# Dating after a decade, playing the game, honesty



## Indy Nial (Sep 26, 2010)

So I'm back in the single life, wanting to date and even have someone in particular I like.

She showed plenty if interest, flirting, touching, etc. I asked her out for lunch more as freinds, things went well and she returned the interest by asking me out for lunch. She then cancelled and I said she didn't owe me lunch, she then said was I rejecting her, I said no and asked her out on a proper date, she couldn't make the day I suggested but said we should catch up and discuss the following week. I did and she said she was free in 3 weekends time - she thinks! I then stupidly said we should forget it thinking I was being given excuses.

I then pulled back and made no attempt to contact her, since then my friends have told me I'm being a d1ck, she clearly likes me and I should ask her out again. She then tells me that I've been ignoring her and asks me out for lunch, I didn't suggest anything. I then talk to her some more and get her number.

I texted her and she always responds instantly, yet her answers are short and not very chatty. The lunch date is this weekend so I'm just going to play it very cool.

Now, the issue I have is that I hate playing games and after going through my x-wifes infidelity have a very, very low threshold for BS. A few times I have come off sounding *****y, I'm not, its just that I see things very black and white. If you like me - great, if not don't waste my time. I'm trying to work on this!

Is game playing inevitable? Is there never a time to just say do you like me or not? If she is just playing games how do I stop being part of the game without looking *****y?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

indy, I'm there with you, decided to jump in and realizing that for many women, particularly attractive ones, you have to play. I was asking basic questions like this on the NMMNG forum, things that have completely eluded me, I was trying to be both polite and assertive and somehow lost a date that I thought was already set up. Was pointed out that I was being rude, or else doing my nice guy care-taking too much that I overthought it. So complicated, anyways just keep doing it and don't chase too much, set the date and say as little as possible to prevent losing their interest. (FTR, I did finally get a first date with a woman last night, it was a little awkward and uncomfortable, but got to know someone genuinely real and nice, exactly what I wanted).


----------



## OOE (Mar 17, 2011)

Just remember that the behaviors/emotional makeup/beliefs that you see while dating will only become more pronounced the more serious the relationship becomes.

Obviously we're only seeing your perception of this woman, but it sounds like you see her as somewhat flaky. If she is, it will only get worse.


----------



## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Indy Nial said:


> So I'm back in the single life, wanting to date and even have someone in particular I like.
> 
> She showed plenty if interest, flirting, touching, etc. I asked her out for lunch more as freinds, things went well and she returned the interest by asking me out for lunch. She then cancelled and I said she didn't owe me lunch, she then said was I rejecting her, I said no and asked her out on a proper date, she couldn't make the day I suggested but said we should catch up and discuss the following week. I did and she said she was free in 3 weekends time - she thinks! I then stupidly said we should forget it thinking I was being given excuses.
> 
> ...


Depends upon your expectation.

Maybe she is nuts for you ... but she has very limited availability, particularly the case if a professional and a mother.

I have a personal rule, if somebody consistently reschedules, or turns down date suggestions , I let it go. They are either simply too busy to possibly engage in anything meaningful or just aren't that into you.

And you can approach it very easily:

"Seems like you're very busy. Just get in touch with me when your schedule frees up." And leave it that.
Onus is on them to make a move and schedule something. 

Dating IS game playing. But you decide your own rules, and how much of anyone elses you are going to put up with.


----------



## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

One of your primary rules should be ...

Do NOT tie emotional outcomes to the expectation of a date.

In a nutshell ... you shouldn't give a sh!t whether this woman wants you to be her soulmate or not. Certainly not now.

And if she cancels a date, you don't get all worked up ... because you aren't attaching anything either personal, or emotional to the date, whether you feel like you're crazy about her or not. Make sense?

Worrying about whether or not she 'likes' you is what you do in high school. You can't personalize it ... not as a man ... not when dating.

Once you have been on several dates and have a far better indicator of how you feel about her, and she about you ... you can make a decision about what kind of emotional investment you are prepared to make.


----------



## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

Deejo has it spot on. It seems like your pre determining how you should emotionally feel with her even before you feel it.

Here's what I would do. Ask her on a date. She cancels. Say ok. Ask another woman on a date. Go on the other date. First woman calls me up. Asks if I'm ignoring her? Say, "yes. Yes I am. I'm just trying to see how long it would take for you to miss me.". Ask her on another date. After much discussion with her setting the terms of the schedule, Let her Schedule for three weeks in the future at eight. Fine.

Ask another woman on a date. Then another. Maybe even a second date with one or to of them. Then the night of my big date I go find out if she's a nice enough lady or a wack job.

Dating absolutely is playing a game. It's the human version of a mating dance some tropical bird does when he's trying to get a little something something. Or something long term. Just have fun with it. Confidence and humor.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Rule of 3.


----------



## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Indy Nial said:


> So I'm back in the single life, wanting to date and even have someone in particular I like.
> 
> She showed plenty if interest, flirting, touching, etc. I asked her out for lunch more as freinds, things went well and she returned the interest by asking me out for lunch. She then cancelled and I said she didn't owe me lunch, she then said was I rejecting her, I said no and asked her out on a proper date, she couldn't make the day I suggested but said we should catch up and discuss the following week. I did and she said she was free in 3 weekends time - she thinks! I then stupidly said we should forget it thinking I was being given excuses.
> 
> ...


Wow!

If you aren't into games, I sure hope you'll find someone who feels the same way you do. I can't imagine all women are doing this - at least not on purpose...


----------



## Indy Nial (Sep 26, 2010)

> Do NOT tie emotional outcomes to the expectation of a date.





