# Ladies, what did you stop doing when you emotionally checked out?



## JohnnyTheRomantic

it is a deep personal choice to emotionally 'check out' of the marriage and entirely a personal one with many different dynamics. What my questions is, is after you made the choice what behaviours changed towards you H?


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## toxxik

My check out was completely sexually related. Quick background-while pregnant I had no drive to the point of discomfort. DH said he was fine holding off but after the pregnancy threw it in my face one night the he had been "handling matters himself" when prior to marriage we had mutually agreed that is what each other was for. The moment those words came out of him mouth I was done unless it was completely my idea. It has only been on the last few months that I let him know how devasted and hurt I was by this. Apparently I was more damaged by this than I ever knew because the change in myself since talking about this has been drastic, just wish I would have said something sooner
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hortensia

Sex. Cooking, cleaning, spending time together. Saying "I love you", unless briefly replying to it with a lifeless "yeah, me too.."


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## indiecat

Can't spontaneously hug him or cuddle up to him.
I see that he has to point out every little thing he does around the house and I do thank him, but it's forced. 
I don't initiate sex because he acts like he's doing me a favor.


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## SaltInWound

I stopped arguing. Responded with a lot of "I don't know".


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## ScarletBegonias

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> it is a deep personal choice to emotionally 'check out' of the marriage and entirely a personal one with many different dynamics. What my questions is, is after you made the choice what behaviours changed towards you H?


I stopped asking if he was going to be home in time for dinner.I'd just make it,eat,and put it away if he wasn't home.
No more questions about where he was or what he was doing either.I didn't care anymore.
if he said he was going to be late,I simply said ok rather than complaining about it or asking why.
I stopped sending I love you texts
Rather than waiting for him to arrive and spend time with me,I'd leave to do my own thing...even if it meant I didn't get home in time to see him before he was off doing the next activity he had planned.


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## Cosmos

I treated him like any other human being I wasn't connected to, apart from the cold disdain I felt for him (I couldn't keep that under wraps). What he thought or said ceased to matter to me, and I stopped sharing my thoughts and feelings with him. I focused on my son and myself and started making a practical exit plan.

(Edited to add: This was after 6 years of me trying to work on the marriage (counseling etc) whilst he lied to me about what his real 'issues' were. I didn't 'check out' lightly.)


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## northernlights

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> it is a deep personal choice to emotionally 'check out' of the marriage and entirely a personal one with many different dynamics. What my questions is, is after you made the choice what behaviours changed towards you H?


I disagree that it was a choice. I did not want to check out, and I fought it as hard as I could. It happened anyway. 

As far as the behaviors, exactly what everyone else wrote. No impulse to grab for his hand, steal a snuggle, initiate sex, or say I love you.


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## EnjoliWoman

I gave no affection, no kissing, no ILYs. Sex was functional. I did obligatory things around the house. I stopped telling my side of anything when he argued with me because I knew he was 'always right' and it was futile. I smoked a lot of pot to numb myself - not good.


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## AgentD

Well for me, I lived with an alcoholic, and one who also has a mood disorder. Of course that was just recently diagnosed, and he has been in AA recovery for 5 years and done well. 

For me, my emotions are tied to the physical part. So if the emotional side has been damaged chances are so has the physical side. Meaning, I pulled away sexually. I no longer felt close to someone who wanted to put their behavior off on me. I also got to the point to where I didn't care that much anymore. The arguments, and disconnection had taken a toll on me and I just kinda checked out. I still did what I needed to for my family, especially my kids, but with him, it was kinda like just going through the motions. I couldn't help it. We are in counseling and hoping things will improve.


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## bailingout

I didn't make the "choice" to check out, it just progressed over time as a result of being in an unhealthy relationship with someone who doesn't think it's unhealthy. 

As for actions, same as most of the others. No desire for sex, to communicate (other than necessities), didn't care if he was here or not or where he went or when he'd be back.

Stopped reacting or trying to resolve issues or give my opinion on things because it was just waste of time and energy. 

Just live life doing what I need to do for me and D. If he's around or not, really doesn't make a difference to me.

I meet most of my needs myself, and between friends and our D, most of the rest are also met regularly.

Surprisingly, I've been happier the last few months than I'd been in many years. As far as him, as someone else said "just going through the motions."


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## Jellybeans

1. Stopped contacting him as much on the phone
2. Stopped doing little things for him
3. Stopped asking him to go places/events with me (since he never wanted to go anyway)
4. Stopped being emotionally vulnerable w/ him
5. Definitely not sexually attracted to him
6. Stopped trying to have a serious conversation
7. Stopped taking him serious
8. Stopped having respect for him
9. Started to resent him
10. Stopped trying to make it work


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## Jellybeans

SaltInWound said:


> I stopped arguing. Responded with a lot of "I don't know".


O
M
G


Yessssssssssss!

When a woman does this, demonstrates indifference, it's prety much over. 

*The opposite of love is indifference. *


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## Jellybeans

ScarletBegonias said:


> I stopped asking if he was going to be home in time for dinner.I'd just make it,eat,and put it away if he wasn't home.
> No more questions about where he was or what he was doing either.*I didn't care anymore.*
> if he said he was going to be late,I simply said ok rather than complaining about it or asking why.





Cosmos said:


> I treated him *like any other human being* I wasn't connected to, apart from the cold disdain I felt for him (I couldn't keep that under wraps). What he thought or said *ceased to matter to me*, and I stopped sharing my thoughts and feelings with him. I focused on my son and myself and started making a practical exit plan.





EnjoliWoman said:


> I gave no affection, no kissing, no ILYs. Sex was functional. I did obligatory things around the house. * I stopped telling my side of anything when he argued with me because I knew he was 'always right' and it was futile.*





AgentD said:


> For me, my emotions are tied to the physical part. So* if the emotional side has been damaged chances are so has the physical sid*e. Meaning, I pulled away sexually. I no longer felt close to someone who wanted to put their behavior off on me. *I also got to the point to where I didn't care that much anymore.* The arguments, and disconnection had taken a toll on me and I just kinda checked out.





bailingout said:


> As for actions, same as most of the others. No desire for sex, to communicate (other than necessities), *didn't care *if he was here or not or where he went or when he'd be back.
> 
> *Stopped reacting or trying to resolve issues or give my opinion on things because it was just waste of time and energy. *
> 
> Just live life doing what I need to do for me and D. If he's around or not, *really doesn't make a difference to me.*


Notice the trend?

When women become indifferent = they're done


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## bailingout

:smthumbup: Jellybean.

So thoughtful of you to tie so many of us together like that.

To the OP, does that help?


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## Jellybeans

Poem I just found online.

The last line is exactly it:

When a Woman Stops Caring — Mirma V. | My HEBC


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## TCSRedhead

I stopped talking to him about anything other than logistics of what was happening around the house. Even that communication was minimal.

I stopped making dinner unless there was other reason (kids).

I stopped initiating sex. 

I stopped spending time with him at all.

I stopped touching him.

I stopped texting/calling him to let him know I was thinking of him.

I stopped inviting him to anything I was doing.


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## trey69

One thing I seemed to notice in the ladies responses was, just about all of them said they stopped or cut back on sex. I'm sure thats because most women relate emotional needs/wants with physical needs/wants. I have to wonder, if some of the posts put up by men who are not getting their sexual needs met by their wives, if this is why? Maybe their wives have tried to tell them and they are not listening? I do wonder if their husbands are a big part of the problem for why they are not getting sex? The women have checked out due how their husbands are making them feel.


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## Thor

My wife (secretly) stopped wearing her wedding rings. There is a long list of new things she started doing, also secretly.


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## Jellybeans

trey69 said:


> One thing I seemed to notice in the ladies responses was, just about all of them said they stopped or cut back on sex. I'm sure thats because most women relate emotional needs/wants with physical needs/wants.


Bingo


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## bailingout

Good observation Trey. You pretty much hit the nail on the head. EXCEPT that men don't "make us feel" this way. You cannot make another person feel the way they do, but many men don't acknowledge/validate/consider "how" we feel, and over time, well we detach. 

Thor- yep that's another sign.


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## silentghost

I can relate to all the posts on here....now I don't feel so alone.
My husbands lack of affection and intimacy, coupled with communication problems with his 'me being right is more important the our relationship' attitude..... drove the nails home. He likes when I initiate romance or compliment him but it will not get reciprocated in any way or form. So, I just don't do it anymore.
I find my life is much more peaceful once I learned to keep my emotions, feelings, and opinions to myself.


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## trey69

bailingout said:


> Good observation Trey. You pretty much hit the nail on the head. EXCEPT that men don't "make us feel" this way. You cannot make another person feel the way they do, but many men don't acknowledge/validate/consider "how" we feel, and over time, well we detach.
> 
> Thor- yep that's another sign.


True, but a lot of posts I have seen are based on people whose behaviors such as drinking, drugs gambling, porn, or some mental disorders can 100% effect another persons feelings and well being. If I was so effected by another persons destructive behavior I would pull away emotionally/physically as well. In fact with my first wife that is what I did, then when I had finally had enough, I filed for divorce.


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## JohnnyTheRomantic

This does help. It provides perspective and as one person pointed out maybe that is why there are sexless marriages. The other common theme with most is the silent agreement with personal choice, while others state they were 'pushed there'.

I definitely get the emotional to physical connection and the need to be emotionally satisfied to get to the physical side.


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## turnera

trey69 said:


> One thing I seemed to notice in the ladies responses was, just about all of them said they stopped or cut back on sex. I'm sure thats because most women relate emotional needs/wants with physical needs/wants. I have to wonder, if some of the posts put up by men who are not getting their sexual needs met by their wives, if this is why? Maybe their wives have tried to tell them and they are not listening? I do wonder if their husbands are a big part of the problem for why they are not getting sex? The women have checked out due how their husbands are making them feel.


 This is pretty universal. I didn't stop having it, out of fear of his reaction, but I sure as hell never want it again and I would NEVER initiate out of desire. Only duty.


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## northernlights

bailingout said:


> EXCEPT that men don't "make us feel" this way. You cannot make another person feel the way they do,


I dunno. I understand that we're generally supposed to own our feelings and take responsibility for them, but I disagree that other people can't make us feel a certain way. There's something that's just magic about love, and when it happens, it sometimes happens even if you don't want it to or aren't trying. In the same vein, sometimes it goes, no matter how hard you're fighting for it. Maybe we're supposed to ideally love in a vacuum, but that's not real life, is it? If someone treats me badly, they make me feel bad. We could replace the "make" in that previous sentence with "the result is that," but isn't that just semantics?


As for the posters who didn't take issue with the "choose to check out" wording, I'm curious if they just didn't address it because it wasn't part of the question, or if some really feel like they consciously chose checking out. The latter would surprise me. Why would anyone choose misery?


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## just got it 55

trey69 said:


> One thing I seemed to notice in the ladies responses was, just about all of them said they stopped or cut back on sex. I'm sure thats because most women relate emotional needs/wants with physical needs/wants. I have to wonder, if some of the posts put up by men who are not getting their sexual needs met by their wives, if this is why? Maybe their wives have tried to tell them and they are not listening? I do wonder if their husbands are a big part of the problem for why they are not getting sex? The women have checked out due how their husbands are making them feel.


This is why I question the HD/LD debate


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## deejov

trey69 said:


> One thing I seemed to notice in the ladies responses was, just about all of them said they stopped or cut back on sex. I'm sure thats because most women relate emotional needs/wants with physical needs/wants. I have to wonder, if some of the posts put up by men who are not getting their sexual needs met by their wives, if this is why? Maybe their wives have tried to tell them and they are not listening? I do wonder if their husbands are a big part of the problem for why they are not getting sex? The women have checked out due how their husbands are making them feel.


How ironic... I can remember a few heated posts over the past year and a half. All men denied this. They SWORE there was "no reason" and she was just cold, mean, and psycho. 

Actually, this still happens. Yesterday, for example. She's moody.


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## Red Sonja

trey69 said:


> I have to wonder, if some of the posts put up by men who are not getting their sexual needs met by their wives, if this is why?


I am a wife whose husband “shut off” sex in year 3 of a 26 year marriage; this is *part *of what started my detachment process. Makes a woman feel like she’s Quasimodo.

Anyhow, to answer the original question … I started seriously detaching from my H after our child left for college, for my own mental/emotional health:

1. I stopped all of my previous activities that catered to his personal comfort … keeping his personal toiletries stocked, making him drinks and appetizers after work, offers of assistance, etc. (too many to list, but you get the idea).

2. I stopped engaging him in anything … sex or other physical contact, conversation, inquiry into his well-being, nothing, nada, zip. However, if he engages me or asks for assistance I will participate.


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## JustSomeGuyWho

trey69 said:


> One thing I seemed to notice in the ladies responses was, just about all of them said they stopped or cut back on sex. I'm sure thats because most women relate emotional needs/wants with physical needs/wants. I have to wonder, if some of the posts put up by men who are not getting their sexual needs met by their wives, if this is why? Maybe their wives have tried to tell them and they are not listening? I do wonder if their husbands are a big part of the problem for why they are not getting sex? The women have checked out due how their husbands are making them feel.


I thought about this too as I was reading this. My wife is probably checked out and that is why I can't get her to respond to any attempt to fix our marriage. She seems perfectly content living this way though. Doesn't matter ... I have given myself a timeline to repair this and I'll keep to it. 

As far as sex goes though, it's never been something she's been terribly interested in. Based on these responses, I would guess she checked out after I separated from her. We reconciled but it was only after the separation that most of these things started happening. Sex was nonexistent long before separation ... what is missing after the separation is affection.

Still don't regret separating. Even if we end up divorced, the positives that came out of that far outweigh the negatives.


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## JustSomeGuyWho

I guess the follow-up question to this is ... once you've checked out have you ever checked back in again ... or are you always done for good?


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## JustSomeGuyWho

trey69 said:


> One thing I seemed to notice in the ladies responses was, just about all of them said they stopped or cut back on sex. I'm sure thats because most women relate emotional needs/wants with physical needs/wants. I have to wonder, if some of the posts put up by men who are not getting their sexual needs met by their wives, if this is why? Maybe their wives have tried to tell them and they are not listening? I do wonder if their husbands are a big part of the problem for why they are not getting sex? The women have checked out due how their husbands are making them feel.


I think that is quite possibly true in a lot of cases. I have often wondered that about my own situation. Then again when you have hormones in play, perhaps some psychological things going on (childhood sexual trauma), etc. it isn't that black and white. You can't always lay it at the feet of the spouse. There are women here who are at the end of their rope because of men who are seemingly uninterested in sex. You have HD women on here who admit to being LD for much of their adulthood until their hormones kick in and they are suddenly HD. Trust me when I say that even if some men don't admit it, if they are in a sexless marriage, they are beating themselves up over what they aren't doing right. It is emasculating. If you've never had that problem then it is easy to point at the husband and say ... well, this guy is the one to blame. Oftentimes that's not true and sometimes it is. I think there is a greater possibility that there are problems in the marriage that caused the issue if at one time you had a very satisfactory sexual relationship and it has since become sexless.


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## diwali123

In my situation my ex was a complete mess, multiple mental illnesses, passive aggressive, liar, irresponsible, didn't give a damn about me or our daughter.
So I stopped listening to his stupid stories, his plans for the yard, his opinions about politics and would just say "uh huh". When he worked himself up into a tantrum and a huge fight and I refused to let him pull me into his emotional fit, I wouldn't try to make up to him, apologize or comfort him. 
When he gave me the silent treatment I just ignored him back instead of trying to smooth things over.
I stopped saying ILY
He acted like such a jerk with my family I just stopped asking him to go with me and started planning holidays apart.
I just stopped expecting gifts or surprises and did the bare minimum I had to for him on birthdays or father's day. 
When he came up to me and grabbed my boob I just ignored him. 
Stopped doing things he liked in bed that I didn't like.
Fantasized about people during sex.
When he wanted to show me the stupid youtube video of the day that his dumb friends sent him I refused to watch it. 
Basically I refused to do anything that I didn't feel like doing, after years of him not doing anything he didn't want to do.


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## TCSRedhead

JustSomeGuyWho said:


> I guess the follow-up question to this is ... once you've checked out have you ever checked back in again ... or are you always done for good?


I nearly destroyed my marriage before checking back in. That said, I can honestly say we are stronger than ever. Neither of us will accept going back to the way it was.


