# Opposite of "If You Are In a Good marriage"



## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

In the "If You Are In a Good marriage" thread, the poster asked if one ever wonders why your spouse loves you as much as they do, even though you know you have faults, yet, they seem to love you anyway no matter what, and you don't often feel you deserve it. It's a sense of mystery.

I wanted to look at this from the opposite standpoint. Has anyone ever gotten a divorce or broken up with someone and wondered the opposite? You evaluate yourself, and you seem like a good catch. Everybody has faults, sure, but you can't pinpoint anything worse than you've heard others talk about. You have a good job, physically attractive, etc.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Do you mean, someone who can't figure out what made the other person want to end the relationship?


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## Luvher4life (Jan 15, 2016)

Are you saying that if you do love someone and they don't love you back?

I was in love with two different women before I met my current wife. I guess both of them just wanted sex, but I wanted more. I guess they just wanted to be friends with benefits instead of a relationship. Each of those relationship lasted many months. I guess if I would've just gone into those relationships with the same intent I wouldn't have gotten my heart broken, but it's all good. I am truly blessed that neither of those relationships worked out. It did work on my psyche, though. It made me wonder if anybody actually could love me, and made me think that I might not be good relationship material.

By the way, I had a good job, my own place, and most consider me very attractive. I'm likely not as attractive now as I was then, but still...


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

southbound said:


> In the "If You Are In a Good marriage" thread, the poster asked if one ever wonders why your spouse loves you as much as they do, even though you know you have faults, yet, they seem to love you anyway no matter what, and you don't often feel you deserve it. It's a sense of mystery.
> 
> I wanted to look at this from the opposite standpoint. Has anyone ever gotten a divorce or broken up with someone and wondered the opposite? You evaluate yourself, and you seem like a good catch. Everybody has faults, sure, but you can't pinpoint anything worse than you've heard others talk about. You have a good job, physically attractive, etc.


In their own eyes, everyone is a good catch.


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## SunnyT (Jun 22, 2011)

I'm a good catch, and a good wife.... but the ex said he didn't want to be married anymore. Said he just didn't want to do it. Of course this was 23 years and 5 kids later. Said I was the best thing that ever happened to him as he walked away. Blah, blah, blah....


I, as a mature adult, know that there is a lot more to it than "I don't want to be married anymore". That was 12 years ago. I've since found a sweet, smart man. We've been together ten. We appreciate the whole partnership/teamwork concept.


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

Livvie said:


> Do you mean, someone who can't figure out what made the other person want to end the relationship?


Yes.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

unbelievable said:


> In their own eyes, everyone is a good catch.


I feel we're only a good catch for someone who is compatible with our brand of weirdness... I mean that in all seriousness.....so being a "good catch" has everything to do with WHO the other person IS - seeing their dynamics "together". 

For everyone who is reasonably healthy minded, without addictions, free from personality disorders/ untreated mental illness, decent communication skills, a sex drive...above average looks, attitude... they could have all that going for them.. yet still make a horrible match with another who is healthy in those ways...

It's surely a complicated maze of sorts to find someone who doesn't mind putting up with our individual quirks.. some may even find them endearing....who welcomes a little neediness in this area, but not in that other area!... how we deal with conflict may drive one crazy.. yet someone else would appreciate it ...

Our sense of humor is another...I've met people others think are hilarious & I just think they are a royal A-hole.. So many little things can make or break a relationship.. where someone else may appreciate what some other person couldn't stand about them...


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

I'm such a good catch I need a forklift to pick myself up. 

However, the audience assumes that a catch is evaluated on the sum of its merits, like the SAT. Look at me, I'm Mr. 2390, all hail 😂

Not quite.

The evaluation is made only on the attributes that the other person cares about. Maybe the 10 points I missed on the SAT is what she cares the most.


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## Lilac23 (Jul 9, 2015)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I feel we're only a good catch for someone who is compatible with our brand of weirdness... I mean that in all seriousness.....so being a "good catch" has everything to do with WHO the other person IS - seeing their dynamics "together".


We are all a little weird and life's a little weird, and when we find someone whose weirdness is compatible with ours, we join up with them and fall in mutual weirdness and call it love.
- Dr. Seuss


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

john117 said:


> I'm such a good catch I need a forklift to pick myself up.
> 
> However, the audience assumes that a catch is evaluated on the sum of its merits, like the SAT. Look at me, I'm Mr. 2390, all hail 😂
> 
> ...


