# Wife wants to leave 25 year marriage because of "friend"



## Seether (Aug 21, 2013)

I have spent quite many hours reading the posts on this forum, but haven't found any threads that have enough similarities to my situation. I was hoping to find that I am in a somewhat common situation so that I could better determine how to deal with it. Since I haven't yet found any answers I am now here posting my own thread. Thanks in advance to those who offer any advice as I am confused how to move forward.

I met my wife at a young age and married a few years later. We have been together for about 25 years. We have had a great marriage and I have always felt like I found someone that complemented me and that I complement very well. I would prefer to continue my life as I knew it, but some things have changed over the last few months that aren't allowing me to do that. 

My wife chose to stay home when we had our first child and has been a stay at home mom for almost 16 years. I have always encouraged her to have friends, or to go back to school, or to seek employment. I have encouraged her to do what makes her happy. She's tried a little of each of those things and has had a few friends but not really close ones. By and large she has chosen to be a stay at home mom and has accepted all that goes with that.

Several months ago (almost a year now), we moved to an apartment complex while we were searching for a home in a new area. It was during this time that she began a friendship with a man. She talked about the friendship very openly and I did not discourage it. I met the fellow as well and he seemed very nice. She also made several other friends as well which seemed to make her very happy to have so many people to interact with regularly. It was the friendship with the man in particular that has caused our problem.

As the friendship she had with this man progressed, she began spending more and more time with him in the common areas (the pool, the club house, etc.) and sometimes in his apartment. She initially was very open about all of this so I didn't think much about it. This continued and eventually she was spending most of her day with him. She would excitedly go and meet him around 4 in the afternoon when he came home from work and would often times "hang out" with him until 10 or 11 at night in the common areas.

This progressed to the point that she was doing this 7 days per week and I would not see her much until 10 or 11 at night. I discussed this with her and asked her to moderate her time with him so that we could have more time together. Initially she agreed, but really didn't change her behavior. We had many more discussions over the following months, but she continued spending an inordinate amount of time with him and her behavior toward me became increasingly irritated. I tried not to get angry and to understand her reasons, but she was never willing to give me much of an explanation.

I understand that this is probably an emotional affair, but I am fairly certain that it is not a physical affair. I believe this because I haven't seen anything that would give me any reason to think that it might be. In addition, although things were causing me grief, we still had a very active sex life (although it only took place after she came home late at night). 

Over the course of many conversations (all initiated by me), she told me that she really enjoyed her new friendships and that she really didn't know if she wanted to be married anymore. She said that she wouldn't have a problem with me finding a girl"friend" to spend time with and several more very uncharacteristic comments. These comments would go on to cause me many sleepless nights, weight loss, and an unbelievable amount of pain. She was a witness to all of this, but was indifferent and continued doing what she had been doing.

Eventually (after months) it came to a point that I felt that I could not remain in the situation. I had to watch as she was leaving to meet him and she talked about him and his children constantly. When she was at home and wasn't talking about him, she was emailing or texting him. I have been very open with her and had only asked her to moderate her time with him. I finally told her that if she couldn't do that, I would have to leave.

She said "I am not going to do that". I asked if she might just cut it back by a couple of hours per day. She said No. She was very excited by the prospect of my leaving. She helped me get of the necessities for my new apartment and helped me decorate. I told her during the process that "this didn't feel right" and she said "Oh well" and just seemed happy that I was going.

She initially said that she felt like this was a good thing, because it could allow her to figure out "what was wrong with her" and that we might be able to reconcile. Since then (as I understand it from both her and the kids), she has continued spending her days with her "friend" and has been going out to clubs with him and some of her other new friends.

She and I are still talking openly and are still maintaining (somewhat) of a sexual relationship around her schedule with him. She is not working, but as I mentioned she spends a great deal of time with her "friend" so any time that she talks or spends time with me has to occur on a weekday during the day when her "friend" is at work as she is not willing to violate her weekends or evenings with him. I have since changed my position on her "friend" and have told her that we could not possibly reconcile until she ends her relationship with him.

At this point, I am not sure how to proceed. Several days ago she came over and told me that she missed me and that she was "about ready to end her friendship" so that we could get back together. She followed up that conversation by spending the next several days with him as though the conversation had never occurred. We talked about that and she just said 'I'm sorry about that". I told her that I don't want to be kept in limbo suffering while she's having the time of her life and that I am going to move forward one way or another. She said that if pressed, she would prefer not to stay married, but would like to maintain a friendship / sexual relationship with me "or not".

I really don't know what to do at this point. When we are together and are not talking about "the situation", everything is great. I really think that the whole problem is that she was desperately craving friendship and now she is just getting drunk on it. I have felt like this was the issue all along or I would have approached it much differently. I just can't believe that she wants to end our long term love affair over this. It just seems so short sighted.

Although she agrees with all of the points that I have made, it doesn't change anything. She says that she knows she is "having problems", but she says that's "just how she feels right now". She says that she thinks I am the perfect husband, but that she just doesn't want to feel like she has any responsibility to be home at a certain time or to tell me where she is going or what she is doing. She knows that the kids are aware of her behavior, but that is of no consequence either.

At this point, we have been talking about a possible divorce. She doesn't seem at all phased by the discussion. She just talks about how she will be fair and I tells me that I can have the kids all I want and that sort of thing. She says she'd like to maintain our friendship / sexual relationship if possible, but also seems quite willing to let that go as well if necessary.

I know this is long and thanks for reading. This is where we are now. As I said everything seems great when we are together when she is available, but the other issue is always there and she is willing to do what is necessary to maintain it. I know that if I press the issue that our marriage will be over and I will have to suffer through the anger, bitterness and resentment. On the other hand, I can remain separated and continue as we are now or divorce and keep her as a sort of girlfriend for who knows how long. It's a tough place to be and I'm not sure how to proceed. I love her and care deeply for her and I feel that at some point she'll likely see that she has made a mistake, but that point may also never come. I also wonder if maybe I should tell her that she could maintain her friendship in moderation as this may increase the chances that we could move back in together? It would still be very hard on me, but I also don't want to be foolish or impulsive about the decision. 

I am open to discussion or suggestions. Thanks.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Have you read in the Coping with Infidelity forum? There is a lot there that you will be able to relate to.. and a lot of help for you. Ask a moderator to move your thread there.

A book that might help you is "Surviving an Affair" by Dr. Harley.

Also read the sickies in the CWI forum.


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

Come on dude...she's definitely have sex with this other man. You have be cuckolded. 

She doesn't want to be married to you anymore, and she wants to be with this other man. Serve her with divorce papers and pull a 180. 

You let way too much stuff slide...why would you ever have allowed her a boyfriend to begin with?

Cut off her money supply, get divorced, get custody and move on with you life.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

I think she is deep in an affair with this other man. She is having her cake and eating it too by being with him without truly leaving you. And you are enabling this. I would repost this in the Coping With Infidelity section. You will immediately get some specific advice about how to deal with the affair. If it were me, I would tell her that she cuts everything off with the other man or you file for divorce.


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## NativeSun09 (Mar 28, 2013)

Your wife is a selfish and lazy person. And you allowed her to walk out on your marriage. Stop supporting her and her "new" lifestyle. Grow a backbone and kick her to the curb. You are seriously still considering letting her hang with that ********* who has been causing problems in your marriage? And she has already chosen him over you. There's your answer. She likes the security you provide but wishes to have her new boy toy. If telling this other dude to back off is going to end it, then end it. There's no other way around it. When she's "available"?! You've got to be kidding me. Your wife has to make time for you, her husband, when she's not screwing this lowlife? Don't be a doormat. Cut off her funds, divorce, and stop being weak in front of your kids. Like Tulsy said, you are being cuckolded.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## zookeeper (Oct 2, 2012)

Let's just say that she is not having sex with the OM (as highly unlikely as that is.) How does it feel to know that she most likely closed her eyes when having sex with you at night and imagined it was him on top of her? 

Her behavior is despicable, but you have plenty of blame in this situation. You should never have accepted her having a close friend of the opposite sex. Too late now, but learn for the future. No good can come of it. A married woman has absolutely, postively no business being alone with another man in his apartment. Period. Same goes for a man. 

