# Newbie - At wit's end with my depressed wife



## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

Hi everyone, this is my first post, found this forum in my quest to save my marriage and my sanity.

Background - married 19 years next week, we have 2 children ages 15 and 17.

Let's start from the beginning. I met my wife at a mutual friend's party way back when and we immediately hit it off. We became absolutely inseparable and about a year and 1/2 after meeting, we were married with a huge ceremony and reception surrounded by friends and family. Life was fantastic!

We began planning a family and the following September, our daughter was born. Life was fantastic!

We wanted another child and decided that if it was a healthy boy, that would be it, no more kids. My son was born, I got a vasectomy, life was still fantastic!

Now comes the bad stuff. About 2 years after my son was born, my wife's brother and only sibling committed suicide without any warning. It was an awful time for us and I bent over backwards to do anything to ease the pain for her and her mom. I helped with all the arrangements, dealt with the kids, and even took it upon myself to clean up the mess he made so my wife wouldn't have to see or deal with it (he used a shotgun ).

My wife fell into a depression which I came to find out runs in her family. I tried everything I could to help get her mind off things. We're both social drinkers and she LOVES to gamble so we made numerous weekend casino trips. It did help a bit, at least she seemed to be herself again for those short times. Having a few drinks and forgetting her troubles helped to bring back a bit of her sex drive which I wasn't going to complain about!

We decided as a family that perhaps a move would help, new surroundings might help her to shed the weight of depression. So we packed up and moved from NY to FL.

Shortly after moving to FL, she went to a doctor to discuss her depression which was NOT getting any better and was beginning to manifest itself in occasional fits of rage that she felt almost powerless to control. Of course he was only too happy to prescribe something for it - Effexor.

To make somewhat of a long story short, she's been on it for years and it has essentially sucked the life out of the loving, vibrant woman I married. She can't hold a job for more than a year, she will end up complaining and acting so miserable that I eventually give in and tell her to just quit. She swears that she will use the time away from work to better herself and get our house together, but it NEVER, EVER happens.

Along with the depression, she developed stomach problems that she blamed everything on. She wouldn't get out of bed and claim it was her stomach. She wouldn't go to work because of her stomach. She wasn't interested in sex because of her stomach. But ironically, her stomach problems never stop her from wanting to go gambling....

Fortunately I have a very good job and we can easily afford for her to stay home. I'm a very active person and in addition to working a full time job, I started a business with her back in 2001 in hopes of motivating her. I ended up doing all the work, arguing with her when she wouldn't do anything I asked her, and eventually, I gave up and closed the business. I'm still bitter over that, especially when I see my competitors at the time still going strong today.

I tried to find something social we could do together, again in hopes of motivating her. I stopped racing cars as a hobby since she had no interest, stopped riding my motorcycle for the same reason, and I renewed an interest in my old hobby of playing guitar and joined a band. This turned out to be MY saving grace, I absolutely love playing out in clubs on the weekends. She enjoys it as well and it's the one time that we can still enjoy ourselves together. That is until the weekend is over and she's back in bed for 22 hours a day.

Drinking does wonders for her, she loves going out and wants to party all weekend. She's a very happy drunk and once again, we get along great then. She will barely sleep all weekend, will want to go out and party and/or gamble, or even just stay home, have a few drinks and play video games. This is a catch 22 for me, I get my wife back for a limited time but I know it's not healthy for her and it's not a healthy basis for a relationship. It always comes crashing down on Monday for her and I'm once again left holding everything up.

I work 50 hours a week at a stressful job. I come home to a large beautiful home that is an absolute disgusting mess inside. I spend my weekends doing laundry and trying to clean up but when I'm gone at work all week, it goes right back to the way it was. The kids help to some degree but it's really not their responsibility outside of basic chores. They're beginning to resent the fact that she does NOTHING all day and then yells at them to clean up. It's not fair and they're right to feel that way IMO.

Part of the problem is that you simply CANNOT have a discussion about this with her. She is unbelievably difficult to argue with, she will ALWAYS turn the tables and bring up anything and everything I have ever done wrong regardless of how unrelated it is to avoid addressing the issue. I get frustrated and walk away almost every time, it's not worth the fight and I hate fighting.

Fast forward to now. She was working at great job for about a year with a dentist's office. She had an incredible opportunity to run the office and really make something out of it and herself. Instead she chose to cut back to 3 days, called in sick 1/2 the time, and last November she quit. She swore up, down, and sideways that this time it would be different, she was going to get herself together, get her health in order, get the house cleaned up, etc.

She's done NONE of it. She had blamed all her woes on her stomach and her idiot doctor wasn't doing anything to help. So finally, I took matters into my own hands, found the BEST gastroenterologist in south Florida and got her there. They now have her on prescription strength probiotics and they've done absolute WONDERS for her, her stomach issues are 99.9% GONE.

That was about 3 months ago. She still sleeps all day, my house is still a mess, she isn't working and has no desire to, and I still have to come home from work after a long day and cook dinner for my family, then throw in laundry so I don't waste my entire weekend in front of the washer & dryer.