And, it's quite possible she didn't know those last ten points were what was most important to her until she married.

She could also have changed her mind about which points were important, after marriage. 

Sometimes, she doesn't even know. Not to worry, there are plenty more out there who aren't sure, either.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Lilac23 said:


> We are all a little weird and life's a little weird, and when we find someone whose weirdness is compatible with ours, we join up with them and fall in mutual weirdness and call it love.
> - Dr. Seuss


 Yep !! I have put this little ditty on here numerous times.. even if it's Dr Seuss..it gets to the heart of it ...that "weirdness" = quirks, personality traits, what we love, what we hate...we all have different shades & tastes, turn off's & turn on's...

We've all met couples where one "compliments" the other's personalty...the Yin & the Yang is play....sure makes for a smoother ride..


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

2ntnuf said:


> And, it's quite possible she didn't know those last ten points were what was most important to her until she married.
> 
> She could also have changed her mind about which points were important, after marriage.
> 
> Sometimes, she doesn't even know. Not to worry, there are plenty more out there who aren't sure, either.


This is the other problem... I did 2 threads on this... trying to understand WHY people change.. or how they change.. that causes so many problems after the vows.. 

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/genera...y-change-over-years-how-have-you-changed.html

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/genera...ng-vows-now-who-what-why-could-weathered.html

With my own Mother.. she told me she married too young, never loved my dad.. and was completely Naive...(her words)...and I can attest they had virtually nothing in common except for having me & they were both savers...

With them..I believe sex blinded them from all the other important stuff... my Father was convinced he was in love.. but he really didn't take the time to get to know her on deeper levels.. and she just "went along" , caught up in that whirlwind stage...


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

My wife posted this to my FB timeline about 8 months ago. I posted this on TAM before, but I love it so I am putting it up again. @SimplyAmorous, this ties into what you are saying.










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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

unbelievable said:


> In their own eyes, everyone is a good catch.


that may be true to a point, but I think some people, if they are a lazy bum with no job, for example, might be able to notice a major flaw.

The puzzle for me is when a man can sometimes lie, cheat, abuse, and any other thing he can think of, but the wife just can't give him up. I've often wondered what could be so great about a person that it overshadows all those negatives. At the same time, what could be so bad about a caring, employed, loving, attractive, man without those negatives that would make a woman turn away. 

I guess I must have spent too much time around the older generation when I was growing up. A man with all those negatives would have disgusted my grandmother, regardless of what else he had.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

@farsidejunky I never heard that before....her posting it surely gave you a  ...I Love the quotes with the "madness" in them.. to me , that = Passion!

I think it's important to be with someone who brings out the BEST in us... if we are with someone who brings us down...it's going to affect our moods every day.. 

Often I read posts here how we shouldn't be influenced by our spouse.. we can rise above that.. I kinda shake my head on that one... We are going to be influenced by someone we share a life with.. there is no way of getting around this.. other than becoming numb , or detaching , which is not healthy...that's a downward spiral, a crack in the foundation.. 

Excuse all the quotes.. this speaks it for me.. what I ultimately wanted.. looked for.. I think many FEEL this at the beginning... I am foolish enough to believe it CAN be maintained through the years... if we have that "madness" for each other !


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

southbound said:


> The puzzle for me is when a man can sometimes lie, cheat, abuse, and any other thing he can think of, but the wife just can't give him up. I've often wondered what could be so great about a person that it overshadows all those negatives. At the same time, what could be so bad about a caring, employed, loving, attractive, man without those negatives that would make a woman turn away.


 My quick answer is : Passion , Desire, Excitement - and if they still laugh together.. despite all those awful faults.. I agree with you.. I'd want NOTHING to do with a LIAR/ cheater or an alcoholic for example...some sound like BAD BOYS.. and many of those appeal to women on some *visceral* scale.. they can't even explain it..

The Abuse part -I'll never understand ... those who have walked it may be better at explaining it.. maybe a loss of self esteem has brought them so low , they don't believe they could find better.. so they make the best of it..


