# Considering Preemptive Divorce?



## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

I hope I can get some honest input about my situation.

I'm 30 years old, married with three children. I'm considering divorcing my wife, not because of anything she's doing, but because of what she may try to do to me 10-20 years from now.


I'm looking at the stats. Half of all marriages end in divorce and most of those are initiated by the woman. There are mid-life crisis issues, "Walk Away Wife Syndrome" and all sorts of other problems. I've seen this happen as the norm with my friends' moms. I really, really want to avoid the whole ordeal. 

In my experience, women seem to leave their husbands for reasons that may or may not be valid, but I don't understand. I don't want to work hard for the next ten years at my career, just to get undercut by a woman whom I've given my best years to and who is angry because "We don't communicate" or something else I don't think about/understand.

She has been a great wife, and things have been great so far, but it's disconcerting to me that so many guys seem to think the exact same thing before the hammer comes down. I feel like I should just get a divorce, or at least have an affair, as insurance against later discontent on her part. Flipping a coin, that's basically what we're doing. If I didn't have children, I'd divorce her immediately, but we do, so, that's something I have to consider. If I can subtly guide her to divorce me, that would be best maybe? 

What so many men on this forum report, will not happen to me. 


I appreciate any constructive opinions regarding my post.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

I think that's one of the silliest things I've ever heard. Rather than spending your time thinking of what she might do to you in 10 or 20 years, you should be spending your time and energy figuring out how to not let that happen. If you prevent the frustrations and resentments from building in the first place, there's no reason why you can't make a lifetime partnership of it.

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## YinPrincess (Jul 31, 2011)

Are you serious??
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mr.rightaway (Apr 27, 2010)

Shenandoah10 said:


> I'm 30 years old, married with three children. I'm considering divorcing my wife, not because of anything she's doing, but because of what she may try to do to me 10-20 years from now.


.

I would focus on pre-emptive success instead. There are no guarantees in life, but if we all used 100 percent of our thought processes on the negatives, nothing would get accomplished. 



> I'm looking at the stats. Half of all marriages end in divorce and most of those are initiated by the woman. There are mid-life crisis issues, "Walk Away Wife Syndrome" and all sorts of other problems. I've seen this happen as the norm with my friends' moms. I really, really want to avoid the whole ordeal.


.

You also would have to look at the true reasons behind those stats: cheating, abuse, neglect, etc. When it comes to divorcing over hang-nail issues, I'm in agreement.



> In my experience, women seem to leave their husbands for reasons that may or may not be valid, but I don't understand. I don't want to work hard for the next ten years at my career, just to get undercut by a woman whom I've given my best years to and who is angry because "We don't communicate" or something else I don't think about/understand.


.

I would also be upset if it turned out that way, but for now, it doesn't sound so much different than _*"I'm considering divorcing my wife, not because of anything she's doing, but because of what she may try to do to me 10-20 years from now."*_ Right? 



> She has been a great wife, and things have been great so far, but it's disconcerting to me that so many guys seem to think the exact same thing before the hammer comes down. I feel like I should just get a divorce, *or at least have an affair*, as insurance against later discontent on her part.


.

Yes, that would be a sure-fire way to insure your own demise and set your pre-emptive divorce in motion. The trends are definitely disconcerting, but so far, based on what you say, they aren't there in your situation.



> What so many men on this forum report, will not happen to me.


. 

You have to keep a site like this--a marriage and relationship help forum--in perspective. A lot of people come here to get help, or vent, in dealing with some of the most difficult situations they will ever face in their lives; they are hashing out their feelings on multiple levels, sometimes writing from intense emotions. Although perhaps an extreme example, there are close seven billion people in the world. This site is a minute representation of the overall picture. While a lot of this site deals with problems and divorce, there is also a "Long-term Success in Marriage" section, among other positive threads from people who have dealt with difficulties in their relationship(s) and come out ahead.





> *Flipping a coin*, that's basically what we're doing. If I didn't have children, I'd divorce her immediately, but we do, so, that's something I have to consider. If I can subtly guide her to divorce me, that would be best maybe?


Life's a gamble. Always has been.


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## RunningOnEmpty (Aug 29, 2010)

You should also have your prostate preemptively removed. After all, there is a 20% chance you will get prostate cancer in 10-20 years.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard.

Maybe I'll quit my job because in 10 years I could be laid off.

Then maybe I'll tie my kids to the chair because maybe in 10 years they'll be in a car accident...or some harm will come to them.



Most bizarre post ever. Sorry, but seriously, get a grip.


