# Just some thoughts on sex from 1 woman



## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Ok, new here, but I have noticed a lot of discussion on the big sex issue. Here is a bit from my personal perspective as a woman.

Guys, sex means something completely different for women than men. It may sound silly to think, but men seriously put WAY more emotional investment on sex than women. Think about it. When men are not getting sex from their women, they jump to "she doesn't love me" while women jump to "I am not physically attractive enough". 

I don't know ay women that say they need sex to know a man loves them. We may use sex to get physically close, through the intamacy, but we would usually be just as happy there with some good cuddle time. I think we wonder sometimes why men NEED it to go all the way, and will use that as power ina game, but we don't need it to feel loved.

That said... My personal experience.... I know men need the act. Somehow spewing forth with the help of a SO equates to some act of love. I get it. That is why I will often give when i am in no mood to get. Like any other little gift, I will give what I think will put that smile on his face out of love.

Now.... If I feel I am not getting what I need, that I am invisible, or that I am not important or respected, I am not likely to give that special gift to the man. That means if you want what you like and need, you better pay attention to what I like and need which is TOTALLY different (not to mention way off from what many of you guys seem to think a woman wants). 

All that said, I will also remind men that YES women do enjoy sex. We may not be using it to get love, we may just be using it to get off. Personally, since I do not require it for an emotional connection, I can make it a great physical gift for myself, with the added bonus of getting the mans arms all over me. If I am not getting frm the man...,. well... There are reasons some showers are longer than others, and it's not always shaving . 

My suggestion is to find a way to stop equating love with how often a women provides sexual pleasure. OR explain to her WHY you need it, saying it is what makes you feel loved, then ask "Do you feel loved?" if she says no.. well that's probably why you aren't getting any. Find out what will make her feel loved, provide that, then wait and see, and DON'T think sex is an issue that will be solved over night!!!! There is a kind of resentment there because generally we don't get why you need it, and our perspective makes you look like sex is all that matters, and because it is not that for us... the misunderstanding makes for a bit of resentment. Just believe that, and don't push it.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

woodstock said:


> I don't know ay women that say they need sex to know a man loves them.


I do. I would feel seriously unloved if sex were absent.



> We may use sex to get physically close, through the intamacy, but we would usually be just as happy there with some good cuddle time.


Yikes! I hope my husband doesn't read that!  Not at all for me. I think there is basis for this generalization. But I think there are so many women who DON'T fit this generalization to limit its usefulness.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

One more tip for the boys.. Since a woman will innitiate sex either to get intamacy, or to get off... PLEASE learn to tell the difference. If it begins with passionate holding, soft kissing, a light carress.. If she is simply pusshing to have your bodies so close you can't tell where you begin or end... that is INTAMACY... go for THAT... soft foreplay, lots of holding... use soft, loving compliment. Kiss and carress her whole body and DON'T use this time to perfect the art of the jack hammer....

Now, if she is a little more agressive, obviously working to turn you on... going right for the grab.. pushing you against the wall and kissing you in ways that make EVERY muscle hard... well then she wants something else... FIRST know what gets her hot and bothered and make sure to let ladies go first (PLEASE remember that because blue balls is not a gender biased condition). Make it about the physical pleasure, and once she has gotten hers.... she will more than likely to allow your needs to be filled in nearly whatever way you need (and in some cases, welll.... in any way you choose.... if you are a very lucky man). 

The key is followig her lead. The signs are NOT subtle, just open your eyes, and pay attention... that's really what we truly want from men.... see the details boys!!


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

vthomeschoolmom said:


> I do. I would feel seriously unloved if sex were absent.
> 
> 
> Yikes! I hope my husband doesn't read that!  Not at all for me. I think there is basis for this generalization. But I think there are so many women who DON'T fit this generalization to limit its usefulness.


Is it the actually intercourse you need? You mean you can feel loved with the man is simply going out with the jack hammer every time? That is a strange place for a woman. All teh women I know get the love from the intamacy... not the insertion, what I am saying is that men need to get that insertion to get that love, in THAT lies the difference. 

Not really a generalization, just a realization about the actual ACT. Think hard on that one.... insertion or intamacy.... which one touches YOUR heart?


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Somewhere in this emotional difference may lie a connection to the fact that a woman does NOT require a big "O" to get what she needs from sex... men get nothing but frustrated and cranky when they lack the big "O"....


