# My Ex is an Insensitive Turd



## Nomorebeans

This will come as no surprise to those here who know my ex-husband's history.

A little back-story: Our 14-year-old son, who lives mainly with me, but spends a night or two here and there with my ex and the woman he left me for, is going out of state to a sleep-away summer camp for the first time for four weeks in a little over a week. 

Tonight, my ex calls me to see if it's OK with me if our son spends Saturday and Sunday nights with them, since school's out and he'll be off work. He goes, "That'll give you some nice breathing room - get him out of your hair for a couple days." (He speaks almost entirely in metaphors.)

I go, "I'll have plenty of breathing room when he's gone for four weeks here pretty soon, but OK - it's always all right with me for him to spend time with you."

He goes, "I would think you'd be looking forward to having all that time to yourself. You can do whatever you want, without him underfoot."

Seriously?

I guess that's the way I'd see things if I were a selfish piece o' crap.

Meanwhile, yesterday I told my boss of 8 years, who's a very happily married father of two younger kids, that my son was going to this camp in a couple weeks, and he goes, "Oh, my God. Four weeks?! How are you doing with that? Are you gonna be OK?"

See the difference?

Insensitive turd.


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## lifeistooshort

Your ex is a turd, for a lot of reasons. 

But in fairness he may just have a different level of bonding than you do. 

My ex used to go for months and not even call our boys when he was stationed out of state. Not deployed, just a few states away. I used to wonder how he could do that. ....i could barely go a week when they visited him twice a year. 

But I came to realize that he does love them, he just isn't bonded to them the way I am, and they know it because they come to me when they need anything and always look forward to coming home. 

I see it as his loss. He's never been what you'd call a hands on father. 

Maybe your ex is like this?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Nomorebeans

lifeistooshort said:


> Your ex is a turd, for a lot of reasons.
> 
> But in fairness he may just have a different level of bonding than you do.
> 
> My ex used to go for months and not even call our boys when he was stationed out of state. Not deployed, just a few states away. I used to wonder how he could do that. ....i could barely go a week when they visited him twice a year.
> 
> But I came to realize that he does love them, he just isn't bonded to them the way I am, and they know it because they come to me when they need anything and always look forward to coming home.
> 
> I see it as his loss. He's never been what you'd call a hands on father.
> 
> Maybe your ex is like this?
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


He definitely is like this. I'd take it a step further and say he's not capable of truly bonding with anyone. His GF went back to her home state at Christmas for a week without him after only having been living with him for three months, and he seemed relieved to be rid of her for a while. I heard my son asking him if he dropped her off at the airport, and he goes, "Why would I do that? That's her problem." 

Yeah. Something is her problem now.


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## JohnA

There are a lot of things not to miss with n ex like that.


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## lifeistooshort

Yeah, she got a real prize didn't she? 

I don't think my ex really bonds with anyone emotionally either. He just has a different level of emotional need than me. .... you sound like you're probably more like me. 

I remember my father talking to him during our divorce, and my father was a straight shooter that wouldn't hesitate to tell me if hde thought I was wrong. He told me that what really struck him about my ex was that he didn't seem to have compassion for anyone and even though he slept next to me for 7 years he didn't seem to know anything about me. 

That's because he doesn't bond and isn't really capable of making an emotional connection. 

I feel sorry for him..... he doesn't know the joy of being close to someone. 

So I think you need to stop assessing his behavior through your lens and filter it through his lens. It'll still look crappy to you but you might come to the conclusion that he actually gives what he can. 

He just doesn't have much to give emotionally.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Lostinthought61

Beans I am so with you, my girls are away either in college or internships and I miss them so much I make excuses to go visit them.....I hate not having them around.


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## SecondTime'Round

I agree this man is not capable of bonding, which is actually quite sad. (Not that I'm feeling empathy for this man!). He doesn't get it (parenthood) and never will . I hope you do OK for four weeks....that's a long time. Write lots of letters!


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## jdawg2015

My daughter is 23 and I still hate leaving her after a visit at school or other trip and keep in contact at least once or twice a week with a text or short call just to check in see how's she doing.