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

Everyone else has given great responses. However, if you generally look at life so negatively, you may need to seek professional help.....before your wife does get fed up and want a divorce.


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

PBear said:


> I think that's one of the silliest things I've ever heard. Rather than spending your time thinking of what she might do to you in 10 or 20 years, you should be spending your time and energy figuring out how to not let that happen. If you prevent the frustrations and resentments from building in the first place, there's no reason why you can't make a lifetime partnership of it.
> 
> C
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I am not wasting any of my life worrying about the irrational behavior that I'm going to have to deal with in a few years. There isn't any method to preventing a divorce. It's not like getting fat, which you can just avoid by diet and exercise. 90% of these marriages end because of reasons that are completely incomprehensible, such as "He just stopped trying." WTF? How can you try to do something, i.e. being married, that just "is."


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

827Aug said:


> Everyone else has given great responses. However, if you generally look at life so negatively, you may need to seek professional help.....before your wife does get fed up and want a divorce.


I'm daring her to give me one, so that is just going to have to be that. 

I love her, and have a lot of respect for her, but I think it's too much of a toss-up whether or not she turns into one of these people that will give you the shaft over nothing.


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

that_girl said:


> This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard.
> 
> Maybe I'll quit my job because in 10 years I could be laid off.
> 
> ...


If there was a 50% chance that I would be laid off, I would change careers immediately. If there was a 50% chance that my kids would be in any kind of accident, I would prevent them from doing whatever activity that accident entailed.


A Japanese soldier at the battle of Iwo Jima had better odds than a married American male in 2011.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Shenandoah10 said:


> I am not wasting any of my life worrying about the irrational behavior that I'm going to have to deal with in a few years. There isn't any method to preventing a divorce. It's not like getting fat, which you can just avoid by diet and exercise. 90% of these marriages end because of reasons that are completely incomprehensible, such as "He just stopped trying." WTF? How can you try to do something, i.e. being married, that just "is."


But that's where you're wrong. There ARE methods of reducing the risk of divorce, same as reducing the risk of cancer, or, as others used as an example, keeping your job. You just need to find what works for you and your wife. And your made up stat of 90% being for completely incomprehensible reasons is about as silly as your initial hypothesis. 

No offense intended, on any of this. But unless you want to spend the rest of your life in a cave, yes, you will risk getting hurt in relationships. Heck, you're not even safe from your kids. But what are your options? Do you want to be alone all your life? And if this a case of just wanting a divorce but looking for justification, ou don't need that from anyone here. But at least be honest with yourself as to why you want out, so you can try to fix things in the future.

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ClipClop (Apr 28, 2011)

Divorce her. Save her the grief of a paranoid man who thinks the worst of her.

What a maroon.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

PBear said:


> But that's where you're wrong. There ARE methods of reducing the risk of divorce, same as reducing the risk of cancer, or, as others used as an example, keeping your job. You just need to find what works for you and your wife. And your made up stat of 90% being for completely incomprehensible reasons is about as silly as your initial hypothesis.
> 
> No offense intended, on any of this. But unless you want to spend the rest of your life in a cave, yes, you will risk getting hurt in relationships. Heck, you're not even safe from your kids. But what are your options? Do you want to be alone all your life? And if this a case of just wanting a divorce but looking for justification, ou don't need that from anyone here. But at least be honest with yourself as to why you want out, so you can try to fix things in the future.
> 
> ...


I appreciate your response. I don't want justification for a divorce, but I can see how it would look like that to someone who wasn't familiar with my thought processes.

It's true that you can't avoid risking loss when it comes to relationships, but I am not sure if relationships, in the modern sense, are worth the risk when the potential for utter devastation is so strong.


As for methods to prevent divorce, I am definitely eager to hear them, as I've seen nothing but hard-working, church-going guys left time and again by women who say things like "I just have to live my life," and "I'm still young," -- none of which really makes sense to me at all.


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

ClipClop said:


> Divorce her. Save her the grief of a paranoid man who thinks the worst of her.
> 
> What a maroon.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


No offense, but I'm not paranoid. Concerning yourself with a 50% risk assessment is not paranoia. It is based on pure math.

As for thinking the worst of her, I don't see how you could say that. As of right now, she's everything I want- physically, mentally. She's a great mother, excellent wife, and respected doctor. Unfortunately, she will be facing the same issues in 10-20 years that I just can't deal with, as I lack the ability to understand any of it. 