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

southbound said:


> that may be true to a point, but I think some people, if they are a lazy bum with no job, for example, might be able to notice a major flaw.
> 
> The puzzle for me is when a man can sometimes lie, cheat, abuse, and any other thing he can think of, but the wife just can't give him up. I've often wondered what could be so great about a person that it overshadows all those negatives. At the same time, what could be so bad about a caring, employed, loving, attractive, man without those negatives that would make a woman turn away.
> 
> I guess I must have spent too much time around the older generation when I was growing up. A man with all those negatives would have disgusted my grandmother, regardless of what else he had.


There was a time when the penalty for picking a lazy man was starvation for a woman and for her offspring. If your grandmother doesn't remember that time she was raised by women who did. Thanks to the miracle of Socialism, American women are actually rewarded by the government for choosing lazy, abusive, or absentee men and they are financially punished by their government for picking devoted hard-working husbands. Nothing puzzling here. It is mass behavior modification by design by politicians and bureaucrats who owe their positions to the poverty and dependency of citizens.


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

unbelievable said:


> There was a time when the penalty for picking a lazy man was starvation for a woman and for her offspring. If your grandmother doesn't remember that time she was raised by women who did. Thanks to the miracle of Socialism, American women are actually rewarded by the government for choosing lazy, abusive, or absentee men and they are financially punished by their government for picking devoted hard-working husbands. Nothing puzzling here. It is mass behavior modification by design by politicians and bureaucrats who owe their positions to the poverty and dependency of citizens.


True, times have changed a great deal from my grandparent's youth, which changes the mate selection process a lot.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

southbound said:


> True, times have changed a great deal from my grandparent's youth, which changes the mate selection process a lot.


Insulating one from the immediately painful effects of a bad decision doesn't turn bad decisions into wise ones. Dating a lazy male is stupid, which is why women have generally resisted the practice for almost all of human civilization. Even female birds and squirrels are usually too smart to waste their time on an unproductive male.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

farsidejunky said:


> My wife posted this to my FB timeline about 8 months ago. I posted this on TAM before, but I love it so I am putting it up again. @SimplyAmorous, this ties into what you are saying.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The operative word is fall in love, not stay in love.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

john117 said:


> The operative word is fall in love, not stay in love.


Meh.

Letter vs. spirit.

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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

I know for me I was a bit too much of a nice guy and married the wrong woman. Objectively I have analyzed my previous marriage to death tryIng to learn and grow as best I can. Truth is I was a good husband in all categories but the nice guy area which In my defense I had ZERO concept of and when I checked in with my X about if she was happy she either consistently lied or was happy with us just not herself. In the end it didn't matter she blew our marriage up from the inside. 

I also have to objectively look at the future and while I was a good husband once I would not make a good one now.


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

farsidejunky said:


> Meh.
> 
> Letter vs. spirit.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


So, the spirit of the message was when you fall in love, it's forever?

Anyone still believe that's possible or does the couple have to work at staying in love after the initial "love"(infatuation) fades?

Edit: Sorry, I must not have sweetened my koolaid enough.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

*Re: Opposite of &quot;If You Are In a Good marriage&quot;*



2ntnuf said:


> So, the spirit of the message was when you fall in love, it's forever?
> 
> Anyone still believe that's possible or does the couple have to work at staying in love after the initial "love"(infatuation) fades?
> 
> Edit: Sorry, I must not have sweetened my koolaid enough.


Wow. The cynicism necessary for either of your posts is pretty heavy.

Can't it just be appreciated for its intent rather than being picked apart in a cross examination?

"Gee, wife, that wasn't bad, but it doesn't at all address STAYING in love."

Ironic that approach does exactly what you say is missing in the meme.

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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

farsidejunky said:


> Meh.
> 
> Letter vs. spirit.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk


Hardly. 

The mechanics of falling in love are different than those of staying in love, unless people live in Unicorny...


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## 2ntnuf (Jul 14, 2012)

*Re: Opposite of &quot;If You Are In a Good marriage&quot;*



farsidejunky said:


> Wow. The cynicism necessary for either of your posts is pretty heavy.
> 
> Can't it just be appreciated for its intent rather than being picked apart in a cross examination?
> 
> ...


It isn't cynicism. It's facing the reality that it takes work to stay in love. It's facing the fact that husbands and wives do change and they don't always find themselves still in love with their spouse.

