# Sometimes just not in the mood...its NOT you



## Michie (Aug 26, 2012)

Dear Husbands/LT Boyfriends.


Sometimes if not most of the time, we aren't secretly angry, or making you suffer for something you did earlier or didn't do.

Sometimes we are not just feeling it. It not your lack of skills, or lack of love play. We are just not in the mood. Be it hormones, or go damn forgetting to shave our legs. Sometimes we are not in the mood. Sometimes we just need to feel sexy to have sex, its got nothing to do with you.

Maybe the baby puked on us today, maybe we noticed weird veins in our theighs, or new laugh lines or crows feet. Maybe we are suffering from horrible cramps and migraines. Maybe we threw our back at work, or pushing the kids to the park today.

Maybe our boss yelled at us and made us feel 2 feet tall, maybe someone called us stupid and useless. Maybe we fought with our mom/dad. Maybe the kids drove us up the wall. Maybe every single on of these things happened at least once today.

Maybe its hard to feel desired when all you heard today was crying and whining, and you spent every freaking iota of affection on the children.

Maybe there has been no moments of peace or quiet.

Maybe we just want you to let us cuddle at your chest and doze off in the secure feeling of warmth and happiness and gratefulness that you'll be there when our eyes open, that you smell like home and that what we need.

Maybe we need you, ALL of you, not just your ****, and we understand that we are loved. Maybe we are more then just a set of sexual skills you enjoy.

Maybe we are not in mood tonight, but we love you more then anyone or anything in this life.

I mean really, do you want us to pretend?


Love forever,

your Wives/LT Girlfriends


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## Mistys dad (Dec 2, 2011)

Yes, pretend.

It's that important.

So, yes, pretend.

Because your list of reasons not to show *"us"* love in the way *"we"* understand it (most of which have absolutely nothing to do with *"us*") is the exact same thing as *"us"* telling you that we don't love you.


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## Michie (Aug 26, 2012)

So you would us rather pretend, force it to become another obligation, and make us resent you.... interesting....and very sad.


Really to sum up your opinion you could have pointed me to your av.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Dear wives/LT girlfriends:

The first time you told us this, we believed you. We believed you the second time too. But after you withheld sex from us for a couple years we started to take it personally. So please stop with the excuses. If you're not into us, just tell us.

Signed,

The husbands/LT boyfriends.


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## Mistys dad (Dec 2, 2011)

Or you could continiously decline, build resentment, destroy the marriage and hurt the one you love.

Is it really an obligation? Showing love to your spouse? Really? For things that are beyond their control. Very sad.

"All in all, it's just another brick in the wall......."


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## Michie (Aug 26, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Dear wives/LT girlfriends:
> 
> The first time you told us this, we believed you. We believed you the second time too. But after you withheld sex from us for a couple years we started to take it personally. So please stop with the excuses. If you're not into us, just tell us.
> 
> ...


I did say "Sometimes". Sometimes, is not no sex for 2 yrs.


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## Michie (Aug 26, 2012)

Mistys dad said:


> Or you could continiously decline, build resentment, destroy the marriage and hurt the one you love.
> 
> Is it really an obligation? Showing love to your spouse? Really? For things that are beyond their control. Very sad.
> 
> "All in all, it's just another brick in the wall......."


As I wrote a moment ago, I did write "sometimes", I am not writing about the relationships that have absolutely no sex in them for months and yrs.


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## Mistys dad (Dec 2, 2011)

"Sometimes" is the seed that grows into the tree of "Never"


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Generally speaking, I know that I don't get irritated if it's a once in a while thing. But I (and I think most men) do get irritated when it becomes a chronic problem. And I think generally speaking if your man is complaining, or seems sensitive about it....it's become chronic. YOU may still think it's just "sometimes", but if he's complaining, he thinks it too often.


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## Michie (Aug 26, 2012)

My husband does not complain, since he not gone without sexual contact for more then week in the 12 years we have been together.

However, when we/I/him do slip, pulling the selfish, it must be me, why are treating me this way, is the most undesirable bit of behavior a man possesses. Its the absolute killer of sexual closeness. Treating your wives and girlfriends like giant vaginas that you need to fill to feel "loved" is BS. 

Again my point was the man then taking a situation as presented above and turning in on himself, maybe its not you, stop supposing it is and maybe invest the time your trying to get laid and use it to why your wife/gf doesn't want to.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Michie said:


> As I wrote a moment ago, I did write "sometimes", I am not writing about the relationships that have absolutely no sex in them for months and yrs.


We never went years without. I'd have divorced long ago if it was years. The problem is that it was sometimes over and over again, way too often.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Just waiting for SA to chime in.....


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## Mistys dad (Dec 2, 2011)

Ok, "We" used to mess around 4 times a week. =208 

Your boss yelled at you every two weeks- 26

The baby puked on you (one child) every 3 days. - 120

You weren't in the mood, 2 times a month. - 24

Threw your back out 2 times a year X 1 week. -8

Migraines, maybe once a month. -12

Fought with Mom- every time you speak to her.

Kids drove you crazy. Every day.

Other factors you don't consider.

Maybe we busted our ass at a ****ty job to help keep a roof over our heads and you forgot to say thanks once and a while.

Maybe the kids drove us crazy, too.

Maybe our boss jumped our ass, too.

Maybe Mom *****ed at us, too.

Maybe we threw our back out, too.

Maybe we have a migraine, too.

And we now have a spouse that doesn't have sex with us.

Ok, now ask yourself where affairs start.


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## pidge70 (Jan 17, 2011)

Some of the responses on here make me wish I was a damn eunuch.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## hookares (Dec 7, 2011)

maybe if you are going to deny your SO intimacy simply because "you aren't in the mood", you shouldn't feign concern if he or she goes elsewhere to find it.
Having been the betrayed spouse, I can say without a doubt that I NEVER denied my ex anything she requested. 
When it was all said and done it didn't matter one iota.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

pidge70 said:


> Some of the responses on here make me wish I was a damn eunuch.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:rofl:

You didn't want us to just agree did you:

:lol:


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## Cyclist (Aug 22, 2012)

G darlin. I thought that something we did that we both enjoy, brings us much closer, is great for us, releases all the best hormones, helps us sleep better, creates great memories, and makes us want each other more would be something you would want to do on a very regular basis.

How stupid of me to think rationally


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

Cyclist said:


> G darlin. I thought that something we did that we both enjoy, brings us much closer, is great for us, releases all the best hormones, helps us sleep better, creates great memories, and makes us want each other more would be something you would want to do on a very regular basis.
> 
> How stupid of me to think rationally


Why wouldn't you be "in the mood" for that.


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## Michie (Aug 26, 2012)

Mistys dad said:


> Ok, "We" used to mess around 4 times a week. =208
> 
> Your boss yelled at you every two weeks- 26
> 
> ...


***Fix*** Really what you mean is "I wanna blow my load so I can fall asleep and forget about my crap day."

Anyway I'm done, since the point has been completely missed.


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

Michie said:


> Dear Husbands/LT Boyfriends.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

Michie said:


> Dear Husbands/LT Boyfriends.
> 
> 
> Sometimes if not most of the time, we aren't secretly angry, or making you suffer for something you did earlier or didn't do.
> ...





Michie said:


> ***Fix*** Really what you mean is "I wanna blow my load so I can fall asleep and forget about my crap day."
> 
> Anyway I'm done, since the point has been completely missed.


Hold on, you've just blown your load now your leaving? Just when I was starting to learn something. Wham bam thank you mam.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Michie said:


> ***Fix*** Really what you mean is "I wanna blow my load so I can fall asleep and forget about my crap day."
> 
> Anyway I'm done, since the point has been completely missed.


If you think it is about blowing our load and going to sleep then sadly you have missed the point as well. Sometimes, sex is about more than just sex. Yes even for a man. Maybe especially for a man.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

Michie said:


> Dear Husbands/LT Boyfriends.
> 
> 
> Sometimes if not most of the time, we aren't secretly angry, or making you suffer for something you did earlier or didn't do.
> ...


Hmmm I think some of these can easily be reversed. In this letter/ I identify more with the husbands....and I'm a SAHM. Baby puked? Take a shower. Guaranteed the smell will wash off! 

Fine, you're not in the mood. But you know what/ Don't keep telling me "if my back felt better..." or "I would love to have sex tonight, but...." Please, husband, if you're not in the mood, just say so. Don't make friggen excuses that will make me feel WORSE than telling me you're not in the mood! And yes, I told him exactly that. Wouldn't you know, it cleared everything right up.


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## Mistys dad (Dec 2, 2011)

Michie said:


> ***Fix*** Really what you mean is "I wanna blow my load so I can fall asleep and forget about my crap day."
> 
> Anyway I'm done, since the point has been completely missed.


Well if you paid attention, I used no gender for my posts. 

So just " blowing my load" doesn't really apply.

Because it's just this simple.

If you have a bad day, but still manage to pretend you love *"us".*

I promise that when *"we"* have a bad day, *"we"* will still pretend to love you.

So when the baby pukes on you, let's go take a shower together.

When your boss gets on your ass, I'll tell you how cute that ass is.

When you throw out your back, I'll rub it down for you.

When the kids drive you crazy, I'll stick them with Mom (see it's a 2 for 1 there) so I can spend time with that hot sexy thing I walked down the aisle.

If your in a bad mood, I tell jokes.

If you hurt, I fix it.

If you need me, hey I'm there.

And all I ask in return is the same from you.

What part of your point did I miss?


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## Interlocutor (Dec 29, 2011)

Wait a second, if I'm not in the mood to do them, I shouldn't be doing the things my wife interprets as signs of love? Wow, this is going to totally free up my schedule!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Michie said:


> ***Fix*** Really what you mean is "I wanna blow my load so I can fall asleep and forget about my crap day."


Isn't that better than drinking or doing drugs? Sex and vigorous exercise are both very good ways to de-stress that are healthy for you.



Michie said:


> Anyway I'm done, since the point has been completely missed.


We understand you point dead on. There is a good chance you're going to look back in 10 years and feel like you were foolish. My wife does. I was hoping SA comes along because she eloquently explains why she feels the same way. I hope your marriage makes it until then without too much damage.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

WorkingOnMe said:


> If you think it is about blowing our load and going to sleep then sadly you have missed the point as well. Sometimes, sex is about more than just sex. Yes even for a man. Maybe especially for a man.


The fact that some wives feel this way was a very recent revaluation for me. 

Wives know that men can separate sex and love so easily and go have a meaningless bang with some chick they just met. Women can try too, but very few really can. So often it kills their self worth and they end up feeling used.. Men near universally can do this and feel all the better about themselves after.

Knowing that, they for some reason wives think that this applies to them when they have sex with their husband. They get this idea in their mind that he's only doing it to get off and it is nothing more. What they don't seem to get is that a husband simply doesn't. Unless things are really bad with loads of resentment built up, a husband isn't using his wife. It really is a combination of the drive for sex plus the desire to feel connected and loved that he is after.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

You've had a bad day and need to talk, or to be held, or pampered. You feel insecure and you need to feel loved. Husbands been looking forward to watching a ballgame all week. Which would you expect him to choose?


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

Michie said:


> So you would us rather pretend, force it to become another obligation, and make us resent you.... interesting....and very sad.
> 
> 
> Really to sum up your opinion you could have pointed me to your av.


Dear Wives and LT Girlfriends (or in my world, if you think like this :lol:, stbxw or stbxgf):

Why do you feel there must be something in it for you to please me? Why is it okay for you to not want to do something for me because there's nothing physical in it for you? You've had a hard day? Is a five minute bj where there's nothing in it for you so hard? Would the fact that maybe you made my day not make your day better? No? There must be something in it for you? Because you know what? I've done for you. I've had chitty azzed days where just the fact that I made you smile and look at me like you loved me more than oxygen made my day. I've gone down on you when there was nothing in it for me. Instead of you appreciating it for what it was, your mind goes instead to "oh my god, he just wants to get laid again". I've phucked you like there was no tomorrow, countless times, sweating and "working" my azz off because you're enjoying it, laying there. I enjoy it too, but what is that like? To be able to lay there and have someone work up a sweat and near themselves to exhaustion to please you while you lay back and enjoy a relaxing, intimate, orgasm experience? Wait, that's right....guys know what that is....it's called a BLOWJOB. Or COWGIRL. Yet, how often does THAT happen? One out of 10? One out of 20? Never?

An "obligation"? You "resent" us? Because you're not in "the mood"? Because we have desires, and because our desires or wants don't suit you at the moment, it's a resentment building obligation??? Really? Should we feel "obligated" and "resentful" when you want us to take you to a play? Go clothes shopping with you? Go down on you because "thats the only way you can get off"??? Take you to dinner in a fabulous restaurant when we'd be even happier hitting the local Carls Junior? Should we feel obligated and resentful? Because romance is important to you? Or should we instead embrace that, understand that, and do that for you because it makes you happy and satisfied?

I can tell you how often it happens in my relationship....WEEKLY. She gives to me when there's nothing in it for her as much as I give to her when there's nothing in it for me. I'm just an hour out of an amazing, earth shaking blowjob where she refused....REFUSED me to please her. And I tried. And she refused. Because she just wanted to feel the satisfaction of pleasing me. Because making me happy made her damn day. And it made my week. To have someone want to GIVE me something when they expected NOTHING in return. And you know what? Do you know what that means to me and her? When she has a bad day, or is not in the mood and just wants to cuddle...what do I do? I don't get all pissy, mopey, or whiney. What I do is this: I pour her a glass of wine. I massage her back. I cuddle with her. I scratch her back until she falls asleep. BECAUSE FOR HER, IT (a bad day, night, headache, etc.) IS NOT YET AGAIN ANOTHER EXCUSE TO AVOID SEX SIMPLY BECAUSE THERE'S NOTHING IN IT FOR HER AND SHE'S NOT "IN THE MOOD".

Signed,

The most satisfied husband of the most satisfied wife in the world....


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

unbelievable said:


> You've had a bad day and need to talk, or to be held, or pampered. You feel insecure and you need to feel loved. Husbands been looking forward to watching a ballgame all week. Which would you expect him to choose?


Well if he really loved her (and it wasn't continuous attention seeking) then he should hit record and go and listen to his wifes problems, hold her and pamper her.
Later, grab a beer and watch the game.

It just seems so obvious to me, one is just a damn game, the other is your life.:scratchhead:


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

I can make tons of excuses not to help my wife heal after hurting her deeply in the past. For me, it has to be a daily thing, and as such -> I can think of daily excuses not to make her feel loved because I was tired, had a sh-t day at work, rude customer, fked up project, whatever the excuse -> it's childish of me to ignore my wife's needs.

I can understand the whole HD/LD thing, even if my situation is a bit on the reverse (I'm lower drive than the missus). It took me a while to understand the concept of just giving without expecting to recieve (for me it's 3-6 hours of my day dedicated to her - it annoyed me for a long time her 'high maintenance'). But that's what love is all about.

If I didn't make this decision to change, my wife would probably have never recovered from all the hurts I inflicted on her despite how strong she is deep inside, I would have continued to hurt her by rejecting her time and time again for simple excuses and the refusal to love her as she deserves from her husband.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

I think the OP has come in for a bit of uncalled for stick here.

It seems to me that what she is saying is that on some occasions she is so washed out and stressed she doesn't feel like sex. Then hubby gets a little p!ssy about it.
It happens.
To me it's all good if a day or two later she humps his brains out.


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## mrcow (Jan 27, 2010)

I started to write a sort of answer, trying to imitate OP's style, but it didn't turn out that well, so, let me say this in a simple, lumberjack style.

men need sex to feel loved.
men don't just need their load blown; it's rarely if never is so in the marriage. perhaps the only way to show us that you really love us is to have sex with us. f**k the perfect dinner that took N hours to make it. f**k the perfectly cleaned house with everything arranged by size and color and not a trace of dust anywhere. we'll be perfectly happy with a simple dinner, hey, enjoy watching us preparing it! 
who f'in cares about unshaven legs? these are the hottest legs in this world, and I'm not talking feverish hot, the Other hot!! we can touch'em, massage'em, caress, kiss and own them in various ways 
we are animals*. and you are, too, it's that you're taught to hide it better.

and just a note regarding to cuddle: it's fine to cuddle. OTOH, how would you feel if your H/LTBF would "sometimes" push you away and say - you know, I'm not in the mood to cuddle, I just don't love you tonight. because that's exactly what we hear when you're "not in the mood", regardless of how much you try to prove otherwise. and I may generalize here too much, but regardless of the manliness level, you know, sometimes it may HURT.
I'm not saying you're supposed to walk on tiptoes around your man responding to his every whim (although I have nothing against it, if giving some thought ), but some general understanding of the opposite camps' point of view is essential. and that applies to BOTH genders.

not sure how lumberjack'y it turned out, but it doesn't matter.

MC

* actually, I'm thinking - if men would unleash their animal more often, there's a high probability that this "sometimes" would turn to "seldom" or "once in a blue moon". /Athol for the President! /

edit:




WyshIknew said:


> I think the OP has come in for a bit of uncalled for stick here.
> 
> It seems to me that what she is saying is that on some occasions she is so washed out and stressed she doesn't feel like sex. Then hubby gets a little p!ssy about it.
> It happens.
> To me it's all good if a day or two later she humps his brains out.


if this is the case - that's good. everybody has a bad day once in a while. the reason I was so wound up - for me that "sometimes" got closer to "everytime", but yeah, I start to see where I took that series of wrong turns; I'm sure, it will work out allright.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

WyshIknew said:


> I think the OP has come in for a bit of uncalled for stick here.
> 
> It seems to me that what she is saying is that on some occasions she is so washed out and stressed she doesn't feel like sex. Then hubby gets a little p!ssy about it.
> It happens.
> To me it's all good if a day or two later she humps his brains out.


Absolutely... anyway, it's really down to the frequency of not wanting sex. I get the OP. As long as it doesn't become a habit, there's nothing wrong with having a few off days...


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Dear Husbands,

The baby is more important than you.

What my boss thinks is more important than what you think.

The ugliness of my veins is more important than the beauty of our love.

My job is more important to me than our marriage.

Love,
Wives who are not in the mood.


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## mrcow (Jan 27, 2010)

mark with X:

[ ] Amen
[ ] and not a single f*** was given that day


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Hicks said:


> Dear Husbands,
> 
> The baby is more important than you.
> 
> ...


Dear Husbands,

Thank you for treating me as your personal sex slave.
I am sorry, I forgot that you have the right to bang away at my ***** whenever you feel like it.

Thank you, because on top of all the other things going on I have now got an adult baby sulking around the house which is making me feel even more sh!tty.

It is sad that you do not seem to realise that a little love, affection and understanding today may pay dividends tomorrow when I may want to have wild sex with you.

I do value our marriage but it is difficult to feel passion for a spoilt whiny baby.

Signed
Wives who are not in the mood.


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## Interlocutor (Dec 29, 2011)

Dear wives,

I am not a compliment machine, a Grey's Anatomy watching partner slave, nor a problem-listening servant. I am not a manufacturing plant of romance or an escort ready to dress nicely and accompany you places at the drop of a hat. I am not a free hugs exhibit or a gift-purchaser. Seeing me as any of these things make me feel used and I will begin to resent you. My life has other purposes than to be condemned to show you love even when I'm not in the mood, like a robot with no free will. Sometimes, I'm just not going to give a **** about your day or your new dress, and I should never be forced to or I will begin to resent you.

Sincerely,
Husbands not in the mood.



This a fun game.

Ideally, all the wives who are rarely in the mood for sex and all the husbands who aren't in the mood for romance and emotional sharing should all accept the perfect solution. GTFO of marriage. It ain't for you...

PLENTY of single women out there that would fvck GLADLY and don't have mood problems or feel used. I married one... And I don't feel used when I provide her emotional needs, even when I'm not in the mood! Imagine that! How odd!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Michie, I understand totally where you're coming from

The times I have refused, a response of sulking just turns me off more. There is nothing masculine, alpha or sexy about a man pouting because he didn't get to stick his d*ck into a vag at the second he wanted to. There is always tomorrow, really. Your d*ck and my v will still be here tomorrow, so sometimesIit can wait.

Being married does not mean a man gets an unlimited of supply of p*ssy on command. It means he takes his wifes feelings into consideration and sometimes she doesn't want to give it up, and that should be ok.

Sometimes my hubby is not in the mood for snuggles and cuddling, sometimes he doesn't want to hear me moan and groan about my day, or be my mr.pep talk. And you know what, that's ok. He's human, not a robot that has to deliver me the goods on command.

And so when I'm tired, sad, grumpy, distressed. I just want my husband to be there for me, not be there "in" me. And my husbad does that, so I am very blessed...

I don't know how some wives put it with these pre-teen husbands who think their wives feelings are never more important than their desire to stick their d*ck somewhere. And then there's the sulking and anger, yuck!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## momtwo4 (May 23, 2012)

Wow. What a myriad of attacks against the OP. I get what she was saying. I don't think she was referring to women who habitually deny their partners. BOTH sides made some good points.


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## Feelingdown (Aug 13, 2012)

I have to say, I wouldn't really want to have sex with the wife if she didn't want to and I don't think any guy would complain if once in a while he got turned down for a valid reason (you can usually tell).

BUT, if you see your husband is really up for it then you should want to do it for him if not for yourself. Isn't that how marriage works?

For the record, I turned the wife down once because I was annoyed with her at the time despite her best efforts. I still felt sick about it afterward thinking how it would have made her felt, it's not something I ever plan on doing again.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

WyshIknew said:


> Dear Husbands,
> 
> Thank you for treating me as your personal sex slave.
> I am sorry, I forgot that you have the right to bang away at my ***** whenever you feel like it.
> ...


Dear Wives,

Thank you for treating us as your personal slave and ATM. I apologize that I forgot you have the right to have all (within reason) of your wishes and desires filled. Marry? Sure. Buy you a house? Sure. Give you babies? Sure. Buy you 60 pairs of shoes while I have maybe 6? Sure. Tolerate you as your hormones run wild during pregenancies and once a month? Sure.

Thank YOU because on top of worrying where the next mortage or car payment is coming from or if I'll ever be able to retire because you want to re-do the living room AGAIN, I know have to deal with someone else harping on me about what I have'nt done around the house lately and why Maria down the street has a better husband and life!

It's sad that you don't realise that after all we've done trying to be a good husband, father and provider and being there to massage your back, soothe your shattered nerves it's still not enough for you and you're not "in the mood"

He11, guess what? After working an average 78 hour week, I'm not in the mood to do the dishes tonight, I'm not in the mood to pick-up little Billy from his friend's house, I'm not in the mood to go back to that sh!tty job again tomorrow and have them suck my soul dry yet again. However, I do it with a smile on my face because it's for YOU! I know I'm not getting any attention tonight from you (why should it be any different than any other night?)

That hot sex dividend that could be there tomorrow rarely (if EVER) comes through. It's as if I invested in JUNK bonds. There was the POTENTIAL of huge returns but in the end, all it did was drain my account!

I too have passion, a passion that has been extinguished so many times that it just hurts now to think about it. 

Don't get me wrong. I understand sometimes you don't want to do it but when I start doing the math (OK, this week is out due to "that time of the month", tonight is out because "fill in excuse here", etc, there aren't a whole lot of days left!

Everyone has a reason not to. Doesn't seem like to many women have a reason to! How about this: We love you. We desire you. We need you. Reason enough?

Yeah, it also feels good to us but we aren't teens anymore looking to nail anything that stands still long enough. We made a commitment to be with you and only you because that's what we want (and we thought you wanted it too). Help us a little more to honor that commitment


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

Feelingdown said:


> I have to say, I wouldn't really want to have sex with the wife if she didn't want to and I don't think any guy would complain if once in a while he got turned down for a valid reason (you can usually tell).
> 
> BUT, if you see your husband is really up for it then you should want to do it for him if not for yourself. Isn't that how marriage works?
> 
> For the record, I turned the wife down once because I was annoyed with her at the time despite her best efforts. I still felt sick about it afterward thinking how it would have made her felt, it's not something I ever plan on doing again.


I agree with most of this. I don't mind being told no but then there should be some type of agreement or discussion "Honey, my back is really hurting today. Can I get a raincheck until Monday? It should be better by then" "Sure baby. Do you want me to massage that part of your back or grab you some tylenol?"


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## Cyclist (Aug 22, 2012)

This is amazing.

Im sorry baby...but the time that I shut that door to the bedroom at night is OUR time. So prepare yourself. Clean up, spend that whole 7 minutes it takes for you to shave, and put something acceptable on. How long did that take?? 12 minutes out of your 16 waking hours.

If you want to cuddle and watch a move, that fine.
If you want to read a book together, thats fine also
If you want to just kiss and cuddle and play around, thats fine too

BUT WHATS not fine is that we dont have sexual contact at least 3 times a week. END OF STORY. Its unacceptable to me to go 48 plus hours without being that close to you, without enjoying ourselves with some sexual context. 

How long does that take?? 30 minutes?? 

SO, after we work 50 plus hours a week and do all the other stuff around the house that you wanted and clean the Fing garage on Saturday instead of playing golf....we ask for 30 minutes of your time. NOT to pull your teeth, not to yell at you, not to make you feel miserable....

TO MAKE YOU CUM...to enjoy this time with you and make us feel good together.

You have 112 waking hours in the week. We ask for SIX. SIX hours a week. FIVE PERCENT of your time to devote to your husband. IS IT REALLY THAT BAD?????


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

How did you "give" her babies, that confuses me. Are you referring only to the moment you ejaculatd inside of her? Because she did 100% of the baby growing and birthing herself, and could've done so without your sperm...

I don't understand where some husbands are getting this idea that their wives sould feel soooo lucky that he was willing to ejaculate inside of her. Most men would be willing to ejaculate inside of most women lol. If she got a baby, is was because she walling to endure pregnancy and the toll it takes on her body and endure labor and the toll that takes. Why any man would take credit for "giving" a woman a baby is baffling to me.

Maybe it's because I don't have kids... but I would be stunned if I got pregnant, gave birth and the first words out of my husbands mouth were "you're welcome" instead of "thank you". 



Toffer said:


> Dear Wives,
> 
> Thank you for treating us as your personal slave and ATM. I apologize that I forgot you have the right to have all (within reason) of your wishes and desires filled. Marry? Sure. Buy you a house? Sure. Give you babies? Sure. Buy you 60 pairs of shoes while I have maybe 6? Sure. Tolerate you as your hormones run wild during pregenancies and once a month? Sure.
> 
> ...


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cyclist (Aug 22, 2012)

And let me add one thing...

WHY dont you try it?? Try it and see what happens. Have sex with your husband 3 times a week and THEN ONCE a week have some CRAZY sex. Maybe 4 hours a week of your time......and see what happens.

You want closeness?? Affection?? Communication?? The freaking yard work done?? Him to want to run home to be with you??? A NEW FREAKING WARDROBE??????

Let alone you will sleep better, feel better, have great memories, and probably drop a couple of LBs in the process

Try it ladies and let us know how it works out for you.

OK thats my rant for the day....back to my 50 hour workweek so I can go home to my SO so she can be to tired for my 30 minutes....


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Michie said:


> Dear Husbands/LT Boyfriends.
> 
> 
> Sometimes if not most of the time, we aren't secretly angry, or making you suffer for something you did earlier or didn't do.
> ...


Dear Wife,

That's nice.

I've got a letter of my own. I couldn't quite find the proper words to say to you after reading yours, so I had a lawyer write up one on my behalf. I think he found just the right language to express exactly how you make me feel. I should be able to give it to you in about 6-8 weeks, so please be patient with me. 