Right now we could start over. I could still find someone else (or no one, which would be my preference), and she could still find a guy to marry and then divorce in 20 years.


Maroon? I've never been called that before.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Shenandoah10 said:


> If there was a 50% chance that I would be laid off, I would change careers immediately. If there was a 50% chance that my kids would be in any kind of accident, I would prevent them from doing whatever activity that accident entailed.
> 
> 
> A Japanese soldier at the battle of Iwo Jima had better odds than a married American male in 2011.


But the fact is, YOU Don't KNOW!:rofl: You can't tell the future. You can't say what will or won't happen. And most people have a 50% chance of getting laid off  Doesn't mean you stop working.


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## chattycathy (Aug 19, 2011)

Better to have loved and lost
than never to have loved at all.


Try to be optimistic that neither of you will ruin things.


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## WhereAmI (Nov 3, 2010)

Shenandoah10 said:


> I think it's too much of a toss-up whether or not she turns into one of these people that will give you the shaft over nothing.


Oh, the irony! You are exactly what you fear she will become.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mr.rightaway (Apr 27, 2010)

Shenandoah10 said:


> It's true that you can't avoid risking loss when it comes to relationships, but I am not sure if relationships, in the modern sense, are worth the risk when the potential for utter devastation is so strong.





Shenandoah10 said:


> No offense, but I'm not paranoid. Concerning yourself with a 50% risk assessment is not paranoia. It is based on pure math.



With all respect given, this is a conversation you should have had with yourself before you got married. It sounds more like a single guy's question than it does a married man's dilemma. Since you are married, as I said before, you should focus on preemptive success, your marriage, raising your children and so on. Although a risk assessment, or life assessment, is always important, letting your fears unnecessarily control you is a position of weakness--a lack of control, instead of control. And again, although the stats are static math, what they represent often requires further analysis.



> As for methods to prevent divorce, I am definitely eager to hear them, as I've seen nothing but hard-working, church-going guys left time and again by women who say things like "I just have to live my life," and "I'm still young," -- none of which really makes sense to me at all.


I am also watching this happen to men I know and it definitely has a reverberating effect on my psyche. Given that, there is really no way to know what was going on behind closed doors in their relationships unless you were there 24/7 with them. If you're expecting women to ever make sense, then I'm sorry to say you are fighting a losing battle.



Shenandoah10 said:


> I'm daring her to give me one, so that is just going to have to be that.
> 
> I love her, and have a lot of respect for her, but I think it's too much of a toss-up whether or not she turns into one of these people that will give you the shaft over nothing.






Shenandoah10 said:


> Right now we could start over. I could still find someone else (or no one, which would be my preference), and she could still find a guy to marry and then divorce in 20 years.


 Well, I am not a proponent of divorce, but maybe you should have this conversation with her and see how she responds. I do think a lot of your fears are unfounded, so far, based on what you say about her, so far. It seems like you are looking to self-sabotage here so you can be free, or something else. Are you currently under any stress, work-related or otherwise? No one's perfect. Is there something about your wife you aren't saying?


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

50/50 means it can go either way. The fact that you focus on it going sour says a lot about how you view the world. That's not math to me. If it was 80/20 in favor of divorce, then now I would see your point...I wouldn't have married at all. Why did you marry if you saw this "math"?

Yes, you have 50% chance of it failing. You also have 50% chance of it thriving. The choice is yours on how you want to look at it.


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

mr.rightaway said:


> With all respect given, this is a conversation you should have had with yourself before you got married. It sounds more like a single guy's question than it does a married man's dilemma. Since you are married, as I said before, you should focus on preemptive success, your marriage, raising your children and so on.


Well, it was 10 years ago when I got married, I had a completely different mentality then ( a reckless, foolish mentality, not to mention the influence of a culture that I don't acknowledge as my own anymore). Nevertheless, what's done is done as far as "I should have done this or that." Considering the state of my life from the time I was born until now, I have to say I have done fairly well for myself, even if this blows up in my face. I will still do better than I would if she divorced me 20 years from now, because I would never get remarried again under any circumstances.



mr.rightaway said:


> Although a risk assessment, or life assessment, is always important, letting your fears unnecessarily control you is a position of weakness--a lack of control, instead of control. And again, although the stats are static math, what they represent often requires further analysis.


I am in a position of weakness right now, no doubt. I'm a married man, so I've already subjected myself to these processes.




mr.rightaway said:


> I am also watching this happen to men I know and it definitely has a reverberating effect on my psyche. Given that, there is really no way to know what was going on behind closed doors in their relationships unless you were there 24/7 with them. If you're expecting women to ever make sense, then I'm sorry to say you are fighting a losing battle.


