# Not handling this very well



## missmolly

*Public Temper Tantrum*

I have just had a public temper tantrum. The full monty - screaming, swearing and throwing things. It was a fit of hysterical rage and no one understood a word of it. . 

I have embarrassed my husband, irreparably offended 3 other people and I feel so ashamed and humiliated. I want to crawl into a hole and never come out. 

Trouble is, I don't know why I snapped. I had been feeling low about a few things for a couple of days but this?? Where did it come from? Annoying things were happening but to totally lose control and so violently?? 
To lose control in this country is to lose face. I have no face left.


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## TiggyBlue

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Have you been stressed lately?


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

A little bit
But to do what I did is so unlike me. 
And unforgivable.


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## TBT

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

I've done it a few times over the course of my life and usually it was when I stuffed my frustrations and anger.You say its so unlike you so the people close to you who really know you should be able to forgive you.You say you've lost face....are you in Hong Kong or a similar area? I hope you don't let this damage your spirit and that you realize you're only human.Maybe a little introspection will help you understand why it happened and help you find a way to release whatever you may have been repressing in a better way.Hope you feel better soon.Take care.


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## Coffee Amore

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



missmolly said:


> A little bit
> But to do what I did is so unlike me.
> And unforgivable.


Did anyone get hurt when you threw things around? Any property damage?

I don't know if it's unforgivable. Depends on what you said, but you said no one could understand you, right? 

The best thing is to give a heartfelt apology. Don't put any excuses or do the old "I'm sorry..... BUT.." A but negates whatever good apology that precedes it. Just apologize sincerely to everyone who was affected, say you've learned from the experience. Most reasonable people will accept a sincerely given apology provided no one was hurt and no serious property damage occured. If you damaged anything, offer to pay for it. 
Who knows maybe in time this will become some funny anecdote among your friends. "Remember the time missmolly really lost it?..."


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Thank you, thoughts from others really helps.
It's true that no one understood my words (not Hong Kong but another Asian country) but my actions spoke for me. 
I slapped away the hand of a gentleman who tried to comfort me (our landlord) and shoved away my sweet household help lady who tried to put her arms around me - twice. 
Damage was only to my own belongings. That shocked these people who have so little and makes me feel worse - as though I am ungrateful. I'm raving I know.
I called my husband out of an international video conference where he was speaking - screeching through his assistant to choose his job or his marriage and come home now. He came but he said it had been extremely awkward and public for him. 

I always examine my actions, sometime perhaps too closely, and I know that my wedding anniversary yesterday distressed me. We had so many congratulatory greetings from others and it was all I could do not to cry all day.


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Gosh Coffee, you made me think on that "I'm sorry ... but".
I do that. I always thought that I owed an explanation of where I was coming from. 
So if people see that as negating the apology then I am guilty of many misguided ones.


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## lilith23

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

If they were being more physical than just using words to comfort you (like using their hands to comfort you by patting or hugging), then I guess you have a friendly relationship with each other and not just complete strangers? If so, then a heartfelt sorry plus explaining why you did what you did, as well as what you were going through might be a good thing. People do feel empathy and forgive easily if we try to explain and if we really were in much stress due to life circumstances.

Once, me and my husband argued and we've got his family involved, and then when his mother came to me, I just cried and let her know all the stress I've been feeling lately and why me and my husband argued, and how I felt sorry for what happened, and she understood it all and forgave it all.

If you don't let people know how you have felt, they might misunderstand it and so they might not forgive you about it. This is not just something we do for ourselves, it's also for other people's sake, since they would have hurt feelings when things are misunderstood and unresolved.


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



lilith23 said:


> If they were being more physical than just using words to comfort you (like using their hands to comfort you by patting or hugging), then I guess you have a friendly relationship with each other and not just complete strangers? If so, then a heartfelt sorry plus explaining why you did what you did, as well as what you were going through might be a good thing. People do feel empathy and forgive easily if we try to explain and if we really were in much stress due to life circumstances.
> 
> Once, me and my husband argued and we've got his family involved, and then when his mother came to me, I just cried and let her know all the stress I've been feeling lately and why me and my husband argued, and how I felt sorry for what happened, and she understood it all and forgave it all.
> 
> If you don't let people know how you have felt, they might misunderstand it and so they might not forgive you about it. This is not just something we do for ourselves, it's also for other people's sake, since they would have hurt feelings when things are misunderstood and unresolved.


Lilith, unfortunately they do not understand English, and despite my effort, I am struggling with the very basics of the language here. And I mean basics, yes, no, please, etc. I do know the word for sorry, but on it's own I don't think it will say much. 
The local language here is so difficult that I have just about given up. 

And I do have a good superficial relationship with these people but without language it will never go to the next level.


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## humanbecoming

From what I understand of most oriental culture, physical touch is fairly taboo unless there is a strong relationship between people. If that's so, and your language skills are nil, simply looking them in the eyes, taking their hand, then casting your eyes downward as you say the words for "I'm sorry" should convey what you need.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Therapy would be good. You can figure out what the monkey on your back is doing to cause you to act in such a way, and find out how to appease it to avoid future episodes. Honestly, if you're not sure why you snapped, that's your job now...not your reputation, not apologies, not carpet sweeping...your job is to understand yourself and to build up trust in yourself. There's something about your life that you're not coming clean on when it comes to self-honesty. You need to get some help to gain insight.


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## Runs like Dog

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Rage or tears? There's a difference.


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## Tall Average Guy

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



humanbecoming said:


> From what I understand of most oriental culture, physical touch is fairly taboo unless there is a strong relationship between people. If that's so, and your language skills are nil, simply looking them in the eyes, taking their hand, then casting your eyes downward as you say the words for "I'm sorry" should convey what you need.


While a sincere apology is needed, there is a lot of work still to do after. I don't want to maek the OP feel worse, but she truly broke her husbands trust as well as possible hurt him professionally. An apology, not matter how heartfelt, will not be enough. She is going to need actions and time to get there. Counseling to figure out what triggered this would help show the steps she is taking.


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## YupItsMe

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

the word unforgivable is totally absurd. Few things fall into that category. Your meltdown isn't on of them. 

Apologize, figure out what happened and move on. 

Being humble is graceful way to live. Public meltdowns are humbling.


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## Illbehisfoolagain

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

So, you demanded that your husband pick you or his job? How on earth are you two supposed to live if he has no job? What caused you to be so insecure that you may have jeopardized his job? What will you two do to support yourselves without an income? Maybe you guys are independently wealthy and don't really need to work? Now that you have give yourself permission to behave this way, you will do it again. You are the ONLY person in this world who dictates how you behave, you have just reached a whole new level with yourself. Is it a fluke, or is it the new you? Only you have the power to decide this. You have likely lost all credibility with anyone who saw you behave this way, a very sincere apology is greatly needed, and like someone else said do NOT try to explain your actions away, thats not apologizing anyway, thats just trying to absolve yourself of any responsibility of your behavior. Own it, and then don't ever do it again!


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## YupItsMe

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



Illbehisfoolagain said:


> Now that you have give yourself permission to behave this way, you will do it again.
> 
> You have likely lost all credibility with anyone who saw you behave this way



These two comments are complete nonsense blowing what one should call a rather large regretful mistake into a fatal event. 

Gimme and the OP a breakl with this B.S. 

Anyone that cant accept a sincere apology isnt worth keeping around any way. 

No one was killed. Lighten up.


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## notperfectanymore

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

I'm sorry that happened Molly. Hats off to recognizing the problem and trying to deal with it...one obnoxios poster on this thread alread got banned.  

Recognition is 1/2 your battle. Try taking out your aggression on something else.....I blast music and clean when I get in one of those moods...or I journal....

Hugz to you...


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## Tall Average Guy

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



YupItsMe said:


> Anyone that cant accept a sincere apology isnt worth keeping around any way.
> 
> No one was killed. Lighten up.


A sincere apology does not restore the trust. Trust he had that they were a team. The next time she has something urgent and demands he takes the call, he wil think back to this. If she does not restore the trust, he may decide he needs to chose work over her.

An apology is merely the first step in repairing the damage.


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



Illbehisfoolagain said:


> So, you demanded that your husband pick you or his job? How on earth are you two supposed to live if he has no job? What caused you to be so insecure that you may have jeopardized his job? What will you two do to support yourselves without an income? Maybe you guys are independently wealthy and don't really need to work? Now that you have give yourself permission to behave this way, you will do it again. You are the ONLY person in this world who dictates how you behave, you have just reached a whole new level with yourself. Is it a fluke, or is it the new you? Only you have the power to decide this. You have likely lost all credibility with anyone who saw you behave this way, a very sincere apology is greatly needed, and like someone else said do NOT try to explain your actions away, thats not apologizing anyway, thats just trying to absolve yourself of any responsibility of your behavior. Own it, and then don't ever do it again!


Perhaps some details will give this more perspective.

My husband left early for work and failed to lock the front door. 
I was sitting in my nightwear having coffee and answering emails when 3 men walked in - this room was upstairs. 
I was unable to find out who they were or what they wanted. 
One man walked in and out of the bedrooms, pointed to the main one, then proceeded to tip the bed on its side, propping it against the wardrobe where my clothes are kept. He stacked 2 chairs and made a small hole in the ceiling.
I was acutely aware of being inadequately dressed and could find only a towel to wrap around myself. 

In the meantime, another man went outside and came back with some tools. My household help arrived, contacted the landlord and he arrived shortly afterwards. None of these people speak English. My husband communicates with the landlord in French. It became apparent that he was giving them permission to continue. In the meantime another man was opening and closing the kitchen drawers, whilst the third one disappeared up to the third floor.

I was trying to stop these people as I had a Dr's appointment that I had waited 2 weeks for. Needless to say that I missed it. 

After being repeatedly told by my husband's office that he wasn't available, I asked them to tell him that if he didn't come to the phone then I would take it that thejob was more important than his marriage. And I meant that. 

Apparently he had made arrangement with the landlord to have some repairs done and to have a ceiling fan fitted. He had not bothered to let me know any of this. Had I known, perhaps I could even have stopped them putting the fan in the wrong room. And I certainly would have dressed for the occasion and arranged it for a day when I didn't have a Dr's appointment. 

I was extremely angry and believe that I had every right to be.
My post was not about that, it was about losing control which is not my usual way of with dealing with problems. I was shocked at the extent of my rage (and yes I was also in tears throughout this) and particularly shocked at how I treated my landlord and lady helper. I have never wrenched a drawer from a repairman's hands and thrown it at him before. This is not usual behaviour for me. 

We are not wealthy but we are financially independent. Not through luck either, but careful planning for our later years. My husband came out of retirement for this job and it was conditional that he keep some balance between work and home life as he had had problems with priorities in the past. We had serious imbalance for many years.


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



Tall Average Guy said:


> A sincere apology does not restore the trust. Trust he had that they were a team. The next time she has something urgent and demands he takes the call, he wil think back to this. If she does not restore the trust, he may decide he needs to chose work over her.
> 
> An apology is merely the first step in repairing the damage.


This team member needs to be kept informed if continued co operation is wanted. 

I am not unreasonable or a monster. But I will not accept being invaded in the privacy of my home and believe that I have the right to invite people into my home after they have knocked at the door. And after I have put on a dressing gown or such.


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



notperfectanymore said:


> I'm sorry that happened Molly. Hats off to recognizing the problem and trying to deal with it...one obnoxios poster on this thread alread got banned.
> 
> Recognition is 1/2 your battle. Try taking out your aggression on something else.....I blast music and clean when I get in one of those moods...or I journal....
> 
> Hugz to you...


Wow, that must have been overnight for me and I missed it. 
I must admit that I was surprised at the responses cos I guess I was really only venting. 
I am a person who always thinks through situations and poses the 'how can I be better next time' questions so I shall certainly mull through the postings and give them thought. 

I really appreciate the input from others, even the negative ones as there is always another way of looking at things and I am far from perfect.


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



Runs like Dog said:


> Rage or tears? There's a difference.



I'm afraid it was unbridled rage with plenty of streaming tears thrown in to boot.


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## TiggyBlue

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Is it possible that you was angry at the situation and anger or emotions from past situation arised?
Sometimes anger can have a snowball effect.


There is a difference finding the cause and looking for an excuse,
finding a cause can be the first step to stopping something like this happening again. 
If missmolly didn't recognize the damage that was done and her behavior was totally inappropriate and irrational was she wouldn't be on here so why state what she already already knows and has stated, I don't see what help that's going to do.

Plus like YupItsMe said this was embarrassing and inappropriate but there's been far worst things done
and the fact people were trying to comfort you shows they realized you weren't in your usual state of mind, otherwise they would have just walked away or started to argue. A sincere apology goes along way (and I agree no but... it always makes an apology seem less sincere)


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## Coffee Amore

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



missmolly said:


> Perhaps some details will give this more perspective.
> 
> My husband left early for work and failed to lock the front door.
> I was sitting in my nightwear having coffee and answering emails when 3 men walked in - this room was upstairs.
> I was unable to find out who they were or what they wanted.
> One man walked in and out of the bedrooms, pointed to the main one, then proceeded to tip the bed on its side, propping it the wardrobe where my clothes are kept. He stacked 2 chairs and made a small hole in the ceiling.
> I was acutely aware of being inadequately dressed and could find only a towel to wrap around myself.
> 
> In the meantime, another man went outside and came back with some tools. My household help arrived, contacted the landlord and he arrived shortly afterwards. None of these people speak English. My husband communicates with the landlord in French. It became apparent that he was giving them permission to continue. In the meantime another man was opening and closing the kitchen drawers, whilst the third one disappeared up to the third floor.
> 
> I was trying to stop these people as I had a Dr's appointment that I had waited 2 weeks for. Needless to say that I missed it.
> 
> After being repeatedly told by my husband's office that he wasn't available, I asked them to tell him that if he didn't come to the phone then I would take it that thejob was more important than his marriage. And I meant that.
> 
> Apparently he had made arrangement with the landlord to have some repairs done and to have a ceiling fan fitted. He had not bothered to let me know any of this. Had I known, perhaps I could even have stopped them putting the fan in the wrong room. And I certainly would have dressed for the occasion and arranged it for a day when I didn't have a Dr's appointment.
> 
> I was extremely angry and believe that I had every right to be.
> My post was not about that, it was about losing control which is not my usual way of with dealing with problems. I was shocked at the extent of my rage (and yes I was also in tears throughout this) and particularly shocked at how I treated my landlord and lady helper. I have never wrenched a drawer from a repairman's hands and thrown it at him before. This is not usual behaviour for me.
> 
> We are not wealthy but we are financially independent. Not through luck either, but careful planning for our later years. My husband came out of retirement for this job and it was conditional that he keep some balance between work and home life as he had had problems with priorities in the past. We had serious imbalance for many years.


Thanks for the explanation. This adds much needed information. It must have been scary for you. If three strange men wandered into my home while I wasn't fully dressed, and I had no way to communicate with them AND my husband knew ahead of time but didn't say anything to me so that I would be ready...I probably would have a strong reaction. Maybe not throwing things, but definitely words would be exchanged with my spouse and the strangers. 
I don't think you need to beat yourself up over this. How often will these people come over anyway? I think the bigger issue is communication between you and your husband.


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## alte Dame

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Have to say that, given your explanation, I might have blown, too. And most people consider me pretty calm and steady.

You can apologize for the severity of your reaction, but you had a right to react, imo.


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## YupItsMe

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Its rather obvious your husband is thoughtless toward you. Please tell me he apologized for being such a thoughtless, insensitive moron for not bothering to tell you to expect foreign visitors while underdressed. I know I would not put my wife in a vulnerable position with foreign speaking workman wandering throughout our home. That is epic failure to care for your well being.


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

well none of this matters anymore. 

It's all over bar the shouting.
Apparently the love has been slipping away and now he wants out. 
He has spent the last 18 months telling me he is the happiest with me now that he has been since we were first married.
No wonder i have been feeling vaguely edgy for the last few weeks. 
35 years last week. Where to now?


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## WyshIknew

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Oh [email protected] sorry to hear that Molly.

Are you sure this isn't just two people hurting with one another right now?

It seems strange that it's the best it's been one day, and then after a big blow out 'the love is slipping away'.

FWIW I don't blame you at all for being angry about the original problem. If you had been Mrs Wysh my life would not be worth living for at least a week.

You know you have people prepared to listen on here, so talk when you feel down ok.


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

I am devastated, I can't even begin to think. 
He sounds cold and final. I have never seen him so cold.


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## WyshIknew

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Have you got friends locally?

It might do you good to talk it all out with a good friend, and yes a little weep if you feel like it.


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## alte Dame

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Is he having an affair?


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



WyshIknew said:


> Have you got friends locally?
> 
> It might do you good to talk it all out with a good friend, and yes a little weep if you feel like it.


No not really, I have never shared things of such a personal nature with others, neither here or back home. Neither of us have ,we've always been each others closest friend. Or so I thought.
This morning I have been trying to find some kind of counselor but no luck so far.


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



alte Dame said:


> Is he having an affair?


He says not (of course) and I can't see any evidence but I haven't been vigilantly looking.

I sometimes look at his email but that looks innocent. 
His laptop always travels to work with him everyday and we lock them away at night as we have been broken into a couple of times. The current one is only a few weeks old. I have never questioned why he needs the laptop at work. 
Anyway, I am not familiar with Mac and wouldn't really know what to even look for.

The mobile is always with him which I suppose could be construed as suspicious. It is kept in a belt pouch as he kept misplacing it. It is used at night as an alarm clock so is always by the bed charging. He is a very light sleeper so would waken should I look or take it to look. I was going to look whilst he was showering this morning and could kick myself for drifting off to sleep.

Last night we went to a lovely restaurant and I kept getting the feeling it was a farewell dinner. It was very pleasant and I kept myself together. However when we got back home he repeated the same things to me and when I said that I didn't think that being apart and 'having some space' would solve anything, he said that he wanted a divorce. He has NEVER said anything like this before. 

I am in such a state. Yesterday I used our only spare bed to sort out my belongings and try to get myself around leaving with my life in 2 suitcases. My visa here expires shortly and he hasn't mentioned renewing it. It is dependent on his work status. 

We are still sleeping in the same bed. During the night I woke up frequently and just couldn't stop sobbing. I feel so humiliated, particularly when I think of our somewhat one sided sex life which I believed was therapeutic due to his ED problems. I now hear that his 'lack of connection' was a large contributing factor. I REALLY believed that he was happy and just struggling with physiological problems. 

This morning he said ' stay, I can't bear to see you so unhappy' but that is just pity and I can't bear to feel so pathetic. 
How can I stay after hearing all that? 

I am so afraid to leave here. Among other things, a disease which devastated my life for 3 years has evidenced itself in the last few days. My arms were paralysed for ten months and no diagnosis was made. Perhaps it was stress induced after all. I can't even tell him as it would look as though I am trying to trap him with pity. 

I am sorry I am rambling so much. I am just so lost.
How do i start again now?


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## indiecat

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

I am so very sorry. The good people always suffer the most.

As for meltdowns, they are usually the result of years of pent up stress and frustration. 

My sister, a very calm person, had a complete melt down at the table during dinner on a very nice cruise ship. Because her husband did not buy her a rose from the vendor that was going table to table. She lost control totally. And this is not like her. Just the ongoing stress of life and marriage caused her to temporarily lose it big time. It was nothing to do with the rose of course.
Luckily her h is a patient man and he dealt with it and was compassionate with her.


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## WyshIknew

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Again Molly, sorry this is happening.

If you feel really down and are sobbing a lot can I suggest a visit to a doctor? They might be able to give you something to help, also mention your recurring problem.

I know you said you don't want pity but at least in some ways that is better than hate or contempt. It shows there are some feelings there for you.

I still think it is strange that this has occured so soon after your melt down. hopefully after all the hurt feelings from your (justified I think) tantrum things might go back to normal.

Please keep venting and talking to us, I know we are just some dudes and dudesses tapping on keyboards thousands of miles away but I think I can speak for the rest and say that we wish you well and hope you can bounce back after this.


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## alte Dame

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

I'm so sorry to hear all of this.

It sounds like this has been coming in his mind for a while & your meltdown brought it to a head for him. If that's the case, his coldness will evaporate.

I wouldn't have any interest in staying for pity either. You definitely need to talk to other people, though. The suggestions for some professional help while you get your act together to leave is a good one.


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## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Thanks everyone for your support. 
I haven't had any luck finding a counselor, only one got back to me and it was to let me know that she now specialises in children.

My husband has stopped being cold and is acting more like an affectionate uncle now. Actually kissing me on the forehead!
He says he is prepared to 'give it a go' but can't make any promises.

I guess that takes the urgency off leaving immediately (I had already bought a ticket to go home in 4 weeks time), but sure hasn't lifted the heaviness from my heart. We had a distant and sexless marriage for over ten years due to his previous 'issues' and having spent a good part of the last 18 months in what I thought was a very good place with him, I have a fair idea of how the former feels. 

But of course it's worse now because of what he has said. During that long bleak period in our marriage I believed it was all due to his ED hangups, but stayed because he always said he loved me and didn't want to be apart. 

He was emphatic on Sat night - 1. I don't love you 2. I don't want to have sex with you 3. I want to spend some time apart.

After spending months here on TAM, I certainly don't feel good about the possible reasons for any of that. 
I looked at his phone today but all but today's messages were deleted. Not sure how to feel about that. He was always commenting to me that I leave too many old messages on mine and why didn't i just delete them straight away.

He slept with his arms around me for a lot of the night. We have always slept with a lot of physical contact, even during his previous fond uncle phase. I managed to stay calm but it was a terrible night. Caressing him is as natural as combing my hair to me and it was horrid to just grit my teeth and will myself to just lie there. 
I don't think this is going to survive.


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## missmolly

I have posted this in The Ladies Lounge in my thread "Public Temper Tantrum". I am reposting here hoping for more advice or feedback. 

We are 18 months into R from his PA and I thought we were ok.
My husband has shattered me after I had a public meltdown over another issue. 

Apparently the love has been slipping away for the last weeks and now he wants out.
He has spent the last 18 months telling me he is the happiest with me now that he has been since we were first married.
No wonder I have been feeling vaguely edgy for the last few weeks.
He told me that he did not love me, did not want to have sex with me, and could not see us continuing together. 

We are living overseas and I think he wanted me to quietly slip away so that he is not the 'bad guy'.

After two days he told me that he could not bear to see me so hurt and that he was prepared to give it 'one more go, but no promises'. On the surface we are being super polite and pleasant to each other but the nights are a nightmare. He sleeps with his arms around me (as always) but I am devastated. 
I don't think we have anything left to build on. I have always loved him and despite all our problems, believed him when he said he loved me. 

35 years last week. Where to now? I had noticed his reluctance to discuss our anniversary but believed him when he said that he was super tired and hassled from a stressful workload that week. 
What hope do we have for anything if we are in different countries?


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## Bellavista

Provided he is not going to run off with one of the local women, a little time apart might give you both time to re-evaluate your relationship.
Your meltdown & the palsy you mention in your previous posts are probably due to functioning at a high level of stress. You & your H are probably both stressing each other out (my H & I do it to each other all of the time). A break may be what you need.


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## missmolly

We have constant breaks as I spend 8 weeks with him here, then I go home for 3weeks or so. We have done this now for 13 months as we still have a home back in Aus, dogs, adult kids (one with serious BPD)

I have thought of the local woman thing as they do throw themselves at western men at times. He denies anything but then again he would, wouldn't he?


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## missmolly

They really like him, I can see it all the time


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## dontpanic

missmolly, I am so sorry that you are going through your husband's emotional withdrawal. It is so painful. 

Does he see an IC or do you have an MC that you can discuss this with?

After 35 yrs I'm sure you know better than me that couples fall in-and -out of love with eachother all the time. Why is now different? Why does he want out now?


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## missmolly

I really don't know why now. I don't understand at all.
I thought we were finally putting the problems of his PA behind us.

I have had trouble finding a counselor in this country but have finally made an appointment for IC for me for next Tues, which is the earliest I could get. At the moment Tuesday seems a lifetime away. 

I am hoping that he will followup with me for couples after that.


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## Bellavista

Every other woman issue I have had with my H has been with women from the Philipines. He said he was attracted to them because they are warm & know how to flatter a man.
Just watch it if you are dealing with single Asian women, they can come on strong to Western men because they want to be rescued from their lives.
BTW, this is not directed at all Asian women, I am not being racist in any form should anyone think that.


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## missmolly

I understand the Asian women thing, I really do. 
I have become very friendly with a delightful young woman here who is the same age as my daughter. She is the live in companion of a fat, somewhat vulgar 65 year old man. 
She warns me all the time to watch out for other women. Something I always smiled at. 

But so many of them are genuinely gorgeous, and flattering and dare I say it, servile. Not to mention their waif like figures. I always feel so clumsy and inelegant. 

My husband denies any attraction or involvement, but he really loves their gentle and gracious ways. He has a huge staff, and even the 40 year olds look 20!! They all make such a fuss of him and he IS extremely kind and thoughtful with people.


----------



## missmolly

except to me earlier this week


----------



## KathyBatesel

He had an affair previously. He works around people who give him a God complex (treat him like he's somehow better or more special than we mortals are) and who are attractive and need to please him to feel most secure in their jobs.

You're battling a lot of influences here.

What needs was he trying to fill with that past affair? What does he think is lacking now? 

Are you willing and able to fill those needs?


----------



## missmolly

Kathy, you are spot on about the dynamics with the people who he works with. And he has such a kind disposition that people are drawn to him.

Re the affair - at about 50 my husband developed ED problems and he chose to withdraw rather than face and discuss it. He just completely shut down with me, emotionally and physically, and this lasted for many years. I eventually gave up trying to ‘reach’ him.
He later told me that he tried porn and masturbation, usually unsuccessfully, for a few years. Then he felt so disconnected from me that when he chose to try chemical enhancement in the form of Viagra, he could not face failure, and found a sexual partner with no strings attached, online. This was SO out of character for him.
Apparently this relationship was unemotional and sexually successful on occasions. It lasted for 7 months and ended when I discovered it.
When faced with the possibility of my marriage ending, I aggressively confronted him, particularly about the sexual issues. I SHOULD HAVE DONE THIS YEARS AGO. And because he said he loved me and was terrified that I would throw him out, he was more willing to open up to me.
When he finally saw that I was aroused by him even if he didn’t have an erection, he relaxed and accepted non threatening sexual activity. I always initiated (I don’t have a problem with that) and I would stroke him a lot which is something that I also enjoyed doing, and I didn’t care if he fell asleep. This happened on a lot of occasions and it was just pleasant physical contact. It broke down the wall that had been up for such a long time. I really love my husband and have always liked just stroking, kissing etc, not necessarily with the goal of climax. Furthermore, we were surprised to find that he could ejaculate without a full erection.
This in itself restored his confidence a bit, and he also increased his ability to accept my attention to him without the need for intercourse. We have been able to have intercourse naturally on occasions, and more so with medication which we just buy on line. We have had very satisfying oral sex.
I also removed my self from the equation somewhat by saying that this was his time in our life and not to worry about where I was at. He was able to do this when I reminded him of all the effort he had made during my time of diminished libido after childbirth. I believe that this greatly removed the stress of ‘performing’ and possible performance failure. And I really meant it, I was looking to see him contented and at peace.
He is in a position of authority and significant power in his work life. Learning to really relax, not be in charge, and just ‘receive’ was a big step for him.

As for now - I have no idea. He can't articulate anything that makes sense.

I am very willing to make reasonable effort for him.


----------



## KathyBatesel

Sounds like another woman is threatening your marriage. I'm guessing that your new and improved love life still didn't measure up physically to what he experienced with the affair, even though your emotional bond increased, and he has an opportunity to find out.

I can't say I have a good recommendation about what to do. I don't know your circumstances and certainly haven't had a marriage that endured as long as yours has. I've had to fight the "god complex" thing twice, and can tell you that giving permission to satisfy his curiosity is not a good solution. 

On the other hand, I wouldn't want to be in a relationship where I wasn't wanted and treasured, either.


----------



## missmolly

I have put considerable effort into exploring the thought of another woman hovering somewhere and just can't come up with anything. Not that I have discarded the thought at all.

I think to some extent, he is 'in love' with his job. He has had two tremendous coveted 'coups' in the last few weeks and has put in enormous time and energy. He has had so many accolades that it can't help but turn his head. Having said that, he does not seem arrogant or self important. 

I am just about ready to give up and go home. I am struggling to maintain composure in front of him and WILL NOT be a blubbering mess - except when alone.


----------



## Catherine602

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

You will have many more melt downs if you stay in this. Go home. Tell him that YOU have made a decision. 

YOU are leaving to make a life for yourself at home. He did not tell you about the repairs. He needs to apologize. At the state you were in and after all you have done for him you at lest deserve that. 

He needs to make amends for saying he does not love you because it was cruel. You don't think he needs you? 

Go home and you will see. He may not beg you to come back if he can't swallow his pride but he will feel your absence acutely. 

If he wants you back he has to admit his mistakes and make amends or don't stay with him. Start making demands. 

I think his reaction will surprise you. Not at first but when he has a chance to consider he is not the one controlling whether you stay or go. 

What you describe doing for him is the pinnacle of love and devotion.

He has been blessed abundantly but he does not realize that it could evaporate in two minutes. 

His wife goes home and his job and all of the accolades will end eventually. Then what?

You are much more substantial than the inauthentic contrived gentleness of some of the local women who sell their souls for a dime. 

Take your precious jewels (that's you) home and nurture yourself back to health and equanimity.


----------



## alte Dame

I feel very sad writing this.

I agree with the other posters who suspect the lure of other women. It sounds like your H is a kind man who does not want to hurt you. At the same time, he says he is no longer in love with you. So, he loves you, but is not in love, and wants to test the waters with someone else.

I am older, in a 30-yr. marriage & can also agree that there are ups and downs & people fall in and out of love. Your particular situation, though, has the ring of the final throes for your H. What you describe really sounds like he wants to move on, but can't bear to see you in such pain.

Do you want to stick around for that? Believe me that I get what a seismic change this is for you. I would still ask whether it wouldn't be better to absent yourself just for your own sake. I think that is what I would do.


----------



## Cosmos

I'm sorry for your pain, OP, but I really can't think that it's healthy for anyone to be in a marriage with someone who says that they are no longer in love with them. Your H has had a PA and now tells you he's no longer in love you, but stays with you because he doesn't want to hurt you?

I'm afraid I can't see any way forward in a situation like that. Your self-esteem and self-respect are going to become non-existent, and eventually it will make you ill. I know it's been 35 years, but do you really want to spend the rest of your life with a man like your H?


----------



## waiwera

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Aw missmolly I'm so sorry your going through this. 
I don't have much to offer other than to say i would go home too.
To my family and friends... 
Let him feel your absence. 

While you get your head around the past few weeks and the past few years and all that you have learnt recently.

All the best.


----------



## costa200

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



> Anyone that cant accept a sincere apology isnt worth keeping around any way.


Problem is many people consider that needing to apologize should be avoided. Apologies are cheap. Not acting like a madman/madwoman seems to be much harder.

But yes, apologies are in order.


----------



## Coffee Amore

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



costa200 said:


> Problem is many people consider that needing to apologize should be avoided. Apologies are cheap. Not acting like a madman/madwoman seems to be much harder.
> 
> But yes, apologies are in order.


Did you read the entire thread before you posted?

She had justification for why she reacted the way she did. Three foreign men entered her home while she was not fully dressed. Her husband knew these men would arrive at the home, but didn't bother to tell her ahead of time. The husband also has all the hallmarks of someone in an affair. If you read the entire thread you'll see the lack of connection and neglect. Her apology is the least of her problems.


----------



## FalconKing

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

missmolly why are you guys specifically in this country for your husbands work? Did he chose to go there? Does he speak the language? You mentioned that you guys had a sexless marriage for a while. Is he often emotionally distant and does he keep things bottled up?


----------



## Lyris

I'm very sorry to read this. I am in a 20+ year relationship and we have had ups and downs, but this sounds very serious.

You sound like you have been a loving, faithful and very committed wife. I'm sorry your husband is clearly of much weaker character.

Make sure you get everything you're entitled to. I wish there was something more hopeful to say.


----------



## dontpanic

missmolly, I am glad that you have made the first step by making an appointment with an IC. I think what I hear from you is that your husband has stopped communicating with you. This is sad and unfortunate, but it is not something that you can control. 

He doesn't want to discuss the relationship with you and he doesn't want to work on it. He just wants you (and his conflicted feelings about you) to go away...disappear...poof. As if the burden of his marriage commitment will just disappear. Whether this is due to him actually being in a new PA or just feeling guilty about not loving you and wishing he was with someone else or his being scared to share how he feels because it will "shatter" you and hurt you deeply -- it doesn't really matter. He is doing what he wants. It is up to you to figure out what you want.

You are not a doormat. After 35 years, you will not just disappear because he wants you to. 

You are a strong woman. He can't shatter you. Whether he is in your life or not, you are worthwhile. You are lucky to have had such a long and loving relationship. But within that relationship, you are a person too. A loving, valuable, real person. Not just an object of your H's guilty conscience.

He gets joy and satisfaction and ego-boosts and appreciation from his work. Where do you get joy from? How are you taking care of yourself?

Why are you letting him hug you at night when he says that he doesn't love you? Are you that desperate for the illusion of his love? Kick him out of that bed. Make him feel the consequences of his actions. No cake-eating. No "I'm not in love with you" but I can still hug you at night to assuage my guilty conscience about past PA or my desire to escape.

You are worth more than that. If you don't treat yourself with respect, why should he?

It sounds like you need to be doing the 180 big-time.

I'm not telling you to end your marriage. I'm telling you to take care of your needs because no one else will.

sending you lots of (((hugs))). i know that you can do it.


----------



## missmolly

Thanks everyone for your responses, I really appreciate it. 
Most are only reinforcing what I also think deep down. It’s just been so darned hard to do though.

Don’tpanic, I have thought a lot about what you wrote and quite agree with most of it. 
I have been thinking 180 style and following a lot of it. Funnily enough I had paid a gym membership only the day before our blow up and I have been attending daily. I am being pleasant and cheerful to the best of my ability and I do not mention the relationship unless he does first. I say my piece if he asks then move on.

Sleeping apart is something that I have thought of also, particularly after this morning when I only just stopped myself from hitting on him. I have always been EXTREMELY sexually attracted to him and sex has been a big part of the marriage in our earlier and immediate recent times. I really don’t think he would reject me but that’s not something that I am going to test. 
We have only one mattress in this house that doesn’t feel like a concrete reinforced slab. Mattresses are not going to put this country on the world map. My husband prolapsed three discs recently and we scoured the place for a proper western one and neither is terribly willing to give it up.

My IC appointment is in three days time and when my husband found out he asked if he could go also. This is a first for him as he has difficulty in receiving outside help. The counselor will not see both of us in IC and this is problematic as another English speaking one may not be possible. I am thinking that I will go once, then it can be all his. She is happy to convert to couples counseling at any time.
Neither of us speak the local language here though he is making a lot more progress than I am. His organization supports only English, and he has an interpreter when needed. 

He is oscillating again, now saying that he can’t throw away 35 years. He is almost acting as though none of this has happened. I am not.
He has looked so unwell that I encouraged him to go to the Dr. and he has had extensive investigations done this week.

We had already planned and purchased tickets for me to fly home in three weeks time, with my husband joining me ten days later for Christmas with our family. He planned to stay in Aus for 2 weeks and I was to remain for an extra 3 weeks joining him in late January. I have not purchased a return ticket

I know I am ultimately strong, it’s just taken a holiday for a few days. A week today in fact. 
Please keep the harsh stuff coming as I know I need it


----------



## Tony55

This marriage can be fixed, but he'll have to want to fix it, and that won't happen until you take control of the situation.

Missmolly, you need to jar his head back into reality, and that's achieved through confidence and determination and by removing yourself from the equation. He'll either chase you or he won't, but I'll bet he chases you.

Anything less and your feeding his confusion.

By the way, based on what you've said here, he's almost certainly involved with another woman.

T


----------



## missmolly

Tony55 said:


> This marriage can be fixed, but he'll have to want to fix it, and that won't happen until you take control of the situation.
> 
> Missmolly, you need to jar his head back into reality, and that's achieved through confidence and determination and by removing yourself from the equation. He'll either chase you or he won't, but I'll bet he chases you.
> 
> Anything less and your feeding his confusion.
> 
> By the way, based on what you've said here, he's almost certainly involved with another woman.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> T


Tony, did you mean pack up and go now or just be distant in our current setting? 
The thing is, I am enjoying my life here and have things that I really wanted to do (for myself) during the next few weeks. I think I would crumble being back home in our house alone. We had only lived in that town for 8 weeks and I don't have much of a support network there. 

