# Loving marriage with a lovelife in the tank.



## Frustrated_in_CA (Mar 25, 2013)

Hello,

I recently joined this site, and I hope some of you have some insight. My wife and I have had ongoing issues with our sex-life, and it is really getting to me. We are in our mid-thirties, in decent shape and are both pretty attractive according to our peers. We have a very loving and affectionate relationship, and an 8th month old son who is the joy of our life. We are partners when it comes to him, our life and our home. We cuddle and try to express our love, appreciation and gratitude verbally every day. She is my best friend, my partner, and my confidant. We can tell each other almost anything, and have very open lines of communication. That is what makes this so perplexing to me. We have had several discussions, but nothing changes. Now I am finding myself pulling away and getting resentful. It scares me.

We have been together for almost 10 years, and married for about 2.5. When we first started dating, our attraction was very strong. We immediately had a powerful connection, and a developed a passionate love life. Those days were amazing, and I realize the early part of any relationship is usually the most exciting sexually. 

About 3 years into our relationship, my wife had some painful issues with her urinary tract and bladder, that also caused discomfort during sex. This was an incredibly difficult time for her. It lasted for a couple of years, and in addition to her discomfort, it put a real hamper on our sex life and a strain on the relationship. It was really horrible for her, to the point where she would sometimes cry in pain when she went to the bathroom or after sex. I felt so bad for her, and tried to be supportive for her anyway I could. I also tried not to let my sexual frustration show because it made her feel guilty. We both loved each other and went to counseling to work through the challenges.

The counseling helped us build a stronger relationship and bond with each other, but it did not do much for our sex life. After her physical issues subsided, over a couple of years things slowly got better (although never anything close to what we had at the beginning of the relationship.) Just before our 6th anniversary as a couple, I asked her to marry me. This seemed to reignite some of the passion for a little while, what wonderful days those were. When we got married, the "honeymoon" period was amazing. For a few months, it seemed like our sexual relationship was getting more exciting and stronger, then it all stopped. 

We went from having fulfilling, intimate, and exciting evenings together several times a week down to a couple of times a month, then to quickies every few weeks when she could "fit me in". Our lovemaking was no longer passionate. She was not interested in foreplay, and would often push me away when I tried to focus on her pleasure. Instead of enjoying our time together, she just wants to "get things done" It began to feel very much as if were just going through the motions like it was a chore, something to get through as quickly as possible. When we do make love, it's one of 2 or 3 standard positions with little to no excitement. I have tried date nights, games, bought her 'toys', etc in hopes that one of these might reignite her libido. Despite the fact she would reach a powerful climax, sometimes several during a session, it did nothing to get her motivated the next time. I've asked her time and again what she would like to spice things up, and she has no answer. She used to like spontaneous moments of intimacy, and claims she still does. That said, 9 times out of then when I try to get frisky with her she says no, usually in a way that makes me feel pretty rejected. She has told me that she doesn't like feeling pressured for sex. She has told me that she doesn't want me to get physical with her without asking first, which takes all of the spontaneity out of it, and is pretty emasculating to boot. Even more frustrating, if I ask too often (a few times in a week without a yes) that is apparently pressure too. If I do start kissing or touching her, more often than not I'm pushed away. When I do ask her, the answer usually isn't what I want to hear.

I stood by her, and tried not to let it get to me. After all, we love each other, we talk, we have fun, we cuddle, we have so many things going for our relationship... It's just sex right? Well stepping forward about a year, we decided to have a baby. When that decision was made, suddenly the sex life was back. We started "practicing" quite a bit . It was awesome, and we were happy. She "pulled the goalie" so to speak, and planned on trying to make a baby for the next several months. Well, we were successful literally on our first attempt. Wonderful, but sooner than expected and it shortened the expected amount of attempts at "trying". Our sex life was pretty good through the first and into the second trimester, when it dropped off significantly. Not unusual, and I'd expected it. Of course, after a new baby comes around I knew our sex-life would go on the back-burner for a while. That said, now it's the worst it's ever been. She has little to no interest in making love, and doesn't seem to willing to do anything to address her lack of interest an its effect on me.

