# My intro



## Post

I found this site through a google search looking for advice on my current relationship. Im a 40 year old man whos ex wife is wanting to get back together after she cheated on me 15 years ago and we divorced. im trying to discover whats going on with me and why I have relationship problems.


----------



## aquarius1

Post said:


> I found this site through a google search looking for advice on my current relationship. Im a 40 year old man whos ex wife is wanting to get back together after she cheated on me 15 years ago and we divorced. im trying to discover whats going on with me and why I have relationship problems.


Perhaps a little more info would be helpful? If SHE cheated, she’s the one with the problem, not you. Has this happened in other relationships? Why do you think you have a problem? It might help if we knew more info.


----------



## jlg07

In the past 15 years, what have you done to work on yourself? Have you gone to counseling? Her cheating is HER fault, not yours, and you shouldn't take it on that it had anything to do with you. Even if you were a lousy husband, she should have divorced you before cheating.

I would be VERY hesitant to have your ex, after 15 YEARS, wanting to get back together -- seems a bit sketchy to me.


----------



## Post

test


----------



## Post

jlg07 said:


> In the past 15 years, what have you done to work on yourself? Have you gone to counseling? Her cheating is HER fault, not yours, and you shouldn't take it on that it had anything to do with you. Even if you were a lousy husband, she should have divorced you before cheating.
> 
> I would be VERY hesitant to have your ex, after 15 YEARS, wanting to get back together -- seems a bit sketchy to me.


I do need counseling, I seem to attracted to women who cheat. I would never cheat but seems all I ever date is people who cheat. my ex wife and I got married just after high school we where very young. she came home one day said it was over she had met a much older man at work and he was her soulmate. keep in mind we where 24 years old at this time with a 1 year old child. I was devastated and lost, but had the money to get a lawyer. I got custody of our son and she put up no fight for anything. We Co-parented very well together. our son is a senior in high school this year. Both our 2nd marriages failed. Again my wife cheated and marriage was sexless, I was relieved it was over. Her soulmate left her to go back with his wife years ago only a few months after we divorced. She met a man and married him then he cheated on her. she claims cheating on me was the biggest mistake ever. the other night she came over to give me money for our sons senior expenses and we had sex. it was very good sex better sex than we ever had when we where married. we are texting constantly and it feels good to talk to her. I had not had sex in a year and a half maybe ive been lonely and this feels good. I got a whirlwind of emotions at the moment


----------



## arbitrator

*Welcome to the TAM Family, @Post ~

What makes you think that a cheating ex doesn't know the drill well enough, if given the opportunity, to just do it all over again?

Unless she consented to serious psychological counseling, I just couldn't bring myself to ever recommending considering it!

Best of luck to you my friend!*


----------



## skerzoid

Post

Whoa Kemosabi.

Just take it slow. Try doing paragraphs and thinking through your posts. Use punctuation. Here is an example:

*I do need counseling, I seem to attracted to women who cheat. I would never cheat but seems all I ever date is people who cheat.

My ex wife and I got married just after high school (when) we were very young. She came home one day said it was over. She had met a much older man at work and he was her soulmate. Keep in mind we (were) 24 years old at this time with a 1 year old child. 

I was devastated and lost, but had the money to get a lawyer. I got custody of our son and she put up no fight for anything. 

We Co-parented very well together. Our son is a senior in high school this year. 

Both our 2nd marriages failed. Again my (2nd) wife cheated and marriage was sexless. I was relieved it was over. 

Her (my first wife) soulmate left her to go back with his wife years ago, only a few months after we divorced. She (then) met a man and married him, then he cheated on her. 

She (now) claims cheating on me was the biggest mistake ever. 

The other night, she came over to give me money for our son's senior expenses and we had sex. It was very good sex, better sex than we ever had when we (were) married. 

We are texting constantly and it feels good to talk to her. I had not had sex in a year and a half. Maybe i've been lonely and this feels good. I've got a whirlwind of emotions at the moment.*

Now then, MR. Post,

1. *She has to prove why she wants this.* People very rarely change, but she may be showing remorse. Watch her actions, not her words. 

2. *Be sure and get a prenuptial agreement if you ever do remarry.* Infidelity should leave her with nothing.

3. *Cheating is never a mistake, she knew what she was doing and chose to do it.* She deserted her son for a POSOM (Piece Of **** Other Man). She is now 40 and getting desperate.

4. *Have her take a polygraph and ask her yes or no questions about why she is doing this.*

5. *Both of you need to get into Individual Counseling (IC).*

6. *You need to change your picker.* 

8. *You seem to have a poor self-image.* Stop being so desperate with women. You are the prize, not them. Make them work for it. Play hard to get.

9. *Women are attracted to Strength, Courage, & Decisive Action.* She wants to come back? Make her work for it. 

10. *You probably did the pick-me dance the first time.* Never do that. Makes you look weak and pathetic while the POSOM looks strong.

11. *How are her finances?* Is she looking for money? You have to really vet her this time.

12. *How would your son feel about her re-entering his life?*


----------



## Post

skerzoid said:


> Post
> 
> Whoa Kemosabi.
> 
> Just take it slow. Try doing paragraphs and thinking through your posts. Use punctuation. Here is an example:
> 
> *I do need counseling, I seem to attracted to women who cheat. I would never cheat but seems all I ever date is people who cheat.
> 
> My ex wife and I got married just after high school (when) we were very young. She came home one day said it was over. She had met a much older man at work and he was her soulmate. Keep in mind we (were) 24 years old at this time with a 1 year old child.
> 
> I was devastated and lost, but had the money to get a lawyer. I got custody of our son and she put up no fight for anything.
> 
> We Co-parented very well together. Our son is a senior in high school this year.
> 
> Both our 2nd marriages failed. Again my (2nd) wife cheated and marriage was sexless. I was relieved it was over.
> 
> Her (my first wife) soulmate left her to go back with his wife years ago, only a few months after we divorced. She (then) met a man and married him, then he cheated on her.
> 
> She (now) claims cheating on me was the biggest mistake ever.
> 
> The other night, she came over to give me money for our son's senior expenses and we had sex. It was very good sex, better sex than we ever had when we (were) married.
> 
> We are texting constantly and it feels good to talk to her. I had not had sex in a year and a half. Maybe i've been lonely and this feels good. I've got a whirlwind of emotions at the moment.*
> 
> Now then, MR. Post,
> 
> 1. *She has to prove why she wants this.* People very rarely change, but she may be showing remorse. Watch her actions, not her words.
> 
> 2. *Be sure and get a prenuptial agreement if you do ever remarry.* Infidelity should leave her with nothing.
> 
> 3. *Cheating is never a mistake, she knew what she was doing and chose to do it.* She deserted her son for a POSOM (Piece Of **** Other Man). She is now 40 and getting desperate.
> 
> 4. *Have her take a polygraph and ask her yes or no questions about why she is doing this.*
> 
> 5. *Both of you need to get into Individual Counseling (IC).*
> 
> 6. *You need to change your picker.*
> 
> 8. *You seem to have a poor self-image.* Stop being so desperate with women. You are the prize, not them. Make them work for it. Play hard to get.
> 
> 9. *Women are attracted to Strength, Courage, & Decisive Action.* She wants to come back? Make her work for it.
> 
> 10. *You probably did the pick-me dance the first time.* Never do that. Makes you look weak and pathetic while the POSOM looks strong.
> 
> 11. *How are her finances?* Is she looking for money? You have to really vet her this time.


note well taken. how does one get access to polygraph


----------



## skerzoid

Post said:


> note well taken. how does one get access to polygraph


You could ask local police who they use. Government still uses them. The main thing is that you sometimes get parking-lot confessions from the cheater. They usually only use four or five questions. Ask your lawyer.


----------



## skerzoid

I wasn't trying to be a smart-a$$ on the writing thing. It just helps folks to read easier, and you will get more & better responses.


----------



## Post

skerzoid said:


> You could ask local police who they use. Government still uses them. The main thing is that you sometimes get parking-lot confessions from the cheater. They usually only use four or five questions. Ask your lawyer.


She has had counseling. not trying to defend her but my parents had money to get a PI and me a good lawyer, I don't think she deserted our son. she has stayed in his life and always put him 1st. I don't think she ever missed any event in his life.

also financially she is making it I don't think its the money


----------



## rugswept

the two of you are way beyond being young impulsive dummies. @ 40, you're getting into the un-crazy part of your lives. 
you had a son together who is now out of high school. 

you've both been down the road of life, a long ways. she was good to your son, or so you expressed. they must have a good relationship. 

it really sounds like she's trying to add stability and meaning to her life. you do have to be cautious with her. just try to find out if she's gone from one paramour to another and you're just the next in line, for now. if she's not really promiscuous and is trying to ground herself, finally, into what can work for her, you might have a good relationship starting up again. 

the common bond you have is your son. is she has been attentive to him and hasn't casually been around the block with many paramours, you might have a real future with her. 

you're both past the crazy years. yes, she was just a dummy in your early years, but now sounds like she is trying to find something in a relationship that is in her comfort zone.


----------



## Sparta

I think you have a good relationship with her, you know her character better than anyone . And that’s why you’re contemplating getting back together with her because it feels right and it should. Have her sign a prenup and get back together with her with a prenup can only do so much damage I don’t think she will. She’s been around the block knows that it’s hard to find a good guy. It’s so f**ked up in the dating World. Honestly I think it’s a good idea. After everything you’ve been through you you will know if she even thinks about f**king around again.


----------



## Post

Sparta said:


> I think you have a good relationship with her, you know her character better than anyone . And that’s why you’re contemplating getting back together with her because it feels right and it should. Have her sign a prenup and get back together with her with a prenup can only do so much damage I don’t think she will. She’s been around the block knows that it’s hard to find a good guy. It’s so f**ked up in the dating World. Honestly I think it’s a good idea. After everything you’ve been through you you will know if she even thinks about f**king around again.


I plan on dating for a long time. I still have trust issues that I would have with any woman. Then it’s my family also. We are a close family and they also felt betrayed by her if that makes since aka my mother, father and siblings. My family thought the world of her. 

I don’t see any reason to marry her for a while. We have co-parented very well together and this year some people actually thought we were together as a couple anyway. I’ve felt the spark coming back for about 6 months now.

Friday night she wanted me to stay over it took everything in my power to tell her no. We are going out to eat this evening together. 

What are some question you think I should bring up. I know before in our marriage she had communication when we talked about relationships issues. She would avoid them. I’ve had some emotions come back. I remember me saying it was like I need a voice recorder to remind her what she had said or done


----------



## skerzoid

Post said:


> I plan on dating for a long time. I still have trust issues that I would have with any woman. Then it’s my family also. We are a close family and they also felt betrayed by her if that makes since aka my mother, father and siblings. My family thought the world of her.
> 
> I don’t see any reason to marry her for a while. We have co-parented very well together and this year some people actually thought we were together as a couple anyway. I’ve felt the spark coming back for about 6 months now.
> 
> Friday night she wanted me to stay over it took everything in my power to tell her no. We are going out to eat this evening together.
> 
> What are some question you think I should bring up. I know before in our marriage she had communication when we talked about relationships issues. She would avoid them. I’ve had some emotions come back. I remember me saying it was like I need a voice recorder to remind her what she had said or done


She needs to address those things she said and did at the time. She has to prove herself. She is the one who has to rebuild this. 

Here are some ideas on questions:

1. *How have your boundaries with men changed in the last 15 years?*

2. *Are you willing to date instead of marry until you prove you are a safe partner, no matter how long it will take?*

3. *If I agree to reconciliation, are you willing to have have free and open electronic communications that we both can see?*

4. *Understanding the pain I have gone through in the last 15 years, are you willing to take a polygraph exam about your feelings for me at the present time?*

5. *If we were ever to remarry, would you sign a prenuptial agreement?*

6. *What are the qualities you want in a man, and why do you now feel that I have those qualities when you didn't see them in me before?*

7. *What steps are you willing to take to make up with my family after the damage that was done to them before?*

Post, you really need to make sure she is safe for you now. Even though you guys are 15 years older now, you are still in the prime of life, emotionally, and sexually. She has to still prove that she is in it for the long haul now. Make her court you, and make her understand she will have to prove herself. No easy short cuts.


