# I want my partner to be a partner and not my enemy/annoying brother



## soulconnection (Jul 10, 2013)

(please excuse the odd indentations)

Well damn, I am now 1 of those women. I don't want my husband to touch me. I am the type that everyone talks about and never thought that I 
would be.

I'm 34, my husband is 36, we've been together for 9 years, married 5 years and we have 2 kids (3.5 year old and a 21 month old). Looking back, things 
have always been luke warm, and not on my end. My husband has never seemed very passionate about me or sex, really. Sure, he liked sex, but I always 
wanted it more and if he had his way once every three weeks would have been fine, though he was passionate when the actual sex occured. And me? I would have 
like at least once a month, though more would have been great.

So yeah, my point is that I wanted sex more than him. I was much more affectionate than him and more appreciate, as well. If I were to play with his hair or scratch his back he would whine 
when I stopped instead of feeling grateful that I was trying
to make him feel good.. If I asked for my hair to be played with that was ok if I did it next or if we did it at the same
time. Basically, he was cool if it all revolved around him. 

The first few years of our relationship it seemed like I could kinda do no wrong. I recall a specific talk we had where he said, "You know, in all my past relationships I was often upset with them for things they did or how they 
treated me and I don't get upset with you like that." Well, that was then....now I annoy the hell out of him. When he's playing clean-up from a fight
all is fine, but our regular days are tough. It's almost like he has no filter or doesn't understand how his words stop me in my tracks and make it really hard
to want to be near him. He drops many little bombs all through out the day and 5 minutes later he's trying to hug me, kiss me, poke my side or joke about
everything. Sometimes I get eye rolls when I ask for help with the kids, which seem to come out of nowhere. I get huge 
exhales if I want to bathe on the weekend while the kids are awake. I get complaints about not cleaning the floor or doing the dishes. Though I actually
trully feel like he loves me and would be devastated if we did divorce, it doesn't feel like he even likes me like a good friend. He doesn't get 
engaged in many of the conversations that I start, even
if they are important in nature. However, when he talks I ask questions to show interest and he talks over my questions. Why? Because he's talking. 
Now I realize he may seem different than he truly is to strangers reading this. He's not an abusive, demeaning guy, but it is more like being 
in an immature marriage with an annoying brother. It gets lonely. If he's not mad at me he's making jokes....constantly. 

In between all of this frustration has been the wonderful world of porn. Ugh. I use to be a big fan of porn. When I was single I watched plenty on my 
own and in relationshiops I've been one to want to watch some here and there. I now have grown to (sorta) hate it. Back in the day when I wanted more
sex than my husband, I found out that he was viewing lots of online porn when I went to bed. Man, that hurt so bad! Porn seems like an ok thing but when
it means that you are not connecting with your significant other? Come on...give your wife some lovin. I eventually found out that he was watching cam girls. I don't believe
he ever paid (you can see many live and free) but that was crossing the line to me in a huge way and I told him this. I let him know that I was really, really 
not ok with this. He said it wouldn't happen again but he didn't understand how sharing fantasies with a live girl and seeing her naked (etc) was not ok with me. So he stopped and all 
was good and then time went by and he was caught again and this has repeated. You know, it didn't really stop. Last December was the worst. I came home 
early from vacation and he was at work. I found many pics of women that were of sexual nature and obviously amature (cam girls). I also found a picture of his penis that he 
was sending to these girls.
I went to sign into my aol e-mail account and their was a sexual log-in name there. Mind you, my husband, supposedly, doesn't even have an aol account.
I did a search online of that e-mail and his picture showed up, though it was clear it was his since only he and I use the computer.When my husband came home
he denied everything. EVERYTHING. The penis picture wasn't even a recent pic, according to him, and even after I showed him that the date was on the pic
he STILL denied it! It took many hours (like always) for him to sorta admit to half of it. I do not think
that my husband technically cheated on me and I don't believe he was trying to, but some kind of serious, sexual play was going on. 

Our sex life went from being every 3 weeks (I guess by both of our choices-my interest in sex slowed after the second child) to barely existent. After seeing those pictures (some were quite unusual)...I just 
feel grossed out....betrayed...lied to (again) and just, really fed up. I'm now the bad guy who doesn't want sex with my husband. But guess what, I do 
want a sex life. Badly. I want to want it with him. But even after therapy it seems like he either doesn't get what is necessary for things to get back to 
"normal" (looking back, we've always had issues) or it's just too much to ask from him and his personality. I'm tired of feeling like I do so much but 
never enough. When we sit down and talk he always says he's so thankful to have me and that I do a lot for our family and kids but I want more. I want to
actually feel it. I don't need us to be perfect but I need to feel respected, liked and appreciated. I want to feel like my husband is my partner and
not my enemy or annoying brother.

