# Men, is this suspicious behavior?



## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

I had this on another thread, but I figured it would be more productive to start a new thread about this since it's a different issue. 

Something that H did really concerned me yesterday. There's this girl who he's been friends with a long time, and she told him one day that he loved him deeply (claimed it was as a friend) so I asked him to stop talking to her and he agreed. The other day I saw that she had wrote on his FB wall and shared an inside joke of theirs and he literally commented back "Hahhahahhahahahahahahahahaha lmbo lollolololoolololol". I asked him, "So you're best friends with her now?" He said "no" and got REALLY REALLY SUPER upset and put his earphones in to ignore me despite me still talking. Didn't even say he didn't want to talk about it, just put in his headphones to ignore me. It REALLY hurt me. He knows how much him ignoring me hurts. Anyway, when I asked him to talk to me again, explaining why I didn't want him talking to her, he said "See? This is why I don't like you to see stuff like that. You overreact." I responded, "You hide things from me?" He was like "no..." and I showed a lot of suspicion, and he changed his act VERY quickly. Went and did a huge pile of dirty dishes when he has not done ONE dish since we got married, since he claims it's my job. Then tried to start a water fight with me & was acting very sweet.

His behavior is making me suspicious. It's my birthday, he knows it, did not say anything about it when he left for work, will not text me back or answer my calls. I really feel like he's hiding something from me.

Am I just being paranoid?


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Opposite sex friend is NEVER a good thing....

It's disrespectful and inappropriate for someone that's in a marriage.

How would your husband feel if you were hanging out/had male friends?

YEAH

As for rest of the crap, I suggest you start accepting the person in front of you for who they are TODAY. Your husband doesn't seam to really care about you based on his actions/behavior.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

ariel_angel77 said:


> It's my birthday



Happy Birthday!!!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

He told you that he would have no contact with her. You have every reason to be upset at him. He needs to un-friend her and block any communication from her. 

By her telling him that she loves him, she has put him (and you) on notice that she would like to break up your marriage. She is not a friend of your marriage.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

I really considered throwing his things out on the lawn today (since it's my apartment). Especially after he was non-responsive this morning, my BIRTHDAY morning. I just really feel like he's showing that he doesn't care about me today. And I really have a feeling like there's something going on. 

If anybody needs background information where I discuss his former emotional abuse in detail see my other thread but basically: yelling, ignoring, belittling, putting me down, insulting me, compulsive lying, and other things. MC made things better but he has made a come back.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

So by your religious standards, the only standards that matter here...what constitutes infidelity? Is an EA enough of a loop hole for you to justify divorcing him? A blowjob? Him fingering and going down on another woman? Do those count? Or is the only thing him sticking his penis in another woman?


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> He told you that he would have no contact with her. You have every reason to be upset at him. He needs to un-friend her and block any communication from her.
> 
> *By her telling him that she loves him, she has put him (and you) on notice that she would like to break up your marriage. She is not a friend of your marriage*.


Given her whole story...this may not be a bad thing at all...


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## GTdad (Aug 15, 2011)

ariel_angel77 said:


> I really considered throwing his things out on the lawn today (since it's my apartment). Especially after he was non-responsive this morning, my BIRTHDAY morning. I just really feel like he's showing that he doesn't care about me today. And I really have a feeling like there's something going on.
> 
> If anybody needs background information where I discuss his former emotional abuse in detail see my other thread but basically: yelling, ignoring, belittling, putting me down, insulting me, compulsive lying, and other things. MC made things better but he has made a come back.


You've convinced me. Now all you have to do is convince yourself.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

ariel_angel77 said:


> I really considered throwing his things out on the lawn today (since it's my apartment). Especially after he was non-responsive this morning, my BIRTHDAY morning. I just really feel like he's showing that he doesn't care about me today. And I really have a feeling like there's something going on.
> 
> If anybody needs background information where I discuss his former emotional abuse in detail see my other thread but basically: yelling, ignoring, belittling, putting me down, insulting me, compulsive lying, and other things. MC made things better but he has made a come back.


You see, this is where you are making a HUGE mistake.

Forget about your birthday, a good man will treat you well and "like your birthday" each and every day.

That's what I hate about birthdays, special treatment.....I would like to be treated special each and every day (to an extent of course).

Take a CLOSE look at his actions past year and let THAT define what kind of a man he is and how caring he is.....how much he loves you etc.

NOT just for today "because it's your birthday".

IDENTIFY, RECOGNIZE and ACCEPT the person in front of you!


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

samyeagar said:


> Given her whole story...this may not be a bad thing at all...


At this point, she might want to encourage it. I'm serious. Let the home wrecking 'good friend' have him. It would be a just reward at that.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

So what are you going to do, Ariel? This post in addition to the other ones you have about how much he sucks--yet it seems the status quo remains.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

DoF said:


> You see, this is where you are making a HUGE mistake.
> 
> Forget about your birthday, a good man will treat you well and "like your birthday" each and every day.
> 
> ...


