# I Found The Toilet Seat Up



## HommeNu

I came home a day early from a business trip about six weeks ago and found the toilet seat up in our upstairs guest bathroom. This may not be remarkable in most households, but I (51) live with my wife (44) and our 3 daughters (17, 15, and 13). 

Living with four women means always putting the toilet seat down. It is an accommodation to their gender that I have fully embraced. We haven’t had houseguests since the Before Times, and no one really uses that bathroom except for overnight guests, so finding the toilet seat in an empty house in the middle of the day in the middle of the work week is, to put it mildly, odd. 

My daughters and their friends were still at school. My wife was still at work. I checked the doorbell video log, but no one had come into the house since everyone left around 7:15 that morning. This would bother me no matter what, but in the past year or so I’ve noticed some distance from my wife—like not being fully present in the evenings after dinner or in the bedroom, and I can’t put my finger on it, but there is definitely a disturbance in the force. And she’s been on a slight-to-medium edge ever since I asked her about the toilet seat. 

Obviously, I suspect there’s been another male in my house, but I have no idea when or why. I have no real reason to suspect she's cheating, but we are hitting our mid-lives and humans can be humans, so it is a possibility that is weighing on me. I found this website and I’ve been reading various threads looking for advice. She’s not guarding her phone, traveling for work, going out with the girls, or disappearing for hours at a time. The only red flag I’ve seen is the open toilet seat, and the only red flag I feel in my gut is her distance. 

But my gut is worried. Very worried. Am I worrying for nothing? Your advice would be appreciated.


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## DudeInProgress

ALWAYS trust your gut. That doesn’t mean it’s always right, but it’s always right unless/until proven otherwise.

Keep your mouth shut and don’t say anything else about it. Start investigating. Check her phone, texts and other applications that could be used for communications. Check your phone bills, email, etc.
It may be nothing, so don’t drive yourself too crazy with it. But if your gut says check, then check. Do your due diligence to protect your marriage and give yourself some peace of mind.

And if it turns out to be nothing, then start working on the distance in your relationship. Don’t ignore that or next time your gut may end up being right.


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## maquiscat

HommeNu said:


> I came home a day early from a business trip about six weeks ago and found the toilet seat up in our upstairs guest bathroom. This may not be remarkable in most households, but I (51) live with my wife (44) and our 3 daughters (17, 15, 13). Living with four women means always putting the toilet seat down. It is an accommodation to their gender that I have fully embraced. We haven’t had houseguests since the Before Times, and no one really uses that bathroom except for overnight guests so finding the toilet seat up in an empty house in the middle of the day in the middle of the work week is, to put it mildly, odd. My daughters and their friends were still at school. My wife was still at work. I checked the doorbell video log, but no one had come in the house since everyone left around 7:15 that morning. This would bother me no matter what, but in the past year or so I’ve noticed some distance from my wife—like not being fully present in the evenings after dinner or in the bedroom and I can’t put my finger on it, but there is definitely a disturbance in the force. And she’s been on a slight-to-medium edge ever since I asked her about the toilet seat. Obviously I suspect there’s been another male in my house, but I have no idea when or why. I have no real reason to suspect she's cheating, but we are hitting our mid-lives and humans can be human so it is a possibility that is weighing on me. I found this website and I’ve been reading various threads looking for advice. She’s not guarding her phone, or traveling for work, or going out with the girls, or disappearing for hours at a time. The only red flag I’ve seen is the open toilet seat, and the only red flag I feel in my gut is her distance. But my gut is worried. Very worried. Am I worrying for nothing? Your advice would be appreciated.


SO just to cover the bases, have you considered that the source might be a daughter? i.e. they had some guy over. Under most circumstances he shouldn't be using that guest bathroom, but if the others were in use, he might have been directed there. Also was anyone doing any work recently in the house, especially near that bathroom? It wouldn't be the first time a worker used the bathroom of the house they are working in, with or without owner permission. How far back were you able to view the footage? Did you look back as far as you could?

Mind you, there may still be issues with you and the Mrs., but that doesn't make this evidence of an affair.


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## ccpowerslave

If I found the toilet seat up in my master bedroom the last thing I’d think is my wife is bonking some dude in my bed. That’s all you got?


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## re16

Your gut feeling is actually more of something to tune into than the toilet seat issue. Be watchful, but don't accuse her of anything unless you have bullet proof evidence. If she thinks she is being watched and had been doing something nefarious, she would go to greater lengths to hide it if you start asking questions.

Regarding the seat issue, a couple of non-nefarious possibilities exist:

I lift the seat when cutting fingernails, a female could do that also... or does anyone ever clean the toilet? Seem like they would lift it to clean.

Keep an eye on the rim under the seat, guys lift it in case they accidentally splash, so I would think if a male really were lifting the seat, there would be evidence underneath even if they put it back down afterward.

What was your wife's response when you asked about this initially and how did you ask?

ETA: how often do you travel for work?


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## maquiscat

ccpowerslave said:


> If I found the toilet seat up in my master bedroom the last thing I’d think is my wife is bonking some dude in my bed. That’s all you got?


It was in the guest bedroom's bath, and he did note he had been away for while. Which does bring up the question of when was it last used that he knew of and if the room is so rarely used, was the seat up even before he left.


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## GusPolinski

Ignore the downplayers and listen to your gut. Could be a daughter's boyfriend, but your commentary re: your wife's emotional distance and her behavior since your mention of the toilet seat would seem to indicate otherwise.

Find a way to discreetly hide a couple of cameras in the house.


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## OnTheRocks

Sounds like nothing to me, but trust your gut, keep your mouth shut, and eyes open. You already showed your hand by asking her about it. She will go into lockdown mode now if something is actually up. 

Side note: I really don't get why it's considered a man's job to put toilet seats down. I am responsible enough to look down before I piss all over the ring. Why do many women expect to have it all prepared for them when they arrive to do their business? My gf and I live separately, and she demands I put it up at her house, which I comply with because it's her house. I never put it down at my house, which is admittedly passive aggressive but it brings me a little joy. It has never even crossed my mind to demand she put it back up at my house... Until today.


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## RandomDude

> This would bother me no matter what, but in the past year or so I’ve noticed some distance from my wife—like not being fully present in the evenings after dinner or in the bedroom and I can’t put my finger on it, but there is definitely a disturbance in the force. And *she’s been on a slight-to-medium edge* ever since *I asked her about the toilet seat.*


🤦‍♂️ Damn it, you may have just pushed it underground. Whatever it is.

Anyway it's worth investigating, your instincts are clues that your subconscious mind picks up that your conscious mind isn't able to discern. These clues form patterns, and yes, suspicions. Don't think about it as if it's about whether it's right or wrong. There's a reason for everything, find out now - but be discreet.

It could even be your wife hiding one of your daughter's boyfriends, could be anything. Check it out.


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## jlg07

Can you go back and check the video from the doorbell for the days that you were out of town?
That may give you either some piece of mind or something to find.
Don't be suspicious -- keep your eyes open. Placing a few video cams around may not be the worst idea.
Also, maybe a Voice Activated Recorder (VAR) in places around the house you think she would talk on the phone....

Check your phone records...


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## QuietRiot

OnTheRocks said:


> Sounds like nothing to me, but trust your gut, keep your mouth shut, and eyes open. You already showed your hand by asking her about it. She will go into lockdown mode now if something is actually up.
> 
> Side note: I really don't get why it's considered a man's job to put toilet seats down. I am responsible enough to look down before I piss all over the ring. Why do many women expect to have it all prepared for them when they arrive to do their business? My gf and I live separately, and she demands I put it up at her house, which I comply with because it's her house. I never put it down at my house, which is admittedly passive aggressive but it brings me a little joy. It has never even crossed my mind to demand she put it back up at my house... Until today.


Sir, I am blind as a bat and at night I cannot tell if the seat is up or down. I have fallen into the toilet several times because the seat was up. It’s courtesy. Also, I clean it so I get to make the terlet rules. But if you’re cleaning it and it’s yours, then do insist she put it back up. It’s your right and duty. Or doody. 🙂


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## Tatsuhiko

As others have suggested, let the matter die. Don't bring it up again with your wife. But go into surveillance mode. Battery operated cameras and recording devices are cheap. 

If you have access to the phone bill, see what numbers are being called or texted frequently.


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## moulinyx

You should absolutely set up additional cameras.

I also have another suggestion. Login to your router through your internet provider and see what devices are connected to your WiFi. It should show active and inactive devices, which may provide more insight into who may have been at your house. There won’t be time stamps but you can at least have an eye out.

Trust your gut. It’s normally right!


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## Diana7

Could she have cleaned it and left it up?
That alone isn't enough, but if you think there is more to it just keep your eyes and ears open.


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## pastasauce79

Check everyone's phones, check the doorbell videos, check the phone bill. You can't say a man was in your house just because the toilet seat was up.


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## Elizabeth001

Is there a second entry point without a video doorbell? I personally only have one installed on my front door. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## HommeNu

Wow. Thank you everyone for responding. I posted this and then took the family out to dinner not knowing what to expect. I appreciate all of your suggestions. Before I answer some of your questions perhaps I should give you some background. My wife—let’s call her Katherine—and I met when I was grad school in Minnesota. She was 24 and working at the university as research assistant. I was 33 and changing careers. We’ve been inseparable ever since. We married 18 months after meeting and she supported me through the rest of grad school. We moved to Florida trading endless winters for endless summers, and I started a business which afforded us a comfortable, financially-stable life while letting her stay home and raise our daughters, which is what she wanted to do. A few years ago when our oldest entered middle school K decided she wanted to buy a business—a little florist shop—in the center of town. She supported me when I started a business and I supported her with the money to fund the purchase and by picking up more of the daily parenting duties. It has been a success thanks to her hard work and she is well-known locally as a community leader.

Our marriage has been great, in my opinion. Like any relationship, it ebbed and flowed over the years depending on work stressors and parenting problems. We hit a particularly rough patch a couple of years ago. We caught our eldest daughter shoplifting which necessitated some hard conversations and hard love. We did not exactly agree on how to handle it, and I think we both still have some reservations and resentments as a result. Around late April of last year I had bike accident while trying to get some Covid exercise which resulted in a surgery. Between that and Covid closures I was housebound for nearly 4 months, which drove everyone crazy particularly my wife. K got progressively distant while nursing me back to health, but I read that it can be a problem when a partner turns into a caretaker so I didn’t worry too much—it was not like I was in any shape to put out anyway—and all the bad moods seemed to pass once I was mobile and back in the saddle again. But I’ve felt a distance between us ever since.


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## HommeNu

@re16 My business is one that requires a fair amount of client contact. I used to travel a lot, but after K bought the florist business I cut it back to 2-3 days every week or so. I usually go out on Tuesday, handle the client on Wednesday, and return on Wednesday night or Thursday morning. That way I am only gone two nights at the most and can be home for the girls' sports events on Friday.


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## HommeNu

@maquiscat I seriously considered it was my oldest daughter sneaking home from school with her boyfriend, yes. I came home on Wednesday morning rather than Thursday because my client had an emergency at his plant and cancelled our meeting after I'd flown out. Such is life. So I went home. When the girls got home from school I asked them about the toilet seat and if one of them had a boy over. All I heard in response was “eeew, dad, gross, no.” I double-checked with the older one but she swears she was in school. Now I have lived with teens long enough to know they will lie to your face with a smile that wouldn't melt butter, but I called the school the next day and all the kids were counted as present in every class so I am not sure how she could have skipped.


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## Marc878

Go online and check your phone bill. An easy first step.


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## HommeNu

@Elizabeth001 Yes, our house has three entry points: the front door which has a video doorbell, a side door that does not and which we rarely use, and a back door that also has a video doorbell.

@jlg07 Yes, I saved all the video clips from that day. Here is what I can see. The kids all go out the back around 7:15 headed to school. K left out of the front door 15 minutes later to walk to the shop about 10 blocks away. That is part of her exercise regime. Amazon dropped off a couple of packages at the front door mid-morning. K came home for lunch around noon. Her delivery van pulled into the driveway and dropped off our weekly flowers--one of the perks of being married to a florist is a home full of fresh flowers--around 12:15. K left out of the front door and walked back to the shop around 1:30. The mail lady made her delivery around 2:30. And I came home just before 3:00. The girls piled in around 3:30, and K walked home around 5:00. Other than a stray dog running through the yard, that was it.


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## HommeNu

I am working from home today so I will check the phone bills this morning and I think I may run by Best Buy to find some wireless cameras. Thank you. I will let you know what I find.


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## Divinely Favored

QuietRiot said:


> Sir, I am blind as a bat and at night I cannot tell if the seat is up or down. I have fallen into the toilet several times because the seat was up. It’s courtesy. Also, I clean it so I get to make the terlet rules. But if you’re cleaning it and it’s yours, then do insist she put it back up. It’s your right and duty. Or doody. 🙂


Best bet is to just put tge lid down completely. Everyone opens and closes the seat/lid to use toilet. Plus it keeps things from falling in the toilet. Girls will flush lifs instead of fishing them out and putting in trash. Then you have a stopped up toilet with blockage.


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## Evinrude58

My thoughts: 

You are obsessing over this seat.

she’s not guarding her phone, no off behavior at all except distance. How is your sex life? Any changes, good or bad? A new position thrown in out of the blue by your wife?

she doesn’t spend any odd time away, nothing different in schedules?

any changes in personal grooming? No new lingerie that she never wears fir

usually a cheater has other red flags. Phone guarding. Unexplained time. Rarely does an affair start off by visits to your own marital home.

Why not consider talking to your wife abiyt the distance? Take a vacation with her? Date her a little? Build your relationship...

also get her phone, go through it, hire a PI, whatever it takes to satisfy your mind.

I Think there are possibilities with daughters too.


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## Cletus

I hope you're not like this with everything in your life. That would be exhausting for a partner.


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## HommeNu

Cletus said:


> I hope you're not like this with everything in your life. That would be exhausting for a partner.


I know, right. I've not said boo about it to my wife or daughters since that day, but I am convinced someone was in the house.


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## Cletus

HommeNu said:


> I know, right. I've not said boo about it to my wife or daughters since that day, but I am convinced someone was in the house.


I don't know anything about you or your circumstances, so I cannot speak with any authority. But I did grow up with a paranoid schizophrenic mother, and this was her behavior. Find a toilet seat up, assume extra-marital affair.


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## CrAzYdOgLaDy

That is odd, especially if that's never happened before. Could someone have cleaned the toilet and then left the seat up? 

Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk


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## jlg07

HommeNu said:


> @Elizabeth001 Yes, our house has three entry points: the front door which has a video doorbell, a side door that does not and which we rarely use, and a back door that also has a video doorbell.
> 
> @jlg07 Yes, I saved all the video clips from that day. Here is what I can see. The kids all go out the back around 7:15 headed to school. K left out of the front door 15 minutes later to walk to the shop about 10 blocks away. That is part of her exercise regime. Amazon dropped off a couple of packages at the front door mid-morning. K came home for lunch around noon. Her delivery van pulled into the driveway and dropped off our weekly flowers--one of the perks of being married to a florist is a home full of fresh flowers--around 12:15. K left out of the front door and walked back to the shop around 1:30. The mail lady made her delivery around 2:30. And I came home just before 3:00. The girls piled in around 3:30, and K walked home around 5:00. Other than a stray dog running through the yard, that was it.


So nothing from the PREVIOUS days for the video?


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## jlg07

Also, you mention that she is more distant lately -- have YOU spoken to her specifically about that? Have specifics, and examples to show her what you mean, and ask her what is going on? IF you do this, DO NOT bring up the toilet seat!


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## BlueWoman

OnTheRocks said:


> Sounds like nothing to me, but trust your gut, keep your mouth shut, and eyes open. You already showed your hand by asking her about it. She will go into lockdown mode now if something is actually up.
> 
> Side note: I really don't get why it's considered a man's job to put toilet seats down. I am responsible enough to look down before I piss all over the ring. Why do many women expect to have it all prepared for them when they arrive to do their business? My gf and I live separately, and she demands I put it up at her house, which I comply with because it's her house. I never put it down at my house, which is admittedly passive aggressive but it brings me a little joy. It has never even crossed my mind to demand she put it back up at my house... Until today.



Oh there are so many reasons. 1) The toilet seat up just looks bad. 2) The rim of the toilet is the nastiest part of the toilet and having the toilet seat down hides it. 3) Women back up to the toilet when we pee. Men don’t. 

But, I suspect you know all of those reasons, and don’t care. That’s on you. But I do encourage you to start pushing your gf to put up the toilet seat in your house. Best to let her know who you are now before you guys get more serious.


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## Marc878

Sounds like nothing and I hope that’s what you find.


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## HommeNu

jlg07 said:


> So nothing from the PREVIOUS days for the video?


I did not download the other days. Honestly, I wasn't thinking. Or more to the point, I kind of expected someone to say, yes, the cleaner came a day early or something. When I asked K when she came home from work, she freaked out. She asked me if I had checked all the doors when I got home. I had. All locked. And I told her I checked the security video log and saw nobody there, but she is convinced we must have had a prowler in the house looking for valuable. She's been triple-checking the locks ever since. I was not and am still not convinced. I’ve racked my brain trying to think of any other inconsistencies. I can’t think of any. Our life seemed picture-perfect. We have a nice home on the water in Florida, we spend a month every summer traveling as a family, we’ve saved almost enough for the onslaught of college tuitions, and honestly, we want for very little. It has been a charmed life. And now I wonder if it is time to pay the piper. Simply put, something in my marriage feels off, but this is the first real thing "out of place." I am worried. I feel like I am carrying a hard pebble in my gut which, I guess, is how I came to find this forum.


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## moulinyx

HommeNu said:


> I did not download the other days. Honestly, I wasn't thinking. Or more to the point, I kind of expected someone to say, yes, the cleaner came a day early or something. When I asked K when she came home from work, she freaked out. She asked me if I had checked all the doors when I got home. I had. All locked. And I told her I checked the security video log and saw nobody there, but she is convinced we must have had a prowler in the house looking for valuable. She's been triple-checking the locks ever since. I was not and am still not convinced. I’ve racked my brain trying to think of any other inconsistencies. I can’t think of any. Our life seemed picture-perfect. We have a nice home on the water in Florida, we spend a month every summer traveling as a family, we’ve saved almost enough for the onslaught of college tuitions, and honestly, we want for very little. It has been a charmed life. And now I wonder if it is time to pay the piper. Simply put, something in my marriage feels off, but this is the first real thing "out of place." I am worried. I feel like I am carrying a hard pebble in my gut which, I guess, is how I came to find this forum.


Are you not able to download the other days? That would be your clear answer. You have the ability to answer this question for yourself.

If you wife is now checking the doors and seeming scared, it doesn’t look like she had someone over. That off feeling can be many things. I suggest sitting her down and telling her things feel off. Maybe she is stressed or dealing with something unrelated to the marriage


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## Torninhalf

HommeNu said:


> I did not download the other days. Honestly, I wasn't thinking. Or more to the point, I kind of expected someone to say, yes, the cleaner came a day early or something. When I asked K when she came home from work, she freaked out. She asked me if I had checked all the doors when I got home. I had. All locked. And I told her I checked the security video log and saw nobody there, but she is convinced we must have had a prowler in the house looking for valuable. She's been triple-checking the locks ever since. I was not and am still not convinced. I’ve racked my brain trying to think of any other inconsistencies. I can’t think of any. Our life seemed picture-perfect. We have a nice home on the water in Florida, we spend a month every summer traveling as a family, we’ve saved almost enough for the onslaught of college tuitions, and honestly, we want for very little. It has been a charmed life. And now I wonder if it is time to pay the piper. Simply put, something in my marriage feels off, but this is the first real thing "out of place." I am worried. I feel like I am carrying a hard pebble in my gut which, I guess, is how I came to find this forum.


Have you checked phone records yet?


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## Blondilocks

If no one ever uses that toilet, the seat could have been left up from the last time the cleaner was there - to let the rim dry.

Also, if your wife is innocent she may be thinking you are projecting because you are cheating. She's probably giving you the side-eye.


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## BigDaddyNY

HommeNu said:


> I did not download the other days. Honestly, I wasn't thinking. Or more to the point, I kind of expected someone to say, yes, the cleaner came a day early or something. When I asked K when she came home from work, she freaked out. She asked me if I had checked all the doors when I got home. I had. All locked. And I told her I checked the security video log and saw nobody there, but she is convinced we must have had a prowler in the house looking for valuable. She's been triple-checking the locks ever since. I was not and am still not convinced. I’ve racked my brain trying to think of any other inconsistencies. I can’t think of any. Our life seemed picture-perfect. We have a nice home on the water in Florida, we spend a month every summer traveling as a family, we’ve saved almost enough for the onslaught of college tuitions, and honestly, we want for very little. It has been a charmed life. And now I wonder if it is time to pay the piper. Simply put, something in my marriage feels off, but this is the first real thing "out of place." I am worried. I feel like I am carrying a hard pebble in my gut which, I guess, is how I came to find this forum.


Obviously I can't read your wife, her actions sound either very genuine or she is liar with a good poker face. I hope you are worrying over nothing.

As a father of a daughter, I would be as or more concerned about my 17 or 15 year old daughter and who they had in the house.


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## HommeNu

@Evinrude58 Our sex life is solid, if a little vanilla lately. We usually have relations 2-3 times per week. Almost always before I go out of town and when I get home, and usually (hopefully!) once over the weekend. No new personal grooming--its all bare everywhere. No new lingerie that I've seen, but maybe I need to check. K does not travel for work at all except for a couple of market/convention type meetings once or twice a year, but I usually go with. She's not phone guarding that I've noticed. She has a password on her phone as do I, but we know each other’s passwords and we trade phones all the time like when something needs mapping or we want to share social media post without sending it to one another. I secretly checked her phone a few times over the past few weeks and there is nothing suspicious, but there are a million messaging apps so who knows.


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## mickybill

Wait, you only checked one day? Seriously if you want see if there is a man in the house you need to look at the days that you were out of town. Go back as far as the recordings go...personally I think someone left the seat up after cleaning.
If this is all you have to suspect your wife is cheating that is pretty thin gruel. Don't screw up a good marriage with such flimsy evidence.


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## CharlieParker

Note to self: do not leave valuables in the toilet, that is the first and only place a prowler will look.


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## Gabriel

HommeNu said:


> I did not download the other days. Honestly, I wasn't thinking. Or more to the point, I kind of expected someone to say, yes, the cleaner came a day early or something. When I asked K when she came home from work, she freaked out. She asked me if I had checked all the doors when I got home. I had. All locked. And I told her I checked the security video log and saw nobody there, but she is convinced we must have had a prowler in the house looking for valuable. She's been triple-checking the locks ever since. I was not and am still not convinced. I’ve racked my brain trying to think of any other inconsistencies. I can’t think of any. Our life seemed picture-perfect. We have a nice home on the water in Florida, we spend a month every summer traveling as a family, we’ve saved almost enough for the onslaught of college tuitions, and honestly, we want for very little. It has been a charmed life. And now I wonder if it is time to pay the piper. Simply put, something in my marriage feels off, but this is the first real thing "out of place." I am worried. I feel like I am carrying a hard pebble in my gut which, I guess, is how I came to find this forum.


I'm guessing one of your daughters had a boy visitor.

But if your marriage feels off, you should address that, independently of this toilet thing. Sit her down, tell her something feels different between you and ask her if something is wrong. If she gets really defensive, or outright denies there is any difference, those are red flags. If she agrees with you that things feel off, and agrees you guys should work on it, I'd be more apt to believe nothing sneaky is happening.


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## Gabriel

CharlieParker said:


> Note to self: do not leave valuables in the toilet, that is the first and only place a prowler will look.


LMAO

And also, they will take the time to use the toilet before they leave.


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## BigDaddyNY

HommeNu said:


> @Evinrude58 Our sex life is solid, if a little vanilla lately. We usually have relations 2-3 times per week. Almost always before I go out of town and when I get home, and usually (hopefully!) once over the weekend. No new personal grooming--its all bare everywhere. No new lingerie that I've seen, but maybe I need to check. K does not travel for work at all except for a couple of market/convention type meetings once or twice a year, but I usually go with. She's not phone guarding that I've noticed. She has a password on her phone as do I, but we know each other’s passwords and we trade phones all the time like when something needs mapping or we want to share social media post without sending it to one another. I secretly checked her phone a few times over the past few weeks and there is nothing suspicious, but there are a million messaging apps so who knows.


I personally think you are being paranoid. As I said before, given everything you shared I would be more concerned about my daughters, but I think even that is probably nothing to worry about.


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## ccpowerslave

CharlieParker said:


> Note to self: do not leave valuables in the toilet, that is the first and only place a prowler will look.


Taped to the underside of the toilet tank in a ziplock is a legit hiding spot just saying.


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## HommeNu

BigDaddyNY said:


> Obviously I can't read your wife, her actions sound either very genuine or she is liar with a good poker face. I hope you are worrying over nothing.
> 
> As a father of a daughter, I would be as or more concerned about my 17 or 15 year old daughter and who they had in the house.


Thank you. Yes, I agree. And if I had not checked in with the school I would just assume the 17 year-old was here with her boyfriend. I love her, but she can be a sneaky one. The thing is the distance I feel between K and me. It has had me slightly off center for a while, but I did not know what to do or say about it as I just chalked it up to the whole world being upside down and now re-opening, and us all trying to find our new bearings.


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## QuietRiot

HommeNu said:


> I did not download the other days. Honestly, I wasn't thinking. Or more to the point, I kind of expected someone to say, yes, the cleaner came a day early or something. When I asked K when she came home from work, she freaked out. She asked me if I had checked all the doors when I got home. I had. All locked. And I told her I checked the security video log and saw nobody there, but she is convinced we must have had a prowler in the house looking for valuable. She's been triple-checking the locks ever since. I was not and am still not convinced. I’ve racked my brain trying to think of any other inconsistencies. I can’t think of any. Our life seemed picture-perfect. We have a nice home on the water in Florida, we spend a month every summer traveling as a family, we’ve saved almost enough for the onslaught of college tuitions, and honestly, we want for very little. It has been a charmed life. And now I wonder if it is time to pay the piper. Simply put, something in my marriage feels off, but this is the first real thing "out of place." I am worried. I feel like I am carrying a hard pebble in my gut which, I guess, is how I came to find this forum.