I'm one of those people who has a really long fuse, but when it goes off, I'm done. I am rapidly approaching that point now, I have had it. I am bitter, I am angry, and I am sad. I do NOT want to end my marriage, I do love my wife but the amount of resentment I've built over the years is staggering and is starting to overflow. It's at the point now where we will have a nice time on a given Friday or Saturday night, I will start to think nice thoughts about my marriage again, but Mr. Resentment comes along and quickly reminds me that it's a temporary farce and that my marriage is essentially a joke. I used to be able to fight him off, but now I can't so the few times we would be able to enjoy are getting tainted.

I used to fear getting raked over the coals if I chose to divorce her, but I'm at the point where I don't even care anymore. I'm 45 years old, I'm decent looking and in good health, I'm active and driven both in work and play, but I feel her sucking the very life out of me. I feel great all day at work, then as I approach my exit off the turnpike, my mood will start to darken. How many more good years of my life do I have left? Now I'm more afraid that I'm going to turn around one day to find my life slipped by while I was busy catering to her.

Our sex life has been spotty, it's always fantastic for both of us when it actually happens, but that's ONLY on the weekends when she's drinking which adds to the problem. Still, it's like pulling teeth to get her in the mood, even though once she's started, she enjoys it thoroughly. I've learned to live with the disappointment there, but it doesn't help that I'm forever approached by gorgeous women 1/2 my age when I'm playing in the band.

I would like to suggest we go to counseling but that will spark a war as does anything I ever say negative. She'll flip out and maybe walk out like she's done in the past only to return 1/2 hour later. The last time she did that, I cannot tell you the relief I felt because I thought she was going to be gone for good...but she came back an hour later.

Does anyone have any suggestions for me before I start contacting attorneys? I'm truly at wit's end, I would absolutely love nothing more than to remain happily married to the woman I love, but not at the expense of my happiness and sanity.

Thanks for reading and sorry it's so long winded. I had hoped that typing all this up would have a therapeutic effect but unfortunately, it just made me more bitter.


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

OUCH.

That sounds really terrible, and I give you props for having stuck it out this long. Clearly, your wife has some addiction problems -- alcohol and gambling, and who knows what else. As you know, she cannot fix these on her own, and you cannot fix them for her. Unless she is willing to make a major turnaround (and it doesn't sound like she is), I do think that you need to get out, and get your kids out of there, before things get any worse. And they will get worse.

I am so very sorry. You'll see a lot of good advice here, as well as support, so I hope you will keep posting.


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

lamaga said:


> OUCH.
> 
> That sounds really terrible, and I give you props for having stuck it out this long. Clearly, your wife has some addiction problems -- alcohol and gambling, and who knows what else. As you know, she cannot fix these on her own, and you cannot fix them for her. Unless she is willing to make a major turnaround (and it doesn't sound like she is), I do think that you need to get out, and get your kids out of there, before things get any worse. And they will get worse.
> 
> I am so very sorry. You'll see a lot of good advice here, as well as support, so I hope you will keep posting.


Thank you for the reply and kind words lamaga. One thing I didn't get into in my original post was my son and the vow I made to myself. My son has mild autism/Asperger's Syndrome and doesn't handle emotions or change very well. I made a promise to myself that I would not leave until he was 18 at which time I hope and pray he will be mature enough to handle the split.

He will turn 18 in exactly 825 days. Sadly, yes I'm counting.


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

Oh, that does make things more difficult. My thoughts will be with you.


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## StoppedWatch (Apr 10, 2011)

JoeRockStar, your post resonated strongly with me. We are in a very similar position.

I don't have any advice about how to handle a partner's depression. I really wish I had. For me the big question is, how long can I live with this weight dragging me and my family down? How much responsibility does the depressed person need to take for their part in the marriage? Because you can't row the boat on your own can you? Sorry, I have no advice on this part at all.

All I can offer is a bit of practical advice on your household itself. It is not fair that you be lumbered with the housework on top of your job. At the same time it is clear that you wife will not do it. It is about time you accepted that this is something that just will not happen. So my advice is this - budget for a cleaner. This has literally changed my life! I love love love love not having to clean house. There is no law in the universe that says one of the marriage partners has to clean the house. It isn't part of the wedding vows. 

That said, an unclean house is a major stressor, and one you can do without. Hire a cleaner and feel the serenity - at least in that part of your life. 

If you can't afford it weekly see if you can have someone come in once every couple of months for a day to do a spring clean.

BTW - my son also has mild aspergers. And I am trying to get my husband to get involved in his music again - perhaps join a band. I think this would be a major help to his depression. (What would be a bigger help is if he dealt with his anger towards his parents, but that is by-the-by).


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

StoppedWatch said:


> All I can offer is a bit of practical advice on your household itself. It is not fair that you be lumbered with the housework on top of your job. At the same time it is clear that you wife will not do it. It is about time you accepted that this is something that just will not happen. So my advice is this - budget for a cleaner. This has literally changed my life! I love love love love not having to clean house. There is no law in the universe that says one of the marriage partners has to clean the house. It isn't part of the wedding vows.
> 
> That said, an unclean house is a major stressor, and one you can do without. Hire a cleaner and feel the serenity - at least in that part of your life.
> 
> If you can't afford it weekly see if you can have someone come in once every couple of months for a day to do a spring clean.


Thank you for the reply StoppedWatch. We actually had a maid coming in twice a week a few years ago but the clutter got to her and she quit!  That's the biggest issue we have, clutter. My wife has more shirts, pants, and SHOES than a department store, 90% of which she NEVER wears so trying to cram anything into her closet is an exercise in futility.