----------



## Nucking Futs

Post said:


> I plan on dating for a long time. I still have trust issues that I would have with any woman. Then it’s my family also. We are a close family and they also felt betrayed by her if that makes since aka my mother, father and siblings. My family thought the world of her.
> 
> I don’t see any reason to marry her for a while.


Or ever.



Post said:


> We have co-parented very well together and this year some people actually thought we were together as a couple anyway. I’ve felt the spark coming back for about 6 months now.
> 
> Friday night she wanted me to stay over it took everything in my power to tell her no. We are going out to eat this evening together.
> 
> What are some question you think I should bring up. I know before in our marriage she had communication when we talked about relationships issues. She would avoid them. I’ve had some emotions come back. I remember me saying it was like I need a voice recorder to remind her what she had said or done


Don't marry her again. Date her, FWB, cohabitate, what ever, but why is marriage even on the table?



> I do need counseling, I seem to attracted to women who cheat. I would never cheat but seems all I ever date is people who cheat.


And you're here asking us if you should continue this. Get counseling before you take this any farther than casual sex with an ex.


----------



## Mr.Married

Nucking Futs said:


> Or ever.
> 
> Don't marry her again. Date her, FWB, cohabitate, what ever, but why is marriage even on the table?
> 
> .


The machine gun cat might be on to something.


----------



## Post

skerzoid said:


> She needs to address those things she said and did at the time. She has to prove herself. She is the one who has to rebuild this.
> 
> Here are some ideas on questions:
> 
> 1. *How have your boundaries with men changed in the last 15 years?*
> 
> 2. *Are you willing to date instead of marry until you prove you are a safe partner, no matter how long it will take?*
> 
> 3. *If I agree to reconciliation, are you willing to have have free and open electronic communications that we both can see?*
> 
> 4. *Understanding the pain I have gone through in the last 15 years, are you willing to take a polygraph exam about your feelings for me at the present time?*
> 
> 5. *If we were ever to remarry, would you sign a prenuptial agreement?*
> 
> 6. *What are the qualities you want in a man, and why do you now feel that I have those qualities when you didn't see them in me before?*
> 
> 7. *What steps are you willing to take to make up with my family after the damage that was done to them before?*
> 
> Post, you really need to make sure she is safe for you now. Even though you guys are 15 years older now, you are still in the prime of life, emotionally, and sexually. She has to still prove that she is in it for the long haul now. Make her court you, and make her understand she will have to prove herself. No easy short cuts.


I’ve ask her 1,2,3,6. I can’t wait to see her reaction on the polygraph test. I noticed something changed with her 6 months ago. 

My son and I were arguing because he is driving and I limit his driving, he has a curfew. He wanted gas money to go somewhere and I would not give it to him. He called his mom hoping she would give it to him. She told him if I would not give him money he didn’t need it.

He made a comment that I try to control him and he knows why mom left. She wrote him a letter about how good of a father I have been to him. I remember reading the letter and thinking we’re has this woman been hiding at. The last 2 Father’s Day she has given him and I gift cards to go out and eat at his favorite restaurant. This Father’s Day I ask her to join us.

As I was typing this she sent me a text. It only says 

thank you and I love you 😘 

I have not responded back to it and if i do I will only say “your welcome we need to talk”.


----------



## Post

Nucking Futs said:


> Or ever.
> 
> 
> 
> Don't marry her again. Date her, FWB, cohabitate, what ever, but why is marriage even on the table?
> 
> 
> 
> And you're here asking us if you should continue this. Get counseling before you take this any farther than casual sex with an ex.


Marriage is not on the table for me. I’m making that clear to her tonight.


----------



## jlg07

Just take it slow, get to really know her again (15 years is a LONG time, even if you were co-parents -- do you know all of the relationships shes had and what happened with them?? etc.).


----------



## lifeistooshort

How can you know that you're attracted to women that cheat unless you know in advance they're cheaters?

It's more likely that you're not prioritizing character and thus choosing women of poor character.

What was it that attracted you to these women? 

This is something to be addressed by a counselor.


----------



## BluesPower

lifeistooshort said:


> How can you know that you're attracted to women that cheat unless you know in advance they're cheaters?
> 
> It's more likely that you're not prioritizing character and thus choosing women of poor character.
> 
> What was it that attracted you to these women?
> 
> This is something to be addressed by a counselor.


Agree with your overall post. 

However, there is a thing that happens in these situations. What is that dynamic? 

Is the guy great out of the gate but gets boring so the women cheat or get board? Is there some other reason? 

Or are there men, or people, that somehow pick cheaters.

There has to be something going on in some of these cases because at least for some people, it happens multiple times with multiple partners????

I wonder what that is about???


----------



## Casual Observer

Post said:


> Marriage is not on the table for me. I’m making that clear to her tonight.


So I'm the odd-person-out on this one. I don't see why marriage, after a suitable engagement, could not be on the table, providing a decent prenup was put in place. I don't go along with this "playing house" stuff. Strict accountability outside of marriage is less than idea, I think. Take the vows before God and if she screws up, she bears the consequences. 

I'm just not seeing what it is you have to lose, by entertaining the idea of marriage again, *if* things truly seem different with her. The FWB thing, the added convenience of raising a kid under one roof, it represents almost an expectation of failure if marriage is off the table. 

And if she screws up, I'm not sure how you're any the worse for wear, other than seeing her as a bad seed and to be avoided in the future at all costs. Another failed marriage with her, if that were to happen, doesn't indict all future relationships with other women.

I'd think 6 months ought to be enough time to see her worse side come out. Just be careful about not setting her up to fail. People live up to their expectations. If you tell her she's not capable of keeping her marriage vows (again), she'll feel like success is not an option, might as well fail.