Because of what I have been through, I have to tell you that you cannot, and should not discount that feeling in your gut. And if she is in fact cheating, she would lie about it until she is caught red handed. On the other hand, if she isn’t cheating, the VAR and cameras is a huge breech of trust.

I don’t know what to advise. Usually I have an opinion, this one is difficult. The distance in the relationship is a red flag though... do you still have sex regularly? If you are out of town weekly, then she has ample opportunity to cheat...


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## BigDaddyNY

HommeNu said:


> Thank you. Yes, I agree. And if I had not checked in with the school I would just assume the 17 year-old was here with her boyfriend. I love her, but she can be a sneaky one. The thing is the distance I feel between K and me. It has had me slightly off center for a while, but I did not know what to do or say about it as I just chalked it up to the whole world being upside down and now re-opening, and us all trying to find our new bearings.


You've said you are still having sex 2-3 times a week and especially when you leave and come home. That doesn't sound like a woman with another man to me. Yes the distance thing is a concern, but I wouldn't jump to cheating just yet. I think you should keep looking around for some other signs, look at the other days while you were gone on the video, but I wouldn't bring up cheating to her over a toilet seat and a gut feeling. What I would do is discuss the distance you are sensing. See if she feels it too and why. Most importantly see what you can try to do to help. Evinrude had a great suggesting. Take her somewhere for a weekend or something. Try to close that distance.


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## CrAzYdOgLaDy

You are looking for problems that aren't there, and can ruin a perfectly happy marriage. From reading your comments it doesn't seem like your wife is cheating. Maybe for peace of mind get a voice activated recorder and put where your wife would chat on her phone, maybe under a car seat. She can't know it's there though. If after a few weeks you find nothing, then get all bad thoughts out of your head. The toilet seat being up doesn't mean your wife is having an affair. It was probably left up to dry after being cleaned.

Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk


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## dubsey

HommeNu said:


> Thank you. Yes, I agree. And if I had not checked in with the school I would just assume the 17 year-old was here with her boyfriend. I love her, but she can be a sneaky one.


It's still probably this, just not during that particular school day. Could have been one of the other evenings before or whatever if it's not used very often.


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## theloveofmylife

I doubt your wife would immediately invite a new lover to your house, a house full of kids no less. I'm guessing a boyfriend of your daughters or the housekeeper left the seat up.

Feeling like something is a little off is nothing to ignore though. The good news is that it might just be something simple, like needing a bit more closeness, affection, or quality time together. Take your wife on a nice date, just you two, something fun. See how things feel before, during, and after. 

It's important not to get into a rut, where the connection just withers away. You're gone a lot, so make up for the time away when you are back home.


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## Al_Bundy

As others have said don't ignore your gut. The people calling you paranoid now would be the same people saying that this was an early "obvious sign" if you were posting about catching your wife cheating.

Because it's not just like things were perfect and the only thing you have is the toilet seat.

If your wife has a brick and mortar business I doubt she'd bring a guy into the house. Why bother when she has a place (her business) all to herself. Does the flower shop have any security cameras?


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## Cletus

Al_Bundy said:


> As others have said don't ignore your gut. The people calling you paranoid now would be the same people saying that this was an early "obvious sign" if you were posting about catching your wife cheating.


Yeah, no. A toilet seat left up is not an obvious sign of anything in any world I have ever lived. 

Making the leap from toilet seat up to affair is about the same as UFO -> alien abductions. Too many intermediate steps.


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## MattMatt

Someone cleaned the toilet, but forgot to put the seat back down?


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## MattMatt

@HommeNu I would suggest some marital counselling, having put the toilet seat idea to one side, as I think marital counselling would benefit you as a couple.


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## HommeNu

I appreciate everyone's thoughts. I do hope that you're all correct and that I am worrying for naught. That said, I am taking some early advice and this afternoon I purchased a set of 3 Arlo wireless cameras at Best Buy which I am going to install outside around the house this weekend. I hear you about VARs but she walks to work as often as she drives, and I cannot imagine that I can hide one on her person and the car ride is too short. Plus, as someone suggested, if she discovered the VARs that might cause too much harm to the relationship. Arlo cameras I can pass off as "additional security." She is supposed to take the girls shopping on Sunday so maybe I will have some time to peek around the bedroom and closet for items unknown to me. I also plan to look at the cell phone bill. I will let you all know what I find. Thank you everyone for your support even those of you poking fun at me.


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## Al_Bundy

Cletus said:


> Yeah, no. A toilet seat left up is not an obvious sign of anything in any world I have ever lived.
> 
> Making the leap from toilet seat up to affair is about the same as UFO -> alien abductions. Too many intermediate steps.


And that's my point. The fact this triggered that response shows his mind was already there.


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## Torninhalf

HommeNu said:


> I appreciate everyone's thoughts. I do hope that you're all correct and that I am worrying for naught. That said, I am taking some early advice and this afternoon I purchased a set of 3 Arlo wireless cameras at Best Buy which I am going to install outside around the house this weekend. I hear you about VARs but she walks to work as often as she drives, and I cannot imagine that I can hide one on her person and the car ride is too short. Plus, as someone suggested, if she discovered the VARs that might cause too much harm to the relationship. Arlo cameras I can pass off as "additional security." She is supposed to take the girls shopping on Sunday so maybe I will have some time to peek around the bedroom and closet for items unknown to me. I also plan to look at the cell phone bill. I will let you all know what I find. Thank you everyone for your support even those of you poking fun at me.


So after my STBXH moved out my daughter and her boyfriend stopped by one day. She texted me after they left and said her boyfriend said I think your mom had a man over…she was like “What” He said the toilet seat was up. 😂
Not the case…I just cleaned the toilet and didn’t put the seat back down. Somethings are simply what they are. 🤷🏼‍♀️


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## Elizabeth001

I’m not sure about her response of freaking out enough to check the doors and stuff. Seems to me if it was so minor that any cleaning or otherwise simple excuse would not have garnered that kind of reaction. Seems suspicious to me. 

Husband’s spidey senses are tingling. He’s been with her all this time. He has purchased extra cameras and who would do that if they didn’t have something deep telling them to do so?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Divinely Favored

Other thought i had was maybe one of the girls got sick,(drunk) and tossed some cookies. I always lifted seat to puke. Also left seat up when cleaning. If it has not been used recently the bowl should be dang near empty from evaporation.


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## Pam

Everything has been upside down for over a year, a lot of small businesses have suffered. Do you know how K's florist business weathered the economy? Maybe the distance is simply worrying about financial stuff. I would lovingly ask her about it if you don't know.


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## QuietRiot

Divinely Favored said:


> Other thought i had was maybe one of the girls got sick,(drunk) and tossed some cookies. I always lifted seat to puke. Also left seat up when cleaning. If it has not been used recently the bowl should be dang near empty from evaporation.


Weird. Why do you lift the seat to vomit?


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## Enigma32

You know what, I get why you are concerned. I know some people think maybe you are being paranoid over a toilet seat but you know the routine in your house better than anyone. If you've been living in that same house with a bunch of women for so many years and that toilet seat has never been up, this minor change will make you take pause. I get it. 

The issue I see here is your investigation. You already have a doorbell camera that you checked which yielded nothing. Now you are thinking of installing cameras, but what if that shows you nothing? Honestly, I think you should just hire a PI to watch your wife for about a week or so and then call it a day.


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## SGr

Torninhalf said:


> So after my STBXH moved out my daughter and her boyfriend stopped by one day. She texted me after they left and said her boyfriend said I think your mom had a man over…she was like “What” He said the toilet seat was up.
> Not the case…I just cleaned the toilet and didn’t put the seat back down. Somethings are simply what they are.


Occam's razor. 

Tapatalk


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## Twodecades

You really just don't have enough info to draw any conclusions, and neither do we have enough to give you much guidance. Occam's Razor, as SGr stated above, is a definite possibility. I think the real issue is your gut telling you something is off. That I do think you need to address.

She could be on edge if she is generally an anxious person, or she could be worried about your daughter having boys over. The intruder theory seems over the top. IS she an anxiety-prone person?

I think for your own sanity, you should rule out infidelity before revisiting this with your wife. You need to know if the issue is internal with you, external with your marriage, or both. Assuming there is no evidence of infidelity, I would then sit down and talk to her. Be open. Give her room to be angry about being recorded without her knowledge. Stress how you appreciate the way she took care of you and explain how you've felt since your illness about the distance. Explain how the distance made you suspect she could be cheating, and you know that's not a healthy place for you two to be. Tell her how you love her and want to protect your marriage but don't want to be paranoid or distrustful. Consider IC and ask her if she'd be willing to go to marriage counseling. You may have some insecurities that need to be dealt with so you don't drive her away. Or there could be some trust or communication issues that you two need to work on.

That's assuming you find there's nothing going on. At this point, I'm not seeing that you will find something with your wife. It'd be helpful for to update either way, though, for those who find this thread down the road.


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## Tatsuhiko

The common advice in here is "trust your gut". I think that's good advice, and his gut is telling him something is wrong, so I'm confused why people are suggesting that OP is being irrational. He sure doesn't seem irrational.

OP, definitely place the new cameras and hide them well. Do not tell her about them, of course.


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## Divinely Favored

QuietRiot said:


> Weird. Why do you lift the seat to vomit?


Larger area(just bowl) and to not get any puke splashed on the toilet seat.


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## manwithnoname

HommeNu said:


> I came home a day early from a business trip about six weeks ago and found the toilet seat up in our upstairs guest bathroom. This may not be remarkable in most households, but I (51) live with my wife (44) and our 3 daughters (17, 15, 13). Living with four women means always putting the toilet seat down. It is an accommodation to their gender that I have fully embraced. *We haven’t had houseguests since the Before Times, and no one really uses that bathroom except for overnight guests so finding the toilet seat up in an empty house in the middle of the day in the middle of the work week is, to put it mildly, odd.* My daughters and their friends were still at school. My wife was still at work. I checked the doorbell video log, but no one had come in the house since everyone left around 7:15 that morning.


Who cleans the toilet? Is it possible it was cleaned and left up a while ago since no one uses it except for guests, and you haven't had guests over recently?

Work on the distance, and obviously be on alert


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## Blondilocks

I'd get security on the side door (which no one uses - except for maybe a burglar, lover, boyfriend?). If you're going to do security, do it up right.


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## Andy1001

I’m mentally counting the times as a seventeen year old that I stayed the night with a date and we used the guest bedroom. Did the bed look tidy when you entered the room?


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## In Absentia

If all the doors are locked, and there are no signs of forced entry anywhere, then it could only have been your wife or your daughters. Someone is clearly lying.


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## Andy1001

In Absentia said:


> If all the doors are locked, and there are no signs of forced entry anywhere, then it could only have been your wife or your daughters. Someone is clearly lying.


I agree with you. Also I would think his wife would not take the chance of one of the daughters coming home unexpectedly if she was cheating which I don’t believe anyway. 
My bet is it’s the oldest daughter.


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## Bluesclues

Andy1001 said:


> I agree with you. Also I would think his wife would not take the chance of one of the daughters coming home unexpectedly if she was cheating which I don’t believe anyway.
> My bet is it’s the oldest daughter.


I agree with this. OP said he checked with the school and she was there so he dismissed it- but she doesn’t need to skip school to have a boy over. There is at least 1 1/2 hours between the time they get home from school and when mom gets home. That doesn’t necessarily mean sex, just having a boy over in her room.


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## OnTheRocks

BlueWoman said:


> Oh there are so many reasons. 1) The toilet seat up just looks bad. 2) The rim of the toilet is the nastiest part of the toilet and having the toilet seat down hides it. 3) Women back up to the toilet when we pee. Men don’t.
> 
> But, I suspect you know all of those reasons, and don’t care. That’s on you. But I do encourage you to start pushing your gf to put up the toilet seat in your house. Best to let her know who you are now before you guys get more serious.


1) your opinion, 2) your preference, 3) do you also walk backwards when approaching the toilet? Still not seeing how it's my responsibility. Been with GF for almost 10 years now, so I assure you she knows who I am.


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## Twodecades

Re: the comment about OP being irrational...to be clear, I'm not saying he is. There just isn't enough evidence to conclude much. If I were a guy in his shoes, the toilet lid up would make me pause, but the fact that it was related to cleaning, flushing something down the toilet, a daughter having a male friend visit or sneaking a boy in, etc. would seem just as likely as my wife cheating. Especially if sex hadn't changed for the worse.

The thing is that people are often too embarrassed to come back and say, "Turns out it was nothing," so in cases like these with very little hard evidence, the place that forum readers' minds tend to stay stuck on is "she was cheating." Another thread comes to mind in which a WW thought her betrayed spouse was cheating when, in fact, he was planning a very nice surprise for her. I realize that's a different situation, but when there isn't a lot to go on, we need to use caution with our assumptions.

My guess would be that it's either innocuous or has something to do with the daughters. However, OP's gut feeling is something is off, and he may even be picking up on something else subconsciously that he can't yet articulate. I hope it doesn't turn out to be what he's fearing.

That's another mind-twisting aspect of infidelity. Sometimes, BSs feel some strange relief mixed in with everything else at DD, because they felt like they must have been losing their minds...something felt "off," yet they were told they were crazy and imagining things. Hence, getting to the bottom of this for his own sanity.


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## DownByTheRiver

It's called cleaning the toilet. You should try it sometime.


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## mickybill

ccpowerslave said:


> Taped to the underside of the toilet tank in a ziplock is a legit hiding spot just saying.


It worked for Michael in "The Godfather."


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## HommeNu

Good morning from the Sunshine State. Thank you all for your comments. I have nothing new to report. We took a family day and drove across the state to visit two of my great-aunts who finally feel comfortable having vaccinated guests. It was really good to hug them. And it was a really nice family day.

Today K and the daughters are joining some of their girlfriends for their first unmasked shopping trip for clothes in over a year. My plan today is to download the cell phone bill and install the Arlo cameras. @Blondilocks suggested putting security on the side door which was the first thing I plan to cover with an Arlo. Because of the way the house sits on the lot the drive comes in by the side of the house and then turns into a garage area with a parking pad which also exits to the street. Our normal traffic pattern is to enter from the front of the house and exit from the parking area into the side street. I am going to place a camera on the garage to catch anyone entering from the "exit." Not sure yet where to place the third one. Anyway, I am thinking as I type and you're probably bored. 

The other thing I intend to do is to search our bedroom and bath for anything out of place or that is new to me.

As I type that now I am beginning to think you all are mostly correct. I am just being paranoid. It has to the the eldest daughter, doesn't it. That makes so much more sense. And she's proven herself wily. I do love her though. We had such a nice day yesterday. K was her usually funny, loving self. The daughters were so happy to go see their Aunties that they didn't squabble. It felt good. I’ve never had a concern that my wife is might be stepping out. It is so far out of her “good girl” personality as to be laughable. I trust her completely. Plus I just don’t know when she would have time.

Someone asked about the health of the flower shop. It has been a strange year in business. I will post a more detailed response later, but it was a much better year than expected.

Okay, I will report back once my chores are complete. I know everyone is here for unhappy reasons, but I wish you all a happy Sunday.


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## Jeffsmith35

Look carefully for any hairs that don't match.


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## Blondilocks

Jeffsmith35 said:


> Look carefully for any hairs that don't match.


And, don't forget to tear the vacuum apart and check for hairs.


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## BigDaddyNY

HommeNu said:


> Okay, I will report back once my chores are complete. I know everyone is here for unhappy reasons, but I wish you all a happy Sunday.


Not all of us are here for unhappy reason. Quite happy hear. Just hoping to learn and maybe help a little along the way.


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## Jeffsmith35

Blondilocks said:


> And, don't forget to tear the vacuum apart and check for hairs.


And carefully dig through the garbage before it goes out to the road 😉


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## MattMatt

QuietRiot said:


> Weird. Why do you lift the seat to vomit?


To avoid getting vomit on the seat? Doesn't everyone do that?


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## ccpowerslave

MattMatt said:


> To avoid getting vomit on the seat? Doesn't everyone do that?


I know I do!


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## QuietRiot

MattMatt said:


> To avoid getting vomit on the seat? Doesn't everyone do that?


😂 Well now I’m the weirdo! No! I don’t want to have my face near the pee pee ring. I like to rest my elbows and forearms on the seat for stability while heaving.


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## BigDaddyNY

QuietRiot said:


> 😂 Well now I’m the weirdo! No! I don’t want to have my face near the pee pee ring. I like to rest my elbows and forearms on the seat for stability while heaving.


Thankfully I haven't had to drive the porcelain bus in a long time, but when I did I always kept the seat down, easier to grip. lol


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## Elizabeth001

HommeNu said:


> I trust her completely.


Huh?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## BigDaddyNY

HommeNu said:


> Good morning from the Sunshine State. Thank you all for your comments. I have nothing new to report. We took a family day and drove across the state to visit two of my great-aunts who finally feel comfortable having vaccinated guests. It was really good to hug them. And it was a really nice family day.
> 
> Today K and the daughters are joining some of their girlfriends for their first unmasked shopping trip for clothes in over a year. My plan today is to download the cell phone bill and install the Arlo cameras. @Blondilocks suggested putting security on the side door which was the first thing I plan to cover with an Arlo. Because of the way the house sits on the lot the drive comes in by the side of the house and then turns into a garage area with a parking pad which also exits to the street. Our normal traffic pattern is to enter from the front of the house and exit from the parking area into the side street. I am going to place a camera on the garage to catch anyone entering from the "exit." Not sure yet where to place the third one. Anyway, I am thinking as I type and you're probably bored.
> 
> The other thing I intend to do is to search our bedroom and bath for anything out of place or that is new to me.
> 
> As I type that now I am beginning to think you all are mostly correct. I am just being paranoid. It has to the the eldest daughter, doesn't it. That makes so much more sense. And she's proven herself wily. I do love her though. We had such a nice day yesterday. K was her usually funny, loving self. The daughters were so happy to go see their Aunties that they didn't squabble. It felt good. I’ve never had a concern that my wife is might be stepping out. It is so far out of her “good girl” personality as to be laughable. I trust her completely. Plus I just don’t know when she would have time.
> 
> Someone asked about the health of the flower shop. It has been a strange year in business. I will post a more detailed response later, but it was a much better year than expected.
> 
> Okay, I will report back once my chores are complete. I know everyone is here for unhappy reasons, but I wish you all a happy Sunday.


If you trust her completely then why did you jump from toilet seat up to my wife must have had a man in the house?


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## HommeNu

Well, I have come down off of my family high from Saturday. Everything seemed fine yesterday, but really not really. Actually, now that I think about it, everyone was a little unsettled. We didn’t talk about it much, but the undercurrent was there. K took the girls shopping just before lunch which gave me most of the afternoon on my own. I spent most of the time trying to place the Arlo cameras. It was harder than I though it was going to be to put the cameras out of sight and still have clear lines of vision. I spent a fair amount of time on the ladder. I finished before anyone came home, but I did to have time to search the house, though I did find 5 different hairs in the Dyson. Joking 

The cell phone bills show no significant increase in usage over the past 18 months, and there is no clear-cut favorite target of her text messages. The bulk of her messages are to her employees, the daughters, me, and a few girlfriends around the country. Dead end there.

I’ve decided to take all of your advice and focus on my wife for a while so I decided postpone the 2-day business trip I was going to take and stay home this week. When I told the family last night, my girls were thrilled because now I won’t miss their sports on Wednesday, but my wife just pursed her lips and asked why. She seemed irritated, but then shook it off. Honestly, I was disappointed at her response. It has me thinking. I think I will take her out for a surprise lunch tomorrow. Today, I will search the bedroom for the unknown unknowns while K is at work.


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## HommeNu

BigDaddyNY said:


> If you trust her completely then why did you jump from toilet seat up to my wife must have had a man in the house?


I wish I had a better response than "something just feels off." As someone suggested earlier, I decided that if I have not found any more red flags by the end of the week, I will pack this away as my paranoia and be done with it. The group-skepticism is actually kind of reassuring. Thank you.


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## ccpowerslave

HommeNu said:


> When I told the family last night, my girls were thrilled because now I won’t miss their sports on Wednesday, but my wife just pursed her lips and asked why. She seemed irritated, but then shook it off. Honestly, I was disappointed at her response. It has me thinking.


My wife would react this way in the past. It was her generic form of, “Aren’t you supposed to be working?”  Alternatively the, “You’re home early <frown>.” was her way of expressing displeasure at the thought I might be messing up my job.


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## HommeNu

I found a dildo. A very large, rather realistic dildo hidden high up behind a pile of sweaters at the top of her closet. It has been used, or at least it is out of the packaging and appears used. I've never seen it before. She has a "toy drawer" where she keeps her girl-gear, and I've never seen this before. It is huge. Like 9 inches long and a couple of inches in diameter. I don't know what to make of it. This is out of character for her. I also found a few pair of new thongs panties in her drawers. She hates thongs and refuses to wear them so I am not sure why she has any. These both feel like red flags to me. I am not sure I am going to be able to sleep tonight.


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## Jeffsmith35

Oh, no. I'm sorry. There are kits to make dildos using silicone molds that lovers send to each other. Keep digging.


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## Al_Bundy

HommeNu said:


> I found a dildo. A very large, rather realistic dildo hidden high up behind a pile of sweaters at the top of her closet. It has been used, or at least it is out of the packaging and appears used. I've never seen it before. She has a "toy drawer" where she keeps her girl-gear, and I've never seen this before. It is huge. Like 9 inches long and a couple of inches in diameter. I don't know what to make of it. This is out of character for her. I also found a few pair of new thongs panties in her drawers. She hates thongs and refuses to wear them so I am not sure why she has any. These both feel like red flags to me. I am not sure I am going to be able to sleep tonight.


Be patient. Let the truth, whatever it is, become clear before you say anything else to her.


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## Kamstel2

I’m one of the people who say that if your gut is trying to tell you something, then there is probably something going on. 

They make tiny video cameras that are very difficult to spot. you might want to buy one and set it up in your bedroom when you finally do go away on your next business trip or a VAR (voice activated recorder). 

Wish you nothing but the best of luck. 
Stay strong, keep your eyes and ears open, and your mouth shut.

good luck


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## HommeNu

Do you think I should ask her about these things? I've been feeling very discombobulated since I found it. Maybe I should just sit down and tell what I found and that I've been feeling off, and ask her to let me into her world again. I don't know. It is going to be hard to sleep imagining her using that thing. I can't believe that she does. She's "not a dildo person." Vibes yes, but not simple dildos yet she has this monster in her closet. So if it is not hers, who's is it and why is it here? No, it must be hers, right? Ugh.


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## Al_Bundy

HommeNu said:


> Do you think I should ask her about these things? I've been feeling very discombobulated since I found it. Maybe I should just sit down and tell what I found and that I've been feeling off, and ask her to let me into her world again. I don't know. It is going to be hard to sleep imagining her using that thing. I can't believe that she does. She's "not a dildo person." Vibes yes, but not simple dildos yet she has this monster in her closet. So if it is not hers, who's is it and why is it here? No, it must be hers, right? Ugh.


NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! Dude, I know it sucks, but keep quiet until you have undeniable proof. Otherwise you'll just push any possible bad behavior deeper underground.


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## Elizabeth001

Kamstel2 said:


> I’m one of the people who say that if your gut is trying to tell you something, then there is probably something going on.
> 
> They make tiny video cameras that are very difficult to spot. you might want to buy one and set it up in your bedroom when you finally do go away on your next business trip or a VAR (voice activated recorder).
> 
> Wish you nothing but the best of luck.
> Stay strong, keep your eyes and ears open, and your mouth shut.
> 
> good luck


Ditto


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Elizabeth001

HommeNu said:


> Do you think I should ask her about these things? I've been feeling very discombobulated since I found it. Maybe I should just sit down and tell what I found and that I've been feeling off, and ask her to let me into her world again. I don't know. It is going to be hard to sleep imagining her using that thing. I can't believe that she does. She's "not a dildo person." Vibes yes, but not simple dildos yet she has this monster in her closet. So if it is not hers, who's is it and why is it here? No, it must be hers, right? Ugh.


She doesn’t use them with you. By herself? Perhaps. Keep this to yourself until you have more info. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## jlg07

Make sure you have some of the cameras where she may use that thing....


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## Enigma32

HommeNu said:


> Do you think I should ask her about these things?


Never ask people questions unless you already know the answer. I'll explain. Let's say your wife really is up to no good and you ask her about it. She will lie and then you've gained nothing, you've just made her become more cautious. What you need to do is keep all suspicions to yourself and find out the truth on your own. If you've got the coin, I'd recommend hiring an investigator. If you don't have the money or just don't like that idea, then you should figure it out on your own. Maybe even bring your suspicions to a friend. Sometimes your friends know what is going on but don't want to tell you. 

Is your wife active on social media? If she is cheating, then the person she is cheating with is likely on there. Maybe stalk her opposite sex friends pages a bit and see if there are any clues on there. Also, if she uses messenger apps to talk to them, it won't really show up on the phone bill. 

If you conduct a thorough investigation and she is cleared, then let this stuff die off. If you find out for certain she is cheating or something, and you can prove it somehow, that's when you ask her what's going on just to see her reaction. By then, you should be preparing your divorce.


----------



## Jeffsmith35

The thong panties are the biggest possible indicator of infidelity. Go absolutely silent, do not tell her anything.


----------



## Torninhalf

Jeffsmith35 said:


> The thong panties are the biggest possible indicator of infidelity. Go absolutely silent, do not tell her anything.


I agree with this. If it isn’t something she wears on the regular and she has not worn them with you yet, it is a huge red flag.


----------



## re16

Whatever you do, stay quiet. You may need to tell her you aren't feeling well (which is true), just don't say why.

