# Different levels of libido



## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

I'll try to keep this brief: I'm 56, she's 48. We've been together 7 1/2 years, engaged for just over 3 years. (Long engagement by design, not today's topic.) Both divorced, I have three sons and she has two. One of mine lives with me, both of hers are still at home.

We always have a good time when we're together. We have lots of interests in common--road trips, dining out, theater, music, etc.. But here's the issue: we don't spend enough time together, in my opinion. We live in the same city, five miles apart. I would just like us to spend more time with each other. As it is,we generally just see each other sometimes on Friday night for dinner, then some time on one weekend day. We both have busy jobs, and hours are slightly different--I get off a little later in the evening.

But I feel that we should have more time with each other at this stage of our relationship. Last weekend: a total of an hour and a half together. We were going to go for a drive. We got something to eat, ran a couple errands, then as we were setting out to ramble, she wanted to go home and take a nap. She works hard and wants to sleep a lot on the weekends, but I work hard too and I make time for us. I feel sometimes as though she does not, and am sort of ambivalent about spending time together.

Trying not to be "needy" here. (I have had issues with this, due to some childhood emotional trauma.) But I don't think it's unreasonable to want more time with the woman I'm committed to for the rest of our lives. Also, she's not much into physical affection. No full-on sex in a LONG time. Not even much making out in a long time. In the early years, when we did have more sex, she was utterly silent through most of it, which was jarring to me. She's not a hugger, not a cuddler. I adore kissing her and touching her. My love languages are Physical Touch and Quality Time. Hers are Quality Time and Acts of Service (though I'm scratching my head over the time thing). 

Any perspectives on this would be most appreciated.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

So, why this: 


bk27 said:


> No full-on sex in a LONG time. Not even much making out in a long time.


what are her reasons for this? Have you discussed? If not, you should. I get that she's not touchy feely, but good LORD, even she must need sex every now and again. 

1.5 hours in a week seems REALLY low for you being together for so long. I think EleGirl has stats that you should have 15 hours per week of doing things together to keep your relationship working (or at least give it a CHANCE to work).


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## oldtruck (Feb 15, 2018)

dump her.
you are not a good match
you both want different things
the sex will continue to get worse

she can be seeing someone else on the side.


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

jlg07 said:


> So, why this:
> 
> what are her reasons for this? Have you discussed? If not, you should. I get that she's not touchy feely, but good LORD, even she must need sex every now and again.
> 
> 1.5 hours in a week seems REALLY low for you being together for so long. I think EleGirl has stats that you should have 15 hours per week of doing things together to keep your relationship working (or at least give it a CHANCE to work).


We have talked about it some. Had a BIG emotional discussion about two years ago. It was better for a while, but things gradually slipped back to not much time together and not much physical intimacy. She had a hysterectomy about four years ago and has had little sex drive since then, and doesn't want to take any hormones to help with it, which I had suggested. She sort of jokingly told me that her best friend and her husband "haven't had sex in years, because they just don't need it." (The friend in question has been married to her husband about 20 years.) I'd even be fine without full intercourse, as there are many other, ahem, "activities" we can do. But she just doesn't seem interested.


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

oldtruck said:


> dump her.
> you are not a good match
> you both want different things
> the sex will continue to get worse
> ...


I don't think she's seeing someone else. I've been through that with my first wife, and I just don't see it. I don't want to dump her, as there are so many wonderful aspects to what we have. Our families are close, etc. (I realize I came on here for advice, and you gave it to me, and I just contradicted it. Please forgive me.) But for all the values we share, it does seem she wants occasional companionship, and I want a real partner. She also puts down any talk about the actual getting married. "It's a long way off, so I don't want to think about it now." That sort of thing.


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

bk27 said:


> We have talked about it some. Had a BIG emotional discussion about two years ago. It was better for a while, but things gradually slipped back to not much time together and not much physical intimacy. She had a hysterectomy about four years ago and has had little sex drive since then, and doesn't want to take any hormones to help with it, which I had suggested. She sort of jokingly told me that her best friend and her husband "haven't had sex in years, because they just don't need it." (The friend in question has been married to her husband about 20 years.) I'd even be fine without full intercourse, as there are many other, ahem, "activities" we can do. But she just doesn't seem interested.


