# After 18 years, I catch her in a 3 year sexting affair



## 3yearquestions (Aug 28, 2017)

I came home on night to find a burner trac phone hidden in our bedroom. It was pass code protected and had a message alert. My wife denied it was hers and made some of the dumbest excuses to cover it up. Once she admitted and gave me the code, there were several pics of the same naked man and also just as disturbing several random pics of his life and times. It was a former boyfriend she reconnected with at a highschool renunion. For the next week she told me how he contacted her and mailed her a phone, it never added up. In the end it was her idea and her phone. The pictures go back to August 2014 and she just contacted him on 8/2/2017. I took the phone from her on 8/3/2017. There did appear to be months long period of no contact during those three years, possibly up to six months. There were only 24 pics and less than half nude. She swears there was never anything physical and she never met him. She said this was an occasional high and she never went further. She did admit to sending pics of herself. Of all the stupid sounding lies she has told she has been genuine in her insistence in counseling and to me it went no further. What hurts it was such a long time. A little background - this was after 18 years of marriage, two beautiful great kids (18 and 16), no money problems, great friends and family, world wide trips, owning businesses together. We shared long walks, quite times and honestly a great, frequent and passionate love life. We even talked about couples who had affairs and she was so firm that "you just can't put yourself in those situations". Even the counselor is at a loss for triggers, why risk so much? She even said he is not that interesting and they never talked, just texted. She refused his offers to meet.

So is this as bad as it seems? Is this the equivalent of a married guy using porn? Can somebody who cheated, lied and hid for 3 years (great years) ever really be trusted? This was not a weekend mistake.
Honestly, I have no gauge here.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Cheaters cheat. 
It doesn't matter how great their lives are.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

3YQ

Don't trust anything she says, waywards minimize get your W a polygraph.

Tamat


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

TAMAT said:


> 3YQ
> 
> Don't trust anything she says, waywards minimize get your W a polygraph.
> 
> Tamat


 Listen to TAMAT.

She's been lying to and deceiving you for 3 years. She even trickle truthed and lied to you after she was busted. What on earth makes you think you have the whole story and complete truth now. They always only admit what they have to. If you hadn't have found that phone she would still be going along full steam.What you see is regret over being caught, not remorse. BIG difference. 3 years is a long time for a guy to just text. Get her to take a polygraph for your own peace of mind.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

Your wife telling you it was an ''occasional high'' is probably accurate. Most people who have affairs, there's not much ''wrong'' in the marriage, it's really that the cheater feels he/she is lacking something inside. Sorry that you're just finding all of this out. What are you going to do?


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## Rick Blaine (Mar 27, 2017)

Yes. Have her do the Polygraph. Please believe us that wayward spouses do not come clean. We have seen this over and over and over again. Don't think your wife is the exception. She has been lying to you for years, and the only reason she is sharing some facts now is because she was caught. 

Set up an appointment for a polygraph with specific questions about her affair. She may fight you on this or offer reasons why it is not a good idea. If she does that means she is hiding more.

Sorry you are going through this.

I recommend you read Surviving an Affair by Willard Harley.


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## Rick Blaine (Mar 27, 2017)

*Deidre* said:


> Your wife telling you it was an ''occasional high'' is probably accurate. Most people who have affairs, there's not much ''wrong'' in the marriage, it's really that the cheater feels he/she is lacking something inside. Sorry that you're just finding all of this out. What are you going to do?


We are all wired to cheat, but if we establish boundaries we protect our marriage. The OP's wife didn't do that. She willfully let down her boundaries. There is no excuse for cheating, no valid reason to support it.


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

3yearquestions said:


> I came home on night to find a burner trac phone hidden in our bedroom. It was pass code protected and had a message alert. My wife denied it was hers and made some of the dumbest excuses to cover it up. Once she admitted and gave me the code, there were several pics of the same naked man and also just as disturbing several random pics of his life and times. *It was a former boyfriend she reconnected with at a highschool reunion*.
> 
> Did she go alone?
> 
> ...


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## Rick Blaine (Mar 27, 2017)

OP,
Be aware that affairs are like addictions. They don't die easily and go underground when discovered. The best way to kill the affair is to expose it to friends and family, including those of the guy she was cheating with. Wait till after the polygraph so you have all the info you need. You should also confront the other man and demand he stay away from your wife. 

Exposure is not meant to humiliate and punish. Rather it shatters the secrecy that affairs thrive in and holds the wayward spouse accountable.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

Is it as bad as it seems? yes.

For 1/6 th of your marriage she has been cheating, but perhaps this is not the first OM, also this OM may have been her first choice and she settled for you. She may have been in sporadic contact throughout your marriage.

Tamat


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## Tatsuhiko (Jun 21, 2016)

Heed the advice about the polygraph. But this might not be her first rodeo. Have the examiner ask her about _this_ affair, but also any others there might have been over the past 18 years. Questions like: has she had sexual contact with _any other person_ since you've been married? Would she have left you for him if he was available?

Expose the affair to the man's wife/girlfriend, if he has one.


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## Dannip (Jun 13, 2017)

Go get STD tested. Her too. together. Have the kids DNA checked. 

It's the message you're sending her. Shame and embarrassment. I'd expose her actions before she paints you as the evil turd. Tell friends and family. Best way to halt her affair. Peer pressure.


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## *Deidre* (Feb 7, 2016)

Rick Blaine said:


> We are all wired to cheat, but if we establish boundaries we protect our marriage. The OP's wife didn't do that. She willfully let down her boundaries. There is no excuse for cheating, no valid reason to support it.


I'd never support it. What I was saying was for him not to blame himself, as he seems to be sharing that his marriage seemed ''perfect,'' and her cheating probably had little to do with him or them.


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## jorgegene (May 26, 2012)

No, it's not like watching porn. Although I think porn is not a good thing, porn is focused on
Something we know is not real. For most men do not get emotionally involved.
It's a former of stimulation only.

Your wife on the other hand was emotionally involved with this man whether she admits it or not.
Believe it; this was draining her emotional energy and sucking the life from your marriage.

Do not minimize this and pass it off as relatively harmless.

It's an affair. Period.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

3yearquestions said:


> I came home on night to find a burner trac phone hidden in our bedroom. It was pass code protected and had a message alert. My wife denied it was hers and made some of the dumbest excuses to cover it up. Once she admitted and gave me the code, there were several pics of the same naked man and also just as disturbing several random pics of his life and times. It was a former boyfriend she reconnected with at a highschool renunion. For the next week she told me how he contacted her and mailed her a phone, it never added up. In the end it was her idea and her phone. The pictures go back to August 2014 and she just contacted him on 8/2/2017. I took the phone from her on 8/3/2017. There did appear to be months long period of no contact during those three years, possibly up to six months. There were only 24 pics and less than half nude. She swears there was never anything physical and she never met him. She said this was an occasional high and she never went further. She did admit to sending pics of herself. Of all the stupid sounding lies she has told she has been genuine in her insistence in counseling and to me it went no further. What hurts it was such a long time. A little background - this was after 18 years of marriage, two beautiful great kids (18 and 16), no money problems, great friends and family, world wide trips, owning businesses together. We shared long walks, quite times and honestly a great, frequent and passionate love life. We even talked about couples who had affairs and she was so firm that "you just can't put yourself in those situations". Even the counselor is at a loss for triggers, why risk so much? She even said he is not that interesting and they never talked, just texted. She refused his offers to meet.
> 
> So is this as bad as it seems? Is this the equivalent of a married guy using porn? Can somebody who cheated, lied and hid for 3 years (great years) ever really be trusted? This was not a weekend mistake.
> Honestly, I have no gauge here.


She's lying. Dig deeper.

And no, this isn't like using porn.

Not even close.


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## MovingFrwrd (Dec 22, 2015)

Sorry you're here. Definitely not a weekend mistake. I'm not in your shoes, but I would definitely tread carefully.

My thoughts are while nothing physical happened, she f*cked up. Pics to him? That's not right. I'm not sure how to handle that. To me, it was a bit more than an EA. I would treat it as though it was a physical affair with the emotions and exchanges. she was probably ripe for a physical affair, but the timing wasn't.

Counseling will help you two quite a bit if that's the route you choose.

What do you want to do?


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## 3yearquestions (Aug 28, 2017)

She went with three girlfriends to the reunion. She saw him there, but never again in person. She has sworn this to our counselor, friends and myself. She states she wants to be clean and rid of the lies. She (we) have begun counseling, she has insisted I confide in friends (trusted confidants, privately). She gives me her phone, email etc. But hell, with Viber which we all had on our phones you can hide anything.


