# Complicated...



## edot30 (Apr 19, 2011)

A bit of a story here, but I have a situation here and am curious of your thoughts.

There is a lot of history, so I am going to attempt to be somewhat brief.

We were in the 'swinger lifestyle' for a little while, and would go to parties and have a good time, although these were mostly people that we met and enjoyed the party with for the night and left. Everything was together, and with everyones full agreement. Yes, I know most people have a poor perception of what this exactly means, but thats not the cause of the problems.

Anyway, we played an online video game together and we ran a small guild of approximately 100 people for awhile before we got bored, and in that time we met another couple that played together also, and became friends with them. The guy played far more then his wife, and we became friends with him, and he helped us take care of some of the 'work' of running the guild. Over time we became good friends with him, and his wife was a friend of ours as well when she was on. 

Eventually though, I noticed that he was talking to my wife far more often then to me, which made me feel a bit off to begin with, but I knew I was busy much of the time when I was there and she was not, so it was understandable. 

Eventually, we ended up meeting in person and got along really well also. We ended up crashing at thier place, as they were also part of the lifestyle. A couple weeks later we started all planning a vacation together, and after another 3-4 months we went and spent a week with them in a beach house. In this time, my wife and I had moved mostly away from the lifestyle activities, at my request, as it seemed to me that more attention (not talking about sex type attention) was being given to other guys then to myself. We were still very active together and everything, but as I was starting to get jealous, it seemed like a bad idea to continue.

So we went on this trip with them, after talking and explaining there were to be no expectations, and that we were moving out of the lifestyle. The trip went pretty well, and there was some playing, but it was limited. It did seem odd to me that the other guy and his wife referred to my wife as 'his girlfriend', but she told me she had asked about that and they were really just joking around.

After getting back, I noticed the other guys wife rarely played anymore, and there would be times when my wife and I would log on, and within 5 minutes they are off raiding some dungeon together, without my having received so much as a hello. 

This was really starting to bother me, and I made that clear to my wife, who explained that she does not have many friends, that he was a good one, and that he simply didnt talk to me because I was always doing something or other. I wasn't normally doing anything to be honest, but she said that was the perception he had. So I started talking to him and getting single word answers back for the most part, while he was talking to her constantally.

Anyway, we stopped playing the game, and they kept in contact periodically by phone, text, and e-mail. I am unable to be on Instant messengers during the day, but she is able to, and so is he, and they talk regularly throughout the day there while she is at work.

She always told me that there was nothing going on, and that they were just friends. I looked at her chat-logs and found there was very little there, so when I asked her how often they talked, and she said a few times a day, I asked where the logs were and she told me that he has chosen to keep them hidden because he knew I was jealous and did not want to cause problems at home. 

I told her they needed to be visible, or this had to slow down, and she said that she would make them visible. I looked again a few weeks later and they were there, in chunks like the logs had been enabled and disabled, and again another 2 weeks later and saw constant extremely flirty messages between them. She would say something like, 'I am bored!' and he would say, 'Well you wouldn't be bored if I was there! You have a desk in the corner I can get under right?' to which she would just giggle. This was one of many constant things.

When confronted, and told that it had to stop, and that either all communication with him was stopping, or I was walking otu the door, and she said she would talk to him about those types of comments and she would stop flirting with him, but that again, she had no friends, always connects better with males, and this was her one really good friend so she did not want to lose him. So, I finially agreed to let them keep talking as long as it was less, she told him this **** needed to stop, and simply told her it was her last shot. She said she understood why I was upset, and would take care of it. I told her at one point I was thinking of calling his wife and seeing how much of this she was aware of, which she of course did not want me to do.

I looked again, and found that it was still happening, only this time all the comments were from him, and she mostly ignored them. I asked her about them and she said that she hadn't flirted, but was never in a good point to say anything when he said something, as she was busy with work or whatever, so she ignored it. . . and that she would say something next time. . .

Maybe she will, maybe she won't. She does not have a lot of history of being able to stand up for herself or to say no to people who are interested in her. She has had low self-esteem for a long time, and I really think that just feeds her need for male attention, no matter how much I do to try and help make her feel her worth.

I know she actually does love me and does not want to hurt me, and I love her very much, but am struggling very hard with this. She also has 2 small kids from her previous relationship, who I love and adore as my own, and have for the past 5 years, with them both still being under 10. They have grown to be a major part of my life, and if we seperate, I know I will end up about 800 miles away from here where my family is, so will lose them. . . If not for that, I think I would have left awhile back for other issues we have had and moved past.

We have had quite a few issues, and have moved past almost all of them, fighting very little now, and maintaining a passionate, exciting relationship. We have always loved each other, but are both admittedly fairly difficult to live with.

I glanced again today quickly, and she told him to call any time he needed anything, and that he would be there, and he pointed out again that he would not contact her at home, and she kept saying not to worry about it. Truth is, I would feel better about it if any of the communication was where it could be heard instead of all of it being hidden, and I think she knows that. However, he insisted he wouldn't call when she was home. Truth is to me the simple fact that HE thinks it should be hidden is completely wrong.

I think she has told him about all of our fights about him, and stretched it out to make me look far more unreasonably and like an ******* then I am. I have never laid a hand on her, but would not be surprised if she told him that I have. 

To be fair, she has gotten bruises on her arms from me (yes, I am admitting that here) but only because we fight differently. Her method is to get right in your face and scream at you for a long time, bringing up everything possible, and my method when facing such strong confrontation is to get out of the situation. The result is she will block a door, cornering me in a room screaming at me, and I have at times picked her up and moved her out of my way so I could leave and go for a walk or a drive. As she is fighting, it is not an easy thing to do, but I have never intentionally caused her any harm in moving her so I can get out of the situation. If I stay silent, she screams more, and anything I say at that point will be turned against me and thrown back in my face. She has a very hard time managing anger. Not that I am saying avoidance is the best response. . . but when faced with that, having the knowledge that anything said will be twisted, what other response is there? (BTW, she hasn't ever physically attacked me either, outside of a slap when moving her from the door (which is not done via a violent shove or anything, but a gently shove, which slowly increases pressure pushing. I would never hit her or try to hurt her moving her))

I know I said that she can keep talking to this guy as long as its less and things are clear, but I don't think that is something I can manage, and am having a very rough time of it. . . 

I suppose I dont know what I am looking for here really outside of a place to vent. . . 

Ugh. Just trying to make it through. I do love her, and she is an incredibly good person, just has some anger issues 

This all sounds worse then things really are, I know. Reality is that we fight maybe one day out of a month anymore, and those are nothing, as we are getting better at dealing with each other. This one topic though I don't know if I can deal with. I keep thinking if she had some girl-friends, maybe this would be less of an issue, but she doesnt ever seem to get along with any of the women she meets. (Perhaps its her flirty nature with guys. . . )


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## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

holy cow, there are some things here that are eerily similar to my story.....I had to do a double take.

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/21495-husband-cant-look-me-same.html


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## edot30 (Apr 19, 2011)

You know, I didn't really take a look back at the post after I posted it until just now. . .

I should have done the whole proof read thing, but holy cow that ended up long!

Sorry for the novel! I may have to edit and shorten that one quite a bit. . . I will look at doing that tomorrow.


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## paramore (Jan 11, 2011)

don't worry about it, I posted my initial thread, the game, the swapping, my situation was different, but there were so many things that hit home with me, I am sorry you are here, but welcome.


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