# At a loss, need to vent....



## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

notmyrealname4 said:


> Sexual abuse? Does your husband know all about this?


Yes. I told him while we were still just dating, when I was 18. Our experiences are very different. My situation happened one time, I told both of my parents right after, who were immensely protective and supportive, who involved police and authorities immediately (though my dad would have preferred to just take him to the woods with a gun and a shovel). My cousin was charged, I attended therapy and counselling immediately afterwards, including sessions with AND without my parents. I was 13. My cousin was 18. He forced me to perform oral sex on him, while my other cousin (15) held me down/watched. 

Traumatizing. Impacted me in a lot of ways. But so thankful for my parents and their unwavering support. I've wondered, since I found out about H's experience, if he thought I'd be damaged like him, so we'd be a good pair. Maybe that's reaching. 

Regardless, I've always been open about it.


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## IamSomebody (Nov 21, 2014)

pygmalioneffect said:


> Thanks so much for your perspective. It helps. Though, I'll admit this makes me quite sad. To know there's just really nothing we can do, that our personalities are just un-changeable and un-matchable. I've considered separation many, many times - I just made up a fresh job resume this morning. I hate the thought of it. Mostly, of course, for its impact on my kids. They will be heart broken. I would love for them to have a happy family unit that was nurturing and whole. I hate that they won't get that. I also hate that H will make it my fault. They will blame me, think I did this to us alone. But is that worse than them thinking this is how relationships are supposed to be? I want to give my kids everything I can - this feels like taking things away.


Do your friends and (both) families know what he is like, what he is doing, what he says? Do they know he is refusing sex with you, that he stays up all night playing video games then sleeps through while you get the kids up and out to school? Do they know he says he is going to make you so miserable that you leave so he doesn't look like the bad guy? You need to let* EVERYONE* know so you can't be blamed for ending the marriage. People need to know what a miserable failure as a husband he is so you don't get blamed for "blindsiding" him and maybe even accused of having an affair. Let them know you have gone to counseling to try and make things better but your husband steadfastly refuses.

You want the most shark-like attorney you can find. Speak to the clerks in the family law court as well as the people who work in domestic violence shelters to get the names of some really good, shark-like attorneys. Then, go speak with each and every one of them - initial consultation is usually free -mentioning something specific about your marriage. This will prevent them from representing your husband.

Get all your important documents - your and your kids' birth certificates and social security cards, your marriage license- and store them in a place where your husband can't get them. Make copies of previous tax returns in case your H tries to claim poor. Copy his birth certificate and social security card but leave the originals for him.

Get your ducks in a row so when you speak with the attorney, you don't waste his/her, or your, time. Find out your rights and responsibilities. While the business you and H operate came to him via an inheritance, he co-mingled those funds with marital funds now making it available to marital division.

IamSomebody


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

IamSomebody said:


> Do your friends and (both) families know what he is like, what he is doing, what he says? Do they know he is refusing sex with you, that he stays up all night playing video games then sleeps through while you get the kids up and out to school? Do they know he says he is going to make you so miserable that you leave so he doesn't look like the bad guy? You need to let* EVERYONE* know so you can't be blamed for ending the marriage. People need to know what a miserable failure as a husband he is so you don't get blamed for "blindsiding" him and maybe even accused of having an affair. Let them know you have gone to counseling to try and make things better but your husband steadfastly refuses.
> 
> You want the most shark-like attorney you can find. Speak to the clerks in the family law court as well as the people who work in domestic violence shelters to get the names of some really good, shark-like attorneys. Then, go speak with each and every one of them - initial consultation is usually free -mentioning something specific about your marriage. This will prevent them from representing your husband.
> 
> ...


Tons of great info here - thank you. 

NO - others do NOT know about his opinions, the things he says, that we are struggling. He talks to no one, and I really have always hated the thought of running him down to my family and close friends. I don't know if that's protecting him or what, but I haven't said anything to anyone. I don't even know how I would start talking about these things....

I will get all the documentation in order this week.

The business was left to both of us - his grandfather split the shares evenly between us. So, he can buy me out of my shares, so he retains his business. Plus we own a couple of rental properties, as well as a vacation home. I'd like to just sell everything and split it. But we will see. None of this can happen unless I line up a job and a place to live (our home is on the business property - I really don't want to stay here). I will begin the attorney search...


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

notmyrealname4 said:


> Again, NOT normal. This isn't forgetting where your hairbrush is, or occasionally neglecting something on the stovetop and having it boil over; any well-adjusted adult would take precautions to prevent losing such important and costly items.
> 
> It's only explainable if he has some type of organic brain disease or injury. Is there a history of early onset dementia in his family? Has he ever had a head injury; recently, or in the past?
> 
> ...


No brain injuries or history of disease in his family that I'm aware of. And this is not new behavior - he has always been this way. 

Threatening divorce on someone that seems so broken feels so terrible. Like I'm abandoning him too.

I have told him I think he is in denial about the abuse - he gets mad and tells me to stop talking about it - he's put it in the past, why can't I?

I desperately love him. But this is tearing me apart too.


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## Hopeful Cynic (Apr 27, 2014)

pygmalioneffect said:


> The molestation is obviously a major issue - he had no adults to advocate for him. His mom and sister had been long gone at that point, and his Dad was blinded by his new wife. When my H finally outright accused his step brother she flipped and claimed H was lying and a sensationalist. The abuse continued for a few more YEARS afterwards. His dad is also so incredibly bizarre. I can't BELIEVE he never stood up once and protected his own son from that crazy abusive woman and her kid. I feel immense pain for him in this area. He brushes it off - it's fine, it's in the past, it's over, I don't hold grudges, etc. etc. I can't relate at all. I'd give ANYTHING for him to get to a therapist. I've begged, pleaded, demanded. And here we are. The only thing I HAVEN'T done is threaten divorce if he doesn't go, and as you can tell, that's next for me. I don't know what else to try.


I think there's a big truth in here. He has learned an ingrained habit to let nothing, and I mean NOTHING, bother him. He avoids, he lies, he distracts, he blameshifts, anything but face things that bother him. So yes, losing all his stuff on a regular basis doesn't bother him. Your pain doesn't bother him. You and your children waking down the side of the highway in the cold doesn't bother him. If he denies his true feelings, he doesn't have to deal with them. Escaping into video games and throwing himself into work helps the avoidance. Talking to you does not. Admitting he was wrong about something would bother him, so he doesn't do it.

The only way things will change is if HE wants them to, and it's going to take mighty hard work on his part. Personality is fairly immutable once in adulthood.