I can't imagine what it's like to have divorced with a younger child doing split custody. Specifically because of things like you have to listen to with your spouse. Or if your ex has a partner who makes things more complicated.

Having to see the women he left you for would must be tough.

Your son will see through his fathers attitude over time. Kids pick up on things way more than we give them credit for.




Nomorebeans said:


> This will come as no surprise to those here who know my ex-husband's history.
> 
> A little back-story: Our 14-year-old son, who lives mainly with me, but spends a night or two here and there with my ex and the woman he left me for, is going out of state to a sleep-away summer camp for the first time for four weeks in a little over a week.
> 
> Tonight, my ex calls me to see if it's OK with me if our son spends Saturday and Sunday nights with them, since school's out and he'll be off work. He goes, "That'll give you some nice breathing room - get him out of your hair for a couple days." (He speaks almost entirely in metaphors.)
> 
> I go, "I'll have plenty of breathing room when he's gone for four weeks here pretty soon, but OK - it's always all right with me for him to spend time with you."
> 
> He goes, "I would think you'd be looking forward to having all that time to yourself. You can do whatever you want, without him underfoot."
> 
> Seriously?
> 
> I guess that's the way I'd see things if I were a selfish piece o' crap.
> 
> Meanwhile, yesterday I told my boss of 8 years, who's a very happily married father of two younger kids, that my son was going to this camp in a couple weeks, and he goes, "Oh, my God. Four weeks?! How are you doing with that? Are you gonna be OK?"
> 
> See the difference?
> 
> Insensitive turd.


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## Nomorebeans

SecondTime'Round said:


> I agree this man is not capable of bonding, which is actually quite sad. (Not that I'm feeling empathy for this man!). He doesn't get it (parenthood) and never will . I hope you do OK for four weeks....that's a long time. Write lots of letters!


I'll have to write lots of letters - they're not allowed to have their phones or screens of any kind while they're there! While I like the idea of him having a true camp experience, I hate that I won't be able to talk to him that whole time.


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## SecondTime'Round

Nomorebeans said:


> I'll have to write lots of letters - they're not allowed to have their phones or screens of any kind while they're there! While I like the idea of him having a true camp experience, I hate that I won't be able to talk to him that whole time.


Are you allowed to visit? (And would he let you?) Do they have a Facebook page where they upload pics for the parents to see?


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## 3Xnocharm

Yeah, your ex is a butthead for sure. Definitely gives you a clear picture of how he sees things. 

If I were you, I would agree to every other weekend. Does your son want to this?


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## Pluto2

Yep he's a turd.

I don't honestly know if its a lack of bonding, or a lack of priority in their lives that make some parents behave like this towards their children. Maybe its the same thing. But there are absolutely some parents (both married and divorced) who view children as an after-thought, and some type of responsibility to be avoided at all costs.

And then there are those parents, like you, who give all you can for your children.

No doubt in ten to fifteen years your ex will wonder why your DS doesn't call and come see him. I bet you won't wonder at all.


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## larry.gray

Since he's self centered, he's not offering to take your son to help you. He's just so emotionally constipated that he can't admit he misses his kid. He most likely views admitting missing him is admitting weakness.


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## Cooper

I know there's a lot of negative history between you and the ex but what a silly thing to get your hackles up over.


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## Nomorebeans

SecondTime'Round said:


> Are you allowed to visit? (And would he let you?) Do they have a Facebook page where they upload pics for the parents to see?


No - they only allow one visit at the halfway point for kids doing the 8-week program. I haven't looked into the Facebook page and photos thing. One thing that helps me is that three of his best friends are going and have gone to this same camp for the last two years. They'll all be in the same cabin, and are good kids. And their parents are veterans of this. One is recently-divorced, herself.

It's just going to be really weird not being able to see or talk to him for so long.

On the upside, I can finally go 100% No Contact with my ex - for a month, anyway - something I've been dreaming about for a year.


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## Nomorebeans

3Xnocharm said:


> Yeah, your ex is a butthead for sure. Definitely gives you a clear picture of how he sees things.
> 
> If I were you, I would agree to every other weekend. Does your son want to this?