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

Woodstock,

I understand what your saying, but to think men can just stop thinking the way they do, in that they need sex to be loved, by just explaining this too us Is a bit nieve. Men need sex to feel loved because it's hardwired in our head from 80 thousand years or more of evolutionary conditioning. Telling us to think differently by just telling us is like telling someone they don't need to breath. It's how we are wired.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Yes, but in understanding you can find a middle ground. I know women who will say flatly they just don't have sex with their hubby, while in the same conversation say how they are so wonderful and attentive. My question is then why on earth would not give back? I think maybe they just don't get what it is for them. In some cases I think it is just plain mean.

I also know men that live under the somewhat juvenile dillusion that women also equate love with sex since we are the ones that talk about "saving it for love" when we are young. I haven't quite figured out exactly where that comes from other than that we have the same desire for intamacy then, but no experience to allow us to separate that from the act.

We can be wired, but when it comes to communicating with one not wired like us.... it helps to have a road map. Kind of a first step to compromise. 

If anything, what I put here could maybe one day fall upon the eyes of a man I will be with, and save him and me the trouble of havig this conversation (which I always do if needed). 

And BTW... humans were once wired to do a LOT of things we would find strange (a couple of years studying anthropology tought me that) but we are that unique species of the planet that continually defies instinct and hardwiring. Reason allows us to, so I offer something to reason with


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

Wow, now I'm beginning to wonder if there's a secret third gender out there. My wife equates love with sex. Plain and simple. In over twenty years, she's never once 'not felt like it' or turned it down. She tells me that she wants some sort of sexual intimacy every day, and hates what the forties have done to me. I've found it to be the best way to stop an otherwise testy argument. Just kiss her, then intercourse, and resume the argument another day. Even though dryness is far from being a problem, I've literally been too sore for more. I'm not bragging. We have our issues, but we discussed sexual needs for many hours before marrying and agreed that this will never be optional.


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## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

its very presumptuous to generalize ones own feelings towards sex (or any other issue) as that of all. I really dont believe all women feel this strongly about not wanting/needing sex. I do agree men and women have different views about sex though (generally speaking).

it seems to me there are alot of women on here that appear to think sex with their husband is like "giving in", or being weak. I dont get that at all. aside from physical or verbal abuse issues, if your husband is a good person and a good father, why make it so difficult?


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Ah, but you said the magic word... INTIMACY... not [email protected]#*ing.... It is the intimacy she craves and has just learned that she can get that from the sex. If she is craving intimacy (not physical pleasure, which I admit is the reason no man will be likely to complain about a sex life with me personally) then you could get the same result from providing intimacy without actual intercourse. The touching, kissing, holding.... 

Now perhaps she is like me and also seriously enjoys the physical pleasure..... she may also be a closet self pleaser as well... I am just sharing the secret that although there can be both, intimacy and sexual pleasure(intercourse) are seperate in the heart of woman...


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## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

:scratchhead:


woodstock said:


> Ah, but you said the magic word... INTIMACY... not [email protected]#*ing.... It is the intimacy she craves and has just learned that she can get that from the sex. If she is craving intimacy (not physical pleasure, which I admit is the reason no man will be likely to complain about a sex life with me personally) then you could get the same result from providing intimacy without actual intercourse. The touching, kissing, holding....
> 
> Now perhaps she is like me and also seriously enjoys the physical pleasure..... she may also be a closet self pleaser as well... I am just sharing the secret that although there can be both, intimacy and sexual pleasure(intercourse) are seperate in the heart of woman...


:scratchhead:


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

What's the head scratch? Women crave intimacy. Men get the same from sex... Women learn they can get the intimacy FROM the sex, but it is still not the sex per say. They are seperate things. One is for the heart, the other is for the body...


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## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

woodstock said:


> What's the head scratch? Women crave intimacy. Men get the same from sex... Women learn they can get the intimacy FROM the sex, but it is still not the sex per say. They are seperate things. One is for the heart, the other is for the body...


not being snotty, sorry. just a little confused because you state in your OP what women really need to enjoy sex, then you state that you "seriously enjoy" the physical pleasure.

in the OP it kinda says that women dont need sex and would be just as happy with cuddle time, i dunno, i'm just confused as usual


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Well it's like this. If I need intimacy, an emotional connection... I don;t NEED sex, but will take it because it involves the hugging, kissing etc that offers the emotinal connection. Cuddling is just as good (actually better). BUT, if I am hot a bothered... well... then I want down and dirty. 

I will admit to being out of a norm in that I have the sex drive of a 16 year old boy (I LOVE IT) but I do not connect it with my emotional drive. 

I also did not mean to imply that women need intimacy to enjoy sex... women need to be pleased physically to enjoy "SEX". To enjoy INTIMACY, women need to be made to feel good on the INSIDE (not talking G spot here).

Women don't NEED sex to feel LOVE. That's not to say they don't need/want it for pleasure... men on the other hand, from many a conversation, many an observation, and what seems obvious if you look closely, NEED sex to feel love. 

