# My fiancé won’t let me see her text messages



## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

I felt a little suspicious after she would sit in the car and chat with someone everyday for 15-20 minutes. I asked her why are you doing that, why not come inside and talk? She said it’s my sister and brother from overseas and I don’t want to lose the call going in the elevator. She then shows me the calls and she was talking to them. Then I asked to see her text messages. She flat out said, NO! Got extremely upset and gaslighted me saying you don’t trust me!! Screamed at me at length and I just said calmly, “you have full access to my phone and I don’t to yours, I rarely ask to see your phone”. She has a history of cheating on others, I’ve had to tell her before to stop texting old lovers and old boyfriends in the last 6 months too. She is not cheating on me physically yet, but I fear she has an emotional relationship with someone that is via text. Help


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Jbird123 said:


> I felt a little suspicious after she would sit in the car and chat with someone everyday for 15-20 minutes. I asked her why are you doing that, why not come inside and talk? She said it’s my sister and brother from overseas and I don’t want to lose the call going in the elevator. She then shows me the calls and she was talking to them. Then I asked to see her text messages. She flat out said, NO! Got extremely upset and gaslighted me saying you don’t trust me!! Screamed at me at length and I just said calmly, “you have full access to my phone and I don’t to yours, I rarely ask to see your phone”. *She has a history of cheating on others, I’ve had to tell her before to stop texting old lovers and old boyfriends in the last 6 months too. * She is not cheating on me physically yet, but I fear she has an emotional relationship with someone that is via text. Help


dude. I’m gonna have to give the Joe Biden come on, man….. to this one.
SMH at the idea of marrying such a woman knowingly


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## MarmiteC (Jun 28, 2021)

If you fundamentally don't trust her you should not be marrying her.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Why people date former serial cheaters?


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> I felt a little suspicious after she would sit in the car and chat with someone everyday for 15-20 minutes. I asked her why are you doing that, why not come inside and talk? She said it’s my sister and brother from overseas and I don’t want to lose the call going in the elevator. She then shows me the calls and she was talking to them. Then I asked to see her text messages. She flat out said, NO! Got extremely upset and gaslighted me saying you don’t trust me!! Screamed at me at length and I just said calmly, “you have full access to my phone and I don’t to yours, I rarely ask to see your phone”. She has a history of cheating on others, I’ve had to tell her before to stop texting old lovers and old boyfriends in the last 6 months too. She is not cheating on me physically yet, but I fear she has an emotional relationship with someone that is via text. Help


I agree with @MarmiteC it's time to put the brakes on the whole thing.

Does she say _why_ she won't let you see her text messages? Not that's it's really important, whatever she says will be a lie.

If she says 'you don't trust me' you can honestly answer "yea, why should I ?"

Anyway that would just be for fun.

You don't need evidence of anything to just walk away.
Whether she's actively cheating now or not, you know who she is and her behavior is shady right now.
Walk away.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

In Absentia said:


> Why people date former serial cheaters?


I didn't know mine was a serial cheater, but the signs were there.
I was young, dumb, naïve, and only saw the good stuff.
She was beautiful and I had low self-esteem.

Perfect recipe for heartbreak.
Fortunately it was relatively short. <5yr. TAM didn't exist then. 
Hell the internet was still in infancy then. So no real help.

Someone on TAM speculated about Father figure and not having a good marriage role model.
100% agree in my case.

Maybe OP too.


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Serial cheaters are like meth addicts, they just destroy every relationship they are in, and you in the process if the relationship is with you. Playing Russian Roulette with your life is no way to plan your future.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

Me doth think the woman protest too much.....her response demonstrates her in ability be honest with you and herself. I promise you if you marry her you will have a marriage of pain until you leave her or she leaves you...sadly that will be the out come, after all a zebra does not change it's stripes


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## QuietGuy (Aug 31, 2021)

This is unlikely to get better. It will most likely end in heartbreak for you if you marry her. You should not have to ask her to drop exs. She should want to do that on her own. Drop her and find someone you don't have to police.


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## Asterix (May 16, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> I felt a little suspicious after she would sit in the car and chat with someone everyday for 15-20 minutes. I asked her why are you doing that, why not come inside and talk? She said it’s my sister and brother from overseas and I don’t want to lose the call going in the elevator. She then shows me the calls and she was talking to them. Then I asked to see her text messages. She flat out said, NO! Got extremely upset and gaslighted me saying you don’t trust me!! Screamed at me at length and I just said calmly, “you have full access to my phone and I don’t to yours, I rarely ask to see your phone”. She has a history of cheating on others, I’ve had to tell her before to stop texting old lovers and old boyfriends in the last 6 months too. She is not cheating on me physically yet, but I fear she has an emotional relationship with someone that is via text. Help


Aren't you glad that you found out about her behavior now instead of finding out after you got married.

She may show you her text messages the next time you ask her if there's a next time OR she may volunteer to show them to you. I'd bet my last dollar that she would have deleted a whole bunch of her texts and done some significant clean up before giving up her phone to you.

I understand the concept of privacy, but it shouldn't be the case between married people or monogamous people, ESPECIALLY when it casts doubt towards the fidelity of the person.

edited to add: @Jbird123 what are you doing spending/wasting your time with this person? You shouldn't need to ask her to stop texting her old boyfriend(s). She should be doing that herself if she valued this relationship. At this point I'd suggest not to believe her words and closely observe her behavior and actions. Words are cheap. With her actions, She'll show you who she really is.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

.


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## re16 (Oct 9, 2012)

Consider yourself lucky you found this before you actually married her and move on... dump her swiftly.

Just say 'I know what you've been up to' and its time to leave.....give her no further info and ghost her.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

Do *NOT* marry her. If you do, you’ll get trouble you don’t need. Be glad you caught this now before it would be much more difficult to get out of. Move on.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Mr.Married said:


> Let’s get real … he is going to marry her. Denial dude….. it’s stronger than the FORCE !!


At least he admits she's in an EA. That's +1 in his favor.

But hasn't yet figured out it's more than that.

She never stopped 6 months ago.
So she's been hooking (PA) up for at least that long.


