# How can I help my BS with his triggers surrounding our intimacy?



## believing in hope (Mar 24, 2013)

Hello,

I've been reading here for nearly a year, off and on. This is my first post though. I've got a question for all of you, preferably those that feel they are making progress in recovery.

Our story isn't so much what matters right here right now, but just so you know I am the WW. We have two small children and nearly 7 years behind us. I was selfish, immature, illogical and downright a horrible partner when I deceived my spouse. My affair was emotional, physical and frequent, and lasted less than a month.

We are nearly one year into recovery. In the beginning we went through what we all call hysterical bonding. We couldn't get enough of each other, we had sex multiple times a day at least once a day. We were desperate for each other. As if we could finally see each other again. Our wall was knocked down and we tried new things, gave to each other, played etc. We still do, frequently.

Since D Day my BS has been challenged with the images that come during sex. Sometimes they are worse than other times, occasionally its a clear mind experience. When this happens its very emotional, we both feel it and try to hold tight to it. We've tried "new things" to try to create a memories that can out bid the negative ones.

My specific question is, do you have any tips that have worked for you? How have you battled triggers during sex? Wayward spouses, please share what you have tried. Betrayed spouses, what has helped you come back to the now? How have you found the way to being able to look each other in the eyes and feel the love that you are together for?

Ditch the criticism. I'm an ex-wayward spouse, and we've been through a lot in the last year. I am honoured and lucky and blessed and thankful to still have the love of my man. He has shown me his strength. And I will show him mine.

Please share. Thanks!


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## tiredwife&sahm (Jan 4, 2012)

The answer is: time. I don't know if I misread, but I got that the affair was a year ago, correct? If so, you have to give him time. I know you may not want him to have these feelings during such intimate moments between you guys, but he can't stop what he feels and you have to remember not to make this about you. I know it's easier to not have to be faced with the guilt sometimes and you just want that person to just forget it already, but this is part of the healing process. You have to allow him to feel what he will feel, to go through the triggers and eventually the triggers will be less and less. I don't think he'll ever stop having them though, they may just be less obvious. Anyway,good luck to you guys wish you the best.


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

Maybe if you could imagine that the roles were reversed, what would you want your husband to do to reassure you?


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## AngryandUsed (Jun 23, 2011)

The R and the time it takes to R depends on (i) WS openness and further honesty, (ii) WS serious heavy weightlifting, (iii) WS understanding of the pain that a BS undergoes, and (iv) the bonding before the Dday that BS feels, (v) BS strength.

Since you have already spent 1 year post Dday, the triggers will be much less in frequency.

Give him your heart, and demonstrate that.

R will be easier and smoother.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

I would say concentrate on the relationship as a whole and the sex issue will start to diminish. Reassure him every chance you get, tell him how much you love him. Let him know he can talk to you about how he's feeling and hug him often hold his hand. You can never apologize enough. But at the same time try to move on with your life. Going back to habits you had while dating and newly married such as letters, notes, anything that you may have stopped doing. Do anything that reaffirms your commitment to him such as playing "your song" or telling him how lucky you are to have him. Be fully transparent even with the smallest things. Love him, by his love language. Do things for his family, send him a gift at work. You have been granted a second chance, look at it as a bring back the romance opportunity. By doing this he will start feeling better and hopefully the sex triggers will start getting better.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

The problem is even when you do do the romantic stuff, how do you show that you mean it this time? After all, you're only about 5 1/2 years into your marriage when you started cheating. And you had 2 kids with him. You should had been in the throes of love, romance and commitment at the start of your life together with your husband and young family.

Yet, you were not.

You should have deep remorse for committing adultery. That level of remorse does not really show through your posts for me.

It appears you have time on your side. Time, remorse and genuine actions are your best allies.


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## VFW (Oct 24, 2012)

BelieveInHope, most WS get bashed on here because they try to shift the blame or are not contrite, neither is true in your case. I don't have any magical words to offer, but would ask if he is in individual counseling? There is no specific way to act or feel as a BS. Many men would have taken your current efforts as sufficient and been able to heal faster than your husband, while others never do.

Key to any relationship is that the relationship is more important to you than you as an individual. You have shown that to be true and working to help your husband heal. I feel confident that your relationship will heal, but unfortunately it does take time. How long? As long as it takes. Hang tough and best wishes.


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## Dyokemm (Apr 24, 2013)

I think VFW makes a very good point, and it is something you will have to be prepared to deal with.

Everyone reacts to trauma differently in life.

For example, soldiers returning from war. Some get over the horror quickly and are never seriously bothered by it for the rest of their lives.

Some experience years of suffering, but eventually come to a point where they process the pain and are able to function in a new way in life, but the pain is never truly gone.

Others are shattered forever by the trauma they have experienced, and never find a way to move past the pain.

If you read enough threads here on TAM from BS's you will see that they exhibit many of the same wide range of problems coping with the trauma of infidelity.

I point this out, because you will need to be prepared for the possibility that your H will never truly recover and this may be a cross your M will have to bear for the rest of your lives.

If you truly hold onto your love for each other, though, it does not have to mean the death of your M. But you will always have to acknowledge the existence of this issue and accept that it is something you just need to learn to live with.

Hopefully, your H will eventually find peace with this issue. But both of you should be prepared to deal with the possibility that he may never truly do so.


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## biola (Dec 28, 2012)

Continue to love him the way he feels love!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

Keeping the third character out of the bedroom, that ghost, is a hard task.
I believe you are doing right. It's sadly almost unavoidable. Trial and error plus time.
Try to have him focused by keeping eye to eye, try telling his name frequently, try to build up his ego by making sure he's the only one in your mind. Be enthusiastic, present.
Some people triy to "play" the images like a movie in which the OM is mocked or ridiculed, or simply rewrite the narrative(*), some other just let them play and accept them until they desensitize, some others try to block them visualizing a STOP sign os similar tricks...

The physical aspect of my wife's infidelity wasn't that deeply painful facet many other BSs suffer. First becuse it was rather lame and unflatering for OM (and her) and no ego treatening for me, second becasue I managed somehow to put it in the same pile of past BFs she had, they never worried me, what proves it's mostly the betrayal what stinks.

I believe, at the end the mind movies will leasen as the trust is slowly rebuilt so keep doing whetever you are doing to mend the marriage in other aspects, become someone safe to be with and this piece will fix itself.

Scroll down the pages of this forum and read the titles, I'm sure there're many threads regarding this issues specifically.
Also google mind movies, google obsessive thoughts...

(*)
I once saved this. It didn't work for me. Still, just in case.

