# Feeling Crazy! What has my life come to!



## feeling_crazy

Hello everyone – I’ve been to the site before although it’s been a long while I need to come back for support. I’m going to try and make this as short as possible. Now that I’m thinking, I don’t think that’s possible so please bear with me. There is so much to tell and I’m really looking forward to your input and support. 
I just recently broke up with my live in boyfriend of 5 years and I’m having the hardest time with my decision. I’m questioning if it was the right thing because I truly do love him immensely. Our relationship has been very dysfunctional and toxic though. 

I’m soon to be 39 years old, am attractive, have a great job and am a single mom to a beautiful 19 year old daughter in college. He is the father of two young girls and has a decent job. When I met him he was just getting out of a bad marriage. They were together for six years. Have two children together and she cheated on him and left her for another man. He was traumatized. They stayed living together for the last two years for the sake of the kids but she was with the other man the entire time. One day he lost it and wound up physically assaulting her. She had him arrested, got a restraining order and that was that.
Him and I started dating six months after she finally got him out and he moved in about 3 months later. Things happened very quickly. He charmed the heck out of me and I fell head over heels and took a leap of faith although they weren’t officially divorced. They did officially get divorced three years into our relationship because she did it and she is recently remarried to a man who is 25 years older than her. He told me that prior to getting married that he always cheated but he changed when he got married and she wound up cheating on him. Should have walked away then.

Before he met me he was dating another woman in whom he started dating as soon as he moved out from his home with his wife. He left her for me when he met me. I know a girl who knows her and according to her she didn’t take it well. Anyway…

So, during our relationship, as I mentioned before he was the most charming man I ever met. He treated me like I’ve never been treated and I was convinced that he was the one for me. He talked marriage and we started living together playing the married couple right away. I fell in love with his daughters and him. At the beginning of the relationship I was all about it but after a while when I saw that he wasn’t proposing, etc. I started to get frustrated. Because I wanted the commitment if I was going to play the role. I let it go thinking that eventually he’d propose but in the meantime, I started to not be as excited about playing step mom, etc. and I let it be known to him. 

Our places have all been in my name and his credit is shot. He pitched in for bills, etc. but has always been financially irresponsible. He couldn’t even have a normal conversation about finances without flipping out so after awhile I felt like he was using me to play wife and for a place for his kids to stay.

That wasn’t the only problem though. There’s more. About six months into us living together I found a note in his truck from another girl. Just saying how she thought he was awesome and she wanted to see him again. He said that it was a note from before me so I said ok, that could be true. Well, I have been cheated on the past so that put me in scared mode and I decided to check our cell phone records because we had a mutual account in my name. I found that he texted and called the girl he left for me a few times. When I called her she said that she didn’t know or text him. When I confronted him though he said it was his boss’s wife’s number. So I called her back and she said “why do you keep calling me? He’s my husband’s friend”. So that means that after I confronted him he called her and told her to say that and she listened. So what did that tell me right there? Doesn’t look good, right? Well, he talked his way out of it and I let it go….for the time being. 

One night we were out drinking and I got belligerent drunk and I guess said some things he didn’t like. When we got to our place he back handed me. I fell to the ground and he drug me down the hall to my place. I was traumatized. Didn’t know what just happened or why. He left but I didn’t call the cops. I was so traumatized and scared. He came back the next morning and apologized and for some CRAZY reason forgave him. He hit me so hard that my jaw was messed up and I had to get a tooth removed from the back of my mouth. I should have left then, I know!

After this, of course it got worse. I needed to continuously check cause I didn’t trust at this point. It was hard to leave though cause I loved him. I thought that maybe I was crazy for checking and just needed to trust. Well, my birthday weekend I found that he was texting one of his ex girlfriends from years ago. When I called to confront her I said why are you texting him and she said that is none of your concern. Why was she so defensive? He talked his way out of that one. I couldn’t see what the texts said cause they were all deleted of course. But I did look at online account and they texted a ton for a few days. So what were they talking about? He talked his way out of it. 

At this point I’m an abusive relationship. I got to the point where I thought it was me. I asked myself what if I didn’t check and act crazy? Would he be seeking attention from other women? What if I didn’t complain about playing step mom to his kids without marriage? Would he be treating me this way?

I always tried to talk to him about my insecurities and he would shut me down. Yell and not talk to me. 

One night I was out working as I bartend from time to time and I got a call from my ex boyfriend who is a friend. He knows my boyfriend because they work for the same company. Well, anyway he called my daughter to get my number just to let me know that my boyfriend was at a bar with some other woman. My ex walked in on them having drinks. Now I know my ex wasn’t lying because first of all, why would he call my daughter in the middle of the night to tell me that and 2nd of all he said he saw them at the bar my boyfriend said he was at that night. I knew something was up. Just felt it in my stomach all day. Like something wasn’t right. He said he was with his best friend who he always answers in front of if I call and that day he wasn’t. He would only text and call from the restroom which I thought was fishy. So my ex said that he was there with her and as soon as my boyfriend and her saw him that they left their drinks at the bar and took off. I found out that she was a new woman who transferred to their company. A woman 10 years older than the both of us. My ex described her in detail. Well, I didn’t hear from my boyfriend until he got home at 3:30 in the morning and acted as if nothing was wrong. When I confronted him he lied and said that my ex was lying to get back with me. Guess what? I said, ok, maybe this maybe that. What if this, what if that and like a dumb ass let it go. 

Well, I let it go as much as I could. I still need reassurance after that and wanted to talk things out but of course he would have his temper tantrums and tell me that I was crazy and that nothing happened and there was nothing to talk about. So we’d get into arguments because of my insecurity and at times he was violent when we were drinking.

I told myself when he was violent that it was my fault for getting beligerant drunk and arguing with him. I felt like I provoked him to do it. Especially when he stopped apologizing for it and would tell me that if I didn’t provoke him it wouldn’t happen. So again, abusive relationship.

While we lived together there were other things I noticed. Like when dong laundry, semen stains on his underwear when we weren’t intimate. He would just do fishy things like wash laundry before I got home. One time he came home and it appeared to have red lipstick on the lower part of his front shirt. 
A few months down the road I decided to check the cell phone records and guess what I find? A number that had crazy amounts of texts on a daily basis to this number I’ve never seen. I call it and find out it was that woman that my ex saw him at the bar with. When I confronted her and asked what was going on she was very defensive and said to take it up with him. When I asked him and he couldn’t lie about it anymore he said she was just a friend. Just a friend that I never heard of and someone he texted all day everyd ay until 5:00 when I got home. He talked his way out of it again and of course I felt like it was me. Maybe if I wasn’t so insecure and always questioning him then he wouldn’t look elsewhere. Because it did get to the point where I questioned his every move. I guess I had a good reason to, right?

So he never gave me closure. Didn’t talk about it. Would have hissy fits if I needed reassurance. I figured I deserved that and nothing. If I brought it up he would have rages and broke my bakers rack and a table chair once. Of course I thought well, if I didn’t provoke him right? 

A few months down the road he was out of town and accidentally left his email up. Of course I checked and found an email between him and her. He had reached out to her and she had said “I seem happy now because I’m not so effed up over you like I was before. I can be a great friend if you ever want to let me in”. Well that to me means that something happened between them for her to be messed up over him and if they were friends before why was she saying she could be a good friend now. That she could show him the real her. At this point I lost it. I felt I had all the proof I needed. 

When I called him and asked he hung up on me but texted that it’s not what it looks like. That they were just friends and she was crazy about him. Well, at this point like I said I had enough. I moved out of our home and got a new place. A week later, guess what? I find out that I’m pregnant!!!! Talk about timing, right? Well, I let him back in because I figured that we’d work it out and he did promise me that we’d get married and that things would be different. 

We started to work on things. I had my new place and he stayed in our old house till the lease was to be up. Well, sadly I had a miscarriage. A week later we decided to have drink together after work but he was acting very strange like he was rushed. I said why rushing? Can’t we just spend time? He said that he needed to get home and be alone. I couldn’t understand why because we always spent time together and for some reason out of nowhere. Well, he called me crazy and said that everyone said I was crazy and threw me out of his house. The entire night I was so sad, crying and couldn’t sleep. Had the WorST feeling. Well, that morning I woke up and decided to drive by our old house together. Well, I saw a car in the driveway that wasn’t his so I went inside because the key was left in the door and I saw a bed made on the living room floor, wine glasses, etc. I started walking up the stairs and he was walking down. He said “what the hell are you doing?” I said what are you doing? He kept going down and I went up. Well, guess who was there in the bathroom? His ex that he broke up with before meeting me. Not his ex wife but his ex girlfriend after his wife. I couldn’t believe it. I was frozen in devastation. I started to walk out and asked him what the hell was going on and do you know that he grabbed me by the arm and made ME leave????? 

Afterwards he called and said of course he didn’t touch her and that he made me leave because he was afraid I was going to hurt her and she did nothing wrong. They didn’t do anything. She was at a bar in the area, ran into each other. Lost her keys and needed a place to stay. 

I FORGAVE HIM! At that point I was so afraid of losing him. I don’t know why. I mean, I did move out after the emails to that other woman but we were working things out when I was pregnant and this was ONE WEEK after my miscarriage that I find him the home that we lived together with someone else!
He weaseled his way back into my life a week later by apologizing like crazy and saying he would never hurt me, is going to marry me, etc. Said everything I needed to hear. How dumb was I?

He likes to drink a lot and does cocaine from time to time and smokes marijuana every day. He drowns out his sorrows of his past life of what could have been with his children. He hates that he can’t see them everyday and hates that he feels he failed them. So he does his “extracurriculars” which is bad. He knows I don’t like that either. So I would nag him about that but it was never out of evil or trying to be a mom. I just know that he is a good person who makes bad decisions and has so much potential.

Well, FINALLY yesterday (two years later) after a few temper tantrums (not hitting) and us just not getting along. Him not proposing to me, me constantly whining about the kids and not wanting to be around them anymore, we just stopped getting along. Him not ever talking to me about how I’m feeling, etc. I decided to end it. I changed the locks, took the rest of his belongings out of here. He had hung up on me for no reason and it was the icing on the cake to EVERYTHING I’ve dealt with. 

I’m so sad though and am wondering if this is the right thing. I keep thinking that maybe if I didn’t act like crazy insecure girlfriend and question him and nag and complain all of the time that he would have proposed to me and would maybe talk. 

He always did thoughtful things like would draw me baths, make me dinners, let be who I am as far as being needy and insecure. Would call and check in all of the time. Came home everyday after work, etc. But I wasn’t happy with that. I felt like I needed more. A wedding ring and a commitment, etc. To talk when I was feeling insecure. He wouldn’t do those things though and I’m emotional and like to talk. He’s emotionally shut down and will not talk.

Well yesterday I had it. Told him that he is too stuck in his past to love anyone the right way and that I needed to get away because years of me trying and nothing has changed. That after years no proposal, no opening up to me, being angry, etc. He said he was sorry that he hurt me, will always love me and hopes I can forgive him someday.

Of course I can’t believe that he didn’t fight for me or beg me to stay. After all I’ve done and the good loving woman I’ve been to him? Well, when I called him to make arrangements to get the rest of his things I asked why he seemed so ok with it and he said “there you go, always wanting to hear what you want to hear when you want to hear it”. He said that he said what he had to say yesterday and I didn’t know that the few things he said translated to working things out? Haha…

So after we hung up of course I get the text of I love you, I can change my ways, etc. AFTER I complain that he didn’t fight for me. I told him that we needed this time apart and until he showed me that he has changed he can’t come back here.

So he hasn’t called or texted like he normally does. I feel like he’s ok with letting me go and it’s killing me. Or he thinks I’m bluffing because I’ve fake broken up with him before. I’ve never taken it to this extreme of changing the locks and moving all of his belonging to a storage unit.

I feel like this is my fault and if I would have just been happy, not nag and trust and not be crazy girl who checked or need to “talk” all of the time and not needed reassurance and just been confident and secure that I would have gotten him to be better and open up more. 

Did I drive him away with my craziness? Or did he make me crazy and I’m thinking he’ll change, etc. If I change will he change?

Why isn’t he begging me and fighting for me? Or should I even care?

I apologize for the LONG thread but I really need some input and advice as I’m so torn. I wanted to get all of it out (and I think I’m leaving some out) so you can give me the best advice possible. I feel like I’ve been abused to the point of believing that it is me. I’ve completely lost myself and self esteem, etc. I feel nuts.

Any words are so appreciated. I look forward to the support I know you can offer me here.

Thank you in advance.

P.S. This is a total crazy story I know. After reading all of it typed out I’m like WOW. I’m very emotional and a mess right now. Can’t believe that my life has come to this craziness!!


----------



## HarryDoyle

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*










*Uhm what?*


----------



## life101

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*



feeling_crazy said:


> So he hasn’t called or texted like he normally does. I feel like he’s ok with letting me go and it’s killing me. Or he thinks I’m bluffing because I’ve fake broken up with him before. I’ve never taken it to this extreme of changing the locks and moving all of his belonging to a storage unit.
> 
> I feel like this is my fault and if I would have just been happy, not nag and trust and not be crazy girl who checked or need to “talk” all of the time and not needed reassurance and just been confident and secure that I would have gotten him to be better and open up more.
> 
> Did I drive him away with my craziness? Or did he make me crazy and I’m thinking he’ll change, etc. If I change will he change?
> 
> Why isn’t he begging me and fighting for me? Or should I even care?


Don't get back with him again. He will not change.

It is not your fault. Start IC ASAP.

Next time, look at the history of person before getting too serious. Most of the people don't change their ways in relationship matters. Once a cheater, always a cheater.

You deserve better.


----------



## hehasmyheart

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

You did the right thing. Nobody needs toxic relationships.


----------



## KanDo

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

Why the h3ll wold you put up with any of this??? Get into individual couseling and straighten yourself out. Lose this guys number and NEVER speak to him again You are lucky to be out of this!


----------



## mineforever

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

You need to move on.....he is not respecting you ir your relationship, he is using you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## chillymorn

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

yuck hes not the man for you.

move on and don't look back.


----------



## iBolt

BLOODY HELL!!!

This is terrible. I am so sorry that this is happening. 

You MUST forget about this rat and get yourself into a safe place. I only read half way through your post and I had to stop when you wrote about being hit so hard that a tooth had to be removed from the back of your mouth. Are you kidding me? NO ONE SHOULD LIVE WITH THIS. VIOLENCE IS NEVER JUSTIFIED.

He will tell you that you made him go crazy. He is manipulating you. He has you sussed and knows you are dependent on him so he does what he does because he has the license to.

Thank your lucky stars that you're alive. Run from this brute.

It is a very common thing with victims of domestic or sexual abuse to think it was their fault. Perpetrators, the really good ones like your partner, are exceptional mind twisters. You live with them long enough to actually start believing there IS something wrong with YOU. You're told something long enough that you start believing it.

This is horrible stuff. LET HIM GO


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello iBolt and thanks for your input. I'm sobbing as I'm typing this right now because yes, you're right. I should have left then. 

I had a major anxiety and panic breakdown last night thinking of all of the horrible things I was put through and the fact that I endured it for so long. I kept telling myself that I dodged a bullet. 

Over the years we had drank a few times and yes, I did say some nasty things when I got upset about what he had done t me with the cheating, etc. and I blamed myself that I brought the physical abuse onto myself because IF I hadn't said those nasty things he would have never hurt me. I guess I should have known better.

I keep thinking though right now of how he has not reached out to me like he normally does and I'm panicking and starting to feel that he's done with me. Because of all of the negativity and drama that I brought into his life everyday with my not trusting, complaining that he didn't treat me right, not feeling happy about being around his children anymore and I told myself that IF I was going to have forgiven him for his wrongs that I need to start with a clean slate and move on. Well, I couldn't. I was still so bitter and resentful for not getting what I wanted that I couldn't be that happy confident girl anymore. All I did when I got home was come to my room and he in the living room and it was just like we both just existed here. I started shutting down because he was shutting down. Again, he was always so loving at first. If we got into an argument he would make things right by apologizing and fixing things. Not anymore. He totally stopped. 

So again, is he not fighting for me because he's had it with my negativity? 

I did really try though. To be happy and to let things go. But when I would need to talk about me being unhappy or that I felt he wasn't putting effort into making me happy anymore he would lose it. Said I was attacking him and telling him what he was not all of the time. He said that he can't be a better man to me when all I tell him is what he's not and what he doesn't do. I always told him that I'm not attacking him. I'm just letting him know what I need and what I'm missing to make me happy. That I can be happy if he put effort and he of course did everything right. That I attacked him. He said why can't you just be happy with what is? Let things fall into place. He said why must I talk everytime you want to talk? Can't you just let me talk when I'm ready? I told him that he NEVER talks. Even if I don't bring it up and give him the chance to. That it never happens.

He stopped complimenting me and making me feel pretty. There were days that I went out of my way to look extra nice and wouldn't get a peep out of him. It hurt that I got nothing. When you're in a relationship it's nice to hear from your better half that they still find you attractive, etc. I said a few times, do you like this today? What about this? He would say yes and I'd say well you didn't tell me and he'd respond with "because you don't give me a chance to". Again, not true even if I didn't mention it. He wouldn't say it.

So that was another issue in our relationship. If I needed to talk he said he felt forced to and would talk when he was ready. If I needed a sweet compliment he wouldn't do it because he felt forced to. He said I'm not doing these things because you want me to do them when you want me to do them. What kind of person who says they love another person has that much pride to not give them what they're needing to feel better in the relationship? Out of pride? That's not love, right?

So again, he's not reaching out to me at all like he normally does. My mom said he's using reverse psychology because he knows that I'm dying to hear something from him and the fact that he's not is making me want it even more. 

I just again, want to know that IF I had changed. IF I had not turned into this whiney, nagging, jealous and insecure girlfriend who didn't trust and questioned everything he did would he have changed and been different to me? If I were the secure confident woman that he met would he have eventually proposed, etc.?

I can't help but to take some blame. I keep running "what if" thoughts and that's not helping me at all. 

I keep thinking that I was his rebound punching bag girlfriend and he's going to change for the next woman. Be a different/better man and treat her better. Like she'll reap the benefits of the potential I know he has. Is that even possible?

I'm sorry that I'm all over the place. This is REALLY hard. One second I'm ok thinking this is the best thing and I'm dodging a bullet and the next is IF I change would he have been? 

Again, is he not reaching out because of reverse psychology or is he not reaching out because he's tired of my crap? When I think that the blame goes on me....

I guess I should care less, right? 

Thank you all for your help! Please keep it coming. My mom is the only one who knows about this so the more support I have to keep strong the better.


----------



## feeling_crazy

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

Hello everyone and thanks for your input. I'm sobbing as I'm typing this right now because yes, you're right. I should have left then. 

I had a major anxiety and panic breakdown last night thinking of all of the horrible things I was put through and the fact that I endured it for so long. I kept telling myself that I dodged a bullet. 

Over the years we had drank a few times and yes, I did say some nasty things when I got upset about what he had done t me with the cheating, etc. and I blamed myself that I brought the physical abuse onto myself because IF I hadn't said those nasty things he would have never hurt me. I guess I should have known better.

I keep thinking though right now of how he has not reached out to me like he normally does and I'm panicking and starting to feel that he's done with me. Because of all of the negativity and drama that I brought into his life everyday with my not trusting, complaining that he didn't treat me right, not feeling happy about being around his children anymore and I told myself that IF I was going to have forgiven him for his wrongs that I need to start with a clean slate and move on. Well, I couldn't. I was still so bitter and resentful for not getting what I wanted that I couldn't be that happy confident girl anymore. All I did when I got home was come to my room and he in the living room and it was just like we both just existed here. I started shutting down because he was shutting down. Again, he was always so loving at first. If we got into an argument he would make things right by apologizing and fixing things. Not anymore. He totally stopped. 

So again, is he not fighting for me because he's had it with my negativity? 

I did really try though. To be happy and to let things go. But when I would need to talk about me being unhappy or that I felt he wasn't putting effort into making me happy anymore he would lose it. Said I was attacking him and telling him what he was not all of the time. He said that he can't be a better man to me when all I tell him is what he's not and what he doesn't do. I always told him that I'm not attacking him. I'm just letting him know what I need and what I'm missing to make me happy. That I can be happy if he put effort and he of course did everything right. That I attacked him. He said why can't you just be happy with what is? Let things fall into place. He said why must I talk everytime you want to talk? Can't you just let me talk when I'm ready? I told him that he NEVER talks. Even if I don't bring it up and give him the chance to. That it never happens.

He stopped complimenting me and making me feel pretty. There were days that I went out of my way to look extra nice and wouldn't get a peep out of him. It hurt that I got nothing. When you're in a relationship it's nice to hear from your better half that they still find you attractive, etc. I said a few times, do you like this today? What about this? He would say yes and I'd say well you didn't tell me and he'd respond with "because you don't give me a chance to". Again, not true even if I didn't mention it. He wouldn't say it.

So that was another issue in our relationship. If I needed to talk he said he felt forced to and would talk when he was ready. If I needed a sweet compliment he wouldn't do it because he felt forced to. He said I'm not doing these things because you want me to do them when you want me to do them. What kind of person who says they love another person has that much pride to not give them what they're needing to feel better in the relationship? Out of pride? That's not love, right?

So again, he's not reaching out to me at all like he normally does. My mom said he's using reverse psychology because he knows that I'm dying to hear something from him and the fact that he's not is making me want it even more. 

I just again, want to know that IF I had changed. IF I had not turned into this whiney, nagging, jealous and insecure girlfriend who didn't trust and questioned everything he did would he have changed and been different to me? If I were the secure confident woman that he met would he have eventually proposed, etc.?

I can't help but to take some blame. I keep running "what if" thoughts and that's not helping me at all. 

I keep thinking that I was his rebound punching bag girlfriend and he's going to change for the next woman. Be a different/better man and treat her better. Like she'll reap the benefits of the potential I know he has. Is that even possible?

I'm sorry that I'm all over the place. This is REALLY hard. One second I'm ok thinking this is the best thing and I'm dodging a bullet and the next is IF I change would he have been? 

Again, is he not reaching out because of reverse psychology or is he not reaching out because he's tired of my crap? When I think that the blame goes on me....

I guess I should care less, right? 

Thank you all for your help! Please keep it coming. My mom is the only one who knows about this so the more support I have to keep strong the better.


----------



## mablenc

I think you need to stick to one thread only. Posting the same question twice is against the forum rules.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## iBolt

FeelingCrazy...you are going round the same circle and you likely won't stop going until you get off this bus.

What does it matter to you if he is a 'better man' for another woman as a result of his issues? PLEASE get yourself into therapy if you can. You are a little too heavily dependent on this punk for your overall self esteem. He is NOT responsible for and is therefore NOT in control of your sense of self. 

I recently started running a community initiative to raise awareness about domestic violence. TRUST ME - perpetrators of this kind of thing are control freaks. They are experts at identifying vulnerable individuals and abusing them. So, I urge you to speak to a professional for help with your dependency issues. I honestly there is anything you can do that will make someone hell bent on cheating not cheat.

I know things will be tough for you IF you choose to let him go. As humans we are social creatures of habit so someone (good or bad) that we've become used to over time are missed when they leave us. Time will help but you should try focusing your attention on other things i.e your daughter, mum, work, gym (my favourite  etc and you will be fine. 

So, please quit blaming yourself for his actions and take a healthy responsibility for yours. You will be ok. Let him go


----------



## SaltInWound

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*



feeling_crazy said:


> I keep thinking that I was his rebound punching bag girlfriend and he's going to change for the next woman. Be a different/better man and treat her better. Like she'll reap the benefits of the potential I know he has. Is that even possible?


Oh, how I wish I had a dollar for every time I have heard myself say those exact words......heard others here on TAM say those words. Look, men like this won't change. Their "nice" act is just that.......an act. They use it to keep the leash on you. Keep reminding yourself that he is using you as a punching bag. It will help you detach and move on.


----------



## MrK

feeling_crazy said:


> I’m soon to be 39 years old, am attractive, have a great job and am a single mom to a beautiful 19 year old daughter in college.


No, you're not crazy. Do not let him talk his way back in. You deserve better. And from that short description above, you should do OK out there. You'll be fine.


----------



## Hortensia

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

If it wasn't for the fact that he has two kids I would've thought you were dating my ex ! The same abusive, selfish and cheating behavior. 

You had a huge, gargantuan, immense and colossal red flag : he BEAT his ex. And cheated on- no matter under what circumstances. But the BEATING her, and having been arrested, did it not scream "beware" to you from all its common sense? A guy who beats his woman is scum - no matter what.
And are you sure she cheated on him, and not the other way around? Maybe he beat the crp out of her because she found his lies.

Anyway, after what he did to you, no words to even comment, please have a restraining order against him, change your locks, your phone number, even the address and never waste another thought on him.
What do you love "immensely"? The violence? The physical pain when he hits you? The emotional pain when he cheats on you over and over again? This is not love, is co-dependency. And the wrong belief that you can't find nobody else. Please get IC and save yourself from this monster !


----------



## COguy

You aren't feeling crazy, you ARE crazy. For staying in this situation when the answer is obvious. You said it yourself.

You need some therapy to find out why you are addicted to these types of people and why you don't immediately leave abusive and bad relationships.

If you don't take care of your own internal issues, then you'll just keep repeating this cycle.

The details of this relationship are a distraction from the root of your own issues. And that is the heart of codependency. Having things to focus on besides our own internal feelings and inadequacies. Check out coda.org and try to go to a local meeting.


----------



## iBolt

COguy said:


> You aren't feeling crazy, you ARE crazy. For staying in this situation when the answer is obvious. You said it yourself.
> 
> You need some therapy to find out why you are addicted to these types of people and why you don't immediately leave abusive and bad relationships.
> 
> If you don't take care of your own internal issues, then you'll just keep repeating this cycle.
> 
> The details of this relationship are a distraction from the root of your own issues. And that is the heart of codependency. Having things to focus on besides our own internal feelings and inadequacies. Check out coda.org and try to go to a local meeting.


:iagree:


----------



## IsGirl3

the pain must have been unbearable for your daughter and family to stand by helplessly and watch you take this abuse. you left him. good. don't look back.


----------



## Acabado

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

Would you chose for your 19 years old daughter a man who has proved once and again to be:
An abuser, at all levels.
Patological lier.
Serial cheater.
Drug addict and raging alcoholic.

Dig deep why you had so low standards for yourself.
Nothing will improve in your ife unless you put self respect (whatevet it looks like) over emotions, particulary over "feeling in love". Run away from charmers. Run away from any man, for a while, untill you get your sh1t together.
If nopt for you, for your daughter: what kind of expectations are your teaching her she should seek in life?


----------



## mineforever

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

First you need to let go... you can't make him into what you want him to be. He is who he is... not what you want him to be. I know you have feelings for him... the problem is I think you love who he could be not who he is. He has showed he can't be faithful, he doesn't respect you, he is abusive.... I know you want him to be the person you know he can be... but he isn't and only he can decide he wants to be a better person you can't make him that person. 

You are right, you have tried. Sometimes in life things just aren't going to work out the way we want..... you may have to walk away for him to realize that he has to change. The only way he may get motivated to change is for him to completely lose you. Have you thought about the fact that you staying maybe his excuse for not changing.... maybe if you leave it will show him his behavior has to change in order to keep you. 

Either way, you need to move on and heal. There is someone out there who will treat you like the gem you are. No one deserves to be treated the way he has been treating you, you need to move on and work on healing from this relationship. If he gets his act together great.... but right now you need to focus on you and let him go figure himself out.


----------



## SunnyT

He isn't calling because he really doesn't care about you. It's all about him, and always has been. It's hard to see when you are in the middle of it. 

Make a plan. Plan for YOUR future. Figure out what you want in life and how to get there. Figure out how to be ok with yourself so no one can take advantage of you again. So you will be healthier in your next relationship. 

Do NOT contact him... for any reason. Surround yourself with positive people who are good for you... girlfriends, family... who ever brings positives to your life. 

Do something you love. Get your finances in order, make your own life stable. Make plans to do something you've always wanted to do. 

Make your life YOUR OWN.... with no room for an abuser.


----------



## In_The_Wind

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

Run forest run !!! I would stay separated
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## psychedelicately

If he's like this with you, he'll be like this with the next one. It's not you... don't let him manipulate you into thinking it's your fault in any way. It's all him---nothing justifies abusing someone like that. Get out and I promise in time you'll see it was the best choice you ever made. I was in a nearly identical situation with my daughters bio dad. I felt exactly as you do now... if you ever want to talk feel free to PM me anytime.


----------



## iBolt

_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Cosmos

Get yourself some abuse counseling and be glad that you've got away from this man (comparitively) unscathed. 

The only thing that changes with abusers is that they get worse.


----------



## silentghost

I agree with Coguy....you are crazy.
You got some serious co-dependency problems here and in some need for some serious therapy.
Why would you want this 'character' to propose to you after all the abuse he's done to you. IT's just not normal.
I'll say it again....get some counseling, therapy or anything that will set your foot on the right path.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello - Thanks to everyone for your advice. For the few of you who have called me crazy, I can't take hearing that right now because he has got me to feeling this way. I came here for positive support. Not to hear what he has me thinking which is that I'm crazy.

On to those who have offered such great advice, thank you again. 

I made a list of everything that has happened and after reading it again and again I'm so shocked to all that has happened. I actually had a major panic and anxiety attack that I thought I had to go to the hospital for because looking at it written down it really hit me HARD. I can't BELIEVE all that I have endured and allowed to happen to me and how much of my life I've wasted THINKING that it was my fault and that he would change.

I guess I should be happy that I'm going on 39. That's not THAT old right? lol...

I am pretty scared of being single and lonely. Although he's been a jerk we have had such good moments and he was my "buddy". I lost some friends during the process who I'm rekindling with now but I'm sort of nervous to have friends again. Does that sound normal? 

Anyway, quick update. I talked to him on Friday as I called him to make arrangements for the rest of things and what he'd like to do with them. He told me I sounded ok and I said yes, I'm ok. I said you sound pretty ok yourself. He said what do you mean? I did it and I know I shouldn't have but I did. I said well you seem to not be that concerned. I guess I'm surprised you didn't have more to say is all. After five years and you're not even fighting for me. I KNOW I shouldn't have said it but I sort of couldn't help it. 

He said "Of course I care but do you want me to grovel in the dirt? I'm giving you your privacy and space". 

I said you know what? Nevermind, I shouldn't have brought it up. I told him to let me know when he was ready for this things. Told him to have a good day and hung up.

OF COURSE after I hang up he texts all of the things I want to hear. The whole of course I don't want this to happen, of course I love you and don't want to be without you, of course I can change and I will change. 

I didn't text back but of course I THOUGHT about it. I guess that's normal, right?

He went out of town to stay with his family and has been texting me "my family says hello and they love you, etc." Like why is he doing that? Knowing how much I love his family. Then he texted good morning, have a good day, I love you. I just can't believe he's doing that.

I texted him a bit ago and I said when are you heading back this way. do you need your work keys and other things he said, yes but it'll be extremely hard to see you. I said I know this isn't easy for anyone. Call me when you want to make arrangements.

So he just called and said that he's going to stay out of town at his families (which is two and half hours away) until 3:00 am and then would drive straight into work. He said that his best friend said he couldn't stay tonight because him and his girlfriend are fighting. I find that hard to believe cause his best friend told him last week that he could stay there if he needed to and he said he also called another friend who said he couldn't stay cause he had family in from out of town. So I'm feeling bad over here because I never intended to throw him out on the streets. I was confident his best friend would let him stay there because he told him he could and his best friend has ALWAYS had his back. He'll do anything for him. So is he lying?

This is all so very hard on me and of course I keep thinking what if, what if, what if? 

Also, again thinking IF I had did this differently, etc. would he have changed?

Like I know he's been down and out because his parents both just died one year apart and I tell myself what if he's at a bad point because it's hitting him? I guess he should be open about that then, right?

Also, those times that he was physical we were drunk and I started beligerant and got into arguments. That doesn't excuse anything, I know. 

I shouldn't think what if, right?

What is he doing? Trying to manipulate his way back in.

Am I thinking right in that IF I were the BEST, most trusting and confident woman in the world that he wouldn't have cheated and treated me the way he did?

Again, thank you. This site is helping so much!!


----------



## feeling_crazy

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

Hello - Thanks to everyone for your advice. For the few of you who have called me crazy, I can't take hearing that right now because he has got me to feeling this way. I came here for positive support. Not to hear what he has me thinking which is that I'm crazy.

On to those who have offered such great advice, thank you again. 

I made a list of everything that has happened and after reading it again and again I'm so shocked to all that has happened. I actually had a major panic and anxiety attack that I thought I had to go to the hospital for because looking at it written down it really hit me HARD. I can't BELIEVE all that I have endured and allowed to happen to me and how much of my life I've wasted THINKING that it was my fault and that he would change.

I guess I should be happy that I'm going on 39. That's not THAT old right? lol...

I am pretty scared of being single and lonely. Although he's been a jerk we have had such good moments and he was my "buddy". I lost some friends during the process who I'm rekindling with now but I'm sort of nervous to have friends again. Does that sound normal? 

Anyway, quick update. I talked to him on Friday as I called him to make arrangements for the rest of things and what he'd like to do with them. He told me I sounded ok and I said yes, I'm ok. I said you sound pretty ok yourself. He said what do you mean? I did it and I know I shouldn't have but I did. I said well you seem to not be that concerned. I guess I'm surprised you didn't have more to say is all. After five years and you're not even fighting for me. I KNOW I shouldn't have said it but I sort of couldn't help it. 

He said "Of course I care but do you want me to grovel in the dirt? I'm giving you your privacy and space". 

I said you know what? Nevermind, I shouldn't have brought it up. I told him to let me know when he was ready for this things. Told him to have a good day and hung up.

OF COURSE after I hang up he texts all of the things I want to hear. The whole of course I don't want this to happen, of course I love you and don't want to be without you, of course I can change and I will change. 

I didn't text back but of course I THOUGHT about it. I guess that's normal, right?

He went out of town to stay with his family and has been texting me "my family says hello and they love you, etc." Like why is he doing that? Knowing how much I love his family. Then he texted good morning, have a good day, I love you. I just can't believe he's doing that.

I texted him a bit ago and I said when are you heading back this way. do you need your work keys and other things he said, yes but it'll be extremely hard to see you. I said I know this isn't easy for anyone. Call me when you want to make arrangements.

So he just called and said that he's going to stay out of town at his families (which is two and half hours away) until 3:00 am and then would drive straight into work. He said that his best friend said he couldn't stay tonight because him and his girlfriend are fighting. I find that hard to believe cause his best friend told him last week that he could stay there if he needed to and he said he also called another friend who said he couldn't stay cause he had family in from out of town. So I'm feeling bad over here because I never intended to throw him out on the streets. I was confident his best friend would let him stay there because he told him he could and his best friend has ALWAYS had his back. He'll do anything for him. So is he lying?

This is all so very hard on me and of course I keep thinking what if, what if, what if? 

Also, again thinking IF I had did this differently, etc. would he have changed?

Like I know he's been down and out because his parents both just died one year apart and I tell myself what if he's at a bad point because it's hitting him? I guess he should be open about that then, right?

Also, those times that he was physical we were drunk and I started beligerant and got into arguments. That doesn't excuse anything, I know. 

I shouldn't think what if, right?

What is he doing? Trying to manipulate his way back in.

Am I thinking right in that IF I were the BEST, most trusting and confident woman in the world that he wouldn't have cheated and treated me the way he did?

Again, thank you. This site is helping so much!!


----------



## alte Dame

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

I recall this exact story from a while ago.


----------



## Cosmos

> Am I thinking right in that IF I were the BEST, most trusting and confident woman in the world that he wouldn't have cheated and treated me the way he did?


Probably not... Until he'd managed to break you down, isolate you and make you think you were going crazy, that is... That's what abusers do.

Counseling, OP. Counseling.


----------



## Phenix70

You HAVE got to get into counseling, the sooner the better.
Contact a battered women's center to get into a therapy group if you have to.
Please, stop playing the "what if..." games with yourself, all you're doing is prolonging the healing process.
Look forward to the future, with healthy people to have friendships & relationships with. 
Your ex is no good, keep repeating that to yourself, he is no good.
Change his name in your phone to "DON'T ANSWER!" & make sure you don't pick up the phone.
Normally I would say to erase it all together, but you need the reminder not to answer your phone, until it becomes second nature to you.
If you get the itchy fingers to call him, then get on here & post, call a friend or your daughter, just don't call him.


----------



## MattMatt

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

He is a charming wife beater. Sadly, they often are.


----------



## EleGirl

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*



feeling_crazy said:


> I made a list of everything that has happened and after reading it again and again I'm so shocked to all that has happened. I actually had a major panic and anxiety attack that I thought I had to go to the hospital for because looking at it written down it really hit me HARD. I can't BELIEVE all that I have endured and allowed to happen to me and how much of my life I've wasted THINKING that it was my fault and that he would change.


Keep that list. Post it on your bathroom mirror. Keep a copy by your bed. And a copy on the table where you eat your meals.

A person is only as good as the bad they do. Forget any good he did. The bad out weights it by bucket loads.

You need to get into counseling and find out why you did this to yourself. You have every right to feel insecure in this relationship. So why did you keep turning it on yourself and making excuses for him?


feeling_crazy said:


> I guess I should be happy that I’m going on 39. That’s not THAT old right? Lol…


39 is not old. I’m 64.. believe me 39 is not old. You have decades of life left.


feeling_crazy said:


> I am pretty scared of being single and lonely. Although he's been a jerk we have had such good moments and he was my "buddy". I lost some friends during the process who I'm rekindling with now but I'm sort of nervous to have friends again. Does that sound normal?


If you are afraid of being alone, get a dog. Seriously. Something like a labor-doodle. They do not shed and tend to be very sweet and loving. Your dog will never cheat on you or beat you up.

How many good times does it take for him to buy his right to mistreat you? He has that figured out you know. That’s how abuvsive people work. He knows exactly how many times he has to be good to you to get you to not kick his ass out the door for good.


feeling_crazy said:


> Anyway, quick update. I talked to him on Friday as I called him to make arrangements for the rest of things and what he'd like to do with them. He told me I sounded ok and I said yes, I'm ok. I said you sound pretty ok yourself. He said what do you mean? I did it and I know I shouldn't have but I did. I said well you seem to not be that concerned. I guess I'm surprised you didn't have more to say is all. After five years and you're not even fighting for me. I KNOW I shouldn't have said it but I sort of couldn't help it.
> He said "Of course I care but do you want me to grovel in the dirt? I'm giving you your privacy and space".


Oh, so now what he is doing is giving you a gift? Stop calling him and stop talking to him. You are a perpetual victim. You buy into his abuse. I read somewhere that people often ‘fall in love’ with someone whose mental illness matches theirs. Well yours and his fit together like pieces of a puzzle. You accept and seem to need to be abused and he needs someone to abuse. A match made it bizzaro-heaven. 

You are the only one who can put a stop to this. Due to your propensity to being sucked into abusive drama y ou need to STOP talking to him and seeing him.

What you do is that you pack his junk and put it out the door. If you can have some guys deliver it to his door. If he has a front lawn just have them dump it on his lawn. Then text you and tell him that his junk is on his lawn, or at his front door. 

Then text him and tell him to never contact you again. That if he does you will consider it stalking and file charges against him. Then block his cell number. Or if you can just call the cell company and get a new phone number. If he ever shows up at your door or approaches you, call the police.




feeling_crazy said:


> I said you know what? Nevermind, I shouldn't have brought it up. I told him to let me know when he was ready for this things. Told him to have a good day and hung up.


To repeat myself, do not call him ever again. Do not ask him what to do with his junk. You get it out of y our place and have some guys, not you, dump it on him. He will keep his things at your place as long as he wants to because it gives him access to you. He thinks he is still in control. You have the power to take his control away from him.


feeling_crazy said:


> OF COURSE after I hang up he texts all of the things I want to hear. The whole of course I don't want this to happen, of course I love you and don't want to be without you, of course I can change and I will change.


This is why you block his number NOW. These are all lies that he uses to keep you hooked. Get that puppy dog. Let is snuggle up with you and you will finally know what love and loyalty looks like.
BLOCK HIS NUMBER


feeling_crazy said:


> I didn't text back but of course I THOUGHT about it. I guess that's normal, right?


Yea thinking about it is normal. Not texting back it good. Blocking his number is BEST.


feeling_crazy said:


> He went out of town to stay with his family and has been texting me "my family says hello and they love you, etc." Like why is he doing that? Knowing how much I love his family. Then he texted good morning, have a good day, I love you. I just can't believe he's doing that.


Why are you having trouble believing this? He does not take you seriously. To him you are his punching bag and someone to abuse to make himself feel like a big man. He’s pathetic slime. Why haven’t you blocked him yet? Stop reading this and block him NOW 


feeling_crazy said:


> I texted him a bit ago and I said when are you heading back this way. do you need your work keys and other things he said, yes but it'll be extremely hard to see you. I said I know this isn't easy for anyone. Call me when you want to make arrangements.


NO… stop texting him. If he needs his work keys he can get them. Put them in his mail box. Have someone else take his keys and small essentials to him. Don’t you be near him in any way.


feeling_crazy said:


> So he just called and said that he's going to stay out of town at his families (which is two and half hours away) until 3:00 am and then would drive straight into work. He said that his best friend said he couldn't stay tonight because him and his girlfriend are fighting. I find that hard to believe cause his best friend told him last week that he could stay there if he needed to and he said he also called another friend who said he couldn't stay cause he had family in from out of town. So I'm feeling bad over here because I never intended to throw him out on the streets. I was confident his best friend would let him stay there because he told him he could and his best friend has ALWAYS had his back. He'll do anything for him. So is he lying?


STOP already!!!! He’s a big boy. He has a job. He can find a place to live in a heartbeat. Just STOP STOP STOP



feeling_crazy said:


> This is all so very hard on me and of course I keep thinking what if, what if, what if?


What if what? What if he was a completely different man? What if he was a unicorn? What if does not get you anywhere. He is who is he. He’s an abusive SOB who you do not need. Try facing reality. Where’s that list. Go read it. Every time you think of him go read that list.


feeling_crazy said:


> Also, again thinking IF I had did this differently, etc. would he have changed?


No you could not have changed him not matter what you did. He is who he is. The only person you can change is yourself. So concentrate on yourself.



feeling_crazy said:


> Like I know he's been down and out because his parents both just died one year apart and I tell myself what if he's at a bad point because it's hitting him? I guess he should be open about that then, right?


Yes he should be open about his problems. He’s a grown man. He should be able to fix his own problems without belittling you, beating on you and cheating.



feeling_crazy said:


> Also, those times that he was physical we were drunk and I started beligerant and got into arguments. That doesn't excuse anything, I know.


You both have a very bad relationship dynamic. You are poison for each other. So get a away from him. Get his junk out of your house, block his cell number. Refuse to talk to him every again.


feeling_crazy said:


> I shouldn't think what if, right?


Right.?


feeling_crazy said:


> What is he doing? Trying to manipulate his way back in.


Yes, you a need for him. He needs someone to abuse to make himself feel good and you do victim so well. Then once he’s done abusing you he can be charming to the women he dates on the side. Kind of like what he did with you and his wife. He abused her and was very charming with you. Once she got rid of him you became her and he has sought out others to be charming with.


feeling_crazy said:


> Am I thinking right in that IF I were the BEST, most trusting and confident woman in the world that he wouldn't have cheated and treated me the way he did?


Wrongheaded thinking. He will mistreat and cheat on any woman he is in an intimate relationship with. 


feeling_crazy said:


> Again, thank you. This site is helping so much!!


Good I’m glad it’s helping.

Have you blocked him yet? 

Have you called anyone to move his junk out?


----------



## Cosmos

I agree with Phoenix about the no contact with your ex. This is vital if you want to move forward to a happier, healthier life. I also agree that your local women's centre is the best place for you to get the help you desperately need right now.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

feeling_crazy said:


> Am I thinking right in that IF I were the BEST, most trusting and confident woman in the world that he wouldn't have cheated and treated me the way he did?


NO!! NO!! NO!! Thats insanity! I remember telling you that before! There isnt a damn thing you could have done to make him NOT be the worthless piece of sh!t that he is! I cannot BELIEVE you are still beating this very obviously dead horse!! STOP TALKING TO HIM!! CUT HIM OUT OF YOUR LIFE AND BE DONE!! And get some counseling to find out why think the way you do.


----------



## Caribbean Man

feeling-crazy,
Your situation is not unique!
If you we in counseling , you will see that these things that are " happening " to you have happened to other women.
It's called abuse.
You are in an abusive relationship and you feel helpless because of low self esteem due to his abuse to you.
It's a vicious , downward spiral that can only end one out of two ways.
Either you get professional help and leave , or he will eventually do you permanent physical harm.
Listen to the others.
Get yourself out of this relationship, and into professional counseling .


----------



## feeling_crazy

You are all right.

I just want to reiterate that the physical was a few years ago. Hasn't happened in the last two years.

Well, once he got upset at a question that I had asked him and he threw a towel at my face. There were a few situations like that. But only when I did something to upset him.

I feel like you're mostly focusing on the physical here. Or when you all say abuse do you mean mental and physical?

I'm sorry if I'm asking a silly question. I'm seriously all over the place.

The last two days have been ok and this morning woke up crying hysterically. Like this hurts more than I ever imagined.

It doesn't help that he texted "good morning, missing you terribly". 

So again, when you say abuse, you're meaning physical and mental? 

I feel like he has done these things in the past, and the reason I lost it and broke up with him is because he hung up on me over something really dumb. I asked him what he did the night before and he slammed the phone down and hung up on me. So of course I feel like am I overreacting? The physical and cheating haven't happened for a long time. Well, not sure about the cheating. It was just that hang up that sort of threw me in a tizzy and I felt like I had enough. I guess that was the icing on the cake, lol.

So I just want to make sure I'm not over reacting.

I guess this is normal thinking to go round and round because of all that has happened.

I appreciate all of your input more than you know. I'm so happy that I've come here.


----------



## feeling_crazy

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

You are all right.

I just want to reiterate that the physical was a few years ago. Hasn't happened in the last two years.