Eyes open, mouth shut.

You need to figure out what is really happening.


----------



## Cletus

HommeNu said:


> Today, I will search the bedroom for the unknown unknowns while K is at work.


If that's not the ultimate expression of complete trust, I don't know what is.


----------



## ccpowerslave

I never would have expected a toilet seat lid would lead to so much intrigue. It’s like a modern day Poirot but with a giant dildo and thongs.

Hastings: Poirot what do you reckon this is?
<Holds up giant dildo>
Poirot: Mon dieu! Hastings do you not know what this is?
Hastings: Erm... no.
Poirot: Well you see Hastings, this is used by the feminine lady during her time alone. WAIT! Hastings! Perhaps not alone! The little gray cells they are now tres active!

Good luck with this OP.


----------



## Elizabeth001

Cletus said:


> If that's not the ultimate expression of complete trust, I don't know what is.


Take care of the words you speak and write. Sounded like wishful thinking to me.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Willnotbill

Enigma32 said:


> Never ask people questions unless you already know the answer. I'll explain. Let's say your wife really is up to no good and you ask her about it. She will lie and then you've gained nothing, you've just made her become more cautious. What you need to do is keep all suspicions to yourself and find out the truth on your own. If you've got the coin, I'd recommend hiring an investigator. If you don't have the money or just don't like that idea, then you should figure it out on your own. Maybe even bring your suspicions to a friend. Sometimes your friends know what is going on but don't want to tell you.


During the times of investigation the best question to ask is one you already know the answer to. It will tell you a lot.


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## Twodecades

@HommeNu, is it possible that she is too embarrassed to talk to you about using the dildo, and/or that she got it during your illness and doesn't want to make you feel bad? In my opinion, this is something she should have discussed with you, as it's a part of your sex life, so you are entitled to do some stealth digging to make sure there isn't she's hiding something nefarious. The thong underwear, however, I don't have any idea about. I like to show my sexy new underwear off to my husband, not buy it and keep it buried in the dresser. Maybe other women are different(?)

Edited to add: I really don't know of any women who buy thongs just for themselves. I'm trying not to be alarmist, Hommenu, and maybe it's some sort of mid-life crisis trying to make herself feel sexier thing, but that one gave me pause.


----------



## Twodecades

Torninhalf said:


> I agree with this. If it isn’t something she wears on the regular and she has not worn them with you yet, it is a huge red flag.


Yeah, I cringed when I read what OP posted about the thongs. I don't know of any women who buy them just for themselves.


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## re16

HommeNu said:


> She hates thongs and refuses to wear them so I am not sure why she has any.


Claiming she hates thongs and then having some that OP has never seen is a pretty major red flag. The dildo could perhaps be explainable, but things are starting to add up. Maybe put the sweaters that cover it in a certain position so you'll know if they've been moved.

I assume you haven't found a burner phone, have you looked at all the apps on her phone (I wonder if something on there is for texting - snapchat / whatsapp maybe something more hidden with chat feature)? Might be a convenient time to have your phone battery die so you have to use hers to finish a conversation and then see what all is on it.

Does she have male employees at the flower shop? Maybe someone that she used to talk about alot and then suddenly stopped talking about?


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## cocolo2019

OP do not confront.
If you can come with a excuse that you feel sick and think you got the Covid, so you can sleep in another room, do it. Because if you sleep with her you are going to have the temptation of asking her.
The dildo can be a firecracker red flag but the pair of thongs is a napalm. Did you check if other devices have connected to your network? Did you download the videos from prior days as recommended here?

It's very probable she is cheating and if she is using a burner phone, well is someone who has experience or is coached.


----------



## maquiscat

Well given the new stuff coming up, if there is an affair, I'm starting to wonder if it's another woman. However, it is still possible that what is happening is that she is getting more into handling her own needs and for some reason finding that more satisfying. If you are going to continue to look into this, as the others have said, say nothing yet. Maybe a camera where you can see who goes into or out of either the guest room or bathroom. You want to be careful about the placement though, as you are not looking to violate privacy or make inadvertent pornos.


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## Tatsuhiko

You might want to schedule that business sooner instead of later because it will giver her an opportunity to have a guest over. I worry you're going to break and start questioning her before you have real evidence. If you question her now, she'll just take any affair further underground, and you'll never know the truth. 

Some folks in here have faked a business trip, or returned a few days earlier than what their itinerary provided. This gave them the opportunity to catch their spouse red-handed.

She might now be spooked about using your house to conduct the affair. Another device you might consider is a GPS tracking device for her car.


----------



## In Absentia

Torninhalf said:


> I agree with this. If it isn’t something she wears on the regular and she has not worn them with you yet, it is a huge red flag.


But why would she keep them in a drawer where her husband could easily find them?


----------



## Torninhalf

In Absentia said:


> But why would she keep them in a drawer where her husband could easily find them?


I suppose she is thinking why would my husband go through my underwear draw?


----------



## jsmart

I agree with the others that the dildo is kind of a red flag but the panties are a huge red flag. 

You can put a small camera pointing to where she has the dildo and panties. If she breaks them out and puts them in her bag, you’ll know she’s using them elsewhere.
You have to look for a burner phone. It’s either in her car or at her job. If you could install a tiny camera at her job, you might be able to capture who is her special friend by seeing the ri body language and facial expression.

I was going to give you **** based on the initial post but having read the additional info, you have enough to be seriously concerned. Always trust your gut.


----------



## In Absentia

Torninhalf said:


> I suppose she is thinking why would my husband go through my underwear draw?


Because she's been distant? After many years married, you pick up any "strange" behaviour immediately. Also, if she is having an affair, she keeps her new thongs in her usual place? Does she think her husband is stupid?


----------



## Torninhalf

In Absentia said:


> Because she's been distant? After many years married, you pick up any "strange" behaviour immediately. Also, if she is having an affair, she keeps her new thongs in her usual place? Does she think her husband is stupid?


Cheaters all think their spouses are stupid when it comes to them hiding an affair.


----------



## In Absentia

Torninhalf said:


> Cheaters all think their spouses are stupid when it comes to them hiding an affair.


Possibly. Luckily, I managed to escape being cheated on, so I wouldn't know. At least that...


----------



## TDSC60

Please do not confront your wife with anything you have found. Mouth shut, eyes open. She could be using the phone at her shop so nothing shows up on the mobile.

Do you really expect her to be truthful about an affair she may be having?


----------



## ABHale

The disconnect and her reaction to you not going out of town is what I would be worried about. There is a reason for it and it could very well be that she is cheating.

Are your daughters acting differently, like maybe they know something?


----------



## BigDaddyNY

HommeNu said:


> Do you think I should ask her about these things? I've been feeling very discombobulated since I found it. Maybe I should just sit down and tell what I found and that I've been feeling off, and ask her to let me into her world again. I don't know. It is going to be hard to sleep imagining her using that thing. I can't believe that she does. She's "not a dildo person." Vibes yes, but not simple dildos yet she has this monster in her closet. So if it is not hers, who's is it and why is it here? No, it must be hers, right? Ugh.


I wouldn't say anything yet. You have a lot of dots, but nothing really connecting them yet. I would at least wait a week or two to see what your cameras find and anything else you can dig up. You don't want to do anything too hastily. You could either make her more cautious if she is up to something or could alienate her and ruin your relationship over nothing.


----------



## pastasauce79

Has she bought any other new fancy, revealing clothes? bras? Lingerie? I hate thongs but I have bought one or two to avoid panty lines under pants or dresses and I haven't told my husband about them. 

What's going on with your sex life? Are you annoying your wife while at home? 

Sometimes I need time away from my husband. I love him but I enjoy alone time. Does your wife like to be alone sometimes as well? 

Keep digging and see what you find.


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## Twodecades

pastasauce79 said:


> I hate thongs but I have bought one or two to avoid panty lines under pants or dresses and I haven't told my husband about them.


That is a very, very good point. There are other options for that, like no-show panties, but owning just a few thongs could be for dressing purposes. The hidden dildo, though, makes them seem less innocent.


----------



## SRCSRC

Give your wife plenty of notice next time you go out of town. Set up as many monitoring devices as possible. Also, have a P.I. watch her moves.


----------



## ABHale

Who makes the flower deliveries and how long are they at the house?


----------



## Killi

HommeNu said:


> Do you think I should ask her about these things? I've been feeling very discombobulated since I found it. Maybe I should just sit down and tell what I found and that I've been feeling off, and ask her to let me into her world again. I don't know. It is going to be hard to sleep imagining her using that thing. I can't believe that she does. She's "not a dildo person." Vibes yes, but not simple dildos yet she has this monster in her closet. So if it is not hers, who's is it and why is it here? No, it must be hers, right? Ugh.


You want to make them know that you are onto them and allow them to destroy evidence, gaslight you and take the affair underground? 
If you are stressed out then hire a PI and let him take care of it.


----------



## HommeNu

I've taken your advice to heart so I've shut my mouth and opened my eyes. I feel completely blown away by the dildo, but from what you all are saying I should be more worried about the half dozen thongs. Just so you know, they are not fancy panties. They look like they're made of regular cotton material, just in thong shape rather than traditional panties. But you all all equally correct that their very presence in her undies drawer is concerning. I slept okay last night with the help of 5mg of melatonin. Again as you've all suggested I've decided to act normal, be a good husband, pay attention, and give her some rope while I continue to investigate. I intend to go through and answer some of your questions directly. I've been pretty quiet today, but I think tomorrow I will surprise her for lunch and take her to one of our favorite local joints.


----------



## HommeNu

re16 said:


> Does she have male employees at the flower shop? Maybe someone that she used to talk about alot and then suddenly stopped talking about?


K has 6 full-time employees although their work is spread across a 6-day week so not everyone works at the same time. She has 4 women who are the talent--the flower arrangers. And she has 2 men, both of whom are the delivery drivers. The delivery drivers tend to be the ones she complains about the most, but she is still complaining about them both.


----------



## HommeNu

cocolo2019 said:


> The dildo can be a firecracker red flag but the pair of thongs is a napalm. Did you check if other devices have connected to your network? Did you download the videos from prior days as recommended here?


Kind of. I went back as far as our system had video which is about a month so I can say there is nothing suspicious in the last month. I won't bore you with the details, but there seems to be a routine that hasn't been broken until school let out a couple of weeks back. Now the kids come and go a bit more, but next week they start some sports camps (finally!) and will be back in a routine again so maybe I will learn more.


----------



## HommeNu

In Absentia said:


> But why would she keep them in a drawer where her husband could easily find them?


Because she knows that rooting around in her undergarments is not something I normally do. The opposite, I try to get her out of her panties. Or I did. To be fair, they were tucked in the back corner under all the other panties. A couple still have price tags on them.


----------



## HommeNu

ABHale said:


> Who makes the flower deliveries and how long are they at the house?


As far as I know, whichever driver is on duty on Wednesday. Most of her orders are for end-of-the-week delivery. She usually has the flowers from the prior weekend that are on edge of spoiling put into 2 or 3 arrangements and delivered to our house to open room in the coolers for the fresh flowers coming in for the weekend coming up. I can't say for sure how long the driver stays, but when I home on Wednesdays my experience is that the driver brings the flowers in and sets them when K tells him to, and then he leaves. All told, 10-15 minutes I guess.


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## Tobyboy

I wouldn’t surprise her at her work( if it’s something you don’t normally do). It’s just going to alert her.


----------



## HommeNu

ABHale said:


> The disconnect and her reaction to you not going out of town is what I would be worried about. There is a reason for it and it could very well be that she is cheating.
> 
> Are your daughters acting differently, like maybe they know something?


I think you may be correct, and I am worried. No, the daughters seem oblivious to everything but themselves. Typical teenagers.


----------



## re16

HommeNu said:


> Because she knows that rooting around in her undergarments is not something I normally do. The opposite, I try to get her out of her panties. Or I did. To be fair, they were tucked in the back corner under all the other panties. A couple still have price tags on them.


Hmmmm, but you never see her wear them? Does make you wonder if they are used so she doesn't get lines in her yoga pants or something like that.

Play it cool for a while, you're on the right track. I'm still on the fence a little, but the gut feeling is swaying me.


----------



## HommeNu

pastasauce79 said:


> Has she bought any other new fancy, revealing clothes? bras? Lingerie? I hate thongs but I have bought one or two to avoid panty lines under pants or dresses and I haven't told my husband about them.
> 
> What's going on with your sex life? Are you annoying your wife while at home?


I have not seen any new fancy or revealing clothes and I did not see any in her closet. Question, why would you not tell your husband that you are wearing a thong to avoid panty lines? It seems like it shouldn't be an issue. Just curious.

Our sex life, I thought, was good. 2-3 times a week when things are good. Less if we've been arguing. But mostly we get along. She likes sex before I go out of town and when I come back so it is usually at least twice a week and sometimes a weekend quickie or long session depending on where the kids are, i.e., not home. But I have felt like she is not wholly present more often than in years past. The dildo is now causing me to wonder if she is not satisfied with me and our sex. That is what hurts the most today.


----------



## Tobyboy

“K came home for lunch around noon. Her delivery van pulled into the driveway and dropped off our weekly flowers--one of the perks of being married to a florist is a home full of fresh flowers--around 12:15. K left out of the front door and walked back to the shop around 1:30.”

Is your wife usually home when the weekly flower are delivered?


----------



## re16

HommeNu said:


> As far as I know, whichever driver is on duty on Wednesday


Wednesday is a day you are normally out of town?

ETA: If flower boy was in the house on the toilet seat day, that's your answer to who used the toilet.


----------



## re16

I would look at exactly how long flower boy is in house for the past few Wednesdays. How long does it take to drop off three bouquets? Five minutes seems ample. Very convenient its often when kids were in school and you were out of town.


----------



## Twodecades

HommeNu said:


> I've taken your advice to heart so I've shut my mouth and opened my eyes. I feel completely blown away by the dildo, but from what you all are saying I should be more worried about the half dozen thongs. Just so you know, they are not fancy panties. They look like they're made of regular cotton material, just in thong shape rather than traditional panties. But you all all equally correct that their very presence in her undies drawer is concerning. I slept okay last night with the help of 5mg of melatonin. Again as you've all suggested I've decided to act normal, be a good husband, pay attention, and give her some rope while I continue to investigate. I intend to go through and answer some of your questions directly. I've been pretty quiet today, but I think tomorrow I will surprise her for lunch and take her to one of our favorite local joints.


I think it's the combo of things you're finding concurrently--dildo, thongs, emotional distance you feel, and the gut feeling--that has some of us more concerned. It's not any one thing, analyzed separately. 

They could all have non-infidelity explanations. Even assuming you find nothing (I hope you find nothing, truly), it seems you and your wife have some talking to do. I can see why you feel hurt. Is it possible that she didn't tell you about these things because she figured you wouldn't care? I'm not blaming you or trying to put you on the defensive. I know it can be easy after being married for many years to drift apart or to check out a bit. Especially with teenagers around to keep track of. Doesn't mean you don't still care deeply.


----------



## Beach123

Why would she need to be home for 90 minutes for the house flowers to be delivered?
He came through the garage? There was no camera at that location - why would she have him come through the garage when most people enter your house through the front door?
I think it’s the make delivery guy that brings the Wednesday flowers. Start checking in that guy. Also see if there are deleted texts to him.


----------



## HommeNu

Tobyboy said:


> Is your wife usually home when the weekly flower are delivered?


I don't honestly know. We live about 10 blocks from the shop so sometimes she walks home for lunch or to have a business conversation she does not want the employees to hear. I know she was home on the day in question. I just looked at the video for the last few Wednesdays. She was not home that last two Wednesdays, but was home the two Wednesdays before that. I have no idea how long the driver is in the house, but I can't imagine it would be that long.


----------



## HommeNu

re16 said:


> I would look at exactly how long flower boy is in house for the past few Wednesdays. How long does it take to drop off three bouquets? Five minutes seems ample. Very convenient its often when kids were in school and you were out of town.


Yes, I agree. The thing is I can't tell from the doorbell video. I can see the van enter the driveway, but because of how the drive turns out, the back doorbell does not see the driveway. Plus K has the flowers delivered to the side door because it is easier to place the big arrangements in the house without negotiating the obstacles in the kitchen.


----------



## HommeNu

Beach123 said:


> Why would she need to be home for 90 minutes for the house flowers to be delivered?
> He came through the garage? There was no camera at that location - why would she have him come through the garage when most people enter your house through the front door?
> I think it’s the make delivery guy that brings the Wednesday flowers. Start checking in that guy. Also see if there are deleted texts to him.


Not quite, but you've got the idea. Whichever driver it is, he comes through the side door (garage is not attached to the house) and there was not a camera on that location, but there is an Arlo pointing at it now. I should learn more during tomorrow's delivery.

It is very hard to imagine my wife banging one of her employees. I mean that is just not done. And the van drivers are, gosh I don't mean to be unkind, but they are not really her kind of people. Oh, that sounds snobbish, but there it is. Do people affair down? I mean, why?


----------



## re16

HommeNu said:


> Yes, I agree. The thing is I can't tell from the doorbell video. I can see the van enter the driveway, but because of how the drive turns out, the back doorbell does not see the driveway. Plus K has the flowers delivered to the side door because it is easier to place the big arrangements in the house without negotiating the obstacles in the kitchen.


Stay cool and investigate. You need more evidence, I would try to check the phone for apps / deleted texts / especially with the male employees. Work affairs are the most common. Will the kids be in camp during the day when your next trip is set to occur?


----------



## re16

HommeNu said:


> Do people affair down?


Yes, almost more often than not.


----------



## HommeNu

re16 said:


> Wednesday is a day you are normally out of town?
> 
> ETA: If flower boy was in the house on the toilet seat day, that's your answer to who used the toilet.


Yes, when I travel, which is usually 2-3 weeks per month, it is often mid-week over Wednesdays. But you are right, it could have been the van driver sneaking a pee. I thought of that too. But why would he sneak a pee upstairs in the guest room toilet when he could use the guest toilet which is located on the main floor under the stairs. Of course, maybe he was looking for something to steal and was suddenly overcome with the urge to micturate.


----------



## HommeNu

re16 said:


> Yes, almost more often than not.


Really?! Is there a psychological explanation for that? It seems counter-intutive.


----------



## re16

HommeNu said:


> Yes, when I travel, which is usually 2-3 weeks per month, it is often mid-week over Wednesdays. But you are right, it could have been the van driver sneaking a pee. I thought of that too. But why would he sneak a pee upstairs in the guest room toilet when he could use the guest toilet which is located on the main floor under the stairs. Of course, maybe he was looking for something to steal and was suddenly overcome with the urge to micturate.


Or he was conducting other business in the guest room...


----------



## HommeNu

re16 said:


> Stay cool and investigate. You need more evidence, I would try to check the phone for apps / deleted texts / especially with the male employees. Work affairs are the most common. Will the kids be in camp during the day when your next trip is set to occur?


Yes, next week. I will be leaving on Tuesday, back on Thursday, and they will be in camps. I am not sure I can wait a week to find out though. This is eating me up inside. I just want to go confront her and ask her for some explanations.


----------



## re16

HommeNu said:


> Really?! Is there a psychological explanation for that? It seems counter-intutive.


Sex for compliments is the typical exchange. If he is complimenting her, she may be more into the ego boost than someone's looks. The affair partner doesn't need to be a good provider, because that is not their role in the affair.


----------



## re16

HommeNu said:


> Yes, next week. I will be leaving on Tuesday, back on Thursday, and they will be in camps. I am not sure I can wait a week to find out though. This is eating me up inside. I just want to go confront her and ask her for some explanations.


Whatever you do, do not confront. You may feel satisified by the answers at the time, but not knowing can eat you alive for years. DO NOT CONFRONT WITHOUT EVIDENCE.


----------



## SRCSRC

I would consider hiring a P.I. to watch her during your trip out of town next week. If she planned something but had to cancel when you cancelled your trip, she should be easy to catch by the P.I. next week.


----------



## re16

Does flower boy have a key or access to a key to the house?


----------



## pastasauce79

HommeNu said:


> why would you not tell your husband that you are wearing a thong to avoid panty lines? It seems like it shouldn't be an issue. Just curious.


I don't think my husband would notice if I'm wearing a thong, seamless underwear, or no underwear. I buy clothes without letting him know and I wear whatever without letting him know. 

Do you do any laundry at home? This could be a way to ask about the thongs and the dildo. You put clothes up and "oh surprise" you saw the thongs or the dildo in her drawer. Ask questions then. 

I really have no clue what's going on with your wife. Both, the dildo and the thongs could be a red flag or not. I really don't know.


----------



## SRCSRC

Don't be fooled by thinking your wife would never consider sleeping with the flower boy. I worked with an attorney who surprised his girlfriend one day by showing up unannounced at her home for lunch. He caught her sleeping with the gardener.


----------



## Willnotbill

@HommeNu In my opinion you need to be patient and gather all the information and evidence that you can. If you find proof of cheating you will need that when you confront. Knowledge is power in a confrontation. If you don't have proof she will likely deny, deny and deny again and then try to shift the blame to you for being paranoid and an untrustworthy husband. Its hard to keep quiet but its in your best interest. Don't forget that even though there are some red flags there might not be nothing going on. I hope this is the case for you and its another reason to be patient. I also recommend a PI. They really are worth the money or at least they were for me.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

HommeNu said:


> Yes, next week. I will be leaving on Tuesday, back on Thursday, and they will be in camps. I am not sure I can wait a week to find out though. This is eating me up inside. I just want to go confront her and ask her for some explanations.


I think you have to wait at least a week while you are out of town just to have some video while you are away. I also think it is overboard to get a PI, as others have suggested. I am firmly in the camp that nothing is going on and if you go too far you are going to damage your relationship with your wife. Yes, there are some things you want answered, but cheating? I don't see it. Plain cotton thongs buried in a drawer, some with price tags still on. That doesn't sound like cheating. It sounds like maybe she bought a 5 pack or something a while back because she had to wear one because of a particular outfit, but since she doesn't care for them they are stuffed in the back of the drawer. Toilet seat up, that is a complete non issue to me. She is still having sex with you. Doesn't seem to try to hide her phone and you found nothing out of the ordinary in the phone bill as I recall. Even the dildo, which you may want to know about, but how does that bring up infidelity concerns? I would want to know what was up with the monster dong, but I wouldn't have cheating on my mind because of it. Even the distance you are sensing from her. That could be something, but doesn't have to be infidelity, and I don't think you will get an answer by snooping around. Even the sum total of all these things doesn't add up to cheating in my opinion.

The tough question is how do you ask her about these things when you don't find a smoking gun? You need to think about how you are going to ask her about the dildo, thongs, and distance. The distance should be easy. You should be asking her about it because you are concerned for her. For the dildo I suppose you could say you found it while looking for anything missing because of the toilet seat "incident". I don't really know how you ask about the thongs. How do you explain why you were digging around in the back of her underwear drawer? Maybe fixing a broken drawer? You need a good explanation.

I think your idea of popping in for lunch is good. I think it gives you a chance to somewhat check up on her and it could also be an opportunity to mention the distance you have been noticing. Maybe shows you actually care and are concerned.

That's my opinion. I could be completely wrong and she could be up to something, but I hope I'm not and I don't think I am.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

SRCSRC said:


> Don't be fooled by thinking your wife would never consider sleeping with the flower boy. I worked with an attorney who surprised his girlfriend one day by showing up unannounced at her home for lunch. He caught her sleeping with the gardener.


Yeah, but gardeners and pool boys are hot, delivery guys, not so much


----------



## Talker67

sometimes it is only paranoia.
did she clean the toilet and leave the seat up?
Did one of your daughters have a BF over when nobody else was home?


----------



## ABHale

HommeNu said:


> Not quite, but you've got the idea. Whichever driver it is, he comes through the side door (garage is not attached to the house) and there was not a camera on that location, but there is an Arlo pointing at it now. I should learn more during tomorrow's delivery.
> 
> It is very hard to imagine my wife banging one of her employees. I mean that is just not done. And the van drivers are, gosh I don't mean to be unkind, but they are not really her kind of people. Oh, that sounds snobbish, but there it is. Do people affair down? I mean, why?


Yes they do. Every day.


----------



## ABHale

HommeNu said:


> Yes, when I travel, which is usually 2-3 weeks per month, it is often mid-week over Wednesdays. But you are right, it could have been the van driver sneaking a pee. I thought of that too. But why would he sneak a pee upstairs in the guest room toilet when he could use the guest toilet which is located on the main floor under the stairs. Of course, maybe he was looking for something to steal and was suddenly overcome with the urge to micturate.


Or the guest room toilet was convenient to the guest room bed.

I would suggest looking the guest bedroom over when you wife is at work tomorrow.


----------



## Beach123

Or place a camera in that bedroom area.

when my kids were growing up…no one left the seat or the lid open. ALL was closed every time the toilet was used. If the lid was even left up it would have signaled to anyone in the house that an outsider had been in that bathroom.


----------



## Evinrude58

HommeNu said:


> Do you think I should ask her about these things? I've been feeling very discombobulated since I found it. Maybe I should just sit down and tell what I found and that I've been feeling off, and ask her to let me into her world again. I don't know. It is going to be hard to sleep imagining her using that thing. I can't believe that she does. She's "not a dildo person." Vibes yes, but not simple dildos yet she has this monster in her closet. So if it is not hers, who's is it and why is it here? No, it must be hers, right? Ugh.


No, do NOT EVER ask questions pertaining to infidelity to which you don’t know the answer.
The thong, maybe... dildo, not a huge deal. Well huge. Maybe not a huge problem.
Plus you’ll embarrass your wife.
Btw, you staying home is not going to fire up your wife. Take her on a fancy, but short vacation. Take her to a nice restaurant and spend the night in a nice hotel. Tell her ahead of time, but you’ve arranged it already and want to know if you should cancel. 
her response if you tell her you’ve planned a weekend at a neat vacation spot with a bed and breakfast, and have a sitter...,,,, if she says no, you have a problem. If she gets excited and happy, you might need to step up to the dating and taking her somewhere once in a while. I don’t know if you do or not already. It’s just ideas. I think it’s the relationship you need to work on more than the cheating wife.