*Mind movies: Changing Your Vision: A Visulization for Overcoming Obsessive Images* 
_Take some time now to lay back and relax. Take a few deep breaths and feel your body unwind. 
As you do so, consciously, intentionally bring the image that you have been struggling with most to mind. Look at it in as much detail as you can. Hear the sounds and see the images that appear in your image as if they are happening right now in this moment. 
Once you have the image firmly in mind try thinking about this as though it were a videotape or a DVD. Imagine that you can alter the image any way you choose to. 
Keeping in mind that you can alter this scene any way you like, take your image and play it in reverse. Imagine that you hit the rewind button on your VCR or DVD player and you are now watching your image as it hums along in reverse. Once you have done this, press play again and allow the image to play out the way it was before you hit the rewind button. 
Now see if you can alter the physical appearance of the image. 
Try and change the size and shape of the people and objects in the image. Try seeing it as though it were tinted in a different hue. Perhaps you can make the whole image blue or green or pink. Once you have done this try looking at your scene from different perspectives. Try seeing it from high above as though you were looking at it from a bird's eye. Then try and look at it from below as though you were a bug watching the scene. 
Finally come up with some ways of your own to manipulate the scene. You may try adding a soundtrack to your videotape if there isn't one playing, or getting rid of the soundtrack if there 
is one playing. You could think about different scents in the room and alter them as well. 
Do anything you can think of with this image. You may even want to make the people in it look like Mickey Mouse or Donald Duck. 
As you do this realize that this image is completely under your control. The image occurs inside your mind and you can alter it any way you choose to. It is in fact your image. You have the 
power to change it if you wish to. 
Once you are satisfied that you can alter the image at your whim, bring yourself back to the present moment and see whether or not you feel a difference in your emotional state. 
Most people find a sense of freedom and relief once they realize they are able to control the images they have been suffering with. Learning that you are in control of your mind can be a powerful experience. _
Dr. Frank Gunzburg Ph.D., P.A

Best wishes


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## LostViking (Mar 26, 2013)

Be his girlfriend, not a wife.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

It will take him time. And your love and empathy. 

Been where your husband is and it is horrible.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## harrybrown (May 22, 2013)

Let him know that he is not your #2, that he is your #1. Show him by your actions and you should try to initiate the action.


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

I have had moments where I triggered big time during sex. We were at a hotel in May. I lost it. I promised myself that I would never do that again to my wife.

So what do I do? I suck it up.  Since we started R there is not a time, (Not one) where we are having sex that I don't think of my wife with the XOM. I have never shared this with her. It suc*s. There are times I just want to leave. I did that in the motel and it was not pleasant for either of us, so I don't want to do that. 

I just can't get this stuff out of my head. All I can do at this point is just try to enjoy the moment.


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## Squeakr (May 1, 2013)

I am not sure how much he knows about your A, detail wise, but do not try to make the time with your BH the same good times that you had with your OM (even if you are trying to make them like it used to be with him, that is not how he will view it). You talk about trying new things and changing things up, but if you never did these things before in your marriage, it will be a trigger that he wasn't getting this before and now after your A he is. He will question if he is getting this change because of the way the OM was with you, you have now realized you like it all of the sudden (of which he will attribute to the OM as well), or that you are doing this as something special for him and him only.

Make sure that you do something that you have only done for him and never for anyone else. I know that for me when I found out that oral was something I never really ever got in our marriage (and I begged for it pretty much) but was given freely to the OM without his even needing to ask, I have trouble with it from now on when/ if it happens (as well as other things she would never take part in with me). I asked her is she just did it and she said, yes. I asked why and she said she knew he liked it. I said I liked it and begged for it, but never got it, and she said she didn't feel that close to me. It felt like she put a bullet through my skull at that point. Don't do this to you BH.

It will take lots of time and reassurance from you if it is to heal (and as in some cases it may never and you both need to decide if that is a situation that you can live with). Be spontaneous and this will help to ease the triggers, as when it is planned he may be thinking about trying to one up the AP and the actions they did.


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## Acoa (Sep 21, 2012)

I'm the BS in my M. We are a bit past a year from Dday and I still struggle with triggers some days. It's getting better. I've come to find that there are three things we need to work on as a copule in order for things to keep improving..

1.) My stuff
2.) Her stuff
3.) Our stuff

My stuff - We all have baggage to deal with. I'm no saint and I have my share of issues to deal with. They don't excuse my wife for what she did. But if we want to have a sucessful marriage, I need to straighten myself out and figure out who I am. There will be things she likes about that, and things she doesn't like. Part of "our stuff" was that I did not express my emotions in the moment. I would bottle it up until I couldn't take it then I'd explode.

Her stuff - My wife knew cheating was bad before she did it. Yet, she did it. I'm not saying it to judge her, just saying that's what happened. She needed to explore what inside of her lead to that moral colapse. She had to make changes in her life to prevent that boundary from getting crossed again. For me, part of feeling better was seeing the changes she made in her life. Abandoning toxic friends, being more accountable for her wearabouts, not deleting texts or email. She also started sharing with me what she is feeling and why.

Our stuff - Communication is king on this one. My stuff and her stuff pull us apart. To remain close and connected we need to talk about that stuff. It's difficult. Dredging up thast "stuff" is painful. I don't know about you or your H, but my wife and I were avoiding that stuff. It was some misguided idea that by not talking about our pain we could protect eachother from being hurt by it. But that's worse. We were actively doing things that hurt the other person (much of it unintentional, but obviously not all of it or I wouldn't be here). But we didn't even realize the pain we were causing each other because we didn't talk about it. We just hoped the other had some magic radar and would notice they hurt us and fix themselves to make it stop. Life doesn't work that way. Some folks are more empathetic than others, but either way, we both need to let eachother know what we are feeling and why. When we need the other person to do something for us we need to ask them. 

It really helped when we started to get under the hood and talk about the difficult things. I stopped feeling like she was hiding things from me to "save me from more pain". Because the truth was I could tell she was holding back. But be careful as the WS that you understand and accept your roll in the "our stuff" category. You need to share your pain, but you can't blame it on your H. You are responsible for your own feelings. You can talk about your H behaviors that bug you and it's important that you get to that. But don't blame that for your letting your boundaries get crossed and having an affair. That's on you.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Do you hold back anything that you didn't hold back with your AP?


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

LostViking said:


> Be his girlfriend, not a wife.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


+1 On this. A girlfriend expresses want and desire and eagerness to impress. Fun sex. Eager sex. Think about why you had sex then, and why you have sex now.

And lol on the anal. I asked for that and other "specials" too and was rebuffed... So there is resentment festering there and her attractiveness dropped down to almost nothing in my eyes. The thought process is your veejayjay is now a public park versus our private backyard; The special of it now gone and shared with others. Sorry. Well, and the darker side; I wanted some sort of punishment and knew my wife didn't want that. I didn't want to get stabbed in the back either, so bending her over using sex (the weapon she hurt me so deeply with) seemed somewhat 'just'. I very well might be out there on my own on that, so it would be something to ask your husband about (and yourself whether you'd be up for it or not).


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## badmemory (Jul 31, 2012)

believing in hope said:


> Ditch the criticism. *I'm an ex-wayward spouse*, and we've been through a lot in the last year.


Some comments,

You say you are an *ex*-wayward after one year of not cheating. Personally, I thinks that's like an alcoholic saying that they're an ex-alcoholic after being sober a year. Better said, if you are, that you're a remorseful wayward spouse.

I can put myself in your husband's position, because I'm not quite two years removed from Dday. We went through the same thing. The hysterical bonding, my mind movies, all of it.

My suggestions to you? Initiate often, allow him to be a little selfish, be naughty, be enthusiastic, keep it light, and don't in any way, approach sex as dutiful. He'll know if you do. Make him think that sex with him is the best thing since sliced bread - even if it isn't. Be patient.

With luck, and some time passed, you'll find a synergy and establish some equilibrium between the two of you. 

At least you're trying to get advice on the subject and being pro-active. That's a good thing.

Good luck.


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## CH (May 18, 2010)

Others have said it, time.

But sometime it never fades or it gets worse. Nothing you can do but be there for him. It's a battle he has to face himself, but that doesn't mean you can't be there to support him in this battle.

It's the price we pay for our selfishness. Too bad it's our spouses who pay the ultimate price for it. We get the rewards and they get the bag of crap. By rewards I mean we got to play around and then keep our family.

