# Not gonna fly.....



## newlife94 (Aug 11, 2011)

Need to vent and need advice.....
Ugh. So my H thinks that I am dumb or something. When I first exposed his A, I told him exactly what stuff needed to destroyed and needed to be gotten rid of for my healing. We have been seeing our chaplain during R until about 3 weeks ago because he left for military training. During his A he had sent lovesongs to the OW and they are still on his iPod and on our iTunes account. I have mentioned on several occassions that this bothers me and today it hit the fan. It has been 4 months and he has had time to do it. Today he tells me that he likes those songs and that I am not allowing him to be a person....I am trying to control him. WTF?????? Really. I am hurting and he is pulling this crap again about control.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

He's still in the affair would be my guess. 

It's not controlling when you want to do something. He doesn't want to let go of the OW.


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## Hunger (Mar 26, 2012)

In my opinion if he wants TR than he will respect all of your wishes. Maybe by keeping these songs he is holding on a little to the thoughts of the AP... that was my initial thought. :/


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## Thorburn (Nov 23, 2011)

He may like them but it triggers you, he needs to get rid of that crap.

My wife became a fan of a professional football team during her A. All she would talk about was this team and how she could not wait for the season to start. The OM wa a big fan. My wife loves baseball but never, ever cared about football. In R I told my wife not to bring up football again. Her FB has a guy pis*ing on the team's mascot. My way of showing the OM, pis* on you.


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## TheGoodFight (Oct 26, 2011)

I get pushback on stuff too. I know just how you feel. I feel like me saying it hurts me to see this or hear about that or whatever it is should be enough for her to want to not do it, but for some reason, they just can't see it.


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## Just Tired Of It All (Oct 22, 2011)

Me to. there is this one object I found that I have this huge nagging feeling that the OW got it for my H.. I think a Bday present. I asked him and he says no, he had bought that for himself.. But I dont beleive him. I dont have proof that he didnt and she did, but I dont want it around if she did.. So I dont know what to do about that one..... but I dont beleive anything he says right now, for obvious reasons, so he could had bought it himself, but still she could had to.. See my point, I cant just throw out everything for the what-ifs.. OR CAN I... hmmmmmm


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## 2xloser (May 8, 2011)

Just Tired Of It All said:


> Me to. there is this one object I found that I have this huge nagging feeling that the OW got it for my H.. I think a Bday present. I asked him and he says no, he had bought that for himself.. But I dont beleive him. I dont have proof that he didnt and she did, but I dont want it around if she did.. So I dont know what to do about that one..... but I dont beleive anything he says right now, for obvious reasons, so he could had bought it himself, but still she could had to.. See my point, I cant just throw out everything for the what-ifs.. OR CAN I... hmmmmmm


Why can't you, if that's what it takes for you to feel right? Yes you absolutely can. Many a counselor/therapist has suggested getting rid of everything up to and incluidng the marital home is fair game to save a marriage....


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

newlife94~

Here's the trouble. In a way you are trying to control him. He's either forced to do it your way or be punished, right? It was not offered to him as a choice that he is free to make or not make--it's a demand. And you tell me how YOU respond when you are forced to do something you don't want to do--even if your intentions are good? Do you do it joyfully or do you do the action and under your breath mutter and resent the sh*t out of it? 

The way to approach this is not to DEMAND. Well you can, but it's counter-productive and results in a relationship where one has power over the other. The way to approach this is as if he is a completely free, equally-valuable adult in the relationship--capable of making his own 'good' and 'bad' choices. He is also completely capable of experiencing the consequences of his 'good' choices and his 'bad' choices! Let him know you want to work it out with him TOGETHER, as a TEAM--that you don't want to force him to do something he isn't willing to do, but that you also are not willing to do something that YOU aren't willing to do. Thus the solution is to keep working away at it until you have an agreement you BOTH agree to freely!

As an example, you mentioned to him before that XYZ needs to be done in order for you to heal from this affair, and that included in the XYZ was deleting the affair songs. It's been 4 months and he has not deleted the affair songs...and when you bring it up he's doing the old "You're trying to control me..." line. Well here it is. He is a fully grown adult. He is 100% free to make choices and to experience the consequences of his choices. I would use a W-T-F-S statement: Tell him that 
"*WHEN *he (chooses to not honor his promise and delete the songs), that you 
*THINK *(he is breaking his promises again and loves her more than he loves you), that you 
*FEEL *(hurt, afraid, insecure, and not very valuable), and 
*SO *you would like to request that he consider the damage his affair has already done and volunteer to delete those songs and do it tonight." [I would suggest some sort of time limit that is basically "do it now" because if you leave the limit open he'll take advantage of that, and if he really wanted to do it, he would do it right away.]

