# Sexual vs. Emotional Affairs



## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

By Gender, which is worse?


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

I don't think that there is a general rule but they are different. 


For me, if my wife did either it would be similar. I would mostly want to know *why* - not in an accusatory way, but to understand what it was that she felt she was missing and needed to find somewhere else.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

I'm pretty sure I don't want to try both to find out.


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## BioFury (Jul 9, 2015)

Thankfully, I've never experience either, and pray that I never will.


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## Ghost Rider (Mar 6, 2017)

I never even cared that much when my wife had what I'm sure people here would label as an "emotional affair". In fact, I was actually somewhat relieved and thankful to have her obsessive attention off of me sometimes.

I was absolutely crushed when she slept with another man. It sent me into a depression and tailspin like nothing I've ever seen in my life.


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## David51 (Sep 12, 2017)

I hate it when people say that their spouse “slept” with someone else. We are all adults here and rest assured there was no sleeping, a lot of other stuff but definitely no sleeping.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

How I envision Amp when writing the OP:


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## SentHereForAReason (Oct 25, 2017)

I used to think they were so exclusive of each other before my own experience and from all that I have read on here of the past few months but it seems that Sexual or Physical Affairs are much worse in my opinion from the Male's perspective and when dealing with females because I'm learning most of the PAs started as EAs, so they have both elements, making them twice as painful for the BS and maybe even exponentially harder to break free from.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

I'd say EAs. EAs often lead to PAs, as the above poster notes. And the emotional attachment is likelier to lead to a desire to leave. Sex is just sex - and in our experience with open relationships, it's not a big deal when either of us has sex with someone else. Even though we're also poly by nature and agreement, an emotional attachment that could detract from our relationship would be the most problematical to deal with. Of course, it's all more complicated and nasty when it's a clandestine affair versus a mutually agreed to fling.


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

Ghost Rider said:


> I never even cared that much when my wife had what I'm sure people here would label as an "emotional affair". In fact, I was actually somewhat relieved and thankful to have her obsessive attention off of me sometimes.
> 
> I was absolutely crushed when she slept with another man. It sent me into a depression and tailspin like nothing I've ever seen in my life.


I just can't imagine not seeing that one coming. Did it just not occur to you that a romantic emotional attachment would naturally lead to a physical expression of those feelings? Did it occur to you, but you thought your wife would never cross that line, so letting it continue was low risk?


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## Ghost Rider (Mar 6, 2017)

MJJEAN said:


> I just can't imagine not seeing that one coming. Did it just not occur to you that a romantic emotional attachment would naturally lead to a physical expression of those feelings? Did it occur to you, but you thought your wife would never cross that line, so letting it continue was low risk?


I never in a million years thought she was capable of crossing that line, until she did.


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## Red Sonja (Sep 8, 2012)

I look at it this way …

If H is having an EA that means he is complaining about me and the marriage to some OW, instead of airing grievances so we may have a chance at fixing them. He is also giving emotional intimacy and affection to OW, instead of me. A HUGE BETRAYAL.

If H is having a PA with OW, he is now contaminated IMO and has risked my health. Also, A HUGE BETRAYAL.

Doesn’t matter if H is doing it for “love” or sex; either one would (and did) result in divorce.

Full disclosure: I have always (more than) supported myself financially and didn’t have young kids at the time.

Some behaviors are unforgivable, YMMV.


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## Aletta (Aug 7, 2017)

As a woman recovering from husband's sexual and emotional infidelity, I honestly don't see how an emotional affair even remotely compares to sexual cheating. People who claim that the pain is the same have probably not been cheated on properly.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

uhtred said:


> I don't think that there is a general rule but they are different.
> 
> 
> For me, if my wife did either it would be similar. I would mostly want to know *why* - not in an accusatory way, but to understand what it was that she felt she was missing and needed to find somewhere else.


*I’m sorry, but there is no way in hell that I could stay that resolved, more especially when I discovered that they had grossly violated their professed holy vows made to me, and said before God, the clergy, the state, our community, our families, friends, and neighbors, as well as many others!*


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

Both are bad. I'm not sure which is really worse. 

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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*They’re equally bad, diminishing trust to an emaciated point that it may never ever be anywhere close to being fully recovered!*


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## Ghost Rider (Mar 6, 2017)

David51 said:


> I hate it when people say that their spouse “slept” with someone else. We are all adults here and rest assured there was no sleeping, a lot of other stuff but definitely no sleeping.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


It's just an expression. I'm pretty sure everyone knows what it means. 

You may be missing the larger point for the sake of playing word games.


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## Red Sonja (Sep 8, 2012)

Aletta said:


> As a woman recovering from husband's sexual and emotional infidelity, I honestly don't see how an emotional affair even remotely compares to sexual cheating.* People who claim that the pain is the same have probably not been cheated on properly*.


And you would be wrong about that. You can't define other people's feelings or views for them.


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## Rhubarb (Dec 1, 2017)

Both are bad but for me sexual affairs are worse. First with emotional affairs there are the matters of degree and duration and so there's the possibility of extracting oneself before things get out of hand. To be honest everyone has transient attractions to other people. How you handle it is really what's important. Recognizing them for what they are and guarding yourself against them is key. A sexual affair for me is a red line. You cross it, you are gone no matter how much it hurts me.


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## Pepe1970 (Aug 25, 2017)

Red Sonja said:


> And you would be wrong about that. You can't define other people's feelings or views for them.


True. In my case, wife cheated twice. 
The first one was purely emotional and didn't get phisical due to distance and time. Other man lived in another state and have a high rank work position which consumed his time and my wife always been crowded by our kids and their constant activities, plus her job. So it was kind of impossible to lead to any phisical contact besides the phone and kept like that for almost 5 years.
The second affair, she conviniently found another man in a town next to ours where we live and yes there was some small percent of emotional leading to reach phisical affair for 3 years.
For me, the second affair affected me much more than the first. Maybe because of the phisical part. Still recovering from DD 8 months ago.

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## Aletta (Aug 7, 2017)

Red Sonja said:


> And you would be wrong about that. You can't define other people's feelings or views for them.


Well, then this goes both ways. No way you can know how it feels to be me. From my perspective an EM sounds like kids's stuff.


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## Youngwife1000 (Mar 26, 2017)

I think for me both are deeply hurtful, I’m under a year trying to recover from my husbands sexual cheating, multiple partners off a sex site. There were no emotions involved, it was just quick convenient sexual gratification and then he’d be on his way. 7 times in all but I found out all at once.
Never in my life have I experienced pain like it, it tore through every inch of me, totally destroying everything I thought we were, everything I thought I was. As we move forward I’m relieved that I’m not also dealing with the fact that he had feelings for these people I’m glad I don’t have to imagine him whispering sweet nothings and lovingly looking into their eyes. I do feel a sense of relief.
However he did often message ladies from the sight too, not to emotionally connect but he was on there for 8 months and did share huge parts of his life amongst the sex talk. This felt really REALLY ****, I still replay those messages in my head. I hate were I find myself. It sucks.
For me on both, it is the realisation that the person you love is capable of such things, they’re capable of living a double life and capable of doing so quite happily. They are capable of telling and repeating so many lies. I find I look at him sometimes and I honestly dont know him and sadly it repulses me. I’m left broken. I’ve only ever wanted to be enough. 
Sorry for the long post.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Aletta said:


> As a woman recovering from husband's sexual and emotional infidelity, I honestly don't see how an emotional affair even remotely compares to sexual cheating. People who claim that the pain is the same have probably not been cheated on properly.


