# Counsellor buying missus' BS!



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

And so it happens again...

Heck, and I was about to agree with her in regards of dealing with our issues ourselves as it's our problem. Then I went for counselling and even though it's obvious the counsellor was trying to keep things confidential - it's also obvious that the missus has been talking so much BS relating her problems to me.

The counsellor kept questioning me about my own past, why all of a sudden? I had this very strong feeling that missus has been snitching throughout the whole session and no matter how much I tried to refocus things back to present she kept trying to psychoanalyse me when they should be psychoanalysing HER! Bah!

The missus is playing dumb about it, typical... Hell she's too manipulative for counselling, she worms her way out of it and now that I got her into it she's not only worming her way out of it but once again turning the tables on me. And group counselling won't work because we'll just keep fighting in front of the counsellor like last time... Sh-t!

She probably reckons she's so smart... oh hell I feel like showing her how REALLY SMART she is by showing her what she's driving me to. Bah! Sorry, I need to vent before I do something I'll regret (again)...


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Ahh ... yes.

That happens. Probably much more frequently than anyone wants to admit. 

So here is your guide to 'the couch'. The counselor is going to use a script to try to get to the root of the problem. That common script is to look into your past in an effort to address the problems you are dealing with in the present. Nothing wrong with that.

But ...

It's ok for you to question the counselor. In fact you SHOULD question where the counselor is going, and why.

Things like:

"Where are we going with this?"

or 

"Why is that important, relevant, etc." are all fair game.

To some extent, you do in fact have to 'give in' to the process. You need to be willing to take a look at some uncomfortable stuff. In your individual counseling sessions, the counselor is going to want to focus on you ... not your wife. So that may also be a reason for the probing questions.

Suffice to say, the more uncomfortable a pointed question makes you? Is a pretty good guide that it is in fact something you need to deal with.

However, I can recall vividly sitting in marriage counseling with my ex and looking at her like she had just found God, in terms of her being open and accepting of what the counselor would suggest for repairing our marriage. Once we walked out the door however, it was back to business as usual.

Any good counselor knows when they are being conned. The trick is determining if you have a good counselor.

I think that would also be a fair question for your counselor. 
"Can you tell when someone is feeding you bullsh!t?"

Stick with it. If you are curious about why the therapist is taking you in a specific direction, ask the 'why' question.

Keep in mind that the therapist is most certainly going to need a great deal of detail about you, in order to better understand the dynamic you have with your wife.

You strike me as a pretty straightforward guy, the therapist should be able to get a sense for that as well.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

My past is over, I've left everything behind and buried. I just don't feel the need to discuss something irrelevant to the situation, and the issues from the past I've dealt with myself (either then marrying a psycho woman), and this nymphomaniac issue of hers has nothing to do with my past. 

She's just trying to pin the issue on me in anyway she can, so she can make herself look the victim because of me and that I should stop turning her down and "hurting her" (aka "shut up, let me milk you, and don't talk back")... Why would they need to interrogate me anyway? I'm just a normal bloke who gets forced into sex by his psycho missus and wants an end to it!

I will most definitely use those lines you suggested next time though. Especially this: 


> "Can you tell when someone is feeding you bullsh!t?"


:rofl:
Her reaction would be most entertaining. Hell I got a headache now...


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Oh gosh, RD... I can totally relate! When my ex finally agreed to go to MC (after we'd already separated), I would feel thsi way too! LOL. I would get so upset when I felt the counsellor was siding with ex and/or validating him. But then I realized--that is the MC's job. They have to listen to both sides of the story and then offer advice.

My advice is to remain calm in MC and answer any/all questions, then state how you feel.

Have you considered that your wife may be a narcissist? There are definitely some traits there. I would bringi up how she w/draws and/or lashes out when she doesn't get her away (unless/until you give in) but she's not willing to do the same for you. I would also bring up her escort past.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

I think there’s a massive difference between counselling and coaching. A counsellor will want to go into your past, parents, childhood etc. And that can be never ending plus it can generate all sorts of emotions and even introduce false memories. Whereas a coach will look at what you have now, what the current situation is, help you to visualise and specify where you want to be and then coach you to get there. Bit like a guy with a bad tennis serve. Why does it matter “how” he got the bad serve? Much better/quicker to see what he’s got and coach him to a better serve, demonstrate how it’s done given what he’s got.