Well, once he got upset at a question that I had asked him and he threw a towel in my face. There were a few situations like that. But only when I did something to upset him.

I feel like you're mostly focusing on the physical here. Or when you all say abuse do you mean mental and physical?

I'm sorry if I'm asking a silly question. I'm seriously all over the place.

The last two days have been ok and this morning woke up crying hysterically. Like this hurts more than I ever imagined.

It doesn't help that he texted "good morning, missing you terribly". 

So again, when you say abuse, you're meaning physical and mental? 

I feel like he has done these things in the past, and the reason I lost it and broke up with him is because he hung up on me over something really dumb. I asked him what he did the night before and he slammed the phone down and hung up on me. So of course I feel like am I overreacting? The physical and cheating haven't happened for a long time. Well, not sure about the cheating. It was just that hang up that sort of threw me in a tizzy and I felt like I had enough. I guess that was the icing on the cake, lol.

So I just want to make sure I'm not over reacting.

I guess this is normal thinking to go round and round because of all that has happened.

I appreciate all of your input more than you know. I'm so happy that I've come here.


----------



## turnera

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*



feeling_crazy said:


> I keep thinking though right now of how he has not reached out to me like he normally does and I'm panicking and starting to feel that he's done with me.


This is the crux of your whole problem. You're codependent. You need therapy to learn to be ok WITH yourself, BY yourself. And no, you don't want him back. You want SOMEone back, and you'll take his bad, just so you can have a man want you.


----------



## Rugs

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*



EleGirl said:


> Keep that list. Post it on your bathroom mirror. Keep a copy by your bed. And a copy on the table where you eat your meals.
> 
> A person is only as good as the bad they do. Forget any good he did. The bad out weights it by bucket loads.
> 
> You need to get into counseling and find out why you did this to yourself. You have every right to feel insecure in this relationship. So why did you keep turning it on yourself and making excuses for him?
> 
> 39 is not old. I’m 64.. believe me 39 is not old. You have decades of life left.
> 
> If you are afraid of being alone, get a dog. Seriously. Something like a labor-doodle. They do not shed and tend to be very sweet and loving. Your dog will never cheat on you or beat you up.
> 
> How many good times does it take for him to buy his right to mistreat you? He has that figured out you know. That’s how abuvsive people work. He knows exactly how many times he has to be good to you to get you to not kick his ass out the door for good.
> 
> Oh, so now what he is doing is giving you a gift? Stop calling him and stop talking to him. You are a perpetual victim. You buy into his abuse. I read somewhere that people often ‘fall in love’ with someone whose mental illness matches theirs. Well yours and his fit together like pieces of a puzzle. You accept and seem to need to be abused and he needs someone to abuse. A match made it bizzaro-heaven.
> 
> You are the only one who can put a stop to this. Due to your propensity to being sucked into abusive drama y ou need to STOP talking to him and seeing him.
> 
> What you do is that you pack his junk and put it out the door. If you can have some guys deliver it to his door. If he has a front lawn just have them dump it on his lawn. Then text you and tell him that his junk is on his lawn, or at his front door.
> 
> Then text him and tell him to never contact you again. That if he does you will consider it stalking and file charges against him. Then block his cell number. Or if you can just call the cell company and get a new phone number. If he ever shows up at your door or approaches you, call the police.
> 
> 
> 
> To repeat myself, do not call him ever again. Do not ask him what to do with his junk. You get it out of y our place and have some guys, not you, dump it on him. He will keep his things at your place as long as he wants to because it gives him access to you. He thinks he is still in control. You have the power to take his control away from him.
> 
> This is why you block his number NOW. These are all lies that he uses to keep you hooked. Get that puppy dog. Let is snuggle up with you and you will finally know what love and loyalty looks like.
> BLOCK HIS NUMBER
> 
> Yea thinking about it is normal. Not texting back it good. Blocking his number is BEST.
> 
> Why are you having trouble believing this? He does not take you seriously. To him you are his punching bag and someone to abuse to make himself feel like a big man. He’s pathetic slime. Why haven’t you blocked him yet? Stop reading this and block him NOW
> 
> NO… stop texting him. If he needs his work keys he can get them. Put them in his mail box. Have someone else take his keys and small essentials to him. Don’t you be near him in any way.
> 
> STOP already!!!! He’s a big boy. He has a job. He can find a place to live in a heartbeat. Just STOP STOP STOP
> 
> 
> What if what? What if he was a completely different man? What if he was a unicorn? What if does not get you anywhere. He is who is he. He’s an abusive SOB who you do not need. Try facing reality. Where’s that list. Go read it. Every time you think of him go read that list.
> 
> No you could not have changed him not matter what you did. He is who he is. The only person you can change is yourself. So concentrate on yourself.
> 
> 
> Yes he should be open about his problems. He’s a grown man. He should be able to fix his own problems without belittling you, beating on you and cheating.
> 
> 
> You both have a very bad relationship dynamic. You are poison for each other. So get a away from him. Get his junk out of your house, block his cell number. Refuse to talk to him every again.
> 
> Right.?
> 
> Yes, you a need for him. He needs someone to abuse to make himself feel good and you do victim so well. Then once he’s done abusing you he can be charming to the women he dates on the side. Kind of like what he did with you and his wife. He abused her and was very charming with you. Once she got rid of him you became her and he has sought out others to be charming with.
> 
> Wrongheaded thinking. He will mistreat and cheat on any woman he is in an intimate relationship with.
> 
> Good I’m glad it’s helping.
> 
> Have you blocked him yet?
> 
> Have you called anyone to move his junk out?





Please keep reading the above, it's your only hope. You came here for help and you received the best and only advice that will help.


----------



## thatbpguy

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

He was looking for the security of having a woman and what that brought to him. In short, he was using you for his own ends.

It was toxic indeed.


----------



## Shaggy

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

You aren't crazy, but you've become locked into a toxic relationship with a person who is abusive and a cheater.

You CAN escape the cycle, you need help like therapy to find new strategies for dealing with your doubt and fear, and his manipulations.

But know this - you can do it, you've already taken the biggest and best step by getting him out. Now work on rebuilding and healing yourself emotionally.


----------



## COguy

Yes, the mental abuse is what wears you down.

The worst part is you don't know how bad it is until you leave.

With a bruise you can see it, you know it's there, it hurts when you touch it. You probably forgot what it was like to not have to walk on egg shells.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

You are most certainly NOT overreacting, you are doing what you should have done a long damn time ago.


----------



## Acabado

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*



> *Hoovering- Don't Get Sucked Back In*
> Hoovering
> Definition:
> Hoovers & Hoovering - A Hoover is a metaphor, taken from the popular brand of vacuum cleaners, to describe how an abuse victim, trying to assert their own rights by leaving or limiting contact in a dysfunctional relationship gets "sucked back in" when the perpetrator temporarily exhibits improved or desirable behavior.
> Description:
> The Hoovering metaphor comes from the popular Hoover brand of vacuum cleaners. Hoovering describes how a non-personality-disordered person, while attempting to escape an abusive situation, gets sucked back into the status quo.
> Hoovering commonly occurs:
> After an emotional outburst, violence or other extreme period of abuse when the victim is most likely to leave, retaliate or seek help from others.
> When the victim starts to pull away from the relationship, leave the relationship or establish firmer boundaries within the relationship.
> When the abuser internally feels unworthy and fears the loss of the relationship.
> A hoovering abuser may shower their victim with gifts, compliments, promises, demonstrations of love and affection in order to persuade the victim to maintain the status quo.
> Hoovering is one of the key components of an Abusive Cycle. Without Hoovering, most abusers would be living alone. Hoovering is the "plus side" to many abusers that makes an abusive relationship seem worthwhile to many victims and sustains abusive relationships over the long term.
> Hoovering requires two willing parties to be effective: the person doing the hoovering and the person being hoovered, who allows themselves to be abused and then sucked back in.
> What it feels like:
> Hoovering feels good! And that's the point! When you are being hoovered, your buttons are all getting pushed, your feelings are getting validated, your needs are being met, your wildest dreams are coming true, your opinions matter, you are the most important person in the world to that certain person.
> Hoovering often feels like vindication. You might find yourself thinking “Finally! The message is getting through! I’m not crazy after all! Now THAT is what I’m talking about!” But watch out...
> When you are starving for any emotional food, just about any kind of personal validation tastes wonderful, but you must remember that not everything that tastes delicious is nutritious.
> Manipulative abusers are often adept at giving their victims enough of what they want to keep them where they want them. Even slave owners know that they have to feed them enough to keep them healthy and productive.
> But how do I know if a hoover is 'real"?
> Many Non-personality disordered people struggle with trying to tell whether a hoover really is a hoover, or if it is a sincere attempt at change by the personality-disordered person whom they care about.
> The mistake in that logic is that it assumes that it can't be both. Many abusers and personality-disordered people really are sincere and really are trying when they also are hoovering. People who are hoovering you may not be consciously trying to manipulate you or deceive you. They may sincerely be trying, even hoping, to make it "better this time". They may not be consciously lying when they make promises of change and put them into practice. They may be so convincing because they are so convinced.
> You are going to have to be like the adult in a parent-child relationship, who listens to their child's black-and-white promises of great expectations or of "I'll never talk to him/her again" and says "Hmm, we'll wait and see".
> If you're not sure if you're being hoovered you should wait and see. Take the long-term view. A person's character is like an average of their behaviors over their lifetime. People can and do make positive changes in their lives sometimes, deciding to change their behavior for the better. Wait a year and see.
> Coping with Hoovering:
> If somebody who has been treating you abusively starts to treat you well, there's no harm in letting them knock themselves out and give yourself a break, but you must be careful not to take the bait to erode your boundaries, settle for less than you deserve, stop doing things that are healthy for you or stop exercising your own independence.
> What NOT to do:
> Don't change any of your boundaries or allow them to be broken during a hoover.
> Don't relax or give up on any consequences of previous poor decisions for the abuser.
> Don't stop any healthy activities or relationships you may be engaged in elsewhere.
> Don't assume the hoover will last forever.
> Don't use a hoover to bargain for a better life. You are setting up the abuser to break a promise and setting yourself up for a disappointment.
> What TO do:
> Remember that mood swings are a normal part of a number of personality disorders and that what goes up must come down.
> Accept that highs and lows are a part of everyone's emotional life and that, for a personality-disordered person, those may be more intense and lead swings in behavior.
> Maintain all your healthy lifestyle habits and relationships with others.
> Take the long-term view. Wait a year.
> Get yourself off the roller coaster. Position yourself so that your safety and happiness isn't dependent on a personality-disordered person's mood.
> 
> 
> 
> Source: Out of the FOG - Hoovers and Hoovering





> What is Hoovering?
> Think of a big old vacumn cleaner gliding along the carpet making a LOT of noise coming your way with promises that it will clean up the mess and make everything "right".
> Hoovering is when the abuser wants to "suck" you back in to the abuser's "game". This means that the abuser needs some more of what we call "narcissistic source" or attention. This can be negative or positive attention.
> An abuser will use many different kinds of hoovering attempts.
> Some examples of hoovering include:
> 1. Health issues. The abuser will need you to help them out because they are having health issues.
> 2. Promises of change. They say they will go to therapy. They will do "anything" to make you happy. False, empty promises they are, but the abuser can seem to be convincing and serious about it.
> 3. Fianacial issues. The abuser contacts you and says that he will lose everything if you don't give him money. It is always a crisis.
> 4. The abuser will show up at club meetings, school activities, events, etc where you attend and will begin to give you meaningful looks or try to speak with you.
> 5. Calls, Texts, E mails. You will boot up your computere one day to find you are once again being "love bombed" by e mail. Or by texts on your phone. This is why you have to block them from being able to contact you in any way.
> 6. By triangulation. Sometimes the abusers will use family members or friends who will call you or just run into you and who will give you a message from the abuser.
> ALWAYS REMEMBER THAT ABUSERS DON'T CHANGE. JUST BECAUSE THEY SAY THEY HAVE CHANGED, ONLY CONSISTENT LONG-TERM POSITIVE BEHAVIOR CAN PROVE IT.
> A few nice words don't really mean anything except they were spoken.


----------



## IrishGirlVA

feeling_crazy said:


> > One day he lost it and wound up physically assaulting her.
> 
> > He told me that prior to getting married that he always cheated....
> 
> > I saw that he wasn’t proposing, etc.
> 
> > Our places have all been in my name and his credit is shot. He pitched in for bills, etc. but has always been financially irresponsible. He couldn’t even have a normal conversation about finances without flipping out so after awhile I felt like he was using me to play wife and for a place for his kids to stay.
> 
> 
> > I found a note in his truck from another girl. Just saying how she thought he was awesome and she wanted to see him again.
> 
> > I found that he texted and called the girl he left for me a few times.
> 
> > When we got to our place he back handed me. I fell to the ground and he drug me down the hall to my place.
> 
> > Well, my birthday weekend I found that he was texting one of his ex girlfriends from years ago.
> 
> > Yell and not talk to me.
> 
> > ....my boyfriend was at a bar with some other woman.
> 
> > He would only text and call from the restroom which I thought was fishy.
> 
> > ....at times he was violent when we were drinking.
> 
> > ....he stopped apologizing for it and would tell me that if I didn’t provoke him it wouldn’t happen.
> 
> > ....semen stains on his underwear when we weren’t intimate.
> 
> > One time he came home and it appeared to have red lipstick on the lower part of his front shirt.
> 
> > Would have hissy fits if I needed reassurance. I figured I deserved that and nothing. If I brought it up he would have rages and broke my bakers rack and a table chair once.
> 
> > When I called him and asked he hung up on me.....
> 
> > I saw a car in the driveway that wasn’t his so I went inside because the key was left in the door and I saw a bed made on the living room floor, wine glasses, etc.
> 
> > ....that he grabbed me by the arm.....
> 
> > ......ONE WEEK after my miscarriage that I find him the home that we lived together with someone else!
> 
> > .....He likes to drink a lot and does cocaine from time to time and smokes marijuana every day.
> 
> > He had hung up on me for no reason....
> 
> > He’s emotionally shut down and will not talk.
> 
> > .....he didn’t fight for me or beg me to stay.
> 
> > ....he hasn’t called or texted like he normally does.


You did the right thing. It should have happened a LONG time ago but YOU. DID. THE. RIGHT. THING.!! 

Keep reading what you wrote over and over and over again. A proposal from him is not going to change his character. If he is not fighting for you then he is doing YOU a huge favor. The person who needs to fight for you is YOU. You are exhibiting very codependent behavior and you need to get yourself into counseling. Just like I had to when I was in a relationship very similiar to yours. 

Don't let this man into your home, your heart or your life again. You are NOT crazy. And look up the term "gaslighting". That's what he is doing to you. He is blaming you for all his behaviors. It's a crock of s**t.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

You really need to limit this thread to one section....


----------



## feeling_crazy

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*

Ok, thanks for clarifying!!

It's hard for me because like I'm missing him. I love to cook meals, etc. and I keep thinking I'm going to make this fabulous meal and he won't even get to enjoy it with me. Like I keep telling myself how do I go about enjoying my life doing this like enjoying stuff on my own? Without having him as my partner anymore? Without the whole huge what if he were here, etc.?

I know that I need to get help. This was a huge first step so I'm proud of myself for that. I'm feeling some level of empowerment. I just don't know how to go about getting therapy. I make enough money, however, I can't afford it because my insurance has a very high co-pay for specialist visits and I just can't afford it. 

What do you all recommend for that? Books? If so, any specific ones you can provide the names for?

I'm working from home today because my emotions are just too high. 

He just called about getting his things and he seems to think that even though he's not going to be living here that we're still together. He told me he misses me and loves me and just wants to be close to me. He said that I haven't responded to his texts and he said "so I'm never going to see or talk to you again?". I said I don't even know how to respond to that.

So he's accepting that he can't come back but he still wants to be with me?

Sorry guys...keep letting me have it. This is super hard on me.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

He only wants to keep using you. Block his number.


----------



## turnera

The first book you need to read is Why Does He Do That? Inside The Minds Of Angry And Controlling Men, by Bancroft. And go to United Way to find a therapist you can afford. You probably won't get through this without one. And choose a friend to be an accountability partner, who you call when you're feeling weak and want to let him come back.

And move his stuff out of your house, yourself. Do NOT let him come in the house to get it. Ask for help doing it, if you have to.


----------



## EleGirl

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*



feeling_crazy said:


> It's hard for me because like I'm missing him.


That’s natural and will pass. One good way to help yourself stop pining for him is use a thought re-direction technique. Remember that list you wrote? Every time you start to miss him, or think good things about him, read the list and mentally re-live those things. Do this until you no longer pine for him.




feeling_crazy said:


> I love to cook meals, etc. and I keep thinking I'm going to make this fabulous meal and he won't even get to enjoy it with me. Like I keep telling myself how do I go about enjoying my life doing this like enjoying stuff on my own? Without having him as my partner anymore? Without the whole huge what if he were here, etc.?


Do you have any female friends? If you do invite them over for your great meals. If you know someone who is sick or down, take the meal to them and eat it with them.

You need to find healthy things to do that fill your life up. One way to start this is to go to Find Meetup groups near you - Meetup check it out and see what they have there that you would enjoy. It’s not a dating site. It’s a site for people to get together to do things that they are interested in and enjoy.



feeling_crazy said:


> I know that I need to get help. This was a huge first step so I'm proud of myself for that. I'm feeling some level of empowerment. I just don't know how to go about getting therapy. I make enough money, however, I can't afford it because my insurance has a very high co-pay for specialist visits and I just can't afford it.
> 
> What do you all recommend for that? Books? If so, any specific ones you can provide the names for?


Two books to start with:

Codependent No More & Beyond Codependency, by Melody Beattie 

Men Who Hate Women and the Women Who Love Them: When Loving Hurts and You Don't Know Why by Susan Forward and Joan Torres 





feeling_crazy said:


> He just called about getting his things and he seems to think that even though he's not going to be living here that we're still together. He told me he misses me and loves me and just wants to be close to me. He said that I haven't responded to his texts and he said "so I'm never going to see or talk to you again?". I said I don't even know how to respond to that.


Why are you talking to him? The way brain chemistry works, every time you talk to him your body produces Oxytocin. When you hear his voice, or you are around him, your brain produces oxytocin, you bond to him. The trick here it to end your bond to him. Oxytocin is the human bonding hormone, some call it the love hormone. It not only causes people to form strong bonds with each other, it makes you gloss over the bad things. This is why you put up with is abuse (yes even emotional abuse, cheating is one of the worst emotional abuses there is). You have sex with him and/or spend time with him. And then your brain produces bucket loads of oxytocin. And then your brain goes numb and you ‘forget’ how much he hurt you. All you want is your next oxytocin fix. And he’s your drug dealer.
Like I said get a puppy. Spending time with a pet also causes your brain to produce oxytocin as well.




feeling_crazy said:


> So he's accepting that he can't come back but he still wants to be with me?


Why are you trying to make sense out of what he says and does? He has learned to manipulate you. So he knows that saying something stupid like that will keep you confuse long enough to give him a chance to move back into your life. Stop listening to his words. Believe his actions.

So stop talking to him. Block his number.



feeling_crazy said:


> Sorry guys...keep letting me have it. This is super hard on me.


It would get a lot easier if you blocked his number and refuse to talk to him. And if you get his junk out of your house.


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

At first, I thought troll thread. Long rambling story, woman who wants to stay with an abuser...

But I'm seeing in the most recent post a change in the OP. And she keeps following up. So with that said...

You're a strong woman, OP. Remember that first and foremost. Write it down somewhere if you have to. You are strong, you are beautiful, and you deserve someone that will make you happy ALL THE TIME, not just some of the time.

The manipulation is HARD to deal with. He was with you for five years, he knows every single thing you love, you fear, you are passionate about...and he will EXPLOIT THEM ALL.

You've already gotten a taste of this, with him texting you about his family missing you and about how much he loves you, appreciates you, and wants to change. If you mentioned to him that you miss cooking for him, I'm sure you would be bombarded with messages about how he loves your cooking and misses your meals. IT'S ALL MANIPULATION.

You love to cook? EleGirl made a good point, invite some friends over. Or just cook for you. When was the last time you made a big, fancy dinner that YOU wanted all for you?

There are hotlines you can call, for domestic abuse (and yes, reiterating that even emotional abuse is still "domestic abuse"). You can also google "support group in (your city)" and find free support groups for other people going through the same things you are.

Agreeing with others; BLOCK his number. If he contacts you again, call the police and report him for harrassment. Think of it this way: you need time to heal and recover. Every time he contacts you he is ripping out your "stitches" so to speak and making you bleed all over again. 

He thinks you're going to come back because you have before. He thinks all he has to do is a, b, and c and you'll come back. Prove him wrong.


----------



## feeling_crazy

LoveAtDaisies - Thanks for making note that I'm actually listening and taking you all up on your advice. It feels good to know that I have this immense amount of support. On a website...just amazing!!!

I know that me moving forward is a MUST.

I appreciate all of the strong words of encouragement. 

I have read the book Co-Dependent No More and nada. Guess I should read it again.

I'm going to go out and get those other books hopefully sometime today. So you all think that the books aren't enough? I still should seek therapy somehow?

I do need to figure out why I am the way I am. This is my third abusive relationship. The other two weren't physical, only cheating and emotional. 

I have also had a few good relationships. 

I just don't know what it is that has me in these bad ones. The one before this one was bad. No cheating and no physical abuse. Just emotionally unavailable. So I went from one bad relationship to an even worse one and I loved this guy the most.

I am so scared that I'll go into another relationship with the same insecurities, trust issues, paranoia.

I want to be healthy and have a healthy relationship where I can be strong, confident, secure and HAPPY. 

I'm so sad that I couldn't do that with this guy. He did have my heart.

It's so funny. I can be a reality show junkie at times. I love the Real Housewives of O.C., New Jersey, etc. and I always tell myself I look like those woman, I'm attractive, I am fun like them, smarter than what some of them seem, etc. so why don't I have a life like that? haha

I feel like I deserve that! So I want to get to a point where I have that.

Hopefully 38-39 is not too old. I read somewhere that older men in their 40's and 50's tend to date women in their 20's and early 30's. Hope that's not true! :scratchhead:


----------



## 3Xnocharm

Stay out of relationships for a couple of years. You need to figure out who YOU are first.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> I just don't know what it is that has me in these bad ones. The one before this one was bad. No cheating and no physical abuse. Just emotionally unavailable. So I went from one bad relationship to an even worse one and I loved this guy the most.


 Anyone can get into a bad relationship. The trick is to get out at the first sign of it being a bad relationship. The reason you were in those bad relationships is that you do not have strong boundaries. You value the feeling of “in love” more than you value anything else. So you trade everything for it. For some reason you do not realize that there are a lot of people you can have that feeling with, so you have the power to choose which of them you want to be with.

Your lack of boundaries are a problem because you allow any crazy nonsense into your life. A person with good/strong boundaries would have walked away from these bad relationships as soon as they saw a serious problem. Instead you make excuses for the guy and you keep thinking that you get him to change. That’s where the co-dependency comes in. He does something very bad and you try to control him by trying to get him to change.


As you have learned, he’s not going to change. So you are just driving yourself nuts trying to control his behavior.


Co-dependency is a natural reaction to being with a person who is bad news; whether it’s drugs, sexual addition, serial cheating, emotional/physical abuse, etc. What do humans do when there is a problem? We try to fix it. Codependency is an attempt to fix the situation. To fix it you have to change him. No one can change another person. So codependency turns into a descent into madness for the co-dependent.


So you are these bad relationships only because you choose to stay and try to turn them into what you want. Stop doing that. If you had kicked him to the curb the first time he did something that was harmful to you, you would have been open to finding another relationship with a man who was not like this.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> So you all think that the books aren't enough? I still should seek therapy somehow?
> 
> This is my third abusive relationship.


What do you think?

You will CONTINUE to send out signals to the wrong kinds of guys if you don't figure out WHY you do it.

If you love reality tv, try watching Tough Love. It starts again this month. You'll learn more about picking the right guy than any other show on tv.


----------



## turnera

Remember this: if you were healthy, the first time this guy cheated on you, or spoke poorly to you, or BACKHANDED you (!), you would have kicked him out for good. The FIRST time. Not the 30th time.


----------



## Dad&Hubby

feeling_crazy said:


> Hello everyone – I’ve been to the site before although it’s been a long while I need to come back for support. I’m going to try and make this as short as possible. Now that I’m thinking, I don’t think that’s possible so please bear with me. There is so much to tell and I’m really looking forward to your input and support.
> I just recently broke up with my live in boyfriend of 5 years and I’m having the hardest time with my decision. I’m questioning if it was the right thing because I truly do love him immensely. Our relationship has been very dysfunctional and toxic though.
> 
> I’m soon to be 39 years old, am attractive, have a great job and am a single mom to a beautiful 19 year old daughter in college. He is the father of two young girls and has a decent job. When I met him he was just getting out of a bad marriage. They were together for six years. Have two children together and she cheated on him and left her for another man. He was traumatized. They stayed living together for the last two years for the sake of the kids but she was with the other man the entire time. One day he lost it and wound up physically assaulting her. She had him arrested, got a restraining order and that was that.
> Him and I started dating six months after she finally got him out and he moved in about 3 months later. Things happened very quickly. He charmed the heck out of me and I fell head over heels and took a leap of faith although they weren’t officially divorced. They did officially get divorced three years into our relationship because she did it and she is recently remarried to a man who is 25 years older than her. He told me that prior to getting married that he always cheated but he changed when he got married and she wound up cheating on him. Should have walked away then.
> 
> Before he met me he was dating another woman in whom he started dating as soon as he moved out from his home with his wife. He left her for me when he met me. I know a girl who knows her and according to her she didn’t take it well. Anyway…
> 
> So, during our relationship, as I mentioned before he was the most charming man I ever met. He treated me like I’ve never been treated and I was convinced that he was the one for me. He talked marriage and we started living together playing the married couple right away. I fell in love with his daughters and him. At the beginning of the relationship I was all about it but after a while when I saw that he wasn’t proposing, etc. I started to get frustrated. Because I wanted the commitment if I was going to play the role. I let it go thinking that eventually he’d propose but in the meantime, I started to not be as excited about playing step mom, etc. and I let it be known to him.
> 
> Our places have all been in my name and his credit is shot. He pitched in for bills, etc. but has always been financially irresponsible. He couldn’t even have a normal conversation about finances without flipping out so after awhile I felt like he was using me to play wife and for a place for his kids to stay.
> 
> That wasn’t the only problem though. There’s more. About six months into us living together I found a note in his truck from another girl. Just saying how she thought he was awesome and she wanted to see him again. He said that it was a note from before me so I said ok, that could be true. Well, I have been cheated on the past so that put me in scared mode and I decided to check our cell phone records because we had a mutual account in my name. I found that he texted and called the girl he left for me a few times. When I called her she said that she didn’t know or text him. When I confronted him though he said it was his boss’s wife’s number. So I called her back and she said “why do you keep calling me? He’s my husband’s friend”. So that means that after I confronted him he called her and told her to say that and she listened. So what did that tell me right there? Doesn’t look good, right? Well, he talked his way out of it and I let it go….for the time being.
> 
> One night we were out drinking and I got belligerent drunk and I guess said some things he didn’t like. When we got to our place he back handed me. I fell to the ground and he drug me down the hall to my place. I was traumatized. Didn’t know what just happened or why. He left but I didn’t call the cops. I was so traumatized and scared. He came back the next morning and apologized and for some CRAZY reason forgave him. He hit me so hard that my jaw was messed up and I had to get a tooth removed from the back of my mouth. I should have left then, I know!
> 
> After this, of course it got worse. I needed to continuously check cause I didn’t trust at this point. It was hard to leave though cause I loved him. I thought that maybe I was crazy for checking and just needed to trust. Well, my birthday weekend I found that he was texting one of his ex girlfriends from years ago. When I called to confront her I said why are you texting him and she said that is none of your concern. Why was she so defensive? He talked his way out of that one. I couldn’t see what the texts said cause they were all deleted of course. But I did look at online account and they texted a ton for a few days. So what were they talking about? He talked his way out of it.
> 
> At this point I’m an abusive relationship. I got to the point where I thought it was me. I asked myself what if I didn’t check and act crazy? Would he be seeking attention from other women? What if I didn’t complain about playing step mom to his kids without marriage? Would he be treating me this way?
> 
> I always tried to talk to him about my insecurities and he would shut me down. Yell and not talk to me.
> 
> One night I was out working as I bartend from time to time and I got a call from my ex boyfriend who is a friend. He knows my boyfriend because they work for the same company. Well, anyway he called my daughter to get my number just to let me know that my boyfriend was at a bar with some other woman. My ex walked in on them having drinks. Now I know my ex wasn’t lying because first of all, why would he call my daughter in the middle of the night to tell me that and 2nd of all he said he saw them at the bar my boyfriend said he was at that night. I knew something was up. Just felt it in my stomach all day. Like something wasn’t right. He said he was with his best friend who he always answers in front of if I call and that day he wasn’t. He would only text and call from the restroom which I thought was fishy. So my ex said that he was there with her and as soon as my boyfriend and her saw him that they left their drinks at the bar and took off. I found out that she was a new woman who transferred to their company. A woman 10 years older than the both of us. My ex described her in detail. Well, I didn’t hear from my boyfriend until he got home at 3:30 in the morning and acted as if nothing was wrong. When I confronted him he lied and said that my ex was lying to get back with me. Guess what? I said, ok, maybe this maybe that. What if this, what if that and like a dumb ass let it go.
> 
> Well, I let it go as much as I could. I still need reassurance after that and wanted to talk things out but of course he would have his temper tantrums and tell me that I was crazy and that nothing happened and there was nothing to talk about. So we’d get into arguments because of my insecurity and at times he was violent when we were drinking.
> 
> I told myself when he was violent that it was my fault for getting beligerant drunk and arguing with him. I felt like I provoked him to do it. Especially when he stopped apologizing for it and would tell me that if I didn’t provoke him it wouldn’t happen. So again, abusive relationship.
> 
> While we lived together there were other things I noticed. Like when dong laundry, semen stains on his underwear when we weren’t intimate. He would just do fishy things like wash laundry before I got home. One time he came home and it appeared to have red lipstick on the lower part of his front shirt.
> A few months down the road I decided to check the cell phone records and guess what I find? A number that had crazy amounts of texts on a daily basis to this number I’ve never seen. I call it and find out it was that woman that my ex saw him at the bar with. When I confronted her and asked what was going on she was very defensive and said to take it up with him. When I asked him and he couldn’t lie about it anymore he said she was just a friend. Just a friend that I never heard of and someone he texted all day everyd ay until 5:00 when I got home. He talked his way out of it again and of course I felt like it was me. Maybe if I wasn’t so insecure and always questioning him then he wouldn’t look elsewhere. Because it did get to the point where I questioned his every move. I guess I had a good reason to, right?
> 
> So he never gave me closure. Didn’t talk about it. Would have hissy fits if I needed reassurance. I figured I deserved that and nothing. If I brought it up he would have rages and broke my bakers rack and a table chair once. Of course I thought well, if I didn’t provoke him right?
> 
> A few months down the road he was out of town and accidentally left his email up. Of course I checked and found an email between him and her. He had reached out to her and she had said “I seem happy now because I’m not so effed up over you like I was before. I can be a great friend if you ever want to let me in”. Well that to me means that something happened between them for her to be messed up over him and if they were friends before why was she saying she could be a good friend now. That she could show him the real her. At this point I lost it. I felt I had all the proof I needed.
> 
> When I called him and asked he hung up on me but texted that it’s not what it looks like. That they were just friends and she was crazy about him. Well, at this point like I said I had enough. I moved out of our home and got a new place. A week later, guess what? I find out that I’m pregnant!!!! Talk about timing, right? Well, I let him back in because I figured that we’d work it out and he did promise me that we’d get married and that things would be different.
> 
> We started to work on things. I had my new place and he stayed in our old house till the lease was to be up. Well, sadly I had a miscarriage. A week later we decided to have drink together after work but he was acting very strange like he was rushed. I said why rushing? Can’t we just spend time? He said that he needed to get home and be alone. I couldn’t understand why because we always spent time together and for some reason out of nowhere. Well, he called me crazy and said that everyone said I was crazy and threw me out of his house. The entire night I was so sad, crying and couldn’t sleep. Had the WorST feeling. Well, that morning I woke up and decided to drive by our old house together. Well, I saw a car in the driveway that wasn’t his so I went inside because the key was left in the door and I saw a bed made on the living room floor, wine glasses, etc. I started walking up the stairs and he was walking down. He said “what the hell are you doing?” I said what are you doing? He kept going down and I went up. Well, guess who was there in the bathroom? His ex that he broke up with before meeting me. Not his ex wife but his ex girlfriend after his wife. I couldn’t believe it. I was frozen in devastation. I started to walk out and asked him what the hell was going on and do you know that he grabbed me by the arm and made ME leave?????
> 
> Afterwards he called and said of course he didn’t touch her and that he made me leave because he was afraid I was going to hurt her and she did nothing wrong. They didn’t do anything. She was at a bar in the area, ran into each other. Lost her keys and needed a place to stay.
> 
> I FORGAVE HIM! At that point I was so afraid of losing him. I don’t know why. I mean, I did move out after the emails to that other woman but we were working things out when I was pregnant and this was ONE WEEK after my miscarriage that I find him the home that we lived together with someone else!
> He weaseled his way back into my life a week later by apologizing like crazy and saying he would never hurt me, is going to marry me, etc. Said everything I needed to hear. How dumb was I?
> 
> He likes to drink a lot and does cocaine from time to time and smokes marijuana every day. He drowns out his sorrows of his past life of what could have been with his children. He hates that he can’t see them everyday and hates that he feels he failed them. So he does his “extracurriculars” which is bad. He knows I don’t like that either. So I would nag him about that but it was never out of evil or trying to be a mom. I just know that he is a good person who makes bad decisions and has so much potential.
> 
> Well, FINALLY yesterday (two years later) after a few temper tantrums (not hitting) and us just not getting along. Him not proposing to me, me constantly whining about the kids and not wanting to be around them anymore, we just stopped getting along. Him not ever talking to me about how I’m feeling, etc. I decided to end it. I changed the locks, took the rest of his belongings out of here. He had hung up on me for no reason and it was the icing on the cake to EVERYTHING I’ve dealt with.
> 
> I’m so sad though and am wondering if this is the right thing. I keep thinking that maybe if I didn’t act like crazy insecure girlfriend and question him and nag and complain all of the time that he would have proposed to me and would maybe talk.
> 
> He always did thoughtful things like would draw me baths, make me dinners, let be who I am as far as being needy and insecure. Would call and check in all of the time. Came home everyday after work, etc. But I wasn’t happy with that. I felt like I needed more. A wedding ring and a commitment, etc. To talk when I was feeling insecure. He wouldn’t do those things though and I’m emotional and like to talk. He’s emotionally shut down and will not talk.
> 
> Well yesterday I had it. Told him that he is too stuck in his past to love anyone the right way and that I needed to get away because years of me trying and nothing has changed. That after years no proposal, no opening up to me, being angry, etc. He said he was sorry that he hurt me, will always love me and hopes I can forgive him someday.
> 
> Of course I can’t believe that he didn’t fight for me or beg me to stay. After all I’ve done and the good loving woman I’ve been to him? Well, when I called him to make arrangements to get the rest of his things I asked why he seemed so ok with it and he said “there you go, always wanting to hear what you want to hear when you want to hear it”. He said that he said what he had to say yesterday and I didn’t know that the few things he said translated to working things out? Haha…
> 
> So after we hung up of course I get the text of I love you, I can change my ways, etc. AFTER I complain that he didn’t fight for me. I told him that we needed this time apart and until he showed me that he has changed he can’t come back here.
> 
> So he hasn’t called or texted like he normally does. I feel like he’s ok with letting me go and it’s killing me. Or he thinks I’m bluffing because I’ve fake broken up with him before. I’ve never taken it to this extreme of changing the locks and moving all of his belonging to a storage unit.
> 
> I feel like this is my fault and if I would have just been happy, not nag and trust and not be crazy girl who checked or need to “talk” all of the time and not needed reassurance and just been confident and secure that I would have gotten him to be better and open up more.
> 
> Did I drive him away with my craziness? Or did he make me crazy and I’m thinking he’ll change, etc. If I change will he change?
> 
> Why isn’t he begging me and fighting for me? Or should I even care?
> 
> I apologize for the LONG thread but I really need some input and advice as I’m so torn. I wanted to get all of it out (and I think I’m leaving some out) so you can give me the best advice possible. I feel like I’ve been abused to the point of believing that it is me. I’ve completely lost myself and self esteem, etc. I feel nuts.
> 
> Any words are so appreciated. I look forward to the support I know you can offer me here.
> 
> Thank you in advance.
> 
> P.S. This is a total crazy story I know. After reading all of it typed out I’m like WOW. I’m very emotional and a mess right now. Can’t believe that my life has come to this craziness!!


If your problem is a text version of the Great Wall of China....Whatever it is...get rid of it. Seriously. I know it sounds like a joke. But if your problems could be a college dissertation, just remove it like a tumor.


----------



## IrishGirlVA

feeling_crazy said:


> This is my third abusive relationship. The other two weren't physical, *only* cheating and emotional.


Do not minimize abuse by using the word "only". Just because it was "only" cheating and emotional doesn't make it any less destructive. 

I am only speaking for myself but when I was in an emotionally abusive relationship I begged him once to just hit me as opposed to beating me down with words hour after hour after hour. It would have been over quicker. But of course there are others who are physically abused who would rather be verbally berated. 

My point is -- abuse is abuse is abuse. Tolerate none of it!


----------



## feeling_crazy

I like the abuse is abuse is abuse comment. That is so true. 

He texted an hour ago and asked if I could rub his neck. That he needs it bad. I said no and didn't hear back. 

I feel again that he's not taking me seriously and if I see him he'll try to seduce me. Unless, I meet him at a mutual place with my daughter? Or I could take the things to a mutual friends to get to him? I think seeing him is a bad idea. I'm already having a hard enough time hearing his voice and even reading a text from him.

I'm thinking I need to get it over and done with though. Suggestions?

Why is he making this harder? When will I start to feel better?

Are there books you can suggest on me learning to love myself again? For self confidence and self esteem?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## turnera

It's almost impossible to get self esteem from a book. You need therapy for that.

He is making it harder because that's what he does. You are a contest and he expects to win. You aren't a person to him, you are an object - to win, to control, to make him feel better. Just like the neck rub. That's your job - make HIM feel better. 

And expect him to go through the 'wheel' that abusers use - those things he knows will get a reaction from you. They usually include flattery, romance, then guilt, then anger, then threats to remove himself from you, anything else he knows will get you feeling guilty or notstalgic. He'll just ride through the wheel, trying this thing, then that thing, until he hits on something that works to get you to let him come home. At this point, it's just a competition to him; to see how he can get what he wants.

Please read Why Does He Do That? asap. It will explain everything.


----------



## turnera

Oh, and take his stuff to a friend's house and have them let him know it's there.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> He texted an hour ago and asked if I could rub his neck. That he needs it bad. I said no and didn't hear back.


So you still want to communicate with him. If you did not, you would have blocked his phone number.



feeling_crazy said:


> I feel again that he's not taking me seriously


Why should he? You are still letting his communications get through to you. He things that you are just playing a game with him. And to be honest, it’s starting to look like you are. If you were serious about breaking off with him you would make sure that he had no way to communicate with you.




feeling_crazy said:


> and if I see him he'll try to seduce me.


If he seduces you, it’s because you want him to seduce you. No one can seduce you without you wanting it.



feeling_crazy said:


> Unless, I meet him at a mutual place with my daughter? Or I could take the things to a mutual friends to get to him? I think seeing him is a bad idea.


Yes seeing him is a VERY BAD idea. Don’t do it. Do not put your daughter in the middle of this mess. Take his stuff to a mutual friend’s house. Let him pick it up there. How much stuff is it anyway? Back seat of your car, a pickup truck full? More than that?

Some people rent a storage unit for 30 days. Put the stuff in the unit and then email/text the combination to the lock. He then has 30 days to get his things.



feeling_crazy said:


> I'm already having a hard enough time hearing his voice and even reading a text from him.


So why are you talking to him and taking his texts? This is what I mean by having bad boundaries. You do not do the things necessary to protect yourself emotionally or physically.



feeling_crazy said:


> I'm thinking I need to get it over and done with though. Suggestions?


Get what over? Do you mean moving his things? Suggestion? Take them to a mutual friends or put them in a storage unit. Or get on craigslist and hire movers to come and get his things and deliver them to his place. There are the “two guys and a truck” kind of movers on craigslist that are pretty cheap. I’ve used them many times.



feeling_crazy said:


> Why is he making this harder? When will I start to feel better?


He does not believe you because you are not behaving like you are serious about breaking off with him.

You need to start owning up to your part in all this. You are leading him on by accepting texts and phone calls from him. You are wondering if he will seduce you (meaning you want him to). He knows you. He knows that you don’t mean what you say. And you have taught him that he’s so charming that you will give in to his charm every time. Why is this different that every other time? It’s a serious question. What are you doing different this time?




feeling_crazy said:


> Are there books you can suggest on me learning to love myself again? For self confidence and self esteem?


Self-Esteem: A Proven Program of Cognitive Techniques for Assessing, Improving, and Maintaining Your Self-Esteem... by Matthew McKay and Patrick Fanning

Healing Your Emotional Self: A Powerful Program to Help You Raise Your Self-Esteem, Quiet Your Inner Critic, and Overcome Your Shame by Beverly Engel


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

Word of warning: it's going to get harder. He'll ramp his efforts up even more the more you ignore him. He will try everything and anything to hurt you. I just went through this with my spouse; there were times I sobbed myself to sleep because his words hurt me so much. Expect him to say he'll kill himself without you, that his family will never speak to you again, that you're hurting your daughter by doing this, that he can't make it financially without you, that you are selfish, you are pushing him away and you are the reason the relationship has gone sour...

But it's a game to him right now, and it's a game YOU need to win.

Read over EleGirl's post, it has a lot of good insight for you and I think will help you a lot. And STOP RESPONDING TO HIM.


----------



## turnera

When I broke up with my mentally abusive fiance, he went out to my car and disabled it so I couldn't leave. Cold, calculating. I walked, literally, til I found a payphone to call a friend. After that, it was all the waterworks, he couldn't eat, sleep, had to drop out of school, etc. - all at my workplace, of course.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello again and thanks for the book recommends!

I keep re reading my list and for some reason I need to hear from you all that this is considered cheating. 

_*"We started to work on things. I had my new place and he stayed in our old house till the lease was to be up. Well, sadly I had a miscarriage. A week later we decided to have drink together after work but he was acting very strange like he was rushed. I said why rushing? Can’t we just spend time? He said that he needed to get home and be alone. I couldn’t understand why because we always spent time together and for some reason out of nowhere. Well, he called me crazy and said that everyone said I was crazy and threw me out of his house. The entire night I was so sad, crying and couldn’t sleep. Had the WorST feeling. Well, that morning I woke up and decided to drive by our old house together. Well, I saw a car in the driveway that wasn’t his so I went inside because the key was left in the door and I saw a bed made on the living room floor, wine glasses, etc. I started walking up the stairs and he was walking down. He said “what the hell are you doing?” I said what are you doing? He kept going down and I went up. Well, guess who was there in the bathroom? His ex that he broke up with before meeting me. Not his ex wife but his ex girlfriend after his wife. I couldn’t believe it. I was frozen in devastation. I started to walk out and asked him what the hell was going on and do you know that he grabbed me by the arm and made ME leave????? 

Afterwards he called and said of course he didn’t touch her and that he made me leave because he was afraid I was going to hurt her and she did nothing wrong. They didn’t do anything. She was at a bar in the area, ran into each other. Lost her keys and needed a place to stay. 

I FORGAVE HIM! At that point I was so afraid of losing him. I don’t know why. I mean, I did move out after the emails to that other woman but we were working things out when I was pregnant and this was ONE WEEK after my miscarriage that I find him the home that we lived together with someone else!
He weaseled his way back into my life a week later by apologizing like crazy and saying he would never hurt me, is going to marry me, etc. Said everything I needed to hear. How dumb was I?"*_

SOOOOOOOO...Even though I had moved from our home, I moved from our home because I found the emails to another woman but we decided to work on it because I became pregnant. Had a miscarriage and a week later he's in our home that we lived in with his ex girlfriend. Like he always made me think that it wasn't cheating because first of all, he didn't "touch" her and 2nd of all I had moved out. But I moved out because I found those emails to some other woman. Was it considered cheating? I feel like I need justification in my own mind.

Also, he just texted that he can get the rest of his things tomorrow. He has three boxes, two garbage bags of shirts and a guitar so it's not that much. He said "are you wanting to get my things out of there completely for finality?" He said "are your heart and head with me at all?"

So I guess again, I don't want to see him. Just trying to figure out how to get the rest of his things. I guess I could drop them off on a friends porch? Or maybe I'll look into having them delivered. I wonder if that is pricey though.

I'm struggling over here guys. I know this wasn't going to be easy but wow.


----------



## turnera

Come on, you're smarter than this. He's just manipulating you.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

YES it was cheating! This man is a sleaze! Put his crap out on the curb and tell him he has two hours to get it or Goodwill is picking it up! Then block his number!


----------



## iBolt

I can totally understand why you're still going over this as you are despite the caring advice you've been given especially by thos folks who still the battle scars from experience. Expecting otherwise from you would be like me asking my ex wife why she stopped taking her meds and thus putting our son's life in danger.

Nevertheless, you must sum up the courage to go and see a therapist. You clearly are not your very best self now as you cannot act in your own best interest. This is why I'm uncertain as to how well the recommended books will work in your case. 

You need to stop all communication with him. Pack his things and have him give you an address to bring them to. He'll be expecting you but do not go. Have someone else make the delivery. I really feel for you and I pray you'll recognise the power in you completely let this man go. You will find someone who will give you what you need. You're not old and the world is big enough
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Wiserforit

feeling_crazy said:


> , I don't want to see him.


People that have successfully manipulated us are a huge danger. We can't figure out how they are doing it, but it's working.