That sucks, and it doesn't bode well unless YOU are ok with just continuing this as a roomates relationship. But even with that, you'd have to spend time together.
This sounds like a "convenience" relationship for her. It's ok, nice to have, and takes NO work on her part to do it...

Also, the part about her friend and husband don't do it because they don't need it -- I BET one or the other of them would have a MUCH different story to tell.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

This is how your life will look in the future. this is it. It may have even less sex than now. Less affection. You already feel like she is hesitant about spending too much time together.

You have to ask yourself, if this is good enough. Do you want full relationship, or just great companionship? Great companionship is important, better than loneliness, and many people decide on that. You have to have a deep conversation with yourself about it. You do know things are not as they supposed to be.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

You’ve got bigger problems than not seeing each other more frequently. The sex thing is a huge red flag. Don’t marry her expecting that to improve. She’s not interested.


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## Tdbo (Sep 8, 2019)

bk27 said:


> I don't think she's seeing someone else. I've been through that with my first wife, and I just don't see it. I don't want to dump her, as there are so many wonderful aspects to what we have.* Our families are close,* etc. (I realize I came on here for advice, and you gave it to me, and I just contradicted it. Please forgive me.) But for all the values we share,* it does seem she wants occasional companionship,* and I want a real partner.* She also puts down any talk about the actual getting married. "It's a long way off, so I don't want to think about it now."* That sort of thing.


I'll state the obvious.
If you don't like what you have during the "Romance" phase, you aren't going to like what happens when the deal is done.
Sounds like she may want out, but doesn't want to be the "Bad guy."
For what you have, why can't you be friends?
If you want more, you should consider moving on.
Her reaction to that announcement will speak volumes.


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

Ithink Tdbo might be right. something has changed for her and she wants out, but does not have courage to say that out loud.


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

WandaJ said:


> This is how your life will look in the future. this is it. It may have even less sex than now. Less affection. You already feel like she is hesitant about spending too much time together.
> 
> You have to ask yourself, if this is good enough. Do you want full relationship, or just great companionship? Great companionship is important, better than loneliness, and many people decide on that. You have to have a deep conversation with yourself about it. You do know things are not as they supposed to be.


Yes. It's painful to contemplate. There are so many other areas in which we align--our general values, spiritual beliefs, dedication to family, responsibility, even quirky senses of humor--it would be a lot less difficult if we didn't align well in other areas. But I do want more than just companionship. At my age, and given my past experience (my first marriage was a 19-year lie on the part of my wife), I simply am looking for more that she wants to give. It's frustrating. Thanks for the input.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

@bk27 I have to agree with @Tdbo ... you two have been together 7 years and engaged for 3, thus these are your early years and the years when you two are most "in love" and this is how it is. So the question becomes, "Is this acceptable as it is right now?" Clearly after 7 years she is content where it's at and does not want to (or need to) change anything, including getting married. It sounds to me as if you do want to (or need to) change things.

I will say this: Beloved Hubby and I are 57yo and 58yo respectively, and we are celebrating one year of wedded bliss this month. This is honeymoon time. If I didn't see desire on his part I wouldn't have married him. If I didn't see him putting forth some effort to at least consider my needs (even if they don't match his needs), I wouldn't have married him. We have tons in common, do all sorts of adventures, get along like peas and carrots, and then go to bed and howl at the moon--at our age! 

So here's my final thought: when a person shows you who they are, believe them. She has shown you that this is who she is. She doesn't want sex very often. She doesn't want to cuddle or touch much. She doesn't want to spend every waking moment together. She wants to be single and share one hour a week with you. So believe her...this is who she is. If that's the case, is that who YOU WANT TO MARRY? If the answer is no (as I suspect it is) then you need to break up with her.


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

Tdbo said:


> I'll state the obvious.
> If you don't like what you have during the "Romance" phase, you aren't going to like what happens when the deal is done.
> Sounds like she may want out, but doesn't want to be the "Bad guy."
> For what you have, why can't you be friends?
> ...


Man, something you just said really struck me. My first wife, as our marriage was finally coming apart, once said to me, "I would have divorced you years ago, but I didn't want to be viewed as the bad guy."


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## WandaJ (Aug 5, 2014)

I think you know what's the answer is. It is painful, but you are already miserable. If you stay, it will be to settle.


