# Anyone else with a passive aggressive spouse?



## marriageontherocks2 (Oct 4, 2017)

I'm dealing with a very passive aggressive wife, this all stems from anger and resentment she won't discuss with me or talk about how to move past it. It's all the time and making me nuts. That constant feeling of walking on egg-shells, of asking "hey what's wrong, let's talk", and you get "I'm fine, things are going great" when clearly her body language is saying something is clearly upsetting her, and more accurately something I did or didn't do that she won't communicate is upsetting her. I'm about ready to throw the towel in and start getting my affairs in order to prepare for a divorce. I don't think I can ever get mentally healthy in an environment like this. I'm near checked out of the marriage mentally at this point.

Has anyone had any success in dealing with an extremely passive aggressive spouse who gaslight's you when you call them on it?

I'm in IC, she refuses to go back, and she doesn't want to do MC.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

It appears your W has checked out as well. No IC or MC? Good indicator your W is finished working on it.


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## sandcastle (Sep 5, 2014)

The" silent treatment "is a form of emotional abuse.


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## Penny905 (Mar 28, 2014)

I agree with Yeswecan, she has checked out. Maybe she has told you many times what she needs and you didn't act on it. If that's the case then she has given up telling you, because from her experience it does no good


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## GraceyA (Nov 21, 2017)

I am in a similar situation to yours. Every time I try telling my husband what I need, he ignores me and says it's my emotions to deal with.
I am in IC right now and is being taught by my therapist to have healthy boundaries for my marriage. 

It's kind of hard if the other person doesn't want to talk.


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## Rick Blaine (Mar 27, 2017)

Penny905 said:


> I agree with Yeswecan, she has checked out. Maybe she has told you many times what she needs and you didn't act on it. If that's the case then she has given up telling you, because from her experience it does no good


Don't turn this on the OP. He is trying, and she is not. End of story.


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## Rick Blaine (Mar 27, 2017)

GraceyA said:


> I am in a similar situation to yours. Every time I try telling my husband what I need, he ignores me and says it's my emotions to deal with.
> I am in IC right now and is being taught by my therapist to have healthy boundaries for my marriage.
> 
> It's kind of hard if the other person doesn't want to talk.


Indeed it is. If he is not willing to deal with the problem or go to counseling, as is the case of OP's wife, then you both have spouses who have quit the partnership. The best course of action is to let the spouse know that if this doesn't change the marriage cannot last. Give them a timeline to make the changes needed to make it worth for both of you. Without a line in the sand nothing will change.


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## KM87 (Nov 5, 2017)

Rick Blaine said:


> Don't turn this on the OP. He is trying, and she is not. End of story.


At this time he is "trying" to get her talking to him about why she's upset currently. Nothing more. It could very well be the case that she has disclosed her needs (perhaps many times) and he's chosen to not meet them (also perhaps many times).. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing expecting a different outcome. Perhaps she is tired of the same conversation with no change in her husband's reticence to meet her needs. In that case, she's absolutely checked out, because of the inaction of her husband. It could very well be a result of what the OP has done.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

marriageontherocks2 said:


> Has anyone had any success in dealing with an extremely passive aggressive spouse who gaslight's you when you call them on it?
> 
> I'm in IC, she refuses to go back, and she doesn't want to do MC.


My husband was a conflict avoider and passive aggressive, and gaslighted to cover up his actions. He did not realize it, or know there were names for what he was doing. He had no desire to admit it, much less read about it. Those behaviors were fear and shame based and very deeply engrained in him.

He is changing, however, but it took time. Here is my method:

Educate yourself about PA behavior, read books, read posts here. Learn to recognize it every single time, and don't play the game. If your wife refuses to learn what it is, describe what she did, and that it is PA.

Also tell her every single time that she is gaslighting. Explain to her what gaslighting is, and what she is doing that is gaslighting.

It will get worse before it gets better. Get ready for months, if not longer of some big conflicts every time you call her out on her behavior. She will get very angry and deny it, and try harder to make you look to blame. Keep pointing it out, and explaining what she is doing, and that you will not play that game anymore.

Eventually, if she has not checked out, she will realize that being PA is weak, and that gaslighting is actually dishonest and cruel. She may decide to stop behaving those ways, since she doesn't get anywhere with it, but looks manipulative and weak every time you point it out.

