# Fellas... Bringing another woman into the bedroom. What's your stance?



## Blue Moon (Sep 7, 2009)

Many hetero women I've found are curious about having some kind of sexual contact with another woman. My question to the husbands who have a wife with even the slightest curiosity is, what are your groundrules and how far are you willing to go?

And if you've had a threesome or some kind of play with another woman in the bedroom, what was the outcome? It's an interesting topic to me since most men (myself included) wouldn't entertain the idea of another man. 

As far as my situation goes, the jury is still out on how I'd feel about another woman but I'm not going to lie, I wonder about it sometimes. The closest I've been (which isn't close at all, lol) with the wife is a three-way kiss with her and one of her girlfriends. It was more drunken playfulness than anything and wasn't like making out. 

But anyway, discuss!

Oh yeah, wives are welcome to discuss too


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## GAsoccerman (Mar 24, 2008)

I would be fine with a FMF or a MFM, my wife would prefer a FMF.

We have done neither, because it is probably something we should leave to a fantasy.

we've talked about it, just were never in the mood to execute it I suppose or never found the right person to do it with.

I think probably a couple swap would be best for us anyway.


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## bella09 (Jul 5, 2010)

I would say this answer solely depends on the closeness and trust, basically the strength of your relationship with your wife. Has she been with another female before? There are so many things to take into account because this could lead to pure disaster if you're not careful. Most men will say either yes to bringing another female in or no to anyone at all. You'll find a few that will say yes to another man, but not many. Choosing the "third party" is where things get tricky. She'll probably want it to be a close friend that she's comfortable with, but then you both would have to face her outside of the bedroom when friends get together, etc. You'll have to address any insecurities, is her friend hotter than her? Don't agree to someone that you might think is even slightly more attractive physically than your wife because even if you think things went alright, your minds will play dirty tricks on you. You could find yourself thinking about this other woman in another way, your wife could start to develop those feelings as well. From me to you, I'm saying don't let it go further than just talking about it, I have personally seen these things go south faster than the speed of light. If you love your wife and want to stay happy and in love with your wife and vice versa, then don't act on it. FYI, my husband would tell you the same thing, don't open pandora's box because you might not be able to close it.


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## MrRomantic (Jun 14, 2010)

I would never do it because I would never allow another man into the bedroom. Even if she said she was ok with another woman, I can totally see it becoming an issue down the road if she decided she would want another man.

I think it should stay in the fantasy realm when it comes to your wife. Girlfriend? that seems reasonable, if the relationship isnt meant to work out, not much harm done then


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## jasmine0247 (Jul 9, 2010)

Don't do it. 

Even if she is interested she will (on the inside) be hurt that you touched/looked/had sex with another woman. Even if she doesn't think that now.

Been there.


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## tjohnson (Mar 10, 2010)

Agree with others. 
From personal pre-marital experience it turns out more complicated/worse then you really think. 

From other secondhand info i can gather the sentiment is it is a Pandoras Box" as previously weell articulated is a box better left closed and locked. 

If you choose to move forward after evaluating the catestrophic risk it places on the marriage consider the following:

1) while confortable avoid a 3rd that you will have to see again. Rule out friends etc. If you have ever slept with a "friend" with the good intention of not changing the nature of the relationship or know someone who has it changes the relationship forever. Just because you are both married and profess to never develop feelings or to think the 3rd will not...i would think again. 

2) Don't think that if a fgf is allowed that a mfm will be suggested after in the interest of fairness. Even if this was not a part of the deal before. Your wive may want you to understand what she is feeling on a conscious or unconscious level. 

3) Set ground rules of what is/not acceptable and allow for a bail out plan if one mid-stream decides to stop. 

Part of the excitement of this sort of thing is like the rush of basejumping or some other activity like this. The thought is exciting but, just educate yourself and evaluate the risks. Don't make the decision in the presents of the 3rd or in an aroused state as that will cloud judgement. Evaluate and consider all the ramifications in "worst case scenario" mode. 

I personally would love to know and it would add to the value of the forum what you decided or not. If it works people may be intersted the circumstances and how you made it work.


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## Anooniemouse (May 5, 2010)

There are some real horror stories form this on this very board if you look around. Things like relationships continuing on with one of the parties, or it being perceived as an open invitation to play the field ... 

I'm not sure its worth the risk. Even when I was still in my 20's, and played around quite a bit -- this led to complications when I tried it. Not necessarily relationship ending complications, but it led one to decide for a time to switch her preference. She changed it again a few years back, but by then no hope of fixing any of that with me.


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## Squire (Jul 14, 2010)

Don't do it, been there, not worth it as time goes on!
My wife has a female friend that likes women. We had talked about it a lot, got us both turned on, so one day we did it, just the one time. It was fantastic at the time I must say!
Now 2 years later it still comes up. For the first year she would go into this weird stage where she felt dirty, that she looked in the mirror and felt disgusted with herself. Then the blame went to me, it was my fault, have I seen her, has she called, etc etc. I think you get the picture. So here we are 2 years later and she seems over the "feeling dirty", but now it's "Remember what i did for you?". We will talk about it while we are having sex sometimes and she gets so turned on it's fantastic.

I love her to death and it was a night I will never forget but a night I will always regret.

My advice..... leave it a fantasy.... not worth the issue's it can cause.


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## Tammigirl57 (Aug 15, 2017)

I wanted to try it, but I am afraid. Afterwards, I know I will not want my husband anymore because he's been with another woman other than me even if I fantasize about it, it's not the same thing in reality. I did allow him to go to an massage parlor for full service, but he didn't like it and afterwards I had nothing but regrets. Some people are much more free spirited than others and can be alright with a threesome, but it isn't for everyone. That's for sure. I'm going to leave it alone. I love my husband and I don't want to share.


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## Tammigirl57 (Aug 15, 2017)

@jasmine0247 I totally agree.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

I think it can be done, but it's not easy, because sometimes, people catch feelings in these situations, too. Sometimes, the wife catches feelings for the woman, or the husband does. It can lead to a lot of pain, from what I've heard. (and read, on this forum, too) I'd be careful if you try this.


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## JustAFamilyMan (Aug 27, 2015)

No thanks. For dozens of reasons, but perhaps the most important being the desire to keep that part of my life between myself and one other without the opportunity for confusion or displacement.


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## chronicallyfrustrated (Jul 21, 2017)

Lots of downer responses here. I'll throw in my own story.

My husband and I have done this with much success. My husband is heterosexual, and I am bisexual, so another female is our natural choice. Our threesome partner is female, and is someone I was previously in a monogamous relationship with. She has a different body type from me, which makes interacting with her sexually intriguing for both my husband and I. When she and I have sex, it's like a vacation from man-land, where foreplay is the main course and pace/pleasure are highly valued. When she and my husband have sex, he comes back to our marriage more invigorated and more passionate about my body/my body type. When we have sex together, it's been historically playful and enlightening. She and I really enjoy teaming up on my husband.

Our mutual sexual interaction with another woman has been a benefit to our marriage. In many ways, it has excited us both and brought us closer together. In some ways, it has uncovered hidden insecurities, or inconsistencies in the way we treat each other, which can then be directly addressed and resolved (as opposed to festering unnoticed.) If I feel jealous, this is a reflection of insecurities I have about myself or our marriage, and I can bring these up and receive affirmation from my husband. I can identify ways in which I am insecure in myself (marriage or no marriage, threesome or no threesome) and work on those independently. I don't believe it is my husband's job to keep me secure in my sense of self - I'm my own responsibility, and he is his own responsibility.

This relationship has worked for us because the partner we brought into our relationship is discreet and trustworthy, and she knows what she wants out of sexual relationships. She is also married, and so there is no broader concern about man-stealing. She is not interested in having children, and we use at least 2 forms of birth control for each encounter.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Zombie thread.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

If I ever am with an OM, it will be just one on one, not into the threesome stuff at all.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*Why on earth would I ever want to make a conscious choice to jeopardize the feelings, faithfulness, and the closeness of the loving woman that I have vowed to exclusively love with all of my heart and soul? 

And given the fact that she has hereby reciprocated those very same vows unto me?*


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## 241happyhour (Jan 31, 2011)

My wife and I have talked about it and we mutually decided that we are going to leave it to fantasy. We have close friends that do this and it definitely works for them but it's just not our thing. I understand the desire and "want to" and if y'all talk about it and it's a go then gitty up and make it happen.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

I talked about it with my FWB. She would be into it. For her it wouldn't matter if it was FMF or MFM. I have no desire for anything but FMF, but even that would be somewhat daunting to me. She would have an issue with who makes who cum and when. Women have the ability to get off many times, so they can get O's from both partners. Men OTOH, usually are good for one good O, at least until they recover. She has an issue with who would get to enjoy that. IOW, she would not want me to get off with another woman, even though I might be enjoying her. Instead she thinks that she should be the one and not the OW. 

But that is quite a bit different than being in a married, committed relationship. My FWB is very sexual and she wants to explore that side of herself. If she swung over to the "other" side though it wouldn't bother me much and if I kept hooking up to with the OW, she wouldn't really be bothered as well. But again this is an NSA relationship so that would be different.

I think for a married couple it would all come down to how you each view sex. Some people believe sex is such an emotional act, that they would never dare think of sharing their SO with another. Others realize that in reality, we are not meant to be monogamous, so they might look at it as a new venue to keep the passion alive. Still others, wouldn't even bat an eye at the idea and would look forward to it.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Old thread, but it never got much attention until revived.

