# Experience with EMDR in marriage counseling?



## Dadof3greatkids (Jul 23, 2012)

Has anyone had any positive or negative experiences with a spouse that is full of anger and resentment undergoing EMDR ("Eye movement desensitization and reprocessing")?

We are about 1.5 months into marriage counseling. We have gone before and this ultimately resulted in me making a lot of positive changes to myself as a man, father and husband. My wife both acknowledges the positive changes, but blows up and (to her credit) acknowledges that her reactions to me when I slip up can be too extreme.

We have gone as a couple 3 times. The first session was fine and positive. The second involved a lot of airing the issues of our past. Last night our therapist, after 3-4 individual sessions with my wife, said that my wife and I should undergo individual EMDR to deal with our past issues. The counselor said that my wife has a lot of anger about the verbal abuse she felt she received in the past and EMDR may help it let it go.

Any thoughts?


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

verbal abuse she felt she received in the past and EMDR may help it let it go.

So you don't believe that it was abuse? That could he a huge part of the problem. Even if you didn't mean to word it that way it's very telling. 

I did EDMR in IC. I did think it helped me to work through some trauma. It might help her to not react so negatively when you do slip up but if deep down you aren't taking ownership she is still going to be angry.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Matt1720 (May 7, 2012)

the few articles i've read on EMDR for anger/PTSD have mentioned generally positive results.


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## Dadof3greatkids (Jul 23, 2012)

diwali123 said:


> verbal abuse she felt she received in the past and EMDR may help it let it go.
> 
> So you don't believe that it was abuse? That could he a huge part of the problem. Even if you didn't mean to word it that way it's very telling.
> 
> ...


Your point about acknowledging past wrongs is very valid. I admittedly get defensive about being labelled an "abuser." Our previous counselor stated that we both verbally abused each other. In our previous sessions over several months, I was very clear about how I verbally abused my wife. Much of it involved calling her "frigid" or a "robot" after fights about her lack of physical affection. My wife grew up with a mother who was extremely and constantly critical and did not show her husband or children physical affection. So after many attempts of telling her year after year that I would really like her to show more physical affection (e.g., simple things like reaching out and taking my hand while sitting on the couch), I became extremely frustrated. This frustration would often manifest itself in other forms and I would say admittedly counter-productive and hurtful statements above and, especially when she was critical of me, compare her to her mother. Yes, this was abusive and had the opposite effect of what I was seeking - closeness and affection.

So I have changed - a lot, both in word and action. My wife acknowledges my changes. Still she says she "Just can't let it go" (the years of hurt and abuse). She's still unable to initiate physical affection (like reaching out and holding my hand), but on most days is receptive to my holding her hand and to me initiating sex. 

I say most days, because she has been diagnosed with depression. When she is feeling depressed and discussions about my needs come up (like in counseling), she locks up and says she's "just not sure she has those feelings for me." 

Our counselor has suggested to her that those feelings are "clouded" by past hurts by me and "her family of origin." So he has recommended EMDR.

I definitely have my own issues, on which I'm working. When I first posted this message, my wife was the only one who was going to engage in EMDR. That dynamic caused a lot of conflict because my wife stated that she was not confident I would not relapse into my "old self." However, after reading more about it and as a showing of a commitment to heal with my wife and work on my own issues, I have agreed to undergo my own EMDR treatments (in separate sessions, not in front of each other...). 

The mere fact that I have continued to acknowledge my issues and agreed to EMDR has already resulted in a lessening of the conflict we have engaged in lately.


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## sweetpea (Jan 30, 2007)

EMDR couldn't hurt so I would go for it. I used EMDR after a traumatic incident in my past, and it definitely helped me recover from the incident.


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## Dr Patti Jane (Jan 23, 2013)

I'm a therapist who uses EMDR as my primary psychotherapy treatment and I've also personally had EMDR for anxiety, panic, grief, and “small t” trauma. As a client, EMDR worked extremely well and also really fast. As an EMDR therapist, and in my role as a facilitator who trains other therapists in EMDR (certified by the EMDR International Association and trained by the EMDR Institute, both of which I strongly recommend in an EMDR therapist) I have used EMDR successfully with panic disorders, PTSD, anxiety, depression, grief, body image, phobias, distressing memories, and bad dreams, DID, and many other problems. It's a very gentle method with no significant "down-side" so that in the hands of a professional EMDR therapist, there should be no freak-outs or worsening of day-to-day functioning. 

One of the initial phases (Phase 2) in EMDR involves preparing for memory processing or desensitization (memory processing or desensitization - phases 3-6 - is often what is referred to as "EMDR" which is actually an 8-phase method of psychotherapy). In this phase resources are "front-loaded" so that you have a "floor" or "container" to help with processing the really hard stuff, as well as creating strategies if you're triggered in everyday life. In Phase 2 you learn a lot of great coping strategies and self-soothing techniques which you can use during EMDR processing or anytime you feel the need.

You learn how to access a “Safe or Calm Place” which you can use at ANY TIME during EMDR processing (or on your own) if it feels scary, or too emotional, too intense. One of the key assets of EMDR is that YOU, the client, are in control NOW, even though you weren’t in the past, during traumatic events. You NEVER need re-live an experience or go into great detail, ever! You NEVER need to go through the entire memory. YOU can decide to keep the lights (or the alternating sounds and/or tactile pulsars, or the waving hand) going, or stop them, whichever helps titrate – measure and adjust the balance or “dose“ of the processing. During EMDR processing there are regular “breaks” and you can control when and how many but the therapist should be stopping the bilateral stimulation every 25-50 passes of the lights to ask you to take a deep breath and say just a bit of what you’re noticing, anything different, any changes. (The stimulation should not be kept on continuously, because there are specific procedures that need to be followed to process the memory). The breaks help keep a “foot in the present” while you’re processing the past. Again, and I can’t say this enough, YOU ARE IN CHARGE so YOU can make the process tolerable. And your therapist should be experienced in the EMDR techniques that help make it the gentlest and safest way to detoxify bad life experiences and build resources.