Next, I would make sure he can tell that you realize he is not forced, and he can make any choice he wants...but if he chooses to delete the songs, the likely outcome will be that you will feel valued and reassured by him--and if he chooses to keep the songs, it will drive a wedge between you two, destroying the intimacy and doing damage to the marriage. Then if he chooses to drive a wedge, knowing that it hurts you and harms the marriage, I'd say it's time for you to evaluate why you're in the relationship and how much you'll be able to share yourself with someone who doesn't value you over some songs. 

Thus the consequence of your request does not have to be "Do it my way or I'm leaving the relationship" (which is just a threat)...but rather an appropriate consequence might be "Volunteer to delete the songs, or know that you are causing irreparable harm to the love in this marriage, and that damage may well cause me to evaluate if I can live with this in my life." 

Likewise what if he really does, of his own accord, like the songs and nothing more? Are you saying he HAS to give up music he likes forever? One thing you might be able to offer as you talk it over "as a team" is to have him remove it now, and in 3 months you'll revisit the songs and see if he can re-add them...and again in 6 months. Or agree to make a list of the songs he likes that trigger you and agree to go ONE-BY-ONE on the songs, and make them love songs about how he feels about YOU!! See what I mean? There are ways reach an agreement you can both live with, rather than just forcing him.


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## Beowulf (Dec 7, 2011)

Affaircare said:


> newlife94~
> 
> Here's the trouble. In a way you are trying to control him. He's either forced to do it your way or be punished, right? It was not offered to him as a choice that he is free to make or not make--it's a demand. And you tell me how YOU respond when you are forced to do something you don't want to do--even if your intentions are good? Do you do it joyfully or do you do the action and under your breath mutter and resent the sh*t out of it?
> 
> ...


This may be the first time I have ever disagreed with you AC.

IMO when someone has an affair they have to relinquish control of the relationship to the betrayed spouse so the BS can feel safe. Added to that if the WS was truly remorseful they would be looking for ways to make the BS feel safe and rectify the damage they have caused. In our R I demanded many things as part of the atonement and trust rebuilding process. I did not feel bad about those demands and Morrigan did not feel controlled at all because she was truly remorseful.

Your WTFS approach might work when the damage of the affair has been mitigated somewhat and after an appropriate amount of time has passed for grieving and trust rebuilding.

As for re-adding the songs at a later date...I'm 20 years out from D-Day. Morrigan and I have a fantastic marriage. Yet I still trigger and she would never ever try to bring anything back into our relationship that would cause those hurtful memories to return.

Point is, if you have to negotiate with a WS to get them to comply with what makes you feel safe in the relationship, they aren't really remorseful at all.


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## TheGoodFight (Oct 26, 2011)

Affaircare said:


> newlife94~
> 
> Thus the consequence of your request does not have to be "Do it my way or I'm leaving the relationship" (which is just a threat)...but rather an appropriate consequence might be "Volunteer to delete the songs, or know that you are causing irreparable harm to the love in this marriage, and that damage may well cause me to evaluate if I can live with this in my life."


Explain to me how this is even a consequence? What can you really do besides mope around? Doesn't this just build resentment?



Affaircare said:


> Likewise what if he really does, of his own accord, like the songs and nothing more? Are you saying he HAS to give up music he likes forever? One thing you might be able to offer as you talk it over "as a team" is to have him remove it now, and in 3 months you'll revisit the songs and see if he can re-add them...and again in 6 months. Or agree to make a list of the songs he likes that trigger you and agree to go ONE-BY-ONE on the songs, and make them love songs about how he feels about YOU!! See what I mean? There are ways reach an agreement you can both live with, rather than just forcing him.


I agree that this sounds good on paper, but it would be much easier to swallow in a "normal" relationship. Maybe on down the road, but I have a hard time swallowing any kind of compromise the way things are early on. 

I'd really like to see this debated out, because AC's response really is more of the professional view on this and BF's position really reflects the view of the more experienced posters here.


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## Just Tired Of It All (Oct 22, 2011)

2xloser said:


> Why can't you, if that's what it takes for you to feel right? Yes you absolutely can. Many a counselor/therapist has suggested getting rid of everything up to and incluidng the marital home is fair game to save a marriage....


Well, I guess I could!! I know I could, but thats not the point I was trying to make...