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## 3yearquestions (Aug 28, 2017)

MovingFrwrd said:


> Sorry you're here. Definitely not a weekend mistake. I'm not in your shoes, but I would definitely tread carefully.
> 
> My thoughts are while nothing physical happened, she f*cked up. Pics to him? That's not right. I'm not sure how to handle that. To me, it was a bit more than an EA. I would treat it as though it was a physical affair with the emotions and exchanges. she was probably ripe for a physical affair, but the timing wasn't.
> 
> ...


I want to move forward and work this out. We have too much to loose. The kids, the future, family, businesses. She has committed to finding herself out and working to change. She has problems with compartmentalizing and think of this as an 'and'. She is a wreck now. Oddly to move forward I have to be her biggest cheerleader. Our future depends on her changing and me forgiving.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

3yearquestions said:


> She went with three girlfriends to the reunion. She saw him there, but never again in person. She has sworn this to our counselor, friends and myself. *She states she wants to be clean and rid of the lies.* She (we) have begun counseling, she has insisted I confide in friends (trusted confidants, privately). She gives me her phone, email etc. But hell, with Viber which we all had on our phones you can hide anything.


 Then she should have zero problems with taking a polygraph, actually she should jump at the chance. It would endorse the truth that she says she has told you.


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

3yearquestions said:


> She went with three girlfriends to the reunion. She saw him there, but never again in person. She has sworn this to our counselor, friends and myself. She states she wants to be clean and rid of the lies. She (we) have begun counseling, she has insisted I confide in friends (trusted confidants, privately). She gives me her phone, email etc. But hell, with Viber which we all had on our phones you can hide anything.


" I lied to you for three years but I'm telling the truth now!"

because you caught her.


OP

If you hadn't caught her it would still be happening. You know that, right?


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

Man, even at face value, you seriously feel like you can get over this? The fact she sent nude pics to him to rub one out to, or he sent it to her to rub one out. Her thinking about him while with you. Her explicitly trying to find time to do this, that's she knows would kill you, would destroy your team and fracture your family. This is the woman whom you have given your everything to that you want to forgive? And that's just if everything she has told you right now is legit.

You'll always wonder. You'll always worry that she needs that high. She will always worry that you are worrying. She will worry that she needs that high. She WILL need that high. She will find other ways to get her high. 

Life won't be the same ever again. Don't think you can ever get back there, it's gone. Poof. If you are ok living in this new life like this, always looking over your shoulder, always wondering and checking up on her, treating her more like a prisoner on leave than a wife, then good for you. I couldn't ever and that's why I'm not.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

This 3 year affair took coordination, planning, effort and extreme secrecy as well as deception.

She has unfortunately disqualified herself from being able to give you the facts you probably need.

I am convinced you need the absolute truth to work through this and she needs it to all come out to be free from it.

The question is, How do you obtain the truth?

Do you have any reliable sources to obtain information about this bozo and your wife?

Does he live nearby?

A polygraph may clarify some doubts but can sometimes be inconclusive.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

*Deidre* said:


> Your wife telling you it was an ''occasional high'' is probably accurate. Most people who have affairs, there's not much ''wrong'' in the marriage, it's really that the cheater feels he/she is lacking something inside. Sorry that you're just finding all of this out. What are you going to do?[/QUOTE
> 
> I think deidre nailed this one....i think in your wife's mind she could a little naughty and get some excitement without crossing some invisible line where there was a point of no return...in some ways she was addressing this need to step outside her good wife mentality. If you are going to stay together you/she need to address this need....remember she did not pick someone close to home, she picked some from her past and away from home...so she did not cross that line, which means she does not trust herself, this way she kept herself in check and kept her double life orderly.
> 
> I am confidences that there are more like her or him out there in reality.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

She went through the trouble to get a burner phone. Can you comprehend the level of DECEIT this entails?? 

Dont you DARE be her cheerleader while she bullsh!ts her way through this. All of this is on HER to do the heavy lifting if you want to stay in this. (which I dont think you should) She needs to take that polygraph, then spend the rest of her life being 100% transparent to you in all things. She is to give you her passwords to all social media, her email, her phone should be open to you at any time. She needs to be willing to allow you to track her if thats what you want, she needs to be open with where she is and who she is with. She needs therapy. You BOTH should be in marriage counseling. 

Are you sure you want to go through all this for a lying cheater?


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

Okay, so what you know is that she had a long-term emotional affair. During this affair, there were photos exchanged and presumably sexting as well. She says she never met him for sex and you tend to believe her. She is in counseling to figure out her issues and is upset at herself. 

Assuming you want to move forward, I would recommend you give her time to fully work out her issues. Then, you start MC to strengthen the marriage. Her affair is completely on her. But, if there are issues with the marriage, both of you can work on that. She will have to be completely open and allow you on her phone anytime you want. Also, she must know that any new burner phone or contact in any way will lead to divorce. I would see if he is married and if so, his wife needs to be told. There can be no further contact beyond telling his wife. If any friend knew of this, that friend is no longer a friend. If any friend says you are overreacting, that friend is no longer a friend. 

I would consider requiring a full STD test and paternity testing of your kids, just to make sure. They are older, and it would make zero difference in how you love and treat them, but this will show your wife that there can be no trust for a while. I would also schedule a polygraph to see if she did meet with him at any time, sex or not.

She needs to admit to her feelings while this was going on. Did she love him? She could also give you a written timeliness of when and how this started and then how it progressed to sexting. Did she ever discuss your marriage? Did she ever put you down? Did they ever even discuss getting together in person? Did she compare his anatomy to yours? These are things you need to know. 

Lastly, ask her to put herself in your shoes. Then ask her how would she ever trust you again? 

This is absolutely fixable but it will be hard on both of you. Many times you will question if it is worth it. I believe it is.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

TX-SC said:


> Okay, so what you know is that she had a long-term emotional affair. During this affair, there were photos exchanged and presumably sexting as well. She says she never met him for sex and you tend to believe her. She is in counseling to figure out her issues and is upset at herself.
> 
> Assuming you want to move forward, I would recommend you give her time to fully work out her issues. Then, you start MC to strengthen the marriage. Her affair is completely on her. But, if there are issues with the marriage, both of you can work on that. She will have to be completely open and allow you on her phone anytime you want. Also, she must know that any new burner phone or contact in any way will lead to divorce. I would see if he is married and if so, his wife needs to be told. There can be no further contact beyond telling his wife. If any friend knew of this, that friend is no longer a friend. If any friend says you are overreacting, that friend is no longer a friend.
> 
> ...




Yet it all hinges on if she is telling the truth. I'm with Gus, dig deeper, she's lying.


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## barbados (Aug 30, 2012)

3yearquestions said:


> I want to move forward and work this out. *We have too much to loose. The kids, the future, family, businesses.* She has committed to finding herself out and working to change. She has problems with compartmentalizing and think of this as an 'and'. She is a wreck now. Oddly to move forward I have to be her biggest cheerleader. Our future depends on her changing and me forgiving.


It's this mind set that will continue to get you cheated on and disrespected. You are valuing "stuff" over your dignity. I have seen this statement over and over and over again here by BS's, and its 99.9% ALWAYS guys who say it.

Ask yourself where her concern was in possibly loosing everything ? Let me answer that for you. SHE DIDN"T CARE ! and she only cares now BECAUSE SHE WAS CAUGHT !


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## MAJDEATH (Jun 16, 2015)

Ask her 2 questions:
- does she love him, did she tell him she did?
- if she wasn't married to you (widow, D, etc) would she be with him?


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

drifting on said:


> Yet it all hinges on if she is telling the truth. I'm with Gus, dig deeper, she's lying.


It is possible to cross this line, but not go physical. I agree there probably is more to this. There almost always is. But, if they are long distance, this may never have gone physical.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

TX-SC said:


> It is possible to cross this line, but not go physical. I agree there probably is more to this. There almost always is. But, if they are long distance, this may never have gone physical.




I'm in full agreement with you, the only upside is distance. I have a bad feeling though that she reconnected with OM during a reunion where OP wasn't present. She was however with three female friends, have you spoken with these three friends OP?


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## FrazzledSadHusband (Jul 3, 2014)

Did she ever send you pic's of her intimate parts with a dirty F me message?

Were you having sex or was she giving you the cold shoulder?

I understand wanting to keep the family together. Life can feel very empty without access to your kids.

But do you want to walk into your bedroom or bathroom & have her quickly pull on a cover up, and realize she was willingly sharing the eye candy with someone else, but doesn't want you to see it? 

