# Worried about state of my marriage



## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

I have done several searches as to some of the common signs of marriage problems and things that typically lead to problems. I feel we could be heading in the wrong direction, which is particularly saddening to me after knowing my wife for 30 years now, 23 years married. We met when I was 18 and she was 17, very much in love and so much in common.

Background to the family 
Around 8 years ago we made a conscious decision to move from the South of England to the North, basically to pursue a better career and be closer to family. Up to that point we had 2 children who were at senior school age and we felt the timing would be ideal at a point they would be moving to a new school anyway. At this point we had a solid relationship, solidarity in that we jointly wanted to do this move and pursue other jobs once moved, and were still intimate with each other.

Unfortunately the move was around the time of the sad death of my father, BUT I think overall I managed to cope pretty well with his loss and managed to recover quite quickly and come to terms with what had happened. We were happy with the house we moved into, and when my mum sold up the family house to move in with my sister, who is only 10 minutes away, this really made the move seem worthwhile. My wife's family are less than an hour and a half away. She does pop down to see them more regularly now.

In hindsight I don’t think the move has worked out as beneficial as we had originally thought. House prices had risen significantly from the time when we originally lived in the area, so our choice became more limited. I have less friends socially than I used to have and this also impacts my wife as she also used to socialise with me and those circle of friends.

I was made redundant 14 months after moving up here along with 14 other staff when the company canned the project we had been working on. I managed to secure a new job quickly in a more senior position but unfortunately the trade off was I now have a 75 mile a day commute taking about an hour each way. Out of the house at 8:00am and typically not back at home until 18:30 sometimes later, and with many periods of overseas travel.

Our problems
We spent a lot of time doing up our current house, which seemed to fight back with one costly problem after another. All the nice interior stuff took a back seat to the exterior issues, roof leaks, gutting, new windows, and me being on extended overseas travel with my job. Sex life dwindled, and I'm sad to say we saw almost a 5 year drought during all this. One evening we had a talk, and the thing that hit me hard was her words "Oh I can't be bothered with that now, it's so long". I quit drinking entirely, not that I drank much anyway, and managed to lose a little weight, and we started going out more, and I actively pursued more sharing of cooking etc. After a while things got better, and after a couple of intimate sessions, we sort of hit a period I can only describe as like akin to "hysterical bonding'. Sex was off the charts for around 3 or 4 months, then all of a sudden it stopped.

Naturally I was a bit confused, and kept pushing as I had been but rejected constantly, and that is where we are still at today, 3 months later. All I get is "not everything is about sex", and I've questioned what she means by that. We had a sort of passionate kiss the other week, I got the signals but was shut down again with the same words.

I'm really at a loss now, many rejections later. As I type this she has finished, as she does most nights, finishing her kindle game, had 1/2 bottle or more of spirits, and turns over and is asleep in minutes. 

She's not always cold towards me, but we did have a large fight last week, again she had been drinking, and I said I would not stand being spoken to aggressively. Vague threats from her about leaving if I was that bothered, follows by me saying if she carried on I may leave, and I wouldn't fancy her chances in a divorce. I don't know why I said that. heat of the moment.

Anyway, we each turned on our own sides to sleep. Next morning, a model wife, apart from sex that is.

I suppose I am a "nice guy", I do feel unsure how to proceed in getting my old wife back, there;s no way i'm going 5 more years with no intimacy, it's killing me thus far. NMMNG and MMSLP have been top of my reading list, and I'm working through them, although struggling with moulding myself into new behaviours in hope it may yield results. I have lost 1.5 stone (21 pounds) in the last 12 weeks, and on target for another 1/2 stone, so trying to build my own confidence.

Anyway thanks for your time reading this, sorry it took a while to get through it all, but i don't want to lose this women in my life, so all help and advice appreciated.


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## commonsenseisn't (Aug 13, 2014)

Have you considered if menopause is playing a role in this? 

What about her drinking and overall health?


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Yes the drinking worries me, on occasions I avoid her if I know she's had a lot. The thing is I don't understand what the trigger is for her drinking so much. I've suspected maybe she was feeling guilty over something, and I've done some basic snooping on phone and email which are open to me. I can't rule out deleted texts but I don't think so.

Her behaviour is off, she's become less communicative over things in general, and the spark between us is dying.

The most hurtful thing to me is the rejection, she still has moments where there's a kiss when going off to work, and sometimes when coming home through the door, but she's much colder when trying to initiate anything and those immortal words "not everything is about sex".

To answer specifics from your question:
She is 3 stone overweight, as I pointed out to her the drinking was not helping with that. She has lost 1 stone as we are both doing the same weight loss programme and gym. 

At 48 I suspected she may be hitting menopause, but she got angry t suggesting that. Her mother said something similar and got a similarly angry reply.


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## clipclop2 (Aug 16, 2013)

does she have a job? What does she do with her time? the drinking could be killing time , that went from having nothing better to do to being a habit and a problem. or she could be using it to avoid you. 

but if she doesn't have a life outside of the home and she doesn't have a life outside of you then that could be part of her issue.. 
she's bored and boring .
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

She works 37 hour week in medical practice. She also has several hobbies, the main one being crafts, sewing and patchwork quilts, she spends many hours in the sewing room, yet another escape from "us time".

Arrives home around 4:30 to 5:00pm on most days, and guaranteed a drink will be lured within 1/2 hour of getting home. I'm often berated when I point this out, as well as subtly reminding her that the weight loss would be quicker without the drink. I get told to "shut up" and this has caused a few brief arguments as I tell her not to speak to me like that.

I've tried talking to her to see if I can get to the bottom of why she is drinking, it's sort of become habit. I've tried various approaches, the concerned husband & family, the angry approach when she sometimes gets argumentative, she goes into this passive aggressive mode of trying to prove a point over something insignificant.

Sober she's a different person, but is very much a woman with some agenda. I guess over the last 8 or 9 years has gradually become less concerned about any needs of mine and more just what she wants.

Somethings changed and I really can't understand the reasons, despite asking may times. I get a short response like "oh nothing it's just me", and she won't engage in an intelligent response. I've asked her many times is she still in love with me, she says yes, but her actions really make me feel insignificant in this marriage. The flags to me are the rejections, the unwillingness to be open about her feelings and what's changed, the sudden U-turn from the intimacy that we re-established.

Do readers think that getting some Marriage Counselling would help to unearth the real feelings of what's going on?


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## clipclop2 (Aug 16, 2013)

It can't hurt.

Did you ask her how her behavior demonstrates her love for you? Love is action not feeling.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

clipclop2 said:


> It can't hurt.
> 
> Did you ask her how her behavior demonstrates her love for you? Love is action not feeling.


Your absolutely right, I have planned a s*** test of my own this weekend. I have a restaurant booked, ****tail bar lined up (although I want to avoid "too much" alcohol for us both) and overnight hotel stay. 

I can't decide whether over the meal is an opportune moment to try and express how I feel, but i fear this may do the opposite and spoil the proceedings. If she is or is not receptive then I'm sure I'll get to find out on Saturday.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

People who drink a lot are usually unhappy about their life. Something is missing. She is self-medicating.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

In Absentia said:


> People who drink a lot are usually unhappy about their life. Something is missing. She is self-medicating.