----------



## Evinrude58

Didn’t realize you had three new pages, which I just read. My thoughts:

I’m no expert, but don’t women sometimes wear thongs so their panty line doesn’t show when they’re wearing certain things?

she’s wanting sex a lot before you go and when you return. That’s about the healthiest indicator I can think of for a wife that misses and loves her husband. I could be wrong, but I’m normally leaning toward thinking cheating is occurring, but I don’t in your case.

I don’t think these red flags are all that telling. They’re weak at best. Ask your wife if she’d like to go off on a long vacation with you. If she does, you should go! How valuable is your relationship with your wife? She’s distant? Well close that distance and bond with her. Go out of your way to satisfy her in bed. Spice things up a little. 
I don’t think a woman who is cheating would want sex before and when you return, and wouldn’t want to spend a long vacation with you. Maybe if she had a guy for pure sex with and nothing emotional. And I just don’t see any real evidence of that.

I thi k you’re going to screw up and embarrass your wife, show her you don’t trust her at all with the Cameras and such, and further increase the distance. I’m all for going detective when suspicions arise, but you had better be darn careful with your detective work.

I’m not at all convinced she’s cheating. I could be wrong.


----------



## CrAzYdOgLaDy

I don't think any of this points towards your wife having an affair. You do need peace of mind though because you feel as though something is going on. Hope you get answers soon so you can put these worries to rest.

Sent from my SM-G970F using Tapatalk


----------



## jparistotle

HommeNu said:


> Because she knows that rooting around in her undergarments is not something I normally do. The opposite, I try to get her out of her panties. Or I did. To be fair, they were tucked in the back corner under all the other panties. A couple still have price tags on them.
> [/QUOTE
> I assume she has never worn them around you or you never noticed. I would suggest cheking the laundry once in a while and then ask "are these new" if you happen to see them in the laundry


----------



## ABHale

Something is up. It may or may not be that she is cheating.

Almost all BS feel a disconnect from the WS when they are cheating.

BS feel that their SO is vacant during sex like OP is feeling here lately.

Then the Look she had when he said he wasn’t going out of town this week.

Something is up.


----------



## ABHale

Why are people focusing on her underwear? Does it really matter? I am assuming they dress and undress in front of one another on a regular basis. I know that I would notice if my wife started wearing butt floss, she has said no way would she ever. So having something that she said she would never wear in her draw would be a read flag, especially if they have been worn but not around me.


----------



## TDSC60

My friend had a job that required frequent travel. Turns out she was having her boy-toy come to his house when he was away.

When he caught her, she told him she never used their bed, only the one in the guest bedroom. She did not want to "soil" their marital bed. Makes no sense, but then, the thoughts of a cheating wife rarely ever makes sense to the betrayed husband.

Motion activated camera in the guest room would catch the activity if there is anything to catch. You can get one that sends and alert to your phone if motion is detected.


----------



## jsmart

TDSC60 said:


> My friend had a job that required frequent travel. Turns out she was having her boy-toy come to his house when he was away.
> 
> When he caught her, she told him she never used their bed, only the one in the guest bedroom. She did not want to "soil" their marital bed. Makes no sense, but then, the thoughts of a cheating wife rarely ever makes sense to the betrayed husband.
> 
> Motion activated camera in the guest room would catch the activity if there is anything to catch. You can get one that sends and alert to your phone if motion is detected.


Having their AP in their guess bedroom is probably more common. I thinks it’s a way that a WW can reduce her guilt. Cici did it in her guest bedroom and had the thought in her head that doing it in her marital bed was taking it too far. 

I’m not convinced there’s cheating but he shouldn’t ignore his gut.


----------



## mickybill

FWIW I think large dildo is hidden because she may think it's "naughty" and not like her other toys, if it is larger than you then that's another reason for her to keep it to herself. Probalbly would die of embarrassment if you brought it out like evidence of a crime.
The idea that he mystery man had one made of himself is in my opinion, absurd.
Panties, maybe they were 10 for $20 at Target I dunno?


----------



## GusPolinski

HommeNu said:


> Yes, next week. I will be leaving on Tuesday, back on Thursday, and they will be in camps. I am not sure I can wait a week to find out though. This is eating me up inside. I just want to go confront her and ask her for some explanations.


I'm generally not a fan of deception, but I'm also not one to discourage a potential BS from using the tools available to him (or her); with that in mind, you should consider telling her that you'll be back at home on Friday... and then returning on Thursday evening.


----------



## ccpowerslave

mickybill said:


> Probalbly would die of embarrassment if you brought it out like evidence of a crime.


Maybe draw a chalk outline around it then add a couple small traffic cones so it doesn’t get stepped on and crime scene tape across the door and maybe a couple flood lights on it powered by a gas generator outside with an extension cord run in.

Le grande reveal!

I just plugged a vibrator into a USB charger and left it out on the coffee table. I plan on using that thing on my wife tonight and if she sees even better! I bought a pack of colored chalk to join in the sidewalk art fun during the pandemic but I think if I decorate the table it wouldn’t be good for me.


----------



## Evinrude58

I have to admit if my SO had a huge Dildo I’d be feeling a little insecure...🤔🤓


----------



## ccpowerslave

Evinrude58 said:


> I have to admit if my SO had a huge Dildo I’d be feeling a little insecure...🤔🤓


Haha if I found one I’d be thinking sleeves. I am not packing that much heat.


----------



## Blondilocks

Maybe she confiscated the dildo from your daughter. 

Maybe she bought the thongs to try to get used to wearing them before strutting her stuff for you. Or, she bought them as a gift for your daughter. 

Put a camera in your closet and see if she goes for the dildo.


----------



## Tatsuhiko

ccpowerslave said:


> Haha if I found one I’d be thinking sleeves. I am not packing that much heat.


Heat? Or perhaps... meat?


----------



## Tobyboy

Thongs(when she normally don’t wear them), Oversized dildo(not in her usual arsenal drawer) would lead me to think that these are mostly used for visual effects. But for who’s pleasure?


----------



## VladDracul

Tobyboy said:


> Oversized dildo(not in her usual arsenal drawer) would lead me to think that these are mostly used for visual effects.


Anything else would be pretty much of a stretch


----------



## snerg

VladDracul said:


> Anything else would be pretty much of a stretch


I see what you did there


----------



## HommeNu

It's been a minute. First an update. I decided to go ahead and surprise K for an early lunch yesterday. At first it was great. She was totally surprised, and seemed pleased to see me. We went around the corner to a favorite little pub where I had my favorite local burger. We even sat next to each other like teenagers rather than across from each other. It was really nice. I walked her back to her shop afterwards and we talked a little about her business. She's having trouble getting flowers in from Asia. I know she is stressed about it. That was the "good." Than I asked her if she wanted to come home for a post-lunch nooner, but she took a pass saying she had to meet some staff which disappointed me. One of her general complaints is that our sex life is not spontaneous enough and here I cancelled a trip, surprised her with lunch, and offered her afternoon delight in our empty house and she said no. Then reminded me that the house was not guaranteed empty because the kids are just out and about. That was the "bad." Our intimacy still seems out of sync. On another note, our weekly delivery of flowers was delivered while I was out. I asked K how the delivery guy got into the house if the girls aren't there to let him in. She said that she keeps a key to the side door on the wall at the shop and the delivery guy takes it and lets himself in. So there is that question answered. 

Someone asked about the delivery drivers. Let's call them Tom and Jerry. Tom is in his mid 20s, an inked skater-type, seems a little lost in the fog of dope, ambitious-less, but super-cute according to my daughters. He has a girlfriend. Jerry is 10+ years older, I'd guess, a little rough, short, mostly lazy, gadfly about town kind of guy. He seems to know everyone everywhere he goes. He has a wife who is clearly the main breadwinner based upon what my wife pays him. It is hard to imagine either of them with K. Tom is so young much closer to our children's ages and Jerry is so, well, rough. God, even as I type the I can hear the English phrase "she likes a bit of rough" in my head. Hmm. I was already to dismiss the drivers but now want to rethink Jerry. Back to the cell phone records I go now that I have a number I could focus on.

The rest of the night was mostly unremarkable. K was a little grumbly, but so were the kids so who knows. I had hoped K might belatedly take me up on my nooner offer, but she was not interested and rolled over as soon as I climbed into bed. I told her this morning that I thought that was an odd reaction after the good day we had, but she said she was PMSing. Now back to mining the phone bills. I am also looking for her computer password list--the paper backup. I think the youngest might know where it is. But I don't really want to involve her.


----------



## re16

Good update, glad you resisted confronting.

The no on the nooner could really be she had something scheduled... but could be part of something broader.

Keep digging but don't accuse / question her yet. I agree with others that you don't want to do damage over something that we're not sure is real.

Now at least you know that other males have access to your house and that could explain the toilet seat. Seems like you would know about anyone who has access to your house though...


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## Lostinthought61

have you thought of putting a camera in the house ? so you can see the coming and going in the house?

also have you thought of hiding the giant dildo on her and see what she say?


----------



## re16

Lostinthought61 said:


> also have you thought of hiding the giant dildo on her and see what she say?


Thats a conversation starter....


----------



## maquiscat

HommeNu said:


> On another note, our weekly delivery of flowers was delivered while I was out. I asked K how the delivery guy got into the house if the girls aren't there to let him in. She said that she keeps a key to the side door on the wall at the shop and the delivery guy takes it and lets himself in. So there is that question answered.


Given this, I'm wondering if the whole toilet seat things is simply one of the drivers used that bathroom, and your wife not daughters are not having anyone untowards over.


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## cocolo2019

Hiding the dildo could create the stage for a confrontation. 
It is better to lay low while investigating.


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## re16

I would likely wait a while to discuss anything about what you found and just stay watchful, like for a couple of months...


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## Willnotbill

HommeNu said:


> It's been a minute. First an update. I decided to go ahead and surprise K for an early lunch yesterday. At first it was great. She was totally surprised, and seemed pleased to see me. We went around the corner to a favorite little pub where I had my favorite local burger. We even sat next to each other like teenagers rather than across from each other. It was really nice. I walked her back to her shop afterwards and we talked a little about her business. She's having trouble getting flowers in from Asia. I know she is stressed about it. That was the "good." Than I asked her if she wanted to come home for a post-lunch nooner, but she took a pass saying she had to meet some staff which disappointed me. One of her general complaints is that our sex life is not spontaneous enough and here I cancelled a trip, surprised her with lunch, and offered her afternoon delight in our empty house and she said no. Then reminded me that the house was not guaranteed empty because the kids are just out and about. That was the "bad." Our intimacy still seems out of sync. On another note, our weekly delivery of flowers was delivered while I was out. I asked K how the delivery guy got into the house if the girls aren't there to let him in. She said that she keeps a key to the side door on the wall at the shop and the delivery guy takes it and lets himself in. So there is that question answered.


Since you mentioned your sex life is a little off right now you might try asking her what you (both of you) could do to help. You could ask her if she would like to try a new toy and go online together and look at the Adam and Eve catalog. Show her different things including the bigger dildos. Don't fixate on it just use it as another option and see what she has to say. She might surprise you and show you what she already bought. The more I read your story the less I think she's stepping out.


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## Galabar01

Could one of the delivery drivers just used the toilet and left the seat up (during a delivery)?


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## Jeffsmith35

Why the delivery driver would go all the way upstairs vs. using the more convenient and closer toilet location is the lingering red flag.


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## Jeffsmith35

My guess is Tom.


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## mickybill

That's something Jerry would totally do.


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## ccpowerslave

Tom & Jerry the classic duo.

Hopefully nobody!


----------



## Wolfman1968

HommeNu said:


> Yes, next week. I will be leaving on Tuesday, back on Thursday, and they will be in camps. I am not sure I can wait a week to find out though. This is eating me up inside. I just want to go confront her and ask her for some explanations.


NOOOOOOO!!!!

Read the Weightlifter's Standard Evidence Post


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## Blondilocks

Your wife does know that a driver could make a duplicate of the key, doesn't she? That's rather careless security wise - you have kids in the house. Wonder how many keys to that door are floating around. I'd re-key it.


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## Willnotbill

Blondilocks said:


> Your wife does know that a driver could make a duplicate of the key, doesn't she? That's rather careless security wise - you have kids in the house. Wonder how many keys to that door are floating around. I'd re-key it.


I agree with this. Just for the safety of your family I would re-key the house locks. I don't think its a good idea to let employees or anyone outside the immediate family have access to your house keys.


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## Jeffsmith35

"Tom is in his mid 20s, an inked skater-type, seems a little lost in the fog of dope, ambitious-less, but super-cute according to my daughters"...

I just had a thought: Could it be that Tom is visiting your oldest daughter?


----------



## In Absentia

re16 said:


> The no on the nooner could really be she had something scheduled... but could be part of something broader.


It's probably because she thought he surprised her with a nice lunch with an ulterior motive: to get in her knickers.


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## mickybill

I sort of see you heading for a cliff and hope that you take breath before going over it.

If you are willing to blow things up before your trip, that's up to you, but I sure hope you rethink that plan. Seriously, drop a bomb like that and then leave town? Not cool bro.
If you have no real evidence and accuse her of infidelity it may take years for the trust to come back if she did not stray, but if she did...

On one hand your only "evidence" is seeing the toilet seat up...no empty beer cans and Xtra Jumbo sized condom wrappers in the trash. No neighbor saying they see a yellow Porsche 911 in your driveway on the days when you are out of town. Not even dudes hanging around with your daughters. The big toy might be her naughty pleasure or it may remind her of her lover. But I think it is just a thing she may use when you are out of town every week...but she seems to like it when you are home again.
On the other hand you are here on an infidelity site. Something brought you here and it must be more than the toilet seat...This site is great and full of people who have experienced infidelity so there can be a "If all you have is a hammer everything looks like a nail" thought process. 
Many people with small businesses have been under a lot of pressure the last year...a flower shop (with a supply chain to Asia) may have made $$$ doing weddings and events in 2019 but not 2020, events are only now coming back. So maybe the lunch was fun and a nice break but the nooner was a bit too spontaneous that day for a multitude of reasons, for example my GF likes to have a meal after sex, not before. 
But I'm afraid some here would say that if she did take you up the nooner opportunity, it would prove she was having an affair...

Sorry for the wall of text and I could be totally wrong, she may be having an affair. Anything is possible. If I was judge I'd say go get me some real evidence then come back. Maybe your new cameras will have the answer. 

Good luck


----------



## Beach123

Does your wife know you installed more cameras?


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## BigDaddyNY

Beach123 said:


> Does your wife know you installed more cameras?


That would pretty much make them useless.


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## CountryMike

cocolo2019 said:


> Hiding the dildo could create the stage for a confrontation.
> It is better to lay low while investigating.


Nah, hide the dildo. Just to see how it goes.

C'mon, you know you want to.


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## Tatsuhiko

Here's what will happen if you confront now: She will deny everything and be very believable. She will have explanations and alibis for everything. She will put a temporary stop to any affair she's having.

Then you'll spend the rest of your life wondering, but never knowing, if she had an affair.


----------



## Cletus

Tatsuhiko said:


> Then you'll spend the rest of your life wondering, but never knowing, if she had an affair.


Something tells me this is inevitable, regardless of what his wife does or does not do.


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## VladDracul

re16 said:


> but could be part of something broader.


There you go bring up the bid dildo again!


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## Evinrude58

I’ve yet to hear exactly what this distance he describes looks like. Good sex before and after he leaves for a trip? Not usually from a cheating wife.

I think this whole thing is a wild goose chase.
Nothing to find, nothing to catch. Or he’s have found something.


----------



## ABHale

maquiscat said:


> Given this, I'm wondering if the whole toilet seat things is simply one of the drivers used that bathroom, and your wife not daughters are not having anyone untowards over.


I could agree with the toilet seat being up if it was in the downstairs bathroom, why go up to the guest bathroom and use it.

Daughters, maybe.

There is still the disconnect OP feels and it isn’t getting any better.


----------



## maquiscat

ABHale said:


> I could agree with the toilet seat being up if it was in the downstairs bathroom, why go up to the guest bathroom and use it.
> 
> Daughters, maybe.
> 
> There is still the disconnect OP feels and it isn’t getting any better.


True enough but a disconnect isn't automatically an affair.

Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


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## Harold Demure

If the flower delivery man has a key and the seat in the upstairs toilet is up, I would be concerned about what the delivery man may be doing in the house. Is he looking around your house when no one else is there? Referring back to post #33, she did freak out over security. How long does he spend in the house each delivery?

Sorry, have forgotten, are the thongs an ongoing issue? Have they all been worn?

The trouble here is that it is very difficult to prove a negative. You are not going to find definitive proof that she is not having an affair, only that there is no evidence to show that she is.

I think the only way you can guarantee you know if anything is going on is to hire a PI. Otherwise, I would carry on doing what you are currently doing, varying your schedule, surprise lunches etc. However, I would carry on doing this not to keep her on her toes and disrupt any shenanigans but for all the good it will do for your relationship by keeping it fresh and your wife feeling loved.


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## In Absentia

Harold Demure said:


> Sorry, have forgotten, are the thongs an ongoing issue? Have they all been worn?


I'm more interested in the monster dildo...


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## Jeffsmith35

OP, praying for you to return on Thursday to find no evidence and a good outcome.


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## nate__00

I am guessing that there is no affair here


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## Killi

Hopefully no affair


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## Mr.Married

She is in big trouble if there are ever two toilet seats up. That would mean there is a threesome going on. Let’s see her explain that !!!!


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## HommeNu

Good morning all. I decided to take a break and think about everything you all said. I began to worry that I way overreacted. So, rather than worry about the past or the future, I decided to be present for the entire weekend. We had a good, normal weekend and beginning of the week. The girls started camps yesterday so a lot of the weekend was spent running errands in 10 different directions getting ready. I leave this morning on a 2-night trip returning Thursday afternoon. I agree with you all that if anything is going on, which I hope there is not, then it will probably happen while I am gone. I will be watching the Arlo cameras; I will let you know.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

HommeNu said:


> Good morning all. I decided to take a break and think about everything you all said. I began to worry that I way overreacted. So, rather than worry about the past or the future, I decided to be present for the entire weekend. We had a good, normal weekend and beginning of the week. The girls started camps yesterday so a lot of the weekend was spent running errands in 10 different directions getting ready. I leave this morning on a 2-night trip returning Thursday afternoon. I agree with you all that if anything is going on, which I hope there is not, then it will probably happen while I am gone. I will be watching the Arlo cameras; I will let you know.


Good choice to take a deep breath and not let this consume you. I truly hope you find nothing and I really believe that will be the case.


----------



## Rus47

HommeNu said:


> Good morning all. I decided to take a break and think about everything you all said. I began to worry that I way overreacted. So, rather than worry about the past or the future, I decided to be present for the entire weekend. We had a good, normal weekend and beginning of the week. The girls started camps yesterday so a lot of the weekend was spent running errands in 10 different directions getting ready. I leave this morning on a 2-night trip returning Thursday afternoon. I agree with you all that if anything is going on, which I hope there is not, then it will probably happen while I am gone. I will be watching the Arlo cameras; I will let you know.


I would be tempted to advertise longer than actual business trip and arrive home unexepectedly. Of course I am devious SOB 😊

Also playing detective too much work. Not sure what PI cost but personally invest lin professional rather than trying to play one


----------



## moulinyx

Rus47 said:


> I would be tempted to advertise longer than actual business trip and arrive home unexepectedly. Of course I am devious SOB 😊
> 
> Also playing detective too much work. Not sure what PI cost but personally invest lin professional rather than trying to play one


I agree with the PI if you still feel that gut feeling after your trip. It’s easy to spiral into an obsession that is hard to climb out of. Your mental health needs to be #1 so you can continue being a functional member of society.

Do you still plan on mentioning your “closet findings”? As a wife I did find the hidden sex toy to be strange - but I guess not everyone is as open about sex? I also think it could have been a gag gift. Didn’t strike me as something that would indicate cheating though.


----------



## re16

HN, I hope you were able to enjoy your trip. Hopefully the cameras didn't catch anything suspicious.... were you watching them remotely?


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## Jeffsmith35

Still praying for a good outcome, HN.


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## re16

Starting to think maybe the camera caught something....


----------



## BigDaddyNY

re16 said:


> Starting to think maybe the camera caught something....


Or the wife found the camera and beat him with the monster dildo.

Seriously though, I hope all is good and this was nothing.


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## No Longer Lonely Husband

I sent the name of this thread to a pal of mine in Nashville....he is writing a song about finding the toilet seat up....crazy what you can do with a hook like that in a song....


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## Blondilocks

BigDaddyNY said:


> *Or the wife found the camera and beat him with the monster dildo.*
> 
> Seriously though, I hope all is good and this was nothing.


I can see the headline now: Death by Dildo


----------



## Andy1001

No Longer Lonely Husband said:


> I sent the name of this thread to a pal of mine in Nashville....he is writing a song about finding the toilet seat up....crazy what you can do with a hook like that in a song....


He could call it “Flushing my dreams away”.


----------



## Willnotbill

I hope the OP found his wife isn't cheating and he can give us an update.


----------



## Harold Demure

Hey HommeNu, how are you doing. Saw that you last looked on here 9 hours but no update from Thursday.

Hope everything is okay and that you are doing well.


----------



## Chippy

OnTheRocks said:


> Sounds like nothing to me, but trust your gut, keep your mouth shut, and eyes open. You already showed your hand by asking her about it. She will go into lockdown mode now if something is actually up.
> 
> Side note: I really don't get why it's considered a man's job to put toilet seats down. I am responsible enough to look down before I piss all over the ring. Why do many women expect to have it all prepared for them when they arrive to do their business? My gf and I live separately, and she demands I put it up at her house, which I comply with because it's her house. I never put it down at my house, which is admittedly passive aggressive but it brings me a little joy. It has never even crossed my mind to demand she put it back up at my house... Until today.


Why do toilets have lids....to be shut when not in use!


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## nate__00

Would honestly be shocked if there was anything worth reporting


----------



## maquiscat

nate__00 said:


> Would honestly be shocked if there was anything worth reporting


I would think that even nothing happened would be worth it. After all, that would be the good news we'd like to see.

Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


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## BigDaddyNY

maquiscat said:


> I would think that even nothing happened would be worth it. After all, that would be the good news we'd like to see.
> 
> Sent from my cp3705A using Tapatalk


You got that right. I wish there were more good news reports around here. It would be nice to see, oh it was nothing and we are all good.


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## Jeffsmith35

HN, we are here for you, no matter what. Please let us know if you need anything.


----------



## VladDracul

It could be like me seeing my buddy in his empty truck about two hours after seeing him with about cubic yard of cow manure compost for his project. He unload it and moved on to something else.


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## Chillidog

Looks like another 0P has left the yard.


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## Willnotbill

Maybe his wife found the hidden cameras and he is unable to post an update


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## EnglishErnest

I was recommended TAM by my wife and I've been at home ill today, started reading and couldn't help getting caught up this thread.

I think when you decided to stay present and spend the weekend just being with your family, that was a great idea.

Suffering is the stories we tell ourselves about the pain we feel. If you spend all your time assuming something bad is happening (a story) and thinking about it, that will ruin your days and keep you up at night. Just being in the present is something I've found really helpful in high anxiety times.

I'm not saying dont keep you eyes open, just also see the good things and the other things you enjoy.

Although this could be a bad thing, it could also become an opportunity for more intimacy, honesty and depth. I hope that is the direction this takes for you.


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## HommeNu

Hello everyone. As you can see I took a break from here to follow your advice to be quiet, observant, and not too obsessive. It has been good. You are all correct. I don't have anything new to report. The cameras have not picked up anything that I felt out of the ordinary. The only folks who come to the house with any regularity are family, a few service people like the mailwoman, the yard guys, the cleaning lady, the floral delivery guys, and the pool girl (yes, we have a once-a-week pool girl so make your jokes now, haha). I even saw the exterminator come and do his monthly service around the house, but nothing out of the ordinary or that caused me pause. The monster dildo remains untouched behind the sweaters, the thongs remain unworn in the drawer, and the toilet seats remain down on the pots. But the wife still shows signs of irritability and distraction. Or I am just reading too much into normal everyday stressors. I think we need to have a couples weekend soon. Anyway, I've kinda enjoyed watching the comings and goings around the house on the Arlo cameras so I am going to leave them up a few weeks longer and then I may transition them to more open and obvious spots for "security." So we are going to enjoy the holiday weekend now and I hope that you all do too. I hope you all have a merry Fourth!


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## ccpowerslave

Great report @HommeNu glad to hear you didn’t catch any nefarious activity!


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## HommeNu

No Longer Lonely Husband said:


> I sent the name of this thread to a pal of mine in Nashville....he is writing a song about finding the toilet seat up....crazy what you can do with a hook like that in a song....


This is TOO funny! I would love to hear the song someday. Thank you for making me laugh. Haha!


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## BigDaddyNY

HommeNu said:


> Hello everyone. As you can see I took a break from here to follow your advice to be quiet, observant, and not too obsessive. It has been good. You are all correct. I don't have anything new to report. The cameras have not picked up anything that I felt out of the ordinary. The only folks who come to the house with any regularity are family, a few service people like the mailwoman, the yard guys, the cleaning lady, the floral delivery guys, and the pool girl (yes, we have a once-a-week pool girl so make your jokes now, haha). I even saw the exterminator come and do his monthly service around the house, but nothing out of the ordinary or that caused me pause. The monster dildo remains untouched behind the sweaters, the thongs remain unworn in the drawer, and the toilet seats remain down on the pots. But the wife still shows signs of irritability and distraction. Or I am just reading too much into normal everyday stressors. I think we need to have a couples weekend soon. Anyway, I've kinda enjoyed watching the comings and goings around the house on the Arlo cameras so I am going to leave them up a few weeks longer and then I may transition them to more open and obvious spots for "security." So we are going to enjoy the holiday weekend now and I hope that you all do too. I hope you all have a merry Fourth!


