# Getting prepared



## ITjustme

So 2 nights ago my wife staight up told me she is no longer sexually attracted to me. She says she loves me but is not in love with me. I had no clue this was coming. We have 2 kids and i do not want to break up the family. We have been married for 10 years. She is already talking about seperating though it will be a while until it happens. I've set up MC but i don't think her heart is in it she says she's willing to try but says it's only because its the right thing to do.

My wife and kids are my whole world. and i don't know where to go from here

any advice i would really like to save this!


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## mattsmom

Go forward with the MC, even if she's not committed to it. It will help you, and she may hear something that changes her mind about the counseling, at least. If you want the marriage to work, putting forth this effort is a good first step.

I would also encourage you to share more of your story here, if you feel comfortable doing so. There are a lot of people who have probably experienced the same thing that you're going through who can give you advice along the way.

Best of luck
Mattsmom


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## Alpha

Out of the blue? Didn't see this coming?

Ten dollars says that there is another man.


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## ITjustme

OK. So she has told me that before we got married I Said something that has stayed with ever since. She was talking to me and told me that one of her x's told her that men would pay her for the things she would do in the bedroom out of protection over her and the way it sounded to me I said well that was rude sounds like he's calling you a *****. the way she explains it i lost her trust that night and i've never been able to gain it back. She said it made her feel powerful and wanted, and i took that away. With all of this she says she's been just giving sex out of obligation and feeling guilty. She also says i'm a little to submissive in the bedroom. That's probably is true i'm always afraid i'm going to hurt her and i'm more than willing to work on that. She getting ready to turn 30 and says she sexually frustrated and wants to see if there's more out there.

The other reason she gave me was that we had been together about 6 months when we moved in together. She wa 17 and i was 22 she was going to move 2 hours away and at that time she was in a bad situiation at her house so i offered. then we ended up getting married after she turned 18. She says because of this She never got a chance to find herself.

For the last couple of night i have not been able to hold it together. Today i have been trying my damndest to hold up a strong front, i'm tired of looking weak. SHe swears she's been faithful and i fully believe her. I'm just looking for someone to talk to about it because we weren't able to get MC until next week. Any advice would be much appreciated


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## JustSomeGuyWho

I have to agree it is very likely there is another man. At the very least an emotional affair if not a physical one. If there wasn't, I would have expected a LOT of discussion leading up to the point of separation. You wouldn't have been totally shocked. Without the influence of having other options, she would have wanted to work on this.

I would start looking for clues. You could post this on the infidelity thread if you want some help on the approach you want to take. If it is another man then your top priority would be to end THAT relationship if you want any chance of keeping your wife.


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## JustSomeGuyWho

ITjustme said:


> OK. So she has told me that before we got married I Said something that has stayed with ever since. She was talking to me and told me that one of her x's told her that men would pay her for the things she would do in the bedroom out of protection over her and the way it sounded to me I said well that was rude sounds like he's calling you a *****. the way she explains it i lost her trust that night and i've never been able to gain it back. She said it made her feel powerful and wanted, and i took that away. With all of this she says she's been just giving sex out of obligation and feeling guilty. She also says i'm a little to submissive in the bedroom. That's probably is true i'm always afraid i'm going to hurt her and i'm more than willing to work on that. She getting ready to turn 30 and says she sexually frustrated and wants to see if there's more out there.
> 
> The other reason she gave me was that we had been together about 6 months when we moved in together. She wa 17 and i was 22 she was going to move 2 hours away and at that time she was in a bad situiation at her house so i offered. then we ended up getting married after she turned 18. She says because of this She never got a chance to find herself.
> 
> For the last couple of night i have not been able to hold it together. Today i have been trying my damndest to hold up a strong front, i'm tired of looking weak. SHe swears she's been faithful and i fully believe her. I'm just looking for someone to talk to about it because we weren't able to get MC until next week. Any advice would be much appreciated


Ok, while I am not convinced there isn't someone else, let's give her the benefit of the doubt. 

She said that someone telling her that men would pay to have sex with her made her feel powerful and "wanted?" ... and your response took that away from her? So, 10 years later she wants a divorce and has no interest in working on it? I'm sorry but she doesn't sound like her head is screwed on straight.


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## 3Xnocharm

ITjustme said:


> OK. So she has told me that before we got married I Said something that has stayed with ever since. She was talking to me and told me that one of her x's told her that men would pay her for the things she would do in the bedroom out of protection over her and the way it sounded to me I said well that was rude sounds like he's calling you a *****. the way she explains it i lost her trust that night and i've never been able to gain it back. She said it made her feel powerful and wanted, and i took that away. With all of this she says she's been just giving sex out of obligation and feeling guilty. She also says i'm a little to submissive in the bedroom. That's probably is true i'm always afraid i'm going to hurt her and i'm more than willing to work on that. She getting ready to turn 30 and says she sexually frustrated and wants to see if there's more out there.


This is absurd. If her ego and self confidence were so fragile that THIS shattered it, you didnt stand a chance to begin with.


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## tacoma

Yes, there is another man.


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## mablenc

Sorry but leaving you because you did not treat her like a woman of the streets? She wants to know what's out there?
She knows what's out there, I'm sure he has a name. Nobody suppresses something so ridiculous for 10 years then all if the sudden confesses. If this was true you would have heard about it sooner and many times. Seems like she's looking for excuses to justify whatever it is she is doing. 

Sorry to ask but, based on what she said about feeling power by getting paid for sex, have you seen an increase in money lately? Or new things around the house? New clothes?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Thundarr

ITjustme said:


> So 2 nights ago my wife staight up told me she is no longer sexually attracted to me. She says she loves me but is not in love with me. I had no clue this was coming. We have 2 kids and i do not want to break up the family. We have been married for 10 years. She is already talking about seperating though it will be a while until it happens. I've set up MC but i don't think her heart is in it she says she's willing to try but says it's only because its the right thing to do.
> 
> My wife and kids are my whole world. and i don't know where to go from here
> 
> any advice i would really like to save this!


ITjustme this is deshavu. You have very few options and you have to act fast. You have to make you wife instantly respect you and find you attractive and think you are worth fightng for and you don't have much time. 

Follow this google search to understand what 180 is and why you need to do it now.
https://www.google.com/#sclient=psy...14,d.eWU&fp=edd23b38b6ed5148&biw=1896&bih=960


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## wilderness

Ridiculous. If that is the best she can come up with, most likely you are a great husband. For now, get a keylogger installed on her computer, a VAR in her car, and access to her phone and text messages.
Whatever you do, don't move out of your home. If she wants out that badly, over a casual conversation that happened over 10 years ago (yet she married you anyway), she leaves, not you. If she wants an in house seperation make sure she is the one to leave the bedroom, not you.


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## Toffer

Find the OM and you'll have your answers


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## Thumper

Ask yourself if you've been doing enough to keep your marriage "alive", helping around the house, helping with the kids, dinners, showing your appreciation. 10 years is the first year a marriage can become a "rut". Couples tend to get complacent, stop working for each other, and do the kids, work thing only. Do you think you've missed signs at her being unhappy? Has she expressed issues that you didn't take serious at the time?

