# I can't seem to win my wife heart back



## Bigowl (Jul 31, 2015)

My wife about 2-3 months ago asked if she could write a letter to our oldest son biological father (Jonathan) who is in prison so that he could start to get to know him. So I agreed. After several correspondents back in forth she asked me if it would be okay if she took Jonathan's mother to see him since she have never seen her son who has been in prison 20 years. Doing the Christian thing I told her that would only be right. While on the trip my wife made a mistake and left her IPad behind. I logged on to her IPad and noticed letter after letter full of erotic/love to Jonathan. I called her and asked her about it she told me I was not suppose to find out this way she was sorry. After she got home we talked and she explained to me she's been unhappy the last two years of our marriage and it has been over along time ago. The reason she says she is so unhappy is because I didn't show her all the emotions she needed and later I found out I have not pleased her sexually in the last 4 years. Then she told me that she was not happy about all the weight I have gained. I know I lacked emotions in our marriage and sometimes I could be down right mean to my wife. I was never because I didn't love her but we have a very hectic life 5 children with autism or ADHD or a combination of both. I often through the marriage had to work two jobs and through it all my wife was sick and hospitalized a lot. 

I have apologized over and over again about not showing her the love and attention she needed through our marriage but now she seems so cold and told me she's in love with both of us and she don't know what to do. I love and have always loved my wife more then life itself but now I think I have lost her. Earlier today I held her in my arms and told her how much I love her and how beautiful she was to me that made her angry. He explained how could you do this to us if you can do it now? Why not years ago? I don't know why? I ask myself this same question everyday. I don't even care about the letters I just want my wife back the sweet, gentle, kind one who was madly in love with me. I don't know what to do I need my wife but more I show her how much she means to me the angrier she becomes. I'm lost I don't know what to do or if I can even live a productive life without her. The more I say we can work through this the more she tells me I don't believe we can. My God our 15 year anniversary is this Tuesday and she just seems so cold. I'm crying everyday over this (and I'm not a man who cries very easy). Please help what can I do to work through all the hurt , pain, and devastation I have caused her?


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## Thound (Jan 20, 2013)

Wow man, so sorry you are here. This may sound stupid, but quit trying to win her back. Read up on the 180 and apply it. You need to detach ASAP. Also, quit apologizing for your short comings. If she was that unhappy, she should have let you know so that you could work on the marriage. Quit putting her on a pedestal. She is a common cheater in my book. Did I read it right? She is in love with a loser who is in jail? if that's the case let her go. She's not very bright.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

It's been my experience that chicks don't like needy little men who beg....they dig confident guys that know what they want and don't have to be a holes about it cuz they can always find another one.

It's time to raise your attraction level by having the confidence to let your wife go and no longer tolerate her crap by asking her to leave.

It is not your job to control her. Your job is to reward those around you that respect you and want to be around you....

You can't demand respect but you can command it by letting go of the ones that don't show any.

Stop rewarding your old ladies bad behavior by being her doormat. You can always be her doormat when she deserves it but from were I'm sitting you are getting walked and and ain't getting shyt back for it.

In short the only need being met here is your old lady...while you sit and rot....you do know you have the power to change that by being calm and confident and working on you and stop pleasing someone you just can't please.

Work on your self let the rest come along and join the ride and reap the reward or let them fend for them selves.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Just in case you missed the point....you don't win her back ...she wins you back!

Let me ask you what have you done to show her what she is losing?

What actions have you taken to make her think twice about her choices?

And talk is cheap...don;t tell me all the crap you have told her and threatened her with!!! I'm talking about action you have taken.


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## Chelle D (Nov 30, 2011)

BigOwl...

I agree that you've got to strengthen up and start caring for yourself. If it starts attracting your wife, all the better, but you've got to be happy with who you are and what you are. I'm sure you've heard the saying... if you can't love yourself, you can't expect others to love you. (Or the saying is similar).

Tell her what you expect out of the marriage. Good Christian man, or not... She sounds like she could benefit from a good awakening, and have some strong guidelines laid down. Tell her whats acceptable, and what's not. Just because he's your son's biological father... does not mean you have to be "christian" and let her walk all over your relationship with an emotional affair with another man.

Don't accept sloppy seconds. In this case, it's emotional seconds. She's got to cut off the affair completely. You do not have to accept this man into your marriage. You did not make vows with her saying you would accept another person in the picture. You have every right to expect her to be yours only.

Tell her that, and dont accept excuses.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

Could they have had conjugal visit? It sounds like she wants to be his. That's why she is repulsed by your signs of affection. Typical woman going after the bad boy. Do you have any biological kids with her? Is he due to get out soon?

