# Confused and torn



## Dude1 (May 19, 2013)

Please be gentle with me, I am new here.

Sorry this is so long.

I hate to admit it, but I really don't see any reason to stay with my wife. I love her, but we just don't seem to be in love anymore.

There is no one else. I am not ready to run to another woman. I have been completely faithful for my entire marriage.

We have been together for twenty years and it has been up and down, like most relationships. 

She was recently divorced and we just dove in. We were head over heels. We lived together early on. Everything was great until she got tired of me not making much money and being thrifty. We began fighting a lot and she eventually kicked me out for being tight with money. I learned and grew up and won her back. 

We married and had a couple kids. We went through the normal challenges of marriage: financial difficulties, losing family members, losing jobs, etc.

She is very vocal and I am pretty subdued. We went to MC several times due to fighting. I tried to become better by reading Marriage books and trying to focus more on her needs. I just don't feel that she gives anything back. She always wants me to change and I really try. She just doesn't seem to want to try to work on what I need from her.

I have always been a physical person. I need physical closeness and passion in my relationship. When we have fought about sex in the past, she makes me feel like a perv for wanting to be sexual with her and try new things. She told me I should have married a prostitute. I got tired of being shot down and made to feel dirty and unwanted and I made a huge mistake by turning to porn.

She was fine with it at first, it was kind of a relief for her to not have to bother with me. But there was still the feeling that I was dirty and our relationship got worse. She felt intimidated by the 'perfect' models I was lusting over. I felt bad that I was married and had to turn to porn because my beautiful wife didn't want me. I resented her more and more.

One day, it all blew up and she kicked me out. She felt like I was cheating on her. I never cheated, she just felt cheated on by the porn. 

I fought for my family. I gave up porn completely and went to counseling and a support group. I begged her to take me back and tried everything to save our marriage.

She finally took me back and we started over. We bought a new house and I got her a new wedding ring and band. She said the ring was nice, but didn't gush over it.

The sex was good when we first got back together, but it soon went back to every now and then. I gained some weight and felt horrible. Job changes happened and I was laid off for a few months.

So, here we are a few years later. I got on a health kick and lost some weight and am feeling great. I got a job with a great company and our kids are now teenagers. We do things as a family, but we spend hardly any time alone romantically.

Maybe twice a month, we'll have a quickie in the shower. She doesn't want any foreplay or kissing; just get in, get off and get on with the day. We rarely have sex in bed. She says she doesn't like the odor after sex without showering afterward. I have offered to wear a condom or pull out, but she declines.
Early on in our relationship, she said that's how sex had progressed with her ex-husband, whom she loathed.

She acts like I am lucky to get what I get. She has mentioned several times over the years that she feels like all I want her for is sex. That is not true, I have always loved her deeply and enjoyed just being together. Sue me if I want to be intimate with the woman I love. I have worked on my approach and have been to counseling with her and alone to more than five different professionals.

So, here I am now: older and tired and beat down and wondering if I should just move on. We have a lot of debt and would have to split it up. She makes very good money and would be fine financially. I could probably scrape by in a small apartment.

I know there are two sides to every story and I am not at all perfect. But I have really tried to make this marriage work. She just does not seem to want to change anything. I feel like just a paycheck and a listener when she needs to vent.

BTW - We are both in our mid forties and in great health.

I hate to leave my kids, but they see that I am unhappy.
I will always spend time with them.
They will always have a home with me, if they choose.

Do I sound like a bad person for wanting to leave?
Am I wrong?

I would appreciate any advice.


----------



## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

Dude,

Sorry you are here, but I think you will be glad you found this place. Your relationship with your wife sounds like it has been filled with drama. That can take a toll on your soul, no doubt.

I only have a brief moment to type here, but I'm sure more veterans will be along soon.

Quick question: Do you know why her first marriage failed?