My wife kissed a girl - it did nothing for her. She thinks women are pretty, but that's about it. She's decidedly straight. And we've brought other women into the bedroom for me, other men for her, and couples for us. Some of those weren't very exciting, mostly because they had poor skills. Some did have skills, and we were in tune with each other, and that lead to some of the best sexual experiences of our lives. Those people got invited back, or invited us back. We also learned some great new things that regularly employ in our own sex life. Other than some big disappointments with some of these people, we've never had any problems otherwise - with them, or between us.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy (Jun 2, 2011)

I had planned a FMF that never happened (the relationship I was in broke up) but I'm hoping someday to try with the same lady with my new bf. 
I went on a date with her, we kissed a little. We chat and send pics. I needed a connection and to trust and know her first. I am 100% comfortable with her and trust her fully. I can't see any problems happening if she decided to join us some night. 

I have done MFM once so far with a few different people taking the second M spot throughout the night. It was quite fun and we loved it. No bad feelings, no problems. We ended up being even closer and I felt safer and more loved after. Unlike if a female came in, I had and wanted no connection to them. No names. I barely spoke to them. 

We both prefer MFM or group with 1 F and we are both happy and satisfied with just each other, we are both good at boundaries (no OS friends) and we trust each other, and we communicate a lot about sex, so it works. We talk a lot before, during, and after. We are just very open and able to clearly discuss things. We both have a set word if we need it to stop. 

It's not something we'd want to do all the time but just for a fun night here and there. 

I wouldn't even consider us an open couple. We would never sleep with anyone else without the other there.


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

I don't play well with others. 
I also don't share my toys.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Spicy said:


> I don't play well with others.
> I also don't share my toys.


*It's not necessarily that I can't "play well" or "fair" with others ~ far from it ~ it's just that those that I've asked to mutually trust, betroth, and marry can't seem to be able to "play well" or "fair" with me!
*


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *It's not necessarily that I can't "play well" or "fair" with others ~ far from it ~ it's just that those that I've asked to mutually trust, betroth, and marry can't seem to be able to "play well" or "fair" with me!
> *


Amen to all you said and volumes more on this subject. Those are the two lines I always used to make it clear what my feelings were to anyone that was going to date me.


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## VladDracul (Jun 17, 2016)

Some folks may be happy with threesomes, swapping, et cetera but if you're needing the sexual stimulation of another person and crave it so much your willing to risk the potential fallout for that stimulation, you're married to the wrong person or wrong to be married at all. Or maybe somethings wrong with you in that your addicted.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Tammigirl57 said:


> I wanted to try it, but I am afraid. Afterwards, I know I will not want my husband anymore because he's been with another woman other than me even if I fantasize about it, it's not the same thing in reality. I did allow him to go to an massage parlor for full service, but he didn't like it and afterwards I had nothing but regrets. Some people are much more free spirited than others and can be alright with a threesome, but it isn't for everyone. That's for sure. I'm going to leave it alone. I love my husband and I don't want to share.


I dont think that committing adultery makes you free-spirited, but very foolish and unwise.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

VladDracul said:


> Some folks may be happy with threesomes, swapping, et cetera but if you're needing the sexual stimulation of another person and crave it so much your willing to risk the potential fallout for that stimulation, you're married to the wrong person or wrong to be married at all. Or maybe somethings wrong with you in that your addicted.


Yes, we've been very happy with it on occasion. It's fun. Need? No. Crave? No. Risk? Minimal with carefully selected partner(s). Married to the wrong person? No - we're absolutely right for each other for a relationship (whether or not that's marriage). Wrong to be married? That's your opinion, one we can't agree with; neither of us think much of marriage, but it can be a useful tool because of the legal benefits - either you're committed to the relationship, or not. Addicted? No.

Some people may have one or more of the issues you mention, but most (at least a large majority of those we've met) do not.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

arbitrator said:


> *Why on earth would I ever want to make a conscious choice to jeopardize the feelings, faithfulness, and the closeness of the loving woman that I have vowed to exclusively love with all of my heart and soul?
> 
> And given the fact that she has hereby reciprocated those very same vows unto me?*


What a refreshing post. :smile2:


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Diana7 said:


> I dont think that committing adultery makes you free-spirited, but very foolish and unwise.


Although I think cheating is poor form, I think some adultery can be tremendous fun.

The following lyrics "Try it; you might like it / But you might / smudge your lipstick", from the Pulp song Your Sister's Clothes, describe some of the fun that can be had.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Personal said:


> Although I think cheating is poor form, I think some adultery can be tremendous fun.
> 
> The following lyrics "Try it; you might like it / But you might / smudge your lipstick", from the Pulp song Your Sister's Clothes, describe some of the fun that can be had.


The happiness and intimacy and trust in my marriage comes from intimacy and faithfulness. Its precious and special.


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## harrybrown (May 22, 2013)

chronicallyfrustrated said:


> Lots of downer responses here. I'll throw in my own story.
> 
> My husband and I have done this with much success. My husband is heterosexual, and I am bisexual, so another female is our natural choice. Our threesome partner is female, and is someone I was previously in a monogamous relationship with. She has a different body type from me, which makes interacting with her sexually intriguing for both my husband and I. When she and I have sex, it's like a vacation from man-land, where foreplay is the main course and pace/pleasure are highly valued. When she and my husband have sex, he comes back to our marriage more invigorated and more passionate about my body/my body type. When we have sex together, it's been historically playful and enlightening. She and I really enjoy teaming up on my husband.
> 
> ...


Does her husband know? Is he okay with this? When does he get to play?


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## Luvher4life (Jan 15, 2016)

Opportunity has presented itself for a FMF a couple of times at least. It seemed I was always attached to one of them, so there was no way I would go through with it. I am truly a one-woman man.

Now that I'm married, there is no way I would bring another person into our sex life. It is adultery, pure and simple, even if it is consensual. I would much rather be with the one woman I love and trust anyway. Adding anyone else would just break that vow of marriage for me.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Tammigirl57 said:


> I wanted to try it, but I am afraid. Afterwards, I know I will not want my husband anymore because he's been with another woman other than me even if I fantasize about it, it's not the same thing in reality. I did allow him to go to an massage parlor for full service, but he didn't like it and afterwards I had nothing but regrets. Some people are much more free spirited than others and can be alright with a threesome, but it isn't for everyone. That's for sure. I'm going to leave it alone. I love my husband and I don't want to share.





Tammigirl57 said:


> @jasmine0247 I totally agree.


Dear Tammigirl57; 

I saw where you tried to talk about this by responding to an old thread and the moderators shut it down.

If talking about it would give you some support or closure, then please start a thread in this area.

From the other thread, you had a medical reason why you couldn't have sex with your H and that is why you gave him permission to visit a massage parlor and get a happy ending. Unfortunately, the hand job escalated into "full service" which is slang for vaginal intercourse. Clearer boundaries on your part and much more self control on the part of your husband should have been discussed. 

It is for those reasons that most recommend absolutely no sex with others in a marriage. 

Again, if you feel it would help to discuss this more to gain closure and perspective, then start your own topic. 

Good luck.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

For me a FFM or FMF sounds like great fun - but as a fantasy. I know that my personality would not be well suited for this. I'd enjoy it - but I'd want it again and probably form too much of an attachment to the other F. I'm just not wired for casual sex. 

Not a snowballs' chance in hell of my wife want it, so its not an issue anyway. She barely wants a MF. 

I think that for the subset of people who are wired to enjoy it, its fine, and I'm jealous of the9r ability to enjoy themselves in a way that wouldn't work for me.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

I once heard a woman say most men are hardly attentive/skilled/have stamina enough to satisfy just one woman at a time, so two is a definite non-starter! 

(of course that assumes the women to be primarily heterosexual rather than bisexual enough to deal with each other)

But the point is well taken for men with heterosexual women--not much in a FFM for the gals here.


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## chronicallyfrustrated (Jul 21, 2017)

harrybrown said:


> Does her husband know? Is he okay with this? When does he get to play?


Yes. They have their own written agreement and set of rules around who is an acceptable partner, safety and frequency. He seems to be OK with it, but we aren't close with him, so I have no idea if he's harboring hidden resentments etc. He's a man of extremely few sexual partners, even at 35 years old and having never been married, so I'd be surprised if he's had any additional sexual partners. I know he has had some additional love interests, to which his wife responds with interest/excitement, but I am not sure what her husband has or has not pursued.


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## thedope (Jan 3, 2017)

Terrible idea.


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## NickyT (Aug 14, 2017)

I am a woman and the FMF fantasy is very much a part of my sexual fantasy life. My relationship would not withstand me seeing my husband enjoy another woman, and I know that. So, it remains a fantasy. 

And, as another responder said, if I am ever going to be with someone other than my husband, it is going to be one on one. I am not, at least not in this lifetime.


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## knobcreek (Nov 18, 2015)

Not an orgy guy, plus I think in an FMF situation it's all about the women wanting to explore each other and you're a third wheel. I would almost feel more secure in MFM situation where we both just nail the lady, that's just me though. I may still encourage it if she waere attractive enough.


