# Wife wants me to cut contact with a female friend. Women's opinions?



## Goldmember357

I have a very good female friend who i was good friends with during our last 2 years in high school she liked me for a long period of time when i never liked her. I got into her we never officially dated but had a little thing it ended cause by that time it was close to end of senior year. She was leaving far away to college and i was not she told me and stopped having the feelings she used to have about me. I imagined cause for so long i never jumped on the opportunity and cause she was coming to realize she was leaving far away in a few months. Before she left we talked and i told her how i felt and she said something about how we dont know the future and could be together who knows. So anyhow i maintained a close friendship with this girl throughout college. Id see her in the summers all those year's i came to realize that i really still liked her even when i had a Girlfriend i came to realize id think of my friend allot. and i could tell she still liked me by the way she treated me instead unlike that of how strictly female friends treated me. 

So college ends and we both move back to our hometown and within a year we are together we dated for 2 1/2 almost 3 years it was a great relationship anyhow i decided to end it because i knew i did not truly deeply love her i just knew while i loved her i did not truly truly love her a "consummate love" if you will. I had finally got to have her all to my own and i realized i could make her my wife but i would never love her like i could another woman who i hoped to meet one day. I broke it up she was heart broken and she really wanted to be friends so i was fine with that and we kept the friendship. So later i married my wife and she is a woman i could truly love and so we married.


Now my wife know's me and her used to date and where friends before for a long period of time and she know's we dated for a few years. I told her this cause i knew she wanted to know and i dont like lying. Anyhow problem arises in that i never told her cause she never asked and cause it was never set in stone but anyhow she finds out that me and this woman had plans to marry. My wife found this out about 1 month ago when my female friend who is engaged and me and my wife had dinner with her and her fiance anyhow wedding rings came up and she mentioned if i remembered a ring she than shut up about it. My wife later asks me what she was talking about and i tell her that i had had gone ring shopping but basically called off marriage and me and my ex now female friend decided to just date longer than marry in the future if it felt right of course i broke it off later. Anyhow my wife was a little upset that i had kept a friendship with a girl i had been really serious with. 

Now the other day my female friend (ex) wanted to skype i had not talked to her since we last had dinner all together and before than i had not talked to her in almost a year. And before than a while. She wanted to catch up anyhow my wife obviously knew about this and exploded telling me she does not want me keep talking to her anymore and asked me how i would feel if she kept a ex around who she almost married.



What should i do? i Understand where my wife is coming from but she never had a problem before with our friendship.


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## livelaughlovenow

Um yes since you never mentioned that she was more than a casual date but someone you considered marrying, from a female tht puts her in a "more than just friends" category and there is no need to rekindle the friendship or grow it through new forms of contact.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Mavash.

This wasn't just a friend this was someone you considered marrying and she has to go. 

Sorry.


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## MrsKy

How would you feel if your wife was doing the same thing?

My husband and I do not have opposite sex friends. Invites too much trouble.

I used to be friends with two of my exes. Their partners were not comfortable with our friendship and even though it hurt me, I understood the fears of these women. So I gracefully walked away and wished these fine men well. Hope they are happy.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best

i have to agree with the ladies above.


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## Browncoat

Ask yourself: if you wife had had an ex-fiancee and long time friend close by would you not worry that at some point an affair (even if just a one time event) could occur?

Your wife is the most important person in your life now, and she needs to feel comfortable. I suspect she will never feel comfortable with the OW around.

As an aside though, I will say that given how long you two dated. I think engagement or no, she should have suspected that you two would have grown very close.


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## Hope1964

There's no place for this other woman in your life now. You need to cut off contact with her. Even if your wife wasn't upset I would say the same thing.


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## Love Song

Goldmember357 said:


> I have a very good female friend who i was good friends with during our last 2 years in high school she liked me for a long period of time when i never liked her. I got into her we never officially dated but had a little thing it ended cause by that time it was close to end of senior year. She was leaving far away to college and i was not she told me and stopped having the feelings she used to have about me. I imagined cause for so long i never jumped on the opportunity and cause she was coming to realize she was leaving far away in a few months. Before she left we talked and i told her how i felt and she said something about how we dont know the future and could be together who knows. So anyhow i maintained a close friendship with this girl throughout college. Id see her in the summers all those year's i came to realize that i really still liked her even when i had a Girlfriend i came to realize id think of my friend allot. and i could tell she still liked me by the way she treated me instead unlike that of how strictly female friends treated me.
> 
> So college ends and we both move back to our hometown and within a year we are together we dated for 2 1/2 almost 3 years it was a great relationship anyhow i decided to end it because i knew i did not truly deeply love her i just knew while i loved her i did not truly truly love her a "consummate love" if you will. I had finally got to have her all to my own and i realized i could make her my wife but i would never love her like i could another woman who i hoped to meet one day. I broke it up she was heart broken and she really wanted to be friends so i was fine with that and we kept the friendship. So later i married my wife and she is a woman i could truly love and so we married.
> 
> 
> Now my wife know's me and her used to date and where friends before for a long period of time and she know's we dated for a few years. I told her this cause i knew she wanted to know and i dont like lying. Anyhow problem arises in that i never told her cause she never asked and cause it was never set in stone but anyhow she finds out that me and this woman had plans to marry. My wife found this out about 1 month ago when my female friend who is engaged and me and my wife had dinner with her and her fiance anyhow wedding rings came up and she mentioned if i remembered a ring she than shut up about it. My wife later asks me what she was talking about and i tell her that i had had gone ring shopping but basically called off marriage and me and my ex now female friend decided to just date longer than marry in the future if it felt right of course i broke it off later. Anyhow my wife was a little upset that i had kept a friendship with a girl i had been really serious with.
> 
> Now the other day my female friend (ex) wanted to skype i had not talked to her since we last had dinner all together and before than i had not talked to her in almost a year. And before than a while. She wanted to catch up anyhow my wife obviously knew about this and exploded telling me she does not want me keep talking to her anymore and asked me how i would feel if she kept a ex around who she almost married.
> 
> 
> 
> What should i do? i Understand where my wife is coming from but she never had a problem before with our friendship.


You married your wife and that's who you are committed to. You need to stop communicating with your EX GIRL FRIEND!! No matter how much you would like to think so ex's can not be true friends. Your wife has every right to want you to cut contact because YOU should!!


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## Love Song

I like how she casually brought up old times (engagement ring) like "don't you remember how good it used to be for us when we almost married? Don't you want to get back together??" Seems like you completely missed the hint. And you are wondering why your wife has a problem with her?!??


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## Middle of Everything

I for one really want my wife to be bff's with guys whose genitals shes seen, touched, kissed, or had inside her.

Note HUGE amounts of sarcasm.

Sorry if this wasnt funny, but I all ways tell my wife I dont believe when guys claim to be "just friends" with a woman. There will be banging desired by them at some point.


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## Peachy Cat

There is no room in your relationship for a third person. The ex needs to go.

If you continue contact, your wife will begin to wither away...


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## DanF

From a man's POV, this is just asking for trouble.
Imagine this scenario some time in the future;
You and your wife have an argument. Your sex life has been going down hill. You're frustrated and turn to your best friend for advice. After all, who could possibly give you better woman advice that a woman that you have known for years?
Since you confide in her everything that you want a woman to be and she has feelings for you, she becomes that woman. An affair develops and you screw up everything with the woman you love because of a woman that wants you for a paycheck.

This woman needs to be out of your life.


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## unbelievable

Funny how this woman went from being "a female friend" to someone you almost married all in the same post. Why didn't you honestly identify this woman? We don't even know you. You used to have the hots for this woman and I'm guessing she either was a sexual partner or you wanted her to be. The fact that you described your fiance' as "a female friend" indicates an initial deliberate attempt to hide and minimize the relationship. If your wife were privately chatting up a guy who used to nail her or who used to be her fiance', you'd come unglued. You waited until the 4the paragraph to describe the real issue at hand, spending the initial 3 on fluff. You notice you said "I don't like lying". You didn't say you don't lie or you don't believe in lying. Your words indicate you do lie or conceal thruth from your wife frequently but you fear detection. You also said you didn't tell your wife the truth because she didn't ask. I don't even need to elaborate on this becuse it's an obvious sign of guilt for anyone. You actually took your wife to have dinner with this woman and you didn't tell your wife that you and this woman used to be fiances? You use the qualifier "basically" before "called off marriage" (notice the absence of the pronoun "I")?
This would tell any interrogator that whatever might have happened, you didn't call off the marriage. It may be more likely that you never had intentions of marrying her but you allowed this woman to believe so. Another thing I find interesting is that you said, "So later i married my wife and she is a woman i could truly love and so we married." You didn't say your wife IS the woman you truly love and you didn't say your wife WAS a woman you could love. How long have you been married? If it's been over a year, why did you start contacting a former fiance' a year ago?