I recommend separation and divorce. You just don't want your children to grow up thinking this is a good way to live their lives. He may start out wanting 50-50, and maybe that's what he needs as incentive to change. More likely, he'll let you take them more and more and more, OR he'll find them a step-mom to take over the parenting.

This stuff about making YOU be the bad guy by initiating divorce, by insisting he'd take the kids as much as he can, that is very likely just manipulation to prevent you from leaving him. Even if it's not a bluff, it sounds like you don't really care what his family thinks, and yours will believe the truth from you.

I get the sense that you love the potential you once saw in the man, not really the man himself. You've nurtured that potential for a decade now and it hasn't come to fruition. Time to admit defeat, because he never will.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

I've been crying all day today. 

The worst part is what set me off. I was looking for places to live. Then I went to tidy the kids' rooms, make beds, just daily stuff. Went into DD's room (which I just re-decorated with her, she LOVES it - I'm an interior designer and don't get to use my skills much since we inherited the family business, so I really like working on my own spaces), and it hit me that this wouldn't be her room for ME anymore. This big, cozy, perfect room that she and I carefully designed and made together to be her sanctuary would stay here. Her sanctuary that she adores, that she spends time in and cherishes would be at HIS house. And I'd be in a rental house with these tiny little bedrooms that I can't truly make ours. And I just collapsed from sadness. 

How pathetic? That my marriage could be ending and I'm desperately sad over losing my house. A material thing that really shouldn't even matter. 

Then I couldn't stop thinking of all these things - that my master bedroom suite that is MY sanctuary in this crazy house, that I love to read in, practice yoga, meditate, just sit on the balcony and watch the scenery outside with my coffee....would likely become some other woman's master bedroom suite. She'd be sleeping in the bed I so carefully bought and sitting in my cozy armchair reading. I wanted to throw up. My kitchen that I designed from scratch would become hers. 

And this is all so gross to me. Why am I like this? It's a house. There will be other houses, other bedrooms. But - there wasn't going to be. THIS was supposed to be my forever house. I cherish and adore this house. My kids LOVE it here. And I'm going to make them split their time between here and some tiny little rental in the city. All these things are so hard. 

I'm still receiving the silent treatment over the second phone cord issue. It's been 4 days. So, judging by his usual pattern, I've got a few more days of this. But this morning I said "I think we should sit down tonight and talk, once the kids are in bed." He said "I can't tonight - busy". "Well another night then. Wednesday, Thursday, Friday. Any night". "Yeah, ok", he said, as he walked out the door. 

I'm trying to form in my mind what I will say. But I'm such an emotional stupid wreck today I can't even think straight. I just keep crying.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

I've posted here a couple of times today and I'm not sure why but my posts aren't showing up? This one's a test.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

pygmalioneffect said:


> I've posted here a couple of times today and I'm not sure why but my posts aren't showing up? This one's a test.


Haha, and suddenly there they are.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

pygmalioneffect said:


> I've posted here a couple of times today and I'm not sure why but my posts aren't showing up? This one's a test.


I see them now. I had an email notice earlier that you had posted and it wasn't showing up. 

Don't feel bad about grieving for your house! Its something that you love and that you put time, effort, money, and all your hopes into. I went through that when I separated from my first husband, I grieved the loss of the house way more than my marriage!


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

Tell your hb that you will talk about it now, and you will see a MC now or your next stop is a lawyer's office.

Your problem is that you married a 5 year old who throws tantrums over respect but doesn't behave in a manner that earns it. He's a spoiled bratty bully.

And you've gotten him used to controlling everything by acting like a nasty baby while you kiss his arse, desperate to hold onto him. 

You are an enabler. Why you'd even want sex with a spoiled 5 year old is beyond me, but if you want a chance to save things take a hard line now.

I doubt it will work but it's possible that seeing you walk might motivate him. 

If it doesn't nothing will.

Be prepared for him to claim to be blindsided.....that's your fault for allowing him to treat you like a doormat for so many years.

My ex actually did a lot of the same things you describe. When I told him I wanted a divorce he begged for counseling, but I was done. If you take a hard line while you're still invested emotionally then you have a chance if he comes around.

Eventually you'll be done and nothing he does will matter.

Stop enabling and making excuses like his mother.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

lifeistooshort said:


> Tell your hb that you will talk about it now, and you will see a MC now or your next stop is a lawyer's office.
> 
> Your problem is that you married a 5 year old who throws tantrums over respect but doesn't behave in a manner that earns it. He's a spoiled bratty bully.
> 
> ...


I'll be honest - this was just the hard line I needed today. 

Feel like a wimpy little whiner after crying all day. Once I put the kids to bed I'll be bringing this up to get things sorted out. I need a discussion now so we can move forward ASAP. I can't focus on work or anything else, I'm just distracted with this. 

An enabler - yes, I can identify with that.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

We just talked. Well. No. I just talked. He said nothing. 

I said he goes to counselling or I leave. By June if he hasn't changed this and been to therapy, AND separate marriage counselling with me, then I'm leaving. And not just go to appease me. I mean do the real actual work involved in getting help. No questions. No conditions. I said "make this effort for me. Or I'm gone. I don't care if you somehow become the most amazing husband on this planet by then, if you haven't been to therapy I'm out". 

Now we will see if he books the appointment and goes. In the past I made the mistake of booking it for him. Then he doesn't show, and claims he forgot since he didn't book it (despite my million reminders). I will book the MC. The first time he doesn't come to that I'm done. But I won't mother him anymore. Book your own appointments and to them like an adult. 

I feel strangely free already. Like my feelings aren't ALL bottled up inside about to blow. 

But - he literally said zero words while I said this all to him. When I asked if he had anything to say he said no. I said "so do you understand what I'm saying to you?". He simply said "yes". And then turned on the tv to start his video game, while I headed to bed alone again. 

Hopeless


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

pygmalioneffect said:


> I said he goes to counselling or I leave. By June if he hasn't changed this and been to therapy, AND separate marriage counselling with me, then I'm leaving. And not just go to appease me. I mean do the real actual work involved in getting help. No questions. No conditions. I said "make this effort for me. Or I'm gone. I don't care if you somehow become the most amazing husband on this planet by then, if you haven't been to therapy I'm out".


*Then stand behind your words.
*
Don't make ultimatums unless you intend to STAND by them. If he doesn't fulfill your requests, then LEAVE. Stop making excuses for him 'because of his childhood.' That's gotten real damned old and the time comes when a GROWNUP needs to own - and *fix* - their own sh*t instead of just sailing through life being an a*sshole and expecting everyone _else_ to accept it "because he was abused." 

