# Looking for the Cheaters point of view



## tiptoe1969 (Dec 31, 2011)

I see a lot of posts from BS but wanted to get some perspective from the WS. I wanted to understand the feelings and thoughts of WS. Does the guilt become so overwelming that you felt like giving up? Why do some cheaters just sit on the fence? You no longer live in the comforts of home, security of family life and life is a mess but still can't decide. You tell the BS that you still love them but you are confused and lost. Why can't a decision be made? Do they want to leave it to the BS to make the decision so that it is now BS to blame if BS decides to end the marriage?

When you are with OW you want your family and life. When you are with wife and kids you want OW.

Why are the BS so afraid to make a decision? Guilt, regret, or fear.


----------



## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

Speaking for myself - and I was able to make a decision but it's still damned painful - it's not fear to make a decision it's paralysis. Assuming an emotional bond with the OW/OM exist - it's hard to break - no different than an emotional bond you might have with anyone else is. The fact that the relationship is illicit doesn't make the bond any easier to break. On top of having to cut off a very intense emotional bond you have the added difficulty of cutting off someone who was very intensely meeting some need that made you willing to commit adultery - this is the "fog." It is literally like a drug addiction, you will do anything to get that fix, consequences be damned. This is why you see so many cheaters do such stupid things. Things they will admit are stupid and self destructive, but they do them anyway because they have to get that fix their affair partner gives them. 

It's an incredibly confusing place to be. To have a spouse and family who you care about (presumably love) on one hand and your affair partner who you may or may not actually love but you sure think you do on the other is incredibly emotionally draining. The only way it can be managed is to compartmentalize it, you put your spouse and family in one pocket and your affair in the other and pray that they never meet. When they inevitably do and you can't maintain the two worlds neatly in their respective compartments any more reality comes crashing down. While reality is crashing down your spouse is in pieces in front of you, your affair partner is likely also in pieces for the very same reason and the cheater is bouncing between the two trying to just put the pieces back together and get the two worlds back into their compartments so he can try to make it all better. Unfortunately the worlds won't go back and as fast as you pick up pieces more fall off. So the cheater ends up stuck trying to keep both worlds from falling apart but it can't be done. They try to put the pieces back on but more fall off than the cheater can keep up with and slowly both worlds crumble. Rather than pick one of the two worlds and focus on it and consign the other to destruction the cheater will keep trying to save both until they are left with either both worlds totally destroyed or the one person who does actually love them and is willing to try to rebuild with them once they hit bottom. If they would only choose one world, commit to it and focus on it that world could likely be salvaged. But, in trying to save both at the same time often both are lost. The cheater just can't sacrifice one to save the other. 

It ultimately comes down to all cheaters are cake eaters. We all want to have our cake and eat it to. We all, at least for some period, want our spouse and family; but we want our affair to. When forced to pick between the two many people can't. 

You'll have a hard time making logical sense of a cheaters behavior because it is totally selfish and self centered, and it's influenced by addiction. It's really just irrational behavior and can't be logically explained very well.


----------



## tiptoe1969 (Dec 31, 2011)

That was very enlightening coming from a cheater. Thanks Sigma. What made you finally decide? Did you hit rock bottom? The analogy of addiction is so true. Some addicts( i.e. drug addicts) hit rock bottom and still don't come out of it and eventually lead to their demise.


----------



## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

Well I've certainly had my struggles but my affair was somewhat unique. I was happily married when mine started and through the whole thing. I always love(d) my wife and never ever intended to leave her. When mine came crashing down I never for a second contemplated leaving my wife for my AP, which despite the fact that I had always been very upfront about this with my AP, really pissed my AP off. When my affair came to the surface I immediately told my wife everything and consigned my affair world to death. That doesn't mean that I didn't struggle - mightily - with killing it. I did. It hurt so badly at times that it literally hurt physically and it took over a year to finally bury it. 

Just so you know. When my affair started I had been with my wife 20 years and married 12. My AP was a high school GF I met on vacation and saw about three times after that. She sent me a friend request on facebook in 2010 - I hadn't thought of her in at least 18 years. 10 days later we were saying I love you and had a full on virtual affair. I never did lay eyes on her in person due to distance, but other than that we were all the way in. Technically since we were never in contact my affair was an emotional one but that doesn't convey the nature of it. I refer to it as a EA/VPA - Emotional Affair/Virtual Physical Affair. It lasted 8 weeks until I let myself get caught. I wanted out but wasn't strong enough to break off the affair on my own - the addiction was too strong.


----------



## tiptoe1969 (Dec 31, 2011)

Sigma, did you relapse at all through the breakup with your AP. I feel he keeps relapsing cuz he is so weak and is not strong enough to overcome the addiction. It's like many times he has tried to quit smoking even took Chantix and still went back and still continues. He actually blamed the affair on depression caused by Chantix. Do I just excuse the relapse and overlook it?

