# Percentage of successful marriages that start as affairs?



## tacoma

I`m always seeing this 2.5% number for successful marriage born from infidelity.

Can anyone cite any study for this number?
My Google-Fu must be sucking tonight as I can`t find anything out there.

I did find this site that states marriages born of affairs have a 25% shot of making it which sounds a bit more reasonable to me.

About Affairs » Blog Archive » Can Relationships That Start as Affairs Succeed…Revisited

There is one respondent in that thread who twists that 25% into 2.5% with a disrespect for mathematical objectivity I haven`t seen since Copernicus unravelled the epicycles.



> I read somewhere that only 10% of people entering an affair end up leaving their spouses. The percentage you quoted is based on those who actually ended up getting married from an affair relationship, so all of them belong to that 10%. Even if everyone who left their spouse ended up marrying their affair partner, only 25% of that 10% will stay married. Which to me translates into – if you are entering an affair relationship, there is only 2.5% chance (25 x 0.1)you will end up marrying and staying married to your affair partner. Maybe that’s why 25% sounds high to you, 2.5% is a better number.


LMAO…ohh that was funny!!

I`d just like to know what the odds are in truth and would appreciate any input.


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## I'mAllIn

No matter what the statistical odds are, I wonder how a person whose relationship started as an affair could ever trust that their partner would be any more faithful to them than they were to their previous partner.


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## tacoma

I'mAllIn said:


> No matter what the statistical odds are, I wonder how a person whose relationship started as an affair could ever trust that their partner would be any more faithful to them than they were to their previous partner.


That`s the thing though.

I`ve not trusted a partner concerning infidelity since my very first girlfriend so for me I`m not capable of that level of trust.

I`m not capable of that level of trust for anyone concerning anything.

I realize that people grow and mature and change during the course of their lives.
I am not the same person I was in my twenties (forties now) and there are many things I did then I would never do now.
There are also many things I do now I would never do then.

I have cheated, I have been faithful.

Considering the sheer numbers in most estimates of people who have had affairs 60-70% can you really completely trust anyone to be faithful at all regardless?

I find the point kind of weak.


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## Janie

I've heard the number is 7%.

Beyond the issue of trusting each other, there is much baggage remaining from the recent previous relationship. Triggers exist everywhere with that level of emotional tension (leaving a marriage, entering a new relationship) and explosions are bound to happen.

Additionally, there is outside pressure to accelerate a natural relationship progression based on the sever weight of the decisions involved. Talk about putting ALL hopes on ONE relationship. You better hope you have it right or you get to live with egg on your face.

I know this because I'm part of the 93%.


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## tacoma

But where are you getting those numbers from Janie?


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## I'mAllIn

tacoma said:


> That`s the thing though.
> 
> I`ve not trusted a partner concerning infidelity since my very first girlfriend so for me I`m not capable of that level of trust.
> 
> I`m not capable of that level of trust for anyone concerning anything.
> 
> I realize that people grow and mature and change during the course of their lives.
> I am not the same person I was in my twenties (forties now) and there are many things I did then I would never do now.
> There are also many things I do now I would never do then.
> 
> I have cheated, I have been faithful.
> 
> Considering the sheer numbers in most estimates of people who have had affairs 60-70% can you really completely trust anyone to be faithful at all regardless?
> 
> I find the point kind of weak.


I guess I come from a completely different place than you do. I've been faithful to my husband for 21 years. I know it's possible. I know others who have been faithful, who didn't find if all that difficult, in fact. So for me I think it's entirely possible to trust your spouse if you make a wise choice to begin with and nurture the relationship. Not easy, but possible. 
BUT, if two cheaters try to build a relationship together I think too many things are stacked against them.


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## Janie

I've only heard it mentioned in conversation. Don't know about the original source.

Sorry.


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## tacoma

I'mAllIn said:


> I guess I come from a completely different place than you do. I've been faithful to my husband for 21 years. I know it's possible.


I never said it wasn`t possible as it obviously is.

However, this forum is riddled with marriages that went 20-30-40 years with no infidelity and then WOOPS there it is!
So to believe longevity equates to security is not a good axiom to buy into.

I didn`t say I`m incapable of trusting, I said I`m incapable of completely trusting anyone not to cheat because it`s been shown to me that anyone can...anyone under the right circumstances.




> BUT, if two cheaters try to build a relationship together I think too many things are stacked against them.