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## diwali123

Once I was done, I was done. My story is quite extreme. After the second time the cops came out because he threatened suicide because we got into a fight and I wanted to leave the house for a while....
I officially decided we were getting a D. But I had to take my time.


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## 3Xnocharm

trey69 said:


> One thing I seemed to notice in the ladies responses was, just about all of them said they stopped or cut back on sex. I'm sure thats because most women relate emotional needs/wants with physical needs/wants. I have to wonder, if some of the posts put up by men who are not getting their sexual needs met by their wives, if this is why? Maybe their wives have tried to tell them and they are not listening? I do wonder if their husbands are a big part of the problem for why they are not getting sex? The women have checked out due how their husbands are making them feel.


I am so happy to read that you caught onto this. I have stated this in posts before in various threads, that I came to the realization that most of my sex drive is mental. Being ignored, criticized, and dealing with his negativity and anger eventually led to me not wanting to have sex. And it happened gradually, I didnt even realize it was happening. I wasnt understanding even myself what was going on with my drive. I finally realized what was up after I was DONE, left him, and got involved with someone else. Suddenly, I found myself WANTING to have sex. It was quite a revelation. This is describing my second marriage. My FIRST marriage, things were so awful sex-wise that I had come to the CONSCIOUS decision that I was never having sex with him again. 

I am thinking this should be a sticky in the SIM forum! :smthumbup:


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## 3Xnocharm

JustSomeGuyWho said:


> I guess the follow-up question to this is ... once you've checked out have you ever checked back in again ... or are you always done for good?


NOPE. Once I am done, I AM DONE. There is no amount of begging, pleading, crying, or promises that could be made that would make me stay. Too little, too late. By the time I am done, I have been through the emotional wringer trying to keep peace, trying to be nice, trying to explain what I need from him only to be ignored, sinking further and further into my shell because the man who once loved me has put me lower than sh!t he scrapes off his shoe.


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## Flygirl

It wasn't a conscious decision to withdrawl. I was just trying to cope and not fall apart. I found myself avoiding his calls. Annoyed when I had to talk to him on the phone. Stopped asking him to go places with me. Stopped including him in my plans. Very impatient with him. If I had to repeat myself, I would end up just saying never mind. I stopped sharing the details of my day or any gossip. I felt relieved if he wasn't home when I got home. I stopped caring what time he came home. Stopped complaining that he was never home. I didn't care if he was mad at me. I didn't care enough to argue about anything. At one point I actually told him to get a girlfriend.


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## Michie

If there is something no one seems to understand is that 'checking out' is not a choice. It is a *defense mechanism*.

If the essential needs are not being meet in a marriage 
(no one is going to fufill all your needs, unrealistic to believe that any man/woman is capable of that) a woman left with wallowing in the sadness or detach not really a choice...Detachment is subtle is happens slowly there is no switch on/off...think of it as mother nature's way of saving or salvaging our self respect and dignity. If spouse took 10 mins out of his own head they would see if from miles away. But no they see the result of the disease...

_Hey....why ain't I getting laid._

Then spouse switches into fix it man mode. MUST FIX. sometimes the damage is done IE woman finds it hard to reattach to the deep bonds and trust that were broken for the fear that it will happen again which is just another cycle of rejection and neglect to her.


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## techmom

Michie said:


> If there is something no one seems to understand is that 'checking out' is not a choice. It is a *defense mechanism*.
> 
> If the essential needs are not being meet in a marriage
> (no one is going to fufill all your needs, unrealistic to believe that any man/woman is capable of that) a woman left with wallowing in the sadness or detach not really a choice...Detachment is subtle is happens slowly there is no switch on/off...think of it as mother nature's way of saving or salvaging our self respect and dignity. If spouse took 10 mins out of his own head they would see if from miles away. But no they see the result of the disease...
> 
> _Hey....why ain't I getting laid._
> 
> Then spouse switches into fix it man mode. MUST FIX. sometimes the damage is done IE woman finds it hard to reattach to the deep bonds and trust that were broken for the fear that it will happen again which is just another cycle of rejection and neglect to her.


Yep, most men only notice a problem when they start getting rejected. Despite years of telling him what is wrong and what you need to fix it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## diwali123

3Xnocharm said:


> NOPE. Once I am done, I AM DONE. There is no amount of begging, pleading, crying, or promises that could be made that would make me stay. Too little, too late. By the time I am done, I have been through the emotional wringer trying to keep peace, trying to be nice, trying to explain what I need from him only to be ignored, sinking further and further into my shell because the man who once loved me has put me lower than sh!t he scrapes off his shoe.


Were we married to the same guy?


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## Michie

3Xnocharm said:


> NOPE. Once I am done, I AM DONE. There is no amount of begging, pleading, crying, or promises that could be made that would make me stay. Too little, too late. By the time I am done, I have been through the emotional wringer trying to keep peace, trying to be nice, trying to explain what I need from him only to be ignored, sinking further and further into my shell because the man who once loved me has put me lower than sh!t he scrapes off his shoe.


Preach! Preach! I'm having a southren bapist revival moment lmao


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## JohnnyTheRomantic

The themes seem to have evolved to checking out as a self defense mechanism after attempting communication.

I am wondering how many women sat their husband down and the W expressed their feelings to their H. I get there are examples of 'trying to have the feelings' conversation. As a 'more sensitive man' i want to talk about my feelings. Knowing there are alot of men that dont, men wouldnt know that THIS talk about feelings is the start of a downhill slide and the general acceleration of resentment.

I wonder what would happen if the warning sign was a big red captain obvious flare. so obvious that the H (or W) cant miss or ignore it unless by choice.

Am i making too many assumptions here ?


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## diwali123

techmom said:


> Yep, most men only notice a problem when they start getting rejected. Despite years of telling him what is wrong and what you need to fix it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Mine didn't try to change until I made him decide whether he was leaving or I was. And it was too late. I still tried for the sake of my daughter but he just lied and pretended until I took him back but his attitude towards me and behavior was the same.


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## bailingout

JustSomeGuyWho said:


> I guess the follow-up question to this is ... once you've checked out have you ever checked back in again ... or are you always done for good?


This one is tough, in past relationships when I "checked out" the relationships ended, but they didn't end because I checked out, they ended because something was missing.

In this one, I wish I had a crystal ball. 

I am somewhat relieved that someone posted they had "checked out" and were able to "check back in", but I wonder if those who did changed THEMSELVES or did their spouses changes meet their needs that enabled them to "check back in"? 

I know of 1 wife IRL who "checked out" and was able to "check back in" but it was because SHE changed HERSELF in order to save the marriage. In her case, her H eventually got on the "to be healthy" train and it worked out for both of them.

Kind of ironic isn't it....in my friends case, "the checked out wife was the one who saved the marriage".


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## Thor

JustSomeGuyWho said:


> I guess the follow-up question to this is ... once you've checked out have you ever checked back in again ... or are you always done for good?


My wife checked out completely. Stopped wearing her rings, decided the marriage was over but she would keep it on minimal life support for another 6 yrs until the youngest was out of the house. New clothes, new hair, new personal trainer. You get the picture.

She is now seemingly all the way back into the marriage.

What changed it? Two conversations. The first was telling her we had to either fix or end the marriage. A few months later I had to draw some very clear boundaries with the very explicit consequence of divorce.

Her transformation was not instantaneous, and in fact things got worse for a few months after the second conversation. But I think she looked over the edge of the abyss and scared herself ****less, and decided I am not the enemy after all.

Us? I don't think we're gonna make it. Too much bad history between us. But that is a different story other than the lesson of being sure of what you really want, because you might get it.


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## bailingout

TCSRedhead said:


> I nearly destroyed my marriage before checking back in. That said, I can honestly say we are stronger than ever. Neither of us will accept going back to the way it was.


Am curious as to when you marriage was almost destroyed, did you change first or did he?


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## diwali123

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> The themes seem to have evolved to checking out as a self defense mechanism after attempting communication.
> 
> I am wondering how many women sat their husband down and the W expressed their feelings to their H. I get there are examples of 'trying to have the feelings' conversation. As a 'more sensitive man' i want to talk about my feelings. Knowing there are alot of men that dont, men wouldnt know that THIS talk about feelings is the start of a downhill slide and the general acceleration of resentment.
> 
> I wonder what would happen if the warning sign was a big red captain obvious flare. so obvious that the H (or W) cant miss or ignore it unless by choice.
> 
> Am i making too many assumptions here ?


Are you talking about my situation? I would think it was obvious but if not I can explain.


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## lifeistooshort

When I checked out I was done, and nothing was going to change that. Sure when I filed for divorce my ex wanted to go to counseling, but the reality was that he didn't give a sh$t about me. He was concerned about his own rear end; I begged him for years to go to counseling, told him I was miserable, that what we had wasn't a marriage, but all I got was that it was my problem. Basically that he was going to do him and i could get bent, but it turned out that he really only felt like that because he didn't think I would leave. Guess what jerk? You're going to do you? Fine, then I'll do me. Never looked back.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jellybeans

JustSomeGuyWho said:


> I guess the follow-up question to this is ... once you've checked out have you ever checked back in again ... or are you always done for good?


Usually when I'm done, I'm done. When I stop trying it is VERY hard for me to get back to a place where I even want to attempt that because I've been trying for so long and getting the same result. The definition of insanity is...



Michie said:


> If there is something no one seems to understand is that 'checking out' is not a choice. It is a *defense mechanism*.


:iagree:




JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> I am wondering how many women sat their husband down and the W expressed their feelings to their H.
> 
> I wonder what would happen if the warning sign was a big red captain obvious flare. so obvious that the H (or W) cant miss or ignore it unless by choice.


My situation: I had been asking my exH to do marraige counselling with me for about a year or more and he flat out refused. I told him repeatedly that something was wrong in our relationship and I felt like he did not respect me. He would tell me there was no point in talking about it, that he didn't care and that "I am going to do whatever I want. Your opinion does not matter to me." Note, I am not without flaws and don't paint myself as a saint. With that said, I tried and would cry myself to sleep at night only to be met with anger and silent treatments that would last for weeks at a time sometimes. I left. During our separation he told me that he would always have to live with the fact and regret that he did not try everything he could to save our marriage. Now, I did not take marriage lightly. I thought it was a forever thing. But it takes two. And I am glad i do not have to have that on my conscience, the not trying. Because I did. I did to the point where it was emotionally exhausting until one day I put my hands up and said "I'm done." You should ave seen the look on his face. I was tired. Sooo very tired.


----------



## Jellybeans

lifeistooshort said:


> When I checked out I was done, and nothing was going to change that. Sure when I filed for divorce my ex wanted to go to counseling, but the reality was that he didn't give a sh$t about me. He was concerned about his own rear end; I begged him for years to go to counseling, told him I was miserable, that what we had wasn't a marriage, but all I got was that it was my problem. Basically that he was going to do him and i could get bent, but it turned out that he really only felt like that because he didn't think I would leave.


I think we were married to the same man.

The lesson: Be very concerned about the woman who stops caring.


----------



## diwali123

I think a lot of people get married secretly believing that marriage gives them the right to do whatever they want, whenever they want. They think their spouse is too weak to leave or that they should be so madly in love that nothing they do will change it and they should just be lucky they married such an awesome person.


----------



## EnjoliWoman

I gave him three years from the first time I stood up and said I was done. He would make a tiny improvement then back to normal. I tried to point out in the moment it was happening so he understood exactly what words and actions were killing any love there had been.

Checking out was gradual over 3 years - I gradually stopped trying to instill change since it just wasn't happening and grew more and more distant. Then I ordered a book to help me understand, opened a separate account, consulted an attorney with funds from that account. By that time I was done, it was just a timing thing.


----------



## turnera

Flygirl said:


> It wasn't a conscious decision to withdrawl. I was just trying to cope and not fall apart. I found myself avoiding his calls. Annoyed when I had to talk to him on the phone. Stopped asking him to go places with me. Stopped including him in my plans. Very impatient with him. If I had to repeat myself, I would end up just saying never mind. I stopped sharing the details of my day or any gossip. I felt relieved if he wasn't home when I got home. I stopped caring what time he came home. Stopped complaining that he was never home. I didn't care if he was mad at me. I didn't care enough to argue about anything. At one point I actually told him to get a girlfriend.


 Add: Dreaded coming home and looked forward to leaving for work.


----------



## turnera

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> I am wondering how many women sat their husband down and the W expressed their feelings to their H.


Well, in my case, my H has witnessed, from me, a couple suicide close calls, multiple MC sessions in which I say I'd rather be dead than keep living with him, and many many cold shoulders and arguments. And he still can't even do the simplest thing MC or I asked for, like just listing 5 positive things a day or speaking to his boss about his missing commissions check. I'd say he's heard more than enough to know I'm serious. The only thing I haven't done is shut down the bedroom, so I guess that's coming next.


----------



## turnera

lifeistooshort said:


> When I checked out I was done, and nothing was going to change that. Sure when I filed for divorce my ex wanted to go to counseling, but the reality was that he didn't give a sh$t about me. He was concerned about his own rear end; I begged him for years to go to counseling, told him I was miserable, that what we had wasn't a marriage, but all I got was that it was my problem. Basically that he was going to do him and i could get bent, but it turned out that he really only felt like that because he didn't think I would leave. Guess what jerk? You're going to do you? Fine, then I'll do me. Never looked back.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I asked mine to go for 20 years. He refused. It was only when I said I was getting ready to move out that he 'immediately' agreed to MC and said he would have done so if I'd ever asked. *sigh*


----------



## VermisciousKnid

techmom said:


> Yep, most men only notice a problem when they start getting rejected. Despite years of telling him what is wrong and what you need to fix it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


There's also Chicken Little syndrome, or call it Boy Who Cried Wolf syndrome if you like. The spouse who is sure that the depth and source of discontent is so clear is often one who blitzes the partner with complaints about trivial and non-trivial things alike. The partner concludes that the spouse is just an unhappy person in general because every issue gets the same angry treatment. 

In my line of work I have customers who rate all of their issues as the highest priority. I tell them that if everything is high priority then *nothing* is high priority. They have to decide what's really important and say so. They have to let less important things go. You can't have everything. I can't have everything. We can both name our critical things.


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## Jellybeans

turnera said:


> Add: Dreaded coming home and looked forward to leaving for work.


Me, too! I would do anything to stay later at work, hit the gym, run errands in order to stall getting home. Home was a source of unhappiness for me.


----------



## KimatraAKM

I stopped caring if he as happy. Really cut back on the lil things. He never cared if I was so why be the only one trying?

I stopped asking for sex... Because he always said no or made me feel like I had the plague. So I started waiting for him to initiate.

I had children.. Because I had stopped loving him as much as I had and didn't want to get hurt by him again I replaced him. I love my children alot more than my husband.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lifeistooshort

Jellybeans said:


> I think we were married to the same man.
> 
> The lesson: Be very concerned about the woman who stops caring.



Ha ha, quite possible. I was wife number two, were your wife number one? Because if you were you should know that he had no part in anything and we're both b$tches.

Lesson number 2: When your wife begs you for years to go to counseling and you blow her off, then decide when she's done with you that your really want to "fix" things, know that your efforts will probably be perceived as self serving and will ultimately be unsuccessful.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## TCSRedhead

bailingout said:


> Am curious as to when you marriage was almost destroyed, did you change first or did he?


I would say that I changed first. I hurt him pretty severely with an EA and then stated I wanted a divorce. It took the course of nearly two years to get where we are now and to build up the communication pieces.


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## Jellybeans

lifeistooshort said:


> Ha ha, quite possible. I was wife number two, were your wife number one? Because if you were you should know that he had no part in anything and we're both b$tches.


Lol. In fact, I was wife #1.


----------



## AgentD

trey69 said:


> One thing I seemed to notice in the ladies responses was, just about all of them said they stopped or cut back on sex. I'm sure thats because most women relate emotional needs/wants with physical needs/wants. I have to wonder, if some of the posts put up by men who are not getting their sexual needs met by their wives, if this is why? Maybe their wives have tried to tell them and they are not listening? I do wonder if their husbands are a big part of the problem for why they are not getting sex? The women have checked out due how their husbands are making them feel.


