# Ladies, please tell me what's going on with my wife.



## TirelessHusband

Let me tell you about our situation.

We are married 5 years, together 10, with a toddler.

My wife is miserable. She just seems like a "miserable person". Not a day goes by when there isn't extended periods of irritation and complaining.

She feels "trapped" and that she's a "housewife", and thinks everything she does (from waking up in the morning to sex with me) is just her "job".

I take care of the baby, do the dishes, laundry, go shopping, bring home dinner, take her out to dinner, bring flowers, and buy gifts. I try to touch her, hold hands, give hugs, cuddle, but she basically hates physical contact.

She thinks I "expect" sex, meaning that if I don't get it I will be upset or angry... so she will often "give" sex out of obligation. This really hurts me. That's not to say she doesn't ever get aroused, but that's definitely the exception.

I'm just dying for her to _want_ to be with me, in any way... to _want_ to hug me, kiss me, hold me, or do any sexual favors or make love to me. I know I sound like the woman here...

We went away for a (nice!) weekend alone, and got a hotel room. She dreaded impending time together in the hotel room because she thought I was just waiting for sex, and that if I didn't get it, I would feel like I wasted my money (and that this trip was just me exchanging money for sex, even though it was her idea, and she was the one who brought up "vacation sex").

On the same weekend, every trip out involved grumbling and complaining. At every turn, she expected that I had something ridiculous and awful lined up for her. It was as if she thought each impending moment was going to be worse than the last, and that I had already messed it up.

When I get sick or hurt, she gets annoyed with me. When she gets sick (which seems like all the time) I bend over backwards to tend to her. When I am emotionally hurt, I can be lying next to her in bed, sobbing my heart out, and she may not even lift a finger to comfort me. She can fling awful insults at me in moments of anger or frustration.

We've tried a bit of counseling. She went on antidepressants after having our baby, and she changed medications at one point, but they didn't help. She felt worse on pills than off.

Her love language is supposedly gifts, but it doesn't make a difference. Mine is touch and she apparently scores a _zero_ there...

I just don't know what to do. I am at my wit's end. I love her and I want her to be happy, and I know that's the only way I'll be happy too.

I'm trying to schedule more counseling, but if anybody has any insight into this kind of psyche, please help.

Sorry if this is long and rambling. And to my wife: if you are reading this and you think it's about us... sorry if any of it is hurtful, but you already know all of these things and we've talked about it.


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## CallaLily

Postpartum depression maybe? Has she been checked out by her doctor?

You said she thinks you expect sex and if you don't get it, you get angry. Do you get angry? 

Sounds like somewhere along the lines she feels some resentment going on possibly. Can you think of any reason why she might feel that way?


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## FirstYearDown

TirelessHusband said:


> Let me tell you about our situation.
> 
> We are married 5 years, together 10, with a toddler.
> 
> My wife is miserable. She just seems like a "miserable person". Not a day goes by when there isn't extended periods of irritation and complaining.Have you explored the possibility of depression?
> 
> She feels "trapped" and that she's a "housewife", and thinks everything she does (from waking up in the morning to sex with me) is just her "job". Was being a housewife her choice? Sometimes when a career woman becomes a SAHM, there can be an identity crisis. I also think that there is some resentment towards you; not sure if it is justified or not.
> 
> I take care of the baby, do the dishes, laundry, go shopping, bring home dinner, take her out to dinner, bring flowers, and buy gifts. I try to touch her, hold hands, give hugs, cuddle, but she basically hates physical contact.I think you are being too nice. She is home all bloody day, so she has time to do dishes and cook! I know a lot of mothers that work full time and still manage to keep the house clean. Your wife seems rather spoiled.
> 
> She thinks I "expect" sex, meaning that if I don't get it I will be upset or angry... so she will often "give" sex out of obligation. This really hurts me. That's not to say she doesn't ever get aroused, but that's definitely the exception. What is so wrong about a spouse expecting sex? :scratchhead: You're married! What does SHE expect from you??
> 
> I'm just dying for her to _want_ to be with me, in any way... to _want_ to hug me, kiss me, hold me, or do any sexual favors or make love to me. I know I sound like the woman here...You are not sounding like a woman, my dear. You are sounding like a man who gives too much and gets nothing in return.
> 
> We went away for a (nice!) weekend alone, and got a hotel room. She dreaded impending time together in the hotel room because she thought I was just waiting for sex, and that if I didn't get it, I would feel like I wasted my money (and that this trip was just me exchanging money for sex, even though it was her idea, and she was the one who brought up "vacation sex").
> Yeah, this is pretty unreasonable. It was her idea. What did your wife think the two of you would do on a romantic weekend? Play checkers??
> 
> On the same weekend, every trip out involved grumbling and complaining. At every turn, she expected that I had something ridiculous and awful lined up for her. It was as if she thought each impending moment was going to be worse than the last, and that I had already messed it up.Depression can make someone see everything negatively.
> 
> When I get sick or hurt, she gets annoyed with me. When she gets sick (which seems like all the time) I bend over backwards to tend to her. When I am emotionally hurt, I can be lying next to her in bed, sobbing my heart out, and she may not even lift a finger to comfort me. She can fling awful insults at me in moments of anger or frustration.Please go to the Men's Clubhouse and look at the Nice Guy Reference, along with the thermostat thingy. You need to pull away, so that she can appreciate you. There is nothing is wrong with men crying. However, in your situation it only gives her more power.
> 
> We've tried a bit of counseling. She went on antidepressants after having our baby, and she changed medications at one point, but they didn't help. She felt worse on pills than off.
> Bingo. I was right about the mood disorder. Sometimes meds are a trial and error solution. I think that the proper meds and counseling would work wonders. Now, did your wife attend individual counseling or was it marriage counseling?
> 
> Her love language is supposedly gifts, but it doesn't make a difference. Mine is touch and she apparently scores a _zero_ there...Classic "Nice Guy" issues.
> 
> I just don't know what to do. I am at my wit's end. I love her and I want her to be happy, and I know that's the only way I'll be happy too.This is not healthy. You need to learn to be happy without letting her depression become yours.
> 
> I'm trying to schedule more counseling, but if anybody has any insight into this kind of psyche, please help.Depression and other mood disorders run in my family.
> 
> Sorry if this is long and rambling. And to my wife: if you are reading this and you think it's about us... sorry if any of it is hurtful, but you already know all of these things and we've talked about it.Are you scared of your wife???