Also, here is a link to an article you might relate to:

Abused Men: How Covert Abuse Begins, Part One | Shrink4Men

And no, you are not a bad person for wanting to leave a bad relationship. Especially when you've put effort in to changing yourself, to no avail.


----------



## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

I agree with you.

I don't see any reason to stay either.

Sorry.


----------



## Conrad (Aug 6, 2010)

ThreeStrikes said:


> Dude,
> 
> Sorry you are here, but I think you will be glad you found this place. Your relationship with your wife sounds like it has been filled with drama. That can take a toll on your soul, no doubt.
> 
> ...


Nothing covert about it.


----------



## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

Conrad said:


> Nothing covert about it.


LOL. I would agree... now.

But knuckleheads like myself, and likely many other guys, had no idea there were creatures masquerading as women out there like this.

But yes, once you've been through it, you realize how crazy you were to tolerate this type of relationship.


----------



## Dude1 (May 19, 2013)

Thanks for the info guys. Great article too.
Any advice on how to prepare for the storms coming?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Rottdad42 (Nov 26, 2012)

It sounds like you have attempted to do everything to woo your wife with zero results. By your words you have taken quite an emotional/physical beating. How much more are you supposed to endure. Something must change. IMHO, two people in that age should be having sex at least once a week. Give or take. I know the "just get it over with" routine all too well. It just plain sucks! Good question from ThreeStrikes, why did her first marriage fail? This might give you some insight. Good Luck.


----------



## Rottdad42 (Nov 26, 2012)

My bad, I didn't respond to your other question. If divorce is your path that you are taking there are a few things to start on. Separate your finances, get your own bank account, change beneficiaries on insurance policies. If you have a 401k, say goodbye to half. Pension as well. Start saving as much as you can, for a new place to live if need be. There is a lot more and the vets here will chime in and give good information. FWIW, I am also from a 20 year marriage, it won't be easy but you will live, I promise. Good luck.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Dude1 said:


> Thanks for the info guys. Great article too.
> Any advice on how to prepare for the storms coming?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Yeah. Start going to therapy every week and learn to like yourself more and stop being a Nice Guy so you can stand up to her.


----------



## Dude1 (May 19, 2013)

Her first marriage was kind of a rebound relationship. She married young. She never really gave a good answer about it, just everything he did wrong. 

I just hate this for my kids. But is it worse for them to see me so miserable or us apart?


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

What they need is to see their dad learn to stand up for himself - alone OR together. They will grow up to be clones of one of you; make sure it's a good example.


----------



## Dude1 (May 19, 2013)

turnera said:


> What they need is to see their dad learn to stand up for himself - alone OR together. They will grow up to be clones of one of you; make sure it's a good example.


You're right on target! Wish I had understood this before now.

She will not ever change on her own, so I will have to be able to give an ultimatum.

I think I will try to get some therapy to grow my cojones back and see where that takes me.

Thanks for all the advice.


----------



## forgiven (Jun 29, 2013)

Hey man, how well did you get to really know her before marrying her? What is her past like, sounds like she is very insecure and just putting up a tough front to protect herself. Was she abused as a kid? What was her father like? You could be her savior if you had the guts to stand up and fight for a real relationship where both of you win and are loved and respected and understood.
The reason I suspect abuse at an early age is the whole sex thing. She needs more security from you than a physical relationship, but you seem stuck on your sexual wants and how to satisfy them. That is NOT unconditional, committed love, that my friend is just lust and selfishness.

You sound like you love your kids, so set a real example for them by being a real man and make real committments, by doing porn you have already had multiple affairs and cheated on her and set anexample for the kids of how to handle a problem.


----------



## Dude1 (May 19, 2013)

forgiven said:


> Hey man, how well did you get to really know her before marrying her? What is her past like, sounds like she is very insecure and just putting up a tough front to protect herself. Was she abused as a kid? What was her father like? You could be her savior if you had the guts to stand up and fight for a real relationship where both of you win and are loved and respected and understood.
> The reason I suspect abuse at an early age is the whole sex thing. She needs more security from you than a physical relationship, but you seem stuck on your sexual wants and how to satisfy them. That is NOT unconditional, committed love, that my friend is just lust and selfishness.
> 
> You sound like you love your kids, so set a real example for them by being a real man and make real committments, by doing porn you have already had multiple affairs and cheated on her and set anexample for the kids of how to handle a problem.