You can't change her but you can decide to not play along with her anymore. If she doesn't change, she has only herself to blame, since you were honest about what you will and will not put up with.

This method has been working in my marriage. It was very rough for a couple of years but my husband is not acting in PA ways anymore. He has not gaslit me in a very long time. I think he didn't like who he was when he acted that way, but he didn't know any other way until he realized that if he didn't change, I was going to leave him for my own sanity when the children graduated.

Good luck!


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## TheOriginalAlphaOmega (Nov 16, 2017)

"You can't change her but you can decide to not play along with her anymore. If she doesn't change, she has only herself to blame, since you were honest about what you will and will not put up with."

This, above.

Passive Aggressive people will only change their behavior for two reasons. 1). Their game of Kung-Fu Crazy doesn't work anymore, because the recipient isn't playing along with the crazy game - thus rendering it ineffective. 2). The PA decides to change...usually because some of life event that generated a "Come to Jabeezus" moment within themselves.

PA's know exactly what they are doing. Sometimes, they even know it's pathetic behavior. But it's all designed to let "you" suffer for some perceived "slight" you may have done to them.

I was PA for most of my life until I had my own "Bajeesus" moment.

AlphaOmega


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## Rick Blaine (Mar 27, 2017)

Araucaria said:


> My husband was a conflict avoider and passive aggressive, and gaslighted to cover up his actions. He did not realize it, or know there were names for what he was doing. He had no desire to admit it, much less read about it. Those behaviors were fear and shame based and very deeply engrained in him.
> 
> He is changing, however, but it took time. Here is my method:
> 
> ...


This is brilliant. I hope the OP follows your direction.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

I had a passive aggressive spouse for 20 years. I divorced him.

Best decision I EVER made .


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

Do what you think is right!

Quit asking her whats wrong they just feed off it.

Don't be $hitty about it just be indifferent about it . When she sees its not working thennshe migyt change if not then kick her to the curb!


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## marriageontherocks2 (Oct 4, 2017)

Dealt with it tonight. I was supposed to take my son to boxing, but when I saw he didn't fold his laundry and put it away like we've asked nicely since Sunday, coupled with the fact that he constantly leaves his dishes out for his mother or I to clean up I said "I'll take you tomorrow assuming you get the laundry done", no yelling, just matter of factly, this is what's happening sort of thing. 

My wife came home and asked how I'm back already, I explained what happened and as I'm talking about 2 full minutes she won't say a word in response at all to anything I say. she's clearly agitated and just carrying on getting some wine like I'm not in the room or speaking. She does this routinely, especially when I discipline the kids in any way. So I call her on it and she claims that she didn't ignore me at all and goes on to list a bunch of things she said in response that never happened. I mean it's ****ing crazy! I stayed calm and just said "you ignored me, refused to say a word in response, then when I called you on it you invented a bunch of things you claimed you said in response when you didn't. That's what happened, I was there, and this is the 1000th time you've done this to me. I just want to let you know I'm aware of it and I think it's childish and I don't appreciate it, it needs to stop, if you can't stop go to therapy". She started to protest then didn't, sulked a bit, then 10 minutes later kissed me and said "sometimes I ignore you", WTF?????


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## Nucking Futs (Apr 8, 2013)

KM87 said:


> At this time he is "trying" to get her talking to him about why she's upset currently. Nothing more. It could very well be the case that she has disclosed her needs (perhaps many times) and he's chosen to not meet them (also perhaps many times).. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing expecting a different outcome. Perhaps she is tired of the same conversation with no change in her husband's reticence to meet her needs. In that case, she's absolutely checked out, because of the inaction of her husband. It could very well be a result of what the OP has done.


Do you have access to some information about this situation that the rest of us don't? Because it looks like you're pulling this right out of your ass.


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## marriageontherocks2 (Oct 4, 2017)

KM87 said:


> At this time he is "trying" to get her talking to him about why she's upset currently. Nothing more. It could very well be the case that she has disclosed her needs (perhaps many times) and he's chosen to not meet them (also perhaps many times).. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing expecting a different outcome. Perhaps she is tired of the same conversation with no change in her husband's reticence to meet her needs. In that case, she's absolutely checked out, because of the inaction of her husband. It could very well be a result of what the OP has done.