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## tacoma

I didn`t even need to read your OP.

If your wife wants you to go NC with this woman then you go NC with this woman.


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby

I agree, the female friend has to go! 

My husband and I do not have friends of the opposite sex.


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## Entropy3000

I know this is the Women's forum but I am echoing tacoma on this one. All that matters is your wife's concerns in this case. 

In addition to his comments I might add the following.

Do not choose another woman over her. As long as you do not respect your wife's wishes you are being unfaithful. If you are actually making time for this woman and meeting up with her, you are cheating IMO.


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## SimplyAmorous

> i never told her cause she never asked and cause it was never set in stone but anyhow she finds out that me and this woman had plans to marry. My wife found this out about 1 month ago when my female friend who is engaged and me and my wife had dinner with her and her fiance anyhow wedding rings came up and she mentioned if i remembered a ring she than shut up about it. My wife later asks me what she was talking about and i tell her that i had had gone ring shopping but basically called off marriage and me and my ex now female friend decided to just date longer than marry in the future if it felt right of course i broke it off later. Anyhow my wife was a little upset that i had kept a friendship with a girl i had been really serious with.


 Us women are jealous by nature, nothing will change this in us, it is built into us for protection....of what is ours... it makes sense, there is an uneasiness that will not go away...if we feel any amount of affection, emotional energy is being entertained with the opposite sex -that rightfully belongs to us. 

Your "serious" history with this woman, her not being clued into the deepness of your feelings (at one time)... likely for years... it plays a significant role, your wife is likely hurt for being the last to know. 

I feel when we marry (also while dating)....*IF* one desires to hold onto any opposite sex friends...the dymanics must change....these personal "one on one" friendships now need to be branched to include *equally* with the spouse/ bf/gf.... this is the only way....to give comfort to your other half. 

And always do everything together, this makes you & your wife a united front...ONE.....among these friends. She will not feel left out, but included...as she should be...in all things.

And if she is not comfortable with that...for the health of your marraige, your spouse comes first.


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## YinPrincess

Inappropriate in my opinion. Your wife is valid in her concerns and wanting to protect her relationship with you. If you want friends, another man will understand you far better than any woman.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## tm84

As a guy, I'd say it's past time to cut contact with your ex. Continuing to talk with her is asking for trouble down the line. If your wife was still talking to someone that she almost married, I very much doubt that you'd feel comfortable with that situation. Imagine what you might be feeling if you knew your wife were talking, emailing, texting, etc...with a man that she was that close to in the past. What if things were going bad between you two and she turned to this other person for comfort and who knows what else down the line...

Your wife should be front and center in your life now, not ex girlfriends. If she feels uncomfortable with that person being in your life, then you need to respect her wishes and remove that person from your life, as hard as that might seem. You need to let go of that part of your past so that you can stay in the present and move forward with your wife.


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## worried123

I had posted on here a while back about my husbands female
Friend. He has a close female friend and I'm cool with
Him having a female friend. What hurt me is that it took time away
From us as a couple and she became very demanding.
You need to know that as a wife you promised her life to her
No where in your vows did it say your wife and female
Friend.

So you need to step back from your female friend 
And show your wife she is the woman you love 
And put her first. Trust me things will get better
You can still maintain a relation ship with your friend 
But remember your wife comes first
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## RClawson

Here is another man's experience. I was introduced to my wife, indirectly, by her ex boyfriend. Now keep in mind I come from a fairly conservative religious background where we premarital sex is frowned on and I struggled to stay on that path.

Imagine finding out after you are married that your wife's ex boyfriend and her had quite a passionate affair. You have been hanging out with this ex and his wife on occasion, his brother is marrying your wife's sister and his other brother is married your wife's best friend. Your wife does not get what the big deal is, after all the sex was "just clinical"! Really! The bottom line is that I will always be linked to him by a couple of degrees of separation for the rest of my life and it sucks. Wish I knew before I was married.

Do your wife a huge favor and let the past go..................forever!


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## marksaysay

In any committed relationship, opposite sex friendships are nothing but trouble. Even if it was just platonic, which it wasn't, it gives you another female other than your wife to share intimate thoughts and details. Many of the cheating scenarios here are due to opposite sex friendships that blossomed into something more. The "friend" has to go.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jellybeans

Goldmember357 said:


> What should i do? *i Understand where my wife is coming from* but she never had a problem before with our friendship.



Know why she never had a problem with the "friendship" before?:



unbelievable said:


> Funny how this woman went from being "a female friend" to someone you almost married all in the same post. Why didn't you honestly identify this woman? We don't even know you. You used to have the hots for this woman and I'm guessing she either was a sexual partner or you wanted her to be. *The fact that you described your fiance' as "a female friend" indicates an initial deliberate attempt to hide and minimize the relationship. *


Exactly. You told your wife she was a "friend" when she was an ex. You lied to your wife. Even going so far as taking them out to dinner together. And then you wonder why she's upset? 

Hello? Anybody home? Because if your wife told you she had a "friend" and then took you out to dinner with her "friend" and later you find out they actually have a long history/even some romance spackled in/even almost got married and were engaged, would you really be ok with her lying to you about it??? 

Cause that's what you did.

Wife wants her out of your life is so either respect your wife or invite all sorts of problems into your marriage. 

This ex wasn't ever and isn't your 'friend.' Friends don't f-ck and almost get married.

Truth.


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## Jellybeans

_*What should i do? i Understand where my wife is coming from but she never had a problem before with our friendship*_

That's because you've never just been "friends" with this woman. You have a logg and romantic history with her. 

Remove her from your Skype and all other areas of your life. Why did you reconnect with her anyway? 

And I just want to add: it was _extremely_ tasteless for her to bring up the ring in front of your wife and her fiance.

No class whatsoever, IMO.


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## galian84

Um, if your wife is uncomfortable with it, she has to go. You married her and need to put her first.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

The rule of thumb is if you've had sex the opposite sex person is off-limits to be friends. Haha, just today a guy friend who really is a guy friend, asked me who the guy was who was with me the other night...I asked him a couple times who? I couldn't figure out who he meant...he was asking about my kids' dad who had dropped my kids off. In my mind I could not equate that I was 'with' him. He only dropped the kids off! That's how much his presence registered. lol. But this illustrates a point. Even if YOU think the impact of having a former intimate partner around is minimal, that's not how other parties think. They see SEX, once you have had SEX with someone, when you are in their vicinity, that is what people see and perceive, that you are 'with' that person, still in SOME KIND of relationship. Perception is everything, it drives people's very real experience of the universe. It's not YOUR reality that matters, it's your wife's. From your perspective everything is fine, from your wife's it is not, and it is just not right or human to impose your perception on someone else. She is a different person and she is certainly entitled to peace of mind in HER marriage. You agreed to marriage, and it is a binding commitment to protect someone else's peace of mind. Her marriage is your marriage. If you continue to do something that prevents her from being centered, your marriage will suffer, and because you are in control of the thing that will make it or break it, it will be because of you, not her. That's just the way it is. This framing is just as legitimate as your framing. If the two framings exist, it still has your being okay with it and her not being okay with it. 0 + 1 = 1. Not 0 = 1 with 0 being just as legitimate as 1 and so why not choose 0. It is not a choice, it is an addition in a marriage, and you have to respect the sum. Branching decisions do not apply. You have committed to one reality and that will be the one that brings the most peace to a couple combined. You said you love your wife enough to marry her, so you already made the choice a long time ago. You are only pretending there is a choice now. There isn't!


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## Goldmember357

Okay i understand the freindship needs to end but maybe some of you did not read my OP (its long dont blame you). I had told my wife that i used to date this girl for a period of time and my wife knew that we dated and knew that we had a friendship before we ever dated. My wife however did not know that we almost married and how "deep" our relationship really was. So that got her upset and hurt her feelings i do not want to hurt her feelings so i will stop its just hard but i will do it. 

It was not till my wife found out that we almost married did she get angry. Also i dont think she was ever mad that i used to date this girl before because me and my (ex) aka female friend rarely ever talked and i told my wife every-time we did. My wife had met her before hand and knew we had dated and never had a problem with it. I assume its because my wife knew that me and my Ex rarely ever talked and that i told her when i did. 


I did not skype with my friend (my ex) on friday and me and the wife were busy on Saturday and Sunday she is also pregnant so that's a joy. I gave my friend an excuse on why i could not skype and told her some other time. I guess it's hard for me cause she was always a part of my life and not hearing from her will be odd, even though i had gone over a year not hearing from her before i always considered her my friend, so completely cutting contact is hard.