Several have suggested another woman but I can't find anything to support it. I am usually fairly proud and he knows it (he claims my role in life is to keep him humble), and I told him there is nothing I would ever beg for but his honesty with this question. He looked me in the eyes and said no.
But he would, wouldn't he??


----------



## Tony55

missmolly said:


> Tony, did you mean pack up and go now or just be distant in our current setting?
> The thing is, I am enjoying my life here and have things that I really wanted to do (for myself) during the next few weeks. I think I would crumble being back home in our house alone. We had only lived in that town for 8 weeks and I don't have much of a support network there.
> 
> Several have suggested another woman but I can't find anything to support it. I am usually fairly proud and he knows it (he claims my role in life is to keep him humble), and I told him there is nothing I would ever beg for but his honesty with this question. He looked me in the eyes and said no.
> But he would, wouldn't he??


His behavior suggests he has a girlfriend, most men don't want a divorce just to be single, they usually have something waiting. Either way, the quickest way to get him to wake up is to tell him you're done with him.

I know thats the tough thing to do, and most likely you won't, but all other options are less likely to bring him around and will prolong the agony of settling this one way or the other.


----------



## missmolly

He has confessed to sexual relations with Vietnamese women. 
I loved him with all my heart.
I have endured the worst week of my life. 
I now hate him totally and absolutely
I am past being heartbroken, I now feel pure hatred.


----------



## Lyris

He deserves your hatred. Expose him to family and his workplace. Don't let him hide.


----------



## missmolly

Lyris said:


> He deserves your hatred. Expose him to family and his workplace. Don't let him hide.


believe me, I will


----------



## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

He has confessed to sexual relations with Vietnamese women.
I loved him with all my heart.
I have endured the worst week of my life.
I now hate him totally and absolutely
I am past being heartbroken, I now feel pure hatred.


----------



## Bellavista

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

I am so sorry to hear that Miss Molly.


----------



## costa200

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



Coffee Amore said:


> Did you read the entire thread before you posted?
> 
> She had justification for why she reacted the way she did. Three foreign men entered her home while she was not fully dressed. Her husband knew these men would arrive at the home, but didn't bother to tell her ahead of time. The husband also has all the hallmarks of someone in an affair. If you read the entire thread you'll see the lack of connection and neglect. Her apology is the least of her problems.


My comment was not so much about this situation itself but rather directed at the one liner i quoted. Then again, acting like an idiot with people who done nothing wrong to her only hurts her image. If she was mad at her husband then he should take the brunt of it, not innocent bystanders. 

Having said that, missmolly sorry for your problems with your husband. I hope you dump that jerk.


----------



## Bellavista

I am sorry to hear that this has happened. Please take care of yourself now, right now you need to be number one in your life.


----------



## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



costa200 said:


> My comment was not so much about this situation itself but rather directed at the one liner i quoted. Then again, acting like an idiot with people who done nothing wrong to her only hurts her image. If she was mad at her husband then he should take the brunt of it, not innocent bystanders.
> 
> Having said that, missmolly sorry for your problems with your husband. I hope you dump that jerk.


I will divorce him so fast that his head will spin.
Dr God at his work, I will shatter that illusion.


----------



## FalconKing

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



missmolly said:


> I will divorce him so fast that his head will spin.
> Dr God at his work, I will shatter that illusion.


Heaven hath no rage like love to hatred turned. Nor hell hath no fury like.......and so it goes....


----------



## Catherine602

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



missmolly said:


> He has confessed to sexual relations with Vietnamese women.
> I loved him with all my heart.
> I have endured the worst week of my life.
> I now hate him totally and absolutely
> I am past being heartbroken, I now feel pure hatred.


I am so sorry this has happened. As I said before, he will regret losing you. These fee-for-service easy women are a temporary fix to his limp sexual prowess. The fix last for the few min it takes for him to cum. How sad for him. 

Your future is bright but only if you avoid the tentacles of perennial bitterness and anger. 

He deceived you but I think you should pity him because he really deceived himself. He has succumbed to the all too easy, sickly sweet saccharin of empty pleasure to prop up his worn out body. 

This, at a time that he craves love and emotional connection. He had all of that, a precious jewel but, and he let it go to pick up coal discarded on the side of a road. 

This is very challenging transition for you but I think you are up for the challenge. You will be surrounded by love and support. 

He will be surrounded by more Vietnamese girls than he can handle. They will fawn over him while reaching into his pocket. 

Get tested for all STD's and get a good lawyer. Take a lump sum payout. You don't want to pay for his foolishness. 

I know it is not easy now but get the support you need and keep to the high road. In the end, your value will be validated. For all of the god-like status he has now he knows he is alone in the world without you. 

You loved him after all the years you were together, you shared history with him, you know his faults, his short-coming and you still loved him. You gave to him because you loved him. 

He will never have that again when he loses you. I doubt if he will find any woman who will give him so much out of pure love.


----------



## WyshIknew

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*



Catherine602 said:


> I am so sorry this has happened. As I said before, he will regret losing you. These fee-for-service easy women are a temporary fix to his limp sexual prowess. The fix last for the few min it takes for him to cum. How sad for him.
> 
> Your future is bright but only if you avoid the tentacles of perennial bitterness and anger.
> 
> He deceived you but I think you should pity him because he really deceived himself. He has succumbed to the all too easy, sickly sweet saccharin of empty pleasure to prop up his worn out body.
> 
> This, at a time that he craves love and emotional connection. He had all of that, a precious jewel but, and he let it go to pick up coal discarded on the side of a road.
> 
> This is very challenging transition for you but I think you are up for the challenge. You will be surrounded by love and support.
> 
> He will be surrounded by more Vietnamese girls than he can handle. They will fawn over him while reaching into his pocket.
> 
> Get tested for all STD's and get a good lawyer. Take a lump sum payout. You don't want to pay for his foolishness.
> 
> I know it is not easy now but get the support you need and keep to the high road. In the end, your value will be validated. For all of the god-like status he has now he knows he is alone in the world without you.
> 
> You loved him after all the years you were together, you shared history with him, you know his faults, his short-coming and you still loved him. You gave to him because you loved him.
> 
> He will never have that again when he loses you. I doubt if he will find any woman who will give him so much out of pure love.


:iagree:

Great post Catherine.

Molly, sorry this is happening but I sense a strength in you. Keep posting and venting, we are listening.


----------



## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

i have just told our eldest daughter and it was so hard. I wasn't vindictive, just honest. 
She said 'he is dead to me'.
She was the apple of his eye,


----------



## missmolly

Thanks again Catherine, again your words are wise. 
He pretty well lives a money free life and just takes 'pocket money'/
I have always handled all our finances. I'm not sure that he even knows any of our passwords. 
He told me this morning that he wants nothing, everything is mine. 
He has put that in writing in a format that he believes will stand in law. He will keep only his salary here. 
Too late to be cool. I have raged like a lunatic. I have not been a gracious rejected wife. Unfortunately the whole street would have heard.


----------



## missmolly

i have ended up with two threads running here. I didn't get back to redirect the other.


----------



## missmolly

*Re: Public Temper Tantrum*

Thank you everyone for your words of support. I really don't have any friends here. The one person I considered a friend told me last night that she doesn't like to know of people's problems cos she doesn't want to take sides. Thanks for that. 
I have ended up with two threads running with this. I started another in General Relationships and meant to redirect this one. 
The other is 'not handling this very well'. I'm really a bit confused about everything. 
My beautiful daughter has just phoned me and asked me to live with her. 
Whilst i know she values her privacy and would never lob on my kids long term, how nice to feel wanted somewhere.


----------



## Halien

I've merged a couple of threads from the OP, and moved the combined thread to Coping with Infidelity so she can get feedback from the members here. If you notice the titles of her replies, it'll help to distinguish between the two concurrent threads in the last couple of pages.

missmolly,
Just a suggestion that if you wish to provide more detail, you can add an edit of the bottom your first post to give the members a little more information of how this situation evolved. I'm so sorry for the struggle you are going through now.


----------



## DavidWYoung

Its OK, we still like you here in Germany!


----------



## OldGirl

MissMolly, I don't really have any advice to give you, Catherine602 and others have given you some wonderful advice. I just wanted to tell you how very sorry I am that this has happened to you. I hope you can get home and give your daughter a big hug soon. It's awful to have to go through this at all, but to have to go through it so far from home must be devastating.


----------



## missmolly

I finally have a ticket home and will be leaving tomorrow. 
I have not behaved well. 
Thank you again everyone for your support.


----------



## jmb123

missmolly said:


> I have posted this in The Ladies Lounge in my thread "Public Temper Tantrum". I am reposting here hoping for more advice or feedback.
> 
> We are 18 months into R from his PA and I thought we were ok.
> My husband has shattered me after I had a public meltdown over another issue.
> 
> Apparently the love has been slipping away for the last weeks and now he wants out.
> He has spent the last 18 months telling me he is the happiest with me now that he has been since we were first married.
> No wonder I have been feeling vaguely edgy for the last few weeks.
> He told me that he did not love me, did not want to have sex with me, and could not see us continuing together.
> 
> We are living overseas and I think he wanted me to quietly slip away so that he is not the 'bad guy'.
> 
> After two days he told me that he could not bear to see me so hurt and that he was prepared to give it 'one more go, but no promises'. On the surface we are being super polite and pleasant to each other but the nights are a nightmare. He sleeps with his arms around me (as always) but I am devastated.
> I don't think we have anything left to build on. I have always loved him and despite all our problems, believed him when he said he loved me.
> 
> 35 years last week. Where to now? I had noticed his reluctance to discuss our anniversary but believed him when he said that he was super tired and hassled from a stressful workload that week.
> What hope do we have for anything if we are in different countries?


Molly,stay strong!!! You live him and have spent 35 years of your life does not mean you are going to feel so low and let him treat you the way he is treating now....He is noone to give you 'Chances' to be with him and dictate the terms of your life;;;;

As for the public rage and loss of temper;;;you know when I was with STBXH, I wold often in the span of 11 years get mad and shouted uncontrollably;;;;;And he used ti against me to always separate from me and made himself look like a VICTIM;;;You know what he treated me like crap;;;Never cared for me;;;Whereas I thought we were friends and in love;;;;;Today that I have finally accepted divorce,then I realize how I wasted my 11 years of life cursing myself,feeling guilty at how I was;;;;;Where in reality all I should have done is to take care of myself and not be with him;;;

You do not have to sob or cry;;;When you finally decide to leave him and accept the separation,I can gaurantee you that he will never find the love and companionship you gave him ;it is a matter of 35b years which can never be replaced;;;;;

Perhaps he is getting a kick out of seeing you feel so sad about not wanting to leave him;;;do not let yourself be treated so badly molly;;;;please;;;;;

It will be a few months but once you stand on your own you will find a new life with no dependence on this husband of yours;;;you shall have your life;;;happy and peacful life;;;;;


And I am 100% sure by my own experience that your anger display in public is because of the extreme pain you feel inside because of this entire ordeal;;;;;;He is noone to control your life like this;;;;;


I took my life in my hand;I had lesser number of years with him but still 12 years is not very short again;;;Life is good and peaceful;;;;;

You are in prayers molly;;;I do not wnat you to cry ;;I do not want you to crave for his affection;;;you deserve love ,you do not have to beg for it;;;;;;

I pray to God and het courage when I start feeling lonely and weak;;;;Stay strong.


----------



## missmolly

jmb123 said:


> Molly,stay strong!!! You live him and have spent 35 years of your life does not mean you are going to feel so low and let him treat you the way he is treating now....He is noone to give you 'Chances' to be with him and dictate the terms of your life;;;;
> 
> As for the public rage and loss of temper;;;you know when I was with STBXH, I wold often in the span of 11 years get mad and shouted uncontrollably;;;;;And he used ti against me to always separate from me and made himself look like a VICTIM;;;You know what he treated me like crap;;;Never cared for me;;;Whereas I thought we were friends and in love;;;;;Today that I have finally accepted divorce,then I realize how I wasted my 11 years of life cursing myself,feeling guilty at how I was;;;;;Where in reality all I should have done is to take care of myself and not be with him;;;
> 
> You do not have to sob or cry;;;When you finally decide to leave him and accept the separation,I can gaurantee you that he will never find the love and companionship you gave him ;it is a matter of 35b years which can never be replaced;;;;;
> 
> Perhaps he is getting a kick out of seeing you feel so sad about not wanting to leave him;;;do not let yourself be treated so badly molly;;;;please;;;;;
> 
> It will be a few months but once you stand on your own you will find a new life with no dependence on this husband of yours;;;you shall have your life;;;happy and peacful life;;;;;
> 
> 
> And I am 100% sure by my own experience that your anger display in public is because of the extreme pain you feel inside because of this entire ordeal;;;;;;He is noone to control your life like this;;;;;
> 
> 
> I took my life in my hand;I had lesser number of years with him but still 12 years is not very short again;;;Life is good and peaceful;;;;;
> 
> You are in prayers molly;;;I do not wnat you to cry ;;I do not want you to crave for his affection;;;you deserve love ,you do not have to beg for it;;;;;;
> 
> I pray to God and het courage when I start feeling lonely and weak;;;;Stay strong.


Again, thank you to a perfect stranger for very kind support.

Leaving my 'other' home was so hard. I thought i would die boarding the plane and I screamed silently all the way home. It was the trip from hell.

I did not leave graciously. Before going I threw out every trace of me and was shocked to see that the house looked so bleak. We had thought it a lovely home. I hadn't realized that everything there, other than the furniture, came from me. Every vase, flower, ornament, picture, nick nack - I threw it all out. 

I am 'home', if I can call it that. I lived in this house and this town for only 8 weeks before we moved overseas. I have visited here a few times since. 
I do not have any friends here and have no community involvement. We commenced renovations during our 8 weeks here and it now has open walls, dangling wires blah blah blah. 

My 2 daughters have been with me for a couple of days but they are both so angry and hurt also that I was almost relieved when they left today.

I know I have to pick myself up but I haven't started that yet. I spent the day drinking brandy and recommenced smoking after FIFTEEN years. I am still such a mess and I know I sound pathetic and wallowing but tonight I don't care. 

I have an appointment with a lawyer this coming week.


----------



## missmolly

He told our daughter he could not take the fights anymore.
WTF?
What fights? I seem to have missed them
Unless of course my distress at his behaviour is considered a fight.
Why can't I flick a switch like he did?

I am so tired. Tired of everything.


----------



## OldGirl

Molly, you don't sound pathetic and wallowing to me. You sound angry and hurt, and you have every right to be. 

Be patient with yourself - it's going to take a lot of time to recover from this.


----------



## Bellavista

missmolly said:


> He told our daughter he could not take the fights anymore.
> WTF?
> What fights? I seem to have missed them
> Unless of course my distress at his behaviour is considered a fight.
> Why can't I flick a switch like he did?
> 
> I am so tired. Tired of everything.


It is funny how one spouse can remember a different reality than the other. It is a way to justify bad behaviour.

One or two disagreements become constant fights in the mind of the spouse looking for an excuse for their actions. Many years ago, when my H left us, he kept picking fights, hoping to get me to leave so I was the baddy. We both have totally different memories of this time.
I thought his leaving came out of the blue, he said he was leaving because we were unhappy together & there was no future. 
Just keep hanging in there, don't drink too much & remember, if you feel you are not coping, there is no shame in seeing the doc for help & meds.
BTW, which state are you in?


----------



## missmolly

I am in rural Vic, having moved here 2 years ago from the city in SA.
IF you can find a clinic which will take new patients, there is a 2 week wait to get into a Dr. here. My only visit here was to the most frightful Dr I have ever met. Patronising, spoke over me, finished my sentences for me and kept looking at the clock. 
I had a wonderful one in SA but she retired just as I left. 

Yes re history, all of a sudden we have had problems all along. 
Only eight weeks ago he was telling me how much he loved me and how lucky he was to have me. 3 weeks ago he encouraged me to pay a new gym membership where we were living. 

Now it wasn't working for him.


----------



## jmb123

missmolly said:


> I am in rural Vic, having moved here 2 years ago from the city in SA.
> IF you can find a clinic which will take new patients, there is a 2 week wait to get into a Dr. here. My only visit here was to the most frightful Dr I have ever met. Patronising, spoke over me, finished my sentences for me and kept looking at the clock.
> I had a wonderful one in SA but she retired just as I left.
> 
> Yes re history, all of a sudden we have had problems all along.
> Only eight weeks ago he was telling me how much he loved me and how lucky he was to have me. 3 weeks ago he encouraged me to pay a new gym membership where we were living.
> 
> Now it wasn't working for him.


Hey Molly,,

I am happy to see you have already taken the 1st step of coming away from him;I know it is very painful but it is for you to get your happiness back and you shall ,I am sure of it;

They do re-write history;let it be ;Do not even bother for a reason;There can be no reason for leaving your spouse unless the spouse is a maniac;None of us were maniacs;

In my case,we had gone for a long trip with my sister,came back ,had a bad quarrel,I came to my parents,he started singling the divorce tune;begged for 2 months and then suddenly,I had enough humiliation;I do not feel him anymore;Never want to see him also;Am focussed on living my life;

It will get better for you;make sure you go for walks and do little excercise,10 minutes meditation or prayer daily and make positive affirmations(just for your well being,ask mother nature to give you a happy and healthy life to you and your family-nothing else);It will happen;

I am getting better everyday,few days are still down but i feel good;
When you feel much hatred try to think he is just another mortal ;And start fresh with your life;;;

Do not bother ;Even if you do now,the more you treat yourself as a child who needs to be taken care of,you shall be kind to yourself;I am kind to myself and try to push away all hurtful thoughts and actions;

Love and hugs !!


----------



## alte Dame

I am guessing that you and I are close to the same age & that you are feeling much like you are in an alternate universe after so many years with your H, especially since he was hiding his secret life so well & telling you he loved you just a short time ago. I'm betting he will have his own real shock when he sees that he's left with a lot of shallowness & emptiness in his life. He'll be wanting to at least reconnect. I hope you will be strong enough by then to have found some new options for yourself in your life. All I can say is that at my age, I really want some solidity and peace. I wish that for you as well.


----------



## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> I am guessing that you and I are close to the same age & that you are feeling much like you are in an alternate universe after so many years with your H, especially since he was hiding his secret life so well & telling you he loved you just a short time ago. I'm betting he will have his own real shock when he sees that he's left with a lot of shallowness & emptiness in his life. He'll be wanting to at least reconnect. I hope you will be strong enough by then to have found some new options for yourself in your life. All I can say is that at my age, I really want some solidity and peace. I wish that for you as well.


He has phoned a couple of times and sounds rather pathetic. 
Says he has commenced antidepressants after a visit to the Dr.

We have communicated a few times for 'housekeeping' reasons - like what the hell am I meant to put in the hand mower as opposed to the ride on mower.
He is coming here in 4 weeks time to do some work on the house as we had left it in a state of semi renovated. Sounded quite hurt when I told him he wasn't welcome to join the family Christmas with my sister. 
Has again stated that I can 'have everything' so I am having that drawn up legally next week before he changes his mind. 

But still I keep hoping that i will wake up to find this all just a bad dream.


----------



## jmb123

missmolly said:


> He has phoned a couple of times and sounds rather pathetic.
> Says he has commenced antidepressants after a visit to the Dr.
> 
> We have communicated a few times for 'housekeeping' reasons - like what the hell am I meant to put in the hand mower as opposed to the ride on mower.
> He is coming here in 4 weeks time to do some work on the house as we had left it in a state of semi renovated. Sounded quite hurt when I told him he wasn't welcome to join the family Christmas with my sister.
> Has again stated that I can 'have everything' so I am having that drawn up legally next week before he changes his mind.
> 
> But still I keep hoping that i will wake up to find this all just a bad dream.


I do hope this really is a bad dream in your case...

But any way life will turn for better.It has too.

See Molly,I know its a matter of 35 years but still, I really do not want him to walk all over you and be a hindrance to your healing process;

I am sure he is going to miss you and the family a lot;But he cannot be a cake-eater to have you as a comfort whenever he needs(he will hurt you and slow your healing ),the family and the other life also;

The more you talk to him,the more you will become desperate and feel this to be like a nightmare;You have to get strong;

If things are to chnage for good,it will be all the more good if you turn into a woman who is not emotionally depedent on anybody ever;

But know that I really hope things turn out good for you;Meanwhile stay strong and please grow away from any emotional depedency on him;;

And he is not doing any favour on asking you to have anything you want;you gave him a family,daughters and 35 yeas of companionship;that is not replaceable by anything;

take care,hugs from my side...


----------



## missmolly

it continues to amaze me that total strangers can be kinder than someone who I believed in for such a long time..


----------



## missmolly

10 out of 10 for TAM
finally got the balls to admit to a 'wonderful new love'

what we all thought all along

After our financial settlement on Wed, exposure will be a pleasure


----------



## jmb123

missmolly said:


> 10 out of 10 for TAM
> finally got the balls to admit to a 'wonderful new love'
> 
> what we all thought all along
> 
> After our financial settlement on Wed, exposure will be a pleasure


Stay strong Molly however you feel;

You do not need a cheating man to be part of your life;And he had the audacity to make you cry and feel bad about yourself when in reality he is the unhappy one and lost!
Keep posting and let us know.Things will get better .


----------



## dontpanic

Missmolly, no words can express my sadness that you have to go through this horrible pain. Severing a bond of 35y seems beyond comprehension. And you didn't make up the love and the good times. It wasn't a lie. In the end, he is so weak and you are so strong. 

Please take care of yourself and remember to eat and sleep. Sending you big (((hugs))). Blessings and peace for you and your family in the year to come.


----------



## Bellavista

:iagree:

I really feel for you at this time.


----------



## missmolly

I am hanging in there but my eldest daughter is distraught. She adored him and held him in such high esteem. They were so close. 
I am heading off to our nearest big city shortly to see her and for my lawyer's appointment


----------



## jmb123

missmolly said:


> I am hanging in there but my eldest daughter is distraught. She adored him and held him in such high esteem. They were so close.
> I am heading off to our nearest big city shortly to see her and for my lawyer's appointment


Let her know ,her father's action does not define her happiness.
Also if she sees you strong,she will heal faster.
And I want you to strong and know that 'This man is not your Husband ;He is a new person'; Just think that he is someone whom you need to talk about business;

He is weak mentally and lost;
Do not beg or want him back.Let him have his dirty life;And I already know what his days are going to be like in the future;

Molly ,do keep posting and take acre of yourself;


----------



## jmb123

Catherine602 said:


> Let me guess - the "wonderful new love" is with the lucky young women who won the lottery. Many have tried but one prevailed.
> 
> He is in a fog of recaptured youth and potency. He has a woman who says she worships him and with whom he has no faults or none that she will ever reveal.
> 
> He is no longer 60's(?). He is 20 something again with his whole life ahead of him. He got someone who knows just how to feed into his need to escape getting old, and feeling less of a man.
> 
> He could be surrounded by his kids looking forward to teaching the next generation, passing on family history, deepening relationships with his kids. And his loving wife who has been at his side for so long?
> 
> He can be happy and feel loved with you and his family. In fact. so happy that he will still miss the past but not fear the future.
> 
> You see, it is not about you Miss Molly, it's his abject fear of the future and his inability to see how getting older and being happy is compatible.
> 
> He is so frightened that he is willing to hang his whole future on a woman he hardly knows, who cannot possibly know him so does not love the real him, who has an agenda to find a western male who has money.
> 
> He may find love but the odds are heavily against him. It is more likely that when he wakes up and sees what he got in exchange for his life, he will think it rather flimsy.
> 
> But that is his problem. You cant save him. He will not listen to you if your try to tell him how fraught with problems his choice is.
> 
> You have to let him go. In letting him go, you will be able to have joy and happiness in this stage of your life. It is going to take time for you but I am convinced it will happen.
> 
> Just know that his choice is not a refection of your value or the value of the 35 yrs you had together. They are precious to him too.
> 
> No, he is like the fabled Fool - "The ignorant despise what is precious only because they cannot understand it". (Aesop's Fable - The [email protected] and the Jewel) He does not know that he has the means to salve his distress right at hand!!



I totally agree to what you have said to Molly ;

Just beg to differ in one context,it is not about whether someone is western or eastern;It is about people's morality which is not dependent on where one lives in this world;And I think here we have many people from all around the world with common issues to help each other out;Its a global world and I firmly think we are all one.


----------



## jmb123

Catherine602 said:


> I was restating the facts as MissMolly gave them. It is very common for women in some countries to actively seek out western men, especially older ones to form an association.
> 
> Their aim is to get out of Oz and come to the a country with a robust economy. It's a fact. I am not besmirching the moral fortitude of any particular culture.
> 
> Other cultures have their particular moral failing but, we are talking about this posters experiences and her situation.
> 
> To that end I need to mention some realities no matter how unpleasant. Apparently, MissMolly has experienced the pursuit of her husband even in her presence.


I am not arguing over here.Let me place another fact.The EX in my case is an Indian and in a french multinational company.And in my case the OW is not an easterner but a french woman.I do not go about saying that french women ahve a tendency to come after rich Indian men.

Also I do not intend to hijack Molly's post.But istaed of focusing what the OW might me like,the fatc remains that she has been wornged by her husband;He was liable to keep her faith;And if he was a man of strong moral character no women east or west could have entered his life.Its his doing.


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## alte Dame

It's a 'wonderful new love,' but it will be a lonely one for him because he is jettisoning his family and he's not in his culture. Your children will make his decision more painful than you, just in the shame and distance he will feel.

I won't feel sorry for him, Molly, although it is pathetic.


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## missmolly

today is a bad day
how do people get through this
this woman is the same age as his CHILD
has he NO morals
he could f*#*ing ADOPT her
is it just me or is this an aberration?


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## alte Dame

I think it is an aberration. I don't think men his age with 35-year marriages do this on balance. Sorry.

I completely believe, though, that he will rue the day. If he is at all the man you thought he was, he will have to deal every waking minute with the voice in his head that says he should be deeply ashamed. This is not your standard infidelity story. Again, I'm so sorry.


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## Bellavista

Just remember, he will probably rue the day he chose this younger woman.
She will bleed him dry, she will use him for a while, to get a better life then she will mock him for being an older man who cannot keep up with her, she will then throw him over for a younger man & in the meantime, take as much as she can.
You get angry, just don't hurt yourself. When my fWH left me for a filopino woman 12 years ago I smashed all my trinkets in rage, I threw out all of our wedding photos. I do kind of regret that now, but at the time, I needed an outlet for the torrent of rage that was racing through me.
When your H comes back to help with the house, try not to be too emotional with him. I know this is hard, I threw my wedding rings at my H and then threw them over the balcony into the garden. If by some miracle, you can appear calm and collected, you will make him wonder.


----------



## missmolly

oh dear, too late
I took both rings, in front of him, and smashed them flat with a hammer. He had the nerve to ask for his flattened ring back.
I said no, it is obviously of no value to you.


----------



## missmolly

stay calm, yes well.
i sent him an email today (which of course i regret)
"it has just occurred to me that this woman is the same age as YOUR CHILD
Same as Mark and Ben
Have you completely lost your mind?? have NO morals??
you could ****ing ADOPT her.
is it just me or is this an aberration?"

now whip me everyone.

of course he has not responded


----------



## Bellavista

No need to whip you, we have all been there.


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## Catherine602

Miss Molly how are you and your daughter? Come back and let us know how you are doing.


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## missmolly

I haven't been back because I really haven't anything to add. 
I stay at this house and just kill time. 
My sister came to stay for a couple of days and that was good but she had to get back to her own family. 
My dogs pick up on the atmosphere and are very droopy and anxious. 
Fortunately I like gardening so i put in a few hours each morning.

I visited a Dr who, amongst other things said 'well you were lucky enough to have 35 fairly good years, some people get none'. Count my blessings right?
The counselor was pleasant and kind but I don't think she really said much. She gave me a sheet of paper with deep breathing and relaxation exercises on it. I might have to go further afield.

My eldest daughter still refuses any contact with her father, and the younger one still ebbs and flows between 'wanting to be there for him' and 'hating him forever'. 

I have a bit of communication with him but it is fairly business like most of the time. He arrives back here on Dec 21st for 3 weeks to try to tidy up some of the renovations which we commenced. 
I know nothing of his life.

I have 3 letters and 2 emails from the lawyer which I haven't even bothered to open. I just can't seem to get interested.

All in all, I feel like a pathetic, weak person and am waiting hopefully for the time healing factor to kick in. 

Oh, I did buy an exercise machine which I am trying to use everyday.


----------



## OldGirl

I'm so sorry, Molly. I wish I knew what to say. I don't think you're pathetic or weak.

I'm thinking of you. 
Simon & Garfunkel - Bridge over troubled water (with lyrics) - YouTube


----------



## missmolly

He mentioned reconciliation last night - ' in a general sense, but not specific to us'. WTF?
I responded
I would do a hot day crawl on my belly through a desert full of steaming camel dung before I would ask to reconcile with you. You treated me despicably, and short of physically assaulting me, you couldn’t have been lower. You know it and I know it. You get to live with that noble memory forever.

I was honest, honourable, loyal, faithful, trusting, unselfish, kind, generous, and for the most part, put your needs before mine. You don’t get to define me, I am still all of those things.


----------



## missmolly

I'm a real winner
I sent him a pathetic message the following night.


----------



## Bellavista

Been there done that. We are after all emotional beings.

Don't beat yourself up, you have had a traumatic experience.


----------



## alte Dame

How are your children reacting now to your H's behavior?


----------



## missmolly

My son is trying very hard to 'not take sides' - his words
Our eldest daughter refuses any contact at all which must be devastating to him as he adores her,
and our youngest, the one with BPD, fits the situation into whatever mood she is experiencing that day.
I continue to advise them to not completely burn their bridges.


----------



## alte Dame

"To not burn bridges..." 

That's impossible now, I think. Your H has tanked a lifetime of family life and love at age, what, 65? 

You and I are the same generation and you have my profoundest sympathy.


----------



## Louise7

I am late to this thread but I have just read all of it and what shines out of your character is strength and passion. We are similar in age and after 20 years of marriage and two kids, my ex had an affair and I booted him out the door and divorced him.

Just wanted to say that I don't regret my marriage, mainly because it gave me two of the most special people on this planet - my children.

Life will be better for you, really it will and the hurt will ease. Remember, your strength and your passion define you, nothing else.


----------



## missmolly

Thank you both, kind words always help.
Unfortunately I appear to have an untapped dark side. 
My house was a bit of a mess this morning and most of the damage appears to be to his belongings. The contents of a filing cabinet can be made to cover a lot of ground. So can a year's supply of prescription medications. Then there's a ten book PhD Thesis - now approx 10,000 pieces. Oh well, he said he didn't want anything of this life here anymore.
I think I might be entering the angry stage, more like a white rage really.


----------



## Bellavista

Yep, I smashed every knick knack we had, threw out every wedding pic I had, gave all of the stuff H left in house away & tossed my wedding rings over the balcony into the garden.
I truly wanted to cut his clothes into shreds, but I resisted. I mean, he tore my heart out & shredded it.

Anger can be cathartic if you don't injure yourself or someone else. At least I could do the grocery shopping when I was angry.

Expect to feel like you are on a roundabout, switching emotions from moment to moment. We were separated for 12 months & I was a mixed nut bag the whole time.


----------



## missmolly

the truly sad part is that we are past the point of no return.
Why can't I hate him?


----------



## WyshIknew

Perhaps because you see him as a sad pathetic person fooling around with some money grubbing little tart and you have lost all respect for him.

I know I would.

You actually sound as though you are doing a little better than a few weeks ago. I hope this is true.

As I've said before in another post lean on your daughters now, it's their time to start repaying the love and care you spent on them when they were young.


----------



## OldGirl

I agree with Wysh, you do sound better. I think it helps to get angry.

I am in no way making light of your situation, Molly, but when I read your post, I thought of this THE WAR OF THE ROSES - Trailer ( 1989 ) - YouTube

They even use the words 'past the point of no return' in the clip.


----------



## missmolly

OldGirl said:


> I agree with Wysh, you do sound better. I think it helps to get angry.
> 
> I am in no way making light of your situation, Molly, but when I read your post, I thought of this THE WAR OF THE ROSES - Trailer ( 1989 ) - YouTube
> 
> They even use the words 'past the point of no return' in the clip.


i had to smile when I read this.
Would you believe that I watched this film only days before this all started? Or rather, days before it all came out into the open. My husband said he didn't want to see it, now I wonder why that would be???


----------



## missmolly

Catherine602 said:


> Because he is too pathetic to hate. I am not saying that to make you feel good. I am pointing out what may be most likely. I have a vivid imagination and so it is fanciful.
> 
> But I write for your amusement. Sounds like you need a good story. Here we go.
> 
> I'll pose a central question - Can a young woman of a different culture with her whole life ahead of her, love and be sexually attracted to a chronically ill, impotent, 65 yo man?
> 
> Possibly, love can overcome much. Can it overcome a lack of shared values and cultural understanding, a wide gap in generational understanding, and questionable reciprocal physical attraction. Possibly.
> 
> is she experiencing the initial heady stages of love which starts with a strong physical attraction, and a vigorous sexual connection? That establishes the strong bond that carries through to the next stage of love when it takes work to stay connected.
> 
> If she never feels that strong connection and does not grow to love him, she may see him as an acquisition. A high yield bond - the investment that keeps on giving.
> 
> Maybe Men contemplating the end, try to recapture their youth and look for a woman who adore them and does not remind them of their faults and physical decline.
> 
> Can he get that from her - possibly. But what if her idea of success is to acquire a vulnerable old man, who falls for her game and serves as her path to riches and citizenship.
> 
> Their needs seem to be at odds but he may come to accept the an empty, unhappy relationship for the appearance of validation so he does not lose face.
> 
> You can't be angry because you care about him and you can see the pain he is headed for.
> 
> He has had what he needed - warmth, love and care as he ages and declines.
> 
> He had that from a woman who remembers his vigorous years, his failures and successes, and loves the core of his being.
> 
> You worry that he will grow old and live a lonely and unloved life. You are not a fool, you are exactly what you should be, the woman who was prepared to love him, no matter what.


had to love this. it made me teary the first time I read it, but after several viewings, I copied and sent it to him.

I have had a sad day. Angry was easier.
I had too many years of a kind, generous, thoughtful, attentive, loving, romantic, sexy, beautiful man to just forget it. 
He has morphed into a monster.


----------



## missmolly

Which isn't strictly true.
Last night I had the night from hell as our BPD daughter chucked a super fruity. 
I contacted him and he made every effort to talk her down. 
He has emailed me several times today, expressing his regret that he isn't here to help at this stressful time. We had always been very united in our efforts with her.


----------



## BrockLanders

missmolly said:


> the truly sad part is that we are past the point of no return.
> Why can't I hate him?


Your lack of hate isn't a character defect, it's an asset. You sound smart, intuitive and most of all spunky. You're a firecracker watching a man's flame slowly extinguish, it's not unreasonable you feel pity toward him despite what he's inflicted upon you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Louise7

Catherine602 said:


> Good golly Missmolly
> 
> I don't know what to say.
> 
> You come across as a class act. Fun, funny, smart, articulate. You have got to be a very attractive woman. Watch out world. :woohoo:
> 
> I'd like to be there when you meet the next man in your life - it would be fascinating, I am sure. When you are ready.


A class act - that's it exactly! You are in my thoughts MissMolly.


----------



## missmolly

Just failed again
I have sent a long vitriolic email pointing out a few of his shortcomings. 
I am tempted to share it but it was too awful


----------



## missmolly

Catherine, again you are right. And I already know all this. 
But I still continue to fail 
Tonight's resolution is to not contact him, to only reply as suggested. 
I just hope that I have the strength to follow through
Today our daughter (his special one) posted a couple of photos of herself at a friend's wedding on FB. She is beautiful. In one she had make up on and looked exquisite. One taken on the following day, showed dark circles under her eyes, and such pain in her eyes. She is the one refusing all contact with him.
I could not resist asking him to look at the pictures, and his response to me was pitiful.
But I will continue to try to follow your wise advise, and be as distant as possible. Keep nagging me please.


----------



## Catherine602

Don't worry I will. You will find it hard to do at first but keep reminding yourself that you are making it easy for him by showing your anger and hurt. You're helping him - he can offload his self loathing on to you. Resist the desire to help him to hurt you. 

I think i can guess what happened to your husband. I think the abrupt change in him was brought about by the seduction of the adoration of people he works with and contact with all those seductive women. it is like opium to westerners. 