Quite honestly, it sounds as though it's just been years of YOU busting your ass every single day trying to make this marriage work and knocking yourself out doing EVERYTHING but chewing his damned food for him while he's been a lazy, self-indulgent, selfish, self-entitled jerk who had no problem LETTING you knock yourself out doing it all. That alone should have gotten his ass kicked out years ago.

You have the patience of a saint. Good luck to you.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

It won't be easy for him.....he's had a long time of behaving like this.

It's possible he needs time to process it, give that to him. 

But absolutely follow through, or your life won't be worth anything with him. 

And you know what? You might have to face the possibility that he doesn't care enough about you or the marriage to get any kind of help. If so you're much better off without him. 

I suspect he thinks you're bluffing.


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## tropicalbeachiwish (Jun 1, 2016)

I'm so sorry that you're dealing with this. Some of things that you described are the things a passive aggressive person would do (the silent treatment & saying that they're going to return something but never do). A passive aggressive person is extremely difficult to deal with. And him constantly threatening divorce whenever you have a conflict is abusive. 

It's so hard to imagine him running a successful business with all of the forgetting that he does. He comes across as an airhead. 

You say that you love him, but love isn't enough to sustain a healthy marriage. You are carrying the household responsibilities. He knows that you're going to do it, so why would he bother putting forth the effort? He doesn't care and is lazy. Maybe that's why he says that he's "laid back". Not caring & being lazy isn't being "laid back". 

You guys are not a match. Keep posting because it'll get worse before it gets better. There are people on this forum that can help you deal with some of the things that he's likely to pull.


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## GuyInColorado (Dec 26, 2015)

Start working on yourself immediately. Work out, eat and drink healthy, get a new haircut/color, new clothes, and start hanging out with friends outside the home when possible. Time to start a new life and prepare to be single. 

I'm surprised you gave him 6 months. I have a feeling you'll be filing for D within a month as he just plays his video game and ignores you.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

GuyInColorado said:


> Start working on yourself immediately. Work out, eat and drink healthy, get a new haircut/color, new clothes, and start hanging out with friends outside the home when possible. Time to start a new life and prepare to be single.
> 
> I'm surprised you gave him 6 months. I have a feeling you'll be filing for D within a month as he just plays his video game and ignores you.


I began working on myself 18 months ago when I first started IC, thoush I originally started getting healthier in 2012, after some health issues. Through healthy diet and exercise I lost the last 20 lbs I had needed to get off, changed my hair, started getting my nails done and going for massage, really just started to focus on myself a lot more. Got a cleaning lady to come twice a month to free me up a little. He didn't really like it, in fact often says He thinks I'm trying to "get hot" so I can find someone better. Serious self esteem issues. But he doesn't seem to care enough to put up a fight over any of it. He is physically active, lean and fit. Our business keeps him physically taxed all day. Besides the regular beer drinking he eats well. In terms of basic physical traits he is very attractive to me. 

Friends - we really just have mutual, married friends. I don't have girlfriends that are just mine, separate from him. I need to find some of these. 

To be honest the six months was mostly for me. I need some time to meet with an attorney, figure out what's going to happen with the business, find a home and furnish it, apply for and get a job. Plus it's nearing Christmas and I need to give my kids one last happy, family one of those. Plus, I think MC needs some time - a couple of sessions likely won't cut it. We have been co-habiting like room mates for years now....6 months seems awfully short to me. Add to that a really poor real estate market that may make it tough to sell our property quickly. 

Today my to do list includes getting MC contacts from my therapists office, booking that initial appointment, and booking an appointment with a lawyer.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

tropicalbeachiwish said:


> I'm so sorry that you're dealing with this. Some of things that you described are the things a passive aggressive person would do (the silent treatment & saying that they're going to return something but never do). A passive aggressive person is extremely difficult to deal with. And him constantly threatening divorce whenever you have a conflict is abusive.
> 
> It's so hard to imagine him running a successful business with all of the forgetting that he does. He comes across as an airhead.
> 
> ...


Passive aggressive is certainly how I'd describe him. 

Our business does well. His family worked hard to establish it and I think that helps. It's also worth noting his grandfather insisted on giving me the same amount of shares as H, and clearly stated he wanted that to happen because H didn't have the same experience, education, and background in business and office management that I do. His grandfather required that we were a package deal when we inherited, and H completely ageeed. I do all the office work, scheduling, handle finances, staffing, etc. He does all the manual work, equipment operations, etc. Which is definitely his strong-suit. I would say we are actually well suited in this way, as we are both able to utilize our strengths to make this work well. 

We both earn our own salary - and they are completely equal. We have a joint bank account for all of the family/kid expenses and savings which we split right down the middle, and the rest of our income we keep to ourselves. He has been on board for all of this, so he's not unreasonable in some ways. He does work hard to cultivate an image that he's a very hard-working family man (I suppose he is?), with a happy marriage and a perfect life, so people tend to think we are just this happy, idyllic little family. 

I sometimes resent that we are SO mismatched personality wise because in so many other ways we work well and make sense. We have made good moves purchasing properties, and are fortunate to be financially secure. In terms of the business we are almost always on the same page with both large decisions and small daily ones. If this marriage could work we would likely be very successful financially and career-wise. That likely won't be the case separately - he will have to find someone to run the office end of the business which I think will be difficult for him, and I'll have to head back to my old field, which has potential to easily support me, but likely won't afford the same types of opportunities I'd have if we could stay on the path we planned for. 

Honestly, I think I'm still here because of all that more than any other reason. It's hard to give up the chance at giving our kids a comfortable, secure life. It's hard to imagine going back to a "regular job" after the rewarding feeling of building your own, successful business. It's hard to give up the freedom and flexibility to make your own hours. But something has to give. I deserve the chance to be valued, loved and respected by my partner. So does he. I deserve to have a connection with my husband that's more than just "we own a business, have kids, and live together".


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## Anne EZcouple (Dec 2, 2016)

Dear Pygmalioneffect,


First let me say that I understand your frustration, sadness and anger over the situation.

Until I met Alison Armstrong's work I did not quite understand men. And that is despite the amount of research I have done to conceive EZcouple.com. 

Your schedule seems unduly busy, but if you started to read the Queen's Code which is a novel she wrote I believe your perspective would shift.

Men do not solve their problem the way we women do. Your husband may be aware inside that he has issues but talking about them, especially in front of you, is not an option he will choose if he does not want to despise himself. 