I think that maybe if a person had sex with a stranger with no emotional connection, for some that may be easier to forgive and get over than if their spouse had a deep emotional connection with another, even if they hadn't actually had full sex yet.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Rhubarb said:


> Both are bad but for me sexual affairs are worse. First with emotional affairs there are the matters of degree and duration and so there's the possibility of extracting oneself before things get out of hand. To be honest everyone has transient attractions to other people. How you handle it is really what's important. Recognizing them for what they are and guarding yourself against them is key. A sexual affair for me is a red line. You cross it, you are gone no matter how much it hurts me.


A real emotional affair is surely so much more than a transient attraction. Its sort of replacing your husband or wife with another, in all ways but sex(or full sex).


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## RWB (Feb 6, 2010)

Like asking the question...

Would you rather be run over by a Honda or 18 Wheeler? Both are potentially deadly. That being said I'd take the Honda.:surprise:


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Diana7 said:


> I think that maybe if a person had sex with a stranger with no emotional connection, for some that may be easier to forgive and get over than if their spouse had a deep emotional connection with another, even if they hadn't actually had full sex yet.



Both are bad but for me personally, PA would be a lot harder to forgive. I don’t think would be able to stop playing mind movies in my head.
It’s interesting there might perhaps be again a gender-specific difference: I would bet that there are more men who would find it harder to forgive a PA than an EA. I actually never heard of EA before until I started reading TAM. Perhaps maybe because often sex means more to men whereas emotional connection means more to women. (All with exceptions as usual).


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Diana7 said:


> A real emotional affair is surely so much more than a transient attraction. Its sort of replacing your husband or wife with another, in all ways but sex(or full sex).




Not to me. If my wife offered her body to another man, I could never forget. Especially since it was not always straightforward for her to offer it to me.
Actually she did have a semi EA some years ago. It didn’t/doesn’t bother me that much. 
It bothered me once when we stopped having sex regularly. 
If she slept with the guy, that would have been it. If it wasn’t a long distance thing, maybe it could have gone further, there’s no way to know now. I made a fuss when I found out and she didn’t realise herself what was happening.
I don’t really blame her to be honest. It is a grey line and unless you are aware what exactly an EA is, it’s very difficult to know or stop yourself talking or writing to someone.
I mean is there such a clear difference between having a male friend and an EA? (Especially when nothing sexual is involved). Nobody is every taught about these things so it can strike one completely by surprise.

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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

Neither is good obviously, but for me...the mind movies of a physical affair would be insurmountable for me.


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## JayDee7 (Sep 12, 2017)

I am what many would call a jealous guy, my wife’s attention and body are for me and no other man. It works for us. She knows I am a jealous guy and is careful to not make friends with men in person or online social media. Either EA or PA would mean it is over.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

farsidejunky said:


> How I envision Amp when writing the OP:


Ha! Nope, not stirring the pot. Just became curious about it after a recent conversation. Years ago, we had a thread on this topic and the genders differed vastly. Men feeling that physical was much worse and women feeling the emotional was much worse. I probably should have not added the both are bad options to force a stand one way or the other to get a truer reading. Having recovered our marriage from a serious LTEA many years back I was just wondering if that had changed. For me, if my wife's EA had turned sexual, I don't think I would have gotten out of the gate in trying to recover. Too much pride and anger I imagine. Had she had a meaningless fling, I doubt I would have either. While terribly painful and damaging to the marriage and myself, the EA didn't cross that line that I knew I would never be able to recover from. The process of killing the EA and allowing time for forgiveness, trust and reconciliation to take effect took years. It was, without a doubt, the most difficult period of my life. If it happened again, I don't think I would have the emotional resolve to go through reconciliation again.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

inmyprime said:


> Both are bad but for me personally, PA would be a lot harder to forgive. I don’t think would be able to stop playing mind movies in my head.
> It’s interesting there might perhaps be again a gender-specific difference: I would bet that there are more men who would find it harder to forgive a PA than an EA. I actually never heard of EA before until I started reading TAM. Perhaps maybe because often sex means more to men whereas emotional connection means more to women. (All with exceptions as usual).
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I would find either very very hard to forgive, but I would eventually forgive for my own emotional wellbeing. However for me I think that both may well end the marriage, and if there had been sex I am not sure I could ever have sex with the man again. Nor would I be able to trust that man again.
I do think that my husband could forgive either if there was repentance, that's the kind of person he is, not that I am going to ever take advantage of his easy going kind nature.


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## Ghost Rider (Mar 6, 2017)

JayDee7 said:


> I am what many would call a jealous guy, my wife’s attention and body are for me and no other man. It works for us. She knows I am a jealous guy and is careful to not make friends with men in person or online social media. Either EA or PA would mean it is over.


It's unfortunate that she is not allowed to make friends with members of opposite sex. Too often people think this is love, but really it is just controlling, abusive behavior.

Through it all, of course, you're the one who is more likely to cheat, not her.

I hope you will find it in your heart to allow her to be a normal human being.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Ghost Rider said:


> It's unfortunate that she is not allowed to make friends with members of opposite sex. Too often people think this is love, but really it is just controlling, abusive behavior.
> 
> Through it all, of course, you're the one who is more likely to cheat, not her.
> 
> I hope you will find it in your heart to allow her to be a normal human being.


It depends on what you mean by friends. Generally I am only friends with men who are my friends husbands. I would never be close friends with a man who my husband didn't know and wasn't also friends with him.


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## RonP (Dec 6, 2017)

Affairs - emotional or the kind that exchange bodily fluids are death to a relationship. That's it.


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## WildMustang (Nov 7, 2017)

I am a woman. My primary love language is physical touch. I feel and express love mostly through physical affection and sex. For me, physical sexual betrayal is much worse, but that doesn't minimize the pain of an emotional betrayal. Both are a deal breaker for me, with the PA hurting more deeply. Once that line is crossed, I'm out.


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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

Sexual affair, not even close for me. 

If my wife had an emotional affair (and nothing more) I would at least be willing to talk it through, see if there is anything left in our marriage worth salvaging.