LOL I guess it's possible I missed her insane PA methods to telling me what I need to change to meet her needs, she's certainly never told me or opened up the million times I've inquired. I'm the one to read 5 Love languages, I'm the one in counseling, I'm the one desperately trying to get her to communicate, she won't, ever, it's just her. It is likely in her mind that she's told me hundreds of times how to meet her needs and 'm failing, when really all she's done is PA BS no one could possibly decipher.


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## Rick Blaine (Mar 27, 2017)

marriageontherocks2 said:


> Dealt with it tonight. I was supposed to take my son to boxing, but when I saw he didn't fold his laundry and put it away like we've asked nicely since Sunday, coupled with the fact that he constantly leaves his dishes out for his mother or I to clean up I said "I'll take you tomorrow assuming you get the laundry done", no yelling, just matter of factly, this is what's happening sort of thing.
> 
> My wife came home and asked how I'm back already, I explained what happened and as I'm talking about 2 full minutes she won't say a word in response at all to anything I say. she's clearly agitated and just carrying on getting some wine like I'm not in the room or speaking. She does this routinely, especially when I discipline the kids in any way. So I call her on it and she claims that she didn't ignore me at all and goes on to list a bunch of things she said in response that never happened. I mean it's ****ing crazy! I stayed calm and just said "you ignored me, refused to say a word in response, then when I called you on it you invented a bunch of things you claimed you said in response when you didn't. That's what happened, I was there, and this is the 1000th time you've done this to me. I just want to let you know I'm aware of it and I think it's childish and I don't appreciate it, it needs to stop, if you can't I would ask you to consider therapy". She started to protest then didn't, sulked a bit, then 10 minutes later kissed me and said "sometimes I ignore you", WTF?????


Well played, Sir. The blue part above is my only recommendation of what you should have said instead. Be direct and call her out on her passive aggressive behavior just as you did. But when you do be sure to avoid selfish demands, angry outbursts, and disrespectful judgments.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

TheOriginalAlphaOmega said:


> "You can't change her but you can decide to not play along with her anymore. If she doesn't change, she has only herself to blame, since you were honest about what you will and will not put up with."
> 
> This, above.
> 
> ...


Would you start your own thread and tell us about this? I would like to know what happened to bring you to that point.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

Araucaria said:


> This method has been working in my marriage. It was very rough for a couple of years but my husband is not acting in PA ways anymore. *He has not gaslit me in a very long time. * I think he didn't like who he was when he acted that way, but he didn't know any other way until he realized that if he didn't change, I was going to leave him for my own sanity when the children graduated.


I lied. He tried it again tonight when I confronted him about something. Whenever he is confronted with a behavior he needs to be aware of and change, and if there is not something he wants and feels he needs to "be nice" in order to get it, he will still immediately go to gaslighting. I think he believes that he is being "alpha" but it is very beta and manipulative. Ugh, old habits are hard to break.

I hope it goes better with your wife. Her admission tonight is a good step. She wouldn't have felt like she needed to admit anything had you played along with her game like you used to. She seems "softer" than my husband.


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

When she kissed you and said sometimes I ignor you. You could of asked why.

Keep the heat on her


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## marriageontherocks2 (Oct 4, 2017)

Araucaria said:


> if there is not something he wants and feels he needs to "be nice" in order to get it, he will still immediately go to gaslighting. I think he believes that he is being "alpha" but it is very beta and manipulative. Ugh, old habits are hard to break.


It is extremely beta and weak to resort to silent treatment, passive aggressiveness, and gaslighting. It's so manipulative. I wasn't really aware of how often my wife did this to me until I really started focusing on it. It's unreal, literally all the time. She can rarely retell any past event where we fought without significant gaslighting. It's been 17 years of this and I'm just now starting to understand what's been going on, it's a bit maddening.

I'm just happy that this time she didn't insist that she was responding to me, and she relented that she in fact didn't respond at all, and was in fact ignoring me purposely. It's a "breakthrough" of sorts.

