# the manipulative kind...



## fire_vogel (Oct 29, 2007)

i do not really know where to begin.
so let me just say that my husband and i are currently evolving in an environment which includes a highly manipulative woman.
the latter is a foreigner, she's married and has kids, all of which she's left in her homeland. and now she is here, having an affair with another married man, who also has kids.

my husband and i lived apart for 3 months (during which we were taking care of our visa issues) but our relationship was still going strong despite the distance. circumstances were such, we didn't really have the choice. but since returning here (slightly more than a week back) i've learnt of the friendship he's had with this woman. i was brought to believe that she is a wonderful person 'the very best there can be' but since coming back, my husband has been filling me on the actual facts.

in fact, my husband and i live in a shared house, and this woman lives in the same house.
from what i've noticed and observed, this woman has got all the men in this house wrapped around her little finger, and what's most amazing, is that they don't even seem to realise it.
my husband has sort of got out of the 'mainstream' group, that exists in this house, since i have arrived, but time is showing me that some damage has already been done (a change in his attitude is the proof of this).

i don't really know what to do or think, and we seem to be having arguments about this which lead nowhere... or rather, which lead to mounting tension, on top of everything else.

do you guys think i'm worrying for nothing?


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

No I think it is something. I have told countless friends that two men or two women can not share an apartment for long without fighting. As each person is different they will not share the chores equally. In the case of you and your husband this women is trying to be the Alpha female. This will only belittle you. If at all possible I'd suggest you and your husband find a place as soon as you can for yourselves.

draconis


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## fire_vogel (Oct 29, 2007)

draconis said:


> No I think it is something. I have told countless friends that two men or two women can not share an apartment for long without fighting. As each person is different they will not share the chores equally. In the case of you and your husband this women is trying to be the Alpha female. This will only belittle you. If at all possible I'd suggest you and your husband find a place as soon as you can for yourselves.
> 
> draconis


we have already decided to move, now it's just a question of finding something else. what freaks me out most, is that my husband tells me that he considers this woman as a 'sister' and that considers the rest of the men in this house as her 'brothers' or even her 'sons' (you leave your own kids back home and you start considering grown up men as sons? what the...?!) and the thing is, at the beginning of my relationship with my husband, when we were still dating, i had a colleague whom i was specially close to and reciprocated my affection and he would call me his little sister, just as i would call him my big brother (i was having issues with my REAL big brother at the time, the latter wasn't speaking to me anymore, and i think i just needed a 'brother-figure', but the friendship was genuine nonetheless). but when my husband, at the time bf, chanced upon a mail from this guy asking me out for a cup of coffee, he got real mad and said that i was being naive and trusting the guy way too much and that i would end up betraying him and things like that. since it was the beginning of our relationship and i didn't want to lose him, i thought about it and realised that i indeed might have hastened in trusting this guy and decided to bring the friendship down to a more formal level.
but today, the very things that he reproached me, these are the things that he is doing. the three months that i wasn't here, he spent lots of time with this woman (and the other housemates as well), she would cook for him as well and he would often praise her when talking to me on the phone (about what a wonderful person she is blablabla... but of course, now i know the true picture). and i found pictures of this woman and him on his phone, his arms around her shoulder.
but the one big thing that hurt the most, was his 'first' lie to me. he had gone to drop his mom at the airport, and over the phone when i asked who was going with him, he said he was going with a male friend. but when i visited his mom to check if she had reached our homeland safely, i found out from her that he had actually gone with this woman (my mother in law seems to think as well that this woman is the best thing that has ever happened to womanhood...for cryin' out loud). so there, i caught his lie.
after thinking about it and i waited till he had finished work (calculating time difference etc), i msged and asked him once again with whom he had gone to the airport. instead of confronting him with the lie, i gave him a chance to tell me the truth. and he did. i was real hurt, but asked him why he lied and he said that he lied coz he didn't want to hurt my feelings, knowing that i'd be hurt if he told me that he was with another woman (i wouldn't have been hurt, i might have been a bit pissed coz i don't even know that other woman, but not hurt coz am pretty open-minded and am not overly possessive or jealous of my spouse). but he apologised profusely and seemed really sorry that he had lied. but nevertheless, he lied.
all that for this woman.

since i've returned, he hardly talks to that woman anymore. but i'm hurt at all the things that have happened in my absence and the lies that he's been telling me, knowingly.

i just don't know what to think anymore.

and i know that my husband is a good man, but i just don't know how to make him realise that certain things he's doing are simply not right.