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

If has been chatting with a man platonically daily for months, why does that hurt me so much?


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

BeyondRepair007 said:


> At least he admits she's in an EA. That's +1 in his favor.
> 
> But hasn't yet figured out it's more than that.
> 
> ...


What’s n EA and a PA?


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## Benbutton (Oct 3, 2019)

I'm going to make this as clear and simple for you as I possibly can:

1. She has a history of cheating = she will cheat now and in the future.

2. The phone and her private conversations in the car along with the secrecy of her texts says it all. Always pay attention to the phone and her behavior with it. Oh and one of the oldest tricks in the book is to use real or fake names to cover up the phone numbers of those whom she is actually calling. Get the phone numbers and call them. 

3. She lost her mind when you requested her phone...gee I wonder why??

4. She is unwilling to share transparency with you. 

You have more than enough here to un- fiance her. I would have at number 1. Don't be stupid.


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## Benbutton (Oct 3, 2019)

Jbird123 said:


> What’s n EA and a PA?


Emotional and physical affair.


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## Works (Apr 3, 2016)

Yes, now I remember how brutal some answers can be. 😂 Not to poke fun.. but on the outside looking in, he most likely will marry her and in 5 years (like me) be back on here to let us know how it is going...

Again, not poking fun at all... but if this is how she is now, that means she doesn't respect you or the relationship. She doesn't care.


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## Benbutton (Oct 3, 2019)

Jbird123 said:


> If has been chatting with a man platonically daily for months, why does that hurt me so much?


Are you there for those"platonic" conversations?


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## Benbutton (Oct 3, 2019)

Works said:


> Yes, now I remember how brutal some answers can be. 😂 Not to poke fun.. but on the outside looking in, he most likely will marry her and in 5 years (like me) be back on here to let us know how it is going...
> 
> Again, not poking fun at all... but if this is how she is now, that means she doesn't respect you or the relationship. She doesn't care.


If one is going to take advice, one should get it from those with experience.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior. There's no such thing is a "reformed" cheater, there's just someone who has better learned how to hide what they're doing. Red flags, as far as the eye can see. Ignore them at your peril. Besides, how exhausting, to constantly be dealing with having to check up on someone, worry about what they're doing... who has time or energy for that drama? Back away and find someone you can trust, who makes your life better, not worse.


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## Works (Apr 3, 2016)

Benbutton said:


> If one is going to take advice, one should get it from those with experience.


Very much true... if one is open and accepting of it. I admit, I wasn't back then. Now, I am... 😀


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

Benbutton said:


> I'm going to make this as clear and simple for you as I possibly can:
> 
> 1. She has a history of cheating = she will cheat now and in the future.
> 
> ...





Benbutton said:


> Are you there for those"platonic" conversations?


No I am not there for the conversation. However, I told her to STOP communicating with whomever man she contacts via text unless she wants to end our relationship. You think she’ll stop or just continue?


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

She’s a serial cheater. They don’t just STOP because you said so. If that worked, I’d still be married.


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## A18S37K14H18 (Dec 14, 2021)

To me, this is an open and shut case. She should already be your EX-fiancée OP.


She has a history of cheating.
She stays outside in the car to communicate to her "friend".
She didn't just say no to you looking at her texts to her "friend", she became defensive and turned it on you, told you were being defensive. Just Google "DARVO" for what she was and is doing to you regarding this.
Oh and you are NOT yet married to this known cheater who is simply being who and what she is to right now.

This relationship should already be in your rear view mirror.

Oh, here is what DARVO stands for and is about.

*Definition of DARVO*
*DARVO* refers to a reaction perpetrators of wrong doing, particularly sexual offenders, may display in response to being held accountable for their behavior. DARVO stands for "Deny, Attack, and Reverse Victim and Offender." The perpetrator or offender may Deny the behavior, Attack the individual doing the confronting, and Reverse the roles of Victim and Offender such that the perpetrator assumes the victim role and turns the true victim -- or the whistle blower -- into an alleged offender. This occurs, for instance, when an actually guilty perpetrator assumes the role of "falsely accused" and attacks the accuser's credibility and blames the accuser of being the perpetrator of a false accusation.


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

I found out who she is contacting. It’s some guy who I don’t know, overweight , not good looking, and lives in a small little apartment. The texts are all platonic BUT she does text him everyday and the most recent text back said, “Thx❤u” whatever that means. He also knows I’m her fiancé and she keeps asking when we can all go out together. He also gave her a fake vaccination cards for her to use that she did use and told me a friend gave it to her. This guy is enjoying talking to her and she likes the attention. She also changed his name to “Simeon” in her phone and his name is Sebastian. I don’t get it? Why chat so much with him and no me? Why is he not a good looking successful guy, it’s insulting to me? Why bread crumb this guy ? Is this an attention seeking thing that she knows may be safe? My ex wife did the EXACT same thing and I let it go for months and they ended up sleeping together in a hotel.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

Jbird123 said:


> No I am not there for the conversation. However, I told her to STOP communicating with whomever man she contacts via text unless she wants to end our relationship. You think she’ll stop or just continue?


@Jbird123

You can not control her. You can't "make" her stop. SHE would have to want to stop for her to actually stop. She doesn't want to stop--you are trying to force her. So since she doesn't want to stop, chances are about 99.99% that she will continue and make some attempt to hide it better. Or DARVO you by denying that she's doing anything wrong, attacking you for finding her more hidden contact, and claiming that she is the victim of your crazy jealousy and you are the offender who's doing wrong. It would sound like this:

_"I'm not the one being a jerk here, Jbird, you are. All I'm doing is talking wth a friend! You're the one who doesn't trust me and went snooping through my things and invaded my privacy! That's so WRONG! YOU are the one destroying our relationship with your insane paranoia and jealousy, trying to tell me who I can and can't talk to! You're crazy! Get some help!"_

Yeah, don't fall for that. In a healthy relationship there is mutual transparency, and that means that both parties are open to each other and include the other in ALL ASPECTS of their life. They let they other see what they're doing, who they're doing it with, where they're doing it, why they're doing it, when it will start and finish, and just everything. Transparency means letting the significant other see their True Inner Self--thoughts and feelings, warts and all. When one party starts to exclude the other, that's a sign of deception.