He accends into a cloud of happy hormones and believes the empty sickly sweet seduction. He cant resist the drug and he will give up everything to get his fix. . He will come down to earth with the worse headache ever. 

He will come down in his own time nothing you say or do will convince him. He is addicted to the situation. I have to add that coming home and facing the mess he made will make him long to go back and get a fix. Don't be surprised or hurt that seeing you and the family makes him want to escape his life. Remember he is addicted. 

This will have to run its course at its own speed. He may never be the same man you knew. Please get as much support as you can. 

I think you will eventually actually be happy with your new life and remember the old one with fondness . This is a stage for you too. This is an opportunity to grow and surprise yourself and everyone who knows you!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## FalconKing

Missmolly I really wish I could give you a hug or something. Few people would be so selfless and patient in a marriage. I think you did a really great job as a wife. You gave your husband the best years of his life. I know how much you are hurting right now. I don't know where I was going with this. I just wanted to say i'm sorry and I feel your pain.


----------



## Paladin

Hey MM, hope you are doing ok when reading this. I've not posted outside your other thread, but couldn't sleep tonight and had a thought cross my mind that I wanted to share. If memory serves, you said there is a computer that he keeps disassembled there at the house. Have you ever gone to a shooting range? Computers look very cool when being struck by large caliber rounds. Shooting ranges are a great way to relive both stress and anger. Once you are done, you can collect the left overs and put them back in whatever box/drawer he kept it in. Hope you smiled. 

-P


----------



## missmolly

I'm thinking more along the lines of using his head as a target. 
Which is untrue, I am just so horribly unhappy

Catherine, I haven't failed today.


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## alte Dame

As you get older, you note that younger people assume that you will have the mindset of an older person. Of course, this mindset is in the heads of the younger people, not the older ones. They think that you should actually feel as old as you are, as old as you look. But that's not what happens usually. If you still have your health, you actually don't feel old in your head. And so, your H acts out as if he's much younger than he actually is & people see it from the outside and call him an old fool, but, no matter - he feels young in his head. The thing is, the young thing that he has cheated on you with sees him through her two-dimensional young person's glasses. She knows he's old. She knows this isn't her future. She knows this isn't real love for her.

And you, miss molly, are young in your head, too. You have decades ahead of you in which you can live well. Your H has wounded you irreparably, but your life is far from over. Just because we're older doesn't mean we're done.


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## missmolly

FalconKing said:


> Missmolly I really wish I could give you a hug or something. Few people would be so selfless and patient in a marriage. I think you did a really great job as a wife. You gave your husband the best years of his life. I know how much you are hurting right now. I don't know where I was going with this. I just wanted to say i'm sorry and I feel your pain.


A hug you say? Mmmm yes please. That would work for me.
Thank you


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## WyshIknew

MissMolly, just for you.


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## Catherine602

Are you in contact with good and true friends? This is a time that you will need to call on a cadre of sincere friends. 

Let them know at the outset what you need and that you don't expect them to have any answers for you or to take away the pain. 

You just need to know that they are there and will be there when you get happy again.

I don't know what to tell you about the pain and confusion. I had one devestating event occur when I was 15 yo that delt with betrayal. I felt as if I would never be happy again. 

But I recovered and I thrived. I don't know if you are spiritual and believe there is a higher spirit that we can call upon. I know people get annoyed when they get preached at but I am not doing that. 

I am sharing my experiences in the hope that by doing so, I can help relieve your suffering. 

I have had my prayers answered. They were specific and detailed requests. The answer did not come in the way that I expected but in the best ways possible. 

If your mind goes in the direction of prayer then make your request specific and believe. If you cannot have exactly what you want, you will get something better. 

Aside from that, when you break down, don't view it as a misstep but as a momentary diversion which can easily be righted. 

You have been married for over 30 yrs. You can't turn off feelings of love and caring like a switch. It is a process to detach and look to a new and vibrant life. 

You think that 65yo women cannot recover from a betrayal from a partner of 30 yrs duration? I have 2 feisty aunts who will tell you differently. 

It's all in the attitude. If you think you can do it you will. Other people may not succeed because they don't believe. You don't have to be one of them.

Just believe, mighty MissMolly - good golly you can't lose if you can turn a boring PhD dissertation into confetti worthy of a fest! That's a miracle gurl - where's the wine?


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## Zing

I was drawn here after reading your comment in another thread...

Btw, very nice words catherine....also to add...
Wrt to your 'feelings' to get back at him miss molly - remember it this way...
Everytime you send him a lashing email...it shows him that he still has that power over you...and that is not something you want to give to him...he might be trying to act noble by stating that he wants to give up all of his earthly possessions to you as he's found true love... but he will wake up out of this mess one day... and that day you want him to remember you in good light - as the lady who stood strong...whether it was beside him or AGAINST him...

However, at this point your emails would not be rousing the right kind of reactions conducive to this divorce... (I'm guessing you are divorcing...)

Think of this scenario - Imagine a man you don't wish to be around (even if he's the one who's been wronged)....imagine you don't want to do much with him...don't want to see him or interact with him...however, he's not able to come to terms with it... so, imagine him constantly lashing back at you through emails.. imagine him trying to provoke reactions out of you...showing you pictures of what you had and what could have been...belittling you... 
Now, how would you feel about such a person? Empathy? No...only more reason to stay away from him and be drawn to other lovers...However if this same man was stern/firm and yet calm/cool & distant... imagine the reactions to that...

I know you mention you've always been calm and are now coming out of your shell and feel explosive now... is there anything you can do to channel your negative energy...voluntary work? Zumba? exercise? whatever it is - let it be group activities so that way you have more distraction and company...

When I've been at my lowest I tend to try to look at people who've suffered more than I am and that helps me recuperate...


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## Zing

Also...please please you say you'd quit smoking 15 years ago...I know life feels dreadful now...but, now's not the time to start...

Please don't think I'm trying to act preachy - I might not have the right to say so...if anything, I might only be your daughter's age... the only reason I do is cos I've seen how much of a battle my brother's had with trying to give it up (he still hasn't and he wants to before they start trying for a baby...so, they still haven't been able to start trying)...

In fact now's the very time you want to show you have control over your life... now's the time you want to work towards being healthy ...infact healthier than before... 

And smoking = not conducive to healthy 

I've seen how some of my friends became agitated between smokes... could it be that this could also be provoking your temper (maybe even a teeny bit)???

You sound like a wonderful woman I'm sure you'll get out of this mess...just hoping you'll also get out of this mess healthier (emotionally, mentally and physically)
Best of luck to you *hugs*


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## missmolly

Thanks again everyone for your kind words of support. 
I really get the NC bit and am getting much better at it.
Have also seen a Dr and am commencing a quit smoking programme. 

Unfortunately, my crappy husband arrives here in about 6 hours time and will be around for 3 weeks. We have a partially renovated house, and greatly entangled finances to sort out. 

Oh, and here's a laugh. He now thinks that he has 'made stupid choices', has 'ruined' everything etc etc. 
I am even receiving progress reports for his trip (as in the past)
I am at the airport.
I am about to board.
Have arrived in Singapore and will be leaving here in an hour.
Will text you when I land. 

Will I meet him? Get real. NO He can find a bus or a donkey or something.

I will do my utmost to remain calm, even if it kills me.
All I am feeling is disgust, repulsion, and scorn.

Will anyone write to me in jail if I fail the calm bit??


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## Zing

Now would be your real test.... I can only imagine how uncomfortable it must be for the three weeks he'll be with you...

and wow the results seem to be back quite soon...he already thinks he's done a mistake... 

Btw, I actually SMILED when I read about your quit smoking program... 

Every time you feel like reacting to him just remember this 'By doing so I'm giving him power over me...and I'm more worthy than that' Just keep repeating that mantra...
Something tells me he's going to try to be more concerned...more caring...more empathetic...more supportive...maybe even more affectionate when he comes...

If and when he does so, just walk away... don't retaliate... master the art of becoming the 'ice queen' ...
I'm not saying you shouldn't feel hurt and should keep everything bottled up...let it out when you are alone...just don't show him your vulnerable side...he hasn't earned the right to see it any more...he saw it for a few weeks and didn't really be empathetic/remorseful...in fact, he used it against you... i.e. told your daughters you had a bad marriage because of the arguments...

Disgust & repulsion, I'm guessing are expected emotions to feel at this stage...you will eventually reach a point where whatever he does good/bad would never rouse any emotions in you...that you are 'beyond caring' ... people here say that is the point when you are truly over him...it will take time... but you will get there... 



missmolly said:


> Will anyone write to me in jail if I fail the calm bit??


No we wouldn't...
because you will come out of this test with flying colours...
Good luck...


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## alte Dame

Good luck, missmolly - made bad choices, ruined things - indeed. Reality is a b!tch.

(I have hesitated on this thread to say the obvious, which is that this man who is heading into his golden years will rue his impulsive choices. The odds are heavily against his doing anything else. Heavily against.)


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## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> Good luck, missmolly - made bad choices, ruined things - indeed. Reality is a b!tch.
> 
> (I have hesitated on this thread to say the obvious, which is that this man who is heading into his golden years will rue his impulsive choices. The odds are heavily against his doing anything else. Heavily against.)


he has already indicated that he realizes that he will die in 'self inflicted misery'
I ignored that


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## OldGirl

missmolly said:


> Thanks again everyone for your kind words of support.
> I really get the NC bit and am getting much better at it.
> *Have also seen a Dr and am commencing a quit smoking programme.*
> 
> *Unfortunately, my crappy husband arrives here in about 6 hours time and will be around for 3 weeks. * We have a partially renovated house, and greatly entangled finances to sort out.
> 
> Oh, and here's a laugh. He now thinks that he has 'made stupid choices', has 'ruined' everything etc etc.
> I am even receiving progress reports for his trip (as in the past)
> I am at the airport.
> I am about to board.
> Have arrived in Singapore and will be leaving here in an hour.
> Will text you when I land.
> 
> *Will I meet him? Get real. NO He can find a bus or a donkey or something.*
> 
> I will do my utmost to remain calm, even if it kills me.
> All I am feeling is disgust, repulsion, and scorn.
> 
> Will anyone write to me in jail if I fail the calm bit??


Molly, I love your sense of humor, and I'm glad to hear that you're giving up smoking. He's not going to be staying at your house for that 3 weeks, is he?


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## missmolly

unfortunately, yes
but the house has two 'wings'
and he will certainly be self catering
I have made sure that the fridge is EMPTY


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## Zing

missmolly said:


> he has already indicated that he realizes that he will die in 'self inflicted misery'
> I ignored that


He said he wanted to divorce you and that he had found wonderful new love... 
and within few weeks he's realized that he will die in self inflicted misery? 

I'm guessing this is even sooner than most of us expected...was he supposedly 'in love' when he told you all this over phone... or was he just reporting on past events as to why he wanted a divorce? 

Or did he just realize this because he'd had to come to terms with how difficult it is assemble a lawn mower?


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## missmolly

Zing said:


> He said he wanted to divorce you and that he had found wonderful new love...
> and within few weeks he's realized that he will die in self inflicted misery?
> 
> I'm guessing this is even sooner than most of us expected...was he supposedly 'in love' when he told you all this over phone... or was he just reporting on past events as to why he wanted a divorce?
> 
> Or did he just realize this because he'd had to come to terms with how difficult it is assemble a lawn mower?


He has never raised the topic of divorce
I did a couple of times earlier on, then said 'if you want one, you get it'
I have been pursuing a financial settlement only.


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## Catherine602

missmolly said:


> Thanks again everyone for your kind words of support.
> I really get the NC bit and am getting much better at it.
> Have also seen a Dr and am commencing a quit smoking programme.
> 
> Unfortunately, my crappy husband arrives here in about 6 hours time and will be around for 3 weeks. We have a partially renovated house, and greatly entangled finances to sort out.
> 
> Oh, and here's a laugh. He now thinks that he has 'made stupid choices', has 'ruined' everything etc etc.
> I am even receiving progress reports for his trip (as in the past)
> I am at the airport.
> I am about to board.
> Have arrived in Singapore and will be leaving here in an hour.
> Will text you when I land.
> 
> Will I meet him? Get real. NO He can find a bus or a donkey or something.
> 
> I will do my utmost to remain calm, even if it kills me.
> All I am feeling is disgust, repulsion, and scorn.
> 
> Will anyone write to me in jail if I fail the calm bit??


I'll bake a cake with a file in it and send it to you. 

Assistance for remaining calm. I have two ideas for yoyr consideration about his self serving self - flagellation and cryptic feelers that suggest R. 

The ambiguous hints that he is rethinking things and wants R.

He probably has no intention of R with you. He needs you but he is addicted to her. He needs you to be able to keep the girl.

You provide the security and emotional suport that he needs to maintain the facade of manliness and confidence for her. 

He has had time to be alone with her without you to comfort him. He has depended on her to meet all of his needs. How well do you think she is doing? She expects material things and use of his power to get her what she wants.

He has probably discovered that she does not really care for him. He may have revealed cracks in his amour and her reaction was not favorable. 

he is giving you a blow by blow to draw you in. 

The expression of regret - naa. Again an attempt to draw you in. You stopped the conflict with him so he has nowhere to offload the guilt. He needs you to beat him up so he can blame you for his betrayal. He then goes back to wonderland in three weeks, obsolved of guilt - he may reason that he was pushed away by you so it is your fault not his. 

DON'T YOU DARE LET HIM OFFLOAD guilt ONTO YOU BY BEATING HIM UP. 

Remain cool and calm. Just think of how much he needs your rath to be able to return to the girl with a sense of righteousness. 

Try to stay away from him. He will pull out all the stops to get your attention. He may give you hints that he is thinking about R to see if he still has his back up plan, you.

Don't fall for it. If he wanted R he would not hint but would drop the gig in Asia and come home to you. He has no intention of doing that. He is too far gone. 

I believe that he does know that his dreams of bliss with an adoring young girl who brings back his youthful vigor are foolish. Sadly, he is too weak to stop. 

Expect him to escalate to get a rise our of you. 

If he wants the fantasy with her, he has to be all in, alone.

Be cool. Stay away from him. Let him sink on his own.


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## OldGirl

Hey Molly, how are you doing? I've been thinking about you.


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## Catherine602

^^^ me too ^^^


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## missmolly

Hi everyone, here’s an update for this weird time. For those who know my story, the saga continues.
I relented and met the train and after a nailbiting 20 mins, the train arrived late. 
I was so uptight and feared being an emotional wreck but this didn’t happen. I was an OR nurse and worked in acute trauma. I would often look around the theatre during critical situations and realize that I was the calmest person in the room. Well this kicked in for me and you would have been proud of how cool I have been. Not a cross word has been exchanged and it has been strangely quietand peaceful here.
My husband met me in tears, and spent the first day or so, unable to really look me in the eye. I stared him down when he did. Within an hour of getting here, and after an all-night flight, he commenced work and by late that evening he had dismantled some walls and rebuilt one. 
He has apologized to me many times per day and this continues. He has ‘taken back’ all the awful things that he said to me, and tells me that he loves me. I reply that I no longer care for him that way.
He moved out of our house and into an apartment shortly after I left, and has had the OW living with him for 12 days. He said that of all the stupid mistakes he has made, this is the greatest one. He admitted this to me before he left to return here, and I replied that I hoped that he would be locking up my half of all our possessions there because anyone could be drifting in and out during his absence. This worried him and he locked as much as possible in an empty bedroom. 
We sat down on the second night to sort out our financial situation and after a while we both said it was just too hard. We drank a lot of wine (more on this later) and tossed around the idea of a ‘living arrangement’ that wouldn’t ruin us both financially. I sarcastically wrote out a list of my expectations and surprisingly he has agreed to them all. I have not indicated that I am prepared to undertake this, but I now realize that he thinks that I have agreed to it.
Now it’s time to call Bandit, and get out the 2 x 4’s. On the wine night previously mentioned, I slept with him. I woke up at 4am, saw him next to me and promptly threw up. I was so disgusted and ashamed of myself that I packed up and went to my sister’s place for 2 days, leaving him alone for Christmas. He says that I hit on him. 
Since I returned here, it has been pleasant and he continues to work hard. 
He has withdrawn his continuation of contract, but has to see out another 12 weeks or face a huge financial penalty. He has sent an email to OW setting out his doubts and the need to talk on his return. He even asked for my input for this email!!!! Get real. He is afraid to ‘evict’ in his absence as he could be cleaned out. I can see his emails but he does not know this. 
As for me, well I seem to have adopted a ‘don’t care about anything’ attitude. I rarely think of our ‘situation’ and just live day by day. I fear a little for his state of mind, and I play with that. I now sleep with him every night and he is forbidden to touch me. I touch him wherever or however I wish and I know this man, it’s doing his head in. I have turned into a shameless ***** and I am not losing sleep over it.

I am ready to accept my beatings from you.


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## Catherine602

I for one can not fault one thing that you have done. To me, you are in a perfect place. True balance, true love. Miss Molly thank you. Thank you for showing me what love does even in the face of unbelievable betrayal. You are not weak or a **** - you love the way few people do - deeply, strongly and enduringly. 

Please keep doing exactly what you feel is best. You instincts are flawless. 

30 yrs of marriage to a man who obviously loved you does not disintegrate after even the most severe blow. A marriage like yours is like a large imposing well armored ship. It can take the hits that would sink a fragile vessel. You are too smart to scuttle your ship. 

Thank you for posting. I wish the very best for you, your husband and all your family. 

Sometimes we need to experience loss before we appreciate our gifts. Your husband lucked out in the wife department. He does not realize how lucky he is. It is understandable, his experience of marriage is with this absolutely stunning, emotionally grounded and loving woman. 

He may have had the impression that he could get another one like you. He did not know that our Miss Molly is a one in a lifetime kind of woman. 

If you both decide to R and I think you will, your connection will probably be even stronger than before this unfortunate affair. He looked into the abyss and it was not pretty. 

Your husband seems to be no fool, he is troubled and confused. It will take you some time to recover fully from his and to trust him if you do R. But I think your reward will be a man who has wised up and falls madly in love with you all over again. This time he will appreciates you. Make sure he shows it. 

He will be very devoted if he is sincere. Make him work hard to get you back. Don't reassure him until he does all of the heavy lifting. He has to realize that he could lose you and be left with the likes of this girl or others of her ilk.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## missmolly

Catherine, I must tell you 
I copied and pasted one of your long postings into an email to my husband some time ago. 
He told me that he read and reread it - every day.


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## Catherine602

Ekkkk I hope it was not one of the really mean ones. 

Thank you for sharing that with me. It is very important to me because of my history. My father cheated on my mom from year 2 of their marriage until he died almost 20 yrs latter. 

When I was a child, I wanted so badly to take away her pain. Of course, there was nothing I could do but to endure with her. If parts of what I wrote helped your husband to wake up, I feel gratified. Thank you Miss Molly 

Keep up your health and psyche. I am sure you know that you are not likely to come back together in a strait line, happy-ever-after way. There will most likely be lots of anger pain and confusion to get through if you chose to R. Please let us know how you are doing, if you can.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## alte Dame

Your H is cake eating to the nth degree & you seem to be OK with that. I'm sorry for all this miss molly, I truly am. I can't imagine how hard this is after 35 years. I think you're enabling his confusion, dysfunction, and bad behavior, though. I know you can't help it - love and lifetime habit don't just go away - but I think you will regret it because he will go back to work and likely back to her or someone else, at least until he makes his way through his own very dense fog.


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## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> Your H is cake eating to the nth degree & you seem to be OK with that. I'm sorry for all this miss molly, I truly am. I can't imagine how hard this is after 35 years. I think you're enabling his confusion, dysfunction, and bad behavior, though. I know you can't help it - love and lifetime habit don't just go away - but I think you will regret it because he will go back to work and likely back to her or someone else, at least until he makes his way through his own very dense fog.


Believe me, I have thought about this. 
I told him this morning to risk losing all and end it before he goes back or our deal is off. 
He has also asked me to go back with him for the last 12 weeks. 
I am still not sure what I want to do. 
I am booked for minor surgery the day after he leaves and will not cancel this. 
I DO know that I don't want to spend the rest of my life wondering what is happening behind my back, and he has yet to prove to me that it is worth another go. 
One day at a time.


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## MattMatt

No need for 2x4s. Things happen.

However, no matter what else you have said to your husband this, surely, must send him some sort of a message?


> On the wine night previously mentioned, I slept with him. I woke up at 4am, saw him next to me *and promptly threw up*.


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## alte Dame

I confess to not understanding all of these details. Has he disavowed the OW completely now? Has he declared that he has made a terrible mistake, that he is sorry & wants you back?

What I understood was that he admitted to sex with a number of other women, said terrible things to you, including that he didn't love you. He wanted a divorce, he said, so you left to try to salvage your life, after which he said that he had found a 'wonderful new love' whom he moved in with.

And now he comes to you for the holidays and...? What exactly? He seems to be regretting much of his behavior, but where exactly does he stand? And where do you stand?


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## missmolly

There was only one woman involved. He said at the time that he did not want to be married any more. I told him that if he wanted a divorce then he could get it and pay for it, and it hasn't been mentioned since. 

He came back here as our house needed a lot of work on it to prepare for sale. I told him I would not do it or organize it. 

Not long before returning, he told me that he had made the biggest mistake of his life. At the time, I said 'bad luck'.

Since returning we have discussed a lot of options for the future. 
He wants R, but I remain very undecided. He continually apologizes and I don't say much. 
I wrote out a list of conditions and he has agreed to all of them. These include ending the relationship (they have lived together for 12 days),and him returning home permanently as soon as can be done without incurring too much penalty. To break the remainder of the current contract (12 weeks), would incur a $30K loss and there is no getting out of it. We have had a legal opinion on this and it is enforceable internationally.
I waver between it's a waste of time, maybe, and I don't know. 
My last posting gives a little more detail. 
I suppose I have been confusing in what I have written. I mostly write in the middle of the night when I cannot sleep.


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## Catherine602

missmolly said:


> Believe me, I have thought about this.
> I told him this morning to risk losing all and end it before he goes back or our deal is off.
> He has also asked me to go back with him for the last 12 weeks.
> I am still not sure what I want to do.
> I am booked for minor surgery the day after he leaves and will not cancel this.
> I DO know that I don't want to spend the rest of my life wondering what is happening behind my back, and he has yet to prove to me that it is worth another go.
> One day at a time.


I wondered if he would want you to travel back with him. I think this is a very good sign. 

The fact that he wanted to get out of the contract which is a NC attempt is also a good sign. He cant get out but, he wants you there with him.

I don't see anything that indicates that he is not sincere about R. Of course, time will tell. 

Have you been able to tell what he needs to do to prove that it is worth giving him this chance?

I see one thing - -- 35 yrs of a good loving husband. Yes, he [email protected] up badly but I can kind of imagine what happened. 

I am not giving him a pass by any means. Consider that in this society, the pursuit of men with assets is a well practiced sport in some circles. 

They pick their target well - the most vulnerable men, stroke his ego, get him addicted to over-the-top praise and veneration. 

So far he has done nothing wrong. He enjoys the pleasant feelings. Then he is presented with the lovely maiden who mirrors the adoration and offers him sex to boot. 

This is a clever escalation. He is already bathing in the pleasantries of being treated like a king. 

The ruse is probably so relentless that before he knows it, he is thinking with his little brain. By that time, he is being reeled in. 

I doubt that he sought this out. Can you consider that in your deliberations? 

There are no guarantees but so much is at stake and the odds seem to be in your favor. 

Find out as much as you can about this game. They probably have ways to deal with men who hesitate and want to get back with their wives. 

Find out what she is likely to do and be ready. Tell him what you find out, knowledge is power. The 12 weeks are likely to be very difficult for both of you if you decide to go with him. 

I also think that you don't have to commit to R till you see how it goes when you go back. Separating out the two processes, R and going back, may help to unconfuse your head. Tell him the same. 

Discuss what happened when you are ready. See if he describes something similar to my guess.


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## Bellavista

In the end, Miss Molly, only you can know what you can deal with.

If you feel your H is truly remorseful & you can live with what he has done, then you can go on to have a stronger marriage for the rest of your lives together.

I do think that if you do decide to reconcile & give the marriage a go, you need to go back with him & stake your claim as it were. You could always travel back a couple of days after him, once you have recuperated from your op.

The other thing to do, is to work through the issues of how you ended up where you are now and what has happened in the past.

I wish you the best in whatever decision you make, just know that you have to think of yourself & your emotional health first, before your family or H.


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## alte Dame

So, the dispassionate view is that your H became infatuated with another woman and threw you under the bus while in thrall to his passion. It was short-lived, though, and he quickly realized that and is now very contrite and wants things to go back to the way they were. (??)

So, the question now appears to be how much damage he has done to your relationship, to you and your family.

You know that you have won the emotional battle. He seems to have woken from his dream and recognizes what he values and stands to lose. In doing what he has done, however, he has hurt you terribly. He betrayed you. How do you feel about his infidelity, the words he used? Can you get past them?

If I were in your shoes, with all this history, I believe I would try very hard to reconcile & trying to process and forgive the betrayals would be difficult. I think I would try nonetheless. There would be two major stumbling blocks - the pain of the betrayal itself (that he's believed himself in love with another woman and has been having sex with her and actually set up housekeeping with her) & the fact that the trust was destroyed. Your H developed his new love in secret and lied to you. Once it was exposed to the light of day, he had second thoughts. These things would be very difficult.

How do you feel now about all of this? It sounds like your feelings are all over the place & rightly so. Are they settling down at all?


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## missmolly

no, not settling down at all 
today I can't do it, I feel something is very wrong.


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## alte Dame

missmolly said:


> no, not settling down at all
> today I can't do it, I feel something is very wrong.


In what way, mm? Do you think his overtures are insincere? Or that you can't go back? Is it confusion or reality setting in?


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## FalconKing

missmolly said:


> no, not settling down at all
> today I can't do it, I feel something is very wrong.


missmolly these feelings will come and go. Some days you will be ok and other days you will just feel a panic and be sick to your stomach. You will be weak and you will be strong. It's normal and it's human. Just take it a day at a time and just decide what you can live with and how do you want the rest of your life to be. This decision making can be anywhere from a few weeks to some months. Time helps to decide all things. Just give it that.


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## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> In what way, mm? Do you think his overtures are insincere? Or that you can't go back? Is it confusion or reality setting in?


It's a bit of all the above and more. 
As I write now, he is sitting opposite me writing 'the email'.
He sat for a long time, making no progress, then eventually confessed that he did not know what to write. 
I asked, somewhat sarcastically, if he would like my help with this and he said yes. 
I would like a dollar for every thought that I suppressed. 
I eventually made some suggestions, primarily with the view that no one needs to be made to feel like trash, and this could be done without that. 
i have come to realize that he has great emotional attachment to this woman and ending it is difficult for him. She's probably quite a nice person, I can't imagine him picking some cheap tarty sort of woman.
Unfortunately this email is in a language that I can't read. 
Our daughter phoned a while ago and said that whilst she would support any decision we made, not to forget that there are plenty of other fish in the sea. I love this girl. 
I no longer look at him with great love. I feel affection for him and enough of it to not want him to be unhappy. 
Our connection is not strong, in fact it feels very flimsy to me. 
I am starting to think of this as a living arrangement, rather than a relationship. Is this enough? If I was 10 years younger I would probably say no. 
I am nearly 65. He is in poor health -he looks frightful and that is through the eyes of a registered nurse with many years experience. I honestly believe that he is not long for this world.

I still see red flags.


----------



## alte Dame

It sounds like you have a perfect storm of emotion happening right now.

You are so horribly hurt, but strangely vindicated. You want to grab on to a reestablishment of the comforts and love you've known for 35 years, but the truth of these last months won't and can't go away. It's true that 'there's no fool like an old fool' and you feel pity for your H. What a mess he has made for himself, and what really should you do for yourself and for him?

He has changed your whole calculus and this is forever because he can't turn the clock back. You can probably recover much of your old feeling, but what he has done will always be here, so things have definitely changed for good.

Your daughter is sweet and correct that there are lots of fish in the sea. It's also true that there can be great satisfaction in swimming alone.

I hope you will take some time to let some of what is happening sink in. Your H is all over the place, it seems, and it wouldn't hurt to give yourself some time and space to see what directions your feelings are going in.


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## Catherine602

Molly do you think that he is physically and psychologically fit to continue his work in Asia? I wonder if he is impaired mentally by his illnesses. 

I mean, organically as a consequence of meds and/or the diseases. Or maybe he has some new illness that is responsible for his current state. 

Maybe he is not hinself because of illness more than a fog. Can you convince him to get a complete physical exam before he goes back? 

I am concerned that the challenge of work along with the weather and possibly diet may hasten his physical decline.

If he is so sick, it may be unwise for him to go back. Surely the contract is not enforcable if he is too sick to continue is it?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602

Forgot to mention. How will you feel if he does go back? I have a feeling that you will be so concered about his fragile physical shape that you may feel compelled to go with him.

Do you think you should try to convince to get out of the contract. That would make the situation more manageable. If he is emotionally connected to this girl he will probably go through a period mourning. 

But you will avoid the conflict of being a nurse maid to him in Asia while he is still seeing this girl.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602

MissMolly thinking of you and concerned. Check in - don't have to tell anything just that you are around. Thanks.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## missmolly

Catherine602 said:


> MissMolly thinking of you and concerned. Check in - don't have to tell anything just that you are around. Thanks.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I will write very soon.


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## Catherine602

Thank you for answering.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## missmolly

Thanks again everyone for your concern.

The last two days have been interesting, mainly because I believe the alien has moved out and my H has returned as himself. Sending ‘the email’ was the beginning of this transformation.

He confessed an enormous relief after it was sent, and it was followed up by a more strongly worded, and finite one.
She of course, replied with more slop than I thought possible. The emails are pouring in. Including how if she can’t be the great love of this life, then she would be waiting in the next life for her role as his true wife. Puke. I can’t look until after he does or it would be obvious that I have access. He only looks about twice per day whereas I would check every hour!!!

He has also admitted to having given her a substantial amount of money to pay ‘her debts’. Our money. I already knew this as I had seen a copy of the bank transfer, but I was waiting for him to tell me. I have a copy of this lodged with my lawyer, just in case we end up needing a financial settlement in the future.

I still feel unsure of how I really feel, and he continues to assume that I am going along with the plan. Disclosure of the money transfer was not a pretty moment. 

I have composed, but not sent, an email to her pointing out why sinners may not be rewarded in the afterlife.
I have also a letter written to my H, asking him to clear out of my life. It is sitting in an envelope, propped against a vase, just in case I want it in a hurry. He has asked me a couple of times what it is, and I have fobbed him off.


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## Catherine602

MM sounds like you are doing better in your accustomed feisty way. Has your daughter and son been of any assistance? . 

Have you and your husband given any thought to terminating or shortening the contracted work? 

I hope you are getting the rest and nutrition you need to get through this. This will probably be the most taxing time. You will need to stay ahead of the psychological assault this girl will likely mount to keep him engaged. I think you should be prepared and discuss it with him. 

Just my opinion but at some point it may be helpful to discuss his take on what this girl was up to. There is a big difference between knowing that he was manipulated Vs. believing he was in a love relationship. If he thinks this girl is sincerely in love with him, he may feel guilty for abandoning her. 

This delusion may make him susceptible to going back to rescue her. This will probably take time for it to sink in. It may help to have a discussion with him to make sure he knows what really happened. To me, this is a vital part of R, if you choose to go that route. 

He was prepared to throw away his loyal wife, children and responsibilities for a girl he had no way of knowing. If you R, I am certain you will tackle this issue. Does he realize the value of what he has? He should. 

The Young-Girl/Boy-In-Love-With-An-Older-Adult is such a common scam it is a wonder that reasonably intelligent people fall for it. Shows the lure of sex and fantasy - an addictive combination. . Indeed, he was not himself. I hope knowing this is one source of comfort to you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602

Mis Molly I left you alone for several days. However, I am concerned about you, I mean to give you privacy. Please check to let us know that you are as well as can be expected, given the circumstances


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## missmolly

I haven't had a lot of 'alone' time to write here during the last few days. 

It's calm and reasonably pleasant on the home front - on the surface. 
I am still vaguely uncomfortable and not too sure why.
The dynamics of our relationship are greatly changed and I find myself having to fight off my own aloofness at times. 

My H appears committed to making this work, and the emails from the XOW have stopped. Some of the last ones were spectacular declarations of undying love, and protestations of not being influenced by gifts and such.

re your comments Catherine - He admits he was taken in and somewhat manipulated. However, it appears she was quite a nice person (his words) and he was certainly besotted by her. Whether or not he is grieving much, I cannot tell. If he is, then he is hiding it well. 

There was a moderate amount of spending on clothing, trinkets, and I suspect, a motor bike. Now my H HATES shopping and would never initiate a trip to a shoe shop. I asked if he offered to take her shoe shopping and he replied 'hell no'. So she was good at dragging him to shop windows and oohing and aahing over things, and he IS generous, so in time he would have just said 'well buy it'.

It's funny how my taste in clothing has become more expensive recently. 

He leaves here to return overseas in two days time and will put in his formal resignation on his first day back at work. The XOW has returned to the south of the country to commence her new life with her new fortune. I have seen this in her emails to him (he shows me everything now) but of course I have noway of knowing if this is all true. Especially as she suggested in one email to him that they continue meeting secretly if I return with him. Living without trust is difficult.

I will return there for a while later on, with my younger sister. I can't face it alone. I would be living in 'their' apartment and may not be able to stay on when my sister returns home. I will just have to wait and see how it goes.

I continue to lose weight, and the quit smoking programme is in place, with only a few breaks.

One point of interest, my H's general health has improved markedly. He no longer has that ghastly nearly dead look, and he says he feels much better. He continues to have a lot of pain with the five prolapsed discs, but will not stop working on the house and grounds. Says it is his penance!!!


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## alte Dame

This sounds like a spectacular clusterf*ck and a sad, sad waste of so many things. After all these years, this is where you are. You must feel like you're in a house of mirrors sometimes. I realize that I should be offering platitudes to prop you up, but for some things, you just need to go into a closet and scream.

How did he meet this woman? How long was it going on? Had he planned to have a secret affair until everything blew up with your meltdown? Jeebus, just how, how, how?


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## Catherine602

Thanks for checking in MissMolly

I read over your previous posts again. One thing I may have glossed over - you said that you were in R for 18 months? So this is his 2nd affair in 2 yrs? Has he cheated before these recent times that you know of?

I don't want to keep harping on this. If you are to weary to read my take on this, which is not kind, please wait to read it at a later time. 

Has it sunk in that he was scammed by a hooker? How does he say this... "it appears she was quite a nice person (his words) and he was certainly besotted by her."? 

The next time he says that, ask him if he thinks this is the first time she has done this. Does he consider a "nice girl" one who is in the business of scamming vulnerable men? 

He still has feelings for a "girl" made a fool of him?! I'd hide myself for a couple of months. 

Does he realize that he was not special to her? In fact, she does not care anything about him. He was an investment, nothing more. One that paid off handsomely.

When she runs through the money he gave her, she will be back at it. Maybe they can be pen pals and he can give her tips. 

I think it is outrageous that he would express any feelings for this woman in your presence MM. 

I can only think that he sees you as his mother not his wife. Otherwise how could he even express any feelings at all for an OW to you of all people. 

Is he so self-centered that he cannot see things from the point of view of a loving devoted spouse? Who is he doing penance for?


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## missmolly

The harsher, the better. It's good for me.
And what a wonderful word cluster**** - yep that's it
Still thinking and finding the time to respond without an audience.


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## missmolly

it is now only four hours since he left and I am a mess. 
So many doubts and I can't feel any comfort in his promises.
He took $500 from a bank account in his name only yesterday - why? He said he wasn't thinking and that was why he didn't take it from our living account.

His 'friend' (whose account I have managed to hack) applied yesterday for a new email address - why?

He says he wants me back with him for this last couple of months overseas, but I have misgivings - why?

My gut feelings are screaming at me but I don't know why.


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## missmolly

and Catherine, yes, he did have an affair a couple of years ago.
If you have read my original posting you would see where it was coming from.
It took me a long time to re-trust and believe in him, but I did, finally. 

His father died suddenly when he was 63 and my H entered his own 63rd year with the conviction that he also would die. I was acutely aware of this but could do nothing to allay his fears. This was the beginning of an horrific time for me. I do not doubt that his fears were genuine, but it was a change from a man who I believed to be honest and faithful. I still believe this.

Tonight however, I am in hell.


