# We have a budget, he breaks it



## ToastisBread (May 13, 2014)

My fiancee and I have been living together for 3 years. We only started budgeting last year after around 6m-1y of him saying that he would track our spending (we both agreed that it made sense for him to track the spending because he had moved from his moms to living with me after university and never had to learn to budget on his own. It was also fairly obvious that his personal spending was more than it probably should be) When I happened to tally up his credit card bill that month last year and he had spent more than he makes in a month on hobby purchases for himself, two months in a row, I was very frustrated. I had been living on a very modest budget since he made considerably less than I did at the time and I readjusted my spending according to our joint income. Needless to say I stopped waiting for him to take charge, I made a budget, tracked our expenses and we had a pretty lengthy conversation about money on the spot. 

_*My problem now is that he continues to break our budget, by thousands of dollars. This is a budget BTW that we have both agree to and have looked into what is a good ratio of spending saving etc... since we have very different habits.*_

When this happened at the end of the last year we discussed ways hopefully get some savings back. He always buys things that have value and he said he would sell some things. This just hasn't been happening. Right now it's around $4000 that he's trying to make off of selling things.

We've talked about how if we were to "borrow" from the future that we would discuss it with one another. Aside from that we have free reign (which is the whole point of budgeted spending money). Now, I came home to yet another purchase of around $2500 along with typical month to month purchases and I just don't know what to do. 

His solution sell more stuff, since he's slowly been accumulating more "debt" in this manner and hasn't actually sold anything for a full year I have little faith this will happen. 

Any ideas?

Heres what we have tried and could work again...

Short weekly 'meetings' (we discuss everything not just money, I personally like these and will probably continue these as a family) These fell apart as soon as our son arrived 4 months ago. Maybe this would help again.


_*I also have some issues with his mother helping us out (we bought a new car, she helped us with a downpayment which she said was with money she owed him (some she did, I doubt all of it) and most recently he needed to pay off a bond with his work and she helped front the money (which wasn't necessary) and basically topped it up by $1000 and although we are paying it back that $1000 isn't expected to come back. I would love to be completely financially independent from both of our parents and also feel like her help is enabling his poor habits. 

I am tempted to talk to her about this but I have always lived by the mantra that "our issues stay between us"._


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

My advice. Get into financial counseling ASAP. Or take over all the finances, and give him access to exactly one account that he gets an allowance deposited every 2 weeks. Unless you get this under control and get him to buy into it, you'll be living paycheck to paycheck for the rest of your life. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Agreed with PBear

I would probably just say "finances are within my control only until he shows/proves more trust".

These HAS to be consequence to his actions.....of some kind.


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## Happyfamily (Apr 15, 2014)

ToastisBread said:


> Heres what we have tried and could work again...
> 
> Short weekly 'meetings' (we discuss everything not just money, I personally like these and will probably continue these as a family) These fell apart as soon as our son arrived 4 months ago. Maybe this would help again.
> 
> [/I]


That's good. We do it about once a month. But you have a problem child. And I mean child.


Financial infidelity is just as bad or even worse than sexual infidelity. If I had to choose between retiring rich with a husband who tapped a few strippers and retiring in poverty with a faithful husband - that's a no brainer to me.


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## papa5280 (Oct 12, 2011)

It sounds like he has never really bought-into the budgeting process, or agreed, in his mind, to abide by it.

Just a hunch, but when you say you've had meetings, are you doing most of the talking? Have you asked (not told) him how he would like to attack the problem? If so, how has he responded? 

Also, have you discussed the possibility of trading-in his credit card for a debit card? That way, he can't spend money he doesn't already have.


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## ToastisBread (May 13, 2014)

papa5280 said:


> It sounds like he has never really bought-into the budgeting process, or agreed, in his mind, to abide by it.
> 
> Just a hunch, but when you say you've had meetings, are you doing most of the talking? Have you asked (not told) him how he would like to attack the problem? If so, how has he responded?
> 
> Also, have you discussed the possibility of trading-in his credit card for a debit card? That way, he can't spend money he doesn't already have.


I wished that were the case, it would make dealing with things a lot easier. I really dislike being put 'in charge' all the time and actively try to get him to step up.

