# Wifes internet relationship driving me nuts



## cowman (Aug 12, 2010)

Well, This is my first post in a place I wish I never had to be. 19 years married this year and this is the forth online relationship for her (that I know of) I knew something was going on, she will not use our laptop, will only go online through her Ipod touch. Kept saying she was emailing a female friend but her almost frantic need to get online was a dead giveaway. I work at home and leave the house at 5am, back in around 8am, wife gets up at 9am. Lately I come in early and always hear ipod landing on night table. So yesterday I put a timer on the internet connection so it would be disabled until 9am. Well no internet use but a total of 52 texts were sent to/from wifes cell phone. The need to chat with this guy was so great she risked getting busted using the cell phone to which I get the bill. I right away asked her what was going on etc.. She said he is just someone to talk to. So i said lets see what he has to say, called him up and he couldn't even man up to admit he knew her let allown texted her all morning. What a coward. Wife swears nothing is going on, but lying has always come very easy to her. The biggest problem I am having with it this time is the cell phone use, and the fact this guy is only 1.5 hours away. She was just in his city 1 week ago, said she was going shopping with a girlfriend. I don't know if she really did. She says she never met him, but after all the lies how can I, or why should I believe her. I don't know what to do. Normally in the past when I have found out, the relation ship stops immediately, this time she openly says she isn't doing anything wrong and wont stop. It feels like everyday a part of my manhood is being lost. I am feeling defeated. Any words of advice would be so appreciated.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

First of all it seems like they are all cowards. If they were real men - men with integrity - they wouldn't be messing with a married woman.

Second - I wouldn't believe her either.

Ask her straight up about your suspicions. Be honest and tell her that you don't believe her and why.

I bet you'll be able to tell by her reaction if you push the issue a bit. If she gets angry and defensive right away - very bad sign.

Good luck.


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## cowman (Aug 12, 2010)

Gets very angry and very defensive. I always know when she is lying, because she starts yelling and blaming me for the worlds problems right away. Met her when I was 18 and I was as gullible as anyone could imaging, thinking back at all the stories I believed when I was younger really makes me feel like a chump now.


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

cowman, welcome to our nice n cozy little victims of cheaters/liars support group. At the very least your wife is having an emotion affair. There's a good chance she may be having a physical affair. It's time for you to get the proof and nail her with it. Is there any way you can bump into her best friend and have a casual conversation? With the right conversation I'm sure you could find out if she and your wife were really together on that shopping trip. My estranged husband used to tell me he was visiting his parents every weekend. That got busted when his parents were at our son's graduation. They told my husband he needed to visit them sometime because they hadn't seen him in months. I loved that! I just had to say something then. I replied, "That's odd--He visits you every weekend". The look on everyone's face was priceless.

Serious though...Affaircare and Tanelornpte offer a lot of resources on this site. Check out their threads.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Hey - don't be so hard on yourself. You aren't a chump. No one wants to believe that someone they are that close to would hurt them like this. That's just human nature.


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## franklinfx (Apr 7, 2009)

Can you see what they actually say, or do you just know how much they talk? Ill admit in your situation, it dont sound good, but just for argument sake, if you found out they were just talking about innocent stuff, would it bother you any less?


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## Okie (Jul 14, 2010)

It really is the lying that got to me. There is no reason my wife needs to talk to another man for over 500 minutes in a month or text over 1000 times. It may well be innocent, but it is still inappropriate in my opinion. Do you have kids? That is an important question. I was lucky in that TOM was over 800 miles away thus making the possibility of physical contact very remote. Physical or not you feel like you are being replaced and it sucks. Other people on here have good advice and answers take it all in and don't do anything until you have a plan.


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## Wisp (Jul 17, 2010)

The position you are in now is your wife is in an EA and probably a PA as well. Not good..

Be calm, keep your wits about you and never lose your temper, be a great husband full of love and kindness. You have said lying comes easy to her, indeed it will get more creative. 

To save your marriage you need to end the affair first.

Below are steps to follow to end the affair , they have been extracted from the affaircare site.

Your wife is not going to stop so …

Do step 2 again just for good measure… even contact the friend and see where she was , assume friend will also lie to cover for her.. 

