# Ladies: What do you think of THIS male advice?



## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

Found these posts on another thread and it got me thinking...is it just ME?

1.) ILYBINILWY = PROOF of an affair!

I think of ILYBINILWY as more of "*I care about you, but I don't love you*." As in:
I care about you, I don't HATE you...

don't want the next 18-wheeler coming down the road to hit you
don't want a piano to fall on your head from a 3rd floor window
don't want the next train to run you over
BUT, I don't "LOVE" you

I care about you as a human being
I care that my children love you as their father
I don't want to have sex with you, but it doesn't mean I'm having sex (or an EA) with someone else either!
I don't want to be intimate with you physically, emotionally, spiritually anymore

2.)


> When you find out who your wife is sleeping with you have an option to expose the affair to kill it. Then you have a good chance to bringing your wife back to the marriage.


Am I the ONLY woman who sees exposing my (theoretical) affair to EVERYONE who knows me - family, friends, co-workers - as THE KISS OF DEATH for my EVER getting back together with you? I would see this behavior as a 'scorched earth' policy: an attempt to completely obliterate my life so I am forced to crawl back to you wherein you will expect me to spend the REST OF MY LIFE on my knees begging your forgiveness, you feel justified in rubbing my nose in it FOREVER whenever you're p*ssed off at me, and you would never let me forget how LUCKY I am that you condescended to take me back. If you TOLD EVERYONE I KNOW, I would assume your ultimate agenda is to humiliate me and make me PAY FOREVER for my transgression.

NOTE: I have NEVER had an affair; I said 'hypothetical' affair. Am I the ONLY woman who feels like this about either/both of these statements that seem to be not-uncommon male POVs on TAM?


*


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## Holland (Aug 20, 2012)

I totally agree with you.

People are too trigger happy to call "affair" on TAM. I know in my case there was no affair.

I also agree that exposing something like that would drive me away forever.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

Should have known you'd be here, Holland; you and I think a lot alike!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

1.)	ILYBINILWY = PROOF of an affair!
This statement means that there is something very wrong with the marriage. It’s time to get serious about finding out what the problems are and fixing them. Well you all should have done this before it got to this point but now that the marriage has deteriorated to this point it’s time to make it top priority.

Sometimes, when either the husband or wife says this, it can mean that they are in an affair.

2.)	Exposing an affair
Most people who deal with helping recover a marriage from infidelity suggest exposing the affair. 

However I think that the scorched earth approach will often back fire. It has to be done very judiciously. The purposes for exposing depend on who the affair it being exposed to.

a)	Spouse of AP – tell them because then the AP will be so busy dealing with their own marital problems that they will drop the wS.

b)	Family of WS – tell them and ask for support in talking to the WS about ending the affair and working on the marriage.

c)	Work- Some advocate telling the job IF the affair is being carried out on the job. Just be sure that the BS is ready to lose the income from the WS. In our current economy it could be quite a while before the WS finds another job.

d)	Friends – only tell as a last resort to get help in talking to the WS.

Some around here seem to think that exposing the affair is about humiliating, embarrassing and punishing the WS. That’s not what it’s about.


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## TiggyBlue (Jul 29, 2012)

I think exposing the an affair a lot of the time is about getting the ws out of fantasizing and romanticizing their actions.

But I agree ILYBNILWY doesn't automatically mean cheating has occured, also think alot of your thought's on what ILYBNILWY are spot on.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

Never agreed that ILYBNILWY meant affair and I cringe every time I see someone suggest that it does.in some cases the poster provides details that lead me to think the ILYBNILWY is because of an affair but mostly I automatically apply it to my own situation...I loved my exhusband but wasn't in love with him anymore.Had nothing to do with another man,he ruined things without the help of another man

IF I was the type to have an affair,exposing me to my friends,family,and every one else would make me run as far from you as possible.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

I've deleted the thread now but I was having a problem over the summer and in no time it was suggested that my husband of 21 years was having an affair. One even said I was having an EA with his best friend.

I ended up laughing so hard that I totally forgot about the problem that I originally posted about. LOL That was an eye opening experience though. Not every marital problem involves an affair. We did have a problem but there was no affair on either side.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

I would also NOT think by someone saying this (the whole ILYBNILWY), that this = they are cut & dried engaged in an affair.

For those whose minds automatically work like this...this is likely a part of their personal experience ....or they can not comprehend that some couples actually talk to each other & share the hard thoughts/ "falling out of love" feelings BEFORE falling into an infidelity. 

And really.... this is a sign of Respect ....even better communication, that whole "willing" Transparency thing going on.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Exposing an affair far and wide is not just recommended for wayward wives, but also wayward husbands, by the Marriage Builders community. 

Even if it does drive the wayward spouse away and scorch the earth, NOT exposing the affair will only show the wayward spouse that the betrayed spouse is not going to stand up for their own marriage. Not exposing shows the wayward spouse that the betrayed spouse is simply going to lay down and let the wayward trample their head into the dust.

