# How about advice for women on how to get more sex? (I don't have any)



## mae (Aug 17, 2009)

I have posted quite a bit on almost every section but I am here to post again. I think I mainly need to vent and maybe find out if I'm crazy or not (I don't think so).

I have been working on my marriage for a while and it is improving, SLOWLY, oh so slowly. My husband seems to be happier in general. But I am still so frustrated! I am not throwing anything back at him and I acknowledge all changes but some things aren't changing, mainly our affection with each other/sex lives.

This week I have worn lingerie to bed every night. I haven't worn lingerie in at least a year and 1/2. I went to Victoria's Secret and bought a new sexy black nightie w/matching thong and wore it to bed. The first night he didn't even notice. The second night he noticed and asked what I was wearing but it didn't interest him at all. The next night I wore different lingerie and he asked where the first one was, but still no sexual interest. The 4th night I wore yet a different one which was similar to the 1st one, still no interest. Etc. Etc. 

Last night I wore the 1st one again and in the middle of the night he woke me up and we ended up having a quickie. The last time we had sex before that was exactly a week before and was also a quickie in the middle of the night when he woke me up. I have a hard time orgasming and can't from just a quickie when I'm half asleep and it's so frustrating. He'll finish and by then I'm awake and turned on and he rolls over to go to sleep. I almost hate having sex with him because it leaves me feeling so frustrated. He has no consideration for me.

Last night I was so mad afterwards that I asked him if he thinks I'm a sex toy. He said no and asked why I asked that. I told him it's because we only have sex when he wants to and only he gets anything out of it really, he's not interested in pleasuring me. He didn't argue and said "I guess I can work on that" but I know he won't. He's already said that before and he doesn't work on it.

Just as a note to anyone who hasn't been following my other threads so I don't get the advice of "why don't you initiate?", I have initiated sex several times per week for several months and I get rejected EVERY time. I give him BJs, offer massages, etc. etc. Doesn't matter. So I was given advice to just back off and make myself feel sexy. So that's what I've been trying to do. Hasn't been working, it's only making me more pissed off.

This was mainly just to vent but any advice is welcome. Thanks.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

No hard feelings intended by my questions. I will preface this by saying I feel desire, reall genuine desire for my wife almost every day. So with that:

- When did his desire drop
- Was there a reason
- Was he highly attracted to you in the beginning
- Was he sexually considerate in the beginning
- Why doesn't he give you oral to bring you to the rapture
- How much porn does he watch/the only way to be certain is with a keylogger












mae said:


> I have posted quite a bit on almost every section but I am here to post again. I think I mainly need to vent and maybe find out if I'm crazy or not (I don't think so).
> 
> I have been working on my marriage for a while and it is improving, SLOWLY, oh so slowly. My husband seems to be happier in general. But I am still so frustrated! I am not throwing anything back at him and I acknowledge all changes but some things aren't changing, mainly our affection with each other/sex lives.
> 
> ...


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## mae (Aug 17, 2009)

MEM11363 said:


> No hard feelings intended by my questions. I will preface this by saying I feel desire, reall genuine desire for my wife almost every day. So with that:
> 
> - When did his desire drop
> - Was there a reason
> ...


I am a very hard person to offend so ask anything you'd like.

To try to answer your questions the best I can:

1. When did his desire drop?

I'm not actually sure. While we were dating we saw each other 1 or 2 times a week (we lived about 2 hours apart) and we had lots of sex whenever we saw each other. It wasn't always just when going to bed either, it was during the day and at night and quite spontanious most of the time. We got married a little over two years ago and then he was deployed for almost a year, so we didn't end up living together until after he came back. When he first came back we had lots of sex for several months and it was spontanious as well. So I guess it was when I got pregnant, maybe when I was about 3 months pregnant or so. Since then it's just sucked.

2. Was there a reason?

He's listed many reasons. He's tired. He's mad at me about something. Etc. Etc. I've worked on anything he's said he's been mad about and that hasn't improved anything and he won't do anything to change being tired, he's just decided that's how things are (he won't go to bed earlier, won't take a nap if he can, etc.).

3. Was he highly attracted to you in the beginning?

I would say he's never been highly attracted to me but he was attracted to me. Per him I'm not the "model type" he used to date (he actual told me my cheek bones weren't well enough defined). He did say he found me attractive or he wouldn't have been with me.