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## moxy

You're married to your wife. Your commitment is to your wife. Ditch the girl-friend.


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## Goldmember357

Jellybeans said:


> Know why she never had a problem with the "friendship" before?:
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly. You told your wife she was a "friend" when she was an ex. You lied to your wife. Even going so far as taking them out to dinner together. And then you wonder why she's upset?
> 
> Hello? Anybody home? Because if your wife told you she had a "friend" and then took you out to dinner with her "friend" and later you find out they actually have a long history/even some romance spackled in/even almost got married and were engaged, would you really be ok with her lying to you about it???
> 
> Cause that's what you did.
> 
> Wife wants her out of your life is so either respect your wife or invite all sorts of problems into your marriage.
> 
> This ex wasn't ever and isn't your 'friend.' Friends don't f-ck and almost get married.
> 
> Truth.


Okay i understand but i DID tell my wife that this girl and me used to date. She knew that we knew each other from HS and that we dated right after college and that it was serious not a short term relationship. My wife knew that i broke up with HER and that we remained friends and we were friends when i met my wife. My wife has met her but i rarely talked to my ex (female friend) anymore after we had broken up and once i got married to my wife i every once in a while talked to my (ex) my wife knew this but was never upset. I suspect its cause we live in different cities far apart and we hardly ever talked anymore. It was not till my wife found out that we almost married she was upset, i never told her that part cause i never proposed to my female friend (ex) just looked at rings. 


Also I will admit before me and my ex ever dated we both liked each other and had liked each other for year's but never dated i talked about that in OP. But after i dated her for a while and broke up with her i truly considered her a friend and i had never done that before hand cause i like always knew id date her at some point.



Anyhow i will end the friendship with my ex (female friend). I dont want to hurt my wife and i do not want it to be a problem.


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## moxy

Goldmember357 said:


> Anyhow i will end the friendship with my ex (female friend). I dont want to hurt my wife and i do not want it to be a problem.


Good man. A guy like that, like you're choosing to be, is a keeper. A guy who chooses the ex over his wife, like you were considering being for like five seconds there, who is dangerously close to a possible EA, should be kicked out of the house. You just saved yourself and her a ton of pain and if you've told the ex that you can't be friends anymore, then you deserve some kudos. It's hard to safeguard the things that matter, but when they matter, the sacrifice is worthwhile. Wise choice to ditch the ex altogether.


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## EleGirl

Goldmember357 said:


> Okay i understand the freindship needs to end but maybe some of you did not read my OP (its long dont blame you). I had told my wife that i used to date this girl for a period of time and my wife knew that we dated and knew that we had a friendship before we ever dated. My wife however did not know that we almost married and how "deep" our relationship really was. So that got her upset and hurt her feelings i do not want to hurt her feelings so i will stop its just hard but i will do it.
> 
> It was not till my wife found out that we almost married did she get angry. Also i dont think she was ever mad that i used to date this girl before because me and my (ex) aka female friend rarely ever talked and i told my wife every-time we did. My wife had met her before hand and knew we had dated and never had a problem with it. I assume its because my wife knew that me and my Ex rarely ever talked and that i told her when i did.
> 
> 
> I did not skype with my friend (my ex) on friday and me and the wife were busy on Saturday and Sunday she is also pregnant so that's a joy. I gave my friend an excuse on why i could not skype and told her some other time. I guess it's hard for me cause she was always a part of my life and not hearing from her will be odd, even though i had gone over a year not hearing from her before i always considered her my friend, so completely cutting contact is hard.


Others have mentioned this but I guess it went over your head.

The night you were out to dinner, she mentioned the ring and then shut up. Your ex's remark about the ring was not an innocent little remark. It's the kind of thing that is said to let you know that she is still interested in you. And it's sort of code to your wife to tell her that your ex is still interested in you.

My bet is that at that dinner your wife picked up on all kinds of undertones from your ex. After that dinner your wife has a much clearer picture of what is going on between you and your ex. And she does not feel safe.


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## YinPrincess

:iagree: ^^^ Bingo!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## angelpixie

Boy, I am impressed with how many men came on this thread and spoke up for Goldmember's wife. I really wish there had been guys like you around my ex years ago when he kept having 'friendships' (ie EAs) with other women. I was the only one objecting, and it was easy to put my feelings aside because he wanted to keep doing what he was doing. Good for all of you that show integrity. Your wives are very blessed.


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## memyselfandi

My fiance and I do not have friends of the opposite sex either. He agrees as well as I do that it's just room for problems.

So my answer to your questions regarding if you can still be friends with an ex girlfriend? Can your wife be friends with an old boyfriend..old fiance..still keep in touch?

If you want your marriage to last....

Nope..Nope..and NOPE!!


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## marksaysay

I would also take things a step further by writing this "friend" a no-contact letter and allowing your wife to read it before sending. This will be an action to go with your words that will do wonders for you and the trust with your wife.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## marksaysay

angelpixie said:


> Boy, I am impressed with how many men came on this thread and spoke up for Goldmember's wife. I really wish there had been guys like you around my ex years ago when he kept having 'friendships' (ie EAs) with other women. I was the only one objecting, and it was easy to put my feelings aside because he wanted to keep doing what he was doing. Good for all of you that show integrity. Your wives are very blessed.


I must admit that while I am much wiser now when it comes to relationships, it took the devastating collapse of my marriage due to my wife's (or exwifes) infidelity for me to learn. I wish I knew then what I know now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Cosmos

Exes are exes for a reason and have no place in a new relationship, let alone a marriage. Your wife didn't have a problem with your relationship with this woman, because she didn't have all the facts. Now she does, she isn't comfortable with it, and I think it would be best to respect that.


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## Bottled Up

EleGirl said:


> The night you were out to dinner, she mentioned the ring and then shut up. Your ex's remark about the ring was not an innocent little remark. It's the kind of thing that is said to let you know that she is still interested in you. And it's sort of code to your wife to tell her that your ex is still interested in you.
> 
> My bet is that at that dinner your wife picked up on all kinds of undertones from your ex. After that dinner your wife has a much clearer picture of what is going on between you and your ex. And she does not feel safe.


Goldmember, I think EleGirl is spot on here. This is a wise observation and if you need a solid explanation to reassure you as to why it is so important you end this friendship, then look no further.

You are probably closer to an affair than you even realize... not because you have any desire on your part, but because your ex is probably ready to go and all it would take is the single pull of the trigger on your end. I once read that when an EA is occurring between 2 people, a woman will rarely make the advance to escalate into a PA. But once the man makes the advance the woman is ready to go for it. That's probably how dangerously close your situation is, and I bet your wife knows it before even you do. And the fact that things have not escalated between you and your ex is also a testament to how much your wife must trust you, but her radar is way up now probably seeing this other woman is ready to move in on your life at the drop of a dime. The OW is a real and serious threat, believe it. 

The icing on the cake here is that when you come as close to marrying someone like you almost did with your ex, it puts a whole new level of emotional closeness and intimacy on a relationship dynamic. Before your wife knew this info, your ex was just a woman you had a relationship with that you decided wasn't right for you but you stayed friendly. Now she knows that this woman was actually so close to your heart that you almost committed your life to her. This OW had almost your full heart at one point in your life - a whole different elevation and seriousness of engagement in a relationship than just dating. It's emotional bonding levels. You had this once with OW, and now your wife is nervous the OW never lost her emotional attachment to you and is just looking for the spark (and window of opportunity) to rekindle with you.

You're wife is a very smart woman... give her the credit and the respect she deserves. Don't just tell her, but show her she is the only woman that will ever have you for the rest of your lives together. Commit to her fully and give her comfort.


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## Jellybeans

Goldmember357 said:


> Okay i understand but i DID tell my wife that this girl and me used to date.
> 
> It was not till my wife found out that we almost married she was upset, i never told her that part cause i never proposed to my female friend (ex) just looked at rings. .


But you see, you lied by omission. You left out a major piece: the fact that you almost got engaged to her and married her. That's not small potatoes. 



EleGirl said:


> Others have mentioned this but I guess it went over your head.
> 
> The night you were out to dinner, she mentioned the ring and then shut up. Your ex's remark about the ring was not an innocent little remark.


Exactly. And taht's why I had mentioned in my earlier post that the ex girlfriend bringing this up in front of his now-wife was totally tasteless on her part. And you better believe, Gold, that it wasn't a slip-up on her part. She said it intentionally. To me hat is massive and shows a lot about her character. Not a good person to be doing that, IMO. Her remark was wholly inappropriate and she has major boundary issues, esp. since she has no qualms with rehashing this stuff in front of her own fiance and your wife. She is a snake. Make no mistake about it.

