# Am I headed for nasty divorce?



## timeforpain (Apr 29, 2012)

I was active here on TAM about 6 mons ago and I got some good advice. I have been out of the marital home 6 months now, but I still have not filed; at first because I was still making sure divorce was the answer for us. Now, I am sure. But my wife refused to cooperate until more time passed, and I have been HOPING hoping hoping for an amicable divorce. So I waited and here we are in mid-December.

In a couples' counseling session last week (only our 2nd such session in 6 months), I said I was done. I didn't want to try any more. She was crying and sad. I felt like the worst person on earth.

The next day I drove over to get my two kids for the weekend as usual. My 7yr old was diagnosed with Type 1 Diabetes last month, so we have to pass a bag with needles, testing kit, insulin shots, etc., back-and-forth to manage his care. She was *ANGRY*. Visibly angry. When I knocked on the door, she opened it and tossed the kids' backpacks and the insulin bag out the door on to the concrete walkway. Needles and other paraphernalia spilled out; I bent down and picked it all up....this is the new tone of our relationship now I guess. 

I am giving her 70% of my monthly take-home so she can pay the mortgage and other bills, plus eat, etc. I live on the remaining $1,600; but in order to do so, I have a rented a $600/mon room with my best friend (who is also my wife's brother). Today she told my brother-in-law that he should kick me out; in fact, she said SHE would like the privilege of doing it.

Where else but in this kind of situation do I give the vast majority of my paycheck to someone who is actively trying to jeopardize that same paycheck? I spend my days working to pay her way and she (unemployed) spends her days trying to sabotage me.

So, after that long-winded lead up... the question for you is this: is it time to give up on the "amicable divorce" and just have her served? I'm certain it will make her even more angry, but I'm not seeing much of a chance that waiting any longer holds much hope for filing as co-petitioners and doing this cooperatively.

I'm wondering if some of you will say "you just dropped a bomb on her... she's upset... give it time and see if she calms down... it would be worth it if you can work together on this." Does anyone want to advocate that?


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

First off stop giving her so much of your paycheck. When you go to court she can argue that this is status quo thus you have to give her that much forever.

Instead find out what your rights are. How much is child support? How much is any spousal support? For how long. These things take into consideration her income as well.

What you can do is take over paying bills yourself for things like the mortgage, etc.

So see an attorney and get a plan in place.

You might want to write her an email or letter telling her that her doing things that will hurt your job will in turn cause less money for her. So she needs to but it out.


----------



## timeforpain (Apr 29, 2012)

I don't know if this blog post has been floated around here before, but it sounds strongly reminiscent of my wife and me.

Divorce and High-Conflict People: Borderlines, Narcissists, Histrionics, Sociopaths and Other Persuasive Blamers « A Shrink for Men


----------



## timeforpain (Apr 29, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> First off stop giving her so much of your paycheck. When you go to court she can argue that this is status quo thus you have to give her that much forever.


The law stipulates that temporary arrangements cannot be used to set terms of the decree. But, that said, your warning agrees with much of the advice I've gotten from lawyers: that I am setting a dangerous precedent.

However, if I give her much less, she will be unable to pay the mortgage and feed herself. (Unless she gets a job, but who knows if/when that's happening....)



> Instead find out what your rights are. How much is child support? How much is any spousal support? For how long. These things take into consideration her income as well.


Child support is on a fixed formula (based on an array of other items like the amount of alimony, each spouse's income, health insurance, etc). But the spousal support is based on a long list of things and subject to a judge's discretion. And since we don't even have a "Petition for Dissolution" filed, there are no orders.

Lawyers are not calling me back this week... too close to Christmas I guess.



> What you can do is take over paying bills yourself for things like the mortgage, etc.


That's actually a great idea. Thank you.



> You might want to write her an email or letter telling her that her doing things that will hurt your job will in turn cause less money for her. So she needs to but it out.


Yeah, your suggestion assumes that she's open to a rational argument. But, as many here know... angry people don't necessarily act in their own best interest.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

timeforpain said:


> However, if I give her much less, she will be unable to pay the mortgage and feed herself. (Unless she gets a job, but who knows if/when that's happening....)


