# It's as if cheaters have a book called: "My Needs, My Needs"



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Which contains 101 ways to harm your spouse and family.


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

MattMatt said:


> Which contains 101 ways to harm your spouse and family.


I think we at TAM could write quite the parody as a collective effort!


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

MattMatt said:


> Which contains 101 ways to harm your spouse and family.


dont forget the subtitle "my needs my needs: and its all your fault"


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## where_are_we (May 24, 2013)

Truthseeker1 said:


> dont forget the subtitle "my needs my needs: and its all your fault"


Yes THIS!!!

Especially fun when they never told you what you were doing to piss them off in the first place to drive them away. Then, when they do tell you it's things that according to him should have been obvious: 

For him it was: 
-You were too sexually aggressive
-you were to successful in your career
-I couldn't handle that you made four times the amount of money as me
- everyone likes you better, even my own family and it's not fair
- my favorite: when you were diagnosed with a life altering disease I was really stressed out about how it would affect me

Having sex with strangers and especially prostitutes made him feel better about how bad I MADE him feel.

LMAO!


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

where_are_we said:


> Yes THIS!!!
> 
> Especially fun when they never told you what you were doing to piss them off in the first place to drive them away. Then, when they do tell you it's things that according to him should have been obvious:
> 
> ...


So let me get this straight - he cheated because you were a popular, sexually aggressive, successful career woman who then got sick - so he just HAD to cheat...poor guy - let break out the worlds smallest violin for his sorry a**,,,,


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## where_are_we (May 24, 2013)

Love, love that tiny violin! You have made my day Truthseeker!


oh almost forgot this one: He said - I didn't think you would ever leave me because who is going to take care of you when your illness gets worse? 

I told him I could hire out services for that, just like he did. 

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!!!


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

Truthseeker1 said:


> dont forget the subtitle "my needs my needs: and its all your fault"


true this


I mean you have to have at least ONE blame shift in the title !


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

where_are_we said:


> Love, love that tiny violin! You have made my day Truthseeker!
> 
> 
> oh almost forgot this one: He said - I didn't think you would ever leave me because who is going to take care of you when your illness gets worse?
> ...


LOL..true.....

so he thought you were trapped with him becuase of your illness so he took the liberty to cheat..he is undeniably a POS - the steaming kind....


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

MattMatt... You've outdone yourself with this one!!

This might become a TAM hall-of-famer...


_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

Chapter One: How Trickle Truths Protect No One But Myself


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

where_are_we said:


> Having sex with strangers and especially prostitutes made him feel better about how bad I MADE him feel.LMAO!


Hahaha

Don't forget the, "And you made me because you weren't meeting my emotional needs to boink anything with a uterus."


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Truthseeker1 said:


> dont forget the subtitle "my needs my needs: and its all your fault"


"... Now give me yummy cake."


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

My needs, my needs; a day in the life of my wife.

Written by; onehunglow

Pictures by; forest preserve enthusiasts.

Foreskin written by one pump chump.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

Chapter Two: How To Reinvent Your Marital History (And Other Lies You Can Tell Yourself And Others To Conceal What A POS You Are)


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

Chapter three; how to utilize deception and feel good about yourself!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Ceegee (Sep 9, 2012)

Chapter 3: Damage Control - How to Position Yourself as the Victim


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## Florida_rosbif (Oct 18, 2015)

Chapter 4 - How to take your affair underground so that you can keep on cheating without getting caught.


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## Truthseeker1 (Jul 17, 2013)

Chapter 5: How to start ever conversation about your affair with what your spouse did wrong or blame shifting in 5 easy steps


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## Forest (Mar 29, 2014)

Chapter 6. How to ignore the positive things your spouse has done:
In the months prior to the affair, our daughter choked on a food object, and nearly died. A night worker, I awoke, and was able to dislodge the item.

Chapter 7. How to focus only on yourself
Just prior to the affair myself and two coworkers were fired upon by a man with a sawed off shotgun. I was the one that was not injured. My former coworker still deals with the buckshot. 
During the affair I was almost blinded in one eye, and suffered a broken hand quelling a bar fight at work.
Ah, sweet ignorance.

(please disregard the braggadocio sound of this, I really am trying only to highlight a cheater's selfish nature)


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

Chapter Four: 10 Cunning Answers To the Question "Why Are You So Protective of Your Phone Lately?"


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## honcho (Oct 5, 2013)

Chapter 5: when no one believes the initial excuses , how to create even more outlandish claims. This could also fall under the victim chapter.

My ex should have just stuck with "can't forgive me for everything" line. At least under the pretense of everything I sure I was guilty of something whatever that may be.


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## TeddieG (Sep 9, 2015)

On a midlife crisis forum, there's a great batch of reasons collected from left behind spouses there, and one is, I kid you not, I cheated on you because you buy bagged lettuce. 

Chapter whatever is next: I cheated because I have ED and it's your fault. Or would that be Appendix 1?


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## Voltaire2013 (Sep 22, 2013)

honcho said:


> Chapter 5: when no one believes the initial excuses , how to create even more outlandish claims. This could also fall under the victim chapter.
> 
> My ex should have just stuck with "can't forgive me for everything" line. At least under the pretense of everything I sure I was guilty of something whatever that may be.


Chapter 6

My Toxic Friends All Agree With Me Based On The Marital Revisions, therefore I'm right. (Editors note, TFs also happen to be the poster children for bad life choices, but that's not their fault either, but they live a rich fabulous life on Facebook, so they must be doing something right. Right?):grin2:

Cheers,
V13


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

Chapter 8: How to Explain Those Pesky Cell Phone Records
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Threeblessings (Sep 23, 2015)

Truthseeker1 said:


> dont forget the subtitle "my needs my needs: and its all your fault"


Classic response exactly Truthseeker - I did it because of YOU, it's your fault. You don't give me what I want. It still shocks me that cheaters will justify their actions. It's not a mistake like forgetting to buy milk will out grocery shopping or reversing your car into another - it's a decision that affects EVERYONE else. Rarely does the perpetrator blame themselves, it's always you, YOU, YOU! Have no time for people like this.


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

OMG, V13. That was DA BOMB!

You really don't want to get me started about the two friends my ex has left, both of whom are indeed toxic, and both of whom have made life choices that make his latest look stellar.

I got "All my friends know the marriage has been over for years" (be sure to include this gem in your book, MattMatt).

Funny - after 27 years, all his friends are my friends, and the vast majority of them were shocked that our marriage was over and have dropped him like a bad habit.


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## TeddieG (Sep 9, 2015)

Voltaire2013 said:


> Chapter 6
> 
> My Toxic Friends All Agree With Me Based On The Marital Revisions, therefore I'm right. :grin2:
> 
> ...