4. Was he sexually considerate in the beginning?

Most of the time. It never seemed to be an issue. He would really try to make me orgasm but that stopped during my pregnancy. It was almost impossible for me to orgasm (for some reason it usually only happens while I'm on top and that wasn't very realistic while I was very pregnant). Since then he doesn't even try or seem to care.

5. Why doesn't he give you oral? 

He told me while we were dating that he didn't like giving oral, mainly because it was a hairy situation. He has given me oral once since we've been together (despite me shaving completely for him).

6. How much porn does he watch?

On this I really don't know. I've caught him at it a few times and he agreed not to watch it but I don't know if he's sticking to that agreement. I have a feeling he isn't since he's deleted the history and cookies on his computer several times beginning when we made that agreement. If he does watch it it's not often because he honestly doesn't have the time. He's generally either watching our daughter or I'm home and he only does it when he's alone. So at most it would be once every two weeks or so. I've seriously thought about getting a key logger but my husband works with computers for a living so I'm sure he'd find it and that wouldn't be good for obvious reasons.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

All good answers but a little scary. Just a few more. 

Is it possible weight is an issue for him? Or are you close enough to your pre-pregnancy weight that it is not a factor? Have you asked him - straight up - is he happy with you physically/fitness wise.

Are you two as young as I think? Late twenties? Because if you are he should want you at least a few times a week - like at least 3-4 times a week. 

The lack of oral on his part is a really bad thing. Sorry, but that is typically a near guaranteed way to please your wife. And I guess if he was really making an effort with straight sex, but he is not. 

If he is not willing to be completely straight with you about this then it will only get worse/turn into a sexless marriage. Sorry but this is not about you, sounds like it is about him. 






mae said:


> I am a very hard person to offend so ask anything you'd like.
> 
> To try to answer your questions the best I can:
> 
> ...


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

mae-

I have posted a whole thread on this subject. The first thing to understand is that it is not YOU. It is not your fault. Here is my thread:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/sex-marriage/4561-difference-between-men-women-who-go-off-sex.html


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## mae (Aug 17, 2009)

MEM11363 said:


> All good answers but a little scary. Just a few more.
> 
> Is it possible weight is an issue for him? Or are you close enough to your pre-pregnancy weight that it is not a factor? Have you asked him - straight up - is he happy with you physically/fitness wise.
> 
> ...


To answer your additional questions, I've always been about 120 lbs. Currently I'm about 145 and losing about 1/2 to 1 lb a week. I am still breastfeeding so am not really supposed to lose it faster than that. I have asked him about his attraction to me. Right after having the baby he was clear on the fact that he didn't find me attractive. Now he won't give me a straight answer on it. 

The thing that pisses me off as well is that he won't help me do anything to lose weight more quickly. I try to get him to take walks with me, he doesn't want to. He often cooks rice with dinner and I have specifically told him that's quite fattening but he still does it anyway. If I don't eat what he makes he gets offended. I try to eat healthy and I exercise as much as possibly time wise. I'm not perfect on it but I try. There hasn't been a week for the last 3 months where I haven't lost weight.

In terms of age, he's 33 and I'm 25. So not too young but also not too old. He acts like he's 60 (always tired, never likes to go out, just wants to go to bed, etc.).

Mark: I did read that article you wrote and maybe you're right. I've tried changing everything I can and it hasn't made a difference. So maybe it isn't me.

I talked to him about it again tonight and told him how dissatisfied I am with our sex life and exactly why. For him the solution is to go to bed earlier, so we'll try that and see if it improves anything. My hopes aren't too high though because I don't think that's the real problem. We'll see...


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Mae,
You sound delightful - I hope my teenage son grows up and meets someone like you. 

Your husband is not being supportive and that is just wrong. You are entitled to feel loved, and desired. In a good marriage that feeling lasts and lasts. Here in my house in year 20, I feel so blessed that my wife is glad that I still crave her touch, look forward to making love. 

Your man needs to make some effort - he needs to walk with you. The walks are a wonderful time to just be together, and the baby in a stoller or a front pack or back pack also benefits. He needs to cook for you and show sensitivity. 

It feels wrong. Like he wants you to have enough extra weight he can blame the sex thing on you. That is really cruel. If he has a desire issue he should not be dumping it on you. 

Would he see a marriage therapist? A sex therapist?