None of this matters DoF. The only thing that matters, the only way she can change her dynamic is to find out he is cheating on her...she has gotten desperate enough that the witch hunt has begun and she is latching onto anything she can find to fulfill that one single out she has left herself. For her own sanity and sake, I hope she finds it, real or constructed in her own mind.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

EleGirl said:


> Happy Birthday!!!


Thank you, EleGirl. That's really nice of you.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

If one spouse is doing something that they feel should be hidden from the other then there is an issue. What they are doing is wrong. What your H is doing is wrong. 

I would say an EA affair is in the works. She has stated her love for him. He is playing the EA game now. Contact needs to stop. Close the FB account.

And HAPPY BIRTHDAY!


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

Jellybeans said:


> So what are you going to do, Ariel? This post in addition to the other ones you have about how much he sucks--yet it seems the status quo remains.


I'm sorry, Jellybeans. I don't mean to make you guys feel like I'm not taking your advice. I really am. I am considering everyone's advice. Hence me considering throwing his things out. I've never had that thought/consideration before. I just want to hear all angles from the people here.

I want to make sure I do what Dr. Phil says. To make sure you can tell your kids you tried EVERYTHING you could to save the marriage.


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## COguy (Dec 1, 2011)

ariel_angel77 said:


> I'm sorry, Jellybeans. I don't mean to make you guys feel like I'm not taking your advice. I really am. I am considering everyone's advice. Hence me considering throwing his things out. I've never had that thought/consideration before. I just want to hear all angles from the people here.
> 
> I want to make sure I do what Dr. Phil says. To make sure you can tell your kids you tried EVERYTHING you could to save the marriage.


I don't know about the other posts but this one sounds awfully suspicious. Guarantee he's got stuff to hide. Sounds like your transparency is bad or you could have checked for yourself. Do you have his passwords/email?


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

COguy said:


> I don't know about the other posts but this one sounds awfully suspicious. Guarantee he's got stuff to hide. Sounds like your transparency is bad or you could have checked for yourself. Do you have his passwords/email?


Yes, I never find anything. I never have his phone though. He takes it to work all day and goes to sleep with it. Last night I was charging it on my computer (we lost the wall charger) and he told me he was going to bed and taking his phone. I told him I would just bring it to him when I came to bed, but he INSISTED on taking it up with him because "he doesn't trust me to remember to bring it up".


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

ariel_angel77 said:


> Yes, I never find anything. I never have his phone though. He takes it to work all day and goes to sleep with it. Last night I was charging it on my computer (we lost the wall charger) and he told me he was going to bed and taking his phone. I told him I would just bring it to him when I came to bed, but he INSISTED on taking it up with him because "he doesn't trust me to remember to bring it up".


That is very weird, suspicious behavior. 

You can log in online to check phone records on a cell phone, so long as you have the account info. I would do that today if I were you. 

On another note, Happy birthday!


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## Jetranger (May 31, 2013)

DoF said:


> Opposite sex friend is NEVER a good thing....
> 
> It's disrespectful and inappropriate for someone that's in a marriage.
> 
> ...


You don't know that would be his reaction. He might not be so insecure as to see everyone of the opposite sex as some kind of threat, or lack trust for his wife.

I mostly have female friends. If my SO told me to stop being friends with them, I'd show her the door and make sure I closed and locked it behind her. 

In the OP's case, I think the female friend acted a bit inappropriately and should have been told as much, but saying he wasn't allowed to talk to her any more? I don't think he meant it when he 'agreed'. That doesn't mean he's up to no good!


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Jetranger said:


> You don't know that would be his reaction. He might not be so insecure as to see everyone of the opposite sex as some kind of threat, or lack trust for his wife.
> 
> I mostly have female friends. If my SO told me to stop being friends with them, I'd show her the door and make sure I closed and locked it behind her.


Out of 100 people, you would probably the only one that would apply above.

It has nothing to do with insecurity, it has everything to do with dynamic of male/female in nature.

Chances are high most people won't even consider dating you if you have "plenty of female friends".

I also have a feeling that you use the term "friends" loosely. How often do you hang out with these friends and also are you physically attracted to any of them?


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

Jetranger said:


> You don't know that would be his reaction. He might not be so insecure as to see everyone of the opposite sex as some kind of threat, or lack trust for his wife.
> 
> I mostly have female friends. If my SO told me to stop being friends with them, I'd show her the door and make sure I closed and locked it behind her.
> 
> In the OP's case, I think the female friend acted a bit inappropriately and should have been told as much, but saying he wasn't allowed to talk to her any more? I don't think he meant it when he 'agreed'. That doesn't mean he's up to no good!


I disagree. 