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## Vinnydee (Jan 4, 2016)

You asked the wrong guy. My wife and I shared her girlfriend for 30 years of our 45 years of marriage. We had a few others in our bed too. Turns out that my wife started to fantasize about women and women only. She would ask her girlfriends to join us in bed using me as bait. Did not do anything other than a brief kiss and fondle until her best friend got divorced and was complaining about not having sex for 8 months. My wife asked her if she would like me to take care of her little problem. She said yes since she had a crush on me from when we were teens and after her girlfriend had her orgasm with me, I invited my wife to join in. We all loved it so much and we already had feelings for each other since we were kids, that we gave our girlfriend her own room in our house and she was in our life and bed for the next 30 years. We only moved away from her 7 years ago but keep in touch and she visits when she can. 

My wife and I were used to threesomes as our regular sex. It took us a few years to get used to not having another women in our bed. Couple sex is that as good as a FFM threesome. So much more you can do with three people and for the bi girls, they get the best of both worlds. Having said this about our poly triad, bringing girls into your marital bed puts your marriage at risk and all other couples we knew who did this divorced because of it. Our case was unusual since we already treated our girlfriend as family before the sex began. Plus both women were long time best friends and bisexual but afraid to tell one another. Usually the other women only has sex with the husband and that can cause problems.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Luvher4life said:


> Opportunity has presented itself for a FMF a couple of times at least. It seemed I was always attached to one of them, so there was no way I would go through with it. I am truly a one-woman man.
> 
> Now that I'm married, there is no way I would bring another person into our sex life. It is adultery, pure and simple, even if it is consensual. I would much rather be with the one woman I love and trust anyway. Adding anyone else would just break that vow of marriage for me.


It does break the vow, completely. Marriage is for a man and woman, and adultery always has serious consequences eventually.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

I would never have a threesome of any kind with a woman I was invested in. Random strangers, sure, but never a wife or girlfriend. I have zero interest in sharing my partner with anyone else. My wife and I made a vow to each other in a church in front of our families. I don't plan to jeopardize that for an orgasm.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

*



Fellas... Bringing another woman into the bedroom. What's your stance?

Click to expand...

*My husband replied, "yes, please."* :grin2:
*


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

am i the only one thinking that a woman asking to bring another woman in for a FMF threesome....is somehow angling for it to become a MFM threesome in the near future? 

Tread carefully here.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Not necessarily. She might be bi and enjoy the idea of playing with another woman as well. 



Talker67 said:


> am i the only one thinking that a woman asking to bring another woman in for a FMF threesome....is somehow angling for it to become a MFM threesome in the near future?
> 
> Tread carefully here.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Talker67 said:


> am i the only one thinking that a woman asking to bring another woman in for a FMF threesome....is somehow angling for it to become a MFM threesome in the near future?
> 
> Tread carefully here.


What's good for the goose is good for the gander.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy (Jun 2, 2011)

Talker67 said:


> am i the only one thinking that a woman asking to bring another woman in for a FMF threesome....is somehow angling for it to become a MFM threesome in the near future?
> 
> Tread carefully here.


Why is a MFM so much worse than a FMF?


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

It depends on a person's interests. I think XYX only works well if X is at least somewhat bi, so that they can enjoy playing around with the other X. 

Personally I wouldn't want a MFM because I'm too straight to enjoy having another naked man in the bed. Nothing wrong with people who do want it, just not for me. 



SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Why is a MFM so much worse than a FMF?


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy (Jun 2, 2011)

uhtred said:


> It depends on a person's interests. I think XYX only works well if X is at least somewhat bi, so that they can enjoy playing around with the other X.
> 
> Personally I wouldn't want a MFM because I'm too straight to enjoy having another naked man in the bed. Nothing wrong with people who do want it, just not for me.


I agree, the words "tread carefully" that were used made me feel like FMF was ok but be careful she doesn't want a MFM cause then it's bad.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Talker67 said:


> am i the only one thinking that a woman asking to bring another woman in for a FMF threesome....is somehow angling for it to become a MFM threesome in the near future?
> 
> Tread carefully here.


This seems to be a common fear amongst men in the internet "manosphere," but I do not think it is a realistic concern in the real world. 

In my experience in the swinging lifestyle, women that are into other women and are interested in FMFs are typically not interested in other men much if at all. 

And of the women that are interested in experiencing two or more males, they are open and able to discuss it upfront and don't rely on the subterfuge and manipulation of dovetailing a MFM out of a FMF. 

People that are adventurous and sexually open enough to have sex with multiple people are usually pretty open and upfront about it and just say what they want to do and don't rely on manipulation and smoke and mirrors.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

My stance on this topic is if my wife wanted to bring another women into the bedroom for 3way and there was another woman that was down to join us - then why on God's Green Earth would I not be all over that???????

If we are talking about two grown, adult, sane, sober, consenting women wanting to have a 3way with me, then barring any religious restrictions or any personal moral beliefs against it, there is no reason not to enjoy it. 

For some people that is going to go against their religious beliefs and I understand and respect that. But we are talking about consenting adults here and if all parties are wanting to do it, then why not??????

I think a lot of people are too governed by fear and dogma. 

Back when we were active swingers, we had well over one hundred sexual encounters with other people. Most were couple/couple and group sex encounters but there were several FMFs and a couple MFMs as well. 

There was not one problem or any falling sky events or any negative repercussions that ever came from it. Some events were better and more fun than others, but all were exciting and pleasurable and fun to one degree or another and nothing bad or destructive ever came from it. 

Yes, if there is dishonesty and manipulation and duress taking place, there will be problems. 

But if 3 people actually want to have a sexual encounter together and none of them are being manipulated or having their arm twisted, then why not????????

There is much fearmongering and dogmatic thinking in this thread and the current "open marriage" thread. 

Are there people that had 3somes or swinging or open marriage at some point in their background that are now divorced or experienced infidelity or marital problems? Of course! 

50% of all marriages end in divorce and infidelity, abuse, neglect and incompatibility are facts of life and part of reality whether people maintain strict monogamy or engage in consensual non-monogamy. 

neither monogamy nor consensual non-monogamy guarantees happily ever after and neither gurantees that someone won't fall out of love with their spouse or guarantees that their spouse won't fall in love with another. We all take our chances and we all roll that dice whether we choose to remain monogamous or choose to invite some others into our marital bed.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

oldshirt said:


> Are there people that had 3somes or swinging or open marriage at some point in their background that are now divorced or experienced infidelity or marital problems? Of course!
> 
> 50% of all marriages end in divorce and infidelity, abuse, neglect and incompatibility are facts of life and part of reality whether people maintain strict monogamy or engage in consensual non-monogamy.
> 
> neither monogamy nor consensual non-monogamy guarantees happily ever after and neither gurantees that someone won't fall out of love with their spouse or guarantees that their spouse won't fall in love with another. We all take our chances and we all roll that dice whether we choose to remain monogamous or choose to invite some others into our marital bed.




Now to be honest, I had and to a degree still have the same fear as everyone else, that my spouse will fall for someone else or that I will pale in comparison to a play partner whether male or female. When we were first discussing inviting others into our bedroom, I too had the same fears of other guys being better hung than me, better looking, better lovers etc etc 
I had and still have the same insecurities and fears as everyone else on this planet. 

But the way I looked at it was there are no guarantees no matter what lifestyle choice you and she can fall in love with Bob in accounting at work just as easily as some man or woman that rubs up against her in a swingers club. 

The risk of marriages experiencing infidelity or loss of affection or falling out of love is present whether you go out for a fun night together at a swingers club and hook up with another couple, or try to lock down your marriage as tightly as you can. 

There are cultures that do not allow their women to leave the house without a male relative chaperone and keep the women covered in bedsheets from head to toe so that no one can actually seen them. They are denied education and not allowed to be employed outside the home and not allowed to even speak to an unrelated male. All of this is in the attempt to ensure their sexual fidelity and to keep them from hooking up with other dudes. And guess what...........they still have infidelity in those places. People still cheat. People still fall in love with others. And even though it isn't even legal to divorce, people still leave their spouses. 

That tells me that restriction does not work. Fidelity and happily ever after can not be assured regardless of monogamy or consenting non-monogamy. 

So if my chances of getting cheated or dumped are 50/50 even if we maintain strict monogamy - then why not get out and live it up and have fun and excitement and great sex while you can??? 

Yes my wife may leave me for another at some point. But I have had years of awesome fun and excitement and pleasure as a couple. I could have spent that time sitting in front of the of TV on couch and had her leave me for someone at work and had nothing to show for it. 

We are pretty much retired from the lifestyle now and I am mostly an armchair swinger and internet warrior on this forum now. But trust me, if she says she wants to invite some chick to come join us in bed one of these days, I am not going to look a gift horse in the mouth and the only question coming out of my mouth is what can I do to make it great for everyone!

If other people want to be Timid Forest Creatures and scamper into the foliage at the first hint of something untraditional and worry about an endless stream of "What-Ifs", that is their prerogative and their choice. I am going to living it up and if I have a heart attack and die in the middle of it, at least I will have a smile on my face :-D


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

oldshirt said:


> Yes my wife may leave me for another at some point. But I have had years of awesome fun and excitement and pleasure as a couple. I could have spent that time sitting in front of the of TV on couch and had her leave me for someone at work and had nothing to show for it.