Move on to step 3

“Extract below”

We use seven steps that are designed to make the affair seem less beneficial than the marriage - they are designed to help you work toward ending the affair:


Step 1) 
Gather evidence.

Just to be clear, it is very typical for the disloyal spouse to deny they are having an affair, even if you walk in and catch them "in the act" so to speak.

They jump up and as they're putting their clothes on they'll say "It's not what it looks like!" So this step is not so much to use as proof to make the disloyal spouse confess, so much as it is proof to the loyal spouse that they are not making a mountain out of a molehill...something REALLY IS going on. So if you suspect, keep an open mind and gather evidence to either prove or disprove your theory.

In some states it is illegal to tape someone without their knowledge so you may want to check your state's laws on electronic surveillance. In general some typical "evidence" could be looking at emails if the disloyal leaves their email open (print them!), looking at the cell phone pictures and texts if their phone is left unlocked, or logging onto your joint cell phone bill online and looking for xxx minutes to the same phone number.

Step 2) 
Confront 

Once the loyal spouse is convinced that there is an emotional or physical affair, the first step is to go to the disloyal directly and tell them to their face that you know about the affair and have evidence in a safe place that proves it's real irrefutably.

Don't tell them where it is or what it is necessarily; just make the statement that you know about it. Then state right out loud that in order for the marriage to work there can not be infidelity and ask them point blank to end the affair.

Ending the affair means that they can never, EVER contact the other person ever again, and they agree to be accountable for their time by sharing passwords to their accounts (facebook, all email accounts, cell phones...etc.). 

On the occasion there is a disloyal spouse who will fall apart just upon being discovered and who have been looking for a way to get out of it but didn't know how. If this is your case, consider yourself blessed and move to the phase of recovering your marriage!! 

If it is not, move to step 3.

Step 3) 

Disclose.

When you have confronted your disloyal spouse about the affair and asked them to end it, and they either refuse to do so or have not done so (maybe they took it more "underground"), the next step is to disclose the affair to ONE very respected authority whom the disloyal is likely to look up to and listen to...someone who is likely to be pro-marriage and tell the disloyal that having an affair is not acceptable...that they should end it and work on the issues in their marriage. 

This one person is possibly one of the *disloyal spouse's parents*, a pastor or religious leader, a teacher or boss. 

Meet or talk with the one person in confidence; explain to them you expect them to keep it confidential but that you need help; and then explain that your spouse is having an affair and give them the facts. If you can, show them the evidence. Then ask the respected person to help you and give you any support they can offer to encourage your disloyal spouse to "come home." 

The idea here to keep this to ONE specific person who is pro-marriage, wise, and trusted by both of you so that any potential for embarrassment is minimized and so your disloyal has the opportunity to "do the right thing." On the occasion a disloyal spouse will listen to the person they trust and respect, and end the affair. If this is your case, consider yourself blessed and move to the phase of recovering your marriage!! If it is not, move to step 4.

Step 4)

Exposure. 

When someone that your disloyal spouse respects has spoken to them about the affair and encouraged them to end it, but they have hardened their heart and refuse to end it, the next step is to expose the affair to those who will likely be affected by a potential divorce. 

The idea behind exposure is not to drag your disloyal spouse's name and reputation through the mud (their ACTIONS are doing that!) but rather to refuse to keep the affair a "secret" and to bring the ugly truth of the unfaithfulness to the light of day. In many ways an affair is like an addiction, and in the disloyal's mind they may be thinking something like, "Oh yes we might be disrupting four people's lives, but don't I deserve some happiness too?" What they DON'T realize is that a divorce will not affect four people --it will be a like the ever-widening wake of a nuclear bomb, affecting possibly hundreds of people!

For this step though, there will be a focus to the exposure.The loyal spouse should contact their own family (parents and siblings), the disloyal's parents and siblings, their church or place of worship, some of the loyal spouse's co-workers, some of the disloyal spouse's co-workers, the loyal spouse's employer, the disloyal spouse's co-workers, and the other person's spouse and inform them that the disloyal spouse is having an affair, that it is serious, that the marriage is in trouble, and ask for help. 

