# We're good people and that was our downfall...



## hurtingbadly (Sep 14, 2011)

After being on this forum for awhile, I have come to the realization maybe we were all too good? We trusted too much and our WS's ran with that and took advantage of it. I dunno... Looking back I feel like I gave him too much freedom, let him go out with his friends without question. I was just too easy to cheat on. Maybe I should have made him more accountable in this family? Just thinking out loud! :scratchhead:


----------



## Hope Springs Eternal (Oct 6, 2012)

hurtingbadly said:


> After being on this forum for awhile, I have come to the realization maybe we were all too good? We trusted too much and our WS's ran with that and took advantage of it. I dunno... Looking back I feel like I gave him too much freedom, let him go out with his friends without question. I was just too easy to cheat on. Maybe I should have made him more accountable in this family? Just thinking out loud! :scratchhead:


It's a sad state of affairs when we have to use a term like "trust too much." Seems trust should be an absolute, but it's just not. What percentage of trust is appropriate?


----------



## hurtingbadly (Sep 14, 2011)

bobka said:


> It's a sad state of affairs when we have to use a term like "trust too much." Seems trust should be an absolute, but it's just not. What percentage of trust is appropriate?


You're totally right. We're supposed to trust our spouse, but looking at all of us on here... I dunno know anymore.


----------



## SadandAngry (Aug 24, 2012)

I don't think so. The fault is inside the cheater, not the bs, and it is usually invisible. You don't know who will make that particular mistake and who won't in the same circumstance. Many will, many won't, both are normal.


----------



## BjornFree (Aug 16, 2012)

hurtingbadly said:


> After being on this forum for awhile, I have come to the realization maybe we were all too good? We trusted too much and our WS's ran with that and took advantage of it. I dunno... Looking back I feel like I gave him too much freedom, let him go out with his friends without question. I was just too easy to cheat on. Maybe I should have made him more accountable in this family? Just thinking out loud! :scratchhead:


Lets look at it this way, if you had curtailed his freedom and had held him accountable, he still could've used the reason that you were controlling to justify his affair.


----------



## joe kidd (Feb 8, 2011)

I wouldn't say I was too good. More like indifferent. Not hard to sneak something by someone who doesn't even acknowledge your existence.


----------



## Left With 4.5 (Aug 4, 2012)

We're supposed to trust our spouses because that's what married people are supposed to do. It's sad that the WS takes advantage of it and do what they do, leaving us betrayed spouses with issues of ever trusting anyone again. Sad.


----------



## Hope Springs Eternal (Oct 6, 2012)

Left With 4.5 said:


> We're supposed to trust our spouses because that's what married people are supposed to do. It's sad that the WS takes advantage of it and do what they do, leaving us betrayed spouses with issues of ever trusting anyone again. Sad.


That's exactly right. Why would you marry someone if you didn't feel you could trust them_ completely?_

If you didn't, what kind of fool would you be?


----------



## So Sad Lady (Aug 31, 2012)

I've pondered this same question for many months. Did we trust too much? Or are we married to completely selfish people? Would our actions or behavior stopped our WS's from straying if we did not trust so much? 

For me, trust was just "there" after 23 years of being together. It wasn't something I ever questioned. It was a given. (makes me sick to even think about it now).

But no, I will not say he strayed because I trusted too much. I will say I am the fool though, for being so trusting. 

And it will never be the same again.

In R, but will never trust blindly, will never have the same faith in my H. But would suspect that even if we parted, and if I were to find someone else, I'd have the same perspective.

The sad truth I've learned after a few decades, is that the only person I can trust is myself. Period.


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Being a betrayed spouse I can say i was not to good...in fact I was criminal in what I did to my WW, but the fact remains that healthy marriages just like unhealthy marriages will have infidelity. 

It all boils down to how the wayward deals with there own sh1t.

For examble pushing my wife around was criminal and she had every right to leave but instead, stayed and slept around. were as some folks go above and behond being a good spouse and still get screwed over.