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## FalconKing

MissMolly you do not trust your husband. You are trying to trust him but in the last few years of your life you have been let down immensely by him. I don't recall, but did you say you were seeking some kind of therapy? If not, I think you should. No meds though IMO. Just get it all out. Be heard by someone. I would be worried if you went back with your husband. Because i feel as of now he is a source of torment for you and at times is manipulative. I think you need some you time. A LOT of it. I know the thought of that may scare you. But people love you. You are a sweet wonderful woman. You could it and you would be fine. But this is how I feel. Whatever you decide I just want you to take care of yourself.


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## Catherine602

My dear MissMolly 

How I wish I could go to your home and sit with you. I could say nothing to comfort you now but I would just be there. 

I am about to make breakfast for my family. When we are finished, I will come back and we can have a virtual sit down. I want to hear a little about your life if you can muster the energy to write. 

All I can say is that from thousands of miles away, New Jersey, USA, you have managed to touch my heart. . Not because of your troubles but because of your sparkles and fire. 

I cannot imagine the love you engender from people who are in your sphere.


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## Catherine602

MissMolly just checking in to see if you are at home. Thinking of you and will check back this afternoon.


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## missmolly

It is 3am here and I am trying to sleep.
However, I am up and down like a yo yo

We lived in this new town for only eight weeks when we decided to move overseas for a short term contract. It was meant to be our retirement home. (it is my mother's home town where I spent many childhood holidays). I don't know many people here and have no community involvement. 
We are on a 5 acre property, 5 kms out of town. It is complicated in that our youngest daughter (the BPD one) followed us here and now lives in the town centre. She is settled and doing rather well here most of the time.

I am however, blessed to have a wonderful cousin here. She is a psych counselor for troubled adolescents but has been a great support to me. In fact, until my H returned, I had not spent a night alone as she would put on her jamies and come over and sleep here everynight.


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## Catherine602

Your cousin sounds wonderful. 

That is a lot of land. Are you raising any animals or do you have horses on the property? 

We recently moved from Kentucky where we had a house (still have it rented) on a one acre lot to an condo in NJ. It is quite an adjustment. 

When is your surgery? Will your sister be going with you?


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## alte Dame

Miss M - I'm sorry to say that I wouldn't trust your H. He wants his cake and eat it, too, I'm betting. He sounds like a man desperately torn between the family that loves him (and he loves), and his 'urges.' This is the second affair that you know of & he appears to be good at hiding it from you until something blows up, at which point he can't bear to deal with the shame and loss of his family. He has put you through hell in these last years.

I know that you have loved him & still feel love for him. You also sound like not only your trust but some of the wifely love you felt for him has been damaged.

When we are older, we often find ourselves caring physically for the people we have had in our lives - our parents, our spouses who become mentally or physically infirm. We usually do this with love and gratitude & a large dollop of a sense of duty that has been earned. I think that you will wind up caretaking for your H very soon, but he will not have earned your devotion. He has, with lightning-quick blows, undone decades of that earned devotion. So, you will be the good wife, but there will be a lot of bitterness and a sense of the pathetic that colors your actions.

Do you want to now spend your time policing him so that you can be sure of his fidelity? That's not how we should go into our golden years.

I suppose what I am suggesting is that you let him go for now, let him do his worst in following his 'urges,' but you make sure to live each day for yourself, the best way you can. He is weak right now. He desperately wants conflicting things in his life & can't resist any of them. He couldn't/can't resist her & he can't bear to be estranged from his family. If you go with him now & become his policeman, you enable his weakness.

You know that I am closer to your age than many of the people on this board. I've thought about this carefully & although I know this is for me a hypothetical, I believe I would 'just let him go' if I were in your position.


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## Catherine602

Alte I think you have come the closet to a realistic assessment and sound advice than anyone. Stay with us to add your sensible steady voice please.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## missmolly

My sensible self agrees with everything that others write here. 

I woke up this morning to find half a bottle of brandy and a pack of cigs missing. I also have a very bruised and swollen right fist so I must have taken a swing at something. (no photos smashed tho).
I sent him an email during the night, saying that I couldn't do this, and that a life without trust wasn't worth living. 
I also told him that I had read all his emails. 

I followed that up with a bit of a softening effect this morning. I explained that I had read the English emails, as most of 'theirs' were in a foreign language which I can't read. 

I have since had a long one back from him, obviously sent in transit as he is still flying now. We have never sent long mushy ones in the past, only 'love you, miss you, see you soon' sort of ones, and now I am wondering if he has grown a silver tongue. 
The recent one certainly sounded genuine and heartfelt, but I am now back in limbo, not knowing what to believe.


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## missmolly

I am heading interstate today as I have a preferred surgeon there. It is where we lived for many years. 
Fortunately I have a lot of friends there and I will stay for 5 days.


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## Catherine602

ActionS speak louder than words. Why the lack of transparency. Hiding communication and communicating in a language you can't read. The $500 taken out of his personal account that you may not have noticed.


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## Catherine602

Be well MissMolly.


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## jmb123

Take care Miss Molly.I have been following your life and wish that you find your happier and stronger self back very soon.

The most wonderful thing about TAm is here you have such good people here who actually care so much .I have seen Catherine following and giving you her genuine replies and sharing her concern for you Miss Molly all alongyou posted your life.That is so good.
I am glad I found TAM.Even though we are over the internet and cannot see each other but still the level of support and guidance we get is great.


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## Bellavista

All the best with your operation. Just remember, one day at a time, that is all you have to get through at the moment.


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## Catherine602

Just dropping in to say I am thinking of you and hope you are healing well. Check in as soon as you can.


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## Catherine602

Hi MissMolly, just knocking at your door to check on you. Will come back tomorrow to see if you are at home. I hope you are healing well; can't wait to hear that you are well.


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## missmolly

Hi Everyone,
Home and healing, just bruised and sore. 
Nothing sinister, but more than first planned.
I will write soon.


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## SaltInWound

Good to see you are recovering.


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## missmolly

I sat here to write last night and couldn't get started. Besides, my hands were shaking too much. 

My trip away was a welcome break and I met up with many really good friends. Perhaps I should move back there one day. It was also comforting to be attending a trusted surgeon, and of course I knew everyone in the OR, Recovery area etc. 

It was confusing though because, with only one exception, EVERYONE kept saying that I should go back and make a last effort to be with my H. Even the surgeon.(they attended uni together) They all knew my H for many, many years (his earlier career was in medicine) and only remember the kind, thoughtful person that he was. 
A few even suggested that I try to get him in for a brain scan!!
Like me, most people have had trouble getting their head around the fact that any of this has happened. 

I had a couple of hellish days when I arrived back home here and it didn't help that I have lost his crushed wedding ring - he had asked for it back and I refused.

Our communication has been 'off' but I can't put my finger on why. 
He says the supposed XOW has contacted him on four occasions, and has returned to her home town some 1000kms away. But of course with no trust, there is no peace of mind. Also, he had promised to 'offer' information and I had had to extract this. Not wanting to upset me just didn't cut it for me.

All in all, it has been completely unsatisfactory. I was composing a 'clear out of my life' email when I received a very long one that sounded as though it was from the man that I used to know.

Last night, with very shaky hands, I booked a flight back. I have left the return ticket open, might be a day, might be a week. I have also booked into a hotel.

I will at least talk to him. I would also like an opportunity to check out his phone and laptop but that could be tricky as at this stage, I do not plan to go to his home. Might be worth inviting him to the hotel for a couple of nights cos he would have to visit the bathroom eventually!!!

Keep the harsh stuff coming please - I need it


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## alte Dame

Not harsh, Miss M, never harsh, I hope.

I can understand why you would book your flight. After all these years - and this last experience must still seem like a surreal aberration. Who knows? Maybe it is.

It was never clear to me what made him 'wake up' and end things with the OW. I thought he had declared that he didn't love you and that she was his new love. How did that change so quickly? And how long was it going on before you learned of it?

You may not want all the details, I know. For me, knowing them would help me decide how to process what he's done and whether I would want to try to repair things with him.

Is he expecting you to return as his wife? Or are things still undecided?


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## curlysue321

I have bipolar disorder and am always afraid I am going to lose control of my emotions. I stay heavily medicated so that won't happen.


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## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> Not harsh, Miss M, never harsh, I hope.
> 
> I can understand why you would book your flight. After all these years - and this last experience must still seem like a surreal aberration. Who knows? Maybe it is.
> 
> It was never clear to me what made him 'wake up' and end things with the OW. I thought he had declared that he didn't love you and that she was his new love. How did that change so quickly? And how long was it going on before you learned of it?
> 
> You may not want all the details, I know. For me, knowing them would help me decide how to process what he's done and whether I would want to try to repair things with him.
> 
> Is he expecting you to return as his wife? Or are things still undecided?


It's true that I did not want to know the details but i have picked up bits and pieces. He told me he no longer wanted to be married, and the night before I left, admitted that he had been unfaithfull. I thought he said with other 'women' but it turns out there was only one. 

He met her during my second to last trip home. 
This was late September. He said 'she hit on me' (very common there) and 'I went with it'. He said it was once. But they continued what I suppose was an EA by email when I returned. 
My last trip home I assume it was full on. I never asked and didn't want to know.
I had noticed behaviour changes and I was extremely uneasy. Hence my public meltdown. He kept complaining of tiredness and back pain, which was genuine. 

When I finally returned to Aus, he said that he was in a relationship. He moved into a new apartment when I left, and 16 days later, she moved in with him. They lived together for 13 days before he came back here to sort out our affairs. 
He told me the night before he came that he had made a huge mistake
He has since asked for a chance to try to repair the damage and rebuild what he had destroyed. I don't trust him and feel paranoid that he is continuing behind my back. I have no evidence to support this but it is eating me up badly. i was ok when he was here, but as soon as he went back, I went badly to pieces. 
I am so nervous that I can't stop shaking (this is a first for me)
and he seems to have withdrawn since he left. I have had a recent email which sounds more like normal and he has contacted me a couple of times today, one being a phone call because I was having trouble with his car. 

Going back there horrifies me and I am dreading it. But I am falling apart here.


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## missmolly

Some of the above wasn't really clear. 
He ended the relationship by email, whilst he was here.
He showed me all their correspondence, including one that confirmed that she was flying south to her home town.
She speaks very little English and all correspondence was in her language. Google was the best i had for translation and it is often illogical. 
I am paranoid enough to think that the breakup was all a show for me and that there is another email account where the EA continues. I have no idea.


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## Bellavista

I know it is hard to trust and it is all so raw still for you. I have thought about this because of my own situation and have come to realise the biggest signs will be in the behaviour.
Is your husband still acting cagey, is he acting very stressed, like he is being eaten alive by a secret?
They cannot help but give off signs if the betrayal is continuing.
In ten end only you know whether you can trust again enough to stay with him.


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## alte Dame

I doubt very much that what you're feeling is paranoia. You have every reason to not trust, every reason to question, very seriously, what his motivations and commitment are.

I can't begin to act or sound like I have any real words of experience & I certainly don't have wisdom here, but I can say with assurance that I wouldn't feel any trust if I were in your shoes. He has bounced you back and forth like a yo-yo, so the lack of trust seems very natural and expected to me.

From what you write, you don't feel you have any good choices right now - you don't want to return to this place that has been so traumatic for you and you don't really feel a comfort level at your place in your home country.

I suspect you'll find some clarity on your trip. It may well allow you to see and understand what you want to live with, what you feel you can live with from now on.


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## Catherine602

I have some reservations about the trip. You just had surgery, and you are nowhere near healed. You mean to take yourself to a place with questionable health care. 

Sorry but what's with these friends? How can they advise yiu to go in your state! Look at yourself, 2 weeks post surgery and an emotional mess, hands shaking. 

And planning a grueling trip to uncertainly. You dont have the reserves to go now. I don't want to pain you but there will be nothing that you can do to change things. 

And you are too vulnerable now. Has he ever taken care of you? Has it always been you taking care of him? He gets your comfort with little expediture of effort. 

I think you don't make him work for it. What is his motive for being nice and luring you back there? 

You set your own value. How can he ask his wife who just had surgery to travel to Asia. He should be calling you to make sure you rest and heal not sweet talk you to join him. 

Please don't go or at lest wait a month. What ever will happen will do so wheather you are there or not. I don't think you should be there to witness any thing that will hurt you.. 

But I think you know best so follow your intuition and don't listen to me.


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## missmolly

I have received an email from my H confirming all that I had suspected.


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## FalconKing

We love you missmolly. Please just relax and be with people who can hold you right now. Just lets us know how you are doing.


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## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> I have received an email from my H confirming all that I had suspected.


Coward. He could have called.


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## alte Dame

So they created another account to continue the A? And he's been lying again?


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## SaltInWound

alte Dame said:


> So they created another account to continue the A? And he's been lying again?


or maybe that he was lying that she moved away.


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## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> So they created another account to continue the A? And he's been lying again?[/QUOTE
> 
> The email was a result of several long phone calls.
> He had already told me of another email account.
> I think this last email might actually be fairly honest.
> 
> I still believe that the lying started only since his 63rd birthday.
> I still believe that he was honest and genuine up until then.
> 
> I will not post the email here. I have already shared it with Catherine. I will share it to a private email address if you PM me


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## Bellavista

Sometimes it can take the WS a couple of sessions to really come clean.


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## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> I think this last email might actually be fairly honest.


I disagree Miss Molly. There is a lot he is not telling you. I sent you an e-mail.


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## missmolly

so the phone calls and emails bounce back and forth.
He is affronted because I was 'vitriolic, bordering on hateful' last night. 
Bad luck buster. Wait until I am in full sail.


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## SaltInWound

Of course he is being defiant. He got busted and his comfortable world is falling apart. Dealing with reality and suffering consequences is no fun for anyone. Stay strong and give it to him with both barrels!


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## Catherine602

I dont know, he might not be as affronted as much as he is afraid. He sees his confidant leaving him. Who will he share his dating experiences with? 

Who will be there to take care of him when OW has drained him dry. Who will nurse him back to health so he can have another adventure? 

Not MM, as he is finding out. His back up has his number and she has rung off. 

I still think you should go dark on him. He will lie to make him feel good. The affronted thing is laughable if it wern't so lame. 

MM see if this makes sense - by communicating with him and showing anger you are allowing him to transfer his guit to you. He expects your anger but he does not expect a calm business-like woman. 

He does not expect you to cut off communication or to fall out of love. Give him a real kick in the azz, change up. Move on with your life. Do different things. 

Different hair style, new attractive clothing. Make sure he knows it is not for him. Be out and about, even if it is just to the moves. 

He has a convenient reason to have betrayed you - you are an angry woman. Your anger may not be recieved in the way you thnk. It may not make him feel guilty, shame or bad at all.

I think he may enjoy the fight. Does He say things to make you angry? His manhood may not be working but, he still has two women fighting over him. What a stud. 

I know it is difficult but you have to find a way to vent to someone other than him. Don't let him bait you. 

You probably won't be able to do this now or suddenly but work towards it slowly. 

Oh an get a handle on the finances before it all goes to the OW. She may get direct access if she smart enough.


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## missmolly

He says he has not seen her.
He says she has moved a long way south
He says he is so confused that he isn't coping with anything. 
He says he is too ashamed to look at me

I know that I rave and rant on here, but with one exception, I remain pretty cool with him. To this day he cannot tell when i am being sarcastic - never could. I told him that I persisted in being civil with him because I loved him so much. He thanked me. WTF??


----------



## Catherine602

Hang in there. You have given two contradictory posts. Please take it easy. Don't cloud your mind Miss Molly. I am worried about you. Are you alone in the house? 

If you are, I think it would be better to have some trusted friend or family member with you today. you are not short of friend. Call on one now. 

Believe it. This will pass, you just have to take it moment by moment.


----------



## missmolly

therein lies my greatest problem. 
I do not know anyone here in this town except for my cousin and my youngest (BPD) daughter. My cousin has house guests this weekend. 
We moved here to retire. It is my mother's home town and where I spent all my childhood holidays with my grandparents. 

Yes i know that I am all over the place, but don't lose my cool very often in front of him. My greatest aim is to stay in control when interacting with him.


----------



## alte Dame

He has told you that he doesn't think he's in love with you any more, but now says he's confused. Does he still want you to come stay with him? Or has he retracted that now?

Your anger is understandable. I can't tell whether it's good or bad to let loose with the vitriol. You have a right to scream, but it might be better for you to just go dark on him. He's tortured you enough at this point.

(Have you considered taking yourself off for a long break - a month or two to regroup and just have some peace?)


----------



## SaltInWound

Miss Molly, has he asked you how your recovery is progressing? I mean, without you bringing it up first?

Please don't tell him you love him.


----------



## missmolly

SaltInWound said:


> Miss Molly, has he asked you how your recovery is progressing? I mean, without you bringing it up first?
> 
> Please don't tell him you love him.



This is starting to sound like a third rate soap opera. 

Yes he enquires daily by text, phone or email. Of this he is attentive. 

Re me joining him? He still mentions it but I do not feel with much conviction. I have just about decided not to go. I haven't cancelled the tickets yet, but the thought of going back makes me feel ill. We had talked of meeting in a neighbouring country for TET, on neutral ground so to speak, but neither has done anything about visas etc. 

I spent much of the wee small hours of yesterday summarising our finances for him (he hasn't got a clue - he usually lives a money free life, that is till recent times) and sorting out new wills. He called me yesterday morning, became extremely upset, told me he would call back last evening and rang off abruptly without a goodbye. 
I have not heard a word since and it is nearly 5am next day here.

I would love to just take off and go somewhere but February is our hottest month - we've had some days around 44-45C already -and I have treasured and nurtured our 5 acres of mature English trees in a park like setting. They really don't like this sort of heat. Funny though that I was prepared to risk them to be with him. I have paid people to look after them in the past, but every trip has cost me one or two of them. 

My little dogs are still with my sister, and the bushfires are heading her way, now about 100kms away from where she lives in a forest. i will probably have to go and collect them, and her 3, and bring them all back here. 

My sister is cross with me because she was planning a holiday with us and bought non refundable tickets. She says she will still go, and encourages me to go with her. But I just can't. Be in the same city and not see him? I would go crazy.

Going dark on him will be the hardest thing I have ever had to do. Despite everything, being away from him is still so difficult.
i am living life one hour at a time at the moment.


----------



## Aunt Ava

I have followed your heartbreaking story, and if I had evil powers your husband would be toast! Just wanted you to know I am thinking of you and sending you strength (with my powers for good!). Please stay strong in your convictions.


----------



## alte Dame

missmolly said:


> Going dark on him will be the hardest thing I have ever had to do.


You need to do it. A basic 180 won't work if he keeps contacting you.

You both need to spend some time realizing what the future is going to look like if he has truly checked out of the marriage.


----------



## Catherine602

I just wanted to give you a heads up. If my thoughts were idle I would not mention them at a time like this. 

You are too upset for idle chit chat but, i feel i need to share my thoughts. 

There seems to be all the signs that the OW is probably back living with him. Makes me sick to write it but I think so. 

His reluctance to make firm plans to meet you on neutral ground, his vagueness when you talk about joining him, and the upset call, and not calling back. 

In all likelyhod she has joined him. It may have been at the time he called. 

The mixed messages may be meant to give you hope and buy him time. He may want to avoid telling you of his betrayal so that you don't act and destroy the fairytale. 

From what I have read on this site, cheaters seem to follow the almost the same script. They lie to avoid dealing with the consequences, they give false hope to keep the BS from acting decisively. 

They speak and act in code. They tell you the truth by their behavior and lie with their mouths. Dont believe anything he says.

Right now, you need someone nearby. I don't want to say too much because you really cannot stand more. But I think you already know. So take it in a little at a time and be prepared. 

It is not you, or the OW . it's the brain storm of feel good chemicals. That's why cheaters behave similarly. They are drunk with the same drugs. It an escape from real life. 

The trees sound so life afirming. How could trees from England grow in Australia? There a whole stand of them you say. 

Those trees are whispering - "I'm here, right here". You have not lost - you gained. You cannot see it now. When you go out to tend the tress, stay very still and listen to them. . 

Someone needs to hear that so that her mind is soothed and her spirit is retorted.


----------



## missmolly

I am not ignoring my wonderful TAM friends
I am stoned, pissed and desparate


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## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> I am not ignoring my wonderful TAM friends
> I am stoned, pissed and desparate


We all understand those feelings. Hang in there.


----------



## missmolly

Catherine602 said:


> How are you? Did you go to get the dogs yet? How is the brush fire situation there. Do they get anywhere near you home.
> 
> Just thinking of you. C


Fortunately it rained so the fires are no longer an immediate threat

My dogs are still with my sister for the moment. I have to return to the surgeon at the end of the week to have sutures removed. I will collect them after that. 

I am not returning to be with my H. He wants a divorce.


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## alte Dame

Sorry, mm.


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## missmolly

I will resurface, I am wound licking for a little while


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## jmb123

missmolly said:


> I will resurface, I am wound licking for a little while


He is going to to rot in the worst and dirtiest corner of hell for the pain and suffering he has inflicted on you.

Youd eserved none of this.

He is a man of low self-esteem,is empty inside;
You filled his life with happiness ,care and love and he began to think that it was all about him and his goodness;
Look at his shallowness how he is after a poor characterless money sucking wh***trying to seek validation from her;
He has done this earlier too with some other wh***.He is a dirtbag,a real POS.
They are all sorry creatures;

I know you have spent years with him.So think of him as a sibling who has wronged you.Just pity him and let him go to hell.Throw the divorce paper on him.DO not let him become a life threatening disease for you.Treat yourself without him.

Miss Molly,Please do not be sad;He does not deserve you.On the practical aspect see that finacially you get every ounce you and your family deserve and he is not left with any dime to throw on that sl**.

We all know who is going to end crying .Do we not Miss Molly?
And do you disagrre that happiness comes from withing and is not because of external possessions,situations or relations,be it anybody anything.Its a state of mind.He is just a relation you got in this life.But every moments you created with him was from within you.You shall be the creator of happy moments again without him or anybody.You ahe to kind to yourself and heal you.Stop hurting you.Just get over with the divorce and be determined to start a hppy ,frsh life.I know none of we thought we would go through all this in our life.But again we have to reconstruct our peace and happiness and throw away anything that made us weak .

And Have you not been very sad since long.Please stop hurting yourself.He is no good.

You can and will have a life of your own .A happy and peaceful life once this cheating person is gone.
We are all better off without these cheating people.

Would you post and talk to people here more often.It will help you tremendously to let your heart out and stand on your feet in a happy healthy manner.Here you already have a lot of friiends.We are all friends and more than that because we haev all been through this and understand it

Also,please make new friends in that new place.Once you start going out you shall realize how god gives you new friends there also.

I am going to post something for you.Hope you like it after reading it.Stay strong.You are in my prayers and i know I shall see you posting happy postys here very soon.


----------



## Aunt Ava

He doesn't deserve you. I say give him what he wants and take him for every dime you can - that's what what he deserves. Please take care of yourself, be kind to yourself.


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## jmb123

No to excess smoking and drinks!
Nobody is worth wasting your life.Its precious.


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## Catherine602

Just checking in. Thinking of you.


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## Catherine602

Will you ever come back? I hope you will.


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## missmolly

Catherine602 said:


> Will you ever come back? I hope you will.


Back home with internet access tomorrow


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## Catherine602

missmolly said:


> Back home with internet access tomorrow


Ok MM will look for tomorrow. Travel safely.


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## missmolly

I am now battling uncontrollable rage and bitterness
I will write when I am more in control of my emotions


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## Aunt Ava

I've been thinking about you, hoping you're okay.


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## alte Dame

I'm assuming that he has gone dark on you. If not, I'm urging you to go completely dark on him. Self-preservation. The first step.


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## Catherine602

missmolly said:


> I am now battling uncontrollable rage and bitterness
> I will write when I am more in control of my emotions


I thought this was why you have been silent. 

Tried to find what to say to sway your mind, in time, towards actionable goals and the future. 

I have had some bad things happen to me early in my life. I had to see the same happen to my sister. It stole our innocence, our youthful vigor and excitement and faith in the future. 

I was consummrd with righteous outrage which increased as I got odlder and realized the selfishness and inhumanity of what happened. 

You know what MissMolly, I was finally able to let it go. Not because of all the phychobabble about forgiveness is about freeing oneself or it's good for the soul. 

[email protected] that - a little revenge would have cleared every bit of anger and bitterness I ever felt just like a good old laxative.

I let go because I could. Does that mean that I forgive - no. Does it mean that if the opportunity to avenge the wrong that I would not take it - no. Does it mean that I turned the other cheek - hell no to the no. 

It just means that I will not give time or thought to that which I can see no action. If or when I could act then I would. That will never happen for me. But the principle holds true. 

Don't waste time on thoughts that promise action but by it's nature will see no action for now. 

Letting go does not mean to forgive or forget. It just means you have a future and a life to plan and live. You have no time for thoughts that consume your precious time and energy. 

So what happens to a person who hurt you so deeply and seems not to feel a bit of compassion or empathy. I am not sure. 

I will tell you of one incident to illustrate. . 

One of my father's sisters was married to a detective in a small town. He was respected, sober and appearently devoted to his wife and only daughter. 

He had some kind of midlife crisis and decided to run off with a 20 yo [email protected] waitress. Suprised, none of us could believe it. Some of the men in the family, my father included, went to New Orleans to talk sense into him. 

He was living with this girl who was giving him holy hell. She eventually left him for another man but he remained in NO until he died a year ago. 

He was lonely and reconciled with his only daughter who visited him when he was dying. At one point he told her that he realized early on that he had made the biggest mistake of his life. He was too embarrassed however to return. 

We were not sure how my aunt would do. She seemed calm and took things in stride. She opined that he was crazy and she divorced him like he was not good enough for her. She is married to a retired military man who dotes on her. They travel, and have common interests. 

She was 52 when her husband left. She was always a cheerful, optimistic person and very loving. The odds of her finding love again is supposed to be very small. She did not know that I quess. 

MissMolly - I can't tell you not to consume yourself with anger and bitterness. Somehow, the bitterness seems to have an element of regretting being the very loving, generous and spunky person you are. 

You can if you'd like, take an example from my aunt. She threated the whole thing like her husband lost his mind to leave what she had. He went to an insane asylum named "Living With a Young Woman You Don't Know". He was never the same. 

I know it is not easy and it will not happen in many months, but it will happen that you will be happy again one day. Take every day on its own and deal with the things of that day only. 

There are many people that are glad you are in the world. I don't know you but your sparke touches me deeply. 

To you MM :toast: I cannot wait to see you roaring back and here are a few (((((hugs ))))) to grease the way.


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## missmolly

Thanks everyone for your messages. 
Today started quite well and for the first time in a very long time, I felt quite positive. However I went downhill this afternoon and have spent most of it in tears and wallowing in self pity. 
I suppose that's better than planning murder. 

I don't want what he has become, but I am so grieving what he was. 

Smoking again, but know I have to quit
drinking a lot, but know I have to quit. 

I am a mess


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## Aunt Ava

Please stop, you are self harming, the drinking and smoking are poisoning your body. Hasn't what he has done to you created enough poison for this lifetime? I know you are in agony, treat yourself with tender loving care. Force yourself to eat good nourishing food, drink lots of water, try taking regular walks with your dogs. Try to relax by listening to some beautiful calming music. 

When you need to release some of the rage I suggest a hammer instead of your hand.


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## Paladin

Don't beat yourself up too badly for coping negatively. You know you have to stop smoking, and at some point you will, same with the booze. Sometimes a bit of self pity is ok too. Mourning the passing of what once was a good and happy thing is not easy or fun. Hang in there, the onl person you ever have to answer to is yourself.


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## Catherine602

Hi - try to stop drinking. Get Xanax instead it will help you to calm down and sleep in a safe way. 

The smoking is worrisome. What if you drink fall asleep with a cig? 

Come on girl. Get a grip. Promise that you will call your doctor for a good drug for you now. 

Are you alone? If so, please make an effort to have someone with you now. 

You can email me at any time and say anything you want even if it is a drunken, murderous tirade. 

I will not call he authorities. I need to go do chores and shop. But I will be able to check my email if you need to vent.


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## missmolly

I have just typed and lost a huge posting. 
I can't do it again tonight, it is 4am here.
I will try again tomorrow.


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## missmolly

So i will attach a picture of my side garden instead


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## alte Dame

Beautiful garden! Now hold that image, close your eyes and get some rest.


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## jmb123

missmolly said:


> So i will attach a picture of my side garden instead


This is so lovely.Wow!I could sleep there the entire day and read all kinds of amazing books.

TC Miss Molly.


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## Catherine602

Hi glad to see you back. The garden looks glorious. I hope you are spending some time out there if it not too hot. 

Does your house have a verandah? I've seen Austrian houses in the movies and they all had large overhang or verandahs to keep the sun out. 

I tried to include a picture of the bedford stone house we own in KY but it didn't work. I'll try again tomorrow. 

We rent it out now since we moved to New Jersey across the Hudson River from Manhattan, NY. I miss our house so much and I miss living in Kentucky. 

We are oringinally from New York but I am having a hard time adjusting back to the homestead. I am working part time for the first time since I started working. My life has changed so much in a one and a half years. Guess you just have to roll with it. 

I look forward to hearing from you tomorrow.


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## missmolly

Yesterday must have been rock bottom because I don’t think I could get any lower. So anything must be up from that.

I was lucky enough to find a new counselor who phoned me and chatted for half an hour or so and will see me next week. He said that he could hear in my voice that I needed support and would make himself available whenever possible.

My only trip to a GP in this town was laughable. Most aren’t taking on new patients and I didn’t have much choice who I saw. I was told that I should be grateful for the number of good years in my life as some people have none. And that was that. 

When in my old city last week I tried to see my previous GP, someone I have a great rapport with, but she was away on holidays.

My days are long and empty. I have five acres of beautiful trees and lots of silence. 
I go into town most days and just walk around but that gets boring after a while. 
I never thought that a visit to the supermarket would the highlight of my day.


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## jmb123

Miss Molly,

Can you become a teacher.In some school or online teacher.Is it possible.Can you please think on those lines?I mean anyhting which you always though of doing,you knowledge in any field which you would be glad to share with others in the world.


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## jmb123

What I asked above is with a reason.And in now does it mean that I am unaware of the turmoil you feel inside.


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## Catherine602

Do you have to keep the house? Can you sell it and move closer to family and friends. I know you just purchased it and don't know the market in the area you live. 

Will the doctor that you saw recently give you an Rx for an antidepressant since he recently saw you? It is a good temporary fix so you can get through this period. 

You may like to take a trip to a museum to walk around or a musical event. It would force you to get out and about. Also something to put your mind on. 

Although it is difficult, try to plan out the day so that you are around people as much as possible.


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## alte Dame

This is extremely hard. You could use some counseling on two different levels: First, to scream and cry about your H, and second, to look very seriously at how you would like your life to proceed for the future.

The strange, unwelcome upside to your H's decisions is that you are very free now to do whatever the h3ll you want. Your mind may not yet be ready to start thinking this way in a big way, but you can start in small doses. What is something, something small, that you've always wanted to do? For me, I've always wanted to arrange to have my groceries delivered because I hate food shopping, for example . Just something small that you never allowed yourself because you had a family to take care of.


----------



## missmolly

Why can't i let go???????


----------



## Louise7

missmolly said:


> Why can't i let go???????


Because grief takes a long time to stop hurting. 

I've read every word of this thread and I am really angry that this 'man' has behaved worse than the average 5 year old. 

I hate to sound harsh but the time for self pity is coming to a close and it's time to reclaim your life. I hope you can attempt one or all of the following:

An appointment with a lawyer to serve him with divorce papers.
Getting served with sort out any 'confusion' for the poor man, leaving him in no doubt.

A block on communication with him. If he calls, don't answer. You are too busy to talk to him. If he emails, do not reply or reply with 'I have no inclination to respond to this.'

On your next trip to town, find the library and specifically, the notice board. Find and join one local group. No, it doesn't matter that you have never done art/archery/pottery/car mechanics before - just pick one and join it. Joining something means you have to show up and you have to leave the house and speak to real live people.

Find a GP. While you are in the library, talk to people and get their opinion on who is good and who isn't. 

Above all, never doubt yourself. You have more balls than the guy you married and it's way past time he knew it.


----------



## missmolly

now for some light entertainment 
He phoned me tonight and it quickly went belly up 
I wrote to him afterwards, somewhat tongue in cheek (which he never understood) - i shall include my email here

Thanks for that
I shall remember our last ‘civil’ conversation forever
How ‘civil’ is linked to you feeling good about yourself
It will shape how we go forward

I am sorry that I failed you 
I am sorry that I could not make you happy in any way whatsoever. 
I am sorry that I was not good enough for you

I did my best, always. I am sorry that you needed a better best

I will remember that some tart that you picked up in the back streets of Hanoi was better than someone who put you first for more than 35 years
I will remember how little my loyalty to you meant to you. 

I am sorry that marriage vows meant nothing to you. 

I also had periods of our life when I was not ‘in love’ with you – but I weathered them. This is normal in any marriage. 

I was also in love with another man for a period of our marriage, but I put our promises to each other first as I felt a strong commitment to what marriage is about.

I did not expect butterflies forever, but I did expect 
for better or worse
through sickness and in health 
until death do us part
because we made these promises

I didn’t know that you had included ‘until a better option came along’

I praised you to everyone I ever met. I admired you. I respected you. I was proud of you. And it was genuine.
Not a ploy or an ego stroking play.

And you didn’t have to buy me. 

What a ****ing fool I was. 

I regret my naive belief in you 
I regret that I trusted you 
I regret that I believed you to be a fine person. 

The whole marriage is one big regret. 

RM was right after all. 
I shall let her know so that she can gloat.


----------



## missmolly

I challenged him to respond
He is the master of ignore 
Here is the response and my comments

what a crock of ****


You challenged me to respond. So I am. 


Because I think you will always continue to bait bait?? request or deserve might be more to the point. me for a response. You seem also to want it on your terms. nonsensical comment You want me to disclose all and bare my soul. I cannot. why not?? do you owe me nothing??


What you said below is true. I acknowledge that. In so doing, I am exposing my soul I guess. In so doing, I am acknowledging that I have thrown it all away... and for what you might ask? Real happiness? To do want I really want for the rest of my life? I cannot for the life of me, explain why this has happened, except to say, that it did. Regrets, yes of course. Can I turn the clock back? I wish I could. bull**** – you will self gratify till you die –RM convinced me of that. The past has happened, we have only the present, and the future is yet to come which for me, is deadly uncertain.


Have I done the "right" thing? From the perspective of many, no! But what is really the right thing? Holding onto something that you feel and know wasn't working, pretending, being drawn inexorably to a lifeless existence? Could you not have told me of your abject misery and removed yourself honourably? You deserve an award for your acting abilty. No one prevented you from telling you how miserable I was making you. I was told not to hold on to anything that made me unhappy. whose advice was this? someone who stood for monetary gain?? If so, doubtful quality of advice. Was it a learned and wise person? So I let go,pissed off, relieving yourself of any moral obligation rightly or wrongly. I am judged, sentenced and most probably banished till the end of my days. You mean rejected by normal moral people


----------



## missmolly

I followed it up with (lots more tongue in cheek until after financial settlement - then the fun will set it.)
I replied as I saw fit
I am now very pissed – the only way I can cope with your betrayal.
I know that I am a good person. you can not rob me of that
You have robbed me of every value I held dear. but you will never rob me of my belief that I am not immoral or wicked. 
I will always have enough compassion to see you not rot to death in hell.
You will always have somewhere to come it you are desperate, ill or dying
I loved you enough for too many years to not have compassion and the desire to comfort you in a time of need



Now how's that for light entertainment.
i think i may have turned a corner tonight


----------



## Aunt Ava

Thanks for the update. You definitely sound stronger, well done on the emails. 
You ask why can't you let go, you know this will be a process. This man has been the center of your life for 35 years, small wonder if you are off center for quite some time yet. 

You need to learn to love yourself, more than you ever loved him. You deserve so much more than what he has given you. You have the opportunity to create a new life for yourself. Dream big, find what makes you happy.

I agree with Catherine in hoping that you could relocate to an area that has more to offer you, it sounds fairly isolated there. Although, you garden is a treasure.

Good things are on the horizon for you, wishing you all the best.


