# Trying to pull the trigger



## Busy Washing My Hair

I’m considering a divorce but have not been able to pull the trigger quite yet.

In Canada you can be granted a divorce based on the following grounds:
-Separated for a year
-One of you committed adultery 
-Your spouse has inflicted physical and/mental harm to you

So my only option right now is 1 year separation. Cleanest way to do it is to live separately. I’ve looked into apartments many times and at this moment I’d love nothing more to move out but financially it’s not realistic for me. I’m still in the home loan so would be responsible for contributing to that plus rent and utilities in an apartment, which I cannot afford.

We can be separated but live under the same roof, but it’s just trickier and certain conditions must be met. I hate the idea of being stuck here for a year but it’s probably the smartest option so I can focus on trying to save some money. I’m thinking of meeting with a lawyer to discuss it so I make sure I meet all conditions and the court will agree that we are separated.

Next is the financial difficulties I will face. As of today I have $500 to my name. We have no savings, no retirement, and while we do own our home I don’t want anything to do with it and am basically prepared to agree to let my husband decide about what happens with the house as long as I don’t get screwed or left on the hook in the end. I don’t want it and I can’t afford it on my own anyway.

I have been toying with the idea for about 6 months but within the past 2 weeks I’ve gotten very serious about it. Last week I told my husband I wanted a divorce and I meant it but then a few days later I told him I loved him and wanted to stay married. I don’t know why I went back on what I said. I’m scared. I can’t make up my mind. He’s the only person I really have and don’t want to lose him but at the same time he’s a horrible husband for me and I’m probably not what he wants for a wife either.

I don’t know why I’m posting this, but I have nobody in real life to talk to about it. I’m hoping if I just start talking about it like I’m really going to do it that I will finally make a move and take some action.

If anyone in Canadian has any experience with separation and divorce, any tips to share, please let me know.


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## Rob_1

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> and while we do own our home I don’t want anything to do with it and am basically prepared to agree to let my husband decide about what happens with the house as long as I don’t get screwed or left on the hook in the end.


The smartest thing to do would be to force a sell on the house, and split the proceeds as per Canada's bylaws.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

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## BecauseSheWeeps

I'm sorry that you are going through this. It's a really tough thing to do but you will be able to overcome it, I promise!


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## Casual Observer

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m considering a divorce but have not been able to pull the trigger quite yet.
> 
> In Canada you can be granted a divorce based on the following grounds:
> -Separated for a year
> -One of you committed adultery
> -Your spouse has inflicted physical and/mental harm to you
> 
> So my only option right now is 1 year separation. Cleanest way to do it is to live separately. I’ve looked into apartments many times and at this moment I’d love nothing more to move out but financially it’s not realistic for me. I’m still in the home loan so would be responsible for contributing to that plus rent and utilities in an apartment, which I cannot afford.
> 
> We can be separated but live under the same roof, but it’s just trickier and certain conditions must be met. I hate the idea of being stuck here for a year but it’s probably the smartest option so I can focus on trying to save some money. I’m thinking of meeting with a lawyer to discuss it so I make sure I meet all conditions and the court will agree that we are separated.
> 
> Next is the financial difficulties I will face. As of today I have $500 to my name. We have no savings, no retirement, and while we do own our home I don’t want anything to do with it and am basically prepared to agree to let my husband decide about what happens with the house as long as I don’t get screwed or left on the hook in the end. I don’t want it and I can’t afford it on my own anyway.
> 
> I have been toying with the idea for about 6 months but within the past 2 weeks I’ve gotten very serious about it. Last week I told my husband I wanted a divorce and I meant it but then a few days later I told him I loved him and wanted to stay married. I don’t know why I went back on what I said. I’m scared. I can’t make up my mind. He’s the only person I really have and don’t want to lose him but at the same time he’s a horrible husband for me and I’m probably not what he wants for a wife either.
> 
> I don’t know why I’m posting this, but I have nobody in real life to talk to about it. I’m hoping if I just start talking about it like I’m really going to do it that I will finally make a move and take some action.
> 
> If anyone in Canadian has any experience with separation and divorce, any tips to share, please let me know.


I think you need a better therapist before pulling the trigger on anything. Being all over the map is not something cured by divorce. Or a relationship. You need to understand why all the flip-flopping first, and find a way through or past it.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

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## Casual Observer

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> A better therapist? I don’t even have a bad one.
> I don’t have one at all currently.
> 
> I should probably get a therapist but either way I know my marriage isn’t good. I’m not sexually attracted to my husband and I never have been! I don’t enjoy sex with him at all. We fight all the time. He has a ton of issues and all of the therapy in the world that I do won’t fix his problems. He barely ticks any of the boxes in what I’ve realized I need from a man and in a marriage.After years of denial and then confusion I finally admitted to myself that I want a child. I told myself I ok not being a mom. I just can’t envision my husband being the kind of father I dream of for my kids. So I told myself I was ok not having children. Nope I realized I was lying to myself and I’ll be very upset at myself if I get old and have no kids and realize it was all my fault because I let myself stay with a man who won’t make a good dad.


It's really tough for someone reading your threads to know how many of your husband's issues are native to him or reactive to you. It's also really tough to get a clue as to whether your lack of sexual attraction to him will carry over to others; worst-case scenario is you thinking everything's fine, nothing could possibly be worse than before, and then... and you want a child with whomever that next person is, drastically raising the stakes and responsibilities. 

And no therapist or shrink to help you figure things out. Yikes. You are very intelligent and often grasp concepts that others find difficult. Yet there is no clarity for you in your own world. 

It is 100% normal to have some fear of major change (like divorce) and cognitive dissonance associated with it. As in, what if I'm making a mistake. Normal. But that's not how you express yourself here. It's not fear of divorce; it's just different thinking on different days. Nothing cumulatively learned or taken comfort from. That's not normal. That's why, I think, you need some professional help before doing anything final. I'm not a professional, this is just my thinking.


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## uwe.blab

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> A better therapist? I don’t even have a bad one.
> I don’t have one at all currently.
> 
> I should probably get a therapist but either way I know my marriage isn’t good. I’m not sexually attracted to my husband and I never have been! I don’t enjoy sex with him at all. We fight all the time. He has a ton of issues and all of the therapy in the world that I do won’t fix his problems. He barely ticks any of the boxes in what I’ve realized I need from a man and in a marriage.After years of denial and then confusion I finally admitted to myself that I want a child. I told myself I ok not being a mom. I just can’t envision my husband being the kind of father I dream of for my kids. So I told myself I was ok not having children. Nope I realized I was lying to myself and I’ll be very upset at myself if I get old and have no kids and realize it was all my fault because I let myself stay with a man who won’t make a good dad.


So these are some of your reasons you want to move on. Clearly not happy, makes sense. I have the problem of convincing myself I will be ok with things that I am not too certain about, then finding out I am in fact NOT happy. So I get it. 

how old are the two of you? how long have you been married?


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## Busy Washing My Hair

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## Busy Washing My Hair

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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m considering a divorce but have not been able to pull the trigger quite yet.
> 
> In Canada you can be granted a divorce based on the following grounds:
> -Separated for a year
> -One of you committed adultery
> -Your spouse has inflicted physical and/mental harm to you
> 
> So my only option right now is 1 year separation. Cleanest way to do it is to live separately. I’ve looked into apartments many times and at this moment I’d love nothing more to move out but financially it’s not realistic for me. I’m still in the home loan so would be responsible for contributing to that plus rent and utilities in an apartment, which I cannot afford.
> 
> We can be separated but live under the same roof, but it’s just trickier and certain conditions must be met. I hate the idea of being stuck here for a year but it’s probably the smartest option so I can focus on trying to save some money. I’m thinking of meeting with a lawyer to discuss it so I make sure I meet all conditions and the court will agree that we are separated.
> 
> Next is the financial difficulties I will face. As of today I have $500 to my name. We have no savings, no retirement, and while we do own our home I don’t want anything to do with it and am basically prepared to agree to let my husband decide about what happens with the house as long as I don’t get screwed or left on the hook in the end. I don’t want it and I can’t afford it on my own anyway.
> 
> I have been toying with the idea for about 6 months but within the past 2 weeks I’ve gotten very serious about it. Last week I told my husband I wanted a divorce and I meant it but then a few days later I told him I loved him and wanted to stay married. I don’t know why I went back on what I said. I’m scared. I can’t make up my mind. He’s the only person I really have and don’t want to lose him but at the same time he’s a horrible husband for me and I’m probably not what he wants for a wife either.
> 
> I don’t know why I’m posting this, but I have nobody in real life to talk to about it. I’m hoping if I just start talking about it like I’m really going to do it that I will finally make a move and take some action.
> 
> If anyone in Canadian has any experience with separation and divorce, any tips to share, please let me know.


Just remember going back and forth with H on this will make the whole situation ten times worse. I think you're on the right track.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

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## Casual Observer

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> My husband has clinical depression, PTSD, a few differently diagnosed forms of anxiety, and is in the spectrum. He has issues that have nothing to do with me.
> 
> In saying that, I can guarantee you that I’m not the wife he dreamed of. I don’t think he’s attracted to me anymore (I think he used to be). I don’t think he likes me and there are legitimate things about me that he definitely had a right to dislike and probably should dislike. I’ve not been a great wife to him and he’s not been a great husband to me. Neither of us respects the other.
> 
> I will not jump right into a relationship with any man who will give me a child. I have very specific things I’m looking for in a man and crave a man like what I’m dreaming of. I’m also sort of ok with just being alone forever if I can’t find a man who fits the bill. I rather do that than settle again.


It’s amazing how much you know about your husband but not yourself. You have an awareness of the ravages of mental health issues, but so far, you have steadfastly avoided help yourself. In general the case will be made that a partner of someone with mental health issues will likely benefit from therapy.

It’s your life, you can do things in whatever order you wish, or not do therapy at all. But I have to believe getting clarity before you do something could benefit you going forward. It might also be of help to your husband, who’s got to be seriously confused by all this.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

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## Busy Washing My Hair

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## Casual Observer

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I can work on therapy during the enforced year of separation. If we change our minds for some reason we can end the separation and not proceed with divorce.


That sounds like a good plan!


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## Busy Washing My Hair

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## Rob_1

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m 34. We’ve been married for about 4 years but together around 12 years.


I just don't know what it is, but almost every time that I read about dissolution of marriages a big percentage of them are of people that were for many years together > 5 and then they marry, just to get divorce in just a couple or few years.

I have not idea what the statistics on that are, but you fit in there. You guys were together for at least 8 years together before marriage. I'm wondering what made you to marry? these issues had to be there long before you married. So, have you thought and analyzed what made you marry him knowing/having already all these issues? I would be curious to know what causes people in long term relationships to marry their partner when all those issues must already be present.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

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## QuietRiot

Can you rent the house out for a year and split whatever you make on it above the mortgage, and live apart for a year? 

Is there an option for legal separation in the mean time?

Its not very kind to tell someone you want a divorce and then take it back… you need more of a plan and way of working with him to carry it out. Maybe he would be relieved that you want to do it in an amicable manner and if he had input into how it’s done. 

I second the need for IC though. You really should talk to someone about how you ended up in this position and confront the toxic aspects that you added to the marriage.


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## Diana7

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m considering a divorce but have not been able to pull the trigger quite yet.
> 
> In Canada you can be granted a divorce based on the following grounds:
> -Separated for a year
> -One of you committed adultery
> -Your spouse has inflicted physical and/mental harm to you
> 
> So my only option right now is 1 year separation. Cleanest way to do it is to live separately. I’ve looked into apartments many times and at this moment I’d love nothing more to move out but financially it’s not realistic for me. I’m still in the home loan so would be responsible for contributing to that plus rent and utilities in an apartment, which I cannot afford.
> 
> We can be separated but live under the same roof, but it’s just trickier and certain conditions must be met. I hate the idea of being stuck here for a year but it’s probably the smartest option so I can focus on trying to save some money. I’m thinking of meeting with a lawyer to discuss it so I make sure I meet all conditions and the court will agree that we are separated.
> 
> Next is the financial difficulties I will face. As of today I have $500 to my name. We have no savings, no retirement, and while we do own our home I don’t want anything to do with it and am basically prepared to agree to let my husband decide about what happens with the house as long as I don’t get screwed or left on the hook in the end. I don’t want it and I can’t afford it on my own anyway.
> 
> I have been toying with the idea for about 6 months but within the past 2 weeks I’ve gotten very serious about it. Last week I told my husband I wanted a divorce and I meant it but then a few days later I told him I loved him and wanted to stay married. I don’t know why I went back on what I said. I’m scared. I can’t make up my mind. He’s the only person I really have and don’t want to lose him but at the same time he’s a horrible husband for me and I’m probably not what he wants for a wife either.
> 
> I don’t know why I’m posting this, but I have nobody in real life to talk to about it. I’m hoping if I just start talking about it like I’m really going to do it that I will finally make a move and take some action.
> 
> If anyone in Canadian has any experience with separation and divorce, any tips to share, please let me know.


Can't you sell the house and have half the profit each? That would give you money for rent. 
You can also live in a house share.


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## Casual Observer

QuietRiot said:


> Its not very kind to tell someone you want a divorce and then take it back… you need more of a plan and way of working with him to carry it out. Maybe he would be relieved that you want to do it in an amicable manner and if he had input into how it’s done.
> 
> I second the need for IC though. You really should talk to someone about how you ended up in this position and confront the toxic aspects that you added to the marriage.


It's not mean or unkind if your partner knows what the plan is. If he understands there's a feeling they aren't good for each other (she claims this is the case) and that divorce makes sense, but the process takes a year and if, in the meantime, something changes... if her own therapy is in some way revealing and there is a path forward in which staying married makes sense, then they can call off the divorce.. if both agree at that time that it makes sense to do so. 

