# Wife angered that I don't listen, demands apologies when I do listen!



## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

I've been having some trouble with my wife, we're both 32. I'd like to see a counsellor but she doesn't. Our arguments always follow the same formula, and she believes that I ignore and dismiss her feelings and that I don't listen to her. On the contrary, I do believe I listen to her and pay her lots of attention. I do all the cooking and cleaning around the house, I pay all of the bills, I work hard and she always has enough money for the things she wants, though admitedly she doesn't go on crazy shopping sprees or anything.

These are the steps our arguments follow:

She accuses me of something that hurts her, ie she thinks I'm not listening or I disagree with her.
She expects an apology immediately. "I'm sorry for not listening", even if I can recite all that she has just told me, proving that I am listening.
She will not enter into any discussion as to whether or not I was listening until I apologise.
Only when I apologise is she willing to entertain the possibility that I was listening.

My memory is above average, I can remember tiny details of stories that she told me years ago. Whenever this happens I protest my innocence and defend myself. I repeat to her, as best as I can, what she was saying.

This isn't good enough. She demands that I apologise for something that I clearly didn't do.

She is very high maintenance, not so much materially, but emotionally. She told me last night that the problem is that I 'seem to not be listening'. I can appreciate that this is her reality, but it is not mine. I can and have proved every time that I have been listening and paying attention. Perhaps she is misreading my body language or whatever. We don't even have TV, so it's not like I'm looking at a screen and nodding at her. This happens when we are walking in the mall, holding hands. I cannot physically look at her that whole time, I gotta walk and navigate around trash cans, kids, trolleys etc!

I said as a half joke 'Do you want me to look at you straight in the eye, hold your hand and stroke your hair every time you speak to me?'. Her reply? 'Oh my god, you're finally getting it'. 

So what is it? Does she have unrealistic expectations of having my absolute and undivided attention at all times, or am I somehow being, as she calls it 'abusive', for listening to her while I glance around me or am eating, etc etc?

Thanks guys.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

This might be a miss, but somtimes when a woman says you are not listening she is not saying you are not hearing, but you are not listenin with you heart!

also women tend to speak 1from their mind,2 from their will, 3 from their emotions and it can be confusing which one she is speaking from.
there is a female poster that made a great statemen that any agression on a mans part even in slight voice changes can affect a womans sharing potintial.


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## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

I feel that's what I'm doing. I'm not a 'uh huh, uh huh' guy. I do converse with her. I listen to what she has to say, ask questions, joke... I feel that I am a good listener. The problem is she requires eye contact when she speaks, but that's not always possible or realistic.

An example was last night, I was stoking the fire. She was telling me about work. We were sitting on the couch. There was eye contact, then I glanced and saw that the fire needed tending. I got up, gave it a poke and she started shouting 'YOU'RE DOING IT AGAIN, YOU'RE NOT LISTENING'. I repeated back to her all that she said. 'APOLOGIZE TO ME' "But I am listening, I told you what you had just said' 'YOU WEREN'T LISTENING. APOLOGIZE NOW. I'M SICK OF THIS ABUSE'

She talks a lot, I do find her interesting and funny. I have no problems with her other than this overreaction which happens daily for the last couple of months.


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## hehasmyheart (Mar 11, 2010)

Wow, if only guys were really that attentive (holding hand and stroking hair).

If she feels neglected emotionally, it could lead to problems and resentment down the road. Talk about it, ask her how you could improve and really listen to what she tells you. 

Try to find small ways to make her feel like she's special to you, little love notes, saying something positive about her, etc.

You definitely need to come to a middle ground with this. Emotional affairs have become very common. Keep the marriage strong to protect it from that possibility.


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## hehasmyheart (Mar 11, 2010)

When you saw the fire needed stoked, you could have said "hold that thought"...lol.


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## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

True!


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## Finchley Argon (Oct 18, 2012)

The only constructive thing I can say is, divorce her. She sounds like an absolute nightmare. I'd rather pull out my nails than be with someone like that.


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## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

Untrue!


