I came home after a late call out (I was a volunteer medic) to him seething, drunk with a gun in his back pocket and holding that letter.

It was a nightmare, him threatening to kill himself, to kill the other man. He had every right to be mad, I just couldn't stand being alone emotionally anymore and I sought that connection with this other man. I was sorry for it before I even got caught and then of course REALLY sorry once all was out in the open. Not because I was caught but because I knew it would hurt my husband. I should have left my marriage before doing what I did, but I young and stupid. So for months this went on, no more with the gun and threats of harm, but yelling at me, barricading me in rooms so I couldn't get away from him, not going anywhere for fear of coming back to him being crazy. I mean I understood why he was enraged and didn't trust me and I deserve all that, but the pushing me and blocking me into closets to continue his screaming and such. It was really scary and I couldn't get out of it in the moments. He would just intimidate me at any cost. 

He continued to drink, but said he'd start therapy. He was going and one day he said the therapist wanted to talk to me. I was shocked to find he was speaking with a female therapist as he's very sour about women in general usually. Once there, she informed me my husband had brought her up to speed on everything I'd been 'up' to. I was floored. I expected him to share about my infidelity however, none of the verbal assaulting had been shared or the physical things he'd been doing to keep me in our bedroom or blocking me in bathrooms/closets, ect. had been shared conveniently. When I spoke about this, she literally told me I should expect him to be this way and it's because of my affair and something I have to deal with. I don't even know how to explain how this made me feel but in that moment, I knew, my husband hearing her say what he was doing was okay, was only going to fuel his fire and he loved every moment of it. He'd set me up for this very thing and this therapist couldn't see past the manipulation he was doing.

There after he said he'd stop drinking and even attended a few AA meetings, bringing back a little disc * day 1, 1 month sober,ect.. But he wasn't sober, he was still drinking. The intense rage never let up for long, a few days maybe and for the next four months or so he would come to my work to check on me. Some days this other mans company truck would be up there, or it was his partner up there maybe working on something as they contracted at the hospital where I worked. I never saw him after that night this all came out anymore but that didn't matter because there was no trust. But my husband would come to my work and if he saw one of those trucks there he'd start calling or worse, walk into the hospital and start getting loud in my office. I finally had to quit my job to make it stop. I started cleaning houses after that to make ends meet. 

One weekend about 8 months later his middle son and girlfriend came to visit for the weekend. I was up making breakfast waiting for everyone to get up as I had a cleaning job that morning to be at and wouldn't be able to hang out in the morning long. My husband came into the kitchen and just started berating me out of no where, that I wasn't going to work, that I was meeting up with this other man. It really was overwhelming, I thought we were past (well not past it all) but really had no idea what may have triggered him to be feeling this way just straight from getting out of bed. His son didn't know about all we were going through and I was asking him to please quiet down and he just got louder saying "Oh you don't want everyone to know you were whoring around?!" I had to get to my cleaning job and just left before his son got up hoping they didn't hear everything. I was in tears and just torn apart. That morning I cleaned this couples home for the last time. I explained to them I was in a situation with my husband where I couldn't stay any longer, I needed to drive straight from their house to my family 10 hours away and that's just what I did.

My entire family already knew what was going on. My husband had called my mom at some point and started in and then left it to me to tell the rest. So I did. I spilled it all. I think he wanted them to hate me, and while of course they were disappointed in me, it didn't have quite the affect he'd hoped. So I called my mom and my aunt and explained what I'd been dealing with (they didn't know about me quitting my job, about the verbal abuse I was enduring or the other things) and they took me in for bit. By the evening he was calling and I didn't even answer my phone, I couldn't. He called my mom and she told him I was on the way back to them and he was livid of course. In his mind they were harboring a fugitive. 

After about two weeks I went back. Returned with the promise of AA, no more drinking and a new therapist who specialized in alcoholism. This therapist was great, he was able to see through my husbands BS, and while he didn't of course condone my affair, was able to get my husband on track with either "You either can't move on from the mistake she made, you don't want to, whatever it is and you need to make plans to separate, or you love her enough to forgive, maybe not forget.. but move forward without the continued hostility." You only have two options. And to be he reminded me that I don't need to continue to put up with what my husband was doing. "You've beat yourself up long enough, and he certainly has beat you up emotionally enough that you too, don't have to continued to take what he is dishing out. You're sorry, you can't go back and change it and you're not doing it anymore. So you have options too." And my husband of course didn't like either of those things he said to him or to me. 

