# Sexy wife in bed only



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Hello. Wife born/raised in SE Asia, if that matters. We married 1996 and moved here (Pacific NW). Three kids. 

We are having a marriage crisis of sorts, that is to say I am convinced I want to leave her. Main reasons are that she wants to be indoors constantly, when we go out she doesn't act interested in being near each other, and for 20 years she didn't do much in terms of guiding the kids (homework, sports, activities, teaching chores, etc). I had all the responsibilities, none were shared. Also she's a lousy housekeeper. I was basically mom and dad for 20 years, now coming to terms that I'm burned out. I can't rewind the clock. 

What plays with my brain a bit is that I remain extremely attracted to her physically, and we have sex daily even though we might argue daytimes. She calls me Mr Handsome in her language. No matter what, we seem to make love every day and that's been constant for 20 years. I don't think there's ever been a time she's refused it. Even on her period, we get back to action 2 or 3 days in. She loves sex and is naturally wet, the foreplay is my favorite part and I really get her going before ramming it home. She is a "receiver" in bed, meaning she doesn't ride me very often, or do anything other than take what I give her. I'd like her to, but it's not her style. I am passionate and love all the action, and it burns calories I suppose. 

So I am coming here to say, all the sex is one thing but I still want to leave. Am I crazy? If you who live in a sexless marriage could advise me, would you say I have it made -- stick to this woman because the sex is there?

I'm thinking to leave and find another sex loving woman. But are they rare? Before I met my wife, I had a girlfriend who had great orgasms but she was really cold most if the time. I could go weeks with no sex, that was when we were in our early 20s.

On a related point, one thing that helped keep us going strong sexually is our hot tub. We don't use it as much lately, but after 12 years of marriage or so, we got one and it was really nice to put the kids to bed then wander out there together and talk, hold each other, etc.


----------



## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

There aren't many women who will want sex daily, but they exist. Most are probably taken, for good reason. However, given that she just goes along with it, and is not much of a wife or companion otherwise, you can probably do much better. If you could be happy with sex every other day (maybe more, but let's say that's a minimum), there are lots of great women who will be more active participants and partners in bed and in life.

My first marriage was sexless, but there were plenty of other problems as well. You only have the sex - and mediocre sex, if that. If the sex stops or is reduced significantly, is there anything else worthwhile about your marriage? My second marriage has all the compatibility, and all the sex - and it's great.


----------



## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

Have you addressed with her the things that she isn't doing? If so, what is her reaction?

Do you love her?


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Thanks for the feedback. 20 years is a long time. I only recently decided to consider leaving. It's a strong compulsion. Yes I think I can do better. She loves me for all the world, that's fine and dandy I guess. Her way of showing that love, is to not be a companion. She's like another child to raise. I want out.


----------



## MrsAldi (Apr 15, 2016)

Be careful the grass isn't necessarily greener. 
You may get another date who's more independent but less interested in sex. 




Guth said:


> Thanks for the feedback. 20 years is a long time. I only recently decided to consider leaving. It's a strong compulsion. Yes I think I can do better. She loves me for all the world, that's fine and dandy I guess. Her way of showing that love, is to not be a companion. She's like another child to raise. I want out.



Sent from my B1-730HD using Tapatalk


----------



## becareful2 (Jul 8, 2016)

That's not a good reason to leave, but leave if you want. Just don't come crawling back to her when she finds a better man than you and you end up with a worse partner than her.


----------



## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

So he's saying that basically the only way he feels his wife is a partner to him is sexually. Others advise that it doesn't matter that she's not a life partner, that's not a good reason to leave (??) she has sex with him so he should stay in the marriage??

ETA yikes, there is more to marriage than just frequent sex. She sounds more like a f$ck buddy than a life partner, if you know what I mean. Not meaning to be disrespectful. Yes, I read your other thread.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Yes thanks. 20 years dedicated to raising kids. Now it's just fuxking every night. I feel nothing about our future. I've made some stupid mistakes in recent years. Thus may be the biggest ever. But I can't help it, the feeling I want out. Thanks for any feedback. Call me crazy too I won't be offended.


----------



## becareful2 (Jul 8, 2016)

Are you the same guy who complains that when he and his Asian wife goes out, she walks about 10 feet behind him? That guy's wife also didn't do much in raising their children and gives him sex often. 

Have you tried talking to her? Tried marriage counseling? Why did you let this go on for 20 years?


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Yes. 10' is the extreme. But no matter how slow I go she trails behind. I can't say why it persisted 20 years. I was wrapped up in focusing on the kids. That's all I can think of. Before I make any big decisions I'll consult a therapist. I don't think my wife is the therapist type, but she will have a chance. 

I had dinner with a close relative last night. She's the only family member I've spoken to about this. She is in the middle of a divorce now. Her husband gave her divorce papers without warning and wouldn't talk about it. 

I am giving my wife plenty of indication. She pretends our conversations about divorce don't exist apparently. We never argue after she comes to bed nude and we embrace. That's the strange part. It's like if we divorce I guess we will have sex the morning we shake hands and part ways. 

She's superstitious, educated but superstitious. I think she imagines if we divorce it's due to a mystic god or ghost. She likes to get advice from fortunetellers. Yes you read that right.


----------



## becareful2 (Jul 8, 2016)

How well do you two communicate? Have you two really talked to one another? Ever sat down and had a serious but gentle, non-confrontational conversation with her? 

Ask her what she thinks you can do better to strengthen the marriage, and you offer her a list of what she can do. Giver her compliments like the frequent sex and go from there. Get her to lower her defenses so she can open up to you. 

If all else fails and she seems unresponsive, look her in the eyes and tell her point blank that your marriage is teetering on the brink of divorce due to many unresolved issues that must be addressed asap, and see how she reacts.


----------



## Lila (May 30, 2014)

Here's a suggestion. ....stop having sex with your wife. 

You're giving her mixed signals. Think about it. You keep saying you're unhappy and want to divorce but continue to have lots of sex with her. 

If you want her to take your concerns seriously, then stop doing that which defines a healthy relationship.

Sent from mobile using Tapatalk


----------



## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

What was asked last week on your other thread, and continues to be asked here - what does your wife specifically say when you address these issues with her? You speak in broad generalities of all the behaviors with your wife that bother you, but never say what your wife specifically says when you address these issues with her. Assuming you have addressed these issues with her.

Sometimes we think the grass is greener. You've been going to coffee shops, picking up women at the supermarket and going to lunch. Are you being honest about whether or not your wife's faults are causing you to look around and leave your wife or are they simply an excuse to look around?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

PhillyGuy13 said:


> What was asked last week on your other thread, and continues to be asked here - what does your wife specifically say when you address these issues with her?


He will never, ever answer this question.


----------



## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

He just wants confirmation to leave. That's all. Hey, if you want out, it's not fair to your wife to stay there. Plus, you are denying some other dude of sex every day. Hook up your fellow man!


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Hi. I think I answered that question before. Realize it's important. What does my wife say?

I poured my heart out to her in April. I told her that I can't keep being the sole person watching over the kids homework and sports, and I really need her to take control of getting our kids to do the housework. Our home is not well kept but we have teenagers sitting there. Walk up to them and get them to do laundry. Get them sweeping the floor. Get them on a dish schedule. Create a notebook. Whatever it takes. I am always the bad guy directing absolutely everything with housework. Enough I can't take it. I am the only one spending time every day looking after their schoolwork. We still have an 11 year old. I asked kindly please -- I'm at the end of the rope here you have to be a parent too. 