These are feelings that are going to pop up for years to come if you keep her around.


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## phillybeffandswiss (Jan 20, 2013)

Yeah, I'll wait, but the 6 month break is more telling to me than anything she claims to not have done. If you are going to really delve into this, which it sounds like you shouldn't, this is where I would start.


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## KevinZX (Jul 1, 2017)

She is a cheater, no question, it would have led somewhere if she wanted it to, guilty is guilty, no half measures, black and white and all that, she will cheat on you if she hasn't already, it's up to you man, get it fixed today, she cheated if she sent nude pictures of herself to a guy who sent her the same, if they had been in the same room sex would have taken place i don't doubt, geography is what stopped them.

Love and Peace always

KevinZX


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## scaredlion (Mar 4, 2017)

If your wife never met the man, never talked with him and only texted, then in my opinion, if this was an affair then it is a poor excuse for one. She was getting the same "kick" from the text that a married man gets from looking at porn on the internet. The only difference is she knew him and the men don't know the names of the women on internet porn. If this was an affair, then every married man who has ever watched porn has had an affair and cheated on their wife. Some people want to rush in and yell "affair" and make a mountain out of a mole hill of inappropriate texting. Now if she had been sending complete nude pictures and making plans to hook up in a hotel somewhere, then that would be a different story. Women view porn also. Check it out on Google. Had you rather your wife watched porn or text? Tell your wife that from now on you and her would do the sexy texting. Don't put a great marriage in jeopardy over something like this. Just tell her how you feel and ask her to stop. Then send her a sexy text with a cool picture of you. I do wish you well.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

ConanHub said:


> This 3 year affair took coordination, planning, effort and extreme secrecy as well as deception.
> 
> .


This is why I'm wary of "My wife is in bits" yes now she is because it probably means you go a little easier on her and maybe like you she sees she's got too much to lose but..

1) If she hadn't been caught this would still be going on today.
2) Three years meant this wasn't just an occasional hobby, she was fully cognisant of her deception, not on impulse or a whim but with full and complete awareness with the a forth mentioned above, planning, effort and coordination.

You caught this but as others are saying there is probably more. She purchased a burner phone which means either she's read an infidelity site or she has experience in making sure she keeps her two lives separate (and this is important).

What you have here is damage limitation, so you won't get the full truth, you'll get the faux remorse or the wife is in bits act but this is the wife side you're getting, your problem is when this has quietened down you still have that other side the cheating one she did so well to compartmentalise to keep separate waiting to restart things or embark on another opportunity when it presents itself.

So yes it is crucial before moving forward you get the full and absolute truth not only what happened during these three years but before that as well.


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## TaDor (Dec 20, 2015)

Have you read every single message?


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

3yearquestions said:


> I want to move forward and work this out. We have too much to loose. The kids, the future, family, businesses. She has committed to finding herself out and working to change. She has problems with compartmentalizing and think of this as an 'and'. She is a wreck now. Oddly to move forward I have to be her biggest cheerleader. Our future depends on her changing and me forgiving.


Do not rush into any reconciliation with her, you are shocked and in that stage where you don't want to lose everything, not a good time for making important decisions. Just tell your WW she has f'ed up badly and you will need the time to heal and get over this and there are no guarantees you will not walk away and divorce her, it all depends on her and how she follows through with truth and the hard work needed to win your trust back.
She needs to be aware of the seriousness of the situation, so do not tell her you want to reconcile, not yet.

Make sure you know everything, you do not need triggers later on if you do reconcile, tell her this, suggest a polygraph.
Focus on yourself for now, forget the MC, get IC and let your wife pull out all the stops to let you know she wants to make things right, you can tell alot about someone from the amount of effort they put in, this is on her not you, why are you the one who has to be her biggest cheerleader? Hell no! She needs to be licking your boots right now. She is a wreck, cause she got caught and knows what she stands to lose, do not fall for all the BS, she willingly lied to you for 3 years! 3 long years, let that sink in, this was not a once in a stupid moment slip up, which some cheaters have, this was a long long long premeditated episode. When you caught her, she lied through her teeth, she was not thinking of you or her family, so stop with the feeling sorry for her and making excuses for her, there are none.
So now you have to emotionally detach to heal yourself and see what she brings to the table, you have all the time in the world, kids are getting bigger, kids ought to know what is happening too and your and her family should know, expose her as this will keep her accountable.
please do not be so willing to rush into reconciliation, cause that shows there are no consequences.
Cheaters are like teenagers, they need loud and clear consequences. Go slow, eat well, exercise, go out with friends, detach, show your WW that she has messed up badly and needs to win you back before you will really commit to R.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

scaredlion said:


> If your wife never met the man, never talked with him and only texted, then in my opinion, if this was an affair then it is a poor excuse for one. She was getting the same "kick" from the text that a married man gets from looking at porn on the internet. The only difference is she knew him and the men don't know the names of the women on internet porn. If this was an affair, then every married man who has ever watched porn has had an affair and cheated on their wife. Some people want to rush in and yell "affair" and make a mountain out of a mole hill of inappropriate texting. Now if she had been sending complete nude pictures and making plans to hook up in a hotel somewhere, then that would be a different story. Women view porn also. Check it out on Google. Had you rather your wife watched porn or text? Tell your wife that from now on you and her would do the sexy texting. Don't put a great marriage in jeopardy over something like this. Just tell her how you feel and ask her to stop. Then send her a sexy text with a cool picture of you. I do wish you well.


She did meet him at a wedding, this is trickle truth and I expect there is a lot more to be dug up, hence a polygraph is needed.


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

Ask her where she got the idea for the burner phone.

Google search for ways to cheat?

From her friends who went with her to the reunion?

Thin air?

Him?


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

If she had a burner phone she has either researched how to cheat and not get caught or this isn't her first affair. She can offer pure transparency when it comes to the electronic devices and social media accounts you know about, but she's already shown you that she has zero problem with owning devices you don't know about. She probably has social media accounts you don't know about, too. So, really, her offers of transparency are meaningless. Whether anything physical happened or not, you know know your wife is not only untrustworthy, but she's sneaky...cunning, even. Reconcile if you want, but understand that this is not a person you can EVER really trust and make decisions accordingly.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

The burner phone bothered me too... took planning much deeper than many other weak excuses.



3yearquestions said:


> I want to move forward and work this out. We have too much to loose. The kids, the future, family, businesses. She has committed to finding herself out and working to change. She has problems with compartmentalizing and think of this as an 'and'. She is a wreck now. Oddly to move forward I have to be her biggest cheerleader.


May I ask how you intend to be her biggest cheerleader? Only she can rewire how she came to these poor choices, whether it be a self-esteem filler issue or needing to love and respect herself more because you cannot sustain propping up 24/7/365... at some point you are going to have to leave her to her own maintenance again.

She found herself before when she was faithful... what would be more helpful would be for her to understand how she lost herself.



3yearquestions said:


> Our future depends on her changing and me forgiving.


To me, although some may not agree, you have the easy part... may your mettle be strong and she quickly learns how to push this lack of self-love out of the way for you both.


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## 3yearquestions (Aug 28, 2017)

TX-SC said:


> It is possible to cross this line, but not go physical. I agree there probably is more to this. There almost always is. But, if they are long distance, this may never have gone physical.


She has been adament that this was never physical, never a meeting, no lunches, no gifts....I know it seems odd that there is no more. This was her "safe" thing and she didn't want to go further. It was a sneaky high (according to her). She is wrecked that something so basic and trivial in need, could have ruined her life and marriage.
Then we really started to open up on our discussions.......

To answer some questions from other posts.
- She does not love him and doesn't really know much about him. The texts were not daily, weekly or even monthly from what I saw.
- She has no interest in him as a person. They never got deep or spent time together. No phone calls, no gifts
- She has told no one and none of her friends (even from highschool) know. I am not close to her highschool friends.

So she has done something in which she didn't think of the consequences, she didn't consider me or the kids of her life as it was.
She compartmentalized this, it was a high and a rush, but nothing more, she didn't want more than that - all according to her

All hard to believe and I struggle with understanding, until......

Yeah I have been to strip clubs with friends, and recently. Not just sitting at a stage and tucking a buck. But hey, its only a strip club, in and out, nothing more (compartmentalizing). Private room in the back with a fully naked women (didn't walk back there thinking of the kids), very heavy petting - never thought what my wife would be hurt (denial, minimizing). It was fun at the time and then it was over (a high). I have done it more than twice (no one time mistake). Would I have done it again if given the chance? - probably.
I told my wife I went to the clubs, but I never went into details. She never asked, so I didn't tell (hiding)

So none of that is an excuse, just gives some insights to the things she did and felt. BUT - the strip clubs were NOT a person I knew. We just decided to go last minute, no planning no attachment.