That is awesome. I'm so happy to hear nothing came up. A couples weekend sounds like a great idea. Someday it would be interesting to find out what the deal is with that dildo, but that is no big deal. Hope you are your family have a great holiday weekend!


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## TXTrini

So... what are you gonna do about the monster dildo? 

I'd suggest dressing it up in dolls clothes just to see a reaction...maybe break the ice to talk about it. I'd be INSANELY curious.


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## ccpowerslave

TXTrini said:


> So... what are you gonna do about the monster dildo?
> 
> I'd suggest dressing it up in dolls clothes just to see a reaction...maybe break the ice to talk about it. I'd be INSANELY curious.


I lol’d.


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## ABHale

I think the thing to do is plan your couple only weekend and discuss what is wrong.


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## Evinrude58

I say if your wife is dark haired, put a big blob of long blond hair in the shower drAin.
😋


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## MattMatt

TXTrini said:


> So... what are you gonna do about the monster dildo?
> 
> I'd suggest dressing it up in dolls clothes just to see a reaction...maybe break the ice to talk about it. I'd be INSANELY curious.


And stick googly eyes on it, too.


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## LATERILUS79

TXTrini said:


> So... what are you gonna do about the monster dildo?
> 
> I'd suggest dressing it up in dolls clothes just to see a reaction...maybe break the ice to talk about it. I'd be INSANELY curious.


This is quite possibly the greatest idea ever. 😂😂😂

I can only imagine her face next tim she goes to pick it up.


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## TXTrini

LATERILUS79 said:


> This is quite possibly the greatest idea ever. 😂😂😂
> 
> I can only imagine her face next tim she goes to pick it up.


Wouldn't you want to know why your spouse had a secret mac daddy?


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## LATERILUS79

TXTrini said:


> Wouldn't you want to know why your spouse had a secret mac daddy?


EXACTLY. A dildo of that size needs a name too. 

Oh, what I wouldn't give to be a fly on wall when OP's wife walks up to him while holding a massive dildo dressed in doll's clothes. You could sell the movie rights to a story like that.


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## Elizabeth001

A girlfriend might have given it to her as a “gag” gift 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Evinrude58

Elizabeth001 said:


> A girlfriend might have given it to her as a “gag” gift
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


 It yet she kept it... lol


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## manwithnoname

Elizabeth001 said:


> A girlfriend might have given it to her as a “gag” gift
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Nicely done.


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## SRCSRC

It's great that you did not find anything suspicious after checking the video cameras, but don't let your guard down. Your gut is telling you something. A change in a wife's behavior concerning intimacy is a big red flag. If her behavior continues in that way, something is definitely wrong. It may or may not be an affair but there is a problem that must be ferreted out.


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## theloveofmylife

SRCSRC said:


> It may or may not be an affair but there is a problem that must be ferreted out.


@HommeNu is gone a lot. It's hard to keep a strong connection when your spouse is gone all the time. BTDT.

Sometimes, you start to feel a bit like strangers if you let things go.

It can also disrupt your entire routine when they return, even when you are glad they are back. It's not an easy position to be in.


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## manwithnoname

Toilet seat up is a not issue for me...too many things can explain it. 

The more serious issue is that she seemed annoyed that his planned business trip was not going to happen.


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## HommeNu

88 minutes. I finished up with my client in a midwestern city far from home, and am back in my hotel room. I just looked at the Arlos. Jerry--the older one--delivered the flower today. His delivery van was in our driveway by the side door and he was in my house for 88 minutes over the lunch hour today. And yes, K, was home the entire time. The doorbell camera logged her entrance and exit. 88 minutes! I don't even know what to think. What do I do now?! I want to call her right now and ask WTF. I think I am going to go throw up.


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## maquiscat

HommeNu said:


> 88 minutes. I finished up with my client in a midwestern city far from home, and am back in my hotel room. I just looked at the Arlos. Jerry--the older one--delivered the flower today. His delivery van was in our driveway by the side door and he was in my house for 88 minutes over the lunch hour today. And yes, K, was home the entire time. The doorbell camera logged her entrance and exit. 88 minutes! I don't even know what to think. What do I do now?! I want to call her right now and ask WTF. I think I am going to go throw up.


This is where you need to set your cameras up as to record who goes into what rooms. You don't necessarily want them in the rooms themselves as that can constitute invasion of privacy. And yes, because the cameras can be hacked or the recordings, there is a valid expectation of privacy in the bedrooms and bathrooms at the least. In the meantime, make sure the video and time stamps are recorded and stored, and gather more evidence. In the end, if she is doing something wrong, she won't be able to deny it. And even if she is not doing something wrong, then you take it to her and show her that she is putting forth actions that are misleading as to what they actually are.


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## SRCSRC

If you live in a no-fault state where infidelity is irrelevant, don't bother gathering too much more evidence. This would eat at me terribly. Maybe not the smartest move, but the lack of intimacy, her distancing, and general annoyance when your out-of-town trip was canceled would be enough for me to confront her now that you have suspicious video evidence. What in the hell was she doing home? Eighty-eight minutes! But that is me. I have been cheated on by my ex-wife and I just can't sit back anymore while I collect information. 

Other things to consider are in-house cameras, VARs, or hiring a P.I. Sorry for your situation. When a marriage seems off, there are usually good reasons behind it.


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## ccpowerslave

Bleh now I feel mild nausea too from reading that. Seems like a hard one to explain, although they do work together so maybe she just made him lunch.

I don’t know if I could wait if I was in your shoes I’d probably blow her up with what I had so far.


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## SRCSRC

What is the general status of your marriage right now? Do you still sense a distance? Is she short with you? How often do you have sex? How would you describe it?


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## re16

HommeNu said:


> 88 minutes. I finished up with my client in a midwestern city far from home, and am back in my hotel room. I just looked at the Arlos. Jerry--the older one--delivered the flower today. His delivery van was in our driveway by the side door and he was in my house for 88 minutes over the lunch hour today. And yes, K, was home the entire time. The doorbell camera logged her entrance and exit. 88 minutes! I don't even know what to think. What do I do now?! I want to call her right now and ask WTF. I think I am going to go throw up.


Flower boy it is.

I would keep this to yourself for the moment. A rush to confront will hurt not help. She will gaslight you and you won't really be able to say definitively one way or the other.

We all know what he was doing there.

This is going to blow up your family, you need undeniable proof.

ETA: If you can't wait, you bluff and say you have evidence and know what she is doing. When she denies, just be adament that you know she is lying. Do not reveal your sources (camera or otherwise) if you do confront. This is riskier than getting the hard evidence.


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## seadoug105

HommeNu said:


> 88 minutes. I finished up with my client in a midwestern city far from home, and am back in my hotel room. I just looked at the Arlos. Jerry--the older one--delivered the flower today. His delivery van was in our driveway by the side door and he was in my house for 88 minutes over the lunch hour today. And yes, K, was home the entire time. The doorbell camera logged her entrance and exit. 88 minutes! I don't even know what to think. What do I do now?! I want to call her right now and ask WTF. I think I am going to go throw up.


Just don’t. You will loose potentially huge intel source. Keep it to yourself… get home and check the toys and thongs…. And still keep quiet…. Regardless of what you find.

Start a narrative now that this meeting did not go well or that you have an issue with this client that will require a longer return visit. Then you can blame your inevitable distance on on your mind being preoccupied with the “issue that arose today while at X client”. During a longer “preplanned” stay in town and watch the cam feed…popping home if you need to check things out…. But this is greatly complicated if you have share location with her… 

Don’t discount or explain away the older dude… Because they always affair down. just think Ron Jeremy was considered desirable by some…. Perhaps he is so blessed….

My heart goes out to you, along with all my strength… because lord knows I probably couldn’t hold back calling her out..


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## ccpowerslave

You could risk it for the biscuit to avoid gaslighting and pretend the worst has happened and you already have evidence. Ex. List out all the stuff you know: distance, weird behavior, time codes, thongs, big purple knobbler, 88 minute flower guy session, and then there’s the recordings from the interior of the house... shake the tree and see what falls out.


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## re16

If you are not vaccinated, maybe you could fake a covid exposure and either stay longer or grab a hotel in your home town.

It is going to be very difficult not to tip your hand, but I think you should hold out if you can.

ETA: Major decision point here is if you are in a no-fault state or if you aren't as you could gain an advantage by divorcing for adultery.


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## HommeNu

I threw up.


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## re16

HommeNu said:


> I threw up.


HN, so sorry this is happening to you. We are all here to help. Do you have an ally that you can confide in like a sibling?

You are in for a rough ride. There will be many emotions, I think I would focus on anger and letting yourself feel that to steel yourself to take appropriate and calculated actions.

Does Jerry have a wife / gf?

It seems your wife has thrown away the life you built together for some hanky with a relative loser.

You now need to protect yourself / your assests / and custody of your children to the greatest extent possible. All decisions need to center on these goals.

When were you supposed to go home?


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## re16

Ideally, before you confront:

1. You have met with as many of the top attorneys in town as you can for a consult. This gives you general do's and don'ts and once you've talked to them, she can't use them. When you confront, her likely first step will be to meet with an attorney and you'll be a step ahead when she is blocked because of your actions.

2. You need prepare for the confrontation by knowing what you will ask and you how will handle gaslighting and denials. Tell her that any lies or omissions will result in immediate divorce and make her provide a detailed timeline of the affair in writing, this will make it hard for her change her story.

3. Most of us here will be of the opinion that reconciliation is very unlikely to be successful and will be advising you to divorce. You'll need to be clear about what is and what isn't a deal-breaker for you. Some choose to reconcile, but it is a long arduous road fraught with pitfalls that ends in a less than ideal scenario, in the best case. If you go or even consider the "R" route, you'll need to be clear about your plans so you receive proper advice.

4. If you are in at-fault state, you likely should have a PI document what she is doing.

5. Be ready to shift 50% of funds out of her control and have new accounts in your name only ready for that.

6. Have a backup plan for separate living arrangements should that occur.

7. Notify work that you will be needing some time off.

8. Understand the financial and custodial implications and parameters of the divorce process.

9. Be prepared with VARs etc and potentially someone else around so she has no chance to falsely accuse you of anything.

10. Setup an STD test for yourself.

11. Decide if a confrontation is even necessary or if you would rather just have her served and begin moving on.

12. Just after you confront or serve her, contact the AP's spouse or significant other to inform them and compare notes, they may already have good intel, and or they may need to know.

13. Avoid sex with her and absolutely do not get her pregnant.

All of this will take some action and time to prepare.....hence why we're saying don't confront yet. You currently have a massive advantage and you want to keep it that way.


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## Rus47

HommeNu said:


> 88 minutes. I finished up with my client in a midwestern city far from home, and am back in my hotel room. I just looked at the Arlos. Jerry--the older one--delivered the flower today. His delivery van was in our driveway by the side door and he was in my house for 88 minutes over the lunch hour today. And yes, K, was home the entire time. The doorbell camera logged her entrance and exit. 88 minutes! I don't even know what to think. What do I do now?! I want to call her right now and ask WTF. I think I am going to go throw up.


You already know what was/is going on. No need to call her and ask, she will just lie. No need to play detective or collect any more evidence. You already have more than enough. All that matters is what are you going to do about it. Maybe Jerry has something akin to the dildo that you discovered. Maybe he has been delivering more than flowers to other ladies in your town.


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## Elizabeth001

I would opt for undeniable evidence. Cameras on whatever guest room is nearest to the toilet seat that was left up. 

You need to breathe and think rationally …or wait until you can. Not the time for rash decisions. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Willnotbill

There is the possibility that there is a good excuse for the 88 minute visit and nothing happened. I would not confront until you know for sure what's going on. You don't necessarily need the smoking gun video but you do need to know and not just have a hunch because she will deny everything.

At this point I would do one of two things. 

1. Hire a PI and go out of town on business. I'm sure they will get you some answers.

2. Place a VAR in your bedroom and guest room or anywhere you think the deed might be taking place. Just make sure they won't be found. Also be prepared to hear things from you kids you don't want to hear too.

I still prefer the PI. You also might set up a business trip ASAP and stay in town. If you are close enough to the house and see something on the camera you can make a "surprise" visit. There would be no denying it then.

I know its tough but keep quiet and don't tip your hand. Hell, its not tough, its plain torture but its what is needed until you know for sure.


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## Elizabeth001

re16 said:


> Ideally, before you confront:
> 
> 1. You have met with as many of the top attorneys in town as you can for a consult. This gives you general do's and don'ts and once you've talked to them, she can't use them. When you confront, her likely first step will be to meet with an attorney and you'll be a step ahead when she is blocked because of your actions.
> 
> 2. You need prepare for the confrontation by knowing what you will ask and you how will handle gaslighting and denials. Tell her that any lies or omissions will result in immediate divorce and make her provide a detailed timeline of the affair in writing, this will make it hard for her change her story.
> 
> 3. Most of us here will be of the opinion that reconciliation is very unlikely to be successful and will be advising you to divorce. You'll need to be clear about what is and what isn't a deal-breaker for you. Some choose to reconcile, but it is a long arduous road fraught with pitfalls that ends in a less than ideal scenario, in the best case. If you go or even consider the "R" route, you'll need to be clear about your plans so you receive proper advice.
> 
> 4. If you are in at-fault state, you likely should have a PI document what she is doing.
> 
> 5. Be ready to shift 50% of funds out of her control and have new accounts in your name only ready for that.
> 
> 6. Have a backup plan for separate living arrangements should that occur.
> 
> 7. Notify work that you will be needing some time off.
> 
> 8. Understand the financial and custodial implications and parameters of the divorce process.
> 
> 9. Be prepared with VARs etc and potentially someone else around so she has no chance to falsely accuse you of anything.
> 
> 10. Setup an STD test for yourself.
> 
> 11. Decide if a confrontation is even necessary or if you would rather just have her served and begin moving on.
> 
> 12. Just after you confront or serve her, contact the AP's spouse or significant other to inform them and compare notes, they may already have good intel, and or they may need to know.
> 
> 13. Avoid sex with her and absolutely do not get her pregnant.
> 
> All of this will take some action and time to prepare.....hence why we're saying don't confront yet. You currently have a massive advantage and you want to keep it that way.


This should be a sticky!

Well done. _high 5_


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Marc878

HommeNu said:


> I threw up.


Sorry man but if you confront now all you’ll get will be lies. The deed is done and you cant change it. Think about this. Infidelity is a life long gift that’ll never fully go away. Upfront most just want them back.

What would you get back?

Im sure like most she’ll be sorry she got caught. She’ll more than likely blame you or you’ll just get more lies. Nothing happened. You’re crazy, etc.

Better think a bit before going down the confront road. Once you spill those beans you can’t get them back.

Does adultery count as far as alimony is concerned in your state? If it were me I’d consult with 3 attorneys before I did anything.

Many jump into R or even worse some stupid marriage councilor and live to regret it.

If it’s a deal breaker just file for D and save yourself years of pain. You don’t need to confront. Hell she knows.


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## Marc878

The one thing is the lack of a decision on your part will mean a longer stay in limbo. She may have put you here but you are the only one that will keep yourself there.

if you need a smoking gun go full force. VARs, PI, cameras. Don’t let this linger.

Have you checked your online phone bill? There are a lot of red flags with the thongs being the biggest one for this to be a coincidence but…..

Really sorry you’re here.


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## GusPolinski

Sorry man.

Be sure to note the position of certain items when you return home.

Also think about strategically deploying VARs and/or additional (hidden) cameras in the bedroom once you get back home.

Also be aware that the MBR might not be where the deed is being done — some WWs will use a guest room in an effort to convince themselves that they’re somehow being less disrespectful by not using the marital bed.


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## cocolo2019

OP fake the Covid and/or if you got the vaccine, fake it using the new variant as an excuse.
This way you can take time to think strategically. If you call pull this mummer"s farce, then try to get in the house when she is away and allocate the cameras and VARs in strategic points.
If you confront now they can come up with an excuse, like "the poor works a lot, he was starving and offered him to take a lunch in the house" and/or "how do you dare to think about me in that way", etc ,etc and the mother of gaslightings.

So try to get a more robust evidence and you can use it as a leverage in a future.

Edit: fixed a lot of typos


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## re16

HN, you OK? Stay with it, you’re entering the worst moments of your life right now.

Churchill said: “when you’re going through hell, keep going”…. You don’t want to get stuck where you are right now / today. You have to move forward, which means plan and then execute.

Run your plans by the group, roll with the feedback you like…. You can do this. We know what you’re feeling….


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## In Absentia

I hope this is the cute skater-type and not the other one...

EDIT: it's the other one!


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## Beach123

So she’s having an affair with the guy who’s married?
When you surprised her for lunch did he act odd? 
Didn’t she say she couldn’t have a nooner with you because she had to go meet an employee that afternoon? 
I’m sorry about this news… but don’t tell her you know until you get the undeniable evidence. She will lie and lie if you can’t prove it.
You may need a camera in the bedroom area. 

But if this is true - this is who she is…and you can’t change that about her. Basically, she isn’t who you thought she WAS.


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## Rus47

Beach123 said:


> So she’s having an affair with the guy who’s married?
> When you surprised her for lunch did he act odd?
> Didn’t she say she couldn’t have a nooner with you because she had to go meet an employee that afternoon?
> I’m sorry about this news… but don’t tell her you know until* you get the undeniable evidence. *She will lie and lie if you can’t prove it.
> You may need a camera in the bedroom area.
> 
> But if this is true - this is who she is…and you can’t change that about her. Basically, she isn’t who you thought she WAS.


Why is more evidence needed? His gut, her manner when an out-of-town trip cancelled, refusing him nooner, toilet seat up, 9" surrogate for the AP when he not available, thongs that WW never wore for the OP, and now the 88 minutes. Why not just hire an attorney, file for D and let his WW react, explain, plead whatever. The more "evidence" he collects is just more bad memories for him to forget. Imagine he plants a VR (which are illegal in some jurisdictions) and then gets to listen to and hour and half of moaning with bed springs creaking in the background. I believe in most jurisdictions the court cares nothing about the reason, adultery or otherwise so her adultery isn't going to change how things go for him. 

Just my opinion, but what he already has is more than enough.


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## Blondilocks

He wouldn't be presenting the VAR in court. In fact, it would be for his own use and he would not even mention it to his wife. He would keep all sources of info to himself. I would place one in the guest bedroom.


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## In Absentia

Maybe they were just having coffee?


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## Tatsuhiko

Please resist the urge to confront her. If you confront now you'll get some explanation like "he's going through a tough time and just needed someone to talk to" or "I asked him to look at our heating system since he has experience in this area." It is better to wait and continue to gather evidence. Every piece of evidence is additional leverage in a divorce, as she does not want to be embarrassed in front of the children, etc. 

Put voice-activated recorders in every bedroom and plan another out-of-town trip. You can even stay at a hotel 5 minutes away and come back home, camera in hand, when you see that he's entered your house.


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## maquiscat

Rus47 said:


> Why is more evidence needed? His gut, her manner when an out-of-town trip cancelled, refusing him nooner, toilet seat up, 9" surrogate for the AP when he not available, thongs that WW never wore for the OP, and now the 88 minutes. Why not just hire an attorney, file for D and let his WW react, explain, plead whatever. The more "evidence" he collects is just more bad memories for him to forget. Imagine he plants a VR (which are illegal in some jurisdictions) and then gets to listen to and hour and half of moaning with bed springs creaking in the background. I believe in most jurisdictions the court cares nothing about the reason, adultery or otherwise so her adultery isn't going to change how things go for him.
> 
> Just my opinion, but what he already has is more than enough.


Depending on the state or country in question, it can matter greatly if he can show an affair. And as a poly, I will make it clear I do mean a relationship he was not made aware of. If she had an affair, it could go as far as he owes her nothing, and count against her for custody. Again laws vary, and we don't know the details of his location.


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## re16

We’ve seen cheating spouses re-write history and turn friends and family against the betrayed many times, portraying the betrayed as the evil family destroyer… he needs bullet proof evidence to keep her from doing that.

Right now, he has circumstantial evidence. It is strong, but a lying / cheating spouse could shoot holes in what he has easily.


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## jsmart

You need more proof before you confront. She can make an excuse of having him do some task. You need a VAR and a hidden camera. If they are doing stuff, it’s probably in the guess bedroom. Some WW think it’s too much to have their OM in their marital bed. It helps relieve a little of the guilt if they only desecrated the rest of the house.


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## Beach123

The evidence is mainly because we know she will lie and try and talk him into staying married to a known cheater.

OP, you ok?


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## Kaliber

If you confront you will never truly know what happened, it will go underground, this is the time that you gather all your strength to find out what really happened!

Your best option:
Extend you work trip for a day or two, and stay in a hotel near your home, once the delivery dude comes and your wife is in there, go and check for yourself, but don't go inside too soon wait for 20 min!
Oh and use your mobile camera to video record every thing, you will need it in case you want a divorce on your terms (assuming adultery is a deal breaker for you! )

*If you tip you hand now*, you will be in a state of limbo and immense pain for a very long time!


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## Rus47

Kaliber said:


> If you confront you will never truly know what happened, it will go underground, this is the time that you gather all your strength to find out what really happened!
> 
> Your best option:
> Extend you work trip for a day or two, and stay in a hotel near your home, once the delivery dude comes and your wife is in there, go and check for yourself, but don't go inside too soon wait for 20 min!
> Oh and use your mobile camera to video record every thing, you will need it in case you want a divorce on your terms (assuming adultery is a deal breaker for you! )


Wouldnt it be easier and more effective to hire a real PI instead of trying to play at being one? Gives third party confirmation at same time.


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## Kaliber

Rus47 said:


> Wouldnt it be easier and more effective to hire a real PI instead of trying to play at being one? Gives third party confirmation at same time.


Yes easier, but the problem is, what will the PI find?!
Van in the driveway (HommeNu knows)
The guy is inside for XX amount of minutes (HommeNu knows)
That's it
Unless she goes out on dates with the delivery man and from @HommeNu investigation she is completely normal so it's unlikely.

The key is that lunch time while @HommeNu is away!
The PI will not get anything new that @HommeNu doesn't know, unless the PI enters the house (and that will never happen!)


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## HommeNu

Rough night. It was hard to pretend. It was very hard to sleep. Felt like I'd been punched in the gut. A lot. Long flight home. Just landed an hour ago. Gonna catch up on all the advice. Not going to confront yet. Probably gonna hire a PI like half of you suggest. Lots of thinking and pretending, I guess, to do still. FML.


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## TXTrini

HommeNu said:


> Rough night. It was hard to pretend. It was very hard to sleep. Felt like I'd been punched in the gut. A lot. Long flight home. Just landed an hour ago. Gonna catch up on all the advice. Not going to confront yet. Probably gonna hire a PI like half of you suggest. Lots of thinking and pretending, I guess, to do still. FML.


Hang in there HommeNu!

It's a really ****ty feeling, and I'm so sorry you're dealing with this. Thanks for letting us know you're safe. Get a nice meal and some rest. We'll be waiting for you.


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## Rus47

Kaliber said:


> Yes easier, but the problem is, what will the PI find?!
> Van in the driveway (HommeNu knows)
> The guy is inside for XX amount of minutes (HommeNu knows)
> That's it
> Unless she goes out on dates with the delivery man and from @HommeNu investigation she is completely normal so it's unlikely.
> 
> The key is that lunch time while @HommeNu is away!
> The PI will not get anything new that @HommeNu doesn't know, unless the PI enters the house (and that will never happen!)


The PI has all of the tools you talk about OP using and can set up surveillance gear in and around house with OP approving. PI knows how to use the equipment OP is an amateur. PI does this work full time, OP trying to earn a living. OP should spend his spare time interviewing attorneys and selecting one to help him manage the mess.


----------



## Rus47

Also, the PI has no emotional involvement, and is a third party to the shytstorm. Can you imagine OP video taping a plowing he interrupts 20 minutes into the party?

OP will have to pretend to leave on business trip. Maybe just get motel room near home.


----------



## Rus47

It is possible PI has an open file on old Jerry. If Jerry is endowed in the top percentile, he likely has many other "clients", word having gotten out what a great FB he is amongst the other local ladies. Maybe another BH like the OP has hired professional help.


----------



## ABHale

Talk with a lawyer and draw up divorce papers. 

You know that she is cheating. There is no reason for him to be in the home. Have her served at the flower shop with a note saying “Hope delivery guy’s name was worth it”. Inform your daughters at the same time WW is getting served. 

Or 

Wait til next week and pretend to go out of town. Check the cam for the delivery and then show up 30 mins later. Have a trusted friend with you so you don’t do anything stupid.


----------



## ABHale

Or just don’t go home, get a room somewhere. When your wife ask where you are and what’s up, tell her she knows damn well what is up. Tell her that you had a PI watch the home and you know everything. Then hang up.


----------



## Lostinthought61

If you do confront make sure part of your demands is a polygraph


----------



## Gabriel

Well, it's definitely strange that he'd be in your house that long. But you have no proof anything happened, nor is it even fully ascertainable that she is cheating with this guy. If they have been doing business a long time, it's possible they completed the transaction, and had a cup of coffee in the kitchen and chatted. You really don't know.

All you have now is MORE reason to suspect her. You already suspected her, and your gut has been sending you signals. Usually your gut is right, but you can't use that in any arguments with her, or in court.

You have 3 possible paths here

1) You confront now and she will probably deny it and make you feel like you are crazy (gaslighting). 
2) You confront now and she can't hide it and just admits, either verbally or non verbally, that you are correct
3) You gather more evidence, something that is absolutely irrefutable this time. VAR, camera upstairs, etc.

#3 is the smartest choice because it will give you the best probability of the most accurate answer. But I totally understand it's excruciating, the waiting.

#2 would honestly be the best result, but you can't control it - it's more likely you get #1 - which is the worst result possible - because A) you won't really know the truth for sure and B) if she is cheating she will just cover her tracks now and make it very hard to catch her.

