# New Member, Big Problems? (little long)



## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

Hello all.
I am dealing with the most difficult week of my life and I am hoping for some insight.
My husband and I have been married for 2 1/2 years. We started out deeply in love on a soulmate level...we had both finally found what we needed in life in each other. It was amazing, instant connection and deep, soul searching nights with him.

We both bring emotional and past issues into the relationship. Mine are depressive/emotive fits and his are depression and a tendancy to get very mad sometimes. We both had terrible childhoods and he suffered an extremely bad first marriage where she never loved him and cheated many times. In the beginning we were a comfort to each other and I felt he truely understood me as no one had.

We moved to a large town and began having money issues and fights. Last year, he threatened to leave me after a big fight. He did not but the pain stuck with me. Ever since then I have been brokenhearted and just trying to stay busy, going to school and work and often just finishing homework before crashing into bed. Sex is amazing but infrequent.:scratchhead:

He always begged me to get my emotions under control to talk to him instead of just crying and shouting, but I had a hard time knowing what to do. I also told him after one night that the aggressive yelling on his part would not continue.

This past weekend, I made a bad mistake and was overly regretful, begging for forgiveness. My mistake was not leaving him alone to handle his anger...I felt so bad and wanted to know everything would be alright. He had a sceduled trip out of town and I called him in the middle of it, starting drama again inadvertently and really throwing him off the deep end. He swore to leave me, that this was the last straw. I did not contact him again until he called me 32 hours later. Those hours were hell.
He said he was set upon leaving me. He was tired of being treated badly by me. I was terribly sad and told him I would do anything to fix it. I had learned about the 180 and Dialectical Behavior Therepy and I think i can instate that into my life.

This morning, he came home for his items. As he walked in I was just waking up. He told me he didn't want to leave me, he loves me and cares for me, but he needs space to spend time with a clear head and think about what he can do to solve us... 
He is going to stay at his brother's house for a few weeks to a few months. He will call me on Thursday, and hope to talk to me about simple topics. He may take me out this weekend. He said, let's consider this a break...ok? Nothing besides that. I was calm (and thought about the 180 the whole time we talked). I did great and he was impressed. He only took his TV, his dog (per my request) and 4-5 wood projects to work on. No furniture, no memorabila except a piece of art I made him.

He was clear that he didn't know his plans for the immediate future. He said right now he was 50/50 on staying or not, but if I could give him time he could feel better and better about it. We agreed not to date or sleep with others. Ideally I'd like a call every few day, but 180 method says that's not healthy, right?


I never knew this would end up with us living apart, if only for a short while. *I love him so much*, and I cannot imagine him not wanting to stay to work on it. It is all I can do to trust and understand him, and to not text or call him! My heart aches to hear his voice. Tonight I put dog food in his dog's bowl on accident and just got heartsick.

My heart wants so badly to believe him, to trust him that he will be back and is thinking of me. Unfortunetely, I went on another forum today and all anyone can say to me is he is going to dump me, he is cheating, he is emotionally abusive, and I am horrifically co-dependent and a fool for not realizing he's cheating on me or has already abandoned me by taking this break, or that he is just letting me down easy and keeping me on standby for booty calls.. That really messed with my head. Now I don't know what to think. Those people seemed so jaded, but placed nagging thoughts in my head, unfounded in truth or what he said to me.

If you have been so kind as to read all of this---what do you think?


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

Also would I be a booty call if we had sex after dates? Or should I tell I won't have sex with him if we aren't living together.
In your opinion, is "break" the end, all the time? Or can it truely be a break with honest intentions. My husband is very honest and never would cheat. I know everyone on the other forums seemed to think so, immediately, but he is REALLY not like that.
I was ready to call him up and call the whole thing off tonight...I don't think I deserve this "space" business, but at the end of the day if a few months of space means we can be in each other's lives still maybe I do want it. It's only been a couple of days, so dear lord maybe I owe him that. maybe I will be suprized by him.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

ELS said:


> This past weekend, I made a bad mistake and was overly regretful, begging for forgiveness. My mistake was not leaving him alone to handle his anger...I felt so bad and wanted to know everything would be alright. He had a sceduled trip out of town and I called him in the middle of it, starting drama again inadvertently and really throwing him off the deep end. He swore to leave me, that this was the last straw. I did not contact him again until he called me 32 hours later. Those hours were hell.
> He said he was set upon leaving me. He was tired of being treated badly by me.