If it has nothing to do with the AP, but I just think it does, if he paid for it with his own hard earned money. Then I dont want to be a person who gets hung up on that one thing... Yet again, here I am, getting hung up on that one thing...... TO LATE... I guess I am that person.. if I dont stop focusing on it, I am going to end up taking a sledge hammer to it....... boy its strange how much rage I have and that one thing, me not knowing if he bought it or her, just psssd me off  I WANT TO TAKE A SLEDGE HAMMER TO IT..... oh boy do I ever!!!


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## BeenThereAndSuffering (Mar 12, 2012)

My opinion is D.I.Y. (do it yourself)..we were riding down the road in my husbands truck and he put in this cd of mixed music that had been burnt and it was sappy love songs so I know my husband didn't burn it nor any of his buddies, so I asked and he shrugged his shoulders so I rolled down the window, popped the cd out of the player and chucked it into traffic. He also had a pink beaded necklace hanging from his his rearview mirror that wasn't mine and I know he wouldn't have bought it so it went out into traffic too...now before people start, I am opposed to littering but it wasn't a well thought out plan but it did make me feel better. So if it is something that is causing you to trigger then trash it, don't wait on them to do it because in hindsight they may not be out of the fog yet and these items could trigger them into staying in it longer...TRASH IT!!


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## Just Tired Of It All (Oct 22, 2011)

OH, I dont want to just trash it, I want to destroy it to little tiny pieces..most everything that was given to or belonged to the AP, he told me when I asked,, but this one thing he says he bought...still... HAMMER TIME...

And I dont trash it first.. I destroy....makes me feel better to rip into it and just tear it to shreds.. At the begging, NOT NOW Iv moved past this, but the first few times awhile ago when I found somthing from/belongs to Ap.. I would destroy it slowly and very very destructivly.. Then I would tell the AP what and how I did it... then end with I love throwing away your money.. makes me happy!!!

I know I know, dont say it was wrong... I dont do that now, but at the start she actually told my H that she was afraid of me.... I told my H, well if she thinks this is bad, then she better never get close enough to me to get my hands on her.... RAGE... ummm yeah

Told you all that at the start I was a total mess, until I came here!!!


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## BeenThereAndSuffering (Mar 12, 2012)

I love it..hammer it, rip it, burn it....I feel there are emotional ties to these items and I see those emotions dying along with the item...it may seem evil but in the end it is just a material thing and it makes me feel better..now I have thought about setting fire to his truck cause she had been there and thats where stuff happened but I withheld that urge because the police and fire depts would be upset along with my insurance company but its for sale..lol..and also the OW told my H she was scared of me too and I laughed because she should be...bwahahaha..


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## Just Tired Of It All (Oct 22, 2011)

BeenThereAndSuffering said:


> I love it..hammer it, rip it, burn it....I feel there are emotional ties to these items and I see those emotions dying along with the item...it may seem evil but in the end it is just a material thing and it makes me feel better..now I have thought about setting fire to his truck cause she had been there and thats where stuff happened but I withheld that urge because the police and fire depts would be upset along with my insurance company but its for sale..lol..and also the OW told my H she was scared of me too and I laughed because she should be...bwahahaha..


Doesn't it!! I mean it almost gave me some sort of twisted happy feeling... No dont set the truck on fire, yeah that might cause a little bit more drama than what you want to deal with, but the image of it does make you smile!!! FOR SALE!!!:rofl:

I wonder why they become scared of us!!! Well if they wouldnt had helped to bring us to the brink of madness then they wouldnt had to have seen the maniac,,, but tell AP about the destruction, along with me throwing away there money, well they did it not me... I just wanted the AP to Know what was happening to all the items she worked hard to buy.... No sense in wasting her money on another womens husband unless she enjoyed the wife destoying it.....

All it was was filth, and I dont want filth around me... thats the way I see any object related to the AP is filth, it doesnt matter is its a million dollar dimond, to me it is filth.....


