# Tired of my wife's lack of intimacy: Suggestions?



## TallDrinkoWater (May 17, 2011)

Good morning,
Hello all, new user here needing some advice.

My wife and I have been married for 17 years and we have 3 kids from ages 10 - 15. Up until last year, since about 1996, I made it a priority to be as intimate as possible trying to show my wife through actions that I was truly in love with her (because I was) by making sure we kissed goodbye, holding her, holding her hand, calling her from work in the middle of the day and whatever else I could think of to be certain she knew I was thinking of her. I also talked to her and let her know what I was doing and that I would feel better if she recipricated...that I needed to know that she was thinking of me. I had read somewhere that the more intimate a husband/wife is, the more successful they become! Also, it was fun and I enjoyed it, and I thought we both enjoyed it.

It would get better for a month or so, then she would would revert back to acting like she didnt care, like we were just friends not an intimate couple, not initiating sex (I would have to do that all the time) and now talking to me or showing me she cared.

So I would talk to her, let her know I'd like more involvement from her, for her to initiate sex, etc. Almost like a bell curve, it would improve then slowly dissipate until she was back to not showing she cared again.

In addition to this, when I would try to have a conversation with her, she would now begin to get irritable with me, start yelling and getting sarcastic as soon as I mentioned anything that had to do with criticising her actions. Of course, when I would admit my faults and what I was doing to correct them, she was all on board and offering constructive criticism, which I took in stride and corrected as best as I could.

Since the end of last year, I've given up. I'm tired of fighting this. Obviously, now, unless I completely initiate it, there is no intimacy in our relationship. Unless I begin a conversation, she is content to watch TV. If I do something nice, I can honestly say I can count the number of times she has said 'thank you' on 1 hand. And, unless its done in a sarcastic manner, I truly cannot remember a time when she has apologized or said 'I'm sorry'.

What really irritates me is that she is all happy and bubbly with her friends. None of them get treated like I do. They all get to see the fun/smiley/friendly/encouraging wife...the wife I married just out of college. I never get to see that when we're alone. I get the sarcastic/pissed off or just completely disinterested wife. I bring this up with my wife; the response is usually along the lines of, "Whatever".

Now, I know that when I point a finger at someone to criticize them, I've got three more pointing back at me. But, damn, I'm just tired of the fight.

I've asked our kids what they think of their parents relationship to get their point of view, and they think its good. Our 10-yr old thinks its really good because "you don't fight like some of my friends parents".

Suggestions?


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Tall,
Take a look at the link and tell me if it makes sense to you. 

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/21278-thermostat-ultimate-barometer-your-r.html





TallDrinkoWater said:


> Good morning,
> Hello all, new user here needing some advice.
> 
> My wife and I have been married for 17 years and we have 3 kids from ages 10 - 15. Up until last year, since about 1996, I made it a priority to be as intimate as possible trying to show my wife through actions that I was truly in love with her (because I was) by making sure we kissed goodbye, holding her, holding her hand, calling her from work in the middle of the day and whatever else I could think of to be certain she knew I was thinking of her. I also talked to her and let her know what I was doing and that I would feel better if she recipricated...that I needed to know that she was thinking of me. I had read somewhere that the more intimate a husband/wife is, the more successful they become! Also, it was fun and I enjoyed it, and I thought we both enjoyed it.
> ...


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## VLR (May 15, 2011)

Been there and I feel for you. A couple of observations:

- A marriage counselor told me I need to make sure I've given 5 geniune compliments before one criticism.

- Everything you wrote was about your efforts to get what you want from her. What does she want that she's not getting from you? Have you asked her? Have you listened when she tried to tell you? Usually, that's the deal. You are doing x,y and z that a wonderful husband would do. Congratulations, but in her mind, you are not doing a, b and c that she wants you to do.

- If and when you do ask her, assuming you reflect back on what she's told you and you can't recall anything, you need to be doing it just for her, not so she will reciprocate with what you want.


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## Sawney Beane (May 1, 2011)

VLR said:


> Been there and I feel for you. A couple of observations:
> 
> - A marriage counselor told me I need to make sure I've given 5 geniune compliments before one criticism.


Judging by what I read on here, there are some people who would struggle to find five things to be genuinely complimentary about with their partners.

"Darling, you really do BREATHE so well...":rofl:


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

As VLR suggested, maybe all the things you do for her ISN'T what she's looking for.

