# Gut feeling and too many red flags



## shakazulu

About two years ago (2016), on DH’s phone, I stumbled upon a text message exchange between my Darling Husband and his half brother, arguing about some family issues. His half brother texted angrily something to Darling Husband, to the effect that ‘I’m not the one sleeping with other women and hiding it from my wife’.

The text blew me off, and when I questioned Darling Husband about what it meant, he said his brother was looking to create trouble in our marriage. In all fairness, the two have had a rocky relationship. So I believed Darling Husband and forgot about it.

Later (2017), he was seen at a hotel (or a club) with a woman, he had an explanation ( said was having fun with his niece in college and her friends). The niece confirmed this, with a caveat that one of the girls, let’s call her Jane, was not really her friend but was rather shady. 

A few months later, in another argument by text with a different family member, Darling Husband was again accused of sleeping with other women under the guise of helping them out financially. This was through a text message again, found on DH’s phone. Same explanation again. I did not pursue it further since his family has plenty of in-fighting and can be brutal to each other. However, the alarm bells started going off at this point.

Later, around the same time, I encountered some call logs in our joint cell phone statement. Darling Husband had been chatting with someone for several hours almost weekly. When I asked, he said it was a female family friend, Jane, needing money, which he promptly wired. He assured me it was that one time and promised he wouldn’t do it again.

Last week, we had a destination wedding in his home town for his uncle. There was a strange woman (Jane) looking rather isolated from the guests. Someone blurted out, ‘Oh, no, she’s here, this might get ugly’, then immediately clammed shut when they noticed me within earshot. After the wedding, I noticed that the woman lingered on after all guests had left. Darling Husband assured me that his family are apparently friends with her family. She’s the only one who attended from her family. She ignored Darling Husband, and he also avoided her like the plague, which was a HUGE red flag because he’s extremely outgoing and was chatting up with all the guests. By this time I was livid, started putting two and two together after having spent the whole day reflecting upon everything. I watched the two throughout and had a miserable time at the wedding. At the wedding reception, another of his brothers said ‘why would Jane come here?’. To add salt to the injury, Jane followed the family to a private evening party, and sat alone in a corner, isolated. DH continued to ignore her the whole time while speaking with everyone else. Later, Jane slipped away unnoticed into the night.

That night at our hotel while Darling Husband was asleep, I found several wire transfer transactions in his email. Dozens of cash transfers to Jane. I woke Darling Husband up and confronted him. He said he didn’t want to upset me that’s why he kept the wires a secret. He said he hasn’t been seeing Jane, she’s a young girl that has financial problems and he felt sorry for her. He told me I was cold and didn’t have a heart. We argued the whole night and he refused to answer any questions about Jane, sticking with his story that she’s in financial trouble and he’s helping.

I demanded that he calls Jane. At first he resisted, but I took his phone and dialed. It went to voicemail. He seemed relieved. The following morning there was a text from Jane saying she missed his call, is everything ok?

I feel like his whole family knows about Jane and I’m the only one in the dark. I always felt something was off since 2016, but couldn’t put a finger on it. My heart is breaking and I have two kids to consider.

We are still arguing, Darling Husband is sticking to his story and denies that he’s sleeping with Jane. I have asked for his financial statements from 2016 to date, he refused. I demanded he calls Jane in my presence, he refused. He refuses a polygraph test too. Instead, I’m the bad person for ‘not trusting him.’ He’s refused to talk about it.

Later, I sat Darling Husband down to ask more questions about everything. He now says that the money was for a business plan that Jane had, a transport business for consignment designer shoes for women. I asked him why I was not included in this business arrangement, but he had no answer. I asked him how much he sent to Jane in total, he gave me a vague number but will not back it up by showing me his financial statements. He even said his niece is on board and knows about this business arrangement. I asked him who else knows, he said just the niece and no one else. I asked him where the incorporation paperwork is, tax IDs and the like. He said Jane did not deliver as agreed, and he has been conned of his money (Jane is now a con-lady?). I sat there, looked at him lying, and mentally planned my next steps. I don’t know whether to feel angry or upset anymore, especially since he has a story for everything and I know he’s lying and will not take his word for anything. I look at him and wonder if this is the same guy I’ve been married to for over 14 years. It’s surreal. He doesn’t want me to call anyone i.e. his niece, Jane, etc. That alone tells me everything I need to know. I have been such a fool for so long. I feel so isolated. How do get the truth?


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## My 8 year mistake

Keep asking for the financial statements and polygraph. If he doesnt comply file for divorce and ask for financial statements as divorce documentation. He will lie because there are no consequences.


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## My 8 year mistake

And dont expect the entire truth. You would never get it.


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## shakazulu

Do you think I should call Jane to get her side of the story?


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## wilson

shakazulu said:


> How do get the truth?


Go to a divorce lawyer and get paperwork drawn up. Go to him with the papers in hand and tell him to immediately show his financial statements or you will file for divorce. Do it during the week so you can go to the bank or accountant if necessary to see the statements. Don't give him any time to clean things up. Don't let him out of your sight or else he'll call the accountant to fake things. If he doesn't agree, then that's all the truth you need.


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## Andy1001

Tell him you are seeing a lawyer and his financial records will be subpoenaed and he can expect to be served soon.


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## 3Xnocharm

You already know the truth. Are you ok with there being another woman in your marriage? If not, then file for divorce, because your H is so far in denial and affair fog that you aren't ever going to get the truth from him. Even if it turned out that he isn't really sleeping with her, he is still putting another woman as priority over you and lying to you, AND giving away your money (collective "you", as in from the marriage) so that is enough infidelity in itself to warrant you filing for divorce. Stop asking him questions and take some action instead.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti

Too many red flags does not require a gut feeling to back it up. 

Gut feelings are things you get in the absence of evidence.

It sounds like you have both. 

Time to go high order nuclear on his ass.


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## Rubix Cubed

@shakazulu

If your husband is so worried and "invested" in her, how does he reconcile that with completely ignoring her at the wedding and after party?
You know what's up here. Your husband is a liar, and a bad one at that.


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## it-guy

These women are probably prostitutes. A little western union here.... a little paying your electric bill there.... so on and so on. I have a client who is a "sender" like this. Seems the local meth *****s like to transact this way.

How did Jane look to you? Kind of rough?


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## shakazulu

"How did Jane look to you? Kind of rough?"

I wish. Jane looked kind of hot, but in a ****ty way.


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## 3Xnocharm

If his whole family knows about her, why haven't you reached out to one of them?? Do you have such a bad relationship with every one of them that you don't feel a single one would tell you if you asked?


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## Spoons027

shakazulu said:


> Do you think I should call Jane to get her side of the story?


If your husband has a story for everything, chances are Jane might too.

Start protecting yourself now. Until some drastic action is taken, you’ll continue to be stuck in your H’s web of lies.


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## it-guy

I can be difficult to get honesty from outsiders when you question them. Seems as though most people do not want to be responsible for a confrontation. So you may want to call several people and ask them. Try to piece something close to the truth from what they all say.

But reading what you have said here, it all sounds pretty bad. At the very least he is being very dishonest with you.


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## oldshirt

Does no one here care about the admitted financial infidelity that is clearly taking place here.

He is giving marital money to some chick that she doesn't even know without her foreknowledge or consent.

This is in addition to whatever sexual infidelity is taking place. 

I'd be just as p1$$ed about the money as the cheating.


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## 3Xnocharm

oldshirt said:


> Does no one here care about the admitted financial infidelity that is clearly taking place here.
> 
> He is giving marital money to some chick that she doesn't even know without her foreknowledge or consent.
> 
> This is in addition to whatever sexual infidelity is taking place.
> 
> I'd be just as p1$$ed about the money as the cheating.


YEP!!!

If this were me the money alone is enough:


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## oldshirt

it-guy said:


> These women are probably prostitutes. A little western union here.... a little paying your electric bill there.... so on and so on. I have a client who is a "sender" like this. Seems the local meth wh0res like to transact this way.
> 
> How did Jane look to you? Kind of rough?


This probably some kind of Sugar Baby arrangement.

He is probably covering some rent and utilities and clothing etc as she works as a stripper while going to nursing school. 

It's just enough separation between sex for money to keep them out of jail.


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## oldshirt

@shakazulu Keep in mind you only need enough signs and evidence that you can see the light.

You do not need to convince him that he is cheating and you do not need his confession and you do not need his consent or cooperation to take action.


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## Beach123

I can't help but ask why YOU keep referring to him as your "DARLING husband?"

Nothing about him is darling!

He's sending another woman your family money! And he's screwing her!

He's been lying and cheating! 

Stop calling him darling! He's not!

Write out on paper what he REALLY is and take a good hard look at who he really is!

Stop lying to yourself about who he is.


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## birmingham

[How do get the truth?}

hi Shakazulu, your post sounds similar to my experience. my soon to be ex husband gave me lots of excuses, no, lies, about the women he chose to "help." i believed him at the time and it took me 5 years to realize that he was choosing these women over me. 

you ask, how do i get the truth? 
for me, i never really got the truth, or enough of "the truth." i got enough evidence to know that he was doing some bad things for our marriage. it's very painful as we are just starting the separation process now. 
i didn't want to believe what was right in front of me. 
sending you support. you are not alone.


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## Openminded

You never get the total truth because cheaters lie (and so do their AP's). Sure you can talk to her but don't bet the bank that she'll tell you the whole story any more than he will -- unless she's very angry at him because he's cut her money off and then you will probably hear more than you otherwise would. 

He's going to try to rugsweep this. Don't let him. Make a plan and get out.

PS

My ex-husband funneled a lot of money to his gf "because she needed it". I know too well what that feels like.


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## MattMatt

@birmingham has been through it, as have others in this thread, so seek out their advice and expertise. (BTW @birmingham, fantastic choice of name. Birmingham, England is my home city!)

Also, tell your husband you are going to a clinic to get STD tests to make sure he hasn't given you anything.

This might make him realise how much he has hurt you.

And lawyer up. In fact, contact several leading law firms in your area (using initial free consultations) so your husband can't use them.

I am presuming you are in the USA. If so, this link will be of help https://www.americanbar.org/groups/legal_services/flh-home/ 

If you aren't in the USA, please let me know, I'll be able to provide something closer to home for you.


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## oldshirt

MattMatt said:


> [MENTION=105674]
> Also, tell your husband you are going to a clinic to get STD tests to make sure he hasn't given you anything.
> 
> This might make him realise how much he has hurt you.


That leaves her the one getting poked and prodded and swabbed and having blood drawn and put through the indignities of STD testing. 

The better move at the moment is to cut off all relations and communications until *HE* gets STD tested and hands her the results. 


The catch is he can't be trusted to actually get the test so she'll need to go with him to confirm that the Qtip goes up his Johnson. 

His reaction to the demand will also be very telling.


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## arbitrator

shakazulu said:


> About two years ago (2016), on DH’s phone, I stumbled upon a text message exchange between my Darling Husband and his half brother, arguing about some family issues. His half brother texted angrily something to Darling Husband, to the effect that ‘I’m not the one sleeping with other women and hiding it from my wife’.
> 
> The text blew me off, and when I questioned Darling Husband about what it meant, he said his brother was looking to create trouble in our marriage. In all fairness, the two have had a rocky relationship. So I believed Darling Husband and forgot about it.
> 
> Later (2017), he was seen at a hotel (or a club) with a woman, he had an explanation ( said was having fun with his niece in college and her friends). The niece confirmed this, with a caveat that one of the girls, let’s call her Jane, was not really her friend but was rather shady.
> 
> A few months later, in another argument by text with a different family member, Darling Husband was again accused of sleeping with other women under the guise of helping them out financially. This was through a text message again, found on DH’s phone. Same explanation again. I did not pursue it further since his family has plenty of in-fighting and can be brutal to each other. However, the alarm bells started going off at this point.
> 
> Later, around the same time, I encountered some call logs in our joint cell phone statement. Darling Husband had been chatting with someone for several hours almost weekly. When I asked, he said it was a female family friend, Jane, needing money, which he promptly wired. He assured me it was that one time and promised he wouldn’t do it again.
> 
> Last week, we had a destination wedding in his home town for his uncle. There was a strange woman (Jane) looking rather isolated from the guests. Someone blurted out, ‘Oh, no, she’s here, this might get ugly’, then immediately clammed shut when they noticed me within earshot. After the wedding, I noticed that the woman lingered on after all guests had left. Darling Husband assured me that his family are apparently friends with her family. She’s the only one who attended from her family. She ignored Darling Husband, and he also avoided her like the plague, which was a HUGE red flag because he’s extremely outgoing and was chatting up with all the guests. By this time I was livid, started putting two and two together after having spent the whole day reflecting upon everything. I watched the two throughout and had a miserable time at the wedding. At the wedding reception, another of his brothers said ‘why would Jane come here?’. To add salt to the injury, Jane followed the family to a private evening party, and sat alone in a corner, isolated. DH continued to ignore her the whole time while speaking with everyone else. Later, Jane slipped away unnoticed into the night.
> 
> That night at our hotel while Darling Husband was asleep, I found several wire transfer transactions in his email. Dozens of cash transfers to Jane. I woke Darling Husband up and confronted him. He said he didn’t want to upset me that’s why he kept the wires a secret. He said he hasn’t been seeing Jane, she’s a young girl that has financial problems and he felt sorry for her. He told me I was cold and didn’t have a heart. We argued the whole night and he refused to answer any questions about Jane, sticking with his story that she’s in financial trouble and he’s helping.
> 
> I demanded that he calls Jane. At first he resisted, but I took his phone and dialed. It went to voicemail. He seemed relieved. The following morning there was a text from Jane saying she missed his call, is everything ok?
> 
> I feel like his whole family knows about Jane and I’m the only one in the dark. I always felt something was off since 2016, but couldn’t put a finger on it. My heart is breaking and I have two kids to consider.
> 
> We are still arguing, Darling Husband is sticking to his story and denies that he’s sleeping with Jane. I have asked for his financial statements from 2016 to date, he refused. I demanded he calls Jane in my presence, he refused. He refuses a polygraph test too. Instead, I’m the bad person for ‘not trusting him.’ He’s refused to talk about it.
> 
> Later, I sat Darling Husband down to ask more questions about everything. He now says that the money was for a business plan that Jane had, a transport business for consignment designer shoes for women. I asked him why I was not included in this business arrangement, but he had no answer. I asked him how much he sent to Jane in total, he gave me a vague number but will not back it up by showing me his financial statements. He even said his niece is on board and knows about this business arrangement. I asked him who else knows, he said just the niece and no one else. I asked him where the incorporation paperwork is, tax IDs and the like. He said Jane did not deliver as agreed, and he has been conned of his money (Jane is now a con-lady?). I sat there, looked at him lying, and mentally planned my next steps. I don’t know whether to feel angry or upset anymore, especially since he has a story for everything and I know he’s lying and will not take his word for anything. I look at him and wonder if this is the same guy I’ve been married to for over 14 years. It’s surreal. He doesn’t want me to call anyone i.e. his niece, Jane, etc. That alone tells me everything I need to know. I have been such a fool for so long. I feel so isolated. How do get the truth?


*If this were the proverbial "smell-test," any reasonable man or woman would definitely think that they had stumbled upon a fart-smelling convention with some rather reeking overtones!

Please be wary!*


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## Chippie

3Xnocharm said:


> If his whole family knows about her, why haven't you reached out to one of them?? Do you have such a bad relationship with every one of them that you don't feel a single one would tell you if you asked?


When my husband had his affair 18 years ago his entire family knew about it, knew he planned to leave me, were talking with the other woman and basically threw me & the 5 kids under a bus. The family of the cheater will often protect their relationship with their family member. I have a limited contact relationship with my in-laws now.
It sounds like the OP's in-laws are a messed up bunch and what they say could probably not be trusted anyway.


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## aine

shakazulu said:


> "How did Jane look to you? Kind of rough?"
> 
> I wish. Jane looked kind of hot, but in a ****ty way.


What nationality are you any your husband? Jane? There are so many red flags here, Jane is his piece on the side, he’s paying her because she my have a kid with him. You need to go scorched earth here, his family knows, only you are being taken for a ride. Show no mercy to your lying piece of xxxx husband. You don’t need any more evidence.