I don't think she's mean or unkind in intention, ever. At the same time, I don't think she is really aware of the baggage she brings to any relationship, not just this one. I think she really underestimates her own sexual issues and how whatever core lies underneath all that doesn't change with a new partner. She could be sexually happy, along with her partner, for a while, only to later discover it was a house built on hopium, a desire (perhaps unintentional) to see the dynamics of the prior marriage as the problem, and she finds herself back where she started, only with a kid added to the relationship this time. Sexually, she just doesn't add up. 

Much better to go through therapy now than after another relationship has started.


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## QuietRiot

Casual Observer said:


> It's not mean or unkind if your partner knows what the plan is. If he understands there's a feeling they aren't good for each other (she claims this is the case) and that divorce makes sense, but the process takes a year and if, in the meantime, something changes... if her own therapy is in some way revealing and there is a path forward in which staying married makes sense, then they can call off the divorce.. if both agree at that time that it makes sense to do so.
> 
> I don't think she's mean or unkind in intention, ever. At the same time, I don't think she is really aware of the baggage she brings to any relationship, not just this one. I think she really underestimates her own sexual issues and how whatever core lies underneath all that doesn't change with a new partner. She could be sexually happy, along with her partner, for a while, only to later discover it was a house built on hopium, a desire (perhaps unintentional) to see the dynamics of the prior marriage as the problem, and she finds herself back where she started, only with a kid added to the relationship this time. Sexually, she just doesn't add up.
> 
> Much better to go through therapy now than after another relationship has started.


Hm, I didn’t mean she was unkind, whatever their issues are. I think it is unkind to do though…throw out divorce for a week then beg them back, only to consider doing it again. I don’t think she is overtly doing that to be mean or nasty, she is just torn and confused. Sorry for the poor wording.


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## Openminded

I can see how your flip-flop actions would confuse him. Throw out divorce one day and take it back the next. The one smart thing you’ve done is not bring a child into this dysfunction. But you do want one and, fair or not, he very likely can have a child for decades more whenever he decides to and you can’t. So I suggest you start working on divorce so the two of you can move on.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

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## Busy Washing My Hair

I’m also coming to realize that I think there may be a very sexual person inside me that’s just never found a man who turned her on or could satisfy her. I’m desperate to find a guy who I’m sexually attracted to and who I love having sex with. The more I think about it the hornier I get. When you’re contemplating cheating our your spouse because you’re so horny and want to experience what enjoyable sex actually feels like, it’s time to cut and run. Sex is not the top priority. I have a LIST of wants and needs in a man, but everything on the list equals what actually arouses me. I’m talking about so much more than physical characteristics. I simply don’t think my husband will ever be that man for me. It’d be asking for him to change into a totally different person. He does not have the qualities that I want and need in a man, especially a husband and father of my future children. I don’t say that to fault him. It’s just the truth. I don’t think I possess the qualities that he wants in a wife either.


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## ccpowerslave

So with respect to kids. I think I was 24 or 25 when I got married, I forget because I am in the sports book watching the Giants Dodgers game and I need Dodgers to win by 2 runs.

Anyway…

I always thought she would someday get pregnant and she did too.

Around early 30s we were like hey wait a second… we could keep all the money and time for ourselves MUHAHAHAH…. So we did that instead and then bought a lot of exotic luxury items and travel. We don’t feel bad about it.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

ccpowerslave said:


> So with respect to kids. I think I was 24 or 25 when I got married, I forget because I am in the sports book watching the Giants Dodgers game and I need Dodgers to win by 2 runs.
> 
> Anyway…
> 
> I always thought she would someday get pregnant and she did too.
> 
> Around early 30s we were like hey wait a second… we could keep all the money and time for ourselves MUHAHAHAH…. So we did that instead and then bought a lot of exotic luxury items and travel. We don’t feel bad about it.


Which is perfectly fine. There is nothing wrong with not wanting children and being happy with that decision. I do not believe that everybody wants kids and that those who say they don’t are really in denial and will either change their mind one day or regret their decision to not have them. No, some people are truly happier without kids.

My husband and I always talked about our future children earlier in our relationship. It was sort of a given we planned to have some. Then we’ve just had a lot of struggles, both to do with our reltionship and then just related to other life things. We both never felt that it was the right time, that we were ready, that we could afford it, that it was a good idea at all.

It’s not a matter of me saying I didn’t want kids and now changing my mind. I just realized a few years ago that my husband wasn’t what I imagined as the type of father I wanted for my kids. I also couldn’t imagine having a kid around our shared dysfunction either. So I tried to convince myself that I was ok not having children and that I wouldn’t be a good mom anyway, I’d probably just be better off if I avoided it since I knew as long as I was married to my husband it wasn’t a good idea. And I kept telling myself that until finally I couldn’t lie to myself any longer.

My current husband and I will never afford exoctic luxury items and fancy vacations, so even without kids we won’t be doing those things. My next husband must be financially stable and responsible with money.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

It was easy to put off kids for a long time with the idea that “it’ll get better one day.” It’s never gotten better and now I’m in my mid-30s and reality has slapped me in the face and I don’t have much time to put it off any longer.


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## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m not intentionally trying to jerk him around. I’m just confused, conflicted, and scared. I mean, if we get along for a day I think “I want to stay married, we can fix this.” Then he’s mean to me the next day and I also see a guy who I want to bang me into the next millennium and I’m like “oh yeah my husband is mean to me a lot and he also has never made me feel like I want him to bang me into the next millennium.” So then I’m googling divorce lawyers. But really it’s more complicated than that. It’s not normal to want a child but keep yourself from having one because you can’t envision your spouse as the kind of father you want for your kids, is it? Most sane people would leave upon that realization if they hadn’t left already.
> 
> He said he also wasn’t happy. Said we make good friends but lousy spouses. He even said he’d file the appropriate paperwork this week because he “wants me to be happy” but he hasn’t done it yet. He suggested I live in our home until I can afford to move out in my own but then he wants my sh*t out of “his” house. I’m not depending on him to do it. It’s not just me who keeps flip flopping. Neither of us can make up our minds on anything.


This seems more amicable than your relationship, work together with him in a friendly way to get it done. You both seem to be wasting time here.

And no, if you have zero sexual attraction for him and never have I do not think that will ever change. And you don’t think he would make a good father, you want kids and he doesn’t? All these are deal breakers I would think.



Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m also coming to realize that I think there may be a very sexual person inside me that’s just never found a man who turned her on or could satisfy her. I’m desperate to find a guy who I’m sexually attracted to and who I love having sex with. The more I think about it the hornier I get. When you’re contemplating cheating our your spouse because you’re so horny and want to experience what enjoyable sex actually feels like, it’s time to cut and run. Sex is not the top priority. I have a LIST of wants and needs in a man, but everything on the list equals what actually arouses me. I’m talking about so much more than physical characteristics. I simply don’t think my husband will ever be that man for me. It’d be asking for him to change into a totally different person. He does not have the qualities that I want and need in a man, especially a husband and father of my future children. I don’t say that to fault him. It’s just the truth. I don’t think I possess the qualities that he wants in a wife either.


Well, I think you are past convincing me. Cheating is the wrong thing to do at every turn, and everyone who has ever been cheated on wishes the person just asked for a divorce and moved on first. It sounds like all that’s needed at this point is the plan and the action. 

Can you just sit down with him and plan it out together? Here’s what we will do with the house, here is the plan for separating, here is what you take, here is what I take. Let’s fill the paperwork out together tonight, etc.


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## ccpowerslave

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> It was easy to put off kids for a long time with the idea that “it’ll get better one day.” It’s never gotten better and now I’m in my mid-30s and reality has slapped me in the face and I don’t have much time to put it off any longer.


This probably won’t help at all but the Dodgers won by two despite having several friends there who wanted to see me lose just out of pure jealousy. I collected on my ticket.

I wonder about a buddy of mine who is your age. He has a very huge awesome family and is married and he doesn’t have any kids yet. This guy is great with kids, he would be an awesome dad. Still nothing…

My wife and I chose to invest in other people’s kids through an endowment we set up. That way we can help the future but at the same time do no work other than signing checks.


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## Anastasia6

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m not intentionally trying to jerk him around. I’m just confused, conflicted, and scared. I mean, if we get along for a day I think “I want to stay married, we can fix this.” Then he’s mean to me the next day and I also see a guy who I want to bang me into the next millennium and I’m like “oh yeah my husband is mean to me a lot and he also has never made me feel like I want him to bang me into the next millennium.” So then I’m googling divorce lawyers. But really it’s more complicated than that. It’s not normal to want a child but keep yourself from having one because you can’t envision your spouse as the kind of father you want for your kids, is it? Most sane people would leave upon that realization if they hadn’t left already.
> 
> He said he also wasn’t happy. Said we make good friends but lousy spouses. He even said he’d file the appropriate paperwork this week because he “wants me to be happy” but he hasn’t done it yet. He suggested I live in our home until I can afford to move out in my own but then he wants my sh*t out of “his” house. I’m not depending on him to do it. It’s not just me who keeps flip flopping. Neither of us can make up our minds on anything.


And why does he believe it’s his house? Did he own it himself before you two got married? I thought you made more than him. If it isn’t his house but marital property which is my understanding, it is best to sell it to get your name off the deed. Especially since you say he can’t afford it.


I’d go ahead and get it sold move into separate apartments for the separation so that when the divorce comes it’s done and not waiting on all the finances to be done.


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## Luckylucky

Casual Observer said:


> It’s amazing how much you know about your husband but not yourself. You have an awareness of the ravages of mental health issues, but so far, you have steadfastly avoided help yourself. In general the case will be made that a partner of someone with mental health issues will likely benefit from therapy.
> 
> It’s your life, you can do things in whatever order you wish, or not do therapy at all. But I have to believe getting clarity before you do something could benefit you going forward. It might also be of help to your husband, who’s got to be seriously confused by all this.


A therapist/psychologist will usually see that the spouse avoiding therapy (especially where the other has depression and PTSD!!) might be the cause.

Any time I see the dreaded ‘I suppose I should see a therapist, I know I need a therapist’, or claims of therapy isn’t going to help in advance… I’d tell the suffering spouse who is dying mentally and on the inside to leave and never look back. 

What are you worried about exposing in therapy? The truth about you??


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## DownByTheRiver

From some of your earlier posts, it seems like a no-brainer to me that you should get a divorce. He's not respectful of you and he's got problems you can't do anything about. Remember you can always get on the internet and find a roommate. You can also work two jobs for a while or whatever it takes. I don't know how much he contributes or how much he spends but you might even be better off financially without him. But I don't know that.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Anastasia6 said:


> And why does he believe it’s his house? Did he own it himself before you two got married? I thought you made more than him. If it isn’t his house but marital property which is my understanding, it is best to sell it to get your name off the deed. Especially since you say he can’t afford it.
> 
> 
> I’d go ahead and get it sold move into separate apartments for the separation so that when the divorce comes it’s done and not waiting on all the finances to be done.


He pays all of our bills out of his account. He sees him as paying the mortgage even though I send him half of every one of my paychecks to go towards our bills. The house is in both of our names.

I didn’t think of selling the house before a divorce. That’s be much easier on one hand but he’ll have to agree to it of course.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

DownByTheRiver said:


> From some of your earlier posts, it seems like a no-brainer to me that you should get a divorce. He's not respectful of you and he's got problems you can't do anything about. Remember you can always get on the internet and find a roommate. You can also work two jobs for a while or whatever it takes. I don't know how much he contributes or how much he spends but you might even be better off financially without him. But I don't know that.


My current job takes up so much of my time,including nights and weekends, that I don’t know how I’d work another one. I’ll have to leave my primary job first and find 2 new jobs. I am working on maybe finding another job soon but I probably won’t make much more. I just want more time to myself to get stuff done in my life and this job pays me less than $40,000 (Canadian) and had me running all over the city and working whacky schedules and taking up a lot of my free time.

Also need to be able to keep all my pets. It’s my 2 goats I’m most worried about because they are goats and need their outside area.


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## DownByTheRiver

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> He pays all of our bills out of his account. He sees him as paying the mortgage even though I send him half of every one of my paychecks to go towards our bills. The house is in both of our names.
> 
> I didn’t think of selling the house before a divorce. That’s be much easier on one hand but he’ll have to agree to it of course.


 If you both agreed on it you can sell it anytime because it's in both your names. I'm just afraid he's going to drag his feet and not want to do it. Which means you will have to involve a court to say it has to be sold.


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## TexasMom1216

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> He pays all of our bills out of his account. He sees him as paying the mortgage even though I send him half of every one of my paychecks to go towards our bills. The house is in both of our names.
> 
> I didn’t think of selling the house before a divorce. That’s be much easier on one hand but he’ll have to agree to it of course.


He of course has the option of buying you out of the house. He’d basically give you half the value of the house.


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## DownByTheRiver

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> My current job takes up so much of my time,including nights and weekends, that I don’t know how I’d work another one. I’ll have to leave my primary job first and find 2 new jobs. I am working on maybe finding another job soon but I probably won’t make much more. I just want more time to myself to get stuff done in my life and this job pays me less than $40,000 (Canadian) and had me running all over the city and working whacky schedules and taking up a lot of my free time.
> 
> Also need to be able to keep all my pets. It’s my 2 goats I’m most worried about because they are goats and need their outside area.


Yes I completely understand that. But it is possible you might be able to find a roommate out in the country or on an acreage. If you yourself rented a little house in the country and then advertise for a roommate you'd probably find one. But I realize all that sounds a lot easier than it really is when you're broke.


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## Anastasia6

TexasMom1216 said:


> He of course has the option of buying you out of the house. He’d basically give you half the value of the house.


She said he can’t afford it on his own. I doubt he has the money to buy her out. I also doubt the bank is going to refinance with him only. She needs to get her name off the mortgage if he ‘gets’ the house.