Well if it is me and I need to fix stuff I wish she would just say so. This is painful to say the least. Painful to see her drinking, and unacceptance there is an issue between us and even more painful that she won't open up.

In one of our previous talks she expressed some concerns over her fathers deteriorating health, and I explained that making herself worse won't make him any better.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

UsernameHere said:


> Well if it is me and I need to fix stuff I wish she would just say so. This is painful to say the least. Painful to see her drinking, and unacceptance there is an issue between us and even more painful that she won't open up.
> 
> In one of our previous talks she expressed some concerns over her fathers deteriorating health, and I explained that making herself worse won't make him any better.


I totally agree, but it's up to you to make her open up more. Something is bothering her. Also, if you don't want her to grow even colder towards you, stop telling her to stop drinking. She needs support, not criticism. Try and find out what the problem is and then solve it. The drinking will go. If you don't act now, it will get worse and eventually it will become irreversible.

Not saying this is easy. It might be you, it might be something else. But you need to get to the bottom of it.


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## Rayloveshiswife (Sep 25, 2013)

She needs to stop the drinking before you can have any hope of discovering and fixing the other issues in your marriage. I would insist on marriage counseling and find a counselor that has worked with alcoholics a lot. The issues they bring to the table are quite different and often require a different approach to get results. 

I'd also consitter finding a job that is closer and requires less travel. 

I'd put off your talk till near the end of your small getaway. And recomend no alcohol at all if you can pull it off. 

Ray
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## clipclop2 (Aug 16, 2013)

SHE has to want things to change. That's the only thing to put before her. Your despite is there. Your willingness is there. Where is hers?

The only thing you need to do is offer consequences. I know you don't want to do that.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Rayloveshiswife said:


> She needs to stop the drinking before you can have any hope of discovering and fixing the other issues in your marriage. I would insist on marriage counseling and find a counselor that has worked with alcoholics a lot. The issues they bring to the table are quite different and often require a different approach to get results.
> 
> *I have backed off a lot as it caused arguments. It's interesting you use the term "alcoholic", said as much too her and her response was "If I was an alcoholic I'd be drinking throughout the day". She fails to think that drinking 3 or 4 litre bottles a week in the evenings is not an excess.*
> 
> ...


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

clipclop2 said:


> SHE has to want things to change. That's the only thing to put before her. Your despite is there. Your willingness is there. Where is hers?
> 
> The only thing you need to do is offer consequences. I know you don't want to do that.


She's comfortable with our family life, she is a good mother to the kids (D20 now left home, S18 still with us), buy's them little essentials when they need them and bit of extra cash as they don't earn big money. The relationship with them both is good.

I just miss the "loving" and affectionate side of my wife, I hope it's not too late to fix this


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Have you checked the phone bill and compared it to her phone to see if here are deleted texts?

Has she had a physical checkup lately?

Does she text much on the phone?

How does the kindle game work? Does she play against other players?


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## Thebes (Apr 10, 2013)

Menopause may be her problem. It can take a big hit on your sex drive. When people bring it up it makes her feel old and useless as a woman. Maybe she needs for you to tell her that you love her and she is still the one for you.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Chaparral said:


> Have you checked the phone bill and compared it to her phone to see if here are deleted texts?
> 
> * I plan to have another look, she got a new phone Galaxy s5 at the weekend and she openly shared her passkey, and doesn't guard it*
> 
> ...


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Thebes said:


> Menopause may be her problem. It can take a big hit on your sex drive. When people bring it up it makes her feel old and useless as a woman. Maybe she needs for you to tell her that you love her and she is still the one for you.


:iagree:

This does make a lot of sense, i stated earlier that suggestions about this were shot down, but I can relate to the fact that it must be a difficult thing for a woman to come to terms with.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Well the weekend preparation is doneL

hotel booked :thumbup:
restaurant booked :thumbup:
venues sorted :thumbup:

The perfect date night, all to ourselves, this will be an acid test of where her feelings are at.

This weekend could go either way, I'm nervous as I hate to think about the possibilities. If she shuts me out, per current form I think MC will have to be considered. I want this marriage to work, so getting to the core of her issues has to be a priority as previous posters have suggested.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

Part of this could also be grieving the loss of the friendship network you guys left, throwing her into the grief cycle. Moving is a major life change as well as job changes. Plus the loss of your Father (so sorry), could also have added to HER grieving as well. She is definitely self medicating. Getting to the bottom of it is very important. Be patient. Be open to hear her. Resist pressing in. 

But something is up.... that is for sure.

I think if you guys recreated your friendship support in your new place outside of family it would help, but I'm not 100% sure this is all it is, but feel it is a layer of what she is going through. Hope tonight goes well.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Already i'm not getting a good vibe, I've mentioned several times over the last day or so about looking forward to having the Saturday evening away, good food etc, all I've had in response so far is "yeah..me too".

Her car broke down today, and the recovery service after 2 hours managed to fix it, needless to say, as soon as she got through the door at around 5:00pm she states, what a stressful afternoon, and made for the gin and tonic.

Around 8:00pm we decided to watch a DVD, and I placed several cases, some remote controls on the seat next to me on one of our sofas. She sat in her usual place on the larger sofa. 10 minutes into the film she accuse me of placing the items on the seat next to so as to stop her sitting there. I pointed out she rarely sits next to me anyway, but she went quiet. Once the film was finished, up she leapt, declared how tired she was. By the time I'd checked doors were locked and house secure, she was in bed out pretty quick......she'd consumed around 2/3 bottle of gin.

I've packed my clothes ready for our weekend, she hasn't even bothered to do that yet, so tomorrow morning is gonna be a big rush. I'm questioning if her heart is really into it, even though it was originally her suggestion we should have a weekend away.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

I have to withdraw my previous comment about the alcohol... 2/3 of a bottle of gin is far too much in one evening...


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## Time4Joy (Dec 13, 2012)

I hope all goes well over the weekend and you are both walking funny on Monday. 

In the event that that doesn't happen, you might check a TAM-like forum for alcohol and substance abusers and those who love them. It's called soberrecovery dot com. 

It's helped me get my head around issues with my dear wife.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

You missed what she was saying.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Well I've had to postpone the weekend away, I came down with a nasty gastrointestinal bug and have been throwing up and had stomach cramps.

As per usual, not that I expect any, but little sympathy for the stomach pain I'm in. All I got when I woke up this morning was:

W: "well if you're not right in the next hour or so we'll have to cancel". 
Me: It's pretty damn obvious we'll have to cancel and rebook for the next week. 
W: Oh well if you're gonna be ill all day I'm gonna rebook my sewing class that I moved from this week back to today"

And she did, off she went at 9:15am and I'm stuck at home on my own.

I'm not asking for a nursemaid, or to be showered in sympathy, but she will be out until around 5:00pm and I feel dreadful.

