# Considering allowing my husband to have sex outside the marriage



## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

*My husband and I have been married for 10 years. We're both in our early 30's and have 4 kids; the oldest is 5 and the youngest is 18 months. My husband has always had a very high sex drive. He wants sex at least twice a day. Before we had kids, I was happy to oblige, but now it's become extremely difficult for me to meet his needs. Not only is it hard to have frequent sex because of the kids, but my libido has plunged while his seems to be growing even stronger. Right now, we're averaging about twice a week, and I do it mostly just to please him. It's not that he's not good in bed or doesn't care about pleasing me; he really tries to make it good for me, but I just don't really feel much desire to have sex. Every now and then I'll be aroused, but that's becoming increasingly rare. Naturally, that has affected the quality of the sex that we do have. We do it mostly in one position, and I can't even begin to entertain his kinky fantasies. I give him blowjobs but that doesn't really help, it just makes him want to have intercourse even more. 

My husband has made it clear that he needs more and/or better sex, and we seem to be at an impasse because i'm not willing (or able) to give him more than I'm already giving him. I've been to my doctor and a sex therapist and they've told me that there's nothing abnormal about me; my libido seems to have just naturally settled at its current low point. The kids keep me busy but i don't work so i don't feel like I'm under a crazy amount of stress or anything. I've just lost interest in sex.

My husband has asked my permission to go outside the marriage to have his needs met. He's suggested a number of ground rules, e.g., he must be discreet, no overnight stays with other women unless he's traveling on business, no dates or social outings with other women, he must use protection, he can't bring other women into our house, no sex with anyone that I know personally, no street-level prostitutes, etc. The only rule I would be subject to is that I can't ask about his extramarital sex life (sort of like a "don't ask, don't tell" policy). This kind of thing is apparently not unusual in his family, since his father and uncles had mistresses that their wives knew about but put up with.

He's a wonderful man and we have a great relationship in every other respect. He helps out around the house and with the kids, he's affectionate, he's a great father, he works very hard (60+ hours/week) to support us and our lifestyle (I have some expensive tastes), and he's good to my family. I can't think of a single thing I've ever asked him to do that he hasn't done. He's good looking and very active (he still finds time to work out regularly and maintain a great body despite his hectic schedule), which is why I think he'd have no trouble meeting women for NSA sex if I were to greenlight this arrangement. 

Obviously I'm not thrilled about the idea of my husband having sex with other women. On the other hand, our sex life has declined to the point where sex is like just another chore for me. Perhaps it would be a relief for both of us if he could have his needs met elsewhere. We love each other and our children very much, so divorce is not really an option. 

Any advice would be appreciated.

EDIT 1: A lot of people have said this indicates that my husband is selfish. I think I should clarify why I disagree, and maybe shed some more light on why I'm actually considering this.

When I said my husband is good to my family, I don't just mean that he's courteous and gets along with them. Four years ago, our family was hit with dual tragedies in the span of two weeks: my sister's husband died in a car accident and my mother was diagnosed with breast cancer. My sister was left penniless and uneducated with a 4 year old son to support. My husband helped her get back on her feet, paid for her to go to nursing school, and has acted as a father figure to my nephew. As for my mother, my husband insisted that she move in with us so that he could help with her care (my father died a while ago and I have no other siblings). Because I was pregnant with my third child and nursing my second, I couldn't attend to my mother as much as I wanted. My husband was there for her more than I was; he tended to her, took her to her doctor's appointments, and even stayed with her in the hospital as she recovered from her surgery. My mom credits him with having saved her life (she's now in remission).

The other aspect of it is that my husband didn't want to have this many kids, he only wanted two at the most. I'm the one who wanted four kids and I still want more, and he has completely deferred to my wishes (though he now says he couldn't imagine a life without our 4 children). He had wanted me to be a working woman but I told him I just wanted to be a stay at home mom and raise my kids, and he acquiesced to my wishes and has never put pressure on me to work, instead working more hours himself to provide me with the lifestyle I want.

So I guess I kind of feel guilty that he's sacrificed way more in this marriage than I have. Because of what he's done for my mom, sister and nephew, I would never even think of leaving him even if I caught him cheating on me. So what's the harm if I allow him this vice? Coupled with the fact that my wish to have a lot of kids is partly the reason why we don't have sex as often, I guess I'm seeing this as a way to even things out and make me feel like this isn't such a one-sided relationship. My husband didn't put it that way when he brought this up, but that's how I'm spinning it to myself. It may sound weird, but that's how I feel.

EDIT 2: See my post on page 8 for an update on how things turned out.*


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## Neil (Jan 5, 2011)

No No and No.

Scenario.

you agree, he then has sex with someone. Thinks ooh, that was good, she was hot. Let's do that again. and again,and again,and again, and before you know it she is meeting his emotional needs too, and when you thought you were being helpful to him by agreeing to it, he takes of with the woman and sets up a new life. *EDIT, and it will be all your fault by AGREEING to let him do it


DON'T even go their. He has Hands doesn't he? He doesn't get NOTHING does he? What a selfish ****


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## Syrum (Feb 22, 2011)

*NO WAY*
For the following reasons

- *Risk of falling in love*
He could very well end up falling in love with someone else.

-*Risk of STD's*
even people who are very careful catch these

-*risk of unwanted pregnancy*
Again people are careful, but it happens all the time.

-*risk of children finding out*
Children are a lot smarter then you think, very cluey. What value will they place on marriage and women if they find out he is doing this?

-*Risk of other people finding out*

How will you feel if friends and family find out about this?

-*Reality of him not caring about you and only his sexual needs*.
How will you feel that your husband is having his needs met by someone else, and didn't love you enough to really work on this with you?

*The biggest one is the way he seems to view relationships and women. He seems to see them as interchangeable and disposable, because that is the example he has gotten from his family of origin. Women are people with complex emotions and feelings, and he has been taught that it is OK to use them for sex*

I would really look at your relationship. Think long and hard about what does turn you on , and think about if he could meet those needs. 

Do you really want to be married to a man who would do this to you?


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

Neil said:


> No No and No.
> 
> Scenario.
> 
> ...


You make a valid point but I don't think it's fair to call my husband selfish. He takes great care of me and our family and works hard so that I don't have to (I told him that I don't want to work, and he's never pressured me to). Like I said, he's a wonderful man in every respect, this is the only area in which our relationship is lacking.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Neil (Jan 5, 2011)

Maya627 said:


> You make a valid point but I don't think it's fair to call my husband selfish. He takes great care of me and our family and works hard so that I don't have to (I told him that I don't want to work, and he's never pressured me to). Like I said, he's a wonderful man in every respect, this is the only area in which our relationship is lacking.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


and the fact that you have 4 kids, ranging from 18 months to 5 years...

No wonder you are not the twice a day wife you were.

He may very well be decent in all other parts of the relationship, but its down right disrespectful and it is selfish to ask you to have sex with someone else because you don't give it him more than twice a week (Believe it or not, some family men would love to be in his position with a house full of kids that age range and STILL get it twice a week).

It all about him, you don't come into it, the fact he has asked your permission doesn't even come close to coming across as being respectful. he will be having sex with someone else, and doesn't even want to be questioned about it. So when he does, you are left wondering, where is he, whats he doing, whos he ****ing tonight. You maybe on the verge of letting him do this, but have you thought about how you would think when he actually carries it out?

By all means, make the excuses, but don't then complain when he is out shagging everyone else and you get none even when you do want it.


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## trey69 (Dec 29, 2010)

The first word that came to mind when reading your post was, SELFISH! That's how your husband is acting right now. 

He should consider himself lucky that he was still having sex twice a week, alot of people don't even have that. He has no regards for your feelings on the matter, I mean you do have 4 kids. 

If he is that hell bent on wanting more sex, then divorce him and he can all he wants. Obviously his priorities are not within the marriage/family.


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## lbell629 (May 10, 2010)

I understand the temptation to want to tell him yes - it would be easier for both of you - his "needs" would be met and you would be off the hook for trying to rouse up some kind of desire to have sex with him. But, please don't give in. Him having sex with other women will not fix this in your relationship. It will only bring in new fears, new questions, new problems. You guys will get through this. He can take care of himself during the times you guys have sex - he is lucky to be getting it two times a week. Taking care of 4 children is exhausting work, especially when they are all under the age of 5!!! It is great that he provides and supports you in other areas of your marriage, but he needs to support you in this one too!! Maybe you guys should plan a weekend away from the kids and rest up before hand so you can have sex all weekend long!


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

It's hard for a woman to get sexually attracted to a man when she is home taking care of 4 kids and he is out working 60 hours / week and finding even more time to work out. The lack of time kills the emotional connection.

Another comment is that 2x per day is unreasonable by nearly anyone's standards. I truly think the quantity can be negotiated if you are more willing to demonstrate to him that you truly value him. And that you truly recognize that his needs are important to him on a deep emotional level, and that this is not something you disdain as him just needing to get off.

So before green lighting this marriage killing arrangement... 
Work on deepening your romantic and emotional connection through more together time, more fun activities etc.


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## Red Riding Hood (Apr 14, 2011)

If my H wanted this, I would never be able to agree to it and keep my self-respect (and it wouldn't help my respect of him either.)

~ Red


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## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

is he just being alpha?

twice a week would be heaven for me, but if she wasnt into it and i sensed it was service sex than i would not really want it. 

letting him go somewhere else is lazy on both of your parts, you both have to work and compromise


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

I have no idea why you do not find his behavior selfish. None. Here is the tipping point for me, sex with random people using protection does not protect against Herpes or a host of other STD's. Skin to skin contact is how it is transferred and a condom doesn't protect always protect against that. Apparently your health is of little concern to this man. His needs are way more important.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

Is it possible this is a poor attempt by your husband to get you to want sex more often?


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## bill2011 (Feb 5, 2011)

I can see both sides of this, She hasn't indicated that she is willing to work with him on this either. I do not believe in going outside the marriage. I would rather end one if necessary. My advice would be to offer 3x a week and make an effort to be more involved in the process. 95% of the married men out there would love this frequency. But anything other than her would be out of the question. 

As a man their is a physical but also emotional attachment to sex. The physical part is easy and most could take care of themselves. Going outside the marriage will lead to a loss of emotional connection for him and will damage the marriage.


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## MGirl (Mar 13, 2011)

Maya627 said:


> This kind of thing is apparently not unusual in his family, since his father and uncles had mistresses that their wives knew about but put up with.


This is interesting. I'm surprised no one has commented on this. Since he grew up seeing this situation with "mistresses" in his family, does he believe this is the "norm" for marriages? I can actually slightly see how he thinks this is acceptable, since he's grown up around it and it was tolerated by the wives.That doesn't *make* it acceptable, but it may help to understand what he's thinking. In his family, if the men had higher drives than their wives, the simple solution was to find a mistress, rather than work on a compromise in the marriage. This is likely his mindset and pattern of thinking. 

Again, that's doesn't make it okay, but it may help you communicate better with him if you understand his thought patterns. I personally think that sitting down and working on a compromise and adjusting expectations is a better solution, but that may not be something he's considered, based on his family history. You may need to approach the subject. Just a thought 

Finding another outlet for him would be the *easy* solution for both of you...takes the responsibility off your shoulders, he gets what he thinks he needs. Is it the best solution? No. The best things in life are the things you put the most work into--if you want a great marriage, you'll have to both fight for it, not settle for the easy route. Just my opinion, though.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

bill2011 said:


> She hasn't indicated that she is willing to work with him on this either.


umm, i think taking care of 4 children under 5 all day every day and still managing to squeeze out twice a week even if she is not feeling in the mood for it IS showing a LOT of willingness to work with him.

it doesnt sound like a good idea to me for the same reasons mentioned here...
sti's
emotional for you
his possibly becoming very emotionally involved with one of the other women
one of the other women becoming pregnant (with making pretty decent $ if one of the other women become emotionally attached an "accident" becomes very possible)

im sure there are at least a few others i missed.


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## jezza (Jan 12, 2011)

Well....I am going to risk getting my head blown off by you all...

Maya627 has stated that she loves her husband, he is a good provider for her and their family, he does all his fair share of household chores despite working long hours etc.
She has also admitted that she is not unhappy with his sex drive but freely admits that hers has plunged and she simply cannot keep him happy - as he is her in all other ways.

Rationing sex (for whatever reason) leads to resentment. He is doing his bit in the marriage deal, she is not doing hers which she freely and openly admits.

I think she is very brave AND considerate....well done Maya.

However...If I got it twice a week I'd be on cloud 9....I get it once a month if I am very lucky.

Maybe maya and her husband need to compromise....3-4 times a week..?? Lots of men here will go green with envy to get it that often!


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

jezza said:


> Well....I am going to risk getting my head blown off by you all...
> 
> she is not doing hers which she freely and openly admits.


if she really does believe this, he is a real sweet talker, or manipulator.

i think under the circumstances, she is doing very well on doing her part.

he is NOT doing his part in even suggesting this.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

jezza said:


> Well....I am going to risk getting my head blown off by you all...
> 
> Maya627 has stated that she loves her husband, he is a good provider for her and their family, he does all his fair share of household chores despite working long hours etc.
> She has also admitted that she is not unhappy with his sex drive but freely admits that hers has plunged and she simply cannot keep him happy - as he is her in all other ways.
> ...


Her drive is low because she has 4 kids under the age of 5. Sex three times a week still. How on EARTH is she not doing her part? That guys level of entitlement is staggering. Nevermind his callousness at being willing to put her health at risk.


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## bill2011 (Feb 5, 2011)

I believe that a man is entitled to quality sex with his wife a couple times a week. It sounds like both of their plates are full, understandable. I am suggesting raising the level of quality. Squeezing in sex doesn't cut it for most men.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

OP,
You edited your original post and it seems you made up your mind about this "vice". Get tested regularly. I wish you the very best.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

MGirl said:


> This is interesting. I'm surprised no one has commented on this. Since he grew up seeing this situation with "mistresses" in his family, does he believe this is the "norm" for marriages? I can actually slightly see how he thinks this is acceptable, since he's grown up around it and it was tolerated by the wives.That doesn't *make* it acceptable, but it may help to understand what he's thinking. In his family, if the men had higher drives than their wives, the simple solution was to find a mistress, rather than work on a compromise in the marriage. This is likely his mindset and pattern of thinking.
> 
> Again, that's doesn't make it okay, but it may help you communicate better with him if you understand his thought patterns. I personally think that sitting down and working on a compromise and adjusting expectations is a better solution, but that may not be something he's considered, based on his family history. You may need to approach the subject. Just a thought
> 
> Finding another outlet for him would be the *easy* solution for both of you...takes the responsibility off your shoulders, he gets what he thinks he needs. Is it the best solution? No. The best things in life are the things you put the most work into--if you want a great marriage, you'll have to both fight for it, not settle for the easy route. Just my opinion, though.


I think the reason he suggested this kind of thing is that if he has a personality flaw, it's that he views sex in a purely physical light. To him, sex is purely a physical need, like eating or drinking. Seeing his dad and his uncles engage in this kind of behavior might have shaped that outlook. And now, because of my vanishing libido, I might feel the same way, which is one of the reasons why I'm considering letting him do this. We do share a deep emotional bond, but I feel like it's always been kind of disconnected from our sex life, even when our sex life was good. I guess that's why I'm not worried about him falling in love with another woman, but it seems like a really weird outlook to have on sex, no?


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

Brennan said:


> Her drive is low because she has 4 kids under the age of 5. Sex three times a week still. How on EARTH is she not doing her part? That guys level of entitlement is staggering. Nevermind his callousness at being willing to put her health at risk.


Read my edit above; after what my husband has done for me and my family, I could never consider him to be callous or have a sense of entitlement. It may not make it right for him to have sex with other women, but it puts things in perspective a bit.


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## MGirl (Mar 13, 2011)

Maya627 said:


> I think the reason he suggested this kind of thing is that if he has a personality flaw, it's that he views sex in a purely physical light. To him, sex is purely a physical need, like eating or drinking. Seeing his dad and his uncles engage in this kind of behavior might have shaped that outlook. And now, because of my vanishing libido, I might feel the same way, which is one of the reasons why I'm considering letting him do this. We do share a deep emotional bond, but I feel like it's always been kind of disconnected from our sex life, even when our sex life was good. I guess that's why I'm not worried about him falling in love with another woman, but it seems like a really weird outlook to have on sex, no?


I've no doubt that watching his dad and uncles engage in this has shaped his view of sex. However, once it's done, it's done. If he does happen to begin to have feelings for other women, there's no turning back the clock. It's a high risk and not one I would be willing to take in my marriage, especially with children involved. I do wish you the best, though.

BTW, please remember that by allowing this, you will be effectively "passing on" the tradition to your children, as they will grow up believing this is what a marriage looks like. Consider this as well.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

Syrum said:


> *NO WAY*
> 
> -*Risk of STD's*
> even people who are very careful catch these
> ...


These are the main reasons why I might decide not to allow this. I'm not at all worried about him falling in love with another woman and would trust him to be discreet about his activities, but STDs and unwanted pregnancies can happen to the most careful of people. That would ruin our marriage.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

MGirl said:


> BTW, please remember that by allowing this, you will be effectively "passing on" the tradition to your children, as they will grow up believing this is what a marriage looks like. Consider this as well.


That's a good point. If he's going to do this, it would have to be so discreet that our children can't find out. And that may not even be possible, since kids can be very perceptive.

As much as I love and respect my husband despite this request of his, I don't want my children growing up with the same attitude toward sex as their father.


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## MGirl (Mar 13, 2011)

Maya627 said:


> That's a good point. If he's going to do this, it would have to be so discreet that our children can't find out. And that may not even be possible, since kids can be very perceptive.
> 
> As much as I love and respect my husband despite this request of his, I don't want my children growing up with the same attitude toward sex as their father.


Kids are smart. They pick up on things *we *don't even pick up on. They will most likely figure it out.


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## COGypsy (Aug 12, 2010)

Maya627 said:


> I think the reason he suggested this kind of thing is that if he has a personality flaw, it's that he views sex in a purely physical light. To him, sex is purely a physical need, like eating or drinking. Seeing his dad and his uncles engage in this kind of behavior might have shaped that outlook. And now, because of my vanishing libido, I might feel the same way, which is one of the reasons why I'm considering letting him do this. We do share a deep emotional bond, but I feel like it's always been kind of disconnected from our sex life, even when our sex life was good. I guess that's why I'm not worried about him falling in love with another woman, but it seems like a really weird outlook to have on sex, no?


I'm going to have to put on my fire retardant gear here--

I think that there's no doubt that you and your husband love each other. And with a large, young family, I agree that it's amazing that you're trying as hard as you are to keep up with his libido--doctors, sex therapists, that shows tremendous effort. But given the circumstances and the fact that change on either side doesn't seem likely--I don't think the arrangement your husband is proposing is entirely unreasonable. 

*IF you're completely comfortable with it.*

It's definitely something that you would have to be at peace with, no doubt. However, I completely understand your husband's point of view, especially given his background. I've never really understood the emotional attachment to sex. I totally appreciate how it gets better over time with someone, but I seem to be missing that whole bonding-through-sex part of the experience. It's time and conversation and all that other closeness that builds intimacy for me and that I value far more in a relationship. But I also realize that I'm in a very small minority on that front, so I'm just throwing that out there to let you know he's not completely alone in that feeling!

Again, I think it's something that you ultimately have to be in full agreement with--but it might be a decent compromise if your terms are met and you're comfortable with the risks, etc. Could you talk to his aunts, etc. about how they felt/managed it maybe?


