# How do I get past this?



## TonyMontanta (Nov 17, 2020)

First off let me start by apologizing if this post seems really long but I feel like I have to explain a lot for you to understand where I am at now in my marriage. I have been married to my wife for 10 years now. We have 2 kids, a home, and many financial ties. For most of those ten years I thought it was a happy marriage. Our dating phase went great but when she moved in we fought a lot and even broke up once and she moved out. It didnt last long and in a week she had moved back in. We had problems living with each other because we are so different. She was always a outgoing person who loves to have a big group of friends, go out and drink and party. I am more of a small group of friends who like to stay in, play video games and I dont drink at all.

Well we managed to stay together for the next 8 years because my wife changed her personality to completely match mine. I can admit now that I was very selfish and did not see that I was holding my wife back from doing the things she loved to do because I would either not go with her or if I did go she said I made things miserable because I looked so unhappy. Eventually she started to just do more and more things without me and even then I did not really notice how unhappy she was.

About two years ago she started getting really distant. We barely did anything together and she started going out multiple times a week and staying the night at friends houses everytime she went out. During this time she had a male friend that she was very close to even before this started happening. I know him and he had been around a lot before this because he is also the godfather to our two kids. I started noticing that they would text or talk a lot. It was to the point where it seemed like it was all day long. There would be times we would be out to dinner with the kids and I could tell she was texting him the whole time. There were times we would be in bed together and I could see the name on her phone and they would text until she fell alseep and then start again in the morning. Of course I asked her about this and she said he was just a friend. We would get into fights about because I got to the point that when I saw her texting him I would blow up and accuse her of cheating.

Finally I got to the point where I just wanted to know the truth so I put a tracker in her car. I already know what I did was wrong and I have admitted that and apologized for it. While I never did see her car stay the night at his house there was several times that she went there before and after going out when she told me she was going with her girlfriends. When all this came out and I confronted her with it she said she would pick him up then go out and then take him home afterwards. To speed things up we finally had a converstaion where she told me that for the last two years she had lost her connection with me. She told me that she still loved me and wanted to make our marriage work but that she was "not in love" with me. She explained all the things that I did in the past and how it made her feel like a shell of former self and that she wanted to be able to go out and spend time with her friends because that is what she had been missing all these years. I was fine with that but everytime I told her I felt like something was going on between her and him she denied it.

Finally again I was fed up and when I was supposed to be leaving the house I doubled back and hid outside the bedroom door and overheard their conversation. She made comments like there was a bruise on her thigh that he put there and how her pillow smells like his house. After hearing all I needed to hear I came in and confronted her. At first she still tried to deny anything happened but then she finally said they slept together. She said she had started having real feelings for him about six months ago and did not know how to deal with them. She said that she knew what she did was horrible and that it being our kids godfather made it even more horrible. She apologized a lot and said she still wanted to work on our marriage but she still had these feelings for him and she doesnt know what to do. She said they grew closer because he was exactly like her. They both are outgoing and like to party and drink. Basically the opposite of me.

Now this was about 4 weeks ago when that happened. Well a week later when we were talking about it she told me that she never had sex with him and that she lied so that I wouldnt leave her that night because I was in the middle of packing my suitcase. I know this may sound wierd but we have had converstaions about infidelity in the past and we both said that we thought we could forgive the other person for a physical affair because we could chalk it up to a mistake that would never happen again but that if either one of us had a emotional affair that it would be over. Its hard for me to trust her now but I did say that to her so maybe it could be true that she only said that in the hopes that I would stay. To explain everything she said that they are very close, he has told her he loves her and would marry her. She said that the bruise came from a time they were playing around she bumbed her leg on a table falling to the floor. She said the pillow was in her trunk from when she sleeps at her girlfriends house and she has taken it inside his house sometimes when they watch movies. She says she has never spent the night there.

I did stay and there is an uneasy tension between us but we dont talk much about what happened because we both agreed to see a marriage counselor and that is starting soon. Where I need help at is how do I ever get past this when he is the godfather. I know there will come a time when I will have to be in the same room with him. I could demand that he never see our kids again but that would just hurt them and they would never understand because they love him. Whats worse is that she has said she does not want to cut him out of her life completely either. She has said that they barely talk anymore and that in just these few weeks she hasnt had the feelings of missing him and wanting to see him as much as she used to. She has said that she has started to feel a little closer to me now that everything is out in the open and that she genuinely misses me and wants to be with me more often. I can say I have seen a change in her behavior toward me and she actually started saying she loved me again which we havent said to each other in months.

I am still just so confused. I dont know what to believe right now and I cant stop thinking about it. I dont sleep, I barely eat and I am sad all the time. I am just trying to make it to when we see the marriage counselor and hope that she can help me. Right now I am just looking for anyones thoughts and ideas on what might help me get through this time.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

First thing you do is tell your “buddy” to stay away from you and your family. If your wife can’t accept this then your marriage is over. Counselling is a waste of time and money if the affair is still going on and it is an affair despite your wife’s protestations. She’s had enough time to get her story straight with her boyfriend and now she’s lying through her teeth.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

Whoa... Cole break that story up into paragraphs please. It's like Mirkwood Forest.


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## TonyMontanta (Nov 17, 2020)

bandit.45 said:


> Whoa... Cole break that story up into paragraphs please. It's like Mirkwood Forest.


Sorry, this is the first time I have talked about the whole thing and I just found myself typing for what seemed like forever. I broke it up to make it an easier read. 
Thank you


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

Your wife's affair is not your fault. Yes, you have faults - we all do - but you could have been the worst husband in the world and it still wouldn't give her a reason to cheat. That choice is 100% on her and there are other choices she could have made if she was so unhappy. She chose this, not you, so stop making excuses for her.

You also need to stop apologizing for her being a cheater! This:_ "I already know what I did was wrong and I have admitted that and apologized for it." _Heck no. She was cheating, you saw the red flags, and you looked into it. That wouldn't have been necessary if she would have been faithful. Do not apologize for her being a cheater or for not burying your head in the sand.

And honestly, she sounds very immature if she's still that into partying and drinking. I grew out of that phase in my early 20's. I have plenty of friends who are still in that phase and guess what? They are all a bunch of immature cheaters. It's time for her to grow up. And again, _she _chose to date and marry you even though you're polar opposites. _She _chose to "lose herself".

Your wife had _at minimum _an emotional affair (EA) with her "friend", and from the sounds of it, it was a physical affair (PA) as well. You said she became distant two years ago, that's most likely when the affair started. There is no way that guy hung around for two years without getting any. He probably wouldn't marry her either, that was all talk so he could get a little something in return.

She needs to write out a full timeline of the affair, with as many or as little detail as YOU want - not what she deems important. Tell her she gets one shot to come clean, any lies and she'll get divorce papers. But you have to be prepared to follow through with that.

Please don't be so naive. That bruise did not come from roughing around, well, maybe it did but not in the way she's claiming. When she goes to a movie theater, does she pack her pillow? No? Then don't believe for a second that she only took her pillow inside to watch a movie. That's a load of BS.

As for the other man (OM) being the godfather, not anymore he isn't! That needs to be put to an end, _immediately_. Is that really the type of man you want to be the godfather to your children? A man who will cheat and most likely **** your wife? A man who encourages infedelity? A man who wants to break up his godchildren's family?! Hell no.

This man needs to be _completely_ cut out of your life. If your wife is unwilling to do that, then it proves she isn't over him and really doesn't care about you or your pain. In that case, you need to be unwilling to stay married to her. He needs to be totally cut out. Your wife can no longer have any contact with him, you should not have to put up with having him in your life, and he is NOT a good role model for your kids.