Also don't be confused between *privacy *and *secrecy*. Privacy is closing the door when you're getting dressed or going to the bathroom. Secrecy is hiding who you really are or what you're really doing. Even in a marriage, people do appreciate some privacy--but there is absolutely NO room for secrecy in a close, intimate relationship.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> My ex wife did the EXACT same thing and I let it go for months and they ended up sleeping together in a hotel.


And this will happen here too (if it hasn't already). It's what serial cheaters do. RUN
EA=Emotional Affair
PA=Physical Affair


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

I just got this text from my fiancé 😳😳😳😳

“I can physically and sexually be with anyone without you ever knowing. If I want to, I can do it every day and every night and any time. There are so many ways to.

But I chose not to. That’s my choice. Not yours. Maybe 🤔 I’ll find someone who feels that we are compatible. And that’s okay.

I know im wasting my time for sure. Thanks for repeating that.”


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> I found out who she is contacting


You found out what she hadn't deleted. She left all the innocent clean stuff.

I bet there's a ton you don't know. Think Iceberg.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> I just got this text from my fiancé
> 
> “I can physically and sexually be with anyone without you ever knowing. If I want to, I can do it every day and every night and any time. There are so many ways to.
> 
> ...


That's a little confusing to me.
Is that a break up text?

Maybe saved you the trouble?

Do you feel manipulated yet? You should. That's what she's doing.

"You should love me because I haven't decided to cheat on you yet" or some such crap. Yea right.


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

Affaircare said:


> @Jbird123
> 
> You can not control her. You can't "make" her stop. SHE would have to want to stop for her to actually stop. She doesn't want to stop--you are trying to force her. So since she doesn't want to stop, chances are about 99.99% that she will continue and make some attempt to hide it better. Or DARVO you by denying that she's doing anything wrong, attacking you for finding her more hidden contact, and claiming that she is the victim of your crazy jealousy and you are the offender who's doing wrong. It would sound like this:
> 
> ...


Your quote of what she would say to me was soooooo exactly correct and almost word for word. I found out it is a guy that is interested in her about the texts are platonic. However, they don’t all read flowing as if some texts are deleted. The last one from her said, “Thx❤U” not in flowing context with what he said. Plus, his name is changed in her phone to Siemon and that’s not his name.


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Jbird123 said:


> I felt a little suspicious after she would sit in the car and chat with someone everyday for 15-20 minutes. I asked her why are you doing that, why not come inside and talk? She said it’s my sister and brother from overseas and I don’t want to lose the call going in the elevator. She then shows me the calls and she was talking to them. Then I asked to see her text messages. She flat out said, NO! Got extremely upset and gaslighted me saying you don’t trust me!! Screamed at me at length and I just said calmly, “you have full access to my phone and I don’t to yours, I rarely ask to see your phone”. She has a history of cheating on others, I’ve had to tell her before to stop texting old lovers and old boyfriends in the last 6 months too. She is not cheating on me physically yet, but I fear she has an emotional relationship with someone that is via text. Help


you are getting married to her, why ???


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

BeyondRepair007 said:


> That's a little confusing to me.
> Is that a break up text?
> 
> Maybe saved you the trouble?
> ...


Exactly. Dump her arse. Fast. Move on. This is a manipulative cheater.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Jbird123 said:


> I felt a little suspicious after she would sit in the car and chat with someone everyday for 15-20 minutes. I asked her why are you doing that, why not come inside and talk? She said it’s my sister and brother from overseas and I don’t want to lose the call going in the elevator. She then shows me the calls and she was talking to them. Then I asked to see her text messages. She flat out said, NO! Got extremely upset and gaslighted me saying you don’t trust me!! Screamed at me at length and I just said calmly, “you have full access to my phone and I don’t to yours, I rarely ask to see your phone”. She has a history of cheating on others, I’ve had to tell her before to stop texting old lovers and old boyfriends in the last 6 months too. She is not cheating on me physically yet, but I fear she has an emotional relationship with someone that is via text. Help


Dump her.


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## A18S37K14H18 (Dec 14, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> My ex wife did the EXACT same thing and I let it go for months and they ended up sleeping together in a hotel.


I'm sorry that happened to you. Like many on this site, I was cheated on too by my ex-husband.

You know what is going to happen if you remain with your fiancée OP.

It's a matter of when, not if.

It's also a matter of when you want to get out of this relationship... now or after she cheats on you, be it with this man or some other man.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Jbird123 said:


> I felt a little suspicious after she would sit in the car and chat with someone everyday for 15-20 minutes. I asked her why are you doing that, why not come inside and talk? She said it’s my sister and brother from overseas and I don’t want to lose the call going in the elevator. She then shows me the calls and she was talking to them. Then I asked to see her text messages. She flat out said, NO! Got extremely upset and gaslighted me saying you don’t trust me!! Screamed at me at length and I just said calmly, “you have full access to my phone and I don’t to yours, I rarely ask to see your phone”. She has a history of cheating on others, I’ve had to tell her before to stop texting old lovers and old boyfriends in the last 6 months too. She is not cheating on me physically yet, but I fear she has an emotional relationship with someone that is via text. Help


You didn't ask a question and you actually have all the answers anyway.

You can do better, right?


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## Benbutton (Oct 3, 2019)

Jbird123 said:


> No I am not there for the conversation. However, I told her to STOP communicating with whomever man she contacts via text unless she wants to end our relationship. You think she’ll stop or just continue?


Ummm...I'm going to go with just continue. She'll _tell you _she'll stop, but she won't.


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

wmn1 said:


> you are getting married to her, why ???


Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a great person and loves me a lot and I love her dearly. I just want her to change this behavior


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

You can _want_ her to change her behavior but that doesn’t mean she really _will_. My guess is you’ll marry her regardless of what you read here so good luck.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Jbird123 said:


> Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a great person and loves me a lot and I love her dearly. I just want her to change this behavior


Other than?