Do you spend much quality time with her? How often to you two go out on dates? How often do you just listen to her after a day of work. Maybe she's just disconnecting from the marriage out of pure boredom. I agree you need to explore the OM theory, but DO NOT accuse her of anything unless you have 100% proof, or you will do even more damage.

Depending on how you answered the above questions. Give 

Winning Your Wife Back Before It's Too Late: Dr. Gary Smalley, Deborah Smalley, Dr. Greg Smalley: 0020049055939: Amazon.com: Books

a read. Maybe even 5 love languages a read as well.

Good luck, hope things work out for you, and remember, be patient you cant fix this overnight, but you can wreck it forever with one comment.


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## wiigirl

Alpha said:


> Out of the blue? Didn't see this coming?
> 
> Ten dollars says that there is another man.











That's a solid bet IMHO.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## happyman64

ITJUST ME

Do yourself a favor. Go to the store today and buy a voice activated recorder (VAR). In fact buy two.

Then place one in her car so you can listen to her talking on her cell phone. Listen to what she says to her GF's and confirm if there is someone else.

Hide the second one in the house where she is often alone and talks on the phone.

Verify that there is no one else. Be smart and get all the facts. MC is a good option if both spouses are being truthful.

I know a few couples that were married young. This can happen.

But you should make it clear to your wife that if she does move out, separate and then D you that you will not be her Plan B.

Protect yourself and your children. Work to improve you.

And get a good attorney. 

HM64


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## ITjustme

No matter what i still believe that she has been faithful.

She did tell me about 9 months ago that things were getting stale in the bedroom. I have asked what can we do. She tells me i don't want to have to tell you what i want and clams up. She says she can't open up to me in the bedroom because of what i said. I've always been a little hands of when it comes to sex because I've been rejected so much. She also tells me that it's no fun if she's not turned on. Which i fully understand. So i try to turn her on Back rubs full body massage, anything i think might make her want me. Don't get me wrong i want sex as much as the next guy.

As to helping around the house i have no problems with that I cook when i'm home, i do dishes, i take out the trash even do laundry when i can. I have always helped with the kids they are school age now so i always try to help get them out the door in the morning. If my schedule allows get them in the bath at night feed the and get them to bed, read stories.


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## ITjustme

AS for the 180 am i to stop asking her about this? I still don't fully understand it and i'm just trying to make myself figure it out? i have already tried not to stop showing so much emotion in front of her and i can't in front of the kids. I don't want them to know what's going on at all.thank for the advice i will go check out those books tonight. As for the 180 i will start


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## ITjustme

No extra money i think its just something that made her feel good. I may have got the wording wrong i can barely think lately i haven't been sleeping well and can barely eat.

I almost think that this may be some kind of mid-life crisis she's been working out a lot(i usually go with her). She's trying to lose weight. Though she looks great. She has been more on a healthy kick and same here. I was told my chlorestol was moderate so we started working together to try to help each other in this.


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## ITjustme

Thumper said:


> Do you think you've missed signs at her being unhappy? Has she expressed issues that you didn't take serious at the time?
> 
> As to this Yes most likely I am horrible at picking up on signs that could be one of my true downfalls even she has told me this. As to if she's ever said anything, I always listen and take things seriously. I am pretty thickheaded when it comes to sign i just don'pick up on things.


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## PieceOfSky

I don't mean to imply this is what you should say (what do I know -- my marriage is all but gone!), but,fwiw, these are my first thoughts about what I'd want her to know...

"You know, I had no idea I said something that hurt you so. But please try to understand, when I hear words indicating how great you were sexually with another man, well, I don't know, my mind goes haywire. I said what I said, most likely because I couldn't stand to think he was a deserving guy. Certainly, I didn't want to take anything away from you, or diminish each other in each other's eyes.

It is true many men, given the chance, would pay top dollar for one night with you. But, please understand, I have pursued you with all my heart, courting you, loving you, building a family with you -- not just for your sexual abilities, not just for your body, but for all of you. Don't you see that? 

Anyways, if you truly have been bothered by this all these years, why haven't you told me before? Did you and I just missed it? It's not fair to have kept this. And surely you can see why I might have reacted "defensively" at the time, and surely you must see I value and desire you more than he did? 

(If no good answer comes forth I would say. I think this is not the real issue. Clearly your unhappy, but this cannot be the reason why NOW you are choosing to quit.


Btw, I do not presume an affair. But, it does seem like she is trying to rationalize leaving by reaching way way past the statute if limitations! I'm sorry to say.


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## Alpha

How is she as a wife and a mother? Is she helpful around the house? Does she work and help support the family? 

Or is she a princess? And have you put her on a pedestal?


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## ITjustme

She is a Loving and caring wife and mother. She is a stay at home mom that was a decision that we both worked out.

After another talk last night I asked if what i said was the only reason. Her answer is no. Basically what she told me is that we got married to young, she didn't have a chance to live her life and struggle to be herself she was never truly attracted to me sexually. She married me because I'm a good man and always knew i would treat her right and thought we could work on the sexual attraction and that it would come with time.

But it never has! we are going to talk to mc next week but she has already said she needs to move forward. The mc is the first logical step that she owes the marriage but next is a seperation to see how much she misses me. 

She says doesn't think we are truly compatible and is afraid it just won't work. she is pulling away from me very fast no longer wants me to touch her says it feels as if i'm being possessive. I just feel a need to connect with her. I've told her i will back off. I know she still cares for i can see it in her eyes. I'm going to prepare for the worst but hope for the best, but i'm afraid all that hope does is make it hurt more.


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## Alpha

Correct me if I am wrong here ITjustme.

So your wife when she was 17 years old, was told by a lover that she was so good in bed that she could get paid for it. This was over 10 years ago. You come to her defense, but she holds this grudge which you don't even know about.

She has two children with you. She is a loving wife. She is also a good mother. 

And all of a sudden she wants to leave you and split the family because the sex isn't good enough for her? 

Sorry, I don't buy it. Something else is going on and you be smart and start digging around.

Letting her out of the house is the worst thing you can do. Do not give her the visa to screw someone else. If you think you are hurting now, how do you think you will feel when you find out she's banging the postman? 

Do not agree to a separation. Keep her at home and monitor her behavior. Be very clear to her that if she leaves on her own volition, you will NOT give her one dime.


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## Thundarr

ITjustme said:


> She is a Loving and caring wife and mother. She is a stay at home mom that was a decision that we both worked out.
> 
> After another talk last night I asked if what i said was the only reason. Her answer is no. Basically what she told me is that we got married to young, she didn't have a chance to live her life and struggle to be herself she was never truly attracted to me sexually. She married me because I'm a good man and always knew i would treat her right and thought we could work on the sexual attraction and that it would come with time.
> 
> But it never has! we are going to talk to mc next week but she has already said she needs to move forward. The mc is the first logical step that she owes the marriage but next is a seperation to see how much she misses me.
> 
> She says doesn't think we are truly compatible and is afraid it just won't work. she is pulling away from me very fast no longer wants me to touch her says it feels as if i'm being possessive. I just feel a need to connect with her. I've told her i will back off. I know she still cares for i can see it in her eyes. I'm going to prepare for the worst but hope for the best, but i'm afraid all that hope does is make it hurt more.


ehh. I dont like the picture this is painting ITjustme. She may be justifying her feelings and re-writing history but what's she's saying is common with young girls who marry naively to get away from home and thinking they'll be grown up and married. I always assume there's another interest because it just seems like there always is. In this case, my assumption is that she's enamored or infatuated. If she's got some character then nothing's going on but having feelings of desire are enough to make her question why she doesn't have those for you. ( I'm speculating based on what I've seen so this could be off base ).