In order to start having any kind of clean house, we need to get RID of stuff first. I tried a bandaid solution of getting a storage unit, now I'm stuck paying $180 for a garage full of JUNK. I have begged her to go through her clothes and give the ones she doesn't want to charity, I get the usual "yes" and it never happens.

Last year when she was still working, I took an ENTIRE week's vacation with the sole intention of cleaning the house. It looked better then it had in YEARS! I literally took 6 huge garbage bags of her old clothes to Goodwill and never even told her - believe it or not, she NEVER noticed. :scratchhead: Sadly, within 2 weeks of me going back to work, the house returned to the exact same condition. 

Fortunately, money isn't a problem, but my pride might be! I'm embarrassed at the thought of having someone else have to clean my family's mess, especially when I have a busy weekend and it gets really bad because I don't have time to get to it all.

I may bite the bullet and take your suggestion though, I'm no neat freak by any means but it is very stressful to walk into every day. It's impossible to find anything anywhere in the clutter so that stresses me out even more.

I'm sorry to hear of your similar difficulties and will keep you in my thoughts. It's consoling to know there are others out there in similar boats!


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## StoppedWatch (Apr 10, 2011)

Clutter! Oh god I know where you are coming from. I can't stand it. It is hard to get on top of. One technique I've found that is helpful is to give every family member a rubbish bin and say "Put in 21 items you will never use again." Don't try to do it all at once, just every now and then, walk into a room with a bag and toss! It is very theraputic. I have done this with my children's un-used toys - no they never noticed!

Once the clutter is under control and you have some clear surfaces then the cleaner has something to work with. It is funny, but every week we run around and 'tidy up' the house before the cleaner comes :lol:

The thing is, if you can get even one stressor out of the way it will make a huge difference to you personally. You need to look after you.


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## ABeautifulDisaster (May 24, 2012)

Not sure really where to start in all this....I was your wife.....I had migraines (which I did but they became more of an excuse than a illness)....I had a few life altering events take place over a 5 year period and that is also the time when I actually developed a relationship with my XH (we'll hope I get the acronym right!) He was also going through a divorce....I truly got to the point where day to day life was hard.....I self medicated....I got to where numbness was awesome in comparison to feeling....My XH enabled me.....I don't think either of us knew that at the time but I know it now....I'll be honest in saying I was not me around him during our marriage....Isn't that insane? But I wasn't and oddly enough now I am in such a better place because of my divorce. I was fortunate in some ways because I am the rarity....I stopped taking Xanax solo and cold turkey....(This is not something I would suggest doing by the way....) I stopped that alone....It made me a horrible, horrible mess for about 2 months....Even though I TOLD him what was going on he did not understand. At the time I was also taking other prescription drugs but Xanax was a huge hurdle for me....(I now take zero!) I think it came too late though because my XH had no clue how to deal with depression....and I didn't either....Most anti-d's just ruin your sex life so if that is the ONE thing that is right you don't want to mess it up....and none of them were a quick fix....and I wanted that quick fix....I needed it.....It never happened....Instead he left me and parts of me understand it and then other parts of me don't....because I was on the way to being me again.....I was....and no matter what change I did he reasoned I only did it because he threatened to leave....so they were pointless....I don't think it ever crossed his mind that mornings were hard....evenings were hard....sunshine was hard....LIVING was hard....In fact he told our counselor that I wasn't giving him what he wanted....when the reality was I wasn't even doing that for myself. A shower once a week was a good thing.....He just couldn't see that....It was so hard for me to function....It was all I could do to be a good mother during that time.....Effexor wreaks havoc with your body...or it did mine....and the process to titrate off of it was described as hell....So I opted out of pills....(And I am not saying do this either I am only trying to tell you what it took me to get to my bottom)....My XH opted out of our marriage. For a good 8 weeks I was in one awful state but I survived....because that is one thing I am.....I am a survivor....depression made me feel like I wanted to drown though....Alcohol made it "better"....eh bullsh!t on that one but at the time it was the band aid to keep things right....I felt wonderful when I had a few drinks....sex was stellar....life was good....but alcohol is just another drug.....A change of place....a change of job....nothing matters when you feel like this....nothing....It is a hard line to find between doing what is best for a depressed person and doing what is best for you.....But ultimately I think you have to do what is best for you because if you don't the resentment for all of the things done wrong will eat you alive....I hate to sit here and say opt out because I think you love her and you have a child but I honestly don't think she will improve without a drastic change....I wish I knew what that was but everyone has to hit rock bottom on their own....if depression (and suicide) have been in her family I know it makes it hard to leave....because you can't know what she will do but if you can't talk to her about it what do YOU do? I can tell you 825 days will not fix it if you can't get some insight to what it would take to fix it.....I also feel like she needs to not only recognize sleeping 22 hours a day is hell but be willing to do something differently, even if it is small steps it is something....Maybe a good counselor could steer you both on how to deal with the situation....?? I truly think that is maybe a start? He/She can help with both sides...her depression and the cracks in your marriage it has caused. It isn't a quick fix either but it is one that you can fix with work.....by the time we opted to go my XH was long past the point of anything working us out....so it failed for me but it might not for you....and it is something you can do if you are dead set on those 825 days to maybe make some sense of it all......I'm not perfect....Heck my house is still cluttered.....At times I just have no idea where to start with that....but I have a job.....I have a job I go to daily...(this is such a huge help) and I don't sleep 22 hours...I am pill free and even though I am a work in progress I am not the shell of the girl I used to be.....so I have hope for you....but please do something to help you deal with all of this.....I think that is the one thing you do have control over....seize it.