Wow just wow.


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## D0nnivain (Mar 13, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> However, I told her to STOP communicating with whomever man she contacts via text unless she wants to end our relationship. You think she’ll stop or just continue?


She won't stop. 




Jbird123 said:


> He also gave her a fake vaccination cards for her to use that she did use and told me a friend gave it to her. This guy is enjoying talking to her and she likes the attention. She also changed his name to “Simeon” in her phone and his name is Sebastian. I don’t get it? Why chat so much with him and no me? Why is he not a good looking successful guy, it’s insulting to me? * * * My ex wife did the EXACT same thing and I let it go for months and they ended up sleeping together in a hotel.


You have been down this road so you know how the story ends. Your FI wants attention & cares more about that than she cares about you. Does that really sound like a good foundation for marriage? 

She also has questionable ethics. This isn't about vaccines or not but LYING about your vaccination status is a real problem. It's also a felony at least in the US to use a fake vaccination card. 




Jbird123 said:


> Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a great person and loves me a lot and I love her dearly. I just want her to change this behavior


You can't go into a marriage hoping for change. That never works. The question has to be do you really want to be married to a woman who is secretive about her phone & constantly chatting with other guys behind your back? If you are OK with that head down the aisle. If not, make a different decision but assume she will not stop this behavior.


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## Diceplayer (Oct 12, 2019)

Jbird123 said:


> Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a great person and loves me a lot and I love her dearly. I just want her to change this behavior


Oh, so that's all that's wrong with her? Well, then all means, go marry her because she's a real catch. 

Dude, do you think so little of yourself that you are willing to settle for a woman like this? If you marry this woman then you deserve what you get. You'll be back here crying because she's banging every man in the building. She doesn't love you. She treats you like sh!t. Get out while you can.


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## rugswept (May 8, 2019)

History is known to repeat itself. 
In many games, and especially this one, past performance is the best predicter of future performance.


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## A18S37K14H18 (Dec 14, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a great person and loves me a lot and I love her dearly. I just want her to change this behavior


We get you want that. You want her to be the kind of partner you want, but the reality is that she isn't.

Honestly, what does love have to do with it?

I'm being serious. Love is NOT enough, it never has been and it never will be so the she loves you and you love her really shouldn't be a factor in this.

Many people love their partners but aren't in love with them.

Many people love their partners but don't like them.

And many folks love people who are NOT good for them, love is funny that way. People out there love folks who lie, cheat, steal, do drugs, who are abusive and on and on. Many love folks who they know aren't good for them.

So much more than love is needed for a couple to be happy in a long term romantic relationship.

Some final thoughts regarding love:

*Love is great. Love is necessary. Love is beautiful. But love is not enough.

In our culture, many of us idealize love. We see it as some lofty cure-all for all of life’s problems. Our movies and our stories and our history all celebrate it as life’s ultimate goal, the final solution for all of our pain and struggle. And because we idealize love, we overestimate it. As a result, our relationships pay a price.

When we believe that “all we need is love,” then like Lennon, we’re more likely to ignore fundamental values such as respect, humility, and commitment towards the people we care about. After all, if love solves everything, then why bother with all the other stuff—all of the hard stuff?

But if, like Reznor, we believe that “love is not enough,” then we understand that healthy relationships require more than pure emotion or lofty passions. We understand that there are things more important in our lives and our relationships than simply being in love. And the success of our relationships hinges on these deeper and more important values.
*
OP, it's great that she loves you love her, but it's not enough. While she loves you, she does not have the same fundamental values that you do regarding respect for you and commitment towards the person she loves (you), not the way you do for her.

There are times, many of them, that we should listen to our hearts, to love...

But there are times we shouldn't and this is one of those times for you OP. It's time for you to listen to logic and reason, to your head and not your heart. You're HOPING for an outcome you want while ignoring the red flags waving in your face.

It's time to deal with reality and not a wish, a hope or a dream.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a great person and loves me a lot and I love her dearly. I just want her to change this behavior


Often in marriage counseling a question is asked that I will ask you.

If she never changed anything about her personality or habits would you be ok with it?

If a woman was going to marry a heavy drinker but hated his drinking, should she count on changing him and marry him anyway?

And the downside in your case is that you know she is a cheater.

Is there anything that makes you think she won't cheat on you?
Other than that weird manipulation text she sent?

Look at what she does, not what she says.


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Jbird123 said:


> I felt a little suspicious after she would sit in the car and chat with someone everyday for 15-20 minutes. I asked her why are you doing that, why not come inside and talk? She said it’s my sister and brother from overseas and I don’t want to lose the call going in the elevator. She then shows me the calls and she was talking to them. Then I asked to see her text messages. She flat out said, NO! Got extremely upset and gaslighted me saying you don’t trust me!! Screamed at me at length and I just said calmly, “you have full access to my phone and I don’t to yours, I rarely ask to see your phone”. She has a history of cheating on others, I’ve had to tell her before to stop texting old lovers and old boyfriends in the last 6 months too. She is not cheating on me physically yet, but I fear she has an emotional relationship with someone that is via text. Help


You two are not a match. Who wants to live like that and I mean either one of you?


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## Mybabysgotit (Jul 1, 2019)

Jbird123 said:


> I just want her to change this behavior


You can "want" til your blue in the face, but the reality is until she "wants" she'll continue the behavior. See, some people have an ingrained need for external validation and they'll do anything for it. One of my Ex GF's had that, and I'm glad she did because without her, I would never be able to recognize the signs. Seems like you saw the signs with your first wife, but for some reason didn't take heed to them. Kind of mind blowing actually.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

Jbird123 said:


> Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a great person and loves me a lot and I love her dearly. I just want her to change this behavior


Look adults have free will. That means that they are capable of making very bad decisions.

Let me share a little experience from a 73 year old man who has been married to the same woman for over 50 years.


A key foundation of a long term marriage is commitment by both to that marriage and relationship.


Marriage is something that is very, very hard to do well.