I think some of his comments about you not having the cheekbones of his other - model - girlfriends - those comments were red flags to me. My wife is not the prettiest woman I ever dated. She sure is the best though. And I sure do love her and tell her how nice she looks, how much I desire her every day. And you know at 47 - I think she is glad I am not looking for some young plaything to feed my male ego. 

This is worrisome. You seem right to me. Your tone is right, you are smart and even keeled. He seems very selfish and not appreciative of you. And by selfish I mean physically he should touch you a lot and give you massages because that is just being physically loving. That is what a good husband does. And sexual frequency - he should not be starving you. And sex itself he should be making sure you get to the rapture every time. And all this stuff combined is painting a bad picture of a man who is somehow not physically connected/emotionally connected with his wife. 

I really would tell you if I thought this was you. I don't. If he resists a therapist/and a sexual therapist that is another bad sign. But give that a shot and good luck. 

I am a little sad for you. 




mae said:


> To answer your additional questions, I've always been about 120 lbs. Currently I'm about 145 and losing about 1/2 to 1 lb a week. I am still breastfeeding so am not really supposed to lose it faster than that. I have asked him about his attraction to me. Right after having the baby he was clear on the fact that he didn't find me attractive. Now he won't give me a straight answer on it.
> 
> The thing that pisses me off as well is that he won't help me do anything to lose weight more quickly. I try to get him to take walks with me, he doesn't want to. He often cooks rice with dinner and I have specifically told him that's quite fattening but he still does it anyway. If I don't eat what he makes he gets offended. I try to eat healthy and I exercise as much as possibly time wise. I'm not perfect on it but I try. There hasn't been a week for the last 3 months where I haven't lost weight.
> 
> ...


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

mae said:


> For him the solution is to go to bed earlier, so we'll try that and see if it improves anything. My hopes aren't too high though because I don't think that's the real problem. We'll see...


In general, I believe that when it's the woman who is short changing the man, he should not try to "talk it out", he should work on himself first - this produces the fastest results. However when it's your way round, it's a different ball game:

Men understand straight talk. You should drive home to him how you feel, listen to his responses and promises, and hold him to them. If he then does not keep his promises, then you know where you stand. But you will have to give him a little time to adjust.

In the meantime, you can also work on yourself. You are probably "too nice", and that never does any good long time. A person with high self esteem has an automatic line in the sand: "He crosses it, and I leave him". Do you have that?


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## mae (Aug 17, 2009)

This may be a dumb question but what exactly is a sex therapist? What do they do? Maybe that is the solution, I don't know. 

I did realize that I have said a lot more in these posts than I've directly told him (of course it's easier to talk to others than the one you're upset with) so last night I was quite frank with him. I told him directly that I was dissatisfied and why. So we will see if that helps. 

I'm not sure if I'm "too nice" or not. I have a feeling I used to be, but maybe not so much now. I can say I have honestly worked on EVERYTHING he has told me he has issues with but it hasn't improved anything, so it can't totally be me. I do have certain lines he wouldn't be able to cross. Like if he were to cheat on me, I'd leave in a heartbeat. If I felt I was in danger or my daughter was in danger from him in anyway (like if he started drinking too much or being violent in any way) I'd leave him. 

However, I do feel like he tries to control me too much and I let him. For example: I feel he completely hinders me from achieving my goals. I've been trying to start my own business for the last year and 1/2 and it's going fairly well but he gets mad if I spend any time on it (like if I work on it on my day off instead of cleaning the whole house) or if I spend any money on it. He knows we can't send our daughter to college or retire at our current jobs, there's no way. Yet he won't do anything about it and he stops me from doing anything about it. He thinks he knows better because he's older. He honestly thinks he's smarter, more mature and more logical than me. He's not happy with his life but he's not really willing to do anything about it and he feels any plans I have won't work.

I go back and forth so much on this! Are issues in our marriage messing up our sex life? Or is our sex life causing other issues? I feel like we should take things one step at a time and our sex life is something we could easily work on first. Then with us feeling very loving and affectionate we could work on tackling our other issues. But maybe I am naive. 

There are many days I just want to give up. I do have a full fledged back-up plan. I know exactly where I would live, what job I would get, how much rent I would pay, how we would seperate our bills, etc. I've thoroughly thought it out. But everytime I think about going through with it I change my mind. To me it seems like our issues are so stupid and easily solved but I can't do it all alone, it has to be a team activity and that's the main problem. Then I do wonder if he's feeling exactly the same way on his end...