And I agree with BottledUp about the difference between someone you casually dated versus someone you almost actually married. If you can't understand why your wife would be pissed, you are delusional. You cannot sit there and honestly say had your wife done the same thing to you that you'd be happy with it. No way, man. Especially not with her ex talking about rings they almost purchased to get married.

Nonetheless, I do commend you for ending the "friendship" with you ex-girlfriend/almost-fiance. You are doing the right thing. Stay far far away from her.


----------



## greenowl

I think if that's what your wife wants you should accept that. Don't end up being even the slightest bit tempted. My husband had an old girlfriend contact him and i knew but i didn't know that he went even further and started seeing her and everything. We are together and it is over with her ,but the trouble it caused. He said he didn't even know how it happened, he just got swept up in it. I'm not saying that will happen, but your intentions may be good but you don't know her intentions. i say leave it alone.


----------



## turnera

Just because you're friends with someone at some point in your life doesn't mean you have to STAY friends with them. You're at a different place in your life, and there's no room there for a former girlfriend you considered marrying.


----------



## lamaga

Once again I find myself in the minority. While it's understandable for your wife to feel some unease, or some jealousy, I just don't think that grown people get to decide who other people have for friends.

You either trust your spouse or you don't. It's a choice. But I wouldn't be with someone who tried to control who I was friends with.


----------



## Love Song

Nope I did read your whole post. It was long but I read the whole thing. Your commitment should be to your wife and your wife doesn't want this friend who used to be your fiance in her or your's life. So because she is your wife and you commited to her you need to accept that what your wife is asking is very reasonable. 

I am speaking from experience here. My husband comes before my male friends though I have dated none of them. I know enough about male female friendships to know ex'x can never be truly friends and therefore will never work no matter how much anyone may try to force it.


----------



## Love Song

Entropy3000 said:


> I know this is the Women's forum but I am echoing tacoma on this one. All that matters is your wife's concerns in this case.
> 
> In addition to his comments I might add the following.
> 
> Do not choose another woman over her. As long as you do not respect your wife's wishes you are being unfaithful. If you are actually making time for this woman and meeting up with her, you are cheating IMO.



I like the way you think Entropy!!


----------



## turnera

lamaga said:


> Once again I find myself in the minority. While it's understandable for your wife to feel some unease, or some jealousy, I just don't think that grown people get to decide who other people have for friends.
> 
> You either trust your spouse or you don't. It's a choice. But I wouldn't be with someone who tried to control who I was friends with.


 Your spouse should be able to tell you if your Independent Behavior is making her uncomfortable. That's what his wife did.

And if you love your spouse, you will reconsider your Independent Behavior. Otherwise, you'll live separate lives, while married. And that will get you divorced.


----------



## gav

Exes have no place in your life, and honestly, if your wife tells you she wants you to cut contact with someone, you should do it, period.

If my wife asked me to cut someone out of my life, I would.

She's my biggest priority next to taking care of myself, and definitely more important than someone else.

If you're in a relationship that's abusive and this is a tactic to isolate you, then this doesn't apply


----------



## Sanity

Sorry no.


----------



## questar1

Your wife is no dummy, mister. Red flags all over the place. Apologize as soon as possible & vow you will never do this again. Lesson learned. One hopes.


----------



## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

Your thinking could be, about your 'friend'...
Wow, my 'friend' acted in a way that really hurt my wife.
My 'friend' failed in terms of making sure that my wife is in an emotionally safe environment.
My 'friend' is a loose cannon.
My 'friend' acted in a way to reduce my joy and security in my marriage.
Why do I have a 'friend' like this?


----------



## bellagirl

Seems to me you are getting something out of knowing you have your ex waiting in the wings. I would examine this. You seem to have more loyal feelings to your ex than your wife. This is the type of thinking that leads to marital problems and infidelity.

If you are being honest with yourself, maybe you will see that you purposely misled your wife about the extent of your relationship with your ex so that you could have your ex in your life. You seem to want both women in some capacity.

Time for some therapy, in my opinion.....


----------



## Goldmember357

Jellybeans said:


> But you see, you lied by omission. You left out a major piece: the fact that you almost got engaged to her and married her. That's not small potatoes.
> 
> 
> 
> Exactly. And taht's why I had mentioned in my earlier post that the ex girlfriend bringing this up in front of his now-wife was totally tasteless on her part. And you better believe, Gold, that it wasn't a slip-up on her part. She said it intentionally. To me hat is massive and shows a lot about her character. Not a good person to be doing that, IMO. Her remark was wholly inappropriate and she has major boundary issues, esp. since she has no qualms with rehashing this stuff in front of her own fiance and your wife. She is a snake. Make no mistake about it.
> 
> And I agree with BottledUp about the difference between someone you casually dated versus someone you almost actually married. If you can't understand why your wife would be pissed, you are delusional. You cannot sit there and honestly say had your wife done the same thing to you that you'd be happy with it. No way, man. Especially not with her ex talking about rings they almost purchased to get married.
> 
> Nonetheless, I do commend you for ending the "friendship" with you ex-girlfriend/almost-fiance. You are doing the right thing. Stay far far away from her.


Yes i ended our friendship with my Ex. She asked to skype again this time later at night like 11pm and asked if i was alone. I told her i cannot and i am really busy i removed her from as a contact on skype.Now the only way she can contact me is by calling me but i told her its best we not talk like this and so often. She has not talked to me since than. 

Its hard for me to say "i dont want to ever speak to you again" cause i was so close for her for year's a large part of my life i have known her.

but you are right she has changed and is purposely for some reason trying to start something with me. I think about it now and she purposely mentioned the ring and likely was giving other signs during dinner of her interest. It makes me angry knowing she would do such a thing and try to show off to my wife or scare her with the thought of her wanting me. I am pissed at the fact she would do that and it can threaten my marriage if i continue speaking to her.

I should of never remained friends with an ex i thought of marrying especially after i got married.


----------



## sandc

Goldmember357 said:


> Yes i ended our friendship with my Ex. She asked to skype again this time later at night like 11pm and asked if i was alone. I told her i cannot and i am really busy i removed her from as a contact on skype.Now the only way she can contact me is by calling me but i told her its best we not talk like this and so often. She has not talked to me since than.
> 
> Its hard for me to say "i dont want to ever speak to you again" cause i was so close for her for year's a large part of my life i have known her.
> 
> but you are right she has changed and is purposely for some reason trying to start something with me. I think about it now and she purposely mentioned the ring and likely was giving other signs during dinner of her interest. It makes me angry knowing she would do such a thing and try to show off to my wife or scare her with the thought of her wanting me. I am pissed at the fact she would do that and it can threaten my marriage if i continue speaking to her.
> 
> I should of never remained friends with an ex i thought of marrying especially after i got married.


Why would you want to remain friends with her? Are you going to go fishing with her? Play golf? What do you get out of the friendship? What is the ex expecting to get out of the friendship? Why string her along? Wish her a happy life and tell her goodbye.


----------



## turnera

I'm glad you're starting to realize the truth. Now do the one thing your WIFE needs, and tell her in front of your wife that you can't continue to be friends with her.


----------



## golfergirl

Goldmember357 said:


> Yes i ended our friendship with my Ex. She asked to skype again this time later at night like 11pm and asked if i was alone. I told her i cannot and i am really busy i removed her from as a contact on skype.Now the only way she can contact me is by calling me but i told her its best we not talk like this and so often. She has not talked to me since than.
> 
> Its hard for me to say "i dont want to ever speak to you again" cause i was so close for her for year's a large part of my life i have known her.
> 
> but you are right she has changed and is purposely for some reason trying to start something with me. I think about it now and she purposely mentioned the ring and likely was giving other signs during dinner of her interest. It makes me angry knowing she would do such a thing and try to show off to my wife or scare her with the thought of her wanting me. I am pissed at the fact she would do that and it can threaten my marriage if i continue speaking to her.
> 
> I should of never remained friends with an ex i thought of marrying especially after i got married.


You didn't end the friendship, you blew her off.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Posse

So how would you feel if your wife had handled the situation the way you just did if the roles were reversed?..............


----------



## Stonewall

I'm not a chick but dude this is so obvious. Send your friend packing. How would you feel if the shoe was on the other foot?


----------



## SabrinaBlue

Goldmember, you didn't end the friendship. You just deleted her off Skype after making up an excuse about being "busy." You asked her not to call you "so often." That's such a lukewarm attempt at ending a friendship that it's obvious your heart isn't in it.

You owe it to your wife - and yourself - to end this properly. You need to be firm and final. The suggestions have been made to give the ex a no-contact letter, or to verbally end it with your wife present. Both good methods in my opinion.