Maybe with three kids 10-15, what she really wants is to be left alone for some period of time during the week.

Maybe not, but you need to find out what is missing. these issues are rarely one-sided and what you re doing or not doing is probably not very evident.

As for initiating intimacy, who cares who initiates? If you want it, ask for it. It's an issue if there's no intimacy, not who initiates it.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

TallDrinkoWater said:


> Good morning,
> Hello all, new user here needing some advice.
> 
> My wife and I have been married for 17 years and we have 3 kids from ages 10 - 15. Up until last year, since about 1996, I made it a priority to be as intimate as possible trying to show my wife through actions that I was truly in love with her (because I was) by making sure we kissed goodbye, holding her, holding her hand, calling her from work in the middle of the day and whatever else I could think of to be certain she knew I was thinking of her. I also talked to her and let her know what I was doing and that I would feel better if she recipricated...that I needed to know that she was thinking of me. I had read somewhere that the more intimate a husband/wife is, the more successful they become! Also, it was fun and I enjoyed it, and I thought we both enjoyed it.


Pause. Good intentions. Possible wrong actions.

Have you done any reading on love languages? The kinds of attention that you have been giving may be how YOU speak love. But it may not be how she hears it. 

My husband speaks love through touch. Not I! I have to work really hard not to flinch with his little drive by caresses. Not that I don't love the feel of him, but if I am say doing the dishes, it feels like his body is in my way. He has a very hard time speaking love my way, through words of affirmation.

But knowing about love languages and specifically what each of yours are may help you learn to speak and HEAR each others'.





> It would get better for a month or so, then she would would revert back to acting like she didnt care, like we were just friends not an intimate couple, not initiating sex (I would have to do that all the time) and now talking to me or showing me she cared.


Ok we are talking about intimacy, caring and sex all in the same breath. This makes sense for you because, like many men, they go hand in hand. The sex forms and strengthens the intimacy.

It may be helpful to recognize that for many women it does not work that way. The feeling of caring and intimacy must preclude the desire for sex. Sex is expression of what is rather than the creation of so to speak.




> So I would talk to her, let her know I'd like more involvement from her, for her to initiate sex, etc. Almost like a bell curve, it would improve then slowly dissipate until she was back to not showing she cared again.


In addition to this, when I would try to have a conversation with her, she would now begin to get irritable with me, start yelling and getting sarcastic as soon as I mentioned anything that had to do with criticising her actions. Of course, when I would admit my faults and what I was doing to correct them, she was all on board and offering constructive criticism, which I took in stride and corrected as best as I could.

Since the end of last year, I've given up. I'm tired of fighting this. Obviously, now, unless I completely initiate it, there is no intimacy in our relationship. 
[/quote]
Pause for a moment. In your mind, try to disassociate sex and intimacy. She likely feels a lack of INTIMACY that makes her not want to have sex.

Please do not feel blamed. Or accused. It takes only one in a partnership to learn new ideas, act accordingly and change the dynamic in the hopes of engendering a change in the other. You are the one who is here. I woudl be saying similar things to her from a different PoV if she were here.



> Unless I begin a conversation, she is content to watch TV. If I do something nice, I can honestly say I can count the number of times she has said 'thank you' on 1 hand. And, unless its done in a sarcastic manner, I truly cannot remember a time when she has apologized or said 'I'm sorry'.


You sound like you have a number of issues before you. Not at all uncommon when things have piled up over 17 years!



> What really irritates me is that she is all happy and bubbly with her friends. None of them get treated like I do. They all get to see the fun/smiley/friendly/encouraging wife...the wife I married just out of college. I never get to see that when we're alone. I get the sarcastic/pissed off or just completely disinterested wife. I bring this up with my wife; the response is usually along the lines of, "Whatever".
> 
> Now, I know that when I point a finger at someone to criticize them, I've got three more pointing back at me. But, damn, I'm just tired of the fight.
> 
> ...


Several prongs, all of them have to do with educating yourself on creating a new dynamic.

1. Google love banks, love languages.

2. Read here the Nice Guy and man up threads. Is it possible to be TOO good to your wife? You betcha. And guess what it kills? You betcha. Sex. Also read the stickies in the Men's Clubhouse about fitness tests and how to pass them. 

3. Find a resource on limit setting in a relationship. if she is treating you poorly, then you need to decide on, and effectively set the boundaries of behavior you are going to set.

Good luck!


