# Talking to grown kids about OW/OM



## TooNice (Nov 26, 2013)

My SD is in town with her new boyfriend. My son has been spending some time with them and my ex. Today, they went to a baseball game... and the OW was with them.

My son (18) has not told me that he met her. I'm not sure when it happened. I THINK it was within the last couple of days, but I'm not sure. I know the divorce is still raw for him, especially based on a conversation I had with him not long ago about my own dating. I have to think he may want to talk about the fact that not only is his dad dating, but he clearly has a committed girlfriend. 

I want him to know that I'm ok... that I'm here to talk if he needs to, but that I will never push him for information. I just want him to know that I'm here, and I know it all sucks. 

How have others handled similar situations?


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## Shoto1984 (Apr 11, 2009)

I have at a much younger level but I think the same concept may apply. I think it doesn't have to be directly addressed. I think just having regular, close, one on one time creates a welcoming environment for things to said if there is a need. It sounds like you have good communication with him so he'll know he can vent to you when he needs to. In my house I can see the wheels turning in their heads and every so often there's a question and we talk and then there's more processing to be done till then next question.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

I think the guy deserves to know that this isnt JUST a new gf of his father's, that this is the OW that helped destroy his parents' marriage. Just sayin. Others may disagree, but I think our kids always deserve the truth.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

I agree that your son deserves to know the truth. He is 18 so it can be told him to at the level of a kid his age. He does not need the nitty gritty.

"Dad and OW have been seeing each other since about ____month/year____ . Your father had an affair with her and decided to divorce so that he can be with her. I was not happy about it all. But I'm moving on. I'm sorry for all the pain and disruption this caused you. You do not deserve it."

Why do I suggest this? Because kids are perceptive. They often get a lot of what is going on. But adults ignore that they are perceptive and don't talk to them about things. For the kid who is left out of the loop, it's like living in a house with poltergeists. You can feel them, sense them, see the damage they cause but you can never actually see them.. so it leaves the child feeling like they are crazy.


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## EnjoliWoman (Jul 2, 2012)

At that age, I agree. He may not have said anything because he might already know that and want to protect you. I like the way EleGirl phrased it, although a simple statement that you know they were dating before you separated might be enough info, along with some reassurance that you are OK and he doesn't need to protect you. Don't press him with questions about ex/OW, just let him know you were aware and you weren't happy about it, but such is life and you are OK.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> Why do I suggest this? Because kids are perceptive. They often get a lot of what is going on. But adults ignore that they are perceptive and don't talk to them about things. For the kid who is left out of the loop, it's like living in a house with poltergeists. You can feel them, sense them, see the damage they cause but you can never actually see them.. so it leaves the child feeling like they are crazy.


They are not only perceptive, but they value honesty, especially from their parents. I know my kid would be twelve kinds of pissed off if she found out later down the line that the "new" girlfriend she just learned to accept was actually the woman who helped her dad destroy the family. And rightfully so!


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## TooNice (Nov 26, 2013)

I've maintained that I am taking the higher road by not telling him. Does he deserve to know? Probably. Do I want to be the bearer of bad news? No. 

If I open my mouth, it will make him sad and angry, it will put his relationship with his dad in jeopardy, and my ex will be furious with me. There is honesty...and I will always be honest with him, but I'm still not convinced that this one is MY job to tell him. It makes me feel like I am being a bit of a martyr, but it just doesn't feel right to break his heart. It hurts enough.


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## zillard (Nov 13, 2012)

His relationship with his father is not your job to maintain. 

Do your part to maintain your relationship, your half of the parenting. 

That includes honesty, without being nasty about his father. Honesty isn't nasty, if delivered appropriately.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

TooNice said:


> I've maintained that I am taking the higher road by not telling him. Does he deserve to know? Probably. Do I want to be the bearer of bad news? No.
> 
> If I open my mouth, it will make him sad and angry, it will put his relationship with his dad in jeopardy, and my ex will be furious with me. There is honesty...and I will always be honest with him, but I'm still not convinced that this one is MY job to tell him. It makes me feel like I am being a bit of a martyr, but it just doesn't feel right to break his heart. It hurts enough.


He might be sad, but his sorrow is not the result of your sharing the truth with him, it will come from his father's betrayal. His Dad knows that and lacks the courage to tell him. He is dumping that on you. Dad is the one, and *only one* putting his relationship with his son in jeopardy. 