Proof that cheaters live in a world inside their own pointy little heads. 

Glad I wasn't drinking anything and in mid-sip because I would have had to blow my nose. :surprise:>:wink2:

I agree with beans. You da bomb, V13. 

Love this thread. It proves my observations were right, and that for the last 7 years whenever I felt it was all about my cheating h, I was right. ALL about him.


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## truster (Jul 23, 2015)

Chapter 9: "I Can't Believe You Invaded My Privacy!" - 10 Tips For Pretending to Have the Moral High Ground


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

I understand the need to commiserate, but as a cheater myself I have never once attempted to shift blame to her, I did not make excuses, never claimed to be a victim, I did not do anything other than *IMMEDIATELY* tell her and own it. I will openly admit to being extremely selfish by placing my needs before hers and if I blame anyone...I blame myself for not seeing how fvcked up I've been all these years.

And some of us cheaters intend upon making good on our promise to seek help, get better, and be a faithful, loving, caring spouse.

But you all go ahead and use that broad brush...In the meantime, I'll continue to love my woman, care for her, be *exclusively* hers, and do the work I need to do to accomplish those goals.


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## Voltaire2013 (Sep 22, 2013)

TeddieG said:


> Proof that cheaters live in a world inside their own pointy little heads.
> 
> Glad I wasn't drinking anything and in mid-sip because I would have had to blow my nose. :surprise:>:wink2:
> 
> ...


The sad part is, the moment a spouse even feels the need to say 'you know what my friends think?' The argument is lost. And it's not gender specific.

Who fsking cares, I didn't marry them, and I don't particularly care for them. It's a fallacy based on their selfishness. Post it to Facebook, I'm sure you'll feel better.

Cheers,
V13


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## TeddieG (Sep 9, 2015)

MountainRunner said:


> I understand the need to commiserate, but as a cheater myself I have never once attempted to shift blame to her, I did not make excuses, never claimed to be a victim, I did not do anything other than *IMMEDIATELY* tell her and own it. I will openly admit to being extremely selfish by placing my needs before hers and if I blame anyone...I blame myself for not seeing how fvcked up I've been all these years.
> 
> And some of us cheaters intend upon making good on our promise to seek help, get better, and be a faithful, loving, caring spouse.
> 
> But you all go ahead and use that broad brush...In the meantime, I'll continue to love my woman, care for her, be *exclusively* hers, and do the work I need to do to accomplish those goals.


MR, really, I KNOW you're different. And I know that you get that if ALL cheaters were like you and owned it, this thread wouldn't exist. The really interesting thing to me about your situation, just based on my limited observations, is that somehow, deep down inside, in your opinion, whatever the hell was going on with you and in your head and your heart and whatever led you to cheat, you're really clear, like Mrs GP, that it wasn't your spouse, and when the fog cleared, you made the decision that your wife was worth walking across hot coals for. 

Just tonight I read a post where people said to LosingHim that if you're willing to fight for something, it means it has worth and value for you and to you. I fought for my marriage for 7 years, and I just realized when I read that post that I did because my marriage and my husband and my vows were worth that much to me. But the beauty and the joy and disappointment and the pain and the destruction and the fearful symmetry of it all is finding out that it isn't worth that much to my husband, after all that, nor was I. After everything I did to demonstrate that HE and US and all that we were was worth it, he not only didn't think so, he blamed ME because it wasn't WORTH IT to him. 

KWIM?


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

TeddieG said:


> KWIM?


Of course I know what you mean. If you'll go back through some of my posts, I have openly posted how stunned I am at the behavior of some of these WSs. You'll even see posts where I say "Kick them to the curb."

So yes...I get it. Some relationships are worth saving and others are not. And it really requires both the BS and the WS spouse to realize that they do care for one another and make the commitment to repair the damage...I get that.

What I don't get is the "scorched earth" mindset of..."DIVORCE! FVCK THEM! DIVORCE THEM"

I understand the bitterness...what I don't understand is blind hatred and I truly believe that the Pavlovian response for divorce is very bad advice without having the full story and facts.

In your case, sure..If your husband wasn't willing to do the heavy lifting to save your relationship, then yes...I understand. What would you have done had he thrown himself at your mercy showing true remorse and a true commitment to repair the damage? It seems to me that you may have considered other options, yes? I would never EVER consider reconciliation if the WS is not FULLY committed to full disclosure, IC and perhaps MC, and doing the hard work, so yes...IKWYM. 

For the record, I am truly sorry that your husband didn't recognize a "good thing" in your relationship and opted to be a jerk. In that case, I would never suggest reconciliation. The onus is on the WS to make good on it IMO.


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## Ceegee (Sep 9, 2012)

We aren't the haters. 

We are the hated. 

We are hated for being what we promised to be. In so doing we were deemed a roadblock to happiness. 

I wouldn't expect anyone who hasn't experienced this to understand - we ourselves wouldn't have understood before this experience.


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

TeddieG said:


> MR, really, I KNOW you're different.


I wanted to let you know that I appreciate your kindness in how you described me. I am different, but what I really am is broken...but I'm working on that. It is excruciatingly difficult to tear down the facade I've built up regarding my persona. So raw sometimes I cry...but us cheaters are broken. Whether we choose to do something about it is up to us, but we're not all ogres. My wife saw something in me that made her decide that I'm worth keeping. I intend on making good on that.


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

Ceegee said:


> We aren't the haters.
> 
> We are the hated.
> 
> ...


Hatred and anger are nothing more than masked pain. Betrayeds and Waywards alike have feelings...we all feel pain. What we choose to do with said pain is entirely up to us.

I don't begrudge BSs for their pain (as I stated earlier that I understand their sentiments) and I feel that I have been a bit more severe on WSs in my posts here on TAM, so yeah.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

Mountainrunner

If my comments offended you I sincerely apologize. I am sure many of my posts may have hurt someone and I don't post with the intentions of causing harm or pain. As I type this I can only think of three FORMER WS's who I believe are sincerely remorseful, Tears, E1, and yourself. What I posted is actually shat I have felt, what I questioned. It was meant in humor and not to be taken as an insult. 

We are all human and fallible, we all have struggles that reach far beyond infidelity. We have life struggles on top of infidelity, concerns of family members in regards to health. At times, even as a Christian man I feel that God has given me too much to handle. My father in law stricken with cancer, untreatable, and soon will pass away. I know he will go soon, he has not eaten very much in the last few days. Even though this is my cross to bear, I need time to vent also. However, as you pointed out, it is not to be at the expense of others. This is why I am apologizing for my posts. 