Most affairs start off as "just friends". I've seen it happen all the time and it is the reason my husband and I agreed to not spend any one-on-one alone time with someone of the opposite sex. He doesn't need to be chit chatting with another woman. If he feels he can't show her or tell her everything that went on, then something is wrong. He should have nothing to hide, if it is truly innocent.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

Jetranger said:


> You don't know that would be his reaction. He might not be so insecure as to see everyone of the opposite sex as some kind of threat, or lack trust for his wife.
> 
> I mostly have female friends. If my SO told me to stop being friends with them, I'd show her the door and make sure I closed and locked it behind her.
> 
> In the OP's case, I think the female friend acted a bit inappropriately and should have been told as much, but saying he wasn't allowed to talk to her any more? I don't think he meant it when he 'agreed'. That doesn't mean he's up to no good!


If you would choose female friends over your W, then you have bigger problems...js :/


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## richardsharpe (Jul 8, 2014)

Good evening Ariel_angel77
Many will disagree with me, but I would never try to break up a friendship with either gender. If there is nothing going on, it will only cause hostility. If there is something going on, they will just find other ways to communicate.

My wife is in contact with many male friends. I'm in contact with many female friends. Trust - its a good thing.


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## lookinforhelpandhope (Apr 10, 2013)

I think this really depends on the person.

Yes, often affairs stem from friendship but that doesn't apply to everyone and honestly, it's more of a reflection of the inadequecies in your relationship than anything else, IMO.

I'm female and have quite a few male friends. Some of them I don't see all that often, some are single, some married/attached then there are a few who I've spent a lot of time with including weekend trips.

I can honestly say I have never thought of any of these guys as anything other then a friend and nothing intimate has ever happened with any of them, nor will it ever happen.

To put another perspective on this, one of my closer male friends separated from his SO for a few months. During that time he was kinda down and a little lonely so we used to quite a lot together, to cheer him up. I found out later (after he reconcilled with his SO) that she was really pleased he'd been spending time around me while they were separate because she was comfortable nothing would happen and actually felt assured that I'd encourage him to stay away from other women while they tried to fix their problems.

Anyway, to the OP, the part about your situation that would concern me is that your husband appears to be covering something up. Even if he isn't having a relationship with this other woman he's ignoring your concerns and lying about his contact with her. Further investigation required, IMO!


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## waylan (Apr 23, 2014)

I don't have a problem with friends of the opposite sex - especially long standing friendships. My problem is that this women told your husband that she is in love with him. That's like a declaration of war against you! A good husband would see the danger and remove it.


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## maverick23 (May 2, 2014)

He is giving you reason to be mistrusting, though based on your Dr Phil standard, breaching his trust would be taking the low road. Your other threads notwithstanding, it sounds like he simply has an easier time communicating with this other person which would be an EA. If he's doing that, it could be a matter of him having an easier time talking to this friend about random subjects than you do. Do you share many common interests? sports? traveling? outdoors? What I am getting at is, how conversational is your marriage? Are you genuinely interested in what happens in your spouse's days?

The highest of high roads in this situation is for you, whether he deserves it or not, to recognize that he isn't getting what he needs from you so he is getting it from someone else. Though it has a moderate chance of growing to a true affair, it could be something simple as talking about work or venting about marriage. Tell him that you recognize this and try to have an open dialogue with him.

If you treat his mistrust with more mistrust, probably not going to end well. Just sayin.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

richardsharpe said:


> Good evening Ariel_angel77
> Many will disagree with me, but I would never try to break up a friendship with either gender. If there is nothing going on, it will only cause hostility. If there is something going on, they will just find other ways to communicate.
> 
> My wife is in contact with many male friends. I'm in contact with many female friends. Trust - its a good thing.


If your spouse has clearly demonstrated boundries then perhaps. However, there is no guarantee of anything is there? 

Richard...the OW professed here LOVE for Ariel77 husband. The H is hiding this. Do you think this is a healthy friendship? :scratchhead:


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

ariel_angel77 said:


> I want to make sure I do what Dr. Phil says. To make sure you can tell your kids you tried EVERYTHING you could to save the marriage.


This may come as a surprise to Dr. Phil and you, but honestly ... your kids aren't going to care if you tried everything. They have no concept of what the actual dynamic is between the two of you that makes remaining together impossible in the first place. 

Children are extraordinarily resilient. Divorce is not good. But it is seldom, if ever, the end of the world scenario that people imagine it will be ... unless you have a spouse with a personality disorder that will continue to fan the flames of the children's pain for no other reason than ... to hurt you.

And lets face it, that isn't someone you should stay married to either.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

ariel_angel77 said:


> he INSISTED on taking it up with him because "he doesn't trust me to remember to bring it up".


Unless your H is a brain surgeon always on call I do not see a need for a cellphone to be in the bedroom at night. If he does not let you see, use or inspect his cell then there is something hiding on it. Marriage is being transparent with everything.


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## COguy (Dec 1, 2011)

ariel_angel77 said:


> Yes, I never find anything. I never have his phone though. He takes it to work all day and goes to sleep with it. Last night I was charging it on my computer (we lost the wall charger) and he told me he was going to bed and taking his phone. I told him I would just bring it to him when I came to bed, but he INSISTED on taking it up with him because "he doesn't trust me to remember to bring it up".