Some more background. My wife is all that now, success, education, friends, no money worries, great kids etc. Back in the day she was not, self conscious, not the good looking one or the cheerleader etc. He was the big-man-on-campus that she couldn't get or he didn't give her the attention. He went through a divorce during this 3 year period, doesn't have a real job, no kids etc. She says he just seems simple. She states that was part of the power and the high, she has it over him now. She didn't want the relationship. It seems more of a "look at me now" confidence trip. I felt very confident walking out of the strip clubs, maybe a little guilty.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

3yearquestions

I don't know exactly what you have questioned your wife about, but reading the comments lately has been troublesome. That is putting it as nicely as I can say. I see your wife as either very intelligent with affairs, or very well coached. This should have you in, I believe nothing that you say, mode. At this moment I can't even tell you to trust but verify, you simply have verify all that comes from her mouth. I know this may seem harsh, cynical, or even slamming your wife, but let me show you what I mean. 

1) is this her first affair? Having a burner phone to contact is either coached or smart.

2) could she have had an affair before this one and gained expierience? Could a former affair have sent her a burner phone and that's why she said OM sent it?

3) are you believing that this affair would still be active had you not found the phone? Has she said she was on the verge of ending this affair?

4) if the roles were reversed, what would she do? Feel? Trust you? Forgive you? 

5) if everything was as good as you say, what was this accomplishing for her that was worth risking all she has? 

6) if this started three years ago, have they met at all three reunions? Have you gone to the reunions? Did she talk to him? Introduce you?

7) you said your therapist is also baffled with her actions, is your wife unclear on why?

8) polygraph, I think this is the only way to get the truth. 

With all of these questions I'm saying she has more to say. I don't think she is anything remotely close to what you are describing. I wish you the best of luck, but I also fear this is much more then you know.


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

Do you believe her?

Do you trust her?


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

High School Reunion : Burner Phone => Poly 

Something happened at the reunion. She is lying. Schedule a poly. Tell her it defies common sense that she would be sitting on a burner phone without some connection other than burning glances at a reunion.


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

drifting on said:


> 3yearquestions
> 
> I don't know exactly what you have questioned your wife about, but reading the comments lately has been troublesome. That is putting it as nicely as I can say. I see your wife as either very intelligent with affairs, or very well coached. This should have you in, I believe nothing that you say, mode. At this moment I can't even tell you to trust but verify, you simply have verify all that comes from her mouth. I know this may seem harsh, cynical, or even slamming your wife, but let me show you what I mean.
> 
> ...


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

3yearquestions said:


> She refused his offers to meet.
> 
> So is this as bad as it seems? Is this the equivalent of a married guy using porn? Can somebody who cheated, lied and hid for 3 years (great years) ever really be trusted? This was not a weekend mistake.
> Honestly, I have no gauge here.


I am of the opinion, and this is probably a minority opinion here on TAM, that cybersex CAN be used to stem thoughts of cheating on a spouse. She obviously was turned on by this EA. Sent him things, he sent her sexy things, and that is as far as it went.

Did YOUR sex life improve during this period? If so...she was using this EA to get turned on, and then pursued sex with YOU. That can be a very GOOD thing.

If during this 3 year EA sex life with you dropped to nothing...that would be a bad sign...she was replacing sex with you with some online guy, and then the next logical step would be physically hooking up with him too.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

I'm out.....


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

scaredlion said:


> If your wife never met the man, never talked with him and only texted, then in my opinion, if this was an affair then it is a poor excuse for one. She was getting the same "kick" from the text that a married man gets from looking at porn on the internet. The only difference is she knew him and the men don't know the names of the women on internet porn. If this was an affair, then every married man who has ever watched porn has had an affair and cheated on their wife. Some people want to rush in and yell "affair" and make a mountain out of a mole hill of inappropriate texting. Now if she had been sending complete nude pictures and making plans to hook up in a hotel somewhere, then that would be a different story. Women view porn also. Check it out on Google. Had you rather your wife watched porn or text? Tell your wife that from now on you and her would do the sexy texting. Don't put a great marriage in jeopardy over something like this. Just tell her how you feel and ask her to stop. Then send her a sexy text with a cool picture of you. I do wish you well.


what she was obviously getting out of this was some man telling her how sexy and hot she was....her seeing her own body turning on a man sexually. ALL women like to feel attractive to other men, and here was recurring proof of it.

the question is, how can YOU make her feel this way? She would might not be searching for this online affirmation IF she felt naugty/sexy/wanted/lusted after in her own bedroom.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

She's lying!


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

3yearquestions said:


> She refused his offers to meet.


Uh huh.

And you actually believe her because.....why?


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

MAJDEATH said:


> Ask her 2 questions:
> - does she love him, did she tell him she did?
> - if she wasn't married to you (widow, D, etc) would she be with him?


LOL. She's a liar trying to save her marriage.

ANYTHING he asks her will be answered with whatever *she thinks he wants to hear*.


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## 3yearquestions (Aug 28, 2017)

drifting on said:


> 3yearquestions
> 
> I don't know exactly what you have questioned your wife about, but reading the comments lately has been troublesome. That is putting it as nicely as I can say. I see your wife as either very intelligent with affairs, or very well coached. This should have you in, I believe nothing that you say, mode. At this moment I can't even tell you to trust but verify, you simply have verify all that comes from her mouth. I know this may seem harsh, cynical, or even slamming your wife, but let me show you what I mean.
> 
> ...


I don't understand "anything remotely close to what you are describing" Is she worse? A total wounded and bad human?


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## 3yearquestions (Aug 28, 2017)

TaDor said:


> Have you read every single message?


She was deleting the messages after reading them. No call logs. They were 23-24 pics saved.
Last text from him "When can I see you?" She is adamant that means, give me a pic


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## 3yearquestions (Aug 28, 2017)

Talker67 said:


> I am of the opinion, and this is probably a minority opinion here on TAM, that cybersex CAN be used to stem thoughts of cheating on a spouse. She obviously was turned on by this EA. Sent him things, he sent her sexy things, and that is as far as it went.
> 
> Did YOUR sex life improve during this period? If so...she was using this EA to get turned on, and then pursued sex with YOU. That can be a very GOOD thing.
> 
> If during this 3 year EA sex life with you dropped to nothing...that would be a bad sign...she was replacing sex with you with some online guy, and then the next logical step would be physically hooking up with him too.


To be blunt, we have always had frequent and passionate sex. 2-3 times a week plus the occasional kisses, hugs, squeezes and fun things. No difference in activity level in those 3 years from before


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

I believe in second chances. I'm giving my fiancee who hid doing heroin and meth from me over the last 1.5 years. Yeah, it ****ing hurts to be lied to. Living a lie. I know how you are feeling and it sucks. Tell others about this, even your kids. There needs to be consequences. I told everyone about her drug use, no more secrets. It all thrives on secrets. And I'm still not sure I'll be with her for the long term. But no big decisions yet. If she's a good person, she deserves a second chance. Some people don't deserve second chances.

But give her a second chance to prove herself. If she ****s up her second chance, then she gets to deal with severe consequences. You won't trust her for a long time. And that's fine. Just keep your eyes and ears open. You'll know if she's lying or cheating again.


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## TX-SC (Aug 25, 2015)

Tread lightly here. I am a big fan of R in many instances and I do think you can save this marriage, but I don't think you are getting the whole story.


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

Does the OM know? I'd use the phone to text back to him and probe for more information. I did this with my fiancee's cousin who was selling her drugs. 

Might be too late for that?

I might have missed it, but is he married? Expose to his wife if so. Blow up his world too.


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## 3yearquestions (Aug 28, 2017)

GuyInColorado said:


> Does the OM know? I'd use the phone to text back to him and probe for more information. I did this with my fiancee's cousin who was selling her drugs.
> 
> Might be too late for that?
> 
> I might have missed it, but is he married? Expose to his wife if so. Blow up his world too.


She lied to protect herself in panic in the beginning (from therapists - nobody comes clean on the first pass). She made it seem it was him who started it and mailed the phone to her twice.
I called him, texted him. Threatened him with looking into obscenity charges (mailing unsolicited porn images). Had a $1200/hr attorney drafting a restraining order etc. Well when she came clean, it was mutual. I told him to back off, but there would be no lawsuit etc. He finally contacted back and apologized and pledged to never try and get involved again.


