# Hello



## HotAirBaloon14

Dont know where to start. Been married for 7 years, together for 9. Past couple months wife has been talking about seperation and divorce. I have been a stay at home dad for past 3 years, now she says I am lazy and not the man she thought I would be. Cleaning up the house like I normally do I ran across petition for divorce paperwork she has started filling out. I have been working on myself since all this started, but it's been hard. I am in school part time, just started a new job, and last Monday was our anniversary. 

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## Tilted 1

Welcome, so how many children do you have? And ages, in the 3 yrs how was it discussed that you would be a SAHD? How long until you finish school. Has your wife only recently changed in attitude or was there other issues? Why DO YOU THINK she is filing for divorce?


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## Diana7

If you are a stay at home dad and are studying as well, then you are NOT lazy. Presumably your child or children are still young?


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## She'sStillGotIt

I'm glad to hear you're working again. It's NEVER a good idea to pull yourself out of the job market for too long or you lose all marketability. Thankfully, it doesn't sound as though 3 years did irreparable damage.

Folks will probably disagree with me because we're not allowed to say anything anymore without offending the masses, but I'll say it anyway. I think your wife lost respect for you being a 'stay at home dad.' Some women simply don't see it as sexy or attractive or a turn-on if their man wants to be a stay at home parent while their wife supports them instead of building a career out in the world.

I'm just saying from the sounds of it, I think she's lost all respect for you. 

Lastly, STOP doing the Pick Me! dance. Jeez, you automatically assume that YOU have to dance as fast as you can and that YOU have to do all kinds of work on yourself in order to keep Miss Thang in your life. She sounds like an arrogant, self-absorbed witch. Find your voice and stand up for yourself.


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## HotAirBaloon14

Tilted 1 said:


> Welcome, so how many children do you have? And ages, in the 3 yrs how was it discussed that you would be a SAHD? How long until you finish school. Has your wife only recently changed in attitude or was there other issues? Why DO YOU THINK she is filing for divorce?


We have the one age 5. I got laid off for a job and I had another job lined up, but she convinced me to find something else I wanted to do and go to school. We both agreed after she convinced me to be a SAHD. I understand her feelings that I should have done more classes, but I was overwhelmed. I am only a few classes away from finishing. We talked about me finding a job when our son started school, and that's when I started looking. Without finishing my degree it's been hard. She only recently changed in attitude, although this has been going on for a couple months now. Before that I never saw it coming.

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## Prodigal

Do you think her change could be due to her being involved with, or attracted to, another man?

For a woman to suddenly change her tune and want a divorce … well, you either didn't realize she was falling out of love with you or she's already fallen in love with someone else.


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## Mr The Other

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> Dont know where to start. Been married for 7 years, together for 9. Past couple months wife has been talking about seperation and divorce. I have been a stay at home dad for past 3 years, now she says I am lazy and not the man she thought I would be. Cleaning up the house like I normally do I ran across petition for divorce paperwork she has started filling out. I have been working on myself since all this started, but it's been hard. I am in school part time, just started a new job, and last Monday was our anniversary.


That is a short post and there is a lot more to discuss. There are a few things that make what you are going through, but there are a few things that are typical.

A stay at home husband is vulnerable. Many women will like the idea, but as @She'sStillGotIt says, the reality is rarely as cool. It can often be that they feel like they have taken the male role. It can be tempting to try to make up for this by working extra hard to impress. 

This can be to mistake the issue. 

Be a call ass manly man. Accept she is likely to divorce you fully. It is regretful, but you are not going to cry about it. Rise to the occasion and focus not on trying to stay married, but on being a great father and role model to your child. Consider that you have to take a different role, get the job to reflect you will need one or smash through the last bit of study and regain your identity.

The man she is likely to want will not be concentrating on his ill-fortune. He will be living up to a higher ideal as a Father. Consider the best (single) Father you can become to your child., and act like that person until you are him. It might well be that your wife falls in love with that man, she might not.


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## HotAirBaloon14

Prodigal said:


> Do you think her change could be due to her being involved with, or attracted to, another man?
> 
> 
> 
> For a woman to suddenly change her tune and want a divorce … well, you either didn't realize she was falling out of love with you or she's already fallen in love with someone else.


I dont believe she is involved with another man, but it could very well be she is attracted to another man and sees him as more of a man than me. 

I would say I didnt realize she was falling out of love. She worked all the time, and i was home with our son our running him around and taking care of everything at home.

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## HotAirBaloon14

Mr The Other said:


> That is a short post and there is a lot more to discuss. There are a few things that make what you are going through, but there are a few things that are typical.
> 
> A stay at home husband is vulnerable. Many women will like the idea, but as @She'sStillGotIt says, the reality is rarely as cool. It can often be that they feel like they have taken the male role. It can be tempting to try to make up for this by working extra hard to impress.
> 
> This can be to mistake the issue.
> 
> Be a call ass manly man. Accept she is likely to divorce you fully. It is regretful, but you are not going to cry about it. Rise to the occasion and focus not on trying to stay married, but on being a great father and role model to your child. Consider that you have to take a different role, get the job to reflect you will need one or smash through the last bit of study and regain your identity.
> 
> The man she is likely to want will not be concentrating on his ill-fortune. He will be living up to a higher ideal as a Father. Consider the best (single) Father you can become to your child., and act like that person until you are him. It might well be that your wife falls in love with that man, she might not.


I get that all that now. We talked about everything as I was staying at home studying, but apparently she wasnt honest with me at the time. I am trying my hardest to be a stand up dad and let her do her thing, but my emotions get the best of me sometimes. 