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## TexasMom1216

Anastasia6 said:


> She said he can’t afford it on his own. I doubt he has the money to buy her out. I also doubt the bank is going to refinance with him only. She needs to get her name off the mortgage if he ‘gets’ the house.


Oh I see that now. And yes for sure she wants her name off of everything. I hope the OP sees a lawyer, I bet she has more options than she thinks. I am also worried about the goats. 🥺


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Nothing bad will happen to the goats. I’m wondering if I could pay to Baird the goats on a property much like horses are boarded at stables. Hmm. Probably not. I mean I’d hate to do that but if I needed just a temporary place for them. I’d live in a mobile home though if it meant having a large property where I could keep the goats with me.


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## TexasMom1216

I bet you could find a place to board the goats. They’d be ok, it would be like going to summer camp for them.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

TexasMom1216 said:


> I bet you could find a place to board the goats. They’d be ok, it would be like going to summer camp for them.


I may look into it. Then it’ll just be a matter of affording it!


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## Casual Observer

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I may look into it. Then it’ll just be a matter of affording it!


Where I live, people rent out goats to clear fields of weeds. So in some places, you could probably loan them to somebody who could put them to good use. Maybe even get paid for it!


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## In Absentia

You are only 34... get out of this mess and find a man you really fancy, not a man-child. And carry on with the therapy.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

TexasMom1216 said:


> Oh I see that now. And yes for sure she wants her name off of everything. I hope the OP sees a lawyer, I bet she has more options than she thinks. I am also worried about the goats. 🥺


One could always eat the goats 😉 . I'm kidding. Mostly. 
No, really just pulling your leg. Goat bbq is quite good though.


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## In Absentia

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> One could always eat the goats 😉 . I'm kidding. Mostly.
> No, really just pulling your leg. Goat bbq is quite good though.


Curried goat is lovely... one of my favourite Jamaican dishes... very popular in the UK.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

In Absentia said:


> Curried goat is lovely... one of my favourite Jamaican dishes... very popular in the UK.


I like that quite a bit. In prev job I had to spend a lot of time in Kingston and Mo-bay, lot of trips. The area shops and local friends made some great food.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

In Absentia said:


> You are only 34... get out of this mess and find a man you really fancy, not a man-child. And carry on with the therapy.


Yes man child is it. Made me cry before work for yelling at me about something stupid. I was standing in a doorway.

Then I didn’t get home until after 9 pm. I had to feed all pets, change everybody’s water, and make myself dinner while he just sat on the sofa the whole time playing games. I’m not asking him to wait on me but if your spouse is working late is it too much to do a few of your shared household tasks so they don’t have to get home at 9 and do everything themselves before dropping into bed?

He also made a mess with something he was working on. Asked him what he was going to do about the mess and he goes “don’t be a b*tch!” Well, there’s paint thinner all over this box outside and it’s a mess so I was just asking. So I went to bed crying too since he was a selfish mean person during the evening as well. Then he got mad at me for crying.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

They’ll be no eating of the goats! 🐐 🐐


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## Busy Washing My Hair

I found a lawyer who will give me a free consultation at least. All I can afford right now! They also have some free legal advice services here so I will probably contact them as well.

It’s mainly the finances that are holding me back at this point, I think. Once I can figure out what to do there then I’ll feel a lot better about moving forward. I have to not fly by the seat of my pants and come up with an actual plan regarding how to get out of this mess money-wise.


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## In Absentia

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Yes man child is it. Made me cry before work for yelling at me about something stupid. I was standing in a doorway.
> 
> Then I didn’t get home until after 9 pm. I had to feed all pets, change everybody’s water, and make myself dinner while he just sat on the sofa the whole time playing games. I’m not asking him to wait on me but if your spouse is working late is it too much to do a few of your shared household tasks so they don’t have to get home at 9 and do everything themselves before dropping into bed?
> 
> He also made a mess with something he was working on. Asked him what he was going to do about the mess and he goes “don’t be a b*tch!” Well, there’s paint thinner all over this box outside and it’s a mess so I was just asking. So I went to bed crying too since he was a selfish mean person during the evening as well. Then he got mad at me for crying.


Terrible man.... I don't know how you put up with that crap.


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## So far so good

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> In Canada you can be granted a divorce based on the following grounds:
> -Separated for a year
> -One of you committed adultery
> -Your spouse has inflicted physical and/mental harm to you
> 
> So my only option right now is 1 year separation.


This is what I remember from my separation and later divorce in Quebec and Ontario. This was a many years ago… when men were real men, and women were real women and goats were real goats Your lawyer will give you better information

Separation is the biggest step. You do the financial separation and whatever your STBXH does, you’re not responsible for.

You can live in the same house, I did that, but the CRA came back to me and told I was still married, can’t file as single. You also get to see your STBXH date other people so you truly have to be done in your mind. In my case I didn’t care but YMMV.

The divorce 1year later is just rubber stamping.

From what I read from your other posts, you are miserable with this man. My advice is to try to *detach* from him as much as possible. Don’t sleep in the same room. Don’t eat with him cook for him, don’t do anything for him. You really need to detach for your peace of mind. You are divorcing him. He can date 20 other girls or boys, he can play video games all day or whatever. He is your X,and you are moving on to a better life. The opposite of love is not gate but indifference…

good luck!


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## Busy Washing My Hair

So far so good said:


> This is what I remember from my separation and later divorce in Quebec and Ontario. This was a many years ago… when men were real men, and women were real women and goats were real goats Your lawyer will give you better information
> 
> Separation is the biggest step. You do the financial separation and whatever your STBXH does, you’re not responsible for.
> 
> You can live in the same house, I did that, but the CRA came back to me and told I was still married, can’t file as single. You also get to see your STBXH date other people so you truly have to be done in your mind. In my case I didn’t care but YMMV.
> 
> The divorce 1year later is just rubber stamping.
> 
> From what I read from your other posts, you are miserable with this man. My advice is to try to *detach* from him as much as possible. Don’t sleep in the same room. Don’t eat with him cook for him, don’t do anything for him. You really need to detach for your peace of mind. You are divorcing him. He can date 20 other girls or boys, he can play video games all day or whatever. He is your X,and you are moving on to a better life. The opposite of love is not gate but indifference…
> 
> good luck!


Detach detach detach


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Seems like maybe he’s detaching already himself. There was definitely a very different feeling in the air this morning while we were getting ready for work. No words spoken until I reminded him that I’ll be home late. He said he has plans with friends from work and will be home late. That was that. Don’t think he would have even told me at all if I hadn’t said I was going to be late.

I’m feeling pretty sad today.


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## TexasMom1216

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m feeling pretty sad today.


It sure would be nice if you could get off this rollercoaster, wouldn't it? Detaching from him is the best course of action. And getting your ducks in a row so you can move on. Neither of you have been happy for a long time. 😔


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## Sfort

Ask your lawyer about an easy payment plan. I'm adamantly opposed to debt, but I'm even more adamantly opposed to living in hell. An indeterminate state is hell.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

TexasMom1216 said:


> It sure would be nice if you could get off this rollercoaster, wouldn't it? Detaching from him is the best course of action. And getting your ducks in a row so you can move on. Neither of you have been happy for a long time. 😔


Yes it would feel very nice. What’s it like to have a life where you’re not constantly upset every day? I’m sure it’s not normal to be with somebody who makes you upset on a daily basis. At the same time I feel very queasy about the change.


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## Openminded

It’s very difficult to be separated and still living together. It takes awhile to get used to it but detachment is the best gift ever.


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## So far so good

Openminded said:


> By the time my exH moved in with his gf, I was so tired of his drama that the peace and quiet every day was lovely.


By the time my XWW left, I repainted her room orange and yellow, the colour of the sun, to cleanse her presence


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## Casual Observer

So far so good said:


> By the time my XWW left, I repainted her room orange and yellow, the colour of the sun, to cleanse her presence


You mean you repainted it before she left? I guess that would have been tainted by her presence though.


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## drencrom

Anastasia6 said:


> She said he can’t afford it on his own. I doubt he has the money to buy her out. I also doubt the bank is going to refinance with him only. She needs to get her name off the mortgage if he ‘gets’ the house.


I have experience with this one. It will take a refinancing or selling of the house and paying it off to get her name off. A mortgage company will refuse to take a name off.

What happened in my instance is x-wife's lawyer demanded I refinance by a certain time. My lawyer told them if refinancing is their demand, that comes with closing costs and if she was the one demanding it, then she has to pay half the closing costs. They refused, and my lawyer told them they have 2 options then, 1) drop the demand and wait for it to be sold, or 2) pay half the closing costs.

And if they don't agree, then since she couldn't pay any of the marital debt, then it would be taken off the table that I take the debt in exchange for all the equity in the house. And if she still wanted equity without a quit claim deed, then she would still be responsible for half the mortgage payments. They agreed.


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## LATERILUS79

Openminded said:


> It’s very difficult to be separated and still living together (I did it for almost a year while we untangled our finances he had complicated). It takes awhile to get used to it but detachment is the best gift ever. By the time my exH moved in with his gf, I was so tired of his drama that the peace and quiet every day was lovely.


Agreed. 

The peace and quiet I've had over the past 3 days has been wonderful. I think I'll be looking forward to my time alone at my place. 

Living together for a year. That would be..... I would need to figure something else out. I only had to do it 4 months and I was not a happy camper. It can be done. 

I'd follow the advice given before. Detach. Stop talking with your spouse all together even if you have to live in the same house. It worked for me.


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## Openminded

LATERILUS79 said:


> Agreed.
> 
> The peace and quiet I've had over the past 3 days has been wonderful. I think I'll be looking forward to my time alone at my place.
> 
> Living together for a year. That would be..... I would need to figure something else out. I only had to do it 4 months and I was not a happy camper. It can be done.
> 
> I'd follow the advice given before. Detach. Stop talking with your spouse all together even if you have to live in the same house. It worked for me.


That time moved slowly. Once the divorce was final, I felt that a huge burden had finally been lifted and I could restart my life. My only regret was staying too long but hope can keep you hooked.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Thanks for the advice and support everyone.

Yes, a year will be rough. I feel like it’ll make it so hard to actually stick to the “divorce” plan. I feel like I’ll continue to flip flop. It’d be much easier to stick to my decision if I had my own place. I have to accept that unless we sell the house, getting my own place will just not be possible right now. It’ll be much smarter to stay here and get another job and save money if at all possible. At least if I have 2 jobs it’ll keep me outside of the house.


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## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Thanks for the advice and support everyone.
> 
> Yes, a year will be rough. I feel like it’ll make it so hard to actually stick to the “divorce” plan. I feel like I’ll continue to flip flop. It’d be much easier to stick to my decision if I had my own place. I have to accept that unless we sell the house, getting my own place will just not be possible right now. It’ll be much smarter to stay here and get another job and save money if at all possible. At least if I have 2 jobs it’ll keep me outside of the house.


You do not want to increase your salary leading up to a divorce, and any savings you accumulate may have to be split with him 50/50. You need to get with a lawyer before doing these things.

It’s better to start over broke and rent a room for a year post divorce than work hard to increase your earning potential and savings only to have that counted against you and redistributed… especially when you have no kids to worry about. If you want to leave the best time to do so is the present.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

QuietRiot said:


> You do not want to increase your salary leading up to a divorce, and any savings you accumulate may have to be split with him 50/50. You need to get with a lawyer before doing these things.
> 
> It’s better to start over broke and rent a room for a year post divorce than work hard to increase your earning potential and savings only to have that counted against you and redistributed… especially when you have no kids to worry about. If you want to leave the best time to do so is the present.


Well, there is nothing besides our house for my husband and I to get from this divorce. Getting a job that pays just a bit more isn’t going to take anything away from me as far as what gets distributed. There is absolutely nothingn to distribute. Even if I managed to save any money it’d probably only end up being a few thousand dollars. I have less than $500 to my name now so having a few thousand saved would be great in comparison. So if the court wants to count a few thousand dollars against me and make me give half of it to my husband then whatever. We’re not talking a sizeable amount of money here at all.

The truth is I also almost certainly won’t be getting a 2nd job either. My first job alone is about to give me a mental breakdown. If I managed to find a new job it won’t pay much better than what I’m making now. I’m just trying to be honest with myself now.

I can’t rent a room. I have quite a few pets, plus the thought of renting a room sounds like absolute torture. I’m starting to think I’ll just stay married and find a way to put up with it if it’s between staying married and having to rent a room for a year plus being stuck in limbo for that long.


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## Openminded

Yes, you can certainly stay married. I think it’s very probable that you will. But it would be a huge mistake to bring a child into a dysfunctional marriage such as yours.


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## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Well, there is nothing besides our house for my husband and I to get from this divorce. Getting a job that pays just a bit more isn’t going to take anything away from me as far as what gets distributed. There is absolutely nothingn to distribute. Even if I managed to save any money it’d probably only end up being a few thousand dollars. I have less than $500 to my name now so having a few thousand saved would be great in comparison. So if the court wants to count a few thousand dollars against me and make me give half of it to my husband then whatever. We’re not talking a sizeable amount of money here at all.
> 
> The truth is I also almost certainly won’t be getting a 2nd job either. My first job alone is about to give me a mental breakdown. If I managed to find a new job it won’t pay much better than what I’m making now. I’m just trying to be honest with myself now.
> 
> I can’t rent a room. I have quite a few pets, plus the thought of renting a room sounds like absolute torture. I’m starting to think I’ll just stay married and find a way to put up with it if it’s between staying married and having to rent a room for a year plus being stuck in limbo for that long.


Im not trying to talk you out of staying or leaving. But if you’re going to leave, do it and do it well. There will ALWAYS be 100 reasons why you “can’t go” but you commit and make it happen anyway. But if you’re going to stay, stay well. Get counseling, mandate MC, find a way to improve your relationship and yourself.


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## Jimi007

Well I would file for the separation. Then just ride it out for a yr as moving is not an option at this point.