Sounds like you're putting a lot into the kids but little into you. She's obviously putting in her emotional energy into someone else. Doesn't matter that her special needs kids lives could be blown apart.

You need to get your weight under control. Go to the gym and work out hard. invest in yourself. it'll make you a better husband and father.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

I reread your post.
#1 she is pissed off at you cuz of the guilt...we all know you love her more then she deserves(even her). that doesn't make her feel good. my advice earlier will take away the guilt and she will feel justified, but in the end this affair won't work out and you are basicly pushing her a way so she can see her bad choices sooner.
#2 you make her feel sad and angry no matter what. You can't compete with new love. The time with her other man is way better with him then you...AGAIN YOU CAN'T COMPETE WITH NEW LOVE... nicing your way through this will only prolong the emotional torture. This will take some time to see how bad her choices were and the conseguences she will face.

I strongly suggest the 180, distance your self, stop crying in front of her (cry in the garage like the rest of us) and make her think twice in what she is lossing by letting her go with a smile on your face (fake it until you make it ).

At the end of the day women like confident men....that don't cry....If you want to save this marriage you will help her pack her bags, thank her for the memories, and know in your heart you are better then this crap and deserve good things from someone that can be honest, loyal, and respectful.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Me and you sure know how to pick um!

I guess my weakness is sl^tty biker chicks.

What was yours?


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

Bigowl said:


> I logged on to her IPad and noticed letter after letter full of erotic/love to Jonathan. I called her and asked her about it she told me I was not suppose to find out this way she was sorry. After she got home we talked and she explained to me she's been unhappy the last two years of our marriage and it has been over along time ago. The reason she says she is so unhappy is because I didn't show her all the emotions she needed and later I found out I have not pleased her sexually in the last 4 years.


 Look up "emotional affair" ("EA"). Even though EA are not physical, it is still cheating. Thus your wife is a cheater plain an simple. Why do I say this? Because understanding that she is a cheater will explain her actions.

First, 95% of cheaters will rationalize why it was OK for them to cheat by making you the bad guy. They hold you to a standard of perfection that no human can meet. They do this because they want to shift blame for their cheating onto you. No matter how hard you try you cannot be perfect, so stop trying to play her game. Remember that since she is now acting as the judge and jury in this game, the outcome of you losing is already determined. Second, call her out on her cheating by calling it what it is to her face. Do not back down or even listen to her reasons for cheating. Tell her that it was her obligation as your spouse to tell you before she cheated that she was unhappy, and so that you would have had a chance to address it, and that if you did not address it she had the moral obligation of ending the marriage before entering into a relationship with someone else. Tell her that you are only 50% to blame for the issues in the marriage, but that she is 100% to blame for cheating. Tell her that the fact that she does not get that is why she is a cheater, and why she has the low morals of someone that can lie and cheat without remorse. Sort of like the morals of a long term felon in prison.

The best way to save a marriage is to be willing to end it and mean it. Tell her that you will file for immediate divorce and not look back unless she takes full responsibility for her cheating, shows real remorse, cuts off all contact with her affair partner, and agrees to full transparency without complaint, which includes all passwords. Do not wait for an answer or try to talk her into this. After stating your demands, proceed with moving forward with divorce post haste. Make her work to earn the right to second chance. The odds are not 100% that she will choose you over her affair partner, but you have much better odds by doing this then by taking your current path of weakness. Besides at least this way if the marriage is over, you leave with your dignity intact.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

How old are all the children? How many of them are both of yours vs hers/yours from previous relationships?

Is she getting emails from him while he's in prison?

I agree with the others in that you have to stop trying to win her back the way you are. You are begging and pleading.. that's not going to work at all.

Start doing things to take care of yourself. Go work out, lose weight. Start doing things for yourself. Start interacting with her according to the 180 (see link in my signature block below.

A book that might help you is "Surviving an Affair" by Dr. Harley. 
Tell her that you would like to recover your marriage. But you will not do that as long as she's in a relationship with Jonathan. In order for you to stay in the marriage you require that she end the relationship (the book tells how to do this) and sends a no contact letter with you involved, you will be moving on with your life. A marriage cannot be repaired as long as there is an affair going on.


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## Bigowl (Jul 31, 2015)

Thank you to everyone I have read the 180 rules and unfortunately broke damn near ALL of them. I have got my balls back now and the 180 rules are going to be strictly applied from now on. Only thing is our anniversary is this Tuesday how do the rules apply to that?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Bigowl said:


> Thank you to everyone I have read the 180 rules and unfortunately broke damn near ALL of them. I have got my balls back now and the 180 rules are going to be strictly applied from now on. Only thing is our anniversary is this Tuesday how do the rules apply to that?