I still think you have to be willing to lose her in order to have the best shot at making her see you differently. Try not to be clingy or emotionally desvastated ( yea it's easy to say ). Those emotionally weak positions strip you of self confidence and that will be a fast track to her wanting out.


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## ITjustme

So we went to our first MC appt. how does everyone here feel about divorce busters he recommended that book to me. I have started it. I know everyone recommends the 180 but isn't that just for affairs. I'm also reading NMMNG and think some of it may pertain to me but not all of it.

I'm willing to put the work into this. I have done some digging and still have no reason to believe there's anyone else. Her thought's are If there was never really any attraction on her side can we build from there. If I have to I will start all over with her but the thought of separation still scares the crap out of me. I look at separation as time apart to reflect on our marriage see how much miss one another and determine if we want to work on it she sees it as we are done if she misses me maybe she'll come back. she wants us both to date. I just think that will confuse the issue.

I haven't been sleeping but 4 hours a night since she told all of this to me i can barely eat. I've lost 15 lbs. since she told me and its only been 2 weeks.

thanks for everything you all have replied with I never expected this i feel so overwhelmed!


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## Thundarr

Divorce busters sounds like a good one for you. Remember the original thought behind 180 which came out of that book is to do something vastly different that what you've been doing since what you've been doing isn't working and it was not targeted at infidelity. It was for stopping the bad dynamics in a failing marriage. IMO most everything listed in 180 is self healing and self confidence advice.


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## ITjustme

So we have 2 big vacations to get through together before we can separate. I don't feel like there is any way to stop any of it. She has already taken off her wedding ring, which completely destroyed me. we got through the first vacation but she's completely distancing herself from me. It's tearing me apart


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## happyman64

I think her not wearing her ring anymore shows you how immature and selfish she really is.

Do yourself a favor. Start detaching and preparing yourself for D with some good outselling.

You should also keep any rings she is not wearing.

If she wants to divorce you and no longer work on the marriage then get yourself in the best shape mentally, physically and financially.

Be strong and show her you will be just fine in the future without her. She wants to bang OM.


She wants to go find herself.

So no moping in front of her. 

Show her you will be just fine. Because in the end you will be.

HM64


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## PieceOfSky

ITjustme said:


> So we have 2 big vacations to get through together before we can separate. I don't feel like there is any way to stop any of it. She has already taken off her wedding ring, which completely destroyed me. we got through the first vacation but she's completely distancing herself from me. It's tearing me apart


Is trying to be with her while you see separation looming ahead extremely difficult -- in the sense that somehow you have to be on guard against behaviors that will further cause her to rationalize and/or be more disinterested in you?

How long before separation -- is it already decided you will separate.

Wishing you strength and courage.


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## ITjustme

As for the separation, it will probably happen about 3 weeks from now. we both have IC starting next week. the have a 2 week vacation that was already paid for. I don't want to separate before because we are going to see family and i don't want the kids to be overly confused. So we are waiting until we get back. She's been looking for a job so she can find an apartment. and in the meantime i guess i will move in with my parents.

I don't want things to get nasty. I want full rights to see my kids whenever i like. I miss the wife i had before, But i guess i have been blind to everything.she rarely talks to me now. We drove 45 mins. back from dinner last night with some friends and she didn't say a word to me.

The day i noticed she had taken off her wedding ring we were at the gym together. I confronted her about it and she says wearing it now feels fake. It feels to me that she's just trying to get herself out there so everyone now she's available, but that's probably just me reading to much into things. 

I love my wife and feel like she's ripping my heart out, and barely has any emotion over it, but i guess that's her detaching herself to not feel the pain. It been almost a month since she told me and i'm still having issues detaching myself from it. I am continuing to try though holding it all in sucks.

Thanks for the support i don't really have anybody to talk to about this except her and the IC. I'm trying to stop talking to her about it worried it will just push her further away.


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## just_about_done

IT, this is just my opinion so tifwiw. It sounds to me like she either has someone in mind or has received enough interest from other men that she feels she can do "better". When someone says we should both see other people, it usually means I want to date other people but you're in the way. I think she's viewing separation as a test run at the single life. 

I wish you the best. However this turns out, you'll be better for it. Good luck.


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## PieceOfSky

Beware that seemingly merely "logistical" choices made as you separate -- say, you moving in with your parents -- can have a major impact on custody arrangements decided by the court.

I often hear folks, especially men, being told "Do not move out of the house, leaving the kids behind", because it will very negatively affect custody decisions.

It may feel painful to have to be considering such tactical matters now, but I strongly think that you need to be aware of what you need to avoid doing, during separation, so that if you eventually divorce, you have the best possible outcome.

I would google "dads divorce". I would also set up a free initial consultation with a divorce attorney to get some guidance on pitfalls to avoid. And/or specifically ask for that sort of info in the "Considering Divorce/Separation" sub-forum.


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## PieceOfSky

I just re-read this thread.

ITJustMe, you seem to be overlooking one very strong possibility, and, if it turns out to be real, the fact you are not willing to face it now and do something about it WILL BE WHAT MAKES IT UNFIXABLE.

I never in a million years would have thought my wife would have had an EA or PA. Or flat out lie to my face, in front of our kids even, once let alone over and over. But she did.

IMHO, now is your one chance to uncover if something like an EA is going on and still be able to do something about it. You owe it to your kids and yourself to bite the bullet and "go all clandestine ops" to find out one way or another.

Granted, there are other explanations possible. But if it is an EA/PA, you won't get another chance to contain the damage.


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## BrockLanders

Lots of red flags here. Have you snooped at all?


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## ITjustme

So we got into a huge fight last night, Because i can't seem to keep my mouth shut about this. She ended up on the couch and i slept in our bed. I have snooped and found no evidence of anything. I think i may have made things worse last night by unfortunately pouring my heart out to her. Though she says she feel i am just trying to make her feel guilty and thats all i've been doing through our entire marriage. Using guilt to keep with her with me. 

As to all that maybe i am and just don't recognize it as guilt. She has been telling me that i trapped into staying with me when she was young and so she stayed with me so as not to hurt me and since i was a good man. That i pleaded with her to stay instead of giving her the choice. When she brought this up again last night she asked if i felt that was right and i told i thought it was right for our situation. then she got mad and i told her "sorry that i cared so much" which just pissed her off more saying that was just more guilt. I don't feel good about any of this. I guess it is what it is. It still hurts, but i don't think i have any choice in the matter anymore. I guess i'm being to pushy. I feel like if i was given a chance i could change and we could work through this. She wants space, I'm willing to give it to her. I love her with all my heart and still can't think of my life without her. I never wanted to be a part time dad. I just don't see anything good coming out of this.


