# UPDATE - Is Debt Enough Reason To End Things?



## lonelyman (Jun 28, 2011)

just an update to my thread about a month ago....

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/genera...sion/28978-debt-enough-reason-end-things.html

she has talked to her debt consolidation company again and a bankruptcy lawyer....she has decided the debt consolidation is a better way to go and is willing to do it....i am not sure of the exact reasoning but i assume its because she will lose her house and/or car if she goes bankrupt....

the debt consolidation will have her making one large monthly payment for 5 years and she will lose all of her credit and credit cards....

thats good and all....but the way im seeing this is she will be becoming more dependant on me for daily expenses and houshold bills because of this big extra monthly payment....so in a way i am feeling like i am basically helping her pay off this debt....which i dont think is fair....

i also see this as us basically being confined to the house for the next 5 years because we will have little or no extra money for "entertainment"....

in some ways i think this is selfish of me to think this....but sometimes i also think she is the one who got herself into this and not me....and sometimes i think this will just be a waste of 5 years of my life....

i also feel like if any emergencies come up she will be expecting me to use my credit for such cases which i will not want to do....it took me years to rebuild my credit (which is now A++++++++) and im not going to ruin it again....

i love her very much and i love her family very much....and they all love me very much....i dont know where to go from here or what to do....i barely sleep at night, i am up most of the night on the computer because i cant sleep....i think about this and our relationship 24 hours a day....right now its 4am....

i have thought about leaving and taking a temporary break because i am so stressed out and burnt out (which she said she would be supportive about)....

it wouldnt be financially possibly (or smart) to get a place of my own....i could move to my parents place which i would not mind and neither would they....problem is that will open the flood gates for family gossip and everybody will be asking me questions....and i am the type of person who likes to keep relationship issues to myself.....

i dont like people/family knowing about my relationship problems or even knowing that we are HAVING problems at all (any problems, not just financial problems)....everybody always thinks our relationship is sunshine and blue skies all the time, and thats the way i like to keep it....

we still have fun together and we still have sex and we tell each other we love each other....but some nights i sleep in a seperate bed (my choice)....i dont really know why i do this, maybe im just trying to get a bit of space....

i just dont know what to do and its ripping me apart inside 

10 years ago i got divorced from my first marriage and that was WAY EASIER than what i am going through now....


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## roamingmind (Jul 20, 2011)

Thank you for the update and I am sorry you have to go through all this. I completely agree with your concerns -- it is a long haul financially. You have to think carefully if this is what you want -- if you are so stressed now, you will be even more stressed if this goes on and there will be resentment growing over time. Five years is a long time--- You have read what others said about being finacially trapped, treking uphill...etc. The way I see it -- it's just me--- if she doesn't get a fresh start and you will eventually fall apart over this -- it will be a major source of tensions and conflicts in your relationship. Please think twice. You need protec yourself ,too. Comparing to the long haul pain, family gossip will pass rather soon. 

Did you ask why she chose debt consolidation? 
Do you mind me asking which state you are living in ?


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## lonelyman (Jun 28, 2011)

roamingmind said:


> Thank you for the update and I am sorry you have to go through all this. I completely agree with your concerns -- it is a long haul financially. You have to think carefully if this is what you want -- if you are so stressed now, you will be even more stressed if this goes on and there will be resentment growing over time. Five years is a long time--- You have read what others said about being finacially trapped, treking uphill...etc. The way I see it -- it's just me--- if she doesn't get a fresh start and you will eventually fall apart over this -- it will be a major source of tensions and conflicts in your relationship. Please think twice. You need protec yourself ,too. Comparing to the long haul pain, family gossip will pass rather soon.
> 
> Did you ask why she chose debt consolidation?
> Do you mind me asking which state you are living in ?


thank you for your reply.....i appreciate it....sorry for taking so long to reply to your questions....

once again i am up at 1am because i can not sleep because of the stress over this whole situation....on my days off i find it hard to get motivated to do anything because this is always on my mind....

i spend most of my days off lately in bed watching tv or on the computer....i am normally an active person who gets out to the gym and things but i just cant seem to get motivated to do anything lately....like i am in complete shut down mode....

this is taking its toll on me mentally and physically....

i find i am using the computer and forums to chat lately just for somebody to talk to because i have nobody i can talk to about this....

i want to make it clear that i am NOT looking for another woman or an affair or anybody to become attached to, just somebody to talk to in a friendly way and about this situation, men or women doesnt matter....

i am not sure why she chose the consolidation....im sure she would explain if i asked, i just never did....yet....she says she has made the choice to do consolidation but has not official signed or gone through with anything yet....im not sure what the holdup is....

i am assuming she does not want bankrupt because she will lose the house and/or her car....and to answer your question we live in canada.....

thank you for your time


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## DawnD (Sep 23, 2009)

I am truly confused lonelyman. I went back to your original post that said all you did was help out "here and there" as you didn't make as much as she did. Which I take to mean that you have been living there rent free, and barely contributing to any bills from living in the house. 