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## Tdbo (Sep 8, 2019)

bk27 said:


> Man, something you just said really struck me. My first wife, as our marriage was finally coming apart, once said to me, "I would have divorced you years ago, but I didn't want to be viewed as the bad guy."


Really, you have it figured out.
In my original posting, I put those items in bold that state it clearly. You may want to go back and review for clarity.
I have to tell you, I'm two years older to you and have been engaged twice in my life to two different women.
Even though they were very different people (Thank God!) they both had one thing in common: they were both excited to be engaged and wanted to be married. My wife of almost 26 years rose to the challenge, the first one...not so much.
That is the crux of the issue, she pooh-pooh's it. That is the dead giveaway.
I could be wrong, and I sincerely hope I am for your sake, she doesn't seem to be that into you.
Like I said, just sit down and tell her that you want to end the engagement. If she truly wants to be engaged, her reaction will say everything.
Whose idea was it to become engaged? Yours or hers?
My guess is that she wants it to be on you. I think you said that she is close to the family. If you break it off, she's probably golden. She breaks it off, she's the villain. She doesn't want that, she probably doesn't want to hurt you.
From what you said, you could probably still remain friends, have dinner, etc on occasion.
If you want something more intense, you are probably better served moving on.


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

Tdbo said:


> Whose idea was it to become engaged? Yours or hers?
> My guess is that she wants it to be on you. I think you said that she is close to the family. If you break it off, she's probably golden. She breaks it off, she's the villain. She doesn't want that, she probably doesn't want to hurt you.
> From what you said, you could probably still remain friends, have dinner, etc on occasion.
> If you want something more intense, you are probably better served moving on.


My idea to get married. Here's the story: for our first three or so years together, she on occasion would say she wasn't interested in getting married. I brought it up a few times and she put it off. "If I married anyone, it would be you, but I'm not there yet." That sort of response. Then, out of the blue, she started sending me pictures of engagement rings (to be fair, they weren't super expensive ones, so I don't think she was just after fancy jewelry) and saying "If you gave me one of these, I'd wear it." A few months later, I bought one. Then we talked more. I asked her a question before THE question: "I have something to give you and something to ask you. Do you want me to ask you now, or would you rather I didn't?" She said go ahead, and I proposed, and she accepted without hesitation. We agreed on a long engagement, time for all of our kids (five between us) to be more settled and independent, which I agreed with, and time for me to get my finances in order (I'd had some problems in that area, but I've since worked out). In all conversations since then, marriage has been viewed as "down the road, so let's not talk about it yet." We take trips together, including some incredibly memorable ones...but no physical intimacy to speak of (just bits and pieces now and then) and no talk of the marriage. Our kids are close to each other. My sons and I adore her dad and stepmother, her sister and kids. I love her boys, and have looked forward to being their stepdad (their biological father now lives out of state). It's so complicated...but you're right, in that she doesn't seem excited or happy to be engaged or thinking of being married to me. (Then again, my first wife acted excited...and that turned out BAD. Of course, we were kids too...)


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## nypsychnurse (Jan 13, 2019)

A relationship, any relationship is not going to work unless both parties are on the same page and their needs are being met...the other alternatives are to meet in the middle or one person must "settle."
I'm going to guess that considering all the good you have between you, that you would be ok if she would meet you halfway on the "issues." After all, nothing in life is perfect...
However, if she is unable or unwilling to do that your only other option would be to settle for what you've got now...and you're already unhappy...
I ended a 6 year/3 engaged relationship a year ago for the same reasons...and it was incredibly painful and difficult to do, as I loved him very much, and we had so many wonderful things together...but in the end...he wasn't able to meet my needs in the affection department and (I tried) but just couldn't accept that "this was it."
Life is short...but you may have 20, 30, or even 40 years of living to do...make the most of it.



Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

I came on here looking for objective thoughts from people who don't know me, and I've gotten that. Have to say, I halfway wished someone would have said I was being ridiculous and needy and had no right to be looking for more out of this relationship, to shut up and be grateful for what I have, etc etc. But the responses have been pretty uniform. Well, thanks to those who took time to offer input.