A good marriage requires each of you to allow yourself to become vulnerable. That means to truly love you have to let down all your shields, emotional, financial, and physical. (Please think about this carefully)


Having children puts incredible stress on a marriage, and that stress and the aftermath of that stress causes many a marriage to fail, which is why two people need to be absolutely certain of their relationship before they marry.


A good marriage requires good communication between the partners and a willingness to negotiate on important items.

Now, I want you to read the above and note that not once did I say that sex was important, that beauty was important, or that being pleasant was important in a long term marriage. Long term successful marriages can be arranged marriages, they can be effectively business contracts, they can be even marriages of convenience. 

You need to figure out why this woman is your fiance and if you want to go forward with actually marrying her.

Look at her post where she talks about how she could cheat if she wanted and you should be grateful that she hasn't. Does that seem like what a woman who is committed to you and committed to a lifetime relationship with your would say or think? Perhaps ask her about your future wedding vows. Would she swear to "forsake all other men" as a condition of marriage? If she says yes, then tell her to practice that pledge by dropping contact with other men starting right now.

You can't change your fiance, only she can change herself. The engagement period is suppose to be a time of growing together and transitioning before marriage. Tell her to put up or shut up and leave. Tell her that you have doubts about marriage because of her behavior. Again, read the message she sent you and you posted about her being able to cheat but not having cheated and how you should be greatful. It shows where he mind is.

Good luck. I really want to advice you not to have children with this woman or unprotected sex until you are absolutely sure of her commitment to you and your relationship.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

If you get married you will severely regret it.
If she lived you she wouldn't be seeking attention from other men.


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## LATERILUS79 (Apr 1, 2021)

Dude. That text? She doesn’t respect you and thinks you are stupid. She definitely thinks she is better than you. On that principle alone I wouldn’t want to be with her.


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

BeyondRepair007 said:


> Often in marriage counseling a question is asked that I will ask you.
> 
> If she never changed anything about her personality or habits would you be ok with it?
> 
> ...


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> When I asked again to see he texts she threw her engagement ring at me hard af and it left a welt on my arm. 😩


The answer seems pretty clear to me how much she cares for you.

And hopefully by now your answer is clear too.

That whole drama was trying to get you to bend to her will and let her have affairs with whoever she wants.
Don't think otherwise.


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## LATERILUS79 (Apr 1, 2021)

Sounds like she did you a solid. Now you don’t have to lose all your money on that ring.

I don’t think she can give you any more indications that she isn’t wife material.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Jbird123 said:


> I found out who she is contacting. It’s some guy who I don’t know, overweight , not good looking, and lives in a small little apartment. The texts are all platonic BUT she does text him everyday and the most recent text back said, “Thx❤u” whatever that means. He also knows I’m her fiancé and she keeps asking when we can all go out together. He also gave her a fake vaccination cards for her to use that she did use and told me a friend gave it to her. This guy is enjoying talking to her and she likes the attention. She also changed his name to “Simeon” in her phone and his name is Sebastian. I don’t get it? Why chat so much with him and no me? Why is he not a good looking successful guy, it’s insulting to me? Why bread crumb this guy ? Is this an attention seeking thing that she knows may be safe? My ex wife did the EXACT same thing and I let it go for months and they ended up sleeping together in a hotel.


Why does any of this matter? You are not married to her. She has not chosen to be only with you. You have no boundaries, which is evident by the fact that you are still with her.
Why are you with her? Why? Why? Why? Please tell us what is so amazing about this manipulative, cheating woman that you have no trust for that you would marry her. Why on God's green earth would you marry someone that you do not trust? That makes zero sense.



Jbird123 said:


> When I asked again to see he texts she threw her engagement ring at me hard af and it left a welt on my arm. 😩


Do you still have it or did you give it back to her? I hope you still have it. Maybe you can trade it in for a nicer one when you find an honest, loving woman.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

@Jbird123 
As heartbreaking as all this is, you are really dodging some serious bullets here.

It's possible this will get worse before it gets better. She may not be done with you yet.
If she's a narcissist she will want you on a leash even after you kick her to the curb.
Don't let that happen!

You need to pull back away from her, take some time, hang with your friends for a while.
Maybe some counseling to help you recover from this and your prev marriage and figure out what tomorrow looks like?

Betrayal is a terrible thing and you seem pretty deeply invested in this...umm.. person.
You need to break those feels asap.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> When I asked again to see he texts she threw her engagement ring at me hard af and it left a welt on my arm. 😩


Just thinking about why this reaction, I would guess she hadn't had time to delete the newest texts.
If she gave you the phone, the jig would be up.

Just a hunch.
Not that it matters now.


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

I just texted the guy she was texting and told him I would literally KILL him if it continues to chat with her. I scared him and he told me everything. He’s in the friend zone for years now. Nothing but her bread crumbing him AND he didn’t know she was engaged. WTF. She never let him know????


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## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

She is shady AF. RUN before you end up with a broken heart and child support/alimony payments.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> I just texted the guy she was texting and told him I would literally KILL him if it continues to chat with her. I scared him and he told me everything. He’s in the friend zone for years now. Nothing but her bread crumbing him AND he didn’t know she was engaged. WTF. She never let him know????


2 things.

1. Don't believe him. He has no reason to tell you anything that would make you want to come after him
2. Who cares about him, your problem is HER


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## marko polo (Jan 26, 2021)

Get your engagement ring back from her and part ways. 

She will not change. She will likely get better at hiding her wayward behavior.


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## Lostinthought61 (Nov 5, 2013)

Jbird123 said:


> Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a great person and loves me a lot and I love her dearly. I just want her to change this behavior


your words reminds me of the frog and the scorpion fable 

_"A scorpion asks a frog to carry him over a river. The frog is afraid of being stung, but the scorpion argues that if it did so, both would sink and the scorpion would drown. The frog then agrees, but midway across the river the scorpion does indeed sting the frog, dooming them both. When asked why, the scorpion points out that this is its nature."_



I am guessing you are not doing a pre-nup where you will play her nothing if she cheats on you in any way. 





No offense Jbird but you are the definition of insanity expecting different results when you are dealing with the same problem her behavior. You have a known entity here, it is not a matter of if but when and when she does you can not blame her...you knew going into this marriage she was a cheater.