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## RebuildingMe

Along with the host of other things (sexless, lack of respect in a fairly new marriage, 11 or 12 “pets”), you really need to work on your finances and money management. There is absolutely no excuse for two working people in their mid thirties, WITHOUT children, to have only $500 to their name and NO retirement or savings at all. That’s insane. You really have to be prepared for this in all aspects, especially if you want children. The clock is ticking and you are going to have to eventually mate up with someone. What are you offering that prospective partner who will be the future father to your child? Good
luck with the lawyer. Make a list of questions. Without children, this should be an easy peasy divorce.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Jimi007 said:


> Well I would file for the separation. Then just ride it out for a yr as moving is not an option at this point.


Yes I think being realistic about what I think I can actually handle right now mentally and financially, I will have to remain living in our home, not make any major career moves (not that I could since I don’t have any sort of qualifications for something with a dramatically higher rate of pay), and spend the time working on things like my health and fitness, my mental health, planning for what career field is like to move into and figuring out what I need to do to get there. If we can just agree to sell the house at that point and split profits since I know we will both need the cash then it might all be ok. I’ll be in limbo for a year but I can still work on a lot of things that I need to fix. I am a mess. I’d try to describe just how much but it’s be too embarrassing. I’m having trouble functioning in life and staying afloat mentally. That won’t just resolve if I get divorced. I need to start addressing those problems now so I can be in a healthier place, some place where I actually have motivation, where I don’t struggle to just get out of bed each day.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

I have 9 pets. 

Yes, finances need a lot of work. I don’t think that I’m really bad with money management, but my husband is. We’ve been sharing finances and bills almost since we were first together. We’ve lived together most of our relationship. Money has always been a big problem between us because I believe in saving and be believes in spending. He always makes me feel bad or controlling for wanting to save, for telling him not to buy something costly that he wants. He gets money and it’s like he HAS to spend it. it’s my fault for putting up with it for so long, for marrying him even though I was well aware what he was like with money.

I prefer to be careful with my money and I don’t make big purchases unless it’s something necessary. I bought my current car when I absolutely had to, when my old car got it the point where it was needing repairs every single month which just became a money pit. I bought a very inexpensive but newer car that would be more reliable. My husband bought a car that was almost 3 times the cost of mine.

I make less than $40,000 a year and this is the most I’ve ever made at any job ever. I’ve been working since I was in college. I’m not lazy and I’m actually an excellent employee, I just got a useless college degree, fell into a low paying job field, and then sold myself short and basically fell victim to believing that this was the best I’d ever do.

My husband is also now making the most he’s ever made, which is more than me but not too much more. We’ve both had a string of not very well paying jobs. I don’t blame anyone for that but ourselves. We both got useless college degrees. We are both messes with mental problems. He was also unemployed for several years so it was just me supporting us which really set us back.

Yep, we cannot afford a child right now. I’ve always known that we couldn’t afford it and that it’s totally inappropriate to have a kid on purpose when you aren’t financially stable. It’s one of the reasons that I’ve intentionally avoided having one with him.

I don’t think a man with the qualities I’m looking for will be interested in me for a plethora of reasons, including what a loser I am as far as my job and my complete lack of any finances. Probably another reason I’m still here.


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair

Openminded said:


> Yes, you can certainly stay married. I think it’s very probable that you will. But it would be a huge mistake to bring a child into a dysfunctional marriage such as yours. I greatly wanted a child and I had one but unfortunately my child was always well aware of the situation, no matter how hard I tried to conceal it, and as a result doesn’t have good childhood memories. If I had it to do over I would have gotten a divorce, found someone compatible, and then had a child. But I didn’t believe in divorce then so I stayed in my marriage much too long. There’s always a price to be paid for that. You’ll discover it down the road.


Right now I feel that I’ll remain married, continue to try to convince myself that I like my husband more than I do, remain childless, and be unhappy forever. It will be my fault, nobody else’s.


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## In Absentia

Had curry goat last night... wonderful! Sorry... it's just that this thread reminded me of it...


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Right now I feel that I’ll remain married, continue to try to convince myself that I like my husband more than I do, remain childless, and be unhappy forever. It will be my fault, nobody else’s.


Going back and forth again for real, or just venting? 
A guy, the right guy, will be self supporting and will start a relationship with you and money won't matter.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Going back and forth again for real, or just venting?
> A guy, the right guy, will be self supporting and will start a relationship with you and money won't matter.


Hopefully just venting, but feeling pretty hopeless about it all at the moment. Sometimes I feel sure that I can and will follow through with leaving but then I just get so overwhelmed. I admit, knowing me, that there’s a very good chance I could end up remaining married and miserable.


----------



## LATERILUS79

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Hopefully just venting, but feeling pretty hopeless about it all at the moment. Sometimes I feel sure that I can and will follow through with leaving but then I just get so overwhelmed. I admit, knowing me, that there’s a very good chance I could end up remaining married and miserable.


I get the overwhelmed feeling. Truly, I understand. You start thinking about a million things that need to get done and you aren’t sure if you can handle them.

you can.

just take your time. Move at your speed, no one else’s.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

I just don’t have faith in myself. My confidence is virtually nonexistent these days. I am already overwhelmed by life at the moment which is why I’m just not sure I have what it takes to actually leave right now. I thought I did a few days ago but then when reality set in it was too much. Most days I feel so overwhelmed that my chest is tight and I care barely breathe, feel as if a panic attack will come on at any moment or a nervous breakdown.

I try to tell myself just so things 1 day at a time. That’s what I’m going to try to work on this weekend. Try to get the current things in my life in order since everything is a disaster right now. If I could just feel like I could catch up on everything that’s an absolute mess right now then I could take on something else like a divorce. Of course my low paying job will have me working a day this weekend so there goes some time for myself to handle my own stuff.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

ccpowerslave said:


> This probably won’t help at all but the Dodgers won by two despite having several friends there who wanted to see me lose just out of pure jealousy. I collected on my ticket.
> 
> I wonder about a buddy of mine who is your age. He has a very huge awesome family and is married and he doesn’t have any kids yet. This guy is great with kids, he would be an awesome dad. Still nothing…
> 
> My wife and I chose to invest in other people’s kids through an endowment we set up. That way we can help the future but at the same time do no work other than signing checks.


I’m really not sure what any of this has to do with my situation. You do have several nice qualities but I’ve noticed you often make posts that not so subtly allude to how much money you have and that is off putting. Whether you do that on purpose or just don’t realize that most people do not live like you, I am not sure. 

I think it’s awesome that you support kids through an endowment but that’s not something many of us normal folks can do.


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## Anastasia6

@Busy Washing My Hair I get the overwhelmed. IF you do one thing. File for separation. Then separate the finances. You each pay 1/2 of the monthly bills. This can legally separate your finances for divorce and allow you to save. You husband seems to be the spender which means if your finances are separate then you can save what you can. I have many pets as well but you really need to look at downsizing the pets.

Yes working on you is a good thing. Stress can be a killer and perfect is the enemy of mental health. Perfect is the enemy of good enough. So figure out what you can and want to improve. work slowly on that.


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## Casual Observer

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Hopefully just venting, but feeling pretty hopeless about it all at the moment. Sometimes I feel sure that I can and will follow through with leaving but then I just get so overwhelmed. I admit, knowing me, that there’s a very good chance I could end up remaining married and miserable.


Married or not will make no difference whatsoever in your outcome at this point. The only thing we know for sure is that you’ll be… miserable. Stop focusing on any one thing as the problem, whether it’s your marriage, your job, or an unmet desire to have children. Find professional help and focus on not what you think, but how. And how to change that.

So I’d say put all these thoughts of daily woe on hold and commit only to finding a good therapist and working through these things ASAP. Stop torturing yourself and likely those around you. You can’t do this on your own. That’s maybe the core issue here.


----------



## attheend02

I have been watching this thread but first contribution.
I agree with Anastasia6 - File for separation now. Get the year started. You can always change your mind (which is the what the year wait is designed for).
I worked with a Mediator rather than a lawyer and they drafted a legally binding agreement that laid out distribution of assets.
The only issue I had was getting 401k distribution accomplished - which I enlisted lawyer help for. 

The year wait seemed like a cruel joke at the time, but it really was just waiting for the formality.


----------



## Openminded

Having children is always a risk because you never know how good your spouse will be at parenting. Your husband, so far, does very little. He may change if you have a child or he may be a lot worse than he is now. I think you’ll stay so my suggestion is get counseling to help you cope. I didn’t and I wish I had.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

My husband would have a baby with me right now if I asked. He goes back and forth on actually wanting a kid but if I initiated it he’d say yes. He is really good with kids and he personally thinks he’d be a good dad. There’s a difference between being really good with children and actually being able to be a quality parent that takes part in the day to day responsibilities of raising a child. He could actually surprise me here but it’s a very big risk in my opinion. I also really fear what would happen if we had a kid and I died. I don’t feel he’d raise them to my standards. I really fear his anxiety and other issues getting in the way of him being actively involved in their activities, like you can’t even go to the grocery store how are you going to show up to your kid’s school play?


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## RebuildingMe

The title is “trying to pull the trigger” (on divorce) and 4 pages in OP is weighing options about having a kid with him??🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️🤔🤔. Sadly, this is a very troubled and dysfunctional person and couple in need of immediate, professional help. Well beyond TAM.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

RebuildingMe said:


> The title is “trying to pull the trigger” (on divorce) and 4 pages in OP is weighing options about having a kid with him??🤷‍♂️🤷‍♂️🤔🤔. Sadly, this is a very troubled and dysfunctional person and couple in need of immediate, professional help. Well beyond TAM.


I’m not weighing the options of having a kid with him. I’ve already done that plenty. Spent years doing it. My last post was in response to what @Openminded said about her situation with her child and ex-husband. Somebody earlier had said my husband didn’t want kids, but no that isn’t the case. He would have a child with me but he’d never initiate it. He doesn’t initiate much of anything. But if I said I wanted one he’d give me one. We’ve come close to doing it in the past but I could never actually go through with it because I knew it would be a selfish and wrong decision. I’m not weighing having a kid with him now, was just saying that I can understand what Openminded is saying because I’ve feared the exact same thing happening to me.


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair

Perhaps if I get out of this marriage and can find a new career where I can make more money I will decide to never be in a committed relationship with a man again and will just get impregnated by sperm I select from a sperm bank. Not as if I could probably ever afford it but who knows maybe one day once I figure out what I want to do with my life and can finally push myself to take the risks required to make it happen.


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## QuietRiot

You can be overwhelmed and miserable where you are, or you take steps to change it. I won’t push you either way, but I do wonder how long you’ve been doing this type of circular thinking and nothing has changed? Definitely seek counseling and do it quickly.


----------



## Openminded

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> My husband would have a baby with me right now if I asked. He goes back and forth on actually wanting a kid but if I initiated it he’d say yes. He is really good with kids and he personally thinks he’d be a good dad. There’s a difference between being really good with children and actually being able to be a quality parent that takes part in the day to day responsibilities of raising a child. He could actually surprise me here but it’s a very big risk in my opinion. I also really fear what would happen if we had a kid and I died. I don’t feel he’d raise them to my standards. I really fear his anxiety and other issues getting in the way of him being actively involved in their activities, like you can’t even go to the grocery store how are you going to show up to your kid’s school play?


Yes, it’s a huge risk. And it can’t be undone once the child is here. I very much hoped my husband would be a good father but he was not. His career was always much more important to him than his family. Never changed. It didn’t matter how many discussions we had about marriage or parenting or anything else. He did exactly as he wished when he wished. I chose to believe him when he said he wanted a child (although he later rewrote history and said that I was the only one who wanted a child and he never would have if I hadn’t wanted one). If I could relive my life I would do none of the things I did during those decades. Not one. But fear and hope kept me there. I think it will for you as well. I’d love to be wrong about that.


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair

QuietRiot said:


> You can be overwhelmed and miserable where you are, or you take steps to change it. I won’t push you either way, but I do wonder how long you’ve been doing this type of circular thinking and nothing has changed? Definitely seek counseling and do it quickly.


Years. Probably over a decade.

Related to my marriage specifically, just as Openminded said that there were frequent talks about how to improve things and yet nothing ever changed in her marriage the same is true for my marriage. I’ve spent years rationalizing why I’m still here, convincing myself this is the best I can do. Even on our wedding day I flip flopped about saying “I do” probably 25 times. 

I know that my relationship isn’t my only problem. No, there’s not one singular thing that’s causing the problems in my life. Well, me. I am the singular thing causing myself problems. It’s all of my bad decisions, indecisiveness, selling myself short, and inability to take risks that has landed me right where I’m at today. I was voted most likely to succeed! I had potential at one time. What a joke!


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair

Openminded said:


> Yes, it’s a huge risk. And it can’t be undone once the child is here. I very much hoped my husband would be a good father but he was not. His career was always much more important to him than his family. Never changed. It didn’t matter how many discussions we had about marriage or parenting or anything else. He did exactly as he wished when he wished. I chose to believe him when he said he wanted a child (although he later rewrote history and said that I was the only one who wanted a child and he never would have if I hadn’t wanted one). If I could relive my life I would do none of the things I did during those decades. Not one. But fear and hope kept me there. I think it will for you as well. I’d love to be wrong about that.


At least your husband was dedicated to his career. Mine is unmotivated in all areas of life.

If I could relive my life since age 18 I’d make different decisions for every single major choice I’ve ever made. I think I made the wrong decision every time and with each bad decision I feel like I’m burying myself further and further into a hole.

I think there’s a good chance you’ll be right about me and what I end up doing. I also wish you were wrong.


----------



## Openminded

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> At least your husband was dedicated to his career. Mine is unmotivated in all areas of life.
> 
> If I could relive my life since age 18 I’d make different decisions for every single major choice I’ve ever made. I think I made the wrong decision every time and with each bad decision I feel like I’m burying myself further and further into a hole.
> 
> I think there’s a good chance you’ll be right about me and what I end up doing. I also wish you were wrong.


