# Considering Divorce - Need objective opinion



## sammie11 (Oct 13, 2017)

Hi all,
I'm new here! Thank you in advance for reading this post and offering your opinion. I am in a terrible place, very afraid of doing the wrong thing or making the divorce decision hastily. 

Here is the story: I've been married almost 10 years. The marriage has always had it's troubles and at the same time he has been kind and patient in the past, I would have never believed he could become so mean. We were super young (19 and 21) when we got married. I have always felt invisible but I could live with that I guess. An example of that is that I've been pregnant 8 times, have miscarried 4 times which was always traumatic for me, lost one baby at birth and the three living I breastfed for well over a year.

I really, desperately needed an extra hand around the house and with the babies but he just never really heard me. My husband never took responsibility for anything. I have always done everything from the mowing to the dishes and beyond. Around 5 years ago he started to develop some anger issues, perhaps from the stress of life with two young kids...? He has always been a bit of a downer but he was really cranky all the time and took it out on me in small ways. Two years ago I made a huge mistake and had an affair. 

I came clean to him myself and completely cut off all contact with that person, made all personal accounts and my journal and phone open and available for my husband to read etc (all the things recommended by our therapist to heal after an affair.) 

2 years ago I started a job, my first real job since we've been married, and it requires me to travel a good bit (maybe a weekend or two per month, sometimes less sometimes more). Together we spoke to my boss about what we can and can't handle for family life and he was very supportive and accommodating. I also go through EXTREMES to make it easiest on him - always let him know my whereabouts, never drink alcohol, never spend time alone with any man whatsoever, never do anything except my job while away. Also, leave pre-made meals, outfits for the kids, etc.

My husband has always resented it somehow though. His anger has become abusive in the past two years and I'm at the point where I feel so crushed in spirit and so unable to let myself be myself. Every day I'm stressed about feeling or thinking in a way that he does not like. He regularly gets so angry he will destroy things around the house, once threw a chair and it literally went through the wall....in front of the kids )': He has hit me twice in the past 6 months (this is new), and regularly (once a week or more) lashes out at me and called me terrible things "stupid ****", "****", and often more covert "Oh, I think you are just fundamentally selfish so it's hard for you to be compassionate." 

I have been doing really well, I'm a proud of my own behavior. When he has what I call an "episode" I do not engage, just tell him calmly, "I would like to talk about your concerns but not when you are yelling/speaking to me that way." The last straw for me is that he won't listen when I say I cannot be part of these tense/scary conversations in the presence of our kids. I feel like I have drained myself emotionally, and physically has not been good either - I've had lots of trouble eating and sleeping (my sister asked if I had an eating disorder I'm so thin!!) and loads of panic attacks ):

All that said, he can sometimes be very nice, which is confusing. 

So after setting my boundaries clearly and firmly for many months, doing my part honestly to the best of my ability, and nothing changing I am thinking it's time to leave this relationship. My only holdup is for my kids. 

This is long I know, so thanks again for reading.


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## TJW (Mar 20, 2012)

No matter whether you have had an affair, your husband has no right to be abusive. He has the right to divorce you for your adultery, if he so chooses, but not to assault you. 

I'd recommend you take your children and get away from him. Get a lawyer and see where you stand legally and financially. And report the physical violence to the police, and press charges. Your husband is committing a crime.

All abusers can "sometimes be very nice". Do not be confused. I'm sure Charles Manson was "sometimes nice", too. Left alone, without professional intervention, the abuser will escalate into worse violence.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

I stopped after reading that he hit you. 

He's abusive and it's only going to get worse.

Leave now.


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## javathehutt (Oct 4, 2017)

I have to agree with lifeistooshort on this one. Think about your children. 

I grew up with a father who was abusive to my mother. One of my first memories as a child was my father giving my mother a black eye and leaving. Afterwards, one of my mother's friends came over and I watched them attempt to cover the black eye with make up as I sat on the kitchen table...mind you, I was 4. 

If he's abused you in front of your children, it will have a huge impact on their lives forever. If you have a daughter, what would be your advice to her? Would you advise her to stay with a physically abusive man?


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## cc48kel (Apr 5, 2017)

I would leave.. If you don't it will get worse. Why would you want your children to see all this? I'm sure it makes them sad and could affect them at school. Protect yourself and the kids.


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## sammie11 (Oct 13, 2017)

Yes, I hate the thought of my kids seeing this. It's easy to second guess myself because he COULD have hit harder, sometimes he is very nice. The thing that makes me feel this is hopeless is that he downplays the importance of how badly he has treated me and says, "Oh its not as bad as you say" or "I barely touched you" and even claims it was an accident when he punched a hole in the wall. He won't even consider how scary it was to me, whether or not he could have hit harder. Without taking responsibility how will he ever make changes? It is crazy making. When I write it all out though it seems so clear that I must leave.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

The problem is:

The problem is, his problem is not his, it is everyone's in that house. 