There may be times when not exposing is the right thing to do, but if there is an active affair going on, exposing is many times the only way to end it.


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## Kermitty (Dec 27, 2012)

ILYBINILWY = PROOF of an affair
I suppose it can't always be true but I feel like someone who is having an affair would have more confidence to actually say that. 

After my husband found out about my affair, I did tell my family and I told him he should tell someone too. The support from family or friends at this time is very important. Unless they aren't the kind of people that are supportive, then nevermind. I am not embarrassed by people knowing I had an affair. One thing you learn after the affair, if you seek help, is the hurt partner can not hold the affair over your head. If you both agree to work it out then that should be understood.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

ILYBNILWY - There are way too many times the crowd on TAM will say "affair!!" without any real proof of an affair. 

ILYBNINLWY doesn't mean the person who said it is in an affair. It can just be that. I don't feel in love with you at this moment. It's a roundabout way of saying we have big problems in the marriage. 

You know when my marriage was at its lowest, I might have said it to my husband (I didn't), and I wasn't having any affair at all. We were just disconnected at the time, but we managed to come back from that.

Exposure of an affair - I'm not a big fan of the scorched earth exposure policy. I've seen it advocated here on TAM and on another very well known marriage website. Rather than going nuclear, it's better to do a surgical exposure judiciously choosing a few key people who might have influence on the wayward spouse. We also forget that not everyone who posts on TAM is from the west. There are people who post here for advice who come from cultures that are very different from USA, England, Canada or Australia. Exposure can have devastating effects on the WS. What if the WS is from a culture where there are "honor killings" of women? Limited, surgical exposure to a few key, hopefully mentally stable, people is far better than announcing it broadly. I just know as I type this there are probably some bitter people who will say "well if she didn't cheat, she wouldn't be killed," but really...are you so far removed from humanity that you think a cheater should be murdered?


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

When I see the ILYBNILWY I simply recommend investigating. I have said it COULD be an affair but never say it definitely. I also wait for other info to come out and point out that they are common red flags of an affair.

While some may think some here are quick to jump to the conclusion that it is an affair, I think if you do alot of reading here, you'll probably find that a high percentage (I won'r even venture a guess here) are in fact affairs


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## cantmove (Feb 20, 2012)

When my stbx said it, it did mean he was cheating. The times I found out and didn't expose he went right back to her. Eventually he left me for her. I exposed then and I'm glad that I did. It helped me not go back and forgive him again when he tried to keep me in limbo. People knowing kept me from making another fool of myself.


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## Lovingwife315 (Dec 10, 2012)

What about exposing the affair and to the OW family (not spouse) and letting them know what their family member has been up to. (OW has been contacting me for months and basks in the pleasure of tourturing me with details of the affair, as well as threatening my family at one time with lose of financial support etc) WS didn't believe she was capable at first but with proof has taken a step back, but not completly out. He is to blinded by the green grass to let go entirely.


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## cantmove (Feb 20, 2012)

Lovingwife315 said:


> What about exposing the affair and to the OW family (not spouse) and letting them know what their family member has been up to. (OW has been contacting me for months and basks in the pleasure of tourturing me with details of the affair, as well as threatening my family at one time with lose of financial support etc) WS didn't believe she was capable at first but with proof has taken a step back, but not completly out. He is to blinded by the green grass to let go entirely.


If I'm understanding you, your ws is still seeing her. Eventually they all discover that the grass isn't greener. If he hasn't made the clear choice to be with you then move on. Do you know where the grass is greener? In a life without a man that cheats on you. The grass in that place is beautiful!


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## Zig (Oct 6, 2012)

1. From what I've read on this forum (especially the CWI section), ILYBINILWY means an affair over 90% of the time. You need to read the posts in the CWI section where someone posts that they got ILYBINILWY, can't believe the suggestion that it's an affair, then post later when they find out it's an affair. It's not 100% but I would say about 95% accurate. 

We live our lives based on rules, not exceptions to rules. My grandfather smoked a pack of cigarettes per day from the time he was 20 and he lived to be 86 (he died of heart disease, not lung disease). I'm smart enough to know that he was an exception to the rule, so I don't smoke.

2. I can't really comment on this. It's not good advice because everyone should divorce their spouse if they've been unfaithful. Taking them back is only giving them permission to do it again. I do recommend exposing them to as many people as you can, but it's pretty dumb to take them back.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

This is called TAM..talk about marriage. Not Talk About Infidelity In Marriage. The CWI is not necessarily representative of most marriages. There are those of us who have had issues in our marriages and it had nothing at all to do with infidelity. That's what several people who posted in this thread alone, including me, have said. ILYBINLWY doesn't mean 95% of the time it's an affair. There needs to be a place here for everyone who has marriage issues, not just the infidelity variety.