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## BeenThereAndSuffering (Mar 12, 2012)

:iagree:


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## newlife94 (Aug 11, 2011)

Just Tired Of It All said:


> Me to. there is this one object I found that I have this huge nagging feeling that the OW got it for my H.. I think a Bday present. I asked him and he says no, he had bought that for himself.. But I dont beleive him. I dont have proof that he didnt and she did, but I dont want it around if she did.. So I dont know what to do about that one..... but I dont beleive anything he says right now, for obvious reasons, so he could had bought it himself, but still she could had to.. See my point, I cant just throw out everything for the what-ifs.. OR CAN I... hmmmmmm


Oh, I sure did get rid of everything I thought was from OW. He was not home from Iraq yet and he had sent a bunch of stuff home. As soon as the crap reached my door it gave a vib of being from her (at this point he did not know I was on to him and had more info than he knew....I was still gathering enough proof- omg that is SOOOO hard from around the world!!) He had told me to let him know when this certain box arrived because he had gotten this antique box from "his soldiers" and he wanted to make sure it arrived ok. It is such a shame.... those flat rate boxes do not hold your body weight- FYI. I stood on the box and did a little jump. Oops, the poor antique box did not make it. It cracked. When he found out he was so upset (oh, I told him it arrived damaged.... evil I know, but he was having the A and if this was my only revenge I think I did pretty good.)
THEN when I found out for SURE about the A.... I called the OW. The first thing I said was thank you for the antique box- it was damaged when it arrived but it makes a good jewelry box. She seemed so confused because she was convinced he was almost divorced and then to find out that he was giving the stuff to me. HAHAHA I hope that haunts her. Oh ... on Dday, I smashed that box into a million pieces and my boys helped me!!! 
Long story, sorry. But here I am 4 months later and still laugh at that phone call with her. 2 hours and I hope that she looks back at their A and judges herself and has nightmares and questions reality the way I do. Actually writing this has been good for me. Thanks for listening.


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## newlife94 (Aug 11, 2011)

Just Tired Of It All said:


> OH, I dont want to just trash it, I want to destroy it to little tiny pieces..most everything that was given to or belonged to the AP, he told me when I asked,, but this one thing he says he bought...still... HAMMER TIME...
> 
> And I dont trash it first.. I destroy....makes me feel better to rip into it and just tear it to shreds.. At the begging, NOT NOW Iv moved past this, but the first few times awhile ago when I found somthing from/belongs to Ap.. I would destroy it slowly and very very destructivly.. Then I would tell the AP what and how I did it... then end with I love throwing away your money.. makes me happy!!!
> 
> ...


When he came home from Iraq....I smashed his laptop into a million pieces. He was using it to communicate with her, UGH no freakin way was that damn thing staying in my house. 
Oh and just recently the poor iPod became the victim- small price to pay. Technology is the worst- giving WS everywhere ways to hide things. So now I just watch closely and hope that every reminder is gone from my house....but if I find something else I have no problem chucking it out a window or smashing it. It is a little bit of therapy for me.


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## newlife94 (Aug 11, 2011)

Just Tired Of It All said:


> Doesn't it!! I mean it almost gave me some sort of twisted happy feeling... No dont set the truck on fire, yeah that might cause a little bit more drama than what you want to deal with, but the image of it does make you smile!!! FOR SALE!!!:rofl:
> 
> I wonder why they become scared of us!!! Well if they wouldnt had helped to bring us to the brink of madness then they wouldnt had to have seen the maniac,,, but tell AP about the destruction, along with me throwing away there money, well they did it not me... I just wanted the AP to Know what was happening to all the items she worked hard to buy.... No sense in wasting her money on another womens husband unless she enjoyed the wife destoying it.....
> 
> All it was was filth, and I dont want filth around me... thats the way I see any object related to the AP is filth, it doesnt matter is its a million dollar dimond, to me it is filth.....


:iagree::iagree:

I have no problem destroying the filth. And when I called the OW, I did tell her thank you. I thanked her for saving me money when she was sending him care packages- too bad he did not get diarrhea from the food she sent. (she was deployed with him but was not there the entire time) She bought him bday gifts, dumb Domo stuff. If you don't know, domo is a character that kids like- dumb that she would send childish stuff like that to a 36 yr old man. Anyway, he sent the stuff home and said that "his soldiers" had bought it for him. I got a vibe VERY early into the deployment and knew that when he made that stupid statement that "his soldiers" gave him something....that was code for gift came from her. YUCK. He sent this stuff home and I cannot tell you the timing. Dday came and two days later this stuff arrived!!! I called the OW and was ripping that stuff to shreds as we were talking. I do not know how much she spent....but I wish she had sent more, that was fun.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

I honestly think its very good and reasonable therapy to trash everything from the AP and everything the WS bought/used for the affair.

For WW, that means dumping/burning the nice clothes, shoes, lingere, etc they wore for the AP.