> It seems like your pre determining how you should emotionally feel with her even before you feel it


I think I've always done this - how do I not? I cant go for a girl unless there is something there, once I'm interested then I'm only interested in that girl. I've never understood how people can be so casual about dating. I need to change this view!

I'm trying NOT to do this but find myself being nervous around her and jealous if I see her with other guys.

As for game playing, I guess I'll just to have to learn the rules! Maybe I've just been lucky but usually all the girls I go for are also interested and I don't think I've ever asked for a number, usually they will say why don't you give me a call and then OFFER their number. Actually, thinking about it maybe I could of had more dates if I'd been more active... 

So... I attach myself too quickly to people and I'm too passive. You think at 37 I would have learnt all this by now!


----------



## Laurae1967 (May 10, 2011)

I would examine why you are gravitating to a woman who may not be available for a committed relationship.

Have you gotten therapy to get over your failed marriage? It's important to try not to continue to pick women who are not good to you or for you. Most people gravitate to the same dysfunctional profile in a mate over and over again until they deal with their own baggage (much of it from childhood).

Your xwife couldn't give you fidelity and commitment and here you are again, being drawn to someone who is showing signs of being less that comfortable with getting close to people. I'd think about that.


----------



## Indy Nial (Sep 26, 2010)

I don't think there is anything deeply psychological, its simply the first girl that I've been attracted to in a long time. I'm sure there is a bit of just missing being in a relationship and that doesn't help but I don't know if she has issues getting close or if she is just simply playing the game.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Simple exercise to shift how you think in terms of dating.

Don't 'imagine' the woman as a long term partner at all. In PUA or dating jargon, this is referred to as Oneitis

Just be in the moment. Engaged in the exchange. Think of dating more as a job interview, or simply framed as getting to know someone, rather than envisioning them as a life partner.

And importantly, don't look for 'the one' recognize that there are thousands of 'ones'. Talk to, engage with, flirt with, many women. Even those that you may never consider involving yourself with.

Purpose of the exercise is to shift your thinking, and make you much more at ease, laid back, conversational, fun ... and as a result, attractive to a wide array of women.


----------



## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

Well, you need to realize the less available you are to her, the more avalable she will be to you if she really is into you. It's like the dating version of MEMs thermostat. If you do all the work, she doesn't have to. You need to find a good balance of the push and pull of attraction and availability. 

Plus, we now get into Preselection events with multiple dates, etc. etc.

As far as curt and direct text responses? It's too early for her to respond otherwise. You seem to want to rush right into the lovey stage. Don't do that. Don't have any pre expectations at all. In fact, the texting game can be fun. Start of with random texts about her day. Then once in a while, include your day...."god! I'm in a meeting and it's lasting forever! Needed to find my happy thoughts and decided to text you! . How's your day going?"

This for a few weeks...then you slip in a few subtle. "hey beautiful! Keeping busy?". AFTER that, then you should start seeing the texts you want to see. Just don't over do it! Only a few random texts a day until you get to the point you crave each others communication. Have fun with this! The journey is the treasure here.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

Indy Nial said:


> I think I've always done this - how do I not? I cant go for a girl unless there is something there, once I'm interested then I'm only interested in that girl. I've never understood how people can be so casual about dating. I need to change this view!
> 
> I'm trying NOT to do this but find myself being nervous around her and jealous if I see her with other guys.
> 
> ...


I think that dating at 37 is a different thing than it was when you were "in the game" before. Socializing in general is. In college and the years just after, things do tend to go the way you talk about above. You get interested and then you go for someone. But I think that's because in those years, we tend to hang around in groups, so you get to know someone, you know that you're attracted, like them, somewhat compatible, etc. and so by the time you actually go on a date, a lot of that groundwork is already laid.

But at this later stage of our lives, you're dating to find out if you're attracted, like them, somewhat compatible, etc. It's basically the other way around. You generally meet people more as a matter of chance--at work, at a party and if there's a little spark, you date to find out if there's more. 

The way that you're approaching this is like that lunch date makes you boyfriend and girlfriend (or dang close) and you're being jerked around. In reality, lunch is just a baby-date, more like an interview that lets you decide if dinner is worth it and you want to find out more about this person. It does tend to make dating more of a numbers game, but easier too since you know it's just getting to know someone instead of bonding forever.


----------



## CalifGuy (Nov 2, 2011)

Actions express priorities - Mahatma Gandhi

If a person's actions aren't showing that you are a priority, then you should move on and find someone who is willing to make you a priority.


----------



## Indy Nial (Sep 26, 2010)

We went on the lunch date today and things went well, she opened up a bit more, mirrored my body language, was a bit nervous at first. The bit BUT here is that previously she has always been very touchy, and there was no touching this time at all - it was almost like she was making a point.

Last week after she asked me to lunch I did get a bit over confident and got a bit too ****y. I then sent her a text midweek which on hindsight really made me sound like I was really into myself, she never responded - she always responds. It was meant to be light and funny, basically I made out that she couldnt wait to see me again. Now it feels as though she may have taken it the wrong way and proving that she can take me or leave me.

When I tried to pay, she refused and said that I can pay next time but I better make sure it was expensive! She made mention of this again but I lost the nerve to ask her out because of her not texting me or trying to contact me + the lack of being flirty.

I'm tempted just to give her half the money for the meal and saying we're now even. Or do I ask her out again? Have I blown it and now she just wants to be freinds? Do I just pull back for a bit?

The push - pull thing just seems to be at extremes at the moment


----------



## LovesHerMan (Jul 28, 2011)

Deejo's advice is spot on. There are many women who will be a good match for you. Don't invest too much emotion in this one, because you will get hurt needlessly. She does sound like she is toying with you, or just not interested enough. I would back off and find others to date.


----------