----------



## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> I challenged him to respond
> He is the master of ignore
> Here is the response and my comments
> 
> what a crock of ****
> 
> 
> You challenged me to respond. So I am.
> 
> 
> Because I think you will always continue to bait bait?? request or deserve might be more to the point. me for a response. You seem also to want it on your terms. nonsensical comment You want me to disclose all and bare my soul. I cannot. why not?? do you owe me nothing??
> 
> 
> What you said below is true. I acknowledge that. In so doing, I am exposing my soul I guess. In so doing, I am acknowledging that I have thrown it all away... and for what you might ask? Real happiness? To do want I really want for the rest of my life? I cannot for the life of me, explain why this has happened, except to say, that it did. Regrets, yes of course. Can I turn the clock back? I wish I could. bull**** – you will self gratify till you die –RM convinced me of that. The past has happened, we have only the present, and the future is yet to come which for me, is deadly uncertain.
> 
> 
> Have I done the "right" thing? From the perspective of many, no! But what is really the right thing? Holding onto something that you feel and know wasn't working, pretending, being drawn inexorably to a lifeless existence? Could you not have told me of your abject misery and removed yourself honourably? You deserve an award for your acting abilty. No one prevented you from telling you how miserable I was making you. I was told not to hold on to anything that made me unhappy. whose advice was this? someone who stood for monetary gain?? If so, doubtful quality of advice. Was it a learned and wise person? So I let go,pissed off, relieving yourself of any moral obligation rightly or wrongly. I am judged, sentenced and most probably banished till the end of my days. You mean rejected by normal moral people


He sounds like an angry 18 year old giving an "I'll prove you wrong" speech as he hops on a bus to NYC in search of his dream to become an actor.


----------



## Bellavista

When a person makes a poor decision, they have to justify that decision somehow. To us on the outside, we find their reasoning and logic flawed, as with what your H has written.
However, if he to be able to keep going each day, he has to keep justifying his choices to himself and to anybody who asks. Obviously his reasoning is faulty and there are many holes you could pick in it, but it won't help. For him to face his arguments are flawed, is to face that he has made poor choices and he is not at that point yet.
He may also feel that he has gone too far to turn around, that he is stuck with the choice he has made so he repeats the mantra he has made to himself.

You are grieving. Not only the loss of the husband you thought you had, but the loss of your dreams of the future. You probably feel shame and don't want to go out in public. I can understand that. For your own sake, you may have to consider selling or walking away from the property and go to where you have support. You have mentioned you have a daughter with issues near you now, can you leave her area to go to another or do you feel you need to be near her?

Could you look at some kind of volunteer work? I know it is hard to be amongst people when you feel like you have a big sign on you branding you as a bad wife, but you are not and honestly, nobody else who matters sees you that way as well.

Stop self destructing, start re planning your future and dare to dream some new dreams. xx


----------



## missmolly

I feel quite cleansed after my exchanges with the worm last night. 

Today I feel a lightness of spirit that I have not experienced for a very long time.

I will set off later today on the first leg of the trip to pick up my dogs. My lovely cousin will come with me for company.

Bellavista, I KNOW that I wasn't a 'bad wife' and won't ever wear that sign. 

I know that my husband is dead. I also know that I want no part of what he is now. He and his **** are well suited.


----------



## Catherine602

MissMolly I'd like you to work on going dark on him. Remember that I said in a previous post that expressing your hurt and anger will not have the effect you intended? 

You are actually helping him by comminicating with him. He cannot hear you. He hears absolution in your expression of anger and hurt. 

The best thing to do is to let him sit in his own sh!t. Don't give him a chance to say anything to hurt you. Business only. Please try to get to that place. 

It won't be perfect at first but after a time you will be able to do it. I think you will be amazed at how destabilizing this one thing will be to the love birds. 

With no opposition, there is no one to play the fantasy role of parental unit in this dime store version of Romeo and Juliet. The lovers will just have each other, kind of raw that. 

MissMolly I can only imagine how your mind will picture this but be realistic. You love him so it is easy for you to overlook the fact that he is a man in his latter years.

He looks and acts every bit of it though. How physically welcomed do you think grandpa is to this girl? The first thing she will do is get him busy getting money. 

She will hold out the possibility of sex to keep him on the hook. Sadly, he will allow himself to be degraded to keep up the dream of being 20 and in love. Poor azz. 

He won't tell you that she is playing him. 

As for being there when he crawls back. I sincerely hope you have come to your senses by then. 

If you continue in this train of thought, I don't know if I can control myself enough to not visit Australia to take you by the shoulders and speak forcefully to you. 

Go dark please!


----------



## SaltInWound

Catherine602 said:


> He looks and acts every bit of it though. How physically welcomed do you think grandpa is to this girl? The first thing she will do is get him busy getting money.
> 
> She will hold out the possibility of sex to keep him on the hook. Sadly, he will allow himself to be degraded to keep up the dream of being 20 and in love. Poor azz.


So true. I'm sure when my husband gets dressed in the morning, I'm sure he looks in the mirror and says 

"Mirror Mirror on the wall
Who is the studliest one of all"

The mirror replies

"Time has not been kind to you
Wake up you fool and get a clue"

Unfortunately, my husband doesn't speak the language of the mirror and hears

"You have everything they want and more
Your studliness goes to the core"

The fog is so thick with my husband, he really can't understand that a 20 something foreign woman isn't going to be attracted to a short old bald fat (think pregnant) man unless he opens his wallet and has a ticket to America, the land of luxury. He literally is romancing on borrowed money. She got herself a broke dud.


----------



## alte Dame

Yes, please go dark. Do this for you. Don't even do business with him - let your attorney do it.


----------



## missmolly

It is my greatest desire to have the strength to never contact the worm again. 
Please keep whipping me. 
I received another soppy email from him today where he rambles on about my 'innate goodness and fairness'.
I have ignored it. 
Day 1 of absolutely NC is drawing to an end. 
I look forward to acheiving day 101.
I suppose I will have to start the legal ball rolling again soon but i need a rest from travel
I picked up my dogs and car and am home again after a 700km round trip in 24 hours. 
My sister is not speaking to me as she thinks that I should be 'over the sulking by now'.
When I told her that I thought her heartless, she hung up on me and sent her husband to hand over the dogs. 

It seems that I can't win anywhere at the moment.


----------



## FalconKing

missmolly said:


> It is my greatest desire to have the strength to never contact the worm again.
> Please keep whipping me.
> I received another soppy email from him today where he rambles on about my 'innate goodness and fairness'.
> I have ignored it.
> Day 1 of absolutely NC is drawing to an end.
> I look forward to acheiving day 101.
> I suppose I will have to start the legal ball rolling again soon but i need a rest from travel
> I picked up my dogs and car and am home again after a 700km round trip in 24 hours.
> My sister is not speaking to me as she thinks that I should be 'over the sulking by now'.
> When I told her that I thought her heartless, she hung up on me and sent her husband to hand over the dogs.
> 
> It seems that I can't win anywhere at the moment.


It's hard to be over someone when you have spent decades together with them as a life partner and their indecisiveness tugs and torments you. The road is lonely but you CAN do this. You WILL do this. Don't let the negativity and selfishness of other people disrupt you. Easier said than done. Much easier said. But those wobbly legs will become strong the more you walk.


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## Catherine602

What selfish insensitive behavior. When people feel powerless to relieve the pain of a loved one, they often run away from it. That may be part of it. It could also be fear that it could happen to her.

Don't expect much from her and don't give much to her at this time. You don't have anything to share with people who cannot give equally to you. 

Just as an aside, would you feel comfortable making this a mantra MM. I think you may have gone through your life giving much more than you get back. 

How about starting now- give only as much as you get. Friends, family, aquentences everyone. That's not selfish, it's realistic. Few people appreciate things they don't work for.

You husbands behavior is taken right out of the cheaters playbook. It is amazing the similarity in the things they do and say. Cheaters rewrite their marital script to justify their deception. I believe there are post on this site outlining the cheaters script. 

Read and memorize the cheaters script so your husbands craziness does not rub off on you. You will be able to anticipate him. Knowledge is power and offers you some control. 

Read about cheating and what happens in the brain of cheaters. It is for you so that you put this cheaters behavior in a bin as far away as possible from your heart. 

When you are tempted to call him, - to appeal to his common sense or to the person he was before, think of what you will be doing. Staying engaged, appealing to him, expressing anger, trying to guilt him will not make him come to his senses. 

It will make it easy for him to stay in the fantasy. He needs your opposition, when she goes through him like sh!t through a duck. He can blame you. Who wants to be an old fool who has been used and tossed aside. Stop getting in his way gurl. 

You will do much better in your mind if you stop fighting this. Let it go to run its own course. There really is nothing that will stop this from playing out. 

Giving up control is difficult because we all think that action will bring results. In some situations, letting go gets the best results for you.

Try hard.


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## alte Dame

Stay dark, divine Miss M. Let that be your mantra. One step at a time, one minute at a time, dark to your POSWH.


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## missmolly

Now into Day 2 and feeling strong. 

I had planned, booked, and paid for, out of our marital funds, an eight day holiday in a neighbouring country for the TET break. 

The worm and the toe nail cutter left to enjoy this yesterday. 

Oh how this fires my strength.

Catherine, I have read and re read just about every word ever written about the 'cheater's script' and have recognised how perfectly he has followed it. 
A large part of my self loathing has been because, despite knowing all this, I continued to be pathetic and weak. 

My sister has apologised.


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## Louise7

missmolly said:


> It is my greatest desire to have the strength to never contact the worm again.
> Please keep whipping me.
> I received another soppy email from him today where he rambles on about my 'innate goodness and fairness'.
> I have ignored it.
> Day 1 of absolutely NC is drawing to an end.
> I look forward to acheiving day 101.
> I suppose I will have to start the legal ball rolling again soon but i need a rest from travel
> I picked up my dogs and car and am home again after a 700km round trip in 24 hours.
> My sister is not speaking to me as she thinks that I should be 'over the sulking by now'.
> When I told her that I thought her heartless, she hung up on me and sent her husband to hand over the dogs.
> 
> It seems that I can't win anywhere at the moment.


Please go right ahead and sulk and tell your sister to shove it, sideways - where the sun don't shine. You are doing a great job. The worm is exactly that - no backbone and I never ever trust any species without a backbone. You do not need to speak with him because you are getting a lawyer to do that for you. Tickle the dogs behind the ears, water them trees and sleep. The rest you rise above and let the lawyer deal with.


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## Louise7

missmolly said:


> Now into Day 2 and feeling strong.
> 
> I had planned, booked, and paid for, out of our marital funds, an eight day holiday in a neighbouring country for the TET break.
> 
> The worm and the toe nail cutter left to enjoy this yesterday.
> 
> Oh how this fires my strength.
> 
> Catherine, I have read and re read just about every word ever written about the 'cheater's script' and have recognised how perfectly he has followed it.
> A large part of my self loathing has been because, despite knowing all this, I continued to be pathetic and weak.
> 
> My sister has apologised.


Okay, so your sister is growing a spine. Deeply pleased you still have more balls than most.


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## alte Dame

I'm glad your sister has apologized. Sometimes other people's pain is simply not manageable, even for family. (My own sisters rely on me for emotional (and all other...) support, but would be flabbergasted if I expected support from them.)

Your H is a very special case, in my opinion. He's a special kind of cheater.

He's so weak that he's helpless to resist the OW. He also can't do without you. And he can't make up his mind. And he can't live with his behavior. He can't seem to do much of anything that requires some strength and maturity and an end to the self-serving navel-gazing. What do you do when a man in his 60's is a blubbering, indecisive fool?

I'm sorry Miss M for being so critical of your H's character, but he's torpedoed his good name in short order. What he has done to you is self-indulgent to the extreme.

The more you stay dark, the more in control of the situation you are. For every day he is on your vacation, you do something excellent for yourself and let him stick it where the sun don't shine.

Have you read 'The Scarlet Letter'? He's Arthur Dimmesdale.


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## missmolly

I continue with my resolve to not contact him.

No one will ever convince me that I did not have years with a beautiful man who I loved deeply and passionately - but something happened to him and my old friend is now dead forever.

I am now wondering if the roots of our childhood do not re emerge as we get older
My mother in law was a kind, sweet, but very uncomplicated woman who loved even when she was walked all over. She made no demands and accepted whatever was handed to her. Sounds a bit like the new chick.

My father was strong, intellectual, challenging, somewhat intolerant of weakness in others, and although Victorian in his distant demeanor, was intensely loyal and honourabe
I find myself thinking of him a lot lately.

Interesting though, that his three daughters married extremely affectionate men.


----------



## missmolly

BTW, i have just had my first day without tears since early November, last year.

Cant stop listening to Katie Melua's "Closest thing to Crazy"


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## SaltInWound

Miss Molly, I think the vacation will be good for you. I have received much therapy from listening to music about having internal strength. 

My go to song is 

Duran Duran- Still Breathing
DURAN DURAN "Still Breathing" - YouTube


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## Catherine602

Hi what was his father like and what was your mother like? 

Who was more like his mother in your relationship? What did he think about his mother? Did he get along well? Did he repect her? 

Are you taking any trips in the near future? Do you think that planning a trip to coincide with the time they are getting back would be good? 

Btw, how do you know what this girl is like? Did he tell you that? Was it said in contrast to yiu? 

If she is so sweet and yielding, how did she manage to get such a large sum of money from him. I doubt that he gave such a sum to her spontaneously. She had to have asked him. 

Hummm would a woman who will take whatever she is given have the balls to ask for a large sum of money? A sum that is more than a years wages i hink you said. Uncomplicated, you read her emails, did they sound like she was uncomplicated? 

I have an idea

She is being what he expects. The stary-eyed phase he is in makes him project what he wants her to be, at his command. He would not notice the cracks in her mask. 

I can nearly guarantee you that she is not like his mother. She is the wrong age, young Asian women have been influenced by western culture. And she is in the wrong line of work. 

She has to skillfully separate resources from men that they would not normally be willing to part with. She will have to have an iron will, patience and ability to manipulate. Does that describe her better? 

He will see that side of her clearly after a while. She has to get her tentacles into him more securely before she treats him in a careless fashion. 

I work in scientific research and teach. I have had Asian male and females in my lab and classes. Some wre married, or had bf. None of them acted like the stereotypical Asian woman. The husbands were westerners or Asian. 

The submissiveness that i expected seems to be a myth. Maybe the ceremonial traditional practices like Geisha's and tea ceremony in Japan, ceremonial dances in Thialand and Vietnam give the impression of submissiveness. 

The women I knew ruled the roost. They ruled with a soft sweet club. They told their husbands what they wanted and they wanted a lot. Many of the husbands cooked and catered to them. not what I expected. 

I think western men buy into the muth because they prefer a woman who does not challenge them. Asian women are as complicated as any woman. 

If i can generalize i found them to be very strong willed in general. They worked hard and did not give up in the face of failure. Not like my Western fellows at all.


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## Catherine602

Keep up the good work!!


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## missmolly

My likening of his mother and the new chick, is no doubt as she wants to appear. I have no doubt that she is a crafty little actress.

I discouraged any talk about her, but he occasionally made comments. It was never as a blatant comparison with me. 
But I read their emails and a picture formed from those. 
Hers were praise and undying love, his mentioned his appreciation of her wonderful cooking and serving of him

I was heartily tired of eating out every night, but every time I suggested cooking at home he would reply that he loved the restaurant life we were living.

His need for a coffee or a wine would always arise before mine, therefore he initiated and tended to these things and served me. 
We always shared domestic chores but as we had a maid, these were few and far between.

He loved his mother very much. She died not long after we moved overseas but she had advanced dementia (she was 93) and the last few years had been rather ‘empty’. The last time we visited she looked at him, gave a beautiful sweet smile, and told him ‘I have a son who looks very much like you – I love him so much’. She continually thanked me for making him so happy and giving her her grandchildren

I never knew his father as he had died a few years previous to our meeting. From what I can glean, I think he might have been a bit of a bully.

My mother – gosh that’s complex. I remember her as being strong and fiery and have many memories of loud, scary arguments with my father. She was always kind and generous to others, and had many friends. Dad was a bit of a loner. 
Over the years, she became a lot calmer, and spent a lot of her time involved in charitable works. All grandchildren adored her and spent a lot of time with her. 

She spent the last ten years of my father’s life caring for him at home after he had a stroke. 
Her care was devoted and exemplary.

Re my H’s giving of money. I can just imagine how it went.

She would look worried, he would ask why and she would allow him to coax it out of her.

She told him that her family was about to lose their small farm holding. They had had to remortgage and foreclosure was pending. He told me that she finally showed him the demands from the financier and he promised to help. He sent this money as part of the’breakup’ email which he sent from here.

She had also asked him to help look after her mother and child (her child lives with her mother) and he had told her that he would look into that later. I threatened him with murder at this stage.

In the breakup email, he also told her that she was to keep all the other gifts, and when I asked what these were, he told me of clothing, cosmetics, jewelry, a motorbike and helmet, and more.

And of course she had free board and lodgings in a large luxurious apartment, and no doubt a top end restaurant life when she wasn’t slaving over a hot stove for him .


----------



## missmolly

BTW the breakup email I refer to was the one which I wasn't meant to see. I found it whilst snooping.

There was another which he showed to me and it was fairly brief and to the point. He sent both on the same day.

I was able to raise these topics as she thanked him for his help when she responded and he showed this to me before he realized that it implicated him.

Anyway, all this crap is academic at this point. What does any of it matter?


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## alte Dame

You are absolutely right that your new H isn't the man that you knew for so many years. I'm assuming that he didn't used to be a fool that could be parted from his money so easily by a young con artist who sees an easy sugar daddy mark. This is really sad, but mostly infuriating and devastating for you.

And the deceit and lies; even while he is supposedly recommitting to you because he couldn't stand himself, he sends a secret, real e-mail. 

I'm hoping you will continue to take things one day at a time. Each day you stay dark is a day closer to sanity for you.


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## Bellavista

Well, he will discover for himself that he has not taken on just another woman, but an entire extended family.

He will now have to financially support all of her family or she will make him feel guilt in the extreme.

Rest assured MM, he will pay greatly for what he has done. Make sure your spousal support in the separation is generous, you need to get your portion before she syphons the rest off for her family.


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## jmb123

Miss Molly,

The fact is the OW in your case happens to be an ASIAN.What if she was an AMERICAN or EUROPEAN.Would your pain be less in this case.Also,then what level of support would you get from other posters here who repeatedly bring out the fact that she beig an ASIAN.
WHy does it have to be potrayed in that manner.Its not about races.Not even about money.
I feel bad becuse I am an Indian hence an ASIAN.Also the ones who profess about western culture do they know anything about the EASTERN culture. In no culture cheating is professed.Infidelity is highly disregarded.But the world is teh way it is.Has got nothing to do with races.

I really feel here the OW woman is of no consideration,she could have been an asian,a european or american ;but the fact is it is the POS Husband of yours who brought about this misery i your life.

And are you really getting comfort by talking about that piece of shot husbnd of yours and how his life is going to be with that *****?
Is it conducive to your well being and healing.No it is going to keep you occupied,thinking what he did ,why he did,what he must be doing,how your life was once...always revolving around this thing.It has been a few montrhs now.I really feel it is time to start a helathy life however tough.

I really feel that its time you do things that needs to be done.Like what had been mentioned by AUnt AVa.Be done with your legal stuff.Protect yourself legally.
On the emotional front you have to stand strong and not want such a man again in your life who is as good as dead afyter cheating on you.You have to learn to live life independently without him.


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## Catherine602

Jmb This is unnecessary and cruel. 

If you are so sensitive to read about a negative occurence in an Asian country then dont read. 

It does take control to avoid posting something that is purposefully meant to hurt a person already in pain. You need to learn to hold your tongue out of compassion and empathy. 

I don't think this site is about getting back at people you think should not mention their negative experiences in Asia. 

You ask for tolerence and understanding for your culture but you can't manage to shows those qualities when it was easy to just not read and not post. 

You have done something worse than your accusation, you took a cheap shot. Feel better? I think you should feel ashamed.


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## Catherine602

If you have a beef with a particular member, PM them in the future.


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## missmolly

JMB,
I am not offended at anything that you have said, either on the forum or in PM. 
On the whole I agree with a lot of what you say.
In my case, and in the city in which we were living however, young women would hit on my husband, even when I was with him. It happened over and over again, and I saw it with my own eyes.
I really believe that western men are considered fair game to a lot of those women. 

I agree with you that the onus was on my H to be honourable and he is responsible for his own behaviour.


----------



## jmb123

Catherine602 said:


> Jmb This is unnecessary and cruel.
> 
> If you are so sensitive to read about a negative occurence in an Asian country then dont read.
> 
> It does take control to avoid posting something that is purposefully meant to hurt a person already in pain. You need to learn to hold your tongue out of compassion and empathy.
> 
> I don't think this site is about getting back at people you think should not mention their negative experiences in Asia.
> 
> You ask for tolerence and understanding for your culture but you can't manage to shows those qualities when it was easy to just not read and not post.
> 
> You have done something worse than your accusation, you took a cheap shot. Feel better? I think you should feel ashamed.


Dear Catherine,

Ashamed for what? for not taking your generalizations.
Yes I am senstive and rightly so and henceforth am not reading your posts to Miss Molly definitely.And I do not need to ask you for any tolerance.My culture is what it is.All i said is do not generalize .That is not conduccive to anyone.It is like having a blind-fold and remaining away from reality.

I am really sorry if I hurt you in any manner . 



Also though I am sensitive,I am not a biased person and can see the world for what it is.And that makes the difference.What is a fact remains so irresepective of what either of us would like to think.
Though I have seen how kind and considerate you have been to MM .This kind fault finding in others instead of focusing on onself-in the name of placing the facts clear -is not going to help anbody.
I hope we do not hijack MM's space with further bickerings.
Peace and luck to both of us and to Miss Molly.

Also you talk about being rude,look at the usage of your words(hold your tongue,cheapshot,vengenace- interesting is it not)


----------



## missmolly

Catherine602 said:


> She has mad skills. She got a lot out of him in a short time and he hardly knew her. She should teach a Master class on "the art of love and the quick buck" or maybe "how to fall in love with a generous man" or "how to fall in love with a mans generosity". All three would be appropriate.
> 
> I am loath to cast any dispersion upon her. It may just be that she fell under his spell after his relentless persuit and offers of money and gifts.
> 
> That makes your husband the ogre. You need to consider that her position is more sympathetic than your own so move on and let the love birds alone. Its been a month.
> 
> How did he manage to spend all of that money when you have control of the finances? That's not pocket change. He is going to need a lot more than what now that he has acquired a large family.
> 
> They will all need clothes, motorbikes, land, houses. He can't deny one if he gives to the others. I don't think it is wise for a man his age to spend so much. He should be spending sensibly. He will not be able to bring in an income forever.
> 
> Oh well I am sure his beloved will look out for him and not let him flit away all of his life savings on her and her family. Even if he does I am certain she will care for him into his golden years.
> 
> Of couse, speculating on what they are doing with your husbands half of the marital assets is none of your business MM. It is his money and by association hers as well.
> 
> It is possible that he may find himself out of money, and home if things don't go well with his beloved. Nothing is garenteed in love. Maybe she will let him borrow one of the bikes he purchased and enough pocket change for gas to get to a call box and give you a ring.
> 
> I hope you are still in no contact or trying as much as you can. If they are traveling you will probably not hear much. The test is when he starts communicating again.
> 
> What have you been doing? Are the dogs adjusting to being back home? What breed are they?


All he told me of their meeting was 'she hit on me and I went with it'. I didn't want to know anymore. 

Yes, I managed our finances as I had more free time than him.. But that doesn't mean that he didn't have access to it. 
Unfortunately for him, he never bothered to activate his access to our other accounts so I have been trickling funds into the ones that he doesn't have access to. He does however have access to our retirement fund.

i have not heard a word from him since he went on vacation. I didn't really expect to. 
Today I paid the retainer to my lawyer and will get the ball rolling there 

I had my first session with the psychologist/counselor today and it went well. I felt a great rapport with him.

He asked me if I had ever considered that my H's behaviour towards me in recent times was abusive. He affirmed that it was. 
He also suggested that he was in need of psychiatric, not even psychological help - quite interesting from opposing disciplines.

He talked of my H's (it is also his initial) 'splitting' which he found a worry. 

Bottom line though, he agrees that NC is the only way forward and encouraged me to follow through with this.

I am still bored senseless here. My dogs are a diversion as I have spent much time clipping and grooming them. They pick up very much on my mood and look worried a lot of the time. 
My young female is a pure bred, but anxious, Maltese ball of pretty white fluff, and the male is a Maltese/Yorkshire cross who is champagne coloured and very attractive. He is an angel and does not have a mean bone in his body.


----------



## Zing

Even though I haven't been posting regularly like Catherine and some of the others, I just wanted to drop in to say that I have been following your story and wish you strength and luck...keep being strong MM...many of the suggestions posted by people before me are very useful...hope you are able to find a creative outlet for the anguish in you...loads of love your way...


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## missmolly

Zing said:


> Even though I haven't been posting regularly like Catherine and some of the others, I just wanted to drop in to say that I have been following your story and wish you strength and luck...keep being strong MM...many of the suggestions posted by people before me are very useful...hope you are able to find a creative outlet for the anguish in you...loads of love your way...


Thanks for your support Zing, I need all I can get at the moment. 
It is the endless empty time that really gets to me - I sat outside the counselor's office today and wondered what to do next. I could think of nothing.


----------



## missmolly

please someone help me


----------



## Bellavista

C, just take a breathe. You can make it through. I know the pain is intense, so bad you want to die, but that is not the answer.

We are all pulling for you, we want you to succeed and recover.


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## Catherine602

missmolly said:


> please someone help me


What do you need?

MissMolly you must find some way of becoming busy. Perhaps taking a look into putting the isolated property on salle. You dont have to actually do it but look into it and it may be eiser than yiu think. 

Either that or close the place up for a few months and move to a place closer to a larger town. 

I think this is an absolute must now. Staying in that physically isolated place for now may be dangerous. You don't need to be isolated now. 

It is difficult to take action when you feel overwhelmed but the rate limiting step is starting the ball rolling. Just start and you will pick up momentum. 

Ok say so what plans can you form to begin the process of decreasing your isolation. No road blocks are allowed to stop you. They may be considerations to take into account and deal with but not absolute impediments. 

So what's the plan. Just a small action to get going. 

No drinking!


----------



## Catherine602

Frankly I am worried about the dogs. You are going to snip them bald. They'll look a sight and they will know it.

I wonder what they look like with no hair. I don't want to know. 

Let's have a plan MM I am waiting. Homework is due.


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## Catherine602

I like the idea of taking a temporary break from the place. It des not have to be long at first. You will have to make arrangements to hire people to care for things while you are gone. 

You will need to decide where to go and what to do when you get there. Plan for travel and then do it. My suggestions may not be practical because I don't have the details but don't reject them on that basis alone. Come up with a more suitable plan. 

You said in many previous post that you had self loathing. This saddens me that you harbor these feelings. You have such a beautiful heart. I can't understand where this comes from. 

I think that it may be the abuse your IC identified. Abusive relationships can break you down. 

How to build you up again. 

I'll be back soon. You have work to do. 

You have to find yourself again. Build yourself from the floor up.


----------



## missmolly

I really lost it last night.

My sister leaves for her holiday tomorrow and was hounding me on Skype for the details of restaurants, tailors, shops, attractions, etc and by the time I had written it all out and made maps for her, I was seeing the life I left behind. Not the marriage, but the life. My days were full and interesting and I had to leave it through no choice of my own.

By the end of that little exercise, I was a blubbering mess. 

I have thought more about the psychologist's use of the word abuse but am not sure about how appropriate it is. I was by no means a suppressed person, and in fact had to pull myself back at times from being domineering and bossy. 
I was acutely aware of this flaw and worked on keeping it under control always. Also, I would always win arguments, not that we had many, for I will not argue unless I KNOW that I'm right, and then will argue to the death.

My self loathing stems from my recent behaviour of being weak willed in the face of knowledge and truth. I hope I have broken that cycle now. 

I intend to finish the renovations here myself. I am not prepared to take a huge loss on the house and have spent time drawing out my plans and will start getting quotes. 


It's just after 3am here and I'm up, bright eyed and bushy tailed because I went to bed early last night. Never a good idea.


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## Aunt Ava

Renovations are an excellent way to distract yourself! Tons of decisions to focus on. You can also distract yourself by thinking of what you would like to do in the future. Is there somewhere you have wanted to visit, learn all about it. Is there a new hobby you would like to investigate. Did you want to take up ballroom dancing? Start dreaming again. 

Once the renovations are done you can make a fresh start and will be well on your way in healing.


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## missmolly

I have just uploaded some pictures of my beautiful babies, in a private album for those who are 'friends' and have access


----------



## missmolly

Bellavista said:


> C, just take a breathe. You can make it through. I know the pain is intense, so bad you want to die, but that is not the answer.
> 
> We are all pulling for you, we want you to succeed and recover.


Thank you Bella, I did just that.


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## alte Dame

Your therapist sounds very good. Your H has abused you, but in what I call the Fitzgeraldian sense of the word 'careless.' I think of this usage often on TAM because the behavior is so sadly common:

"They were careless people, Tom and Daisy-- they smashed up things and creatures and then retreated back into their money or their vast carelessness, or whatever it was the kept them together, and let other people clean up the mess they had made"

The difference between these characters and your H is that he wrings his hands over the fact that he feels helpless to not hurt you. He isn't helpless, though. He is weak in this regard.

I think he needs a psychiatrist, too. The man is a wrecking crew at the moment and is making unbalanced decisions.

I know it is impolitic for me to say this, as well, but your sister is being insensitive re her trip. She should not be taking it under the circumstances, imo.

Deep cleansing breaths. One hour at a time. One new thing a week to add to your schedule.

And lie down and get some sleep, Miss M.


----------



## SaltInWound

alte Dame said:


> I know it is impolitic for me to say this, as well, but your sister is being insensitive re her trip. She should not be taking it under the circumstances, imo.


If she were taking the trip, the right thing to do is not talk about it and definitely don't expect MM to be a travel agent. Right now, I don't even like hearing references to the country where my "home" is. It triggers me big time.


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## SaltInWound

alte Dame said:


> The difference between these characters and your H is that he wrings his hands over the fact that he feels helpless to not hurt you. He isn't helpless, though. He is weak in this regard.
> 
> I think he needs a psychiatrist, too. The man is a wrecking crew at the moment and is making unbalanced decisions.


yes, yes, and yes! He knows the outcome will be bad and still he does it. It doesn't make sense.


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## Catherine602

I wonder if there is a way that your sister can be managed? I don't judge her self obsorption because she may never have been in a spot were she needed to give unselfishly. 

There is a fine line. On the one hand, you need to maintain a close relationship but it needs to adjust to fit the circumstances now. 

She seems not to want to acknowlege the profound change in your life. Is is almost as if she is pretending it did not happen. 

That is something your IC may be able to help you negotiate. 

Giving her travel info, most of which she could have collected and asked a few details, took a lot out of you. How will you handle something like this again?

I think that you need to protect yourself and sensitive people to the fact that you are not able to give as much as you did before this happened.

What did your phychologist mean by saying he split? I think he may have some underlying medical issue. He seems so childlike and rutterless, not a person who could handle a job requiring leadership and cognitive facility. 

Has his ability to work changed?


----------



## SaltInWound

Catherine602 said:


> What did your phychologist mean by saying he split?* I think he may have some underlying medical issue.* He seems so childlike and rutterless, not a person who could handle a job requiring leadership and cognitive facility.
> 
> Has his ability to work changed?


I think that is what MM had suggested at the beginning of this thread.


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## missmolly

Catherine602 said:


> What did your psychologist mean by saying he split? I think he may have some underlying medical issue. He seems so childlike and rutterless, not a person who could handle a job requiring leadership and cognitive facility.
> 
> Has his ability to work changed?


The comment about splitting was part of a larger description of compartmentalization. How he appeared to be separating aspects of his life and not allowing them to overlap. The psychologist ('G' from now on), thought it extreme to the point of worrying.

My H had complained that his short term memory loss was worrying him (and me) and also that he felt he was losing concentration. He said the effort to remain totally focused all the time was exhausting him. 

His problem.


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## Catherine602

I wonder if it is the earliest signs of dementia. Well that is his problem. 

What did you do today? I hope you left some hair on the dogs. What kinds of things are you planning for the house?


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## alte Dame

missmolly said:


> The comment about splitting was part of a larger description of compartmentalization. How he appeared to be separating aspects of his life and not allowing them to overlap. The psychologist ('G' from now on), thought it extreme to the point of worrying.
> 
> My H had complained that his short term memory loss was worrying him (and me) and also that he felt he was losing concentration. He said the effort to remain totally focused all the time was exhausting him.
> 
> His problem.


I can't help but worry that he will deteriorate and wind up on your doorstep to take care of. I hope you have an affordable full-care nursing home that you can drop him off at.


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## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> I can't help but worry that he will deteriorate and wind up on your doorstep to take care of. I hope you have an affordable full-care nursing home that you can drop him off at.


Think Kathy Bates in 'Misery'


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## alte Dame

missmolly said:


> Think Kathy Bates in 'Misery'


LOL. Or Nurse Ratched.

(But then again, that would mean that you'd have to be there. I'd just dump him off at the home and then catch a plane to Tahiti.)


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## missmolly

Catherine602 said:


> I wonder if it is the earliest signs of dementia. Well that is his problem.
> 
> What did you do today? I hope you left some hair on the dogs. What kinds of things are you planning for the house?


Get ready to get your socks rocked off. 
Hey, I don't clip them every day!! Did you see the pics I posted of them, myself, and my children?? You will have to 'befriend' me to see the album as it is a private one on my profile page. 

Today I finally fell asleep at 6.30am and slept until 11am
I have been sewing and making the best of my clothes 2 sizes smaller. 

The house? Well I will go on with a modified version of what we had planned to do. A new kitchen, repositioning of a couple of walls, and turning a few windows into French doors. I will also add some pergolas. I am drawing the plans and looking to get some quotes. 

His Lordship has condescended to come and do the wall repositioning and whatever I ask of him. I hope he doesn't renege (that spelling looks incorrect) on that as it will add thousands to the cost. He is extremely good with his hands and is a good worker. I shall have the whip out. 

I have not been in touch with him, but he had already agreed to do that. 

We also have a half demolished bathroom which will have to be completed.

Still NC from me, not that I have heard from him. Holidays are too much fun.

Posting the legal agreement back to the lawyer was a shaky moment, but I toughened up quickly.


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## Catherine602

Has he remained in contact with your daughter with BPD? You said he was good at getting her calm when she had a crisis. He will of course contact you in the near future and when he does, answer the email to remind him that he has a daughter that he elected to bring into the world. She is troubled and needs him to keep in contact with her and to show at lest a little concern for how she is doing. 

Having a gf near her age does not replace her. Say it in a nice way out if concern for your daughter who must be feeling abandoned by her father. That is one of the core issues in BPD. 

I don't know about having him work on the house MM. it may cost thousands more but it may be worth the extra money. Having him do the work my give him the impression that he is working off his debt to you and his family. Secondly he is in the house and around you. There is no way that you can do no contact with him in the house. That defeats what NC can do. 

You are the main beneficiary of NC. That is the only way that you are going to be able to look ahead at a new life. Having him in the house will have falling back into habits that have existed between you two for 3 decades. You are at the cusp of a new life. You are too unsteady now to be pulled backwards by his presence. He can see tge house when it is completed and when you are happy in your new life. You can thank him sincerely for freeing you to live your own life. 

I am not naive to think that it is easy to turn away from a shared life and all of the plans you made. What happened with your sister was a case in point. However, when you are ready to put on small step after another to make a life for yourself, the momentum will start and it will get easier to move ahead. 

While you are getting through the legal process and the preparations for separation of assets, start making those tiny steps. It will make the process easier on your mind. 

Is it possible for you to avoid situation that trigger bad reaction like the one with your sister? I think she needs to know that she needs to be more careful about what she dies and says. The best way to make a person who takes you for granted take notice is to stop giving them more than you are getting from them. She will notice the absence. Let her know you need her now.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602

I forgot how to make a friend request. Can you tell me.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## FalconKing

Catherine602 said:


> I forgot how to make a friend request. Can you tell me.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Haha I had the same problem. I added people to my contacts but they were still not my friend. It's a specific feature that does it but I don't know how for mobile. And I don't use tapatalk.


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## missmolly

If you left click on a member's name, the bottom choice in the drop down menu is 'Add xxxx to your contacts' -the next screen gives an option to send a friend request and needs to have the box checked.
The recipient then has to accept the request. 
not sure how to do it on a mobile though

Scroll down on member's profile page to see albums on bottom right of page
I named my album 'This and That'
Double click on pictures to enlarge and read caption.