While reading you it seems to me that he is deeply challenged since you have had your children and what it entails. His fear of harming the ones he loves, including you, makes your life difficult to say the least. At this stage, during his video games, it might be the only time when he feels a man because he can be successful then. His feeling of inadequacy and inability to make you happy is killing him from the inside.

You might feel that I ignore your own pain in this. I hope you don't because I just want you to take some emotional distance in order to see the bigger picture. Then you will be in better position to decide for the next step.


Whatever you decide after you read that groundbreaking book, please know that being in a relationship in the long run is not easy. If you succeed to overcome this your couple will be so strong that it will weather anything else.

Here is an amazon link for your easy reference http://amzn.to/2fR3elj

I wish you the best, and please feel free to reach out to me via EZcouple.com, contact us form. I am not sure I can leave my email here and I am the one reading all the emails received.

Warm regards,

Anne


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## Seasong (Mar 1, 2012)

Hi P
Has your husband ever been dx with adhd? The way you describe him losing things all the time is very typical. My husband has it. He loses various things all the time. Nothing like vehicles! Much of the time things are in the house, but still, it can get crazy. 

Main difference is he will admit it, feels embarrassed, and we work as a team to try to prevent it. So if I hand him something that is supposed to go in his wallet I have him take it out, and he puts it in immediately and he doesn't feel threatened by my reminders. I only do that if I don't see him make the move on his own.

He got diagnosed with adhd as an adult but didn't go on medication until about two or three years ago. That has helped with some things.
I learned a lot reading on adult forums and books. He did too. There is way more to the condition than losing things, and not everyone has that issue but many do. To someone without adhd it seems crazy to lose things like wallets, keys, you name it, but learn about it, and you see it differently. My husband has worked hard to break some ingrained bad habits, and learned to find ways to deal with such a devastating issue for an adult to deal with. He's come a longggg way! Maybe get him tested and go from there. He may have taught himself not to care due to feeling deep shame.

I can't help with anything else. Just to offer you some (((hugs))).


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

Seasong said:


> Hi P
> Has your husband ever been dx with adhd? The way you describe him losing things all the time is very typical. My husband has it. He loses various things all the time. Nothing like vehicles! Much of the time things are in the house, but still, it can get crazy.
> 
> Main difference is he will admit it, feels embarrassed, and we work as a team to try to prevent it. So if I hand him something that is supposed to go in his wallet I have him take it out, and he puts it in immediately and he doesn't feel threatened by my reminders. I only do that if I don't see him make the move on his own.
> ...


Hi! 

I've often thought he is ADHD. I've never said it to him though. He is so hyper critical about these things I just know it would end up him seeing me as "psychoanalyzing" him. Even if I say it nicely, respectfully, and let him know I care about him and want this to get better. He simply refuses to say he has any problem at all. This is why I think he also has a personality disorder. 

I would give anything to get to a functional place like you and your husband. I'd have no problem at all helping him remember things. When I do that now he sees it as an attack and resents me for it. So I don't. 

It's other things too. About 6 months ago we had a scary issue here at our home. We have a large second -story deck on one side, and he used to park his truck near the deck because it is close access to the lower entrance to the house. The deck has no access to the ground level, you have to come through the house. Well late at night one night suddenly someone was opening the sliding door from the outside second story deck. This thief had climbed up onto Hs truck, shimmied over the deck railing, and was coming in to presumably rob the place. We had regular arguments about the doors being locked up, but he goes out regularly to smoke, so it wasn't at that time. He, of course, at that time in the night (2 am) was right there in the living room playing video games, so he and this guy got into an altercation and he activated our home alarm system. Cops came, took the guy, he was charged, etc. 

H was very shaken up. He installed extra locks on the sliding door and windows and stopped parking his truck near the deck. Well tonight when I got home I noticed his truck was parked there again. Came into the house, made lunches, bathed kids etc. Went to go to bed and noticed the sliding door was unlocked. I went to lock it and he said (while playing video games) "I'm going out there in a minute". I said "ok can you lock it up when you're done?" "Of course, I always do, why wouldn't i?" I responded "sorry I'm just nervous with the truck parked there". He rolls his eyes dramatically and says "I'll go move it if it's an issue". Yeah. It's a bit of an issue for me. But I just say "ok, as long as things are locked up I'll feel better". And then he was suddenly angrily accusing me of saying he doesn't protect us. I just said "I am surprised we are not on the same page here. I think we can mitigate risks like this by taking steps to prevent bad things happening. That's all. I'm not saying you can't protect us, just lets lock up to reduce the chance something bad will happen". Then he went off "what if the bad guy brings a ladder or his own truck? You know they can just smash the glass right? Bad things happen." 

I just walked away and am now alone, in our bed, flabbergasted that this is my life, while he's out there laughing and chatting with strangers on his head set over some role playing game. Like I'm not even real.

I just am so angry with myself that I've let it get like this. It's a circle of pain and discomfort and sadness and I'm just running it forever, looking for a way out. 

I booked our first mc session. He says he booked an IC session. But is there hope for him? I simply can't imagine a possible scenario where this gets better. 

I went to my own IC session today. It was sad. And hard. I'm so tired.


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

Bring up the ADHD in the MC session where you can be heard. Any decent therapist will at least drill down into the reason you think this might be the case and it will provide a forum for you to open up on these issues and be heard 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

Anne EZcouple said:


> Dear Pygmalioneffect,
> 
> 
> First let me say that I understand your frustration, sadness and anger over the situation.
> ...


Thank you Anne! I do know from my own therapy that I struggle to understand him and his motivations, which makes it hard for me to empathize with his behaviour and choices. 

I will certainly check out the site and the book you mention.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

TheTruthHurts said:


> Bring up the ADHD in the MC session where you can be heard. Any decent therapist will at least drill down into the reason you think this might be the case and it will provide a forum for you to open up on these issues and be heard
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


This is definitely a tactic I will employ. This is the main reason I insist on MC - a different forum than we've ever been in to discuss things. Hopefully one that will allow us to be completely open eventually. 

Thank you


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## notmyrealname4 (Apr 9, 2014)

At the end of the day, [after you've given counseling a decent chance]; you have to feel safe and sane in your home. If there's no improvement; you have to make some difficult choices.

The incident with the truck being parked against the deck? You can't go on forever with someone who is oblivious to your feelings and need to be secure.


No matter what his own private demons are.


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## Seasong (Mar 1, 2012)

Yes, adults with adhd have had to learn ways to cope on their own if never having early intervention so they compensate with some bad habits.