It's not an issue of "women not making sense," and I don't want to go on any kind of sexist diatribe. It is what it is, for better or for worse. And I don't know what's going on behind closed doors. I am not very worried about that though. I'm more worried about damage control. I know that an American citizen can divorce a spouse at any point for any reason, and that half of them will do so. 






mr.rightaway said:


> Well, I am not a proponent of divorce, but maybe you should have this conversation with her and see how she responds. I do think a lot of your fears are unfounded, so far, based on what you say about her, so far. It seems like you are looking to self-sabotage here so you can be free, or something else. Are you currently under any stress, work-related or otherwise? No one's perfect. Is there something about your wife you aren't saying?


She's great. I am under a lot of work-related stress. I'm trying to finish my ph.d with three kids and a wife who works constantly (but that is not a problem). 

Maybe I am looking to self-sabotage as you said? If so, that isn't the worst thing in the world. It's much better to go through the pain of exercise (actively seeking a divorce) than to get jumped on the street (being a bewildered middle-aged ex husband who has no idea why that has happened to him).



Thanks for taking the time out to reply though. I am not ungrateful even though we disagree.


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

that_girl said:


> 50/50 means it can go either way. The fact that you focus on it going sour says a lot about how you view the world. That's not math to me. If it was 80/20 in favor of divorce, then now I would see your point...I wouldn't have married at all. Why did you marry if you saw this "math"?
> 
> Yes, you have 50% chance of it failing. You also have 50% chance of it thriving. The choice is yours on how you want to look at it.


At the time I really didn't have any guidance or knowledge of anything. I was still "special" in those days, as were we all. 99% if marriages, business ventures, or ping pong matches could end in defeat and I'd still have tried anything.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

I think you just want to be single LOL


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

that_girl said:


> But the fact is, YOU Don't KNOW!:rofl: You can't tell the future. You can't say what will or won't happen. And most people have a 50% chance of getting laid off  Doesn't mean you stop working.


At a certain age you understand that the majority of bad things that can happen will at some point though, to a certain percentage of people outside of "individual effort."


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

I see you are finishing your PhD while your wife is already a physician and, I assume, a successful one. Are you an MD/PhD? If not, I am surprised that you selected a career that offers such a slim chance of even modest success. This might interest you - 222 NIH grants: 22 researchers : Nature News. If you plan on a research/teaching career your chances of getting and sustaining funding at a level that would denote success over the life of your career is much less than 50%. . 

You will need to do a postdoc for a few years after that PhD and you need to chose an area of researchh that is unique enough to bring the positive attention of your colleages and the notice of universities or industry. PhD's are a dime a dozen the competition for grants and positions is stiff. Many spend their career in someone's lab living on soft money. Just thought you might consider this. Maybe you should divorce and start in a different line of work. 

I agree with you and strongly encourage you to divorce ASAP. I don't believe your relationship is so wonderful at lest not from your wife's perspective and i dont think you are as effective in hiding the depth of your anger, mistrust and paranoia from your wife as you seem to believe. Have you experienced some event that has hurt you deeply or have you been diagnosed with paranoid, narcissistic or borederline personality dysorder? Do you have autism or Asbergers? 

From your description, you have changed over the last 10 years. I doubt that the change has escaped your wife's notice and maybe that is the reason you are considering divorce. You are not the man she married obviosly and she may not love the man you have become, is that your problem?. Surely you are not so artful as to be able to hide your the fact that you are disconnected from your wife. Or is it she who is disconnected from you? 

Moreover, if you can cooly caculate the odds of your possible pain against the disruption in the lives of 3 innocent beings and come up with a plan to leave then you lack compassion, empathy and the capacity to shoulder the responsibilities of a man. If you are as successful a poser as you say then you are either a narccissit, sociopath or a borderline. 

If that is the case tgen I agree with you, get a divorce and get out of the lives of these people, it will be a blessing for them.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mr.rightaway (Apr 27, 2010)

Shenandoah10 said:


> I'm more worried about damage control. I know that an American citizen can divorce a spouse at any point for any reason, and that half of them will do so.
> 
> Maybe I am looking to self-sabotage as you said? If so, that isn't the worst thing in the world. It's much better to go through the pain of exercise (actively seeking a divorce) than to get jumped on the street (being a bewildered middle-aged ex husband who has no idea why that has happened to him).