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

COGypsy said:


> It's definitely something that you would have to be at peace with, no doubt. However, I completely understand your husband's point of view, especially given his background. I've never really understood the emotional attachment to sex. I totally appreciate how it gets better over time with someone, but I seem to be missing that whole bonding-through-sex part of the experience. It's time and conversation and all that other closeness that builds intimacy for me and that I value far more in a relationship. But I also realize that I'm in a very small minority on that front, so I'm just throwing that out there to let you know he's not completely alone in that feeling!
> 
> Again, I think it's something that you ultimately have to be in full agreement with--but it might be a decent compromise if your terms are met and you're comfortable with the risks, etc. Could you talk to his aunts, etc. about how they felt/managed it maybe?


This is EXACTLY the way he seems to feel. He's very affectionate and romantic towards me and I love that, but he just seems to think that sex is a purely physical activity. He thinks sex is about two people getting each other off, not growing close to each other emotionally. And since my libido started disappearing, I've grown indifferent to that view, maybe even started to agree with it a little. 

One thing I've got to consider is that if I say no and our sex life continues in its current state (and we're actually down to once a week, now that I think about it, with the quality diminishing), he may hold out for a while until he feels like he can't hold out any longer and then go do it anyway. And then he would resent me in the process. He's been traveling a lot for his job lately and I know for a fact that women flirt with him despite his wedding band, so there won't be any shortage of opportunities for him. Is it inevitable that he'll go down this route no matter what I say, and is that worse for our marriage than if he has my permission?


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## MGirl (Mar 13, 2011)

COGypsy said:


> I'm going to have to put on my fire retardant gear here--
> 
> I think that there's no doubt that you and your husband love each other. And with a large, young family, I agree that it's amazing that you're trying as hard as you are to keep up with his libido--doctors, sex therapists, that shows tremendous effort. But given the circumstances and the fact that change on either side doesn't seem likely--I don't think the arrangement your husband is proposing is entirely unreasonable.
> 
> ...


I'm "suiting up" as well, because I really understand all the frustration and emotion involved with the whole situation. Although it's something I *could not* do in my marriage, I can actually easily comprehend the dynamics of her relationship. I understand what both sides are feeling and thinking and it makes sense to me on some level. 

However, my concern would be (as previously mentioned) STD's and _the children growing up with this as their primary example of what a marriage should look like and what sex should be like in a marriage_. Will the boys grow up viewing women as a walking vagina, only there to please him? Will the girls grow up thinking that this is how men should treat them? I'm not psychology buff, so I don't know if these are valid concerns or not, but I would be genuinely concerned about these situations. As a mom, my relationships are teaching moments to my son. He will soak up what my husband and I teach him through our marriage, and I want to make sure I am teaching him the *right* things.


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## MGirl (Mar 13, 2011)

Maya-How often do you get away from your children for "me" time? How often do you get away from them for time with just you and your husband?


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

MGirl said:


> Maya-How often do you get away from your children for "me" time? How often do you get away from them for time with just you and your husband?


We actually do manage to have a date night once a month or so, when we have my mom or my sister come by and look after the kids. But it rarely ever ends in sex.


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## MGirl (Mar 13, 2011)

Maya627 said:


> We actually do manage to have a date night once a month or so, when we have my mom or my sister come by and look after the kids. But it rarely ever ends in sex.


 Do you get out of the house and do things you enjoy away from your children? I can't speculate what it's like to have 4 children(I only have 1) but I know that when I make time for myself a few times a week it really helps my sex drive(mine fluctuates like crazy). Do you go out for coffee with friends? Go on walks outside with your husband or by yourself? Curl up with a sappy romance movie without the kids? Are you doing anything to help prod that sex drive back to life or are you just passively accepting the fact that it's taking a backseat? Maybe you're already doing these things, I just thought I'd ask


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Maya: So now he is only getting twice a week , how does this affect him, is he moody, angry, fights? What has he been doing to relieve himself? 

Some might call this an "OPen Marraige" type of thing. It surely wouldn't be for ME, I think if my husband wanted to do that, it would hurt me very much. BUt at the same time, a RAGING sex drive is not easy to contain, very difficult to just wash from your mind, it can affect your whole outlook on life, I wouldn't call him selfish - cause I know what THAT feels like. So I am not quick to judge anyone. 

I give you both ALOT of credit for the OPENNESS that flows between you. Does he know you posted here seeking advice? Have YOU offered others alternatives / suggestions before coming to this?

There just has to be another way! Most guys would just use Porn to deal with a lack of sexual satisfaction in the marital bed, have you ever discussed this ... plus adding a couple days to the week? Hiring a babysitter once a week, it sounds at though you have things well off financially. 

This is really not meant to be funny, but in the spirit of ANYTHING to keep this monogomous -what about a blow up doll. Realistic Silicone Love Dolls, Latex & Cyberskin Sex Dolls, Buy Adult Male Sex Toys Online

MGirl has some excellent points- about what he grew up with , his mindset, how your boys will pick this up. I don't think this can be hidden. Count on it, they will learn of it at some point & they will likely never look at their dad the same again, loosing some respect & questioning their parents marraige. 

There has got to be another answer.


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## Mrs.G (Nov 20, 2010)

What children grow up seeing will undoubtedly affect their adult relationships. I grew up seeing cheating and emotional abuse, I am surprised that I actually got married! Still don't believe in happily ever after for years and years. How could I believe men could be faithful, when I never saw it??
Your husband is a loving, giving person. However, because of his blind spots with commitment and mistresses being accepted, he has a skewed view about the exclusivity of married sex.
You could also say that it's not fair, that he had to have more children than he wanted or a SAHM for a wife. I'm wondering if resentment is one of the reasons your hubby is wanting to have an open marriage.
Ultimately, what TAM members say means very little. You will have to decide if this is what you truly want, especially with all the risks.
I was once in an abusive relationship with a domineering and ugly man. My self esteem was non existent. Not having sex with this fool was my misguided way of regaining power. I would tell him to go sleep with someone else, just so he'd stop pushing me to be intimate with him.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

MGirl said:


> Do you get out of the house and do things you enjoy away from your children? I can't speculate what it's like to have 4 children(I only have 1) but I know that when I make time for myself a few times a week it really helps my sex drive(mine fluctuates like crazy). Do you go out for coffee with friends? Go on walks outside with your husband or by yourself? Curl up with a sappy romance movie without the kids? Are you doing anything to help prod that sex drive back to life or are you just passively accepting the fact that it's taking a backseat? Maybe you're already doing these things, I just thought I'd ask


MAYA: Are you on hormonal birth control by any chance? if so, this can REALLY mess with your otherwise Normal Sex drive. Does the Pill Cut Women's Sex Drive? New Study Sees Link - TIME

Maybe your answer is as easy as switching to NON-hormonal birth control & your drive will take flight again. MGirl did a thread on the copper IUD, I highly recommend this. http://talkaboutmarriage.com/ladies-lounge/23200-copper-iud-questions.html 

Maybe I am odd, but I have alot of kids, never slowed me down on anything I wanted, I have 6 (5 still at home, ages 4-13), I have a higher drive than my husband. A year ago, I would have been in PURE HEAVEN if he wanted it 3 times a day! So long as you have a safe environment for them to play in, have some gates up, put the TV on, use a baby monitor if you have too, take a nap during the day so you will be more energized at night. 

And a locked bedroom door, I don't see why kids have to hamper an enjoyable sex life. Just my thoughts.


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## Mrs.G (Nov 20, 2010)

I'm really happy that you have managed to have a good sex life with so many children, SimplyAmorous.
Based on what I have been told and what I read on TAM, you are the exception, not the rule.
The OP is lucky she can take a nap during the day. 
Don't most parents get busy once the kids are in bed? That seems to be the norm in my circle.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CH (May 18, 2010)

Wife gave me this scenario also recently. I told her with my past, it's like handing the keys to a kid to a candy store. I respectfully declined (don't get me wrong, I was sorely tempted) and told her once or twice a week would be fine and I'll just have to take care of myself in between.

Now if she was just to lay there and be like a dead fish then I might re consider the proposition. But knowing my past history, that might not be the best idea. Always the chance I might get emotionally attached to a single woman and everything starts all over again like before.

My wife is like a diesel engine, takes forever to get going but once it's turned on it can go on for a very long time :rofl:


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## MGirl (Mar 13, 2011)

Mrs.G said:


> I'm really happy that you have managed to have a good sex life with so many children, SimplyAmorous.
> Based on what I have been told and what I read on TAM, you are the exception, not the rule.
> The OP is lucky she can take a nap during the day.
> Don't most parents get busy once the kids are in bed? That seems to be the norm in my circle.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm usually so exhausted by the time my husband gets home at night, neither of us is up for much. Lately I just can't get turned on enough for much. Afternoons work perfect for us...he'll turn on Diego for our son, give him a bowl of popcorn, lock the doors and we get busy  Gotta get creative!


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Mrs.G said:


> I'm really happy that you have managed to have a good sex life with so many children, SimplyAmorous.
> Based on what I have been told and what I read on TAM, you are the exception, not the rule.
> The OP is lucky she can take a nap during the day.
> Don't most parents get busy once the kids are in bed? That seems to be the norm in my circle.


I know what you mean, I read it here all the time, baffles me. 

I do have a naturally high energy level though. I was never the doting Mom type, holding the babies every moment of the day, or trying to keep the noise level down (I vacummed even when they were sleeping)-they get used to it . They all learned from birth ,there WILL ALWAYS be noise in this house, AND you will be woken up if we have to go. Friends would come over & say "shhhhhhh you'll wake the baby" and I was like "good, if they are up NOW, they will sleep better at night". 

I always kept them 'happy" while I get everything I needed DONE while my husband was at work. I never had any help at all, and really, I didnt need it. And I still used to get mad at my husband cause he would fall asleep at night before the movie was over. I never expected him to get up in the middle of the night either, that was MY job. 

Unfortunetly I DID put my kids before my husband for many years -so this I regret. I know why I did this , cause I was SOOOO distraught over not being able to conceive for almost 7 yrs, so when they started coming, I felt So darned blessed to have them, I lavished all my love on them, even putting them in bed with us. (STUPID). I had 4 under the age of 6 at one time, 2 was in cloth diapers (now that is some work in comparison to pampers!) and I didn't even have a dryer at the time, but hung them outside on the line. 

I should have been having ALOT of sex with my husband then, but had other things on my mind. "Energy" has never been an issue for me personally. 

Husband knows when that starts to go on me, I must be SICK and in need of seeing a doctor.


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

Maya627 said:


> These are the main reasons why I might decide not to allow this. I'm not at all worried about him falling in love with another woman and would trust him to be discreet about his activities, but STDs and unwanted pregnancies can happen to the most careful of people. That would ruin our marriage.


IMO, you should be worried about all of it.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Jamison said:


> IMO, you should be worried about all of it.


Nevermind that none of that seems to cross his mind.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

i havent see this asked, though i may have just missed it...
what if this was agreed on and your husband was on the road for his job and you just happened to have a rush of hornyness cum over you?
would he mind if you found someone to just be a [email protected] for you for a couple hours?


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

2nd_t!me iz_best said:


> i havent see this asked, though i may have just missed it...
> what if this was agreed on and your husband was on the road for his job and you just happened to have a rush of hornyness cum over you?
> would he mind if you found someone to just be a [email protected] for you for a couple hours?


This is an excellent questoin and if he has a problem with THIS, hmmmmmm, there goes the "Open Marraige" thoughts.


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

Brennan said:


> Nevermind that none of that seems to cross his mind.


No, I'm talking about her, the wife. Shes more worried about STDS or unwanted pregnancy, which is fine, but shes least worried about him falling in love. So while shes stuck at home with her 4 kids anyway doing this and that, taking care of them and the home etc, he is going to go get some sex. :scratchhead:

Is this what marriages have come to now? Just being all casual, if needs aren't being met or whatever, they consider opening the door to either third parties or letting the spouse go have sex with another? 

I guess some people see it as, their spouse is outta their hair for a bit and the other spouse gets sex, so I guess they feel they both win.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

I have to be honest. I am a Christian person and would not necessarily encourage someone to go outside their marriage to have their sexual needs met as it is a religious thing for me. HOWEVER, I have to congratulate you on being somewhat open-minded and realistic about this: when you and your husband made your vows part of the promise was to meet each other's needs. All too often women expect their husband to "just put up with" what is basically a sexless marriage and yet would not in any way "just put up with" it if their husband stopped meeting their financial needs! 

I would encourage you to think about it like this. If your hubby did just stop meeting your financial needs today... or slowly tapered off until you only got $100 per week to live off of (as in paying all bills, mortgage, groceries and everything) you'd start to feel desperate and frustrated right? And that is roughly how your husband feels. I'm glad you're able to keep an open mind and address options and work on something with him that BOTH of you can live with. But for me, I would suggest thinking about yourself and what turns you on and stimulates you, and see if you couldn't find a way to rebuild some of the desire for sex. For example, for me it is rarely a "sexual technique" or doing this or that which turns me on, but rather some all-day, suggestive talk; some hint at what he'd like to do; some erotic loving talk; and those "glancing touches" as if he is trying to NOT touch me and can't avoid it. I also am more turned on when I'm relaxed, with candles, with Frank Sinatra music, etc. I am NOT turned on in thongs, but I am turned on in soft, silky natural clothing that feels good to my skin. I am turned on when I smell good so I wear my perfume and smell amazing all day. Get the idea? So in order to make love as often as my own Dear Hubby would like, I tend to do things for myself throughout the day that will give me the option to be "in the mood" at night! Make sense? 

Bear in mind that this is not "what he does for you" as the responsibility here is on you. Find out what turns you on and learn how to do more of that, even with the kids. Like SA, I had seven kids and we had a very regular, satisfying sex life...we FOUND A WAY...and you can too if you take the time to get to know yourself and do what pleases you. I think as mom's we very frequently think so much about the kids and "others" that we forget how valuable it is to also care for ourselves so that we can care for others!! Thus rather than an open marriage, I suggest you learn to wear silk, put on some White Diamonds and maybe lipstick, and tease him all day until YOU are hot and bothered for him.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

2nd_t!me iz_best said:


> i havent see this asked, though i may have just missed it...
> what if this was agreed on and your husband was on the road for his job and you just happened to have a rush of hornyness cum over you?
> would he mind if you found someone to just be a [email protected] for you for a couple hours?


My thoughts as well. Actually if there is a Karma god, when he is no longer able to get an erection, instead of her being sympathetic and work around it, she decides to do exactly as he is. Tells him that because he isn't able to, she is going to go out and find someone else. 
I guess in sickness and in health doesn't mean anything anymore. It is only adhered to until it becomes too inconvenient and then it gets tossed out the window.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Jamison said:


> No, I'm talking about her, the wife. Shes more worried about STDS or unwanted pregnancy, which is fine, but shes least worried about him falling in love. So while shes stuck at home with her 4 kids anyway doing this and that, taking care of them and the home etc, he is going to go get some sex. :scratchhead:


Exactly. And this makes him a great father how? He already works long hours so now he is going to pick up a side hobby and spend even less time with his family just because sex 3 times a week is too little. 
How is this not selfishness, entitlement and just all around arrogance?

She's already made up her mind though.


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

I would suggest you and your husband coming together as a team to see what you all can work out. Fins some kind of compromise on this if possible. 

Considering letting him step outside of the marriage to me, is like giving someone a get out of jail free card. Not that he is, I'm saying his sex drive obviously is more than yours right now, so why give him more ammunition to go have more sex with strangers, just because your drive doesn't match his? He needs to understand where you're coming from too, with the kids and all that you do.


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## CallaLily (Jan 13, 2011)

Brennan said:


> Exactly. And this makes him a great father how? He already works long hours so now he is going to pick up a side hobby and spend even less time with his family just because sex 3 times a week is too little.
> How is this not selfishness, entitlement and just all around arrogance?
> 
> She's already made up her mind though.


Oh I agree. I think if he gets the green light on this, she will be even more alone. Between his regular job, his new side hobby, and his homelife, something will surely suffer, and I bet it will be the homelife.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Affaircare has the best thoughts and advice on this entire thread, if there is ANY way at all to arouse your sex drive so the 2 of you can experience satisfaction together, THIS is in the best interest of the marriage, you and his future & your children. 

Break the cycle of his family history.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Maya has a distinctly non American view of marriage. She's telling her husband he's more or less on his own sexually. So he's free to get, if not a _goumada_, a _putana_ or several _putanas_. 

It will obviously change what her marriage is, but it's not all that strange either. The French call it _mariage blanc_.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Runs like Dog said:


> Maya has a distinctly non American view of marriage. She's telling her husband he's more or less on his own sexually. So he's free to get, if not a _goumada_, a _putana_ or several _putanas_.
> 
> It will obviously change what her marriage is, but it's not all that strange either. The French call it _mariage blanc_.


Mariage blanc - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

yeah that's one way to frame it. Mostly it's the old European tradition of marrying for political gain, or wealth or genes or keeping it in the extended family. I mean it's not 'cheating' if she's giving him permission, is it? It's something else.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Runs like Dog said:


> Maya has a distinctly non American view of marriage. She's telling her husband he's more or less on his own sexually. So he's free to get, if not a _goumada_, a _putana_ or several _putanas_.
> 
> It will obviously change what her marriage is, but it's not all that strange either. The French call it _mariage blanc_.


How is she telling him he is on his own sexually? 3 times a week is on his own? I stand by what I said.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

Runs like Dog said:


> I mean it's not 'cheating' if she's giving him permission, is it? It's something else.


i still feel this would be cheating on the marriage, whether it is open marriage, 3somes, swinging or anything else that involves bringing other people into the marriage with both parties agreement or not. what does 'for better or worse mean'?
seems people always forget about the worse part.


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## luckyman (Apr 14, 2011)

A few posts on this thread really have me scratching my head. As far as "needs" go, a man doesn't "need" to have sex twice a day. To say that once per week was not enough to sate a man's sex drive tells me that this man is placing too much emphasis on sex. My sex drive is very high, and I am able to adjust it to the comfort level of my wife. I don't "need" sex every day. I may "want" sex every day, but that has nothing to do with it. 

If I am pressuring my wife for sex when she is not in the mood I am far more likely to cause her to become defensive and far less likely to achieve my goal of increased sexual intimacy. Men are NOT animals. We don't need to have sex as often as many here would suggest. 

Allowing a sexual surrogate is ridiculous. Regardless of what a great man your husband may be in every other area, where sex is concerned he is behaving very immaturely.


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

Affaircare said:


> I have to be honest. I am a Christian person and would not necessarily encourage someone to go outside their marriage to have their sexual needs met as it is a religious thing for me. HOWEVER, I have to congratulate you on being somewhat open-minded and realistic about this: when you and your husband made your vows part of the promise was to meet each other's needs. All too often women expect their husband to "just put up with" what is basically a sexless marriage and yet would not in any way "just put up with" it if their husband stopped meeting their financial needs!


:iagree:

Maya i think your communication on this subject has been wonderful. i knew another poster on here who went through something similar, only it was his wife that wanted to be with others. He realized that he couldnt cage her and so he let her go and even tried to go along with her. In the end he didnt want that kind of lifestyle and they split up, but there was no animosity (at least not apparently) over the issue. It was very eye-opening for me to know couples can disagree over something so personal and not turn into raving, jealous, possessive lunatics. You remind me of him because you are so open and honest. I think because of that you will be spared a lot of deception from your H. He wont feel like he needs to hide it from you and in that respect you two are able to decide together. I really look up to couples like yourselves.