Your problems may not end when his' are stuffed where the sun don't shine.

Stuffed and shifted into the past. The place you were, no longer are.

But, they will be lessened. That is the lesson to be learned by all in that house.


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## Mizzbak (Sep 10, 2016)

sammie, 
This is such a painful, awful situation for you to be in. Have you spoken to anyone about what is going on? Can you talk to your sister? You need to get support from someone who can physically be there to help you. And you need to get legal support and intervention. 

There is something that I want to make very clear. Your affair is not an acceptable excuse or a reason for what your husband is doing. My husband cheated on me and I agree that it hurts and it sucks incredibly to be cheated on. And it can make the betrayed person very angry. BUT that doesn't give your husband the right to abuse you and your family like he has been. You have not done anything that could deserve it. (I'm not even going to get into how your kids don't deserve to be exposed to what he is doing and who he has become.) If your husband cannot get over what happened, then he should have made the decision to exit your marriage. But what he is doing is not justifiable, no matter what your past mistakes were.

Your husband is spiralling down into something horrible. And if you don't want him to take you and your kids down with him, you need to get out.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

@sammie11, 

There actually is a reason why he seems nice sometimes and it confuses you. There is a cycle that abusive people go through, and here is an image of it:










As your relationship progresses, the cycle typically becomes more and more intense. The abuse stage lasts longer and becomes more violent, while the loving remorse stage dwindles. Usually an abuser loves a good challenge. The goal is to win the victim back, at any price. The harder the abuser has to work to win back the person they abuse, the more they appreciate the "victim." So they begging and pleading may last, but the actual feeling of love and actions of behaving lovingly dwindle. 

I know you are hoping for the best and giving him the benefit of the doubt, but I would strongly suggest that you leave at least to protect yourself from being hit. And don't forget, hitting is not the only form of "physical" abuse! Physical abuse is defined as "any intentional act causing injury or trauma to another person or animal by way of bodily contact." So physical abuse can include pushing, pinching, choking, grabbing, smacking, kicking, shaking, backing you into a corner, blocking the way so you can't leave, pulling your hair, punching the wall right by your head, throwing things at you, holding a knife over you, preventing you from sleeping, kicking the dog, throwing the cat hard up against the wall, breaking down a door to get to you, locking you out of the house in winter, forcing you out of the car. 

I would highly recommend learning a little more about verbal abuse, at Dr. Irene's site. I just started on the first page and kept reading and reading ... and I learned a lot. Welcome to Dr. Irene's Verbal Abuse Site|Dr. Irene's Verbal Abuse (Site)!


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## sammie11 (Oct 13, 2017)

Wow, wonderfully helpful information. Thank you so much for this! Dr. Irene's site is amazing!


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Once a relationship becomes violent, then its time to go.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

There are links to two safety/exit plan info sites.....

http://www.ncdsv.org/images/DV_Safety_Plan.pdf
Safety Planning ? Domestic Violence Resource Center

Below is a safety exist plan that I put together. You can look through all this and take what makes sense for you and make your own plan.....

Call 911 and they will help you get away.
* The National Domestic Violence Hotline | 24/7 Confidential Support*
If you are afraid your internet usage might be monitored call the national domestic violence hotline at 1 800 799 7233.

========================================

It is very hard to leave a marriage. Boy do I know that from experience. There is a way to make it easier… having a plan and having a strong support system. Just work your plan one step at a time. That way you are not look at a huge problem. Instead you are looking at small steps. 

If you search on the internet for "domestic abuse exit plan" or "domestic abuse safety plan" a lot will come up that you can look over. The one below is one that I added some things to base on my own experience.

*Get a support system: *



Find a local organization that provides counseling and help for victims of domestic abuse (emotional and physical). Get into counseling with them. They will have sliding scale counseling.


Also check into legal aid in your area.



Talk to attorneys and do research on the internet to find out your rights in divorce. Check on sites like Amazon for books about divorce in your state. Be informed. Check out legal aid in your area. Ask the domestic abuse organization if they have a list of attorneys who do pro-bono work or very low fee work and how specialize in cases of divorce with domestic abuse. Most will have such a list. Many attorneys will give a half hour free consultation. If you have a good list of questions, you can learn about your rights and how the local court system handles specific issues. You might even find an attorney that you really like.