I cannot believe I'm so strongly in the 2nd-chance column on this one.


----------



## Nucking Futs

Casual Observer said:


> So I'm the odd-person-out on this one. I don't see why marriage, after a suitable engagement, could not be on the table, providing a decent prenup was put in place. I don't go along with this "playing house" stuff. Strict accountability outside of marriage is less than idea, I think. Take the vows before God and if she screws up, she bears the consequences.
> 
> I'm just not seeing what it is you have to lose, by entertaining the idea of marriage again, *if* things truly seem different with her. The FWB thing, the added convenience of raising a kid under one roof, it represents an awareness of your personal history with this woman almost an expectation of failure if marriage is off the table.
> 
> And if she screws up, I'm not sure how you're any the worse for wear, other than paying a small fortune to break out of a marriage you shouldn't have been in in the first place other than seeing her as a bad seed and to be avoided in the future at all costs. Another failed marriage with her, if that were to happen, doesn't indict all future relationships with other women.
> 
> I'd think 6 months ought to be enough time to see her worse side come out. It took around 5 years the first time. Just be careful about not setting her up to fail. People live up to their expectations. If you tell her she's not capable of keeping her marriage vows (again), she'll feel like success is not an option, might as well fail.
> 
> I cannot believe I'm so strongly in the 2nd-chance column on this one.
> 
> I can't believe anyone that's been through a divorce would be.


----------



## skerzoid

How did it go last night?


----------



## Casual Observer

Yes, true, I have not been through a divorce, nor do I see that as a future likelihood. Asked 8 months ago, the answer might have been different. 

Seems like there ought to be a way to set up a prenup that would minimize financial exposure, not just assets but legal fees, in the event things went south. But there ought to be a lot of things that make sense, right?


----------



## Post

skerzoid said:


> How did it go last night?


I mentioned the polygraph to her, she replied what ever it takes. i also ask her why, i've never got a answer from her as why she did this to me years ago. the answer she gave me seemed honest and i felt she had thought about this for many years.

her explanation was we were so young, we started dating at 16 and married by 19. she had never had another man make advances on her. she said after giving birth to our son she went back to work and the man started complimenting her looks. then he went on about how miserable his marriage was. she was working night shift, i was working day shift we never saw one another and this guy was giving her attention I was not. 

I ask her how does she know this would not happed again. she explained she has better communication skills and understands that all relationships have ups and down now. she explained the grass is never greener on the other side. im leaving out a lot because it would take me hours to type all this. she has requested we go to couples therapy, she says she has lived with this regret long enough. 

Ill admit all this has me feeling good. i told her we will see where it goes from here. she wants us to take a family trip together on her expense, she said she has always wanted our son to experience that with us. she would like us to go to the outer banks of NC together as a family. 

We set up a couples session for next week. she seems very genuine and ive never been able to talk to her like this. as for her second marriage she says im by no ways her second choice, she said he was toxic and made her realize how much more of a mistake she had made. she has been to counseling for 3 years now and would really like for me to go. 

she also explained how her other relationships felt dirty to her and ours always felt pure. she poured her heart out to me like she has never done before. she says she will do what ever it takes and long as i also work with her.


----------



## Post

btw she owns her home and so do i so we have no need to move in together either


----------



## aquarius1

I have to admit this one has me intrigued. People can learn and grow and change. 15 years is a long time and you were both VERY young when you first met. 
Life has a way of teaching us things. Perhaps she has learned? I agree with others. Go very slowly, keep your eyes open. Counselling sounds good. Pre up for sure.


----------



## Post

Also remember I have not just jumped into this in a week. We have been communicating for 6 months. I was the one who initiated sex she didn’t stop me. We have been on unofficial dates prior and she has not been aggressive or pushing me to make decisions.


----------



## StillSearching

Post said:


> btw she owns her home and so do i so we have no need to move in together either


Get the book "The Rational Male". Read it. Be ready, strong, and informed. 
It can changes everything. You will understand her and her behavior and how to respond to it.


----------



## UpsideDownWorld11

Eh, I don't know why your self esteem is so low you want to get back with someone that treated you like trash. Now she is contrite after she was tossed away like trash by her AP? Go figure, you are her security blanket... You can do better if you so choose.


----------



## Oldtimer

Firstly, it’s a crapshoot, 15 years after the deed and she’s supposedly changed. I would normally be on the get the **** away bus, but looking inward, I know people can change for both the better and for the worst. I have. For the better of course.

I was a real ******* in my previous life, but in changing, I’ve tried to make amends with those I’d hurt, sometimes too little too late as some have passed. I have become a better man, husband and father, which brings around the question why can’t she be a better woman and spouse. You’ve already said she’s been a good mother throughout the 15 years even though she crapped on both you and your son that many years ago.

Just a perspective on changes. I do wish you well in your eventual choices sit will affect both you and your son. Remember, this is just an opinion.

OT


----------



## UpsideDownWorld11

Post said:


> I mentioned the polygraph to her, she replied what ever it takes. i also ask her why, i've never got a answer from her as why she did this to me years ago. the answer she gave me seemed honest and i felt she had thought about this for many years.
> 
> her explanation was we were so young, we started dating at 16 and married by 19. she had never had another man make advances on her. she said after giving birth to our son she went back to work and the man started complimenting her looks. then he went on about how miserable his marriage was. she was working night shift, i was working day shift we never saw one another and this guy was giving her attention I was not.
> 
> I ask her how does she know this would not happed again. she explained she has better communication skills and understands that all relationships have ups and down now. she explained the grass is never greener on the other side. im leaving out a lot because it would take me hours to type all this. she has requested we go to couples therapy, she says she has lived with this regret long enough.
> 
> Ill admit all this has me feeling good. i told her we will see where it goes from here. she wants us to take a family trip together on her expense, she said she has always wanted our son to experience that with us. she would like us to go to the outer banks of NC together as a family.
> 
> We set up a couples session for next week. she seems very genuine and ive never been able to talk to her like this. as for her second marriage she says im by no ways her second choice, she said he was toxic and made her realize how much more of a mistake she had made. she has been to counseling for 3 years now and would really like for me to go.
> 
> she also explained how her other relationships felt dirty to her and ours always felt pure. she poured her heart out to me like she has never done before. she says she will do what ever it takes and long as i also work with her.