Her response was to help our son that night with a bit of homework. Nothing more. The other day I walk in the house is a disaster. Everyone there. I called our 11 year old, clean off the table. Got our 19 year old -- clean your bathroom, now. Our 18 year old. Clean up thus kitchen, now. Drop your dang phones and do these tasks now. Guess what -- 30 minutes later all done. But it's 20 years of this and my wife will NOT change. She can not ever keep a clean house ok? Is it that hard to understand? It's actually, I am convinced, impossible for her to do. Mentally incapable. I've tried very hard and 20 years along here. Initially the kids were so young I overlooked it and was super busy anyway. 

Then the walking part, I told her very recently and basically on my knees saying hey this is serious. I can't stay married to someone who won't stay by my side anytime we go anywhere. She just listened. It's not something she can do apparently. I'd say she tried to improve on it. It's not her nature. She doesn't care how important it is. 

On going outside. Well she won't ever be an outdoors person.


----------



## Anon1111 (May 29, 2013)

Guth said:


> So I am coming here to say, all the sex is one thing but I still want to leave. Am I crazy? If you who live in a sexless marriage could advise me, would you say I have it made -- stick to this woman because the sex is there?


nobody else can tell you what you should be happy with

if you're not happy, you're not happy

I am in the opposite situation from you, but I would have little tolerance for the situation you've described either.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Herschel fellow man if you have a woman who doesn't keep a house clean. Doesn't like to go outside. Never affectionate outside of coming to bed naked every night rubbing her fine ass all over you to come get inside. Is that all it takes to keep a man happy?


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Anon1111 thanks. Others suggested I didn't share her response so I shared it here. That really summarizes it.


----------



## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

I guess what I'm trying to get at is her way of thinking. Does she think she doesn't help with homework, or keeping the house cleaned, does she agree, disagree, what is her reasoning? What is her perspective?

Same for the walking behind you has she ever explained why she walks behind you.

But as others have said I guess it's not important. If you've had it, you've had it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Guth said:


> Anon1111 thanks. Others suggested I didn't share her response so I shared it here. That really summarizes it.


You really didn't. You mentioned on one occasion that she DID reply about the walking behind you at least once. You called what she said "excuses". So she must have said SOMETHING.


----------



## KillerClown (Jul 20, 2016)

Guth said:


> Herschel fellow man if you have a woman who doesn't keep a house clean. Doesn't like to go outside. Never affectionate outside of coming to bed naked every night rubbing her fine ass all over you to come get inside. Is that all it takes to keep a man happy?


Can I ask you what her background is? Was she working in an office or a shop? You say she is educated but what did she study?


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

OK you guys know more than I do about these issues, I am a newcomer to the forum and appreciate your help. I will ask her to respond about WHY that is very important. I assumed if she came to me and said "hey I can't take this any more, you are always playing video games until 2:00 AM" (which I don't but just for the sake of conversation). Then the thing is, I would feel the need to stop playing video games until 2:00 AM to make things right with her. However, she didn't ask me to explain WHY I play video games until 2:00 AM. That is important too. OK thanks again.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

About her background. Well 20 years here. Before that she grew up in a world of privilege due to her father's success. But he had booms and busts. I think the first 10 years just regular people. The next 10 wildly successful. Then came to live with me here.


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Guth said:


> OK you guys know more than I do about these issues, I am a newcomer to the forum and appreciate your help. I will ask her to respond about WHY that is very important. I assumed if she came to me and said "hey I can't take this any more, you are always playing video games until 2:00 AM" (which I don't but just for the sake of conversation). Then the thing is,* I would feel the need to stop playing video games until 2:00 AM* to make things right with her. However, she didn't ask me to explain WHY I play video games until 2:00 AM. That is important too. OK thanks again.


So your cleaning and child care complaints (which seem very valid to me) resonate with something from my history. When DH and I were first married, he did no housework. I was the primary bread winner at the time. And I did ALL the housework. I would "tell" him. But he Just Couldn't Get It. His Mom had done everything. He grew up his entire life like that. Changing something which is part of you for your whole life, that you personally don't have a strong motivation to change is easy to just never get all the way done.

Sometimes ACTIONS speak louder than words in the form of effective limit setting, though I don't know how likely that is to work in your case since

a. this pattern is one that has been in place for 20 years
b. she does not seem to care about the mess.


----------



## KillerClown (Jul 20, 2016)

Guth said:


> About her background. Well 20 years here. Before that she grew up in a world of privilege due to her father's success. But he had booms and busts. I think the first 10 years just regular people. The next 10 wildly successful. Then came to live with me here.


So is it fair to say that she does not clean house or raise the children because back home that was not her job? Can we assume that everything you have a problem with can be chalked up as part of her upbringing and her culture? If so, have you made efforts to learn about and adapt to her culture?


----------



## Steve1000 (Nov 25, 2013)

KillerClown said:


> So is it fair to say that she does not clean house or raise the children because back home that was not her job? Can we assume that everything you have a problem with can be chalked up as part of her upbringing and her culture? If so, have you made efforts to learn about and adapt to her culture?


In a different thread that I stumbled across, he describes that he has lived awhile in her home country and has some ability to speak his wife's native language.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

I actually lived in her country for several years and graduated from a local college there. So the cultural challenges are not that great. She was always the one who grew up thinking of the outside world. I was always the one who strangely had an extraordinary ability with languages. So I'm very well versed in her language and culture. 

Yes the issue could very well be cultural because education isn't a strong point where she comes from. Neither are athletics. Many people live in cluttered homes. I guess I went along for years with it. Give me some credit . We seem like the perfect couple in many respects. But I'm likely going to separate from her early next year. We have a large property setup that is pretty complicated. I don't mean to complain about owning a lot of property. It just makes things take time. Probably I will sell it. We both relocate to where our son will study. Nice town. Then she can spend time raising our son. This will be painful but I can't stay. I'll probably get a home nearby and if over time we can salvage it, make that a rental and move back. I really would like her to find someone else. Frankly it's perfect. But I think we came aong way, and I don't want her to lose face. Trial separation is best. I think.


----------



## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

Guth said:


> Herschel fellow man if you have a woman who doesn't keep a house clean. Doesn't like to go outside. Never affectionate outside of coming to bed naked every night rubbing her fine ass all over you to come get inside. Is that all it takes to keep a man happy?


I am not arguing with you about what makes a good marriage. I was just getting an idea about the interactions other are having with you that it seems to me that you just want to have confirmation about getting out. I did joke about the sex, and probably unfairly.


----------



## KillerClown (Jul 20, 2016)

Guth said:


> I actually lived in her country for several years and graduated from a local college there. So the cultural challenges are not that great. She was always the one who grew up thinking of the outside world. I was always the one who strangely had an extraordinary ability with languages. So I'm very well versed in her language and culture.
> 
> Yes the issue could very well be cultural because education isn't a strong point where she comes from. Neither are athletics. Many people live in cluttered homes. I guess I went along for years with it. Give me some credit . We seem like the perfect couple in many respects. But I'm likely going to separate from her early next year. We have a large property setup that is pretty complicated. I don't mean to complain about owning a lot of property. It just makes things take time. Probably I will sell it. We both relocate to where our son will study. Nice town. Then she can spend time raising our son. This will be painful but I can't stay. I'll probably get a home nearby and if over time we can salvage it, make that a rental and move back. I really would like her to find someone else. Frankly it's perfect. But I think we came aong way, and I don't want her to lose face. Trial separation is best. I think.