I know that you're likely very exhausted from pouring every last shred of your attention into the children, your parents, your boss, your crowsfeet, your hairy legs, and that spot of baby puke on the front of your shirt, but please take the time to read my letter whenever you're in "the mood". 


Love forever(?),

Your Husband


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

mmm... lots of resentful men in this thread... and I thought _I_ was bitter...


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## strugglinghusband (Nov 9, 2011)

In Absentia said:


> mmm... lots of resentful men in this thread... and I thought _I_ was bitter...



Not resentful, more like hurt, beyond any words can describe....


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## Cyclist (Aug 22, 2012)

If this probelm could be solved the divorce rate in this country would go down to 25 pct.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

strugglinghusband said:


> Not resentful, more like hurt, beyond any words can describe....


Hurt beyond words because your wife didn't drop her panties for you after she'd spent the whole day feeling like crap? Interesting...

I do wonder if she feel equally hurt beyond words when you show her over and over again that her bad day, personal feelings, bodily pain or discomfort are simply not as important as your desire to get laid.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

aribabe said:


> Michie, I understand totally where you're coming from
> 
> The times I have refused, a response of sulking just turns me off more. There is nothing masculine, alpha or sexy about a man pouting because he didn't get to stick his d*ck into a vag at the second he wanted to. There is always tomorrow, really. Your d*ck and my v will still be here tomorrow, so sometimesIit can wait.
> 
> ...


Everyone has a right to turn down sex from their partner. They do not have the right to expect their partner to not have a negative reaction. 

And to state that me being irrated with my wife when she turned me down for the second night in a row when we had not had sex in 5 nights merely because I was pouting over not getting to put my c*** in her P**** is offensive.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Cyclist said:


> If this probelm could be solved the divorce rate in this country would go down to 25 pct.


Actually 65% of divorces are filed by women so it doesn't appear that men are actually filing in response to chronic sexual regection.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

aribabe said:


> Hurt beyond words because your wife didn't drop her panties for you after she'd spent the whole day feeling like crap? Interesting...
> 
> I do wonder if she feel equally hurt beyond words when you show her over and over again that her bad day, personal feelings, bodily pain or discomfort are simply not as important as your desire to get laid.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


How about a WOMAN hurt beyond words because her husband is on medications that are affecting his sex drive to the point that he hardly wants it AT ALL? How about a woman who is hurt beyond words because no matter what has been said and done, her husband's doctor simply says "it's just the depression"? Really? Just the depression? Gee, that's wonderful. And yet, he has been battling this for FOUR f*cking years and NOW he can't do what we want? Are you f*cking KIDDING ME?

Trust me, the hurt/resentment/whatever isn't confined to just one gender. Oh, and when he WAS able to work? I was, and always have been, a SAHM. I am on disability, and am in pain A LOT. I still managed to WANT to have sex with my husband. I still managed to actually HAVE sex with my husband. Give me a break!


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

I just do don't understand. I must be missing something here.
I just dont see the problem with the wife sometimes saying no. 

I'm not talking about weeks on end, months with the odd pity shag thrown as a bone to keep the dog quiet. It's once in a while.

Perhaps I'm just lucky, most of the time one or the other initiates and we are both into it.
Other times the wife will ask if I'm horny and would I like to empty them out to stop them popping (her words). Those times she sometimes catches up and gets horny too, other times she is quite happy just to let me finish.

Other times she will say "sorry do you mind if we don't?". And guess what? Thats cool too.

The thing is, women are strange chaps, I've had bronchitis and still been horny.
Women are wired different.

I have found that sulking does me very little good and in fact belittles me in her and my eyes.
I've even been able to turn the "do you mind if we don't" around by cuddling her, listening and responding.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> Everyone has a right to turn down sex from their partner. They do not have the right to expect their partner to not have a negative reaction.
> 
> And to state that me being irrated with my wife when she turned me down for the second night in a row when we had not had sex in 5 nights merely because I was pouting over not getting to put my c*** in her P**** is offensive.


They certainly do have the right to expect their spouse not to have a negative reaction.

When my husband turns down cuddles or kisses sometimes, he has every right to expect for me not to start acting like a whining b*tch about it. And if I did start acting like that, i'd just get less kisses and cuddles. No man wants to snuggle up to a whining b*tch anymore than a woman wants to sleep with an pouting man-child.

Sorry you're offended, but it's the reality. Your wife is not your p*ssy giving robot. She's not. Anymore than you are her affection/attention giving robot. So if you are having an awful 5 days at work, boss being an ass, coworkers acting like kids, I would hope your wife would not expect you to still spend hours listen to her complain about this and that. I would hope she would give you space, be UNDERSTANDING that outiside influences can and do impact your desire to listen to her. And you should be equally UNDERSTANDING that outside influences may be impacting her libido.

Maybe instead of being irritated with her for not putting out, you can help her figure out what's causng her distress/discomfort. That's masculine, and it's sexy. Pouting is not.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

aribabe said:


> Hurt beyond words because your wife didn't drop her panties for you after she'd spent the whole day feeling like crap? Interesting...
> 
> I do wonder if she feel equally hurt beyond words when you show her over and over again that her bad day, personal feelings, bodily pain or discomfort are simply not as important as your desire to get laid.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


No, hurt because there was a different reason for every day of the month not to drop her panties. Hurt because there was always a reason not to have sex, but never a reason to have it.

I am lucky because my wife and I are in a great place but I remember this pain all to well. Remember how after a great time being together as a family, doing stuff that she wanted, the excuses would start the minute we walked into the door - too tired, a headache, the meal did not agree with her. You name it, it was there. I would get home and want to spend time with her in the evening and she would be too tired. But if I had to bring work home and stay up late, she suddenly was able to make it to midnight to watch her shows. Heck, I can recall her claiming to be tired, so after cuddling, I told her to head to bed while I would stay up to do some work. I came to bed after midnight to find her up reading.

Like I said, things are good now, so when she says not tonight, I believe her. Much of that is her following through on her rainchecks and showing with her actions that it was her and not how she felt about me. But when things were bad, these types of excuses would have set me off just like some of these posters. It is too bad that the OPs original point got lost, but when I was in this situation, I doubt I could have heard that message either.

As a final note, sex with my wife is both physical and emotional to me. It is not just about getting off (if it was, I could masterbate), it is about being loved and loving my wife. To equate wanting that with my wife to merely a desire to get laid is just plain wrong.


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

*So you would us rather pretend, force it to become another obligation, and make us resent you.... interesting....and very sad.*

True. Very sad.

*Or you could continiously decline, build resentment, destroy the marriage and hurt the one you love.
Is it really an obligation? Showing love to your spouse? Really? For things that are beyond their control. Very sad.*

Also true, and very sad.

I've lived this for 5+ years. My W has zero drive, or should I say that she has zero drive to do anything with me. I told her that I simply will not live in a s*xless marriage. She knows that I am willing to walk, and that I can replace her. That may sound cold, but it is what it is. 

End result...I get duty s**, usually twice/week. It sucks for both of us, and a massive pile of resentment builds for both of us. I would have walked years ago if we didn't have kids at home.


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Maricha75 said:


> How about a WOMAN hurt beyond words because her husband is on medications that are affecting his sex drive to the point that he hardly wants it AT ALL? How about a woman who is hurt beyond words because no matter what has been said and done, her husband's doctor simply says "it's just the depression"? Really? Just the depression? Gee, that's wonderful. And yet, he has been battling this for FOUR f*cking years and NOW he can't do what we want? Are you f*cking KIDDING ME?
> 
> Trust me, the hurt/resentment/whatever isn't confined to just one gender. Oh, and when he WAS able to work? I was, and always have been, a SAHM. I am on disability, and am in pain A LOT. I still managed to WANT to have sex with my husband. I still managed to actually HAVE sex with my husband. Give me a break!


Sorry to read all that Maricha. Sometimes you see people posting and you get this idea that they've got it all together and then you see this.

Are the meds permanent? I've even read of some anti depressants that can help a low sex drive.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

aribabe said:


> They certainly do have the right to expect their spouse not to have a negative reaction.
> 
> When my husband turns down cuddles or kisses sometimes, he has every right to expect for me not to start acting like a whining b*tch about it. And if I did start acting like that, i'd just get less kisses and cuddles. No man wants to snuggle up to a whining b*tch anymore than a woman wants to sleep with an pouting man-child.


So you have *no* negative reaction when he turns you down? You just say so okay with just a happy smile. Of course you have a negative reaction. You can be expected to be mature about it, and expect that from your husband, but you have no right to expect him to not be disappointed.



> Sorry you're offended, but it's the reality. Your wife is not your p*ssy giving robot. She's not. Anymore than you are her affection/attention giving robot. So if you are having an awful 5 days at work, boss being an ass, coworkers acting like kids, I would hope your wife would not expect you to still spend hours listen to her complain about this and that. I would hope she would give you space, be UNDERSTANDING that outiside influences can and do impact your desire to listen to her. And you should be equally UNDERSTANDING that outside influences may be impacting her libido.
> 
> Maybe instead of being irritated with her for not putting out, you can help her figure out what's causng her distress/discomfort. That's masculine, and it's sexy. Pouting is not.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


No, she is not a robot. She is my wife, lover and friend. I expect her to want to be that for me, just as I want to be that for her. The problem is that list of outside influences happen every day. Based on that, I could reasonably decide never to listen to her, because there is always something going on. So I could chose to do that, or I can chose to step up and meet my wife's needs except under the most difficult circumstances. I don't think that is unreasonable, and I don't think it is unreasonable to expect that same from her.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

aribabe said:


> How did you "give" her babies, that confuses me. Are you referring only to the moment you ejaculatd inside of her? Because she did 100% of the baby growing and birthing herself, and could've done so without your sperm...
> 
> I don't understand where some husbands are getting this idea that their wives sould feel soooo lucky that he was willing to ejaculate inside of her. Most men would be willing to ejaculate inside of most women lol. If she got a baby, is was because she walling to endure pregnancy and the toll it takes on her body and endure labor and the toll that takes. Why any man would take credit for "giving" a woman a baby is baffling to me.
> 
> ...


I refer to the fact that I would have been fine if we didn't have kids at all. I changed my view because it was something she wanted and desired. Actually, when I was single, I was actually dead set against it.

Yes, while she endured all the rigors of pregnancy, I assumed all the financial obligations raising children. Don't get me wrong, I do love my kids but I know (as any parent does) that our lives would have been easier without. 

I'm not saying that if given the chance now I would trade them in (so to speak) but I knew back then that having kids would be a HUGE responsibility and have adverese affects on finances, sex life, etc. Yet I did it anyway beacuse it was something my wife wanted, needed in her life and I loved her so much I was willing to put aside my own self-centered needs to make her feel happy and fulfilled. 

Not sure where you are coming from with your somewhat short sided view of my last post. That was simply one aspect of many


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

WyshIknew said:


> Sorry to read all that Maricha. Sometimes you see people posting and you get this idea that they've got it all together and then you see this.
> 
> Are the meds permanent? I've even read of some anti depressants that can help a low sex drive.


Yes, they're permanent. Unless there is a miracle cure for bipolar disorder + ADD + anxiety & agoraphobia.... he has no choice but to take the meds to even function around people, even his wife and kids. Trying to get him in to see his primary doctor, not just the psychiatrist, to see if MAYBE there is a massive decrease in his testosterone. Unfortunately, we have to work our appointments around my parents' appointments...

Anyway, we still manage to have sex once a week, but it still hurts when wanting more but he just can't do it. He has been on different combinations of antidepressants for four years. His body adapts to them and they stop working. The sad thing? One medication that USUALLY increases drive, Adderall... I was reading sexual side effects of it and most had an increase. There were a few who had a decrease, to the point of either never wanting or rarely wanting. Well, my husband, sadly, fell into that category and, the med did nothing for his ADD. Ritalin helps him though. Unfortunately, the effects of the Adderall have been lasting... not sure if it is the drug itself or if it triggered something else. I really don't know. But I'm pissed off that the psychiatrist didn't really acknowledge much, ya know?


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

Cyclist said:


> If this probelm could be solved the divorce rate in this country would go down to 25 pct.


:iagree:


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## Cherry (Sep 23, 2009)

larry.gray said:


> The fact that some wives feel this way was a very recent revaluation for me.
> 
> Wives know that men can separate sex and love so easily and go have a meaningless bang with some chick they just met. Women can try too, but very few really can. So often it kills their self worth and they end up feeling used.. Men near universally can do this and feel all the better about themselves after.
> 
> Knowing that, they for some reason wives think that this applies to them when they have sex with their husband. They get this idea in their mind that he's only doing it to get off and it is nothing more. What they don't seem to get is that a husband simply doesn't. Unless things are really bad with loads of resentment built up, a husband isn't using his wife. It really is a combination of the drive for sex plus the desire to feel connected and loved that he is after.


I think this is a struggle for some wives to deal with especially if they don't have a healthy view of sex and/or have been used and/or there has been some form of infidelity in their marriage and/or they have had more casual sexual partners in the past.. It's taken a while for me to separate this with my H, and I've just recently started to recognize and really feel his love through our intimate moments. 

I'm getting better about recognizing when I'm about to turn him down and I really don't have a valid excuse to not do it... When he's worked OT at work, or he mowed the lawn, or took the kids for an hour to give me some alone time or he did a number of things he usually does for me or our family, what's a little fun to show him I appreciate what he does for me/us, not to mention I know I will really enjoy it once we get going 

Oh and when my boss would be all over my a$$ at work, I would ultimately find comfort in my H.. it wasn't always that way though as my H wasn't always the most comforting man to me


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

aribabe said:


> Hurt beyond words because your wife didn't drop her panties for you after she'd spent the whole day feeling like crap? Interesting...
> 
> I do wonder if she feel equally hurt beyond words when you show her over and over again that her bad day, personal feelings, bodily pain or discomfort are simply not as important as your desire to get laid.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Ari,

How often do you and your husband have sex a week?

Let's skip all the he understands when I don't want to stuff. What's the average?


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Maricha75 said:


> How about a WOMAN hurt beyond words because her husband is on medications that are affecting his sex drive to the point that he hardly wants it AT ALL? How about a woman who is hurt beyond words because no matter what has been said and done, her husband's doctor simply says "it's just the depression"? Really? Just the depression? Gee, that's wonderful. And yet, he has been battling this for FOUR f*cking years and NOW he can't do what we want? Are you f*cking KIDDING ME?
> 
> Trust me, the hurt/resentment/whatever isn't confined to just one gender. Oh, and when he WAS able to work? I was, and always have been, a SAHM. I am on disability, and am in pain A LOT. I still managed to WANT to have sex with my husband. I still managed to actually HAVE sex with my husband. Give me a break!


I almost don't know how to respond to this except to describe my experience...

My husband was in a bad car accident, I didn't get any for 2 whole months and I am young and VERY high drive. But I didn't get mad at him once for not being able to give it to me. That would've been wrong.

I'm sure your husband is doing the best he can, being on a medicaion tha kills your libido is probably as difficult for a man as it is for the woman affected. Maybe you guys could try toys sometims. You'd probably hae to initiate since he doesn't have that natural push at the moment.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

aribabe said:


> How did you "give" her babies, that confuses me. Are you referring only to the moment you ejaculatd inside of her? Because she did 100% of the baby growing and birthing herself, and could've done so without your sperm...
> 
> I don't understand where some husbands are getting this idea that their wives sould feel soooo lucky that he was willing to ejaculate inside of her. Most men would be willing to ejaculate inside of most women lol. If she got a baby, is was because she walling to endure pregnancy and the toll it takes on her body and endure labor and the toll that takes. Why any man would take credit for "giving" a woman a baby is baffling to me.
> 
> ...


Last I knew, it took both sperm and egg to make a baby. Has that changed? I will agree to one point... the HUSBAND isn't always necessary to make the baby TOGETHER. She could go to a sperm bank, absolutely. But how much will that cost? Sperm is still needed, whether some women wish to admit it or not!

There are women who use the term "give me a baby"... THEY want the husbands to give them children. So how is it ok for the women to say it but not the men? My husband GAVE me our children. I WANTED to endure the pregnancies...all 4 pregnancies, all three children. 

Why is it that everything these men are saying here is automatically wrong? THAT is baffling TO ME!

Oh, and my husband didn't say "thank you" or "you're welcome" to me when OUR children were born. He said "he's beautiful!", "she's gorgeous, just like her mama!"... and "he's perfect!". It has nothing, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with who gave the child to whom. We were WILLING EQUAL participants...And, I know that WITHOUT HIM, we wouldn't have these children. As a matter of fact, without a SPECIFIC male/female combination, the children we ALL have would not be here. Just food for thought. So, yes, without our husbands, we would NOT have the children we have now.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

aribabe said:


> I almost don't know how to respond to this except to describe my experience...
> 
> My husband was in a bad car accident, I didn't get any for 2 whole months and I am young and VERY high drive. But I didn't get mad at him once for not being able to give it to me. That would've been wrong.
> 
> ...


He IS doing the best he can. I initiate sometimes, or try to. But it rarely works. We are at once a week, no more than that. The thing is, he can get an erection but not cum. And, that pisses him off. To the point that he shies away from it quite often. 

Toys are not an option. I am still trying to get him to allow bullets. He is very resistant. But, anything bigger? Out of the question. And I WILL NOT push that issue.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

aribabe said:


> I almost don't know how to respond to this except to describe my experience...
> 
> My husband was in a bad car accident, I didn't get any for 2 whole months and I am young and VERY high drive. But I didn't get mad at him once for not being able to give it to me. That would've been wrong.
> 
> ...


Wow! 2 whole months!

Sorry but you're going to get a lot of crap for this post! As you've seen here, some (both men and women) have gone alot longer. My personal best? 8 months


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Cherry said:


> not to mention I know I will really enjoy it once we get going


That's the one element that REALLY tweaks me. She does enjoy it when she gets going, so why not?

Thankfully that's in our past now.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

aribabe said:


> I almost don't know how to respond to this except to describe my experience...
> 
> My husband was in a bad car accident, I didn't get any for 2 whole months and I am young and VERY high drive. But I didn't get mad at him once for not being able to give it to me. That would've been wrong.


He had a reason. If many of these men wives' had an actual physical reason, they would be understanding. The men complaining are ones where the wife just doesn't want to because she's come up with all sorts of reasons in her mind that she shouldn't.

The crappiest of all is the one I listed. "I think he's just using me, so I'm going to deny the both of us pleasure."


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> So you have *no* negative reaction when he turns you down? You just say so okay with just a happy smile. Of course you have a negative reaction. You can be expected to be mature about it, and expect that from your husband, but you have no right to expect him to not be disappointed.
> 
> 
> 
> No, she is not a robot. She is my wife, lover and friend. I expect her to want to be that for me, just as I want to be that for her. The problem is that list of outside influences happen every day. Based on that, I could reasonably decide never to listen to her, because there is always something going on. So I could chose to do that, or I can chose to step up and meet my wife's needs except under the most difficult circumstances. I don't think that is unreasonable, and I don't think it is unreasonable to expect that same from her.


Um yeah, that's exactly what I do. If he says he isn't up for cuddling I kiss him on the cheek, say ok and go about my day. My whole world doesn't fall apart if my husband isn't in the mood for snuggling. I see him all the time so I assume we'll just cuddle later. Pouting everytime my husband didn't feel like talking, cuddling, playing around etc would be emotional manipulation and that's not right.

And I don't expect for him to decline under only the most difficult circumstances either. The house doesn't need to be on fire, world ending for him to say no. Sometimes he's not in the mood "just cuz'" and that's a-ok with me.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

P*ssy giving robot.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

I for one am not bitter or angry.
I recongize my wife has to be in the mood. I recognize that life sometimes gets in the way of her feeling sexual. All husbands recognize this.

But, how many wives who use "excuses" recognize that prioritizing their own sexuality within their life (over work, kids, house), will lead them to happiness?


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Mistys dad said:


> Or you could continiously decline, build resentment, destroy the marriage and hurt the one you love.
> 
> Is it really an obligation? Showing love to your spouse? Really? For things that are beyond their control. Very sad.
> 
> "All in all, it's just another brick in the wall......."


This was precisely what I thought when I read the OP. Life is life, and it will always be there. Tired is tired, and we will always be tired. Should the stars really have to align before a husband wife can have sex? Just the thought makes me squirm. 

Yeah, sometimes we're tired. But guess what? The husband is probably tired too. He needs love just as much as we do.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> If you think it is about blowing our load and going to sleep then sadly you have missed the point as well. Sometimes, sex is about more than just sex. Yes even for a man. Maybe especially for a man.


Sex is more than just sex to some women too! I always felt disconnected and somehow even lonely if my exSO and I went more than a day or two without making love.Sex doesn't fix everything but it sure is a good start...not the specific act of intercourse but all the things that go along with intercourse.the touching,the heated stares,the desire to please the person you love,etc.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

WyshIknew said:


> I just do don't understand. I must be missing something here.
> I just dont see the problem with the wife sometimes saying no.
> 
> I'm not talking about weeks on end, months with the odd pity shag thrown as a bone to keep the dog quiet. It's once in a while.


I think this thread is a classic case of "hitting a nerve".

Do I think the OP intended to leave the impression that women should chronically be able to deny their husbands sex? No, I actually do think she intended to talk about "once in awhile" (despite my sarcastic response, which was done entirely in jest).

But with hot button topics like this, on a board filled with denied spouses, it's liable to get out of hand.

Also the long, endless list of excuses the OP listed in her "letter" serve to reinforce the notion that a lot of women put everything before their husbands needs/desires, expecting him to take up the rear, and also is filled with the classic excuses a lot of spouses are served on a weekly, and even daily, basis.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Michie said:


> My husband does not complain, since he not gone without sexual contact for more then week in the 12 years we have been together.
> 
> However, when we/I/him do slip, pulling the selfish, it must be me, why are treating me this way, is the most undesirable bit of behavior a man possesses. Its the absolute killer of sexual closeness. Treating your wives and girlfriends like giant vaginas that you need to fill to feel "loved" is BS.
> 
> Again my point was the man then taking a situation as presented above and turning in on himself, maybe its not you, stop supposing it is and maybe invest the time your trying to get laid and use it to why your wife/gf doesn't want to.


No offense, but seeing the natural desires that a husband has for his wife as nothing more than "wanting a giant vagina" is BS. If he only wanted a vagina he'd screw any which one he could himself into. It so happens that husbands want _their wives_ because, shocker, they _love them_ and want to feel close to them in an intimate way.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Created2Write said:


> This was precisely what I thought when I read the OP. Life is life, and it will always be there. Tired is tired, and we will always be tired. Should the stars really have to align before a husband wife can have sex? Just the thought makes me squirm.
> 
> Yeah, sometimes we're tired. But guess what? The husband is probably tired too. He needs love just as much as we do.


For you to understand that at your age is wonderful!


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Your husband did not give you your children, could not and can not do it. Your husband had an orgasm inside of you, that's it. It sounds harsh but it's just the truth. 

Sperm is free, always has been and always will be. Every woman on the planet can get pregnant, or at last enough sperm to try, for free, if she wanted to.

No one here is automatically wrong, nor are they automatically right. I do believe some of these husbands are delusional to some degree, that they're heart is broken because their wife has the audacity to maintain autonomy over her own body and vagina.

I have often heard my father thank my mother for giving him me and my sibling, I have never heard it the other way. May be a cultural thing... mothers are the givers of life




Maricha75 said:


> Last I knew, it took both sperm and egg to make a baby. Has that changed? I will agree to one point... the HUSBAND isn't always necessary to make the baby TOGETHER. She could go to a sperm bank, absolutely. But how much will that cost? Sperm is still needed, whether some women wish to admit it or not!
> 
> There are women who use the term "give me a baby"... THEY want the husbands to give them children. So how is it ok for the women to say it but not the men? My husband GAVE me our children. I WANTED to endure the pregnancies...all 4 pregnancies, all three children.
> 
> ...


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Toffer said:


> Ari,
> 
> How often do you and your husband have sex a week?
> 
> Let's skip all the he understands when I don't want to stuff. What's the average?


I would say we have sex between 3 and 4 times a week, closer to 3 than 4
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

Dear Spouse;

Its ok that you don’t want sex tonight. I know you’ve had a hard week and sex is the last thing on your mind. I feel for you, and want you to feel secure and loved. What you don’t know: The only real way I know how to feel and express my love for you is to make love to you so you feel so very special and loved because that it works for me. It is fine to reject that love tonight. It is fine to reject it on occasion. I don’t dwell on the ‘uncommon’ and respect you enough to know you wouldn’t intentionally want to hurt my feelings. 

Just know though, when it becomes common that I’m no longer allowed to express my love or receive it in meaningful ways to me, at some point, I’m going to question its existence in our marriage. I start wondering if you are trying to intentionally hurt me. I’ll stuff down the hurt and betrayal; I’ll make justifications for myself to help bury this pain. It grows and my reasoning for ‘why this is happening’ will get very foggy. Maybe I’ll believe you are having affairs. Maybe I’ll believe I’m ugly and unwanted. Maybe I’ll believe you really hate me down deep. Maybe I’ll believe you are just using me to support you. Maybe I’ll question whether you just did it at first to dupe me into marrying you. I won’t talk to you about ‘it’ because I’ll feel even less loved and wanted when you fight me. You will even lie and tell me you understand, then still not make love to me; Love for you isn’t found this way. 

And because I am a fairly simple animal that is hurt, I may lash out in pain. You’ll also see me become more and more desperate to feel loved again, re-assured that what we have is special. I’ll keep pressuring because I can’t quite accept you no longer love me. And all the while, I will also be blind how all these negative things make me a unattractive person and a ‘turn off’ reinforcing ‘your mood about sex with me’. I’m also no better than you; I don’t recognize how you are expressing your love because that isn’t how I do it.

What exactly did you throw away because you have a headache, had a bad day at work, feel sick or got thrown up on by a baby (which aren’t uncommon things at all)? You may be throwing away the love in the marriage if you let that be your reason for seldom expressing your love to me...


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## hookares (Dec 7, 2011)

There are any number of reason for either party to be unable or unwilling to have intimacy with their spouse.
The problem arises when it's not BOTH who regret it.


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## Cyclist (Aug 22, 2012)

Hicks said:


> I for one am not bitter or angry.
> I recongize my wife has to be in the mood. I recognize that life sometimes gets in the way of her feeling sexual. All husbands recognize this.
> 
> But, how many wives who use "excuses" recognize that prioritizing their own sexuality within their life (over work, kids, house), will lead them to happiness?


That is my thought exactly.

I dont mind being turned down once in a while. I dont need to have sex twice a day or once a day for that matter. But I DO need it to be a priority in our lives. It doesnt supercede raising children or paying bills, but its OUR time together.

It seems that so many woman view it as a job. Maybe their husband isnt any good in bed and is a selfish lover? Maybe they just dont like it. But it seems that so many times they were fine with it on almost a daily basis while dating and early in the relationship only for it to fall back to close to last on the list of weekly activities later in life. Thats what seems to be the issue.

We are not talking about couples that have a frequent sex life here. 2-3 times a week. We are talking about once a week or less, or god forbide an entire 30 days without some kind of contact.