P.S. i'm sorry this got so long, it's all just been simmering for so long inside... it just got out.

thanks for reading it anyway, it means a lot to me.


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## evenow (Oct 15, 2007)

It sounds like a rather odd relationship that your husband has with this woman. If he feels the need to lie, this isn't good at all. I hadn't read this post before I replied to your other one. Another reason a man is sometimes insecure and possessive is because he feels guilty about something. 

He may be a little too emotionally involved with this lady. I would be worried too. A good way to tell if your feelings are justified is by having an open conversation with him about your fears. If they are dismissed or he reacts defensively, that would tell you a lot and it wouldn't be a positive sign.

If I told my husband I was concerned that he was getting a little too close to someone and nothing was going on he would listen and change his behavior accordingly. If he did the same to me and something _was_ going on--I would feel resentful, angry and continue my relationship while trying to make him feel crazy and guilty for suggesting anything.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

evenow said:


> If I told my husband I was concerned that he was getting a little too close to someone and nothing was going on he would listen and change his behavior accordingly.


That is exactly the way the wife and I are, other then the fact she is a bit flirty, which in the end I ask she just doesn't cross certain barriers I'd feel uncomfortable with.

draconis


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## oceanbreeze (Oct 8, 2007)

interesting post. it's definitely time for the both of you to be together but separate from any outside influences.


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## SageMother (Jun 28, 2007)

I think you need to put your foot down. If this isn't a blood relative , and even if it is, you shouldn't be subjected to this woman's presence.


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## fire_vogel (Oct 29, 2007)

@ evenow: i did talk to him about it and he began by telling me that he understood my reaction, but the discussion ended in heavy silence. prior to which he was justifying the closeness that has been established between them by using the same excuses of him considering her as a sister and her considering him and the other guys as 'sons' (i really can't take in this BS).

@ oceanbreeze: my exact thoughts. this is why we have decided to move.

@ sagemother: unfortunately, due to our financial situation, living in a shared house/flat turns out to be much more affordable for us. in time we hope to be able to get ourselves a flat of our own, but right now we can't afford that. but like i said, we have decided to move. and it will take another month before that happens (notice period for the current house).


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## fire_vogel (Oct 29, 2007)

just a little update... or rather an observation, with reference to what draconis said earlier about this woman wanting to be the Alpha female:

not that i have any such ambitions in this house, i couldn't care less. all i want is to be at peace, quiet and living happily, without interfering in the lives of others and vice versa.
but i noticed yesterday that this woman is quite possessive of the position she holds in this house. i was talking to one of the housemates yesterday (a female) and this woman came along, carrying big bags and it was obvious she was going to put them in her room, but she just stopped right there in the kitchen (that's where we were the other housemate and i) and barged into the conversation, trying to manipulate all the attention. for crying out loud, it was so bloody pathetic. i just greeted the other housemate and walked away. this 'attention' that she needs, well i don't need it, so she might as well have it. but when it's my husband's attention that she's seeking, well i do have a problem with THAT.

what i can't seem to understand though, why be so b*tchy? and b*tch-like?
she's left a husband back home, is cheating on him with some other married guy over here, so why does she feel the need to get close to so many other men? it's sickening, it makes me want to puke. it just makes me absolutely sick to my stomach.

oh and each time i want to talk about things that bother me about this woman, my husband keeps telling me to ignore her, to just drop it, forget about it, ignore her. but is it wrong for me to want to talk about things that bother me? even if it's about her? (or rather specially if it's about her) am i just being too anxious? bothering too much about it? SHOULD i drop it? and ignore her? or should i make him understand that i want/need to talk about it?


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

No you should not just ignore it. This is something that is eating at you. Your husband needs to respect that. Just because he can ignore what is going on doesn't mean you have to.