Personally, I don't think his absence automatically means that he is cheating. But personally, again, it is the outcome of what you two are creating in your expectations of marriage.

I never considered myself old-fashioned, but I have been married for 25 years. My wife and I agreed to never, ever discuss divorce unless it was a situation that would be followed by an attorney visit with a 100% likelyhood of ending it. Where is the committment from your husband? Doesn't he care that you are hurting?

Secondly, I think you forget that he is supposed to be an adult. He certainly has. His anger is his business, and there is absolutely no excuse for having to elevate it above your own needs, and if he is hurtful, he should be the one apologizing. Not you. Why in the world would you have to be sorry? Set some boundaries about how you need to be treated to feel safe with him. As a guy, we decide to marry someone that we cherish, and you appear completely worthy of that. Somehow, though, you seem to be letting him turn this around to be all your fault. I'm only suggesting that if you expect to be treated as one worthy of a better standard, booty calls will not be much of a possiblity.

I know this comes across as severe on him, but in most cases like this, a large part of the problem is that the guy is setting selfish standards, and the wife is making herself miserable by trying to meet them. In the end, because you are a good woman, respecting yourself will have a more powerful affect on changing him than letting him get away with making it all your fault. And, you will feel better about yourself.


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

Thank you for answering, I really appreciate it.
What do you think of how he left the house yesterday. What do the implications appear to be? The other forum said he would just say anything to get out the door and away. I don't know if that is the truth. he is just not like that. He says what he means and feels all the time and is not insincere.
I agree with you that he was wrong to be so angry and hurtful this last week. When would be a good time to ask for an apology? What do I discuss with him on Thursday? Why do you think he is making me wait till thursday to talk? All these questions burn in my mind. I am afraid that if I ask for more from him, he will say that I ask too much and I need to let him be.
He mentioned he was angry because I would not be quiet and listen to his needs, instead pursuing my own need for forgiveness, even after many requests for peace and quiet. While I do deserve for someone to accept my human faults, if he needed time to do that I definitely should have listened to him. I think what I was showing him is that I was not listening to his needs, and that lead him to believe he was not important to me.
He stated that he realized he had some problems too yesterday morning. He mentioned his anger and his distrust. He said he wanted to really look into them and get over them. I hope that's the truth.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

ELS said:


> Thank you for answering, I really appreciate it.
> What do you think of how he left the house yesterday. What do the implications appear to be? The other forum said he would just say anything to get out the door and away. I don't know if that is the truth. he is just not like that. He says what he means and feels all the time and is not insincere.
> I agree with you that he was wrong to be so angry and hurtful this last week. When would be a good time to ask for an apology? What do I discuss with him on Thursday? Why do you think he is making me wait till thursday to talk? All these questions burn in my mind. I am afraid that if I ask for more from him, he will say that I ask too much and I need to let him be.
> He mentioned he was angry because I would not be quiet and listen to his needs, instead pursuing my own need for forgiveness, even after many requests for peace and quiet. While I do deserve for someone to accept my human faults, if he needed time to do that I definitely should have listened to him. I think what I was showing him is that I was not listening to his needs, and that lead him to believe he was not important to me.
> He stated that he realized he had some problems too yesterday morning. He mentioned his anger and his distrust. He said he wanted to really look into them and get over them. I hope that's the truth.


It really helps if other people share their opinions too, so I 'm kicking this back up to the top partly for this reason.

Its hard to understand the dynamics without more information, but I was going under a couple of assumptions based on what you mentioned. His leaving, in many cases, doesn't get you off the hook in terms of contribution, and only time will tell if its due to another person. On face value, it seems that he wants space to think, but he's being immature about it.

