# my body, your body



## HazelGrove (Feb 29, 2012)

GreenEyes's thread on tattoos made me think more widely about our relationship with our bodies and the bodies of our spouses. How much do we 'own' the other's body? Do we have a right to say - 'I don't want you to cut your hair/dye your hair/have a tattoo/pierce your nose/wear this dress/smoke/drink/...' ? How much should we take their preference into account in making decisions about our own bodies? How much do we expect to take our preferences into account?

I don't like my husband smoking. It makes him smell different, and I don't like that smell on his skin. I don't like the idea of all these health issues associated with smoking. But he's a respectful smoker, doesn't smoke in the home, cleans his teeth, etc. He does all he can to minimise the unpleasantness to me. And when it comes to his health...it's his body, isn't it? He can choose to commit slow suicide if he wants. Yet... because of the intimacy between us, because we have become 'one body' spiritually, his body concerns me. Just as my body concerns him. 

Where is the boundary, exactly? Not sure there is one rule to fit all, but it's something worth exploring. I've not been married long enough (a year at the end of April) to have found my bearings exactly around that question.


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## DvlsAdvc8 (Feb 15, 2012)

I don't see anything wrong with expressing how much you don't like something... but I draw the line at harping on it.

Every now and then my wife would catch me sketching out my tattoo idea and every time I'd get an earful of how trashy she thought tattoos look or "are you going to start wearing wife-beaters too?"

As if when she sees a guy like David Beckham she's thinking how trashy he looks... yeah right.

I've dealt with plenty of my wife's choices in hairstyle without harping on how much I didn't like it... in fact I generally soften it up... "not really my thing, I prefer yadda yadda, but if you're happy with it..."

Smoking is a somewhat different beast I think, given its not simply a cosmetic choice but a health choice. Still, I think its best to register your distaste without harping on it. When someone tries to tell me what I can't do or otherwise control me, I have a tendency to want to do that thing even more out of pure spite.


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## GreenEyes (Jan 27, 2011)

I am gonna say it......I agree with DvlsAdvc8..... LOL I think it's ok for the other to state their opinion on the matter, but ultimately it's my body, things like changing my hair color, getting a tattoo, or a piercing is not harmful to anyone or to the relationship.

That being said I think that the person getting the tattoo/piercing should be respectful of their spouse's feelings and not go all out getting sleeves and neck and leg tattoos with multiple face piercings haha 

I don't believe that just because you get a tattoo that makes you trash. How one carries, takes care of, and presents oneself is what makes them trash or not.

In my situation I had the piercings and the crazy hair when we met, the tattoo came after we had been dating, but I heard no objections from him when I got the first one (though it had only been 5 months) He states his opinions on my hair, he doesn't like that I constantly change the color of it, but it never ever looks bad on me, I carry most hair colors well. My hair is something I've been changing up since I was 16, and that's a part of who I am and has been since he's known me...so I would hope he wouldn't really expect me to change that. If he wanted to dye his hair blonde I would tell him to go for it!! haha Not that it would look good, but really is it hurting anything for him to do it?? No...


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## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

I reserve the right to express my opinion about what my wife does to herself but not the right to demand or pressure her to do or not do anything. It's her body and she owns it, but as her partner I get to have an opinion but not a vote. 

As for my body. I would do anything to mine she wanted me to as long as I didn't personally have strong feeling about it. If she wants me to do one thing, and I feel strongly in another direction she looses - sorry but I live in here - she doesn't.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

I'm a bit of a geek when it comes to studying social trends, and I think that many modern trends took away our ability to just be able to answer questions like this implicitly. We focus on the experiences of being married, but not so much the old fashioned rationalism of what it means to each partner in "being married". Or the mutual understanding we shared of what it meant to be married before we actually said "I do".

Hope it makes sense, but what I'm getting at with this situation is that when it comes to boundary issues with our bodies, for me "being married" means that I naturally elevate the things that make my wife happy, content and secure, while she does the same for me. Plus, we respect each other's fears.

Smoking is a no brainer in the marriage understanding between my wife and me. You fear for his health, and the odor speaks for itself. And if he is honest, he'll describe his smoking as an addiction. Really, their aren't legitimate positives for most married couples these days.

Tattoos are also pretty easy. If you want a tattoo, then how does that fit into your marital foundation of 'being married'? Your husband sees that it has special meaning to you. Getting the tattoo will not make him fear that something bad will happen, like a gang tattoo. It would only really matter if he found them so repulsive that it takes away from the marriage itself.

One issue of boundaries we faced was motorcycles. In parts of my life when I lived with my parents, the biker culture was always big. But my wife was a health care worker, and she had literally scooped a guy's brains into a trashcan as they seeped from an open wound. The thought of me having an accident similar to the ones that killed two distant cousins terrified her. Yes, it was my body, and maybe my right. But that little annoying understanding that we developed through pre-marital counseling made it a moot point.

