# Friends with an OW?



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

*This is a long one!* 

Hello, everyone! This is my first post (I've lurked on here, however) and I appreciate any insight. I'm pretty sure of my decision, but outside advice wouldn't hurt either. Also, if this is in the wrong forum or a repeat of other threads, I'm sorry!

I was a BS and left my then-fiancé a few months shy of our wedding. I thank God I did, as I'm still young (in my 20's) and have a lot of life ahead of me.

I have a "friend," who I'll call 'K' for the sake of this post. I've known her for a good deal of time. She's very fun to hang out with, we share lots of things in common, and we've always enjoyed each other's company. She doesn't have many girlfriends so we've gotten close (she's told me I'm like a sister to her).

Here's my issue: K had been talking about a guy who she is involved with that she really adores and is in love with. They have been going out for around 6+ months, and I have never met him. She would tell me all about their love life, their dates and what not, but all I really found out about him was his first name. I thought it was weird, since we were friends, that she didn't tell me anything else about him. Like I said, nothing more than his name.

Then, after me continuously trying for more details about this mystery guy, she finally told me that he was married! Obviously, as you'd guess, I was shocked and disappointed. Of all people, I never expected her to be an OW. After all, she was there for me when my ex cheated and pretty much witness all of the crap he and the (crazy) OW put me through. 

As soon as she told me that, I advised her to end the relationship, for a number of reasons that I'm sure y'all can come up with. She went into hyper-defensive mode, which I guess I should've expected, and fed me all the lines that 'he wasn't happy with his wife, blah blah' and said she loved him and wouldn't leave him, that they were soul mates, I wouldn't understand (darn right, not my thing) and so on.

Like I said, I keep telling her that having that relationship is wrong (in my eyes, at least) and is only headed toward a fiery collision and that it was best to end it but she won't budge. I've even tried hooking her up with single men, yet she refuses. 

At this point, I am slowly cutting off contact with her. I know she senses this and is asking me why. I've told her that I don't approve of her relationship, and while I understand that I have no control over what she does, I don't want to be in any kind of friendship with someone like her (an OW). 

She thinks that I'm not being a good friend to her/supportive, and that I should suck up my feelings to be there for her. Thing is, I can't, especially after my experience as a BS. She of all people, had seen what I went through, and for her to become the OW and ask me to support her relationship was a slap in the face. 

We've had a great friendship/history together, and I'm kind of sad that it's all going to be thrown away because she is being so destructive to herself as an OW and to the BS & WS's family. I can't see myself friends with her if she continues like this (and she's made it clear that that's her plan), but at the same time, I'm sure I'll miss her and the fun we've had.

I guess, really, I'm looking for reassurance that I'm making the right choice by ending our friendship. She doesn't have very many girlfriends, so if/when sh*t hits the fan, should I reach out to her? 

Blah, I don't even know why I'm entertaining the thought of being friend's with an OW, especially after my own experience.

Would any of you (BS's) ever be friends with one?

Thanks for any help!

(I'm sorry if this was hard to follow/too long, I'm not too good at relaying information)

- Hotsthrnmess


----------



## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

You are definitely doing the right thing. But let her know why --- essentially what you've just written. That because you yourself experienced the pain of infidelity that you can in no way support it in any form. Remind her of how she supported you. Though she may not want to hear it, also tell her she may be being played by the WS. It's very likely his wife is clueless and he's just taking advantage of your friend. Tell her that if the relationship doesn't work out (when it doesn't) that you will be there not to say "I told you so" but to be her friend and encourage her towards taking the right steps towards healing and never doing it again. (Or whatever your words are.) But let her know that when the mierd_ hits the fan you'll be there for her......Hopefully she'll learn from it. 

Geez....this exact thing happened with my sister. Her best friend helped her catch her husband right in the beginning of an affair....and then her bf ended up doing the same thing. My sister told her that she was going to get burned, spurned, etc and that there was no way for it to work out well. She reminded her that she (her bf) had helped her bust open her husband's blooming affair, and it stopped it. Sure enough my sister's bf lost her sterling reputation all for a pipe dream. The OM went back to his wife and my sister's bf is alone and suffering from social ostracization. Very sad. 