The picture you are painting of a future such as that, with a 50% chance of devastation, is, indeed, an unfortunate one for either sex, not just the men. If it's a financial standpoint that is your concern, where you will have more time to regroup and rebuild a nest egg than if she rips you apart in court in 20 years, leaving you in total ruin at middle age, then I see what you are saying. Would it be correct to assume you've done some math on that? Just to reiterate, though, there is a 50% probability she will not. I cannot speak to a cultural difference and any difficulties that arise from that. It seems a bit as if you have already made up your mind? If so, all I can say is to just make doubly sure it isn't the stress, and the stress only, that is talking, especially when coupled with the enormous pressure in finishing a Ph.D. Although, in your case, it seems as if this has been on your mind for some time. If so, then the wheels are probably already in motion for you, whatever you choose to do.


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## mr.rightaway (Apr 27, 2010)

Shenandoah10 said:


> I will still do better than I would if she divorced me 20 years from now, because I would never get remarried again under any circumstances.
> ...
> I am in a position of weakness right now, no doubt. I'm a married man, so I've already subjected myself to these processes.
> ...
> It's not an issue of "women not making sense," and I don't want to go on any kind of sexist diatribe. It is what it is, for better or for worse. And I don't know what's going on behind closed doors. I am not very worried about that though. I'm more worried about damage control. I know that an American citizen can divorce a spouse at any point for any reason, and that half of them will do so.


I apologize if that was offensive. I should not have put it that way. Perhaps I'm having difficulty on why you are heavily focused on something 20 years in the future. Something has spooked you for sure, as the divorce rates in this country have been known for a long time.


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

Catherine602 said:


> I see you are finishing your PhD while your wife is already a physician and, I assume, a successful one. Are you an MD/PhD? If not, I am surprised that you selected a career that offers such a slim chance of even modest success. This might interest you - 222 NIH grants: 22 researchers : Nature News. If you plan on a research/teaching career your chances of getting and sustaining funding at a level that would denote success over the life of your career is much less than 50%. . _Posted via Mobile Device_





I am already aware of how screwed I am in this regard, as I'm not even in the sciences, but the humanities. I'm going to stick it out and hope for the best no matter what there though. Being a homeless drunk has got to be rough but it's better than explaining one of these irrational divorces to your son and watching him become more and more confused over the years. Also, my wife isn't a physician, but a vet. Nevertheless, she's very successful and I'm very proud of her. 



Catherine602 said:


> I agree with you and strongly encourage you to divorce ASAP. I don't believe your relationship is so wonderful at lest not from your wife's perspective and i dont think you are as effective in hiding the depth of your anger, mistrust and paranoia from your wife as you seem to believe. Have you experienced some event that has hurt you deeply or have you been diagnosed with paranoid, narcissistic or borederline personality dysorder? Do you have autism or Asbergers? _Posted via Mobile Device_


What the heck does some disorder have to do with anything? I don't really understand how "looking with an unbiased attitude towards the hard facts = some kind of insanity, paranoia."

As for things that have happened in the past, yes, like every other human being, I've had some crummy times. That doesn't affect this though. If my relationship was poor like you seem to think, then I'd be getting a divorce instead of replying to these posts. I am making an inquiry, not looking to be judged by strangers ( though I did assume that would happen). 



Catherine602 said:


> From your description, you have changed over the last 10 years. I doubt that the change has escaped your wife's notice and maybe that is the reason you are considering divorce. You are not the man she married obviosly and she may not love the man you have become, is that your problem?. Surely you are not so artful as to be able to hide your the fact that you are disconnected from your wife. Or is it she who is disconnected from you? _Posted via Mobile Device_


I am the fulfillment of the boy she married, just as she is the perfect version of the girl I married, and the implication that I'm insecure in the relationship makes sense long-term but not now. I am as secure in my relationship as I am running a 5k. One day I won't be able to run a 5k. It's probably around the same time that all these bs divorces over "people living life" start to kick in. 



Catherine602 said:


> Moreover, if you can cooly caculate the odds of your possible pain against the disruption in the lives of 3 innocent beings and come up with a plan to leave then you lack compassion, empathy and the capacity to shoulder the responsibilities of a man. If you are as successful a poser as you say then you are either a narccissit, sociopath or a borderline. _Posted via Mobile Device_


I haven't come up with a plan for anything. I haven't had discussion 1 with her. I really doubt I have any kind of problem like you describe. Furthermore, I really doubt if I was a middle-aged woman any of this bs about being a sociopath or any of that would even be brought up. Probably a bunch of "you go girls" and high fives for cuckolding some fat bald guy who busted his ass for 20 years paying for a house.