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## Sofa Sleeper (Aug 17, 2017)

Just want to tell you as an unfaithful one, that her minimizing her involvement and blaming the other guy for initiating contact, etc is solely her trying to protect herself from what you may think of her. It is going to take some time and some serious soul searching and looking inward until she can just own it ALL... her intent, her thoughts, her actions, her motives, her choices, her consequences. It takes us some time to come out of the lies we have even told ourselves and to be honest with ourselves and those we love. She is in panic mode right now. It isn't right though. I'm sorry. I hope you two can work through this together.


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## 3yearquestions (Aug 28, 2017)

Sofa Sleeper said:


> Just want to tell you as an unfaithful one, that her minimizing her involvement and blaming the other guy for initiating contact, etc is solely her trying to protect herself from what you may think of her. It is going to take some time and some serious soul searching and looking inward until she can just own it ALL... her intent, her thoughts, her actions, her motives, her choices, her consequences. It takes us some time to come out of the lies we have even told ourselves and to be honest with ourselves and those we love. She is in panic mode right now. It isn't right though. I'm sorry. I hope you two can work through this together.


She has sworn she has now come clean with all details and that it feels good. She says it is a stress relief to be done with it....knowing she now has a lot of work to do on herself and our marriage.


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

3yearquestions said:


> She was deleting the messages after reading them. No call logs. They were 23-24 pics saved.
> Last text from him "When can I see you?" *She is adamant that means, give me a pic*



Ok


And the burner.

You describe her this way : My wife is all that now, success, education, friends, no money worries, great kids etc. 

She sounds great. How did this exemplary person come up with the idea of a burner?


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## smi11ie (Apr 21, 2016)

Just take a moment and have a good old think about any weird moments or any strange sexual behavior. It is quite likely that she has been physical. The problem you are going to face (recurrently) is that you will never be sure. Can you do a text recovery on her phone? This might give you the big picture. Also if you ask this guys wife for help to get to the bottom of it then at least you have eyes on him. Good luck.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

GuyInColorado said:


> I believe in second chances. I'm giving my fiancee who hid doing heroin and meth from me over the last 1.5 years. Yeah, it ****ing hurts to be lied to. Living a lie. I know how you are feeling and it sucks. Tell others about this, even your kids. There needs to be consequences. I told everyone about her drug use, no more secrets. It all thrives on secrets. And I'm still not sure I'll be with her for the long term. But no big decisions yet. If she's a good person, she deserves a second chance. Some people don't deserve second chances.
> 
> But give her a second chance to prove herself. If she ****s up her second chance, then she gets to deal with severe consequences. You won't trust her for a long time. And that's fine. Just keep your eyes and ears open. You'll know if she's lying or cheating again.


Wait... did I read that correctly?

You're actually attempting to reconcile with your fiancée?

And let's be clear -- waywards don't _deserve_ second chances.

Where it is extended to them, it is done as a gift of grace -- not because they _deserve_ it.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

3yearquestions said:


> She was deleting the messages after reading them. No call logs. They were 23-24 pics saved.
> Last text from him "When can I see you?" She is adamant that means, give me a pic


Are her pants on fire yet?

Because _she's lying_.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

3yearquestions said:


> I don't understand "anything remotely close to what you are describing" Is she worse? A total wounded and bad human?




I'm saying what @ConanHub said, this feel good little adventure had so much planning, deception, for just a little thrill from sending a picture or text. I also don't believe that is something most people would risk their home life for. In my opinion this isn't her first rodeo (affair) and learned from a pretty good coach. This is also far different from strip clubs, did you get a burner? Did you plan in detail how to contact strippers? Did you have separate accounts to contact these strippers? No, you went to your local strip club, nothing more then any other person would. What you did there was wrong, but don't confuse the two.

You have described your marriage and your wife as the ideal marriage we all strive for, only to find your wife was sending pictures to others. Look at the level of deception used, look at she could have ended this after a year, the phone only had three more days usage. I guarantee she would have bought more minutes, and if she tells you no, she's lying. Schedule a polygraph and tell her your going on a date night. Drive to the polygraph and once there tell her what you are doing. Her reaction will say it all, and you will have a parking lot confession. At the very least you would get a polygraph fail. 

Imagine yourself getting into an affair, would you think to go and buy a burner phone?


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

Also....I'm guessing they would have to be in communication another way besides the burner phone. I mean, if there is a six month gap, what are the chances she will dig out the burner phone at the right moment to be able to chat? Zilch. On the other hand, they could summon each other to chat at a certain time through another means. What I am basically saying is that they would need to know when each other would be available to sext. They were most likely using other chat apps, things you can access through a computer such as Yahoo Messenger, Facebook messenger, Skype etc. The burner phone is simply the "evil you know". Everything else they are using is more than likely the bulk of where their relationship is/was maintained. 

Poly. Do it because YOU deserve to know for sure!


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## Broken_in_Brooklyn (Feb 21, 2013)

Spicy said:


> Also....I'm guessing they would have to be in communication another way besides the burner phone. I mean, if there is a six month gap, what are the chances she will dig out the burner phone at the right moment to be able to chat? Zilch. On the other hand, they could summon each other to chat at a certain time through another means. What I am basically saying is that they would need to know when each other would be available to sext. They were most likely using other chat apps, things you can access through a computer such as Yahoo Messenger, Facebook messenger, Skype etc. The burner phone is simply the "evil you know". Everything else they are using is more than likely the bulk of where their relationship is/was maintained.
> 
> Poly. Do it because YOU deserve to know for sure!


ditto. OP, she has only admitted what you already know. The tip of the iceberg. Sorry.


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## Taxman (Dec 21, 2016)

Before acceptance and starting a reconciliation, you will need to ensure that there is truth in your relationship. To that end, have her submit to a polygraph. Her reaction to you requiring this will give you some answers. If she freaks, then there is a lot more that you do not know. If she goes along, then do the test and then begin the process of reconciliation. Be adamant that you will not entertain the notion of reconciliation until you are absolutely assured that there was nothing more than what she did emotionally.


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## BetrayedDad (Aug 8, 2013)

@3yearquestions 

They've banged on multiple occasions like rabbits..... 

You live in utter fantasyland if you think otherwise. 

She's playing you like a fiddle. No remorse at all.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

drifting on said:


> I'm in full agreement with you, the only upside is distance. I have a bad feeling though that she reconnected with OM during a reunion where OP wasn't present. She was however with three female friends, have you spoken with these three friends OP?


My first thought exactly.

She got physical with him at the reunion three years ago. That is why she bought the burner. That is why they exchanged numbers. That is why they were sending nude photos - to remind them of that time they spent together as lovers.

For someone to purchase a secret phone and keep it charged and hidden for three years is an extreme level of deception and betrayal of you and commitment to OM.

She is lying. There is more you don't know.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Is this comparative to porn? LOL, no, it's absolute cheating with another individual. 

She had a BURNER PHONE!!!!!!!! That's a 99.9% certainty that she's cheating physically with this guy. You have heard lie after lie, and only get trickle truth. Now you suddenly think you have the truth.

I'm NOT saying you should divorce. I DO think you need to consider it. I DO think you need to find out the whole truth.
1) if you did not get the burner phone IN YOUR POSSESSION IMMEDIATELY upon it's discovery and never let it out of your hand, she likely deleted all the really bad stuff if it's possible. If that's the case, it was physical. NOBODY goes to the trouble of getting a burner phone unless they're cheating phyiscally or at the very least sending bad stuff like nude pics. YOu only saw partially nude stuff and no really bad stuff like her scheduling a rendezvous with him. Makes me think either:
A. she deleted bad stuff before you got the phone
b. It was not physical and nothing really bad happened other than the emotional redirection from you to him in her mind which quite possibly has eroded her love for you in a really bad way.


Poly graph is in order. iF it's passed (it won't be one way or another, you're almost guaranteed a parking lot confession which will be more trickle truth) on the physical part, you can better decide if you want to stay in the marriage.

IF you choose to stay in the marriage no matter what she has done, then you are making a life altering mistake. Even the mentality of staying in the marriage no matter what is a life altering mistake.

Wrapping it up: Your wife had a burner phone. I'd say there's a better chance they had sex than I have of winning the lottery. Seriously.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

Sorry you are going thru this


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## WasDecimated (Mar 23, 2011)

3yearquestions, I don’t think the gravity of what your WW has done has sunk in yet. Here’s the thing, you can’t trust anything she says right now. 