Take your comment about the timeliness of an apology, for instance. Is it possible that it might be better just to move on, but with firmer expectations?

Let me just ask if this might be something that he is thinking. What if you are the type who always needs to know where you stand in any given situation? He says something childish, and you want to discuss it. To understand it. He gets angry, and you need to apologize or have him apologize to you. Every incident needs a discussion for understanding. In this case, its entirely possible that he just needs a chance to breathe once and a while. He feels stifled and pressured.

Does that make sense? Or, does it apply? Sometimes, you might have to learn to just let things work themself out with a trusting attitude. Deliberately forgive wordlessly, if its a small thing. I'm not suggesting that he never apologize, but just make sure that his frustration isn't caused from your need to always keep your finger on the pulse, so to speak.

In my early years, my wife wanted to talk about and analyze every word that was said. That's just what it felt like to me. I, on the other hand, wanted the security of her knowing that I was 100% committed, so when we're just being imperfect humans, I just needed her trust. But instead of running away like your husband (if that is what is happening), I tried to put these feelings into words, and she began to understand. As a guy, there's a time for analysis and talk, but there's also a time for trust.

Maybe I missed the mark. Still, certain things have to be unnaceptable to you. But you guys have to communicate the rules to each other, agree on them, and then live it. After these are agreed upon, that is the point where apologies are truly needed.

When either of you communicate these boundaries, have the other paraphrase them to ensure understanding. Rule #1 is that you will not be yelled at, abandoned, etc. In return, you will treat him this way ________.

If the issue is primarily communication and boundaries, then you really seem like you have the determination to make it work. My suggestion would be to extablish rules regarding discussion of divorce and separation.

For me, having my wife trust my dedication by not hyperanalyzing every remark and action was simply the greatest achievement in the early years. But I'm not an avoider. Some guys are. When its time to talk and analyze, we did it. Its all about balance and trust.


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

Here is what I am going to do. I just called him and asked him to meet with me after he is done at work. 

I am going to tell him that early in our relationship I believe that I relinquished control to him out of fear and desire to keep him. He did not want this and it has stressed him. I am going to tell him that I need to take more control in the relationship, telling him what I need and desire instead of merely agreeing with everything he says. I will tell him that if he needs space, that's fine because i need it too, to make sure i can stick with my new goal. I will tell him that I would like to make plans to actively work on the relationship in person.

If he tells me he can't handle this, I do not know what I can do but attempt to begin the healing process and try to move on. Even if he reacts badly today, he may listen to what I have to say and it may resonate with him. We'll see. 

Please tell me if this is the right thing to do.


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

> Let me just ask if this might be something that he is thinking. What if you are the type who always needs to know where you stand in any given situation? He says something childish, and you want to discuss it. To understand it. He gets angry, and you need to apologize or have him apologize to you. Every incident needs a discussion for understanding. In this case, its entirely possible that he just needs a chance to breathe once and a while. He feels stifled and pressured.


You have hit the nail on the head here. This is a big problem for me/us


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

ELS, Trust is the foundation in every good relationship -more so in a marriage. As Halien said, if you have to over analyze and discuss every incident, you will choke him. Discover a way for you to openly trust him. Yes, you will put your heart out there but it's what all of us do with our SO. Not only will he be less pressured by being around you, but you will also start to feel less needy and more independant. He will love you for that; and I believe will respond in kind.

As for reliquishing control in the relationship, I think you mean to say that you are allowing him to make all decisions about your feelings and you comply. There's no way YOU will ever be truly happy that way, and if you are unhappy, it will reflect on him as well. It's a vicious cycle. Yes, you need to be honest with him a let him know what your feelings and desires are; don't give in to mediocrity just because you want to keep the peace with him. Value your feelings and discuss them with him; you may be surprised at how well he reacts to your opening up.

Give him and yourself breathing room and be the woman he originally fell in love with. It sounds like he is just too pressured. Just my .02 worth.


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

"you may be surprised at how well he reacts to your opening up."