Honestly... Sounds like she is feeding you BS by the shovel load. So, she ditched you and your one year old for some old dude that played her. Then he dumps her for his wife (?) per usual and XX failed relationships later, now she is back to her Safety Net. I'm guessing 15 years didn't treat her so well and her options are vastly limited. Except Plan B or C or D - YOU! 

Now, 15 years later she wants to play happy family?? Are you effing kidding me? How gracious of her! You mean to tell me, it took her 15 years, a series of failed relationships to realize that she wanted you all along? Your love is pure even though she soiled it with deceit and extramarital sex with another man...

I wouldn't even treat her as a potential plate since you both have a kid together. That will just lead to too much drama. I sure as hell wouldn't trust her 'changed ways'. You are playing on her terms, you are in her frame. She is choosing you, you aren't choosing her.

I'm sure you aren't buying what I'm saying.. Well, you said it yourself, you have a penchant of falling for women who cheat. Now, you are back with a confirmed cheater and aren't smelling the **** fumes...


----------



## WorkingWife

Post said:


> She has had counseling. not trying to defend her but my parents had money to get a PI and me a good lawyer, I don't think she deserted our son. she has stayed in his life and always put him 1st. I don't think she ever missed any event in his life.
> 
> also financially she is making it I don't think its the money


Folks will say that people never really change. Once a cheater, always a cheater. But I would say people can and do change. There is often a BIG difference in emotional maturity between a 20 year old and a 40 year old. 

I think it depends on WHY she cheated. What was inside of her that made her suddenly so attracted to this aging "soul mate." What made her able to lie to and deceive you? Are those things inherent flaws in her character, or were they a symptom of her immaturity and inability to handle a relationship at that time? What qualities made him feel like "soul mate" to her at the time? How did she feel about you in comparison, and why?

And what is inside of you that you gravitate toward cheaters? Insecurity? A desire to save them?

They say it is very easy to fall back in love with someone you've known intimately, but people tend to romanticize their memory of the relationship and usually the same issues repeat.

I would say just take is slow and really pay attention. IC is a good idea for both of you. So is discussing what happened, why, and if you two are going to get serious again, how to put precautions in place to prevent a recurrence. For example, if either of you find yourself feeling attracted to someone else, are you able to talk about that openly with each other and willing to distance yourself from the person of interest? Can you agree to no opposite sex "friendships"? That sort of thing.


----------



## Post

tonight she has agreed I can look at her phone anytime I like and gave me passwords to all her accounts. she screen shot a note pad with all her user names and passwords. two things I got passwords for her home surveillance cameras and bank account on there I didn't ask for it, but could be useful in tracking her. I downloaded the surveillance app and can see every thing going on at her house. I can see all her entry doors and her driveway entry. (im going to watch my son on it)

I've read on here people put a gps tracking thing on cars but I think that's a little much for now but what you guys think. Ive told her I got a lot of trust to build. she has had no issues answering or giving me any info I want. we going to give this a chance. I know ive been warned. ill keep everyone posted.


----------



## Post

StillSearching said:


> Get the book "The Rational Male". Read it. Be ready, strong, and informed.
> It can changes everything. You will understand her and her behavior and how to respond to it.


Ive read this in the past and been on the authors blog.


----------



## farsidejunky

Post said:


> tonight she has agreed I can look at her phone anytime I like and gave me passwords to all her accounts. she screen shot a note pad with all her user names and passwords. two things I got passwords for her home surveillance cameras and bank account on there I didn't ask for it, but could be useful in tracking her. I downloaded the surveillance app and can see every thing going on at her house. I can see all her entry doors and her driveway entry. (im going to watch my son on it)
> 
> 
> 
> I've read on here people put a gps tracking thing on cars but I think that's a little much for now but what you guys think. Ive told her I got a lot of trust to build. she has had no issues answering or giving me any info I want. we going to give this a chance. I know ive been warned. ill keep everyone posted.


Listen to yourself for just a moment...

You are already preparing to spy when she hasn't technically done anything to you...at least not in the last some-odd years.

Is this how you envision a life with her? Being her warden?

How utterly exhausting. 

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


----------



## Post

farsidejunky said:


> Listen to yourself for just a moment...
> 
> You are already preparing to spy when she hasn't technically done anything to you...at least not in the last some-odd years.
> 
> Is this how you envision a life with her? Being her warden?
> 
> How utterly exhausting.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


its this site giving me doubt and pushing me to be like this. Ill be honest if I set more rules in my previous relationships maybe I would not be in situation I'm in today


----------



## StillSearching

Post said:


> Ive read this in the past and been on the authors blog.


Then why are you so Blue Pill?


----------



## 3Xnocharm

UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> Eh, I don't know why your self esteem is so low you want to get back with someone that treated you like trash. Now she is contrite after she was tossed away like trash by her AP? Go figure, you are her security blanket... You can do better if you so choose.


Agree. I feel like this is just an all around BAD idea and my advice is to NOT do this.


----------



## BluesPower

Post said:


> its this site giving me doubt and pushing me to be like this. Ill be honest if I set more rules in my previous relationships maybe I would not be in situation I'm in today


I think what a lot of people are saying is... Why go back there at all? 

Why put yourself through any of this? Which is a good question...

I know that you have been taking your time with her. I get that you are trying to be careful. 

Maybe it will all work out? 

Now, like you say... If she has changed, If she is a different person, If she is someone that you could maybe trust with your heart a little... Well maybe it will be OK. 

I would not invest much for a really long time, like YEARS and never marry her again, ever...


----------



## StillSearching

Post said:


> its this site giving me doubt and pushing me to be like this. Ill be honest if I set more rules in my previous relationships maybe I would not be in situation I'm in today


No need to set rules at this point.
No need to point fingers at a forum, per se.
You are who you believe you are, and you are who she perceives you to be.
Be a better you, for you, and it will fall into place.