Maybe you’ll surprise both of us.😉


----------



## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Well, me. I am the singular thing causing myself problems. It’s all of my bad decisions, indecisiveness, selling myself short, and inability to take risks that has landed me right where I’m at today. I was voted most likely to succeed! I had potential at one time. What a joke!





Busy Washing My Hair said:


> At least your husband was dedicated to his career. Mine is unmotivated in all areas of life.
> 
> If I could relive my life since age 18 I’d make different decisions for every single major choice I’ve ever made. I think I made the wrong decision every time and with each bad decision I feel like I’m burying myself further and further into a hole.
> 
> I think there’s a good chance you’ll be right about me and what I end up doing. I also wish you were wrong.


There are people here who would love to go back to 35 and have a redo… you aren’t geriatric and a lost cause, that’s just the critic talking again. All it takes is the commitment to refusing to accept the status quo of misery and fear of change.

You know that you won’t simply be handed a new life, you have to do the hard work and do the scary things you’ve never wanted to in order to get it. The more you combat your fears, prove the inner critic wrong, and demand more for yourself and your life… the more your life will change. If you have no respect and love for yourself; nobody else will either. You’re all you’ve got sister. And I see you ripping yourself down more than anyone else can.


----------



## RebuildingMe

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Years. Probably over a decade.
> 
> Related to my marriage specifically, just as Openminded said that there were frequent talks about how to improve things and yet nothing ever changed in her marriage the same is true for my marriage. I’ve spent years rationalizing why I’m still here, convincing myself this is the best I can do. Even on our wedding day I flip flopped about saying “I do” probably 25 times.
> 
> I know that my relationship isn’t my only problem. No, there’s not one singular thing that’s causing the problems in my life. Well, me. I am the singular thing causing myself problems. It’s all of my bad decisions, indecisiveness, selling myself short, and inability to take risks that has landed me right where I’m at today. I was voted most likely to succeed! I had potential at one time. What a joke!


That is a waste of a decade. Are you going to wate another one? It gets harder, not easier, as you get older looking for a partner. More so for a female. My advice is to get a divorce, learn a trade that will make you financially independent and stable and find a guy that matches your style. All in that order.


----------



## LATERILUS79

QuietRiot said:


> There are people here who would love to go back to 35 and have a redo… you aren’t geriatric and a lost cause, that’s just the critic talking again. All it takes is the commitment to refusing to accept the status quo of misery and fear of change.
> 
> You know that you won’t simply be handed a new life, you have to do the hard work and do the scary things you’ve never wanted to in order to get it. The more you combat your fears, prove the inner critic wrong, and demand more for yourself and your life… the more your life will change. If you have no respect and love for yourself; nobody else will either. You’re all you’ve got sister. And I see you ripping yourself down more than anyone else can.


Busy,

read and then re-read QR’s words here.

she is 100% correct. Some of us don’t come to your point in our 30’s. I would have loved to have my do-over in my 30’s as opposed to now - but that isn’t possible. This is definitely a silver lining.


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## Openminded

When I was 34 and thinking about getting out, I couldn’t even imagine a time that I would be twice that age but that time got here quickly. Instead of getting out when I had all the time in the world I waited until I didn’t. So much of my life would have been different had I gotten out at 34. That’s my biggest regret.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Well I guess having sex wasn’t the best way to detach today was it? And I’m the one who initiated it too.


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## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Well I guess having sex wasn’t the best way to detach today was it? And I’m the one who initiated it too.


How about you initiate some marriage counseling while you’re at it. Apparently you’re not that adverse to sex after all.


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## RebuildingMe

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Well I guess having sex wasn’t the best way to detach today was it? And I’m the one who initiated it too.


It’s okay. Everyone on this thread is aware that you ain’t leaving your marriage.


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## Openminded

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Well I guess having sex wasn’t the best way to detach today was it? And I’m the one who initiated it too.


That’s a predictable way to get him to forget you mentioned divorce.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Openminded said:


> That’s a predictable way to get him to forget you mentioned divorce.


I guess, but that wasn’t my intention. I actually just wanted to have sex. For the last 2 weeks or so I’ve actually had a sex drive, not specifically associated with him but it’s like I know what it feels like to feel uncontrollably horny for the first time in my entire life.


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## LATERILUS79

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I guess, but that wasn’t my intention. I actually just wanted to have sex. For the last 2 weeks or so I’ve actually had a sex drive, not specifically associated with him but it’s like I know what it feels like to feel uncontrollably horny for the first time in my entire life.


This is NOT a cool move. 

Horny or not, you told this man that you want a divorce and that you've never been sexually attracted to him. 

I'm not going to defend your husband as I've read your threads and he has done his fair share of awful things - but i damn well know what it feels like to be on the receiving end of a relationship with a spouse that chooses when, where, how long, etc when it comes to sex. 

You aren't doing him a favor. You are messing with his mind. 

Did you tell him you were just using him for sex because now you feel like it? 

Again, I'm not going to defend his actions towards you, but you have full control over your actions towards him. If you want to stay with him, then work on the marriage. If you don't want to stay with him, have integrity. Don't hurt him even worse than what he is right now - even if he does awful things to you. 

And I don't want to be a hypocrite here - this is advice I needed to have beaten into me by some very smart people here at TAM. I'm no better. I needed to learn. Go out on a high note. If you aren't attracted to him and you don't want to be married to him, don't use him for sex. You are just going to mess up his mind worse.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

LATERILUS79 said:


> This is NOT a cool move.
> 
> Horny or not, you told this man that you want a divorce and that you've never been sexually attracted to him.
> 
> I'm not going to defend your husband as I've read your threads and he has done his fair share of awful things - but i damn well know what it feels like to be on the receiving end of a relationship with a spouse that chooses when, where, how long, etc when it comes to sex.
> 
> You aren't doing him a favor. You are messing with his mind.
> 
> Did you tell him you were just using him for sex because now you feel like it?
> 
> Again, I'm not going to defend his actions towards you, but you have full control over your actions towards him. If you want to stay with him, then work on the marriage. If you don't want to stay with him, have integrity. Don't hurt him even worse than what he is right now - even if he does awful things to you.
> 
> And I don't want to be a hypocrite here - this is advice I needed to have beaten into me by some very smart people here at TAM. I'm no better. I needed to learn. Go out on a high note. If you aren't attracted to him and you don't want to be married to him, don't use him for sex. You are just going to mess up his mind worse.


I do get what you’re saying but if we do end up remaining married we better find a way to enjoy sex together and to improve our relationship in many different ways. 

He knows the truth about how I feel. I didn’t force him to sleep with me. He’s a big boy and can make his own decisions.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Deleting this post. I think it’s obvious I need to take a bit of a break from TAM and sort my head and decisions out on my own for a little while.


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## Beach123

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I guess, but that wasn’t my intention. I actually just wanted to have sex. For the last 2 weeks or so I’ve actually had a sex drive, not specifically associated with him but it’s like I know what it feels like to feel uncontrollably horny for the first time in my entire life.


what changed to make you feel this way suddenly? Be honest.


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## Sfort

@Busy Washing My Hair Was the sex worthwhile?


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Beach123 said:


> what changed to make you feel this way suddenly? Be honest.


Im not completely sure. I’ve been thinking very seriously about what I want in my ideal man lately, even made an actual written list. Ever since I did that and started thinking about the possibility of divorce and actually having a chance to find a man that comes to what I want I’ve been pretty horny all the time. I even started watching porn too (but not like that Catholic wife in the thread about the lady addicted to porn, I’m actually like eating food and doing my job not hiding and masturbating multiple times a day). Anyway the more I do this the hornier I seem to get. It’s probably not really healthy.

I saw a guy out in public the other day and I had a “I wanna rip your clothes off right here in front of everybody” sort of feeling. Well I interacted with him but it was part of my job and nothing inappropriate.


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## Beach123

From experience, the more sex I have - the more I want.
Go without for a while and I stop thinking about it.

but it is interesting that once you mentally eliminated your husband from your mental space = you became more interested.
Maybe you two just aren’t a good match.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Sfort said:


> @Busy Washing My Hair Was the sex worthwhile?


I didn’t even orgasm and I actually didn’t care. I had a toy but didn’t care about using it. I had fun. I enjoyed myself. I was actually glad that my husband orgasmed and enjoyed himself. I was actually thinking of being with him and not fantasizing about some other guy, real or imaginary. Normally I’m always very concerned about my own orgasm but I wasn’t this time. I was just along for the “ride” but I wasn’t faking any of it. We had a really good day together. If every single day could be like this then I’d be pretty happy. I did a few positive things for myself that I’ve been putting off. We did a house project together and didn’t argue about it - he offered to help, which he never ever does. He also did an outside chore, a thing he never does, without being asked and that was all before the sex even happened. He said a genuine thank you to me after I made lunch. Yes these are all really mundane things but they aren’t things that normally happen in our house. I really like him today. If he could just be this way all the time I actually would be more attracted to him. It’s nothing about him physically - it’s the non-physical things that I find very unattractive.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Beach123 said:


> From experience, the more sex I have - the more I want.
> Go without for a while and I stop thinking about it.
> 
> but it is interesting that once you mentally eliminated your husband from your mental space = you became more interested.
> Maybe you two just aren’t a good match.


I think just doing it more a lot recently may have something to do with it. I mean we went from 3 times in 5 months to whats now probably 3-4 times a week. I started masturbating again too which I had essentially stopped for many many months. After my first thread on TAM I realized ok maybe this is a problem I have and what I’m doing is not right. I’m not being a good wife. I started making an effort with sex. I didn’t have much of a desire when I first started initiating more often but it’s like the more and more we did it the less averse I felt toward it. I would say I definitely don’t currently have an “ew sex is gross” sort of feeling. We’ve had a few bumps where it just didn’t work for me and I couldn’t get into it, probably because I was just trying to force it too much in those moments, but for the most part I have enjoyed each time. I mean, do I feel like “wow, sex is the most amazing thing ever!” No way, I do not. But I also haven’t had any “this is a big waste of time I rather be doing something else” thoughts either. I haven’t thought about how ridiculous I look and sound during sex for the last several weeks either.


----------



## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I didn’t even orgasm and I actually didn’t care. I had a toy but didn’t care about using it. I had fun. I enjoyed myself. I was actually glad that my husband orgasmed and enjoyed himself. I was actually thinking of being with him and not fantasizing about some other guy, real or imaginary. Normally I’m always very concerned about my own orgasm but I wasn’t this time. I was just along for the “ride” but I wasn’t faking any of it. We had a really good day together. If every single day could be like this then I’d be pretty happy. I did a few positive things for myself that I’ve been putting off. We did a house project together and didn’t argue about it - he offered to help, which he never ever does. He also did an outside chore, a thing he never does, without being asked and that was all before the sex even happened. He said a genuine thank you to me after I made lunch. Yes these are all really mundane things but they aren’t thinks that normally happen in our house. I really like him today. If he could just be this way all the time I actually would be more attracted to him. It’s nothing about him physically - it’s the non-physical things that I find very unattractive.


How interesting, you treat him like an attractive human being and in turn he wants to act like one. I’m astounded. (Not really, that’s sarcasm.)

And yet here you are still thinking if HE could be this way all the time when you have actual proof YOU have the power to make the change in your relationship. Sigh.


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair

I also didn’t seek him out to use him for sex today. I was going to masturbate. He came in the room and asked what I was doing. I said I was getting ready to masturbate but we could have sex instead if he was interested. He said yes. And so we had sex. I didn’t really think about it ahead of time and it just sort of came out of my mouth without thinking.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

QuietRiot said:


> How interesting, you treat him like an attractive human being and in turn he wants to act like one. I’m astounded. (Not really, that’s sarcasm.)
> 
> And yet here you are still thinking if HE could be this way all the time when you have actual proof YOU have the power to make the change in your relationship. Sigh.


It was actually the opposite this time. He acted like an attractive person first (and continued doing so after).


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## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> It was actually the opposite this time. He acted like an attractive person first (and continued doing so after).


Really??? Then please explain this. 



Busy Washing My Hair said:


> After my first thread on TAM I realized ok maybe this is a problem I have and what I’m doing is not right. I’m not being a good wife. I started making an effort with sex.


You are all over the place with him, with yourself, your marriage, your life. You have huge mood swings in the course of one day just judging by what you’ve written today. 

Please see your doctor and get your hormones tested, then see an IC and hopefully an MC. I’ll stop commenting because I don’t think you actually want to hear any of this anymore, but you have way more control and power over your life and your relationship than you want to believe.


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair

QuietRiot said:


> Really??? Then please explain this.


Oh, sorry I guess I was confused by what you were referring to. When I said he acted like an attractive person first I was referring to the events of today only. He did things that made me happy earlier in the day before we had sex. The sex did not come first today. I wasn’t referring to the whole time period since I joined TAM and started putting more effort into sex. That’s obviously what you must have been referring to. Notice in my comment I said “this time.” 



QuietRiot said:


> You are all over the place with him, with yourself, your marriage, your life. You have huge mood swings in the course of one day just judging by what you’ve written today.
> 
> Please see your doctor and get your hormones tested, then see an IC and hopefully an MC. I’ll stop commenting because I don’t think you actually want to hear any of this anymore, but you have way more control and power over your life and your relationship than you want to believe.


You’re right, the way I speak here is reflective of the way I feel in real life and the various thoughts and feelings I have throughout the day. It’s very…I can’t even find the right word to fully describe how it feels to go back and forth.