I have heard so many men say that they feel so close to me during sex, or mention love with sex, or say they don't feel loved if they are not getting it.... 

Women though, if the man can't/won't have sex may talk about the physical frustration, but as long as intimacy, the little hugs, carressing, noticing of details and such is there, then so is the feeling of being loved. 

I guess I made it confusing somehow.. didn;t mean to... it's really not confusing at all.


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## greeneyeddolphin (May 31, 2010)

I don't really agree with the "just as happy with cuddle time" theory. I mean, yes, if I had to, I would make myself happy with that. But the truth is, if I want to cuddle with someone, I have 2 kids that I could cuddle with. Sex with my boyfriend is something that I can't get from anyone else, and that he doesn't give to anyone else. It's something special between just the two of us, that only the two of us share. It makes me feel loved because it's so unique to us (unique in terms of not doing it with anyone else, not implying that no one else has sex ). Without sex, I would feel less loved by him. 

At the same time, there is the physical aspect to it, which he does so well. And I won't deny that sometimes I do look forward to sex just for that. But if sex stopped, I would feel like maybe he didn't love me, because it's the one thing that only we share together, that no one else can get in on, and now here he doesn't want to do it, and why would that be? 

And I don't look at sex as some sort of gift I give to him, or something to barter with to get what I want. I don't pull the "If you'll do X, I'll give you a bj" type thing. I enjoy sex, with him, and when we have sex, I want it to be mutual, that we both want it and want to be there and get pleasure out of it, not something that one of us is giving to the other in order to get something else or because we feel like we have to. 

I think there are a lot of other underlying factors that could make a woman (or a man, for that matter) decide not to have sex with her partner that you're not looking at. Of course, you can't, because they're individual to each of those women who aren't having sex. But to generalize the way you have here...I don't really think you can do that.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

If that's the only thing you share together, then you will be in trouble one day if one can't... Not a good thing IMO..

I generalize because in general, men and women ARE different. We think, feel, see, and react in different ways. Humans are all individual, but we do fall into generalizations based on gender. There is no way around that one. The thing is to know the differences and work with them. 

I am simply saying like with everything else, we, meaning the genders, feel sex in a different way, like it for different reasons, and get different things out of it. 

Now really ask yourself. If he did not want to have sex suddenly, would your first thought be about love? or would it be to look in a mirror and wonder if his attraction to you changed? I remember thinking it was love, then realized, nope... found myself looking in the mirror wondering why I did not turn him on (Turned out to a dog BTW.. long story, but has some hysterically funny, if not disturbing details HAHA)

I am not even saying the differences are bad... just there. Knowing that makes it less likely for sex to become some deciding make or break factor in a relationship... There are a LOT of discussions here on that one, and in many of them I am reading them thinking that it is so silly for it to be made into the deal it is. 

Just the insanely logical side of me seeing that sex does not have to be the make or break (unless it is of course occurring outside the relationship)


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## greeneyeddolphin (May 31, 2010)

woodstock said:


> If that's the only thing you share together, then you will be in trouble one day if one can't... Not a good thing IMO..


You completely misunderstood what I said. I said it is the only thing that we share that NO ONE else shares with us. We have plenty of common interests, but we also share those common interests with other people. We DO NOT have sex with other people. So sex is the one thing that we get from each other as a result of our love for each other. We could find other people to share our common interests with, if we didn't share them in common, but we couldn't find other people to have sex with, since we are exclusive. I think I was pretty clear in expressing that the first time around, so I'm not sure how you misunderstood it. 

As far as your generalizations based on gender, it's called stereotypes. And have you considered that the only reason that these stereotypes still exist is because people who, like you, form generalizations based on them, have made both genders feel as though they MUST fit that stereotype or else people will think there is something wrong with them? Perhaps if people stopped saying women look at sex this way and men look at sex that way, both men and women would be able to be honest as individuals and be honest with their partners about how they look at sex, and then maybe some of these "we don't have as much/the kind of sex that I want" stories would go away because people would have gotten an honest statement of what their partner wanted instead of a statement of what the partner thinks they need to be based on their gender, regardless of how they would really feel otherwise. 

And yes, if my boyfriend did stop having sex with me suddenly, I would wonder about love as my first thought. I look exactly the same as I did when we first met, as does he, and our personalities have not changed either. So, yes, that would be my first thought, not physical attraction.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Well then you are unique in my experience with people. As for generalizations... well .. I don't mind them when they point out a general truth. I am fine with men and women being so different, it is what offers us so much potential for balance. And yes, an honest statement is needed between lovers, but it certainly helps to know where that statement comes from and WHY it is likely to differ from your own.