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## HotAirBaloon14

There is more to the story, I just dont know how to tell it all. I have already pushed her to the point she wont talk to me unless she initiates the conversation, and if I get any reply it's a short, snappy reply. I am trying my hardest to be a good dad, finish school, and work a new job. I have a new job that sucks and wont pay my bills if I have to move out, so that adds to my anxiety. 

She decided she needed time away and wanted to go to her moms for Thanksgiving. I said that sounded like a good idea, but she wouldn't go without our son. Thanksgiving has always been my favorite holiday, she knows that, but I let her take him anyways thinking that was the right thing to do. It has completely ruined this holiday for me and I wont be able to ever look at it the same. While she has been gone I have not been texting her, buy still get a text from her every so often. If I dont reply I'm being an ass, if I do reply she replies back with a short rude text. 

After discussing not spending money until we figure things out, she bought a new matress and a new computer, wth?

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## Married but Happy

I suggest that you consult a lawyer and find out what your rights are in your situation. Do it now - you really can't afford to wait and just hope things will change.


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## HotAirBaloon14

Married but Happy said:


> I suggest that you consult a lawyer and find out what your rights are in your situation. Do it now - you really can't afford to wait and just hope things will change.


I'm not just waiting to see what happens, but I am going to try and save my marriage. 

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## Prodigal

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> I'm not just waiting to see what happens, but I am going to try and save my marriage.


You can't save your marriage alone. Your wife took off to spend Thanksgiving with her family and didn't give a good cahoot what happened to you.

I have this gut feeling that there very well could be another man. It may not have progressed to the physical, but don't rule out she could be having an emotional affair. Your wife has checked out. I'm sorry, but that's how I see it as a woman.


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## BluesPower

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> I'm not just waiting to see what happens, but I am going to try and save my marriage.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk





Prodigal said:


> You can't save your marriage alone. Your wife took off to spend Thanksgiving with her family and didn't give a good cahoot what happened to you.
> 
> I have this gut feeling that there very well could be another man. It may not have progressed to the physical, but don't rule out she could be having an emotional affair. Your wife has checked out. I'm sorry, but that's how I see it as a woman.


Honestly brother, you really need to listen to what you are being told. 

Odds are that she has another man, that is not a SAHD, sorry but more than likely true. 

I suspect that she has been cheating a while, she is tired of your dead weight, and she HAS moved on. 

You need to protect yourself, and you need to do it now. You don't have a marriage to save, probably have not had one for a while. 

In the FUTURE, NEVER EVER depend on another person for your financial survival, it is a fools errand.

Please, wake up and protect yourself while you can, I suspect that you are about to be left in the dust...


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## Prodigal

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> After discussing not spending money until we figure things out, she bought a new matress and a new computer, wth?


If this doesn't make you realize your wife has no respect for you, I don't know what will ….


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## Tilted 1

Yup, some KISA is telling her what he would do for her if she was his. And you acting the way you are currently is the "pick me dance" but with little to offer you are only the babysitter. And she will make the decision for you because you have to her every whim.


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## HotAirBaloon14

Prodigal said:


> You can't save your marriage alone. Your wife took off to spend Thanksgiving with her family and didn't give a good cahoot what happened to you.
> 
> 
> 
> I have this gut feeling that there very well could be another man. It may not have progressed to the physical, but don't rule out she could be having an emotional affair. Your wife has checked out. I'm sorry, but that's how I see it as a woman.


That could be true. If there is another man she has not had the chance to get physical outside of work.

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## Prodigal

People have lunchtime "quickies" all the time. Do you have access to her phone? Social media? I'd suggest you start investigating. If you find nothing, fine. But I have a suspicion you might be in for an unpleasant surprise.


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## HotAirBaloon14

Prodigal said:


> People have lunchtime "quickies" all the time. Do you have access to her phone? Social media? I'd suggest you start investigating. If you find nothing, fine. But I have a suspicion you might be in for an unpleasant surprise.


After the replies on here I have gotten a little paranoid and shamefully did some digging. We are both off social media and I could not find anything showing she is back on one. I did look into her text and can say the only way she is texting another guy is if she deletes all those text immediately and that person has an iPhone, as those dont show up on phone bill.

I know most people feel like this at first, but I feel in my heart that she would never cheat on me, she is honestly just disappointed in my lack of having a good paying job by now. We live more comfortable than a lot of people and have a decent savings, but have not been able to put much into that savings in a while, or plan an expensive vacation. She says I am lazy and lack motivation. She is a very career oriented person and I am a laid back person who doesnt always react as quickly as she wants. 

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## Prodigal

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> After the replies on here I have gotten a little paranoid and shamefully did some digging.


There is nothing to be ashamed of for "digging." I'd suggest you read a few threads on the Coping With Infidelity forum here. Trust, but verify is frequently advised. 



HotAirBaloon14 said:


> … have not been able to put much into that savings in a while, or plan an expensive vacation. She says I am lazy and lack motivation. She is a very career oriented person and I am a laid back person who doesnt always react as quickly as she wants.


At least you have a savings account. And why does a vacation need to be "expensive" in order to be taken? Maybe I'm just too old to understand this concept, but if two people enjoy common interests and each other's company, ANY vacation should be fine. Hell, my husband and I used to camp out in a two-room tent and we had a great time.

Here's the thing I see happening here: Your wife is treating you with complete disrespect. You've mentioned several times that she calls you "lazy." Not a constructive or nice thing to say to one's spouse, is it? 