When we budgeted I originally insisted that we both come up with one and then we merged them (his left out several important things and had roughly what we have agreed upon as our spending money, mine would have been lower).

Yes, I find that I have to take charge at first with our meetings but then we started switching off. They're isn't as much involved in his but they're supposed to be short and to the point.

Overall he doesn't engage in the topic. I have asked what he thinks we should do about it and he normally just goes quiet. Looking back his pattern is to try to avoid talking about it... his point of selling things recently was at least something I suppose.

_*I think the money issue is more indicative of a spending addiction than simply not being considerate or being selfish. It's tied in with some anxiety and some other things. Talking through this stuff was part of our reason for having meetings._


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## ToastisBread (May 13, 2014)

PBear said:


> My advice. Get into financial counseling ASAP. Or take over all the finances, and give him access to exactly one account that he gets an allowance deposited every 2 weeks. Unless you get this under control and get him to buy into it, you'll be living paycheck to paycheck for the rest of your life.
> 
> C
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Financial councelling is an option. 

I really dont want to be incomplete control of our finances and would really like to avoid this if at all possible.....


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## ToastisBread (May 13, 2014)

Happyfamily said:


> That's good. We do it about once a month. But you have a problem child. And I mean child.
> 
> 
> Financial infidelity is just as bad or even worse than sexual infidelity. If I had to choose between retiring rich with a husband who tapped a few strippers and retiring in poverty with a faithful husband - that's a no brainer to me.


I should maybe point out that although his income has been modest the growth for his salary is quite large. I am concerned about retirement etc... but its doubtful that we would ever be in poverty.

Even now... he wont go into debt but when we have money in our account its spent.


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## SpinDaddy (Nov 12, 2012)

It’s like an agreement that nobody abides by huh? So no you don’t actually have a budget. Sorry. 

Depending on your income, it sounds like I’d suggest you find a fee based financial planner and get something working now rather than later. If that’s out of your range find some consumer credit counseling.

Despite all the TAM threads about penis size, oral sex, infidelity, lack of sex, too much sex, kinky sex and yadda-yadda the number one killer of marriage is . . . . poor financial management.

Get yourselves in line now – you’ll be glad you did.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

What about 3 bank accounts? His, yours, and joint. Nobody takes money out if the joint account, but paychecks go into it. Monthly allowances go into the his and her's accounts. If he can't control credit card spending, give him one that's only tied to his account. You could do the same, and keep a real one in the freezer. 

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

A successful marraige is more about the person you chose than about some feelings you get when you are young.

The solution to this is to financally decouple and stop living together. Don't marry him until he demonstrates that he is a man, as opposed to a boy.


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)

ToastisBread said:


> ...he would track our spending (we both agreed that it made sense for him to track the spending because he had moved from his moms to living with me after university and never had to learn to budget on his own.)


Ummm... this makes no sense at all! Why would you give complete budget control to someone who has only lived with his mom and had NO EXPERIENCE budgeting? Talk about sink or swim...

Well, he has sunk you. It is time for you to take control of ALL the money since he obviously isn't capable. You pay the bills, you both agree on an amount for spending money, and he gets an allowance. When it's gone, it's gone until next month.

Personally, I would think twice about marrying someone who has demonstrated that he is so irresponsible with money (more importantly, he is disregarding an issue that is very important to you.) Financial strain is one of the biggest reasons for divorce.


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## Toshiba2020 (Mar 1, 2012)

What is he buying that he spends all of his income? If its family and household spending, such as tools to work on the house, lawn care equipment thats one thing but if hes gambling, drinking, buying electronics/video games, etc... thats a more serious problem as those things have no value return and are more about his personal desires.

I know you said you have talked with him about a budget before but did he really understand or just say something like "yeah sure were on a budget"? Probably a good idea to take his cred/debit cards away from him for awhile and just give him cash. Every week give him what you both decide on is a fair amount of "fun money" and if he spends it all by the end of the day on monday thats just too darn bad, slowly he will learn to cut back on unnecessary expenses and not just swipe anytime he wants something.