Again, you're doing the right thing.


----------



## adv (Feb 26, 2011)

If your friends actions don't mesh with you boundaries and standards, and as a betrayed woman yourself it doesn't sound like she does, then I think you're making the right decision to drop her as a friend. Whether she will admit it or not, she knows what she's doing wrong yet she does it anyway for her own selfish reasons.

What if in the future, you find someone else you love and want to create a life with and she decides she is also "soul mates" (how I hate that phrase) with him?

In short, she's not trustworthy so dump the friend.


----------



## KanDo (Jun 15, 2011)

Cut this person out of your life.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

Thank you for the answers so far! This was probably a dumb question to ask, anyway, kind of a no-brainer? Oh well, but I honestly know she needs to go and having your outside advice/opinions helps.


----------



## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

If she came to you and confessed to being a meth-head and expected you to support her would you? Give her that analogy. Tell her both are destructive activities. The meth-head thinks meth is the best thing in the world and enhances experiences. You would do all in your power to get her off the meth pipe. But if she refused you would not remain friends

. Because friends don't automatically support whatever the other person wants. A real friend looks out for the best interest and doesn't blindly support any and all activities. 

Tell her you'll welcome her back when she gets her head together. Tell her your last piece of advice as 'a friend' is that cheaters rarely change so you'll be there when he cheats on her - but not before. 

Find a better class of friend.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

adv said:


> If your friends actions don't mesh with you boundaries and standards, and as a betrayed woman yourself it doesn't sound like she does, then I think you're making the right decision to drop her as a friend. Whether she will admit it or not, she knows what she's doing wrong yet she does it anyway for her own selfish reasons.
> 
> What if in the future, you find someone else you love and want to create a life with and she decides she is also "soul mates" (how I hate that phrase) with him?
> 
> In short, she's not trustworthy so dump the friend.


Hopefully, I'm replying to you ADV, but you're exactly right. It's funny when you have to hear an outside person tell you the exact same thing you've told yourself in order for it to sink in, in a way.

Her actions definitely don't mesh with mine, so on that basis alone, I should let her go. I just almost feel bad (I don't know any other word to describe it) because like I said, she has no other close girlfriends to talk to and when this all falls apart, and I know it will, she won't have anyone left (I doubt anyone else would approve).

Also, bingo! Not trustworthy at all!


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

thesunwillcomeout said:


> You are definitely doing the right thing. But let her know why --- essentially what you've just written. That because you yourself experienced the pain of infidelity that you can in no way support it in any form. Remind her of how she supported you. Though she may not want to hear it, also tell her she may be being played by the WS. It's very likely his wife is clueless and he's just taking advantage of your friend. Tell her that if the relationship doesn't work out (when it doesn't) that you will be there not to say "I told you so" but to be her friend and encourage her towards taking the right steps towards healing and never doing it again. (Or whatever your words are.) But let her know that when the mierd_ hits the fan you'll be there for her......Hopefully she'll learn from it.
> 
> Geez....this exact thing happened with my sister. Her best friend helped her catch her husband right in the beginning of an affair....and then her bf ended up doing the same thing. My sister told her that she was going to get burned, spurned, etc and that there was no way for it to work out well. She reminded her that she (her bf) had helped her bust open her husband's blooming affair, and it stopped it. Sure enough my sister's bf lost her sterling reputation all for a pipe dream. The OM went back to his wife and my sister's bf is alone and suffering from social ostracization. Very sad.
> 
> Again, you're doing the right thing.


Thank you for your advice, thesunwillcomeout! (I love your name, btw) I'm sorry this all happened to your sister! Hopefully she's doing much better 

But yeah, I just need to let her go right now, and if she falls, I can say I tried. There's only so much I can tolerate, and this is definitely it. Hopefully by the time this is over, and she's realized the mess she's made and has learned from it, I can be in a place where I'll welcome her back as a friend. I don't know though, because I would always wonder if I could trust her, ya know? 

But it is definitely time for me to let her go.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

KanDo said:


> Cut this person out of your life.


Thank you, I will be doing that


----------



## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Tell her why you are cutting her off and ask her to think a bit on why you would do it to someone as close as her.

And you will welcome her back once she ends it.