I've been in a very dark spot these last couple of months. I want to put a positive foot forward and believe it's important spiritually, but this is
scary. It pains me to think that I could ruin the magic and stability that family should be for my kids. I can't believe that their is a possibility that I may have to hear my daughter cry and ask for daddy one night or morning, knowing that he is not going to be living in the house any more. It seems so unfair. To make matters worse, I am a stay at home mom. Their world would be completely turned upside down. It would go from being with mommy all the time and having both parents in the house, to divorced parents, mom not home and in child care and potentially moving. Awful. 

I don't want a divorce but I know that I don't like our marriage the way it is. I am currently working on myself in hopes that I can trigger a change in my husband, too, or become emotionally strong enough to do the scariest thing I've ever been faced with. 

I want to cry so hard but I'm worried that it will just get my mind into the constant worry mode that it has been in lately. I'm tired of worrying...I just want to snap my fingers and make day to day life work for us again. Welp, their goes the idea of not crying


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## mattsmom (Apr 2, 2013)

Oh, honey, I'm so sorry! I completely understand how you feel. I told my husband that I can be needed anywhere. I need to be wanted. I need him to make me feel like I and my feelings are important to him. He says he doesn't know how to do that. 

My first husband was into porn, as well. That was before the internet, by the way. Anyway, I thought I was stupid for being jealous of a girly magazine. But, he was rejecting me in favor of taking the magazine into the bathroom with him. And he wasn't very careful about not leaving "evidence" of his time with the magazine, either. That was long ago, though. I'm sorry that you're fighting that battle. 

There are worse things in life than to have your parents divorce. As a matter of fact, I think that it's easier on the children when they're younger. Children are amazingly resilient and adaptable. If they grow up in a home where Mom and Dad are together, but miserable, that's what they'll learn. 

Take some time for yourself. Go to a park or somewhere quiet where you can be alone with your thoughts, and really consider what would make you happy. For me, it's peace and sanctuary. It's so much easier to be lonely when you're alone than it is to be lonely when you're laying beside the man who is supposed to love you. 

I wish you the very best, and encourage you to stay on the boards. They can be a great source of help.

Blessings,
Mattsmom


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## soulconnection (Jul 10, 2013)

Thank you 
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## soulconnection (Jul 10, 2013)

After reading some posts I'm feeling like crap. I want to be a loving wife to my husband :....( And I hate that when he tries it doesn't feeling like enough cause its never a permanent change . My husband is not some awful man. Besides the porn/webcam girls, I think our personalities are just really clashing and my needs are changing or becoming harder to hide. Well crap, and now I'm remembering the times he makes lame comments to me....bleh.

I guess I'm just really feeling bad cause I know my husband sees our marriage the way many men see their situations on here. I know he thinks I'm expecting to much. It's almost like we're in two separate books (not just different pages). He knows he has a short fuse but definitely doesn't understand the hurt and anger it causes me. Those feelings paired up with the webcam issue and brotherly joking is making me not interested in being loving :....( I feel like crap. I want to be loving :...( I want to feel liked and respected.... I hate this.
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## mattsmom (Apr 2, 2013)

I'm right there with you. Those little jabs are like he's taking a rock-hammer to the mortar of your relationship. He's just picking it apart, little by little. Would he be willing to go to marriage counselling? Perhaps having someone else say the words will make him understand how hurtful his words are. I've told my husband several times that words can hurt more than physical abuse. Once someone hits you, the pain goes away in a day or two. Words cut deep and the pain can stay around for a long, long time.


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## soulconnection (Jul 10, 2013)

We've been going for the past 2.5 months or so : / Sometimes I feel like it helps but it's short lived and because of this I can't even full appreciate those times since I know it's just clean-up. 

I know this may sound wacky but Ive totally thought about getting on medication to just not care...
But it still leaves us with a whacked out sex life and spiritually, it doesn't seem right.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## mattsmom (Apr 2, 2013)

Yeah, I would bring up one specific incident in counselling, and he would take it completely literally, and apply it to EVERY situation. I swear that we speak different languages. I just don't know how to get through to him and make him understand. 

I wish you the best of luck. Keep coming here for support.

Mattsmom


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## CEL (May 7, 2013)

Hey Soul well I see two problems in your relationship lets tackle the glaring one first and my least favorite topic Sex Addiction. I am going to post some questions with the answers a sex addict would give that would be me by the way.