No, our son doesn't want to do this. He says it's "awkward" for him over there. She's nice to him, and I'm glad for that. But he says she's just this person he doesn't really know, and it's "just weird" to hang out with his Dad with her there.

So, he spends maybe a night or two a month with them, and is accepting about it, but not really happy. Other than that, his Dad takes him to the gym or the library or somewhere elsewhere for a few hours a day when he's in town. His Dad does want him to spend more time at his house than he does, but doesn't want to deal with the day-to-day weekday stuff like getting him up and ready for school and driving him there. He also doesn't understand why it's awkward for him - but then, being incapable of empathy will do that to a person.


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## Nomorebeans

larry.gray said:


> Since he's self centered, he's not offering to take your son to help you. He's just so emotionally constipated that he can't admit he misses his kid. He most likely views admitting missing him is admitting weakness.


I think there's some truth to this - he's never been one for introspection - just the opposite - he goes to great lengths to portray himself as the hero he thinks he is.

I like that - "emotionally constipated." I've referred to him before as emotionally anorexic, but yours is better.


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## 3Xnocharm

Nomorebeans said:


> No, our son doesn't want to do this. He says it's "awkward" for him over there. She's nice to him, and I'm glad for that. But he says she's just this person he doesn't really know, and it's "just weird" to hang out with his Dad with her there.
> 
> So, he spends maybe a night or two a month with them, and is accepting about it, but not really happy. Other than that, his Dad takes him to the gym or the library or somewhere elsewhere for a few hours a day when he's in town. His Dad does want him to spend more time at his house than he does, but doesn't want to deal with the day-to-day weekday stuff like getting him up and ready for school and driving him there. He also doesn't understand why it's awkward for him - but then, being incapable of empathy will do that to a person.


Eh, he's 14, let him do what it is that he feels is best for him. Just keep your ex out of your house. If he doesn't want to go, then don't make him, just make sure he knows that dad isn't welcome to come hang out in YOUR home any more. (hopefully I don't have your situation confused with someone else!) The only two people responsible for that relationship is your son and your ex.


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## Nomorebeans

3Xnocharm said:


> Eh, he's 14, let him do what it is that he feels is best for him. Just keep your ex out of your house. If he doesn't want to go, then don't make him, just make sure he knows that dad isn't welcome to come hang out in YOUR home any more. (hopefully I don't have your situation confused with someone else!) The only two people responsible for that relationship is your son and your ex.


His Dad doesn't come into my house anymore. (You do have the right situation, 3X!) And that's certainly helped me get closer to really moving on.

Trouble is, now it seems like he calls and texts me more often. He really can't stop that cake-eating. I let all his calls go to voicemail, unless our son is with him. He left me a 4+ minute message the other day, really just repeating a number of things he's already said before in regards to our son, and none of which required any response by me.


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## ThreeStrikes

3Xnocharm said:


> Eh, he's 14, let him do what it is that he feels is best for him. Just keep your ex out of your house. If he doesn't want to go, then don't make him, just make sure he knows that dad isn't welcome to come hang out in YOUR home any more. (hopefully I don't have your situation confused with someone else!) The only two people responsible for that relationship is your son and your ex.


It's the responsibility of both parents to encourage a healthy relationship between the child and other parent.

Not doing that, or undermining that relationship because you can't keep your personal feelings towards you ex at bay, is parental alienation. It damages your kid.

We don't let 14 year old kids do what they feel is best for them. They are 14.


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## Nomorebeans

ThreeStrikes said:


> It's the responsibility of both parents to encourage a healthy relationship between the child and other parent.
> 
> Not doing that, or undermining that relationship because you can't keep your personal feelings towards you ex at bay, is parental alienation. It damages your kid.
> 
> We don't let 14 year old kids do what they feel is best for them. They are 14.


I don't think anyone's advocating for undermining anyone's parent-child relationship, here.