I’m sorry if I made you feel that I don’t want to hear what you have to say. That wasn’t my intention. I think you’ve been correct in everything you’ve said. Well, I have to be careful in saying that because maybe I don’t understand what you’ve been saying at all. I had sex with him pretty regularly for years, not starfish sex either. He was still a jerk to me a lot of the time. Sort of sounds like you’re saying if I treat him like an attractive person (aka have sex with him and show that I genuinely desire him) he’ll behave accordingly. So I started making an effort with sex weeks ago and he just decided to act like an attractive person because of it today? I think if anything he’s acting different because of our discussion last weekend in which I clearly expressed how unsatisfied I am and he’s actually starting to listen.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m really not sure what any of this has to do with my situation. You do have several nice qualities but I’ve noticed you often make posts that not so subtly allude to how much money you have and that is off putting. Whether you do that on purpose or just don’t realize that most people do not live like you, I am not sure.
> 
> I think it’s awesome that you support kids through an endowment but that’s not something many of us normal folks can do.


Not using @ccpowerslave exactly as the baseline but there would be a comfort to you and the future, where the guy was financially secure and the relationship/life didn't revolve around the absence of money, right?

That's just practical.


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Well I guess having sex wasn’t the best way to detach today was it? And I’m the one who initiated it too.


Such is life. It happens.


----------



## In Absentia

My head is spinning...


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

In Absentia said:


> My head is spinning...


I'm just rolling with it. Sometime a person starting to ride a different bike wobbles a bit building up to speed.

They may even crash. Just have to get back up and on the bike and try again.


----------



## In Absentia

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> I'm just rolling with it. Sometime a person starting to ride a different bike wobbles a bit building up to speed.
> 
> They may even crash. Just have to get back up and on the bike and try again.


yeah, I get it, but I'm also getting more tired than the OP...


----------



## Ragnar Ragnasson

In Absentia said:


> yeah, I get it, but I'm also getting more tired than the OP...


It could be humorous, substitute analogy with aforementioned goats..
When one starts to ride a different goat, sometimes a person slips and rides the old goat now and then too.....


----------



## ccpowerslave

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> I'm just rolling with it. Sometime a person starting to ride a different bike wobbles a bit building up to speed.
> 
> They may even crash. Just have to get back up and on the bike and try again.


The mental shift is a big one. I can say for myself the idea of not being married anymore took a very long time to sit upstairs percolating before it translated into action.


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Not using @ccpowerslave exactly as the baseline but there would be a comfort to you and the future, where the guy was financially secure and the relationship/life didn't revolve around the absence of money, right?
> 
> That's just practical.


Yes of course.


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair

In Absentia said:


> My head is spinning...


Imagine being me. 🌪


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair

This isn’t even the first time I’ve told him I wanted a divorce, but it’s the time where it felt most real. We’ve been on the verge of divorce probably 5-6 times.


----------



## RebuildingMe

You throwing out the divorce word no longer has any meaning nor impact on your husband. Much like the boy who cried wolf. You probably get satisfaction over saying it in the heat of the moment but inside his head, he’s laughing at you.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

RebuildingMe said:


> You throwing out the divorce word no longer has any meaning nor impact on your husband. Much like the boy who cried wolf. You probably get satisfaction over saying it in the heat of the moment but inside his head, he’s laughing at you.


Then why was he crying after I said it this time?

In the past I’ve said it in the heat of the moment but that wasn’t the case this time. It felt different and real this time. Before, I’d just say it when I was really mad. This time it was something I had been thinking about for quite a bit of time beforehand.

Granted the next day he said me threatening divorce had lost a lot of its effect and that I just needed to figure out what I really wanted to do.


----------



## In Absentia

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Imagine being me. 🌪


I can't...


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## RebuildingMe

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Then why was he crying after I said it this time?
> 
> In the past I’ve said it in the heat of the moment but that wasn’t the case this time. It felt different and real this time. Before, I’d just say it when I was really mad. This time it was something I had been thinking about for quite a bit of time beforehand.
> 
> Granted the next day he said me threatening divorce had lost a lot of its effect and that I just needed to figure out what I really wanted to do.


I think it’s a passive-aggressive game you two play. “I want a divorce!” Followed up by “now get into the bedroom and [email protected] me!” You two are spinning your wheels. I know you said he is on the spectrum or something, but I think you should also get an evaluation as well. BPD?


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair

RebuildingMe said:


> I think it’s a passive-aggressive game you two play. “I want a divorce!” Followed up by “now get into the bedroom and [email protected] me!” You two are spinning your wheels. I know you said he is on the spectrum or something, but I think you should also get an evaluation as well. BPD?


I don’t know. My feelings about him fluctuate greatly depending on the day and how he behaves. Yesterday was a great day from the afternoon on . I slept better than I have in ages. I woke up and actually sort of felt desire for him specifically not just general sexual desire. This morning my I was thinking I’d sort of like to have sex with him.

Well then the bubble burst. I screamed because a wild animal almost ran into the house and I was screaming at him to shut the back door that was open. Me screaming flipped some sort of switch in him and he punched me in the arm and then shoved me across the dining room where I flew sideways into a hutch full of glass dishes. There was no thought before my scream and there was no thought before he just shoved me. Me screaming triggered something in him. So I’m not feeling happy thoughts right now.


----------



## Casual Observer

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I guess, but that wasn’t my intention. I actually just wanted to have sex. For the last 2 weeks or so I’ve actually had a sex drive, not specifically associated with him but it’s like I know what it feels like to feel uncontrollably horny for the first time in my entire life.


So how was it for you? How was it for him? (Sorry, this was answered a while back)


Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Deleting this post. I think it’s obvious I need to take a bit of a break from TAM and sort my head and decisions out on my own for a little while.


I wish the best for both of you. Separately or together.


Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Then why was he crying after I said it this time?
> …
> Granted the next day he said me threatening divorce had lost a lot of its effect and that I just needed to figure out what I really wanted to do.


He cried because he may care very deeply for you and wants what’s best, not just for himself, but for you as well. The possibility of that meaning separate paths… sure, you see it as a change that brings some sense of relief, but it’s also really painful letting go of someone you actually do love.

Obviously making some assumptions that might not be true here.


----------



## LATERILUS79

What the hell? Has he ever been physical like that with you before?!

no reason to work on marital problems if he is getting violent. You need to leave him.


----------



## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I don’t know. My feelings about him fluctuate greatly depending on the day and how he behaves. Yesterday was a great day from the afternoon on . I slept better than I have in ages. I woke up and actually sort of felt desire for him specifically not just general sexual desire. This morning my I was thinking I’d sort of like to have sex with him.
> 
> Well then the bubble burst. I screamed because a wild animal almost ran into the house and I was screaming at him to shut the back door that was open. Me screaming flipped some sort of switch in him and he punched me in the arm and then shoved me across the dining room where I flew sideways into a hutch full of glass dishes. There was no thought before my scream and there was no thought before he just shoved me. Me screaming triggered something in him. So I’m not feeling happy thoughts right now.


Ummmm, Wtf.


----------



## Openminded

I think you are both on the spectrum and you don’t react well to each other.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

LATERILUS79 said:


> What the hell? Has he ever been physical like that with you before?!
> 
> no reason to work on marital problems if he is getting violent. You need to leave him.


Yes, he’s hit and shoved me before and it takes a certain circumstance for it to happen. It doesn’t happen often but it’s like an automatic reflex for him when there’s a sudden, very tense situation and I scream or yell. Like one time, the last time I remember anything like this happening, there was a crazy driver on the road and they almost hit us head on when we were getting ready to turn onto our street. I screamed out just like I suppose many people would do when another vehicle is about to plow into them. He just instinctually reached over and punched me in the arm.


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## Openminded

Pushed you? No. No. No. Was that the first time? He needs to understand it should be the last time.


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## Openminded

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Yes, he’s hit and shoved me before and it takes a certain circumstance for it to happen. It doesn’t happen often but it’s like an automatic reflex for him when there’s a sudden, very tense situation and I scream or yell. Like one time, the last time I remember anything like this happening, there was a crazy driver on the road and they almost hit us head on when we were getting ready to turn onto our street. I screamed out just like I suppose many people would do when another vehicle is about to plow into them. He just instinctually reached over and punched me in the arm.


My guess is that it’s likely spectrum-related as to unexpected noise. But he needs to learn to control it. If he can’t, there will likely come a day when you really get hurt.


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## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Yes, he’s hit and shoved me before and it takes a certain circumstance for it to happen. It doesn’t happen often but it’s like an automatic reflex for him when there’s a sudden, very tense situation and I scream or yell. Like one time, the last time I remember anything like this happening, there was a crazy driver on the road and they almost hit us head on when we were getting ready to turn onto our street. I screamed out just like I suppose many people would do when another vehicle is about to plow into them. He just instinctually reached over and punched me in the arm.


Be honest, is it really in the arm?


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## Busy Washing My Hair

QuietRiot said:


> Be honest, is it really in the arm?


I’m being honest. Usually it’s my upper arm or upper leg. I think the time in the car he hit me in the upper arm and on my thigh a few times in rapid succession. It’s always a very quick reaction.


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## LATERILUS79

That’s weird. I guess that could be with something about him being on the spectrum. My ex wife pissed me off plenty. It never crossed my mind to start punching her.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

LATERILUS79 said:


> That’s weird. I guess that could be with something about him being on the spectrum. My ex wife pissed me off plenty. It never crossed my mind to start punching her.


I don’t think what he’s doing in the moment crosses his mind at all, he just does it. Then afterwards he knows it was wrong and he apologizes. Today he said he knows he needs to figure out how to stop doing it but just doesn’t know how.

He also has PTSD which I think contributes to it.


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## Openminded

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I don’t think what he’s doing in the moment crosses his mind at all, he just does it. Then afterwards he knows it was wrong and he apologizes. Today he said he knows he needs to figure out how to stop doing it but just doesn’t know how.
> 
> He also has PTSD which I think contributes to it.


Yes, the combination of the two issues makes it worse. People on the spectrum are very sensitive to loud, unexpected noise and they often lash out. It’s like a startle reflex — automatic with no thought behind it. However, that doesn’t mean it can continue. He needs therapy to learn to cope with his issues.


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## ccpowerslave

LATERILUS79 said:


> That’s weird. I guess that could be with something about him being on the spectrum. My ex wife pissed me off plenty. It never crossed my mind to start punching her.


Hitting a woman = scum.


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## QuietRiot

Openminded said:


> Yes, the combination of the two issues makes it worse. People on the spectrum are very sensitive to loud, unexpected noise and they often lash out. It’s like a startle reflex — automatic with no thought behind it. However, that doesn’t mean it can continue. He needs therapy to learn to cope with his issues.


But if he was completely having no control, how does he control where he hits her? This story doesn’t make sense to me. Ugh this just gets worse.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

QuietRiot said:


> But if he was completely having no control, how does he control where he hits her? This story doesn’t make sense to me. Ugh this just gets worse.


What doesn’t make sense? For some reason if I scream or yell he gets triggered and his instant reaction is to get mad (his face is filled with rage in these moments) and whack me or shove me or both. There isn’t a conscious thought that crosses his mind, I don’t think, other than pure rage and I think there’s some sort of strange defense panic mode that happens too, but he’s not consciously thinking “I’m going to punch her real hard in the arm so she shuts up.” It happens almost instantaneously. He’s very quick to anger like that in those situations. He can’t regulate his emotions well. It’s like an immediate emotional response without any thought process involved. These are the only times when he does this. He doesn’t randomly just come up and punch me because he feels like knocking me around. It’s only in these types of high stress situations and it happens very quickly like with no build up to it at all.

It’s not as if he’s having out of control muscle spasms and his limbs are just flailing at me and I don’t think that’s what @Openminded is saying. There are some people on the spectrum that have tantrums, they are almost non-functional, it’s obvious just by looking at them that they’re “off,” and some are just randomly violent to themselves and/or to others, sometimes almost seeming as if they just have physical ticks and can’t control hitting themselves over and over. That’s not my husband. His spectrum disorder is relatively mild in comparison. I personally don’t really think that his reaction to hit me has much to do with that disorder at all. I think it may be related to other mental health issues, especially the PTSD, but I don’t think he’s just some spastic person with autism lashing out uncontrollably.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Afterwards he proceeded to just complain about everything I do wrong. I’m apparently a POS and an airhead because I accidentally bumped into him and caused him to spill some coffee. I didn’t see that he was standing right behind me. So some coffee spilled on the tiled kitchen floor. It’s normally something that I’d just laugh about and say sorry and clean it up but he was so mad. His face was filled with rage again but he just verbally went after me that time. Then later he was mad that I didn’t really want to talk to him when he wanted to applogize. He goes “Well, I guess good days are just followed by bad days.”


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## LATERILUS79

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Afterwards he proceeded to just complain about everything I do wrong. I’m apparently a POS and an airhead because I accidentally bumped into him and caused him to spill some coffee. I didn’t see that he was standing right behind me. So some coffee spilled on the tiled kitchen floor. It’s normally something that I’d just laugh about and say sorry and clean it up but he was so mad. His face was filled with rage again but he just verbally went after me that time. Then later he was mad that I didn’t really want to talk to him when he wanted to applogize. He goes “Well, I guess good days are just followed by bad days.”


Your bad days though are really bad. Sounds like he just expects you to deal with his crap without him trying to get help and work on it.


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## Casual Observer

To @Busy Washing My Hair - I'm going to give you something to think about from an employer's perspective (which I am). Both you and your husband would like better-paying jobs, but I don't think you're going to get there. Why? Because neither of you respond... "appropriately" to situations. You husband lashing out, hitting things, when he gets angry. You constantly going back and forth on decisions and tolerating situations that should be considered intolerable and demanding of a solution. Here's the thing- what we are in our relationships, we'd like to think that's separate from who we are in the rest of the world, but it's not. These traits are going to be evident in the workplace. They're going to be evident to friends. They're going to limit your options.

You know where this is heading. Put everything on hold, stop thinking either of you can fix this on your own, and get help. Professional help. Some have suggested both of you are on the spectrum. I understand where that's coming from, but it's also possible that you're (incorrectly) built for co-dependent relationships and have some desire to please people. Maybe your sexual past wasn't about yourself but it was thinking you could please somebody else. But this is armchair quarterbacking and projection. Get some real help before making any important decisions.