You make it sound as if I think the differences are bad. Not at all. And as for sex being your own thing... I still have to sayI think that is dangerous to put so much pressure on the act since it is likely to ebb and flow with life, and hormones and lots of other things. One day you will need to find something else to replace what you get from sex.


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## greeneyeddolphin (May 31, 2010)

woodstock said:


> Not at all. And as for sex being your own thing... I still have to sayI think that is dangerous to put so much pressure on the act since it is likely to ebb and flow with life, and hormones and lots of other things. One day you will need to find something else to replace what you get from sex.


You are assuming a lot about me and my relationship based on two posts in a relationship forum. Where exactly did I say I put pressure on the act? I didn't. You put that interpretation on my words. I never once said that if he didn't have sex with me at least X times per day/week/month/year, I would think he didn't love me. I simply said if it stopped altogether, I would think that. 

And who says that one day the sex will need to be replaced? I know plenty of couples well into their 60s, 70s, and even 80s who still have sex. And if, by some chance, something does happen that we can't, our relationship would be just fine. You see, your assumption that I put pressure on sex in our relationship is not quite right. If sex stopped with no explanation and no cause, I would think no sex = no love. But if he were to have a medical condition to precluded sex, or I had one, that is a very different situation, and would not make me think that. And also...I would have a conversation with him, rather than just going with my thoughts. 

Sex is not a dealbreaker for our relationship. All of my thoughts and feelings on this are based on how our relationship has always been, and all is with the knowledge that I would simply talk to him if this situation were to arise and we would be able to figure out what was going on. 

Please stop making assumptions based on my words here. You are seeing a few words typed on a page, you do not know my entire thought process, or have any knowledge of my relationship, my past, or anything else. You have no solid base on which to build your assumptions.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

My interpretation came from the words presented. That's all I have to go on. And I am not saying to be mean. just as you made assumptions and interpreted what I wrote, I did the same. Can't do much more.

I am not sure what you expect people to do on a forum, but generally it involves making assumptions based on what can be interpreted from the page. That's all I am doing. Nothing more nothing less.

My words are based on my own experiences, and realizations, along with long, detailed conversations with both sexes on the subject and meant to be from me. If your experience is different then great, but like I said, you would fall far out of the norm from my own experience as well as what has been gained through my conversations and explorations of the subject with other. 

There are always exceptions that prove the rule. Don't get all antsy or uptight by my words. You made just as many assumptions and interpretations as I did. frankly, since I don't know you, your relationship does not mean, well anything to me directly, and didn't mean to make it sound as if it did, neither did I make any assumption that I would mean anything to you.

It's no biggie, I am fine when people disagree with me, in fact in some cases, depending on the person, it has lead to some of the best realizations of my life so I welcome it... as long as that disagreement can be handled by both parties. Doesn't always work that way, say la vie


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

Honestly I'm too old to equate sex with love anymore. I'm not sure that I ever did. I have sure known plenty of women who did, however. Women who, after a one night stand, wondered if he loved her. REALLY???? I see the young girls in my neck of the woods who believe a guy loves her b/c he's having sex with her (even though he treats her like total crap). 

If my sweetie stopped having sex with me, I wouldn't doubt his love, but I'd know there's an issue *somewhere*. Somehow I think if he stopped loving me, there would be way more evidence of that than the cessation of sex. 

Maybe that's an entirely different thing, however.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

WOW, I don't equate what I thought when i was young and just testing the waters to reality LOL I guess I grew out of that "he must love me if he is inside me" thing... Looking back I feel that was society placing a little girl feminine thing on me. 

Lets say for argument's sake.... I am speaking of the adult viewpoint here HAHA


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

Is 45 old enough?


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Used to thin that was just about right, till I tangled up in 45 going on 18, but that is whole different issue HAHA

Seriously though, I think your age will totally change the connection to my point of view. I think at a certain age all that girly crap about love and sex becomes, I dont know, unrealistic somehow? It kind of goes the way of fairytales and knights on white horses. LOL I have to laugh even thinking about my youth and that OMG I love him so I will F him thought process. Youth was so cute HAHA


major misfit said:


> Is 45 old enough?


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

woodstock said:


> Seriously though, I think your age will totally change the connection to my point of view.


You think? Though some never grow out of that "girly crap" as you so eloquently put it.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Hey I am still woman, WOMAN, the girl is long gone.... Well unless there is a really creepy bug in the room, then girl comes out screaming HAHAHA


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

wow, i aparently really push the buttons of folks standing on the defensive. Really didnt mean to, can only suggest finding a zen and chilling out
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

I'm suggesting a flogging stick and cat o' nine tails instead.