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## hehasmyheart (Mar 11, 2010)

Nah, definitely not divorce type of issues. Sometimes it's hard to find a happy medium, and good balance where you can both be happy. Just try to be mindful of her needs and what it takes for her to be fulfilled.

There are some very good resources throughout the site, different books and such that can help.


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## hehasmyheart (Mar 11, 2010)

Maybe you could also ask questions to act interested. This way, she knows you're listening and interested. You could even repeat back parts of what she has said to let her know you're listening. Research how to be a good listener/communicator. It's a google search away.


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## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

As I stated, I do ask questions, I do repeat. I don't feel the need to act interested, I am interested! There's not once where she accused me of listening where I failed to repeat and understand what she has said. The issue, to me, is that once eye contact is broken she believes I'm not listening. I tried to explain that for me it's like when you listen to talk radio. You don't need to keep an eye on the dial or the speakers to listen to what the DJ or the callers are saying and to understand them!


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

> 'Do you want me to look at you straight in the eye, hold your hand and stroke your hair every time you speak to me?'. Her reply? 'Oh my god, you're finally getting it'.


All I can say is that I'M A WOMAN and I think this is effin' CRAZY!!!!

High-maintenance doesn't BEGIN to cover it. Definitely would rather PULL MY NAILS OUT ALSO than live like this! This is SO BEYOND 'needy'....I personally believe you'll NEVER be able to "fill up" this empty vessel -- sounds like there's REAL DAMAGE to her emotionally.

If SHE won't go to counseling, go by yourself. You will be able to learn coping mechanisms, get recommendations on books about better communication, etc.

But, like I said, I think this will ONLY continue...and will get worse. Good luck!


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## Finchley Argon (Oct 18, 2012)

bluepocket said:


> As I stated, I do ask questions, I do repeat. I don't feel the need to act interested, I am interested! There's not once where she accused me of listening where I failed to repeat and understand what she has said. The issue, to me, is that once eye contact is broken she believes I'm not listening. I tried to explain that for me it's like when you listen to talk radio. You don't need to keep an eye on the dial or the speakers to listen to what the DJ or the callers are saying and to understand them!


Ask yourself honestly, what if all this nonsense happened with your friends? You wouldn't stand for it for a moment. If you were to be completely honest with yourself, you'd realise that you've put yourself in a position where you find yourself justifying childish behaviour, or asking for advice on how to deal with it (you shouldn't deal with it at all). It's really sad reading your posts because you sound broken, that's what you've allowed yourself to be reduced to. It's an insult to your dignity. 

The only useful and logical thing to do is divorce her. If you met her for the first time and she acted that way would you be attracted to that? It's going to carry on and it's going to get worse. Let divorce be your coping mechanism.


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## Finchley Argon (Oct 18, 2012)

Satya said:


> learn how to cope with her behaviour.


What? Why?


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## Finchley Argon (Oct 18, 2012)

Satya said:


> If she's not going to go to counseling (and im not sure I read signs you are altering your own behaviour, if so then I'm mistaken) then the only thing you will be able to do is cope. Do you see where I was going?


If she's not willing to get herself fixed, divorce is the only solution. He shouldn't have to cope with unacceptable and intolerable behaviour. If she was willing to sort herself out that would be different, and it would be worth staying married, but that's not what we're seeing here. 

When people meet, assuming one isn't a masochist, they don't tend to be attracted to negative traits, and therefore they don't get together in the first place. Yes he's married to her now, but fortunately he can get divorced. I don't understand why anybody needs to excuse her behaviour.


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## Cosmos (May 4, 2012)

Rather than apologizing for something you know you haven't done, tell her that you're sorry that_ she_ _feels _that you're not listening to her. Acknowledge that this would be a hurtful thing for you to do, and that you are certain that you aren't doing it. But if she _feels_ that you are, her feelings are important to you and you would like her to tell you what it is that makes her feel this way. In other words, put the onus on her to explain what makes her _feel _that you're not listening, when in fact you know that you are.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

Does she attend to you in the same way?
Eye contact, etc.. does she apologise?