Sorry for the length, but I think we should be willing to put all of these types of issues into the perspective of our joint ideals for our marriage, if that makes sense.


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## nomoretogive (Oct 29, 2011)

GreenEyes said:


> I am gonna say it......I agree with DvlsAdvc8..... LOL I think it's ok for the other to state their opinion on the matter, but ultimately it's my body, things like changing my hair color, getting a tattoo, or a piercing is not harmful to anyone or to the relationship.
> 
> That being said I think that the person getting the tattoo/piercing should be respectful of their spouse's feelings and not go all out getting sleeves and neck and leg tattoos with multiple face piercings haha
> 
> I don't believe that just because you get a tattoo that makes you trash. How one carries, takes care of, and presents oneself is what makes them trash or not.


This is an ongoing topic of discussion/argument in my house. My husband had tattoos when I met him -- about five, and really distasteful and ugly, to me, but they were almost always covered by his clothing, so I guess it didn't really repulse me enough to care at that time, when I was young and dumb. 

Since we've been married, I've gotten numerous tattoos and love them. With the exception of the one on the back of my neck, none of my tattoos can be seen when I wear clothing. Swimsuits are a different story, but thankfully I don't rock those very often  I'm also self-employed and no one cares if I have tattoos that show. 

I know it's hard to define "tasteful" for another person, but I've grown to hate his tattoos, because they're so...tacky. He has like six giant eyeballs joined together on one arm, and then the ugliest naked chick doing something with a lion on the other. Seriously, couldn't he get a hot chick if she was going to live on his arm forever? 

I have a tendency to get tattoos that have meaning in my life. When going through a really rough time in my life, I got a tattoo that is a symbol for perseverance. I am a huge believer in karma, and have the word karma across my back, almost like a jersey. Point is, I'm obviously not anti-tattoo, and believe that when done well and in good taste they are an awesome form of self-expression. 

All that to say that this is one of our bigger arguments right now because he DOES want to get full sleeves on both arms. They have been sketched out and I just really hate them. Just tacky, and they will be there forever.

So where we stand now is that he is free to do whatever he wants, go ahead and get them, but my opinion is I find them unattractive and distasteful, and somewhat offensive, and it may change how I look at him in my mind. In other words, while five ugly somewhat-hidden tattoos don't bother me, "in-your-face" tattoos are not something I find attractive. 

My main opposition, though, I think, is in how people with tattoos, especially sleeves, are perceived, right or wrong, in our little neck of the woods. My husband has had trouble keeping a job -- multiple jobs in four years -- and I keep telling him that I'm not comfortable with him getting sleeves and potentially limiting his ability to get work because the hiring folks are opposed to them or make assumptions about him through their own lens. He has already interviewed with one company that because his tattoos were partially visible he didn't get the job. 

What it really comes down to, I guess, is that I'm sick of carrying the load around here financially as it is with his inability to keep a job that it ticks me off to no end that he is so adamant on doing something that would perpetuate that problem. I've told him this and we've had a conversation about it. He agrees that in his industry/our area tattoos can be a problem, but he insists that he wants to do it anyway. 

We can't seem to reach a compromise. I've suggested that he get his next tattoo on his back, where it can't be seen. He insists that he doesn't want it there. I've suggested he look into training for a different line of work where maybe tattoos would be more acceptable; he doesn't want to do that. I've tried making myself love what he has sketched out, and I just can't. 

Maybe because I'm too close to the situation, and firm in where I stand, I'm not seeing another compromise or fix to this argument. Is there one? In my mind, he can do whatever he wants -- get the tattoos/sleeves and struggle with unemployment -- but then I reserve the right to revisit whether, one, I still find him attractive and, two, whether I'm willing to put up with lengthy unemployment when he can't get a job because of it.


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## In_The_Wind (Feb 17, 2012)

Funny thing one time my wife asks do you like my long hair I said I love it at the time it was down to her rear end, anyway i came home the next day and it was cut short I just started laughing nowadays she lets me know and asks for my opinion before getting her hair cut, which I dont care how she gets it cut or colored it is nice that she asks though.

On the motorcycle issue she rides too and has her own bike that she picked out


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## LaxUF (Feb 13, 2012)

If you really like/love someone you generally try to make yourself more appealing to them or at least not so drastically that it affects your entire appearance. If I was considering such a change then I'd run it across his desk but at the end of the day I have the final decision... Of course the same courtesy/consideration would be returned for his choices as well.