The focus and main concern here is to contact those who may be harmed by the affair, give the facts, and ask them either to support the loyal or talk to the disloyal and tell them to return to the marriage. And by the way--YES you speak to your employer so they know why you seem distracted, cry at work, and aren't as productive--and you contact the disloyal's employer because they are seriously in jeopardy of a sexual harrassment lawsuit! Their property, time, and resources are being used for unwanted sexual contact (you, as the spouse, do not want it) and they need to address it or they could be sued. And YES you contact the other person's spouse and ask, "Are you aware that my spouse is having an affair with your spouse? I have evidence... " Nothing ends an affair faster than the OP's spouse screaming and putting their foot down!
Now, your disloyal is likely to be pretty upset with you for exposing their affair:

A) Affairs are much more "fun" when they are a clandestine romantic rendezvous and not brought to the truth of being adultery! 

And B) you are trying to cut them off from the drug they are "addicted" to: the affair.

But just like you sometimes have to endure the fury of an addicted friend in an intervention--it's for their own good and the hope is that once the addiction is broken, they will see and appreciate what you did. Your marriage can survive your disloyal spouse's anger--it can not survive ongoing adultery. On the occasion is a disloyal spouse who realizes that everyone knows about their affair--and the OP's spouse screams and puts a stop to it--and the affair is killed. If this is your case, consider yourself blessed and move to the phase of recovering your marriage!! If it is not, move to step 5.


Step 5)

Carrot & Stick

In this phase you focus on two things: work on yourself to be the person you once were who attracted your spouse again AND allow your disloyal to experience the natural consequences of their choices. 

You work on yourself by eliminating the things that extinguished love between you two (like judging, angry explosions, enough is never enough) and by re-starting the things that kindled love between you two (like romantic doo-dads). You need to do BOTH...but eliminating love extinguishers is the most important of the two. 

The idea here is that the disloyal is getting some of their needs met by the Other Person but you want them to see that you do "get it" and that you are an attractive alternative able to meet their needs. The second part is about NATURAL consequences. This doesn't mean that you punish the disloyal, but rather, nope--you are not leaving the house so they can move their lover in. If the disloyal wants to be with their lover, they'll need to move out and nope the kids do not go with them. 

There is no reason for the children to leave their home, their bed, their neighborhood, their friends, their school because the disloyal is with the OP--so a natural consequence there is that the disloyal loses some time with their children. That's the cost of choosing to have an affair and what WILL happen if they choose to divorce. Allow them to experience that hurt because it will teach them faster that affairs HURT and cost A LOT!!

You should know that this step is not "long term" because no one can give and give and give forever when an affair is being rubbed in their face. Eventually the time would come for you to say, "I've done what I could to win you over and now I need to move to the next step before I lose all love for you." Sometimes a disloyal spouse sort of sits on the fence in this step because they are getting needs met by two folks.

On the occasions there are disloyal spouses whose affair just die a natural death--like the Other Person just gets sick of it and leaves them--or they begin to see the good of staying and how much leaving would hurt...and they think maybe that too much water has passed under the bridge. Periodically let your disloyal know that you would love to have them back and work on the marriage. Invite them to return. If this is your case, consider yourself blessed and move to the phase of recovering your marriage!! If it is not, move to step 6.


Step 6) 

Consequences. 

In this step you write the disloyal a letter and explain that you love them, admit the things you did to contribute to the affair, indicate what you're doing to end those things, and then say that unless they end ALL contact with the OP and never, EVER contacts the OP again, you need to end all contact with the disloyal. The idea behind this step is to give them a more realistic taste of what divorce could be like--to not have you in their life to meet ANY needs! 

They also can no longer depend on you for those little household chores, blame you for the day's events, nothing. Here are some Sample Consequences Letters For some practicalities, if you have children one of the common things a female disloyal will pull is wanting the loyal to do things "...for the children" when really it's to meet one of her needs. In the Consequences Step, it is already set up ahead of time that there is an intermediary or buffer between the disloyal and loyal spouse. This can be a person who agrees to do it...this can be a notebook that the children carry in their backpack when they go between houses... but by no means is the loyal spouse to accept phone calls or read IM's or emails.