The frustrating thing is that this has been ongoing for a long time, and nothing is changing. She says that she's "lost her mojo", and doesn't feel sexy. That said, I tell her she is beautiful and/or sexy almost daily. I pay her compliments, I flirt, I do all I know to do to help rebuild her confidence. I think a lot of it goes back to the pain issues she had several years ago. It physically hurt her when we had sex for a couple of years. I can understand how that could kill a sex drive. That said, it's been years since that was an issue, and she does get pleasure out of it. When she feels like it <honeymoon, making babies> it's great and she's into it. The rest of the time (when I can get her to agree), it's like she is just fulfilling her obligatory duty. 

We have talked about this plenty of times. She knows how I feel. I've told her that once a month or less is not working, and that we need to find out passion. She agrees, but doesn't give me anything to work with, nor does she take any actions to address it herself. She almost never initiates. Instead she just wants to cuddle on the couch and act like nothing is wrong. Don't get me wrong, I'm a HUGE cuddler. Love it. But now I am starting to pull away from the cuddling. I don't like it as much as I used to because I can't help but get a little aroused when we press our bodies so close together. I get aroused, but know that there is nothing I can do about it. If I try to get frisky when cuddling, she pushes me away. I am getting resentful, and I'm not sure what to do anymore.

I want to stay true to my marriage, and have no desire to seek sex outside of marriage, but I have to be honest, The thought has occurred to me. I travel for business, and on more than one occasion, I've had opportunities that I have passed up on because I can't bear the thought of being unfaithful to her, but those opportunities have become more tempting as my frustration mounts and time passes. I do not want to cheat, and I do not want to leave the marriage. I can't bear the thought of a divorce, and could not do that to my son. I'm in between a rock and a hard place and I don't know what more to do. I feel rejected, sexually frustrated, and like I am a bad person if I pressure my wife because she just feels guilty.

I don't know if any of you will have an answer, but just getting it off my chest is helping a little.

Thank you, 
Frustrated_in_CA


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

I think the best advice is to go to Married Man Sex Life | How to have the marriage you thought you were going to have. By which I mean doing it like rabbits. and read the Primer.

Good luck.


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## Frustrated_in_CA (Mar 25, 2013)

@PHTlump - Thanks, but I've tried the assertive take-charge approach. She's not into that, but prefers the gentle and soft touch. Trust me, I would like to be more aggressive in our sex life, but that's a turn off for her.


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## roostr (Oct 20, 2012)

my situation is pretty much the same. After our 3rd kid things declined steadily over the last 16 years. Went from great to just ok. It is my opinion that once the "mojo" is gone it doesn't come back. I truly believe this is something that only a woman can understand (if they even do), but it is pretty evident that having children can change some women dramatically when it comes to their sex life and life in general. I also believe some people (men and women) get very complacent in their marriage and taking their partner for granted becomes second nature.


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## Frustrated_in_CA (Mar 25, 2013)

roostr said:


> my situation is pretty much the same. After our 3rd kid things declined steadily over the last 16 years. Went from great to just ok. It is my opinion that once the "mojo" is gone it doesn't come back. I truly believe this is something that only a woman can understand (if they even do), but it is pretty evident that having children can change some women dramatically when it comes to their sex life and life in general. I also believe some people (men and women) get very complacent in their marriage and taking their partner for granted becomes second nature.


Yeah, I do know that babies are rough on the sex drive, but it had been going on since long before that. It's just gotten even worse now. 

I definitely feel taken for granted these days, and I've told her as much. She then falls into a funk feeling guilty, and lamenting about how she's not good enough. That's not what I'm going for, and then I feel bad for making her feel guilty. She does tell me she appreciates me often, but the actions don't really reflect the words.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

You seem to be a chronic bad decision maker, would you agree? I mean, it looks like at every turn when she has treated you badly you've rewarded her. First by marrying her when sex was bad, then making a baby. You say she prefers the gentle approach. You do realize that she prefers it because it's easier to blow you off, right?