*grin*


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Ahh, well kink is whole different story, and somehow I think flogging definitely separates intimacy from pleasure HAHA Or pain, unless one leads to the other for you HAHA


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

Don't mistake sarcasm for defensiveness. And I'm going with Trenton on this one....


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Oh trust me, I was contacted and it was NOT sarcasm, it was just crazy HAHA


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## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

You're crazy. Stop sharing your thoughts you stinky stock of wood!


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

well ya I am crazy, but i believe the discussion on stinky stocks of wood was taking place over the "do you swallow" thread HAAAAAA


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## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

hahahahahaha


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

Oy, I think things are going to get very interesting around here, lol!


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Ummm Probably LMAO


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## Shianne (Feb 5, 2011)

I am not okay with just cuddles. I am much more demanding a physical partner. I do not equate sex with love but I will feel undesired if I don't have sex. I can get LOVE from other sources, my children for example give me love with no sex, but if I am with a man that I am not getting sex from. If he is giving only love he will quickly become another child. Not a partner.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Ah, but feeling undesired is different than feeling unloved.. men are more likely to feel unloved without sex. This is where I find things interesting. Knowing a man needs that for love, I can more easily communicate that like him, I need that feeling too, but it will come from something different. So.... if I am feeling loved so will he. Also makes it easier to understand the man's needs sometimes. I don't feel so much resentment over sex and his absolute need to have it in order to reconnect, when I would rather wait, since like me, he is just seeking that same feeling.

The last relationship I was in when for a rollercoaster ride. When we were working on an up after hitting a down.. I would seek out a conversation about how to change things and what we both needed to do, then would pretty much want him to need me, or to pull me close and act completely relieved to have me in his arms. His needs went right to sex and needing that to reassure him that my love was still there. Until I understood that is what he was seeking in the sex, I kind of resented the idea, first thinking "geez, all you want is a roll in the sack? is that all I am to you?" 

Ok, so that feeling always did creep up, but I could pretty much reason it away by acknowledging to myself that he was looking for the same thing as me.

This is why I put things like this out there. It was a realization that fixed one thing for me and I am sure will serve me well in the future. I don't really mind that a man needs that, though I wish more men would realize that the needs ARE different and think about it when we are looking for love and don't want it to be sex. 

It's all about making communication less of an exercise in decoding.


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## Shianne (Feb 5, 2011)

I think men CAN feel love without sex. They can have loving non-sexual relationships just as women can. The sex is what MAKES it a marriage in my personal opinion. It is the church sanction for sex. It is the thing that is to be for no one else. It is the line, the defining factor that takes it from love to love and desire. Men don't need it to feel loved they might, just like women need it to feel handsome, strong, desired and like he still "has" it. Just like women. 

Forgive me here but in my personal experience... women just withdraw it faster, not feeling the other kinds of love that they want and having lower sex drives they are not interested in BEING desired, it can become a chore fast if anyone feels it is an obligation.

And nobody likes feeling like an obligation. I can want sex in the worst way and if I get a hint of my husband not wanting but going along out of obligation it is an instant mood kill. I will just take a shower later. Of course I may be mixing all of this up lol since I have been told that I "think more like a man" by most every person that gets to know me.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Well ya, cuz you know the kid does not learn not to touch the stove cuz ya tell em not to, they learn cuz it hurts when they do it behind your back LOL Sometimes men don't get how it feels to have that token of love removed till ya remove it. 

Seriously though... really? Sex is just for marriage? I am hoping the man I marry is greatfull for the fact that I am learned in practiced in the area, and he gets to reap the cumulative benefits HAHA


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## Shianne (Feb 5, 2011)

LOL no sex is not just for marriage. I am so far from that belief but the laugh it gave me was awesome. BUT it is what defines marriage in my opinion. It is implied and expected that 2 married people will have sex. Some hold out for it but marriage is a sexual (and financial) commitment. Even in open marriages it is still a commitment with ground rules about how they will handle sex.


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## Shianne (Feb 5, 2011)

hehehe sexual generalizations from me lmfao... as if I would know squat about normal. I do know Normal, it is a town in Illinois. I should really refrain from this conversation probably but I did want to show that every stereotype although often based on many is not fitting to all. Some of us are out of that norm.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Well, my mom married my stepfather in a hospital room from which he never emerged after the wedding. What made their wedding was simply love and respect for each other. Neither needed anything more than they had already given. Not that I want to consider my mother's sex life... but when the subject has come up *gag* there was none due to my stepfather's medical conditions... they still had their 14 years or so and a few months of wedded bliss. So... there is much more that can make a marriage, or a relationship.