You're going to have to take it, maybe when he's sleeping?

Honestly though, this is why I think it's important to have these conversations well before this. You've got to establish the protocol well in advance so that it's not a big deal to say, "I want to check your phone." But understand that even with that there's always a way to cheat (you can get a burner phone or deleting app or find a million other ways to chat that could never be traced).

I think what you'll be looking for is not a message, but the absence of one. They've clearly been talking, not seeing anything on his phone is a dead giveaway that he's deleting conversations. And being protective of a phone is THE number one red flag of cheating, along with "I love you but I'm not IN love with you."


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

Ariel_angel...does any of this really matter? The whole emotional part of it? Just what would constitute a severe enough infidelity for you to feel you have grounds for divorce? What evidence exactly are you hoping to find to justify what you want to do? What most everyone here feels you SHOULD do, and supports you doing?


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## Nigel Pinchley (Jul 29, 2014)

The argument of opposite sex friends aside (that argument comes up again and again here and never, ever goes anywhere), your H's behavior definitely seems suspicious. When people get grabby with their cellphones, that's usually a sign that there's something on it they don't want you to see.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

So suppose you got his phone...then what? Would you need photographic evidence of him banging this other chick for it to allow you to leave? Suppose you find texts that they have back and forth professing their love for each other, but him saying they can't have sex, even though he really wants to because he doesn't want to allow you to leave? That they can do everything but, and by the way, that hand job she gave him at the office was stellar...


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

waylan said:


> I don't have a problem with friends of the opposite sex - especially long standing friendships. My problem is that this women told your husband that she is in love with him. That's like a declaration of war against you! A good husband would see the danger and remove it.


Well, it has to work both ways. He'd also have to devalue the marriage, loose boundaries, go back on his promises and vows and any number of things just to have an affair. Not all friendships devolve into romances... actually, very few do. Add to it that she declared her love long ago and he didn't act on it. Why would that change?

And hiding... I get that. If my life was regulated to 'throw your stuff on the lawn' for a "lol" response (and my life is actually regulated to that dysfunction), I'd tend to hide it too. The only reason I let my wife see this is to judge her reaction to see if she can deal with me actually knowing and interacting like a normal human with the opposite gender... and she can't. Think it's fun getting accused of cheating year after year after year? 

Still though, I have hope and still show/tell her thinking maybe one day she'll get it through her head that I meant my vows... So I don't hide much and settle into 'fight mood' that looks remarkably similar to her husband's reaction. It becomes ingrained; Contact is made, dread sets in knowing my wife will discover at some point and engage, my mood switches to 'emotionally distant', and I'm ambushed... She also likes special days so she can blame me for 'ruining her day'. What fun to mark most holiday's! And it too sets me off, particularly her bday & mothers day since it hasn't gone battle free in decades....

And just so you know, the thought does start entering your head after multiple confrontations like that: If I'm going to be punished for the crime, might as well earn it. It's just a slow poison...

So, you are young. You need to stop that mental escalation in your head now before the poison spreads. My marriage didn't... dysfunctional as hell. It's simple: Do you think he would cheat? If so, why? And start dealing with that and talking about that until you feel secure. Girls will talk to him; you can't stop that or force him into some tower wearing a chastity belt...


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Racer said:


> Girls will talk to him; you can't stop that or force him into some tower wearing a chastity belt...



Girls talk to me as well. None profess their undying love for me(as in this case). If they did the "friendship" would need to wither on the vine. It would have to as my wife would not approve of the "kibble" being fed to my ego from a "girl friend". At this point, we are just not friends any longer. It has moved on to a beginning of an EA. I can assure you her H loves the ego stroke.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

Thank you guys for the help. I took a suggestion and checked the cell phone bill (which he doesn't know I can do). Nobody except me, his mom, brother, and sister. So I think that's a really good sign.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

samyeagar said:


> So suppose you got his phone...then what? Would you need photographic evidence of him banging this other chick for it to allow you to leave? Suppose you find texts that they have back and forth professing their love for each other, but him saying they can't have sex, even though he really wants to because he doesn't want to allow you to leave? That they can do everything but, and by the way, that hand job she gave him at the office was stellar...


Trust me, I wouldn't put up with anything like this.


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## Nigel Pinchley (Jul 29, 2014)

I don't mean to cause any further stress in your situation, Ariel_Angel, but do keep in mind that there are a lot of forms of communication on cell phones that don't register on your bill as a phone number (ie, chatting/photo apps that use your data plan, not your text messaging system)
for example:

- kik
- snapchat
- FB messenger

Even things like twitter, instagram and reddit can be used for stuff like that, and they'd never appear as specific phone numbers on your bill.