Well I`m living proof that`s a fallacy but what I`m looking for is some objective evidence to support that assertion.

I believe the assertion is wrong headed based on numbers alone.

If the common numbers cited above are correct then 70% of people cheat at one time or another.
Odds are that a vast majority of relationships involve at least one if not two cheaters.(odds are most relationships would involve two cheaters.)
The fact is that the vast majority of marriages do not fail.
So past cheating is at best a poor barometer when considering the success of a marriage.

There are obviously other more important factors involved in the longevity of marriage.


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## LBG

Well, my marriage started as an affair and we've been married almost 8 years. I'll accept full responsibility for my part in it, I was the married one. I got married because I was pregnant and was heavily pressured to do so, yes, I know I made the decision to go through with it, but I waited until I was 36 weeks before saying I do. I loved my husband but wasn't in love with him and had never been. There was never any passion there period. You can't force love or passion. We were just much better friends.

Enter my current hubby, he quickly became my best friend and an EA began. We spent a lot of time together around my ex who was also his friend. For me, the feelings were undeniable and we did not engage in a PA until 5I months later. We never hid or snuck around during the EA, ex was there the entire time he was just oblivious to what was right in front if him.

Ex left for basic in beginning of June, PA started in July. We were best friends and we've remained that way. I told my ex the truth and answered all of his questions honestly. I felt that I owed it to him to tell him the truth and not let him find out from someone else. Fast forward, we're doing really great. We have our problems, but not because of the affair.

I think it's all situational. We turned out great and have been through 4 deployments and our fair share of military training and I can proudly say we've both remained 100%. Is it easy to trust someone else? Well that depends on if they can show you their faithfulness and prove to you that they are loyal.

I don't think there's a one-size fits all answer here.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tacoma

LBG said:


> I think it's all situational. We turned out great and have been through 4 deployments and our fair share of military training and I can proudly say we've both remained 100%. Is it easy to trust someone else? Well that depends on if they can show you their faithfulness and prove to you that they are loyal.
> 
> I don't think there's a one-size fits all answer here.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



I agree with you completely and that`s kind of the point of this thread.

I`m always seeing this "one size fits all" answer but have never seen where it comes from.

I`m referring to the 2.5-3% of affair marriages succeed statement.


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## FrankKissel

tacoma said:


> If the common numbers cited above are correct then 70% of people cheat at one time or another.


Could you please cite on objective, scientific study that suggests 70 percent of people cheat on their spouse?
Because the best study I've seen on the subject - the U. of Chicago's rolling survey on social issues - had tabbed it at about 15 percent of women and 20-25 percent of men. 

And by objective, I mean from someone not trying to sell you a book, a program or private eye services.

Or are the figures you cite include unmarried people? If so, what constitutes cheating? If a single guy is dating two women, is he cheating?
Just curious as to how those figures are derived.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tacoma

FrankKissel said:


> Could you please cite on objective, scientific study that suggests 70 percent of people cheat on their spouse?
> Because the best study I've seen on the subject - the U. of Chicago's rolling survey on social issues - had tabbed it at about 15 percent of women and 20-25 percent of men.
> 
> And by objective, I mean from someone not trying to sell you a book, a program or private eye services.
> 
> Or are the figures you cite include unmarried people? If so, what constitutes cheating? If a single guy is dating two women, is he cheating?
> Just curious as to how those figures are derived.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


That`s kind of the point of this whole OP.

I`ve never seen any stable study to support any of the infidelity numbers tossed around here.

So...

I got the 25% of marriages born of infidelity number from Farnk Pittmans book.
Amazon.com: Private Lies: Infidelity and the Betrayal of Intimacy (9780393307078): Frank Pittman: Books

I haven`t read it don`t know who Dr.Pittman is beyond his bio at amazon.
I just ran across it while looking for that 2-3% number earlier and it sounded far more realistic than the 2-3% number I hear bandied about.

The 70% of people cheat number is the high end of numerous studies I`ve recently seen reported on the net.

The Monogamy Myth
Amazon.com: The Monogamy Myth: A Personal Handbook for Recovering from Affairs (9781557043535): Peggy Vaughan: Books

States 60% of men and 40% of women have cheated or will cheat on their spouses.

The author then goes on to a correlation that isnt` immediately seen but fairly sound once considered.