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## TallDrinkoWater (May 17, 2011)

VLR said:


> Been there and I feel for you. A couple of observations:
> 
> - A marriage counselor told me I need to make sure I've given 5 geniune compliments before one criticism.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the response. I've asked specifically what she wants, gave her time to think it over, then I wrote them down (and dated the note) and committed to working on them...letting her know when I'm doing those things so she can see that I'm making an effort at it. But it is a two way street; I let her know what I wanted to see and none of them happened. No commitment to getting them done. Nothing. When I asked why she wasn't making an effort, she just says, "Because I dont feel like it".

This is how a lot of our conversations go; when I peel back the onion, and she hasn't gone off the deep end by yelling/screaming and getting sarcastic, the bottom line I've found out is she doesn't want to put out the effort.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

TallDrinkoWater said:


> the bottom line I've found out is she doesn't want to put out the effort.


OR she doesn't know how to or really what she wants. It is not at all uncommon for women (and men from a different angle) not to really know what they want. She may not realize she is fitness testing you, and you are failing. 

See my other post. The Man Up, Nice Guy and Fitness Test topics are ones you want to look at. (Not to the exclusion of the love bank. The love bank stuff is important too.)


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## TallDrinkoWater (May 17, 2011)

Thanks for the suggested reading.

A lot of the warm/hot characteristics apply to me. But I've felt that if I don't respond to her in a lot of those ways, there will be no intimacy in our relationship.

So, as I indicated, near the end of last year, I've just gotten tired of the fight and have implemented a contrarian effort to a lot of the warm/hot items. 

The result: We are more like roommates with a cordial relationship. We both love our kids and I won't entertain divorce but damn, I'm just tired of it.

Something else that comes to mind while thinking of this. We were at one of our kids events this past weekend with the wife of one of our friends that have been married for about 15 years. He showed up a little late...she completely turned her attention from our conversation, looked at him, cupped his cheeks with both her hands and gave him a kiss to welcome him because she hadn't seen him all day.

Now that, to me, is a sign that she's thinking of him and they are intimate. My wife has not ever done that but I keep wishing and hoping that maybe she'll change. Or, maybe not and I'll wait another few years for the kids to start their own lives and address this problem at that time.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

TallDrinkoWater said:


> Thanks for the suggested reading.


Are you referring to me?


> A lot of the warm/hot characteristics apply to me. But I've felt that if I don't respond to her in a lot of those ways, there will be no intimacy in our relationship.


I have no idea what you mean bu warm/hot characteristics.



> So, as I indicated, near the end of last year, I've just gotten tired of the fight and have implemented a contrarian effort to a lot of the warm/hot items.
> 
> The result: We are more like roommates with a cordial relationship. We both love our kids and I won't entertain divorce but damn, I'm just tired of it.


Like it or not, complaining to her that you want sex is never going to work. 



> Something else that comes to mind while thinking of this. We were at one of our kids events this past weekend with the wife of one of our friends that have been married for about 15 years. He showed up a little late...she completely turned her attention from our conversation, looked at him, cupped his cheeks with both her hands and gave him a kiss to welcome him because she hadn't seen him all day.
> 
> Now that, to me, is a sign that she's thinking of him and they are intimate. My wife has not ever done that but I keep wishing and hoping that maybe she'll change. Or, maybe not and I'll wait another few years for the kids to start their own lives and address this problem at that time.


Yah it frequently makes sense to do the same thing hoping for a different result. Oh wait! That is the definition of insanity. 

Seriously, you can either

- complain - you will get no change
- live with it - you will get no change
- divorce - and then you will just get to go through this again with your next wife having learned nothing

Or you could carefully read the stuff on here and elsewhere and learn how to change the dynamic in your relationship.


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## Hoosier (May 17, 2011)

Something else that comes to mind while thinking of this. We were at one of our kids events this past weekend with the wife of one of our friends that have been married for about 15 years. He showed up a little late...she completely turned her attention from our conversation said:


> I registered just so I could respond to this post! I know exactly what you mean, its not just the sex, but the INTIMACY that is lacking. I have been traveling this same path for the last 14 months, and after 30 years of marriage, I too have had enough. If I wanted a roommate to do dishes thats what I would have done and not gotten married. Intimacy may be out of our marriage, I am soon to follow....I too have given up.... in the last three months I have heard her tell the guy she works with, and her brother that molested her as a child that she loved them....she wont say that to me, "cause she isnt sure"...know where I stand. From reading on many of these forum posts I see that some women still love their husbands, up until last week I was not so sure.