So basically if you have to help pay for the housing/utilities you want out? Purely asking here, no sarcasm intended. I do read your updates, and saw where she has gambled and been irresponsible. I understand that concern. But I also am surprised that people have been glazing over the part where she pays all the bills and you were only "chipping in when/if you could"


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## lonelyman (Jun 28, 2011)

DawnD said:


> I am truly confused lonelyman. I went back to your original post that said all you did was help out "here and there" as you didn't make as much as she did. Which I take to mean that you have been living there rent free, and barely contributing to any bills from living in the house.


i am paying a good portion of all bills, household and daily expenses....pretty near 50%....sorry if i gave you the wrong impression by the way i worded things, maybe my fault for not being more specific.....i am not living "rent free" by any means....


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## lonelyman (Jun 28, 2011)

a bit of a further update.....

we talked a bit today and my assumption was correct, she does not want to go bankrupt because she feels like she will lose her house and/or car....

my apologies for wording things incorrectly, she is not looking to do a debt consolidation, she is looking to do a debt proposal....basically the company will negotiate with the creditors to pay a lower amount on all of her debts....

she is going to see another company tomorrow about it to get a second opinion....i have told her that she might want to speak with a bankruptcy lawyer....i feel like a good lawyer might be able to save her home and car but that might just be wishful thinking on my part....i dunno.....

i guess we will see what tomorrow brings....


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## golfergirl (Dec 8, 2010)

lonelyman said:


> a bit of a further update.....
> 
> we talked a bit today and my assumption was correct, she does not want to go bankrupt because she feels like she will lose her house and/or car....
> 
> ...


If her home is her primary residence, in Canada I don't think they take it. Depends on province. My ex tried to run a scam where he claimed his actual home was his common-laws and claimed to live in his rental property to save both homes when he claimed bankrupt. He kept a car too....
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lonelyman (Jun 28, 2011)

golfergirl said:


> If her home is her primary residence, in Canada I don't think they take it. Depends on province. My ex tried to run a scam where he claimed his actual home was his common-laws and claimed to live in his rental property to save both homes when he claimed bankrupt. He kept a car too....
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


thanks for your input....this is why i want her to talk to an actual lawyer instead of just these debt proposal companies....am i right in thinking a lawyer is a better option?


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## golfergirl (Dec 8, 2010)

QUOTE=lonelyman;398312]thanks for your input....this is why i want her to talk to an actual lawyer instead of just these debt proposal companies....am i right in thinking a lawyer is a better option?[/QUOTE]


What about Deloitte and Touche?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lonelyman (Jun 28, 2011)

golfergirl said:


> QUOTE=lonelyman;398312]thanks for your input....this is why i want her to talk to an actual lawyer instead of just these debt proposal companies....am i right in thinking a lawyer is a better option?



What about Deloitte and Touche?
_Posted via Mobile Device_[/QUOTE]

not sure what you mean, is that the name of a company?


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## golfergirl (Dec 8, 2010)

lonelyman said:


> What about Deloitte and Touche?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


not sure what you mean, is that the name of a company?[/QUOTE]

Yes accounting firm that handles bankruptcies
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

By all means, go to a lawyer. Do you have a nonprofit there like CCC? They will reduce your payments for you by consolidating, but they don't make a profit so they're more trustworthy.

As for your relationship, I see two things: one, you two are NOT communicating and being honest with each other! How can you survive without that? Tell her the truth, ok? TODAY. Tell her that this is driving you into depression because you feel trapped by HER actions and YOUR guilt at abandoning her.

Two, you need to sit down and work out a REAL, HARDLINE PLAN for what you will and won't cover. Both of you sign it. Make sure that this plan does NOT take up all your income. You must include 10% for savings and 10% for your own personal use, at the very least. NON-NEGOTIABLE. That plan must include expenses for BOTH of you covering the things you're worried about. If you have to, hire a CPA to work out a plan for you that's logical and reasonable. And if you ever see her backsliding into making you feel guilty for not covering more, pull out the signed contract and ask her if she wants you to walk.


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## lonelyman (Jun 28, 2011)

thanks turnera and everybody else for the replies.....

just another update.....

she just got back from another consultation with a different company that will do a debt proposal to her creditors for her....

they have gone over her finances and income and daily expenses and came up with the following....

this companies fee is not a percentage but a straight up 1000 bucks....her overall consumer debt is about 70,000 bucks and they have said they can get that reduced to about 30,000 which would have her paying about 600 a month for 5 years....

i am skeptical about this....how can they say this without even talking to the creditors?....i guess this is just an estimate of what they think they can negotiate?

this seems alot better than the first company she spoke with....but my question is....are these companies trustworthy?....she said after she pays the company all her payments go directly to the courts/creditors so nothing to do with the company from there....

i am telling her i still think its better for her to speak with an actual lawyer as opposed to these companies....but she doesnt want to listen....am i correct in thinking a lawyer is better?

i am glad that she is taking care of this but deep down inside i am still angry it has come to this point because she has been irresponsible with her spending and i guess that is what is bothering me....