My husband told me the same thing that he was happy in the marriage and that it just happened through the bond they were creating as friends. He was always the family man, homebody and actually said to me I was the full package and loved me very much. I don't think he intended to leave me either. I just keep kicking him out.

When I disapproved of his EA and kicked him out it suddenly became a PA. I feel that he then felt entitled to just make it a full blown affair (kinda narcissistic). Sometimes I look at my actions regarding the affair and maybe I am just too impatient to let things happen and then do things (i.e. kick him out, tell OW husband, give him divorce papers) that I regret.


----------



## transformedxian (Dec 31, 2011)

I was once a WS. I'm not proud of it, I wouldn't do it again, but I can't say I regret it, simply because it made my marriage stronger and I learned much about myself. I wrote an article about it that I posted here. (The links within the article are now broken.) Hopefully this will give you some much-desired insights into the mind of a WS.

I wrote this when I spied an online romance developing between two people on Twitter. The male half and I were later talking, and he said he saw the error of his ways, broke things off with the other woman and decided that he only wanted to be with his wife. Oh, and by the way, would I consider being with him as an "additional"?  He no longer wanted to replace his wife, but he was OK with having a piece on the side. :scratchhead:

The gentleman and I have spoken a few times since, IM or email, but it was mostly to tie up loose ends and to agree that starting over isn't an option. Shoot! My life's so full now, I wouldn't have the time to devote to something like that again.


----------



## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

Oh boy did I relapse. D Day was 8/18/2010 - my last contact with OW was mid March 2011. Here's a quick version - if you want a more detailed account you can find my first thread here http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping...a-committed-wife-cant-get-ow-out-my-mind.html On the night of D Day I told my wife I had to call my AP and tell her it was over and she would not be hearing from me again, I invited her to listen but I did not ask her permission. I called my AP and told her I had been caught and that it was over - she called me everything you can imagine. Of course I got all kinds of emails that night continuing to call me all kinds of bad things. A couple of days later the emails changed to are you ok? I miss you - that kind of thing. I responded to one or two saying yes I was ok and I'm sorry you're hurt but this is how it must be. I always told my wife about these. They kept on for a while but I would not respond. My wife continued to get more and more frustrated and I was really hurting. Of course I hated what I had done to my wife, but it was really killing me knowing and hearing that my AP was really hurting to. I convinced my wife to let me reestablish contact in an effort to get closure and a "good" goodbye - hopefully to get my AP to go away. It didn't work and ended in another blow up. Fast forward about 4 months - she's still been sporadically sending me messages and suddenly I get a friend request from someone I don't know but suspect is her - like an idiot I accept. She ask me why and my answer is that I don't mind her having a window into my world, she just can't participate. Well you know where this is headed, we end up chatting online one day - mostly platonic - but chatting none the less. Ironically, that night my wife looks me in the eye and ask, "Have you heard anything from her?" My wife caught me so off guard I lied to her face and said no - that was the first and last time I lied to her about anything. I knew I was at a precipice. If I went to work the next day with that lie in place I would chat with my AP again and that would be the official resumption of the affair. So, I woke my wife up at 2:00am and told her about the friend request and contact. She was pissed. However, that was the end of my attachment to the affair. That was the moment when I picked my wife over my AP. The next day I messaged my AP that I had confessed to my wife and this was goodbye - that's the last words she has received from me. That was March 2011, my AP continued to send me the random message until August 2011. I have received nothing from her since then. Sorry that's so long - can you believe that's a short version???

I read your other thread - sorry for what you're going through. I'll tell you this. I could never have broken the addiction to my affair without my wife holding me accountable - never. Unfortunately your H has his head very far up his ass as you no doubt know. You may have to start down the road of divorce and actually be committed to it - hoping that he'll come around before you get to the end of that road. He may - he may not - but either way it's likely the only way to get him to kill the affair.


----------



## FourtyPlus (Dec 18, 2011)

My A was a EA and virtual like sigma's. I never met the OM. I didn't love him either and I've come to realize that I probably did want to get caught either. The night before Dday, my husband came and took my laptop. I knew deep down what he was looking for and I didn't do anything to prevent it. I also didn't do anything to tell him beforehand what he would find.
When he found out, I felt relieved. I didn't have to hide anymore, I didn't have to sneak off to go online. I felt like a huge burden was lifted off my chest.
I was in no way prepared for the emotional roller coaster that followed. 
I have always loved my husband but I will say that I was not in love with him as much anymore when the A started. We had drifted apart and the A of course, contributed to more drifting.
When it was all over and we decided to work it out and R, he said he felt like I would have to fall in love with him allover again and I did. Took time but dang, my husband is the best thing that could have ever happened to me and there are butterflies in my stomach when he looks at me.
His triggers are still there and I'm just learning now how to deal with them. I'm hopeful that we'll make it. Most days are pretty good, some are very bad and it takes a lot for me to not throw in the towel because I feel he'd be so much better off without me. The good days outweight the bad ones most of the time though and I just can't give up!