----------



## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

Tell her you are p*ssed then, and why.
Call her out on it.
If she really IS a friend, she will understand your position and what she did and agree to end the friendship is the best thing to protect your marriage, as a real friend would.
If she is not a friend and gets all defensive about what she did, then you can end the so-called friendship.
Both paths lead to ending the friendship.
So either way with a discussion in which your wife would have access to, of course, it will end.
I think you made a really good choice not marrying this woman. Don't second guess your judgement when you made that choice.
It seems like it was sound. 
Obviously your wife is the better woman for you. Continue making that choice!


----------



## Maricha75

Goldmember357 said:


> Yes i ended our friendship with my Ex. She asked to skype again this time later at night like 11pm and asked if i was alone. I told her i cannot and i am really busy* i removed her from as a contact on skype*.Now the only way she can contact me is by calling me but *i told her its best we not talk like this and so often.* She has not talked to me since than.
> 
> *Its hard for me to say "i dont want to ever speak to you again" cause i was so close for her for year's a large part of my life i have known her.*
> 
> but you are right she has changed and is purposely for some reason trying to start something with me. I think about it now and she purposely mentioned the ring and likely was giving other signs during dinner of her interest. It makes me angry knowing she would do such a thing and try to show off to my wife or scare her with the thought of her wanting me. I am pissed at the fact she would do that and it can threaten my marriage if i continue speaking to her.
> 
> I should of never remained friends with an ex i thought of marrying especially after i got married.


No, you did NOT end the friendship. You blew her off. You made a SHOW of ending the friendship, likely so your wife would think you mean it. If you REALLY meant to end it, you would have told her point blank that her bringing that stuff up was in poor taste and you aren't gonna talk to her anymore because of how it made YOU AND YOUR WIFE FEEL! Seriously, it doesn't matter how long someone has been in your life. You acknowledge that she wants more, you need to cut her out, COMPLETELY! You have not just women telling you this, but men as well! Write her a NC letter and be done with it.


----------



## Catherine602

You said “she purposely mentioned the ring and likely was giving other signs during dinner of her interest” 

Yet you still cannot tell her she the friendship for over for good because she insulted the woman you love? Really? That makes sense to you? 

I think you have a stronger emotional attachment to this friend and should let your wife go. You obviously value an immoral, jealous, devious woman above a woman who committed to you. 

Do you get a charge out of her wanting you? Do you enjoy having two women fighting over you? You like keeping you wife in a state of anxiety to make you feel that you are so attractive that treating her badly does not make her leave? 

Let me give you a tip. You have more problems in your relationship than you are aware of. The behavior you revealed here - is it a pattern in your relationship?. Do think it is OK to dismiss your wife’s apparently legitimate concerns? 

If that is so, you are the type of man that will likely have a walk away wife. It will seem sudden to you but she will reach a point of no return after giving you a chance to change your dismissive treatment of her. 

They try to get their husband to change to address their concerns for a time and then reach a tipping point. If he does not see her concerns as important and ignores them, she gives up. When she leaves it is over for good.


----------



## turnera

I was going to say the same thing. Your inability to just say goodbye means you are emotionally attached to her and you WANT to be able to contact her again.

How would you feel if your wife told you that about HER old boyfriend?


----------



## strugglinghusband

WTHeck is so hard about just sayin "Sorry we can not be friends any longer, its just not appropriate"... end of story, no explaining, no rationalizing, no anything...you owe her nothing, you owe your marriage everything.


----------



## questar1

Catherine602 said:


> You said “she purposely mentioned the ring and likely was giving other signs during dinner of her interest”
> 
> Yet you still cannot tell her she the friendship for over for good because she insulted the woman you love? Really? That makes sense to you?
> 
> I think you have a stronger emotional attachment to this friend and should let your wife go. You obviously value an immoral, jealous, devious woman above a woman who committed to you.
> 
> Do you get a charge out of her wanting you? Do you enjoy having two women fighting over you? You like keeping you wife in a state of anxiety to make you feel that you are so attractive that treating her badly does not make her leave?
> 
> Let me give you a tip. You have more problems in your relationship than you are aware of. The behavior you revealed here - is it a pattern in your relationship?. Do think it is OK to dismiss your wife’s apparently legitimate concerns?
> 
> If that is so, you are the type of man that will likely have a walk away wife. It will seem sudden to you but she will reach a point of no return after giving you a chance to change your dismissive treatment of her.
> 
> They try to get their husband to change to address their concerns for a time and then reach a tipping point. If he does not see her concerns as important and ignores them, she gives up. When she leaves it is over for good.


:iagree:These are incredibly wise and insightful words!!

I myself am on my third go-round of the H insisting on caring for an ex-GF either excluding me or inconveniencing me or embarrassing me to go see them. He calls them "old friends." No, they're not. And three times = enough, I will indeed walk out next time. 

I am learning a lot from this thread about my own situation. I am seeing that I have to insist that my H not just "blow off a lunch date" because I was so pissed. He also has to tell the ex GF why it was inappropriate for him to be there, and he has to do that without just blaming me. "Da Wife didn't want me to go." Bull. How about, "I realized it's out of line for you and me to meet for lunch without inviting DW. After all, I'm married now, and that's the most important thing you need to know, so don't even ask." He hasn't done that yet which means he is more afraid of alienating them than me.

It's just wrong and stupid and inappropriate, and most grown-ups eventually figure it out. Sadly, it's too often AFTER the spouse has reached "the tipping point" and walked out. Optionally after doing some physical damage to something you value. 

Now i see how I have been putting up with a flimsy outcome--he just "blows off" the arrangement that made me angry. Now I see I have to insist he take it a step further and say WHY, and cut the other person off for good.

As should you.


----------



## Catherine602

Quester I think you have given him too many chances and he does not think you will leave. I am not saying you should leave but back off completely. 

Don't say anymore about it no matter what he does. He knows where you stand and he knows what your reaction will be. He is not concerned but he has fun pushing your button. 

Why provide him with a show? Change up what you are doing is not working. Stay out of that rat hole. 

You meet his needs right? Why? If he can keep you off balance give him a taste of his own medicine. ignoring him and cooling off towards him will get his attention.

there are some needs that you should withdraw. Tell him you are cannot meet his needs for now because you are considering what you want to do. 

If you are not going places without him, start. Just meet gf for dinner go to a club. Have drinks with friends. Go some place after work if you are employed. Get yourself in shape like you are going to date again. Wear makeup hair etc. If he complains just repeat you are thinking give you space. 

You have to get yourself in a mental state to let him go. If you do not want to live in a state of anxiety then you must be willing to leave. If he cares enough he will change. If he does not care you may as well get out.


----------



## SabrinaBlue

This is really pretty simple. Does your wife come first in your marriage, or does your ex?


----------



## Goldmember357

Catherine602 said:


> You said “she purposely mentioned the ring and likely was giving other signs during dinner of her interest”
> 
> Yet you still cannot tell her she the friendship for over for good because she insulted the woman you love? Really? That makes sense to you?
> 
> I think you have a stronger emotional attachment to this friend and should let your wife go. You obviously value an immoral, jealous, devious woman above a woman who committed to you.
> 
> Do you get a charge out of her wanting you? Do you enjoy having two women fighting over you? You like keeping you wife in a state of anxiety to make you feel that you are so attractive that treating her badly does not make her leave?
> 
> Let me give you a tip. You have more problems in your relationship than you are aware of. The behavior you revealed here - is it a pattern in your relationship?. Do think it is OK to dismiss your wife’s apparently legitimate concerns?
> 
> If that is so, you are the type of man that will likely have a walk away wife. It will seem sudden to you but she will reach a point of no return after giving you a chance to change your dismissive treatment of her.
> 
> They try to get their husband to change to address their concerns for a time and then reach a tipping point. If he does not see her concerns as important and ignores them, she gives up. When she leaves it is over for good.


This makes me feel terrible reading this.

She asked me to skype with her late at night after the initial time i blew her off and asked if i was alone she than asked again on Saturday via text saying "i miss your voice" this was after my last post. (i told my wife about this) 

Today i sent her an email and told her that is inappropriate she texted me asking me what gives. 

I called her today with my wife present and i told her that we cant be friends anymore and that her comments and actions are out of line i told her i wish her luck and a good life and she said fine and hung up.


----------



## Love Song

Goldmember357 said:


> This makes me feel terrible reading this.
> 
> She asked me to skype with her late at night after the initial time i blew her off and asked if i was alone she than asked again on Saturday via text saying "i miss your voice" this was after my last post. (i told my wife about this)
> 
> Today i sent her an email and told her that is inappropriate she texted me asking me what gives.
> 
> I called her today with my wife present and i told her that we cant be friends anymore and that her comments and actions are out of line i told her i wish her luck and a good life and she said fine and hung up.