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## alphaomega (Nov 7, 2010)

woodstock said:


> well ya I am crazy, but i believe the discussion on stinky stocks of wood was taking place over the "do you swallow" thread HAAAAAA


There is a "do you swallow thread?". Excuse me ladies...I'll be right back.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

To clarify the generalizations here, I don't want people flipping out... DUH I am aware not everyone is the same, BUT I am also aware that somehow we all fit into being part of a generalization, a steryoetype blah blah. Underneath it all, women are women, men are men and there are distinct differences between how we think, feel, and see. 

I don't think i am stereotyping to say that women do not HAVE to experience the big "O" to enjoy a sexual encounter. Sure it's nice, but if we had to have that everytime we would be going CRAZY! No offence boys, but, well, Ya, we don't everytime HAHA On the flip side... trying being a woman who gets one then stops and goes to sleep before the man gets there HAAAAAA ok that would probably be REALLY funny for the woman and her GF's HEHE, but also kinda mean...

Just saying there are some differences, and if you know what they are, then when you are communicating about sex, you can better understand your partner. I know from experience that as a woman I will translate what my partner says as I understand it for myself, but that does not always translate to what he meant to say. 

I know men always talk about women speaking in code, well.... Good god men! you really think you are free from your own code? Lordy lodry I feel as though I am dealing with the Enigma with some men! (Ok I know most of you don't get that but trust me... along the lines of Navaho code talking here)

I hate intentional games, and I hate bad communication.. BUT I know relationships are a game of sorts and there is no excaping it and I know we speak the same words, but the languages are different so I just try to make it a little easier to make my way through. Will admit it does not always work, some folks are so far out of the norm well, Hey I am still trying to figure out the form of English of my ex and wondering why he never supplied me with a translator or at least my own private mind reader for assistance HAAA And either he was really as dumb as he seems or I have my own communication issues, though I pretty much will always say exactly how I feel, and wear my self on a transparent sleeve around people I trust... but hey, will have to figure that out when I find someone with a more working brain cells to be with.


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## surfergirl (Jan 27, 2011)

woodstock said:


> ... trying being a woman who gets one then stops and goes to sleep before the man gets there HAAAAAA ok that would probably be REALLY funny for the woman and her GF's HEHE, but also kinda mean...


I have often thought of doing that (you know....just for fun to see the reaction teehee)...but yeah, never end up doing it 'cause it seems kinda mean


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## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

some insight into the female mind


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## MarriedWifeInLove (May 28, 2010)

woodstock said:


> Seriously though, I think your age will totally change the connection to my point of view. I think at a certain age all that girly crap about love and sex becomes, I dont know, unrealistic somehow? It kind of goes the way of fairytales and knights on white horses.


I actually resent that comment.

I am 50 going on 51 and I still am "girly" about love and sex with my husband.

And WTH is the matter with still believing in fairytales and knights on white horses? That way of thinking gives hope to some. 

While I'm old enough to realize that it is just that - a fairytale - I don't want to lose that sense of wonder and hope that life is just that...helps get me through the hard times.

You have the right to your opinion, as well as everyone else here - just don't push it down our throats - ALL women are not like you, or me, for that matter (and I am blunt and outspoken too, but not to the point of being totally insensitive to others).

I happen to love fairytales and knights on white horses - thank you!


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

MarriedWifeInLove said:


> I happen to love fairytales and knights on white horses - thank you!


And you may be shocked to find out that on this, you and I also agree. Wonders never cease, eh?

My view is a bit more tempered now but is there just the same. I posted as much a very long time ago on this forum ... and it's a black horse for me, not a white one.


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

I honestly think it comes down to a person's "love language". My SO's happens to be physical touch and quality time. THAT is what makes him feel loved. The physical aspect adds to that exponentially. BOTH ways. 

I don't like discussing my sex life much, so without much detail...lying in the afterglow, one of the tremendous feelings for me was that I felt totally LOVED. And yes, it was the sex that made it feel that way. I would have felt the same if he had just cuddled me, but the sex took it to another level.


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## notaname (Feb 4, 2011)

Deejo said:


> And you may be shocked to find out that on this, you and I also agree. Wonders never cease, eh?
> 
> My view is a bit more tempered now but is there just the same. I posted as much a very long time ago on this forum ... and it's a black horse for me, not a white one.


That's hot. :smthumbup:


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Fairytales are fine when the provide hope, but they become dangerous when they are used to escape....

I have to say, I kind of feel bad for people who need the act so badly in order to attach the intimacy to love. So many things can hapen to prevent the act from being an option (as in the case of my mom). 