This is a second marriage for both of us. I made it clear that IC and MC would be necessary to me if issues cropped up. He started IC before we got married but she was a dud. The first med didn't agree with him either. So after married we found a better therapist for him. We only had about 6-8 sessions of MC but it helped over all.

My oldest, 25 now, has it as well so I'd been through therapy with him starting young. He got dx at age 7-8 and I learned a lot when he was a teen how not to demean him. They have similarities and differences of course.

My husband says I calm him down. I was born and bred a type A but having my son kind of helped me to reexamine myself. Would my head really explode if the pots and pans weren't aligned in the cabinet? Did a wrinkle in the middle of the made bed matter that much? I wanted him to have self esteem. Not do everything myself or everything over. I'm saying that just in case you see it in your kids.

My doctor told my to throw away my watch when my daughter didn't breast feed according to my plan. Little things, but potentially big things.

If my husband hadn't shown me such a willingness to do therapy ( he was also moving into a house with a tween and a teen, and I'm progressively disabled), and a genuine sense of teamwork, no arrogance, and just a little bit of a need to be right at times, i couldn't have done it.

You said things were good at first. And he does have good qualities. I wonder if any other gamers might be able to help, or former gamers. I'm sure there are some on these boards.
Mine will get hyper focused on tasks, especially fixing computers, but not to where I mind. I really feel for you.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

It's been a tough couple of weeks. I've been to IC each Thursday. Last week we had our first MC session. He sat there. He was silent, apart from basic yes and no answers. I brought up our major communication issues. She asked him what he thought of that. He just looked down at his lap. This is just one example. The whole hour. No words. No contribution. So I talked. He was quiet. Then we went home and he never said anything more about it. 

He speaks to me only out of necessity. Something with the kids, or our extended families, or work. Otherwise, no conversation at all. When he does speak to me it is monotonous and robotic. Completely void of feeling. 

I think he must hate me. He looks at me Like I'm ruining his life. How do I continue like this? He's so checked out. He stays up all night, sleeps until noon, is completely emotionally disconnected from us. Our only shared interaction as a family is during dinner. He's at work from noon till dinner time, comes home, We eat together, he goes back to work, comes home again after kids (and often me) are in bed, games all night, comes to bed an hour or so before I get up at 5:45, sleeps till noon. Why won't he just leave? He obviously can't stand to even be near me. He can't be happy. How do I make this livable? In the old days I'd talk to him, initiate intimacy, find a way for us to connect physically, so we could connect emotionally. But I'm so tired. And I don't want to physically connect with someone who feels how he so clearly does about me.

I've spoken to a lawyer. He's recommended I don't leave - if I do it looks bad on me, like I'm ok with leaving my kids. Obviously I can't just take them. He thinks I should hold out for him to go, which will also apparently bode better for me with the business as well. 

It's torture to live like this.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

I just posted this on another thread, but thought I should put it here also - it very much outlines what I'm feeling now. 

Telling him what I need is a major hurdle because we have a massive fundamental communication barrier. When I say "I need...." or "I feel...." he automatically gets defensive and can't handle any input from me at all. He claims I'm always mad, or some other feeling than I SAY I'm feeling. In every discussion we've had over the past year (I have them all recorded), I tell him how I'm feeling, and he says "no - you're lying. you feel (xyz)" instead. When I say "you think I'm mad, but I do not FEEL mad, why do you think that is? What am I doing that makes you think this?" he says "your body language". I've worked hard to employ communication strategies. Sometimes I'm not 100% efficient at it yet. But his reading my body language is a constant problem. Just yesterday I was standing in our master walk in closet, trying to decide on a plan for organizing something. He was there fixing the light switch. He read me standing there in the closet looking around as me impatiently waiting for him to get out of my way, so he got frustrated with me. I wasn't even thinking anything about him or regarding him at all. What was going through my head had nothing to do with him. I didn't say any words (normal, rational people say "excuse me please" if someone is in their way, right?). I just stood vertically looking around the room, one hand in my pocket and one hand hanging at my side. I've become hyper-sensitive of how my body looks in these scenarios as a way to hopefully dispel any false assumptions by him, so I pay a lot of attention. 

Yesterday he told me he didn't want to live in misery anymore. I said I didn't either. But, I've been in therapy for two years, read dozens of marriage and communication books, employed tons of strategies for making this better - but it isn't working because I'm doing that all alone. It's like I'm playing on this football team but I'm the only one who knows the play or the strategy. You can't win with only one team mate knowing the play. He has shown no interest in trying any of these things, as to him it's simple: I change how I talk, feel, and act. He says I'm the cause of every single issue, since he's so laid back nothing bothers him, so it must be me making all these problems up. It just feels like such a joke. He sincerely believes none of his behavior impacts me or how I feel at all. Last night I told him that in order for me to be willing to continue I need him to STOP telling me my feelings. It's so disrespectful to have your spouse say "no - you don't feel what you say you feel. You're lying. You feel this instead." Like I don't have the mental capacity to know whats happening in my own head. I NEED that to stop. His response? "Sorry, I can't do that until you stop acting the way you act - your body language says you're mad, so whatever you verbally say doesn't count". But his history of reading my body language is regularly inaccurate, so I'm upset that he's willing to base the entire fundamental of all of our marriage issues on an assumption that I feel a certain way when I'm TELLING him that's not what I feel....ugh. It's so tiring to even think about all of this. For so many years he'd say those things to me, I actually started to believe I must be unstable. I've been assessed for bi-polar and personality disorders because he had me questioning my own sanity. There is no other person in my life who reads my body language and gets it so wrong. 

I told him last night. We go to marriage counselling ASAP or after the New Year we need to work up a separation agreement. My initial plan was to give him until June - but it's just enabling him to push the counselling off. I desperately need him to hear me in a neutral zone with an impartial third party present.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

I also need to note here - he stated multiple times last night that he was still so angry over the issue with the phone cord and how I accused him of taking the second one. He is so mad that I would talk to him the way I did and accuse him of taking it. He said "I will NEVER be ok with being treated that way". So he has clearly hung onto this and let it fester. He's also telling me that the reason he is staying up all night and sleeping during the day and gaming and ignoring me is because of the cord issue - that I hurt him so badly with this that he can't bear to look at me or be near me. He said "so you did this all to yourself". I responded by telling him I only wanted to be respected - that meant my belongings too, and that when I discussed the cord with him I was only trying to find out where it was and let him know it meant a lot to me if he could respect my things. In that discussion I was trying to tell him this was important to me, so going forward please show me more respect. But he just can't stay on the communication path. As soon as I said that he said "SHOW ME MORE RESPECT AND I'LL SHOW YOU MORE!". On one hand I wish I had never said a word about the stupid cord. But my therapist is saying all the time that I need to communicate my needs to him, or he'll have no idea what I need from him and I'll never get any of what I need (wow...bad sentence). 