I don't believe in fairy tales any more. You may do so at your own risk.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Wolf1974 said:


> I know for me I was a bit too much of a nice guy and married the wrong woman. Objectively I have analyzed my previous marriage to death tryIng to learn and grow as best I can. Truth is I was a good husband in all categories but the nice guy area which In my defense I had ZERO concept of and when I checked in with my X about if she was happy she either consistently lied or was happy with us just not herself. In the end it didn't matter she blew our marriage up from the inside.
> 
> I also have to objectively look at the future and while I was a good husband once* I would not make a good one now.*


Just curious Wolf.. why do you say this ???


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

john117 said:


> Hardly.
> 
> The mechanics of falling in love are different than those of staying in love, unless people live in Unicorny...


I'm going to answer this with an article that I feel captures it..it's a dopamine rich / "rewards" thing going on that's "Unicorny" land I guess...... one thing is very clear.. it takes 2 that care about each other & want each's happiness.. it also helps tremendously they are romantically minded -I've always looked at that more as a "spiritual" thing.. for those geared more sensitive & giving towards a Lover. 

 Brain Study Reveals Secrets of Staying Madly in Love - What brain scans teach us about intense long-term passionate love




> *The Characteristics of Intense Romantic Love*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Then it spoke of : *1) *The importance of sexual frequency...*2)* Closeness & Union....*3) *Attachment...*.4)* Feeling safe & Secure....*5)* Friendship-Based Love vs. Romantic Love and *6)* Long-Term Romantic Love vs. Early-Stage Love... the ending here: 



> *So What Have We Learned?
> *
> From this study, we have learned that the neural activity of individuals in intense romantic long-term love share remarkable similarities to the neural activity of individuals newly in love. (Interesting.) We have learned that romantic love can be sustained in long-term relationships. (Phew, that's a relief !) And that intense, passionate long-term love is a dopamine-rich activity maintained by sustained rewards. (Come again?)
> 
> ...


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

I'm not sure I agree. The above is newly in love vs LTR in love. Falling in love in my view at least means you're not newly in love yet but have attraction, courtship, logistics of dating, and so on to iron out. 

Maybe I'm a semantics geek...


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

SimplyAmorous said:


> Just curious Wolf.. why do you say this ???


Just an honest self evaluation SA. I believe that one of the foundations of marriage is compromise. When I was married I always gave and gave ....... on everything, even things really important to me in an effort to show love. Foolish I know but it was how I was raised to believe husbands should be. 

Now single and living life how I want I find myself unwilling to compromise on anything. So I have gone from one extreme to the other and don't think I would make a good husband


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

There's a lot to be said for "people change."

And thank goodness for that.

The person you were in your 20s ought not to be the same person you are in your 50s. Every person you met, every joy you experienced, every sorrow you suffered, and every betrayal you endured changes you, one way or another. It absolutely has to because we are all humans.

Sometimes people change at different times and for different reasons, and often those changes are assimilated into a relationship for the better. Other times, not so much.


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## FeministInPink (Sep 13, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> My quick answer is : Passion , Desire, Excitement - and if they still laugh together.. despite all those awful faults.. I agree with you.. I'd want NOTHING to do with a LIAR/ cheater or an alcoholic for example...some sound like BAD BOYS.. and many of those appeal to women on some *visceral* scale.. they can't even explain it..
> 
> The Abuse part -I'll never understand ... those who have walked it may be better at explaining it.. *maybe a loss of self esteem has brought them so low , they don't believe they could find better.. so they make the best of it..*


This is exactly it. My XH's emotional abuse started out as a trickle, almost imperceptible at the beginning, just a constant drip... drip... drip... that slowly eroded my self-esteem and self-worth. At the bottom, when things were at their worst, I didn't believe that I deserved any better than what he was giving me (something that my mother had conditioned me to believe as well, growing up). I didn't think that anyone else could possibly ever love me--and he insisted that he DID love me--so there was no point in leaving, if there was no hope for anything better. His abuse conditioned me to be grateful for the scraps that he gave me, rather than seeing it for what it really was. I believed I was unloveable, and so all I deserved was scraps. I knew I was miserable, but I was so bogged down by all of it that I couldn't see any other option.

What saved me?

TAM, and a house-full of (older, wiser, and divorced) women writers on retreat who were fascinated by my marital problems and who encouraged me to open up, asked all the right questions, and offered me unconditional love and support, despite not really knowing me.


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