To make things worse, newer versions of the phone operating systems (iOS, Android, Amazon Fire OS, etc) are in many cases sending what you think are text messages as chat messages over the data wire. For new versions of Android, the text app uses Google Hangouts, which is actually a chat app and NOT text messages (though this feature can be turned off).

Unfortunately, with these kinds of apps becoming ever more popular, the cell phone bill isn't as reliable as it once was. You can check the data usage of the phone line in question, but afaik you can't get an itemized breakdown of the websites and services he's using.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

Nigel Pinchley said:


> I don't mean to cause any further stress in your situation, Ariel_Angel, but do keep in mind that there are a lot of forms of communication on cell phones that don't register on your bill as a phone number (ie, chatting/photo apps that use your data plan, not your text messaging system)
> for example:
> 
> - kik
> ...


No, I appreciate you trying to make sure my eyes are open. He had one of those old flip phones where you cant even really get on the internet for $20 (we are a low income family). But I won't cross off the possibility that there's a burner phone or something else.

There's a reason he acted like that after I found that FB wall post. Aside from whether a married man should have female friends, aside from everything. It was his reaction.


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## Jetranger (May 31, 2013)

Anonymous07 said:


> Most affairs start off as "just friends". I've seen it happen all the time and it is the reason my husband and I agreed to not spend any one-on-one alone time with someone of the opposite sex. He doesn't need to be chit chatting with another woman. If he feels he can't show her or tell her everything that went on, then something is wrong. He should have nothing to hide, if it is truly innocent.


So he can't have any sense of privacy, especially here when he's guilty until proven innocent? 

It doesn't seem like much of a life where you have to tell someone you can't be their friend (or even talk to them) because your spouse won't let you?



richardsharpe said:


> Many will disagree with me, but I would never try to break up a friendship with either gender. If there is nothing going on, it will only cause hostility. If there is something going on, they will just find other ways to communicate.
> 
> My wife is in contact with many male friends. I'm in contact with many female friends. Trust - its a good thing.


If a guy wants to cheat, he'll just find another woman - one you don't know about, and he'll find a way to do it, too. 



DoF said:


> Out of 100 people, you would probably the only one that would apply above.
> 
> It has nothing to do with insecurity, it has everything to do with dynamic of male/female in nature.
> 
> ...


You know fourth fifths of **** all about me and my personal life, and are telling that my friends aren't the most important thing to me after I said I'd dump someone who told me to end friendships? Good grief. 

If someone doesn't want to date me because of my friends then fine, I don't want to know them anyway. I'm not going to throw away my personal life because of an insecure woman who could then turn around and dump me moments later. It does involve insecurity if you see every other woman as a threat. Yes, males and females are designed by nature to want to spread their genetic material far and wide, but that doesn't mean we are uncontrollable. Just because the opportunity presents itself doesn't force you to take it!


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

Jetranger said:


> So he can't have any sense of privacy, especially here when he's guilty until proven innocent?
> 
> It doesn't seem like much of a life where you have to tell someone you can't be their friend (or even talk to them) because your spouse won't let you?


In a marriage, there should be complete openness/transparency. My husband has all of my passwords and accounts, as I have nothing to hide. If he wants to use my cell phone, I'd hand it right over. If he logged into my facebook, it wouldn't be a big deal. I have the same for my husband and have the ability to look up anything/use anything of his. Do I feel the need to? No, but my husband isn't acting weird. If he acted suspicious, then I would question him about it and check up on him. He is not "guilty until proven innocent", he is acting guilty, so it's on him. 

If someone professed their love to my husband, they definitely would not be friends. It's completely inappropriate. I would hope that my husband would have enough respect for me to call off that friendship, just as it is the right thing to do.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

Yeswecan said:


> Girls talk to me as well. None profess their undying love for me(as in this case). If they did the "friendship" would need to wither on the vine. It would have to as my wife would not approve of the "kibble" being fed to my ego from a "girl friend". At this point, we are just not friends any longer. It has moved on to a beginning of an EA. I can assure you her H loves the ego stroke.


My understanding that happened before Ariel... And you distance because it can get weird; Which he did for Ariel. 

If I remember right, Ariel is college aged, so I'm guessing that was an old one-way HS crush. So I'm picturing a teenaged girl telling a boy she's in love with him and getting rejected.... Not a "experienced" 30 something adult saying those words to a married person where it's probably a deeper consideration. Hell, my teenage daughter is in "love" with someone else every other week. (Scares the hell out of me too)


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

Ariel, how old is your husband?


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## Jetranger (May 31, 2013)

Anonymous07 said:


> If he acted suspicious, then I would question him about it and check up on him. He is not "guilty until proven innocent", he is acting guilty, so it's on him.
> 
> If someone professed their love to my husband, they definitely would not be friends. It's completely inappropriate. I would hope that my husband would have enough respect for me to call off that friendship, just as it is the right thing to do.


It's your perception of 'guilty', though - if you kept asking to go through his stuff all the time, that's another thing. It does raise a question of whether you trust him when he says nothing is going on, he has to provide evidence (or access to it). It just feels like self-incrimination to me.