:iagree:

Yep, my husband had been told for years this was the issue, but when he was made aware he had a hand in what was going on with me, he acted like he just didn't get it. According to my counselor, they feel he does get it, he just doesn't want to acknowledge it, because knowing he caused me pain fuels him with guilt, but yet not enough to change anything, so yet he still wonders, why am I not getting sex like I want? Really? :slap::wtf:


----------



## techmom

VermisciousKnid said:


> There's also Chicken Little syndrome, or call it Boy Who Cried Wolf syndrome if you like. The spouse who is sure that the depth and source of discontent is so clear is often one who blitzes the partner with complaints about trivial and non-trivial things alike. The partner concludes that the spouse is just an unhappy person in general because every issue gets the same angry treatment.
> 
> In my line of work I have customers who rate all of their issues as the highest priority. I tell them that if everything is high priority then *nothing* is high priority. They have to decide what's really important and say so. They have to let less important things go. You can't have everything. I can't have everything. We can both name our critical things.


So you're saying that the issues are trivial? If they matter to one spouse they should matter to both. Disconnecting is done as a result of feeling ignored, then we tune out and men would wonder what is wrong only when the sex decreases. Then he will complain becuase of lack of sex, which is not the real issue. The real issue is feeling like you are listened to and are feeling ignored.

Customer service example would not be fair here, marriage is not a business.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## VermisciousKnid

techmom said:


> So you're saying that the issues are trivial? If they matter to one spouse they should matter to both. Disconnecting is done as a result of feeling ignored, then we tune out and men would wonder what is wrong only when the sex decreases. Then he will complain becuase of lack of sex, which is not the real issue. The real issue is feeling like you are listened to and are feeling ignored.
> 
> Customer service example would not be fair here, marriage is not a business.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Trivial would be "you left a breadcrumb on the counter" or "you forgot to start the dishwasher before leaving for work." In the larger scheme of things these are trivial. That doesn't mean you won't get upset by them. But if you are getting upset by that kind of 'event' then I guarantee that your spouse is reading that to mean one thing while you might think that he's interpreting it your way - that you want out. It's like a 'background noise of discontent" that makes clear communication more difficult. 

It isn't customer service per se, but close enough. The point is that you have to prioritize and communicate. Just saying, "I'm unhappy with the situation" fixes nothing.


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## Michie

If your looking for big red captain obvious sign, suitcases packed is a good one. Here the bit that frosts my cookies.

Spouse is geniunely unhappy, it is clearly evident day to day as spouse has at least witnessed it and can look back with the power of memory when they were happy....i mean have you hear your spouse laugh or made them laugh in the last week or month or longer. have you seen a smile. does your spouse seek your company....i think these are obvious signs


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## JohnnyTheRomantic

Cora28 said:


> I´ve sat my H down and told him. I´ve told him I´m unhappy and I´ve told him why. I´ve told him it´s make or break time. He still doesn´t get it. I´m thinking about trying out my last tactic (telling him I will find someone else if he can´t change) but if I´m honest, I don´t know if I care enough now to fight for our marriage. I need to do some soul searching.
> 
> I accept that our marriage breakdown isn´t all H´s fault. It takes 2 to tango but we´ve let it go on for so long that I´m not sure if the cracks can be healed. We have young children so I feel obliged to ´try´
> 
> Out of interest, what warning sign are you referring to? That either the H or W finds someone else?


the captain obvious flag (warning sign) would be telling your spouse that you will find someone else if they cant change/meet your needs.


----------



## VermisciousKnid

Michie said:


> If your looking for big red captain obvious sign, suitcases packed is a good one. Here the bit that frosts my cookies.
> 
> Spouse is geniunely unhappy, it is clearly evident day to day as spouse has at least witnessed it and can look back with the power of memory when they were happy....i mean have you hear your spouse laugh or made them laugh in the last week or month or longer. have you seen a smile. does your spouse seek your company....i think these are obvious signs


Those are the symptoms. Whose responsibility is it to figure out the actual problem? It has to be the person having the problem. That person has to communicate it clearly. 

Women are just as blind-sided as men when the spouse that they thought was happy or maybe not that unhappy just up and walks away. I don't think the message is ever as clear as we think it is.


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## turnera

Not unless you accompany it with an 'I'm leaving if this doesn't change' statement like I did.


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## bailingout

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> The themes seem to have evolved to checking out as a self defense mechanism after attempting communication.


:iagree:



JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> I am wondering how many women sat their husband down and the W expressed their feelings to their H. I get there are examples of 'trying to have the feelings' conversation. As a 'more sensitive man' i want to talk about my feelings. Knowing there are alot of men that dont, men wouldnt know that THIS talk about feelings is the start of a downhill slide and the general acceleration of resentment.


I told him, he dismissed how I felt. (See the trend here?)

How about we start with teaching our young to VALIDATE other peoples feelings and opinions and accept that just because they are different than ours, it doesn't make them wrong. 

Another suggestion would be to teach our sons that they don't have to "fix" their W's complaints/gripes or whatever, but simply to acknowledge how they feel. (I've read that many men are wired to feel the need to "fix" things.) 

Edited to Add: This comment I made (see above about "fixing") could stop the invalidating trend to begin with, IMO. Maybe if someone felt validated, they wouldn't check out.




JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> I wonder what would happen if the warning sign was a big red captain obvious flare. so obvious that the H (or W) cant miss or ignore it unless by choice..


That would be nice. Preferably before it gets to the current big red obvious flares of EAs, PAs, separation & D.



JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> Am i making too many assumptions here ?


I don't think so. Now if you could just share all of this with the H (or W) of those who have "checked out"- a few marriages might be saved.


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## Jellybeans

Ok, super bizarre. I wrote a post a few minutes ago and it's not on this thread. I did not say anything derogatory or a curse word. What gives? Where'd my post go?!



bailingout said:


> I told him, he dismissed how I felt. (See the trend here?).


Yep! 



bailingout said:


> How about we start with teaching our young to VALIDATE other peoples feelings and opinions and accept that just because they are different than ours, it doesn't make them wrong.



If only!!!


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## pollywog

Stopped sex, made him move to guest room and no arguing from me. I am now trying to be indifferent toward him.


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## TCSRedhead

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> the captain obvious flag (warning sign) would be telling your spouse that you will find someone else if they cant change/meet your needs.


Why find someone else while married? Why not leave/divorce?


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## LifeIsAJourney

I checked out after years of living with a verbally abusive, emotionally volatile husband who self-medicated with pot and alcohol. I begged him to get counseling for years. He refused stating that I was the one who needed help, not him. A year ago I announced that I was ready to walk out the door unless something changed. He quit smoking pot, started counseling (IC) and we started marriage counseling a couple of months ago. 

What is it about seeing a woman's a$$ framed by suitcases that makes men so agreeable? 

So now I'm trying to make this work and get some sort of feeling back for my husband but I'm really not having much luck. I went to my IC today and she told me to "fake it until you make it", just like in AA. Does anyone know if this actually works?


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## bailingout

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> the captain obvious flag (warning sign) would be telling your spouse that you will find someone else if they cant change/meet your needs.





TCSRedhead said:


> Why find someone else while married? Why not leave/divorce?


Johnny----No one should threaten a spouse like that.

One should explain what they need from their spouse, if the spouse refuses/unable to meet the need, then decide if it's acceptable or leave. 

Then figure out why you were attracted to and attracted someone who was unwilling/incapable of meeting your needs to begin with....fix yourself...then find someone more compatible.

JMO


----------



## turnera

LifeIsAJourney said:


> So now I'm trying to make this work and get some sort of feeling back for my husband but I'm really not having much luck. I went to my IC today and she told me to "fake it until you make it", just like in AA. Does anyone know if this actually works?


 Have you read His Needs Her Needs? It's the best thing I know of that may help you achieve that.


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## diwali123

I tried faking it, begged to go to counseling, begged him to read books or get on marriage builders. I printed out the needs quiz and he refused to fill it out because "I already know Im not filling your needs."
I asked him to move into separate rooms and just co parent. He refused and said he couldn't live like that.
I started sleeping in my daughter's room as much as I could. 
Tried going out on dates without baby. He acted like I didn't exist when I spent so much time getting new clothes and new make up. Wouldn't look at me or talk to me. 
At dinner he started a fight and on the first night we had away from our baby we didn't have sex. 
I tried to keep having sex. He would even sabotage that. I told him I needed to feel desired, wanted, not just the closest available hole.
He told me because I didn't have sex with him for four months during end of pregnancy and post partum, (even though I offered HJ and Bjs and was turned down) that his sexuality was **** off and he couldn't turn it back on. 
I told him he needed to take care of his illness...again and again he refused. 
I don't know how much more I could have done. 
I had a one sided EA with a male friend at the end. This guy and I went out for drinks together and he said "oh how cute, you are going on a date" like he couldn't even be bothered to be jealous because how could anyone find me attractive.


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## JohnnyTheRomantic

bailingout said:


> Johnny----No one should threaten a spouse like that.
> 
> One should explain what they need from their spouse, if the spouse refuses/unable to meet the need, then decide if it's acceptable or leave.
> 
> JMO


Completely agree. Using the words 'if you cant meet my needs' or 'change to meet my needs' or i will find someone else is not a positive way to message the finality of the request. Sure. It could be packaged much nicer like "well W/H i have discovered i have emotional need x y z. Here is what i need from you to be in this relationship. If we cant meet each others needs in the relationship, then what are we doing here and maybe there is someone else out there for each of us". you know, whatever presents a nicer message. 

i am actually going through this now, re-defining what my EN are, clearly communicating them to W. W is who she is. If she cant meet my needs after I have clearly defined them, then it becomes a different conversation. Either she doesnt know how (not much weight here as i told her specifically what i need) or choice.


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## turnera

You talk a lot about how she's not meeting your needs. What are you doing to meet hers?


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## TCSRedhead

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> Using the words 'if you cant meet my needs' or 'change to meet my needs' or i will need to file for divorce.


Fixed that for you.


----------



## JohnnyTheRomantic

turnera said:


> You talk a lot about how she's not meeting your needs. What are you doing to meet hers?


Pouring on the romance. Love Notes. Sweet Texts. Nice emails. A gentle touch. Looking into her eyes and saying <something romantic>. Being present while in the same room (no computer/phone/tv/etc.) Bought flowers. And questioning my 'reactions' before jumping to conclusions.

It has made a very big difference. Our communication has changed for the better, that is for sure. (She didnt check out, but based on some of the common signs, it was coming).

Examples:



> I could conquer the world with just one hand as long as you were holding the other.





> i fall in love with you every time i see you


The reality is, i am putting *everything* into this relationship. If it doesnt work out, it will not be from me screwing it up or "not trying hard enough", which also seems to be a common theme. 

I base my decisions on evidence, not conjecture or an over active mind. Coming here has helped me immensely.


----------



## JohnnyTheRomantic

TCSRedhead said:


> Fixed that for you.


Thank you, because that is what I would do.


----------



## LoriC

TCSRedhead said:


> I stopped talking to him about anything other than logistics of what was happening around the house. Even that communication was minimal.
> 
> I stopped making dinner unless there was other reason (kids).
> 
> I stopped initiating sex.
> 
> I stopped spending time with him at all.
> 
> I stopped touching him.
> 
> I stopped texting/calling him to let him know I was thinking of him.
> 
> I stopped inviting him to anything I was doing.


Ditto


----------



## bailingout

Cora28 said:


> I disagree. I´ve told my H what my needs are. No change as yet. I know what attracted me to my H 15 years ago and my emotional needs were being met then and were until about 5 years ago (when kids came along). Why does that mean that I have a problem with the man I chose? The person you marry isn´t necessarily the person they are today. Having kids and other life altering experiences on the way causes ups and downs in any marriage but it doesn´t mean I married the wrong person, does it?


My apologies, I should have specified this to the cases where one discovers their needs were never being met, to avoid making the same mistake. 

In your case, as they were originally met & something changed (kids) is a different scenario but just as frustrating.


----------



## bailingout

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> Pouring on the romance. Love Notes. Sweet Texts. Nice emails. A gentle touch. Looking into her eyes and saying <something romantic>. Being present while in the same room (no computer/phone/tv/etc.) Bought flowers. And questioning my 'reactions' before jumping to conclusions.
> 
> It has made a very big difference. Our communication has changed for the better, that is for sure. (She didnt check out, but based on some of the common signs, it was coming).
> 
> Examples:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The reality is, i am putting *everything* into this relationship. If it doesnt work out, it will not be from me screwing it up or "not trying hard enough", which also seems to be a common theme.
> 
> I base my decisions on evidence, not conjecture or an over active mind. Coming here has helped me immensely.


Glad your romance approach is helping. Don't fall into the trap of wearing romance blinders, keep your eyes open for other possibilities, just in case. 

My H could pull out every romance trick known to man kind and it would have zero effect on me, in fact, I would be repulsed by it. My point in saying this is to warn other men who may read this that not all of the issues can be fixed by romance & for some reason some think/are taught/ or are told that women just need to feel loved. Some women also require validation & respect. JMO

Good luck


----------



## diwali123

Be careful with cookie cutter romance. 
Make it specific to her and genuine.


----------



## JohnnyTheRomantic

diwali123 said:


> Be careful with cookie cutter romance.
> Make it specific to her and genuine.


it is specific to her, no cookie cutter.


----------



## JohnnyTheRomantic

bailingout said:


> Glad your romance approach is helping. Don't fall into the trap of wearing romance blinders, keep your eyes open for other possibilities, just in case.
> 
> My H could pull out every romance trick known to man kind and it would have zero effect on me, in fact, I would be repulsed by it. My point in saying this is to warn other men who may read this that not all of the issues can be fixed by romance & for some reason some think/are taught/ or are told that women just need to feel loved. Some women also require validation & respect. JMO
> 
> Good luck


I would argue that validation and respect have to be there before romance.


----------



## JohnnyTheRomantic

Did you ladies stop calling your H by the pet/friendly names like honey/babe/etc and just use his name?


----------



## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby

I stopped caring. The sex obviously stopped. The cooking stopped and i refused to pick up after him. My ex h was very mean telling me everyday what a worthless ***** I was. I basically ignored him and I was straight forward that we were through.

He begged and pleaded for me not to leave, but the damage was too severe and he cheated on me several times.


----------



## bailingout

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> I would argue that validation and respect have to be there before romance.


For sure. And yes pet names are eliminated or used less.


----------



## Jellybeans

I'mInLoveWithMyHubby said:


> I stopped caring. The sex obviously stopped. The cooking stopped and i refused to pick up after him. My ex h was very mean telling me everyday what a worthless ***** I was. I basically ignored him and I was straight forward that we were through.
> 
> He begged and pleaded for me not to leave, but the damage was too severe and he cheated on me several times.


Soo glad you got away from that guy, InLove, and met a nice man


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## diwali123

I do sometimes wonder what on earth was going through my ex's head. I get the feeling he really thought that I would never leave. 
Even after the final separation I think he was doing things to get me back. He filed for divorce out of the blue. Totally surprised me but I was thrilled.
I think he had someone tell him it was a 180 move. 
Then he let the house get foreclosed on. I think he truly believed I would just give up and move in with him at our friends' house. 
When that didn't work he started sleeping with my friend. 
Like I would be so upset I'd take him back. I don't know, he just makes no sense.


----------



## Jellybeans

diwali123 said:


> I do sometimes wonder what on earth was going through my ex's head. I get the feeling he really thought that I would never leave.


That's exactly what he was thinking since you saw that you stuck around for so long. So when you decided no more, he was prob confused as hell.


----------



## diwali123

During the first separation he I think was getting coached on what to say by someone. Divorce busters or something. I didn't buy any of it. He claimed to be interested in things he has always told me were stupid (tarot cards) and suddenly wore his ring after 8 years of insisting it was too hard to wear it and it bugged him. 
I told him I felt like he was reciting lined and he insisted he wasn't. 
I took him back because he started counseling and finally went to an endo and found out I was right about his thyroid being crazy off and that his family doc was a quack. 
He promised not to fight in front of our d, that he had worked on his anger. 
All lies.


----------



## turnera

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> Pouring on the romance. Love Notes. Sweet Texts. Nice emails. A gentle touch. Looking into her eyes and saying <something romantic>. Being present while in the same room (no computer/phone/tv/etc.) Bought flowers. And questioning my 'reactions' before jumping to conclusions.


Is that her love language? I personally HATE when my husband does that stuff. It's not my LL. Acts of service is. He buys me jewelry while our house falls apart around our ears.