Catherine602 said:


> If that is the case tgen I agree with you, get a divorce and get out of the lives of these people, it will be a blessing for them.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



I'm looking at my wife asleep on the couch right now. I don't think she could be replaced by anyone else. I just wonder if, no matter what we do marriage and the traditional family are damned in the developed world. I'd rather avoid being one of these pathetic guys who gets crushed. That shouldn't offend anyone with sense.


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

mr.rightaway said:


> I apologize if that was offensive. I should not have put it that way. Perhaps I'm having difficulty on why you are heavily focused on something 20 years in the future. Something has spooked you for sure, as the divorce rates in this country have been known for a long time.


Not offensive at all. If anything, I'd be labeled as being the woman-hater in the thread, which is ridiculous. 
As for things that shook me up, I turned 30. I now believe without a doubt that I will either reach 55 or die first. I used to keep it in the back of my mind. When I got married, I was 20, and I had the same attitude towards my wife that I have now. It's the future that scares me. I am not certain I know how to be a bonafide "adult," if some of these awesome guys who were divorced irrational don't seem to measure up. 

Secondly, I lost a friend to an accident, so I also believe now that anything can happen out of the blue.

My own parents' lives I'm sure has an affect on my thinking. There's no way that isn't the case. I just want to know what's in store.


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## Alice748 (Nov 11, 2011)

I think that's one of the silliest things I've ever heard. Rather than spending your time thinking of what she might do to you in 10 or 20 years, you should be spending your time and energy figuring out how to not let that happen. If you prevent the frustrations and resentments from building in the first place, there's no reason why you can't make a lifetime partnership of it.


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## mr.rightaway (Apr 27, 2010)

Shenandoah10 said:


> I used to keep it in the back of my mind. When I got married, I was 20, and I had the same attitude towards my wife that I have now. It's the future that scares me. I am not certain I know how to be a bonafide "adult," if some of these awesome guys who were divorced irrational don't seem to measure up.


You can correct me if I'm wrong or way off-base, but I feel the problem may lie in your fear of your job future, which, in turn, calls into question your manhood/adulthood. Fear of the future. A lot people are in that same boat right now, even the educated ones. So, if you fail in that area, you will not be the man your wife and kids think you are, or should be, and while you respect your wife, she is still more successful. And I mean no disrespect, but in 20 years if she is much more successful than you are, she is the one who would have to be worried. It might be that you are taking your immediate fears and piggybacking them onto future unknowns. If that is true, it would be my assertion that that isn't productive thought.

Whether this is the case or not, I can tell you the story of my father. During the '91 recession, things were pretty bad at the time. He later told me that he used to pace around in the basement, thinking of...perhaps leaving, I don't know. Difficult economy, several children, pressures high. Not that he was actually going to leave, but that it was, perhaps, somewhat of what you're dealing with now. He stayed and worked things through.

Now, if you're talking about what's happening to the guys on this forum, your reaction is not dissimilar from my own. How can so many guys on here (or the ones in real life for that matter) who are successful and educated get divorces? Too many divorces for irrational reasons. I just have no idea. But, in my opinion, the divorce rate is a larger societal problem, the least of which you can do anything about, and that for now does not fit your situation, based on what you say. A preemptive divorce to prevent a future pain that does not yet exist will not prevent any immediate pain you are dealing with.



> Secondly, I lost a friend to an accident, so I also believe now that anything can happen out of the blue.


Death of people we are close to always makes us re-evaluate what is important. Anything can--and will--happen in life.



> My own parents' lives I'm sure has an affect on my thinking. There's no way that isn't the case.


Explain.



> *I just want to know what's in store.*


You can't. Period.


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## SurpriseMyself (Nov 14, 2009)

WhereAmI said:


> Oh, the irony! You are exactly what you fear she will become.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


So true! Project much?


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

I'm 35 and never had these thoughts of doom.

Life is what you make it. Focus on the bad, and it will most likely be bad. I choose to do the opposite.


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

that_girl said:


> I'm 35 and never had these thoughts of doom.
> 
> Life is what you make it. Focus on the bad, and it will most likely be bad. I choose to do the opposite.


You might just be less of a realist.