----------



## MrMathias (Nov 19, 2012)

You're clearly a good friend, don't worry about that at all. You know from personal experience that she's heading down a terrible path, and you tried to stop her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

walkonmars said:


> If she came to you and confessed to being a meth-head and expected you to support her would you? Give her that analogy. Tell her both are destructive activities. The meth-head thinks meth is the best thing in the world and enhances experiences. You would do all in your power to get her off the meth pipe. But if she refused you would not remain friends
> 
> . Because friends don't automatically support whatever the other person wants. A real friend looks out for the best interest and doesn't blindly support any and all activities.
> 
> ...


Thanks, I liked the analogy, makes sense and can probably help her understand where I'm coming from.

Btw, she's the only friend that is like that. All of my other girlfriends are great and I couldn't see them being like this!


----------



## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

We are validly judged by the company we choose to keep. Your so called friend is not a person of integrity or one with high morals. She wants you to accept her choosing to be the OW because it validates her low morals.

You are doing the right thing.

I would advise you try to find who the OM is and expose it to his wife. She has amoral right to know.


----------



## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

hotsthrnmess said:


> Thanks, I liked the analogy, makes sense and can probably help her understand where I'm coming from.
> 
> Btw, she's the only friend that is like that. All of my other girlfriends are great and I couldn't see them being like this!


You won't ever succeed in convincing her that she is doing something wrong and immortal. That would be her accepting she is making bad choices.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> We are validly judged by the company we choose to keep. Your so called friend is not a person of integrity or one with high morals. She wants you to accept her choosing to be the OW because it validates her low morals.
> 
> You are doing the right thing.
> 
> I would advise you try to find who the OM is and expose it to his wife. She has amoral right to know.


Thanks, and I agree, I think the OM's wife deserves to know the truth. If I find out any more information and am able to relay it to her, I will.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

DrMathias said:


> You're clearly a good friend, don't worry about that at all. You know from personal experience that she's heading down a terrible path, and you tried to stop her.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thank you. It's hard not to worry about her however I am realizing that I am a good friend, and have been so to her. I've tried to get her out of this situation (although too far in), but if she doesn't want it, I can't stop her.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> Tell her why you are cutting her off and ask her to think a bit on why you would do it to someone as close as her.
> 
> And you will welcome her back once she ends it.


Thing is, I have tried to tell her. Even though I was a BS, I've let her know that what she is doing will not only hurt the BS & family in her situation, but hurt herself as well and she won't listen. Ah, so frustrating!


----------



## survivorwife (May 15, 2012)

hotsthrnmess said:


> Thing is, I have tried to tell her. Even though I was a BS, I've let her know that what she is doing will not only hurt the BS & family in her situation, but hurt herself as well and she won't listen. Ah, so frustrating!


Therein lies your problem. She won't listen. She isn't the friend (to you) that you thought she was.

I am (or was) friends with an OW. Her story is a bit different from yours in that her OM is single (divorced) but living with a woman who he claims it is all but over. The couple fights alot (or so he claims). She then leaves him and visits with her family on weekends (thus leaving the APs together, etc.) and my friend knew this man back when they both were children, as they were neighbors, They had a "history".

The difference between your story and mine is that my friend did in fact listen to me. She acknowledged (finally) that he was cheater, and he was cheating on the woman who he was living with. How does that make her feel? Second best, perhaps? Booty call and nothing more? Where was this headed? Has the girlfriend left yet? No? Is she willing to be at his beck and call behind this woman who lives with him that she knows nothing about?

Finally, she saw the light. She didn't like being the OW. Second best. Booty call. He won't even take her out to dinner. Be seen in public with her. Call her (or she call him) when the urge comes upon either of them. This was their life and it is over because she finally realizes how degrading being an OW can be. Can you friend face that same reality?

If your friend can have that sort of conversation and still remain an OW, then you really don't need someone like in your life. She is no friend. However, if you can drag her out of the fog and let her see the light of day again, it will be nice to know that you have a friend that listens.

Either way, good luck to you.