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## Tdbo (Sep 8, 2019)

bk27 said:


> My idea to get married. Here's the story: for our first three or so years together, she on occasion would say she wasn't interested in getting married. I brought it up a few times and she put it off. "If I married anyone, it would be you, but I'm not there yet." That sort of response. Then, out of the blue, she started sending me pictures of engagement rings (to be fair, they weren't super expensive ones, so I don't think she was just after fancy jewelry) and saying "If you gave me one of these, I'd wear it." A few months later, I bought one. Then we talked more. I asked her a question before THE question: "I have something to give you and something to ask you. Do you want me to ask you now, or would you rather I didn't?" She said go ahead, and I proposed, and she accepted without hesitation. We agreed on a long engagement, time for all of our kids (five between us) to be more settled and independent, which I agreed with, and time for me to get my finances in order (I'd had some problems in that area, but I've since worked out). In all conversations since then, marriage has been viewed as "down the road, so let's not talk about it yet." We take trips together, including some incredibly memorable ones...but no physical intimacy to speak of (just bits and pieces now and then) and no talk of the marriage. Our kids are close to each other. My sons and I adore her dad and stepmother, her sister and kids. I love her boys, and have looked forward to being their stepdad (their biological father now lives out of state). It's so complicated...but you're right, in that she doesn't seem excited or happy to be engaged or thinking of being married to me. (Then again, my first wife acted excited...and that turned out BAD. Of course, we were kids too...)


You're in a hard place.
Sounds like she cares about you and doesn't want to lose you.
However, that doesn't transfer into married.
She felt you were headed off the reservation, and wanted to do "Just enough" to keep you on board and pacified.
If you made a move to end it, she probably would move enough to try and keep you on the hook.
You have to do what is right for you. I think you know what that is.
If you deviate from that you're settling.
You have three options: 1) maintain the status quo, 2) pull the plug, or 3) take the middle road which would be to withdraw and make her pursue you.
Whatever path you take, best of luck.


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

I'm 56. She's 48. We've been together seven and a half years, engaged for three years--long engagement by design. We do not live together. Each of us has been married once before. I have three sons, she has two. One of my mine lives with me, both of hers still live with her.

We are great together in almost all ways. We share interests and values, we truly enjoy the time we have together. We typically see each other on the weekends, and maybe one evening during the week. We have slightly different work schedules, and both have busy, active careers. I love her deeply and am committed to her, and I believe she is to me.

But...

I still have a strong sex drive...yes, even at my age! She has almost none. Part of this changed after she had a hysterectomy about four years ago. In the first couple of years we were together, we enjoyed sex together. She was active, and both of us experimented and explored with each other. Now, almost nothing. We rarely do more than a bit of kissing. She doesn't want to do anything when her boys are at home (they are 21 and 16, and we know the older one is sexually active himself), and I only have a twin bed at my home, so not much room! We sometimes fool around a bit when we travel, or when her boys are away, but last year, for example, we may have had sex three times. It's nearly June, and we haven't had anything beyond kissing and a bit of fondling at all this year. Last year, we took a two-week cross-country road trip, lots of time together. The trip was wonderful, but we only fooled around twice. Once was just heavy petting, once I ended up having to bring myself to orgasm and she sort of assisted.

I have brought this up to her. She doesn't like deep conversations, and jokes that we are "like an old married couple." She knows I have a strong libido, and that I desire HER. I've made it clear that I want her, and only her. Also, on the topic of sex, she will refer to having been taught as a child that sex outside of marriage was wrong, and still can't totally get around that. I can understand that, but it was never brought up in the first couple of years we were together. Further, when we do get active, she is almost silent. She says she doesn't know what she likes sexually--apparently her sex life with her first husband wasn't very satisfying either. She says she's NEVER had an orgasm. I don't think she's able to relax and let go in the moment.

She's never been a hugger or cuddler. We do hold hands in the car, or out walking, etc. Or I'll put my hand on her leg while driving. She accepts that with no problem. I LOVE kissing her, and we do kiss, though often it seems to lack passion on her part.

The thing is, the rest of our life together is great. We've been through some tough times--medical issues, financial, family, etc.--and have always been there for each other. I love her kids and she loves mine. There simply isn't much passion, and this frustrates me. I realize we're not kids in our 20s, but I also don't want to imagine that at 56, my sex life is over, especially when I desire her so greatly. Right now it feels like we are friends and companions, but not really lovers. I'm not ready to be an "old married couple" just yet...even before we're married!