Also is she controling in daily things with you?

Do you have any children yet?

Does she show respect for you?

I dont know why but i want to ask if she is a teacher?
Is she a highly scrupled person?
Does she react strongly to negative facial gestures, like rolling eyes?

How long married? Did she keep asking early on "do you love me"
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jane_Doe (Aug 9, 2012)

Finch, the OP already expressed a preferred desire to 'cope' and help deal with her behaviour over the desire to divorce, so I think that's where Satya's advice was coming from. He doesn't want to divorce, believes it is not marriage-ending behaviour, and is seeking coping/behaviour altering mechanisms, both of which counselling is well-known for. Divorce should never be the first option for marital struggles outside the realm of abuse.

My husband is like you OP, he has a crazy-good memory too (at least relatively). I've accused him of not listening when it blatantly feels like he isn't (i.e he's actively engaged mentally and physically with something else) but he can repeat verbatim what I just said (even if his reply WAS 'yes' to an 'or' question lol). When it happens I'm usually shocked enough to drop the subject.


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## Finchley Argon (Oct 18, 2012)

Jane_Doe said:


> Finch, the OP already expressed a preferred desire to 'cope' and help deal with her behaviour over the desire to divorce, so I think that's where Satya's advice was coming from. He doesn't want to divorce, believes it is not marriage-ending behaviour, and is seeking coping/behaviour altering mechanisms, both of which counselling is well-known for. Divorce should never be the first option for marital struggles outside the realm of abuse.
> 
> My husband is like you OP, he has a crazy-good memory too (at least relatively). I've accused him of not listening when it blatantly feels like he isn't (i.e he's actively engaged mentally and physically with something else) but he can repeat verbatim what I just said (even if his reply WAS 'yes' to an 'or' question lol). When it happens I'm usually shocked enough to drop the subject.


The OP has asked for advice, and in my opinion it is marriage ending behaviour and that's what my advice is based on, because I really do think that the OP is deluding himself and I feel the need to tell him this. If he manages to cope with it then that's all well and good, but for the sake of his dignity I don't think he ought to. I mean, if he does cope with it, what's next? It's not nice to think that he could come back here one day with another problem to do with his wife's behaviour, and then deciding to cope with that too. If she was willing to acknowledge that she has a problem and is resolved to deal with it, that would be different, that's what married people do, but so far there's nothing that indicates that.


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## ankh (Oct 14, 2012)

And you stay with this woman why? Is the sex mind blowing? Why endure this?


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## Finchley Argon (Oct 18, 2012)

ankh said:


> And you stay with this woman why? Is the sex mind blowing? Why endure this?


That's a possibility, but I'm thinking that it's just a simple case of complacency. I understand that it's hard to let go after so long, but it's better than slowly dying inside. I'm not saying I'd find it easy to leave, but I do know it's the best thing to do.


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## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

Thanks for all of the messages guys.

Yes, sex is amazing. She's a stunning woman, very, very intelligent, gifted in many areas. It's just that her neediness, which was never there at the beginning, is taking on a life of its own and getting me down. I should note that this has only really became an issue a couple months ago.

We do have a kid that we love very much. It's not that I don't believe in divorce but I do think that Western culture dictates that everyone must demand to have everything they want right now, and if that doesn't happen, one must fight or leave. I do believe in give and take, making personal sacrifices and the benefits of personal insight and growth.

In short, divorce would only be an option when two people are so unhappy in a stagnant relationship that all parts of their lives are affected. 

Right now, my wife is annoying the hell out of me. Does that mean I should leave and have my child live with my wife and another man for the week, myself and another woman on weekends? Does he need to have half siblings down the road because my wife is being very needy? No.

Whatever is causing my wife to crave such constant attention, I don't know what it is. But it exists. And it can be identified. And it can be dealt with together and I'll give her the support she needs to get over it. Perhaps it's daddy issues. Maybe it's past bf issues. Heck, maybe I really do have a DO NOT DISTURB sign materialize on my nose when she starts talking. But something is happening.