So if you can bear it, I'd go #3.


----------



## Gabriel

Kaliber said:


> Yes easier, but the problem is, what will the PI find?!
> Van in the driveway (HommeNu knows)
> The guy is inside for XX amount of minutes (HommeNu knows)
> That's it
> Unless she goes out on dates with the delivery man and from @HommeNu investigation she is completely normal so it's unlikely.
> 
> The key is that lunch time while @HommeNu is away!
> The PI will not get anything new that @HommeNu doesn't know, unless the PI enters the house (and that will never happen!)


Totally agree - Homenu should do his own recon - he's already gone part way there. Now do the VAR and camera inside the house.


----------



## Rus47

Gabriel said:


> Usually your gut is right, but you can't use that in any arguments with her, or in court.


Why would he need to use arguments in court? Everyone I have ever known who divorced didn't use any "arguments in court", cuz the court didn't care why the divorce was happening. And in nearly all cases neither party appeared in court, their attorneys negotiated the settlement, filed the paperwork, and sent the bills. The whole process is essentially a financial transaction.

If OP just wanted a divorce because he wanted one, I doubt the results would differ from him presenting to a judge video with sound of Jerry plowing her.


----------



## Marc878

I’d check with the attorney on alimony laws in your state regarding adultery. Most good attorneys can recommend a PI as well.


----------



## Evinrude58

You have no proof of cheating yet. If she doesn’t have a burner phone, and you’ve checked the phone bills, unless she’s using an app to communicate with him that self erases..,.
I agree there’s no way this guy should be in your house for 88 min alone with your wife.

but, you do not have proof. I say put cameras in the bedrooms and catch them in the act. 
your wife, if she is cheating, will lie to you without hard proof. Get it.

Also, did your wife want sex when you returned? Does she still want a kiss, want to go do things with you? You haven’t answered much concerning her attitude toward you.

I hate you’re going through this.


----------



## Gabriel

Evinrude58 said:


> You have no proof of cheating yet. If she doesn’t have a burner phone, and you’ve checked the phone bills, unless she’s using an app to communicate with him that self erases..,.
> I agree there’s no way this guy should be in your house for 88 min alone with your wife.
> 
> but, you do not have proof. I say put cameras in the bedrooms and catch them in the act.
> your wife, if she is cheating, will lie to you without hard proof. Get it.
> 
> Also, did your wife want sex when you returned? Does she still want a kiss, want to go do things with you? You haven’t answered much concerning her attitude toward you.
> 
> I hate you’re going through this.


Totally agree. And I hate this for you too. The pit in the stomach this causes is the WORST. 

I lost so much weight.


----------



## ABHale

There is no need for phone calls or messages. He delivers flowers to the home. There will be calls or messages for this purpose. They can plan everything in person.


----------



## Beach123

Or set up the PI now and tell her you are delayed a couple days on your trip. But stay in a hotel close to home.
Once the PI has the proof - get home and let her know she needs to move ASAP… the gig is up!
You need to do this while the kids are away - she knows while everyone is away she can do whatever she wants. 
There’s no value in monitoring her when you/the kids get home - there won’t be any activity between them.

After you expose her - notify his wife!


----------



## Kaliber

@HommeNu your wife will sense something not right with you, careful!
Be ready to say anything like you eat something bad at the airport and you think you have food poison... any thing that will not tip her off!
You can try the PI route, and I recon he will give you the needed equipment to monitor the house from the inside!
You might need to re-create the same environment when you went for your work trip, like pretend that you are going on a work trip and book in a local hotel.
Remember same environment to create an opportunity for her!

At the end, there could be no cheating,* but you need to verify that without doubt!*


----------



## Willnotbill

I don't think its best for the OP to rush into a confrontation. What will another week or two hurt to gather info? There could be several reasons why the delivery guy was there. So far it sound like the only thing for sure the wife is guilty of is very bad judgement. Once the OP confronts his wife it will change his marriage and could destroy it. For that reason he needs to be confident he knows whats going on. The PI or carefully placed VARs should get him the info he needs.


----------



## Gabriel

It may be that if they are cheating they only do it very occasionally - so since that was "already done" him staying an extra day or two might not really work.

I'd instead have another trip "planned" in 1-2 weeks, but just stay in a motel and watch the camera. Come back home after the truck is sitting there for 30 minutes.


----------



## Kaliber

Confronting now would be the worst idea ever..
Easy for the wife to say: _Oh I made him lunch, the poor guy was talking to me about his marriage problems and the future of his kids , he is in a very bad place now and I was just counselling him, if that bothers you honey, I will not do it again, come here give me a hug... How was your trip?_

*And it could be TRUE or NOT!*


----------



## re16

Did she know Jerry before the florist business started?


----------



## Ursula

HommeNu said:


> Rough night. It was hard to pretend. It was very hard to sleep. Felt like I'd been punched in the gut. A lot. Long flight home. Just landed an hour ago. Gonna catch up on all the advice. Not going to confront yet. Probably gonna hire a PI like half of you suggest. Lots of thinking and pretending, I guess, to do still. FML.


I'm so sorry about all that you're going through.


----------



## Graywolf2

As others have said do not confront. The problem is that your wife knows you and will pick up that you’re not acting normal. So have a story ready. You might even plant it before you get home.

Examples: You’re not feeling well and need to make an appointment for a check up. Problem at work. Use a real problem and blow it out of proportion.


----------



## MattMatt

Hopefully it's nothing nefarious and there's no cheating.


----------



## manwithnoname

I went back to re read based on new revelations. It explains why there are no red flags as far as phone guarding etc. goes. She would be able to communicate with an employee with no trail. Your gut feeling was all you had, other than the toilet seat. Her distance, reaction to a cancelled trip, thongs you've never seen her wear, average sized dildo, and then the 88 minutes. Wasn't there another time, pre extra cameras, where she was there for about 90 minutes the same time as a delivery? 

I don't know what a PI might uncover, other than her and delivery guy being in the house for that amount of time.....you already know this. Place more hidden cameras, VARs I guess and keep monitoring until you get hard evidence, otherwise it will be explained away and then hidden more.

It may be innocent...but it doesn't appear so to me at this point.


----------



## ABHale

HommeNu said:


> I found a dildo. A very large, rather realistic dildo hidden high up behind a pile of sweaters at the top of her closet. It has been used, or at least it is out of the packaging and appears used. I've never seen it before.


It isn’t average size.


----------



## MattMatt

Unless she needed to discuss something with an employee about a work related issue that she and the employee could not dare have overheard?

An example I can think of if an employee believed another employee was stealing from the business. 

Talk about it in the shop/store and risk being overheard?

Have a meet up in a restaurant or bar? Might be seen and the thief gets forewarned?

Better to have the meeting at a place where they would have no risk of the suspected thief overhearing them or seeing them. Especially if it is a location where they should both be, your house during a delivery.


----------



## Blondilocks

What I don't get is why she can't bring the flowers home herself.


----------



## In Absentia

It looks very suspicious, but there could be a genuine reason. I would try and set up a secret camera somewhere...


----------



## MattMatt

Blondilocks said:


> What I don't get is why she can't bring the flowers home herself.


Because every delivery is an advert for the company?

And having a delivery rather than having to take it yourself can make you feel special. Besides, if she doesn't want to go to the flower shop that day she still gets her flowers?


----------



## jsmart

He needs at least 2 small hidden cameras. One in the master and the other in guess bedroom. I think if they are doing it in the house, it will most likely be in the guess bedroom but having one in the master can catch her going for the toy or if she’s wearing the sexy underwear.

he needs to get everything in place and schedule his midweek business trip. Seems that is when she gets the delivery that last over an hour. When they have their afternoon delight, call her about mid visit. See if she answers out of breath.

I want to know how she’s acting. Was she happy to see you on your return? With you being very emotional over this discovery, she may have been wondering what was wrong. I really want this to be one of the few rare false alarms we get on TAM. Unfortunately, it’s so rare. The gut is rarely wrong.


----------



## Blondilocks

MattMatt said:


> Because every delivery is an advert for the company?
> 
> And having a delivery rather than having to take it yourself can make you feel special. Besides, if she doesn't want to go to the flower shop that day she still gets her flowers?


You think her neighbors don't know she owns the flower shop? The delivery fee is coming out of her pocket - yeah, I can see how that would make her feel special.


----------



## MattMatt

She probably writes it off against tax.


----------



## Livvie

I think it's really suspicious, but there is a little more information needed. Was this a one time thing? Could they have had lunch together or a business discussion? 

I think you need to gather just a little more information.


----------



## Rus47

manwithnoname said:


> I went back to re read based on new revelations. It explains why there are no red flags as far as phone guarding etc. goes. She would be able to communicate with an employee with no trail. Your gut feeling was all you had, other than the toilet seat. Her distance, reaction to a cancelled trip, thongs you've never seen her wear,* average sized dildo*, and then the 88 minutes. Wasn't there another time, pre extra cameras, where she was there for about 90 minutes the same time as a delivery?


OP said it was huge, like 9" ?!? So she certainly wasn't using it to comfort herself while husband out of town. More likely to console herself while old Jerry was taking care of other ladies in the town.

Of course maybe neither OP nor I know what "average" is for these things lol.


----------



## Rus47

jsmart said:


> *He needs at least 2 small hidden cameras. * One in the master and the other in guess bedroom. I think if they are doing it in the house, it will most likely be in the guess bedroom but having one in the master can catch her going for the toy or if she’s wearing the sexy underwear.
> 
> he needs to get everything in place and schedule his midweek business trip. Seems that is when she gets the delivery that last over an hour. When they have their afternoon delight, call her about mid visit. See if she answers out of breath.
> 
> I want to know how she’s acting. Was she happy to see you on your return? With you being very emotional over this discovery, she may have been wondering what was wrong. I really want this to be one of the few rare false alarms we get on TAM. Unfortunately, it’s so rare. *The gut is rarely wrong*.


I put myself in OP's shoes, just like him know nothing about VAR, hidden cameras, staking out the house or any of this investigator stuff. First need to buy the equipment (where?) read all of the damn manuals, test them out, yada yada. Would just as likely have the devices discovered. And showing up during the party not good for OP's health if old Jerry is former MMA instructor or USMC retired. Old Jerry might be packing more than one "gun". 

OP is distraught just with the info he has found already. And yes, the gut is the best truth detector evolution provided.


----------



## Rus47

Blondilocks said:


> You think her neighbors don't know she owns the flower shop? The delivery fee is coming out of her pocket - yeah, I can see how that would make her feel special.


I thought OP said the flowers for the shop were delivered at house because there wasn't space at the shop to receive them. Most florists use a LOT of flowers if successful and sometimes a small shop will barely have space. Maybe the shop owner's convenient explanation to her hubby?


----------



## Blondilocks

Rus47 said:


> I thought OP said the flowers for the shop were delivered at house because there wasn't space at the shop to receive them. Most florists use a LOT of flowers if successful and sometimes a small shop will barely have space. Maybe the shop owner's convenient explanation to her hubby?


The flowers delivered to her home are the old flowers - the ones getting ready to expire.


----------



## Willnotbill

Rus47 said:


> I put myself in OP's shoes, just like him know nothing about VAR, hidden cameras, staking out the house or any of this investigator stuff. First need to buy the equipment (where?) read all of the damn manuals, test them out, yada yada. Would just as likely have the devices discovered. And showing up during the party not good for OP's health if old Jerry is former MMA instructor or USMC retired. Old Jerry might be packing more than one "gun".
> 
> OP is distraught just with the info he has found already. And yes, the gut is the best truth detector evolution provided.


If OP hires a Private Investigator they would have devices to set up in the home.


----------



## Evinrude58

Op doesn’t answer many questions.....


----------



## Torninhalf

Evinrude58 said:


> Op doesn’t answer many questions.....


I’m concerned for him. I wish he would come back and at least tell us he is ok.


----------



## maquiscat

Lostinthought61 said:


> If you do confront make sure part of your demands is a polygraph


Don't bother. It has long been proven that they are unreliable. Too many people have learn to game the machine.


----------



## maquiscat

Rus47 said:


> Why would he need to use arguments in court? Everyone I have ever known who divorced didn't use any "arguments in court", cuz the court didn't care why the divorce was happening. And in nearly all cases neither party appeared in court, their attorneys negotiated the settlement, filed the paperwork, and sent the bills. The whole process is essentially a financial transaction.
> 
> If OP just wanted a divorce because he wanted one, I doubt the results would differ from him presenting to a judge video with sound of Jerry plowing her.


Because states are at fault divorce states and such evidence can affect if alimony is paid or how much as well as child support and custody. But it can also be used to show others that he's has legitimate reason to divorce her, instead of her turning them against him.


----------



## jsmart

Rus47 said:


> I thought OP said the flowers for the shop were delivered at house because there wasn't space at the shop to receive them. Most florists use a LOT of flowers if successful and sometimes a small shop will barely have space. Maybe the shop owner's convenient explanation to her hubby?


I agree that he should hire a PI. These guys have the right tools and knowledge of the best way to catch them in action. The OP is too emotional now to embark on a trial and error learning curve of different devices and techniques. Since he will know the delivery time, it will not require much time to crack this case. 

I’m still hoping this is all a misunderstanding but there are quite a few red flags that are hard to ignore. With the biggest being his gut picking up her aloofness. We all know that the opposite of love is indifference. That’s is what his gut is picking up. She stopped caring about him. She may still have sex with her husband but her heart is not with him.


----------



## Willnotbill

maquiscat said:


> Don't bother. It has long been proven that they are unreliable. Too many people have learn to game the machine.


The Polygraph worked perfect for me. When I asked my wife to do a polygraph, she agreed but I think she thought she was just calling my bluff. The day before the poly she confessed because she knew she wouldn't pass.


----------



## Anastasia6

OP right now you still have not much. She may be cheating she may not be cheating. I know I regularly have conversations with co workers that last an hour or more. Since she is paying Jerry she doesn't even have to feel bad about talking with him. You need more info than what you have right now.


----------



## ShatteredKat

*HommeNu*

Have you given thought to obtaining some very hard to find "spy" camera and a voice recorder or two?

Google "spyguy" and look at all the stuff available

And a thought (I have Arlos all around the house) - would wife have a visitor knowing (assuming she does) that there is video recording of what is coming and going in your driveway? Do you have "Smile, you're on camera" signs posted? 

I'm thinking the 88 minutes was some kind of business and she didn't give a thought about the time the driver's vehicle in your driveway. -hoping I'm not wrong on that thought

If you have the camera recording signs (stickers on doors?) then I would think "Jerry" is also aware his presence is known and for how long.

The Arlo cameras - I would think - would be noticed easily as they are not very small. AND - the Arlos I have can record sound - so you have one of those models?

Granted some of your puzzle pieces are very concerning but, taken together, some pieces don't quite fit.

Best to keep your worries to a very trusted acquaintance (and us Internet strangers) and not confront until you know for certain whether or not some kind of activity is ongoing that is not kosher with your marriage agreements.


----------



## ABHale

HommeNu was throwing up over this. I don’t think he wasn’t able to hide his thoughts. Will just have to wait to see if he comes back.


----------



## Blondilocks

Rus47 said:


> I put myself in OP's shoes, just like him know nothing about VAR, hidden cameras, staking out the house or any of this investigator stuff. First need to buy the equipment (where?) read all of the damn manuals, test them out, yada yada. Would just as likely have the devices discovered. And showing up during the party not good for OP's health if old Jerry is former MMA instructor or USMC retired. Old Jerry might be packing more than one "gun".
> 
> OP is distraught just with the info he has found already. And yes, the gut is the best truth detector evolution provided.


This thread will provide the OP with a lot of info:


Wolfman1968 said:


> NOOOOOOO!!!!
> 
> Read the Weightlifter's Standard Evidence Post


----------



## Willnotbill

I'm not convinced his wife is cheating but I still see one major red flag. I run my own business and there is no way would I ever have a private meeting with female employee at my home. There are way too many things that could go wrong with that. A charge of sexual harassment by an upset employee can ruin a business and a person. There's too much on the line to put yourself in that position.


----------



## Tatsuhiko

On the subject of polygraphs, I've been reading these forums for years and have rarely seen the suggestion of a polygraph fail. I'm not saying that a polygraph is accurate or foolproof. But what inevitably happens is that it yields the desired result:

1) A staunch refusal on the part of the accused cheater to take the polygraph. The betrayed spouse gets a gut feeling based on the nature of the refusal--e.g. the words used by the betrayer--as to whether the refusal is essentially an admission of guilt
2) A parking lot confession
3) Squeezing out at least more trickle truth--often enough truth to help the betrayed spouse make a decision. 
4) In conjunction with observations of other behavior by the accused cheater, a level of relief for the betrayed spouse when the polygraph comes back "clean"

One only need to read the accounts of all betrayed spouses who've used the polygraph to see how consistent these results are. Yet there are always these debates about whether the polygraph is supported by science. It doesn't matter.


----------



## Marc878

Were her new thong panties used/moved? In the wash?


----------



## Bandade

Tatsuhiko said:


> On the subject of polygraphs, I've been reading these forums for years and have rarely seen the suggestion of a polygraph fail. I'm not saying that a polygraph is accurate or foolproof. But what inevitably happens is that it yields the desired result:
> 
> 1) A staunch refusal on the part of the accused cheater to take the polygraph. The betrayed spouse gets a gut feeling based on the nature of the refusal--e.g. the words used by the betrayer--as to whether the refusal is essentially an admission of guilt
> 2) A parking lot confession
> 3) Squeezing out at least more trickle truth--often enough truth to help the betrayed spouse make a decision.
> 4) In conjunction with observations of other behavior by the accused cheater, a level of relief for the betrayed spouse when the polygraph comes back "clean"
> 
> One only need to read the accounts of all betrayed spouses who've used the polygraph to see how consistent these results are. Yet there are always these debates about whether the polygraph is supported by science. It doesn't matter.


I have undergone two polygraph exams in my life. Both were work related at a time when their use was allowed in the workplace in the US. A lot of people say that they are pseudoscience and ineffective. They are wrong. A polygraph in the hands of a skilled examiner is extremely accurate. In both cases the examiner was able to determine who was stealing from our employer. I was asked a lot more than the 3-4 questions you read about, however they were all yes/no questions. Believe in polygraphs!


----------



## manwithnoname

Rus47 said:


> OP said it was huge, like 9" ?!? So she certainly wasn't using it to comfort herself while husband out of town. More likely to console herself while old Jerry was taking care of other ladies in the town.
> 
> Of course maybe neither OP nor I know what "average" is for these things lol.


I assumed it was to take the place of an average sized ****. Aren’t they all that size?


----------



## Rus47

manwithnoname said:


> I assumed it was to take the place of an average sized ****. Aren’t they all that size?


----------



## Elizabeth001

manwithnoname said:


> I assumed it was to take the place of an average sized ****. Aren’t they all that size?


No. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## BigDaddyNY

manwithnoname said:


> I assumed it was to take the place of an average sized ****. Aren’t they all that size?


Is every penis the same size? No, so why would every dildo be the same size? Heck, you can even make your own.


----------



## maquiscat

Willnotbill said:


> The Polygraph worked perfect for me. When I asked my wife to do a polygraph, she agreed but I think she thought she was just calling my bluff. The day before the poly she confessed because she knew she wouldn't pass.


Now as a psychological tool to fool those that do not realize, or at least know and know they can't do what is needed to fool it, it is useful. But I would never rely on it, unless I was sure I could get a result like yours


----------



## Cletus

maquiscat said:


> Now as a psychological tool to fool those that do not realize, or at least know and know they can't do what is needed to fool it, it is useful. But I would never rely on it, unless I was sure I could get a result like yours


Nor should you. Things that are effective and reliable can pass double blind studies. Polygraphs cannot, anyone's anecdotal evidence notwithstanding.


----------



## SunCMars

Cletus said:


> Nor should you. Things that are effective and reliable can pass double blind studies. Polygraphs cannot, anyone's _anecdotal_ evidence notwithstanding.


Yeah, why would anyone believe two blind, addict dopes?


----------



## Tatsuhiko

Again, the question about polygraphs is not whether they pass double-blind studies or have any scientific basis. The question is whether they yield the results desired by the betrayed spouse. Time after time, they do. One would have difficulty finding an story in this forum where a polygraph, or the threat of a polygraph, did not bring closure.


----------



## manwithnoname

manwithnoname said:


> I assumed it was to take the place of an average sized ****. Aren’t they all that size?





manwithnoname said:


> I assumed it was to take the place of an average sized ****. Aren’t they all that size?





Rus47 said:


>





Elizabeth001 said:


> No.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk





BigDaddyNY said:


> Is every penis the same size? No, so why would every dildo be the same size? Heck, you can even make your own.


 I thought it was obvious that I was kidding.


----------



## Evinrude58

manwithnoname said:


> I assumed it was to take





manwithnoname said:


> I thought it was obvious that I was kidding.


was to me

mine is only 8”. Everyone knows 9” is at least an inch above average.🤭
That much have touched a nerve lol.


----------



## Beach123

Any update OP?


----------



## Divinely Favored

maquiscat said:


> Don't bother. It has long been proven that they are unreliable. Too many people have learn to game the machine.


Only with drugs.


----------



## manwithnoname

Evinrude58 said:


> was to me
> 
> mine is only 8”. Everyone knows 9” is at least an inch above average.🤭
> That much have touched a nerve lol.


My mistake was assuming that they are all similar sized, and I only really had my own to go by. 
I apologize to all.


----------



## Divinely Favored

manwithnoname said:


> My mistake was assuming that they are all similar sized, and I only really had my own to go by.
> I apologize to all.


They go from little willie to donkey kong in sizes. See some at the store the size of baseball bats.


----------



## Blondilocks

Divinely Favored said:


> They go from little willie to donkey kong in sizes. See some at the store the size of baseball bats.


He's still kidding, folks.


----------



## Kamstel2

Think it is time to set up tiny cameras in the kitchen, bedroom, living room and any extra bedroom, especially before your next trip.


I hopeIt isn’t what it looks like.

Good luck and be strong.


----------



## MEA

HommeNu said:


> I came home a day early from a business trip about six weeks ago and found the toilet seat up in our upstairs guest bathroom. This may not be remarkable in most households, but I (51) live with my wife (44) and our 3 daughters (17, 15, 13). Living with four women means always putting the toilet seat down. It is an accommodation to their gender that I have fully embraced. We haven’t had houseguests since the Before Times, and no one really uses that bathroom except for overnight guests so finding the toilet seat up in an empty house in the middle of the day in the middle of the work week is, to put it mildly, odd. My daughters and their friends were still at school. My wife was still at work. I checked the doorbell video log, but no one had come in the house since everyone left around 7:15 that morning. This would bother me no matter what, but in the past year or so I’ve noticed some distance from my wife—like not being fully present in the evenings after dinner or in the bedroom and I can’t put my finger on it, but there is definitely a disturbance in the force. And she’s been on a slight-to-medium edge ever since I asked her about the toilet seat. Obviously I suspect there’s been another male in my house, but I have no idea when or why. I have no real reason to suspect she's cheating, but we are hitting our mid-lives and humans can be human so it is a possibility that is weighing on me. I found this website and I’ve been reading various threads looking for advice. She’s not guarding her phone, or traveling for work, or going out with the girls, or disappearing for hours at a time. The only red flag I’ve seen is the open toilet seat, and the only red flag I feel in my gut is her distance. But my gut is worried. Very worried. Am I worrying for nothing? Your advice would be appreciated.


I usually advise people to trust instincts.
You don’t want to look paranoid though.
Maids often leave toilet seats up as a mildew preventative.
Or maybe one of your teens was experimenting (you know - we women CAN pee standing up and get 95-99% in the bowl by straddling the bowl).
There are so many possibilities here that I wouldn’t jump to conclusions.
I would install a hidden camera somewhere though if I really thought my instincts are correct.


----------



## re16

HN, I hope you survived the weekend. Keep a cool head if you can. Were you able to pretend things were normal? Did you confront (hopefully not yet)?


----------



## Kaliber

Started to worry about @HommeNu
Lots of people here are worried!


----------



## BigDaddyNY

Kaliber said:


> Started to worry about @HommeNu
> Lots of people here are worried!


I think he is all good at this point. The cameras picked up nothing while he was gone and wanted to take his wife away for a weekend. Seems like this one is a rare happy ending.


----------



## CountryMike

Problem solved.

After 362 responses it may be time to close this thread.


----------



## Chillidog

BigDaddyNY said:


> I think he is all good at this point. The cameras picked up nothing while he was gone and wanted to take his wife away for a weekend. Seems like this one is a rare happy ending.


He recorded Jerry the delivery driver there for 88 minutes and his wife was home at the same time. I think you commented on his prior out of town trip.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

Chillidog said:


> He recorded Jerry the delivery driver there for 88 minutes and his wife was home at the same time. I think you commented on his prior out of town trip.


Oh crap, I missed that. How ****ty is that. People genuinely suck.


----------



## jjj858

88 minutes. I doubt they were having tea and crumpets.


----------



## ABHale

BigDaddyNY said:


> Oh crap, I missed that. How ****ty is that. People genuinely suck.


He was puking his guts up the night before he went home. I hope he is ok. This really sucks.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

ABHale said:


> He was puking his guys up the night before he went home. I hope he is ok. This really sucks.


I think I will have to stop reading some of these. It actually makes me physically angry to hear this kind of thing. I can't believe how people who are supposedly in love can inflict this worst kind of pain on the person they love.


----------



## Kamstel2

HommeNu, 
Just checking in on you. How are you doing?

hope things are are going as well as can be expected.

hang in there. Stay strong!
I promise you will get through this


----------



## Rus47

BigDaddyNY said:


> I think I will have to stop reading some of these. It actually makes me physically angry to hear this kind of thing. I can't believe *how people who are supposedly in love can inflict this worst kind of pain* on the person they love.


Obviously they never loved anyone but themselves, entitled to what they want when they want it. What amazes me is why these narcissists don't just remain single and play the field as widely as they wish. No one would care and no innocents hurt. Maybe they have a sadistic streak as well.