My son's only spent a night here or there with his Dad since he moved his GF in because that's all he's invited him to do. Even though my ex is sometimes off work for several days in a row, he doesn't want to deal with the hassle of getting up early and taking his son to school (he's zoned for a different school where he lives, so he can't get a bus to it there).

He says he wants him to spend more time over there with them this summer when he gets back from camp, and I don't plan to keep him from doing that.

That said, he invited him to stay with them for three days during his Spring Break. He stayed for two, but was uncomfortable spending a third night and asked him to bring him home, and he did. I had nothing to do with that.

Should we have both forced him to stay longer when he was unhappy and uncomfortable and wanted to come home? Maybe you think so, but I have to disagree.

I never badmouth my ex or his GF to our son. I even defend him when our son complains about him.

I started this thread to vent about my ex not seeming to care that we won't be able to see or talk to our son for four weeks, whereas my boss expressed to me basically that he'd be a mess if that were the case for him and his kids. 

There is no parental alienation issue here - the only issues are that my ex is emotionally impaired, and I let his nonsense affect me way more than I should.


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## Cooper

Nomorebeans said:


> I don't think anyone's advocating for undermining anyone's parent-child relationship, here.
> 
> My son's only spent a night here or there with his Dad since he moved his GF in because that's all he's invited him to do. Even though my ex is sometimes off work for several days in a row, he doesn't want to deal with the hassle of getting up early and taking his son to school (he's zoned for a different school where he lives, so he can't get a bus to it there).
> 
> He says he wants him to spend more time over there with them this summer when he gets back from camp, and I don't plan to keep him from doing that.
> 
> That said, he invited him to stay with them for three days during his Spring Break. He stayed for two, but was uncomfortable spending a third night and asked him to bring him home, and he did. I had nothing to do with that.
> 
> Should we have both forced him to stay longer when he was unhappy and uncomfortable and wanted to come home? Maybe you think so, but I have to disagree.
> 
> I never badmouth my ex or his GF to our son. I even defend him when our son complains about him.
> 
> I started this thread to vent about my ex not seeming to care that we won't be able to see or talk to our son for four weeks, whereas my boss expressed to me basically that he'd be a mess if that were the case for him and his kids.
> 
> There is no parental alienation issue here - the only issues are that my ex is emotionally impaired, and I let his nonsense affect me way more than I should.


I don't want to sound like I'm defending your ex, but I did want to address the highlighted comment.

As a parent you want to teach your kids all sorts of lessons, including independence and resourcefulness. Putting your kids in a position to learn and grow is critical, and sending the kid to camp is a great example. Sure you are going to miss the kid but the attitude you need to project is excitement for the opportunity he will have.

So here's why I think this bothers you so much. Your ex is no longer a part of your sons day to day life, you are angry and resentful about that (been there). The ex's comment about enjoying the break while your son is gone you take personally because you think that's his reality. ie; I like my life because I don't have to deal with the kid every day and now you're going to see how nice it is to not have the kid there everyday and be able to do what you want when you want. 

I could be wrong but I doubt if your ex wakes up everyday being thankful his son isn't there. But the reality is your ex has become more disconnected to his son as other parts of his life have evolved (girlfriend and living some where else). Could he be a better parent? Probably. Is he happy being a divorced man without custody of his son? I guarantee you that wasn't his plan when he married you. 

Here's my point. I don't think your ex's comment was anything more than random conversation. If one of your girlfriends would have made the same comment you probably would have jumped up on the table yelling "PARRRTY!!!) lol

Stop wasting your energy by dissecting and analyzing every thing your ex says. I am a man who kept the kids while my ex moved right into another mans home and became an instant step mom leaving our kids as an after thought. I was very pissed, not so much at the divorce but at the way she changed lives so easily, so I get what you feel OP. But you need to let your life evolve, other wise you will end up with a tiny little heart made of stone. 

Your ex may be an ass, but you can't change that nor does being pissed about it all the time do you any good, nor does it do your kid any good. Make your life evolve into something more instead of being focused on what's missing. Tell your son you love him and will miss him but tell him how excited you are for the adventure he is going to have. And have some fun while he's gone!