It doesn't matter if it will hurt your kids. The OM needs to go. If you knew someone was unsafe to be around your children, would you allow it just so the kids wouldn't get sad? This man is a terrible role model for your kids. Being around him is not fair to you and healing will be a hell of a lot harder if you have to keep seeing him around like that. I have to regularly see and talk to a man my wife cheated with because they have a child together and it ****ing sucks. You don't want to do that. Your kids will get over it.

And honestly, telling them WHY the OM is no longer around is okay as well. There are age-appropriate ways to talk to children about infidelity, and yes, they do need to know otherwise they will make up their own reasons why the OM is no longer around and why mommy and daddy are fighting. Those reasons are usually along the lines of the kids thinking it's their fault, they were naughty, someone doesn't love them, etc.

You and your wife both need individual counseling right now, NOT marriage counseling. Your wife needs to get to the bottom of why she allowed herself to cheat and destroy your family. Without doing that, there is a good chance it will happen again. She needs to fix those issues, not ignore them and say it will never happen again. She needs to get to the root cause and fix it. Marriage counseling comes later.

You need counseling as well. Infidelity is traumatic and it needs to be properly processed and dealt with. The way you are feeling is totally normal and it does get better but honestly, not anytime soon. Healing from infidelity takes 2-5 years... You don't ever really get over it, it's more like learning to live with it. For now, make sure you are taking care of yourself. Get out for walks, make sure you're eating at least a little bit, try to focus on things you like to do.

You should both read this book: "How to Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair" by Linda MacDonald It will show you what your wife should be doing, and show your wife what to do. If she's unwilling to do that, well, that tells you all you need to know about reconciling with her. She should be bending over backwards right now.


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## QuietRiot (Sep 10, 2020)

Main point of the story here... you are confused and want to save the relationship with a woman who wants to party, wrestle her best boyfriend in living rooms, spends all her time at the bars HAPPILY, and says... HEY! That’s just me being me! This is who I am! 

But she will throw you a bone and make a HUGE sacrifice of not being “too close” to this guy anymore...You should really still trust her to go party and bar hop and stay with her friends all night though still, cus that’s just her personality? Oh and the best part, she said she banged him to “save the marriage”.... and you actually understand this argument. I’m actually scratching my head right now.

Please clarify if I am misunderstanding this situation...


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

You have been played as the chump all along. She’s a party girl and a player and she played you. 

DNA test the kids because there is a real chance this “godfather” is actually their bio dad. 

Sometimes people change and turn into people we don’t recognize any more.

She never was who or what you thought she was.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

I'm going to set aside everything about this other man since it is entirely possible he is just her friend, and just say that you two were never a match. You can love someone and not be a good fit to live together. You don't like to do anything and she needs to be social and go do things. Most people do. Let her go. Forget about the other guy. I've had plenty of men who were just friends. You two just aren't a good match.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

DownByTheRiver said:


> It is entirely possible he is just her friend ... I've had plenty of men who were just friends.


Do you text them all day long, from the moment you wake up until you fall asleep? While on dates or out with your family? Do you lie about your whereabouts to see them? Take your pillow to their house? Do they tell you they'd marry you? Come on...


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## Broken at 20 (Sep 25, 2012)

oldshirt said:


> You have been played as the chump all along. She’s a party girl and a player and she played you.
> 
> *DNA test the kids because there is a real chance this “godfather” is actually their bio dad.*
> 
> ...


I would hold off on the DNA test for a couple reasons: 

Firstly, ask a lawyer. It's possible that you're still on the hook for child-support. So even if you're not the father, you could be paying. Additionally, I wonder if it could impact custody in family courts? 

Secondly, this is something you can NEVER unlearn. Something you can never forget. Have a very frank conversation with yourself. Do you want to know, or not? 

I am not saying one is better than the other. Just want to make sure you know all the details before making a decision.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Andy1001 said:


> She’s had enough time to get her story straight with her boyfriend and now she’s lying through her teeth.


I’d say she’s had over 10 years to work on her game plan and cover stories.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

It was before cellphones. We worked in the same place up the street and I lived nearby. They often came home with me for lunch and if there wasn't a gig, hung out at my apartment until all hours. I didn't lie to anyone and whoever I was dating knew I had male friends and sometimes they knew them as we were all in one big circle, and never had any kickback from them because they weren't insecure men who would have trouble finding women. 

This one never likes to leave the house or do anything, and he managed to get a woman over there, but he knows full well if she goes, he'll be doing without for some time to come because no one is going to just come over there and beam into his lap and be satisfied with his lifestyle.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I'm going to set aside everything about this other man since it is entirely possible he is just her friend



Did you really just say that????? Really???


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## TonyMontanta (Nov 17, 2020)

bobert said:


> Your wife's affair is not your fault. Yes, you have faults - we all do - but you could have been the worst husband in the world and it still wouldn't give her a reason to cheat. That choice is 100% on her and there are other choices she could have made if she was so unhappy. She chose this, not you, so stop making excuses for her.
> 
> You also need to stop apologizing for her being a cheater! This:_ "I already know what I did was wrong and I have admitted that and apologized for it." _Heck no. She was cheating, you saw the red flags, and you looked into it. That wouldn't have been necessary if she would have been faithful. Do not apologize for her being a cheater or for not burying your head in the sand.
> 
> ...


Thank you for your comments. This is the way i have been feeling, just hard to accept that our marriage is probably over. Do you think things could change if she agreed to explain the timeline and cut him out completely. I do agree with cutting the OM out completely but I would not talk to the kids about it yet. They are 8 and 5, not sure how well they could handle it.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

He has no proof. She's starved for socializing and he won't do anything with her. She doesn't have to just sit around doing nothing and talking to no one just because that's what HE does.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> He has no proof. She's starved for socializing and he won't do anything with her. She doesn't have to just sit around doing nothing and talking to no one just because that's what HE does.


So what qualifies as proof then if spending countless nights out in the town with guy, taking her pillow to his his house, him saying he will marry her, her having bruises from him on her legs, her CONFESSING to having sex with him and her refusing to break up with him does not qualify as proof?? 

Does he need to have a Notary Public video the encounter and then have the FBI extract semen from her vagina and do a full DNA analysis to match it to the OM before we can say that we have proof?


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

Coletrickle said:


> Do you think things could change if she agreed to explain the timeline and cut him out completely.


You wouldn't all of a sudden feel better but it could make her more of a candidate for reconciliation. But she still has to be ready and willing to do the rest of the work, so do you. Couples can recover from infidelity but it's not easy, at all. She could do everything right and it still might not be enough. Or you could still decide to leave her, whether that's now, in a year, or in 10 years. 



> I do agree with cutting the OM out completely but I would not talk to the kids about it yet. They are 8 and 5, not sure how well they could handle it.


It's definitely not a conversation you should rush into, and it should never be for revenge or to turn the kids against your wife. There are age appropriate ways to talk to the kids though. My kids were in that age range when I talked to them about my wife's infidelity. 

Some people will say you shouldn't tell the kids but professionals disagree with that. If the parents are fighting all the time, divorcing, or someone is cut out of their life, they need to understand why. Again, when the time is right.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Coletrickle said:


> Thank you for your comments. This is the way i have been feeling, just hard to accept that our marriage is probably over. Do you think things could change if she agreed to explain the timeline and cut him out completely. I do agree with cutting the OM out completely but I would not talk to the kids about it yet. They are 8 and 5, not sure how well they could handle it.


The problem here is basic compatibility. She will still be her and you will still be you. 

Are you each going to change your basic persona and being? 

Sure she could cut if off with him, butt does that mean that she’s going to want to sit around at home evening the peace and quiet?