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

Thank you for the reply ABeautifulDisaster. Some of your points really hit home with me, I will address them below:



ABeautifulDisaster said:


> My XH enabled me.....I don't think either of us knew that at the time but I know it now


I absolutely, positively know I'm guilty of this. I can't help it, when she has a couple of drinks, I get my wife BACK!!! It sucks in a way because I know it's the booze, but sometimes you take what you can get. When we go out and she has a few, she becomes friendly, funny, charming, and sexy. She's the belle of the ball when we go out on the town, I'm pretty well known in our area because of my band's popularity and I know she loves the attention she gets as a result. When my band plays, she's the "rockstar wife" and she loves that role, well - minus the women 1/2 my age hitting on me.  

Then of course, there's the sex. It's AMAZING when she's had some drinks. It's all but nonexistent when she doesn't, and, on the very RARE occasion that we will have sex when she's sober, it's nothing to write home about, she's barely interested.



ABeautifulDisaster said:


> Effexor wreaks havoc with your body...or it did mine....and the process to titrate off of it was described as hell....


I can attest to this, it IS hell. I swear the pharmaceutical companies design it this way, but that's a conspiracy theory for another thread.... My wife tried to get off it once a few years ago and became near suicidal, she had to go back on it to keep her sanity.

The switch to Cymbalta wasn't easy but it was better than going off it cold turkey. I'm not convinced Cymbalta is any better than Effexor for her but the one thing it has helped with were her mysterious body aches, they're much better with Cymbalta.

In both cases, I made it a point to be as understanding and compassionate as humanly possible. She told me a few weeks ago how much she appreciated my patience when switching to Cymbalta and she even made it a point to tell our friends how caring I was during that rough time. <blush>



ABeautifulDisaster said:


> But ultimately I think you have to do what is best for you because if you don't the resentment for all of the things done wrong will eat you alive....


What would be best for me would be to have back the woman I married! I don't know if it's possible, but sometimes I'm optimistic as I can see a glimpse of her still in there from time to time. As resentful as I am sometimes, I'd be a liar if I said I didn't still love her. 



ABeautifulDisaster said:


> and it is something you can do if you are dead set on those 825 days to maybe make some sense of it all......


I'm not dead set on this, not by any means. Maybe I'm subconsciously using it as an excuse to procrastinate leaving in hopes that things will change? I've always believed that my kids need to come first to some degree and since we don't openly fight all the time and there's no abuse, I need to stick it out for now, especially for my son since he has trouble dealing with emotions and drastic change.



ABeautifulDisaster said:


> I'm not perfect....Heck my house is still cluttered


Lol I can get over a cluttered house. The problem is that it's a constant reminder of her laziness/inabilities and it's on TOP of not working, sleeping all day, etc. If a cluttered house were the only issue, I'd be ecstatic.



ABeautifulDisaster said:


> I am pill free and even though I am a work in progress I am not the shell of the girl I used to be.....so I have hope for you....but please do something to help you deal with all of this.....I think that is the one thing you do have control over....seize it.


GOOD FOR YOU!!! :smthumbup: I swear those pills are poison. I have my own preference for self-medication (of the green, leafy variety  ) but it's occasional and in moderation. But I'm still ME, it doesn't change who I am like the anti-depressants can do.

I recall I tried to use Wellbutrin once to quit smoking cigarettes. Never in my life did I feel so horribly depressed! After a week of this, I stopped taking it and felt better by the hour, even my wife begged me to stop taking them, she had never seen me so down in the dumps.

AD's are trial and error with far more error if you ask me. The drug companies don't even really fully understand how they work and that scares me.

Thanks again for the reply and for sharing your story, I hope things continue to improve for you!


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

Quick update from last night - I swear my wife KNOWS when I'm at my breaking point. I was somewhat cold on the phone to her yesterday afternoon before I left work and I know she picked up on it. I got home and she was up cooking dinner. Penne ala vodka...mmmmm. 

The up and down drives me absolutely CRAZY!!! I WANT nothing more than to feel in love with her and be happy about it! It's so frustrating to feel so happy one day and then have it kicked out from under me the next.

Thanks again to all who have replied, it really helps to hear others' stories and know I'm not alone in this.


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

Joe - sorry to hear about your sitch. For now, I can just say that I relate to a LOT of what you wrote. Married nearly 20 years to a woman with severe depression/anxiety, who refuses to do anything about it.

ABeautifulDisaster - thanks for sharing your thoughts/story. I wish you peace going forward.


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

So our 19 year anniversary is coming up tomorrow. I took off last Thursday & Friday to spend some time with her. It was a complete and total waste of 2 days off.