The only thing you can do is stay away from them.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> SOOOOOOOO...Even though I had moved from our home, I moved from our home because I found the emails to another woman but we decided to work on it because I became pregnant. Had a miscarriage and a week later he's in our home that we lived in with his ex girlfriend. Like he always made me think that it wasn't cheating because first of all, he didn't "touch" her and 2nd of all I had moved out. But I moved out because I found those emails to some other woman. Was it considered cheating? I feel like I need justification in my own mind.


Yes that is cheating. He told you that he was going to work things out with you. But then he has his not-so-ex in the house for the night. Of course he had sex with her. Stop trying to convince yourself that you did not see what you say. This is why you feel like you are going crazy. You are an intelligent woman. You know darn well what you saw. 

And so what if you moved out because he has emailing another woman. That makes two women he was cheating with at the time.

If you and he were standing at the top of the Golden Gate Bridge and he hold you to go ahead an jump because there is no way you will get hurt. Do you jump? Or do you listen to that voice in your head that says “Hey girl, that’s a 220 ft (like a 22 story building) drop into water. At that height it’s like hitting concrete.” I assume that you would not make that jump on his word. So why don’t you trust your own judgment for the lies he tells you when you are looking at the truth?



feeling_crazy said:


> Also, he just texted that he can get the rest of his things tomorrow. He has three boxes, two garbage bags of shirts and a guitar so it's not that much. He said "are you wanting to get my things out of there completely for finality?" He said "are your heart and head with me at all?"


Did you speak to him? Is that when he asked these questions? What was your answer?



feeling_crazy said:


> Also So I guess again, I don't want to see him. Just trying to figure out how to get the rest of his things. I guess I could drop them off on a friends porch? Or maybe I'll look into having them delivered. I wonder if that is pricey though.



Ok, he wants to do this on his own time. Do not agree to let him come over to your place tomorrow.

You does not have a lot at your place. So go drop it off at a friend’s house. Then tell the friend to call him and tell him. Then you send a text to him saying *“You things on xxxx’s porch. Do not not every call or text me again. Do not come by my place. I’m done.”* Send the text and block his phone number so you do not get his calls or texts.




feeling_crazy said:


> I'm struggling over here guys. I know this wasn't going to be easy but wow.


There is a woman here who went through a lot of this. Her name is Stella Moon. What really liberated her was when she finally took the advice to clean out the garage and put his stuff in storage. Doing that broke some flood gate for her. She found so much strength in doing that.

Try it. Take his tuff to a friends and then block him.

What keeps you going is wondering what he will do next, what he will say. And his stiff keeps a tie to you. 

You have to power to end this and make it much easier on yourself.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello - Thanks for confirming that it was, in fact cheating. It makes me feel stronger even though I knew that in the back of my mind.

I did speak with him yesterday when he said those things and I just said listen, this isn't easy for anyone. It has to be done. It's been years of trying to fix things and nothing. He said "all of our issues are fixable and you were the only one trying to fix them". I'm assuming that means he's TRYING to say that he will start working on them. Anyway, at that point I just said I have to go. Let me know about your things and said have a good night and hung up. He called me twice after and I didn't answer.

I did change his name in my phone to "Mr. No Good"

I'm here at work this morning and I'm having an incredibly hard time. Panic, anxiety and can't focus. I think that comes from the possibility of seeing him so I don't want to do it. I'm going to have my friend come and get his things and meet him.

I also am having this major panic and anxiety because again, it's all hit me, he's like my drug so I'm going through withdrawal, I'm scared of the future and it's just been years of this so it's all like hitting me now. I can't stop crying and I can't focus on what I need to do which is work.

I wonder if I spoke with my boss (who is the HR Director) and let her know honestly that I'm going through something and just need a few days to get through it. I feel like I just need to be home, in privacy to get most of the tears out and to just have some privacy while doing so.

Do you think that's a bad idea? Just curious if any of you have ever done that to get through a break up from an abusive relationship?


----------



## Princess Puffin'stuff

This is craziness.

Seriously, nothing is going to change until the OP starts to love herself. Focusing on what he did and what it is supposed to mean is futile. 

OP, please seek intensive therapy.


----------



## IrishGirlVA

To be honest, I'm surprised your are the most focused on his cheating. This is a man who put his hands on you. He violated your body. He manipulates a situation to make you feel like you are crazy. He knows that you are vulnerable to being emotionally abused. He knows that no matter what, you will second guess yourself and forgive. STOP LETTING THIS MAN MAKE A FOOL OUT OF YOU! His need to control you is stronger than his need to have you back in his life. He wants to win this battle but you need to win the war. He can swoon you every which way to Sunday because his end game is to win. 

And don't take his wonderful sweet words as a compliment. Look at it as him disrespecting your decision yet again. He doesn't care what is best for you. It's all about him!! 

Like one poster said, there is no book or manual you can read to gain self respect. That is a gift you need to give yourself. If you can't find the strength to do what is right for yourself then please find it for your daughter. If she had a choice she would not want this toxic man in her life but unfortunately, she doesn't have a choice. She relies on you to do what is best. And what is best is removing both of you from this situation.


----------



## IrishGirlVA

Oh, meant to add one more thing, sorry --

I think it is ok to take ONE day off work if that's really what you need to do but I found that being home alone only intensifies the sadness and desperation. You need to keep yourself busy. Personally, I don't recommend being in a place that only has memories of him around.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Yes, you’re right. I have been focused a ton on the cheating. I don’t know if that is because that seemed to happen more? Or because it hurt my pride because I felt the other woman was better than me? Anyway, I see what you’re saying.

I texted him this morning and I gave him the name of a place he can go to get his phone activated and I told him he has till Thursday. He said “wow, you’re really trying to push me out..get some work done”. Of course that ticked me off because like you all said I should have done so already without giving him notice but I sort of feel bad for him and don’t want him to be without so I gave him a friendly heads up. So instead of “thank you” it’s “wow you’re really trying to push me out..get some work done”. Typical ungrateful of him. 

He then texted and said “you’re pushing me out and I don’t want any of this. I want us without pressure, expectations, demands and entitlements”

I wrote back and said “you think this is what our relationship should consist of? That’s not a relationship. That’s you wanting something where you can do whatever you want and without me expecting things from you. I’m sorry but that’s not how it works”

He then said “you build a relationship out of will. Not out of “I deserve and you never” don’t tell me you’re the expert”

So I guess I was supposed to never express my feelings of what I needed and I was supposed to lie to him and tell him that he “DID” and was meeting my needs?

I’m so confused with how he thinks.

I know you said to cut his phone off and I am. He has till Thursday. 

I don’t think I should even respond anymore explaining myself a to why things are how they are. He doesn’t get it.

It's still his thinking and how things should go...he doesn't get that after all he's put me through he should have jumped through hoops to give me what I needed, period!


----------



## 3Xnocharm

Yeah, stop responding, you are only feeding the beast. Dont let him get to you, you are doing good! And I agree with Irish, go ahead and take a day, but then get back to work. It will give you something else to focus on, and shows your managers that you are dedicated even when things are tough personally.


----------



## IrishGirlVA

feeling_crazy said:


> I wrote back and said “you think this is what our relationship should consist of? That’s not a relationship. That’s you wanting something where you can do whatever you want and without me expecting things from you. I’m sorry but that’s not how it works”


*BRAVO!! *

:yay:


----------



## feeling_crazy

Yaaaayy!!! Right??


----------



## feeling_crazy

Well he responded with "you build a relationship out of will, not out of "I deserve and you never" Don't tell me you're the expert"

So of course I lost it on him and said: (sorry this is long) but I had to:

"I told you I deserved because I DO and you for some reason felt I didn't. I explained the NEVER to you and it was because you started to cut back on what it is I needed so if was hurting me and bothering me I kept talking to you to see if you would open your eyes to my needs and make a change. You took me telling you what I was needing as a personal attack. I never understood why. If you think that you were meeting my needs and what I did DESERVE from you than that's fine and your opinion. But that was a huge issue. You thinking that you were doing enough when I felt you weren't putting effort forth like you used to. I tried to talk with you about this numerous times and nothing changed so...and also, you're not the "expert" either. I feel like you're insulting me. I keep trying to explain and you always made me feel bad for doing that by not having a convo with me and shutting me down. We have on very FEW occasions had constructive heart to hearts. Maybe once or twice so that leads to an unhealthy relationship when both partners aren't willing to COMMUNICATE and work from both ends. No matter what I say though you won't look at it through my perspective. You have always thought what you wanted regardless so there is no point and why I feel that we're here today. Like you would always say "going in circles" and same ol same ol cause you refuse to open up. and I'm drained. There's SO much more I can say but I feel it's pointless cause of all that I said above. That's why we're done. Until you can learn what it takes to have a good relationship. You really need to start looking at other peoples perspectives and lose the know it all mentality of always having to be right. You don't have to let pride control your life. I'm done trying to explain."

I haven't heard a word back.

I hate how he tries to make me feel like it was my fault for feeling entitled and telling him that I deserved. Was I supposed to lie and fake that I was happy? He also always took everything as a personal attack.

He was so proud that when I would tell him I missed him complimenting me he said that I should wait for him to compliment me and that he would do it when he was ready. He didn't compliment me out of PRIDE because it was what I wanted WHEN I wanted it according to him.

Also, he would never talk because I wanted to talk when I wanted to talk. Not when he was ready. So I would sit back and wait and nothing happened. So again, he wouldn't talk because of pride because he felt that it was what I wanted WHEN I wanted it.

Like it's so twisted. His pride and narcissism has and will continue to ruin all good things in his life until he gets it together.

No word back.


----------



## turnera

You remind me of my first year with my DH. He proudly informed me that he didn't believe in giving gifts when you're 'supposed to,' meaning birthdays and Christmas. He preferred surprising someone with a gift (i.e. being the hero). So my birthday rolls around and he ignores it. I asked why and he repeated this nonsense. So when his birthday came around 6 months later, I ignored it. You would have thought I killed his mother, he was so upset. How dare I? I just shrugged and said 'you said you don't believe in having to give gifts, we skipped my birthday for that reason, so I figured I was supposed to do it, too.' He never purposely ignored my birthday again.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

feeling_crazy said:


> Well he responded with "you build a relationship out of will, not out of "I deserve and you never" Don't tell me you're the expert"


The easier and more direct response to this little a$$hole comment would have been "FVCK YOU". :smthumbup:


----------



## iBolt

Cough cough. From what you've written here and without the background of domestic violence to seriously consider, I would say that it would be really interesting to hear his side of the needs being met issues you raised. It is true that neither love nor affection should be forced out of people. In my view, these things just like respect comes naturally but with effort. While a person can nurture a plant, the flowers will boom in their own due time. 

For some men, the more a woman expresses a need, to him it will only sound like it is being demanded. Sometimes, the way it is communicated makes things worse. This gets his back up and he does not want to give in. You feel ignored and get mad and he responds negatively. So the waltz commences. 

Speaking from experience, I submit that I really do wish that more women will try to understand men (not that I am suggesting you do not)

However, as I said before, the history of serious domestic violence qualifies this chap for prison. There is no justification for that kind of treatment on you. 

Might I suggest that you keep your responses to him more succinct and purely focused on him collecting his stuff - no more no less. Do stop trying to conversate with him or teach him a lesson. He is right and you are hopeless without him in his view. I think you're wasting your time trying to reason with him.

* PS: I LOVE THE WAY YOU HAVE STEPPED UP YOUR GAME. YOU ARE DOING AN AWESOME JOB UNDER TERRIBLE CONDITIONS. GO GIRL *
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## doubletrouble

*Re: Feeling crazy! What has my life come to!*



feeling_crazy said:


> Am I thinking right in that IF I were the BEST, most trusting and confident woman in the world that he wouldn't have cheated and treated me the way he did?


No, if You were THAT woman, you never would've given him the time of day to begin with. Stop making this YOUR fault.


----------



## iBolt

doubletrouble said:


> No, if You were THAT woman, you never would've given him the time of day to begin with. Stop making this YOUR fault.


Agreed. Totally.

People who cheat do so because they're rarely satisfied and willing to 'settle' for what they have. Watch the TV. You'll frequently hear stories of A-List celebrity couples both of whom look gorgeous and seem to have everything going for them. Suddenly they're getting divorced because one cheated. So madam, this ain't nothing about you. Your partner is a pathological liar that is also an expert manipulator. You're heading in the right direction. Stay the course but do please be careful for your safety. If he sees his control over you weakening, he could become more aggressive. Be careful
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## feeling_crazy

iBolt said:


> Cough cough. From what you've written here and without the background of domestic violence to seriously consider, I would say that it would be really interesting to hear his side of the needs being met issues you raised. It is true that neither love nor affection should be forced out of people. In my view, these things just like respect comes naturally but with effort. While a person can nurture a plant, the flowers will boom in their own due time.
> 
> For some men, the more a woman expresses a need, to him it will only sound like it is being demanded. Sometimes, the way it is communicated makes things worse. This gets his back up and he does not want to give in. You feel ignored and get mad and he responds negatively. So the waltz commences.
> 
> Speaking from experience, I submit that I really do wish that more women will try to understand men (not that I am suggesting you do not)
> 
> However, as I said before, the history of serious domestic violence qualifies this chap for prison. There is no justification for that kind of treatment on you.
> 
> Might I suggest that you keep your responses to him more succinct and purely focused on him collecting his stuff - no more no less. Do stop trying to conversate with him or teach him a lesson. He is right and you are hopeless without him in his view. I think you're wasting your time trying to reason with him.
> 
> * PS: I LOVE THE WAY YOU HAVE STEPPED UP YOUR GAME. YOU ARE DOING AN AWESOME JOB UNDER TERRIBLE CONDITIONS. GO GIRL *
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Hi iBolt - The issue with me and what I needed was never anything out of line. After so many years of mental and physical abuse and being cheated on my self esteem went down the drain. I stopped caring about how I looked. Stopped dressing up so often, etc. When I DID take the time to dress up and that was a huge deal I just wanted to hear from my significant other that he thought I looked nice. Just something...anything! So I would say something along the lines of "do you like my new shirt?" or "how is my eye shadow? I have a new color on?" and he'd respond and then I'd say well, you didn't even seem to notice jokingly. Then at times I would tell him "I feel like you don't compliment me anymore or make me feel special like you used to". He told me that he didn't compliment me because I didn't let it just happen. That's when I would say it's because it never happens anymore. It's just nice to hear from my boyfriend that HE thinks I look nice. It's nice to hear that you're still attracted to me.

So yes, maybe I was needy but again I went from this self confident woman who he mad feel BEYOND beautiful to being barely noticed towards the end. So yes, I felt extremely insecure. Especially after all that happened. So was that being too needy?

Also, when I would want to discuss things likes finances (cause he's horrible with them) I'd try to get him to talk to me about a budget and he would flip out and shut down. Turned it into an argument. I was only trying to help him. A couple of times he asked to borrow money AFTER he spend his pay on cocaine. He knew I knew this so when I asked him what he spent all of his money on (sarcastically) he got defensive. I didn't appreciate him spending his money on cocaine and then needing a loan from me to make ends meet that week. So of course I'd need to have a conversation about that and he'd flip out. Walk away like a kid. 

At about two years and four years I wanted to talk about marriage to see where his head was on that and if he had any intention of marrying me and he would say "why do you have to ask me?" "why can't you just let things happen?" "why do we need a piece of paper to make you happy?" He would never just say things in loving way. For example, along the lines of I definitely want to marry you and I love you, I'm just broke now and am saving...but NO he could NEVER say anything like that. It was always very defensive and like I was annoying him.

So I would tell him why can't you say things this way to make me feel better about it, etc. and I don't know. I feel that after ALL that he has put me through the LEAST he could do is talk to me.

Believe me he would say "let things happen" and I've waited for YEARS for him to initiate a constructive conversation or a heart to heart. 

So now, iBolt I'm wondering...did I approach that the wrong way and make him feel like less of a man? Or was what I was asking for normal? 

I'm starting to question myself over here and that's not good...


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello everyone - UPDATE to the soap opera saga...

After those texts earlier I texted and said that his things are with my friend and that he won't be seeing me today.

He called and said to please not give his things to anyone else because he doesn't want anyone touching his things. I said you're not getting me or understanding me and he said here we go again. I don't get you and he hung up on me!

So I texted and said here we go again. Some things never change. You would hang up on me in the middle of conversation like you've always done. Are you the person who said he would change? This is why I'll never believe you nor fall for your trap again. you have no respect for me to hold a normal conversation. This is why its over. Cause I deserve better than being hung up on all of the time. I say you don't get it because you're acting like you don't. I wasn't telling you what you're not. I'm saying you don't understand me. If this has been such a huge issue for you and you need to turn crap around on me then you should be happy to be rid of me, right? Again, hang up in the middle of conversation cause that's what we were just having about your things. I can't deal with it anymore!!! Please don't text or call again.

So THEN he texts "Tell any of your future husbands they don't get it 1000 times, that they never do, that they couldn't just say, that they didn't say quick enough, that they don't talk enough, that they can't hold a conversation, that they'll never change, that they don't see your perspective, that they are just putting it back on you, over and over and see how exhausted the other guy is, even though he hasn't done a damn thing!"

So he texts me again to tell me that I told him what he's not, etc. tries to guilt trip me...

Or should I feel bad? 

I mean after all I endured does he expect me to be happy when he is still giving me crap after I forgave him? Am I wrong?

I had talked to my brother at this point about all that happened and he was blown away of what I've endured. He said I can't believe you took him back into your life after you walked in on him and his ex in YOUR home. He was disappointed and totally understands. He, along with you all got me super fired up so I sent him not the nicest text because I've had it with his manipulation.

I said "My FUTURE husband won't have put me through the things that I've FORGIVEN you for but have not FORGOTTEN!! Me taking you and your children back into my life and giving you my heart and soul after your first cheating episode and after catching you with that other piece of trash in the home we shared was a GIFT to you!! You should have never taken advantage of that!! You should have been better to me, married me like you promised but you lied to get back in and you expect me to not resent you after all the **** you pulled even AFTER taking you back into my life?? WHATEVER!! I should have left you for your mistakes a LONG time ago!! How DARE you make me out to be the bad guy!! You will NEVER manipulate me into feeling I was wrong again!! EVER!! My actions towards you were a result of how you treated me!! To think that you still don't take any accountability and place all blame on me is beyond disgusting!! My future HUSBAND will get the best of who I am!! The woman you lost out on!!"

So that was my fired up text!!

So..ready to hear what he responds with?! "That's a pretty ugly thing to say, guess you don't get it. I have been and will remain sexually faithful to you even in this trial. Put a race horse in a stall and tell him everything he's not and he's gonna buck"

I can't believe he said TRIAL! So I wrote back with "You can argue all you want. There is no "trial" I made the decision to never put up with your **** ever again! Your things are with my friend and you can pick it up tomorrow on your way home. You can reach her at......"

So then he responds "you don't have to give me thing to anyone hard ass. You can drop them off in the driveway"

THEN he texts "who have you been talking to?"

So now I'm talking to someone else? 

Like I'm just blown away. I feel that I was mean with my last text but I don't understand what he expects from me. To be this happy go lucky woman when I was getting the short end of the stick.

Am I wrong here at all?

iBolt? Do you think I'm wrong? Cause I feel like I'm questioning...


----------



## EleGirl

He is using all the things in the past that got you to take him back. He’s using the things that confused you and made you feel guilty, unsure of yourself, etc.

He does not believe you, for example “this trial”, because you have never stuck by your word before. 

He asked who you are talking to because he know you and believes that there is no way in hell you’d stand up to him like this without a strong support system.

This might very well escalate now. He has used violence against you in the past. As you can see he’s starting to come unglued. He is losing control of you. So he might up the anty now. I would not be surprised if he comes by your place and tries to gets violent.

This is very important. Please, for your safety do the following:

Text him and say: “I repeat, you stuff it at xxxx’s house. Nothing of yours is at my place. You have no reason to ever come here again. This is a warning. Do not come near my home. If you do I will call the police and file charges for stalking. If you get violent as you have in the past I will file charges. DO NOT CONTACT ME EVER AGAIN.”

Once you send that you cannot ever contact him again either. Do not pick up your phone. The best way to handle this is for you to block his number.

If he shows up at your door, DO NOT OPEN THE DOOR. Through the door tell him to leave.. TELL HIM THIS ONE TIME. If he does not leave call 911. 

Do you know how to record using your cell phone? Record everything that goes on while he’s at the door. Use the video if you have to.

If he approaches you anywhere outside your home. Do not have conversation with him. Just turn on y our cell video and clearly tell him to get away from you because you are afraid of him based on past abuse. If he does not leave call 911.

Your life could very well be at risk. Typically women are killed on the 3rd time they try to leave an abusive husband/significant-other. Just be careful. He's escalating.

ETA: IF he’s at your door, when you call 911 and/or are recording what’s going on, do not yell or talk to him except to tell him to leave. If you yell a lot or try talking to him as you have via text you might come off as hysterical.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Like I'm just blown away. I feel that I was mean with my last text but I don't understand what he expects from me. To be this happy go lucky woman when I was getting the short end of the stick.
> 
> Am I wrong here at all?
> 
> iBolt? Do you think I'm wrong? Cause I feel like I'm questioning...


STOP THIS. You were not mean. You telling him the way things are now. He's trying to push you.

You were not wrong. You were right. 

Go read your list again.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

This is getting childish, stop texting him, he doesnt deserve a response. You have nothing to question, you are doing the right thing, start following your instincts and stop questioning them!

STOP TALKING TO HIM.
STOP TALKING TO HIM.
STOP TALKING TO HIM.
STOP TALKING TO HIM.
STOP TALKING TO HIM.
STOP TALKING TO HIM.
STOP TALKING TO HIM.
STOP TALKING TO HIM.
STOP TALKING TO HIM.
STOP TALKING TO HIM.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Elegirl - I'm in a panic over here about being unsafe. Seriously having an anxiety attack. I thought that but do you think he's risk going to jail with his two young daughters? 

I feel like throwing up right now cause what if he tries to hurt me or my daughter? I'm beyond scared right now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## turnera

Don't you DARE go get his stuff from your friend's, either.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> Elegirl - I'm in a panic over here about being unsafe. Seriously having an anxiety attack. I thought that but do you think he's risk going to jail with his two young daughters?
> 
> I feel like throwing up right now cause what if he tries to hurt me or my daughter? I'm beyond scared right now.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Do you have someone who can stay with you guys for a few nights?


----------



## feeling_crazy

Yes I can ask someone. What difference will that make though? Can I get a restraining order against him now?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## EleGirl

He might very well take the risk. You have never called the police on him. He would not expect you to do anything. 

This is all about control. He needs to be in control of you and if it takes beating the crap out of you to get you back in his control he might just do it.

Is there someone who can come stay with you?

What can you do to secure doors and windows in your place?

I hope you are safe. But it's good to plan for the worst.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Yes I can ask someone. What difference will that make though? Can I get a restraining order against him now?


It does a lot of good to have someone else around. He's less likely to do anything if someone else is with you. 

If there is someone else there, they can call 911 if needed. 

Someone else can be a witness and tell the cops what happened.


----------



## feeling_crazy

I can ask someone. Can I get a restraining order?

I have the door bolted, chain locked and a chair in front of it.

I can't breathe I'm so scared!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## EleGirl

I don't think you can get a restraining order until he does something.

Do you know any attorneys or police officers who you can call and ask if in your jurisdiction they will do the base on past physical abuse. 

What state do you live in. We could help you look stuff up.

I know that here where I live I can go to the court hours and file for a restraining order. But it has to be done during regular business hours.

A few years ago my son and I helped a young lady. She was 18, her male roommate (not her bf) had started to make physical advances on her and he was starting to get rough. So we went over to load all of her things onto our truck and move her to my place for a while. The roommate called, said he was on his way over and threatened her. So we called 911. They sent two officers over who took a report. They wrote a temporary restraining order against him. It was good for a week or so. They told her that she would have to go to the court hours and see a judge for a more permanent order.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> I can ask someone. Can I get a restraining order?
> 
> I have the door bolted, chain locked and a chair in front of it.
> 
> I can't breathe I'm so scared!!


Get control over the fear. The fear is part of what he used to control you. Get mad. Get angry. How dare he do what he's done so that you now feel this way with fear for you and your child.


Use that anger for the strength you need. Do some deep breathing to calm yourself down.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi everyone – Hard to sleep last night after the warning Elegirl gave me. Made it through the night ok, though. Thank goodness! The physical was years ago. Nothing crazy for about two years now. He only did it when we argued and if it was a HUGE argument. About 7 times over the last five years. Again, last time was about two years ago. So do you think that trait is gone? Only comes out when pushed?

Just feeling nervous over here.

He did a few weeks ago tell me “you should be slapped” cause I told him that he wasn’t doing something I wanted..I think I told him that he “never” makes me feel special anymore. We were arguing because he didn’t make it home after being at his best friends where he got too drunk to drive so I told him to stay there. We argued the next day because I told him that he wasn’t a frat boy anymore and why can’t he just have a few beers at a normal limit with his friends and just make it home at a decent time? So of course that escalated into other things and I told him he didn’t make me feel special anymore and some other things and that’s when he said “you should be slapped for making those things up”. Didn’t hurt me though.

So I guess, yes, it’s still verbal. Would that stop if I had stopped?

I’m having a hard time this morning because he texted me “I’m dying without you. I don’t know what to do without my best friend and lover” and then just a minute ago he texted “good morning”. I haven’t responded.

I can’t stop thinking about the good things to you guys. Just the sweet things he did for me. How he isn’t gross like some of my exes were, lol. When I say gross I mean, farting, belching, etc. He was very vain about that stuff, very clean, always dressed nice. Super funny and when thoughtful so thoughtful so this morning I went into a panic because I thought what if he changes and what if this and that.

I know he won’t change according to you all but it’s still weighing down on me. I haven’t eaten in days it seems. 

Just having a hard time. Missing him. Praying that I did make the right decision and praying for strength. Just needing some refreshed words of encouragement again that I am doing the right thing.

P.S. His phone will be shut off by this Friday. In the meantime hearing from him is hard. Especially when he says he's dying without me and misses his best friend because that's what I thought we were. Best friends and lovers. Just so sad. I can barely take it.

UPDATE: He just emailed:

_I want you to be happy, I want to be happy. I know the things I need to do and I know the things you want. I know the things you need to do also. Even though you think you do everything, and all you think about is pleasing me, that was not the case. I was not pleased or happy either for multiple reasons, particularly life altering events. I'm hoping to reach you someday soon, and I am concerned it will be too late because you are so adamant about what you "deserve", from your new husband. Please stop being vindictive with your words and with my personal items. _

WHAT THE HELL?? I get that he was sad about his parents passing. I get that but yes I feel strongly that ALL I did was to please him. 

Out of EVERYTHING he could say this is what he says????

Do you see how I feel that I'm wrong? Like I was wrong and he viewed me as not doing things to please him? I'm so confused. Do I need to change?


----------



## turnera

Yes, you do need to change. You need to stop blaming yourself. Learn to love yourself and be ok WITHOUT A MAN. Only then can you safely HAVE a man.

He's still trying to control you, make you feel weak, make you second-guess yourself, by telling you what YOU do wrong. That's how abusers often control their victim - making them doubt themselves.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> he's dying without me and misses his best friend because that's what I thought we were. Best friends and lovers. Just so sad. I can barely take it.


Exactly his intention. He KNOWS that those words are what will get you to take him back. So he says them.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

Dont cave, ignore that email. He is SO full of sh!t. You know this. Stop questioning every little thought you had and move you made. You are finally doing the right thing for yourself, stay the course.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi everyone - He just called and said that he doesn’t want his things in anyone else’s hand. To please not give it to my girlfriend. That we don’t need to have other people involved in our business. That it’s the biggest slap in the face for me to do that to him. I said WHAT do you propose then because I CANNOT and DO NOT WANT TO SEE YOU!! He said to take them to his best friends and I told him I don’t want to go over there either. 

He said why are you rushing to get my things out of there anyway? I said don’t you need them?? He said all I need is God and water. I said you have your best friends tax papers in there and your work keys. You don’t need them? He stayed quiet so I said what do you want me to do? Leave you the storage key? Then you can call and I’ll leave. He said never mind and I said ok, never mind then and hung up.

Like he keeps saying why do I want to rush his things out and he doesn’t get why...he said my things aren’t even in your apartment, they’re in your storage unit and you’re rushing to get them out? 

He said you never want to see me or talk to me again? I said I already said what I said.

I think I’m going to have to lie and give those things to my girlfriend anyway and have her drop them off when no one is there. 

He doesn't get that those things still tie him to me and I need it all gone so I can move forward!

Why is he making this so difficult???? I’m tempted to just throw the crap away!!!


----------



## turnera

Don't get in that conversation with him again. You already TOLD him what you will/did do. It's up to him if he wants his stuff or not, and if he does, he goes to your friend's house. Period.

NOT YOUR PROBLEM ANY MORE.

The way he was talking to you, you are still together. You're NOT. The way you're acting now? It's how people act after they have broken up. Start thinking like a single person, not his partner.


----------



## turnera

And STOP TAKING HIS CALLS.


----------



## feeling_crazy

I forgot to say when I talked to him he said "are you talking to anyone" and I said no, why do you keep asking me that?

He said because I feel like you're already seeing someone else.

I told him I wasn't and I'm just moving forward with my life.

After I hung up he said "I'm sorry, I'm just incredibly stressed right now"

I feel sort of bad for him although I shouldn't. Why is my heart so big?

I'm afraid now that he's stressed that I need to worry even more about him snapping.

I want to stay calm and cool and try not to upset him too much. cause I'm afraid.


----------



## turnera

Abusers always think you've found someone else because it can't possibly be THEM that you're getting away from.


----------



## feeling_crazy

So his things are out. We all know I've been wanting his things out like yesterday. Earlier I texted and said that I want to gt this done and over with because his things here still tie me to him and we're done and I need to move forward with my life. He didn't respond.

Well, I don't know what came over me but I texted him and said if you're in the area, I'll take your things down to my car and leave them in there unlocked and you can come and get them. He said ok. He just left.

He called when he got here because I guess the door relocked after awhile to unlock it and I did. I forgot to take down his plant from his dad's funeral and guitar pic so I told him that I had it and if he wanted me to bring them down. He said, no, not right now. I said, so you don't want me to come down and he was very stand offish and said, "no, stay there".

So I saw him for one second through the window and I'm completely out of my mind hysterical. I can't believe that seeing him for one second would get me this way.

I know that I did one of the hardest parts and this is progress, however, I do miss him like crazy. I feel like I want to die right now.

I also don't get how he goes from telling me all of those sweet things this morning to completely being stand offish and not even wanting to see me. I know I SHOULDN'T care but I just don't get that. It sounded like he was crying though. 

Why the change in attitude and demeanor? Is that part of the game?

I'm just thrown off. 

And hysterical. I know I did the right thing but I can't help feeling crushed right now. I also can't believe seeing him for one second from far would do this.

Again, hard part done. I'm still moving forward but I got that done and over with.

Why is this hurting so much more now? I just want to feel better.

I still can't believe that he just acted that way. Jekyl and Hyde. Is that part of his game? I just need to know.


----------



## iBolt

feeling_crazy said:


> Hi iBolt - The issue with me and what I needed was never anything out of line. After so many years of mental and physical abuse and being cheated on my self esteem went down the drain. I stopped caring about how I looked. Stopped dressing up so often, etc. When I DID take the time to dress up and that was a huge deal I just wanted to hear from my significant other that he thought I looked nice. Just something...anything! So I would say something along the lines of "do you like my new shirt?" or "how is my eye shadow? I have a new color on?" and he'd respond and then I'd say well, you didn't even seem to notice jokingly. Then at times I would tell him "I feel like you don't compliment me anymore or make me feel special like you used to". He told me that he didn't compliment me because I didn't let it just happen. That's when I would say it's because it never happens anymore. It's just nice to hear from my boyfriend that HE thinks I look nice. It's nice to hear that you're still attracted to me.
> 
> So yes, maybe I was needy but again I went from this self confident woman who he mad feel BEYOND beautiful to being barely noticed towards the end. So yes, I felt extremely insecure. Especially after all that happened. So was that being too needy?
> 
> Also, when I would want to discuss things likes finances (cause he's horrible with them) I'd try to get him to talk to me about a budget and he would flip out and shut down. Turned it into an argument. I was only trying to help him. A couple of times he asked to borrow money AFTER he spend his pay on cocaine. He knew I knew this so when I asked him what he spent all of his money on (sarcastically) he got defensive. I didn't appreciate him spending his money on cocaine and then needing a loan from me to make ends meet that week. So of course I'd need to have a conversation about that and he'd flip out. Walk away like a kid.
> 
> At about two years and four years I wanted to talk about marriage to see where his head was on that and if he had any intention of marrying me and he would say "why do you have to ask me?" "why can't you just let things happen?" "why do we need a piece of paper to make you happy?" He would never just say things in loving way. For example, along the lines of I definitely want to marry you and I love you, I'm just broke now and am saving...but NO he could NEVER say anything like that. It was always very defensive and like I was annoying him.
> 
> So I would tell him why can't you say things this way to make me feel better about it, etc. and I don't know. I feel that after ALL that he has put me through the LEAST he could do is talk to me.
> 
> Believe me he would say "let things happen" and I've waited for YEARS for him to initiate a constructive conversation or a heart to heart.
> 
> So now, iBolt I'm wondering...did I approach that the wrong way and make him feel like less of a man? Or was what I was asking for normal?
> 
> I'm starting to question myself over here and that's not good...


Feeling_better (there, I gave you a new name )

I am very sensitive to your predicament and do not wish in any way to encourage you for one millisecond to question the urgent need for you exit this relationship.

So, I will be a politician (which I am) and circumvent your question by saying the real issue as things stand now is nothing to do with needs being met or how you approached this chap. The real issue is that you need to get yourself into a physically, emotionally and spiritually safer place. 

I declare an interest in that my stbx said some of the things you're saying and I responded in some of the ways your partner did i.e shutting down, responding negatively to being told 'how' I should respond to a cue from her. I just didn't like that kind of thing. I do understand that there is a love game that goes on in relationship where either parties does things expecting something in return from the other BUT I think there's a fine line between this and manipulating one's companion.

Irrespective of this, it cannot and does not justify the way you have been treated by this man. Please, I plead with you, recognise the goodness in you. You need not internalise so much the terrible things that have happened in your past. Both good and bad will claim their own at some point - so those who have violated you will reap their rewards accordingly. Do what you can to gain control of your life and not rely so much on external sources for internal security. 

Humans are humans and are by nature fallible. To place your happiness or security in the hands of one person is akin to Obama entrusting US national security to the Afghan or Pakistani government. Take charge of you; ALL of you - I see you are already doing so. Don't stop now


----------



## EleGirl

If you still have the plant and the poster, take them to you friends. He can pick them up there. Do you see why we told you to take his things to someone else’s place? If you had done that, you would not be in such turmoil right now. 

You keep talking to him on the phone, you have him come over to your car to get his stuff and then you offer to take a few things that you forgot to him at the car. 

It sounds like you want to talk to him and see him. 

Let’s pretend for a minute that he’s crying. So what. He’s probably been with other women this week as well. It’s not like you are the only women in his life. Keep that in mind.

I’m sorry if I scared you last night. That was not my intent. My intent was to just help you be prepared for the worst, with the hope that it would never happen.


feeling_crazy said:


> Again, hard part done. I'm still moving forward but I got that done and over with.
> 
> Why is this hurting so much more now? I just want to feel better.
> 
> I still can't believe that he just acted that way. Jekyl and Hyde. Is that part of his game? I just need to know.


If you had taken his things to your friends you would not feel so bad right now. While you are moving forward, you keep creating opportunities to talk to him, see him, etc. The reason you feel so bad is that you are no protecting yourself. 

Yes it’s part of his game. He might really be crushed at the moment. Then in the next moment he’ll blame it all on you. And then he’ll call up another woman, go on a date and enjoy himself. 

He apparently lives on a rollercoaster. You are trying to get off that rollercoaster but cannot quite get off yet. I say that because you have not blocked his calls and you had him come to your place and get his stuff and then offered to take more out to him (meaning that you wanted to see him).


----------



## feeling_crazy

Yes, I know that I'd get yelled at for not taking that part of advice but honestly, I didn't want to have my girlfriend have to do it because they hate each other and I figured "how hard could it be?' That's what I honestly thought. So I said, ok just come and do it so we can get it done and over with.

I am proud of myself for taking this step, although I should have approached it differently. I really did not want to see him because I knew this would happen BUT I figured I'd be stronger. I was wrong there. It's ok though. I have to keep plugging forward. 

I called the cell phone company and in order to avoid a huge cancellation fee I cancel it on the 20th of this month. In the meantime, I am logging online to block him from being able to reach me or my daughter. 

IF he wants to reach me he'll do it via email I'm sure. I'm going to have to ask at work if there is a way to block that as well.

So no, I didn't want to see him because I knew it'd be hard not realizing that even seeing him from the top of a balcony where I live in a mid rise would effect me. I didn't even get the details of his face it was so brief. 

So again, thank you for your support. I'm staying as strong as possible although super hard.

But yes, I'm wanting off of this roller coaster ride. I never thought a year ago that I'd even be to where I am today with this so this strength is all new and out of nowhere. Just wish I felt a bit stronger.

P.S. He did make me feel bad for telling me or pretty much saying in his own words that I would drive my future husband crazy too. That really hurt me because I feel like he still views the bad and how I didn't communicate how he wanted me to vs. seeing the great woman I was to him, minus those few things.


----------



## iBolt

feeling_crazy said:


> Yes, I know that I'd get yelled at for not taking that part of advice but honestly, I didn't want to have my girlfriend have to do it because they hate each other and I figured "how hard could it be?' That's what I honestly thought. So I said, ok just come and do it so we can get it done and over with.
> 
> I am proud of myself for taking this step, although I should have approached it differently. I really did not want to see him because I knew this would happen BUT I figured I'd be stronger. I was wrong there. It's ok though. I have to keep plugging forward.
> 
> I called the cell phone company and in order to avoid a huge cancellation fee I cancel it on the 20th of this month. In the meantime, I am logging online to block him from being able to reach me or my daughter.
> 
> IF he wants to reach me he'll do it via email I'm sure. I'm going to have to ask at work if there is a way to block that as well.
> 
> So no, I didn't want to see him because I knew it'd be hard not realizing that even seeing him from the top of a balcony where I live in a mid rise would effect me. I didn't even get the details of his face it was so brief.
> 
> So again, thank you for your support. I'm staying as strong as possible although super hard.
> 
> *But yes, I'm wanting off of this roller coaster ride. I never thought a year ago that I'd even be to where I am today with this so this strength is all new and out of nowhere. Just wish I felt a bit stronger.*
> 
> _WRONG! WRONG! UBER-WRONG! It DID come from somewhere. It came from you. You have all the strength you need to see this to a decisive end. You are only just discovering it bit by bit. More good surprises await you...courtesy of - you guessed it... YOU!!! _
> 
> P.S. *He did make me feel bad for telling me or pretty much saying in his own words that I would drive my future husband crazy too.*
> 
> _Ahhh. The classic trick of controlling manipulators. "You'll never get anywhere without me". "I am the best thing that ever happened to you and now you'll return to the gutter from whence you came". They'll even be so kind as to give you advice on how to live your 'next life' away from them.
> 
> Just ignore it all. They're the desperate cries of a vile dying king who sees his kingdom slipping away from him. In other words, you're winning and he knows it. Enjoy _
> 
> *That really hurt me because I feel like he still views the bad and how I didn't communicate how he wanted me to vs. seeing the great woman I was to him, minus those few things.*
> 
> Apart from the fact that you still have blood running through you and you have a heart, why do you care what he says? You must be brutal and yet fair (cos you don't want be like him) in ridding yourself of this man.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Yes, I know that I'd get yelled at for not taking that part of advice but honestly, I didn't want to have my girlfriend have to do it because they hate each other and I figured "how hard could it be?' That's what I honestly thought. So I said, ok just come and do it so we can get it done and over with.
> 
> I am proud of myself for taking this step, although I should have approached it differently. I really did not want to see him because I knew this would happen BUT I figured I'd be stronger. I was wrong there. It's ok though. I have to keep plugging forward.


I can understand this. It was a big step. At least most of his stuff if gone. Now that you know how seeing him affects you, just have someone take the couple of other things to his place and leave them at the door. 


feeling_crazy said:


> I called the cell phone company and in order to avoid a huge cancellation fee I cancel it on the 20th of this month. In the meantime, I am logging online to block him from being able to reach me or my daughter.
> IF he wants to reach me he'll do it via email I'm sure. I'm going to have to ask at work if there is a way to block that as well.


Good, blocking him from calling is a good idea. 
Generally you can block emails as well. 
Keep in mind that while you can block his number, he could just call you from another number. So be prepared for that. If he calls on another number, as soon as you hear his voice just say “Do not call me and hang up.”

If he emails you, never respond quickly if at all. Let it sit for 24 hours so that you can collect your thoughts. And only respond if absolutely necessary.



feeling_crazy said:


> But yes, I'm wanting off of this roller coaster ride. I never thought a year ago that I'd even be to where I am today with this so this strength is all new and out of nowhere. Just wish I felt a bit stronger.


Remember that a journey of 1000 miles starts with one step. You are doing great.


feeling_crazy said:


> P.S. He did make me feel bad for telling me or pretty much saying in his own words that I would drive my future husband crazy too. That really hurt me because I feel like he still views the bad and how I didn't communicate how he wanted me to vs. seeing the great woman I was to him, minus those few things.


He accomplished what he wanted to accomplish… he has you now feeling badly about yourself and back on the rollercoaster. Stop it.

What do you mean that you did not communicate the way he wanted you to? Please explain.


----------



## feeling_crazy

iBolt, thanks for the new name. I 'm kinda liking that one better! 

Elegirl, the other things he won't be seeing. I'm going to dispose of the plant. Unfortunately, it's almost a goner. Lets just say I don't have a green thumb, lol.

When I say didn't communicate, I guess I always used words that were considered "extreme", for instance I used the word "never" a lot and he hated that. He said I made him feel like less of a man. I can honestly say that I did always say you NEVER compliment me, you don't make me feel special anymore, you never talk to me, etc.

I just always complained. I mean, even when it came down to some of the music he listened to. I was a control freak. I stopped compliment him and telling him sweet things, etc. I guess that came from not being happy with the situation and in reaction to him withdrawing from me and not giving me what I needed.

I guess I keep going in circles.

I did check the cell phone records cause I was curious and said what do I have to lose if I find something and I actually didn't find anything. I know that doesn't mean he wasn't doing anything behind my back. For all I know is he could have been more on top of it and didn't chance it considering he knew I had the option to although I hadn't in about two years. 

So I saw the nothing in the cell records and then I was thinking of what iBolt said in how I communicated and I'm just wondering again IF I had been more trusting, happy go lucky, complimentary, not questioning, whining, demanding and more confident would have things been different?

I just want to make sure I did all I could and I want to know ONE MORE TIME that who I was didn't cause how things went down? WHY am I feeling responsible and guilty?????

His ex wife even told me that he had deep rooted issues and that he had anger issues with her and that he even had a cocaine issue when they were married. That was years ago. 

I guess I need to keep telling myself that. He did that with her as well. She said he didn't cheat on her but I think she was so busy cheating on him that she didn't care to pay attention or notice.

I really need to stop taking the blame for the down fall. I already apologized for where I was wrong. Unlike him, the good that I did far outweighed the bad which the bad I feel was brought upon by him.

I'm drained...yet relieved...yet sad...yet curious....yet still "what iffin'g"...what a big jumble of emotional madness 'aye?

One thing at a time, I guess. One step at a time.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> iBolt, thanks for the new name. I 'm kinda liking that one better!


Ask a moderator if they will change your name for you… it’s worth a try….


feeling_crazy said:


> I did check the cell phone records cause I was curious and said what do I have to lose if I find something and I actually didn't find anything. I know that doesn't mean he wasn't doing anything behind my back. For all I know is he could have been more on top of it and didn't chance it considering he knew I had the option to although I hadn't in about two years.


Ok now you did that. Don’t do it again. Your attitude needs to be that you do not care if he calls someone else. He’s out of your life.


feeling_crazy said:


> When I say didn't communicate, I guess I always used words that were considered "extreme", for instance I used the word "never" a lot and he hated that. He said I made him feel like less of a man. I can honestly say that I did always say you NEVER compliment me, you don't make me feel special anymore, you never talk to me, etc.
> 
> I just always complained. I mean, even when it came down to some of the music he listened to. I was a control freak. I stopped compliment him and telling him sweet things, etc. I guess that came from not being happy with the situation and in reaction to him withdrawing from me and not giving me what I needed.
> 
> I guess I keep going in circles.





feeling_crazy said:


> So I saw the nothing in the cell records and then I was thinking of what iBolt said in how I communicated and I'm just wondering again IF I had been more trusting, happy go lucky, complimentary, not questioning, whining, demanding and more confident would have things been different?
> 
> I just want to make sure I did all I could and I want to know ONE MORE TIME that who I was didn't cause how things went down? WHY am I feeling responsible and guilty?????


You need to accept that you were not perfect. No one is. But you did not cause him to cheat or abuse you emotionally or physically. 

You are solely responsible for your actions. He’s solely responsible for his actions.

Let’s say for a minute that you were a screaming, nagging screw (worst case). Ok, so it drives him nuts. He has a choice of how he will handle it. Here are the three choices that come to mind:
1)	He could do the right thing and talk to you. Figure out what both of your needs are then the two of two of you set about meeting each other’s needs. And even go to MC w/you. 
2)	He could leave you if he decided that it was too much.
3)	Or he could cheat, lie, berate you, hit/abuse you. 
He had choices and he chose #3. That’s his choice.




feeling_crazy said:


> His ex wife even told me that he had deep rooted issues and that he had anger issues with her and that he even had a cocaine issue when they were married. That was years
> 
> I guess I need to keep telling myself that. He did that with her as well. She said he didn't cheat on her but I think she was so busy cheating on him that she didn't care to pay attention or notice.


Yep, look at the pattern of his behavior. The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior.


feeling_crazy said:


> I really need to stop taking the blame for the down fall. I already apologized for where I was wrong. Unlike him, the good that I did far outweighed the bad which the bad I feel was brought upon by him.