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## CallaLily

"What is so wrong about a spouse expecting sex? You're married! What does SHE expect from you??"

He also stated she thought he would get angry if she didn't want to. Well if he does, then yeah thats an issue.


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## Dadof3

Read 5 Love Languages, No More Mr Nice Guy, Hold on to your NUTZ

Taking a crack at the anger associated with sex:

Been there done that. I know it isn't a person's right to demand anything from their spouse. Generally when most things are going well in a relationship, being turned down for sex isn't and shouldn't be a biggie. The anger that comes out is more about the angry person NOT feeling ANY needs being met as opposed to those just sexual. Remember, women need emotion to be sexual, men need sex to be emotional. The anger is expressed frustration in regards to the individuals needs (any and all of them NOT being met). There are DEFINITELY better ways for these needs to be expressed and met, but often, in these situations, its as if the person who is ANGRY feels like they are the only ones trying to meet the other's needs, and the other isn't reciprocating. 

It really is as the 5 love languages put it. Some couples get together where both individuals have complete opposite primary love languages, but one of the two can speak in the other's secondary language. It's enough to get them together and marry because of all the hormones that bring two together. Then marriage and reality hit. The one speaking the other spouses secondary love language doesn't understand why the spouse won't reciprocate, not only with the primary love language (which most likely is touch), but the spouse doesn't even converse in the individuals secondary love language.

So - anger about sex, in my opinion, is a red herring to the overall relationship dynamic.


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## TirelessHusband

Thanks to the replies so far.

I know post-partum depression is part of the mix, but that has only intensified long-standing issues. She's over the serious lows (anxiety, self-imposed isolation, suicidal thoughts, etc.) for at least 6 months now.

For CallaLilly: no I don't get angry. I try to respect her feelings in bed... I can't control arousal, but I can control my expectations.


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## CallaLily

Being a mother and wife maybe she feels she has lost herself someone how. That happens sometimes. You being there for her and trying to be encouraging will hopefully help some. Get her to check in with her doc to make sure everything is ok too.


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## COguy

I'm going to suggest a book, I didn't read it until after my wife cheated on me, but I wish I had. It's called What Wives Wish Their Husbands Knew About Women by James Dobson.

Your story has a lot of similarities to mine. I know what state of mind you are in. You are TRYING to meet your wife's needs. You WANT to show her you care. You are thinking logically and rationally about your relationship and don't understand the outcome. In essence, you are being specimen: Normal Guy.

Unfortunately, we are married to emotional creatures, and apparently it takes getting hit with a frying pan to "get it." In my case, I didn't get it until my wife had already started her emotional affair.

Put the sex on hold for a moment. I know that's hard because as a guy we want sex, it's more of a need than a desire really. I can only tell you the sex will come when you address the root problem.

The root problem, is *you*. Sorry, that sounded harsh. But only YOU can change in this situation. Your wife may or may not come around in this situation, but until she does, you are the one that has to make the effort.