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## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> What doesn’t make sense? For some reason if I scream or yell he gets triggered and his instant reaction is to get mad (his face is filled with rage in these moments) and whack me or shove me or both. There isn’t a conscious thought that crosses his mind, I don’t think, other than pure rage and I think there’s some sort of strange defense panic mode that happens too, but he’s not consciously thinking “I’m going to punch her real hard in the arm so she shuts up.” It happens almost instantaneously. He’s very quick to anger like that in those situations. He can’t regulate his emotions well. It’s like an immediate emotional response without any thought process involved. These are the only times when he does this. He doesn’t randomly just come up and punch me because he feels like knocking me around. It’s only in these types of high stress situations and it happens very quickly like with no build up to it at all.
> 
> It’s not as if he’s having out of control muscle spasms and his limbs are just flailing at me and I don’t think that’s what @Openminded is saying. There are some people on the spectrum that have tantrums, they are almost non-functional, it’s obvious just by looking at them that they’re “off,” and some are just randomly violent to themselves and/or to others, sometimes almost seeming as if they just have physical ticks and can’t control hitting themselves over and over. That’s not my husband. His spectrum disorder is relatively mild in comparison. I personally don’t really think that his reaction to hit me has much to do with that disorder at all. I think it may be related to other mental health issues, especially the PTSD, but I don’t think he’s just some spastic person with autism lashing out uncontrollably.


Sorry, I wasn’t clear there. What doesn’t make sense to me is him having a hair trigger reaction he has “no control” over but then controls where he hits you…on the arm or leg. That makes no sense in the context “he doesn’t mean to”, then how does he hit the same places every time? It would make sense if he is having a temper tantrum and thinks he can get away with it if he doesn’t hit you in the face. “It’s not abusive if it’s JUST the arm!” Type thing? 

I don’t care what the reason for the violence is, I don’t think it should ever be tolerated. Your story is sad.


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## Jimi007

You could have solved your problems by calling the Police..Restraining order ect. It would be a wake up call for the both of you. Don't be somebody's punching bag. It never end well


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## Casual Observer

Jimi007 said:


> You could have solved your problems by calling the Police..Restraining order ect. It would be a wake up call for the both of you. Don't be somebody's punching bag. It never end well


It appears this has never been something that escalates beyond the reflexive physical action. If things were progressing to the point where she feared for herself, or _should_ fear for herself, I would agree. But calling in the police and heading down the path that would inevitably lead to, is something that needs to be very carefully considered beforehand, and OPs track record of thinking in a consistent and predictable fashion is very poor. She might think it's the right decisions one day, the worst thing she'd done in her life the next.

And I get it! That's exactly how many abused people act!!! But in this particular situation, the underlying issues of mental health, all around, would be made worse by involving the police. I think. 

I also understand the appeal of calling the police, to give at least some permanence to something in her life. But I think that's reactive to the way she changes her thinking day-to-day. Forcing something unfortunate just to create change of lasting nature might not be the right answer. But I get it.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Jimi007 said:


> You could have solved your problems by calling the Police..Restraining order ect. It would be a wake up call for the both of you. Don't be somebody's punching bag. It never end well


Probably not something I’d do


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Casual Observer said:


> It appears this has never been something that escalates beyond the reflexive physical action. If things were progressing to the point where she feared for herself, or _should_ fear for herself, I would agree. But calling in the police and heading down the path that would inevitably lead to, is something that needs to be very carefully considered beforehand, and OPs track record of thinking in a consistent and predictable fashion is very poor. She might think it's the right decisions one day, the worst thing she'd done in her life the next.
> 
> And I get it! That's exactly how many abused people act!!! But in this particular situation, the underlying issues of mental health, all around, would be made worse by involving the police. I think.
> 
> I also understand the appeal of calling the police, to give at least some permanence to something in her life. But I think that's reactive to the way she changes her thinking day-to-day. Forcing something unfortunate just to create change of lasting nature might not be the right answer. But I get it.


I don’t really k ow what else to say but yeah all of this I think.


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## QuietRiot

Casual Observer said:


> It appears this has never been something that escalates beyond the reflexive physical action. If things were progressing to the point where she feared for herself, or _should_ fear for herself, I would agree. But calling in the police and heading down the path that would inevitably lead to, is something that needs to be very carefully considered beforehand, and OPs track record of thinking in a consistent and predictable fashion is very poor. She might think it's the right decisions one day, the worst thing she'd done in her life the next.
> 
> And I get it! That's exactly how many abused people act!!! But in this particular situation, the underlying issues of mental health, all around, would be made worse by involving the police. I think.
> 
> I also understand the appeal of calling the police, to give at least some permanence to something in her life. But I think that's reactive to the way she changes her thinking day-to-day. Forcing something unfortunate just to create change of lasting nature might not be the right answer. But I get it.


Some people are not comfortable unless they are suffering and miserable, as sad as that is. I don’t think counseling of any type is going to happen.


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## Affaircare

Here's the thing: Does he "automatically hit" his boss at work if there's a loud noise? Does he "automatically" hit his friends or his pastor if they scream? I ask because if he DOES automatically hit his boss, his friends, or his pastor, then it is something like a PTSD or an involuntary instinct. If he DOES NOT automatically hit his boss, his friends, or his pastor (or whatever spirtual leader/mentor he may have)...then he CAN control it and just chooses to not control it around you. To me that would indicate violence and abuse...not a tic due to some kind of mental illness.


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## Blondilocks

It would be a good idea if the OP learned not to scream and yell at her spouse. No one appreciates that nonsense. Not that this idea will even be considered because, well, you know.


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## RebuildingMe

Blondilocks said:


> It would be a good idea if the OP learned not to scream and yell at her spouse. No one appreciates that nonsense. Not that this idea will even be considered because, well, you know.


But apparently he wants her to scream during sex. Does that mean he wants to punch her in the arm again?


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

RebuildingMe said:


> But apparently he wants her to scream during sex. Does that mean he wants to punch her in the arm again?


Now, that's a durn good quandry right there. Good one.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Blondilocks said:


> It would be a good idea if the OP learned not to scream and yell at her spouse. No one appreciates that nonsense. Not that this idea will even be considered because, well, you know.


I don’t yell and scream at him but yes you’d think by now I’d learn to not do it even in certain situations where it may just be a natural reaction. Did you read my posts? Yesterday he was standing at the door and it was open. I was outside in our backyard l, he was in the doorway of our house with the door open. I saw a flash of a small wild animal like a squirrel or a chipmunk or something (never saw exactly what it was because it happened so fast) running right toward the door (because one of my dogs was chasing it and steering it right into the house). I yelled out “shut the door!” We have several pets and I didn’t want a wild animal getting into the house. He was just standing there with the door open not paying attention. And sure enough whatever it was ran up scattered up the screen and onto the roof of our porch then into a tree. It would have come straight through the door. So yes I didn’t think and just yelled out in a panic. Time before that was when we were almost hit head on my somebody who had to have been drunk and speeding down the street. I couldn’t control that I yelled at “oh my god!” And they missed us probably by 5 inches and then ran into a ditch.

All of the other times have been similar. I do not just go around yelling and screaming at him.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

RebuildingMe said:


> But apparently he wants her to scream during sex. Does that mean he wants to punch her in the arm again?


He’s never asked me to scream during sex. It’s me who wants him to make some sort of noise (not screaming) or do something every now and then during sex to let me know he’s into it or that he likes (or doesn’t like) something I’m doing. He’s completely silent during sex and it’s hard to tell if he’s enjoying himself or not sometimes. Plus I just like when guys makes a little noise during it or talk to me and tell me what they like. It’s weird when it’s completely silent.


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## RebuildingMe

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> He’s never asked me to scream during sex. It’s me who wants him to make some sort of noise (not screaming) or do something every now and then during sex to let me know he’s into it or that he likes (or doesn’t like) something I’m doing. He’s completely silent during sex and it’s hard to tell if he’s enjoying himself or not sometimes. Plus I just like when guys makes a little noise during it or talk to me and tell me what they like. It’s weird when it’s completely silent.


Oh yes, I was confused. It was you that want him to make noise. So when he does, punch him back 😂


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## Busy Washing My Hair

QuietRiot said:


> Some people are not comfortable unless they are suffering and miserable, as sad as that is. I don’t think counseling of any type is going to happen.


You have no idea if I’ve ever been to therapy or not. Just because I am not currently going does not mean that I never have.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

RebuildingMe said:


> Oh yes, I was confused. It was you that want him to make noise. So when he does, punch him back 😂


It‘s not very funny.

I wish I’d just never posted here at all. It’s only made me feel worse, more hurt, and now embarrassed.


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## RebuildingMe

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> It‘s not very funny.
> 
> I wish I’d just never posted here at all. It’s only made me feel worse, more hurt, and now embarrassed.


I apologize. I just don’t know what you want from the forum? You flip flop daily. It’s hard for anyone to give you any advice when you wash, rinse and repeat daily. How is tomorrow going to be any different from today? Only action creates change.


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## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> You have no idea if I’ve ever been to therapy or not. Just because I am not currently going does not mean that I never have.


Im talking about now. The future. Getting help. I don’t think you or your husband will do that. I hope you prove me wrong. Sometimes being wrong is a good thing.


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## Casual Observer

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> It‘s not very funny.
> 
> I wish I’d just never posted here at all. It’s only made me feel worse, more hurt, and now embarrassed.


You're right; some things aren't funny at all. The physical violence is throwing some of us for a loop though. If you feel embarrassed, or hurt, can you turn that inside out, get it to spur you to action so you can say "I'll show those TAM a-holes I've got what it takes to deal with this on my own, I've got a therapist lined up who knows a whole lot more than those amateurs who just want to use me to feel better about themselves!"

Or something like that. 

There are a whole lot of people here really pulling for you.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

QuietRiot said:


> Im talking about now. The future. Getting help. I don’t think you or your husband will do that. I hope you prove me wrong. Sometimes being wrong is a good thing.


This was said nicely. You can be truthful and kind at the same time. But other statements like “Some people are not comfortable unless they are suffering and miserable, as sad as that is”come off as very judgmental, very high and mighty. I know this won’t mean anything to you because you and everyone else will just interpret it as me being defensive. There are many reasons people may have a hard time seeking help, therapy, counseling, or assistance of some other sort and it can’t all be boiled down to “Oh they just enjoy being miserable. They enjoy wallowing and they want people to feel bad for them.” It’s not always that simple. Maybe it’s always been easy for you to ask for help. Maybe mental health counseling is just par for the course for you. Maybe you don’t have about 25 layers of crap to shovel through to the point of therapy basically paralyzing your life and making it so you’re such an emotional wreck digging all of that stuff up that you can barely function. If so, I’m happy for you. A little empathy goes a long way. But I get that the judgmental 2 x 4s work on some people. That what some people need. They don’t work on everybody. They are hurtful to many people. There’s a way to say the same exact thing without sounding so judgmental.


----------



## LATERILUS79

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> This was said nicely. You can be truthful and kind at the same time. But other statements like “Some people are not comfortable unless they are suffering and miserable, as sad as that is”come off as very judgmental, very high and mighty. I know this won’t mean anything to you because you and everyone else will just interpret it as me being defensive. There are many reasons people may have a hard time seeking help, therapy, counseling, or assistance of some other sort and it can’t all be boiled down to “Oh they just enjoy being miserable. They enjoy wallowing and they want people to feel bad for them.” It’s not always that simple. Maybe it’s always been easy for you to ask for help. Maybe mental health counseling is just par for the course for you. Maybe you don’t have about 25 layers of crap to shovel through to the point of therapy basically paralyzing your life and making it so you’re such an emotional wreck digging all of that stuff up that you can barely function. If so, I’m happy for you. A little empathy goes a long way. But I get that the judgmental 2 x 4s work on some people. That what some people need. They don’t work on everybody. They are hurtful to many people. There’s a way to say the same exact thing without sounding so judgmental.


You know, you can click on anyone's name here. You can read their stories. You can see where they were when they first came here. You can see the language they used when they first started posting here compared to now. 

QuietRiot has virtually smacked me in the face more times than I can count..... and I deserved it. 

Just the same as everyone else here when they showed up to TAM.


----------



## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> This was said nicely. You can be truthful and kind at the same time. But other statements like “Some people are not comfortable unless they are suffering and miserable, as sad as that is”come off as very judgmental, very high and mighty. I know this won’t mean anything to you because you and everyone else will just interpret it as me being defensive. There are many reasons people may have a hard time seeking help, therapy, counseling, or assistance of some other sort and it can’t all be boiled down to “Oh they just enjoy being miserable. They enjoy wallowing and they want people to feel bad for them.” It’s not always that simple. Maybe it’s always been easy for you to ask for help. Maybe mental health counseling is just par for the course for you. Maybe you don’t have about 25 layers of crap to shovel through to the point of therapy basically paralyzing your life and making it so you’re such an emotional wreck digging all of that stuff up that you can barely function. If so, I’m happy for you. A little empathy goes a long way. But I get that the judgmental 2 x 4s work on some people. That what some people need. They don’t work on everybody. They are hurtful to many people. There’s a way to say the same exact thing without sounding so judgmental.


I didn’t say you enjoy it, I said some people are not comfortable unless they are suffering. I think you are comfortable with what you know. A man that punches you, a flip flopping emotion every 3 minutes, paralyzed by fear of leaving more than finding hope. It’s the human condition for some of us to suffer, it’s what we do with it that matters. 

Yes I’ve been all of the things you’ve mentioned. In the deepest hole imaginable, digging myself out pebble by pebble. Life sucks, but even in the midst of the darkest times I see glorious beauty in the transformation that happened as a result. I did get lots of therapy, I did seek physical, spiritual and mental help. I still do. I’m nowhere near complete and fixed nor will I ever be. It’s not judgement I feel toward you, it’s sadness and understanding. And yes, I think you deserve better and you can do better. That is hard to hear from strangers, but sometimes that’s the only one you will hear it from. 