This is how TAM is supposed to work. You come here for advice, you get the truth and you make changes for the betterment of your marriage. Good for you for ending things with her. :smthumbup:


----------



## turnera

Nice. Good job. Now set up a romantic weekend somewhere and whisk your wife away.


----------



## iheartlife

goldmember357 said:


> i called her today with my wife present and i told her that we cant be friends anymore and that her comments and actions are out of line i told her i wish her luck and a good life and she said fine and hung up.


*thank god.*

Now start channeling your true self into your marriage and share everything with your wife.


----------



## brokenbythis

*Wow.. a guy who actually listens to reason and makes the right choice.*
My husband, on the other hand, has been having what I consider to be EA's with other women for years. One particular woman, who he has admitted he was in love with for the past 20 yrs (she never wanted to date him though) he sees, texts, meets and "helps" behind my back. He has discussed our marriage problems with her too.

I told him a few mths ago he had to cut all contact with her. He did, then a few weeks ago I found out he is back in contact with her. His excuse is she was going through a personal crisis and "needed" him. She is married by the way. He loves to rescue her and "be there for her".

He has absolutely no idea what a marriage is. He told me he is not willing to give up "friends" he has known for a lot longer than me. He told me I am asking him to be only loyal to me. I am trying to make him give up his "friends", trying to control him, etc.

I stand firm that if she is in his life in any way I am NOT. Goodbye... Hope she keeps him warm at night and is there for him like I have been for 12 years.


----------



## Catherine602

Please don't feel bad. I was trying to get you to see how it may appear to your wife. You could not seem to see things from what may have been her perspective. What I wrote does not describe what you meant to have her feel. 

I put myself in her place and tried to imagine how I would feel if my husband wanted to maintain a friendship with a woman who was my enemy. Any woman who try's to get a man to cheat is an enemy if he loves his wife. 

I think you have to take a fresh look at your relationship and how you let your wife know her value to you. I am not sure that she feels important to you right now. It took you a long time to fix this thing with this friend. It took her obvious persistent attempts to have an affair for you to finally see the light. 

So this is not the end of the thing. Women don't forget. If you want to sustain a good relationship with your wife, you are going to have to make changes. I think you owe her an apology. 

This drama could have been avoided if you were not so focused on your right to have a friend. Maybe focus on how your action affect your relationship and make reasonable changes.

Consider anything that distances you two as a big problem that needs attention. Making changes in yourself to suit your wife is not a capitulation to her control if they are simple request that are easy to honer and yield a big payoff in making your wife feel loved and important to you.


----------



## turnera

Moving forward...

Read His Needs Her Needs together

Start spending 15 hours a week together on bonding time

Print out the Love Buster questionnaire from marriagebuilders (avoid their toxic forum - you will get creamed), both of you fill it out and then share, so you each know how you LB (harm) your partner; spend the next 2-3 months eliminating those bad habits

After 2-3 months, print out their Emotional Needs questionnaire and do the same; change how you are meeting each other's ENs

Set aside one HOUR each week to discuss the status of your relationship; the rest of the week, HAVE FUN and ENJOY each other. Build up the feel-good chemicals all over again.

Put some spice in your life.


----------



## iheartlife

Also, The 5 Love Languages in addition to turnera's recs

It's a very short book and they have a fast free website questionnaire, get your wife to fill it out ASAP and you do it too.

What you will find is that you can learn to express your preferences / needs in the marriage and be heard and have them fulfilled by your wife.

You in turn learn how to communicate better and will find the ability to meet her needs more profoundly, as well.

it's a win/win situation, a no-brainer. best of luck to you.


----------



## Catherine602

One thing that has not been mentioned and is extremely important - how well do you feel your wife meets your needs? 

Can you think of why you may have wanted to hang onto to the friendship dispute her discomfort? Miight it have been your way of telling her that there is something missing. 
Of course don't use this as an excuse if there are areas that need attention. If you were aware that your needs were unmet, there are healthy ways to deal with it. 

Look especially at what this friendship did for you and how it may relate to what may be missing from your relationship. 

Make sure to use this unfortunate episode to examine you satisfaction and your wife. This could really be a boon to your relationship.


----------



## WorkingOnMe

Catherine602 said:


> One thing that has not been mentioned and is extremely important - how well do you feel your wife meets your needs?
> 
> Can you think of why you may have wanted to hang onto to the friendship dispute her discomfort? Miight it have been your way of telling her that there is something missing.
> Of course don't use this as an excuse if there are areas that need attention. If you were aware that your needs were unmet, there are healthy ways to deal with it.
> 
> Look especially at what this friendship did for you and how it may relate to what may be missing from your relationship.
> 
> Make sure to use this unfortunate episode to examine you satisfaction and your wife. This could really be a boon to your relationship.


Your first paragraph is the first thing I thought when I read this thread. Your second paragraph is why I didn't post my thoughts. Reading this site the last few months I'm beginning to think that there really are no healthy ways to deal with it. Your spouse either meets your needs or not. And you either choose to live with it or don't. But there seems to be no fixing it. Can't think of any success stories I've heard on here where that's happened.


----------



## turnera

WorkingOnMe said:


> Your spouse either meets your needs or not. And you either choose to live with it or don't. But there seems to be no fixing it. Can't think of any success stories I've heard on here where that's happened.


 That's silly, I know of dozens of couples who either reunited or who found each other after learning and following said methods.

If your spouse isn't caring about you, there's a reason, and it usually starts with YOU.


----------



## WorkingOnMe

I'm talking specifically about the sex in marriage board and what I've seen there in the last couple months is a bunch of people settling. I'd love if you could point me in the direction of a thread where a man made some change in his self and his frigid wife became everything he ever wanted.

Anyway that's not what OP's thread is about and I'm not going to hijack it. It's just an observation.


----------



## turnera

No, it's not about that. What you're describing IS the hardest thing to fix in a marriage, especially if she has a mental reason, as in an aversion. Such a thing would require her engaging in strict mental help to get past it.

That said, she will never achieve that realization if you just accept it. You'd either have to say "I can't stay married to you if you won't have sex" or you'd have to accept it. Do you know which one you're at?


----------



## turnera

However, you'd have to take a good hard look at your marriage, warts and all, FIRST, to see if there is anything on your side that is making her not desire you any more. Once you have honestly addressed those things, THEN you could put the onus on her. For example, my DH Love Busts me into the ground with his unwillingness to take care of our house. I hate him for it, and he KNOWS how important it is. Yet he still won't fix the damn house. So the only time we have sex now is when he initiates it and takes care of me first so I'm willing. Five years ago, we shopped for videos and toys together because he hadn't destroyed my feelings for him by LBing me so much; today, I wouldn't even consider it.


----------



## iheartlife

deleted--thought the better of it


----------



## DiZ

You need to cut contact right now with this woman. Your marriage should be more important.


----------



## NextTimeAround

Catherine602 said:


> Do you get a charge out of her wanting you? Do you enjoy having two women fighting over you? You like keeping you wife in a state of anxiety to make you feel that you are so attractive that treating her badly does not make her leave?


Goldmember, I would love to read your answer. I am convinced that men who insist upon these friendships just like spectating the cat fight.


----------



## Catherine602

Working there are success stories. Look up Daily Ground. 

A lot of people with problems stop posting. You don't know if it is because they solved their problems or gave up. 

I may be naive but I think that there are few insolvable problems. I read that LTR go through periods of problems followed by improvement. 

If you read DG thread, it seemed hopeless at first but be kept plugging away trying different things until he hit on the right thing. 

Don't fall into a feeling of defeat. Keep at it, you may have to do things that require you to push past your inhibitions.


----------



## jaquen

Goldmember357 said:


> but you are right she has changed and is purposely for some reason trying to start something with me. I think about it now and she purposely mentioned the ring and likely was giving other signs during dinner of her interest. It makes me angry knowing she would do such a thing and try to show off to my wife or scare her with the thought of her wanting me. I am pissed at the fact she would do that and it can threaten my marriage if i continue speaking to her.
> 
> I should of never remained friends with an ex i thought of marrying especially after i got married.


My initial response, based off your OP, was that your wife just needed to get over it. It's a super unpopular opinion on here I am sure, but I don't think a spouse has the right to dictate to you who your friends are, assuming that your intentions are pure. They can let their feelings be known, and you should always take them under consideration, but marriage is not a dictatorship. Asking your spouse to cut out friends, people who are extraordinarily important to the fabric of your life, is an enormous request, and could be viewed as totally unreasonable if that request is based off unfounded insecurities. 