----------



## alte Dame (Aug 7, 2012)

This has happened to me three times in my life, each one with a different outcome:

First - A good friend, newly divorced, gleefully told me that she was planning to meet an old bf on his next business trip and sleep with him. They'd been flirting on fb. He had a W and 2 small children. I read her the riot act, asking her how she felt to know that her xH had been with other women. She came back to me a few days later & proudly reported that she had called it off.

Second - A friend flirted for years with a married man, telling me that his marriage was in name only. Finally they started an affair & she fell madly in love. It's clear he'll never leave his W & my friend became miserable. I regularly read her a much softer riot act & she finally got the strength to break it off. I don't think my advice was decisive, but she definitely listened.

Third - One of my closest, dearest friends is a wonderful person and is very lonely. She connected with an old love & they started an affair. His W is very sick and hasn't been able to be a real W to him, so my friend tells herself that it's not so terrible (???). I told her as well that I believe his W would be crushed and she shouldn't want to be a party to that. She's still with him. I said what I needed to.

For me, it's never a question of whether you should be supportive of a friend who is doing this. It's really a question of whether you inform the OW. This issue can be incredibly hard. In the first and second cases I probably would have done it. In the third, I simply can't bring myself to tell her.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

survivorwife said:


> Therein lies your problem. She won't listen. She isn't the friend (to you) that you thought she was.
> 
> I am (or was) friends with an OW. Her story is a bit different from yours in that her OM is single (divorced) but living with a woman who he claims it is all but over. The couple fights alot (or so he claims). She then leaves him and visits with her family on weekends (thus leaving the APs together, etc.) and my friend knew this man back when they both were children, as they were neighbors, They had a "history".
> 
> ...


Thank you for sharing your story, survivorwife.

I'm wondering if my friend can face the same reality. As of right now, it doesn't appear so. I have tried talking to her, and wonder if its worth it anymore. I would hate to see her life (as well as the BS in their case) spiral downward and end terribly, but I have to remind myself that she's consciously choosing her role and what happens to her is her choice. 

I really appreciate the advice, thank you.


----------



## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

hotsthrnmess said:


> Thank you for your advice, thesunwillcomeout! (I love your name, btw) I'm sorry this all happened to your sister! Hopefully she's doing much better
> 
> But yeah, I just need to let her go right now, and if she falls, I can say I tried. There's only so much I can tolerate, and this is definitely it. Hopefully by the time this is over, and she's realized the mess she's made and has learned from it, I can be in a place where I'll welcome her back as a friend. I don't know though, because I would always wonder if I could trust her, ya know?
> 
> But it is definitely time for me to let her go.


Sorry -- when I wrote that I didn't realize how I was coming across. Not until I read your comment. In no way did I mean that you should be friends with her while she's in this affair, or even after, if she's just spurned but hasn't had a huge remorseful life change! I think it's good to lay the hard words on her and to be very clear before you cut off the friendship (which I think you have done, no?) 

The only reason I said "let her know when the bs hits the fan you'll be there for her" was to say -- that if she hits bottom. It all comes crashing down and she comes to her senses and she has no one and she is truly, truly remorseful and needs a friend and you feel you can be that person, then it would be a redeeming gesture. BUT that's not a role for everyone and if you need to cut out the toxic completely and forever, then do it. In my sister's case, when her friend (who she did cut off) completely hit the skids, my sister was there when no one else would be. She had the cojones to tell her that what she was doing was very wrong and then when the affair was over she had compassion and was a friend to her. (I'm not sure I could do it -- I would hope.) My sister's friend is essentially starting over (payback) and has come to her senses. She realizes now she was in a fantasy and blew her sense of right and wrong for a lie. But not everybody comes around like that. 

And my sister is doing well, thx. She caught it right before it turned PA. Funny because we both now have experienced the same thing....and we're twins. Odd. 