Are you going to transform into a party animal and Big Man On Campus? 

Those are the extremes, but will you be able to meet in the middle to where each of you is content and satisfied with your lives or in order to meet each other halfway, will you each be miserable?


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Coletrickle said:


> Thank you for your comments. This is the way i have been feeling, just hard to accept that our marriage is probably over. Do you think things could change if she agreed to explain the timeline and cut him out completely. I do agree with cutting the OM out completely but I would not talk to the kids about it yet. They are 8 and 5, not sure how well they could handle it.


That's not even a discussion. If you think there's any room for this guy in her life, while being married to you, you'd better start working on the post you'll be writing six months from now where you tell us that you were so wrong to think she could continue to talk or see this guy because it turns out they've been continuing behind your back etc.

YOU need to take control, not her. When she's gone, pack her bags, put them by the front door, and tell her that her choices don't work, the only thing that keeps her in the house, maybe keeps the marriage intact, are YOUR demands. Primary being no contact, in person, on phone, no way, no how, with OM. Nor is he the god parent anymore. He gave that up when he (OM), by his choice, chose to disrespect your family.

I can't see her coming around to this. You've really got to watch for any wiggle-room she tries to find. You can't cave to anything she says "But that's unreasonable, what about...".


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

oldshirt said:


> So what qualifies as proof then if spending countless nights out in the town with guy, taking her pillow to his his house, him saying he will marry her, her having bruises from him on her legs, her CONFESSING to having sex with him and her refusing to break up with him does not qualify as proof??
> 
> Does he need to have a Notary Public video the encounter and then have the FBI extract semen from her vagina and do a full DNA analysis to match it to the OM before we can say that we have proof?


My point is they're not right for each other anyway so they both need to cut bait. Women can be friends with men all day long and sometimes for years.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> My point is they're not right for each other anyway so they both need to cut bait. Women can be friends with men all day long and sometimes for years.


I agree on the incompatibility part.

But at some point women get drunk or lonely or insecure or mad at their BF/H or just needing some extra ego strokes or validation and they have sex with these “friends.”

Especially after spending years out on the town partying with them, having movie nights at their house, coming home with bruises between their legs and I’m especially inclined to believe that a woman has had sex with a “friend” when she tells her husband that she had sex with him. I guess I’m kinda quirky that way.

And let’s not forget that the wife told Cole that the OM has told her that he will marry her given the chance.

IMHO that is a lo-carb wedding proposal and men do not propose to women they ain’t banging.

Let’s at least be reasonable here.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Or want to bang. I've just been on all sides of this and I know some women can maintain friendships without banging a guy. I don't know if she did or not...

For example, I had a male friend who looked like a male model. He could have whatever woman he wanted, but he wasn't a player and he was picky and not taking advantage of his good looks. We went to lunch, we worked together, we confided in each other about our love interests, we went to concerts together. While dating other people, we went out of town to concerts together, just me and him, because we liked certain bands the other liked. We never so much as held hands. One trip, we stayed at my friend's house and I slept on the couch and he slept on the floor nearby. Nothing ever did happen. We maintained a friendship through other relationships, both of us. 

The friendship had to come to an end when he married one of my ex-serious boyfriend's second wife. She cheated on my ex-bf to be with him. It was a clusterf**k, obviously, so that was when we quit doing any hanging out or communicating. 

But yeah, nothing ever happened between us. We were just friends. 

It's not the bigger issue, though. Their issue is more fundamental.


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## bandit.45 (Feb 8, 2012)

You don't ask your kids permission to cut a cancer out of the marriage. Do what you need to do to get rid of this guy. The kids will get over it.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

She’s very likely been playing you for awhile but she apparently doesn’t want a divorce. The question is how much work is she willing to do to repair your marriage, if it can even be repaired (that’s always the big question), and (most important of all) if that’s what you really want. The OM has to immediately go, obviously. And it wouldn’t be wise to ever again trust her the way that you have until now. I hope things work out for you.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Women can maintain friendships without banging a guy. I don't know if she did or not...


Of course they can, but in THIS situation there are plenty of red flags _and_ she admitted to an EA and PA. Why are you so adamant that the red flags and her own admission are not conclusive enough?


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

But then she took it back and explained she said it just to keep him from leaving and why. I'm just saying we don't know. Where there's smoke, there's usually fire, but you can't always assume there is because some people don't operate on that level.

The bigger issue is she isn't getting what she needs out of this marriage and it's doomed, so he may as well pull the plug.


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## Thumos (Jul 21, 2020)

I have some good news and some bad news. I can’t break it up into “bad news first, good news next” because some of what appears to be “bad news” actually works out to be good news later.

so here’s just the news: you won’t get past this. Not gonna happen.

There is before and after. Your life has been radically altered without your consent. It won’t ever be the same. Illusions have been ripped away never to return.

This is big bad severe trauma and you’re about to enter a maelstrom of emotions that will take years to sort out. It will go more quickly for you if you go meet with an attorney right now, understand your rights and file for divorce quickly.

Healing will happen more quickly but you will always have scars.

you did nothing wrong with the gps tracker. Nothing to apologize for. Your wife is a Proverbs 30:20 woman who has torn down her house with her own hands.

a wife who caroused regularly and doesn’t come home isn’t all in on a true marriage. You’ve been in a one sided open marriage and accepted it. I’m sure there have been other men and ONS’s.

Rip the band aid off and next her. By staying and dithering and worrying about financial entanglements you’re doing the dreaded pick me dance. I’m one to talk but I plan on divorcing my WW in the New Year and that’a the fallout from a 3 mo affair. My WW wasn’t out carousing the nights away and sleeping over at another man’s house.

read the books No More Nice Guy, Cheating in a Nutshell, and the Way of the Superior Man so you can start deprogramming yourself.

her admission and retraction of sex is just good old fashioned gaslighting. Happens all the time.
Learn how to spot it.

Adultery is abuse. Don’t accept abuse.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> But then she took it back and explained she said it just to keep him from leaving and why.


Hmmm, let’s take a count here and see how many women have lied and told their partners they were not screwing somebody when in fact they were -

By my count there have been 4,296,173,289 women over the years that have lied about not screwing someone when they actually did.

Now let’s count the number of women who have lied to their partners and told them they had screwed someone else when in fact they had not - - - - 

Anyone??

Anyone?

Anyone?


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Well, he's the one who brought it up, so he must have given it some weight due to past conversations of theirs. I mean, they should divorce because she wants to have social interaction and he doesn't want to do anything. Maybe she thought she could have both there for awhile. 

Even if they divorce, she might go to this friend for awhile, but being as social as she is, she will be out meeting new people and seeing what's out there pretty much as soon as the pin drops.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Openminded said:


> She’s very likely been playing you for awhile but she apparently doesn’t want a divorce. The question is how much work is she willing to do to repair your marriage, if it can even be repaired (that’s always the big question), and (most important of all) if that’s what you really want. The OM has to immediately go, obviously. And it wouldn’t be wise to ever again trust her the way that you have until now. I hope things work out for you.


Why do we always say "how much work" the partner having the affair has to do, but stay in the marriage? The first thing that should come to mind is not work, but absolutes. As in, one must absolutely give up all contact with the AP. That's not "work." That's not something you go through years of therapy for. That's a thing you exclude from your life. Period. 

When you tell your partner about the "work" they have to do to repair the marriage, right up front, from their perspective that could sound like "OK, this is going to take me time to deal with." Baloney. The betrayed spouse is the one who needs time to deal, time to heal. The initial process does not require "work" on the part of the betraying spouse. It requires a very simple exclusion, an absolute exclusion, something for which there is no thinking about. Because if there is, if it becomes "work", then it isn't going to happen. 