In the end I think you have to tell your H your concerns with STDs, the kids finding out, and anything else bothering you. Give him your concerns and let him decide but dont try and give him permission or not. I think you are correct in saying he'll just end up resentful and do it anyway. Let him make the decision for himself and that way everyone is informed. It sounds like you two have a great deal of respect for each other and im sure everything will work out just fine.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Brennan said:


> How is she telling him he is on his own sexually? 3 times a week is on his own? I stand by what I said.


Oh no doubt. But he is, more or less. Heck I don't know, it's bizarre


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Runs like Dog said:


> Oh no doubt. But he is, more or less. Heck I don't know, it's bizarre


She has mentioned that he views sex as purely physical. With her or with anybody. Just a release. I have no doubt that seeing all the male members in his family step out on their wives shaped his view. As Syrum said, women are disposable and to be used for his needs. Now he wants to continue that cycle. 
I honestly get the impression that she puts him up on a pedestal as a beacon of virtue in taking care of her family and her. She is marginalizing herself in the meantime. He works so hard, he provides, he does this and that. What does she do? Only takes care of 4 kids under the age of 5 and then rationalizes her decision to let him cheat by saying after all, me having these kids, kids he didn't want in the beginning is why my sex drive is so low. So rape was involved? 
Now because she views him in such light, she feels that he deserves sex on the side. He deserves to go out and spend even less time with his family, go out and have sex with whoever he wants, go out and possibly contract a disease and give it to her and possibly while pregnant. His penis is going to play Russian Roulette with her life and possibly a fetus. If that isn't the epitome of selfish, I don't know what is. 
Either she has been drinking Kool Aid or he has done one bang up job manipulating her.


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## Syrum (Feb 22, 2011)

2nd_t!me iz_best said:


> umm, i think taking care of 4 children under 5 all day every day and still managing to squeeze out twice a week even if she is not feeling in the mood for it IS showing a LOT of willingness to work with him.
> 
> it doesnt sound like a good idea to me for the same reasons mentioned here...
> sti's
> ...


This response is so awesome. 

I agree, she is trying, but it's not enough for him. I am sure once the children are a little older things may change. 

Small children can be so exhausting.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Syrum said:


> This response is so awesome.
> 
> I agree, she is trying, but it's not enough for him. I am sure once the children are a little older things may change.
> 
> Small children can be so exhausting.


Of course you think his response is awesome. 
He is totally right though. 
You know what hasn't been mentioned? If she is drained and tired and he is rearing for sex and full of energy, why doesn't he channel that energy into helping out his wife more and taking some of the burden off of her. She did mention that he takes care of the kids but she also is under the impression that he deserves to step out because SHE had so many children. So low energy mom and high energy rearing for sex every day dad. Could his time not be better spent using that energy for something positive rather than telling his wife he wants to cheat on her?


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

Going there is a very bad idea. Everyone has given some excellent reasons. Unfortunately, I was married to man for more than 20 years who basically had various sexual additions. Without going into all of that saga, I will give you one piece of advice. If you allow this door to be opened, you may as well say good bye to the comfortable life you now know. Your husband will fall in love with one of the mistresses. Then, your husband will toss you and the children. Your husband may never have any intention to leave you, but he WILL stumble upon a mistress who has other ideas. There is no honor among women who date well-to-do married men. They are out to take away what you have--and they will use whatever means they have to in order to accomplish that goal. I know what I'm talking about because I am now the ex wife who is basically "left out in the cold". It's not a place you want to be. Keep that door closed!


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## Ira (Dec 19, 2010)

I honestly am not trying to be rude. I really do get your position with the sex situation.

Here is what I ( think ) I would do.

Ask husband how often he thinks he would seek out said sex person. Say he responds 3 times a week.. ask him if he would settle for 2 times a week as a comprimse. Then give him sex 2 times a week!!!!!

Seriously would not a 1/2 hr or even an hr 2 times a week be si much easier on you & him then all the emotions your both going to go through?

You are not the only one who sees what a good man you have ( hell I will trade you lol  ) and your willing to hand him over to someone else willingly??

Don't kid yourself - he can't find THAT many different women, so in time emotions will get involved.

Also maybe he will sleep with one of your childrens moms, aunts etc and your kids will find out about this down the road.

Just sounds way too messy to me all over afew hours a week on your end.


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## jezza (Jan 12, 2011)

The OP said that her husband works long hours (60+ a week) yet still manages to find the time to help her around the house and with the children as much as he can.
She also openly admits to having lost her sex drive and finds even twice a week sex a necessary chore that she does not enjoy.

She is trying to find a solution that keeps everyone happy. As I have said in a previous post, lack of sex etc breeds resentment.

The lack of sex in a marriage is the elephant in the room. It has a negative effect on everything else in the marriage..the wife feels guilty, the husband rejected and resentful = the wife feeling resentful etc its a vicious circle.
However, if you remove the sex issue (the 'rotten apple') from the marriage, very often the marriage actually improves.

Why? Because the male is getting what he wants/needs, the wife isn't having to do something she doesn't want or like doing...everyone is happy.

It doesn't make it right....but we live in a real world, not Toytown!


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## Mrs.G (Nov 20, 2010)

Jezza, you are so right! 
If the hubby works 60+ to give her and the four children (which he only had because of the wife) a good life AND he helps out at home....what a jerk he is for wanting sex! LOL
I would KILL to live the priveliged lifestyle so many women get to have! I had an awful wedding and we live in a crappy apartment, because there is no money. If women want to be SAHM with many children, they need to accept that the man has to work a lot to support their lavish life! You can't want to live affluently and then complain that the husband isn't around.
As I mentioned before, resentment seems to be the problem. I would totally resent being badgered into having children or more than I wanted. Maybe the husband knew that sex would go out the window, with so many kids!
The husband feels like he deserves some fun, after breaking his back to provide AND helping with children.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

To the OP, if you are really wanting to do this, then of course whatever is said to you here will not matter. So, if you want to do this, I say go ahead and tell your husband (if you haven't already), give him the go ahead, and it will be interesting to see how things are going for you all in a few weeks or months.

I have a feeling its not going to be what you thought, and if you yourself have any resentment already, then if he does this, you will probably have even more.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

If your husband works so many hours and still finds time for recreation AND wants stray sexual partners while you get to kid wrangle to exhaustion; then your marriage is zooming towards destruction.

You need to rebalance the equation.

Hire a sitter and enlist your husband's help.

Catch up on rest and your libido will return.

Do not agree for your husband to screw around.

And if I were you I would suspect he is already and just wants to not admit it or hide it anymore.

What's he doing that requires 60 hours a week?

Does your lifestyle require that extra time?

Maybe adjust your lifestyle so he can be home more.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

michzz said:


> And if I were you I would suspect he is already and just wants to not admit it or hide it anymore.




This actually crossed my mind as well.


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

Jamison said:


> This actually crossed my mind as well.


:iagree: Ditto!

I think the husband is playing some mind games with this one. Just another case of having the ole "cake and eating it too". Only he is going to get approval from her and make her accept the blame.


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## AgentD (Dec 27, 2010)

When your husband asked your permission to go outside of the marriage for sex, how did it make you feel? Like a slap in the face? Like a slap to the marriage as a whole?

I don't care how much he works or what he does for you and the kids etc. You work too, you have 4 kids. You are tired and now have a lower sex drive due to your responsibility of being a mother/wife, but yet his sex drive is higher with being a husband/father and he wants more and more. Odd his is high, and does so much and your is low but yet you do alot to. Whats keeping his so high I wonder? 

With all of these hours he works,what exactly does he do? Has he always worked hours like this? Or is this new? Having sex with him twice a week isn't unreasonable, and like alot of people on this board, would be thrilled to get just that! 

I have to wonder like a few others have said, its possible he has already stepped outside fo the marriage, and just looking for you to go along with it, so he no longer has to hide it. I would think juggling a 60 hour work week job, and trying to be a father/husband in his homelife would be hard enough, so if in fact he was already having sex with others and hiding it, then thats bound to make it harder. I guess in his mind if you knew about it, then to him it would take the pressure off of what he is doing and having to hide it. 

I'm not saying 100% for sure this is what he is doing, but I do think its possible. And also, if he isn't already, well sounds like he has a interest in someone that might be willing to help him entertain his idea.


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## trey69 (Dec 29, 2010)

I don't know that you have to consider allowing your husband to have sex outside of the marriage, because its pretty apparent that if he is asking your permission to do this, then either; 

A.) He already is doing this, and wants to ease his guilt about sneaking it, by getting you to agree to it. 

OR

B.) He must already have a potential person lined up that is willing to do this with him.


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## ladyybyrd (Jan 4, 2011)

I agree 100% with Neil.


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## Atholk (Jul 25, 2009)

What do you think the cause of your drop in libido is?

What kind of medication do you use?

What kind of birth control do you use?

Have you had any kind of endocrine work up for sex hormone levels?


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

I agree with others who say he is already cheating. No doubt. His mentioning his "idea" to his wife is a way to ease guilt and to make it less stressful on him having to sneak around. Him, him and him.
Also, 60 hours a week working isn't "breaking his back". In this day and age and in this economy, the 40 hour work week is a myth. Most people I know work way more than 50 hours a week. For 3 years my husband worked 70+ hours a week and that was to keep his job, not provide a "lavish lifestyle" for us.
In the OP's case, she has 4 kids under the age of 5. She is working 24 hours a day. 7 days a week. He isn't working harder than her, he just has her convinced that he is and "deserves" to have his cake and eat it too. His entire childhood framed this logic. A gaggle of selfish men who went outside their marriages to get what they wanted. A very telling part of her post was that the Mom/Aunts "tolerated" the mistresses. If that doesn't sound like veiled resentment I don't know what does and that will be her.


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## venis (Mar 8, 2011)

Boy this is interesting.
I'm with you if your husband is the man you have described and you love him and trust him. Well let him enjoy his free time how ever he want to. As long as you both put in a fail safe. So if this does bother you it will stop or if he need you you will be their for him and not reject him. Could their be problems sure, but the fact is that a problem could arise either way.
My guess is if you let him go on this journey he will come home to roost. Sex is just Sex , BUT LOVE now that is some thing special. Some guys cheat on their wife in many way and just not with sex. Gambling, playing sports, fising cars whatever. I think he has already give you the greaest complement of all. How look at the list of thing he does that you said he did.
The man is great he is not looking to leave you or have an affair he would have done that by now.
I have read the post to your thread and most of the responces are full of personal issues from them. I can see your ready for this to happen so if this is true than tell right now that you give him what he has requested. See how this will cause him to love you even more.


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## whammy (Apr 22, 2011)

a relationship is not a relationship unless it involvesregualr sex. not just sex, but wanting to have sex with your SO. 

you CANNOT be in love with someone unless you actively WANT to have sex with them. 

so id say, that I doubt your in love with your husband. its not your libido, I bet you think about sex all the time. If brad pitt walked into your bedroom and threw you on the bed, I doubt it would a "chore" to sleep with him. and the fact that youur thinking about letting your husband go outside the marriage proves that you are not in love with him. if my wife was like you i would tell her that I am going to have sex outside of the relationship too because I WILL NOT live a sexless life. and if my wife got mad, I would say "why do you care/, you dont even want me"

and that is just it, you dont care because you dont want him.


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## anon_4_now (Mar 23, 2011)

My .02...

She stated the the multiple weekly sex sessions are a *chore* for her. She has no desire other than to be an available receptical. Don't get me wrong, that is great that she is willing to do that for him and other men would love that arrangement. If I was able to have sex 7 days a week with my wife and it was nothing more than her laying there... I'd get very tired of it. Even if she throws a few moans in for good measure... I could tell if she was just going through the motions... 

I can get the "motions" from my hand but that doesn't meet my intimacy needs. 

This couple seems to have a great relationship that involves alot of communication and honesty. I would think that the OP would have mentioned any problems in their marriage or insecurities if she had any. 

Obviously, it would be best if there was a magic boost for her libido that would help her enjoy and share intimacy in this manner with her husband but that doesn't exist. I think the idea should be thoroughly discussed between the two of them. Pick up a few books on open marriages. There are alot of different suggestions for contracts and groundrules that they may not have thought about yet.


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## Frustrated4Fifteen (Apr 20, 2011)

I haven't seen this angle brought up, although, I admit I did sort of skim the last couple of pages...

He's working 60hr/wk.
He's "taking care" of her family.
He's home sometimes providing at least a modicum of emotional support.
Disease aside, who is this woman that is going to agree to have sex with him without him having to "woo" her? Without demanding a significant portion of his already limited "free" time?
And if it becomes just 1 woman, the door is even more open for the possibility of the emotional attachment everyone else has already mentioned.
OK, if it's a different woman every time, what kind of woman will they all be? 
Or if it is often an above street level prostitute, that will get quite expensive and probably reduce the lifestyle you are accustomed to, and praising him so much for.

I believe even if he truly is in it for the sex only, and you are willing to let him go out for the sex only, it's inevitable that you will lose more of what you are getting (and want) than just the sex.


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## whammy (Apr 22, 2011)

all these people that congratulate the wife for let him have sex with her a couple times a week. and no they ARE NOT having sex...she is LETTING HIM have sex with her. she IS NOT having sex...he is. what man wants that? he is pretty much using his wife to masturbate into... she mine a well be a "real doll" (google it) If that was me...that would make me feel so far from my wife I wouldnt even recognize her. and dont be confused. this situation is chipping away his feelings and connection to her piece by piece. which is why he is bringing up the open marriage thing. all an open marriage is letting married finely have with people they want to have sex with while still getting the comfort of marriage. ask people in open marriage. 'would you guys make if one of you demanded to close to relationship again?" I bet about 95% say "not a chance"


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## trey69 (Dec 29, 2010)

To the OP, hows things? You haven't posted back.


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## rppearso (Feb 4, 2011)

For my wife and I (no kids) we have sex every other day but on the days we do have sex its sometimes twice in that day, the first one in her mouth (after skipping a day so the volume is high) and then later on in the night having sex.

I would say that if his labido is really high twice a day is not to much to ask, if the kids are that much to watch why dont you get a part time job and hire a full time nanny (if you have an extra room let the nanny stay there for reduced payment, maybe bunk bed the kids to accomodate this). Then one of you needs to get fixed or perform more oral and get on a pill, there is no reason to be having 4 kids unless you have a farm to put the kids to work otherwise 4 kids is just an expensive burden, only in modern days would some think of that comment I just made as negitive, back in the day kids were assets now days we have converted them into liabilities which is a real shame, by shifting the roles and responsibilities and how much kids in the USA in modern times are coddled. If you are sacraficing your relationship with your husband over your kids your in the wrong, kids do NOT come before your spouse period they are off spring.

That being said I would never do the swinger thing but the posts I have read are wrong in their context that he is selfish, I think you are dropping the ball on your wifely duties and if you just accept that this is how it is you may in fact be dealing with a divorce and dont expect his 60 hrs a week to continue if he is paying child support, both your qualities of life will go way down, the whole child support game is a train wreck, men will avoid it to the ends of the earth and you will have to get a full time job and put the kids in day care and get sporatic court arm twisting CS payments.

Its a funny thing that men dont like working for free with uncle sam and child support funeling off more than 50% of their income, not much incentive there to work OT let alone work at all (unless its under the table)

I have seen this play out and it leads to complete ruin, so much easier to just put out. My wife and I helped a friend that was going through this exact thing and my wife got to see the ruin it caused and it also led to my divorce in the past, and she said geez all this for something that was so easy to fix.

Do you let him cum in your mouth, do you swallow, maybe try giving him a rim job, something that does not involve him cumming inside you, maybe start with sex and finish with oral, etc.

You dont want to go down this road of swinging or a divorce or having a dissatisfied husband. Maybe the kids need some harsh disipline if they are running amock when you are trying to get it on.

Remember your husband comes first and the kids second, you might need to get a regular baby sitter for the 18 month old so you can do it every day and maybe make the second time that day a quickie, theres ways to make it work you just have to be willing and be smart about it, the kids should not be running your life your the parents, that 5 year old can be belted if they are way out of control.

Modern society has totally warped child disipline.


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## zaliblue (Apr 26, 2011)

First of all....EWWW.....thats disgusting that u would even consider it. I'm sorry if that is harsh but it would break my heart for my husband to ask to have sex with another woman. What is the point of being married? Don't you love him at all? Apparently not in my opinion if u are willing to share him....and then on top of it, you are not allowed to ask about the affairs? Hmmm....ok? Can u really be happy knowing that ur hubby is boinking another woman? I guess marriage means different things to different people because to me it means being faithful and enough for one another....


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## Timy (Mar 12, 2011)

OK, my two cents. I think I understand your situation as I am living it. But on the H side. Probably michzz is right, stating that he might be saying twice a day just to make you have it more often with him, not that this is bad, just lake of communications skill and trying to manipulate the situation a bit. I don’t blame him for trying because his needs are not being fulfilled. Now, fulfillment; even your husband might not be aware of this, but for me, my lack (btw once a week if I'm lucky and I would be able for twice a day) is for my wife to show me that she wants me, likes me, likes my body and what I have to offer. It’s for her to make advance to me, not always me chasing. If your H is emotional pattern is physical, than even if you would give him every day and he makes the advance every time, he would soon be confused and feeling the same way after a few weeks. I disagree that he goes elsewhere, because he will leave that for sure. Be honest to yourself and to him on how much you can give him, don’t let him go outside the marriage, and once established, chase him down a morning or afternoon for some hot sex, although you’re not in the moon, it will makes a huge difference for him. 
I know you said that he was the perfect husband, but... is it possible that he’s not feeling some of you need??? You might not be aware that you have hole not being fulfil... Have you read The Five Love Language? I would recommend this for you and your H (audio version available).


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## Unexpected Outlook (May 7, 2011)

Every man is different. Every woman is different. To take the words of ANY respondent as an automatic mirror of your husbands feeling on anything would be a mistake on your part. You are his wife . And as such _should_ know him better than anybody and be able to gauge any replies according to his unique beliefs , background, and personality. 


That being said. I for one DO NOT feel that a woman "cannot" love a man if she does not wish to have sex with him. That conclusion is drawn by the poster as his personal opinion and beliefs and does not speak for "every" man. I also do not agree that the "point" of marriage is having sex with one another and that without it there is no reason to a marriage. I married to have someone to share LIFE with; sex is a very small part of the totality of what that means in my book. I DO agree with rppearso ; all parties concerned lose when divorce happens and there are many men who suddenly "opt out " of suceeding when faced with the prospect of not being able to retain the fruits (court orders for the relinquishing of a large portion). So a prospective divorcee and her children are not even certain of that shallow compensation for their entire previous life. 