I think on this along the same lines as MC vs. marriage enrichment programmes. The latter show/demonstrate established structures and dynamics, values and beliefs that are known to lead to healthy and happy marriages.

But RD I think you are way better off to create, specify, declare and enforce your personal boundaries. Sometimes you have to say no, you have to be intolerant and suffer the consequences before things change, for the better or worse.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

@Jellybeans

Argh, I'm afraid I will be judged for my past however. Few can actually believe that a street kid like me went from nothing to having a successful legitimate business and a family of my own without the aid of counselling yet with no issues left unsettled. I just don't like this being turned on me, especially when it's not me being the sexually abusive partner in our marriage 

I'm definitely tempted to bring out her escort past as revenge for what I suspect she pulled. But if the counsellor IS indeed doing their job, then meh... I don't know.

My wife definitely has some traits of narcissism, she grew up in an elitist environment. Her posture reflects this, a lot of pride and traits of a spoiled rebellious princess, not to mention her behaviour in the past when I got married to her. She acknowledges this however as one of her 'demons'.

@AFEH

Well I am saying no now, with counselling to help prevent the whacky atomic splits that may happen during this trail. Except I'm putting up with them indirectly regardless, through manipulations after manipulations. I can tell she's in pain and sometimes I just feel like holding her close and telling her everything will be alright but she could take it as I'm giving in or something.

I can't have that... *sigh*


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

RandomDude said:


> @Jellybeans
> 
> Argh, I'm afraid I will be judged for my past however. Few can actually believe that a street kid like me went from nothing to having a successful legitimate business and a family of my own without the aid of counselling yet with no issues left unsettled. I just don't like this being turned on me, especially when it's not me being the sexually abusive partner in our marriage


That is what counselling is for! To talk about yoru feras and how you feel! Don't squash how you feel. Talk about it! Like someone said, the more you fear something/are afraid of something--that is the exact thing(s) that should be dealt with in therapy. If it makes you uncomfortable--that is something that should be dealt with!!! That's what therapy is for! Talk about how you don't want to be judged for X and how you want to address the fact you are being sexually abused. Bring up both subjects!



RandomDude said:


> I'm definitely tempted to bring out her escort past as revenge for what I suspect she pulled.


Well, don't do it as "revenge." Do it because it's something that needs to be dealth with/discussed. Put all your cards on the table. You aren't be transparent unless you do this. 



RandomDude said:


> My wife definitely has some traits of narcissism, she grew up in an elitist environment. Her posture reflects this, a lot of pride and traits of a spoiled rebellious princess, *not to mention her behaviour in the past when I got married to her*. She acknowledges this however as one of her 'demons'.


Elaborate.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Well it's going to be difficult because in my brain it's going back and forth "look what the missus is forcing you to talk about" and getting me rather p---ed off. I'm going to try to refocus the topic on her the next time around and how I have to deal with her.

As for her behaviour, last year she was worse, I made an account just for that, and at first it started off with me wondering how to deal with an inter-religious crisis but soon realised that my gut was right and she's twisting her religion, friends, family, and counsellors to attempt to get me to submit to what she wants. She was very extravagant in her spending and still really disrespected me and it wasn't until I put a foot down that she realised she's gone too far. She was trying to change me. In the end she got a bit traumatised nowadays over me showing my heartless side during that time.

It was then she told me she's not perfect and admitted to her certain 'demons'. But after a while she gets 'possessed' again and I have to break her down... like now, and this time it's the same old 'lust demon' I've been putting up with for years since marriage. I didn't expect it really, it's like she hid the issues from me and hoped after marriage she would be free from it but instead the 'demon' just manifested.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

RandomDude said:


> Well it's going to be difficult because in my brain it's going back and forth "look what the missus is forcing you to talk about" and getting me rather p---ed off. I'm going to try to refocus the topic on her the next time around and how I have to deal with her.
> 
> As for her behaviour, last year she was worse, I made an account just for that, and at first it started off with me wondering how to deal with an inter-religious crisis but soon realised that my gut was right and she's twisting her religion, friends, family, and counsellors to attempt to get me to submit to what she wants. *She was very extravagant in her spending and still really disrespected me and it wasn't until I put a foot down that she realised she's gone too far.* She was trying to change me. In the end she got a bit traumatised nowadays over me showing my heartless side during that time.
> 
> It was then she told me she's not perfect and admitted to her certain 'demons'. But after a while she gets 'possessed' again and I have to break her down... like now, and this time it's the same old 'lust demon' I've been putting up with for years since marriage. I didn't expect it really, it's like she hid the issues from me and hoped after marriage she would be free from it but instead the 'demon' just manifested.