I have long dark hair... If the guy I'm with wants me to cut it short or bleach it; he is more than welcome to go out and find someone that matches his criteria... However... if he suggests trying out a different cut/style/color that isn't too far off from what I already have then I'm open to giving it a shot... same goes for clothes, hobbies, music, sports... 

The key is to not go overboard with expectations and allow room for reasonable compromise.

Regarding tattoos... As someone mentioned previously most people don't rush out and get a tattoo on a whim. I thought long and hard for years about what I wanted for a tattoo. I'd browse casually here & there if I happened to be near a shop... one day I stumbled across the EXACT one I'd been hoping to find. I was sacred & nervous but I did it and don't regret it for a second. 

My roommate at the time (sweet little sorority bff) totally freaked out and begged me not to do it... she cried while I was gone but by the time I got home and she saw how happy I was she smiled and congratulated me. 

I knew what I wanted to add to it (in memory of my dad) but again I waited until I stumbled across the exact design... My very conservative catholic boyfriend was really, really upset with me when I got home. Once he cooled down and became rational again he accepted the significance & that it was my body... didn't mean that he was ok with me doing it prior to notifying him (ummm couldn't b/c he was at work). 

We compromised by my apologizing & that I would try to notify him in the future... Lessons learned from that mid 20's relationship: advance notice of body art, no dancing on bars/tables with girlfriends, do not show any midriff areas or wear skirts/shorts shorter than arm/fingertip length...:sleeping: I wonder why we didn't last??? :scratchhead:

There is VAST difference between being controlling and being considerate (on both sides).


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## Mistys dad (Dec 2, 2011)

Opinions are a right.

But, every action has a consequence.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

I worry about my husband's drinking only because his liver is his only liver. He drinks a lot...well, compared to me, who drinks maybe once a week (a glass or two of wine). he drinks a few beers a night and while it doesn't effect his personality or responsibilities, I worry about his health.

His penis is all mine though :rofl: We joke about that all the time. My body is his body, his body is mine.


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## Stryker (Feb 3, 2012)

HazelGrove said:


> GreenEyes's thread on tattoos made me think more widely about our relationship with our bodies and the bodies of our spouses. How much do we 'own' the other's body? Do we have a right to say - 'I don't want you to cut your hair/dye your hair/have a tattoo/pierce your nose/wear this dress/smoke/drink/...' ? How much should we take their preference into account in making decisions about our own bodies? How much do we expect to take our preferences into account?
> 
> I don't like my husband smoking. It makes him smell different, and I don't like that smell on his skin. I don't like the idea of all these health issues associated with smoking. But he's a respectful smoker, doesn't smoke in the home, cleans his teeth, etc. He does all he can to minimise the unpleasantness to me. And when it comes to his health...it's his body, isn't it? He can choose to commit slow suicide if he wants. *Yet... because of the intimacy ( Care n Love) between us, because we have become 'one body' spiritually, his body concerns me. Just as my body concerns him. * *COMELY...it WAS but..*
> 
> Where is the boundary, exactly? Not sure there is one rule to fit all, but it's something worth exploring. I've not been married long enough (a year at the end of April) to have found my bearings exactly around that question.*TROUBLE IMPENDING ??*


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## waiwera (Sep 8, 2009)

My H's opinion matters more to me than anyone elses in the world. So I doubt I would do anything to myself that would make me appear less attractive to him on purpose.

I have long hair...H loves it so i keep it. 
I'm the same size and shape I was 25 years ago when we met..he likes my shape so i work at keeping it.

H had a moustache (since he was about 12 years old!) for the first 20 years we were together. I asked him to shave it off to see how it looked, he didn't really want to and thought about it for a many weeks. One night we were going out for dinner for my birthday and H came out dressed to go...all clean shaven. I loved him for that and just wanted to jump him there and then!

If it was a health issue...I would say a husband and wife have a vested interest in each other and have every right to express an opinion of dislike of a certain activity (ie: the smoking).. then the 'smoker' has the option to of doing what they want... hopefully they care enough about their spouse to take their feelings, at the very least, into consideration.

I like to do things that are good for me, good for hubby and my marriage.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Mistys dad said:


> Opinions are a right.
> 
> But, every action has a consequence.


When you do something that your spouse does not like, you send the message that what you are doing is more important than their opinion. Nothing wrong with that in many circumstances, but it is the message being sent. It is critical to remember that when deciding what is important.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

I have been told I can`t get a tattoo, but I know that really means I won`t like it if you do.


My wife wanted a breast job, I said "Fine just know it could have a negative impact on my attraction to you."