MR you are indeed a good man, and you have been fortunate to find a great woman. You are also a strong man to admit your faults on this forum, to see you are broken and a work in progress. I can tell you in many posts I wrote I felt very weak, but if it helps somebody, then it was worth it to me. I remember how I felt and where I was at when I began posting. I didn't even feel like a man I was so low. I'm doing better now, therapy and anger management have helped, and I feel like a man again. 

So even though betrayed spouses have said some hurtful posts I don't believe they are intionally trying to cause harm. Rather they are posting what they have had to deal with, what caused them pain, but doing so in a light hearted way. As Teddieg said you are different MR, and in a good and inspiring way. Just as Tears and E1 are, you understand what your actions have caused, the turmoil and devastation a betrayed spouse feels. I sincerely hope you continue to post here for a long time to come.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TeddieG (Sep 9, 2015)

MountainRunner said:


> What I don't get is the "scorched earth" mindset of..."DIVORCE! FVCK THEM! DIVORCE THEM"
> 
> I understand the bitterness...what I don't understand is blind hatred and I truly believe that the Pavlovian response for divorce is very bad advice without having the full story and facts.
> 
> ...


I agree with you about the danger of rushing to divorce. He is just now divorcing me after 7 years (that I know of) with the wh*re. But there were two times when I really thought he was home and he had said he was sorry, and he wanted to work on things. But the second time, the last time, he started feeling the need to reach out to people he knew connected to her, and started with the SIL. I asked him if that was a good idea if he was really trying to stay away from the wh*re, and he got mad and said he didn't really think he could withstand scrutiny and questioning. So of course he contacts the SIL, and then the brother, and then the mother, and then of course . . . 

He didn't have what it took to reconcile; he knew the onus was on him, and this wasn't his first go-around. He and his first wife attempted reconciliation after she cheated on him, and they tried, but failed, only for his then wife to decide she did in fact want to try again and he had another woman pregnant, a rebound that cost him dearly. 

He didn't have the intestinal fortitude, and I guess that, combined with his bi polar disorder and his NPD, just made it impossible for him to try. I was good for a Plan B, I was good enough for a stop over now and then when he'd had a fight with OW, I was good enough to drop in on when he was tired of the cops showing up at her house, but for the long haul? Nope. And I guess the reason I'm mad is because he thinks his wh*re is good enough to dump all that we had, even though he has complained about her to high heaven - a drunk, a negligent mother, a drama queen. I guess he needs the excitement. 

But believe me, I gave him AND a reconciliation plenty of opportunities to make things work, and it didn't. That makes me mad, at me, really, for wasting the time trying.


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## TeddieG (Sep 9, 2015)

MountainRunner said:


> I wanted to let you know that I appreciate your kindness in how you described me. I am different, but what I really am is broken...but I'm working on that. It is excruciatingly difficult to tear down the facade I've built up regarding my persona. So raw sometimes I cry...but us cheaters are broken. Whether we choose to do something about it is up to us, but we're not all ogres. My wife saw something in me that made her decide that I'm worth keeping. I intend on making good on that.


I'm really happy for you guys. What makes you different from a lot of people is that you acknowledge you're broken, but you've made a commitment to work on it, and acknowledged and cared about your wife's commitment to you. My h is broken and was before i met him, and his facade broke when the doctor broke his penis with the stent. And I don't think of my h as an ogre. I do realize I should probably be kinder to cheaters, but if h my had affaired up, and not down, it might make some sense. And I know I'm not perfect, but I was there for him, with him, by him, whatever it was . . . 

As I said elsewhere, I'm not sure if the guy I fell in love with is the guy my h really was. He may have been acting and working hard at being the guy he was because he wanted to be a good guy. But the guy he is now? There's almost a thug there. I don't know if that's the real him and his physical and mental issues left him too broken and too tired to keep up the facade, or if the first guy, the one I fell in love with, is in there, trapped, and trying to get out. That's the one I was counting on, and it feels like we've both lost a battle, and if he's in there, I feel I'm abandoning him. That's the feeling I could never get past and something I had to ride out. I needed him to decide what HE was going to do, because I couldn't pull the trigger and send him to the hell he's living in now.

What I REALLY wanted was for my h to be like you, and respond like you, and do the work like you, and heal and grow like you. And I wanted to be woman enough to help him do that.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

MountainRunner said:


> Of course I know what you mean. If you'll go back through some of my posts, I have openly posted how stunned I am at the behavior of some of these WSs. You'll even see posts where I say "Kick them to the curb."
> 
> So yes...I get it. Some relationships are worth saving and others are not. And it really requires both the BS and the WS spouse to realize that they do care for one another and make the commitment to repair the damage...I get that.
> 
> ...


this is one set of advice. And those who give it give it from thier own perspective. I don't think anyone deserves to be cheated on. For me only two thing exist that get you an automatic boot in the ass out of my house, you cheat on me or you hurt my kids. Aside from that I'm all good with working on things. I suspect many who have been cheated on feel the same way. The act of cheating is about as low bottom and disrespectful as a person can be to one another. It's is the literal **** you and in my opinion should not be forgiven because someone who does this isn't someone who you can trust. 

That said some do reconcile and move past it and that's great. Sounds like you did with your spouse and beat the odds. But I think giving a perspective of divorce and you deserve better than this is solid advice. We all give our perspective.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

MountainRunner, your reality was not the reality of the BSs who are posting here. I think I can safely say that we know that. To many of us, you are a rare gem, and I say that sincerely.

This thread allows us to voice our frustration for the reality that we endured. Many of us did deal with unremorseful, unapologetic, gas-lighting, blame-shifting, self-absorbed a$$es. 

It does not apply to all who deal with infidelity, and for that I am thankful, and hopeful.


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## TeddieG (Sep 9, 2015)

drifting on said:


> Mountainrunner
> 
> If my comments offended you I sincerely apologize. I am sure many of my posts may have hurt someone and I don't post with the intentions of causing harm or pain. As I type this I can only think of three FORMER WS's who I believe are sincerely remorseful, Tears, E1, and yourself. What I posted is actually shat I have felt, what I questioned. It was meant in humor and not to be taken as an insult.
> 
> ...


Drifting, I know you posted this to MR, but thank you for reflecting on the possibility of posts being hurtful. I have a lot of concern in that I try to be positive and kind and uplifting, but I have gotten really comfortable with this place and tend to vent sometimes, without realizing that I shouldn't generalize. In the support group I belonged to before, there were few reconciliations. Reconcilers were in the tiny minority, and I so badly wanted to be in THAT group. The divorce has me kind of raw right now, although for much of the time I'm okay with it, if I can handle the paperwork and the negotiating in small bits and bites. 