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## tech-novelist

I didn't even need to finish reading the original post to see enough red flags for a world communist party convention.

I can't believe no one has posted http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/209754-standard-evidence-post.html yet, but maybe I missed it?

Although in this case I'm not sure that is even necessary, because at the very least the husband is extremely dishonest. That is quite enough that he should be served with divorce papers.


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## MattMatt

Beach123 said:


> I can't help but ask why YOU keep referring to him as your "DARLING husband?"
> 
> Nothing about him is darling!
> 
> He's sending another woman your family money! And he's screwing her!
> 
> He's been lying and cheating!
> 
> Stop calling him darling! He's not!
> 
> Write out on paper what he REALLY is and take a good hard look at who he really is!
> 
> Stop lying to yourself about who he is.


I think she was using it in an ironical sense. I could picture the venom she used every time she referred to him as her "darling husband."


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## arbitrator

Chippie said:


> When my husband had his affair 18 years ago his entire family knew about it, knew he planned to leave me, were talking with the other woman and basically threw me & the 5 kids under a bus. The family of the cheater will often protect their relationship with their family member. I have a limited contact relationship with my in-laws now.
> It sounds like the OP's in-laws are a messed up bunch and what they say could probably not be trusted anyway.


*The same with my RSXW!

Her personal friends seemed to value their relationship more with her alone, than with me being in the picture as her sidekick!

Her family, while showing lukewarm signs of religiosity, catered to RSXW, bolstered by both their kinship to her and their family money!

When I was summarily ditched by her, it seems to have been done by them also!

To them, in the scope of her infidelity, there was no right or wrong; which truly exemplifies that "blood is indeed thicker than water!"*


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## She'sStillGotIt

shakazulu said:


> I have been such a fool for so long. I feel so isolated. How do get the truth?


Ugh. Quit calling him 'darling husband' for starters. He's a *serial cheating lying sack of ***** and there's NOTHING darling about him.


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## MattMatt

She'sStillGotIt said:


> Ugh. Quit calling him 'darling husband' for starters. He's a *serial cheating lying sack of ***** and there's NOTHING darling about him.


Yeah. She knows that. She's married to the rotter so she is fully aware of what he is.

I took it that she was using that term in an ironical sense?

It's like how when a person in Ireland says: "That's nice" they are really saying: "**** you!" but are too polite to use that expletive. 
:rofl:

Just do a YouTube search for: "Mrs Brown's Boys that's nice" to see irony in action.


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## birmingham

hi Shakazulu, how are you doing today/evening? 
@MattMatt, fantastic. I picked "Birmingham" rather randomly for anonymity. although I am a big England fan.


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## shakazulu

UPDATE – Last night, in the wee hours of the morning while DH was asleep, I logged in his phone and found Jane online, and started chatting with her pretending to be him. I said the wife is freaking out and starting to ask questions. Jane sang like a canary, urging him not to say anything to me. Then Jane started reminiscing about their time together, discussed the places they were together, washrooms in hotels, clubs, etc. All the while, Jane was urging him not to disclose anything to me and stick to the shoe business story. I chatted with Jane for an hour, resisting the urge to call her out, curse her out, and tell her she was chatting with the wife. My heart was thumping and it was like an out of body experience. I could not believe the gory details about what they did together. We have a vacation home and Jane reminisced how they did each other behind that vacation home and inside it and how it felt good and all that, and how she will keep sneaking and doing him even if she ever got married because they had a special connection. My heart is broken, I am at work now contemplating my next move. Jane did mention that she still loves him and what they have is magical. I, still pretending to be him, asked if she kept any of our pics together because I had to delete everything. Dumb Jane said no problem, I provided her with my own email address, saying it is new and I just opened it. Jane said she would open a new email address as well so they can chat in secret because her fiancé likes to snoop. Jane apparently has a fiancé. Jane sent their pics together and I have those as well. Jane mentioned by name family members that knew about their affair. It was hard to sit there and continue typing and chatting with her.

My scum of a DH slept on, oblivious to what was going on, but I am meeting with an attorney during my lunch break. Jane reminisced about their last time together right before the wedding. This has been going on for over 2 years. I left DH working from home as I plan my next move. I cannot believe it – how stupid and blind I have been. For what it's worth, and since someone asked, we are Americans.


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## BluesPower

Well, I am sorry in a way, and in a way I am not...

But frankly, isn't it better to know with our a doubt, so you don't have to wonder, so you can move on with life. 

Now, he can pay you for the time that you were his faithful wife. It is just time to move on...


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti

shakazulu said:


> UPDATE – Last night, in the wee hours of the morning while DH was asleep, I logged in his phone and found Jane online, and started chatting with her pretending to be him. I said the wife is freaking out and starting to ask questions. Jane sang like a canary, urging him not to say anything to me. Then Jane started reminiscing about their time together, discussed the places they were together, washrooms in hotels, clubs, etc. All the while, Jane was urging him not to disclose anything to me and stick to the shoe business story. I chatted with Jane for an hour, resisting the urge to call her out, curse her out, and tell her she was chatting with the wife. My heart was thumping and it was like an out of body experience. I could not believe the gory details about what they did together. We have a vacation home and Jane reminisced how they did each other behind that vacation home and inside it and how it felt good and all that, and how she will keep sneaking and doing him even if she ever got married because they had a special connection. My heart is broken, I am at work now contemplating my next move. Jane did mention that she still loves him and what they have is magical. I, still pretending to be him, asked if she kept any of our pics together because I had to delete everything. Dumb Jane said no problem, I provided her with my own email address, saying it is new and I just opened it. Jane said she would open a new email address as well so they can chat in secret because her fiancé likes to snoop. Jane apparently has a fiancé. Jane sent their pics together and I have those as well. Jane mentioned by name family members that knew about their affair. It was hard to sit there and continue typing and chatting with her.
> 
> My scum of a DH slept on, oblivious to what was going on, but I am meeting with an attorney during my lunch break. Jane reminisced about their last time together right before the wedding. This has been going on for over 2 years. I left DH working from home as I plan my next move. I cannot believe it – how stupid and blind I have been. For what it's worth, and since someone asked, we are Americans.


Wow!
Kudos to you for keeping your cool in the face of a most extreme situation! 

Have you thought about what will happen the nest time your husband chats with her and she says something about your discussion and he goes ????? Be prepared.

While you probably already knew enough that the affair wouldn't come as a shock, but that family members knew without telling you? Egad! That's gotta' be hard to take. I hope at least she was talking about members of his family, not your family?


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## 3Xnocharm

Oh... my … god....

GOOD FOR YOU, WELL DONE!!! 

I know how crushed you are, and the feelings that were coursing through you as you were talking to her... the sick gut, the shaking, the sweating. Ugh. Were you able to save or copy your conversation somehow? I guess if not, the emails should be sufficient proof. Do you live in at at fault state for divorce?

I am so sorry you are going through this, and you were SO brave to do what you did! Take him for everything you can, he is disgusting.

Editing to add... TELL HER FIANCE.


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## wilson

That was a lot to hear in such a short time. Humans often react in strange and unpredictable ways in situations like this. Don't be surprised if your subconscious starts freaking out. Get a personal counselor so you can work through your feelings in a healthy way. I imagine your emotions will be on a crazy roller coaster for a while. Try to hold on and remember that it's only temporary. Ironically, you need to be really strong right now to get through all this. This was pretty awful, but a silver lining is that you got the unvarnished truth. Most betrayed spouses never know the full depth of what went on and have nagging suspicions long after. At least you won't have to deal with that. Sorry for what you're going through, but I'm sure it will all work out in the end.


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## shakazulu

"Have you thought about what will happen the nest time your husband chats with her and she says something about your discussion and he goes ????? Be prepared."

This bothers me as well because they are still in touch. They spoke yesterday while I was at work (revealed by the chat) and I know they will speak again today. Based on the chats, I gathered that the two were freaking out wondering what I knew and how to hide any more info from me. 

And, I have everything and wondering where to store it. What a piece of ****. Some of the details are nasty – Jane describing sexual details of what they did together, all the while cautioning him that it’s their special secret and not to disclose anything. Nasty details. I have the pictures too. I am looking for a safe place to store everything.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti

shakazulu said:


> "Have you thought about what will happen the nest time your husband chats with her and she says something about your discussion and he goes ????? Be prepared."
> 
> This bothers me as well because they are still in touch. They spoke yesterday while I was at work (revealed by the chat) and I know they will speak again today. Based on the chats, I gathered that the two were freaking out wondering what I knew and how to hide any more info from me.
> 
> And, I have everything and wondering where to store it. What a piece of ****. Some of the details are nasty – Jane describing sexual details of what they did together, all the while cautioning him that it’s their special secret and not to disclose anything. Nasty details. I have the pictures too. I am looking for a safe place to store everything.


Let me echo @3Xnocharm:

TELL HER FIANCE. Immediately. Blow this thing up on both ends.


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## syhoybenden

See if you can find out who her fiance is.

He needs to know before he makes the biggest mistake of his life.


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## 3Xnocharm

shakazulu said:


> "Have you thought about what will happen the nest time your husband chats with her and she says something about your discussion and he goes ????? Be prepared."
> 
> This bothers me as well because they are still in touch. They spoke yesterday while I was at work (revealed by the chat) and I know they will speak again today. Based on the chats, I gathered that the two were freaking out wondering what I knew and how to hide any more info from me.
> 
> And, I have everything and wondering where to store it. What a piece of ****. Some of the details are nasty – Jane describing sexual details of what they did together, all the while cautioning him that it’s their special secret and not to disclose anything. Nasty details. I have the pictures too. I am looking for a safe place to store everything.


Probably Cloud storage. Use the email you created, send everything there and make sure your login is super secure. Back up the file to a thumb drive. People who are more tech savvy than I am will surely have ideas to help. 

They are going to know that you know as soon as they connect today. Don't expect him to blow up in your face, I think more likely he will start digging underground to better hide things from you. A quick check on Facebook would most likely show you who her fiancé is, you MUST get in touch with him. Think about what it feels like that his ENTIRE FAMILY knows about this and hasn't told you... he deserves to know. If that lawyer today isn't a complete moron, go ahead and file NOW. Ask about using forensic accountants to get his financial info so that they can reveal everything that he has given to her. Any money is considered marital, and he can be required to repay you that money he sent her without your knowledge or consent. You must move quickly because he will start hiding crap TODAY.

Do you know where he was pulling money from? You should be able to gain access to anything joint.


----------



## jlg07

"And, I have everything and wondering where to store it. What a piece of ****. Some of the details are nasty – Jane describing sexual details of what they did together, all the while cautioning him that it’s their special secret and not to disclose anything. Nasty details. I have the pictures too. I am looking for a safe place to store everything."

Did you take copies of the chat you had with her (I hope so). Send to yourself in various emails (google, yahoo, etc.). Copy to a couple of USB drives and give them to a relative that you trust. Also copy up to a cloud server.

VERY sorry you found out, but you CLEARLY have the evidence, so there is no more wondering. He will NOT be able to hide anything or rewrite your marriage history. EXPOSE this to everyone (clearly his family already knows -- you can tell them **** YOU for not letting me know and tell them never to bother you again). Expose to all of your friends and your family.

Get a shark lawyer also -- this guy deserves NO consideration. Take him to the cleaners.


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## faithfulman

Shaka - you have the pictures, did you screenshot the chats?


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## shakazulu

I have everything - screenshots of the chats, pics. ETC. DH is blowing up my phone. Like clockwork, after I left for work, he and Jane touched base and discovered that they didn't chat with each other. Well, he is denying everything and asking to put Jane on the phone to admit that she made up all the stories. Good thing, I am not dumb anymore.


----------



## wilson

shakazulu said:


> I have everything - screenshots of the chats, pics. ETC. DH is blowing up my phone. Like clockwork, after I left for work, he and Jane touched base and discovered that they didn't chat with each other. Well, he is denying everything and asking to put Jane on the phone to admit that she made up all the stories. Good thing, I am not dumb anymore.


LOL! That's a good one. Keep records of everything. It will help greatly during the divorce. Also, get a voice activated recorder and keep it on you at all times. You can get one at stores like Walmart/Target. There's no telling what lies he'll come up with.

When it comes time to split assets, be sure the money he sent to Jane comes out of his share.

If you really want to take him and Jane up on their offer, have them meet at your attorney and sign a sworn affidavit where they answer questions like "Have you ever had sex?". Then if they lie, you can sue them.


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## 3Xnocharm

shakazulu said:


> I have everything - screenshots of the chats, pics. ETC. DH is blowing up my phone. Like clockwork, after I left for work, he and Jane touched base and discovered that they didn't chat with each other. Well, he is denying everything and asking to put Jane on the phone to admit that she made up all the stories. Good thing, I am not dumb anymore.


I knew they would be stupid enough to try and deny the whole thing! Did you try to play stupid at first?? I would suggest you try not speaking to him right now, all he is going to do is more of the same and lie/deny right to your face. You are doing great, I know this is awful for you. 

Re the pics she sent to your email... are there pics of the two of them together?


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## shakazulu

Yes, the pics are of the two together. DISGUSTING. I played stupid at first, then he started yelling and I hung up on his behind.


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## WorkingWife

Edited to delete my original comment - I replied to your post about confronting Jane before I saw you had incontrovertible proof. So sorry you are going through this.


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## WorkingWife

Beach123 said:


> I can't help but ask why YOU keep referring to him as your "DARLING husband?"


DARLING came across as obvious sarcasm to me.


----------



## shakazulu

DARLING is sarcasm... please disregard it.


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## 3Xnocharm

shakazulu said:


> Yes, the pics are of the two together. DISGUSTING. I played stupid at first, then he started yelling and I hung up on his behind.


Morons... she wanted to tell you she made it all up, yet sent pics of the two of them! How stupid they are! They are running scared now. Try to keep your composure, it helps you have the upper hand, while they fall apart. (easy for me to say, I know!!) Also be prepared for a barrage of incoming calls and texts from his family too...ignore and block is my suggestion. 

Were you able to see the lawyer yet today?


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## WorkingWife

shakazulu said:


> I have everything - screenshots of the chats, pics. ETC. DH is blowing up my phone. Like clockwork, after I left for work, he and Jane touched base and discovered that they didn't chat with each other. Well, he is denying everything and asking to put Jane on the phone to admit that she made up all the stories. Good thing, I am not dumb anymore.


She must be amazing with photo shop if she made up that stuff...

I really feel for you but you are doing FANTASTIC considering what you're going through.


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## She'sStillGotIt

shakazulu said:


> ....and how she will keep sneaking and doing him even if she ever got married because they had a special connection.


LOL. So she says they have a 'special connection,' do they? If having a *special connection *is defined as "doing each other" in hotel or dance club bathrooms and outside behind your vacation house, then this dumb-ass has some seriously LOW expectations in life.

And if the "DH" in your later posts now means *****-head*, then I applaud you.


----------



## shakazulu

They are both disgusting, nasty people. Still in shock. He took her to half the hotels & nightclubs in our home town, and half in the city we frequent when we go to the lake house. The same spots we frequent as a couple. The lake house is where I take my kids for summer, and that's where we always spend Christmas. It is forever tainted. All those places are tainted. Could he not find a new location for his shenanigans? 

The lawyer is drafting divorce paperwork immediately. It will be a long weekend.


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## 3Xnocharm

shakazulu said:


> They are both disgusting, nasty people. Still in shock. He took her to half the hotels & nightclubs in our home town, and half in the city we frequent when we go to the lake house. The same spots we frequent as a couple. The lake house is where I take my kids for summer, and that's where we always spend Christmas. It is forever tainted. All those places are tainted. Could he not find a new location for his shenanigans?
> 
> The lawyer is drafting divorce paperwork immediately. It will be a long weekend.


I am so proud of you for moving on this so quickly. I hope you are able to get all the financials he has been working to hard to hide! 

Yes, they are disgusting and I feel for you that so much is tainted for you now.


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## oldshirt

shakazulu said:


> , he is denying everything and asking to put Jane on the phone to admit that she made up all the stories. Good thing, I am not dumb anymore.


This shows you just how deeply committed he is to being dishonest and deceptive.