Our discussions are so exhausting because he goes off on these tangents. I'm trying so hard to employ communication techniques to stay on course, but we need help.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

His alleged hangup with the cord is nothing more than classic gaslighting. Maybe you should turn the tables on him and tell him that this is not really how he feels about it!


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## MAJDEATH (Jun 16, 2015)

It is agonizing reading your description of his mental condition. Does your area allow you to non-voluntary commit him to a mental health facility for evaluation/treatment? My W required this at one time due to a misdiagnosis and incorrect medication for a mental health condition. She was much better 3 days later.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

MAJDEATH said:


> It is agonizing reading your description of his mental condition. Does your area allow you to non-voluntary commit him to a mental health facility for evaluation/treatment? My W required this at one time due to a misdiagnosis and incorrect medication for a mental health condition. She was much better 3 days later.


Involuntary commission is not permitted in my area. Honestly, any time I've mentioned anything like this he accuses me of "psyching" him. He believes he is perfectly fine and normal, and it is me who just is such a negative, miserable person. He says that my life is so good, but because of my personality issues I have to FIND negative things to have a problem with, to assuage my negative nature. He believes I'm not happy unless there are problems. To me this whole argument makes me sound so psychotic. Like only someone who is actually insane would feel those things. I've had myself assessed for personality disorders because of these kinds of accusations. Three years of therapy trying to figure out what is happening in my brain. I've been cleared of all. And honestly, I feel happy a lot of the time. I enjoy it, like most sane people. Even as I'm feeling happy he perceives that I'm upset or sad or mad. I don't know how to control his perceptions of me anymore - he always says "change your body language"....but I'm not doing anything in specific, he just decides I'm mad and then I have to try to convince him I'm not. I'm just so tired of having to be guarded all the time.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

We had a MC session the other day and I talked about a lot of these things. Yesterday he made the effort to wake up at 6:30, help get the kids out the door, and then we went off to work. TOGETHER. Afterwards we came home together, and he helped me get the house ready and prep dinner, as his parents were coming. I was in a state of partial shock all the while. After his parents left I told him that it meant so much to me to have him on my team all day - I told him I really appreciated all of his effort and help, and that he made time to be home with us in the evening instead of at work. It made me feel like he cared about me and it mattered to him that I had so much to do. I told him it felt so great to not feel alone. We spent some time talking about us, and he told me that he was going to try harder to save us. He came to bed at 11:30 (about 30 mins after me), and we cuddled. I'm hopeful that this is a sign of willingness to change, but time will tell. I won't hold my breath after only one day. But it felt so very good.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

While its nice that he made the effort, it isn't going to hold up. He will be back to himself before the weekend is up. He has serious issues, on top of his passive aggressive personality. People like this don't change. At least you had a good day.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

@pygmalioneffect

Could you please check your threads and see if the posts that you say are missing are back? 

The admins say that they fixed it. I'm not sure.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

EleGirl said:


> @pygmalioneffect
> 
> Could you please check your threads and see if the posts that you say are missing are back?
> 
> The admins say that they fixed it. I'm not sure.


Hi Elegirl! Nope - this thread was several more pages long than it is now, beginning with my big, long, massive outline of many things occurring in my marriage over many years, as well as mine and my husbands backgrounds and some childhood stuff that I think has impacted us. Not sure where it all went. I'd sure like to be able to see it though, at least as a reference point someday. If nothing else it will probably help me in IC. 

Thanks for your help!!


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

EleGirl said:


> @pygmalioneffect
> 
> Could you please check your threads and see if the posts that you say are missing are back?
> 
> The admins say that they fixed it. I'm not sure.


The thread is back!! Wow. It's actually interesting reading it back now. And sad. 

I'm currently working on my exit plan. Things are taking a while, we have a complex scenario with the business and our properties and things. Plus it's busy season at work, it is tough to fill my position and train someone right now. It may be fall before things are completely hashed out and I can move. 

At this point I have no idea where his head is at. I've struggled for so long with not being valued by him, I've nearly completely stopped communicating with him at all. Every single sentence and word I say is misconstrued and it's so exhausting having to re hash and defend my every word for hours after I say it. So I try to say nothing. 

I have not told H I am leaving for sure. We had that discussion 6 months ago requiring IC and MC. Neither happened. I tried to work through MB with him. I did MB as well as I could alone. He said "if I have to read a bunch of psychology-babble to be with you, then too bad". I guess I'm just not worth it. So. It's June and I called my lawyer. He didn't do what I needed. 

When originally trying MB in march I was asking him what he needs to be happy. He said "I just want to be loved and happy". "Right, but how can I make that happen on my end - what can I do?" "Just stop being so miserable". So I tried to explain I'm feeling negatively because of our relationships "status" and I need that to be addressed in order for my feelings to improve. He says "well I can't be responsible for your happiness". Ok. So I have to be responsible for BOTH of our happiness alone. 

It's just constant talking in circles. Adamant refusal that any thing he has ever done has impacted how we got here. Plain ambivalence when asked to alter certain behaviours that hurt me. Consistent insistence that he's a fabulous husband and I should be happy for what I have. 

the last few times we sat down to try MB work we discussed items at hand and things would come up that I had worked on in IC. If I even mentioned that "in therapy I learned (xyz) about myself" in relation to that thing, he'd lose it. He'd say "I'm so sick of hearing about your "therapy". It's an intentional jab to punish me for not going to IC". No. it was actually me trying to say "this is what I've learned about myself, and I'm giving that info to you too, as my spouse". 

In IC I learned that I really desire to be in a relationship with a partner who needs and wants me. Not someone who just keeps me around for convenience. I desperately loved and needed him. He didn't feel the same way. It felt so unequal and took a toll on my self confidence - my own husband doesn't want or need me. When I say "what are your feelings of we separate?" He says "well our business is down the toilet. And I feel bad for the kids". And for me it's "my heart feels ripped to shreds because I so deeply and fully loved you. I don't know how to BE in the world without you. I don't know who I am without you." I discovered in IC that I loved and needed my husband and he could take or leave me. I Am a convenience for him, I am just there or not there. No feelings. No wanting. No powerful sadness that I'm gone. 