Support and reassure him. And never let it happen again, you will say NEVER will this happen again but trust me it can. It's up to you on how to handle it in the future, there will always be temptation, especially when things get tough again. And no marriage is a fairy tale, 16 years after my affair and I've had more than my share of opportunities, it was very, very hard to turn them down but I did.

And my wife to this day still brings it up sometimes if an argument gets very heated. Like once or twice a year. In time it fades but it NEVER goes away 100%, NEVER.


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## Vanguard (Jul 27, 2011)

CH said:


> Others have said it, time.
> 
> But sometime it never fades or it gets worse. Nothing you can do but be there for him. It's a battle he has to face himself, but that doesn't mean you can't be there to support him in this battle.
> 
> ...


At least you own it. I like what you've said about this thing-- it's up to us. Time heals but time also makes people bolder and more likely to cheat. 

It takes incredible will not to cheat, and I'd imagine it takes even greater will to not cheat _again_. Most people want to think they have this but very, very few actually do. 

I hate to be a party pooper, but someone who regards themselves as a former wayward, rather than letting their loved one dub them such, worries me a great deal.


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

Some weeks ago my wife said to me, "relax Mac" right before the act. Well that brought back what was on the VAR. My wife told the XOM on the recording the second time they were going to have sex and after a long conversation "Relax", and then the moans soon started. So even that word is somewhat a trigger. 

We use to have sex in the back of her Jeep. And that is where they had sex several times. I can't wait to get rid of that car.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

believing in hope said:


> Hello,
> 
> I've been reading here for nearly a year, off and on. This is my first post though. I've got a question for all of you, preferably those that feel they are making progress in recovery.
> 
> ...



Are you in IC? because you say about a year ago you were a "selfish, immature, illogical and downright a horrible partner........." how have you managed to transform yourself in such a short amount of time to someone ready to "show your strength"? Getting IC is the only way you can demonstrate that you are genuinely sorry, which should be his prerequisite for ever touching you again, or allowing you to touch him.

...and sorry for not being willing to ditch the criticism, but your intial post above bears a strong witness to you being a very artificial person. The way you're able to put across a kind of "dog on it honey let's just put it behind us and get on with a happy life!" 
kind of attitude. I recommend first demonstrating to him that you possess a level of empathy regarding ANYTHING. that might get his attention......


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## hurtingbadly (Sep 14, 2011)

CH said:


> Others have said it, time.
> 
> But sometime it never fades or it gets worse. Nothing you can do but be there for him. It's a battle he has to face himself, but that doesn't mean you can't be there to support him in this battle.
> 
> ...


It has gotten worse for me. I'm two years in, really one year after second DDay. At first we went thru that hysterical bonding crap, that slowly went away and we continued sex, but it didn't feel the same anymore for me. That connection, specialness was just gone. Sometimes I cried afterwards. Recently, about a month ago a switch just turned off for me. Like totally, completely turned off. I have zero desire to have sex with him. It sucks, cause the sex drive is still kinda there, I just don't want to do it with him. He's been on the sofa for a month now. I had issues doing a certain thing I knew homewrecker did for him, I just couldn't bring myself to do it anymore. Now, I can't even imagine romantically kissing him. Just typing this I realize how bad it has become. I think I reached that point. He hurt me too much. The thing was I thought sex was pretty good between us. I never denied him. I just don't understand why he'd ruin that.


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## hurtingbadly (Sep 14, 2011)

Squeakr said:


> I am not sure how much he knows about your A, detail wise, but do not try to make the time with your BH the same good times that you had with your OM (even if you are trying to make them like it used to be with him, that is not how he will view it). You talk about trying new things and changing things up, but if you never did these things before in your marriage, it will be a trigger that he wasn't getting this before and now after your A he is. He will question if he is getting this change because of the way the OM was with you, you have now realized you like it all of the sudden (of which he will attribute to the OM as well), or that you are doing this as something special for him and him only.
> 
> Make sure that you do something that you have only done for him and never for anyone else. I know that for me when I found out that oral was something I never really ever got in our marriage (and I begged for it pretty much) but was given freely to the OM without his even needing to ask, I have trouble with it from now on when/ if it happens (as well as other things she would never take part in with me). I asked her is she just did it and she said, yes. I asked why and she said she knew he liked it. I said I liked it and begged for it, but never got it, and she said she didn't feel that close to me. It felt like she put a bullet through my skull at that point. Don't do this to you BH.
> 
> It will take lots of time and reassurance from you if it is to heal (and as in some cases it may never and you both need to decide if that is a situation that you can live with). Be spontaneous and this will help to ease the triggers, as when it is planned he may be thinking about trying to one up the AP and the actions they did.


See? This pisses me off. I gave him oral often. Why would he go and get it from someone else? So he didn't appreciate what I did for him ever. Now I can't bring myself to do it. It would be torture for me cause I'd be thinking about her doing it to him.


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## nogutsnoglory (Jan 17, 2013)

It may take years. It may never be ok. This is the damage you caused him. You of course want it to stop so you can feel better and not relive the guilt. You have to relive the guilt though, for the rest of your life. As he will never be able to feel as connected to you as he once did. Most if not all of us have a special bond that we share with our spouse and lovemaking is the realization of that connection. With out the bond it is just sex as many of us have experienced as well. Most will say the bond is so much more special and we love to feel that special feeling where it is only the two of us in the world at that moment. You took that away from your husband. Now he just has sex with you. He wants to have that feeling back badly, and I am sure there are moments he can feel it, but when they are interrupted by the pain, the mind movies etc... it is devastating and takes the life out of you. he may never recover, only time will tell. I do recommend counseling for him though as it will help to give him tools mentally to properly compartmentalize his feelings and learn to cope with the hurt. It will not make it go away though.
Cheaters do not realize what they have done, they do not realize the level of pain they caused. They think they know, but they have absolutely no idea. You can read a thousand stories and think you understand, but until it happens to you, you have no idea what the feeling is like.


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## billybobb (Aug 2, 2013)

you need too give it too him all the same way you did possibly with the other men , anal , car back seat , with out condom , let him come in side even anal if he did . he need's too conquer all this and take the cave man seat again from the other men . do wild stuff hair pull , span king , bent over table . tell him he has bigger member and that he is moore skill full then the other men and the other where smaller and less skill full .


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

Thorburn said:


> Some weeks ago my wife said to me, "relax Mac" right before the act. Well that brought back what was on the VAR. My wife told the XOM on the recording the second time they were going to have sex and after a long conversation "Relax", and then the moans soon started. So even that word is somewhat a trigger.
> 
> We use to have sex in the back of her Jeep. And that is where they had sex several times. I can't wait to get rid of that car.


forget the car; you need to get rid of that wife....