Let a trusted family member, friend, coworker or neighbors know your situation. Develop a plan for when you need help; code words you can text if in trouble, a visual signal like a porch light: on equals no danger, off equals trouble. 
If you do not have friends of your own, start making them. Even if you don’t share your situation with them, just having a social outlet for you and even your children will help. One way to meet people is to go to www.meetup.com Search for meetup groups in your area. In most areas they have a lot of things to choose from. You just sign up and go.



*Set up a ‘safe address’ and ‘safe storage space’. *



If you have a trusted friend/family-member, ask them if you can use their address for some things and if you can store some things at their place… like a box of important papers. If you do not have someone who will help you out in this way, rent a PO Box and a small storage space. Use the ‘safe addresses for your mail. Use the ‘safe storage space’ to keep important things you will need like:


your mail from the ‘safe address’


All account info and ATM card for your personal checking account


Copies of all financial paperwork, filed tax forms, etc.


Certified copies of birth certificates, marriage license, passports, 


Car title, social security cards, credit cards, 


Citizenship documents (such as your passport, green card, etc.) 


Titles, deeds and other property information 


Medical records


Children's school and immunization records


Insurance information


Verification of social security numbers Make sure you know your husband’s Social Security Number and your son’s. 


Welfare identification


Valued pictures, jewelry or personal possessions

*Financial Plan*


Consider getting a job as soon as you can if you do not already have one. This will give you access to money and independence.


*Your safety Plan: *

You need a safety plan just in case you need to leave immediately if things get out of hand. 



Know the phone number to your local battered women's shelter. 


Keep your cell phone on you at all times for dialing 911. It’s best to dial 911. You need to establish a record of his abuse. So call 911 and start creating that record. If you think that it is not safe for you to leave, ask the 911 operator to send the police so that they can ensure your and your child’s safety when you leave.


If you are injured, go to a doctor or an emergency room and report what happened to you. Ask that they document your visit. 


Keep a journal of all violent incidences, noting dates, events and threats made. 


Keep any evidence of physical abuse, such as pictures. 


You can get a VAR (voice activated recorder) and keep it on you at all times when you are around your husband. This way you can get recordings of the abuse. 


Plan with your children and identify a safe place for them. Reassure them that their job is to stay safe, not to protect you.


If you need to sneak away, be prepared. Make a plan for how and where you will escape. 


Back your car into the driveway, and keep it fueled. Keep your driver's door unlocked and other doors locked for a quick escape. 


Hide an extra set of car keys. 


Set money aside. Open a checking account in your name only and put your paycheck (or a portion of it) in that account. Do not use the address of the home you live in with him for this checking account. Use your ”safe address” to the account and keep all of the paperwork related to the account in your “safe storage space”. 


Pack a bag. Include an extra set of keys, IDs, car title, birth certificates, social security cards, credit cards, marriage license, clothes for yourself and your children, shoes, medications, banking information, money" anything that is important to you. Store them at a trusted friend or neighbor's house. Try to avoid using the homes of next-door neighbors, close family members and mutual friends. 


Take important phone numbers of friends, relatives, doctors, schools, etc. 


Know abuser's schedule and safe times to leave. 


Be careful when reaching out for help via Internet or telephone. Erase your Internet browsing history, websites visited for resources, e-mails sent to friends/family asking for help. If you called for help, dial another number immediately after in case abuser hits redial. 


Create a false trail. Call motels, real estate agencies and schools in a town at least six hours away from where you plan to relocate.


*After Leaving the Abusive Relationship*


 *If you get a restraining order, and the offender is leaving the family home: *


Change your locks and phone number. 


Change your work hours and route taken to work. 


Change the route taken to transport children to school. 


Keep a certified copy of your restraining order with you at all times. 


Inform friends, neighbors and employers that you have a restraining order in effect. 


Give copies of the restraining order to employers, neighbors and schools along with a picture of the offender. 


Call law enforcement to enforce the order. 


 *If you leave the family home: *


Do not leave your children with your abusive spouse/partner. Take them with you. Talk to your attorney and/or the abuse organization counselors to make sure you do this in a way that will not jeopardize your future custody rights. You don’t want to look like you are kidnapping your children.


Consider renting a post office box or using the address of a friend for your mail. Be aware that addresses are on restraining orders and police reports. Be careful to whom you give your new address and phone number. 


Change your work hours, if possible. 


Alert school authorities of the situation. 


Consider changing your children's schools. 


Reschedule appointments if the offender is aware of them. 


Use different stores and frequent different social spots. 


Alert neighbors, and request that they call the police if they feel you may be in danger. 


Talk to trusted people about the violence. 


Replace wooden doors with steel or metal doors. Install security systems if possible. Install a motion sensitive lighting system. 