And for what? ...."for what" ultimately is the question. The measure will lie in what your husband considers sex as. You've heard a list of people tell you that for them its the measure of being married, being accepted, cherished - all kinds of things . But what is it TO HIM. For me, sex is not love. It might occur with someone I love but to have it does not imply love. It implies I'm horney. It implies I want relief. It might even imply I want a certain _kind_ of relief. But it doesn't "equal" love. A million men and women have sex with people they don't love every day . So that is not rare. Some of them even have sex with people they don't LIKE. Sex that they enjoy. Sex that they have on an ongoing basis. Because it is a PHYSICAL release that PHYSICALLY feels really really good. When I was young I had sex with a certain girl without EVER dating her formally for 3 years. I wouldn't even have told you we were sexually involved I was so far from wanting "her" . Many years later, as a married man I had an affair with a woman that I knew had sex with other men . I pretended "I had no idea" because I did not care 6 cents who she slept with as long as I got mine. Would I have left my wife for her? Jesus christ no. Why sleep with her then ? Cuz she was (as they say) " a nasty freak" and I wanted nasty freak. Where there other issues in our marriage? Yes . And probably the thing you want to do more than anything else is TALK -really talk if its possible- to your husband and find out all of whats going on with him. There is likely "something" . It might not be that he already is cheating. (It wasnt' with me) but "something" that he is not/does not want to disclose/is afraid to disclose is probably up. 

Does sex with some other woman though equal your marriage ending ? No. Not unless it may already without it.


Be careful listening to accusations that "he is already cheating ". A suspicious woman is an easy push for a guy who has issues with being trusted. 

I would say that your guy at least deserves points for bringing the thought/want of sex with somoene else out in the open . Most guys won't do this . They do lie and cheat. 

To me, a man doing what your husband is attempting to do is not "trying to get permission to cheat". He's trying to make sure he _doesn't_ cheat. Cheating is dishonesty and secrecy. And taking something from you that you thought you could depend on in your relationship . - The ability to trust him. 

Your husband -in my book- is struggling to make sure you KEEP that. Its why he brought it to you.


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## Freak On a Leash (Feb 19, 2010)

My husband's sexual drive is in the toilet right now too. We are separated but married with no plans for divorce. We just live in separate homes. He alone, me with the kids. 

To give you an idea of what kind of relationship we have: He was just here at my apartment and he's picking me up later to go out to dinner and I spent all day yesterday with him kayaking and last weekend we went away together boating on Lake George. 

During the week I'm with the kids at my apartment and he is at his house. We rarely see each other during the week. 

My sex drive is a lot higher than his right now. He's a recovering alcoholic and has "issues". I like to have sex both days on the weekends and be groping each other like mad in between. He just wants to keep it "like friends" even though he says he's turned on by me. It's a source of irritation and frustration for me but I'm trying to work through it and be understanding. 

That said, I would NEVER think to ask him to "get it someplace else." I couldn't imagine doing so or wanting to do it. Marriage is for "better and for worse" and there is no license for infidelity. Marriage is about monogamy and loyalty. We all have our problems and sometimes it makes things "inconvenient" both physically and emotionally. In my marriage we've had to deal with mental illness, alcoholism and now his low sex drive. It's not good but we DO love each other and are trying to come to grips with ourselves and with each other. He's dealt with me and my problems in the past and now it's my problems. So if sex isn't something that he finds important than I'll give him the space that he needs and hope things get better. I'd NEVER just go down to the local bar or log onto Match.com because my physical needs aren't being met because the rest of my relationship is doing fairly well and improving. As was pointed out, sex is just ONE part of the tapestry of our marriage. 

As for your situation, you have FOUR kids and that'll take the stuffing out of any mother. But you do have a husband too and he's a human being whose needs need to be met. There has to be SOME compromise here. For one, you need to set aside a "date night" where you can focus on each other as a couple. Not be a mother, but a WIFE and attend to his needs in that capacity. 

That said, he needs to be a HUSBAND and that means remaining faithful to his marital vows. Right now you are both acting selfish when it comes to EACH OTHER. You need to find common ground. If sex twice a day isn't reasonable (sounds a bit much to me) how about twice a WEEK? And during those times you need to put forth more effort then just laying down on the bed and spreading your legs. 

So how about working out a compromise before acting like this is some sort of chess game?


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## HelloooNurse (Apr 12, 2010)

I had a similar arrangement with my ex boyfriend (long term boyfriend, and the reason we broke up had nothing to do with it). It worked really well. But the key thing is you need to find out if your partner is one of those people for whom sex = love. Luckily my ex was not one of those people (nor am I) so it worked like a charm. He would go out whenever he felt the need, get a root, and then come home and shower. I didn't ask any questions - don't really want to hear the gory details hahahaha. But in the end it was great because it stopped him whining at me, and it got his needs met. And emotionally it worked well because there was no resentment from him towards me (since im not into sex).. he just got that need fulfilled elsewhere. Someone else got the booty, and I got the lovin  He never got any emotional connection from his friends-with-benefits, he just got a root and thats it!

So it works great, but I'm sure there would be complications if either one of you believes that sex = love.


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## Nickitta (May 12, 2011)

*A big NO*. Having sex with another woman will bring your husband closer to her. 
You might have a clear set of rules between you and your husband, but these rules won't apply to her. If you are willing for another woman to have sex with your husband, get ready to expect the worse... and you will only have yourself to blame when it all goes "belly up". No sympathy from me here...


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## Nickitta (May 12, 2011)

> a relationship is not a relationship unless it involvesregualr sex. not just sex, but wanting to have sex with your SO.
> 
> you CANNOT be in love with someone unless you actively WANT to have sex with them.


I second that. Otherwise it is just a FRIENDSHIP, or a brother/sister relationship.


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## luvlost09 (May 15, 2011)

Have you ever thought about getting him help? I mean twice a day everyday? You've gotta be kidding me! Maybe he's a sex addict. Apparently, it's a real disease. Like drug and alcohol addiction.

Or, maybe he already had sex with other women and now wants your permission so he doesn't feel like he cheated after all. 

Your rules kind of contradict themselves too. How can a man have sex with a person everyday and not become emotionally attatched? It's not like they won't talk at all. There will be conversation. Or, so that doesn't happen, he's supposed to have multiple partners? If he finds different women everyday to go to bed with him, they are prostitutes. I don't care how good looking your husband is. No self respecting woman is going to jump in the sack just because some cute, horny guy asked her to. 

I don't understand how you are not appauled about this. I think that if my husband would have even brought that kind of thing up to me, I'd throw him out on his ass. But, you think you need him to take care of you. Or, you like him taking care of your every need. 

Now, the more I think about this, I can see both sides. But either way the outcome is still the same. YOU NEVER ALLOW THIS TO HAPPEN! Not if you wanna stay with this man. I understand that you're tired, and what he's asking seems to be too much. But, he is fine with taking care of everything for you emotionally, financilly, physically, everything. You don't even have to work. So, now I think, he's bending over backwards for you, working 60+ hours a week. Maybe you should be ready and willing whenever he wants. 

Actually, that may be my ending opinion. Girl, he's doing it all for you and all he wants is to romp a couple times a day? (Not to mention sex isn't a one way street, you'll enjoy it too.) If you want to keep the perfect life you have now, LET HIM HAVE IT!


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## Roooth (May 13, 2011)

You know what? You're solution is right here in this forum! With all the HD wives with LD husbands, all you have to do is hook the wife up with your husband. If he came over to my house a few times a week, both of our marriages would be great! lol :rofl:


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## Roooth (May 13, 2011)

For a more serious reply, could it be possible to hire someone to watch the kids or take them to Aunties or Grandma's on a regular basis so you both can schedule some unrushed time together? Maybe with some time to relax, for him to romance you, for some slow foreplay, this could help? And perhaps half the days could be for you to have alone time to regenerate yourself? It is very difficult for someone to give give give. I know he's done a lot in your marriage, but you give give give to the children and now feel you must do this. 4 kids is a lot of work. If you had some time that was just for you to regenerate yourself and fill your "love cup", maybe the other nights you'd have some left over to give to him with enthusiasm.

You say you have expensive tastes. If this is a financially difficult proposal that you think would otherwise work, you must make it a priority and give up extravagances. After all, if you split up, financially you'd be giving up much more. Just some thoughts.

On a side note, man oh man to be getting it once or twice weekly... ah well.


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## JRiZZY (Aug 11, 2011)

BIG NO!!!!!!! If you don't think this is selfish behavior well then I don't know what is. I would be absolutely horrified if my husband had the audacity to ask if it was ok for him to sleep with other women. How would your husband feel if YOU wanted to sleep with other men?? As someone living with an STD, I can tell you first hand that if your husband was to go out and sleep with a woman that had herpes, and he contracted it, and then came home and kissed your children on the mouth, they would contract the oral form of herpes. Is that what you want for your family???!!! For christs sake you take care of 4 children. What woman WOULDN'T be exhausted and have a lower sex drive??!!


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## jezza (Jan 12, 2011)

I read Maya627's initial post...I haven't trawled through the subsequent 7 pages! However, based purely on her first post, I take my hat of to her and bow down in respect.

Putting the possible consequences of allowing her husband to have his (natural) needs met outside aside, here is a wife who fully accepts and respects her husband's needs. 
She loves him dearly and it is obvious that he is a 'good' man who has a high sex drive. She accepts that she simply cannot oblige him because (quote) "I have lost all interest in sex". 

Her 'inability' to oblige him will lead (if it hasnt already) to resentment...she is doing what she can to help....even if it means agreeing to him getting his needs met elsewhere.

I do not want to be drawn into whether its right or wrong, but atleast Maya accepts she has a problem and is trying to do something about it.
Well done Maya! And I really hope that whatever happens, its for the good....for the both of you.


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## hmd1016 (Aug 12, 2011)

Maya627 said:


> *My husband and I have been married for 10 years. We're both in our early 30's and have 4 kids; the oldest is 5 and the youngest is 18 months. My husband has always had a very high sex drive. He wants sex at least twice a day. Before we had kids, I was happy to oblige, but now it's become extremely difficult for me to meet his needs. Not only is it hard to have frequent sex because of the kids, but my libido has plunged while his seems to be growing even stronger. Right now, we're averaging about twice a week, and I do it mostly just to please him. It's not that he's not good in bed or doesn't care about pleasing me; he really tries to make it good for me, but I just don't really feel much desire to have sex. Every now and then I'll be aroused, but that's becoming increasingly rare. Naturally, that has affected the quality of the sex that we do have. We do it mostly in one position, and I can't even begin to entertain his kinky fantasies. I give him blowjobs but that doesn't really help, it just makes him want to have intercourse even more.
> 
> My husband has made it clear that he needs more and/or better sex, and we seem to be at an impasse because i'm not willing (or able) to give him more than I'm already giving him. I've been to my doctor and a sex therapist and they've told me that there's nothing abnormal about me; my libido seems to have just naturally settled at its current low point. The kids keep me busy but i don't work so i don't feel like I'm under a crazy amount of stress or anything. I've just lost interest in sex.
> 
> ...


* OH HONEY, i HAVE BEEN DOWN THIS ROAD SIMILIAR TO YOU. i WAS MARRIED FOR 12+ YEARS TO MY HUSBAND , NOW EX-HUSBAND. HAD A GREAT LIFE HE WAS A GOOD FATHER, HUSBAND AND PROVIDER. i TOO WAS ABLE TO STAY HOME WITH OUR 3 BOYS. WE MOVED TO SOUTH FLORIDA WANTED TO CONCENTRATE ON SPICING UP OUR MARRIAGE AND FULFILLING OUR FANTASIES. STARTED GOING TO A SWINGER CLUB, MET A SWF , PLAYED WITH HER SEVERAL TIMES, BECAME CLOSE FRIENDS AND I EVEN WAS CRAZY ENOUGH TO ALLOW HIM TO SPEND THE NIGHT WITH HER ON OCCASION WHEN I DIDNT HAVE THE TIME FOR PLAYTIME OR REALLY WASNT INTERESTED ANYMORE. HE ALWAYS TOLD ME HOW MUCH HE LOVED ME, I WAS THE MOST IMPORTANT PERSON TO HIM AND HE PUT ME UP ON A PEDISTAL AS A GOOD WIFE AND MOTHER. HE FOUND HIS LIFE WTH HER MORE APPEALING, NO KIDS, NO BILLS TO PAY, AND NO DRAMA. I FOUND THE 3SOME QUICKLY BECAME A 2SOME . NOT THAT YOU ARE INVOLVING YOURSELF IN THAT BUT ALLOWING HIM TO HAVE SEX OUTSIDE THE MARRIAGE WILL ULTIMATELY END YOUR MARRIAGE I TRULY BELEIVE. HE COULD BECOME EMOTIONALLY ATTACHED TO WHOM EVER, LIFE TO BE ABLE TO SEE HIS CHILDREN AT HIS CONVENIANCE. NOT SAYING THIS WILL HAPPEN TO YOU BUT I'M SURE THAT THERE WILL ALWAYS BE SIDE EFFECTS AND THEY WILL NOT BE GOOD. THIS IS NOT A QUICK FIX, MAKE TIME FOR EACH OTHER ALONEM OUTSIDE OF THE HOUSE AND YOUR LIBIDO WILL COME BACK AND THE PASSION WILL TOO. BEST OF LUCK.*


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## pidge70 (Jan 17, 2011)

jezza said:


> I read Maya627's initial post...I haven't trawled through the subsequent 7 pages! However, based purely on her first post, I take my hat of to her and bow down in respect.
> 
> Putting the possible consequences of allowing her husband to have his (natural) needs met outside aside, here is a wife who fully accepts and respects her husband's needs.
> She loves him dearly and it is obvious that he is a 'good' man who has a high sex drive. She accepts that she simply cannot oblige him because (quote) "I have lost all interest in sex".
> ...



If she was truly doing something to fix the problem she would work harder on herself. Letting him have sex outside the marriage is a lazy way out.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## HelloooNurse (Apr 12, 2010)

I think this sounds like a great arrangement to me. Well, that is, if he isn't one of those "sex = love" people. If he is, then yeah that could be a bit dicey. But if not, it sounds really good. Everybody's happy. Just make sure that you get him tested before you have sex with him yourself, if that is what you are planning on doing at some stage. You never know where people have been these days.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

pidge70 said:


> If she was truly doing something to fix the problem she would work harder on herself. Letting him have sex outside the marriage is a lazy way out.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree:


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## Atholk (Jul 25, 2009)

There's already a woman in his mind.


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## piqued (Mar 25, 2010)

Maya, here's my take on it...
First, I commend you for even being open to this. You love your husband, you respect him, and want to make him happy. Your husband loves you, has always been there for you, your kids, your family, etc. and has these needs that he wants fulfilled. You have adequate groundrules set up (except if this were to happen an added groundrule should be that he has to have sex with you whenever you want), precautions are going to be taken, and things are going to be above board. Sounds like a workable plan.

However...don't do it.  A spouse with exclusive sexual relationships outside of the marriage will eventually bring the marriage down. The post above this is correct; at some point the endless sex he is getting from a no strings attached, sexy young thing, will steal his heart. He'll love you all forever, but what man wouldn't rather start spending all his time in a playground with no responsibilities and loads of orgasms?

What I would recommend is tell him "no" and figure you're going to get a divorce once you find out he's doing it anyway, or, tell him that will be the outcome so perhaps you should just divorce now if sex with other women is that important to him. Say you understand, but that ultimately it will rip the family apart, so you two might as well make it as clean as possible.

The other option is to say no to the outside exclusive relationships, but - whether you are 'into it' or not, start making yourself available for sex. And, don't just make yourself available, but initiate sex. Initiate at different times of day, in different places, get a little naughty if you want to feed his kink.

I'm not saying to do the following unless you can, but you might want to set up a surprise threesome for him (with someone you two will never see again). Or go out to dinner, dress sexy, and don't wear panties. Then surprise him at the table by placing his hand there. IOW, fulfill some of his fantasies, whatever they may be.

Might it be work for you? Perhaps, but it's a lot better way to stay close to your husband, and to keep your family, than to take the lazy path and say "go ahead and screw someone/anyone else." 

Like you said in your edited initial post...at times he has gone above and beyond the call for you and your family members. He has given a great deal. If you can do this for him (by becoming his vixen) then you can keep your marriage a happy and healthy one.

If you don't, then one way (sleeping around) or another (he gets sexually frustrated) your marriage may very well end.

Is this fair? I don't know, perhaps not. But, sometimes we make unconditional sacrifices for those we love.

My 2 cents...


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

The French call this _Mariage Blanc_. Look it up but I think Wiki's definition is wide of the mark. It really means a marriage of political advantage. Like, I imagine, the Clintons.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

piqued said:


> I'm not saying to do the following unless you can, but you might want to set up a surprise threesome for him (with someone you two will never see again.


No way. Everything you said was right on the money except this one. If you read some of the posts on this thread from some of the people who tried a threesome, you'll see that it also is very dangerous to a marriage. Besides, a one time threesome will not satisfy him since he will want to do it more than once.


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## XtraDoubleMint (Aug 23, 2011)

I have questioned it myself how is it possible for a MM to even have a "sexual" relationship outside his marriage, due to circumstances with his wife and their intimacies and NOT be emotionally be involved with the OW. 

I am currently involved with the MM, as he so indicated his wife can no longer be sexual because of health issues and she has willingly, but even suggested to him to find his intimacy with another, but under the condition he "comes home" to her and not to "fall in love" with the OW. 

He is the exact gentleman of which Mya describes of her husband. Very kind, giving, loving and unselfish in his ways. Always there for his family and goes above and beyond for his family and friends.

As far as the "not having the emotional side" of the situation....its a gamble. Yes, I will say, the gentleman does have feelings for me (so, he says). I told him, that was not the agreement of this so-called relationship. 

Its a double edge sword for the wife, as there is always two-sides to every situation.


XDM


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

JRiZZY said:


> For christs sake you take care of 4 children. What woman WOULDN'T be exhausted and have a lower sex drive??!!


Sorry couldn't resist this - I have 6, tiredness has NEVER been an issue for this MOM. Other things were back in the day but during all of my kids, he needed more sleep than me, I used to get upset with him for falling asleep so early, and I never made him get up in the midde of the night for any of them, even on his days off. That was my job & I held to it. Of coase I didn't work though. 

I could have done it 3 times a day -for a time. My kids would have survived just fine. And do. All parents need is a locked bedroom door, Some baby gates, baby swing, a good DVD, many things to entertain -bribe the oldest to watch them for an hour here, an hour there ! What is wrong with that. 

I undertand many women DO get tired, just saying - the # of kids does not always make this an impossibility. 

Sometimes us MOMS put too much of a priority on the kids - I was guilty of that one myself , but not cause of a lack of "energy" for my husband. More out of ignornace & stupidy.


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## uphillbattle (Aug 17, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> Sorry couldn't resist this - I have 6, tiredness has NEVER been an issue for this MOM. Other things were back in the day but during all of my kids, he needed more sleep than me, I used to get upset with him for falling asleep so early, and I never made him get up in the midde of the night for any of them, even on his days off. That was my job & I held to it. Of coase I didn't work though.
> 
> I could have done it 3 times a day -for a time. My kids would have survived just fine. And do. All parents need is a locked bedroom door, Some baby gates, baby swing, a good DVD, many things to entertain -bribe the oldest to watch them for an hour here, an hour there ! What is wrong with that.
> 
> ...


I REALLY think you need to have a talk with my wife


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## Sawney Beane (May 1, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> Sometimes us MOMS put too much of a priority on the kids - I was guilty of that one myself , but not cause of a lack of "energy" for my husband. More out of ignornace & stupidy.


In short, if both partners want an active sex life, they'll find a way a way to have one. If one partner doesn't want to have an active sex life, they'll find a way to make sure they don't...


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Sawney Beane said:


> In short, if both partners want an active sex life, they'll find a way a way to have one. If one partner doesn't want to have an active sex life, they'll find a way to make sure they don't...


No truer words spoken I am afraid. Accually that is the heart of my message .