If my wife had a sexual affair, I would probably get confused with being The Flash with how fast I would serve her ass divorce papers  There is no coming back from that one, not one bit.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

EllisRedding said:


> Sexual affair, not even close for me.
> 
> If my wife had an emotional affair (and nothing more) I would at least be willing to talk it through, see if there is anything left in our marriage worth salvaging.
> 
> If my wife had a sexual affair, I would probably get confused with being The Flash with how fast I would serve her ass divorce papers  There is no coming back from that one, not one bit.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Diana7 said:


> I would find either very very hard to forgive, but I would eventually forgive for my own emotional wellbeing. However for me I think that both may well end the marriage, and if there had been sex I am not sure I could ever have sex with the man again. Nor would I be able to trust that man again.
> 
> I do think that my husband could forgive either if there was repentance, that's the kind of person he is, not that I am going to ever take advantage of his easy going kind nature.




But what exactly is an EA anyway? When does friendship become ‘emotional’?
My wife had a long distance male pen pal for a while. She would tell him about everyday things and her aspirations etc. Occasionally complaining about me not understanding her (once or twice that I know of). There was mild flirting but nothing really sexual. Though she would tell him stuff I would find hard to extract from her. That’s the part that hurt a little.
When exactly does it become an EA and ceases to be friendship? There was never any talk of ditching me or wanting to be with the other guy. Is that something you would leave your husband/wife for?
Seems silly and completely not in the same ball park as ****ing somebody.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Actually I’m being hypocritical: I have tried discussing my marriage problems and even sex life with opposite sex (via text). That would usually be a mutual or wife’s friend. I was never interested in the other person, just discussing the issue and trying to solve it or get a different perspective. Now I have TAM. Do I have an EA with TAM? 


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## Red Sonja (Sep 8, 2012)

inmyprime said:


> But what exactly is an EA anyway? When does friendship become ‘emotional’?
> My wife had a long distance male pen pal for a while. She would tell him about everyday things and her aspirations etc. Occasionally complaining about me not understanding her (once or twice that I know of).* There was mild flirting but nothing really sexual. Though she would tell him stuff I would find hard to extract from her. That’s the part that hurt a little.
> *When exactly does it become an EA and ceases to be friendship? There was never any talk of ditching me or wanting to be with the other guy. Is that something you would leave your husband/wife for?
> Seems silly and completely not in the same ball park as ****ing somebody.


The bolded is the "line in the sand" that should never be crossed. IMO, it is the edge of the slippery slope and it's all downhill after.


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## Red Sonja (Sep 8, 2012)

inmyprime said:


> Actually I’m being hypocritical: *I have tried discussing my marriage problems and even sex life with opposite sex (via text)*. That would usually be a mutual or wife’s friend. I was never interested in the other person, just discussing the issue and trying to solve it or get a different perspective. Now I have TAM. Do I have an EA with TAM?


You were playing with fire. This is, at the very least, highly inappropriate behavior.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Red Sonja said:


> You were playing with fire. This is, at the very least, highly inappropriate behavior.



Inappropriate from what perspective? Towards my wife or towards the friend?
The only purpose of even talking about it was because I thought her friend would make me understand and explain an issue (what appeared to be a female issue) better.
I suppose if I paid a female psychiatrist for the same outcome, it would have been more appropriate? But the psychiatrist wouldn’t have known what my wife was like.
There was never any interest in the person I was talking to - that I remember very clearly - and there’s is no way a guy could have offered me the same depth of insight.
Never had b a million years could the topic itself lead to an affair with the person I was talking to - it was not about the person.

From my wife’s writing to her penpal, I could tell she was curious about him (asking questions about him/his life, rather than talking about an issue).

I mean where exactly is the boundary? Maybe better not to have any conversations with the opposite sex at all? 
Right now I’m talking about an issue about an issue; some are of the opposite sex I presume, is this also inappropriate?


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Red Sonja said:


> The bolded is the "line in the sand" that should never be crossed. IMO, it is the edge of the slippery slope and it's all downhill after.




But one could argue that she didn’t tell me those things because I wasn’t asking and trying hard enough! If I did, she may have told me. 
The line with PA is pretty clear. The line with EA is....all over the place.


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## Rhubarb (Dec 1, 2017)

inmyprime said:


> Right now I’m talking about an issue about an issue; some are of the opposite sex I presume, is this also inappropriate?


This is a public forum. You aren't talking in private. Furthermore if you started seriously flirting here a bunch of people would jump down your throat given the nature of the forum.

Edit: Here's a general rule I use. Don't do anything of this nature that you think would upset your spouse. Would she mind you talking about your sex life with another woman?


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

inmyprime said:


> Occasionally complaining about me not understanding her (once or twice that I know of). There was mild flirting but nothing really sexual. Though she would tell him stuff I would find hard to extract from her. That’s the part that hurt a little.


RS is correct. These are all red flags that it had moved from a friendship level to an emotional one. He is becoming or has become her emotional center, not you. She tells him things she won't tell you. She probably doesn't tell you 50% of the contact or content. It is mostly under the radar. In an EA, the dopamine can spike just as quickly at the sound of his text alert as the sound of his fly unzipping. 

EA's are dangerous because they can slip to the next level without one or both of the individuals knowing it. The "Lines in the sand" are a lot fuzzier, the behavior rationalized and the relationship compartmentalized.


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## Ghost Rider (Mar 6, 2017)

Rhubarb said:


> This is a public forum. You aren't talking in private. Furthermore if you started seriously flirting here a bunch of people would jump down your throat given the nature of the forum.
> 
> Edit: Here's a general rule I use. Don't do anything of this nature that you think would upset your spouse. Would she mind you talking about your sex life with another woman?


What if your spouse is completely unreasonable about this, like mine was? Then where is the line?

I swear to God, the way some people talk in this forum, you'd think we were in Iran.

Honestly, I have trouble believing in emotional affairs at all.


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## Rhubarb (Dec 1, 2017)

Ghost Rider said:


> What if your spouse is completely unreasonable about this, like mine was? Then where is the line?
> 
> I swear to God, the way some people talk in this forum, you'd think we were in Iran.
> 
> Honestly, I have trouble believing in emotional affairs at all.


What exactly is completely unreasonable? As for living in Iran what do you mean? Is anyone claiming couples can't set their own rules? I have my rules. I'm not forcing them on you or anyone else. If a guy wants his wife to walk around in a hijab and his wife wants to wear one, what business is it of mine or anyone else's? 

Perhaps your problem was your standards were incompatible from your spouses, but that doesn't mean there is anything inherently wrong with either set of standards.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Rhubarb said:


> This is a public forum. You aren't talking in private. Furthermore if you started seriously flirting here a bunch of people would jump down your throat given the nature of the forum.
> 
> Edit: Here's a general rule I use. Don't do anything of this nature that you think would upset your spouse. Would she mind you talking about your sex life with another woman?



It’s not so simple. Discussing anything that might be an issue would probably upset her. She may not think we have an issue with even if I think we might have an issue. Does it mean I have no right to discuss it?


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## JayDee7 (Sep 12, 2017)

I should have mentioned she is a jealous woman as well. Example, we are invited to a holiday party of one of my colleagues. The colleague is a married female who I have known and worked with for five years, when I told my wife we had been inviting my wifes second and third questions were what does she look like and does she flirt with you. I said she is good looking but she is married and not a flirt. it works for us. I know she has colleagues who are friendly males and I have friendly female colleagues but it ends there. There are no friendships of the opposite sex. No lunches or phone calls or texts or messages or anything with opposite sex people for either of us unless it is a group setting. We are married, why in the world should either of us have it any other way. 