Tell her that since she does not know if she wants to be married and because she is in a affair, you will not be celebrating your anniversary.

Also get the book I suggested. There is a lot more beside the 180 that you need to do.

Have you exposed her affair to anyone? 

How old is your step daughter? I'm concerned about her dragging a young girl into this.


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## dash74 (Jan 3, 2015)

Bigowl said:


> Thank you to everyone I have read the 180 rules and unfortunately broke damn near ALL of them. I have got my balls back now and the 180 rules are going to be strictly applied from now on. Only thing is our anniversary is this Tuesday how do the rules apply to that?


Dinner for one at a fancy restaurant and I like watches so if you have the dough an Omega planet ocean with a black dial and orange bezel remember its an investment


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## lilith23 (Sep 6, 2012)

One thing I don't get it is why didn't she talk with you about this? I don't get it, how can anyone be unhappy for so long and not talk to their spouses.

You're not responsible to read her mind and she could have talked with you honestly. Did she do that even once?

Also, even if she is unhappy, cheating is wrong. She decided to marry and commit and if she can't handle with vows then don't commit. Relationships are not just roses so people don't get to make vows of committing for better or worse then don't commit when the worse comes. She could at least divorce before starting her relationship with her ex.


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

lilith23 said:


> One thing I don't get it is why didn't she talk with you about this? I don't get it, how can anyone be unhappy for so long and not talk to their spouses.


She's gone, and nothing's gonna' bring her back. CLASSIC WAW.

180 time. It's over pal. Happens ALL THE TIME. And everyone's still acting like your situation is unique. 

The worst thing that EVER happened to relationship discussions was when Tom Cruize jumped up and down on Oprah's couch. WAW discussions were actually starting to get traction and Oprah was leading them. Then THE WORLD'S attention turned to crazy Tom Cruize. And now NOBODY knows what goes through the mind of the 70% of women who are unhappy in their marriages.

Lilith...You have been on these boards 3 years and you are asking that question? You just fully describes the WAW in that one, innocent question. While you read posters from here on out, read them with the knowledge that A LOT of women are in marriages with men they hate.

I thought I was the rare man who had it made. Not a PERFECT marriage, but close. I loved her. She loved me. We were life partners. In it to the end. We were going to make it. She was my love, my life, my everything. And I was hers.

Imagine what went through my head. My mind, my BODY, in that horrible moment when I realized she had actually hated me for the past 5 years or more.

It happens. Read men's stories from now on accepting that it COULD happen at least. Those stories will make A LOT more sense from now on


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/genera...husband-workaholic-doesnt-show-affection.html

The very next thread I open after I posted the above. It was next in line, by the way. I COULD do this ALL DAY. I just thought the timing was interesting on this one.


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## lilith23 (Sep 6, 2012)

MachoMcCoy said:


> She's gone, and nothing's gonna' bring her back. CLASSIC WAW.
> 
> 180 time. It's over pal. Happens ALL THE TIME. And everyone's still acting like your situation is unique.
> 
> ...


I'm registered since 3 years ago but only come here from time to time.

There is another thread about a wife that discovered how much hate his husband feels about her when she accidentally discovered his rants about her in a Facebook group.

Idk, I can't imagine this kind of thing as I always tell what's going on inside me and expect my husband to do the same. Discovering something like this is probably screw my mind with trust issues. It must be very hard for you to realize that...


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

Sorry to pick on you Lilith, but you will REFUSE to believe this one. Ready?

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/281650-i-woke-up-stranger.html

Read the original post in that thread. 

Ok, you read it? Here goes...

IF this woman ever works up the courage to leave this bastard, he will be SHOCKED that it happened and will claim that she never discussed these problems with him in the past. I can almost guarantee it. And all the really smart experienced chicks on this board will be giving her all of this great advice all while having NO CLUE what is going on in this ****weeds's mind. 

After all these years. Decades. CENTURIES, and nobody gets that dynamic yet. Maybe you need to feel that kick in the gut to understand it. But all these threads are clear as day to me ever since. 

Clear as day...


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## lilith23 (Sep 6, 2012)

MachoMcCoy said:


> Sorry to pick on you Lilith, but you will REFUSE to believe this one. Ready?
> 
> http://talkaboutmarriage.com/general-relationship-discussion/281650-i-woke-up-stranger.html
> 
> ...