But I would really hate to know that my own pain is causing someone else some through my words. MR is right, anger is a form of pain, and I saw a lot of it in my h. And the title of the thread really struck me, because I am JUST NOW seeing how profoundly selfish my h is and has been through all this. 

So I'm in part mad at me; I feel stupid and duped.

And I am SO sorry about your father in law. We just went through that with my mother. She was diagnosed a little over a year ago but chemo and radiation weren't enough, and we lost her in September. You'll be in my thoughts, drifting.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

Chapter 8 
How to use religion and self righteous attitude to feel better 

Chapter 9
Kids, they aren't really hurt by any of this and 15 other lies you need to repeat to yourself daily

Maybe I could dedicate those to direct to my X op?


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

TeddieG

Finding the strength required for reconciliation is rare. Possibly as rare as a WS who gets what they did. Reconciliation is a long hard process without shortcuts. It's brutal to find out exactly how broken the WS is, it's even more brutal to self reflect and notice how much you are flawed. I know I have not been a model husband, I want to be, just as much as my wife wanted to be the model wife. We are both fallible and combined we had an adequate marriage overall. Worthy of cheating? No marriage is worthy of cheating even if abuse is present. That is why there is divorce. 

Your husband probably wanted his marriage with you, he was just too weak to be the man you needed. That's not on you in the least, you were a great spouse, he just couldn't live up to that. He is broken and can't do the work associated with reconciliation. To tell the truth not many people have that strength, so reconciliation has a high rate of failure. I can tell you my wife is remorseful, doing the heavy lifting and totally committed. I am committed also, and yet we struggle because of how difficult reconciliation is. 

You didn't waste seven years, you became a much more intelligent and better person for enduring what you have. Your next relationship will be that much better because of this failed reconciliation. It's it heartbreaking? Yes, but you now have the opportunity to find the man who will love and cherish as you deserve. You will be a happier person, more well rounded, and best of all the best self you can be. So see the positives you have accomplished, see the positives yet to come. You will be just fine TeddieG, this I know.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## pidge70 (Jan 17, 2011)

MattMatt said:


> Which contains 101 ways to harm your spouse and family.


I wonder, when you start threads like this, I feel like you haven't coped with your W's infidelity as well as you would like us to think.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Florida_rosbif (Oct 18, 2015)

Wolf1974 said:


> Chapter 9
> Kids, they aren't really hurt by any of this and 15 other lies you need to repeat to yourself daily


I like this one, it's painful, but I like it. 

The corollary is, if the kids do turn out to be hurt by the explosion of the family unit, do the feedback loop back to "It's your fault that I had the affair so you have to take some responsibility for what's happened to our children..."


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## TeddieG (Sep 9, 2015)

pidge70 said:


> I wonder, when you start threads like this, I feel like you haven't coped with your W's infidelity as well as you would like us to think.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Pidge I love your avatar. LOL! 

But one of the things I'm wondering about, now that h is gone and the divorce almost final, is triggers. I'm sure I'll have them a lot (if I see a license plate from his home state, which is 1200 miles and on the other side of the country from here, but I do occasionally see them), or just any little thing. 

And from some time I spent on some midlife crisis forums, I know that people come through MLC and reach the other side and still have characteristics that they didn't overcome, like selfishness or abruptness or lack of empathy. 

This thread and your response makes me wonder if WS's who embrace reconciliation might still carry with them some practices or attitudes that linger from the wandering. I guess I should ask MattMatt, since he started the thread.

This thread drew me because I am in the throes of h deciding against reconciliation and even against our marriage, but I am curious how triggers work. The triggers I've primarily experienced were while he was home. I'm just wondering what they will be like now. It seems to me a thread like this could be the product of a trigger and a way to deal with it.


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

pidge70 said:


> I wonder, when you start threads like this, I feel like you haven't coped with your W's infidelity as well as you would like us to think.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I don't know I think sometimes humor is the best way to deal with personal loss and tragedy personally. :smile2:


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## Wolf1974 (Feb 19, 2014)

Florida_rosbif said:


> I like this one, it's painful, but I like it.
> 
> The corollary is, if the kids do turn out to be hurt by the explosion of the family unit, do the feedback loop back to "It's your fault that I had the affair so you have to take some responsibility for what's happened to our children..."


I know that is what my X wife would like to think. Unfortunate for her her children aren't gullible and will see through those lies once they are old enough to hear the why we divorced.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

I thought this thread was meant to be a bit tongue-in-cheek. Perhaps I misinterpreted the intent?

I'll quietly exit now... 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

happy as a clam said:


> I thought this thread was meant to be a bit tongue-in-cheek. Perhaps I misinterpreted the intent?
> 
> I'll quietly exit now...
> _Posted via Mobile Device_




That was my perception also, and then reading Mountainrunners post made me realize how hurtful my posts could be construed.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

TeddieG said:


> Pidge I love your avatar. LOL!
> 
> But one of the things I'm wondering about, now that h is gone and the divorce almost final, is triggers. I'm sure I'll have them a lot (if I see a license plate from his home state, which is 1200 miles and on the other side of the country from here, but I do occasionally see them), or just any little thing.
> 
> ...




Triggers are painful, I trigger regarding anything in a forest preserve as that is where my wife and OM met up. So trees, grass, gophers, squirrels, dandelions, leaves, and birds!!!! Yay!!!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

MountainRunner said:


> I understand the need to commiserate, but as a cheater myself I have never once attempted to shift blame to her, I did not make excuses, never claimed to be a victim, I did not do anything other than *IMMEDIATELY* tell her and own it. I will openly admit to being extremely selfish by placing my needs before hers and if I blame anyone...I blame myself for not seeing how fvcked up I've been all these years.
> 
> And some of us cheaters intend upon making good on our promise to seek help, get better, and be a faithful, loving, caring spouse.
> 
> But you all go ahead and use that broad brush...In the meantime, I'll continue to love my woman, care for her, be *exclusively* hers, and do the work I need to do to accomplish those goals.


MR, I think you're a good guy that is trying to make good on his promises.

Being honest though, you wouldn't have really broken your promises to begin with if there weren't some nuggets of truth in this broad brush while you were cheating, though?

Maybe build us a bridge by describing your mindset while you were cheating.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

pidge70 said:


> I wonder, when you start threads like this, I feel like you haven't coped with your W's infidelity as well as you would like us to think.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It's not the infidelity that causes most of the problems in our relationship.

Problems are caused by my wife's Asperger's Syndrome which can be hard to cope with sometimes to be honest. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

marduk said:


> Maybe build us a bridge by describing your mindset while you were cheating.