It works for us, it likely would not work for everyone and that is fine for them.


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## Rhubarb (Dec 1, 2017)

inmyprime said:


> It’s not so simple. Discussing anything that might be an issue would probably upset her. She may not think we have an issue with even if I think we might have an issue. Does it mean I have no right to discuss it?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Right? It's not about rights. It's not illegal, you can do what you want. However I would suggest that discussing anything having to do with the sex-life with your wife or even your relationship with her is not a topic you should be discussing with other women if your wife objects. 

I'm not telling you what to do, but then again if it's causing problems for you, maybe you should change something. This kind of thing isn't about right or wrong. It's about negotiating boundaries that you can both live with.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Rhubarb said:


> Right? It's not about rights. It's not illegal, you can do what you want. However I would suggest that discussing anything having to do with the sex-life with your wife or even your relationship with her is not a topic you should be discussing with other women if your wife objects.
> 
> I'm not telling you what to do, but then again if it's causing problems for you, maybe you should change something. This kind of thing isn't about right or wrong. It's about negotiating boundaries that you can both live with.




It was more a rhetorical question. Let me try and explain better.
Say we have an issue that is affecting our marriage. Talking or discussing it with my wife only upsets her and leads to no resolution and more problems. Talking with a friend (say a female friend of ours/ a family friend) provides a better insight and an objective perspective on the problem that either makes me understand better where my wife is coming from or what the root cause might or perhaps changes the way I think about it. Would my wife be upset finding out that I talked to a woman about our problem? Probably. But not because I talked to a woman but because I verbalised that we have a problem to begin with. Has it fixed the issue talking to someone else? Yes, because you often can’t fix all your issues bu talking to each other - it’s a fairy tale. 
Was it wrong or ‘unethical’ is my question because my wife would probably not ‘approve’ of it even though it was the most productive way to fix the issue.
I really don’t feel that I would be in any ‘danger’ of sleeping with another woman if I discuss a marriage issue. If I was, I would most definitely not do it. And actually I don’t do it anymore (I have perhaps done it twice in the past as well). TAM has replaced the need for it.
I always felt it was more helpful to discuss something like that with a female actually because somehow you get less predictable answers.




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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Rhubarb said:


> This is a public forum. You aren't talking in private. Furthermore if you started seriously flirting here a bunch of people would jump down your throat given the nature of the forum.
> 
> Edit: Here's a general rule I use. Don't do anything of this nature that you think would upset your spouse. Would she mind you talking about your sex life with another woman?



Also: talking in private or talking in public: does it make a difference? I didn’t mean that anything here would lead to flirting or getting to know anyone. just in general: if you share details about your marriage, talk about it, voice concerns and frustration into the ‘ether’ (on TAM) whether to strangers or someone I know: this is not something my wife would be particularly thrilled about. She would ask me to talk to her about it (and I do, but it doesn’t always solve anything).


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

inmyprime said:


> It was more a rhetorical question. Let me try and explain better.
> Say we have an issue that is affecting our marriage. Talking or discussing it with my wife only upsets her and leads to no resolution and more problems. Talking with a friend (say a female friend of ours/ a family friend) provides a better insight and an objective perspective on the problem that either makes me understand better where my wife is coming from or what the root cause might or perhaps changes the way I think about it. Would my wife be upset finding out that I talked to a woman about our problem? Probably. But not because I talked to a woman but because I verbalised that we have a problem to begin with. Has it fixed the issue talking to someone else? Yes, because you often can’t fix all your issues bu talking to each other - it’s a fairy tale.
> Was it wrong or ‘unethical’ is my question because my wife would probably not ‘approve’ of it even though it was the most productive way to fix the issue.
> I really don’t feel that I would be in any ‘danger’ of sleeping with another woman if I discuss a marriage issue. If I was, I would most definitely not do it. And actually I don’t do it anymore (I have perhaps done it twice in the past as well). TAM has replaced the need for it.
> ...


If you want to discuss marriage problems find a male friend or a marriage counsellor. Its not appropriate for you to discuss issues with you wife and marriage with another woman.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Diana7 said:


> If you want to discuss marriage problems find a male friend or a marriage counsellor.



I can discuss some issues with male friends but to be honest none of my male friends are terribly insightful. Why is a male friend more appropriate? Just because I’m less likely to have sex with a male friend? (Both would have in fact the same probability in reality ending up in a sexual encounter so why the ‘sexism’ when it comes to discussing issues?). She would object me discussing any of our issues with male friends, I’m pretty sure.

I don’t think my wife would be very happy if I went to see a marriage councillor on my own either. According to the logic of ‘don’t do anything your other half wouldn’t approve of or be happy about’, I shouldn’t be seeing a marriage counsellor either. Or is it ok because you pay them and it’s their job.. People pay for prostitutes too and they have the same likelihood of ending up in a relationship with you as a sex therapist would (arguably less likely).


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Amplexor said:


> RS is correct. These are all red flags that it had moved from a friendship level to an emotional one. He is becoming or has become her emotional center, not you. She tells him things she won't tell you. She probably doesn't tell you 50% of the contact or content. It is mostly under the radar. In an EA, the dopamine can spike just as quickly at the sound of his text alert as the sound of his fly unzipping.
> 
> EA's are dangerous because they can slip to the next level without one or both of the individuals knowing it. The "Lines in the sand" are a lot fuzzier, the behavior rationalized and the relationship compartmentalized.




Yes of course. I now know all of this now. As does she, kind of, after I explained it all to her. 
The point is, most people (who don’t frequent TAM) have absolutely no idea what EA means; they think as long as there is no sex, it’s all fine. I’m convinced my wife didn’t really know what was happening and I’m also relatively sure if the guy pushed her for more or became more explicit, she would have realised what was going on and backed off (I think, but I can’t be 100% sure of course).
I have read all the email correspondences (that i know of, It was luckily a long distance thing) and it all seemed fairly innocent and only mildly flirtatious. In a kind of ‘close friend’ manner (except she didn’t know him very well, but she said that it is easier to talk to somebody you don’t know well, when I confronted her about it. Which in a way is true because it’s easier for me to write things on TAM too than to talk to someone I know as well).
Anyway, it was all a long time ago and I have no idea if anything would have happened if it wasn’t long distance or if the guy showed more initiative. It was actually my wife who seemed to show more interest in him, than him in her, from the writing. I think at the time, she was going through a rough time and desperately needed someone to talk to. I wish I picked up on this earlier and had been there for her more perhaps.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

inmyprime said:


> I can discuss some issues with male friends but to be honest none of my male friends are terribly insightful. Why is a male friend more appropriate? Just because I’m less likely to have sex with a male friend? (Both would have in fact the same probability in reality ending up in a sexual encounter so why the ‘sexism’ when it comes to discussing issues?). She would object me discussing any of our issues with male friends, I’m pretty sure.
> 
> I don’t think my wife would be very happy if I went to see a marriage councillor on my own either. According to the logic of ‘don’t do anything your other half wouldn’t approve of or be happy about’, I shouldn’t be seeing a marriage counsellor either. Or is it ok because you pay them and it’s their job.. People pay for prostitutes too and they have the same likelihood of ending up in a relationship with you as a sex therapist would (arguably less likely).
> 
> ...