We are also not talking about if I got in an accident or there is a serious health issues. Those are different issues. We are talking about 2 healthy adults that are in a relationship and what the expectations are in that relationship.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

aribabe said:


> Um yeah, that's exactly what I do. If he says he isn't up for cuddling I kiss him on the cheek, say ok and go about my day. My whole world doesn't fall apart if my husband isn't in the mood for snuggling. I see him all the time so I assume we'll just cuddle later. Pouting everytime my husband didn't feel like talking, cuddling, playing around etc would be emotional manipulation and that's not right.


Again, who says anything about acting like the world is falling apart. I mean just normal disappointment. My wife turns me down, I am disappointed. Those are my emotions and just as she has the right to hers, I have a right to mine. I don't pout or fall apart. I shrug my shoulders, am understanding and continue living. But I won't lie and not say I am disappointed. If you are not even a little disappointed when your husband does not cuddle, I have to wonder why you want to cuddle with him.



> And I don't expect for him to decline under only the most difficult circumstances either. The house doesn't need to be on fire, world ending for him to say no. Sometimes he's not in the mood "just cuz'" and that's a-ok with me.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I don't disagree. When things are good in the relationship, it is very easy to shrug off and not care, because your spouse is meeting your needs so many other times. But on this forum, you have a lot of spouses that are not getting their needs met. With that in mind, those excuse are bound to raise the ire of those folks. Accusing them of just wanting to shoot their load in their wife is insulting and is not going to convert them to your view point.

I see that list that the OP and you agree with, and I can't remember a day when something either on that list or close to it did not happen. And I remember when it seemed like those excuses where grabbed onto like a liferaft by my wife as an excuse to not have sex. And I remember her telling me it wasn't me it was just life when I raised her not wanting to have sex. And I remember thinking that when something was important to her she found a way to do it, but she could not find a way to have sex with me. 

As we improved our relationship, including the sex life, the hardest thing for me was not to revert back to the resentment when an excuse came up. I had to trust that she was being honest with me when she said she was just not in the mood. While I mostly handled it well, I did fail at times (I am human). But as I worked on my stuff and she worked on hers, it became easier to trust that the changes were permanent on both sides.

Perhaps it is easiest to sum it up and say that if the HD is only having sex once every other week, this list is going to touch a raw nerve, but it they are having it 2-3 times a week, they will understand and appreciate it.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Before you get too offended at ari people, keep in mind her age and experience level. She's posting based on a certain specific set of experiences. She posts based on what she "knows".


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

Why can't sex be viewed by the tired spouse as a chance to get re-energized?? I don't know about anyone else but I can be dead on my feet and if my exSO started kissing me and rubbing me something in my brain/body clicks and I feel alive and awake again.

no one else feels that way??? it's just viewed as an exhausting experience that requires tons of time and preparation so that's why it isn't done very often?


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

aribabe said:


> How did you "give" her babies, that confuses me. Are you referring only to the moment you ejaculatd inside of her? Because she did 100% of the baby growing and birthing herself, and could've done so without your sperm...
> 
> I don't understand where some husbands are getting this idea that their wives sould feel soooo lucky that he was willing to ejaculate inside of her. Most men would be willing to ejaculate inside of most women lol. If she got a baby, is was because she walling to endure pregnancy and the toll it takes on her body and endure labor and the toll that takes. Why any man would take credit for "giving" a woman a baby is baffling to me.
> 
> ...


Is that really what sex is being reduced to these days? "Just an ejaculation"? That is so sad, I honestly don't know how to comment. 

Please Lord God in heaven, strike me dead if ever I say the same thing.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Before you get too offended at ari people, keep in mind her age and experience level. She's posting based on a certain specific set of experiences. She posts based on what she "knows".


True
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

aribabe said:


> So if you are having an awful 5 days at work, boss being an ass, coworkers acting like kids, I would hope your wife would not expect you to still spend hours listen to her complain about this and that. I would hope she would give you space, be UNDERSTANDING that outiside influences can and do impact your desire to listen to her.


When a man has a week like you describe, what he needs is sexual intimacy with his wife. 

When a woman has a week like you describe, what she needs is to have her husband listen to her.

This is what people need to realize. If the husband learns to listen and be there and the wife learns to be sexual, then marriage can be great.


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## Cyclist (Aug 22, 2012)

ScarletBegonias said:


> Why can't sex be viewed by the tired spouse as a chance to get re-energized?? I don't know about anyone else but I can be dead on my feet and if my exSO started kissing me and rubbing me something in my brain/body clicks and I feel alive and awake again.
> 
> no one else feels that way??? it's just viewed as an exhausting experience that requires tons of time and preparation so that's why it isn't done very often?


You may be in the top 7 percentile of woman.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

aribabe said:


> I would say we have sex between 3 and 4 times a week, closer to 3 than 4
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


And there it is.

While you agree with many of the OPs original ideas, the fact remains that right now you and your husband have a sex life that many of us (men and women) would kill to have.

Why don't you try this little experiment:

For the next three weeks, use some of the excuses that the OP had in her post. No sex for 3 weeks. See what happens then and give us a shout

All I am looking for would be to have the type of frequency you have and I'd even be happy with a little less


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

aribabe said:


> Your husband did not give you your children, could not and can not do it. Your husband had an orgasm inside of you, that's it. It sounds harsh but it's just the truth.
> 
> Sperm is free, always has been and always will be. Every woman on the planet can get pregnant, or at last enough sperm to try, for free, if she wanted to.


Except she did not. My wife wanted mine and that was what got her pregnant. Sure, she sacrificed more physically to have those kids, but to assert that men are fungible leaves me speechless. 



> No one here is automatically wrong, nor are they automatically right. I do believe some of these husbands are delusional to some degree, that they're heart is broken because their wife has the audacity to maintain autonomy over her own body and vagina.
> 
> I have often heard my father thank my mother for giving him me and my sibling, I have never heard it the other way. May be a cultural thing... mothers are the givers of life
> 
> ...


Serious question - are you intentionally trying to insult the men on here? Your posts flat out state that men only want their women so they can have their vag, that men only want women so that the men can shoot their load, that men pout because women won't be their sex slaves and that men are not necessary for kids? Anything else you want to get in while you are at it?

I think I see a kernal of truth in your posts. But your instance on insulting the men in the audience prevents any of it from being heard. You really should consider that when trying to convince others.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

aribabe said:


> Hurt beyond words because your wife didn't drop her panties for you after she'd spent the whole day feeling like crap? Interesting...
> 
> I do wonder if she feel equally hurt beyond words when you show her over and over again that her bad day, personal feelings, bodily pain or discomfort are simply not as important as your desire to get laid.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Really? I'm having a ahrd time sensoring my language here, because this really, really p*sses me off. I'm not a man, I can't say that I understand their sexual desires because I don't. However, I have a HD and I _love_ sex with my husband. Not only is he an incredibly satisfying lover, he's also drop dead gorgeous. He has the sexiest body ever and he knows exactly how to please me. 

If _I_ feel withdrawls from sexual intimacy with my husband, I can only imagine what he feels even 24 hours after previous sexual contact. Is it merely the physical build up? Hardly. He has a hand and can service himself just fine if he needed to. The _desire_ is _for his wife_...ya know...the women he vowed to spend the rest of his life...Geez. It's not like he just wants to dip his wick and get off and call it good. 

UGH.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

aribabe said:


> Your husband did not give you your children, could not and can not do it. Your husband had an orgasm inside of you, that's it. It sounds harsh but it's just the truth.
> 
> *However, what you fail to acknowledge is that in most cases, this is a joint decision. Either he no longer wears a condom or she gets off BC. *
> 
> ...


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

aribabe said:


> Sorry you're offended, but it's the reality. Your wife is not your p*ssy giving robot. She's not. Anymore than you are her affection/attention giving robot. So if you are having an awful 5 days at work, boss being an ass, coworkers acting like kids, I would hope your wife would not expect you to still spend hours listen to her complain about this and that.


Uhhhh....marriage isn't something that just exists. Life will _always_ be there, and I would hopte that both the husband and wife would _still_ put out in the sex and emotion departments, no matter how tired they were. 



> I would hope she would give you space, be UNDERSTANDING that outiside influences can and do impact your desire to listen to her. And you should be equally UNDERSTANDING that outside influences may be impacting her libido.


Why? Why do outside sources _have_ to impact those things? Cause reality is....they really don't. We just allow them to, and use it as excuses later. Yeah, days can be busy and we get really tired and sore. That makes sense. That what someone else says effects libido or willingness to listen? LOL.



> Maybe instead of being irritated with her for not putting out, you can help her figure out what's causng her distress/discomfort. That's masculine, and it's sexy. Pouting is not.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You know what else isn't sexy? Selfishness. Excuses. Laziness. Take your pick. 

I should stop before I get in trouble.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

por me nobody understands how hard it is to be a women .....booo hoo booo hooo.


get over it!


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

aribabe said:


> Your husband did not give you your children, could not and can not do it. Your husband had an orgasm inside of you, that's it. It sounds harsh but it's just the truth.


Well, if he "just had an orgasm" then, by that token, I was "just a receptacle. Sad view of it, don't you think? And, I never said my husband GAVE me our children. I said SOME women say those things. My husband and I gave EACH OTHER our children. There is nothing that can be said that can change THAT view. We were willing EQUAL participants and created our children TOGETHER.



aribabe said:


> Sperm is free, always has been and always will be. Every woman on the planet can get pregnant, or at last enough sperm to try, for free, if she wanted to.


I will agree that sperm is free. What I was saying is that if the woman didn't want to CHEAT on her husband, she could go to a sperm bank and buy it. Or, she can accept the fact that without THAT SPECIFIC MAN, the children she has would NOT be here. It's biology lol. I couldn't get the three kids I have right now by using the sperm of another man. It is impossible. So, yes, the husband, if the wife wants to have HIS children, is very much needed.



aribabe said:


> No one here is automatically wrong, nor are they automatically right. I do believe some of these husbands are delusional to some degree, that they're heart is broken because their wife has the audacity to maintain autonomy over her own body and vagina.


Ok, let's reverse it... the wife has autonomy over her own body and vagina... the husband has autonomy over HIS own body and penis. No matter how it is viewed, it sucks when your spouse doesn't want to have sex. It SUCKS when you go from 3 times a day, down to once a day, down to 3-4 times a week, down to once a week...once every two weeks.... once a month.... and so on. So, feel sorry for the men who have the audacity to maintain autonomy over their bodies too, ok?



aribabe said:


> I have often heard my father thank my mother for giving him me and my sibling, I have never heard it the other way. May be a cultural thing... mothers are the givers of life


Not sure where you're from.... cultural thing? Well, yes, mothers are the givers of life...the have the life growing inside of them. They go through labor and delivery (or, like me, have to have c-sections...which does NOT negate the whole "giving birth"). They are GENERALLY the primary caregivers. Yes, women are the givers of life. However, without the FATHER, they wouldn't BE mothers. It's a simple fact. Without the sperm AND the egg, we have no children conceived. My dad never, to my knowledge, never said the words "thank you" to my mother for giving him my sisters and me. He didn't view it as giving HER either. It was EQUAL. They recognized the fact that they were BOTH needed to create us. They recognized the fact that while sperm is readily available, only his sperm would have made me, only his sperm would have made each of my sisters. 

I don't understand why people don't get that! LOL


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

The whole children debate is severely off topic. But for the record, we gave each other our children. That is a fact. If she used any other sperm but mine, they would be DIFFERENT children. We're not in love with different children. We're in love with our specific children, whom could not have been made without the two of us specifically. 

Only a person without children could possibly try to make the argument that a couple's children are not a gift from each other.

If we were having this debate at a c0cktail party, Would Ari even be able to have a drink in her hand?


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

aribabe said:


> Your husband did not give you your children, could not and can not do it. Your husband had an orgasm inside of you, that's it. It sounds harsh but it's just the truth.
> 
> Sperm is free, always has been and always will be. Every woman on the planet can get pregnant, or at last enough sperm to try, for free, if she wanted to.
> 
> ...


I always thought _both_ were responsible.

Oh well. Guess men shouldn't have to pay child support then, if the mother is the giver of life and all.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

Wow

I don't think I've hit the like button so many times in one post for virtually everyones response other than the OP (who beat a well thouht out retreat) and ari!-


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

ScarletBegonias said:


> Why can't sex be viewed by the tired spouse as a chance to get re-energized?? I don't know about anyone else but I can be dead on my feet and if my exSO started kissing me and rubbing me something in my brain/body clicks and I feel alive and awake again.
> 
> no one else feels that way??? it's just viewed as an exhausting experience that requires tons of time and preparation so that's why it isn't done very often?


I'm with you. When I've had a bad day, the only thing I want to do is make love with my husband. It's relaxing, it releases hormones that make me happy and even take away my headaches...and it makes me feel so loved and cherished. And, maybe I'm weird, but I actually _like_ to feel desired by my spouse. I wish he would initiate more flirtation and sexy talk throughout the day.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Toffer said:


> And there it is.
> 
> While you agree with many of the OPs original ideas, the fact remains that right now you and your husband have a sex life that many of us (men and women) would kill to have.
> 
> ...


We have gone 3+ weeks without sex, I have bouts of depression at times that totally kill my libido. But I wasn't the person who recognized it as depression, it was my husband. I declined him sex for maybe a month and a half, mostly using tired and headache as a reason why, which were true. And my husband didnt get angry with me or behave negatively towards me, he just talked to me. Asked me what was wrong, what was going on, not why I'm not putting out. He showed genuine concern for me and got me in to see a dr, and then a counselor, where I was diagnosed with depression. But I digress...

If my husand had spent that month and a half badgering me about why I wasn't giving him any, sulking and pouting, I would have probably left him. Wouldn't need the extra stress. But he was. Man about it, and it was just sexy as hell looking back. THAT was alpha
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> The whole children debate is severely off topic. But for the record, we gave each other our children. That is a fact. If she used any other sperm but mine, they would be DIFFERENT children. We're not in love with different children. We're in love with our specific children, whom could not have been made without the two of us specifically.
> 
> Only a person without children could possibly try to make the argument that a couple's children are not a gift from each other.
> 
> If we were having this debate at a c0cktail party, Would Ari even be able to have a drink in her hand?


Yea, yea, ok... back to the topic 

So, sometimes men aren't in the mood...sometimes women aren't in the mood. I, for one, have found sex to be a great stress reliever. Also, I learned that if I actually ALLOW my husband to show me affection throughout the day, I am more receptive to having sex that night. Don't let your daily life interfere with your relationship with your husband. Seriously, it will only build more resentment and push you away from each other.


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## SadSamIAm (Oct 29, 2010)

Thought I would fix the OPs post. Here is what she meant to say ....


Dear Husbands/LT Boyfriends.


Sometimes if not most of the time, we aren't secretly angry, or making you suffer for something you did earlier or didn't do.

Sometimes we are not just feeling it. It not your lack of skills, or lack of love play. We are just not in the mood. Be it hormones, or go damn forgetting to shave our legs. Sometimes we are not in the mood. Sometimes we just need to feel sexy to have sex, its got nothing to do with you.

Maybe the baby puked on us today, maybe we noticed weird veins in our theighs, or new laugh lines or crows feet. Maybe we are suffering from horrible cramps and migraines. Maybe we threw our back at work, or pushing the kids to the park today.

Maybe our boss yelled at us and made us feel 2 feet tall, maybe someone called us stupid and useless. Maybe we fought with our mom/dad. Maybe the kids drove us up the wall. Maybe every single on of these things happened at least once today.

Maybe its hard to feel desired when all you heard today was crying and whining, and you spent every freaking iota of affection on the children.

Maybe there has been no moments of peace or quiet.

Maybe we just want you to let us cuddle at your chest and doze off in the secure feeling of warmth and happiness and gratefulness that you'll be there when our eyes open, that you smell like home and that what we need.

*But we realize it isn't all about us. We realize you need to feel loved and cared for, no matter how bad our day was. Thank you for understanding and I promise I will be all yours tomorrow night.*

Maybe we need you, ALL of you, not just your ****, and we understand that we are loved. Maybe we are more then just a set of sexual skills you enjoy.

Maybe we are not in mood tonight, but we love you more then anyone or anything in this life.

I mean really, do you want us to pretend?


Love forever,

your Wives/LT Girlfriends[/QUOTE]


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

aribabe said:


> Your husband did not give you your children, could not and can not do it. Your husband had an orgasm inside of you, that's it. It sounds harsh but it's just the truth.
> 
> Sperm is free, always has been and always will be. Every woman on the planet can get pregnant, or at last enough sperm to try, for free, if she wanted to.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I’m sort of offended with your idea. I assume you do know and understand half that child’s genetic code is mine right? Sure, you could get knocked up by any guy, but it won’t be MY child. I could knock up any woman too, and it would be my child, but NOT YOURS. How does your society look upon that?

You laid an egg. You do it every month just like the rest of the female world. Are you so unique and special when I put it this way. Your eggs are as free as my sperm. Those eggs don’t care who’s sperm fertilize it. My sperm doesn’t care who’s eggs it fertilizes. You aren’t any more special than anyone else. You just want to feel special.... So, we want you to feel special too. But if you devalue our role as men to being meaningless, you are anything but special; You are condescending. 

If you want to just celebrate yourself, by all means go right ahead thinking so selfishly. But the bottom line is you did need a man to fertilize your egg; You can’t do it alone (as graphically represented by your monthly). If you don’t think your man is special enough to give you that child growing in your belly, I feel sorry for you. I’m sure he thinks you are special for giving him a child. Isn’t it better to think: You gave me a child. And I gave you a child. It is our child and it took both of us to make this OUR CHILD.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

No you're not just a receptacle, receptacles simply accept. You accepted and then created life, and gave birth to life and if you breastfed, then you fed that life as well. And you did that a detriment t your own body, and accepted the scars of surgery because of it . That is beautiful and wonderful

I concede that sperm and egg is needed, and I could/would never disgaree. Its this thinking that husband can GIVE a child to his wife, that bugs me.

I am of indian and african descent. That's why I say it could be cultural. 

But that is clearly a dead horse Maricha, and I don't mind agreeing to disagree.




Maricha75 said:


> Well, if he "just had an orgasm" then, by that token, I was "just a receptacle. Sad view of it, don't you think? And, I never said my husband GAVE me our children. I said SOME women say those things. My husband and I gave EACH OTHER our children. There is nothing that can be said that can change THAT view. We were willing EQUAL participants and created our children TOGETHER.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

So, if I were to write a letter to husbands this is how it would read:

Dear husbands/LT boyfriends:

It's true that life happens. It's true that our job, or if we are a SAHM, the kids, can sometimes tire us out. It's true that we don't have an unlimited source of energy to keep us going throughout the day, and we definitely need down time to relax after a hectic day. 

But ya know? You work just as hard as I do, if not harder. You put up with people you may not even like while you're at work, and you fix other people's mistakes, and all so that we can have a roof over our heard and food to eat. We're _both_ tired, I'm sure, and since this relationship is really damn important to us, I think we should make it a daily effort to spend quality time together. Know that I love you and I recognize and appreciate all that you do for us. I also know that you appreciate all I do with the kids and/or my job, so I think we deserve some one-on-one time. Maybe even some making out, and baby if you want some sex, come and get it. I'm here for you, as I know you'll be here for me when I need to vent or even cry because of how tough the day has been. 

I understand that marriage is mutual, and we can't allow life to get in the way. The marriage will die if we do. And while I love our children, I was a wife/SO to you before I was ever a mother of our children and I will _never_ let other things get between us. Your needs are important to me, just as mine are important to you, and while we may get busy and tired...I know that we'll make it because we're still dedicated to each other. 

Signed, a wife who gives a ........


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> So, if I were to write a letter to husbands this is how it would read:
> 
> Dear husbands/LT boyfriends:
> 
> ...


Ok I admit it. I "liked" your post before I even read it. All I saw was that it was a letter to your husband on this topic and that it was from you, and I suspected it would be great. Now that I've read it, I stand by my "like".


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## roger boschman (Aug 3, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Dear wives/LT girlfriends:
> 
> The first time you told us this, we believed you. We believed you the second time too. But after you withheld sex from us for a couple years we started to take it personally. So please stop with the excuses. If you're not into us, just tell us.
> 
> ...


Working has got it right. All the excuses mentioned are perfectly acceptable once. Maybe twice. But, unless you are menstrating, you should pretend. Or at least do a thorough hand-job. And you can do that while menstrating. The man needs relief. Give it. -- Roger G. Boschman, Therapist.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

And, honestly, "pretending" really isn't that bad. It's not bad at all. There are times when I'm not in the mood and I can tell my husband wants to make out and, eventually, make love. I may not feel like it at the moment, but I enjoy his touch and his kisses so I pretend. 

And I didn't die. I didn't feel used. I didn't cry afterward. Quite the contrary. I actually _enjoyed_ it, and felt awesome once it was over. And my husband? He felt loved, cherished, desired...isn't _that_ good enough motivation to do it? It _should_ be.


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## strugglinghusband (Nov 9, 2011)

aribabe said:


> Hurt beyond words because your wife didn't drop her panties for you after she'd spent the whole day feeling like crap? Interesting...
> 
> I do wonder if she feel equally hurt beyond words when you show her over and over again that her bad day, personal feelings, bodily pain or discomfort are simply not as important as your desire to get laid.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_





You've serioulsy misjudged me, the hurt is very real and deep....its not about sex, its about the connection, it all ties together...

The hell with dropping her panties so I can get laid, if I want laid, I could go out to the bar and pick up some chick, but thats not gonna happen, I want my wife and only my wife, I'm married and in love with my wife..I dont look at her like some kind of sperm receptacle.

The once in awhile I can handle quite well,I dont pout like some little ***** because I didnt get my way. I man up and try to see where she's coming from, what can I do to help make her feel better, back rub, listen to her(I mean really listen) she's beat, ok I make dinner,tidy up the house give her some you time to herself etc etc...not in the hopes of getting laid but because I love her and want her to be happy. I could go on and on, I dont let not getting 'laid" affect my outlook, my world dosent revolve around it nor should it.

what I cant handle to well is it happening over and over, and trying to fix it by yourself.

I get where the OP is coming from, I guess I should have stated that before and to me that is an ok situation.

Like I said the rejection, just plain hurts..


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

aribabe said:


> Sperm is free, always has been and always will be. Every woman on the planet can get pregnant, or at last enough sperm to try, for free, if she wanted to.


Yes it is. Plenty of women chose that. They also get to raise those children without a loving father and get to live off what they can earn and extract from the government.



aribabe said:


> No one here is automatically wrong, nor are they automatically right. I do believe some of these husbands are delusional to some degree, that they're heart is broken because their wife has the audacity to maintain autonomy over her own body and vagina.


It is always her body to do with as she chooses. She just shouldn't ignore that by getting married, her choices affect two people.


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## 123pleasehelpme (Aug 29, 2012)

Jobs and modern day life have ruined us, stop blaiming yourselves and others, and if your partners can not support you through the life that idiots have created throughout the years (idiots being government and people who have shaped this idiotic western society) then you need to try to work things out, and understand why each individual is hurting, and stop feeling as if your love life and sex is ruining eachother, when it could be what you are doing for yourself, 
you should not depend on another person for your happines if you yourself are not happy, ask yourself if u are, and if u are, ask ur partner and if they r, then u are not happy together, but if your both miserable because of the life you have chosen for yourself , ie, your friends, your job, your relationship with people, your attitude towards life, what you eat, if you excersize, if you take time out of your day to have "Me time", then, do that, and stop being so dependant on one another, to depend on another, you must first depend on yourself


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

aribabe said:


> We have gone 3+ weeks without sex, I have bouts of depression at times that totally kill my libido. But I wasn't the person who recognized it as depression, it was my husband. I declined him sex for maybe a month and a half, mostly using tired and headache as a reason why, which were true. And my husband didnt get angry with me or behave negatively towards me, he just talked to me. Asked me what was wrong, what was going on, not why I'm not putting out. He showed genuine concern for me and got me in to see a dr, and then a counselor, where I was diagnosed with depression. But I digress...
> 
> If my husand had spent that month and a half badgering me about why I wasn't giving him any, sulking and pouting, I would have probably left him. Wouldn't need the extra stress. But he was. Man about it, and it was just sexy as hell looking back. THAT was alpha
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Again you make assumptions for others

Many of us (including myself) have had the talks, read the books, been to counseling to try and discover what the relationship issues are/were. 

For us, things often improved during these time but then slid back to what they always were.

After you've gone to the doctors, the councilers and the local witch doctor and it all reverts to the same issues (and everything else has been tested and checked) what do you do then? Call it LD, call it tired from work, kids etc. the result is the same. Always a reason NOT to.

Consider yourself fortunate (in a way0 that your issue was one that could be diagnosed and treated. Many here have not had that "luxury" (and I am in no way trying to diminish the seriousness of depression here)

So even though your husnad asked "why I'm not putting out" and dragged you to doctors to find out why you wouldn't let him stick his d!ck in you, you didn't find that self-serving in any way? His Vag robot was broken and he did all he could to fix it.

Sexy


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Created2Write said:


> Really? I'm having a ahrd time sensoring my language here, because this really, really p*sses me off. I'm not a man, I can't say that I understand their sexual desires because I don't. However, I have a HD and I _love_ sex with my husband. Not only is he an incredibly satisfying lover, he's also drop dead gorgeous. He has the sexiest body ever and he knows exactly how to please me.
> 
> If _I_ feel withdrawls from sexual intimacy with my husband, I can only imagine what he feels even 24 hours after previous sexual contact. Is it merely the physical build up? Hardly. He has a hand and can service himself just fine if he needed to. The _desire_ is _for his wife_...ya know...the women he vowed to spend the rest of his life...Geez. It's not like he just wants to dip his wick and get off and call it good.
> 
> UGH.


Please stay on this board for *FOREVER*.

Many of these women won't listen to the men because they seem to have a level of misandry that prevents them from listening to the men. But you and SA beating them up may get through to them.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

"Give you that child growing in your belly..."

That's exactly what I am referring to. He could not give me a child or put one in my belly. Can't now and never will be able too. He can have an orgasm, inside my body, and that's it. He could have that same ejaculation outsode of my body. The only thing he would have to do differently is change location. 

There is no risk involved, not for his life safety, his safety or his health. But being pregnant, is incredibly risky, giving birth, even riskier. So for a husband to think that his orgasm is the same as his wife's body creating a child, giving birth to said child and nourishing that child, it's almost laughable. 

I'm not devaluing men's role. I am only saying that giving children is not a role you play. You provide for children, love them, teach them, help them grow. But you can't, never will be able, to,give your wife a baby.



Racer said:


> I’m sort of offended with your idea. I assume you do know and understand half that child’s genetic code is mine right? Sure, you could get knocked up by any guy, but it won’t be MY child. I could knock up any woman too, and it would be my child, but NOT YOURS. How does your society look upon that?
> 
> You laid an egg. You do it every month just like the rest of the female world. Are you so unique and special when I put it this way. Your eggs are as free as my sperm. Those eggs don’t care who’s sperm fertilize it. My sperm doesn’t care who’s eggs it fertilizes. You aren’t any more special than anyone else. You just want to feel special.... So, we want you to feel special too. But if you devalue our role as men to being meaningless, you are anything but special; You are condescending.
> 
> If you want to just celebrate yourself, by all means go right ahead thinking so selfishly. But the bottom line is you did need a man to fertilize your egg; You can’t do it alone (as graphically represented by your monthly). If you don’t think your man is special enough to give you that child growing in your belly, I feel sorry for you. I’m sure he thinks you are special for giving him a child. Isn’t it better to think: You gave me a child. And I gave you a child. It is our child and it took both of us to make this OUR CHILD.