We knew each other for over a year before marriage. With a breakup in between.

No abuse. She had a fine home life. Her Dad is a great guy, but the whole family is extremely selfish and all about themselves.

It isn't just about sex for me. It is the whole intimacy thing. Like I said, my Love Language is Physical Touch.

My kids were not aware of the porn issue.

I want to be happy. 
For me, if someone is not trying to make me happy in relationship, then they are too involved in their own happiness to care. It should be a two way street.

I have tried to make her happy over the last twenty years.
It is just very difficult always giving and never receiving. 

I don't want her for just sex. My God, if that were the case, I would have left years ago and become a male ****.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Have you read No More Mr Nice Guy yet?


----------



## MSC71 (Aug 1, 2012)

I hate to read when people tell others to leave their marriage. Maybe that is what you wanted to hear to ease any guilt. Make your marriage what you want it to be. So many people leave because they are unhappy. That comes from within. If you are unhappy look at yourself and not your spouse.


----------



## Michelleinmichigan (Jun 26, 2013)

Sorry friend, but she didn't like the porn and you did it anyway until things blew up. I wish men realized that for normal women (who aren't faking it for money), having sex with avid porn viewers feels like an assault. It feels gross. Men who watch porn objectify women, and they think they are being loving, they're not.

The terms "I need to grow a pair" or "need some cojones back" are terms I have heard from porn addicts that are actually doing the abusing with gas lighting to hide their habit and passive aggressive behaviors. Sooner or later they were found to be living double lives. Most partners had no idea of the extent porn usage despite living with the person for years. The fact that you say you have been faithful is really good, but they said the same thing until they were caught.

A healthy man's life doesn't revolve around sex. Sex ddicts can come across as the nicest guys, even victims, but they are actually Jeckyl and Hyde personalities. ex. Ted Bundy was a porn junkie.

There are simply hyper sexual men, who are able to convince their wives to share in their appetites and after wonder how they lost them to another man.

Your wife is probably the only thing keeping you stable and functional. I would bet that the moment you move out, you will be on a downward spiral into this addiction. It is progressive and very hard to stop. 

I bet your wife is a saint, and she even gives you pity ...., despite the fact that it makes her feel dirty, something like a mixture of being raped and her body being used for you to self medicate.

This story is likely not even the tip of the iceberg. I hope I'm wrong, if not, then I hope you can overcome this.


----------



## MSC71 (Aug 1, 2012)

Most women are not okay with their spouse looking at porn. It really does effect their self esteem. Makes them feel like they are not good enough. And I'm sure the lack of sex may of been why you watch it. And that is a normal reaction o think. But in the end, it's taking you even further away from what you really want and need. So try to look at porn as something coming between you and your wife.


----------



## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

Michelleinmichigan said:


> Sorry friend, but she didn't like the porn and you did it anyway until things blew up. I wish men realized that for normal women (who aren't faking it for money), having sex with avid porn viewers feels like an assault. It feels gross. Men who watch porn objectify women, and they think they are being loving, they're not.
> 
> The terms "I need to grow a pair" or "need some cojones back" are terms I have heard from porn addicts that are actually doing the abusing with gas lighting to hide their habit and passive aggressive behaviors. Sooner or later they were found to be living double lives. Most partners had no idea of the extent porn usage despite living with the person for years. The fact that you say you have been faithful is really good, but they said the same thing until they were caught.
> 
> ...


Um...WHAT? :scratchhead: He stopped the porn, they started over, and she went right back to how she was. She does not want to have sex with him, did you miss all this?? You must have dealt with porn addiction with someone before, you are projecting A LOT of bitterness here toward the OP. 