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

To disrupt a mans sex drive you have to really have serious relationship issues. I just don't think that is it. You sound like a really good partner. I think his desire circuitry is broken and that is not going to be acceptable to you. 

Sex is 10 percent of the relationship when it is good/great. It rapidly becomes 90 percent of the relationship when it is going badly. 

You have nicely explained the score to him. Give him a week. He either steps up or he isn't going to. 





mae said:


> This may be a dumb question but what exactly is a sex therapist? What do they do? Maybe that is the solution, I don't know.
> 
> I did realize that I have said a lot more in these posts than I've directly told him (of course it's easier to talk to others than the one you're upset with) so last night I was quite frank with him. I told him directly that I was dissatisfied and why. So we will see if that helps.
> 
> ...


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

mae said:


> This week I have worn lingerie to bed every night. I haven't worn lingerie in at least a year and 1/2.


that's a huge step. maybe you should take it a little slower. and if he doesnt respond to you the first night, certainly do not do it again. i dont even own lingerie anymore. 

i take baby steps with my H. right now i think i need the emotional side of my sex life and so im pushing my H in that direction. He'll ask me why i dont touch him anymore and i'll tell him i dont feel emotionally connected to him and i need that before the physical. 

i used to pressure my H for sex, and even when id get it, i hated it. who wants to feel like the have to pressure their spouse into sex with them?? so with that approach, its a lose/lose situation. the only way sex is fulfilling is if you feel desired and wanted. im waiting for that, now. i dont want sex just to have sex. i want the intimacy and the love. so as you can imagine, i dont have sex often. 

You'll have to feel like you spouse wants you first. You'll have to feel like you dont have to get all dressed up, that he'll want you just the way you are. if you get sex any other way, you will still not feel good about it and your H will be confused. he thinks you just want sex. so when you get sex he doesnt get that you are not looking for just sex. you want the intimacy. you cant put the cart before the horse. you'll have to have the love and intimacy with him before you feel satisfied. 

My H and i have sex maybe once a week. but it feels better then when we were having it two or three times a week. because i feel like we have an emotional connection now. and the emotional connection is what im focusing on because im realizing that its a big part of the picture.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

Blanca said:


> My H and i have sex maybe once a week. but it feels better then when we were having it two or three times a week. because i feel like we have an emotional connection now. and the emotional connection is what im focusing on because im realizing that its a big part of the picture.


You have your methods, and I don't want to criticize... But remember, sex is also for him. He may want to occasionally enjoy it in a purely sensual way without to much emotion. There are many many segments to sex. In a good marriage, you get to explore all of them. Personally, I like to cycle through all the different types from time to time.


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## Mrsgomez (Oct 24, 2009)

It sounds to me like he is just in a rut your weight may also bean issue to him but constantly asking him what's wrong will only make it worse marriages need sex especially at your age but just chill out relax take some you time and things will straighten themselves out you are in a down soon you will be up again ..... the pain in the ass but also fun roller coaster i call marriage


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## Nekko (Oct 13, 2009)

mae said:


> I have been working on my marriage for a while and it is improving, SLOWLY, oh so slowly. My husband seems to be happier in general. But I am still so frustrated! I am not throwing anything back at him and I acknowledge all changes but some things aren't changing, mainly our affection with each other/sex lives.


I can relate to this, a lot actually, which is why i am actually responding to this even though i'm pretty clueless to what men like that want. 


> This week I have worn lingerie to bed every night. I haven't worn lingerie in at least a year and 1/2. {.....}The 4th night I wore yet a different one which was similar to the 1st one, still no interest. Etc. Etc.


Well, first of all, he's used to you. And regardless of anything anyone might say, I've personally noticed that men get arroused by the personality behind the lingerie. At least my man does. Him not noticing might offend you, but we've all been in the situation where we are so sure of our spouses being there that we don't even look at them! Because we know they are there..and focus on our own stuff. Hot and sexy, appealing, is an attitude. Sure, when a married man already is used to perceiving his wife as hot...sexy lingerie makes him even more excited. When a man is used to seing his wife as the mother of his kids and the 'safe' person he settled down with, he has relatively regular sex with, then he won't really see you in a sexual way regardless of what you're wearing. You wore lingerie to bed in what way? What was your attitude while you were wearing it? Did you behave flirty before or did you just put lingerie on, jump in bed and expect him to notice? I can wear the skankiest undies to bed(a guy that doesn't know me offered to dive one hour just to see me in them when i gave him the link to show him what i bought)...mine hardly noticed or cared, but this was because i just acted normal. If i'm confident and sexy though (which i can rarely pull off due to my insecurities, and just treat him like a man, not my husband = don't demand that he gets horny right now for me cause he's supposed to), it works  Get my point?