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## Sawney Beane (May 1, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> No truer words spoken I am afraid. Accually that is the heart of my message .


And at the end of the day, most of the stuff here is about one partner trying to find a way to make the other one give a **** about something they would frankly rather avoid.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

Sorry I never followed up with this thread. Thank you to everyone for your thoughts and advice. This is how things turned out.

After a lot of soul-searching, I initially told my husband that I wouldn't allow him to step out and that instead, I would recommit myself to reviving my libido and improving our sex life. My husband didn't argue; in fact, he appreciated my efforts. Long story short, it didn't work. No matter what we tried, I couldn't get into sex at all, not even slightly. And because I could no longer get wet, sex was actually becoming physically painful for me, even with KY. After a month of unsuccessfully trying to jump-start my sex drive, I became convinced that I have a medical problem notwithstanding my doctor's assurances that I was normal. I decided to seek a second opinion. I went to another doctor and sure enough, my second doctor diagnosed me with hyperprolactinemia, a rare disorder caused by a benign, tiny tumor on my pituitary gland. He said it's probably a mild case because I don't have any other symptoms. So that's the good news (I guess): I do indeed have a medical condition that's destroying my libido. 

Unfortunately, there's some bad news too. The doctor said that since I didn't have any other symptoms, we should monitor it but that it could be safely left untreated. I told him that's not an option since my husband and I would like our sex life back. But as we explored my condition and medical history further and reviewed treatment options, we realized that, due to an unrelated prior medical condition, I can't take any of the medications normally used to treat this condition without possibly experiencing very serious side effects. Surgery is also extremely inadvisable, for the same reasons. Beyond that, treatment options are limited (though my doctor did say there's a non-trivial chance that the problem could go away by itself). So basically, I'm stuck with this medical condition that's killing my libido with no way of treating it.

So I had to do some soul-searching again. I realized that a monogamous relationship in which one spouse's sex drives is at zero and the other's is off the charts and neither can budge is not sustainable. Practically speaking, insisting that my husband only have (bad) sex with me in the name of monogamy could pose a bigger threat to our marriage than allowing controlled infidelity. So this time, I decided to give my husband permission to have his needs met elsewhere. I imposed a few additional conditions: he has to use a second cell phone and a second email account for communicating with other women, his second cell must be kept out of my or our children's view, he has to tell his doctor about his open marriage, he has to be tested for STD's every six months, he is not to discuss his open marriage with anyone other than his doctor and the women he sees, our children are never to know about this arrangement, any money he spends on other women (be they escorts or mistresses) cannot come out of our joint account or show up as charges on our joint credit card statement, I can revoke my consent to this arrangement at any time, and we are never to talk about this again aside from discussing his medical check-ups. I told him that my strong preference would be for him to only seek out other married women who have open marriages, but I didn't impose that as a condition. We also agreed that we would continue to monitor my medical issues and that I would keep seeking treatment options. The kicker was this: I told him that if I let him do this, I reserve the right to insist upon a to-be-determined number of extra-marital hookups of my own if and when my libido ever comes back, just for the sake of reciprocity (I don't know if I would ever exercise that right since I've never wanted to have sex with another man, but I'd like to have the option if he has it). He agreed to that. 

We're almost three months into this arrangement. I can't say it has gone totally smoothly, but I can't say it has gone poorly either. I do feel more emotionally distant from him knowing that he's having sex with other women. The toughest is when he comes back from business trips, since that's when I can be almost sure that he has had sex with someone else. On the other hand, I also feel a strange sense of relief knowing that my husband isn't sexually frustrated all the time and that I no longer have to worry about being available to serve his needs. That has actually lowered my stress level a lot, as weird as it sounds. My husband and I still go out to dinner, we still have our date nights, and we still have an active social life. My husband's demeanor towards me hasn't changed at all; to his credit, he's scrupulously adhered to all of our conditions so far. The only change I've seen is a small but noticeable increase in the number of hours he works. Sometimes he'll call and say he has to work late and I'll be tempted to ask what kind of "work" he'll be doing, but I resist that temptation. I don't know how he's going about his new lifestyle, but I don't really want to know either.

I don't think I would recommend this arrangement to anyone else. Our situation seems to be unique due to my medical issues, and I'm still hopeful that I can resolve those issues, restore our sex life, and return our marriage to normal. This is hopefully a temporary measure, both to allow my husband to fulfill his needs and in recognition of everything he's done for me and my family.

*EDIT:* When I said I don't want to know how he's going about his new lifestyle, that's not entirely true. My husband has a second laptop that he uses mostly for work-related stuff, and I snooped around on it a few days ago when he wasn't home. I did get a small window into his world. I saw emails on there in which he was setting up dates or hookups with other women. With at least some of the women he sees, he seems to be open about his marriage (he told one woman, "I can't meet then because my wife's birthday is that day and I'm planning on doing something special for her. What about Thursday?"). A couple of these women weren't very subtle; one sent him a picture of her wet panties and said "You did this to me! When can we "do lunch" again?" He responded, "lol! I'll check schedule and let you know..." In his web history, I found visits to escort websites and a dating website for married people seeking to have affairs (couldn't see his profile though, since he wasn't logged in), as well as a completed order for some special brand of condoms. I also saw statements of his personal credit card that had charges at hotels and expensive restaurants. I was worried I would find evidence that he was falling in love with another woman, but I didn't see anything like that. All in all, I didn't find anything that I wouldn't have expected. I didn't really feel any different afterwards.


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## mary35 (Jul 18, 2010)

"I didn't really feel any different afterwards."

You may not have felt any different - but for some reason I felt incredibly sad after reading your update!


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## MissLayla1986 (Aug 27, 2010)

I would rather my husband take another wife than do what your husband is doing.

I didn't read through the entire thread, but don't you worry that once your husband tastes the "forbidden fruit" of casual sex with random women and escorts, he won't be able to go back to being monogamous if/when you get your sex drive back?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

mary35 said:


> "I didn't really feel any different afterwards."
> 
> You may not have felt any different - but for some reason I felt incredibly sad after reading your update!


Don't get me wrong; I did initally feel very shocked and jealous. I didn't talk to him much when he came home later that day. But it didn't make me feel any different about the arrangement. Once the initial shock wore off, I realized that none of what I saw should have been unexpected, and that it's probably better if I don't know the details of that aspect of his life.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## CH (May 18, 2010)

So he sleeps with X number of women. Then if you're condition gets better you can sleep with X number of men?

I would tend to agree with MissLayla.

He may be saying, sure honey I'm up for that hoping that your condition never improves (just one perspective from a mans point of view).

But when the day comes he'll be saying sleep with another man and I'm out the door.  Yes, us men can be pigs and it's a sick double standard.

Just giving you one scenario of what could happen, from a man's point of view.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

MissLayla1986 said:


> I would rather my husband take another wife than do what your husband is doing.


I don't know about that. Marriage is permanent (well, it's supposed to be, anyway), and this is a temporary solution. Even with the marginally higher risk of STDs and pregnancy, I think it's better if my husband is having casual sex with different women rather than starting another committed relationship. I don't want him to develop an emotional attachment to another woman. Besides, there probably aren't very many women in America who would be okay with a polygamous marriage.



MissLayla1986 said:


> I didn't read through the entire thread, but don't you worry that once your husband tastes the "forbidden fruit" of casual sex with random women and escorts, he won't be able to go back to being monogamous if/when you get your sex drive back?


Oh, I do. Trust me, this is not an ideal solution. My husband is only 34 and is still very much in his sexual prime. His sex drive is actually stronger now than it was in his early 20's when we met. My worry is that if I don't agree to this, my husband will hold out until he can't hold out any longer and then go and do it anyway without my permission. That would be more harmful to our marriage, since he would come to resent me in the process.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

cheatinghubby said:


> But when the day comes he'll be saying sleep with another man and I'm out the door. Yes, us men can be pigs and it's a sick double standard.
> 
> Just giving you one scenario of what could happen, from a man's point of view.


That did occur to me, but I think it's unlikely. For one thing, he has a very high income and is the sole breadwinner in our family. Our accounts are joint and the house is in both of our names, so he has a lot more to lose financially in the event of a divorce than I do. Aside from that, I've never known him to be anything other than honest and forthright throughout our 10+ years together. And it's doubtful that I would even exercise the right to step out because I've never wanted to sleep with another man, I just wanted to reserve the right to do so to keep things fair.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MissLayla1986 (Aug 27, 2010)

Maya627 said:


> Besides, there probably aren't very many women in America who would be okay with a polygamous marriage.


True. Women who would consider becoming a second wife to a married man are probably vastly outnumbered by women who would have casual sex with a married man behind his wife's back. That's kind of sad and ironic, IMHO.

I posted here about a similar issue I went through a year ago (which is how I found this forum). Basically, some medication I was taking killed my libido and made me depressed and groggy. The depression and grogginess derailed my gym regimen, which caused me to gain weight and further diminished my self-esteem. It became a vicious cycle, and made me paranoid that my husband was cheating on me (he wasn't). That caused some problems in our marriage. But I was able to find alternative treatment options for my medical issues that eliminated those side effects before things got out of hand. 

Your husband sounds a lot like my husband: high achieving, high sex drive, high energy. Aside from our rough patch a year ago, I've been lucky enough to be able to keep up with his sex drive and his energy level, but I do sometimes worry about what might happen if and when things change. 

Anyway, I'm very sorry you're going through this. I hope you get your drive back and your sex life and marriage soon return to normal. Please keep us updated.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

Layla - I'm also a fitness freak, and it's one of the things that has helped me keep my self-esteem through all of this. Even when I saw the escort web pages that my husband had viewed, none of them looked like they were in better shape than me or had a better body than me, even though they were probably surgically enhanced. I still feel very confident about my sex appeal even though my husband is now seeing other women.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MissLayla1986 (Aug 27, 2010)

Maya627 said:


> Layla - I'm also a fitness freak, and it's one of the things that has helped me keep my self-esteem through all of this. Even when I saw the escort web pages that my husband had viewed, none of them looked like they were in better shape than me or had a better body than me, even though they were probably surgically enhanced. I still feel very confident about my sex appeal even though my husband is now seeing other women.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


This just occurred to me... if he's seeing escorts, don't you worry about him getting an STD? I know you said you're making him get tested and all, but that's just after the fact, it doesn't actually prevent anything. Isn't there a high risk of him catching something from an escort if he's seeing them regularly?

Also, don't high-end escorts cost a lot of money?


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## mary35 (Jul 18, 2010)

I don't know anything about this medical condition you have, but is it possible that it is affecting your hormone levels? Have you had your hormone levels checked, especially testosterone? Bio-identical hormones have been a life saver for my sexual life.

If I were you, I would be moving heaven and earth to remedy this medical condition. I would tell the doctor exactly what was happening with your marriage, and ask him to help you with this issue. If he won't help you, keep seeking for a doctor that will. It would seem to me that you have plenty of reason to treat the condition, even without other symptoms. 

Another thought would be to find a good sex therapist or a doctor that specializes in sex issues for women. It sounds like money is not an issue and you may have other avenues available if you do some research. 

I wonder - Is it really possible to KNOW your husband is having sex with others, quite frequently it sounds like, and not think about it or have it affect you and your marriage, and especially your self esteem? I know I could NEVER EVER handle something like this. Even if this was my ideal to begin with, the thoughts and curiosity would eat away at me bit by bit until it destroyed me and my marriage. But I also realize others are different. However the fact that you are curious and looked into what he is doing, tells me it may not be so easy for you either. Can you really ignore this and not have it bother you? 

I fear that you may have opened up something in your marriage that you may never be able to close back up. I hope I am wrong and I really hope you can find a better solution that works for both of you and your marriage.


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## okeydokie (Sep 10, 2008)

mary35 said:


> If I were you, I would be moving heaven and earth to remedy this medical condition. .


^^^^this

It seems as if the medical issues have been dismissed as totally uncurable and thats just the way it is. my wife has done the same thing with her medical issues and quit seeing doctors years ago (migraines to be specific). i would never stop seeing docs/specialists for any health issue that was affecting my life like yours is. there has to be something that can be done to help you. this alternative you have implemented with your husband is not going to work long term.

i truly feel badly for you both


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

I accually feel bad for you both also. It sounds like you are a strikingly beautiful woman so this helps you somehow, but geeeze, this is very very sad. 

Not sure what else to add . Some marital situations are very very difficult. 

I once caught a movie on TV called "Breaking the Waves' -truly heart breaking - about young married love & the husband becomes a Paralegic shorty after - anyway - I did a thread on this and got some judgement for some of the things I said. This was only imagining, mind you, being in such a situation. 

At that time- when I did that thread, my sex drive was out of control, and I seriously doubt I could have handled such a situation without terrible resentment growing within me. Some things in life are truly heartbreaking. That has calmed for me and I must say, I think that makes a difference in how we may handle such things. 

My husbands way of dealing with that - would have been to allow ME to be with someone. I also feel that is LOVE , even if others would judge it . But hey, that was our discussion. 

Here is the thread http://talkaboutmarriage.com/genera...-truly-unthinkale-happened-your-marraige.html


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

mary35 said:


> I don't know anything about this medical condition you have, but is it possible that it is affecting your hormone levels? Have you had your hormone levels checked, especially testosterone? Bio-identical hormones have been a life saver for my sexual life.
> 
> If I were you, I would be moving heaven and earth to remedy this medical condition. I would tell the doctor exactly what was happening with your marriage, and ask him to help you with this issue. If he won't help you, keep seeking for a doctor that will. It would seem to me that you have plenty of reason to treat the condition, even without other symptoms.
> 
> ...


My hormone levels are actually normal, which is why my first doctor missed this. My second doctor explained to me how this condition was killing my libido without affecting my hormone levels, but it's complex and I don't fully understand it. Believe me, I'm doing everything I can to address this condition; money is no object and my husband, to his credit, has been fully supportive of those efforts. My doctor referred me to two different specialists, but both strongly advised against exsting medications or surgery. One of them gave me hope in the form of a new medication on the horizon, but he said it won't hit the shelves for at least another six months. I tried a herbal supplement that was suggested by the other specialist, but it hasn't worked.

You're right, I can't say this isn't bothering me and I'm not sure if it's sustainable, but i'm handling it for now. Going into my husband's laptop was probably a mistake and I don't plan on doing anything like that again, no good can come of me learning to gory details. I keep myself busy with my kids, staying fit, and a couple of other hobbies I've picked up. My sister and i have grown closer lately and she's the only one I confided in about this (well, aside from this board). She understands our position and has a lot of respect for my husband because of everythng he did for our mother, her and her son, so she more or less agrees with our choices. I might have a breaking point if this goes on long enough, but I don't feel as if I'm near it yet.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

MissLayla1986 said:


> This just occurred to me... if he's seeing escorts, don't you worry about him getting an STD? I know you said you're making him get tested and all, but that's just after the fact, it doesn't actually prevent anything. Isn't there a high risk of him catching something from an escort if he's seeing them regularly?
> 
> Also, don't high-end escorts cost a lot of money?


Well, I told my husband that I won't have sex with him while he's doing this, so the risk is on him, not me. But I did thoroughly research that trade before I agreed to this (I know more about escorts now than i care to know), and it turns out the risk of contracting an STD from a high-end escort is actually very low. All high-end escorts require the men they see to wear condoms, which already drastically reduce the risk of getting an STD. Aside from that, they get themselves tested regularly and cater mainly to high-income, married professionals, so it doesn't seem like the pool of men they see would have a high occurrence of STDs to begin with.

High-end escorts generally run $300/hr and up, which my husband can easily afford given his income, as long as he's not seeing them every day.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I accually feel bad for you both also. It sounds like you are a strikingly beautiful woman so this helps you somehow, but geeeze, this is very very sad.
> 
> Not sure what else to add . Some marital situations are very very difficult.
> 
> ...


Thank you so much for sharing that link; it did provide me with some perspective. I read through some of the replies, and it made me think about my husband's views about sex. Basically, he has no concept of sex being a means of strengthening an emotional bond or an expression of love. He seems to see sex as purely a physical need. That connection between sex and love that other people have doesn't seem to exist in his psychology. So to him, getting it from someone else seems to be the same as getting it from me. I'm not sure how I feel about that. I know my husband loves me, and he never cheated on me before this because we used to have amazing, frequent sex. But I can't say that I don't wish my husband saw sex with me that way. I definitely don't want my children growing up with similar concepts.

It's a double-edged sword, so to speak. I know that because of his attitude about sex, it's highly unlikely that he'll start to have feelings for another woman during this arrangement, which he otherwise might have been susceptible to if his views were different and he had an affair because of my medical issues. But the fact that he seems so comfortable with this arrangement and can have these separate worlds without it affecting him emotionally is unsettling to me.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Maya have you spoken to your husband about feeling more distant from him and your current developing misgivings? I ask because I have come to understand from reading and my own marriage that secrets distances couples. 

The fact that you are not keeping your husband abrest of how you are feeling may be a mistake. If thinks go south it is likely to do so suddenly. As you said it will reach a tipping point where a number of negative will pile up until you can not honor this arrangement. 

The reason I think you should keep your husband in the loop is because he is interested in how you are doing if he loves you. In addition, a sudden change of heart is may be more difficult to deal with than a change that he has time to think about. 

It supprises me that he is taking time away from you and the family. I would say that going to fancy resturount seems antithetical to an arrangement where he is getting just physical needs met. If there are meals at fancy resturounts that elevates the relationship with these women. Sharing such a meal require communication with someone he likes spending time with. That's the way I see it. You are making quite a sacrifice to make him happy, what may be at the back of your mind is that he is not making an equivalent sacrific for you. 

In fact, he seems to be enjoying his time with these women. There are so many that he can't fit them all in. Is that really what you had in mind when you agreed to this? If you sacrifice so much why can't he. He really does not need to have so much fun does he? 

Just out of a sense of fairness to you. He can certainly cut down the number of encounters and time he spends with this and instead spend more time with his wife taking you to fancy eateries? Would that be too much to ask given what you are doing for him? 

I agree with you that this may go south quickly. With the present arrangement, he gets all of his needs met while you do not. He get to look like the good family man at you expense. It is not your fault that you fell ill. It might be better to separate. He will have as much contact with the kids as he wants, you will still sustain the lifestyle you have now but you will not have to watch what is going on. Plus he will feel the consequences of the way this is being handled. He may want to rethink if his sexual needs are more important than his family. It may be. 

Does he watch porn? That might heighten his libido. Anyway, I think it is not sustainable because the sacrifices being made are unequal. In fact you are the one making them not him and you are the one who needs to have her husband make sacrifices for her. You did not plan this illness and you need more of him now to help you cope.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

You husband is very very high test, read the 3rd post on this link about the role it plays with men. http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/17010-modern-men-warning-long-16.html

That IS a double edged sword -truly as you want him to feel THAT way with you deeply but at the same time, it is LESS of a threat of him ever being emotionally entangled- with anyone. 

I can tell you my husband is a LOWER Test guy and he would NEVER have sex with someone WITHOUT an emotional connection, he has told me that a # of times. We just talk about all kinds of things. 

And Me.... when My drive went UP, I suddenly felt , for the 1st time in my life & marraige -- If I was not getting my needs met, I COULD have had sex with someone other than my husband, that is how STRONG & unrelenting those feelings were -they messed with my head ! I kept it all at home of coarse, but I am telling you, there was a change in my thinking, an urgency to what I needed. I had other physical symptoms of HIgh Test - so much energy, I hardly needed any sleep, my body felt like it was walking on air , I felt wonderful, I never needed a touch of forplay, was ready to go! My underarms reacked like my hormonal teenage sons and my fantasy life was out of control.