Dude1, you are not bad for wanting to end this. It sounds like you both made a good effort to try and make this work. Its understandable that you want to find some happiness.


----------



## Michelleinmichigan (Jun 26, 2013)

3Xnocharm said:


> Um...WHAT? :scratchhead: He stopped the porn, they started over, and she went right back to how she was. She does not want to have sex with him, did you miss all this?? You must have dealt with porn addiction with someone before, you are projecting A LOT of bitterness here toward the OP.
> 
> Dude1, you are not bad for wanting to end this. It sounds like you both made a good effort to try and make this work. Its understandable that you want to find some happiness.


Why did it end up with her kicking him out before he stopped? I have absolutely dealt with porn addiction, and thank God it wasn't personal. Porn addicts, ADDICTS in general lie, and are extremely manipulative, they lie to themselves, they live fantasies, have double lives, and almost always come across as Mr.Wimpy NiceGuy.

You have one side of the story. That side of the story smells like a sex addict to me, and I called him out on it. I could be wrong. But, you certainly don't know. There are always 2 sides to every story.


----------



## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

Michelleinmichigan said:


> Why did it end up with her kicking him out before he stopped? I have absolutely dealt with porn addiction, and thank God it wasn't personal. Porn addicts, ADDICTS in general lie, and are extremely manipulative, they lie to themselves, they live fantasies, have double lives, and almost always come across as Mr.Wimpy NiceGuy.
> 
> You have one side of the story. That side of the story smells like a sex addict to me, and I called him out on it. I could be wrong. But, you certainly don't know. There are always 2 sides to every story.


If the woman is so unhappy after finding the porn and she is creeped out by it and doesn't want to have sex with their husband shouldn't she leave? Instead stay and make his and her life a living hell? The OP said he corrected his mistake. He shouldn't have to pay for it forever. Nothing the OP wrote suggested he was a porn addict. 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Michelleinmichigan (Jun 26, 2013)

richie33 said:


> If the woman is so unhappy after finding the porn and she is creeped out by it and doesn't want to have sex with their husband shouldn't she leave? Instead stay and make his and her life a living hell? The OP said he corrected his mistake. He shouldn't have to pay for it forever. Nothing the OP wrote suggested he was a porn addict.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


What I have seen is that the woman has NO IDEA why she feels the way she does. She thinks she is simply not sexual. They think they aren't sexual despite having healthy sex lives in the past.

Addicts are manipulative, but sex addicts are master manipulators. One woman I know who dealt with this was a tv persona. She had children with this sex addict and basically blamed herself for 10 years for having an unhappy marriage. She hated the porn, he went underground. Everyone told her porn was normal. H was passive aggressive, and in order to cover up, engaged in gas lighting.

She was a smart lady, but didn't understand what was happening. She would, however blow up at the abuse. Her husband was NEVER satisfied sexually or otherwise, she felt like she made him miserable, he walked around miserable. After their initial marriage spats, and she was willing to work things out, he had a quota of how many times they HAD to have sex, she tried to oblige despite the fact that his touch made her cringe. He was present in body but not in mind. He did nothing he said he would, and if she confronted him on anything, H would act perplexed, a deer in the headlights, he cried and said he was sorry, and would do anything. It was the usual pattern. He NEVER did anything he said he would.

She found hundreds of text messages with a lady, while she, a beautiful lady, was pregnant. H claimed it was a friend. She caught him in endless lies. She told him to leave, and he desperately called all her friends literally crying saying there was a misunderstanding and he desperately loved his family, please help. Everybody chimed in and tried to make her give him a second chance. They advised him to be the man she thought she married. Etc. He did none of that.

He didn't say bad words, or even drink in public. He didn't have friends, and seemed completely dedicated to his family.