I agree. Of course, the better your connection, quality of marriage, and sex life, the less likely it is that anyone else will be better overall. And if someone is, then she/I should go be with them so we're happier. The novelty and excitement is short term in these scenarios. We're really not concerned that anyone else could be more appealing, given our wonderful history and incredible compatibility both in and out of bed. If your marriage has significant problems or lacks, then bringing others into your bedroom will only emphasize those issues. People with problems are more likely to cheat, than swingers with a good marriage.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Agreed. I see them as completely symmetric, but if someone agrees to one, they should be clear at the outset whether or not they are happy to try the other.





SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> I agree, the words "tread carefully" that were used made me feel like FMF was ok but be careful she doesn't want a MFM cause then it's bad.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

I've heard that people end up having feelings in some of these situations, I can see that happening. That is what would concern me, not so much physically inviting someone into our sex lives. My husband has no interest, and neither do I, but if I were to have an interest, the feelings part would concern me. Maybe one of us develops more of an emotional attachment to the person.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Agreed. I think a lot of people believe that they can have casual sex, but find that when it happens they develop an attachment. 

I wish I could enjoy casual sex, but I know I can't. 



*Deidre* said:


> I've heard that people end up having feelings in some of these situations, I can see that happening. That is what would concern me, not so much physically inviting someone into our sex lives. My husband has no interest, and neither do I, but if I were to have an interest, the feelings part would concern me. Maybe one of us develops more of an emotional attachment to the person.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

uhtred said:


> Agreed. I think a lot of people believe that they can have casual sex, but find that when it happens they develop an attachment.
> 
> I wish I could enjoy casual sex, but I know I can't.


Yea, I don't judge anyone who has casual sex but I can't really enjoy sex if there's nothing else there, but the sex/chemistry. Part of good sex to me anyways, is that you know the person well, that they're not just a prop for pleasure.


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

Sex allows my wife and me to be intimate with and vulnerable to each other in a very unique way. It enhances our love relationship and builds and reinforces the bond between us. 

Speaking for myself, I have never been able to have sex without some kind of emotional attachment because sex is an act of service. When I have sex with my wife, I am completely devoted to meeting her needs first and foremost. Meeting her needs makes me feel fulfilled in a very unique way. It is physical pleasure, but it is also an expression of love between us.

Bringing a 3rd into our bedroom would mean extending our relationship to that person, because I would experience sex the same way with her and invest myself in her the same way. I am not able to wrap my head around mercenary sex whether it be a 3way or some other kind of sanctioned fling. I am certain that even a "no strings" sexual relationship with a 3rd would end up with strings, because that's the way that I am wired and how I approach sex. I don't think that I would be capable of fooling around with a 3rd in our marriagebed without weakening my relationship with my wife. At best it would be a distraction keeping me from making my relationship with my wife everything that it can be. At worst it would sap the energy and strength that sex brings to my marriage.

I am monogamous because I feel a very deep sense of satisfaction from focusing on our marriage. I really enjoy being so completely focused on my wife. It is very humbling to know that she could choose to give herself to others, but instead chooses to give that part of herself to me. It is very gratifying to work through the dry spells together, working to keep our sex life vibrant and deeply satisfying as life throws curve balls at us (not to mention aging).

My wedding vows are not chains that keep me from looking outside my marriage for sex or bringing someone else in. They are only a reflection of the kind of marriage that I want to have and live. I forsake all others not because I spoke the words. I spoke the words and live them because it is the way that I want to live my life with my wife.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Married but Happy said:


> I agree. Of course, the better your connection, quality of marriage, and sex life, the less likely it is that anyone else will be better overall. And if someone is, then she/I should go be with them so we're happier. The novelty and excitement is short term in these scenarios. We're really not concerned that anyone else could be more appealing, given our wonderful history and incredible compatibility both in and out of bed. If your marriage has significant problems or lacks, then bringing others into your bedroom will only emphasize those issues. People with problems are more likely to cheat, than swingers with a good marriage.


you said everything spot-on. 

If you have a great marriage and a good love, respect and compassion for each and have great communication, then if you both of you want to explore some form of non-monogamy then you can do it without having any unsurmountable problems. 

But if you have a crappy marriage, then it will blow it apart (and other things will probably blow it apart just as easily)

I always compared swinging with wind on a fire. If the fire is well established and burning brightly, a wind will make it burn hotter and more intense. If the fire is weak and flickering, the wind will blow it out. 

So too is swinging. If the marriage is well-established and solid, swinging will make it hotter and more intense. If it is weak and teetering on the brink, it will push it over into the abyss.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

*Deidre* said:


> I've heard that people end up having feelings in some of these situations, I can see that happening. That is what would concern me, not so much physically inviting someone into our sex lives. My husband has no interest, and neither do I, but if I were to have an interest, the feelings part would concern me. Maybe one of us develops more of an emotional attachment to the person.


My experience is in relation to swinging specifically and not open marriage or polyamory or some kind of long term triad like Vinnydee, so keep that disclaimer in mind. 

But when we were swinging there were A LOT of feelings. It was never a cold, detached and purely physical endeavor for anyone. There were a lot of feelings of fun and elation. Feelings of warmth and affection. Feelings of friendship and comorraderie and a genuine like and affection for people. There were also obviously feelings of attraction and desire.... and yes there were many orgasms and great sex and a lot of sweat and heavy breathing. 

So it's not that there were never "feelings" involved because the reality is there were a lot of them. 

But in swinging, it is something that couples do together as a couple, usually with other couples....... kinda like doubles tennis LOL. 

So while there are 'feelings' it is something that you are doing with your own spouse and it is something that they are doing with their own spouse. As what Married But Happy said, each couple has their own bond, their own history and their own life together and at the end of the evening everyone goes home with their own partner and back to their own home and marital life together. .......and usually with a little wicked grin and wink between them. 

(and then swingers often have incredibly intense "reclamation sex" when they get home, but that is a whole other topic :-D ) 

So yes there are feelings. But those feelings are still within the marital bond. Swinging for us was intramarital sex even though it did involve other people in the bedroom. 

I'm sure it sounds like word soup and an alien language for someone who does not do it or has not experienced it. But that is how it worked for us and many of the couples that we knew in the lifestyle.


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

oldshirt said:


> If the fire is well established and burning brightly, a wind will make it burn hotter and more intense.


And destroy everything around it when a stray spark lands or it gets out of control. Just my opinion.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

pplwatching said:


> And destroy everything around it when a stray spark lands or it gets out of control. Just my opinion.


Could that happen?? Sure. Anything is possible. 

But just like a bonfire in the back yard, the more effort people try to understand the risks and take personal responsibility to try to minimize them as much as possible, the less likely you are to burn the house down. 

Can it still happen despite all your efforts to control and contain it? Yeah probably. 

But if you want to live of life of guaranteed safety and security and have a life without risk - you picked the wrong universe to live in. 

My opinion is your spouse is just as likely to fall out of love with you due to boredom and stagnation and same-old-same-old as they are to fall out of love with you going out and partying and dirty dancing and living it up at a club. 

And you and your spouse are just as likely to cheat or fall in love with someone at work or at the gym or at a coed softball team or running club as you/they are to fall for a swing partner. 

It comes down to do you want to take your chances by playing it safe and following all the 'rules' of society and hoping everything works out the way it is "supposed to"? 

Or do you want to take your chances by living life to the fullest and getting the most out of it that you can. 

If you choose the former - all the power to you and I hope it works great for you. 

I chose the latter. I figured my wife could leave me just as easily with someone she meets at work while I am home getting fat on Doritos at home. If I'm gonna go down - I'm gonna go down swinging. If I'm going to strike out, I'm going to strike out swinging for the center field fence and not just standing there watching the pitch go by.


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

oldshirt said:


> And you and your spouse are just as likely to cheat or fall in love with someone at work or at the gym or at a coed softball team or running club as you/they are to fall for a swing partner.


My wife is significantly less likely to fall for someone at work (etc) because we actively spend time working on our marriage and our relationship with each other. We spend time together sexually to reconnect, relax, have fun, and energize our marriage. Getting here was no walk in the park, but the journey has made us stronger. It doesn't affair proof us by any means, but it does help sway the odds in our favor. Adulterating our bond by spending time swinging or bringing others into our bedroom would distract us from that and put the focus elsewhere. Taking our attention off of each other and replacing it with the attention of another sexual partner would seem to me to increase the odds of her falling for an extramarital partner.

Perhaps for a swinger the odds are about the same for both of your examples. I don't know, but I suppose it would depend on the marriage and their circumstances. I would hazard a guess that it increases the odds of both, but that's just a guess based on many years lurking around boards like these. Many people cheat because their relationship is unsatisfying, they feel abandoned and disconnected in their marriage, or don't value their marriage and spouse. I have seen posts that imply may things although they may not represent the average couple's experiences, and probably largely omit what happens to swinging couples.


Respectfully,


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

oldshirt said:


> Could that happen?? Sure. Anything is possible.
> 
> But just like a bonfire in the back yard, the more effort people try to understand the risks and take personal responsibility to try to minimize them as much as possible, the less likely you are to burn the house down.
> 
> ...


It's not following the rules of society, because societies moral values are getting worse and worse, it's wanting to keep the promises made in the marriage service, of wanting to treat your spouse with love and respect, or knowing that faithfulness is vital, and of keeping that special intimacy between husband and wife.