You've created a dynamic over years together where the message was that her happiness was the most important thing. You've encouraged her to do whatever she wants, probably with little accountability. Is it surprising that she has turned into a selfich, self-centered narcissict? 

Whoever you think she was when you married her, that woman no longer exisits. Stop giving her support and intimacy. Especially stop having sex with her. I really have a hard time getting around the idea that you are willing to have sex with her when she most likely had sex with another man just hours (even minutes) before. Get checked for STD's. Move on with your life.


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## accept (Dec 1, 2011)

You dont mention or I may have missed it if the other person is married. You really dont have an option. You must give her an ultimatum, best if you move elsewhere, or divorce. You cannot keep on 'sharing' her and it sounds like you get the 'lesser' portion of her.


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

I shake my head at reading this. If you have already moved or are about to move to another apartment, then you have to separate your finances. IOW, since you make all the money you need to tell your wife that it's about time she gets a job so that she can support her new lifestyle after you and the kids find another place to live. I think the prospect of her having to work for a living will be like a splash of cold water in her face. 

Since this OM has kids, is he married or seeing someone? If so, you should start talking to his lady friend. I'm guessing he's divorced.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

She's not spending all that time in his apartment just talking. Wake up. She's cake eating and you are allowing it. This is not about friendship. 

Do you really want to continue to be a doormat -- your chances of successfully reconciling are zero if you continue on the path you are on. If she thinks you are filing and moving on she may wake up. But she may not. Be prepared either way. 

And she needs to start supporting herself immediately.


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## Seether (Aug 21, 2013)

Oh Wow. Thanks for the responses, however, I think that my post didn't come across as I had intended. I agree with some of what has been said, but I seriously do not believe that she is having a sexual relationship with this fellow. It is not just denial. I have looked for clues and have seen her with him many times and do not think this is the situation. I'm almost afraid to explain much further because I don't think this situation is typical although people will assume that it is.

I know it is hard to believe, but they spent a great deal of time in the common areas and with other friends that they mutually share. She does go to his apartment to have dinner and to hang out, but my kids went along to spend time with his kids many times and they also tell me that he is a nice guy and have never mentioned having seen anything out out of the ordinary. I really believe that it is a friendship that has taken on too much significance.

As far as a divorce is concerned, we are talking about the possibility of this now. Doing that will not give her the cold splash of water to the face that someone mentioned. She will likely receive child support and a settlement that will allow her to continue her relationship while she goes back to college to finish her degree. 

I agree that it is a messed up situation, but it's not at all what one might assume. The guy is recently divorced himself because of his wife's infidelity (from what I have been told). My kids know him and tell me that if he knew we were having issues because of him, he would probably end the relationship. I know people are going to hammer me for saying this, but I didn't want to screw up her friendship with him because it is the one thing that really seems to make her happy these days.

I talked with her today and told her that I really felt that I felt that she was not thinking toward the future and spoke of the likely temporary nature of her relationship with this fellow. She said that really made her want to think about it more. So I am expecting more conversation about this very soon and then I will absolutely move forward with divorce or reconciliation, but one or the other will have to happen soon.

To answer a few of the questions: 1. Yes, our finances are separate, but I am paying the bills because the kids are spending equal time with each of us and I wont put them in a bad situation. 2. An ultimatum has already been given. 3. I am not being weak, but I am trying to be logical and to consider this as unusual situation that doesn't fit the standard. I don't want be rash.

Thanks to all.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Seether said:


> I know people are going to hammer me for saying this, but I didn't want to screw up her friendship with him because it is the one thing that really seems to make her happy these days.


You really think that little of yourself?


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## Seether (Aug 21, 2013)

Of course not. I would react very differently if I believed this to be a physical relationship. Is it wrong to put myself in her shoes and to consider how it might be to not have any close friends for years? I will deal with it and divorce is a definite possibility, but in my opinion one should not throw away a long term relationship because the other makes a dad decision. I had really hoped that there might be others that had a similar situation with a "friend" causing so many problems. I almost with that I had posted that it was a female so that the assumption would not automatically be that there is a physical relationship. That would change the dynamic and the assumptions wouldn't it?


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## BK23 (Apr 17, 2013)

Seether said:


> Of course not. I would react very differently if I believed this to be a physical relationship. Is it wrong to put myself in her shoes and to consider how it might be to not have any close friends for years? I will deal with it and divorce is a definite possibility, but in my opinion one should not throw away a long term relationship because the other makes a dad decision. I had really hoped that there might be others that had a similar situation with a "friend" causing so many problems. I almost with that I had posted that it was a female so that the assumption would not automatically be that there is a physical relationship. That would change the dynamic and the assumptions wouldn't it?


take off the blinders. Lot's of use have dealt with a "friend" like this when our spouses had emotional affairs. Your wife is being unfaithful. The only question is whether it is just emotional at this stage or also physical.

If by some miracle your wife isn't already sleeping with this guy, she will be in short order. You, your marriage, and your family don't have a chance while this guy is in the picture.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Seether said:


> Of course not. I would react very differently if I believed this to be a physical relationship.


Why?


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## justonelife (Jul 29, 2010)

Look at the title of your thread. A woman doesn't walk away from a 25 year marriage over a "friend". And they don't spend 6-7+ hours a day with "friends". Those are ridiculous assumptions.

If she really needs friends so badly, she can find some nice women to hang out with. Even if it were women, this is way too much time to be spending with friends. You shouldn't have to beg your wife for attention.

She needs a splash of cold water. File the paperwork. If she really doesn't care about a divorce, then you already have your answer. You have nothing to hang on to.


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## Seether (Aug 21, 2013)

I guess I can understand how she could have a close connection with another person. I am just confused about how it came to be more important than her primary relationship. A physical relationship seems like it would be a much deeper form of intimacy and I could not imagine being intimate with her if I knew that she had been involved with that sort of situation.


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## justonelife (Jul 29, 2010)

Seether said:


> I am just confused about how it came to be more important than her primary relationship.


Newsflash - You aren't her primary relationship any more.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Seether said:


> I guess I can understand how she could have a close connection with another person. I am just confused about how it came to be more important than her primary relationship. A physical relationship seems like it would be a much deeper form of intimacy and I could not imagine being intimate with her if I knew that she had been involved with that sort of situation.


She did nothing you did not permit.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Seether said:


> I have spent quite many hours reading the posts on this forum, but haven't found any threads that have enough similarities to my situation.


Then you're not reading the right threads.

Your situation is repeated all over these boards.

Your wife is having at least an EA and most likely a PA with this guy and you don't believe it because the human denial system is so powerful and is so evolutionarily geared towards protecting a person from the shock of reality that you have comfortably wiped that very likely possibility right off the table.



Seether said:


> She said "I am not going to do that". I asked if she might just cut it back by a couple of hours per day. She said No. She was very excited by the prospect of my leaving. She helped me get of the necessities for my new apartment and helped me decorate.


Wow. You take such a passive approach, first making one request, then backing off and making a softer one, which she also refused, then you go and offer to leave and she's all over it.



Seether said:


> I told her during the process that "this didn't feel right" and she said "Oh well" and just seemed happy that I was going.


You conveniently got right out of her way and made it much easier for the two of them to carry on. 



Seether said:


> she is not willing to violate her weekends or evenings with him. I have since changed my position on her "friend" and have told her that we could not possibly reconcile until she ends her relationship with him.


Weak. "If and when you decide to give it up with him I'll be here for you."

It's ultimatum time. It's either give him up or we're done. But the answer seems pretty clear. She's ok without you in her life, and I think you already know that but again, the denial is preventing you from really putting it all out there so you make these weak threats which do nothing but enforce the fact that wife can do whatever she wants with this guy.



Seether said:


> At this point, I am not sure how to proceed.


File the divorce papers and be prepared to follow the course until she either does everything you request including going no contact with this guy, OR the judge stamps the divorce papers final.



Seether said:


> I told her that I don't want to be kept in limbo suffering while she's having the time of her life


She doesn't care about your wants or needs, that's clear.



Seether said:


> She said that if pressed, she would prefer not to stay married, but would like to maintain a friendship / sexual relationship with me "or not".


She's done. 



Seether said:


> I just can't believe that she wants to end our long term love affair over this. It just seems so short sighted.