Not from personal experience, but from what I've seen here, over and over and over again. From personal experience, I can believe it is very, very difficult for people to change their spots.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> explained she said it just to keep him from leaving and why


I didn't understand her reasons on this -- telling her husband she DID have sex with this other guy was supposed to keep him from LEAVING? Ummm, not in any normal world I know of.
Telling him they DID NOT would MAYBE have a chance that he wouldn't leave (even though he heard the discussion), but wouldn't saying they DID have sex surely drive him away?


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

I don't understand it either, but he put it out there like he gave it some weight due to some past conversation or even deal they had in the past.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

yeah, pretty weird though


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Casual Observer said:


> Why do we always say "how much work" the partner having the affair has to do, but stay in the marriage? The first thing that should come to mind is not work, but absolutes. As in, one must absolutely give up all contact with the AP. That's not "work." That's not something you go through years of therapy for. That's a thing you exclude from your life. Period.
> 
> When you tell your partner about the "work" they have to do to repair the marriage, right up front, from their perspective that could sound like "OK, this is going to take me time to deal with." Baloney. The betrayed spouse is the one who needs time to deal, time to heal. The initial process does not require "work" on the part of the betraying spouse. It requires a very simple exclusion, an absolute exclusion, something for which there is no thinking about. Because if there is, if it becomes "work", then it isn't going to happen.
> 
> Not from personal experience, but from what I've seen here, over and over and over again. From personal experience, I can believe it is very, very difficult for people to change their spots.


I say it because I lived it. Some people want to at least see if they can reconcile (I did the first time) and a great deal of work is necessary for that. Some people want to divorce immediately (I did the second time) and there’s nothing wrong with that. I tend not to support reconciliation — although I did live that life for a long time — but I don’t usually tell someone to divorce if they haven’t indicated they are considering it. My impression is that he wants to reconcile. If he doesn’t want that then I say move on and don’t look back. And my advice about the OM was that he had to immediately go — obviously.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Not sure you can come back from this OP, but if you decide to try to save the marriage, she must cut off the OM completely. No contact ever again. If she won't do that, there's no point in even trying.

Your children will get over it, they need you far more than they need him. He is a predator, a threat to their family. Cut him out.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

jlg07 said:


> I didn't understand her reasons on this -- telling her husband she DID have sex with this other guy was supposed to keep him from LEAVING? Ummm, not in any normal world I know of.
> Telling him they DID NOT would MAYBE have a chance that he wouldn't leave (even though he heard the discussion), but wouldn't saying they DID have sex surely drive him away?


The reason you don’t understand her rationale is because is poppycock and complete BS and everyone but the OP knows it. 

The reason he is buying it is because he is desperately grasping at any straws he can.


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## jsmart (Mar 14, 2015)

Tony, this POS has to be cut from your family’s life permanently if you want a chance a R. 

The question you need to ask yourself is, do you really want this woman, who for the last 2 years has openly been carrying on an affair in front of you? 

Also, I know that opposites can attract but your WW seems like an a very extroverted person who is not into being a family first wife. For her to be texting OM while out on an evening with the family seems really F’d up. She probably spends her days thinking nonstop of OM , being emotionally distant from not only you but even the kids.

You need to ask for a detailed timeline of the affair and have her read it to you. this for you to understand what your really forgiving and for her to face the horrible things she has done to her husband and father of her children.

Also make sure you expose to her family. Not in a “your daughter is a who..” but in a help me fight for the family. The more she has to face what she’s done the sooner she can get out of the fog she is in.

Right now she is probably in a let me appease him a little and then I can get back to my man. Yes that’s right. In her mind and heart, that POS is her man. You’re the provider and baby sitter . To change that will require bold action.

BTW: why haven’t you confronted POS yet?


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> I don't understand it either, but he put it out there like he gave it some weight due to some past conversation or even deal they had in the past.


The reason he put it out there is because he is desperately holding on to whatever thin shred of hope he can, no matter how ridiculous.


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## QuietRiot (Sep 10, 2020)

TonyMontanta said:


> Thank you for your comments. This is the way i have been feeling, just hard to accept that our marriage is probably over. Do you think things could change if she agreed to explain the timeline and cut him out completely. I do agree with cutting the OM out completely but I would not talk to the kids about it yet. They are 8 and 5, not sure how well they could handle it.


You poor guy. I understand your heart is broken, and you have no idea what to do or how to mend it. I’m sorry you have to feel this. 

Your lifestyles and goals and ideas on what a family looks like are incompatible. Believe me I can relate. It’s a tough, jagged pill to swallow. Yes, “things can change” but the people do not. And quite honestly, it benefits her to have you at home raising the children so she can party. Your personality benefits her life. What does her true personality do for yours?

I have young kids, I would never consider leaving them several times a week to party and not return home. Bedtime stories and kisses and songs and tucking them in is something I miss only for rare occasions. This is my lifestyle and no bar, no guy friend, no any friend is more joyful than those moments. Just saying. But I have a husband that was never here and had no issues living his best life without us. So I understand your predicament. Not judging you, but you can “patch” this up and kick the can down the road until you’re ready to deal... but one day you’ll be in my shoes, catching them in parking lots and sneaking off on their own vacations while leaving you with the kids.


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## QuietRiot (Sep 10, 2020)

oldshirt said:


> Hmmm, let’s take a count here and see how many women have lied and told their partners they were not screwing somebody when in fact they were -
> 
> By my count there have been 4,296,173,289 women over the years that have lied about not screwing someone when they actually did.
> 
> ...


_cricket...
....cricket..._


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

Casual Observer said:


> Why do we always say "how much work" the partner having the affair has to do, but stay in the marriage? The first thing that should come to mind is not work, but absolutes. As in, one must absolutely give up all contact with the AP. That's not "work." That's not something you go through years of therapy for. That's a thing you exclude from your life. Period.
> 
> When you tell your partner about the "work" they have to do to repair the marriage, right up front, from their perspective that could sound like "OK, this is going to take me time to deal with." Baloney. The betrayed spouse is the one who needs time to deal, time to heal. The initial process does not require "work" on the part of the betraying spouse. It requires a very simple exclusion, an absolute exclusion, something for which there is no thinking about. Because if there is, if it becomes "work", then it isn't going to happen.
> 
> Not from personal experience, but from what I've seen here, over and over and over again. From personal experience, I can believe it is very, very difficult for people to change their spots.


It can be difficult for some WS's to give up their AP, depending on how invested they are or the inner issues that led to infidelity. It can be work for them to not resort to old habits or coping mechanisms and run back to the AP. Yes they have to go NC but it's not always easy. Not saying that's right, it is what it is, and it certainly can take a lot of IC work to correct what led them to cheat.

So that is part of the work. But for me, when I think of "the work" required (from both the WS _and _BS), it's also things like all the individual and marriage counseling, the BS and WS dealing with things like mind movies as a couple and the initial fallout. That sort.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

jlg07 said:


> I didn't understand her reasons on this -- telling her husband she DID have sex with this other guy was supposed to keep him from LEAVING? Ummm, not in any normal world I know of.
> Telling him they DID NOT would MAYBE have a chance that he wouldn't leave (even though he heard the discussion), but wouldn't saying they DID have sex surely drive him away?