As for Ariel... maybe it was deep platonic love? I know they say people have to find something desirable about the other person to want to be friends with them, and if they've been friends for some time then maybe there is a deep connection and mutual fondness. Ariel didn't like this (has this girl been friends with her H for longer than Ariel?) and demands he cut contact.

This is her overreacting. Not taking his or her (probably his) word for it that it was friendly only, not saying 'please tell her not to say stuff like that, it makes me uncomfortable', but outright STOP TALKING TO HER. H sees he can't reason with this so 'agrees'. Then the inside joke is posted, he responds, and she comes over with a deliberately antagonistic comment. Not this **** again thinks H, putting on his headphones rather than respond in kind and have an argument. 

She's pushed his buttons, he pushes hers back and then explains why he's doing it. He doesn't think it's fair having to give up his friend. She doesn't believe him.

His actions then are, I agree, a bit strange. He might be running around like crazy out of guilt because he's up to no good. OR he might be running around like crazy trying to show Ariel "look, I'm with you, not her, I'll do some things for you in a half-assed but well-intentioned way to prove it so we can just resolve this and move on with our lives".

I'd love to hear his point of view on this (as would we all) but I don't think it's all one-sided, and I hope it's genuinely no cause for concern.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

Racer said:


> My understanding that happened before Ariel...


No, she said this to him while we were married with a child.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

Anonymous07 said:


> Ariel, how old is your husband?


He is 21 also.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

This is great, you guys. It is 8PM and he's still not home or answering his phone. What a wonderful way to spend my birthday, at home waiting around for him.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

I'm sorry to hear that.
He must have a screw loose.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Take yourself out if you can.


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## 6301 (May 11, 2013)

ariel_angel77 said:


> If anybody needs background information where I discuss his former emotional abuse in detail see my other thread but basically: yelling, ignoring, belittling, putting me down, insulting me, compulsive lying, and other things. MC made things better but he has made a come back.


 All these things are uncalled for and me thinks that if you continue to let him walk all over you like he's been doing then his vice has now turned into a habit and habits are hard to break.

Time for you my friend to give him a serious dose of reality and let him know in no uncertain terms that he either gets a attitude check or he might find himself homeless.

Let him know that when he comes home, that he checks his ignorance at the door because it's no longer welcome in the home, and stop putting up with it. 

I would also let him know that he has a choice. Either cool it with the female friend or go live with her but he can't have both.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

ariel_angel77 said:


> He said "no" and got REALLY REALLY SUPER upset and put his earphones in to ignore me despite me still talking. Didn't even say he didn't want to talk about it, just put in his headphones to ignore me.


You should have ripped the earphones out of his ears and destroyed them right there and then.


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## tennisstar (Dec 19, 2011)

Why would you put up with this? I was in relationships like this, and finally, I realized those men didn't care for me. Even had a child with one...didnt make him treat me better.

Guess what, my child turned out fine. Yours will too. But why teach your children that it is ok to disrespect and treat mom bad.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

Racer said:


> My understanding that happened before Ariel... And you distance because it can get weird; Which he did for Ariel.
> 
> If I remember right, Ariel is college aged, so I'm guessing that was an old one-way HS crush. So I'm picturing a teenaged girl telling a boy she's in love with him and getting rejected.... Not a "experienced" 30 something adult saying those words to a married person where it's probably a deeper consideration. Hell, my teenage daughter is in "love" with someone else every other week. (Scares the hell out of me too)


Even if this did occur before Ariel it remains that this "girl friend" is still in contact and curious. You know, what "could" have been type curious(IMO). My wife would not put up with it. Would not entertain me talking to a friend that professed love to me no matter what time in my life. For me, life for me started anew when I said "I do". Old flames or would be flames are long forgotten and to not reappear again in my life. If they do via FB or chance meet it is a simply "hey" and I move on. I have had a chance meeting once with my cheating fiance of old. She looked at me like a deer in the headlights. I looked right through her and kept on going about my business. That relationship is long dead and buried. This is just the way I handle my marriage. Total respect for my significant other. Perhaps this is part of the recipe that has helped get us to 20 years married.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

ariel_angel77 said:


> This is great, you guys. It is 8PM and he's still not home or answering his phone. What a wonderful way to spend my birthday, at home waiting around for him.


Insensitive comes to mind.


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## Philat (Sep 12, 2013)

ariel_angel77 said:


> He is 21 also.


He's 21, going on 12.

His behavior should make you suspicious--suspicious that your H is a self-centered juvenile twit. "I love you deeply as a friend" is just BS. As is turning it back on you by accusing you of overreacting (this is what they all do when they get caught with their hands in the cookie jar).

He has some maturing to do.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

Is your husband aware that the ONLY way you will be able to leave him is if he has sex with another woman?


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

ariel_angel77 said:


> This is great, you guys. It is 8PM and he's still not home or answering his phone. What a wonderful way to spend my birthday, at home waiting around for him.