He would slip away at night, saying his shoulder hurt etc. That was the only sign of porn addiction that presented itself. Still she had NO IDEA why she felt so miserable, alone, and depressed. It took a neighbor to tell her who her husband was, which everyone had a hard time believing. Wife knew she was telling the truth and H finally admitted his problem when there was no way to pretend otherwise.

Addict has 2 different personas: doting husband and sex fiend. He is a handsome attractive man from a seemingly good family. Pornography was the reason he lost his 1st marriage. Ironically his first wife was in the same profession as the 2nd, and never said a word to anyone either.

Sex addiction is so sneaky, it isn't officially on the the books as a disorder, even though most specialists know that this is an epidemic problem


----------



## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

For the one example you gave their are a dozen or more woman who are LD and make every excuse in the book not to have sex with their husbands. These same wife will then discover porn on their husbands phone or computer and then label him a porn addict. Its ridiculous.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## mineforever (Jan 31, 2013)

Dude1.... I somehow don't think the porn is the issue really. I think it is a symptom of a dysfunctional relationship....as is her multiple excuses and rejection of you sexually. You both have to want to fix this relationship...one of you can't fix it alone abd I get the feeling that is what your doing. Your meeting her emotional (intamacy) needs with communication and spending time together but she is not meeting yours....that won't work. As long as you meet hers what is her insentive to meet yours? Sad to say but for some selfish people that is how they work. Your going to have to jolt her out of her comfort zone....rock her boat a little. You are going to have to also stop letting her stone wall you with past transgressions (old porn usage). Set down your expectations... tell her "we're going to counseling /sex therapist or we go to a divorse attorney", tell her she can make the decision who to call. Good luck....you can do it!
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## forgiven (Jun 29, 2013)

If you or your spouse has been married before, then it is very hard to see the current marriage as secure and safe from the same end. You both need to be open and honest about your goals and fears and you both need to think WE can and get rid of I want or the ME ME attitude.

You need to decide that you are in it for "better or worse" I do believe that is one part of the vows you took when you got married. Then stand firm on that committment. any talk about divorce just creates a grand canyon between the two of you.


----------



## Dude1 (May 19, 2013)

The porn is not even an argument anymore. It's in the past. We moved on.
I was just giving some honest background on the relationship problems in the past.
Thanks to all those who are giving great advice on what to do.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Michelleinmichigan (Jun 26, 2013)

richie33 said:


> For the one example you gave their are a dozen or more woman who are LD and make every excuse in the book not to have sex with their husbands. These same wife will then discover porn on their husbands phone or computer and then label him a porn addict. Its ridiculous.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The fact that the wife either feels like a prostitute with her husband and/or thinks her husband needs a prostitute, the fact that she can only have sex in the shower, and the fact that he's annoyed because she makes HIM feel like a perv", she makes him "feel dirty" implies serious disfunction somewhere. 

Because of his wife he made the mistake of turning porn? really? The fact that he doesn't take accountability for his decisions, and sugar coats them, makes me question other things. wife was just mad because she felt he was being unfaithful? (Complete disconnect with wife's feelings)

Maybe he isn't the problem, but the fact that his entire reasoning for wanting to leave basically revolves around sex being 2x a month isn't right. The fact that it is a constant problem in their marriage says something.

He doesn't just want more sex, he wants "passion", and to "try new things", pretty sure most adult men understand the basics of seduction, and would know that a woman that feels that way about him, isn't capable of going there. Only porn stars can act like that. 

Wife seems to have always been the primary breadwinner, but he insinuates he does everything, and says "she doesn't give anything back." What does that mean?

The fact that they have been through 5 different marriage counselors over the years, and just a couple of years ago he fought so "desperately" for his marriage, and now just a couple years later he's only getting it 2x a month, and now he is not in love? Something is wrong, and I think Dude is simply reaching out.

If Dude wants his wife to be a porn star every night, that's definitly not going to happen. She really seems to have been traumatized at some point in time, and that doesn't turn on and off like a button. So if "separating unless she meets my needs" is really the question, I guess the answer would be, YES.