You're gonna feel so relieved to disengage.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

thesunwillcomeout said:


> Sorry -- when I wrote that I didn't realize how I was coming across. Not until I read your comment. In no way did I mean that you should be friends with her while she's in this affair, or even after, if she's just spurned but hasn't had a huge remorseful life change! I think it's good to lay the hard words on her and to be very clear before you cut off the friendship (which I think you have done, no?)
> 
> The only reason I said "let her know when the bs hits the fan you'll be there for her" was to say -- that if she hits bottom. It all comes crashing down and she comes to her senses and she has no one and she is truly, truly remorseful and needs a friend and you feel you can be that person, then it would be a redeeming gesture. BUT that's not a role for everyone and if you need to cut out the toxic completely and forever, then do it. In my sister's case, when her friend (who she did cut off) completely hit the skids, my sister was there when no one else would be. She had the cojones to tell her that what she was doing was very wrong and then when the affair was over she had compassion and was a friend to her. (I'm not sure I could do it -- I would hope.) My sister's friend is essentially starting over (payback) and has come to her senses. She realizes now she was in a fantasy and blew her sense of right and wrong for a lie. But not everybody comes around like that.
> 
> ...


No, I completely get where you're coming from and I really appreciate the help! I hate this position I'm in but I will be talking to her soon, one last time, at least temporarily, to see where she's at. After that, and if she's unapologetically continues to be an OW, I can say I've tried and I'm done. 

Also, I'm glad to hear your sister is doing well! Y'all are very strong ladies to both go through such crap.


----------



## thesunwillcomeout (Jun 25, 2012)

hotsthrnmess said:


> No, I completely get where you're coming from and I really appreciate the help! I hate this position I'm in but I will be talking to her soon, one last time, at least temporarily, to see where she's at. After that, and if she's unapologetically continues to be an OW, I can say I've tried and I'm done.
> 
> Also, I'm glad to hear your sister is doing well! Y'all are very strong ladies to both go through such crap.


I'm so sorry you're having to deal with it as a FBS. Last thing you need!

Btw love your name too. Cracks me up!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Laurelindoren (Dec 3, 2012)

You should probably tell her that most men who cheat usually end up going back to their wives. 

I'll use my husband as an example. I read one of the online conversations and he was promising her a house out of the country he told her he loved her. As soon as I found out he dropped her like a rock. I didn't even ask him to break it off because at that point I was set on getting a divorce. He told her I found out and he loved me and he never wanted to talk to her again. 

In a way I can understand taking the risk if you don't think the married man is in love with you, but so many of these OWs think that the man is in love with them and they're going to leave their wives and give them the world. The fact is that usually doesn't happen. They're being used. 

Even if the man does leave his wife the odds that the relationship will last are highly stacked against the relationship working out.


----------



## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

hotsthrnmess said:


> *This is a long one!*
> 
> Hello, everyone! This is my first post (I've lurked on here, however) and I appreciate any insight. I'm pretty sure of my decision, but outside advice wouldn't hurt either. Also, if this is in the wrong forum or a repeat of other threads, I'm sorry!
> 
> ...


I don't have time to read all the responses. 

But, yes, I think you did the right thing. She is likely a huge trigger for you being a BS and also, how could you ever trust her around a new boyfriend. It is very common for a woman to go after her friend's husband in the infidelity arena. 

Yes, you absolutely did the right thing, and the fact that she doesn't understand your pain given you are a BS and she knows that, scares me.


----------



## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

hotsthrnmess said:


> because like I said, she has no other close girlfriends to talk to and when this all falls apart, and I know it will, she won't have anyone left (I doubt anyone else would approve).
> 
> Also, bingo! Not trustworthy at all!


Uhm, do you have any inkling why she may have no other close girlfriends? 

Some savvy women are good a pegging a women who would have no qualms about labeling their spouse or significant other as their soulmate, and cheating with their best friends mate. 

Your friend sounds like this type of women. Being a BS already, which means you were likely not the suspicious, jealous, controlling type of person, you may be vulnerable to this women's mind games because you are not the suspicious type.

Run.


----------



## C-man (Oct 23, 2012)

As difficult as it is, you are doing the right thing. Just make sure to explain to your friends why. Your values are important and your friend should also be sensitive to your history. She can't see this because she is in her own affair fog - and acting selfishly, while fooling herself that she is doing this for the OM. She needs to understand the consequences of what she is doing. She needs to understand how destructive her relationship is, and how it has very low odds of surviving.

Your friend is on a path that has very few happy conclusions, for her, for the OM, for the OM's wife and family. Again, you are doing the right thing.