----------



## MattMatt

Post said:


> note well taken. how does one get access to polygraph


Search Google for local polygraph experts.

I think that there are possibly unresolved issues between the two of you.

Therefore I would recommend counselling both as individuals and as a couple.


----------



## Post

StillSearching said:


> Then why are you so Blue Pill?


once you go off the red pill path its no coming back, you are just imitating the red pill supplier after you have been cheated on. Once you have been cheated on or dumped by a person you are no longer red pill. i assume i could go from a 5 to a 2 and become the 2s red pill, but im still a blue pill because the 10 will not have me


----------



## BarbedFenceRider

I say....You guys already have a working relationship of sorts. Why rock the boat. I think the millenial term is FWB.... I say, let it ride for awhile and after a period of months to a year, then you can re-evaluate if adding more *commitment is something you BOTH desire. I think you are old enough to see the forest from the trees.

In other words...."Bang away" and proceed with caution Will Robinson.


----------



## UpsideDownWorld11

Post said:


> StillSearching said:
> 
> 
> 
> Then why are you so Blue Pill?
> 
> 
> 
> once you go off the red pill path its no coming back, you are just imitating the red pill supplier after you have been cheated on. Once you have been cheated on or dumped by a person you are no longer red pill. i assume i could go from a 5 to a 2 and become the 2s red pill, but im still a blue pill because the 10 will not have me
Click to expand...

That sounds very deep, but I have no clue what it means.


----------



## WorkingWife

Post said:


> tonight she has agreed I can look at her phone anytime I like and gave me passwords to all her accounts. she screen shot a note pad with all her user names and passwords. two things I got passwords for her home surveillance cameras and bank account on there I didn't ask for it, but could be useful in tracking her. I downloaded the surveillance app and can see every thing going on at her house. I can see all her entry doors and her driveway entry. (im going to watch my son on it)
> 
> I've read on here people put a gps tracking thing on cars but I think that's a little much for now but what you guys think. Ive told her I got a lot of trust to build. she has had no issues answering or giving me any info I want. we going to give this a chance. I know ive been warned. ill keep everyone posted.


Good luck to you! I'm hopeful and excited for you two. 

You might also want to check out the book "Surviving an Affair" by Willard Harley because it has a check list of things to do and ways to handle a relationship where you have good boundaries that prevent the opportunity from arising in the first place, plus good habits (like spending a lot of time together) that help keep your connection to each other strong and satisfying. 

Some of the things the book recommends -- like sharing passwords and being able to look at your spouses phone, email, etc. anytime seem over the top/invasive to many. But if neither of you has anything to hide, they can be reassuring. And it sounds like you're planning some of them anyhow.

Regarding GPS tracking, you don't have to put a device on her car. Just use the "find my phone" feature if you have iPhones, share your locations through contacts, or download a phone app that does this. You can look up where the other is at any time. Personally, I like the idea that my guy can find out where I am. What if I need help? I usually have no idea where I am, LOL. He'd be able to come save me based on my GPS location. It's also great if you have teenage kids for keeping track of each others whereabouts.


----------



## WorkingWife

farsidejunky said:


> Listen to yourself for just a moment...
> 
> You are already preparing to spy when she hasn't technically done anything to you...at least not in the last some-odd years.
> 
> Is this how you envision a life with her? Being her warden?
> 
> How utterly exhausting.


Um... it's not "SPYING" it's "AUTHORIZED SURVEILLANCE!" ;-)

Seriously though, I know a lot of people think you must be are horrified at the idea of reading a spouses emails or knowing their location at all times. But for a lot of others, it's just normal. I can't imagine having passwords my spouse doesn't know, or not wanting to share my location. 

For some, it would be exhausting to think "I need to go check on her." but for others it can be comforting to know you can at any time, expecially if there was duplicity in the past. And it can be a helpful for proper handling of any interactions with members of the opposite sex if you know your spouse *could *be reading what you say.


----------



## Noble1

Hey there. From what you have posted it seems like you are in control of "this" relationship so far.

One thing I need to point out, which I'm sure you already know, is that many posters on here have their own stories which impact what they advise and such.

For me, I do feel that people can change if they really want to and if your ex-wife has gone through some hard times she may have indeed changed for the better.

It may be that your ex is looking at the past with "rose colored" glasses due to the fact that it may have been her first "serious" relationship and is fondly remembering your past together.

As you have mentioned, I see no large issues with the both of you keeping a "casual" type relationship as long it works for you.

Sounds like you know enough to protect yourself now so enjoy what you can and do what is best for you.

Good luck.


----------



## BluesPower

WorkingWife said:


> Um... it's not "SPYING" it's "AUTHORIZED SURVEILLANCE!" ;-)
> 
> Seriously though, I know a lot of people think you must be are horrified at the idea of reading a spouses emails or knowing their location at all times. But for a lot of others, it's just normal. I can't imagine having passwords my spouse doesn't know, or not wanting to share my location.
> 
> For some, it would be exhausting to think "I need to go check on her." but for others it can be comforting to know you can at any time, expecially if there was duplicity in the past. And it can be a helpful for proper handling of any interactions with members of the opposite sex if you know your spouse *could *be reading what you say.


I actually agree with all of this. I am this way and expect any serious women that I am with to be the same. 

I guess for this OP, I am just worried, but it really could work out, which would be cool. 

For me, if we are together, then we are together. You should know where I am at and what time I am coming home if we are not together. 

I want to know when to expect her so I wont worry, because (sorry) her driving scares the **** out of me. 

I hope this works out...


----------



## OnTheFly

BluesPower said:


> I want to know when to expect her so I wont worry, because (sorry) her driving scares the **** out of me.


Dude....fist bump on that one!


----------



## WorkingWife

BluesPower said:


> I want to know when to expect her so I wont worry, because (sorry) her driving scares the **** out of me.