I don't know that I'm specifically asking for advice here. I just wanted to vent in a safe forum. I have tried so many times to talk about this, but it makes her very uncomfortable. She doesn't like talking about feelings, emotions, sex, in general. She always listens when I talk, but I sense she is uncomfortable with communicating about it. I think she would be happy with a sexless relationship and marriage. The physical component is important to me, however, as one part of a successful relationship.

PS. I've brought up the possibility of her taking hormones, and she will not consider it.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

You'll never be happy in this relationship long term. She's a great friend and companion, but not gf or wife material. I have friends who are more affectionate than your gf! Of course, while you want more, perhaps this is enough for the rest of your life. Only you can decide - but better to decide sooner rather than later when it could become a lot more complex.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

You've been in a relationship with this woman for over 7 years, it's not going to change and she clearly doesn't want or need it to. She's happy with things the way they are. If anything, she wants LESS intimacy, not more. You mentioned that she is unwilling to even _consider _trying HRT. This woman clearly does not want or need things to change, and not only that, she's unwilling to even hear your side. She really doesn't sound all that committed to having a good relationship. 

You don't live together, you don't spend much time together, you don't have sex, and you barely have other forms of intimacy (physical or emotional). So, what exactly do you have here? It sounds more like a one-sided friendship than a relationship. 

It sounds like, for whatever reason, she has issues around intimacy in general (emotional and sexual). Those issues are not going to be fixed until/if she decides she wants to get help for it. Even then, it's a long, hard road and there are no guarantees. Right now, she doesn't see any reason to change. She's happy with the way things are and she doesn't care enough about you to change them. Sorry, but that's just how it is. 

If you want things to be different, you are going to need a new partner.

Don't look at it as "another" failed relationship. The only failure would be staying. There is no sense wasting more time on a woman who is not compatible with you and quite frankly, is really just a friendship.


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## Marriednatlanta (Sep 21, 2016)

Yeah....if you are not married yet - don't jump into the marriage pool.


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## OnTheFly (Mar 12, 2015)

bk27 said:


> I LOVE kissing her, and we do kiss, though often it seems to lack passion on her part.


Putting the sex aspect aside for a moment, this ^^^^ is heartbreaking.

I can commiserate.


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## BigbadBootyDaddy (Jun 18, 2018)

From now till dead, do you want to live like this?
I would bail in a heart beat. What are you afraid off? Being alone? You’re practically there ( living apart)

You know how many women there are who are looking for passion? Thousands.

Time to jump on the dating game. But know if you do, your current partner will jump your bones. That’s how it usually works.


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

What makes me so terribly sad about all this is that our values, interests, etc., align so well in so many other ways, certainly moreso than my first wife, or any other relationship I've had. I love her kids, she loves mine, we have couples friends, and on and on. 

I question whether my expectations are too high. Do I want too much? Is it worth walking away from a committed relationship because of the lack of sexual intimacy? I'm not a young guy, but then again, I'm not old either. I (hopefully) have a lot of years of living to do. I decided a few years ago I wanted to do it with this woman. But obviously I have doubts, or I wouldn't be asking advice of strangers. I'm a passionate person (not just sexually), and living a life without passion isn't appealing.

An example: on Sunday night she came over to my house and I made dinner. (I'm not a good cook, so this is kind of rare, ha!) We had dinner, watched a movie, she ordered delivery of cookies from one of those gourmet cookie places. It was a nice, low-key evening. But when the movie credits started rolling, she stood up and said, "I'm gonna go." I asked her to come into my bedroom, closed the door (my adult son was home, and his bedroom is next to mine), and had the idea of just a little making out. Kissed her, touched a bit. She returned the kiss, but did nothing else. And she just seemed uncomfortable, like she couldn't wait to leave.

I forgot to add in my original post: she and I have discussed this before, about two years ago. I think I was almost on the verge of ending it, but frankly said to her that we needed to be more "intentional" about our relationship. She agreed. And yes, it was better for a while. I think she's used to me, comfortable with me, and has no need for passion. That "old married couple" syndrome--and we're not married yet! She's smart, attractive, funny, successful in her career, a great mom, a devoted friend, a woman of great integrity and character...I could go on. But I'm not satisfied, and this makes me very sad. Makes me wonder if I should just be satisfied with what we have and not lust (pun intended) for more.