That’ll be a boundary of intolerance. You need more.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Like what I'm doing now? I should take it one step further and tell her to quit with her manipulative tendencies and start ACCEPTING she has issues that needs to be changed (and not just admitting it)... but she's always been good at keeping her bases covered like now.

I have no "real" proof she snitched to the counsellor, just a gut feeling. Just little bits and pieces here and there from the counsellor and signs that the back of my mind picked up on. I've relied on my instincts for years and it turns out they tend to be correct, but the missus doesn't care even if I "know" as long as she can't be accused directly and be forced to admittance without excuses/denials.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

SAHM, one child. She doesn’t have enough going on in her life to keep her interested, occupied and motivated in healthy ways.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

^ There are plenty of SAHMs that don't sexually abuse their husbands and act selfishly.



RandomDude said:


> I have no "real" proof she snitched to the counsellor, just a gut feeling.


Snitched about what?

Call her out on it in counselling. You are supposed to be 100% honest in there.


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## jayde (Jun 17, 2011)

WE're in MC for about 4 months now (dang! that long already). She's also seeing the same guy for IC. (Bad idea I've been told - and seeing it's true). The session before last, I told the guy that I didn't think he was really helping us much. We can ***** at each other at home and don't need to do it in front of him if he isn't going to intervene to clarify our communication (or lack thereof), or help us to see perspectives we cannot see being mired in the ditch of marriage. He said, 'well, we'll get to that . . .' The last session, he actually had something interesting/helpful to contribute. 

For whatever this is worth . . .


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

Jellybeans said:


> You are supposed to be 100% honest in there.


That’s a fabulous Sentiment. But I do wonder how many people are honest. It is the way to be. I know that.


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## ManDup (Apr 22, 2011)

RandomDude said:


> Like what I'm doing now? I should take it one step further and tell her to quit with her manipulative tendencies and start ACCEPTING she has issues that needs to be changed (and not just admitting it)... but she's always been good at keeping her bases covered like now.
> 
> I have no "real" proof she snitched to the counsellor, just a gut feeling. Just little bits and pieces here and there from the counsellor and signs that the back of my mind picked up on. I've relied on my instincts for years and it turns out they tend to be correct, but the missus doesn't care even if I "know" as long as she can't be accused directly and be forced to admittance without excuses/denials.


Hmm... I'm not sure why you continue to want to conceal things from your counselor. The counselor isn't there simply to help you "win" a fight with your spouse. They are there to give you tools to communicate better with your spouse, and individual tools to know when to use that communication to enforce your own boundaries. If you have issues that you don't want to talk about and think aren't related to the present, you should bring them up and explain to the counselor why you think they don't matter. You could be wrong, you know. 

I think the fact that your wife was an escort has a lot to do with the current situation. Or at least vice versa, she became an escort to satisfy an unquenchable addiction, which she still hasn't fixed. Now tell me, why did you marry her?


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## bs193 (Jan 2, 2011)

RandomDude said:


> I should take it one step further and tell her to quit with her manipulative tendencies and start ACCEPTING she has issues that needs to be changed (and not just admitting it).


I am curious, are you willing to accept YOU have issues that need changed? Sorry, but I think MC only works if you both are willing to admit fault and takes steps to change. You seem to be in MC for the sole purpose of fixing HER, and not the marriage, and if that is the case you are just wasting time and money.

You say you are concerned about "snitching". Are you two meeting with the MC separately? If so, I would suggest stopping that and only meeting as a couple. If this person is either of your IC, then find someone else for MC.


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## ManDup (Apr 22, 2011)

bs193 said:


> I am curious, are you willing to accept YOU have issues that need changed? Sorry, but I think MC only works if you both are willing to admit fault and takes steps to change. You seem to be in MC for the sole purpose of fixing HER, and not the marriage, and if that is the case you are just wasting time and money.
> 
> You say you are concerned about "snitching". Are you two meeting with the MC separately? If so, I would suggest stopping that and only meeting as a couple. If this person is either of your IC, then find someone else for MC.