I understand you wanting a clean home and a little help with the kids. If the current situation is unbearable then it is perfectly within your right to want a separation. But please also understand that she never deceived you and whatever she is doing wrong is not out of spite. This is the woman you married. She is the mother of your children and you need to treat her with respect that she deserves.


----------



## fightforher (Dec 4, 2013)

Your post look like just whining about your situation and asking that everybody take your side and tell you to leave her. From your post it does not sound like you have been very firm about your requirements to continue with this marriage. You are firm with your kids, and not with your wife. You don't seem to have made it clear to your wife that this is a deal breaker and you are ready to leave. Or did you make it clear that your plan is to leave if these issues are not resolved?


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Hello. Trust me I don't care if you approach this by blaming me. So go ahead I probably deserve it.

It's hard to proactively decide I will end 20 years of marriage with three kids (two grown). Maybe the majority of posters here are on the other end of it. I don't seek anyone to join my side. If anything I appreciate those who call me crazy and any other choice words.

I was very clear and deliberate. I said this is just driving me to leave our 20 year marriage! She didn't change at all. Maybe 2 days.


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Guth said:


> Hello. Trust me I don't care if you approach this by blaming me. So go ahead I probably deserve it.
> 
> It's hard to proactively decide I will end 20 years of marriage with three kids (two grown). Maybe the majority of posters here are on the other end of it. I don't seek anyone to join my side. If anything I appreciate those who call me crazy and any other choice words.
> 
> I was very clear and deliberate. I said this is just driving me to leave our 20 year marriage! She didn't change at all. Maybe 2 days.


Have you shared with her that you are considering ending the marriage over this?


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Yes. I used the divorce word. In April. Long talk. I had just finished an excruciating period of completing our taxes, another massive burden that falls on me. And they are a beast. Because I have to account for a pile of papers. That takes weeks. So she may have dismissed it as a result of the stress. I honestly dismissed it myself as a result of stress. But I'd never come to that before. Plus, since April, I want to move forward with a separation even more. 

We had one more talk and I was more direct. I will do it again. 

You know, I've heard this phrase that people can't change. I think she can't. The house will always be a mess unless I pick it up. She also senses some relief when I clean up all the crap she's hoarded. There is an element of hoarding disorder. 

As far as the kids, what's done is done. She didn't participate one bit on the things I outlined. I am bitter.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Another thing that's kind of funny is that as we had our talk she said hey, you know what you upset me too. You LOOK AT YOUR PHONE AND DRIVE. Ok. So ever since then I really stopped doing it. Or close. That's apparently the extent of her frustration.


----------



## becareful2 (Jul 8, 2016)

You need to send a clear message to her by not having sex with her. Go sleep in another room from here on out. See if that will motivate her to talk to you. You make it seem like she's a mime who rarely utters a word.


----------



## fightforher (Dec 4, 2013)

becareful2 said:


> You need to send a clear message to her by not having sex with her. Go sleep in another room from here on out. See if that will motivate her to talk to you. You make it seem like she's a mime who rarely utters a word.


If you separate or divorce then she will not get any sex from you. So, no harm in just cutting her from from the sex and see if she will listen to you tell her how serious you are about it. Send her a clear message by not having sex with her.



Guth said:


> Yes. I used the divorce word. In April. Long talk. I had just finished an excruciating period of completing our taxes, another massive burden that falls on me. And they are a beast. Because I have to account for a pile of papers. That takes weeks. So she may have dismissed it as a result of the stress. I honestly dismissed it myself as a result of stress. But I'd never come to that before. Plus, since April, I want to move forward with a separation even more.
> 
> We had one more talk and I was more direct. I will do it again.
> 
> ...


Make it clear that you need her and the kids to clean up the clutter. Make the consequence that you will throw things away. See if that gets her attention.

One of two things seems to be going on here:

1) You fail to make it clear how serious you are about terminating your marriage unless things change.

2) She understands and does not want the marriage to go on and is just waiting for you to exit.


----------



## poida (Jan 17, 2014)

Lila said:


> Here's a suggestion. ....stop having sex with your wife.
> 
> You're giving her mixed signals. Think about it. You keep saying you're unhappy and want to divorce but continue to have lots of sex with her.
> 
> ...


I like that idea. It takes it out of the equation.

Personally, in my second marriage, the personal connection I have with my wife is so much deeper than my first and I wouldn't trade that for anything. To just be able to hang together and be totally happy is where it is at.


----------



## poida (Jan 17, 2014)

Guth said:


> Another thing that's kind of funny is that as we had our talk she said hey, you know what you upset me too. You LOOK AT YOUR PHONE AND DRIVE. Ok. So ever since then I really stopped doing it. Or close. That's apparently the extent of her frustration.


Classic distraction tool.

Would you say your wife is insecure? Does she struggle to express how she feels? If yes to both, suggest she see a counsellor about it.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Fighterher is probably right about her.

I sense she MIGHT be adopting a "fine then divorce me" attitude. How sad and stupid. I've treated her pretty well. Not asking too much. 

Then again, the concept of "patience" in her culture and indeed the word patience as used in her language, has a meaning that translates differently. I think she's resigned to be patient. Time will sort things out, in her mind. 

The dumbest thing I could do is separate and/or divorce with our current state of financial affairs. We don't have huge assets, though to me it's huge. More than I ever thought I'd have, and 50% could keep me going for decades. She'll probably get swindled out of her half by relatives etc. Basically if I liquidate things and structure our assets such that splitting them is relatively straightforward, that's ideal. A whole different topic.

Very sad. You know, we are in mid/late 40s. If our kids were 3, 6, 10 years old I would never think of leaving. I've been super loyal and dutiful. Ready to take the blame for maybe rushing with the kids and letting things slide that I never knew would come along later. 

The other thing is, I know she's attracted to me -- and vice versa. She may not be a stunner to everyone, but my God she is the most gorgeous woman to me. Head to toe. A few years ago at the elementary science fair, I was there and across the gym I see a lady walk in. Hmm look at her. Sexy. Focused my eyes and 25 yards away that was my wife. I read about men forgiving their wife's wrinkles or whatever, wives who contain about their slob husband. Let me tell you, I am so crazy about her eyes, her shoulders, her legs, her rear end. The thought of never having sex with her is almost impossible. Then again I know there's a better match out there. Sorry to drone on and on. Thank you.


----------



## notmyrealname4 (Apr 9, 2014)

Why not do outdoorsy stuff with your guy friends. If you're in the PNW, there wouldn't be a shortage of those types of groups.


Can't you get an accountant to do your taxes for you? Your wife won't do it; and it's another headache for you.


If she is accustomed to wealth in her family of origin, perhaps she had servants to do the dirty work of daily life? Could you have a cleaning service come in for a few hours of cleaning a week? This would probably be cheaper than getting a divorce and losing half of your assets. I know you shouldn't "have" to do that; I'm just thinking of the fastest way to solve a problem that is more annoying than it is immoral or "wrong".