And even now, you get no sex but you reward her with cuddling.

Anyway, it seems that your resentment is finally starting to make you pull away, and I think that's a good thing. You should read on here about "turning down the thermostat". Your wife feels very safe in treating you this way. You've probably told her that you'd never leave no matter how much she tortures you. Hey, if you really feel the need to say that to someone, say it to us. But don't let her think that way. It's enabling her.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/21278-thermostat-ultimate-barometer-your-r.html


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Frustrated_in_CA said:


> @PHTlump - Thanks, but I've tried the assertive take-charge approach. She's not into that, but prefers the gentle and soft touch. Trust me, I would like to be more aggressive in our sex life, but that's a turn off for her.


It seems like you've tried the gentle, soft touch for years without success. And MMSL doesn't have to be the opposite of that. You can be assertive and gentle at the same time. Find a balance.

You just have to decide whether you're going to allow her to sentence you to a sexless marriage, or not.

Good luck.


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## Frustrated_in_CA (Mar 25, 2013)

WorkingOnMe said:


> You seem to be a chronic bad decision maker, would you agree? I mean, it looks like at every turn when she has treated you badly you've rewarded her. First by marrying her when sex was bad, then making a baby. You say she prefers the gentle approach. You do realize that she prefers it because it's easier to blow you off, right?
> 
> And even now, you get no sex but you reward her with cuddling.
> 
> ...


No, I wouldn't say I'm a chronic bad decision maker. She certainly has not treated me badly "at every turn". In most respects she is an amazing woman and wife. There is much more to marriage than JUST sex, and I am very happy and fulfilled in many aspects of our marriage. The problem is almost exclusively limited to that aspect of our relationship. 

Your comment on the gentle approach may be right. I've had similar thoughts before, but when I've taken a more assertive approach it usually ends with her pushing me away like I've done something wrong. She gets upset if I try to be playfully forceful, or even talk a little too dirty to her. It was not always the case. That said, I do have to correct one point. I'm not "rewarding her with cuddling". I also enjoy cuddling, it's just that now it's also frustrating because I get aroused with no outlet.

I've also never said I would never leave. She knows that it's something I would never want to do, but I've also told her in no uncertain terms that I would not live in a marriage where I was unhappy. I am not unhappy with our marriage, just our sex life. Granted, the former is now starting to affect the latter.

Anyway, thank you for the feedback. I will definitely check out the posts on "Turning down the thermostat". Maybe some of those techniques will help get the point across.


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## Frustrated_in_CA (Mar 25, 2013)

PHTlump said:


> It seems like you've tried the gentle, soft touch for years without success. And MMSL doesn't have to be the opposite of that. You can be assertive and gentle at the same time. Find a balance.
> 
> You just have to decide whether you're going to allow her to sentence you to a sexless marriage, or not.
> 
> Good luck.


Thanks you. I haven't read through the book, but just read reviews and descriptions. $10 is worth it if it really can give me some tactics that will save my love life. I'll check it out.


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## jd08 (Nov 20, 2012)

Your wife either 1) doesn't understand your biological need for sex or 2) doesnt care. 

Neither one of these are good. I know because you have written my story except I'm a little younger (we are 30). We have a daughter who is almost 4 and she's due with the 2nd in July. We went through a few years of twice a month. After a lot of arguing I've gotten her to once a week which still doesn't really satisfy me but I've come to accept that shes trying and it's the best I'm gonna do. 

Your wife needs to understand that you are seeking sex as a form of intimacy and this idea needs to be reinforced through counseling, books (5 love languages is good for this), and third parties. If she's like my wife at all, she tends to lose focus on things outside of herself and lacks understanding about the importance of sex to a marriage partner. 


How many other relationships was she in before you met her?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

I'm going to give it to you straight.

If there is a physical reason why sex still hurts to the point of crying in the bathroom.... how can you expect to have sex with her? Even if there isn't she may associate sex with that period of her life....so any foreplay to her equates to pain since she knows you want to stick it in her.