Jewelry, if worth anything should be pawned with the money given to the BS to do what they want.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Just Tired Of It All (Oct 22, 2011)

newlife94 said:


> Oh, I sure did get rid of everything I thought was from OW. He was not home from Iraq yet and he had sent a bunch of stuff home. As soon as the crap reached my door it gave a vib of being from her (at this point he did not know I was on to him and had more info than he knew....I was still gathering enough proof- omg that is SOOOO hard from around the world!!) He had told me to let him know when this certain box arrived because he had gotten this antique box from "his soldiers" and he wanted to make sure it arrived ok. It is such a shame.... those flat rate boxes do not hold your body weight- FYI. I stood on the box and did a little jump. Oops, the poor antique box did not make it. It cracked. When he found out he was so upset (oh, I told him it arrived damaged.... evil I know, but he was having the A and if this was my only revenge I think I did pretty good.)
> THEN when I found out for SURE about the A.... I called the OW. The first thing I said was thank you for the antique box- it was damaged when it arrived but it makes a good jewelry box. She seemed so confused because she was convinced he was almost divorced and then to find out that he was giving the stuff to me. HAHAHA I hope that haunts her. Oh ... on Dday, I smashed that box into a million pieces and my boys helped me!!!
> Long story, sorry. But here I am 4 months later and still laugh at that phone call with her. 2 hours and I hope that she looks back at their A and judges herself and has nightmares and questions reality the way I do. Actually writing this has been good for me. Thanks for listening.


:rofl: I had to laugh on this one, very smart move on your part. Not so much on his...... Sending it home, why do out spouses think we are dumb? But it only goes to show you that our "VIBES" are right! So I already brought up this item to him, which he says he bought, but I got that "VIBE" so I think I am going to have to be smart like you and figure out away to make it go bye bye without him really knowing how 

If he bought it then good for him, but I dont like the Vibe I get when I see it.. So I think I am going to go with HOW I feel about it.. Maybe she did,and he Knows it will get destroyed if he tells me, but he did tell me about the other stuff... Still got that feeling..

You Know, one time I found a Pre-Paid credit card thing, I called the company verified how much was on there, asked question to see what would happend if the card was lost or stolen.. Well you Know it can be traced onced it used or somthing. But I asked what if it never gets used but is lost, they said nothing really.. SO I CUT IT UP into a million peices and whated for my H to come home and left it on his table with the scessors.. I told him, boy she really like throwing her money away... She cant get it back I made sure of it before I destroyed it.. 

The thing is, he never spent one dime off it, so I dont know why she got it for him? Maybe she did know what else to buy him, so she gave him this.. Well I really did throw her money away that time... It felt good.. :smthumbup:


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## Just Tired Of It All (Oct 22, 2011)

This is my 200 post, I just wanted to post to hit it.. I dont know why I had the urge to.. It just felt like a milestone!!!! Weird!! But for some reason It feels like I hit a marker of some sort..


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## newlife94 (Aug 11, 2011)

Just Tired Of It All said:


> :rofl: I had to laugh on this one, very smart move on your part. Not so much on his...... Sending it home, why do out spouses think we are dumb? But it only goes to show you that our "VIBES" are right! So I already brought up this item to him, which he says he bought, but I got that "VIBE" so I think I am going to have to be smart like you and figure out away to make it go bye bye without him really knowing how
> 
> If he bought it then good for him, but I dont like the Vibe I get when I see it.. So I think I am going to go with HOW I feel about it.. Maybe she did,and he Knows it will get destroyed if he tells me, but he did tell me about the other stuff... Still got that feeling..
> 
> ...


I am not sure what your item is that is nagging you...but we can help you come up with a creative way to see it gone. If it is glass- you suddenly become clumbsy with the vacuum and knock it off the table. If it is anything that will break- there is a way to see a tragic end for it. 
Good for you for cutting up that card!! These women who latch on to married men, what the heck is wrong with them!?!?! I think this woman will likely not even think about another relationship for a very long time. 
She was shocked that I called....well when she did not accept my FB friend request, I was bummed. If she was so nice...why shouldn't we be friends????? When she answered, I said "well, we have so much in common now--maybe we should talk." I know she would lose her security clearance and her lively hood if I turned her in(or my H for that matter). So I said very matter of fact-"if I ever find out she attempts to contact him again, for anything....it will be a shame for all of this to end up on the desk of her commander." 
I saw on one thread about someone talking about a revenge A, this was way better revenge to me. Destroying stuff she bought, telling her he was giving said gifts to me and being the bigger person- just letting karma come along and take care of her. I think that bus hit her pretty hard after our talk.


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