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## Rob_1 (Sep 8, 2017)

Jbird123 said:


> I just texted the guy she was texting and told him I would literally KILL him if it continues to chat with her. I scared him and he told me everything. He’s in the friend zone for years now. Nothing but her bread crumbing him AND he didn’t know she was engaged. WTF. She never let him know????


Listen dude: I'm not trying to be an asshole, but you come across as a pathetic, weak dude that most likely is so afraid to lose this woman that you actually are starting to sound like a 15 years old teen that can't let go of his first puppy love. You loving her dearly have nothing to do with your equation here. The equation is her behavior, and her lack of respect for you, while you are just sitting there taking it, and calling other dudes (that's pathetic) when the person you need to put in place is HER. The dude can be replaced by her at the flick of her fingers. 

She text you that she can go on ****ing anyone she wants without you ever finding. threw her ring at you, and you're still there???? dude, you lack character and self respect. We see lots of guys like you, ***** and moan about their woman flirting with other men, disrespecting, doing as they wish, and still those dude just like you won't dump them. So, I guess that deep down you know what's in store for you with this woman, but like all the other pathetic men, you will keep her, marry her, and forgive her when she cheats on you. 

When men show weakness of character, their women the first thing they do is disrespect them, then, they see how far they can go. You will know that she has lost all respect for you when after years of marriage she ask you for an open marriage, or some sort of **** like that. Enjoy the ride with her. I can see how fun it will be.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Mr.Married said:


> Dude !!! Wife that up immediately!!! There is no more fun than the fun of retaining a divorce lawyer!!! Get you some !!!!!!


It’s even more fun to think about or witness other dudes banging your wife. Abd they get rewarded with half your stuff or more even if they cheat. It’s an all around good time.
He needs to get paperwork on her fast! What a catch!!!!


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Jbird123 said:


> I just texted the guy she was texting and told him I would literally KILL him if it continues to chat with her. I scared him and he told me everything. He’s in the friend zone for years now. Nothing but her bread crumbing him AND he didn’t know she was engaged. WTF. She never let him know????


Congratulations, you have uncovered the tip of the iceberg


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Rob_1 said:


> She text you that she can go on ****ing anyone she wants without you ever finding.* threw her ring at you*, and you're still there????


She threw the ring at him? lol well that's one way to get it back, make her mad and she'll give you back the ring!


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Jbird123 said:


> I just texted the guy she was texting and told him I would literally KILL him if it continues to chat with her. I scared him and he told me everything. He’s in the friend zone for years now. Nothing but her bread crumbing him AND he didn’t know she was engaged. WTF. She never let him know????


So.... now you, in writing, threatened a man's life. Hm. Don't be surprised if you hear a knock on the door, "Open up, police." Threatening to kill someone is foolhardy. He certainly has enough for a restraining order. Your fiancée could also use it in the future to show that you have violent tendencies and make false domestic violence claims. You are digging your own hole here. This is what being in a relationship with this woman is doing to you. 

He is not the problem. Your fiancée is. She is manipulating you. I have a feeling that you'd stay with her if she actually was physically cheating on you. She would have some sad story or she'd turn it around on you and you'd be back here asking how you can please her, so she won't cheat.

I get it. You love her. But seriously, she is not good for you. She is not treating you in a loving manner. Who does that?! Someone that you can't trust, but you already know that because you don't trust her.

You want to know how you can change this? By leaving her. You cannot change how she is behaving. She has to do that and clearly she doesn't want to. Rather than take responsibility for herself, she is using DARVO. DARVO = Deny - Accuse - Reverse Victim and Offender. This is a clear indication that she has no intention of being a good mate. Instead she manipulates you.

The relationship is already fraught with trouble and you two are not married. Marriage is for two people who 100% have each other's backs and treat each other lovingly and respectfully. That is not what you have.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

What you are in love with is an image you have put together without enough substance... an illusion.

Once you have the substance in there I believe you will not see the result so attractive.

Let go of the things and people that hurt you.

Then begin the process of fixing your picker... this means *you* working on understanding why this would even begin to be a worthy choice as a life partner. 

It is worth the time...


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

GusPolinski said:


> Dump her.


That’s kinda vague. Do you mean he should stop dating her, take his ring back, or send her cheating self packing?
Why are you being so hard to understand?
😂


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

QuietGuy said:


> This is unlikely to get better. It will most likely end in heartbreak for you if you marry her. You should not have to ask her to drop exs. She should want to do that on her own. Drop her and find someone you don't have to police.


So far, I agree with everyone! This post really struck something in me though, and is spot-on. Your fiance should want to be with YOU, and you shouldn't have to ask her to not talk to her exes. If you do, that says a lot about her character, and how she feels about you. Personally, I would hightail it out of your engagement and relationship in general.


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> No I am not there for the conversation. However, I told her to STOP communicating with whomever man she contacts via text unless she wants to end our relationship. You think she’ll stop or just continue?


I think she'll continue. As long as it's working for her to have her cake and eat it too, why wouldn't she?


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## Marc878 (Aug 26, 2015)

Jbird123 said:


> I felt a little suspicious after she would sit in the car and chat with someone everyday for 15-20 minutes. I asked her why are you doing that, why not come inside and talk? She said it’s my sister and brother from overseas and I don’t want to lose the call going in the elevator. She then shows me the calls and she was talking to them. Then I asked to see her text messages. She flat out said, NO! Got extremely upset and gaslighted me saying you don’t trust me!! Screamed at me at length and I just said calmly, “you have full access to my phone and I don’t to yours, I rarely ask to see your phone”. She has a history of cheating on others, I’ve had to tell her before to stop texting old lovers and old boyfriends in the last 6 months too. She is not cheating on me physically yet, but I fear she has an emotional relationship with someone that is via text. Help


Good god! Why are you engaged to this? Are you that hard up?


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## ccpowerslave (Nov 21, 2020)

In Absentia said:


> Why people date former serial cheaters?