Has she filled out the LB and EN questionnaires?


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## JohnnyTheRomantic

turnera said:


> Is that her love language? I personally HATE when my husband does that stuff. It's not my LL. Acts of service is. He buys me jewelry while our house falls apart around our ears.
> 
> Has she filled out the LB and EN questionnaires?


i am going to do request we both do the 5LL first, then EN, LB. I did the 5LL and reviewed EN and LB. be interesting to see if what is important to me is important to her....


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## turnera

It won't be. You come from two different FOO and set of experiences.

My stepmom used to buy the same gift for all the kids (young adults) at Christmas. It was always something SHE wanted, so she'd buy us each one and then add one for herself.


----------



## LivingAgain

Like most here, I stopped arguing, no affectionate gestures, no initiating sex...

STBXH thinks himself to be a great romantic with cards, poems, etc. but it repulsed me because it was all fake. While he was asking me how to save our marriage, he was dating... puhleeasse!

The only anger I have left is how he treats our kids and how he let us go into financial ruin....as far as HE is concerned; indifference. If not for the kids and financial crap to be cleaned up, I'd never talk to and deal with him again and be HAPPY!!


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## Trying2figureitout

It is very interesting to hear how ladies check out.... and feel totally justified..really?

Seems weird as a guy.

How on Earth do you feel justified to do this to the husbands you PROMISED in from of your friends, family and if you believe in God..god to love until death do you part?

Seems VERY petty to me as a man. Who's the adult?

A real man would NEVER hold grudges like women tend to do.
Really why check out just divorce him and respect him as a human.. if your feelings are so hurt.

Otherwise you are simply being SELFISH and dishonoring your vows. Seriously man up and quit playing the drama card. Get you heads back in your marriage and apologize to your husbands for making their life miserable. Either stay and work on communication or leave... don't torture the poor guy.


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## LivingAgain

Trying - 

I checked out but knew I'd get around to asking for D.
I was trying to get my DD healthy again after suicide attempt and a DS off to college...

I honored my vows through one affair, years of MC and IC, ENs, LBs, love languages etc only to be rewarded from H with more lies, and no patience for ME when 1) my only parent died and 2) the suicide attempt of one of our children (to which he felt was a HUGE inconvenience to HIM)

I did EVERYTHING possible to save our marriage - but TWO need to be in on that...I am done with the self-absorbed, delusional person that didn't uphold his vows.

I did ask for a divorce when I knew I did everything I could...why didn't he ask me for a divorce before his two affairs?? Oh because he felt he deserved a devoted wife AND a girlfriend!


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## Michie

Don't got it in me right now to respond to that post. Any other takers ladies?


----------



## ScarletBegonias

Michie said:


> Don't got it in me right now to respond to that post. Any other takers ladies?


well,we'd all be happy as clams if our men had followed THE PLAN like some others posters


----------



## Michie

ScarletBegonias said:


> well,we'd all be happy as clams if our men had followed THE PLAN like some others posters


I am trying to focus right now that this poster, like a lot of us on this thread had their love and faithfulfulness thrown back in our face as if it were trash. As if we were no longer worthy of our spouse's time. That we were a sideline in our spouse's life. Perhaps if said poster went back read our posts again from that standpoint they would understand...


----------



## SurpriseMyself

Cosmos said:


> I treated him like any other human being I wasn't connected to, apart from the cold disdain I felt for him (I couldn't keep that under wraps). What he thought or said ceased to matter to me, and I stopped sharing my thoughts and feelings with him. I focused on my son and myself and started making a practical exit plan.
> 
> (Edited to add: This was after 6 years of me trying to work on the marriage (counseling etc) whilst he lied to me about what his real 'issues' were. I didn't 'check out' lightly.)


I did the exact same thing. I also didn't want him to touch me for any reason. I even hate it when he hugs me. I too am working on an exit plan.


----------



## ScarletBegonias

Michie said:


> Perhaps if said poster went back read our posts again from that standpoint they would understand...


based on other posts in various threads,I highly doubt this realization will hit.Some people just haven't gotten there yet and need more time I suppose.OR they'll stay stuck in the same frame of mind for the rest of their lives.


----------



## SurpriseMyself

trey69 said:


> One thing I seemed to notice in the ladies responses was, just about all of them said they stopped or cut back on sex. I'm sure thats because most women relate emotional needs/wants with physical needs/wants. I have to wonder, if some of the posts put up by men who are not getting their sexual needs met by their wives, if this is why? Maybe their wives have tried to tell them and they are not listening? I do wonder if their husbands are a big part of the problem for why they are not getting sex? The women have checked out due how their husbands are making them feel.


About the withholding sex thing, I have yet to meet a woman who says she's not having sex with her husband to punish him or have control over him. For me, I don't want to have sex with someone I don't like, don't trust, and don't respect.


----------



## ScarletBegonias

ebp123 said:


> For me, I don't want to have sex with someone I don't like, don't trust, and don't respect.


I'd question a person's character if they were ok with having sex with someone they didn't like,didn't trust,and didn't respect..male or female.


----------



## SurpriseMyself

LifeIsAJourney said:


> What is it about seeing a woman's a$$ framed by suitcases that makes men so agreeable?


OMFG... so funny and so true.


----------



## LivingAgain

ebp123 said:


> About the withholding sex thing, I have yet to meet a woman who says she's not having sex with her husband to punish him or have control over him. For me, I don't want to have sex with someone I don't like, don't trust, and don't respect.


Exactly.


----------



## Michie

ScarletBegonias said:


> based on other posts in various threads,I highly doubt this realization will hit.Some people just haven't gotten there yet and need more time I suppose.OR they'll stay stuck in the same frame of mind for the rest of their lives.


Thats a shame as I think we ladies posting here as coming from a place of honesty and a desire to help.


----------



## ScarletBegonias

Michie said:


> Thats a shame as I think we ladies posting here as coming from a place of honesty and a desire to help.


most are coming from that place.not all are ready for that though.some ladies and some men are hurting and just want to lash out.


----------



## diwali123

Trying2figureitout said:


> It is very interesting to hear how ladies check out.... and feel totally justified..really?
> 
> Seems weird as a guy.
> 
> How on Earth do you feel justified to do this to the husbands you PROMISED in from of your friends, family and if you believe in God..god to love until death do you part?
> 
> Seems VERY petty to me as a man. Who's the adult?
> 
> A real man would NEVER hold grudges like women tend to do.
> Really why check out just divorce him and respect him as a human.. if your feelings are so hurt.
> 
> Otherwise you are simply being SELFISH and dishonoring your vows. Seriously man up and quit playing the drama card. Get you heads back in your marriage and apologize to your husbands for making their life miserable. Either stay and work on communication or leave... don't torture the poor guy.


If you haven't noticed, these weren't real men.


----------



## lifeistooshort

Trying2figureitout said:


> It is very interesting to hear how ladies check out.... and feel totally justified..really?
> 
> Seems weird as a guy.
> 
> How on Earth do you feel justified to do this to the husbands you PROMISED in from of your friends, family and if you believe in God..god to love until death do you part?
> 
> Seems VERY petty to me as a man. Who's the adult?
> 
> A real man would NEVER hold grudges like women tend to do.
> Really why check out just divorce him and respect him as a human.. if your feelings are so hurt.
> 
> Otherwise you are simply being SELFISH and dishonoring your vows. Seriously man up and quit playing the drama card. Get you heads back in your marriage and apologize to your husbands for making their life miserable. Either stay and work on communication or leave... don't torture the poor guy.



So as a man does honoring your vows include treating your wife like she matters to you and you're a partner in the marriage or does it simply mean staying married? 
Seems weird to me as a woman.
What part of "let's go to counseling" and "this isn't working" doesn't register, so that she has to have one foot out the door before anything registers? Time to quit being selfish and realize that marriage vows don't mean you are now free to sit back and treat your spouse like cr$p because you think they promised not to go anywhere.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## turnera

Trying2figureitout said:


> How on Earth do you feel justified to do this to the husbands you PROMISED in from of your friends, family and if you believe in God..god to love until death do you part?
> 
> Seems VERY petty to me as a man. Who's the adult?


You seem to have skipped over the part where the MAN stopped holding up HIS side of the bargain FIRST, and thus got this RESPONSE.


----------



## diwali123

How does a man feel justified to tell his wife he will be a supportive father and then two weeks before the baby is due inform her that he isn't going to help at all? 
How does a man feel justified letting his wife go through severe sleep deprivation and not lifting a finger to help? Or getting irate when she wants to go out for an hour by herself? 
Or refusing counseling, books and talking about the marriage? 
Or calling her a ***** in front of her child? 
Or starting fights and giving the silent treatment for days? 
Or ripping up the wedding photo? 
Or lying about where he is so he can go hang out with friends leaving her alone with an infant 24 hours a day? 
Or refusing to take time off when wife has two ear infections in each ear? 
Or when wife is crying about her brother in Iraq, saying loudly "don't cry, he's not dead yet."
I could go on and on.


----------



## JohnnyTheRomantic

lifeistooshort said:


> So as a man does honoring your vows include treating your wife like she matters to you and you're a partner in the marriage or does it simply mean staying married?
> Seems weird to me as a woman.
> What part of "let's go to counseling" and "this isn't working" doesn't register, so that she has to have one foot out the door before anything registers? Time to quit being selfish and realize that marriage vows don't mean you are now free to sit back and treat your spouse like cr$p because you think they promised not to go anywhere.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The reverse is true. I have read about the Walk a Wife, not the walk away husband, however the principles apply to both genders.

If it were me and my wife said it is not working, lets go to counseling. I would be there, however I want my R to work.


----------



## Jellybeans

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> If it were me and my wife said it is not working, lets go to counseling. I would be there, however I want my R to work.


One would think that people who respect their partner and see that their partner is hurting WOULD be open to a compromise like that. However, as you are seeing in all of these responses, is that the guys involved simply did not care enough to try.They figured their ladies were not going anywhere. Gross miscalculation.


----------



## lifeistooshort

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> The reverse is true. I have read about the Walk a Wife, not the walk away husband, however the principles apply to both genders.
> 
> If it were me and my wife said it is not working, lets go to counseling. I would be there, however I want my R to work.


Glad to hear that, hopefully you know that comment wasn't directed at you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## diwali123

Jellybeans said:


> One would think that people who respect their partner and see that their partner is hurting WOULD be open to a compromise like that. However, as you are seeing in all of these responses, is that the guys involved simply did not care enough to try.They figured their ladies were not going anywhere. Gross miscalculation.


I think mine figured if we had a baby I would be stuck. So he poured on the charm for a few years after we went through hell together. 
Then tried to trap me. He asked for years for us to have a baby and then acted like he hated her and me. 
Ironic part is having her made me realize how selfish and horrible of a man he really is and that she and I deserved a better life.


----------



## Jellybeans

Sorry to hear of that Diwali. It's one thing for him to treat you bad but to treat the baby as if he hated her... that is awful.

On a positive note: GLAD you got away!


----------



## diwali123

He had about five minutes a day of sweet time with her. 
Most of his bad behavior towards her was directed at me. Like he hated holding her. He hated changing her diaper. He would just scowl and sit looking like a serial killer if he was forced to hold her. 
He would tell me it didn't matter be ause she was a baby and she wouldn't remember and this part of her life wasn't important. He would say he couldn't bond because she wasn't in his body for nine months. 

I knew eventually she would feel the scorn and get tired of being ignored and pushed away. 

Sad that the older she got the more she was excited to see him but he expected me to keep her away from him when he got home so he could relax. 

How do you tell a two year old that daddy doesn't want to say hi to you? 

Long story but after he knew for sure I was serious about divorce suddenly he became concerned with his rights as a father. 

When we were separated half the time he would call me on his day to take her and say he was sick or too tired or "too distraught" to take her. 
He never wanted her for more than a quick overnight because it was too much for him. 
But then suddenly he demanded entire weekends. 

I started working because I needed to have a job to get a divorce. This was way before the separation. We both worked full time but he still wouldn't help me for more than 10-15 minutes a day. 

I once woke him up at 6 because she had been up for an hour and I just wanted to lay down a little before I went to work. He started yelling and cursing me out. Then later called me a B for it in front of her. 

A few times we all came home after work and she was all over him, he took her into another room and I fell asleep. I woke up 30 minutes later, went in there and he was irate with me for not coming to get her. 
After I was forced to move in with my mom she would ask every day when she was going to see her dad. It broke my heart.


----------



## Trying2figureitout

ScarletBegonias said:


> well,we'd all be happy as clams if our men had followed THE PLAN like some others posters


Probably would.


----------



## JohnnyTheRomantic

So ladies. If you had disconnected, would you give your H a speech like this:



> i just want you to be happy and i am willing to do anything for you to have that. If you could go anywhere and 'be away from legal issue', i would just want that for you. For you to be happy and live the rest of your life, without me.


?


----------



## ScarletBegonias

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> So ladies. If you had disconnected, would you give your H a speech like this:
> 
> 
> 
> ?


tried the disconnection speech.As with everything I said,he didn't listen or care.


----------



## Jellybeans

On another note, your pit is adorable, Scarlet (if that's your pit in the avatar).


----------



## ScarletBegonias

Jellybeans said:


> On another note, your pit is adorable, Scarlet (if that's your pit in the avatar).


awww isn't he gorgeous? not mine though,I have a blue but he's darker than the one in the pic.

pits rock:smthumbup:


----------



## Jellybeans

diwali123 said:


> He would just scowl and sit looking like a serial killer if he was forced to hold her.


That is scary.


----------



## diwali123

Jellybeans said:


> That is scary.


He never once had one of those moments where he just stared at her with awe and love. Not once. 

It was like someone flipped a switch after she born and he turned into Satan.


----------



## TCSRedhead

Trying2figureitout said:


> It is very interesting to hear how ladies check out.... and feel totally justified..really?
> 
> Seems weird as a guy.
> 
> How on Earth do you feel justified to do this to the husbands you PROMISED in from of your friends, family and if you believe in God..god to love until death do you part?
> 
> Seems VERY petty to me as a man. Who's the adult?
> 
> A real man would NEVER hold grudges like women tend to do.
> Really why check out just divorce him and respect him as a human.. if your feelings are so hurt.
> 
> Otherwise you are simply being SELFISH and dishonoring your vows. Seriously man up and quit playing the drama card. Get you heads back in your marriage and apologize to your husbands for making their life miserable. Either stay and work on communication or leave... don't torture the poor guy.


No one asked what prompted this to happen - simply the signs that indicated it had. 

Stop being so preachy and judgmental when your marriage is still in limbo for pete's sake. 

It's obvious this triggered you because YOUR wife has emotionally disconnected from YOU but the OP wanted to know what things happened when the disconnect occurred.


----------



## LifeIsAJourney

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> So ladies. If you had disconnected, would you give your H a speech like this:
> 
> 
> 
> ?


JTR, are you saying your wife said this to you? Or is this just an example?


----------



## in my tree

It's interesting reading all the responses too. I just keep saying to myself : me too!! Yeah, I did that too!! I'm with ya!

I think the most pronounced things that I did were mainly to focus on myself instead of us. I ate when I wanted to, cleaned what I wanted to or ignored the chores that I didn't want to do, I went out with my friends away from him and really had little to do with him other than the formalities of living with a roommate. I didn't pay too much attention to what he did. That was his business. It sounds cold when written like that, but contrary to what some posters here may think, I had damn good reasons.


----------



## Trying2figureitout

TCSRedhead said:


> No one asked what prompted this to happen - simply the signs that indicated it had.
> 
> Stop being so preachy and judgmental when your marriage is still in limbo for pete's sake.
> 
> It's obvious this triggered you because YOUR wife has emotionally disconnected from YOU but the OP wanted to know what things happened when the disconnect occurred.


When is it EVER right to emotionally disconnect from your spouse?

That is basically another form of the* silent treatment* which gets blasted here.

Did not see that in the marriage instructions.... 

Seems disingenuous and childish. Marriage is meant to be tough deal with it through both the peaks and valleys. You promised him your best..is this it? Disconnecting?


----------



## TCSRedhead

Trying2figureitout said:


> When is it EVER right to emotionally disconnect?
> 
> Did not see that in the marriage instructions....
> 
> Seems disingenuous and childish. Marriage is meant to be tough deal with it through both the peaks and valleys.


No one said it was right, did they?