My XWW met up with an old school friend at her 20th reunion. That single event was the beginning of a two year affair. My marriage was solid in every respect, the way you describe yours. That didn’t stop her from risking it all. When I discovered what was going on, my XWW started lying very convincingly. She minimized the crap out of the situation. Like your WW, she claimed they never met up after the reunion as well. The truth is, she was banging this clown at least once a week while I was at work! 

3 years!!! A hell of a lot can happen in 3 years. It takes a special type of person to keep something like this hidden for that long. You need to keep that in mind. 
I guarantee this story of hers is much, much deeper than she claims. With all the way to communicate and meet up in this modern world, they could be using other methods, not just a burner phone. No man hangs in there for 3 years with out getting some...!

Where does her OM live? Is he close by?
Is he married? Did you contact his wife? (You should. You may find out some additional info)
What does she do during the day? What does she do with her extra time? 
Is she on Fakebook? Hidden email accounts?

You need to think back in time and connect the dots.

If you want the truth, schedule a Lie Detector Test. Don’t tell her anything about it. It needs to be a surprise. When you arrive in the parking lot, tell her about the test. You may just get a parking lot confession…but still proceed with the test.


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## Hoosier (May 17, 2011)

"She was deleting the messages after reading them. No call logs. They were 23-24 pics saved.
Last text from him "When can I see you?" She is adamant that means, give me a pic"


LOL!!!!!


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

3YQ

Your WW is devastated because she lost the person she felt was her soul mate and she is mourning losing someone who gave absolute meaning to her life. 

I’m not exaggerating you have to understand that the addiction your WW had to the OM was at least as intense as an addiction to opium. She might try to say she is sad for betraying you, but much more she is heartbroken over her losing the OM.

You need to think what you are going to feel 5, 10 and 20 years from now if you stay with your WW. This is why getting a polygraph now is best, because the fact that she is LYING to you still means you will never recover completely or not have those thoughts when you look at her. 

Tamat


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

3yearquestions said:


> She has sworn she has now come clean with all details and that it feels good. She says it is a stress relief to be done with it....knowing she now has a lot of work to do on herself and our marriage.


She is full of crap. You keep avoiding the subject of a polygraph...why is that? Are you afraid to know the truth? You can learn a lot just by her reaction when you tell her you want her to take one. Even if she agrees, she likely will panic before it happens and spill the truth to you last minute. Either that or she will just run away. You cannot believe a word she says until you polygraph.


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## intuitionoramiwrong (Mar 18, 2014)

Have you ever accused her of cheating? Did your marriage get rough a few years ago? I'm wondering why the burner phone. Who pays the bills?

Are you going to reach out to this guy?


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

3yearquestions said:


> She went with three girlfriends to the reunion. She saw him there, but never again in person. She has sworn this to our counselor, friends and myself. She states she wants to be clean and rid of the lies. She (we) have begun counseling, she has insisted I confide in friends (trusted confidants, privately). She gives me her phone, email etc. But hell, with Viber which we all had on our phones you can hide anything.


"Saw" him?

There is more to this than she is willing to say.

Also,



Spicy said:


> Also....I'm guessing they would have to be in communication another way besides the burner phone. I mean, if there is a six month gap, what are the chances she will dig out the burner phone at the right moment to be able to chat? Zilch. On the other hand, they could summon each other to chat at a certain time through another means. What I am basically saying is that they would need to know when each other would be available to sext. *They were most likely using other chat apps, things you can access through a computer such as Yahoo Messenger, Facebook messenger, Skype etc. *The burner phone is simply the "evil you know". Everything else they are using is more than likely the bulk of where their relationship is/was maintained.
> 
> Poly. Do it because YOU deserve to know for sure!


Even Words with Friends has a chat feature. Seriously, cheaters use any means at their disposal.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Formally known as Hoosier said:


> "She was deleting the messages after reading them. No call logs. They were 23-24 pics saved.
> Last text from him "When can I see you?" She is adamant that means, give me a pic"
> 
> 
> LOL!!!!!


Just saw this quote. She deleted the bad stuff and left the stuff that might have a snowflake's chance in hell of being minimized if the phone were ever found.

When can I see you? That means "give me a pic"........

Indeed, this is laughable. She will lose total respect for you if you stoop so low as to allow her to think you MIGHT believe that.

Your wife has been having sex with her old boyfriend off and on for a long time. You need to accept that. It's a burner phone, dude. We all want to wish that our cheating spouse didn't do what it's obvious they did. We will lie to ourselves and pretend to believe anything to avoid the pain of accepting that our marriage is basically over and our spouse is a total skunk of a cheater.

You have caught your wife cheating, plain and simple. What are you going to DO about it???

I think you are going to rugsweep this and try to move on with as little pain as possible. Thing is, this stuff can't be ignored and the pain is going to be excruciating and lasting months, or it's going to be steady pain lasting for years until you divorce anyway and have to endure the excruciating pain as well.

Smart money is on serving her with divorce papers, totally busting up her fantasy world, showing yourself to be a person who doesn't tolerate cheating, and IF (big if) she decides you are worth giving the full truth and taking the consequences of losing you in the process (an indication of true remorse)---- you might be able to better decide to stay or divorce.

I say again--- your wife has been lying to you for years and has been found with a burner phone which has delted texts in which the last message is "when can I see you?" C'mon man......... 

I would pay whatever it took to recover those deleted texts if possible. About your only chance of some actual truth.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

If it hasn't been said yet, if OM is married, his wife needs to know what's up.

Like yesterday.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

GusPolinski said:


> If it hasn't been said yet, if OM is married, his wife needs to know what's up.
> 
> Like yesterday.


He alluded to the fact that OM was going through a divorce during the 3 yr affair. 

I'm guessing because OM's wife caught them together during the reunion. OP did not say they were caught, but this makes sense and fits in with the scenario that she is still hiding a lot from him. And also explains how the affair and secrecy was established.


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## Taxman (Dec 21, 2016)

Oh yeah the OM is in the middle of a divorce. Get some confirmation of that from his wife. I bet their divorce is news to her. Just as his impending removal from his place of residence will be news to him.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

I'll double up on what Taxman says, OM will frequently lie to lead women into falling in love with them. They are akin to conmen.

The classic setup for an affair is for the OM to tell stories about how his W is separated from him, abuses him, cheats on him, gives him no sex or is cruel to him. These stories are intended to elicit a feeling of sympathy on the part of their target but often the stories are backwards and the OM is the one guilty of his own accusations. Speaking with the wife or SO of the OM will clear this up usually. 

The other side of OM stories are the ones where they brag about how much good they do, and how well they treated their wives again fictional.

The intent of these stories is to get the target woman to start complaining about their husband, once that starts it's easy to escalate further as they are allied against a common enemy namely their spouses. 

It's your job to unmask the OM and show your WW who the OM really is, this might or might not release your WW from the OMs aura, but it is a good weapon for your arsenal. 

Tamat


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## Mizzbak (Sep 10, 2016)

3year,

The first weeks and months after D-day are pretty awful. So, I think it unsurprising that us BS's may try to limit our pain (even though it might not be a conscious decision at that point). If what we know already is so hurtful, then we really don't want to think about what we might not know. So we don't interrogate and demand answers - not like we should (if we want to get to the root of it all). And I agree that this is where the seeds of rugsweeping can be easily sown. My D-day was in June last year and I spent 2 months in relative denial before I could face thinking about what more there might have been. I obviously couldn't deny the facts that I already knew, but I was very unwilling to critically extrapolate on from them. I took what I was told at face value and I assumed that my husband was finally being truthful with me. My world was already too broken to be able to sustain anything else. It took those 2 months for me to be able to get angry enough to grit my teeth and ask much harder and more critical questions. 

Many of the posters on this thread are pointing to aspects of your wife's behaviour and calling this clear evidence that she is not telling you the full story. (TBH, I agree with them that the level of conscious deceit she was practising seems too extreme and sophisticated for the full story to simply be what she has already confessed to.) And almost all of us BS's here have experienced the very gradual uncovering of the truth of our spouse's betrayal. Especially in circumstances where they did not confess, but instead were caught out. It is possible that we are wrong. And your wife has already told you everything. But, I'm afraid that it is also possible that she has not.