I appreciate the opportunity to write this out and share anonymously.


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## BigbadBootyDaddy (Jun 18, 2018)

If your son came to you with your problem, what would you tell him?


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## 2&out (Apr 16, 2015)

Sounds to me like you've already been friend zoned so I am not sure what your question is. If you want a lover and sex then you need to pursue that with someone else. If she falls by the wayside O-well. Not sure of your sense of humor and if you are trying to be funny but the marry her part ? LOL !!


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

BigbadBootyDaddy said:


> If your son came to you with your problem, what would you tell him?


Ah. Good question. Oh, I suspect I'd tell him to evaluate the relationship as a whole, to consider whether both he and his partner were giving their best effort and were satisfied. I'd tell him above all to communicate with his partner about it. And I'd likely tell him that in the end he has to do what is best for himself, that he is responsible for his own happiness, and "life's too short" to be in a relationship that doesn't meet your needs. Sigh.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

I am sorry about your situation, but admittedly a little puzzled about why you are seeking advice. All you need to do is look at the posts from other men on here that ended up marrying women fully aware that they didn't like sex. Don't become one of them and end up back on here complaining when she doesn't change. Go find someone that is into you.


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

ReformedHubby said:


> I am sorry about your situation, but admittedly a little puzzled about why you are seeking advice. All you need to do is look at the posts from other men on here that ended up marrying women fully aware that they didn't like sex. Don't become one of them and end up back on here complaining when she doesn't change. Go find someone that is into you.


That's the irony. After my divorce (15 years ago), I had short relationships with a couple of women who were totally "into me." They both turned out to be fairly insane, and not really suited for the kind of long-term relationship I was looking for. The women I've been with who are intelligent, educated, stable, attractive, and have some degree of shared interests and values, wind up being not so into me. And so it goes.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

It sounds like in your heart you already know everything you need to know about this.

If you need permission to get out of this relationship, then you will get it from just about everyone here. Marry this woman, and you will be sexless for the rest of your life. You'll be either unhappy, or you'll cheat. 

What else could we possibly say here?


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

Cletus said:


> It sounds like in your heart you already know everything you need to know about this.
> 
> If you need permission to get out of this relationship, then you will get it from just about everyone here. Marry this woman, and you will be sexless for the rest of your life. You'll be either unhappy, or you'll cheat.
> 
> What else could we possibly say here?


Yeah. I wouldn't cheat, so I'd just be unhappy. (I was cheated on in my first marriage, and I can't fathom sexual infidelity.) Still can't help but wonder if, for a guy of 56 years old, I'm placing too much importance on the physical intimacy. But yes, I see all of the responses to my original post have been in agreement. A couple of friends I've spoken to in person are in agreement. In some ways I was waiting for someone to contradict me and tell me I should happy with what I have and forget the sex aspect, etc etc.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

bk27 said:


> Yeah. I wouldn't cheat, so I'd just be unhappy. (I was cheated on in my first marriage, and I can't fathom sexual infidelity.) *Still can't help but wonder if, for a guy of 56 years old, I'm placing too much importance on the physical intimacy.* But yes, I see all of the responses to my original post have been in agreement. A couple of friends I've spoken to in person are in agreement. In some ways I was waiting for someone to contradict me and tell me I should happy with what I have and forget the sex aspect, etc etc.


That line of thinking is ridiculous. The oldest women I dated was 54 and she was highly sexual. Don't gaslight yourself into believing its not important to you. Usually its the low drive partner thats doing the gaslighting. This is something I never really understood.


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## Lila (May 30, 2014)

@bk27 you have started the same exact thread three different times.

June 25, 2018








Fiancee seems distant


I'm a 54 year old guy, my fiancee is 46. We have been together 5 1/2 years, and officially engaged a little over a year. We have both been married before. I have three adult sons, but two of them (ages 24 and 20) are currently living with me. She has two sons (19 and 14) who both still live with...




www.talkaboutmarriage.com





18 days ago








Relationships and Addiction


Whether it's drugs, alcohol, gambling, sex, pornography, or anything else, addictions can be detrimental to the health of a relationship.




www.talkaboutmarriage.com





and now this one.