I know it’s like frosted shredded wheat. It looks like shredded wheat but in reality the flip side has a bunch of sugary glop on it.

Oh somehow I thought you meant cereal cheaters.


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

GusPolinski said:


> Dump her.





Evinrude58 said:


> That’s kinda vague. Do you mean he should stop dating her, take his ring back, or send her cheating self packing?
> Why are you being so hard to understand?
> 😂


Or, it could mean a date to the local garbage dump?


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> _*I just texted the guy she was texting and told him I would literally KILL him if it continues to chat with her. I scared him and he told me everything. He’s in the friend zone for years now. Nothing but her bread crumbing him AND he didn’t know she was engaged. WTF. She never let him know????*_


You've got yourself quite the catch there, don't you?

Either you're pulling our legs or you are just so desperate that you refuse to see how pitiful your situation actually IS.

Keep chasing a lying POS who can't even show you the same amount of respect that most of us show the common housefly. We'll see you back here in a couple of years when she's given you some dreadful STD that you'll keep for life and you've finally pulled your head out of the sand and admit we were all right about her.

In the meantime, at least try to find your pride for the love of god.


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## OddOne (Sep 27, 2018)

Marry her, and if she ever becomes pregnant, don't you dare question the paternity of the baby! You got yourself a real keeper. Nothing short of a divine goddess.


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a great person and loves me a lot


Ahhhh, that´s different....
Something like winged cows I gess


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

The ring left a welt on your arm……😝
That is classic.

“Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a_ great person and loves me a lot_”

Omg


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> I just texted the guy she was texting and told him I would literally KILL him if it continues to chat with her. I scared him and he told me everything. He’s in the friend zone for years now. Nothing but her bread crumbing him AND he didn’t know she was engaged. WTF. She never let him know????


More proof that she would make a terrible wife.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

TexasMom1216 said:


> There's no such thing is a "reformed" cheater, there's just someone who has better learned how to hide what they're doing.


There are actually a number of reformed cheaters on TAM and some of them give pretty good advice and one of them amazing advice.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

@Jbird123 I know it seems like we’re all piling on you with the same message.

But that’s just it. Remember where you are. We’ve all seen this story a thousand times and you’re at a pivotal point in this thing.

No one here wants you to endure pain. But not listening to this chorus of voices is a sure fire way to pile misery into your life.

Trust the collective wisdom here, even if it sounds like your situation is different.
It really isn’t.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Mr.Married said:


> There are actually a number of reformed cheaters on TAM and some of them give pretty good advice and one of them amazing advice.


I agree with this 100%.

I also agree that hoping a cheater will become reformed so one can have a happy marriage is a really really childish thing to do with almost zero chance of success.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Edited….

This guy isn’t stable… I’m out.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> No I am not there for the conversation. However, I told her to STOP communicating with whomever man she contacts via text unless she wants to end our relationship. You think she’ll stop or just continue?


Why would she stop? There are so many apps to carry on this type of thing that leaves no trace.


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## Asterix (May 16, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior. There's no such thing is a "reformed" cheater, there's just someone who has better learned how to hide what they're doing. Red flags, as far as the eye can see.


and



Mr.Married said:


> There are actually a number of reformed cheaters on TAM and some of them give pretty good advice and one of them amazing advice.


I suppose, a "reformed" cheater is not the same thing as a "former" cheater. A person, once a cheater will always be considered as such. They may do a significant amount of work on themselves and try to mend their ways, but it'll still be in them. It's somewhat like alcoholics. There's always the danger of a relapse.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a great person and loves me a lot and I love her dearly. I just want her to change this behavior


If she is doing this before you’re even married, she will never quit. She sees no problem with what she is doing. She doesn’t love you enough to stop.


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## A18S37K14H18 (Dec 14, 2021)

Mr.Married said:


> Are her tits that big ?


I'd like to think that never happens and isn't the case, but being that I'm in my 50's, I know better.

My first husband cheated, many times and 4 women, in particular, were that way for him. He couldn't think straight, act straight etc. due to the chests on Sue, Sarah, Michelle and especially Heather.

I doubt that's the case for OP, but sadly it does happen. 

None of us really know the reason for OP, but I'm leaning towards lack of self-confidence, lack of self-respect etc. It affects so many, both men and women and they put up with unimaginable things because of it.

In many respects, I was that way myself when I was young, in my teens and 20's and even into my 30's sadly. I was insecure, I had body image issues and I put up with things I shouldn't have from my first husband.

OP has to chart his own path, he's received a lot of great advice but he needs to make changes to himself.

If these things are true, it's him and not her. My point is that this lady being this way is on her of course, not OP. But the fact that OP is still with her, a lady like this, doing these things, is on him so he needs to work on himself, get himself to counseling and work on, identify and address the things, reasons and causes that have led him to be in the boat he currently finds himself in.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Asterix said:


> I suppose, a "reformed" cheater is not the same thing as a "former" cheater. A person, once a cheater will always be considered as such. They may do a significant amount of work on themselves and try to mend their ways, but it'll still be in them. It's somewhat like alcoholics. There's always the danger of a relapse.


Agreed. They’re just a cheater who is better at hiding and sneaking. You’re always having to wonder, to check up on them, to check their phone and track them. Doesn’t seem worth it to me. If someone wants to cheat, they will, and nothing will stop them. Best to cut bait and run. Let them become someone else’s problem.


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## Casual Observer (Sep 13, 2012)

Jbird123 said:


> I just texted the guy she was texting and told him I would literally KILL him if it continues to chat with her. I scared him and he told me everything. He’s in the friend zone for years now. Nothing but her bread crumbing him AND he didn’t know she was engaged. WTF. She never let him know????


Cheating on a boyfriend or girlfriend ONCE might be a mistake that one learns from. More than once? You've got to be kidding. The odds are HORRIBLE that cheating is out of their system. It's who they are. Cheating is an entirely different animal that having many sexual partners. You shouldn't shame someone for their choice of sexual lifestyle, which might change over time anyway. Cheating is a frame of mind, allowing yourself to not consider consequences to others of inherently selfish actions. 