. NOt sure WHY in God's name this happened to me, but it did, it was a crazy ride, loved it but was tormented by it at the same time, so I feel I can identify with many raging hormonal men- because of that experience. Lasted so many months, now back to earth, need sleep again, can feel my aches & pain, need forplay to get aroused. My mind back to "normal". 

I can see your concern with not wanting your children to compartamentalize sex like this. It is an interesting subject. Was his father like this also?


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

Maya627 said:


> It's a double-edged sword, so to speak. I know that because of his attitude about sex, it's highly unlikely that he'll start to have feelings for another woman during this arrangement, which he otherwise might have been susceptible to if his views were different and he had an affair because of my medical issues. But the fact that he seems so comfortable with this arrangement and can have these separate worlds without it affecting him emotionally is unsettling to me.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


What you believe as his attitude toward sex may not have anything at all to do with whether he develops feelings for any of these other women. If he has sex with them, he will. Go out and do some research on "vasopressin" and "oxytocin". These are chemicals that are released in a person's brain during sex and cause bonding.

Here are only a couple of many, many articles that you can research about this:

The science of sex (OneNewsNow.com)

The Science of Sex - BodyLogicMD

Here's a brief excerpt from the first article you may be interested in:

_"Males have their own neurochemical related to bonding: vasopressin. It floods the male brain during sexual intercourse, causing him to feel at least partially bonded to every woman with whom he's been intimate. If men begin a pattern of having sex with partner after partner, they risk not developing the ability to form long-term emotional attachment. As McIlhaney and Bush put it: "Their inability to bond after multiple liaisons is almost like tape that loses its stickiness after being applied and removed multiple times."_

Perhaps something for you to think about. I think you are right for feeling unsettled, and also agree with Catherine602 that this is a very one-sided sacrifice - all on your side.

God Bless.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> You husband is very very high test, read the 3rd post on this link about the role it plays with men. http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/17010-modern-men-warning-long-16.html
> 
> That IS a double edged sword -truly as you want him to feel THAT way with you deeply but at the same time, it is LESS of a threat of him ever being emotionally entangled- with anyone.
> 
> ...


My husband is indeed high test. He also got himself checked out back when these issues started and that's what we discovered (he actually tried taking a male libido suppressant, but it didn't work). I'm not sure I agree that high test necessarily causes a disconnect between sex and emotion in men; my sister tells me her late husband also had a very high drive (wanted it 4-5x per week) but was very romantic and passionate about their sex life and seemed to view sex as a way of bringing them closer together emotionally. 

My husband's father, grandfather, and uncles had mistresses that their wives knew about but put up with, so they likely had similar views about sex. This was seen as normal in their family. He also doesn't have any sisters, which perhaps makes it harder for him to put himself in my shoes. I have no doubt that his upbringing is responsible for his attitudes on sex.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

So what's there left to discuss?


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## XtraDoubleMint (Aug 23, 2011)

If it continues where you both are not intimate on that level, it will eventually become an addiction for him seeing other women.

Emotions do play a part, regardless.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

Maya627 said:


> I'm not sure I agree that high test necessarily causes a disconnect between sex and emotion in men;


I don't either accually, just that some other hormones are likely not in balance, and if his test is too high and something else too low -it could cause this disconnect. 

Heck most of us could use a BETTER balance in some area of another. I think I am a bit out of whack in dopamine. It's not too high but I definetly have an addicting personality when I get interested in something, it can be overkill. 

I do believe our hormones play a very huge ROLE on WHY we do and act the way we do -- that book I got was all about helping us recognize this, understand ourselves, then taking steps to NOT allow these things to CONTROL our behavior. To understand why something is the way it is - IS very important - before judgement.

I see you as a wife trying to understand her man, even if this situation is really disturbing.

I will be the 1st to say ---The trials & triulations of a high Test man are NOT the same as a Lower Test man in the sexual arena. IT is harder for a HIgh test man to remain faithful, statistics speak this very loudy. 


I guess you are right back where you started. I am curious if you have threatened to leave him over this -how does he react? Or you never did?


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> I don't either accually, just that some other hormones are likely not in balance, and if his test is too high and something else too low -it could cause this disconnect.
> 
> Heck most of us could use a BETTER balance in some area of another. I think I am a bit out of whack in dopamine. It's not too high but I definetly have an addicting personality when I get interested in something, it can be overkill.
> 
> ...


I haven't threatened to leave him. To be honest, even despite our current problems, I can't imagine ever being able to do that. I love him very deeply. He's a good husband notwithstanding his stepping out, and we're still affectionate with each other. He has always been and continues to be an excellent father to our children. My mom and sister love him like a blood relative because of everything he's done for them (see the edit in the original post for details). Even now, he visits my mother on his own to make sure she's doing okay, and he calls my sister regularly to check up on my nephew and ask if they need anything. When he takes our kids out for outings, he usually insists that my nephew come with them. He's a wonderful man despite his shortcomings, and I still cry sometimes when I think of all that he did (and still does) for my family during that difficult time. This why I'm so emotionally conflicted over this.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

Catherine602 said:


> Maya have you spoken to your husband about feeling more distant from him and your current developing misgivings? I ask because I have come to understand from reading and my own marriage that secrets distances couples.
> 
> The fact that you are not keeping your husband abrest of how you are feeling may be a mistake. If thinks go south it is likely to do so suddenly. As you said it will reach a tipping point where a number of negative will pile up until you can not honor this arrangement.
> 
> ...


He has never been into porn. He says it doesn't appeal to him. Even when I went through his laptop, I didn't find any porn aside from the escort websites. 

I wouldn't necessarily say that he's taking away time from us. He is spending more hours at "work", but he's also getting there much earlier than he used to (7:30-8:00 instead of 8:30-9:00), I'm usually asleep when he leaves the house. He has indeed apparently been dining with some of the women he's seeing. Some of these were at out-of-town places when he was traveling for work, but others were here locally on evenings that he said he had to work late. But he frequently had to work late even before (though at that time I was certain that he was actually working). When he's told me he needs to work late, I usually invite my sister over that evening, so not too much has changed there. He's doing it more often now, but not a huge amount. He had previously agreed to a "no dating" condition when he first suggested this arrangement, but I didn't insist upon it when I finally agreed to it three months ago. 

I hadn't thought about the idea of a separation, but it's an interesting suggestion. The one huge drawback is that if he got his own place separate from me, it gives him more opportunities to shack up with women, which wouldn't make things any easier for me. But perhaps living with him is making this more emotionally difficult for me than it would be otherwise. I don't think I've yet reached the point where I think it would be necessary, but it's something to keep in mind.


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## MissLayla1986 (Aug 27, 2010)

Maya627 said:


> Thank you so much for sharing that link; it did provide me with some perspective. I read through some of the replies, and it made me think about my husband's views about sex. Basically, he has no concept of sex being a means of strengthening an emotional bond or an expression of love. He seems to see sex as purely a physical need. That connection between sex and love that other people have doesn't seem to exist in his psychology. So to him, getting it from someone else seems to be the same as getting it from me. I'm not sure how I feel about that. I know my husband loves me, and he never cheated on me before this because we used to have amazing, frequent sex. But I can't say that I don't wish my husband saw sex with me that way. I definitely don't want my children growing up with similar concepts.
> 
> It's a double-edged sword, so to speak. I know that because of his attitude about sex, it's highly unlikely that he'll start to have feelings for another woman during this arrangement, which he otherwise might have been susceptible to if his views were different and he had an affair because of my medical issues. But the fact that he seems so comfortable with this arrangement and can have these separate worlds without it affecting him emotionally is unsettling to me.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I don't think that's a guy thing or a high drive thing because my husband is not like that at all. He is high drive and he's a man so he's of course physically attracted to other women, but he has told me that he can't imagine sleeping with someone he doesn't love. 

It's perhaps normal for men to not have as strong an association between sex and emotion as women, but no association whatsoever? I'm not sure that's a healthy or normal way to conceptualize sex. Have you considered urging your husband to see a psychologist or a sex therapist to evaluate his views toward sex?


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

In sickness and in health for better or for worse means nothing to him apparently. I agree with Catherine, he gets everything he wants, while you do not.
Not sure how you see him as such a great husband but you do. I feel very sad for your situation and if karma has anything to do with this, you will find your cure right about the time he has ED and viola, your turn.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Wanted to add that mark my words, one of these women are going to get pregnant. Wealthy man + woman willing to accept being second = pregnancy. Instead of him using your money (marital assets) to pay for these [email protected]/hotels/dinners, he will be using your money to pay 18 years of child support. Money that is your families money. 
So your options are let him cheat in front of you or find out he is cheating behind you? That isn't marriage, that is blackmail.
I have no idea how you put up with this, literally none. He is taking time and resources away from you and your children and increasing his time and his resources to other women. That man needs a wake up call with either a swift kick to his naglas or an attorney slapping him with papers.


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## Sawney Beane (May 1, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> In sickness and in health for better or for worse means nothing to him apparently. I agree with Catherine, he gets everything he wants, while you do not.
> Not sure how you see him as such a great husband but you do. I feel very sad for your situation and if karma has anything to do with this, you will find your cure right about the time he has ED and viola, your turn.


Not saying I agree with the proposed solution, but your take on situations like this is:

"Your sex life is over. Deal with it."


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Sawney Beane said:


> Not saying I agree with the proposed solution, but your take on situations like this is:
> 
> "Your sex life is over. Deal with it."


No, not at all. This husband could get creative. There is more to sex than just intercourse but he chooses to view it only one way.
He also sounds to have some serious issues regarding sex. She said he viewed sex with her the same as sex with anybody else. Just an act or a release. No connection or emotion. It sounds like he is deeply disturbed.

Having said that, he took a vow and it sounds like he meant it up until the sh!t hit the fan and then he was out. Is that marriage? No.


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## Sawney Beane (May 1, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> No, not at all. This husband could get creative. There is more to sex than just intercourse but he chooses to view it only one way.


I quite agree, but in a case where only one partner is prepared to be creative or accept the other's creativity? You're back to "My way or the high way. Deal with it."

Note, this could equally apply to any partner of any sex.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Sawney Beane said:


> I quite agree, but in a case where only one partner is prepared to be creative or accept the other's creativity? You're back to "My way or the high way. Deal with it."
> 
> Note, this could equally apply to any partner of any sex.


HE is the one saying my way or the highway. He is holding her hostage in essence. She tried. Either let me cheat in front of you or let me cheat behind your back. That isn't marriage, that's blackmail.
She seems to be very accepting of the situation, to a fault and he seems to reap the benefits of being a "family man" while getting everything he wants on the side. He's a fraud and she already has issues with it, 3 months in. I can assure you her resentment levels will hit epic proportions. She has already said that he spends less time with her and the children and has to "work late". Come on. 
If she did the same to him if he had an illness and couldn't perform sexually, do you think he would be so understanding. Not a chance. Marriage IS in sickness and in health and he chose the easy way out.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> HE is the one saying my way or the highway. He is holding her hostage in essence. She tried. Either let me cheat in front of you or let me cheat behind your back. That isn't marriage, that's blackmail.
> She seems to be very accepting of the situation, to a fault and he seems to reap the benefits of being a "family man" while getting everything he wants on the side. He's a fraud and she already has issues with it, 3 months in. I can assure you her resentment levels will hit epic proportions. She has already said that he spends less time with her and the children and has to "work late". Come on.
> If she did the same to him if he had an illness and couldn't perform sexually, do you think he would be so understanding. Not a chance. Marriage IS in sickness and in health and he chose the easy way out.


I'm sorry, but I just can't stand for my husband being called a fraud. Despite our current issues, he is my husband, and what he's doing now doesn't undo everything he's done over the years to earn my love, respect, and admiration. You don't seem to have any appreciation for the sensitivity and complexity of this situation. I appreciate your thoughts, but I came here for advice, not to be told repeatedly how horrible a person my husband is.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

For whatever it is worth on here Maya , I felt your post about how you have cried thinking about all the wonderful things your husband has done for your family, being there for them -was beautiful, it is very very obvious TO ME, that the man has some very redeeming qualities about him. Most women would ERASE and conveniently forget all the good of a man - because of what you are dealing with, they would re-write history, and I feel you are an amazing woman to recognize HIS GOOD, even admists the Bad - what others see as pure selfishness. 

When it comes down to it, this is between you and your husband & what you 2 decide to do -out of love & undertanding for each other. Most people will frown mightily on this type of situation as they would never allow such a thing in the own marriage, they can not even wrap their head around it , let alone what it would do to *the heart*. 

I just hope whatever you do decide, you can find *peace *with it, TherealBrighteyes did have a good point about (if your husband has not had a vesectomy) some women may see $$$ signs & get pregnant , I surely wouldn't put that past some gold diggers out there. 

I am sure you have went over this till you are blue in the face , what to do, I see you as a very very understanding and loving wife just trying to handle a very very very difficult situation.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Sawney Beane said:


> Not saying I agree with the proposed solution, but your take on situations like this is:
> 
> "Your sex life is over. Deal with it."


I don't see anyone saying the above. Of course his sex life should not be over because his wife is ill if he makes that choice. It his drive and he can do as he pleases. The suggestions were for Maya to establish boundaries. The purpose of boundaries is to protect against emotional and physical injury. She has none and that is why she seems to be headed for an emotional fall. 

To suggested that his sex life is over because she is sick is a demand not a boundary. One of the suggestions was that they separate. The benefit to her is that she does not have to endure the indignity of watching her husband date and have a fun time with other women. It is true she will not be able to watch him in his new diggs but that's the point. She has no control over him and that he might move some chick in. That is indeed a disadvantage I suppose but is it any worse than that he is dating fast and furious? He just has to take care of business in a hotel room of maybe his office when every one is gone. 

He has to deal with not seeing his family every day, people knowing that he has left his wife for the purpose of seeing other women. He may consider that something he would rather not people know but it is what it is. He has to handle that. Perhaps if he suffered some consequences he will rethink his attitude towards women. Right now they are a collection of warm holes and he is a penis. This is a limited view of 1/2 of the population.

Alternatively they could divorce. They can remain good friends and love each other but he will have his life and freedom to be consumed by the pursuit of sexual pleasure. Maya will have no less than what she has now, except she can protect the family assets for her kids he can use his half to buy all the woman he wants. he does not associate sex with love so why keep him around he can be loved from afar.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

SimplyAmorous said:


> For whatever it is worth on here Maya , I felt your post about how you have cried thinking about all the wonderful things your husband has done for your family, being there for them -was beautiful, it is very very obvious TO ME, that the man has some very redeeming qualities about him. Most women would ERASE and conveniently forget all the good of a man - because of what you are dealing with, they would re-write history, and I feel you are an amazing woman to recognize HIS GOOD, even admists the Bad - what others see as pure selfishness.
> 
> When it comes down to it, this is between you and your husband & what you 2 decide to do -out of love & undertanding for each other. Most people will frown mightily on this type of situation as they would never allow such a thing in the own marriage, they can not even wrap their head around it , let alone what it would do to *the heart*.
> 
> ...


Thank you, SimplyAmorous. Your advice and understanding really do mean a lot.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

MissLayla1986 said:


> I don't think that's a guy thing or a high drive thing because my husband is not like that at all. He is high drive and he's a man so he's of course physically attracted to other women, but he has told me that he can't imagine sleeping with someone he doesn't love.
> 
> It's perhaps normal for men to not have as strong an association between sex and emotion as women, but no association whatsoever? I'm not sure that's a healthy or normal way to conceptualize sex. Have you considered urging your husband to see a psychologist or a sex therapist to evaluate his views toward sex?


I've always known that he viewed sex that way, but I never thought about whether that was normal or not because it hasn't been an issue in my marriage until now. I think his motivations for wanting to bring me to orgasm were more driven by his "alpha male" ego and asserting his masculinity than a unique expression of love towards me. But the sex was always amazing and I always orgasmed, so it was never an issue. To tell you the truth, I wasn't exactly much into romance myself and was perfectly content that my husband's concept of good sex was just both of us achieving orgasm. I just thought all men were like that. I've learned now that that's not the case.

I think that having him see a therapist to analyze his concept of sex is a good idea, I'll suggest that to him at some point.


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## MissLayla1986 (Aug 27, 2010)

Maya627 said:


> I've always known that he viewed sex that way, but I never thought about whether that was normal or not because it hasn't been an issue in my marriage until now. I think his motivations for wanting to bring me to orgasm were more driven by his "alpha male" ego and asserting his masculinity than a unique expression of love towards me. But the sex was always amazing and I always orgasmed, so it was never an issue. To tell you the truth, I wasn't exactly much into romance myself and was perfectly content that my husband's concept of good sex was just both of us achieving orgasm. I just thought all men were like that. I've learned now that that's not the case.
> 
> I think that having him see a therapist to analyze his concept of sex is a good idea, I'll suggest that to him at some point.


I'm all for men embracing an "alpha male" persona with their wives (this was actually being discussed in a couple of the other threads), but machismo can't be the only basis upon which a man seeks to cultivate a healthy sexual relationship with his wife. Love must also be a big part of the good sex equation, IMHO.

It sounds like he's completely compartmentalized the marital relationship. I.E., if the purposes of marriage are threefold--1) love and companionship, 2) fulfilling physical needs, and 3) procreation--he seems to regard these three as completely separate and independent of one another. So that if one of them cannot be fulfilled with his wife, he thinks it's okay to fulfill it with someone else without having any detrimental effect on the other two. That doesn't strike me as a healthy way to view marriage.


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## mary35 (Jul 18, 2010)

Maya, my heart goes out to you. This is a horrible situation with no really good answers. I honestly don't know what to say that could be of any help.

Here is a site I found on line. Who knows maybe they could help you in some way or direct you to someone who can. 
The Berman Women's Wellness Center

Good Luck!


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Maya,
While this situation is causing a lot of posters here to get highly emotional I would like to add some observations:
1. I absolutely believe he can have escort sex without a strong emotional connection to the women
2. He definitely does love you and your family
3. The post about him getting all his needs met while you don't is not really valid. I am confident he would far prefer a strong sexual relationship with you. He is making the best of a tough situation. 
4. My guess - if you give him no choice he will accept a separation and ultimately even a divorce. He is not agreeable to being in a sexless/sort of sexless marriage.






Maya627 said:


> He has never been into porn. He says it doesn't appeal to him. Even when I went through his laptop, I didn't find any porn aside from the escort websites.
> 
> I wouldn't necessarily say that he's taking away time from us. He is spending more hours at "work", but he's also getting there much earlier than he used to (7:30-8:00 instead of 8:30-9:00), I'm usually asleep when he leaves the house. He has indeed apparently been dining with some of the women he's seeing. Some of these were at out-of-town places when he was traveling for work, but others were here locally on evenings that he said he had to work late. But he frequently had to work late even before (though at that time I was certain that he was actually working). When he's told me he needs to work late, I usually invite my sister over that evening, so not too much has changed there. He's doing it more often now, but not a huge amount. He had previously agreed to a "no dating" condition when he first suggested this arrangement, but I didn't insist upon it when I finally agreed to it three months ago.
> 
> I hadn't thought about the idea of a separation, but it's an interesting suggestion. The one huge drawback is that if he got his own place separate from me, it gives him more opportunities to shack up with women, which wouldn't make things any easier for me. But perhaps living with him is making this more emotionally difficult for me than it would be otherwise. I don't think I've yet reached the point where I think it would be necessary, but it's something to keep in mind.