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## believing in hope (Mar 24, 2013)

Its been quite some time since I posted this question to you all. Since I did we moved across the country (second time in a year). We both took some time off from TAM to settle again. Reading back on my post now gives me more of an objective view point, quite clearly to the outside eye I could appear to be unremorseful by my "ditch the criticism" comment. Also with my "ex-wayward" term for myself. 
When I wrote here I was seeking help and was wanting advice from other wayward spouses who have persevered and felt as though they have worked towards bettering their relationships now. The way I am with my partner and the way I speak on TAM are different. I am not seeking approval or trying to convince anyone here just how devastating it is for me to have done what I did. So by asking for no criticism I was trying to avoid the obvious self work that I do at home and look for something constructive to add to it. As for being an ex-wayward well, that was denial. I cheated, I lied, I had forsaken my love, I disrespected him, our childrens lives, and myself. I am a cheater and I will always carry that. But I am so sad, so sorry and so remorseful. 
I can say with absolute honesty and conviction that I will never be unfaithful again. I'd rather not live than to cause the pain and wreckage that I have.
I apologize to any BS who read my post and felt that I was just another WS who doesn't honestly feel remorse. I do. I do. I do.
The change in my emotional strength is something that happened quickly with me, not to say that I don't have much learning and growing to do, because I know it will never end. I will always have struggles, temptation and depression to battle its just about where I put that energy when the problems arise. Do I turn in to my partner when its tough or do I turn away? I can say that in the last year I have sat and listened while my H vents, while he yells, screams, hurts himself to divert the pain. I have laid beside him and held him when he cries and taken the worst of names and character insults in the book. But I haven't faltered, its my turn to be the rock. He has only just gone back to work. I moved our family across the country to change our surroundings where we lived with his family for a year. I moved us back when I realized that I couldn't support us where we were. In the last year I have done the parenting while he lay in bed. And now, I am working my a$$ of to get us back on our feet.
I am blessed to have his love, his strength, his endurance. He is my greatest motivation and my biggest hero. I will wait everyday for him.

In regards to intimacy. I never did anything new or different with OM, though I have found that because my H wants details, he has triggers surrounding everything. 3 days after DDay we had a small vacation planned, he agreed to come so we could get away from home and talk there. While we were away our hysterical bonding began. It was animalistic, we needed each other. Our fear of the loss of each other was so great that our intimacy level skyrocketed and my openness (which was always somewhat reserved) broke open. I wanted him so badly that I forgot my walls and bad memories and left it all behind. Since then we have tried it all... and have a lot of fun doing it. Its great, our sex life is better than ever. Its the triggers that are bad. Its all the time, still. Ive read all the advice and understand the need to build new exciting memories for us and only us.
I believe that now its about proving that I can be strong and have the fortitude to hold us while we crawl out of what is beyond the hardest of times that we had before.

We both went to counselling. We've had IC and MC. Since our most recent move we haven't been able to find a community focused counselling group in our city yet. I know we would both benefit a lot if we could. Right now it feels like its just us battling this war and we could use some backup.

Thank you all for your posts.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Glad to hear it is turning around for you. Keep going and keep being there for him. It's all you can do.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Headspin (May 13, 2012)

believing in hope said:


> Reading back on my post now gives me more of an objective view point, quite clearly to the outside eye I could appear to be unremorseful by my "ditch the criticism" comment. Also with my "ex-wayward" term for myself.
> ...........
> As for being an ex-wayward well, that was denial. I cheated, I lied, I had forsaken my love, I disrespected him, our childrens lives, and myself. I am a cheater and I will always carry that. But I am so sad, so sorry and so remorseful.
> 
> ...


Well there's a turn up for the books!!

I did'nt enter your thread for advice or anything else because I thought you were just another self centred self serving loathsome entitled selfish cheat.

It seems you realise that too and it's really refreshing to hear you say all the 'right things' in the 'right' way.

Well done

Clearly you are doing the 'heavy lifting' and that at least gives your reconciliation a chance. you seem to understand the trauma of 'triggering' and although correct it will never be forgotten you seem to have got yourselves into a place mentally where you have good hopes of staying together 

This must have taken a massive inwards looking process from you that will probably never be too far away forever but you do seem to understand the colossal magnitude of your actions so ... 

This little thread is actually a very very good example of - post 1 - how not to ask for help if you are a wayward spouse and getting little respect / response and your last post - showing how a wayward ought to react if there is to be any hope of a true real 'honest' reconciliation

Fingers crossed it keeps going well for you both


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## Vanguard (Jul 27, 2011)

Thorburn said:


> I have had moments where I triggered big time during sex. We were at a hotel in May. I lost it. I promised myself that I would never do that again to my wife.
> 
> So what do I do? I suck it up. Since we started R there is not a time, (Not one) where we are having sex that I don't think of my wife with the XOM. I have never shared this with her. It suc*s. There are times I just want to leave. I did that in the motel and it was not pleasant for either of us, so I don't want to do that.
> 
> I just can't get this stuff out of my head. All I can do at this point is just try to enjoy the moment.


I have nothing but love for you, friend. 

Why the fvck do you put yourself through that?


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## ironman (Feb 6, 2013)

Hi BiH,

You wanted advice, well here's mine ...

Feed his ego. But be genuine about it. False compliments will be seen through and make you look even worse. Make him your king of the household. Don't ever compare him to another man ... ever. Be humble.

Even with all this, he may not recover. What you did was destroy his self-esteem as a man ... it takes a looooong time to recover that. Some guys never do and many may need to end the relationship to do so. You need to grow a thick skin and be prepared for a long journey to recovery (at his discretion).

Good luck. Hoping you've really seen the light ....


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## missthelove2013 (Sep 23, 2013)

badmemory said:


> Some comments,
> 
> You say you are an *ex*-wayward after one year of not cheating. Personally, I thinks that's like an alcoholic saying that they're an ex-alcoholic after being sober a year. Better said, if you are, that you're a remorseful wayward spouse.
> 
> ...


this!!
I totally understand the WS wanting to move on, but she is on the BS time line...one year in, the WS is still doing some heavy lifting...sure they BOTH need to move on eventually, she HAS to earn and regain his trust, forgiveness, he HAS to forgive and move forward...but its his time line Im afraid

I like the fact that you guys did the hysterical bonding...the way you put it "rediscovered each other" is cool...as long as its for real and not faked (no reason to think it is) I think thats VERY important to R

If it were me, I would just want her to be there to LISTEN to me, comfort me, and reassure...let him do the talking...just remind him you love him and you are willing to do whatever he needs to regain his trust...DO NOT TELL HIM YOUR A WAS A MISTAKE...all I can think when someone claims it was a mistake is "then it can happen again easily enough"...affairs arent mistakes, they are "on purposes"...

good luck to you and I sincerely hope you guys keep moving forward


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## missthelove2013 (Sep 23, 2013)

hurtingbadly said:


> It has gotten worse for me. I'm two years in, really one year after second DDay. At first we went thru that hysterical bonding crap, that slowly went away and we continued sex, but it didn't feel the same anymore for me. That connection, specialness was just gone. Sometimes I cried afterwards. Recently, about a month ago a switch just turned off for me. Like totally, completely turned off. I have zero desire to have sex with him. It sucks, cause the sex drive is still kinda there, I just don't want to do it with him. He's been on the sofa for a month now. I had issues doing a certain thing I knew homewrecker did for him, I just couldn't bring myself to do it anymore. Now, I can't even imagine romantically kissing him. Just typing this I realize how bad it has become. I think I reached that point. He hurt me too much. The thing was I thought sex was pretty good between us. I never denied him. I just don't understand why he'd ruin that.


I never experienced being a BS in my marriage, but had some girlfriends cheat on me...and we did the same thing, hysterical bonding...never knew the term till TAM and it fits...my first love cheated with a 40 something cop (we were 18)...and the cop was the nicest guy around, predator...anyways after she cheated and we got back, we had sex like rabbits...multiple times a day, and we spent every second together...it wasnt faked, it was like when we first started telling each other "i love you"...I made the mistake of demanding detail on their sex, and she gave me a lot of details...and after the bonding, these details haunted me, and it killed our sex life...I couldnt even kiss her anymore and she just disgusted me...


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

All you need to know is that you owe nobody here any appologies. They are nameless, faceless people on an internet message board. Sometimes people who go through stuff like this themselves empathize so much with the party who is hurting that they forget that they aren't the one's in the situation.