Eventually we moved to another state, his drinking was less but he never stopped. Since we were 5 states away from where the affair occurred that finally slowed down to a trickle, but every now and then he'd bring it up and throw it at me. I just let him, it was usually when he was drunk. I found out he too had been speaking to other women he used to date when he was in high school. But that was okay because it was just talking (and pictures) but nothing physical. I didn't even care anymore. They eventually lost interest in him or he them and then he work kept him busy. I know he's not innocent, but I did my time and things got better. Now and again his ugly would come out, but it was few and far between. Then his youngest son from his second marriage died. He was just a teen, being a teen and paid the ultimate price for being young and acting dumb. You can imagine this sent him into a tailspin and the drinking really took over again.

At this point, I didn't try to intervene, there was no sense. He had so many friends enabling his drinking, they weren't thinking about the rest of us, just him. Which is his mindset. Me, me, me. So while we both worked, I would come home and do everything just as I always did, and he would sit and drink. Come to bed long enough to tap it and then leave right away to go back and drink. He started talking about having a child with me and I thought he was crazy. He'd talked for years about us having a child together but I was content to be step mom and take care of what he had. Plus I never wanted to bring a baby into the mix with our history and his drinking. But after his son died something changed. I told him I would consider it, but he would truly need to get help for his addiction. He agreed and wasn't drinking and going to therapy, it was good. But it didn't last and by that time I was pregnant.

I remember being exhausted and finally having the balls to ask him to help me out around the house. He proceeded to tell me the following, "This isn't a partnership. I'm not a damn women and if you wanted a woman then you should have married one." Being pregnant my emotions on this one really got to me. Years later it still hurts thinking about it and he says he doesn't remember saying it. He was drunk when he said it so maybe not, but he seemed a little embarrassed. But even now he isn't embarrassed enough to actually help out around the house. But two weeks ago, he again told me he wasn't made to scrub floors or wash dishes. That him and I aren't equal. He is the breadwinner, yet he is also the major spender in our marriage. So I too have to work to support all his little projects he likes to work on. He's better than me because he makes more money. 👏 I guess I'm naïve or was just too dumb to ever realize how mysogonystic he really is. He never helped me with our son after he was born. For one week he got up long enough to get him out of his crib and put him down because my back was out. But that was merely to hand him off to me only. The resentment I feel has not been something I throw in his face, I'm not a fighting wife or passive aggressive, I just shut down. So while I don't dread it up, I feel it every day and have not been able to let go it. And I know that in itself is destructive.

But I can't take it anymore. I've done nothing but give, give and give some more, thinking I could make up for my mistake, thinking it would make him love me, and I don't even know what else. Last fall two days before our anniversary he had me answer an email for him and up popped his messenger with a female pic. I didn't think anything of it, swiped it away and finished the email he was dictating to me while his best friend I'd flown in for his birthday played in the pool with our son. I joking handed his phone back to him and said "Oh your GF messaged you by the way on messenger." He got extremely flustered and was like no one messaged me, and just started acting stupid and I was like here I'll show you and I took his phone and opened it up and there it was, talking about her ass in high school and asking her for pics because it was his birthday and her asking what she was going to get in return. 

I just couldn't believe it really, I was just joking when I said what I did and after everything I've done to right this terrible atrocity of wrong doing to and innocent man?? Honest to God, I don't know what else I can do to make this man happy. He has a spouse (with the exception of the affair I had ten pus years ago) at his beck and call, sex on demand, however you want it for that matter, built in maid, babysitter, financial planner, cook, secretary, ect. Most men would be begging for and then this. Like when is the playing field evened up? Were you getting back at me for the affair when you were talking to your ex 5 years ago? Were you still getting back at me when you left the hospital the night I had our son to drink and watch porn and is this also payback for my onetime affair? How much more do I need to go through?

After that, my emotion for him, it just died. I've been living like this for a year and it's taking it's toll. He finally realized I guess two weeks ago when he asked me what was wrong with me. I'm just done being taken advantage of. I've tried for months to talk about how I was feeling, but he always just shut me down. I understand he doesn't want to talk about what he was doing last year, I get it. He made me though, rather he didn't let me talk but just expected me to take the lashing I was getting over and over and I did like a champ and you can't have one heartfelt conversation with me? It just killed everything I thought I knew about this man. He isn't a bad man, selfish yes, he would do anything for a friend or college, he's dedicated to his work, but he just can't put 1/8 of the effort into his marriages. I should have seen that knowing he'd been divorced twice before me. But hell, I was barely an adult, I didn't know any better.