> Conservative infedelity statistics estimate that “60 percent of men and 40 percent of women will have an extramarital affair. These figures are even more significant when we consider the total number of marriages involved, since it's unlikely that all the men and women having affairs happen to be married to each other. If even half of the women having affairs (or 20 percent) are married to men not included in the 60 percent having affairs, then at least one partner will have an affair in approximately 80 percent of all marriages. With this many marriages affected, it's unreasonable to think affairs are due only to the failures and shortcomings of individual husbands or wives."


"At least one partner on 80% of all marriages will have an affair."
That`s astounding.

80% damn.

I can`t find the source of that 70% of all people cheat quickly apparently but I believe it referred to all relationships and not just marriage.

I`ll post it if I find it, I`m still kinda searching around for all these numbers.


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## FrankKissel

Well, again - and please don't take this as a swipe at you - I'm highly skeptical of any figures cited by someone trying to sell me a book with a premise that monogamy is a "myth." Especially when said author doesn't disclose the source of the figure or the methodology at which it was arrived. And especially when the figure is three times larger than one determined via scientific means by one of the nation's top universities. And especially especially when that three-times greater figure is described as "conservative."

I agree that infidelity statistics are inherently unreliable because, after all, unlike a divorce it's not something done in public. But when someone with a clear bias (i.e. the desire to sell books) produces an unsourced number out of wack with one derived by an objective university study, I tend to be cynical.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tacoma

FrankKissel said:


> Well, again - and please don't take this as a swipe at you - I'm highly skeptical of any figures cited by someone trying to sell me a book with a premise that monogamy is a "myth."


Oh no no swipe at all.
That`s what I`m doing is trying to find the sources for all these numbers and I`m having very little luck finding anything done with any type of scientific methodology.

I do appreciate the UC lead on their study as I hadn`t found it and now I have a lead to explore that I can actually find.





> I agree that infidelity statistics are inherently reliable because, after all, unlike a divorce it's not something done in public. But when someone with a clear bias (i.e. the desire to sell books) produces an unsourced number out of wack with one derived by an objective university study, I tend to be cynical.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I agree infidelity statistic have got to be the least reliable stats in existence due to the very nature of the subject and the social taboos against it.
I can`t imagine what possible controls could be put in place to insure any reliable survey even in a study done by a reliable source,
At least a reliable source would state what controls or lack of were used.
With that in mind I`m off to look for that UC study.

Thanks!!


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## AB1

I wish I could help but I couldn't find the information. 

I do remember reading somewhere that a marriage that began as an affair had an exceedingly low chance of making 15-20 years. I remember this as low single-digits but can't find the report again.

Personally, I would think there is an aspect of moral caliber in play. It takes a lot of work to make 15-20 years. The idea of sorry, just not in love anymore so I think I will have an affair, versus I need to work on my marriage are not learned differences in my opinion. People will yield to one thought or the other. Some will cave into a fantasy and others will not. 

As an example, I think if a man has an affair with a married woman he will likely do it again when someone "better and younger" comes along. I think this is the basis of what the study showed.


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## Tall Average Guy

tacoma said:


> If the common numbers cited above are correct then 70% of people cheat at one time or another.
> Odds are that a vast majority of relationships involve at least one if not two cheaters.(odds are most relationships would involve two cheaters.)
> *The fact is that the vast majority of marriages do not fail.*So past cheating is at best a poor barometer when considering the success of a marriage.



Where do you get this figure? From a quick search, I found the following:

_50% percent of first marriages, 67% of second and 74% of third marriages end indivorce, according to Jennifer Baker of the Forest Institute of Professional Psychology in Springfield, Missouri.

According to enrichment journal on the divorce rate in America:
The divorce rate in America for first marriage is 41%
The divorce rate in America for second marriage is 60%
The divorce rate in America for third marriage is 73%_

If the 50% percent overall rate that is so often thrown around is to be believed, the second set of numbers seems realistic. I recall having heard that the over all divorce rate for second and third marriages is higher than for first marriages. 

I can't vouch for the basis for these numbers, but they are not wildly out of line with what others are saying.