This link's thread doesn't seem like the same situation, and in the middle of the post the OP said that she tried to tell him how he had hurt her but didn't work. They have been fighting and even went to counseling, if the husband is shocked if the wife leaves then he must be quite oblivious.

In this thread and the FB one, both simply found out but they never had big issues (or perhaps they are also oblivious??).

In the end, of course threads are written by OPs based on their own perspective so we will never get to know the real truth. Perhaps I'm also not seeing the pattern you are seeing, I never experienced it afterall. :S


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## dental (Apr 16, 2014)

Bigowl said:


> ... she explained to me she's been unhappy the last two years of our marriage and it has been over along time ago .... I didn't show her all the emotions she needed and later I found out I have not pleased her sexually in the last 4 years. ... she was not happy about all the weight I have gained .... I know I lacked emotions in our marriage and sometimes I could be down right mean to my wife .... I was never because I didn't love her but ...


Ouch. It seems that you woke up a little too late. Very probably your W has tried to communicate at least the last 5 years about her unhappiness. In hindsight, is this the case here? You also say you were downright mean to your W. That was probably not very constructive either. 

It sounds that she made her decision already, and is pursuing happiness elsewhere. You've got some serious reflecting to do where you are now, how you got here and eat the future will hold for you. Good luck!


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Sounds like you're a typical placeholder dad for a single woman with a kid.

When does convict boy get out of jail?

What did he do?

Tell her the next time she goes to see him her stuff will be out in the yard.

Talk to a lawyer about how you will be able to keep your kids away from him in the future.


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

You may have done the wrong thing in the past, but suddenly changing into a loving and wonderful husband now is simply too late. To chase her now that she has cheated on you looks weak and desperate and is simply not going to be believable. On top of anger she feels will be disgust and loathing.

You said you are now doing the 180, and that's a good thing imo if you can keep it up. You may need to start coming to terms with the marriage being over, and you need to realise you don't need her in your life, you can do fine without her. Honestly, that's the only way I've seen people make it through bad times, not through desperately clinging to their partner, but through quiet confidence that no matter what happens, you'll be just fine.


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## EVG39 (Jun 4, 2015)

Big Owl,
Sorry you are here. You did not choose to be here and it is key that you remember first and foremost that it is not your fault. but you are in the process of getting a very hard education in human sexual dynamics. You are trying to understand what your wife has done and why and your (and especially her) first inclination is to blame you . Stop it right now. She is to blame. Period. But here are a couple of concepts you need to wrap your mind around in order understand your wife and her new behavior.
First your wife is exhibiting all the behaviors of an alpha widow. This is a woman who sleeps with alphas in her 20s and, as a result, refuses to "compromise" for a beta male later on (or does so, grudgingly). This is true even in the case (and is mostly the case) where the alpha male discards the woman unceremoniously after he has his way with her. She still holds him above all others and seeks him out thereafter, whatever his poor behavior (and failing that, pines over him, sometimes for decades). She views you as the beta, especially because you were willing to do the hard work to parent the alpha's child when he was out doing what he wished. That makes you his inferior. And she doesn't want an inferior man, she wants (and feels she deserves) the superior man. So your doing the right thing made you seem weak to her. Yucky, I know. And probably blows the top of your Christian brain (and mine too) but biology is another god that will be served. Happens all the time.
The second concept you need to get your mind around is the blame shifting, or something I have heard better described elsewhere as the rationalization hamster. The rationalization hamster is a legendary creature dwelling deep in the minds of the self-delusional. From birth, the rationalization hamster enters a symbiotic relation with its host, whereby whenever the host feels a craving to do something completely insane and malicious that will have horrible consequences for everyone in the long run, the rationalization hamster will jump on its wheel and run really, really fast, getting the magical hamster wheel to spin out a bunch of neat rationalizations for the ultimately devastating action. Here's how that plays out in your case,

Your Wife begins the affair for no reason other than she wants to.
Wife feels guilty
Wife doesn't want to feel guilty. 
Wife's rationalization hamster kicks in to help her find reasons to blame someone else.
Hamster finds you.
Hamster says hubby ignored you wife, was workaholic, got chubby, etc. , etc. etc.
Wife says Ah-Ha and can now blithely blame you for the affair, its all my husband's fault huzzah!
Wife's guilt all gone and she now really feels good since she deserves this affair as in her hamsterized mind you drove her to it. 
Good-bye guilt Hello dopamine rush.

Okay, now you see what you are dealing with ? The reasons became known to her only after she entered the affair as a way to get rid of her guilt. And if worked for her. And nearly worked on you. Don't accept her narrative. It's BS.