I'd rather not, thank you. I've been put through the TAM "meat grinder" enough, and at the moment I really don't feel like getting dogpiled on as I just spent 5 hours in the ER watching my wife writhe in agony from some large kidney stones. I'm wiped.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

MountainRunner said:


> I'd rather not, thank you. I've been put through the TAM "meat grinder" enough, and at the moment I really don't feel like getting dogpiled on as I just spent 5 hours in the ER watching my wife writhe in agony from some large kidney stones. I'm wiped.


Ouch! Your poor wife! 

I know what you mean about the "meat grinder."

I once told my full story on TAM about how I got together with my wife (I was her affair partner) and that didn't go down too well, which I actually expected. We have been together now for 25 years, in total.


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## TeddieG (Sep 9, 2015)

MR, so sorry about your wife's kidney stones. My h had them, severely, and three procedures to rid himself of them. I remember the ER visit well. Sending out my best thoughts to the both of you.


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## Hardtohandle (Jan 10, 2013)

Truthseeker1 said:


> dont forget the subtitle "my needs my needs: and its all your fault"


I'm laughing out loud as quote this.. This was funny..


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## Hardtohandle (Jan 10, 2013)

This is utterly some great funny stuff..


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

It's good that folks here can laugh through the pain.


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

That's all we're trying to do, here - laugh through the pain.

If you yourself have never been cheated on by someone who vowed to forsake all others for you, you really don't know what that pain is like. And if you've never been left for the OM/OW, and by someone who wasn't willing to even remotely try to save the marriage, you really, really don't know what that pain is like.

I'm tired of crying all the time. It's nice to have a laugh at the expense of the one who left me and our child once in a while, instead of wallowing in the feeling of abandonment I'm constantly trying to elude.


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## Marduk (Jul 16, 2010)

MountainRunner said:


> I'd rather not, thank you. I've been put through the TAM "meat grinder" enough, and at the moment I really don't feel like getting dogpiled on as I just spent 5 hours in the ER watching my wife writhe in agony from some large kidney stones. I'm wiped.


I hope she's OK!


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

marduk said:


> I hope she's OK!


Thank you Marduk, she's sleeping now. We got home, I made her some soup, gave her a couple of norcos and she is sleeping now. Best thing for her at the moment. Sorry to have hijacked the thread folks.

And now...back to our regularly scheduled program.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

MountainRunner said:


> Thank you Marduk, she's sleeping now. We got home, I made her some soup, gave her a couple of norcos and she is sleeping now. Best thing for her at the moment. Sorry to have hijacked the thread folks.
> 
> And now...back to our regularly scheduled program.




Ouch!!! Painful those stones are. When I had mine I felt like I was giving birth, actually I did to a stone the size of a grain of sand!! The sharpest pain I ever felt was a kidney stone, MR I hope your wife is staying comfortable through this. Well wishes for a speedy recovery and God's blessings sent your way.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

drifting on said:


> Ouch!!! Painful those stones are. When I had mine I felt like I was giving birth, actually I did to a stone the size of a grain of sand!! The sharpest pain I ever felt was a kidney stone, MR I hope your wife is staying comfortable through this. Well wishes for a speedy recovery and God's blessings sent your way.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Thanks DO...Oh and BTW, I wasn't offended or hurt by anything you or anyone else here for that matter. I just wanted to point out that there are those of us cheaters who truly do feel horrible for the destruction they've created by their own selfish needs (of which I even conceded that I was selfish and disrespectful of my wife's needs and emotions).

Once my eyes were open, I immediately set about to rectify the situation. Again...muchas gracias Amigo.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

MountainRunner said:


> Thanks DO...Oh and BTW, I wasn't offended or hurt by anything you or anyone else here for that matter. I just wanted to point out that there are those of us cheaters who truly do feel horrible for the destruction they've created by their own selfish needs (of which I even conceded that I was selfish and disrespectful of my wife's needs and emotions).
> 
> Once my eyes were open, I immediately set about to rectify the situation. Again...muchas gracias Amigo.




I am relieved I didn't offend you with my poor choice in words and posts. That was not my intention at all, however, I can see how it could cause hurt to a WS who has worked very hard to change themselves. I guess I was just ignorant in my posts and trying to spread the pain I felt towards others. Something that I don't believe anyone deserved. So I apologized to you if I had caused you harm. MR o have much respect for you, for how you are helping your wife through, for realizing you were broken, and for your efforts and dedication to become a better person. I admire your strength, character, and dedication.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Ceegee (Sep 9, 2012)

Chapter 7 

After kicking your spouse out of the home, divorcing him, taking 1/3 of his paycheck, accusing him of abuse, lying etc, now is time to hit him where it hurts. 

How to turn the kids against him/her.


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

Chapter Pi: Throwing Everyone Under The Bus To Continue Protecting Yourself 

First paragraph: Now that you've left your spouse and family for your Affair Partner, you can alleviate your guilt about the destruction you've caused to their world by blaming HER/HIM for everything! Here are some handy phrases you can use: "She/he knew I was married and not separated, but she/he pursued me, anyway" and "I couldn't help it - she/he threw her/himself at me."

Chapter Pi Plus One: My AP And I Screwed You. Now Let's All Join Hands And Sing!

First paragraph: Even though you've succeeded in making your ex hate your AP by throwing her/him under the bus as detailed in the previous chapter, there's no reason you can't all be friends. No hard feelings, right? If your AP likes to bake, she/he can send two dozen homemade cookies with your child to your ex's house in the guise of them all being for your child. Nothing inappropriate, there. It's a peace offering. And if your ex doesn't graciously thank your AP for their thoughtfulness, well, there's just something wrong with them. It's sad when those who have been thrown away like yesterday's garbage and have their noses rubbed in it regularly can't just get over it and move on.


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## nursejackie (May 22, 2015)

I am reading all the chapter headings and feeling a righteous indignation toward all WS everywhere- and then I remember I am one of those [email protected] self centred broken people too. Its always a humbling experience 

DO I thought I was sincerely sorry for the hurt and pain I caused my H -but maybe not sorry enough ? Maybe I can't be sorry enough because of his undisclosed A/EA? I am trying.

Sorry to hear about your FIL. My dad is also dieing of cancer -these are hard times and it does feel like the load is too heavy a burden. I stayed home from work these past few days to try and deal with his fast decline (and H's and I's "stuff")

MR -I wanted my H and I to be one of the minority that makes it - but the roller coaster often threatens to throw us both off--your attitude (and others with successful R's is motivation to keep at it.
(yikes the kidney stone pain is the worst ever- more painful even than childbirth- hope your wife is feeling better soon)


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## Heatherknows (Aug 21, 2015)

nursejackie said:


> I am reading all the chapter headings and feeling a righteous indignation toward all WS everywhere- and then I remember I am one of those [email protected] self centred broken people too. Its always a humbling experience


If I'm not mistaken I think the OP is a WS.