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## ReasonableMan

Tall Average Guy said:


> Where do you get this figure? From a quick search, I found the following:
> 
> _50% percent of first marriages, 67% of second and 74% of third marriages end indivorce, according to Jennifer Baker of the Forest Institute of Professional Psychology in Springfield, Missouri.
> 
> According to enrichment journal on the divorce rate in America:
> The divorce rate in America for first marriage is 41%
> The divorce rate in America for second marriage is 60%
> The divorce rate in America for third marriage is 73%_
> 
> If the 50% percent overall rate that is so often thrown around is to be believed, the second set of numbers seems realistic. I recall having heard that the over all divorce rate for second and third marriages is higher than for first marriages.
> 
> I can't vouch for the basis for these numbers, but they are not wildly out of line with what others are saying.


From what I've read, the second set of numbers looks accurate. The divorce rate peaked in the 1980s and has declined since, and is still dropping today though fewer people marry. I saw a study (I have no link right now) that showed that the adultery rate is also dropping over time as fewer people find themselves in unhappy marriages. But I haven't seen any study that had solid numbers on the failure rate of marriages founded on adultery.

Of the people I've known who married after getting together through adultery, most seemed pretty insecure about themselves and each other. One couple spent a lot of time telling each other that each was the hottest person on the planet. I guess they had to prove to themselves that their cheating was inevitable, but at the same time won't happen in their current marriage because each of them is the best there is. But of course none of this adds up to anything when it comes to divorces rates for such marriages.


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## LBG

I don't know how accurate or reliable this is, but here's something I found.

A lesser known fact is that those who divorce rarely marry the person with whom they are having the affair. For example, Dr. Jan Halper’s study of successful men (executives, entrepreneurs, professionals) found that very few men who have affairs divorce their wife and marry their lovers. Only 3 percent of the 4,100 successful men surveyed eventually married their lovers.

Frank Pittman has found that the divorce rate among those who married their lovers was 75 percent. The reasons for the high divorce rate include: intervention of reality, guilt, expectations, a general distrust of marriage, and a distrust of the affairee.

Infidelity Statistics, Cheating Spouse Statistics - WomanSavers


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## Anubis

I wonder if it counts as an 'affair' for statistical purposes if someone meets their next partner before their divorce is final?


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## Goldmember357

most marriages will not be successful after an affair on average if you think otherwise you are fooling yourselves. Id agree with that percentage being right. Thing is things like jealousy, anger, pity, you question yourself question them. Question why they did it the list is endless. Its often to much for most people to come back from and often people who stay in those set relationships do it for other reasons as the love is dead and hope's for a stable or consummate love are all but gone.


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## Goldmember357

ReasonableMan said:


> From what I've read, the second set of numbers looks accurate. The divorce rate peaked in the 1980s and has declined since, and is still dropping today though fewer people marry. I saw a study (I have no link right now) that showed that the adultery rate is also dropping over time as fewer people find themselves in unhappy marriages. But I haven't seen any study that had solid numbers on the failure rate of marriages founded on adultery.
> 
> Of the people I've known who married after getting together through adultery, most seemed pretty insecure about themselves and each other. One couple spent a lot of time telling each other that each was the hottest person on the planet. I guess they had to prove to themselves that their cheating was inevitable, but at the same time won't happen in their current marriage because each of them is the best there is. But of course none of this adds up to anything when it comes to divorces rates for such marriages.


the Divorce rate among college educated people within the same social class is at an all time low. However divorce rate among those who are not in that bracket might be higher. I know its higher among those who marry under the age of 24 and those who have children before marriage along with those who are low income/poverty. Statistically speaking at least


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## tacoma

To zero in on the Op then my assumption is correct.

The 2.5% success rate I keep hearing about has no foundation.

Pittmans numbers are the best I can find and he states That 25 percent of affair marriages are successful/
That is a far cry from 2-3%.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jellybeans

I don't think there will ever be a "right" percentage" because if you poll a group of 100 it will have one percentage, if you poll a different group of 100 the following day, another percentage and on and on and on.

I do thi nk the #s prob aren't astronimically high for having started as an affair but who knows.


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## tacoma

Jellybeans said:


> I don't think there will ever be a "right" percentage" because if you poll a group of 100 it will have one percentage, if you poll a different group of 100 the following day, another percentage and on and on and on.
> 
> I do thi nk the #s prob aren't astronimically high for having started as an affair but who knows.


I agree they aren't high and any stats you see concerning people personal relationships are going to be skewed.

However that 2.5% number has always struck me as waaaay off.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jellybeans

Ya know, I can't even give a # I think would be "average" -- I guess it's one of those things we will never know.