Last night while I was racing around the house getting chores down after I got home from kids activities at 9:30 pm, he said "I'm going for a plate of wings". I said "ok have fun". He goes every week. I always say that. He said "ok well I guess not then". I was confused. "Why?" I said. "Well you're obviously mad about it". "Um, no, I don't care if you go or don't". "Well you're folding the laundry all fast like you're mad"......omg. I said "no. I'm folding the laundry all fast so I can get all my chores done before I get to finally collapse into bed. Has nothing to do with you". So he stormed out. Then, 45 mins later my daughter was out of bed saying she couldn't find her iPod earlier and could I do a find iPhone. So I pulled up my find my iPhone app, and his iTunes account was logged in - he had used my phone a few days earlier to locate his (as usual) lost phone. So when I opened the app it showed him at a house several blocks from ours. Not at his usual pub where he goes for wings. I immediately felt guilty I had unintentionally spied on him. But I couldn't shake feeling so awful. Where was he; what was he up to, etc. I couldn't sleep. He got home at 3 am and I didn't want to say anything and cause a fight. This morning I asked him where he went for wings. He said the pub. so I told him what happened and he flew off the handle that I don't trust him and he was at the pub all night, blah blah blah. I tried to say "if the roles were reversed you wouldn't feel even a twinge of what I'm feeling?" He says "no absolutely not. I'd never spy on you and I trust you." Since then, all day today he's treated me terribly. He called me out in front of a bunch of our staff and shot down a decision I had made last week. He made me look like an idiot. I pulled him aside and told him how he made me feel and he said I'm just fabricating these things to justify my bad behaviour. It's just so dysfunctional. I can't handle it any more. 

I'm trapped in the house till fall for sure. It's torture. And I'm still so sad for my kids. I hope we can be the best possible for them. I doubt my h will be capable of this.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

pygmalioneffect said:


> Last night while I was racing around the house getting chores down after I got home from kids activities at 9:30 pm, he said "I'm going for a plate of wings". I said "ok have fun". He goes every week. I always say that. He said "ok well I guess not then". I was confused. "Why?" I said. "Well you're obviously mad about it". "Um, no, I don't care if you go or don't". "Well you're folding the laundry all fast like you're mad"......omg. I said "no. I'm folding the laundry all fast so I can get all my chores done before I get to finally collapse into bed. Has nothing to do with you". So he stormed out. Then, 45 mins later my daughter was out of bed saying she couldn't find her iPod earlier and could I do a find iPhone. So I pulled up my find my iPhone app, and his iTunes account was logged in - he had used my phone a few days earlier to locate his (as usual) lost phone. So when I opened the app it showed him at a house several blocks from ours. Not at his usual pub where he goes for wings. I immediately felt guilty I had unintentionally spied on him. But I couldn't shake feeling so awful. Where was he; what was he up to, etc. I couldn't sleep. He got home at 3 am and I didn't want to say anything and cause a fight. This morning I asked him where he went for wings. He said the pub. so I told him what happened and he flew off the handle that I don't trust him and he was at the pub all night, blah blah blah. I tried to say "if the roles were reversed you wouldn't feel even a twinge of what I'm feeling?" He says "no absolutely not. I'd never spy on you and I trust you." Since then, all day today he's treated me terribly. He called me out in front of a bunch of our staff and shot down a decision I had made last week. He made me look like an idiot. I pulled him aside and told him how he made me feel and he said I'm just fabricating these things to justify my bad behaviour. It's just so dysfunctional. I can't handle it any more.
> 
> I'm trapped in the house till fall for sure. It's torture. And I'm still so sad for my kids. I hope we can be the best possible for them. I doubt my h will be capable of this.


So did you go check out who's house he was at? Or was it someone you already know? With his rotten behavior, it would not surprise me to find out he is cheating. 

I'm sorry things have gone this way for you. He is making it very clear that you and the marriage are not a priority for him, and thats just so sad. I am like you, as far as needing a partner who needs and wants me, so I completely relate to how you are feeling. I never wanted to have a partner who I just live along side, and sadly I have not found him yet. If I were you, I would just quietly work toward my exit, then let him know once you are close to being out. I wish you the best.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

3Xnocharm
So did you go check out who's house he was at? Or was it someone you already know? With his rotten behavior said:


> Is it sad that I don't really care? Its not a house I know or recognize. He insists he wasn't there, that it must have been off by 35 blocks from where he claims he really was. But I just.....don't care. I don't care who it is. I don't care. The only thing I care about is that he is willing to do that to me. Deal breaker all the way. No other details required.
> 
> I'm 30. I deserve love with someone who actually wants me. I deserve to feel alive and have a partner and live a life that's not just filled with feeling awful about myself and the life I'm leading. I'm actually pretty awesome...outside of this relationship I feel like myself. When we are near each other, if I'm at home, I just feel stifled and chained and imprisoned. Outside of here I am strong and assertive and fun and joyful. I am valuable. I am lovable.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

pygmalioneffect said:


> Is it sad that I don't really care? Its not a house I know or recognize. He insists he wasn't there, that it must have been off by 35 blocks from where he claims he really was. But I just.....don't care. I don't care who it is. I don't care. The only thing I care about is that he is willing to do that to me. Deal breaker all the way. No other details required.
> 
> I'm 30. I deserve love with someone who actually wants me. I deserve to feel alive and have a partner and live a life that's not just filled with feeling awful about myself and the life I'm leading. I'm actually pretty awesome...outside of this relationship I feel like myself. When we are near each other, if I'm at home, I just feel stifled and chained and imprisoned. Outside of here I am strong and assertive and fun and joyful. I am valuable. I am lovable.


I went back through and re-read this thread. I clearly remember when you were posting, and felt the same exhaustion and exasperation reading it again. If it taxes ME mentally to read what you are dealing with, I can only imagine what it must be like in real life. I understand when you say you just dont care where he was. It bothers me that he lies about it, you dont deserve to be lied to. And WOW I didnt realize you were this young! You absolutely need to get out of this and go find your happy.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

3 weeks ago he sold his Xbox and all of his gaming equipment. I was shocked. I thought perhaps we were getting somewhere. 

But nothings really changed. We coexist. He fills all of his time with work now. He has zero interest in spending any time with me outside of basic required time for work and kids. I have a close friend who is an incredible musician. He gave us tickets to one of his shows last week. I insisted we go since our kids were with my parents and we hadn't been anywhere or done anything together in at least a year. We went. Had some dinner. Listened to music. He refused to dance or have any fun with me. And then an hour before the shows end he wanted to get back home since he had more work to do. We came home, I went to bed, he worked. 