I don't get the "walk behind you 10 feet" thing, it sounds cultural. Or are you much taller than her, with longer legs. A regular gait for you, might be exhausting for her; especially as she doesn't sound like the type who goes for physical fitness regimens. Perhaps she can't keep up comfortably, doesn't want to criticize her husband (cultural?)---so she just gradually lags behind. Could be a passive-aggressive way of _telling_ you to slow down.

As to the fortune teller thing? I don't know. Some grown men play in fantasy football leagues. Some people play the ponies. Some people like to reenact the Civil War. As long as she doesn't base important decisions on it; who cares really?


It sounds like you've got one foot out the door already. Just throwing out a few ideas, fwiw.


----------



## john117 (May 20, 2013)

You can't appreciate what you have until you lose it or walk away. It's a numbers game, and the odds of finding someone with fewer skeletons in the closet aren't very good...

Having said this...

You are asking her to give you bon sexual affection. Maybe she doesn't know how. Stereotypes. Maybe it's not in her. 

For example I could be on a date with Selma Hayek and she would notice quickly that I'm a bit immature despite my years. That's me. I spent five plus decades building my persona. I appreciate the simple things in life, not the Opera, a five course meal, and a walk thru Central Park. I'm more the Netflix, Wendy's, and Best Buy kind of guy.

It doesn't mean I am not a great responsible guy. But this is who I am. Maybe she's like that. My daughters never did a chore in their lives. But they did well in what matters most

I suggest you find a "jury of your peers" and observe how their wives from the same culture behave. Maybe she's isolated here. Do people in her country show lots of affection? My wife is from Central Asia and alas, they don't... Not the couple dozen I know. So...


----------



## notmyrealname4 (Apr 9, 2014)

john117 said:


> You are asking her to give you *bon* sexual affection. Maybe she doesn't know how. Stereotypes. Maybe it's not in her.


I like your comment; but I don't understand the above term. "Bon" as in the French word for "good"?

Sounds like OP's wife does that already, she just doesn't do it in an assertive style.


----------



## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Non, not Bon


----------



## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

I agree...stop having sex with her.

See how you feel then.


----------



## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

The "passiveness" OP describes is typical Asian behavior. Frequently the women are entirely passive and the man does everything, and is expected to make sure everything is great for them both, and from what I hear it is often greatly intimidating for many Asian men if the woman actively participates. Weird but its a cultural thing.

Likewise with the public activity - what you describe is standard behavior in many Asian areas - only wanton women are publicly social with men.

As for the housekeeping , you should have got housestaff, which again is a normal Asian thing - doesn't have to be significant, but it is a "work task" to do many household chores something people are paid to do. And being work things, they're stuff the staff do, not what family members do (and are not trained in).


----------



## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

Guth said:


> Fighterher is probably right about her.
> 
> I sense she MIGHT be adopting a "fine then divorce me" attitude. How sad and stupid. I've treated her pretty well. Not asking too much.
> 
> Then again, the concept of "patience" in her culture and indeed the word patience as used in her language, has a meaning that translates differently. I think she's resigned to be patient. Time will sort things out, in her mind.


For someone _married_ to a person of another culture, you seem to have very little understand about how that culture works.

Divorced women are "broken", "faulty".
If you decide to reject her that that is _your_ choice as the husband. If you are putting her childrens' health/life in jeopardy then she _might_ be seen as permitted to return to her parents, but would still be considered a failure.

So it's not "patience", it is the acceptance of ones' fate and role in life, something that she has been brought up and conditioned to do, and like the walking in public, she unlike you, has never been shown or expected to do as you expect.
So she will follow the cultural things she's been taught as values, and will passively await your decision.

And if your taxes are an issue, then as the man you are expected to hire someone to deal with it. Asian women handle matches, and hatches, not service work - so household finance yes, but not government taxes excetra as that's outside world stuff.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Very valuable comments here -- thank you VERY much especially the suggestion of getting out with others more often, etc.

I think spotthedeaddog has cherry picked things I've said and not included what bothers me most.

But I value all feedback here, and frankly this is a very friendly and helpful forum. You are more kind to me than I expected.

Were you born and raised in SE Asia spotthedeaddog? Just wondering because you provide a lot of stereotypes here that are really not true. I don't want to beat my own drum here as some kind of Asian expert but I lived there for several years of my young life when I was deeply fascinated by the culture and learned the language very well -- I can watch the television and understand just about everything. I am the one who made all the flashcards for our kids in their mother's language in fact, and tried as hard as I could to teach them her language. She always used English. Well she loves English. That's her. 

Within various regions there are different styles of husband/wife interaction but I can tell you, wife tailing husband not walking together is very uncommon. Where she's from, you see so many wives actually holding their man's elbow as they walk together. Not only that, but here where we live, among a huge Asian population, you almost always see a wife walking together with husband, especially moments together (the two of them). I'm very observant and this is three years along -- I've been watching for years locally so don't tell me it's an Asian thing for the woman to walk behind her husband -- it is NOT.

Housework, well sorry. I know so many couples here in the Asian community and not a single one has mentioned a housekeeper. Many do have grandma at home helping. True. I think over the years, looking back, I should have tried to setup a housekeeping deal. In fact we did at one point but it was strange. I don't mean to bore you with stories but the housekeeper was a Russian lady who cleaned our place once a week for about a month, as I recall, not doing a great job really, then she called and said she had all kinds of personal problems and wanted us to help get her out of some bind. We didn't even know her. It was my wife who NEVER liked having that person come into our house anyway. In fact it was a source of some friction. 

The big issue I have is an unshakeable annoyance that I spent the better part of 20 years doing absolutely everything to make sure the kids are growing -- to specialize in learning skills, sports, etc. If you are a parent, and your kids graduated from high school and picked up academic scholarships while competing at elite levels in sports. Well you know the thousands of hours you spent, and you know those kids are headed for success. I had to do it all. No turning back the clock. So kill me for not forcing her to get involved. She wouldn't have anyway. Now, within the Asian community here let me tell you this is not the job of the father only. Far from it. So where in your Asian stereotypes does my wife fit in, on not having any sincere interest in educating them? Sorry I may not ask politely on that.

Taxes. Yes I would not expect her to do the taxes. And I do pay an accountant several thousand dollars to compile everything and file personal and corporate taxes. We have our own company and I take on way too much, every year around mid-Feb through March I go through it all. I should do it quarterly. I can improve.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

spotthedeaddog said:


> For someone _married_ to a person of another culture, you seem to have very little understand about how that culture works.
> 
> Divorced women are "broken", "faulty".
> If you decide to reject her that that is _your_ choice as the husband. If you are putting her childrens' health/life in jeopardy then she _might_ be seen as permitted to return to her parents, but would still be considered a failure.


By the way, her mother and father divorced (her dad went off and had kids with two other women, hundreds of miles away). He passed away, broke. Mother still alive. 

She has two brothers. The older brother - divorced, single. The other brother - divorced, then remarried. 

So in her family, she's the only one who hasn't divorced. And they all look up to her. Would never be seen as Faulty in any way, especially since money counts more than anything and in our household more has been accumulated than any of them have. Money talks.