It is up to Dad to a parent. He can choose to do so with honesty and integrity, or not. That is his choice. You can also chose what kind of parent you want to be for your son-and that is your job. You are protecting your ex and that job has ended, you just don't see it yet.


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## Cooper (Apr 18, 2008)

I always weigh my actions against the consequences. That philosophy makes me ask what the end result would be of outing a cheating spouse or parent. Who does it hurt and what does it gain? Does it really make them accountable for their actions? Or does it just cause more pain?

I never told any one in my ex's family about her infidelity, nor did I share that info with our kids, who at the time were young teens. Truthfully I didn't need to because she moved in with the guy and started taking him to her family functions so things were pretty apparent.

As far as the kids go I was cognizant that their relationship with their mother was very different than my relationship with her was. Sure you could say she betrayed them as well and I couldn't argue that point but at the end of the day I didn't want to be the person that made two kids hate their mom. What would that accomplish? 

Conversations with my kids were based around the difference in our home life, her new living arrangement and the introduction of step siblings. There was no un ringing the infidelity bell, so my goal was to help the kids adjust and let them decide what they would accept or not.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

Cooper said:


> Sure you could say she betrayed them as well and I couldn't argue that point but at the end of the day I didn't want to be the person that made two kids hate their mom. What would that accomplish?.


I see this differently. You would not have been the person that made the kids hate their mom.

Any animosity the kids may hold stems from their mother's actions and behavior, not from being told the truth.

I am an advocate of age-appropriate disclosure to the destruction of the family. The kids are part of that family and deserve the truth in their life. Clearly, every situation is different. But in our case, when they had one parent, who in the end and still, lies as easily as he breathes, my kids desperately needed a parent they could trust.


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## zillard (Nov 13, 2012)

Cooper said:


> There was no un ringing the infidelity bell, so my goal was to help the kids adjust and* let them decide* what they would accept or not.


Was that fair though, if they went into that decision blindly?


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## zillard (Nov 13, 2012)

As an 18 year old, how would you feel if you found out about something like this from a 3rd party, later?


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## soccermom2three (Jan 4, 2013)

zillard said:


> As an 18 year old, how would you feel if you found out about something like this from a 3rd party, later?


Yep, I would rather it come from me than from someone else.

Something similar happened to my cousin. A huge family secret about my aunt and my cousin's father came out later by another (not so nice) family member. My cousin was shocked and put off guard at the time. It was really something my aunt should have told him years before.


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## chillymorn (Aug 11, 2010)

part of life in general is learning how to deal with the disappointments that come your way. learning to feel anger and sorrow and learning to forgive are all part of being a good person.

by shielding him for any perceived anger/disappointment etc. you could be causing more harm than good. he might even harbor anger towards you for not being honest.

I would tell him like others suggested that dad cheated and that your doing your best not to be resentful and bitter about it and moving on with your life also.

he can then process it and decide how to act towards dad and his new girl friend. and he can also decide to forgive him when hes ready.


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## zillard (Nov 13, 2012)

I had a discussion about this with a child psychologist - how to honestly answer questions about why divorce happened. Keep in mind this was for a child under 10.

The suggested ideal response was, "When we got married we made promises to each other. Those promises were broken."

Psych said due to the fact that I certainly didn't keep all mine either (love, cherish, respect, etc), that it was an honest answer while still age appropriate. Also acknowledges my side of it, so isn't bashing her mother. 

Now for a teenager, they'd likely have more questions, "what promises". And at that age they know what cheating is, have been exposed to that in the world already. So then it is age appropriate, without nitty gritty details. And there I would lead with those that I broke, and then those that she broke. 

That delivery (and delivery is KEY) is good, helpful, honest, open, and much different than just calling your ex a lying cheater.


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## lifeistooshort (Mar 17, 2013)

I think you need to be very careful in what you tell your kids. I feel like many look at this from the perspective of the betrayed but through a narrow lens. I know in my parents marriage my dad had several affairs that I know of, though I don't think that's ultimately why they split up. I think my mom would've been fine with him pursuing others as long as he paid bills. It was actually my father who didn't want to live like that. He did make some poor choices but we're not going to go there because he's no longer with us and he and my mom made peace.