So here I am, doing everything I was doing before, being the good and dutiful wife. Am I miserable, yes. I don't have the financial means to live on my own. I don't want to destroy my child. I'm not that selfish. He asks me what I want to do and I don't have an answer. I finally told him last night, I'm doing everything I'm supposed to be doing. "Oh I'm not complaining, but for you to be happy maybe therapy?" I'm not against therapy but that's not going to fix my unhappiness. As long as my unhappiness isn't affecting you negatively then why does it matter. It never mattered before to you. He still has clothes everyday, gets sex when he wants it, even though it's just me there until he's done, he's just fine with that. I can be robot, I have been for years. 

Bring on the criticisms, I know I need to hear it. I'm not even sure what I'm looking for here. Maybe to vent, maybe a little validation because my feelings have only ever been invalidated? I don't know.


----------



## Mr.Married

.


----------



## Pip’sJourney

Get out.. this is a bad situation. He is an alcoholic and will never change. You had a job as a Medic so go back to that and get another job. This is completely unhealthy and you deserve better.


----------



## Al_Bundy

Is this how you want your child raised? If not then you need to change it. You said you were a medic so it's not like you don't have any skills.


----------



## Diana7

It sounds like a very unhappy marriage to me. It's hard to see how either of you can be at all happy. Do you want this to continue?


----------



## Bulfrog1987

Al_Bundy said:


> Is this how you want your child raised? If not then you need to change it. You said you were a medic so it's not like you don't have any skills.


I was a medic, I have to go back to school. I'm no longer national registered.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

Diana7 said:


> It sounds like a very unhappy marriage to me. It's hard to see how either of you can be at all happy. Do you want this to continue?


He's happy. As long as his needs are met, he believes everything is fine.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

Bulfrog1987 said:


> He's happy. As long as his needs are met, he believes everything is fine.


Let me rephrase, maybe he's not happy. He's not unhappy though, he's complacent. And he is perfectly comfortable with complacency.


----------



## Al_Bundy

Bulfrog1987 said:


> I was a medic, I have to go back to school. I'm no longer national registered.


If that would help you support you and your child then go for it. You're 34, you're going to look up and be 44 in the same situation if you don't act. 

I know you said something about therapy won't fix your unhappiness. If you do leave and want to have a healthy relationship in the future you will need therapy to figure out why you stayed in relationship like this. Otherwise the next guy is going to be just like him.


----------



## SunCMars

I get it.
Leave him, divorce him.

I agree, finish up your schooling for that EMT job. These jobs are in demand, nation wise.
If possible, stay at your parents while you finish up your degree.

You may consider joining the Army National Guard.
They will pay for your schooling and you can be a medic in the Guard.
There is an age cut off, so, don't dally.

If you put in 20 years you will get a lifetime pension and health benefits.
That is rare offering in today's America.


_Are Dee-_


----------



## Deejo

Come up with a plan. And execute the plan. 

You don't have the resources to cut it on your own now? Change that. While you still have the security of the marriage.

You have friends or family that can assist?

I'm left with the impression that this isn't about helping you arrive at a decision. I suspect you are already there. The problem is that you don't have the means to follow through on the decision. Is that the case?


----------



## Deejo

Come up with a plan. And execute the plan. 

You don't have the resources to cut it on your own now? Change that. While you still have the security of the marriage.

You have friends or family that can assist?

I'm left with the impression that this isn't about helping you arrive at a decision. I suspect you are already there. The problem is that you don't have the means to follow through on the decision. Is that the case?


----------



## Laurentium

Yeah, you made several serious mistakes. Marrying him in the first place, for one, and more seriously, getting pregnant by him when he was an unrecovered alcoholic who talked about shooting people. 


Bulfrog1987 said:


> I'm not even sure what I'm looking for here. Maybe to vent, maybe a little validation because my feelings have only ever been invalidated?


You didn't say very much about your feelings.


----------



## Laurentium

Al_Bundy said:


> I know you said something about therapy won't fix your unhappiness. If you do leave and want to have a healthy relationship in the future you will need therapy to figure out why you stayed in relationship like this. Otherwise the next guy is going to be just like him.