Maybe she's in that so called "affair fog" that people here talk about. Maybe she'll suddenly snap out of it and everything will be great. I highly doubt it but if you want to try to go that route you need to step up the pressure, again you do that by filing the divorce papers and hand her a hard dose of reality.



Seether said:


> She doesn't seem at all phased by the discussion.


No surprise there. I think I said it. She's done.



Seether said:


> She says she'd like to maintain our friendship / sexual relationship if possible,


Must be nice to have 2 guys to choose between. Shows what she thinks of you. Look up "cake-eating"



Seether said:


> I am open to discussion or suggestions.


File for divorce. Step up and be a man and be tough and be strong. No more of this "I might want a divorce if this keeps up".

Maybe she'll realize she's about to screw up the best thing that ever happened to her, maybe you'll realize she's become the worse thing that ever happened to you.


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## BrockLanders (Jul 23, 2012)

Would you hang out with a woman for hours everyday if you weren't banging her?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

My perspective - which my wife shares - is that we are together because we want to be. We choose each day to stay. We want the best for each other. If it turns out that one of us would be happier, more fulfilled, or whatever elsewhere or with someone else, we're free to go. Our vows only state that we'll stay together as long as we both love each other. Sometimes, that's difficult, but we keep the long view in mind and work through issues like any healthy couple. 

There is no "should" for us - it's what we both agree is appropriate - for us. There are limits and boundaries, of course, but those are far looser than "traditional" marriage. We have more individual freedom, but have agreed we MUST keep each other fully informed and there are things we give each other veto power over. Ignoring those constraints would put us in the same circumstances that could lead to divorce for any couple, of course.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Why did you leave the apartment, she's the one that has abandoned the children and her husband. She should leave. You know she'd move in with him, the home wrecking OM.

Stop call him her friend - call him his real name, her affair partner.

Get Not Just Friends by Shirley Glass

And she won't get child support, if you have custody.


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## 6301 (May 11, 2013)

Friend

You just logically lost your marriage by sitting around contemplating rather than opening your eyes and taking a good look at the situation

When your wife is running out of the house at 4PM to greet this bum when he comes home from work. She doesn't come home until 10 or 11. She tells you to get a girlfriend. SHE HELP YOU PACK YOU EFFING CLOTHES WHEN YOU THREATEN TO MOVE THE F--- OUT! She isn't one bit fazed when you talk divorce. Tell me please, I gots to know! WHERE IS THE LOGIC!!

You don't want to be rash? Dude, the only rash you might have to worry about is the one she gives you that she will get from him. What the hell do you think she's doing over at his house? Better yet, why are you letting her? 

No wife should be doing the things she doing. NO WIFE! She's doing this right under your nose and your trying to use logic. Try telling this story to a MC. Any MC. After they hear it, one or all will no doubt reach out and boot you in the ass and call you a liar for such a stupid story. Wake the hell up. You have kids and it seems like neither one of their parents have any common sense. 

I honestly don't know how you can literally watch your wife chase some other guy down the street when he comes home from work. Not come home. Pack your clothes. Not give a sh!t if you get a girlfriend. Big deal, she throws you a piece of a$$ and for some reason you accept it and are grateful. What you need to do is the next time she goes chasing after this guy make sure her possessions go with her. Wake the hell up man. Your giving men a bad rap honest to God.


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## WakeUpCall (Aug 13, 2013)

Seether for you own self respect and dignity and for any possibility of getting your miserable excuse for a wife back (I know I have one) you need to detach and file tomorrow with the same cold hearted emotion that she has shown you. You do not want a woman that has no respect for you. Shock and awe my friend.


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## Seether (Aug 21, 2013)

Ok, I get it. I should have handled it differently. This didn't happen all at once, it was a progression and I wasn't sure at what point to draw the line. Maybe I should have raised hell about it, but this was a person that I have learned to trust over the last 25 years so cut me some slack. I never thought that her intentions could be anything less than good. I just assumed that I misunderstood the situation. I wish I had handled it differently. I would love a re-do. 

She does spend more time with the kids now that we have separated. As for the custody situation, I understand that it is difficult for the father to get the children in this state unless the children make the choice. I'm not sure I want to put them in that situation. 

I will, however, seek out a lawyer and get some useful advice about the situation and determine the best way to move forward. I began here with the idea that I wanted to make sure that I wasn't being overly jealous or controlling by asking her to lessen the time that she spends with the man that she calls her "friend". 

Apparently (according to the responses), I should have made demands much earlier. I already know that at this point any sort of ultimatum that requires her to take action will very likely end in divorce. The only ultimatum I have given at this point is that she'll have to "figure things out" soon. She had wanted 7 months (the length of my lease) to figure it out, but I decided a couple of weeks into it that I would not wait that long. I realize that I am going to have to press the issue in order to move forward. Thanks for the support.


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## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

Seether said:


> The guy is recently divorced himself because of his wife's infidelity (from what I have been told).


Phooey! Most likely he was the cheater. If he had been cheated on, he would recognize how inappropriate his behavior is.

Your wife is fVcking him. Just because you can't imagine it, doesn't mean it's not happening. 

It's happening, and it's happening a lot.

Your wife is a Cake Eater with a capital C. (gawd I can't stand cake-eaters)

You've enabled it. You've been a Doormat with a capital D.

File for D. See what she does. For christ's sake, stop paying for her to live like a single person.

The Unified Theory of Cake

Does he ever come to her apartment? If so, set up a nanny cam in her bedroom. You're paying her lease. It's your apartment.


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## Seether (Aug 21, 2013)

I left because I couldn't handle watching her leave each day to spend time with him. Again, I agree that I handled it badly. He doesn't come to her apartment as far as I know. The kids tell she has been spending every night with him at the pool until it closes, but that she doesn't usually go to his house. Again, that is why I don't think it is physical. I'm not there to interfere and she still spends her time in the common areas rather than just going to his apartment.

I still think that this is an EA, but I know what I have to do. Thanks for all of the book recommendations. I'm going to head to the library tomorrow. I've got plenty of time to read right now!


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## Seether (Aug 21, 2013)

The Unified Theory of Cake - Excellent.


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## BrockLanders (Jul 23, 2012)

Seether said:


> Ok, I get it. I should have handled it differently. This didn't happen all at once, it was a progression and I wasn't sure at what point to draw the line. Maybe I should have raised hell about it, but this was a person that I have learned to trust over the last 25 years so cut me some slack. I never thought that her intentions could be anything less than good. I just assumed that I misunderstood the situation. I wish I had handled it differently. I would love a re-do.
> 
> She does spend more time with the kids now that we have separated. As for the custody situation, I understand that it is difficult for the father to get the children in this state unless the children make the choice. I'm not sure I want to put them in that situation.
> 
> ...


Dont beat yourself up for doing what you thought the right thing. You're not a cheater, its not your fault for trusting your wife. That's in her camp.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## northernlights (Sep 23, 2012)

If she's out at the pool all evening with this guy, who's taking care of your kids?


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## HappyKaty (Nov 20, 2012)

Seether said:


> I still think that this is an EA, but I know what I have to do. !


In my experience, an emotional relationship is much harder to get over, than a physical one. If your wish is for reconciliation with this "woman", you better be praying for a PA.


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## Iver (Mar 8, 2013)

She's still not working? So she gets to hang out with her "friend" and you pay all the bills? Jesus.

Put a VAR in your place to get her talking to the OM; if possible check her texts to the OM as well. 

Your passivity in the face of all this is disturbing.


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## imtamnew (May 13, 2013)

I want my wife to feel loved and hated because of me.
I want her to be happiest and saddest because of me.
I want her to talk nonstop with me and give only me the silent treatment.

I want her to be married to only me.

Not some other guy.

This is the basis of my marriage. I don't know what your arrangement is, it does not appear to be a marriage to me.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

I really want to bash my head after reading the OP...Are you that naive ? Please don't trust your instinct for a couple of days and snoop beyond the obvious.

Or just ask her. She probably think you know by now that they are having sex. She will probably confess to kissing the first time though...

She separated because of her relationship with this guy. She is going out to clubs with him. What the hell do you think is happening ? 

The guy probably knows that both of your separated because of the amount of time she is spending with him. yes, he knows. That should tell what he thinks of you.



> Several days ago she came over and told me that she missed me and that she was "about ready to end her friendship" so that we could get back together.