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## Nomorebeans

Cooper said:


> I don't want to sound like I'm defending your ex, but I did want to address the highlighted comment.
> 
> As a parent you want to teach your kids all sorts of lessons, including independence and resourcefulness. Putting your kids in a position to learn and grow is critical, and sending the kid to camp is a great example. Sure you are going to miss the kid but the attitude you need to project is excitement for the opportunity he will have.
> 
> So here's why I think this bothers you so much. Your ex is no longer a part of your sons day to day life, you are angry and resentful about that (been there). The ex's comment about enjoying the break while your son is gone you take personally because you think that's his reality. ie; I like my life because I don't have to deal with the kid every day and now you're going to see how nice it is to not have the kid there everyday and be able to do what you want when you want.
> 
> I could be wrong but I doubt if your ex wakes up everyday being thankful his son isn't there. But the reality is your ex has become more disconnected to his son as other parts of his life have evolved (girlfriend and living some where else). Could he be a better parent? Probably. Is he happy being a divorced man without custody of his son? I guarantee you that wasn't his plan when he married you.
> 
> Here's my point. I don't think your ex's comment was anything more than random conversation. If one of your girlfriends would have made the same comment you probably would have jumped up on the table yelling "PARRRTY!!!) lol
> 
> Stop wasting your energy by dissecting and analyzing every thing your ex says. I am a man who kept the kids while my ex moved right into another mans home and became an instant step mom leaving our kids as an after thought. I was very pissed, not so much at the divorce but at the way she changed lives so easily, so I get what you feel OP. But you need to let your life evolve, other wise you will end up with a tiny little heart made of stone.
> 
> Your ex may be an ass, but you can't change that nor does being pissed about it all the time do you any good, nor does it do your kid any good. Make your life evolve into something more instead of being focused on what's missing. Tell your son you love him and will miss him but tell him how excited you are for the adventure he is going to have. And have some fun while he's gone!


You make some good points, Cooper. 

I just dropped my son off at the airport. Alone. And I did very well. We talked enthusiastically about all the fun he was going to have with his friends on the way. Went with him to get his boarding pass and meet up with his group. All the kids - some we know from school and many who have gone to this camp before - were so excited and happy. They had five or six adult chaperones from the camp there to escort about 40 kids on the flight to the camp. All very friendly and professional.

I got him to Security and watched him go through it, waved to him one more time, and then he was gone. Very proud that I didn't shed a tear - didn't even get choked up - in front of him. Got talking to one of his friend's Moms who's sent her son to this camp for the last two summers and who knows it's my first time after her son went through Security, and started to cry just a little, but really because she was being so sympathetic and understanding. Pulled it together pretty quickly after that, and we laughed about it. She said she did the same thing two years ago when it was her son's first time. 

I noticed that both she and her ex-husband were there to see their son off, and both divorced parents of another of my son's friends were there to see their son off. Didn't look like they all went together, but the other parent showed up in each case to see his son off.

My ex never even offered to take him, or to go also to see him off, even though he's in town. He did spend some time with his son yesterday, and said his good-byes then, I guess.

I know I shouldn't project how other people go about it onto him and expect him to behave the same. But I have to admit it irritates me.

You say that if a girlfriend said to me what he said about enjoying having a break from my son, I'd have made a joke of it. But here's the thing - not one of my friends or coworkers has said that. Why? Because they're not insensitive turds, and because they know I'm not one, either. I'm also not a drama queen, I swear, even though it may seem like that to those here who don't really know me. 

I'll tell you what I do look forward to - No Contact with the ex for 30 days. He really has absolutely no reason to text or call me while our son is gone, and certainly no reason to see me. I can pretty much guarantee he won't contact me tonight to make sure he got up to camp OK - and that's fine with me - he's a pilot who doesn't think that way - no news is good news where that's concerned for him. So there is that.

And I am excited for my son. I think he's going to have a great time with his friends and make new friends - he's very outgoing and extroverted and makes friends very easily. This is the perfect thing for him to spend part of his summer doing. And he'll be in the Blue Ridge Mountains by a lake - it's outrageously beautiful there.