Now don't misunderstand me, you are a standup guy. I can tell already. First off, you care about your wife. You're already in the top 25% of the male population, too many guys are selfish *******s. Second, you know her love language, you just shot up a few more points. Third, you're in a marriage forum trying to get advice on fixing your marriage. Congratulations, you just put yourself in the top percentile of decent men. Many many women would be lucky to have you, you are a good husband and probably a very good father.

Now that we have that established, consider that everything you are doing or have done to improve your marriage up to this point never happened and will be completely useless going forward. That's how your wife feels about it. It's one thing to know your wife's love language, and in many ways that is the first step and I'm glad you took it. It's another thing to know what your wife NEEDS.

This won't come from a book, and it won't come from being rational or logical. It comes from not saying anything, and listening to what she is saying all day every day. You almost have to turn off yourself and listen as an outsider. It's hard to explain, but once you do it once, it will become very easy to you. It's a lot like looking at one of those fuzzy magic eye pictures that are supposed to be dolphins or pyramids. Telling someone how to see it is tough, but once they do, it comes easier and easier until it's effortless.

Such is framing your mind to understand your wife. I can only give you examples from my marriage and hope it makes it easier to see what I'm getting at.

My wife told me, "You never help out around the house." That always bothered me, because I did help out and I thought I did a good job and did a lot more than other husbands. When the lightbulb went off, I realized my wife wasn't saying "You never help out around the house" she was really saying, "I feel like you don't WANT to help me around the house. I feel like I'm in this alone." And it's true, I didn't. I would do whatever she asked, but wasn't really interested in making sure she felt rested out of my own initiative.

My wife told me, "You always call me stupid." Another anger issue for me, I never called her stupid! How could she say that?? When I finally listened to what she was saying and not to her actual words, I realized that it didn't matter if I called her stupid or not, it mattered that she thought that I thought she was stupid. Things I would do would make her feel inferior. I needed to fix that.

My wife told me, "You always come home and call me a b*tch and complain about how crappy I am." Uhhh I never did that, what am I a monster? Well when I shutup and listened, I realized that my wife was feeling unappreciated and depressed.

The bottom line is it didn't matter what I was doing, or how good of a husband I was. My wife was hurting and I wasn't doing the things she needed me to. Once I realized that and started seeing how my actions made her feel, helping out around the house became enjoyable for me. I just wrote about this here in how I relate sex to dishes.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/35627-my-basic-expectations-5.html#post503510

Your wife is telling you she's unhappy. She's miserable. She's depressed. Find out what she REALLY needs and be their for her. When that happens, the sex will come. What the book I suggested will show you is how completely stressful and hectic it is to be a mother. I mean watch your kids while your wife is on vacation for a week and tell me it's an easy job. Holy crap I would blow my brains out if I had my wife's job. It not only is extremely difficult, stressful, and demanding, but you also get no appreciation for it. The last thing your wife wants after her day is to hear about sex. Hell if my wife came home after I watched the kids all day and asked me for sex without helping me with the kids first I'd probably tell her to go to take a hike. 

When your wife starts feeling like you care about her, like you're there for her and understand her, like you support her and that she's secure with you, then she'll start desiring sex with you. But it takes a lot of work and commitment. It's also the hardest time in your marriage, when you have young kids. They eat up so much of your time and energy, if both parents aren't 100% focused the marriage is going to suffer.

I would suggest reading the book, really start listening to your wife and start trying to approach your wife with love and respect before even discussing your needs. Counselling is another great idea. There's so much built up resentment from both of you that talking about it calmly and getting to the root of your issues is going to be tough without a mediator. Do that for a few weeks/months and see what her response is.

In the meantime, make sure you are making time for yourself and are your own person. Don't fall into the trap of doting on her 24/7 and making her your whole world, that's not attractive or healthy.

Also, this is an EXTREMELY vulnerable time for your wife. She is essentially in the stage where she either has started or will soon start an extramarital affair. I didn't see anything in your post that this has started yet, but you need to start low-grade snoopery. Check her phone records, maybe read some of her texts, FB messages, emails, simple confirmation she's where she says she is, etc. If you see any contact with guys, old flames, flirty messages, sneaking out to bars, you're going to add some complication to the mix. DO NOT MAKE THE SAME MISTAKE I DID AND BE NAIVE. If my wife can cheat, yours can too. The biggest warning sign for cheating you already shared, your wife is unhappy and withdrawn from you, if she starts dressing provocatively, going out with friends late at night, losing weight, getting protective of her phone or computer, talking about wanting to "find herself" or "be free", you should be extremely suspicious.


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## WillWeMakeIt

Another book suggestion is "Intimacy Anorexia" by Douglas Weiss.
This was a real eye opener for us.


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