We're both quite stubborn. She demands an apology, I demand to stand up for myself. We'll hopefully get counselling and, fingers crossed, one of us with have a realization that we're going about this all screwed up.
Worst comes to the worst, I'll bite the bullet and get extra eyes implanted on both sides of my face and get used to saying I'm sorry. Not for me, but for my kid.


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## Ayla (Aug 24, 2011)

Does she work? Why are you doing all the housework and cleaning? Stand up for yourself. Dont apologize if you know you aren't wrong. State I was listening to you or I wouldn't be able to recall what you were saying. My dear...it seems to me that your issue lies in that you're not getting the response you want but you have no control over my responses...I'm a grown man. I'm only obligated to listen and I'm NOT apologizing so if you want to ruin our evening together sit there and sulk and see how far that gets us.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

OP I admire the fact your so willing to work on your marriage rather then toss it out the window at the first sign of trouble. Clearly she has issues and it may not be daddy issues... might be mommy issues lol either way it does sound like she needs counseling. It also sounds as if you both have two very different ways of communicating. My own spouse and I have this issue as weell. When I talk I expect one to give me the courtesy and respect to stay put and look at me. Now I'm not a touchy feely person so the staring into eyes and stroking hair would seem weird to me.

My spouse has ADD/ADHD so he will often start looking around and sometimes even walks off to another room while I'm talking and this irks the hell out of me. Sometimes I follow him and other times I have to say.. "excuse me... I'm talking here!" Its been hard to get used to and cope with... especially since I hadn't known about his condition for a good chunk of our relationship. I had assumed he didn't find me worthy of showing respect to... that's how I felt and it hurt alot. 

Perhaps if you point out to your wife that you both have different ways of communicating and its obviously causing an issue... perhaps counseling can help you both find a way to compromise better... that may sway her to attend therapy?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

Ayla: She's a musician, so has a lot of free time. I have an export business that I run from my laptop and I occasionally fly out, but by and large I'm at home and running the home, minding the kid when he's not at school etc. 

What you're saying makes sense, but shutting down, dragging my heels and making demands just doesn't work in this instance.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Like ayla and a few others have said... why do you do all the housework and what does she do? How much time do you two actually spend together? What have been her biggest complaints?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Nevermind the what does she do part of my post lol
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

Gaia: Thanks for sharing. Maybe I have ADHD! Who knows. I'm down for counselling and just seeing what's up. I accept that it could be all me, but I think we're just interacting in an unhealthy way. My ability to multitask (poke fire, listen to wife, think about dinner!) could be coming across as inattentiveness. I do think that it could be a body language problem and she's misreading me. Either way, I hope she comes to therapy with me, I'm going to make an appointment next week and hopefully it'll be the beginning of something great.

Gotta stay positive!

edit: Well, I guess I'm kind of a carer. I try and take care of my wife as much as possible. I think I could do with more acknowledgement in that department. I do love her and I am as devoted as a man can be, but yeh, I can't let her walk over me or take me for granted.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

So if you are really listening & she thinks you are not & demands an apology...what happens if you refuse to apologize for something you did not do?:

Ms. Bluepocket: You are not listening; apologize now.

Mr. Bluepocket: Yes, I was listening so I will not apologize.

Ms. Bluepocket: __________________________________


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Oh its not all you bluepocket. Her demands and attitude aren't helping either.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

Since divorce isn't an option for you or one that you are not willing to proceed with, then you got along road ahead of you. You can't fix or change her, but you can change how you react when she acts like this. You need to learn new ways to deal with or cope. My suggestion is seek out a counselor for yourself and maybe they can give you some suggestions on how to handle things.


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## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

Emerald said:


> So if you are really listening & she thinks you are not & demands an apology...what happens if you refuse to apologize for something you did not do?:
> 
> Ms. Bluepocket: You are not listening; apologize now.
> 
> ...


Here's a bunch of examples:
"You never listen to me"
"You always ignore me"
"You are being so hurtful"
"Why won't you ever apologize to me"
"You always do this"
etc.