> Last night I wore the 1st one again and in the middle of the night he woke me up and we ended up having a quickie. The last time we had sex before that was exactly a week before and was also a quickie in the middle of the night when he woke me up. I have a hard time orgasming and can't from just a quickie when I'm half asleep and it's so frustrating. He'll finish and by then I'm awake and turned on and he rolls over to go to sleep. I almost hate having sex with him because it leaves me feeling so frustrated. He has no consideration for me.


Yes, because you're the wife. You're safe, he doesn't need to impress you anymore. That's the way i see it. 


> Last night I was so mad afterwards that I asked him if he thinks I'm a sex toy. He said no and asked why I asked that. I told him it's because we only have sex when he wants to and only he gets anything out of it really, he's not interested in pleasuring me. He didn't argue and said "I guess I can work on that" but I know he won't. He's already said that before and he doesn't work on it.


He won't because he doesn't see it as a real problem. He'll most likely even forget about it. And it's not because he's mean. He's not inside your head or soul, doesn't understand how frustrated you are. I know this because i did this too on several occasion (non-sex related). I heard what i was told but wasn't aware how bad it felt for him. I realized ...hmm..months later. When i did realize it was a big issue for him, it suddenly became my priority and i changed.



> So I was given advice to just back off and make myself feel sexy. So that's what I've been trying to do. Hasn't been working, it's only making me more pissed off.


Well, i see that as a solution too. It's hard though, i'm struggling with it too. Because you need to be sexy for yourself and raise your own self esteem with that. If you are doing it strictly for him, it won't work and you'll be bitter. He needs to be intreagued and understand there's more to you than he sees and knows (wife, mother of kids, quickie partner, person that brings the sandwiches). We all have this silly way of thinking that we know our spouses inside out, what they are thinking, doing and can offer. So, you in lingerie might equal to him that you want sex, but if your attitude and way of being isn't sexy for him...he might not want sex, despite how hot you look in that neglige. Do I make any sense?

In theory this sounds easy, in practice i found this hard. Anyway, good luck to you :smthumbup:


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

This is not right. I am 46 - with my wife 21 years - married 20. This afternoon we talked about our plans for tonight. We are going to our sons football game - and then she said we could play tonight if I wanted. I started grinning and said hell yes I want to play - it has been since Tuesday - I literally started getting a physical reaction just talking to her about our date. 

And if she had not mentioned it - I would have. 

This should not be like solving rubiks cube in the dark. If it is, your partner is broken. Really. 






Nekko said:


> I can relate to this, a lot actually, which is why i am actually responding to this even though i'm pretty clueless to what men like that want.
> 
> Well, first of all, he's used to you. And regardless of anything anyone might say, I've personally noticed that men get arroused by the personality behind the lingerie. At least my man does. Him not noticing might offend you, but we've all been in the situation where we are so sure of our spouses being there that we don't even look at them! Because we know they are there..and focus on our own stuff. Hot and sexy, appealing, is an attitude. Sure, when a married man already is used to perceiving his wife as hot...sexy lingerie makes him even more excited. When a man is used to seing his wife as the mother of his kids and the 'safe' person he settled down with, he has relatively regular sex with, then he won't really see you in a sexual way regardless of what you're wearing. You wore lingerie to bed in what way? What was your attitude while you were wearing it? Did you behave flirty before or did you just put lingerie on, jump in bed and expect him to notice? I can wear the skankiest undies to bed(a guy that doesn't know me offered to dive one hour just to see me in them when i gave him the link to show him what i bought)...mine hardly noticed or cared, but this was because i just acted normal. If i'm confident and sexy though (which i can rarely pull off due to my insecurities, and just treat him like a man, not my husband = don't demand that he gets horny right now for me cause he's supposed to), it works  Get my point?
> 
> ...


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## mae (Aug 17, 2009)

MEM11363 said:


> This should not be like solving rubiks cube in the dark. If it is, your partner is broken. Really.


I would have to kinda agree. It shouldn't have to be rocket science. 