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

You are not mistaken. MattMatt said in this thread, and I'm sure he has in others, that he was his current wife's AP.

Most of us Betrayed Spouses in this thread were either left for the AP, or divorced because reconciliation wasn't an option for either or both parties.

I think those of you WS's who are truly remorseful and doing everything you need to be doing to regain your spouse's trust and rebuild your marriage are exempt from our comments. Most of us wish our waywards had been like you and immediately ended their affairs, gone to counseling with us, etc. And most of us would have tried to save our marriages if that were the case.

I know that's already been said, but some of you still seem to be offended by this thread.

I can't say I've walked a mile in your shoes, but as much as I vent about my ex here, I do wish I could understand what he was thinking. Surely you can try to imagine what you would feel like if it were your spouse who cheated, lied to you repeatedly about it, continued merrily on with the affair after you found out about it, and left you and your kids for the AP. Can't you?


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## Heatherknows (Aug 21, 2015)

Nomorebeans said:


> You are not mistaken. MattMatt said in this thread, and I'm sure he has in others, that he was his current wife's AP.
> 
> Most of us Betrayed Spouses in this thread were either left for the AP, or divorced because reconciliation wasn't an option for either or both parties.
> 
> ...


I can completely understand. If my husband cheated on me I would be crushed.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Heatherknows said:


> If I'm not mistaken I think the OP is a WS.


Well, sort of. It was complicated.

It was a drunken RA that I didn't realise was an affair until it almost went physical. Then I realised that I was being an utter POS and immediately confessed to my wife. And had a breakdown thst required medicine to help pull me through.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

marduk said:


> Maybe build us a bridge by describing your mindset while you were cheating.


OK Marduk, I've reconsidered, so I will add this...

I have successfully managed to purposely destroy every single relationship I was ever in due to my philandering. As I discover what makes me tick (because I've gone through 55 years of life really not understanding), I have in some shape or form managed to convince myself that my partner does not love me anymore. Now why would someone do that you say, right? I mean it...Every woman I have been romantically involved with I found some way to "KNOW" that she no longer wants me. Now here is why...I don't deserve her love. I have such a low opinion of myself that I tell myself "why would she want to be with a guy like me?"

I drive myself into a depression and then...all it takes is for a woman to express interest and she begins "feeding me"...and it is all over.

I sabotage myself and I never understood that until recently.


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

Thank you for that, MR. It was very brave of you, and gives me insight into my ex I didn't have before.

I felt like he was pushing me away for years, and never understood why, because he was at the same time always telling me how much he loved me. 

Here I thought he left me for her because he thought he was entitled to something better. I'm here to tell you that no one will ever love and understand him like I did. But he couldn't see that. So, as the saying goes, he will get the love he thinks he deserves.

It makes me very sad for him. And this is honestly the first time I've actually felt pity for him.

I'm glad you have found this insight to yourself. You should be proud - you worked hard, and it took great courage, to get there.


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## TeddieG (Sep 9, 2015)

Thanks, MR. Agreed, it was not only brave of you, but generous of you. You said what I think my H would say. And I would say what nomorebeans said. 

The difference is, you figured it out. I don't what it would/will take for MY h to figure it out, IF he ever does. I DO think my h would say that no one loved him as much or ever got him or saw into him and still loved him as much as me, but he's still sabotaging. Part of it is FOO stuff. 

But here's the weird part of it. Your wife did something that led you to realize if you didn't stop self-sabotaging, you were going to lose her, and you valued her enough, above all the other relationships you let go, to become self aware enough to stop doing it. 

Or maybe it was random, and you just happened to figure it out and were with someone who had insight into that and wanted to ride it out with you. I guess my point is, maybe your wife did something or said something or acted in a particular way that made you realize what you were doing, or you were willing to try to stop the self-sabotage and knew she would stand by you, either because she saw what you had been doing to yourself or just intuitively knew you were on the verge of a breakthrough about SOMETHING big about yourself you were willing to fix.

I'm rambling. But I suspect you guys get my drift. 


Either way, good for you, good for her, and thanks for being honest.


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## Heatherknows (Aug 21, 2015)

MattMatt said:


> Well, sort of. It was complicated.
> 
> It was a drunken RA that I didn't realise was an affair until it almost went physical. Then I realised that I was being an utter POS and immediately confessed to my wife. And had a breakdown thst required medicine to help pull me through.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


What is an RA?


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

Heatherknows said:


> What is an RA?


Revenge affair


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## nursejackie (May 22, 2015)

I wasn't offended-just a wake up call that as much as id like to think this is all behind me - it isn't, ever.


Also sometimes I think that what I am writing on here is what is in my heart but my actions to my H don't always reflect what I know to be true from TAM.

The hardest thing for me is to show that I am 100% remorseful when I am still holding resentment towards him for his lies. 

I do know how it feels to suspect my spouse of having an EA/A. I don't know what it feels like to have the details come out of his mouth and understand with certainty. I am not sure I am strong enough to withstand that. I don't know what its like to have someone give up on the marriage and leave…yet

The situation most BS posting here find themselves in is beyond heartbreaking. I am rooting for everyone to find happiness and peace and it is difficult to equate what I did with having the strength to cause such devastation. If all potential WS read CWI they would never ever cheat. They would alter the circumstances that were leading to the possibility as soon as they recognized it. 

Unless they are really heartless POS with no integrity and void of good character.

Life is uncertain, marriage is tough, humans are complicated.


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## Heatherknows (Aug 21, 2015)

Pluto2 said:


> Revenge affair


Thx!


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

TeddieG said:


> But here's the weird part of it. *Your wife did something that led you to realize if you didn't stop self-sabotaging, you were going to lose her*, and you valued her enough, above all the other relationships you let go, to become self aware enough to stop doing it.


I would not have figured out this diagnosis if it wasn't for her. She did in fact do something that led to my "epiphany". I swear, the moment it occurred is still very vivid in my mind. We were in the kitchen and she was screaming at me (keep in mind that this is just a day or two post D-Day) about my behavior around women and at one point she screams "WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU? WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOUR HEAD?"

Suddenly, I just shut up, looked at her and softly said "I don't know, but I will find out."

After a bit of googling on "self esteem", "infidelity", "behavior" and various other iterations, I stumbled across a website that described personality disorders. What I read there very closely described me, and it was very disconcerting and most definitely not promising. Most material I was reading was telling the partner of an NPD/BPD/HPD to simply throw in the towel and leave because our rates of successful treatment are not very good.