----------



## diwali123

Really. Even when someone is being emotionally abusive?


----------



## turnera

Trying2figureitout said:


> When is it EVER right to emotionally disconnect from your spouse?


Why aren't you asking the MEN that question?

Are you not reading that each one of these women reached that point AFTER BEING IGNORED or discounted? 

Why is it the WOMAN's job to just sit and accept negligence while the man is allowed to do it first?


----------



## Trying2figureitout

turnera said:


> Why aren't you asking the MEN that question?
> 
> Are you not reading that each one of these women reached that point AFTER BEING IGNORED or discounted?
> 
> Why is it the WOMAN's job to just sit and accept negligence while the man is allowed to do it first?


Because she is married. Same way I sat and accepted negligence of a formerly sexless marraige.

Difference is I communicated with my spouse all along and we worked on things over time together rather than doing some silent treatment like plan.

Its holding a grudge plain and simple. This emotional disconnect thing. Its weak and very self centered.

Divorce or try your best everyday regardless of the other spouse.


----------



## in my tree

Trying2figureitout said:


> When is it EVER right to emotionally disconnect from your spouse?
> 
> That is basically another form of the* silent treatment* which gets blasted here.
> 
> Did not see that in the marriage instructions....
> 
> Seems disingenuous and childish. Marriage is meant to be tough deal with it through both the peaks and valleys. You promised him your best..is this it? Disconnecting?


I don't know if any of this is "right". It is something that some of us can't help. It's not a choice. For instance in my case I found it impossible to be emotionally connected to someone who abused me, my daughter, lied and stole from others. 

Btw if you ever find those marriage instructions, can you make a copy and share them here? I'm sure we'd all love to take a gander.


----------



## diwali123

Trying2figureitout said:


> Because she is married. Same way I sat and accepted negligence of a formerly sexless marraige.
> 
> Difference is I communicated with my spouse all along and we worked on things over time together rather than doing some silent treatment like plan.
> 
> Its holding a grudge plain and simple. This emotional disconnect thing. Its weak and very self centered.
> 
> Divorce or try your best everyday regardless of the other spouse.


I couldn't magically wave my fingers and divorce him. As it was he made my life a living hell. I was a SAHM with no car of my own with no money of my own. 
Kind of hard to just divorce. 

I think you are projecting big time.


----------



## diwali123

in my tree said:


> I don't know if any of this is "right". It is something that some of us can't help. It's not a choice. For instance in my case I found it impossible to be emotionally connected to someone who abused me, my daughter, lied and stole from others.
> 
> Btw if you ever find those marriage instructions, can you make a copy and share them here? I'm sure we'd all love to take a gander.


I didn't realize when we got married I was agreeing to be abused, neglected, treated like dirt and he could do whatever he wanted. Had I known that was his idea of marriage I never would have married him. 
It's not holding a grudge when it keeps happening every day. 
I didn't marry him to be his live stock.


----------



## Jellybeans

Trying2figureitout said:


> Because she is married.


Um SAY WHAAAAAAAAAAAAT?


----------



## Trying2figureitout

diwali123 said:


> I didn't realize when we got married I was agreeing to be abused, neglected, treated like dirt and he could do whatever he wanted. Had I known that was his idea of marriage I never would have married him.
> It's not holding a grudge when it keeps happening every day.
> I didn't marry him to be his live stock.


Its also not doing anything positive to attempt to remedy the situation.


----------



## Trying2figureitout

Jellybeans said:


> Um SAY WHAAAAAAAAAAAAT?


Yes you know marriage... in front of your family and friends and if you believe in god for life?

Oh and I'm sure you all are without any blame right?

Oh but payback feels so good right?

Face it if you are emotionally checked out you should leave and divorce. otherwise you are staying for convenience.


----------



## diwali123

Trying2figureitout said:


> Its also not doing anything positive to attempt to remedy the situation.


Honestly you sound like a man who believes he should be able to do anything and his wife will just feel so fück ing grateful to be married to him she will put up with it.
Did you not see that he refused counseling? Wouldn't go to a dr for his mental/thyroid problem? Would t even do the needs questionarre? Wouldn't read any books or talk about improving things or listen to my feelings?


----------



## diwali123

Trying2figureitout said:


> Yes you know marriage... in front of your family and friends and if you believe in god for life?
> 
> Oh and I'm sure you all are without any blame right?
> 
> Oh but payback feels so good right?
> 
> Face it if you are emotionally checked out you should leave and divorce. otherwise you are staying for convenience.


Then he should have left first. I'm not sure what part of this you don't get.


----------



## Trying2figureitout

diwali123 said:


> Honestly you sound like a man who believes he should be able to do anything and his wife will just feel so fück ing grateful to be married to him she will put up with it.
> Did you not see that he refused counseling? Wouldn't go to a dr for his mental/thyroid problem? Would t even do the needs questionarre? Wouldn't read any books or talk about improving things or listen to my feelings?


Never mind go back to listing all the ways ladies (wives) check out and the things they stop doing intentionally to their spouse I'm sure that will be helpful to know for some. Sure it helps the ladies compare notes also about what works best.


----------



## diwali123

If it makes you feel any better, I don't think he gave a rat's ass. He was so checked out he didn't know I existed.


----------



## diwali123

Trying2figureitout said:


> Never mind go back to listing all the ways ladies (wives) check out and the things they stop doing intentionally to their spouse I'm sure that will be helpful to know for some. Sure it helps the ladies compare notes also about what works best.


What works best for what? None of us got anything out of this. I just wanted to stop wasting my energy and protect myself. It didn't have an impact on him. Nothing did. Or we wouldn't have divorced.


----------



## turnera

Trying2figureitout said:


> Its also not doing anything positive to attempt to remedy the situation.


 Oh, right, because you can just snap your fingers and make a man stop being an abuser...:scratchhead:


----------



## Trying2figureitout

turnera said:


> Oh, right, because you can just snap your fingers and make a man stop being an abuser...:scratchhead:


Over time with effort possibly...


----------



## TCSRedhead

Trying2figureitout said:


> Over time with effort possibly...


And meanwhile I should have waited until he finishes me off? I mean, it was only a broken nose, two black eyes and countless bruises. Oh, and a missed stabbing when the knife went in to the door behind my head.

But, I should have been more patient and just waited.

My bad.


----------



## in my tree

TCS - I was just going to say that that would take either a complete doormat and/or a near saint to work with the abuser.


----------



## Trying2figureitout

TCSRedhead said:


> And meanwhile I should have waited until he finishes me off? I mean, it was only a broken nose, two black eyes and countless bruises. Oh, and a missed stabbing when the knife went in to the door behind my head.
> 
> But, I should have been more patient and just waited.
> 
> My bad.


Obviously you should leave that situation... most emotional check outs are over much less than physical abuse. Glad you left that physically abusive marriage and are safe now.


----------



## diwali123

Trying2figureitout said:


> Over time with effort possibly...


So 14 years isn't enough time?


----------



## TCSRedhead

diwali123 said:


> So 14 years isn't enough time?


Not according to the plan, apparently.


----------



## turnera

Trying2figureitout said:


> Over time with effort possibly...


 :rofl:


----------



## turnera

Trying, point me to the thread where you are telling the _husbands_ of these women what THEY should be doing. I'd like to read it.

Oh, wait, they aren't HERE trying to learn to be better partners, are they? THEY think nothing is wrong and the wife should just buck up and be more supportive.


----------



## diwali123

I don't know how my ex found this site.


----------



## Trying2figureitout

turnera said:


> Trying, point me to the thread where you are telling the _husbands_ of these women what THEY should be doing. I'd like to read it.
> 
> Oh, wait, they aren't HERE trying to learn to be better partners, are they? THEY think nothing is wrong and the wife should just buck up and be more supportive.


What I do is a start. Its in my sig and plenty do come here.

Face it it takes both to mess up a marriage.
Belive me no spouse in a troubled marriage thinks "nothings wrong" they may not know immediately how to correct it that comes over time when at least one spouse is connected and willing to do the right thing regardless.

My wife read ZIP apart from my letters.. yet we survived sure it was tough but hey lifes tough. Two wrongs don't make a right.


----------



## turnera

No one is there asking for help. And practically the only guys who ever come here are the ones whose wives are already leaving or are cheating. There's a reason there's a whole section in the self help books about Walkaway Wives.


----------



## diwali123

Two wrongs don't make a right but divorcing an abuser and living happily and strong is awesome.


----------



## JohnnyTheRomantic

LifeIsAJourney said:


> JTR, are you saying your wife said this to you? Or is this just an example?


had said this to me a couple of months ago. before any posts on here.


----------



## JohnnyTheRomantic

turnera said:


> Trying, point me to the thread where you are telling the _husbands_ of these women what THEY should be doing. I'd like to read it.
> 
> Oh, wait, they aren't HERE trying to learn to be better partners, are they? THEY think nothing is wrong and the wife should just buck up and be more supportive.


I am an H and I am here to educate myself and be a better partner, so lets not generalize too much.


----------



## turnera

Yes, but it's because you've gotten 'the speech,' right?


----------



## JohnnyTheRomantic

turnera said:


> Yes, but it's because you've gotten 'the speech,' right?


well that might be a topic for a different thread - what speeches do you use to emotionally detach...

if you consider the speech i posted previously "the speech", that was not the trigger for me coming to TAM, which is a great resource by the way. So thank you all for that !!

My wake up was her telling me she 'felt smothered'.

at the root of this, i am holding "whatever it takes" to make this work i will do, without sacrificing myself in the process.


----------



## just got it 55

turnera said:


> No one is there asking for help. And practically the only guys who ever come here are the ones whose wives are already leaving or are cheating. There's a reason there's a whole section in the self help books about Walkaway Wives.


My wife disconnected from me slowly for years. It was 99.999% my fault. My fear for years of my believing she would at some point walk away. I worked on turning it around. She has responded incredibly. Only problem is she says she disconnected for fear that I would die young. I just don’t buy that given our history .I only wish she would be honest with herself as to why.


----------



## LivingAgain

Trying2figureitout said:


> Yes you know marriage... in front of your family and friends and if you believe in god for life?
> 
> Oh and I'm sure you all are without any blame right?
> 
> Oh but payback feels so good right?
> 
> *Face it if you are emotionally checked out you should leave and divorce. otherwise you are staying for convenience.*


EXACTLY what he did to me with the FIRST affair...HE should have asked ME for a divorce. He "checked out" first, only his idea of checking out was to get a girlfriend and then lie and pretend he still loved me...

Ladies, I think we should be DONE justifying ...whoever said projection is correct!


----------



## diwali123

LivingAgain said:


> EXACTLY what he did to me with the FIRST affair...HE should have asked ME for a divorce. He "checked out" first, only his idea of checking out was to get a girlfriend and then lie and pretend he still loved me...
> 
> Ladies, I think we should be DONE justifying ...whoever said projection is correct!


Yep.


----------



## Jellybeans

Trying2figureitout said:


> Yes you know marriage... in front of your family and friends and if you believe in god for life?
> 
> Oh and I'm sure you all are without any blame right?
> 
> Oh but payback feels so good right?
> 
> Face it if you are emotionally checked out you should leave and divorce. otherwise you are staying for convenience.


Oh I am well aware of what a marriage is. Nobody here has said they are blameless. This isn't "payback." Why are you putting words in peoples' mouths?

You said I should leave and divorce? Done and done. It seems a LOT of the women here are saying they did just that. Not sure what point you are trying to make. 



Trying2figureitout said:


> Never mind go back to listing all the ways ladies (wives) check out and the things they stop doing intentionally to their spouse


Well that IS the entire point of the thread. :rofl:

Go back and re-read the thread topic. If the replies bother you so much, you could just, you know, stop reading the responses. 

But Johnny had some questions and we're answering them. 



diwali123 said:


> I don't know how my ex found this site.


:rofl: I literally LOL'ed when I read that.


----------



## diwali123

[:rofl: I literally LOL'ed when I read that. [/QUOTE]

oh by the way ex, I used to think about (friend) when we did it and I had a steamy long distance fling with our ex roommate after you got the house foreclosed on and filed contempt of court against me. 
That's why he won't talk to you anymore. Oh he also told me he knew a longtime ago you were mentally unbalanced. 
I feel better now,


----------



## just got it 55

This has been going in the direction of a gender thing. Neither men nor women has the market cornered on checking out. A person can check out for no apparent reason to the other. The issues have just not been clearly communicated such as built up resentment over one spouse working 50 plus hours (Wife or Husband) and the other feeling left alone .


----------



## 3Xnocharm

Trying2figureitout said:


> It is very interesting to hear how ladies check out.... and feel totally justified..really?
> 
> Seems weird as a guy.
> 
> How on Earth do you feel justified to do this to the husbands you PROMISED in from of your friends, family and if you believe in God..god to love until death do you part?
> 
> Seems VERY petty to me as a man. Who's the adult?
> 
> A real man would NEVER hold grudges like women tend to do.
> Really why check out just divorce him and respect him as a human.. if your feelings are so hurt.
> 
> Otherwise you are simply being SELFISH and dishonoring your vows. Seriously man up and quit playing the drama card. Get you heads back in your marriage and apologize to your husbands for making their life miserable. Either stay and work on communication or leave... don't torture the poor guy.


Are you serious?? If you read through this forum, you should see that there are MANY MEN who checked out emotionally from their marriage for the SAME reasons as the ladies who have posted here! Its NOT A GRUDGE! Its called SURVIVAL! How dare you come at those who posted here about their VOWS! The vows were already broken by the spouse spewing nastiness and name calling, the spouse who is ignoring, and treating the other like dirt, or cheating, or abusing! No one looks to check out, it is an instinctive response to one's environment. No one here was man bashing, just sharing experiences...well, til YOU posted.


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## diwali123

I bet if someone started a thread about men checking out, we would see similar responses.
Many men on TAM are here because they have been deeply hurt by selfish immature women. It goes both ways.


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## Trying2figureitout

3Xnocharm said:


> Are you serious?? If you read through this forum, you should see that there are MANY MEN who checked out emotionally from their marriage for the SAME reasons as the ladies who have posted here! Its NOT A GRUDGE! Its called SURVIVAL! How dare you come at those who posted here about their VOWS! The vows were already broken by the spouse spewing nastiness and name calling, the spouse who is ignoring, and treating the other like dirt, or cheating, or abusing! No one looks to check out, it is an instinctive response to one's environment. No one here was man bashing, just sharing experiences...well, til YOU posted.


Looks like I hit a nerve. That usually indicates I'm spot on.
Its a grudge. Not all are abused... just hurt feelings.


----------



## 3Xnocharm

Trying2figureitout said:


> Looks like I hit a nerve. That usually indicates I'm spot on.
> Its a grudge. Not all are abused... just hurt feelings.


Yeah you hit a nerve, because you are trying to make the disconnection out to be a grudge, and it's not. You check out to survive day to day, without going postal on your spouse. It isn't normally a conscious thing, it's survival instict. Who are you to judge how seriously or not other people have taken their vows?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## missmim

Trying2figureitout said:


> Looks like I hit a nerve. That usually indicates I'm spot on.
> Its a grudge. Not all are abused... just hurt feelings.


That interesting, in another post you were telling cuddlebug that his newfound LD (including non sexual intamacy) was a defense mechanism, to his wife's LD and his needs being met. Now i feel for cuddlebug, but How is this any different.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Michie

*Trying2figureitout*

You're not trying to figure anything out, that is evident from your posts on this thread. This saddens me.

A crtitcal thinking and reasonable person should look at this thread and think "Phew this is good points on how to dodge a bullet and avoid pain."

You however from your perch of bitterness and resentment are thinking
"i KNEW she was trying to fvck me!!!"

You refuse to see cause and effect, you refuse to see that most of the posters refused to let go of their self worth, their dignity, they refused to let the actions of their spouse widdle them away to nothing.

As I said before the disconnection is a self defense against having one love and respect of their spouse thrown repeatedly time and again back at them as though that love was worthless, as if the vows you made were worthless, as if the time invested was worthless, as if the bond of having children was worthless.

If you still don't get it, we won't accept that we are without worth.
Nor the comprise, respect and love that marriages are made of.


----------



## Jellybeans

Michie said:


> You're not trying to figure anything out, that is evident from your posts on this thread. This saddens me.
> 
> You however from your perch of bitterness and resentment are thinking
> "i KNEW she was tring to fvck me!!!"