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## lifeistooshort

ITjustme said:


> So we got into a huge fight last night, Because i can't seem to keep my mouth shut about this. She ended up on the couch and i slept in our bed. I have snooped and found no evidence of anything. I think i may have made things worse last night by unfortunately pouring my heart out to her. Though she says she feel i am just trying to make her feel guilty and thats all i've been doing through our entire marriage. Using guilt to keep with her with me.
> 
> As to all that maybe i am and just don't recognize it as guilt. She has been telling me that i trapped into staying with me when she was young and so she stayed with me so as not to hurt me and since i was a good man. That i pleaded with her to stay instead of giving her the choice. When she brought this up again last night she asked if i felt that was right and i told i thought it was right for our situation. then she got mad and i told her "sorry that i cared so much" which just pissed her off more saying that was just more guilt. I don't feel good about any of this. I guess it is what it is. It still hurts, but i don't think i have any choice in the matter anymore. I guess i'm being to pushy. I feel like if i was given a chance i could change and we could work through this. She wants space, I'm willing to give it to her. I love her with all my heart and still can't think of my life without her. I never wanted to be a part time dad. I just don't see anything good coming out of this.


Bad, bad move. Groveling is sooooo unattractive, and "forgive me for caring too much" DOES reek of guilt tripping. Why would you want someone that doesn't want you? How can you stand sex with someone that's told you they're not sexually attracted to you? I couldn't, but that's me. Tell her that you love her and would like to save the marriage but if she doesn't show her the door, and tell her you'll look for someone that does want you. It might increase your value for her to know you're going to get someone else. 
I told my ex directly that I didn't want sex with him, that I didn't love him, and wanted nothing to do with him, and he STILL tried to guilt trip me into staying. It made him look so pathetic in my eyes.....sorry for the harsh tone but the more you push the less value you have in her eyes.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## happyman64

Itjustme

You need to stop talking to her.

You need to mentally prepare yourself from this split.

You need to realize how selfish she is behaving.

You need to realize that you can only control "you" and your girl is full of crap.

Let her go.

You will be just fine. The harder you make it for her to leave the easier she will find it to leave.

Your biggest mistake is not showing her the door.....

So try it.

You might be surprised.

Show her the door.

The key is not looking back.

HM


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## ITjustme

I always thought she was attracted to me until She told me she wasn't. I guess I was just so in love with her I couldn't see it. I don't want sex with someone who is not attracted to me and unfortunately now i feel like all i have been getting Is pity or duty sex for the last 12 years. even I thought she loved me back. I just feel so hurt and ashamed at the same time. I feel i should have known and that now am i even worthy?


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## ITjustme

happyman64 said:


> Itjustme
> 
> You need to stop talking to her.
> 
> You need to mentally prepare yourself from this split.
> 
> You need to realize how selfish she is behaving.
> 
> You need to realize that you can only control "you" and your girl is full of crap.
> 
> Let her go.
> 
> You will be just fine. The harder you make it for her to leave the easier she will find it to leave.
> 
> Your biggest mistake is not showing her the door.....
> 
> So try it.
> 
> You might be surprised.
> 
> Show her the door.
> 
> The key is not looking back.
> 
> HM


The thing is we don't have an easy way of splitting she has no where to go and no job she is looking. i don't want to hurt the kids and my relationship so i don't want to leave. I am looking at staying with my parents because i can't afford another place either.


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## happyman64

Send her to your parents.

Stay in the house with the kids.

You are going to find out that most of her issues have nothing to do with you.

She is full of crap.

Be patient. Be calm. Be silent. Just listen.

And do not leave the home.


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## PieceOfSky

ITjustme said:


> .
> .
> .
> I think i may have made things worse last night by unfortunately pouring my heart out to her. Though she says she feel i am just trying to make her feel guilty and thats all i've been doing through our entire marriage. Using guilt to keep with her with me.
> 
> As to all that maybe i am and just don't recognize it as guilt. She has been telling me that i trapped into staying with me when she was young and so she stayed with me so as not to hurt me and since i was a good man. That i pleaded with her to stay instead of giving her the choice.
> .
> .
> .



Kind of puts in in a tough spot, doesn't it? You are no longer allowed to tell her how you feel, because it might make her feel guilty, which would then just prove that you are trying to make her feel guilty to manipulate her to do something she has no power to resist doing.

Kind of makes you responsible for her emotions and actions.

Kind of frees her from having to have any adult responsibilities in your relationship.

Kind of frees her from having to own any part of her decision to withdraw from the relationship.

Kind of makes you responsible for anything and everything in her life that disappoints her or frustrates her. 

--- Sarcasm ON ---
How selfish of you -- to have feelings, and to let her know what they honestly are. Didn't you know this relationship was supposed to be all about how she feels? Didn't you know you are not allowed to have feelings of your own, let alone express them to her openly honestly? Didn't you know you need to censor the thoughts and emotions you would otherwise express because you are such a good man and she is powerless to do anything but give in and succumb to your selfish wants and needs?

--- Sarcasm OFF ---


It feels to me she is manipulating you.
It's not fair.
You'd be wise to understand it.
Might help to permit yourself to get angry about it, and knock a few inches off the height of that responsibility-free pedestal she wants you to keep her on.

I suggest you purchase In Sheeps Clothing and read Chapter 9. You can buy the Kindle version and instantly view it in your browser.

I also suggest you checkout Out of the FOG - Top 100 Behaviors & Traits of Individuals who suffer from Personality Disorders

I am not saying she has a Personality Disorder (and, my therapist advises me it is NOT a good idea to suggest to anyone that they have one). But, just reading some of the ways people manipulate is opening my eyes to things in my life. I could be wrong, but I'm feeling that line of study might be useful to you too.

I wish you strength.


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## just_about_done

She want's to seperate but has no place to go? Here's how you respond to that. "Tough sh!t. Hit the bricks toots, the kids can stay here with me." 

Did she think it was going to be easy? Does she expect you to move? 

"Hey, I'd like to destroy the life you thought you had, and I'd like you to be the one to do all the leg work to make that happen. What do you say?" It's bad manners really.


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## happyman64

She wants to separate but has no real plan.

So make a plan.

The plan includes you and teh kids.

Let her feel consequences for her actions.


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## Thundarr

ITjustme said:


> So we got into a huge fight last night, Because i can't seem to keep my mouth shut about this. She ended up on the couch and i slept in our bed. I have snooped and found no evidence of anything. I think i may have made things worse last night by unfortunately pouring my heart out to her. Though she says she feel i am just trying to make her feel guilty and thats all i've been doing through our entire marriage. Using guilt to keep with her with me.
> 
> As to all that maybe i am and just don't recognize it as guilt. She has been telling me that i trapped into staying with me when she was young and so she stayed with me so as not to hurt me and since i was a good man. That i pleaded with her to stay instead of giving her the choice. When she brought this up again last night she asked if i felt that was right and i told i thought it was right for our situation. then she got mad and i told her "sorry that i cared so much" which just pissed her off more saying that was just more guilt. I don't feel good about any of this. I guess it is what it is. It still hurts, but i don't think i have any choice in the matter anymore. I guess i'm being to pushy. I feel like if i was given a chance i could change and we could work through this. She wants space, I'm willing to give it to her. I love her with all my heart and still can't think of my life without her. I never wanted to be a part time dad. I just don't see anything good coming out of this.