I am merging this one with the one you posted 18 days ago.


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

Lila said:


> @bk27 you have started the same exact thread three different times.
> 
> June 25, 2018
> 
> ...


My apologies for my own confusion.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

You have one kid at home and she has two younger ones. You only have a twin bed so sex has to be at her place with a grown up bed. If you really wanted to have sex, you'd plunk down the money for a decent sized bed. Is your bedroom a closet?

Any woman you date is going to wonder why you only have a twin bed. Geez. Try to at least help solve your own problem.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

OP, I am not trying to be harsh here, but this must be the relationship you want if you posted about it roughly two years ago. I was unaware of that. With that said my advice is still the same. You need to decide if you want a friend or a girlfriend, and honestly after reading your thread from 2018, I feel like you guys could be incompatible in other areas as well. 

From what I gather you guys still don't see each other that often. I would think that would build up some pretty good sexual tension in a normal relationship. You're telling me she came to your house hung out and watched a movie, then proceeded to act "uncomfortable" when you kissed her. If my girlfriend is repulsed by a kiss from me I shouldn't be dating her. Maybe I am just a jerk, but if she were my girlfriend I would tell her don't bother coming back. From what I am reading I really think you were friend zoned years ago. She just didn't bother to tell you.


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

Blondilocks said:


> You have one kid at home and she has two younger ones. You only have a twin bed so sex has to be at her place with a grown up bed. If you really wanted to have sex, you'd plunk down the money for a decent sized bed. Is your bedroom a closet?
> 
> Any woman you date is going to wonder why you only have a twin bed. Geez. Try to at least help solve your own problem.


The bed issue is a fair point, thank you. It relates mainly to past financial issues, etc. But your point is well taken.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

Blondilocks said:


> You have one kid at home and she has two younger ones. You only have a twin bed so sex has to be at her place with a grown up bed. If you really wanted to have sex, you'd plunk down the money for a decent sized bed. Is your bedroom a closet?
> 
> Any woman you date is going to wonder why you only have a twin bed. Geez. Try to at least help solve your own problem.


Oh man....I was going to say that. Glad you did. Don't you want to cuddle after sex OP, pretty hard for two grown ups to do that in a twin size bed, and as a single man you want to make your bed and bedroom as comfy and inviting as possible. A nicely made bed and a clean bedroom that smells really good is a must have! You'd think my bedroom was a really nice hotel room minus my personal effects which are very well organized. 

With that said I'm not sure fixing your bedroom will help you with your current girlfriend, but it will help when you start dating if thats the path you choose. Honestly...if you do start dating again I think you have to fix it. I worry that that it might give a bad first impression. Its something that would be ok if you were living in a dorm room and in college, but I'm thinking if most mature women knew going in that their man was sleeping in a twin size bed, it may give them pause.


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## lovelygirl (Apr 15, 2012)

bk27 said:


> Do I want too much? Is it worth walking away from a committed relationship because of the lack of sexual intimacy? I'm not a young guy, but then again, I'm not old either. I (hopefully) have a lot of years of living to do. I decided a few years ago I wanted to do it with this woman. But obviously I have doubts, or I wouldn't be asking advice of strangers. I'm a passionate person (not just sexually), and living a life without passion isn't appealing.


What you are looking for is perfectly FINE and NORMAL.



> I forgot to add in my original post: she and I have discussed this before, about two years ago. I think I was almost on the verge of ending it, but frankly said to her that we needed to be more "intentional" about our relationship. She agreed. And yes, it was better for a while. I think she's used to me, comfortable with me, and has no need for passion. That "old married couple" syndrome--and we're not married yet! She's smart, attractive, funny, successful in her career, a great mom, a devoted friend, a woman of great integrity and character...I could go on. But I'm not satisfied, and this makes me very sad. Makes me wonder if I should just be satisfied with what we have and not lust (pun intended) for more.
> 
> I appreciate the opportunity to write this out and share anonymously.