Look I bet you are a good and decent man. I know you didn't deserve this. But buddy you have been dealt a bad hand here. I don't think I would put very much energy into saving the marriage.. I would worry about your kids and yourself. She's too far gone. Sorry.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

lilith23 said:


> *One thing I don't get it is why didn't she talk with you about this? I don't get it, how can anyone be unhappy for so long and not talk to their spouses.
> *
> You're not responsible to read her mind and she could have talked with you honestly. Did she do that even once?
> 
> Also, even if she is unhappy, cheating is wrong. She decided to marry and commit and if she can't handle with vows then don't commit. Relationships are not just roses so people don't get to make vows of committing for better or worse then don't commit when the worse comes. She could at least divorce before starting her relationship with her ex.


unfortunately many spouses do this. It's typical in WAW or WAH. However cheating spouses always like to rewrite history So it's possible she wasn't really upset about much, enter the emotionally affair and now to deflect guilt, she wants to blame all the marriage woes on him to make herself feel less guilt.

Cheater think 101 really.

Op keep up the 180. Gina a nice steakhouse and go celebrate your anniversary alone. Sit at the bar and eat it's not nearly as lonely as you would think


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## MachoMcCoy (Oct 20, 2014)

lilith23 said:


> if the husband is shocked if the wife leaves then he must be quite oblivious.


That is exactly my point. A man who is SHOCKED that his wife is leaving is almost ALWAYS being left by a wife who told him until she was "blue in the face" what the issues were.

Once you can wrap your head around THAT, you may start getting it.


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## nirvana (Jul 2, 2012)

EVG39 said:


> Big Owl,
> Sorry you are here. You did not choose to be here and it is key that you remember first and foremost that it is not your fault. but you are in the process of getting a very hard education in human sexual dynamics. You are trying to understand what your wife has done and why and your (and especially her) first inclination is to blame you . Stop it right now. She is to blame. Period. But here are a couple of concepts you need to wrap your mind around in order understand your wife and her new behavior.
> First your wife is exhibiting all the behaviors of an alpha widow. This is a woman who sleeps with alphas in her 20s and, as a result, refuses to "compromise" for a beta male later on (or does so, grudgingly). This is true even in the case (and is mostly the case) where the alpha male discards the woman unceremoniously after he has his way with her. She still holds him above all others and seeks him out thereafter, whatever his poor behavior (and failing that, pines over him, sometimes for decades). She views you as the beta, especially because you were willing to do the hard work to parent the alpha's child when he was out doing what he wished. That makes you his inferior. And she doesn't want an inferior man, she wants (and feels she deserves) the superior man. So your doing the right thing made you seem weak to her. Yucky, I know. And probably blows the top of your Christian brain (and mine too) but biology is another god that will be served. Happens all the time.
> The second concept you need to get your mind around is the blame shifting, or something I have heard better described elsewhere as the rationalization hamster. The rationalization hamster is a legendary creature dwelling deep in the minds of the self-delusional. From birth, the rationalization hamster enters a symbiotic relation with its host, whereby whenever the host feels a craving to do something completely insane and malicious that will have horrible consequences for everyone in the long run, the rationalization hamster will jump on its wheel and run really, really fast, getting the magical hamster wheel to spin out a bunch of neat rationalizations for the ultimately devastating action. Here's how that plays out in your case,
> ...


Great post!
I was not aware of the hamster until now. I looked it up, my wife uses it as well, but to justify her pi$$y irrational behavior towards me.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

EVG39 said:


> Your Wife begins the affair for no reason other than she wants to.
> Wife feels guilty
> Wife doesn't want to feel guilty.
> Wife's rationalization hamster kicks in to help her find reasons to blame someone else.
> ...


:iagree::iagree::iagree:
Well said. @OP: You need to read this over and over again until you truly understand this.


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## TRy (Sep 14, 2011)

MachoMcCoy said:


> A man who is SHOCKED that his wife is leaving is almost ALWAYS being left by a wife who told him until she was "blue in the face" what the issues were.


 That is not true if there is an affair partner involved. What happens when there is an affair partner is that the cheater reinvents history to blame shift the affair onto their spouse. In trying to save the marriage, the good spouse accepts blame and tries to earn the cheater's heart back. Bottom line, the reasons for the cheater cheating are false, and the very fact that the cheated on spouse is trying so hard to win the cheater back proves that if the cheater had really communicated with their spouse until they were "blue in the face", the cheated on spouse would have worked to correct the issue.


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