This happened because the OM had too much of her when you left her and probably ignored her that day. And probably after that she is rationing her time with him. 

You are probably in severe denial about the whole thing from your first post but I think the faster you come out of this, the less months you waste your time on this. Read the recommended books on infidelitysuggested here. It will explain away a lot of your wife's behavior. Very critical that you do this. The more you make it normal for her(Paying for both the houses and making it financial comfortable for her while she goes and chats up with another man, ignoring you etc. Make her start working if she wants to spend resources of this marriage on another guy). 

She getting her financial needs met by you while she spending all her emotional stuff on this guy, giving you bit off scraps so as not to lose your support. You probably do not see it this way because your eyes are blinded by the implicit trust that happens in a relationship and because you love your wife

Get angry at how she is treating you. What would you tell a friend who's wife is treating him like yours ?


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

> but I didn't want to screw up her friendship with him because it is the one thing that really seems to make her happy these days.





> I told her during the process that "this didn't feel right" and she said "Oh well" and just seemed happy that I was going.


Just quoting the obvious. Where did you put her and her happiness and did she put yours in her priorities


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## BrockLanders (Jul 23, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> Just quoting the obvious. Where did you put her and her happiness and did she put yours in her priorities




She helped him move into his apartment, thats about it from what Ive read.


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## Lordhavok (Mar 14, 2012)

Wow, she's stomped a mudhole in you and she's walking it dry. Your paying her to f*ck someone else while you wait around for your turn. Wake up and show some backbone man, damn. Divorce her ass and let her boyfriend pay her bills, he's the top priority and your just the backup plan in case things dont work out. I really find it hard to believe that you would just stand by and allow this to happen, makes me wonder if this post is for real.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

BrockLanders said:


> She helped him move into his apartment, thats about it from what Ive read.


that is putting it mildly. 




> She said that she wouldn't have a problem with me finding a girl"friend" to spend time with and several more very uncharacteristic comments.


Missed it the first time.. I will bet a month's paycheck that she is already having sex with this guy for sometime. This line is sure shot of a physical affair. She is trying to level the field after her infidelity. She was also having sex with you during the same time so as not to arouse suspicions...



> These comments would go on to cause me many sleepless nights, weight loss, and an unbelievable amount of pain. She was a witness to all of this, but was indifferent and continued doing what she had been doing.


Seriously ?


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Seether said:


> she doesn't usually go to his house. Again, that is why I don't think it is physical.


The operative word being "usually". Which means sometimes, she DOES go to his house. What do you think happens when they go there?

You don't think it's physical because you don't want to believe it's physical.


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## Seether (Aug 21, 2013)

I get that I have handled this situation poorly. I think every situation is a bit different and there are some dynamics that I just cannot convey. I think that is why my description of the situation makes it appear as though I have been overly passive. I probably have been to a certain extent, but not to the extent that has been suggested. I addressed it early on, but I probably should have raised hell about it. Maybe that would have stopped it in it's tracks. I still do not believe that she has had a physical relationship, but it has become so somewhat irrelevant at this point. I do agree with some of the comments that have been made.

I have not wasted any time. I met with her this morning and presented the ultimatum. Not surprisingly, she chose the divorce option. I plan to meet with a lawyer this coming week to determine what is required to file for divorce.

I am doing all that I can to avoid anger or saying anything that I will regret later. I know that no matter what I say at this point it will not change her feelings about the situation. I am hoping to maintain a friendly relationship now and in the future as she is the mother to my children and I will have many dealings with her in the future. It is such a shame that I we will be throwing away so many happy years and so many good memories but it appears as though there are no options left.


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

Seether said:


> I still do not believe that she has had a physical relationship....


You are incredibly naive...like, unbelievably. You should listen to people in the thread. Actually, go tell this same story to people you know and see what they say.

I would bet your life on it...she's sleeping with him.



Seether said:


> I have not wasted any time. I met with her this morning and presented the ultimatum. Not surprisingly, she chose the divorce option. I plan to meet with a lawyer this coming week to determine what is required to file for divorce..


No shock there. She wants you gone, and I'd expect her to go public with her relationship once you are legally separated, making like it only went physical once you guys broke up. 

Are your reading the books mentioned in this thread? You need enlightenment. Read "Not just friends", as someone mentioned.



Seether said:


> I am doing all that I can to avoid anger or saying anything that I will regret later. I know that no matter what I say at this point it will not change her feelings about the situation. I am hoping to maintain a friendly relationship now and in the future as she is the mother to my children and I will have many dealings with her in the future. It is such a shame that I we will be throwing away so many happy years and so many good memories but it appears as though there are no options left.


This is your own FOG. You are in a fog believing she hasn't slept with him and that your actions may be able to prevent it. Unfortunately, you actions or inaction have facilitated the affair from the beginning. 

At some point you should be pissed off...royally. I mean think about it....your wife has abandoned you to be with another man. She even has your kids convinced that he is a great guy, which will make it easier when she transitions him in as her lover...they will believe her, thinking it only happened after the fact, and hey, he's such a great guy, makes mom so happy. You, who has provided everything for her in this life, have been used, and you are not appreciated by her at all. In fact, in many way, you are repulsive to her because she can see you don't respect yourself, and therefore has no respect for you.

I hope that some of what you read here upsets you...that should be redirected towards the woman who cheated on you. Even if you think it's just an emotional affair (which it's not, it's both E and PA), you still need to wake up to the fact that she has replaced you, and it shouldn't just make you sad...you should be pissed about it.

You shouldn't be worrying about maintaining a friendly relationship with someone who does this to you. You should read about the 180 and apply it...no contact except for the kids. It's time to take care of you now...she's gone...cut her off.


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## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

Seether,

Your situation is NOT different. 

It is time to cut the b!tch off! Go to the bank, pull out half of all your money...or all of it if you really want to mess with her. Set up your own accounts and stop paying her to fvck the POSOM. 

Try and move your kid into your place and start taking care of him or at least shoot for 50% custody. That way when the $hit hits the fan and she realizes that her support is GONE you can either start drawing child support from her or you won't have to pay any.

What state do you live in? Do they have alimony?

Friendly relationship??? Friends don't do what she is doing to you. Go ahead and tell her that you are done being friends, she might as well know.


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## Iver (Mar 8, 2013)

I'm sorry that you are in this predicament. 

Does your STBXW understand she will have to work now? That you'll have 50-50 child custody?

Has any of the negative repercussions of a divorce sunk in?

Just from what you've written she seems to be in La-La land (which you have been paying for by the way.)

I think you should rethink keeping a friendly relationship with her, especially if she makes her hook up with the OM official. Something tells me she'll be moving in with him very soon.


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## Seether (Aug 21, 2013)

I asked her during the divorce discussion if she would feel the same if she had to work to maintain her situation. She said that she would work full time if necessary. We do not live in an alimony state and she says that she wants to have joint custody and we are currently keeping them (teenagers) 7 days per week each.

When I said that I want to maintain a friendship, I meant that I do not want to blow up or to have an angry demeanor around her. I want to keep it "friendly". We have gotten to the point that there is little that I could say that would make a difference. I know I've tried. At this point, I just want to maintain a positive situation for my kids and do not want them to think badly of her. They are watching it all unfold and are very unhappy with her behavior too. 

I'm there for them though and will gladly take them full time if that is something that they want to do. I'm moving forward now, will get the divorce, and will try to figure out how to recover from all of this.

Thanks for all of the advice and book recommendations.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Oh, and post the OM up on cheaterville.com as the home wrecker he is.

Google him, he may already be there.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

The first thing I would do is join their little pool party, accuse the om of being a back stabbing home wrecker. Remind him of what he went through with his kids. Tell him he will be deposed along with his kids and he will be named in the lawsuit.

Put him on cheaterville.com and give him the link.

Tell your wife you will go for custody for her immoral behavior.

Move back in and keep insisting she move out.

Get angry and use your testicles, its at God gave them to you for. The reason your losing is because your wife sees you as awimp and the other man as a real man. Period


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Why don't you have a discussion with the "friend" ? Are you scared of her reaction ?


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> Why don't you have a discussion with the "friend" ? Are you scared of her reaction ?


Why not?