I gotta say, for someone who's been in a relationship with her for 7 years, you don't know much about her. You've had little talks about stuff ...here and there ... as if you've been afraid to fully open up. It sounds like you've had "teenage" talks...chit chat ...about stuff that you need to have a SERIOUS and THOROUGH conversation about. That's not enough to fully know someone or to really know their intentions. She might never want to remarry again so that question needs to pop up again. If she wants to get married she should know she'll be able to fulfill your desires (and you hers). You don't have the luxury of time to wait on her for years and years. On the other hand, you might be able to catch a younger chick with the same libido as you. 

She's in menopause (or post-menopause) so her libido won't get any higher. If what you get now isn't enough for you, it will be worse many years down the road where things will deteriorate.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

The one day during the week and on weekends may not be enough for her to feel really connected to you. If you pop for a new bed, at least you'll have more opportunities to practice.

You can always put a time line in your mind for how much longer you're willing to wait to see improvement.


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## Cletus (Apr 27, 2012)

I can't disagree with anything anyone here has posted about improving your bedroom.

But.

Someone who actually values having a sexual relationship with you would not be put off of sex for 6 months because of the size of your bed. A way would have been found by now.


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

Someone who actually values sex would not put all the onus on the partner with 2 teenagers living at home to provide the free hotel. She might feel like she is just a booty call which would surely put a damper on any loving feelings.


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## Girl_power (Aug 11, 2018)

Why aren’t you guys living together.


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

Girl_power said:


> Why aren’t you guys living together.


When I proposed and she accepted three years ago, we agreed it would be a while yet before we got married and combined households. For my part, I had some financial issues I wanted to straighten out (which I have since done). We also wanted all of our kids to be more or less out of the house and semi-independent before we moved in together. (This was more her stipulation than mine, but I agreed.) She still doesn't seem too excited about the prospect of getting married, though. Surprise!


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## bk27 (Jun 25, 2018)

Blondilocks said:


> Someone who actually values sex would not put all the onus on the partner with 2 teenagers living at home to provide the free hotel. She might feel like she is just a booty call which would surely put a damper on any loving feelings.


As I said, you make a fair point. The business of my bed is kind of a convoluted story, and really beyond the scope of this discussion. But, you are correct. The twin bed was supposed to be a temporary thing. It's time I replaced it. I don't disagree with the point you and others have made on this.


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## badsanta (Oct 13, 2014)

bk27 said:


> She had a hysterectomy about four years ago and has had little sex drive since then, and doesn't want to take any hormones to help with it, which I had suggested.


So she had a hysterectomy, and struggles with her sex drive. To which you told her that she was broken and needs to go to the doctor and fix that so that you can objectify her for hot sex?

I am not saying that is what you said, but that is probably what she heard. 

In my opinion once a woman has a hysterectomy the nature of her sexuality changes. You have to go through a process and learn what that new sexuality is. If you want her to enjoy sex again, she needs to feel loved and accepted just the way she is. 

In my marriage things drastically improved after my wife got her hysterectomy (no hormones needed). Best thing that could have ever happened! We are obviously not teenagers anymore, but no monthly cycles now gives us a huge advantage from when we were behaving like teenagers. Just say'n...

You may want to try just making her feel loved and accepted and not make her feel sexually broken.

Regards, 
Badsanta


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## aaarghdub (Jul 15, 2017)

Based on what I’ve seen so far:

1) She likely has an avoidant attachment style from either family of origin or previous marriage.

2) You likely have an anxious attachment style which freaks out an avoidant. Too close they feel smothered, too far away they feel abandonment.

3) She had a hysterectomy which without hormone intervention means she has no sex drive. This won’t improve.

4) She’s a busy middle-aged woman with job and kids. Guess what... she has no energy. My wife and her friends are all exhausted from crappy sleep plus no testosterone means extremely low energy levels (and sex drive). Also, she’s emotionally exhausted and has little bandwidth for you.

5) You both want different things. You want passion and sex, she wants companionship and can do without the sex. Sex has a huge emotional bonding function for men and if it’s phoned in, given out of guilt it makes it worse. If she was vested, your love languages would matter. 

6) If you get married, expect her to come home from work, zone out on her tablet, and go to bed early every night and not want sex. Good with that?

Have you considered pre-martial counseling? Might be what you need to break the logjam.

BL - none of these will get any better with marriage. Would you still hangout if you weren’t committed or having sex? You are relying on someone else for your happiness and she doesn’t not want to have to deal with that as well. She’s already exhausted.


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