Do you think it could just be a matter of you two having two incompatible personalities? Do you think she might consider compromising and going a little easier on you? Because from where I'm sitting, this marriage sounds like it's burnt toast. Laid back or not, you'd better sit down and have a VERY serious discussion with your wife. At this point, it sounds like she's done. Sorry.


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## HotAirBaloon14

Prodigal said:


> There is nothing to be ashamed of for "digging." I'd suggest you read a few threads on the Coping With Infidelity forum here. Trust, but verify is frequently advised.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> At least you have a savings account. And why does a vacation need to be "expensive" in order to be taken? Maybe I'm just too old to understand this concept, but if two people enjoy common interests and each other's company, ANY vacation should be fine. Hell, my husband and I used to camp out in a two-room tent and we had a great time.
> 
> 
> 
> Here's the thing I see happening here: Your wife is treating you with complete disrespect. You've mentioned several times that she calls you "lazy." Not a constructive or nice thing to say to one's spouse, is it?
> 
> 
> 
> Do you think it could just be a matter of you two having two incompatible personalities? Do you think she might consider compromising and going a little easier on you? Because from where I'm sitting, this marriage sounds like it's burnt toast. Laid back or not, you'd better sit down and have a VERY serious discussion with your wife. At this point, it sounds like she's done. Sorry.


Incompatible, I dont know. We have a lot of the same personality traits and thoughts. We have gotten along great for 9 years. We dont fight much at all. I have always loved spending time with her and have always tried to do new things with her. 

She wont talk to me at all about our marriage right now, so I dont bring it up. We seem to get along for a while and talk, and then something happens and she goes into mad mode and becomes short with me. I just let her do her thing at that point and leave her alone. We just got back from getting a Christmas tree, everything went fine until right before we got home, then snap. 

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## Wolfman1968

See an attorney!


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## HotAirBaloon14

Wolfman1968 said:


> See an attorney!


I have consulted with one already.

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## Prodigal

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> She wont talk to me at all about our marriage right now, so I dont bring it up. We seem to get along for a while and talk, and then something happens and she goes into mad mode and becomes short with me. I just let her do her thing at that point and leave her alone. We just got back from getting a Christmas tree, everything went fine until right before we got home, then snap.


C'mon, man, this is your WIFE. Something is setting her off. You are backing off, letting her treat you badly, and you aren't saying what you want to say. Why are you permitting her to call all the shots???? I get that you are laid back, but this is a major red flag she is waving in your face.

I'm beginning to wonder if what you claim to be laid back is more a case of fear. Because if you have any fear about manning up and putting it out there, I can understand why she's disrespecting you.

Sorry, but it's time to strap on a pair and tell her to cut the crap and tell you what the hell is going on here. Seriously.


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## SunCMars

The snap comes from this inner conflict she is feeling.
Yes, she is conflicted.

One part of her wants to split off from you, the other part, her habits and your traditions are making a slow process of this divide, in her mind.

She hates that she repeatedly reverts to that loving-wife state.

She is frustrated that she can't get rid of you. Fast enough.

Your resisting and acting as a normal husband is setting her off.

She is trying to drive you off. 
At this, she is failing and this pisses her off.

Does she have a new man? 
Maybe, a guy feeding her sweet nothings.

A guy at work maybe has opened her eyes that there are more possibilities for her with regards to men.
She sees herself as desirable. 

She wants a better life than the one that she has. And you are not contributing (enough) to her dream.

It matters not whether she is in a EA or Pa, she is going to look for this as soon as she dumps you.
Unbridled ambition knows what it wants and soon learns what is in the way of it.

At work, she sees men who fit her ideal. 
At home, she sees a husband who gives her fits with his spiel.

Sorry, it happens.

You will be able to find her replacement. Nice, honest guys always do........

Just add to your descriptive's, viz., nice, honest, and gainfully employed.


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## Mr The Other

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> After the replies on here I have gotten a little paranoid and shamefully did some digging. We are both off social media and I could not find anything showing she is back on one. I did look into her text and can say the only way she is texting another guy is if she deletes all those text immediately and that person has an iPhone, as those dont show up on phone bill.
> 
> I know most people feel like this at first, but I feel in my heart that she would never cheat on me, she is honestly just disappointed in my lack of having a good paying job by now. We live more comfortable than a lot of people and have a decent savings, but have not been able to put much into that savings in a while, or plan an expensive vacation. She says I am lazy and lack motivation. She is a very career oriented person and I am a laid back person who doesnt always react as quickly as she wants.


Generally, men spot 25% of the times their partner's have affairs. Women spot it about 400% of the time.

Being a man, it is sensible for you to do a little vigilance. That said, posters here are often projecting their own experience. I do not think my own ex-wife was having an affair, but there were many on here convinced of it.

Frankly, I am inclined to take her at face value. She probably does want to see your masculine side.


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## delupt

You seem to be taking the right steps of getting back into good work. 
A stay-at-home dad is a dead man, especially if married to a corporate career woman; she's surrounded by achieving guys while the SAHD is doing the dusting. A 5yo is surely in school 9-5pm so get your career/job restarted asap.

Oh, and get access to her phone and check for all the usual messaging apps (WhatsApp, Kik, Viber, Telegram, Signal, etc.) ...


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## HotAirBaloon14

delupt said:


> You seem to be taking the right steps of getting back into good work.
> 
> A stay-at-home dad is a dead man, especially if married to a corporate career woman; she's surrounded by achieving guys while the SAHD is doing the dusting. A 5yo is surely in school 9-5pm so get your career/job restarted asap.
> 
> 
> 
> Oh, and get access to her phone and check for all the usual messaging apps (WhatsApp, Kik, Viber, Telegram, Signal, etc.) ...