Yes. The MC isn't there to fight your fights for you, they are there to teach you how to fight your own fights. And at the very least, that is a change in you, not her, so only you can change, and you can only change yourself.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

@Jellybeans



> Snitched about what?


My past as a street kid, people tend to judge me for that in RL. Same with her past as an escort, hence I didn't bring her past up, but I'm seriously suspecting she brought up mine... making me a tad p---ed off.
And we're not doing group for now due to the last few dramas despite trying to speak 'one at a time'. It's IC at the moment.

@Jayde

Guess I have to make sure the counsellor is going to be proactive eh? heh

@ManDup

When I met her she already left her past behind and she had no issues apparent when we were friends, or even later lovers. The issues came out during marriage, but I must admit she seems to have changed when I cheated on her. At first I've suspected her sex drive could be due to insecurity so I spent this year speaking her 'love language', reassuring her, initiating, calling her up instead of her calling me. Yet she still built up secret resentment whenever she didn't get some. She was an inspiring woman once, nowadays though, guess there's as much negative baggage that came along with her positive sides.

Ne ways, the past is buried for a reason, I just hate talking about it in a counselling session. Guess there's still a bit of paranoia as I did some rather crazy stuff in my youth when I had to do what I had to do to survive. The scars I carry from my past is just skin-deep regardless.

@Bs193

That would be ideal if only she stopped trying to pin everything on me as if I'm the one who should change. I don't want to fight her over who is right or wrong but the way she's dealing with the counsellor (and all past ones) is forcing me to simply say it HOW it REALLY IS. We're going for group later as the first session was more like WW3 with a spectator.


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## Neil (Jan 5, 2011)

RandomDude said:


> but I must admit she seems to have changed when I cheated on her. At first I've suspected her sex drive could be due to insecurity so I spent this year speaking her 'love language', reassuring her, initiating, calling her up instead of her calling me. Yet she still built up secret resentment whenever she didn't get some.


I have been reading your story for a while now, as I have genuinely never come across one as such like this.

However, I think personally in my opinion, you really need to focus on this. 

I think this is the root of all your issues.

A lot of women who have been cheeted on aer reportedly have a big increase in sexual desires, in order to try and "reclaim" their man so he doesn't do it again.

I honestly feel that your wife has done this, and when she deosn't "get some" she thinks you are going off her and are about to go and cheat again.

Somehow I think you need to focus on meeting her needs emotionally to make her more secure that this is something you are not going to do, its allmost like she is damn well making sure you are so sore and tired that you won't even think about "doing someone else" because your equipment is raw and painful.

I still think you need to set some boundries with her though, but maybe not in the true "manned up" style. Any time you refuse sex, she thinks "he doesn't want me anymore", so maybe show her much love in every other way you can think of to make her feel more comfortable, but be stern enough when she is being a ***** about things.

Never have a heard of such a scenario, but, its not healthy at all


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## bs193 (Jan 2, 2011)

RandomDude said:


> @Bs193
> 
> That would be ideal if only she stopped trying to pin everything on me as if I'm the one who should change. I don't want to fight her over who is right or wrong but the way she's dealing with the counsellor (and all past ones) is forcing me to simply say it HOW it REALLY IS. We're going for group later as the first session was more like WW3 with a spectator.


This is just my opinion, but I would keep the sessions on a level playing field, meaning don't use one who has ever seen either of you individually. Our MC made it clear before the first session she will NEVER see us individually because it could create a suspicion of bias and restricts the element of transparency and honesty between the two of us. After reading how others meet individually between couple sessions I thought her approach was restrictive but I now have come to believe her approach is best.

I have also come to believe that two concepts will completely kill any potential for progress in counseling. The first is blame....there can be none. If one is focused on their perception of fault on the other, then they won't see how they contributed to the problem. The other is the concept of "right and wrong". There is no right and wrong, and its not about winning or losing which is basically the same thing. We know we are in MC because we were both wrong and blaming solves nothing.

Allowing the sessions to turn into a battle of blame, or who is right and who is wrong, means the MC isn't doing what you are paying them to do. Now it is possible the MC sat back and let it go on to see the dynamics in the relationship but if it continues I would STRONGLY suggest finding another MC. This one could do you both more harm than good.


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