Yep, you do.


feeling_crazy said:


> I'm drained...yet relieved...yet sad...yet curious....yet still "what iffin'g"...what a big jumble of emotional madness 'aye?
> 
> One thing at a time, I guess. One step at a time.


 One day at a time.


----------



## iBolt

feeling_crazy said:


> *iBolt, thanks for the new name. I 'm kinda liking that one better! *
> 
> _Haha. Given all the efforts and huge strides you're taking, your current screen name does not suit you at all._
> 
> *When I say didn't communicate, I guess I always used words that were considered "extreme", for instance I used the word "never" a lot and he hated that. He said I made him feel like less of a man. I can honestly say that I did always say you NEVER compliment me, you don't make me feel special anymore, you never talk to me, etc.
> 
> I just always complained. I mean, even when it came down to some of the music he listened to. I was a control freak. I stopped compliment him and telling him sweet things, etc. I guess that came from not being happy with the situation and in reaction to him withdrawing from me and not giving me what I needed.*
> 
> _Shhhh. There's a dude on here. His name is Uptown. This is one of the behaviours (according to him) that identify someone that's BPD. He may notice your post soon. PS: Might you be my stbx? I can tell you that for me, when my wife used those words exactly as you used them, it always (and I meant that) made me feel that everything else that I am doing counts for nothing - so why bother to keep trying. However, your use of exaggerating words does not justify the treatment you have had. The cheating, lying etc nuh nuh. Don't carry his can. It's his._
> 
> *So I saw the nothing in the cell records and then I was thinking of what iBolt said in how I communicated and I'm just wondering again IF I had been more trusting, happy go lucky, complimentary, not questioning, whining, demanding and more confident would have things been different?*
> 
> _PLEASE READ MY POSTS CAREFULLY! I sincerely do not think there is anything you could have done to make him relate differently to you. You are a vulnerable woman. You met a man who was a predator of vulnerable women. You played the role needed to make him stay. Simple. Now you're seeing the light and he's getting mad. I repeat - I do not believe that there is anything more you could have done. Even "IF" there was, I wouldn't ask you to do so because you or nobody should be in a relationship with a person who behaves this way to their partner. REMINDER - This man hit you "so hard that my jaw was messed up and I had to get a tooth removed from the back of my mouth."_
> 
> *I just want to make sure I did all I could and I want to know ONE MORE TIME that who I was didn't cause how things went down? WHY am I feeling responsible and guilty?????*
> 
> Maybe we should conduct a poll here on TAM which would go something like this:
> 
> Dear TAM expert. Having considered the matter of Feeling_better,
> 
> _
> Do you think there is more she could have done to save her relationship? YES or NO
> If YES, would you advice her to return to the relationship in an attempt to save it? YES or NO
> _
> 
> *I'm drained...yet relieved...yet sad...yet curious....yet still "what iffin'g"...what a big jumble of emotional madness 'aye?*
> 
> _I know the feeling very well_
> 
> One thing at a time, I guess. One step at a time.


----------



## turnera

CRAZY, no matter how you feel, the two of you do NOT belong together. Know you made the right decision.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Howdie everyone!

iBolt – I would actually like to have a TAM Administrator put a poll together. I’m curious to see what everyone thinks, however, I have a feeling that they may all say I did the right thing. I didn’t even know it was an option. Can we do that?

Turnera- Yes, I know no matter how I feel I made the right decision. 

I guess for some reason, right now I keep going back to the reason that I finally lost it and had enough, which I don’t think I explained on here. He was out of town last week on a work assignment. He normally would invite me to meet him for a day or two cause it’s a quick drive and this time he didn’t so of course, my non-trusting paranoid suspicious feelings kicked into play. I let it go though. Said, just try to trust and I did, however, on Monday night he disappeared on me for a few hours and wouldn’t answer my calls or text back. All while he was supposedly having drinks with male co-workers. He did eventually but it was from a restroom. Then he was so drunk that when I asked him where he was he didn’t even know. He called me the next morning STILL drunk before he went into training. Then on Wednesday, the night before he was heading home the next day, same thing. Disappeared for a bit and then when he did call, he called from a restroom. I did speak to him later that night before I went to bed.

Next morning, it’s around 8am and I hadn’t heard from him. He normally calls around 6:30-7:00 like clockwork to check in. So I called his cell phone and he picked up the phone and didn’t say anything. He just sat there as I kept on saying hello, hello, hello. I thought maybe bad connection so I hung up and called his hotel room. He picked up and said “well it’s gonna be a beautiful day, huh?” Sounded completely drunk or out of it. I said, you’re late, haha. He said I know, where were you at 6:00 to wake me up then? I said, still sleeping but I saw the time and hadn’t heard from you so I just thought I’d check in and make sure you were on the ball. Then I said late night, huh? And he said “oh yah”. So I said what did you guys wind up doing? And with that he SLAMMED the hotel phone down and hung up on me. I couldn’t believe he did that and I didn’t understand why so I called the room back and he picked up the phone and hung it up. Me still not understanding why he hung up like that I called the room back and this time he picked it up and put it down on a table. I could hear him moving around the room. Because of history I immediately go into a panic and start thinking that he’s in there with someone else. I mean, WHY ELSE would he have acted that way after I asked him what did you wind up doing last night?

So I go into thinking the worst and panic mode and that’s when I snapped and said I cannot take feeling this way anymore. He finally called an hour later and said “I was running late and getting around” I said, ok that’s fine, I get that but you don’t think that you could have just said baby, I’m running late and I need to get around vs. hanging up on my face when I ask you what you did last night? I don’t get what I did to deserve that. He said “like I said, I was running late…must everything be about you?” and hung up on me AGAIN.

So that’s when I sort of lost and said enough is enough. I’m done with this crap. Firstly, because I didn’t appreciate him being so rude. I mean, WHO does that? And 2nd because those feelings of when he cheated in the past came rolling in again and I don’t want to feel that way anymore.

So again, I’m thinking did I really break up with him over a hang up? But in the grand scheme of things I need to remember that it was because of EVERYTHING and that was just the icing on the cake.

After reading that, that seems pretty legit, right? It’s just too much.

Again, just needing reassurance because I’m thinking again, hang up? Really? But it’s been years of treatment like that. Hanging up in the middle of conversations, walking away and that one because of my non trust that he brought into my life I couldn’t handle it anymore. I just lost it and said enough is enough.

So I thought I would tell you all what finally threw me over the edge to say it’s done.

*P.S. I just created a poll and I did it incorrectly. How do I delete and resubmit? *


----------



## turnera

I always say, think of your mom watching this. Would she be happy with what you accept? If not, DON'T.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Howdie everyone!

iBolt – I would actually like to have a TAM Administrator put a poll together. I’m curious to see what everyone thinks, however, I have a feeling that they may all say I did the right thing. I didn’t even know it was an option. Can we do that?

Turnera- Yes, I know no matter how I feel I made the right decision. 

I guess for some reason, right now I keep going back to the reason that I finally lost it and had enough, which I don’t think I explained on here. He was out of town last week on a work assignment. He normally would invite me to meet him for a day or two cause it’s a quick drive and this time he didn’t so of course, my non-trusting paranoid suspicious feelings kicked into play. I let it go though. Said, just try to trust and I did, however, on Monday night he disappeared on me for a few hours and wouldn’t answer my calls or text back. All while he was supposedly having drinks with male co-workers. He did eventually but it was from a restroom. Then he was so drunk that when I asked him where he was he didn’t even know. He called me the next morning STILL drunk before he went into training. Then on Wednesday, the night before he was heading home the next day, same thing. Disappeared for a bit and then when he did call, he called from a restroom. I did speak to him later that night before I went to bed.

Next morning, it’s around 8am and I hadn’t heard from him. He normally calls around 6:30-7:00 like clockwork to check in. So I called his cell phone and he picked up the phone and didn’t say anything. He just sat there as I kept on saying hello, hello, hello. I thought maybe bad connection so I hung up and called his hotel room. He picked up and said “well it’s gonna be a beautiful day, huh?” Sounded completely drunk or out of it. I said, you’re late, haha. He said I know, where were you at 6:00 to wake me up then? I said, still sleeping but I saw the time and hadn’t heard from you so I just thought I’d check in and make sure you were on the ball. Then I said late night, huh? And he said “oh yah”. So I said what did you guys wind up doing? And with that he SLAMMED the hotel phone down and hung up on me. I couldn’t believe he did that and I didn’t understand why so I called the room back and he picked up the phone and hung it up. Me still not understanding why he hung up like that I called the room back and this time he picked it up and put it down on a table. I could hear him moving around the room. Because of history I immediately go into a panic and start thinking that he’s in there with someone else. I mean, WHY ELSE would he have acted that way after I asked him what did you wind up doing last night?

So I go into thinking the worst and panic mode and that’s when I snapped and said I cannot take feeling this way anymore. He finally called an hour later and said “I was running late and getting around” I said, ok that’s fine, I get that but you don’t think that you could have just said baby, I’m running late and I need to get around vs. hanging up on my face when I ask you what you did last night? I don’t get what I did to deserve that. He said “like I said, I was running late…must everything be about you?” and hung up on me AGAIN.

So that’s when I sort of lost and said enough is enough. I’m done with this crap. Firstly, because I didn’t appreciate him being so rude. I mean, WHO does that? And 2nd because those feelings of when he cheated in the past came rolling in again and I don’t want to feel that way anymore.

So again, I’m thinking did I really break up with him over a hang up? But in the grand scheme of things I need to remember that it was because of EVERYTHING and that was just the icing on the cake.

After reading that, that seems pretty legit, right? It’s just too much.

Again, just needing reassurance because I’m thinking again, hang up? Really? But it’s been years of treatment like that. Hanging up in the middle of conversations, walking away and that one because of my non trust that he brought into my life I couldn’t handle it anymore. I just lost it and said enough is enough.

So I thought I would tell you all what finally threw me over the edge to say it’s done.

UPDATE: He texted today and said, "please out of respect for me don't post pics showing your cleavage on Facebook"

I felt insulted by that! He always tried to make me feel like that's all that men looked at. Like that's all I have to offer is my looks. Yes, I'm endowed in that area so how am I supposed to hide that? Crop my entire body out? 

Then he texted an hour later: "Sorry, I will ALWAYS love you and think you're beautiful!!! We've been through too much baby!! Have a great REST of the day!!"

Like is he nuts? He keeps switching his moods up with me? 

I can't wait till I can delete his line on the 20th! Cause he's really starting to weird me out. One minute he's sad, the next he misses me and the next he's ok and accepting it?

What's the deal??????

I realized another red flag I should have noticed when we first started dating. I had pictures from years stored on my personal laptop. When he moved in with me he went through and deleted all of my pics that were with men (ex's and just friends). I couldn't believe he had the audacity to do that!! It was my laptop and some of those pics were precious to me. So I should have noticed that along with that he hit his ex as a HUGE red flag. Signs of a controller maybe?

*One more thing....I just created a poll and I did it incorrectly. How do I delete and resubmit?
*

THANKS!!! Hope to hear from you all soon! Missing my support system today!


----------



## turnera

Abusers will switch through the 'wheel' of what works. He may try guilt; if that doesn't work to get you to let him back in, he'll try anger; if that doesn't work, he'll try romance; etc. All the things that used to get you to crumble and doubt yourself or miss him or be scared of him, he'll keep trying all of them, one after another, to see which one works, to get what he wants.

It's what they do.


----------



## turnera

Have you gotten that book I recommended yet?


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi Turnera - I am reading The Manipulative Man at the moment. The books that you all recommended were not available at the half price bookstore that I went to so I went with this one and so far so good. Very interesting. I skipped straight to the Abusive Manipulator section although I think he falls under narcissist as well. I will read from front to back when I'm done with the abusive section.

He texted "I can't believe that I'm sitting here without you by my side. I don't even feel like myself. It's so surreal"

This is so very hard on me. I took tomorrow and Monday off to feel what I have to feel and hopefully be better by Tuesday.

I just don't see it happening with him continuously texting me and saying these things. 

Why won't he just let me go? Why does he have to make this so difficult?

I'm really sad. I'm feeling so lonely. So many thoughts in my head.

Scared he'll find someone else and be better to her. I know odds are slim but I'm afraid she'll get the portion of him that I love which I miss so much.

I just need support.

It's hard because it's been five years that we came home to each other everyday and hung out, made dinner together, went to bed together. This was seriously almost every day and night for five years. 

That's tough to let go of so I understand his text saying he doesn't even feel like himself and it's surreal because I'm feeling the same way.

I hate this. Every second of it. I have been through a break up before but NOTHING like this one. 

Please keep your support coming as you have. I'm feeling sadder and sadder and I'm supposed to be feeling stronger and stronger. 

Well, I'm having my moments. One minute ok and the next horrible. More horrible than ok.

It would help if he just let me go. Again, why so difficult for him to let me?

Because I'm a challenge and chase now? Because he wants to mooch off of me and not live on his own? because it's a control thing? Because he really loves me?

Just keep setting me straight....PLEASE


----------



## EleGirl

Is there anyway u can block his calls and texts? 

If not u can txt him that u do not want him to contact you ever again. From here on out you will consider it harassment and stalking. If he does not stop you will get a restraining order against him for staulking you.

You already told him to stop contacting you right? After that any contact is harrassment. He is not respecting you at all. More of his usual disrespect.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## iBolt

feeling_crazy said:


> Howdie everyone!
> 
> iBolt – I would actually like to have a TAM Administrator put a poll together. I’m curious to see what everyone thinks, however, I have a feeling that they may all say I did the right thing. I didn’t even know it was an option. Can we do that?
> 
> Turnera- Yes, I know no matter how I feel I made the right decision.
> 
> I guess for some reason, right now I keep going back to the reason that I finally lost it and had enough, which I don’t think I explained on here. He was out of town last week on a work assignment. He normally would invite me to meet him for a day or two cause it’s a quick drive and this time he didn’t so of course, my non-trusting paranoid suspicious feelings kicked into play. I let it go though. Said, just try to trust and I did, however, on Monday night he disappeared on me for a few hours and wouldn’t answer my calls or text back. All while he was supposedly having drinks with male co-workers. He did eventually but it was from a restroom. Then he was so drunk that when I asked him where he was he didn’t even know. He called me the next morning STILL drunk before he went into training. Then on Wednesday, the night before he was heading home the next day, same thing. Disappeared for a bit and then when he did call, he called from a restroom. I did speak to him later that night before I went to bed.
> 
> Next morning, it’s around 8am and I hadn’t heard from him. He normally calls around 6:30-7:00 like clockwork to check in. So I called his cell phone and he picked up the phone and didn’t say anything. He just sat there as I kept on saying hello, hello, hello. I thought maybe bad connection so I hung up and called his hotel room. He picked up and said “well it’s gonna be a beautiful day, huh?” Sounded completely drunk or out of it. I said, you’re late, haha. He said I know, where were you at 6:00 to wake me up then? I said, still sleeping but I saw the time and hadn’t heard from you so I just thought I’d check in and make sure you were on the ball. Then I said late night, huh? And he said “oh yah”. So I said what did you guys wind up doing? And with that he SLAMMED the hotel phone down and hung up on me. I couldn’t believe he did that and I didn’t understand why so I called the room back and he picked up the phone and hung it up. Me still not understanding why he hung up like that I called the room back and this time he picked it up and put it down on a table. I could hear him moving around the room. Because of history I immediately go into a panic and start thinking that he’s in there with someone else. I mean, WHY ELSE would he have acted that way after I asked him what did you wind up doing last night?
> 
> So I go into thinking the worst and panic mode and that’s when I snapped and said I cannot take feeling this way anymore. He finally called an hour later and said “I was running late and getting around” I said, ok that’s fine, I get that but you don’t think that you could have just said baby, I’m running late and I need to get around vs. hanging up on my face when I ask you what you did last night? I don’t get what I did to deserve that. He said “like I said, I was running late…must everything be about you?” and hung up on me AGAIN.
> 
> So that’s when I sort of lost and said enough is enough. I’m done with this crap. Firstly, because I didn’t appreciate him being so rude. I mean, WHO does that? And 2nd because those feelings of when he cheated in the past came rolling in again and I don’t want to feel that way anymore.
> 
> So again, I’m thinking did I really break up with him over a hang up? But in the grand scheme of things I need to remember that it was because of EVERYTHING and that was just the icing on the cake.
> 
> After reading that, that seems pretty legit, right? It’s just too much.
> 
> Again, just needing reassurance because I’m thinking again, hang up? Really? But it’s been years of treatment like that. Hanging up in the middle of conversations, walking away and that one because of my non trust that he brought into my life I couldn’t handle it anymore. I just lost it and said enough is enough.
> 
> So I thought I would tell you all what finally threw me over the edge to say it’s done.
> 
> UPDATE: He texted today and said, "please out of respect for me don't post pics showing your cleavage on Facebook"
> 
> I felt insulted by that! He always tried to make me feel like that's all that men looked at. Like that's all I have to offer is my looks. Yes, I'm endowed in that area so how am I supposed to hide that? Crop my entire body out?
> 
> Then he texted an hour later: "Sorry, I will ALWAYS love you and think you're beautiful!!! We've been through too much baby!! Have a great REST of the day!!"
> 
> *He knows you are winning. He is a dying vile king that knows he is losing it all. Expect more of these mind twisting stuff. If you prepare yourself for it, there'll be no surprises eh! He knows you better than you know yourself it seems..ha smart man*
> 
> Like is he nuts? He keeps switching his moods up with me?
> 
> I can't wait till I can delete his line on the 20th! Cause he's really starting to weird me out. One minute he's sad, the next he misses me and the next he's ok and accepting it?
> 
> What's the deal??????
> 
> I realized another red flag I should have noticed when we first started dating. I had pictures from years stored on my personal laptop. When he moved in with me he went through and deleted all of my pics that were with men (ex's and just friends). I couldn't believe he had the audacity to do that!! It was my laptop and some of those pics were precious to me. So I should have noticed that along with that he hit his ex as a HUGE red flag. Signs of a controller maybe?
> 
> *One more thing....I just created a poll and I did it incorrectly. How do I delete and resubmit?
> *
> 
> 
> *I tried doing your poll thing, it was mad confusing  No idea how you delete*
> THANKS!!! Hope to hear from you all soon! Missing my support system today!


----------



## anchorwatch

iBolt said:


> BLOODY HELL!!!
> 
> LET HIM GO


:iagree:


----------



## iBolt

feeling_crazy said:


> Hi Turnera - I am reading The Manipulative Man at the moment. The books that you all recommended were not available at the half price bookstore that I went to so I went with this one and so far so good. Very interesting. I skipped straight to the Abusive Manipulator section although I think he falls under narcissist as well. I will read from front to back when I'm done with the abusive section.
> 
> He texted "I can't believe that I'm sitting here without you by my side. I don't even feel like myself. It's so surreal"
> 
> This is so very hard on me. I took tomorrow and Monday off to feel what I have to feel and hopefully be better by Tuesday.
> 
> I just don't see it happening with him continuously texting me and saying these things.
> 
> Why won't he just let me go? Why does he have to make this so difficult?
> 
> *1. It is not his job to let you go.
> 2. It is YOUR job to let you go*
> 
> 
> I'm really sad. I'm feeling so lonely. So many thoughts in my head.
> 
> *You are little different to a recovering drug addict. You need your fix. Don't be tempted by the bait. HE is not the solution to your loneliness, sadness etc.*
> 
> Scared he'll find someone else and be better to her. I know odds are slim but I'm afraid she'll get the portion of him that I love which I miss so much.
> 
> *Holy crap!!!
> 
> 1, She will also get the part of him which you hate. (Do you still envy her now?)
> 2, What is it with you what he does with his life after you? Remember you don't own him
> 
> As human beings, we are social creatures of habit. Why do you think battered women sometimes remain in a brutal relationship? "The devil you know" saying is no joke! You still have your rose tinted glasses on - TAKE THEM OFF!*
> 
> I just need support.
> 
> It's hard because it's been five years that we came home to each other everyday and hung out, made dinner together, went to bed together. This was seriously almost every day and night for five years.
> 
> That's tough to let go of so I understand his text saying he doesn't even feel like himself and it's surreal because I'm feeling the same way.
> 
> I hate this. Every second of it. I have been through a break up before but NOTHING like this one.
> 
> Please keep your support coming as you have. I'm feeling sadder and sadder and I'm supposed to be feeling stronger and stronger.
> 
> Well, I'm having my moments. One minute ok and the next horrible. More horrible than ok.
> 
> It would help if he just let me go. Again, why so difficult for him to let me?
> 
> *
> REPEAT-
> 1. It is not his job to let you go.
> 2. It is YOUR job to let you go*
> 
> Because I'm a challenge and chase now? Because he wants to mooch off of me and not live on his own? because it's a control thing? Because he really loves me?
> 
> Just keep setting me straight....PLEASE


*At some point you will need to own your stuff. I understand what you're going through. I am having the same as well but the happier and thoroughly satisfied I am with myself and the more peace I feel, the less I doubt decision. I know I am not an idiot and would not be filing for a divorce on a whim. You need to trust yourself madam.*


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> It would help if he just let me go. Again, why so difficult for him to let me?


IBolt is right. It's not up to him to let you go. You are the one dumping him. He is a game player and abusive control freak. He'll keep trying as long as you give him a way to communicate with you. And so far you are allowing him to communicate with you. YOu have the power to stop this but are not. Why not?

Why haven't you blocked his number yet?



feeling_crazy said:


> Because I'm a challenge and chase now? Because he wants to mooch off of me and not live on his own? because it's a control thing? Because he really loves me?


Not because you are a challenge. You have not been a challenge for a long time.

Yes he wants to mooch off you and not live on his own. He want you to pay his way so that he has more money to date other women. He is a user. There is a rule... "Never do anything for a man over 4 years old that he can do for himself." Memorize that. He can support himself. Why were you letting him mooch off you? It's something for you to think about.

Yes it's a control thing. He feels like THE BIG DUDE when he abuse, controls and beats on you. That gives him control over you. Think of it this way. He's a guy who needs a punching bag. You filled that role pretty well. So not it's time stop filling that roll.

He will treat the next woman the way he treats you. He has to because he as mental problems that control him.



feeling_crazy said:


> Just keep setting me straight....PLEASE


OK


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello all!

Elegirl - I'm not able to block his number because our lines are on the same account and I'm not able to cancel his line until the 20th to avoid another monthly payment plus the early termination fee.

I get that it's not up to him to let me go. It's up to me. I feel like I'm getting stronger than one second the next I'm weak again.

I was thinking about how everything went down and I feel like throwing him out unplanned with financial issues, no money saved, while he was still mourning the death of both his parents, etc. was harsh. I feel like I've forgiven him for worse in the past and didn't kick him out then and then to go and do all of this because he hung up and to have his world come crashing down on him was mean and not loving.

He gave me lots of money as well so he wasn't saving because he was providing to me. He wasn't rich because so much money went to child support but he did support as much as he could when he could and I appreciated that. Then again, he spent money on weed, etc. 

He was financially set back because he got his car repo'd two years ago, would take constant pay day loans out to make ends meet and then get overdrafts from not paying those back, etc. I guess he was just a financial wreck. I have to keep that in mind. 

I know that him staying here until he found a place though wouldn't have been good. We probably would have kept with the same routine but I'm wondering is that what I should have done? Was that the loving and right way to approach it?

I have a big heart and I can't help but to feel heartbroken for him and guilty at the same time.

I wasn't that understanding while he was mourning and I made everything about me. You're not complimenting me, you're not making ME feel special, etc. I mean, I was good to him at the same time though. 

Is this normal? Was the way I approached harsh of me? 

Am I just trying to find an excuse to let him back into my life because It's too hard to handle being without him? 

What an emotional roller coaster ride this is! WOW! I'm seriously ALL over the place! I thought that after the break up is when things are done and you just start moving forward. I'm still an emotional mess and going in circles just like I was prior to me breaking up with him.

I haven't heard from him since yesterday early evening and he ALWAYS reaches out by 8:00 am like clock work so although I know it's best that he don't reach out to me because it makes it hard I'm sad that he hasn't reached out to me.

It's like I don't want to hear from him but I do. 

Is he just realizing that it's over and moving on or is this just another tactic he's trying thinking that by not reaching out and going silent I'll want to reach out to him?

Well, he just did text so why is that I feel relieved when he does but at the same time it makes me sad? This is the hardest thing I've ever had to do. Because I love him. I was hoping for a miracle of change but IF he were going to change wouldn't he have changed what he needed to when I kept telling him what I needed?

Or was I a spoiled needy brat? 

Did I approach this the wrong way? What can I do or tell myself to make myself think differently. On top of being hurt and missing him now I'm feeling guilty on top of it. 

I guess I just need to keep reminding myself of the bad. 

Help, please!


----------



## 3Xnocharm

STOP FEELING GUILTY!! The man is a sleaze, and treated you like sh!t! Just keep reminding yourself of that! He is worthless, and he used you. Everyone has told you that you did the right thing, so start believing us. Try to start focusing your energy elsewhere, away from him. Start focusing on your future, and letting go of the past.


----------



## turnera

Yes, you're just making excuses. If he wants to man up and become a better partner, he can - from somewhere else. He has issues, you have issues, and neither of you was improving while together. Now you both have reasons to do so. Let him prove to you that he can grow up and do the right thing. Once things have calmed down, maybe you can talk to him again - from another home. You're not his parent, let him be a man and deal with his own crap. Maybe starting with no more weed. He'll never do that while you continue to baby him.


----------



## EleGirl

You will be up, down and all over emotionally for a while. That’s just normal. But you have to weather this to get to the other side; to the calm.
Ok so you were not perfect. Who is? The relationship you had with him was a soul killer. That’s all that matters here. The relationship was bad for you. And he was abusive both physically and emotionally. He’s a serial cheater. 

Every time you tell more about him it gets worse. He’s not “just” a cheater and an abuser, he’s also unable to live within his means. Come one you don’t need a man like this. He might be charming but at his age it’s going to fade fast now… especially with his drinking and hard living. Then you are going to be left with an old, worn out SOB who is a cheater, abuser and financially irresponsible. Just think of that image.

You need to start changing your thoughts. Every time you start this crazy thinking, stop yourself and think of something that relaxes you. Do you like the beach? Think of yourself sunning on your favorite beach. As humans we do not have control over what pops into our minds. But we have control over what he allow to dominate our thoughts. We have the self-awareness to recognize a harmful thought, to stop thinking it, and to think of a good thought.

Here’s a video for you. It’s about the “happy secret to better work”. But if you apply the things he tells you to do to your personal life… you will improve your life and through this breakup a lot faster.. plus this guy is really funny. The laughs will do you a lot of good.

Shawn Achor: The happy secret to better work | Video on TED.com


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi everyone – He just called from an unknown number and I did answer and we just talked on the phone for an hour. Yes, an hour. A lot of the stuff was the same, he was very cordial and actually talked and explained that we could never move forward if I were stuck in the past. That I reminded him of what he did wrong every time we argued. I said because when you did something wrong to me my thinking was like seriously?? After this man has pulled all of this stuff and I’ve forgiven him for it he can still act this way? 

I told him that I’ve tried to forgive and that I’ve given it my best shot but that I just don’t think that I can ever forget and that will always be an issue in our relationship. 

We pretty much talked about the same things we’ve talked about forever but in a more constructive fashion. At the end I said what is it that you’re wanting from me exactly right now? He said that he just wants for us to take this time apart to better ourselves and work on our issues individually and that he wants is us to come back together healthy and happy so we can move forward the way we’re supposed to. 

I told him that I don’t know if that’ll ever be because I don’t know if I can move forward ever from what he’s done to me. That I gave it my best shot and I was holding on because I was praying for a miracle to happen but it didn’t so I needed for my own sanity and mental well being to move on.

I told him that we both have our issues and by us being together those issues weren’t getting worked out. Isn’t wasn’t healthy for either of us.

I also confirmed (so he could feel better) that I don’t plan on dating. I guess, not to only make him feel better but also because I don’t want to or plan to. I need to heal first. 

I told him that I feel that we rushed into things after his separation from his ex wife and he still had emotional baggage. He said maybe at first but not anymore.

I said bottom line is we both have issues. I don’t trust you and I don’t know if I ever can. There has been too much damage done. I told him that the smallest thing would throw me into a panic and I don’t want to feel that way anymore.

He said I keep saying damage and that is just negative talk and not moving forward. I said, I really can’t help it. It’s the truth. Damage has been done and that’s that. I was diagnosed with PTSD because of all of it. It’s not a joke.

He told me that he is looking for a place out by his girls, and that I don’t like even more because the girl that I caught him with lives over there. Well, in the next town over. So IF we ever came to a point that we were going to try and work it out that if he lived there it would never happen. I get that he can see anyone in any house he lives in but just something about what happened when I saw them together and thinking that she’s that close, etc. that it would just be too much to handle. So that confirms this again.

He said I don’t plan on talking to that woman ever again and who knows…she could be married, she could live out of state..he asked how I knew and I told him I know because I do know (I know people who know her).

So a lot was said and for once it was a constructive conversation and I feel ok after it, however, I’m concerned that he says what happened with female #1 and female #2 weren’t sexual. So I said, I don’t believe that but in your mind that’s not considered cheating? He said I’m sorry. It was wrong. I know it was wrong. I promised that I’d never do it again and I haven’t. So I feel that because he doesn’t consider it sexual that he doesn’t think it was as wrong? I didn’t like that at all.

So anyway, I was nice and I’m happy that he agreed that we’re done and need time away. But then, he just texted me again.

So what is going on? Did he just have that conversation because I always complained that he didn’t have conversation to try and get back in? What the hell????

I thought he would get it after the hour long conversation!

Or maybe he’s just giving in so I can give in..

I know I shouldn’t of talked but I’m glad that it was constructive…was he honest, I don’t know. Was he just bending so I can bend? I know I just need to move forward and I am. I didn’t give in and I didn’t cave which shows A LOT considering our past.

So what is going on? Did he have constructive convo because he’s accepting and moving on or because he’s trying another tactic? 

Again, keep me in my place! Tough love is good!


----------



## 3Xnocharm

Dont answer any more texts or calls from him, he thinks if he keeps at you enough that you will cave, DESPITE the "constructive" conversation you had. He is so used to having you there to use and abuse, he isnt sure how to deal by himself. Too bad so sad. And I call bullsh!t on the "nonsexual" relationships he was having, we are all grownups here and we know what happens. 

Just be done and ignore him.


----------



## EleGirl

Read this over and over...



turnera said:


> Abusers will switch through the 'wheel' of what works. He may try guilt; if that doesn't work to get you to let him back in, he'll try anger; if that doesn't work, he'll try romance; etc. All the things that used to get you to crumble and doubt yourself or miss him or be scared of him, he'll keep trying all of them, one after another, to see which one works, to get what he wants.
> 
> It's what they do.


----------



## EleGirl

He says that his encounters with the other woman was not sexual. Even the one you caught in his (your joint) bed.

Do you know how to tell when a cheater is lying? It's easy.. they are lying when they are talking.


----------



## turnera

Oh, isn't he so good now? So loveable? So level-headed?

His current spoke on the wheel is to gaslight you, convince you that the bad things you remembered didn't really happen. Because look at how nice and even and loving and logical and giving he's being, right?

IT IS A TRICK. All he wants is to get back in your house.


----------



## turnera

And didn't you find him and the OW IN YOUR BED?

Why the hell would he be IN A BED with her if it wasn't for sex? Was he giving her a back rub?

Come on, you're not that gullible.


----------



## turnera

Stop answering the phone - any number.


----------



## EleGirl

turnera said:


> Stop answering the phone - any number.


good idea.

If you know who the call is from, like a girl friend or work, then answer. Otherwise let the caller leave a message.

Change your message to say..

"I am not available to take phone calls right now. Please leave your name, number and brief message. I will call you back."


Then only call back people you want to call.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Yes, Well when I moved from our house together I took the bed and left him bunk beds for the girls. 

When I got to the house I saw an unknown car in the drive and looked through the back window. She was standing up tucking her shirt in and he was in the basement. I walked around to the front of the house and amazingly he had left the house key in the door (meant to be, huh?) Anyway, I walked in and they were upstairs. I heard him asking her "are you just going to stay here?" There was a bed made on the living room floor out of the two bunk beds. He put them together to make one larger bed on the floor. I noticed wine glasses too. Then I started walking upstairs and he walked down. He said what the heck are you doing? I said what the hell are you doing? he kept going downstairs and I went upstairs and opened the bathroom door and she was standing there fixing her hair. I said who are you cause I didn't recognize her at first and her response was "why don't you ask everyone else?" I was so numb I couldn't picture her but then I noticed who she was. His ex after his wife and before me. I went downstairs and I went to go towards him to hit him I was so outraged. He grabbed my arm and threw me out. Said I had to go. 

I didn't catch them in that bed together but all of that happened. I never could figure out whey he made ME leave over HER. That almost hurt the most. Why would he do that?

Then he called and he didn't touch her. It's not what it looks like and he made me leave because he didn't want me to argue or fight with her because she didn't do anything wrong and nothing happened.

So that's why I maybe forgave because I didn't actually CATCH them like that.

I am still so scarred from it all. I mean, he made ME leave! Why? I look so dumb to her. 

Just traumatizing and I can never forget that. I'm sure they had sex. Or again, could it have been the way he said because I didn't catch them in the act? That is stupid thinking, I know.

She said why don't you ask everyone else..like did his friends know? I hate even re-living this right now.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Yes, Well when I moved from our house together I took the bed and left him bunk beds for the girls.
> 
> When I got to the house she was standing up tucking her shirt in and he was in the basement. Anyway, there was a bed made on the living room floor out of the two bunk beds. He put them together to make one larger bed on the floor. I didn't catch them in that bed together.
> 
> So that's why I maybe forgave because I didn't actually CATCH them like that.


If they were not sleeping together, there was no need to put two mattresses together. 

Even the appearance of inappropriate behavior is not acceptable in a relationship. That's why someone who loves you never puts themselves in the position of even looking like they might be cheating.

If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck call it a duck.


----------



## feeling_crazy

So Elegirl - Yes, you agree. Sleeping together?

Also, why so defensive she was?

And he made me leave? 

Like that hurt so bad. I can't move forward after that. 

I mean, right??? 

I'm getting fired up again.


----------



## turnera

crazy, you wouldn't get a jury to believe they weren't having sex. 

They were having sex.

Just move forward. NO man deserves you who would kick YOU out of your own home.

Stop taking calls and delete all texts. 

HE IS TRYING TO WEAR YOU DOWN.


----------



## feeling_crazy

I like how you put in the view of a jury.

Also, I had moved out three weeks before but I moved out because I found emails of him to ANOTHER woman. So yes, it was our home at one point, I guess.

Gosh, I'm upset and he expects me to move forward and be happy go luck and never bring up the past when he ticks me off?


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> So Elegirl - Yes, you agree. Sleeping together?
> 
> Also, why so defensive she was?
> 
> And he made me leave?
> 
> Like that hurt so bad. I can't move forward after that.
> 
> I mean, right???
> 
> I'm getting fired up again.


The two of you were in the middle of turmoil in your relationship at the time because he was mistreating you. Things were undecided. And the first thing he can think of is to have a sleepover with another woman, all while he's trying to convince you to stay with him. And then when you discover them he treats you like an annoyance and kick you out of the house.

Oh yea, you have very right to be furious about this.

But please stop getting fired up. Go do something like take a nice long clamming hot bath. Pamper yourself. Stop thinking about this jerk. Change you thoughts.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Yes, Elegirl, exactly! I didn't go and sleep with another man!

It'll never work, right? I so did the right thing! Even though it was two years ago?

Right?

He keeps texting..I'm assuming because he thinks he "softened" me up all because I actually talked to him on the phone and was nice?

I'm starting to think he has issues..haha

Just keep telling me nothing was justified, he did me wrong and it'll never get better!


----------



## turnera

When is your first therapy appointment?


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> I like how you put in the view of a jury.
> 
> Also, I had moved out three weeks before but I moved out because I found emails of him to ANOTHER woman. So yes, it was our home at one point, I guess.
> 
> Gosh, I'm upset and he expects me to move forward and be happy go luck and never bring up the past when he ticks me off?


When you found him with this woman, it was more proof that he was cheating and with more than one woman. 

He wants you to forget the past because it serves his purpose. If you forget the past, then very time he cheats it's the first time. Every time he lies, is abusive, etc. it's the first times.

Stop going over this in your mind. You have your list. You now that any one of the incidents you wrote about in that list is enough to end a relationship. You gave him way too many chances. He is who he is. He's not going to change.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Yes, Elegirl, exactly! I didn't go and sleep with another man!
> 
> It'll never work, right? I so did the right thing! Even though it was two years ago?
> 
> Right?


Keep in mind that back then you left him because you found texts between him and a woman he was cheating with. Then you caught him in the house with another woman.

It takes the BS 2 - 5 years to recover for infidelity when the WS is going everything in their power to prove that they can be trusted and treating the BS well.

Your BF never did what he needed to do to prove to you that he can be trusted. He never started really treating you with love and respect. Of course you never got over it. He will not even acknowledge that he did something wrong.

You gave him 2 years to do the right things. He blew it. He continues to deny what he did and down play your very real hurt and concerns.



feeling_crazy said:


> He keeps texting..I'm assuming because he thinks he "softened" me up all because I actually talked to him on the phone and was nice?


Yep, he's trying all his 'charming' tricks and he thinks that the last one softened you up. Just ignore his texts.



feeling_crazy said:


> I'm starting to think he has issues..haha


Starting to think this? What was the big clue :rofl:



feeling_crazy said:


> Just keep telling me nothing was justified, he did me wrong and it'll never get better!


Do you see


----------



## feeling_crazy

Yes Elegirl - His way of making things up to me and fixing what he did was being home with me and coming straight home everyday. Um, isn't that what couples that live together do? Like he was giving me a gift? 

Besides, he was cheating with a woman that worked there. I'm sure if he really wanted to he could have ran off during lunch with her or they could have found their ways.

So I guess I'm also a bit insulted that he said the fact that he came home to me everyday was how he made up for it.

He told me I would never let him live it down. Nope, not when I'm still finding stains on your underwear and finding random texts to other women that you call friends at work. 

I get that it's ok for men to have female friends/acquaintences and I get that he was afraid for me to know that he had any because I'd flip out but wouldn't it have just been more wise to tell me about them? It made it look worse when he was deleting the content.

A year ago one his female co-workers texted him and said "why don't you ever want to hang out? I can stop asking." When I asked what that was about he said she's just wondering why I never go to happy hour with them, etc. 

Well when I checked the cell phone records there were a ton of texts between them that were deleted from his phone.

Now this woman wasn't that attractive and I was surprised that he'd talk to her so I thought ok well maybe not but now that I think about it...it still was inappropriate to text and delete AFTER the other incidents.

I JUST remembered that one!!

Gosh, I'm upset. Tired. Like it's supposed to be a break up and I'm still here living like I'm with him.

So what do I do now? Text him that I'll never forget and that I hope he had no inclination after today's conversation that i'll ever get back with him and to never reach me again?

I'm ticked.


----------



## turnera

crazy, how many times have you already told him that now?

STOP TALKING TO HIM.


----------



## Caribbean Man

turnera said:


> crazy, how many times have you already told him that now?
> 
> *STOP TALKING TO HIM.*


:iagree:

Something a lot of women in these abused situations don't understand is that their abuser knows exactly what to tell them to make them feel sorry for him and to give them false hope that the relationship can actually be fixed.
The abuser will always tell them to focus on the good times in the relationship whilst they minimize their role of abuse and blameshift.

Whenever he calls again ,she needs to dominate the conversation , and lay the blame squarely on at his feet.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Guys, this is getting harder for me. Like I'm missing him so bad right now that my heart is aching.

Like I feel like he was a drug and I'm going through withdrawal. Is that normal. Like to feel like my heart is clenched and I just want to scream.

Especially since it's a Friday night, my 19 year old has her own plans. Totally get that but I'm like wow. This is our first Friday night not together and I'm slowly feeling like I want to scream and lose it.

Normal? 

I don't remember feeling this way with any of my other break ups.


----------



## iBolt

feeling_better

I am getting the impression that you are relying quite a bit of external validation and repetitive advice on here. I also think EleGirl particularly (and several others) have been rather firm in their suggestions. 

I am not sure how long you can keep going round this path before people start to jump off. This is YOUR cake. You partly baked it. You will have to decide for yourself if it is still good enough to be eaten or thrown away. You keep saying you want to be told or reminded and all that..you are an adult. Get a grip of yourself. 

PS: Even though I don't know you, I prayed for you last night. I am still hoping on you. Life will go on after this dude.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy,

Read this.. about half way down starts the explanation of why you feel the way you do....

Lisa Copeland: Ladies, Are You Addicted To Love?


----------



## turnera

Seriously?

Are you that weak of a human being that you can throw away your AND your children's future away just because you need to hear a man's voice?

Wow.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy,

So what's going on now girl? Nothing all day?


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi everyone - Just checking in. I didn't really feel like thinking much about it yesterday so I laid low. My daughter and I had a huge event to look forward to last night so my mind was preoccupied with that. We had a great time.

Now back to today and I'm feeling sad again. Just lonely, I guess. I'm so used to having him by my side.

I don't have many friends. One best friend who is unavailable right now because unfortunately, she's involved in an unhealthy relationship and trying to figure things out. Another that I adore and is a great support but has her own things going on and I have my beautiful daughter who is the ultimate best friend, but she is 19 and has her own life to enjoy and live.

So he was my best friend and side kick and the one I did everything with.

I've been in long term relationships and have never really been single for more than a year of so, so I feel like I don't even know how to live a life as a single woman. I just don't know what to do with myself and how to enjoy me and how to feel ok with not having a man in my life.

I do think that having more girlfriends would be a tremendous help.

I'm watching my real housewives reality show re-runs today and I envy what these women have. Like it's the life that I want and should have. I want to be a confident woman that has a beautiful circle of friends who I can dress up with and go out from time to time or have them over for dinner and/or just coffee and a family and a beautiful home at the same time.

I don't have any of that.

I'm also so afraid because I'm going to be 39 next month, men don't hit on me and if I'm attractive as people say or think and I know that I'm fun and outgoing why is that? 

It just instills a fear that wow, I'm going to be 39 and I'm starting over single now? That paired with the fact that I don't get men that talk to me yes, I'm scared and I don't like that feeling of not having what I want and being lonely. 

I also can't help but to not think of what he's doing, where he's at, etc. I know he has a great circle of friends so he's busy right now doing something fun. 

While I'm at home on a BEAUTIFUL day on my laptop surfing the net, watching reality shows and just feeling unbelievably sad and lonely. I even have the day off of work tomorrow so again, just feeling like I should be doing more and I have no one to do anything with. 

Again, also scared. With all of the thinking that I'm doing I've been having panic and anxiety today.

I guess I just don't know how to enjoy myself and create a life that will have me feeling confident and secure. I want friends, to be happy and to love myself and be happy.

I don't know how to go about getting there. I feel so stuck.

P.S. He did call last night after I texted him on error only an "S". He called immediately (I didn't answer) and he left a message asking if I was ok and if we needed him for anything. So I miss that. Although he was a jerk face at times he was also my best friend and supporter. 

So what do I do? How do I get past these feelings of fear and inadequacy and lonliness? I feel like I have no one.


----------



## Prodigal

feeling_crazy said:


> While I'm at home on a BEAUTIFUL day on my laptop surfing the net, watching reality shows and just feeling unbelievably sad and lonely. I even have the day off of work tomorrow so again, just feeling like I should be doing more and I have no one to do anything with.
> 
> So what do I do? How do I get past these feelings of fear and inadequacy and lonliness? I feel like I have no one.


Volunteer. Get outside your head and your own problems by helping people who have it a whole lot worse. Seriously.

Homeless shelters, battered women's shelters, meals on wheels, soup kitchens ... you name it.

Or, you can continue to fixate on your own problems. Your life. Your choices.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> So what do I do? How do I get past these feelings of fear and inadequacy and lonliness? I feel like I have no one.


You start creating a full life.

One thing to start with. Go to Find Meetup groups near you - Meetup See what is going on in your area. Find things that you like and go to them. Maybe you can even get your friend who having problems to go to some of them with you.

Take look and see if you find anything in your area that you are interested in. Let us know what you find.


----------



## turnera

You could be finding a park near you and going for a walk every day. You could be finding the nearest library and signing up for a card and getting one new book every week. You could be volunteering at the food pantry near you. You could be signing up for classes at your community college to meet new people. You could be online looking for clubs in your area for any of your interests. You could be calling up old friends. You could be meeting your kids' friends' parents.


----------



## EleGirl

turnera said:


> You could be finding a park near you and going for a walk every day. You could be finding the nearest library and signing up for a card and getting one new book every week. You could be volunteering at the food pantry near you. You could be signing up for classes at your community college to meet new people. You could be online looking for clubs in your area for any of your interests. You could be calling up old friends.* You could be meeting your kids' friends' parents*.


I like that. Throw a get-together for your daughter, a few of her friends and their parents. It could be dinner, or lots of finger food, or even just desert, coffee and wine.


Do good things for other people.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Good day everyone! 

Firstly today, I would really like my change from "crazy" to better. I just like the sound of that better, I feel that I am getting better and I don't like to see "crazy" there. I did email the contact address last week and have not received a response on that as of yet. Any suggestions?

Second, I do like the idea of meeting up with my daughter's parents friends, only thing there is she's 19 so it's not like I could set up play dates or anything. Also, unfortunately, most of my daughters childhood friends have gone on a different path, not the best path, while my daughter is doing the right thing, sophomore in college and works..just has a good head on her shoulders so she is lacking in the friend department herself, unfortunately.

Update from yesterday, I did go out for a few as a great band we know was performing and I ran into two of his friends whom I NEVER see there. I frequent this place quite often. It was hard to see them cause of course I was reminded and then my heart fell when I saw them because I thought maybe my ex was there. I did talk to our mutual friend and they said they invited him but he turned it down because I knows I go there and didn't want to do that to me. So, he was respectful there in knowing that I don't want to see him.