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## joygirl (Aug 19, 2013)

warlock07 said:


> Why don't you have a discussion with the "friend" ? Are you scared of her reaction ?


He already answered this question; He doesn't want to mess up her friendship with him.

This is just unbelievable. I wonder where some women get these kind of husbands from:scratchhead:


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Seether, what would change if you knew they were having sex during the marriage ? 

How would you react if they start going out "officially" ? (They are already dating now.)

Even if you won't go back with her, use this as a learning experience.


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## wilderness (Jan 9, 2013)

Move back into your house immediately. In the event of divorce, the single worst thing you can do is to move out of your home.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

How come you never joined the little pool parties and performed your duties as a c*ck blocker?

Move back in and tag along. Give him the finger across the throat sign.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Seether said:


> .Not surprisingly, she chose the divorce option. I plan to meet with a lawyer this coming week to determine what is required to file for divorce.
> 
> I am doing all that I can to avoid anger or saying anything that I will regret later. I know that no matter what I say at this point it will not change her feelings about the situation. I am hoping to maintain a friendly relationship now and in the future as she is the mother to my children and I will have many dealings with her in the future. .


Things might have turned out differently if you had handled things differently in the early stages. You were weak and passive, and allowed things to spiral out of control. But who knows, it might have happened anyway.

Since you're going the divorce route I agree this is the best way to handle it.

Keep it civil, get it done as fast as possible, but don't do her any favors. Going forward, keep your conversations with her short and only about matters directly related to settling your divorce and about the children.

Things


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Get a var. Get her to talk about how she would be happy with an open marriage etc. This could help you with custody when this all hits the fan. I'm assuming you don't want posom being called daddy.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Btw, the next time she talks about how you can be friends and still have sex, ask her if she thinks that will be cool with your new wife and the kids new step mom .


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## Iver (Mar 8, 2013)

Think about how you would respond if she wakes up from her fantasy and wants to recommit to the marriage. (having to work full time can really help focus the mind, especially if she's been a stay at home mom)

Would you want her back? (polygraph appointment would be recommended)

Have the decency to be honest with the children as well. None of this crap about "sometimes two people just decide for no reason to divorce" Be clear. A marriage is two people and your wife has decided to add an OM to it. That's why the divorce is happening. 

Be open to asking for full or majority custody. She can see how much fun having to go to work is and seeing her children part time.


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> Why don't you have a discussion with the "friend" ? Are you scared of her reaction ?





joygirl said:


> He already answered this question; He doesn't want to mess up her friendship with him...


Ya, he actually said that. It's unbelievable.


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## Seether (Aug 21, 2013)

As I mentioned in one of my earlier posts, there are a lot of things that I didn't convey that have happened. In answer to your question, I have joined them at the pool on several occasions. It did not appear to me that there was anything other than a cordial friendship. She is almost always at the pool or in the common area and I always knew where to find her. The issue is that she just wanted to all of her time with her friends (and the one in particular). Usually this is until 10 or 11 at night. I never get to see her and I do not enjoy hanging out with them for hours at the pool as we just sit there and repeat the same old conversations again and again. She tells me that it isn't that way when I am not there. She says that I am intimidating and that is why her "friend" and other friends do not act in the same way and isn't enjoyable.

Yea, I realize that my moving out wasn't the best way to handle it. I thought it would force her to re-evaluate our marriage and that she would soon move in with me and get away from the situation. Yes, it backfired, but I haven't ever been through this before and it seemed logical at the time. I thought that showing her that she was going to lose me was a show of balls. I briefly considered telling her to leave, but didn't for the kids sake and opted for leaving myself.

Yes, I could force my way back into the apartment. Yea, but the issue is that I cannot physically force her to stop spending time with her friend or friends. At this point my kids tell me that she spends as much time with other friends as with the initial guy. I think that the issue is all about perceived freedom and independence and that it isn't so much about the particular guy that's involved. Don't blast me for that. I've listened in on conversations, read texts and emails and have found nothing that suggests a physical relationship.

She does have some problems but I think it is a midlife crisis thing where she feels like she's missing out on something. I am dealing with it now the best way I know how. I have an appointment with a lawyer and plan on filing for divorce. I told her that I wanted to get with her friend and have a conversation and she didn't freak out but just said that he wasn't the issue. I really don't know if he is the issue. I would like for him to be because then it would make more sense and I could really be pissed, but instead I am just confused. She said she just wants to be able to hang out at the pool with her friends as much as she wants, she wants to go dancing at clubs, she wants to stay out until 2 in the morning if she wants playing card games or whatever. She just doesn't want to be married.

Many of the replies seem like they are suggesting that I try to exact some sort of revenge to straighten her ass out. I would do it in a heartbeat if I thought it would change anything. I am fairly certain that if I do that we will come to the same end - divorce and the only difference would be that we would hate each other and feel anger and resentment towards each other for the foreseeable future. That doesn't seem like a positive environment for the kids if you ask me.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

It was different when you were there because they all knew what was going on. They repeated conversations to hide or to make you leave sooner.


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## Iver (Mar 8, 2013)

[Seether] 
_She said she just wants to be able to hang out at the pool with her friends as much as she wants, she wants to go dancing at clubs, she wants to stay out until 2 in the morning if she wants playing card games or whatever. She just doesn't want to be married._ 

She doesn't fully grasp the concept of working full time does she?

She does know she's not 18 on summer break and living with her parents? Because that's the life she's imagining she'll be living from what you've written.

The problem now is she's still in fantasy land that you are paying for. 

Can you describe how you both will fare financially once divorced? Does she know this?


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Seether said:


> Many of the replies seem like they are suggesting that I try to exact some sort of revenge to straighten her ass out.


Yes, you get a lot of that here.

Always consider the source. A lot of people on this board have been burned pretty badly and they seem to have a vendetta against all cheaters.

If you're filing for divorce most of the advice you're getting on this thread is worthless and it really doesn't matter what her relationship is with this guy. 

Get a divorce, keep things civil, and get her out of your life as quickly and as cheaply as possible.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Seether,

Do you ever get angry?
It is possible that a man and woman can have a deep emotional relationship without sex. A woman can really love a charming gay hairdresser who makes her laugh. But is that what you see? That your wife is fæghag?

If your wife is not having a sexual relationship with this guy, then the situation is also pathetic: she is so uninterested in you that a platonic relationship could replace you. 

Not only should divorce your wife, given the level of disrespect she has exhibited, but you should go into therapy to find out why you are unable to stand up for yourself.


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## justonelife (Jul 29, 2010)

This isn't about exacting revenge on her. It's about standing up for yourself, establishing some boundaries and demanding a certain level of respect from your wife. You have given her everything she wants with NO consequences. You are the only one being hurt here. Doesn't that make you angry?

If she doesn't want to be married, that's fine. File for divorce and tell her that she has 3 months to find a job because then you will be cutting off financial support. What are you hanging on for anyway?


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Seether said:


> I guess I can understand how she could have a close connection with another person. I am just confused about how it came to be more important than her primary relationship. A physical relationship seems like it would be a much deeper form of intimacy and *I could not imagine being intimate with her if I knew that she had been involved with that sort of situation*.


You could not imagine her having sex with somebody else. Why?

Many years ago I played tennis at a club and drank beer with the pros. There was a woman who managed the bookings. She was had a LTR with one of the pros. They were very open about it. Everybody knew what was going on.

The woman's husband used to come over and hang out. People didn't joke quite as much when he came around. He was a very meek guy. Did he know and accept it? Did he choose to be a cuckold. Was he gay? I could never figure it out. One time we all went over to her apartment with her husband. It was truly bizarre to me.

The OM did not flaunt his command over her affection. He was nice to the BH but with zero respect or fear. If the BS knew or learned of the situation he dared not speak up.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

LongWalk said:


> Seether,
> 
> Do you ever get angry?
> It is possible that a man and woman can have a deep emotional relationship without sex. A woman can really love a charming gay hairdresser who makes her laugh. But is that what you see? That your wife is fæghag?
> ...


:iagree::iagree: Child abuse and/or extreme low t


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Why don't you try hanging out with them more often. Does she make enough to live on there?

Do the kids stay with you at all?

How did you intimidate them? Does the om fear you at all?