Here's hoping he is pleasantly surprised by me. I am ready and rarin' to say this! Will update tonight with how it went.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

Please keep us posted. I will pray for a positive outcome for you.


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

Well he just left here. I talked to him about my realizations and he actually had a few himself. He said...I believe that this break is good for us, we are already getting somewhere and I am glad you are growing, for you. He said he'd like to get back together ideally but we just need to wait and see. He's still thinking months (sigh) He realizes he has problems and no longer wishes for them to interfere in any relationship we have. He talked about all the stress he puts himself in and mentioned trying to relax. We talked about moving but left it pretty open ended.

He made a date with me for Saturday.

I wish he had just moved back home tonight, lol....but one day is not enough space for either of us. In certain ways it feels like the break is becoming more of a solid thing (Yuck), but we both have so much more hope than just yesterday. Bad feelings keep creeping back to me, but yet we made so much headway in just one day apart.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

ELS said:


> You have hit the nail on the head here. This is a big problem for me/us


Sometimes, this type of questioning sends a different signal than you intend, as I mentioned. I just want to be clear, because the intention is often pure, but the reception gets mingled by the mix of your words..

Often, guys are not as comfortable with ourselves in a marriage relationship, and whether we are meeting the woman's needs. But he's still 100% committed. You are more comfortable with your feelings, and just want to better understand. Almost every time, though, he's hearing that you have doubts about his intentions, love for you, and even his performance. But most importantly, in a sense you are unsure of his real dedication and intent. Maybe you're insecure, and just need affirmation. To him, you might be in effect just saying, "You're just not doing good enough for me."

When you think about what you really need to hear, my wife, in her case, started learning to clarify. Sometimes, she'll flat out say, "I'm feeling insecure, so ...". Or another disarming tactic, "You know I trust you, and you are always there for me, but when you say something like this ..., it makes me feel ..."

What I'm suggesting is that almost every guy is analytical, yet easy to disarm with ego stroking comments. If 50.5% of the words you say are positive, we'll take the bad too. If 2.5% are positive, and the rest are questioning, seeking understanding, etc, we bail to our safe place. For me, I just needed to see a smile once and a while.

Hope it helps.


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

Halien you are so incredibly helpful.
Did you read about our meeting today, just one day after he got stuff to stay at his brothers?
Do you think we have a chance?!


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

ELS, I think Halien has a lot of great comments. That statement about seeing a smile every now and then - BIG YES to that one. I seldom saw a smile directed at me from my wife in our later years -and I don't mean when something funny was said, I mean a loving smile. I missed that so much, it would have made a world of difference to me. And yes, when my wife was questioning me on the simplest of tasks I was performing - I would definitely bail to a safe place. Give some thought to Haliens post I think it offers some pretty good insight into the guy mind. We are analytical but I believe we are simple creatures when it comes to emotions we don't want all the complexity and confusion, we just want a simple love act from a woman. Just a smile, or a touch, or a kiss that is unsolicited would go a mile in our minds. Woman expect the same from men but seldom do I see them take the first step to do the same in return; you don't always have to wait for your SO to make the first move. Just my experience on it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

Thank you BrighterLight, your comments give me hope. So much better than the other forum I experienced.
Did you read the outcome of my meeting with my husband?


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

ELS said:


> Well he just left here. I talked to him about my realizations and he actually had a few himself. He said...I believe that this break is good for us, we are already getting somewhere and I am glad you are growing, for you. He said he'd like to get back together ideally but we just need to wait and see. He's still thinking months (sigh) He realizes he has problems and no longer wishes for them to interfere in any relationship we have. He talked about all the stress he puts himself in and mentioned trying to relax. We talked about moving but left it pretty open ended.
> 
> He made a date with me for Saturday.
> 
> I wish he had just moved back home tonight, lol....but one day is not enough space for either of us. In certain ways it feels like the break is becoming more of a solid thing (Yuck), but we both have so much more hope than just yesterday. Bad feelings keep creeping back to me, but yet we made so much headway in just one day apart.