But then I'm confused because he called three times yesterday, I didn't answer and texted a few times and I didn't respond. 

He called this morning at about 6 am from an unknown number to warn me about a traffic closing close to where I work. I was very cordial and said thanks for the heads up but I'm not working today. I'll keep that in mind for the rest of the week. Have a great day.

I was ok hearing his voice. I wasn't really bothered. Hung up and went right back to sleep. Yes, I slept in till 9:00am today! 

Then he texted "would you like some company for lunch today? No strings attached, LOL"

So what is he doing? I feel like he's being respectful by not going to the bar I was at yesterday, however, still reaching out and then texting and asking if I want to see him during lunch.

I guess I don't understand. I feel again, like he thinks we're together and just separated or he thinks this is just a trial, etc. 

He obviously did not read that last email I sent him or he's just not respecting my wishes or he's going to remain persistent until I give in? Or maybe he hates that he lost so he'll continue till he wins.

Again, just confused. What's the deal with what he's doing?


----------



## turnera

He's manipulating you AND your friends. Look at how good and loving I am. Don't I deserve another chance?


----------



## 3Xnocharm

He is being an ass by not respecting your boundary. Tell him to leave you alone and to never contact you again. 

Being a single woman is awesome! Stop thinking about men and relationships, and focus on yourself! YOU DONT NEED A MAN. Being on your own is what you make of it. I hardly have any girlfriends and spend most of my time by myself. (daughter not included...) When you are by yourself, you can do whatever the hell you want to whenever the hell you want to do it. Want to paint your living room or kitchen a fun new color? DO IT! Want to rearrange the furniture? DO IT! You can watch what you want on tv, you can set the thermostat at whatever you want, you can clean your bathroom or do the laundry at midnight, you can eat ice cream for dinner....and there is no one there to argue with you, or insult you, or make you feel less than! 

You really need to embrace this time, and dont even give thought to another relationship until you are comfortable with yourself.


----------



## turnera

My mom refused to let my dad come home after he went to sow his wild oats. She said, why should I have to turn into the Stepford Wife all over again, just to keep him from yelling at me? I don't need that. She happily never even dated again. She loved being single.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Yes, Turnera. I hear what you're saying.

He's just really persistent. I'm pretty bothered because I would like to believe that he truly loves me and his intentions were good but from you're all saying I have blinders on and he's the real deal stay away from kinda guy.

Just in my nature. 

I'm going to tell him again. He's clearly not getting the picture which I'm so surprised of because I've NEVER taken it to this level. Ever.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

I feel the same way, scared to date, afraid to trust! Hopefully we both do a better job with those red flags if there is a next time. If there isnt a next time, thats ok, I like me!


----------



## turnera

Don't tell him. Just stop answering the phone.


----------



## feeling_crazy

So he called again and again I talked to him about that I feel like this isn't a break up and he said "I get what this is but are we just never going to talk again? after all of these years" I said, I don't even know. He said I don't know either. It's all so weird and new. I told him that us seeing each other right now is not a good idea. I said you haven't changed over the weekend, this I know. He said "well, it's inevitable that I'm going to see you".



Like I'm numb at how to even respond.



Then he asked me if I still wanted to go to Depeche Mode concert (my favorite band of all time)..and of course I want to go to that. So bad! But I can't go with him. I told him, thanks for the offer but save that money so you can get settled. He said, ok well let me know if you change your mind.



So, like then I said I'm gonna go...I'm gonna take a walk and he said "ok talk to you later"



Like what is going on here? 



I'm feeling like it's routine still and we're not even really just broken up. Just taking space. so I'm starting to feel scared to tell him to leave me alone because at times I'm feeling again, that this isn't even real. Like you know what I mean. Like it's feeling like routine and just space.

Is this what his plan is? To break me down? Is he that smooth? like to know how to do it?


----------



## 3Xnocharm

feeling_crazy said:


> So he called again and again I talked to him about that I feel like this isn't a break up and he said "I get what this is but are we just never going to talk again? after all of these years" I said, I don't even know. He said I don't know either. It's all so weird and new.


The problem here is YOU, not him! We KNOW what he is doing, the question is, WHY did you not answer his question correctly? Your answer should not have been "I dont know", it should have been "thats right, we are never going to talk again"! He will keep this up until YOU put an end to it!


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> So he called again and again I talked to him about that *I feel like this isn't a break up* and he said "I get what this is but are we just never going to talk again? after all of these years" * I said, I don't even know. * He said I don't know either. It's all so weird and new. I told him that *us seeing each other right now is not a good idea. * I said you haven't changed over the weekend, this I know. He said "well, it's inevitable that I'm going to see you".


What you told him is that you are not breaking up with him. That you are just confused but not breaking up.





feeling_crazy said:


> I'm feeling like it's routine still and we're not even really just broken up. Just taking space. so I'm starting to feel scared to tell him to leave me alone because at times I'm feeling again, that this isn't even real. Like you know what I mean. Like it's feeling like routine and just space.


You feel this way because you have not set the boundaries you need to break up with him. To be honest it sounds like you have no plans of actually breaking up with him. Instead you just want to toy with him for a while. You want him to beg you to come back.

Actions speak a lot louder than words. Your actions are that you continue to communicate with him. You leave ways for him to contact you.
He calls from his phone and you ignored it. Then he calls from a different number and you talk to him like he’s your long lost lover. What is that about? His calling you from a different number is him showing a HUGE disregard for you. You told him to not contact you. You did not way do not call me from your number but its ok to call me from any other number. 



feeling_crazy said:


> Is this what his plan is? To break me down? Is he that smooth? like to know how to do it?


This is just a lot of drama. You like the drama and he knows it. He’s not smooth at all. His plan is to keep trying every stupid thing he can think of to keep you talking to him and to keep texting you. It does not matter how stupid it is, he will keep doing it. He knows one thing. He knows that as long as he can do this you will eventually break down and swoon for him. 

He knows that you love drama and you live with a very immature image of what ‘love’ is. Somehow you think that his actions are cute and you like him chasing you. If you did not.. you would not talk to him when he calls.

You are not being consistent. You are not holding your boundaries.

If you really did not want to talk to him again you would not talk to him again. When he calls from a different number, you would say something like “DO NOT CALL ME!”. And then you would hang up. You have no obligation to talk to him and be polite. 

To be honest, it sounds like you have no intention of really breaking it off with him. You will continue playing this game with him for a bit and then go back with him. He will become worse than he’s ever been because he will need to break you down more to control you.


----------



## Prodigal

Wow. Just WOW. I read this entire thread. My reaction? As soon as a man laid a finger on me, I would have had this creepy guy tossed in jail for assault and clamped a restraining order on him immediately thereafter. 

Just reading this makes me uncomfortable. And all these questions about "Why does he do this?" and "Why does he say that?" 

OP, you probably will dismiss my suggestion, but perhaps your time would be more constructively spent if you seriously started seeking answers as to what is going on inside your own head. 

Because you are so fixated on what someone else is doing, you don't have a clue what is wrong with you.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi guys - I just want to reiterate that I'm not asking for drama at all intentionally. I'm in a really tough spot. I've never loved anyone as much as I love him and I've never had to break it off with someone for reasons like this.

So it's not easy. Of course I was praying for a miracle and maybe deep down I'm hoping that there was still a chance but according to all of you he'll never change, etc. I get that. It's still REALLY hard though. 

To go from waking up with him and doing everything with him everyday for FIVE years to completely not hearing from him again? So yes, I'm struggling and I guess I'm just afraid.

I know I need to figure out what my issues are but that is bothering me when I hear from you guys that I'm the issue because again, yes, I feel that I was part of the issue. so what does that mean?

I feel like I am crazy or I've officially lost it and I hate it. This doesn't make me feel any better or any more secure that I'll find a man who would accept my "craziness", right?

So I'm sorry if some of you are frustrated but I've taken HUGE steps away from him that I NEVER thought I could do so when I fall back all I need is support and words to get me back to where I was when feeling stronger.

I'm not expecting for this to be easy, however, I need for you all to be patient with me. I've come a long way and I'm sure there will be ups and downs and moments of weakness.


----------



## turnera

When we say you're the issue, we are NOT saying you caused him to be an abusive jerk. We're saying that YOU have problems standing up for yourself. Which is why you let him use you the way he did. THOSE are the issues you have, the personality who lets an abuser in her door in the first place. 

There's nothing wrong with you as a person. And there ARE great men out there who would never hurt you or use you like this one. But you have to spend time focusing on YOU, not you as a partner. Do you understand the difference? Your whole life isn't about being WITH someone.


----------



## Prodigal

feeling_crazy said:


> I've never loved anyone as much as I love him ...


This isn't love. Sorry. You've come here seeking advice. You've gotten it. We are not psychiatrists or psychologists. You need to get into regular counseling sessions with one. 



feeling_crazy said:


> So it's not easy. Of course I was praying for a miracle and maybe deep down I'm hoping that there was still a chance but according to all of you he'll never change, etc. I get that. It's still REALLY hard though.


If he wants to change, he will. If you want to change, you will. In response to it being "REALLY" hard, all I can say is you either put on your big girl's panties and do what it takes to have a better life, or expend all your energy looking for the answers in other people.

Should you choose to look to people to solve your problems, make you happy, or give you the love you desire, I'm afraid you are in for more bitter disappointment.

Happiness is an inside job. Sorry. That's the truth.



feeling_crazy said:


> I feel like I am crazy or I've officially lost it and I hate it. This doesn't make me feel any better or any more secure that I'll find a man who would accept my "craziness", right?


I don't get this. I just don't.:scratchhead: If you are so desperate to have a man in your life, you are going to keep attracting losers, abusers, nut jobs, and the type of man who won't respect you. Forget that crap Tom Cruise said when he declared, "You complete me." 



feeling_crazy said:


> So I'm sorry if some of you are frustrated but I've taken HUGE steps away from him that I NEVER thought I could do so when I fall back all I need is support and words to get me back to where I was when feeling stronger.


You are not differentiating between frustration and people talking to you as adult-to-adult. You want to take a huge step? Go no contact. And, for about the billionth time, get counseling.


----------



## EleGirl

This is hard for you mostly because you have let him text and phone you. You talk to him. Every time you get a text from him or talk to him you have to start your separation from point zero. You start all over again.

We keep telling you how to make the break and how to start feeling better. But you do not seem to believe us.

You have to not talk to him and not respond to any text he sends you. This means that you have to hang up on him if he calls you from a number you do not know... just "do not call me" and hang up.

Only be doing this will the pain start to go away.

I just do not know how to tell you this more clearly.


----------



## committed4ever

feeling_crazy said:


> Hi guys - I just want to reiterate that I'm not asking for drama at all intentionally. I'm in a really tough spot. I've never loved anyone as much as I love him and I've never had to break it off with someone for reasons like this.
> 
> So it's not easy. Of course I was praying for a miracle and maybe deep down I'm hoping that there was still a chance but according to all of you he'll never change, etc. I get that. It's still REALLY hard though.
> 
> To go from waking up with him and doing everything with him everyday for FIVE years to completely not hearing from him again? So yes, I'm struggling and I guess I'm just afraid.
> 
> I know I need to figure out what my issues are but that is bothering me when I hear from you guys that I'm the issue because again, yes, I feel that I was part of the issue. so what does that mean?
> 
> I feel like I am crazy or I've officially lost it and I hate it. This doesn't make me feel any better or any more secure that I'll find a man who would accept my "craziness", right?
> 
> So I'm sorry if some of you are frustrated but I've taken HUGE steps away from him that I NEVER thought I could do so when I fall back all I need is support and words to get me back to where I was when feeling stronger.
> 
> I'm not expecting for this to be easy, however, I need for you all to be patient with me. I've come a long way and I'm sure there will be ups and downs and moments of weakness.


I read your whole thread too and I fear for you getting back with him. A man who have shown violence might want to get you back just to punish you. I've seen this in my own family. He was so so nice to her to get her back. She was missing him so, so much that she had push the violence to the side, because like you it had only been a few incidents.

Once he got her back he tighten his grip on her and then she was really just scared to leave and scared to stay. She did not want to go to shelter, and the only thing that get her out of it was he was convict of a DUI and while he was in jail her Mom pass away from cancer so she just relocate. None of us have seen him again but sadly she will not set foot in this state again.

ETA: DUI/manslaughter


----------



## EleGirl

committed4ever said:


> I read your whole thread too and I fear for you getting back with him. A man who have shown violence might want to get you back just to punish you. I've seen this in my own family. He was so so nice to her to get her back. She was missing him so, so much that she had push the violence to the side, because like you it had only been a few incidents.
> 
> Once he got her back he tighten his grip on her and then she was really just scared to leave and scared to stay. She did not want to go to shelter, and the only thing that get her out of it was he was convict of a DUI and while he was in jail her Mom pass away from cancer so she just relocate. None of us have seen him again but sadly she will not set foot in this state again.


Interesting.

One of my cousins was with an abusive guy for a few years. The only reason she finally broke up with him is that one night he tore the tank off a toilet and threw it at her. It hit her in the foot fracturing it. She was distraught so she left the house at midnight an was hobbling around with that broken foot. She call her brother who went to pick her up.. but he called 911 on the way. 

The police came, arrested him. He was charge with domestic violence and the court put a restraining order on him that prevented him from going near the house they owned together. 

We convinced her to pack up and leave him. She put he house up for sale. She also moved out of state.

Had the police and courts not intervened, I'm sure she would still be with him and he'd still be abusing her.


The dynamics of abuse are tough. They suck in the victim at some very low, subliminal level that is so hard to break away from. This is why leaving as soon as abuse starts is so important... leave before you get stuck.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello everyone and thanks to the new folks who have chimed in to support. 

His physical abuse was very far and few in between and it only happened when I had a few drunk arguing episodes or if I argued in general or questioned him. I realize that I did not trust and I questioned him on practically everything so he was frustrated maybe. Especially if he wasn't cheating anymore.

The most recent times where I checked the cell records about a year ago and he was texting his ex female boss I questioned him and he got so upset that he slammed down and split the bathroom sink in half. There were episodes of that but again, it was only when I doubted and questioned him, etc.

So again, I guess maybe I should have trusted? Like I feel that he wouldn't have gotten so upset if he weren't frustrated because he was for once doing the right thing. Like he said?

Sometimes I wonder if he was just so angry because he finally was doing the right thing, I was stuck in the past and kept questioning and not trusting?

I know that if that were the case with me and I were doing the right thing that I would have probably gotten fed up with being accused to.

I'm getting off track here though. I just want reassurance that what I'm saying above is not the case. 

I'm up and down. Like he will never change. Ever ever ever.

P.S. one more time, how do I get to someone here to change my name? 

Thanks so much! I really am so grateful for all of you here and your patience during this fiasco.


----------



## iBolt

feeling_crazy said:


> Hello everyone and thanks to the new folks who have chimed in to support.
> 
> His physical abuse was very far and few in between and it only happened when I had a few drunk arguing episodes or if I argued in general or questioned him. I realize that I did not trust and I questioned him on practically everything so he was frustrated maybe. Especially if he wasn't cheating anymore.
> 
> The most recent times where I checked the cell records about a year ago and he was texting his ex female boss I questioned him and he got so upset that he slammed down and split the bathroom sink in half. There were episodes of that but again, it was only when I doubted and questioned him, etc.
> 
> So again, I guess maybe I should have trusted? Like I feel that he wouldn't have gotten so upset if he weren't frustrated because he was for once doing the right thing. Like he said?
> 
> Sometimes I wonder if he was just so angry because he finally was doing the right thing, I was stuck in the past and kept questioning and not trusting?
> 
> I know that if that were the case with me and I were doing the right thing that I would have probably gotten fed up with being accused to.
> 
> I'm getting off track here though. I just want reassurance that what I'm saying above is not the case.
> 
> I'm up and down. Like he will never change. Ever ever ever.
> 
> P.S. one more time, how do I get to someone here to change my name?
> 
> Thanks so much! I really am so grateful for all of you here and your patience during this fiasco.


1, You could have been as squeaky clean as a nun's bottom and he likely would have still cheated on you. You revisionist sense of history is not helping you to see the wider issues here. You were hit so hard that a tooth had to be removed from the back of your mouth. Not cool. You caught him cheating right? What does this have to do with the price of milk? Nada! 
2, I repeat that your reliance on external validation will not do you much good. You need to make YOUR OWN DECISION, trust it and be at peace with it. There are only so many ways you can be advised on what to do. Ultimately, it is your choice. If it pleases you then go back to him. What's stopping you? If you really believe that you could have done something differently as to make him change, then call him right now to return to your home. 

This puts you out of your misery and those of us on TAM of the suspense.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Prodigal

iBolt said:


> If you really believe that you could have done something differently as to make him change, then call him right now to return to your home.
> 
> This puts you out of your misery...


I agree 150% with iBolt. You don't listen, and barely acknowledge, any of the advice you have been given. And you've been given a lot of good advice. However, you choose to just go on and on and on.

So now we get yet another round of questions. 

Call him. Have him over. Let him move back in. You aren't going to stop obsessing and asking questions about this man. 

I don't get it, but it's your life. People have tried to help. But you are totally fixated on this guy. Sad, but true.

I doubt people are going to keep trying to offer assistance when you won't stop freaking out long enough to get a grip and calmly consider the help/advice that has been offered thus far. I don't know if you're addicted more to drama or this man. But I've lived with an addict. And I know it is not rational. Again, sad, but true.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Prodigal said:


> I agree 150% with iBolt. You don't listen, and barely acknowledge, any of the advice you have been given. And you've been given a lot of good advice. However, you choose to just go on and on and on.
> 
> So now we get yet another round of questions.
> 
> Call him. Have him over. Let him move back in. You aren't going to stop obsessing and asking questions about this man.
> 
> I don't get it, but it's your life. People have tried to help. But you are totally fixated on this guy. Sad, but true.
> 
> I doubt people are going to keep trying to offer assistance when you won't stop freaking out long enough to get a grip and calmly consider the help/advice that has been offered thus far. I don't know if you're addicted more to drama or this man. But I've lived with an addict. And I know it is not rational. Again, sad, but true.


Prodigal you've dated an addict? Are you saying I'm not rational and I am the one who needs to change or not rational in thinking it will ever be good with this man? Can you clarify?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## committed4ever

feeling_crazy said:


> The most recent times where I checked the cell records about a year ago and he was texting his ex female boss I questioned him and he got so upset that he slammed down and split the bathroom sink in half. There were episodes of that but again, it was only when I doubted and questioned him, etc.


But you realize, right, that there are lots and lots *and lots* of men who will never hit a woman no matter what? Especially a woman they truly love. Why would you want anything less than a relationship like that? That just his *reasonable *treatment of you.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

feeling_crazy said:


> Hello everyone and thanks to the new folks who have chimed in to support.
> 
> His physical abuse was very far and few in between and it only happened when I had a few drunk arguing episodes or if I argued in general or questioned him. I realize that I did not trust and I questioned him on practically everything so he was frustrated maybe. Especially if he wasn't cheating anymore.
> 
> The most recent times where I checked the cell records about a year ago and he was texting his ex female boss I questioned him and he got so upset that he slammed down and split the bathroom sink in half. There were episodes of that but again, it was only when I doubted and questioned him, etc.
> 
> So again, I guess maybe I should have trusted? Like I feel that he wouldn't have gotten so upset if he weren't frustrated because he was for once doing the right thing. Like he said?
> 
> Sometimes I wonder if he was just so angry because he finally was doing the right thing, I was stuck in the past and kept questioning and not trusting?
> 
> I know that if that were the case with me and I were doing the right thing that I would have probably gotten fed up with being accused to.
> 
> I'm getting off track here though. I just want reassurance that what I'm saying above is not the case.
> 
> I'm up and down. Like he will never change. Ever ever ever.
> 
> P.S. one more time, how do I get to someone here to change my name?
> 
> Thanks so much! I really am so grateful for all of you here and your patience during this fiasco.


Have you read what you wrote here?? You are minimizing ABUSE and making excuses for him!! YOU are taking the blame for HIS actions!! When are you going to accept that while you are not perfect, or completely without blame in the relationship, the man is a sleaze, an a$$hole, a user, and an abuser!! Why cant you face this fact??? Stop questioning it! 

YOU DONT NEED A MAN!!!!


----------



## Prodigal

feeling_crazy said:


> Prodigal you've dated an addict? Are you saying I'm not rational and I am the one who needs to change or not rational in thinking it will ever be good with this man? Can you clarify?


Please see post #177 by turnera. She clarifies quite well. I am married to an alcoholic; thus, an addict.

And I learned I cannot have a rational discussion with an addict. 

You claim you are having panic/anxiety attacks over the loss of this man. A man who beat you. I understand denial and minimization. Addicts do it all the time.

Perhaps you should read the responses here and thoughtfully consider what others have said. That will require you to calm down and assess what you have been told. Then sit back and think about it awhile.

I'm not going to answer questions about a man who screws around and hits women. So, if you wish to minimize what he has done, that's your choice.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Prodigal you've dated an addict? Are you saying I'm not rational and I am the one who needs to change or not rational in thinking it will ever be good with this man? Can you clarify?


Prodigal is saying that your desire to go back to go back to a man who cheated on you and knocked your teeth out is not rational.

So yes, it's not rational to think that it will ever be good with this man.


----------



## turnera

Have you read Why Does He Do That? yet?


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello Turnera - I am in the process of reading The Manipulative Man. This is next on my list. I'm calling the library to see if they have it in stock. If not, I'm going to purchase on Amazon. 

Thanks so much for checking! I'm on it! 

Also, I was reading a bit about co-dependency and yes, I fall in that category. This I know. I’m curious to know if anything that I did to him was considered abusive in a sense. For instance, my need to control and check in on him constantly, my mistrust, when arguing I did say nasty things to him and call him names (at times when I was hurt and upset), etc. Like are those things considered abusive? Can a co-dependent person abuse their partner with their need to control everything?

Also, I was reading about codependency online and came across this portion below of people changing. I’m assuming this doesn’t apply to someone who is abusive, etc.?

_The moment that can nudge a relationship toward healthy change is the moment you decide you've had enough.

"Often the thing that gets an alcoholic to go to AA, or narcissists to see that something's wrong," Tessina says, "is losing somebody. It's ironic that the person who wants to stay there forever and give and give has to say 'OK, I'm through. I'm done. I'm leaving,' before the partner will turn around and say 'Oh, wait a minute, I really do care about you.'"

Bochner has seen clients go through the same realization. "The willingness to leave is often what sets things straight. They have to get to a point where they have to save themselves by saying 'I love you, but I have to take care of me.' Then, sometimes, the relationship actually changes."_


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Hello Turnera - I am in the process of reading The Manipulative Man. This is next on my list. I'm calling the library to see if they have it in stock. If not, I'm going to purchase on Amazon.
> 
> Thanks so much for checking! I'm on it!
> 
> Also, I was reading a bit about co-dependency and yes, I fall in that category. This I know. I’m curious to know if anything that I did to him was considered abusive in a sense. For instance, my need to control and check in on him constantly, my mistrust, when arguing I did say nasty things to him and call him names (at times when I was hurt and upset), etc. Like are those things considered abusive? Can a co-dependent person abuse their partner with their need to control everything?


Co-dependents try to control their partner. But you have to look at the source of this.

He is abusive and cheats on you. So you become co-dependent and try to control him so that he stops abusing you and cheating.

Co-dependency is a natural reaction to a spouse who has serious mental health and/or addiction issues.

Your ex-bf has serious mental health issues... being emotionally abusive and physically abuse stem from mental health issues on his part. And not it's not the kind of mental health issues that he an take a med for. 

How do you stop not trusting, checking up on him, trying to guess what to say/do so he does not abuse you and not cheat on you again? You get away from him because he is the source of the problem not you.

For example you questioned him about his involvement with another woman so he hit to so hard he knocked some of your teeth out. Questioning him does not in any way justify what he did to you. 

As a matter of fact, his actions with the other woman justified you asking him about it.

How can you not see that his hitting you, verbally/emotionally abusing you and cheating on you are not justified by anything you did. 

The ONLY justifiable reaction to the things you have done is for him to: seek out counseling with you, discuss things with you in a calm way, change his own offensive behavior... or he leaves you. That's it.

Those are the only justifiable actions for any spouse no matter what the issues are. There is never a time when physical/emotional abuse and/or cheating are justified.

Co-dependent based attempts to control are not generally abuse.. they are an attempt to fix abusive behavior. But it never works. So really, backing off and/or leaving are the only viable choices.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> "Often the thing that gets an alcoholic to go to AA, or narcissists to see that something's wrong," Tessina says, "is losing somebody. It's ironic that the person who wants to stay there forever and give and give has to say 'OK, I'm through. I'm done. I'm leaving,' before the partner will turn around and say 'Oh, wait a minute, I really do care about you.'"
> 
> Bochner has seen clients go through the same realization. "The willingness to leave is often what sets things straight. They have to get to a point where they have to save themselves by saying 'I love you, but I have to take care of me.' Then, sometimes, the relationship actually changes."[/I][/U]


Right. And this is not a DIY project. If you want to go down that road get a counselor ASAP.


----------



## feeling_crazy

EleGirl said:


> Co-dependents try to control their partner. But you have to look at the source of this.
> 
> He is abusive and cheats on you. So you become co-dependent and try to control him so that he stops abusing you and cheating.
> 
> Co-dependency is a natural reaction to a spouse who has serious mental health and/or addiction issues.
> 
> Your ex-bf has serious mental health issues... being emotionally abusive and physically abuse stem from mental health issues on his part. And not it's not the kind of mental health issues that he an take a med for.
> 
> How do you stop not trusting, checking up on him, trying to guess what to say/do so he does not abuse you and not cheat on you again? You get away from him because he is the source of the problem not you.
> 
> For example you questioned him about his involvement with another woman so he hit to so hard he knocked some of your teeth out. Questioning him does not in any way justify what he did to you.
> 
> As a matter of fact, his actions with the other woman justified you asking him about it.
> 
> How can you not see that his hitting you, verbally/emotionally abusing you and cheating on you are not justified by anything you did.
> 
> The ONLY justifiable reaction to the things you have done is for him to: seek out counseling with you, discuss things with you in a calm way, change his own offensive behavior... or he leaves you. That's it.
> 
> Those are the only justifiable actions for any spouse no matter what the issues are. There is never a time when physical/emotional abuse and/or cheating are justified.
> 
> Co-dependent based attempts to control are not generally abuse.. they are an attempt to fix abusive behavior. But it never works. So really, backing off and/or leaving are the only viable choices.


Hi Elegirl! This clears it up a lot. Thank you!!! When he hit me the first time with the tooth incident it was because we got into an argument about something. I really don't remember because we were drinking. There was no cheating that I knew of at that time so I don't even recall what caused but I do remember an argument of some sort. 

Does that justify it, of course not. The other times were due to yes, us drinking and me getting emotional and arguing and saying things that weren't so nice. Again, I know that doesn't justify it.

Other times we were sober, for instance the time he broke the bathroom sink. It was because I questioned him about texting his ex female boss.

So yes, I guess I didn't have a right to be verbally mean to him when drinking but he shouldn't have lost control.

****Here is a time or an example of how I feel that I was difficult to deal with and where I feel that I needed to change: I was feeling jealous and insecure because he said he wanted to start working out. He had started taking care of himself more so I had of course thought that he was doing it because he was seeing someone else and wanted to impress her. So I asked him "are you working out because you're trying to impress someone?" and he got upset and threw a towel in my face. So that is just an example of how I was probably very difficult to deal with because my insecurity. Why sometimes I think was it me that caused it? Why we could never be better. But then again, I didn't trust and with good reason, right?

I'm just feeling like it was me again...or there are things that I needed to change.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

feeling_crazy said:


> ****Here is a time or an example of how I feel that I was difficult to deal with and where I feel that I needed to change: I was feeling jealous and insecure because he said he wanted to start working out. He had started taking care of himself more so I had of course thought that he was doing it because he was seeing someone else and wanted to impress her. So I asked him "are you working out because you're trying to impress someone?" and he got upset and threw a towel in my face. So that is just an example of how I was probably very difficult to deal with because my insecurity. Why sometimes I think was it me that caused it? Why we could never be better. But then again, I didn't trust and with good reason, right?
> 
> I'm just feeling like it was me again...or there are things that I needed to change.


OMG...HE WAS CHEATING! So you are justified in asking questions!


----------



## feeling_crazy

3Xnocharm – Yes, I get that he cheated. Of course but my whole thing is IF he had realized his mistake and didn’t do it again (like he said) I can see me continuously accusing him as driving him nutty.

Like I didn’t have to be THAT insecure to think he was working out to impress someone else ya know? Like that’s where I feel like “am I totally out of line in my thinking?”

When someone cheats and say they stop and change. When is it time to stop asking questions and feeling insecure? Is there ever a time?

I really was just wondering and needed to hear what you said again.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> Hi Elegirl! This clears it up a lot. Thank you!!! When he hit me the first time with the tooth incident it was because we got into an argument about something.


There IS no BECAUSE, don't you see that? 

THERE IS NO REASON FOR A MAN TO HIT A WOMAN. 

EVER.

The fact that you just keep making excuses for him hitting you is proof that you are still in Victimhood. Well, if I just didn't so and so, yes but I was being this and that...he wouldn't have hit me.

That's why I need you to read that book I keep pushing. It will explain to you that there is NOTHING on your part that justifies being hit. The fact that you continue to make excuses for him and pine away for him tells me that you will probably go back to him. You aren't done being a victim yet.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi Turnera - Yes, I see and I PROMISE you and myself and my daughter that I will not be going back to him.

It's just a hard process for me to adjust to because I've been so torn down in thinking that it was me and what I deserved, etc. 

So then I go online and I read about co-dependency, etc. and I see those things that give me glimmers of hope. 

But I know that it'll never change. He's already 37. I figured IF he were going to change he would have by now.


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

It's been a while since I last checked in on this thread!

Feeling, you may not see it, but you have made AMAZING strides. You are sliding back some, but overall you've done some amazingly hard things that took a lot of courage to follow through with. Bravo!

That confusion and sadness and hurt? It's scary, but it's okay. Every time you feel like that, I want you to remember how angry you felt when you found him with that other woman.

Do you remember that feeling? Good. Now make a vow that you will NEVER be with someone that can make you feel like that again.

And start going out! Find new fun places, if not in your town in the town over. Do stuff that you and him DIDN'T do. Did you ever want to go to a museum he wasn't interested in? Go! When was the last time you treated yourself to a massage, or a pedicure, or a facial? (Don't give me this "I'm not a girly girl" stuff, that's a copout!)

Doing stuff on your own can be scary, and I understand not wanting to go out because it seems difficult. I promise you will enjoy it.



> I figured IF he were going to change he would have by now.


YES. REMEMBER THIS. Write it on a Post-It and put it next to your phone and your computer (since he's calling and e-mailing you).


----------



## feeling_crazy

Thank you LoveAtDaisys – Yes, when I think of what he did and when I caught him with her it hurts more than makes me angry. Is that weird? Either way, I don’t even want to feel that way again. It scares me though that I will go through that again with someone else. 

I’m going to get back to doing things that him and I didn’t do. I just can’t help but feel when I’m doing something fun and new that I want to share it with him. Or it makes me sad that he wouldn’t have shared it with me. Does that sound normal? 

Like I feel like it’ll be difficult to enjoy things without him by my side because the whole time I’m wishing he were enjoying it with me. Like yesterday I made an amazing dinner and I know he loved my cooking and I was sort of wishing he were there to enjoy it with me. I really don’t know if that’s normal or not but would like to hear.

He did text and call a few times today and I did not respond. Changing his name to DON’T ANSWER has helped tremendously and TODAY, I’m not feeling so affected by it. I know that may change later.

I appreciate all of you and for you realizing the great strides I’ve made because although I feel like I’m having weak moments and I do have questions that may seem repetitive, I feel that I FINALLY did it and that a higher power helped me do what I couldn’t do for myself after YEARS of me praying for an answer and the strength to do it. Like it just happened out of nowhere. I think this is why he’s so surprised to because of all that I endured to finally be done after a hang up. He’s like WOW. I’m like WOW, lol.

I still have been praying for a sign that I did the right thing though. I guess I keep getting those answers here! 


----------



## turnera

Hah! DON'T ANSWER - that is really smart! Do you mind if I borrow that to give advice to others?


----------



## feeling_crazy

Turnera! LOL! I got the advice from someone here on this thread. Share away!!


----------



## iBolt

feeling_crazy said:


> Thank you LoveAtDaisys – Yes, when I think of what he did and when I caught him with her it hurts more than makes me angry. Is that weird? Either way, I don’t even want to feel that way again. It scares me though that I will go through that again with someone else.
> 
> I’m going to get back to doing things that him and I didn’t do. I just can’t help but feel when I’m doing something fun and new that I want to share it with him. Or it makes me sad that he wouldn’t have shared it with me. Does that sound normal?
> 
> Like I feel like it’ll be difficult to enjoy things without him by my side because the whole time I’m wishing he were enjoying it with me. Like yesterday I made an amazing dinner and I know he loved my cooking and I was sort of wishing he were there to enjoy it with me. I really don’t know if that’s normal or not but would like to hear.
> 
> He did text and call a few times today and I did not respond. Changing his name to DON’T ANSWER has helped tremendously and TODAY, I’m not feeling so affected by it. I know that may change later.
> 
> I appreciate all of you and for you realizing the great strides I’ve made because although I feel like I’m having weak moments and I do have questions that may seem repetitive, I feel that I FINALLY did it and that a higher power helped me do what I couldn’t do for myself after YEARS of me praying for an answer and the strength to do it. Like it just happened out of nowhere. I think this is why he’s so surprised to because of all that I endured to finally be done after a hang up. He’s like WOW. I’m like WOW, lol.
> 
> I still have been praying for a sign that I did the right thing though. I guess I keep getting those answers here! 


:smthumbup::smthumbup::smthumbup:

BRAVO.

You ARE moving in the right direction girl. The thing is this and I am speaking from current experience. It is perfectly normal to feel that feeling about the person you are splitting up with. You will not be human if you didn't. The fact that you were emotionally invested in the relationship so much also explains why we both feel this way. Here is the trick. 

We both need to recognise these feelings for what they are and not confuse them for something else. We feel this way because we are grieving over what we had. Like when a loved one dies, we know we cannot bring them back. We only think about the good times. We wish we had said thanks more. We wish we had been a bit nicer. We wished we were a better whatever. We rarely think about the pain that the deceased caused when they were alive. 

It probably will always be that way. We need to let go - peacefully and not resist. The sun will rise tomorrow, Anthony Weiner will never be US President and life will go on. The key is to let go - peacefully and not resist despite the real feelings of loss. Let go...


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

I have a sneaking suspicion that in a couple days, the sadness and pain will fade a little. I'm not saying they'll go away, but I bet you'll be feeling a lot better.

When he was constantly contacting you, he was ripping that bandaid off of the wound and you had to re-start and put it back on each time. The less you contact him, the more that wound can heal.

I mentioned that incident because I think a couple pages back you wrote that you wanted to hit him after you caught him? The important part is the feeling. That anger. Maybe instead the weekend he blew you off would be a better example. Choose something that he did that just PISSED YOU OFF. And remember that, and every time he contacts you think of that moment and how mad you were. It'll help remind you why you're doing this on those days you miss him and he's being so deceptively sweet.

You're doing really well!! Don't give up and I can't wait to see the happy ending in this story


----------



## EleGirl

I like his new name on your phone as well "Don't Answer" ... brilliant!!!

It does sound like you are doing better today. There will be good days and bad days. Over time the good days will take over.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello everyone – Yes, things seem like they’re getting better. The DO NOT ANSWER, again, really does work! Pretty effective!

Today I just realized something though and I’m feeling rather hurt by it or confused maybe. The last two times that we broke up (for the VERY short time that it was – a week tops), he was very remorseful. Called, texted, emailed and opened up his heart and told me so many sweet things, apologized, begged me to not leave him, promised to marry me and that he would change, etc. etc. I mean, it was stuff that of course every girl wanted to hear. 

Now, this time with the break up and now that he’s REALLY out of my home he’s trying to lure me back but with the most random small things like text messages saying “I miss you” or sending me songs via email that we used to talk about being our wedding songs someday. He apologized but it seemed very fake and not heartfelt and again, just didn’t say what he used to say to me. He’s not fighting like he did before and saying those things like he did before and although I know it’s a good thing that he’s not, I’m just wondering why. Like after all of this time I would have thought he REALLY would have fought like he did before considering the extreme that I’ve taken this break up to.

So is he not fighting like he used to because he’s hoping that I’ll break down like I have in the past? He thinks it’s easier to break me down and he doesn’t have to fight as hard because I’ve given in so easily before? I just don’t understand and I guess I’m sad and feel a bit insulted. Like he doesn’t care as much and after all that has happened you would think that a man who really loved you and wanted to be with you would do everything in his power to win you back.

Again, I know I shouldn’t care but I just don’t understand. So again, just feeling confused and hurt by that. I just don’t understand the way that works. That’s my thinking and I’d love some clarification on that. One more time NOT cause I’m wanting to get back. I just am like “wow” I guess.

My feelings and thoughts are in NO WAY meaning that I’m thinking of going back because I’m not. It’s just what I’m feeling today. 

Maybe I'm getting angry...maybe I feel like he's not because he grew tired of my portion of the bull crap and I'm taking it personally? Like again, did I ruin it? 

I know I'm off in thinking but I'm just venting. Having a "moment".


----------



## turnera

Remember that, to an abuser, you are a THING. Something he WINS. Or controls. Or doesn't. He does this through whatever tool works at the moment. You're acting different this time because you're getting help here. He sees the difference. He's re-evaluating. He will either try another tactic or he will give up and go seek a new UNHEALTHY woman to control.

What YOU need to do is ask yourself if your need for him to 'prove' himself to you (so you can return to him in all your glory of being proved to) is stronger than your need to finally embrace healthy adulthood and not NEED that dysfunctional prove it prove it prove it. Because you're educating yourself and moving forward to seek a healthy relationship with yourself and - maybe, a couple years down the road - with some other man who isn't messed up.


----------



## turnera

Are you seeing a therapist yet? Why not?


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi Turnera - Not as of yet. I emailed my former therapist late last night. Waiting on a response. Even when she does get back to me I can only afford seeing her once a month.

I guess that'll have to do with some reading, online research, etc.

I just don't understand why this is so up and down and why I even care that he's not fighting for me. I was just curious and maybe just feeling like it's a slap in the face and that's hurting my self esteem a bit more?

Honestly, I don't even know.


----------



## turnera

You care that he's not fighting for you because that's a high school way of dealing with a boyfriend. My DD22's best friend is married to a guy who she keeps demanding that he 'prove' he loves her. It's never enough. It's HER problem, HER lack of self esteem, but she has to keep getting constant assurance that he wants her, because she refuses to do any work on her own problems. Eventually, he's going to give up, because she's never satisfied.

You and he were caught in a perennial tug of war, an unhealthy one, where you demanded that he show you he loves you by wooing you back home, after periods of his horrid behavior. Instead of just WALKING AWAY from the bad behavior, you just accepted it and then made a pitiful attempt to pretend to leave him so he could 'make up for it.' And then, feeling vindicated (he really does love me, look at how hard he tried to kiss up to me) - but still not addressing your lack of self esteem (which would have kept you from this relationship in the first place), you came back. Satisfied he had you back under control, he stopped wooing you and started going back to his REAL character, an abuser. And thus the cycle continued.


----------



## EleGirl

I agree with Tundra. You are acting differently this time. Perhaps he even has picked that you are not coming back. 

Maybe he is trying to figure out what to do. But since you cannot talk to you or see you, he is not getting the clues that he's used to getting from you.. so he's confused and in the dark.

He might also have realized that you are different and you are getting healthier emotionally. He does not want an emotionally healthy woman. Like Tundra said.. to him as an abuser you are a thing for him to use... a possession that he abuses to make himself feel superior. If you don't act the way he needs you to (as his victim) he needs to go find another victim.

Abusers are remarkably honed into the behavior of those around them. They know who they can abuse and who will not allow it. It's sort of a 6th sense. That's an abuser's survival mechanism.


----------



## EleGirl

turnera said:


> You care that he's not fighting for you because that's a high school way of dealing with a boyfriend. My DD22's best friend is married to a guy who she keeps demanding that he 'prove' he loves her. It's never enough. It's HER problem, HER lack of self esteem, but she has to keep getting constant assurance that he wants her, because she refuses to do any work on her own problems. Eventually, he's going to give up, because she's never satisfied.
> 
> You and he were caught in a perennial tug of war, an unhealthy one, where you demanded that he show you he loves you by wooing you back home, after periods of his horrid behavior. Instead of just WALKING AWAY from the bad behavior, you just accepted it and then made a pitiful attempt to pretend to leave him so he could 'make up for it.' And then, feeling vindicated (he really does love me, look at how hard he tried to kiss up to me) - but still not addressing your lack of self esteem (which would have kept you from this relationship in the first place), you came back. Satisfied he had you back under control, he stopped wooing you and started going back to his REAL character, an abuser. And thus the cycle continued.


This is very good. I have read that people are attracted to others who have emotional issues that fit with theirs. This post explains very well how the two people with these problems fit together like gloves. Each person needs the other to play their part of the emotional game.


----------



## iBolt

turnera said:


> You care that he's not fighting for you because that's a high school way of dealing with a boyfriend. *My DD22's best friend is married to a guy who she keeps demanding that he 'prove' he loves her. It's never enough. It's HER problem, HER lack of self esteem, but she has to keep getting constant assurance that he wants her, because she refuses to do any work on her own problems. Eventually, he's going to give up, because she's never satisfied.*


:iagree:

Sadly, this is a very true observation and in my view, was a primary factor in me filing for a divorce. Some partners can live under this constant test. I just couldn't do it anymore. I knew there were insecurities there but it seemed that I had to prove myself over and over again. Funny enough, when we first went to a MC last year, she came up with a list of demands or things that I needed to prove to her during the session. The therapist was not pleased. I will not miss this part of our marriage at all because, it was a series of exams that I could never pass. 

Please pardon my temporary hijack of your thread


----------



## turnera

More T/J: What's worse is she just had her birthday, and she made her husband spend more than $600 on her in a series of hotels, dinners, etc., to make her feel better (this a young couple with one car, a grocery store job and a SAHM). And now she's telling my DD22 that she won't be able to go on the weekend trip they have had planned for a year...because she can't afford to go. So she ruined my daughter's plans because (1) she already spent all their money on herself and (2) going on THAT trip won't make her feel special. I wish DD would just stop being friends with her; she does this ALL.THE.TIME.

feeling...know that I am NOT saying you are like this, lol. I was just talking about the primal need to be reassured.


----------



## feeling_crazy

iBolt and Turnera - This is how I was with him. So that's why I feel like I contributed to problems as well. I feel thought that I was like this more because of the cheating and my self esteem being shot and I feel like he didn't show me enough love.

So again, I feel like I drove him to certain things because of my insecurity because of what he did to me.

Also, this is why I mentioned this before and asked had I not needed constant reassurance, etc. if we would have been better.

Gosh, I'm starting to wish I never brought that up because now I'm what iffing again.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> iBolt and Turnera - This is how I was with him. So that's why I feel like I contributed to problems as well. I feel thought that I was like this more because of the cheating and my self esteem being shot and I feel like he didn't show me enough love.
> 
> So again, I feel like I drove him to certain things because of my insecurity because of what he did to me.
> 
> Also, this is why I mentioned this before and asked had I not needed constant reassurance, etc. if we would have been better.
> 
> Gosh, I'm starting to wish I never brought that up because now I'm what iffing again.


Were you like this in previous relationships... constantly asking for the guy to prove his love for you? 

Were like this with this current (ex)bf before he started to cheat and abuse you?


----------



## turnera

fc, even if you DID bug him about stuff, HE HAD NO RIGHT TO HIT YOU.

And you SHOULD NOT BE MARRIED to a man who hits you.

Can you at least agree on that?


----------



## feeling_crazy

EleGirl said:


> Were you like this in previous relationships... constantly asking for the guy to prove his love for you?
> 
> Were like this with this current (ex)bf before he started to cheat and abuse you?


Hello - No I was not in prior relationships. Nothing out of the norm, at least. When my ex fiancée and I broke up it got the point where I was needing for him to prove his love but nothing like I am/was with my current ex.

And no I was not like this prior to the cheating of my current ex. That mostly started after he cheated and abused. 

I was a bit jealous though at stories of how he was with his ex wife and I did wonder why he wasn't that way with me. I did compare and I did bring that up to him but not the way I was after the cheating and abuse. It got worse after that.


----------



## feeling_crazy

turnera said:


> fc, even if you DID bug him about stuff, HE HAD NO RIGHT TO HIT YOU.
> 
> And you SHOULD NOT BE MARRIED to a man who hits you.
> 
> Can you at least agree on that?


Turnera - Yes, I agree no right. Even when I was bugging him. Again, he only hit me those few times. The sober times was more breaking things, etc.


----------



## turnera

Again, when you were contemplating marriage, were you thinking 'gee, I hope this marriage goes well. I hope I only get hit a few times. I hope he only breaks things, then it will be a great marriage'? Was THAT your standard for a good marriage?


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Turnera - Yes, I agree no right. Even when I was bugging him. Again, he only hit me those few times. The sober times was more breaking things, etc.


Take the 'only' out of that sentence. One of those times he knocked teeth out. That's a hard enough hit to kill someone. 


When a person breaks things in anger the message is "this could be you I beat on next time". Breaking things is very scary.

He did not have to hit you often because those few times did the trick. You were afraid of him. So then all he had to do was to break things .. it's a threat.

What were the things that he broke.. give us a bit of an inventory of them.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Hello - No I was not in prior relationships. Nothing out of the norm, at least. When my ex fiancée and I broke up it got the point where I was needing for him to prove his love but nothing like I am/was with my current ex.
> 
> And no I was not like this prior to the cheating of my current ex. That mostly started after he cheated and abused.
> 
> I was a bit jealous though at stories of how he was with his ex wife and I did wonder why he wasn't that way with me. I did compare and I did bring that up to him but not the way I was after the cheating and abuse. It got worse after that.


So then, constantly bugging him to prove his love to you was your reaction to his cheating, abuse and acting unloving to you.