These things are living to the fullest. Sleeping around when you are married always ends badly.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

oldshirt said:


> My stance on this topic is if my wife wanted to bring another women into the bedroom for 3way and there was another woman that was down to join us - then why on God's Green Earth would I not be all over that???????
> 
> If we are talking about two grown, adult, sane, sober, consenting women wanting to have a 3way with me, then barring any religious restrictions or any personal moral beliefs against it, there is no reason not to enjoy it.
> 
> ...


Its not about fear or dogma, it's about focusing on what marriage is, what sex in marriage is for, and how vital faithfulness is.
No point in marriage unless you are going to keep that intimacy between the 2 of you. 
If you are not going to forsake all others, then don't get married. 
Being here makes me forever grateful for the many men I know who would never act that way.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

oldshirt said:


> My stance on this topic is if my wife wanted to bring another women into the bedroom for 3way and there was another woman that was down to join us - then why on God's Green Earth would I not be all over that???????
> 
> If we are talking about two grown, adult, sane, sober, consenting women wanting to have a 3way with me, then barring any religious restrictions or any personal moral beliefs against it, there is no reason not to enjoy it.
> 
> ...


Sorry, but I must disagree with the "But if 3 people actually want to have a sexual encounter together and none of them are being manipulated or having their arm twisted, then why not????????"

Why not is simple. Having a threesome or more in your home town among friends, business acquaintance and others, imho, will possibly cause disruption for years to come. Just too many ways it can go wrong. Others have expressed the negatives.

Again, imho, the way to properly do threesomes and more is to arrange it with professional prostitutes or swingers' clubs. The key is to never do it in your home town or, even, state. My wife and I have had fmf, ffmf, ffmff and, of course, FKK and swingers' club in Europe. Tijuana is a fun place. The key to it is that it is a physical act and not emotional. Love the body but don't care about their personality. The wife has stated and I have agreed no other males will touch her. This has worked for 33 years. Heading to Prague for our next adventures.

Thanks for posting.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Diana7 said:


> It's not following the rules of society, because societies moral values are getting worse and worse, it's wanting to keep the promises made in the marriage service, of wanting to treat your spouse with love and respect, or knowing that faithfulness is vital, and of keeping that special intimacy between husband and wife.
> 
> These things are living to the fullest. Sleeping around when you are married always ends badly.


It's two different life perspectives and I'm not sure the devote monogamist and the swinger will ever meet in the middle. 

All I can say is that we do treat each other with love and respect and we believe we have a very special intimacy between us. It's an intimacy so special in fact that it has allowed us to invite others into our bed and all has worked out well.

I also really thought back to when we first started discussing this (after 10 years of traditional marriage and 2 kids) and it has been a couple months shy of 13 years since we first started dipping our toe into the swinging waters. It has been 13 years and nothing has ended badly yet. 

Now if there is some kind of time-delay fuse that blows up after more than 13 years, then I guess I will be proven wrong. 

But in 13 years, a lot of bad things could have happened had we not started swinging as well. And that has kind of been my point to all of this - monogamy does not provide any guarantees and it is not any kind of force-field against bad things happening either.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

Diana7 said:


> Its not about fear or dogma, it's about focusing on what marriage is, what sex in marriage is for, and how vital faithfulness is.
> No point in marriage unless you are going to keep that intimacy between the 2 of you.
> If you are not going to forsake all others, then don't get married.
> Being here makes me forever grateful for the many men I know who would never act that way.


I think that the problem here is the thought patterns of males and females. Women seem to view sex more as a purpose. Men seem to view sex as exercise, entertainment, need for physical release and plain fun. No purpose except to be happy. 

I respect the opinion but feel the puranical view of sex in marriage actually causes divorces. Love does not overcome a man's sexual need. If his lover does not provide what he needs, he will look elsewhere. Bottom line, imho, love cannot take the place of sex.

OP, in the scenario where the woman will only provide sex once a month but the male NEEDS it almost daily, what would you recommend: husband, tough it out, divorce or visit a professional for an non-emotional romp?

Thanks.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

George36 said:


> Sorry, but I must disagree with the "But if 3 people actually want to have a sexual encounter together and none of them are being manipulated or having their arm twisted, then why not????????"
> 
> Why not is simple. Having a threesome or more in your home town among friends, business acquaintance and others, imho, will possibly cause disruption for years to come. Just too many ways it can go wrong. Others have expressed the negatives.
> 
> ...


OK I get your point and it does have some validity. 

But it is kind of like saying driving a car is dangerous because there are drunk drivers on the road and someone could run a stop sign and the driving conditions change in inclement weather and road conditions and some people don't wear their seatbelts and if the brakes of the car aren't maintained they can fail etc etc etc etc etc 

Yes, non-monogamy has inherent risks. Noone has suggested that it doesn't. 

Monogamy has inherent risks as well. 

recklessness and irresponsibility and ignorance and ill-intent can blow up a monogamous relationship just as readily as non-monogamous one. 

Part of adult life is being informed and responsible and recognizing the potential risks and taking prudent steps towards reducing and managing those risks. 

If people do not want to put in the time and effort to research what they are doing and don't want to put in the time and effort to understand and manage the risks - then they should not be doing that particular activity. 

And that applies to everything from driving a car, riding a bicycle, skiing SCUBA diving, painting the house on a ladder, kayaking down a river etc etc etc etc etc etc. 

My point in my post above assumed that we are dealing with sane, sober, consenting adults who are thoughtful and intelligent enough to think about what they are doing and to determine what risks might be involved and to take prudent steps to manage, reduce and mitigate those risks. ....and then understand that there could still be some kind of negative occurance that still comes out of left field that they will have to deal with. 

C'mon people. This shouldn't have to be spelled out as a legal disclaimer in fine print with every single post about consenting adults doing what they feel is right for them.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

oldshirt,

We agree mostly. I just believe that sane, rational people will shop for the threesome like they do for cars, house, insurance, etc. I believe that time and effort needs to be expended on investigating the whys and what for of the threesome. Just because they want to have sex would not be enough of a thoughtful review.

I, also, believe that distance from home and loved ones is important. Discretion is the key. To say that a high sex drive for a male needs to be just ignored is fraught with danger. Diane7 discussed that no one around her does it. If it is discrete, out of area and it saves a marriage, I am not sure that I see a problem. Having travelled in many countries for these adventures, I believe that Diane7 would be surprised by those around her if she new the total truth. I have met many mongerers who, up front, will tell you that out of country, out of mind sex saved their marriages. I know the people around me would not believe what my wife and I experience.

Just my humble opinion.

Thanks.


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## Dannip (Jun 13, 2017)

So.....

It all depends


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

George36 said:


> I think that the problem here is the thought patterns of males and females. Women seem to view sex more as a purpose. Men seem to view sex as exercise, entertainment, need for physical release and plain fun. No purpose except to be happy.
> 
> I respect the opinion but feel the puranical view of sex in marriage actually causes divorces. Love does not overcome a man's sexual need. If his lover does not provide what he needs, he will look elsewhere. Bottom line, imho, love cannot take the place of sex.
> 
> ...


Many women enjoy sex for the sake of it, and there doesn't need to be a ''purpose.'' That is a myth that started somewhere, not sure where, but probably the same person who started that myth started the myth that women aren't visual. lol

Women aren't the ''providers'' of sex, that is also a mindset that is archaic. Healthy marriages should have healthy sex lives, barring any medical conditions. But, this idea that men need sex 1000 times more than women, and women are gate keepers of it, is really not true.

And there's nothing wrong with how Diana views sex. This idea that we can't be satisfied enough with just one person and that we should satisfy every sexual kink we have and if our spouse won't satisfy every kink, we should have a right to seek it elsewhere, are also myths that people tell themselves when they want to justify cheating and so on. I don't judge those who want to have threesomes etc but I don't think there's anything wrong with never wanting to be a part of one.


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## pplwatching (Jun 15, 2012)

*Deidre* said:


> This idea that we can't be satisfied enough with just one person and that we should satisfy every sexual kink we have and if our spouse won't satisfy every kink, we should have a right to seek it elsewhere, are also myths that people tell themselves.


I agree, except when two people agree and are happy with sexual variety, whether or not they are rationalizing behavior that may hurt them. I personally believe it's bad for a marriage, but at the end of the day mutual agreement should be a factor. Two people who want a "puritanical marriage" should be able to have a discussion about why it is the right choice for them (beyond parroting), and understand the implications. Two people who want extramarital partners should be able to understand each other and the implications. I think that it's important to acknowledge that not everyone wants the same thing out of marriage or gets the same thing from sex with their spouse. 

Where things become a problem is when one spouse wants it and one doesn't. In an ideal world everyone would understand each other's wiring before marriage and nothing would ever change or go off the rails. In reality we don't always know what we really want, rationalize our choices, or change and life has other plans for our sex drives. Sometimes the less dominant spouse goes along to get along, and the more dominant personality controls the discussion. It's a big discussion full of "ifs" and "buts" for sure. Regardless of how we got to the point of commitment, living it takes work and a willingness to be honest with ourselves and a willingness to really understand our spouse and their needs, and put them first.