Tell people you work with about the situation and have your calls screened by one receptionist if possible. 


Tell people who take care of your children who can pick up your children. Explain your situation to them and provide them with a copy of the restraining order. 


Call the telephone company to request caller ID. Ask that your phone number be blocked so that if you call anyone, neither your partner nor anyone else will be able to get your new, unlisted phone number.

 
Here are some ways you can find out things about your finances and some about how you can start saving money in your own name. I’m not putting them on the open forum because I don’t want to tip off people who are abusers.

Some of this might sound crazy. But you are completely in the dark and these are ways that people I know, even I, got the info we needed so that our spouse could not rip us off in a divorce.

Check his wallet and get photographs of any cards and other info that he has in there to include his driver’s license. Make sure to save them somewhere that he cannot get to, like on the cloud.

If he has a brief case do the same thing to it. Do you have a scanner at home? If not get one. I have a small portable that’s easy to use. That’s all you need. Just scan everything in his briefcase into pdf or jpgs. And again keep that info in a cloud account.

If you do use a cloud account, make sure that it does not create an account on your PC that he could see. There is a way to prevent that.

Does he have a home office or a place at home where he works sometimes? If so search it (often). Check the trash.. (I found out all kinds of stuff about my husband by searching his trash. Like I found letters from his affair partner. That’s how I found out about one of his affairs. I also found receipts and statements showing that he was moving money that I earned into accounts and investments in his and his mother’s name. 

Another thing that you might want to try is to go through the trash from his business if you can get to it. Just snatch the bags of trash out of the trash bin into your car, take them some place where he will not see you go through it and search. I kid you not, you can find stuff.

Get a key to his car. Make one if you need to. Then search it often. Search every cranny. Again I found all kinds of info that way. My then husband was hiding papers in the well where the spare tire and tools go. When he traveled, I drove to the airport, found his car in long-term parking and searched it. He was using his car to hide things while he traveled.

Get online and order his credit report. It could lead to all kinds of info on accounts he has.

Search the court records for any law suits. If he has a business, it might have been sued and he might have had to disclose financial info. Here where I live there is a website for the state of New Mexico where we can search on a person’s name to find all court cases of any kind… to include if they were sued, arrested and charged, divorced, etc. I’m sure that New York has something similar.
Make sure that you take an inventory of everything of value in your home. Take photos of everything. And do a walking inventory through the house. That way he cannot hide or dispose of things of value during a divorce.
=========================================
Now about money

Then open bank accounts in your name only. Use an address other than your home address. Also do electronic statements, etc. so that there is no paperwork for him to find. You can open a bank account with as little as $25.

If at all possible, every time you go to a store, get out cash. Even if it’s $10. I know a woman who did this. She’d get out between $40 and $60 with every purchase. It added up… to thousands over a few year period. Make sure that you throw away the receipts before you get home or keep them where he cannot find them. Do not put them in your home trash.

Go through your house and sell anything that you can. Just tell him that you are wanting to simplify your life and declutter. List things on craigslist and sell it. Put the money in your bank account.

Here is a link to a thread about evidence gathering.
http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/209754-standard-evidence-post.html


If you have access to a computer that he uses, put a key stroke monitor on his computer. A very good one is Webwatcher. It captures every keystroke and takes screen shots. Then it sends the information to your account on their website. So you don’t even need to get on his computer after the software is installed. You will be able to get passwords, account numbers, etc. this way.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

@sammie11

As others have said, it's time for you to get out of this marriage...for your children first and then yourself second.

Pay a lot of attention to the Cycle of Abuse info that Affaircare posted. 

Your husband is not only verbally abusive, he is a violent man. He's physically abusive. Abuse is about control. So you need to be very careful with your plan to leave and end the marriage. He will get worse if he feels he's losing control of you. 

Please call the hotline I posted above and find an organization in your area that can help you. 

Make a safety plan and an exit plan.

Be safe. Keep your children safe.

Putting holes in walls, throwing chairs through walls is all domestic violence. The message is "this time it's the wall, or the chair (whatever), next time it just might be you I put through the wall." It's a threat to kill you. Do you realize what would happen to you if he were to do to you what he did to that chair & wall? You would be at least in the emergency room with life threatening injuries. And you just might be dead.

Take his violence very serious. Please call the police if he ever hits you, pushes you, throws objects, puts holes in the wall, etc. You need a record that proves he's physically abusive and violent. You need that to protect your children. YOu need it to push the courts to force him into counseling in order to have time with your children. You need it to prove that you are in need of help.


