# Time to get my ducks in a row?



## Poppy (Mar 14, 2012)

Another lie exposed on Friday in therapy. Yes he did go back to one prostitute twice. Said she told him what bar she would be in and at 1am he decided to go find her. He told me he never saw any of them more than once. Not a big issue in the big scheme of things I hear you say, but to me it is just another lie 9 months into this nighmare. He also said he never went to these places with the intention to leave with someone, but now I know that he would go there and pick a target girl with 'features that floated his boat' and his win would be if he got her to go back to his hotel with him. He admits he is a narcissist and takes full responsibility, but how do I live with this? It was all so premeditated and so many conscious decisions. He said that that is a plus because he was not out of control and therefore can control it, but why did he not then? He is already talking about his desire to travel with work again and go out on a Thursday night in NY for a couple of beers after work. Am I unreasonable to feel that this is all unacceptable? Is the betrayal all just too much damage to really move on from and both be happy and healthy? Am I a failure if I give up now no matter how hard he is trying? His therapy is good, but I fear that this is never going to be liveable with. Every time I see an Asian woman I trigger and if I am with him I think he fancies her. Every time I see a 7 Eleven I trigger because I know he got condoms from there in Hong Kong. He wrote me love notes around the house the other morning, but they triggered me too as they reminded me of the notes I would put in his case when he went to Hong Kong...and every time he went he slept either with a prostitute or with the Indonesian he was having a year long affair with. When do you know when to walk away? He is being the father and husband I always wanted, but why not for the last 15 years? Do I just file for divorce and move on? I fear that too much damage has been done and bottom line is I dont feel special.


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

Of course you don't feel special, your husband is sleeping with prostitutes.

Everyone has their own line, and mine are more lax than a lot of folks around here, but sleeping with prostitutes? I just wouldn't accept that. You say he is being the "father and husband you always wanted" -- but really? This is the father and husband you always wanted, someone who goes to prostitutes, admits he is a narcissist, and seems to not really even be accepting responsibility?

I think it's unacceptable, and I don't think you are unreasonable at all. I do think you have bit of what I'll call, for lack of a better term, Stockholm Syndrome, and you desperately need some individual counseling to help you realize that this is not borderline unacceptable, this is WAY WAY WAY unacceptable.

Good luck.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

How does a narcissist stop thinking about themselves and start thinking about other people?

This is a question I'd ask a trained professional.

I've always understood that narcissism is what sends therapists quaking in their boots, peeing their pants, calling someone else to take them as a client.

Typically, narcissism is untreatable. The basic standard for measuring it is the degree to which they will admit responsibility for their actions and not project them on to others. Since narcissists do this constantly--externalize ALL of their problems and never taking ANY blame--it is extremely difficult to persuade them that there is any reason to change.

Does your sex addiction therapist still ask you why you're with him? That person, more than any other, should have a good understanding of the chances for change. If they are telling you to run for the hills, your only other choice is to get a second opinion from another similarly trained expert. Who is, more than likely, going to tell you precisely the same thing, but if that is what you need to make your decision, then do it.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

your ducks should have been lined up and marching 9 months ago

http://www.maniacworld.com/marching-ducks.html


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## TorontoBoyWest (May 1, 2012)

Almostrecovered said:


> your ducks should have been lined up and marching 9 months ago
> 
> Marching Ducks - Video


This.

The clown was with prostitutes. 

Line. Crossed. Cya.


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## Poppy (Mar 14, 2012)

I am so scared. I am not in my home country. I have no family here. I am not a US citizen, but so have a Green Card. I do not work, but am a qualified teacher. He is taking full responsibility and getting alot of help..IC twice a week and sex therapy at least once a week. I have two children aged 10 and 12. He has threatened suicide and he will have nothing other than his job...no family support, no friends, no interests. I know I am not responsible for him and he made these horrific decisions, but I have been with him for 22 years. I also fear that he is truly transformed and will be a wonderful, attentive, loving and faithful husband from now on and I will have walked away.