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## Seether (Aug 21, 2013)

The kids stay with me for 7 days and then her for 7 days. Ok, i have had a lot of rocks thrown at me, but I want to do what I can. I want to stay married and have my wife back the way that she was. I am taking some of the advice that I have received in the forum. I have a few questions though.

I am meeting with the OM or "friend" today to discuss his role in our situation. I'm not sure what I hope to gain other than to let him know that he is the cause of another person's divorce or marital difficulties. It would be nice if he would withdraw at from her at that point, but I doubt that it will happen.

The reason I have any hope at all is that my wife came over last week and hugged me and told me how much she missed me and said that she was ready to end the relationship with the other man. We had lunch together and awesome sex. 

Three days went by where she didn't call or text and didn't have much to say when I called or texted. I met with her and said Hey what's the deal. I thought you were ready to move forward and leave the friend behind. She said "I'm sorry I shouldn't have said that". Then she said "I do want the divorce". She said she wanted to experience life as a single woman and to be independent and free. Although I am financing the independence! I have read that it could cause legal problems if I shut off all access to our account so I don't know that there's much that I can do on that front. She said "I need to be alone and I crave it like nothing else".

I looked through my emails and saw one from two weeks ago where she said that if we get back together she would only visit her friend on occasion. I told her that wont' work. It's all or nothing. The following week is the event that I explained earlier. I understand now that this is cake eating behavior.

So what now? Should I seek out a lawyer and move forward while doing a 180 to see if anything changes and then just follow through if it doesn't or should I hold off for a while? Anything else that might help me to fix the situation. I thought I might try to get the kids to ask to stay with me full time so that she will have even more lonely time to think about what she is doing. I don't know. I also ordered several of the books including the The Divorce Remedy. Im hoping it will offer some good advice.

Another suggestion is that I should just move back in. I really don't think that I can take the emotional beating that I get when she leaves all the time right in front of me to be with her friend. Also I have a lease on the other apartment that I can't get out of easily so that causes some difficulty. What difference is it likely to make in regards to getting her back if I move in or stay separated doing a 180? 

Oh an to answer another question that was asked earlier. I guessed the pw to her email account and had an opportunity to look through it. The only thing that really bothered me was that she forwarded an email that I sent her about emotional affairs to the "friend". It was about him so that really upset me because I know they had a conversation about it.

Ok, I am doing what I can to do this right. I know I have made mistakes like the hanging out and having sex last week and contacting her to try to discuss the inconsistencies with her. She told me that she'll make sure that there aren't any more inconsistencies and that she is now absolutely sure what she wants - to be divorced and single. I asked her what she wanted that for - if she wanted F*** other dudes. She said "maybe I don't know but I want to have the ability to make those decisions".

So that's where we are. I currently have an appointment with a lawyer this week and a counselor too. She says she will go me to counseling, because I need it to get over all of this. Yep she said that. She said that it wasn't for her, but she would explain her side to the counselor so that she (the counselor) could help me. If it had been last week she wouldn't have said that at all.

Thanks all for the advice. Keep it coming.


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## zookeeper (Oct 2, 2012)

It's over. Move on. She has left you with zero reason to think you will win her back. I'm not really sure why you would want to considering her complete disregard for you, your family and her marriage vows. I wouldn't.

One other thing. Stop referring to her boyfriend as he friend. He is her boyfriend. Other man, affair partner, POS, whatever. All accurate. Friend is not. You want to keep calling him her friend because you just don't want to face that they are having an affair. They are. You really think that just because you haven't found the smoking gun that the crime has not been committed? Get real. And get a lawyer. Maybe he can help you find your way out of the fog you're in. The longer you continue down this road of denial and willful blindness the greater the price will be.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## kezins (Aug 25, 2013)

Sorry you are going through that. I have ended up in relationships with women who seek out male "friends" and it's certainly a lesson I've learned. As soon as a woman starts seeking out male friends, it's time to cut her off. 

They'll try to get away with it at first with the whole there's nothing wrong with a man and married woman being friends and doing things together, but 99 out of a hundred times, it's total BS.

My wife started pulling this same thing last summer, so I told her she can do whatever she wants. I don't control people, but I certainly made sure she got a job, because I'm not fully financially supporting a woman who does these things. We pretty much live separated now. I have one floor of the house and she has the other. I guess at least I habe more money now and I'm not financing her activities.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Seether,

You need to become a man of few words. File for divorce. Hand your wife the papers and let your actions talk.

Cut off her money. She should have whatever child support would give her. Alimony is something you need to fight over. Cut off the economic life blood of her single life style.

Get your testosterone checked. Work out on weights. Lose weight is you are overweight. Cut way back alcohol consumption. Do you smoke? Now is a good time to quit.

Get a good haircut. Buy some nice clothes.


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## kezins (Aug 25, 2013)

zookeeper said:


> It's over. Move on. She has left you with zero reason to think you will win her back. I'm not really sure why you would want to considering her complete disregard for you, your family and her marriage vows. I wouldn't.
> 
> One other thing. Stop referring to her boyfriend as he friend. He is her boyfriend. Other man, affair partner, POS, whatever. All accurate. Friend is not. You want to keep calling him her friend because you just don't want to face that they are having an affair. They are. You really think that just because you haven't found the smoking gun that the crime has not been committed? Get real. And get a lawyer. Maybe he can help you find your way out of the fog you're in. The longer you continue down this road of denial and willful blindness the greater the price will be.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I agree. This doesn't sound like a friend....definitely a boyfriend. If she wants to do that sort of thing with a man who sleeps with married women, they'll both have karma coming their way in the future. I'd definitely suggest documenting the situation, because if it comes down to court one day, she'll deny everything and you'll be paying for her and the boyfriend to have fun in the future. 

If she's not working, I'd highly suggest getting her to work. If it comes down to divorce, you'll be paying out less money if she has a job that proves she can support herself.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

kezins said:


> Sorry you are going through that. I have ended up in relationships with women who seek out male "friends" and it's certainly a lesson I've learned. As soon as a woman starts seeking out male friends, it's time to cut her off.
> 
> They'll try to get away with it at first with the whole there's nothing wrong with a man and married woman being friends and doing things together, but 99 out of a hundred times, it's total BS.
> 
> My wife started pulling this same thing last summer, so I told her she can do whatever she wants. I don't control people, but I certainly made sure she got a job, because I'm not fully financially supporting a woman who does these things. We pretty much live separated now. I have one floor of the house and she has the other. I guess at least I habe more money now and I'm not financing her activities.


Do you have a thread?
Listen to Kezins


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Take half the money out of the acct. Open your own acct. Tell her no more money, get a job. A single working mom , somehow seems to have a different outlook on life.

If you can talk to the om without acting like a p"ssy go for it. Print off a page of cheaterville.com and show him where anyone that googles his name is going to find out what kind of man he really is.

Of course you get banned if you say what you would really do here.

If your kids are old enough, let them know what is going on and how the om and their mom are tearing up their family.

Jmho, is kids ten or older have a right to know who is screwing them. If they refuse to have anything to do with him or his kids, how can that hurt?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Are you paying the bills for both houses? Start cutting things off.


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## kezins (Aug 25, 2013)

LongWalk said:


> Do you have a thread?
> Listen to Kezins


I haven't made a thread on my situation yet, but I might. I actually got burnt big time in my first marriage, so I am definitely taking all kinds of steps to not get burnt this second time. 

I think I'm actually pretty decent marriage material for a guy, but I always make the mistake of jumping into relationships quickly before properly evaluating the person I'm with. 

If I end up divorced this time, I'm going to remain a bachelor until the end. It's too easy to get burnt in a marriage, especially with the family courts geared against males.


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## kezins (Aug 25, 2013)

Chaparral said:


> Take half the money out of the acct. Open your own acct. Tell her no more money, get a job. A single working mom , somehow seems to have a different outlook on life.
> 
> If you can talk to the om without acting like a p"ssy go for it. Print off a page of cheaterville.com and show him where anyone that googles his name is going to find out what kind of man he really is.
> 
> ...


The job part is key. It would be a mistake to turn the kids against her though. Kids of all ages are pretty smart. I wouldn't lie to them, but definitely wouldn't try to turn them on the mother either regardless of how scummy she is. That wouldn't turn out well.