Anyway, I just wanted to note that you were spot on that it was indeed something that my wife did that brought us here to this point. 

I swear I don't deserve her, but I'm trying my best to do right by her now. She is a wonderful woman and I'm very lucky she is still here with me.


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## john117 (May 20, 2013)

There used to be an awesome Tiny Violin app when I had a Windows Phone about 5 years ago. You could actually "play" it. I used to do that in team meetings when people complained...


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## TeddieG (Sep 9, 2015)

MountainRunner said:


> I would not have figured out this diagnosis if it wasn't for her. She did in fact do something that led to my "epiphany". I swear, the moment it occurred is still very vivid in my mind. We were in the kitchen and she was screaming at me (keep in mind that this is just a day or two post D-Day) about my behavior around women and at one point she screams "WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU? WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOUR HEAD?"
> 
> Suddenly, I just shut up, looked at her and softly said "I don't know, but I will find out."
> 
> ...


Thanks for sharing! Positive outcomes are always nice to hear about.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

Nursejackie

You have shown remorse for your actions and will have a difficult reconciliation. That's not to scare you, it's to prepare you for how difficult your journey will be. Your up against some tough odds, but with dedication and commitment from you both, you can make it. Your task is incredibly hard while suspecting your spouse, I think you are strong enough. I hope you and your spouse find peace and happiness, and that your relationship grows stronger.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

nursejackie said:


> The situation most BS posting here find themselves in is beyond heartbreaking.


Ain't that the truth. Hell...I'm the WS and some of the stories I read are so heart wrenching that I find myself needing to step away for a bit. In the same token, I find that it keeps me accountable for what I have done...if that makes any sense, but it does to me.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

MountainRunner said:


> I would not have figured out this diagnosis if it wasn't for her. She did in fact do something that led to my "epiphany". I swear, the moment it occurred is still very vivid in my mind. We were in the kitchen and she was screaming at me (keep in mind that this is just a day or two post D-Day) about my behavior around women and at one point she screams "WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU? WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOUR HEAD?"
> 
> Suddenly, I just shut up, looked at her and softly said "I don't know, but I will find out."
> 
> ...




MR, that is the day you discovered many things about yourself and your life. Your realization that there was a disorder and your wife pleading to you made you realize this. No longer could you deny that something was amiss in your thought process. It is your response to this situation that I find to be truly remarkable. You self reflected, you researched, you applied information to your being. In other words MR, you could no longer run or hide from your emotions and feelings regarding your actions. That in itself became a problem for you, and finding the cause your number one priority. 

Since then you have thought of ways to make your wife feel safe, remorse, regret, and determination to correct your flaws. This is why I apologized, my posts were insensitive and demeaning in my opinion, but I am letting them stand as people can then see my flaws and how fallible I am personally. I found self reflecting to be very difficult with infidelity, but I didn't look at the big picture. I had difficulty looking at the flaws our marriage had and internally placed all the blame on my wife. I thought why am I in therapy? She caused this, not me. The bigger picture showed me so much more, once I was able to see it. 

You deserve your wife, and she deserves the now improved MR. In my opinion you both were lucky to find one another, to marry, and to be together the rest of your lives. It is obvious that this lady loves you very much, and your actions show how much you love her.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TeddieG (Sep 9, 2015)

drifting on said:


> MR, that is the day you discovered many things about yourself and your life. Your realization that there was a disorder and your wife pleading to you made you realize this. No longer could you deny that something was amiss in your thought process. *It is your response to this situation that I find to be truly remarkable. You self reflected, you researched, you applied information to your being.* In other words MR, you could no longer run or hide from your emotions and feelings regarding your actions. That in itself became a problem for you, and finding the cause your number one priority.
> 
> Since then you have thought of ways to make your wife feel safe, remorse, regret, and determination to correct your flaws. This is why I apologized, my posts were insensitive and demeaning in my opinion, but I am letting them stand as people can then see my flaws and how fallible I am personally. I found self reflecting to be very difficult with infidelity, but I didn't look at the big picture. I had difficulty looking at the flaws our marriage had and internally placed all the blame on my wife. I thought why am I in therapy? She caused this, not me. The bigger picture showed me so much more, once I was able to see it.
> 
> ...


:iagree::iagree::iagree:

Drifting on, thanks for showing that a BS can overcome too. Between the two of you, there is a lot of hope in these posts.


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## header (Nov 14, 2015)

Matt I read your story.

Your wife cheated on you!

So is this how you feel about her?


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## nursejackie (May 22, 2015)

MattMatt
I also wanted to figure things out more clearly with your story - I am not sure how to do that? 
As I have it so far 
you were married, your wife cheated, you had an RA then divorced your wife and married the AP?
Definitely need some filler here...

DO - thanks for the kind words of encouragement- not that great the last couple of days-triggering over everything- he saved an article about a band whose genre he would never listen to (but OW is hugely into) then lied about what the genre was, also watching the food channel all the time -another OW interest- she would bring samples of her baking in for H and others to try (and the reason he said he brought her a food gift back from our holidays). 

I HATE this feeling. HATE it. It makes me feel insecure and imagine all sorts of s#!t. I can go from him watching the food channel to them … in an instant. Stupid and counter productive to our R. It makes me so angry 

Then I am reminded through this thread that half of all this pain (or more) is on my shoulders. He asked me if I had looked OM up in the last 25 years? yes- googled his name a couple of times to see what he was up to- also accepted him on a business site as a friend then deleted my account - years and years ago- but it is NOW for H.

Sorry if this is a threadjack? It was kind of related.


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## MountainRunner (Dec 30, 2014)

nursejackie said:


> MattMatt
> I also wanted to figure things out more clearly with your story - I am not sure how to do that?
> As I have it so far
> you were married, your wife cheated, you had an RA then divorced your wife and married the AP?
> ...


Hang in there Jackie. All the best my friend...*big hug*


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

All the best to both of you, NJ and MR.

NJ, my ex had at least two EAs that I know about - one about 14 years ago that ended (or went way underground) because I finally let him know, since he couldn't seem to figure it out himself, that the relationship was inappropriate. He was making mixed CDs for her of music he liked that he wanted to share with her (which he had never done for me even though I asked him to on a couple occasions) and couldn't understand why that, and regularly "buddy bidding" for month-long schedules of airline trips with her, bothered me. He's had another one going on with another flight attendant - the one at whose father's funeral he met the OW - the enabler - for the entirety of our marriage. Don't know why I was shocked when he ultimately left me for this most recent OW - maybe he was right, after all, when he said I should have seen it coming.