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## Almostrecovered

My dad is still married to his mistress 16 years later
My wife is still with me and didnt marry her OM


so 50%


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## Jellybeans

^^ True facts


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## tacoma

Almostrecovered said:


> My dad is still married to his mistress 16 years later
> My wife is still with me and didnt marry her OM
> 
> 
> so 50%


Works for me.
It`s about as objective as any other numbers I`ve seen


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## SimplyAmorous

MY dad & Step Mom's was one of the favorable statistics -not only has it lasted, but they were "meant to be", never any problems in their marraige at all, still hopelessly in love after 35 yrs... the way she talked about my dad in a Hospital waiting room one day last year -got me all teary eyed. No force would have stopped these 2 from getting together. 

Only thing good about them was....they didn't hide it when it started to happen, my step mom was my Mom's best friend, my mom didn't love my dad, the marriage was a disaster.

My Step Mom's husband used to be my dad's best friend!! (the 4 of them lived close to each other -all friends).... What a triangle it was. I was a casualty of that affair but you know what, I thank God for my step Mom today, she is amazingy with my dad, some of his health problems, their marriage has been a fine fine example to me ... even if her parenting skills left much to be desired in my teen yrs.


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## anotherguy

AB1 said:


> ...Personally, I would think there is an aspect of moral caliber in play. It takes a lot of work to make 15-20 years. The idea of sorry, just not in love anymore so I think I will have an affair, versus I need to work on my marriage are not learned differences in my opinion. People will yield to one thought or the other. Some will cave into a fantasy and others will not...


Im not sure I buy into 'moral caliber' as much as I used to. Or rather - I think that opportunity and means play the larger part than many would like to believe. There are studies out there that demonstrate this from children to adults and across professions and backgrounds... that if given the opportunity to do something.. people (for example) keep a found wallet or cheat on a test.

If this is true.. and lets for arguments sake say that it is - I feel that it also means that it is more 'dangerous' to allow ourselves to get into a ethically hazardous situation (such as flirting outside the marriage with a willing participant) than many believe.

Virtue untested is merely innocence, someone said. But allowing yourself to get in the position of being tested is folly.

Just babbling... sorry if that is badly off topic.


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## tacoma

anotherguy said:


> If this is true.. and lets for arguments sake say that it is - I feel that it also means that it is more 'dangerous' to allow ourselves to get into a ethically hazardous situation (such as flirting outside the marriage with a willing participant) than many believe.
> 
> Virtue untested is merely innocece, someone said. But allowing yourself to get in the position of being tested is folly.


I completely agree with this.

It does go directly against the common wisdom of this forum though.

Moral calibur changes over time and experience.

Situations that would have led me to destroy my relationships when I was twenty have taught me that those situations are to now (at 44) be avoided at all cost.

I also am far less susceptible to falling for those situations now.

Ironically the main reason I wouldn`t cheat on my wife is what cheating with my wife did to me years ago.

Odd but true.

Lessons learned.


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## isla~mama

The average divorce rate for first marriages is about 50%, the rate for 2nd or more marriages is even higher... so a 25% chance of making it from an affair sounds about right since by definition that would be a second or more marriage for at least one party.

I know of one marriage that started as an affair... my childhood friend's dad married his mistress... they are still together decades later.


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## Almostrecovered

no-first marriage divorce rate in the US is 40%

second and more timers raise the overall average to 50%


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## babyz

OK - I'm going to say something that may fly in the face of a lot of beliefs. I do not believe a perfect relationship exists. I believe some people will accept the hand they have been dealt and make the best of it... and if it does not get really bad (and sometimes even when it is really bad) they will stick with the marriage for many many years. On the other hand, I believe there are plenty of people who simply get fed up with the emotional and/or physical turmoil and they bail out by either getting a divorce and moving on or by having an affair to ease them through the transition.

Every relationship, affair based or not, has about the same odds of working despite all the percentages. Because we are all individuals, each pairing either works (long or short term), or it does not.

I spent the last 30 years learning lesson after lesson on this subject. I'm a little OCD when it comes to relationships. Like another poster here, I don't have 100% trust in anyone. To a degree I inspect what I expect. Now and then and not to the extreme. Maybe once every two or three months I'll just show up where my partner said she'd be. And so far 100% of the time she has told the truth. 