He was caught completely dead-to-rights and he still gives it everything he has to lie to your face no how rediculous his lies are. 

There is no hope here for a healthy, functional, honest relationship. He is a fraud.

The proof is Chrystal clear now. There can be no denying it or rug sweeping it or keeping your head in the sand.

You no longer have the luxury playing dumb or the luxury of denial. You must now accept his chronic dishonesty and adultery as absolute, undeniable fact. 

That is the burden or not being dumb.


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## oldshirt

And ill go back to what I said in my first post- Stop trying to convince him he is cheating and stop trying to get a confession out of him. 

That is playing his game. You confront him and produce proof and he just denies it and makes up excuses and rationalizes it away...and you go round and round.

You each trying to be "right" and each trying to get the other to capitulate. 

You can spend your life trying to have that final "ah hah!!" moment to to get him to confess, or you can spend your time and energies making a new life for yourself without this conman and slickster playing smoke and mirrors with you while he carries on with other women.


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## aine

shakazulu said:


> UPDATE – Last night, in the wee hours of the morning while DH was asleep, I logged in his phone and found Jane online, and started chatting with her pretending to be him. I said the wife is freaking out and starting to ask questions. Jane sang like a canary, urging him not to say anything to me. Then Jane started reminiscing about their time together, discussed the places they were together, washrooms in hotels, clubs, etc. All the while, Jane was urging him not to disclose anything to me and stick to the shoe business story. I chatted with Jane for an hour, resisting the urge to call her out, curse her out, and tell her she was chatting with the wife. My heart was thumping and it was like an out of body experience. I could not believe the gory details about what they did together. We have a vacation home and Jane reminisced how they did each other behind that vacation home and inside it and how it felt good and all that, and how she will keep sneaking and doing him even if she ever got married because they had a special connection. My heart is broken, I am at work now contemplating my next move. Jane did mention that she still loves him and what they have is magical. I, still pretending to be him, asked if she kept any of our pics together because I had to delete everything. Dumb Jane said no problem, I provided her with my own email address, saying it is new and I just opened it. Jane said she would open a new email address as well so they can chat in secret because her fiancé likes to snoop. Jane apparently has a fiancé. Jane sent their pics together and I have those as well. Jane mentioned by name family members that knew about their affair. It was hard to sit there and continue typing and chatting with her.
> 
> My scum of a DH slept on, oblivious to what was going on, but I am meeting with an attorney during my lunch break. Jane reminisced about their last time together right before the wedding. This has been going on for over 2 years. I left DH working from home as I plan my next move. I cannot believe it – how stupid and blind I have been. For what it's worth, and since someone asked, we are Americans.


So so sorry but for what it is worth I like how you played this and got all the information you need to know, there is no way out of this for y Ur cheating husband.
Good move to go to lawyer. Next thing blow this up to all of your family and friends that do not know. Expose her to her fiancé too, you have the evidence. Make sure you take him to the cleaners also, get a bull dog lawyer. How old are your kids, are they old enough to be told? Under no circumstances cover for him. I think you know deep down you have been making excuses for him for years, stop it and take care of yourself and kids, when you lose resolve remember how easily he lied to your face, how easily he snuck around behind your back, how ready he was to embarrass you in front of people at the wedding. He really is a POS. He is not the man you married. Remember that and to get past the betrayal, please talk to a counsellor or therapist so that you start you life on the right track without him.


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## aine

3Xnocharm said:


> Probably Cloud storage. Use the email you created, send everything there and make sure your login is super secure. Back up the file to a thumb drive. People who are more tech savvy than I am will surely have ideas to help.
> 
> They are going to know that you know as soon as they connect today. Don't expect him to blow up in your face, I think more likely he will start digging underground to better hide things from you. A quick check on Facebook would most likely show you who her fiancé is, you MUST get in touch with him. Think about what it feels like that his ENTIRE FAMILY knows about this and hasn't told you... he deserves to know. If that lawyer today isn't a complete moron, go ahead and file NOW. Ask about using forensic accountants to get his financial info so that they can reveal everything that he has given to her. Any money is considered marital, and he can be required to repay you that money he sent her without your knowledge or consent. You must move quickly because he will start hiding crap TODAY.
> 
> Do you know where he was pulling money from? You should be able to gain access to anything joint.


To add: take copies of all documents, bank and credit card statements, insurance policies, pension info, expense details, title deeds for assets, Mutual funds info, share certificates, everything you can find in his belongings, do it now when he is at work.


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## aine

shakazulu said:


> Yes, the pics are of the two together. DISGUSTING. I played stupid at first, then he started yelling and I hung up on his behind.


He started yelling? the POS deserves to lose everything. You are doing well, stand firm, avoid any confrontations with him, do 180, no discussion, nothing. Play out your game plan.


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## Spoons027

Now you have the evidence. The evidence doesn’t lie. Anything your H and his mistress say is moot at this point. It seems like he’s doing and saying anything to prevent his double life from being exposed.

You can also make multiple copies of the files and put them in the hands of people you truly trust.

Good job for finding the truth. Can you limit your interactions with your H? Like a gray rock or 180?

By the way, if hidden sexcapades and stolen moments are his mistress’s definition of a ‘special connection’, then you honestly gotta feel sorry for ‘em. That’s just sad. 🙄


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## Adelais

shakazulu said:


> They are both disgusting, nasty people. Still in shock. He took her to half the hotels & nightclubs in our home town, and half in the city we frequent when we go to the lake house. The same spots we frequent as a couple. The lake house is where I take my kids for summer, and that's where we always spend Christmas. It is forever tainted. All those places are tainted. Could he not find a new location for his shenanigans?
> 
> The lawyer is drafting divorce paperwork immediately. It will be a long weekend.


You must be feeling terrible with the knowledge of what he has been doing and where.

The only good thing is that now that you know for sure, you can take action to better your own life. No need to stay with a liar and a cheater.

Is he still denying it?


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## 3Xnocharm

Araucaria said:


> You must be feeling terrible with the knowledge of what he has been doing and where.
> 
> 
> 
> The only good thing is that now that you know for sure, you can take action to better your own life. No need to stay with a liar and a cheater.
> 
> 
> 
> Is he still denying it?



@shakazulu how are you holding up?



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## the guy

Good job on getting out of infidelity.

Ya it sucks and the pain is the worst, but you do have the truth and that's worth a lot. So as painful as it was you played it right.


Now you have the power....use it wisely!


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## the guy

I strongly suggest you find the other guy and let him know his chick is ****ing around with your old man.
You got this far....put a nail in this by contacting him!


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## the guy

She is feeling like **** ...just like when you and me were going through this crap!


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## the guy

3Xnocharm said:


> @shakazulu how are you holding up?
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


She feels like crap.... just like when you and me were going through this shytsandwich called infidelity.


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## the guy

This might not mean a lot now...but life does get better!


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## shakazulu

It’s been a rollercoaster of emotions. On getting home Friday after work, husband was all heated up and defensive, begging me to speak with Jane so she denies the affair. I banished him to the basement that night (my family was over for dinner earlier, complicating everything). Later, he came up when everyone was asleep, sneaked into bed beside me and I managed to get a confession from him, confirming everything in my chat with Jane (disgusting that I had to wear a sexy lingerie and tease him to do this before shoving him off me after he confessed). The full confession destroyed me. I guess a tiny, whiny part of me was still hopeful that this was all a bad mistake. He says Jane was crazy and nasty and he couldn’t help himself. He said he wouldn’t do it again and asked for a reconciliation. Said he wouldn’t consent to a divorce and begged that we work this out. Again, my heart was broken. It’s one thing reading the chats from Jane, but to hear those words coming from his mouth nearly killed me. My emotions are all over the place.

The next day, he DARES to ambush me with Jane on his phone and put her on speaker to apologize. Hearing that whispery, girlish voice squeak ‘it really isn’t a big deal, just let it go and don’t stress yourself, it won’t happen again since I have my fiancé and I have moved on’ was like a knife plunging and twisting in my back over and over, again and again. She thinks SHE can move on with her fiancé and live happily ever after after destroying my life???? Worst humiliation ever. I went nuclear on their two behinds and completely lost it. Cursed them, told Jane she could have him, and threw him out. I can’t find Jane’s fiancé yet, she’s all over social media but there’s no mention of her boyfriend. I doubt he exists but will continue to look. Husband later sneaked back in through the basement door and is begging we work this out (using the two kids as bait). Yeah right.

I forgot to thank everyone for their support and encouragement during this painful ordeal. I never thought this could happen to me. That’s how secure (and stupid) I was. I’m getting tested on Monday. They never used protection. That’s one thing I nearly forgot about until someone reminded me. Thanks all.


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## Spoons027

shakazulu said:


> It’s been a rollercoaster of emotions. On getting home Friday after work, husband was all heated up and defensive, begging me to speak with Jane so she denies the affair. I banished him to the basement that night (my family was over for dinner earlier, complicating everything). Later, he came up when everyone was asleep, sneaked into bed beside me and I managed to get a confession from him, confirming everything in my chat with Jane (disgusting that I had to wear a sexy lingerie and tease him to do this before shoving him off me after he confessed). The full confession destroyed me. I guess a tiny, whiny part of me was still hopeful that this was all a bad mistake. He says Jane was crazy and nasty and he couldn’t help himself. He said he wouldn’t do it again and asked for a reconciliation. Said he wouldn’t consent to a divorce and begged that we work this out. Again, my heart was broken. It’s one thing reading the chats from Jane, but to hear those words coming from his mouth nearly killed me. My emotions are all over the place.
> 
> The next day, he DARES to ambush me with Jane on his phone and put her on speaker to apologize. Hearing that whispery, girlish voice squeak ‘it really isn’t a big deal, just let it go and don’t stress yourself, it won’t happen again since I have my fiancé and I have moved on’ was like a knife plunging and twisting in my back over and over, again and again. She thinks SHE can move on with her fiancé and live happily ever after after destroying my life???? Worst humiliation ever. I went nuclear on their two behinds and completely lost it. Cursed them, told Jane she could have him, and threw him out. I can’t find Jane’s fiancé yet, she’s all over social media but there’s no mention of her boyfriend. I doubt he exists but will continue to look. Husband later sneaked back in through the basement door and is begging we work this out (using the two kids as bait). Yeah right.
> 
> I forgot to thank everyone for their support and encouragement during this painful ordeal. I never thought this could happen to me. That’s how secure (and stupid) I was. I’m getting tested on Monday. They never used protection. That’s one thing I nearly forgot about until someone reminded me. Thanks all.


The fact that he had/continues to have the audacity to ask you for reconciliation when he consulted her to convince you that 'it isn't such a big deal' shows where his mind is at. First step in reconciliation is to cut off all contact with the AP. He's only concerned with doing damage control and protecting his own behind right now. I hope you have stored the evidence someplace secure and extra safe.

And sorry, but 'he couldn't help himself'? Correct me if I'm wrong, but he had an lta with her, right? You're saying he couldn't help himself for *two years*? It's already past the point of 'won't happen again' and 'wouldn't do it again'. Wow.

Please keep moving forward and don't get sucked into the hoovering. The kids need at least one stable and happy parent with good morals.

No more lingerie confessions, 'kay? Time to gray rock him. If you think he wants even a sliver of a chance to work things out, tell him he needs intensive therapy. Like yesterday.

Hope all the tests come back negative.


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## aine

shakazulu, sorry but your WH is a really big POS:

He is minimising what he has done
He has no concern for the damage his behaviour has done to your or the family
He has no concern for your feelings, emotions in getting that w**** to speak to you
He has NO respect for you or for your marriage
He is hoovering you big time.

DONT LET HIM manipulate you, I know you are uncertain, shocked and hurt but proceed with plan to get rid of him.

Get a restraining order, get the divorce papers yesterday and please dig info on her boyfriend, Im sure someone on FB will help you out if you PM them for the info.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti

shakazulu said:


> It’s been a rollercoaster of emotions. On getting home Friday after work, husband was all heated up and defensive, begging me to speak with Jane so she denies the affair. I banished him to the basement that night (my family was over for dinner earlier, complicating everything). Later, he came up when everyone was asleep, sneaked into bed beside me and I managed to get a confession from him, confirming everything in my chat with Jane (disgusting that I had to wear a sexy lingerie and tease him to do this before shoving him off me after he confessed). The full confession destroyed me. I guess a tiny, whiny part of me was still hopeful that this was all a bad mistake. He says Jane was crazy and nasty and he couldn’t help himself. He said he wouldn’t do it again and asked for a reconciliation. Said he wouldn’t consent to a divorce and begged that we work this out. Again, my heart was broken. It’s one thing reading the chats from Jane, but to hear those words coming from his mouth nearly killed me. My emotions are all over the place.
> 
> The next day, he DARES to ambush me with Jane on his phone and put her on speaker to apologize. Hearing that whispery, girlish voice squeak ‘it really isn’t a big deal, just let it go and don’t stress yourself, it won’t happen again since I have my fiancé and I have moved on’ was like a knife plunging and twisting in my back over and over, again and again. She thinks SHE can move on with her fiancé and live happily ever after after destroying my life???? Worst humiliation ever. I went nuclear on their two behinds and completely lost it. Cursed them, told Jane she could have him, and threw him out. I can’t find Jane’s fiancé yet, she’s all over social media but there’s no mention of her boyfriend. I doubt he exists but will continue to look. Husband later sneaked back in through the basement door and is begging we work this out (using the two kids as bait). Yeah right.
> 
> I forgot to thank everyone for their support and encouragement during this painful ordeal. I never thought this could happen to me. That’s how secure (and stupid) I was. I’m getting tested on Monday. They never used protection. That’s one thing I nearly forgot about until someone reminded me. Thanks all.


So Sorry this is all happening. I have to say that your strength, integrity, and sheer intestinal fortitude, are highly inspirational to all. Most of us face serious (albeit different) challenges. Regardless of what those challenges are, we would all do well to exhibit your resolve.

As strong as you are and as supportive as we are of you, hopefully you have trusted adult family and friends you can learn on at this time as well.


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## Openminded

Many men don't want a divorce. They just want someone on the side for fun while maintaining all the comforts of home. Be prepared for him to fight to stay married. Don't fall for it because you'll likely never be able to trust him again. I reconciled with a cheater who swore on everything he could think of that it would never happen again. He lied. That very often happens. You don't want to be there, believe me.


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## Adelais

I concur that you will never be 'safe' in this marriage if you decide to believe him and R. He had a 2 year LTA....let's break that down: *for 2 years* he repeatedly *had sex* with her, *lied* regularly to you to cover up the time away from you, lied to you after his escapades, *stole time* from the family to spend with her, may have even had sex with you _with her still on him_, *kissed* you the same day after he kissed her and probably had *oral sex* wtih her as well, *spent your finances* on her *stealing $* from the family, and the list goes on.

This wasn't a short term craziness he went through. His affair was long term, and very calculated, _for a long time_. His character has been trained to be deceptive after 2 years of lying.

Don't believe him. Lock your bedroom door in the future. Don't listen to him much less let him get in bed with you.

Go back to your bedroom, and send him to the basement. Start the 180 and proceed with the D papers. I hate divorce, but I hate a person staying and suffering with a chronic liar and putting their health in jeopardy more.


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## 3Xnocharm

“It really isn’t a big deal”.... are you effing kidding me?? What is she, 12?? What a piece of work!

Your H is disgusting. He is continuing to completely disrespect you by keeping himself up in your face and not agreeing to cooperate with divorce. Just another kick in your face. Well news flash for him, he doesn’t have to agree with a divorce for you to get one! Stay strong and keep on your path. Detach and 180, and if it becomes necessary, look into a restraining order. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## MattMatt

Divorce seems to be the only valid option what with your husband's level of disrespect.


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## faithfulman

DH "only" got with this immoral trollop because of the dirty freaky sex, and it was "no big deal"

So surely he won't care if you find a nice young stud and get freaky with his "big deal", no?

I'm sorry if that's too much or too soon for you, but it would be nice if your husband had to at least think about having to face his own hypocrisy and mind movies. 

If that is too far for you accept my apologies!


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## She'sStillGotIt

I couldn't help but chuckle when I read the part about this vile POS saying he'd 'never consent to a divorce,' as though he has a *choice*. Not only is he a vile POS, but he's an ignorant, vile POS. 