And by the way... how can one be pushing anything down anyone's throat on a forum? It is not like you can't escape my opinion here... just don't read it HAAAA Or do as you did and express your own along with.... I take no offense to that, I welcome it, but since this is a back and forth format of conversation/debate, expect me to ether respond or challenge, especially since I began this ****** HAHA

Again, in case anyone missed it, this is based on more than myself, and I offer it as a piece of perspective in order to ease the challenge of gender communication....

I do gotta say.. It seems interesting to me that I at least seem to have gotten the male side right, even if myself and my friends are WAY off some norm with chicks LMAO The women are defending their men (with the input of their own perspective on it) but not to many men denying my perception of that end.... Either I am on to something there, they aren't reading, or they prefer not to divulge the secrets of the male mind *giggle*


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

What is wrong with "the act" anyway? And so what if someone FEELS loved when they have sex with their partner? It's not just for the men. EQUATING sex with love is a different thing..and I dare to think that there are men who DO. There are also men who feel loved by the kissing, caressing, cuddling, and the time spent. Sex is the ultimate expression of that love, imho.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

woodstock said:


> Fairytales are fine when the provide hope, but they become dangerous when they are used to escape....
> 
> I have to say, I kind of feel bad for people who need the act so badly in order to attach the intimacy to love. So many things can hapen to prevent the act from being an option (as in the case of my mom).
> 
> ...


Nahh ... most of the men avoid the Ladies Lounge like the plague. Cooties ... you know how it is.

I'll have to reread you.


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

ya well, you boys so soon forget the "circle circle dot dot" the cootie shot allows us access to your lounge HAHA

Misfit... again, I am not saying ANYTHING is wrong with the act, OR that anything is wrong with what it is to people. Just saying that when the issues over sex DO arise (they usually do at some point) knowing these things can help improve communication.

Me, I LOVE the act... I mean I LOVE the act HAHA But I don't often attach emotion to it.... of course there are times that I do, but that totally depends on how the act is committed  Never do I need it to feel loved though.... I just need to feel seen, appreciated and a little attention to the details to really feel loved... the sex is all realy good gravy for me. In my experience with the "hims" the sex is more the meal and the rest is the gravy..... that means that when we talk sex, even if we are saying the same WORDS we are meaning something totally different... helps to know that


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## major misfit (Oct 17, 2010)

Maybe you've just met the wrong "hims"?


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## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

I'm actually very, very fond of the knight in shining armor as well. Old Wood over there and I have always somewhat disagreed on this. I enjoy being spoiled and really don't have any desire how to learn "man things". The traditional dance between men and woman works for me except I do want to be valued and respected and I think that was/is sometimes lacking. It's not that I can't do it on my own, it's that I don't want to.


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## Trenton (Aug 25, 2010)

major misfit said:


> Maybe you've just met the wrong "hims"?


That would be the case exactly.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Ok ... You have been read.

Quite frankly, your generalizations feel a little too _specific_

I can't argue nor would I question what you feel, how you operate or what feels right in the relationships that you are in or have been in.

You're claim about women not needing sex to feel love? True. For my girlfriend. She has outright told me as much. False for no fewer than a dozen other women I have been with. On several occasions I have heard articulated from the lips of a woman that there is no more intimate and loving an act than the bond that sex creates. Who knows ... maybe they were faking it ... 

For me, one man; I can have an intimate sexual relationship without love. I cannot imagine having an intimate loving relationship without sex. If I am in love, THE most clear and demonstrative way that my partner can convey that message is through sex. It isn't the ONLY one. But it is the most powerful - and if it is absent, all of the other manners of delivering the message of 'I love you' simply don't mean as much.

And that's how it is. For me.

Your talking points remind me of every once in a while a guy will post about the salient points of the 'biological imperative of sex'.
(Views and opinions expressed below are not necessarily those held by Deejo)
Men are driven to pursue sex with as many partners as possible to assure the species carries on. Women are driven to accept a genetically superior, or preferrable sex partner for the goal of producing offspring with a high rate of survivability and success. Their makeup consists of the desire to nurture and protect children to sexual maturity. 

It ain't wrong. Not by a longshot. But no way in hell is it the whole story either.

I'm fine with generalizations. Some encapsulate a general concept far more successfully than others.

In this case, I'm not going to argue that this is your truth and experience ... in general.

Lot of the ladies have this kind of issue with the 'Man Up' discussions. It is a strategy of behavior and self-control offered to men as a means of recovering their sense of self-esteem, or balance in a faltering relationship. I don't expect the recommendations to make a lick of sense to someone whose experience has nothing in common with those that are struggling with issues surrounding respect, attraction, or sex.

One size most certainly does not fit all, and that's ok. Keeps things interesting.