Yes, this.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

Deejo said:


> Come up with a plan. And execute the plan.
> 
> You don't have the resources to cut it on your own now? Change that. While you still have the security of the marriage.
> 
> You have friends or family that can assist?
> 
> I'm left with the impression that this isn't about helping you arrive at a decision. I suspect you are already there. The problem is that you don't have the means to follow through on the decision. Is that the case?


I don't have family anywhere near me. I can't move back home because there is no room. Yes I want out, but I don't know how to execute it.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

Deejo said:


> Come up with a plan. And execute the plan.
> 
> You don't have the resources to cut it on your own now? Change that. While you still have the security of the marriage.
> 
> You have friends or family that can assist?
> 
> I'm left with the impression that this isn't about helping you arrive at a decision. I suspect you are already there. The problem is that you don't have the means to follow through on the decision. Is that the case?


I don't have the means no. I don't have any family close to me, 10 hours away. We've been here about 2 years, I have friends but not friends that can help with my son. I do work so I've started saving what I can in the event the time to leave does arrive. I'm not in physical danger.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

Laurentium said:


> Yeah, you made several serious mistakes. Marrying him in the first place, for one, and more seriously, getting pregnant by him when he was an unrecovered alcoholic who talked about shooting people.
> 
> You didn't say very much about your feelings.





Laurentium said:


> Yeah, you made several serious mistakes. Marrying him in the first place, for one, and more seriously, getting pregnant by him when he was an unrecovered alcoholic who talked about shooting people.
> 
> You didn't say very much about your feelings.


He said 10 years ago the night he found out about the affair. That's not ever happened again. Not that's its a good excuse for even doing it that one time. Recovery in an alcoholic is never ending. At least in his case.


----------



## Laurentium

Bulfrog1987 said:


> He said 10 years ago the night he found out about the affair. That's not ever happened again. Not that's its a good excuse for even doing it that one time. Recovery in an alcoholic is never ending.


Yeah, I understand and agree on both of those points.


----------



## Sfort

Bulfrog1987 said:


> He isn't a bad man


Yes, he is. Get away while you still have some life to live.


----------



## Trident

To use a metaphor, your marriage died when you had the affair. It's been purgatory ever since.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

Trident said:


> To use a metaphor, your marriage died when you had the affair. It's been purgatory ever since.


This is fairly accurate.


----------



## lifeistooshort

You know what OP? You think the age difference isn't an issue but you're wrong. You imagine that you're mature and that's all there is to it but there are other issues whatever maturity you have won't compensate for.

I know because my ex was 19 years older. I met him whevi was 31 and he was 50, so I was much further along in life then you.

First of all, a 20 year old can be mature compared to other 20 year olds but you still only have the life experience of a 20 year old, and a lot of maturity comes from life experience. Were you really as mature then are you are now? I hope not because that means you haven't grown.

Second, why do you think a 44 year old man would sniff out and marry a 20 year old? There is an emotional power imbalance due to the difference in life experience that makes young women good targets because they put up with a lot more then a woman his own age. Look at what you've already put up with, and on top of that you brought a kid into this.

I finally left my ex a few years ago at 44 and should've left him a lot sooner. And my ex wasn't an abusive drunk...we had other issues. But he definitely sniffs out much younger women because they put up with his nasty crap.

Do yourself a favor and go home to your family. Ad long as your hb is a drunk he's going to be dangerous. Don't start with affairs...that's trashy...but don't let anyone shift all of the focus to your affair either. You have much bigger issues in the form of a predatory, abusive drunk who is both selfish and dangerous. A older woman is much lesser likely to put up with this..


----------



## Bulfrog1987

lifeistooshort said:


> You know what OP? You think the age difference isn't an issue but you're wrong. You imagine that you're mature and that's all there is to it but there are other issues whatever maturity you have won't compensate for.
> 
> I know because my ex was 19 years older. I met him whevi was 31 and he was 50, so I was much further along in life then you.
> 
> First of all, a 20 year old can be mature compared to other 20 year olds but you still only have the life experience of a 20 year old, and a lot of maturity comes from life experience. Were you really as mature then are you are now? I hope not because that means you haven't grown.
> 
> Second, why do you think a 44 year old man would sniff out and marry a 20 year old? There is an emotional power imbalance due to the difference in life experience that makes young women good targets because they put up with a lot more then a woman his own age. Look at what you've already put up with, and on top of that you brought a kid into this.
> 
> I finally left my ex a few years ago at 44 and should've left him a lot sooner. And my ex wasn't an abusive drunk...we had other issues. But he definitely sniffs out much younger women because they put up with his nasty crap.
> 
> Do yourself a favor and go home to your family. Ad long as your hb is a drunk he's going to be dangerous. Don't start with affairs...that's trashy...but don't let anyone shift all of the focus to your affair either. You have much bigger issues in the form of a predatory, abusive drunk who is both selfish and dangerous. A older woman is much lesser likely to put up with this..