I would take GREAT pleasure in giving him a one-way trip right out the front door on the end of my right foot, if I were you.


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## frigginlost

I'm going against commenting on the POS husband right now, to offer something to the OP.

You are without a doubt one of the most bada$$ women to ever post on these boards. The way you have handled everything garners so much freaking respect and makes you so incredibly attractive it's stunning. *You* are not going to have any trouble finding someone to fill that hole that is left with all of us that have been cheated on. Believe me, your husband now sees a side of you he never knew existed, and it is incredibly attractive to him. He is in for a massive life change that he has no control over, and it is going to bother him until the day he dies.

You took complete and total control of the situation. Keep doing so.


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## 3Xnocharm

frigginlost said:


> I'm going against commenting on the POS husband right now, to offer something to the OP.
> 
> You are without a doubt one of the most bada$$ women to ever post on these boards. The way you have handled everything garners so much freaking respect and makes you so incredibly attractive it's stunning. *You* are not going to have any trouble finding someone to fill that hole that is left with all of us that have been cheated on. Believe me, your husband now sees a side of you he never knew existed, and it is incredibly attractive to him. He is in for a massive life change that he has no control over, and it is going to bother him until the day he dies.
> 
> You took complete and total control of the situation. Keep doing so.


Amen!!!


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## shakazulu

I started reading my post from start to finish, and it still looks surreal to me. I have blown this up to his family (many of who knew or suspected the affair but said nothing), I also talked to Jane’s mom (since they are family friends), but right now I cannot find the fiance, but that can wait. What I cannot do is keep this a secret. Everyone must know what they did to me. On reading Jane’s chats carefully, and looking at the pictures, I am beginning to comprehend the emotional and psychological damage this has done, and trying not to snap because I can barely hold it together.

1. Two kids to consider, 11 and 13 – they have noticed the strain at home. The girl is especially very close to her dad.

2. 14 years down the drain, I was 23 when we got married. That’s my young life gone with a ‘poof!’

3. Front seat view on the details of the affair i.e. names, places, intimate details. The mind movies are torturous. On closely reading the messages, Jane mentions the time they had a quickie right under my nose outside late at night in our vacation home, when we had a party and all family friends and neighbors were there. I remember that day because I retired to bed early with the kids. Later, I remember that H came into bed and we made love, with the stench/bodily fluids of HER still on HIM. This level of callousness, selfishness and disrespect is unfathomable.

4. The unprotexted sex. Jane is counseling him in one of the chats ‘if she asks about this, say yes, we had protected sex’. Great job exposing us to health risks like this, hubby!

5. In one of the last messages, Jane is asking when the next hook-up is, and saying she will open a new email address for their communications because her fiance is snoopy. In other words, this affair would have continued if I didn’t find out. Yuck.

6. Last, but not least, all of our favorite locations are tainted now. Our hometown (that’s where Jane lives) and half the hotels and clubs in it; our vacation house, our current house, other cities we used to frequent, etc. HE TOOK HER TO ALL OF OUR FAVORITE PLACES

7. And the wedding! She has tainted that as well- I recall her smug face sitting there and looking shady, staying out after all the guests had left. Following us into a private late night party of clubbing and dancing, then sneaking out into the night.

8. Oh, and he bonded with Jane and is still in a fog. When I exposed this to families, the phones started going crazy buzzing. He says to me ‘you should have kept this a secret and let us deal with it as a couple. Jane is young and I don’t want her life ruined or her committing suicide over this.’ Yeah right. What about me, the mother of his kids? Where is his concern if I overdosed or slashed my wrists to end my pain. Scumbag!

The list is endless…


----------



## 3Xnocharm

Girl... hugs to you, sooo many hugs. 

His concern for her over you is just... I cant even... You are the WIFE for crying out loud, you were supposed to be priority, and he doesn't give one damn what he has done to you, not ONE. You did the right thing exposing, too bad you cant find the fiancé. But, most likely if he exists, it wont take long for word to reach him too. I can remember a friend of mine who cheated getting so offended that her BH exposed her affair! I just told her that's what you do when your partner cheats, you expose it to end it and to find support! She to this day cannot wrap her mind around WHY so many people still want nothing to do with her, it kills me. Its like she cant see just how horrible what she did actually was, no remorse. Your H is of the same mind. 

You are doing amazing. I know you feel like you're falling apart, and do give yourself a chance to do so for a time. You are setting such a strong example for other betrayed spouses who come here looking for answers. You can hold your head high.


----------



## wilson

shakazulu said:


> 1. Two kids to consider, 11 and 13 – they have noticed the strain at home. The girl is especially very close to her dad.


Shame on him for worrying that Jane is young and all this exposure will affect her. What about his own daughters?!? They are at the ages where this can have a significant emotional impact. It's clear that your H has lost his mind and cannot be counted on at all. I'm sorry so much is falling on you, but it's clear that you're going to have to be both parents to your daughters through all this. Be their emotional rock as much as you can so that they make it through all this okay.


----------



## Spoons027

shakazulu said:


> I started reading my post from start to finish, and it still looks surreal to me. I have blown this up to his family (many of who knew or suspected the affair but said nothing), I also talked to Jane’s mom (since they are family friends), but right now I cannot find the fiance, but that can wait. What I cannot do is keep this a secret. Everyone must know what they did to me. On reading Jane’s chats carefully, and looking at the pictures, I am beginning to comprehend the emotional and psychological damage this has done, and trying not to snap because I can barely hold it together.
> 
> 1. Two kids to consider, 11 and 13 – they have noticed the strain at home. The girl is especially very close to her dad.
> 
> 2. 14 years down the drain, I was 23 when we got married. That’s my young life gone with a ‘poof!’
> 
> 3. Front seat view on the details of the affair i.e. names, places, intimate details. The mind movies are torturous. On closely reading the messages, Jane mentions the time they had a quickie right under my nose outside late at night in our vacation home, when we had a party and all family friends and neighbors were there. I remember that day because I retired to bed early with the kids. Later, I remember that H came into bed and we made love, with the stench/bodily fluids of HER still on HIM. This level of callousness, selfishness and disrespect is unfathomable.
> 
> 4. The unprotexted sex. Jane is counseling him in one of the chats ‘if she asks about this, say yes, we had protected sex’. Great job exposing us to health risks like this, hubby!
> 
> 5. In one of the last messages, Jane is asking when the next hook-up is, and saying she will open a new email address for their communications because her fiance is snoopy. In other words, this affair would have continued if I didn’t find out. Yuck.
> 
> 6. Last, but not least, all of our favorite locations are tainted now. Our hometown (that’s where Jane lives) and half the hotels and clubs in it; our vacation house, our current house, other cities we used to frequent, etc. HE TOOK HER TO ALL OF OUR FAVORITE PLACES
> 
> 7. And the wedding! She has tainted that as well- I recall her smug face sitting there and looking shady, staying out after all the guests had left. Following us into a private late night party of clubbing and dancing, then sneaking out into the night.
> 
> 8. Oh, and he bonded with Jane and is still in a fog. When I exposed this to families, the phones started going crazy buzzing. He says to me ‘you should have kept this a secret and let us deal with it as a couple. Jane is young and I don’t want her life ruined or her committing suicide over this.’ Yeah right. What about me, the mother of his kids? Where is his concern if I overdosed or slashed my wrists to end my pain. Scumbag!
> 
> The list is endless…


So much for begging to work it out. 

Keep working on detaching from him. Nothing good will come from listening to whatever other foggy crap tumbles out of his mouth.

And to do the dirty with the AP and later do it with the spouse in the same night? The highest form of disrespect.

And what exactly does he mean ‘deal with it as a couple’? He was the one who brought another person into it!
The mental gymnastics are wild with your H.


----------



## Ursula

First off, you're not the bad person in this situation, so don't let him manipulate you into thinking this. He's a liar, a cheater and a master manipulator. If I were you, I would get my affairs in order (bank accounts, custody of your kids, a place to live, etc.), and I would boot it outta there. And shame on his entire family for knowing this is happening and not informing you.


----------



## frigginlost

shakazulu said:


> I started reading my post from start to finish, and it still looks surreal to me. I have blown this up to his family (many of who knew or suspected the affair but said nothing), I also talked to Jane’s mom (since they are family friends), but right now I cannot find the fiance, but that can wait. What I cannot do is keep this a secret. Everyone must know what they did to me. On reading Jane’s chats carefully, and looking at the pictures, I am beginning to comprehend the emotional and psychological damage this has done, and trying not to snap because I can barely hold it together.
> 
> 1. Two kids to consider, 11 and 13 – they have noticed the strain at home. The girl is especially very close to her dad.
> 
> 2. 14 years down the drain, I was 23 when we got married. That’s my young life gone with a ‘poof!’
> 
> 3. Front seat view on the details of the affair i.e. names, places, intimate details. The mind movies are torturous. On closely reading the messages, Jane mentions the time they had a quickie right under my nose outside late at night in our vacation home, when we had a party and all family friends and neighbors were there. I remember that day because I retired to bed early with the kids. Later, I remember that H came into bed and we made love, with the stench/bodily fluids of HER still on HIM. This level of callousness, selfishness and disrespect is unfathomable.
> 
> 4. The unprotexted sex. Jane is counseling him in one of the chats ‘if she asks about this, say yes, we had protected sex’. Great job exposing us to health risks like this, hubby!
> 
> 5. In one of the last messages, Jane is asking when the next hook-up is, and saying she will open a new email address for their communications because her fiance is snoopy. In other words, this affair would have continued if I didn’t find out. Yuck.
> 
> 6. Last, but not least, all of our favorite locations are tainted now. Our hometown (that’s where Jane lives) and half the hotels and clubs in it; our vacation house, our current house, other cities we used to frequent, etc. HE TOOK HER TO ALL OF OUR FAVORITE PLACES
> 
> 7. And the wedding! She has tainted that as well- I recall her smug face sitting there and looking shady, staying out after all the guests had left. Following us into a private late night party of clubbing and dancing, then sneaking out into the night.
> 
> 8. Oh, and he bonded with Jane and is still in a fog. When I exposed this to families, the phones started going crazy buzzing. He says to me ‘you should have kept this a secret and let us deal with it as a couple. Jane is young and I don’t want her life ruined or her committing suicide over this.’ Yeah right. What about me, the mother of his kids? Where is his concern if I overdosed or slashed my wrists to end my pain. Scumbag!
> 
> The list is endless…


Every single thing you are feeling is completely normal. It is without a doubt the hardest roller coaster you will ever ride. Everything you thought about love, trust, loyalty, etc. has been obliterated. Your mind is going to play some of the coldest tricks in the book with you to try to deal with the trauma it is facing. Being cheated on is one of the most painful things that can be done to a person. It destroys everything they believed love actually was.

What you need to know is that although it does not feel like it, you are healing. Slowly but surely. Your moral compass and your character are two extremely strong things and they will pull you through. You've just got to tough it out.

Now, regarding your ex. The same thing is happening in his brain although it is a 180 degree view. Everything that he believed in regarding you (his control of your marriage) is now gone. It's been obliterated and he is in an ocean trying not sink. The loudest animal in a jungle is one that is hurt and he is going to do everything humanly possible to stay alive. He is not going to play fair, he is going to try manipulation, and he is going to try to use your moral compass and your character against you. In other words, he can't beat you fair and square as you already showed him just how incredibly bada$$ you are, so he has no other routes but to try to get you in his pigpen and get dirty.

Stay the course! You are so ahead of the game regarding him. Stay there. Give him *nothing*. Show him *nothing*.

My ex took the guy she was cheating on me with to every hangout we went to in our hometown. It's playbook cheating. You're not alone in what has been done to you. What is different form others, is that you are the one in control. He's weak. Very weak. Use that against him...


----------



## MattMatt

@shakazulu Here is proof your husband can't find his own rear orifice with a clue and a flashlight:-


----------



## Sports Fan

He is 100% cheating. The question is what consequences are you going to offer?


----------



## aine

Shakazula, stay the course, you are doing great. Get a counsellor for yourself, get rest, good food, talk to clos3 friend, get support. You need to stay strong for your kids. Your 13 yr old is old enough and probably knows more than you think. What about the lawyer? Keep looking for that Fiance, his knowing will help keep them on the back foot.


----------



## Beach123

shakazulu said:


> I started reading my post from start to finish, and it still looks surreal to me. I have blown this up to his family (many of who knew or suspected the affair but said nothing), I also talked to Jane’s mom (since they are family friends), but right now I cannot find the fiance, but that can wait. What I cannot do is keep this a secret. Everyone must know what they did to me. On reading Jane’s chats carefully, and looking at the pictures, I am beginning to comprehend the emotional and psychological damage this has done, and trying not to snap because I can barely hold it together.
> 
> 1. Two kids to consider, 11 and 13 – they have noticed the strain at home. The girl is especially very close to her dad.
> 
> 2. 14 years down the drain, I was 23 when we got married. That’s my young life gone with a ‘poof!’
> 
> 3. Front seat view on the details of the affair i.e. names, places, intimate details. The mind movies are torturous. On closely reading the messages, Jane mentions the time they had a quickie right under my nose outside late at night in our vacation home, when we had a party and all family friends and neighbors were there. I remember that day because I retired to bed early with the kids. Later, I remember that H came into bed and we made love, with the stench/bodily fluids of HER still on HIM. This level of callousness, selfishness and disrespect is unfathomable.
> 
> 4. The unprotexted sex. Jane is counseling him in one of the chats ‘if she asks about this, say yes, we had protected sex’. Great job exposing us to health risks like this, hubby!
> 
> 5. In one of the last messages, Jane is asking when the next hook-up is, and saying she will open a new email address for their communications because her fiance is snoopy. In other words, this affair would have continued if I didn’t find out. Yuck.
> 
> 6. Last, but not least, all of our favorite locations are tainted now. Our hometown (that’s where Jane lives) and half the hotels and clubs in it; our vacation house, our current house, other cities we used to frequent, etc. HE TOOK HER TO ALL OF OUR FAVORITE PLACES
> 
> 7. And the wedding! She has tainted that as well- I recall her smug face sitting there and looking shady, staying out after all the guests had left. Following us into a private late night party of clubbing and dancing, then sneaking out into the night.
> 
> 8. Oh, and he bonded with Jane and is still in a fog. When I exposed this to families, the phones started going crazy buzzing. He says to me ‘you should have kept this a secret and let us deal with it as a couple. Jane is young and I don’t want her life ruined or her committing suicide over this.’ Yeah right. What about me, the mother of his kids? Where is his concern if I overdosed or slashed my wrists to end my pain. Scumbag!
> 
> The list is endless…


Well, end it as quickly as you can.

Time away from him will give you more clarity and peace = the ability to adjust and be happier without him stealing your peace of mind.


----------



## shakazulu

First week after my D Day – Emotionally, I am a wreck but starting to grasp reality gradually. Still unable to sleep at night, on auto pilot and trying to function, go to work and be a mother.
After blowing this up to his family, the ones who knew or suspected the affair, they are mostly on his side (which is OK, because blood is definitely thicker than water). H is still denying the affair, only that now he has his stooge of a family backing him. When I exposed, I mentioned that I had documentary evidence i.e. the screen shots with Jane, and the pictures she sent of them together. The VILE family is siding with Dumb Jane and their narrative when they blow up my phone is ‘that she knew it was me all along and made up the stories’. They say that the pics have been photo shopped. Someone has even conjured up alternate pictures (of the Jane and H together in a crowd, and with his family to prove how messed up I am). Jane was supposedly their family friend, remember? They are choosing her SIDE over mine.
I know I was super naïve and trusting before, but there is no going back. I am just surprised the lengths they are going through to make it sound like I am the one who is crazy (the perils of being married to a Charming Narcissistic).
Still waiting on the lawyer to file. He seems to be dragging his feet all of a sudden. H has refused to move out of the house. 
Again, thanks to everyone for their support. The online resources have been helpful. It feels somewhat better to finally see the light, but the next chapter of my life looks scary and uncertain.