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

mr.rightaway said:


> You can correct me if I'm wrong or way off-base, but I feel the problem may lie in your fear of your job future, which, in turn, calls into question your manhood/adulthood. Fear of the future. A lot people are in that same boat right now, even the educated ones. So, if you fail in that area, you will not be the man your wife and kids think you are, or should be, and while you respect your wife, she is still more successful. And I mean no disrespect, but in 20 years if she is much more successful than you are, she is the one who would have to be worried. It might be that you are taking your immediate fears and piggybacking them onto future unknowns. If that is true, it would be my assertion that that isn't productive thought.


Some of this rings true, but the whole "manhood" thing isn't as important to me really, because that's going to be gone in 20 years anyway. 

I do think some of what your saying is relevant though,


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

Brandon455 said:


> Are you serious??




Yes I am, Brandon.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Shenandoah10 said:


> You might just be less of a realist.


No. I just know ANYTHING can happen. Divorce is the least of my worries. Especially divorce in 10 years :rofl:

My stepdad died within 2 weeks of getting a cold. A COLD! So....there goes your theory. You could get hit by a bus tomorrow. Better not leave your house EVER again  :lol:


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

Shenandoah10 said:


> Not offensive at all. If anything, I'd be labeled as being the woman-hater in the thread, which is ridiculous.
> As for things that shook me up, I turned 30. I now believe without a doubt that I will either reach 55 or die first. I used to keep it in the back of my mind. When I got married, I was 20, and I had the same attitude towards my wife that I have now. It's the future that scares me. I am not certain I know how to be a bonafide "adult," if some of these awesome guys who were divorced irrational don't seem to measure up.
> 
> Secondly, I lost a friend to an accident, so I also believe now that anything can happen out of the blue.
> ...


It sounds like you're picking one thing to focus on when you feel like so many things right now are out of your control. If you feel like you can control the outcome of your marriage - - for good or for bad - - then everything else will be okay by sheer force of will. Think about all the chaos you have right now:

*Milestone birthday*--always makes people "think" and to some degree, face their mortality

*Death of a friend*--yet another slap in the face from mortality. I remember how much it sucked when it became strikingly concrete that I was not invincible and not immortal. It sounds like you've had those realizations more or less all at once lately.

*Finishing up your PhD*--you've likely either done nothing but school, or else school has been your main focus for the last 25 years and now that structure as you know it, is ending and you have to move on to the next stage professionally

*Next stage professionally*--you have three small children that are going to depend on you to be that "bonafide adult" now in the world outside being a student. That has to feel like a lot of pressure.

So with all of this kind of bubbling in the background all the time, it's easy to come to a conclusion that one solution to all of this is to get a divorce. Then you eliminate a whole pool of people to risk disappointing mortally, financially, professionally. If you just cut it all off now, then you won't have to worry about being successful for them, them being hurt or sad if you die or any of that. Add in the benefit of protecting yourself from future hurt if things go the other way, and it's a magic wand solution to a lot of other insecurities during a time of really big upheaval in your life. 

My advice would be to table any big, sweeping actions for now until after you've defended and things have settled a bit. Instead, enjoy the present. Date your wife. Play with your kids. Work on your dissertation and find your postdoc or job. 

Then in a year or year and a half, re-visit the idea when you don't have quite so many other things potentially muddying the issue. If you still don't want the risk of a marriage and family, then you can make the choice with a clearer head knowing that you're really dealing with a marriage issue and not a life-stage issue.


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## jayde (Jun 17, 2011)

Seriously? 36 replies?

I guess I make 37.


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

COGypsy said:


> It sounds like you're picking one thing to focus on when you feel like so many things right now are out of your control. If you feel like you can control the outcome of your marriage - - for good or for bad - - then everything else will be okay by sheer force of will. Think about all the chaos you have right now:
> 
> *Milestone birthday*--always makes people "think" and to some degree, face their mortality
> 
> ...


This is all true. I'm thankful for your insights.

I'm thankful for all these replies. There's no way I'm going to get a divorce. That was never going to happen, looking back. 

I just feel like my life is out of my control and slipping away rapidly.


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## Shenandoah10 (Nov 12, 2011)

jayde said:


> Seriously? 36 replies?
> 
> I guess I make 37.



38, and I guess that's it.


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

Shenandoah10 said:


> This is all true. I'm thankful for your insights.
> 
> I'm thankful for all these replies. There's no way I'm going to get a divorce. That was never going to happen, looking back.
> 
> I just feel like my life is out of my control and slipping away rapidly.


We've all had these crazy times, you've got a lot going on and are entitled to a bit of a freak out. Just recognize it for what it is and keep moving forward. This too shall pass. 

And there's #39
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

#40.