You guys have kids?

When he comes home, tell him you are going out > go enjoy yourself.

Don't do anything wrong though (cheat) but go have fun, you deserve it.

I would also say to give him a fair warning and tell him if it doesn't change you are going to end the marriage. He deserves that IMO.

Sometimes as men (in your case, boys) need that reminder/reality check. Especially at that age, we are WAY too selfish, ignorant, careless and stupid to think clearly.



And if he doesn't change, well, you lost NOTHING. And remember, you will find a great man if you take your time and be smart. In the end, you will be 20x better off and some.

And also, think of all this as a present to yourself. Getting out of a ****ty relationship and looking forward to bright future!!!

Good luck


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

DoF said:


> You guys have kids?
> 
> When he comes home, tell him you are going out > go enjoy yourself.
> 
> ...


She already made it clear in her other thread that is no longer there that the ONLY grounds for divorce per her religious beliefs is physical infidelity, so unless she catches him inside another woman, this isn't going to happen...unless she gets so fed up with, and worn down by the poor treatment, that she has an epiphany...


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

Sleeping with the phone.

Here comes the train...


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

Thank you for the advice, you guys. I've been doing a lot of thinking.

I don't think he really cares about me. He made up a complete lie of himself when we were dating (very devout Christian, same morals, etc.) so that I would be with him. Complete 180 after we moved in together. He has never confessed a lie unless I found out, and there have been a lot.

I've also thought about how I really feel for him. I don't think I really LOVE him like I'm supposed to. I think I feel really trapped. I think that's why I've felt so depressed this year, because I just don't want to be with him. I mean, I spend most of my time wishing I could go back in time and NOT have married him. I thought I was marrying someone completely different than I actually was. He took away my first marriage from me, the ability to marry the person I truly love.

I just keep thinking that if I ended things now, I would have time. Time to actually marry the person I'm in love with. The person who actually loves me back (knowing what love is). I mean, I see all these people who divorce after 20 or 30 years when they find out their husband is cheating and wonder if they wish they would have done it sooner when they knew they shouldn't have married that person. Part of me says I would be committing this big sin and I shouldn't get divorced, but the other part of me says I will just be held back in every way if I stay married to this person.

Just rambling some thoughts, I guess. Anyway, he was really nice to me today. I was looking over her post on his wall and his comment back got re-upset about it, asked him to remove her as a friend. He said no because he doesn't want to be mean to anyone and he doesn't like deleting any friends. I gave up on it and sat down elsewhere. He did it and was upset about it until I let him add her back, then he was happy again.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

I know that this is hard. But you are going to have to make a decision. Don't be one of those people who wakes up 20-30 years from now and realizes that they have wasted their youth.

If you stay... put 1000% into it. You will need to deal with a lot of crap. But you will need to realize that you are 100% responsible for your own happiness no matter what he does. And even if you put in this 1000%, he can walk at any time.

IF you leave, do it soon, very soon so that you can get on with your life.

It is not in God's plan for you to be this unhappy.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

Thank you for that insight, EleGirl.


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## lenzi (Apr 10, 2012)

ariel_angel77 said:


> He did it and was upset about it until I let him add her back, then he was happy again.


Why did you let him add her back?


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

In a way, he did you a favor. He made it very clear that his concern for HER feelings is much more important than his concern for YOUR feelings. So the question is... What are you going to do with this message?

C
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

lenzi said:


> Why did you let him add her back?


I felt like my making him delete her would push him towards her.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

PBear said:


> In a way, he did you a favor. He made it very clear that his concern for HER feelings is much more important than his concern for YOUR feelings. So the question is... What are you going to do with this message?
> 
> C
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You really think so? I mean, he ended up deleting her to "prove" to me that my feelings mattered more, or was that not what he was doing? If not, then I should handle it differently.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

ariel_angel77 said:


> *You really think so*? I mean, he ended up deleting her to "prove" to me that my feelings mattered more, or was that not what he was doing? If not, then I should handle it differently.


Of course her POSSIBLE feelings mattered more to him than your REAL feelings. He knew how you felt because you told him...he just speculated what her feelings would be, and he argued on her behalf, and continued to campaign for her until you relented and her POSSIBLE feelings, probably wishful thinking on his part, won out.


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## Anonymous07 (Aug 4, 2012)

PBear said:


> In a way, he did you a favor. He made it very clear that his concern for HER feelings is much more important than his concern for YOUR feelings. So the question is... What are you going to do with this message?
> 
> C
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree:

My husband asked me to delete a male friend of mine(old friend from high school) and I did so because my husband is more important to me than some friend(the friend did overstep a line). Your husband chose his friend over you, but only followed through with deleting her on his own to keep you strung along in thinking he will be "better". He is doing just enough for you to double guess yourself.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

He deleted her because you insisted. Then he was unhappy. You told him to add her back and now he's happy. What do you think that means? Maybe that he cares more about her feelings than yours? 