I am working and trying to get my foot in a door leading to my choosen career, it's been difficult. We have friends and family who are more than qualified for their jobs having a hard time finding a job. I know I am blind being in my position, but I do believe you are right about being around successful men all day at work and that causing her to see me in a different light. That's difficult to accept as me staying at home raising our son was as much her idea as mine. I dont believe she has any messaging apps and hate to go looking for them. 

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## BluesPower

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> I am working and trying to get my foot in a door leading to my choosen career, it's been difficult. We have friends and family who are more than qualified for their jobs having a hard time finding a job. I know I am blind being in my position, but I do believe you are right about being around successful men all day at work and that causing her to see me in a different light. That's difficult to accept as me staying at home raising our son was as much her idea as mine. I dont believe she has any messaging apps and hate to go looking for them.


Listen, with respect, you really are spending a lot of time justifying your decisions to NOT MAKE A DECISION... 

Regardless of how progressive and egalitarian people THINK they are, almost all women, loose respect for a man that THEY are supporting.

"As much her idea as mine"????? Really, doesn't sound that way. And if it really was both of your ideas, she does not feel that way anymore.

And "and hate to go looking for them", really? Listen, almost everything you have said in your posts, indicate the she is screwing around... And the only reason that you have not had the self-respect to leave is that she has all the money, as far as I can tell. 

Honestly, you are in denial about all of this. You need to get a JOB that pays well and file for divorce. And, frankly it kind of sounds like you may need to grow up in a lot of areas...

Can you see any of this?


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## UpsideDownWorld11

Just to echo others. You might as well cut off your balls and drop them in her coach bag if you agree to be a SAHD. The role reversal thing isn't catching on anytime soon. She is gonna see those high earning men around her and see you holding a dustpan, you can figure out the rest.


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## jlg07

IF this is how she is acting, do NOT feel bad about investigating further -- texts, computer usage, use a VAR, etc. You shouldn't be dealing with this blind, and right now you are. You need more info to see what is going on and causing this all of a sudden.


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## HotAirBaloon14

BluesPower said:


> Listen, with respect, you really are spending a lot of time justifying your decisions to NOT MAKE A DECISION...
> 
> 
> 
> Regardless of how progressive and egalitarian people THINK they are, almost all women, loose respect for a man that THEY are supporting.
> 
> 
> 
> "As much her idea as mine"????? Really, doesn't sound that way. And if it really was both of your ideas, she does not feel that way anymore.
> 
> 
> 
> And "and hate to go looking for them", really? Listen, almost everything you have said in your posts, indicate the she is screwing around... And the only reason that you have not had the self-respect to leave is that she has all the money, as far as I can tell.
> 
> 
> 
> Honestly, you are in denial about all of this. You need to get a JOB that pays well and file for divorce. And, frankly it kind of sounds like you may need to grow up in a lot of areas...
> 
> 
> 
> Can you see any of this?


All valid points. I have been looking for a good paying job for months now, before all this started. She might have lost respect for me being a SAHD but she was the one that initially brought it up and I have been honest about all of it durring the process. Maybe they are excuses and I cant see the truth, but I find it hard to walk away. She is not tech savvy at all and not able to hide stuff like that. Only option left is get a recovery program and somehow get her phone and download deleted info, you suggest that? She has not through all of this spent extra time away from home.

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## Tilted 1

Yes get phonlab, and do the check. Then if nothing and you don't think she has a burner phone. Then dazzle her with some kind of employment, and look to change jobs when the one offering more comes along. Get a masculine job, until then and don't come home and complain you hurt, just take it in stride.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> That could be true. If there is another man she has not had the chance to get physical outside of work.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk


Brother, this is one of the first things a spouse tries to convince themselves of. 

It's almost a given that there has been time and opportunities for in this case the wife.

Concentrate on yourself, start the what if scenarios in your planning. As in what if she left tomorrow with your son, or served you divorce papers today.

She appears to have already left you in her mind and is just waiting for the best timing for herself.

Make whatever plans you can to get financially independent. Make her shoulder some child and home responsibilities. Don't ask her to, just do it.

You're welfare is just as important as hers, and should be more important to you than hers, I'm sad to say.

Her cards are on the table for you to see. Her future plans don't include you from what she's showing.

This is harsh sounding although it's not meant to be, but you are going to have to believe what you see happening, at some point. 

Because it will happen without you. Whether or not you want it to or are ready for it.

Hang in there.


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## HotAirBaloon14

Tilted 1 said:


> Yes get phonlab, and do the check. Then if nothing and you don't think she has a burner phone. Then dazzle her with some kind of employment, and look to change jobs when the one offering more comes along. Get a masculine job, until then and don't come home and complain you hurt, just take it in stride.


I do have a job now, and am continuing to look avidly for a better job. I dont come home and complain about anything, that's is one of the many things I have been doing is not be negative. 

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## Mr The Other

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> I do have a job now, and am continuing to look avidly for a better job. I dont come home and complain about anything, that's is one of the many things I have been doing is not be negative.


Good work!

Getting a job is vital and not to woo her back. Just having work helps give a man his role and confidence back. It should not be this way, but it is.

I once knew a much younger girl who had a brilliant brain. She wanted a serious relationship with me, but also wanted it to be her who went to work. These things do happen. Frankly, part of me was tempted. But, there were other factors and I suspect she would not have like the idea as much as the reality. 