So I'm more happy for him than sad that he'll be gone for a month and I'll miss him, now. That's progress.


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## 3Xnocharm

You did good, Mom!


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## Nomorebeans

3Xnocharm said:


> You did good, Mom!


Thank you, 3X! I'm proud that he didn't see me getting choked up, and that a day later, I'm just hoping he's having the time of his life.

Turns out the NC thing was very short-lived.

My ex couldn't even go 24 hours with No Contact. He called me last night. I probably should have let it go to voice mail, but I answered it. He said he was just calling to see if I got the recorded message about all the campers arriving safely at camp that he had just gotten. I had. Then he asked how "the send-off" went. I told him it went fine and didn't go into any specifics.

He called me again today while I was at work. That one I let go to voicemail. It ended up just being under the guise of him not being able to cash a tax refund check that was made out to both of us (but really just owed to him - he prepaid taxes quarterly out of his own account for the year, so we had agreed he could keep the refund) at the dipsh!t bank without me also being there with my ID. When I called him back, he asked if there were set times our son would be able to call us while he was away. I told him no (I had told him this before, but he tends to not listen to me, so he missed it), they're not allowed to have or use any phones, but they are allowed to send emails a couple times a week and are encouraged to write and mail letters and post cards as often as they'd like. He goes, "Wow. I didn't realize they don't get to make any phone calls. Will you please let me know if you get a letter or email from him?"

I said of course I'd let him know if there was any news from the camp or him whatsoever. He said he'd appreciate that.

So I take it back - apparently he's not exactly an insensitive turd - just empathy-impaired. And clearly, he already misses his son.


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## 3Xnocharm

Geez. Tell him to stop calling you, make him use text or email only from now on. Not sure why he is making up sh!t to contact you for...


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## Nomorebeans

3Xnocharm said:


> Geez. Tell him to stop calling you, make him use text or email only from now on. Not sure why he is making up sh!t to contact you for...


I have a theory. He's still cake-eating. He now gets the 25% (his term early on in the blame-shifting and rationalizations for why he had the affair) he was missing from our marriage, but is missing the 75% he had. They have nothing in common, other than happening to be from the same town. They have had separate families and children and lives until a couple years ago. He has 27 years of history and a child with me. She doesn't know his family, and hasn't met any of his college friends with whom he keeps in touch. I know all about all of them. His sister and I were each other's maids of honor. His father lived with us for a couple years after his mother died. I sat with his father when he was dying and it was too much for him to deal with. I have attended several of his cousins' weddings.

What has she done? Told him how sexy and amazing he was, and what a shame it was that his wife didn't appreciate him, when he was still married with a 13-year-old son? Have wild, affair sex with him? Move in with him from another state and then proceed to constantly complain about how much she misses her home and family (he'll never move out of this state)? Maybe she cooks and cleans and does laundry for him, too. But that's about it.

I told him when I found out about her that he shouldn't throw in with the first woman he's with after me - he should take some time, date different women, and find one that's worthy of him.

But you know what? I think he has. They both have exactly what they deserve - each other.

(The important thing is I'm not bitter.)

(And you're right - no more phone calls - he can text or email.)


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## joannacroc

Nomorebeans said:


> I have a theory. He's still cake-eating. He now gets the 25% (his term early on in the blame-shifting and rationalizations for why he had the affair) he was missing from our marriage, but is missing the 75% he had. They have nothing in common, other than happening to be from the same town. They have had separate families and children and lives until a couple years ago. He has 27 years of history and a child with me. She doesn't know his family, and hasn't met any of his college friends with whom he keeps in touch. I know all about all of them. His sister and I were each other's maids of honor. His father lived with us for a couple years after his mother died. I sat with his father when he was dying and it was too much for him to deal with. I have attended several of his cousins' weddings.
> 
> What has she done? Told him how sexy and amazing he was, and what a shame it was that his wife didn't appreciate him, when he was still married with a 13-year-old son? Have wild, affair sex with him? Move in with him from another state and then proceed to constantly complain about how much she misses her home and family (he'll never move out of this state)? Maybe she cooks and cleans and does laundry for him, too. But that's about it.
> 
> I told him when I found out about her that he shouldn't throw in with the first woman he's with after me - he should take some time, date different women, and find one that's worthy of him.
> 
> But you know what? I think he has. They both have exactly what they deserve - each other.
> 
> (The important thing is I'm not bitter.)
> 
> (And you're right - no more phone calls - he can text or email.)