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## dallasapple (Jun 20, 2012)

> Maybe even some making out, and baby if you want some sex, come and get it. I'm here for you, as I know you'll be here for me when I need to vent or even cry because of how tough the day has been.


This is wonderful if its true ..but its not always true..the "as I know you'll be there for me when I need to vent or cry because of a tough day"..as a matter of fact sometimes you know they WONT be ..like its pretty much guaranteed"..

So "baby come and get it " would be a stand alone as in baby come and get it(what you need at the moment) even though I know if I need you most likely I'll need to call a friend or just get over it on my own..the majority of the time anyway..

IOW your motive can not be with any expectation of reciprical love in the manner YOU NEED it ..It may even be recipricated in the manner THEY choose to give it thats easiest or more natural for them ..But not what your heart desires and longs for the most..

And if you want to stay married to that person it has to be accepted and "good enough" by BOTH...Having sex will NEVER Ensure all other needs on either side will be met..let alone your other highest needs..or that in fact they WONT be neglected /ignored...or approached in a half assed doent really want to do it manner...

You are litterally settign yoru self up for complete dissapointment and in fact utter dissolusionment if you think "baby come and get it " means anythign more than "baby come and get it " and when thats over its untill 'baby wants to come get it again "..

What are you (nto yo specifically ANY person ) who that morning "baby comes and gets it" then later that evening after a hard day you want to vent or cry they say "sh*t" I just walked through the door can you give me a break ..besides that you are "always upset about something"..What do you say "but baby you came and got it this morning"?You know what they say ?But that was for YOU TOO not just me...THATS how I SHOW you how much I CARE about you ...What?Didnt you enjoy it too?


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Ok I admit it. I "liked" your post before I even read it. All I saw was that it was a letter to your husband on this topic and that it was from you, and I suspected it would be great. Now that I've read it, I stand by my "like".


Me too!


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

larry.gray said:


> Please stay on this board for *FOREVER*.
> 
> Many of these women won't listen to the men because they seem to have a level of misandry that prevents them from listening to the men. But you and SA beating them up may get through to them.


Oh, and add Maricha75 to this list!


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## momtwo4 (May 23, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> This was precisely what I thought when I read the OP. Life is life, and it will always be there. Tired is tired, and we will always be tired. Should the stars really have to align before a husband wife can have sex? Just the thought makes me squirm.
> 
> Yeah, sometimes we're tired. But guess what? The husband is probably tired too. He needs love just as much as we do.


I don't think that the OP was saying that the "stars all have to align" before having sex. I think what she was saying is that there ARE times when it is just too hard to get in the mood to have sex without feeling resentful. I don't think she was saying to push your husband away whenever you are not feeling horny.

However, as a mom to four young kids I totally get what she is saying. I've worked full-time and I've stayed home and taken care of four little kids. There is something that is emotionally draining about being grabbed and surrounded by little people ALL day long. I do need my space sometimes, and I don't feel guilty telling my husband that in a nice way. And it doesn't have to do with him. I love him for what he does for our family, and he loves me for what I do for us. We respect each other's boundaries.

I'm not going to make a habit out of depriving my husband for sex. But if the baby has pooped on me, if the three-year-old peed her pants twice, and if I'm so bone tired that the thought of sex makes me feel a little sick, I'm probably going to pass on it that night. Now I'm LD, and I realize that many of you HD wives might not be able to relate to feeling this way. Nevertheless, it is a very real feeling for SOME wives and mothers.

Once again, I'm not saying that wives should make it a chronic habit to deprive their spouses. I believe that we should do all we can to make our spouses happy while respecting our own boundaries.


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## ocotillo (Oct 17, 2011)

momtwo4 said:


> Wow. What a myriad of attacks against the OP. I get what she was saying. I don't think she was referring to women who habitually deny their partners. BOTH sides made some good points.


Yeah, but you have to admit that ten varied and different reasons for not being in the mood, a few of which are fairly chronic occurrences for adults with children set the 'mood' for the responses that followed..... Those things happen more than 'sometimes.'


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

larry.gray said:


> Oh, and add Maricha75 to this list!


There is actually a long list of women here who "get it". The ones who don't are just more vocal sometimes.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

aribabe said:


> I'm not devaluing men's role. I am only saying that giving children is not a role you play. You provide for children, love them, teach them, help them grow. But you can't, never will be able, to,give your wife a baby.


Wow, that's quite a level of hatred for men you have there...


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

aribabe said:


> I concede that sperm and egg is needed, and I could/would never disgaree. Its this thinking that husband can GIVE a child to his wife, that bugs me.
> 
> *Sounds as if she advocating a sperm-jacking!*
> 
> ...


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

aribabe said:


> "Give you that child growing in your belly..."
> 
> That's exactly what I am referring to. He could not give me a child or put one in my belly. Can't now and never will be able too. He can have an orgasm, inside my body, and that's it. He could have that same ejaculation outsode of my body. The only thing he would have to do differently is change location.
> 
> ...


Without the sperm, a women can't have a baby. Without your husbands sperm, you would not have any of your children. You caould get another man's sperm and have different children, but you can't have your current kids without him. He gives those to you just as you gave them to him. That is not an opinion, that is just a fact.

You can believe that you did more to bring them to this world, that you contributions in carrying them to term are far more important. I might even agree. But you are wrong in saying that he did not have a part in giving you the child that you gave birth to.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

WorkingOnMe said:


> There is actually a long list of women here who "get it". The ones who don't are just more vocal sometimes.


What's so impressive about created2write is that she gets it NOW. 

SA got it after her own drive surpassed her husband and now she feels bad for the time lost. My wife is starting to get it now.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

how did the topic get turned into who gives whom the babies?

this is about why you can't muster enough energy to give and receive love(because that's what sex in a marriage should be).stop using kids,housework,blahblahblah as your excuse.If you are truly and completely in love with your partner you will want him even if you have to hold your pretty little eyes open with paperclips.i speak from personal experience.
Women who deny their husbands give ALL women a bad name.Hell they give marriage a bad name too bc men associate being married with not having a sex life anymore.It sucks.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

momtwo4 said:


> I don't think that the OP was saying that the "stars all have to align" before having sex. I think what she was saying is that there ARE times when it is just too hard to get in the mood to have sex without feeling resentful. I don't think she was saying to push your husband away whenever you are not feeling horny.
> 
> However, as a mom to four young kids I totally get what she is saying. I've worked full-time and I've stayed home and taken care of four little kids. There is something that is emotionally draining about being grabbed and surrounded by little people ALL day long. I do need my space sometimes, and I don't feel guilty telling my husband that in a nice way. And it doesn't have to do with him. I love him for what he does for our family, and he loves me for what I do for us. We respect each other's boundaries.
> 
> ...


I can try to understand that. But the opposite side to that coin is that husbands have bad days too, and their feelings and needs are just as real and as important as ours.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

larry.gray said:


> Please stay on this board for *FOREVER*.
> 
> Many of these women won't listen to the men because they seem to have a level of misandry that prevents them from listening to the men. But you and SA beating them up may get through to them.


 Thanks. 

lol "beating them up".


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## dallasapple (Jun 20, 2012)

> I don't think that the OP was saying that the "stars all have to align" before having sex. I think what she was saying is that there ARE times when it is just too hard to get in the mood to have sex without feeling resentful. I don't think she was saying to push your husband away whenever you are not feeling horny.


I agree...just like its WRONG to say 'baby come and get it" whenever he feels like it no matter how ****ty you feel ..becasue you expect that whenever YOU FEEL like *****ing or venting or crying even if HES not in the "mood" to listen to it he SHOULD even though regardless if "baby came and got it' he STILL had a **** ass day ..IMHO he shouldnt (just like unwanted sex) have to feel "pushed" because of an I OWE YOU (from him getting it)to grit his teeth and bare it..Besides that the "venting " is apples for apples..MANY men like to vent to thier wives..about traffic..about the ass hole co-worker or boss..about their sinuses..about didnt have time to even eat lunch that day ...about the WEATHER...


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## momtwo4 (May 23, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> I can try to understand that. But the opposite side to that coin is that husbands have bad days too, and their feelings and needs are just as real and as important as ours.


My husband has his stressful days when he needs his space as well. And I certainly respect that.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> Without the sperm, a women can't have a baby. Without your husbands sperm, you would not have any of your children. You caould get another man's sperm and have different children, but you can't have your current kids without him. He gives those to you just as you gave them to him. That is not an opinion, that is just a fact.
> 
> You can believe that you did more to bring them to this world, that you contributions in carrying them to term are far more important. I might even agree. But you are wrong in saying that he did not have a part in giving you the child that you gave birth to.


I don't have any children....

The only thing my husband can give me in regards to a child, is sperm. That's a fact. He can not produce a child for me, no matter how much sperms he ejaculates inside of me. I, and other women, are the sole child producers. That is a fact.

And yes having an orgasm does carry less weight than going through labor. Thts not a fact though, just my very strong opinion.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## dallasapple (Jun 20, 2012)

momtwo4 said:


> My husband has his stressful days when he needs his space as well. And I certainly respect that.


Exactly its not "on tap" that husbands are availabe 24/7 every time the wife has a "need"..Its about being there for one another WHILE respecting each others limits and bounderies..within REASON..

Stressign each other out over our "needs" and treating it like tit for tat swap meet is a recipe for MUTUAL unhappiness.

If I felt like DUMPING a load of crap I experienced that day on my husband and he had "signaled" not a good time I wouldnt say "but I had sex with you last night so you have "no excuse" unless you have spinal menigitis ..or some sort of head injury not to listen to me spew..

I give him his "man space" just like I need my "woman space" ..in fact its "human space" ...


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

If my wife has a bad day, I don't want her to EVER not come to me.

That's just cold and mean to want distance when what she wants is to be close and vent. She needs a hug, cuddled close and she needs to be listened to. It's not freaking hard! No matter what my day is like, what is the problem?


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

aribabe said:


> I don't have any children....
> 
> The only thing my husband can give me in regards to a child, is sperm. That's a fact. He can not produce a child for me, no matter how much sperms he ejaculates inside of me. I, and other women, are the sole child producers. That is a fact.
> 
> ...


Doing my best to not use fist. of. death.

For the love of God woman, neither you NOR your husband can do this on your own (Biology 101) and as others have said this is way off topic!

Why don't you let this go and get back to the point of the topic. It wasn't who can make the babies, it was about the excuses spouses (yes, both men and women) use to avoid sex!


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

aribabe said:


> I don't have any children....
> 
> The only thing my husband can give me in regards to a child, is sperm. That's a fact. He can not produce a child for me, no matter how much sperms he ejaculates inside of me. I, and other women, are the sole child producers. That is a fact.
> 
> ...


If you ever have kids, ask you husband if that baby that you carried is also his. Try telling him that he had nothing to do with the child, and that you were the only one who created it or made it. Also explain to him why he has an obligation to raise and nurture a child he had nothing to do with and had no part in creating.

With all of that, I will stop the thread jack.


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## momtwo4 (May 23, 2012)

larry.gray said:


> Please stay on this board for *FOREVER*.
> 
> Many of these women won't listen to the men because they seem to have a level of misandry that prevents them from listening to the men. But you and SA beating them up may get through to them.


And as a LD person this makes me feel bad as a wife and woman. I get that my husband's needs are important. I DO get that. But sometimes after reading these posts I feel like less of a woman and wife because I don't always feel ready to have sex whenever my husband does. I feel I am less of a wife because I sometimes do have very stressful days and that does affect my sex drive.

If I were a truly devoted wife, I should always be able to "squash" my emotions, put on the lingerie and have at it.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Be the wife that you could be. If you're starting to listen to this, then good for you.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

ScarletBegonias said:


> how did the topic get turned into who gives whom the babies?
> 
> this is about why you can't muster enough energy to give and receive love(because that's what sex in a marriage should be).stop using kids,housework,blahblahblah as your excuse.If you are truly and completely in love with your partner you will want him even if you have to hold your pretty little eyes open with paperclips.i speak from personal experience.
> Women who deny their husbands give ALL women a bad name.Hell they give marriage a bad name too bc men associate being married with not having a sex life anymore.It sucks.


SO true. Which is why things like this get to me so much. I still don't get the disassociation between love and sex. Since when did it become such a chore? Since when does someone have to be "in the mood" to love on their spouse? I'm sure that, after a long day of work, my husband doesn't particularly want to come home and hear me talk about my day. He's tired, he's dirty...most of the time he's cranky. But he still listens, because he loves me. Just like, I may be tired from dealing with stupid students who don't understand how college works and they expect everyone else to get things done for them, but my husband had no part in that frustration. He didn't cause them, so why should he be punished? 

And really, isn't it better to get love from your spouse/give them love after a bad day? End it on a good note? For me it is.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

larry.gray said:


> Please stay on this board for *FOREVER*.
> 
> Many of these women won't listen to the men because they seem to have a level of misandry that prevents them from listening to the men. But you and SA beating them up may get through to them.


And if I forgot any of the other women with similar views, sorry. I really do value your input to this board!


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## Zatol Ugot? (Mar 5, 2012)

I have read every post in this thread. I just had to chime in to say..."fascinating".

Carry on.


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## strugglinghusband (Nov 9, 2011)

momtwo4 said:


> And as a LD person this makes me feel bad as a wife and woman. I get that my husband's needs are important. I DO get that. But sometimes after reading these posts I feel like less of a woman and wife because I don't always feel ready to have sex whenever my husband does. I feel I am less of a wife because I sometimes do have very stressful days and that does affect my sex drive.
> 
> If I were a truly devoted wife, I should always be able to "squash" my emotions, put on the lingerie and have at it.


Sometimes is fine, and squashing your emotions is not fine.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

momtwo4 said:


> And as a LD person this makes me feel bad as a wife and woman. I get that my husband's needs are important. I DO get that. But sometimes after reading these posts I feel like less of a woman and wife because I don't always feel ready to have sex whenever my husband does. I feel I am less of a wife because I sometimes do have very stressful days and that does affect my sex drive.
> 
> If I were a truly devoted wife, I should always be able to "squash" my emotions, put on the lingerie and have at it.


It's a give and take. lots of men want it every day but bc they GET their wives aren't always into it,they "squash" their emotions and go rub one out in the bathroom in secret.

If he can do that, I don't see why the wife can't TRY to be open to his advances at least every other day or every 2 days...sometimes all it takes is some kisses and caresses til you realize,hey I'm in the mood now!


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

This?

Cheap Trick - I Want You To Want Me Live 1978 TV - YouTube


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

dallasapple said:


> Exactly its not "on tap" that husbands are availabe 24/7 every time the wife has a "need"..Its about being there for one another WHILE respecting each others limits and bounderies..within REASON..
> 
> Stressign each other out over our "needs" and treating it like tit for tat swap meet is a recipe for MUTUAL unhappiness.
> 
> ...


I agree with this and yet can see it leading to the same issues noted by many posters here. If your husband repeatedly was unwilling to listen to you when you needed that from him, how long would it take for that to become a problem? How long before you would start resenting the sex you are having and perhaps starting to withdraw? I suspect it would happen, and legitimately so. How long could he brush you off and claim he is not in the mood before you start to question his excuses.

Despite what we all want, love is rarely unconditional. A big part of it is the feedback loop where my wife works to meet my needs and I work to meet her needs. If I cut it off on my giving, it is human nature for her to wonder, *after a while*, what is in it for her. There exceptions, such as for illness or injury or loss, where we need to be patient. But when things are in the norm, we expect effort from our spouse and them from us.

It is a balance, and over the long term requires thinking of your spouse just as much as you think of yourself.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

aribabe said:


> There is no risk involved, not for his life safety, his safety or his health. But being pregnant, is incredibly risky, giving birth, even riskier. So for a husband to think that his orgasm is the same as his wife's body creating a child, giving birth to said child and nourishing that child, it's almost laughable.


Maybe that’s part of your impression: “being pregnant, is incredibly risky”. It isn’t. It isn’t without risk, but “incredibly risky” is a gross exaggeration. Your body is biologically built for that. Yes, problems occur, but they aren’t ‘the normal pregnancy’. And it is no where near the same and I have no idea where you got that impression from my post. 

My body as a man does what it is biologically built to do, as is your body. I like to see you try to produce 200 to 600 million sperm in a day.... You can’t. My boys work really hard to get the job done. 

You do what? Two eggs a month? Phft.... big deal; They can’t even swim or survive outside you all on their own... that ain’t so special


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

No that's not true momtwo4 your needs are important as well. Geeze.... a woman doesn't have to squash her needs and cater to her guy.. likewise a man doesn't need to squash his needs to cater to his girl. Compromise!! Btw.... sperm holds the dna for making a child so in all reality... yes men do give their wives a baby... and she in turn gives it to him by being an incubator for the child to develop. If you want to say a woman can easily replace a man as a "sperm donor" a man can easily replace a woman as an incubator.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

aribabe said:


> I don't have any children....
> 
> The only thing my husband can give me in regards to a child, is sperm. That's a fact. He can not produce a child for me, no matter how much sperms he ejaculates inside of me. I, and other women, are the sole child producers. That is a fact.
> 
> ...


Biologically speaking this in inacurrate. A wife can only produce half of the equation that it takes to create a child, likewife for the father. Maybe you haven't taken a biology class, but the whole point of a sperm and egg meeting is so that the person being made can have a full amount of DNA. 

It's been a year since I took this clas, but basically...each person has a certain amount of DNA. The sperm that fertilizes the egg has exactly half(including what decides if the child is male or female), and the woman has half as well. There are ttwo strands of DNA in every human being. The man contributes one strand, the women contributes the other. 

So when it comes to "creating" a child, both the man and woman are equally responsible, and this is scientifically proven. Yeah, the women carries the baby, but she doesn't give it life. They both do.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

momtwo4 said:


> And as a LD person this makes me feel bad as a wife and woman. I get that my husband's needs are important. I DO get that. But sometimes after reading these posts I feel like less of a woman and wife because I don't always feel ready to have sex whenever my husband does. I feel I am less of a wife because I sometimes do have very stressful days and that does affect my sex drive.
> 
> If I were a truly devoted wife, I should always be able to "squash" my emotions, put on the lingerie and have at it.


Don't be that hard on yourself. At least you realize that it is an issue and one you regognize. It's really not about alwys feeling ready. It's also about how you handle the times you don't.

Your emotions are important and your husband should also be willing to accept perhaps a little less. Comprise


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## dallasapple (Jun 20, 2012)

momtwo4 said:


> And as a LD person this makes me feel bad as a wife and woman. I get that my husband's needs are important. I DO get that. But sometimes after reading these posts I feel like less of a woman and wife because I don't always feel ready to have sex whenever my husband does. I feel I am less of a wife because I sometimes do have very stressful days and that does affect my sex drive.
> 
> If I were a truly devoted wife, I should always be able to "squash" my emotions, put on the lingerie and have at it.


(((HUGS))))

You arent "less of a woman"..

If however you think its a "problem" and you can "work on it" and it woudl benefit your marriage and your "confidence" as a "woman " then you should..

And Im sorry half the so called "women" here have had in the past or will in the future there own "dips" ..SO have the men or some of the womens husbands here ..

Anyone can get on a forum and go ...I have WILD hot SEX with MY man..MEN need sex and I BLOW and suck and anytime he WANTS ! Men have NEEDS and Im horny as a cat in heat and I just GET WET adn cream in my pants when I see MY husbands PENIS Im here for him anytime he needs!Im GRATEFUL my husband wants my hot wet p**sy!

Then you get the men going "Likes ..dream wife" Likes" wish I had you " ..etc..YOu get LOTS of "man attention" if you announce a "mans need for sex" and your "willingness to provide it" ....How "deeply you understand a "mans need" READ through the lines..People like you arent embellishign or lying..


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

ScarletBegonias said:


> It's a give and take. lots of men want it every day but bc they GET their wives aren't always into it,they "squash" their emotions and go rub one out in the bathroom in secret.
> 
> If he can do that, I don't see why the wife can't TRY to be open to his advances at least every other day or every 2 days...sometimes all it takes is some kisses and caresses til you realize,hey I'm in the mood now!


You have any unmarried sisters at home still?


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

dallasapple said:


> (((HUGS))))
> 
> You arent "less of a woman"..
> 
> ...


Having a healthy view of sex and wanting sex from your partner doesn't mean you're lying or embellishing. 

Wanting sex doesn't make me or any of the other women who LOVE sex any less real than you or anyone else here.


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## dallasapple (Jun 20, 2012)

larry.gray said:


> If my wife has a bad day, I don't want her to EVER not come to me.
> 
> That's just cold and mean to want distance when what she wants is to be close and vent. She needs a hug, cuddled close and she needs to be listened to. It's not freaking hard! No matter what my day is like, what is the problem?


Well your just a better person than 90% of other men..The male version of hot and ready whenever..

I guess its "not a problem " for you but for unperfect people it is..


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

Racer said:


> Maybe that’s part of your impression: “being pregnant, is incredibly risky”. It isn’t. It isn’t without risk, but “incredibly risky” is a gross exaggeration. Your body is biologically built for that. Yes, problems occur, but they aren’t ‘the normal pregnancy’. And it is no where near the same and I have no idea where you got that impression from my post.
> 
> My body as a man does what it is biologically built to do, as is your body. I like to see you try to produce 200 to 600 million sperm in a day.... You can’t. My boys work really hard to get the job done.
> 
> You do what? Two eggs a month? Phft.... big deal; They can’t even swim or survive outside you all on their own... that ain’t so special


Not aimed specifically at Racer (because God knows I've chimed in here too on this TJ) but can we all please stop feeding this troll-like part of the thread?


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

larry.gray said:


> If my wife has a bad day, I don't want her to EVER not come to me.
> 
> That's just cold and mean to want distance when what she wants is to be close and vent. She needs a hug, cuddled close and she needs to be listened to. It's not freaking hard! No matter what my day is like, what is the problem?


No kidding, right? This isn't freaking rocket science. I thought this was kind of Relationships 101 stuff...even Jr. Highers can grasp this. Yet somehow marriage(which is supoosed to be two people making a life together) is all about personal space and distance from the spouse?

Now, believe me, I get needing to have some alone time. I get needing space. There's nothing wrong with that. But "being tired" isn't a legitimate excuse to ignore your spouse. We kind of vowed to be there for them, and I don't know about anyone else, but the clause "unless I'm really tired" wasn't included.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Toffer said:


> Doing my best to not use fist. of. death.
> 
> For the love of God woman, neither you NOR your husband can do this on your own (Biology 101) and as others have said this is way off topic!
> 
> Why don't you let this go and get back to the point of the topic. It wasn't who can make the babies, it was about the excuses spouses (yes, both men and women) use to avoid sex!


Fist of death is fine, whatever...

Biology 101 says that women do DO it on their own. You know what, show me a pregnant man or man in labor, and I'll agree that it's a team effort. Just show me one child produced by a man, just one. Men give sperm, women give babies. Fact of life. 

To get back on point... 
A man will never put a child into anyone's belly, nor should they feel entitled to or deserving of sex because they "gave their wife a child". That's impossible to do.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

momtwo4 said:


> And as a LD person this makes me feel bad as a wife and woman. I get that my husband's needs are important. I DO get that. But sometimes after reading these posts I feel like less of a woman and wife because I don't always feel ready to have sex whenever my husband does. I feel I am less of a wife because I sometimes do have very stressful days and that does affect my sex drive.
> 
> If I were a truly devoted wife, I should always be able to "squash" my emotions, put on the lingerie and have at it.


I feel bad for you and women in this situation. For me, I know all I ask for is an honest effort. I know that our drives will never match perfectly. I feel it is my right, and your too, to make a real effort to meet each others needs.


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## dallasapple (Jun 20, 2012)

> Having a healthy view of sex and wanting sex from your partner doesn't mean you're lying or embellishing.


I never said it was..

But I also wasn't talking about a healthy view..


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> I feel bad for you and women in this situation. For me, I know all I ask for is an honest effort. I know that our drives will never match perfectly. I feel it is my right, and your too, to make a real effort to meet each others needs.


that's what i wanted to say, you just said it better


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## dallasapple (Jun 20, 2012)

> Wanting sex doesn't make me or any of the other women who LOVE sex any less real than you or anyone else here.


LOL!! ...Again where did I say I didnt love sex or want sex?

Nice trick ..didnt work..


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

dallasapple said:


> I never said it was..
> 
> But I also wasn't talking about a healthy view..





dallasapple said:


> (((HUGS))))
> 
> Anyone can get on a forum and go ...I have WILD hot SEX with MY man..MEN need sex and I BLOW and suck and anytime he WANTS ! Men have NEEDS and Im horny as a cat in heat and I just GET WET adn cream in my pants when I see MY husbands PENIS Im here for him anytime he needs!Im GRATEFUL my husband wants my hot wet p**sy!
> 
> Then you get the men going "Likes ..dream wife" Likes" wish I had you " ..etc..YOu get LOTS of "man attention" if you announce a "mans need for sex" and your "willingness to provide it" ....How "deeply you understand a "mans need" READ through the lines..People like you arent embellishign or lying..



looks like that's what you're saying here.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

dallasapple said:


> LOL!! ...Again where did I say I didnt love sex or want sex?
> 
> Nice trick ..didnt work..


trick? there is no trick and people who have read other posts from me know i'm not that type of poster.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

momtwo4 said:


> And as a LD person this makes me feel bad as a wife and woman. I get that my husband's needs are important. I DO get that. But sometimes after reading these posts I feel like less of a woman and wife because I don't always feel ready to have sex whenever my husband does. I feel I am less of a wife because I sometimes do have very stressful days and that does affect my sex drive.
> 
> If I were a truly devoted wife, I should always be able to "squash" my emotions, put on the lingerie and have at it.


It's not about "feeling" ready. I can attest that I don't always "feel" ready. For me anyway, a lot of my readiness for sex comes from my mental and emotional state beforehand. Knowing that I might need to be warmed up to the idea, and my husband helps to get me to relax and unwind. Being willing to try is just as important as having that "feeling", imo.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

momtwo4 said:


> And as a LD person this makes me feel bad as a wife and woman. I get that my husband's needs are important. I DO get that. But sometimes after reading these posts I feel like less of a woman and wife because I don't always feel ready to have sex whenever my husband does. I feel I am less of a wife because I sometimes do have very stressful days and that does affect my sex drive.
> 
> If I were a truly devoted wife, I should always be able to "squash" my emotions, put on the lingerie and have at it.


I certainly don't want you to think you are less of a wife or a women because stressful days affect your sex drive. It certainly does for my wife and I understand that. Your needs are important and definitely need to be considered, and you should not just squash your emotions. What makes a great wife is one who balances that with my needs and our needs as a couple.

A bit ago, my wife and I had not connected in a couple of days. She had gotten a bit of a bug one evening, so begged off. No problem, we cuddled and enjoyed being close while I pampered her a tiny bit. The next night we were interupted by a kid, which put a damper on her mood. So the third night and I can tell she is just not feeling it. Nothing particularly bad happened that day, but her mood for sex was pretty blah, at least from her body language. So imagine my surprise when we get to bed and she starts some light kissing and touching. Then she asks me to give her a massage, and then things take off. After a great session, she turns to me and says "I am glad I let you start me up."

To me, that is a real wife and woman. One that recognizes when I am working to meet her needs and wants to try and meet mine. She does not need to get reved up everyday, but she makes sure that there is balance in the relationship, and is willing to work with me to make sure my needs are met as well as hers.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

FrenchFry said:


> OP you dared to suggest that sex is not the fix-all to all relationships in Sex in Marriage.
> 
> You dared to suggest there might be other factors in life inhibiting never ending sexual passion.
> 
> Godspeed OP.