She had wanted to go away on vacation originally. We used to go away ALL the time, cruises, trips to the Keys, etc., but a couple of years ago we had an overnight trip to the Hard Rock that made me vow never to go on vacation with her again. The Hard Rock down here has a casino which is of course her favorite place in the universe. To make a long story short, she wound up staying in the casino and gambling ALL NIGHT long, leaving me in the room by myself despite repeated promises that she was going to be "done" soon. When it got to be 6AM, I walked downstairs with all the bags packed, found her, made a scene and told her I was leaving NOW whether she was coming or not. Needless to say, I was apprehensive about another vacation.

So I threw the ball into her court and asked her to plan something since she doesn't work and has oodles of free time. She planned nothing.

My son wanted to have an end of school year party on Saturday. The house was of course a wreck. I ended up spending my 2 days off cleaning the house for his party and doing all the shopping for chips/soda/etc that SHE was supposed to do but she didn't feel up to it.

So we try and salvage the weekend by going out to see a friend's band Saturday night as my band was off this weekend. While we were there, a friend of hers started talking to her about a tragedy that happened, her son's best friend was killed on his bicycle by a motorist, very sad story. This subsequently sends my wife into a downward spiral for whatever reason so she alternated between belligerent and weepy for the rest of the evening all the way through Sunday.

Worst weekend ever.  I don't see me making it to my 20 year anniversary, at least not with my sanity. I can also say with near 100% certainty that I won't even get a card from her for our anniversary tomorrow because she's probably going to sleep the entire day away while I'm at work. To add insult to injury, I picked up some kind of stomach bug and have been running to the bathroom since yesterday, yay! 

One highlight to my otherwise dismal weekend, while my wife was trying to stuff our life savings into the Joker Poker machine at the bar on Saturday night, I spent a couple of hours flirting with a VERY attractive lady who was incredibly charming and sexy. No, I didn't do anything besides flirt but knowing she was totally into me really helped boost my battered ego! :smthumbup:


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## lamaga (May 8, 2012)

Oh, Joe. You deserve SO MUCH BETTER.


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

lamaga said:


> Oh, Joe. You deserve SO MUCH BETTER.


Thanks Lamaga. Courtesy of this forum, I discovered some great reading resources and have started reading No More Mr. Nice Guy. Holy crap, the beginning of this book absolutely describes my life to a T!



> Five decades of dramatic social change and monumental shifts in the traditional family have created a breed of men who have been conditioned to seek the approval of others.
> 
> I call these men Nice Guys.
> 
> ...


Wow, how profound! Going to tear through this book today, hopefully I will glean some tips on how to deal with all this.


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## jenniferswe (Apr 23, 2012)

sounds like she probably has some serious mental issues. She was probably put on the wrong medication. If you haven't already, get her into a good mental health professional. This way the core problem can be treated and maybe the addictions will decrease.


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## brendan (Jun 1, 2011)

Joe - i think you are what i would have been in 17 years time.
Most things you said are exactly what my wife was like after marriage started after being diagnosed.,,,anyway i wont talk about myself but what i picked up on is,

- looks like you know its over as you litterally know the days to your sons 18 and also now dont think you will make 20years

- you flirting witht he girl at bar whilst wife gambled, well from experience that will lead to more with someone else eventua;;y but yes it does feel good to know shes into you.

-the wife senses your at breaking point bit, thats so true what you said

-your wifes addiction is gambling/drinking/partying. others on depression have different addictions but most od depression are addicted to something for an outlet

-no i dont think you will get the wife back that you married, thats all i wanted but quickly realised after 18 months it aint going to happen.

now - not that im the best person to give advice, but we ended in mutually 5 months ago, and get along quite well now we are seperated and still there for our daughter. and i feel so much more relaxed and few weeks ago actually met a girl which i thought would be to early to act upon after seperation but found out last night she has nno problem with it so hopefully we are going to start dating. I feel like a rerlaxed 21 year old again.

still feel sorry for ex wife obviously and still care for her.


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

jenniferswe said:


> sounds like she probably has some serious mental issues. She was probably put on the wrong medication. If you haven't already, get her into a good mental health professional. This way the core problem can be treated and maybe the addictions will decrease.


Thanks Jennifer, she certainly seems to. It appears to be a pattern in her family, her brother committed suicide as mentioned and all her 1st cousins seem to be on medications ranging from Zoloft to lithium, and quite a few are raging alcoholics.

I've tried to lead that "horse to water" but I can't even get her to take her probiotics every day which have made a tremendous difference in her overall health. She has to want to do it, I'm done trying to force her to better herself.


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

brendan said:


> Joe - i think you are what i would have been in 17 years time.
> Most things you said are exactly what my wife was like after marriage started after being diagnosed.,,,anyway i wont talk about myself but what i picked up on is,
> 
> - looks like you know its over as you litterally know the days to your sons 18 and also now dont think you will make 20years
> ...


Glad to hear that things are looking up for you Brendan and thanks for the reply. 

Some days I'm ready to give it all up (like yesterday) but other days I have some hope that we can make this work.

Thanks to this forum, I found the book "No More Mr. Nice Guy". I plan to post a separate thread on it but it's worth mentioning here. I started reading it yesterday at lunch time and am nearly finished with it. All I have to say is WOW, this book has almost described the last 12 years of my life to a T. It's going to be a long, difficult road for me to successful at employing all the advice in the book but I'm 100% determined to try my hardest.