In my relationships and marriages I have cheated. First marriage twice. Married the second paramour and have stayed married 13 years. Second marriage once. And I got caught and it's been a brutal 2 years. So brutal in fact that I am thinking of leaving. I deserved to pay, but I did not realize the payments would go on forever. So to answer the question, does the PA/EA relationship last, yes it can. But nothing is perfect and the sooner we realize that the more likely we will accept the fact that nothing lasts forever.


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## tacoma

babyz said:


> OK - I'm going to say something that may fly in the face of a lot of beliefs. I do not believe a perfect relationship exists. I believe some people will accept the hand they have been dealt and make the best of it... and if it does not get really bad (and sometimes even when it is really bad) they will stick with the marriage for many many years. On the other hand, I believe there are plenty of people who simply get fed up with the emotional and/or physical turmoil and they bail out by either getting a divorce and moving on or by having an affair to ease them through the transition.
> 
> Every relationship, affair based or not, has about the same odds of working despite all the percentages. Because we are all individuals, each pairing either works (long or short term), or it does not.
> 
> I spent the last 30 years learning lesson after lesson on this subject. I'm a little OCD when it comes to relationships. Like another poster here, I don't have 100% trust in anyone. To a degree I inspect what I expect. Now and then and not to the extreme. Maybe once every two or three months I'll just show up where my partner said she'd be. And so far 100% of the time she has told the truth.
> 
> In my relationships and marriages I have cheated. First marriage twice. Married the second paramour and have stayed married 13 years. Second marriage once. And I got caught and it's been a brutal 2 years. So brutal in fact that I am thinking of leaving. I deserved to pay, but I did not realize the payments would go on forever. So to answer the question, does the PA/EA relationship last, yes it can. But nothing is perfect and the sooner we realize that the more likely we will accept the fact that nothing lasts forever.


Actually babyz this flies in the face of everyones belief on this forum.(it seems)
Everyone but me that is.
I wholeheartedly agree with every word you said.


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## Singleton

Here is the math:

Out of 100 couples, (Pittman's sample in his book private lies) 
He said 50% of affairs couples divorced.
But, only 12% (12) actually married OP.
And then 75% of those failed (12*.75)= 9
Thus only 3 married betrayers are left 

So divorce rate for the cheaters is 75%. However the chances for cheaters to end up in a successful marriage is 3%. This is were confusion is regarding percentages.

What cannot be expressed in numbers is that many cheaters are shunned by their friends and family especially when they marry their "best friend's" spouse!

The main point is that affairs bring nothing but suffering eventually even to the selfish cheaters.


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## Hortensia

Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie are together since 2004, and still going strong...


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## AlphaProvider

tacoma said:


> I`m always seeing this 2.5% number for successful marriage born from infidelity.
> 
> Can anyone cite any study for this number?
> My Google-Fu must be sucking tonight as I can`t find anything out there.
> 
> I did find this site that states marriages born of affairs have a 25% shot of making it which sounds a bit more reasonable to me.
> 
> About Affairs » Blog Archive » Can Relationships That Start as Affairs Succeed…Revisited
> 
> There is one respondent in that thread who twists that 25% into 2.5% with a disrespect for mathematical objectivity I haven`t seen since Copernicus unravelled the epicycles.
> 
> 
> LMAO…ohh that was funny!!
> 
> I`d just like to know what the odds are in truth and would appreciate any input.


It's a very low percentage. If you understood all the dynamics that you are fighting against to make a relationship as a result of an affair workout it will make more sense.

There is ONE particular situation where a relationship born of an affair may work.

Say a husband or wife is in a very abusive and corrosive relationship. They are trapped and no way out. They meet their angel, the social groups are happy and bless the new relationship, it was formed for a good reason to start with, that may just work.

As usual its still always better to divorce first before starting a new situation.

The relationships as results of affairs usually do NOT workout, because you got into it in the first place normally off of a bad motive. It's usually lust and passion based and a good component of the lust and passion was driven from needing to be underground, the secrecy of it. Also in the minds of both people was bad motives and reasonings.

All of this stuff will come out and be paid for later, plus the social component. It's likely your going to have alot of people mad, many of them formed your support bases.

Without your support bases, and now support bases turned against you, you will have stress. You never had any good fundamental reasons to be together in the first place, so it won't last.

Never mind the reasons, is they usually don't last.

Player stuff usually comes to light and is dissolved badly.