But the other day it was:
"You are abusive"
which kinda changed everything.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

I agree with callalily and hopefully your wife follows your lead and learns to change the way she acts and copes as well. The demanding an apology does seem childish and controlling.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

bluepocket said:


> Here's a bunch of examples:
> "You never listen to me"
> "You always ignore me"
> "You are being so hurtful"
> ...


She likes to blame. I see she uses the word "YOU" right much. Not good, seek some counseling, because like I said if divorce isn't an option you will need to learn how to deal with this. Suggest MC for you both too, if she wont go, then you still need to.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Perhaps she has always felt this way, grew resentful by not letting you know and just keeping it inside and this is her finally at breaking point. You should ask her how long she has felt this way.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cosmos (May 4, 2012)

Neediness is nearly always a symptom of self-esteem issues. As she hasn't always been this way, and it's only reared its ugly head over the past months, it shouldn't be too hard to identify the cause. Unfortunately, neediness is something that feeds off itself and is as debilitating for the sufferer as it is annoying for the other party. Constant reassurance doesn't work, either, because it's an issue that only the needy person can fix from within.

It's good that you're both going for counseling, because it could be something very minor that just needs a few tweaks and a point in the right direction.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

This may be learnt behavior from childhood. Maybe her Mother or Father demanded that the children apologize when the children didn't listen. We all know that young children are not the best listeners. It may have been difficult for her so she is now doing what she "knows" with you.

You can break the cycle if that is what it is.


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## 40isthenew20 (Jul 12, 2012)

I have found over the years that its easier and well mannered to put down the paper or iPad when your wife is speaking to you. Look her in the eye and engage in the conversation. You can get back to the sports page in a few minutes; it'll still be there when she's finished. 

Little subtle things lie that go a long way.


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## moxy (Apr 2, 2012)

She's being a little clingy because she does not feel heard. Maybe you should both read "The Five Love Languages".


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

Went from "You never listen to me" to "You are abusive".

Why do I have this sinking feeling that there is something that she is not telling you?


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## Finchley Argon (Oct 18, 2012)

F-102 said:


> Went from "You never listen to me" to "You are abusive".
> 
> Why do I have this sinking feeling that there is something that she is not telling you?


I noticed that too. She sounds like bad news. Awful in fact. To interpret not receiving adulation as abuse.


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## SlowlyGettingWiser (Apr 7, 2012)

Is it possible she's got her eye on someone else...and she's trying to justify her wandering eye her straying thoughts by blaming YOU for not being attentive enough?

Just a thought.


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## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

It could well be projected issues from her childhood. If an opportunity arises I'll try and bring it up.
I'm not reading or watching TV when she speaks to me, but I may be chopping vegetables or walking around with her. Come to think about it, the only time when I don't make eye contact and it's OK is when I'm driving.
Of course it's possibly she's eyeing someone up, but we do spend most of the day together
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Ayla (Aug 24, 2011)

bluepocket said:


> Ayla: She's a musician, so has a lot of free time. I have an export business that I run from my laptop and I occasionally fly out, but by and large I'm at home and running the home, minding the kid when he's not at school etc.
> 
> What you're saying makes sense, but shutting down, dragging my heels and making demands just doesn't work in this instance.


I didn't say it would make her stop. You can't change her or force her to go to counseling. She is giving you two options: apologize or I'll make you miserable.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

SlowlyGettingWiser said:


> Is it possible she's got her eye on someone else...and she's trying to justify her wandering eye her straying thoughts by blaming YOU for not being attentive enough?
> 
> Just a thought.


A very real possiblity because this behavior is fairly new...ie, something has "changed."

Torment husband with false claims of abuse so he leaves her, freeing her up to be with OM.


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## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

I dunno. It's possible. Never considered it. :/


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## delirium (Apr 23, 2012)

To me it sounds like she is having some self esteem issues, I get more clingy with my husband when I am depressed, etc. If this is something new as in the past couple of months, this isn't normal behavior for her and something has to have happened/changed that caused it.