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## pidge70 (Jan 17, 2011)

While my SO and I do have sex regularly, there is rarely any intimacy. He hasn't ever really been an affectionate guy. I know the "roommate" feeling myself all too well.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Ben (May 8, 2011)

TallDrinkoWater said:


> Good morning,
> Hello all, new user here needing some advice.
> 
> My wife and I have been married for 17 years and we have 3 kids from ages 10 - 15. Up until last year, since about 1996, I made it a priority to be as intimate as possible trying to show my wife through actions that I was truly in love with her (because I was) by making sure we kissed goodbye, holding her, holding her hand, calling her from work in the middle of the day and whatever else I could think of to be certain she knew I was thinking of her. I also talked to her and let her know what I was doing and that I would feel better if she recipricated...that I needed to know that she was thinking of me. I had read somewhere that the more intimate a husband/wife is, the more successful they become! Also, it was fun and I enjoyed it, and I thought we both enjoyed it.
> ...


And these types of women wonder why their man has an affair and quick to play victim!

I think that if she truly doesn't value you like you claim on here, then the feelings are not mutual between you two. Of course, after the fact of the affair initially she will see you as the one 100% at fault, but I think it takes two to tango and she is driving you into this situation. Some women need their husband to have an affair to be kicked into gear to finally look at themselves too, and I have seen this example a couple of times now with friends.

I'm suggesting nothing, but just saying.


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## discouraged1 (Mar 16, 2010)

TallDrinkoWater said:


> Good morning,
> Hello all, new user here needing some advice.
> 
> My wife and I have been married for 17 years and we have 3 kids from ages 10 - 15. Up until last year, since about 1996, I made it a priority to be as intimate as possible trying to show my wife through actions that I was truly in love with her (because I was) by making sure we kissed goodbye, holding her, holding her hand, calling her from work in the middle of the day and whatever else I could think of to be certain she knew I was thinking of her. I also talked to her and let her know what I was doing and that I would feel better if she recipricated...that I needed to know that she was thinking of me. I had read somewhere that the more intimate a husband/wife is, the more successful they become! Also, it was fun and I enjoyed it, and I thought we both enjoyed it.
> ...


I think my wife has two husbands! She is sharing us.... Thought I was the only one with these challenges. I honestly have no idea what to do either.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

She doesn't treat her friends like crap because they'll leave if she does. She puts you on the back burner because she can and you'll still be there.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

QUOTE=unbelievable;323773]She doesn't treat her friends like crap because they'll leave if she does. She puts you on the back burner because she can and you'll still be there.[/QUOTE]

:iagree:


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## TallDrinkoWater (May 17, 2011)

Mom6547 said:


> Are you referring to me?
> ------------------
> I dont think I was referring to you...a Member31163(?) had mentioned reading about the hot/cold characteristics and I had read the article and the string of response.
> ------------------
> ...


------------------------
Thank you for the advice and I have been reading the stuff on here. I have been trying to change the dynamic of our relationship for 12-14 years; I'm not complaining, just laying out the facts as I see them.

By the way, divorce is not an option to me. We made a commitment when we were married and I honor that commitment. Even if it was an option, there is no chance I'd subject my children to a split household.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

One person can commit to slavery but one can't commit to a marriage. Two people are required for a marriage. I have no intention of leaving mine, either, but I'm not going to give her the impression that I'll tolerate just any old treatment forever and there will be no ill consequences for her. Even the most loyal dog won't tolerate neglect and abuse forever. I'll bet she doesn't like being a fraction of a wife any more than you like having a fraction of a wife. Women are competitive. Give her something to fight or work for. A man can be too reliable, too forgiving, too submissive, too helpful. If she's colder, turn down your heat, find something outside the house to do (preferably where lots of available women are). She wants space, give her plenty and act like you are happy as a pig in slop. I don't recommend having an affair but it doesn't hurt for her to know she isn't the only woman on earth and ignoring you might come with a price she doesn't wish to pay.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

TallDrinkoWater said:


> ------------------------
> Thank you for the advice and I have been reading the stuff on here. I have been trying to change the dynamic of our relationship for 12-14 years; I'm not complaining, just laying out the facts as I see them.