So good for you for trying to fix things and acknowledging your faults, but the appology isn't necessary, not to screen names and avatars here. To your husband, definitely. 

I never experienced HB because I was cut loose after I found out. So I have no advice. Just cheering you guys on.


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## Headspin (May 13, 2012)

sinnister said:


> All you need to know is that you owe nobody here any appologies. They are nameless, faceless people on an internet message board. Sometimes people who go through stuff like this themselves empathize so much with the party who is hurting that they forget that they aren't the one's in the situation.


No she doesn't *need* to apologise but actually *we are important. Very* To her actually

We are the ones who understand her and particularly her betrayed husbands plight and she realises to her credit that many of us would not go near this thread because of what she said and the way she said what she did in her opening post 

Good of her to realise that and explain herself and how she understands that

I find her apology really heartwarming actually and in fact I think it will help her no end for doing that 

We are nameless and are faceless but she realises that we have a lot in common with her husband to the point where she would not want to try and trickle rug sweep us 

I say she is showing the betrayed, whoever we are, a lot of respect and her husband even more so 

It's part of her remorse package that is imo working positively for her - for them


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## awake1 (Jan 29, 2013)

believing in hope said:


> Its been quite some time since I posted this question to you all. Since I did we moved across the country (second time in a year). We both took some time off from TAM to settle again. Reading back on my post now gives me more of an objective view point, quite clearly to the outside eye I could appear to be unremorseful by my "ditch the criticism" comment. Also with my "ex-wayward" term for myself.
> When I wrote here I was seeking help and was wanting advice from other wayward spouses who have persevered and felt as though they have worked towards bettering their relationships now. The way I am with my partner and the way I speak on TAM are different. I am not seeking approval or trying to convince anyone here just how devastating it is for me to have done what I did. So by asking for no criticism I was trying to avoid the obvious self work that I do at home and look for something constructive to add to it. As for being an ex-wayward well, that was denial. I cheated, I lied, I had forsaken my love, I disrespected him, our childrens lives, and myself. I am a cheater and I will always carry that. But I am so sad, so sorry and so remorseful.
> I can say with absolute honesty and conviction that I will never be unfaithful again. I'd rather not live than to cause the pain and wreckage that I have.
> I apologize to any BS who read my post and felt that I was just another WS who doesn't honestly feel remorse. I do. I do. I do.
> ...


Is there a way you could point your husband toward this forum? 

If he started a thread it could be helpful to him.


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## Philat (Sep 12, 2013)

BiH: The triggers could last for years, but should decrease in their intensity over time. For me as the BS it has been several years and I still get anxious driving past the street where OM used to live. When these triggers happen show your H that you recognize what is happening and understand why it is happening, and let him know you'll do what you have to to ease his pain. Don't game it, be totally up front. Once WW and I were driving past OM's street and she could see I was clenching the wheel to the point of white-knuckling. My mind movies were in full gear. She just took my hand in hers, and the tension dissipated. He needs to know he's not alone in his suffering.


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## harrybrown (May 22, 2013)

Keep telling him that you are sorry. And he will continue to need to hear from you that you love him more than you loved your AP.

Glad you are still together. When you can get back into counseling.


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## now_awake (May 29, 2013)

I never understood hysterical bonding. All I wanted to do was get away from WH. I still can't imagine being intimate with him. Why put myself in such a vulnerable position? 

In the end, it may all be a deal breaker no matter what you do now. All you can do is to keep going. My H is super remorseful too, and it's still so difficult. Sometimes I wish he would want to give up. At least that would make more sense to me. 

Anyway, I'm glad things are going better for you both. We seem to be in the same part of the country. PM me if you ever want to chat.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

There are two parts to sexual cheating - the sex and the betrayal 

Different people place different priorities on each part and can do so without recognizing even in their self what those priorities really are.

You've been working to be supportive of you BS. Which is good. You are showing him that you value him and that he is important and primary to you, and by taking his angry words you are showing that you will sacrifice your own comfort to help him.

But does he trust you like he did before? Do he worry who you are with? Does he question why you cheated with the OM out of all the men on earth? Why that particular man in that particular situation?

I ask because when you got married you pledged to be faithful, and I'm sure you meant it then, and your husband knew it to be true.

Yet, eventually a situation arose - and opportunity and a man came together and you made the choice to be unfaithful.

Does you husband deep down fear that its possible that such a situation might again arise, despite your vehement protests and current acts of care and sacrifice to him?

I ask because him having triggers around your sex acts with the OM may be not as much about the sex act, but that the moment of you choosing and desiring to have the OM enter you is a clear cut focus point of you choosing to betray your husband. Its the clear spot where the line got crossed by choice.

This is just an observation and a guess, but I suggest you may think about it. See the act of sex with the OM for its symbolic value and why that triggers your husband.


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## bfree (Sep 30, 2012)

Believing, I'm glad to hear things are going better. You do sound much more centered and introspective. If your husband is still struggling mightily with triggers and the mind movies I would suggest that the two of you begin posting in the reconciliation thread here in the Coping With Infidelity section. It's a very non judgemental thread where both waywards and betrayed share together their stories and helpful suggestions while traveling the reconciliation road. It might be helpful for both of you.


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

Prepare yourself for the possibility he will never get past it and may walk away from you. Some men, such as myself, can never get beyond the magnitude of the betrayal and will simply choose not to live with such pain. For some, life's too damn short to live in constant agony.

I attempted to reconcile with my wayward wife but came to realize it wasn't worth it. This may or may not be the case for your husband. You're in for the fight of your life.


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

"Ditch the criticism". That right there is the attitude that contributed to me walking away from my soon to be ex cheating wife.

You need and deserve criticism, and declaring you won't take it is an indication you are still selfish, immature and not really remorseful.

Eta

I read your latest post, seems you have opened your eyes some. Good to read.


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## nogutsnoglory (Jan 17, 2013)

Healer said:


> Prepare yourself for the possibility he will never get past it and may walk away from you. Some men, such as myself, can never get beyond the magnitude of the betrayal and will simply choose not to live with such pain. For some, life's too damn short to live in constant agony.
> 
> I attempted to reconcile with my wayward wife but came to realize it wasn't worth it. This may or may not be the case for your husband. You're in for the fight of your life.


Agreed, I am of the school that, I am a confident man, a good man, and am of value. Due to this, I respect myself way too much to stay with a woman that is anything less than faithful.
I am in no way saying that others do not value themselves the same. I just think others are naive enough to think they found the one woman they can be happy with. If he is of strong will and holds respect for himself at a very high level, there is a good chance he will realize he will never think about you the way he used to. The freedom in his mind to do so is gone and for most it is gone forever. 
I need to be able to give myself to my wife. If I have doubts about her, I can't do that and would leave her. Make sure you always remember if he stays, you deserved to be left at the curb for what you did. He treasures you and you turned what he treasured into trash. You will be lucky if he gets past it.
Cheaters often make the mistake of thinking they deserve a second chance, they don't. It is nothing but a gift given from the BS.


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

nogutsnoglory said:


> Agreed, I am of the school that, I am a confident man, a good man, and am of value. Due to this, I respect myself way too much to stay with a woman that is anything less than faithful.
> I am in no way saying that others do not value themselves the same. I just think others are naive enough to think they found the one woman they can be happy with. If he is of strong will and holds respect for himself at a very high level, there is a good chance he will realize he will never think about you the way he used to. The freedom in his mind to do so is gone and for most it is gone forever.
> I need to be able to give myself to my wife. If I have doubts about her, I can't do that and would leave her. Make sure you always remember if he stays, you deserved to be left at the curb for what you did. He treasures you and you turned what he treasured into trash. You will be lucky if he gets past it.
> Cheaters often make the mistake of thinking they deserve a second chance, they don't. It is nothing but a gift given from the BS.