Ha

This post made me lol

Godspeed,indeed 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Toffer said:


> Dear Wives,
> 
> Thank you for treating us as your personal slave and ATM. I apologize that I forgot you have the right to have all (within reason) of your wishes and desires filled. Marry? Sure. Buy you a house? Sure. Give you babies? Sure. Buy you 60 pairs of shoes while I have maybe 6? Sure. Tolerate you as your hormones run wild during pregenancies and once a month? Sure.
> 
> ...


I think that's just to YOUR wife...unless you have more than one.

I say that because it's very specific. Your wife doesn't work, I take it? I work. I pay 1/2 the bills and starting next month, because of money issues, I'll be paying the mortgage for now. I own 2 pairs of shoes for every day and one nice pair for going out. H has 4 pairs of tennies that I bought him because he hates to shop.

I can see being frustrated at the wife that the letter is written about/to. But "Dear Wives" doesn't make sense...at least not to me.

Sex in this house is seen as a fun *bonus* to our days. It's a fun way to unwind and blow the shet out. It's nice to have sex to forget about the unpaid bills, the shet that needs to be done, etc. I am a wife, but I am not like your wife. I am sorry your wife frustrates you so much. I am sure you have said to her the things you wrote in that letter? If not, you should.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

momtwo4 said:


> And as a LD person this makes me feel bad as a wife and woman. I get that my husband's needs are important. I DO get that. But sometimes after reading these posts I feel like less of a woman and wife because I don't always feel ready to have sex whenever my husband does. I feel I am less of a wife because I sometimes do have very stressful days and that does affect my sex drive.
> 
> If I were a truly devoted wife, I should always be able to "squash" my emotions, put on the lingerie and have at it.


It's not about being less of a wife, or some defect you have.

It's about setting up your LIFE so that you put a priority on accessing your sexuality above the many other things that destroy it. And its about understanding that doing this will bring you personal fulfillment more than the many other things you are spending your energy on...

The things that stress you out, bother you, your lack of libido, the worries you have... These are not "Immovable Structures" in your life. These are peices of furniture you have arranged in your life....You put them where they are. You put your worry beads in the LIVING room and stored your libido in the attic. What I am saying is you have every freedom in this world to arrange the furniture in a more marriage oriented way.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

that_girl said:


> I think that's just to YOUR wife...unless you have more than one.
> 
> I say that because it's very specific. Your wife doesn't work, I take it? I work. I pay 1/2 the bills and starting next month, because of money issues, I'll be paying the mortgage for now. I own 2 pairs of shoes for every day and one nice pair for going out. H has 4 pairs of tennies that I bought him because he hates to shop.
> 
> I can see being frustrated at the wife that the letter is written about/to. But "Dear Wives" doesn't make sense...at least not to me.


No, this isn't about my wife. This was just my knee jerk reaction to the OP

My wife works. I was just following the format (to a degree) of the OP


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Toffer said:


> No, this isn't about my wife. This was just my knee jerk reaction to the OP
> 
> My wife works. I was just following the format (to a degree) of the OP


OH. Ok. lol. Good, then. You have a lot of anger goin on, no? LOL That's just how I read that. I was like, "Dang! That boy needs a drink and needs to talk to his wife!!"

Carry on.


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## bubbly girl (Oct 11, 2011)

Michie said:


> However, when we/I/him do slip, pulling the selfish, it must be me, why are treating me this way, is the most undesirable bit of behavior a man possesses. Its the absolute killer of sexual closeness. *Treating your wives and girlfriends like giant vaginas that you need to fill to feel "loved" is BS.*


This statement is what upsets me about your attitude. It's dismissive and belittling of your husbands feelings. 

We all have needs and it's up to each of us to meet our spouse's needs as best as possible. Your husband would have no right to tell you that your need to cuddle in order to feel loved is BS any more than you telling him he's wrong to say he needs sex to feel loved.

It makes me angry when I read things by women that make men sound like they're animals. They're not. They are human beings just like us women. They want love and respect as much as we do. I can't say that I know how it feels to be a man...I don't have large amounts of testosterone flowing through me. I can understand how a man feels...to a degree...by listening to what men tell me.

My husband has high testosterone levels...he NEEDS sex. He struggles with some of the more romantic aspects of the relationship, but he does show me how much he loves me in his own way. Sex is one of the main ways. I revel in the fact that after all these years, growing older, having children, etc my husband still has such a strong desire for me. No I am not just a vagina for him to get off in. I am his wife...the only woman he has sex with. The only woman he loves. I can not wrap my head around getting upset that your husband desires you. I believe it would be a very sad day if my husband stopped desiring me. So much connection would be lost in our marriage.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Yet another post by the ever modest TEG - Tall Exceptional Guy. TEG has managed to educate his wife about men in a loving and patient manner. 

What a beautiful dynamic: 
TEG understands that as the lower desire partner, her needs and wants are different. He understands her and ACCEPTS her. 

TEG's W understands and ACCEPTS that as the higher desire spouse he has needs as well, needs that while different from hers are EVERY BIT as valid. 



Tall Average Guy said:


> I certainly don't want you to think you are less of a wife or a women because stressful days affect your sex drive. It certainly does for my wife and I understand that. Your needs are important and definitely need to be considered, and you should not just squash your emotions. What makes a great wife is one who balances that with my needs and our needs as a couple.
> 
> A bit ago, my wife and I had not connected in a couple of days. She had gotten a bit of a bug one evening, so begged off. No problem, we cuddled and enjoyed being close while I pampered her a tiny bit. The next night we were interupted by a kid, which put a damper on her mood. So the third night and I can tell she is just not feeling it. Nothing particularly bad happened that day, but her mood for sex was pretty blah, at least from her body language. So imagine my surprise when we get to bed and she starts some light kissing and touching. Then she asks me to give her a massage, and then things take off. After a great session, she turns to me and says "I am glad I let you start me up."
> 
> To me, that is a real wife and woman. One that recognizes when I am working to meet her needs and wants to try and meet mine. She does not need to get reved up everyday, but she makes sure that there is balance in the relationship, and is willing to work with me to make sure my needs are met as well as hers.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

that_girl said:


> OH. Ok. lol. Good, then. You have a lot of anger goin on, no? LOL That's just how I read that. I was like, "Dang! That boy needs a drink and needs to talk to his wife!!"
> 
> Carry on.


We have our issues and have had some talks and evrything but it's not as bad as I projected in the post.

I just get a little edgy sometimes when someone gets on here and seems to blame one sex or the other for all their issues.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

that_girl said:


> OH. Ok. lol. Good, then. You have a lot of *anger goin *on, no? LOL That's just how I read that. I was like, "Dang! That boy needs a drink and needs to talk to his wife!!"
> 
> Carry on.


I just wanted to say that this post is soo much more funny when you misread the bold portion above as 

*angry groin*

Otherwise, nothing of substance to add, so please carry-on.


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## Interlocutor (Dec 29, 2011)

Wow, it appears ari has a language and math barrier.

Gestation, labor, and birth: 100% the woman's body. Agreed. God bless women.

CREATING life: 50% woman and 50% MAN... NO DEBATE... Just count the ****ing chromosomes in a sperm cell and in an ovum. 23+23=46 chromosomes, the amount in our DNA right now... Seemingly, God/Evolution has it done this way so neither the man, woman, nor ari out there could say the crap she's been saying, but ari never got the memo.

In other news, many male citizens have been flooding our court systems trying to be forgiven/waived of their child support payments citing the evidence of an Internet user on talkaboutmarriage.com. Each citizen was dismissed with a free math and science book.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

The reason I found the initial post so offensive is that it:
- Has a me, me, me flavor to it. This is not someone on a team, this is the star player explaining why all the valid reasons they have for causing their team mate distress. 
- Mixes up completely different things - fully controllable, less controllable, not controllable

Physical sickness is a protected category. Thats why the vows say in sickness and in health. 

Baby related stuff is in a gray area. Some amount of it is valid, and beyond that the baby has become the magic prop used to excuse any and all bad behavior by the mom. 

The list below reflects an interesting mindset that I believe to be part of a total cultural melt down. Assuming your partner consistently makes it clear that they find you attractive and are attracted to you, this list is pure narcissistic self indulgence: 
1. Forgot to shave (guess what - shaving is either important to you or not, if it is do it. don't use your lack of organization or planning as a valid "excuse" for making a desire imbalance worse)
2. Veins, crows feet - this is your issue - don't make it your partners
3. Weight problems - same thing - even more so if you are not actively working on it. If you have serious enough issues about your weight, focus on it. If not, don't hide behind this as yet another excuse. 

As for the boss yelling at you: If you messed up, you likely will feel bad. And if it is a rare event, and you really are upset and out of sorts it is ok to say "I made a mistake at work, got yelled at and feel bad about it. And I am really not in the mood tonight - I'm sorry if you are disappointed". 



Michie said:


> Dear Husbands/LT Boyfriends.
> 
> 
> Sometimes if not most of the time, we aren't secretly angry, or making you suffer for something you did earlier or didn't do.
> ...


----------



## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Dead horse....

Men don't give women babies. Never have. Never will. 
Men are unable to "put a baby in her belly". Can't now, never will be able to.
Know your roles, baby producing is not one of them.
Thanks for the semen 

I don't even know how this is an argument lol. Its like women arguing that they produce semen too. Silly. But I guess in the world of equality, even men can produce babies. I'm just wondering why I've never seen it, must be a cultural thing 



Interlocutor said:


> Wow, it appears ari has a language and math barrier.
> 
> Gestation, labor, and birth: 100% the woman's body. Agreed. God bless women.
> 
> ...


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

aribabe said:


> Dead horse....
> 
> Men don't give women babies. Never have. Never will.
> Men are unable to "put a baby in her belly". Can't now, never will be able to.
> ...


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Toffer said:


> aribabe said:
> 
> 
> > WILL EVERYONE PLEASE STOP FEEDING THE BIOLOGICALLY CHALLENEGED?
> ...


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## Unsure in Seattle (Sep 6, 2011)

Obvious knows little about biology or gender relations troll is obvious.

Toffer; I couldn't agree more re: blaming one gender or the other for all of the ills of the world. Pointless. 

It's nice to see some of the excellent responses after such an inflammatory post. Trolls aside, that is.


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## Interlocutor (Dec 29, 2011)

YES, men GIVE women half of the materials to create life.

Women give the other half... Then, women have the baby the MAN and the WOMAN created mathematically equally together gestate in her womb...

This is taught in middle school. The man has MATHEMATICALLY EQUAL role in CREATING life... Pick up a science book.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Aribabe said:


> This message is hidden because aribabe is on your ignore list.


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## Interlocutor (Dec 29, 2011)

Toffer said:


> aribabe said:
> 
> 
> > Dead horse....
> ...


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

I have conceded multiple times that men provide their sperm for the creation of a baby.

Women, however, are the only PRODUCERS of babies. Men can not produce, or give a woman a baby.

Is this honestly that confusing for people or am i just going crazy:scratchhead:




Interlocutor said:


> YES, men GIVE women half of the materials to create life.
> 
> Women give the other half... Then, women have the baby the MAN and the WOMAN created mathematically equally together gestate in her womb...
> 
> ...


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## Interlocutor (Dec 29, 2011)

aribabe said:


> I have conceded multiple times that men provide their sperm for the creation of a baby.
> 
> Women, however, are the only PRODUCERS of babies. Men can not produce, or give a woman a baby.
> 
> Is this honestly that confusing for people or am i just going crazy:scratchhead:


As I I said, problem with English... You do not know the meaning of the word produce... English or education barrier, which means you should avoid debates with educated people in English.

A man by himself or a woman by herself do not produce a thing dear. Get a dictionary.

Here I did it for you:

Produce = verb, to make or manufacture from components or raw materials. 

If I only have wood because I am a carpenter, I cannot produce a home which has wood and bricks by myself. I can produce it WITH a mason, which then means the product is not my own. The mason and the carpenter produced the home, even if the carpenter spent nine months decorating it afterward.

_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

So it's like baking a cake. The men give half the ingredients required to make the cake baking process work.The women give the other half,bake it then they decorate it and make it perfect together awwwwwww


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

MEM11363 said:


> Yet another post by the ever modest TEG - Tall Exceptional Guy. TEG has managed to educate his wife about men in a loving and patient manner.
> 
> What a beautiful dynamic:
> TEG understands that as the lower desire partner, her needs and wants are different. He understands her and ACCEPTS her.
> ...


Thank you. I am fortunate to have a great wife that taught me about women in a loving and patient manner.

To go full circle, one thing she did teach me was that her mood was not always about me. That things effect her mood and have nothing to do with her love for me. By giving her that space, it seemed to free her to deal with what was bothering her and then show her love to me without the pressure. She could freely give it, as opposed to being forced to give it.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

Ari, I have a question for you. And it isn't about the whole nonsense about our husbands giving us children (those of us who have children, that is). My question is about the cultural difference you suggested earlier. You said... Indian and African-American? Or was it Indian and African? Too lazy to go sift through the posts.

Anyway, I know there are subjects that I am ignorant about. Mine is cars. I know next to nothing about cars. I know where to put the gas. I know how to check the oil, fill it when needed. I know how to check the coolant, etc. But I don't tell my husband how to replace a transmission. I don't tell him how to rip apart the dash of a Mercedes to fix something in it. And he doesn't tell me that I know nothing about how hormones affect our bodies. He has absolutely no interest in my college anatomy book...ok, MAYBE a slight interest in that one.  But he doesn't care to look at the HOW'S and WHY'S of our bodily functions. He leaves that to me. He also lets me explain all that to the kids because of my background in that area lol.

Anyway, back to the original topic. I understand being too tired, etc. But I HAVE learned that it takes away a lot of stress I have built up throughout the day.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

Do men really need women to have shaved legs in order to get turned on by them? (that was one of the reasons for not being in the mood)

i was rereading the letter and one of the things was about not feeling sexy and therefore not being in the mood bc of that.
it reminded me of a time w/my exSo where I felt really gross and while I wanted him I couldn't get myself in the zone.We laid there naked and since I felt gross i had the blankets pulled up to my chin lol 
I voiced to him that I didn't feel sexy.

Well that was all i needed to say in order for him to jump into action.I got more affection, unique compliments, and feel good statements given to me than I knew what to do with.It was wonderful to get that reassurance and tlc.
the fact that he took that moment to work hard at showing me how sexy I was to him turned around my whole attitude and salvaged the evening.If he could make that effort even though he was mentally exhausted from working all day,helping w dinner,helping me with dogs,etc...I could make the effort to block out my "you're unsexy" thoughts. I did and it was wonderful


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

There does seem to be English/vocab problem here

but that problem is not mine...
and i'm going to leave this at that 

some people you just can't reach/teach
whatever....



Interlocutor said:


> As I I said, problem with English... You do not know the meaning of the word produce... English or education barrier, which means you should avoid debates with educated people in English.
> 
> A man by himself or a woman by herself do not produce a thing dear. Get a dictionary.
> 
> ...


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Somebody else said it earlier and I also felt it.....the OP left me with the feeling that all the stars had to align just perfectly for sex to happen. And let's be honest, how often are the conditions really just that perfect. If you always wait until everything is perfect right down to the shaved legs it'll never happen.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Indian and african-american techincally

Born in India, Indian father, african-american mother. Raised since a teenager in Georgia  



Maricha75 said:


> Ari, I have a question for you. And it isn't about the whole nonsense about our husbands giving us children (those of us who have children, that is). My question is about the cultural difference you suggested earlier. You said... Indian and African-American? Or was it Indian and African? Too lazy to go sift through the posts.
> 
> Anyway, I know there are subjects that I am ignorant about. Mine is cars. I know next to nothing about cars. I know where to put the gas. I know how to check the oil, fill it when needed. I know how to check the coolant, etc. But I don't tell my husband how to replace a transmission. I don't tell him how to rip apart the dash of a Mercedes to fix something in it. And he doesn't tell me that I know nothing about how hormones affect our bodies. He has absolutely no interest in my college anatomy book...ok, MAYBE a slight interest in that one.  But he doesn't care to look at the HOW'S and WHY'S of our bodily functions. He leaves that to me. He also lets me explain all that to the kids because of my background in that area lol.
> 
> Anyway, back to the original topic. I understand being too tired, etc. But I HAVE learned that it takes away a lot of stress I have built up throughout the day.


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## Interlocutor (Dec 29, 2011)

aribabe said:


> There does seem to be English/vocab problem here
> 
> but that problem is not mine...
> and i'm going to leave this at that


You do that. It's your only option until you can come up with something better than "I'm right because I think I am," with no linguistic, mathematical, or biological appeals.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

Do we choose the mood/ feeling or does the mood/ feeling choose us?


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

I know, so that's exactly what I'm going to do 

My my, male sensitivity, it sure is something 



Interlocutor said:


> You do that. It's your only option until you can come up with something better than "I'm right because I think I am," with no linguistic, mathematical, or biological appeals.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

Ari, will you please stop? Must you continue baiting?


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## ScaredandUnsure (Nov 17, 2011)

This thread went from somewhat interesting to really irritating.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Women are not the producers... we are the incubators for petes sake! If we were the producers we wouldn't need the male gender! Wether you realize it or not ari... your posts are giving off a sense of entitlement to the female side. "Oh we have the babies so we are entitled to deny you men sex and you should worship the ground we walk on"..... that is the air your giiving off atm ari... and its one I disagree with.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

ScarletBegonias said:


> So it's like baking a cake. The men give half the ingredients required to make the cake baking process work.The women give the other half,bake it then they decorate it and make it perfect together awwwwwww


Last commet on this, promise 

I agree with you. It is like baking a cake

Men are the batter
Women are the oven

If you put a pan full of batter into an oven that's not heated, when you take it out in 30 minutes it will still just be batter. No cake will be PRODUCED. Agreed?

Semen is just batter, not a baby. When you impregnant your wife you are NOT putting a baby in her belly, you're just putting batter into her oven lol. Then nine months later, SHE produces you a cake, I mean, a baby.

Create does not equal produce

Create means to put together
Produce means to bring forth

Women are the only one's bringing forth a baby
PS: merriam webster also usea "to give birth" as a definition of the word produce

K, done 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

Gaia said:


> Women are not the producers... we are the incubators for petes sake! If we were the producers we wouldn't need the male gender! Wether you realize it or not ari... your posts are giving off a sense of entitlement to the female side. "Oh we have the babies so we are entitled to deny you men sex and you should worship the ground we walk on"..... that is the air your giiving off atm ari... and its one I disagree with.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Women are not just the incubator Gaia. Incubators simply hold. You are not just holding a baby in your stomach, that baby is living off of you, feeding from you. 

I don't think women need to be worshipped for being the producers of life/babies. It is what it is. But to have men claiming that they are GIVING a baby to women, that is ludicrous and totally impossible.

Husbands claiming that they deserve sex because they gave a baby to their wife. That thinking irks me because it makes no biological or medical sense.

Women/wives can deny sex for whatever reason. They don't have to use the excuse that they give birth. They can just say they don't want to. Women do that, right?



Gaia said:


> Women are not the producers... we are the incubators for petes sake! If we were the producers we wouldn't need the male gender! Wether you realize it or not ari... your posts are giving off a sense of entitlement to the female side. "Oh we have the babies so we are entitled to deny you men sex and you should worship the ground we walk on"..... that is the air your giiving off atm ari... and its one I disagree with.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Ah I get what your saying now... and yes the sense of entitlement irks me as well no matter which gender it comes from. It tends to screw some of us over.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

Yay, I think I've been understood (at least slightly?) 

That's the first time today lol
I was seriously thinking there really was something wrong with my English, ha.



Gaia said:


> Ah I get what your saying now... and yes the sense of entitlement irks me as well no matter which gender it comes from. It tends to screw some of us over.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

WorkingOnMe said:


> Somebody else said it earlier and I also felt it.....the OP left me with the feeling that all the stars had to align just perfectly for sex to happen. And let's be honest, how often are the conditions really just that perfect. If you always wait until everything is perfect right down to the shaved legs it'll never happen.


And, honestly, having sex with your spouse when you're not in the mood isn't the greatest sacrifice in the world. It is entirely possible to enjoy it, and even _get_ in the mood because of it.


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## Interlocutor (Dec 29, 2011)

aribabe said:


> Last commet on this, promise
> 
> I agree with you. It is like baking a cake
> 
> ...


By its other definition, then yes you are right. If I pulled a baby from my car and showed the baby to you, then I have also produced a baby, just as I can produce my license to an officer asking for it... English barrier dear, because in standard English no one would say it that way. We'd say "deliver" or "give birth to" or "demonstrate."

Insofar as you mean to deliver or bring forth, I feel so bad for you. You just can't catch a break because other than the female lead role in the film Apocalypto women don't typically deliver babies by themselves... I guess the doctor and the mother are the ones producing the baby by your definition... So much for that!

If you mean deliver or bring forth, sure women produce... Who cares?

If we mean the way EVERYONE has been using it in this thread, surely at your awares, then no. You cannot produce a child by yourself. The product of life is the collaboration of female and male roles. In fact, the men play more of a role because we decide the gender... The women play obviously the greatest role during GESTATION and delivery. Two things men have to be extremely grateful for.

You mean produce as in to "show" the baby? LOL to that. Sure, you can hold a baby by yourself and demonstrate it to a crowd I hope. Congrats.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

CanadianGuy said:


> Do we choose the mood/ feeling or does the mood/ feeling choose us?


Bingo!! Feelings and moods are entirely within our control. When I'm angry because a friend of mine says something stupid on facebook, and my husband comes home right as I'm done reading it, there's nothing written in the fates that says I _must_ continue to be mad. I can choose to be mad all night, or I can choose to let it go and enjoy time with my husband. 

I can also choose to work myself into the mood, or I can choose not to.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

I think men deserve sex from their wives because every honest man deserves to feel loved and cherished. I don't think it has anything to do with babies.


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## southbound (Oct 31, 2010)

When i was married, making love to my wife was a great thing after a bad day of a bad boss or babies crying all day. If anything, a bad day made me appreciate my wife even more, not kill the mood.

For me, sex with my wife made things right that were wrong emotionally, everything didn't first have to be right for me to be in the mood.


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## Goldmember357 (Jan 31, 2012)

All i can say is be very careful and exercise extreme caution when dating someone and marrying them.

I can understand you not being in the mood. I am not in the mood sometimes when my wife wants sex i have turned her down before because i really did not feel like having sex at all. I am a thinker i love to get lost in my mind and in reading so i am not always up for sex nor do i feel i need to. I sometimes view too much sex as us being lower than human and being that of an animal, i get much pleasure from other things. 

I have no idea how i came to mind set. But i must say it is very helpful.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

southbound said:


> When i was married, making love to my wife was a great thing after a bad day of a bad boss or babies crying all day. If anything, a bad day made me appreciate my wife even more, not kill the mood.
> 
> For me, sex with my wife made things right that were wrong emotionally, everything didn't first have to be right for me to be in the mood.


:smthumbup:Heck yeah.


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## Unsure in Seattle (Sep 6, 2011)

Created2Write said:


> I think men deserve sex from their wives because every honest man deserves to feel loved and cherished. I don't think it has anything to do with babies.


Yep. And vice versa, of course.

Sex shouldn't be a chore or a sacrifice. If it is, you're doing it wrong.


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## ScaredandUnsure (Nov 17, 2011)

I think it's cruel for two people who supposedly love each other, with hold vital parts of their marriage. Be it sex or emotional needs or whatever.

But I will say this, if my dude ever withheld affection from me, and only touched me when wanting sex, sex would probably stop with him as would the relationship. It has to be a two way street, not one person doing all the work. Had enough of those relationships in my life, won't be the one bending over backwards to please someone when that someone couldn't care less about my needs.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

*I know i said last comment....*



Interlocutor said:


> By its other definition, then yes you are right. If I pulled a baby from my car and showed the baby to you, then I have also produced a baby, just as I can produce my license to an officer asking for it... English barrier dear, because in standard English no one would say it that way. We'd say "deliver" or "give birth to" or "demonstrate."
> 
> *Language barrier indeed....
> 
> ...


*ok, i really really am done. Good luck with the babies interlocutor, whatever role you play *


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## CanadianGuy (Jun 17, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> Bingo!! Feelings and moods are entirely within our control. When I'm angry because a friend of mine says something stupid on facebook, and my husband comes home right as I'm done reading it, there's nothing written in the fates that says I _must_ continue to be mad. I can choose to be mad all night, or I can choose to let it go and enjoy time with my husband.
> 
> I can also choose to work myself into the mood, or I can choose not to.


Thanks for your feedback on this C2W. 
Do feelings and moods apply to our basic drives? Sex, food and, shelter. 

I'm feeling hungry but not in the mood for soup. 
I'm need out of the rain but would prefer a cave over a tree.
I'm feeling horny but am in the mood for a woman not a man. 

Can we help feeling hungry? Can we help wanting to be out of the cold and rain? Can we stop feeling horny?


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

aribabe said:


> Women are not just the incubator Gaia. Incubators simply hold. You are not just holding a baby in your stomach, that baby is living off of you, feeding from you.


First, the baby isn't held in your stomach. It is the uterus. The stomach is for digestion...ewww. But yes, like an oven we are incubators. You went with the baking a cake metaphor. Cakes are baked in an oven. The oven incubates the ingredients to make the cake. Those ingredients feed off of the heat of the oven and the cake grows. When the time comes, you take it out and you have the cake. The oven didn't put in the ingredients. The oven only incubated it. It took eggs, flour, sugar, etc. to make it. And that's the point the men and some of us women have been trying to make. 



aribabe said:


> I don't think women need to be worshipped for being the producers of life/babies. It is what it is. But to have men claiming that they are GIVING a baby to women, that is ludicrous and totally impossible.
> 
> Husbands claiming that they deserve sex because they gave a baby to their wife. That thinking irks me because it makes no biological or medical sense.
> 
> Women/wives can deny sex for whatever reason. They don't have to use the excuse that they give birth. They can just say they don't want to. Women do that, right?


By saying "I produced this child, you didn't", it essentially tells the man "You are unimportant, unnecessary to the process." That's hitting below the belt. Men are VERY much necessary tot he process. They are VERY much needed to produce (the definition I am using is create from raw materials, as found in the dictionaries I used) a baby. Without their contribution, we would NOT have children. We are not amoeba. We do not reproduce asexually. I suspect your husband would agree with this, at least. And he would feel as if you cut his balls off if you implied he wasn't needed to have your children someday. A woman saying she did it all herself irks ME because medically and biologically, it is incorrect. "Giving" your spouse a child makes no sense EITHER way because NEITHER gives the child to the other. They make it TOGETHER. If that is too hard to comprehend, I am so sorry.... but it's true. I didn't give my children to my husband. He didn't give them to me. We made them TOGETHER. 50-50

Now... about the OP.....




Michie said:


> Dear Husbands/LT Boyfriends.
> 
> 
> Sometimes if not most of the time, we aren't secretly angry, or making you suffer for something you did earlier or didn't do.
> ...


Look, the bottom line, as has been stated on this board *MANY MANY TIMES*..... everyone feels love in different ways. Some feel it with physical acts (i.e. *gasp* SEX). Some feel it by words. The point is, you need to know what makes YOUR PARTNER feel loved, not just you, and certainly not any one of US here ONLINE!