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## insight (Aug 25, 2011)

Maya627 said:


> Thank you so much for sharing that link; it did provide me with some perspective. I read through some of the replies, and it made me think about my husband's views about sex. Basically, he has no concept of sex being a means of strengthening an emotional bond or an expression of love. He seems to see sex as purely a physical need. That connection between sex and love that other people have doesn't seem to exist in his psychology. So to him, getting it from someone else seems to be the same as getting it from me. I'm not sure how I feel about that. I know my husband loves me, and he never cheated on me before this because we used to have amazing, frequent sex. But I can't say that I don't wish my husband saw sex with me that way. I definitely don't want my children growing up with similar concepts.
> 
> It's a double-edged sword, so to speak. I know that because of his attitude about sex, it's highly unlikely that he'll start to have feelings for another woman during this arrangement, which he otherwise might have been susceptible to if his views were different and he had an affair because of my medical issues. But the fact that he seems so comfortable with this arrangement and can have these separate worlds without it affecting him emotionally is unsettling to me.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Hi, you say that your husband's attitude towards sex seems to be purely physical in nature? I would caution you that he may feel this way now because of a strong sex drive, but as he approaches mid-life in your marriage, he may begin to realize that there always was a strong need to bond with you emotionally. Don't make the mistake of thinking that just because he has a strong sex drive as a relatively young man, that he doesn't also have a deeper need to feel connected, and this is his way of doing so.

Meanwhile, he may be out trying to satisfy a need for something that he is unclear about, because his sexual appetite is all he sees. Be careful, because even though you think you are unable to give him something that you think you are unable to provide, you may only be hurting yourself and him in the process.

Your husband may be a great husband, good provider, and all those great qualities you mentioned, but have you thought about this: It sounds to me like he may be emotionally immature, meaning that there could be a very strong underlying reason why he is so sexually driven. That underlying reason might be emotionally based on some need to feel a deep sense of connectedness to a female. You should be that female, not the many women he is allowed to sleep with because of your new arrangement.

Listen, I know this has been hard for you both, but I believe there are ways for you to connect sexually and emotionally without having to resort to your current arrangement. Sure, it won't be optimal, but life can't always be the way we want, and we can't always have our cake and eat it too. If he has needs, then do your part to help him get them satisfied in a way that helps you both. You know, sex doesn't have to be just about physical gratification, and it is clear to me that you both probably need to be more intimately and emotionally connected. Letting your husband go out and be with other women isn't really helping as much as you might think, and it sure isn't helping you.

I am speaking from experience when I tell you that I have always had a very strong sex drive, one which has never been even close to being satisfied in my marriage. To add insult to the situation, after the kids came, my wife was diagnosed with ovarian cancer, followed by a complete hysterectomy and chemotherapy. What was once a bad situation, just became worse. I considered going outside my marriage, but didn't, because that is just me. But what I realized as time went on and I rounded the 50yr old mark was this: There had always a very deep desire to be connected to my wife emotionally, which even she was never very good at or needy in herself. My sex drive had decreased a little, not much, but enough so that I began to see that there was definitely a strong emotional element involved with my strong sex drive. That, combined with the fact that I had not matured to the point of being able to recognize what was motivating me. Our relationship was bound to mature in order for it to survive life's tests. The problem was, now I had to somehow convince my wife that I really did need to be both physically and emotionally connected to her, a new challenge.

I hope what I have said helps! Good luck!


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

MEM11363 said:


> Maya,
> While this situation is causing a lot of posters here to get highly emotional I would like to add some observations:
> 1. I absolutely believe he can have escort sex without a strong emotional connection to the women
> 2. He definitely does love you and your family
> ...


Thanks for your reply. That's one thing that my husband kept repeating during our conversation in which I agreed to this arrangement, that he would much rather be with me but he can't make his sex drive just go away. It's reassuring, but it doesn't do much to alleviate the emotional strain of knowing that my husband is intimate with other women. Divorce is not an option, but a temporary, amicable separation is looking like a good idea the more I think about it. I understand where my husband is coming from and I'm willing to look the other way on his sex life for now, but I can't live with him while he's not keeping it at home.


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## insight (Aug 25, 2011)

Maya, May I ask?

Regarding your medical condition: Does this condition prohibit you from being able to have a normal orgasm? If so, do you masturbate?

Do you and your husband have any sexual contact at all any more?

Are you willing to go without sex from hence forth if he continues to go outside your marriage?

Forgive me if these questions are too personal or improper here. I only mean to help if I can.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

insight said:


> Hi, you say that your husband's attitude towards sex seems to be purely physical in nature? I would caution you that he may feel this way now because of a strong sex drive, but as he approaches mid-life in your marriage, he may begin to realize that there always was a strong need to bond with you emotionally. Don't make the mistake of thinking that just because he has a strong sex drive as a relatively young man, that he doesn't also have a deeper need to feel connected, and this is his way of doing so.
> 
> Meanwhile, he may be out trying to satisfy a need for something that he is unclear about, because his sexual appetite is all he sees. Be careful, because even though you think you are unable to give him something that you think you are unable to provide, you may only be hurting yourself and him in the process.
> 
> ...


Thank you for sharing that your story. I'm very sorry for what you and your wife had to go through but I'm glad to hear that you grew closer as a result. Someone else argued that my husband's concept of sex is not healthy or normal, and it's definitely possible that there are some deep-seated psychological reasons why if that is indeed the case. I'm going to encourage him to see a therapist to evaluate his sexual mindset.


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## insight (Aug 25, 2011)

Maya627 said:


> Thank you for sharing that your story. I'm very sorry for what you and your wife had to go through but I'm glad to hear that you grew closer as a result. Someone else argued that my husband's concept of sex is not healthy or normal, and it's definitely possible that there are some deep-seated psychological reasons why if that is indeed the case. I'm going to encourage him to see a therapist to evaluate his sexual mindset.


Hmmm, is that all you got out of what I had to say? Perhaps I expect too much.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

insight said:


> Maya, May I ask?
> 
> Regarding your medical condition: Does this condition prohibit you from being able to have a normal orgasm? If so, do you masturbate?
> 
> ...


Yes; I haven't had an orgasm in a very long time, and I can no longer get wet so sex became painful. It's basically impossible for me to become aroused, so I don't masturbate either. 

No; my husband and I are no longer sexually intimate. Towards the end I was giving him BJs after intercourse became increasingly painful, but I stopped after we agreed to this arrangement. One of the conditions is that while this arrangement is in effect, I won't have any kind of sexual relations with him. We're still affectionate with each other, but in non-sexual ways or ways that won't lead to sex. 

My strong preference is to get my libido back ASAP and resume our normal sex life. When that happens, I will end my consent to the arrangement. Doctor said that the condition is such that it can safely remain untreated since I don't have any other symptoms, but I need my sex drive back. As soon as my doctor and I find a safe option to treat this, I'm taking it.


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## TantalusAgenda (Aug 25, 2011)

Forgive me, but your husband's attitude seems remarkable. You maintain, with apparent good reason, that he is not selfish, yet he is making what appear to be unrealistic and unfair demands of you in order to fulfill his own desires and sexual fantasies... what isn't selfish about that?

It seems to me that with your husband's "high sex drive" he is founding your marriage primarily on sex. Sex is the most important factor - everything else comes second. What about helping you deal with your problems? What about working through a problem together? What about going through the high's and lows? It sounds like your husband is making unrealistic demands for sex on a plate and when you, quite rightly, can't deliver he is looking for your permission to go off elsewhere... I can only think of strongly insulting words to describe him!

I am a man. I am in my mid thirties. I am married. I have a child. And for all I want it, I don't get to have sex anywhere near as often as you... there's no wonder you are dry and can't orgasm... you must be bashed to death down there! I have sex with my wife two or three times a month, if I am lucky, and I am an unhappy about it - unhappy enough to set up a blog to explore the issues in a reasoned and adult way, and explore solutions which are going to benefit both of us. Your husband sounds very immature.

From what you've said, your sex has been primarily about him. It may have been satisfying for you in the past, but what has he really done to help you through your problem? I am actively trying all sorts with my wife, and for me the best sex is had when we are both completely into it... he needs to get his head out of the clouds and smell the coffee!

Submissive blow jobs are not the answer, allowing him to shag other women is not any answer either. It's completely degrading for you and show's no compassion or respect towards you, his wife.

You need to put a stop to this now, and get him to think about you for a change rather than himself.

Sorry.


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

Maya627 said:


> Yes; I haven't had an orgasm in a very long time, and I can no longer get wet so sex became painful. It's basically impossible for me to become aroused, so I don't masturbate either.


Maya ~

Is there anything that can be done to alleviate the dryness? That is the same kind of thing that many menopausal women go through when they encounter a decrease in their hormones, and there are many remedies that can be tried. Have you tried any of those?

It seems so heartbreaking that you have a medical condition and are just told "Sorry, you just have to live with it. We have no treatment for you." I would consider seeking out other physicians for consultation until you can get a more acceptable result. I wouldn't just give up without a fight. 

And, ultimately, it is your decision as to what you find acceptable to live with. I have tried to put myself into your situation in my mind, and I think that I would make some additional conditions: 1) that my husband not engage in anything outside of the sexual encounters (such as going to dinners or 'dates' with these women) and 2) that the encounters take a minimal amount of time (e.g., only scheduled on certain dates and for a very specific timeframe). Would you want to set up the schedule or preview the schedule, as opposed to them being done on an 'ad hoc' basis? In otherwords, I think that the 'rules of engagement' must be very tightly managed.

And lastly, do you let your husband know what is really in your heart? Do you feel that you have adequate emotional support in your illness and with this situation? I think you mentioned a sister you talk to? Is there a support group for people who suffer from the medical condition that you do?

My heart goes out to you! Wishing you all the best.

Bless you.


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## bellamaxjoy (Oct 27, 2011)

My husband and I are recovering from his having a very intense EA. I am so afraid for you that one of these women will give your husband what he wants, and he will become attached. Then your unselfishness will be re payed with him leaving you for someone who will give him sex whenever he wants, as well as he emotional connection you develop after it.


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## misticli (Oct 28, 2011)

I see this has been going on for some time. I feel very sorry for you. I do understand you husbands need to have sex. Sex is a huge part of any marriage. I do think him leaving the marriage bed in this manner is not going to turn out well. Sex keeps you emotionally connected with you partner. When you leave other people to satisfy such an important need for your husband you put yourself in a position where he may find someone he gets attached to and you could lose him.

There are a lot of things you can do if dryness is an issue down there. Visual stimulation, watching porn together, using sex toys, anal sex etc. Then there is also drugs to increase your libido as well. I hope you can work things out.


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## Zzyzx (Aug 24, 2011)

Just discovered this thread. Heartbreaking story. For all the naysayers out there, I say Maya is making the best of it. She gets her husband's attention to their kids, her sister, her nephew, her mother. That has to count for something and to Maya, it has. At the same time, it needs to be clear to everyone that her husband cannot do the sexless marriage, period. Not at all.

One of my best friends was in a sexless marriage. Basically the sex disappeared after their first child, then she got him to give her two more, but absolutely no sex after that. Further, she refused to consider that she was at fault, refused to consider even seeing any doctors or counselors, she gaslighted that this was normal. Maya has gone much further than her. So my friend said, OK, I love children period, I love being around my children and the only way I can maintain the level of contact I want with my children is to stay married. But there was still enormous tension in the house due to his sex drive and her unwillingness to do anything about it. And then she told him he was evil for having that sex drive and no way would she countenance him cheating on her. But he couldn't get her to consider counseling around this.

He put up with this for two years before he fell for an affair with someone in his office, then spent 5 years in a succession of them, all behind her back of course. But there was more emotional entanglement in these affairs than he wanted to deal with because he still wanted to stay married and be a father. So he bit the bullet and started seeing escorts and continued that until the last child finished high school at which time he finally filed for divorce. With the escorts, it was easy to keep the emotional connection out of it. The old rule of thumb being the escort isn't being paid for her time, she's being paid to leave.

His comment to me was that when his drive was satisfied outside of the marriage, he was relaxed around his wife, no pressure on her anymore, then the relationship actually improved much to his amazement. He thinks she suspected, but she never once confronted him as he was extremely careful all along to keep it away from her to the point of getting tested for STD's at least once a year. When he filed for divorce, they had not had sex in 14 years. Sheesh!!! was all I could say, I cannot imagine putting up without sex for that long. I would have divorced her, but he wanted to be with the kids that badly.

Just another viewpoint. So I say bravo to Maya for making the best of a truly heartbreaking and terrible situation. Remember to the naysayers she is getting something out of this just as much as her husband is. She is getting to keep an intact marriage with a man who still values his family and his in-laws. That alone is worth something... and she needs to remind herself every day of this. That if she didn't give this outlet, he would have either gone behind her back or he would have divorced her.

Postscript: my friend is now with a girlfriend whose drive he says is about half of his. For which he feels very grateful to get that much as he now feels like he is with someone he doesn't have to cheat on. He truly hated the way he had to deal with his wife just to be around his kids. Hated the way his sex drive drove him crazy (and still does). His ex-wife was relieved to have the divorce, she did take her half, but there's no animosity, simply an understanding... that could still happen to Maya. So I pray for her sake that she can find the fix for her condition.


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## Mr B (Feb 6, 2009)

Many people, mostly men, can only get fully aroused sexually with a new partner. This is often caused by a fear of intimacy due to childhood issues.

But these people also want what many others want- a family, a good relationship, sexually and otherwise. But a fear of intimacy which can often be subconscious, can cause men to lose their ability to perform sexually with anyone they feel close to. This can cause a marriage to become sexless and allowing men with these problems to seek sex outside the marriage allows them to have sexual release but usually will not endanger the marriage because they are going to have sexual difficulties with anyone they get close to. So there is very little chance that he would fall in love or try to start a relationship with someone new. he knows his sexual problems will just reoccur with anyone else. This protects the marriage. 

This is a problem with women too but they can still have intercourse despite feeling anxious due to intimacy fears. Men on the other hand often lose the ability to get an erection due to the anxiety and so cannot engage in a sexual relationship unless he has a casual or new relationship with the women he is having sex with.

Most wives would not allow their husbands to have sex outside the marriage so often these men turn to porn and masturbation as the only way they can obtain sexual release and a long term sexless marriage is the result.

Therapeutic treatment for male sexual dysfunction caused by a conscious or subconscious fear of intimacy usually has a poor outcome and many sex therapists attempt to treat the sexual dysfunction rather than the root cause which usually goes undiscovered.


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## Ayan (Nov 26, 2011)

WOW, reading what you wrote was like a interesting movie! lol

For one I don't think i could ever live with my Husband having sex with other women and going out to eat with them, but you sure could and i do understand what you two are going through is a unique one.

I hope you are happy and he will NEVER fall in-love with anyone else but you. 

I say do what makes one happy- 

Good luck and god bless everything for you !


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## kallywana (Dec 2, 2011)

Do not encourage your husband to commit adultery. It is sin against God, you and your children. 

Try other sex positions. Give me him a good ****.
Believe me, once he starts sleeping with other women, there will be problem in your marriage. l can't share my husband with another woman. 

Let him sex with you as much as he want, that is not asking for too much considering the sacrifices he has made for you and your family.


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

Thanks Maya for starting this thread. I may now understand what my wife is going through. I don't Know if she has your condition but she has severe dryness ans sex is always painful.

She is really trying all sorts of things that helps with dryness. For 19years we have been through this. She has ALWAYS been like this. She doesn't seem to want to go to the Doctor about this.

I stick around because I do not want to be away from my daughter. I am SOOO close to having an EA it scares me.

With your thread it will help me be more understanding. For the last year now my wife and I have been having much more sex than ever before. So I know she is trying her best as painful as it is for her. I am a little more understanding now.

I don't want my wife to go through all the CR** that you are going through.


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## jezza (Jan 12, 2011)

I hope Maya is still keeping a track on this thread because I would like to take my hat off to her! What a wife! I have every admiration for her.

They had a problem in their marriage. They clearly love each other dearly but she - for both medical and possible emotional reasons is simply not interested in sex...and doesn't seem to be able to make herself even remotely interested in sex. 

She was woman enough to understand that her husband wanted that physical intimacy with her but also, being a man he needed sex.
She couldnt provide him with either...they both loved each other, why should he abstain?

If a couple love cross country running together, but one unfortunately has to give it up for whatever reason, should the other one also give it up?

What about a marriage where physical disability prevents one partner from having sex of any sort...should the other one simply became asexual aswell?

Maya made a very brave and courageous decision...it wasnt easy and the situation isnt ideal.
My only hope for them both is that she gets her libido back and that he is simply having sex and not falling in love.... As they seem such a happy and 'successful' couple in every way except one... and a very import one at that. 

Maya....I wish you and your husband all the very best...you BOTH deserve it.


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

Well, I'm sure Maya has likely left the building as this thread is from this summer and I haven't seen a post from her for awhile.

@Maya ~

If you are still out there, can you give us an update and let us know how you are doing? I think of you periodically and I get a little clench in the region of my heart when I think what you have had to go through.

I will say that I vehemently disagree with a number of the more recent posts.

Here is the deal. I don't believe that a person will be able to maintain their self-respect and self-worth in a situation like this. A wife letting her husband out and about like this will ultimately destroy her. And Maya's husband isn't just meeting up with an escort for an hour to get a 'fix', he is wining and dining his paramours - that is taking it to a whole other level. It is only 'sanctioned' cheating in my opinion, and when there's the word 'cheat' in there no good will come of it.

Maya, I recently came across this great book and read it. Please consider looking at this. YOU deserve a great, committed relationship just as much as the next person. YOU deserve someone who will be willing to GIVE to you.

Amazon.com: The Courage to Be Yourself: A Woman's Guide to Emotional Strength and Self-Esteem (0824297245698): Sue Patton Thoele: Books

I wish you peace on your journey.

Best wishes.


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## jezza (Jan 12, 2011)

I know I posted earlier on this page, but I have just read zzyzx's post. I could have been that friend he was talking about!

I have been (am still) in a basically sexless marriage - might be allowed to have sex with my wife 4-6 times a year and then she sees it as a 'duty'.
About 10 years ago I too had an affair... We have two children...I love them dearly, didnt (still don't!) want to lose them...+ house +++ so I stay married. 

My marriage is a bit like Maya's....more or less OK apart from the lack of sex. 
I 'strayed' because someone paid me the attention I wasnt getting from my wife (even though I was doing all the 'right' things). 
Whilst I was having the affair my marriage DID get better... As I was getting sex elsewhere I was no longer 'annoyed' with my wife.... it was as if this sexual 'black cloud' that hung over our marriage was suddenly lifted.
At the time I didnt think my wife suspected...and to this day (10 years on) she has not mentioned a thing. But I know through a friend of hers that she did know.

Why didnt she confront me? I think its because she knew I wouldn't 'leave' and me getting sex elsewhere took a massive burden off her shoulders.

The affair lasted about two years when it was brought to a sudden and tragic end.

So....whilst sex is very important in a marriage (especially to the man)...a marriage CAN sometimes improve if the sex part is being met elsewhere.

This is why I admire Maya....she made a very courageous decision.