Well put and 100% true.

I'll never understand the mentality of the WS who thinks they deserve or even wants a second chance. The moment you have sex with someone who isn't your spouse, you have killed the marriage, dead.

I almost understand the walk away wife better. They're selfish and cruel, but at least it makes sense. They kill the marriage and walk away. The ones who want to screw someone else, then be welcomed back, I do not get that at all. That's my stbxww. She actually texted me the other day "is it all you hoped it would be? Are you happy? I'm suffering in pain, hope that makes you feel better". She was referring to me having my freedom. I replied " all I ever wanted was my family". Her response? " I gave you everything". LOL. Right. She cheated, left me, and now it's me who has "thrown her away". ****ing deluded.


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## nogutsnoglory (Jan 17, 2013)

Healer said:


> Well put and 100% true.
> 
> I'll never understand the mentality of the WS who thinks they deserve or even wants a second chance. The moment you have sex with someone who isn't your spouse, you have killed the marriage, dead.
> 
> I almost understand the walk away wife better. They're selfish and cruel, but at least it makes sense. They kill the marriage and walk away. The ones who want to screw someone else, then be welcomed back, I do not get that at all. That's my stbxww. She actually texted me the other day "is it all you hoped it would be? Are you happy? I'm suffering in pain, hope that makes you feel better". She was referring to me having my freedom. I replied " all I ever wanted was my family". Her response? " I gave you everything". LOL. Right. She cheated, left me, and now it's me who has "thrown her away". ****ing deluded.


Just the unbelievable selfishness that we see in the WS. Good for you for leaving her. She sounds like the deserves to be left type. Hysterical, she is blaming you for tossing her to the side. She sounds like a keeper. 
As in, some one please keep her away from me!


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

nogutsnoglory said:


> Agreed, I am of the school that, I am a confident man, a good man, and am of value. Due to this, *I respect myself way too much to stay with a woman that is anything less than faithful.*I am in no way saying that others do not value themselves the same. *I just think others are naive enough to think they found the one woman they can be happy with. *If he is of strong will and holds respect for himself at a very high level, there is a good chance he will realize he will never think about you the way he used to. The freedom in his mind to do so is gone and for most it is gone forever.
> I need to be able to give myself to my wife. If I have doubts about her, I can't do that and would leave her. Make sure you always remember if he stays, you deserved to be left at the curb for what you did. He treasures you and you turned what he treasured into trash. You will be lucky if he gets past it.
> Cheaters often make the mistake of thinking they deserve a second chance, they don't. It is nothing but a gift given from the BS.


this time with the "bolded lines" really bolded.
--------------------------------------------------------------

THIS!! bolded lines especially........

thinking this way is not a natural state for many of us. BUT, if a BS is going through all the work and turmoil of recovering from the WS behavior, they might as well set their sites on the best healing objective they can conceive of. so see the two bolded sentences above - if you can get yourself to think like that, then you'll end up pretty good regardless of whether you D or R.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

believing in hope said:


> Its been quite some time since I posted this question to you all. Since I did we moved across the country (second time in a year). We both took some time off from TAM to settle again. Reading back on my post now gives me more of an objective view point, quite clearly to the outside eye I could appear to be unremorseful by my "ditch the criticism" comment. Also with my "ex-wayward" term for myself.
> When I wrote here I was seeking help and was wanting advice from other wayward spouses who have persevered and felt as though they have worked towards bettering their relationships now. The way I am with my partner and the way I speak on TAM are different. I am not seeking approval or trying to convince anyone here just how devastating it is for me to have done what I did. So by asking for no criticism I was trying to avoid the obvious self work that I do at home and look for something constructive to add to it. As for being an ex-wayward well, that was denial. I cheated, I lied, I had forsaken my love, I disrespected him, our childrens lives, and myself. I am a cheater and I will always carry that. But I am so sad, so sorry and so remorseful.
> I can say with absolute honesty and conviction that I will never be unfaithful again. I'd rather not live than to cause the pain and wreckage that I have.
> I apologize to any BS who read my post and felt that I was just another WS who doesn't honestly feel remorse. I do. I do. I do.
> ...


OP - sounds like your husband has gone through a major bout of depression. true? (see bolded lines)


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Your devotion to him and time will help.

First few times we made love after my wife's affair I could not fully maintain an erection and that was a purely psychological reaction.


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## theroad (Feb 20, 2012)

believing in hope said:


> Hello,
> 
> I've been reading here for nearly a year, off and on. This is my first post though. I've got a question for all of you, preferably those that feel they are making progress in recovery.
> 
> ...


Not knowing detailed timeline of the affair, how your BH found out, whether you told him all or trickle truthed your BH, what work you have done towards recovery, did you meet OM through work, or OM was a neighbor, so me making offers on how to move forward hard.

So I will say that recovery is a 2 to 5 year process. Where are you on that timeline?

Incase you have not done all that needs to be done to recover get the book Surviving An Affair by Dr Harley. Then another book when you finish the first book is His Needs Her Needs by the same author.


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

PTSD counseling might help.

The reactions of the betrayed spouse resemble the post-traumatic stress symptoms of the victims of catastrophic events. Common reactions to the loss of innocence and shattered assumptions include obsessively pondering details of the affair; continuously watching for further signs of betrayal; and physiological hyperarousal, flashbacks and intrusive images. The most severely traumatized are those who had the greatest trust and were the most unsuspecting.


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## happened2me (Oct 5, 2013)

Healer said:


> Well put and 100% true.
> 
> I'll never understand the mentality of the WS who thinks they deserve or even wants a second chance. The moment you have sex with someone who isn't your spouse, you have killed the marriage, dead.
> 
> I almost understand the walk away wife better. They're selfish and cruel, but at least it makes sense. They kill the marriage and walk away. The ones who want to screw someone else, then be welcomed back, I do not get that at all. That's my stbxww. She actually texted me the other day "is it all you hoped it would be? Are you happy? I'm suffering in pain, hope that makes you feel better". She was referring to me having my freedom. I replied " all I ever wanted was my family". Her response? " I gave you everything". LOL. Right. She cheated, left me, and now it's me who has "thrown her away". ****ing deluded.


Unfortunately renewing your marriage vows only does just that. It's hard to see it as more than just a symbolic "renewal" of the marriage. It does not change the fact that your spouse has sex with someone outside of the marriage. It's gotta be the most bitter pill to swallow.

YOU "threw her away?" Sounds like someone that wanted to have their cake and eat it too. I don't understand how someone can turn your world upside down and then blame YOU. Incredible.


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## hookares (Dec 7, 2011)

Since the OP has only had the one affair, perhaps he can find a way to bury the memory. I wouldn't know since my ex was cheating for so long that I often find I have been talking in my sleep about the experience. My solution is to not go to sleep with any woman I entertain.


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## believing in hope (Mar 24, 2013)

Headspin said:


> Well there's a turn up for the books!!
> 
> I did'nt enter your thread for advice or anything else because I thought you were just another self centred self serving loathsome entitled selfish cheat.
> 
> ...



Headspin:

The more time that passes, the more objective I become. Where I was emotionally was different from how I projected myself to be when I wrote my first post. But, because everyone here is somewhat fictitious in my world I really wasn't looking for approval, or even trying to be gentle with my words. Yet what I do understand is that no matter where I look for help or however I ask for it it is a direct reflection of how I am approaching the subject, my life. I have never wanted anything more than I want my family together now. Yes am doing as much heavy lifting as I can take, and I'm building muscle as we go. I will allow nothing to get in the way of me showing my family love, doesn't matter if he stays or not. He will always have my support and my dedication.