I'm a mixture of angry, hurt and f'ing lonely at this moment in time.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Blossom Leigh said:


> Part of this could also be grieving the loss of the friendship network you guys left, throwing her into the grief cycle. Moving is a major life change as well as job changes. Plus the loss of your Father (so sorry), could also have added to HER grieving as well. She is definitely self medicating. Getting to the bottom of it is very important. Be patient. Be open to hear her. Resist pressing in.
> 
> But something is up.... that is for sure.
> 
> I think if you guys recreated your friendship support in your new place outside of family it would help, but I'm not 100% sure this is all it is, but feel it is a layer of what she is going through. Hope tonight goes well.


Thanks Blossom, for your comments. I have thought long about this and always felt that the move was a good thing as it was what we both really wanted, we were too isolated from family in that part of the UK. We were apart for 5 months, me going back at weekends until we found a suitable house and schools. As I type this I begin to panic a bit and have a realisation that there could have been a possible EA/PA. Here's my thoughts, although it was 9 years ago so confirming anything would be impossible.

Around 12 months before we moved, there was a guy who attended the physio clinic where my wife worked, he was into motorbikes and my wife was doing her test. We were both introduced to his circle of friends and we went to the occasional function with him and others of his friends. I never really took to him that much as he quite often used to drop around our house unannounced and the wife was taken with him. She used to say poor S he's had a lot of pain and that was his excuse to smoke the odd joint (for pain relief yeah right). Once I came home from work and S and the wife were out on chairs in the garden, he was smoking his stuff as usual. I never felt I had cause to worry as his visits were often short, usually because he stopped by en-route home, and he wasn't always alone. One thing that did red flag a bit was I complained to the wife about him smoking pot even if it was outside, all I got was "well he's in a lot of frequent pain" and I said "well it doesn't seem to stop him riding his motorcycle does it?"

After that he never came round again, but on at least 2 occasions the wife went to his as he was moving furniture and fitting some flatpack wardrobes. She felt obliged to go and help him with those tasks. It's a long while ago so I can't remember exactly, but I think there were perhaps 1 or 2 other occasions that I know of she went over there, once was with the kids, so never felt any resin to distrust her.

Around 6 - 7 weeks before we moved, there were no signs of S on the scene, we heard he was going on some spiritual healing thing overseas. My wife had one of her regular hospital checkups, and received a letter for us to both attend the clinic. The female doctor dropped a bombshell that a test had come back positive for Chlamydia. Now I had been totally faithful in the marriage, and felt uneasy as the doctor sort of looked at me. My wife is the only person who I had been with, and she stated as much the same. The doctor implied that on occasions the test can give a false positive but to be sure we both got the 2 tablets to take. 

As I type this I begin to feel an idiot. There was never any cause to suspect any infidelity but I think in the same situation today I would have handled things much differently, older and wiser.

The sex was still good up until 5 years ago when we hit the 5 year drought as I wrote about in my original post. All of the above looks damning, but nothing has ever surfaced since which ever made e question things.

Could they have had a short affair?
How could any of these events be linked to 5 years ago when we had moved on and were no longer living in the south UK?
After S disappeared, Wife removed numbers she had in the phone, I know there was no further contact from S.
I've never received any form of confession or similar, maybe there isn't anything to confess and she did remain faithful despite how bad it seems when writing this


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

First comments are to your illness. How has she treated illness with you in the past?


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## thumbper (Sep 11, 2014)

*Your absolutely right, I have planned a s*** test of my own this weekend. I have a restaurant booked, ****tail bar lined up (although I want to avoid "too much" alcohol for us both) and overnight hotel stay.

I can't decide whether over the meal is an opportune moment to try and express how I feel, but i fear this may do the opposite and spoil the proceedings. If she is or is not receptive then I'm sure I'll get to find out on Saturday.*

I am thinking that the cancelled weekend is a good thing after all. If you are scheaming a s*** test, you will probably get s***. If you are sad, angry and lonely now, take it from me, wait till you drop cash on a hotel, fancy dinner and probably some pity shopping, only to drive home sans the sex, intimacy and heartfelt discussion you had hoped for.

In contrast however, if your home is busy with kid(s) and private conversation and argument are not available there, the weekend of privacy away, may work well. Not if it is a s*** test but if it is intended to get out of the stale environment in which your issues have brewed. AND if you state exactly that! "Honey, I wanted to get away alone with you to let you know that I love you and I miss the relationship we had previously. I miss the intimacy and sex we shared and I want to see if we can find a way to fix things moving forward." Admit that you understand you probably have upset, disappointed and pissed her off at times but your goal is to understand her FEELINGS and work from there. Your issues will come later. There will be hurt feelings and resentment but it is necessary to open the wounds of the past in order to heal going forward. You open the mistakes of the past only to learn and change moving forward. Do not persist on the past with a he said, she said, no I didnt, yes you did focus. If that is how she felt then that is how she felt! Remember you are dealing with feelings here, address the feelings. When communication breaks down, facts and feelings become two very different things. You have stated many life stressing things going on: middle age, kids moving out, empty nesters...soon?, death, moving, weight gain, weight loss (expectations?) lost contact with social network, disappointed with lots of work on new home. And let me just say from experience, menopause can sneak up and quietly (at first) grab control of everything. So discuss the life events with her and listen for her feelings.

Weather at home or elsewhere, it is going to take a lot of listening (active-listening, as my advisor JLD would state) in order to get to the root cause of the issues. The drinking, lack of sex and aloofness are only symptoms of the real issue(s). Guaranteed, you both have issues, you are both unhappy and both of you will need to self evaluate and be willing to accept blame and implement change. 

The weekend is not over, it is not a loss. You can still tell her what you wanted from the weekend away (leave the sex and BJ part out). 
Good luck.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Blossom Leigh said:


> First comments are to your illness. How has she treated illness with you in the past?


Never much sympathy. I have had a few occasions of hospitalisation:

Tonsillectomy - in hospital for 3 days visited only for 45mins to an hour on 2 days 
Hernia op - 3 days in hospital - arrived just for the last 30-40 mins of the visiting hour of the day
Constantly anything I have is never as bad as XYZ that she's had, or told to shut up

She got in at 5:30pm from her class, and 5:45 poured her first Gin & Tonic, she also produced a new 1 litre bottle of Gin out of the cupboard that wasn't there yesterday.

I swear that if it wasn't for the fact she showed the results of her class, I would suspect she was sneaking off and getting her needs met elsewhere.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

When she complains about the relationship what are her complaints?

Could you tell what I meant the other day whe I said you missed what she was saying?

And yes, you may be right about an affair nine years ago. Are you considerinv confronting her?

Today you may just have to focus on getting better. Pickle juice does wonders for nausea and vomiting fyi


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Blossom Leigh said:


> When she complains about the relationship what are her complaints?
> *- Lack of disposable income to have regular breaks
> - Activities we can do jointly, but we have made a lot of effort to spur each other on in the gym in efforts to lose weight
> - I refuse to watch her crappy chick flicks (Twilight etc) - she implies cos I don't watch them I have no romance. This is complete BS as last Valentines I bought Card, Flowers the works and I got nothing back in return
> ...


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

Just try to relax and be calm. Heal first, figure this out later.