----------



## maquiscat

Divinely Favored said:


> Only with drugs.


Incorrect. Some have done so by sheer control of their body. Some by truthful, but misleading answers. One method involves a small rock in one's shoes. It's not that hard with a little study and practice.


----------



## re16

Well if HN is following his normal travel schedule, another trip should be happening (or faux trip if he has a sting operation going). Hopefully he has the proper surveillance setup for some definitive answers this time. Kids would need to be in camp again for it to happen.

Wednesday at noon is the witching hour (flower / special delivery time).

Hopefully its not Tom delivering for 88 minutes this time.


----------



## Evinrude58

Wish OP would return and contribute.
There’s no smoking gun yet on his wife cheating. I hope he gets some answers.


----------



## Rus47

Evinrude58 said:


> Wish OP would return and contribute.
> There’s no smoking gun yet on his wife cheating. I hope he gets some answers.


In his shoes, would be too busy with attorney, PI, trying to keep my job to be sitting at keyboard typing into a forum.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

Evinrude58 said:


> Wish OP would return and contribute.
> There’s no smoking gun yet on his wife cheating. I hope he gets some answers.


I do too. I know it is a long shot, but there may be a valid explanation other than cheating. I just have to hold out hope.


----------



## Evinrude58

She may be cheating, but if she is, she’s a seasoned pro. There’s no phone evidence. There’s no evidence of regular communication (usually cheaters need to constantly communicate). I know she works with the alleged AP, but still, cheaters have their AP on their mind 24/7. If she is cheating, the only explanation is it’s purely physical and she just wants sex, which I’d think is somewhat rare.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

Evinrude58 said:


> She may be cheating, but if she is, she’s a seasoned pro. There’s no phone evidence. There’s no evidence of regular communication (usually cheaters need to constantly communicate). I know she works with the alleged AP, but still, cheaters have their AP on their mind 24/7. If she is cheating, the only explanation is it’s purely physical and she just wants sex, which I’d think is somewhat rare.


She is also still having sex with H, which usually seems to go to zero when cheating. I fear it will be crushed, but I still hoping for a good outcome.


----------



## Divinely Favored

maquiscat said:


> Incorrect. Some have done so by sheer control of their body. Some by truthful, but misleading answers. One method involves a small rock in one's shoes. It's not that hard with a little study and practice.


All the ones who have tried...our poligrapher has come to us and told us tgey were trying to beat the test. They do not tell lie or truth...only if one is trying to decieve.


----------



## Evinrude58

BigDaddyNY said:


> She is also still having sex with H, which usually seems to go to zero when cheating. I fear it will be crushed, but I still hoping for a good outcome.


But he hasn’t really come back and answered any questions About how things are lately.
One sentence and gone. So maybe she’s not having sex with him before he leaves and after he returns, which is a good sign she’s not cheating to me as well.


----------



## seadoug105

Evinrude58 said:


> But he hasn’t really come back and answered any questions About how things are lately.
> One sentence and gone. So maybe she’s not having sex with him before he leaves and after he returns, which is a good sign she’s not cheating to me as well.


I see what you did there….

and you are correct… 

unless your not….

but I like it….

except for when I don’t….


----------



## Anastasia6

BigDaddyNY said:


> She is also still having sex with H, which usually seems to go to zero when cheating. I fear it will be crushed, but I still hoping for a good outcome.


I think that being chatty explains quite a bit.


----------



## Beach123

HommeNu said:


> I did not download the other days. Honestly, I wasn't thinking. Or more to the point, I kind of expected someone to say, yes, the cleaner came a day early or something. When I asked K when she came home from work, she freaked out. She asked me if I had checked all the doors when I got home. I had. All locked. And I told her I checked the security video log and saw nobody there, but she is convinced we must have had a prowler in the house looking for valuable. She's been triple-checking the locks ever since. I was not and am still not convinced. I’ve racked my brain trying to think of any other inconsistencies. I can’t think of any. Our life seemed picture-perfect. We have a nice home on the water in Florida, we spend a month every summer traveling as a family, we’ve saved almost enough for the onslaught of college tuitions, and honestly, we want for very little. It has been a charmed life. And now I wonder if it is time to pay the piper. Simply put, something in my marriage feels off, but this is the first real thing "out of place." I am worried. I feel like I am carrying a hard pebble in my gut which, I guess, is how I came to find this forum.


Isn’t it interesting she tried blaming it on a “prowler”? And she made a big deal with drama on top to deflect her guilt… then “acted” paranoid about checking the locks. 

It really makes me mad that she reacted that way. She will lie and lie right to your face!

She needs consequences when you finally address what she’s been doing.

It’s also pretty convenient she always had delivery guy come to the only door without the camera. Sounds like she’s been doing this schedule for a while. 

Early in your posts you noticed she entered the house at noon - delivery guy came in driveway at 12:15 and she left the house at 1:30. So she’s consistent - seeing him for closer to 90 minutes while you’re away. 

Delivering the flowers is just a ploy that gets him in the house without having to explain anything to you. How long has he been delivering the flowers? We’re they delivered while you recuperated? Was anything amiss then - that you noticed when he delivered those flowers while you recovered from surgery?


----------



## re16

Beach123 said:


> Isn’t it interesting she tried blaming it on a “prowler”? And she made a big deal with drama on top to deflect her guilt… then “acted” paranoid about checking the locks.
> 
> It really makes me mad that she reacted that way. She will lie and lie right to your face!
> 
> She needs consequences when you finally address what she’s been doing.
> 
> It’s also pretty convenient she always had delivery guy come to the only door without the camera. Sounds like she’s been doing this schedule for a while.
> 
> Early in your posts you noticed she entered the house at noon - delivery guy came in driveway at 12:15 and she left the house at 1:30. So she’s consistent - seeing him for closer to 90 minutes while you’re away.
> 
> Delivering the flowers is just a ploy that gets him in the house without having to explain anything to you. How long has he been delivering the flowers? We’re they delivered while you recuperated? Was anything amiss then - that you noticed when he delivered those flowers while you recovered from surgery?


Good observations and looking at that older post in light of new revelations definitely puts a different twist on that part of the story.

The false drama over a prowler was definitely an intentional over-production, which even HN noticed. This is a clear show of intentional deceit and her true mindset. And the time she left to go back to work also indicates a similiar length of rendezvous.

I think during his recuperation time, she was unable to operate on her regular 'delivery' schedule, and this irritated her.... essentially HN being home was an inconvenience to her affair.


----------



## Beach123

Any update OP? Hope you are ok.


----------



## TDSC60

HommeNu, stay calm. You have evidence that COULD be a physical affair or COULD be nothing more that your wife offering lunch to an employee. 

Have the PI setup cameras inside your house or do it yourself. You need definite proof to confront and at this point all can be explained away.

In a couple of weeks, and maybe another overnight trip for you, then you will know the truth.


----------



## Rus47

In a month, OP has gone from what he thought a typical married with teenagers to being faced with possibility of one of worst things he could face, on par with being told you have Cancer. So it is understandable he may not care to engage with internet strangers. Especially if he has confirmation. Like he confronted wife n she told him "Jerry way bigger/better and just couldnt pass it up"


----------



## Evinrude58

If she’s guilty I hope she gets caught red-whatevered and OP lays the divorce smack down on her.

If not, she’s due an apology.


----------



## Rus47

Evinrude58 said:


> If she’s guilty I hope she gets caught red-whatevered and OP lays the divorce smack down on her.
> 
> If not, she’s due an apology.


If guilty there is no good path forward


----------



## Livvie

Someone just reminded us the wife blamed the toilet seat on a prowler. 

I was hoping the hour and a half visit of the delivery guy was just innocent talking business or having lunch together, but this makes me doubt that. Because if delivery guy is inclined to go in and stay (I doubt this last visit was the first time he's been in the house) she would have probably attributed it to him, before a prowler, and told her husband about innocent house visits.


----------



## Kamstel2

Just checking in to see how you are doing. 
hope you are doing well.

good luck and stay strong


----------



## mickybill

I don't like it but my gut feeling is that HommeNu found enough evidence or when confronted Mrs HommeNu admitted what we feared and he is not ready to share with internet strangers/friends, OR he confronted and she had a perfectly reasonable explanation for the 88 minutes and he is embarrassed for crying "Wolf!" OR after bringing up the idea that she was cheating the Mrs got royally pissed off and left him for a week OR he is taking a few weeks off from TAM.
Whateverwhichway happened I hope that HNu is doing ok.


----------



## LATERILUS79

Don’t see any reason to continue to discuss or debate (lol. Even though I am writing this post!😂)

OP will be back when he is back.
Or not.
Just like all of these threads go.


----------



## MattMatt

Sometimes it's easy to forget that people come to TAM for help and advice, not to provide other members with entertainment.


----------



## Willnotbill

I hope the OP is doing well and he got the answers that he needed. Having suspicion and not knowing is a terrible feeling. I think he got a good advice here. He might of been overwhelmed with the people saying he should divorce no matter what. 
I don't think anyone can tell someone they should divorce or stay with their spouse. Everyone has a different level of forgiveness. I actually have no forgiveness what so ever but wouldn't tell someone to divorce. That is a personal decision that only they can make. I just hope they have all the information to make that decision. Sometime things aren't what they seem - good or bad.


----------



## Tatsuhiko

I hope he comes back just as a lesson to trust your gut when it comes to your spouse's behavior. This story would be useful to future TAM users even if he comes back just to briefly say whether she was indeed having an affair.


----------



## ccpowerslave

I just hope nothing really tragic happened (worse than blowing up the marriage).


----------



## Mr.Married

Andy1001 said:


> He could call it “Flushing my dreams away”.


Face Down Seat Up


----------



## Htuna2

*


----------



## Htuna2

QuietRiot said:


> Weird. Why do you lift the seat to vomit?


It is easier to support your arms on the seat plus the toilet is cool if you are having dry heaves. Just make sure it is clean😟


----------



## Mr.Married

Htuna2 said:


> So, what are you doing in the guest bedroom bathroom? I don't know anyone that would go into a guest bedroom when they sleep in another room unless the office is there or something you need is stored there BUT, that is all. Geesh. Do you go through the house with a fine tooth comb every time you return from a business trip? I think that is strange. Your life seems pretty nice. I think you are just paranoid. Maybe you are hoping something is going on. Grow up and get a life. Don't create a problem that doesn't exist. I suspect the cleaner left the seat up after cleaning.


Considering he caught the flower delivery man in his house with his wife for more than an hour you may want to rethink your stance.


----------



## Htuna2

*


----------



## Htuna2

*


----------



## Htuna2

*


----------



## Htuna2

*


----------



## Htuna2

*


----------



## Elizabeth001

Htuna2 said:


> Why are you going through her drawers. I don't tell my husband when I buy underwear, duh. That seems kind of controlling to me.


Perhaps read the whole thread before posting a conclusion? Just a suggestion…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Livvie

Htuna2 said:


> The delivery guy could just be snooping around in the house since it is probably a lot nice than his.


Uhhh he was there with the wife for an hour and a half and you think he was just snooping around because the house is nicer than his? What?


----------



## Htuna2

*


----------



## Htuna2

*


----------



## TXTrini

Htuna2 said:


> My post was prior to reading that but STILL think it is strange. I see a man that is paranoid, controlling and perhaps has a temper. Been married to someone like that and you are always on edge even if they are a great person. It really affects you emotionally.


I get that you're trying to get your post count up, but good God, read before you comment. Or spread out your posts to other threads, FFS.


----------



## MattMatt

Htuna2 said:


> Wouldn't be the first time. Could be casing it to see if he could take something of value that wouldn't be noticed.


While he was with the wife?

Your posts are unhelpful and are veering toward being off topic.


----------



## Htuna2

*


----------



## Tested_by_stress

Htuna2 said:


> Wouldn't be the first time. Could be casing it to see if he could take something of value that wouldn't be noticed.


Lol, reaching a bit here.No?


----------



## Htuna2

TXTrini said:


> I get that you're trying to get your post count up, but good God, read before you comment. Or spread out your posts to other threads, FFS.


I could care less about post counts.


----------



## MattMatt

Htuna2 said:


> I still say it is strange you would be checking out a rarely used room and bathroom.


That's not what happened. He did *not* check out a "rarely used room and bathroom" as you claimed. It was just something different that he noticed in his own house after returning from a long business trip.


----------



## Dictum Veritas

Htuna2 said:


> I could care less about post counts. I just find it strange that he comes home from business trip, checks out a rarely used bedroom/bathroom, sees toilet seat up and immediately thinks wife is having an affair to the point of installing cameras. He apparently doesn't trust her and is at least paranoid, nosey and controlling. In his case it looks like there may be something to it but still seems he has some personality issues


What's black and stands on the roof?



A coal-stove....


It's MY coal-stove and I can put it where-ever the F I want!

Likewise, it's OP's house. He can do in it what-ever he wants. He can use whatever bathroom he wants and if something triggered suspicion, he can definitely take any action there to allay or confirm his fears and none of us has any business dictating it.

Once one of us pays for his home, then maybe we have the right to tell him what he can or cannot do in it. Until then, we best not make it our business because it's not.


----------



## RebuildingMe

Htuna2 said:


> I could care less about post counts. I just find it strange that he comes home from business trip, checks out a rarely used bedroom/bathroom, sees toilet seat up and immediately thinks wife is having an affair to the point of installing cameras. He apparently doesn't trust her and is at least paranoid, nosey and controlling. In his case it looks like there may be something to it but still seems he has some personality issues


Good god. OP is now the bad tempered, toxic, controlling one? All while his wife is playing with the delivery man? What planet did you just arrive from?


----------



## MattMatt

Dictum Veritas said:


> What's black and stands on the roof?
> 
> 
> 
> A coal-stove....
> 
> 
> It's MY coal-stove and I can put it where-ever the F I want!
> 
> Likewise, it's OP's house. He can do in it what-ever he wants. He can use whatever bathroom he wants and if something triggered suspicion, he can definitely take any action there to allay or confirm his fears and none of us has any business dictating it.
> 
> Once one of us pays for his home, then maybe we have the right to tell him what he can or cannot do in it. Until then, we best not make it our business because it's not.


I thought for one moment you were going to say "A Black Heron" but you didn't! 🤣 

I have been working on a list of birds of South Africa. 

But I agree with your point. His house, his rules.


----------



## Dictum Veritas

MattMatt said:


> I thought for one moment you were going to say "A Black Heron" but you didn't! 🤣
> 
> I have been working on a list of birds of South Africa.
> 
> But I agree with your point. His house, his rules.


Herons, do you know the mess they make on cars? No, I prefer the coal stove on the roof, it confuses the Herons and scares them away from the vehicles 🤣.


----------



## MattMatt

Dictum Veritas said:


> Herons, do you know the mess they make on cars? No, I prefer the coal stove on the roof, it confuses the Herons and scares them away from the vehicles 🤣.


I had heard that.


----------



## Htuna2

*


----------



## ABHale

Htuna2 said:


> The delivery guy could just be snooping around in the house since it is probably a lot nice than his.


Not with his wife home.


----------



## MattMatt

Htuna2 said:


> I am not denying that but I don't know any man that would go into the guest room (rarely used) and check out the bathroom, just saying. I asked my husband and he said he wouldn't do that.


He didn't say anything about going into the room, just that he noticed the position of the seat. Might have been through the open door, perhaps?


----------



## ABHale

Htuna2 said:


> I am not denying that but I don't know any man that would go into the guest room (rarely used) and check out the bathroom, just saying. I asked my husband and he said he wouldn't do that.


So you and your husband are the standard that everyone else follows? Do you know how arrogant what you said is?

He has had suspicions of something being off in the marriage for a while. He was looking to see what he could find.


----------



## Elizabeth001

ABHale said:


> So you and your husband are the standard that everyone else follows? Do you know how arrogant what you said is?
> 
> He has had suspicions of something being off in the marriage for a while. He was looking to see what he could find.


Or… he just happened to notice it out of the corner of his eye.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Tatsuhiko

Shouldn't someone ban or block Htuna2? I came here thinking there were relevant updates and all I found was babbling from someone who hadn't bothered to read the thread.


----------



## Htuna2

ABHale said:


> So you and your husband are the standard that everyone else follows? Do you know how arrogant what you said is?
> 
> He has had suspicions of something being off in the marriage for a while. He was looking to see what he could find.


I am not saying that. Only that that is MY experience. Again, I hope things work out for them and they are able to work through it.


----------



## Elizabeth001

Htuna2 said:


> I am not saying that. Only that that is MY experience. Again, I hope things work out for them and they are able to work through it.


What you meant to say was “I’m sorry…I was triggered by my own experiences. Let me go and read the whole thread and then perhaps I can offer an objective opinion”

You’re welcome. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Htuna2

*


----------



## Htuna2

Elizabeth001 said:


> What you meant to say was “I’m sorry…I was triggered by my own experiences. Let me go and read the whole thread and then perhaps I can offer an objective opinion”
> 
> You’re welcome.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Thank you, that would have been a better choice of words.


----------



## ABHale

If his wife is cheating, I hope he finds the best cutthroat, female, hot as hell lawyer. Then frees himself from someone that could do that to him.


----------



## sideways

Htuna2 said:


> I am not denying that but I don't personally know any man that would go into the guest room (rarely used) and check out the bathroom, just saying. I asked my husband and he said he wouldn't do that. I hope everything works out for both of them. If she is having an affair it will devastate the whole family. 😟


So your husband wouldn't so he speaks for ALL men??

I've done this (check out the guest bathroom) countless times. Does the TP and tissues magically replace themselves? Does the toilet clean itself? Does the floor get cleaned on its own? Does the sink get cleaned on its own? The shampoo, conditioner & soap in the shower get replaced on its own?


----------



## Htuna2

sideways said:


> So your husband wouldn't so he speaks for ALL men??
> 
> I've done this (check out the guest bathroom) countless times. Does the TP and tissues magically replace themselves? Does the toilet clean itself? Does the floor get cleaned on its own? Does the sink get cleaned on its own? The shampoo, conditioner & soap in the shower get replaced on its own?


I generally do all that.


----------



## Marc878

I go upstairs once a week or so and flush the toilet or clean it if needed. Run water in the sink and bathtub. Nothing unusual about doing that.


----------



## Beach123

And I can say that any toilet seat lid NOT closed to the down position would have had anyone n our household to be asking “who didn’t put the lid down?” 

Seriously, when things are out of the norm - people notice when they live in the same house and expectations have been laid out for years. 
When my kids were babies - the rule was close the lid - that way they didn’t mess with the water and the dog never drank from the toilet.

The lid is there so that it serves a purpose!


----------



## RebuildingMe

Besides for @Htuna2 being completely out of touch with reality, why are we still posting on this thread?


----------



## ccpowerslave

RebuildingMe said:


> Besides for @Htuna2 being completely out of touch with reality, why are we still posting on this thread?


I hope the OP is physically and mentally ok. With that said, I think we all know the real reason.

The giant dildo.


----------



## Diana7

ABHale said:


> If his wife is cheating, I hope he finds the best cutthroat, female, hot as hell lawyer. Then frees himself from someone that could do that to him.


Or a good male lawyer?


----------



## VladDracul

MattMatt said:


> Sometimes it's easy to forget that people come to TAM for help and advice, not to provide other members with entertainment.


Or maybe the "88 minutes" was the cliffhanger at the end of season one. We all knew at the time it was going to be a major screw up when HN didn't put one of the cameras inside the house.


----------



## MattMatt

How's it going, @HommeNu?


----------



## VladDracul

ABHale said:


> If his wife is cheating, I hope he finds the best cutthroat, female, hot as hell lawyer. Then frees himself from someone that could do that to him.


If she brought that cat around after HD discussed the toilet seat incident, she's stupid, got a set of balls bigger than the dildo found (if she were a guy), or both.


----------



## ABHale

Diana7 said:


> Or a good male lawyer?


Nope, it has to be a drop dead gorgeous female lawyer.


----------



## maquiscat

Htuna2 said:


> I generally do all that.


You may, but in our household, I tend to do that more often. There are plenty of other households where the man will do these things instead of the woman.


----------



## maquiscat

RebuildingMe said:


> Besides for @Htuna2 being completely out of touch with reality, why are we still posting on this thread?


To keep it handy in hopes the OP provides us an update?


----------



## Diana7

ABHale said:


> Nope, it has to be a drop dead gorgeous female lawyer.


Why?


----------



## ABHale

Diana7 said:


> Why?


Just because I could.


----------



## Enigma32

ABHale said:


> Nope, it has to be a drop dead gorgeous female lawyer.


Yup. This is how you do it. When I got divorced, I contacted a pretty young lawyer to work for me. In the end I didn't need her, but she was the one I was gonna go with.


----------



## Dictum Veritas

Male lawyer, female lawyer, who cares. Hire yourself the meanest shark in the tank with the reputation to match who specializes in men's rights in divorce. Tall, short, ugly as sin, beautiful as all the heavens, who cares. The most effective lawyer who is the best in the game, that's the one you want.


----------



## RandomDude

Well... sh-t... and here I thought it was likely one of his daughters sneaking in a boy.

88 minutes huh...


----------



## Thevengfulone

HommeNu said:


> I came home a day early from a business trip about six weeks ago and found the toilet seat up in our upstairs guest bathroom. This may not be remarkable in most households, but I (51) live with my wife (44) and our 3 daughters (17, 15, 13). Living with four women means always putting the toilet seat down. It is an accommodation to their gender that I have fully embraced. We haven’t had houseguests since the Before Times, and no one really uses that bathroom except for overnight guests so finding the toilet seat up in an empty house in the middle of the day in the middle of the work week is, to put it mildly, odd. My daughters and their friends were still at school. My wife was still at work. I checked the doorbell video log, but no one had come in the house since everyone left around 7:15 that morning. This would bother me no matter what, but in the past year or so I’ve noticed some distance from my wife—like not being fully present in the evenings after dinner or in the bedroom and I can’t put my finger on it, but there is definitely a disturbance in the force. And she’s been on a slight-to-medium edge ever since I asked her about the toilet seat. Obviously I suspect there’s been another male in my house, but I have no idea when or why. I have no real reason to suspect she's cheating, but we are hitting our mid-lives and humans can be human so it is a possibility that is weighing on me. I found this website and I’ve been reading various threads looking for advice. She’s not guarding her phone, or traveling for work, or going out with the girls, or disappearing for hours at a time. The only red flag I’ve seen is the open toilet seat, and the only red flag I feel in my gut is her distance. But my gut is worried. Very worried. Am I worrying for nothing? Your advice would be appreciated.


You should have not confronted her yet. Now they will be more careful about leaving evidence. Your gut is right. Her behavior is feeding your gut feelings. Don't mention anything else to her. Start checking your bedsheets, smells of aftershave. As much as I hate to say this check the crotch area in her panties. Install nanny cameras and VARs around your house.If shes banging him there you will find out


----------



## Diana7

Enigma32 said:


> Yup. This is how you do it. When I got divorced, I contacted a pretty young lawyer to work for me. In the end I didn't need her, but she was the one I was gonna go with.


I prefer a good lawyer/solicitor, the sex is immaterial.


----------



## ABHale

I will stop my thread jack.


----------



## Gabriel

Well, OP was on TAM 3 days ago, he's just lurking occasionally and not updating his thread. 

Hmm....


----------



## jsmart

I was hoping this was going to be one of the few false alarms we get on TAM but when they don’t come back it’s usually bad. Many BHs are afraid to admit the depth of the betrayal or the story that they are trying to accept because they know the response they will receive on TAM. It’s sad because just when they need the help the most, they instead go the MC route, which ends up being such a disaster for most BHs.


----------



## Theborg

Thevengfulone said:


> You should have not confronted her yet. Now they will be more careful about leaving evidence. Your gut is right. Her behavior is feeding your gut feelings. Don't mention anything else to her. Start checking your bedsheets, smells of aftershave. As much as I hate to say this check the crotch area in her panties. Install nanny cameras and VARs around your house.If shes banging him there you will find out


Really? Sniffing her panties? Hell, why not just slip a chastity belt on her when she's sleeping.... If it's THAT bad, just get a divorce. And hope the daughters don't find out that Dad is sneaking around videoing everyone in the house. Creepy.


----------



## Dictum Veritas

What I find really creepy is people telling a husband with a gut feeling that his wife is betraying him that any action he takes to allay or confirm his fears is creepy, manipulative or excessive when it's anything short of shaking the truth out of the spouse. One can't help but wonder what these people have to hide from their spouses and what they have gotten away with because their spouses didn't take the time or put in the effort to thoroughly investigate their own gut feelings.


----------



## Beach123

Gabriel said:


> Well, OP was on TAM 3 days ago, he's just lurking occasionally and not updating his thread.
> 
> Hmm....


Which usually indicates he doesn’t intend to take any action on her behavior.


----------



## ABHale

Gabriel said:


> Well, OP was on TAM 3 days ago, he's just lurking occasionally and not updating his thread.
> 
> Hmm....


After some of the post, I can understand.


----------



## VladDracul

Hell AB, the OP's got everybody torqued up with the 88 minutes his old lady spent with the delivery guy. He need to come back an finish the story. Ghosting us now will be worse than David Chase did us in series finale of the Sopranos.


----------



## ABHale

I think it went sideways with the talk and joking about average size. That had to be brutal to read after finding out about the 1 1/2 hrs it took to make a delivery. I don’t think I would come back if I was him.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

ABHale said:


> I think it went sideways with the talk and joking about average size. That had to be brutal to read after finding out about the 1 1/2 hrs it took to make a delivery. I don’t think I would come back if I was him.


This is all anonymous. That usually takes the edge off of fear and embarrassment. It could be a valuable lesson to others to know how this turned out. @HommeNu could provide either be a warning to those that feel something isn't quite right or a bright spot of hope in a usually dark place. Either way is valuable I think.


----------



## ABHale

Phone is messing up.