It takes 2-5 years for a BS (betrayed spouse) to recover from infidelity. And that's when the WS is doing everything possible to prove that they can be trusted and to help the BS heal.

He did neither. So your reaction of feeling unloved and insecure were/are normal reactions to not being treated with love and as someone special.

Yes, it was probably annoying to him. Your mistake was staying and trying to squeeze real love out of a false/abusive man. Like they say, you cannot get blood out of a rock. Well you cannot get love out of an unloving man. 

This means that you have a bit less to work on than if you are normally a bottomless pit of need. You are not. You just need to get out of a very bad situation to which you reacted by becoming understandably needy.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Elegirl - Yes, he hit my jaw so hard that the very last tooth broke in half and had to be removed. Gosh, that is a horrible memory to relive.

He broke a chair to my brand new table once (forgot over what..I'm sure me questioning him on something) or actually I had locked him out and he broke in the door and broke the chair.

When I asked him for more clarification on him being at the bar with that other woman he broke my bakers rack.

When I asked him about texting his ex female boss he broke the bathroom sink.

He has punched doors and made holes, etc.

That kind of thing.

He wouldn't have broken them if I didn't bring anything up though, right? I know not acceptable but just saying.


----------



## turnera

Say what?!

He broke things BECAUSE IT SHUT YOU UP. HE chose to break things because that is part of how he controlled you.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Yes that is how he controlled me. I do realize that. It got to the point where I was afraid to say anything although it didn't stop me (I think that's why he got so upset cause it wasn't working, lol)

But yes, towards the end I told myself "what kind of a life am I living?" Walking on egg shells constantly and afraid to talk to him about pretty much anything anymore and that's when I realized that he had control or used those tactics to shut me up and I was actually living that way. In denial yet not in denial. Make sense? Like I knew what was going on in a sense.

At any rate, no more controlling of this gal!! I'm freeeeee from that evil son of a you know what!!!  :smthumbup:


----------



## iBolt

feeling_crazy said:


> Elegirl - Yes, he hit my jaw so hard that the very last tooth broke in half and had to be removed. Gosh, that is a horrible memory to relive.
> 
> He broke a chair to my brand new table once (forgot over what..I'm sure me questioning him on something) or actually I had locked him out and he broke in the door and broke the chair.
> 
> When I asked him for more clarification on him being at the bar with that other woman he broke my bakers rack.
> 
> When I asked him about texting his ex female boss he broke the bathroom sink.
> 
> He has punched doors and made holes, etc.
> 
> That kind of thing.
> 
> He wouldn't have broken them if I didn't bring anything up though, right? I know not acceptable but just saying.


Can you say 'psycho'? What?! I can't believe what I've just read
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## 3Xnocharm

feeling_crazy said:


> He wouldn't have broken them if I didn't bring anything up though, right? I know not acceptable but just saying.


SERIOUSLY??? You are STILL asking this?? No, he wouldnt have broken them if he wasnt a CHEATING, LYING PIG with the maturity of a three year old!


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Elegirl - Yes, he hit my jaw so hard that the very last tooth broke in half and had to be removed. Gosh, that is a horrible memory to relive.
> 
> He broke a chair to *my brand new table* once (forgot over what..I'm sure me questioning him on something) or actually I had locked him out and he *broke in the door and broke the chair*.
> 
> When I asked him for more clarification on him being at the bar with that other woman he broke *my bakers rack.*
> 
> When I asked him about texting his ex female boss he broke the *bathroom sink.*
> 
> He has *punched doors and made holes*, etc.
> 
> That kind of thing.
> 
> He wouldn't have broken them if I didn't bring anything up though, right? I know not acceptable but just saying.


This list of things he broke is exactly what I expected. Look at how many of the things he broke were YOUR things.

People tend to think that an abusive person loses control of them self and just turns into the "destructive hulk mad man". But that's not true. They are very much in control. Note that he did not break HIS things. Nope, he was in complete control and carefully selected what to break.. your things. Your things represent YOU... thus the message is "This time your things, next time it just might be you."


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Elegirl - Yes, he hit my jaw so hard that the very last tooth broke in half and had to be removed. Gosh, that is a horrible memory to relive.
> 
> He broke a chair to my brand new table once (forgot over what..I'm sure me questioning him on something) or actually I had locked him out and he broke in the door and broke the chair.
> 
> When I asked him for more clarification on him being at the bar with that other woman he broke my bakers rack.
> 
> When I asked him about texting his ex female boss he broke the bathroom sink.
> 
> He has punched doors and made holes, etc.
> 
> That kind of thing.
> 
> *He wouldn't have broken them if I didn't bring anything up though, right? I know not acceptable but just saying.*


Now to address this one. I wanted a post just for this one comment of yours.

%#$)&(&#$!!!!!! {string of obscenities} Woman, don't you know that you have the absolute right to ask the man you are in a committed relationship with these things? He has the OBLIGATION to answer them calmly and truthfully. This is what I mean when I say that you have weak boundaries. Your boundary needs to be that you have a right question what looks like inappropriate behavior with other women.

Saying that if you had not brought up things he did not want to respond to is why he hit/abused you and broke things make just as much sense as saying that he did it because you were breathing. He did those things to train you (control you ) to let him cheat, lie, ignore you, etc. 

If you cannot ask your partner why he’s in contact with another woman, then you get the hell out of the relationship.


----------



## feeling_crazy

EleGirl said:


> This list of things he broke is exactly what I expected. Look at how many of the things he broke were YOUR things.
> 
> People tend to think that an abusive person loses control of them self and just turns into the "destructive hulk mad man". But that's not true. They are very much in control. Note that he did not break HIS things. Nope, he was in complete control and carefully selected what to break.. your things. Your things represent YOU... thus the message is "This time your things, next time it just might be you."


I never looked at it that way but makes so much sense! I mean, he didn't have much there to begin with but he had a few things. Mostly everything was mine.

I'm pretty disgusted right now.

Do you think that he (abusers) know what they're doing? Like he (they) aren't just people who have anger issues, etc.? The only reason I ask is because he's super smart, funny, loves God (crazy, right) and seems to know right from wrong. So it's crazy and makes me a bit scared to know that he had planned that out to a T like that.


----------



## feeling_crazy

EleGirl said:


> Now to address this one. I wanted a post just for this one comment of yours.
> %#$)&(&#$!!!!!! {string of obscenities} Woman, don't you know that you have the absolute right to ask the man you are in a committed relationship with these things? He has the OBLIGATION to answer them calmly and truthfully. This is what I mean when I say that you have weak boundaries. Your boundary needs to be that you have a right question what looks like inappropriate behavior with other women.
> 
> Saying that if you had not brought up things he did not want to respond to is why he hit/abused you and broke things make just as much sense as saying that he did it because you were breathing. He did those things to train you (control you ) to let him cheat, lie, ignore you, etc.
> 
> If you cannot ask your partner why he’s in contact with another woman, then you get the hell out of the relationship.


Yes, Elegirl - I hear that 100%. His issue was that he answered my questions but I found them to be dishonest because they didn't make sense so I questioned again and again. Because I needed to make sense of it. So he flipped out when I kept questioning and that's when broke things.

Still doesn't make it right.


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

feeling_crazy said:


> Do you think that he (abusers) know what they're doing? Like he (they) aren't just people who have anger issues, etc.? The only reason I ask is because he's super smart, funny, loves God (crazy, right) and seems to know right from wrong. *So it's crazy and makes me a bit scared to know that he had planned that out to a T like that.*


It IS crazy and it SHOULD make you scared! This is how manipulative people work (I tell you as a recovering manipulator).

The things we say, the things we do, they're done with the thought of what will make the greatest impact to make you want to do what we want. It's not like it's a conscious thought - "oh, f_c hates being told she's a nag, so I'll call her a nag" - but it's something we just do. It's not necessarily an organized, thought-out plan; rather, it's a bad response to conflict. It's "I want this person to do x, and they won't, so I'm going to do whatever it takes to get them to do x". And it takes a whole lot of insight and work to change that. I still slip up, all the time, and I constantly have to stop and think about what I'm doing to make sure I'm not falling into bad habits.

I don't know that he's willing to put that effort in though. And I definitely don't think you should hang out to see if he will!


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> I never looked at it that way but makes so much sense! I mean, he didn't have much there to begin with but he had a few things. Mostly everything was mine.
> 
> I'm pretty disgusted right now.
> 
> Do you think that he (abusers) know what they're doing? Like he (they) aren't just people who have anger issues, etc.? The only reason I ask is because he's super smart, funny, loves God (crazy, right) and seems to know right from wrong. So it's crazy and makes me a bit scared to know that he had planned that out to a T like that.


I doubt that he sits down and plots what to do. But he has learned behavior. Most likely his father or some other male role model in his life was like this. Or it could have been his mother that he identified with. Sometimes abusers learn this behavior on their own.

What happens is that they learn to use their anger and explosive behavior to their advantage. For example in previous relationships (or observing an adult in his younger life) he learned that if he gets angry, yells and breaks things and even hits someone... that person will back down and do what he wants. Of course this usually only works with family and others who are very close... like a girl friend.

And when the set about breaking things they don't want to break their own stuff, they like their own stuff. So they break your stuff. Plus your stuff is a great stand-in for you. So the abuser gets to look completely like a person overtaken by anger and out of control. But they get to have revenge on your by breaking your stuff... and sometimes breaking you. And as you see with yourself, with a bit of twisting things around he can even make you feel like you deserved it and it's your fault.

This behavior is learned on the and controlled in him on the subconscious level. It usually stems from early life learning. IT's automatic by now in him.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Yes, Elegirl - I hear that 100%. His issue was that he answered my questions but I found them to be dishonest because they didn't make sense so I questioned again and again. Because I needed to make sense of it. So he flipped out when I kept questioning and that's when broke things.
> 
> Still doesn't make it right.


What you did was normal. Just about all BS do this. They ask the same question over and over. They do it to make sense. They do it to see if they get the same answers. They do it because each time the WS adds a bit more info so over time the BS gathers more info.

Remember I said that the WS has to do things to help the BS heal. This is one of the things that the WS has to do, they have to answer the questions, even the same questions patiently over and over. It can go on for months. Then once the BS feels that they have the truth, or most of it, the BS will stop the question. 

The fact that he would not do with patiently with you means that he had no interest in helping you heal, or in proving over time that he could be trusted. He was only interested in not talking about it so that he did not feel pressured.

One way I've heard the questioning explained is that a marriage (or committed relationship) is a shared experience. When the WS cheats, they have an experience that cut the BS out. So in order to feel whole again the affair has to be brought into the shared experience. When the BS asks over and over.. and the WS responds, the affair is slowly integrated into their shared experience. Once the BS feels that it's a shared experience, the BS will stop asking the questions... at that point the affair belongs to both of them.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi everyone - Thanks for those words on everything. You break it down and explain it in ways I would have never thought.

Today I'm finding myself very sad and feeling very weak. After being out last night for a friends birthday and not connecting with anyone there, feeling extremely out of place, etc. it just made me want him there or to be with him because I found comfort with him. Like he was my partner and my side kick and who I did everything with and I felt comfortable.

So I ALMOST called him. I had a few drinks in me and I had one of those moments. What if he went and got help, etc. etc.? Like for some reason I didn't even care. My emotions were so strong and I almost did. I didn't though.

But today it's just hard because I'm having the what if moments and they are eating me alive. I can't even explain how I feel but it's intense.

Like I'm almost at a point of saying whatever, I don't care what anyone else thinks, etc. etc.

I need some strong words right now. Any words.


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

Those moments will come. And those moments suck.

That's why I recommended thinking of the most recent thing he did to make you angry. So whenever you're feeling sad and missing him you remember that last a$$hole move he made and remind yourself you aren't missing anything.

He won't change unless he wants to. His actions have shown he doesn't want to. I know how much that hurts, but it's true.

I'm thinking of you. Stay strong, you will look back on this and be happy these dark days are behind you.


----------



## iBolt

Remember the grieving the dead analogy I used earlier? Don't confuse your feelings now for what you actually need. Hang tough.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## turnera

Get a big piece of paper. Write down every time he's ever made you feel bad, ever gotten mad, ever broken something, ever blamed you, ever HIT you...write it all out so you can see it on one piece of paper. 

Going back - JUST FOR COMFORT?

Is that what you're reduced to? Your whole life is boiled down to just not wanting to be alone, to just having to have this man comfort you, squeeze you, lie to you? Are you THAT WEAK?

I don't think so.


----------



## EleGirl

turnera said:


> Get a big piece of paper. Write down every time he's ever made you feel bad, ever gotten mad, ever broken something, ever blamed you, ever HIT you...write it all out so you can see it on one piece of paper.
> 
> Going back - JUST FOR COMFORT?
> 
> Is that what you're reduced to? Your whole life is boiled down to just not wanting to be alone, to just having to have this man comfort you, squeeze you, lie to you? Are you THAT WEAK?
> 
> I don't think so.


She already has this list... she wrote it up in the first couple of pages here.

But it seems that she's stopped reading it.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Hi everyone - Thanks for those words on everything. You break it down and explain it in ways I would have never thought.
> 
> Today I'm finding myself very sad and feeling very weak. After being out last night for a friends birthday and not connecting with anyone there, feeling extremely out of place, etc. it just made me want him there or to be with him because I found comfort with him. Like he was my partner and my side kick and who I did everything with and I felt comfortable.
> 
> So I ALMOST called him. I had a few drinks in me and I had one of those moments. What if he went and got help, etc. etc.? Like for some reason I didn't even care. My emotions were so strong and I almost did. I didn't though.
> 
> But today it's just hard because I'm having the what if moments and they are eating me alive. I can't even explain how I feel but it's intense.
> 
> Like I'm almost at a point of saying whatever, I don't care what anyone else thinks, etc. etc.
> 
> I need some strong words right now. Any words.


Get out your list of bad things he's done. Read it every time you start thinking that you want to talk to him.

When you want to talk to him... first relive him hitting you so hard that he broke your tooth. really re-live it. Stay in that place and then get ANRY.

You need to cultivate your anger. There are times when anger is appropriate. This is one of those times. Cultivate it. Use it for energy. You need that for a while.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello everyone – Thanks for those words. 

Yes, I brought the list out and I’ve read and read and read and read. Thing that is really getting to me is that I’m still sad because I keep thinking of his potential and the good times and how IF I wouldn’t have brought that out of him it wouldn’t have happened. I know it’s totally irrational and not logical but it’s how I FEEL. I guess, maybe I’m not wanting to face reality because deep down I still love him and I want it to work out. I know it’s not normal thinking but I can’t HELP but to want to work it out. I can’t HELP but miss him. 

I don’t know. I’ve never been this torn over a relationship break up.

I’m ok. I haven’t gone back. I’ve been sticking to my word but my mind keeps racing. The thoughts of potential and the thoughts of my portion of it.

It’s wrong I know and I’m sure I’ll get upset and strong again but. Just where I’m at right now and I hate it.

What is wrong with me????? I know that my therapist that I saw when I caught him the 2nd time in our home said that I developed some form of PTSD. I’ve always had OCD and I think that’s my issue right now is that I’m totally obsessing about it. I can’t stop thinking about it. The what if’s, etc.


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

f_c:

There is no potential. Those good things you're remembering are just the times where he wasn't actively treating you like sh!t.

You've never been this torn over a breakup because nobody's ever made you so dependent. He made you weak. I know you aren't weak!

Feelings don't have to be rational. You're right. But you CAN control them. You CAN decide how you want to feel. Right now you're deciding to be sad and to miss him. You have the ability to stop and say "right now I am sad and I don't want to be, I choose to be happy instead".

And then do something that makes you happy.

I think maybe you should step away from the thread and from TAM for about three days. Give yourself some time to get out there without talking to us daily and reminding yourself about this situation. We'll still be here when you come back.


----------



## iBolt

LoveAtDaisys said:


> f_c:
> 
> There is no potential. Those good things you're remembering are just the times where he wasn't actively treating you like sh!t.
> 
> You've never been this torn over a breakup because nobody's ever made you so dependent. He made you weak. I know you aren't weak!
> 
> Feelings don't have to be rational. You're right. But you CAN control them. You CAN decide how you want to feel. Right now you're deciding to be sad and to miss him. You have the ability to stop and say "right now I am sad and I don't want to be, I choose to be happy instead".
> 
> And then do something that makes you happy.
> 
> I think maybe you should step away from the thread and from TAM for about three days. Give yourself some time to get out there without talking to us daily and reminding yourself about this situation. We'll still be here when you come back.


:iagree:


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi everyone - Guess who's back!!!!???? Well, I feel like not being on here was not that great for me. I sort of fell weak. 

Ok, I'm going to be totally honest and I expect for you all to give it to me. I decided to meet him on Friday to get my building entrance key. I'm not sure what came over me but I said screw it, I felt comfortable. Met him parked in a bank parking lot. Lots of cars and activity so I knew I'd be safe. He got into my car and hugged me and we talked for around 10 minutes. I did slip and make out with him very briefly but put an end to it immediately. He did try to seduce me and it worked for a SECOND. Crazy thing is I didn't feel like I was loving the make out session. I wasn't into it. Not sure if that was because I really didn't care to or because I was holding a wall up. Anyway, when he left he told me he loved me and hugged me and I did start crying. I'm not sure why. 

So he texted all weekend and called a few times and was as sweet a pie. I did talk to him briefly. 

Today comes and out of nowhere I didn't hear a peep from him until after he got off of work which isn't his normal "routine". I normally hear first thing every morning. 

He called because his phone line gets disconnected tomorrow and he has a full voicemail inbox of messages from his parents who are both deceased. He's had them saved for years. I get that they mean a lot to him and it's a legitimate concern that he'd lose the messages. So he asked me to reach out to Verizon and find out what his options are to not lose them. I did reach out and even took some time out of the end of my work day to look it up for him and found a few routes. I even had his voicemail password reset so he could actually get into his voicemail and listen to them because he locked himself out. 

While I'm doing this he texted "I love you". It honestly didn't even phase me for a second.

I called him after work to let him know the details, etc. of what options I found. He said he was doing laundry and was very short and non chalant with me. I asked him if he was ok and he said, yes, just had a crazy day. He said, well is that it? I said this weekend you were so nice and pleasant and all of a sudden out of nowhere today your non chalant and are acting like you can't talk? I just don't get that. I said are you around people you can't talk in front of and he whispered "they don't even know who I'm talking to". So anyway, I was bothered and said ok well. Then there was a weird silence and he hung up on me!

Of course I was like REALLLY???? After this is one of the reasons we're broken up today and then after I took time out of my day to help him he hangs up on me? So I teat texted him that he's a jerk and that his phone I being shut off today. I know that's a total lie because it has to be tomorrow but.

He texted back and said "you made me sit in awkward silence. If you want to talk, then talk". I texted back that I did talk and I did try to help and that I didn't care for his temper tantrum although I understand he had a rough day and that I was going little black dress shopping for a wedding I'm going to on Friday and I told him that I hope his night gets better.

He never texted back.

SOOOOOOO, I made the mistake of seeing him Friday briefly and I don't know what is going on. He like totally pulled a 360 on me mood wise and I'm wondering why. Like does he feel like he has control again and the ball I in his court again and that he's "won" or if I did something that I don't even know about. It's really bothering me though.

Like what did I do to deserve that? 

Of course I'm thinking he's already with someone else and the thought of that is crushing me. Not that I want to be with him but that would be REALLY hard to take just a few weeks later.

Or is this a tactic of his? Does he feel like ball is back in court?

I honestly feel like I can't figure this out, it's really bothering me and although I broke up with him I feel like I'M being rejected now. Because I feel weak for one second.

Can you guys please give me some advice here because again, I'm in a bad place. I can't seem to make sense of things and I want to for peace of mind.

Please help! 

P.S. I shouldn't have gotten off of the board, not even for a second. That's how much you all have helped me remain strong. 

P.S.S. He told me on Friday that he accepted my decision and that he's at peace with it and that he's hoping we'll take the time to work on ourselves and reunite someday.

Is all of this screaming he's with someone else? Or again, a tactic? I honestly don't get the immediate turn around in mood and behavior. Please help me make sense of this so I don't go crazy (or craziER)...thank you.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

Honestly, who gives a fvck about why he is doing what he does. You never should have put yourself in that position. You seem incapable of coming to the conclusion that the man is just a piece of sh!t no matter how many times he confirms it for you.


----------



## EleGirl

I'll give you the answer for why he does everything he does.. he's messing with you. He's working as usual to make you feel uncertain about things, to feel jealous, and to put you down.

I actually think your recent interactions with him were good for you because you found out a few things...


He's still game playing and will not stop.

You did him a big favor and his response was to be rude to you.

You are starting to separate from him emotionally as you did not really get caught up in the make out session.

So lessons learned. Don't do this again. He's poison.

What have you been doing for yourself?


----------



## feeling_crazy

Elegirl – Thanks and good to hear from you again. I understand that he’s probably messing with me but I just don’t understand why. Again, he went from being the sweetest, texting how much he misses and loves me and calling, etc. to acting completely distant, non-caring and non chalant overnight. I feel like something happened to make him that way. 

Maybe he’s starting to realize that he’s better off without me? Maybe he’s starting to realize that I was and can be a royal pain in the butt and is feeling relieved? 

I just don’t understand how he fought so hard last time and begged and charmed my socks off and this time hardly anything. So that is like a slap in the face to me. Because I’m finally taking the big step to be rid of him and took it to the point of moving him out and he’s hardly acting like he’s phased now.

Maybe there is and has been someone else in the picture and now he’s falling in love with her so that’s why the sudden switch?

Again, I just feel like now I’m being rejected and the ball is in his court. Because now he doesn’t care. 

I can’t believe that I’m the one who broke up with him and now I’m feeling rejected and questioning even more. I don’t want him to have that power. I don’t want him to feel like he “won”.

I can see if he acted like he didn’t really care from the get go of when I threw him out but to act a certain way at first and then OVERNIGHT change his behavior? Like what “clicked” to make that happen? I just don’t understand. 

This may sound crazy but when he was texting and calling and trying to win me back (with the little efforts that he was), I was feeling stronger. Now, that he’s pulling this I’m feeling weaker. I had the emptiest feeling this morning on the way to work. I couldn’t stop crying. Almost didn’t make it in.

Yes, I know lesson learned and I will not do it again.

I just feel like the ball is in his court again because of the way that I’m feeling. 

The feeling of what if he’s dating someone else, etc. and it’s not easy to handle. That would hurt so bad. To know that he was already with someone else and moving on from me.

What have I been doing? Exercising here and there, reading, watching tv…nothing too fabulous. 

I really am disliking this feeling so much.

I'm confused by all of it this new behavior.


----------



## Princess Puffin'stuff

You seem to be thriving on the drama of it all.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> I made the mistake of seeing him Friday briefly and I don't know what is going on. He like totally pulled a 360 on me mood wise and I'm wondering why. Like does he feel like he has control again and the ball I in his court again and that he's "won"


Exactly. He seduced, you responded. And pulling the 180 is what they do, to pull the rug out from under your feet so you are back to wondering how to keep them happy. They cycle through the 'methods' to keep you on your toes and not let you be secure. They cycle through the methods to see what works on you. You responded to nice, so he had to change to silent, to keep you coming.

If you'd read the book I suggested, you'll understand all of this.


----------



## Gems

I've been following along and rooting for you, f_c.
I think that when you meet him and make out with him, that is confirming for him that he still has control of you. He can still get you to meet with him and make out with him if he chooses to. I really believe that if you cut him off cold turkey - not just phone calls, but not responding to ANY texts or e-mails, not talking to any of his friends (because it would get back to him) and not going any place you know he might be, THAT would drive him crazy. Then he would know that you were completely disengaged and it really is over. 
Have you noticed that it seems like every time you two meet up or talk on the phone he's said things about "working on our own issues" and "reuniting"? It doesn't seem like you've ever argued that either. I think that's his way of keeping you hanging on. And every time you meet with him or respond to a text or an e-mail, he knows that you are STILL hanging on. Couples who are really and truly broken up and don't have kids or other business together rarely text/email/meet in a parking lot. There's just no reason to. 
You have to COMPLETELY disengage to show him that you are over and done with him. Otherwise why should he try hard to get you back? He can still see you or text or e-mail you whenever he's not out sleeping with one of his old girlfriends. And if you don't think he's still doing that, you really are thinking crazy.


----------



## turnera

DD22's friend was with a bipolar guy who choked her, hit her, threatened to kill himself if she left...she finally left and came back home, only to find out she was pregnant, but she was determined to stay here.

Except she kept calling him. She never really broke it off. And now, after a fight with her mom (who was doing EVERYthing for her), she ran back to this sleazeball. All because she never stopped contact with him and he drew her back in. _It's what they do._

That is where you are headed if you don't stop all contact.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

I'm done. Unsubscribing from this thread. I cant take the OP acting like a child any more.


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

In the past, when he was cruel/nonchalant/distant, what did you do? You doubled your efforts to reach out to him, right?

He's playing a trick. He knows you, better than you know you, and he's using that knowledge to try and pull you back in.

If you don't want him to have the power, YOU have to take it away. Does it hurt? Yes! Breakups SUCK. They aren't easy for either party.

It's like a game of tennis. The ball (in this case, your relationship) can only keep moving if both players are active. If you throw down your racket and leave the court, there's nothing he can do, you just ended the game.

By breaking up with him and cutting off his phone and kicking him out, you've "thrown down your racket". You've already ended the game, there's nothing he can do except keep trying to convince you to pick up your racket again. Right now, even if you don't feel like it, YOU have all the power!


----------



## feeling_crazy

Turnera - Thank you! You always put it into such great perspective. I'm picking up the book after work today. I just finished reading the Manipulative Man. Looking forward to this one! 

Gems - Thanks as well! You're very right. I did meet him to get the building entrance key which I didn't really want him having so that was pretty important and I don't plan on doing that again. His phone gets shut off today so I plan on going NC because I'll be able to block his new number once he gets it.

3Xnocharm - I'm sorry that you feel that I'm acting like a child. I honestly think that was a bit harsh but if you feel that way you do. I don't need to hear that from someone on the board as I feel horrible about myself enough as it is. I'm actually feeling kind of dumb right now and like I have major issues because I'm here and am trying to make sense of it all. Thanks for your input and your time though. That is appreciated. 

LoveAtDaisy's - Thanks so much! I really like the way that you guys word it. Your support and words really keep me getting through this.

I'm sorry to any others here who I've come across as child like or who have annoyed. Really not my intention at all. The different points of views and perspectives are what help me so much. When something happens that happens to throw me for a loop I come here and express the entire situation because I want to give you all of the details for the best advice and to keep me in "line". 

It may not SEEM that I'm being helped because I keep asking questions but you all have no idea. It took me so much to even take that first step in which I never thought I would have. Again, IF I didn't have the patience and support here of you all I would have fell weak and let him back in the weekend after I kicked him out. I think that says a lot.


----------



## turnera

You're doing a lot. You just can't rest yet. You need a LOT of therapy, to get to a point where you won't doubt yourself instead of the other person.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Elegirl – Thanks and good to hear from you again. I understand that he’s probably messing with me but I just don’t understand why. ....


I have three large dogs.. There is an irrigation ditch that runs alone side on one of our fields. People walk their dogs along the ditch bank. Every darn time someone walks down that ditch trail with their dog, my dogs, all three of them, run to the fence and bark at the person and thier dog. You'd think that after years of this my dogs would figure out that this is a pretty silly thing to do. But nope, they do it every time.

Now why do they do it? It's simple, they are dogs. And that's what dogs do.


----------



## feeling_crazy

I like that analogy Elegirl! ALOT!

So I need advice on if I'm being evil or not and on what to do?

Of course he’s having issues with accessing the website that will help him save the voicemails that he has saved from his deceased parents. He was needing to do that today because his phone should be cut off today. So he couldn't access the website to do so at work because it is blocked. 

SO he just texted and asked if he could just give me the $60 to keep his current line going for one more month. I wish he didn’t know I was cancelling early cause he wouldn’t ask that. It’s like really though? 

Then I asked him if he had money to get his new line turned on and he said no…um, ok? So he’s not gonna have a phone? 

Like what the hell? I get that cancelling the line today isn't an obligation but I told him today and I gave him options and time to get it figured out.

The voicemailsforever.com website that I suggested to him is $20.00 and you can do it remotely and not have to connect to a computer. I think I’m just going to suck up the $20 and do it for him and email him the messages. Because he said he doesn't have the money.

Now he said is car is overheating…does he have a black cloud over him or what? Lol

Like I don’t even want to have to do the effin work!!!

I guess I'm here because I'm tired of mothering him. EVERY TIME there has been an issue I've come to the rescue or his family and friends have. He was a very spoiled child growing up and still is. He's the youngest of three older sisters. I feel like he doesn't do things purposely because he knows they'll get handled somehow or other.

Anyway, I guess I'm tired. I don't want to be mean or come across as malicious but how will he ever learn if I'm always there to handle things for him? I'm not even his wife (never was) nor girlfriend anymore ya know?

How will he ever learn to appreciate what he had if I don't let him fall on his ass finally?

Is that mean? 

Should I just suck up the $20 and do it for him and cancel his phone line?

Or give him till midnight to get to a computer to handle it?

Again, I don't want to be a "b" word because I know those messages mean so much and he's had them saved for years now but at the same token it's like come on already!!!

What to do? What do I say?

I'm torn and guess maybe being a sucker? Again, those mean a lot to him and I wouldn't want that done to me so that's why I'm asking.

Thanks!!


----------



## turnera

Of course he’s having issues with accessing the website that will help him save the voicemails that he has saved from his deceased parents. He was needing to do that today because his phone should be cut off today. So he couldn't access the website to do so at work because it is blocked. *NOT YOUR PROBLEM. YOU ARE NOT TOGETHER.*

SO he just texted and asked if he could just give me the $60 to keep his current line going for one more month. *NOT YOUR PROBLEM. YOU ARE NOT TOGETHER.*

Then I asked him if he had money to get his new line turned on and he said no…um, ok? So he’s not gonna have a phone? *NOT YOUR PROBLEM. YOU ARE NOT TOGETHER.*

Like what the hell? I get that cancelling the line today isn't an obligation but I told him today and I gave him options and time to get it figured out. *MORE THAN WHAT YOU NEEDED TO DO.*

The voicemailsforever.com website that I suggested to him is $20.00 and you can do it remotely and not have to connect to a computer. I think I’m just going to suck up the $20 and do it for him and email him the messages. Because he said he doesn't have the money. *OF COURSE YOU WILL. YOU ARE A SAVER, IT'S WHAT YOU DO. EVEN THOUGH IT'S NOT YOUR PROBLEM, AS YOU ARE NO LONGER TOGETHER.*

Like I don’t even want to have to do the effin work!!! *THEN DON'T. EXPLAIN TO ME WHY YOU 'HAVE TO' DO ANYTHING?*

I guess I'm here because I'm tired of mothering him. EVERY TIME there has been an issue I've come to the rescue or his family and friends have. He was a very spoiled child growing up and still is. He's the youngest of three older sisters. I feel like he doesn't do things purposely because he knows they'll get handled somehow or other. *OF COURSE HE DOES. AND LOOK AT WHAT YOU ARE DOING.*

Anyway, I guess I'm tired. *I don't want to be mean* or come across as malicious but how will he ever learn if I'm always there to handle things for him? I'm not even his wife (never was) nor girlfriend anymore ya know? *NOT YOUR PROBLEM. YOU ARE NOT TOGETHER.*

How will he ever learn to appreciate what he had *NOT YOUR PROBLEM. YOU ARE NOT TOGETHER.*
if I don't let him fall on his ass finally? *YOU DON'T 'LET' HIM DO ANYTHING. NOT YOUR PROBLEM. YOU ARE NOT TOGETHER.*

Again, I don't want to be a "b" word because I know those messages mean so much and he's had them saved for years *AND HE WAITED UNTIL THE LAST DAY, THE LAST FEW HOURS - TO SUCK YOU BACK IN. ON PURPOSE.*

What to do? What do I say? *DID WE NOT TELL YOU NEVER TO TALK TO HIM AGAIN? WE ALREADY ANSWERED YOU.*

I'm torn and guess maybe being a sucker? *YES*
Again, those mean a lot to him and I wouldn't want that done to me so that's why I'm asking. *AND HE HAS HAD "YEARS" TO GET THEM. HIS FAULT, HIS PROBLEM. AS YOU ARE NO LONGER TOGETHER AND YOU WILL NEVER SEE HIM AGAIN, NOT YOUR PROBLEM.*


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

Agreeing with Turnera.

My father told me years ago, "if something is important to you, you will find the time to do it". He was right.

If those messages were as important as he says, he would have found some way to preserve them before now.

Were those the last words and thoughts I had from my mother and father? I would have found some way to save them to my computer as mp3 files. I would have made multiple copies so I could never lose them, in addition to keeping them on my cell phone. I'm sure you would too.

Lastly: NOT YOUR PROBLEM. YOU ARE NOT TOGETHER.


----------



## Gems

I'm agreeing with Turnera and LoveAtDaisys.
He wouldn't even have asked you if he didn't think you would do it for him. Because you always did and he thinks he still has you controlled to do whatever he wants. So of course you will do this for him too (he's thinking).

Don't do it.

I would say, text him/call whatever just one last time to say, "I'm sorry, the phone's still going to be cut off at midnight, I hope you find a way to save those messages, but I've done all I can. Goodbye."...and click. Hang up. He hung up on you plenty of times.

You may think it's coldhearted, *****y, whatever, but I bet you cash money he will find a way. But you are NOT to do anything FOR HIM anymore, starting NOW.

You've been pretty damn nice in my opinion throughout this whole ordeal, and so far all it has gotten you is grief from him and mixed messages. That can end now if you have the guts to tell him that you are not going to take any further responsibility for this.

And don't you DARE feel guilty! As Daisy's dad said, he would have found time to do it already if it was so damned important to him.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi everyone - I know I shouldn't feel guilty but I am. The cell phone company made the mistake of cancelling earlier but before we get into that.

He called me at work before I got off and I asked what he planned on doing. He said that he doesn't have the money and said "just go ahead and cancel the line and I'll lose the messages and you'll get your way...BYE" and hung up on me!!

At that point I'm infuriated because I didn't get a chance to tell him how I was willing to help him.

I got fired up and decided to look at the cell phone records before I disconnected just to see if I could see anything inappropriate thinking it would fire me up even more. Well, I found that he texted his ex female coworker who he was texting quite a bit a year ago AFTER work hours. We got into how it was inappropriate then and he promised he'd stop. Well, we were still together a month ago and he was texting her. It was one day from 6pm-10pm. He reached out first. I think that's betraying me. IF he needs to talk to her about work related items it can happen DURING the work day, right?

At this point I'm livid but tried to stay calm. Called him to tell him that his phone is being shut off at 12 and it wasn't a joke. I told him that even though he was rude that I wouldn't do that to him. He said "you're not doing me any favors by kicking me out of your home, taking your apartment keys and cancelling your line"...UM REALLY???? I stayed calm there to. I was pretty hurt by that because I'M the reason he even had a phone! He has a storage unit full of furniture for his place when he moved out that I provided to him when I brought new furniture. He has that because of ME! Not to mention the other ways I've taken care of him.

So I started to talk about how he let me down and that he broke a promise. He didn't know what I was talking about. So I told him that I saw that he texted her and that I felt betrayed because he broke a promise. He said "this is what you wanted to talk about? This is what you called for". That made me even more mad. Why dismiss it? So I said that is all you have to say? He said "what do you want me to say?" I was so dumbfounded I just started to rat off how I dislike who he is and some other unfriendly things. He said "it's not even what I think and that I'm wrong." He said "your making things up in your head". I said I SAW them with my own eyes. He said "it's not what you think it's all work related" then he said "you talk to guys that you work with" I said yes I do and it's at work and never after hours! Don't you dare try to justify it and turn it around on me! I said you can never be trusted. I told him that he is missing the whole point! That he has broken my trust in the past time and time again and that it's inappropriate to be texting a female coworker after hours and that he knew it made me feel uncomfortable and he broke his promise to stop! He didn't think much of it. At this point I told him that I wanted nothing to do with him that he fVcked up the best thing he's had in his life and that I'm done and deserve more! I said more but I'll leave that out.

I called the cell phone company to have the phone scheduled to be shut off at midnight and guess what? They accidentally terminated it early so I don't think he even had a chance to save the messages.

I feel HORRIBLE so I tried the cell company again and they reactivated the line temporarily for free t see if the voicemails haven't been lost. He needs to reactivate his phone to use it and I can't call him directly so I texted his friends that he's staying with to please have him call me from one of their phones regarding his voicemail and it's time sensitive. So far no response.

So I feel beyond guilty as them deleting the line was an accident and I know that he'll be hurt and think that I was being evil and vindictive when that wasn't the case. I don't want him to think that I'm a "b" word. I don't want him to have that memory of me.

So I tried to fix it. If he doesn't respond than he's out of luck, I guess.

I know I shouldn't care but like I said those were precious memories for him and I totally may have ruined that for him.

We'll see I f he reaches back.

I'm also feeling SO sad because he's been deleted from Facebook, telephone line now cancelled and I feel like it's the real deal now. Before I was feeling semi-ok because I was still hearing from him and talking but now the reality is sinking in that I cut those ties and it's really over. I'm having panic and anxiety and I feel like my heart has been ripped from my chest. Not to mention the guilt on top of it.

Anyway, I feel dumb for texting his friends but what else could I do?

Please help me kick this feeling of guilt. 

I don't want him to think that I'm evil.


----------



## iBolt

f_c

Just a quick and serious question. IF the servers that carried TAM blacked tomorrow, what would you do until carriage was restored?


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Hi everyone - I know I shouldn't feel guilty but I am. The cell phone company made the mistake of cancelling earlier but before we get into that.
> 
> He called me at work before I got off and I asked what he planned on doing. He said that he doesn't have the money and said "just go ahead and cancel the line and I'll lose the messages and you'll get your way...BYE" and hung up on me!!
> 
> At that point I'm infuriated because I didn't get a chance to tell him how I was willing to help him.
> 
> I got fired up and decided to look at the cell phone records before I disconnected just to see if I could see anything inappropriate thinking it would fire me up even more. Well, I found that he texted his ex female coworker who he was texting quite a bit a year ago AFTER work hours. We got into how it was inappropriate then and he promised he'd stop. Well, we were still together a month ago and he was texting her. It was one day from 6pm-10pm. He reached out first. I think that's betraying me. IF he needs to talk to her about work related items it can happen DURING the work day, right?
> 
> At this point I'm livid but tried to stay calm. Called him to tell him that his phone is being shut off at 12 and it wasn't a joke. I told him that even though he was rude that I wouldn't do that to him. He said "you're not doing me any favors by kicking me out of your home, taking your apartment keys and cancelling your line"...UM REALLY???? I stayed calm there to. I was pretty hurt by that because I'M the reason he even had a phone! He has a storage unit full of furniture for his place when he moved out that I provided to him when I brought new furniture. He has that because of ME! Not to mention the other ways I've taken care of him.
> 
> So I started to talk about how he let me down and that he broke a promise. He didn't know what I was talking about. So I told him that I saw that he texted her and that I felt betrayed because he broke a promise. He said "this is what you wanted to talk about? This is what you called for". That made me even more mad. Why dismiss it? So I said that is all you have to say? He said "what do you want me to say?" I was so dumbfounded I just started to rat off how I dislike who he is and some other unfriendly things. He said "it's not even what I think and that I'm wrong." He said "your making things up in your head". I said I SAW them with my own eyes. He said "it's not what you think it's all work related" then he said "you talk to guys that you work with" I said yes I do and it's at work and never after hours! Don't you dare try to justify it and turn it around on me! I said you can never be trusted. I told him that he is missing the whole point! That he has broken my trust in the past time and time again and that it's inappropriate to be texting a female coworker after hours and that he knew it made me feel uncomfortable and he broke his promise to stop! He didn't think much of it. At this point I told him that I wanted nothing to do with him that he fVcked up the best thing he's had in his life and that I'm done and deserve more! I said more but I'll leave that out.
> 
> I called the cell phone company to have the phone scheduled to be shut off at midnight and guess what? They accidentally terminated it early so I don't think he even had a chance to save the messages.
> 
> I feel HORRIBLE so I tried the cell company again and they reactivated the line temporarily for free t see if the voicemails haven't been lost. He needs to reactivate his phone to use it and I can't call him directly so I texted his friends that he's staying with to please have him call me from one of their phones regarding his voicemail and it's time sensitive. So far no response.
> 
> So I feel beyond guilty as them deleting the line was an accident and I know that he'll be hurt and think that I was being evil and vindictive when that wasn't the case. I don't want him to think that I'm a "b" word. I don't want him to have that memory of me.
> 
> So I tried to fix it. If he doesn't respond than he's out of luck, I guess.
> 
> I know I shouldn't care but like I said those were precious memories for him and I totally may have ruined that for him.
> 
> We'll see I f he reaches back.
> 
> I'm also feeling SO sad because he's been deleted from Facebook, telephone line now cancelled and I feel like it's the real deal now. Before I was feeling semi-ok because I was still hearing from him and talking but now the reality is sinking in that I cut those ties and it's really over. I'm having panic and anxiety and I feel like my heart has been ripped from my chest. Not to mention the guilt on top of it.
> 
> Anyway, I feel dumb for texting his friends but what else could I do?
> 
> Please help me kick this feeling of guilt.
> 
> *I don't want him to think that I'm evil*.


Oh good lord. Get a grip. You are not evil. He had a few weeks notice that the phone was being cut off. HE IGNORED it all this time. So it's HIS PROBLEM that he did not take care of this in a timely manner. Most messages can be downloaded directly from a cell phone to a computer file. He had more than enough time to act like a big boy and take care of his own stuff.

If you hear anything else from him on this just tell him he had weeks to take care of it.


----------



## iBolt

EleGirl said:


> Oh good lord. Get a grip. You are not evil. He had a few weeks notice that the phone was being cut off. HE IGNORED it all this time. So it's HIS PROBLEM that he did not take care of this in a timely manner. Most messages can be downloaded directly from a cell phone to a computer file. He had more than enough time to act like a big boy and take care of his own stuff.
> 
> If you hear anything else from him on this just tell him he had weeks to take care of it.


EleGirl You deserve a medal. 

I am not sure if f_c would not be happier being back with this dude JUST to be sure that: 

1. she is not an evil witch
2. the dude is a car crash
3, even evil witches get fatally hurt by car crashes


----------



## feeling_crazy

Well...it's done. Like really done. He texted to say that he activated the phone line and "the messages are gone and you're awesome!"

Really? He doesn't even know what I went through to make that happen! So I texted "you don't even know what I went through to make that happen! They cancelled early accidentally you ungrateful prick! and yes, I am pretty awesome!"

So he responded with the guilt trip text of "Thanks, now that I skipped through those other paragraphs you wrote earlier it means so much more in the long run than those voices that are gone forever. At least I heard my mother singing to me and daddy talking to me yesterday when I listened to them. Maybe I'll write about it and the consequences of momentary vindictiveness."

So I'm seeing that REGARDLESS of what I say he's still going to paint me out to be the evil person and there is no point in trying to prove to him otherwise.

No thank you for trying, no nothing but that I'm a vindictive woman. That hurts so much. I don't think he ever saw the good in me. What a slap in the face.

Sometimes I feel like hates woman. Because his mom was abusive and his ex wife cheated, left him, etc. he probably just thinks all woman are evil.

I texted one FINAL text "I already told you that it was scheduled for midnight. It was a fluke that I spent an hour trying to fix, including paying a reactivation fee. You should know better that I did nothing to hurt you intentionally. I've always had your back and where has that gotten me? You're going to think what you want regardless of what I say. I've already explained what happened and again no longer need to prove anything. You've had over a week to get this handled anyway. I've done all I could do and I've been OVERLY nice considering the circumstances. I can rest and sleep peacefully knowing that I've been good to you even after the fact. And you say I'm entitled? Seriously? lol. Please have a good night. Please don't text back as I'm done. The phone is being disconnected again in a moment anyway. So you're welcome and take good care."

His phone is now RE DISCONNECTED. 

I can't believe that he views me in such a negative light. He feels entitled and is so ungrateful. That's his thing. Entitlement and Non Empathetic. He never apologizes either.

SOOOOOOO, I'm done feeling guilty. I've seriously have done enough for him. It was an accident and he still views me poorly? No point in worrying about what he thinks.

I doubt I'll be hearing from him again and it's gonna be hard but I have to really let go now.

I'm off to start reading Why Does He Do That and am looking forward to it.

I am in shock over his response though. I'm always the bad one, lol.


----------



## EleGirl

In the kindest way I can say this...

I'm shocked that you are still getting all caught up in this nonsense.. he's a big boy and had plenty of time to get those messages. If he really cared so much about them he would have copied them off right after they passed away.

So stop... if he calls you again from another number just hang up on him. 

Get a grip.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy,

I talked to you before about setting boundaries. Here is one for you to add to the list you need to make.


Never, ever do anything for a male over the age of 4 that they can do for themselves.

What you see with his attitude about this messages, his being upset that you cancelled his cell that you were paying for, etc... is the results of you treating an adult man like a 3 year old...like you had to take care of him like a baby. Oh and he used that over and over again.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello Elegirl and everyone,

It was a long night and so hard to get out of bed today. I seriously feel like my heart has been ripped out of my chest. I may go home from work early today because I just feel drained and super sad. Again, because this is the real thing. 

I’m not feeling so guilty anymore about the messages. Again, nothing I can do. I do feel that I was a bit impulsive. I guess I’m telling myself I could have kept him on the line and just let him pay the $60 per month until the contract was up in a few months. I don’t even remember what the rush was or why I had to do that. It’s not like he can’t reach out to me any other way. I think it’s how I respond that matters, right? Or wrong?

I just feel like we were together for so long and that I could have been a bit more lenient and patient with how I approached the break up. I feel like I had pressure from my friends and I think from a few here to get the phone line cut off.

He even said yesterday “why the rush to get me out and to cut me off completely?” 