Yes, I was hoping you understood that she is wanting to be drawn in.

Without her having to ask for it.

The chick flicks are her trying to hint the above to you.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

In Absentia said:


> I have to withdraw my previous comment about the alcohol... 2/3 of a bottle of gin is far too much in one evening...



Any amount of gin actually  I love all kinds of British things but gin... Acquired taste I suppose. 

Seriously, several liter bottles of gin a week is major league alcohol over-use with dire health consequences. We are not talking beer or wine here. Does she recognize she's self medicating?


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

john117 said:


> Any amount of gin actually  I love all kinds of British things but gin... Acquired taste I suppose.
> 
> Seriously, several liter bottles of gin a week is major league alcohol over-use with dire health consequences. We are not talking beer or wine here. Does she recognize she's self medicating?


It started out with wine, typically 1 bottle a night, I raised my concerns directly with her, and she used to nastily snap back to shut up. She then started to develop stomach problems, diagnosed with Irritable Bpwel Syndrome (IBS) and acid reflux issues, plus started piling on the weight. She became obsessed about her size, at which point I had a serious talk about the consequences of her drinking, and I was convinced her IBS was triggered as a result of the acidity of all the wine she was consuming. I was slapped down for saying that, of course she defended that the IBS was nothing to do with drinking, a point we still disagree on.

Despite being on various medications for the IBS (Omoperazole, Mintec etc) she continues to drink. Of course now the wine has progressed into Gin and Vodka. She refuses to accept the quantity is of a level to be alcoholic, claiming that if she was alcoholic she'd be drinking throughout the day.:scratch head:

As regards the weight we both joined slimming world program, and the gym. I don't drink so in the same time (12 weeks) I've managed to lose over 1.5 stones the wife only just reached 1 stone, but has not lost much over the last 2 weeks. She gets defensive when I pointed out she could have lost more without drink...but I have been very complimentary about the fact that the weight loss she has is noticeable, and she looks better. (i.e some positive compliments). She's not really complimented back much however on how much better I look. I've dropped around 2 sizes in clothes, and am beginning to bulk up my arms and upper body quite nicely with gym weights. 

A question I need to throw out to any TAM members is "How should I deal with her drinking"?
Is it time to dish out consequences? If so what?
Do I really want to link consequences to the marriage?

I feel out of my depth in raising re drinking issue, other attempts have led to arguments. I really need some sound advice on dealing with this going forward.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

UsernameHere said:


> I feel out of my depth in raising re drinking issue, other attempts have led to arguments. I really need some sound advice on dealing with this going forward.


She is a functioning alcoholic... doesn't matter she doesn't drink during the day... the fact that she HAS to drink in the evening is a sign of alcoholism... some people can control it, some people will progress into full-blown alcoholism. Going from wine to spirits is a bad sign, I'm afraid. If she stayed on wine, it would be almost ok, although even 1 bottle of wine/night is far too much.

The acid reflux could be the drink indeed...

What to do... difficult one. The thing is, since she is drinking so much, she should stop. You have no chance to get her back without getting rid of the alcohol. You could give her an ultimatum... but, to be honest, I'm pretty sure she would choose alcohol over you. Worth a try. Then you'll know where you stand for sure...


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

This is becoming hard work. We had just got back from the supermarket around 1:15pm and I went back to the car to fetch the remaining shopping bags to bring them into the house.

As I went into the kitchen, there she was pouring a large Gin & Tonic. The following conversation, with her becoming defensive:
Me: Are you seriously having a drink at this time of the day?
W: Yes, it's the weekend
Me: So what's the real reason for every night this week then?
W: Does it matter, I'm still losing weight aren't I?
Me: Why bring weight into the discussion, it's the consumption that you should be worried about. Look, I love you dearly, and this really is starting to worry me now.
W: Well you don't need to worry about me, I didn't ask you to?
Me: Are you serious you don't think your own husband should be worried about this behaviour. you need help, and you need to accept this is beyond just a casual drink.

She's now sleeping soundly, out cold on the sofa at 16:45 after having at least 4 G&T's. My son just tried waking her to ask something and she is out for the count.

I didn't think the moment was right earlier for laying down ultimatums, me or the booze, I still feel that I need to try and get to the reasons behind the drinking first to stand some chance of developing a strategy for dealing with it.


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## notmyrealname4 (Apr 9, 2014)

48 is approaching menopause. Mood swings/irritability are symptoms.

And plain old mid-life crisis: shoulda, coulda, woulda. She may be thinking of ways she could have lived her life differently, and it's too late now. *That has nothing to do with you, btw.*

People with IBS have to be_ super_ careful of what food and drink they consume.

Your wife is messing up her liver big time.

It's like nothing is worthwhile to her anymore (depression). Would she listen to suggestions about seeing a counselor; maybe getting antidepressants. I can't believe I'm saying that. But it's got to be less detrimental than all the gin she is consuming. Alcohol is a central nervous system depressant.

Alcoholics don't change/seek help, until they are ready to. Sometimes this is called "hitting bottom".

I think chlamydia can stay in your body undetected for long periods of time. Is it possible either you or her had it from a previous partner? Or are you each others one-and-only. If you were virgins when you married, and then both tested + for it; someone has cheated.

You are dealing with an awful lot right now. New job, awfully long commute time, house constantly needing repairs. Is there anyway that you can just make time for yourself. If your wife shuts herself in her sewing room, can you use that time to pursue an interest of your own.


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## Thebes (Apr 10, 2013)

UsernameHere said:


> :iagree:
> 
> This does make a lot of sense, i stated earlier that suggestions about this were shot down, but I can relate to the fact that it must be a difficult thing for a woman to come to terms with.


It can be even more than just that. Menopause will also cause wild mood swings in some and insomnia plus other issues.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

She sounds so far gone into alcohol that a family intervention is in order.

Does she ever drive drunk?

Right now, you are going to have to consciously choose to stop looking to her to give you what you need emotionally. She is not able to give it to you given her current state. She needs the tough love of intervention. And you will have to steel yourself for the load of blameshifting and gaslighting that will hit you when you do.

If you are afraid of hard work... This intervention will fail.

Because it will not be for the faint of heart.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Blossom Leigh said:


> She sounds so far gone into alcohol that a family intervention is in order.
> 
> *Wow you may be right, this scares me. I think what I will have to do is start to stress on her the impact her drinking is having on the family, her health etc, and start to impress on her the serious impact it is having on the relationship. Her work provides, as does mine, an EAP where counselling is available. I think I'm going to have to insist she seeks help.*
> 
> ...


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

1. Standing your ground when they flail against you
2. Standing your ground when they fall again and choose to blame you for the fall
3. Standing your ground yet extending empathy and compassion even on days when it is a struggle for you, but because THEY are struggling for their lives
4. Standing your ground when you feel like running for the hills
5. Standing your ground when it seems like there is no end in sight
6. Standing your ground when it looks like you are smelling sweet success
7. Standing your ground to protect your kids and hold up a better model of behavior for them.
8. Standing your ground when your loneliness is deep because your spouse can't give you what you need for now.
9. Standing your ground FOR your spouse
10. Standing your ground FOR you...