I would never go to a male friend and discuss personal issues. I wouldn't discuss them at all unless my husband was ok about it. If you have marriage issues then that's between you and her, and if you need help then you both need to see a marriage counsellor together.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Diana7 said:


> I would never go to a male friend and discuss personal issues. I wouldn't discuss them at all unless my husband was ok about it. If you have marriage issues then that's between you and her, and if you need help then you both need to see a marriage counsellor together.




She doesn’t think we have issues (issues that are worth seeking professional help for).

Would your your husband be ok if you told him that you have marriage issues and are planning to discuss them with your female friends? (And perhaps go and see a MC?)


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

inmyprime said:


> She doesn’t think we have issues (issues that are worth seeking professional help for).
> 
> Would your your husband be ok if you told him that you have marriage issues and are planning to discuss them with your female friends? (And perhaps go and see a MC?)
> 
> ...


Firstly he would say that we need to try and sort them ourselves. 
He went to MC with his first wife, so I guess he would be ok with that. I doubt if I would ever go to another person with private marriage issues, but if I ever did, it certainly wouldn't be a man.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

I'm still not convinced an emotional affair is a real thing.

So absent thinking emotional affairs are real, my poll answer would be none of the above.

All this emotional affair stuff seems all over the place. Some people have kittens over their partner looking at someone of the opposite sex. While others think talking to others is a bridge too far. While being friends with others or spending time with them etc is an egregious act. Then there's being sexually attracted to another, liking someone, lustful thoughts, unrequited lust/love etc.

Then there is flirting, one of my wife's friends sometimes flirted with me, only while my wife was present. I wasn't attracted to her and I'm sure she wasn't attracted to me either. Likewise my wife wasn't worried about it at all, her friend just wanted to see how quick my wit was and how charming I could be with some banter.

My wife has also sometimes been flirted with as well and has sometimes found it quite flattering.

There was one time in a supermarket about four years ago, when my wife and I were shopping when this gay man who I wasn't attracted to started trying to flirt with me. My wife was with me at the time and we found it funny that he was keen on me and behaved so boldly.

Also circa four years ago, there was this man that took a liking to my wife, who was a client of one of the government services my wife managed. She tried to fob him off by telling him she was married, yet he didn't get the hint and hung around a pub my wife went to after work once a week so he could talk to her. So she told me about him and asked me to come along one night to meet him. I was very friendly and charming towards him and was keen to talk to him about his life and activities. Yet after a little while he didn't want to hang out with us anymore and avoided my wife after that.

The thing is I trust my wife, and will trust her until her actions (not her thoughts) prove otherwise.

I just don't see any point in apoplexy over friendships, or feelings that are absent actions, or make believe stuff inside people's heads.

Likewise on multiple occasions over the years especially from being 17 through 35, while in monogamous sexual relationships, I have sometimes been offered sex by different women. Which includes women that I have been sexually attracted to and enjoyed their company. Yet despite finding their personality, aesthetics and sexuality rather appealing, I turned them down quite easily. Since I think it's poor form for me to cheat on any of my sexual partners, while in a sexually exclusive relationship.

At the end of the day if people don't act upon their thoughts, I really don't care what they think inside their heads.

So I have no desire to be the thought police, and haven't and won't humour the same sort of nonsense from any of my sexual partners.

If my wife is going to have an affair and cheat on me for real (like actually have sex or share sexual acts with another), she will choose to do exactly that.

If my wife chooses to do that and I find out about such actions. It is highly likely she will forfeit her opportunity to continue to share a sexual and marital relationship with me, because I would dump her (as I did with my ex-wife).

The same applies to me as well.

It is not my role, nor my wife's role to police each other or control each others thoughts and behaviours. She is welcome to make her own choices, have her own thoughts and do what she chooses to do. Just as I have my own thoughts, make my own choices and do what I choose to do.

If my wife isn't going to have an affair and cheat on me for real, she will choose not to have sex or share sexual acts with another without my knowledge or consent.

I have no problem with my wife sometimes being attracted to others, or sometimes having lustful thoughts for others (which she does). Or is friends with others without having sex with them or doing sexual acts with them (which she has).

I am also fine with being attracted to others and desiring others, while maintaining a monogamous sexual relationship. Just as long as those who are committed to me, don't betray me by sharing sexual actions with others absent my informed consent.

Likewise I am also fine with being attracted to others and desiring others, while maintaining non-monogamous sexual relationships. Just as long as those who are committed to me, don't betray me through breech of promise absent my informed consent.

I am not everything in every way to my wife and she is not everything in every way to me. As autonomous people, we are free to have our own thoughts and have other friends and interpersonal relationships regardless of their gender. Just as we are each free to choose to be monogamous and give each other sexual fidelity, or choose not to be monogamous and not give each other sexual fidelity.

Fortunately my wife and I are on the same page with this, she is also not convinced that emotional affairs are actually a real thing either.

In my opinion this idea that emotional affairs are a real thing, comes form a mindset that is built upon insecurity and unhealthy codependent thinking.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Personal said:


> I'm still not convinced an emotional affair is a real thing.
> 
> So absent thinking emotional affairs are real, my poll answer would be none of the above.
> 
> ...


The things you describe such as a bit of flirting or having a chat with a member of the opposite sex isn't anywhere near an emotional affair. Its an emotional intimacy that you should only have with your spouse but with another person. Its very real and it will very often lead to a full blown physical affair. 
Yes I can see that you don't have any idea of what it is, but many have and have suffered badly through it.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Diana7 said:


> Its an emotional intimacy that you should only have with your spouse but with another person.


For brevity since it is just above your post, you would think you would not quote my whole post since doing so is redundant.

That said my wife and I don't share your above quoted opinion.

I am close with an attractive single woman who I have been good friends with since 1992. Who I have even slept with in her bed (no sex though) in 1994 or 1995. That said during a party at hers way back in 1992 I did have sex with another woman, in her bedroom once while she was in the room with us.

In the past when between sexual relationships we have sometimes gone out on platonic dates for dinner, movies and concerts. Plus when starting to date my wife during 1996, before she became my wife. We sometimes went on double dates together as well. So she would bring a guy along, while I brought my now wife.

Likewise we still sometimes catch up with each other alone. Although my wife has also sometimes caught up with her alone as well. My wife and I do sometimes all catch up with her together as well of course.

Over the years we have also had a habit of just randomly bumping into each other, even when in different states, towns and cities.