My dad's affairs, while wrong, need to be in the context of the entire dynamic of the marriage. I understood this context as I got older and could see both of their contributions. My ex is convinced I was cheating, which I wasn't, but let's assume for arguments sake I was. One could argue our kids deserve honesty but if we're going to go there i could tell them there dad is an abusive pos who thinks women are beneath him and didn't give a rat's behind for anyone but himself. 

But that would benefit them how? They have a good relationship with him but they're already starting to figure out who he is, and they're 12 and 14. You have to be careful when you open the "honesty" can because other things you don't like could come out.

Sometimes it's blatantly black and white though so everyone must use their own judgement.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

lifeistooshort said:


> My dad's affairs, while wrong, need to be in the context of the entire dynamic of the marriage. I understood this context as I got older and could see both of their contributions. My ex is convinced I was cheating, which I wasn't, but let's assume for arguments sake I was. * One could argue our kids deserve honesty but if we're going to go there i could tell them there dad is an abusive pos who thinks women are beneath him and didn't give a rat's behind for anyone but himself. *
> 
> But that would benefit them how? They have a good relationship with him but they're already starting to figure out who he is, and they're 12 and 14. You have to be careful when you open the "honesty" can because other things you don't like could come out.
> 
> ...


*This* is the kind of approach you should NOT take if this is to be discussed. You can give them the honest facts without blasting the other parent (as much as you may WANT to!) and projecting your own feelings about it into the discussion. 

In TooNice's case, she could approach it in this way with her son:
So has your dad told you much about his GF? .. or... Has you dad explained to you how he and GF met? 

And take it from there, depending on his response, to explain that the two of them had started "dating" (gag) while she was still married to his dad. Calm, matter of fact, and answer any questions. He is 18 so its hard to guess his response, but in the long run, him hearing the truth from one of his parents is the best thing. I am afraid he will feel betrayed if it comes out any other way. I know with my daughter, I would have hell to pay! :surprise: She is very passionate about truth!


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## TooNice (Nov 26, 2013)

Thank you - all of you - for your input on this. It's a sensitive topic that carries passionate opinions, obviously. 

I am not sorry for the way I have handled things so far. I am seeing the merits of both positions, however. I have protected my ex in order to protect our children. As we move through the process, I am seeing that my ex is not only NOT the man I thought I married, but I don't think he ever was. He has done things the past few weeks to make me see that we are not co-parents. He is in life for himself. 

I have lost my SD in the divorce. My son is all I have left of what our family once was. I will fiercely fight to maintain honesty and open communication with him. But I will not sit him down and tell him the truth out of spite. 

I found out that he first met OW several weeks ago when he was first home from college. It was at what he perceived to be an odd place for her to be, and wasn't sure who she was or why she was there. Then she spent the entire weekend with my ex, my SD, her BF, and my son. Still no real explanation. When I told my son that I knew she was there, he said, "Who IS she?" I was too bewildered by the fact the my ex would not discuss something so huge with our son, that I did not take advantage of the opportunity to talk. But I will next time. 

We had some really great conversations today. About my SD, about me dating, as well as some other things. I am confident that he knows he can talk to me about anything, and I will work to be more honest in the future - without being bitter or mean. I don't have that in me.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

"Protect your children" WTF....were where *we* when they were getting **** on at the play ground, phucked with in the cafeiteria, the high school parking lot, and now at their 1st job.

How in the hell do *we* think we are protecting our kids when they have all been through so much crap.....

Sure it sucks that the parents are going through some shyt, but at the end of the day we all go through a lot of crap....you can't protect them but you can prepare them by talking about the hard shyt life has to offer and the healthy way in dealing with it and the unhealthy way to deal with it..


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## TooNice (Nov 26, 2013)

Part of "protecting" everyone has also included maintaining a civil relationship with my ex. As long as he thinks I'm keeping his little secret safe, he thinks I am playing nicely and we can all get along. I do not know who this man is or how he will react if he finds out that I was honest with our son and blew his cover. 

Just another piece of the complicated puzzle that no one has covered. I just don't feel this is a black and white issue.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Infidelity is never a black and white issue...thats why this forum is great...take what you will in what fits your sitch.

Hell dealing with my 26D was alot different then dealing with my 21S.....my old dest ...well her mom made her bed!

My youngest is very sensitive ...wanted to make sure his mom was OK.

I wasn't very civil when my old lady cheated....phuck that... I got betrayed!