LOL. I won't say *women *are bad drivers, but I will say *I* am the female driver that stereotype was based on. I know my driving scares the hell out of my BF. Apparently watching me back up is *extremely* troubling. hahaha. Sorry sister drivers. 0


----------



## OnTheFly

WorkingWife said:


> BluesPower said:
> 
> 
> 
> I want to know when to expect her so I wont worry, because (sorry) her driving scares the **** out of me.
> 
> 
> 
> LOL. I won't say *women *are bad drivers, but I will say *I* am the female driver that stereotype was based on. I know my driving scares the hell out of my BF. Apparently watching me back up is *extremely* troubling. hahaha. Sorry sister drivers. <a href="http://talkaboutmarriage.com/images/TAMarriage_2015/smilies/tango_face_angel.png" border="0" alt="" title="Angel" ></a>
Click to expand...

Takes courage to admit that, kudos, and as G.I. Joe says, “knowing is half the battle!”

Now, go get some driver’s Ed, soldier!


----------



## WorkingWife

OnTheFly said:


> Takes courage to admit that, kudos, and as G.I. Joe says, “knowing is half the battle!”
> 
> Now, go get some driver’s Ed, soldier!


Actually, my BF is a "professional driver" in that he races 3 wheelers. He's given me some tips that are helpful already, and I plan to see if he can help with certain skills -- like backing up, parking, pulling a trailer (if absolutely necessary), understanding where the parts of my car that I can't see due to my height are, etc. BUT - can he ever give me depth perception? Or a sense of direction? Will I ever stop being spacey? Mmmmm... you have to pick your battles.


----------



## She'sStillGotIt

What's that saying?

*"It's called a breakup because it's broken."*


----------



## She'sStillGotIt

Post said:


> tonight she has agreed I can look at her phone anytime I like and gave me passwords to all her accounts. she screen shot a note pad with all her user names and passwords. two things I got passwords for her home surveillance cameras and bank account on there I didn't ask for it, but could be useful in tracking her. I downloaded the surveillance app and can see every thing going on at her house. I can see all her entry doors and her driveway entry. (im going to watch my son on it)


I'm just curious as to why ANYONE would want to resort to this *ridiculous *behavior of having to become the relationship police and having to monitor everything their UNTRUSTWORTHY 'partner' does because she's a known liar?

Is your lying, cheating ex the *only* woman in a 600 mile radius from you, OP? Is that why you're willing to settle for so precious little?

I don't get it.


----------



## manwithnoname

She's exhausted all her options and has come back to a good ole scratching Post.


----------



## StillSearching

Post said:


> once you go off the red pill path its no coming back, you are just imitating the red pill supplier after you have been cheated on. Once you have been cheated on or dumped by a person you are no longer red pill. i assume i could go from a 5 to a 2 and become the 2s red pill, but im still a blue pill because the 10 will not have me


You can always go to reality. (Red Pill)
If your a 8 don't look for a 10. 
There's no way you could keep her in your frame. 
Look for a 7 and stay in your frame.
Improve yourself.
The red pill is not for her, it's for you. 
Have a good idea of your SMV. 
You sound like you have no clue. 
Blue Pill will not help you find it.


----------



## personofinterest

UpsideDownWorld11 said:


> Post said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> StillSearching said:
> 
> 
> 
> Then why are you so Blue Pill?
> 
> 
> 
> once you go off the red pill path its no coming back, you are just imitating the red pill supplier after you have been cheated on. Once you have been cheated on or dumped by a person you are no longer red pill. i assume i could go from a 5 to a 2 and become the 2s red pill, but im still a blue pill because the 10 will not have me
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> That sounds very deep, but I have no clue what it means.
Click to expand...

 Nothing having to do with the red pill has any depths. So no, it's not deep.


----------



## StillSearching

personofinterest said:


> Nothing having to do with the red pill has any depths. So no, it's not deep.


That's the truth!
The truth is never deep.
Red Pill is right on the surface.


----------



## Andy1001

What I see is a woman facing into her forties with a lifetime of failed marriages, and relationships with men who didn’t hang round for long when they got what they wanted.
So all of a sudden Post is looking like a good plan B. 
Because that’s all you will ever be to her, plan B.
Now if you feel that this is as good as you’re going to get then maybe give her a whirl. But always remember that you missed out on her best and most attractive years, she was giving her young twenty something body to other men while you looked after the child. You are not what she wants in a man. But she’s hitting forty and her days of attracting hot younger guys are coming to an end.
You see yourself as finally in control of her which you probably prayed for when she left. She’s back begging you for a second chance and you see yourself as a “catch” finally.
You are not a catch, you are plan B.
Never be plan B.


----------



## Post

StillSearching said:


> You can always go to reality. (Red Pill)
> If your a 8 don't look for a 10.
> There's no way you could keep her in your frame.
> Look for a 7 and stay in your frame.
> Improve yourself.
> The red pill is not for her, it's for you.
> Have a good idea of your SMV.
> You sound like you have no clue.
> Blue Pill will not help you find it.


I don’t know my smv but I’d easily say I’m better looking then both her other partners. One dude was old and dorky other dude was straight up fat and ugly. I’m 10 to 20 years younger better looking and financials better then both guys. Some times I think that’s why the sex with them don’t bother me. I know I’m better in bed. She said 2nd husband was more of what Andy1001 described. I find her extremely attractive So I don’t see how I’m getting the bad end of the deal. Getting good sex and home cooked meals I’ll take that, if she leaves oh well let her go.


----------



## farsidejunky

WorkingWife said:


> Um... it's not "SPYING" it's "AUTHORIZED SURVEILLANCE!" ;-)
> 
> 
> 
> Seriously though, I know a lot of people think you must be are horrified at the idea of reading a spouses emails or knowing their location at all times. But for a lot of others, it's just normal. I can't imagine having passwords my spouse doesn't know, or not wanting to share my location.
> 
> 
> 
> For some, it would be exhausting to think "I need to go check on her." but for others it can be comforting to know you can at any time, expecially if there was duplicity in the past. And it can be a helpful for proper handling of any interactions with members of the opposite sex if you know your spouse *could *be reading what you say.


Heh.

I actually don't disagree with any of this.

That said, when entering a new relationship (or new/old as it were) and he is already lining up his surveillance methods?