Oh I'm not saying he wasn't predatory and didn't take advantage back then. And yes I've grown. There isn't an emotional power balance now.. There is no emotional balance at all in this man that is logical or meaningful. Yes, I've brought a child into the world under this, I also can't change that so thank you for pointing it out. I can however change the scenery for my child and intend on doing so.

There are many points I agree with here and appreciate you're insight.


----------



## lifeistooshort

Bulfrog1987 said:


> Oh I'm not saying he wasn't predatory and didn't take advantage back then. And yes I've grown. There isn't an emotional power balance now.. There is no emotional balance at all in this man that is logical or meaningful. Yes, I've brought a child into the world under this, I also can't change that so thank you for pointing it out. I can however change the scenery for my child and intend on doing so.
> 
> There are many points I agree with here and appreciate you're insight.


My kid comment wasn't meant to suggest you could change it or that you should want to. Kids are great and I'm happy you get to have that...I have 2 now grown sons whose father was also a drunk, albeit my age, so I even understand that part. A big reason I married the older guy was because I was damaged from my marriage to my kids father. Fortunately he has since quit drinking and we have an amicable relationship now.

I'm not surprised that your hb's emotional advantage is shrinking. It was the same with my ex...he was quite emotionally stunted so as I got older whatever advantage he had disappeared just like your situation. Our situations have much in common. My ex had the emotional development of a 12 year old and couldn't talk about anything beyond sports and the weather, and 44 year old me just had enough.

I hope you find it in you to get rid of this guy. I'm much happier without my ex...I have a lovely bf much closer to my age and it's fantastic. Go home to your family and focus on becoming self sufficient. I built my career and now make 6 figures, but I didn't come to this field until I was 37 so you can do it too. I wasn't going to take care of an old guy who treated me like ****.


----------



## D0nnivain

You need to get out & you know that but you are not strong enough to. Try going to some Al-Anon meetings. It's a support group for people who love alcoholics. There you should find the support you need to get away from this gun wielding depressed lunatic you call a husband.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

I no longer respect my husband because he feels helping out or doing any home chores makes him 'the woman' in a marriage and he literally told me he wasn't built to scrub floors or wash dishes. After he actually said that out loud, any remote ounce of respect I had for him vanished.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

sokillme said:


> be emotionally strong enough to show your soft side to your wife. Not be emotional but show your feelings.


This right here is what I'm talking about! There's nothing that gains my respect and admiration for a man than this.


----------



## sokillme

Bulfrog1987 said:


> I no longer respect my husband because he feels helping out or doing any home chores makes him 'the woman' in a marriage and he literally told me he wasn't built to scrub floors or wash dishes. After he actually said that out loud, any remote ounce of respect I had for him vanished.


Did you marry Fred Flintstone?


----------



## sokillme

Bulfrog1987 said:


> This right here is what I'm talking about! There's nothing that gains my respect and admiration for a man than this.


I think context is important in that quote, for instances it's OK and healthy to be emotional in reasonable circumstances such as death or whatever. I don't want to make it seem like I am advocating for men to act like Vulcans. If anything that has gotten us into problems too. We all should strive for emotional intellegence.


----------



## oldshirt

Bulfrog1987 said:


> I no longer respect my husband because he feels helping out or doing any home chores makes him 'the woman' in a marriage and he literally told me he wasn't built to scrub floors or wash dishes. After he actually said that out loud, any remote ounce of respect I had for him vanished.


The devil is in the details and a matter of context here. If all he does is sit around drinking beer and playing video games and doesn't lift a finger to provide for or take care of the family home, then I understand your grievance.

But does he do other things to provide for the support, safety and functioning of the house and home besides scrubbing floors and washing dishes? Does he climb up ladders to work on the roof and gutters? Does he do maintenance and repairs on the lawn mower and take care of the lawn? Does he patch holes in the concrete in the driveway? Does he unclog the toilet when you drop a big bomb that gets stuck? Does he keep the cars in running order? Does he work 2 or 3 jobs to pay for everything? 