As betrayed spouse's its not us ....its them and how the wayward deal with there own crap. Thats my $0.02

Again, no matter what, being good poeple or not .....its them not us!!!!!!!


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

Left With 4.5 said:


> We're supposed to trust our spouses because that's what married people are supposed to do. It's sad that the WS takes advantage of it and do what they do, leaving us betrayed spouses with issues of ever trusting anyone again. Sad.


When my wife had her affair I was shattered and blamed her 100%.

I stayed for the children, and later in my loneliness I developed feelings for someone else. I didn't plan to, I didn't know how to handle it. It gave me a new appreciation for how she had fallen into infidelity.

I was lucky that my potential OW was a moral person and no impropriety was possible, my wife was unlucky that the person she developed feelings for was a horny young male who felt no guilt trying to get into her pants regardless of the impact to her long term future and family.

But if I can't trust her I can't trust myself. 

And I've known her 30 years now...the affair was 22 years ago. She is one of the most decent, moral and caring people I know, and more worthy of trust than anyone else I know, including me.

Doesn't mean I'm not sad sometimes, but this is the real world. Nobody said it was meant to be easy.


----------



## B1 (Jun 14, 2012)

joe kidd said:


> I wouldn't say I was too good. More like indifferent. Not hard to sneak something by someone who doesn't even acknowledge your existence.


wow..right there with you Joe on this one.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## 5Creed (May 29, 2011)

I think the majority of people get married and plan to stay faithful to their spouse. Not trusting that your husband or wife will remain faithful to you for the life of your marriage doesn't usually enter your mind; at least it didn't in mine. My STBX and I had the "model" marriage. We really did have things together at one time. Put each other first and we had the us against the world thinking. Before we knew it though, we had stopped working on the marriage.

I know for a fact-because he told me-that he did not set out to have an inappropriate relationship with anyone. Our marriage was fracturing and she was there to listen to him so he shut me out.

I think with all relationships, marriage or even dating exclusively is a leap of faith. Moving forward, I know I have a new awareness of what can happen and how some parts of a relationship are so fragile and need attention and care.


----------



## Torrivien (Aug 26, 2012)

I think about this matter every day.
There's a french saying: Trop bon, trop con. Meaning: Too nice, too dumb.

I really believe that all the fault lies inside the cheater, no matter what circumstances led to cheating but I definetly won't look at people the same way, I did. I know it's wrong to generalize but it isn't something I can control.

Trust is a binary thing, in my opinion. So either you trust, or you don't. So from now on, I'll give people the benefit of the doubt, but the doubt will always be there.


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

5Creed said:


> I think the majority of people get married and plan to stay faithful to their spouse. Not trusting that your husband or wife will remain faithful to you for the life of your marriage doesn't usually enter your mind; at least it didn't in mine. My STBX and I had the "model" marriage. We really did have things together at one time. Put each other first and we had the us against the world thinking. Before we knew it though, we had stopped working on the marriage.
> 
> I know for a fact-because he told me-that he did not set out to have an inappropriate relationship with anyone. Our marriage was fracturing and she was there to listen to him so he shut me out.
> 
> I think with all relationships, marriage or even dating exclusively is a leap of faith. Moving forward, I know I have a new awareness of what can happen and how some parts of a relationship are so fragile and need attention and care.


Exactly right.

To me this was key with reconciling with my wife. I either had to take the leap of faith with her again, or with someone else (or stay alone).

I judged she was a better than average risk, and that we could avoid a repeat of the mistakes. So far so good.

Mind you it was a long process to get to that point! When I first stayed it was for the kids and I didn't trust her at all.


----------



## foreverhealing (Oct 14, 2012)

I agree with bjorn free and wazza, no matter what we could've done, it could've still happened because we can't control anyone but ourselves. We can choose to rebuild the marriage with our repentant spouses or with a new stranger that possibly could cheat.? That's one reason i stayed in my marriage, the risk is lower that my h will cheat again, especially if we stay in tune to each other. We learned how to be married. Who wants to start over with an unlearned person? Going through infidelity is traumatic, can't imagine going through it again.