----------



## fightforher (Dec 4, 2013)

Most of us here on this forum try to help others with suggestions to what to do to save their marriage. You come me asking if you are crazy to think of leaving your marriage. Your reason is that you are tired of pulling all weight to raise your kids and do the housework and she walks behind you in public. In addition you have made it clear that you are doing a great job raising the kids and getting the kids to keep the house clean (and you do pick up the house as well).

Look at it from her perspective. She has a guy that will raise her kids, do an excellent job of it. Keep the house clean. And give her sex every night. I would say she has a pretty good life.

However you are not happy.

So, you have to make the change by letting her know that this is unacceptable to you. That she needs to help a lot more. And if she does not you will leave. If if you leave then her pretty good life will not be quite the same.

So step up and let her know. And let her know that sex will stop as well (if you leave there will be no sex, and if she does not help more there will be no sex). See what she thinks about having some of her pretty good life fall apart.


----------



## bilbag (Aug 3, 2016)

Guth said:


> So I am coming here to say, all the sex is one thing but I still want to leave. Am I crazy? If you who live in a sexless marriage could advise me, would you say I have it made -- stick to this woman because the sex is there?
> 
> I'm thinking to leave and find another sex loving woman. But are they rare? Before I met my wife, I had a girlfriend who had great orgasms but she was really cold most if the time. I could go weeks with no sex, that was when we were in our early 20s.
> 
> On a related point, one thing that helped keep us going strong sexually is our hot tub. We don't use it as much lately, but after 12 years of marriage or so, we got one and it was really nice to put the kids to bed then wander out there together and talk, hold each other, etc.


I will consider getting a hot tub.
I think it is not rare to find a sex loving woman. Finding a woman who loves you is more difficult, I think. That is my perspective although I have not stepped outside of marriage to verify. 
I don't think you have it made based on the endless sex in your marriage. At some point it may decrease or stop, then what? You are frustrated and don't seem in love with her anymore but still attracted to her. How about rekindling the love in your marriage by doing activities that are not sexual, but about intimacy and showing affection? Carry her on your back so she won't fall 10 feet behind.


----------



## john117 (May 20, 2013)

There's Asian and there's Asian... Can you be a bit more specific? The Muslim and Soviet type Central Asian countries vs IndoPak vs SE Asia vs....


----------



## notmyrealname4 (Apr 9, 2014)

Guth said:


> setup a housekeeping deal. In fact we did at one point but it was strange. I don't mean to bore you with stories but the housekeeper was a Russian lady who cleaned our place once a week for about a month, as I recall, not doing a great job really, then *she called and said she had all kinds of personal problems and wanted us to help get her out of some bind. We didn't even know her. * It was my wife who NEVER liked having that person come into our house anyway. In fact it was a source of some friction.
> 
> The big issue I have is an unshakeable annoyance that I spent the better part of 20 years doing absolutely everything to make sure the kids are growing -- to specialize in learning skills, sports, etc. If you are a parent, and your kids graduated from high school and picked up academic scholarships while competing at elite levels in sports. Well you know the thousands of hours you spent, and you know those kids are headed for success. I had to do it all. No turning back the clock. So kill me for not forcing her to get involved. She wouldn't have anyway. Now, within the Asian community here let me tell you this is not the job of the father only. Far from it. So where in your Asian stereotypes does my wife fit in, on not having any sincere interest in educating them?




That was a very weird scene with the Russian housekeeper. I was thinking you could use a service. Check Angie's List or Yelp to get other's opinions of your local housekeeping businesses. Don't get someone through Craigslist or the church bulletin board or anything informal like that.

If your wife doesn't like having a stranger come in to clean, then she has to start cleaning. If she won't, then you are allowed to have a professional maid service come in and keep your place decent. You are at work. You shouldn't have to come home and crack the whip to get everyone to do chores.


I can tell that you feel a lot of frustration from having to do the heavy lifting with regards to child rearing. But, it is water under the bridge now---20 years. And if you've raised kids who are going to college on even partial scholarships; you can take honest pride in that. You haven't "wasted time". So you can focus on that accomplishment to mitigate your more negative feelings.

I think everyone's given their best shot at why your wife might be walking 10 feet behind you in public. If it isn't cultural, and she isn't in terrible cardiac health, so that she can't walk very fast----then I don't know, it is strange. Could she be sulking because she'd rather be home watching TV? Like I said before, that would be an indirect, passive-aggressive way to get back at you for taking her out when she'd rather stay at home on the couch. You can't force people to exercise or enjoy the outdoors.


----------



## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

Guth said:


> Very valuable comments here -- thank you VERY much especially the suggestion of getting out with others more often, etc.
> 
> I think spotthedeaddog has cherry picked things I've said and not included what bothers me most.
> 
> ...


I have had a lot of contact with Asians who are no longer in their home country and they tend to be wealthier/high class than average.
Did not her level of interest in English indicate a difference from her culture (re: your interaction with the children), and here we tend to see the Asian couples huddled together, or the wife following. The former is often the case when his command of English is poor.
With the Russian lady that doesn't surprise me, I would be very surprised if Russian lady didn't have particularly good manners/mannerisms, especially if she's expecting things from the pair of you beyond her agreed price (a very Russian thing, but not common in some Asian areas). Why did your wife hire her if she didn't like her.

Re: child excellence - I'm not talking about the pathetic stereotype of the tiger mother. Which is actually more based around the concept that working is a good thing to do and doing good things will make you happy and worthwhile person (an older but not uncommon philosophy).
Not knowing which part of Asia you're referring to narrows it down a lot. If we include Singapore, then the men folk are more active in voicing there expectations of the child, yet in Japan it is seldom done and the "loving father" isn't that common. Whereas depending on which province of China the situation can go from doting, to near ignorance (also related to income and profession) - Westernised areas of China being far more diverse. Since you did say SE, I think we can pass on the more northern Asian communities where the father tends to play a more involved but traditionally disciplinarian role.
The other issue is that of your childs gender - in some cultures where I live, the boy children are almost ignored and tend to run wild, where the girl children are impressed at birth as domestic help, then domestics (cleaning/cooking), then after 13-15 are expected to do the child minding for the whole whanau (group of family and friends of family).

I also used to run my own company, and around here $4,000 is about what it costs to get a certified accountant to do simple end of year Revenue statements and Balance sheet for a 1-3 person small company. Have a look at a product called "Xero" to see if you can get support in your area. It's an excellent product.

back to the kids mum again. That would be a warning sign indeed. It speaks of a person who is withdrawn from society and just marking time, almost at a mental health issue level, mostly because there appears no resentment, just mental withdrawal. So when I say "mental health" I'm not talking schizoid or Bipolar, but the type of withdrawal associated with severe emotional trauma and a young age, just how young you'd be best suited to estimate based on what kind of emotional maturity/behavior she executes - because the trauma seems to stop the development and internalise at the age the trauma happened. So it could be a great danger, or loss of a close loved one, or sexual trauma - the result being is the developing internal being stops expanding and withdraws from active interaction with the world - like being dragged to a concert that you know you'll hate, you know you have to "be" there but you do your best not to tune in or participate.... and it's that "not participating" in society at any level which you seem to be describing. Again, you're right, I'm a long way away and no expert in the area, and only going off your first couple of postings, so take that with the salt it deserves.