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## missmolly

Catherine,
an issue of separation is that together we were comfortable financially, apart borderline. To modernise this place on my own would just about clean me out, particularly as he is no longer saying 'you can have it all'.
We committed to this house which had sat on the market for a long time. The grounds are beautiful, but the house very uninspiring, but had potential.

We have done this with several houses over the years, and very profitably. This, of all our houses, needed a lot of modernising, but with relatively small effort or investment. 
It just has no market appeal as it is. 

We have already done the expensive, but 'unseen' work, eg house is now totally solar powered, but it still needs more to be aesthetically appealing. All our previous houses sold quickly and easily when we had finished them.

Also the market is very flat here at the moment. 

It is relatively inexpensive to live here due to the solar power, and natural large potable water supply. I get a hefty rebate from the solar in summer, which offsets heating costs in winter. 

I may even decide to stay here. I just don't know yet. It is a house which can can closed up and left, particularly in our winter which of course is summer in the UK, Europe and US. This would enable me to travel if I can find dog sitters.

I am furious that he has walked out leaving me in a house that I wouldn't have chosen to live in as is. 
It could sit on the market for years like this. Currently it is the worst house in the best street, so to speak.

Also, he is talking mid to late April by which time I am hopeful of wearing steel gloves, 24/7


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## missmolly

Hey, and it's a big house - you can all come for holidays 
I no longer feel the need to be anonymous - I'd be proud to meet any of you


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## Catherine602

Boy would I love to go to Australia. It is on our bucket list to go. 

I am your BFF now. 

I saw the dogs what happened to the little ones leg? Was it broken?

Can the dogs go outside to play? Would a kangaroo's or a Tasmanian devil eat them up? They won't make a large meal but in such an arid climate food must be scarce. They would make a hefty snack. 

I love your pictures. You look soooo sweet. Your daughter seated to the right with the blue-gray dress looks like you. 

I understand about the finances but is there any way you can keep contact to a minimum. How about having your son be the go -between? 

What did you do today. What are your plans to get involved with activities that bring you in contact with other people? I know you're busy with the house and sewing and all but those are solitary task. 

You need ones that take you out among people. You may think it is too soon but start small for a short time. Going to the grocers does not count. 

I need a daily report. Glad to hear that you got some sleep. Did you ask your IC about meds to calm you down PRN? You can have them on hand just in case. 

Have you had a drink today? Are you still smoking?


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## missmolly

Yes Mum

No, no drinking. I have a strict 6pm rule which I don't break. 
Now the smoking is another story. I got to day 12 then started again on the day of the 'I'm going on the holiday' phone call. When I can face the nauseating quit smoking meds again I will give it another go. 

Little Ned snapped his ACL and had to have a reconstruction and graft. He was not allowed to walk on it for 6 weeks and he was so good about it. 
He cried only once, and that was on the first night when I put him in that little bed that I had made up on the floor. After lifting him up onto my bed, there wasn't ever another squeak out of him.

The daughter you referred to is my youngest, the one with BPD. The one in the middle is blonde and arrived for the family portraits with dyed black hair and blonde roots. She was also bared footed. She looks very like her father. They all arrived lookiing like ragamuffins so I took off my silk shirt and wore a T shirt. 

My son as go between? Err - I don't think so. He is what I describe 'a funny fish'.. He rejects all modern technology and does not use computers or mobile phones. He was a very prem baby and had lots of problems. He is eccentric and different, but kind and honest in an innocent kind of way. He is in a greater state of disbelief about this situation than any of us.

I drove into town today and sat in the shade and cried for a long time. I looked around me at all the passers by and wondered where on earth to start. 

Tonight my cousin and I are going for dinner to a lovely little country pub which is close by. i have avoided it as they all know my H and assume that I have gone back. 

I have already had to explain it all to someone today. I have ignored emails from an old friend since arriving back in Aus and today she called out of concern. Her husband owns a company which makes and installs commercial kitchens and she offered his help to get mine done. Very kind, but they are 900 kms away. 

I think today can only be described as a backwards one. I have told you only the good bits. 

Lots of outdoors for my dogs. I live on five acres and it is quite safe.


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## Catherine602

I am at work so this will be short. Sitting out sounds good, even if you cry. At lest you are not at home crying. Find different places to sit. What you will enjoy doing will come to you eventually. Get out there don't stay home. What happens before 6 relative to drinking. 

How many miles is 900 km. I could look it up but too lazy. Does your cousin live in an area that is nice to visit as in there are things to do? 

On final thing is the med that you are taking for the smoking Chantix? If so look up the side effect profile. I may not be the best at this time. Ok carry on, will check in latter.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## missmolly

good days, bad days 
then there's ****e days


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## missmolly

After the obligatory hour of trying to fall asleep, I am up again with my thoughts racing. 

What happened to this beautiful man who had some sort of hideous personality change in his 63rd year of life. 

I admired and respected him so much and was so proud to be his wife. Perhaps too proud.

How he morphed into this evil monster is more than I can grasp.

His personality change was so extreme that I can't help but wonder if there is a 'posession' that has taken place. i don't normally believe in this sort of thing, but I am now starting to wonder is he has not been taken over by some sort of devil.

I know I am not wrong in my believe of his extraordinary kindness and generosity. I always marveled at his unselfishness.

Now he is possessed of such characteristics that I am still reeling from the shock of it. It is on my mind for every waking moment. And it wakes me from sleep. Could he have suppressed and hidden an evil side from me for 35 years?? Am I an absolute idiot??

There is no doubt that his treatment of me has been cruel and unforgivable. But could anyone truly hide this for almost a lifetime?


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## Catherine602

I marvel too. I can't get a handle on it. If he is as kind and empathetic as e appeared to be, how can he not have called his family for such a long time? How can he take this vacation that you planned? 

I am not as good of a person as he was and I just could not have taken a vac hat you planned. I really think he has a disease that is effecting his reasoning and cognitive abilities. 

Did you two argue during the marriage? Did he assert himself, let you know what he wanted even when it was something you did not want? Did he have a strong personality? Was he a little selfish? 

Some people are too nice and they hide rage for not getting what they want. Could he have been too complient?


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## alte Dame

I agree with Catherine that there is something rotten in Denmark when it comes to your H's mental health. He sounds like he's in the midst of a breakdown.

Thinking this might help you get through the day, but you have to focus laserlike on your own health, mental and otherwise. Whatever is happening with and to your H is taking a dramatic toll on you & you need to call BS on it as much as you can. (I know I'm preaching to the choir, - just trying to offer support.)


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## missmolly

I hate nights.
The dreams are horrid and recurring.
In one which seems to be set on re-run – he is standing looking at me with tears in his eyes.
He tells me that he is truly sorry that he no longer loves me, and loves another. He tells me that he can’t go unless he has my blessing. So he just stands and looks at me and waits for me to say it’s okay.
I am starting to think that this is the reality. 

Mr Nice Guy – possibly a bit in the earlier years. I think I managed to convince him that his opinions, positive and negative, were important.

In retrospect, I realize now that in the weeks leading up to our blowup, he was already gone.
There wasn’t much tension, it was more sort of nothing. 
He complained to me later that he couldn’t bear all the arguments that we were having. We had NONE. He must have been having them with himself inside his head.

All this dwelling on the past is so pointless. 
SO WHY CAN’T I STOP THINKING ABOUT IT?

The bushfires continue to rage. The lives of two volunteer FF's have been lost when a burning tree fell onto the fire truck. 
My IC sent me a text during the night cancelling our appointment early next week. He is also a volunteer FF and has gone to help, not knowing when he will return. 
Again I woke this morning to a haziness and the smell of smoke, even though they are nearly 100 kms away.


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## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> I hate nights.
> The dreams are horrid and recurring.
> In one which seems to be set on re-run – he is standing looking at me with tears in his eyes.
> He tells me that he is truly sorry that he no longer loves me, and loves another. He tells me that he can’t go unless he has my blessing. So he just stands and looks at me and waits for me to say it’s okay..


Are you taking any antidepressants? Some of them cause vivid dreams. I think I recall you previously mentioning most of what you have said above.....him crying, saying sorry, telling you he doesn't love you, etc. It is just in your head and it is in your dreams now. As far as the part where he is standing there waiting for you to give your blessing......you know that is his wishful thinking. It is part of your own thought process that you repeat every single day and it is now active in your dreams. Don't beat yourself up over this. If you are on antidepressants, talk to your doctor. If you are not, then still talk to your doctor. Maybe medication can help.



missmolly said:


> In retrospect, I realize now that in the weeks leading up to our blowup, he was already gone.
> There wasn’t much tension, it was more sort of nothing.
> He complained to me later that he couldn’t bear all the arguments that we were having. We had NONE. He must have been having them with himself inside his head..


You did not have arguments. Sounds like his rewriting of the marital history to justify leaving. 



missmolly said:


> All this dwelling on the past is so pointless.
> SO WHY CAN’T I STOP THINKING ABOUT IT?.


You are not going to be able to immediately throw away 3 decades of love for a person. It will take time.


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## Catherine602

The dream is interesting. Tell him his release has nothing to do with you so he should stop haunting your dreams. His suffering is because he could have used the kindness and regard that he shows strangers on the people most in need. His wife and children. 

His bondage is of his making. He did nit make an orderly exit when he could have. He in gaged in diliberate deceit. Falling in love is no excuse to be cruel and careless of those aroipund you. 

He will not be release until he atones. His atonement has nothing to do with you because you did not commit these atrocities. Tell him to get out of your dreams and be a man and get his house in order. 

When he atones whst do you want to ask him to do for you MissMolly. He is asking you to release him, what do you need to go forward.

What do you want him to do for you. It has to be as difficult as what he asking of you. It cannot be that he love you again because it is counter to his request and you will go in circles and never get rid of the dream. Think big MissMolly. 

He gets released when you find his replacement that us part of his atonement. That and get out of yiur dreams Tell him to go away and not to stress you before that time. If he does you will not be able to move on. 

Tell him he must treat you with respect and defrerence and to treat his children with the love and attention they deserve from a father. If he cannot do that then he can walk in the shadows for a mellenuim. 

He will never get what cannot get what you can't give and that has nothing to do with you MM. That us a universal truth. 

To talk her on a vacation that you planned is the height of hubris. He must atone for the wrong he has done to his kids and to you. He could have made an orderly exist instead he blew up the lives of innocent people. 

You are not holding him MissMolly he is holding himself. He will not take responsibilty. He us trying to offload it on you. He holds the keys to hus release from bondage. If he cant find them then he betrer go and look and leave yiu alone. 

He has not atoned for his wrongs so his release has nothing to do with you. Tell him to go away and do a proper atonement and an orderly, kind and considerate leav taking. To stay in his kids lives. 

Being in love does not absolve him of acting loving. If he cant manage that then he will never rest. 

The dream will cease to haunt you and you will rest. 

Write down what you want to say to him in your dream he will hear you.


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## missmolly

I am busy preparing the documentation for our financial settlement, to be forwarded to my lawyer in this coming week.
My H asked recently what her advice was.
I replied that she suggested that I screw him. 
Sounds like a plan to me.

Oops, I broke a few more things today, and gave away lots of goodies.


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## Louise7

missmolly said:


> I am busy preparing the documentation for our financial settlement, to be forwarded to my lawyer in this coming week.
> My H asked recently what her advice was.
> I replied that she suggested that I screw him.
> Sounds like a plan to me.
> 
> Oops, I broke a few more things today, and gave away lots of goodies.


I think you are doing an amazing job. Something that helped me was to write down how I was feeling in a journal. Didn't matter how crazy it sounded and how from day to day the emotions expressed were contradiction personified. The best thing about it was looking back at the journal a year later and seeing how far I'd come.

Speaking of breaking things... When I was divorcing the ex, my former mother in law asked for a dinner service back - one she had given me as a wedding present when I married her disfunctional son. Sure, no problem. I dumped it all in black trash sacks - no wrapping them up, no padding of any kind. I left it all on the doorstep and told her to come get it all. I watched from the window as The Witch carried the sacks to her car. Everyone of them split in the road. Shame that.


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## missmolly

Well done Louise, I can't think of a better way to return an unwanted gift. 

Journals, well I just about need a new hard drive to store all my ramblings.


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## Catherine602

Mmm what did you break and what are you giving away? 

What do you think about changing the bedroom around. Furniture placement, color schem, wall color. Get rid of his stuff from the room. Make it your own for now. What do you think? 

Did you get back to sleep this AM? I find if I get up the usual time even if I have not sleep well, it is easier to get to sleep the next night. I also use a short acting sleeping pill, Abilify sp? when i cant sleep for a few nights in a row. It last only 4 hrs and I wake up with no drowsiness. 

It will be hard to stop the thoughts abruptly. It will probably be a gradual process and take time. I think having answers will help a great deal. 

Thinking of the past is a way of looking for answers. If you were dealing with a difficult man for years, you might have been prepared for trouble but you did not have any signs. 

You said that you encouraged him to assert himself. Did he do that latter in the marriage? When you had a fight, what was he like? Was he engaged or did he avoid conflict. 

You also said he had an affair before. This may be a painful question but is it possible that he has had multiple affairs? The great majority of infidelity goes undetected. 

Do you think that he may have hidden aspects of his personality and activities from you? The two affairs shows a capacity for deceit and selfishness. Not something I would expect from a man who appeared to be kind and caring. 

The answers to this may be staring you in the face MM. getting them will greatly relieve you of some ruminations. 

Reframe the way you look at your husband based on the things he did and did not do. the previous infidelity and the quality of R. Was it sincere R or another deception. 

He may not have been so sweet. You may be projecting because you are sweet. Hope I did not say anything out of turn. 


Do you have plans for today?


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## missmolly

Up again and it's still dark here. 
Last evening was horrid. 

Believe me, I have examined every aspect of our marriage. 
I don't believe that he had other affairs and felt a strong sense of commitment from him always, that is until his 63rd year.

And I am not so sweet, if you knew of my thoughts in the last few days you would be horrified.
I am very capable of self examination and believe that i face the truth full on. 

I downloaded our chat files from a recent online conversation and was somewhat surprised to find that the record commenced during the discovery period of his first affair. I had returned home and left him on a tropical island. 
I believe that the first R was genuine. 

His elevation of status in the recent overseas posting was profound. I believe that he succumbed to ego and that he developed a sense of entitlement. He went from laughing at the old man with a young lycra clad beauty on the arm, to a sense of 'hey why can't I have that instead of an old wife'. Coupled with his now relative riches and appeal, he thought he was missing out on something. And I am not convinced that there isn't a sprinkling of early dementia thrown in to boot.

We did not fight much in the later years of the marriage. I learned to curb my temper many years ago when I realised that that was the one thing which made him withdraw. He would always discuss anything rationally, but would not engage in fire fueled challenges. 

I found the empty frames of his degrees yesterday. I assume he took them back with him. The frames were the first crash. This was followed by a framed picture of us which was on his desk. 
I then 'returned' all recent gifts from him. What a mess the floor is. I was forced to close the door so that the dogs don't cut their feet on the broken glass. I added to the decoration by including a few of his books. 

My daughter was here for a while and I told her to help herself to anything. Like him, she is a bit of a computer geek and she left with a large bag of stuff. 

I did ask her to put his top of the range Mac computer back though.

No I don't have any plans for today or any other day. Well I guess i will go on with the 23 page document that I have to prepare for my lawyer. Finding the required documentation is very tedious as I 'rearranged' the contents of the filing cabinets one night a while ago.
I move hoses every 2 hours every day, do a bit of sewing and that's about it. I drive into town once per day and wander around for a bit. 
I went through the safe and found the jewellery which his mother expressed often, was to go to our daughters. I left that and will watch with interest to see what he does with it.

I added pages to my saved journal, mainly about his character flaws and new set of values

I fell asleep composing my suicide note.


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## missmolly

Here is my last 'journal' entry. Not sent of course. 

Doctors (4), Psychologists(2),Lawyers (2), friends (many) and family (many), all agree that there is no lower act than to bring your shag partner into our home in my absence. It is the the lowest act of betrayal possible . I try to find a word for it but fail. 
By admitting to it, it confirms your depravity, and by agreeing to it, shows her total lack of moral fibre. 
No woman of ANY substance would do that to another. She is a slag. 
So what do you base your wonderful new relationship on? It can’t be respect and admiration, for you are as bad as each other, and are well suited. This is a genuine question for I am very curious to know what replaces respect and admiration.
I can think only of conceit (you are above the rules of common decency), lust (on your part, gain (on her part), and fantasy. 
Do you honestly feel any self respect??


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## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> I fell asleep composing my suicide note.


Do NOT hurt yourself C. Call a suicide hotline if you have to. Don't let him get the best of you. You still have your kids and a home and some financial stability. You know my situation. You have it way better than I do, but I refuse to allow my husband the satisfaction of wiping me off the face of the Earth the way he hopes he can. You have a lot to offer a good man who appreciates you.


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## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> His elevation of status in the recent overseas posting was profound. I believe that he succumbed to ego and that he developed a sense of entitlement. He went from laughing at the old man with a young lycra clad beauty on the arm, to a sense of 'hey why can't I have that instead of an old wife'. Coupled with his now relative riches and appeal, he thought he was missing out on something. .


Same thing happened here. We moved overseas, he got a very well paying, upper management, secure job for life, moved into a brand new very large house unlike one we ever could afford, got the Volvo, obtained new younger single bottom feeder friends, and then looked at me and thought.....old model, boring American. In his eyes, I was like the carnation in a bouquet of roses.


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## Catherine602

What was the suicide note all about? If you did feel very desperate what would you do that is adaptive? 

When I was very young I made a suicide attempt after a very traumatic event. I was luckily to survive. I realized only afterwards that suicide is the most hostile act one can make towards loved ones. 

It is the people who care that suffer if you are not around. They also blame themselves for not doing enough to help you. 

What do you do with the pain, thoughts and sleeplessness. I really think that you need the help of medication for the short term. The sleeplessness can make you irrational so you need to tackle that. 

Can you put calling your physician with an urgent request for meds to help during this period? 

You have to go on knowing that life will be better. It will be new and the new will be better than the old. At the time of my attempt, i was not able to see past the next day and did not have faith in the future.

I just wanted relief. You can get relief with meds. Will you do that? Call your physician.

You have to have dreams for the days ahead. You are not there yet only because you need to process what has happened, organize it and file it away. 

I wish that was easy or quick but 30yrs of processing is not quick. 

You mentioned that you did not tell some of your family and friends. Would you feel comfortable telling them when they call to talk? Might be good to get it out. 

Did you compose a response to the dream request? 

What you said about the change in money, status and the rewards offered by these girls trolling for old men. 

What a perfect storm. The comming together of events and forces so totally new and seductive. Money, sex, adoration, no wonder he entered the land of fairytales. More like a Grimm fairytale. 

What a rude awakening when he reaches the end with the barb. He got greedy and succumbed to the oldest trick in the book. Mephistopheles offering eternal life and sensuous saturation. 

I am convienced by what you said about his character before this happened. I can see that the sudden change in his status did not give him a chance to get acclimated to having lots of money and new friends who want a share of it. 

I think You are going to have to do a little better on the "to do" on the home front MM.


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## missmolly

I don't plan suicide, just get pleasure knowing that it would eat at him. And I KNOW it would. 

I don't have a physician. Doctors not taking new patients in this town. I have told of my one experience with the only appointment that i could get. 

My cousin is going to ask hers if he will see me, just once. 

I couldn't believe my bad luck when my old trusted one in my old home town was away on holidays when I went back there recently.


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## Catherine602

Oh yes the doctor with a wonderful healing manner. Told you to get over it. 

Well you redecorated his office. Are you ready to make your room into a nice soothing oasis?

I like the picture of the dog. In fact, I want him/her. Soooo cute.


----------



## SaltInWound

Catherine602 said:


> What you said about the change in money, status and the rewards offered by these girls trolling for old men.
> 
> What a perfect storm. The comming together of events and forces so totally new and seductive. Money, sex, adoration, no wonder he entered the land of fairytales. More like a Grimm fairytale.
> 
> What a rude awakening when he reaches the end with the barb. He got greedy and succumbed to the oldest trick in the book. Mephistopheles offering eternal life and sensuous saturation.
> 
> I am convienced by what you said about his character before this happened. I can see that the sudden change in his status did not give him a chance to get acclimated to having lots of money and new friends who want a share of it.


:iagree:


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## missmolly

My room is already my room.
It is new and was completed during the last visit home. 
I have since painted, carpeted and moved into it.

That dear little dog is a sweetie, but has 'attitude'
She is also clingy and even goes to the loo with me!!


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## alte Dame

Catherine's reference to Mephistopheles is apt, in my opinion. Your H's demise is very Faustian. These are old stories and they continue to resonate because people keep doing the same things over and over.

Everyone who hears your story knows that your H is an OLD man by society's standards. His transformation sounds desperate & it seems sadly predictable how it will end.

I know that you have issues with your dogs and the fires and all sorts of other considerations, but sitting around the house and taking the occasional walk alone is not good for you right now. It just isn't. Period.

You need to get the h3ll out of there for a while and take care of yourself. You need to give the whole mess with your very messed up H a huge middle finger for a while. Make some plans and get out. You need to do it.


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## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> Catherine's reference to Mephistopheles is apt, in my opinion. Your H's demise is very Faustian. These are old stories and they continue to resonate because people keep doing the same things over and over.
> 
> Everyone who hears your story knows that your H is an OLD man by society's standards. His transformation sounds desperate & it seems sadly predictable how it will end.
> 
> I know that you have issues with your dogs and the fires and all sorts of other considerations, but sitting around the house and taking the occasional walk alone is not good for you right now. It just isn't. Period.
> 
> You need to get the h3ll out of there for a while and take care of yourself. You need to give the whole mess with your very messed up H a huge middle finger for a while. Make some plans and get out. You need to do it.



I agree, but just don't know where to go. i keep thinking where, where, where, but don't come up with any answers.

Here I am, up again at 4am like a coiled spring, and waking mid conversation with himself. i am so tired of how he haunts my nights. 

I also have to keep working on this financial stuff and submit it to my lawyer, it needs to be set in place sooner rather than later. Before she gets her greedy little claws in any deeper.


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## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> I also have to keep working on this financial stuff and submit it to my lawyer, it needs to be set in place sooner rather than later. *Before she gets her greedy little claws in any deeper*.


She knows she has to work fast. She knows he could change his mind nd leave her and she knows a divorce means you could also take a good chunk of it. 

I guess that is one advantage I have. We have no property or assets of any kind. He blew the savings and never saved for retirement, so he only has a mountain of debt. There really is nothing she can take until she marries him, and by then he will have even less than he has now. He won't be worth the effort.


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## alte Dame

There are plenty of places to visit. Set up a spa vacation for yourself. This isn't something I would naturally do, but in your position, I could easily see a month of just getting out and away and letting other people take care of me.


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## Catherine602

Road Scholar: Advanced Search

MM this is a travel organization that arranges educational tours. My aunts have taken several trips with them. They go all around the world. The nice thing is that you can pick the trip on the basis of what you like to do. I am not suggesting you use this but just to give you an idea of what is out there. 

I stuck to Australia because I think you don't need a trip far away. What you could do is to take a trip that is near a place with friends and or relatives. Then visit with them afterwards. Take a short trip maybe 2 to 3 days and then visit for another 2 or 3 days. 

Let people into your thoughts MM. You are writing in journals which is good but you may not be enough right now. 

I believe that people can act as emissaries for good, even strangers. But you have to let them in. Your feelings of despair are not unique, they are shared by many, especially people on this forum. 

You may express something that is simular to what a fellow TAMer has felt. They may be further along in the process and share there story with you and offer some encouragement. 

I wish I could find the right words to say. Someone else may have them if they connect on the basis of simular experiences and thoughts. 

Use us we are here for you. Nothing you say will shock anyone. Instead, it will draw people in. 

Tell what you are thinking. You had your husband to talk to all these years. I know you would rather talk to him and I believe you will do that again. However, right now you need to express yourself to real and or virtually real people while he is in his fog. 

What do you think? Try a small step - just a few paragraphs and see where that gets you.


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## missmolly

A Spa? now there's a jolly thought. We were staying in a spa in Bali when I found out about his first affair. I've sort of gone off spas. 

Do you you really want to know how consumed I am with hatred at the moment? How I would like to run a knife through him?

On a kinder note, perhaps a slow, painful, lingering death, complete with a leaking ileostomy, might be more suitable.


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## alte Dame

We're going off to the mountains this weekend - lots of snow and cold, cold sunny weather. How about something like that? Has he ruined every season and place for you? The rat...


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## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> Do you you really want to know how consumed I am with hatred at the moment? How I would like to run a knife through him?


We will hold him down for you. 

Hatred is good. Better than depression, because it motivates.


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## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> We're going off to the mountains this weekend - lots of snow and cold, cold sunny weather. How about something like that? Has he ruined every season and place for you? The rat...


Well it's jolly cold where he is at the moment. My visa is still good and I am thinking that I might just go back there and publicly humiliate him. Looking up flights now. 

Might sit on the front steps of his office and sob loudly for 2 days. Now he would hate that more than ANYTHING. Tarnish his good guy image? great appeal


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## missmolly

Catherine602 said:


> He has an ileostomy?
> 
> What happened in Bali?


ha ha 
no 
but i wish him a leaking one

That's where we were when I first discovered what a pile of pure **** he is.
Affair number one in the his 63rd year.


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## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> Well it's jolly cold where he is at the moment. My visa is still good and I am thinking that I might just go back there and publicly humiliate him. Looking up flights now.
> 
> Might sit on the front steps of his office and sob loudly for 2 days. Now he would hate that more than ANYTHING. Tarnish his good guy image? great appeal


No. Don't cry. Show up with a chair, a pan for water, a towel, and a nail kit.


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## missmolly

mmm there's a flight available on Wed night


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## Catherine602

You couldn't ruin his rep. There is only one way his good guy image can be damaged. If he grabbed his balls, his dignity and his manhood and left that fetid place and came back home to the people who he owes his loyalty. 

As long as he is mesmerized by puedo-love, puedo- admiration and puedo-dependence, and handing over real cash, he will be a stand up guy in thier eyes.


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## SaltInWound

Catherine602 said:


> If you go can you get someone to go with you?
> 
> Don't get into legal trouble there MM.


Most foreign prisons are barbaric. Avoid any physical confrontation if you encounter her.


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## missmolly

still thinking about going. 
I wouldn't care how much I humiliated him but I will not do that to myself. 
Tho the sobbing part is appealing. I know most of the staff, particularly the security staff (we hired a lot of them to be in our home after the third break in). 
That's if they recognise me - I have lost 49lbs since leaving there. 

As for slagface, I doubt that I would ever acknowledge her presence. After all, ignore says a lot. 

Same old problem tho, no one to mind the dogs. 
My cousin's daughter, the one who has had a stroke and is now a manipulative invalid, has decided that she doesn't like dogs and they are no longer welcome there. She used to drool over them. 

She now summons her mother home frequently as she is 'afraid to be alone'. She plans to move to the city soon, WTF, and my cousin is very relieved.

My sister is now there and she makes frequent postings on FB about how much she loves the place. I have asked her several times not to see him, that I would see it as a betrayal of me, and to date she has ignored my emails. I ask her twice per day.

I have blocked him on FB - how childish does that sound. I log in briefly once per day as it is the only contact I have with my daughter in Melbourne. For some reason our phones don't recognise each other. As luck would have it, he was online when I looked for messages this morning. He goes there about once a week. 

I changed my contact details for a foreign currency account which I trade, and i was furious to see that they BCC'd him into their response. After not contacting him for eight days, the first thing he would have seen when returning to work today would have been that email from the trading complany. Almost negates NC. 

Today I smashed all his CD's and DVD's and ripped up a few more books. The pile of litter on his study floor is getting higher.


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## Catherine602

I dont understand you sister. Why would she not honor a simple reasonable request? 

You need her now but I think you should give her as much as she gives you and no more. Sometimes family members take each other for granted. 

How are your plans going? I am not so sure about going there now. Perhaps later when you have something you need to accomplish. I don't think you have thought ths out well enough so that you get some amount of closure. What do you think. 

Was your sister actually vacationing wih them? That may have been one reason he did not try to contact you. Your sister and her husband provided the family contact that he needed. 

Let me know what are doing and thinking will check in on you latter tonight.


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## alte Dame

Seriously. WTF is up with your sister? What kind of cr*p is this? I know she wouldn't derail her trip, but now she's waxing ecstatic on FB about it? Maybe I'm a bad influence, Miss M, but I would stop talking to this sister. This is rubbing salt in a wound. Why do that? Do you two have bad blood between you that would in any way explain such cruel behavior?

And don't go back to where your H is. You must know what people who know him and have any idea of his OW must think of him. It's pathetic. Pathetic. He's tanking himself on all fronts. So sorry. This sucks very badly for you, I know.


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## missmolly

A new day, a new start.
Common sense reigns again.

I won’t go as I would only make a fool of myself and at least my dignity is still intact, if nothing else. 

My sister wrote to me this morning and in amongst her other news, mentioned that ‘she was not thinking about him at the moment’ – whatever that means. 
Normally I don’t have a problem with her so I don’t really know where she is coming from lately. 
She said once that he was her family also after so long, but he sure as hell doesn’t think that way as he fobbed them off to a hotel. 

I had a blast from the past this morning when I received a phone call from my first ever boyfriend. I was madly in love with him also, come to think of it he was the only other man (boy) who I ever felt so much for.
And he unceremoniously dumped me also. He had left a 3 year relationship when we hooked up, and he ended up going back to and marrying her. 
We talked for ages.


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## alte Dame

What a strange coincidence.

I confess that I don't understand all the stories I read here about connecting with the ex and how dangerous it can be, etc. When I got on fb, I ran for the hills every time I got a feeler from an ex. I was broken up with them for a reason.....

But, glad that you had a nice talk. I take it he's still married.


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## SaltInWound

I am glad you had someone to talk to and have an escape from the overwhelming stress you have been under lately.


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## missmolly

When packing up to move to this house nearly 2 years ago, I came across a beautiful large coloured studio portrait of this old BF, taken with his mother and his sister when he was about two years old. 
I couldn't bring myself to throw it out so I put a lot of effort into finding him and returning it. No mean feat either as he had been living in California for a long time. 

Anyway, when he received it he called me. He was so grateful as his mother had died whilst he was living overseas, and when he arrived back here his brother had thrown out most of the contents of her house, including all photographs. He has never forgiven his brother for this.

I then found and copied lots of photos, both private and school ones, and sent them to him. 

We have exchanged the odd email here and there, and my husband has seen them all. They met once many years ago at an aero show where exBF was a parachutist. 

He is in his second marriage, but they live apart.

His youngest daughter has had similar problems to my youngest.


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## alte Dame

Well....go for it. Someone you feel a real connection to to talk to. I'm glad you have that right now.


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## Catherine602

Opps didnt see your last post

I imagine that it is important that you don't expect anything but conversation and commiseration so you are not dissapointed that he does not try to call more frequently. 

Got any other old boyfriends you are keeping under wraps? 

What did you do today? Any progress on the financial doc or travel For relaxation plans? 

I think your sister may have been so anxious to have a good time on vacation that she is ignoring some glaring improprieties. maybe when she gets back she will see things clearer and make amends. 

Given that you have not had problems with her before. 

I am glad you are not going over there.


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## missmolly

For those who have access to my pics, I have just uploaded an old photo of the ex BF. I thought him seriously cute but wonder what he looks like now?

I was forced to break NC with my H today as our youngest has had a meltdown and it was all about him. She was doing so well. She had not been drinking, not since NY's eve, but went out and got blind drunk last night. Today when I called to see her, she had been drinking and was sobbing about how he had deserted her. 

My message to him was that if he had any heart left at all, to please contact her as she was feeling very rejected by him . 

He phoned her immediately and apparently they had a good conversation. She was very calm when she told me of it. 

His feedback email to me was brief and I have ignored it.

He told HER that he is coming back here in April so finish sorting out our affairs. He has told me NOTHING.

Oh how hard it is to not write and tell him what a first class prick he is.


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## missmolly

advice please - may I send this??

Suzi tells me that you told her that you are coming back here in April. Were you going to bother to tell me??
or is this just more of your bull****?

The string on which I dangle is fraying rapidly.


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## Bellavista

I imagine you are feeling rather frayed but I would suggestsomething more detached if you must send something.


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## missmolly

too late, we have just had an email slinging match


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## Catherine602

I hope he keeps his word and does come in April. It would be so cruel to say that to her and then not follow through. She is too fragile for that. Can you ask him to call his daughter every week and to communicate by email frequently? 

For a man you said was kind to strangers I don't think that is too much to ask. His behavior is not what I expect of the kind helpful person you describ. I don't think he would be able to know of her distress and not want to be there her. 

MissMolly remember that you don't want to allow him to off load guilt onto you. So try not to engage in conflict. Don't take this apparently happy time for him fool you. The full story has not unfolded yet. She has him in such a state that this so called kind man has forgotten his family and a daughter who needs him. All for one woman. 

I hope she plans on taking the burden of supplying all of the needs of an old man because he will be depending on her for the same. Let it play out MM. be patient. He is high now but has a long way to fall when this is over. Hang in there. 

What are your plans for today?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> too late, we have just had an email slinging match


Are you ok MM? Don't get yourself upset enough to start drinking. It will only make you feel worse later. Don't give him the satisfaction. Remember, he has this **** whispering in his ear. He is only getting off on the fact that he has 2 women after his attention......even if he has to create conflict for yours. You getting angry only reinforces his justification for getting away from you and choosing the OW. And you can bet he is sharing what you are saying to him, so the OW is also telling him how he should be feeling and how she is the better choice......because she is so kind and never fights with him. 

Be careful in other ways. You asked for his help with your daughter and he complied. However, the e-mail slinging match that happened after between you and he...........he may look at that and say "[email protected], I did what she asked and then she finds an excuse to create a fight. Let her deal with our daughter next time.". I know this is not the right thing for him to do, but if he is evil enough, he will use your daughter as a weapon against you. And you both end up on the losing end. 

I understand how your daughter feels. Our grown son is still having a hard time accepting that his father went from giving him all the emotional support, etc and the day he said "I want a divorce" was the day he forgot he had a son. 

Detach. Breathe.


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## missmolly

Epic fail on my part last night, an epic fail.
I broke every rule in the book


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## alte Dame

The rules at this point are completely for your benefit. In the long run, it's much better to detach as much as possible because it helps tremendously to assuage the hurt.

However, if you need once in a while to blast him, then that may well be to your benefit as well.

So don't be too hard on yourself. The rules aren't engraved in stone.


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## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> Epic fail on my part last night, an epic fail.
> I broke every rule in the book


He is the epic fail. Remember that.


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## Catherine602

No rules, no laws MissMolly. They're guides and you decide what you need to do. If you do something that you think is not working for you then you change up. It won't be perfect but it will good enough until you can do things more in keeping with what you think is best. 

I think that it might be too soon to expect you to turn on a dime. Thats not how life works. It is easy for me to give you advice but I am not in the eye of this storm. 

MissMolly would you be open to PM a member by the name of Affaircare to ask her to read your thread and offer guidance? She is a wonderful lady and excellent resource. With her expertise she may be able to add some additional things for you to think about. 

Please let me know how you are doing and let me know if you feel comfortable calling Affaircare. Thank you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## missmolly

i have sent a PM to Affaircare

Drinking - about half a bottle of brandy per night (an improvement)
Smoking - about 40 per day 
Eating - sometimes
Weight loss - now 50 lbs
State of mind - stuffed

IC - still out fighting the fires.

BTW I expect nothing of old BF, I have not even told him of my 'situation'.


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## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> Weight loss - now 50 lbs.


Are you still within a safe weight zone? You can always drink smoothies to add calories and nutrition if you think you need it.


----------



## missmolly

SaltInWound said:


> Are you still within a safe weight zone? You can always drink smoothies to add calories and nutrition if you think you need it.


Yes, I could afford to lose that much and probably a little more. 

Here I sit tonight, in tears and feeling very sorry for myself. 

I am tired, so tired, but afraid to go to bed. The dreams are hideous and i fall asleep and wake up thinking about him. I think of him all the time during the day. I always did

I alternate between rage and despair. My daughter asked me to find an old photo for her and during my search I looked at so many old pictures of him. I loved him so much. 
At least that slag up there doesn't have the handsome young man he was, only the crumbly old creep he is now.

Our exchanges were fairly ugly last night. 

My daughter was so thrilled to hear from him last night and sounded so happy today. She doesn't know that I asked him to call her. 

He expected to know firm dates of his leave today, but I did not hear from him as he had indicated. 