My wife and I never really discussed our expectations, we just had them. That was all well and good at the beginning of the road when the relationship was high on bonding chemicals, but seemed to fall apart in practice. We knew that expectations bring responsibilities. A spouse that expects fidelity and doesn't make an effort to meet the other's sexual needs is not living their vows. Likewise, a spouse who marries knowing that expectation and yet doesn't acknowledge genuine effort and justifies extramarital sex in the name of biology isn't living their vows. A spouse doesn't like <insert sex act here> can arguably be living their vows, in which case it's back to communication and compromise versus rationalizing whatever feels good.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

*Deidre* said:


> Many women enjoy sex for the sake of it, and there doesn't need to be a ''purpose.'' That is a myth that started somewhere, not sure where, but probably the same person who started that myth started the myth that women aren't visual. lol
> 
> Women aren't the ''providers'' of sex, that is also a mindset that is archaic. Healthy marriages should have healthy sex lives, barring any medical conditions. But, this idea that men need sex 1000 times more than women, and women are gate keepers of it, is really not true.
> 
> And there's nothing wrong with how Diana views sex. This idea that we can't be satisfied enough with just one person and that we should satisfy every sexual kink we have and if our spouse won't satisfy every kink, we should have a right to seek it elsewhere, are also myths that people tell themselves when they want to justify cheating and so on. I don't judge those who want to have threesomes etc but I don't think there's anything wrong with never wanting to be a part of one.


You believe in a lot of myths. To each their own but i believe that you are categorically wrong on many of them. Let's agree to disagree. Of course, women are the gatekeeper to sex and they overall have a lessor libido than man. Will you find exceptions, sure. But overall, we men are the hound dogs. Just do some googling and look at the statistics. 

Diana is doing great in her beliefs. More importantly, she has shown much maturity by being on this site, asking probing questions and keeping an open mind. She will do well.

Thanks for the post.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

George36 said:


> You believe in a lot of myths. To each their own but i believe that you are categorically wrong on many of them. Let's agree to disagree. Of course, women are the gatekeeper to sex and they overall have a lessor libido than man. Will you find exceptions, sure. But overall, we men are the hound dogs. Just do some googling and look at the statistics.
> 
> Diana is doing great in her beliefs. More importantly, she has shown much maturity by being on this site, asking probing questions and keeping an open mind. She will do well.
> 
> Thanks for the post.


I disagree that women have "less" libido or sexual desire than men. In fact once a woman has had all switches flipped into the on position, there is no man that can match her. 

Where men and women differ are in a number of areas. 

Most men would have sex with most healthy women if there were no consequences where as most women are only sexually attracted to a very few men.

Men's libido is very constant and consistent where as women's a cyclical depending on where she is at in her cycle. 

Men's desire is spontaneous and intrinsic where as women's are responsive and heavily dependent on the environment and the comfort and the amount of seduction and assuming the dishes are done and the laundry is hung up etc LOL

So there are differences in women's sexual response, but they are far from "less" and the argument can even be made that they have a higher capacity.


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## MrsHolland (Jun 18, 2016)

oldshirt said:


> I disagree that women have "less" libido or sexual desire than men. In fact once a woman has had all switches flipped into the on position, there is no man that can match her.
> 
> Where men and women differ are in a number of areas.
> 
> ...


These statements are of course your opinion and not fact. 

Please ppl stop with the unfounded generalisations all it is doing is harm to the next generation when people keep propagating this stuff.

Some women are responsive, some spontaneous. Some men are responsive and some spontaneous. 

As for a woman's libido being related to her cycle, never had this myself and as a woman that is post menopause (as are many of my friends) my libido is very high, we have sex approx 10 times per week with equal initiation and desire levels. My friends that are in my age group have healthy drives so it has zero to do with cycles.
If anything post menopause can increase the amount of sex some have, no risk of pregnancy is the most liberating thing that has ever happened to me.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy (Jun 2, 2011)

I've always enjoyed and wanted sex at least equal to a man, more than many. 
Many of my girlfriends are the same. 

Women are taught and told we don't like sex. We often don't get the chance to express it because there is still negativity to a sexual woman. Women don't as often experiment and figure out what they like and enjoy because we're not "supposed to" sleep around. 

It's not an even playing field, as that changes more women explore and embrace their sexuality. 

There is a thread called sex starved wives, you'll find many women are the HD partner of a LD husband.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

oldshirt said:


> I disagree that women have "less" libido or sexual desire than men. In fact once a woman has had all switches flipped into the on position, there is no man that can match her.
> 
> Where men and women differ are in a number of areas.
> 
> ...


What you just described is a lot of requirements women have that men don't. Maybe this is just semantics, but that sounds a lot like "less" desire. If all these conditions have to be met then the inherent desire is definitely less. As you say, a woman will rock it like any man once all her switches are in the on position. But a mans switches are always in the on position. That sounds a lot like more inherent desire to me. If it's not more desire, it's at least more accessible desire, which in the end has the same net effect. 

(speaking in generalizations only of course, as another post acknowledged, there are exceptions, but this is certainly true in the aggregate)


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

George36 said:


> I think that the problem here is the thought patterns of males and females. Women seem to view sex more as a purpose. Men seem to view sex as exercise, entertainment, need for physical release and plain fun. No purpose except to be happy.
> 
> I respect the opinion but feel the puranical view of sex in marriage actually causes divorces. Love does not overcome a man's sexual need. If his lover does not provide what he needs, he will look elsewhere. Bottom line, imho, love cannot take the place of sex.
> 
> ...


I don't know, we both see sex in a very similar way, as fun, and important, and a way to expresses love in a committed marriage. 
I don't agree it causes divorces at all, I see that marriages where there is faithfulness are far far more likely to last. 

As to your question to the op, I am not going to do either of those things no matter how much or little my husband wants sex. My husband and marriage are far more important to me than that. For better or for worse. Marriage is about love and commitment and keeping the promises made to each other.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

oldshirt said:


> I disagree that women have "less" libido or sexual desire than men. In fact once a woman has had all switches flipped into the on position, there is no man that can match her.
> 
> Don't believe this one at all. If you took a male under the same "all switches flipped on" you would have that man never stop masturbating whenever and whenever.
> 
> ...


Will have to agree to disagree. Typing things like "woman sex drive versus men" into Google brings up results that supports my position as a woman's sex drive being less than a male. I agree there are examples of equal as my wife is one of those. Until she reached her fifties she could keep up with me. Now, I am still daily and she is happy with once or twice a month.

It is funny though that your examples are all of men wanting sex more. See notes above. Btw, we are not talking about capacity. I have the capacity to win the lottery but will probably never happen. We are talking about horniness. Surely you can see that men are much more horny than females, much more often. Take masturbation. A male might masturbate many times a day. Women rarely. 

Please give me your feedback point by point and I will do the same. This is an important discussion as, until you deal with reality, it will be hard to get anywhere.

Thanks for the dialogue.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

I think that if you have to beg your woman for sex on a regular basis, most likely she's not interested in sex...with you.

Barring medical conditions, women aren't turning down sex with men that we have great chemistry with, who love us, and who we connect with in bed. But, I'd quickly become a 'gatekeeper' of sex if it becomes little more than a chore to get my husband off, with no regard to if I'm enjoying it or not. And unfortunately/fortunately, chemistry does matter. If a couple loses that over the course of a relationship/marriage, nothing can take the place of that when it comes to sex. I think this is why there are so many stories on here about marriages where the sex life just dies out. In many cases, it isn't medically related, and the couple has a good life outside of the bedroom. So, in my opinion, that just comes down to chemistry, and not being turned on by the person anymore, and that isn't anyone's fault, but it's something that shouldn't be dismissed and excused with 'women have low libidos.'


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

Diana7 said:


> I don't know, we both see sex in a very similar way, as fun, and important, and a way to expresses love in a committed marriage.
> I don't agree it causes divorces at all, I see that marriages where there is faithfulness are far far more likely to last.
> 
> As to your question to the op, I am not going to do either of those things no matter how much or little my husband wants sex. My husband and marriage are far more important to me than that. For better or for worse. Marriage is about love and commitment and keeping the promises made to each other.


I applaud you for knowing yourself and I am impressed by many of your answers. I do understand your positions. I served as a Legal Officer and Administrative Officer while in the Navy and my job entitled assiting couples before, during and after marriage. I am not a know it all but have extensive experience. Also, I watched 1000s of married sailors going ashore overseas to hire prostitutes. 

I am a realist in these matters.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

*Deidre* said:


> "women enjoy sex as much as men, but we enjoy it with men who are concerned with our pleasure as much as their own. Women aren't turning down sex with men that we have great chemistry with, who love us, and who we connect with in bed. But, I'd quickly become a 'gatekeeper' of sex if it becomes little more than a chore to get my husband off, with no regard to if I'm enjoying it or not.


You supported my point. Thanks. You have conditions on who you have sex with. Unfortunately, normally, we men do not. To us, the only thing important is the happy ending.

If you are saying that, once women find their "shining knight, they ravage him to the utmost like a HD man would ravage a woman, I would agree. But, while a woman is finding that knight, we men would have bedded many hand maidens. 

Thanks for the dialogue.


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## MrsHolland (Jun 18, 2016)

George36 said:


> Will have to agree to disagree. Typing things like "woman sex drive versus men" into Google brings up results that supports my position as a woman's sex drive being less than a male. I agree there are examples of equal as my wife is one of those. Until she reached her fifties she could keep up with me. Now, I am still daily and she is happy with once or twice a month.
> 
> It is funny though that your examples are all of men wanting sex more. See notes above. Btw, we are not talking about capacity. I have the capacity to win the lottery but will probably never happen. We are talking about horniness. Surely you can see that men are much more horny than females, much more often. * Take masturbation. A male might masturbate many times a day. Women rarely.
> *
> ...