I've just seen too many men and women hurt because of porn. I feel for the wife too.

"Pornography can reach out and snatch a kid out of any house today, it snatched me out of my home 20, 30 years ago. And as diligent as my parents were, and they were diligent in protecting their children, there is no protection against the kinds of influences that are loose in a society that tolerates this.” ~Ted Bundy

Parents please make sure your kids ever see that crap.


----------



## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

I get it. Your anti porn. It wouldn't matter if the OP wrote his wife beat this man wife a golf club every other day, tortured him emotionally and physicially for 20 years, refused to sleep with him for whatever reason. You hear the word porn and you label him a porn addict and the wife is justified in her abuse. Quit your ranting and spreading your agenda and read the OP words.


----------



## Michelleinmichigan (Jun 26, 2013)

richie33 said:


> I get it. Your anti porn. It wouldn't matter if the OP wrote his wife beat this man wife a golf club every other day, tortured him emotionally and physicially for 20 years, refused to sleep with him for whatever reason. You hear the word porn and you label him a porn addict and the wife is justified in her abuse. Quit your ranting and spreading your agenda and read the OP words.


Nope, Dude said sex is down to 2x a month, and he needs, he needs, he needs.

My intention was not to label him a sex addict. My point is that rampant porn usage kills it for a man's "game" 95% of the time. Few are good lovers, because they are just getting their fix, and women eventually feel used so sex becomes repugnant. 

Even when they are good lovers, they lose notion of what real love and intimacy is, and their spouses are depressed and lonely. Those are rarely faithful. 

Dude is looking to justify himself. Women do the same thing. ANY woman could make a case for her husband being abusive if she wanted to, it helps with the guilt. I am equally fair when women do this, even though everyone else automatically sides with whoever gave them the story first.

There are two sides to every story, just remember that.


----------



## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

Which he has address already, he stated he is done with porn but you keep throwing it in as the only problem. 
Its his thread, so obviously he is stating his needs. How many men have you been with that you can throw numbers like 95% of the time?
You judged this poster as soon as he mentioned porn.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Michelleinmichigan (Jun 26, 2013)

richie33 said:


> Which he has address already, he stated he is done with porn but you keep throwing it in as the only problem.
> Its his thread, so obviously he is stating his needs. How many men have you been with that you can throw numbers like 95% of the time?
> You judged this poster as soon as he mentioned porn.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I'm not judging him for mentioning porn. I think that his poor wife has a problem if she can only have sex in the shower. 

Everything else he complains about are signs that she has a problem. I'm saying that their sexual relationship can be affected by porn, and result in what he is dealing with.

95% isn't my personal score with men. This is an epidemic, that also effects women, the problems are documented. 

The Sex Addiction Epidemic - Newsweek and The Daily Beast

There are numerous studies on the effects of pornography, and they range from no good to scary. 

http://www.oprah.com/relationships/The-Negative-Effects-of-Porn


----------



## richie33 (Jul 20, 2012)

And there is plenty of studies that state the opposite. The OP thread suggests nothing of addiction. You want to keep throwing something out there that is not. You suggest every male who has looked at porn is potential Ted Bundy tells me what you think if this subject. Good luck Dude. Keeping doing the best you can for your marriage. If your wife wants to join you in making thing better that's great...if not...life is too short to be unhappy.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## Dude1 (May 19, 2013)

Thanks Michelle, for completely taking this thread to some kind of oprah show or Lifetime movie about the evils of men and their nasty testosterone and sex addictions.

There are plenty of normal women out there who enjoy sex. Plenty of women who love the differences in men & women. What is wrong with wanting to be happy with someone? A relationship should be give and take. That's all I'm saying.

I have a lot to give as a partner. But I expect to feel loved and desired. If that is wrong, then sue me. Just move on if you aren't going to give me any advice I can use.

I have said before, I have made many mistakes in the past and I will continue to make mistakes. The difference is I am trying to be better. I just want a relationship with one woman that is give AND take.