He was screwed over by his ex wife and left with nothing and now he was left with nothing by me and out of nowhere on top of that. He went from one relationship where he got screwed to our relationship in where he got screwed. Like he completely had the rug pulled out from underneath him and had no time to plan, etc. so I do feel bad about that. Like he felt so badly about himself because his ex wife cheated on him and left him for another man so he was down and out and then you have me starting in the middle of the relationship always whining and complaining and telling him what he doesn’t do instead of praising and helping him to become a better person. So I feel like he just got royally screwed.

Maybe that's why I did "baby him" as you say Elegirl. Because I felt bad for him.

I know I shouldn’t but it’s the way I feel because I do love him and I think always will so it’s hard for me to see someone struggling. That’s always been me though and even my family is like that. They forgive quickly and love whole heartedly. It’s just in me to be this way. I don’t have the heart to ever hurt anyone or see them down regardless of what they’ve done. 

He did email this morning and said “good morning” so maybe he realized that he was being a brat and unappreciative. I’m surprised honestly that he even reached out. He’s throwing me off with that because in my head I want to think it’s because he loves me and forgives me for the impulsive and bratty decisions that I make. 

Do you all ever think that he really loved/loves me? Is there a possibility for someone like this to ever change with therapy? Or is he too much of a narcissist? The one’s that could probably drive a therapist crazy? Lol

I feel like he’s never had to suffer repercussions for his decisions with me so what if this will set him straight? Because he’s never “lost” me. Is there ever any hope? 

Maybe the fear is kicking in and I’m just thinking irrationally again. I just want to hear from you all if it’s ever a possibility or if he’s a goner. My mom said once that a person is who they are going to be by their mid 30’s and from there it’s VERY HARD to change. True statement?

Please understand where I’m coming from. I do love him so it’s a struggle now. I think more than ever. Just hoping to hear your honest opinion about people like him and the possibility of change with therapy, etc. Or is it a lost cause.

If you think lost cause then I know for sure and it’ll be the last time I need closure on this.


----------



## Princess Puffin'stuff

This whole ridiculous drama is unnecessary. You're feeding it and thriving on it. I can't believe people are continuing to respond to this craziness. OP - please seek professional help.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> those were precious memories for him and I totally may have ruined that for him.


Please explain to me how YOU ruined anything. You bent over backwards, you were going to PAY to save his messages, YOU got it reinstated after they accidentally disconnected it. YOU contacted him. YOU contacted his friends.

Tell me where, in all that, YOU did anything to ruin anything?

fc, you seriously need a therapist. This behavior is beyond victimhood.


----------



## Gems

I feel the need to tell you that your thinking that he has been "screwed over" is just so far out of whack that I now think you really need some serious mental health help. I'm not even kidding.

So, this guy has:
Cheated on you several times
Hit you
Broken your things
Provided with free room and board by you
Provided with free furniture by you
Provided with free cell phone service by you
Now is willfully screwing with you

And HE is the one that's been screwed over? I don't even know in what universe that's possible. YOU were screwed over. You believed all the lies this dirtbag ever tried to tell you. When you didn't, and questioned it, he broke your stuff and hit you. He could have killed you, do you realize that? Yes I know he was drunk, and you were questioning him, but NORMAL people do not respond to questioning by hitting their partners even when they're drunk. He cheated on you MANY MANY times, far more than you know or even suspect, I will tell you that.
What is your limit, f_c? When do YOU decide that someone no longer deserves your time, love, and energy? Because this guy doesn't and no, he NEVER will.


----------



## Prodigal

I think there are some very well-meaning people here who are trying to give excellent advice. However, although that advice is briefly acknowledged, it is followed by yet another narrative of allowing this man to have contact ... and the pain that causes.

Perhaps the OP'er is as much a victim of herself as she is/was of this abusive man.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Thank you for the honest and direct words. I need to hear it this way.

Gems, yes the physical was mostly when drinking. I was very mouthy though and said some very nasty things to him as I was beligernt and rehashing the bad times cussing him out, calling him names, etc. Yep, I lost it too. Again, not justifying it.

The other times were yes breaking things cause I wanted to "talk" and continue to have my questions answered. I know, no excuse.

But Yes, I've been a victim of myself. NO doubt. I can't deny that and it hurts. I think that the main reason is because I'm such a lover and a caretaker and a forgiver. I want to believe the best in everyone and I think that people have the ability to change so I continue to forgive and give chances.

I will not live that way again. That is a promise.

I'm on the path to a new life with a few questions and set backs but that is ok. I'm here today and thought I'd never be and I'm going to keep moving forward, period. 

I will say that he's been relentless today in trying to reach out to me. He's messaged me and has said "good morning" He has asked me "how does your bed feel at night", "I miss flirting with my girlfriend of five years" and now just asked "what time are you off because I'd like to see you tonight if your daughter is working late. I thought you would like some company".

Now this is nutty to me! I haven't responded at all but his behavior is so odd. Like he just won't take no for an answer. He is starting to scare me to be honest with you.

So either he is really realizing the error of his ways and knows I've slipped through is fingers so he's going to step his game up OR I'm a game and/or a conquest to him to see if he can "win" again.

What the fudge...I'm hoping he'll let go eventually.

In the meantime, him acting this way is actually clarification to the type of person he is. Instead of reeling me in he's sinking a deeper hole for himself.


----------



## turnera

He's just cycling through the wheel, trying to figure out which comment will get you to respond.


----------



## feeling_crazy

I think he's a bipolar narcissist...scary


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

You're free, f_c.

Ignore all future communication from him and move on with your life. You deserve it.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Yes, I'm going to block him because it's not stopping. Now, it's with the guilt trip of because I did respond to leave it alone. It's done and this isn't a game so he responded with the whole guilt trip of:

"This game you speak of sure is painful... what the ****. I just miss you. Im hurting and wanted to feel better for a minute. no game. just a question......bye"

So yah, he's upping his game now. He hasn't tried to talk to me or see me this much for the last two weeks so why now? He's in panic mode cause he realizes I'm not joking or he's still trying to win.

Either way, I'm done communicating with him.


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

:woohoo::yay:

BLOCK HIM. I'd also highly recommend letting a girl friend know what's going on; if he can't get to you through you he may try through your friends.

And get yourself a nice glass of wine and a good book/veg to a good show tonight, you've earned it!


----------



## EleGirl

FC,

The reason you dropped him off your cell service is because that ties you to him in a huge way. To break off with him, you have off every connection in one fell swoop.

He's a big boy and can get his own cell service. For Cricket service he does not even need to go through a credit check. There are all kinds of alternatives for getting a cell.

Enabling a person to abuse you and use you (financially and otherwise) is not being loving. It's being stupid. This is what you are doing.

In a healthy relationship each partner encourages and supports the other to be the best they can be. That's a huge component of love. Putting up with his lying, cheating, abuse, violence and disrespect is encouraging him to be the worst he can be.

Your definition of love and kindness are messed up.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello everyone - Long time. I've taken a step back and have been doing things like reading, etc. I'm in the middle of "Why Does He Do That". Very interesting read. 

Today is my birthday and talk about having a HARD time emotionally. I knew it'd be bad but not THIS bad. 

Of course because I'm 39 and didn't think that my life would be where it is today. I have spent the last 5 years celebrating with him. Always the same type of special celebration. It doesn't help that he texted and asked if I wanted to do that. Just so we can hang out and talk.

Yes, he texted. He has a new new phone. 

Over the last few weeks. I saw that he added one of the girls he was texting and deleting the messages last year on Facebook. As soon as I delete him from Facebook he goes and adds her? Then on top of that he liked her "out there" picture? This is coming from a man that told me that I was "attention" seeking and never liked anything I did on Facebook when we were together. But here the girl he was texting and deleting last year is now his friend and he's liking her things? Like she's not attention seeking? Why is it that I get made to feel like a slvt for posting pictures on Facebook but he praises hers? That just doesn't make sense to me.

So he was texting her and deleting messages last year and now FB friends and liking her pic and commenting? Does that mean he was talking to her and seeing her whole time? Isn't that kinda fast for someone who has said he loves me and doesn't want anyone else? Doesn't that seem fishy?

Also, my good friend (who dated his best friend for years) told me yesterday that he had on occasion taken her phone to make phone calls to the girl he cheated on me with because he was afraid that I'd see the records. WOW, this was EARLY in the relationship when things were ok between us. 

When I confronted him he didn't deny it and said why is that you're so stuck in the past? Why can't you let things go and move forward? I told you that I've changed and won't do it again. He told me that he can never move forward and be a better man if I keep bringing up the past.

I said do you honestly think you're capable of being faithful to me? He said ABSOLUTELY. I said no you can't. That's why I keep bringing up the past to make a point that you won't. You did this even when things were good between us. I asked what is different now? He said, because it just is.

He said today that he's sorry. That he's realized the error of his ways and has really learned his lesson. That he can't concentrate on work and can't stop thinking about me. He keeps wondering if our relationship is too tainted to fix. He keeps wondering if he should just let me go because of all of his infractions. He wonders if couples therapy would work. He wonders if we should just take things day by day, he says that he can't handle not hearing from me everyday. 

Of course when he agrees to couples therapy it makes me think well WHAT IF? What if it's different this time because I've never made him deal with repercussions for his behavior. What if?

So I was just too bummed today to go to work. He called to wish happy birthday. From different numbers I need to add and I was crying. He said to enjoy my birthday and day off and to not be sad. I said how can I not be sad? My life is not where I expected it to be and I'm grieving a relationship. He got upset and yelled. I'm trying to be positive and all you do is wallow in the mud. I'm trying to make you feel better and you're stuck in the past. I said you don't have to try and make me feel better but please respect that YES I'm Debbie Downer right now and yes I'm not positive and haven't been lately. If I'm sad on my birthday I'm sad. So be it! It's because of you anyway. So please don't tell me how to grieve and that it's not ok to be sad.

He totally just brushed it off and said I don't know what to say anymore. Did you want me to come over and hang out? I said, of course not. that's not a good idea and hung up.

I haven't heard from him since. But of course on my birthday I'm beyond sad and he's thrown a curve ball my way with the whole therapy deal, etc.

Is there any chance that he's learned a lesson from me actually leaving for this long? Will therapy help?

I feel like there is no way. He's had so many chances to change. but then again, I've never left him like this.

Or is he desperate because he hates where he's living now? Is having car issues? Cannot get approved for a place to stay because of his credit issues and background check which includes DUI and Domestic Violence charges.

He said that he would never live with me again though. So i don't know if desperate.

I'm here for support again because I can't lie. I'm having a weak moment with the what if's. Is any of the above possible?

Have cheaters learned after multiple instances once they were taught a lesson?

Or am I just way off in thinking.

What a way to spend my birthday right? It's horrible.

I look forward to hearing from you all again. I'm needing the advice and support during my moment of possible weakness.

Thank you so much.


----------



## EleGirl




----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Hello everyone - Long time. I've taken a step back and have been doing things like reading, etc. I'm in the middle of "Why Does He Do That". Very interesting read.
> 
> Today is my birthday and talk about having a HARD time emotionally. I knew it'd be bad but not THIS bad.
> 
> Of course because I'm 39 and didn't think that my life would be where it is today. I have spent the last 5 years celebrating with him. Always the same type of special celebration. It doesn't help that he texted and asked if I wanted to do that. Just so we can hang out and talk.
> 
> Yes, he texted. He has a new new phone.
> 
> Over the last few weeks. I saw that he added one of the girls he was texting and deleting the messages last year on Facebook. As soon as I delete him from Facebook he goes and adds her? Then on top of that he liked her "out there" picture? This is coming from a man that told me that I was "attention" seeking and never liked anything I did on Facebook when we were together. But here the girl he was texting and deleting last year is now his friend and he's liking her things? Like she's not attention seeking? Why is it that I get made to feel like a slvt for posting pictures on Facebook but he praises hers? That just doesn't make sense to me.
> 
> So he was texting her and deleting messages last year and now FB friends and liking her pic and commenting? Does that mean he was talking to her and seeing her whole time? Isn't that kinda fast for someone who has said he loves me and doesn't want anyone else? Doesn't that seem fishy?
> 
> Also, my good friend (who dated his best friend for years) told me yesterday that he had on occasion taken her phone to make phone calls to the girl he cheated on me with because he was afraid that I'd see the records. WOW, this was EARLY in the relationship when things were ok between us.
> 
> When I confronted him he didn't deny it and said why is that you're so stuck in the past? Why can't you let things go and move forward? I told you that I've changed and won't do it again. He told me that he can never move forward and be a better man if I keep bringing up the past.
> 
> I said do you honestly think you're capable of being faithful to me? He said ABSOLUTELY. I said no you can't. That's why I keep bringing up the past to make a point that you won't. You did this even when things were good between us. I asked what is different now? He said, because it just is.
> 
> He said today that he's sorry. That he's realized the error of his ways and has really learned his lesson. That he can't concentrate on work and can't stop thinking about me. He keeps wondering if our relationship is too tainted to fix. He keeps wondering if he should just let me go because of all of his infractions. He wonders if couples therapy would work. He wonders if we should just take things day by day, he says that he can't handle not hearing from me everyday.
> 
> Of course when he agrees to couples therapy it makes me think well WHAT IF? What if it's different this time because I've never made him deal with repercussions for his behavior. What if?
> 
> So I was just too bummed today to go to work. He called to wish happy birthday. From different numbers I need to add and I was crying. He said to enjoy my birthday and day off and to not be sad. I said how can I not be sad? My life is not where I expected it to be and I'm grieving a relationship. He got upset and yelled. I'm trying to be positive and all you do is wallow in the mud. I'm trying to make you feel better and you're stuck in the past. I said you don't have to try and make me feel better but please respect that YES I'm Debbie Downer right now and yes I'm not positive and haven't been lately. If I'm sad on my birthday I'm sad. So be it! It's because of you anyway. So please don't tell me how to grieve and that it's not ok to be sad.
> 
> He totally just brushed it off and said I don't know what to say anymore. Did you want me to come over and hang out? I said, of course not. that's not a good idea and hung up.
> 
> I haven't heard from him since. But of course on my birthday I'm beyond sad and he's thrown a curve ball my way with the whole therapy deal, etc.
> 
> Is there any chance that he's learned a lesson from me actually leaving for this long? Will therapy help?
> 
> I feel like there is no way. He's had so many chances to change. but then again, I've never left him like this.
> 
> Or is he desperate because he hates where he's living now? Is having car issues? Cannot get approved for a place to stay because of his credit issues and background check which includes DUI and Domestic Violence charges.
> 
> He said that he would never live with me again though. So i don't know if desperate.
> 
> I'm here for support again because I can't lie. I'm having a weak moment with the what if's. Is any of the above possible?
> 
> Have cheaters learned after multiple instances once they were taught a lesson?
> 
> Or am I just way off in thinking.
> 
> What a way to spend my birthday right? It's horrible.
> 
> I look forward to hearing from you all again. I'm needing the advice and support during my moment of possible weakness.
> 
> Thank you so much.


Look at the things you posted in this last post….

Using your friend’s cell phone to call other women. The woman on facebook. Him snappy at you on the phone.

He does seem to miss you at least some. But he also does not seem to have changed one bit.

Not to beat up on you… but you made a mistake to not have planned to so something with someone today. For the holidays for the next year, plan something far in advance with other people so that you are not alone.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Elegirl - THANK YOU! So good to hear from you again.

I can go to dinner with a friend this evening and my daughter but I'm not feeling up to it. I've been crying all day. Horribly.

So yes, I see he hasn't changed much. But he's also said some things he hasn't said before. The counseling. Is it hopeless?

Is it all hopeless? Is he desperate?

I'm totally questioning myself.

Of course I thought I'd hear from him after I turned him down because it's my birthday but he's disappeared. Probably because I'm such a negative nelly and Debbie Downer. How can I be happy and positive right now though?

I don't know if couples therapy would reform him or if its even worth considering. Probably not, right?

There is no way he's changed so fast. how can that be?


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Elegirl - THANK YOU! So good to hear from you again.
> 
> I can go to dinner with a friend this evening and my daughter but I'm not feeling up to it. I've been crying all day. Horribly.
> 
> So yes, I see he hasn't changed much. But he's also said some things he hasn't said before. The counseling. Is it hopeless?
> 
> Is it all hopeless? Is he desperate?
> 
> I'm totally questioning myself.
> 
> Of course I thought I'd hear from him after I turned him down because it's my birthday but he's disappeared. Probably because I'm such a negative nelly and Debbie Downer. How can I be happy and positive right now though?
> 
> I don't know if couples therapy would reform him or if its even worth considering. Probably not, right?
> 
> There is no way he's changed so fast. how can that be?


From his phone calls, no he has not changed. 

MC will not change him. Only he can change himself. 

A much much bigger question for you...

Could you emotionally surviving giving him a 6 month chance at counseling only to find out that he is still doing all that he was behind your back?


----------



## feeling_crazy

I feel like I could survive, however, I don't know if I can trust. I feel like he will more than ever now try and cover his tracks than before. Because he knows that I'm on to him and now he has his own cell phone so I wouldn't be able to check cell phone records, etc.

Well, he just failed a test and I feel it won't change. I asked him IF in the event down the road that I were willing to give him another chance if he were willing to be transparent. He got defensive. Said "yep, that's what plan A should be". I said that when cheaters do what they did that's what they should be willing to do. He said "Of course. My life will be an interview and you can have everything you need. Yep, of course. I'll sign my life away and hung up on me".

I think that reaction said it all. IF he really loved me why would he be so defensive about it? Wouldn't the response have been of course I love you baby. Whatever it takes? But he has to make me feel bad for even asking if it was possible AFTER I shouldn't have even considered it!!

Am I right? Or overreacting? 

My mom said to try and test him that way and see how he responds and he failed.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> So yes, I see he hasn't changed much. But he's also *said* some things he hasn't said before. The counseling. Is it hopeless?


fc, what does it say in Why Does He Do That? What does it say is the abuser/controller's NUMBER ONE way to control you?

With WORDS. People like him LIE LIKE WEASELS. And WORDS are their METHOD to get you to do what they want.

What's the old adage?

ACTIONS, NOT WORDS.

Is he in therapy? Is he deleting all other women from his life? is he no longer RAISING HIS VOICE at you? 

Of course not. Because he expects to be able to use his WORDS to get back to his status quo.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> I feel like I could survive, however, I don't know if I can trust. I feel like he will more than ever now try and cover his tracks than before. Because he knows that I'm on to him and now he has his own cell phone so I wouldn't be able to check cell phone records, etc.


Yep. If you got back with him, he would have to agree to give you the password to his cell account online and to his cell phone so you could check it every time.



feeling_crazy said:


> Well, he just failed a test and I feel it won't change.


Did you just talk to him again? Sounds like it.


feeling_crazy said:


> I asked him IF in the event down the road that I were willing to give him another chance if he were willing to be transparent. He got defensive. Said "yep, that's what plan A should be". I said that when cheaters do what they did that's what they should be willing to do. He said "Of course. My life will be an interview and you can have everything you need. Yep, of course. I'll sign my life away and hung up on me".


Well he told you that he has no plan to be transparent, ever. He has no plan to stop cheating, ever.


feeling_crazy said:


> I think that reaction said it all. IF he really loved me why would he be so defensive about it? Wouldn't the response have been of course I love you baby. Whatever it takes? But he has to make me feel bad for even asking if it was possible AFTER I shouldn't have even considered it!!


Yes, if you loves you and want to be with you his main concern would be helping you heal, making you feel safe and him proving that he can be trusted over time. He could are less if you feel safe and heal. 


feeling_crazy said:


> Am I right? Or overreacting?


You are right on.


feeling_crazy said:


> My mom said to try and test him that way and see how he responds and he failed.


Your mom had a good idea. I’d rephrase it. He failed sure, but he told you what his true intentions are.


----------



## feeling_crazy

EleGirl said:


> Yep. If you got back with him, he would have to agree to give you the password to his cell account online and to his cell phone so you could check it every time.
> 
> 
> Did you just talk to him again? Sounds like it.
> 
> Well he told you that he has no plan to be transparent, ever. He has no plan to stop cheating, ever.
> 
> 
> Yes, if you loves you and want to be with you his main concern would be helping you heal, making you feel safe and him proving that he can be trusted over time. He could are less if you feel safe and heal.
> 
> You are right on.
> 
> Your mom had a good idea. I’d rephrase it. He failed sure, but he told you what his true intentions are.


He just sent:

Baby have a good night. Know that I love you and truly wish and pray god cover you in peace on your special day. I'm sorry it was your worst birthday ever and I know its all because of me. I'm so sorry I feel horrible. I just wanna go back to bed.I'm sorry
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> It doesn't help that he texted and asked if I wanted to do that. *Just so we can hang out and talk*. Manipulation.
> 
> Yes, he texted. *He has a new new phone*. Funny how NOW he has money.
> 
> Over the last few weeks. I saw that *he added one of the girls he was texting* and deleting the messages last year on Facebook. As soon as I delete him from Facebook he goes and adds her? Well, duh, that's what his purpose is - to have women hang on him to stroke his ego. If you're not willing to do it, someone has to.
> 
> Then on top of that he liked her "out there" picture? This is coming from a man that told me that *I was "attention" seeking* and *never liked anything I did *on Facebook when we were together. Because once he has you, his job is to tear you down, to KEEP you. All part of the game: build the NEW girl up to hook her, and tear the OLD girl (you) down, to KEEP you kissing his ass.
> 
> Why is it that *I get made to feel like a slvt* for posting pictures on Facebook but he praises hers? That just doesn't make sense to me. Because he has to tear down the woman who has committed to him, so she will lose confidence and won't leave him. You should have read that in Why Does He Do That? by now.
> 
> So he was texting her and deleting messages last year and now FB friends and liking her pic and commenting? Does that mean he was talking to her and seeing her whole time? Isn't that kinda fast for someone who has said he loves me and doesn't want anyone else? Doesn't that seem fishy? No. It's what Abusers and Users do - keep you down on your knees begging him not to be mad at you, while he's chatting up the NEXT woman on his list - as it's all part of the game (which you should have read in WDHDT).
> 
> Also, my *good friend* (who dated his best friend for years) told me yesterday that he had on occasion *taken her phone *to make phone calls to the girl he cheated on me with because he was afraid that I'd see the records. WOW, this was *EARLY in the relationship *when things were ok between us. So, the person you consider a GOOD FRIEND let him cheat on you WITHOUT TELLING YOU and you still call her a good friend? Wow. And he's been cheating YOUR ENTIRE RELATIONSHIP? Wow. That tells me that you don't have the self worth to get rid of 'good' friends who help your husband cheat on you and not tell you (whose friend IS she?), your husband simply is incapable of not cheating, and fully intended to cheat on you from the beginning, and he considered himself enough of a player to schmooz with your 'good' friend and know she wouldn't tell on him. Why are you not furious?
> 
> When I confronted him he didn't deny it and said why is that you're so stuck in the past? Why can't you let things go and move forward? I told you that I've changed and won't do it again. He told me that he can never move forward and be a better man if I keep bringing up the past. All typical Cheater and Abuser words. From the script. Follow actions, not words.
> 
> He said today that he's sorry. That he's realized the error of his ways and has really learned his lesson. In a month? Right. That he can't concentrate on work and can't stop thinking about me. My abuser fiancé said the same thing. He keeps wondering if our relationship is too tainted to fix. He keeps wondering if he should just let me go because of all of his infractions. Trying the guilt thing so you feel sorry for him and say 'oh no, don't feel bad about yourself, you're not that bad.' He wonders if couples therapy would work. He wonders if we should just take things day by day, he says that he can't handle not hearing from me everyday. Typical abuser script.
> 
> Of course when he agrees to couples therapy it makes me think well WHAT IF? What if it's different this time because I've never made him deal with repercussions for his behavior. What if? You made him deal for, what, 3 weeks? Five weeks? that is NOT long enough to even DECIDE to change, let alone do any WORK to change. You are deluding yourself because you want him so badly.
> 
> So I was just too bummed today to go to work. Are you going to get fired for missing so much work? He called to wish happy birthday. From different numbers I need to add and I was crying. He said to enjoy my birthday and day off and to not be sad. *I said* how can I not be sad? My life is not where I expected it to be and *I'm grieving a relationship*. He *got upset and yelled*. I'm trying to be positive and *all you do is wallow in the mud*. I'm trying to make you feel better and you're stuck in the past. You said you were grieving AND HE YELLED AT YOU. You 'made him feel bad' by showing him what he did wrong - and he YELLED at YOU. Honey, that's not change.
> 
> So please *don't tell me how to grieve* and that it's not ok to be sad. He totally *just brushed it off* and said I *don't know what to say anymore*. Did you want me to come over and hang out? I said, of course not. that's not a good idea and hung up. So when you DO stand up to him, he ignores it. Because that doesn't help him regain control. I'm proud that you said not to come over, btw.
> 
> Is there any chance that he's learned a lesson from me actually leaving for this long? Will therapy help? No. Well, it won't help him. Therapy for YOU will help YOU.
> 
> Or is he desperate because he hates where he's living now? Is having car issues? Cannot get approved for a place to stay because of his credit issues and background check which includes DUI and Domestic Violence charges. Well, duh.
> 
> He said that *he would never live with me again* though. So i don't know if desperate. Manipulation to get you scared that he's pulling away. And it looks like it worked.
> 
> Have cheaters learned *after multiple instances* once they were taught a lesson? What do you mean by multiple instances? I see one.


----------



## Gaia

Don't give him the satisfaction of a response. Find something to keep yourself occupied. If he wants you, truly wants you... he will work his ass off for you. 

If not... you will be able to move on and find someone who truly cares.


----------



## hereinthemidwest

You needed a poll to ask if you did the right thing? Please Girlfriend I pray you didn't let him PULL you back into that mess. Your head and heart are at war. Be strong.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> He just sent:
> 
> Baby have a good night. Know that I love you and truly wish and pray god cover you in peace on your special day. I'm sorry it was your worst birthday ever and I know its all because of me. I'm so sorry I feel horrible. I just wanna go back to bed.I'm sorry


Please tell me that you have not responded to this. Do not respond. You have his new number. Block it.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Turnera - thanks for the post! So helpful. Yes, he's cheated more than once. It's all in my first super long thread.
_Posted via Mobile Device_

Also my good friend was only an acquaintance years ago. Didn't know me that well. We've become close last two years. 

Elegirl and everyone else - thank you! I have not responded.

P.S. these replies are short cause they're from my phone.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> Also my good friend was only an acquaintance years ago. Didn't know me that well. *We've become close last two years*.


And she only JUST NOW told you that she helped him cheat on you? That's your definition of close?


----------



## feeling_crazy

turnera said:


> And she only JUST NOW told you that she helped him cheat on you? That's your definition of close?


No she's told me things before but at that time I took it as speculation or that we were just early dating. She re explained and clarified. It was at a different time. I had blinders on.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## turnera

Bullshyte. She could have made it plain to you. If she wanted to.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello everyone – Thanks again for all of the support. I’m glad to be back and glad that you’re still here for me. It means a lot.

So after he hung up on me yesterday with the whole me questioning him if he were willing to be transparent I did text him to tell him off. I know I SHOULDN’T have but I was really ticked off and I really couldn’t help myself. I said: 

“Way to approach! You failed there! You’re NOT ready to move forward and you’re NOT willing to do what it takes to make it work! You making me feel like I annoyed you by asking for that is NOT how someone approaches our situation. You seem displeased and surprised that I even asked! What I asked for is what it takes to save a broken relationship where trust was broken and that doesn’t go for just us. It’s for everyone. I’m DONE giving chances. I can’t BELIEVE that I even considered it. Not sure what I was thinking. I’m asking you to PLEASE once and for all leave me ALONE. This is going nowhere. I broke up with you a month ago and it’s still the same crap! I do thank you for showing me that it would continue to be the same with you. God has yet answered me AGAIN. I’m off of this roller coaster ride. I do pray that you someday learn because you obviously haven’t. I’ll continue to be sad but I’ll be ok. I’ll get over it and I’ll be ok knowing that my life would have been the same with you and I won’t miss that after awhile. Sign your life over? Is that how you really view it? It’s a tad extreme. You really need to take some time to really think about all that has done down. Really process it. You hanging up and your reaction just gave me a bit of strength so thank you!!”

That’s when he responded with the whole: “Baby have a good night. Know that I love you and truly wish and pray god cover you in peace on your special day. I'm sorry it was your worst birthday ever and I know its all because of me. I'm so sorry I feel horrible. I just wanna go back to bed. I'm sorry”

First of all I can’t believe that he even responded and with that because it's off subject. I sometimes feel he has a mental disorder and I, because of who I am and always feeling the need to explain did text him back. I was fired up. I guess I was annoyed he would even go there so I said:

“You just hung up on me an hour ago! I guess the nice twin is back. I’m really drained of arguing with you and getting you to see. You made it clear that you’re not capable. IF you loved me and wanted to be with me your main concern would be helping me heal, making me feel safe and you proving that you can be trusted again over time. Your reaction to me asking you to be transparent showed that you could care less if I feel safe and heal because you feel that it should be done your way. Sorry, but that’s NOT how it works. You being mean earlier was because it’s your way of not fully giving in to what I want. If you’re being defensive about it now there’s no way I could expect you to actually follow through in the long run. Just made me sad to realize the truth of this. I’m really drained. It’s been a long rough and sad birthday. I need to rest now please. I truly hope the best for you. Thank you for the apology and take care.”

So he probably thinks I’m a whack job because what kind of a response is that? I just felt that I had to explain why I’m upset though. Because I feel like he doesn’t get it. I guess I shouldn’t try to continue to explain anymore. It’s been the same circle over and over and he just won’t get it. He refuses to or he's to proud and doesn't want to be told what to do. That’s the narcissist abuser in him.

So today I’m sad. Yes. He hasn’t responded which is surprising. Maybe he’ll get the hint. Maybe he’ll stick to his word of “maybe I should let you go because too much damage has been done”. Or maybe he’s giving me silent treatment as another tactic.

I guess I shouldn’t care but again, it’s just sad. He has thrown so many things my way and has made me question myself yet again.

Again, thank you all for being here and for keeping me strong!!

P.S. I haven’t blocked his number yet because I’ve never with any other break ups have had to so I feel like why is this one different? Why can’t I handle it and be civil if need be? Just not respond to him.

P.S.S. I do feel bad. Like if he went silent because I hurt his feelings? Like if I made him feel guilty or less of a person. I don't ever want to hurt anyone and I almost texted to tell him sorry if I hurt him but I have not. I will not. I just am too nice and always worried about others. I should care less.


----------



## turnera

You're worrying about hurting his feelings? What's wrong with you?!

"Too nice" is the exact type of victim people like him seek out.

And why is it HIS place to let YOU go? You broke up with him. Right? HE has no choice in this, BUT to let you go since you (supposedly) have stopped all contact with him. Right?


----------



## EleGirl

"I guess I shouldn’t try to continue to explain anymore."

That's right.

STOP worrying about hurting his feelings.

The reason that you have to block his number is that YOU keep getting sucked into his game. It is to protect YOU.

I have an image of him when he's playing these games with you. Re sends you a text or calls you with sort of a smile on his face. in his mind he things that you are being silly. you will stop this eventually because you will give into his charm. He think's your rants are annoying but 'cute'. they are not something to take seriously. His charm has always worked on you, it will again.

He is not taking you seriously. He said that he has to let you go? Really? As I recall you dumped him. In his mind he is working on believing that if he cannot hypnotize you back, he dumped you.

He thinks you are silly. He's toying with you.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello everyone – I’m needing advice to calm down right because I’m irate. He keeps taking things up another notch and another and another.
I’ll try to make this quick. We have a cousin in the family that has been known to be a homewrecker of sorts. Even with the family. She slept with my first cousin’s boyfriend and used to text one of my ex’s years ago, went out to eat a few times with my other ex and for many reasons she can’t be trusted.

Now, she’s on my Facebook and Linkedin ages because she’s family and just that. Well, a year ago he added her on linkedin. I didn’t feel comfortable with that because of the reasons listed above and expressed my reasons and concerns to him of why I didn’t think the needed to be connected at all. It also bothered me that I have other cousins and family members on there but he didn’t add them , only her and I thought that was weird. She’s beautiful, don’t get me wrong and super smart. I just found it odd. Well, anyway, he deleted her. 

Well, as I said earlier she’s on my Facebook as a friend and for those of you on Facebook you can see when your connections make new friends. Well, guess what? A bit ago it showed in the newsfeed that her and him had just become friends. I was really thrown off by that and sort of offended considering that we had this conversation of my uneasiness a year ago. So I went to my Linkedin account and guess what? He added her on there as well! So I’m super upset. WHY would he have done that? He knows how I felt uneasy before so he not only adds her on Facebook today but Linkedin as well? He hasn’t even added any of my CLOSEST family members but he adds her?!

So, although I SHOULDN’T have I texted him and said “Wow, ok you added my cousin to Facebook and Linkedin today? After our conversation a year ago. You deleted her then but now you take it a step further and add her to Linkedin AND Facebook? You really have no respect what so ever!”

So he called after that and said “I’m sorry I’m napping. What are you talking about?” 

I said you know what I’m talking about and I don’t understand why you would do something like that that you know I would see and you know that makes me uncomfortable. I’m not doing anything out here to make you hurt or feel uncomfortable and I’m not disrespecting you in any way so I’d appreciate it if you had the same respect for me and didn’t do those things to me. I feel like it’s childish. 

He said “I’m sorry didn’t you delete me from Facebook?” 

And I said yes, I did but I can see when you make a connection with my connections. 

He said “I’m sorry, I wasn’t even thinking about you when I did that” 

I said that’s fine, you just keep doing what you’re doing. 

He said “why are you yelling?” in where I wasn’t even yelling. 

Then he said “I’ll just delete the entire Facebook account” and I said you don’t have to. Just please don’t do anything that will be thrown in my face. 

He said “ok whatever, I’m going back to my nap”. I said you go back to your nap and I don’t want to EFFING here for you again and hung up!

So after that I felt crazy for flipping out about everything because he was so non-chalant about it and threw the whole “I WASN’T EVEN THINKING ABOUT YOU” out there that I had to text to cover my butt so I texted:

“You don’t even add my closest family members but you do my cousin that we can’t trust? Whatever though. Not that I care at this point but I wanted to point it out because it just shows that you’re incapable of being respectful or capable of change. If you REALLY wanted me back or whatever it is you’re trying to do with the constant contact you’d be different. Not that this will change anything. This is just my case in point. You play too many games. Hilarious actually. You keep sinking deeper and deeper.”

So granted I know that I have no right to tell him who he can or can’t talk to but the point is it’s a FAMILY member that he knows our family can’t trust. I don’t trust her NOR him and he goes and does that? Like why would he pinpoint HER and not add the people that mean the most to me? 

Now I have to worry about hearing that he’s with my cousin? I wouldn’t be able to handle that.

So I feel like a nut for saying anything because he made me feel SO dumb. His whole demeanor was like ok you’re nuts, I’ll delete her.

He totally got under my skin and I’m beyond hurt right now.

Like WHY does he keep doing these things to me? I’m not doing anything to hurt him. I haven’t done anything in his face to disrespect him so WHY is he doing these things to me?

I’m hurt and I’m having anxiety now wondering if he’s doing my darn cousin! Like I need this on top of everything else?

Then I’m wondering if I should text him again to tell him to PLEASE LEAVE me along or do I just ignore him now in every sense?

Can you please tell me why this is happening? Is this purposely done? Is he really out to be with her?

Like what the hell?

It’s a Friday night and while he’s at home taking a “nap” or doing whatever he’s doing I’m here having a panic attack and anxiety because of what he’s done and thinking I overreacted and am nuts.

Please, what do I do? Did I over react? I mean, I think it’s wrong?

Do I need to text to make it seem like I’m not crazy?

Or just leave it alone with that last text and completely cut him off now and if I see anything else just ignore it?

I'm so upset.

Elegirl, Turnera...anyone? I'm flipping out...


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Hello everyone – I’m needing advice to calm down right because I’m irate. He keeps taking things up another notch and another and another.
> I’ll try to make this quick. We have a cousin in the family that has been known to be a homewrecker of sorts. Even with the family. She slept with my first cousin’s boyfriend and used to text one of my ex’s years ago, went out to eat a few times with my other ex and for many reasons she can’t be trusted.
> 
> Now, she’s on my Facebook and Linkedin ages because she’s family and just that. Well, a year ago he added her on linkedin. I didn’t feel comfortable with that because of the reasons listed above and expressed my reasons and concerns to him of why I didn’t think the needed to be connected at all. It also bothered me that I have other cousins and family members on there but he didn’t add them , only her and I thought that was weird. She’s beautiful, don’t get me wrong and super smart. I just found it odd. Well, anyway, he deleted her.
> 
> Well, as I said earlier she’s on my Facebook as a friend and for those of you on Facebook you can see when your connections make new friends. Well, guess what? A bit ago it showed in the newsfeed that her and him had just become friends.


Why was the Great Wall of China built? To keep out the invaders.
Build your own great wall… delete the both of them form your contacts on Facebook and every other social media.

Think of him as a zombie invader… do everything to keep the zombie out.



feeling_crazy said:


> I was really thrown off by that and sort of offended considering that we had this conversation of my uneasiness a year ago. So I went to my Linkedin account and guess what? He added her on there as well! So I’m super upset. WHY would he have done that? He knows how I felt uneasy before so he not only adds her on Facebook today but Linkedin as well? He hasn’t even added any of my CLOSEST family members but he adds her?!
> 
> So, although I SHOULDN’T have I texted him and said “Wow, ok you added my cousin to Facebook and Linkedin today? After our conversation a year ago. You deleted her then but now you take it a step further and add her to Linkedin AND Facebook? You really have no respect what so ever!”
> 
> So he called after that and said “I’m sorry I’m napping. What are you talking about?”
> 
> I said you know what I’m talking about and I don’t understand why you would do something like that that you know I would see and you know that makes me uncomfortable. I’m not doing anything out here to make you hurt or feel uncomfortable and I’m not disrespecting you in any way so I’d appreciate it if you had the same respect for me and didn’t do those things to me. I feel like it’s childish.
> 
> He said “I’m sorry didn’t you delete me from Facebook?”
> 
> And I said yes, I did but I can see when you make a connection with my connections.
> 
> He said “I’m sorry, I wasn’t even thinking about you when I did that”
> 
> I said that’s fine, you just keep doing what you’re doing.
> 
> He said “why are you yelling?” in where I wasn’t even yelling.
> 
> Then he said “I’ll just delete the entire Facebook account” and I said you don’t have to. Just please don’t do anything that will be thrown in my face.
> 
> He said “ok whatever, I’m going back to my nap”. I said you go back to your nap and I don’t want to EFFING here for you again and hung up!


Do you remember that you broke up with him? He can do anything he wants. He can see anyone he wants now. It’s not your concern. Stop this nonsense. At this point it looks like you are stalking him. 
Yea you said that you don’t’ want to hear from him again… over and over. Then you text him and harass him for doing things that he has the right to do.
This is a game you are playing. 

Delete him and her from your social media.
If they start to date she will find out that he’s abusive. 



feeling_crazy said:


> So after that I felt crazy for flipping out about everything because he was so non-chalant about it and threw the whole “I WASN’T EVEN THINKING ABOUT YOU” out there that I had to text to cover my butt so I texted:
> 
> “You don’t even add my closest family members but you do my cousin that we can’t trust? Whatever though. Not that I care at this point but I wanted to point it out because it just shows that you’re incapable of being respectful or capable of change. If you REALLY wanted me back or whatever it is you’re trying to do with the constant contact you’d be different. Not that this will change anything. This is just my case in point. You play too many games. Hilarious actually. You keep sinking deeper and deeper.”


Why are you looking for respect and change form a guy who knocked out your teeth, cheated on you and who you broke up with. Do you even remember that you told him that it’s over?



feeling_crazy said:


> So granted I know that I have no right to tell him who he can or can’t talk to but the point is it’s a FAMILY member that he knows our family can’t trust. I don’t trust her NOR him and he goes and does that? Like why would he pinpoint HER and not add the people that mean the most to me?


It does not matter why he friended her. It’s not your business. He’s not your friend. She’s not your firend. You do not trust either of them. So block them from your life.
Now I have to worry about hearing that he’s with my cousin? I wouldn’t be able to handle that.



feeling_crazy said:


> So I feel like a nut for saying anything because he made me feel SO dumb. His whole demeanor was like ok you’re nuts, I’ll delete her.
> 
> He totally got under my skin and I’m beyond hurt right now.


Its nuts that you said anything to him at all. This is stalking behavior on your part. If you are hurt it’s because you chose to not block him from you facebook meaning that you wanted to keep an eye on him. Sorry, no sympathy here for your hurt.
If you shoot yourself in the foot on purpose, well you chose to do it. Meh.. your choice.


feeling_crazy said:


> Like WHY does he keep doing these things to me? I’m not doing anything to hurt him. I haven’t done anything in his face to disrespect him so WHY is he doing these things to me?


Why? Maybe because he finds it entertaining to mess with you. You do seem to fly off the handle pretty easily. Why did he act nonchalant with his replies? It adds to the humor.
Or maybe because he’s and accomplished manipulate and abuser. Thing else has worked to get you back under his control so not he’s going for the jealousy angle. Who better than your cousin to use as bait to set the trap. And boy did you bit.
Personally I think that it’s both reasons. He’s having fun and things this might work. At least it gets you all riled up. And see, he’s not even around you. He did not even talk to you and he was able to control you. He wins this round with a huge trophy.


feeling_crazy said:


> I’m hurt and I’m having anxiety now wondering if he’s doing my darn cousin! Like I need this on top of everything else?


Please stop the drama. Block the both of them from every social media account you have. Block him from your phone. Delete his number so that you cannot text him. 


feeling_crazy said:


> Then I’m wondering if I should text him again to tell him to PLEASE LEAVE me along or do I just ignore him now in every sense?


You are the one who bothered him today. You’d look like an idiot if you sent him that text. 
Do you honestly think that everything is all about you? Do you think that everything he does is all about you? 


feeling_crazy said:


> Can you please tell me why this is happening? Is this purposely done? Is he really out to be with her?
> Like what the hell?


It’s happening because you refuse to put up your wall. You refuse to block him. You are brining this on yourself.


feeling_crazy said:


> It’s a Friday night and while he’s at home taking a “nap” or doing whatever he’s doing I’m here having a panic attack and anxiety because of what he’s done and thinking I overreacted and am nuts.


Funny how he can control you from a distance. Boy does he know our buttons and how to play you. And you love the drama so much that you just encourage it by not blocking him form your life.


feeling_crazy said:


> Please, what do I do? Did I over react? I mean, I think it’s wrong?


Yes you over reacted. No it’s not wrong that he friended her. It’s wrong that you reacted and you did and harassed him.


feeling_crazy said:


> Do I need to text to make it seem like I’m not crazy?


If you text him again it will make you seem even crazier. Stop it. Instead of texting him block him, cut him out of your life.


feeling_crazy said:


> Or just leave it alone with that last text and completely cut him off now and if I see anything else just ignore it?


Yes this is what you need to do. We have been telling you for weeks to do this. Are you really this slow a learner.


feeling_crazy said:


> I'm so upset.
> 
> Elegirl, Turnera...anyone? I'm flipping out...


Look you know I’m supporting you here. But you have to do your part. If you are not going to do your part, then being supportive becomes a waste of time.

You are an adult woman with a 19 year old daughter. Why do you have such a hard time controlling your emotions? You really need to get into counseling and figure this out.

Here’s an idea. Whenever this nonsense happens write a response, writing what you feel, think, etc. Express you feelings and thoughts until you are exhausted form writing if that’s what it takes.

Then either save it or delete it. But do not send it to him or whoever you are upset with.

Post here too if you need someone to talk to. 

But stop this knee jerk reaction stuff.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi Elegirl and thank you. He did bother me today by texting at 4:00 am "Good morning, I LOVE YOU" I didn't respond and he texted this afternoon "guess you didn't like that message" and I didn't respond and then he called twice after that so yes, he did bother today.

I get that it's none of my business but do you see why it bothers me?

I'm not doing that to him.

I feel beyond dumb and stupid because I never intended to come off as harassing him and he knows that I saw that they were friends in my new feed and not because I was stalking his page.

I think itS funny tough that yesterday he freaks out on me because he couldn't keep tabs and see anything on my page but I'm a stalker today?

I never intended to come across that way. I just was am hurt cause I feel it's maliciously done on his part and he's hurt me enough as it is.

I feel like the whack job that he calls me.

Now he wins, right? 

I want to correct it and let him know that I'm ok and better than him and above it. I guess there's no fixing that now.

I hate this. You said that I get affected easily and I do. I've always been that way with him so I feel like maybe I am the whack job and maybe that's why he cheated. Cause I was the beautiful wife playing woman at home who was a bit of a whack job but he stood for the comfort and cheated cause I'm "not right".

I can't stop crying at how foolish and dumb I feel.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Prodigal

Have you ever considered blocking his number? I mean, what is the point of reading the messages if they trigger you.

My theory is you get off on the drama of it all. Nobody can get under your skin or rattle your cage if you block them. 

I don't think it bothers you as much as you claim. AGAIN ... if you didn't want to be exposed to his nonsense, you would BLOCK HIM. Seriously.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> but do you see why it bothers me?


Frankly, no. For someone who SUPPOSEDLY broke up with a guy, you act REMARKABLY like his girlfriend.

Do you want our help, or not?


----------



## Prodigal

And P.S. - You wouldn't give a rat's azz if he thinks you are certifiably insane if you would set some boundaries. I mean, c'mon ... you are a grown woman. Start asserting yourself and ignore this loser. 

Because he IS a loser. Why give a sh!t what this clown thinks?

B-O-U-N-D-A-R-I-E-S.


----------



## turnera

My DD23's friend, who 'ran away' to Colorado with a guy and came back a year later, immediately met a guy she moved in with who is bipolar, hits her, chokes her, threatens to kill himself, won't take his meds, won't get a job, keeps her in a Podunk town away from family and friends. She breaks up with him, comes home to mommy, who puts her back in college, drives her everywhere, helps her get a job. But because her mom, knowing she has to be at work at 6am, tells her she can't be on the phone after 11pm. Friend flips out, calls a friend, who drives her 2 hours away back to her loser boyfriend.