:iagree: That is exactly what it sounds like.


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## diwali123

The nerve you hit was all of us realizing we are talking to a selfish entitled woman hating man who thinks his wife is there to be subservient to him like all our exes.


----------



## lifeistooshort

diwali123 said:


> The nerve you hit was all of us realizing we are talking to a selfish entitled woman hating man who thinks his wife is there to be subservient to him like all our exes.



Men are allowed to hate on us because our sole purpose in life is to make the poor, defenseless man miserable, and to use him for everything we can because he's such a great catch and brings so much to the table. Didn't you know that?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## TCSRedhead

lifeistooshort said:


> Men are allowed to hate on us because our sole purpose in life is to make the poor, defenseless man miserable, and to use him for everything we can because he's such a great catch and brings so much to the table. Didn't you know that?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Shoot - I've been doing it wrong!


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## diwali123

Not all men...just the crazy abusive ones with mommy issues.


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## lifeistooshort

diwali123 said:


> Not all men...just the crazy abusive ones with mommy issues.


My ex used to call such people "issues with legs". Of course he didn't recognize that he was one of them.....I will say that for all of his issues he did have a great sense of humor, at least when he wasn't being an a$$.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Trying2figureitout

Michie said:


> *Trying2figureitout*
> 
> You're not trying to figure anything out, that is evident from your posts on this thread. This saddens me.
> 
> A crtitcal thinking and reasonable person should look at this thread and think "Phew this is good points on how to dodge a bullet and avoid pain."
> 
> You however from your perch of bitterness and resentment are thinking
> "i KNEW she was trying to fvck me!!!"
> 
> You refuse to see cause and effect, you refuse to see that most of the posters refused to let go of their self worth, their dignity, they refused to let the actions of their spouse widdle them away to nothing.
> 
> As I said before the disconnection is a self defense against having one love and respect of their spouse thrown repeatedly time and again back at them as though that love was worthless, as if the vows you made were worthless, as if the time invested was worthless, as if the bond of having children was worthless.
> 
> If you still don't get it, we won't accept that we are without worth.
> Nor the comprise, respect and love that marriages are made of.


How exactly does this thread tell people to avoid pain? Its about the signs your wife checked out.. once that occurs there is literally nearly 100% no going back.... except in my wife's case due to my efforts.

I applaud those ex-wives who divorced as that was a good thing rather than wasting the guys time pretending. Most won't go to the lengths I did to rectify the pain.

And don't sit on your high perches and assume YOU DID NO WRONG... you did and you know it deep down.

You could have done better.

IT takes both to screw up a marriage and you all know that.


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## diwali123

I should have separated two years after we got married like I planned and forced him to get therapy instead of listening to his excuses and lies. Maybe if I had put my foot down then we would have had a chance. 
But I trusted and that was what I did wrong.


----------



## Michie

Trying2figureitout said:


> How exactly does this thread tell people to avoid pain? Its about the signs your wife checked out.. once that occurs there is literally nearly 100% no going back.... except in my wife's case due to my efforts.
> 
> I applaud those ex-wives who divorced as that was a good thing rather than wasting the guys time pretending. Most won't go to the lengths I did to rectify the pain.
> 
> And don't sit on your high perches and assume YOU DID NO WRONG... you did and you know it deep down.
> 
> You could have done better.
> 
> IT takes both to screw up a marriage and you all know that.


Except your wife.........riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight

I'm still married. Just had our 13th anniversary.

And I'm pretty sure no one here blamed the entire scope and scale of their marriage issue on their husbands alone.

No one said they did no wrong...my God why am I wasting my words.


----------



## Trying2figureitout

Michie said:


> Except your wife.........riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight
> 
> I'm still married. Just had our 13th anniversary.
> 
> And I'm pretty sure no one here blamed the entire scope and scale of their marriage issue on their husbands alone.
> 
> No one said they did no wrong...my God why am I wasting my words.


Most emotional checker outers don't admit at least 50% of the fault for the bad marriage.. its easier to point the finger and 'check-out' on your spouse as a 'coping' mechanism. Because actually working on the marriage would be work and that's hard and not assured of success.

Why are you still married if you are unwilling to deeply evaluate why you are checked out? Better to cut him loose if you are unwilling to check-in. He is probably waiting for a lightbulb to go off in your head.


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## Created2Write

Trying, there's something here that you're missing: if a husband or wife doesn't want the marriage to change, they simply _will not_ do anything to make it change, regardless of what the other spouse does or says. One person can not make a marriage, which is something you seem determined to ignore. Perhaps it's because your marriage has been hell for you for so long, that now your only way of dealing with it is to accept that you, by yourself, have the power and ability to change your wife? No matter how long it takes? No matter how much pain you have to go through? Even on your blog you say that BOTH spouses need to recognize the darker parts of themselves. But what happens when one spouse refuses to do that? Is the other one supposed to wave a magic wand and say the magic words and watch as their husband or wife is changed to be more sensitive and caring?

That might work to turn Cinderella's rags into a gorgeous ball gown that wins her Prince Charming, but it doesn't work that way in reality. If one person isn't willing to put in the effort that it takes to fix the marriage, then it will not matter what anyone else says or does; the key to fixing that marriage is in the spouse who _refuses_ to try. One person can only do so much, and can only fight for so long before they've given all they have to give. 

And again, no one here has said that emotionally checking out is the right thing to do. And you don't have to preach about their faults and failings. I'm sure each and every one of them has gone through their fair share of personal guilt, wishing they could have done more and knowing they couldn't. Until you've lived in their specific situation, you have no right to speak a word against them at all.


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## diwali123

He just doesn't get it. He says you should just get a divorce, we say we all did get divorces. 
He says you should have done everything you could, we lay out everything we did to save the marriage while the other person let it die.
I think he's either a troll or just really an angry hurt person.


----------



## Trying2figureitout

Created2Write said:


> Trying, there's something here that you're missing: if a husband or wife doesn't want the marriage to change, they simply _will not_ do anything to make it change, regardless of what the other spouse does or says. One person can not make a marriage, which is something you seem determined to ignore. Perhaps it's because your marriage has been hell for you for so long, that now your only way of dealing with it is to accept that you, by yourself, have the power and ability to change your wife? No matter how long it takes? No matter how much pain you have to go through? Even on your blog you say that BOTH spouses need to recognize the darker parts of themselves. But what happens when one spouse refuses to do that? Is the other one supposed to wave a magic wand and say the magic words and watch as their husband or wife is changed to be more sensitive and caring?
> 
> That might work to turn Cinderella's rags into a gorgeous ball gown that wins her Prince Charming, but it doesn't work that way in reality. If one person isn't willing to put in the effort that it takes to fix the marriage, then it will not matter what anyone else says or does; the key to fixing that marriage is in the spouse who _refuses_ to try. One person can only do so much, and can only fight for so long before they've given all they have to give.
> 
> And again, no one here has said that emotionally checking out is the right thing to do. And you don't have to preach about their faults and failings. I'm sure each and every one of them has gone through their fair share of personal guilt, wishing they could have done more and knowing they couldn't. Until you've lived in their specific situation, you have no right to speak a word against them at all.


See that's where you and I disagree... I do believe one person can change a marriage (as long as there is love left). It takes one doing the guiding back to bliss. There is such a thing as "The law of reciprocity" over time. It also takes understanding how tough it is on the other spouse.

Parts of my marriage have been hell...the rest awesome. So you take it in as an overall score until you return to bliss....together.


----------



## diwali123

As long as there is love left? 
That's it right there. He stopped loving me and I couldn't make him love me again. 
I think many men in relationships become unhappy but don't want to be the bad guy. They don't want to break up or divorce and make a woman cry. Instead they stay and act like a jerk until she breaks up or divorces, so they don't have to do the dirty work and they look like innocent victims. 

I truly believe that is why so many divorces are filed by the woman. That and in many cases the man just doesn't feel like doing the work to file and the woman just wants to get on with it. 

In my case I did things that my h disagreed with that were unresolvable in his delusional eyes. Instead of just saying he wanted to divorce he decided to trick me into having a baby with him. Maybe as a way to punish me or break me into doing what he wanted.


----------



## techmom

Trying2figureitout said:


> See that's where you and I disagree... I do believe one person can change a marriage (as long as there is love left). It takes one doing the guiding back to bliss. There is such a thing as "The law of reciprocity" over time. It also takes understanding how tough it is on the other spouse.
> 
> Parts of my marriage have been hell...the rest awesome. So you take it in as an overall score until you return to bliss....together.


I think yall are beating a dead horse here.


----------



## Created2Write

Trying2figureitout said:


> See that's where you and I disagree... I do believe one person can change a marriage (as long as there is love left). It takes one doing the guiding back to bliss. There is such a thing as "The law of reciprocity" over time. It also takes understanding how tough it is on the other spouse.
> 
> Parts of my marriage have been hell...the rest awesome. So you take it in as an overall score until you return to bliss....together.


If there is still love left, then the person _should_ want to improve the marriage. A person who still loves their husband or wife isn't going to act the way the husbands to these women acted. In my opinion since these husbands had absolutely no interest in recognizing their own faults or changing, or even going to counseling, there _wasn't_ love left.


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## diwali123

At that point it was just let's see how much hell I can make her life.


----------



## Michie

Trying2figureitout said:


> Most emotional checker outers don't admit at least 50% of the fault for the bad marriage.. its easier to point the finger and 'check-out' on your spouse as a 'coping' mechanism. Because actually working on the marriage would be work and that's hard and not assured of success.
> 
> *Why are you still married if you are unwilling to deeply evaluate why you are checked out? Better to cut him loose if you are unwilling to check-in. He is probably waiting for a lightbulb to go off in your head.*


Again WRONG!

if we are now speaking of me directly, and you actually reviewed my posts, you will realize that I have never said that I or my marriage were so forgone that I checked out. 

There was however a period of distancing around the time of the birth of our first son....Its a really long in telling, so I'll spare all of you. And we both did what we had to, to stop it from becoming more hurtful.

And why have I not done it for this current (but passing) time of crisis which began last summer. Which was wholly and completely the choice of my husband therefore his fault entirely,
well I'm not 100% sure I haven't checked out.

OK to be honest, I guess I had straddled the fence of checking out....The pain at its height, the betrayal, the well fvuking everything I wish I could have completely shut down or walked away. 

So I have made the choice to stay and help my husband, I have to consciously make the choice, even many times a day to not check out. I will have a flash to a particular day or a song or something triggers a memory. Its horrible. Everyday that passes my respect and admiration and trust for my H is growing to what it was. 

Its funny on TAM the hate for a "walk away wife" but everyone tells wives to D their spouse if the check out...Ohhh set him free and walk away. But you crucify those do.

Fvcking double standard much.


----------



## deejov

Trying2figureitout said:


> It is very interesting to hear how ladies check out.... and feel totally justified..really?
> 
> Seems weird as a guy.
> 
> How on Earth do you feel justified to do this to the husbands you PROMISED in from of your friends, family and if you believe in God..god to love until death do you part?
> 
> Seems VERY petty to me as a man. Who's the adult?
> 
> A real man would NEVER hold grudges like women tend to do.
> Really why check out just divorce him and respect him as a human.. if your feelings are so hurt.
> 
> Otherwise you are simply being SELFISH and dishonoring your vows. Seriously man up and quit playing the drama card. Get you heads back in your marriage and apologize to your husbands for making their life miserable. Either stay and work on communication or leave... don't torture the poor guy.


I would like to answer this one, as I recently explained this to my husband.

Boundaries and consequences.
It is no different than a man who isn't getting his needs met.

A consequence to not getting your needs met is you might detach. Divorce would follow in a lot of cases, but first it is necessary to take a step back and evaluate the situation without emotion. It's action, not words. One should always have boundaries if their sense of self worth is being eroded by a man. 

It is actually better. Then one can really see what the issues are, what role they play in the issues, and whether or not it can be resolved.


----------



## SaltInWound

diwali123 said:


> At that point it was just let's see how much hell I can make her life.


The silent treatment is about as close to hell as a person can get.


----------



## Trying2figureitout

SaltInWound said:


> The silent treatment is about as close to hell as a person can get.


I agree its basically equivalent to withholding sex/emotions

All three are pre-meditated and designed to* hurt your spouse* either consciously or sub-consciously.

I don't buy the "self-protection" argument..its payback for perceived resentments more or less. It is designed to hurt, payback, even the score whatever you want to call it to make you feel better.

Everyone holds the power to change their thoughts/mind once you decide to withhold X you have the power to give X.

Don't try rationalizing it ..call a spade a spade.


----------



## deejov

Trying2figureitout said:


> I agree its basically equivalent to withholding sex/emotions
> 
> All three are pre-meditated and designed to hurt your spouse.
> 
> I don't buy the "self-protection" argument..its payback for perceived resentments more or less.
> 
> 
> Everyone holds the power to change their thoughts/mind once you decide to withhold X you have the power to give X.
> 
> Don't try rationalizing it ..call a spade a spade.


Sure, no problem. I will willing say that I am full of resentment and withholding sex for payback.
That's how you will see it, anyways. 

However, my opinion and thoughts are what matters. And what you should consider. Otherwise, if you are not able to "see" things from your spouse's point of view, you will always be right and they will always be wrong. 

Does your wife see things your way? We know she doesn't. 
All you own in this world is just what you stated....

Everyone holds the power to change their thoughts/mind once you decide to withhold X you have the power to give X.

Listen to your own advice. She has the power to decide. You are right about that. She chooses not to. It's a boundary to give your most intimate part of yourself to someone who is not worthy of it, or if you are no longer, in your mind, in a committed relationship. 

It's called self respect, and it really is respect for YOU, too.


----------



## Created2Write

Trying2figureitout said:


> I agree its basically equivalent to withholding sex/emotions
> 
> All three are pre-meditated and designed to* hurt your spouse* either consciously or sub-consciously.
> 
> I don't buy the "self-protection" argument..its payback for perceived resentments more or less. It is designed to hurt, payback, even the score whatever you want to call it to make you feel better.
> 
> Everyone holds the power to change their thoughts/mind once you decide to withhold X you have the power to give X.
> 
> Don't try rationalizing it ..call a spade a spade.


I have an analogy here. Let's say you work in an incredibly stressful job. All jobs are stressful to a certain degree, but let's say this one is particularly so. You've done well at this job yourself and received a few raises and a promotion since you were hired on. Because of your hard work and success, your coworkers don't like you. They intentionally exclude you from things you used to be included in, they stop working nearly as hard as they had been working before, and they make it abundantly clear that they don't like you or respect you. In fact, it all culminates in a face-to-face confrontation wherein you are "called out" on things _they_ felt were shallow...i.e. they had done something dangerous and against the rules and, in an effort to keep your job safe, you did the right thing and told your superior about the situation. Now, they think you're a cutthroat. A guy who will step on anyone to gain favor from those above him. 

It's not true, of course. You _know_ that you did the right thing. You have a wife and children at home, and you would never risk getting yourself fired just to stay somewhat popular. But still, the words of the others upset you. They make you angry. Really angry. They cut you deep because you've always prided yourself on being a man of integrity. But, desiring to be the best man you can be, you emotionally detach yourself from the situation to better see if anything they have said is even remotely true. Emotions can, often, cloud our vision and make us extremely bias. By emotionally detaching and looking at the situation as if you were a third party, without the anger and hurt, you're more capable of seeing things how an unbiased person would see it. And, of course, if that person was even a remotely good worker, they would agree that you did the right thing. 

So, Trying, emotionally detaching is NOT always about punishing the person who hurt us. Emotions _do_ cloud our judgment. It's why women who are in physically abusive situations oftentimes _stay_ with the guy who is hitting them...they "love" him, they're scared to leave. Those emotions cloud reality and make it, nearly, impossible to see the truth. For women who have been neglected and put on the back burner for so long, it can be difficult to see things objectively without emotionally detaching. That detachment could mean the difference between a woman just up and divorcing her husband out of anger, or actually seeing that there _is_ something left to salvage. 

It's honorable that, for your marriage, you were willing to put up with just about anything and work through just about anything. But what if your wife had _not_ responded positively to your efforts? What if, as you continued to fight for your marriage, your wife had continued to move further and further away from reconciliation? What if she refused to go to counseling, even though you asked her dozens of times? What if she refused to respond to your personal efforts to change yourself or even acknowledge that you were trying at all? What if she told you that she didn't think anything was wrong in the marriage, even though you know there's a lot wrong because you're being denied sex, you're being denied emotional intimacy, you're being denied a chance to improve the marriage? 