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

foreverhealing said:


> I agree with bjorn free and wazza, no matter what we could've done, it could've still happened because we can't control anyone but ourselves. We can choose to rebuild the marriage with our repentant spouses or with a new stranger that possibly could cheat.? That's one reason i stayed in my marriage, the risk is lower that my h will cheat again, especially if we stay in tune to each other. We learned how to be married. Who wants to start over with an unlearned person? Going through infidelity is traumatic, can't imagine going through it again.


I like your user name. Says it all really.


----------



## AngryandUsed (Jun 23, 2011)

Hurting badly,

You gave freedom to him and it was your good nature.
He cheated and it was his bad nature.

Even if you had been strict with him, he could have found ways to cheat.

Now that you know about lies, even from the close ones, you will remain vigilant in future. Hard lesson, indeed.


----------



## hurtingbadly (Sep 14, 2011)

AngryandUsed said:


> Hurting badly,
> 
> You gave freedom to him and it was your good nature.
> He cheated and it was his bad nature.
> ...


Yep, I'm no longer naive.


----------



## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

hurtingbadly said:


> After being on this forum for awhile, I have come to the realization maybe we were all too good? We trusted too much and our WS's ran with that and took advantage of it. I dunno... Looking back I feel like I gave him too much freedom, let him go out with his friends without question. I was just too easy to cheat on. Maybe I should have made him more accountable in this family? Just thinking out loud! :scratchhead:


I agree, and I did the same, and I feel the same as you. 

In one book on infidelity I remember a case history reported in which a doctor who was cheating on his loyal loving very unsuspiscious supportive wife, actually admitted in counseling that his wife made it "too darn easy to cheat".

Also, recent university studies on "mate guarding" a nice way to say suspiscious and posessive and watchful of the spouse's free time, are cheated on faaaaar less, than spouses that give their spouse too much freedom for Boys or girls nights out or men or girl's only trips. 

My brothers used to warn me too, that I was giving my spouse too much freedom. 

Still, I do think that there has to be some character flaw in the cheater for them to take advantage of a loving easygoing spouse, and think it is okay. 

Also, perhaps some of the personality disordered cheaters actually pick a naive, easy going spouse knowing they eventually intend to cheat and are hoping it will be easier to get away with it.

The mate gaurding research flies in the face or earlier claims that being too posessive will drive a mate away. 

I think, in my case, following that advice, was partially enabled my STBEH to cheat.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

I think we should trust but we should also be LOGICAL. If a spouse continues to find ways to put their needs above yours, it's time to ramp that down a bit.


----------



## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

I cannot or do not want to apologize because of the way that I was reared by two loving parents. A combination of the good that they showed me coupled with some bad experiences made me at least, I feel, who it is that I am today. And I know that it's vastly out of character for a male to even entertain envisioning the aura of a perfect marriage where everything is as close to bliss as possible, but, fortunately or unfortunately, I have done so.

I don't really know if that is in my genetic makeup, or has something to do with my Christian faith and teachings, but it, by and large, represents who I am.

Good, caring, and, yes, Christian people do stray; both intentionally and unintentionally, more often than not under the cloak of coversion.

I would think that the difference in me and a lot of people like me is that we have a spiritual conscience that helps to govern our actions, always letting us know that such actions would not only serve to hurt our spouses, but our children, extended family, and loving friends just as much.

I'm thinking that the price of infidelity is just far too expensive for the scant and fleeting scintilla of pleasure that one comes to derive from it!


----------



## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> I'm thinking that the price of infidelity is just far too expensive for the scant and fleeting scintilla of pleasure that one comes to derive from it!


I agree. Despite numerous invitations to cheat with desirable men, I always thought the price of it was too high for moments of illicit pleasures. 