Nothing has improved in the last week since talking to him about it. I certainly haven't tried any more and I really don't care any more. But I do get pissed off when he tries to have a quickie in the middle of the night, which he did two nights ago. I told him no 5 times and finally gave up because I was so tired. So we had stupid sex for 3 min, then he came and was fine and we went to sleep (with me being highly annoyed of course). I would rather he just go jerk off in the bathroom.

I'm not dressing up for him or doing anything else nice for him. I dressed up for myself once this week, just for work, that was fun. I got a lot of compliments at work, which made me feel good. 

I disagree my weight is the issue. If that's really the issue he should just say so and then I will know he is truely an a-hole and doesn't deserve me. I also don't continually ask him about it, I rarely bring it up. But I'm not really willing to sit here for 10 years hoping it sorts itself out magically.

Thanks for all the imput and advice.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

mae said:


> But I do get pissed off when he tries to have a quickie in the middle of the night, which he did two nights ago. *I told him no 5 times* and finally gave up because I was so tired. So we had stupid sex for 3 min, then he came and was fine and we went to sleep (with me being highly annoyed of course). I would rather he just go jerk off in the bathroom.


The above would tend to indicate that there is a power struggle going on. Is it that you want more sex, or that you want it more on your terms?

If you were willing to work with what you both have in common, you might get somewhere. Over time you could turn quickies in the middle of the night into marathons at noon. But if he always says no to you and you keep saying no to him, there ain't going to be a lot of action.


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## katie jane (Oct 26, 2009)

that sounds just like me but im the one doing the pestering lol !! trying not to and have tried to find a middle ground !! hard going frustrating hs a 2 times a week person and im a 3 times a day person !! i guess its talking and finding that middle ground together


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## mae (Aug 17, 2009)

MarkTwain said:


> The above would tend to indicate that there is a power struggle going on. Is it that you want more sex, or that you want it more on your terms?
> 
> If you were willing to work with what you both have in common, you might get somewhere. Over time you could turn quickies in the middle of the night into marathons at noon. But if he always says no to you and you keep saying no to him, there ain't going to be a lot of action.


This is the first time I have told him no. It's not that I want it only on my terms, it's that I want him to give a sh1t if I get anything out of it and to for once be considerate of what I want. I don't mind quickies in the middle of the night, but when that's ALL you get and the other person rejects you all the time, it's BS. I'm not going to put up with that any longer.


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

mae said:


> but when that's ALL you get and the other person rejects you all the time, it's BS. I'm not going to put up with that any longer.


That's fair enough! Just remember to add a sprinkling of humour, and you're well on the way to being home and dry.

But yours does not sound like a happy house, with lots of laughter and giggling. True?


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## mae (Aug 17, 2009)

MarkTwain said:


> That's fair enough! Just remember to add a sprinkling of humour, and you're well on the way to being home and dry.


Not totally sure what you mean by this, but I do want to apologize if my last post sounded biting, if that's what you mean. This is definitely an upsetting subject for me and I feel like I've played fair and am being stiffed by my hubby for no reason, you know what I mean?

No, it's definitely not a household of laughter and giggles, except where it comes to our daughter. She giggles a lot and that definitely makes us laugh 

I feel like I'm stuck in a rut. I've tried to use everyone's advice in some way, from backing off, to trying to make myself more sexy (yes, in attitude, not just in dress), to pouncing on him, to talking frankly with him about it, and nothing seems to be working. 

I feel like at this point he's pushed me to the other edge where I just don't want it anymore. I don't want to have sex with him. So I guess it's just a waiting game, to see if he's willing to change it or if I need to leave him because I refuse to live like this for another 10 years or for the rest of my life.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

When we had a rough spot in year 16 and 17 I flat out told my wife that I could tolerate sex once every 5 days at the worst. And it had to be good sex - which it was. Thing is my wife was good about the 5 day rule. Every once in a while we did it more frequently then that, but not very often. Still even during that period of time on any given night if I told her that I needed her, she would have sex with me. 

So me - I would tell someone my minimum and let them know if they can't live with that - then I either want out or want my freedom to have external entertainment. 

It has never come to that - and never will but I always made it clear that sex is not optional in a marriage. If you are sick, you get a hall pass, but that is it. 





mae said:


> Not totally sure what you mean by this, but I do want to apologize if my last post sounded biting, if that's what you mean. This is definitely an upsetting subject for me and I feel like I've played fair and am being stiffed by my hubby for no reason, you know what I mean?
> 
> No, it's definitely not a household of laughter and giggles, except where it comes to our daughter. She giggles a lot and that definitely makes us laugh
> 
> ...