ITjustme, here is a list from a book call "Divorce Busters". The concept is to place worth on yourself and take away her belief that you're waiting on her emotional scraps.


Don't pursue reason, chase, beg, plead or implore.
No frequent phone calls.
Don't point out "good points" in marriage.
Don't follow her/him around the house.
Don't encourage or initiate discussion about the future.
Don't ask for help from the family members of your WS.
Don't ask for reassurances.
Don't buy or give gifts.
Don't schedule dates together.
Don't keep saying, "I Love You!" Because if you have a brain in your head, he/she is at this particular moment, not very loveable. (In your case IJM, she doesn't want to hear it).
Do more then act as if you are moving on with your life; begin moving on with your life!
Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and independent.
Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get busy, do things, go out with friends, enjoy old hobbies, find new ones! But stay busy!
When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation) be scarce or short on words. Don't push any issue? No matter how much you want to!
If you're in the habit of asking your spouse his/her whereabouts, ASK NOTHING. Seem totally uninterested.
Your partner needs to believe that you have awakened to the fact that they are serious concerning their assertions as to the future (or lack thee of) of your marriage. Thus, you are you are moving on with your life? with out them!
Don't be nasty, angry or even cold - Just pull yourself back. Don't always be so available? for anything! Your spouse will notice. More important, he/she will notice that you're missing.
No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment? Make yourself be someone they would want to be around. Not a moody, needy, pathetic individual but a self assured individual secure in the knowledge that they have value.
All questions about the marriage should be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may not be for quite a while). Initiate no such conversation!
Do not allow yourself to lose your temper. No yelling, screaming or name calling EVER. No show of temper! Be cool, act cool; be in control of the only thing you can control? YOURSELF!
Don't be overly enthusiastic.
Do not argue when they tell you how they feel (it only makes their feelings stronger). In fact, refuse to argue at all!
Be patient and learn to not only listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you? HEAR what it is that they are saying! Listen and then listen some more!
Learn to back off, keep your mouth shut and walk away when you want to speak out, no matter what the provocation. No one ever got themselves into trouble by just not saying anything.
Take care of you. Exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil.
Be strong, confident and learn to speak softly.
Know that if you can do this 180, your smallest CONSISTENT action will be noticed far more than any words you can say or write.
Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you are hurting more than ever and are feeling totally desperate and needy.
Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse. It's not always about you! More to the point, at present they just don't care!
Do not believe any of what you hear them say and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives and do so in the most strident tones imaginable. Try to remember that they are also hurting and afraid. Try to remember that they know what they are doing is wrong and so they will say anything they can to justify their behavior.
Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel. It "ain't over till it's over!"
Do not backslide from your hard earned changes. Remain consistent! It is the consistency of action and attitude that delivers the message.
When expressing your dissatisfaction with the actions of the wayward party, never be judgmental, critical or express moral outrage. Always explain that your dissatisfaction is due to the pain that the acts being committed are causing you as a person. This is the kind of behavior that will cause you to be a much more attractive and mysterious individual. Further it SHOWS that you are NOT afraid to move on with your life. Still more important, it will burst their positive little bubble; the one in which they believe that they can always come back to you in case things don't work out with the OM/OW."


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## lifeistooshort

Of course you're worthy, and there are plenty of great women who will be happy to have you. I wouldn't worry about the past, either she's rewriting history or she was attracted to you at one time, but since you're not a mindreader how could you be expected to know if she willingly had sex with you? Now that she's said it you can keep your dignity and find someone that wants you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ITjustme

After the fight Sunday night My heart sank. Of course to me there no longer feels like we have a shot at R and we are closer to the big D than i ever imagined. I am trying to steel myself though this, though i have always been the type to wear my heart on my sleeve. I have a dr. appt. today to see if there anything i can do about the anxiety so i can sleep again. I need to take care of myself and quit worrying. It's just hurting me it's not bringing me closer to her, that's for sure! I see my therapist Wednesday. Hopefully all these things will help. I won't give up on our marriage until the fat lady sings, but i think i am done pouring my heart out. That is obviously not working i hope i haven't caused too much damage already. I still love her! Though i don't expect anything to ever be the same. I want my wife back. Keeping the hope alive while trying not hurt and not show my hurt to my wife is the hardest thing i will ever do in my life.

thank you for all of the support and advice this website is very helpful.


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## mattsmom

ITjustme;

One quick word of advice. If your insurance will cover it, it's much better to see a psychiatrist for any type of anti-depressant or anti-anxiety meds. Family practitioners can certainly prescribe them, and you can avoid the stigma of seeing a psychiatrist. On the flip side, psychiatrists receive specialized training and are much better at selecting the correct meds for your situation.

At the risk of sounding like a corny hippie, have you ever thought about looking into a yoga class? Yoga isn't just for woman, and it can be an amazingly calming experience. I wish you the very best and hope you find peace.

Blessings,
Lee


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## PieceOfSky

Yoga is helpful to me too, despite me not quite having the ideal body type for it!

And is is calming just being around a group of soft-spoken, relaxed, centered people for a change. That sort of thing gives me hope.

Oh, and ditto on the psychiatrist vs. other MDs.


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## Wiserforit

ITjustme said:


> She did tell me about 9 months ago that things were getting stale in the bedroom. I have asked what can we do. She tells me i don't want to have to tell you what i want and clams up. She says she can't open up to me in the bedroom because of what i said. I've always been a little hands of when it comes to sex because I've been rejected so much. She also tells me that it's no fun if she's not turned on. Which i fully understand. So i try to turn her on Back rubs full body massage, anything i think might make her want me. Don't get me wrong i want sex as much as the next guy.


Yeah, *PieceofSky* was on track here with the full-on manipulative attack here: "you aren't doing something right but I am not going to tell you what it is..."

So the question is why. An affair is one possibility but so is just having decided to check out of the marriage. But either way, grinding you into dust to expedite her aims. 

There is an over-arching theme of everything being your fault and nothing you can do to fix it. 

When you are crushed emotionally it is very difficult for you to do battle, so this is the point behind it. Emotional warfare. That is why the 180 is so effective: Separating yourself from her emotionally is the way you insulate yourself from this kind of warfare.


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## ITjustme

Wiserforit said:


> Yeah, *PieceofSky* was on track here with the full-on manipulative attack here: "you aren't doing something right but I am not going to tell you what it is..."
> 
> So the question is why. An affair is one possibility but so is just having decided to check out of the marriage. But either way, grinding you into dust to expedite her aims.
> 
> There is an over-arching theme of everything being your fault and nothing you can do to fix it.
> 
> When you are crushed emotionally it is very difficult for you to do battle, so this is the point behind it. Emotional warfare. That is why the 180 is so effective: Separating yourself from her emotionally is the way you insulate yourself from this kind of warfare.


So we are week into our second vacation. Can someone post the 180 for me. We are staying with family. So I had to leave all my reading behind. Due to no one knows what's going on between us yet. 