Despite these men being just as attractive but typically far wealthier than my husband I chose to remain faithful for many reasons including that I love my spouse and would not want to inflict so much emotional harm on him for a brief thrill.

This brings us to issues of impulse control. 

Perhaps cheaters have difficulty with impulse control. 

If that is true, reconciliations will rarely work in the long haul. 

They may work while there is some financial reason or superficial reason for the cheater to reconcile, that mostly benefits them, but eventually they will once again FAIL to exert impulse control.


----------



## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

foreverhealing said:


> I agree with bjorn free and wazza, no matter what we could've done, it could've still happened because we can't control anyone but ourselves. We can choose to rebuild the marriage with our repentant spouses or with a new stranger that possibly could cheat.? That's one reason i stayed in my marriage, the risk is lower that my h will cheat again, especially if we stay in tune to each other. We learned how to be married. Who wants to start over with an unlearned person? Going through infidelity is traumatic, can't imagine going through it again.


I don't understand the logic behind this, though I am for second chances and rebuilding. 

I could state the opposite: We can choose to rebuild with a person that we KNOW to be capable of cheating. Or find a new partner who within 60-75% chance doesn't commit to cheating (depending on statistics). Just saying


----------



## fishfast41 (Dec 12, 2010)

I never in my wildest nightmares thought something like this could happen to my marriage. The funny thing is that I'm not a trusting person by nature..I think that through previous experience in my life that most people are not to be trusted at all. My wife and I dated for 4 years before marriage. I waited that long to ask her mainly because it took me that long to assure myself that she could indeed be trusted. That being said,I always figured that you have to trust your spouse, or you have no marriage. This is why she was able to do what she did without me finding out for a while. I learned better than to trust anyone completely a long time ago, and now that I did trust once again, I got stabbed in the back once again. I don't think I'll ever be able to trust my wife ever again because of this, and if I decide to stay with her,she's just going to have to learn to deal with that. But in that case, do I still have a viable marriage?


----------



## underwater2010 (Jun 27, 2012)

While I agree that I am a good person, I don't feel that my kindness and trust give any person a reason to disrespect or dishonor me. Yet that is often how society works. There are always people loking to get one over on somebody.

Think about it this way, we either get walked all over being the nice guy or your a controlling b**** for not allowing guy time.


----------



## Wazza (Jul 23, 2012)

fishfast41 said:


> I never in my wildest nightmares thought something like this could happen to my marriage. The funny thing is that I'm not a trusting person by nature..I think that through previous experience in my life that most people are not to be trusted at all. My wife and I dated for 4 years before marriage. I waited that long to ask her mainly because it took me that long to assure myself that she could indeed be trusted. That being said,I always figured that you have to trust your spouse, or you have no marriage. This is why she was able to do what she did without me finding out for a while. I learned better than to trust anyone completely a long time ago, and now that I did trust once again, I got stabbed in the back once again. I don't think I'll ever be able to trust my wife ever again because of this, and if I decide to stay with her,she's just going to have to learn to deal with that. But in that case, do I still have a viable marriage?


100% trust, probably no. I am back at 99% and I'll live with that.


----------



## gumby0811 (Oct 14, 2012)

_Posted via Mobile Device_I keep asking myself this same question. My WS even had friends tell him in the past that he was lucky I didn't hound him like their wives did and say they were surprised I didn't.... But if I wasn't that way then I wouldn't be the easy going woman he fell in love with.


----------



## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

gumby0811 said:


> _Posted via Mobile Device_I keep asking myself this same question. My WS even had friends tell him in the past that he was lucky I didn't hound him like their wives did and say they were surprised I didn't.... But if I wasn't that way then I wouldn't be the easy going woman he fell in love with.


The scary part is that some shrinks opine that cheaters by nature target trusting honest naive people. 

They do this knowing it will be easier to get over on them. 