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Thanks Blossom, you are being a real support here, and I thank you for your advice.

Well, I started discussions in trying to get her to realise how worried me and the kids were about her drinking. It was interesting to see how she rationalised it in her head, and she flatly refuses to accept the problem. I was told abruptly to "F*** off and shut up about it. We ended up arguing as I refused to be spoken to in that tone, so in the end she just clammed up.

Here's the Rational hamster at work:
1) She still is adamant an alcoholic is someone who wakes up wanting drink; I pointed out that she may not be there yet, but if she carries on then that might be a reality
2) She forgets that she gained 3 stone (42 pounds) due to drink over the last 12 to 18 months, she rationalises the small window of time since she is losing weight due to being on a slimming programme and going to the gym.
3) She's totally ignoring the side effects, lack of sex drive and being a horrible person to be around when drinking. She blames her mood on everyone annoying her by pointing out how much she's drinking; i.e it's my fault she's in a mood
4) The next one is a gem......well I put loads of tonic in.....as if that reduces the fact that each drink is typically a double measure

I've completed 2 online surveys as honestly as possible based on what I am aware of in terms of daily consumption. They both confirm she is in high risk/high dependency, so i have printed the results to show her. She can see the answers I have put, but no doubt she will refute them.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

UsernameHere said:


> Thanks Blossom, you are being a real support here, and I thank you for your advice.
> 
> Well, I started discussions in trying to get her to realise how worried me and the kids were about her drinking. It was interesting to see how she rationalised it in her head, and she flatly refuses to accept the problem. I was told abruptly to "F*** off and shut up about it. We ended up arguing as I refused to be spoken to in that tone, so in the end she just clammed up.
> 
> ...


This is why I listed #1as#1... I knew this would be the very first thing to hit you. 

And you are welcome.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

UsernameHere said:


> Thanks Blossom, you are being a real support here, and I thank you for your advice.
> 
> Well, I started discussions in trying to get her to realise how worried me and the kids were about her drinking. It was interesting to see how she rationalised it in her head, and she flatly refuses to accept the problem. I was told abruptly to "F*** off and shut up about it. We ended up arguing as I refused to be spoken to in that tone, so in the end she just clammed up.
> 
> ...



Well, she is in denial... which is typical. Some people can handle it, some other slide inexorably towards full-blown alcoholism... hopefully, she'll manage to understand that she is on a very slippery path...


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## AliceA (Jul 29, 2010)

If she wasn't addicted she could easily stop. Her family is extremely concerned and she claims she is annoyed at hearing people tell her she is drinking too much. Simple solution is to stop drinking; no more concerned family, no more annoying complaints about it, but because she is addicted, she can't bring herself to consider this as an option.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

breeze said:


> If she wasn't addicted she could easily stop. Her family is extremely concerned and she claims she is annoyed at hearing people tell her she is drinking too much. Simple solution is to stop drinking; no more concerned family, no more annoying complaints about it, but because she is addicted, she can't bring herself to consider this as an option.


:iagree:
Oh and tonight on getting home from work i'm getting the silent treatment. I'll see how long it lasts but to be honest I'm enjoying the time catching up with events with my daughter who popped around this evening, and getting the latest news from my lad regarding his Army Cadet Instructor application/interview.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Had some time on my hands today and was reading Weightlifters useful thread. I managed to get into her Google history, 95% of it pretty boring stuff, but a couple of searches stand out as "unusual".


2 months ago - search on Mitochondria antibodies 
I believe from a quick google search his is related to scarring of liver tissue, of course she works in a medical practice so the search may have been patient related

Within the last 2-3 months - around 9:30am on 2 or 3 days a week a login to Lloyds Bank Personal Banking. Her main account is with another bank, this is the first I know about a Lloyds account

Using Location services, her phone has showed up once or twice a week at a public house/restaurant about 4 miles from her place of work. A few times it has been around 12:30pm (lunchtime) and 2 or 3 times after work and the trace then shows coming home. I don't know how reliable location services is, it shows stationery for 30-50 minutes.

I really don't know what to make of all this. The google searches and the location is all from her Android phone, so I know it isn't anyone else using say a laptop/PC.

I'll collect details of dates and times at the public house, and maybe suggest someone saw here there on such and such a day, see what her reaction is like. Maybe a VAR is in order as well for the car. Aaaagghhh just when I thought dealing with the drinking issues was tough enough.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

UsernameHere said:


> [*]Using Location services, her phone has showed up once or twice a week at a public house/restaurant about 4 miles from her place of work. A few times it has been around 12:30pm (lunchtime) and 2 or 3 times after work and the trace then shows coming home. I don't know how reliable location services is, it shows stationery for 30-50 minutes.
> [/LIST]


OOhhh F*** on google maps adjacent to the pub is a Travel Motel/lodge (Premier Inn in the UK). My heart is beating so fast now, I really need to establish if there is any connection with all of this.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

Yes, VAR.

And possible PI if you can swing it.

Could be something, could be nothing. 

You won't know for sure until you have proof.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Maybe she stopped for a drink? I'm the optimistic type...


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

In Absentia said:


> Maybe she stopped for a drink? I'm the optimistic type...


She doesn't need to she stocks up from the local supermarket on her way home when the bottles empty.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

In Absentia said:


> Maybe she stopped for a drink? I'm the optimistic type...



Yes, right now, the ONLY proof you have is that her alcohol is her lover. Entirely possible.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

UsernameHere said:


> She doesn't need to she stocks up from the local supermarket on her way home when the bottles empty.


True, but this is around work where she can't stock up.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Nice large glass of cold Sauvignon Blanc before going home to listen to my pestering husband... 

Ever wondered why she doesn't pour herself a G&T straightaway? She's full of wine (or whatever) already...


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

Stalling the emotional pressure of going home.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Blossom Leigh said:


> Stalling the emotional pressure of going home.


I'm not really sure where emotional pressure comes from? I do a lot around the house despite long days, I vacuum, polish and tidy/put away clothes when needed (not excessively) she does hew fair share as well.

I have not begged or become needy over lack of sex, just tried when the moment seemed right. 

I subtly pushed about being around the vicinity of the pub/motel, she claimed to not have any reason to venture to that area, which is true she has no valid reason to be there. She carried on answering as well as carrying on putting away dishes, she didn't stop to face me.

She noticed 5 minutes later that I was not convinced, and went quiet. She gathered I think that her answer was not sufficient, and qualified if I felt she was having an affair. She was not upset, didn't break down, and calmly stated that she is not involved with anyone else, she does love me, and accepted that she has some issues that need to be worked on. I said that I had concerns over how distant she has become and I blamed the drink. She accepted responsibility for that and made at least some commitment to looking to cut it down. 

I said I remain skeptical because of how snappy and defensive she becomes when drinking. We discussed our plans for this weekend, postponed from last week, and she stressed we need to do that more, and life/work/health has got in the way of "us".