----------



## Spoons027

shakazulu said:


> First week after my D Day – Emotionally, I am a wreck but starting to grasp reality gradually. Still unable to sleep at night, on auto pilot and trying to function, go to work and be a mother.
> After blowing this up to his family, the ones who knew or suspected the affair, they are mostly on his side (which is OK, because blood is definitely thicker than water). H is still denying the affair, only that now he has his stooge of a family backing him. When I exposed, I mentioned that I had documentary evidence i.e. the screen shots with Jane, and the pictures she sent of them together. The VILE family is siding with Dumb Jane and their narrative when they blow up my phone is ‘that she knew it was me all along and made up the stories’. They say that the pics have been photo shopped. Someone has even conjured up alternate pictures (of the Jane and H together in a crowd, and with his family to prove how messed up I am). Jane was supposedly their family friend, remember? They are choosing her SIDE over mine.
> I know I was super naïve and trusting before, but there is no going back. I am just surprised the lengths they are going through to make it sound like I am the one who is crazy (the perils of being married to a Charming Narcissistic).
> Still waiting on the lawyer to file. He seems to be dragging his feet all of a sudden. H has refused to move out of the house.
> Again, thanks to everyone for their support. The online resources have been helpful. It feels somewhat better to finally see the light, but the next chapter of my life looks scary and uncertain.


Well, geez. If his family is trying so hard to cover it up, then it’s honestly no wonder the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree with your H.

And just like him, you don’t need to listen to their lies either. You’ve got a lingerie confession, what more evidence do you need?

And if the lawyer continues to drag it on, get another bullshark attorney.

Glad you’re working on getting away from them. These people obviously cannot be entrusted with your life.


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## jlg07

Tell his family to go **** themselves -- you know the truth, they are covering up for a cheater and liar. NP -- you won't be associating with them anymore anyway after the divorce.

EDT: Well, don't tell them literally to go **** themselves!!! TRY to find that fiance. And maybe post a couple of her texts to his FB page...  Make sure YOUR friends /family know the truth regardless of what his family says. EVEN if it was true she knew it was you and made it up, WHO WOULD SUPPORT such an a**hole.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

jlg07 said:


> Tell his family to go **** themselves -- you know the truth, they are covering up for a cheater and liar. NP -- you won't be associating with them anymore anyway after the divorce.
> 
> *EDT: Well, don't tell them literally to go **** themselves!!! *TRY to find that fiance. And maybe post a couple of her texts to his FB page...  Make sure YOUR friends /family know the truth regardless of what his family says. EVEN if it was true she knew it was you and made it up, WHO WOULD SUPPORT such an a**hole.


*No, DO tell them this!* Then block them at every communication avenue, they have no reason to contact you and you have ZERO obligation to speak to them or to tolerate their bullcrap. If your attorney doesnt file by Monday, tell him you are taking your case to someone else who will actually help you.


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## smi11ie

The behavior of your husband and his family is very disrespectful. You should go no contact with them. Be careful that they don't drag the kids into it because they all sound nuts.


----------



## jlg07

"When I exposed, I mentioned that I had documentary evidence i.e. the screen shots with Jane, and the pictures she sent of them together. The VILE family is siding with Dumb Jane and their narrative when they blow up my phone is ‘that she knew it was me all along and made up the stories’. They say that the pics have been photo shopped. "

What would be the point of this elaborate ruse to conjure up all the fake stories/text that JANE sent to "you" and the fake pictures? What reason does the family say it was all done for? They clearly are grasping at straws here, so just ignore them on keep on with your plan. YOU will come out of this great -- THEY will still be lying to themselves and stuck with a cheater among them (and maybe more than one if they are this one-sided).


----------



## Openminded

I hope you completely cut his family out of your life (you'll obviously have to co-parent with him but you certainly can remove his family). Be prepared that they will all tell lies to your children so have a plan for countering that. This will be very messy but you will come out of it the winner.


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## aine

Sha, of course the family will support him, they have been accessories for a long long time so that it has become the new normal. Rely on your family and friends. YOu don't want your kids anywhere near these people, they will corrupt your kids. - Do not interact with your WH, ignore him
- Work on that lawyer processing things quickly, get all docs etc.
- Ask your friend/sibling to find out who her fiance is, you need to blow up her world, can you report her to her workplace?

Take care of yourself, rest, good food, etc. Join a divorce support group to help you through what comes next.


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## 3Xnocharm

Hey @shakazulu, how are you holding up?


----------



## shakazulu

Several months post discovery of his affair, my husband’s head is still stuck firmly in the clouds. He is deeply committed to remaining deceptive. I have layers and layers upon evidence of his long term affair, I have pictures of him and his affair partner together, cuddling, smiling and looking very much in love. I have confessions from family members who saw this affair develop and were too embarrassed or simply said nothing because they did not want to get involved. I have intimate text messages from his affair partner (I must admit, I entrapped her one night, chatted with her using his phone, pretending to be him, and that’s how all my suspicions were confirmed). I have a taped phone conversation from his affair partner (he put her up to it, to apologize for the affair upon my discovery, and I recorded it) admitting their dirty actions together. My husband supported his affair partner financially during his long term affair. I have wire transfer confirmations of the sums of money he sent to her. He still denies supporting her, the money was for ‘a business arrangement that went sour’. Finally, I have his own watered-down version of a written timeline of the affair. I also have his own confession, admitting his fault after day two of the affair discovery. The first week, he started well, answering questions. Yet, he now denies that an affair even took place. According to him, his affair partner is ‘a jealous, lying, vindictive woman because he is a good, strong man who did not succumb to her charms’.

Upon discovery of his affair, I was in complete and utter shock and disbelief. I steered clear of alcohol, but got into a self-destruction mode with sleeping pills. I am now clear-minded, still discovering new things every day i.e. expired condoms from 6-8 years ago (cannot be the same affair partner, as she would have been a minor, so this was probably an encounter with another woman). I have become a detective in my own home (he refused to move out, so I let that go). The affair did not happen, it is all in my head, he says. They went to all these hotels/clubs/trips and ‘did nothing, just had a drink’. He ‘cannot own up to what he did not do’.

Why should I put up with his denials? Why should I wait for the ‘aha’ moment when he comes from the darkness into the light? Why should I put up with him asking me to ‘get over it’ so that things go back to the old normal? The old normal, you know, where I was being cheated on and in the dark, where he would gaslight, manipulate or deflect, and where everyone seemed to know about his double life except me? Why should I put up with his verbal abuses, blaming me for his affair (i.e. you did not give me attention! Many women would love to be in your shoes! The other woman was open and communicative, you are not! You never loved me anyway! This was your plan from the very first day we got married! Looks like you are determined to break this marriage! You know what, I am not sorry for the affair, you deserve it!) This is the reason why – two pre-teen children, their stability and financial reasons. I could throw in ‘I love him’ in there, but I fear that every day my heart grows cold as this charade continues.

I am seeing a therapist individually to work out through my own feelings of despair and heartbreak. I don’t believe that marital counseling would work. Marital counseling would probably work when the cheating spouse sees the error of their ways. A part of me was hopeful that we can still reconcile, that inside this monster I could find the man I fell in love with 15 years ago, and I feel that I owe this to my children. I think a good way to start would be, at the very least, own up to your transgressions. However, it gets more difficult - my resentment grows because he fails to do this, and gets angry at me i.e. ‘I have given you two months to get yourself together, what else do you want?’

Is this denial an affair fog? Has anyone ever encountered this from a cheating spouse who got caught?


----------



## attheend02

why shouldn't he deny? It seems you are allowing him to walk all over you.

Why are you still married to this POS?


----------



## Diana7

Why haven't you started the divorce process? Its bad enough that he cheated without blaming you still.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

shakazulu said:


> Why should I put up with his denials?
> 
> 
> This is the reason why – two pre-teen children, their stability and financial reasons. I could throw in ‘I love him’ in there, but I fear that every day my heart grows cold as this charade continues.
> 
> I am seeing a therapist individually to work out through my own feelings of despair and heartbreak. I don’t believe that marital counseling would work. Marital counseling would probably work when the cheating spouse sees the error of their ways. A part of me was hopeful that we can still reconcile, that inside this monster I could find the man I fell in love with 15 years ago, and I feel that I owe this to my children. I think a good way to start would be, at the very least, own up to your transgressions. However, it gets more difficult - my resentment grows because he fails to do this, and gets angry at me i.e. ‘I have given you two months to get yourself together, what else do you want?’
> 
> Is this denial an affair fog? Has anyone ever encountered this from a cheating spouse who got caught?




Oh HELL no. Do you seriously think that you owe it to your children to stay with a man who lies out his ass, and is treating you like such **** while he has betrayed and continues to betray not just you, but those children you are using as an excuse to stay. This is sick. Your kids deserve a strong mom who shows them by example what to do in the face of betrayal and abuse. They deserve a mom who places her own mental and emotional well being as a top priority, so she can be happy... happy moms make happy kids. There is no level of financial security or material possessions that makes it ok for you to stay with this vile piece of crap. 

No, this is not affair fog that he is in. He is just a grade A selfish ass-hole, and you are allowing it. You are allowing his disrespect of you and your kids, allowing his abuse, and allowing his affair to continue with zero consequences. Snap out of it and kick his sorry ass to the curb then take him for everything he’s worth. 




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## sunsetmist

You owe it to your children to set a good example for what a marriage should be, not cheating, lying, belittling, etc. He wants you to run his family and her as his sidepiece--til the next one. After divorce, he will have to move out. Do the 180 and have as little contact with him as possible--even in the same house--text him. Have plans for kids only contact. Do not debate this situation.

The man you thought you loved does not exist--remember the out of date condoms--years of infidelity. He thinks if he denies enough he will wear you down. Even if he were just going out for drinks--a lie--that is dating! He has lied so much he cannot remember his story. Stop wavering--stand up for yourself.

What happened to your anger? Do not let him destroy you emotionally. You have pictures, texts, his confessions. He and his family are laughing at your ignorance and lack of action. File. How can you keep making excuses? By now, I'd want to be gone even if he were a saint--because he has no respect for you. Or you could just ask Jane to move in with y'all as it might be cheaper if you continue your spinelessness.


----------



## Openminded

Serial cheaters lie and deny when they're caught because they don't feel it benefits them to tell the truth so they don't. Serial cheaters rarely want a divorce but their spouse will never be enough for them. Each time they're caught, serial cheaters expect their spouse to just get over it and move on while they look for their next opportunity. And your children will be watching all of that and very likely repeating it when they grow up. 

That's the life you're looking at if you stay.


----------



## aine

shakazulu said:


> Several months post discovery of his affair, my husband’s head is still stuck firmly in the clouds. He is deeply committed to remaining deceptive. I have layers and layers upon evidence of his long term affair, I have pictures of him and his affair partner together, cuddling, smiling and looking very much in love. I have confessions from family members who saw this affair develop and were too embarrassed or simply said nothing because they did not want to get involved. I have intimate text messages from his affair partner (I must admit, I entrapped her one night, chatted with her using his phone, pretending to be him, and that’s how all my suspicions were confirmed). I have a taped phone conversation from his affair partner (he put her up to it, to apologize for the affair upon my discovery, and I recorded it) admitting their dirty actions together. My husband supported his affair partner financially during his long term affair. I have wire transfer confirmations of the sums of money he sent to her. He still denies supporting her, the money was for ‘a business arrangement that went sour’. Finally, I have his own watered-down version of a written timeline of the affair. I also have his own confession, admitting his fault after day two of the affair discovery. The first week, he started well, answering questions. Yet, he now denies that an affair even took place. According to him, his affair partner is ‘a jealous, lying, vindictive woman because he is a good, strong man who did not succumb to her charms’.
> 
> Upon discovery of his affair, I was in complete and utter shock and disbelief. I steered clear of alcohol, but got into a self-destruction mode with sleeping pills. I am now clear-minded, still discovering new things every day i.e. expired condoms from 6-8 years ago (cannot be the same affair partner, as she would have been a minor, so this was probably an encounter with another woman). I have become a detective in my own home (he refused to move out, so I let that go). The affair did not happen, it is all in my head, he says. They went to all these hotels/clubs/trips and ‘did nothing, just had a drink’. He ‘cannot own up to what he did not do’.
> 
> Why should I put up with his denials? Why should I wait for the ‘aha’ moment when he comes from the darkness into the light? Why should I put up with him asking me to ‘get over it’ so that things go back to the old normal? The old normal, you know, where I was being cheated on and in the dark, where he would gaslight, manipulate or deflect, and where everyone seemed to know about his double life except me? Why should I put up with his verbal abuses, blaming me for his affair (i.e. you did not give me attention! Many women would love to be in your shoes! The other woman was open and communicative, you are not! You never loved me anyway! This was your plan from the very first day we got married! Looks like you are determined to break this marriage! You know what, I am not sorry for the affair, you deserve it!) This is the reason why – two pre-teen children, their stability and financial reasons. I could throw in ‘I love him’ in there, but I fear that every day my heart grows cold as this charade continues.
> 
> I am seeing a therapist individually to work out through my own feelings of despair and heartbreak. I don’t believe that marital counseling would work. Marital counseling would probably work when the cheating spouse sees the error of their ways. A part of me was hopeful that we can still reconcile, that inside this monster I could find the man I fell in love with 15 years ago, and I feel that I owe this to my children. I think a good way to start would be, at the very least, own up to your transgressions. However, it gets more difficult - my resentment grows because he fails to do this, and gets angry at me i.e. ‘I have given you two months to get yourself together, what else do you want?’
> 
> Is this denial an affair fog? Has anyone ever encountered this from a cheating spouse who got caught?



It sounds like you are married to a Narcissist and to be honest they will never change. He has treated you every which way and you have gone back for more, probably due to trauma bonding. You need to read up as much as you can on Narcissists, trauma bonding and hoovering and all their tactics. The only way you can defeat this man is to sue for divorce, take him to the cleaners and then go No contact. Why are you not angry about this and using all this information against him. 
What you will never get is acknowledgement of your pain and grief, acknowledgement of his wrongs, a change in the way he treats you. 
You do not seem to understand but he is incapable of change and because you are addicted to this man due to the terrible mistreatment (trauma bonding) you cannot let go of him. 
He has managed your expectations down to crumbs and even if he throws you a few scraps of consideration you accept it as hope. 
There is no hope in this marriage, it will eventually kill you and leave you a former shadow of yourself. His family are all the flying monkeys the Narc keeps around him, you are made out to be the crazy ***** who deserves all of this. 
Please please get yourself to a therapist who knows how to deal with victims of narcissistic abuse. You cannot win this war treating him as a normal human being, Narcissists do not have a soul. He will destroy you.


----------



## Loveshorror

I have news for you - your husband isn’t the only one with his head in the clouds. Why are you still focusing on evidence? You have all you need. Instead, you continue to allow your husband to mistreat you, and in all likelihood continue the affair. This state of limbo you’ve put yourself in will destroy you. And that doesn’t even touch on the financial infidelity, which you also apparently are giving your husband a pass on. Why should he change what he is doing? He’s had no real consequences so far.

You need to act to protect yourself, your kids and to get out of infidelity. Otherwise when nothing changes... nothing changes.


----------



## shakazulu

He should finally be served tomorrow. It’s taken a while getting things ready. He has no idea. A part of me still thought he’d wake up and start to take responsibility.

The worst thing about this is waking up one morning and discovering that you are married to a total stranger. I have been hit by a ton of bricks, and I now lay down bruised and battered, conceding defeat. I never ever thought in my wildest dreams that I would be here.

I’m nervous and worried about the kids. He’s been telling them that ‘mom wants him to move out’. My 11 year old son was mad at me. I took my daughter out for coffee one evening after her gymnastics classes, and he berated her when we returned late because she didn’t answer her phone. She’s now scared to go out anywhere with me. I haven’t told them why we’re fighting. 

And no support from either side of the family. I wasn’t expecting any from his side, of course. But my own mother and sisters have been a disappointment. They are thumping the Bible and touting ‘forgiveness’.

I’m a wreck, still in shock. Reading about narcissism and all that. Talking to a therapist. Trying to avoid fights. I always thought, naively, that cheaters who say they want to stay married at least take some responsibility for the hazards they cause.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

shakazulu said:


> I’m nervous and worried about the kids. He’s been telling them that ‘mom wants him to move out’. My 11 year old son was mad at me. I took my daughter out for coffee one evening after her gymnastics classes, and he berated her when we returned late because she didn’t answer her phone. She’s now scared to go out anywhere with me. I haven’t told them why we’re fighting.