1. Do you engage is porn/sex when it could negatively impact your life? Yes

2. Do you engage in porn/sex when it will physically harm you? Yes

3. Do you hide your porn/sex from your spouse? Yes

4. Have you put off having sex with your spouse so you could look at porn? Yes

5. Do you use porn/sex to self medicate "stress,anger, sadness"? Yes

6. Has you porn/sex negatively impacted your life and yet you keep doing it? Yes

7. Is porn/sex something that you consider and event "do you think about it, anticipate it, look forward to it"? Yes

8. Have you even used porn so much that you could not perform for your spouse? Yes


So how do you think he would do? After you tell me I will get more into it on what you could do next.

Now the second part seem to be that he is not meeting your needs. I can suggest some books that I found very helpful to me once you read start reading them we can continue to talk about them. When we start a marriage we don't really have the tools to make it work we think because we love each other it should be simple. Well it is not. We don't have the skills to make a good marriage so we get in bad habits in addtions we lack a common language with the other person so talking does not help because it is like we are talking two separate languages everything is misunderstood and mixed up. The first step is getting a common language going and setting up some easy to follow ground rules. That is where these books come in. First they will help you understand the two important rules 

1. Consensus they call it POJA I think what this means is that all decisions are made by BOTH of you. No unilateral decisions anymore. This includes EVERYTHING. Sex, finances, chores, kids, meals all that jazz. Sounds crazy but is actually really easy

2. Enthusiastic agreement. Neither partner does something they do not want to do. Okay what this means is that if you agree to something it is something that you will not resent later. You are happy to do it not begrudgingly doing it to get something but genuinely happy doing it. Resentment kills love so you need to get that out. Once both of you agree to that it makes the negotiation of consensus easier.

His Need Her Needs
Love Buster
5 Steps to Romantic Love

Questions

1 Your ages? 
2. Time married?
3. Kids ages?
4. How much independent time do you guys have? So this means do you go out without him does he go without you, do you share hobbies those kinds of things.
5. How much time without the kids?
6. Date night?


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## soulconnection (Jul 10, 2013)

Busy week. I will respond as soon as I can 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## soulconnection (Jul 10, 2013)

Ok, so I took a bit long with replying to these questions, eh? It's been quite the rollercoaster, as usual and I was a bit overwhelmed, at the time, in answering these questions. But I'm ready, so here goes....




CEL said:


> 1. Do you engage is porn/sex when it could negatively impact your life? *Yes*
> 
> 2. Do you engage in porn/sex when it will physically harm you?
> *No*
> ...


So tonight is the night that I answered these questions because I am feeling real down. We just had a talk and I'm feeling guilty and frustrated. Part of me feels extreme guilt knowing that my husband would stay in this marriage forever, just the way it is, and then another part of me is furious that he would be willing to have a life like this. Why be in a sexless marriage? Does he really think that just magically 1 night everything will go back to "normal?" Though our normal was him wanting sex once every 3 weeks....*exhale* And what about this constant fighting? Why be ok with this?! My husband's mom and dad have both been married and divorced 3 times, as a result my husband's siblings have remained in extremely BAD and dangerous marriages. I believe they all made subconscious packs to never divorce. No matter what. I sorta thought that I was like this...but I feel this weight on me and it's getting so tiring...I know I can not go on this way.

I have 2 little ones and a huge pile of guilt to go with them. I am a stay-at-home mom. A divorce would rock us all to the core. My husband makes good money but we have so many bills that we are struggling with just our 1 household. I do have a degree but I did some searching and it's not going to get me much (or even enough) when I would also have child care to be concerned about. I am getting certified to be a personal trainer in a couple of months but, once again, not sure if that will be enough to keep us afloat.

I know I'm talking finances right now but man, what about the FAILURE? What about the pain I would be causing my husband and my family? Why can't this just be put back together? Have we ever really been in a place that I was completely fulfilled?

I'm hurting tonight...


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## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

He is clearly a porn addict and needs to get that taken care of, and he won't take it seriously or see any change until he believes it is a problem. There are a lot of resources online for porn addiction, including resources specifically for the wives of porn addicts.

I could easily see the following as being big parts of the problem you have:

1. You know he's addicted, and despite trying your best to make him understand that it hurts you, he still hasn't stopped. (He probably just hides it better)
2. The nature of his addiction is particularly painful because it isn't just viewing pictures/video, it involves actively interacting with other girls who are likely younger and haven't had to introduce two children to the world. Being a passive observer is one thing, but an active participant is another thing entirely.
3. From another angle, I could see someone in your position struggling with the fact that, to a lot of people, this isn't an obvious major offense. He didn't have sex with someone else, there was no "over the line" emotional connection with anyone, so it's hard to rationalize your very real and legitimate feelings of betrayal, even to yourself.
4. I imagine it's a struggle knowing that he probably won't ever quit porn, can't accept that it's a problem, and worst of all, that he isn't willing to do so even for your sake.