I see this as a good sign. To see that you have a plan is easlily something that can change things. Just keep in mind that until you are able to really begin making the changes, or put objective actions out there, he could just be holding back a little. I certainly hope this is it, and that you'll see him come back over the weekend.

Again, though, don't let yourself get convinced that this is all your doing. Boundaries are needed, along with expectations. By bringing these up in a way that connects them to a better future, and in a positive light, you can begin a process that will still have some bumps in the road, but will give great results. Men are simple enough that we'll take on the world with just a little encourgement from our wife. And her trust.

With that said, it's a little odd that he would say that he is glad that you have a plan, for you. This makes me afraid that he was planning to split prior to this meeting, but that this meeting has made him rethink it. It may be a good idea to do something on this date, like a memento of a good time you had in the past, to remind him of the good times. Seeing your heart through these words, however, its most important for you to realize that you deserve to be in a relationship where you can be respected and loved. This should be pretty obvious to him, if he has any sense.


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

It is a little scary that you think that...I know only time will tell but he said lots of things like I was hoping you'd realize this. I told him that if he doesn't take me back then I would be a better woman for the next person in my life and he looked offended. He said I'd like to get back together but there's no telling what the future will hold. You may find you do not want me.
I asked him if he wouldn't want me. He said, no, I don't see that happening. Then as he was leaving he asked me to pack his items in different boxes. I asked him why and he said that he'd like to clean out before moving into the next house. I said, well, I kinda hoped you'd help me move if we are getting a new house...It sortof freaked me out a little...but the rest of the converstation had been going so well. Maybe he really is just hoping I'll leave him first. Man. I am feeling so negative this morning. It is hard to sleep alone.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

Perhaps start a thread in the Ladies Forum. There are so many wise women there, and some probably don't check this area as much. Talk about the loneliness.

With the added info, its beginning to sound like he's just really feeling inadequate. That's something that he has to resolve within himself, but supported by your new goals.


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## madimoff (Feb 17, 2010)

Fwiw, even if you do start going to the Ladies section, don't for goodness sake stop posting here... I've read more (or anyway as much!) sense in a few posts in this thread, so appropriate, so to the point for my situation, ..... please keep asking the men, halen & the others might just help more than you in the process! It's that mismatch of understanding what men feel, what women feel, what each want, the messages given whether spoken or unspoken, all of that stuff, an articulate man could help us all get on better track

sorry, waffle I realise but the thread so excited me... I've cut and pasted to show my OH & see if he agrees!!!


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

People are starting to tell me that he is already gone. I asked him directly-are you just letting me down easy, if so, please do not. He said-NO I am not, you know me! I would NOT put myself through this if i didn't want to. He has never lied to me and really is very direct with everything he wants to do...including moving to brother's for space. He would not waver and change his mind like he is doing if he really wants to move on for good.
Then out of the blue, people are telling me that a little space can be a good thing for a relationship, even he himself, and I agree somewhat.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

ELS said:


> People are starting to tell me that he is already gone. I asked him directly-are you just letting me down easy, if so, please do not. He said-NO I am not, you know me! I would NOT put myself through this if i didn't want to. He has never lied to me and really is very direct with everything he wants to do...including moving to brother's for space. He would not waver and change his mind like he is doing if he really wants to move on for good.
> Then out of the blue, people are telling me that a little space can be a good thing for a relationship, even he himself, and I agree somewhat.


Time for a little facts of life discussion. Just being a little humorous, but it might ease your mind just a bit.

If you are a suddenly single, attactive woman in your 20s or 30s, you can go to almost any place where people meet, raise your hand, and a dozen or more guys are lining up to be your guy. Typically, guys initiate. Typically, guys are desperate.

If a suddenly single guy goes that same route the girl just went, you can usually hear the crickets chirping. 

We guys know it. We think about it all the time. A guy doesn't easily throw away a sure fire thing only to hear the crickets chirping.


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

<3 It thank you again H. Your comments have helped me in ways I cannot begin to describe.