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## adaisyandarose

_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## julianne

I know one marriage that started from a work place affair, they were both married. They subsequently left their respective spouses and got married to each other. Last I heard, he was miserable.


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## JustSomeGuyWho

Interesting. My wife and I are probably done after 20 years (21 at the end of the month). I've all but given up. She is a good and decent person. Compassionate with high character. I will not have an affair but if I did, I just can't imagine marrying that person. How could I possibly marry a woman who thought it was ok to have sex with a married man and furthermore had the poor judgement to marry that man? How could I love a woman that I cannot trust? Seems like that marriage would have a very high chance of failure.


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## tainted

I know many people don't want to hear this but the majority of marriages(over 50%) don't last either. Ones that started off as affairs have diminishing hope after the affair fog wears off.


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## Horizon

I wish my WS had taken off with that 'married with children' SOB. I reckon it would have been easier to act on rather than finding out after the fact as I did. F**k cheaters!

"What is the percentage of failed long term relationships after an affair?"


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## Philat

Thinking out loud:

Define "successful." Marriage X is good for 20 years but ends in divorce over an affair. Failure? The cheating partner from Marriage X marries his/her AP, forming Marriage Y, and 10 years later, when surveyed for a study on the success rate of marriages that start as affairs, Marriage Y is still intact. Success? 20 years = failure, 10 years = success? Is divorce the only measure by which a marriage is successful or not? And who's to say that two years after being recorded for posterity as a successful affair-based marriage Marriage Y doesn't go belly-up?

My conclusion: There isn't any good answer for any of this.


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## Thor

My mom (while married to my dad) had an exit affair with a man (who was living with a woman at the time). He and my mom got married, and they just had their 25th anniversary. It's been a really good marriage.

This is probably not a typical situation at all. Certainly this is not a data point to use in support of affairs!


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## John Lee

tainted said:


> I know many people don't want to hear this but the majority of marriages(over 50%) don't last either. Ones that started off as affairs have diminishing hope after the affair fog wears off.


This is a "statistic" that gets repeated over and over again, but it's not accurate.

The Myth of the High Rate of Divorce | Psych Central
Are Marriage Statistics Divorced from Reality? - TIME
Fifty Percent of American Marriages End in Divorce-Fiction!


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## questar1

Interesting thread, one that keeps on ticking.

I realized, reading it, that my marriage "sort of" fits into this category. And that's another point: There may be fuzzy lines around these classes of second/third/post-affair/affair marriages. 

My divorce was all but final when things got serious with my current husband. Since I was not fully divorced I suppose technically I was having an affair, I guess. Separated, filed papers, adversarial, talking only through lawyers, etc. And then my now-husband walked into my life. So: What research category should we put this in?

The thing though is this. My current husband is the man I should have married many years ago. He is the right fit for me. He is the man I wanted to be with, while choosing to be with Mr. Wrong instead, out of a sense of duty (I was dating Mr. Wrong first when i met Mr. Right, and held to my firm beliefs in monogamous dating out of sheer moralistic stupidity). 

So as far as I am concerned, my current marriage is righting a wrong, literally!

I am rectifying the past. 

The sad part is that, meanwhile, we both got older. I had 3 kids with Mr. Wrong. And hit perimenopause. I was barely 30 when I married Mr. Wrong. I was closing in on 50 when I met and mated with Mr. Right. 

To me the takeaway message is, Be smarter the FIRST time around, don't lie to yourself, be very exacting in who you pair up with. 

H and I are currently dealing with issues on two levels. First, the stuff that is there because we simply got older while living separate lives, instead of marrying younger and maturing together. Second, the usual differences between people that just grate on your nerves. And of course the fact that I have 3 kids, he has none; my parents are alive, his aren't (he is much older).... There are burdens that life itself brings.

As for statistics, it seems to me from reading the preceding posts that divorce statistics apply evenly to everyone. Maybe as we get older and into second and third marriages, we're just too exhausted to keep tolerating crap and know that we have the means to leave, so the divorce rates go higher.... but overall I suspect the reasons and the results are similar. Some work out, some don't. 

With my H I feel as though I have finally come home. There are problems (duh, that's how I found TAM), but our backgrounds, ethics, education, families, socioeconomic history and expectations, etc., make us phenomenally compatible.... Was it an affair? I don't care. Sophistry. We were meant to be. And that would be a better indicator than our marital status before marrying each other IMHO. Sometimes, the first time (often, sadly, producing children) is simply a mistake. 