All because she can't control her emotions at being told TO GET OFF THE PHONE.

That's what you remind me of. You are SO UTTERLY REACTIVE that you can't even do what you (say you) want to do. That's not adult behavior, ok? Some day, you need to grow up and decide if you're going to do what is RIGHT or what FEELS GOOD.


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

Hon, he failed your test. This isn't the first one he's failed.

How many more tests does he have to fail?

By talking to him again he thinks he has a chance. He's going to keep wearing you down and keep hurting you. Please don't let him.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Good to hear from you all. Yes, I shouldn't give a rats ass! 

He just texted "just got up...weird dreams and thought where am I?"

Do u see how he texts the most random things as if nothing happened?

You guys mentioned that I'm overly reactive to everything and yes I agree. Do any of you here know the possible cause of that? Is it from abuse?

I'm not talking to him nor responding anymore. I can't let him make me feel any crazier than I am.

It's amazing that I thought I'd be "losing" him to my cousin or anyone as they'll sooner or later find out who he really is. Unless there is some crazy miracle in where he changes for someone else. Of course the thought of that bothers me. But according to mostly all of u those odds are astronomical.

He's failed so many tests and I need to remember that.

I just get so sad and it's hard to believe that he would intentionally try to hurt me after all he's already done.

I need to get my angry on again.

I think the fact that I just found out my company was sold and we all may be out of a job is not helping. I'm overly stressed cause of that and I think the combination of that and this break up just really is getting to me.

Not that it matters but I want to reiterate that he didn't knock my teeth out. When he hit me it was my back jaw and my last wisdom tooth cracked so I had to get it removed. Feeling like I need to clarify not that it makes it any better.

This site and your support is truly a god send. I'm really looking forward to the day where we can talk fashion or football or something other than this soap opera!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Prodigal

feeling_crazy said:


> He just texted "just got up...weird dreams and thought where am I?"
> 
> Do u see how he texts the most random things as if nothing happened?
> 
> You guys mentioned that I'm overly reactive to everything and yes I agree. Do any of you here know the possible cause of that? Is it from abuse?


I think you are immature. You claim you are a slave/victim to your feelings and emotions. You just can't help how you feel. Uh, wrong. Adults DO have control over their thoughts and feelings. They can choose to wallow in drama and misery or they can pull themselves together and start focusing on other things.

Yep, it IS possible. It's called freedom of choice.

You mentioned you were going to block this guy weeks ago. But now you are wondering why you are reactive? You choose to be. Honestly.

I think people have given you tons of great advice. You choose not to change. That is fine. It's your life and no skin off my nose.

But nobody is going to hang around here holding your hand in cyberspace if you just keep doing the same thing.

It has gotten beyond boring. I'm not interested in this bum you keep talking about.

Want to discuss fashion, politics, football, bee keeping? Great. Go seek out these interests. Make a conscious choice to quit focusing on a dead-end, go-nowhere relationship. 

Maybe you want to keep discussing this soap opera. I can only speak for myself, but I'm bored hearing about it. Really.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Hi Elegirl and thank you. He did bother me today by texting at 4:00 am "Good morning, I LOVE YOU" I didn't respond and he texted this afternoon "guess you didn't like that message" and I didn't respond and then he called twice after that so yes, he did bother today.
> 
> I get that it's none of my business but do you see why it bothers me?


I can kinda see why it bothers you, especially since you are working over time to imagin them in some torid love affair. You are your worst enemy in this.
Look at it this way… if she gets involved with him.. now she will smacked around by him. But you are no longer being smacked around, cheated on and lied to. YOU WIN!!!! YOU DUMPED HIS ASS!!


feeling_crazy said:


> I'm not doing that to him.


I feel beyond dumb and stupid because I never intended to come off as harassing him and he knows that I saw that they were friends in my new feed and not because I was stalking his page. [/QUOTE]
I think itS funny tough that yesterday he freaks out on me because he couldn't keep tabs and see anything on my page but I'm a stalker today? [/QUOTE]
OK so you left out a lot and did not let us know that you have had a huge amount of communications with him. I take back the stalking thing. You are still talking and involved in some level. 

So no you are not stalking him. Instead you are still caught up in the drama. The two of you are still locked in this silly drama.



feeling_crazy said:


> I never intended to come across that way. I just was am hurt cause I feel it's maliciously done on his part and he's hurt me enough as it is.
> 
> I feel like the whack job that he calls me.
> Now he wins, right?


Is this a game? All you have to do to win is to take him off all of your social media, block his number on your cell and delete his phone number. There you won. You will never have to listen to his crap again. Can you do that? Do you want to be free of him or not?



feeling_crazy said:


> I want to correct it and let him know that I'm ok and better than him and above it. I guess there's no fixing that now.


You correct it by blocking him and cutting him out of your life. 



feeling_crazy said:


> I hate this. You said that I get affected easily and I do. I've always been that way with him so I feel like maybe I am the whack job and maybe that's why he cheated. Cause I was the beautiful wife playing woman at home who was a bit of a whack job but he stood for the comfort and cheated cause I'm "not right".


Oh stop it already. 

You show him that you are not a crazy whack job by blocking him and cutting him out of your life. 




feeling_crazy said:


> I can't stop crying at how foolish and dumb I feel.


You can avoid putting yourself in this position by blocking him and cutting him out of your life. 

Do you get it yet: block him and cut him out of your life.


Sit at your computer and just write all that you fell down. get it out of your system. Then print it out and rip up the paper. Put it in the trash where it belongs.

That's what you do if you have emotions and thoughts that you cannot control.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Good to hear from you all. Yes, I shouldn't give a rats ass!
> 
> He just texted "just got up...weird dreams and thought where am I?"
> 
> Do u see how he texts the most random things as if nothing happened?


And yet you do not block him.

Now tell me why you do not block him. It’s clear why he keeps doing this. He’s messing with your head. He’s a con man, an abuser, that’s what they do. 



feeling_crazy said:


> You guys mentioned that I'm overly reactive to everything and yes I agree. Do any of you here know the possible cause of that? Is it from abuse?


Was your mother overly emotional and reactive like this? Was there a lot of emotional drama in the home you grew up in?

My best guess is that you are “addicted” to drama. There are people who seek out crazy situations. If they cannot find one they create one. The highly emotional reaction to the drama causes brain chemistry changes that your brain craves. The only time you really feel alive is when there is drama. The rest of the time things are a bit flat emotionally for you.

That’s why you don’t block his texts. Every time he calls and/or texts you it causes you to get emotionally agitated, the brain chemicals flow and your brain is happy.

I think you need to see a doctor. You may need some anti-depressants or other meds to get you out of this state. If you were not like this before you met him, yes sever emotional abuse causes brain chemistry to go off whack. A doctor and counselor can go a long way to help you straighten out your brain chemistry and stop this nonsense. 

I know that now you are going to start going on that, see, yep I’m just as crazy has he thinks I am. Looks he’s crazy. He could not do what he does if the was a mentally healthy person. The two of you created an emotionally sick relationship. Either you had problems before you met him, or he drug you down into his mentally off environment. I think of it like two people who cannot swim, clinging to each other in deep water. You cling and kick and thrash and eventually you both pull each other down.



feeling_crazy said:


> I'm not talking to him nor responding anymore. I can't let him make me feel any crazier than I am.


You will allow him to continue to “make you crazy” until you block all access he has to you. And keep in mind that at this point you are not a victim. You are a willing participant. 


feeling_crazy said:


> It's amazing that I thought I'd be "losing" him to my cousin or anyone as they'll sooner or later find out who he really is. Unless there is some crazy miracle in where he changes for someone else. Of course the thought of that bothers me. But according to mostly all of u those odds are astronomical.
> 
> He's failed so many tests and I need to remember that.
> I just get so sad and it's hard to believe that he would intentionally try to hurt me after all he's already done.


Why do dogs bark…. Because they are dogs, silly.



feeling_crazy said:


> I need to get my angry on again.


yep


feeling_crazy said:


> I think the fact that I just found out my company was sold and we all may be out of a job is not helping. I'm overly stressed cause of that and I think the combination of that and this break up just really is getting to me.


Why do you think that they will fire everyone? Did they buy the company to destroy is? Stop this nonsense about him and start job hunting. I you can move, move. 


feeling_crazy said:


> Not that it matters but I want to reiterate that he didn't knock my teeth out. When he hit me it was my back jaw and my last wisdom tooth cracked so I had to get it removed. Feeling like I need to clarify not that it makes it any better.


I know.. I’m using hyperbol to make my point. Saying that he “knocked your teeth out” also uses a lot fewer words than “When he hit me it was my back jaw and my last wisdom tooth cracked so I had to get it removed.” And no it does not make it any better. 


feeling_crazy said:


> This site and your support is truly a god send. I'm really looking forward to the day where we can talk fashion or football or something other than this soap opera!


So block him.. then we can go on to some fun topics.


----------



## turnera

Is his number blocked yet?

Is he removed from your FB?

No? Quel surprised.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello everyone – Hope you’re all well. Better than I am. I did not block his number. I did worse. I talked to him via text and a few phone chats attempting to be a “friend”. I said why can’t I do this with him? We’ve spent so many years. Well, talking to him made me feel even weaker (no surprise there) as I so deeply wanted to believe his words and change were possible. I was considering taking him back. Yes, I said it. I was CONSIDERING it. That didn’t last very long though….

He agreed that adding my cousin to FB and Linkedin were inappropriate and he deleted her from FB but not from linkedin so I asked him yesterday via text when he was going to delete her on Linkedin? He texted back “WOW, tomorrow!!!”

So we got into it of course because I said why did you have to say “wow”? To make me feel bad for bringing it up? He said I’m worried over pointless things.

Then of course we were at it about that pretty much all day…because I told him he hasn’t changed and he told me that he “doesn’t want to change if he’s always being told to change” So he obviously is vindictive and bitter because I've told him that he needs to change...

Then this morning he said “I already said I’m changing and I will. What you fail to listen to is you don’t need to ask. You don’t need to tell me I’m not changing, I’m the same, I’m mean..it will only take me longer”

So this morning I wrote “That’s your pride saying it will only take you longer. Sorry if I don’t see you’re changing. I’m not going to lie and say you are. I call it like it is. It’s not fair to lie to you either..sorry”

So he just wrote “Let’s just not talk. I would rather hear nothing from you than any of the crap you’re spewing over and over. It doesn’t help anything, period. Talk about pride. I have heard it all 100x in calls and texts. You’ve used up all your b1tching minutes on my account”

So at that point I was blown away…because he told me “let’s just not talk”..REALLY???????

So I said “the problem is that we don’t have constructive conversation. It’s always over text or on the phone with you hanging up on me! But that is fine, to think that I was going to have you over on Wednesday for dinner, to spend time and talk and hopefully move forward in a more positive direction but you would rather not talk? This is fine. I don’t know that the hell I was thinking. Temporary moment of insanity. You won’t be hearing from me. I’m done trying. Take care”.

And there has been no response from him and I feel like the BIGGEST idiot right now because this is his approach to it?? I was giving him a chance even when I SHOULDN’T have…even when he wasn’t fighting hard for me…or truly showed that he was changing…

And he tells me that he doesn’t want to hear from me???

I can’t believe that…

Like I KNOW that you’re all probably upset but I’m human and I did have a weak moment…I didn’t move forward because of how things went down yesterday but yes I considered it…

And now he knows this and now I feel beyond dumb…

I don’t understand how he can go from last week telling me he’s dying without me to now telling me “let’s not talk” because I told him he hasn’t changed? Am I supposed to lie to him and tell him otherwise? 

Anyway, talk about a MAJOR SETBACK..because I’m feeling like my heart was open to him again and I feel like he shut me out because I constantly tell him what he’s not…

So I feel bad…because I’m questioning myself thinking did I say too much to him to bring him down? Is he really tired of ME?

Is he acting like he doesn’t care and he’s over me because I did in fact say to much to bring him down and tell him what he’s not or is he seeing someone else? I just don’t understand how he goes last week from dying because he needs to me to now saying and acting this way?

I don’t even know how to turn this around…I mean, I texted him that last text of “momentary insanity” but does that do it justice? Should I call and say more? 

Tell him to really leave me alone? Or maybe he’s really left me alone now…

So I feel like I got rejected…and I can’t handle that…especially when I broke up with him!

Please help me out here because I don’t know what to do…do I call or text more? Damage control..

What is going on?????

Feel like I’m losing it…

Please be easy on me..I know it’s frustrating for you all but I can’t take any harshness right now…I’m not feeling good at all

I feel weak and so dumb and like he won...


----------



## committed4ever

OP, I have read most of your thread. You know what I often think about when reading it? Your daughter and when I was her age (I'm 28). To my Mom I know she never thought I ever listen to her or consider what she said or paid any attention to what she did. Truth is I was looking to her constantly as an example. Some things I was too stubborn to admit she was right, but mostly I watch her and how she conduct herself in relationships.

I keep thinking about your daughter and how she must feel to observe your behavior. Although your daughter is older (19 or 20, right) she at an age that she need to see something better than how you are handling your business. I know on TAM it's always said "do it for you, do it for you." But I'm saying if you can't stop this nonsense for your own well being, can't you at least consider your daughter? Then later maybe you can switch it around to "doing it for you."

I'm sorry if this make you angry. I just had to say it. Our behavior affect all who are in our sphere of influence, and your daughter is definitely in yours.


----------



## turnera

Not to mention that you're teaching her to become a codependent mess just like you. We become what our parents are.

Just think what she would learn if she saw you walk away from a harmful man and just...BE. With no need to have ANY man around. She'd learn to honor herself, respect herself, and never put any man's needs ahead of hers. 

Instead she's learning to create needless drama, treat men as more important than her, and be a doormat.


----------



## EleGirl

He did not reject you. Your perspective is all wrong.

You called him on his BS. So it was you rejecting him. 

Sit back for a minute and look at what went down. He was nice for a few days until he thought he had you eating out of his hand. Once you called him on not deleting her from linked in he realized that his little game was not working on you. That's why he's stomped off now like a 2 year old having a tantrum.

The ploy now is that, you are supposed to feel rejected and come begging him to take you back.

Do not talk to him. I'm getting tired of saying this.. but please block his number.

I agree with the others. You seem stuck in high school emotionally. You really need to go to counseling to get through this.

Was there a traumatic thing that happened to you in jr high or high school? I mean super traumatic. If so what was it?


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi Elegirl and everyone else and thank you! 

The good thing that I have going with my daughter is that she does not know of the physical abuse. She does know if the infidelity though. I could never let her know of the physical. As a matter of fact, no one in my family knows of the physical. Just one very close friend.

I'm trying to stay strong for her and the reason I made the move was for her as well. I'm trying to set a good example.

Elegirl - I don't know why I react this way. I do recall from younger childhood having various people disrespect me physically and I've always frozen when that happened.

For instance, a cousin slapped me across the face in anger when I was younger and I just sat there.

A guy that we were all with in high school randomly slapped me in the face for no reason. I was frozen, didn't say a word and felt humiliated and embarassed but continued the night on with our friends as normal.

My ex boyfriend before this one spit in my face once and I forgave him.

I really don’t understand why it is that I feel like I “deserve” to be treated this way or that I don’t have enough self respect to stick up for myself.

Even when I caught him and that woman in our home I sort of froze..didn’t even know what to say to her. She got mouthy and I sort of just walked away feeling dumb and pathetic because I didn’t even have words to defend myself.

I grew up by being raised by grandparents who were wonderful to me, however, they weren’t very open in regards to conversations on how to grow up, have respect for myself, etc. they felt that love was supporting me and providing me with all that I needed and again, they provided a good life for me that my mom couldn’t have, they just lacked that.

And I did see numerous fights between my uncles and mom, etc.

Maybe I learned that it’s ok to forgive that kind of treatment?

Now thinking of when I was slapped by my cousin and that guy..the feeling is numb…just like I felt when that happened…why on earth could I not defend myself or stick up for myself? I was frozen in fear I guess?

I normally just cower and don't stand up to people. I have more now and recently than I ever have but back then I did not.

I feel so ashamed.


----------



## LoveAtDaisys

f_c, it sounds like being apart has given you a chance to learn a lot about yourself. Which is good!

So you know now that you freeze at confrontation. That's okay. You can't change the past, but you can change how you react now. And I know that for me, realizing that I had the power to change things now was a really powerful moment!

Don't be ashamed of the past. Use it as a learning tool. Use it as a stepping stone to become better, so that you never have to feel that fear and numbness and shame again.

I still think a therapist would do you a world of good, but I am so proud of how far you've come in the time you've been posting here. And if you can continue to put distance between you and your ex, your ability to grow and change is limitless.


----------



## Prodigal

There is only so much people can do here to help you. I don't understand why you don't get into counseling. At least a counselor could give you undivided attention during a session and start delving into why you are a doormat for this man.

If you cannot afford counseling or your health insurance plan doesn't cover mental health (which is usually pretty rare ...), your county will have a list of sliding-fee scale counseling providers.

One thing I learned from living with an addict is ANYONE who really wants to get better will find a way to do so. It's up to you. I just don't think folks on TAM have the resources you need.

Consider it.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hi everyone: It’s been awhile. I’m here so all of you can give me my “I told you so” and it feels horrible. It feels horrible to have to come back here and explain what is going on. I tried my hardest to stay away from him. I was in so much pain. After reading the book “Why Does He Do That” about possible reformed people and about how people need to process there break ups their own way I decided to do just that. After him chirping in my ear, etc. I decided that maybe there were things about me that I needed to change and for my own sake I needed to give it one more try. I just had to. 

Well, we broke up 3 months ago and we started spending time again about a month ago (he did not move back in). It went great. He was as awesome as could be. Extra loving, sweet, you know the man that I fell in love with. During this time I was just relaxed. Didn’t really question much and just said I’m going to go with the flow. The one thing I did mention were my boundaries and I did say that if we’re working it out it has to be exclusive and at first he was hesitant to talk about what our “status” was and said all I know is that I want to be with you and only you and we need to take things slow until we come back together. So I took that as exclusive. I wouldn’t have it any other way because of my trust issues. Plus, why after 5 years do we need to take it slow, right? He knows that his job on rebuilding was to rebuild trust and he agreed to do that.

Well, like I said things were great. He told me last week that he was heading out of town for training for work again and actually invited me this time. I told him I couldn’t because I don’t have time off of work. Well, he told me last week that his training ran from Tuesday through Friday. That he would leave for training on Monday. Well, we spent the weekend together and he had his bags packed. Said that he was leaving straight there from my place on Sunday because training started at 8am on Monday now. I thought it was a bit odd and being the non trustworthy person that I am because of good reason I checked the training website to see if the dates had changed (because that’s public knowledge). Well, the training site had the original dates he told me of Tuesday through Friday. I didn’t question it though. I said ok, maybe they didn’t update their site yet. 

Well, he leaves yesterday at around 2pm and it takes about 2 ½ hours to get there. He said he loved me and would call me as soon as he got there. Well, we spoke on his way there, he told me how much he missed me already and almost turned around to come back and be with me. He said that he was tired and was just going to nap as soon as he got there. Well, he texted me “made it safe, love you”, didn’t call. I felt very uneasy about all that he was telling me. You know, just had that feeling so I figured I’d call the hotel to chat with him. Well, guess what? The hotel said that they don’t have anyone there by that name and that he’s not supposed to check in until Monday because training doesn’t start till Tuesday. So he lied. 

Then when he finally called last night he said “hi love, I’m with so and so at my favorite restaurant here” I said ok good, I called the hotel cause I didn’t hear from you and they said you weren’t there? He said “no they didn’t” and I said yes they did. Then he came back and said “Oh that’s because I’m staying at a different hotel for the one night”. He gave me the name of the hotel during that conversation. He then said I love you and I’ll call you later. We hung up. Well, of course I wanted to reassure myself that nothing was up because of my suspicion so I decided to call that hotel and guess what? No one there by that name or even registered to check in by that name. I even asked if the guy that he SAID he was with was checked in because I thought maybe they were sharing a room and he wasn’t there either.

I didn’t hear from him until late around 10:30pm and it was a text that said “goodnight baby I love you so much” Then I texted and said where are you? Are you ok? and no response. Then I tried calling and no answer. Then I texted “ok then..done”. and nothing. He never called or texted back. I did try calling him this morning and no answer.

I called the training center today and the rep confirmed that training doesn’t start until tomorrow. There was no fluke on their end. So he lied and to the extreme. 

I offered for him to stay with me again last night because I’m working from home today and he turned me down. Said that he wishes he could but he had training first thing at 8am and had to leave. So, if it were innocent he wouldn’t lie. Whatever he is lying to me about has to be worth it for him to do what he’s doing.

So I’m just like sobbing. I really can’t stop crying. Like I just don’t get it. I keep questioning. Like I heard him at the toll booth but I think I must have called every hotel in that small town and he’s not there. So where is he? And with who? And why lie?

Like I know he’s probably going to say we weren’t “together” like he said when I caught him with his ex last time but we are working on things and I’m not out there seeing other men. 

I just feel heartbroken. Like my chest hurts in the worst way. For him to do this to me. I just don’t get it. Why? Like he doesn’t even know how much pain he’s caused me. I can’t even deal right now.

So it’s all a big lie. Of course the first thing that comes to mind is he stayed with another woman. Why else would he lie? Make up something so elaborate? 

I know that I’m assuming but what else can it be? EVEN IF it weren’t another woman than he’s not doing what he has to do to build up trust again.

I just feel dumb and heartbroken and honestly can’t even deal with the pain. I feel rejected.

Then he was SO nice all weekend. He hung up pictures that have been needing hung for awhile now, made me breakfast in bed, rubbed my back, washed my clothes, was extra loving and then he goes and pulls this the same day/night?

Like I don’t even know what to tell him if and when he does call. Like how do I approach him and let him know that I know he was dishonest without coming off as some crazed psychopath?

Then again, he may not even call. Maybe he's onto the fact that I'm onto him.

I just don't even know what to do. I'm a freakin wreck. I feel like he rejected me. Like he picked another woman over me again and again IF that's the case he firstly won't admit it and secondly IF he did he'd say that we weren't exclusive and just working on things. 

So again, I know that I'm assuming but what else could it be that he would need to lie so elaborately about?

What the heck do I say IF and WHEN he calls? I don't want to come off as crazy but I also don't want him thinking he got over on me.


----------



## turnera

Of course he stayed with another woman. Why would you even doubt it?

Just change your phone number, change your locks, and block him on the Internet.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> how do I approach him


Please tell me why you ask this? I really want to hear your reasoning. I'd like to understand the mind of an abuse victim that after all this feels SHE has to approach HIM? I know the real answer; I just want to know if YOU have any idea.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> how do I ... let him know that I know he was dishonest


By doing what I said - changing your phone number, changing your locks, and deleting him from your Internet. THERE IS NOTHING THAT CAN COME OUT OF YOUR MOUTH that could ever say more.

But of course we KNOW that you have no intention of leaving him, so why do I even bother?


----------



## feeling_crazy

turnera said:


> Please tell me why you ask this? I really want to hear your reasoning. I'd like to understand the mind of an abuse victim that after all this feels SHE has to approach HIM? I know the real answer; I just want to know if YOU have any idea.


Turnera - Because I want him to know that I know. That he didn't get one over on me. I don't know. I'm just a mess right now. I guess my head is all over the place.

I'm really needing you all right now though. That I do know. It's all that I have right now.

Of course I have to leave him now. I've given him too many chances.

Do you agree that it seems like he's with another woman? Or am I nuts?

I feel like I may not even have a chance as I feel like he chose another woman over me and now he's done.


----------



## turnera

He didn't get one over on you...yet you are still going to keep him?

What good does THAT do?

Oh no...I KNOW you're cheating on me...I wish you wouldn't DO that...I HATE when you're cheating on me...what do you want for dinner tonight, honey?


----------



## turnera

Are you in therapy?


----------



## feeling_crazy

turnera said:


> He didn't get one over on you...yet you are still going to keep him?
> 
> What good does THAT do?
> 
> Oh no...I KNOW you're cheating on me...I wish you wouldn't DO that...I HATE when you're cheating on me...what do you want for dinner tonight, honey?


No Turnera - I'm asking if I'm over reacting..I would say that working things out in a relationship means no seeing other people, right?


----------



## turnera

You expected him to change from a cheating abuser to a guy you wished he could be - in a MONTH.


----------



## feeling_crazy

turnera said:


> You expected him to change from a cheating abuser to a guy you wished he could be - in a MONTH.


I just thought that working things out means exclusivity and honestly and I did want to believe him. 

I didn't think that he'd be out there with other woman already.

Again, I think I'm assuming but it all points to that. There is no other reason for him to create such an elaborate lie, right? 

Then I don't understand how he was SO extra sweet before he left knowing that he had this planned already.

I'm at a loss.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> Then I don't understand how he was SO extra sweet before he left knowing that he had this planned already.


You said you read Why Does He Do That? already. I suggest you read it again, and look for the parts about how abusers JUST EXUDE CHARM. It's part of what they do. It's fun for them to make you fall for them again, to draw you back in. 

You are nothing more to him than a challenge. 

Just like the OTHER women he's doing this to.


----------



## feeling_crazy

turnera said:


> You said you read Why Does He Do That? already. I suggest you read it again, and look for the parts about how abusers JUST EXUDE CHARM. It's part of what they do. It's fun for them to make you fall for them again, to draw you back in.
> 
> You are nothing more to him than a challenge.
> 
> Just like the OTHER women he's doing this to.


Turnera, so you agree that it's most likely he's with another woman and that's why he lied?

I just can't believe that he would do this to this extent. Knowing that I kicked him out last time. 

Like he would jeopardize what he has with me for another woman?

I just feel like there is something about her that he really must like to leave me or ruin things the way he has.

It's like a slap in the face. I feel rejected and like he picked another woman over me. It's hard to explain, I guess.

So what do I say to him? I want him to know that I know he's a liar without coming off as a psycho that checked ever last hotel, etc.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

feeling_crazy said:


> I just don't even know what to do. I'm a freakin wreck. I feel like he rejected me. Like he picked another woman over me again and again IF that's the case he firstly won't admit it and secondly IF he did he'd say that we weren't exclusive and just working on things.
> 
> So again, I know that I'm assuming but what else could it be that he would need to lie so elaborately about?
> 
> What the heck do I say IF and WHEN he calls? I don't want to come off as crazy but I also don't want him thinking he got over on me.


How can you NOT know what to do?? Seriously?? He is off fvcking another woman, playing you for the fool that you are, and you dont know what to do????? Toss all his sh!t out, like everyone here told you do to in the first place, change your locks, block his number and never, ever speak to him again!! ITS NOT THAT HARD!!!!  STOP BEING A FREAKING DOORMAT!!!!


----------



## 3Xnocharm

feeling_crazy said:


> Turnera, so you agree that it's most likely he's with another woman and that's why he lied?
> 
> I just can't believe that he would do this to this extent. Knowing that I kicked him out last time.
> 
> Like he would jeopardize what he has with me for another woman?
> 
> I just feel like there is something about her that he really must like to leave me or ruin things the way he has.
> 
> It's like a slap in the face. I feel rejected and like he picked another woman over me. It's hard to explain, I guess.
> *
> So what do I say to him?* I want him to know that I know he's a liar without coming off as a psycho that checked ever last hotel, etc.


YOU DONT SAY ANYTHING TO HIM EVER AGAIN!!!! Jesus, you have made NO progress whatsoever!


----------



## turnera

What exactly does he have with you? Other than a doormat who believes his lies and is no challenge?



> I feel rejected and like he picked another woman over me.


If you would do what ALL of us have TOLD you ad nauseum to do - go to a psychologist and start WORKING ON YOURSELF...you would no longer even be SAYING this, much less thinking it.

You're your own worst enemy.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> No Turnera - I'm asking if I'm over reacting..I would say that working things out in a relationship means no seeing other people, right?


You told him your boundaries. One of them what that the two of you are exclusive. It does not matter if he verbally agreed or not. It's your boundary.

He has crossed your boundary. He cheated again, for the gazillionth time. 

Of course you are not over reacting. You are actually UNDER-reacting.

There are many ways to communicate with a person. Verbally (spoken or written) and through actions are the most usual. Through actions is the most powerful.

If you do as Turnera says, that is the most powerful way to tell him that he has crossed your boundaries. Just stop communicating with him.

You want to talk to me and tell him because you want attention from him and you want the drama. 

If you talk to him and tell him that you know he's gone out with someone else he will lie. He will tell you that you are imaging things, being controlling, etc etc. 

But it does not matter, at the very least this is a HUGE lie. A lie is not acceptable. Cheating is not acceptable.

Just change your phone number. That way he cannot reach you by a phone other than his own. If he has a key to your place, change locks again.

Does he have things at your place? if he does take them over to his place tonight and leave them there.

Do you have a key to his place?


----------



## turnera

Tundra, lol


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> Turnera, so you agree that it's most likely he's with another woman and that's why he lied?
> 
> I just can't believe that he would do this to this extent. Knowing that I kicked him out last time.
> 
> Like he would jeopardize what he has with me for another woman?
> 
> I just feel like there is something about her that he really must like to leave me or ruin things the way he has.
> 
> *It's like a slap in the face. I feel rejected and like he picked another woman over me. It's hard to explain, I guess.*
> 
> So what do I say to him? I want him to know that I know he's a liar without coming off as a psycho that checked ever last hotel, etc.


He did not chose another woman over you. This is not a contest between you and another woman. She's not the only other woman. She's one of many... this is how he operates. He's not faithful to any woman.

He has never chosen you either. You are just a good lay and easy to manipulate. So he be with you can no one else is available. 

Again.. he did not chose you. He did not chose anther woman. *He chose himself as always.*


----------



## EleGirl

turnera said:


> Tundra, lol


LOL sorry about that. I just got up so I'm looking through foggy eyes.

Fixed it....


----------



## feeling_crazy

Yes, thanks everyone. I am looking at this the wrong way. I did reach out to his sister, who became a friend and she wrote:

"I just don't know what to say or tell you. So I conferred with our other sister and she says this.................


i dont know.... he is who he is...always has been always will be. Take him as he is or get out. i dont know where he was at or why he was doing whatever he was doing. I think she is legit to have trust issues with him. But i can guarantee it was like that right from the get go and she just didnt see it!

and I'm just like............did you read this back and hear yourself???? if you are that obsessed with the trust issue (and rightfully so) that you HAVE to verify that he isn't where he said he was going to be...............then stop it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I hate to be so blunt and by no means wish to hurt you/r feelings, but......that is crazy"

So they are saying he was like that from the get go and I just didn't see it. I'm wondering if he's cheated on every girl. Well, he did tell me that he's been unfaithful in the past. That he was only faithful to his ex-wife.

I love how she called me crazy though..cause I certainly feel that way. No doubt about that.

Are you guys ready for this though? He JUST texted "Hello baby! Call you here during lunch soon" 

So he's STILL going to lie and say that he's at lunch during training out of town when I know he's not there.

That is crazy!! 

Like what the hell???? Do I even say??


----------



## 3Xnocharm

feeling_crazy said:


> yes, thanks everyone. I am looking at this the wrong way. I did reach out to his sister, who became a friend and she wrote:
> 
> "i just don't know what to say or tell you. So i conferred with our other sister and she says this.................
> 
> 
> I dont know.... He is who he is...always has been always will be. Take him as he is or get out. I dont know where he was at or why he was doing whatever he was doing. I think she is legit to have trust issues with him. But i can guarantee it was like that right from the get go and she just didnt see it!
> 
> And i'm just like............did you read this back and hear yourself???? If you are that obsessed with the trust issue (and rightfully so) that you have to verify that he isn't where he said he was going to be...............then stop it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I hate to be so blunt and by no means wish to hurt you/r feelings, but......that is crazy"
> 
> so they are saying he was like that from the get go and i just didn't see it. I'm wondering if he's cheated on every girl. Well, he did tell me that he's been unfaithful in the past. That he was only faithful to his ex-wife.
> 
> I love how she called me crazy though..cause i certainly feel that way. No doubt about that.
> 
> Are you guys ready for this though? He just texted "hello baby! Call you here during lunch soon"
> 
> so he's still going to lie and say that he's at lunch during training out of town when i know he's not there.
> 
> That is crazy!!
> 
> Like what the hell???? Do i even say??


dont say anything!!!

For crying out loud even his own SISTERS know he is a worthless POS!!


----------



## turnera

She did not call you crazy. 

She said continuing to expect him to be a decent human being is crazy.


----------



## turnera

feeling_crazy said:


> Are you guys ready for this though? He JUST texted "Hello baby! Call you here during lunch soon"


What's wrong with that? He's making his daily "keep her roped in just enough to have her hanging on my every word so she wants me but doesn't feel brave enough to stand up to me" contact.

He's back to the same old abuser you sought out in the first place.

_Because you aren't getting therapy._


----------



## EleGirl

His sister told you what we all know. He's always been like this. They are also right that this is crazy and you just need to stop this.




feeling_crazy said:


> Like what the hell???? Do I even say??


YOU SAY NOTHING. You do not talk to him today or ever again.

Instead of calling him today, change your phone number and spend your time letting everyone but him know what your new number is.

Or you don't change your number and you block his number. When he calls you from another number you say only "never contact me again". 

But I doubt you will do anything to end this. So you will go on being his piece of a$$ when all his other girlfriends are not around. He picked you because you are a very emotionally broken person. And you will not get the help you need to fix yourself. He has no respect for you because you have no respect for yourself.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Yes, well he knows that I knew he didn't stay at the hotel and his response was:

Someone else from his company must have reserved in their name. (I called and threw out even the company name and they did a search by that and nothing).
He is at that training facility today and will send pics (he did send pics and they look like they came from his phone)
He IS in class today and will prove it to me by taking a pic (haven't received that one yet)

BUT I have called the training center and he wasn't even on the roster for any training today at all.

So he send me pics of the outside and it looks like they're from his phone but that's all I got.

Then of course he got mad and said "I came here for a sabbatical. Not to be privately investigated."

This was before he sent the pics.

I texted him and asked what class he was in exactly and he didn't respond. So he's lying. Or he's punishing me for not believing him.

NONE of it makes sense though.


----------



## turnera

Jesus Christ, fc. How many times, how many ways, can we say this BEFORE YOU HEAR US?

It ALL MAKES SENSE.

He is a lying, abusive, serial cheater WHO USES YOU AND *ALL THE OTHER WOMEN* HE SCREWS.

It's what he does.

Even his own sisters said so.

*It all makes sense because it's what he does.*


----------



## 3Xnocharm

feeling_crazy said:


> Yes, well he knows that I knew he didn't stay at the hotel and his response was:
> 
> Someone else from his company must have reserved in their name. (I called and threw out even the company name and they did a search by that and nothing).
> He is at that training facility today and will send pics (he did send pics and they look like they came from his phone)
> He IS in class today and will prove it to me by taking a pic (haven't received that one yet)
> 
> BUT I have called the training center and he wasn't even on the roster for any training today at all.
> 
> So he send me pics of the outside and it looks like they're from his phone but that's all I got.
> 
> Then of course he got mad and said "I came here for a sabbatical. Not to be privately investigated."
> 
> This was before he sent the pics.
> 
> I texted him and asked what class he was in exactly and he didn't respond. So he's lying. Or he's punishing me for not believing him.
> 
> NONE of it makes sense though.


STOP TEXTING HIM!!! Why are you even talking to him when he is off screwing another woman??? FFS!! Go dark!


----------



## feeling_crazy

That's my problem you guys..I don't know if he's with another woman right now for sure?

I'm trying to make sense of it all which is why I mentioned the pictures, etc. just throwing me off.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

feeling_crazy said:


> I texted him and asked what class he was in exactly and he didn't respond. So he's lying. Or he's punishing me for not believing him.
> 
> NONE of it makes sense though.


You know what he is doing? (besides having sex with someone else) He is reading all of your texts, and he is LAUGHING his ass off at you! With every text you send, you are making a bigger and bigger fool out of yourself for him, and he is getting off on it! 

WARNING..BLUNT TRUTH AHEAD....


I dont even know why we are all talking, you arent listening to any of us. You are too busy asking WHY WHY WHY he is a cheating a$$hole POS instead to see the reality that THAT is who he is, and that nothing you can do, EVER, is going to change that fact. So you have two choices...LIVE WITH IT and shut up about it, or find some self respect and KICK HIM OUT of your life for good!


----------



## 3Xnocharm

feeling_crazy said:


> That's my problem you guys..I don't know if he's with another woman right now for sure?
> 
> I'm trying to make sense of it all which is why I mentioned the pictures, etc. just throwing me off.


Does it even matter???? He is LYING TO YOU either way! Wow, what a great partner he is!!!


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> That's my problem you guys..I don't know if he's with another woman right now for sure?
> 
> I'm trying to make sense of it all which is why I mentioned the pictures, etc. just throwing me off.


It does not matter if he's with another woman. He's lying about where has been and what he has been doing on this trip. Lies of that level are enough to end a relationship over.


----------



## turnera

Or should be enough, if you had any self esteem.

But considering that you couldn't stay away from him for even 3 months, it's clear you don't.

Therapy?


----------



## Prodigal

feeling_crazy said:


> I'm trying to make sense of it all ...


I'll tell you what you should do, crazy. Quit coming on TAM asking us to figure out this loser who f^cks you and f^ucks other women.

Adults who are emotionally mature realize that trying to pitch a tent inside someone else's brain to pick apart their motivations for doing anything from wiping their butts to blowing their nose is a waste of time.

You won't get counseling. 

You don't listen to a damn thing people tell you here.

And you keep asking "why is he doing this?" and "what makes him say that?"

If you want help to get better, I'm sure you will get awesome support. There are people on TAM who I don't always agree with, but I respect their insights and life experience. LOTS of good folks here.

But if you want to play high school games wondering why this scum bucket screws around, I think you should seriously consider finding other forums that may be able to give you the answers you seek.

As it is, I don't see people responding to you much longer. After all, what is the point? You say, "Yes, I see what you mean, BUT ..." and you revert to the same-old, same-old.

Hon, it's getting REAL OLD. Seriously.


----------



## feeling_crazy

Hello all – Believe me, I know you all must be frustrated. I really don’t have the money to get counseling at the moment because of what I make and even though it’s decent, I can’t afford it. So this is why I’m here. I’m sorry that I’m this way. I’m trying to make sense of things because I’m just confused.

Of course he told me everything he told me and if he COULD HAVE stayed with me on Sunday he would have and to please stop giving him a hard time and just trust, etc.

I explained to him why I felt uncomfortable and how everything came across as shady and asked if it were the other way around, if he’d feel the same way. He said, of course not. He said that he’s answered my questions and that I should let it go.

He’s not getting that the ONLY way I will believe him is IF he shows me proof that he was at that class yesterday. I want to tell him that but I don’t want to come across crazier than he thinks I am. But it’s the truth. It’s what I NEED in order to ever consider talking to him again.

He just makes me feel like I’m being over reactive over something so silly or over “nothing” according to him…

One thing that I’m feeling good about is that I didn’t let him move back in..and I wouldn’t…so that’s a positive still…

I slept nothing the last two nights in anxiety and am feeling that way today…I think it’s because I know the truth and he’s making me go against my intelligence…or am I slightly wrong? Could it remotely be a possibility that he’s telling the truth?

Cause he got so angry..like I was stressing him out over nothing..and the way he explains it..it sounds like it COULD BE

Please be patient with me…I really only have you all..

So how do I tell him that I need proof that he was at the class yesterday showing a date or something or I can’t talk to him ever again? Or is that extreme??


----------



## turnera

Sorry, I can't do it any more. Either you ditch him or I can't help you any more.

THERE IS NO WAY TO REDEEM THIS RELATIONSHIP, ok? Therefore, I will not - CAN not - help you discuss him.


----------



## committed4ever

I beginning to have second thought about this whole thread


----------



## feeling_crazy

Committed4ever please don't start with the questioning of this thread. My story is 100% legit. 

Makes me feel worse that you think that.

Thank you.


----------



## EleGirl

feeling_crazy said:


> I slept nothing the last two nights in anxiety and am feeling that way today…I think it’s because I know the truth and he’s making me go against my intelligence…or am I slightly wrong? Could it remotely be a possibility that he’s telling the truth?


He is not making you go against your intelligence. You are choosing to go against your intelligence. You are the one who is looking for excuses to stay with him. 



feeling_crazy said:


> Cause he got so angry..like I was stressing him out over nothing..and the way he explains it..it sounds like it COULD BE


Has he shown you the hotel bill(s)? He’s lying. He’s acting angry because he knows that will get you to shut up.


feeling_crazy said:


> Please be patient with me…I really only have you all..


Counseling only works if you do want to change and actually do the things that are learned in counseling. IT’s the same with this site… it only works if you follow through. You seem to have no intention of following through. Instead you just want someplace to come and piss and moan while you continue a relationship with a serial cheater who is using you and abusing you.

You are no longer a victim. You are a willing participatent. So far it looks like you like this relationship and the drama it creates. So you will put up with his nonsense.

You say that we are all you have. None of us come here to bring frustration into our lives. This place is hard enough to deal with when we can help a person get to a better place and better their lives.

It’s a sickening feeling to deal with a person who just wants to stay with someone and wants to play the game of “lets talk about how awful it is”. Well no one here wants to talk about him or how awful he is. The only thing we are interested in is you getting out of an abusive relationship and working to fix yourself. 


feeling_crazy said:


> So how do I tell him that I need proof that he was at the class yesterday showing a date or something or I can’t talk to him ever again? Or is that extreme??


Just send him a message saying “I’m done. Cannot deal with the drama. Please do not every contact me again.”

Then either change your phone number or block his number.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

EleGirl said:


> He is not making you go against your intelligence. You are choosing to go against your intelligence. You are the one who is looking for excuses to stay with him.
> 
> 
> Has you shown you the hotel bill(s)? He’s lying. He’s acting angry because he knows that will get you to shut up.
> 
> Counseling only works if you do want to change and actually do the things that are learned in counseling. IT’s the same with this site… it only works if you follow through. You seem to have no intention of following through. Instead you just want someplace to come and piss and moan while you continue a relationship with a serial cheater who is using you and abusing you.
> 
> You are no longer a victim. You are a willing participatent. So far it looks like you like this relationship and the drama it creates. So you will put up with his nonsense.
> 
> You say that we are all you have. None of us come here to bring frustration into our lives. This place is hard enough to deal with when we can help a person get to a better place and better their lives.
> 
> It’s a sickening feeling to deal with a person who just wants to stay with someone and wants to play the game of “lets talk about how awful it is”. Well no one here wants to talk about him or how awful he is. The only thing we are interested in is you getting out of an abusive relationship and working to fix yourself.
> 
> Just send him a message saying “I’m done. Cannot deal with the drama. Please do not every contact me again.”
> 
> Then either change your phone number or block his number.


:yay::yay::yay:


----------



## Gems

Good grief, 24 pages!
So here's what we have so far:
Boy meets girl.
For a while, everything is great. FC is head over heels, he is "the one", she is imagining a future with POS. A future with rainbows and puppies and unicorns.
POS starts lying and cheating. FC is crushed, wondering why would he do this when everything was so great...when HE was so great...the perfect guy for me.
POS starts being violent and tells FC it's her fault for pushing his buttons. FC is remorseful and seemingly agrees, yes I shouldn't have questioned you. You have lied and cheated repeatedly but I should just trust you gbecause you say to.
FC finally "leaves" POS. Except not really. He moves out and she is heartbroken that she has lost POS possibly forever, so she takes every opportunity to stay in contact to make sure that he hasn't changed.
I kind of get this part, sadly. Really. She had a good thing with POS. Then it went really bad. So she thinks that maybe he's going to run off and find someone else and that girl is going to get all the good stuff, because FC thinks she only got the bad stuff because it was her fault for nagging, pushing, questioning, etc. So she has to make sure that doesn't happen. If it does it just proves it was her fault. In her mind. I get that this is what's going through her mind. That, "if only I hadn't questioned him all the time and was just happy, he would have been truthful and faithful" because he WAS (she thinks) truthful and faithful in the Beginning Happy Time. If he finds someone else and is happy, then it MUST BE that the New Woman is something she is not, because it proves he can be honest and faithful and all the other good things.
This is exhausting just typing it.
FC, I kind of get it. It's so very hard to let go. It feels like a failure when you can't make a relationship work no matter what you do. And you remember and wish it could still be like it was.
But too much has happened. Too many lies, too many infidelities, too many fights, too many harsh words, and too many by far violence done to you. It can never be the way you want it again. You see now that the last month was just a charade. He didn't mean any of it. He's out with someone else right now. Maybe he even laughs and shows her your texts and says, "Oh it's my psycho ex again, can you believe it?"
I feel really bad for you. But you are the only one who can stop it completely and walk away. I just don't see that you're ready to do that yet.


----------



## Prodigal

I'm calling complete and total B.S. 

EleGirl is 100% correct in her assessment of you. You just come here to b!tch and moan. 

Can't afford counseling - BULL. BULL. BULL. Counseling is on a sliding scale or free for those who cannot afford it. There IS counseling available through county social services, the YMCA, YWCA, or any other number of avenues. None of which you have bothered to investigate.

Why? Because it's the lazy way out to come here. Guess what? You have shot yourself in the foot. People tried to help. You just kept doing the same stupid stuff. Lather. Rinse. Repeat.

I think committed4ever has every right to question this thread. After all, you just keep whining and sitting on your pity pot. Frankly, I'm beginning to doubt the authenticity of this thread myself. 

I imagine your friends have gotten so sick and tired of listening to this baloney that they avoid you. We were patient with you. But you sound like a whiney kid. Seriously. I have been on TAM a long time and this is the first time I have ever seen anyone wallowing so much in pity.

You are a drama addict. Addiction is hard to kick. You are nowhere near wanting to get better. So keep on posting, but I guarantee you, people will stop responding. 

AND QUIT ASKING US TO FIGURE OUT THAT BUM'S MOTIVES. WE DON'T KNOW. DO YOU COMPREHEND THAT?


----------



## Prodigal

EleGirl said:


> It’s a sickening feeling to deal with a person who just wants to stay with someone and wants to play the game of “lets talk about how awful it is”. Well no one here wants to talk about him or how awful he is.


:iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:

AMEN!!!


----------