This is another unfounded generalisation. It is opinion, not fact.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

George36 said:


> You supported my point. Thanks. You have conditions on who you have sex with. Unfortunately, normally, we men do not. To us, the only thing important is the happy ending.
> 
> If you are saying that, once women find their "shining knight, they ravage him to the utmost like a HD man would ravage a woman, I would agree. But, while a woman is finding that knight, we men would have bedded many hand maidens.
> 
> Thanks for the dialogue.


Are you saying that most men have no standards and as long as they're getting laid, they don't care what the woman is like? lol

I didn't say anything about a shining knight.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

MrsHolland said:


> This is another unfounded generalisation. It is opinion, not fact.


Why do men masturbate more than women?

Nature and nurture. From an evolutionary perspective, men are hardwired to want to orgasm because it’s necessary for reproduction, says Dr John Bancroft, a senior researcher at the Kinsey Institute. “It isn’t the same for women; they don’t need to have orgasms in order to procreate.” 

Article link - Why Do Men Masturbate More Than Women? | Men's Health

Please type into Google and you will find other articles. Please provide contrary facts if you have them. 

Thanks for the dialogue.


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## JustAFamilyMan (Aug 27, 2015)

George36 said:


> You supported my point. Thanks. You have conditions on who you have sex with. *Unfortunately, normally, we men do not. To us, the only thing important is the happy ending.*
> 
> If you are saying that, once women find their "shining knight, they ravage him to the utmost like a HD man would ravage a woman, I would agree. But, while a woman is finding that knight, we men would have bedded many hand maidens.
> 
> Thanks for the dialogue.


What? No, the bolded especially, that's not even close to accurate. The happy ending is the least important part of sex. It's the easiest to get without anyone else involved. The rest are beliefs built from a strange cyclical relationship between how men wanted women to be (abstinent until meeting them and then savages in the bedroom) and how men then decided women must be. Women like sex. A lot. They like to talk about sex. They like to talk about men the way men talk about women. There are people with different libidos, but that line isn't drawn on gender.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

*Deidre* said:


> Are you saying that most men have no standards and as long as they're getting laid, they don't care what the woman is like? lol
> 
> I didn't say anything about a shining knight.


You described a shining knight type man. Are all men dogs, no. While I was on the U.S.S. Midway, an aircraft carrier with 5000 sailors, we went ashore in Australia, Philippines, Singapore, etc, and the vast majority was out in town looking for sex. Over 6 years on ships, I saw more dogs than celibate sailors. I have travelled the world and it is the same. 

So, yes, most men will definitely have sex with a less than desirable woman for the happy ending. Women look for relationship but men seek happy endings. 

Thanks again.


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## MrsHolland (Jun 18, 2016)

George36 said:


> Why do men masturbate more than women?
> 
> Nature and nurture. From an evolutionary perspective, men are hardwired to want to orgasm because it’s necessary for reproduction, says Dr John Bancroft, a senior researcher at the Kinsey Institute. “It isn’t the same for women; they don’t need to have orgasms in order to procreate.”
> 
> ...


I am talking about real world not internet articles. Anecdotally I can tell you of many women and men that the reverse of what you say is true. Also havin been in a sexless marriage years ago I have spent many years and spoken to 1000's of women on the topic and absolutely many women DO love sex and DO masturbate, regularly. 
Many men are LD and many do not masturbate.

It is a very old fashioned way of thinking that the all of a gender is a certain way.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

JustAFamilyMan said:


> What? No, the bolded especially, that's not even close to accurate. The happy ending is the least important part of sex.


I definitely disagree with the above. Does not make sense. Can you tell me the times that you have had sex and been satisfied with no happy ending. Men routinely pay for quickies. On the way to work. On the way home. No way is the happy ending the least important part. Do you have any studies on this or is it your opinion?

Thanks for the dialogue.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

George36 said:


> You described a shining knight type man. Are all men dogs, no. While I was on the U.S.S. Midway, an aircraft carrier with 5000 sailors, we went ashore in Australia, Philippines, Singapore, etc, and the vast majority was out in town looking for sex. Over 6 years on ships, I saw more dogs than celibate sailors. I have travelled the world and it is the same.
> 
> So, yes, most men will definitely have sex with a less than desirable woman for the happy ending. Women look for relationship but men seek happy endings.
> 
> Thanks again.


I know there are guys who just want sex, but a guy doesn't need to be celibate in order to have standards. 

You don't seem like that kind of man. You have been married for a long time, and you seem to have emotional needs that you look for your wife to fulfill. Men and women both want relationships, _and_ good sex. There are exceptions to the rules, but if that weren't the case, men would stop asking women to marry them. Men don't need to get married to get a 'happy ending,' so the only reason they do, is because they too look for a deeper level of intimacy.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

MrsHolland said:


> I am talking about real world not internet articles. Anecdotally I can tell you of many women and men that the reverse of what you say is true. Also havin been in a sexless marriage years ago I have spent many years and spoken to 1000's of women on the topic and absolutely many women DO love sex and DO masturbate, regularly.
> Many men are LD and many do not masturbate.
> 
> It is a very old fashioned way of thinking that the all of a gender is a certain way.


Definitely will need to agree to disagree. Articles and studies are not important? Are you serious? I provide you a study and you provide your experience. I am sorry but I do not believe your experience applies instead of studies. 

Thanks for the dialogue.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

George36 said:


> Definitely will need to agree to disagree. Articles and studies are not important? Are you serious? I provide you a study and you provide your experience. I am sorry but I do not believe your experience applies instead of studies.
> 
> Thanks for the dialogue.


Why do you want to believe that women dislike sex as compared to men, and don't like to have orgasms as compared to men? I don't understand why you are insisting on this, when it's not true.


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## MrsHolland (Jun 18, 2016)

George36 said:


> Definitely will need to agree to disagree. Articles and studies are not important? Are you serious? I provide you a study and you provide your experience. I am sorry but I do not believe your experience applies instead of studies.
> 
> Thanks for the dialogue.


Yet you use you experiences in the army to try and sell your old fashioned ideas.

Twas fun but it is lunch time here.


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## MrsHolland (Jun 18, 2016)

*Deidre* said:


> Why do you want to believe that women dislike sex as compared to men, and don't like to have orgasms as compared to men? I don't understand why you are insisting on this, when it's not true.


I think he is here to just have a lend of us.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

*Deidre* said:


> I know there are guys who just want sex, but a guy doesn't need to be celibate in order to have standards.
> 
> You don't seem like that kind of man. You have been married for a long time, and you seem to have emotional needs that you look for your wife to fulfill. Men and women both want relationships, _and_ good sex. There are exceptions to the rules, but if that weren't the case, men would stop asking women to marry them. Men don't need to get married to get a 'happy ending,' so the only reason they do, is because they too look for a deeper level of intimacy.


Now, you are talking. Why do men get married? Here is a start, 15 Truthful Reasons Men Want To Get Married | HuffPost Again, type into Google and you will find some more reasons.

My wife and I understand each other's sexual needs. We separate the physical from the emotional. My sexual desire is quite extensive and, unfortunately, cannot be ignored. I am not sure a female can readily understand a man's drive. I cannot understand women's shopping, hair styling, shoes desire and plenty of other things. We are wired differently.

Btw, I respect women much more than men. They are stronger and more stable and less likely to allow their libido to get the better of them.

Thanks for the dialogue.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

*Deidre* said:


> Why do you want to believe that women dislike sex as compared to men, and don't like to have orgasms as compared to men? I don't understand why you are insisting on this, when it's not true.


You have missed my points. Women do not "dislike" sex as you write. Of course, they also want orgasms. Imho and studies, women want sex less often than men for the reasons Imhave written about previously.

If it is not true, please find me some articles or studies. I have provided some.

Thanks for the dialogue.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

MrsHolland said:


> Yet you use you experiences in the army to try and sell your old fashioned ideas.
> 
> Twas fun but it is lunch time here.


It was fun and bedtime here. I provided experiences and studies. You provided your opinion.

Btw, it was the Navy.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

MrsHolland said:


> I think he is here to just have a lend of us.


Can't or won't debate but, instead, throw stones. Btw, what does "have a lend of us" mean?

Thanks.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

I have been very respectful in my debating and I have provided articles supporting my positions. I am new here but I would like to ask if there is some club here where contrary opinions cannot be discussed?

If so, I will take my leave from the site and leave you to it.

Thanks.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

George36 said:


> You have missed my points. Women do not "dislike" sex as you write. Of course, they also want orgasms. Imho and studies, women want sex less often than men for the reasons Imhave written about previously.
> 
> If it is not true, please find me some articles or studies. I have provided some.
> 
> Thanks for the dialogue.


What an ironic title. 

Study: Men underestimate how much their wives and girlfriends want sex.


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## SlowlyGoingCrazy (Jun 2, 2011)

I can't stand shopping or hair styling or shoes. I like sex. 

My bf has a very high drive yet has gone long periods without because he refuses to settle for just banging anyone. Amazingly enough he's not an animal, he can control his impulses and desires. 