As I recall, you were married after two weeks of dating. If that's correct, then you had no possible way to know who he really was. Now you are finding out. You have to decide if you want to be married to the person he really is.


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## Thebes (Apr 10, 2013)

ariel_angel77 said:


> I really considered throwing his things out on the lawn today (since it's my apartment). Especially after he was non-responsive this morning, my BIRTHDAY morning. I just really feel like he's showing that he doesn't care about me today. And I really have a feeling like there's something going on.
> 
> If anybody needs background information where I discuss his former emotional abuse in detail see my other thread but basically: yelling, ignoring, belittling, putting me down, insulting me, compulsive lying, and other things. MC made things better but he has made a come back.


I hate to be a negative Nelly but ignoring, belittling, insulting you sounds like typical behavior of one that is cheating. I've been there and was treated like that. I think you are being cheated on.

Ever try to call him at work needing help and they act like you committed a crime by needing them? More cheating behavior.


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## Thebes (Apr 10, 2013)

ariel_angel77 said:


> You really think so? I mean, he ended up deleting her to "prove" to me that my feelings mattered more, or was that not what he was doing? If not, then I should handle it differently.


I would keep my eye out, she may reappear again or he could get a different FB account.


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## Philat (Sep 12, 2013)

ariel_angel77 said:


> I felt like my making him delete her would push him towards her.


You were manipulated into feeling this way, because your man-boy of a husband pouted that you took his toy away from him.

Look, I don't mean to criticize anyone's beliefs, but divorce is not a sin if the partner is not committed. If it is at all possible that the man you thought you married is still inside this guy, then by all means try counseling, see your clergy, etc. If the man you thought you married was truly an illusion, then better the illusion is burst now.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

We knew each other for 3 years in middle school, dated for a year in 8th grade. Talked every now & then throughout the six years, as much as you would talk to an acquaintance. When we met up again, apparently he had gotten saved and was this HUGE Christian, always praying, reading the bible, going to church, quoting verses, talking about God, etc. The WHOLE nine yards. Even went to get anointed (with oil) every service. He demonstrated this person to me with characteristics of what I had always looked for in the man I would marry. He was this whole person who clicked with me in every single way with me and had every moral and value I had.

COMPLETELY changed after we moved in together. Just completely different from described above. My only conclusion is that he put on a fake personality to get me to marry him, and when he had me, he could show his true self.

So, are you supposed to stay married to someone who wasn't who they said they were when you married them? Completely lied about themselves? I would think that God wouldn't want someone to divorce because He wouldn't want them to give up...this feels totally different.


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

So you guys think I should leave before finding out if he's actually cheating with her? Or are you saying that's not the point, that the point is he obviously doesn't care about me?


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

ariel_angel77 said:


> So you guys think I should leave before finding out if he's actually cheating with her? Or are you saying that's not the point, that the point is he obviously doesn't care about me?


Listen, the guy treats you like sh1t. The decision to stay is yours alone, but I think, especially at your very young age, you deserve better, and for me personally, any god that I would consider believing in would not expect that I suffer what you feel yours is demanding you to...just saying.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

He treats you badly. That's enough to leave.


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## clipclop2 (Aug 16, 2013)

He cares about her more than he cares about your marriage. What does that tell you?

Worrying about pushing him toward her should never be a concern in a marriage. You can't push him anywhere. He goes where he wants to go. And at times with your blessing. You don't think he sees both your weakness and your lack of resolve to fight for him?


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

ariel_angel77 said:


> So you guys think I should leave before finding out if he's actually cheating with her? Or are you saying that's not the point, that the point is he obviously doesn't care about me?


Ariel...

...

...

...

_What kind of phone does your husband have?_


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## weightlifter (Dec 14, 2012)

GusPolinski said:


> Ariel...
> 
> ...
> 
> ...


^^^^^^^ I dub the poster above...

SIR APPLEHACKER!


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

Let me find out this afternoon.

Wouldn't it show up on the phone bill though, since he doesn't use apps? lol


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

ariel_angel77 said:


> Let me find out this afternoon.
> 
> *Wouldn't it show up on the phone bill though, since he doesn't use apps? lol*


_How do you *know* this?_


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## ariel_angel77 (May 23, 2014)

Because up until Friday he used one of those old flip phones with no apps


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

ariel_angel77 said:


> Because up until Friday he used one of those old flip phones with no apps


Interesting. What is he using _*now*_?


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

he was a player too


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## TheCuriousWife (Jan 28, 2013)

Ariel I stand by everything I PMed you.

I still think this is a stinky marriage, and that you both would be better off apart. The foundation of the marriage was built on lies, and that is no way to start a relationship.


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## Thebes (Apr 10, 2013)

Wouldn't hurt to see how many Facebook passwords he has saved.

Only leave if you want to we are just saying what we think. 

I do smell a cheater though.

If calling her was his only option it could show up.


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