The main point is to get you back on your feet after this knock. If it helps your marriage, that is very great. If your marriage falls apart anyway, then it is vital. 

Do you like sport?


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## HotAirBaloon14

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Brother, this is one of the first things a spouse tries to convince themselves of.
> 
> 
> 
> It's almost a given that there has been time and opportunities for in this case the wife.
> 
> 
> 
> Concentrate on yourself, start the what if scenarios in your planning. As in what if she left tomorrow with your son, or served you divorce papers today.
> 
> 
> 
> She appears to have already left you in her mind and is just waiting for the best timing for herself.
> 
> 
> 
> Make whatever plans you can to get financially independent. Make her shoulder some child and home responsibilities. Don't ask her to, just do it.
> 
> 
> 
> You're welfare is just as important as hers, and should be more important to you than hers, I'm sad to say.
> 
> 
> 
> Her cards are on the table for you to see. Her future plans don't include you from what she's showing.
> 
> 
> 
> This is harsh sounding although it's not meant to be, but you are going to have to believe what you see happening, at some point.
> 
> 
> 
> Because it will happen without you. Whether or not you want it to or are ready for it.
> 
> 
> 
> Hang in there.


I know her cheating is a possibility, it's just not something I am going to jump to and accuse her of yet. I am working and trying to prepare myself for a divorce as much as I dont want it. She hasn't served me with papers yet or confirmed she does want one. So until then I do want to try and make it work, as much as people here say she is done and cheating on me, I cant go with that until I have some proof, I will look.

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## Marduk

Ragnar Ragnasson said:


> Brother, this is one of the first things a spouse tries to convince themselves of.
> 
> It's almost a given that there has been time and opportunities for in this case the wife.


I don't mean to add to OP's paranoia, but my ex wife somehow managed to have a full blown physical affair while we drove together to work every day, ate lunches together most days, and spent all weekend every weekend together. Weekday evenings we also spent together.

She literally must have been having sex with him in a storage room at work or something.


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## Marduk

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> I know her cheating is a possibility, it's just not something I am going to jump to and accuse her of yet. I am working and trying to prepare myself for a divorce as much as I dont want it. She hasn't served me with papers yet or confirmed she does want one. So until then I do want to try and make it work, as much as people here say she is done and cheating on me, I cant go with that until I have some proof, I will look.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk


What does she say when you ask her what she wants?


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## HotAirBaloon14

Marduk said:


> What does she say when you ask her what she wants?


She says ," I dont know, I want time alone, I think I want to seperate " she wont talk and I try not to ask too much or she gets mad.

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## Marduk

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> She says ," I dont know, I want time alone, I think I want to seperate " she wont talk and I try not to ask too much or she gets mad.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk


And you let that be acceptable?

This is guerrilla warfare. She fires off an emotional pot shot and then runs away. 

Don’t let it be. 

Tell her there’s the door if she’s unhappy and won’t talk about it. If she will talk about it, different story.


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## HotAirBaloon14

Marduk said:


> And you let that be acceptable?
> 
> 
> 
> This is guerrilla warfare. She fires off an emotional pot shot and then runs away.
> 
> 
> 
> Don’t let it be.
> 
> 
> 
> Tell her there’s the door if she’s unhappy and won’t talk about it. If she will talk about it, different story.


When I try to pry more it only pushes her more towards the door. If that's where she is headed, then fine, but I'm not going to push her out. 

I dont have a clue what she is actually thinking besides she is highly disappointed in me right now. I'm working on improving myself and trying to not completely lose her in the process. I dont let her walk all over me, at the same time I dont go looking for fights with her. 

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## HotAirBaloon14

Marduk said:


> I don't mean to add to OP's paranoia, but my ex wife somehow managed to have a full blown physical affair while we drove together to work every day, ate lunches together most days, and spent all weekend every weekend together. Weekday evenings we also spent together.
> 
> 
> 
> She literally must have been having sex with him in a storage room at work or something.


Well that's what she would have to be doing. We are literally together all the time except when she is at work, and she doesnt work any overtime. 

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## BluesPower

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> When I try to pry more it only pushes her more towards the door. If that's where she is headed, then fine, but I'm not going to push her out.
> 
> I dont have a clue what she is actually thinking besides she is highly disappointed in me right now. I'm working on improving myself and trying to not completely lose her in the process. I dont let her walk all over me, at the same time I dont go looking for fights with her.


This post and the one right before it from you are the actually definition of a doormat and letting her walk all over her. 

You are scared to "Push" her. If you ask questions she gets "Mad". Doormat. 

Do you have zero self respect? Really? 

You have the right to know what is going on, and even though you don't believe it or understand it, you are being walked all over. 

I you just refuse to see...


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## Mr.Married

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> Marduk said:
> 
> 
> 
> And you let that be acceptable?
> 
> 
> 
> This is guerrilla warfare. She fires off an emotional pot shot and then runs away.
> 
> 
> 
> Don’t let it be.
> 
> 
> 
> Tell her there’s the door if she’s unhappy and won’t talk about it. If she will talk about it, different story.
> 
> 
> 
> When I try to pry more it only pushes her more towards the door. If that's where she is headed, then fine, but I'm not going to push her out.
> 
> I dont have a clue what she is actually thinking besides she is highly disappointed in me right now. I'm working on improving myself and trying to not completely lose her in the process. I dont let her walk all over me, at the same time I dont go looking for fights with her.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Oh goodness.....you really need to go back and read this a couple times and let it sink in.

You already lost the battle....your doing the “I don’t want to push her away dance”. Lack of personal strength and boundaries is what led you to where you are.