So I would urge you to focus on yourself right now. Focus on ensuring that you get and feel strong enough (if you are not there already) to be able to demand the answers that you deserve. And then ask (and cross-check and challenge) until you are certain in your gut that there is no more to know. I first posted on TAM because I wanted someone to tell me that the picture I was precariously holding in my head was true and that everything was going to be just fine. The response that I got was similar to the one that you have received. But I will say this - don't let them scare you off. What they are saying is important, whether your wife has told you the full truth or not. And the reality is that a WS has (hopefully temporarily) lost the right to expect their spouse to simply believe whatever they are told.


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## Herschel (Mar 27, 2016)

I think a lot of people here, while giving the correct advice, are missing the major snag. He thinks she didn't realize the consequences of her actions. That's what's keeping him from freeing himself of the idea that she is a guilty dog. She just didn't realize how bad this was. 

Reality check: she thought you were too stupid to catch her and it was worth the risk. Get that? What she was doing was worth the risk. She figured she could talk you down if she needed to. She thought, ok, he'll buy it. Dude, you know how many people have been in your spot and thought, oh my god, why didn't I realize this earlier.

And to @GuyInColorado regarding a second chance. You aren't doing that, and neither is this guy. You never had a shot. A second chance implies she made one mistake. I shot up heroine hat one time and I probably shouldn't have. I made out with the guy at my high school reunion and I probably shouldn't have. Whether you believe in second chances, those are the instances.

These women have been lying to you dudes for years. Every night, for hundreds of nights, they have known about something you didn't know and was hiding from you. This consumer their thoughts when it was late at night and dark. Did I accidentally leave my phone out? I'm just going to get some water. Was that text message my friend with my drugs. Oh no, that was just my mom. You are both so hung up on continuing to live these lies in hopes it has some sort of truth to it. Both of these relationships are broken and neither will have happy endings.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

3yearquestions said:


> She was deleting the messages after reading them. No call logs. They were 23-24 pics saved.
> Last text from him "When can I see you?" She is adamant that means, give me a pic


Do you seriously believe this?


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## Dannip (Jun 13, 2017)

She's protecting her lover, dude. Not your marriage. 

She admits yet minimizes what you've seen and know. Nothing else. It's called trickle truth. Drip drip drip. After tons denials. 

All cheaters do this. It's called the cheaters script. 

VAR the car and anywhere she sits alone in the house. Cheaters feel safe in the car to talk. Then at home when you're out. 

I'd have her served with divorce papers. That and expose her to family and friends. Also contact OM wife/GF. 

You need to stop this dead. Immediately. Delays only cements her feelings for him. 

The divorce papers will wake her up. You can always slow walknthe process or halt it. You need leverage, dude. 

Go nuclear. You can't nice her out of this. Burn her out of it.


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

farsidejunky said:


> Do you seriously believe this?


He wants to believe it.


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## Jasel (Jan 8, 2013)

> She was deleting the messages after reading them. No call logs. They were 23-24 pics saved.
> Last text from him "When can I see you?" She is adamant that means, give me a pic


Dude, c'mon.....


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Talker67 said:


> I am of the opinion, and this is probably a minority opinion here on TAM, that cybersex CAN be used to stem thoughts of cheating on a spouse. She obviously was turned on by this EA. Sent him things, he sent her sexy things, and that is as far as it went.
> 
> Did YOUR sex life improve during this period? If so...she was using this EA to get turned on, and then pursued sex with YOU. That can be a very GOOD thing.
> 
> If during this 3 year EA sex life with you dropped to nothing...that would be a bad sign...she was replacing sex with you with some online guy, and then the next logical step would be physically hooking up with him too.


This post drove out @ConanHub.

Have you seen the muscles on that rascal? Your words must really sting.
...........................................................................................................................................................

I drive away posters too. Keep it up. And you too will be famous [too,3,4] for being such a Flim-Flam....Man.

When you drive away the likes of @Evinrude58, @Emerging Buddhist @john117 @bandit.45 you have arrived. Not 'at' a good spot, necessarily.
.............................................................................................................................................................................................
John 1:17

In a few sentence [unworthy] brief.

So it is not for want of precepts that so many of us are going to destruction, but it is for want of power to fulfill the precepts.

Grace is love giving. Law demands, grace bestows. Law comes saying ‘Do this,’ and our consciences respond to the imperatives of the obligation. But grace comes and says, ‘I will help thee to do it.’ Law is God requiring; grace is God bestowing. ‘Give what Thou command-est, and then command what Thou wilt.’

Christ is Grace, Moses is Law.
..................................................................................................................................................................................................
To the OP:

*Your wife lost her way.
She knows what is Right, She knows the Laws of God.... uttering her vows on her wedding day.
She lacks the Will to stop. She stands at the bottom of Mt. Olive...her legs too weak and {lazy?} to make the climb.

Knowing and Doing...two different precepts...two different challenges. A balancing act that some people do [poorly?, predictably?, pitifully?]. 
The act and the doing is done by the winner, the stronger force, the stronger impulse in men and in women.
*
....................................................................................................................................................................................................

The writer of this Post [SCM/Red Dog] has lost his Way and his Guiding Star [not said in Jest]. Adrift over the Atlantic...heading for Ireland...and @MrsAldi s cat.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

Please remember, every choice we make shows intent... while it may not be momentarily understood why we love ourselves less, it cannot be disconnected from the fact we have chosen to do so.

Desire is a brutal master if you allow it to roam the mind unchecked... if she will choose to be honest, then you can possibly choose to trust her again, but you will not get one without the other.

Her compartmental walls will have to go first... if she cannot move those out of the way then the lies will stay contained within a prison of her own design, and you her willing cellmate.

She fears the the one thing (truth) that will set her and you free...


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Where did you get the information her boyfriend was getting a divorce? If a cheater tells you its raining, go look outside to be sure. The odds she has done much more than she has admitted to is 99/1. Seriously, no one ever comes here with the whole story.

For the last time, how far away does he live. We have a limitless number of cheaters that manage to hook up several times a year though they live hundreds of miles, even thousands, apart.

You have been trying to sweep this under the rug. That will result in disaster. Hope she hasn't sworn on your childrens life yet.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

3yearquestions said:


> She was deleting the messages after reading them. No call logs. They were 23-24 pics saved.
> Last text from him "When can I see you?" She is adamant that means, give me a pic


When can I see you means exactly what it says. 

How far away does he live from you?


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

GusPolinski said:


> If it hasn't been said yet, if OM is married, his wife needs to know what's up.
> 
> Like yesterday.


OM went thru a divorce during the three years.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

Sorry but you are still being lied to. She was to well prepared for this, burner phone and all.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

When I have sex with my wife, I want her thinking and wanting me. I do not want to be the stand in for some guy she just had a sexting session with.

Her fantasizing about another man during sex with her husband is not a good thing for the marriage in my mind.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*If you were not with her at the high school reunion, what's to say that they didn't hit it off immediately taking their renewed passion over to some local hotel room. Then as soon as they woke up from their nightly orgy, she wanted to keep things going on a perpetual basis and was savvy enough to think of a burner phone, which she immediately went out and bought, and kept its existence as a secret from you! Only until such time that you ambled across it, that is!

Given that, if it's not too awfully far over to Lover Boy's hometown, then what's to say that she didn't make some covert day-trips over there, that you really don't have the first damned clue about, to help satiate both their raging hormones and insatiable gonads?

Let's see here: Mundane to nonexistent marital sex life with her, burner phone, lying, deception, remorse only at being found out, texts, sexting, naked pictures, et. al. ~ you do the math!

If that's what you choose to want to live with for the rest of your life, then you can certainly enjoy being her Plan B!*


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## No Longer Lonely Husband (Nov 3, 2015)

She met him. You are being lied to. You should tell her she comes clean or divorce petition will follow shortly. You have to be forceful, firm, and unyielding in situations such as what you are in. Burner phones from my experience and knowledge of several affairs and divorces of acquaintances are a sure sign it is physical. Gus is 100% spot on.

You should not tolerate her false statements any longer. Tell her that the only way you will stay married is a polygraph. I would also have her draft a no-contact letter and you mail it yourself registered where he must sign for it. If he is married, tell his wife what is going on. Or better yet, threaten to post all of his photos on the internet.

Do not let her play you! You do not deserve this **** sandwich.


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

Are you resistant to the polygraph for a reason??


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## dadstartingover (Oct 23, 2015)

What is with all the polygraph talk? Seriously... it's over. 

"AH HA!! You're lying!" Well, no sh*t. We already know that. For three years, even. Consistent lying. In fact, there's a close to 100% chance that the lies extend beyond what you know so far. Physical affair? Yeah, probably. So what? She broke the relationship off three years ago. What happened between then and now is inconsequential.