If we are going to judge men by how much they scrub the floor and make them shine, we're probably setting ourselves up for disappointment. Not to be sexist but most men simply have a different scale of what constitutes a thorough scrubbing and how clean is clean. 

I've tried to scrub the floors and thought if I could do that it would take some of the stress and pressure off of her, but no matter what I do or how much elbow grease I put into it, she would just come along right behind me and do it anyway and say that I didn't do it right. (sigh ) So in that sense, I guess I am not "built" for scrubbing floors either.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

@oldshirt 

So to be more clear, I have NEVER asked him to do either of those things, that's him pulling that out of what I'm trying to describe as my own needs for more of a connection and knowing that he appreciates me. I needed him, these last three years to get up with our son once in a while during the night, maybe cook a meal once month, offer to out our son to bed once in a while so I can go to bed when I'm exhausted. Now, our child doesn't want him to do anything for him, because 'that's momma's job.' It's freaking sad, and he's mad at me. Oh yes, I tell my son, "Now make sure when dad comes to help you, even though you're calling for me that you freak out." Like I need that on my plate too. No, this is just the circumstances of you avoiding being involved. 

Yes he can do all the things you described above. And because he has those abilities, that's the only contribution he will provide when needed. They are important things too to a household but not all a healthy household runs on. I too, have worked on our home, removing drywall, patching drywall and painting, even putting a floor down myself in my office. I cut the grass, he does not, though he would if I let it grow tall enough. I also can and do fix plumbing because I've been put in a position where I had to do it. So I'm not down playing those important contributions of a talented male, it's just there are other desires and needs I have other than simply having a 'manly' man, who won't attempt to connect with our family on any other level.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

EleGirl said:


> Did you tell him what your reaction to this is?


I've not told him in the literally words no. We are just going about our day to day. He loves to pretend everything is fine, would rather put his head in the sand than give anymore attention to it. 


The day he said that to me, we were sitting outside and it just took me back to when he made it point to tell me how we are not partners and I should have married a woman if that's what I wanted. I didn't speak a word from that point on. It was just the seal to the envelope of knowing what I need to do next. We are finished. Well, I am finished.


----------



## EleGirl

Bulfrog1987 said:


> @oldshirt
> 
> So to be more clear, I have NEVER asked him to do either of those things, that's him pulling that out of what I'm trying to describe as my own needs for more of a connection and knowing that he appreciates me. I needed him, these last three years to get up with our son once in a while during the night, maybe cook a meal once month, offer to out our son to bed once in a while so I can go to bed when I'm exhausted. Now, our child doesn't want him to do anything for him, because 'that's momma's job.' It's freaking sad, and he's mad at me. Oh yes, I tell my son, "Now make sure when dad comes to help you, even though you're calling for me that you freak out." Like I need that on my plate too. No, this is just the circumstances of you avoiding being involved.
> 
> Yes he can do all the things you described above. And because he has those abilities, that's the only contribution he will provide when needed. They are important things too to a household but not all a healthy household runs on. I too, have worked on our home, removing drywall, patching drywall and painting, even putting a floor down myself in my office. I cut the grass, he does not, though he would if I let it grow tall enough. I also can and do fix plumbing because I've been put in a position where I had to do it. So I'm not down playing those important contributions of a talented male, it's just there are other desires and needs I have other than simply having a 'manly' man, who won't attempt to connect with our family on any other level.


I would like to move (or copy) some of your posts on this thread to that thread you already have. They give valuable info to help us all know what you are going through. Are you ok with that?

You work outside the home as well, right?

When I asked my son's father to share in the housework with me, specifically clean toilets, he told me with indignation that he does not do toilets. So I replied to him that we have a problem because I don't do them either. And then I hired someone to do the house cleaning. If he's too good to clean a toilet, so am I. And for the records, yea, we both had full time jobs.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

EleGirl said:


> I would like to move (or copy) some of your posts on this thread to that thread you already have. They give valuable info to help us all know what you are going through. Are you ok with that?
> 
> You work outside the home as well, right?
> 
> When I asked my son's father to share in the housework with me, specifically clean toilets, he told me with indignation that he does not do toilets. So I replied to him that we have a problem because I don't do them either. And then I hired someone to do the house cleaning. If he's too good to clean a toilet, so am I. And for the records, yea, we both had full time jobs.


That is fine. There's so much that's gone on and going on that should probably just not even respond to others on their posts. I mean well, but I have my own thoughts based on what I'm going through that just may not actually be helpful? _sigh_ I don't want to push my biases' on anyone else. 