I am just so tired of it all.

Oh, and the little white ball of fluff pictured has now started to bite everyone who calls in here. 
Life sucks.


----------



## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> I alternate between rage and despair.


This is normal. I am still experiencing the same. 



missmolly said:


> I loved him so much.


Notice how you said LoveD....past tense. It is a step toward detachment, whether it was conscious or not.



missmolly said:


> Our exchanges were fairly ugly last night.


In the exchange, did he say anything that stood out to help you better understand his frame of mind? Did he try to blame you for his choices? Did he say anything out of character? 



missmolly said:


> He expected to know firm dates of his leave today, but I did not hear from him as he had indicated.


That is just his way of trying to get to you and wear you down. My husband did the same to me before his flight to tell me he wanted a divorce (and I did not know he was going to give me that news). 



missmolly said:


> Oh, and the little white ball of fluff pictured has now started to bite everyone who calls in here.


You have been understandably upset. Your little dog is feeding off your emotions. Pets are much like children in that respect.


----------



## missmolly

Oh yes, it is definitely past tense.
I now despise him.
I would step over him and go out for coffee if he lay dying on my floor.

So why can't I stop thinking about him?
Except my thoughts are now all vile and evil


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## alte Dame

You need to get out of there. Start planning a trip. Start thinking of places you haven't been, but would like to see.


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## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> You need to get out of there. Start planning a trip. Start thinking of places you haven't been, but would like to see.


I keep thinking of where to go.
The couple of places that I was keen to see, we had planned for 2014.

We have travelled extensively around the world as we made a choice to ‘do’ things rather than ‘have’ things many years ago. We have taken our children to many countries, some several times.

I look at cruises and travel sites, but can’t muster any enthusiasm whatsoever. People assure me that this will come back, but at the moment it is severely lacking. 
Then of course there is always the problem of the dogs.

It is possible to walk away and leave this house in our winter, which of course is summer in the northern hemisphere. Maybe by then I will have some interest.

I have an elderly aunt who lives in the Blue Mountains, just west of Sydney, and she called this morning. I am immensely fond of her. 
She requires minor surgery in a couple of weeks time and I thought that I could go and be there for her.
It is a six hour drive each way. 

My dogs are always welcome at her home. My big public meltdown as described at the beginning of this thread, occurred the day after her son and his wife left after visiting us. I have to face all these people eventually but I am embarrassed to be an ugly person in front of them


----------



## Affaircare

MissMolly~

At your request and the request of some other posters, I have read your entire thread from beginning to end. I do have several thoughts I'd like to share with you, but I'm at work at the moment and so I'd like to share my biggest thought with you, and my big thought is:

*YOU are in control of your thoughts, your feelings and your actions.*

I point this out to you, because several times in your thread you've said, written, or acted like your STBX (soon-to-be-ex) did something to you and you have no control whatsoever over what came spewing out of your mouth or what actions you did. As if some zombie or evil spirit just inhabited your body and BAM you could watch but you couldn't stop it. 

Now unless you ACTUALLY believe you are being inhabited by evil incarnate...that means that you DO have the ability to choose what you say, to choose what you do, and to choose what you feel!! And I know you may think to yourself: "Well WHY in the name of God would I choose to think and feel and act like this? I can't help it!" Yes. You. can. You are not someone else's helpless puppet. You are a fully grown, mature, adult woman, and you can choose to curse and rage and engage with a man whom you know is going to drive you to drink...or you can choose to do things that are wiser and healthier for you. Right now, I'll be honest: I suspect you interact with him and choose to be hurt like this because it give you a "reasonable reason" to act in an unreasonable way toward him. You can rage and curse and drink and destroy yourself "because he left you"... and that's your justification. 

Just like we all wonder "Well why does a Disloyal Spouse do what they do when they know it's going to cause all kinds of harm?" ... we may wonder why you are doing what you know is going to cause all kinds of harm. You know that drinking harms you, but you keep brandy in the house and keep buying it. You know that contacting him tears you to shreds but you keep contacting him. You know that not eating properly (or only drinking) is physically harming you, but you don't eat anyway. See that? And just like we wish that the Disloyal Spouse's would stop themselves and do the RIGHT thing even though that's harder..it's the same for you. You have the ability to stop yourself and do the right thing, but you keep choosing the epic fails and the uncontrolled raging and the vicious spite. 

Now missmolly, if I didn't care about you and the situation you are facing and the anguish, honestly I wouldn't even bother to reply to you. Hey we're in countries around the world from each other! But I did take the time to reply, and you know why? Because I do care! And I want the anguish and pain to stop!! But I can't stop that for you--only YOU can do that--and here's how: 

1) Stop being in touch with him ever in any way. No phone; no email; no texting....nothing. If he tries to contact you, unplug the phone from the wall, delete that email address, and turn off your cell phone. 
2) Eat every day. If you don't feel you can swallow past the lump in your throat, get soup. It's warm and nutritious and you can swallow it. Every day eat at least oatmeal and soup for lunch and dinner (or dinner and tea) 
3) Exercise every day. Rather than giving him a verbal beating or doing what you know is wrong and will hurt you...get physical in the gym. Try boxing! Try something that physically wears you out. You'll sleep better and release the energy of anger.
4) Throw out all booze today. Now. Do it--don't just read. If you have a problem with alcohol, that's not the end of the world. Admit it and look for some help. Ask me I'll help you find something. But if you don't--if it's just that right now you're so upset--then throw out the liquor, don't buy anymore, and drink water when you're tempted to get drunk. 

See part of the issue here is that for 30-something years you two have been together and he did false recovery and you're heartbroken. I get that... I do. But he has done what he's done, and in response to his bad behavior, you are reacting with bad behavior of your own and that is not WHO YOU ARE! So you need to stop and start being who YOU are. YOU are a woman of dignity and strength and beauty. YOU are a woman of worth. So start acting like that kind of woman...and don't say "I can't" because you CAN..you just won't. 

You don't have to be stuck alone in a rural home that's partially built. You own half of the assets of the marriage, so let that be part of HIS assets and part of the burden HE has to deal with (that will put a damper on his promiscuity!), and you take some cash, buy a little condo or modest home in the city where you want to be, and go there! Get a job. Be by the people you want to be by...where you want to be! Or sell this house for what you paid for it--you're no worse for wear and have all that cash to move! My point here is that you may not "be there" right now but you sure could be...you could make plans to get there step by step....but instead you choose to drink, to blame him for how you're acting, and to let vitriol and hatred rule your heart. You can stop and MissMolly, every day...every minute of the day...I'm asking you to take ahold of yourself and stop yourself. Act like you want to be. 

*YOU are in control of your thoughts, your feelings and your actions.*

So my first assignment for you is to look at #1, #2, #3, and #4 above and tell me which of those things you did TODAY. We're living here day-by-day....and if you have the urge to contact him, go hour-by-hour. Hey when I was leaving my abusive exH I had to put it off 15 minutes at a time (15 minutes-by-15 minutes) but I did it, I did not break NC, and my heart healed because of it! You can too, MissMolly. So what did you do TODAY?


----------



## missmolly

Affaircare, 
thank you for taking the time to read and respond. 
i am still digesting the contents and will respond later after more thought.
I agree with much of what you have said, but also strongly disagree on a couple of points. 

I will continue to give much thought to your posting.


----------



## missmolly

Okay, here goes

I agree with a lot of what you have said. It is time for me to stop ‘sulking’ as my sister succinctly puts it

Re drinking – I have had one brandy ****tail before dinner for almost 40 years and will continue to do so. I will however, commit to just that

Re eating – I am delighted with my weight loss and will continue to eat fresh fruit and tomatoes which grow prolifically in my garden

Re exercise – I am sure that I have enough of that without joining a gym as I am caring for a five acre property in a serious drought situation. I drag 90 metre hoses around every two hours and pace by the hour.
Also I had surgery not so long ago and am not supposed to do too much for 6 weeks.

Re get a job – now here I have genuine resentment. About six months ago, my window of opportunity for maintaining nurse registration arose (I had been ill for 3 years and not able to work, but recovered) and I based my decision to let it lapse on his declaration that I need never have to worry about working again, and that he had no ill feeling whatsoever about this. My choice for financial independence is no longer possible without a lengthy and expensive retraining program which I would finish at age 67.
I wasn’t even accepted as a volunteer.

I have raved and ranted to my heart’s content on here, as suggested by other posters, but I believe that my husband is the luckiest man alive for not being on the receiving end of this for the most part.

My spite and vitriol has been relatively recent, as I remained stupid and hopeful for a long time that he would come to his senses over the ridiculous situation of him now being a sugar daddy to some young tart. 

With very few exceptions, my communication with him has been pleasant and courteous to the point of making me want to vomit. I was determined to remain amicable until we had a financial settlement in place. 

However – find myself a condo (what exactly is a condo?) or modest place to live? No way. I entered the marriage with more than 50% equity in a substantial home in a prestigious area. He arrived with an old car, a roll top desk, and a half completed PhD.

I also received a substantial inheritance from my mother not so long ago. In Australian law, I am entitled to claim that back and I will. 
There is no way that I am leaving with a modest anything. I also have worked for most of our marriage.

After our marital settlement is in place, I plan to screw him for repayment of every cent of the inheritance .My lawyer assures me that it would be pointless for him to fight this. My parents intended it to eventually go to their grandchildren, not to a pack of villagers in some third world country.

NC is an extremely difficult issue as we have a lifetime of financial entanglement to unravel and the management of a daughter with significant BPD. In this he is extremely good.
I aim to keep it at a business level. I can’t see the point of a lawyer asking him for instance, at $550 per hour, where the underground water pipes are.

I am thinking of keeping this place. No judge in the land will throw me out of our home and it is a place that can be locked up and left for most of the winter. 
It is relatively cheap to maintain as it is fully solar powered and has a large source of potable water. Being just off the main highway between two major cities, I imagine that I will have a lot of visitors when I become sociable again.

I am sure that I will think of more later and will add if I do so.


----------



## Catherine602

MM checking up on you early. I am so glad that Affaircare posted. 

Her perspective reframes how we were thinking of what is happening and what you are doing. I hope that you find her post inspiring and enables you to pull out this nose dive. Please use all of your reserves of strength and control to take tender loving care of you.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## missmolly

BTW I re read my entire thread today and see that I had said that I quit smoking about 15 years ago. 
I reassessed that and it is just on 20 years.


----------



## Louise7

missmolly said:


> Okay, here goes
> 
> I agree with a lot of what you have said. It is time for me to stop ‘sulking’ as my sister succinctly puts it
> 
> Re drinking – I have had one brandy ****tail before dinner for almost 40 years and will continue to do so. I will however, commit to just that
> 
> Re eating – I am delighted with my weight loss and will continue to eat fresh fruit and tomatoes which grow prolifically in my garden
> 
> Re exercise – I am sure that I have enough of that without joining a gym as I am caring for a five acre property in a serious drought situation. I drag 90 metre hoses around every two hours and pace by the hour.
> Also I had surgery not so long ago and am not supposed to do too much for 6 weeks.
> 
> Re get a job – now here I have genuine resentment. About six months ago, my window of opportunity for maintaining nurse registration arose (I had been ill for 3 years and not able to work, but recovered) and I based my decision to let it lapse on his declaration that I need never have to worry about working again, and that he had no ill feeling whatsoever about this. My choice for financial independence is no longer possible without a lengthy and expensive retraining program which I would finish at age 67.
> I wasn’t even accepted as a volunteer.
> 
> I have raved and ranted to my heart’s content on here, as suggested by other posters, but I believe that my husband is the luckiest man alive for not being on the receiving end of this for the most part.
> 
> My spite and vitriol has been relatively recent, as I remained stupid and hopeful for a long time that he would come to his senses over the ridiculous situation of him now being a sugar daddy to some young tart.
> 
> With very few exceptions, my communication with him has been pleasant and courteous to the point of making me want to vomit. I was determined to remain amicable until we had a financial settlement in place.
> 
> However – find myself a condo (what exactly is a condo?) or modest place to live? No way. I entered the marriage with more than 50% equity in a substantial home in a prestigious area. He arrived with an old car, a roll top desk, and a half completed PhD.
> 
> I also received a substantial inheritance from my mother not so long ago. In Australian law, I am entitled to claim that back and I will.
> There is no way that I am leaving with a modest anything. I also have worked for most of our marriage.
> 
> After our marital settlement is in place, I plan to screw him for repayment of every cent of the inheritance .My lawyer assures me that it would be pointless for him to fight this. My parents intended it to eventually go to their grandchildren, not to a pack of villagers in some third world country.
> 
> NC is an extremely difficult issue as we have a lifetime of financial entanglement to unravel and the management of a daughter with significant BPD. In this he is extremely good.
> I aim to keep it at a business level. I can’t see the point of a lawyer asking him for instance, at $550 per hour, where the underground water pipes are.
> 
> I am thinking of keeping this place. No judge in the land will throw me out of our home and it is a place that can be locked up and left for most of the winter.
> It is relatively cheap to maintain as it is fully solar powered and has a large source of potable water. Being just off the main highway from Melbourne to Sydney, I imagine that I will have a lot of visitors when I become sociable again.
> 
> I am sure that I will think of more later and will add if I do so.


*"There is no way that I am leaving with a modest anything"*

:rofl::lol::lol::rofl::smthumbup:

MM, please have this printed on a teeshirt and wear it with pride.


----------



## Affaircare

Right! Catherine you said it!! :iagree:

MissMolly I'm not saying he deserves to be treated well or that you don't deserve all to which you are entitled, but rather that when you do make choices that harm you, such as choosing to get drunk...well drinking tends to loosen inhibitions and then a person says out loud what they think and without self-control and it becomes a fight...screaming ensues...etc. What you don't need is what it's doing TO YOU. 

As far as your husband goes, I personally think you just give him enough rope and he'll hang himself. Let him get stuck with some young tart and have to put up with hearing how he's no fun and can't fulfill her sexually for the rest of his miserable, lonely life! He will receive exactly what's coming to him!!

Meanwhile, for you...I do have faith in you that you can come out of this well. As an example, when my exH and I divorced, he ran off with the wistress to another state, abandoning me and our business and our two children. I had a 4000 sq.ft. home with a pool, and there was no way I could afford it on my own, and I also could not keep our business afloat without him! So by myself I had to untangle all our financial entanglements: close our business, fire people I had worked with for years, put their families into financial uncertainty, contact all our customers, deal with all the business vendors who needed to be paid and were angry AND try to avoid foreclosure on our house...all while mourning the loss of our marriage, the kids' father, my husband and trying to deal with that pain. It was HORRIBLE and I kept thinking "Where am I going to live? I have no idea how I'm going to do this!" And the housing market at the time was somewhat flat, so I was afraid the house would sell for less than we paid. 

Well long story short, I did deal with it all and I forgot something really important. If I wasn't tied down to my exH...I could go anywhere I darn well pleased (as long as he had appropriate visitation with the kids). I could pick a house I LIKED, where I wanted, near the people by whom I wanted to live!! (I picked one on the outskirts of a suburb, with small gardens, a pool, and a neighborhood rec center we could all use, and I LOVED it!) And that's what I was trying to say to you. If you don't like dragging those hoses all over the property, and you are lonely out there in the rural area--you can move to the city or closer to the city--you can move closer to your family or your friends. You know how you've always wanted to live ___? Well you can go there now, if you want!! You know how you've always like stone homes...or brick ones...or the one with the pool...or the gardens...whatever? You can pick the one YOU LIKE and there is no one to stop you! 

Does that make sense? 

Frankly, if you let your nursing credential expire because he told you he'd support you, I'd say that sounds like reason enough to present that in a court of law and make a court degree that he has to pay alimony for a lifetime. Yep have the court garnish is paycheck so he never even SEES your money, he's not in control of you, and you're guaranteed to receive it. And guess who won't like the fact that all of his money goes to you? That's right...the tart!! It's like the most delicious karma because all at once you'd be getting the support you've earned from a lifetime of being faithful, and he will be getting his well-deserved "come uppance" for making such STUPID choices!!

So I'm trying to encourage you. You can survive this. You can choose to do things that untangle the tangled finances. You can choose to change your phone number so he doesn't call you  Give your phone to the daughter who needs to hear from him now and then so he can call that number and get her. You can choose to stay where you are if you enjoy it and it builds you up there...but if it doesn't you can work toward the goal of getting free of that particular house and going where YOU want to go! You can choose to go to divorce support groups. You can choose to consider another kind of career if you want to work--like if you've always wanted to be a painter, do that now! 

See what I mean? The world is open to you. You do not have to sit alone, in the middle of nowhere, being miserable, calling the man who has hurt you over and over so you can be hurt some more. You are smart, beautiful, and valuable--and you can make choices that BENEFIT you. So was there one thing you did today that helped to untangle your finances from his?

P.S. How fun will it be when his tart discovers that all the "money" in the family is actually yours and he gets "an old car, a roll top desk, and his PhD"....and that's all!! :lol:


----------



## Lyris

Australian courts don't generally allocate alimony. Spousal support may be ordered in exceptional circumstances, such as to allow a non-earning spouse to continue to care for a profoundly disabled child. So, unfortunately, I don't think MissMolly will be able to be properly compensated for the loss of her professional registration.

That's good news about the inheritance though, MissMolly. Stay resolute and get every single thing you are entitled to.


----------



## missmolly

Lyris said:


> Australian courts don't generally allocate alimony. Spousal support may be ordered in exceptional circumstances, such as to allow a non-earning spouse to continue to care for a profoundly disabled child. So, unfortunately, I don't think MissMolly will be able to be properly compensated for the loss of her professional registration.
> 
> That's good news about the inheritance though, MissMolly. Stay resolute and get every single thing you are entitled to.


My lawyer assures me that I will be entitled to spousal support, given my age and the length of our marriage. 
She says that there is no way that any judge would ever make me leave our home, and recovery of the inheritance is just about a given. She also says that I am entitled to half of our retirement fund, and recovery of the portion which he gave away to pay the 'debts' of his new little innocent. 
She believes that loss of my registration will also be a huge influencing factor in spousal support.


----------



## alte Dame

missmolly said:


> After our marital settlement is in place, I plan to screw him for repayment of every cent of the inheritance .My lawyer assures me that it would be pointless for him to fight this. My parents intended it to eventually go to their grandchildren, not to a pack of villagers in some third world country.


Absolutely great, Miss Molly! Absolutely. Nothing of yours goes to her. He's already taken way too much.


----------



## Openminded

.


----------



## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> Absolutely great, Miss Molly! Absolutely. Nothing of yours goes to her. He's already taken way too much.


Yes he has. And he took something that I didn’t think possible.

He took my will to live. I haven’t said much about it here on TAM, but for every thought I had of him, I had one for how to die.

I have researched and practiced hangman’s knots. I have gone out driving looking for a good and certain place for a fatal car crash. I have torn this house apart looking for drugs. I have sat with a bottle of caustic soda in my hand (I was too big a coward for that as I have seen the outcome in the OR and they sometimes survive). 
I had quite severe chest pain one night and I was glad. It lasted for several hours. I put out a lot of food and water for the dogs, and left a note for my cousin to not wake me in the morning, but please call in on her way home from work. I didn’t want my dogs alone for too long.

An old work friend and I had worked out a perfect suicide if ever faced with the end of a painful and terminal illness. It was quick, painless and certain. When in charge of the OR, I had the keys to the pharmacy storeroom.. When I became ill a few years ago it had a sudden onset, and I never returned to work, hence didn’t have my ‘stash’. I saw her recently and asked if she had hers, and if she would get some for me. She refused saying it wasn’t the right time for me.

My cousin – the psych nurse – told me yesterday that she was aware of my state of mind and that is why she stayed here every night. She has stayed away a couple of nights this week as she feels that I am stronger, and she is right.

The first night that she stayed away, I was poking through my husband’s desk looking for something and came across a bottle of quite strong sleeping tablets. I looked at them for a long time, and finally decided to take just one.

I had the first decent sleep since last November, and I have taken one each night since. I no longer sit up all night writing essays in my ‘journal’.


----------



## missmolly

Openminded said:


> Miss Molly,
> 
> I have read your thread since the beginning (but only registered yesterday). I know your story so I will give you a brief version of mine. You and I are of the same generation. I'm in my 60's, married for 45 years and about to file for divorce.
> 
> My husband cheated 30 years ago and although I thought (or perhaps "hoped" is the better word) the other woman was out of the picture forever, she resurfaced a few years ago and may never have been really gone. When that happened, I told him that I might not get over it this time.
> 
> Recently, I decided I wasn't over it and told him I would be filing for divorce soon (I am working out financial details). Within a couple of weeks, he had found someone else --- interestingly, not the other woman of 30 years ago so apparently they weren't really soul mates after all.
> 
> Here's to a better life for both of us.
> 
> Openminded


Thank you so much for your input.
Perhaps we can go traveling together in the future?


----------



## missmolly

Catherine602 said:


> MM would it help if you had some insight into what happened to him? It is not you so what is it then.
> 
> It is so puzzling that a man who was kind and attentive would suddenly check out of the lives of people who need him the most. There was a kinder more considerate way to exit the marriage if that is what he wanted. He could have gone through a divorce and an orderly exit.
> 
> If this girl loved him she would wait the relatively short time it woukd have taken to respectfully leave his marriage.
> 
> If he is such a good person, he would not divorce his children. I don't think the average man can go from a loving relationship with his kids to completly forgetting about them.
> 
> MM is probably struggling with what happened I think. If he were an unsteady character all along, maybe this would not be so unexpected but to do a 180 is difficult to fathom.
> 
> What the hell happened.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think it’s simple really. He stopped loving me and met someone else. Or it could have been the other way around.

But he was weak after all, and couldn’t face doing it ‘nicely’. So he adopted a personality which allowed him to to do whatever it took to end the marriage. 

I ,also, met and loved another man during a bleak time in our marriage but remained true to our vows.
He was single, but too decent to ever become involved with a married woman. I would have had to end my marriage first. 

I mentioned in another thread on BPD that our youngest daughter went through a period of self-harming. She made one serious attempt on her life, stabbing herself several times and severing her gastric artery. She was taken to my work, and my OR, where she was operated on by my friends and co workers. The surgeon even called me and said that for an extra $10, he would do a lobotomy so that she didn’t do it again. 
My previously mentioned ‘interest’ was the senior intensivist on duty and he resuscitated and saved her. I didn’t even call and thank him.

My daughter was ‘certified’ and, on the advice of the social worker, we refused to take her home when she was ready for discharge. Refusing her request to come home was SO hard. It was make it or break it time for her and she had to make some choices. She had refused in the past, but at this time she chose to voluntarily enter residential rehab where she stayed for 7 months.

It was shortly after this that my husband went ‘off the rails’.

Re our children

He has promised frequent contact with the youngest

Our elder daughter still refuses to take his calls. She has spoken to him once saying ‘I love you because you are my father. But I think you are a **** for the way you treated my mother and I can’t forgive you”

Why he won’t take calls from my son, I can only guess. My son is totally honest and one of the most morally strong on this earth. Perhaps this contact would make him have to look at himself and he can’t face that.


----------



## missmolly

Affaircare,

I do appreciate what you wrote and read it many times.

The one thing which repeatedly jumped out and hit me in the face was ‘you keep choosing the epic fails and the uncontrolled raging and the vicious spite.’

Yes I succumbed to spite and bitterness but that is not the real me. I am normally a very caring and kind person and I hated hearing myself described like that. In the past I have always had little respect for vicious spiteful people. 

I can’t say that I am over it, because I’m not. But I am doing my best and will continue to do so.


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## alte Dame

You continue to sound quite depressed to me. Are you following up with therapy right now?


----------



## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> Why he won’t take calls from my son, I can only guess. My son is totally honest and one of the most morally strong on this earth. Perhaps this contact would make him have to look at himself and he can’t face that.


I think this is what is wrong with my husband, the reason why he refuses to talk to our grown son. He doesn't want to face what he has done. It is like he is trying to divorce both of us. We are treated as if the same person. We are ignored. It is agonizing. It is like rugsweeping an entire life, actual people, rather than the event that killed us as a family. Oh well, his loss. Our son says he never wants to be the kind of person his father turned out to be. He actually fears it.


----------



## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> You continue to sound quite depressed to me. Are you following up with therapy right now?


My IC has returned from the fires and he called me yesterday morning, and again last night. 
I have an appointment with him next Thursday


----------



## SaltInWound

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...man-who-has-own-fiance-but-wants-him-too.html

This is an older thread, but interesting.


----------



## Catherine602

Hi MissMolly just checking in. I am so glad you therapist is back and communicating with you. 

Your expression of dispair really touched me. I an glad you posted what you are really going through. 

My only comment is that when I have faulty feelings about myself, I pretend that I am what I want to be. I also pretend that I love myself. . It may sound silly but you can change your feelings from the outside in. Acting like you have it all together and that you are handling this may train your mind to actually do so. 

What do you need to change? You have to love and care about yourself. His treatment does not define who you are or your worth as a woman. If his attentions defined you as a woman then that would mean that he has special powers over women. He may think he has become a stud but he is a common fool and the target of a scam. Feel sorry for him but don't be scammed yourself. 

If you think less of yourself becsuse of this low girl then you have allowed her to define you. You give her power over you. They are in control, their every move effects you and drives to destroy yourself. I am certain that no one can set your value but you. 

Expend you efforts in withdrawing your finances from him before it gives it all away. Can withdraw your share of money from all accounts that you share? Cut off access to any money that is yours alone. If you share credit cards cancel them so that he does not run up debt. 

Let him know that he needs to apply for credit in his name. Anything you can do that is legal and protects you financially you should do it. Consult with your lawyer of course. 

On another front, search for something that will engage you now and not require too much work on your part. That why I thought traveling away might work. Visiting friends or family who understand. Or an activity that will engage you now. 

I am not minimizing what you are enduring. I also don't see your anger as unreasonable given the cercunstances. What is concerning is that you are taking out your anger on you. I know it is not easy to disengage yourself from him but it is the best way to protect yourself. 

How are you getting on?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Openminded

missmolly said:


> Thank you so much for your input.
> Perhaps we can go traveling together in the future?


Smiling. We will, for certain, be traveling together through life on this journey we didn't seek. I used to travel extensively in the world (I missed your part of it though and wish I hadn't) and I may take that up again when I get through all of this.

I always keep you in my thoughts.


----------



## missmolly

Does any one_ really_ want to know of my dull existence?
Yesterday I packed up my dogs and took them walking in a pretty park which I had noticed in the town. 
I was the only person there
We walked for a while and as I left I saw a faded sign 'no dogs allowed'
so I walked around the external perimeter for a while - again seeing not another living soul.
Two cars went past. that's something though isn't it?

Email from H last night - apologizing for the pain caused by his deceit and betrayal but ' I suppose you don't want to hear this'. Oh, and letting me know that ****face has moved in with him.

In my usual weak fashion, I responded 'You're dead right there mate 'At least I maintained my good Aussie slang.

Today I didn't bother to get out of bed till 6.30pm. First time in probably 30 years. I just couldn't see the point. 

Was greeted by an email from H saying that he was indignant that someone had lied to him. Weakness Personified replied 'welcome to the real world'.
He replied 'you are right, as usual'

So all in all, another couple of days of being a total idiot.


----------



## missmolly

Why don't I just ignore the creep?
It's a case of 'act, then think', when it should be the other way around. 
Trouble is I shoot back my responses in 10 seconds flat.


----------



## LetDownNTX

Its really hard to not reply or to ignore totally. I had a problem with that as well. Each time I saw an email I would get a flutter in my tummy and then I would open it and it wouldnt be "I love you, Im an idiot, what have I done" and it would just hurt more. I would reply because he was all I knew and I could stand not having some contact with him, even if it wasnt positive!

Keep doing what you are doing! Before long you'll be able to delete his emails without reading them!


----------



## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> Email from H last night - apologizing for the pain caused by his deceit and betrayal but ' I suppose you don't want to hear this'. Oh, and letting me know that ****face has moved in with him.


He is looking for a reaction from you to see if you still care. He is also trying to ease his guilt. He says to himself..... "I moved my mistress in, but it is ok, because I apologized." Reality is, it doesn't work that way and he knows it. 



missmolly said:


> Was greeted by an email from H saying that he was indignant that someone had lied to him. Weakness Personified replied 'welcome to the real world'.
> He replied 'you are right, as usual'


He knows his fantasy [email protected] doesn't want to hear him complain about reality. That is why he is e-mailing you. You always gave a sympathetic ear. 

When you get the urge to respond to him, go outside. Take the dogs for a walk. Go do yard work. Find something to do.


----------



## SaltInWound

Catherine602 said:


> Yes I really want to hear every mundane detail of what you are doing. I get worried when you don't check in for a whole day. Just expect me to keep saying the same things over again about what you are not doing until you do it.
> 
> If you can listen to me repeating myself, I can listen to what is happening with you everyday. I don't expect to be entertained.
> 
> About the emails - SIW has it spot on. I think there is something else, he needs to hear from you because he needs your support to be able to manage this girl.
> 
> He knows that if he has to lean on her totally, she will not be so tolerent of him. Another thing with the repeated I sorrys - he is inviting you to punish him. If you do then he can say to himself that he had every right to betray you.
> 
> He offloads his guilt once or twice a day then goes on in the fantasy. Let's say you get to the point that you stop answering his emails, where does the guilt and self loathing go? It stays where it belongs, with him.
> 
> It builds and he becomes an old sorry man with all the wrongs he has done. Not speaking to an adult son who calls him is inhuman. Baiting an innocent wife is cruel. Abandoning a sick daughter who depends on him for stability is horrible.
> 
> You don't need to castigate him for these let him feel it, ruminate in his addled brain. Let him pour his heart out to the only one he has left, a young girl who does not care about him and certainly not his problems. She wants his money and that is it.
> 
> Make a list of all of the things you want to tell him about his deciet and When you feel like answering, read it over. Then know with certainty that by not discussing his sins with him he discusses it with himself. He gets to feel.
> 
> He also loses something he needs - your support and the assurance that you have not left. He knows this will not last and he is sure that you will take him back.
> 
> As long as he knows he will not be old and alone in a nursing home to live out his days, he can engage in his fantasy until the bell tolls.
> 
> Do you want to be his confidant when it is over. You want to listen to how painful it is to lose his one true love? Do you want to nurse him back to health until he finds the next OW? Do you want to be his guilt dump?
> 
> Everytime you have to deal with the urge to respond first read over your list, answer the above questions and then answer or don't based on what your feel.
> 
> You will soon read the emails with amusement. They will become desperate and he will share his problems. If someone lying to him is upsetting wait until he finds out all the other lies, manipulations, and humiliating derision he has in store.


I applaud you for a well written, truthful post! Miss Molly, pay attention to this. She knows what she is talking about! When you start feeling down or weak, reread it. Print it out and put it on your refrigerator. The next time he e-mails.......read this post again. Draw strength from it. He knows he sh!t in his bed.


----------



## alte Dame

There is truly nothing new under the sun, although every time we experience that 'nothing new,' it is so painful. 

I think I asked at one point if you'd read Thomas Mann's 'Death in Venice.' Great writers observe, describe and warn.
The plot of 'Death in Venice':


"Gustav von Aschenbach is an aging German writer who is the paragon of solemn dignity and fastidious self-discipline. Determinedly cerebral and duty-bound, he believes that true art is produced only in "defiant despite" of corrupting passions and physical weaknesses.


When Aschenbach has the urge to travel, he tells himself that he might find artistic inspiration from a change of scene. Aschenbach's subsequent trip to Venice is the first indulgence he has allowed himself in years; it signals the beginning of his decline. Aschenbach allows the languid Venetian atmosphere and gently rocking gondolas to lull him into a defenseless state. At his hotel he notices an extremely beautiful fourteen-year-old Polish boy named Tadzio, who is visiting with his mother, sisters, and governess. At first, Aschenbach's interest in the boy is purely aesthetic, or so he tells himself. However, he soon falls deeply and obsessively in love with the boy, although the two never have direct contact.

Aschenbach spends days on end watching Tadzio play on the beach, even following his family around the streets of Venice. Cholera infects the city, and although the authorities try to conceal the danger from the tourists, Aschenbach soon learns the facts about the lethal epidemic. However, he cannot bear to leave Tadzio and stays on in Venice. He becomes progressively daring in his pursuit of the boy, gradually becoming more and more debased, until he finally dies of the cholera, degraded, a slave to his passions, stripped of his dignity."


----------



## Shoshannah

Catherine602 said:


> Yes I really want to hear every mundane detail of what you are doing. I get worried when you don't check in for a whole day. Just expect me to keep saying the same things over again about what you are not doing until you do it.
> 
> If you can listen to me repeating myself, I can listen to what is happening with you everyday. I don't expect to be entertained.
> 
> About the emails - SIW has it spot on. I think there is something else, he needs to hear from you because he needs your support to be able to manage this girl.
> 
> He knows that if he has to lean on her totally, she will not be so tolerent of him. Another thing with the repeated I sorrys - he is inviting you to punish him. If you do then he can say to himself that he had every right to betray you.
> 
> He offloads his guilt once or twice a day then goes on in the fantasy. Let's say you get to the point that you stop answering his emails, where does the guilt and self loathing go? It stays where it belongs, with him.
> 
> It builds and he becomes an old sorry man with all the wrongs he has done. Not speaking to an adult son who calls him is inhuman. Baiting an innocent wife is cruel. Abandoning a sick daughter who depends on him for stability is horrible.
> 
> You don't need to castigate him for these let him feel it, ruminate in his addled brain. Let him pour his heart out to the only one he has left, a young girl who does not care about him and certainly not his problems. She wants his money and that is it.
> 
> Make a list of all of the things you want to tell him about his deciet and When you feel like answering, read it over. Then know with certainty that by not discussing his sins with him he discusses it with himself. He gets to feel.
> 
> He also loses something he needs - your support and the assurance that you have not left. He knows this will not last and he is sure that you will take him back.
> 
> As long as he knows he will not be old and alone in a nursing home to live out his days, he can engage in his fantasy until the bell tolls.
> 
> Do you want to be his confidant when it is over. You want to listen to how painful it is to lose his one true love? Do you want to nurse him back to health until he finds the next OW? Do you want to be his guilt dump?
> 
> Everytime you have to deal with the urge to respond first read over your list, answer the above questions and then answer or don't based on what your feel.
> 
> You will soon read the emails with amusement. They will become desperate and he will share his problems. If someone lying to him is upsetting wait until he finds out all the other lies, manipulations, and humiliating derision he has in store.


:iagree: brilliant!


----------



## missmolly

Thanks everyone, I shall print Catherine's posting and put it on the front of my fridge.


----------



## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> There is truly nothing new under the sun, although every time we experience that 'nothing new,' it is so painful.
> 
> I think I asked at one point if you'd read Thomas Mann's 'Death in Venice.'



Although once an avid reader, this is one I have missed. I shall add it to my 'must read' list

Unfortunately my concentration for reading has deserted me at the moment and I have not read a paper, book or magazine since last November.


----------



## Affaircare

There is one other thing that he gets from his emails. If you are still part of his life, when things go poorly and he goads you and you reply with a snarky response, he can then blame YOU rather than blaming himself for his life and his choices. 

Let me give you an example. Let's say his little strumpet wants to make love and being a man who is 60yo who was at work all day, he's tired and he can not get hard. Now it couldn't be his "soulmate" doesn't understand him. And it couldn't be that he made a mistake choosing a 5yo over the wife of his youth. So what else could it be? OH YES!! It must be missmolly. Yes, that's it--the stress of having to deal with her is making him limp!

So he emails you a thinly veiled jerk email that contains the words 'I'm sorry' and 'maturity' and some talk about not being 'meant to be' or something that all sounds good... and he baits the hook. You naturally realize he is nowhere near actually repentant of how he is still continuing to behave, and if anything he's sorry he got caught and has to pay the price....so you take the bait and reply with a smarta$$ comment. Just a little one so it's not like you raged at him...but now he has what he needs. The problem is "you" and not the ****-ette and not him!!

"See how she talks to me?" he says. "I wrote to her from the heart and she replied with hatred and it's no wonder I can't get hard when I have to deal with an ex-wife like that! I've had to put up with that for decades! Oh Poor Me!" Now he can blame you for all the problems in his life, none of which have to do with all and ALL OF WHICH are directly from his own choices to be unfaithful. 

missmolly, it's time to close that email address. Let him face his own issues and his own pain and his own problems. BLOCK HIM and only speak via a lawyer or via a friend who agrees to be the "go between" so none of his bullsh!t gets through to you. Then carry on with your own life and deal with your own sorrow and grief.