----------



## Calibre12 (Nov 27, 2012)

hotsthrnmess said:


> Hopefully, I'm replying to you ADV, but you're exactly right. It's funny when you have to hear an outside person tell you the exact same thing you've told yourself in order for it to sink in, in a way.
> 
> Her actions definitely don't mesh with mine, so on that basis alone, I should let her go. I just almost feel bad (I don't know any other word to describe it) because like I said, she has no other close girlfriends to talk to and when this all falls apart, and I know it will, she won't have anyone left (I doubt anyone else would approve).
> 
> Also, bingo! Not trustworthy at all!


:iagree: Let her go since you have opposing self-esteem & value systems. She will reach out to you when lesson learned. Then, if she repeats her mistake or plans to, you will know she is serial. You can then decide to cut her off permanently. Too, I notice that about mistresses, they have few friends, many acquaintances...because they keep themselves in reserve for the married man. In a way you are being used as a "filler" friend (something to do) when he is busy with his wife and children because in her own mind she is being "faithful" to him by hanging out with a "safe-y" named you. That's why you met him, so she can reassure him that you are not another man. I seems mistresses get off on a high from perceiving that they are most valuable because a married man is "placing them above his wife and children". I dare say, married men cheat because they have the opportunity to do so with women who have low-self esteem.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

remorseful strayer said:


> Uhm, do you have any inkling why she may have no other close girlfriends?
> 
> Some savvy women are good a pegging a women who would have no qualms about labeling their spouse or significant other as their soulmate, and cheating with their best friends mate.
> 
> ...


No, I did not have any inkling. Like I said, she was by all means, a great friend and I loved hanging out with her. I didn't know she was an OW, so I didn't have that piece of info as a possibility as to why. I have no clue if she's a repeat OW which could explain it. All I can say, is that she was a bit flirty with guys when we'd go out. But yeah, I didn't know why. 

Oh, I'm not vulnerable to her mind games. I haven't tolerated her excuses at all, because that's what they are, excuses. I haven't entertained her rationalizing her relationship and don't plan to.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

remorseful strayer said:


> I don't have time to read all the responses.
> 
> But, yes, I think you did the right thing. She is likely a huge trigger for you being a BS and also, how could you ever trust her around a new boyfriend. It is very common for a woman to go after her friend's husband in the infidelity arena.
> 
> Yes, you absolutely did the right thing, and the fact that she doesn't understand your pain given you are a BS and she knows that, scares me.


That's exactly one of the reasons I told her when she asked me why I was acting distant. I told her that it was huge trigger/slap in the face to hear her talking about "her man" (blagh) considering I was a BS not that long ago and she knew about what happened.

I agree, like someone else pointed out, I don't know that I could trust her around my future guy if I were to let her in. 

Just sucks that she doesn't realize the damage she's doing and that our friendship is heading toward its end. Thanks for the advice.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

RightfulRiskTaker said:


> :iagree: Let her go since you have opposing self-esteem & value systems. She will reach out to you when lesson learned. Then, if she repeats her mistake or plans to, you will know she is serial. You can then decide to cut her off permanently. Too, I notice that about mistresses, they have few friends, many acquaintances...because they keep themselves in reserve for the married man. In a way you are being used as a "filler" friend (something to do) when he is busy with his wife and children because in her own mind she is being "faithful" to him by hanging out with a "safe-y" named you. That's why you met him, so she can reassure him that you are not another man. I seems mistresses get off on a high from perceiving that a married man is placing them above his wife and children which means to them that they are more valuable.


Wow, I never thought about that, but you make good points about being a "filler friend." I haven't met him, although she's attempted to get us all together but I adamantly refuse, because knowing me, I'd probably go off on him 

That's also true about the 'high,' when she talks about his marriage (or what she knows, because as we all know, married men who cheat lie...) she always would mention how much better she was for him, that he loved her more, that he treated her better, etc. So gross hearing it.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

Cedarman said:


> As difficult as it is, you are doing the right thing. Just make sure to explain to your friends why. Your values are important and your friend should also be sensitive to your history. She can't see this because she is in her own affair fog - and acting selfishly, while fooling herself that she is doing this for the OM. She needs to understand the consequences of what she is doing. She needs to understand how destructive her relationship is, and how it has very low odds of surviving.
> 
> Your friend is on a path that has very few happy conclusions, for her, for the OM, for the OM's wife and family. Again, you are doing the right thing.