But then you wrote the above. This woman is disrespectful, and you fully acknowledge that she's a potential threat to your marriage. Now I find myself confused as to why you even made this topic, when there is only one right option: end the friendship completely. Friendship, above all, is built on mutual respect, and your friend obviously doesn't have much respect for you, because she doesn't respect the most important relationship in your natural life.


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## iheartlife

jaquen said:


> I don't think a spouse has the right to dictate to you who your friends are, assuming that your intentions are pure.


That may be the case, in a hypothetical world.

Very, very, very few people PLAN on entering into an emotional affair. All it takes: spending time alone one on one (I'd include phone calls and email exchanges); confiding personal problems with one another; this leads to discussions about problems in the marriage; this leads to complaints about the spouse; feelings of care--not love, just care--are expressed; caring is proven by actions; the two become infatuated.

We can all be high and mighty about our rights to be friends with whomever we want and no spouse of ours is ever going to 'dictate' that. But I believe marriage is founded on a deep love and respect; we take into account our partners' feelings; we trust them not to take advantage of that to impose unreasonable requests; and we guard our hearts and love for our spouse by not putting ourselves into situations that MIGHT lead to love. We do not fool ourselves into thinking we are stronger than other people.

My feelings on this subject were very painfully earned.


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## Aristotle

Most people with good intentions would have called her exactly what she was, an ex-fiancee.


However, you have managed to call her a long term friend (with benefits) that you kind of dated a little bit but left for college then came back and fell in love with but decided it wasn't really love because you realized you didn't want her that much so you went from making love to friends with benefits, to just friends you keep in touch with because you have sooo much history.


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## Maricha75

jaquen said:


> *I don't think a spouse has the right to dictate to you who your friends are, assuming that your intentions are pure.* They can let their feelings be known, and you should always take them under consideration, but marriage is not a dictatorship. Asking your spouse to cut out friends, people who are extraordinarily important to the fabric of your life, is an enormous request, and could be viewed as totally unreasonable if that request is based off unfounded insecurities.


In theory, yes, you are correct. But it's about respect. If your spouse is uncomfortable with certain friends, you need to listen to WHY the spouse is uncomfortable. And if the spouse asks you to no longer speak to someone, you should respect that wish. It doesn't matter if the friendship is four years or four days. People say "trust your gut" and if your gut says "stop the friendship", you do it.


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## Jellybeans

jaquen said:


> *I don't think a spouse has the right to dictate to you who your friends are*


It's not about dictatorship. It's about protecting a marriage.


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## Aristotle

Just saw goldmember told the ex fiancee to have a nice life. Good for you man.

Wise decision.


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## jaquen

iheartlife said:


> That may be the case, in a hypothetical world.
> 
> Very, very, very few people PLAN on entering into an emotional affair. All it takes: spending time alone one on one (I'd include phone calls and email exchanges); confiding personal problems with one another; this leads to discussions about problems in the marriage; this leads to complaints about the spouse; feelings of care--not love, just care--are expressed; caring is proven by actions; the two become infatuated.


At which point if you find yourself slipping into an emotional affair, intentional or not, than that's the byproduct of deep fissures in your marriage, not the cause. An affair is always the end result of issues. So if it's gotten to that point, my wife and I need to address how the hell we got there in the first place.



iheartlife said:


> We can all be high and mighty about our rights to be friends with whomever we want and no spouse of ours is ever going to 'dictate' that. But I believe marriage is founded on a deep love and respect; we take into account our partners' feelings; we trust them not to take advantage of that to impose unreasonable requests; and we guard our hearts and love for our spouse by not putting ourselves into situations that MIGHT lead to love. We do not fool ourselves into thinking we are stronger than other people.
> 
> My feelings on this subject were very painfully earned.


This seems contradictory to me.

If I am to trust that my spouse "not to take advantage of that to impose unreasonable requests", then why not, with that same level of trust, put full faith behind the notion that your spouse wouldn't cheat on you? Or are we dealing with different levels of trust? In which case, if I can't fully trust my spouse, I don't want to be with her.

I get that a lot of people on this board have painful experiences with infidelity. That leads to a lot of cautionary behavior and advice on TAM, as though people are working to prevent their spouses, or even themselves, from cheating. I see people going as far as to avoid having friends of the opposite sex.

But that is neither my, nor my wife's, approach to marriage. I have zero reason to mistrust her, and we work hard to keep abreast of issues in our marriage because we communicate constantly about where we are. We don't dictate one another's friendships (tried that once before we were married, didn't work, and was a ultimately a pointless and very silly endeavor). We don't care about the sexes of our friends. And we don't spend time concerned about the possibility of infidelity. 

If that level of suspicion, mistrust, and constant worry becomes what our marriage is about, then it's time to think about ending it, affair or no affair.


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## CandieGirl

jaquen said:


> My initial response, based off your OP, was that your wife just needed to get over it. It's a super unpopular opinion on here I am sure, but I don't think a spouse has the right to dictate to you who your friends are, assuming that your intentions are pure. They can let their feelings be known, and you should always take them under consideration, but marriage is not a dictatorship. Asking your spouse to cut out friends, people who are extraordinarily important to the fabric of your life, is an enormous request, and could be viewed as totally unreasonable if that request is based off unfounded insecurities.
> 
> But then you wrote the above. This woman is disrespectful, and you fully acknowledge that she's a potential threat to your marriage. Now I find myself confused as to why you even made this topic, when there is only one right option: end the friendship completely. Friendship, above all, is built on mutual respect, and your friend obviously doesn't have much respect for you, because she doesn't respect the most important relationship in your natural life.


My husband used to think that my insistence on him cutting out his female friend was unreasonable...he also used to think I was insecure, etc...I finally was able to get him to see things from my side; he was hurting me by insisting on keeping this friendship alive, so it had to go. When he told her that there would be no more friendship, she turned on him like a rabid dog and verbally attacked both of us. And I'm glad she did; she showed her true colours to my husband, and now he knows that his friend was really no friend at all.


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## Aristotle

iheartlife said:


> That may be the case, in a hypothetical world.
> 
> Very, very, very few people PLAN on entering into an emotional affair. All it takes: spending time alone one on one (I'd include phone calls and email exchanges); confiding personal problems with one another; this leads to discussions about problems in the marriage; this leads to complaints about the spouse; feelings of care--not love, just care--are expressed; caring is proven by actions; the two become infatuated.
> 
> We can all be high and mighty about our rights to be friends with whomever we want and no spouse of ours is ever going to 'dictate' that. But I believe marriage is founded on a deep love and respect; we take into account our partners' feelings; we trust them not to take advantage of that to impose unreasonable requests; and we guard our hearts and love for our spouse by not putting ourselves into situations that MIGHT lead to love. We do not fool ourselves into thinking we are stronger than other people.
> 
> My feelings on this subject were very painfully earned.


Awesome reply. 

I think some people go against the grain to simply entertain themselves on the forums. I truly do believe this.


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## CandieGirl

iheartlife said:


> That may be the case, in a hypothetical world.
> 
> Very, very, very few people PLAN on entering into an emotional affair. All it takes: spending time alone one on one (I'd include phone calls and email exchanges); confiding personal problems with one another; this leads to discussions about problems in the marriage; this leads to complaints about the spouse; feelings of care--not love, just care--are expressed; caring is proven by actions; the two become infatuated.


What about people who pursue affairs (EA or PA) with no regard for the marriage? I'm sure that happens a lot...true predators.


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## jaquen

CandieGirl said:


> My husband used to think that my insistence on him cutting out his female friend was unreasonable...he also used to think I was insecure, etc...I finally was able to get him to see things from my side; he was hurting me by insisting on keeping this friendship alive, so it had to go. When he told her that there would be no more friendship, she turned on him like a rabid dog and verbally attacked both of us. And I'm glad she did; she showed her true colours to my husband, and now he knows that his friend was really no friend at all.



What does this woman's reaction to the ending of the friendship have to do with your insistence that he end the friendship?

Your husband was either going to eventually cheat with her, or not. And if he has the inclination to cheat on you, it wouldn't matter if this particular friendship ended or not.

Nobody can force your spouse into an affair, even women like the one above. Eventually somebody in the friendship for reasons beyond the pure joys of camaraderie will show their cards, at which point the person should end it. But all of this is totally irrelevant to whether you trust your spouse or not.

I've been here. My wife has had a couple male friends over the years who I KNEW had feelings for her. It was just a gut feeling. She didn't believe me, thought she knew them so well, and considered the relationships purely platonic. I told her to just watch out, because the men would eventually show their cards. Eventually, in both cases, the men made it clear they had feelings. These weren't bad guys here, but they were men who were developing feelings for an incredible, warm, open woman (and my wife truly is a spectacular human being). But she eventually had to end the friendships. And she did so _on her own_.