----------



## missmolly

I have deleted him


----------



## missmolly

Today? I discovered that I had a new rock bottom

However, my posSTBXH remains deleted
Doing that was like another knife in my heart and my soul.

I saw my IC today. I didn't think that I could ever be civil to another male, but he is special. 

He ended the session by re closing the door and hugging me.

He is indeed special.


----------



## missmolly

well it is 2.25am here and I was doing my best to sleep.

My daughter phoned and woke me. She was extremely upset because apparently the creep has put his special friend up on his Facebook page.


----------



## Thorburn

What I have done the last week. My WS is still living with me. I don't talk to her. I wrote a letter as suggested by a pastor basically saying I loved you, still do, sought godly counsel, prayed for you and because I love you I will be filing for D.

She opened a FB using her maiden name and was referring to me as her ex. Hooking up with at least one guy that we had an argument about two years ago who she was going to hook up with. 

My son told me to stop looking and let her do whatever she wants, we can't stop her.

All it did was show some of her family who were sitting on the fence just how bad she is.

So, block him. Don't respond to him in any manner unless it is through the attorney.

Cut him off.

It is hard but once you start doing this and you make it through a day without responding you have accomplished a very good goal.

You may need to hear this more than once. It took me over a year to have my eyes really opened and I am still in shock.

But as the pastor said, give her the letter, and follow through with D. He also said to get my accounts together for the attorney.

Letting go is hard and may seem impossible but do it. Let him go.


----------



## missmolly

Thorburn said:


> What I have done the last week. My WS is still living with me. I don't talk to her. I wrote a letter as suggested by a pastor basically saying I loved you, still do, sought godly counsel, prayed for you and because I love you I will be filing for D.
> 
> She opened a FB using her maiden name and was referring to me as her ex. Hooking up with at least one guy that we had an argument about two years ago who she was going to hook up with.
> 
> My son told me to stop looking and let her do whatever she wants, we can't stop her.
> 
> All it did was show some of her family who were sitting on the fence just how bad she is.
> 
> So, block him. Don't respond to him in any manner unless it is through the attorney.
> 
> Cut him off.
> 
> It is hard but once you start doing this and you make it through a day without responding you have accomplished a very good goal.
> 
> You may need to hear this more than once. It took me over a year to have my eyes really opened and I am still in shock.
> 
> But as the pastor said, give her the letter, and follow through with D. He also said to get my accounts together for the attorney.
> 
> Letting go is hard and may seem impossible but do it. Let him go.


Thorburn,

I have deleted him from everything but unfortunately our daughter hasn't.

She doesn't live with me, she is in the city, but called when she saw it.


----------



## Thorburn

missmolly said:


> Thorburn,
> 
> I have deleted him from everything but unfortunately our daughter hasn't.
> 
> She doesn't live with me, she is in the city, but called when she saw it.


I did the opposite. I called my son. He said, "Dad, stop looking, all it will do is upset you". I took his advice.

Your daughter and your WS may talk, like my son and WS did a few days ago. I felt betrayed in that my son said he was not going to talk to his mother. I had to get over it. Let it go. Down the road they will R, maybe sooner than later. My son is an adult and has to make his own decisions. Right now he is an ally. But is also very torn. 

Just try to work through each issue as they come. It stinks.

Here is a big bear hug.


----------



## Acabado

missmolly said:


> I have deleted him





missmolly said:


> However, my posSTBXH remains deleted. Doing that was like another knife in my heart and my soul.





missmolly said:


> My daughter phoned and woke me. She was extremely upset because apparently the creep has put his special friend up on his Facebook page.





missmolly said:


> I have deleted him from everything but unfortunately our daughter hasn't.
> She doesn't live with me, she is in the city, but called when she saw it.


Connect the dots.


----------



## SaltInWound

Catherine602 said:


> MM which of your daughters told you about the FB posting? If it is your daughter who was his favorite, how old is she? She hit to be over 20. If so then I think she is old enough to take of her Momin her time of need. Can you talk to her?
> 
> Explain why it is so important to you that she keep info about her father to herself.
> 
> I understand she is upset however, she will have to talk with friends about any info she finds describing. Anything else she can feel free to discuss.
> 
> The time of this posting is interesting. Just when you cut him off. I wonder if it his way of communicating his anger? He knows this will get back to you.
> 
> MM I know this is terribly upsetting but let's reframe it.
> 
> If he so happy and so sorry, why is he hurting you in such a public way? He cant communicate with you any other way and he is very angry that you cut his azz off. However, he is so crazy that he did not consider that he is exposing his foolishness to all the world.
> 
> You think he wants to advertise his happiness? No I don't think so. Would any sane man advertise something on FB that is meant to deliberately humiliate his kids and his family?
> 
> Would a man who has garnered the respect of friends and professional associates all these years disabuse them of their good opinion of him in one fell swoop? He is advertising that he is cheating on his wife. Not only that, he advertises that he is a foolish old man who being taken to the cleaners!! So what is going on.
> 
> He has got to have something wrong with him. He also is very angry with you M M for cutting his stupid azz off. And he chose this crazy azz way to show it. It's like a child showing off. He did consider all of the angles. Most of all that he made himself a laughing stock.
> 
> Hang in there M M. He may begin to behave in an erratic fashion now so be prepared for anything. Mostly, you have to decode his behavior. It is not what you think. You need to feel some pity for him.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Another very intelligent post!


----------



## missmolly

Thorburn said:


> I did the opposite. I called my son. He said, "Dad, stop looking, all it will do is upset you". I took his advice.
> 
> Your daughter and your WS may talk, like my son and WS did a few days ago. I felt betrayed in that my son said he was not going to talk to his mother. I had to get over it. Let it go. Down the road they will R, maybe sooner than later. My son is an adult and has to make his own decisions. Right now he is an ally. But is also very torn.
> 
> Just try to work through each issue as they come. It stinks.
> 
> Here is a big bear hug.


Thank you.
Hey, didn't I ask you to marry me a few weeks ago?
See, I still have a sense of humour after all. 

My daughter still refuses any contact with her father but obviously hasn't deleted him from FB.
She is normally extremely independent and rarely looks to lean on me for anything. She is the one who was closest to her father and she is 34. I think Catherine asked these questions.


----------



## alte Dame

I still think he's a man who is in thrall to his baser emotions right now and is simply too weak to do what any honorable, mature man would do, which is not shame himself and ruin his life by giving in to his impulses.

Maybe there is some senility starting here. Several have mentioned that and it's certainly a possibility. (There was a recent thread started by a man in his early 70's whose wife was very hostile and openly sleeping with a neighbor's son (in his 20's). The woman was around the same age as her H and had never acted out this way before.)

It's almost like he's tearing himself apart because he desperately wants two mutually exclusive things - his tart and his family. I think he's operating with a weakened mind and can't handle the dissonance of the things that he desires for himself. I still believe the best thing his family can do for him now is to ignore him. If they offer him even the slightest lifeline, he will persist in the fiction that he can actually have both of the things that he wants.


----------



## missmolly

alte Dame said:


> I still think he's a man who is in thrall to his baser emotions right now and is simply too weak to do what any honorable, mature man would do, which is not shame himself and ruin his life by giving in to his impulses.
> 
> Maybe there is some senility starting here. Several have mentioned that and it's certainly a possibility. (There was a recent thread started by a man in his early 70's whose wife was very hostile and openly sleeping with a neighbor's son (in his 20's). The woman was around the same age as her H and had never acted out this way before.)
> 
> It's almost like he's tearing himself apart because he desperately wants two mutually exclusive things - his tart and his family. I think he's operating with a weakened mind and can't handle the dissonance of the things that he desires for himself. I still believe the best thing his family can do for him now is to ignore him. If they offer him even the slightest lifeline, he will persist in the fiction that he can actually have both of the things that he wants.


Right at this moment I don't care if he's a man about to dance on the moon in a tutu. 
I don't care where he is coming from but I sure know where he's headed. 

He is entering into a seriously difficult time in his life. 

(just hope I feel the same way tomorrow)


----------



## missmolly

I have just received a very supportive email from the wife of one his _very_ esteemed colleagues. 

How he would cringe if he could read her comments. 

I don't think there will be many invitations for dinner from there from now on.


----------



## Catherine602

missmolly said:


> I have just received a very supportive email from the wife of one his _very_ esteemed colleagues.
> 
> How he would cringe if he could read her comments.
> 
> I don't think there will be many invitations for dinner from there from now on.


Yes and now it starts. He made a foolish move posting on FB. What did he expect? A high five from his colleagues? They are embarrassed for him. 

I would imagine he will be contacted by people he knows and they will contact each other. You said people knew him as a caring family man. What will shock them is that he is cruel enough to go so public. 

It would have been easy not to announce an affair online if the announcement would humiliate his kids and his side of the family who no one would think is responsible for his cheating. 

The contractors for his job, is this so common that they will continue his contract no matter what? I can just imagine the quality of his work now. He will be lucky if he is not released before the contact expires. 

MM wanted to ask you to resist sending him any correspondence about that email. Any contact at all, even negative ones will let him know that you are reacting to his latest ploy. He will get reactions from people directly. It will not be positive. 

I ask you to be prepared for his actions to get even more bazaar and illogical. Please resist the urge to tell him how little traction his attempts to bait you are getting. 

Right now you are ahead in ways that you cannot see. Stay that way. It will get easier to see that you ahead are but you must stay the course. 

You don't want to start the NC process all over again by giving him what he wants, your assurance that you will be there to sooth him when the balloon burst. It won't be tragic if you do contact him but it will prolong the process.


----------



## missmolly

I have no intention of contacting him at all

JUST WISH I COULD SLEEP!!!


----------



## Catherine602

((((((( HUG )))))))  big hug for you.


----------



## Catherine602

missmolly said:


> I have no intention of contacting him at all
> 
> JUST WISH I COULD SLEEP!!!


Ask IC for short acting sleeping pills?


----------



## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> I have just received a very supportive email from the wife of one his _very_ esteemed colleagues.
> 
> How he would cringe if he could read her comments.
> 
> I don't think there will be many invitations for dinner from there from now on.


:woohoo:


----------



## missmolly

Psychologists in Australia do not have prescribing power for drugs. The medical profession guards that fiercely. 
It's part of the Doctor God Syndrome, a bit like my H really.

The Dr I saw said 'get over it' as outlined earlier. 

ALL hugs greatly appreciated.


----------



## Bellavista

Try phernagan. Not only will you sleep, you won't sneeze either.


----------



## missmolly

Bellavista said:


> Try phernagan. Not only will you sleep, you won't sneeze either.


Funny you should say that, my daughter offered me her unfilled script yesterday. I shall get it today


----------



## Affaircare

Missmolly~

When I first discovered my exH's infidelity, I couldn't sleep either. I didn't sleep more than 5-6 hours for probably 2 years. But you know what I did do? I started about 11pm to do "de-stressing" things, like I stopped doing housework or chores, I stopped writing in my journal, I started reading a pleasure book (in other words, not a book for fixing relationships or self-help...just "a good story"), I made a cup of chamomile tea, and at midnight every night I took melatonin. It's a natural hormone that is meant to make you feel drowsy, and the idea was to naturally give myself time to unwind and relax enough TO BE SLEEPY. Also with melatonin you don't get that "I took a sleeping pill" hangover the next morning.


----------



## missmolly

Affaircare said:


> Missmolly~
> 
> When I first discovered my exH's infidelity, I couldn't sleep either. I didn't sleep more than 5-6 hours for probably 2 years. But you know what I did do? I started about 11pm to do "de-stressing" things, like I stopped doing housework or chores, I stopped writing in my journal, I started reading a pleasure book (in other words, not a book for fixing relationships or self-help...just "a good story"), I made a cup of chamomile tea, and at midnight every night I took melatonin. It's a natural hormone that is meant to make you feel drowsy, and the idea was to naturally give myself time to unwind and relax enough TO BE SLEEPY. Also with melatonin you don't get that "I took a sleeping pill" hangover the next morning.


Once an avid reader, I am now struggling with concentration. I haven't read a book, newspaper or magazine since November. I have read the first few pages of what looks to be a great novel, about 15 times.

My H used to use melatonin sometimes but we were never able to buy it in Aus. We always bought it whilst overseas.
Anyone here from Aus with a source??

I actually don't have trouble falling asleep when I go to bed -I'm usually so darned tired. This usually happens quickly. But I rarely go longer than a couple of hours before my vivid dreams wake me.
These dreams have been downright awful at times, then I'm almost afraid to sleep again as they repeat. My own groaning in my sleep wakes me at times also. I make these frightful noises like a dying animal. Now that took some courage to admit.


----------



## Catherine602

Hi MissMolly. What are you doing? Got any plans for today? More details needed. 

How has the sleep issue worked out? 

Remember the small steps to a new life. I'd like to hear what you thinking /doing towards that end. Any progress no matter how small is important. How are your children doing? 

Have the wildfire's stopped?


----------



## Openminded

missmolly said:


> Once an avid reader, I am now struggling with concentration. I haven't read a book, newspaper or magazine since November. I have read the first few pages of what looks to be a great novel, about 15 times.
> 
> My H used to use melatonin sometimes but we were never able to buy it in Aus. We always bought it whilst overseas.
> Anyone here from Aus with a source??
> 
> I actually don't have trouble falling asleep when I go to bed -I'm usually so darned tired. This usually happens quickly. But I rarely go longer than a couple of hours before my vivid dreams wake me.
> These dreams have been downright awful at times, then I'm almost afraid to sleep again as they repeat. My own groaning in my sleep wakes me at times also. I make these frightful noises like a dying animal. Now that took some courage to admit.


I understand what you are saying. For the past three or four years I had no trouble falling asleep but would then wake up two or three hours later. However, since I made the decision to get out, my sleep time has been lengthening recently. I still can't sleep eight hours straight but I'm up to five, sometimes six, hours straight.

I think the mind is trying, during sleep, to fully process and integrate what's going on and that causes the vivid dreams and those wakeful periods.

I'm sure this is a temporary thing and it will sort itself out soon. It's exhausting, I know.


----------



## Catherine602

Hi MissMolly. Stopping by to let you know i am thinking of you. Hope you are sleeping better and you are around people as much as possible.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Louise7

missmolly said:


> Thank you.
> Hey, didn't I ask you to marry me a few weeks ago?
> See, I still have a sense of humour after all.
> 
> My daughter still refuses any contact with her father but obviously hasn't deleted him from FB.
> She is normally extremely independent and rarely looks to lean on me for anything. She is the one who was closest to her father and she is 34. I think Catherine asked these questions.


"Hey, didn't I ask you to marry me a few weeks ago?
See, I still have a sense of humour after all. "

Get in line MM. T is quite a catch and I predict a line of ladies knocking on his door once he gets out from under.


----------



## Catherine602

Don't want to be a bother but dropping by to say hello and that I am thinking of you.


----------



## Catherine602

Hello MM just checking in. Thinking of you.


----------



## missmolly

still alive but not much kick in me at the moment 
will write soon


----------



## missmolly

sorry guys, but I have no will for anything


----------



## SaltInWound

MM, hang in there. You are not alone in how you feel. Don't let him win. Stay tough. Remember that he is old, a fool, and a coward. He will fall, and fall miserably as a broke man. His collegues see through him. He is fooling nobody. You are a strong woman with a smart mind. You already surpass him just by breathing.


----------



## missmolly

thank you


----------



## Catherine602

You're welcome Molly. Will talk to you tomorrow.


----------



## Catherine602

hi MM. Thinking of you.


----------



## missmolly

I am visiting my aunt for a few days. Poor internet AND mobile phone reception here. Back on Thursday


----------



## SaltInWound

missmolly said:


> I am visiting my aunt for a few days. Poor internet AND mobile phone reception here. Back on Thursday


I am glad to hear you will have some interaction with loved ones. Enjoy your time away. It will be good for you.


----------



## Catherine602

Thanks for the update. Will be looking out for you and thinking of you.


----------



## missmolly

I have been in the darkest black hole for the last couple of weeks and writing has been beyond me.

Also, I feel I have worn out my welcome on the ‘coping with infidelity’ pages. I doubt I will ever cope with it and will end up a bitter, evil old hag.

My H continues to surpass himself regularly with his newly attained talent for ugliness. We have had some great slinging matches over our settlement and I now derive pleasure from being a thorn in his side. His opinion of me means nothing to me (now that’s progress), and I delight in being the rotten old wife and couldn’t care less if this elevates the little alley rat in his eyes. It may be an uneducated toe nail cutter, but my goodness, it sure has street smarts. He is welcome to it.

He has offered to fly our daughters over to meet his great new love and both have declined. Hats off to my girls. I am careful what I say in front of them as I want neither to think that I am deliberately poisoning them against him. They have made their own decisions.

I still feel in a state of homelessness. He is screwing me over so badly financially that there is no doubt that I will live on the poverty line. I have a new legal representative and she is local. She does not paint as rosy a picture as the city ones did, but I suspect is being more realistic. 
She thinks spousal support is hardly worth the effort unless I want him to be greeted at the airport here with a warrant for non payment. There is no way that it can be enforced if he resides overseas. She has had experience with several similar cases and says that there will only one winner, and it is the one from a different culture.

I am dragging out the settlement for as long as possible as he continues to pay me a generous amount from our retirement fund. I don’t discuss this with him, but he has assured our daughter that he won’t cut it off. I have replaced several large household items and will do so for as long as it continues. If I am to live in poverty, then I shall at least enter it with new appliances.

My long term future does not look rosy.

M H is returning here – for THREE weeks – to sort through his belongings and prepare the house for sale. He has even asked if he may stay here!!!!!! I have told him that I am not prepared to do anything to help. If the house is valued at a very low price, then I might just be able to buy him out. I have no where to go and no reason to be anywhere, so it might just as well be here for now.

It might even be fun if he stays here. He is not good with heights in his old age and always asks me to hold the ladder. Now that could be really fun.

So you can see that I am now an old, bitter hag and my short term pleasure will be his displeasure.


----------



## MattMatt

missmolly said:


> I have been in the darkest black hole for the last couple of weeks and writing has been beyond me.
> 
> Also, I feel I have worn out my welcome on the ‘coping with infidelity’ pages. I doubt I will ever cope with it and will end up a bitter, evil old hag.
> 
> My H continues to surpass himself regularly with his newly attained talent for ugliness. We have had some great slinging matches over our settlement and I now derive pleasure from being a thorn in his side. His opinion of me means nothing to me (now that’s progress), and I delight in being the rotten old wife and couldn’t care less if this elevates the little alley rat in his eyes. It may be an uneducated toe nail cutter, but my goodness, it sure has street smarts. He is welcome to it.
> 
> He has offered to fly our daughters over to meet his great new love and both have declined. Hats off to my girls. I am careful what I say in front of them as I want neither to think that I am deliberately poisoning them against him. They have made their own decisions.
> 
> I still feel in a state of homelessness. He is screwing me over so badly financially that there is no doubt that I will live on the poverty line. I have a new legal representative and she is local. She does not paint as rosy a picture as the city ones did, but I suspect is being more realistic.
> She thinks spousal support is hardly worth the effort unless I want him to be greeted at the airport here with a warrant for non payment. There is no way that it can be enforced if he resides overseas. She has had experience with several similar cases and says that there will only one winner, is it is from a different culture.
> 
> I am dragging out the settlement for as long as possible as he continues to pay me a generous amount from our retirement fund. I don’t discuss this with him, but he has assured our daughter that he won’t cut it off. I have replaced several large household items and will do so for as long as it continues. If I am to live in poverty, then I shall at least enter it with new appliances.
> 
> My long term future does not look rosy.
> 
> M H is returning here – for THREE weeks – to sort through his belongings and prepare the house for sale. He has even asked if he may stay here!!!!!! I have told him that I am not prepared to do anything to help. If the house is valued at a very low price, then I might just be able to buy him out. I have no where to go and no reason to be anywhere, so it might just as well be here for now.
> 
> It might even be fun if he stays here. He is not good with heights in his old age and always asks me to hold the ladder. Now that could be really fun.
> 
> So you can see that I am now an old, bitter hag and my short term pleasure will be his displeasure.


Hmmm, Miss Molly. Old? Nope. Bitter? Well, perhaps, but with good cause. Hag? Not at all.

You are well shot of him! BTW, your avatar is beautiful! Such a pretty little dog!:smthumbup:

My best wishes to you and your girls.


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## Louise7

missmolly said:


> I have been in the darkest black hole for the last couple of weeks and writing has been beyond me.
> 
> Also, I feel I have worn out my welcome on the ‘coping with infidelity’ pages. *No you haven't!!!*I doubt I will ever cope with it and will end up a bitter, evil old hag.
> 
> My H continues to surpass himself regularly with his newly attained talent for ugliness. We have had some great slinging matches over our settlement and I now derive pleasure from being a thorn in his side. *Excellent.* His opinion of me means nothing to me (now that’s progress), and I delight in being the rotten old wife and couldn’t care less if this elevates the little alley rat in his eyes. It may be an uneducated toe nail cutter, but my goodness, it sure has street smarts. He is welcome to it.
> 
> He has offered to fly our daughters over to meet his great new love and both have declined. Hats off to my girls. I am careful what I say in front of them as I want neither to think that I am deliberately poisoning them against him. They have made their own decisions.*A very smart move though I know how hard it is to keep quiet.*
> 
> I still feel in a state of homelessness. He is screwing me over so badly financially that there is no doubt that I will live on the poverty line. I have a new legal representative and she is local. She does not paint as rosy a picture as the city ones did, but I suspect is being more realistic.
> She thinks spousal support is hardly worth the effort unless I want him to be greeted at the airport here with a warrant for non payment. *Well that would be cool.* There is no way that it can be enforced if he resides overseas. She has had experience with several similar cases and says that there will only one winner, is it is from a different culture.
> 
> I am dragging out the settlement for as long as possible as he continues to pay me a generous amount from our retirement fund. I don’t discuss this with him, but he has assured our daughter that he won’t cut it off. *So get your lawyer to get this written in to the settlement* I have replaced several large household items and will do so for as long as it continues. If I am to live in poverty, then I shall at least enter it with new appliances.*I would also start stashing money away, perhaps in an account in one of your daughter's names.*
> 
> My long term future does not look rosy.*It will be okay because you will be minus one lowlife, grade A Richard (I'm not sure I'm allowed to say ****, or prick or any of the other choice adjectives I'd like to use.*
> 
> M H is returning here – for THREE weeks – to sort through his belongings and prepare the house for sale. He has even asked if he may stay here!!!!!! *No. You are fussy about who you breath air with. He can find a hotel and come to the house between the hours of 9am and 5pm*I have told him that I am not prepared to do anything to help. If the house is valued at a very low price, then I might just be able to buy him out.*I refused to do any work on the house when I was where you are. I let it rot. I then got 3 valuations and made sure I pointed out every fault with the house that I could. The valuation was nearly 40k below where it should have been. :smthumbup:* I have no where to go and no reason to be anywhere, so it might just as well be here for now.
> 
> It might even be fun if he stays here. He is not good with heights in his old age and always asks me to hold the ladder. Now that could be really fun.*It would be a terrible shame if you got a sneezing fit while you were at the bottom.*
> 
> So you can see that I am now an old, bitter hag and my short term pleasure will be his displeasure.


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## Aunt Ava

Welcome back, I have worried about you in your absence. You can't wear out your welcome here, this is a sanctuary for you, a place where you can vent and receive understanding and support when you do.

Bravo to your daughters. It is refreshing to see adult children stand up to a cheating, lying parent instead of the "whatever makes him happy" attitude so prevalent in today's society.

Considering that your STBXH is treating you so shabbily I don't know why you should have to tolerate his presence in your home for three weeks. He can make other arrangements, if he should insist - then dear lady you can have the pleasure of making his every waking minute miserable. Although, I suppose the adult thing to do is "the 180". For your own sanity and self preservation that would be wisest. 

Sending you strength and hoping you will remember the words of Winston Churchill "when going through hell keep going". Don't give up on yourself, you will get through this and you owe it to everyone that loves you to keep going.


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## missmolly

MattMatt said:


> Hmmm, Miss Molly. Old? Nope. Bitter? Well, perhaps, but with good cause. Hag? Not at all.
> 
> You are well shot of him! BTW, your avatar is beautiful! Such a pretty little dog!:smthumbup:
> 
> My best wishes to you and your girls.


Thanks MattMatt

That pretty little dog has been renamed Muriel 
She told me that she hates her real name and refuses to answer to it. Her name was of Vietnamese origin.


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## missmolly

Thanks for your comments Louise. 

The retirement fund will have to be 'cashed up' for the settlement so that payment will cease at that time. My fear is that he is 'milking' it already and I can't do anything about that as it is in his name and I don't have access. He has already admitted to taking $20K, and given the toe nail cutter $12K for her 'debts' and that was in January. 

My solicitor has suggested that I have it frozen immediatedly but that will leave me with no income at all and I would have to live off our savings. I think I am prepared to risk him milking it as should he do this, I have one avenue for restoration which I believe he has forgotten about. 
We have an overdraft facility which we set up in both names years ago when we needed $350K between house settlements. We have never used it since but it remains active. 
I tried to cancel it but the bank refused unless we both present together at a branch to do this. This means that he has not cancelled it either. 
If I find that he has milked the retirement fund, then I shall drawdown twice that amount, immediately repay my half, then he will be left with the debt of the other half. 

I am already stashing cash as I find that I am not even able to obtain a credit card should he cancel our joint one. I am deemed to have no income as the retirement fund is in his name only.

Where he stays when in Aus is a problem as a hotel/motel would be a hefty expense and it would come out of 'our' funds here. He is paid in American dollars and is not likely to have brought much with him. The cheapest motel around here is $80 per night and I don't really want to part with that sort of money for three and a half weeks. He would also need a rental car as we live quite a distance out of town, and this would also come from the local funds. 

I found a packet of Valium recently and am saving it for his visit. I have practiced with quarter of a tablet and find it quite calming. I will save it for the moments when I can't control smashing a fist into his evil face. 

I have already refused to do any of the work around the house and he will find it quite a hovel when he arrives. The grass will be quite high by May and that's a lot of grass on 5 acres. Every dish in the house will be used and spread out, discarded clothing will litter every floor (which won't be swept for weeks), and rubbish bins will be overflowing and surrounded by surpluss litter. I will tell him that I have lost interest in appearances and am no longer houseproud. 
He has a maid and I do not, and after all, I am very, very old.

re I refused to do any work on the house when I was where you are. I let it rot. I then got 3 valuations and made sure I pointed out every fault with the house that I could. The valuation was nearly 40k below where it should have been.

WELL DONE!! My plan exactly.

Now that ladder .....


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## missmolly

Aunt Ava said:


> Welcome back, I have worried about you in your absence. You can't wear out your welcome here, this is a sanctuary for you, a place where you can vent and receive understanding and support when you do.
> 
> Bravo to your daughters. It is refreshing to see adult children stand up to a cheating, lying parent instead of the "whatever makes him happy" attitude so prevalent in today's society.
> 
> Considering that your STBXH is treating you so shabbily I don't know why you should have to tolerate his presence in your home for three weeks. He can make other arrangements, if he should insist - then dear lady you can have the pleasure of making his every waking minute miserable. Although, I suppose the adult thing to do is "the 180". For your own sanity and self preservation that would be wisest.
> 
> Sending you strength and hoping you will remember the words of Winston Churchill "when going through hell keep going". Don't give up on yourself, you will get through this and you owe it to everyone that loves you to keep going.


I had started to feel like a Class A Whinger.

I'm really proud of my daughters. My eldest volunteered only last night 'My father is dead, and I grieve for that. What remains in his shell, I want no part of'. 

I'd like to think that I could 180, but I know I won't be able to. I will do my best to keep my distance from him. However no longer caring what his opinion of me is has been quite empowering and I'm sure he will leave with no doubt that I think him a moron.


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## Aunt Ava

How are you MM?


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## missmolly

not good


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## SaltInWound

Hang in there MM. Don't let him destroy you. Are you staying busy? Keeping alcohol consumption to a minimum?


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## Aunt Ava

Molly I have worried about you, I was so hoping things were improving.


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## alte Dame

Maybe talking to us will help, even just a little.


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## Lyris

I've been thinking about you too. So sorry things aren't improving.


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## missmolly

I have not been coping very well and am going into hospital today
My husband has been here for two weeks and left yesterday
He has taken what he wants to keep and had it shipped overseas


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## Bellavista

Miss Molly, I do hope that you can get some help within the medical system. I am sorry to hear that you are struggling to cope and pray for strength & clarity of mind for you.


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## disconnected

I registered a few days ago, and started thread "I never saw this coming ..."

SaltInWound referred me to missmolly's thread, which I have just finished reading (over a day and a half).

There are similarities with MM's and my situation in that our husbands have taken up with young Asian women in the countries we are based in.

My husband is 63, and he has become something that he always detested seeing -- he always thought that it was never a 'good look' seeing old 'foreigner' men with young local (Asian) women.


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## missmolly

I’ve been working on this update for a few days now. 
My life took a nosedive after my last real posting.

Anger gave way to misery and heartbreak again and although I had lightened up greatly on the drinking, it was still more than it should have been. I wasn’t sleeping well and had come to a standstill with all but the basics of life. Whilst I didn’t take to my bed, I certainly had pajama days when I didn’t even bother to dress.

An old friend who is an artist invited me to the opening night of her show and as it was in the town nearest to where my sister lives, I decided to attend. My daughter decided to accompany me. 
It was a hairy trip over the mountains, with half of the road closed for repairs after the massive damage of the fires. The road was only open at night, with daylight used for repairs. My daughter had a massive panic attack and it was ages before it was safe to pull over so that she could get to her medication. 

I followed that with a massive sad attack as we drove past a property that my H and I had always wanted to buy, and had missed out on by 20 mins when it was on the market. Fate – I wonder how it would have turned out had we bought that property.

Anyway, I arrived quite late at my sister’s place in a very shaky state and this was followed by one of the worst nights of my life. I was aware of her capacity to be acerbic and judgmental, but had never been on the receiving end of it. I will spare you all the detail, but it culminated in her insisting that I hear all about her visit to V’nam, mocking me when I begged her to stop, me hitting the brandy, and then I assaulted her by throwing a chair at her. 

She had me carted away to hospital, strapped down in a Mad People Ambulance (with a police escort), and I spent the next few hours convincing the doctors that I was sane. When discharged at daylight, I was immediately arrested and she had me charged with assault. I was taken to the police station on the floor of a paddy wagon, and was then in a cell. When released many hours later, I was made to wait in a park in the middle of the town for 3 hours, and my dogs, car and daughter were delivered to me. The police said that she has also taken out a restraining order against me, but I have heard no more about it.

I have given up alcohol completely since that night. I often wonder why I turned to alcohol as I was only a light social drinker before that. And of course, all the alcohol did was just delay facing the reality in broad daylight.

The following weeks were like being back in square one. Coupled with the isolation, it was a truly horrid time and I withdrew from everyone and everything. 

My H (that word is a joke now) came back for 3 weeks and I allowed him to stay at the house. As with his previous trip, it was surprisingly calm and civil, and we talked quite a bit. He believes himself to be in love with this person.

He went through our belongings and packed and shipped out 3 boxes. He has no plans to return to Aus to live. He has given up a lifetime of possessions and all but a handful of a magnificent library. He has left me with over SIXTY boxes of books, and sundry items to deal with.

I held it all together in front of him (for the most part), but inside it was just hideous for me. I started savagely chewing my tongue in my sleep, and have even damaged some teeth. I could barely speak for the last few days as my tongue was swollen and torn and by then I was chomping on it day and night and just couldn’t stop.

I drove him to the airport as I was going to the city to stay the night with my daughter (who still refuses contact with him) and was admitted to a private clinic the next day. I am still there and of course he does not know. I am accepting heavy sedation to stop the chewing. I also look like the village idiot whilst doing it.

Incidentally, he told me that my sister and her husband stayed at his home whilst there on holidays. She lied to me. No wonder she had such a strong opinion that he is being fleeced. I have had no contact with her.


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## Openminded

Oh, missmolly, I am so sorry to hear what you have been going through. I keep you in my thoughts always.


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## Aunt Ava

MissMolly, thanks for the update, so relieved you're taking steps for your well being. Your sister sounds delightful - NOT! It almost sounds as though she deliberately baited you, makes me wonder what she hoped to accomplish. We can only hope the karma bus finds her, after it finishes with your sorry excuse for a husband.

You are in my thoughts, I am sending you strength, peace and healing.


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## alte Dame

I'm so sorry for this update. Your H and sister will have their own reckonings. At the very least they have to live with themselves.

And for you, Miss M, I send some restorative vibes across the oceans.

Stay off the sauce. I, too, have learned that it makes things far worse. We are not too old, you and I, to think that there is some life ahead of us worth living. I hope you start to heal and can see that again.


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## missmolly

Hello everyone. I dropped off the world for a while.

Your messages were a comfort to read and they break into a long silent existence. 

I spent a month in the clinic, a place I have mixed feelings about. The ‘classes’ I was supposed to attend were taken by a young Viet woman and I really freaked out. My Dr told me not to attend them , so I had a lot of spare time on my hands. I had periods where I felt ok but am not sure that the medication does much. The best thing I was given gave me the first decent sleep since last November and my Dr assured me that they are not addictive.

After returning home the mouth problem deteriorated again and I have been fortunate to finally find a GP who is kind and understanding. She also said that she had no knowledge of the medications I was taking (apparently they are new and not widely used yet), so she referred me to a Psych Dr about an hour away from here. This new Dr was fairly cold and clinical and showed no empathy. 

She ridiculed the medication I was on and has me grading off it. She would not continue the sleeping meds. She wants to replace them all with drugs that I am not prepared to take and I have an appointment with her tomorrow to battle it out.

I have had another visit to my elderly aunt near Sydney, and three days in my old home city – again I found my friends to be great but hated being there. Just too many memories. 

So I am back to being alone here but I must be getting used to it. At first the solitude and loneliness was unbearable, but now I don’t mind so much. I still don’t see or speak to anyone except shop assistants and I prefer to be here than in the town. I find that I have very little to say to people which is interesting as I have always been a bit of a chatterbox in the past, and usually comfortable with most people. My cousin is quite unwell and I see her only briefly and infrequently.

I am finishing some painting and making new curtains but have not faced the boxes in the shed yet. I guessed there to be about 60, but a count recently revealed over 130. I gave up counting then.

I have done nothing about selling the house as it still needs some basic work to be done. Sometimes I think I should buy him out and just stay here. It is also very wet and muddy here at the moment and my little dogs do their best to bring lots into the house.

The main reason that I have not written is because I find thinking of my H too upsetting and I just do my best to keep him out of my mind.

Thank you for not giving up on me. Mzflower, please see PM.

BTW - I now lead an alcohol and nicotine free life.


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## alte Dame

I'm glad to hear that you're out of the hospital and have stopped the drinking and smoking.

You sound solitary, which itself isn't a bad thing - I like my solitude quite a bit - but perhaps you could start a new thread here or just visit this thread to talk to your friends here regularly. You can't imagine how often I think of you and wonder how you are doing.


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## Aunt Ava

I echo Alte Dame's sentiments. Thanks for coming back to update us, please know that you have been in my thoughts often. I am relieved that you are moving forward and no longer self harming with the alcohol and cigarettes. 

Solitude can be a double edged sword, it can be healing but it can also become a prison of your own making. As you continue to heal you will probably return to your former "chatterbox" self---or at least find a balance between the extremes. 

Keeping you in my thoughts, please take care.


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## Mzflower

Thanks you for the up-date. (Ck your pm). And congrats on the alcohol and cigs! Thats a big accomplishment and you should be proud. 

Selling and relocating is a task I'm sure you're not quite ready to tackle yet, but I hope you do soon and move closer to family and friends. You deserve to be happy, healthy and enjoying life! You will get there!! Enjoy the day and keeping the fluffy Mz Molly out of the mud  xxo


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## disconnected

I haven't visit your page for a few weeks, and have now just seen your long message/update and the responses from others.

It is so good to hear that you are recovering. Good on you re the cigarettes and alcohol.

I hope you are continuing to make really good progress. 

I have often thought about you and wondered how you were getting along. It is your story that was a turning point for me. (Along with the story of overthemoon88). When I read how your WH was treating you while you were trying to save the marriage, well, at that point I thought I would not go down that track.

It is very difficult finding ourselves 'out' of our marriages, and being plunged into single/solitary lives. 

I hope you are doing really well. It is a plus that you have your dogs. Overthemoon88 also has a little dog ... I think that cats and dogs are great healers. They love us unconditionally.

Please keep well.


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