Shame on him for saying crap like that to your kids! Once he is served, you MUST tell your kids both the truth about what is going to happen and WHY. Be HONEST with them. They dont need dirty sordid details, or you going over the top emotional, but they need the truth. "I found out your dad had a girlfriend, and that is not okay when you are married to someone. It hurt me very much and I cant trust him any more." They will have questions, no doubt, please answer them, even if it means revealing that your H is not sorry for what he did. Also you need to have a come to Jesus talk with him about pulling this kind of crap with your kids. Its manipulative and very damaging. You BOTH need to work hard at making sure they feel as secure as possible through this. 



shakazulu said:


> And no support from either side of the family. I wasn’t expecting any from his side, of course. But my own mother and sisters have been a disappointment. They are thumping the Bible and touting ‘forgiveness’.


How horrible of your family! You may need to come to terms with the fact that you will have to cut them out of your life, at least for a while. You are doing the right thing for YOU, and they should be ashamed for not supporting you. You have been betrayed in the worst way, and you CAN forgive, that doesnt mean that you keep yourself chained to the situation. 

Good for you for having the courage to do the right thing for yourself, I am so glad you came back to update.


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## Affaircare

shakazulu said:


> ... I’m nervous and worried about the kids. He’s been telling them that ‘mom wants him to move out’. My 11 year old son was mad at me. I took my daughter out for coffee one evening after her gymnastics classes, and he berated her when we returned late because she didn’t answer her phone. She’s now scared to go out anywhere with me. I haven’t told them why we’re fighting.


 @shakazulu it is absolutely 100% reasonable and right for you to tell your kids why you and their father are fighting. Tell them the truth and tell them in an age-appropriate way, such as "I have something to tell you that makes me very sad, but you deserve to know. Your father and I are fighting because I found out he has a girlfriend and has had one for a long time. I believe when people marry they should be faithful to each other, and so even though I wanted our marriage, I just can not accept infidelity and he does not choose to stop. So yeah, we are fighting about that because we disagree. I do not choose to stay married to someone who won't remain faithful to me, and I do have concrete evidence so I know for a fact it's the truth, even though it tears me up inside." 

The idea is not to put him down or talk for him about what he thinks and feels, but rather to share with them what YOU believe and what YOU think and feel. You tell them YOU are sad...YOU believe in faithfulness...YOU won't accept infidelity...etc. And if they say something like "Well why won't dad quit?" or "Doesn't dad want to stay married?" you can just say "You will need to ask your father about that--I don't speak for him. I am just letting you know my own beliefs and thoughts and feelings."

It's important for you to tell the kids the truth, because it is not YOU being the bad guy for bringing the affair into the light of day--it is HIS ACTIONS--his choice to commit adultery and not stop--that are causing this divorce. But the kids are part of the family. They deserve to know why their world is blowing up. They will think the worst, and if they are like most kids, they will blame themselves somehow. By telling them the truth, they will hear your morals and learn about fidelity, but they will also know that they have at least one parent who will tell them the truth--one parent on whom they can depend! That's important!



> And no support from either side of the family. I wasn’t expecting any from his side, of course. But my own mother and sisters have been a disappointment. They are thumping the Bible and touting ‘forgiveness’.
> 
> I’m a wreck, still in shock. Reading about narcissism and all that. Talking to a therapist. Trying to avoid fights. I always thought, naively, that cheaters who say they want to stay married at least take some responsibility for the hazards they cause.


In real life, at any time, he could have humbled himself, admitted to what he's done, confessed to you and his family and your family, stopped committing adultery, and agreed to IC and MC to work on the damage HE has done. Instead, he has purposefully chosen to continue to lie, to attempt to gaslight you, blamed you, tried to rugsweep adultery, and then deflected responsibilty for HIS choices onto you! None of that is the action of a (hu)man who has truly repented!


----------



## nekonamida

Shakazulu, I read your first post back in January and I am SO RELIEVED that you have filed. This is a complete nightmare and your WH has made it 100x worse by not even pretending to be the slightest bit remorseful. What an ass!

Affaircare has given you amazing advice on what to tell your children. The affair is public knowledge so they are both at risk of finding out from multiple people now that they are getting old enough. Would you rather they hear it from you or from them?


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## alte Dame

You can tell your children in an age-appropriate way why you are divorcing their father. There are lots of resources to help you formulate your message to them.

For you, though, it should be enough to know that he is a serial cheater and will not stop. Without the divorce, you would be living in constant drama and heartbreak until you take your last breath. If you start to wobble, ask yourself where you want to be in 5 years, in 10 years. If you don't want to be miserable and heartbroken by your lying, cheating WH, then stay the course with the divorce.


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## Openminded

I'm sorry your family is not supporting you. Some are unfortunately that way. Ignore them and their so-called "advice". 

Expect him to continue to lie and deny so he can make you the bad guy to everyone. He will alienate your children if he can. Don't let that happen. Get the truth out there.


----------



## MattMatt

shakazulu said:


> He should finally be served tomorrow. It’s taken a while getting things ready. He has no idea. A part of me still thought he’d wake up and start to take responsibility.
> 
> The worst thing about this is waking up one morning and discovering that you are married to a total stranger. I have been hit by a ton of bricks, and I now lay down bruised and battered, conceding defeat. I never ever thought in my wildest dreams that I would be here.
> 
> I’m nervous and worried about the kids. He’s been telling them that ‘mom wants him to move out’. My 11 year old son was mad at me. I took my daughter out for coffee one evening after her gymnastics classes, and he berated her when we returned late because she didn’t answer her phone. She’s now scared to go out anywhere with me. I haven’t told them why we’re fighting.
> 
> And no support from either side of the family. I wasn’t expecting any from his side, of course. But my own mother and sisters have been a disappointment. They are thumping the Bible and touting ‘forgiveness’.
> 
> I’m a wreck, still in shock. Reading about narcissism and all that. Talking to a therapist. Trying to avoid fights. I always thought, naively, that cheaters who say they want to stay married at least take some responsibility for the hazards they cause.


Instead of them thumping the Bible, maybe they should, oh, I don't know, *read* it a bit more? 

They should support you. 

However, we have your back! :smthumbup:


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## shakazulu

Boy oh boy, don’t I wish I listened to all of you wise posters earlier when my DD1 nightmare started in January this year?

I was understandably in shock. So very stupidly, after listening to family and friends and using excuses about kids, business, homes bla bla bla. I asked my attorney to place everything on hold, and started the pick me up dance. We still fought and argued daily. The environment was toxic and unhealthy, I couldn’t trust one word that came out of his mouth. He still denied everything.

Then he got into IC and asked if I could join him. I watched him deny things and lie to the therapist- all for $125 a session. 

But DD2 came in October. He’d reached out and rekindled his affair with his longtime girlfriend- a different one from the DD1 woman. This one has been in his life since 2005. We were married in 2004. Go figure. Don’t ask me how, but I have recordings of him declaring his love and begging to see her again. He’s making plans and talking dates and hotels and cities (he actually left for a ‘business trip’ to her home city)He’s trash talking me. He’s defending himself to her about the first woman. My husband is arguing with another woman about another woman (she too is a friend of his family and had heard about the first woman and was upset that he ‘cheated on her’)It’s disgusting. I did more digging- there’s a lot of sexting and private part pictures. At one point, 3 years ago, through my digging, he was dating and sexting the two women concurrently at the same time.

I’m only writing because you guys warned me and I didn’t listen. Even with the red flag denials, blatant emotional abuse, and him using the kids to demean me. I sat there, waiting for the unicorn. Waiting for my husband to come to his senses while playing the dutiful wife and swallowing my pain.

Alas, DD2 came upon me. I’m a fool yet again, but this time, I’m out. 

Guys, for the hundredth time, if your cheater isn’t the slightest bit remorseful- RUN!!!!!!!


----------



## 3Xnocharm

I am sorry it had to happen this way and that you got even MORE hurt! This time, make sure you walk through that door he keeps holding open for you and DONT LOOK BACK. We are here for you.


----------



## Marduk

I’m so sorry. 

But as they say, leave a cheater and gain a life.


----------



## aquarius1

Im so sorry that it has come to this. But for your sake I am glad that you finally have some very definitive confirmation.
At least now you will no longer doubt yourself or your sanity. It's so cruel.
If you haven't already, please get tested for STDs.


----------



## moon7

shakazulu said:


> About two years ago (2016), on DH’s phone, I stumbled upon a text message exchange between my Darling Husband and his half brother, arguing about some family issues. His half brother texted angrily something to Darling Husband, to the effect that ‘I’m not the one sleeping with other women and hiding it from my wife’.
> 
> The text blew me off, and when I questioned Darling Husband about what it meant, he said his brother was looking to create trouble in our marriage. In all fairness, the two have had a rocky relationship. So I believed Darling Husband and forgot about it.
> 
> Later (2017), he was seen at a hotel (or a club) with a woman, he had an explanation ( said was having fun with his niece in college and her friends). The niece confirmed this, with a caveat that one of the girls, let’s call her Jane, was not really her friend but was rather shady.
> 
> A few months later, in another argument by text with a different family member, Darling Husband was again accused of sleeping with other women under the guise of helping them out financially. This was through a text message again, found on DH’s phone. Same explanation again. I did not pursue it further since his family has plenty of in-fighting and can be brutal to each other. However, the alarm bells started going off at this point.
> 
> Later, around the same time, I encountered some call logs in our joint cell phone statement. Darling Husband had been chatting with someone for several hours almost weekly. When I asked, he said it was a female family friend, Jane, needing money, which he promptly wired. He assured me it was that one time and promised he wouldn’t do it again.
> 
> Last week, we had a destination wedding in his home town for his uncle. There was a strange woman (Jane) looking rather isolated from the guests. Someone blurted out, ‘Oh, no, she’s here, this might get ugly’, then immediately clammed shut when they noticed me within earshot. After the wedding, I noticed that the woman lingered on after all guests had left. Darling Husband assured me that his family are apparently friends with her family. She’s the only one who attended from her family. She ignored Darling Husband, and he also avoided her like the plague, which was a HUGE red flag because he’s extremely outgoing and was chatting up with all the guests. By this time I was livid, started putting two and two together after having spent the whole day reflecting upon everything. I watched the two throughout and had a miserable time at the wedding. At the wedding reception, another of his brothers said ‘why would Jane come here?’. To add salt to the injury, Jane followed the family to a private evening party, and sat alone in a corner, isolated. DH continued to ignore her the whole time while speaking with everyone else. Later, Jane slipped away unnoticed into the night.
> 
> That night at our hotel while Darling Husband was asleep, I found several wire transfer transactions in his email. Dozens of cash transfers to Jane. I woke Darling Husband up and confronted him. He said he didn’t want to upset me that’s why he kept the wires a secret. He said he hasn’t been seeing Jane, she’s a young girl that has financial problems and he felt sorry for her. He told me I was cold and didn’t have a heart. We argued the whole night and he refused to answer any questions about Jane, sticking with his story that she’s in financial trouble and he’s helping.
> 
> I demanded that he calls Jane. At first he resisted, but I took his phone and dialed. It went to voicemail. He seemed relieved. The following morning there was a text from Jane saying she missed his call, is everything ok?
> 
> I feel like his whole family knows about Jane and I’m the only one in the dark. I always felt something was off since 2016, but couldn’t put a finger on it. My heart is breaking and I have two kids to consider.
> 
> We are still arguing, Darling Husband is sticking to his story and denies that he’s sleeping with Jane. I have asked for his financial statements from 2016 to date, he refused. I demanded he calls Jane in my presence, he refused. He refuses a polygraph test too. Instead, I’m the bad person for ‘not trusting him.’ He’s refused to talk about it.
> 
> Later, I sat Darling Husband down to ask more questions about everything. He now says that the money was for a business plan that Jane had, a transport business for consignment designer shoes for women. I asked him why I was not included in this business arrangement, but he had no answer. I asked him how much he sent to Jane in total, he gave me a vague number but will not back it up by showing me his financial statements. He even said his niece is on board and knows about this business arrangement. I asked him who else knows, he said just the niece and no one else. I asked him where the incorporation paperwork is, tax IDs and the like. He said Jane did not deliver as agreed, and he has been conned of his money (Jane is now a con-lady?). I sat there, looked at him lying, and mentally planned my next steps. I don’t know whether to feel angry or upset anymore, especially since he has a story for everything and I know he’s lying and will not take his word for anything. I look at him and wonder if this is the same guy I’ve been married to for over 14 years. It’s surreal. He doesn’t want me to call anyone i.e. his niece, Jane, etc. That alone tells me everything I need to know. I have been such a fool for so long. I feel so isolated. How do get the truth?


Suspicious


----------



## moon7

shakazulu said:


> Boy oh boy, don’t I wish I listened to all of you wise posters earlier when my DD1 nightmare started in January this year?
> 
> I was understandably in shock. So very stupidly, after listening to family and friends and using excuses about kids, business, homes bla bla bla. I asked my attorney to place everything on hold, and started the pick me up dance. We still fought and argued daily. The environment was toxic and unhealthy, I couldn’t trust one word that came out of his mouth. He still denied everything.
> 
> Then he got into IC and asked if I could join him. I watched him deny things and lie to the therapist- all for $125 a session.
> 
> But DD2 came in October. He’d reached out and rekindled his affair with his longtime girlfriend- a different one from the DD1 woman. This one has been in his life since 2005. We were married in 2004. Go figure. Don’t ask me how, but I have recordings of him declaring his love and begging to see her again. He’s making plans and talking dates and hotels and cities (he actually left for a ‘business trip’ to her home city)He’s trash talking me. He’s defending himself to her about the first woman. My husband is arguing with another woman about another woman (she too is a friend of his family and had heard about the first woman and was upset that he ‘cheated on her’)It’s disgusting. I did more digging- there’s a lot of sexting and private part pictures. At one point, 3 years ago, through my digging, he was dating and sexting the two women concurrently at the same time.
> 
> I’m only writing because you guys warned me and I didn’t listen. Even with the red flag denials, blatant emotional abuse, and him using the kids to demean me. I sat there, waiting for the unicorn. Waiting for my husband to come to his senses while playing the dutiful wife and swallowing my pain.
> 
> Alas, DD2 came upon me. I’m a fool yet again, but this time, I’m out.
> 
> Guys, for the hundredth time, if your cheater isn’t the slightest bit remorseful- RUN!!!!!!!


Wow! Now that was soul destroying. Pray amd pray hard, @shakazulu. Idk how to mantain any resemblance of sanity in this situation without God's help. Whatever you choose to do, dont destroy yourself in the process.


----------



## VFW

Sorry that you find yourself in this situation. Friends and families can really deal out some terrible advice, though well intended. For those that throw the Bible in your face, remind them that stoning was the penalty for infidelity. Additionally, forgiveness is built on the premise that the offending party is contrite. Your STBX was not only not contrite, but continued to deny anything even happened. This guy has lied for so long, he doesn't have the truth in him. Pay no attention to his words, look at his actions for your answers. Also, unless you need proof to prove infidelity, then just walk away, he is not deserving of another minute of your time. Look to set up a schedule for the holidays for the children. The holidays can be a tough time to go through this kind of mess, so be very sensitive to the kids concerns. I think that you should consider looking to start new traditions this year with just you and them. Look at decorating the tree early and do it together, maybe go to a Christmas movie together, a showing of the Nutcracker, religious events, musical events, etc.


----------



## Openminded

It takes time — sometimes even a lot of time — but it will get better. And life will be good again.


----------



## BruceBanner

shakazulu said:


> Guys, for the hundredth time, if your cheater isn’t the slightest bit remorseful- RUN!!!!!!!


Their remorse would be a facade; You should run regardless.


----------



## Beach123

Well I was married to a guy much like your soon to be exH... I can say get that divorce finalized as soon as you can. The freedom is totally worth it. The peace of mind is fantastic.