If the disloyal calls the loyal should say something like, "Are you calling because you're ready to end the affair? Oh, you're not? Then please respect my wished for no contact until you're ready to do that. Goodbye" and hang up. All email attempts, just forward to the intermediary. Keep the focus on ending the affair and recovering marriage. Don't get caught up in arguing over secondary or trivial issues.

Undoubtedly by this point life is not going great for the disloyal as they persist in doing what they know is wrong, and so they need to have someone in their life whom they can blame for everything that's going wrong.

If the loyal spouse is the one getting the blame a) that extinguishes a lot of love for the loyal spouse and b) that give the disloyal spouse somewhere to displace the blame rather than looking at themselves and their own choices! So it is necessary for this time of no contact in order to maintain what little bit of love the loyal spouse may still have and allow the disloyal to take personal responsibility for their choices as soon as possible.

Again, in this stage there are occasionally disloyal spouses whose affair just die a natural death--the OP just gets sick of it and leaves them--or they begin to realize that a divorce would be VERY painful to them...and they think maybe that too much water has passed under the bridge. Periodically let your disloyal know that you would be willing to have them back and work on the marriage. but that at this point some substantial damage has been done. Invite them to return. If this is your case, consider yourself blessed and move to the phase of recovering your marriage!!If it is not, move to step 7.


Step 7)

Legal Separation. 

The final step that we'd recommend before divorce is a legal separation. To be blunt, many affairs die a natural death within two years, so if a loyal spouse can stall for that amount of time, there is a good chance that the disloyal spouse would at least consider returning. Thus, as a tactic that will both stall the legal process of divorce and protect both the family assets and the loyal spouse and children, we would recommend a legal separation and suggest a minimum of one year legal separation. During the legal separation, the loyal spouse should continue to work on eliminating love extinguishers and once again reclaiming love kindlers--but they can also suggest marriage counseling or begin to date the disloyal again.

The disloyal spouse may push for a "quickie" divorce in an attempt to legitimize their affair partner, but if nothing else, a legal separation will give all parties involved a chance to recover from the emotional rollercoaster and a likely chance of ending the affair. 

Once the affair is actually OVER--then it's conceivable the disloyal may still decide they would rather stay apart, but at that point with all good conscience the loyal spouse will have literally done all they could to save their marriage.


Follow the steps , start today..

best wishes.


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## cowman (Aug 12, 2010)

No I can't see what they say. She refuses to use the computer. Will only chat and email through her Ipod touch. I guess if it was complete everyday chat, I wouldn't be so concerned. But would someone really go the the extent she is going to and lie to everyday chat?? If she used a computer I could track what was being said, but with this Ipod I don't know how. Any ideas?


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## cowman (Aug 12, 2010)

And yes, we have 2 kids. Oldest goes to college this year younger is 13. Both know and have seen first hand what she has been doing. Youngest actually put me on to this latest EA. Still hopping not a physical affair.


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## cowman (Aug 12, 2010)

How can I gather evidence. Hotmail isn't crackable, I can't get stuff off Ipod. what do I do. I have done all the be the great husband stuff to the extent that our marriage has really gotten stronger. How ridicules does that sound with what is going on.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Have someone follow her.

Does she work?


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## cowman (Aug 12, 2010)

yes, she works just a few minutes down the road.


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## Wisp (Jul 17, 2010)

Cowman:

You know that she is in contact with OM, you called him and he denied contacting her,, BIG red flag and lots of lies...So you are aware of the danger to your marriage.

Keep very calm, this will take time and plan your steps. The words hurry up and wait apply, be very very patient and methodical. 

Do not get excited, mad or anything else, breath deeply , keep your emotions at bay and control the tone of your voice.

I have inserted a line of **** for the priority items

**** Check your financial status, have a plan in place ready to implement if needs be that will allow you to secure the monies and remove all credit. You do not want her using a credit card or something similar and you are responsible for it.

****Tell her once off she needs to stop all contact with the OM and evidence this to you. You require full access to her Ipod touch. *She will decline*, no fighting please, you can explain it is hurting your feelings and affecting the family,

Hunt_Brown’s extract below:-
“I'd tell her that you are struggling with the relationship, that you know you have contributed to the problems and that you want to address your part in this by going to a couples therapist and that one of the topics you need to discuss with the therapist, or right now if she won't attend, is that the behavior at issue is unacceptable, and that it has to stop, and the consequence of failing to stop could and probably would include divorce.

it's not a threat, you want to stay married, you want to save the relationship, but the price of her behavior is too high for you to pay.” 