Yes I work for a call center (cloud based) from home and then am the director of a two day a week mother's day out program as well. You do make a good point though and in his defense, I actually do remember him telling me to hire someone, I never did because I could do it all, I just never understood why he wouldn't help. Plus we didn't have the money for it really.


----------



## oldshirt

Bulfrog1987 said:


> @oldshirt
> 
> So to be more clear, I have NEVER asked him to do either of those things, that's him pulling that out of what I'm trying to describe as my own needs for more of a connection and knowing that he appreciates me. I needed him, these last three years to get up with our son once in a while during the night, maybe cook a meal once month, offer to out our son to bed once in a while so I can go to bed when I'm exhausted. Now, our child doesn't want him to do anything for him, because 'that's momma's job.' It's freaking sad, and he's mad at me. Oh yes, I tell my son, "Now make sure when dad comes to help you, even though you're calling for me that you freak out." Like I need that on my plate too. No, this is just the circumstances of you avoiding being involved.
> 
> Yes he can do all the things you described above. And because he has those abilities, that's the only contribution he will provide when needed. They are important things too to a household but not all a healthy household runs on. I too, have worked on our home, removing drywall, patching drywall and painting, even putting a floor down myself in my office. I cut the grass, he does not, though he would if I let it grow tall enough. I also can and do fix plumbing because I've been put in a position where I had to do it. So I'm not down playing those important contributions of a talented male, it's just there are other desires and needs I have other than simply having a 'manly' man, who won't attempt to connect with our family on any other level.



I read your other thread. IMHO it's basically time to stick a fork in it. I think you've been used and played. 
You thought he was a charming mature and developed man and were probably flattered that he was giving you time and attention. 

But as was alluded in your other thread, it was all more dark and predatory. 

When a 44 year old man is wining and dining a 20 year old woman, it's easy for the 20 year old to think that the reason she is getting his attention and courting is because she is skinnier and prettier and sweeter than those jaded and nasty 30something and 40something year old women with their muffin tops and cellulite. 

But real reason is the mature women with the life experience and wisdom can see what duds and losers and dysfunctional protoplasm they really are and so they won't touch them with a ten foot pole. 

Yes the 20 year olds are skinnier and prettier but what is more important to guys like this is they are naive and more easily manipulated and used. They lack the life experience and wisdom to smell the rat and know whats really going on. 

They think they have won the prince, but what they have really gotten is the village drunk and village sheister dressed up in the prince's old clothes from the castle's thrift shop. 

Now you are the jaded 30something with the stretchmarks and the lines on your face from gritting your teeth and having a permanent scowl. 

But you can also see him for the dud and failure that he really is. Now you can smell the rat and can spot the predator a mile away. Now you will know which men are to be avoided at all costs. And now you can warn the young 20somethings that the grown men sniffing around them taking them to fancy restaurants and trendy clubs in nice cars aren't exercising their ability to get the prettier and skinnier girls because they are such a fine catch..... but rather because experienced and mature women can see through their bullshyt. 

They won't listen to you of course because now they'll be the ones thinking you are the bitter and jaded one. But they'll learn. Just as you have.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

oldshirt said:


> I read your other thread. IMHO it's basically time to stick a fork in it. I think you've been used and played.
> You thought he was a charming mature and developed man and were probably flattered that he was giving you time and attention.
> 
> But as was alluded in your other thread, it was all more dark and predatory.
> 
> When a 44 year old man is wining and dining a 20 year old woman, it's easy for the 20 year old to think that the reason she is getting his attention and courting is because she is skinnier and prettier and sweeter than those jaded and nasty 30something and 40something year old women with their muffin tops and cellulite.
> 
> But real reason is the mature women with the life experience and wisdom can see what duds and losers and dysfunctional protoplasm they really are and so they won't touch them with a ten foot pole.
> 
> Yes the 20 year olds are skinnier and prettier but what is more important to guys like this is they are naive and more easily manipulated and used. They lack the life experience and wisdom to smell the rat and know whats really going on.
> 
> They think they have won the prince, but what they have really gotten is the village drunk and village sheister dressed up in the prince's old clothes from the castle's thrift shop.
> 
> Now you are the jaded 30something with the stretchmarks and the lines on your face from gritting your teeth and having a permanent scowl.
> 
> But you can also see him for the dud and failure that he really is. Now you can smell the rat and can spot the predator a mile away. Now you will know which men are to be avoided at all costs. And now you can warn the young 20somethings that the grown men sniffing around them taking them to fancy restaurants and trendy clubs in nice cars aren't exercising their ability to get the prettier and skinnier girls because they are such a fine catch..... but rather because experienced and mature women can see through their bullshyt.
> 
> They won't listen to you of course because now they'll be the ones thinking you are the bitter and jaded one. But they'll learn. Just as you have.