----------



## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

Guth said:


> By the way, her mother and father divorced (her dad went off and had kids with two other women, hundreds of miles away). He passed away, broke. Mother still alive.
> 
> She has two brothers. The older brother - divorced, single. The other brother - divorced, then remarried.
> 
> So in her family, she's the only one who hasn't divorced. And they all look up to her. Would never be seen as Faulty in any way, especially since money counts more than anything and in our household more has been accumulated than any of them have. Money talks.


Might be different social group to the Asians I deal with. Money was never discussed, definitely not openly in front of children/public.

And yeah the divorce was _BIG_ thing with all of them.


----------



## becareful2 (Jul 8, 2016)

Regarding the walking behind you issue, this might work or it might not, but it's what I would do if I were in your shoes. The next time she walks behind you, turn around and walk back towards her in a non-aggressive way. I doubt she will keep backing away forever. When you reach her, take her hand and kiss it gently. Then look into her eyes, smile, and gently ask her, "Do you love me?" If she says "yes," then hug her and respond with, "Then walk with me." Then hold her hand and gently lead her. 

You cannot be confrontational about this, only gentle and loving. Let me know if that works.


----------



## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Is your wife a sahm?

From what I see, you do everything and your wife has no consequences for not meeting her responsibilities. Where I come from, people work for their keep. I've been a stay at home, homeschooling mother for over 20 years. I cannot imagine expecting my husband to take care of everything as long I have sex with him. That's not a partnership.

Where does she get her spending money from? Who does the grocery shopping? Who does the cooking? Who runs the kids to and fro?


----------



## Steve1000 (Nov 25, 2013)

Guth said:


> By the way, her mother and father divorced (her dad went off and had kids with two other women, hundreds of miles away). He passed away, broke. Mother still alive.
> 
> She has two brothers. The older brother - divorced, single. The other brother - divorced, then remarried.
> 
> So in her family, she's the only one who hasn't divorced. And they all look up to her. Would never be seen as Faulty in any way, especially since money counts more than anything and in our household more has been accumulated than any of them have. Money talks.


It's rather interesting reading posts giving you advice about "Asian" culture, then continuing with age-old stereotypes. As you already know, Asia is an extremely large area made up of wide range of cultures. 

My advice to you is to continue to think this through. Does your wife remember your birthday? Does she ever express her feelings for you? Does she have confidence that you care about her?


----------



## Scannerguard (Jan 26, 2010)

> If you who live in a sexless marriage could advise me, would you say I have it made -- stick to this woman because the sex is there?


Yes.

Next question.

If you have several thousand dollars to pay an accountant to do your taxes, you have money to make up for your wife's other shortcomings. Consider it money well spent.


----------



## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

Scannerguard said:


> Yes.
> 
> Next question.
> 
> If you have several thousand dollars to pay an accountant to do your taxes, you have money to make up for your wife's other shortcomings. Consider it money well spent.


several thousand dollars for an accountant is small potatoes. A real business (eg over half mill turnover) really needs a professional eye on the books, and a few thousand is pretty good price and doesn't get much. either you pay it bit at a time, so the job is easy but you're constantly spending. Or you do as much of the cashbook etc and keep great records which takes time, and then it costs a lot more in an almost single hit, because the accountant has to familiarise themselves and set things out to their way (and check your records). There isn't a perfect way to do it, but there are lots of worse ways.


----------



## QuietSoul (Feb 11, 2012)

You have had some thought out, helpful responses here. I won'tvrepear whatvotgers have already said, but I do have a few other comments for you to consider. 

1. Firstly, just an observation, and comparison to my own situation... You have sex every day, even on days when you are arguing, and even in this difficult season where you are considering divorce. I am not judging you (in fact i am impressed) but it does seem strange to me. I know if I was not feeling emotionally close with my husband, or things were tense between us, I would probably not feel like being sexually intimate with him, at least as often. 

2. You said in one of your posts that you had made some big mistakes in your marriage or done some regretable things. Are you able to elaborate? It may paint a fuller picture. 

3. Do you love your wife?

4. Dr o you think she loves you? 

Re housework stuff, I am not the tidiest wife and it is a subject that comes up for us. I do try to be tidy and sometimes I'm great but I can be inconsistent. Sometimes I am slow or mentally overwhelmed. Sometimes when I do make a big effort, I stay up too late and my H gets angry that I an not looking after myself. Sometimes I get 9 out of 10 things right bit my H starts an argument with me over the 1. 

I don't know what else you could tell us that would allow is to offer more suggestive insight but from what you wrote so far, I don't really have a sense of her voice, of what she does and says when you tall about rhese things or how she responds when the situationals come up


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

QuietSoul said:


> You have had some thought out, helpful responses here. I won'tvrepear whatvotgers have already said, but I do have a few other comments for you to consider.
> 
> 1. Firstly, just an observation, and comparison to my own situation... You have sex every day, even on days when you are arguing, and even in this difficult season where you are considering divorce. I am not judging you (in fact i am impressed) but it does seem strange to me. I know if I was not feeling emotionally close with my husband, or things were tense between us, I would probably not feel like being sexually intimate with him, at least as often.
> 
> ...


What a nice post. Thank you. This forum is so supportive and frankly restores my faith in internet forums. Wow. Thank you all.

Before I answer QuietSoul, let me say that I wanted to downplay the whole cultural aspect because for one thing I am about as accustomed to her culture as anyone could be. Also, the stereotypes of Asian women are way off base. My wife is very much not the stereotype anyway. She's bold and not submissive, but in a good way. You can't hear what I'm saying about her, and think I'm overlooking some cultural thing. The only stereotype I suppose you could apply to her is her sex appeal, the physical appearance, melts me because I find her to be one of the most sexually attractive women in the world. That is something I have to stop applying so much weight, because so much about her crushes me and frankly I'd say the odds of me leaving are very high. Arrgh.

QuietSoul. Thank you. To answer you --

1. Yes we argue. What I think is that the house gets filthier and more cluttered. I overlook it. Until finally I can't even walk inside our pantry. My word, here we are living in a gorgeous home (2800 sq ft single level, no McMansion and just a beautiful layout). We even have a walk-in pantry to keep food. I never grew up like that. Imagine, your own pantry. How on earth can she never clean it, through stuff in there, on top of each other, continue buying stuff and just piling it on top of each other until finally there's junk all over the floor. It's so gross. Then I invest one hour of my time, and I should be more generous and not complain because it's just one hour. But I have to empty the entire thing, throw out bags of food. Re-organize it. During this time I build up anger and maybe lose my temper and say LOOK AT THIS IS THIS NORMAL? NO. THIS IS GROSS. Then I start carrying on about how the entire house is always full of junk, she can't take anything out to the garbage. She even lets garbage pile up on our counters because she doesn't want to put it in our compactor. It's like a sickness. Then the kids, I am the only one directing them to clean. 20 years of this.

But despite these episodes where I lose it, so to speak, later we forget it all and make love. Yes I do it because she's the sexiest thing in the world, and it's great exercise. She's probably a nymphomaniac. There's nothing she loves more. So we somehow make love daily no matter what. Maybe in her mind she thinks I will always be married because we do that. We may be the only couple with perfect sexual chemistry who get a divorce?