You can play with the words but do not dilute the message that this is a threat to the stability of you marriage. I personally would leave the divorce word out for now,, perhaps something like 'negatively affect our marriage' 


If you do not recall the number you dialled then access your bill and obtain the number if they can’t do so now, activate billing so it shows you the detail. Be patient.

When you do get the number post that you have it, do not post the detail on the forum. 

There are websites that may assist in tracking the number back to a named person with addresses.

This may come in handy as one may have to make his life difficult; for all you know he may be a married man.

****Prepare a standard script with words and sentences you will use when communication to friends and family 

****Call her folks and let them know that she is in an emotional affair and having inappropriate contact with OM,
Give them enough information but not to much detail include the city visit where he stays. Let them know even the kids have noticed and are affected by this and she is disregarding her family feelings. 
Ask them to support you as you love her and wish to recover the marriage. 
Be prepared to be rebuffed – not all parents will support you, but you have done the deed.

Next gather a list of her friends, try and find their contact details or as much info as you can. Call or mail them and go through the script. They to may rebuff you do not despair. 

**** Have her work HR and Bosses contact numbers ready. Message here is if wife is doing this during work hours you may if you choose let her company know she is having an affair on company time. You will need the billing information to confirm this.

Now sadly reading between the lines I suspect whatever you do is not going to phase your wife.

You can
Assume that she does not stop
Family and friends cannot or will not help you.

You will then contact her Boss and tell him/her she is having an affair whilst on company time. Billing info is urgent here, a plus is if one can obtain OM’s name and place of work. 

If after all this has come to pass and she still continues then the phrase “The affair does not continue on the family time or dime comes to play.”

Post an update and you will be advised..


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## franklinfx (Apr 7, 2009)

cowman said:


> No I can't see what they say. She refuses to use the computer. Will only chat and email through her Ipod touch. I guess if it was complete everyday chat, I wouldn't be so concerned. But would someone really go the the extent she is going to and lie to everyday chat?? If she used a computer I could track what was being said, but with this Ipod I don't know how. Any ideas?


 Reason I asked, is because I personally chat w/ several different ladies and men ,through emails and PMs on a few different forums, somtimes theres a little flirting going on (with the gals of course) but I try to keep it clean and innocent. My wife isnt much for stimulating conversation these days, so if Im bored I strike up a conversation online I dont see the harm. The reason Im bringing this up is, sometimes these conversations get pretty interesting, it could be about anything that interests me, hunting, music, politics, and some are about relationships and even sex (just not w/ eachother) even though its innocent, you sort of get caught up in the conversation and the urge to read or respond to a message gets pretty compulsive. doesnt necessarily mean shes in love w/ the person shes talking to, you may say "then why does she want to hide it" ? well thats a good point, but be honest, do you really want your wife to know everything you say to other people in confidence? Im sure the out of town shopping trip ,in the city the guy lives in, has got ya bugged out. I feel for ya man, but dont let your mind play tricks on you either. like I said before, it dont look good, but its probably not as bad as you think. Hope it works out for you (my gramps told me once "everything happens for a reason")


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## cowman (Aug 12, 2010)

Wisp, I believe you are absolutely correct, "I suspect whatever you do is not going to phase your wife." . Sad but true.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

lol, I was thinking the same thing.


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## cowman (Aug 12, 2010)

I am the biggest fool ever... We sat in a candle lite bath last night, had a great talk, cuddled all night and this morning, in the bath she says a girlfriend of ours that she works with asked her to come over for lunch and a swim in her pool with a couple of the other girls they work with. What could be the harm in that right?? She wouldn't really lie about this being I see the girlfriend every couple of days. and it would be too easy to check?? WRONG AGAIN. I am soo dumb.. Meet wife on her break 1 hour ago to eat with her. Both all smiles and in love. How was swimming and lunch? Great she says. Then girlfriend standing in front of us and I ask her if she had a good afternoon in the pool and lunch? YES YOU got it.. We didn't have lunch. SHe wasn't with me. BUSTED. She says she just wanted some time to herself and went to town. She was in her bathing suit and everything, played me perfectly. 