It's totally understandable that you're bitter. You've had the rug pulled out from under you. But I noticed that the more I allow myself to start getting angry, the more worked up I allow myself to get. In the end, the anger won't serve you well. Believe me, I agree he's a noncommittal idiot. I have one of those myself (XH who basically says if his son is sick when he is about to drop him off at school and I have work and he doesn't, well, it's not my custody night anymore, so he's your problem now). It will drive you crazy if you let it. But at a certain point you have to make the decision to take steps to control your anger and how much you allow yourself to care about what your X is doing when your son isn't there. Are you in therapy? Forgive me if you mentioned this on a previous thread, but I get a little muddled with all of the different posters. 

But I feel like you need to pick your battles. Regarding your son's staying overnight more often when he doesn't feel comfortable, maybe have your son discuss how he would feel about a middle ground, like your XH taking your son out without his GF sometimes so they can spend some one-on-one time together. Or your XH and his GF taking him out to do something for the day, an activity he enjoys, obviously, and then him coming home to you so he isn't put in a position where the new reality is forced on him. He will have time to get used to the idea of his dad with the new woman, if she is indeed a permanent fixture. As galling as I'm sure you find the idea (it is pretty hard to take), with how much you love your son, you will want to help him cope with his life as it is now, new XH's GF included.


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## NoChoice

OP,
Please remember that when someone is so tightly bonded to themselves it precludes them being able to bond with others.


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## Pluto2

3Xnocharm said:


> Geez. Tell him to stop calling you, make him use text or email only from now on. Not sure why he is making up sh!t to contact you for...


Completely agree.
He fired you. One of the consequences is he has to form his own relationship with his son, not rely on you to facilitate it.

And this is not contrary to peaceful co-parenting. You are not alienated him from his son. You should be ensuring that your ex has separate communications with his child, not relying on your relationship with your child as his attempts to parent. Time for him do it.


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## 225985

Hey Beans,

Your son must be at camp now. How are you managing?


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## GusPolinski

My younger brother went away to camp for a couple of summers when we were kids.

Best summers I ever had.

:lol: :rofl:


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## Spotthedeaddog

Nomorebeans said:


> Tonight, my ex calls me to see if it's OK with me if our son spends Saturday and Sunday nights with them, since school's out and he'll be off work. He goes, "That'll give you some nice breathing room - get him out of your hair for a couple days." (He speaks almost entirely in metaphors.)
> 
> I go, "I'll have plenty of breathing room when he's gone for four weeks here pretty soon, but OK - it's always all right with me for him to spend time with you."
> 
> He goes, "I would think you'd be looking forward to having all that time to yourself. You can do whatever you want, without him underfoot."


It's a technique of not admitting liability for his desires/plans/machinations.
By putting everything back on you he's doing you the favors so doesn't have to feel obligated/consider any effects on others.
Quite common PC/Passive aggressive behavior, especially in office/government circles.


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## Nomorebeans

blueinbr said:


> Hey Beans,
> 
> Your son must be at camp now. How are you managing?


Hey, Blue! I'm managing better than I thought I would, come to think of it. Thanks for asking!

I miss him terribly, of course, but I've been really trying to focus on other things. I have my wonderful dog Buttercup for company, who has really proven to be such a blessing in our lives, so that certainly helps.