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## Poppy (Mar 14, 2012)

Almostrecovered said:


> your ducks should have been lined up and marching 9 months ago
> 
> Marching Ducks - Video


I did not know about the prostitutes 9 months ago..just the 30,000 US dollars he had spent entertaining himself in bars and the affair. He lied to my face for 6 months about the prostitutes. Even when I told him the doctor was asking for the date of his last exposure...he said May and I now know it was the 21st August. Not defending myself at all because I know what you are saying, just explaining how long this process has been.


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## Poppy (Mar 14, 2012)

And my other fear? That 75% of marriages involve infidelity and 70% of partners never know. I fear I will never trust again and the chances of finding a faithful man are next to zero.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

BS stat


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

Poppy, $30,000???????????

I know that you want to stay in the hopes that he will be Mr. Perfect. OK, but while you are waiting that out, please do go see an immigration attorney and see what your options are. Information never hurts. You are in quite a fix, but it won't hurt to just think about your options.


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## ParachuteOn (Apr 20, 2012)

Poppy said:


> I am so scared. I am not in my home country. I have no family here. I am not a US citizen, but so have a Green Card. I do not work, but am a qualified teacher. He is taking full responsibility and getting alot of help..IC twice a week and sex therapy at least once a week. I have two children aged 10 and 12. He has threatened suicide and he will have nothing other than his job...no family support, no friends, no interests. I know I am not responsible for him and he made these horrific decisions, but I have been with him for 22 years. I also fear that he is truly transformed and will be a wonderful, attentive, loving and faithful husband from now on and I will have walked away.


OMG poppy I am sorry you are back in this spot. My heart really goes out to you. Please don't blame yourself. Your H is quite a piece of work. 

It seems he is using the fact that you aren't working or a citizen to do whatever he wants. Actually, it sounds like he will do whatever he wants no matter where you live....

Please tell me you have not been sleeping with him without protection. I am having a full STD panel done after finding out there MAY have REMOTELY been physical cheating. Your H has admitted to it. And SEVERAL times with hookers. He is playing with fire and YOU may be the one who gets burned. 

Please take care of yourself and keep posting.


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## Count of Monte Cristo (Mar 21, 2012)

Almostrecovered said:


> BS stat


:iagree::iagree::iagree:

You'll find someone even better once you are free of this scumbag.


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## ParachuteOn (Apr 20, 2012)

And Poppy, only time will tell if he has truly changed, so don't let fear get the best of you. 

He should NOT be making you afraid he will commit suicide. That is unnecessary roughness bigtime.

On the upside, if he is a true narcissist, he will never suicide. He is just pulling that out to control you.


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## Poppy (Mar 14, 2012)

Please dont give up on me.


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

No one's giving up on you, Poppy. You are in a helluva fix, no doubt, but people have gone thru worse and survived, and even thrived. The good thing is that in a divorce, if you could prove the prostitute thing, you'd come out pretty well financially -- that's all pending what it does to your immigration status, which is why I suggested that your first move, before you do anything else, is to consult an immigration attorney. 

And if you don't want to decide anything for a while, that's ok, too -- just please keep talking to us.


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## Poppy (Mar 14, 2012)

And I'll tell you why he will never be the one to leave me....how about living in a million and a half dollar house, exotic vacations, beautiful wife and children, Porche and Mercedes in the garage.....just cant help feel I am being played. The therapist told me he will never file for divorce because all this is too important to him and his image as a successful family man at work in NY. He of course tells me I am the love of his life.


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## Poppy (Mar 14, 2012)

I have talked to a lawyer and I would need to get a divorce here in NJ, even though I got maried in the UK and am a UK citizen. My children and I have our own Green Cards and are US Residents, so we could stay here, but if I wanted to move back to the UK I would have to get approval from a judge and would not want to take his children the other side of the Atlantic from their Father. This is where the girls have lived for 6 years (apart from last year in Singapore)..and even then we kept the house unrented so we could come back at Christmas and the summer.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

Poppy said:


> And my other fear? That 75% of marriages involve infidelity and 70% of partners never know. I fear I will never trust again and the chances of finding a faithful man are next to zero.