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## believing in hope (Mar 24, 2013)

awake1 said:


> Is there a way you could point your husband toward this forum?
> 
> If he started a thread it could be helpful to him.


awake1

I think he found TAM even before I did, and certainly reads it often, however he's not inclined to do as I have and enter the forums. Maybe I can get him to sign up still. Im finding that the more reading I do the more I understand not just the magnitude of my actions but also myself. :smthumbup:


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## believing in hope (Mar 24, 2013)

nuclearnightmare said:


> OP - sounds like your husband has gone through a major bout of depression. true? (see bolded lines)


Yes, true. Something that we were both struggling with in our own ways, but that I caused great harm to when I betrayed him. Its as if he took mine on. I hate that. I still struggle with mine, but my focus is on our family and that brings us strength.


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## illwill (Feb 21, 2013)

Will_Kane said:


> PTSD counseling might help.
> 
> The reactions of the betrayed spouse resemble the post-traumatic stress symptoms of the victims of catastrophic events. Common reactions to the loss of innocence and shattered assumptions include obsessively pondering details of the affair; continuously watching for further signs of betrayal; and physiological hyperarousal, flashbacks and intrusive images. The most severely traumatized are those who had the greatest trust and were the most unsuspecting.


All of that to stay with a cheater. Divorce does lesson that pain. Because your wife did not cheat on you, your ex wife did.


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## Headspin (May 13, 2012)

believing in hope said:


> Headspin:
> 
> The more time that passes, the more objective I become. Where I was emotionally was different from how I projected myself to be when I wrote my first post. But, because everyone here is somewhat fictitious in my world I really wasn't looking for approval, or even trying to be gentle with my words. Yet what I do understand is that no matter where I look for help or however I ask for it it is a direct reflection of how I am approaching the subject, my life. I have never wanted anything more than I want my family together now. Yes am doing as much heavy lifting as I can take, and I'm building muscle as we go. I will allow nothing to get in the way of me showing my family love, doesn't matter if he stays or not. He will always have my support and my dedication.


Thanks for the reply

I think you're on the right path. Think you know there will be setbacks and this will take a long time but you look to be giving yourselves a better chance of making it than most fractured couples

Keep as focused as you are and your 'new' marriage can succeed


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

Your main enemy---is your H's sub--conscious--that is where the battle is

I am sure you hold him, and try to help him thru his pain---when he triggers----you know what has to be done, and are doing it-------------------BUT

I am not sure of your daily situation, as to what goes on in your families life each day---but from what I can gather, you seem to be the only one working---and you are doing most of whatever is being done around the house

That MUST change---your H, has to go to work, and he must be active in the day to day activities of living life, each day------
You must make him get up off his butt---and rejoin the world---you cannot enable him to continue to hide from life

His sub--conscious is the driving force behind what your H has become---you need to learn how to deal with that problem

Your problem, is he may never get over what has been done to him---having sex, is only a part of everyday life, so don't put so much emphasis, on the HB,------you have major problems, and you have to deal with them----and enabling him---is not helping-------get him up and out each and every day---and get him back into the world


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

hurtingbadly said:


> It has gotten worse for me. I'm two years in, really one year after second DDay. At first we went thru that hysterical bonding crap, that slowly went away and we continued sex, but it didn't feel the same anymore for me. That connection, specialness was just gone. Sometimes I cried afterwards. Recently, about a month ago a switch just turned off for me. Like totally, completely turned off. I have zero desire to have sex with him. It sucks, cause the sex drive is still kinda there, I just don't want to do it with him. He's been on the sofa for a month now. I had issues doing a certain thing I knew homewrecker did for him, I just couldn't bring myself to do it anymore. Now, I can't even imagine romantically kissing him. Just typing this I realize how bad it has become. I think I reached that point. He hurt me too much. The thing was I thought sex was pretty good between us. I never denied him. I just don't understand why he'd ruin that.


HurtingBadly,

I can't help but wonder if there is some other aspect of your relationship that is also failing and your sex life suffers because of it. Sounds like you are headed for D and cannot stop the train.


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## Headspin (May 13, 2012)

hurtingbadly said:


> It has gotten worse for me. I'm two years in, really one year after second DDay. At first we went thru that hysterical bonding crap, that slowly went away and we continued sex, but it didn't feel the same anymore for me. That connection, specialness was just gone. Sometimes I cried afterwards. Recently, about a month ago a switch just turned off for me. Like totally, completely turned off. I have zero desire to have sex with him. It sucks, cause the sex drive is still kinda there, I just don't want to do it with him. He's been on the sofa for a month now. I had issues doing a certain thing I knew homewrecker did for him, I just couldn't bring myself to do it anymore. Now, I can't even imagine romantically kissing him. Just typing this I realize how bad it has become. I think I reached that point. He hurt me too much. The thing was I thought sex was pretty good between us. I never denied him. I just don't understand why he'd ruin that.


I've re read this post of yours repeatedly hurting and if ever a few words might, just might, stop a potential cheat it's these words of yours 

Anybody thinking of cheating should read these words 

Once you've done your deed be it physical or emotional, you'll never, never - *EVER* be able to take it back - all you'll have is a memory of how good you wife husband was and you simply cut them up and dumped them 

Never to return

Somewhere on this site these words should be permanently seen


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

BIH, have you thought of offering him a free pass?

Was OM married? Did your hubby get to eff up his life? This helps some but not all.


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## awake1 (Jan 29, 2013)

believing in hope said:


> awake1
> 
> I think he found TAM even before I did, and certainly reads it often, however he's not inclined to do as I have and enter the forums. Maybe I can get him to sign up still. Im finding that the more reading I do the more I understand not just the magnitude of my actions but also myself. :smthumbup:



Tam usually helps a great deal. 

The pain of being cheated on, for many of us is simply unexplainable. I don't know how to describe in words that do the suffering justice. 

I guess like many other things, if you haven't experienced them yourself it's hard to relate. 

If he were here or had his own thread, we could maybe guide him on some possible steps to take so that he can begin to repair some of the damage to his self esteem and ego.

I do worry when you say you hold him when he cries. I'm not sure if it's a cultural issue, but the last person he should be seeking comfort from is you. It strikes me as unhealthy, though i'm no psychiatrist or councilor.


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## love=pain (Nov 26, 2012)

Thorburn said:


> I have had moments where I triggered big time during sex. We were at a hotel in May. I lost it. I promised myself that I would never do that again to my wife.
> 
> So what do I do? I suck it up. Since we started R there is not a time, (Not one) where we are having sex that I don't think of my wife with the XOM. I have never shared this with her. It suc*s. There are times I just want to leave. I did that in the motel and it was not pleasant for either of us, so I don't want to do that.
> 
> I just can't get this stuff out of my head. All I can do at this point is just try to enjoy the moment.


Just read this and I feel the same, there has not been a time since DDay when he hasn't been in the bedroom with us, it's not as frequent (start to finish) as it once was, heck a few times right after DDay I had some panic attacks during or when we were finished, almost ran out of the house half naked the first time just had to get away.
With all that I will say it is diminishing there are just moments during when something pops in the old head sometimes it is fine and I get through it other times not that is just how it goes.
They say time heals all wounds or at least you learn to live with the scars.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

I'll say it again, I think the sex act with the OM is a focus point because its the perfect symbol of the moment of total surrender to the OM and betrayal of the husband.