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## sammie11 (Oct 13, 2017)

Hi again everyone. I really appreciate your responses and have been reading through the links given. 
I see that my husband's behavior is abusive and that no human being should even treat another human being this way. I do not feel as though I am in danger physically, and I am hesitant somehow to consider him a full out, dangerous abuser. I have separated from him and although he has attempted to get back together a few times (but I refuse since he still downplays his treatment and claims it is normal for couples to fight, etc...he won't take responsibility for his actions) he has not threatened me as it seems many abusers do. Although it was scary when he hit me and damaged trust, the verbal abuse has by far been the biggest issue for me.

I am curious - if it were just the verbal abuse alone, not hitting whatsoever, would you all still encourage me to go? Or do you think verbal abuse is an overly sensitive reason to leave a marriage?


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

I think abuse of any kind is a reason for divorce.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

sammie11 said:


> Hi again everyone. I really appreciate your responses and have been reading through the links given.
> I see that my husband's behavior is abusive and that no human being should even treat another human being this way. I do not feel as though I am in danger physically, and I am hesitant somehow to consider him a full out, dangerous abuser. I have separated from him and although he has attempted to get back together a few times (but I refuse since he still downplays his treatment and claims it is normal for couples to fight, etc...he won't take responsibility for his actions) he has not threatened me as it seems many abusers do. Although it was scary when he hit me and damaged trust, the verbal abuse has by far been the biggest issue for me.
> 
> I am curious - if it were just the verbal abuse alone, not hitting whatsoever, would you all still encourage me to go? Or do you think verbal abuse is an overly sensitive reason to leave a marriage?


Well there is verbal abuse and there is verbal abuse, but now that its gone violent it will only get worse. If a man hit me that would be it.


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

I doubt very much that his abusive behavior, whether verbal, emotional, and/or physical would change. It takes a lot of effort/time, along with professional help for someone to change somewhat for the better. Per your posts, he is minimizing his behavior toward you. This is absolutely not good. He would only behave for a while, then the cycle would start all over. My advice to you is to get out of this relationship. Do all you need to do to be prepared and ready for when you serve him.


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## Mizzbak (Sep 10, 2016)

sammie, 
When we love someone we want to believe the best of them. We want to believe that all the times that they hurt us, and were uncaring of our pain, were just anomalous, and not who they really are. But actually they are showing us who they are and how they think of us in how they act towards us. Every day. Even if "all" your husband had done was verbally abuse you, would you want any one of your children to grow up and live in a marriage that was like that? If it wouldn't be good enough for your children, then it shouldn't be good enough for you. You deserve better. So no, I don't think that you are being overly sensitive about verbal abuse. Right now, your marriage is not a healthy, happy place for you and your children. Which is why you have made the decision to step out of it.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*You may well have cheated but IMHO, he drove you to it!

There is no excuse for inflicting either mental or physical abuse on a mate!

You need to visit with a good family attorney and have them assess all of your legal rights! You need to be out from under his purview!*


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## GuacaColey (Sep 19, 2017)

sammie11 said:


> Hi all,
> I'm new here! Thank you in advance for reading this post and offering your opinion. I am in a terrible place, very afraid of doing the wrong thing or making the divorce decision hastily.
> 
> Here is the story: I've been married almost 10 years. The marriage has always had it's troubles and at the same time he has been kind and patient in the past, I would have never believed he could become so mean. We were super young (19 and 21) when we got married. I have always felt invisible but I could live with that I guess. An example of that is that I've been pregnant 8 times, have miscarried 4 times which was always traumatic for me, lost one baby at birth and the three living I breastfed for well over a year.
> ...




Oh sweetie. 

I too, had a husband who would curse me out several times a week, throw household objects in anger, blame me for all his unhappiness. 

I tried so hard to make him happy. Did his laundry, ironed his clothes and made his lunches for work, gave him sex all the time and encouraged him to have lots of time with his friends. 

At the end of the day, none of it was good enough and he always hated me. He blamed me for things that were out of my control.

You made a bad decision that hurt your marriage, and you have sought genuine repentance (your transparency with your phone, whereabouts, etc) and I think you have given this your best. 

He doesn't have the right to keep punishing you. 

For your marriage to succeed, he must be willing to let go of the past and build a new foundation with you.

Please find the strength to leave this man. He is escalating, things will only get worse.

I left my DH over 4 months ago because he was emotionally and verbally abusive and things were headed to being physical. I realized I really missed the man I wanted him to be and not who he actually was. 

Now every morning I wake up with hope and a new sense of joy. I'm not always fearful of what hateful words are going to come out of DHs mouth next. It hasn't been easy, but I've rediscovered my peace. 

It's worth it. For you and your littles. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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