If anyone can explain in the image below if the points may be due to phone signal masts/connection rather than physical location this may explain things. I'm no expert, but I do believe her.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ovmgfkuavo09db4/Capture.JPG?dl=0


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

OP:

I feel for you. whatever is driving her to drink - to self medicate - is something she brought to the marriage, not sopmkething you caused. those kinds of defficiencies/damages are born out of a person's childhood more often than not IMO.

it also sounds as if there is near prima facie evidence of her commiting adultery??? am I reading that correctly? 

I wish people marrying under the Christian/western tradition could get it straight that "for better or for worse" does NOT include infidelity; that honoring one's marriage does not include doing so while their partner is simultaneously desecrating it! 

OP there is no 'statute of limitations' on infidelity - I do indeed think you should confront your wife about cheating on you. sounds like its not a question of 'whether' but one of 'why.' playing nurse to her alcoholism should follow 2nd to that. If this leads her to rage or walkout or otherwise sever the marriage - well look my response here is NOT based on how to save your marriage but on how to save you. the latter is more important in any case.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

nuclearnightmare said:


> OP:
> 
> I feel for you. whatever is driving her to drink - to self medicate - is something she brought to the marriage, not sopmkething you caused. those kinds of defficiencies/damages are born out of a person's childhood more often than not IMO.
> 
> ...


:iagree: I'm working towards a controlled confrontation but I'm not sure if I have enough at this point.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

Pressure over the drinking. That was the pressure I was referring to.


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## notmyrealname4 (Apr 9, 2014)

UsernameHere said:


> If anyone can explain in the image below if the points may be due to phone signal masts/connection rather than physical location this may explain things. I'm no expert, but I do believe her.
> 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/ovmgfkuavo09db4/Capture.JPG?dl=0



I can't explain it.

Maybe you could call your cell phone provider's customer service phone number, and ask them.

You don't have to say "I need to know if my wife is cheating". You can just ask them how to interpret the map - ask them what that mapping system is based on and how it works.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

UsernameHere said:


> :iagree: I'm working towards a controlled confrontation but I'm not sure if I have enough at this point.


OK. for "prima facie" I was referring to her contracting clamydia. I'm not a medical expert but if you didn't give it to her, is it really possible that she's been carrying it from before the marriage?? that would have amounted to about 15 years, yes? i.e. have you investigated whether her STD could have meant anything other than her cheating on you, realistically. that's what I meant....


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

nuclearnightmare said:


> OK. for "prima facie" I was referring to her contracting clamydia. I'm not a medical expert but if you didn't give it to her, is it really possible that she's been carrying it from before the marriage?? that would have amounted to about 15 years, yes? i.e. have you investigated whether her STD could have meant anything other than her cheating on you, realistically. that's what I meant....


Sorry misunderstood. I'm still working on the current bunch of evidence. Something else cropped up that I'm following up with the motel, I've done some cross checking of hotel checkin details against known dates, this may be something or nothing.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Okay. Figured out the exact location where that screenie is from. Relax Im not gonna blab it. The pinged location is 700 feet/ 215 meters from suspect location. Lets break this down.
1) Location on that what we in the US call an interstate is an illogical place to stop more than once and not during an emergency. 
2) The most logical places are the restaurant and hotel.
3) However, using street view, note withing same distance are a number of apartments to the NE and SW and a number of what appear to be offices, mostly to the SW. 
4) Least probable but not impossible are the large number of large warehouses nearby. Is any of them a supplier to her work? Sorry I dont have time to street view and look them all up.

Suggestions.
1) VAR is often your easiest and cheapest friend. Just do it right and exactly to my instructions and secure the pizz out of it so it wont fall even if she goes over the worst bump on the road ever.
2) GPS like the ezoom I mentioned are more accurate. Ive seen them 50 feet off but not 700.

I cant emphasize SIX things enough.
1) You have red flags but you need to work it out. Get on it or it will eat you alive.
2) DO NOT do a soft confront. "Golly honey this looks bad" Confrontations are nuclear war and look like this, "Wife I know you screwed Chad Dooshbag last Friday at noon at the notell motell and I know more. I need a full and complete confession or I will divorce you. I know more than you think."
3) DO NOT EVER listen to your wife have sex with another man if it happens in her car. Hear him get in and kissing start... STOP listening and have a trusted friend listen. It will wreck you in ways you can not fathom.
4) NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER tell her of the VAR or GPS. The are your aces in this like poker.
5) NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER tell her of the VAR or GPS. The are your aces in this like poker.
6) NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER tell her of the VAR or GPS. The are your aces in this like poker.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Thanks Weightlifter much appreciated.

Motel have provided details of bookings in and around each of the dates nothing in her name. Doesn't mean couldn't be in someone else's but drawing a blank.

I pretended that I got a call from the banks customer services today when she was at work. She didn't look uncomfortable, or change subject etc, cool as ice response. I think she genuinely looked puzzled by why that Bank would contact her when her account was with another. I asked her if she had gone ahead and changed hers as a couple of months ago she was thinking of changing because the bank she was with had messed up with overcharges. She showed me her bank cards.

She's had a few drinks this evening, Vodka this time, and has already got into a minor tiff with my son (who's 19 and lives at home with us). He had a go at her about being moody after drinking and has gone upstairs. I'm sat on my laptop typing, and she's just had a go at me for no reason...she says "I'm surprised you're still down here coz I'm watching a chick flick (Twilight :sleeping::sleeping, I ain't bothered, I'm pretending to watch with 1 eye.


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

The car and gps will answer it. You are going to tear yourself apart.

Be careful of watching twilight. It can make you penis fall off. It's that bad.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

weightlifter said:


> The car and gps will answer it. You are going to tear yourself apart.
> 
> Be careful of watching twilight. It can make you penis fall off. It's that bad.


:rofl:

I am so glad I never got roped into those shows. Bless his heart. Hope you survived it.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Well I survived Twilight, although it did bring on another bout of nausea :bsflag:

Anyway the weekend away happened, it was good to get away from all the crap that's been going on, and a chance to let loose a bit.

The wife was quite affectionate, lots of hugs, kisses handholding, and we enjoyed the shopping, bars and restaurants. No sex though, that was clearly off the agenda when an opportunity arose in the room. I didn't push it, or push for a reason, it would have spoiled the weekend to end up fighting. She definitely noticed my shift in body language, it hurts to be rejected, but I thought what the hell lets hit the bars and enjoy the evening.

Having lost a lot of weight, and still going, my confidence is much better. We were sitting on a large comfy sofa in a trendy ****tail bar, when a couple of very nice ladies, at least 1o years or so younger than me sat next to us. I'm not used to it, but the one next to me started chatting, and much to my wife's annoyance appeared to be subtly hitting on me. I didn't encourage it, but kept conversation pleasant and above board. I did feel it was a perfect opportunity to show the wife that at least I'm not a lost cause, and not a dead loss wit the women. I thought maybe with the hint of jealousy she may want to claim me back later but....NO sex was still off the agenda.:roll eyes:

So we're back home, it's 14:30 and .....drumroll.....in she walks with a Vodka & Coke. I ain't gonna argue.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

The alcohol is her lover. Her #1 lover. 

I am really glad you guys had a great time. 