For these women, they _have_ tried, and for much longer than you have. One women here said she'd tried to save her marriage for over fourteen years...ten years longer than you. Another said it was upwards of ten, six years longer than you. You even set a boundary...if, after four years, the sex hadn't returned in frequency, you would divorce. And yet these women were _still_ fighting tooth and nail to save their marriages long after the four year mark. 

You are in no place to judge them. Even if you have been 100% successful in your plan, you still haven't lived in their situation. The difference between your situation, where you were working on your marriage and your wife stilled pulled away, and these marriages here, is that their husbands _weren't_ working on their marriages. They were content to sit back and watch the marriage die, while the wives busted tail to try and keep some spark left. After five+ years of being the only one fighting for the marriage, you come and tell me if you still see things the same way.


----------



## Trying2figureitout

Created2Write said:


> I have an analogy here. Let's say you work in an incredibly stressful job. All jobs are stressful to a certain degree, but let's say this one is particularly so. You've done well at this job yourself and received a few raises and a promotion since you were hired on. Because of your hard work and success, your coworkers don't like you. They intentionally exclude you from things you used to be included in, they stop working nearly as hard as they had been working before, and they make it abundantly clear that they don't like you or respect you. In fact, it all culminates in a face-to-face confrontation wherein you are "called out" on things _they_ felt were shallow...i.e. they had done something dangerous and against the rules and, in an effort to keep your job safe, you did the right thing and told your superior about the situation. Now, they think you're a cutthroat. A guy who will step on anyone to gain favor from those above him.
> 
> It's not true, of course. You _know_ that you did the right thing. You have a wife and children at home, and you would never risk getting yourself fired just to stay somewhat popular. But still, the words of the others upset you. They make you angry. Really angry. They cut you deep because you've always prided yourself on being a man of integrity. But, desiring to be the best man you can be, you emotionally detach yourself from the situation to better see if anything they have said is even remotely true. Emotions can, often, cloud our vision and make us extremely bias. By emotionally detaching and looking at the situation as if you were a third party, without the anger and hurt, you're more capable of seeing things how an unbiased person would see it. And, of course, if that person was even a remotely good worker, they would agree that you did the right thing.
> 
> So, Trying, emotionally detaching is NOT always about punishing the person who hurt us. Emotions _do_ cloud our judgment. It's why women who are in physically abusive situations oftentimes _stay_ with the guy who is hitting them...they "love" him, they're scared to leave. Those emotions cloud reality and make it, nearly, impossible to see the truth. For women who have been neglected and put on the back burner for so long, it can be difficult to see things objectively without emotionally detaching. That detachment could mean the difference between a woman just up and divorcing her husband out of anger, or actually seeing that there _is_ something left to salvage.
> 
> It's honorable that, for your marriage, you were willing to put up with just about anything and work through just about anything. But what if your wife had _not_ responded positively to your efforts? What if, as you continued to fight for your marriage, your wife had continued to move further and further away from reconciliation? What if she refused to go to counseling, even though you asked her dozens of times? What if she refused to respond to your personal efforts to change yourself or even acknowledge that you were trying at all? What if she told you that she didn't think anything was wrong in the marriage, even though you know there's a lot wrong because you're being denied sex, you're being denied emotional intimacy, you're being denied a chance to improve the marriage?
> 
> For these women, they _have_ tried, and for much longer than you have. One women here said she'd tried to save her marriage for over fourteen years...ten years longer than you. Another said it was upwards of ten, six years longer than you. You even set a boundary...if, after four years, the sex hadn't returned in frequency, you would divorce. And yet these women were _still_ fighting tooth and nail to save their marriages long after the four year mark.
> 
> You are in no place to judge them. Even if you have been 100% successful in your plan, you still haven't lived in their situation. The difference between your situation, where you were working on your marriage and your wife stilled pulled away, and these marriages here, is that their husbands _weren't_ working on their marriages. They were content to sit back and watch the marriage die, while the wives busted tail to try and keep some spark left. After five+ years of being the only one fighting for the marriage, you come and tell me if you still see things the same way.



Fair enough... I did put a four year limit on "understanding" I too will emotionally detach if at that mark I am not satisfied with progress..feeling justified as I gave my wife this warning two years ago and re-affirmed a few months ago. She knows four years is it. That is all I'll give her and she is fully aware of the consequences. See I'm still at the take it or leave it mark its up to her to continue progress... so we'll see.

At least in my case she has been forewarned with plenty of time to respond...rather than just doing it out of the blue one day.


----------



## northernlights

Trying2figureitout said:


> Fair enough... I did put a four year limit on "understanding" I too will emotionally detach if at that mark I am not satisfied with progress..feeling justified as I gave my wife this warning two years ago and re-affirmed a few months ago. She knows four years is it. That is all I'll give her and she is fully aware of the consequences. See I'm still at the take it or leave it mark its up to her to continue progress... so we'll see.
> 
> At least in my case she has been forewarned with plenty of time to respond...rather than just doing it out of the blue one day.


Do you think you're so different from the rest of us? I told my husband 3 3/4 years ago that we were on a bad track and I felt myself pulling away from him. I told him that if we continued on the way we were, I didn't know if I would love him any more. I asked him to please not go there, because I didn't know if I was strong enough to get back out if we did. I told him we needed to do this together, because I couldn't do it by myself. 

Well, guess what? He didn't give a fvck. So don't sit there and tell me that I'm not keeping my vows. I'm Catholic, and even my church allows for divorce when one spouse won't be a spouse.


----------



## Created2Write

Trying2figureitout said:


> Fair enough... I did put a four year limit on "understanding" I too will emotionally detach if at that mark I am not satisfied with progress..feeling justified as I gave my wife this warning two years ago and re-affirmed a few months ago. She knows four years is it. That is all I'll give her and she is fully aware of the consequences. See I'm still at the take it or leave it mark its up to her to continue progress... so we'll see.
> 
> At least in my case she has been forewarned with plenty of time to respond...rather than just doing it out of the blue one day.


I'm sure the women here have _also_ communicated with their husbands _a lot_ over the years that they have been fighting for their marriages.


----------



## Created2Write

Trying, the greatest issue here is that you seem to assume a great deal about these women, people you've never met before. You assumed they were just resentful and emotionally detached to punish their husbands...when the hasn't been the case. You assumed they were just being selfish and lazy and pulling away because they didn't care about their husbands...which hasn't been the case. You assumed that this emotional detachment came out of the blue, without any warning, when that definitely hasn't been the case.

You're making too many assumptions here. You're not the only person who has a painful and disappointing marriage. And guess what? Not every man in this world cares about their wife. Not every man in this world wants to better their marriage. It IS possible that these husbands were scumbags who couldn't care less about whether their marriages lasted or not. Now, no one is saying that the marital issues are all the husband's fault. We all know that both spouses contribute to the state of the marriage. However, in these cases _only_ the wives actually wanted to work on the marriage, and they fought for years and years and years to do so. 

You really need to stop making so many assumptions. It only serves to upset people and make you seem like an ignorant jerk.


----------



## mkgal1

Usually when people disconnect after many years of trying (to no avail).............this is typically what it's about:


----------



## turnera

Created2Write said:


> I'm sure the women here have _also_ communicated with their husbands _a lot_ over the years that they have been fighting for their marriages.


 And THAT is the whole point of this thread, as well as the basis of the entire 'genre' of walkaway wives: women 'complain' about the marriage not living up to their expectations - i.e., the husband figuring once he's married he can stop paying attention to his wife - and men 'never hear' them. Until it's too late. And 'too late' translates into the women gradually shielding her heart from more ignoring and pain and wondering what's wrong with HER that he no longer cares about her - until they're no longer in love with him.

Now, if we could ensure that all 18 year olds take a course on His Needs Her Needs or something, they'd know what was really going on, and stop blaming themselves. And maybe take proactive steps to avoid it all.


----------



## janefw

JohnnyTheRomantic said:


> it is a deep personal choice to emotionally 'check out' of the marriage and entirely a personal one with many different dynamics. What my questions is, is after you made the choice what behaviours changed towards you H?


I have checked out over a long period of time, to where now, I really don't care too much about my husband or my marriage. 

My husband pulled the classic 'bait and switch'. He was crazy about me before marriage, and lost interest almost as soon as the engagement ring was on my finger. By the time we got married, we were no longer having sex. I thought that may be because I was pregnant, but after the child was born, he was no more enthusiastic than he had been before. For the first year of my marriage, we had sex maybe 3 times. At the time, I was so stunned and hurt and confused that I didn't like to ask why, but since then - we have been married for 14 years in November of this year - I have tried multiple time to restore the sexual contact within our marriage. I have begged, pleaded, remonstrated, cried, yelled, argued, prayed, sought counseling, blah blah blah. I did the sexy underwear, I lost weight, I dyed my hair, I looked up how to 'please' my man, I gave him every bit of love and affection and kindness that anyone could want (and more besides). I have raised his two children and our child as though they were all my biological kids. I went back to work when he became 'disabled' and I have worked every day that has been given to me since. I also am a full time student, trying to always increase that pay check you know. 

Over 11 years, he has been a SAHD other than a year in one job, and two months in another - at which point he said he hated the job so much he had to leave (yeah, I have hated some of my jobs too but had to stick it out), and at that point he went back on disability benefits. He promised me then that he would do all the work that we need to have done in our house, and the three years since then he has done .. nothing. He complains about the kids leaving out a dirty knife, but he never cleans up. He's the laziest person I have ever met in my life. All he wants are more toys. He currently has two motorcyles, neither of which we could afford, but he had tantrums until he got them. Now he doesn't ride any more. He spends money like water. He will NOT be accountable. I have to try to reinforce with him every month that we need to STOP SPENDING NOW. I did not go into marriage intending to be my h's mom, and I have resisted his every attempt to put me into that role, including him texting me to ask "can I get .." at which point I refer him to the spreadsheet that I keep sending to him, which clearly shows in b&w what stage our monthly budget is at. He hates that answer. He wants me to just say yes. It's b.s.

I cannot believe anything he promises. He has lied dead straight face to my face. He has carried out illicit, sneaking online relationships with other women - which may have turned physical at one point, but I don't know that - I don't trust him as far as I can throw him.

So, yeah, I am emotionally and physically completely and totally checked out. 

What did I stop doing? I stopped caring. When he says he doesn't feel well, I really don't care. I just ignore him. He's a hypochondriac too, so yeah, whatever. When he moans about something for a really long time, I tell him I will make him an appointment, just let me know to do it, but he never does, so I don't listen to his moans and groans and I don't care if he's sick. I do what 'needs' to be done when he's sick. I'll make those appointments, I'll go with him if he needs me to, and I'll pick up what he needs. But I dont really care if he has a cold or whatever. Boo hoo, get over it. 

I don't think about him. I really don't. I mean, this is the man that I worshipped - there's no other word for it. I made a massive, massive mistake and put him on SUCH a pedestal. He was my "god". Even 2 years ago I still thought the world of him. Now, I just don't. My whole day passes at work and I don't think of him unless he contacts me. Then I deal with whatever it is and move on with my day. 

I don't have any hope for the future nor daydream about what the rest of our lives will be together. In fact, I dread it. Right now, we still have a lot of time ahead with kids at home. The eldest is 21, and will graduate college in the fall, and then we expect him to be moving on - and he is ready to leave. The next one is 16, and the youngest 13. So we still have about another 10 years of child rearing. What we would do on our own, I can't imagine. He talks about us taking off and seeing the country, and I want to laugh in his face. How will we do that when, for one, _I_ will still be working? He seems to forget about my job when it's convenient for him - and yet my job pays all the freakin' bills. I guess we are going to be millionaires in 10 years. Also, I can't imagine how boring that will be when we have nothing to talk about and no sex life. Maybe 'see the country' means 'see lots of young chicks that aren't your wife', because the way he stares at young women is really, really creepy. 

Why don't I leave him? Because the two kids of his first marriage already went through one divorce. I don't want them to experience a second. And our kid - he doesn't deserve to have that happen. Most of the time, we rub along alright, pretty much like roommates. It's not what I wanted for marriage but it's what I've got.


----------



## KevinLW

I hear you all and sympathize with you, but you women have to understand that the way you treat us men sometimes make us become emotionally detached as well. 

We are at the bottom of the totem poll when it comes to your everyday lives. Most of you love God first, and then your male pastors (and you obey every word from this guy's mouth), then your girlfriends (which you tell every little detail of your marriage to, and i've learned recently that when women hang out, they love getting tipsy. They're cuddling up to and snuggling up with their girlfriends which in a way seems much better to women than the affection your husband's could ever give you), then kids (which of course the husband should love just as much as his wife does). Last, but definitely not least, the male co-workers that obviously wants a piece of our wives (but she pretends not to notice how these guys are always staring at her like a piece of meat). 

When this happens, the husband feels that he has to compete with every other person that is in his wife's life. My wife became detached and i sat her down and explained why i became started acting the way i did. I got upset, and mean, and very emotional because i felt like i was losing her.

Im writing this in hopes that women would understand that these are some of main reasons why men cheat!! If you all are so emotionally detached from him, maybe you should suck it up and file for divorce and let him find a relationship where he is actually loved!! We are all humans which means we all are not perfect!!!


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## turnera

Uh, most of us don't even go to church any more.

I get that you've been hurt, but you are WAY over-generalizing and placing your situation on the shoulders of all women.


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## KevinLW

This is my point. you say im over-generalizing and most of you dont go to church anymore. So, those cars that block all the streets on sunday contain only men? Statistically, women go to church waay more than men do. I've done the research. Plus, most of the women my wife and I know go to church.

How am i placing my situation on womens shoulders? This is why some men act the way they do. Im not taking up for men who abuse their wives and girlfriends. Im talking about men who work hard, loves their kids, and then have to deal with a woman who walks around with a frown on her face everyday for some odd reason, and never wants to talk about it.


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## turnera

KevinLW said:


> I hear you all and sympathize with you, but *you women* have to understand that *the way you treat us* men sometimes make us become emotionally detached as well.
> 
> We are at the bottom of the totem poll when it comes to *your everyday lives*. *Most of you* love God first, and then your male pastors (and you obey every word from this guy's mouth), then your girlfriends (which you tell every little detail of your marriage to, and i've learned recently that *when women hang out, they love getting tipsy*. They're cuddling up to and snuggling up with their girlfriends which in a way seems much better to women than the affection your husband's could ever give you), then kids (which of course the husband should love just as much as his wife does). Last, but definitely not least, the male co-workers that obviously wants a piece of our wives (but she pretends not to notice how these guys are always staring at her like a piece of meat).
> 
> When this happens, the husband feels that he has to compete with every other person that is in his wife's life. My wife became detached and i sat her down and explained why i became started acting the way i did. *I got upset, and mean*, and very emotional because i felt like i was losing her.
> 
> Im writing this in hopes that women would understand that *these are some of main reasons why men cheat*!! If you all are so emotionally detached from him, maybe you should suck it up and file for divorce and let him find a relationship where he is actually loved!! We are all humans which means we all are not perfect!!!


Not generalizing? See above in bold. And, of course, it's the women's fault that men are 'forced' to cheat, right? 

meh


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## turnera

KevinLW said:


> This is my point. you say im over-generalizing and most of you dont go to church anymore. So, those cars that block all the streets on sunday contain only men? Statistically, women go to church waay more than men do. I've done the research. Plus, most of the women my wife and I know go to church.


I said MOST OF US - meaning most people. Religion is down all over the world.



KevinLW said:


> then have to deal with a woman *who walks around with a frown on her face everyday for some odd reason, and never wants to talk about it*.


Sounds like you just have no idea that women ARE different from men in terms of reacting to things. Read some books about it, if you're having so much trouble seeing your marriage from your wife's point of view. Start with His Needs Her Needs, which explains it all very well. Read it together. It will change everything. Assuming you have an open mind, of course, and are not continuing to be _upset and mean_. If you are, you are ensuring that she will leave you eventually.