Welcome back to the dreamers side  lol.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Shenandoah10 said:


> This is all true. I'm thankful for your insights.
> 
> I'm thankful for all these replies. There's no way I'm going to get a divorce. That was never going to happen, looking back.
> 
> I just feel like my life is out of my control and slipping away rapidly.


Since you are in the humanities, I'd like to suggest a book, "Man's search for meaning" by Viktor Frankl. The author was a Nazi concentration camp survivor. The book is thin but dense. I read it 3 times over the last 10 years and it says something different to me each time. 

Although you are looking at your marriage, I think your appraisal of your life is more global. You are reaching a major millstone and it is at such times that it is natural to look around. 

Life has many unexpected major forks. Sometimes we recognize which decision will take us down a major fork and sometimes we don't. It's the ones you don't recognize that make you stop and wonder where you are and how you got there. 

It's those stealth events and decisions, the surprises, that remind us that we cannot control all aspects of our lives. We are all subject to the forces of nature, the evils of man/woman and the foolishness of our own natures. 

If you have an inner context, it can guide and sustain you. I have faith in God. Harm, disease, death and sorrow has and will come to me but, I will live them out as they come. 

I will not let the bad cast a shadow over the joys and blessings of my life. Rather I allow the joys cast a shadow over the harm and that is the balm that sees me through. That is one area that I can control, my faith in the future. 

You have lost your faith in the future and given up. Maybe it's depression or a natural psychological re-centering. I think you need an internal compass, a road map that is substantial and life sustaining. It is effected by life events but not ruled by them. 

That, in part, is the theme of Frankl's book. It is not a recipe or a cookbook but an invitation. He tells the story of his life and the lives of others in the camp and how he emerged intact. He invites the reader to find a similar sense of purpose and meaning in their lives and offers a contextual guide.


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

If you go back and reread all the posts from everyone, you will notice one thing....

There's nothing irrational about divorce. There's always a reason why it happened.

For instance : Wife cheated on me. Husband cheated on me. My spouse is a controlling idiot....et al. Etc. etc.

Perhaps what's irrational is the behavior of the disloyal. But there's always a reason.

Well, except your reason. That would be th first irrational excuse I heard...the preemptive divorce.

So, what would be worse? The fifty percent chance of explaining to your son about your divorce, or the 100 percent chance of you explaining to him you divorced his mom because statistically, the probability was high that it was going to go south anyways. I'm sure with that last reason, hes going to think your a bit wacko.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shane Jimison (Sep 1, 2011)

You can't be serious?


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## mr.rightaway (Apr 27, 2010)

YinPrincess said:


> Are you serious??
> _Posted via Mobile Device_





> Originally Posted by *Brandon455*
> Are you serious??





jayde said:


> Seriously? 36 replies?
> 
> I guess I make 37.





Shane Jimison said:


> You can't be serious?


He reaffirmed that he was serious in post #35:


Shenandoah10 said:


> Yes I am, Brandon.


Shenandoah10, sometimes when we're under a lot of stress it makes our minds race and we can come up with all sorts of stuff. Just remember to allow yourself to relax and take it easy every once in awhile.

Reply #46. Pretty good stat.


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## WonderingAway (Dec 20, 2011)

Yes. You should divorce your wife. Wow....

Please do not take this as sarcastic or a stab at you, but you need to see a therapist. This is not a college philosophy class; it is a website to HELP people with marriage issues and to lend a shoulder or ear to listen. 

Start a blog or something.

I mean... Really??


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

You need to look at the numbers a bit closer..... Your chances of getting divorced are not 50%. They are actually quite a bit lower. That 50% number is, well misleading.

*Divorce Statistics in America*
Current divorce statistics in America is estimated at 50%. This data is not accurately correct, however, it is reasonably close to actual. The Americans for Divorce Reform estimates that "Probably, 40 or possibly even 50 percent of marriages will end in divorce if current trends continue.", which is actually a projection. Commanly said, 50% of all marriages in the America end in divorce. But this statement about the divorce statistics in America hides all the details about distribution, however. 


Age at marriage for those who divorce in America

Age..............................Women.........Men 
Under 20 years old........27.6%.........11.7% 
20 to 24 years old........36.6%.........38.8% 
25 to 29 years old........16.4%.........22.3% 
30 to 34 years old........8.5%...........11.6% 
35 to 39 years old........5.1%.............6.5% 


Taking the above numbers into account, if you married between the ages of 25-29, you have about a 19% chance of getting a divorce.

Divorce Statistics : Divorce Rate Statistics


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