We had quite a few drinks the other night and she apoligized for the way things have been lately. This seems to me the first time she has shown emotion about the situation. I was unable to continue the conversation with her due to the amount family around.

I'm dreading going home and seperating. I just wish I could read her mind so I would know what's really going on. I just want my wife back. I don't know how to act around her anymore. I'm not allowed to touch her or act like myself anymore around her. This is all so confusing. If there is something I need to change I am more than willing but I still don't really know where to start.

I can't help but wonder if this all my fault. That I just didn't recognize things before they got worse. I love her so much and now I feel I can't talk to her anymore because I'm just pressuring her for a resolution.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## JohnC_depressed

Do not beg, plead, or show weakness. Do not tell her you love her. Detach as much as possible emotionally while still being pleasant. She has checked out of the marriage (at least temporarily) and you pressuring, pleading begging etc. is exactly the wrong thing to do. Give her space and what is going to happen is going to happen. There is very little you can do to change that now. Work entirely on you. Get fit, get healthy. The better you look and the more confidant you appear the better your chances of having a positive outcome.


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## ITjustme

So we are back from vacation. She still wants nothing to do with me. I love her with all my heart. I'm willing to do anything to get her back. I have told her this but all she wants is to seperate. She says if i truly love her i would let her go. That i should have done this before we married. She was wanting to move in with her sister and get a job. Her words not mine I pleaded for her to stay and move in with me. This to her was a trap.

Now she no longer trusts me. The only reason i can think of for this is that fight we had where she told me that i was guilt tripping her. Though she also says i use guilt to get sex, but if she feels guilty for not giving me sex is that my fault.

I feel i'm losing all my self worth. I'm trying not to let it keep me down but don't have the energy to keep my head up and think that this will all work out. i feel like the day she took her ring off it ended everything. I don't want to lose my wife. She made me who i am today. I'm a better man because of her.

I'm still so lost! i can't keep myself from talking to her.


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## happyman64

I read this last post as she has lost you. 

Now go be happy. Pursue this new job and go have a great life. 

Without her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ITjustme

I'm still trying to figure out how to let it go. To distance myself from her without dying inside. I'm having trouble sleeping. Have been put on Anti-depressants for anxiety to help with sleep. She seems to to have no problem turning off all love and care for me and wants to move on and date. I'm no longer allowed to look at her longingly "It makes her feel guilty". She is beautiful and if i tell her she is it makes her feel uncomfortable. 

How do people just turn it all off to do the"180"? If it would help i would but i can't seem to find a way to just shut it off.


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## happyman64

Do you really have any choice?


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## Thundarr

ITjustme said:


> I'm still trying to figure out how to let it go. To distance myself from her without dying inside. I'm having trouble sleeping. Have been put on Anti-depressants for anxiety to help with sleep. She seems to to have no problem turning off all love and care for me and wants to move on and date. I'm no longer allowed to look at her longingly "It makes her feel guilty". She is beautiful and if i tell her she is it makes her feel uncomfortable.
> 
> How do people just turn it all off to do the"180"? If it would help i would but i can't seem to find a way to just shut it off.


ITjustme, many years back when I went through this with my EX, it was like a switch flipped. If you're lucky (and I was) then you'll wake up one morning and the world will be different, better. You'll realize the only thing you're losing is the *mirage* you created to begin with. You'll realize you owe it to yourself to see the EX as others see her.


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## Machiavelli

So, when is she moving out?

Why do you need to move in with your parents, since she's not contributing anyway?

Your wife says your not sexually attractive. Do other women agree with her?


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## Idyit

How do you let her go?? Just like the bravest soldiers you accept that you are already dead. 

Man up, 180, go Alpha, grow a great big pair of solid brass balls. Do not be a plan B for her (by the way it seems like you were only an 'acceptable' solution for her initially). If you should fail to regain her affection you will be very well positioned for your next phase of life.

I really do wish you well.

~Passio


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## MSC71

*Re: Re: Getting prepared*



ITjustme said:


> I'm still trying to figure out how to let it go. To distance myself from her without dying inside. I'm having trouble sleeping. Have been put on Anti-depressants for anxiety to help with sleep. She seems to to have no problem turning off all love and care for me and wants to move on and date. I'm no longer allowed to look at her longingly "It makes her feel guilty". She is beautiful and if i tell her she is it makes her feel uncomfortable.
> 
> How do people just turn it all off to do the"180"? If it would help i would but i can't seem to find a way to just shut it off.


My wife asked me to stop telling her I love her or compliment her. I think it was to ease her guilt. I wish I would of not stopped. This wad before divorce was filed and I knew it was coming. So I appeased her trying not to rock the boat.


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## mattsmom

MSC71 said:


> My wife asked me to stop telling her I love her or compliment her. I think it was to ease her guilt. I wish I would of not stopped. This wad before divorce was filed and I knew it was coming. So I appeased her trying not to rock the boat.


As a woman who has had "the talk" with her husband, I can say that (at least in my situation) not wanting to hear "I love you" in every other sentence has nothing to do with guilt. It has everything to do with the appearance of desperation. When those words are said out of desperation, rather than true emotion, they are meaningless. It doesn't mean that he doesn't love me. It just means that the words don't mean anything, anymore. I don't want him to be desperate. I want him to be the man he was when I met him. I want him to show me that he loves me. The words don't prove a thing. Actions are what count.


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## PieceOfSky

Are you working on the 180?

On another thread, someone said he printed out a copy and kept it in his pocket, and read it several times a day.


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## MSC71

*Re: Re: Getting prepared*



mattsmom said:


> As a woman who has had "the talk" with her husband, I can say that (at least in my situation) not wanting to hear "I love you" in every other sentence has nothing to do with guilt. It has everything to do with the appearance of desperation. When those words are said out of desperation, rather than true emotion, they are meaningless. It doesn't mean that he doesn't love me. It just means that the words don't mean anything, anymore. I don't want him to be desperate. I want him to be the man he was when I met him. I want him to show me that he loves me. The words don't prove a thing. Actions are what count.


 Very true. Actions speak louder than words.


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## ITjustme

I have quit saying I Love You since they day she stopped saying it back to me. Though i have been complimenting on how beautiful she is lately and i have been getting "Your making me feel uncomfortable" so now i will no longer compliment her. As for the 180, I feel as if i may be to a point where i can actually start that but if i impliment it "Letting go" feels like giving up all hope of anything coming back. My counceler seems to be just trying to ease me into saying she's basically already gone. I'm losing all hope. The thing is I'm not really interested in losing my wife and family. Though I know that i can't change her or her decision. I do want to put my best effort into it. When you say actions speak louder than words, what actions when i'm no longer allowed to touch her and or barely talk to her other than friendly chit chat?


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## LongWalk

ITjustme said:


> I have quit saying I Love You since they day she stopped saying it back to me. Though i have been complimenting on how beautiful she is lately and i have been getting "Your making me feel uncomfortable" so now i will no longer compliment her. As for the 180, I feel as if i may be to a point where i can actually start that but if i impliment it "Letting go" feels like giving up all hope of anything coming back. My counceler seems to be just trying to ease me into saying she's basically already gone. I'm losing all hope. The thing is I'm not really interested in losing my wife and family. Though I know that i can't change her or her decision. I do want to put my best effort into it. When you say actions speak louder than words, what actions when i'm no longer allowed to touch her and or barely talk to her other than friendly chit chat?