Understand your value as a human being, and you put up with much less than this.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

Spicy said:


> Are you resistant to the polygraph for a reason??


*I honestly believe that she'd refuse to take it, knowing that the results would literally nail her mammeries to the proverbial wall!*


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

Calling it even because you go to strip clubs makes for a pretty miserable marriage going forward, in my opinion. Saying you are both 'flawed' and can just adjust your life together based on that knowledge is naive.

I, too, think she is lying. Her text indicates clearly that they have met up. What she tells you the language means simply doesn't add up. The language doesn't mean that.

For me, if you want to keep your marriage, she needs to come clean so that you know what you are reconciling and you need to stop going to strip clubs. No matter what men want to tell themselves, this is hurtful to most women. If your goal is to not do hurtful things to one another, then you need to acknowledge what they are. I would definitely get a poly. Right now she's scared ****less that you will find out more and even the threat of a poly could open the floodgates.


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## MyRevelation (Apr 12, 2016)

3yearquestions said:


> She has sworn she has now come clean with all details and that it feels good. She says it is a stress relief to be done with it....knowing she now has a lot of work to do on herself and our marriage.


If you go back to OP's last post 3 days ago ... and by his continued absence ... it appears to me that he has chosen to pull out the broom and sweep this all under the rug. It's a shame, but hardly unusual in these situations.


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

dadstartingover said:


> What is with all the polygraph talk? Seriously... it's over.
> 
> "AH HA!! You're lying!" Well, no sh*t. We already know that. For three years, even. Consistent lying. In fact, there's a close to 100% chance that the lies extend beyond what you know so far. Physical affair? Yeah, probably. So what? She broke the relationship off three years ago. What happened between then and now is inconsequential.
> 
> Understand your value as a human being, and you put up with much less than this.


Agreed, but many people need to be sure. A marriage is not something to be taken lightly, and I can respect that a person wants as concrete an answer as possible. I'm sure it would be a parking lot confession, and most likely a flat out refusal to do it. Which would also allow him more proof.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Looks like we lost OP....


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

He had already made up his mind before the end of page two. 

Just an occasional thrill. 

No way it was ever physical.

Did not affect the marriage -really. 

1 visit to a strip club=3 years of lies and deception.

"When can I see you?" = "send me a picture."

Eventually he will pay the price for keeping the blinders on.


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## JustTheFacts (Jun 27, 2017)

The thing is, if it wasn't a PA, he is more of a cheater than she is. He didn't just visit a strip club. He went in the back room at least twice and had physical contact with a naked woman. Sorry but that is cheating in my book and a lot of women's books. Am I wrong?


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## Malaise (Aug 8, 2012)

TDSC60 said:


> He had already made up his mind before the end of page two.
> 
> Just an occasional thrill.
> 
> ...


The thing is this: In his heart he knows it was physical. For years.

But, he has the façade of a good marriage going, he's afraid to D, and , as I said, he wants to believe her. He needs to otherwise he'll be forced to do something.


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## wilson (Nov 5, 2012)

What kind of phone is it? There is forensic software that can recover deleted messages from phones. Even if you can't get the messages, you can tell her that you're sending the phone off to a place which can recover all deleted information. Tell her that if it reveals anything you don't already know, the marriage is over.


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## Decorum (Sep 7, 2012)

There is an active thread where a middle age woman a co-worker and an 24y/o male intern went to celebrate something, she is a manager.

Drinking and sex ensued, perhaps a 3way, IDK. Afaik she was not prone to this.
Co-worker\friend never exposed it.

On another thread long time friends hid a wife's affair, and then the wife's affair (of the poster) until she confessed.


We see it over and over again. Friends hid it, co-workers hid it, and some of the more toxic variety, even encourage it.

It's often possible for the cheater to pull it off without the friends even knowing.

I would not put much trust in a chaperone.

You would be well within reason to wonder, when she re-connected with him at the reunion, what exactly was connected.

How likely is it at this point that she would admit, "oh btw I had sex with him that weekend."?


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## harrybrown (May 22, 2013)

3yearquestions said:


> I want to move forward and work this out. We have too much to loose. The kids, the future, family, businesses. She has committed to finding herself out and working to change. She has problems with compartmentalizing and think of this as an 'and'. She is a wreck now. Oddly to move forward I have to be her biggest cheerleader. Our future depends on her changing and me forgiving.


you do not know what you are forgiving.

She is still lying to you.


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## flowersandsun (Sep 23, 2017)

i stopped feeling sorry for this guy (OP) when he said he visits strip clubs, goes in the back room with naked stripper, heavy petting etc etc. I hate how men feel they are entitled to this type of activity but when a woman gets her dirty sexual needs met elsewhere its ruining the marriage etc. Men you need to understand this hurts 99% of us wives/women to our very core. It's a secret Male place that we are not a part of and it's engaging in physical sexual touching in a highly sexually charged environment. How is this okay but your wife can't have her secret too? The OP said he didn't tell her what goes on there at the club because its his little man secret and why would he? It would make him look like a pig. She is only left to imagine how he may compare her body etc to the 20 year old naked woman he was watching/engaging with in a sexual manner. i can completely see how that could easily make a wife/woman go and do something as drastic as his wife has done. Not saying that it's right her going that route but i could see being driven to that if my husband was going out and getting gratification elsewhere and thinking it's no big deal.

I just recently found out my husband has been going to strip clubs for the past 2 years. He hid it from me and i'm still trying to get to the full truth. My husband doesn't think it's cheating to have a naked girl on his lap because there's no kissing and he swears he didn't touch her which of course i don't believe. Im left wondering all sorts of scenarios that could have happened. And will i ever know the truth? How long will i have to have this on my mind taking up all my thoughts. There's tons of hurt and betrayal from all angles. Point is for most women this act in the club which men find so innocent is crossing the line, it's cheating and it's devastating to us....and on top of it the husbands are paying the girl too with OUR money. It's completely bogus that men have been conditioned that their dirty clubs/secrets are okay for a male night out when they feel like it and we should just suck it up but if we cross the line it's off to divorce court.


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

flowersandsun said:


> I hate how men feel they are entitled to this type of activity but when a woman gets her dirty sexual needs met elsewhere its ruining the marriage etc. Men you need to understand this hurts 99% of us wives/women to our very core.


 You sound pretty triggered ( maybe rightfully so), but lumping 3.78 *BILLION* men into one category knocks the legs out from under your first and only post. It's also interesting how you can speak for 99% of 3.72 billion women. That must be a stressful position to be in.


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## flowersandsun (Sep 23, 2017)

i was exaggerating with the 99% women to make a point. Ive read a lot lately about women's position on this issue and an overwhelming majority of women posting don't like it. Of course i don't know full statistics. And I never once said all men in the world population are like this... its you that decided that's what i meant...i was referring to married men that frequent strip clubs..i thought that was implied in the context of post, i was writing quickly so cut some slack please....


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## dadstartingover (Oct 23, 2015)

My wife and I go to strip clubs together. She's not intimidated by other women. It's a sexy thing we do... amongst 100 other secret sexy things. Doing those things together keeps her from being the mean harpy WIFE in my eyes and makes her the most awesomely sexy wife ever. I would have to be a complete moron to ever break her heart. 

She recognizes my male libido. She likes going. She never shames me. She is secure in our relationship.


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## flowersandsun (Sep 23, 2017)

dadstartingover - i think that is great you go together because you are being open and honest and including your wife in your outing. If she is fine with it then no big deal. The issue i have is with husbands going behind their wives back and thinking it's just an innocent outing with the boys...


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## Rubix Cubed (Feb 21, 2016)

flowersandsun said:


> i was exaggerating with the 99% women to make a point. Ive read a lot lately about women's position on this issue and an overwhelming majority of women posting don't like it. Of course i don't know full statistics. And I never once said all men in the world population are like this... its you that decided that's what i meant...i was referring to married men that frequent strip clubs.*.i thought that was implied in the context of pos*t, i was writing quickly so cut some slack please....


\

I'm calling Bull****e on that.

"I hate how men ...", "Men you need to ..."
If you had meant men who frequent strip clubs, then you should have said Men who frequent strip clubs . It would make you appear much less like a misandrist, but Hey, you're in good company here anyway.


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## TDSC60 (Dec 8, 2011)

I have never gone to a strip joint on my own. I have however been on business trips where that was one of the things coworkers sought out. I always refused to go until one day I told my wife about it. She said that "I don't care where you get your appetite as long as you eat at home". Watching girls half my age swing on a pole does nothing for me.


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