I'm not perfect by any means of measure, I get that. But I'm willing to sit down and talk about things I need to improve. She just acts PA and gaslights events in order to manipulate me into doing what she feels she needs. If I have plans to go out and she's just feeling needy and wants me home, instead of saying "can you please stay home, I had a bad day and want to just hang out with you". She'll ignore me, act all pissed off, start a fight, gaslight me about how the fight started, what was said and wasn't said in order to manipulate me into staying home. It's infuriating.


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## chillymorn69 (Jun 27, 2016)

By letting her do this your whole marriage you essentially trained her to keep doing it because it worked.

Now you have to stand your ground without being an asshat and retrain her that it won't work on you anymore.


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## NickyT (Aug 14, 2017)

I agree with everyone who said your wife has checked out. One person, no matter how dedicated and determined, can not save a marriage. I suggest you let her know very clearly and firmly of your plans, and tell her the ball is in her court. Make it clear what you need to continue in the marriage (IC, MC, etc)

Good luck.


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## TheOriginalAlphaOmega (Nov 16, 2017)

marriageontherocks2 said:


> ....It's been 17 years of this and I'm just now starting to understand what's been going on, it's a bit maddening.


Yeah, man. I can totally relate. Us PA's are experts at giving you just enough to pizz you off, but only enough to make you second guess that thought of.."wait...wtf? Did she/he just disrespect me? Wait..what? No..it couldn't be....It must all be in MY head.......wait...maybe it IS my fault. Maybe it really is me...."

I'm surprised you lasted 17 years. Normally, 10 years tops before we drive you crazy enough to finally understand that something is just not right in this scenario. You must have a very empathetic personality in that you could second guess yourself so much about what you knew was really happening but always gave the benefit of the doubt.

AO


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## TheOriginalAlphaOmega (Nov 16, 2017)

NickyT said:


> I agree with everyone who said your wife has checked out. One person, no matter how dedicated and determined, can not save a marriage. I suggest you let her know very clearly and firmly of your plans, and tell her the ball is in her court. Make it clear what you need to continue in the marriage (IC, MC, etc)
> 
> Good luck.


I disagree that she actually "checked out". TRULY AND FULLY Checking out would not justify PA behavior. Checking out would mean Apathy, and the kung-fu crazy of Passive Aggressiveness isn't required if you have Apathy. This can be demonstrated on the behaviors of their professional life and their personal life. A PA person would never give the silent treatment to a co-worker or a boss. There's nothing to gain in that scenario except maybe getting fired. Back at home, though...the spouse goes into full PA mode. It's a power play. By going silent, and making you feel confused and insane...wondering what the heck you did wrong, always keeps you on your toes and keeps you guessing if everything is your fault. You put all the cards into the hands of the PA spouse. This is why most spouses living with a full blown PA often comment on how the PA spouse is like two different people outside the home. Around friends and workplace, they are perceived as the most happy, fun-loving person. At home...it's like living in a special kind of hell.



The quote above though may actually work. You are cornering her into a "come to bajezzus moment", where she will find herself teetering on that precipice, where she can continue her actions as usual and fall over the edge....or realize she needs to find some real footing again and re-evaluate what got her to that ledge in the first place.

It's really a 50/50 chance. Some people are just resistant to change. Even if it means falling over the cliff. Others can take a deep look into their personality and realize the current status quo is a messed up dynamic and things need to change.

Keep in mind....change is hard. If she decides not to fall over the ledge....the kind of deep seated behavior embedded in a PA takes a LONGGGGGG time to purge. She may relapse...and if you give in even once....then that sets the precedent for the "status quo is still OK" mode of thought.

It took about two years of vigilance and self-reflection for me to purge myself of my PA destructive behaviors. I thought I could cheat a few times and just go with what I "knew". But I had the clarity of thought to finally understand my own thought process and learn how to immediately recognize and change my behavior. After a while, I was "free".

Well...sort of. It's amazing what you just can't give up after a lifetime of learned behaviors. At first when I felt slighted, my first instinct was to still go silent....but I immediately followed up with..."I understand what you are saying...but I can't really fully express myself completely right this instant. If you give me a few minutes to collect my thoughts, we can continue this conversation and make it more productive". Then, I worked at purging my PA thought patterns...took a really good look at what the conversation partner was really trying to say...accept the fact that she had a legitimate right to her emotions even though they may not be reflective of the actual truth...and then continue the conversation...