Also, I have no idea where we might fit into the statistics given that this is my third marriage and his first. ??? Gee, what are our chances?


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## JustSomeGuyWho

questar1 said:


> Interesting thread, one that keeps on ticking.
> 
> I realized, reading it, that my marriage "sort of" fits into this category. And that's another point: There may be fuzzy lines around these classes of second/third/post-affair/affair marriages.
> 
> My divorce was all but final when things got serious with my current husband. Since I was not fully divorced I suppose technically I was having an affair, I guess. Separated, filed papers, adversarial, talking only through lawyers, etc. And then my now-husband walked into my life. So: What research category should we put this in?
> 
> The thing though is this. My current husband is the man I should have married many years ago. He is the right fit for me. He is the man I wanted to be with, while choosing to be with Mr. Wrong instead, out of a sense of duty (I was dating Mr. Wrong first when i met Mr. Right, and held to my firm beliefs in monogamous dating out of sheer moralistic stupidity).
> 
> So as far as I am concerned, my current marriage is righting a wrong, literally!
> 
> I am rectifying the past.
> 
> The sad part is that, meanwhile, we both got older. I had 3 kids with Mr. Wrong. And hit perimenopause. I was barely 30 when I married Mr. Wrong. I was closing in on 50 when I met and mated with Mr. Right.
> 
> To me the takeaway message is, Be smarter the FIRST time around, don't lie to yourself, be very exacting in who you pair up with.
> 
> H and I are currently dealing with issues on two levels. First, the stuff that is there because we simply got older while living separate lives, instead of marrying younger and maturing together. Second, the usual differences between people that just grate on your nerves. And of course the fact that I have 3 kids, he has none; my parents are alive, his aren't (he is much older).... There are burdens that life itself brings.
> 
> As for statistics, it seems to me from reading the preceding posts that divorce statistics apply evenly to everyone. Maybe as we get older and into second and third marriages, we're just too exhausted to keep tolerating crap and know that we have the means to leave, so the divorce rates go higher.... but overall I suspect the reasons and the results are similar. Some work out, some don't.
> 
> With my H I feel as though I have finally come home. There are problems (duh, that's how I found TAM), but our backgrounds, ethics, education, families, socioeconomic history and expectations, etc., make us phenomenally compatible.... Was it an affair? I don't care. Sophistry. We were meant to be. And that would be a better indicator than our marital status before marrying each other IMHO. Sometimes, the first time (often, sadly, producing children) is simply a mistake.
> 
> Also, I have no idea where we might fit into the statistics given that this is my third marriage and his first. ??? Gee, what are our chances?


I personally would not place you in the affair category because no matter how "technical" you want to get, I think the intent of the thread is to capture the success rate of affairs that precipitated a divorce and ended in marriage. Yours doesn't even fall into "exit affair".

What I would be curious about though is ... what is the success rate of marriages that take place within a certain time period after a divorce. Meaning ... somebody that you date during the separation or immediately after the filing. I've always been of the mindset that a person needs to take some time after a divorce for self-discovery. Trying to figure out who you are and who you want to be. I think marriage works best when you are completely comfortable with who you are and what you want. Chances are good that you are not that person towards the end of a failed marriage, especially a long term one. The success rate for second marriages is lower than first marriages ... but purely speculating ... that may be because people often jump into LTR and marriage right after their first marriage ends.


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## barbados

2 of my 4 sister's cheated on their first husbands, and both eventually married their APs and both are still married to them almost 30 years later.

My one sister had 3 young kids at the time, and her now H was leaving his 3rd wife, and has 4 kids in total from his first 3 wives. They did not have children together.

My other sister had no kids, but her now H had 3 young kids at the time. It was their second marriage for both. They have 1 child together. (she will be 21 in a couple months)

BTW, off topic but worth mentioning. Want to talk about Rug Sweeping ? The soon to be 21 year old still does not know that my sister was married before ! (and she was married for about 5 years)

You can't make this stuff up ! YIKES !!


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## johndz

Oh, I think if a ffair happen, it can happen again wit another person, thus the percetage is too low, those are not succeful relationships.


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## mel123

I don't have any numbers, but if they will cheat with you. They will cheat on you.


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## Outofluck

How can you trust someone who cheated on their ex with you? What makes someone think that it won't happen to them & think that the other will be faithful?


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