What if she was paralyzed or brain dead would you insist on having sex?

Now she should modify sex to the things that don't hurt her physically or psychologically . Her other parts aren't broken.

I think you and her need to come to and agreement on what is considered sex in your relationship based on medical/psychological factors... and see if that works for you two...otherwise you can always leave her.

In the meantime its for better or worse

Watch resentment it is meant for the other but only hurts you.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Trying2figureitout said:


> If there is a physical reason why sex still hurts to the point of crying in the bathroom.... how can you expect to have sex with her?


The OP stated that the physical issues were resolved years ago.



> Even if there isn't she may associate sex with that period of her life....so any foreplay to her equates to pain since she knows you want to stick it in her.


Perhaps. But that is a problem to be solved. It's not a justification to avoid sex indefinitely.



> What if she was paralyzed or brain dead would you insist on having sex?


Are you saying that women who withhold sex from their husbands are brain dead?



> I think you and her need to come to and agreement on what is considered sex in your relationship based on medical/psychological factors... and see if that works for you two...


The OP stated that she simply isn't interested in doing much with him. For her, sex is a chore to be avoided for as long as possible, and then dispensed with as quickly as possible so she can get back to what is important to her.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

PHTlump said:


> The OP stated that the physical issues were resolved years ago.
> 
> 
> Perhaps. But that is a problem to be solved. It's not a justification to avoid sex indefinitely.
> ...


What I am saying is that people who avoid sex with a spouse (after being notified that it is harmful) usually have a significant reason (Physical or mental)... it is up to the other spouse to accept that just as if they were put in a situation after an accident that produced a brain dead wife.

Is withholding sex right? NO... but you signed up for better or worse and have your life to try to come up with a compromise. Or leave.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Frustrated...unfortunately, your wife isn't into sex or isn't into you sexually or both.

But this can be turned around.

The first thing you'd have to do to turn it around though is make sure she understands that you are both headed toward a divorce.


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

Frustrated... take a box to work tomorrow and come home with all your personal stuff. When she sees you, just tell her that you "lost your mojo" and really have no interest in working so you quit.

How is breaking the implied contract in the marriage that you will work and support your family any different than breaking the implied contract in marriage of her meeting your sexual needs? It isn't.

If she has lingering psychological issues with pain and sex, it's up to her to find help to resolve them. If it is physical pain, again she must seek help.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Trying2figureitout said:


> What I am saying is that people who avoid sex with a spouse (after being notified that it is harmful) usually have a significant reason (Physical or mental)...


I agree. Most people in the world act rationally in their own self-interest. That doesn't mean the reason is a valid justification.

If my wife burned dinner, so I shot her in the face, well I had a reason, didn't I? But my response wasn't justified.

Similarly, if a wife is sick, so she withholds sex from her husband for a few days, then she's justified. However, if a wife gets sick, and then withholds sex from her husband for years, even long after she has fully recovered, well that's not justified.



> it is up to the other spouse to accept that just as if they were put in a situation after an accident that produced a brain dead wife.


You lost me here. If you're saying that a wife deciding to withhold sex from her husband is the same as a wife being in a coma, then I disagree. A wife in a coma isn't acting rationally, or even deciding anything at all. A wife withholding sex from her husband is making a decision, every day, to refuse sex.



> Is withholding sex right? NO... but you signed up for better or worse and have your life to try to come up with a compromise. Or leave.


Marriage isn't a suicide pact. Each spouse has the responsibility to provide for the other's needs. If you are married to a woman who disregards your needs and expects you to serve here even while she refuses to reciprocate, then I don't think she has grounds to dispute you leaving her.


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## hookares (Dec 7, 2011)

OP, my ex used the same tactics with me and managed to keep it going for twenty years. She too, used to have to "fit me in" on occasion which became ever so less frequent as time passed.
Turned out that she had been a serial cheater from day one and the kids weren't even mine.
Look a little closer.


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## Frustrated_in_CA (Mar 25, 2013)

Thanks to all for your responses. I appreciate your input and suggestions.