The correct move once you found the divorce papers was to sign them and hand them to her before she even gave them to you.

You have already lost. 

Take the lead!!! Operate from a position of strength!!! Stop laying down in front the steam roller.

A passive man is not attractive.... it’s just how it is. 

Despite what main stream media wants you to believe.....being a “vaginized man” is not cool.


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## Prodigal

Who gives a damn if she's ticked off if you ask her what the hell is going on??????

Yeah, you are acting like a beta/doormat. For the life of me, I can't understand why you are allowing HER anger to decide YOUR lack of reaction.

Jeesh, get ANGRY already!!! She's treating you, and talking to you, like you're crap. It's one thing to be easy-going and laid back. It's quite another to allow your spouse to speak to you this way.

As a woman, I'm just being upfront with you. She has a foot out the door. She's keeping you in line with HER agenda by using anger and threats. I don't know why you would want to hang on to this nasty woman, but it's your life. However, I will once again advise you lay it on the line to her and just have it out. 

I get the feeling that some of your hesitancy may be due to realizing you'll be in a financially worse situation if you walk. The thing is, you can't put a price on self-respect. And I speak from experience, having walked out on my alcoholic husband when my finances were less than stellar … JMO.


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## Bluesclues

I will set aside for a moment whether she is cheating or not...

Stop acting like a scared little boy when she gets mad. Call her on her it when she treats you with disrespect, even if she may be right about why she is mad. Stand up and demand respect. 

My XH was a SAHD when our kids were little. It was my idea too - he hated the job he was in and I didn’t want him to be miserable. I had no idea I would come to resent him so much. He was a “laid back” guy too, which translates to lazy and unable to multi-task. Which meant I had to (in my mind) do “everything”, I had to work to pay all of our bills and pick up the slack at home so he could be laid back. And he got the luxury of spending time with our children that I didn’t. I was jealous of my SAHM friends but would convince myself I  was career-focused and this was what I wanted. I really wanted to go back in time and pick a different man, a man that would allow me the choice to be a mom at home or work, but not NEED to be the sole one carrying everything. 

We still had good moments in between but my resentment would build and build until I lashed out. And he would cower and give me space. Which just reinforced my belief that I had another child to mother, not a partner or a man. I do wonder what would be different if he had ever said “Hey, cut the ****.” We were both struggling with the roles that didn’t fit us as it turned out. 

Makes me sad. Oh, and my second husband cheated only during work hours. The COW had a lovely 5 min commute.


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## Ragnar Ragnasson

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> She says ," I dont know, I want time alone, I think I want to seperate " she wont talk and I try not to ask too much or she gets mad.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk


OP, regrettably that's another sign.


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## Marduk

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> When I try to pry more it only pushes her more towards the door. If that's where she is headed, then fine, but I'm not going to push her out.
> 
> I dont have a clue what she is actually thinking besides she is highly disappointed in me right now. I'm working on improving myself and trying to not completely lose her in the process. I dont let her walk all over me, at the same time I dont go looking for fights with her.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk


She’s getting something out of the ability to threaten you, and not be called on it. 

What is it?


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## HotAirBaloon14

Marduk said:


> She’s getting something out of the ability to threaten you, and not be called on it.
> 
> 
> 
> What is it?


I dont have a clue.

I mean I have a job now, I'm still looking for other jobs, still in school and almost finished, I've been losing weight, what am I doing still that so wrong, besides wanting to save my marriage?

Do I need to stop just caring about savinh my marriage and Only focus on me?

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## Mr The Other

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> I dont have a clue.
> 
> I mean I have a job now, I'm still looking for other jobs, still in school and almost finished, I've been losing weight, what am I doing still that so wrong, besides wanting to save my marriage?
> 
> *Do I need to stop just caring about saving my marriage and Only focus on me?*
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk


You are responsible for your half of the marriage. 
Women will often resent their husbands having less income than them. This is not your fault or hers, but it is reality.
Well done on getting a job, good luck on getting a better one.

Become the best man that you can be and your marriage is more likely to work. Either way, an emotionally needy man is not the man you admire, nor one she admires.

There is no right and wrong as such. Asking that is, wrong. It is framed in the context of how do I do the "good boy" thing. 

Well done on losing weight. I suggest you go for weights and MMA. These communities are typically more welcoming than you might expect.

Tell me, and I am sorry this is harsh so I want to add hope, what type of men in your own life do you admire and respect? Particular individuals?


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## HotAirBaloon14

Mr The Other said:


> You are responsible for your half of the marriage.
> Women will often resent their husbands having less income than them. This is not your fault or hers, but it is reality.
> Well done on getting a job, good luck on getting a better one.
> 
> Become the best man that you can be and your marriage is more likely to work. Either way, an emotionally needy man is not the man you admire, nor one she admires.
> 
> There is no right and wrong as such. Asking that is, wrong. It is framed in the context of how do I do the "good boy" thing.
> 
> Well done on losing weight. I suggest you go for weights and MMA. These communities are typically more welcoming than you might expect.
> 
> Tell me, and I am sorry this is harsh so I want to add hope, what type of men in your own life do you admire and respect? Particular individuals?


I dont have anyone I specifically admire. The type of guy I admire is one who is happy in life, has a good job and a happy family. One who doesnt worry about what people think or their ideas of what he should be. 

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## Marduk

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> I dont have a clue.
> 
> I mean I have a job now, I'm still looking for other jobs, still in school and almost finished, I've been losing weight, what am I doing still that so wrong, besides wanting to save my marriage?
> 
> Do I need to stop just caring about savinh my marriage and Only focus on me?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk


Wow. Whoosh!