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## Tron (Jan 31, 2013)

I am not sure what you mean by access to the accounts. At the very least you are entitled to your half of everything. Secure it in separate accounts and stop paying for her to go out and live the single life she is dreaming about. Cut her off! 

If she wants to be single then she is going to have live with everything that that entails, including getting a job and paying for her own living expenses. You are no longer her H. She fired you!

You haven't mentioned what state you live in, but if you are taking the kids 50/50 then most likely she will not be entitled to much if any CS. 

Do you have a lot of savings?


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

> I asked her what she wanted that for - if she wanted F*** other dudes. She said "maybe I don't know but I want to have the ability to make those decisions".


have you asked her if she had already ?

Seether, the details change a little here and there but this is a generic affair. She made you move out. She told you in a roundabout way that she is going to have sex with other people. She will probably justify in hindsight when you eventually find out. Your wife's affair is as routine as it comes.

Even if she is not having sex, she is going to in the near future. She wants all the advantages of being single with havin any responsibilities. That in itself is disgusting entitled behavior. If she wants to be single, let her take responsibility for herself. 

You have too much love and respect for her and it is clouding your view of her selfishness. Have you discussed her behavior with anyone else. ?

If you are worried about taking actions that might cause her to hate you, prepare to be taken advantage for the rest of your life. There is a difference between amicable agreeable divorce and being a doormat.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

On word about the OM. If he is ok with destroying the marriage or have an affair with your wife, he wouldn't bother too much about lying to you.


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## kezins (Aug 25, 2013)

warlock07 said:


> I asked her what she wanted that for - if she wanted F*** other dudes. She said "maybe I don't know but I want to have the ability to make those decisions".
> 
> have you asked her if she had already ?
> 
> ...


It's a classic case of someone who wants to balance out more than one relationship at a time in her favor. It's very manipulative and she will completely leave when it seems like an advantage to her. I'd say start taking steps now to look out for numero uno or she's going to burn you hardcore mentally and financially. 

At this point, you have to wake up and see her for what she is or you might be doing yourself extra damage in the future.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/going-...dragging-my-heart-around-329.html#post3836898

read that post. another BS posted it. not trying to advocate violence but try to get what he meant...


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Chaparral said:


> If your kids are old enough, let them know what is going on and how the om and their mom are tearing up their family.
> 
> Jmho, is kids ten or older have a right to know who is screwing them. If they refuse to have anything to do with him or his kids, how can that hurt?


I think the children should be left out of their parents divorce as much as possible. To use them as pawns in a battle will only hurt them. In so many ways.

The divorce will be tough enough, the emotional scars from pitting one parent against the other will be far worse.

Yes we know mom is the bad guy, she's still their mom and they still need her in their lives.

This does not necessarily apply in the case of an abusive, neglectful, drug addicted parent but that does not seem to be the case here.



kezins said:


> I wouldn't lie to them, but definitely wouldn't try to turn them on the mother either regardless of how scummy she is. That wouldn't turn out well.


This.

Bad wife does not equal bad mother.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

lenzi said:


> Bad wife does not equal bad mother.


There is definitely a correlation.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Conrad said:


> There is definitely a correlation.


Sure, some cheating wives are checked out of being a wife and being a mother as a sort of package deal, and/or are so wrapped up in the affair they don't care about anything else; but others love their kids and will do anything for them and don't show them any neglect, as far as the kids are concerned they treat them the same way they always have, however, they've just checked out of the marriage and want nothing to do with hubby.

A woman I know cheated on her husband. She lives with her affair partner who has a child of his own. She's got two kids, she's a wonderful parent, but their father rarely sees them or has much to do with them at all.


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## wilderness (Jan 9, 2013)

lenzi said:


> Sure, some cheating wives are checked out of being a wife and being a mother as a sort of package deal, and/or are so wrapped up in the affair they don't care about anything else; but others love their kids and will do anything for them and don't show them any neglect, as far as the kids are concerned they treat them the same way they always have, however, they've just checked out of the marriage and want nothing to do with hubby.
> 
> A woman I know cheated on her husband. She lives with her affair partner who has a child of his own. She's got two kids, she's a wonderful parent, but their father rarely sees them or has much to do with them at all.


I usually really like your posts; and I respect your opinion, but you are totally wrong on this one. It is the epitome of bad parenting to have an affair. It sets a horrible example and it harms the children. In my opinion anyone involved in an affair should lose custody, that's how serious it is.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

Ok I can be wrong.


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## Iver (Mar 8, 2013)

I have a feeling things are not so bueno on the home front for Seether...


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Iver said:


> I have a feeling things are not so bueno on the home front for Seether...


SIGH could see that coming


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## Seether (Aug 21, 2013)

Update-

A lot has happened since I last posted.

I met with the OM. It seems that he and my wife connected emotionally because he was coming out of a divorce and confided in her. They now have a very strong "friendship, but that is all". I have spoken with him since and he agreed to remove himself from the situation. I later found out from my kids that she has been spending as much time as ever with him.

I have read No More Mr. Nice Guy and The Divorce Remedy. They are both good reads. I will say that The Divorce Remedy may have confused the situation a bit as it suggests hanging on and acting as though I am just dandy until she comes around. I cancelled the lawyer appointment for the moment.

My kids both broke down to the wife. My son has become angry and had a conversation / argument with my wife. My daughter broke down in tears and said that she feels like her mom is no longer the same person and that she doesn't know what to do. They both tell me that she is rarely at home. I am trying to help them both cope as well as I can and am going to talk with the a counselor about them this week. I told them that they are old enough that they can probably choose to live with me full time if they like as I will always be there for them.

The kids softened my wife a bit. She had a talk with me yesterday and said that she is willing to work on things, but that she is not ready to move in with me or to spend much time with me or to stay over. She agreed to watch a movie with me and the kids. She left very early though and the kids said that she was probably leaving to meet with the OM and friends at the apartment pool as it did not close for a few more hours.

At this point, I am pretty clear on what is going on. She is involved in a relationship that includes the OM and a couple of other women friends. She spends every free moment with these two or three people. I don't think she is involved in a sexual relationship but it is definitely an emotional affair. She is still very much in the fog. She says she is willing to work on things. My daughter told me that she may have only said that because she broke down to her. So far, other than watching a part of a movie with us, I have not seen anything that would indicate that she truly wants to work on things.

I am thinking that I will wait a couple of weeks to see how things go down and then file for D if necessary. I now feel like I have a good read on the situation, but I don't know if she can see her way out of the fog and I don't know if she can ever be the person that she once was.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Keep a journal of where your wife is spending her time. Ask your kids to help out, they are old enough. When you file go for full custody, if only as a bargaining point, and demand child support.

If I can remember correctly, she doesn't work. Have you cut funds to a minimum?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Btw, hoping your wife gets her act together before she loses whats really important. 

Have you discussed this with her family?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Since her OM outright lied to you, I would confront the Homewrecker trio in a more direct way. There is more than likely more than you know. You should var the home to see what you can find.

I would also see if you could get the kids to start spending more and more time at your place.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

kezins said:


> The job part is key. It would be a mistake to turn the kids against her though. Kids of all ages are pretty smart. I wouldn't lie to them, but definitely wouldn't try to turn them on the mother either regardless of how scummy she is. That wouldn't turn out well.


He is not turning the kids against her, she is doing that all by herself. In addition, anything he can do to save his family is fair in my opinion. He is in a battle with a Posom, no holds barred, no prisoners taken.


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## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

Seether said:


> *I now feel like I have a good read on the situation,* but I don't know if she can see her way out of the fog and I don't know if she can ever be the person that she once was.


You are still seeing what you want to see.


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## Iver (Mar 8, 2013)

I think you should drop by one night to see where you wife is spending the night - I don't believe she and the OM are "just friends" 

Sorry but every time that story has been told to a husband here it turns out to be a PA.

VAR your house; ask to see her text messages - or if possible pull them from her plan if it is in your name. 

The fact the OM lied to you is very telling.


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## barbados (Aug 30, 2012)

The absolute worse thing you could do is cancel the attorney meeting. You need to get D papers drawn up ASAP and have her served. You are enabling her to continue her affair. In fact, you are making it laughingly easy for her. And you are in complete denial that she is having a full blown sexual relationship with this man.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Seether said:


> Update-
> 
> A lot has happened since I last posted.
> 
> ...