There are 2 areas that the book touched on that literally had me putting it down and staring into space saying to myself "OMG, that's exactly what I do!" The first is the topic of unspoken contracts. I always felt that going above and beyond for my wife would make her be appreciative and do all the things I wanted from her in return. The problem is that I never consulted HER on this deal just as the book says! The second touches on asking my spouse to do things that I would never, ever consider doing for myself, i.e. quit your job, go back to school, go get your hair done, etc. I have told her similar things over the years in hopes of lifting her spirits but they never have the intended effect.

This book has in a short time empowered me to look at myself and hopefully make the changes in ME that need to be made so that I'm happy for a change. I always told myself that it was a huge mistake on my part to hinge my happiness on her actions but this book has driven that point home. 

Now it's time for ME. If she wants to tag along, great, I would love nothing more, but if she doesn't, I NEED TO MOVE ON WITH MY LIFE! I'm 45 years old and in good health, why am I missing out on life because of her? It's insane and I cannot for the life of me understand why I have done this for so many years. I have a great career that pays me pretty darn well, I have a large circle of friends that I enjoy spending time with, I'm still ok looking I guess  and I feel 1/2 my age when I'm not wallowing in depression over my wife. I know that I'm blessed with these things and I will no longer throw those blessings away! :smthumbup:


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## CWOG (Jun 11, 2012)

I've been there. The depression and social anxiety. I too got to where I didn't do anything but stay in bed and would ask my daughter and husband to do simple things for me. I had totally became lazy. I did have a job but the depression was so bad, the doctor had me off from work. After miscommunications me and the Human Resource department, I ended up being termed from the company while still under doctor's care. I had become so lazy and unwilling to live life I didn't even bother trying to go to corporate about this wrongful termination, I didn't try for a new job... I lost all interest in everything, even sometimes sex. The depression was really bad. I would avoid important appointments because the depression had me insecure about the 65lbs I had gained in a matter of months. I was either constantly irritated or sad and crying. I admit I took a lot of my depression out on my husband. Treated him like he was some nasty dog with rabies or something. I treated my husband with little regard. I mean to a point to where people would say no wonder he went into an EA. Yes, he is responsible for his actions just as I am responsible for mine. I don't know what to say about getting past this. My husband apparently chose to separate. But I can tell you this much... his EA and separation from me has caused a new change in me. I got up out of that bed, went back to the gym to lose that 65lbs I'd gained (still a work in progress. Lost 20 so far), I am back into school and trying to get back to work. I had been spending loads of time to get me back to normal. Had he not left, I think I would have been still drowning in my depression. I thank God for allowing him to leave because it even brought me back closer to God as I had been before. Sometimes, I think, you might have to take actions to let the partner know that you do not like what's going on and that it's hurting the marriage. You can still care and love someone enough to give them time and space. I don't think you leaving would betray her if you help her get the help she needs. I'm not telling you to do anything, just saying maybe it's a thought to consider. I still have my medication Wellbutrin. But I haven't had to take it but twice actually since he's been gone over a month ago. I honestly feel a lot better inside. Though, because of my Christianity, I believe it was God that got me back to me. So I don't look at the separation or the EA my husband had in a negative way. Yes, it was wrong, but if it caused me to better me mentally, spirituality, emotionally, and physically, why would I object to that. Maybe you should pray for her and let God work it out. I was always told "Let go and let God". I'm patiently waiting for his return. God has allowed me to keep the faith and hope for a better outcome. I know people would think nobody changes that quickly. But for me, since I'd already live that committed Christian life, and was willing to allow God to put me back where I use to be in him, God took those things out of me that I begged him to remove. One must want, have faith, and believe that God can and will do it for him/herself. Maybe go to bible study with her or something. Ask God to remove the blindfold from her eyes so that she see and feel what this is doing to her marriage. You never know, she might one day ask God to heal her and she believe and have the faith and then become a new person for the good. It can happen. It has with me. I will even post back to share the success story about my marriage with you all.


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

CWOG said:


> I've been there. The depression and social anxiety. I too got to where I didn't do anything but stay in bed and would ask my daughter and husband to do simple things for me. I had totally became lazy. I did have a job but the depression was so bad, the doctor had me off from work. After miscommunications me and the Human Resource department, I ended up being termed from the company while still under doctor's care. I had become so lazy and unwilling to live life I didn't even bother trying to go to corporate about this wrongful termination, I didn't try for a new job... I lost all interest in everything, even sometimes sex. The depression was really bad. I would avoid important appointments because the depression had me insecure about the 65lbs I had gained in a matter of months. I was either constantly irritated or sad and crying. I admit I took a lot of my depression out on my husband. Treated him like he was some nasty dog with rabies or something. I treated my husband with little regard. I mean to a point to where people would say no wonder he went into an EA. Yes, he is responsible for his actions just as I am responsible for mine. I don't know what to say about getting past this. My husband apparently chose to separate. But I can tell you this much... his EA and separation from me has caused a new change in me. I got up out of that bed, went back to the gym to lose that 65lbs I'd gained (still a work in progress. Lost 20 so far), I am back into school and trying to get back to work. I had been spending loads of time to get me back to normal. Had he not left, I think I would have been still drowning in my depression. I thank God for allowing him to leave because it even brought me back closer to God as I had been before. Sometimes, I think, you might have to take actions to let the partner know that you do not like what's going on and that it's hurting the marriage. You can still care and love someone enough to give them time and space. I don't think you leaving would betray her if you help her get the help she needs. I'm not telling you to do anything, just saying maybe it's a thought to consider. I still have my medication Wellbutrin. But I haven't had to take it but twice actually since he's been gone over a month ago. I honestly feel a lot better inside. Though, because of my Christianity, I believe it was God that got me back to me. So I don't look at the separation or the EA my husband had in a negative way. Yes, it was wrong, but if it caused me to better me mentally, spirituality, emotionally, and physically, why would I object to that. Maybe you should pray for her and let God work it out. I was always told "Let go and let God". I'm patiently waiting for his return. God has allowed me to keep the faith and hope for a better outcome. I know people would think nobody changes that quickly. But for me, since I'd already live that committed Christian life, and was willing to allow God to put me back where I use to be in him, God took those things out of me that I begged him to remove. One must want, have faith, and believe that God can and will do it for him/herself. Maybe go to bible study with her or something. Ask God to remove the blindfold from her eyes so that she see and feel what this is doing to her marriage. You never know, she might one day ask God to heal her and she believe and have the faith and then become a new person for the good. It can happen. It has with me. I will even post back to share the success story about my marriage with you all.


Thank you for the reply CWOG and I'm happy to hear that your life is improving! 

I sincerely hope that I can get my wife to awaken from this fog she's in before I "have" to leave to preserve my sanity. If not, I will at least know that I tried my best to make it work and can leave with a clear conscience.

While I genuinely appreciate your prayer/bible study suggestions, I'm not a big believer in organized religion despite being raised in a strict Catholic family and married in a Catholic church. I've become agnostic and try to simply follow the golden rule of treating others as I would like to be treated. Besides, according to them I'm going to hell for all eternity if I decide to leave her and get on with my life.


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

Just wanted to stop in and update my thread. Things aren't getting any better despite promises and assurances from her that she's "going to get it together". I've been trying to stick with my NMMNG plans and have been mostly successful thus far. It hasn't helped my marriage in any way but it has helped me to be happier and cope a bit better.

Had a long talk with my mom yesterday over lunch. She is usually the LAST person on earth that I confide in, we just don't have that kind of close relationship. I broke down in tears and told her that I was considering leaving once my son turns 18 in 2 years. I fully expected the Catholic/Italian speech on how you're not supposed to get divorced but incredibly, it never came. She was actually very SUPPORTIVE of the idea which lends credence to my belief that my mom never liked my wife much in the first place. Very unexpected but pleasantly surprising.

Anyway, they say that following the NMMNG principles will either fix a marriage or send it into an overdue grave, it's looking more and more like the latter. That's fine but I just wish I could go to sleep, wake up, and have it all over and done with.


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

Another update to my thread and I'm very happy to say it's a positive one! 

Thanks to this forum, I read NMMNG and started to apply its principles. Understandably, I met with resistance from my wife but plodded on.

Several weeks later, I have to admit the book was spot on. While she has her issues, I began to realize that I was at least partially to blame for the rut our marriage was in. As I stated earlier (or possibly in another thread) when my wife and I met, I was the assertive alpha male. In response to the tragedies of her brother's suicide and her mom's cancer and subsequent death, I put myself in a caretaker role and coddled her in an effort to get through the tough times. I don't regret doing so and would do it again, but my problem was that I DIDN'T STOP PLAYING THAT ROLE.

The timing of reading the book coincided with the 1 year anniversary of her mom's death so I used it as a milestone to get her to let go and move on. At the same time, I stopped being a "nice guy" and focused on myself. I also put pressure on her to accept some of the responsibility of taking care of the house, herself, and our children.

Well I'm VERY happy to say that things seem to be turning around! :smthumbup: My marriage isn't out of the woods yet but I'm definitely seeing signs of life! She has been cooking more dinners, doing dishes, doing some laundry, taking better care of herself and......she actually initiated sex with me while she was sober!!!!! :yay:

Some more amazing things she has done recently:

- Instead of laying in front of the TV all day like a zombie, she has started reading (50 Shades of Grey actually  ). 

- She is going for a manicure and pedicure today and plans to look nice for a dinner date we have with friends this coming Friday night.

- We went to a friend's pool party this past Sunday and I reminded her that we used to have awesome pool parties until our house fell into such a sad state that we're embarrassed to have company. She started cleaning up the back deck and plans to have a big party before the kids go back to school in late August.

- She has taken more responsibility for her health. Prior, I had to constantly remind her to take her pills, eat properly, etc. I completely stopped doing that and told her that I can't always be there to be her personal nurse, she must take her health into her OWN hands and she has definitely done so.

Like I said, we're not out of the woods yet but I feel more optimistic about my marriage than I have in years. I can't say enough thanks to all the wonderfully kind people on this forum who offered advice and stories and to Dr. Glover for penning NMMNG, I think you guys just might have helped save a dying marriage. :toast:


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## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

What's NMMNG?


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

x2startermom said:


> What's NMMNG?


Sorry, it's a book by Dr. Robert Glover called No More Mr. Nice Guy.

No More Mr. Nice Guy

It is so heavily referenced on this forum that many use the acronym to refer to it.