Sorry I'm not trying to depress you here. I thought I'd spell that out to emphasize that his porn use is a problem, but unfortunately it is a problem that most men can't see or accept. I think the easiest test of whether it is an addiction or not though is when a guy starts hiding it and/or cannot stop despite clear consequences, meaning he will take risks and hurt others in order to get his fix. Clearly I think he's passed that test for addiction. Considering the struggles you've described, this isn't an issue of finding a way to forgive your husband or cope with his addiction. I don't think there are many women who would still feel desire and find passion for a man who can't keep himself from seeking out young women online, despite knowing how much it hurts and betrays you?

Are you in MC? You really need to insist on that at a certain point I think and bring these issues to light. It's natural for an addict to deny it and try to make it out to not be a big deal. To the addict and even most who know him/her, it really isn't a big deal. It isn't like alcoholism/drug addiction/gambling/physical abuse because there are virtually no outside signs of the problem, and the damage caused is almost entirely constrained within the marriage. I think until he can get this problem under control, nothing will improve...


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## Cs4ever (Aug 8, 2013)

Soulconnection, 

Sorry things are so tough right now. The whole silent hurting thing is really the worst part of this whole process I think. 

As to the rest, I don’t think you should ever underestimate a guy’s ability to abide. We’re told our whole life to be tough and strong and not show any weakness. So I think most guys tend to ride out an unfulfilling marriage and compensate with other things- work, friends, video games, sports, etc… Which brings us to the porn thing. Most guys do it to some degree or another, and I don’t know that I’d argue that some folks are truly addicted, but it seems that most guys use it as a crutch. Not really realizing the damage it does to their relationship. Meanwhile their wife is of thinking why porn and not me, how can I measure up to that, or possibly even just plain yuck, no thanks that’s not for me. The point being that I would bet that the porn thing is a symptom of some larger underlying problem that you guys haven’t addressed. It’s not so much as rejection of you as a safe place a guy can go as he disengages emotionally for whatever reason. Now if you address the underlying issues and he isn’t willing to stop and or work on it, then it’s a larger problem and should certainly be addressed as such. But for now, I don’t know that I’d say porn was so much the issue as a symptom. 

The comments you made about your husband’s parents and siblings would seem to suggest that he doesn’t really have a whole lot of good role models in terms of a functional relationship which means he’s going to have to consciously work at developing good habits. Change is hard for anyone and its doubly hard when it involves something you’re this emotionally invested in. Speaking from my own experience, it takes a few wakeup calls before you really get it through your head that this is hard work, requires effort, and that you need to change- not because your wife told you to or because you are somehow giving into your spouse, but because fundamentally their feelings are important enough to you so that you want to make them happy. It’s not about her being right and you being wrong, it’s about making the other person feel loved. This was a huge revelation for me when it eventually happened. There’s an art to “giving in” (perhaps it should be giving) without having it turn into a me wrong and you right thing. My wife has any number of odd preferences that I don’t entirely agree with, but I love her and its really no skin off my back to accommodate them. It took me a long time to learn this- sounds like maybe he hasn’t. 

My point is that this sort of behavior and other good marriage habits are likely things he’ll need to work on consciously, and getting to the point where he realizes he needs to is likely going to take some time. 

My big question is, does he realize that you are in crisis? My impression is that he doesn’t, you have a lot of guilt built up over this (who wouldn’t, and by the way you shouldn’t, you have every right to feel fulfilled in your marriage and asking him to do a few things to help with that and feeling like you want to leave when he doesn’t is not unreasonable), and these are fundamentally tough conversations to have. Which makes it hard to really come out and say how bad things are. So it’s possible he’s over there in his clueless guy bubble thinking things are going to get better eventually (magically) and waiting them out. My guess is that he’s likely has his own list of things that are causing him pain that he hasn't talked about (hence the fact that he’s pulling away). The best thing you can do is get all that out in the open as quickly as possible, start to work through it, and hopefully get to a better place. If you tell him how much you're hurting and he doesn’t or won’t work on it, that’s one thing. But it would be a shame to see things end for you both because he didn’t realize there was crisis until it was too late. 

My 2 cents. Hope it helps and hope things get better. 


C’s 4 Ever

______________________

"The only thing that speaks the truth is the eloquence of passing time." 

Poi Dog Pondering, Collarbone

"Always remember, there was nothing worth sharing like the love that let us share our name." 

Avett Brothers, Murder in the City


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## cdbaker (Nov 5, 2010)

Wow, very well said CS4Ever.

I still believe strongly that he qualifies as a porn addict and it has to be addressed as such, but certainly there are a myriad of underlying factors that can lead a man to that point which also need address.

Still, really really well said CS4Ever!


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