That was exactly my thought. If you tell your husband you have been cheating he may well leave. If you tell him you werent cheating why would he leave? 
She is clearly lying. No one admits to an affair if there isnt one. OP I am afraid she is taking you for a fool and lying about it as well. As well as that you are blaming yourself, as well as that she is still acting like a teenager still wanting to go out drinking and partying when she is a married woman with 2 children. She needs to grow up and she also needs to come clean about what happened. Set up a lie detector test, you may well get a confession before it. How can you possibly decide what you want when she is still lying to you? 
At the absolutely minimum you must cut him out of your lives.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Openminded said:


> I say it because I lived it. Some people want to at least see if they can reconcile (I did the first time) and a great deal of work is necessary for that. Some people want to divorce immediately (I did the second time) and there’s nothing wrong with that. I tend not to support reconciliation — although I did live that life for a long time — but I don’t usually tell someone to divorce if they haven’t indicated they are considering it. My impression is that he wants to reconcile. If he doesn’t want that then I say move on and don’t look back. And my advice about the OM was that he had to immediately go — obviously.


Maybe you misunderstood me. You lived the side of the betrayed spouse though. I'm saying the spouse having the affair shouldn't get the opportunity to believe they could "work" towards getting rid of their AP, towards no-contact. 

For you, the betrayed spouse, of course it's work. OMG it's got to be the worst thing you could go through. I would never minimize what you have to do, your choices, their impact. That's all "work" that the betraying spouse has placed upon you. The betraying spouse has it relatively easy, in my opinion, because they don't get to fret about it. They have to make a choice, right then, and there's no slack to be cut. It's not work; it's a second-strike and you're out. The first strike was the affair. 

The betraying spouse's "work" starts after the no-contact edict. From that point on, they have to regain trust and help their spouse cope with their loss.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

jlg07 said:


> I didn't understand her reasons on this -- telling her husband she DID have sex with this other guy was supposed to keep him from LEAVING? Ummm, not in any normal world I know of.
> Telling him they DID NOT would MAYBE have a chance that he wouldn't leave (even though he heard the discussion), but wouldn't saying they DID have sex surely drive him away?


If at first you don't succeed, obfuscate further. Give him something different to think about.


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## TonyMontanta (Nov 17, 2020)

oldshirt said:


> The problem here is basic compatibility. She will still be her and you will still be you.
> 
> Are you each going to change your basic persona and being?
> 
> ...


W


jlg07 said:


> I didn't understand her reasons on this -- telling her husband she DID have sex with this other guy was supposed to keep him from LEAVING? Ummm, not in any normal world I know of.
> Telling him they DID NOT would MAYBE have a chance that he wouldn't leave (even though he heard the discussion), but wouldn't saying they DID have sex surely drive him away?


This came from random conversations we have had in the past where we said people can forgive a physical affair because it can be a one time thing or a person was too drunk or whatever. A person can apologize and then never do it again but when it came to a emotional affair then the heart had moved on to another person and that would be the end. She said she knows she doesnt love him but he is fun to be around because he is like her and they just have fun. Im not saying its right what she said, its actually reall f***ed up and that week was hell. I dont think it was right but i can only tell you why she said she did it.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

What I find particularly confusing with this situation is why she is still in the marital home and has not already left? 

I think the real questions we need to be probing is why is she still there and seeming to consider staying?

She seems to have more basic lifestyle compatibility and fun with the OM. She has admitted being sexually active with OM. Has stated she can’t/won’t cut off contact with OM and has stated OM has said he would marry her.

- so why is she still there?

Is OM chronically unemployed and living in his mom’s basement? Is he currently married to someone else?

Is Tony a lot better off financially than the OM? 

Does she prefer to stay in the marital home because she has a built in babysitter while she goes out and has sex with other men? Is he actually supporting her affairs and partying to the point she gets more party time and more “richard “ with him than without him? 

I think her motives for staying need to be examined more closely and see if those reasons are valid or even in Toney’s better interests or not. 

Her reasons for staying at this point may not actually be in his best interests. 

Me suspects he may simply be making this too easy for her. A lot of these severely beta men do this. They roll out the red carpet to accommodate these WWs and try to provide more servitude to them so that the WW basically won’t leave until her nest is perfectly feathered with the OM. 

Then she calls the movers on Friday and is all moved into the OM’s on Saturday. I’ve personally seen this a couple different times in real life. 

In the mean time the BH is still talking about how to “work things out” and how to accommodate and service her better for the “Pick Me! Dance.”


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## QuietRiot (Sep 10, 2020)

TonyMontanta said:


> W
> 
> This came from random conversations we have had in the past where we said people can forgive a physical affair because it can be a one time thing or a person was too drunk or whatever. A person can apologize and then never do it again but when it came to a emotional affair then the heart had moved on to another person and that would be the end. She said she knows she doesnt love him but he is fun to be around because he is like her and they just have fun. Im not saying its right what she said, its actually reall f***ed up and that week was hell. I dont think it was right but i can only tell you why she said she did it.


I hate to split hairs, but it just doesn’t make sense that if she is going to LIE, she would better serve herself and the chance at saving the marriage by lying and saying “Absolutely nothing happened. Nothing to see here. We are juuuuuust friends.” But she chose to “lie” and say “I banged him”. It just doesn’t make sense in any context and to the rest of us reading this, is a confession of truth that she regretted later.... but regardless of that one thing, she at minimum had an EA, wasn’t that your dealbreaker?
Here it is, if you want the truth, you’ll need a polygraph. If she in fact has nothing to hide she will take it. If she is remorseful and truly wants to reconcile with you, she will take it. If she wants to string you along and gaslight you, lie to you and go back to status quo... she will tell you it’s an invasion of privacy, how dare you, she is offended that you’d ask, blah blah blah. So why not put that out there as terms of reconciliation and see what she says? You will have your answer either way I think.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

oldshirt said:


> What I find particularly confusing with this situation is why she is still in the marital home and has not already left?
> 
> I think the real questions we need to be probing is why is she still there and seeming to consider staying?
> 
> ...


As usual, I got too wordy and distracted in my own mind. 


What I’m getting at here is many of these party girl/WWs try to smooth over their BHs because the BHs are so accommodating and supplicating they are actually able to screw around with more guys and party MORE in the marital home than they would as a single mother on their own. 

Her rationale for trying to schmooze him over and saying she wants to stay is because he babysits while she screws around and he gives her enough financial support that she can party more and screw more guys as a cheating wife than she would on her own as a single mother on her own with at minimum of 50/50 custody. 

Her reasons for trying to stay may be more nefarious rather than virtuous.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Oh, well, except that's not going to be the case. If she divorces him, gives him joint custody, as she should and is the norm at least in the US, she will have no kids for 3 1/2 days a week and can do whatever she wants.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

Sorry you are here @TonyMontanta but your wife had an affair and she did sleep with the guy. What she is telling you is only the tip of the iceberg. You do not have to make decisions right now but should at least do the following so that you can get your head straight to make decisions

1. Start doing the 180 on her, talk about nothing except the kids. Request a full accounting of all she has done.
2. tell her no contact with OM. Ask her to write out a timeline of the affair and all the meetings, sleeping, cheating all of it. Tell her if she lies (and you will find out) it will be over, no second chances. Make her write a 'no contact' letter also.
She also needs to do a polygraph after you have her timeline. Give her a deadline
3. Tell all family and friends about what she has done
4. Ensure OM's wife, gf and family knows that this man has blown up your family (remember the quicker you shame them both the faster the affair dies). This is not to get your wife back but to remove the dross and be able to see clearly.
5. Seek a lawyer and see what your options are with regard to child support, alimony etc.
6. Go see a counsellor or therapist for yourself to work through your emotions and thoughts which are currently all over the place, you need to reach an equilibrium so you can make clear decisions. You also need to find out how you contributed to the problems in the marriage. Her infidelity is not your fault, she made her own choice to do this.
7. You must get STD tested and so must she.
8. No sleeping with her at all. Be careful of hysterical bonding sex. Cut it all out.
9. Spend lots of time doing things with your kids, without her.
10. Once you sort yourself out, you will be much clearer as to whether you want to try and save this marriage or leave.
In your answers you appear to be very passive, almost afraid to lose her. You need to take charge of this situation. Listen to many of the men on here who took charge in their situations (some reconciled some did not). Remember show her you are willing to lose her and let her go. In fact you may have to as she will probably do it again.