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## x2startermom (Jan 8, 2010)

Ah I didn't know. Kinda new to the forum.


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## kate542 (Jul 25, 2012)

You sound like a wonderful person to have put up with all this and been so supportive to your children and wife.
My only thought is don't end up like me 42 years on and trapped in a loveless relationship I should have divorced my husband after the children came out of university.
Remember life is short and it is for living there is no going back.


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## Baldguitarguy (Jul 31, 2012)

Well, well, well.

Joerockstar.

I have been comming to this forum for a few months, been married 25 years, and could not put my finger on exactly what was wrong in my relationship. I eep reading through posts to see if I can come up with what to do.

I have my own issues and am not a perfect person.

But I needed to take the time to register and post on your thread and say thank you.

I honestly feel like I could have written what you did and by reading your posts I was able to have something "go off" in my brain and see what is going on in my own relationship.
The comment you made about "seeing glimpes of my wife from time to time" really hit home.

I don't have any advice for you - I just wanted you to know that your post helped me. And I thank you for taking the time to share your story.

If I could summarize what I read and how I feel - it would be frustration - not anger - perhaps biterness - but certainly frustration.

Thanks again and good luck to you.

BTW, Jesus is real, and he loves you.


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## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

I'm a softy and always hoping for complete reunification of a family even when it looks like it may not work out.

It's obvious you love your wife but mourn the loss of her and are getting strung along by the tidbits she throws you when she appears even if this only happens when she's drinking or gambling.

Your wife takes your love and your strength for granted. She wallows in self pity and does nothing to change it and when she does change it, it constantly proves to be temporary.

In your case, the only chance you have at saving your marriage is sending a wake up call to the entire house. There is a point were medical ills and depression are masking self indulgent entitlement. 

Most people fall on hard times and deal with devastating news at some point in their lives. It is absolutely not a permanent excuse to take a permanent time out from life or you can bet your life will fall apart.

How can you live one second more with where you are? Why is 18 for your child the magic number? Don't you think that seeing him Mom wallow in her miserable life is sending your children a clear message? It's simply not acceptable and it's no more acceptable today than it will be in two years.

I think you need to be bluntly honest with your wife today. Explain to her temporary and scant reprieves from her sad sack self is not enough anymore. You expect, and deserve, to be living with a partner who is proactively living life with you.

You may make it more complex than it is because emotionally you are conflicted. Please value yourself, your wife and your children more. I don't mean this as an insult. Playing the role of caretaker to a grown woman is not a good thing for any family even when it feels like the right thing to do. You deserve better. Your children deserve better and, most importantly, your wife deserves better.

You can't do it for her but you can set clear boundaries and expect her to live up to them or face immediate consequences. At the end of this she will be alone with two resentful kids and will most likely fall deeply into wallowing in her own misery. 

She needs a big ass dose of gratitude for all you have and all she is choosing to miss out on. Tell her you support her but you don't support her destroying herself and taking the family down with her. Nothing that has happened to her is an excuse. Excuses are lame and prevent growth.

Do this today, not tomorrow. Do this and don't let up even when you feel conflicted, convinced by her or feeling that it would be easier to just hang in there till you can end it.


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

Baldguitarguy said:


> But I needed to take the time to register and post on your thread and say thank you.
> 
> I honestly feel like I could have written what you did and by reading your posts I was able to have something "go off" in my brain and see what is going on in my own relationship.
> The comment you made about "seeing glimpes of my wife from time to time" really hit home.
> ...


You're most welcome Baldguitarguy! Heehee I can sure relate as a fellow balding guitarist! :lol:

I'm very happy to hear to my story helped you. As stated in my most recent entry, things are looking up because I have stood up for myself and set boundaries for my wife. This is still holding true thankfully. My wife has been getting up out of bed EVERY morning, has been helping with housework, and has been far more affectionate/amorous then she has been in quite some time. She still has her moments but they are to be expected and they are fewer and far between as I will no longer tolerate them and she knows it now.

My best advice to you is to pick up a copy of No More Mr. Nice Guy and read it through. I can honestly say that this book has so far saved me from divorce. 

Best of luck to you!


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## JoeRockStar (Jun 5, 2012)

Trenton said:


> You can't do it for her but you can set clear boundaries and expect her to live up to them or face immediate consequences.
> 
> Do this today, not tomorrow. Do this and don't let up even when you feel conflicted, convinced by her or feeling that it would be easier to just hang in there till you can end it.


Thanks Trenton. I have done exactly that and I'm very happy to say that it IS working! I've been kind to her but FIRM on those boundaries and it's definitely made a huge difference.

I even overheard her on the phone to her girlfriend the other day saying how she doesn't know why I hadn't tossed her out on her behind yet. She's getting it now. My requests are NOT unreasonable and she knows it. Things are looking up and I owe it to this forum! :smthumbup:


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## moonstone999 (Jul 11, 2012)

Hello JoeRockStar.

By any chance, is your wife abusing drugs? And I don't mean her prescription antidepressant, I mean perhaps painkillers, powder drugs, stimulants.

From what you've written, the change in personality after her brother died, the sleeping all day, the messy house, the history of gambling, etc... makes me think she might be taking drugs of some sort and suffering addiction.

Just a thought.


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