Have you been doing the same thing when you try? Or have you tried to learn new things.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

When I read that divorce is out of the question from a man or woman who are being treated like a cipher by their spouse, I want to cry. Divorce is a terrible end game but it has to always be on the table. Why, because marriage is a contantly evolving union and sometimes the evolution is damaging to one or more persons. 

The way you describe yourself and then your wife - sounds like you are in two different relationships. There is something missing, you must be honest because you must know what it is. Think, dig deep. If your wife is as horrible a witch as you make her out to be and divorce is not an option then you have decades of misery ahead of you. 

If however she has redeeming qualities just like you but, you have lost each other somehow over the years then there is hope. What really happened? What do you need to do to bring the real problem to light. Are you willing to go to the brink to save this, by that I mean consider that you want to separate or divorce and let her know that it is on the table.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## VLR (May 15, 2011)

Notice though, OP, how you started the thread saying all the nice little things you are doing to create intimacy and then when we continue reading we find out about the "Contrarian effort" you have implemented. Is it possible your wife notices the inconsistency? If so, what do you think goes through her mind when she sees you doing the supposed "thoughtful" things?


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Tall,
Would you stay married if your W had an affair? If yes, would you stay married if even after you discovered the affair she refused to end it? 

The reason I ask is that if you don't do something different, that is where this is headed. 

Let me start with this. If she responds ok/positively to you initiating sex than you should be initiating. It really is ok if she doesn't initiate as long as she mostly says YES and actively participates when you connect. 

My guess: Flowers, perfume, love notes do NOTHING to turn your W on. Gentle sex - probably doesn't do that much for her. She wants/needs to see some EDGE from you. And EDGE is not anger, aggression. It is a determined, firm, strong willed approach to a situation you want to change. 

The blatant flirting with another man in front of you. That is about her trying to PROVOKE some sorely needed EDGE from you. 

>>>>>>>>>>>>
He showed up a little late...she completely turned her attention from our conversation, looked at him, cupped his cheeks with both her hands and gave him a kiss to welcome him because she hadn't seen him all day.
>>>>>>>>>>>>




TallDrinkoWater said:


> Thanks for the suggested reading.
> 
> A lot of the warm/hot characteristics apply to me. But I've felt that if I don't respond to her in a lot of those ways, there will be no intimacy in our relationship.
> 
> ...


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## steak (May 6, 2011)

Most women seem to be like that.


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## Summergirl (Aug 17, 2011)

I registered to reply to your post because it is like a mirror image of my problem! I am the one who craves physical intimacy and loving words and my husband shows his love other ways. THe frustrating part, though, is that in the beginning of our relationship he WAS loving, attentive, kissy, huggy, and sexually all over me--so you can't blame it on: oh, he's just not that way. He insists that he does love me and chalks his lack of affection and desire to "I'm Old"(there is an 11 year age difference), "My job is stressful", "I'm tired cuz I work a million hours a week". He really is a good husband and amazing father--we have 2 kids--a one and three year old, and quite a wonderful life but the lack of affection and intimacy has me so lonely and miserable that I cry all the time and am at the end of my rope. We have talked this thing to death and am out of ideas. When something works for me I will let you know!


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## nada (Aug 20, 2011)

discouraged1 said:


> I think my wife has two husbands! She is sharing us.... Thought I was the only one with these challenges. I honestly have no idea what to do either.


Sounds like my ex . I have sympathy with your situation and make a few guesses from what you write. I have a few questions:

- Is she in control/power over the relationship? (Does she wear the pants?)
- Do you feel she has lost her respect for you?
- Two people is thinking of her best interest and one is thinking of you?
- Do you feel like a caretaker in the family/ an employee?


If this sounds familiar I have a few field tested strategies you may consider:

1) Do not make eye contact with her, do not show her intimacy and reject her sexually - turn your back on her and DO NOT CAVE IN. She will quickly pick up that something has changed.
2) Tell her (and mean it): I DON'T NEED YOU!! (You WANT her, but you don't NEED her)

- (Untested) - pick up a new interest: start going to the gym and spend time on improving your attractiveness. This should not go undetected on her radar. If she ask you why the change, then be a bit vague. You are not cheeting, but it will look like that to her.

If she does not contribute her fair share in the relationship, why should you put in your?

This works temporarily if the situation is similar to the questions above. It seems like you need to put in a lot of effort to regain power in the relationship - and that may make you more into the man she married . 


Best of luck
Nada


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