Plus for a while up till 6 years ago, when my wife and I moved to the middle of nowhere. My friend and I often shared dinner at a pub once a week, without my wife after work. And would then spend the evening together doing a social activity, before I would sometimes take her home to hers.

I do have some emotional intimacy with her because she is a dear friend, who I have always had some time for.

At the moment I haven't caught up with her in a few months since I have been pretty busy. Yet when that happens, my wife often remind me to give her a call and see what she's up to.

My wife knows all of the above, and is fine with it all. I can be friends with whomever I like, just as my wife can be friends with whomever she likes.


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## Rhubarb (Dec 1, 2017)

inmyprime said:


> It was more a rhetorical question. Let me try and explain better.
> Say we have an issue that is affecting our marriage. Talking or discussing it with my wife only upsets her and leads to no resolution and more problems. Talking with a friend (say a female friend of ours/ a family friend) provides a better insight and an objective perspective on the problem that either makes me understand better where my wife is coming from or what the root cause might or perhaps changes the way I think about it. Would my wife be upset finding out that I talked to a woman about our problem? Probably. But not because I talked to a woman but because I verbalised that we have a problem to begin with. Has it fixed the issue talking to someone else? Yes, because you often can’t fix all your issues bu talking to each other - it’s a fairy tale.
> Was it wrong or ‘unethical’ is my question because my wife would probably not ‘approve’ of it even though it was the most productive way to fix the issue.
> I really don’t feel that I would be in any ‘danger’ of sleeping with another woman if I discuss a marriage issue. If I was, I would most definitely not do it. And actually I don’t do it anymore (I have perhaps done it twice in the past as well). TAM has replaced the need for it.
> ...


So if you had ED you wouldn't mind your wife talking about it to mutual friend? Maybe you wouldn't but I can guarantee you a lot of guys would. TAM is a different story. You are anonymous so nobody is going to know who either of you are. Also I don't see how talking to someone else about a problem and not your spouse solves it, unless the problem is solely yours. Even if you get some ideas on how to approach her, if it requires change on her part you are going to have to talk to her sooner or later, or somebody is.


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## Ghost Rider (Mar 6, 2017)

Diana7 said:


> Firstly he would say that we need to try and sort them ourselves.
> He went to MC with his first wife, so I guess he would be ok with that. I doubt if I would ever go to another person with private marriage issues, but if I ever did, it certainly wouldn't be a man.


What if your husband wouldn't even discuss it with you, and you felt like you needed a male perspective? Assume for the sake of argument that you are not in this forum. Then what will you do? Just live with the problem, for fear of doing something "inappropriate"?


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Ghost Rider said:


> What if your husband wouldn't even discuss it with you, and you felt like you needed a male perspective? Assume for the sake of argument that you are not in this forum. Then what will you do? Just live with the problem, for fear of doing something "inappropriate"?


There are so many resources on marriage and relationship out there for us to research. Also I would pray. 
The thing is that all men are different just as all women are, so asking a man about another mans issues may well not help anyway.


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Rhubarb said:


> So if you had ED you wouldn't mind your wife talking about it to mutual friend? Maybe you wouldn't but I can guarantee you a lot of guys would. TAM is a different story. You are anonymous so nobody is going to know who either of you are. Also I don't see how talking to someone else about a problem and not your spouse solves it, unless the problem is solely yours. Even if you get some ideas on how to approach her, if it requires change on her part you are going to have to talk to her sooner or later, or somebody is.




That’s not the kind of issue I would discuss (though no, I wouldn’t mind). It’s more like why she thinks about something a certain way, why we always end up arguing about a certain issue or why I or she feels something...Just relationshipy/emotional stuff. Though I have also discussed the need for more sex with her and her need to have less and the meaning of it all etc...
You are right though. Of course it would be better not to discuss these things with others. It would be even better not to have any of these issues at all.
I just am not sure it is not necessarily unhealthy or damaging to a relationship if you know the boundaries. 


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## 269370 (Dec 17, 2016)

Rhubarb said:


> So if you had ED you wouldn't mind your wife talking about it to mutual friend? Maybe you wouldn't but I can guarantee you a lot of guys would. TAM is a different story. You are anonymous so nobody is going to know who either of you are. Also I don't see how talking to someone else about a problem and not your spouse solves it, unless the problem is solely yours. Even if you get some ideas on how to approach her, if it requires change on her part you are going to have to talk to her sooner or later, or somebody is.




That’s not the kind of issue I would discuss (though no, I wouldn’t mind). It’s more like why she thinks about something a certain way, why we always end up arguing about a certain issue or why I or she feels something...Just relationshipy/emotional stuff. Though I have also discussed the need for more sex with her and her need to have less and the meaning of it all etc...
You are right though. Of course it would be better not to discuss these things with others. It would be even better not to have any of these issues at all.
I just am not sure it is not necessarily unhealthy or damaging to a relationship if you know the boundaries. I think I was always relatively clear in my mind that I was ‘using’ the other person to help our marriage rather than enjoying spending time with other person.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Personal said:


> For brevity since it is just above your post, you would think you would not quote my whole post since doing so is redundant.
> 
> That said my wife and I don't share your above quoted opinion.
> 
> ...


You are free to live life the way you choose. I have seen far too many people get too close to members of the opposite sex in the past, and for many it ended up in physical as well as emotional affairs, so I am pretty strict about my own boundaries. 
For example, I would never have a meal out alone with another man, nor socialise with him without my husband. That's my own decision based on past observations of people and experiences of life. I also have no desire to go out with another man apart from my husband. I also would never talk about personal or intimacy issues with another man. We clearly have very different ideas of what a marriage is.


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## Rhubarb (Dec 1, 2017)

inmyprime said:


> I just am not sure it is not necessarily unhealthy or damaging to a relationship if you know the boundaries.


It may not be, especially if your wife doesn't know about it. However I believe someone should respect their spouse enough to keep relationship matters private if that's their wish. This is separate from the issue of guarding against an affair.

In fact I had to solve this with my wife. Sometimes when she knew I was out with my buddy she would call me up if she was upset over something and insist I talk about it. Then when I got home she would ask me if I talked to him about it. Of course I had to say something because he was sitting right there and he's going to ask me if he hears me arguing. So I told her if you want to keep this stuff private don't call me when I'm with my friends because you know they are going to hear me. Just wait until I'm home. She hasn't done this since. Oddly the fact that my friends would hear me talking on the phone somehow hadn't crossed her mind before. 

The thing is, both people have to be on the same page. You negotiate your boundaries and then stick with what you negotiated. In my case I have no desire to have friends that I talk to about relationship problems. I deal with stuff myself and keep everything in-house. The exception was when I was with my first wife and I found out she was cheating . At that point all bets were off. I just needed some sort of support because it felt like I had been punched in the gut. Also I already knew I was getting divorced. But again I was talking to guys.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

Diana7 said:


> We clearly have very different ideas of what a marriage is.


Yes we do.

That said I think it is a good thing you have found someone, who shares your perspective and you are happy to be with. Just as I have found someone, who shares my perspective and am happy to be with.