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## delirium (Apr 23, 2012)

I don't understand her reaction, though. Demanding you apologize before even being willing to discuss it? I wouldn't apologize in those circumstances.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

There is usually other signs if there is someone else, i.e. texting more, changing passwords on phone, email, facebook, keeping phone by her all the time, going somewhere else to use it, huding it under pollow ot somthing when sleeping, changes in her self- new hair, weight loss, new clothes/undergarments, they usually mention the person to you (dont ask me why) in a good or bad way, like there is this guy ar work that bugs me, or maybe like "do you remember so and so's dad I saw him at the jym today, or went out with coworkers and saw so n so, etc

Anybody got any others to add?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

Guys, have to say I wasn't expecting a suggestion that she may be cheating. I'm really not the type to snoop, and don't wish to invade her personal privacy. I'll keep an eye out for other warning signs before I even begin to contemplate snooping, I just don't want to go down that road.


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## Benevolence (Oct 8, 2012)

You say it started a few months ago, what happened a few months ago?

She sounds very insecure, maybe she thinks you are interested in someone else or she is not happy with some part of herself (all of a sudden) Ask her what's up, why the change.


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## bluepocket (Oct 20, 2012)

We moved house a few months ago. Perhaps that was a trigger.

She is very confident professionally, but in her personal life, yeh, I think she is much more insecure.


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## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

I have to LOL sometimes at just how often I see my own past behaviors in the crazy woman threads! 

I used to be a lot like this in my own anger. And there is no possible way you could have convinced me that I was overreacting. The only way I learned it was through hearing from so MANY people who didn't know each other and since I'm not a stupid woman, finally had to acknowledge it. 

Reflexive listening exercises are great if your listening skills aren't good, but it's also possible that they're fine. It would be abnormal for you to stop and stroke her hair when she's talking about how she took out the garbage before she ran to the grocery store. Sometimes comments are just comments and don't need full, undivided attention. However, when she's trying to actually communicate or vent, it becomes more important.

Although you aren't wrong, bluepocket, I think it's going to be important for you to do two things: you will have to set your pride aside sometimes and apologize even when you didn't do anything wrong, but you also have to set some firm boundaries. The question you must ask yourself for BOTH of these things is, "What's more important, the marriage or this issue?" 

Your answer will be "the marriage" in many cases, but it should be "this issue" when it comes to things that harm you. Your boundaries should be set up to prevent harm to you and to her. In other words, when she says, "You're not listening!" you would benefit from putting the marriage first and saying, "Oh, sorry!" in a non-chalant way and being aware that she's needing your attention right now. 

On the other hand, you should not allow her to paint your character as abusive, and you should make it very clear to her that if she assassinates your character, you *will* walk away and stop listening altogether.


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

Emerald said:


> A very real possiblity because this behavior is fairly new...ie, something has "changed."
> 
> Torment husband with false claims of abuse so he leaves her, freeing her up to be with OM.


Or so that her family and friends can say that she made the right choice in leaving him.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

hehasmyheart said:


> Maybe you could also ask questions to act interested. This way, she knows you're listening and interested. You could even repeat back parts of what she has said to let her know you're listening. Research how to be a good listener/communicator. It's a google search away.


Definitely agree with the reflexive listening exercise. It not only shows good listening, it becomes a good conflict resolution tool should it become necessary.

Definitely would not tolerate her calling you an abuser. You need to stop that right now. It sounds like she feels entitled (in a bad way) to something.


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## jameskimp (May 8, 2012)

bluepocket said:


> but yeh, I can't let her walk over me or take me for granted.


Sounds like it's too late for that.

You cook, clean, take care of your kid, and work. And what does she do? Complains and works as a musician?

She has it too good and is being emotionally abusive towards you.
Couple that with the fact that you'd soon rather give in to her ridiculous demands than divorce and that is a recipe for disaster for you to be rolled over like an insignificant bug.

Don't be a doormat. Giving into her every time will worsen this problem, not solve it.


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