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## Thumos (Jul 21, 2020)

frusdil said:


> He is a predator, a threat to their family.


There’s a trope wayward wives use that I call “little lost girl in the woods” - the AP is not a predator. Women aren’t little lost girls in the woods being preyed on by wolves. Women like sex as much as men. If they had it with another man chances are they wanted it and sought it out. This is about her choices and actions, not the other man.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

TonyMontanta said:


> W
> 
> This came from random conversations we have had in the past where we said people can forgive a physical affair because it can be a one time thing or a person was too drunk or whatever. A person can apologize and then never do it again but when it came to a emotional affair then the heart had moved on to another person and that would be the end. She said she knows she doesnt love him but he is fun to be around because he is like her and they just have fun. Im not saying its right what she said, its actually reall f***ed up and that week was hell. I dont think it was right but i can only tell you why she said she did it.


You really don’t see that your wife is in love with him. He is in love with your wife and he is your kids godfather?!?!?! WTF!!!! Bad choice for a person that is supposed to help guide your kids.

Your wife is in the middle of a emotional affair, wake the fk up!

Your wife is having sex with this guy, wake the fk up.

It has to be no contact with this guy.

He needs to be kept away from your kids.

You wife is cheating on you. This is not your fault.

She should have come to you two years ago and had the conversation that the two of you had.

Instead of doing this, she checks out of the marriage and starts fking your kids godfather. Great ****ing guy and you want him around your kids?!?!?!

You need to get off your it’s my fault ride and pull your head out of the sand.

STOP THE PICK ME DANCE!

Wives lose all respect for a husband that is doing what you are doing.

Read No More Mr Nice Guy.

She needs to read No Just Friends.

See is lying and she is in a full blown affair.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

TonyMontanta said:


> W
> 
> This came from random conversations we have had in the past where we said people can forgive a physical affair because it can be a one time thing or a person was too drunk or whatever. A person can apologize and then never do it again but when it came to a emotional affair then the heart had moved on to another person and that would be the end. She said she knows she doesnt love him but he is fun to be around because he is like her and they just have fun. Im not saying its right what she said, its actually reall f***ed up and that week was hell. I dont think it was right but i can only tell you why she said she did it.


But above and beyond the PA, you KNOW she was having an EA already? Why would admitting to a PA WHILE YOU KNOW she had a PA make you stay? She doesn't want to stop contact with him -- that already tells you it was a PA no matter WHAT she says.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

TonyMontanta said:


> First off let me start by apologizing if this post seems really long but I feel like I have to explain a lot for you to understand where I am at now in my marriage. I have been married to my wife for 10 years now. We have 2 kids, a home, and many financial ties. For most of those ten years I thought it was a happy marriage. Our dating phase went great but when she moved in we fought a lot and even broke up once and she moved out. It didnt last long and in a week she had moved back in. We had problems living with each other because we are so different. She was always a outgoing person who loves to have a big group of friends, go out and drink and party. I am more of a small group of friends who like to stay in, play video games and I dont drink at all.
> Well we managed to stay together for the next 8 years because my wife changed her personality to completely match mine. I can admit now that I was very selfish and did not see that I was holding my wife back from doing the things she loved to do because I would either not go with her or if I did go she said I made things miserable because I looked so unhappy. Eventually she started to just do more and more things without me and even then I did not really notice how unhappy she was.
> About two years ago she started getting really distant. We barely did anything together and she started going out multiple times a week and staying the night at friends houses everytime she went out. During this time she had a male friend that she was very close to even before this started happening. I know him and he had been around a lot before this because he is also the godfather to our two kids. I started noticing that they would text or talk a lot. It was to the point where it seemed like it was all day long. There would be times we would be out to dinner with the kids and I could tell she was texting him the whole time. There were times we would be in bed together and I could see the name on her phone and they would text until she fell alseep and then start again in the morning. Of course I asked her about this and she said he was just a friend. We would get into fights about because I got to the point that when I saw her texting him I would blow up and accuse her of cheating.
> Finally I got to the point where I just wanted to know the truth so I put a tracker in her car. I already know what I did was wrong and I have admitted that and apologized for it. While I never did see her car stay the night at his house there was several times that she went there before and after going out when she told me she was going with her girlfriends. When all this came out and I confronted her with it she said she would pick him up then go out and then take him home afterwards. To speed things up we finally had a converstaion where she told me that for the last two years she had lost her connection with me. She told me that she still loved me and wanted to make our marriage work but that she was "not in love" with me. She explained all the things that I did in the past and how it made her feel like a shell of former self and that she wanted to be able to go out and spend time with her friends because that is what she had been missing all these years. I was fine with that but everytime I told her I felt like something was going on between her and him she denied it.
> ...


Polygraph


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Oh, well, except that's not going to be the case. If she divorces him, gives him joint custody, as she should and is the norm at least in the US, she will have no kids for 3 1/2 days a week and can do whatever she wants.


Right, but she can do what she wants 7 days a week now and he likely funding a lot of it.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

Thumos said:


> There’s a trope wayward wives use that I call “little lost girl in the woods” - the AP is not a predator. Women aren’t little lost girls in the woods being preyed on by wolves. Women like sex as much as men. If they had it with another man chances are they wanted it and sought it out. This is about her choices and actions, not the other man.


Correct.

This guy was INVITED into their lives and invited into her heart and her jay-jay.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

oldshirt said:


> Right, but she can do what she wants 7 days a week now and he likely funding a lot of it.


Did I miss something? Is he unemployed and home with the kids all the time?


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Thumos said:


> There’s a trope wayward wives use that I call “little lost girl in the woods” - the AP is not a predator. Women aren’t little lost girls in the woods being preyed on by wolves. Women like sex as much as men. If they had it with another man chances are they wanted it and sought it out. This is about her choices and actions, not the other man.


Oh yes - THIS!!! 
You should have heard my sister when she got caught in her multiple affairs and tried to blame HER HUSBAND (my BIL who my kids and I adore!) for not seeing that she was being tempted and stopping her...I don't think I've ever been SO ANGRY...it was sickening, and I still won't speak to her for being such a liar. 
DISGUSTING.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Dude everyone is being really nice here with you, so let me apologize up front because I won't be - YOU ARE NOT RIGHT - WAKE THE **** UP!

The real question you need to be asking is why do you want to get over this, if over this is living in a situation that makes you very unhappy and allows you to be abused like you have. You should want to get the hell out of this!

Let's not even go into your wife's difficult relationship with the truth.

So your wife a new mother had and affair (yeah it's an affrair and they slept together) because you expected her to act like a wife and mother and not go out partying like a single girl.

Dude I work with a few young mothers and on Monday's we will casually ask how our weekend went. You know how much they say they were out with their boyfriends who are not their husbands? Never. You know how often they say they were out with their husband's socializing, very rarely. You know what they say they did, kid stuff. When I say, you guys should go to this place or that, you know what they say. That's really hard with young kids. Which one doesn't belong here? Hint, it ain't you.

I am really curious what you did that was SO BAD except marry someone who is a terrible wife and mother. Then have the expectation that she wouldn't act like a single girl when she had two young kids.

So yes there is a problem, but the problem is that you are blaming yourself for your wife being terrible.