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## MarkTwain (Aug 1, 2008)

mae said:


> No, it's definitely not a household of laughter and giggles, except where it comes to our daughter. She giggles a lot and that definitely makes us laugh


You see, your household is upside-down. Your daughter should be surrounded by laughing loving parents who cuddle in front of her. And she should be emotionally feeding of that. What you have in your house is two adults feeding off the child. Now don't get me wrong, children _are_ a blessing, but your husband is cold becuase he did not have love and affection demonstrated to him in _his _parental home.



mae said:


> I feel like at this point he's pushed me to the other edge where I just don't want it anymore. *I don't want to have sex with him.* So I guess it's just a waiting game, to see if he's willing to change it or if I need to leave him because I refuse to live like this for another 10 years or for the rest of my life.


Do you see the dichotomy here? You say in your thread title that you want more sex, but you say here you don't want it with _him_...

I'm not picking on you, I'm just being a mirror - please don't smash me 

I know how much you hurt honey, I'm just trying to lift you up in a helicopter to show you a more distant horizon than you can see from the ground.

I'm the first person on here to talk about sex sex sex... but usually when it goes wrong there is something else behind it. In your case I am guessing your husband's dry upbringing - possibly some alcoholism on his parent's part. And then on top of that there is whatever you are bringing to the table. 

Most of the time humans don't mean to hurt each other, it's just that through ignorance, we end up making a mess.


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## mae (Aug 17, 2009)

I do see what you're saying Mark. I guess at the start of this post I was actually still trying. I did want more sex with him. I still want more sex, but I want it to be meaningful and I feel like at this point he has some making up to do first. 

I don't want meaningless sex for the rest of my life or I'd just go to the nearest bar and pick out some cute random guy. The sad thing is that would probably yield more passionate sex than with my husband! LOL. Not what I'm looking for. I'm not a cheater. I would just end it first.

His dad was (and is) a very emotionless guy and doesn't show affection. My husband blames his inability to show affection on this. I can understand that, but a person has to be willing to change and therein lies the problem. He recognizes it's a problem but won't work on it. 

My parents always had financial trouble and surprise surprise, I also had financial trouble. But I recognized the issue and worked to solve it. I am now much better with my finances and am helping my parents with theirs. So I know it's possible to change despite your upbringing, but you have to want to. You can't just "accept" it and live with it for the rest of your life.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Mae,
You are in the right here. These quickies that just please him are total bs.






mae said:


> I do see what you're saying Mark. I guess at the start of this post I was actually still trying. I did want more sex with him. I still want more sex, but I want it to be meaningful and I feel like at this point he has some making up to do first.
> 
> I don't want meaningless sex for the rest of my life or I'd just go to the nearest bar and pick out some cute random guy. The sad thing is that would probably yield more passionate sex than with my husband! LOL. Not what I'm looking for. I'm not a cheater. I would just end it first.
> 
> ...


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## QuitaBee (Aug 11, 2009)

I say continue to wear the sexy lingerie, have orgasms by yourself! Do it while he's in the bed if your bold enough , he's likely to join in. I dont know any man who isn't turned on by that(I might be wrong)! That way your already turned on so if he does join you with a quickie your more likely to reach your peek. Go walking by yourself, take initiative to not let this piss you off so much. Be the woman that YOU want to be, do what YOU find sexy and be confident in doing so!! I realize the more we rely on ourselves for satisfaction, the more we come into our own the more the men pay attention...


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## mae (Aug 17, 2009)

QuitaBee said:


> I say continue to wear the sexy lingerie, have orgasms by yourself! Do it while he's in the bed if your bold enough , he's likely to join in. I dont know any man who isn't turned on by that(I might be wrong)! That way your already turned on so if he does join you with a quickie your more likely to reach your peek. Go walking by yourself, take initiative to not let this piss you off so much. Be the woman that YOU want to be, do what YOU find sexy and be confident in doing so!! I realize the more we rely on ourselves for satisfaction, the more we come into our own the more the men pay attention...


Some good advice. Unfortuantely pleasuring myself just doesn't do it for me, and trust me, I've tried. But I will continue to exercise and try and make myself feel sexy.

Just as an update: It's been a couple weeks since we had sex. Yesterday I saw a myspace message he sent to his ex-girlfriend telling her she still looks sexy and hot (he's never, ever said anything like this to me). It was pretty much the last straw. Last night he tried to have sex with me and I told him hell no. I told him I had seen the message and that I was pretty much done and had no desire to have sex anymore with him. 