95% of this is true, however I don't have frown lines or a permanent scowl. I had cellulite and was chubby way back when and still weigh the same I did 15 years ago. Thankful for that lol. I do now also have a few stretch marks from my son, but I can live with that! I'm not all used up so I got that going for me haha.


----------



## oldshirt

Bulfrog1987 said:


> 95% of this is true, however I don't have frown lines or a permanent scowl. I had cellulite and was chubby way back when and still weigh the same I did 15 years ago. Thankful for that lol. I do now also have a few stretch marks from my son, but I can live with that! I'm not all used up so I got that going for me haha.


I am sure you are a hottie. My point is not to imply that you are at all unattractive but rather to point out that you are now the woman that your 20 year old self thought was was all jaded and bi+chy and overweight etc and why that successful and charming 30/40 something man with the Lexus was picking her instead of the women closer to his age. 

Now that you have the life experience and the wisdom and knowledge, you can see the truth. Your 20 year old self didn't.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

oldshirt said:


> I am sure you are a hottie. My point is not to imply that you are at all unattractive but rather to point out that you are now the woman that your 20 year old self thought was was all jaded and bi+chy and overweight etc and why that successful and charming 30/40 something man with the Lexus was picking her instead of the women closer to his age.
> 
> Now that you have the life experience and the wisdom and knowledge, you can see the truth. Your 20 year old self didn't.


Oh yes. I'm fully on board with what you were trying to portray. He also was also bankrupt when I met him, so no Lexus or fine dining there, I genuinely loved him. But moving on from the shallow, I'm definitely aware of what I wasn't then. You have hit the nail on the head.


----------



## DownByTheRiver

Bulfrog1987 said:


> I no longer respect my husband because he feels helping out or doing any home chores makes him 'the woman' in a marriage and he literally told me he wasn't built to scrub floors or wash dishes. After he actually said that out loud, any remote ounce of respect I had for him vanished.


Yeah, because look what that means he thinks of you -- in his eyes, you are lowly and so are other women. He thinks he's superior. Not uncommon, but tragically ignorant.


----------



## DownByTheRiver

Bulfrog1987 said:


> That is fine. There's so much that's gone on and going on that should probably just not even respond to others on their posts. I mean well, but I have my own thoughts based on what I'm going through that just may not actually be helpful? _sigh_ I don't want to push my biases' on anyone else.
> 
> Yes I work for a call center (cloud based) from home and then am the director of a two day a week mother's day out program as well. You do make a good point though and in his defense, I actually do remember him telling me to hire someone, I never did because I could do it all, I just never understood why he wouldn't help. Plus we didn't have the money for it really.


Well, it's good he's down for hiring someone, but it doesn't diminish his crap attitude thinking he's better than women and above doing things they do routinely. Once you leave him, he will try to find a new maid and cook and babysitter but if not, he can hire his own housekeeper.


----------



## DownByTheRiver

Bulfrog1987 said:


> 95% of this is true, however I don't have frown lines or a permanent scowl. I had cellulite and was chubby way back when and still weigh the same I did 15 years ago. Thankful for that lol. I do now also have a few stretch marks from my son, but I can live with that! I'm not all used up so I got that going for me haha.


Well, there's nothing that says you have to go right out and get married again.


----------



## Bulfrog1987

DownByTheRiver said:


> Well, there's nothing that says you have to go right out and get married again.


No plans on it. I'm perfectly content to be alone


----------



## Bulfrog1987

DownByTheRiver said:


> Well, it's good he's down for hiring someone, but it doesn't diminish his crap attitude thinking he's better than women and above doing things they do routinely. Once you leave him, he will try to find a new maid and cook and babysitter but if not, he can hire his own housekeeper.


Yeah, he'll try. Doesn't bother me in the least.


----------



## DownByTheRiver

Bulfrog1987 said:


> Yeah, he'll try. Doesn't bother me in the least.


Well, when you leave someone, that's the goal, to just stop caring what they do. Takes a strong confident person to pull it off. And of course if there's kids, you can't just shut it down.


----------



## JTK-NCC1701




----------