Folks, we don't have extra money. We live paycheck to paycheck. How can I kick her out when she has no were to go. What do I do. I am a mess. I didn't think I could go any lower and I got kicked several times while down there.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

That's her problem. She CHOSE to cheat and harm you. Her problem.

Give her an ultimatum. Do what you say, or you help her pack. 

NOW is the time you need to stop being a doormat, ok?


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

turnera said:


> That's her problem. She CHOSE to cheat and harm you. Her problem.
> 
> Give her an ultimatum. Do what you say, or you help her pack.


Its hard to do this - and I don't think you are being a doormat - your world has changed for the worse in a hurry. You've been punched in the gut - it takes a second or two just to catch your breath.

Also, I don't think you need to rush into things. Took time to get here, will take time to get back.

How much of your finances do you control? Is the cell phone bill in your name? Consider cancelling it. Same with credit cards.

Get a new banking account and change where you deposit YOUR paychecks.

You probably can't kick her out - but try to think of things you truly have control over and start making things hard for her. Tell her you won't support her while she's involved with another man.

Any chance any of this will work?


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## Wisp (Jul 17, 2010)

“Folks, we don't have extra money. We live paycheck to paycheck. How can I kick her out when she has no were to go. What do I do. I am a mess. I didn't think I could go any lower and I got kicked several times while down there”

Again I want you to assume the worst for all things then you are not surprised when it happens.

Read my post again, draw up your plan, and follow the steps. 

The financial one is important as is the one more face to face dialog with your wife..


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

You have to get going on this. She will not stop unless you take more direct, drastic action.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You may also want to go away for a few days and really think about this. You say she has a HISTORY of seeking out other men while married to you. 

She is a SERIAL CHEATER, cowman.

Are you sure you don't deserve better than this?

Have you been to counseling to find out why you have such low self-esteem that you think you don't deserve better?


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## cowman (Aug 12, 2010)

2 years ago I made her go to her doctor to discuss her problems. Doc put her on anti depress drugs, sent her to counseling. But unfortunately a counselor is only as good as the info they are being given. Needless to say it didn't do a thing, but she loved the attention. Attention is very important to her. She was my first. 18 year old believe anything and was getting lots of sex. What more could I have wanted. Now I know I should have wanted A LOT more. I am her second husband. She had me convinced she was an abused woman, was being cheated on and every other scenario under the sun. And I sucked it up. Over the years as I aged I found all to be lies. She just thought a was a better catch.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

So maybe *you *need a better catch.


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## cowman (Aug 12, 2010)

Well this morning we mover her out to the travel trailer. Maybe not the bet solution but with our cash situation it was the best I could come up with. Her therapist is not back till Monday so we have to wait till next week to try to deal with the compulsive lying. She says she can't stop lying and dosent know why. Call mother inlaw last night. She was VERY receptive to talking about wife. Turns out they took her to counseling as an older teen because she wouldn't quit lying. Wife would only go once because they wouldn't let her get away with lying to the counselor. Longest talk ever with mom 1.5 hours. It opened my eyes a lot. Next step is counseling. Is a lying disorder treatable??


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

No.


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## Wisp (Jul 17, 2010)

No councellor can teach a person to stop lying. It is down to the person.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

IMO, lying is by far the #1, deepest, most ingrained defective trait a person can have. That's why it's so important to teach kids not to lie when they are learning who they are. Once lying becomes your WAY of dealing with things - and more importantly, _escaping your responsibilities_, it's nearly impossible to quit.


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## nice777guy (Nov 23, 2009)

Maybe its tied into some other type of compulsive behavior.

I believe that if she wants to stop, with some help, she'll have a chance.

She has to really want to work on it, but I don't think it's hopeless.


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## cowman (Aug 12, 2010)

I have a feeling she may (trying to be the most positive here) be subconsciously trying to derail our marriage so she can be free and re-live her younger days. All she needs is to be free. Well she is one step closer.


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