Listen man, I'm trying to help you here. We're trying to help you here. But we can't make you want to be helped, and we can't give you courage.

You are part of this marriage. Therefore, if you're not firing on all cylinders, then neither is your marriage. And you cannot control your marriage or your wife - you can only control yourself.

So here's what you do instead of what you're doing:

1. start working out. Today. Heavy emphasis on lifting heavy things and putting them back down again. Repeat as many times as you can, every day.

2. start eating right. 1/3 protein, 1/3 good fats, 1/3 carbs by calorie count. Get an app, set your target weight, and let it count your calories for you.

3. do not beg for attention from your wife. Instead, be worthy of her attention. Get your **** done. Get your school done. Hold down your job and find a better one if you need to. Have discipline. Have integrity. Lead by virtue of who you are and where you're going instead of the husband label.

4. Once you have your **** together, sit down and have the conversation with your wife that you've been avoiding. Start by looking her in the eye and asking her if she's sorry she married you, and if so, why. If her reasons are valid, work on them. If they aren't, say so - without fighting or defending yourself. If she wants out, make it easy for her to go. If she wants to stay, make it clear to her what your expectations are from marriage.

Do not dance on the edge of a precipice forever asking for someone else to make you safe.


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## BluesPower

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> I dont have anyone I specifically admire. The type of guy I admire is one who is happy in life, has a good job and a happy family. One who doesnt worry about what people think or their ideas of what he should be.


Might I suggest that you maybe think about admiring men that feel good about themselves? That do not let their wives treat them like a doormat, and walk all over them?

Men that feel good in their own skin? Men that are not only great fathers, but set an example for their children about how NOT to be treated by their (most likely cheating) wives? 

Men that teach their children how they should be treated in their relationships, that don't allow themselves to be buffaloed in to being a SAHD. Men that do not allow their wives to treat them the way that yours does. 

Do you think that this type of perspective might help you more in life and in fact may help you to have a happy family with somebody (Not your current wife) and a happy marriage??????


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## Mr The Other

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> I dont have anyone I specifically admire. The type of guy I admire is one who is happy in life, has a good job and a happy family. One who doesnt worry about what people think or their ideas of what he should be.


Thanks for the answer. It is really open. Well done. 

You are also going through an incredibly rough time in your life and will be feeling overwhelmed.

- happy in life
- has a good job and a happy family
- One who doesnt worry about what people think or their ideas of what he should be

That is a fine list. The last one means you can take or leave all of this.

- Happy in life.
You will have ups and downs, but you can be happy with you life overall. The challenge is to live it as best you can.

- Has a good job and a happy family
That is essentially a good Father figure. You can certainly be that from what I read. The only suggestion I would make is this, you are responsible for being a good Father figure, you are not responsible for anyone else's happiness but your own. If they are unhappy, it is on them.
I could be completely wrong, but I get the impression of a man who has not been the ideal father figure you would like. Life not being yourself can be tough.

- One who doesnt worry about what people think or their ideas of what he should be
That equates, perhaps, in part to someone who knows what they are *doing* in their life and has a sense of higher calling. In the second part, it equates to *being* at ease with yourself. 

May I ask your own family background?

My own situation that brought me here was newly married to a wife with whom I could get on, but who would not make any decent constribution to the marriage. I tell you that as we all project our own situations on to things when we read them.

PS: Typical TAM book suggestions:
- No More My Nice Guy, discussion of the difference between being truely good and being passive/domesticated. It was recommended to me on here, though not that useful!
- Awareness, Anthony deMello. Mind blowingly great for me, but I did have a suitable spiritual background for it.


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## Marduk

The classics may serve you if you don’t have any mentors in real life. 

I like this one:

http://seinfeld.co/library/meditations.pdf


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## sunsetmist

Is it possible that your wife was waiting for you to finish school before she began to distance herself?

As a female and I read this, I'm feeling that it would be easy for you to be overwhelmed. Take a couple of things at a time. 

The bottom line is if you feel good about yourself, you will radiate confidence/assurance and present a more attractive personal to everyone, not just family.


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## HotAirBaloon14

sunsetmist said:


> Is it possible that your wife was waiting for you to finish school before she began to distance herself?
> 
> 
> 
> As a female and I read this, I'm feeling that it would be easy for you to be overwhelmed. Take a couple of things at a time.
> 
> 
> 
> The bottom line is if you feel good about yourself, you will radiate confidence/assurance and present a more attractive personal to everyone, not just family.


I dont think she was waiting, but what would I know. 

I did feel good about myself until all this happened, now I'm trying to get that feeling back.

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## Mr.Married

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> still in school and almost finished, I've been losing weight


Awesome .... Good Job !!!!!

Finish school !!!!!! Finish school !!!!! don't give up ..... it's almost dome...finish it !!!!


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## Marduk

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> I did feel good about myself until all this happened, now I'm trying to get that feeling back.


It's there for you to take.

But you're the one that's going to have to take it.


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## sunsetmist

Well yuck. Sorry we made you feel doubt. We do not know either of you and we are speaking generally. We all have areas in which we can improve, so working on suggestions will at least occupy your mind. 

i like @Mr The Other's and @Marduk's advice. When she talks separation/divorce, give her complete attention, make eye contact, ask the questions you have and ask for examples (i.e. "describe what you mean by lazy."). Tell her how much she means to you. Ask how long she has felt this way. But do all this as a man who is firm and confident, who wants to save his marriage, but has to have valid input to know if there is anything left to save.