It's like the moment in classic vampire literature, not twilight crap, where when vampire bites the woman and she has effectively an intense orgasm as gives herself body and souk willingly from that moment to the vampire. It's the moment of truth between where she's been enthralled by the vampires mesmerizing and where she has become his. There is a split second where she is awake and aware and has a choice - and she chooses to embrace him.


So the act of sex choosing the OM over fidelity become the focus point as its the moment of ultimate betrayal where the line is crossed.


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

believing in hope said:


> My specific question is, do you have any tips that have worked for you? How have you battled triggers during sex? Wayward spouses, please share what you have tried. Betrayed spouses, what has helped you come back to the now? How have you found the way to being able to look each other in the eyes and feel the love that you are together for?
> 
> 
> 
> Please share. Thanks!


Hi

I think only time and consistent remorse and transparency will help him as well as counseling.

My case is a bit different in that my wife had refused sex for years.....10 years.

So our sexual bond was broken. I missed sex and feared eventually getting ED and never again being able to enjoy sex, but I loved my wife and did not want to divorce her. So, I stupidly cheated.

We are now in reconciliation a good strong one it seems. We both took a good hard look at our issues and both compromised. 

Cheating is the wrong way to address issues in the marriage, but sometimes, the faithful spouse does not listen to or hear voiced complaints. 

This is not always the case. Sometimes the faithful spouse has done absolutely nothing to derail the connection to the unfaithful spouse. 

If that is the case then it may be more difficult to overcome and infidelity for a faithful spouse. 

If the faithful spouse is doing something to cause the disconnect and changes that behavior then, IMO, the reconciliation can be real and strong. 

The other thing perhaps is to show the faithful spouse studies that indicate that people who are considering divorce, for any reason, who decide to stay and work on the marriage are more often than not, five years out, happier that those who chose to divorce and even remarry.

The other thing is that there are circumstances in a marriage that may make a person who would never cheat, vulnerable to cheating. 

The faithful spouse needs to be open to this. 

Just as someone who has never been cheated on can not understand the feeling, neither can a person who claims they would never cheat understand the reason someone may cheat, even though they themselves always proclaimed that they would NEVER cheat. 

Individual counseling may help the faithful spouse be willing to take a good honest look at their own faults, if faults in fact exist in them.

Because, if the faithful spouse does not see themselves clearly, it is very likely that their next spouse may also cheat on them. 

IMO, that is why time and time again, you see people on this board who have been cheated on repeatedly in ALL their relationships.


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

awake1 said:


> Tam usually helps a great deal.
> 
> The pain of being cheated on, for many of us is simply unexplainable. I don't know how to describe in words that do the suffering justice.


The faithful spouses need to acknowledge that the pain of being continually rejected, either sexually, physically or emotional, by a spouse no matter how self righteously faithful they are, is ALSO a feeling that goes beyond describing in mere words. 

After an affair, IMO, a psychological evaluation to rule out personality disorders in the cheater is a good idea. 

If you are dealing with a personality disordered individual they will likely cheat no matter how nice, faithful, helpful, loving, sexual the faithful spouse is. 

On the other hand, there are many faithful spouses who simply refuse to acknowledge their own faults. 

And, BTW, the faithful spouse needs to be evaluated to for personality disorders, too. 

Many cerebral narcissists are totally disinterested in any other person's physical or emotional needs.


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

Headspin said:


> No she doesn't *need* to apologise but actually *we are important. Very* To her actually
> 
> We are the ones who understand her and particularly her betrayed husbands plight and she realises to her credit that many of us would not go near this thread because of what she said and the way she said what she did in her opening post
> 
> ...


I agree. Definitely an awesome resource for her to be able to enter the mind of the betrayed and see what her husband is feeling right now.


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## awake1 (Jan 29, 2013)

remorseful strayer said:


> The faithful spouses need to acknowledge that the pain of being continually rejected, either sexually, physically or emotional, by a spouse no matter how self righteously faithful they are, is ALSO a feeling that goes beyond describing in mere words.


My FWW rejected me emotionally, physically, and sexually. It didn't compare at all. When she wasn't doing that, I was getting yelled at, almost daily. 

I was always deluded in thinking she would calm down one day, if only I tried harder to please her.

I can understand pain is relative though, and one persons experiences may not be as severe as another's, or affect them as much. 



remorseful strayer said:


> And, BTW, the faithful spouse needs to be evaluated to for personality disorders, too.
> 
> Many cerebral narcissists are totally disinterested in any other person's physical or emotional needs.


In the case of most of the BH stories, they do suffer from some things. Mostly a collection of personality traits unofficially called nice guy syndrome. 

No doubt many betrayed do suffer from different problems that draw them to people who often manipulate and use them. Co-dependency is probably the most common, though i'm no psychologist. Still, it doesn't take a weatherman to tell the sky is blue. 

Either way, cheating is an action done by the cheater and cannot be blamed on anyone else. 

Your points are good ones though in cases of R or not. Betrayed need to look in the mirror as they often have their own sets of problems to deal with.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

remorseful strayer said:


> The faithful spouses need to acknowledge that the pain of being continually rejected, either sexually, physically or emotional, by a spouse no matter how self righteously faithful they are, is ALSO a feeling that goes beyond describing in mere words.
> 
> After an affair, IMO, a psychological evaluation to rule out personality disorders in the cheater is a good idea.
> 
> ...


RS:
I have seen some very thought-provoking posts from you lately, including the ones in this thread. the problem is my commenting on them would swiftly take this thread and the others into the "hijacked" realm. maybe I can figure a way to start a separate thread on some of this.....

breifly here, I'll say that adultery is an act of humiliation. One single affair, in fact one single episode of adultery is an act that humiliates the BS. "Humiliate" is a strong word, but it is the right word to use....that's how serious an affront adultery is IMO. I think that most of ther other insults or offenses a spouse commits during a marriage are mere 'slights' in comparison.

I'm sure that one could find cases, perhaps yours is one of them, where the BS had exhibited _other_ behaviors that constituted so much serious abuse that their treatment of the WS was equally humiliating. Vague claims by the WS of "needs not being met", not being listened to, being taken for granted etc. do not qualify as serious abuse, IMO. But like I say, every case is different, and yours may be.


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## theroad (Feb 20, 2012)

WyshIknew said:


> BIH, have you thought of offering him a free pass?
> 
> Was OM married? Did your hubby get to eff up his life? This helps some but not all.


RA affairs do not solve problems. They just create new problems.

Even if the BH nails his OW ten times to every one time that the OM banged his WW. The BH will never be able to get his WW unbanged by the OM.


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

remorseful strayer said:


> Just as someone who has never been cheated on can not understand the feeling, neither can a person who claims they would never cheat understand the reason someone may cheat, even though they themselves always proclaimed that they would NEVER cheat.


Rubbish. All of us here are pretty damn well versed in the "reasons" cheaters cheat. Don't make it out to be all mystical and magical and sh*t. Selfishness and poor character are at the top of the list. Nice try though!


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## Healer (Jun 5, 2013)

remorseful strayer said:


> The faithful spouses need to acknowledge that the pain of being continually rejected, either sexually, physically or emotional, by a spouse no matter how self righteously faithful they are, is ALSO a feeling that goes beyond describing in mere words.
> 
> After an affair, IMO, a psychological evaluation to rule out personality disorders in the cheater is a good idea.
> 
> ...


Good grief!!! You "need" to stop sh*tting on and dictating to betrayed spouses on this forum!


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