I guess this was kinda a wake up call for him, though I've told him before that I was pretty much done with our marriage. It was interesting how he was shocked that I had said no to sex. I've literally never turned him down before, maybe now he knows how it feels, though I doubt it.

We didn't really get to resolve anything last night because our daughter woke up and it took me a couple hours to get her back to sleep. This morning he took his own initiative and made an appointment for us with a priest at an Episcopalian church (I don't know where he got this idea from since neither of us are Episcopalian but that's ok). I'm pretty happy about this, it's middle ground. I didn't really want to see a therapist and he wasn't willing to go to my church for counselling, so it's middle ground and that's ok with me. I was very happy that he took his own initiative and I didn't have to do it.

We agreed to talk again tonight. I'm not sure what the outcome of that will be since every conversation inevitably ends with what I'm doing wrong. I told him last night that at some point he needs to stop and look at what he's doing. I also specifically pointed out what I knew were my weaknesses in the relationship and apologized, saying I would work on them and pointing out how I had been improving on them (mainly with cleaning and finances). He agreed but didn't follow suit and take a look at anything he'd been doing. He has a very hard time looking at his actions. I hope the conversation tonight goes somewhere.

I'll keep everyone updated and any other input would be great.


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## coffee bean (Apr 3, 2009)

Your story is like the Lily Allen song 'No Fair'

I wonder how it would go down if you hinted or downright told him he is no good in bed?

I bet he wouldn't want to be known as crap in bed. I'm surprised his male pride lets him get away with being so useless.

I was really angry about this thing that he won't let you get on with your own business ideas on your day off. Clean the house? I would tell him to clean the effing house himself and march off and do more interesting things. Don't put up with it honey bun.

What does an episcopalian priest know about women and their orgasms? - don't let him hoodwink you - get someone who's going to be on your side.

I think Quitabee is totally right - dress up and be sexy for yourself and long may you bask in compliments. Eventually you'll hit it off with someone who can't wait to give you as much pleasure as you can stand, if your husband hasn't bucked his ideas up before then.

Pleasuring yourself is a bit of an art but don't give up - it will keep you going and help you understand your own responses more. Doing loads of kegel exercises ALWAYS helps. 

What about making it clear, as MT often advises men to do, that sexual satisfaction is an inherent right for each married partner? Tell him that if he's not going to bother with it then he can say so and you can get it elsewhere.

Here's a quote from Dan Savage:

"Marriage can be about all the things you list, but so long as sexual exclusivity is presumed to be a part of marriage—a defining part, according to the right-wingers—spouses have a right to expect sexual activity within their marriages. People who are interested in marriage but not sex—people whose lists only include family, friendship, stability, love, someone to grow old with, and on and on, but not sex—need to inform their prospective spouses of their disinterest in sex before marrying, not after.
As I've said a million times: If you don't think that sex is what marriage is all about, mostly about, or even partly about, if sex is something you can live without, that's grand. But you need to marry someone who feels the same way or inform your betrothed of your disinterest in advance. And if you lose interest in sex after you marry, but want your partner to stick around for the family and stability and friendship, I'll let you in on a little secret: The spouse is likelier to stick around if you give the spouse permission to get his or her sexual needs met elsewhere.
It never ceases to amaze me how many people who aren't interested in sex—who consider sex to be trivial and unimportant—nevertheless deny their frustrated partners permission to do this trivial, unimportant thing with others."

Savage Love - Columns - Savage Love - Dan Savage - The Stranger, Seattle's Only Newspaper

(is the 2nd letter in the column if you want to look it up)


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## HappyHer (Nov 12, 2009)

There are some wonderful suggestions here but no one has mentioned the two main points I'm seeing here. Depression could certainly be one culprit. Has he been screened for depression? If not, please insist that he do so. The other point is that pregnancy and being with child. You said you are still nursing. Many men become horrified at the thought of "defiling" their children's mother. Now that you are the mother of his child, and breast feeding, he could really be going through a tough adjustment time. He may not even be aware of that on a fully conscious level, only that his desire has dropped. Counseling is certainly the ideal place to start with this. Fatherhood, and remaining in a sexual relationship with "Mom" really trips some guys up. If there is also some depression going on, that will take a big hit on the libido as well.


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