I like helping around the house and taking her out to dinner and buying flowers and doing things that are not in my nature because it makes HER happy. If I wanted sex all the time, I would have stayed single and played the field or paid for hookers.

There is a difference between sex and making love. The latter is a lot more satisfying.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Dude, have you read His Needs Her Needs?


----------



## Michelleinmichigan (Jun 26, 2013)

Sorry Dude1, men are great, never said otherwise. never said anything about the evils of testosterone. I said porn can cause men to suck in bed, and causes symptoms like the ones your wife has.

There are plenty of women who enjoy making love. There are plenty of seductive men, who women want to throw their panties off for too, and those are men who understand women, get in their heads, and make them feel good.

You say the porn is gone, but her symptoms are still there. Maybe your not the one that caused this problem, or maybe you have a passionate relationship with Hand, and all the visual images that you can bring up at any time, every night: which can amount to the same thing. Who knows? People can also lie to themselves and they are their own worst enemies.

Nobody here can tell you what the right thing to do is. Nobody here can help you feel justified in the long run, or help numb your conscience that perhaps is telling something is wrong. Nobody here is judging you personally, you are anonymous.

You just need to be honest with yourself, and if you do simply have an insatiable desire for sex (making love), a void that you can't seem to fill, deal with it now before it causes you a of problems. See an IC and be perfectly honest. 

For future reference with other women, needy men are not attractive. 

For some strange reason I have no doubt of what the problem is, and I know you are suffering, and have suffered a lot because of it. I'm sorry for that. Hope everything gets better.


----------



## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

Michelleinmichigan said:


> There are plenty of women who enjoy making love.


And Dude needs to find one.

I think we've beaten this horse enough. It's probably time to help Dude with a viable exit plan, if leaving is what he wants to do.

Do you have a plan at this point, OP?


----------



## Dude1 (May 19, 2013)

turnera said:


> Dude, have you read His Needs Her Needs?


No, I'll have to check it out.


----------



## Dude1 (May 19, 2013)

GTdad said:


> And Dude needs to find one.
> 
> I think we've beaten this horse enough. It's probably time to help Dude with a viable exit plan, if leaving is what he wants to do.
> 
> Do you have a plan at this point, OP?


I do not have a plan yet. It will be a huge step.

Any pointers?


----------



## mineforever (Jan 31, 2013)

mineforever said:


> Dude1.... I somehow don't think the porn is the issue really. I think it is a symptom of a dysfunctional relationship....as is her multiple excuses and rejection of you sexually. You both have to want to fix this relationship...one of you can't fix it alone abd I get the feeling that is what your doing. Your meeting her emotional (intamacy) needs with communication and spending time together but she is not meeting yours....that won't work. As long as you meet hers what is her insentive to meet yours? Sad to say but for some selfish people that is how they work. Your going to have to jolt her out of her comfort zone....rock her boat a little. You are going to have to also stop letting her stone wall you with past transgressions (old porn usage). Set down your expectations... tell her "we're going to counseling /sex therapist or we go to a divorse attorney", tell her she can make the decision who to call. Good luck....you can do it!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Dude1...I really think you need to step back and see if you are the only one trying to fix this relationship and if you are maybe its time to move on.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Dude1 said:


> No, I'll have to check it out.


 Even if this marriage doesn't work out, to me, it is the bible of relationships. Everyone should read it - everyone. Because it's basic psychology, and we can't escape psychology.


----------



## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Any pointers? 

We have to know what you want, first.


----------



## MSC71 (Aug 1, 2012)

Tell her what you are thinking. If she refuses to go to counseling or do anything to make things better then you have your answer. But talk to her like a human. Dont get mad. Don't criticize or point fingers. Let her know you are unhappy. And you want things to be different. And your willing to meet her half way with any solution.


----------



## Dude1 (May 19, 2013)

I have IC set up for next week. We'll see how that goes.


----------