The problem with studies is that we are not on even ground. You can't get results from studies that don't have the same parameters for both parties. 

Most women love sex. One big problem is many men are bad at sex. It takes a lot more to get us off than it does a man. Him picking up some woman at a bar is a much, much higher probability of him getting off than her. This is one reason we don't hump everything with a penis. 

Add that to the "she's a sl*t shaming" and the chances of us getting raped or murdered (and it's all our fault I mean, what did we expect going home with a man? Oh she was drinking? All her fault) 

Women are going to be a little more careful about who they sleep with. Doesn't mean we don't love sex.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

*Deidre* said:


> What an ironic title.
> 
> Study: Men underestimate how much their wives and girlfriends want sex.


Reading the article makes sense. We men tend to believe women wants sex less. It goes on to say, "These studies have reliably shown that men tend to overestimate the sexual interest demonstrated by these women’s behaviors.". ALso, the age matters. This article was about long term relationship.

Let's just agree to disagree. Goodnight.


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## JustAFamilyMan (Aug 27, 2015)

George36 said:


> I definitely disagree with the above. Does not make sense. Can you tell me the times that you have had sex and been satisfied with no happy ending. Men routinely pay for quickies. On the way to work. On the way home. No way is the happy ending the least important part. Do you have any studies on this or is it your opinion?
> 
> Thanks for the dialogue.


A few dozen? I mean, not having an orgasm during sex isn't all that common, but the times it has happened I haven't left "dissatisfied". Most of those times in fact it's just been a prelude to a much wilder time later that day/night, as the inability to get there is usually due to an interruption. Some men may routinely pay for happy endings. I won't pay for anything.

Why is it you think men pay for sex instead of just masturbating? If the orgasm is all that matters, why go through the hassle some men do to have one inside or on another person rather than taking care of it themselves quickly, for free?


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

JustAFamilyMan said:


> A few dozen? I mean, not having an orgasm during sex isn't all that common, but the times it has happened I haven't left "dissatisfied". Most of those times in fact it's just been a prelude to a much wilder time later that day/night, as the inability to get there is usually due to an interruption. Some men may routinely pay for happy endings. I won't pay for anything.
> 
> Why is it you think men pay for sex instead of just masturbating? If the orgasm is all that matters, why go through the hassle some men do to have one inside or on another person rather than taking care of it themselves quickly, for free?


Men need both physical and emotional support. Paying a prostitute gives you some of both. Physical - happy ending, Emotional - physical contact with a female. Just my humble opinion.


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## JustAFamilyMan (Aug 27, 2015)

George36 said:


> Men need both physical and emotional support. Paying a prostitute gives you some of both. Physical - happy ending, Emotional - physical contact with a female. Just my humble opinion.


I'd share that opinion about what they need, though I don't think I'd describe sex with a prostitute as providing any of it.  

If the orgasm was the ultimate goal, there are many easier ways to get it than paying for it or bar trolling. It's similar with exercise. The endorphin rush is a reward we can become addicted to, but we do not exercise for the endorphin rush. It's an undercurrent, not the carrot at the end, and one you could take shortcuts to acquire anyway. 

Men are more casual with their encounters because they have fewer responsibilities associated with it. If they mess up and get a prostitute pregnant, they don't have to either abort the pregnancy or carry a child to term. They don't have to deal with the social stigma. A man who gets around is just a man bein' a man, a player in the eyes of his buddies. A woman who does that is suddenly morally suspect. 

There is no question the dynamic is different between the two of us, but you can't then march that backwards into blanket statements about what men and women *desire*.


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## George36 (Aug 26, 2017)

JustAFamilyMan said:


> I'd share that opinion about what they need, though I don't think I'd describe sex with a prostitute as providing any of it.
> 
> There is no question the dynamic is different between the two of us, but you can't then march that backwards into blanket statements about what men and women *desire*.


Whether anyone here wants to admit it, prostitutes are a very important part of this world. I can understand your opinion on what you feel you do not get from prostitutes but I disagree. Prostitutes are in every country in every part of the world. 

What do you think the millions of men that daily visit houses of prostitution worldwide come away with? The demand by MEN is great. Why do you think MEN break the law to see prostitutes in many countries?

It surprises me greatly that many here want to promote the same desires by men and women. That goes against ALL evidence to the contrary. The demand for sex worldwide by men is shown by the houses of prostitution worldwide. Please show me the demand needed by women and the commercial use. 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_by_country Prostitution around the world.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strip_club 300,000 strippers to meet demands by men's needs

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massage_parlor Around the world brothels for men

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pornography#Commercialism - CNBC has estimated that pornography was a $13 billion industry in the USA, with $3,075 being spent on porn every second and a new porn video being produced every 39 minutes.[44]. Plus it reads: More than 70% of male internet users from 18 to 34 visit a pornographic site in a typical month.[68] A 2009 study published in the Journal of Economic Perspectives found that Utah was the largest consumer of paid internet pornography per capita in the United States.[69]

The demand by men is great. Where is proof of the demand by women?

https://www.marriage.com/advice/physical-intimacy/how-important-is-sex-for-women/ - The low (or non-existent) sex drive

When it comes to sex women have very complicated sex drives. Many factors can influence desire. There are the short-term influences such as a long day with children or at work, a fight with a friend (or your partner), illness…And then there are long-term influences such as age (menopause), critical health issues, or continual, chronic stress.

i am surprised by the women here defending men. Please, please show this old man that the world has changed and women want to be as warped, sick, addicted and, yes, mentally ill as men.

Do you women want to be like us and have such needs that you chance ruining lives to hook up? Do you really want to be an arrogant person who uses the other sex? 

Sorry, but if you cannot accept these difference between men and women, it will never change. If you cannot be part of a solution, you are part of the problem.

Again, thanks for the dialogue. Wish there were more realist here.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

A few posts back George, you claim that you 'respect women.' Then, you post that above. lol

I definitely think we are not only not on the same page, but not in the same library.

It’s biological for both genders to desire sex. It doesn’t make anyone depraved to desire sex. It’s what you do with the desire, that matters. You seem to imply that having basic biological desires towards sex is somehow wrong or depraved. It’s not. You seem to think that if women desire sex, they’ll desire it the same way men do. Actual people on this site are telling you our observations and experiences, and you keep directing us to Google. I don’t know whether to laugh or be sad that you have such a narrow view of sex and sexuality.


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## JustAFamilyMan (Aug 27, 2015)

George36 said:


> It surprises me greatly that many here want to promote the same desires by men and women. That goes against ALL evidence to the contrary. The demand for sex worldwide by men is shown by the houses of prostitution worldwide. Please show me the demand needed by women and the commercial use.


You continue to be unable to separate what people from from how they want it and how they express those desires. You're repeatedly demonstrating an inability to grasp how culture and the expectations each culture carries with it have helped shape that behavior well beyond biological differences. 

For instance. Which 5 Book Genres Make The Most Money?

Unless you think men are lining up all week long to purchase the next Danielle Steel novel. And before you launch into a "see? Women are all cerebral and like unrealistic love fantasy" you may want to browse the description of these men and the covers on the books once in a while. Yes, there are differences, but you've lost touch with what those are and why some exist.


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

SlowlyGoingCrazy said:


> Why is a MFM so much worse than a FMF?


you do not have the old "my penis is bigger than your penis" argument

AND from the guys point of view....he gets to do TWO women


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

George36 said:


> Now, you are talking. Why do men get married? Here is a start, 15 Truthful Reasons Men Want To Get Married | HuffPost .


wow, what a crock of ****! 15 "reasons" men get married, and not one of them is "Because i want to get laid every day"? totally unbelieveable


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowlyGoingCrazy View Post
Why is a MFM so much worse than a FMF?

Because, to most men, sharing your wife with another man is unacceptable, but you having another woman yourself seems more okay if she's good with it. Also, most men are more likely to be turned on by their wife hooking up with another gal than with another guy. (not justifying this as logical, just saying that's how many men see it). 

Also, men tend to be more homophobic than women. Being in the presence of another naked, aroused man, will kill most guys. Most women probably don't want to be naked with another woman either, but I suspect the frequency and degree of revulsion is a bit less.

Just look at the popularity of lesbian porn among heterosexual men. Conversely, many fewer women are into gay male porn.


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## Rocky Mountain Yeti (Apr 23, 2017)

Talker67 said:


> wow, what a crock of ****! 15 "reasons" men get married, and not one of them is "Because i want to get laid every day"? totally unbelieveable


Maybe in the past when sex before marriage was taboo. But now? Look at all the treads around here about how sexual frequency slowed after marriage. Moreover, how certain sex acts, like oral, come to a screeching halt in so many marriages after the ring is on. 

I'm not sure many people see marriage as a gateway to more frequent sex any more. Daily? That's the sexual 1% right there, and certainly not indicative of most.


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

the guy THINKING he will get laid every day is why he gets married. I never said he actually WOULD get laid every day!:grin2::grin2:


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

I think bringing another woman into the bedroom would be awesome.

Bringing two or more would be even better!!!


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Nope. Fun in fantasy but no on the reality for me.

Though a little girl play short of full on make outs and sex is a serious turn on for me.

Women feeling each other and dancing together do miraculous things in my pants!

No logic here but it is what it is. Mrs. Conan and I agree that boy play is yukky while some girl play is a turn on.

Go figure...


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