I'm having my pool and patio redone right now. The work started on it two days ago. It's been a long time coming - the pool and patio are both original with the house, which was built in 1978. So, the pool needs resurfacing and retiling, and the patio is Chattahoochee - rounded pebbles set in concrete that feel like - well, rounded pebbles - beneath your feet. And the patio is severely cracked in some places. I'm having brick pavers put down instead. Hoping to have it all done before my son gets home in a week, but I'll be happy with it just being well underway by that time. I say this, and the two workmen are still out there at almost 6:00 on a Friday night before a holiday weekend. They were here until almost 8:00 last night. Point is, I've been focusing on this project. Even though I'm not doing it myself, I spent a lot of time cleaning everything off the patio last weekend except a few big things that they say they can move around as they go. Also ordered cool new patio furniture on sale at Costco that will come late next week. Ceiling fans are next. It's going to be Shangri-La out there when it's all finished.

My dog still checks my son's room for him each morning. At first I thought it was kind of dumb of her when she kept doing it after he'd been gone for one, and then two, and now three weeks. But she sleeps with me, and when school was still on, she would go into his room every morning and wake him up. She would do that eventually on the weekend days, too. Sometimes, when he'd sleep over at a friend's house or stay with his Dad, she'd go in to wake him and find him not there. I think it's smart, actually, that she has so much "object permanence." She must know that eventually, she's going to go in there and there he'll be.

I really look forward to her reaction the first time she sees him again after he gets home.


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## joannacroc

Pets can be a real blessing. Sounds like you're coping really well! Good dog, Buttercup 

I know how you feel. I'm preparing to let me little man go with his Dad for his summer vacation, Dad version (I'm taking him away for vacation in a few weeks). It hurts too much to think about letting him go for over a week, so I'm keeping busy and concentrating on making sure he's ready. The house is going to feel very empty. 

I'll have to follow your lead and focus on a larger project, like your pool/patio remodeling. Have you been in touch with friends since he's started camp?


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## Nomorebeans

joannacroc said:


> Pets can be a real blessing. Sounds like you're coping really well! Good dog, Buttercup
> 
> I know how you feel. I'm preparing to let me little man go with his Dad for his summer vacation, Dad version (I'm taking him away for vacation in a few weeks). It hurts too much to think about letting him go for over a week, so I'm keeping busy and concentrating on making sure he's ready. The house is going to feel very empty.
> 
> I'll have to follow your lead and focus on a larger project, like your pool/patio remodeling. Have you been in touch with friends since he's started camp?


How old is your son, Joanna? Sorry you'll be without him for over a week. It used to be hard for me when my son would go with his Dad just for a few days to Disney World (we live in Florida) on Spring Break - he used to take him every year - a "boys' vacation."

This paver/pool refurbishing company has been working through the weekend. A crew of four plans to show up tomorrow to lay the pavers on the whole patio in one day. I told their foreman I hated to think of them working on a Sunday, and on a holiday weekend besides, but he said they're extremely busy, and he has crews doing that pretty much every weekend to stay on schedule. So, I'm excited that the pallets of pavers that are currently sitting on the side of my driveway will be on the patio by this time tomorrow. Then, they'll come in the middle of next week to resurface and then refill the pool, and it'll be all done! I ordered ceiling fans on sale at Lowe's today.

Had a bit of a setback last night. Found out that my ex and his girlfriend are going to have a little mini-vacation with his brother and his wife in a couple weeks - I imagine she'll be meeting them for the first time. His brother cried on the phone about how sad he was about what his brother had done and our divorce the last time I talked to him, which was in March. I guess life goes on without me for everyone. I should have seen it coming - I have to remember that both my brothers have been divorced, and in both cases, because they cheated on their wives. I didn't care much for the women they cheated with, but I didn't cut off all ties with my brothers because I disapproved of their choices. Still, it hurts me to think of my ex BIL and SIL laughing it up with the POS OW. I love both of them dearly, and have many fond memories of spending Christmases and Thanksgivings with them when my ex's whole family would get together. He hasn't just removed himself from my life - he's removed his brother and sister from it, too, after knowing them for 27 years.

Effing people. Effing life.

:::Think about the patio. Think about the patio.:::

My son will be gobsmacked when he gets home and sees the transformation out there. It's going to be beautiful.


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## 225985

Nomorebeans said:


> :::Think about the patio. Think about the patio.:::


Post back with pics when the pool and patio is done. You can have a virtual TAM Pool Party. I'll be there. :smile2:


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