I have made up my mind to trust in my husband. I believe it is the most powerful thing I can do for him and for myself. First of all it will show me as a caring, compassionate wife that understands his struggle and has faith in his love. Second, it will make me not so nuts, picking apart every sentence, phrase, and opinion of others. If I KNOW the only truth is OUR truth, than I can do this, gratefully even.

While this break is killing me, it is needed, for both of us. We are both in that young "soul-searching" phase. I've already grown through my suffering, and the more I think of this as a good thing FOR ME, the less I think about him being in another house, holing up in a man cave.

I still will update with successes/trials but I will NOT be on here everyday whining about something someone negative and unknowing said about our relationship.


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## onceagain (May 31, 2011)

Man oh man, Halien, you're awesome. You should be a marriage counselor! LOL. Too late for me and my marriage, but I wish I'd read your posts sooner!!!


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

onceagain said:


> Man oh man, Halien, you're awesome. You should be a marriage counselor! LOL. Too late for me and my marriage, but I wish I'd read your posts sooner!!!


Thank you so much! Trust me, though, my wife gets frustrated because I analyze things. The gesture she gives from time to time is what I call the fist of death. I get it when I trap her in a female logic trap. Means it doesn't matter if she's wrong, I better tell her she's right and smile while I do it.


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

Hey all...just wanted to share a small triumph and breakthrough, perhaps even of my own understanding here. 
Tonight we spoke on the phone and it was stated that we are still regular husband and wife, just living apart and working on the relationship constructively. Husband is just relaxing, and I can too. For some reason I'd thought my status was still in serious jeporady. 

Actually, for a good reason-He'd left very angry at me and I really thought that was the whole reason. It's quickly coming forward that it's more about him at this point, thinking about how to grow and learning to just "breathe". 

I can lay off the tough gal act and just talk normally with him! I can tell him my feelings, just not act sappy and whiney (in front of him).

I instigated talk about when we met and our first flitations...he responded well so maybe I left him feeling positive tonight.


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

So, how can I work towards him coming home? Time, Time, Time? Or is there some things I should specifically be saying or doing at this point?:scratchhead:

Also I hope I didn't come across as ungrateful for the help here. I really appreciate everyone here and have learned a ton already....I just meant up above that I won't consider the opinions on that other forum I disliked so much, and people in my life who are less than informed and just reflecting their negative experiences onto my relationship. Thanks again H and BrighterLight and all else who have helped.


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

Well my husband was too broke to go out on Saturday like we had planned. I am going out with him tonight for dinner and a longer, more exciting date tommorrow. I am thinking of making a picnic perhaps.

I was really upset about saturday and I told him I wanted him to be more excited to see me. He said that was a crappy thing to say because it wasn't like he didn't want to see me, he just didn't have any money.

I've been so cranky, it's almost like i need some proof that he cares here, now. I went out last night and was aggressively pursued by a guy and it reminded me that my husband should still want me!!! I find myself a little sceptical that tonight will even happen, even though he told me he wants to go out.  This is bad, huh? I need to just be normal and nice and see how the evening goes...if I walk in with a bad attitude it will just push us apart.

Edit-He did come by and we had dinner out. I probably pushed a little too hard on the physical stuff and was overall trying not to be nervous like the entire time. :S I think I made it weird and awkward...I'm mad at myself. He still wants to go out tommorrow though.


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## ELS (Jun 8, 2011)

Ok, please...what do I do?!
He canceled on me again tonight. His car's headlights do not work and he can't drive around in the dark. Seems legit.
He called me tonight and said he was tired and sick. I tried to make plans for this weekend and he said can we just wait? I'm really tired of making plans and I don't know what to do this weekend. After a long silence he said...I know you took that personally please don't....I am really really just tired of thinking ahead about everything.
I'm losing him. He's blowing me off. He doesn't even want to see me. I'm barely important to him...my head is spinning. I thought everything was going better.
Maybe he was just tired and cranky and I should just let us both sleep on it. OMG i'm angry right now...i could really make a mistake easily...helP????


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