I do wish you all the best, I know you are capable of much more than you think you are.


----------



## Busy Washing My Hair

I’ve actually had a lot of therapy. I come from an extremely dysfunctional family.

A therapist won’t really help with what I need right now. A personal trainer and figuring out my new higher earning career path and taking action on starting with that will do far more for my mental health than another round with a therapist right now. Those are the things bothering me and hindering me the most. I hate the way I look and I have no money and hate my job.

I am making a choice right now. To me, being on my own and having to work 2 crappy jobs that make me miserable just to stay afloat is worse than my current situation.

I’m going to work on making myself look super attractive. This sounds shallow but I’ve really neglected myself. Stopped working out completely, stopped taking care of my skin, stopped wearing makeup, haven’t had a professional haircut in 2 years, gained 25 lbs. it makes me hate myself. When I look good I feel good and and am confident. Right now I just spend most of my time hiding because I hate the way I look so I have no confidence. So that’s step 1.

I’m going to figure out a new career because there’s nowhere to go in my current line of work and I hate my line of work and never meant to be in this career field. I need money, plain and simple.

I actually have a degree in psychology 🤣
I don’t work in that field though and have no interest to. I’ve started a number of masters degrees programs but never finish cuz I have no interest.

Anyway, I got frustrated. I’m not patient. I wanted to be able to leave right away. I legally cannot and financially I cannot. I felt a bit hopeless for a few days. I am extremely emotional. I have emotional issues it’s true. It makes my reactions…intense.

Anyway, I’m going to try to figure out how to file for legal separation without any money to afford a lawyer’s help right now.

Once I’m officially separated then I’m free to have sex with somebody if I finally meet a man who really makes me horny before a full year is up.


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## Blondilocks

LATERILUS79 said:


> You know, you can click on anyone's name here. You can read their stories. You can see where they were when they first came here. You can see the language they used when they first started posting here compared to now.
> 
> *QuietRiot *has virtually smacked me in the face more times than I can count..... and I deserved it.
> 
> Just the same as everyone else here when they showed up to TAM.


She has never smacked me in the face and I'm the resident asshole according to (ahem👈) some.😋


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## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’ve actually had a lot of therapy. I come from an extremely dysfunctional family.
> 
> A therapist won’t really help with what I need right now. A personal trainer and figuring out my new higher earning career path and taking action on starting with that will do far more for my mental health than another round with a therapist right now. Those are the things bothering me and hindering me the most. I hate the way I look and I have no money and hate my job.
> 
> I am making a choice right now. To me, being on my own and having to work 2 crappy jobs that make me miserable just to stay afloat is worse than my current situation.
> 
> I’m going to work on making myself look super attractive. This sounds shallow but I’ve really neglected myself. Stopped working out completely, stopped taking care of my skin, stopped wearing makeup, haven’t had a professional haircut in 2 years, gained 25 lbs. it makes me hate myself. When I look good I feel good and and am confident. Right now I just spend most of my time hiding because I hate the way I look so I have no confidence. So that’s step 1.
> 
> I’m going to figure out a new career because there’s nowhere to go in my current line of work and I hate my line of work and never meant to be in this career field. I need money, plain and simple.
> 
> I actually have a degree in psychology 🤣
> I don’t work in that field though and have no interest to. I’ve started a number of masters degrees programs but never finish cuz I have no interest.
> 
> Anyway, I got frustrated. I’m not patient. I wanted to be able to leave right away. I legally cannot and financially I cannot. I felt a bit hopeless for a few days. I am extremely emotional. I have emotional issues it’s true. It makes my reactions…intense.
> 
> Anyway, I’m going to try to figure out how to file for legal separation without any money to afford a lawyer’s help right now.
> 
> Once I’m officially separated then I’m free to have sex with somebody if I finally meet a man who really makes me horny before a full year is up.


Ok.


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## QuietRiot

Blondilocks said:


> She has never smacked me in the face and I'm the resident asshole according to (ahem👈) some.😋


Well post something preposterous and I will! We can get in a girl fight. Growl.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

QuietRiot said:


> Ok.


Ok.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

QuietRiot obviously doesn’t believe me.


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## LATERILUS79

Blondilocks said:


> She has never smacked me in the face and I'm the resident asshole according to (ahem👈) some.😋


Some of us are more stable than others. 

I tend to suffer from a disease called "stubbornness" which requires doses of smacks from time to time. 

I'd say that a good 90% of TAM members require or required this when they first came here with their relationship problems. 

The other 10% of TAM? Those are the stable A-holes.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Not everyone responds to slaps though, despite what you think. Then again, somebody who didn’t realize that their wife was gaslighting them into believing that no wife actually has sexual with her husband may have warranted a few slaps.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

.


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## LATERILUS79

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Not everyone responds to slaps though, despite what you think. Then again, somebody who didn’t realize that their wife was gaslighting them into believing that no wife actually has sexual with her husband may have warranted a few slaps.


This is true. Absolutely. I certainly didn't come here thinking I was perfect. Far from it.

You don't know what you don't know.

I used to get pissed off when people would tell me something I didn't want to hear. Now I try to think why someone would come to their conclusions. Don't get me wrong, some people here do think they are better than everyone else and like to tell people they suck at life. Most people here have good intentions and want to help. The people in your thread have come here to help.

You don't need any 2x4s from me. Others have that covered. I'll just say I'm hoping for the best for you because you give me the impression that you want to do better than where you are right now. That's awesome. I hope that in a months time you can come here and tell us about your progress!


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## RebuildingMe

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m no longer going to post here. The fact that nobody calls Blondilocks out on suggesting that I should just not scream at my husband (essentially saying that his treatment of me was deserved) as well as her refusal to apologize or acknowledge that what she said was not right makes me realize this isn’t a good place.


You tolerate his behavior so why should an internet stranger back you up? You’ve said so many outlandish things here. You are inconsistent in your thoughts and actions. Just take action to improve your situation. Everyone would love that and you would too. You anger is misplaced. Good luck OP.


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## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m no longer going to post here. The fact that nobody calls Blondilocks out on suggesting that I should just not scream at my husband (essentially saying that his treatment of me was deserved) as well as her refusal to apologize or acknowledge that what she said was not right makes me realize this isn’t a good place.


@Blondilocks! Dammit you done it again! I’m getting my paddle.


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## Sfort

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’m no longer going to post here. The fact that nobody calls Blondilocks out on suggesting that I should just not scream at my husband (essentially saying that his treatment of me was deserved) as well as her refusal to apologize or acknowledge that what she said was not right makes me realize this isn’t a good place.


Don't leave. You were warned. I think you're getting some benefit out of the interaction. Stick with it.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

.


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## RebuildingMe

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Nah, I’m good. I don’t think coming to a forum that makes me cry almost every day is really doing me much good.
> 
> I need to focus on real world things and maybe making some genuine real world friends.


I think reality smacking you in the face is making you cry.
Smartest thing you said in two weeks. I really wish you well. You have a lot to work on, but freedom is a price worth paying for.


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## Jimi007

@Busy Washing My Hair 
Breathe....just Breathe.....I don't think anyone here means you I'll will. When a man shoves , hits a woman, it's a huge trigger...Take what you want , leave the rest.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

.


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## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> There we go again. Denying that anybody here could have possibly said something that was actually hurtful and it’s just that I can’t handle reality, which people here have so thankfully finally made me see through their touch love and “telling it like it is.”
> 
> No, I cry when my feelings get hurt and they get hurt very easily, which I can admit. I have cried a few times because somebody here has been so nice to me too but those are good tears. I thank those people for that.
> 
> Believe me, nobody here as slapped me in the face and made me see reality. I didn’t need anyone to do that for me. I’ve known what my reality was all on my own for quite some time. Has it made me cry? Sure it has. But it’s nothing that anybody here made me see.
> 
> And to the last comment here, I don’t think anybody means ill will either but it doesn’t change the fact that I obviously can’t handle strangers on the internet and their opinions.


Out of curiousity, why can’t you handle having friends in real life either?

I find it a bit ironic you want people to accept responsibility and accountability for words, but you seem to have a really difficult time accepting your responsibility and accountability for changing your life or your situation… you seem to want to blame it on being ugly and worthless which are completely out of your control. Even just considering how the healthy way is to go about that; you have 345 reasons why those don’t work for you... that’s not an insult… just an observation.

A lot of people here use humor… perhaps much of it is in poor taste, (not me of course I’m hilarious) but if you don’t take everything so personally… and try to look objectively, I find it’s not as offensive as it may seem.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

.


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## LATERILUS79

Busy, you're good. 

Take your time. You aren't going to fix everything overnight. 

Good to hear you are getting back on your bike. I think it will do you a lot of good physically and emotionally. I get your social anxiety issues. I do. Riding bikes makes meeting people so much easier in my opinion. Look for opportunities when you go out on your rides.


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## Busy Washing My Hair

Please permaban me so I cannot come back here. Thank you.


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## Casual Observer

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> I’ve actually had a lot of therapy. I come from an extremely dysfunctional family.
> 
> A therapist won’t really help with what I need right now. A personal trainer and figuring out my new higher earning career path and taking action on starting with that will do far more for my mental health than another round with a therapist right now. Those are the things bothering me and hindering me the most. I hate the way I look and I have no money and hate my job.
> 
> I am making a choice right now. To me, being on my own and having to work 2 crappy jobs that make me miserable just to stay afloat is worse than my current situation.
> 
> I’m going to work on making myself look super attractive. This sounds shallow but I’ve really neglected myself. Stopped working out completely, stopped taking care of my skin, stopped wearing makeup, haven’t had a professional haircut in 2 years, gained 25 lbs. it makes me hate myself. When I look good I feel good and and am confident. Right now I just spend most of my time hiding because I hate the way I look so I have no confidence. So that’s step 1.
> 
> I’m going to figure out a new career because there’s nowhere to go in my current line of work and I hate my line of work and never meant to be in this career field. I need money, plain and simple.
> 
> I actually have a degree in psychology 🤣
> I don’t work in that field though and have no interest to. I’ve started a number of masters degrees programs but never finish cuz I have no interest.
> 
> Anyway, I got frustrated. I’m not patient. I wanted to be able to leave right away. I legally cannot and financially I cannot. I felt a bit hopeless for a few days. I am extremely emotional. I have emotional issues it’s true. It makes my reactions…intense.
> 
> Anyway, I’m going to try to figure out how to file for legal separation without any money to afford a lawyer’s help right now.
> 
> Once I’m officially separated then I’m free to have sex with somebody if I finally meet a man who really makes me horny before a full year is up.


That post… there’s a lot you’ve held back on disclosing until recently. The physical altercations and now, long time after it first came up, and many many times since, you disclose a history of therapy. All the suggestions many made, including me, to seek therapy… you chose not to disclose. You chose not to say, bern there, done that. Why?


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

It was only a matter of time before bwmh left of her own accord imho. Hopefully some tidbits of good honest info from tam will stick with her.


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## In Absentia

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> Please permaban me so I cannot come back here. Thank you.


You can... with a different user name and using a VPN...


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

In Absentia said:


> You can... with a different user name and using a VPN...


You beat me to it. I do forecast a new member with similar writing style soon....


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## In Absentia

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> I do forecast a new member with similar writing style soon....


well, yeah...


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## QuietRiot

Busy Washing My Hair said:


> .


That’s a hell of a period I was quoted on. Yikes, I’m sure it was epic. I’m notably chastised. 

I do wish you well OP, despite what you think…we all do. Take care.


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## Casual Observer

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> You beat me to it. I do forecast a new member with similar writing style soon....


There has been a relatively common theme where the OP’s exit is accompanied by the declaration that they’re now free and can go have sex with whom ever suitably turns them on. Whether still married or not. Not a long term thing but immediate. No time to heal or process. After pages and pages of heart-breaking posts, it’s felt a bit odd.


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## Blondilocks

The OP has definitely experienced more sturm and drang than most. Sometimes more sturm and sometimes more drang depending on circumstance. Bless her heart.


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## Casual Observer

Blondilocks said:


> The OP has definitely experienced more sturm and drang than most. Sometimes more sturm and sometimes more drang depending on circumstance. Bless her heart.


I don’t know what sturm and drang are, but I approve this message.


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## LATERILUS79

Casual Observer said:


> I don’t know what sturm and drang are, but I approve this message.


Ok. Now I don’t feel so bad. I had no idea what they were either.


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## ah_sorandy

LATERILUS79 said:


> Ok. Now I don’t feel so bad. I had no idea what they were either.


*Definition of Sturm & Drang*



1 *: *a late 18th century German literary movement characterized by works containing rousing action and high emotionalism that often deal with the individual's revolt against society 



2 *: *turmoil


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## RebuildingMe

ah_sorandy said:


> *Definition of Sturm & Drang*
> 
> 
> 
> 1 *: *a late 18th century German literary movement characterized by works containing rousing action and high emotionalism that often deal with the individual's revolt against society
> 
> 
> 
> 2 *: *turmoil


I had no idea. Now I feel my investment in this 11 pages has finally paid off.


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## ccpowerslave

LATERILUS79 said:


> Ok. Now I don’t feel so bad. I had no idea what they were either.


I’m familiar…



https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/VII:_Sturm_und_Drang



Has the now classic song “512” on it about Randy’s prison cell.

Now that OP has flown the coop this is back to “what’s on your mind”?


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## Blondilocks

RebuildingMe said:


> I had no idea. Now I feel my investment in this 11 pages has finally paid off.


Glad to have you helped you out, bud.


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## TexasMom1216

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> You beat me to it. I do forecast a new member with similar writing style soon....


Someone got tired of one game. They’ll start another.


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