@JD08 - Thanks. We have spoken about it at length, and she does understand the needs. I really hope it isn't that she doesn't care. She's very nurturing in most respects, just not in the sack. As for relationships, she'd had a couple of serious ones before she and I started dating.

@Trying2figureitout - While I understand your point, I don't think you make a fair comparison. Someone who's brain-dead doesn't have the capability to make choices, or express themselves. I have worked with her through her physical issues for years and am very understanding. She no longer has those physical issues. As you point out even if it were all related to the discomfor she used to feel, there are other alternatives that a caring partner could do instead. I don't understand your point that I should just "accept that" she doesn't feel like having sex as though it's beyond anyone's control.

@hookares - Oh man, I'm so sorry to hear that. It would devistate me if that's what is happening here. I really don't think it's the case, but thanks for the fair warning. I hope you have found someone who treats you better.


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## Woodchuck (Nov 1, 2012)

Frustrated_in_CA said:


> @PHTlump - Thanks, but I've tried the assertive take-charge approach. She's not into that, but prefers the gentle and soft touch. Trust me, I would like to be more aggressive in our sex life, but that's a turn off for her.


Frustrated

My problem was even worse than yours. Here is a post I made elsewhere that may apply to you.....

I was in the same boat as you. The marriage was sexless, fights, disrespect, F-bombs thrown in my face almost daily, negative attitude, just a total marital hell.....I typed up our states divorce laws, left them on her placemat, and walked....I came back in a few hours, BIG FIGHT....We decided we had too much invested in our marriage to divorce, we needed help....
Someone suggested the book "The 5 Love Languages"...I bought it that day. I had NO hope the book would help...I planned to scan thru fast and $hit can it. 
When we got it, she started reading it, but after a couple of chapters had to do chores, so I picked it up and started reading...The premise is simple, The wording isn't psycological crap, and it made sense....I don't think I put the book down till I finished it......Then the wife picked it up, and finished reading it....Here it is in a nutshell.....

A person feels good about the person who fulfills them emotionally...It makes that person EASY TO LOVE...

The whole point of the book is that different people need different things to feel emotionally fulfilled...You speak the language you understand to your mate, and they reply in the language they understand.....If both don't speak the same languages they do not give their mate the emotional support they they crave...They become emotionally bankrupt....

There are 5 languages:
1 Acts of service
2 physical touch
3 Words of affirmation
4 Quality time
5 gifts


If you need "Physical touch" And your mate speaks gifts...
You are craving a hug, and sex, and she buys you a ROLEX......
You become emotionally bankrupt.....

Your wife craves "words of affirmation", and you tile the bathroom....She is going to be pissed....

You are both saying I love and support you, and both of you hear 
nothing but gibberish....

If two people decide they want to love one another, and want their partner to be emotionally fulfilled, The book will show both of them how...
People who learn how to communicate have less conflict...It's as simple as that...

Saturday my wife was in a bad mood...We are doing some work on the kitchen, and she felt she had wasted the morning because she couldn't find a light fixture....She came home and began acting out in a negative manner.....In the past I would have picked up on it, fed off of it, and a blowout would have ensued...DEAD CERTAIN.....

Instead I tried to tease and reason her out of her mood...Everything stayed light, and no fighting...

Sunday I lay down after breakfast to watch TV. The wife joined me and said she had been silly for being in such a bad mood the day before, and was very affectionate....

We had HONEYMOON SEX for 3 hours.....It was absolutely one of those lovemaking sessions that you always remember.....

It was not the first time we have done that since reading the book........

How much would a day like that mean to you.....

If you look up my threads last Oct.-Dec. You will see the absolute hell my life was then....If someone had told me they could make this big a change in my marriage, for $5,000 cash....I would have paid GLADLY.....Not bad for $10 on ebay....

My advise is get the book, do the program with your mate. Practice it for a couple of months, and see if your marriage and feelings about each other aren't improved ....All you have to loose is 10 bucks....

Please feel free to PM me...

good luck
the woodchuck


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