Its just time to deal with the elephant in the room.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Blossom Leigh said:


> The alcohol is her lover. Her #1 lover.
> 
> I am really glad you guys had a great time.
> *Thank you - it was very good*
> ...


I'm thinking of arranging some IC for myself via my Employee Assistance Program. I'm finding the whole think pretty stressful. That elephant in the room is taking a pretty big dump all over my marriage. I'm experiencing the stomach cramps/nausea again as I type this, maybe some of this is stress related, my doctor suggested the possibility.

I'm dropping thoughts of anything going on, the location data looks too subjective, and 99% of the data stacks up with her movements. The bank issue, dug more but doesn't seem to be anything conclusive. Her phone is clean and behaviours in general, apart from the drinking, seem OK. I'm getting a VAR to see what general discussions with friends & family turn up, she may discuss things or may give away some clues regarding us.

I'm going to plan out a confront/honest discussion as soon as I can, I'm just trying to map out what to say and how to say it. Any help here appreciated. I don't want to write a letter for fear of coming across weak, but face to face I want a night when she's not been drinking.


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## Angelou (Oct 21, 2014)

In Absentia said:


> People who drink a lot are usually unhappy about their life. Something is missing. She is self-medicating.


I agree. She feels the unhappy feelings and tries to drown them with alcohol. She needs to let it out and she will feel better...


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

*UPDATE:
I have not had an opportune moment for a serious talk yet, too much going on this week like my sisters birthday, gym, Slimming World weigh in session last night and she's on a GNO tonight.

There was a fresh bottle of vodka in the fridge Tuesday night, and I took a small opportunity to challenge why she felt the need to pour 2 or 3 drinks...all I got back was "thats my business" and "your not my psychologist so keep out of my business". In all these years I've never known her behave or react in such a way. In our younger days, she was a quieter, kind and affectionate person, and somehow over time she has become a bitter and defensive person, and is showing the same traits that her mother has had all he life.

Believe me when I say her mother is the spawn of satan, she is the most narcissistic and self centred person you could ever meet. I have never got along with her, the whole adult side of that family are the strangest people you could ever want to meet as well, so much so that many of them don't even bother with each other. Her father is a bit more "normal" but has had years of ill health and is so co-dependant on her mother for some odd reason, how he remained married to this evil person is a mystery to me.

I've taken some solace by talking to the telephone/online counsellors on my EAP Program, as that is 24hours and free. If I need it I can have 6 sessions initially of IC but they do not provide MC that would be something we would handle by available counselling organisations like Relate,


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

Co-dependency is progressive and it sounds like your wife has advanced forms of it which can include severe alcohol addiction. 

She is choosing self destruction

Instead of self recovery.

I have found a 12 step program that helps with co-dependency AND alcohol addiction Celebrate Recovery

It would work for you BOTH. From what I can tell the meetings have a nice size to them and it is international. 


I think it's time to put your eyes on your own paper for a while. Negative pressure is only going to drive her further into herself and eventually blow her up, so right now leave the discussion about alcohol alone and seek recovery for yourself. Put your eyes on your own paper, pursue health for yourself, since situations like these create codependency in you when you don't even realize it. She is walled off right now and the only way to bring her out of it is for her to perceive no pressure existing on the other side of the wall. Just an open invitation to join the fun of choosing better. So just find a meeting for yourself and tell her you are going, she is welcome to come anytime, then leave her totally alone about it. Open invitation, then silence on that topic. Go yourself and Heal well... she will see what she needs to see and do what she needs to do in time....


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## Plan 9 from OS (Jul 13, 2012)

Some observations and questions:

Clamydia...WTF?!?! You seriously didn't go all out and call her on the carpet then and there and ask who the hell was she screwing??? Did SHE go apesh!t the moment she found out she had an STD and accused you of sleeping with a skank? I'm amazed - truly amazed - that this wasn't your wake up call. Pretty freaking obvious that your wife was having an affair with "Blaze the biker guy"...

Your wife has been drinking a lot. Obviously, she's a pretty hardcore alcoholic. I know of no woman that can polish off half a bottle of gin or vodka on a daily basis who was NOT an alcoholic. And on your big weekend away, you said "F it, let's go to the bars?????". WOW!

Next you find a secret bank account that you did not know about and your wife is being at places where she is not supposed to be and not telling you what she's up to. Unexplained losses of time after work, etc. 

I think it's pretty obvious what has been going on here for the past several years. Question is whether you're going to take any action to deal with it.

ETA: At your wife's current pace, I doubt she makes it to 58. *WAKE UP AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT *!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Plan 9 from OS said:


> Some observations and questions:
> 
> Clamydia...WTF?!?! You seriously didn't go all out and call her on the carpet then and there and ask who the hell was she screwing??? Did SHE go apesh!t the moment she found out she had an STD and accused you of sleeping with a skank? I'm amazed - truly amazed - that this wasn't your wake up call. Pretty freaking obvious that your wife was having an affair with "Blaze the biker guy"...
> *
> ...


*Thanks, that's why I started this thread. I need the 2x4 around the head so thanks I do plan to do something about the situation, I'm just getting my ducks in a row on all this. Timing is very relevant as there is a separate issue relating to my son that developed a few weeks ago. He made a [weak] suicide attempt drank a litre of vodka and took some pills, went off the grid. Got a call from ambulance crew that found him, so we are in the aftermath of that. BUT...to those reading this thread, the wives drinking was severe BEFORE all of this and is not the root cause, that has been going on some time. Son is fine by the way, he had a lot of issues in his own life that he's having o come to terms with, relationships, girls, career that got too much.*


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

Praying for your son.... all of you.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Blossom Leigh said:


> Praying for your son.... all of you.



Thank you. My son is doing fine, he's been able to access counselling and has been able to progress and address some of his own issues by talking to the right people.

As for me, I've just been so busy the last week or so, just waiting for an opportune moment....which presented itself this evening. 

I've not dived in straight away for answers to everything in the last few postings, as was suggested the drinking issue has got to take priority. Ironically she is being retrained in more medical stuff, ECG Heart monitoring, spirometry, general health, weight, bloods etc...and in her training pack was a laminated questionnaire to assess alcohol consumption of patients. So after tea, the wife as usual, poured a vodka, so i suggested we complete the questionnaire. She flatly refused and started an argument saying, I wish you hadn't seen that. Anyway she kicks off, and my son came in to hear what was going off, he told her straight to lay off, and to realise what she's doing to herself. She left the house for 10 minutes. So, we completed the questionnaire as honestly as we could.....she scored 20, out of a max of 28. The key quite clearly stated >18 = High dependency. Of course we knew that but she never believed it.

I wrote a note that we loved her and that clearly she needs to seek help, that I can't force her but that of the questions stated "Has the person ever injured anyone by drinking" ... I pointed out that she perhaps hasn't put herself or others in hospital through drink that she was "injuring our marriage", "Injuring our normal daily life" and most of all "injuring herself". 

Blossom, you said she would kick back and it would get tough, and indeed it has started, she finally came back, and has sat in the kitchen on her own sulking like a 5 year old. I'm not gonna kick off any more tonight, she needs to read my note, and I need to see what blame shifting comes my way. 