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## KevinLW

ok. i will read it. i also have two girls and a boy. they are all wondering why she's acting the way she is. About her leaving, i think i will be the one leaving first. Im a person that puts his family first and i honestly think shes tired of having a family. When shes with her friends, she has the biggest smile on her face and she always says shes having the time of her life. I think im gonna do the leaving so I can be happy again as well. I wash my own clothes, cook most of the food, take care of the yard, im in two different colleges studying for my computer science degree, and i take care of my kids!! Im also tired!!! 

thank you turnera for book advice. i will pick it up.


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## turnera

Start your own thread so we can give you targeted advice. I'm sure that there are lots of things you can do to fix this marriage before you just give up. (and I am NOT talking about you doing MORE, just doing smarter)


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## KevinLW

i think i will. thanks.


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby

KevinLW said:


> I hear you all and sympathize with you, but you women have to understand that the way you treat us men sometimes make us become emotionally detached as well.
> 
> We are at the bottom of the totem poll when it comes to your everyday lives. Most of you love God first, and then your male pastors (and you obey every word from this guy's mouth), then your girlfriends (which you tell every little detail of your marriage to, and i've learned recently that when women hang out, they love getting tipsy. They're cuddling up to and snuggling up with their girlfriends which in a way seems much better to women than the affection your husband's could ever give you), then kids (which of course the husband should love just as much as his wife does). Last, but definitely not least, the male co-workers that obviously wants a piece of our wives (but she pretends not to notice how these guys are always staring at her like a piece of meat).
> 
> When this happens, the husband feels that he has to compete with every other person that is in his wife's life. My wife became detached and i sat her down and explained why i became started acting the way i did. I got upset, and mean, and very emotional because i felt like i was losing her.
> 
> Im writing this in hopes that women would understand that these are some of main reasons why men cheat!! If you all are so emotionally detached from him, maybe you should suck it up and file for divorce and let him find a relationship where he is actually loved!! We are all humans which means we all are not perfect!!!


A) I don't go to church(I'm housebound)

B) My husband comes first before anything else. I very highly value my marriage and so does my husband. Our kids come a very close second. 

C) I tell my friends nothing! My husband is my one and only best friend. I only have 100% trust in my husband. I do not go out and I do not drink.

D) I'm a disabled SAHM, but if I did work I would not ever flirt with another man. I do not take notice of other men where ever I'm at. My husband is number one in my life and I would never disrespect him.

E) Most of all, there is absolutely nothing in this world that can justify an affair.

It's not fair to generalize of most women. Just as it's not fair to generalize of most men.


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## KevinLW

i agree with you. i shouldnt generalize, and i feel that a person shouldnt put anyone above their spouses. i was a little too upset with that reply.


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## TCSRedhead

KevinLW said:


> I hear you all and sympathize with you, but you women have to understand that the way you treat us men sometimes make us become emotionally detached as well.
> 
> We are at the bottom of the totem poll when it comes to your everyday lives. Most of you love God first, and then your male pastors (and you obey every word from this guy's mouth), then your girlfriends (which you tell every little detail of your marriage to, and i've learned recently that when women hang out, they love getting tipsy. They're cuddling up to and snuggling up with their girlfriends which in a way seems much better to women than the affection your husband's could ever give you), then kids (which of course the husband should love just as much as his wife does). Last, but definitely not least, the male co-workers that obviously wants a piece of our wives (but she pretends not to notice how these guys are always staring at her like a piece of meat).
> 
> When this happens, the husband feels that he has to compete with every other person that is in his wife's life. My wife became detached and i sat her down and explained why i became started acting the way i did. I got upset, and mean, and very emotional because i felt like i was losing her.
> 
> Im writing this in hopes that women would understand that these are some of main reasons why men cheat!! If you all are so emotionally detached from him, maybe you should suck it up and file for divorce and let him find a relationship where he is actually loved!! We are all humans which means we all are not perfect!!!


If that is how your Christian wife is treating you, she isn't following the path set out in the Bible. God does come first, then your husband, then family. 

For the husband, God first, then wife, then family.

It's when the priorities and attention is lost that marriage begins declining.

While we don't attend church nor are we overly religious in many ways, we do follow this pattern in our marriage and I can say it does work for us.


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## badcompany

Jellybeans said:


> 1. Stopped contacting him as much on the phone
> 2. Stopped doing little things for him
> 3. Stopped asking him to go places/events with me (since he never wanted to go anyway)
> 4. Stopped being emotionally vulnerable w/ him
> 5. Definitely not sexually attracted to him
> 6. Stopped trying to have a serious conversation
> 7. Stopped taking him serious
> 8. Stopped having respect for him
> 9. Started to resent him
> 10. Stopped trying to make it work



So I'm seeing 7 to 8 of these things from my wife. The thing is, she resents me for things beyond my control during the last few years, a crappy economy and tough times that didn't allow her material needs to be met, and I was in such constant back pain for such a long time that I didn't get any rem sleep and wasn't very pleasant to be around. I would just start to get into some good sleep and my back would bind up so tight and hurt it would wake me up and I'd have to change position.
I had surgery finally and for the first time in years I am getting some decent sleep, I am feeling better and trying to better meet her needs to get her to check back in but it's not working, in fact she's getting worse.


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## TCSRedhead

badcompany said:


> So I'm seeing 7 to 8 of these things from my wife. The thing is, she resents me for things beyond my control during the last few years, a crappy economy and tough times that didn't allow her material needs to be met, and I was in such constant back pain for such a long time that I didn't get any rem sleep and wasn't very pleasant to be around. I would just start to get into some good sleep and my back would bind up so tight and hurt it would wake me up and I'd have to change position.
> I had surgery finally and for the first time in years I am getting some decent sleep, I am feeling better and trying to better meet her needs to get her to check back in but it's not working, in fact she's getting worse.


That's a lot of where I was. Try talking to her directly about it. Own the parts where you were not doing that, talk about what you both need and start fresh. Just do it.


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## badcompany

TCSRedhead said:


> That's a lot of where I was. Try talking to her directly about it. Own the parts where you were not doing that, talk about what you both need and start fresh. Just do it.


I have, more than once, and I get stonewalled with #6 and #7.


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## Created2Write

KevinLW said:


> I hear you all and sympathize with you, but you women have to understand that the way you treat us men sometimes make us become emotionally detached as well.
> 
> We are at the bottom of the totem poll when it comes to your everyday lives. Most of you love God first,


As a professing Christian, yes I love God first...as I should. 



> and then your male pastors (and you obey every word from this guy's mouth),


Um, no. I have had many issues with the pastors I have had over the years, and left many churches because of those issues. I obey _God_, and the laws of this land...nothing and no one else. 



> then your girlfriends (which you tell every little detail of your marriage to, and i've learned recently that when women hang out, they love getting tipsy. They're cuddling up to and snuggling up with their girlfriends which in a way seems much better to women than the affection your husband's could ever give you),


Wrong again. I have only two girlfriends that I would even trust the details of my marriage with, and even _then_ I don't tell them every little detail. I don't gossip or complain to my girlfriends. _If_ I ever tell them of an issue I've had, it's one that has been dealt with, and I only tell them of it to help _them_. I give my girlfriends hugs, of course. I'm a very physically affectionate person and I don't get to see my closest friends very often. One of them lives in the UK, a handful of them live either out of this state or hours away from me so I rarely see them; I cuddle with them because I miss them, but I certainly _don't_ prefer it to the affection I get from my husband. Nothing could ever compare to what I feel when I receive his affection.



> then kids (which of course the husband should love just as much as his wife does).


They're your kids...you _should_ love them, as should your wife. 



> Last, but definitely not least, the male co-workers that obviously wants a piece of our wives (but she pretends not to notice how these guys are always staring at her like a piece of meat).


Some of us really don't notice other men because, frankly, we don't _care_ about other men and whether or not they're staring. I sure don't. 



> When this happens, the husband feels that he has to compete with every other person that is in his wife's life. My wife became detached and i sat her down and explained why i became started acting the way i did. I got upset, and mean, and very emotional because i felt like i was losing her.
> 
> Im writing this in hopes that women would understand that these are some of main reasons why men cheat!! If you all are so emotionally detached from him, maybe you should suck it up and file for divorce and let him find a relationship where he is actually loved!! We are all humans which means we all are not perfect!!!


And why do the women detach? Do you think that it's because the husband's have done everything they can to show how crazy they are about their wives? Some husband's _don't_ show affection to their wives; some husband's _don't_ take their wive's needs seriously. Some women detach out of spite, I'm sure. Others feel it's the only way they can keep from going crazy. 

I'm sorry about your personal situation, but perhaps you should examine your own actions to make sure that you really have been there for your wife. You may think you have, but if she were asked, what would _she_ say? And maybe you have. Perhaps your wife is just spiteful. But there are other marriages where the husband hasn't met his wife's needs, and you're doing them a great disservice by assuming that those wives are just cruel and don't care.


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## sugarbunny

stopped wearing wedding band. stopped calling him during the day to see how he's doing. doing things and going places without him. I don't care what he thinks or does. I don't picture my future with him. Like I've told him. I don't care. After 20 years in this relationship. I look at him and I see a big whiney, lazy, looser. I have no respect for him. I can't stand him. I don't trust him. I have changed the most within the last year. I'm doing my own thing. Don't ask for or want his opinion. If he doesn't like it he can hit the road. I'v had enough.


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## jen53

it doesn't seem to be a conscious choice - I started to realise husband wasn't thinking of me when we had sex, so my body switched off - the pain associated with the anticipation of love and intimacy being met by rejection, or leading on, twisting it to try to make me dress him, play his games - seemed to end any sexual feelings arising in me.
the constant worrying about what he was doing, wore me down, and my pleadings, questions, trying to please amounted to nothing -it was as if a light switch turned off.
I can't talk about feelings, our future, all the thoughts of a future together went out of my mind. I am scared as I am in a limbo, knowing we are finished but not knowing what to do about it. Hence I have gone into myself re running past events etc almost debriefing myself out of what I thought was a perect marriage and I find I have lost any need to argue, chat, talk of future or love - disconnecting, odd after so long of being in denial and trying to hang onto my love for him..its as if I realised he wasn't the person I thought, all trust and faith in his intentions etc have gone, I grieve for a lost person, my love - its scarey, but it has happened without me planning it to-I used to dread falling out of love with him


----------



## Emotionally Distant Wife

I stopped the following:

1. making his lunch for work
2. cleaning the house other than the basic, cleaning up after dinner, cleaning the bathroom.
3. stopped doing his laundry
4. stopped going to church with him
5. stopped planning activities to do together.
6. stopped trying to have conversation with him other than necessary things around the house. Did you feed the dog? Have to talked to adult children? etc..
7. go to bed & get up at different times than spouse.
8. Do not call during the day unless it is absolutely necessary. No small talk. Only necessary conversation.
9. Stopped going to work functions/co worker functions with spouse.
10. Stopped buying cards/gifts for holidays, birthdays, anniversaries etc.
11. Planned a vacation without spouse
12. I told him that it didn't matter what he did, ( says he is helping more around the house, not yelling, being nicer etc) it's too late. 
13. No Intimacy (sex, hugging, kissing, holding hands, cuddling, no touching period)

My husband is upset that I do not go to church with him any more. He confronted me about it and I just said I didn't want to go anywhere with him that in my opinion he is a great big hypocrite. How he can sit in church and act like the happy couple when he acts awful at home is beyond me. I can not sit there at present an all is good appearance so therefore I refuse to go. He has told church members that have asked why I haven't been in church that I am a "Non Believer" now. He told me this, I think just to start an argument. All he got from me " Was that necessary to say that" and I walked off. I refuse to argue with him. 


He told me that he knew I was upset, he knew he had been wrong and that he was trying to change. However I see no difference. He feels like he has changed due to the fact that he isn't yelling as much. However, he just doesn't realize that all the yelling and mean behavior has done nothing but develop and strong ability in me to ignore everything he says & does. 

We both know that to divorce after all these years would be absolute financial ruin for the both of us, it would cause much distress to our adult children. So I have decided to tough it out and live my own life within the confines of the marriage but I will not be a wife to him


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## UnicornCupcake

Oh man, there are MILLION signs we've checked out before we cut back on sex.

The biggest one for me is silence. If I'm talking less it means I don't want to communicate with him.
A lot of head nodding and "ok" 
Basically, if she's silent for awhile be very ****ign worried


----------



## Lostinthought61

Hi, This is old thread, what your saying has validity but should start your own thread so the form can respond just to your your situation.


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## NobodySpecial

Trying2figureitout said:


> It is very interesting to hear how ladies check out.... and feel totally justified..really?
> 
> Seems weird as a guy.
> 
> How on Earth do you feel justified to do this to the husbands you PROMISED in from of your friends, family and if you believe in God..god to love until death do you part?
> 
> Seems VERY petty to me as a man. Who's the adult?


It must be the one who promised to love and ... woa... cherish. Must be that guy who ignored for years. Are you reading the same thread?


----------



## NobodySpecial

Lostinthought61 said:


> Hi, This is old thread, what your saying has validity but should start your own thread so the form can respond just to your your situation.


Woops.


----------



## Handy

*........he has always told me were stupid (tarot cards)*

There is a lot of good advice from both sides but mostly what the women talk about. 

Tarot Cards?????? Maybe knocking on wood makes things come true too, along with a lot of other superstitions.

It is difficult for me to understand why some people consider tarot cards to be something to believe in.

Believing in some things does not make it true.


----------



## NobodySpecial

Handy said:


> *........he has always told me were stupid (tarot cards)*
> 
> There is a lot of good advice from both sides but mostly what the women talk about.
> 
> Tarot Cards?????? Maybe knocking on wood makes things come true too, along with a lot of other superstitions.
> 
> It is difficult for me to understand why some people consider tarot cards to be something to believe in.
> 
> Believing in some things does not make it true.


Neither is pretty much anything one sees on tv. Or video games. It is still fun.


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## Handy

* Nobody Special
..It is still fun.*

OK I can live with fun but some people take tarot cards half way serious.


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## Wifeynow

When I checked out, I try not to start conversations unless they are about "business things" (finances, something that needs to be done to the house, like that). I am even toned, but with no affection in my voice. I sleep in another room ( which is unnecessary, he hasn't wanted sex in years). I never touch him, do not say "I love you," or anything remotely like that. I do not phone him at work, and at home try to stay in my room unless I am cooking or doing some other form of housework. Got any suggestions for some more?


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## pLaTesPinNeR

I know this is an old thread....

I'm feeling myself check out currently. I guess I'm wondering how long most are able to function and tolerate living this way? It's so awkward and uncomfortable? I am sure it's different for everyone, but in my situation I can not make a move to leave before the end of June. The idea of being this detached and negative for that long feels so toxic to me. I can tell my kids can feel it, even though we never argue or anything in front of them. They can just feel it. H left our bed 8 days ago when he began silent treatment, so they see he's sleeping on the couch, and vaguely grunting responses at me when I engage him (minimally - only about kids/pets/home, etc.). 

It's palpable - my whole family can feel it. We were at my parents last sunday and my mom, dad, brother and sister in law all separately cornered me asking if I was alright and what was going on. It was really uncomfortable.

I just so desperately want to get out of here, so I don't have to feel this any more. 8 months is a long time. Roughly how long did you ladies live this way, and were you able to make it more bearable in some ways?


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## SpicyGinger

Stopped being interested in sex or anything that involved us doing things as a couple.


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## Debbie 59

bailingout said:


> I didn't make the "choice" to check out, it just progressed over time as a result of being in an unhealthy relationship with someone who doesn't think it's unhealthy.
> 
> As for actions, same as most of the others. No desire for sex, to communicate (other than necessities), didn't care if he was here or not or where he went or when he'd be back.
> 
> Stopped reacting or trying to resolve issues or give my opinion on things because it was just waste of time and energy.
> 
> Just live life doing what I need to do for me and D. If he's around or not, really doesn't make a difference to me.
> 
> I meet most of my needs myself, and between friends and our D, most of the rest are also met regularly.
> 
> Surprisingly, I've been happier the last few months than I'd been in many years. As far as him, as someone else said "just going through the motions."



I can understand this, I started to do things myself no longer asking him to come along. As I'm typing this he sitting one room I'm in the other. I have the T.V just to have sound in the house If not there will be nothing more them quiet
There no talking anymore, its just a need to know thing. So we are going through the motions like you. I just got tried of trying to keep things together.


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## turnera

Debbie, why not just make plans to move on? Start a new life?


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