In any event, my point is I know EAs are extremely hurtful, so I feel for you. You cheated 25 years ago, and you blame yourself partly for his current EA? Don't do that to yourself. No one deserves being forsaken for / replaced by (even partially) another life partner while still married or in a committed relationship. Even if it's a RA. Perhaps even moreso. Because a RA is driven by spite. An A is driven by selfishness. Neither is pretty, but spite is just a shade more willfully hurtful than the other.


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

All the best to both of you, NJ and MR.

NJ, my ex had at least two EAs that I know about - one about 14 years ago that ended (or went way underground) because I finally let him know, since he couldn't seem to figure it out himself, that the relationship was inappropriate. He was making mixed CDs for her of music he liked that he wanted to share with her (which he had never done for me even though I asked him to on a couple occasions) and couldn't understand why that, and regularly "buddy bidding" for month-long schedules of airline trips with her, bothered me. He's had another one going on with another flight attendant - the one at whose father's funeral he met the OW - the enabler - for the entirety of our marriage. Don't know why I was shocked when he ultimately left me for this most recent OW - maybe he was right, after all, when he said I should have seen it coming.

In any event, my point is I know EAs are extremely hurtful, so I feel for you. You cheated 25 years ago, and you blame yourself partly for his current EA? Don't do that to yourself. No one deserves being forsaken for / replaced by (even partially) another life partner while still married or in a committed relationship. Even if it's a RA. Perhaps even moreso. Because a RA is driven by spite. An A is driven by selfishness. Neither is pretty, but spite is just a shade more willfully hurtful than the other.


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

Sorry for the double (triple?) post. Dang phone app isn't letting me edit OR delete, apparently.


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## Ceegee (Sep 9, 2012)

nursejackie said:


> ...
> 
> If all potential WS read CWI they would never ever cheat. They would alter the circumstances that were leading to the possibility as soon as they recognized it.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the reminder. 

Chapter 9

Compartmentalization -


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## nursejackie (May 22, 2015)

No more beans- 
Ugh! I am sorry for what you have been through. How can they be so delusional? Because really- a personalized CD of all her favourite music? how could that be inappropriate?! The whole thing is -it means they are thinking about them away from work, planning on what they can do to make them happy, show them that they care…but we are supposed to be "mature " and let go of the " petty jealousy"…

H wanted me to make handmade soap for the OW to show his appreciation for everything she does for him! Also brought her my magazines I threw out, the grapes from our vines to make jelly, potatoes he dug up on our vacation…

He told our MC that they have no feelings for each other -NONE- just your typical workmates interacting day to day..
14 texts one day, 19 the next, none inappropriate- but none about work either.

Today I can't handle it. Not even a little bit.


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## Nomorebeans (Mar 31, 2015)

Oh, man, NJ! Yeah, they're idiots. My ex would ask me to help him type emails to his first EA - that one happened before there was texting. He'd always mention me in them so I'd feel better about the fact that he was going out of his way to stay in contact with her and had three or four paragraphs to share with her at a time. Funny thing - he never sent emails to his male friends. It didn't help matters that he told me she was coming off an affair with a married captain that had ended badly, and she needed a friend. Aw. Poor dear.

Meanwhile, he got out of control jealous once when he was sure I must be having an affair because I bought new underwear right before going on a business trip to San Francisco. It wasn't sexy underwear - it was the kind of underwear you'd wear to work, like most of my other underwear. But it was just of slightly higher quality than my usual stuff.

Another time, he was sure I was screwing around because he saw a text on my phone from a number he didn't recognize that just said "I wish we could go to movies together." It was from a girlfriend in Utah who was responding to a post I'd just made to Facebook about a movie I had just gone to see.

All of these are signs I should have heeded. He was a cheater, so figured I must be one, too.

Sorry you're dealing with this kind of crap from your H. The hand-me-down gift giving is particularly gag inducing. I know it hurts.


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

nursejackie said:


> No more beans-
> Ugh! I am sorry for what you have been through. How can they be so delusional? Because really- a personalized CD of all her favourite music? how could that be inappropriate?! The whole thing is -it means they are thinking about them away from work, planning on what they can do to make them happy, show them that they care…but we are supposed to be "mature " and let go of the " petty jealousy"…
> 
> H wanted me to make handmade soap for the OW to show his appreciation for everything she does for him! Also brought her my magazines I threw out, the grapes from our vines to make jelly, potatoes he dug up on our vacation…
> ...




Nursejackie

I don't know if this helps you at all or not, but hang in there. After you have moved through your affair you will move through his. Both will get worked out but as you are going through it is very brutal. Reconciliation is very difficult, but people make it through, look at mountainrunner. Think of the difficulty he is going through with his disorders also. He has made great progress as have you. 

Some days you both need a break, and that's fine to do. You can dot his NJ, you are so much stronger then you think.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## nursejackie (May 22, 2015)

DO- hah! made me cry!


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## nursejackie (May 22, 2015)

Thanks it does help. 

It just seems so pointless. we go round and round over the same stuff and never resolve anything. He won't take responsibility for any lies unless i have concrete proof -then he has these lame excuses that are probably more lies. But of course I can't talk because of what I did.

He complains about me not trusting him and snooping but he doesn't trust me either anymore. So now he is checking up on me and suspicious any time i go out. He wants to check my phone and emails, and Im still unable to quit my compulsive sleuthing.

The hysterical bonding has run its course (although it sure was fun while it lasted)

Its our 30th anniversary on Monday. It seems like such a pathetic farce that we can even call ourselves man and wife you know?
The kids are taking us out to a fancy restaurant to celebrate. Ugh.

We have a trip booked the day after xmas to spread my moms ashes which he is looking into cancelling his ticket as he says he can't live like this anymore.

TOTAL thread jack. Sorry Matt!

Back to the book "I'll be a selfish pr!ck and then you can never get over it…"


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## drifting on (Nov 22, 2013)

nursejackie said:


> Thanks it does help.
> 
> It just seems so pointless. we go round and round over the same stuff and never resolve anything. He won't take responsibility for any lies unless i have concrete proof -then he has these lame excuses that are probably more lies. But of course I can't talk because of what I did.
> 
> ...



I didn't mean to make you cry, I sent you a PM.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## highwood (Jan 12, 2012)

Cheaters will always justify in their mind that the they are the victim and they had no choice but to cheat...I couldn't help myself....you were not giving me what I needed..I find myself thinking with H that he does not give me what I need but I have not strayed...I think it comes down to character. In my opinion I have better character than him and cannot lie as easily as he could.


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## IIJokerII (Apr 7, 2014)

chapter 10: How to Make them Accept their plan B Status quo....... And Like it!


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