In regards to your MIL, if she has the money and is willing to give the money as a "gift" then let her, i would never take a loan from a family member as this creates tension and creates a sense of control over you and that you are constantly in debt to them but if its a gift take it say thank you and do what you want with it. But at the same time he shouldnt be using his mom as a ATM every time he wants to buy something, he does need to learn to save and handle big expenses on his own as someday mommy wont be there for him, or even worse some day she will be elderly and need to be put in a retirement home but wont have enough money to do so because she gave it all away to cover her sons spending habits over the years.

EDIT: Just realized you said fiance and not husband, now would be a good time to go to marriage counseling, look for one that specializes in financial counseling as well.

Also, if he cant handle simple finances be sure to watch out for any financial skeletons, my wife surprised me with $30k worth of student loan debt even though she said "oh i think its around $10k"


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## CJ61 (Feb 24, 2014)

ToastisBread said:


> _*My problem now is that he continues to break our budget, by thousands of dollars. This is a budget BTW that we have both agree to and have looked into what is a good ratio of spending saving etc... since we have very different habits.*_


Your husband might have a compulsion and it plays out in his spending.
That he continually breaks both the agreement and the spending is of serious concern.

His idea of selling off the items is akin to the reverse rationalization process used by compulsive people to justify their wrong actions.

He should be in personal counselling to deal with that compulsion that's driving him to spend money which he can't afford on things he doesn't really need.

If that compulsion isn't dealt with professionally it could threaten your future financial stability.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You don't have a budget. You have a dream of one. Just face the fact that you will forever be the one who controls the money. And never ever give him access to more than $500 at a time again.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

What are the consequences of his actions? So far I see none. Not like he's been evicted for not making the mortgage payment or had a car repossessed or something. If he's spending that much above your income, how are you paying the bills?


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## TiredFamilyGuy (Jan 18, 2014)

OP - do not sign or take out any credit or guarantee with this man, such as for the dual rental. You'd have to be crazy to do that - or incapable of learning.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## FormerSelf (Apr 21, 2013)

It doesn't matter if you find the reason for his behavior..what is more important is that his behavior ought to change. You may feel like the forum folks are overreacting, but really, many of us have been on the financial downside of someone with an addictive personality...and have DEEPLY SUFFERED because the behavior wasn't confronted.

The fact that you are having conversations and he is still coming home with $2500 in purchases show that he doesn't get it or doesn't want to get it. This is a huge warning sign...as this will greatly affect your quality of living. And you shouldn't care about earning potential...because an impulsive spender will ramp up the spending right along with those raises. 

Right now, you guys are floating...but there will be no traction unless every single penny has been budgeted. All it takes is something to go wrong and your're sunk. Read My Total Money Makeover. It's very simple and ordered to help you know what you need to have financial security.


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## TikiKeen (Oct 14, 2013)

He needs IC to address his compulsive spending and the shame which is likely driving it.

And do not marry him until he has shown he can exercise faithfulness to you via money-handling for at least a year. No "joint" anything with him. No borrowing, cash-only for him, no access to anything in your name, no more credit (and get rid of as much via paying off as you all can now, evenly---not *you* paying it off.

Do not do for him what he can do for himself. I learned that the hard way: my kid's illness prevents me from stereotypical FT work, and that changed at 2 years into the relationship. My H spends horribly and we've had to backtrack to square one to re-teach proper budgeting. Spending is his addiction; he can control his circumstances in that moment, and in that moment, he's spending to feel better.

We're just now to the point, four years in, of having a prudent emergency reserve.

Just because you all have more money _now_ does not mean that he won't spend his way into bankrupting the marriage eventually. Again, as long as he's thinking addictively, he will act like an addict.


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## whatslovegottodowithit? (Jan 6, 2013)

Premarital counseling for sure for you guys. I heard the other day "When someone shows you who they are, believe them!" You are seeing what married life will be like. There are no vows and he is behaving as such. Don't make the mistake some do by believing that marriage will change a behavior...the warning signs are already there. It appears he is showing you he doesn't care what you say.

Have you tried a wants vs. needs approach (re: spending) together with him?

If it is a compulsivity issue, he needs to know it's unacceptable by actions not words. It usually takes a fall to rock-bottom before these personality types make a change, and sadly, relapses can and do occur!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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