Ask for way more than you want in those divorce papers - because there is always compromise that comes at the end of the proceedings. I also made mine get and keep a life insurance policy that pays me a lot if/when he dies. I had it court ordered.

Request spousal support and child support and assets. You won’t get everything you ask for but you won’t get anything you don’t ask for.

My exH - when I found out about his affair (it wasn’t his first one) I told him not to come home. The divorce took about 3 years to finalize. I wasn’t so disgusted with him I couldn’t even have a conversation with him. I knew it wouldn’t change a thing and would be a waste of my breathe.

It wasn’t until last year my older son had a medical emergency that we had to spend a lot of time together every day. That’s when he actually apologized. I was shocked when he asked me to forgive him!

I forgave him long ago - probably 12 years ago. I am just glad I’m not living that nightmare anymore.

When anyone steals your peace of mind and you keep allowing it - it takes a bit of your soul each day you keep agreeing to betray yourself when you stay!

I feel free! And you should too!

You don’t need your family/his family to agree with you. You know what he did and he’s not gonna admit it anymore - that’s on him! He knows what he did to you (mine did too). He has to live with his own twisted conscience. That’s a pretty good revenge right there.

My exH’s family sided with him too - but I didn’t care at that point - I was SO over it and SO done. Years later they interacted with me at a family event and they were all VERY kind and loving to me - I stayed neutral. They know he lacks character. I don’t need to discuss any of it with them. I was there - I smiled and interacted as a classy gal would. I went home feeling relieved - relieved I’m not living that life anymore.

I hope you can move forward and be kind to yourself.

Ask for a LOT in those divorce papers! Do not even speak to him! Nothing good will come from any conversation with him. Just do NOT engage. If you must - only answer with yes, no or maybe as your standard response to any question he asks.

Do take care of yourself now. Look out for your kids too. It’s useful to gently explain to your kids exactly why you are leaving him! Explain that he broke the marital vows and you deserve better/ to be treated with respect and honor and they should also have that standard for their marriage too.

If it’s needed don’t hesitate to seek professional counseling.

Post here if you need support. I’ll check back more often - I’m happy to be supportive.

It does get better if you take charge of your future and don’t allow anyone to be unkind. It also gets better when YOU start moving forward so you can react to him without feeling any emotions - just neutrality.


----------



## She'sStillGotIt

shakazulu said:


> I’m only writing because you guys warned me and I didn’t listen. Even with the red flag denials, blatant emotional abuse, and him using the kids to demean me. I sat there, waiting for the unicorn. Waiting for my husband to come to his senses while playing the dutiful wife and swallowing my pain.
> 
> Alas, DD2 came upon me. I’m a fool yet again, but this time, I’m out.
> 
> Guys, for the hundredth time, if your cheater isn’t the slightest bit remorseful- RUN!!!!!!!


Of course he wasn't remorseful, OP. 

True remorse seems to be a myth. I mean come on. If they're only too happy to lie to your face every single day and feel their affair is worth risking their marriage, then quite clearly, that's how they feel. So why on earth would they *suddenly *have all this 'remorse' only AFTER they're caught? If he had no remorse on Monday night when he lied to your face in order to get out of the house to go to his affair partner's place for a little 'alone time,' then it's ridiculous to assume he's suddenly going to feel it on Tuesday after you caught him. You're not seeing remorse. You're just seeing *self preservation*. Those big tears of 'remorse' from a cheater and all those sugary promises of cutting off contact with their affair partner (when they really have no such intention of doing that), and all those proclamations of how they didn't *realize* what they "almost lost," are so typical, they're boring. That's what most of them say when they're caught. And most cheaters will happily park their lying asses in a therapist's chair for an hour once a week if it means avoiding divorce court. 

That was just regret at having been caught, and pure self preservation you were seeing.

OP, you only did what most newly betrayeds do, and that's to want so *badly* to believe his lies that you ignored the red flags and all the advice we were giving you. We see this done all the time. Sadly, it seems a lot of posters DO come back at one point or another to tell us they caught their cheater again. I'm very glad to see that this time, there won't be another chance for him to just **** all over you yet again.

This will be the best 180 pounds of worthless flesh you'll ever lose.


----------



## Beach123

And my exH also would say he would do anything to stay together. But history showed that didn’t include being faithful to me!

He really wanted to be married - he just didn’t know how to be monogamous.

His actions and words never matched and I always worried. 27 years of worry! 27 years of him thinking I was believing all his lies. There always lies. 

I don’t miss it at all - and it’s been almost 15 years since I left him.


----------



## MAJDEATH

OP, so what's the latest with your situation? Did he move out and start paying support? Did you sever all joint accounts? Tell the kids that Dad maintains girlfriends?


----------



## Beach123

What’s the update? Have you changed anything?


----------



## MAJDEATH

I guess she is gone.


----------



## shakazulu

I’m not gone. Thanks to everyone for your support. It’s heartbreaking and I cannot believe I’m back here but I’m glad my eyes are opened. My greatest fear when this fiasco started was reconciling only to discover another affair years later. I’ve had one year to process things so maybe I’m luckier than most. 

I’ve been busy planning my move out of the family home. It’s especially hard because the kids are in the middle of the school year and it’s the holiday season!!! I was hoping to suck it up until the summer but the situation was impossible. I was losing my soul. None of our families know that I’m splitting yet. Right now I need support and encouragement and nothing else. I haven’t been getting that.

And it’s Christmas and breaks my heart that the kids will associate the holidays with a time their family was breaking apart. I regret wasting the whole summer waiting for a unicorn.

The reality is hitting me that my life and kids’ lives as we knew it is over. Buying new furniture and everything from scratch. Starting life from scratch and picking up the pieces. Husband said I couldn’t take anything out of the house (says he won’t let me go). Wrote a long cut and paste ‘apology’ from the internet pretty much saying how ‘a strong marriage requires trust and openness and that we both need to be mature and make this relationship work’. Nothing in that email had any sense of responsibility for getting us here or breaking our marriage vows. To him, I’m the one with the problem and acting crazy by ‘not believing in him’. 

I just don’t get it. To him, he did nothing wrong, those women are ‘good family friends he’s known for years’ and I’m the one breaking our family. He’s still caught in his alternate reality.


----------



## Tilted 1

Good for you, and most states are a 50/50 shared assets. Regardless what you STBX says. Take half of the all financials you both share. And if he gets weird get a woman crisis to help you get a temporary Restraining order.


----------



## She'sStillGotIt

shakazulu said:


> Husband said I couldn’t take anything out of the house (says he won’t let me go). Wrote a long cut and paste ‘apology’ from the internet pretty much saying how ‘a strong marriage requires trust and openness and that we both need to be mature and make this relationship work’. Nothing in that email had any sense of responsibility for getting us here or breaking our marriage vows. To him, I’m the one with the problem and acting crazy by ‘not believing in him’.


Who gives a **** _what_ this guy wants. I sure wouldn't. And Prince Charming has no authority to tell you WHAT you can take out of the house. Who the hell does he think he is? I'm sure the fool thought his phony cut-and-pasted apology and equally phony proclamations of true love were going to stop you in your tracks and make you realize what a PRIZE you're walking away from. :rofl: He must have been shocked when his feeble 32 seconds of sheer Herculean effort of Googling, cutting and pasting didn't fix his marriage right then and there.

Do ONE thing for yoruself right now - *get to a lawyer immediately*. Stop being foolish and allowing this ass-hole to dictate what you can take of your OWN belongings and what you CAN'T take. 

You're making the same mistake most people make - not getting EDUCATED by a lawyer as to what your rights actually are and instead, making *uninformed* decisions because you don't *know *any better.

GET TO A LAWYER NOW!


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## aquarius1

Not sure how it works where you are but my sister took the cops with her to her former house to pick up her things.

One waited outside the house, one went with her inside the house while she pointed out and picked up the items that were hers. Her ex was very quiet during the whole event, guess he didn't want to tangle with the law!

She took pics of the larger items that she wanted for collection later so that he couldn't sell/burn/remove them and then claim that they were never there.

Get a lawyer. If even to help educate you on your rights. Listening to a deluded a**hat is no way to go.

You need to make him feel the full effect of his behaviour by exercising your LEGAL rights to your possessions.


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## moulinyx

You wouldn't want anything from your tainted marital home anyways! Purchasing all new things will be a physical fresh start to support your mental new beginning. You are certainly right to take things, but I do think a clean break will help the healing process. 

Your (ex?)husband does seem to have some personality disorders (I saw a mention of narcissism), which clearly helps him stay in the clouds and feel untouchable. He will always talk himself up to be the perfect husband and continue running through various women. 

I witnessed a very similar breakdown happen with a family friend. He had multiple affairs throughout their dating relationship, engagement, and then marriage. Each time he did the same song and dance your husband did. This wasn't a one time mistake or lapse in judgement...but something he needs to feel like a whole person. There's so much thrill involved along with getting to reinvent yourself with each person. 

Anyways, you are taking all of the right steps to come out a stronger person! I hope you are at least excited to berid of his awful family. I would have sang like a canary if I caught wind of anything like that within my family! What kind of good standing person would hide such a thing??


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## nekonamida

Shaka, he can take that letter and shove it up his ass! He knows EXACTLY what he's doing. He's doing anything and everything to keep you as his wife and have a girlfriend or 3 on the side. DO NOT listen to him. Just keep planning your escape and GTFO.

Take all that guilt you have about breaking up the family and tainting the holidays - dump it right on him where it belongs. YOU did everything you could to stay married. You were willing to overlook him denying an affair that you had photographic evidence of. All he had to do was keep it in his pants until after the holidays and he couldn't even do that. He could not go 6 months without cheating on you. 6 freaking months! Which means he's been cheating on you for YEARS and years.

Make a list of every horrible thing he's done to you. Put it somewhere where you will read it every single day. Start to feel weak and like doing the pick me dance? Read the list. Read it until it sinks in that this man is a monster and you deserve better.


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## shakazulu

The danger is in the planning, but I’m making headway. I was actually hoping that we could sit down as two adults with children to discuss the breaking up, and doing what’s best to ensure a smooth transition for the kids. Recognize that the marriage has failed and bla bla. Well, that’s not happening with my husband. He will not discuss anything related to the marriage ending.

One minute he says he doesn’t care, next minute he’s willing to work with a lawyer on any separation agreement I want, then he’s sorry for ‘causing this’ and is begging to ‘fix it’. The next minute he’s blaming everyone else for interfering in his marriage, calling my dwindling support system and getting into arguments with them. Then threatening to discard the kids so that ‘I can go ahead and find a new perfect dad’ for them. And other times he’s just plain old mean and vindictive and keeps making threats. Then declares how much he loves me. It’s exhausting and I’m tired.

I’m remaining focused on my move out and getting the new place ready for the kids before telling them. I have a lawyer but at this point I have to get out of the house. He’s never moving out and I don’t care anymore. That’s a fight for another time.

Thanks to everyone for your support.


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## Adelais

@shakazulu, you have so much proof and yet he still is denying. I can understand your frustration that he refuses to admit the truth, and is trying to paint you as crazy and unforgiving.

Steel yourself for living in the reality that what he is is not only a liar regarding his multiple affairs, but that he is a wicked manipulator, trying to convince you that you are crazy and that you shouldn't believe all the evidence.

When you feel yourself wavering, ask yourself if you would want to live with a man who would play with your mind. He is not safe for you in any way. The best thing that you can do for yourself is to get away from him and insulate yoursel from him.

He is dangerous and harmful to you and to your children. If he can lie like that to you and try to play with your mind, he will also do it to your children. Getting them away from his manipulations will be a blessing that you are giving them.

Your home will be broken, but 1/2 of it, your half, will be sane, honest and a good place for your children. Some day they will put all the pieces together and they will realize that he and his family are crazy, lying, manipulative people. They will know that you did the best thing for yourself and for them.

Do you have family on your side who support and love you or are you alone in this?


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## Adelais

I'd suggest that you print out all the evidence you have: pictures, texts, emails, etc., lame timeline he made, and type the phone call where the OW admitted things, and keep all that in a folder. When you begin to waver or question if you made the right decision, pull out that file and look at the evidence. It will make you mad, but more importantly, it will remind you that you are perfectly sane, that he is a liar and manipulator, and that you are doing the right thing by divorcing him so you don't have to be subjected to his gaslighting anymore.

Also, the fact that he refused to move out of the home, or give you anything, making it that much more difficult to you is simply unforgiveable. Document that too, and put it in your file as another wicked thing he did to you.

He doesn't love you. Blech. Those words shouldn't ever come out of his mouth, when speaking of his relationship or feelings toward you. He has treated you as if he hates you. No one should treat even an animal the way he has treated you.


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## shakazulu

I’m alone. My family are out of state hundreds of miles away. The supportive ones can only do so much from afar. The rest is up to me. I have to dig myself out of this hole and be a strong and sane role model for my kids. 

I’ve been drinking and sinking into depression the whole year while my husband was busy seducing woman no. 2. My own kids were constantly worried about me. I’m ok now. It’s just a matter of time.

My husband just doesn’t care about anyone but himself and I have to accept that bitter reality.


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## Adelais

Even though TAMers hate this, I'm going to give you a cyber hug anyway ((((shakazulu)))) 
You WILL feel better someday. The sooner you act and finish moving out, divorcing him, etc. the sooner you will feel better.


shakazulu said:


> I’m alone. My family are out of state hundreds of miles away. The supportive ones can only do so much from afar. The rest is up to me. I have to dig myself out of this hole and be a strong and sane role model for my kids.
> 
> I’ve been drinking and sinking into depression the whole year while my husband was busy seducing woman no. 2. My own kids were constantly worried about me. I’m ok now. It’s just a matter of time.
> 
> My husband just doesn’t care about anyone but himself and I have to accept that bitter reality.


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## moulinyx

My heart hurts for you while reading this. I think you have been given all of the advice anyone can spare. Unfortunately, only time will fix this awful feeling you have. Its so easy to talk a big game and encourage people to dump their loser husbands after their true colors are revealed, but no one acknowledges the act of ripping yourself apart from the person you married. It is so painful and make the days feel like years. 

Are you able to attend any support groups or join some sort of club to have a social release? Being isolated will not help you move forward in a healthy way. Again, so sorry you are enduring this living hell.


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## sunsetmist

I am glad that you think reality is setting in. How hard to believe that he is not, nor will ever be, the man you thought he was. He cannot wake up because he believes his fairy tale.

Be very careful of the safety of yourself and your children as reality slaps him in the face. You likely only know a part of his depravity--you alone had a marriage. He was still living the single life with you as maid and housekeeper.

Build a new life--anything honest will be better. Alcohol and pills are not your friends. Stop thinking like a married person--it is a habit. Take care of you--your kids need sanity and stability. Be the kind of person he will regret mistreating, not someone who needs him or collapses.

Most of all, remember his infidelity is not your fault in any way. He cheated, lied, disrespected, and bragged arrogantly about how he was living the life. His value is gone--he has chosen the worthless path. He has an empty hole in his soul with no ability to fill it. You can do this, after all you have already fought most of the battle.


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## donesies

I’m sorry you are dealing with this. I had a sudden discovery a couple years ago and went through all the emotional turmoil that you are now, but I did it AS I was filing (at the recommendation of this forum). I have long since gotten over her and the affair and have learned from it. I am happier than I’ve ever been in my life and I believe you will be too. It’s hard and it will always sting a little bit, but that’s because you cared for your spouse and there’s nothing wrong with that.


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## aine

shakazulu said:


> The danger is in the planning, but I’m making headway. I was actually hoping that we could sit down as two adults with children to discuss the breaking up, and doing what’s best to ensure a smooth transition for the kids. Recognize that the marriage has failed and bla bla. Well, that’s not happening with my husband. He will not discuss anything related to the marriage ending.
> 
> One minute he says he doesn’t care, next minute he’s willing to work with a lawyer on any separation agreement I want, then he’s sorry for ‘causing this’ and is begging to ‘fix it’. The next minute he’s blaming everyone else for interfering in his marriage, calling my dwindling support system and getting into arguments with them. Then threatening to discard the kids so that ‘I can go ahead and find a new perfect dad’ for them. And other times he’s just plain old mean and vindictive and keeps making threats. Then declares how much he loves me. It’s exhausting and I’m tired.
> 
> I’m remaining focused on my move out and getting the new place ready for the kids before telling them. I have a lawyer but at this point I have to get out of the house. He’s never moving out and I don’t care anymore. That’s a fight for another time.
> 
> Thanks to everyone for your support.