You are getting plenty of good advice but it is hard to follow because it is counter intuitive.

Think of your wife as a cat. If you make moves towards it, it may suddenly run away. When you see a cat about to bolt and you keep on towards it, you are guaranteed to see it shoot off. If you pay no attention to the cat, it may stop to lick its paws. Maybe it will come to you.

1) Under no circumstances leave your home. That is a terrible mistake that could have dire consequences for your status as a father. She wants to leave, let her leave.

2) Boredom and a desire for a new mate is just instinct. She is giving into instinct. Probably she has already cheated or at least had a taste of EA.

3) Once she moves out she will face many new realities, including economic problems. They will cause her to reflect, but that is no guarantee that she will return.

4) To recreate attraction you must become independent of her. Several of the posters here are expert coaches. If Machiavelli or HappyMan tell you to do something, it will be your best alternative, given the info you have provided.

5) Your wife has written you off in terms of sex ranking. At present she may intellectually say that you can find someone else. Emotionally, she does not believe any woman in the world could find you attractive. OK, maybe a crack addict who is homeless, but certainly no one at her level.

The day that you have picture up Facebook hanging out with other women, it may hit her like sledgehammer. She may be very anxious to get you back. No guarantee but some chance.

6) Boundaries
Right now your wife is testing the boundaries. Separation is sexual freedom. If you are a nice guy while she is testing the strange and new, she will lose all respect for you. The only boundary you can enforce in separation is to cut her off. No discussion about Aunt Alice or her nice new dress – yes, the dress that wants to lift for other men but not you. Talk only about your children and divorce.

If she is so anxious to try out other men, why didn't she just file for divorce right off the bat? She wants to have one hand on the branch before she swings to the next. Take away the branch that you control. File for D first without warning. That will get her attention.

"Why did you do that, that was mean," she'll say.

"Sorry that you feel that way" is all that you reply.

Make her think: "Holy shı†, how can he just get over me like that?"

This will not guarantee anything, but it is your best strategy.

Start working out. Lifting weights, etc.

There are very good threads that can educated you, make you laugh and cry. Read ReGroup and LostLove, compare them. One follows advice and is making a comeback. The other is drowning.


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## LongWalk

A question: are you willing to pay for her to buy sexy underwear to go on dates with other men?


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## ITjustme

I already bought them. I know what you mean. I'm starting to feel myself pull away but I still may have to give her what she needs. The resentment of me staying might make it worse too.


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## Unique Username

"2) Boredom and a desire for a new mate is just instinct. She is giving into instinct."

That is total BS

And the 180 thing...could be an effective MANIPULATION....Game playing....ha just doesn't sit well for me.


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## ITjustme

The thing about the 180 i don't like is the games. She keeps telling that i'm trying to manipulate her, when all i'm really trying to do i lay it all on the table. If we end up separated the 180 will be all i can do.


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## ITjustme

I've been Kicked out. I found my wife has been texting another guy. I guess i pushed to hard.


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## LongWalk

ITjustme said:


> I already bought them. I know what you mean. I'm starting to feel myself pull away but I still may have to give her what she needs. The resentment of me staying might make it worse too.


From your moniker I gather that you are in IT professionally. Do you write code or are you a systems administrator?

Whatever your line of work you are not being paid minimum wage. You may not be wealthy but you haven't mentioned a financial crisis. Well, you are going come under pressure now because divorce and separation cost money.

Your wife never went to college. Did she even finish high school? From the sound of it she doesn't have much work experience either. She must think she is going to get by on child support, alimony and a minimum wage job. Out of those she will have to pay for stuff like babysitters. Clothes to attract new men. Gym membership, etc.

If you pay for this stuff willingly you essentially finance her having sex with other men in her search to replace you. If you do this, she will disrespect you even more on a psychological level your claims to be her mate will further destroyed.

For the moment she is not in love with you or attracted to you, but you have been the provider and mate. That is something real, but she doesn't perceive or value it because it is still there for her. If you withdraw emotional and financial support, she will notice. Even if she gets angry that is far better than if she smiles at you, takes money and fills the car tank to drive to PosOM's place for the night.

Do not help her pack stuff for her new apartment. Do not drive it over, hug her goodbye and wish her luck.

Turn off her telephone... by the way have you gotten a copy of cellphone usage? Is she calling some number often?

Give her exactly the amount of child support that is standard and let her figure out her own economy.

She is around 28. That is young enough on the dating scene to still be able to start a new family with another guy. Still, she has two children and not much money. Your miracle replacement may not be so easy to find. Maybe she has PosOm all lined up. But does he want to be step dad?

You need to cut her off financially and emotionally to spell out the reality of divorce. File first. It takes a time before it becomes final. You cancel it or remarry, but you need to show her the consequences of her current path.


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## Plan 9 from OS

ITjustme said:


> I've been Kicked out. I found my wife has been texting another guy. I guess i pushed to hard.


What do you mean you've been kicked out? You mean out of your home or out of her life as her man? If it's the latter, then you've been kicked out when she first dropped the bomb shell on you. 

If I were you and your wife is so big into trying to "find herself", I think you have the opportunity to at least salvage something by getting a divorce that will favor your needs. If I were you, I would talk to her about getting a divorce and agree to sever all ties completely, and that you would be more than happy to take the kids so that she can be free to find herself and live life. It's hard to truly live as a single again if you are caring for kids, so you would be more than happy to free her from that burden. No support from her would be needed by you. Honestly, I don't know your whole story, but it seems obvious that you put more energy into your marriage than she did. You can use her strong desire for a new start to your advantage in a divorce. Manipulative? Yes, but at least you can minimize the damage to you if you play your cards right.


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## LongWalk

Do not leave your home. It will be the biggest mistake. Let her go live with him
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ITjustme

She kick me out of the house last night she has been wanting me to leave for a while. I got quite P.O'd when i found texts on her phone last night to another guy. Apparentlly she just met him this week and looking at the texts she just started texting him last night. In her mind we have been separated since she dropped the bomb 2 months ago and been just waiting for me to get out of the house. So i'm gone.


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## tom67

ITjustme said:


> She kick me out of the house last night she has been wanting me to leave for a while. I got quite P.O'd when i found texts on her phone last night to another guy. Apparentlly she just met him this week and looking at the texts she just started texting him last night. In her mind we have been separated since she dropped the bomb 2 months ago and been just waiting for me to get out of the house. So i'm gone.


Why did you leave tell her to go to him.


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## tom67

Whose name is the house in yours? If so move back in.:slap:


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## ThreeStrikes

Do you think she's crazy enough to call the cops and get a restraining order against you if you stayed in your house?


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## LongWalk

You are harming your children by leaving. Go back and tell her to leave. :banghead::banghead:


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## toonaive

As others have said, there is another man. You recently found this out to be true. You were advised to not leave your home, you did. You revealed your source of information far far too early. She is now seriously pissed off that you are raining on her good time. You have found out her illicit secret. You have now allowed her to have control over you even more, and you continue to do so. 