That statistic is not accurate. 

Just look at all the betrayed spouses here who never thought of cheating even though like all marriages there was some rough spots.


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

Poppy, it seems that you are suggesting that the assets are all yours -- in which case, heck. Get thee to a lawyer and work something out. You are holding all the cards here, and he keeps cheating.


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

Poppy, I have been following your story! So sorry that you keep getting further information.

I do understand about the asian women trigger though...I experience the same thing. If we are watching tv or are out in public and I see an attractive asian lady..I get that sick anxious jealous feeling. I wonder is he thinking about his EA.....terrible feeling to have and at the same time it seems so stupid but I can't help it.

Asian woman, singapore, Phillipines, the name Vivian, are all triggers for me...a year ago all of those would have meant nothing to me.


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## LeighRichwood (Mar 31, 2012)

Just one word about the lying - all cheaters lie like crazy. They will always choose a lie over the truth. It often takes months, even years, for all the truth to come out. Sometimes it never does.

The key for you - in my humble opinion - is for you to realize that you will likely continue to learn more about your husband's actions. If you decide to stay with him, understand that you'll need to find a way to get past it all. Believing that you know all the details already is unreasonable. You probably don't.

This is difficult. But it's reality. Every person who decides to stay married in some way has to accept that the past is the past and that the future is what they're after. 

And don't everyone jump here - I don't mean that there aren't consequences for the past or that issues don't need to be resolved. What I mean is that at some point we have to accept that what happened is done and move forward. Even if moving forward is in divorce, it's not staying where you were.

Poppy - lamaga has made a good point. If you've seen a lawyer and you want a divorce you should get on with it. Waiting for the other shoe to drop is a bad way to live.


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## Poppy (Mar 14, 2012)

Firstly, I spoke to a lawyer when I returned to the USA from Singapore because I wanted to be educated enough to know where I stood and to make an informed decision about trying to save my marriage based on my love for him and not my fear of leaving due to financial issues. The assets are mine in that I married him, therefore if I file for a divorce he will lose 50%..no big house and allimony and child support to pay. I told my H that it was sad that all of this was not enough to satisfy him and that the saddest thing was that I fell in love with him when were both 17 and had nothing.


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## Poppy (Mar 14, 2012)

highwood said:


> Poppy, I have been following your story! So sorry that you keep getting further information.
> 
> I do understand about the asian women trigger though...I experience the same thing. If we are watching tv or are out in public and I see an attractive asian lady..I get that sick anxious jealous feeling. I wonder is he thinking about his EA.....terrible feeling to have and at the same time it seems so stupid but I can't help it.
> 
> Asian woman, singapore, Phillipines, the name Vivian, are all triggers for me...a year ago all of those would have meant nothing to me.


Ridiculous isnt it? Asian women, Singapore, Thailand, Phillippines, Indonesia, the name Annie.....and my kids lived there for a year so it comes up alot and the furniture we bought there arrived with the shipment a few months ago. It just hurts.


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

It is unlikely that he will ever leave you but very likely that he will start seeing prostitutes again. I am a therapist and this pattern is very typical. The fact that he has been with prostitutes show that he is just using them for his own needs (typical Narcissistic trait), no committment just wants to feel good, therefore a prostitute fits that bill. A prostitute just wants paid and no baggage.

You need to learn all you can about this type of behavior and decide what you want. He is more than likely showing you all sorts of love right now because it serves his purpose for right now.

I wish that there were better answers for you.


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## Cosmos (May 4, 2012)

Sad to say, I think too much damage has been done. Whether his counselling is successful or not, the fact that he not only betrayed you but also jeopardised your health (and possibly life) by having sex with prostitutes (condoms are not always effective in preventing AIDS) is something I know I could never move beyond. However, the question is - can you? 

I'm sorry you're going through this, Poppy, and wish my opinion was a more positive one.


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