Your STBX is a narcissist, he probably has a family behind him who are all flying monkeys. Read about it. He is not your friend, he will not lose, he does not care about your emotional or mental health or that of the kids. The sooner you realize he is the enemy, the better for you. Women go back to narcissistic men at least 7 times before they break free. You have to get that divorce and go NO CONTACT in order to be completely free of his brainwashing and misogyny. He will blame all of this one you, he will try and poison whatever support you have against you and paint you out to be a mad woman. Please do not sucuumb. Get a pit-bull lawyer and fleece him. Let his family have a copy of the evidence you have against him. Tell your kids everything, some of them will use their common sense.


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## MattMatt

Adelais said:


> Even though TAMers hate this, I'm going to give you a cyber hug anyway ((((shakazulu))))
> You WILL feel better someday. The sooner you act and finish moving out, divorcing him, etc. the sooner you will feel better.


Nobody here hates cyberhugs.


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## Adelais

MattMatt said:


> Nobody here hates cyberhugs.


You and I don't. However I've read more than one post here over the years (written by male members) mocking another forum and their use of cyberhugs. :frown2: 

(TJ over)


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## Openminded

It’s difficult to move on but staying in a bad marriage is much more painful than leaving and starting a new life. It can take time to work through it all — sometimes a lot of time — but once it’s settled and you’re comfortable in your new life you’ll wonder why you ever hesitated.


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## MattMatt

Adelais said:


> You and I don't. However I've read more than one post here over the years (written by male members) mocking another forum and their use of cyberhugs. :frown2:
> 
> (TJ over)


Yeah but nobody of any consequence!


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## shakazulu

Thanks again to everyone for your kind words of support. The new lease is in place and I’m furnishing the condo for move in after the new year. My attorney is prepping the filings for service right after I move out. To be honest, I want to be out of that house when he’s served. He can be mean and vindictive, and has used the kids to demean me in the past.

I’m worried that he might discard the kids. They love him. He’s been threatening to do that and says ‘if choose to destroy my family that’s on me’. When he refused to move out, I said I would. His response? ‘Don’t take anything out of the house.’ Notice he didn’t say ‘don’t take my kids with you’. He was more concerned about the expensive furnishings in the house.

Otherwise I’m actually eager to get out and excited about the the peace of mind. Is this normal? I can barely sleep at night.


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## Stillasamountain

shakazulu said:


> Otherwise I’m actually eager to get out and excited about the the peace of mind. Is this normal? I can barely sleep at night.


Normal? Meh. Who knows? More importantly, who cares?

What it strongly says to me though, is just how toxic this man and your relationship with him has become. That you're seemingly looking forward to be free of him bodes well for your future happiness, I'd say.


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## shakazulu

Happy New Year friends. It’s hard to believe that exactly a year ago I was here discovering my husband’s serial cheating.

He found out about my plans to move out... . Two days after Christmas, he returned home at 2am while my kids and I were asleep with the kids. He woke us up screaming and accusing me of having an affair with my realtor. My poor kids were traumatized and had to watch their mother being shoved screamed at and shoved around in her nightie half naked.

As the kids stood there watching and scared, he started berating me about breaking his home, cheating with the really while demanding that i get out. Initially, I didn’t argue back, was completely mute and ignored him. He then telephoned his family and had them on speaker lying that I wanted leave him for another man. The kids were in shock, scared and agreed with everything he said when he put them on the phone to confirm.

When I continued to ignore him, he got angrier, grabbed and started yanking my arm. I finally spoke and said no, then said I was leaving. He was pushing me to get out ignoring my protests that I needed to get dressed first. It then hit him that I was serious about leaving, so he shut and blocked the bedroom door as I struggled to get my clothes on. 

I was worried about the kids and started trying to explain that I had to leave and would be back for them and that they should never allow themselves to be treated badly. They were crying and confused (12 and 13).

He instructed the kids to hide the car keys and told me I wasn’t going anywhere. I had my cell phone in my hand and then called the cops to say I was being prevented leaving a violent situation.

The cops came, took our statements, asked if this had happened before ( the pushing and slapping has happened a few times). He asked the kids to back him up and deny everything since I had no bruises. He was sobbing to the cops and whining that he’s been a good citizen for many years with a clean record that I wanted to ruin. They asked if I had anywhere to go, I said I couldn’t leave the kids (they were too scared to come with me anyway)  after seeing what happened. The cops left. 

Couldn’t leave my kids to be more brainwashed that I’ve abandoned them.

My poor, poor kids are traumatized and are too scared of their dad. They were like zombies that night agreeing with everything he said. The silver lining is that they’re seeing what their dad realtor is, which is devastating for them.

My lawyer was out of town of town for the Christmas season. I have to wait for next week to see her.


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## shakazulu

Sorry for all the typos... my hands were shaking as I recalled that horrible night.


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## 3Xnocharm

Oh my gosh, how horrible! Not just what he did to you, but that he pulled the kids right into the middle of it! Disgusting! I hope you fight for full custody of them, he should be required to have supervised visits only! You need to get out of there NOW! I am so, so sorry you are going through this...


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## jlg07

Make your plans, get your stuff and kids together and LEAVE when he is out of the house. Don't tell him/warn him before hand. It is AWFUL that he is doing this to you. Nobody should be abused like this, and ESP. NOT in front of the kids. There is something seriously wrong with him, so PLEASE leave before it escalates.


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## aquarius1

Please contact a womens shelter immediately and make hasty arrangements to leave with your children. Dont tell him or them.
This is escalating. I am afraid for you.
You can contact your lawyer from the shelter.


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## *Deidre*

Sounds like a textbook narcissist. You should look into narcissistic personality disorder, it will help clear away the fog and see what a master manipulator they are. It will be hard to break free from him, narcissists are hard to break up with, because they don't like losing. Not because they fear losing their loved ones, they just fear losing. They don't know how to love others. 

I hope that you can find your way out. I also agree with someone who suggested Jane is a prostitute, although I don't think she's that, but rather she's looking for a sugar daddy to pay her bills. There's no ''business venture,'' lol He's wiring money to women in exchange for sex. He's disgusting.

Call him your ''disgusting husband.'' DH.


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## shakazulu

I’m shaken by the Christmas holiday events as the kids are too. My heart breaks for them. Because of H’s intimidation and aggressive demeanor towards the kids, there’s no guarantee that they’ll agree to come with me. He has been telling them that no one is going anywhere and families stick together no matter what. 

Moving out is ideal and attractive, but the kids might not come because they’re terrified of dad. The older one is more perceptive, though.

I was going to have him served at work next week. He’s been threatening to discard the kids, kill himself or move out and disappear. With any luck, he might just slither off into the darkness.

Or he might stay to fight and make things worse.


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## jlg07

"I was going to have him served at work next week. He’s been threatening to discard the kids, kill himself or move out and disappear. With any luck, he might just slither off into the darkness."
This is pure manipulation as is terrorizing the kids and "brainwashing" them about staying together. YOU need to counter his hysterics with calm explanations to them. THEY should not be put into a situation where he may harm them. They should NOT be terrified of their father. THAT should show them that they need to be away from him for a while. Just tell them we need to leave so that he can calm down.
Women's services groups can help you with all of this, esp if he is intimidating the kids....


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## aquarius1

I'm not sure why I didn't think of this earlier.
Get a VAR (voice activated recorder) IMMEDIATELY
Your phone will not be good enough. If you are awoken, scared in the middle of the night you may not be able to find and push record on your phone
Keep the VAR on you at ALL times (apparently when you sleep too)
If he begins another tirade, you have it on tape for the cops to hear and he cannot sweet talk his way out of it.
Protect yourself. Get one today.
Some people here will be able to advise you on the best one.


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## MJJEAN

shakazulu said:


> I’m shaken by the Christmas holiday events as the kids are too. My heart breaks for them. Because of H’s intimidation and aggressive demeanor towards the kids, there’s no guarantee that they’ll agree to come with me. He has been telling them that no one is going anywhere and families stick together no matter what.
> 
> Moving out is ideal and attractive, but the kids might not come because they’re terrified of dad. The older one is more perceptive, though.
> 
> I was going to have him served at work next week. He’s been threatening to discard the kids, kill himself or move out and disappear. With any luck, he might just slither off into the darkness.
> 
> Or he might stay to fight and make things worse.


You need to disclose to your kids the affair, with age appropriate evidence (the "I love you"s and plans to meet) and get them to a therapist who will make damn sure to explain to them their father is an abuser and you are all his victims.

You kept your head in the sand the first few times you were warned what he is by his family. You kept your head in the sand when you got evidence. You stayed, played nice, and looked for a unicorn. What has that gotten you? Freakin play hardball. He traumatized your kids. Stop being an ostrich shaped door mat. Your kids need to understand their reality and they need you to suck it up and be strong.


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## wilson

You need to protect your kids. You need to be their "knight in mommy armor" to protect them from their monster dad. They're too young to have to make decisions about this. Don't put them in that position. Tell them that you are keeping them with you and keeping them safe. Explain that dad is very upset and needs time to work through things. In the meantime, the kids will stay with you and be safe.

One complication is that you are in the shared marital home, which he has legal access to. Hopefully the lawyer can come up with a solution for that. If possible, the safest thing would be to move somewhere else since he wouldn't have legal access.


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## Openminded

Your husband may be bluffing. Or he may not. You need to take every precaution possible.


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## aquarius1

shakazulu how are things going?


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## Amplifi

I learned that it's almost always best to listen to your guy. It's your second brain, and in many ways, more intuitive.


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## aine

shakazulu said:


> I’m shaken by the Christmas holiday events as the kids are too. My heart breaks for them. Because of H’s intimidation and aggressive demeanor towards the kids, there’s no guarantee that they’ll agree to come with me. He has been telling them that no one is going anywhere and families stick together no matter what.
> 
> Moving out is ideal and attractive, but the kids might not come because they’re terrified of dad. The older one is more perceptive, though.
> 
> I was going to have him served at work next week. He’s been threatening to discard the kids, kill himself or move out and disappear. With any luck, he might just slither off into the darkness.
> 
> Or he might stay to fight and make things worse.


Expose your POS WH with all the evidence you have. Your kids are old enough to know. Then share it with all family and friends. Carry a smart phone or VAR with you. Record all of his abuse and then save it on your PC. Then share that also. He is abusive, you should have him charged for domestic violence. Show your kids that you are standing up for yourself, remember the trauma they are experiencing, he will continue inyou let them stay with him.


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## Amplifi

So many times, I didn't listen to my gut. He always ends up gurgling "I told you so".


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## jai_mann

shakazulu said:


> She thinks SHE can move on with her fiancé and live happily ever after after destroying my life???? Worst humiliation ever. I went nuclear on their two behinds and completely lost it. Cursed them, told Jane she could have him, and threw him out. I can’t find Jane’s fiancé yet, she’s all over social media but there’s no mention of her boyfriend. I doubt he exists but will continue to look. Husband later sneaked back in through the basement door and is begging we work this out (using the two kids as bait).



I know this is a bit of an older post and I haven't made it the whole way through the thread yet, but I wanted to chime in on a solution for you and others who need to locate the significant other of the affair partner.

In this case, it's clear the husband hasn't let go of Jane. So, you get a GPS tracking device that can be put on the outside of a car. You stick this on your spouses car. Follow the spouse to the affair partner. Once you know which car is the affair partners, put the tracker on their car. Then you can track them back to their lair. That's where you should find the other poor significant other who is getting cheated on and you can break the news however you need to. 

I wouldn't do any tracking unless you know you can keep your emotions in check where the cheaters meet, otherwise it ruins the effort. The other person being cheated on deserves to know within the limits of your capabilities. If the whole thing is too stressful maybe recruit a friend to help do the tracking. Those devices plus the 1 month payment plan are like $100. Put yourself in their shoes, well wait, you are in their shoes. So you know they deserve to know to make informed decisions.

I hope the thread gets better in terms of things for you OP.


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## shakazulu

I had to climb out my hole of depression and darkness, pray to God for strength and execute everything while he was away on a business trip. I moved out into a small condo 2 miles away (school boundary constraints). I took nothing from the house…just clothes, one car and kids, who thankfully saw the light. I was lucky enough have a good job and was able make things work financially. I left behind everything I’d worked for, and started life afresh in my late 30s, buying used furniture and household items. Lots of therapy and healing. I now feel so blessed and lucky to finally be peaceful, despite being left in marital debt. I see my kids less than I’d like, they have grown to respect me and that gives me strength. I’m taking it one day at a time as we work towards the divorce/custody process. He’s stonewalling everything. The scumbag still has the nerve to ask for financial support to pay for the mortgage and bills. I have to swallow my anger a lot, because we have to coparent, and it’s important to me that he maintains a relationship with the kids. He loves/discards the kids too, depending on his mood on a particular day.

Before, I had a mountain of reasons to think he was the greatest guy ever. If the universe hadn’t just dropped irrefutable evidence into my lap in January 2019, I’d still be in the dark right now. And he was a complete double lifer with women. He was most definitely a fake…. acted attentive, loving, considerate. You can truly not know how demented some cheaters are.

Thanks for reading as we go through these challenging times with the virus.


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## Tilted 1

shakazulu said:


> I had to climb out my hole of depression and darkness, pray to God for strength and execute everything while he was away on a business trip. I moved out into a small condo 2 miles away (school boundary constraints). I took nothing from the house…just clothes, one car and kids, who thankfully saw the light. I was lucky enough have a good job and was able make things work financially. I left behind everything I’d worked for, and started life afresh in my late 30s, buying used furniture and household items. Lots of therapy and healing. I now feel so blessed and lucky to finally be peaceful, despite being left in marital debt. I see my kids less than I’d like, they have grown to respect me and that gives me strength. I’m taking it one day at a time as we work towards the divorce/custody process. He’s stonewalling everything. The scumbag still has the nerve to ask for financial support to pay for the mortgage and bills. I have to swallow my anger a lot, because we have to coparent, and it’s important to me that he maintains a relationship with the kids. He loves/discards the kids too, depending on his mood on a particular day.
> 
> Before, I had a mountain of reasons to think he was the greatest guy ever. If the universe hadn’t just dropped irrefutable evidence into my lap in January 2019, I’d still be in the dark right now. And he was a complete double lifer with women. He was most definitely a fake…. acted attentive, loving, considerate. You can truly not know how demented some cheaters are.
> 
> Thanks for reading as we go through these challenging times with the virus.


Let it be as such, you have suffered greatly, and what wisdom you can get from her family for clousure do it. (She) is just using this as manipulation STILL, when will this madness stop for you,?


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## 3Xnocharm

I am so glad you got out and your kids too. While it’s good that you want them to have a relationship with their father, please keep in mind that that relationship is up to HIM. That is HIS responsibility and if he craps the bed, then so be it. Your kids have you as their safety net always. 

I’m so proud of you. 




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Buffer

Hi Shakazulu,
So sorry you have gone through what you did. His family are very enabling to each other. 
It is never ok to accept abuse; be it physical, financial, emotional, etc. STBX is a selfish pig. He has financial responsibilities to his children, even if it is 50/50 custody. Trust your legal representatives in this. Try to get everything on a even keel for the children‘s sake.
Sound like you are well on your way, don’t let hubby gaslight the children. 
one day at a time
cyber hugs 🤗 
Buffer


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## shakazulu

I’m now out of that marriage and I look back daily asking myself why on earth I was wasting my time trying to fix a broken soul. 

I think I was literally caught unawares and had to scramble to find my footing before seeing my STBX for who he really is. That itself was a journey and a process. Took a lot of prayer too.

I’ll be ok. It’s taken me a whole year to start thinking clearly. Everyday gets better. Everyday my mind clears and I’m just so happy to be out, accepting that life doesn’t always work out as you anticipate. My focus is on my kids now, trying to heal them too.


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## 3Xnocharm

Glad to see you feeling positive! Take the lessons forward with you and never let this happen to you again.. you deserve so much better! I’m cheering for you out here!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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