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## Maya627 (Apr 15, 2011)

Well, what can I say. Things haven't gotten any better, and the situation seems to have passed the point of no return. I'm still struggling with my libido-killing health issues. No sex drive, very little sexual attraction. And to be honest, my motivation to solve my health issues is declining. In September, I gave my husband an ultimatum that if he wants to continue seeing other women, he has to move out and get his own place. He said that was fair and he obliged. But he also basically said he isn't willing to stop having sex with other women. He said that his sex drive is stronger than ever and that he simply needs to get his sex from somewhere. He said he would go crazy if he couldn't have sex, and that his lifestyle isn't all that different from taking mistresses or multiple wives like they do in some cultures. He said it would be better if everything were out on the table than if he snuck around in secret. He said that he still loves me and that he will never have feelings for any other women, but that he needed to have sex with other women if he couldn't have it with me. He reiterated that for him, sex is purely a physical need and that he doesn't attach any emotion to it like other people do. I honestly didn't know what to say. The alternative living arrangement lasted about a month before I finally caved and gave him permission to move back in since it was having an effect on our children. He kept his apartment and he uses it to meet other women, but he spends most nights at our house.

I've done a little investigation and inquiry into my husband's sex life, and he's been busy. There are at least two steady 'mistresses' whom he sees regularly, along with other random women he meets here and there. He says all of the women he sees know he's married. He says he only meets women for dinner when he's out of town on business. I'm not sure if he's seeing escorts; I didn't ask about that and frankly don't want to know much more than I already know. 

I think I've just grown numb to the whole thing by now. Our relationship has become more like a friendship now than a marriage. He is still an excellent father to our children. He still does everything else I ask him to do. He pulls his weight around the house and then some. He makes sure I never have to worry about money. He still helps out my mother and sister and treats them like blood relatives. He's still emotionally supportive. He tells me he loves me. I'm not sure I love him back anymore. I just can't bring myself to leave him though.


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## Trickster (Nov 19, 2011)

This must be so hard for you Maya. My wife has a low sex drive like you. She Always had and it hasn't changed over 19 or so years. 

If something doesn't change, I may be asking my wife the same thing that your husband asked you. I was very aggressive this past week and we had sex almost every day for a week. we skipped one day in the middle. It seemed like it was exhausting for her. I know she is trying so hard to enjoy it, which makes it even harder to push her to have more sex. 

With children, there is no easy answer. I am glad to see you point of view. It's helping me be a little more understanding as to what my wife may be going through. I just don't want to have to resort to doing the things that your husband is doing. I honestly don't want to hurt my wife they way you are being hurt.


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## The_Swan (Nov 20, 2011)

I'm saddened to read your situation. 

I hope you can find the courage and strength to divorce him. 
You deserve so much better.


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## TallJeff (Nov 1, 2011)

Maya,

Have you considered counseling? I think your husband seeing others may be a reasonable solution and that perhaps a professional can help you both arrive at the mental place you need to be in to make this work.

I understand his circumstance. You were basically in a place in your marriage where you could have love without sex. Therefore it's not impossible for him to have sex without love. 

But once that was happening, you assumed there was love there too, which may very well not be the case. 

It sounds like he's a good man with a very natural and normal need. It'd be a shame to lose him and the support he provides to your family given this one thing (as large as it may be).

So perhaps a professional counselor could help. It sounds like your family has the means to explore such a possibility.


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## TallJeff (Nov 1, 2011)

Sawney Beane said:


> In short, if both partners want an active sex life, they'll find a way a way to have one. If one partner doesn't want to have an active sex life, they'll find a way to make sure they don't...


Agree 100%. Things are generally good with the wife and I. But when she makes excuses for the occasional lull (lull is always on her end), I tell her "Where there is a will, there is a way." 

Meaning don't play the lack of sex on the lack of 'a way', blame it solely on your will.


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## TallJeff (Nov 1, 2011)

Therealbrighteyes said:


> In sickness and in health for better or for worse means nothing to him apparently. *I agree with Catherine, he gets everything he wants, while you do not.*
> Not sure how you see him as such a great husband but you do. I feel very sad for your situation and if karma has anything to do with this, you will find your cure right about the time he has ED and viola, your turn.


I don't completely agree with this. The other alternative is Maya gets what she wants (no sex) and he does not.

I do think Maya should talk to her husband about her feelings of distance. He thinks he's playing by the rules and maybe thinks things are ok. If he wanted to just cheat, he easily could have. But he didn't, he came and asked permission.

I bet if Maya expressed concern, he'd stop for her sake.


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## LongHaulforHappiness (Dec 28, 2011)

I agree with TallJeff, counseling for you is the way to go. A good counselor will help you where you are confused and lift you when you're down. There is more than just a 'physical need' going on here. This is a lifestyle that your husband has adopted and you love him enough to try and be supportive. You feel like you have failed him in some regard and he's been so good to you otherwise and you want him to feel fulfilled. You love him completely and should have absolutely NO regrets on how you've handled it. You've done more for this man than any other woman in your situation would be willing to do. But what type of relationship do you want? Is intimacy with other women in this way a deal breaker? It's kind of unchartered territory for those of us who can't understand it. Find a great therapist who can give you the insight you lack. Are you really ok with it? Are the trade-offs worth it? What do YOU WANT from a relationship? What do YOU NEED? I would rather my kids see me happy and intimate ON EVERY LEVEL with my partner then to have just a friendship with their Dad and him stepping out to 'get his needs met'. They don't have to be told the details, they will get that something is up between you two. And...I have a feeling that your husband would have opted for this lifestyle whether your sex drive was low or high. Sounds like something he would like to do for himself but he's willing to be open about it. I think this has NOTHING to do with YOU. It has everyhthing to do with HIM!


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## lastradas (Oct 14, 2011)

I have to admit that I am very confused by the responses here. I have only been posting here actively for a while but have been a long time lurker. In this time I have read uncountable posts by people whose spouses do not have sex with them anymore, for a variety of reasons. 

The majority of the time these people are told that their spouse is a selfish human being who, if they really loved their partner, would just get over it and have sex/engage in sexual behavior even if they didn't feel like it. The poster's sexual desire takes precedence over any reasons the spouse may not want to have sex with their partner. Reasons are mostly unknown or only speculation on the part of the poster - most of the time, questions to really understand the spouse's motive are not asked. 

Maya made a decision to agree to an arrangement that ultimately made her emotionally distance herself from her husband. All of a sudden people are comforting her and calling her husband a prick. He is sticking to the rules and yet, he's the one who's getting all the crap. I wonder what people said if he posted here being depressed that his wife doesn't want to have sex anymore.

Don't get me wrong, I truly feel for Maya. I understand why she made the decision she made. But it's pretty much a fact that these arrangement never, ever work out. I don't think that either one of them is being selfish. They simply have very different levels of sexual desire and it is next to impossible to satisfy them being a in a relationship with each other without one partner getting the short end of the stick. Should he stop seeing escorts? He has a strong sexual drive which there is nothing wrong with it, but she is currently (maybe never) not able to satisfy it. It is neither his or her fault - it is what it is. Is she supposed to have sex with him for the sake of satisfying his needs while feeling used and only loved for her body? Neither one here is right or wrong and I don't think there is an ideal solution. 

As previously suggested, counseling may be the only option but only if both think if it's possible to work it out in a way that meets both their needs.


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## TallJeff (Nov 1, 2011)

I agree so much with lastradas.

It seems there are multiples choices here. None are good, you're left to choose the least bad option.

1. Divorce. The kids are denied a 100% father. Maya is denied the very comfortable lifestyle to which she has become accustom. Maya's extended family will not likely receive the great support they've received from this kind man.

2. Stay together but Maya's health/libido issue remains unsolved and hubby remains faithful. His resentment issues will grow and no one is happy in the house. It sounds like he may be less stressed AND Maya was less stressed when the sexual issue was off the table. But this option would put it back on the table.

3. Stay together but hubby may have his one unmet need met elsewhere. Hubby is happy, but he seems like a good guy and would honestly rather have this need met by Maya. Maya is happy that hubby is there, a 100% father, and she and her family are better cared for. Maya is unhappy because she can't reconcile that other women are satisfying her husband in a way she can't/has chosen not to. 

Of all these, working with a counselor to help with that last bit of #3 seems the best to me, though we each may have different opinions.


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## chattycathy (Aug 19, 2011)

Maya,
with the money he spends towards an apartment to **** around in, you must have finances to spare.
Please ask him to put a huge chunk of the marital assets in your hands so you can open an account in your name only to feel less vulnerable about the situation.
Then, arrange for someone to hold your hand as you see an attorney
and
file for divorce.
Let him be with the kids as much as he wants as you heal from the horrors he brings to your feet.
I don't care how low or nonexistant your libido is and how high and powerdriven he thinks his is. Big whoop.
He is abusing you with neglect and emotional attacks of your soul. He is devaluing you as a woman. As a person. 
Send him on his way.
Be strong.
Your health actually requires you to do this for you and the kids.


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## TallJeff (Nov 1, 2011)

> He is abusing you with neglect and emotional attacks of your soul. He is devaluing you as a woman. As a person.


Cathy,

That may very well be the best thing for Maya, but remember that her husband ASKED first. He didn't just cheat when he was off on business travel. He didn't just have an affair in his city. He ASKED. 

After Maya gave permission then she had a hard time dealing with it.

I accept that it may not work for her now, and she has the right to change her mind. But I honestly don't think it's fair to call him a bad guy. He is only doing what he asked and received permission to do.

I bet many women here wish they had a man as loyal to them and their family as Maya's husband.


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

TallJeff said:


> I bet many women here wish they had a man as loyal to them and their family as Maya's husband.


Loyal is when a person faithfully sticks by you through thick and thin - whether you are sick or healthy. The word 'faithful' is usually used in the definition of loyalty, as in "faithful to one's oath, commitments, or obligations." These seem to be things that Maya's husband is definitely not. He certainly is not faithful to the marriage vow he took 'to forsake all others' 'in sickness and in health'.

No, I don't think you'll find many women at all who would want a man like Maya's husband. I feel sorry for her. Her self-respect and self-worth are being crushed by the heels of a philanderer who is parading as a good and faithful husband.  I hope that she wakes up and takes action before it is too late.

Best of wishes, Maya.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Enchantment,
So what is it you suggest if one partner has zero desire for sex with the other? And let's assume this is not a therapy issue - they genuinely like each other but one of e, really does NOT want to have sex with the other.



QUOTE=Enchantment;530266]Loyal is when a person faithfully sticks by you through thick and thin - whether you are sick or healthy. The word 'faithful' is usually used in the definition of loyalty, as in "faithful to one's oath, commitments, or obligations." These seem to be things that Maya's husband is definitely not. He certainly is not faithful to the marriage vow he took 'to forsake all others' 'in sickness and in health'.

No, I don't think you'll find many women at all who would want a man like Maya's husband. I feel sorry for her. Her self-respect and self-worth are being crushed by the heels of a philanderer who is parading as a good and faithful husband.  I hope that she wakes up and takes action before it is too late.

Best of wishes, Maya.[/QUOTE]
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## TallJeff (Nov 1, 2011)

I believe in Monogamy, too.

But Monogamy means having sex with ONE (mono) person. It doesn't mean just not having sex outside your marriage.


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## Enchantment (May 11, 2011)

MEM11363 said:


> Enchantment,
> So what is it you suggest if one partner has zero desire for sex with the other? And let's assume this is not a therapy issue - they genuinely like each other but one of e, really does NOT want to have sex with the other.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The situation you refer to is not the situation Maya is in - and my response was to her situation, not to a generality. She has a debilitating medical condition that is impacting her. In all honesty, I would expect her husband to suck it up in that case. For one thing, there are other ways of being pleased than just PIV. If there are hands, if there are mouths, if there are elbows, there can be intimacy.

Her husband wants more than just sex - he wasn't willing to go to an escort for an hour every few days - he wanted to wine and dine the women he was with. I feel that he wants Maya to give him carte blanche to have affairs. In my opinion, these two should part ways - and I rarely ever say to people to end it, leaving it to them to decide their fate.


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Enchantment said:


> Loyal is when a person faithfully sticks by you through thick and thin - whether you are sick or healthy. The word 'faithful' is usually used in the definition of loyalty, as in "faithful to one's oath, commitments, or obligations." These seem to be things that Maya's husband is definitely not. He certainly is not faithful to the marriage vow he took 'to forsake all others' 'in sickness and in health'.
> 
> No, I don't think you'll find many women at all who would want a man like Maya's husband. I feel sorry for her. Her self-respect and self-worth are being crushed by the heels of a philanderer who is parading as a good and faithful husband.  I hope that she wakes up and takes action before it is too late.
> 
> Best of wishes, Maya.


Exactly. This isn't the case of "eh, not tonight dear", she has a medical issue and instead of him being there in sickness and in health....he is busy getting his rocks off with other women, breaking their agreement that if it bothered her he would stop and spending the family resources for his escapades. I do not see him being some sort of awesome guy. He bailed. Period.
Maya, I know what I told you many months ago upset you. I will dial it down a bit but he is putting his own needs in front of you and your children and that is not the ways of a good husband. 
I am so sorry for what you are going through.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

But what I see is that her husband has been as honest with Maya as she wanted. And she's determined that the benefits of being married to him outweigh the drawbacks. She's making an informed decision.

My GF also has a pituitary tumor. Her's was caught on an MRI, I believe, and she had funky hormonal things going on as well. I was going to ask her what kind she has, just out of curiosity. Her doctor suggested her tumor might negatively affected her libido levels, but if I'm seeing reduced libido levels, I can't imagine what her healthy levels would be like!

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## chattycathy (Aug 19, 2011)

I don't see that her H was honest with her. 
That is bunk.
He played on her bend towards kindness to ask if he could do something awful. Not husbandly.
It is not okay that he asked and implemented cruelty. 
It IS mental cruelty.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

daffodilly said:


> Right. He's the pillar of honesty. Because we all know that if she had refused, he would have totally accepted it and NOT gone behind her back.
> 
> He _honestly_ agreed that she could rescind her acceptance and he would comply. He darn well knows today that she's distant and not okay with it, and instead of considering himself damn lucky that she took a risk to make HIM happy and can't handle it anymore, he is saying "Well, now that I've had a taste, I can't go back".
> 
> If he had a drop of love for her, he'd stop, and focus on what intimacy he can get from her. And be grateful that she was even willing to try this arrangement for his sake.


I'm not saying he's not a jerk, a turd, an @sshat... Take your pick of nasty names, I'll agree with them. But he is being honest about what he wants, and what he's doing. And she's made a decision that the benefits she gets from being married outweighs the drawbacks of separating or divorce.

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

PBear said:


> I'm not saying he's not a jerk, a turd, an @sshat... Take your pick of nasty names, I'll agree with them. But he is being honest about what he wants, and what he's doing. And she's made a decision that the benefits she gets from being married outweighs the drawbacks of separating or divorce.
> 
> C
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Do you really think he wouldn't have cheated regardless if she was okay with it? His honesty is nothing more than abandonment in my mind. Imagine if the shoe was on the other foot and he couldn't have sex. Would it be "honest" of her to go find someone else despite his agony over her doing it? Is that what marriage is all about? Not to me it isn't.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Again, I'm not saying he's a wonderful man for what he's done, or that he wouldn't have cheated, gotten someone else pregnancy, or got a funky STD. He could be out Satan worshipping every three days, for all I care. My point is that she has all the information she needs to make a decision, and she's decided that there's more benefit to her staying in the marriage than to separating. She's taught him that his behavior is an acceptable tradeoff to her. If she doesn't like it, she has the tools available to change the situation.

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## gonefishin (Oct 7, 2011)

Maya
I remember ten years ago. Kids were young, wife could not meet my sexual needs. She was frustrated one day and said "I can not keep up with you, if you need it that bad get a girl friend"

I walked out of the room and 30 seconds later walked back in and told her that I would never do that to her. She was and is my best friend and I have to much respect for her. I felt terrible that she had to say that to me.

Your husband working his ass off to support the family has nothing to do with your sex life.


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## tjohnson (Mar 10, 2010)

Syrum said:


> *NO WAY*
> For the following reasons
> 
> - *Risk of falling in love*
> ...


I agree with all these points and will reiterate:

Friends and family will likely find out. I also agree if your H starts having a physical relationship it will likely turn into more even if he tries to keep it otherwise. Much as he loves you he will likely bond with the one need that you cannot seem to fulfill. 

I should also point out that he feels so strongly about this need that he is willing to put his marriage at a high level of risk. 

I too suffer from a LD wife. It is painful at times. I deal with it and it is the source of much friction with my wife. Unlike your H I am grateful for BJs. They serve as a release and a way to bond with my wife unfortunately, they are way too rare. Many men would be happy with BJs and while not perfect better than wanking it. Would I want to have sex every day…you bet… so would most menWorking 60 hours a week, being a good father and provider is great and you are lucky. Remember he does these things for his own gratification too. I don’t care if he put his wooden leg on a fire to keep your mother’s house warm in the winter. It does not give him a free pass on asking for what he is asking for. 

Even with permission it is still cheating. It just gives him a clear conscience and can tell the women he meets that you and he “have an understanding”. 

I am still not quite understanding why you can't work on this in another way. I know I let my wife slide on this part of our marriage when i recognize:

1) the other contributions you make to me/the family
2) that you are making an effort in this area. 

I just have a question about the frequency here. My friend is a doctor and he says that people typically undersate the amount they drink and overstate the amount they excersize. Is your H really dissatisfied with 2/week or is the number really less. Whenever, i keep track and report it back to my wife later she always is shocked and even disputes the number.


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## johniori1 (Dec 28, 2011)

He could very well end up falling in love with someone else.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

TallJeff said:


> I believe in Monogamy, too.
> 
> But Monogamy means having sex with ONE (mono) person. It doesn't mean just not having sex outside your marriage.


That really needs to be spelled out to people. Some people think monogamy means giving someone else the key and then sitting back hoping they might use it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

TallJeff said:


> I believe in Monogamy, too.
> 
> But Monogamy means having sex with ONE (mono) person. It doesn't mean just not having sex outside your marriage.


We have a winner!

:iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:


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## Therealbrighteyes (Feb 11, 2010)

Entropy3000 said:


> We have a winner!
> 
> :iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree::iagree:


Not understanding this at all. Jeff said in a previous post that she should continue to allow him to cheat while she goes and gets counseling for her broken heart. Exactly how is any of this monogomy and also not completely breaking his vows to her? :scratchhead:


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## dymo (Jan 2, 2012)

Maya, I feel so bad for you.

I wish there were a way to make your husband know the pain you feel. Have you told him you feel the way you do? What this "arrangement" is doing to kill your feelings for him? He should know. Maybe you could show him this thread.

If this keeps going, please give thought to a divorce. Children model their relationships on their parents. They shouldn't be modeling after a loveless marriage. 

Your husband does what he does partly because his dad did it. If you have a son, he shouldn't grow up thinking what his dad does is okay.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

It seems the arrangement is working out for him, but not for you, and this is not surprising. I'm sorry in a way that I bumped this thread up with my question about an update. I was hoping that things were going well with you, Maya. 

You're a much stronger woman than I am.


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## Posiedon (Nov 25, 2012)

Lack of sex in marriage especially if deficit is proven medically is sufficient grounds for divorce across the globe and has been upheld in numerous courts...

would say a working arrangement for the deprived party (husband) due to a medical issue (wife) is better than a non-working arrangement - divorce or separation from the perspective of all parties (wife/husband and kids).


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

I wonder how Maya is doing these days.


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## Woodchuck (Nov 1, 2012)

Why don't you have the sister move in as a surrogate/sister wife?


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