2. Big mistakes. OK good question. So here's the deal. I am a tinkerer and to a small extent an inventor. In around 1999 I created something very unique and it survives to this day. It was very successful. We have trademarked some property. We earn money from that. But I continue throwing money at other ideas, and so many do not pan out. It's hard to get a string of winners going. Let me tell you. Like writing music I guess. You get one hit, but no more hits? In 2007 I did have a very successful period which still goes on now, but I did not implement it correctly. I was the first to do it, then others copied it totally, and they are the ones making money. Also, I put tons of time into a project around 2009, total fail, closed it up entirely, actually damaged our reputation a tiny bit for setting it up then closing but I had to cut bait. Then around 2011 I had a chance to do something really big, but I focused on a different aspect and again, all the effort was lost. In 2014 I launched a new product and frankly it is the best in the entire world. Even in Zurich Switzerland they have an inferior version, I improved it. It is an absolute masterpiece. But I believed in it TOO MUCH. If you believe in yourself too much, you can end up on the short end of the stick. In this case, my new product is actually taking off locally but slowly. Also, I don't own the equipment that it's made on, so that company with the equipment makes all the profit for now. It's really a money loser. But we shall see. 

So my mistakes are career related. I don't work for anyone else but I'd like to. I'd like to change my company and have it spun off. Then I can get a "real job" in my area of expertise, and give our marriage another shot, but my wife will not likely change. She will not hold my hand, walk side by side, or keep a clean house. I don't think she will change. 

3. I don't love my wife at all anymore because of what I've described here. I want to connect with a woman who enjoys the outdoors, who cherishes moments alone outside walking together, and who can keep a clean house. I only love my wife for her physical appearance and insatiable sex drive.

4. I think she really loves me, doesn't understand how close I am to leaving, and doesn't want to become a divorcee. Too much uncertainty for her.

Thank you.


----------



## john117 (May 20, 2013)

In our McMansion, the cat has his own pantry, adjacent to this three room cat suite  (bedroom, attached full bath / litterbox, walk in closet with built in shelves adapted for cat tower use).

Seriously, as immigrants grow older they grow more fond of their culture of origin... Initially little things, then more and more. Have you considered this?


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

john117 said:


> Seriously, as immigrants grow older they grow more fond of their culture of origin... Initially little things, then more and more. Have you considered this?


Probably so. Yes I would agree. Very good point.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

john117 said:


> Seriously, as immigrants grow older they grow more fond of their culture of origin... Initially little things, then more and more. Have you considered this?


The only thing is, her behavior in terms of not wanting to walk together, not coming around to talk to me when I'm sitting down, this endless clutter and filthy home keeping, well it's not her "culture of origin". I was just at a popular location yesterday and noted several couples who appeared of the same Asian culture, all strolling together. It's pretty hard to find a guy walking with his wife a few feet back, in her culture. Not here and not in her country. I've tried to dismiss it on cultural grounds before but that theory does not hold water. Three years observing it too.


----------



## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

It sounds like she is over-spending on things that get thrown away. Why are you allowing this? You make the money. You give her the money. She mishandles it. You get upset, but there are no natural consequences to her mishandling of the money. She gets to do whatever she wants and spend however she wants while you are making all the money, but you don't do anything to change the dynamic. I fail to see how this is all her.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

CynthiaDe said:


> It sounds like she is over-spending on things that get thrown away. Why are you allowing this? You make the money. You give her the money. She mishandles it. You get upset, but there are no natural consequences to her mishandling of the money. She gets to do whatever she wants and spend however she wants while you are making all the money, but you don't do anything to change the dynamic. I fail to see how this is all her.


It's not the money it's the mess. I don't mind losing $2.80 on a half eaten bag of potato chips, etc. You'd really have to see the mess she makes. It piles up and there is zero organization. 

She earns money too. We don't argue about money we have all we need but we don't live an expensive life. We just pay ourselves a modest salary and keep the rest. That is because we own a company. I don't look at the pantry, and scuzzy fridge (she never throws anything out), and think of money wasted on the moldy leftovers and blackened coriander that she brought home 7 weeks ago.


----------



## john117 (May 20, 2013)

Those couples could be second generation or fob's (fresh off the boat)... If they're all your age, that's different.


----------



## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Your son is 11. Have him be the garbage collector in the house. If other children are still home, assign them duties as well. You don't have to do it all. And, quit rewarding your wife's behavior with banging her brains out. You're sending two different messages and it isn't fair to her.


----------



## QuietSoul (Feb 11, 2012)

If I am hearing you correctly, I am perceiving that at a deeper level from the physical practical things that are happening (not cleaning, not walking with you etc) that the heart issue is that you have expressed your feelings and frustrations to her and her response indicates she doesn't care and is not trying to improve these things, even knowing how important by hey bare to you. Like she doesn't care about by your feelings and isn't committed to sharing the load of responsibilities


----------



## Spotthedeaddog (Sep 27, 2015)

Guth said:


> The only thing is, her behavior in terms of not wanting to walk together, not coming around to talk to me when I'm sitting down, this endless clutter and filthy home keeping, well it's not her "culture of origin". I was just at a popular location yesterday and noted several couples who appeared of the same Asian culture, all strolling together. It's pretty hard to find a guy walking with his wife a few feet back, in her culture. Not here and not in her country. I've tried to dismiss it on cultural grounds before but that theory does not hold water. Three years observing it too.


Most of my experience is from people in and around Japan and some less western areas of China.

If that is the norm where you are, then I would say she sounds like she is clinically depressed and seeking to be difficult in a non-active way. When a person is depressed many of the factors in their life turn upside down with regards to judgement - instead of doing things to make life better, the thought hits them as a dullness and makes them feel stretched and tired. They seldom if ever get positive emotional feedback from success or working on something - it is just an energy sapping time filling chore, more on par with waiting in the ED than building something worth effort.
Generally they plod along, doing minimum, avoiding things which could make them happy or make them sad; in a numb cocoon. Sometimes they get a burst of activity, which frequently results in more problems as seldom does the energy outlast the barriers. Often this involves people trying to give "encouragement", which actually feels more like people pouring cold urine on them than actually helping. What is worse sometimes they succeed at their goal...only to plunge them into a post-event depression (damned if I can remember the proper term at the moment). here's a near random page which gives some ideas about dealing with such stuff:
5 Ways to Battle Post-Event Depression: Life After An Event

So try reading up and asking some questions about depression and see if some of that seems to fit.


----------



## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Having great sex with a woman you're not in love with, every night?
You're not normal. If you don't love her, it shouldn't be all that.

My advice:
Hire a housekeeper since you're so wealthy-- duh...

Start doing things that make you happy and don't be so dependent on your wife for social stimuli, and count your lucky stars you have regular good sex with a woman you find attractive.

Start changing your own attitude and see if she changes hers. Found out what she needs. Take care of her, maybe she will give more of what you need.

You have a loyal wife who takes care of her body and gives you great sex.

Lose her and you'll see what youre missing. This thread sounds like bs to me, but you have my advice.

There are no perfect people. You're never going to find a woman that satisfies your every need. Start satisfying your own needs. You are capable.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Hi. Thanks.



Evinrude58 said:


> Having great sex with a woman you're not in love with, every night?
> You're not normal. If you don't love her, it shouldn't be all that.