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

JMHO.

only true beatches withhold sex from a husband. and if you find your wife withholding sex (not turning you down once in a while for a good reason) send her down the road. you will be happier in the long run.



its the ultimate power move .....I have it and you want it so I can control you. when she starts with that attitude you picked a bad apple!


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

CanadianGuy said:


> Thanks for your feedback on this C2W.
> Do feelings and moods apply to our basic drives? Sex, food and, shelter.
> 
> I'm feeling hungry but not in the mood for soup.
> ...


In my opinion, "feelings" can be incredibly inaccurate. A man can do everything his wife says she wants him to do, and she may still never "feel" in the mood. It's essential for us to be in control of our feelings and our moods. 

That doesn't mean that husbands can treat their wives poorly and expect her to still put out. Obviously things do contribute to mood as well. But when a husband is meeting his wife's needs, she should be able to put herself into the mood for him.


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## Michie (Aug 26, 2012)

Actually it seemed my point was *entirely* missed.

As you may recal the title of the thread is "sometimes just not in the mood...its NOT you"

The part that is critical here is the *not you* part. As I am referring the wives/girlfriends who still physically and emotionally desire their partner. But for whatever reasons does not want sex that moment in time. It has nothing to do with not wanting you, just don't feel like getting laid.

Really is it that hard to fathom.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Nope! 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Michie (Aug 26, 2012)

Gaia said:


> Nope!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thank you! Sheesh!


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## Michie (Aug 26, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> That doesn't mean that husbands can treat their wives poorly and expect her to still put out. Obviously things do contribute to mood as well. But when a husband is meeting his wife's needs, *she should be able to put herself into the mood for him.*


Excuse me, what?


Sometimes that may just be physically impossible.



***EDIT

What a closely related point I was trying to make in my first post was in contradiction to all the people who have now said that wives/gfs use sex as a tool of control.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

Michie said:


> Actually it seemed my point was *entirely* missed.
> 
> As you may recal the title of the thread is "sometimes just not in the mood...its NOT you"
> 
> ...


No, it isn't hard to fathom. But at the same time, there are SOME who, while they feel the desire for awhile, use the excuses given. And As...WOM, I think pointed out, they are accepted at first. But then it grows into a habit. SOME of the women (ok, some men as well) think "hey, it worked last time, let's see if I can milk it again". No, I am not saying that's what your point is. What I am saying is that the jaded(?) men here heard THOSE excuses from their loving wives in the beginning. And they accepted them...and kept accepting them. Until they now find themselves here, trying to explain to some of the women on here (again, not saying YOU are one of those women, Michie) that they aren't legitimate excuses FOR THEM and why. And they get lambasted for speaking up against it, to keep SOME women from doing the same to their own husbands. In a sense, I see them as cautioning both men and women as to where that road can lead, and to take steps to avoid that happening to them. 

Guys? Yay or nay?


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Michie said:


> Really is it that hard to fathom.


After 15 pages, dozens of post deletions and a couple of bans ... apparently so.

Context is everything.

Lots of dudes on here that have a better chance of seeing Bigfoot than having their wives express any sexual interest in them, despite their efforts to be good husbands.

That is from whence much of the ire comes.

Because quite simply, "It's not you ...I'm just not in the mood" is the number one excuse proffered. 

Hope that helps.


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## barbados (Aug 30, 2012)

Mistys dad said:


> Ok, "We" used to mess around 4 times a week. =208
> 
> Your boss yelled at you every two weeks- 26
> 
> ...



BRAVO !!! Couldn't be stated any better !


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## Juicer (May 2, 2012)

I understand you may just want to cuddle after a long day, because you had a horrible crappy day. 
Could we do it not wearing lots of pajamas though?

Also:
At least 2 business days a week, I have to get up at 6:30 a.m., and I get home at 11:00 p.m. If I am lucky. And I have to spend it with guys that I may really like, or I may have to spend it with guys that have ego's like Rush Limbaugh. (and the worst part is, I have to act like I like them!
So...Could you maybe give me some sex, just to remind me, why I do that? (because it is to provide for you!)


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

You were so very outspoken, opinionated, prolific and impish when you first came here ...

My how you've changed not a whit.


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## accidentalfeminist (Aug 30, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> So, if I were to write a letter to husbands this is how it would read:
> 
> Dear husbands/LT boyfriends:
> 
> ...


 Harder? Says who?


Created2Write said:


> You put up with people you may not even like while you're at work, and you fix other people's mistakes, and all so that we can have a roof over our heard and food to eat.


 I'm pretty sure women who work experience the same things, and work for the same reasons...not sure why the differentiation between men who work and women who work...


Created2Write said:


> We're _both_ tired, I'm sure, and since this relationship is really damn important to us, I think we should make it a daily effort to spend quality time together. Know that I love you and I recognize and appreciate all that you do for us. I also know that you appreciate all I do with the kids


 (strangely assuming the mom is the child-rearer)


Created2Write said:


> and/or my job, so I think we deserve some one-on-one time. Maybe even some making out, and baby if you want some sex, come and get it. I'm here for you, as I know you'll be here for me when I need to vent or even cry because of how tough the day has been.
> 
> I understand that marriage is mutual, and we can't allow life to get in the way. The marriage will die if we do. And while I love our children, I was a wife/SO to you before I was ever a mother of our children and I will _never_ let other things get between us. Your needs are important to me, just as mine are important to you, and while we may get busy and tired...I know that we'll make it because we're still dedicated to each other.
> 
> Signed, a wife who gives a ........


Please, tell me more about what a great wife you are to give sex whenever he wants it even while working full-time and raising your children. Oh, wait....nevermind. You actually haven't lived this life, you just THINK you will be better than the rest of us.


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## accidentalfeminist (Aug 30, 2012)

Mistys dad said:


> "Sometimes" is the seed that grows into the tree of "Never"


You could also say that "always" is the seed that grows into the tree of "rape." If you think that NOT having sex when you want it causes resentment, try putting yourself in the shoes of someone who "has" to give sex whenever their partner wants it no matter what. Neither extreme is healthy.


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## accidentalfeminist (Aug 30, 2012)

Mistys dad said:


> Ok, now ask yourself where affairs start.


In the minds and hearts of those who make excuses and blame others for their own bad behaviour.


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## accidentalfeminist (Aug 30, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> I think men deserve sex from their wives because every honest man deserves to feel loved and cherished. I don't think it has anything to do with babies.


This assumes that every husband is an "honest man." What if he's not? Is there such a thing as a husband who is not "deserving" of sex from his wife? That's what I take objection to: the generalizations. The assumption that if you're married, you now and forevermore DESERVE sex from your spouse, just because you want it. It's such an attitude of selfish entitlement. If your spouse doesn't want it, why would you? I don't see the lure of having sex with someone who'd rather not at the time. That is "using". Of course, ideally, every couple would be in sync emotionally and spiritually and they'd both "want" it at the same time every time. Realistically, though, sometimes one will and the other won't. That does not have to be a big deal, really. There is so much more to marriage.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Created2Write said:


> Bingo!! Feelings and moods are entirely within our control. When I'm angry because a friend of mine says something stupid on facebook, and my husband comes home right as I'm done reading it, there's nothing written in the fates that says I _must_ continue to be mad. I can choose to be mad all night, or I can choose to let it go and enjoy time with my husband.
> 
> I can also choose to work myself into the mood, or I can choose not to.


Yep, that doesn't only apply to sex. I _was_ horrible at it. I tended to carry the grumpiness of other events beyond what I should.

At the same time, when someone is grumpy about an event that wasn't caused by us, we need to remember it isn't directed at us. Calmly saying "please don't take your frustration out on me" is WAY better than escalating back.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Trenton said:


> <sarcasm> Really? You especially value women's input on these boards if the align with your own? That definitely leaves you open for new understanding and growth and definitely doesn't leave you open to automatically like something based upon the poster rather than the material posted. </sarcasm>


Yes I do, no sarcasm needed.

It's not what I will learn from them, it is the fact that women can say the EXACT same thing and other women will listen to them more because of their gender. 

Now this thread... from the women on the other side of the argument I've learned bupkus. Mainly because they are so angry in this one.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Deejo said:


> Lots of dudes on here that have a better chance of seeing Bigfoot than having their wives express any sexual interest in them, despite their efforts to be good husbands.


Fortunately following the advice of the board has freed me being one of them.



Deejo said:


> That is from whence much of the ire comes.
> 
> Because quite simply, "It's not you ...I'm just not in the mood" is the number one excuse proffered.
> 
> Hope that helps.


You nail it exactly. That is the excuse I heard.

I never went more than about 3 weeks without. Most of the time it was about 2 weeks dry spell. She always had desire around ovulation. I had it nowhere near as bad as many of the men here describe.

Since I got the carrot dangled enough to keep me coming back, I got shot down A LOT. At least 5 times a month of rejected attempts. Multiply by 12 months and 8 years that's about 500 times.

Somewhere around 450 times I said I would take it no more.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Trenton said:


> You've learned bupkus from women on the opposite side of this argument because you don't want to. Don't blame it on their anger or their gender.


I confine it solely to this thread. There's lots of anger flying in this one. I've leaned a whole lot in the year and a half I have been on this forum.


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

What I find funny is this: Much of what drives men to desire sex is our homones. And for that we're villified by many women. "Men are pigs". "Men only want one thing". "Why can't they think of anything else". "That's all you care about". "Can't you shut that thing off". Etc., etc., et-freakin' cetera.

Yet take that same woman, whose hormones are going crazy during pregnancy, a change of life, or what have you...and suddenly they have an incredible (if not fleeting) very high sex drive, where they can't get enought, and turn them down JUST ONCE in any manner that even *remotely resembles *the way they've turned us down COUNTLESS times, and the level of butt hurt they feel and display is off the charts.

I've witnessed this a few times. And the irony and hipocritical nature of it would be funny were it not so sad that some women (not all) cannot look outside of their own selves for just a few moments to realize this.

The ones that can logically look at the "other side" and understand it for what it is, unfortunately seem relatively few and far between. They're GOLD when you find them. And I've found that THOSE women who are not so wrapped up in themselves that they can see anothers point of view, and really TRY to understand their wants and desires, make EXCELLENT relationship partners in virtually every other area as well. 

Just sayin'. 

Now, can the same be said for men and their understanding of women's needs? Absolutely. And those of us that "get it" are also, sadly, relatively few and far between as well. 

If people spent more time trying to truly understand the opposite sex instead of villifying them for what they don't understand, there would be so many more happy, satisfied, and loved people in the world.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

maricha75 said:


> no, it isn't hard to fathom. But at the same time, there are some who, while they feel the desire for awhile, use the excuses given. And as...wom, i think pointed out, they are accepted at first. But then it grows into a habit. Some of the women (ok, some men as well) think "hey, it worked last time, let's see if i can milk it again". No, i am not saying that's what your point is. What i am saying is that the jaded(?) men here heard those excuses from their loving wives in the beginning. And they accepted them...and kept accepting them. Until they now find themselves here, trying to explain to some of the women on here (again, not saying you are one of those women, michie) that they aren't legitimate excuses for them and why. And they get lambasted for speaking up against it, to keep some women from doing the same to their own husbands. In a sense, i see them as cautioning both men and women as to where that road can lead, and to take steps to avoid that happening to them.
> 
> Guys? Yay or nay?


*yay! Yay! A thousand times yay!*


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

accidentalfeminist said:

"That's what I take objection to: the generalizations"

She then went on to say:

"I'm pretty sure women who work experience the same things"

Those who live in glass houses.....


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

I think when a LD spouse starts denying sex to the HD one on a regular basis, she or he should have the courage to leave the marriage (which is not a marriage anymore, just a partnership), instead of inflicting years of pain to the other half. This is what I don't understand. Sex is not that important to you, go and find another LD person! (From someone who would be happy with once a week.)


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

Trenton said:


> This is so bad. The fact that women liked it is equally bad.




? whats bad about it? the bottom line is everybody has to learn how to deal with the stresses in life and its not an excuse to treat your husband or wife poorly.

boo hooo nobody loves me I'm going to go eat worms attitude.


I'm not saying that seeking some simpthy from your signifigent other is wrong but if its your general attitude then it gets old. 

and reciprocation is needed when you know its been awhile and your husband has been understanding then show him the next time by being overly enthuastic and telling him thanks for understanding the other day when I wasn't in the mood.

it take two to tango for the long haul.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

donny64 said:


> What I find funny is this: Much of what drives men to desire sex is our homones. And for that we're villified by many women. "Men are pigs". "Men only want one thing". "Why can't they think of anything else". "That's all you care about". "Can't you shut that thing off". Etc., etc., et-freakin' cetera.
> 
> Yet take that same woman, whose hormones are going crazy during pregnancy, a change of life, or what have you...and suddenly they have an incredible (if not fleeting) very high sex drive, where they can't get enought, and turn them down JUST ONCE in any manner that even *remotely resembles *the way they've turned us down COUNTLESS times, and the level of butt hurt they feel and display is off the charts.
> 
> ...


awsome!:smthumbup:


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## Cherry (Sep 23, 2009)

Trenton said:


> When I was prego my husband would rub my feet every day (yes, after working 60 hour weeks)...ohhhh bliss! When I asked him why he was so exceptionally nice he said that I was carrying his baby and it's the only way he knew to show gratitude. He also made cute little lists. When I miscarried I still vividly remembering him asking the doctor if we'd ever be able to have another child and if we did could it hurt me in any way. He's always, always been so concerned about my well being.
> 
> Sorry but if I guy I've married and am having children with doesn't recognize what I'm going through and isn't in it with me and feels that he gave me a baby and that's, that...Gods...I pity the fool
> 
> ...


Well put. And you reminded me of our pregnancy... My H spent the first 8 months absolutely doting on me, it was so much fun.. he treated me like an absolute princess! And then when they were born, and I slipped into a coma for 10 days, my H was there every single night... He literally wore out a pair of shoes running around that hospital trying to find out if/when his wife and babies could go home. And when I did just miraculously wake up on that 10th day.. my H was there in tears. 

And then there were new babies and resumed drinking and yes, lack of sex and attention towards my H.. taking care of two babies is hard. I exhausted that excuse and he sought the attention he craved elsewhere. We ended up in divorce and then marriage counseling (yes, that order). There were a lot of excuses I used over the years... And my H tried to meet me at every one with a solution, if there was one. 

I get what the OP is saying though, and so long as its similar to what Tall Average Guy explained (page X of 23+) how it happens in their marriage and the whole two day fuss. This continues to be somewhat of a struggle in our marriage, but like I said earlier, my H seems to meet my "excuses" with a solution.. and he just helped me eliminate my excuse that life sucked because I wasn't a SAHM.. I am now (2 weeks now)... So we shall see how this effects my drive. 

And I'm with you Trenton.. if someething is creating stress longterm.. life is too short.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Michie said:


> My husband does not complain, since he not gone without sexual contact for more then week in the 12 years we have been together.
> 
> However, when we/I/him do slip, pulling the selfish, it must be me, why are treating me this way, is the most undesirable bit of behavior a man possesses. Its the absolute killer of sexual closeness. Treating your wives and girlfriends like giant vaginas that you need to fill to feel "loved" is BS.
> 
> Again my point was the man then taking a situation as presented above and turning in on himself, maybe its not you, stop supposing it is and maybe invest the time your trying to get laid and use it to why your wife/gf doesn't want to.


 Oh my - when I read threads like this, I just want to scream, pull my hair out...







......It near pains me to read some of this stuff...I get very emotional, so much I want to share.... because it slaps ME in the face...my regrets as a wife..

But unlike your husband Michie, mine HID how he was feeling, put a bushel on his desire ...he stuffed, silently suffered to appease me....I was oblivous to his pain, he started feeling less loved -I was so into our babies (6 total, but 5 in 10 yrs).......he was so very very sensitive to my Desire for him, that he would not bother me if he felt I was not into him. Basically ....I took my husband for granted. I would give anything (cried a river over this)....to re-live those years. I was not too tired, I was just not AWARE, I wasn't "getting it"....since I never felt "deprived" of his love, his wanting me, sex at my beck & call, I never had that "thirsting in the desert" feeling that sooooo sooooo soooo many men struggle through in their marriages. God bless those who are Faithful. 

Not sure how your husband is outside of the bedroom, but mine treated me like a Queen, loved me , held me, listened to me -and never expected-when he was antsy -burning with desire. Was this right -HELL NO!! I had every right to KNOW -TO HEAR how he was feeling inside-he should have whined -pi$$ed & moaned about it. Damn him! Then I would have had a chance to DO something about it, I would have never wanted him to suffer like that. Just sucking up to us women is not the answer either. 

You know the closest thing I ever came to resenting him was -because he HID his pain from me. He told me how he used to wake up with raging erections & just wanted them to go away, like they were a scourge to his body...he wanted his drive for me to just DIE..... I only recall one time him asking me for a hand job... he shared how hard that was to do that morning, asking me to touch him...because he was so "in need"... ya know...I CRIED hearing that -even now as I write. It just wasn't right, I was his wife, I should have been *his comfort*, he was always so damn good to me. 

Here I thought we had the perfect marraige... he was happy.... while he was stuffing feeling less loved by me, feeling he was a "burden" to me...a slow silent resentment growing underneath... every woman must understand how this affects our men....if you feel he is a burden -trust me, Resentment is already building. I give you MY story to show the other side...if your husband didn't say anything to you, but did what you ask in your opening post -this would never erase his pain. You may feel good, but he will still have that insatiable longing within...frustrated, like a punching in the gut...(PAIN THIS IS )...which will rob him of his emotions & vulnerabilty towards you as well. 

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/sex-ma...l-etc-how-robs-us-intimacy-we-crave-most.html

Then I got hit with the sex drive increase- OVERDRIVE is an understatment ~ I wanted it 3 times a day! If anyone knows what it is like to be on the other side-- it is yours truly. I was nothing like my husband, I wanted sex & I was gonna get it - I was not a silent sufferer, it felt like torment to not be able to touch him, thank God he wanted that ! Or I think I would have went stark raving MAD. 

Donny64 is so damn right with his words here >>>


> *Donny64 said*: Yet take that same woman, whose hormones are going crazy during pregnancy, a change of life, or what have you...and suddenly they have an incredible (if not fleeting) very high sex drive, where they can't get enought, and turn them down JUST ONCE in any manner that even remotely resembles the way they've turned us down COUNTLESS times, and the level of butt hurt they feel and display is off the charts.


When the shoes hit MY FEET, OM freaking G, I cried a river, because I suddenly realized, after I blew this subject wide open with my husband, how he suffered - FOR ME, putting himself down. I could have never done it ! Never. 

I am so convinced... (expecially since I was never LD to begin with)...that countless women do not understand, can not comprehend....how MEN feel overwhelmingly loved through SEX, love making, our affection & yeilding to them in the physical. I cared more about reading a book at night, or had the baby inbetween us. :banghead::banghead::banghead:

If you love & cherish the man you married... If he has been a GOOD MAN... Don't make the mistakes I did...you may not be as lucky as me -when your time of need comes upon you (if it does) -he may be so full of resentment, he will revel in your getting "paid back" for how you pushed him away. 

Your husband is crying out to you...it may be unbecoming at times...because he is speaking out of his HURT, his pain, rejection is a continual slice to the







... please be careful to "get this"...how many of us lash out when we are hurt and say mean things??? Men are no different. You did say he doesn't complain in your opening line, that it is not his fault. 

Realize, sexual intimacy is the 1 act he can only get FROM YOU, the woman he chose to marry, to love & cherish for life....... you have no idea how much this hurts him when you express he sees you as "just a Vagina", that it is all about sticking it in a hole, getting laid calling his emotions BS.....you might as well spit in his face....seriously, this is trampling his feelings into the ground. ....If I ever uttered those words to my husband, he would have never touched me again. Thank God I never felt that way. 

When was the 1st time you felt "USED" by a man... was it in dating, was it with him? Where does this come from? When you do come together, is it Making Love or is he a selfish lover, getting off & not caring about your needs? 

I would think those who struggle with feeling USED....discarded sexually....by ex Bfs/ lovers.... that these experiences & the emotions attached to them....could re-surface & be carried into marraige ...similar to a woman who's been raped...or sexually abused, how she struggles to feel every man after - may have similar intentions, it is a war in the mind. Some things can not be erased from the psyche. Possible ?? 

This song likely expresses your husbands deep emotions in wanting to hold, caress and take his wife to the heights of pleasure ...when we FEEL this way, we just can't lay it down.... It is near impossible. 

Bryan Adams - Please Forgive Me - YouTube

Some of the words....



> Please forgive me, I know not what I do
> Please forgive me, I can't stop loving you
> Don't deny me, this pain I'm going through
> Please forgive me, if I need you like I do
> ...


NOW this Expresses a Good husband's heart -in relation to Sex ...making love, hear it today. 

Please take the time to read this :

 Sex is an Emotional NEED...Male sexuality is a central part of who he is as both a man and a husband

If you care to please your husband & make him the happiest man alive -because he has been GOOD to you , you appreciate all that he brings to your life & family...I think this is your answer...so much lies in our attitudes, enthusiam for pleasing our partners, a spirit of "giving" -because of how much we love >>>

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/sex-ma...allowing-our-partner-turn-us-love-making.html


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## accidentalfeminist (Aug 30, 2012)

Toffer said:


> accidentalfeminist said:
> 
> "That's what I take objection to: the generalizations"
> 
> ...


Lol. Are you saying that men in the workplace have to sometimes fix others' mistakes and work with people they dont like but women dont experience those things when they are in the workplace? Because thats the statement I was replying to. Its not a generalization to point out that men and women experience many if not all of the same challenges while working outside the home. Its just fact.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## strugglinghusband (Nov 9, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> Oh my - when I read threads like this, I just want to scream, pull my hair out...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


:iagree::iagree:

S/A for president!

the part about being a good man, the pain of rejection, sometimes it makes you question yourself and you wonder 
"I must not be a good man" and thats very sad


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

Trenton said:


> <sarcasm> Really? You especially value women's input on these boards if the align with your own? That definitely leaves you open for new understanding and growth and definitely doesn't leave you open to automatically like something based upon the poster rather than the material posted. </sarcasm>


I reply to this once more now that SA has posted.

Do you get it now? SA and creted2write are FAR more articulate than any of the men who have posted so far. I'm glad she's chimed in because she's able to explain it in a way that I simply can't.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> If you love & cherish the man you married... If he has been a GOOD MAN... Don't make the mistakes I did...you may not be as lucky as me -when your time of need comes upon you (if it does) -he may be so full of resentment, he will revel in your getting "paid back" for how you pushed him away.


I'm working on not being too full of resentment, and recently I'm really getting there.

For me the huge blow up happened a few months ago. My wife has a huge cycle with her drive. Crazy in the middle and little for 2 weeks. It's getting more crazy in the middle now and she wants it WAY more than I want it. Fortunately not more than I'm capable of so far.

Every time she wanted I got myself in the mood. I wasn't going to do that to her - I wouldn't leave her wanting.

Then she shoots me down two weeks later. That sent me rather apoplectic. It took a while, but she is really getting it now. Yeah, I really will get myself in the mood regardless of what's swirling around in my mind. If I'm physically capable, I will do it _for her as often as she wants_. And if I'm not, my hands and tongue are hers. She wasn't really ready to believe that I simply didn't think it was appropriate to deny your spouse their sexual desire and I wouldn't let my mood get in the way.


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## SprucHub (Jan 13, 2012)

that_girl said:


> OH. Ok. lol. Good, then. You have a lot of anger goin on, no? LOL That's just how I read that. I was like, "Dang! That boy needs a drink and needs to talk to his wife!!"
> 
> Carry on.


Actually TG, Toffer got my W pretty much down to a tee. The only thing that he was off on was the shoes thing - she doesn't have too many. And I am never "not in the mood" to do the dishes or pick someone up or wakeup for a screaming child. I get to hear how stressful it is that she wants to go to the beach but the girls need naps.

There is a lot of anger, but mostly sadness. But, it's becoming indifference. 

Funny thing is I have talked to her and she thinks she is making great strides to be more affectionate (read affectionate, not sexual). She is now at about 25% of what would pass for adequate affection and demonstrated love and respect.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Trenton said:


> Do you really think that women who disagree with other women will listen to them more than they will a man they disagree with?
> 
> I can tell you that I won't.


Is that really so hard to imagine? If someone is making an argument, and someone who you feel better understand's your position agrees with that argument, are you saying you don't listen a bit closer to see if you are missing something? If you don't, then you are one of the very few who don't.



> Logic, reasoning and emotion tell me that:
> 
> 1. A woman or man who is LD and refuses sex from her man/his woman to the point where she/he is not having sex with him/her except once or twice a month, year or decade is lacking a connection to her husband/wife and has a lot to work on.


I absolutely agree. I think that in this scenario, both the HD and LD spouse have work to do.



> 2. A woman or man who believes a woman or man should put out once she/he is married to a man/woman and is guilty of something if she/he doesn't is narrow minded and has to work on herself/himself and her/his ability to connect with their partner on equal terms.


Not sure. I married my wife with the expectation that she would have sex with me. I do think that because we got married she generally should want to have sex with me. If she decided she does not want to, I need a reason why. Not being in the mood just won't cut it.



> 3. A man does contribute to a pregnancy but absolutely does not produce a baby. heh


No argument. I suspect if the poster arguing that hadn't started off insulting men left and right, she would have gotten a lot better response.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

If your idea of commitment is that you will act like a loving spouse only when you happen to feel like it and only when you have nothing better to do and only when everything in your life is rosy and you feel your partner "deserves" it, stay single. That's no commitment at all. Would you go into massive debt and enter into a business partnership with someone who would only come to work when they felt like it? Pay bills only when they felt like it? Steal from the company whenever they felt like it? Would you go into battle with a "partner" who may or may not have your back? I fed my kids every day. I went to work every day. I do my husband thing every day. Not because I always "feel" like it but because that's the promise I made. I don't need anyone to explain to me that kids and dogs get hungry. I don't need an owner's manual to know my wife is a human being and deserves to be treated like one. If I treated her with cruelty, it wouldn't be her fault because she didn't whimper enough. It'd be my fault. Just in case there actually are clueless types in this world, people are social creatures. They need to feel loved. Normally functioning adults need sex. People eat. If you are wearing a ring and callling yourself a husband or a wife but you aren't attending to your spouse's basic needs, you are a damned fraud. If you want to act like you're single, get an attorney and make yourself single. If you want to continue to be married, get with the program and behave like what you purport to be.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

accidentalfeminist said:


> Lol. Are you saying that men in the workplace have to sometimes fix others' mistakes and work with people they dont like but women dont experience those things when they are in the workplace? Because thats the statement I was replying to. Its not a generalization to point out that men and women experience many if not all of the same challenges while working outside the home. Its just fact.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


No, I am just pointing out that you made a general statement too after climbing all over someone else for doing it.

You have also attempted to put words in my mouth wih your reply when my reply consisted almost entirely of your words!


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> Is that really so hard to imagine? If someone is making an argument, and someone who you feel better understand's your position agrees with that argument, are you saying you don't listen a bit closer to see if you are missing something? If you don't, then you are one of the very few who don't.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This

Plus: She married me with the expectation that I would not look for sex with another.