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## lonelyman (Jun 28, 2011)

turnera said:


> As for your relationship, I see two things: one, you two are NOT communicating and being honest with each other! How can you survive without that? Tell her the truth, ok? TODAY. Tell her that this is driving you into depression because you feel trapped by HER actions and YOUR guilt at abandoning her.


thanks turnera....i will talk to her tomorrow about this....we have had enough to deal with for one day....i really do appreciate your help....


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

No no no - there are WAY too many scam companies taking your money just like you describe. Look up your city directory and find the Chamber of Commerce or whatever similar you have, and ask THEM for a recommendation. 

You can also do a review of the company. Google their name and add the word 'scam' and/or 'reviews' and see what you get. If they're scamming, people usually complain on line nowadays.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

lonelyman said:


> i am still angry it has come to this point because she has been irresponsible with her spending and i guess that is what is bothering me....


You are mad that she is making you into her father.


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## lonelyman (Jun 28, 2011)

Thanks again,

I checked out the companies like you said and went on their websites, and they seem like they are legit companies, I still think a lawyer would be better but she thinks that will cost her a lot more money, so she doesn't want to speak with one, that is the reason she gave me,
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## roamingmind (Jul 20, 2011)

What she is doing in the US is called debt settlement --- please see my previous reply in you other post about the option -- she has to be careful because the waived debt is taxable -- I am not familar with Canada's laws, but it is probably not much of difference. 
The debt company will tell you not to file bankruptcy and they will conveniently omit some consequences she might have to face. Ask them about the tax. 

A lot of bankruptcy lawyers provide first counceling for free. Do a little research, call them up. A good lawyer should be able to save her house and car. 

Yes, she will have public record, but unless she is going to work in finace related industries, it will not affect her job hunting. 
And she is forced to learn to be finacially responsible after that. 

$600 a month doesn't seem to be a large amount, but depending on your income, it could take away many other things you could enjoy. Above all, if she is not making enough, when you are married, this essentially become your debt. Are you willing to pay for that? 

This is not being selfish; it is reality; it's about a fresh start for both of you. And it has nothing to do with your love for her. It's not fair you have to burden because of irresponsibility and reluctance to consider your situation and feeling.


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## lonelyman (Jun 28, 2011)

Thanks roamingmind,

That is a good point about the taxes, I will tell her to ask about that, she has agreed to at least inquire about a lawyer for a possible consultation, I am thinking the same thing you are, a lawyer should be able to save the house,

When the debt settlement person workout out her numbers and proposal I was completely excluded from the numbers,

So basically with her income she is able to afford all of the expenses (house, car, bills, daily living expenses) plus the 600 a month on her own income,

So basically my income is really just extra money, obviously I put some towards the bills but she could (mathematically) do it on her own if she needed to,

I have basically told her I won't get married until this is taken care of one way or another, and she seemed okay with that and understood my position,

The stress is just getting so high that I can barely function on a daily basis, I only sleep about 2 hours at a time, and the second I wake up this is on my mind and I can't sleep again,
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## roamingmind (Jul 20, 2011)

L, 

Please take a look at the link below. It will give you most of the information you need for personal bankruptcy in Cananda, including the time involved ( 9 months), cost, exemption ( yes, house and car are exempted)---

Hope this helps.

Bankruptcy Canada: Connect with Experts Who Can Help You Today


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

It's time for you to go to a doctor and look into some temporary anti-depressants. You probably have what's called situational depression (caused by a particular event/situation). The way my doctor explained it, your body creates its own 'feel good' chemical that allows you to smile, laugh, and enjoy life. When you encounter a stressor, it uses more of the chemical to overcome it and still be ok. Over time, you are still using a 'higher dosage' of your body's feel good chemical until you use it up. Then depression/anxiety sets in and looks exactly like you. Your well is dry. You can't pump any more feel good out. So you need a temporary flooding of ADs to prime the pump so it starts flowing again on its own.

I had to go on it last year after my mom died and I still couldn't stop crying after 5 months. He just gave me 3 months worth, and it worked; it got me 'happy' (read: not crying) enough that I could return to normal and stop taking them.

Please ask your doctor.


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## lonelyman (Jun 28, 2011)

"Roamingmind" thank you for the link I will look through it with her together tonight,

"Turnera" I took your advice and checked out the chamber of commerce and the company they recommend is actually the last company she just went to see,

And thank you for the medical advice that is something I will look into for sure,
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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