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## Marduk

Doubt is good. 

The only real confidence is the one you find after at least one - or perhaps hundreds or thousands of dark nights of the soul. 

Doubt is only bad if you get stuck in it.


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## HotAirBaloon14

Not sure if it's good or bad, but she came home and had an attitude again, and I snapped. I told her I didn't do anything to deserve the attitude and I wasnt going to sit there and take it anymore, she needed to take that somewhere else. Her reply was "you need to take yourself somewhere else", which came out half hearted. I told her I dont have to. She isnt happy with me but she lost the attitude so far.

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## Mr.Married

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> Not sure if it's good or bad, but she came home and had an attitude again, and I snapped. I told her I didn't do anything to deserve the attitude and I wasnt going to sit there and take it anymore, she needed to take that somewhere else. Her reply was "you need to take yourself somewhere else", which came out half hearted. I told her I dont have to. She isnt happy with me but she lost the attitude so far.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk


Stand your ground. Don’t back down. You have the right to command respect.


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## HotAirBaloon14

Mr.Married said:


> Stand your ground. Don’t back down. You have the right to command respect.


Well today she said she wants to sit down and talk about divorce this weekend..

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## Mr The Other

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> Well today she said she wants to sit down and talk about divorce this weekend..


You aspire to be a great husband and great father. 

Live it. 

Be clear as to what you need and what you are willing to give. Be open, take responsibility. If something is not acceptable to you, make it clear that you are calling it "I will not accept that" rather than "That is not fair".

This is a horrible place to be in. Be the best man you can be.

Seriously. It is rough. I have been there. God speed.


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## Marduk

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> Well today she said she wants to sit down and talk about divorce this weekend..


Ensure you sit down this weekend. Actually set a time and a place for it. Sit down, and give her the space to talk. Just listen. Nod occasionally to let her know that you're listening. Don't interrupt until she makes some kind of final statement or starts to circle on the same stuff over and over. Maybe make notes.

I give 2/3 odds it's more bluff and bluster. For what reason, who knows. If so, ask her what she's really trying to achieve by continually threatening divorce, but not actually discussing what the problem is.

In case she's serious, ask her two questions:

1. Why?

2. What's her plan?

In either case, if she tried to end the conversation without answering those things, I'd probably tell her that while she can end the conversation any time she wants, that doesn't mean you have to tolerate it.


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## Rob_1

So far you've been so reactive instead of proactive. If you continue this way she's going to chew you up, and spit you out in the divorce. 

You must be proactive now. Lawyer up and be knowledgeable for when you sit down to talk divorce. If you haven't, today buy a recorder and carry it with you at all times and make sure is on when you are anywhere near her. You must do this for your own protection in the even of her filling a bogus domestic abuse charge against you to get you out of the house. Don't think for a moment that she's not capable because you might sooner or later be very sorry.

Don't leave the house, so far you've been the primary parent, if you leave you might be taken for a ride with abandonment, and loose any chance to primary custody, if that's what you want.

Do the 180 now, your marriage has been toasted for awhile but, you have refused to accept it.
Time to grab your balls, and man up for what's coming your way. Start listening to what people are telling you. Use any advice that you think will help you, discard the rest.


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## Mr.Married

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> Well today she said she wants to sit down and talk about divorce this weekend..
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk


Take command of the situation .... there is no time like now. 

This discussion should take less than 20 min.

This is a "state your position" discussion ...... NOT .... "I need you to want me."

Keep your mouth closed ...let her talk......and make sure you do listen. Really.....listen.

Read @Marduk post again. 

This is a PLAN ..... not a circle the toilet bowl over and over.


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## HotAirBaloon14

Rob_1 said:


> So far you've been so reactive instead of proactive. If you continue this way she's going to chew you up, and spit you out in the divorce.
> 
> You must be proactive now. Lawyer up and be knowledgeable for when you sit down to talk divorce. If you haven't, today buy a recorder and carry it with you at all times and make sure is on when you are anywhere near her. You must do this for your own protection in the even of her filling a bogus domestic abuse charge against you to get you out of the house. Don't think for a moment that she's not capable because you might sooner or later be very sorry.
> 
> Don't leave the house, so far you've been the primary parent, if you leave you might be taken for a ride with abandonment, and loose any chance to primary custody, if that's what you want.
> 
> Do the 180 now, your marriage has been toasted for awhile but, you have refused to accept it.
> Time to grab your balls, and man up for what's coming your way. Start listening to what people are telling you. Use any advice that you think will help you, discard the rest.


I have consulted a lawyer and plan to retain her if needed. 



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## Prodigal

HotAirBaloon14 said:


> Well today she said she wants to sit down and talk about divorce this weekend.


I know I come across as a hard-ass, but I'm really sorry to hear this. Sounds to me like you're a good guy. Please keep us posted and let us know what reason(s) she gives for wanting a divorce. I'll be most interested to know if she actually follows through.


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## HotAirBaloon14

I have been avoiding saying the following to avoid trying to sound like I am blaming her for everything. She started a new job the beginning of the summer. It was her first 8-5, 5 days a week job, she is a nurse, and she hates the hours. She left a flight nurse job that was bad but still wants to fly. I encouraged her to find another but she is stuck in this job for a couple more months. It was suppose to be a great job, but only thing great about it is pay. Her grandfather, who she was very close with, passed away at the end of the summer with her by his side. Then our son started school and a few activities that take up a couple evenings a week. She was coming home every evening just to say hi and watch us leave. I know her stress from all this only brought out and multiplied her feelings towards me. 

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