Your wife had an affair with your friend, and won't even dump him. (Put that on your phone as a reminder and have it go off once an hour to let it sink in.) Something is very wrong that you are posting on a message board how you can learn to live with this, like you are the one who is wrong here. You are in agonizing pain because trying to live with it is like sticking your hand in hot boiling water. You mind is telling you get the hell out! Listen to it!

NO ONE SHOULD LIVE LIKE THIS.

You have a long life ahead of you, you will have a better one with someone who is a grown adult, and who treats you with human decency and respect. Who doesn't lie to your face, make you try it figure out the truth, spit in it and then blame you for it. Your wife blames you for her abuse of you.

Finally and talk of you staying together is just SILLY because YOUR WIFE IS JUST GOING TO DO THIS AGAIN. It's her nature. She has no value in yours or anyone else live as a wife. She makes a great other women though.

Truth is I will bet money once you are truly done this women will SUDDENLY find her love for you and dump the guy. Because your wife is not a real person, she is a fraud who lives on drama and attention. You are her surrogate father figure. NO ONE can have a real relationship with someone like this. She is not the first but she is very typical.

Don't go to a marriage counselor. You don't have a marriage you are the surrogate father to asshole relationship. And whatever type of marriage you have has nothing to do with your issues. Once again, your only problem is her nature.

One more time - Your wife had an affair with your friend, and won't even dump him - and you are going to go to marriage counseling? Does this sound right to you?

Seek help to get the strength to get free of this mess. It's never going to get better if you stay. But I will promise you it will if you leave, and your kids will be better for it because your wife is just going to continue to follow this pattern. She doesn't even recognize she has a problem but blames you for her abuse of you.

Go read some articles about being marry to women narcissist and tell me they don't ring true, and not even in this situation particularity.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

LisaDiane said:


> Oh yes - THIS!!!
> You should have heard my sister when she got caught in her multiple affairs and tried to blame HER HUSBAND (my BIL who my kids and I adore!) for not seeing that she was being tempted and stopping her...I don't think I've ever been SO ANGRY...it was sickening, and I still won't speak to her for being such a liar.
> DISGUSTING.


To your credit.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Occasionally, over the years, I’ve noticed some male posters blaming the evil, bad men who preyed on their helpless little wives. Easier than blaming the person they chose to reconcile with, I guess. But instead try blaming the cheater you’re married to. I put 100% of the blame on my husband even though I knew his AP relentlessly chased him (he never said that she did but she wasn’t exactly subtle). It was totally up to him — the archetypal Mr. Nice Guy — to say no and respect our marriage and he didn’t. Same for all the helpless little wives out there. It’s complete bs that they were taken advantage of because they’re such innocent, fragile little things and just didn’t know what was going on until it was too late to stop it. They absolutely do know. They just hope that you don’t.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

You want to know the truth, call the guy and say - "hey she told me you had sex with her but I want to give you a chance to explain because of our history." Bet he doesn't protest but just apologizes.

Come on dude. What are you doing here? It's crazy you even have to go through this but if you have to that is the way.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Openminded said:


> Occasionally, over the years, I’ve noticed some male posters blaming the evil, bad men who preyed on their helpless little wives. Easier than blaming the person they chose to reconcile with, I guess. But instead try blaming the cheater you’re married to. I put 100% of the blame on my husband even though I knew his AP relentlessly chased him (he never said that she did but she wasn’t exactly subtle). It was totally up to him — the archetypal Mr. Nice Guy — to say no and respect our marriage and he didn’t. Same for all the helpless little wives out there. It’s complete bs that they were taken advantage of because they’re such innocent, fragile little things and just didn’t know what was going on until it was too late to stop it. They absolutely do know. They just hope that you don’t.


One could say it's just plain old male chauvinism.

The thing is the men who treat their wives like children almost always get cheated on. It's a pattern. It's an unhealthy dynamic even before the cheating. they become the surrogate father to these women, who want to rebel. They often just transfer from one set of parents to another.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Or want to bang. I've just been on all sides of this and I know some women can maintain friendships without banging a guy. I don't know if she did or not...


How many women do you know tell their husbands they did though? Why even bring this up given the circumstances. Obviously OP's example is way beyond this.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

DownByTheRiver said:


> The bigger issue is she isn't getting what she needs out of this marriage and it's doomed, so he may as well pull the plug.


She cheats (if we want to kid ourselves it only an emotional affair) and the issue is she is not getting what she needs out of the marriage? 

Really?

Talk about blaming the victim.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Openminded said:


> Occasionally, over the years, I’ve noticed some male posters blaming the evil, bad men who preyed on their helpless little wives. Easier than blaming the person they chose to reconcile with, I guess. But instead try blaming the cheater you’re married to. *I put 100% of the blame on my husband even though I knew his AP relentlessly chased him (he never said that she did but she wasn’t exactly subtle). It was totally up to him — the archetypal Mr. Nice Guy — to say no and respect our marriage and he didn’t.* Same for all the helpless little wives out there. It’s complete bs that they were taken advantage of because they’re such innocent, fragile little things and just didn’t know what was going on until it was too late to stop it. They absolutely do know. They just hope that you don’t.


SO TRUE!!!!
When I was in my early 20s, a family friend went after my first husband, literally stepping in front of me a few times to get his attention. It went on for weeks. Every time, I backed completely off, and let HIM deal with it. I was a little nervous about what could happen (him choosing her), but I was clear that if he wanted to do that, I'd let him go, and I'd move on too. I just wanted him to be happy - if he wanted her, he could have her...but not ME.

I was NEVER threatened by her interest, nor would I have blamed HER if he had taken her up on her "offer"...Lol! HE had the responsibility to ME...she didn't. She was nothing to me.

After nicely putting her off for a few weeks, and her not taking the hint, he finally forcefully told her to leave him alone, and she moved on.


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## Beach123 (Dec 6, 2017)

She sees you as a chump... because you’ve been a pushover!

she needs to be single. File for divorce.

there’s not one single reason she should need to spend the night anywhere after going out! And she shouldn’t need to go out like a single gal either! Why can’t she asks friends over to the house?

Your wife is a boldfaced cheater! Stop making it so easy for her to cheat on you!

she been having an affair right in front of you! Why are you acting so weak? If she won’t end her affair and never speak to him again then divorce her as soon as possible!
And stop believing it’s only been six months - if they have been texting that much for years - that’s how long the affair has been.

she’s been distant with YOU since she became more focused And invested in HIM! Don’t be her fool for one more second - make her move out now!

she’s had no consequences - so she has no reason to change a thing! Make sure and expose her cheating to all friends and family -SHE should be embarrassed!


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

LisaDiane said:


> After nicely putting her off for a few weeks, and her not taking the hint, he finally forcefully told her to leave him alone, and she moved on.


If only my husband had done that!


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

Triggering a little here. If you were half way outgoing instead of introverted this could mostly be my story.

The only way this marriage can be saved is if this "friend" is permanently cut from your lives. And let me tell you, that won't be easy. She's deeply connected to this man, to the point he is your kids' godfather. That's deep. Despite that, there is ZERO chance your marriage survives with him in it. Zero. 

If you really want to save it, and feel you can have a happy life 5-10 years from now with your wife, you have to demand him being 100% gone. AND, she'll have to agree to it.

In my case, my wife had a relapse with her OM and would communicate with him behind my back (but no visits). When I found that out I said, he's gone or I file. Make your decision now. I didn't care any more about the consequences. That's the stage you need to get to. If he is in your wife's life, they WILL end up falling in love, and/or have sex when they can. No cap. He goes or the marriage is over.


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## sideways (Apr 12, 2016)

Downbytheriver NOBODY put a pistol to this womans head and made her have kids. So she likes to socialize...ok fine. 

Socializing does NOT entail having sex with another man while being married!!!