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## Dollystanford (Mar 14, 2012)

hell yeah I'm with ya
it may very well be an affair but it's also a way of saying 'it's not you it's me' and an easy way out

as for the scorched earth bit - my favourite is telling HR. Yes some companies may give a toss but a lot don't unless it's encroaching on work

I can just see the look on our HR Director's face - total fricking indifference


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## Zig (Oct 6, 2012)

Coffee Amore said:


> This is called TAM..talk about marriage. Not Talk About Infidelity In Marriage. The CWI is not necessarily representative of most marriages. There are those of us who have had issues in our marriages and it had nothing at all to do with infidelity. That's what several people who posted in this thread alone, including me, have said. ILYBINLWY doesn't mean 95% of the time it's an affair. There needs to be a place here for everyone who has marriage issues, not just the infidelity variety.


You didn't read my post. YOU and the posters here are part of the 5%. You are an exception to the general rule.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

Zig said:


> You didn't read my post. YOU and the posters here are part of the 5%. You are an exception to the general rule.


Where are you drawing this 95% and 5% data from?


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

I have read CWI. Many times. I've posted there as well. While I haven't experienced infidelity and never hope to, it doesn't mean I'm ignorant of it. I think that's what some of us are saying here. We're not clueless about the signs of infidelity. We know the red flags. We also recognize that people who say ILYBINLWY may be like some of us who have experienced marital problems not related to infidelity.


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## Zig (Oct 6, 2012)

Coffee Amore said:


> Where are you drawing this 95% and 5% data from?


I was a lurker for many months before I joined. I read God knows how many threads. When someone posted that they got ILYBINILWY, the vast majority of the time (and I mean the VAST majority of the time) they would do some snooping and discover an affair.

Find a lump doesn't mean cancer all the time, just most of the time.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

(Dude creeping about in the Lady's Lounge)

I have never bought into the ILYBANILWY to automatically equate to an affair. But I am willing to bet that a majority of the time its a passageway many spouses go through on the way to one. I got the speech from my wife and yes she was in an affair but I'm sure she felt that way long before it started. And it put her in a position to be vulnerable to the EA. There are no absolutes in marriage turmoil. ILYBANILWY could just as easily be associated with Walk-a-Way wife syndrome. That could have been the end result of her feelings also, especially now that the kids are leaving home.

As far as exposure goes, I agree it is far too commonly thrown out on the forum. In my opinion it is the nuclear option and in most cases is a "kill it or cure it" strategy. Had I used it early on in our R I'd be posting in the divorce forums. It has its place in recovery but needs to be understood and utilized in a manner that assists in recovery. BS's are desperate for answers and some jump at the first advice they get only to find out they just screwed the pooch in the process. I considered it but never used it in our recovery and am glad I didn't. I can do without the whispers, winks and rolled eyes at family get togethers thank you very much.


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## Lyris (Mar 29, 2012)

I wonder if there's a difference in how women and men tend to use ILYBINILWY.

I have read before that statistically, men are unlikely to initiate a divorce unless they are involved somehow with another woman. Women initiate divorces for lots of reasons, and often will leave with no other person involved.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

I rarely venture into the Infidelity section so I clearly do not know the storylines of most of those situations... I am so transparent with my husband... some would cringe....

He would know long before if I had a problem with him & I was falling out of love... I wear my feelings on my sleeve...in my words, attitude & I will go out of my way to confront any issues at hand....I want Peace & free flowing romance in my marriage.....he'd know I was halfway out the door - before I even left it. 

But he does so appreciate this side of me...even if it might be a little "in your face" at times ... He'll happily take the good with the Bad. And I want the same treatment in return - from my man. 

I don't doubt that the scales are far more in favor of there being someone else though!


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## Ten_year_hubby (Jun 24, 2010)

Coffee Amore said:


> Where are you drawing this 95% and 5% data from?


Just ask any marriage counselor that has seen over 500 couples in their career and they will confirm it.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

> There may be times when not exposing is the right thing to do, but if there is an active affair going on, exposing is many times the only way to end it.


Oh I *TOTALLY* agree that this is the way to end the affair; I just think people are stupid to ASSUME the WS will COME BACK TO *YOU* after you use this policy.

This sort of presumes that the only two people of your gender on Earth are YOU and the AP, so 'exposing' has cut off their ONLY OTHER source. Obviously NOT true!


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

As a man, may I interject with my own observations? There is definitely a strong correlation between ILYBINILWY and an affair, just as their is a high correlation between both an affair and divorce and ILYBINILWY and divorce.

So a very common process we see on this board a lot is:

Unhappy marriage -> affair -> ILYBINILWY -> divorce

sometimes (rarely in my judgement) the affair part or the ILYBINILWY part can get skipped but often same unhappy marriage ultimately results in divorce. I think most people who've experienced unhappiness in marriage can relate to the ILYBINILWY, and would think it, but realize it would be hurtful to utter the actual words to your spouse, because when you are still vested in the marriage you realize that kind of hurt would drive it further apart. When you actually utter it, the intent is to drive it apart because you are checking out, and often but not always, when you get to that point its because you realize there are better looking options available, which is why marriages always end messy.


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