I’m sure you know that grounding exercises are terrifically helpful and really essential, for anyone. You can use some of the techniques in Dr. Shapiro's new book "Getting Past Your Past: Take Control of Your Life with Self-Help Techniques from EMDR." Dr. Shapiro is the founder/creator of EMDR but all the proceeds from the book go to two charities: the EMDR Humanitarian Assistance Program and the EMDR Research Foundation). Anyway, the book is terrific. It's an easy read, helps you understand what's "pushing" your feelings and behavior, helps you connect the dots from past experiences to current life. Also gives lots of really helpful ways that are used during EMDR therapy to calm disturbing thoughts and feelings.

EMDR is a treatment approach which has been empirically validated in over 24 randomized studies of trauma victims and many other studies with other "psychiatric disorders." It is considered one of the three treatments of choice for trauma by organizations such as ISTSS (International Society for Traumatic Stress Studies), American Psychiatric Assoc, American Psychological Assoc, Dept of Veteran Affairs, Dept of Defense, Departments of Health in Northern Ireland, UK, Israel, the Netherlands, France, and other countries and organizations. 

As noted in the American Psychiatric Association Practice Guidelines (2004, p.18), in EMDR “traumatic material [or ANYTHING specific] need not be verbalized; instead, patients are directed to think about their traumatic experiences without having to discuss them.” Given the reluctance of many clients to divulge the details of their experience, this factor is relevant to willingness to initiate treatment, retention and therapeutic gains.

The research shows that EMDR works, and at 15-month follow-up continues to hold (see Wilson, S., Becker, L.A., & Tinker, R.H. (1997). Fifteen-month follow-up of eye movement desensitization and reprocessing (EMDR) treatment of post-traumatic stress disorder and psychological trauma. Journal of Consulting and Clinical Psychology, 65, 1047-1056).

The World Health Organization (WHO) now has "guidelines on problems and disorders specifically related to stress." (In press)
“Individual or group cognitive behavioural therapy (CBT) with a trauma focus, eye movement desensitization and reprocessing (EMDR), or stress management should be considered for adults with posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD).”
"Individual or group cognitive behavioural therapy (CBT) with a trauma focus or eye movement desensitization and reprocessing (EMDR) should be considered for children and adolescents with posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD)."

In addition to my therapy practice, I roam the web looking for EMDR discussions, try to answer questions about it posted by clients/patients, and respond to the critics out there. It's not a cure-all therapy, however, it really is an extraordinary psychotherapy and its results last. In the hands of a really experienced EMDR therapist, it's the most gentle way of working through disturbing experiences.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

I would be willing to bet that if your description of things is accurate her problems are more about her childhood than you at this point.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## lonesomegra (Dec 11, 2011)

Glorified self hypnosis in my opinion! The problem lies in that there are unpredictables such as people affected by weather such as dry winds and snow. These can act as a triggers that negates such therapy. Smell can do likewise.
As a really angry affected person I think a level of anger is required to make us feel and not become neutered hound dogs or a flock of sheep.

Doctor methinks thou dost protest too much.


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## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

How often did your wife express her preferences, etc., in your sexual relationship back when it was good--whenever that was? How often did she indicate what she liked or wanted you to do? How often did she direct your hand or mouth or movements? How active was she in teaching you about giving her pleasure?


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## Dadof3greatkids (Jul 23, 2012)

@diwali123 - you may be right, but all I can do is focus on ME. I do however find that talking to her about my past experiences and their impact on me does cause her to ever so slightly talk about her past experiences. One telling issue our therapist called her on was that my wife tried to blame her mother's lack of affection on my wife's father being controlling (implying husbands cause their wives to act poorly). The therapist stated it was more likely my wife's mother's traumatic childhood that resulted in her ability to show affection. 

@sisters359. Even when things were sexually at their hottest (and they still occasionally get very passionate), my wife has not verbalized what she likes. She has indicated what she does not like because she considers it dirty (including her receiving oral sex - she considers it gross for me to go down there and then come back up and kiss her on the mouth). After the birth of our 3 kids, she was very self-conscious about her breasts. I always told her I loved them and would try to kiss and caress them during sex, but it made her very uncomfortable. After a few of her friends had breast enhancement, she really wanted it and eventually she did. After that, when things are very passionate she never says anything about her breasts, but it is clear that she enjoys me touching/kissing them. However, in the last couple of years, she has not had an orgasm. I can tell she's come very close, but it just does not happen. I've invited her to make suggestions, but she just does not like talking about these things.

I know my wife has problems with her body. She's in great shape, but constantly tells me she has gained 10 pounds and feels fat. I'm always quick to tell her how attractive she is and I can tell she appreciates that. (I am pretty sure THIS insecurity comes from her mother, who is constantly telling her what to wear, what she looks bad in, don't get too sun-tanned, don't wear shirts that show your shoulders because your arms are too big, wear your hair this way cause it looks good (an 80s style that no one wears, etc.)


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