Sexual dynamics are always going to be a ripe topic for hoeing around in ... and talking about too.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Deejo said:


> And you may be shocked to find out that on this, you and I also agree. Wonders never cease, eh?
> 
> My view is a bit more tempered now but is there just the same. I posted as much a very long time ago on this forum ... and it's a black horse for me, not a white one.


Horse color doesn't matter. As long as you go all Old Spice on us, we're good.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

"Hello Ladies, how are you? Fabulous ..."


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## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

Deejo said:


> "Hello Ladies, how are you? Fabulous ..."


he can get away with it


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Deejo said:


> "Hello Ladies, how are you? Fabulous ..."


Screw the talking! I was referring to the diamonds dripping from his hand. :rofl:


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

Life experience I think has led to the whole "learning the man crap" HAHA I still have fantasies, but I don't let the fantasy become an escape nor do hold real men to those I make up in my head. And actually, I would love not to have to do it either, but when it has to be done and you are the only one there, well you figure it out HAHA And ok, so I DO like being able to make a better fire than the men HAHAHA You know I do too LMAO



Trenton said:


> I'm actually very, very fond of the knight in shining armor as well. Old Wood over there and I have always somewhat disagreed on this. I enjoy being spoiled and really don't have any desire how to learn "man things". The traditional dance between men and woman works for me except I do want to be valued and respected and I think that was/is sometimes lacking. It's not that I can't do it on my own, it's that I don't want to.


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## Draguna (Jan 13, 2011)

Damn you Deejo, I wanted to say that. And woodstock, your understanding of the average man is astounding. Really. Would think that you are MEM or Ian who created another account 

Either way, I can anyone write one for women? I havent zeen one woman who is the same as another. For example, any time I'm not in the mood, my girl thinks there is something wrong. Happens rarely, but for example, if she has been ill and I've taken care of her, I can't just switch I to perv mode easily. So by the time she is almost healed, she will want it and I'd be in care mode. Also, if it were up to her, we would never have foreplay again. She just wants to get at it and enjoy the **** out of me. I'm more of the caress type of person. Happy middleground: short foreplay (10 min) followed by uh... You know. 

But you are right about not feeling loved by sex. I told her once that I could not do it without love. She said oh... I could. We were both amazed at eachother. But yeah, most of our emotional needs stuff is swapped if you would take normal gender roles. 

Only the deeper stuff such as the need for sex by me, her need for love outside the bedroom and security and a few other things are normal. The rest is swapped for us.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

I am not saying there is no individuality, but rather that the individual grows out of the general... the core and basis will still reflect basic differences... as for the caring when sick... perhaps she is just in a hurry to thank you and women DO know that men enjoy sex, and when we want to REALLY give you something, that's a good one, plus it gives us the added physical pleasure we enjoy, at least if it is done right HAHA

Even though you see things as swapped, I think if it was peeled down, it would come out of certain generalizations. If you ever took ethics, I am sure you studied the male/female perspectives... What that tells you is that regardless of the ends... the means are very different as are the reasons for attempting the means...

Ask men and women the age old question of whether it is OK for a man to break into a pharmacy to steak medicine for his child and though both may come up with the same answer, the differences lie in the explanation of that answer.... More often than not, men will resemble other men in their answer, and women women....

Taking it a step further, I have thoughts that will conflict these to a degree if you add in the debate over social changes in gender roles and how that affects the perspective (IE the woman who breaks the glass ceiling and the man who plays Mr MOM.... but I am still looking at both the evidence and the emerging science on that one)

And ya..... I know... I over analyze, but it serves me in the end when I am seeking to understand the opposite sex, or at least it gives me a decent starting point HAHA I pay VERY close attention to detail (sometimes missing the obvious LMAO)


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## sinnister (Dec 5, 2010)

All I know is that it's a two way street. If men should realize that they need to provide love in the way their wife needs it, then shouldn't the wife have to do the same? And why does the man have to make that first move? To get the love that she requires, why can't a woman change the way she thinks about it? Why does the man have to?


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## woodstock (Feb 21, 2011)

I never said anything about man having to go first (don't even look for it, I just do, I think most women DO if you look at it, we can't help ourselves HAHA) I agree totally it's a two way street which is why it is so important for either side to understand how the other sees things so you CAN give what is needed. We tend to give what WE think is wanted as opposed to what the other actually DOES want.... Hence why I talk so much about the differences and how important they are to recognize. It's first step... from there, understanding the individual is easier, from both ways 



sinnister said:


> All I know is that it's a two way street. If men should realize that they need to provide love in the way their wife needs it, then shouldn't the wife have to do the same? And why does the man have to make that first move? To get the love that she requires, why can't a woman change the way she thinks about it? Why does the man have to?


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