Is the house in your name as well as hers?
I think you completely missed what I was saying. YOU pay the mortgage. Don’t give her the $$ to pay the mortgage. Hand her as little money as you can. So you pay the mortgage, the gas, electric, etc. 
Another point, if you give her the money you have no idea if she is actually paying the bills with it.



timeforpain said:


> Child support is on a fixed formula (based on an array of other items like the amount of alimony, each spouse's income, health insurance, etc). But the spousal support is based on a long list of things and subject to a judge's discretion. And since we don't even have a "Petition for Dissolution" filed, there are no orders.


There are different kinds of spousal support. 1) Interim, 2) rehabilitative 3) long term

Interim support is what one spouse pays the other while the divorce is in progress but not final. 

Rehabilitative is for shorter term marriages, IT’s paid for some fixed period of time to let the SAHM/D get back in the job market. It’s paid after the divorce is final. It’s often for half the length of the marriage.

Long term is, well long term and can be lifelong. It’s paid after the divorce is final. 

Until there is a court order you do not have to give her anything so you are going way overboard right now.

Your wife has a very good education and earning ability. Unless you earn quite a lot more than she would in her field you won’t have support to pay for long. What you need to do right now is to put some pressure on her so that you two don’t lose anything like the house, our children are taken care of … but she feels the pressure to set serious about job hunting.

Also figure out what the interim support would be. Don’t know what state you are in… in California the below site is used to calculate interim child support and spousal support. It takes both your and her income into consideration. 

https://www.cse.ca.gov/ChildSupport/cse/guidelineCalculator

Then she gets child support + interim spousal support. You don’t pay any bills above that for her. She will need to live within that amount of income or go get a job.


----------



## timeforpain (Apr 29, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> Is the house in your name as well as hers?


The house is in both our names. And the loan is through her parents.



> I think you completely missed what I was saying. YOU pay the mortgage. Don’t give her the $$ to pay the mortgage. Hand her as little money as you can. So you pay the mortgage, the gas, electric, etc.


No, no... I did understand and I think it's a brilliant idea.



> Another point, if you give her the money you have no idea if she is actually paying the bills with it.


The joint checking acct is "her" account. I have my own separate account now that my paycheck deposits to. But I am still on the joint, so I know the bills are being paid because I see them being auto-paid via withdrawals from the joint acct. What I don't see is what that $3k-$4k per month on her separate credit card is buying.



> Long term is, well long term and can be lifelong. It’s paid after the divorce is final.


The mere mention of this sends chills. We have been married 11 years, but she has a doctorate from 2001, and now a master's degree as well (2012). She has worked as a veterinarian (2000-2002) and as a researcher (sporadically from 2004-2012) with decent pay. She quit her job after I moved out (sigh) but I would assume most judges would insist she return to work and would not award her a ton of maintenance... but I have no idea how this will play out.



> Until there is a court order you do not have to give her anything so you are going way overboard right now.


I'm easily manipulated with guilt and she says "the kids need snow boots" or "DS broke the sliding glass door" and she needs money. I don't have the heart to say "let them wear plastic bags over their shoes" or "too bad.. live with it" so I pay.



> Your wife has a very good education and earning ability. Unless you earn quite a lot more than she would in her field you won’t have support to pay for long. What you need to do right now is to put some pressure on her so that you two don’t lose anything like the house, our children are taken care of … but she feels the pressure to set serious about job hunting.


If she had kept her vet job, she'd be making $122k/yr according to a co-worker at that hospital. That's more than I make (I make $108k/yr). But I've been making $20k-$30k on the side for the past few months (I know, it's ridiculous, but it's temporary income) so she feels there is no reason for her to return to work. Of course I don't think I can sustain working two jobs for much longer... 



> Also figure out what the interim support would be. Don’t know what state you are in… in California the below site is used to calculate interim child support and spousal support. It takes both your and her income into consideration.


I'm in Colorado. Our temporary maintenance is only for families making < $75k/yr so we don't fit there, but that formula is 40% of my gross minus 50% of hers. Since hers is 0, that's 40% of mine only, so $3600 per month. 

We also have a child-support worksheet that would grant another $150/mon to my wife, bringing the total to $3750 per month. I am giving her $4200, so yeah... $450 higher than that formula would require (although once again, it doesn't apply to us anyway).



> Then she gets child support + interim spousal support. You don’t pay any bills above that for her. She will need to live within that amount of income or go get a job.


She is begging me to reconsider and I'm trying to be steadfast and say "No, I think it's time to end this."

Piling on top of this with "Oh, and you need to get a job because I'm cutting support" is just more pain than I can inflict right now.

Thanks so much for your replies elegirl. You're my hero. :smthumbup:


----------