I'll post again when i get the opportunity


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

I forgot to add, I've completed NMMNG and MMSLP books. I'm now contemplating doing the MAP I'VE LOST OVER 1.5 STONES and weight training now. feeling great


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

Stay strong... as rough as the waters might get, it does not serve her to allow her to remain in the condition she is in. Proud you guys are putting voice to your concerns about her destructive habit to not only herself but the whole family. Cheering you on!


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Well it looks like standing up to her and writing that note has had some impact.

I got home from work and she greeted me with hugs, kisses and a huge apology that I was right and she had begun to realise that her drinking was, in her words, "becoming excessive".

I remain skeptical, as I am sure she won't be able to just stop, but at least now she has realised the damage it's doing to us, our marriage and her own state of mind. Little steps as they say, the fact she openly admitted to a problem is a breakthrough. 

I explained to her that she should perhaps start with her works EAP, if she needs some additional support, but that at home we would un-judgingly help her to cut down.

Thanks for the advice received so far, it helped me a lot to get my own act together. There's still more to address, and I will, I have managed to get some firm evidence of internet history which shows attempts over the last few months for logging into this mystery bank, and there's the other issues of trust regarding Biker Boy.


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## Blossom Leigh (Mar 27, 2014)

Excellent UH! I felt that until she started addressing that, the rest was a bust anyway. This is great! Love the affection.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

Usernamehere:

do you think you would be unhappy without her? do you love her that much despite her screwing around on you while at the same time denying sex to you? you don't trust her - with good reason. To remain her husband you will have to assume and accept that she has cheated on you several times. if so that is up to you, but you can have compassion for her, maybe even remain her caretaker but that doesn't mean you shouldn't divorce her.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

OP, a sidenote:

the thing you deserve real congratualtions for is your working out and losing weight. that takes some real discipline. good for you


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

nuclearnightmare said:


> Usernamehere:
> 
> do you think you would be unhappy without her? do you love her that much despite her screwing around on you while at the same time denying sex to you? you don't trust her - with good reason. To remain her husband you will have to assume and accept that she has cheated on you several times. if so that is up to you, but you can have compassion for her, maybe even remain her caretaker but that doesn't mean you shouldn't divorce her.


I'm sort of 50/50 about this at the moment. I have to have "the talk" and at least give her some opportunity to respond to the areas of concern. I am certain about giving an ultimatum about the lack of sex, I plan to give her until the end of the month to turn things around and work on this, I'm prepared for counselling if that is required.

On infidelity, that's a no brainer, if there is either any confession to this or evidence to truly indicate this, then to answer your question YES i could move on. At my age (50) I am not too thrilled at this prospect, but i just don't think I could see her as the person I married any longer if she had truly betrayed me. 

On a brighter note, we have been more civil with each other, and she has actively avoided alcohol since Wednesday. I was planning on having the talk last night, but was dealt the curveball of coming home to an apologetic wife, who accepted her drinking issues, and had spent many hours preparing a great meal for us both. I stuck to just discussing the issues relating to that, but my heart and mind is still unsettled, and I need to deal with wider issues sooner rather than put it off.

I am unsure if working a 180 would be the right approach. At the moment, I'm working on me, I'm maybe the fittest I've ever been, doing weights, eating well, accessing as much free counselling on my EAP as I can, it's helping me focus. I'm on a low dose anti-depressant which is helping me through all this.


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## anchorwatch (Mar 5, 2012)

If she's really going to work toward sobriety, and you say she's apologetic. It's not time to ignore her. It's time to support her while she faces her faults. IMHO


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

*Re: Re: Worried about state of my marriage*



anchorwatch said:


> If she's really going to work toward sobriety, and you say she's apologetic. It's not time to ignore her. It's time to support her while she faces her faults. IMHO


I agree with this. It's going to require an even longer period of selflessness on your part while she works through beating her addiction.


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## nuclearnightmare (May 15, 2013)

Username:

I like your last post - answering mine. Your thinking on this is actually pretty wise I think. I especially like the 'working on yourself' aspect. sounds like you're really applying yourself there.

in terms of your wise thinking I note one exception. I really think your working assumption has to be that she HAS cheated on you. when you talk with her about it she will either confess some things, or she will say she has never cheated on you - where the latter is an answer you simply cannot put much faith in at all. she came home with an STD 20 years into your marriage. plus she does all these GNOs, plus her drinking issues. where there is a lot of smoke, there is almost certianly a fire. I think the reality is she has cheated on you more than once with more than one person.

as for you continuing to be selfless and caring. Again, like I said, you can be her selfless, caring EX.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Update:

It's early days, but wife has managed to go almost a week with no alcohol in the evenings. She is at least trying, and it has been a challenging week for her with job retraining, and lots of extra hours of getting on-the-job coaching for her new role.

I had this evening an initial "talk" with her about the sudden U-turn on intimacy since her last visit to her parents 3.5 months ago. I explained that since that visit home, she showed some increase signs in drinking, mood swings and the dead stop on sex. She downplayed the significance of the timing, I actually thought that she perhaps had received some bad news about her fathers illness that she was either sworn to secrecy over or wasn't prepared to share, hence her change. It seems that is not the case.

She simply has said the following:

"She's not that bothered about sex"
"Why am I not surprised you wanted a talk about getting your leg over"
"OK so you want me to fake it then when you want it"
"It's so messy, too much hassle" {We discovered that G-spot O's led to her having a lot of liquid} 

I explained that it was nothing of the sort, she has completely ignored any needs that I have as long as she doesn't want intimacy then that's a selfish point of view. I explained she needed to work on this, was it wrong for me to feel affection and love for her, that her attitude was all her, her, her needs and took no account of my feelings. It seems that since her dad's illness, he has had so many issues that have led him to be impotent and has felt less of a man, so much so he's been on and on at her mother about sex, but has had all sorts of strange ideas about her mother going off with strangers. Obviously my wife and mother in law have been discussing these issues, but I feel my wife is forming an opinion that that's all men think about. Thing is she's sort of formed these opinions without checking in on me.

I left things on note that she really must understand how it has made me feel lonely, and in the words of MMSLP..."I feel like we are in a legalised friendship". I'll let her think things over, and I'll stress this again before I go away on my business trip next week. Let's see from there, if she isn't prepared to make efforts then it may be time to up the ante and express counselling as an option, beyond that well there's still the other issues to address.


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## UsernameHere (Sep 26, 2013)

Wife gave me the biggest hug this morning and kiss before getting ready to leave for work. She said "I do love you, you know I wouldn't be with you if I didn't"... WTF??

I calmly just said "Well it's a strange way of showing it, but I did begin to wonder".

I think the more I look at the situation, I've been too much of a nice guy, I've lived with the status quo and she's pretty much dictated how things were going to be. I'm pushing back now, setting some boundaries on what behaviour I expect, and she has quite clearly been thinking about stuff in her mind.

I'm gonna still push my agenda, and continue to work on me, my fitness. I need to find a hobby and start getting a social life back for myself, I suppose do a 150 rather than a 180 as I need to improve my happiness with my life.


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