Not to be mean, but if you continue this pattern. She will take everything you own, including your children, and you will be required to support her financially for a long time. Im pretty sure where some of that money you work hard for will go. Why are you so willing to allow another man to potentially take your place in your marriage and your children? And you continue to pay for it? Or did I miss something?


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## LongWalk

toonaive said:


> As others have said, there is another man. You recently found this out to be true. You were advised to not leave your home, you did. You revealed your source of information far far too early. She is now seriously pissed off that you are raining on her good time. You have found out her illicit secret. You have now allowed her to have control over you even more, and you continue to do so.
> 
> Not to be mean, but if you continue this pattern. She will take everything you own, including your children, and you will be required to support her financially for a long time. Im pretty sure where some of that money you work hard for will go. Why are you so willing to allow another man to potentially take your place in your marriage and your children? And you continue to pay for it? Or did I miss something?


:iagree:

You will pay for the other man to take your place. Not only will take your spot in bed, you're wife will want him to be a daddy figure when you are not babysitting her children.

You cannot get your wife back easily but you can lose your children and be an indentured servant for the next couple of decades.

Move back immediately. Do not explain or argue with her. Tell her you are separated and she is free to go.

Don't forget there is no guarantee that the PosOm is a normal good guy. He could be a first class arse. Your wife is in love and is no fit judge.


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## Unique Username

I would consider last night as a spat.
Come home after work as normal. 
It is your home with your kids as well.
Since She is the cheater, or on the road to cheating if she hasn't already.....She should be the one to leave. "Go stay with Aunt Millie or Sister Petunia or Mom and Dad while we figure things out"...this will give her the freedom she craves and She has left. So then you circle the wagons with your Family to make sure the kids lives are altered the least. Structure and having routine is really important for kids to feel safe and to help with their mental health in this difficult time. Mom might not be around, but she can certainly speak with them on the phone and you could certainly take them to the park for parenting time with mom. 
She is probably under the impression that everything defaults to the Wife/Mom keeping the house and the kids and getting child support..............doesn't mean this is the best thing for your situation. BUT you are gonna have to think long and hard about this. Are you willing and do you want to be their primary caregiver? Are you willing and able to arrange for daycare and all those things regarding them (pediatrician, dentist, recitals, classes, lessons, extra-curricular activities etc etc) with little if no help from their Mother? Are you willing and able to have little free-time FROM your kids as financially a single-income parent won't have as much extraneous cashola to use for "fun"

Good too if she leaves -- her shenanigans with OM would be less likely shared/viewed/experienced by the children. (And you will have to have a talk at some point about what is acceptable for your children to be involved in (with her dates or OM or whatever....these are adult things and shouldn't be shared with your kids)

There are many workable options. A good book to help is "Mom's House Dad's House"

You can try for sole custody with Mom having visitation and HER paying support to you (or vice versa)

You could go for joint custody and no support paid from either parent...since you have equal time supporting the kids.

Etc

BUT, I would say go home after work. And let her know that she can certainly go "temporarily" stay with relatives wifey while you are figuring out these things because I'm not at fault and I'm not leaving my home or my children. Keep calm, give her zero reason to call the cops. You could even have your phone videotape your calm discussion so that IF it gets heated you have proof you weren't the violent one etc

NOW...if you think that you'd really rather be on your own in a new place and don't want the responsibility with your children 24/7....you have this option too. Decide what is best for you and your children. 
Example, A long time female friend of mine had become disillusioned in her marriage for many reasons (some accurate some not some selfish) but she decided it was actually better for her son to stay with his Dad and she would leave. 
I personally would never do that as it is my responsibility and pleasure to parent my child. 
BUT...it was really a better thing for her son, Dad was very caring and involved with his church and family etc. And her son made really good friends with others in their church and he ended up having multiple families where he felt love and support. NOW her son has graduated with honors from University, Has a really challenging and financially rewarding career as a civilian employee of the DOD. SO untraditional solutions CAN work. 

Good luck to you in whichever avenue you decide to travel down...


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## r0r0bin

Another blindsided man, sorry for you for not being a man to move on without her. YOu have your controll why being weak or afraid on this.


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## Machiavelli

Love and War. One of the first things they teach you is that you cannot win a war through defensive measures alone. You've got to go over to offense as soon as you can or you just get pummeled.


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## ITjustme

Basically Staying in the house was just making things worse. Seeing her being so detached from our marriage was just making me want to talk things through more. Constantly bickering over stupid sh!t because my emotions were fully charged all the time. At the beginning of all of this she gave us a 50/50 shot saying if i gave her the space she was requesting things might come back. She had asked me to leave at the beginning, then again in the heat of an argument where i wouldn't and she slept on the couch and then the night i left after finding her texting another guy. that i know she wasn't texting before all this started. SHe took her wedding rings off early in this stating it was over the day she told me everything "to her". She states that if this was just a relationship that we would have broken up and moved on. The marriage is just on paper and from her point of view she's not cheating because i should have left when she asked me to the first time. Now she has told me i have narrowed the margin of us ever getting back together by staying in the house. She has threatened to call the cops on me if i try to stay in the house. She wants me to go to councelling with her stating that i'm volatile. I'll go with her. I have completely stop talking with except for things about money and the kids. She asked my intentions about the kids recently and i told her straight that i did not want to be a weekend dad, I want them at least 50/50 i won't take just the weekends and if that does not work I would like them all the time. I have my parents to fall back on for help. This pissed her off royally and she basically didn't talk to me for a while. 

The things that really scare me is that all her family is far away. I'm afraid that if things get really bad she might pack up and try to take the kids with her. I trust her enough that i don't think she would but who knows. I have an appt. to see a lawyer on the 30th to find out my rights. I have been trying to keep my mind busy so i don't dwell on everything.


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## PieceOfSky

Don't move out. Hurts your chances with custody of the kids.

I would call lawyer tomorrow morning and explain there is a chance she might take off with the kids, and you NEED to know NOW what you should do about it.

Also mention to the lawyer her threats to call the cops if you stay in the house. WTF? She has some nerve, IMHO. You've got enough to worry about, and I'd hope a lawyer could pint out the things you can safely ignore.

My wife said we should separate, maybe. She assumed I would be the one leaving. She was surprised that I would not accommodate her view of how it should work.

I have little to no experience here, but I wonder if you would feel better and have better options if you were to pre-emptively lot file for divorce.

The 30th sounds a long way away to me, to get informed of your rights.-


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## LongWalk

:iagree::iagree:
Piece of Sky is right.

If you let the pressure get to you and move out, your legal position as father could be in big trouble. You will become the weekend dad if you let her drive you away.

Stay in your children's home. If you leave, the courts see you as a deserter. If she takes your children somewhere without your permission, that is parental abduction. You can go to court and force her back.

Get a lawyer asap and file for divorce. Divorce takes time. You can always retract it if you save your marriage. However, at this point you need to let your wife know that her claim that the marriage is over has consequences.

She does not get to end the marriage by dating out of the family home that you finance. Let her go and life with other men and have sex with them in an apartment/house that you do not pay for.


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