Her expectations were met


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

unbelievable said:


> If your idea of commitment is that you will act like a loving spouse only when you happen to feel like it and only when you have nothing better to do and only when everything in your life is rosy and you feel your partner "deserves" it, stay single. That's no commitment at all. Would you go into massive debt and enter into a business partnership with someone who would only come to work when they felt like it? Pay bills only when they felt like it? Steal from the company whenever they felt like it? Would you go into battle with a "partner" who may or may not have your back? I fed my kids every day. I went to work every day. I do my husband thing every day. Not because I always "feel" like it but because that's the promise I made. I don't need anyone to explain to me that kids and dogs get hungry. I don't need an owner's manual to know my wife is a human being and deserves to be treated like one. If I treated her with cruelty, it wouldn't be her fault because she didn't whimper enough. It'd be my fault. Just in case there actually are clueless types in this world, people are social creatures. They need to feel loved. Normally functioning adults need sex. People eat. If you are wearing a ring and callling yourself a husband or a wife but you aren't attending to your spouse's basic needs, you are a damned fraud. If you want to act like you're single, get an attorney and make yourself single. If you want to continue to be married, get with the program and behave like what you purport to be.


I double like this post!


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

larry.gray said:


> I'm working on not being too full of resentment, and recently I'm really getting there.


:smthumbup:



> Every time she wanted I got myself in the mood. I wasn't going to do that to her - I wouldn't leave her wanting.


 Good husbands are like that .... and likewise, so are good wives. 



> Then she shoots me down two weeks later. That sent me rather apoplectic.


 I'd feel the same, then we hate ourselves for "loosing it" --but damn it -it's not fair, is it [email protected]#$%^& 

When one is such a GIVER..... it sure as hell helps to be married to another GIVER. 

I personally think I would be too much of a S of a B to live with if my husband didn't like sex, he never even refused me & I still got bent out of shape....getting all emotional thinking he didn't desire me anymore, when he couldn't keep up. I'd make a horrible man with very little patience in this area. Thank God for some Viagra & Stiff Nights I say !! His sweet attitude was... so long as he could get it up, he wanted to USE it - music to my ears ! 



> Yeah, I really will get myself in the mood regardless of what's swirling around in my mind. If I'm physically capable, I will do it _for her as often as she wants_. And if I'm not, my hands and tongue are hers. She wasn't really ready to believe that I simply didn't think it was appropriate to deny your spouse their sexual desire and I wouldn't let my mood get in the way.


You are living the lessons /the truth/ the wisdom in that thread I did ....about....Allowing our partners to turn us on to Love Making

Ya know, I don't feel women realize the easy end of the stick we are on...... if men aren't in the mood or nervous in the act, it ain't going UP ....*Performance Pressure *can be grueling. I've seen my husband struggle to please me -because he is such a good man, then I would feel bad...

Men slowly loose Testosterone as they age, more for some than others. He never turned me down, even when it struggled to go UP....I have yet to read too many stories of love like that on this forum . My husband is a Gem... I helped him through it very nicely of course... His test levels were approx 200 points lower than other men his age, so the Encron told us, but it never slowed us down. 

So all younger wives...I say...Revel in the delight of your husband's sweet desire NOW while it is there for the taking. He is in "HIS PRIME" sexually .....someday the tables may turn on you...(unless you are on meds to suppress it)....you may get a fierce taste of that lustful antsyness & longing -you too, won't be able to lay it down... it will make you aggressive, cranky & highly emotional. And you'll find yourself saying "OMG, how did you contain this all those years?" ...the light bulb will finally go on










Best to Trust our husbands and their words to us RIGHT NOW, some are better commuicators than others ,but it doesn't mean one loves less or feels less in this area. 

****** Also...for every wife who feels strongly on the other side, that he needs to give me my peace, leave me alone, he shouldn't need sex more than once a week.... 

Where do you line up in these examples ....of understanding the hurt...

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/sex-marriage/39526-five-cases-refusal-what-really-means-refused.html



> *Sawney Beane said*: I said I felt that the key was the phrase "if they know they are hurting them deeply". The refusing partner either is, or is not, aware of the hurt this causes.
> 
> I could see five situations around this.
> 
> ...


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

Michie said:


> Excuse me, what?
> 
> 
> Sometimes that may just be physically impossible.
> ...


Moods _are_ within our control. Yeah, we can be tired, and that's fine every once in a while. But even when we're tired, both spouses should be able to "put themselves" in the mood to be there for their spouse, emotionally, sexually...whatever. That's what marriage is, and since life will never cease to make us tired and sore and cranky, we must not allow it to dictate how we respond to the person we love.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

accidentalfeminist said:


> Harder? Says who? I'm pretty sure women who work experience the same things, and work for the same reasons...not sure why the differentiation between men who work and women who work... (strangely assuming the mom is the child-rearer)
> 
> Please, tell me more about what a great wife you are to give sex whenever he wants it even while working full-time and raising your children. Oh, wait....nevermind. You actually haven't lived this life, you just THINK you will be better than the rest of us.


Just stating my opinions. You don't have to agree with them.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

accidentalfeminist said:


> This assumes that every husband is an "honest man." What if he's not? Is there such a thing as a husband who is not "deserving" of sex from his wife? That's what I take objection to: the generalizations. The assumption that if you're married, you now and forevermore DESERVE sex from your spouse, just because you want it. It's such an attitude of selfish entitlement. If your spouse doesn't want it, why would you? I don't see the lure of having sex with someone who'd rather not at the time. That is "using". Of course, ideally, every couple would be in sync emotionally and spiritually and they'd both "want" it at the same time every time. Realistically, though, sometimes one will and the other won't. That does not have to be a big deal, really. There is so much more to marriage.


If a wife is in a relationship with a _dis_honest man, she can ignore everything we're all saying then. But since this conversation has been about people who do love their spouses, my point stands.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

unbelievable said:


> *If your idea of commitment is that you will act like a loving spouse only when you happen to feel like it and only when you have nothing better to do and only when everything in your life is rosy and you feel your partner "deserves" it, stay single.* That's no commitment at all. Would you go into massive debt and enter into a business partnership with someone who would only come to work when they felt like it? Pay bills only when they felt like it? Steal from the company whenever they felt like it? Would you go into battle with a "partner" who may or may not have your back? I fed my kids every day. I went to work every day. I do my husband thing every day. Not because I always "feel" like it but because that's the promise I made. I don't need anyone to explain to me that kids and dogs get hungry. I don't need an owner's manual to know my wife is a human being and deserves to be treated like one. If I treated her with cruelty, it wouldn't be her fault because she didn't whimper enough. It'd be my fault. Just in case there actually are clueless types in this world, people are social creatures. They need to feel loved. Normally functioning adults need sex. People eat. If you are wearing a ring and callling yourself a husband or a wife but you aren't attending to your spouse's basic needs, you are a damned fraud. If you want to act like you're single, get an attorney and make yourself single. If you want to continue to be married, get with the program and behave like what you purport to be.



:smthumbup::smthumbup::smthumbup:


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

accidentalfeminist said:


> You could also say that "always" is the seed that grows into the tree of "rape." If you think that NOT having sex when you want it causes resentment, try putting yourself in the shoes of someone who "has" to give sex whenever their partner wants it no matter what. Neither extreme is healthy.


Of course not. But I don't see too many people advocating to plant the seed of rape as you so non-confrontationally put it.

That is why this is such a volitile issue. HD spouses who have been shut out are hurt that a list of pretty common everyday occurances justify their spouse refusing sex. Personally, I struggle to think of a day when when of those things does not happen.

The flip side is the LD spouse who feels that they are never allowed to put sex aside while dealing with the big stresses in life. While never personally being there, I can understand and empathize.

I don't see much benefit in trying to argue the one sides resentment is worse or more justified than the others.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Created2Write said:


> If a wife is in a relationship with a _dis_honest man, she can ignore everything we're all saying then. But since this conversation has been about people who do love their spouses, my point stands.


Let me speak for myself here too.... I have not read all of these pages, this thread is like a wild fire out of control ....

I am ONLY speaking of GOOD husbands in my posts... husbands who have shown they love, cherish, they are attentive to their wives emotional needs, they are decent fathers, they listen, help, and show respect to their wives... but Yep--they got a raging sex drive and they want more in the sack. They get a little out of hand once in a while expressing this. 

How long does a BJ take ...a willing hand job... A couple times a week- if you want to forgo the intercourse... if you plan for the am... wake him up under the covers, just imagine the  you'll put on his face before he leaves for work ......he will feel abundantly loved & satisfied -he will squeeze you a little tighter when he kisses you-before hitting the door - and have you on his mind all day. 

A sexually satisfied man is a HAPPY man. 

We can all make the time -when we genuinelly care about our spouses.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

Rape? If my wife attends to my sexual needs even though she may not magically "feel" like it, that's not rape. It's just her putting her needs second and mine first (assuming that would ever happen). In the same vein, every time I trudge off to work or do some task for my wife even though I don't feel like it, I'm not a slave, I'm acting like a husband. If a woman breastfeeds her infant even though she doesn't feel like it, is the infant committing assault? If you want to be master of your own body at all times, stay single. When I agreed to be a husband, I agreed that my body would be shared. My body goes to work and earns wages to support my wife and family. My body is used to help my wife, comfort my wife, protect my wife, pamper my wife, not when I feel like it, but when she needs it...and yes, my body attends to her sexual needs. I agreed to do so when I got married. If it's not my place to take care of her, who's is it? Where is this magical universe where people get to do only what they feel like doing?


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

SimplyAmorous said:


> How long does a BJ take ? A couple times a week- if you want to forgo the intercourse... if you plan for the am... wake him up under the covers, just imagine the  you'll put on his face before he goes out to work ...he will feel loved & satisfied -he will squeeze you a little lighter when he kisses you for work too.
> 
> We can all make the time -when we genuinelly care about our spouses.


awww i used to do this when i was partnered up it's such a loving gesure and really amps up the appreciation you get from your partner


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

ScarletBegonias said:


> awww i used to do this when i was partnered up it's such a loving gesure and really amps up the appreciation you get from your partner


I dare every naysaying wife on here to try it for a week or 2... then come back and post how their husbands reacted, if any changes take place in their marriages... But *attitude* is everything. 

And we CAN adjust our attitude if we so desire... for instance: 

I find myself in this postion when my kids want me to play monopoly, I hate this game, the time it takes.. .sometimes I just get so bored, I throw myself on the floor and say "I can't take it anymore"...yeah -this is really being a Pi$$y baby...but I've done it -just to get out of playing that stupid game . 

Do I have to act like -heck NO... I have the ability to put on a , realize this is MY time with MY children, to not waste these moments, and rev my engine to act like a child for an hour to benefit THEM. And you know what, I never regret that -when I do. 

IN this same way, we can give this to our husbands, a game of monopoly takes a site longer than getting a man to orgasm! 

It's all about attitude...and never forget showing some


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

If most wives were completely honest, they'd admit that 95% of their husband's time was spent for the benefit of someone other than himself. He shouldn't have to wait until he reaches heaven to get a little reward.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I dare every naysaying wife on here to try it for a week or 2... then come back and post how their husbands reacted, if any changes take place in their marriages... But *attitude* is everything.
> 
> And for CAN adjust our attitude if we so desire... for instance:
> 
> ...


Yup!

Sex is also very empowering. In a good way. It empowers both individuals to get to know the really intimate, secrets parts of the other person...and I don't even mean physically. Emotionally. Spiritually. Mentally. Personality. Sex is also great for self-reflection. And when I see just how pleased my husband is when I have sex with him, it helps to know that it wasn't the physicality that made him happy...it was _me_, his wife.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Sex is like money in a marriage.

Sometimes both people want to buy something.
Sometimes the wife spends some money on herself
Sometimes the husband spends some money on himself.
Sometimes the wife spends some money on her husband
Sometimes the husband spends some money on his wife.

I would find it strange if we had to both be in the mood, always, at the same time, to spend some money.


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## ScaredandUnsure (Nov 17, 2011)

FrenchFry said:


> I hate to be a nay-sayer...
> 
> But it didn't work in my relationship. It made him a more greedy, more entitled and overall a bigger douchelord. Plus it made me cranky because while it's sooo easy for me to give him an orgasm, he uses an excuse that because it takes *slightly* more work to return the favor, I don't love him enough.
> 
> ...


Yep, my ex husband ran wild with my offers of BJ's. Would give him one, he'd roll over and go to sleep. 4 times a week. While I still give BJ's to my partner, I refuse to go that route again.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

FrenchFry said:


> I hate to be a nay-sayer...
> 
> But it didn't work in my relationship. It made him a more greedy, more entitled and overall a bigger douchelord. Plus it made me cranky because while it's sooo easy for me to give him an orgasm, he uses an excuse that because it takes *slightly* more work to return the favor, I don't love him enough.
> 
> ...


I did give a post above that one -clarifying everything I say...I am meaning *GOOD men*....those who have consistently shown love, are attentive to their wives emotional needs, they are decent fathers, they listen, help, and show respect ..... 

When Unbelievable made this comment


> If most wives were completely honest, they'd admit that 95% of their husband's time was spent for the benefit of someone other than himself.


 I could speak this about MY husband... he is that wonderful ....and still I cheated him in the past..I was the one who could have done *more*... I know I am not alone. 

I am speaking to those wives. 

I realize not all men are like this -and it is never good to take someone for granted.... I ought to know , as I'm guilty myself to some degree!

My husband never even asked me for BJ - in our entire marraige ,for goodness sakes, he would have died & went to heaven if I gave him one though! He is spoiled now and he still doesn't take advantage.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

FrenchFry said:


> It's funny, I can always feel when the momentum has shifted towards him seeing me as a subject in his kingdom rather than the Rasputin to his Nicholas.
> 
> Now that I get it, I enjoy the dynamic but it's something to be mindful of when I start getting the urge to give give give.


Probably every relationship has one who is tilted as more of a Giver....Not to put myself down but my husband is surely MORE of the giver in our marraige, he might not agree right now, and he is so darn humble -he might not agree at all - which is totally silly to me...cause our kids surely would ! 

Noone should be left feeling taken advantage of, this too can cause resentment. 

That is great that you "get it " though...and still care. :smthumbup: BUt yeah, *HE* needs to care too - how you are feeling, absolutely - his seasoning that with some appreciation, some gratitude with you satifying him, keeping him Mr. Happy.


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## romantic_guy (Nov 8, 2011)

Michie said:


> Dear Husbands/LT Boyfriends.
> 
> 
> Sometimes if not most of the time, we aren't secretly angry, or making you suffer for something you did earlier or didn't do.
> ...


This thread has grown so much and I have not read all of the replies, so I quote the OP to get back to the main post. I think it was a GREAT post!! I have two points:

1. Do I want my wife to pretend? Not really, but she can still have sex with me even if she does not really feel like it. I don't need her to pretend she wants it; she can be perfectly honest and say, "I am not really into it tonight, but you can go ahead." There are times that she starts sex in "neutral" but ends up in "overdrive." That is because, as a woman with "responsive desire" she often starts not feeling like it, but ends up really wanting it and having a great orgasm. 

I came across this quote in the book, "The Couple Checkup" (great book BTW)

"About 80 percent of married couples report that the husbands want sex more than the wives do, but some researchers believe this may have more to do with the fact that our culture tends to define desire by the initiation of sex. Debra Taylor and Michael Sytsma found that women experience a receptive type of sexual desire that is triggered once sexual activity begins. They claim that most women will respond positively to sexual advances; they are just biologically less likely to think about it in the first place."

(©2008 David Olson Ph.D.;Amy Olson-Sigg;Peter J. Larson Ph.D, Thomas Nelson Publishing)

2. There must be times that I put my desires aside and "...let us cuddle at your chest and doze off in the secure feeling of warmth and happiness and gratefulness that you'll be there when our eyes open, that you smell like home and that what we need." I actually enjoy that as well. My wife has chronic pain and simply cannot get past the pain enough to be able to have sex. BTW I love the way you worded that! 

I believe that it is a combination of both. There are times that my wife needs to go ahead anyway even thought she is not feeling like it and there are times that I just need to hold her, to reassure her that I am there for her, that I love her, that I am not going anywhere, that she will get though it, etc. It is all about meeting each others needs.


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## donny64 (Apr 21, 2012)

ScaredandUnsure said:


> Yep, my ex husband ran wild with my offers of BJ's. Would give him one, he'd roll over and go to sleep. 4 times a week. While I still give BJ's to my partner, I refuse to go that route again.


Well, your ex wasn't the brightest, was he?!!! :scratchhead: While my initial reaction after receiving a great bj (as I'm sure most men would love to do) is to just want to zonk out, I don't do it. If she doesn't want something in return (sometimes she doesn't and she does it just because she likes to do for me), then I will darn sure make certain I get my butt up, tease her, tickle her, laugh or tell jokes with her, hold her, watch tv with her, talk to her, etc., etc., etc. I "ramp up" my interaction to show my appreciation and to make it fun for her beyond just the "experience of giving it" to me. 

We (ok, maybe just I) had the most amazing night the other night. She stated a stong desire to give me a bj, and had been "craving it". She kept teasing me with it throughout dinner. Later after dinner, and during her very talented and enthusiastic bj, I kept attempting to reach down and "get her motor revving" and do something for her. She'd squirm away. I'd try again. She'd move away. I'd try again, I mean, I wanted her to have fun too and for it to not just be all about me!!!! She started to FORCEFULLY push me back and away, and kept at what she was doing (quite well and enthusiastically I might add). At one point she pushed me back, grabbed my hands and pinned them down on the couch by my sides while she continued without missing a beat. That whole experience was such an incredible turn on for me on a couple levels! One, she was "taking control". Two, she was obviously looking for nothing in return and just wanted to please me and was enjoying doing so. Both huge turn ons. 

Do you think I went to sleep after that?!!! I wanted to!!! :sleeping: But I didn't!  I gave her a smack on the butt or two and started rough housing with her a little bit, making her laugh, kissing her, some more playful teasing, after which we talked for a good long while and had some wine. THEN we went to bed to a peaceful sleep. 

AND I FELT LIKE A MILLION FREAKIN' DOLLARS, and have such a continued desire to show her how much she is appreciated it is hard to describe. She made me feel like a million bucks....I WILL return the favor, continually, in ways that she feels makes her feel like a million bucks. And I'm sure she'll continue with her efforts as well.

My god I love women who "get it". When you pair them with a guy who "gets it" as well, it is bliss for everyone.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

> *Romantic Guy quoted*: About 80 percent of married couples report that the husbands want sex more than the wives do, but some researchers believe this may have more to do with the fact that our culture tends to define desire by the initiation of sex. Debra Taylor and Michael Sytsma found that women experience a receptive type of sexual desire that is triggered once sexual activity begins. They claim that most women will respond positively to sexual advances; they are just biologically less likely to think about it in the first place."


 Absolutely true, due to Estrogen, Women overwhelmingly have the RECEPTIVE Sex drive and due to Higher levels of Testosterone, MEN have the more aggressive sex drive. 

Estrogen is the Marilyn Monroe in all of us, It gives women their curves, their softness...when in power, the females of every species signal "Take me, I'm yours" ... Estrogen scripts a woman into being willing and available but does not necessarily inspire her to initiate the act. That is Rambo's Job - as he's overloaded with Testosterone. 

I feel whomever has the higher drive needs to be the most arousingly "creative" to bring their partner to a place of wanting.....If a man can get her to "welcome" his touch, half the battle is already won.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> Absolutely true, due to Estrogen, Women overwhelmingly have the RECEPTIVE Sex drive and due to Higher levels of Testosterone, MEN have the more aggressive sex drive.
> 
> Estrogen is the Marilyn Monroe in all of us, It gives women their curves, their softness...when in power, the females of every species signal "Take me, I'm yours" ... Estrogen scripts a woman into being willing and available but does not necessarily inspire her to initiate the act. That is Rambo's Job - as he's overloaded with Testosterone.
> 
> I feel whomever has the higher drive needs to be the most arousingly "creative" to bring their partner to a place of wanting.....If a man can get her to "welcome" his touch, half the battle is already won.


:smthumbup:

Great post here.


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## Juicer (May 2, 2012)

Now I know I have no excuse to complain because I was rarely ever denied, but reading all these post reminded me of something.

I was hanging with some of my friends out in the man cave, having some fun just talking and making fun of eachother, and we start talking about each other's wives. 

Now (at the time) I loved my wife, and found her attractive. But I will say that my friends had wives that were drop dead beautiful. 
But then it was brought up how often we get sex. (Because how much fun is a Ferrari Enzo, if you are never allowed to drive it?)

Anyway, they rattle off numbers like, 1, 3, 6. 
And I won, hands down, at 10+ 

And I was probably the most satisfied and happy husband of that group there was.


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## ocotillo (Oct 17, 2011)

Trenton said:


> 3. A man does contribute to a pregnancy but absolutely does not produce a baby. heh


Well, yeah....

Given the fact that a single sperm weighs ~1.7*10^-11 grams and the average newborn weighs in the 6 to 8 pound range, it should be obvious that the raw materials have come from the woman's body. So her body did 'produce' the child in a very real sense. 

But the question of 'production' is a misconstruction of the original statement on this thread. Of course a man does not literally 'give' a woman a child. The statement is poetic and its use goes far back into antiquity, appearing in Ancient Hebrew and Greek both. 

Probably the most familiar example to people today is Rachel's statement to Jacob, 'Give me children or I shall die!' from the OT.


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## momtwo4 (May 23, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> I certainly don't want you to think you are less of a wife or a women because stressful days affect your sex drive. It certainly does for my wife and I understand that. Your needs are important and definitely need to be considered, and you should not just squash your emotions. What makes a great wife is one who balances that with my needs and our needs as a couple.
> 
> A bit ago, my wife and I had not connected in a couple of days. She had gotten a bit of a bug one evening, so begged off. No problem, we cuddled and enjoyed being close while I pampered her a tiny bit. The next night we were interupted by a kid, which put a damper on her mood. So the third night and I can tell she is just not feeling it. Nothing particularly bad happened that day, but her mood for sex was pretty blah, at least from her body language. So imagine my surprise when we get to bed and she starts some light kissing and touching. Then she asks me to give her a massage, and then things take off. After a great session, she turns to me and says "I am glad I let you start me up."
> 
> To me, that is a real wife and woman. One that recognizes when I am working to meet her needs and wants to try and meet mine. She does not need to get reved up everyday, but she makes sure that there is balance in the relationship, and is willing to work with me to make sure my needs are met as well as hers.


Thank you for sharing a balanced view.


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## momtwo4 (May 23, 2012)

Created2Write said:


> It's not about "feeling" ready. I can attest that I don't always "feel" ready. For me anyway, a lot of my readiness for sex comes from my mental and emotional state beforehand. Knowing that I might need to be warmed up to the idea, and my husband helps to get me to relax and unwind. Being willing to try is just as important as having that "feeling", imo.


I don't disagree with that. What I do disagree with is ALWAYS being in the right "mental and emotional state" for sex. While this might be the ideal, it is not the reality for me--especially with a household of kids. This does not mean that I habitually turn my husband away. But if I DO occasionally decline sex, it should not be a problem. And I do not need to feel guilty because I am not always 100% in the right mental state for sex.


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## momtwo4 (May 23, 2012)

Hicks said:


> It's not about being less of a wife, or some defect you have.
> 
> It's about setting up your LIFE so that you put a priority on accessing your sexuality above the many other things that destroy it. And its about understanding that doing this will bring you personal fulfillment more than the many other things you are spending your energy on...
> 
> The things that stress you out, bother you, your lack of libido, the worries you have... These are not "Immovable Structures" in your life. These are peices of furniture you have arranged in your life....You put them where they are. You put your worry beads in the LIVING room and stored your libido in the attic. What I am saying is you have every freedom in this world to arrange the furniture in a more marriage oriented way.


I get what you are saying, and I already have. My libido was in the attic for a long time (that's one of the reasons I came to this forum in the first place) and I have been making a strong effort to change that. 

What I'm realizing more and more is that I have a naturally low libido. It is just the way I am. That does not mean that I ignore my husband. It does not mean that we have sex once a month. (We have sex about 2-3 times a week). However, it does mean that there are times when I have to pass on sex. When I do decline, I remember that I need to make it up to him in the near future.

I did not place worry beads in my living room. I do have four children, though, that need my near constant attention. And I have a husband that needs love, support, and sexual fulfillment. I realize that. I believe a strong marriage develops from balance and compromise from both partners.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

momtwo4 said:


> I don't disagree with that. What I do disagree with is ALWAYS being in the right "mental and emotional state" for sex. While this might be the ideal, it is not the reality for me--especially with a household of kids. This does not mean that I habitually turn my husband away. But if I DO occasionally decline sex, it should not be a problem. And I do not need to feel guilty because I am not always 100% in the right mental state for sex.


oh goodness if I claimed to always be 100% in the mood for it i'd be a total liar lol

the best thing i've learned is to keep an open mind on allowing yourself to be coaxed and helped into the mood by the man who loves you


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

momtwo4 said:


> I get what you are saying, and I already have. My libido was in the attic for a long time (that's one of the reasons I came to this forum in the first place) and I have been making a strong effort to change that.
> 
> What I'm realizing more and more is that I have a naturally low libido. It is just the way I am. That does not mean that I ignore my husband. It does not mean that we have sex once a month. (We have sex about 2-3 times a week). However, it does mean that there are times when I have to pass on sex. When I do decline, I remember that I need to make it up to him in the near future.
> 
> I did not place worry beads in my living room. I do have four children, though, that need my near constant attention. And I have a husband that needs love, support, and sexual fulfillment. I realize that. I believe a strong marriage develops from balance and compromise from both partners.


From what you are posting here, I don't think you need to worry about being "less of a wife and a woman." :smthumbup:


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

momtwo4 said:


> I get what you are saying, and I already have. My libido was in the attic for a long time (that's one of the reasons I came to this forum in the first place) and I have been making a strong effort to change that.
> 
> What I'm realizing more and more is that I have a naturally low libido. It is just the way I am. That does not mean that I ignore my husband. It does not mean that we have sex once a month. (We have sex about 2-3 times a week). However, it does mean that there are times when I have to pass on sex. When I do decline, I remember that I need to make it up to him in the near future.
> 
> I did not place worry beads in my living room. I do have four children, though, that need my near constant attention. And I have a husband that needs love, support, and sexual fulfillment. I realize that. I believe a strong marriage develops from balance and compromise from both partners.


I agree totally. It's a two way street. Men need to adapt to their woman, and women need to adapt to their man. And you are doing a great job from what you have written. And no man would expect his wife to be in the mood constantly. And any wife who feels the need to reject her man which is totally acceptable and normal, can do so in a way that still makes him feel loved, special and important. Indicating "I'm just not in the mood, get over it" is harmful to the marriage. Indicating i'm not in the mood, but your needs are important to me and will not go unfulffilled very long and by the way you are a great husband" takes the very same amount of verbal energy to communicate and is productive to the marriage.

This whole notion of "being in the mood" and kids who demand attention is at issue also. If a woman views these things as "taking" from her, then her mindset will be that taking care of kids is a chore, having sex is a chore etc.

But, another way to look at these things are gifts you are receiving. You receive happiness from these things. If you view things this way, this also improves your state of fulfillment.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

The context of the notion that a man "gives" a woman a child is indeed ancient, and still a very prevalent idea today among some non-Westernized cultures and nations.

We're talking about enormously patriarchal societies, where women are defined largely by the fact that they are wives and mothers. A woman's entire existence would be based off her relationship to the men in her life, from first father, to later husband, and eventually son. A woman quite literally lived, and died, according to the quality of her relationships with men. So under these circumstances, yes, a man would be "giving" a woman everything, including her children. She couldn't just run out to the local sperm bank, have some random man's semen inserted, and decide to skip on down the road of single parenthood. Everything she had was "given", and her role was to be the grateful receiver.