If anything, you will regret being gullible when you find out the truth and the damage it did to your kids. The kids breaking down is not normal. maybe they know something more than what they told you and are caught up between betraying their father or mother. 

Your rigidness in assessing your situation is going to hurt you and your kids....Take some input from some one you trust in real life, Or hire a PI FFS. That you still mention that you believe there is no PA only proves that you are not fully detached from the situation as you claim to be.

Your wife affair is not unique. It looks like every other affair I've read on the site. Even to the details pertain the OM. DevastatedDad, read his thread. He confronted the guy who was sexting his wife and this OM begged and cried. He thanked him for not outing him to his wife. And resumed the affair after a couple of months. If they are having sex behind your back, why would they have issues with lying to you ? 

The only thing unique is how how headstrong you are in denial. Please take the advice of some of the posts in this thread. Your wife is taking advantage of your belief in her.


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## barbados (Aug 30, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> If anything, you will regret being gullible when you find out the truth and the damage it did to your kids. The kids breaking down is not normal. maybe they know something more than what they told you and are caught up between betraying their father or mother.
> 
> Your rigidness in assessing your situation is going to hurt you and your kids....Take some input from some one you trust in real life, Or hire a PI FFS. That you still mention that you believe there is no PA only proves that you are not fully detached from the situation as you claim to be.
> 
> ...


:iagree: Warlock has summed up the situation perfectly. I hope your not only reading it, but PROCESSING IT!


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## ferndog (Dec 2, 2011)

she is no longer respecting you as her husband. u need to sit her down and lay some rules down if she wants to save the marriage. if not then u have to do the next thing. 

Let Them Walk - Bishop T.D. Jakes - YouTube


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

Seether said:


> ... I cancelled the lawyer appointment for the moment....I have not seen anything that would indicate that she truly wants to work on things....I am thinking that I will wait a couple of weeks to see how things go down and then file for D if necessary. *I now feel like I have a good read on the situation*....


Doesn't sound like you can read too well at all. Take some control and file. What exactly are you waiting for?


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

Seether said:


> I have read No More Mr. Nice Guy and The Divorce Remedy. They are both good reads. I will say that The Divorce Remedy may have confused the situation a bit as it suggests hanging on and acting as though I am just dandy until she comes around. *I cancelled the lawyer appointment for the moment.*


I am going to be harsh.

Do you really enjoy being cuckolded? I think your lack of self-respect could be the reason your wife so easily moved on to her lover.

Your kids are teenagers, for goodness sake. They can take care of themselves. They better be able to handle life situations like this. What type of example are you setting for them?

Your wife treat you like sh!t and you retreat and retreat. She has lost respect for you. Why should she stay with someone she cant respect?

Learn to detach. Go out and meet other women. Go out and exercise. Build muscles. Join a yoga class - lots of women there. Take ballroom dancing.

Move on, move on. You have a limited time on earth. Stop wasting it on an unfaithful wife.


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## Iver (Mar 8, 2013)

One day, when the kids are staying with you get in your car and go over to your old apartment say ~ 11 pm and let yourself in. See if your wife is there or not. Put a VAR somewhere. 

The idea you have that this is not a sexual relationship with the OM is frankly a stretch. Even if you are correct how much more of this will you tolerate? 

Lay the law down with her and file for divorce. Demand that she get a job immediately, even if its working as a janitor at night. That should hopefully cool her jets. (what is she qualified to do workwise?)

It's time for you to make her to realize the party is ending. (the one you have been paying for by the way)

If you haven't done so you really need to read Athol Kay's MMSL.


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## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

This is a classic A where the WW fashions a new and exciting life for herself & the BH and children are just pests to be tolerated.

Anyone who wants to argue that OP's WW can do what she is doing and still be a good mother can go ahead and do that, but I will shout them down. Her behavior and decent mothering are mutually exclusive.

Take care of yourself and your kids, OP.

If you are still freely financing her entitled life, consult your lawyer about how much you can brake the flow of funds. Certainly, if she is accessing anything that is in your name only, cut that off.

You need to start getting on with business.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

warlock07 said:


> The only thing unique is how how headstrong you are in denial. Please take the advice of some of the posts in this thread. Your wife is taking advantage of your belief in her.


Actually, that's not all that unique.

Yet, the duration does give pause.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Just seeing this thread. I will comment here and then read the rest.



Seether said:


> ....
> 
> Several months ago (almost a year now), we moved to an apartment complex while we were searching for a home in a new area. It was during this time that she began a friendship with a man. She talked about the friendship very openly and I did not discourage it.
> 
> ...


Move. Then divorce.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Seether said:


> Of course not. I would react very differently if I believed this to be a physical relationship. Is it wrong to put myself in her shoes and to consider how it might be to not have any close friends for years? I will deal with it and divorce is a definite possibility, but in my opinion one should not throw away a long term relationship because the other makes a dad decision. I had really hoped that there might be others that had a similar situation with a "friend" causing so many problems. I almost with that I had posted that it was a female so that the assumption would not automatically be that there is a physical relationship. That would change the dynamic and the assumptions wouldn't it?


Still catching up. Ok so this post transitions to the OP defending the behaviors. We see this a lot. Even though the house is burning to the ground that say they are just trying to take the chill off.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

It is difficult to believe that your wife is not having a sexual relationship with this man. Moreover, she has convinced him that you a such a softy that he can bluff his way past you to allow them to continue the affair without a meltdown.

Sorry to be so pessimistic. Seether, you are able to convey your dignity and moral sensibility. This will often serve you well in life since. However when dealing with dishonest people who assume the best about others, honesty and good faith may not be the best policy.

re: cheating wives good mothers or not
No doubt, all things considered cheating wives are worse mothers. They need not always be failures as mothers; that is too categorical. In the case of your family, your children's anxiety is an enormous clue that your wife if failing them as a mother. They see the effects of her affair.

Pay attention to your children's perception. They are crying out for you to act. File for divorce asap. Cut off your wife's money if you can.

If she shows remorse and comes round, you can always rebuild a new marriage. That reconciliation vibe doesn't come through at all.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

I am amazed that this started on here anyway 8/20 and he moved out very soon after and got into another apartment and had a visitation schedule set up. 

I am late to this of course, but why he did not move the wife and children to another apartment I do not know. I would not have agreed to a visitation schedule and enable her affair with the other guy. I would have closed out the old apartment as much as possible. I would not have paid for anything that did not support the move. I could care less what the law mught saw down the road. You protect your family at all costs.

But this went down very quickly. It went from months of issues to him moving out. 

I would never cordially talk to the OM. You do not beg another man to stop stealing your wife. That is uber weak and enabling. 

So he is back in limbo it seems. She has her space for the affair and can settle in now. He is still funding her affair. The kids are involved with this.

Any discussion of sex or not sex is absurd at this point. Even more so now since he has moved out.

Instigation
Isolation
Escalation

Him moving out allowed her even more isolation. She wanted him to go. He did nothing to hold her accountable. I am not bashing ... I am assessing here. Nothing has been done to encourage her to stop the affair. It has all worked to enable it. In fact him taking the kids will allow the couple to have even more time and fun together.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Built in babysitter for her & posOM.


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

Entropy3000 said:


> ... Nothing has been done to encourage her to stop the affair. It has all worked to enable it. ....


Exactly. Husband is a huge enabler.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

And he is paying all the bills.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Chaparral said:


> And he is paying all the bills.


Paying her to leave him.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

So rather than just me being ... critical. My point is that he has needed for a very long time to stop enabling her. He still is.


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

Entropy3000 said:


> So rather than just me being ... critical. My point is that he has needed for a very long time to stop enabling her. He still is.


People do what they want to do.

He doesn't want to get her upset.

His words.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Conrad said:


> People do what they want to do.
> 
> He doesn't want to get her upset.
> 
> His words.


You are correct. It is his choice. Fear to act.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Entropy3000 said:


> So rather than just me being ... critical. My point is that he has needed for a very long time to stop enabling her. He still is.


Yes, yes, yes, ...............but he won't listen. Like so many others that come through here............... . . . . . . . . .then we get the wish I had listened lament. Should, coulda , woulda.


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## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

I think OP has left the building....


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## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

ThreeStrikes said:


> I think OP has left the building....


Under hostile fire


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