I know my kids clearly under stand consequences when a bad choice is made...it to bad they had to be witness to their own mom getting hurt for her unhealthy choices.

But at the end of the day bad choices have consequences.....


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

You guys know how phucked up my case was... my oldest said" dad there are to many OM's...it's not them it's mom"


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

TooNice, you sound almost afraid of your ex, are you? What exactly do you think he's going to do if your son learned his secret? Are there other, younger children involved or is it just you and your DS?

Your ex will treat you the way you allow him to treat you. I guess I'm not seeing your need to maintain the appearance of civility with a man who does not behave civilly. You should also know that infidelity should never, ever be disclosed to children out of spite. And I don't think that's what anyone here is advocating. Your DS has been placed in a situation, by your ex, that is causing stress and confusion. You have the ability to provide him with information to make this make more sense.

But you're going to do what you're going to do. Good luck.

Edit: Too Nice, I just noticed that you are also the Banishment thread, my bad. So no younger children, narcissistic ex, no immediate family. I understand your feeling of abandonment. But right now, you need to find ways to detach from this man. You do not owe him the loyalty of secret keeper. He ruined that with his infidelity and emotional abuse. You will get stronger the more separated you can become. Sending hugs. The more you separate your life from his, the more you will see this-at least I hope so. He does not have the power you give him.


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## TooNice (Nov 26, 2013)

I'm not afraid of him, I just have no idea who he is now. The past few weeks have shown a side of him that I once would have said could never exist. Please understand that I am not spiteful. If I were, this is a conversation I would not be having. I would have told his family the truth when they asked me. 

My son and I have had some great talks the past few days. Now that he's home for the summer, we are settling into our routine. I had already talked to him about the fact that I am dating, so we covered that again. He's comfortable with me being up front with him when I go out, so that's nice for me to know. We also talked about his sister's treatment of me. He hadn't realized how bad it was until this past Christmas, and has noticed a lot more now. He said he doesn't get it, but I know how close he is to her. I told him I will be okay, and he should continue with their relationship as they have. But I think it's also fair to say out loud that it does make it harder for me. It was during that talk that I realized that it really is me and him now. He is my family. And I think he gets that, too. 

I reiterated again that I will be ok. I deserve to be treated well, and I think he knows that I wasn't. So whatever happens with his dad, his sister, his dad's gf, I hope knowing that I will be ok will make it easier for him to talk to me. And I will be appropriately honest going forward. Frankly, I will not be surprised if there is a wedding that is announced or even takes place in three more months. Given my ex's recent behavior, my son will not be prepared for that. That will open up opportunities to talk.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

i am curious @TooNice, why are you prioritizing civility with your ex? You don't have minor children together, your son is 18. There is little co-parenting possible. You say you lost your SD. So why are appearances so important? Is there any interaction you two have on a regular basis?


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## TooNice (Nov 26, 2013)

No, I don't have regular interaction outside of our son's life and school stuff. However, I was intertwined with his family for more than 20 years. We do still have two children together, even if they are grown and I need to pull away from one of them. There are holidays to come, celebrations, and mournings where I will still need to see him. And most of all, he is my son's father. My son can make whatever decisions he needs to as time progresses, but right now, that's still his dad. And I am simply not an uncivil person (hence the username!). I dislike negative feelings and energy, even when it may be justified. 

We have always treated family in a broader view; even celebrating Christmas with my SD's mom. I realize it may be difficult for some to understand, but I do still hope for a more positive vibe in all of this one day. Maybe that won't happen, and maybe as time goes on, I will just drift further away and not have a relationship with his family. But I hope that's not the case. 

I don't know if that answers your question, but hopefully it offers some insight.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

I appreciate that you do not consider yourself an uncivil person. Please don't value your civility over your need for separation from your ex. I ended a 28 year marriage so I do understand the inter-twining of families. In my case, his family has chosen not to have much contact with me and my children, not because of any lack of civility on my part, but rather their loyalty goes with their family. I guess they don't see us as family anymore. It happens. Cutting ties with my ex was the healthiest move I could make, emotionally. I don't speak ill of him, but I quit being his social secretary, debriefing him on school, or making excuses for him. Those were roles I would happily play during our marriage, but not now. He continues to have the freedom to be whatever kind of parent he chooses.

Good luck.


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