If you were with someone like me it wouldn't work very well, just as if I were with someone like you it wouldn't work very well. Although that doesn't mean neither of us can't have a splendid marital relationship, or would be terrible partners. It just means that we would do well to be with someone, who shares similar values and perspectives to ourselves.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Amplexor said:


> By Gender, which is worse?


 I voted sexual.

Emotional affairs are nearly as bad and often lead to physical, however, emotional affairs do not risk pregnancy or disease.

I am also totally exclusive when it comes to my genitals. My woman has no permission to expose my body to someone I never agreed to be intimate with.

Crossing that line and exposing my body to be violated by the touch of another man is worse than being raped(emotionally) because my trusted wife would have been my betrayer.

I would not stay married to someone who defiled me like that.

I would probably divorce over an EA but might work it out if the circumstances were right and she immediately snapped out of it when I found out.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Ghost Rider said:


> It's unfortunate that she is not allowed to make friends with members of opposite sex. Too often people think this is love, but really it is just controlling, abusive behavior.
> 
> Through it all, of course, you're the one who is more likely to cheat, not her.
> 
> I hope you will find it in your heart to allow her to be a normal human being.


Umm...

While I mostly agree with having friends within a healthy marriage, your condescending attitude kind of surprises me.
Your wife banged another man and it would have been two men if the other one was closer.

Maybe she needed some stricter boundaries at least because your marriage wasn't healthy because she had very unhealthy behavior?


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## Ghost Rider (Mar 6, 2017)

ConanHub said:


> Umm...
> 
> While I mostly agree with having friends within a healthy marriage, your condescending attitude kind of surprises me.
> Your wife banged another man and it would have been two men if the other one was closer.
> ...


I could not stand the post that I was responding to. The guy abuses his wife and brags about it. To me, that is disgusting and I hope she gets away from him.

In my case, I did not want to control my wife like she always tried to control me. I wanted her to choose me only if she genuinely wanted to be with me, not just because I could have her under my thumb. She didn't choose me, she choose her new guy instead, so **** it.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

@Personal

You have stirred some intriguing thoughts that I have had for a while.

I believe in EA's but I also mostly see sex and relationships like you do.

I might just start a thread about this subject because it seems to me that most people are too uptight and conversely, out of control about emotional connections outside of marriage.

Aside from my religious adherences, you and I see almost exactly eye to eye on the subjects about sex, attractions and relationships.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Il


Ghost Rider said:


> I could not stand the post that I was responding to. The guy abuses his wife and brags about it. To me, that is disgusting and I hope she gets away from him.
> 
> In my case, I did not want to control my wife like she always tried to control me. I wanted her to choose me only if she genuinely wanted to be with me, not just because I could have her under my thumb. She didn't choose me, she choose her new guy instead, so **** it.


I'll review his post. I didn't see abuse in it but maybe he has posted elsewhere?

While I think marriages should be healthy enough that opposite sex friends should be included, I know many folks that aren't that strong or healthy so they make boundaries they both agree to and function in.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

One sign of an emotional relationship is that your spouse makes decisions to favor someone else and doesn't bother to discuss these decisions with you.

the desire to splurge on someone (moneywise) can happen in either type of relationship.

As a woman, a few things that I have noticed:
1. there are a fair few women who crave male attention which can lead them to behaving inappropriately with another man. 
2. My exH was a passive aggressive type which could explain why he encouraged female attention of this sort. A friend of mine remarked on how aggressive he could be, sometimes undercutting me in social settings.
3. Some women get off on getting male attention without having "to put out."
4. If you talk about problems in your life, some people feel authorised to tell you how to live. This is one of thesigns that your partner is in an emotional affair. That is, he/ she is telling you what to do as per "the friend" and judging you based on "the friend's" opinion.
5. Friendships are dynamic. That means how you behave towards someone today will inform the relationship tomorrow. If you give someone the idea that you need their advice / company / whatever ...... their behavior may become overbearing as a result.


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## CantBelieveThis (Feb 25, 2014)

both suck....but hearing your spouse tell you they love another.....that is tough one


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Personal said:


> Yes we do.
> 
> That said I think it is a good thing you have found someone, who shares your perspective and you are happy to be with. Just as I have found someone, who shares my perspective and am happy to be with.
> 
> If you were with someone like me it wouldn't work very well, just as if I were with someone like you it wouldn't work very well. Although that doesn't mean neither of us can't have a splendid marital relationship, or would be terrible partners. It just means that we would do well to be with someone, who shares similar values and perspectives to ourselves.


 yes I agree.


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## EllisRedding (Apr 10, 2015)

ConanHub said:


> I voted sexual.
> 
> Emotional affairs are nearly as bad and often lead to physical, however, *emotional affairs do not risk pregnancy or disease.*
> 
> ...


To me the bolded is absolutely huge. Yes, an EA can hurt, but when your SO is willing to jeopardize your health and/or bring someone else's child into the mix, there really is no way to look at that person other then the POS they are.

When I compare an EA to PA, we all share emotional bonds with people that are not our SOs. Obviously there is a point where the emotional bond becomes an EA, but to an extent you can "somewhat understand" how an EA can happen unexpectedly. Maybe it is just me, but I don't share a physical bond with anyone except my W, and you don't somehow unexpectedly just fall on someone else's penis or vagina lol...


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## smokefire05 (Aug 24, 2017)

What is the accepted definition of emotional affair? Never meeting in person and just talking on the phone or texting and email complaining about their spouses? Or is it getting to know each other online sexting nude pics having live masturbation skype sex sessions and phone sex? IMO an online sex affair is not much different from a "real" in person affair. With both you have the relationship and the orgasm.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

smokefire05 said:


> What is the accepted definition of emotional affair? Never meeting in person and just talking on the phone or texting and email complaining about their spouses? Or is it getting to know each other online sexting nude pics having live masturbation skype sex sessions and phone sex? IMO an online sex affair is not much different from a "real" in person affair. With both you have the relationship and the orgasm.



Good question. Here's my opinion and I'd like to see those of others:

Someone stuck in an emotional affair
1. favors the new person over their established partner. Favoring in terms of resources such as time, money. Imagine your partner canceling a weekend activity to help their "friend" out and not even discuss with you. OR you figure out that the only time you go to a nice restaurant is when the friend comes along.
2. Your partner's mood is affected by this person. Ever notice your partner suddenly become animated whenever this person arrives?
3. Your partner expects high standards of you but forgets those high standards with the "friend." For example, my exH was very cutting if I tripped up and actually repeated something I had told him before. Whereas, I noticed a certain someone could repeat stories many times and he would listen intently and laugh at the appropriate times as if it were the first time he ever heard it.
4. Your partner compares you to the "friend." She's kinder, more generous, 
5. Every little thing she says and does is funnier, more interesting,
6. Whenever the 3 of you are together, some people aren't sure who's the spouse and who isn't........

Maybe others.....


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

I was hoping a lively debate on emotional affairs was going to get started.