Especially with a man who's the Godfather to your kids. 

This woman is not only a bad wife but she's a freaking HORRIBLE mother!!

What woman puts the safety of her kids family in jeopardy by having an affair with another man??

There are women (and men) who can go out from time to time (a break from the kids) and refrain from cheating on their spouse and blowing up their family.

This woman is selfish and has NO BUSINESS being a mother. She wants to socialize and party and cheat have at it but NOT as your wife. Kick this loser to the curb and focus on your kids and giving them a home they deserve. 

I'm sure your loser wife will be happy without the responsibilities of being a mother and that will open up her social schedule so she can stay out to the wee hours of the night and spread her legs for whoever.

Your kids deserve a parent who have their best interest at heart. A woman who's willing to blow up their world to cheat doesn't fit the bill.


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Openminded said:


> If only my husband had done that!


I would have been pissed she disrespected my wife in this way.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

It looks like someone had a name change. Whatever. Your wife and her boyfriend have been having a gay ol' time while you sat home and took care of the kids. May as well change your name to Chump. She ain't worth it. Divorce. Enough said.


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## LisaDiane (Jul 22, 2019)

Openminded said:


> If only my husband had done that!


Yeah, he never cheated on me...he did all the other bad things you can think of (at the end), but never cheated.


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## oldtruck (Feb 15, 2018)

Mandatory NC with the OM and written timeline and polygraph and
DNA paternity test. All done ASAP.


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## Thumos (Jul 21, 2020)

Have you insisted she get tested for STD’s and you as well? This will tell you a lot. If she balks and says she didn’t have sex with him then you can just say “then there should be no problem reassuring me with an STD test” (and you need to get one yourself regardless). Also a polygraph has been mentioned. Another great way to call her bluff. Again if she balks you can say “you should have no problem reassuring me you’re telling me the truth.” And still with all that, even if she didn’t have sex (which is extremely unlikely) she has been unfaithful to you.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

sokillme said:


> She cheats (if we want to kid ourselves it only an emotional affair) and the issue is she is not getting what she needs out of the marriage?
> 
> Really?
> 
> Talk about blaming the victim.


Oh, B S. I said and most people agreed that these two are not right for each other. I never said either of them were wrong for being how they are. But someone who wants to socialize and do things isn't going to be happy with someone who only wants to stay home and play games. And he's obviously not happy that she wants to go out and socialize. They're just not right for each other and they need to face it and get out.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Oh, B S. I said and most people agreed that these two are not right for each other. I never said either of them were wrong for being how they are. But someone who wants to socialize and do things isn't going to be happy with someone who only wants to stay home and play games. And he's obviously not happy that she wants to go out and socialize. They're just not right for each other and they need to face it and get out.


Right, the car has a flat tire, and you talk about the gas mileage it gets.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

sokillme said:


> Right, the car has a flat tire, and you talk about the gas mileage it gets.


Once again, B.S. If you can't get over someone having a differing opinion or one that isn't black and white, put me on ignore.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Once again, B.S. If you can't get over someone having a differing opinion or one that isn't black and white, put me on ignore.


If you can't handle people disagreeing with your opinion then maybe you shouldn't post it in a public forum.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

sokillme said:


> If you can't handle people disagreeing with your opinion then maybe you shouldn't post it in a public forum.


No, thanks.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

TonyMontanta said:


> Thank you for your comments. This is the way i have been feeling, just hard to accept that our marriage is probably over. Do you think things could change if she agreed to explain the timeline and cut him out completely. I do agree with cutting the OM out completely but I would not talk to the kids about it yet. They are 8 and 5, not sure how well they could handle it.


There is no way to fix this. You have been second best (actually probably 5th or 6th best) for years. Your wife has been having sex with this man ever since she started being “distant” from you. I’m shocked that you want to pretend at this point that she hasn’t been banging the guy for years.

I kniw how much pain you’re in. To help you get out of it EVENTUALLY (it’s gonna hurt for long time), I’m going to tell you that I believe you should divorce. If you stay, you will likely get things back the same. Same as in a wife that has no feelings for you and uses you to make her life easier since the OM clearly doesn’t want to marry her. Want them to break things off? Divorce her. They’ll be split within 3 months.

Your wife doesn’t love you. She’s told you so. Act accordingly.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Diana7 said:


> That was exactly my thought. If you tell your husband you have been cheating he may well leave. If you tell him you werent cheating why would he leave?
> She is clearly lying. No one admits to an affair if there isnt one. OP I am afraid she is taking you for a fool and lying about it as well. As well as that you are blaming yourself, as well as that she is still acting like a teenager still wanting to go out drinking and partying when she is a married woman with 2 children. She needs to grow up and she also needs to come clean about what happened. Set up a lie detector test, you may well get a confession before it. How can you possibly decide what you want when she is still lying to you?
> At the absolutely minimum you must cut him out of your lives.


No need for a polygragh here. She’s a liar and OPknows this, he has a problem with accepting it. That’s all.

he heard her tell the OMabout a bruise he put in her thigh for goodness sake.
OMG this is the most obvious, cut and dry case of cheating.
OP, get out of denial. She’s cheating. She’s been cheating.

Sir, if you stay with her, she will continue to cheat.

it hurts. It will hurt for a long time. Welcome to the club nobody wants to belong to. Just don’t stay in this. That’s even sadder. Get out if this legal farce you refer to as marriage and move on and get past this painful chapter in your life. You’re not helpless. You’re not wanting to deal with the pain. That won’t stop you from hurting. Divorcing her will eventually get you out of pain.


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## QuietRiot (Sep 10, 2020)

Evinrude58 said:


> No need for a polygragh here. She’s a liar and OPknows this, he has a problem with accepting it. That’s all.
> 
> he heard her tell the OMabout a bruise he put in her thigh for goodness sake.
> OMG this is the most obvious, cut and dry case of cheating.
> ...


Some people need to see for themselves to believe, fully. I would probably still be waiting and wasting my time on reconciliation and false hope had I not seen it with my own eyes.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

He heard her with his own ears already. I think if she rode the OM in front of him and handed him a sex video she made, then told him it was all a gag, he’d still not accept that she’s been cheating on him for years. 

But I see your point. She’s never take it though.


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## QuietRiot (Sep 10, 2020)

Evinrude58 said:


> He heard her with his own ears already. I think if she rode the OM in front of him and handed him a sex video she made, then told him it was all a gag, he’d still not accept that she’s been cheating on him for years.
> 
> But I see your point. She’s never take it though.


There are those people! And you could be very right in this case. I don’t think he would WANT her to take it either. So yeah.


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## Thumos (Jul 21, 2020)

Let me say again. Adultery in all of its forms is abuse of a faithful spouse. Do not put up with abuse. Think about the same course of action and advice that would be offered to a spouse who was the victim of any other form of abuse. Act accordingly.


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## QuietRiot (Sep 10, 2020)

Thumos said:


> Let me say again. Adultery in all of its forms is abuse of a faithful spouse. Do not put up with abuse. Think about the same course of action and advice that would be offered to a spouse who was the victim of any other form of abuse. Act accordingly.


And much like those women with bruises and broken ribs you hear them say “but I LOVE him, he didn’t MEAN to I DESERVED it...”
I think you’re right in your analysis.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

My daughters hamster has a bigger sack than you. Guys like yourself will always be in a victim role through out life. Get your crap together.


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## re16 (Oct 9, 2012)

OP - I sincerely hope you don't seriously believe this is possibly not a full blown affair. This is a no doubt about it situation. This has been right in front of your face for years. 

If you are ok with it, whatever, but don't for a second think she hasn't been in PA for a long period of time.


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