But keep in mind that even within this cultural/social context, the term "give" was pretty interchangeable for men and women. It wasn't at all uncommon to hear a man talk about his wife "giving" him five healthy sons, for example.


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## Created2Write (Aug 25, 2011)

momtwo4 said:


> I don't disagree with that. What I do disagree with is ALWAYS being in the right "mental and emotional state" for sex. While this might be the ideal, it is not the reality for me--especially with a household of kids. This does not mean that I habitually turn my husband away. But if I DO occasionally decline sex, it should not be a problem. And I do not need to feel guilty because I am not always 100% in the right mental state for sex.


I don't think anyone has said that wives and husbands should "always" be in the mood for sex. Realistically speaking, it's not possible...even for a HD spouse. And there's absolutely nothing with occasionally saying no in a loving way. I'm sure that most of us here, if not all of us, have said no to our spouse at one time or other. What is being said is that, oftentimes, the occasional no _can_ become habitual. It's obviously not with you, so of course you shouldn't feel guilty. There's give and take in your relationship, and that's a good thing.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

MT4,
I have enjoyed your posts from the get go. You have a high level of self awareness, and paired with that a genuine commitment to your H. 

The bridge we built to cross the HD/LD chasm is made of:
- Understanding: We really do understand each other very well and understand how it feels to be the other. 
- Acceptance: I accept that she is LD just as much as she accepts that I am HD. I do not "resent" her composition, it is part of who she is. 
- Commitment: This is reflected by the compromise we have found. And our compromise means that because I don't grind her on frequency, she enjoys connecting with me. Sometimes that enjoyment is mainly emotional, sometimes it is highly sexual. Either way we both demonstrate a high level of focus on each others experience. 

The commitment is not to have a great sex life. The commitment is to have a great marriage and a strong, positive sex life is a key part of that. 




momtwo4 said:


> I get what you are saying, and I already have. My libido was in the attic for a long time (that's one of the reasons I came to this forum in the first place) and I have been making a strong effort to change that.
> 
> What I'm realizing more and more is that I have a naturally low libido. It is just the way I am. That does not mean that I ignore my husband. It does not mean that we have sex once a month. (We have sex about 2-3 times a week). However, it does mean that there are times when I have to pass on sex. When I do decline, I remember that I need to make it up to him in the near future.
> 
> I did not place worry beads in my living room. I do have four children, though, that need my near constant attention. And I have a husband that needs love, support, and sexual fulfillment. I realize that. I believe a strong marriage develops from balance and compromise from both partners.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

Looking back over the course of this conversation, one thing stands out the most to me:

This thread might be ground zero for bannings.


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## ocotillo (Oct 17, 2011)

momtwo4 said:


> I don't disagree with that. What I do disagree with is ALWAYS being in the right "mental and emotional state" for sex. While this might be the ideal, it is not the reality for me--especially with a household of kids.....


..And that is a good explanation of how everyone misunderstands each other and threads like this erupt like a volcano. 

On one hand, you have people whose spouses are never in the mood. Let's face it, the OP did not tell them anything they have not already heard ten thousand times and more. Some of them would be overjoyed with once or twice a week, but they're rebuffed with every excuse in the book.

And on the other hand, you have people whose spouses are in the mood all the damn time and the harsh criticism the OP receives strikes them as unfair. 

I don't know what the solution is, but I've watched this happen multiple times now :scratchhead:


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

I wasn't in the mood last night because it was so yucky hot and my husband smelled like day old BO. :lol: Normally, I don't mind, but with the heat, omg.

He wasn't in the mood last night because it was so yucky hot and he smelled like day old BO (worked hard yesterday around the yard in 103 heat), and was too tired to shower.

Whatever. We had a quicky before work yesterday morning.


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

jaquen said:


> Looking back over the course of this conversation, one thing stands out the most to me:
> 
> This thread might be ground zero for bannings.


It doesn't have to be. I'm pretty passionate about the subject but never got disrespectful. That's all it takes.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

I wasn"t in the mood this morning because I rubbed one out in the shower. then when I get out she wants some action. couldn't believe it but he rose to the occasion 5 min after well you get the drift. had to work for the second orgasm. But I felt like a stud after!


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

NICE! hahaha...

Why didn't you just try to get with your wife before the shower?

I tried the other morning...then our 3 year old c-block came running in with her "big cough".


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

that_girl said:


> NICE! hahaha...
> 
> Why didn't you just try to get with your wife before the shower?
> 
> I tried the other morning...then our 3 year old c-block came running in with her "big cough".


she a hard read in the morn.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

that_girl said:


> I wasn't in the mood last night because it was so yucky hot and my husband smelled like day old BO. :lol: Normally, I don't mind, but with the heat, omg.
> 
> He wasn't in the mood last night because it was so yucky hot and he smelled like day old BO (worked hard yesterday around the yard in 103 heat), and was too tired to shower.
> 
> Whatever. We had a quicky before work yesterday morning.


Loved reading this! :smthumbup:

My wife's been out of town for the better part of a week. I was looking forward to seeing her, and we were both looking toward some intimate time. She then told me that her cycle started earlier than expected, and her cramps were abominable, which pretty much eliminated even the slimmest chance of sex. Regardless, I'd wanted to get her a nice little romantic treat, and still went ahead with it. She came home to a little set up of red roses, candles, a card, some of her favorite sushi rolls, and a bottle of moscato. She was so moved, even as the pain washed over her in waves (my wife suffers from endometriosis, which makes her periods normally extraordinarily painful). I didn't pressure her at all, and resigned myself to the idea of no sex for a few more days.

Today she's in even more pain, so I go out and pick her up some pads, chocolate, and aleve. She'd actually managed to find a few old prescription strength naproxen, which took some of the edge off. Before I know it she's giving me those eyes, and asking in her super sweet, playful voice if we can have a little sex. Now we'd been cuddling already, and my solider was already standing at attention, so of course I was ready to go (though I was surprised). Even with her cramps, her very hard week of out of town work, and her vagina being totally off limits, we indulged in a couple of wonderful activities, and had a great, mind blowing time, with her having quite a few toe curling orgasms.

Moral of the story? You don't always need to wait for the "ideal" conditions. Be open to connecting sexually, no matter what is going on. It won't always work, sometimes the obstacles will prevent sexual connection, which is OK. But sometimes, if both of you stay open, you can find a little unexpected beauty among the ashes.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

jaquen said:


> Loved reading this! :smthumbup:
> 
> My wife's been out of town for the better part of a week. I was looking forward to seeing her, and we were both looking toward some intimate time. She then told me that her cycle started earlier than expected, and her cramps were abominable, which pretty much eliminated even the slimmest chance of sex. Regardless, I'd wanted to get her a nice little romantic treat, and still went ahead with it. She came home to a little set up of red roses, candles, a card, some of her favorite sushi rolls, and a bottle of moscato. She was so moved, even as the pain washed over her in waves (my wife suffers from endometriosis, which makes her periods normally extraordinarily painful). I didn't pressure her at all, and resigned myself to the idea of no sex for a few more days.
> 
> ...


Awwww I suffer from endo as well. Those cramps are CRIPPLING! Way worse than child labor. Ever since surgery, I have had NO PAIN!! First time in 19 years.  You are a good husband! My husband hated seeing me in pain. I couldn't even take meds that much because it made my jaw hurt (TMJ affected by so many things). Did you know that Costco has a generic "Naproxen"? 2 big bottles for 8 bucks!!  Also, if she hasn't read up on a diet/nutrition for endo, she should. I cut gluten out of my diet and was 80% painfree BEFORE my surgery. Just a thought. And limit caffeine. Gluten and caffeine are both inflammatories...makes endo way worse. They took an ovary and scraped a TON of lesions off my colon (and took a 7 pound endometrioma out) and it made SUCH a DIFFERENCE! (Endo can never be cured...just maintained..for those who may not know. Even a hysterectomy can't cure it, because the lesions on the organs will still swell up, tear away from the organs and bleed every month until menopause. It feeds on estrogen. My whole abdominal cavity was glued together with it  )

But my thing is...sometimes we just aren't in the mood. That is not time for a tantrum. That's when we just say what it is and laugh and talk about how old we are that we dont' want sex, and still spend time together...keep the flow going.

I can see if it was a regular situation that we weren't in the mood, then it would be a problem. But for us, it's not the usualy so when it happens, we don't get upset.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

that_girl said:


> Awwww I suffer from endo as well. Those cramps are CRIPPLING! Way worse than child labor. Ever since surgery, I have had NO PAIN!! First time in 19 years.  You are a good husband! My husband hated seeing me in pain. I couldn't even take meds that much because it made my jaw hurt (TMJ affected by so many things). Did you know that Costco has a generic "Naproxen"? 2 big bottles for 8 bucks!!  Also, if she hasn't read up on a diet/nutrition for endo, she should. I cut gluten out of my diet and was 80% painfree BEFORE my surgery. Just a thought. And limit caffeine. Gluten and caffeine are both inflammatories...makes endo way worse. They took an ovary and scraped a TON of lesions off my colon (and took a 7 pound endometrioma out) and it made SUCH a DIFFERENCE! (Endo can never be cured...just maintained..for those who may not know. Even a hysterectomy can't cure it, because the lesions on the organs will still swell up, tear away from the organs and bleed every month until menopause. It feeds on estrogen. My whole abdominal cavity was glued together with it  )


Thank you for all of this. Yes, I hate that she's in so much pain during her period. It's not easy to watch. I've done a decent amount of research into the condition, and how to ease some of her suffering.

Her cramps are actually worse now that she's more active. It's always been like that. Typically the pain for her is in the 6-7 range when she's sedentary, but if she's living an active life, with regular exercise, the pain is even worse. 

We're sort of at an impasse right now. She has a doctor now who believes in both a traditional western medical approach and a holistic/natural approach as well. He's given her some wonderful, all natural product recommendations for other things that have worked out well. She's about to order this product that he recommended to help with the pain.

I would love for her to go gluten free. I live basically 90% of my life gluten/wheat free, as I life a very low carbohydrate lifestyle. That's what works best for my body, and it does wonders for keeping me healthy, and is great for weight management. I also don't get sick, and haven't been sick in over half a decade. She doesn't enjoy the level of low carb that I live at, but I would like to see her approach her diet, which is a Weight Watchers approach but with a LOT of gluten and wheat, differently just so she can see what happens. It's funny that you said this, because I decided late last night to ask her to take up this approach for a month and see what happens.

I've also seen that some people got relief from acupuncture. We've got great insurance via my wife's job with NPR, and there is a possibility she could get covered for it. But she's very resistant. Despite her burgeoning appreciation for alternative medical practices, she's still very skeptical. She's been dealing with this for 21 years of her life so far, and I think she's beginning to believe that nothing will work.


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

unbelievable said:


> If your idea of commitment is that you will act like a loving spouse only when you happen to feel like it and only when you have nothing better to do and only when everything in your life is rosy and you feel your partner "deserves" it, stay single. That's no commitment at all. Would you go into massive debt and enter into a business partnership with someone who would only come to work when they felt like it? Pay bills only when they felt like it? Steal from the company whenever they felt like it? Would you go into battle with a "partner" who may or may not have your back? I fed my kids every day. I went to work every day. I do my husband thing every day. Not because I always "feel" like it but because that's the promise I made. I don't need anyone to explain to me that kids and dogs get hungry. I don't need an owner's manual to know my wife is a human being and deserves to be treated like one. If I treated her with cruelty, it wouldn't be her fault because she didn't whimper enough. It'd be my fault. Just in case there actually are clueless types in this world, people are social creatures. They need to feel loved. Normally functioning adults need sex. People eat. If you are wearing a ring and callling yourself a husband or a wife but you aren't attending to your spouse's basic needs, you are a damned fraud. If you want to act like you're single, get an attorney and make yourself single. If you want to continue to be married, get with the program and behave like what you purport to be.


:allhail:


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## ocotillo (Oct 17, 2011)

Trenton said:


> Hey now, I was just stating biological facts that were being stated by another poster but she was being put through the ringer.
> 
> If a man is in the relationship and committed and the couple plans for and works towards giving birth to a child, it is very much a couple thing and a beautiful, poetic, meaningful thing. When you have posters moaning about how they didn't want children but gave them to their wife anyway...well, that isn't that beautiful. No one was pointing that out but they couldn't help but insult the poster pointing it out. Why do you think?


My wife and I wanted children terribly and had a lot of trouble conceiving the first time, so I'd be a member of the choir on this one. 

I'd add that your second paragraph is a more eloquent indictment against reliance upon biological facts than I could ever have stated.


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## dallasapple (Jun 20, 2012)

Trenton said:


> Hey now, I was just stating biological facts that were being stated by another poster but she was being put through the ringer.
> 
> If a man is in the relationship and committed and the couple plans for and works towards giving birth to a child, it is very much a couple thing and a beautiful, poetic, meaningful thing. When you have posters moaning about how they didn't want children but gave them to their wife anyway...well, that isn't that beautiful. No one was pointing that out but they couldn't help but insult the poster pointing it out. Why do you think?


I could be the "female version of that" I was NOT ready to have a secnd child at 21 ..my husband begged me ..so I "had a child for him" under much pressure..

When he(our 2nd son) was born he(my husband ) kissed me and said thank you..

I still to this day dont think of "our son" as my "husbands child"..


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

My W's body reacts badly to a high level of gluten. 

Being totally gluten free was a bit tough for her because she had to give up so many favorite foods. That said, a low gluten diet seems to work very well for her. And for me. 





jaquen said:


> Thank you for all of this. Yes, I hate that she's in so much pain during her period. It's not easy to watch. I've done a decent amount of research into the condition, and how to ease some of her suffering.
> 
> Her cramps are actually worse now that she's more active. It's always been like that. Typically the pain for her is in the 6-7 range when she's sedentary, but if she's living an active life, with regular exercise, the pain is even worse.
> 
> ...


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Trenton said:


> SA is far more in favor of the male perspective than most women on these boards. That's not necessarily a bad thing but it is what it is and I know nothing about created2write but I do know SA has admitted previously to being biased to the male perspective and even more empathetic overall towards men. Because of that I'm not surprised that men find themselves desiring to hit the like button but, like I do to all posters, I read their threads one by one.


This is very true, I am admittedly biased towards *high drivers *in general...whether that be men or women....simply because I feel I have been on both sides of this issue.. when I was putting my kids before my husband..(heck projects too).... I felt happy & dandy, loving life, marriage was beautiful, I had the world at my feet -while he was suffering -questioning my love for him. Should have never happened. 

Then when I came into that "overwhelming feeling"- trading shoes with him (my drive raging)...... well... I ain't my husband, I would have wrecked a marraige over not getting enough sex...I would not live in resentment.... 

It was very difficult on me when I started to question *his desire.*...what a SINKING hurtful feeling this was... I let it get me down sometimes...I was comparing the reality of his Test levels, allowing this to speak to me...building this up in my mind ...you know us women can be emotional at times, then add PMS... Heaven help our men!!! I think my husband wanted to clobber me a handful of times. We had this amazingly growth in intimacy with my crazy questioning at the same time. 

So for me, I felt I had a real taste of what man men deal with on a daily basis and this is why I speak the way I do. I felt it was 10 times harder - hell 20 times - to be the one in want & dissed ( I wasn't even rejected, just imagining that was enough!)....over the one who could so easily spare 15 minutes a day to give /touch/ caress & move the others world to feeling amazingly loved. I can't see this ever changing in my mind &







, regardless of my sex drive...not after my experience..and how it has moved my husband. 

But yeah, maybe it is easy for me to say...my needs are always met.. he never lets me down, no resestment on my part....for wives who are dealing with that & hurtful behavior from their husbands -questioning HIS LOVE......it's just a whole nother animal to me...In those cases....he needs to get with the program & be thinking of his wife ~ fullfilling her too. Or she has a right to be holding out a little. Self examine ourselves & our roles 1st. 

Women need to feel loved, and men need to feel Respected (and I'll add "desired")...this fullfilles them. 

None of us are perfect though, when we miss it, we need to sincerely apologize, seek higher ground with our partners..... the







, the attitude, a willingness to give...it's worth gold in these issues of intimacy.. 

If there is a cycle to break here... it has to start with someone.


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Come to think of it I actually question this thread...

My wife has already on more than one occasion made me forget whatever the fk was on my mind that day and turned me into a starved bloodhound out for some "vigorousness"...

In the end, maybe there isn't any excuse...


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

OP..thank you for posting.

I used the letter as part of an e-mail as one of the final steps in my almost three year sexless recovery with my wife.. It helped her I'm sure. 

That along with a heartfelt letter to my wife did the final trick.
We will not be sexless another year.... good to go
Last of a series of recovery steps I instituted three years ago.
Look for a Marriage 2.0 thread in the future for play by play recovery tips.
Hope you don't mind if I use it to help others.


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## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

I just put up with it and pretend to enjoy it for his sake, Michie. Its still your job to make sure hes sexually satisfied, and whats it cost you? 15 or so minutes. 

Not in the mood is selfish, because even though your body isn't in the mood, his is. His wants something. His mood builds up, yours passes.


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

kipani said:


> I just put up with it and pretend to enjoy it for his sake, Michie. Its still your job to make sure hes sexually satisfied, and whats it cost you? 15 or so minutes.
> 
> Not in the mood is selfish, because even though your body isn't in the mood, his is. His wants something. His mood builds up, yours passes.


How often are you in the mood? Is it different?


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## 45188 (Sep 13, 2012)

ME? I'd say every few days for me, sometimes daily. Sometimes not for weeks, but I still put up with it if he wants it and even pretend to like it. I don't make him feel guilty or ashamed that he wants sex and I don't. Like I said, it costs me 15 minutes. He'll get frustrated.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Trenton said:


> Writing a letter to your spouse explaining that men need sex for an emotional connection and their wives owe them that, is the same.


Hmm, I think you and some others are kind of missing the point here.

Most HD people (at least most guys) don't feel their spouses owe them sex. However, we do expect that the presence of a satisfying sex life should be the default status of our marriages. And, no, those two concepts are not contradictory.

Let me put it this way. In marriage (as in the rest of life) there will be some distinctly good days, some distinctly bad days, and the more-or-less ordinary days (which are the the majority). The ordinary days are the ones where you live life - work and it's hassles, chores, kids and homework, etc.

Now, it's easy to see sex would happen on the good days and how sex would not happen on the bad days. But on those ordinary days, sex should be generally good as well. There are simply not enough notably good / stress free days to keep the fire burning. And, your attraction to your spouse should be enough to sway the mood in favor of sex.

IOW, too often the prevailing sentiment in the mind of the LD partner is "there needs to be a good reason to have sex". An extraordinary show is demanded; having an ordinary day of going to work, tending to home and kids, and spending a little time connecting non-sexually (sometimes that's all the time there is) is not enough.

The above-noted attitude needs to be adjusted to "there needs to be a good reason to NOT have sex; good sex should be the norm". If you are not disposed _towards_ sex - that lack of inclination is the problem.

So while sex is not owed, it should not have to be striven for either. An important part of that is making sure that (1) you are sexually compatible with your partner or (2) if you feel sex is for after marriage, you need to understand that you are committing yourself to provide cheerfully even if you decide later on that you really are not all that into him / her.


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Created2Write said:


> It's been a year since I took this clas, but basically...each person has a certain amount of DNA. The sperm that fertilizes the egg has exactly half(including what decides if the child is male or female), and the woman has half as well. There are ttwo strands of DNA in every human being. The man contributes one strand, the women contributes the other.


Yes, it's amazing how people forget there are 23 _pairs_ of chromosomes in every human being - one in each pair coming from each parent.


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

DTO said:


> Hmm, I think you and some others are kind of missing the point here.
> 
> *Most HD people (at least most guys) don't feel their spouses owe them sex. However, we do expect that the presence of a satisfying sex life should be the default status of our marriages. And, no, those two concepts are not contradictory.*Let me put it this way. In marriage (as in the rest of life) there will be some distinctly good days, some distinctly bad days, and the more-or-less ordinary days (which are the the majority). The ordinary days are the ones where you live life - work and it's hassles, chores, kids and homework, etc.
> 
> ...


:iagree:


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## Trying2figureitout (Feb 3, 2011)

kipani said:


> ME? I'd say every few days for me, sometimes daily. Sometimes not for weeks, but I still put up with it if he wants it and even pretend to like it. I don't make him feel guilty or ashamed that he wants sex and I don't. Like I said, it costs me 15 minutes. He'll get frustrated.


Thanks wtf is up with my wife?


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

The responses here are nothing short of ridiculous. Have puke all over you? Hop in the shower with me and fondle my balls. Got yelled at by your boss? To hell with that, screw me. Kids screaming? Lock them out of the bedroom and nail me. Have the flu? Give me a bj. If you don't, you don't love me and I will find sex elsewhere. 
Amazingly, the OP was called selfish. This place is nuts. Certifiable. :wtf:


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## Interlocutor (Dec 29, 2011)

DTO said:


> Hmm, I think you and some others are kind of missing the point here.
> 
> Most HD people (at least most guys) don't feel their spouses owe them sex. However, we do expect that the presence of a satisfying sex life should be the default status of our marriages. And, no, those two concepts are not contradictory.
> 
> ...


Quoting so that people have an example of the real point here is.


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## aribabe (Aug 9, 2012)

*I think i'd like to super "like" this post... :smthumbup:
*


Therealbrighteyes said:


> The responses here are nothing short of ridiculous. Have puke all over you? Hop in the shower with me and fondle my balls. Got yelled at by your boss? To hell with that, screw me. Kids screaming? Lock them out of the bedroom and nail me. Have the flu? Give me a bj. If you don't, you don't love me and I will find sex elsewhere.
> Amazingly, the OP was called selfish. This place is nuts. Certifiable. :wtf:


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> The responses here are nothing short of ridiculous. Have puke all over you? Hop in the shower with me and fondle my balls. Got yelled at by your boss? To hell with that, screw me. Kids screaming? Lock them out of the bedroom and nail me. Have the flu? Give me a bj. If you don't, you don't love me and I will find sex elsewhere.
> Amazingly, the OP was called selfish. This place is nuts. Certifiable. :wtf:


Wow. To borrow from Bill Maher, looks like someone forgot her Dramaquine.

No one said her husband would cut and run at the first missed orgasm. What we are saying is that a chronic lack of sex will damage the marriage.

Let's look at the rest of your statement. With the exception of the flu, demanding jobs, demanding kids, chores to do, etc. are all part of daily life. If each of those is a disqualifier for sex, how often would sex happen? Maybe on the weekends, and if you aren't too busy? Maybe now that you have kids he should give up sex as a legitimate request? Don't laugh - there are people who feel exactly that way.

My position is NOT that it's never okay to refuse sex. The problem I had with the OP and similar posts is that they convey a sense that it's okay to deprioritize sex in your day-to-day life. That attitude ignores the reality that such an attitude over the long term takes a big toll on the marriage.

Sometimes, an across-the-board devaluation is exactly what happens. Then you see some of:

* My child has baseball and gymnastics, and the PTA cannot function without me, so sex is not a priority and I don't care.
* I have other relationships too (extended family, friends). How can you suggest I put them on the back burner just so you can get your rocks off?
* We're older now, I don't have the physical ability I once did, and I am too old to have kids, so what's the point of sex?

I am not saying this will inevitably happen. But, having lived through it first-hand, I can absolutely say that long-term depriortization of sex does harm and kill marriages.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Bright,
We must be reading different threads. I stand by my initial response. 


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.
The reason I found the initial post so offensive is that it:
- Has a me, me, me flavor to it. This is not someone on a team, this is the star player explaining why all the valid reasons they have for causing their team mate distress. 
- Mixes up completely different things - fully controllable, less controllable, not controllable

Physical sickness is a protected category. Thats why the vows say in sickness and in health. 

Baby related stuff is in a gray area. Some amount of it is valid, and beyond that the baby has become the magic prop used to excuse any and all bad behavior by the mom. 

The list below reflects an interesting mindset that I believe to be part of a total cultural melt down. Assuming your partner consistently makes it clear that they find you attractive and are attracted to you, this list is pure narcissistic self indulgence: 
1. Forgot to shave (guess what - shaving is either important to you or not, if it is do it. don't use your lack of organization or planning as a valid "excuse" for making a desire imbalance worse)
2. Veins, crows feet - this is your issue - don't make it your partners
3. Weight problems - same thing - even more so if you are not actively working on it. If you have serious enough issues about your weight, focus on it. If not, don't hide behind this as yet another excuse. 

As for the boss yelling at you: If you messed up, you likely will feel bad. And if it is a rare event, and you really are upset and out of sorts it is ok to say "I made a mistake at work, got yelled at and feel bad about it. And I am really not in the mood tonight - I'm sorry if you are disappointed". 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michie 
Dear Husbands/LT Boyfriends.


Sometimes if not most of the time, we aren't secretly angry, or making you suffer for something you did earlier or didn't do.

Sometimes we are not just feeling it. It not your lack of skills, or lack of love play. We are just not in the mood. Be it hormones, or go damn forgetting to shave our legs. Sometimes we are not in the mood. Sometimes we just need to feel sexy to have sex, its got nothing to do with you.

Maybe the baby puked on us today, maybe we noticed weird veins in our theighs, or new laugh lines or crows feet. Maybe we are suffering from horrible cramps and migraines. Maybe we threw our back at work, or pushing the kids to the park today.

Maybe our boss yelled at us and made us feel 2 feet tall, maybe someone called us stupid and useless. Maybe we fought with our mom/dad. Maybe the kids drove us up the wall. Maybe every single on of these things happened at least once today.

Maybe its hard to feel desired when all you heard today was crying and whining, and you spent every freaking iota of affection on the children.

Maybe there has been no moments of peace or quiet.

Maybe we just want you to let us cuddle at your chest and doze off in the secure feeling of warmth and happiness and gratefulness that you'll be there when our eyes open, that you smell like home and that what we need.

Maybe we need you, ALL of you, not just your ****, and we understand that we are loved. Maybe we are more then just a set of sexual skills you enjoy.

Maybe we are not in mood tonight, but we love you more then anyone or anything in this life.

I mean really, do you want us to pretend?


Love forever,

your Wives/LT Girlfriends





Therealbrighteyes said:


> The responses here are nothing short of ridiculous. Have puke all over you? Hop in the shower with me and fondle my balls. Got yelled at by your boss? To hell with that, screw me. Kids screaming? Lock them out of the bedroom and nail me. Have the flu? Give me a bj. If you don't, you don't love me and I will find sex elsewhere.
> Amazingly, the OP was called selfish. This place is nuts. Certifiable. :wtf:


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## jaquen (Mar 1, 2012)

What amazes me about the endless excuses is that you can have really great sex, if you know how to push the right buttons, in 15-20 minutes if you're in a hurry. There is no prescribed window of time that sex HAS to happen. It's not like it always has to be some long, marathon event. 

Even with all the typical day to day burdens, if you can't steal away and devote to your spouse the time it takes to watch just _half_ an episode of_ The Cosby Show_, a few times a week, then you really need to examine why the hell you got married in the first place.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Holy crap! If I let every problem in our daily lives to keep us from having sex, we may as well be roommates.

Sure, there are times when sex just isn't going to happen, but there's a nice way to stay connected through all the crap in life so sex is wanted.

H finally got out of his head. Thank god. It was really suckin....and not in a good way.


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