Next time you are in bed and he wants to get frisky turn to him and say I want to talk to you first. Make yourself heard and understood before anything else happens.

draconis


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## fire_vogel (Oct 29, 2007)

it seems he's more ready to hear me out now... when it comes to this woman and some other things that happen in the house. i do feel we're bonding and getting closer. nothing's perfect, of course, but i feel positive. i just feel good about things right now. so am not going to be negative and think negatively. it'll just ruin what's happening and growing so nicely right now.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

fire_vogel said:


> it seems he's more ready to hear me out now... when it comes to this woman and some other things that happen in the house. i do feel we're bonding and getting closer. nothing's perfect, of course, but i feel positive. i just feel good about things right now. so am not going to be negative and think negatively. it'll just ruin what's happening and growing so nicely right now.


I am glad things are going better for you. You mentioned other issue would you care to explain.

draconis


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## fire_vogel (Oct 29, 2007)

draconis said:


> I am glad things are going better for you. You mentioned other issue would you care to explain.
> 
> draconis


well yes, there are some other issues in the house. some of them quite silly, which could have been resolved easily amongst mature adults (but the people round here just don't fit into that category... they go more for the 'spoilt brats' one) and one which i kind of feel confused and annoyed about.

my husband's best friend also lives in the shared house (of course, through help from my husband...). my husband basically got him a job, helped him move to this town... and finally to this place. and this guy, was also one of the witnesses for our wedding. back home, we were like real close, all of us. but now, everything has changed. my husband and his friend hardly talk to each other anymore. this guy, has joined hands with this 'woman' and some of the other housemates and seem to find ganging up against my husband and myself very fun.

the amusing part really, is that these people don't know me, and i have done absolute nothing to them (my husband might have had rows with them) but i wasn't even in the country... so i can't possibly see what they reproach me... other than the fact that i'm his wife, and i find that so immature.

as the days go by, i'm learning more about the 'characters' in this house and i don't know whether to laugh or just frown.
there's this woman... whom i've already told you about, married, with kids, but having an affair with another married man, who also has kids. but one of the male housemates here proposed to her some time back... and she didn't exactly say NO. and she flirts around with this other male housemate. and not that i have anything against homosexuals, absolutely not, but there's this housemate, who's gay, but who loves preaching about religion... and he hates my husband (from observation, i would say it's because he can't stand the fact that my man is so manly...).

these people show absolutely no respect, they talk about my husband/me when i'm in the same room as them, but they tend to use code language, thinking that i'm absolutely stupid or something. i'm just waiting for them to get straightforward and tell me stuff to my face, so i can start giving them pieces of my mind. maybe that might get them to grow up (though i pretty much think these are hopeless cases)...

and after all that, rest assured, my husband and i are actively looking for another place  we couldn't possibly carry on living here. but we're getting closer, and creating a little bubble of our own. so it helps so much with keeping out all the external...crap 

it just surprises me that some men can be so naive as to let themselves be ruled over like this... by such a woman (the term 'such a woman' is actually my way of saying 'b****'... nice isn't it? the British manners are really REALLY rubbing off on me... lol )


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

fire_vogel ~ No doubts some people are weak. The house whose name is it under? Who is it rented to or owns it?

draconis


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## fire_vogel (Oct 29, 2007)

draconis said:


> fire_vogel ~ No doubts some people are weak. The house whose name is it under? Who is it rented to or owns it?
> 
> draconis


uhm well it's the normal British shared house concept.
the landlord X, legally owns it, but rents it out to A, B, C etc... and these are the tenants with signed tenancy contract.

and my particular situation is, the people in this house are just the tenants, the landlord does NOT live with us. however, his nephew (that would be the homosexual... who also tries hard to be the Alpha male.........) lives here and kind of tries to represent 'authority' in the house (it's like kindergarten i tell ya) and the rest are mere tenants.


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Well if all of you are equal I would not worry about ms queen bee as much.

draconis


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## fire_vogel (Oct 29, 2007)

you're right. thing which i'm doing too... i mean, i'm not worrying about it much anymore. the only thing that worried me was how close my husband was to her. but all that's sorted out now. so i really couldn't care less about the woman.


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## fire_vogel (Oct 29, 2007)

just a final update... the woman moved out sometime back, she's returned to her home country. haven't heard from her since. so nothing happening in that way anymore and the house is much more quiet without her around. this chapter is pretty much closed


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## draconis (Oct 3, 2007)

Good to hear, hopefully she will not be back ever.

draconis


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## fire_vogel (Oct 29, 2007)

hopefully.


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