I never berated her. I never forced her to chose "them or me". No hysterics, ultimatums, tearful pleas, or proverbial lines drawn in the sand. I trusted her, and she eliminated these men when it became clear that they did not belong.


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## jaquen

Aristotle said:


> I think some people go against the grain to simply entertain themselves on the forums. I truly do believe this.


You've got to be kidding me. For some very strange reason you seem to be almost antagonistic toward the notion that people can, and do, approach their marriages from a different perspective than you.

This is hardly the first time that I've seen you making wild, and inappropriate, assumptions about posters on this board who's only "crime" was that they don't see eye to eye with you on how to conduct their marriages.


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## CandieGirl

jaquen said:


> What does this woman's reaction to the ending of the friendship have to do with your insistence that he end the friendship?


Her reaction proved my point 100%. It wasn't a friendship; she just wanted to keep him around as an option for the next time she got bored. He hadn't heard from her in 2 years. Nice friend.


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## Aristotle

jaquen said:


> You've got to be kidding me. For some very strange reason you seem to be almost antagonistic toward the notion that people can, and do, approach their marriages from a different perspective than you.
> 
> This is hardly the first time that I've seen you making wild, and inappropriate, assumptions about posters on this board who's only "crime" was that they don't see eye to eye with you on how to conduct their marriages.


I have yet to see you in a thread where you are not debating against the majority on every issue possible. It seems to be a trend for you or just your personality. But let me try to be reasonable and see if I can be "eye to eye" with you on this issue. Your spouse should never dictate your friendships, even if the friendships are EXs/ex relationships. You have never told your wife who she can and can't be friends with even when she had two male friends you knew wanted more from her. Instead of asking her to stop being friends with them, you let them spend more time with your wife and make moves on her. They were good guys though, but your wife is a vortex and even the most sincere guy would fall for her if she spends enough time with them. Eventually they made the move, as you expected, and your wife noticed. Are we eye to eye still? Being that she is perfect, she did exactly what you expected her to do without you ever forcing the issue. Now she respects you so much more because as always, you were right. 

Even before the OPs ex-fiancee made a move on him, you were going to disagree with the majority and say it's okay for an ex to be friends with her husband? I am sorry, that is just outright WRONG marriage advice. Is it your opinion, yes. Do I think we should all have opinions? Yes. Is it good marriage advice? NO. It's absolutely HORRIBLE marriage advice.

I'm sorry if I am wrong though. If you truly believe what you typed, I apologize. It just feels to me like you are trying to argue, that's all.


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## Jellybeans

Aristotle said:


> I have yet to see you in a thread where you are not debating against the majority on every issue possible.


Is it a troll?


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## Aristotle

Jellybeans said:


> Is it a troll?


I am really beginning to wonder if he purposely stirs the pot in every thread or he truly believes what he types.


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## jaquen

Aristotle said:


> I have yet to see you in a thread where you are not debating against the majority on every issue possible.


Then you've yet to read the majority of the threads I've participated in. 

And you seem to be working under the banner of some sort of very flawed logic that even if my views ran contrary to the "majority" on every issue, than the automatic conclusion is that I'm being contrary just for kicks.

There might be fools who troll this board for the purpose of getting some kind of cheap thrill by being rebellious, but I find that both pathetic, and laughable. It's equally as laughable that you assume my entire entire belief system is all manufactured just to get some sort of rise out of you and this board. :rofl:



Aristotle said:


> If you truly believe what you typed, I apologize. It just feels to me like you are trying to argue, that's all.


Well thank you for apologizing, because yes you have been so far off the mark with how you perceive my intentions, especially with our very limited contact, that it was rather baffling.

And yes I believe everything I type. Why? Because I have an incredibly successful relationship, have been madly in love with the same woman my entire adult life, we are very happy, and the bottom line is that it works for this marriage. There are a lot of issues, matters, and concerns that people on TAM sweat consistently that are non-issues for us (i.e., picking friends). We are "that couple" in real life that a lot of people look up to, and what is behind closed doors is just as beautiful as it's appearance out in the open. I am very proud of my wife, of our relationship, of the love story we have together so far.

So while I totally respect your, and the majority's, right to dole out any kind of advice you chose, I will continue to speak on what *works for us*. 

And considering that I've met plenty of people in my short time here who have appreciated my views, I'm going to assume that our way does indeed resonate with some.

Edit: And the fact that you, and Jellybeans, are seriously having a discussion as to whether I am a "troll" just about says it all. I see the "group think" is alive and well for some of you. I am clearly wasting my time in even trying to explain my perspective to people so quick to wield such incredible judgement.


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## iheartlife

CandieGirl said:


> What about people who pursue affairs (EA or PA) with no regard for the marriage? I'm sure that happens a lot...true predators.


yes, there are lots of flavors of cheating. Two other kinds: empty, needy people who are bottomless pits in constant search for validation. They need counseling and cannot always be fixed.

Then there are narcissists of various stripes. The actual universe was created for them, so the usual rules simply don't apply to them. They desperately need counseling and often can't be fixed.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Aristotle

jaquen said:


> My initial response, based off your OP, was that your wife just needed to get over it. It's a super unpopular opinion on here I am sure, but I don't think a spouse has the right .....


It is indeed the unpopular opinion....

Let me make sure I see you eye to eye on this one.... Ex-fiancee or not, his wife has no say in her husband having a friendship with her. 

lol, amazing stuff there. I'd say that is pot stirring at its finest.


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## jaquen

Aristotle said:


> It is indeed the unpopular opinion....
> 
> Let me make sure I see you eye to eye on this one.... Ex-fiancee or not, his wife has no say in her husband having a friendship with her.
> 
> lol, amazing stuff there. I'd say that is pot stirring at its finest.


Did you actually bother to read the rest of my post? 

"*They can let their feelings be known, and you should always take them under consideration* but marriage is not a dictatorship. Asking your spouse to cut out friends, people who are extraordinarily important to the fabric of your life, is an enormous request, and could be viewed as totally unreasonable *if that request is based off unfounded insecurities.*"

Did you also see where, after he clarified that he was aware the woman was intentionally trying to get him back, a point missing in the OP, I jumped on the "end the friendship" bandwagon, you know the precious majority you're so proud to belong to?

Or are you just, for whatever bizarre reason, intent on delving into asinine internet debates?

Get a grip. Clearly something about me irks you, as you've become, across a couple threads, downright inflammatory toward me. But you're a big boy, so deal with it, or put me on ignore. Because all these troll accusations, and constant attempts to unearth my "real" intentions, are tired and frankly a bit...creepy. Everyone isn't subscribed, thank God, to the Aristotle way of marriage.


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## Aristotle

jaquen said:


> Or are you just, for whatever bizarre reason, intent on delving into asinine internet debates?
> 
> Get a grip. Clearly something about me irks you, as you've become, across a couple threads, downright inflammatory toward me. But you're a big boy, so deal with it, or put me on ignore.


Psychological projection or projection bias is a psychological defense mechanism where a person subconsciously denies his or her own attributes, thoughts, and emotions, which are then ascribed to the outside world, usually to other people. Thus, projection involves imagining or projecting the belief that others originate those feelings. 


....... or you could just put the super popular opinion on ignore.... oh wait.


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## jaquen

:lol:

One thing I can say about your Aristotle. You certainly do keep things...interesting.


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## Aristotle

jaquen said:


> :lol:
> 
> One thing I can say about your Aristotle. You certainly do keep things...interesting.


I'm just easy . You get me everytime.


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## Jacked

The fact that you even posted the question, starting with two fat paragraphs of all the history you have (more appropriately, the reasons you have convinced yourself and now trying to convince us that you should be allowed to keep this woman in your life), followed by the fact that you never told your "true love?" about her, creating an environment in which this woman feels she has a RIGHT to a separate relationship with you despite your wife's feelings, tells me that you have already chosen who you want. 

You want total strangers to give you permission when there shouldn't even be a question. The word you don't seem to understand is "Loyalty." I feel sad for your wife because she has already lost the war. Be kind and let her go quickly if you can't put her first now and always.


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## turnera

Jacked, go ahead and read the whole thread before you post, it will save you from speaking to a point that's already been resolved.


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## Jacked

I didn't realize there were more pages. I thought I had read to the end. Makes me wonder if I missed more pages on other posts. Probably. Well, glad it was resolved. 

Sorry to all. ;D


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## turnera

No worries, we all do that when we first come to a forum and aren't used to how it works. We also get tons of old threads commented on cos newbies don't realize to look at the last date posted.


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