Thanks for the advice, Cedarman! It's sad because as much as I've tried to tell her, the only way it appears that she'll learn how damaging her actions are is if they're exposed. She just doesn't (and won't) get it until it explodes in her face.


----------



## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

hotsthrnmess said:


> No, I did not have any inkling. Like I said, she was by all means, a great friend and I loved hanging out with her. I didn't know she was an OW, so I didn't have that piece of info as a possibility as to why. I have no clue if she's a repeat OW which could explain it. All I can say, is that she was a bit flirty with guys when we'd go out. But yeah, I didn't know why.
> 
> Oh, I'm not vulnerable to her mind games. I haven't tolerated her excuses at all, because that's what they are, excuses. I haven't entertained her rationalizing her relationship and don't plan to.


With some women who steal other people's boyfriends or mates, part of the syndrome is getting really close and friendly with the target man's wife or girlfriend. 

In some cases, taking away their best friend's spouse or boyfriend, feeds their damaged ego and self esteem. 

Your friend's affair partner likely does treat her better than the wife when he is with her, at least for now. The fact that she is really into talking about the wife and making comparisons, between the wife and herself, scares me.


----------



## MrMathias (Nov 19, 2012)

One of the first things I did after I discovered my WWs affair was to read _Not... Just Friends_. One of the chapters explores the affair partner's perspective and reasons for getting involved with a married person. The chapter mostly addresses a single OW, as their reasons for getting in an A are seemingly a little more complex (everyone ought to know why a single OM is chasing a married woman). 

Even as a betrayed person I felt pretty sorry for the OW that were described. They're really quite pitiful in their delusion. 



remorseful strayer said:


> Yes, you absolutely did the right thing, and the fact that she doesn't understand your pain given you are a BS and she knows that, scares me.


I met my current wife shortly after being betrayed by my first. That's how we became close in fact. 

Didn't stop her from cheating, and even worse led me along in a FalseR for a few months despite seeing first hand my daily emotional and physical pain. 

Bottom line is people in the midst of affairs simply aren't thinking about _anyone else_- no matter their background.


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

remorseful strayer said:


> With some women who steal other people's boyfriends or mates, part of the syndrome is getting really close and friendly with the target man's wife or girlfriend.
> 
> In some cases, taking away their best friend's spouse or boyfriend, feeds their damaged ego and self esteem.
> 
> Your friend's affair partner likely does treat her better than the wife when he is with her, at least for now. The fact that she is really into talking about the wife and making comparisons, between the wife and herself, scares me.


I'm not the BS to the WS, and she wasn't the OW in my situation, but I understand where you're coming from. As far as I know, she has not gotten close to his wife (the BS) but it bothers me that she would do this knowing my situation and expecting me to be there for her somehow.

Yes, it's really weird that she makes those comparisons. She really believe everything he feeds her about his wife, their relationship and that they'll be together eventually. I think it feeds her ego to know that he "loves her more" than the wife, etc.


----------



## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

DrMathias said:


> One of the first things I did after I discovered my WWs affair was to read _
> 
> 
> 
> ...


_

Sorry to hear that, mate. You are right people in affairs aren't thinking about anyone else, but themselves. I know first hand, but your wife continuing to lead you on in a false R, is exceptionally cruel._


----------



## hotsthrnmess (Dec 5, 2012)

DrMathias said:


> One of the first things I did after I discovered my WWs affair was to read _Not... Just Friends_. One of the chapters explores the affair partner's perspective and reasons for getting involved with a married person. The chapter mostly addresses a single OW, as their reasons for getting in an A are seemingly a little more complex (everyone ought to know why a single OM is chasing a married woman).
> 
> Even as a betrayed person I felt pretty sorry for the OW that were described. They're really quite pitiful in their delusion.
> 
> ...


DrMathias, thank you for your help, I appreciate it. I'm sorry to hear that this has happened to you more than once. 

The bolded is just what bothers me the most. I've never been the OW, so I won't even truly understand her mind, but I would hope that someone who has witnessed the destruction that affairs cause wouldn't involve themselves in it. Oh well, though, I guess.


----------