----------



## tiptoe1969 (Dec 31, 2011)

I wish my husband would see the light. When my husband was home I had a pretty good net on him. Access to all accounts, GPS tracking system, cell phone bill etc. but he was stiil able to find the hole. I finally decided and told him to go to her. I wanted him to be with her so that he would truly see the reality instead of the fantasy. They would be free to do anything they wanted with no secrets or boundaries. They are both broke my husband just filed for bankruptcy and she already has a bankruptcy. Husband quit job, lives with sister and she lives with her mother after husband kicked her out. They will soon see reality. I guess i just need to sit back and see their fantasy world crumble and by that time I will be emotional prepared to decide what I want now.


----------



## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Well, I'll throw out some other input. Mine were exit affairs (there were two partners). One was shortly before I told my wife I wanted to split up, the other was after. My wife never found out about either, although in hindsight I suspect she was just in denial. At the time I told her I wanted out, I wasn't in an affair.

She could have caught me and done whatever she liked, but the result would have been the same. I would have left under a slightly more compressed time frame, but I still would have left. My STBXW has been doing a pseudo-180 on me since I moved out, and to be perfectly honest with me, that's just fine. We're still amicable, but haven't phoned each other since I moved out. I communicate via text or email with her, but we can still joke around, and spending time together for things like birthday parties isn't uncomfortable.

Anyway, feel free to ask any questions, and I'll answer honestly. I feel bad for what I've done, but mostly for the label I now have for future relationships. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## ing (Mar 26, 2011)

Thanks Sigma. This goes a long way to being able to understand the way it works.


----------



## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

ing said:


> Thanks Sigma. This goes a long way to being able to understand the way it works.


Glad something useful can come from my stupidity. Of course that's only me, my experience and my understandings from being on here. There are all kinds of people, all kinds of affairs, and all kinds of reasons those people have them. 

The thing I have come to hate the most in my time here is cheaters dragging their loyal spouses through this kind of B.S. The lack of decision and commitment, the trickle truth, the waffling. It's just so unfair to totally crush your unsuspecting spouse with the revelation that you've cheated and then continue to twist the knife while you try to extract your head from your butt.


----------



## HerToo (Oct 3, 2011)

I'm pretty much where your husband is with the exception that mine affair was an EA. It was passionate, and I had intentions of ending my marriage just for the reason to go to the OW. Not a good reason at all. Mine ended when I got caught via cell phone evidence. D-Day was several months ago, still fresh.

I'm stuck on the fence even though my wife has forgiven me. She is not holding me accountable. I am doing it all. I have mental relapses almost daily. I continue to drag my wife through this crap (like Sigma says) and cause her and myself recurring pain as a result. I am so confused despite that I'm going to IC, and starting MC real soon. 

Hopefully your husband pulls his head out soon. I need the jaws of life to extract mine. When it does come out for me, it could be too late.


----------



## tiptoe1969 (Dec 31, 2011)

HerToo, are you still contacting the OW? Why are you staying and enduring the pain for both your wife and yourself? Since your wife is not making you accountable you probably feel like you don't have to do anything. Pretty soon it is going to blow up because your wife will start to feel like there is no change (thats how I felt). Don't put your wife through all the pain and heartache because after repeated offenses it may become irrepairable. I am at that point now. I love my husband but I know love will fade and my emotions for him get weaker as each day goes by. As I get stronger my desire to reconcile becomes less and less. If you love your wife and kids, stop now before its too late.


----------



## Catrina (Dec 27, 2011)

6 times i took my partner back and 6 times he left me to go back to his AP, i got worse emotinally, mentally and physicaly each time he left and am worse now than when i found out in sept, when he was back home he was resentful unemotional and unresponsive to anything i did or tried to do, told him yest that it was over with me and go on to her that id had enough pain, before he left i asked him did he love her and also asked him did he love me he said he loves nobody, he came over today for some of his stuff and i can honestly say it was the first day i didnt see any resentment toward me...... why the resentment toward me???????????????? anyway i said the same to him and he said he was resentful toward me when i took him back and 5 out the 6 times it was him who asked


----------



## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

HerToo - have you considered the possibility that what you REALLY want is your AP but you just won't let yourself admit it??


----------



## HerToo (Oct 3, 2011)

I keep NC. The EA is long over. Until I can figure things out, I'm stuck. I do everything such as complete transparency.

@sigma: I think about that as well. But I'm not suppose to think that way.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

Time for complete honesty, that includes with yourself.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## HerToo (Oct 3, 2011)

I agree 100%. I want to say it all in MC, because my W doesn't want to hear any of it. I already say it in IC. But that does nothing for me.


----------