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## Personal (Jan 16, 2014)

My wife and I like Carsie Blanton's perspective on this.



> Carsie Blanton Blog Post
> 
> *Emotional Affairs Are Not a Real Problem*
> 
> ...


Although I won't quote the whole article it is well worth reading.


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## Natasha33300 (Oct 11, 2017)

So would you guys consider a man becoming friends with a coworker an emotional affair? Texts only no hanging out. Was discussing relationship issues. Friendship lasted 3 weeks until the wife cut it off. Been 5 months and no texts between them. They stopped being friends because wife was uncomfortable. Nothing sexual and never any talk of being more than friends. Would this be considered a friendship or emotional affair?


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Natasha33300 said:


> So would you guys consider a man becoming friends with a coworker an emotional affair? Texts only no hanging out. Was discussing relationship issues. Friendship lasted 3 weeks until the wife cut it off. Been 5 months and no texts between them. They stopped being friends because wife was uncomfortable. Nothing sexual and never any talk of being more than friends. Would this be considered a friendship or emotional affair?


Why do two work colleagues need to text each other? Unless its strictly to do with work of course and in work hours. Discussing relationship issues isn't something that any married person should be doing with someone of the opposite sex. 
For me a work friendship crosses the line when there is private texting and discussing of personal issues. Fortunately the wife in this case was aware of the dangers and asked that it stop.


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## Natasha33300 (Oct 11, 2017)

Yes you are right! They should not have done this. But would it be an emotional affair or just a stupid mistake on the married mans part? Some people do believe that men and women can be just friends.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Natasha33300 said:


> So would you guys consider a man becoming friends with a coworker an emotional affair? Texts only no hanging out. Was discussing relationship issues. Friendship lasted 3 weeks until the wife cut it off. Been 5 months and no texts between them. They stopped being friends because wife was uncomfortable. Nothing sexual and never any talk of being more than friends. Would this be considered a friendship or emotional affair?


I would say the constant texting / messaging is the red flag. Ask yourself, of all the friends that you have, how many do you text regularly multiple times a day daily.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Natasha33300 said:


> Yes you are right! They should not have done this. But would it be an emotional affair or just a stupid mistake on the married mans part? Some people do believe that men and women can be just friends.


Its hard to say when a friendship turns into something more. Even if it wasn't at that point yet, it soon would have been.
How many affairs started with the two being just friends and texting etc outside work? That's often the first step. If someone needs relationship advise, they can go to a friend of the same sex.
I have strong boundaries with men, and I wouldn't be texting a man nor discussing his or my relationship issues.


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## notmyrealname4 (Apr 9, 2014)

/


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

The same thing as far as I am concerned. I used to care about whether there was penetration or fondling or exchange of pictures or cybersex or who knows what. It is all the same. Over time I have come to understand it is all the same. The flirting and openness, nay invitation, to where that may go next. It is all the same. Not even on a continuum, let alone in separate categories. Having a close friend of the opposite sex is not the same thing. Once you are into sexual suggestion, invitation, content, or whatever, it is the same thing. Sadly. And in most cases, if you have become aware of any of this, you will never know for sure about what you do not know. Some marriages here have survived infidelity. Sadly, mine has not and that is mostly because as much as I thought I wanted to let it go, I could not. So that much at least is on me.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Personal said:


> My wife and I like Carsie Blanton's perspective on this.
> 
> 
> 
> Although I won't quote the whole article it is well worth reading.


Personally Personal,

I read her opinion as the same rationalizing, blame shifting, compartmentalizing, entitled, playing victim & victim blaming as any other WS on here in either an EA or PA who wants to justify his/her affair. Her balancing of how much "hurt" you can handle or how much you dole out to your "partner" strikes me as a selfish way to deal with one's needs or conflict in the relationship. Tolerance is not the same thing as empathy. Balancing hurt is not the same thing as compromising. Rationalizing is not understanding.

EAs can be deadly to a relationship. They can be as real in emotional entanglement as a PA. They use the same techniques as a PA to hide, protect and deceive the unsuspecting BS. They are gray, murky and boundaries are unclear which makes them susceptible to spiraling out of control. And if not killed, they will ultimately lead to a PA. As the BS in my marriage, it left a scar that will never be covered, will never go away and it took something from me I can never fully get back. That probably naive faith that my wife could never betray me. She did and there is no way I can put the lid back on that box.

It's easy for the author say that EAs aren't real with what I would consider a condescending tone. For her, she seems to be teetering on falling into one herself but rationalizes it with her husband not meeting all of her needs. Or maybe she just has poor boundaries. She simply doesn't understand how much damage can be done to an individual from the fall out of an EA. Until you've felt the "hurt" of being mentally butt-****ed by a fantasy man that in realty was nothing more than a voice at the other end of a phone, you can't really understand how deep that wound is. You can't understand the negative impact is has on one's confidence, self worth or ability to trust. And how hard it is to regain those if you ever can. Even ten plus years passed D-Day and a successful reconciliation, that specter lurks in the shadows for me. 

Rant Off!


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## Steve1000 (Nov 25, 2013)

As of now, 62 men have voted and 21 women have voted. Are there really that many more men here than women?


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## toblerone (Oct 18, 2016)

It's the internet! Of course there are more men than women!


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

I can't decide which is worse.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

It depends.

A drunken one night stand, which is confessed straight away.

Or an Emotional Affair which drags on for years, with words of love being expressed, which is only unearthed by accident.

Which would be worse?


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

MattMatt said:


> It depends.
> 
> A drunken one night stand, which is confessed straight away.
> 
> ...


Your examples drive the point home. What can make EAs especially cutting is that many of them are conducted in plain sight. Everybody can witness how dismissive someone is with their spouse. Most PAs are done in secret. 

and finding out that you've been tricked into agreeing to things for the benefit of the other person is especially galling.


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## Holdingontoit (Mar 7, 2012)

I think they are both awful. Would not want my wife doing either. Certainly would not want her doing both, with 2 different men, so that I could compare which caused me more pain!

I do think part of the difference in the responses by gender reflects that here on TAM we have a bunch of men who are not having as much sex with their wives as they wish they had. If you are a man in that situation, then a PA is probably going to hurt more than a EA. Why? If you feel deprived of sex, and have been begging your wife to have more sex with you, and she refuses, but then she goes and has sex with another guy, well, that is the ultimate betrayal. That shows that she wasn't rejecting the sex (too tired, hurts, time of the month, etc.), she was rejecting YOU. That is being stabbed to the core. 

On the other hand, if you feel deprived of sex, and have been begging your wife to have more sex with you, and she refuses, and then goes and spends time with another guy, well, that is time you don't have to spend with your wife pretending you are thrilled with her and the marriage and life itself. That is time you can masturbate in your bed and not have to slink off to the bathroom or the living room. And if she is spending time with him but NOT having sex with him, then someone else is taking some of the workload off you and he isn't getting any more sex out of it than you are. In some ways, his wife having a EA but not a PA is a win for the husband.


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