Yes, In my circles too, both men and women would chastise me for allowing my husband too much freedom for BNO's and men's trips. 

They were right, too. He used these things as covers for his cheating. 

I wonder how many of his male friends knew this and were afraid to tell me out right.


----------



## hurtingbadly (Sep 14, 2011)

Sara8 said:


> The scary part is that some shrinks opine that cheaters by nature target trusting honest naive people.
> 
> They do this knowing it will be easier to get over on them.
> 
> ...


My WS's male friends knew, but then again they were doing the same thing. Just they got caught earlier and he got away with it longer. He used to tell me how awful they were. Wow, was I stupid.


----------



## gumby0811 (Oct 14, 2012)

See the 2 friends i know of of my WH who said these things to him are his best friends, and the only friends he has told all of this to. He went to them for support assuming they would take his side and BOTH of these guys have done the exact opposite, they told him he is an idiot and a few other choice names. One of them (his best man at our wedding) called me checking to see how i am dealing and has been a very great support through all of this for me (his wife and i are best friends as well). I never thought his friends would support me but they have. So not all WS' friends are accessories to the bad behavior. The biggest thing this has taught me about myself though is that I have to start standing up for myself and start having my needs met instead of being his doormat, and that the people in our lives WILL support me in this


----------



## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Sara8 said:


> The scary part is that some shrinks opine that cheaters by nature target trusting honest naive people.
> 
> They do this knowing it will be easier to get over on them.


It truly makes me wonder the very same thing. In my case, my STBXW had her two out-of-town BF's, both while I was cohabitating with her as well as post-separation. Her cell phone logs revealed massive numbers(thousands) of minutes and texts expended on them, indicative of a minimum of EA's; her cell phone travel logs more accurately indicate PA, by her frequent overnight/weekend travels to their home cities as well as to getaway cities like New Orleans.

Now if there are two people that STBXW logged in even more cell-phone minutes with moreso than with the OM, it would have been either her best girlfriend in college and business partner in a major SE city, or her ex-neighbor girlfriend that lives in the Midwest.

It really makes me wonder if STBXW ever bled any of the details of her affairs to them, or if like everyone else, they, too, were kept in the dark about all of those lurid details!


----------



## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

I've thinking a bit about this subject. I think the title of the thread is a bit troublesome. It suggest that it was your good qualities and traits that made your world fall to pieces. 

While it's easy to adapt this kind of thinking when you're hurt, angry or just don't understand what just happened to you, it's also calling for pity. And it really shouldn't!

Try to reverse the sentence: We're bad/evil people and that was our rise... doesn't make sense, does it?

Would you have had a better relationship being bad or evil? I don't think so. No one wants to live in a relationship with an evil person, so your spouse might have cheated or left in this scenario too, maybe even more so.

It was not you being good that caused your spouse to cheat, it was his/her personal issues. Believe this instead. So please continue to be good, you will be the best thing that ever happened to your next partner. And for the purpose of R, it doesn't do you any tood to believe that you shouldn't be good (just remember to a bit more vigilant in the future )

Take care. live in the moment and be good.


----------



## Left With 4.5 (Aug 4, 2012)

gumby0811 said:


> See the 2 friends i know of of my WH who said these things to him are his best friends, and the only friends he has told all of this to. He went to them for support assuming they would take his side and BOTH of these guys have done the exact opposite, they told him he is an idiot and a few other choice names. One of them (his best man at our wedding) called me checking to see how i am dealing and has been a very great support through all of this for me (his wife and i are best friends as well). I never thought his friends would support me but they have. So not all WS' friends are accessories to the bad behavior. The biggest thing this has taught me about myself though is that I have to start standing up for myself and start having my needs met instead of being his doormat, and that the people in our lives WILL support me in this


This has happened to me. My ex confided to his best friend and was told that he is an idiot and is currently helping me through all this. Friends usually remain loyal to each other but I think it comes down to morals. The best friend didn't believe in cheating and didn't support my husband.


----------