Do you speak from experience? I am posting here thinking it's odd but who knows. I am her first and only sexual partner. She is my first virgin.



Evinrude58 said:


> My advice:
> Hire a housekeeper since you're so wealthy-- duh...


It depends on what you call wealthy. The money we pay ourselves is modest. Now we have two kids at university so that's around $35k per year after tax cash going out the door, and thankfully they are on scholarships otherwise it would be more. We own property which is how the bulk of it is. We could pay a housekeeper though.

We had three kids and the house was a total dump, but now we've got it down to one kid. Housekeeper with one kid? I'm working on him helping out. From my view if a kid grows up with someone else cleaning his room and scrubbing his toilet, what kind of precedent does that set? By the way she is now out of town visiting her family overseas and our house is all tidied up and staying orderly without her.



Evinrude58 said:


> Start doing things that make you happy and don't be so dependent on your wife for social stimuli, and count your lucky stars you have regular good sex with a woman you find attractive.


Agreed. This is good advice.



Evinrude58 said:


> Start changing your own attitude and see if she changes hers. Found out what she needs. Take care of her, maybe she will give more of what you need.


Well I think the bulk falls on her. She's ridden a gravy train of nice homes, zero money problems, three beautiful kids, husband that does all the organization (which has really broken me, I've outlined the fact that I'm dad AND mom). I have been basically every man she could ever want. Loyal and productive and an epic father figure. In return she wanders behind me everywhere we go, doesn't want to leave the house, keeps a totally messy cluttered house. The more I type these things the more I want to get OUT of this.



Evinrude58 said:


> You have a loyal wife who takes care of her body and gives you great sex.
> 
> Lose her and you'll see what youre missing. This thread sounds like bs to me, but you have my advice.


I can see why you are suspicious because I've read other posts here and some seem contrived. If you're a longtime poster maybe you have an eye for the made up stories. But this is purely legit and I am a real person with this situation.

The sex is, she's a taker not a giver. I could go into details but is it necessary. She doesn't initiate anything and basically pulls me in and loves every second. In some respects the sex with her is like the other activities in our life. I am responsible for everything outside of bed and everything when the lights go out too. I consider myself a very good lover, and most likely I could get better sex elsewhere. The thing about my wife is her track record of 20 YEARS of wanting it all the time. Now that's remarkable and I've loved it.


----------



## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

You're resentful of the life you have created for yourself. Would you have been happier if she had not been a virgin and had some experience?

You know those fabulous kids you have? Well, guess who carried them for nine months and delivered them.

You let all these gripes and moans build over the course of the relationship instead of tackling them early in the marriage. Notice how many times I have typed the word you? I hope you do get a divorce and find out that you're not really all that in the world of dating. Your wife won't have a problem replacing you. Good luck.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Thanks. I think it's called for. 

I'd like to be single for awhile. I'll do it with or without being married, so separation or whatever. As a man there are how many women to date every week? Too many to count. That's just a fact. A 40+ year old woman, this idea of someone else to replace me, it's a bit of a stretch. Not that I am so amazing but look how we met, were, did, shared language, knowing the culture, etc. 

I look forward to being not married to her. Not sure what she will do but I'll get a bit of a laugh knowing that whoever takes her on is getting messy counters and filthy fridge for life, and everything else that comes with it. Good riddance. I guess every person who chooses to end a marriage is not concerned that she is off with someone else.

If you've ever seen the movie Paris Texas I can identify with it. Need time AWAY from what I have now. It will take 6 months at least. Hope I can keep it together in the meantime. Any other comments appreciated. Thanks again.


----------



## MikeTO (Aug 18, 2016)

OP like other have stated unless you stop having sex with your wife she isn't going to take what you say seriously. You should sleep somewhere else. Just try this for a month and maybe she will listen.


----------



## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

You need to tell her the things that need to change, and have a "reevaluate date" set. Let her know the date. When that date comes, you can either stay if she seems to be changing for the better, or initiate divorce if she is not. She needs to know that every (you set the time frame) you will be reevaluating the marriage, and making a decision, so she doesn't think it is a game and slip back into old behaviors.

At least this way you won't be blind siding her. BTW, I don't believe she will change.

Don't stop having sex with her, because that is the only good thing about the marriage. However, if the date comes that you reevaluate and decide you are going to divorce her, stop having sex. It is not fair to her, and it will mess with your head and take away your resolve.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

IMFarAboveRubies said:


> You need to tell her the things that need to change, and have a "reevaluate date" set. Let her know the date. When that date comes, you can either stay if she seems to be changing for the better, or initiate divorce if she is not. She needs to know that every (you set the time frame) you will be reevaluating the marriage, and making a decision, so she doesn't think it is a game and slip back into old behaviors.
> 
> At least this way you won't be blind siding her. BTW, I don't believe she will change.
> 
> Don't stop having sex with her, because that is the only good thing about the marriage. However, if the date comes that you reevaluate and decide you are going to divorce her, stop having sex. It is not fair to her, and it will mess with your head and take away your resolve.


Thanks. Have you done something like this? In reality, I have spoken with her before. I tell her so sincerely things, and then she does change. The thing is, it's such a joke because she changes for like ONE DAY. That's why it's so funny. I have told her before, that she does zero with the kids to support their homework, involvement in school, etc. So that evening she goes and spends a long time working with our son. Wonderful! Then the next day and forever thereafter she never does it again. On cleaning it's worse. Because with cleaning she may listen to what I say but not even clean up for a single day. I am so convinced she will never change. So the decision I have to make is if I put up with it for the rest of my life or leave. 

I'm sorry to say at some point, and likely in the next year, I'm out. The finances must be dealt with. 

It's best to liquidate what we own before I leave. Yes, continue having sex with her as these financial things are sorted out and we move, purchase new property that is easily split by courts. In the meantime sex with her is about all I'll have to look forward to at the end of the day, and I think I've said enough times she is absolute perfection in my eyes in terms of beauty. I am resolved to know I'll not likely see the same physical beauty in my next marriage, if there is one, but other things will play a more important role! My wife is not really that beautiful either but her look and body turn me on to no end. That is the crazy thing about these events I am about to go through. Yikes.


----------



## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

No, I haven't actually done it to completion, but I am in the process. Setting a date (or time period) has strengthened me. I am learning what I need to get in order now, so I am not overwhelmed when (if...probably "when" though) I pull the plug. I'm even filling out the D papers because they are intimidating and require a lot of work to get everything together.

Since you have told her what you need, and she is not taking you seriously, you will probably have to divorce her.


----------



## Guth (Oct 23, 2015)

Here's a strange thought. When I think of her hooking up with someone new, the only thing that bothers me would be if he insulted her appearance. Like hey you got little tits. Or anything about her looks. Swear I'd want to kill the guy. That's it. I have always called her gorgeous and beautiful and praised her looks from day 1. I hear some men make disparaging comments about their wife. That is not me.


----------



## NobodySpecial (Nov 22, 2013)

Guth said:


> So the decision I have to make is if I put up with it for the rest of my life or leave.
> 
> I'm sorry to say at some point, and likely in the next year, I'm out. The finances must be dealt with.


Have you considered TELLING HER THIS and see if it spawns a meaningful, longer term change?


----------