Nah. If I felt it had to be that way, I wouldn't get back together with her. 



Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


----------



## skerzoid

Post

This is a tough crowd here. You aren't going to get much encouragement here I'm afraid.

But what the hell, you say she's hot, and a good cook? You go in with your eyes open, monitor all you want, and have a good time. If she cheats again, you know the possibilities. You know what she's capable of.

With today's attitudes, nobody gives a **** whether you are married or just living together, so what the hell. 

I'll bet she finds you a lot more attractive if you just treat her like a girl friend that you can dump on impulse. Just keep the upper hand. If she doesn't like that....well then, tell her not to let the door hit her in the ass on the way out. She should be the one scared that you'll dump her. Keep it that way.


----------



## Casual Observer

Post said:


> I don’t know my smv but I’d easily say I’m better looking then both her other partners. One dude was old and dorky other dude was straight up fat and ugly. I’m 10 to 20 years younger better looking and financials better then both guys. Some times I think that’s why the sex with them don’t bother me. I know I’m better in bed. She said 2nd husband was more of what Andy1001 described. I find her extremely attractive So I don’t see how I’m getting the bad end of the deal. Getting good sex and home cooked meals I’ll take that, if she leaves oh well let her go.


Sounds like you’re saying the damage has already been done (and dealt with) so not much downside. Both of you are damaged goods, and maybe it doesn’t really matter how you got there (that it was her fault) but you’re both older and wiser and able to get past the past. 

If there’s ever a need to exploit a moral high ground, you have it. But it’s also personally empowering to feel you don’t and likely won’t need to because as I said, not much downside here if you walk away but potentially lots of upside. 

And it not only sounds like a cute story but also sounds like a story that you want to be a part of. 

Getting back together with her will never pass muster here on TAM though. It would fly in the face of a lot of well-intentioned and nearly-always-correct advice to protect your pride & ego and stand up to those who treat marriage vows like a parking ticket with a rental car. 

If things work out, you need to come back and tell the story. You owe it to the few romantics of TAM. You’ll get a lot of crap from people saying you’re delusional and ignoring the warning signs. And they might be right. But what if they’re wrong?


----------



## She'sStillGotIt

Post said:


> tonight she has agreed I can look at her phone anytime I like and gave me passwords to all her accounts. she screen shot a note pad with all her user names and passwords. two things I got passwords for her home surveillance cameras and bank account on there I didn't ask for it, but could be useful in tracking her. I downloaded the surveillance app and can see every thing going on at her house. I can see all her entry doors and her driveway entry. (im going to watch my son on it).


Well THAT sounds like the romance of the century to me. 

I guess you're *unfamiliar *with sneaky liars owning burner phones? 

Or cheaters who use apps every day by installing them when they leave in the morning and then uninstalling them before they get home from work every day?

You do know there are lots of apps out there that let you talk, text and chat _within_ these apps using WiFi - which means she's *not* using her phone's calling or texting features, which means there is NO history of foul play on her cell phone bill.

Are you aware that cheaters can get various other phone numbers from Google Voice for instance, so calls can be routed elsewhere and not to their cell phone when they're at home?

Are you familiar with app utilities that let you HIDE apps that are installed on your phone so anyone going through your phone with a fine-tooth comb will NOT see whatever app you've chosen to hide from view? You could have Tinder installed but these hiding apps will literally hide all traces of it so you ca go through her phone til the cows come home and STILL never see it.

I could go on and on but you get the message.

And sadly, the message here is that it's a cheater's world. There are far too many sneaky ways to get away with bad behavior, now. So the point I'm making is BIG DEAL that she's given you 'full access' to her phone. That means *absolutely nothing* anymore.

I'm sorry, but I'm just being honest.


----------



## She'sStillGotIt

Post said:


> I don’t know my smv but I’d easily say I’m better looking then both her other partners. One dude was old and dorky other dude was straight up fat and ugly. I’m 10 to 20 years younger better looking and financials better then both guys. Some times I think that’s why the sex with them don’t bother me. I know I’m better in bed. She said 2nd husband was more of what Andy1001 described. I find her extremely attractive So I don’t see how I’m getting the bad end of the deal. Getting good sex and home cooked meals I’ll take that, if she leaves oh well let her go.


How long did it take to delude yourself into thinking she's a 'good deal?'

Seriously? How long did it take?

How long did it take to chip away at every single boundary you've ever had, to lower every single expectation you ever had in a woman, and to mow down every single flapping red flag attached to this opportunist before you were finally able to convince yourself that ANY part of this woman is a *good* idea?

I will say that Casual Observer makes a salient point - this could end up being the better-late-than-never true love story of the century and we doomer and gloomers of TAM need to sit back and shut up. >

I really hope it does work out for you this time around, Post. I just think that you're WAY too good for someone this low down the food chain, but that's just my opinion...it's your life and your choice.


----------



## StillSearching

Post said:


> I don’t know my smv but I’d easily say I’m better looking then both her other partners. One dude was old and dorky other dude was straight up fat and ugly. I’m 10 to 20 years younger better looking and financials better then both guys. Some times I think that’s why the sex with them don’t bother me. I know I’m better in bed. She said 2nd husband was more of what Andy1001 described. I find her extremely attractive So I don’t see how I’m getting the bad end of the deal.* Getting good sex and home cooked meals I’ll take that, if she leaves oh well let her go*.


Ok, good!
I didn't get that feel from your post at first at all.


----------



## Openminded

Hope your son doesn't emotionally invest too much in this.


----------



## skerzoid

Openminded said:


> Hope your son doesn't emotionally invest too much in this.


That would be my only concern here, and it's a *BIG ONE*. Ask him how he would feel about it if you two got back together. And, I would ask her if she is ready to be a *REAL* mother again. 

Otherwise, you're a big boy now. You've gotten plenty of warnings about why you shouldn't, so I would go in with an attitude that the burden is all on her. 

But I would still *POLY* her and make that a condition of her coming back into you and your son's life. If she's serious about this, she should *JUMP* at the chance to prove herself.


----------