There`s no more talk of a breast job.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

I have a very strong influence over what clothing my wife buys and wears. To the point of shopping for her. Why? Otherwise she'd walk around like a crazy cat lady in 3 sweatshirts or some 80 year old Boca broad in 12 different kinds of gold lame. She will color her hair and it's always in some dark tone. Makeups' a hit or miss. I'm color vision deficient so I can't help with that. But if I didn't I swear she'd get picked up for being insane and homeless.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

HazelGrove said:


> GreenEyes's thread on tattoos made me think more widely about our relationship with our bodies and the bodies of our spouses. How much do we 'own' the other's body? Do we have a right to say - 'I don't want you to cut your hair/dye your hair/have a tattoo/pierce your nose/wear this dress/smoke/drink/...' ? How much should we take their preference into account in making decisions about our own bodies? How much do we expect to take our preferences into account?
> 
> I don't like my husband smoking. It makes him smell different, and I don't like that smell on his skin. I don't like the idea of all these health issues associated with smoking. But he's a respectful smoker, doesn't smoke in the home, cleans his teeth, etc. He does all he can to minimise the unpleasantness to me. And when it comes to his health...it's his body, isn't it? He can choose to commit slow suicide if he wants. Yet... because of the intimacy between us, because we have become 'one body' spiritually, his body concerns me. Just as my body concerns him.
> 
> Where is the boundary, exactly? Not sure there is one rule to fit all, but it's something worth exploring. I've not been married long enough (a year at the end of April) to have found my bearings exactly around that question.


Another controversal subject. For my wife and I we have ownership of each other in the caring sense. Not an object and not a slave.

I will just summarize that I am a big believer in POJA. Policy of Joint Agreement. That covers beyond this topic.


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

HazelGrove said:


> GreenEyes's thread on tattoos made me think more widely about our relationship with our bodies and the bodies of our spouses. How much do we 'own' the other's body? Do we have a right to say - 'I don't want you to cut your hair/dye your hair/have a tattoo/pierce your nose/wear this dress/smoke/drink/...' ? How much should we take their preference into account in making decisions about our own bodies? How much do we expect to take our preferences into account?
> 
> I don't like my husband smoking. It makes him smell different, and I don't like that smell on his skin. I don't like the idea of all these health issues associated with smoking. But he's a respectful smoker, doesn't smoke in the home, cleans his teeth, etc. He does all he can to minimise the unpleasantness to me. And when it comes to his health...it's his body, isn't it? He can choose to commit slow suicide if he wants. Yet... because of the intimacy between us, because we have become 'one body' spiritually, his body concerns me. Just as my body concerns him.
> 
> Where is the boundary, exactly? Not sure there is one rule to fit all, but it's something worth exploring. I've not been married long enough (a year at the end of April) to have found my bearings exactly around that question.


I don't think spouse's 'own' each other's bodies at all. I know if you are a biblical person, it says that each of your bodies are the others. But, it's more of a stewardship, than an ownership.

Stewardship is "the careful and responsible management of something entrusted to one's care." Ownership implies possession, but stewardship implies trust and caring.

You care about and are concerned about your spouse's body and well-being. If they have the same sense of stewardship that you do, they will feel the same way about you, and they will also take into consideration the things that bother you and vice versa.

Each couple needs to define the boundaries of stewardship in their relationship. I think things should be discussed and shared - so the ideas about getting something that could substantively change your appearance, especially something more permanent, such as getting tattoos should be divulged and discussed. It is not just one of you living with them, it is both.

For smoking, your spouse needs to make a decision to stop, but you can be a good steward of their body by encouraging them and helping them to kick the habit so they can live a healthier life.

Alas, at the end of day you cannot make your mate do what they choose not to. But without stating your opinion as to the wise stewardship of their body, you don't have a leg to stand on. And, if they constantly begrudge you that stewardship, then you also know where you stand and what their viewpoint is on marital stewardship.


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## Stryker (Feb 3, 2012)

Enchantment said:


> I don't think spouse's 'own' each other's bodies at all. I know if you are a biblical person, it says that each of your bodies are the others. But, it's more of a stewardship, than an ownership.
> 
> 
> New International Version (©1984)
> ...


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Well, however you want to look at it, his penis is mine. I play with it often. Ok, so maybe I don't own it, but I 'check it out' like a library book quite often.


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## hurtnohio (Jul 17, 2011)

_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## hurtnohio (Jul 17, 2011)

that_girl said:


> I worry about my husband's drinking only because his liver is his only liver. He drinks a lot...well, compared to me, who drinks maybe once a week (a glass or two of wine). he drinks a few beers a night and while it doesn't effect his personality or responsibilities, I worry about his health.
> 
> His penis is all mine though :rofl: We joke about that all the time. My body is his body, his body is mine.


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## hurtnohio (Jul 17, 2011)

Damn, thatgirl! Does your husband realize how lucky he is?

You always know how to keep threads interesting!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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