My best friend and her husband came over for dinner last night. H is not a big fan of them. They are super social, clearly very much in love, and they are great daters. They go out at least weekly together. They share common interests. They make an effort to spend time together. So they were talking about all of their recent dates - restaurants, wine tastings, rock climbing, golf, etc etc. I said "wow that all sounds nice!". H grasped onto me saying that and then confronted me once they left. He was mad I would say that to them, since it made it sound like I wished I could do those things too. I said "well....I do wish that". He said "well it's not realistic for everyone to just get to have fun all the time". Wow. I responded "they both work full time, they have two kids like we do, house, family, etc. The difference is they MAKE time for that stuff because it's a priority to them. You think THEY are unrealistic, but what ACTUALLY is unrealistic is being obsessed with work and letting it fully consume you. Working 90 hours per week is unrealistic and unnecessary." Well. Wrong thing to say. He decided my saying that meant I wasn't as committed to our business as he thought and maybe he didn't want to run a business with someone who thinks that way. I said "so don't then, my shares are for sale. Give me fair value for them, and fill your boots working all you want". 

I don't want to live this life where we miss everything. We never do anything as a full family. We may as well be separated already. Except I have to live with the torture of sleeping next to him every night. 

This morning he posted some crap on Facebook about "enjoying life and the little things and taking time to enjoy your kids while you can" etc. All his friends are commenting "you're so right", etc and I just want to vomit. It's such a carefully cultivated crock of ****. It's all about image and I'm so resentful that everyone thinks he's this committed, doting husband and father. 

I need to 180. I need to organize and attend social events and do my own things. I need to make myself a 40 hour/week work schedule and stick to it exactly. And fill the remaining time with friends and my kids and some life. I'm suffocating here. I'm isolated and angry.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Your husband has ZERO interest in you. I agree you need to 180. Then I think you need to get out of this marriage.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

Living here is killing me. Being ignored, like I'm invisible. Just all the awkwardness. Day in and day out. I can't stand it here.


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## pygmalioneffect (Nov 28, 2016)

a few months since my last post. Bringing exit plan to fruition is proving difficult. I let H know of my intentions to leave, and that I required my half of our assets. We met jointly with our attorney's. Unfortunately, he apparently has no liquid cash and cannot pay me a dime. He does not want to sell assets, so things were awkward for a while, as I was pushing to force the sale of the houses. 

In terms of the business, I was left with two choices, I could walk, and keep my shareholder status. I'd receive dividends and be able to vote on any pertinent decisions. I was advised this was pretty risky - if I leave he could basically do anything with the business, including rack up debt, that I could be liable for as a primary share holder. This would also mean I'd walk with pretty much zero cash, besides my half of the 25K or so we have in savings until forced sales on our properties go through. Not much, considering I need a house, car, furnishings, and everything else. Also depending on him, he could potentially intentionally sabotage the business to hurt me (which I doubt, but nothing surprises me anymore). OR. I could try to force a sale of the business, which I hoped to avoid because it's his families multi-generational legacy, and I just don't have the heart for that.

I spent several weeks searching for rentals and trying to find a car that suits my needs in my price range. It was proving difficult. I was planning to leave and just cross my fingers for the remaining money.

So. I was in a tough spot. Until the last week in September when H came to me and said that an interested buyer had approached him, and he thought we should consider selling the business. We are currently in the midst of negotiations, and will hopefully have a deal on the table in the coming weeks. If all goes well the deal should close and I can move on in spring, when we will get paid for our shares and the property. Out of those funds he will be able to buy me out of our other physical assets he refuses to sell. I can buy a house, get a job, and finally live. 

All this time things have been about the same. He pretends all is fine and normal. I have 180'd. I increased my gym visits to 4 per week while D and S are in sports, or I bring them with me and they hang out in the kids area. I've maintained my three days of yoga per week. I am functional and pleasant with him at work. I do all the house work and things I possibly can, and try not to sweat it if I fall a little behind. I've increased the cleaning lady visits despite his protests. I SCHEDULE time for just me. My mom has been fabulous at helping facilitate that by taking the kids more. I've been spending more time cultivating some friendships. Been to a few concerts and shows, dinners with the girls, my 15th high school reunion. I quit two of my three volunteer committees. I've started more creative work that I missed since we inherited the business, and hope to move back into that field once this is all over with. 

I do not report to him where I will be. I arrange for the kids to be taken care of, and I go do my thing. So far, he hasn't said anything, except for the night of my high school reunion, as he saw group photos on social media, when he made sure to comment that my ex-boyfriend (who I hadn't seen since high school) and I "seemed close" in the photograph. And he also made a comment when I purchased a new dress - wondering where I would wear such a thing. I replied I wasn't sure, but it made me feel good about myself and so I bought it. I imagine he must notice that I'm never home....but, he doesn't seem to care much. 

Several months ago a different ex - the only other man I've loved, who I had immense feelings for, started following me on social media. He's started messaging me and I admit it feels strange, to be in touch with him again. All these feelings, thinking of what my life could have been like, if it had worked out with him instead. It's all been very platonic, just touching base and inquiring about how life is all these years later. He asked me to go for coffee to catch up, and I refused, and explained I didn't feel comfortable with it right now, due to some personal issues I was going through. H read all of these messages on my phone the other day, almost two weeks after this conversation initially occurred - so he's obviously feeling something, since he snooped - and I caught him with my phone. H insisted he thought I should go for coffee with him because he trusts me and has "zero self esteem issues"..... I was so confused. Like - did you forget we're separating? And also, I didn't ask for your permission....I know that meeting him for coffee is probably not that big of a deal, we were a large part of each others lives for a long time. BUT - I'm technically still married and I don't want to put myself in a scenario where I may feel those old feelings start coming up. It's not time yet. H said "it's only coffee, right? I mean, it's not like you're going to have sex at starbucks".... I just said "yeah, definitely not", and walked away. I don't understand this man I've been with for 13 years?!?!?!?!? What is his motivation here? Why push me to go for coffee with my ex? Is he trying to test me to see if I'll "cheat"? 

I really want to get out of here. I could try to find a rental, but then in March when the business sale goes through I want to buy. So I move my kids twice in five months? Plus all the money is tied up right now - finding a rental will be tough until the funds are released. 

Biding my time.


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## cma62 (Jul 31, 2010)

Your H is pushing you to see your ex to justify himself cheating if you find out.
Not saying he is cheating but if he is , he is assuaging his guilt by encouraging you to see your ex.

If he is cheating and you find out ...his response will be..” well, you met up with your ex”


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