----------



## ABHale

BigDaddyNY said:


> This is all anonymous. That usually takes the edge off of fear and embarrassment. It could be a valuable lesson to others to know how this turned out. @HommeNu could provide either be a warning to those that feel something isn't quite right or a bright spot of hope in a usually dark place. Either way is valuable I think.


I think the joking around about the size of her toy was at the wrong time. Especially with the pain he was in at the time.


----------



## Jeffsmith35

HN experienced a traumatic realization of the worst kind. He was noticing a "Disturbance in the Force", so he began investigating and kept finding more things that unfortunately confirmed his gut feeling that something wasn't right. I hope he was able to play it cool upon arriving home after the latest discovery, while clandestinely preparing for a divorce filing, adding more hidden cameras, and (likely the most effective and safe method) installing several very-well-hidden VARs to gain more concrete evidence of exactly what is going on upstairs while he is away.
And I hope he has a trusted friend who can help him navigate through this possible nightmare. That friend would be able to listen to anything captured on the VARS for him, to protect him from emotional destruction. HN, we hope you are dealing with this as well as possible. Be well.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

ABHale said:


> I think the joking around about the size of her toy was at the wrong time. Especially with the pain he was in at the time.


You are right, this is no laughing matter. Quite the opposite.


----------



## VladDracul

ABHale said:


> I think it went sideways with the talk and joking about average size. That had to be brutal to read after finding out about the 1 1/2 hrs it took to make a delivery. I don’t think I would come back if I was him.


Here's the thing. Old HN was highly suspicious about the toilet seat, so much so he pursued the camera footage,and installed additional cameras outside purely out of suspicion and with the intention of watching his house. He queried his wife and daughters about the toilet seat alerting her that he was on to the possibility a visitor he may not approve of. She likely knew about the additional cameras and certainly was cognizant of his suspicions. His reporting of the 88 minute "visitation" by the delivery guys makes me want to ask the following questions.
1 Why would Katie bring a human dildo to the house knowing her old man was on high alert and was likely watching the cameras like a military drone pilot and would certainly catch the presents of a delivery van and people entering and exiting the house. (not withstanding possible spy cams planted inside)?
2. Since Katie owns the shop, why wouldn't she just close up for lunch and do the guy on the flower prep table without having to worry of HN or a daughter strolling in or just do the guy after the shop closed.
3. With HN's heightened awareness that maybe of some "friendly Henry" is slipping in the side door to service his old lady when he ain't around, why didn't he place a camera inside?
From my early career as a CPA, I'm going to need more numbers to make this thing add up.


----------



## In Absentia

VladDracul said:


> 2. Since Katie owns the shop, why wouldn't she just close up for lunch and do the guy on the flower prep table without having to worry of HN or a daughter strolling in or just do the guy after the shop closed.


She wants to use the monster dildo. I believe it was there before the husband installed the security cameras.


----------



## ABHale

VladDracul said:


> Here's the thing. Old HN was highly suspicious about the toilet seat, so much so he pursued the camera footage,and installed additional cameras outside purely out of suspicion and with the intention of watching his house. He queried his wife and daughters about the toilet seat alerting her that he was on to the possibility a visitor he may not approve of. She likely knew about the additional cameras and certainly was cognizant of his suspicions. His reporting of the 88 minute "visitation" by the delivery guys makes me want to ask the following questions.
> 1 Why would Katie bring a human dildo to the house knowing her old man was on high alert and was likely watching the cameras like a military drone pilot and would certainly catch the presents of a delivery van and people entering and exiting the house. (not withstanding possible spy cams planted inside)?
> 2. Since Katie owns the shop, why wouldn't she just close up for lunch and do the guy on the flower prep table without having to worry of HN or a daughter strolling in or just do the guy after the shop closed.
> 3. With HN's heightened awareness that maybe of some "friendly Henry" isslipping in the side door to service his old lady when he ain't around, why didn't he place a camera inside?
> From my early career as a CPA, I'm going to need more numbers to make this thing add up.



I don’t think she knew where he put the cameras. He did it while she and the girls were at the mall or out somewhere. 

Why close shop?? Especially if it is normally open all day. That would raise suspicion among her employees. Why did she lock the place up with delivery guy with her???

He found the toy hidden in her closet. It wasn’t with her other toys. He also didn’t search the house until he found the toilet seat up. It had been there for some time before the toilet seat. 

The home is the perfect place because delivery guy is coming by there on a normal routine to deliver flowers. OP is out of town on business. Girls are off doing their own thing or school.


----------



## VladDracul

When I was in the business, I'd never go by a woman's house unless the husband approved. That is a big mistake and increases the chances of catastrophe. Nevertheless, I know it does happen, primarily by folks who think there spouse is too lame brained to catch on to what's going on. Back in the day, I've serviced several women at there business locations and its really a relatively save haven when she owns the business and aware of security. Additionally, I don't think suspicions raise among her employee, if any, would be worse than suspicions raised by a delivery van parked for more than a few minutes in front of the house. My recommendation to her would be schedule the business delivery after hours. A delivery van by a flower shop would likely raise no more eyebrows than a white pickup truck at a construction site.
My question has to do with why she would do such a stupid thing as bring the guy in within days of HD becoming aware of another man in the house, unless she wanted to get caught (which was all but guaranteed). Maybe it was an oversight he didn't put a camera in the house, but not doing so with his high level of concerns about the toilet seat is perplexing.


----------



## Amanhasnoname

ABHale said:


> I think the joking around about the size of her toy was at the wrong time. Especially with the pain he was in at the time.


You could be right AB. 
Different people handle dificult circumstances in different ways, some like to see the funny side of it (I confess I'm one of these) a sort of don't let the bugg3rs get you down sort of approach, whilst others only see the serious, painful side of the equasion.
Whatever happened I hope HN is ok.


----------



## ABHale

Amanhasnoname said:


> You could be right AB.
> Different people handle dificult circumstances in different ways, some like to see the funny side of it (I confess I'm one of these) a sort of don't let the bugg3rs get you down sort of approach, whilst others only see the serious, painful side of the equasion.
> Whatever happened I hope HN is ok.


I think most people want to see the brighter side of something. It just isn’t possible right when your world just turned upside down. 

Your on a thread for insight and help. 

Then you catch a video of another man spending 90 mins in your home with your wife. 

As your world is falling apart, you come back to the thread and see people joking about a toy used by the WW. 

I can understand why someone wouldn’t come back after that. Talk about insult to injury.


----------



## Asterix

I hope that @HommeNu is still reading this thread even though he's not actively replying to it. 

All I'd like to say is this: It is perfectly okay and understandable how you feel about the situation. Also please understand that there are a lot of people here who have gone through similar or worse situations (not trying to marginalize your pain). Please ask your questions and the people here will do their best to answer your questions to get you safely through these turbulent times. 

Stay strong! We are rooting for you.


----------



## Elizabeth001

Asterix said:


> I hope that @HommeNu is still reading this thread even though he's not actively replying to it.
> 
> All I'd like to say is this: It is perfectly okay and understandable how you feel about the situation. Also please understand that there are a lot of people here who have gone through similar or worse situations (not trying to marginalize your pain). Please ask your questions and the people here will do their best to answer your questions to get you safely through these turbulent times.
> 
> Stay strong! We are rooting for you.


Especially if you found out negative things but want your marriage to work. Not saying that it can if that’s the case…just saying that feedback is helpful. 

Peeps around here can help you work towards whatever your goal is…even if you are just embarrassed that it turned out to be nothing. 

Anonymity is awesome 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Beach123

Well… it’s now been some more time that has passed so there should be more evidence that OP has learned since the last discovery.

Has the pattern continued? Have the cameras shown any other scenarios?

Or have your kids now been home again the past week or so?


----------



## Blondilocks

I hate cliffhangers.


----------



## Kaliber

@HommeNu had a gut feeling that something wasn't right!
The stuff he found, and the wife reaction when he cancelled his trip, it enforced that gut feeling!
I think he found out his wife was not faithful, his reaction at the hotel for just known about the 88min was rough!
The delivery guy was with his wife alone for 88min in his house, he knew at that moment that his beloved wife, the one that he devoted his life for and worked so hard to make her happy and secure betrayed him in the most horrible way!

He want back home and it was confirmed, he is going threw a lot of emotions (roller-coaster)
He must be in despair now!

He will soon be very angry, because he found out that: *He payed the full price (years of his life, emotions, support, resource ..Etc) for something that the other guy got for free!*
The other guy took one of the most precious thing in his life, for free, and easily, and inside his territory (his house, his home, his sanctuary), and the wife allowed that, enjoyed that, wanted that, she had no love or respect for her husband!

@HommeNu, you don't need to update us!
Just be strong!
Because life is not fair, and only the strong will survive!


----------



## Theborg

Or he found nothing at all and doesn't want to come back here and be told that he needs to stone her anyway.


----------



## VladDracul

Kaliber said:


> He must be in despair now!


Knowing not only was she banging the delivery guy, but realizing she is a lot dumber than he ever imagined. Now that what he believed to be his greatest fear is confirmed, he is faced with the possibility that a far greater fear is his daughters may have received their cognitive abilities from their mother rather than from him.


----------



## VladDracul

Theborg said:


> Or he found nothing at all and doesn't want to come back here and be told that he needs to stone her anyway.


Yah, I agree. Out of the many reasons the delivery guy could have spent 1 1/2 in his house, banging his old lady is just one of um.


----------



## TDSC60

The delivery guy spending 1.5 hours in the house can be explained by many logical reasons other than an affair.

He shows up just as she starts preparing lunch and asks him to join just to be polite.

She wants to discuss scheduled deliveries for the following few days with him.

She needs to go over his work schedule due to some reason.

At this point it is a "wait and see" if he installs cameras inside to get undeniable proof.


----------



## Jeffsmith35

TDSC60 said:


> The delivery guy spending 1.5 hours in the house can be explained by many logical reasons other than an affair.
> 
> He shows up just as she starts preparing lunch and asks him to join just to be polite.
> 
> She wants to discuss scheduled deliveries for the following few days with him.
> 
> She needs to go over his work schedule due to some reason.
> 
> At this point it is a "wait and see" if he installs cameras inside to get undeniable proof.


That doesn't explain "Jerry" using the upstairs toilet to pee and leaving the lid up. Why would he go up there when the main floor bathroom is more convenient? That's the thing that began this thread. Think of a reason for him to be upstairs if his visit was innocent.....


----------



## MattMatt

Jeffsmith35 said:


> That doesn't explain "Jerry" using the upstairs toilet to pee and leaving the lid up. Why would he go up there when the main floor bathroom is more convenient? That's the thing that began this thread. Think of a reason for him to be upstairs if his visit was innocent.....


He felt awkward using the family karzi?


----------



## VladDracul

Jeffsmith35 said:


> Think of a reason for him to be upstairs if his visit was innocent.....


Changing the filter on the upstairs A/C?


----------



## Mr.Married

VladDracul said:


> Changing the filter on the upstairs A/C?


Too embarrassing to shat downstairs ?

Wheew ...... someone grab the air freshener!!!


----------



## mickybill

Jeffsmith35 said:


> That doesn't explain "Jerry" using the upstairs toilet to pee and leaving the lid up. Why would he go up there when the main floor bathroom is more convenient? That's the thing that began this thread. Think of a reason for him to be upstairs if his visit was innocent.....


There is no proof that Jerry left up the lid. But since there are a lot of hammer owners here everything looks like a nail.
There is a helluva lot of connecting unseen dots in this thread, with no info people fill it in with their own ideas.
Sad part is that this was compared to a tv show that ended without a simple solution (Sopranos), don't forget that this guy may be going thru the worst thing he can imagine. It's life not HBO.
There are like 25 reasons why he ain't popping in at TAM everyday. 
I hope he and his family are ok.


----------



## snerg

mickybill said:


> *There is no proof that Jerry left up the lid.* But since there are a lot of hammer owners here everything looks like a nail.
> There is a helluva lot of connecting unseen dots in this thread, with no info people fill it in with their own ideas.


I agree to a point. There's a lot of speculation.
However.
If it walks like a duck.
If it quacks like a duck.
There's a high probability it's a duck.



mickybill said:


> I hope he and his family are ok.


This is the main item.


----------



## mickybill

snerg said:


> I agree to a point. There's a lot of speculation.
> However.
> If it walks like a duck.
> If it quacks like a duck.
> There's a high probability it's a duck.
> 
> 
> This is the main item.


To invoke Occam's razor...is the simplest answer to a toilet lid left up that the wife is having an affair with an employee in the house that has 3(?) kids and a husband living there? To me, no.

But something brought the OP to an infidelity site so there's a good chance that I am totally wrong...


----------



## Blondilocks

I think Jerry brought the flowers to the house and decided they needed a little drink so he immersed the stems in the toilet and then he spent his typical 88 minutes arranging them in vases.


----------



## BruceBanner

Rus47 said:


> Obviously they never loved anyone but themselves, entitled to what they want when they want it. What amazes me is why these narcissists don't just remain single and play the field as widely as they wish. No one would care and no innocents hurt. Maybe they have a sadistic streak as well.


There are adulterers on r/adultery who say they get off on the taboo, naughtiness, and the thrill of being caught.


----------



## Talker67

BruceBanner said:


> There are adulterers on r/adultery who say they get off on the taboo, naughtiness, and *the thrill of being caught.
> *



this is for certain!


----------



## Talker67

Dictum Veritas said:


> What I find really creepy is people telling a husband with a gut feeling that his wife is betraying him that any action he takes to allay or confirm his fears is creepy, manipulative or excessive when it's anything short of shaking the truth out of the spouse. One can't help but wonder what these people have to hide from their spouses and what they have gotten away with because their spouses didn't take the time or put in the effort to thoroughly investigate their own gut feelings.


you need proof,
while a "gut feeling" is not to be ignored, sometimes you are just paranoid and NOTHING is actually going on!

VARs are relatively cheap and easy to hide.


----------



## ABHale

Talker67 said:


> you need proof,
> while a "gut feeling" is not to be ignored, sometimes you are just paranoid and NOTHING is actually going on!
> 
> VARs are relatively cheap and easy to hide.


No you don’t need proof. 

Disconnecting from your SO. 

Showing your negative feelings that you won’t be going out of town this week. 

Having another man in the house for 90 mins when you are out of town. 

That would be everything I would need. Because I would never do that to my wife. I would never do anything that even looked like I could be cheating. There is no reason to have a male employee in there home by herself. If he needed to talk, they could have gone to a coffee shop.


----------



## VladDracul

ABHale said:


> If he needed to talk, they could have gone to a coffee shop.


Or just "talked" at the business after hours  If I were to take over finishing my version of the story, I'd have the husband setting up a fake trip and catching the tattooed delivery guy (you know, the bad boy type) inserting flowers in the wife's vase. When the police discovered the bad boy's body, the detective would notice a tattoo on his pecker saying "Welcome". Later that day, the detective inquired of the coroner as to the official cause of death and jokenly mentioned the tattoo on the deceased's pecker. The coroner said, "the 'Welcome' showed when the guy was soft. When erect it said, "Welcome to Cincinnati. Have a nice day".


----------



## Blondilocks

VladDracul said:


> When erect it said, "Welcome to Cincinnati. Have a nice day".


Every guy's dream.😂 Santa must be so bored.


----------



## manfromlamancha

How is it that this thread is still going when there is no sight of the OP???? Shouldn't it be closed by now?


----------



## VladDracul

Ought to be closed; lest jokers like some of you guys will mistakenly think folks have been snookered an keep making facetious comments.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

It sure would be good to hear from @HommeNu


----------



## Kabontee

Although not always, I find people getting on the edge is a defensive tactic to make one feel good for some things they are covering up not necessarily cheating. Having succeeded to raise a daughter to 17 years implies a long and quality relationship. It is best to let go since nasty things come up when the person in a relationship starts to investigate their own relationship and look for other pursuits like spending more quality time with your daughters which will bring you more satisfaction than knowing who left the seat up.


----------



## Livvie

Kabontee said:


> Although not always, I find people getting on the edge is a defensive tactic to make one feel good for some things they are covering up not necessarily cheating. Having succeeded to raise a daughter to 17 years implies a long and quality relationship. It is best to let go since nasty things come up when the person in a relationship starts to investigate their own relationship and look for other pursuits like spending more quality time with your daughters which will bring you more satisfaction than knowing who left the seat up.


So you are saying nasty things come up when you investigate something odd so it's best not to investigate?

What a completely unhealthy way to live life.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

Livvie said:


> So you are saying nasty things come up when you investigate something odd so it's best not to investigate?
> 
> What a completely unhealthy way to live life.


Some people are okay with blissful ignorance. Problem is, the situation you are ignorant about still existing and is often a ticking time bomb waiting for you to find it. Then when it blows up you look and feel like an oblivious idiot. I would rather know and take situation head on.


----------



## LATERILUS79

Saw that OP was on here last night. Would have been nice for him to post a reply.


----------



## MattMatt

LATERILUS79 said:


> Saw that OP was on here last night. Would have been nice for him to post a reply.


People are here to get help, not to entertain us. When @HommeNu has something to tell us, he will. But in his own time.


----------



## LATERILUS79

MattMatt said:


> People are here to get help, not to entertain us. When @HommeNu has something to tell us, he will. But in his own time.


Fair point, MattMatt. I can see how my wording can be interpretted in that manner. That certainly was not my intent.


----------



## BruceBanner

BigDaddyNY said:


> It sure would be good to hear from @HommeNu


Don't rush him; This isn't Jerry Springers. If he needs our advice he'll be back. In situations like these I assume the worst and that the spouse's worst fears were realized.



Kabontee said:


> Although not always, I find people getting on the edge is a defensive tactic to make one feel good for some things they are covering up not necessarily cheating. Having succeeded to raise a daughter to 17 years implies a long and quality relationship. It is best to let go since nasty things come up when the person in a relationship starts to investigate their own relationship and look for other pursuits like spending more quality time with your daughters which will bring you more satisfaction than knowing who left the seat up.


I know this is off-topic but have you ever been cheated on? Are you speaking from experience? What you said sounds like a coping mechanism.


----------



## Kamstel2

Just checking in to see how you are doing.

Hope you are well.

Hang in there. You will get through this


----------



## re16

Everytime we approach a Tuesday / Wednesday, I wonder if HN is on a trip and conducting surveillance in an attempt to obtain hard evidence. If the evidence search has been going on this many weeks, it must be torture. Hopefully he is hanging in there.


----------



## mickybill

I just think he found out yes or no about the affair and decided that this wasn't his thing...


----------



## Tatsuhiko

mickybill said:


> I just think he found out yes or no about the affair and decided that this wasn't his thing...


Another possibility: sometimes the betrayed spouse goes to see an attorney who advises him/her to stop posting online.


----------



## HommeNu

Hello. I am still here, alive. And I am still human. I appreciate your concern. I cannot say I appreciated all the jokes at my expense. I am afraid I cannot say anything more at the moment on the advice of my lawyer and at request of our local police detectives. Hopefully, I may be able to fill in some of the blanks after this week. I haven't decided to, though; I don't feel like being fodder for d*ckhead jokesters anymore.


----------



## sideways

Strength for whatever you're dealing with!!


----------



## Evinrude58

Hoping you found some evidence so even if you’re hurting from it, you have some concrete info that you can use to go forward with your life. Judging by the attorney and detectives involved, it appears you have learned the worst.
Very sorry. I had hoped this was a rare care that your gut was wrong.😣


----------



## maquiscat

HommeNu said:


> Hello. I am still here, alive. And I am still human. I appreciate your concern. I cannot say I appreciated all the jokes at my expense. I am afraid I cannot say anything more at the moment on the advice of my lawyer and at request of our local police detectives. Hopefully, I may be able to fill in some of the blanks after this week. I haven't decided to, though; I don't feel like being fodder for d*ckhead jokesters anymore.


Sadly, you won't avoid such jokesters. They are everywhere. But plenty of us are interested in knowing what the outcome is, whenever it finally comes about. It's enough to know now that there is progress, even if it comes in the form of "I can't say anything for now". Just check in every couple of weeks or so, and say still an ongoing event or something.


----------



## RebuildingMe

Glad to see you back. I was following your thread. Don’t worry about the people who got out of line. There are others here that can help, even if you just want to vent. Plenty of good people that have been through cheating spouses that want to help and provide some advice. Best of luck to you OP!


----------



## Marc878

HommeNu said:


> Hello. I am still here, alive. And I am still human. I appreciate your concern. I cannot say I appreciated all the jokes at my expense. I am afraid I cannot say anything more at the moment on the advice of my lawyer and at request of our local police detectives. Hopefully, I may be able to fill in some of the blanks after this week. I haven't decided to, though; I don't feel like being fodder for d*ckhead jokesters anymore.


Sorry you’re here. Most are here for your benefit. Take care.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

HommeNu said:


> Hello. I am still here, alive. And I am still human. I appreciate your concern. I cannot say I appreciated all the jokes at my expense. I am afraid I cannot say anything more at the moment on the advice of my lawyer and at request of our local police detectives. Hopefully, I may be able to fill in some of the blanks after this week. I haven't decided to, though; I don't feel like being fodder for d*ckhead jokesters anymore.


So sorry about those making jokes. I only hope for your sake that you are okay as can be and are coping with your situation.


----------



## MattMatt

@HommeNu *Speaking as a moderator, if you find any post that you feel is mocking you or is rude, please report them.*


----------



## MattMatt

I have a horrible feeling that we have been here before with another member. Remember when a member found out that his wife wasn't just cheating she was also involved in some serious illegal acts?

I get the feeling something similar might be happening here.


----------



## ccpowerslave

Either way it is really bad. If both ways at the same time super super bad especially with the kids.


----------



## re16

HommeNu said:


> Hello. I am still here, alive. And I am still human. I appreciate your concern. I cannot say I appreciated all the jokes at my expense. I am afraid I cannot say anything more at the moment on the advice of my lawyer and at request of our local police detectives. Hopefully, I may be able to fill in some of the blanks after this week. I haven't decided to, though; I don't feel like being fodder for d*ckhead jokesters anymore.


Sorry to hear that it sounds like something was going on. Maybe request to have this thread moved to Private section.

We're here for you if you need us.

Stay strong and remember this is not your fault. Hoping you and the daughters are all ok...


----------



## MattMatt

Due to recent developments this thread was moved to the private section.


----------



## HommeNu

Why has this thread been made private?! I did not request this. Please return it to the status quo previous.


----------



## bobert

HommeNu said:


> Why has this thread been made private?! I did not request this. Please return it to the status quo previous.


All private does is stop it from showing up in search engines and stops non-registered users from seeing it... Nothing else changes.


----------



## HommeNu

MattMatt said:


> Due to recent developments this thread was moved to the private section.





bobert said:


> All private does is stop it from showing up in search engines and stops non-registered users from seeing it... Nothing else changes.





bobert said:


> All private does is stop it from showing up in search engines and stops non-registered users from seeing it... Nothing else changes.


Super-frustrating. Maybe once I’ve filled in the details you’ll see I want this public. Please Mr. MattMattModerator, please return this to public. If I feel it needs privatized, I (me, myself and I) will ask you for the transfer.


----------



## farsidejunky

HommeNu said:


> Super-frustrating. Maybe once I’ve filled in the details you’ll see I want this public. Please Mr. MattMattModerator, please return this to public. If I feel it needs privatized, I (me, myself and I) will ask you for the transfer.


Moved from private based on your request. I put it in CWI unless you think it more appropriate in another section. 

And to repeat what Matt indicated, if you feel a post is inappropriate, please report it.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## ABHale

How are your girls H?


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## Beach123

Glad you are alive and ok.


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## jsmart

It’s amazing how that internal feeling in your gut about spouse is hardly ever wrong. The initial impetus for the thread may have been around @HommeNu spidey senses going off over finding the toilet seat up in the guess bathroom that’s upstairs in a house with all girls but it was all in an environment in which he could feel his wife distancing herself. So even though he chose the toilet seat thing fir the title, it was that feeling in the gut that really brought him here. 

With mention of police, I truly hope this doesn’t involve his daughters.


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## TDSC60

HN, did you hire a PI? Mentioning an attorney and police detective advising you to stay quiet has my curiosity peaking.

Definitely follow the attorney's advice. I wish you and your kids the best.


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## Diana7

The police were involved when I had to separate from my husband and it's not nice at all and I feel for you. 
Obviously no forums like this 22 years ago ,I never shared anything on line and I have still never said what happened anywhere in public (just a handful of close family/ friends know), so be careful about what you say in public, especially on the internet, when others are involved.


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## jorgegene

this does not sound like a joking matter at all. hope that things get resolved for the better, one way or the other.


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## Asterix

@HommeNu , it is understandable that you don't want to subject yourself to the juvenile humor of the jokesters/jerks. Unfortunately there will always be people like this. But there are well meaning people here as well who would want to see that you do well and that you take care of yourself. They will give their suggestions/two cents etc. which may (or may not) help you see the situation from a different point of view and gain additional insights. I'd suggest that you ignore the jerks and ask for any suggestions/advice that you need. The mods can and will remove the offending posts from this thread.

Hope you are doing well otherwise and taking care of yourself right now.


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## jjj858

Wondering about police being involved. They don’t get in the middle of civil issues like this so I’m curious as to how a criminal element can be involved.


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## re16

jjj858 said:


> Wondering about police being involved. They don’t get in the middle of civil issues like this so I’m curious as to how a criminal element can be involved.


I can think of quite a few scenarios, and none of them are good. Will await the news from HN... For some reason, I have a feeling this is something seriously nefarious.


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## Diana7

jjj858 said:


> Wondering about police being involved. They don’t get in the middle of civil issues like this so I’m curious as to how a criminal element can be involved.


Coud be all sorts of things.


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## farsidejunky

@HommeNu I am closing this thread for now. Speculation and bickering tend to run rampant in the absence of the OP posting. It can be reopened at ANY TIME. All you have to do is PM me or any of the following:

@MattMatt 
@EleGirl 
@lifeistooshort 

As soon as you are ready, let one of us know. Until then, I wish the very best for you.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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