Now...I just accept the fact that whatever "she" says...it's really not 100% about me. And, in fact..it just may be 100% about me. Emotions are going to ebb and flow...anger is going to be portrayed....then concern...then some more anger....It's all good. And I just might learn something about myself that I never noticed before and change is good. 

Or...she's being a complete unrealistic beotch and I need to stand my ground because what she's saying right now is total "CrayCray"

It's a long, long road to reprogram your mind. And it will be an even longer road for you. You will have to both be empathetic of her thought process, AND believe in yours at the same time - all trying to carefully not mesh those two things together. If she is strong enough and willing enough she will bear most of the burden...but it will still be a difficult road.

God speed, friend. I wouldn't wish my kind of crazy on anyone.


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## TheOriginalAlphaOmega (Nov 16, 2017)

Araucaria said:


> My husband was a conflict avoider and passive aggressive, and gaslighted to cover up his actions. He did not realize it, or know there were names for what he was doing. He had no desire to admit it, much less read about it. Those behaviors were fear and shame based and very deeply engrained in him.
> 
> He is changing, however, but it took time. Here is my method:
> 
> ...



Wow. This is impressive. You must be an especially strong person to have that fortitude to go through the mind-changing process in your spouse's PA behavior. Are things better? Was your "threat of leaving" his "come to bajeesuz" moment? Are there still some eggshells to walk on? Is your head still "noisy" with worrying about the PA behaviour? That's what it is, from what I understand..it's noise in your head...it's the buzzing that's always there...wondering about when the next PA episode is going to happen and when you will have to deal with "that" again.

Kudos to you! Not everyone can do what you did.

Just to let you know....I asked my partner at the time what it was like not being around me...much later after I "fixed" myself and it didn't trigger me to hear about my less-than-impressive qualities. Here's a paraphrase of the response...

"It's quiet. It's really quiet. It's peacefully wonderful. It's like when you were young and you had your own apartment and there was absolutely nothing to do and your had absolutely no thoughts in your head and you just decided to read a book because you could...and then you did...and it was wonderful because there were no distractions....just peaceful reading".

I can imaging that peacefulness of "nothingness"....no worries...no eggshells...is bliss.

We have a knack of making your mind "noisy" and chaotic. It's what we are good at.

Cheers and all the best to you!


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

marriageontherocks2 said:


> I'm dealing with a very passive aggressive wife, this all stems from anger and resentment she won't discuss with me or talk about how to move past it. It's all the time and making me nuts. That constant feeling of walking on egg-shells, of asking "hey what's wrong, let's talk", and you get "I'm fine, things are going great" when clearly her body language is saying something is clearly upsetting her, and more accurately something I did or didn't do that she won't communicate is upsetting her. I'm about ready to throw the towel in and start getting my affairs in order to prepare for a divorce. I don't think I can ever get mentally healthy in an environment like this. I'm near checked out of the marriage mentally at this point.
> 
> Has anyone had any success in dealing with an extremely passive aggressive spouse who gaslight's you when you call them on it?
> 
> I'm in IC, she refuses to go back, and she doesn't want to do MC.


Nope...0


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## WildMustang (Nov 7, 2017)

marriageontherocks2 said:


> I'm dealing with a very passive aggressive wife, this all stems from anger and resentment she won't discuss with me or talk about how to move past it. It's all the time and making me nuts. That constant feeling of walking on egg-shells, of asking "hey what's wrong, let's talk", and you get "I'm fine, things are going great" when clearly her body language is saying something is clearly upsetting her, and more accurately something I did or didn't do that she won't communicate is upsetting her. I'm about ready to throw the towel in and start getting my affairs in order to prepare for a divorce. I don't think I can ever get mentally healthy in an environment like this. I'm near checked out of the marriage mentally at this point.
> 
> Has anyone had any success in dealing with an extremely passive aggressive spouse who gaslight's you when you call them on it?
> 
> I'm in IC, she refuses to go back, and she doesn't want to do MC.




If only one person in the marriage is willing to work on the marriage, go to counseling, get help (read books/articles/blogs, go to marriage seminars) etc, it won't work.

If only one person is rowing the boat, that boat just keeps going in circles.

Ask me how I know this...

Keep the boat.

Just get a better partner who is willing to row.


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