We make such a huge deal of infidelity in marriage, so big a deal, I think we overlook the importance of cheating in dating. Again, once could be a teachable moment. A pattern is another thing entirely.

Run. Away. The problem is not the guys. It's her.


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## Asterix (May 16, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Agreed. They’re just a cheater who is better at hiding and sneaking. You’re always having to wonder, to check up on them, to check their phone and track them. Doesn’t seem worth it to me. If someone wants to cheat, they will, and nothing will stop them. Best to cut bait and run. Let them become someone else’s problem.


I agree completely. It is taxing to act as the jailer/warden for another person. There's always that subtle tipping point which changes the viewpoint towards the BS's behavior as controlling and oppressive. They don't think what it is that they did that brought them to this place.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Jbird123 said:


> No I am not there for the conversation. However, I told her to STOP communicating with whomever man she contacts via text unless she wants to end our relationship. You think she’ll stop or just continue?


Umm, are you a little Pillsbury dough boy? A little poo?

Why are you even taking time to consider this lizard you are currently with?

It kind of reeks of desperation.

Why don't you go find yourself a human woman to date?


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## Talker67 (Apr 7, 2016)

your gut is telling you who she is texting. you do not need to actually read the texts.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Jbird123 said:


> Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a great person and loves me a lot and I love her dearly. I just want her to change this behavior


So you're kind of like an unarmed police officer? You say stop or you'll say stop again?

What repercussions is she facing for not stopping?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Jbird123 said:


> I just texted the guy she was texting and told him I would literally KILL him if it continues to chat with her. I scared him and he told me everything. He’s in the friend zone for years now. Nothing but her bread crumbing him AND he didn’t know she was engaged. WTF. She never let him know????


Derp derp derp....


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Hottest threads on this forum are always the ones with the easiest solutions yet the most stubborn of OPs.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Evinrude58 said:


> That’s kinda vague. Do you mean he should stop dating her, take his ring back, or send her cheating self packing?
> Why are you being so hard to understand?
> 😂


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

ConanHub said:


> Umm, are you a little Pillsbury dough boy? A little poo?
> 
> Why are you even taking time to consider this lizard you are currently with?
> 
> ...


Because there are absolutely NO women that are faithful. I haven’t met one. They all **** around. All of them


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

Asterix said:


> I agree completely. It is taxing to act as the jailer/warden for another person. There's always that subtle tipping point which changes the viewpoint towards the BS's behavior as controlling and oppressive. They don't think what it is that they did that brought them to this place.


Absolutely! I feel like I had to teach her how to be in a relationship. She wanted to get married too. Too much training for someone who use to be a SWINGER. No joke. She was a swinger and had been begging me to go . It’s just not me. I don’t want to share my woman ,


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## NotEZ (Sep 23, 2012)

Jbird123 said:


> Absolutely! I feel like I had to teach her how to be in a relationship. She wanted to get married too. Too much training for someone who use to be a SWINGER. No joke. She was a swinger and had been begging me to go . It’s just not me. I don’t want to share my woman ,


Then find a woman that doesnt want that either....

This is not that one.

Sent from my SM-G781W using Tapatalk


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## DownByTheRiver (Jul 2, 2020)

Swingers shouldn't get married. Swingers should stay single and have fun. We need to face that this is never going to work.


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## Beach123 (Dec 6, 2017)

Jbird123 said:


> Your quote of what she would say to me was soooooo exactly correct and almost word for word. I found out it is a guy that is interested in her about the texts are platonic. However, they don’t all read flowing as if some texts are deleted. The last one from her said, “Thx❤U” not in flowing context with what he said. Plus, his name is changed in her phone to Siemon and that’s not his name.


Why are you even still with her? You can not marry her… your life will be hell every single day!!! 

Just tell her to move now!


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## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Jbird123 said:


> Because there are absolutely NO women that are faithful. I haven’t met one. They all **** around. All of them


ALL the women in my life have been faithful, we all broke up for all sorts of reasons but infidelity was never an issue, whether physical or emotional. None of us even got close to such things.

Yes, cheaters comprise ALOT of people, even the majority. Cheaters are TYPE - but your problem is not only do you not know how to separate the wheat from the chaff - but even if you do - you simply do not have the backbone or strength to enforce your boundaries and hence you will only encourage infidelity, dishonesty and outright disrespect from your partners.



Jbird123 said:


> She faces no repercussions, I may just kill myself. I may jump off my 47 th floor balcony or shoot myself with my .38 . Not sure yet


Of course she faces no repercussions. That's your plan? To kill yourself? 🤦‍♂️

You think that makes you man worthy of respect?


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> Because there are absolutely NO women that are faithful. I haven’t met one. They all **** around. All of them


Total nonsense. Loads of people are faithful, both men and women. 
How about you stop making excuses to stay with a cheater and liar and actually find a faithful woman.
Just because the small number you have dated have cheated you are claiming that ALL have cheated? 

If you marry this person your life will be awful. Do you really want a liar and cheat to be the mother of your children?


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> Because there are absolutely NO women that are faithful. I haven’t met one. They all **** around. All of them


Exception made of " I haven’t met one.", IMO you are wrong


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## manwithnoname (Feb 3, 2017)

ConanHub said:


> *Pillsbury dough boy*?


 I knew it!


----------



## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

This is a very simple equation.
The op is dating a hot woman, the hottest woman who has ever given him the time of day. She is also a serial cheat and a manipulative shrew. 
He will do anything, forgive anything, past, present or future to stay with her. 
The only thing that niggles him is her sexting her other guys while he’s sitting beside her. If she would do it in private he would be happy. To him ignorance is bliss.
Anyone who actually thinks he would dump her are fooling themselves, he’s going nowhere.
@Jbird123 let me give you a piece of advice. Never mistaken beauty with goodness.


----------



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Jbird123 said:


> She faces no repercussions, I may just kill myself. I may jump off my 47 th floor balcony or shoot myself with my .38 . Not sure yet


If you aren't being glib, you need far more help than we can offer and you have bigger problems than a ridiculous woman.


----------



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Jbird123 said:


> Because there are absolutely NO women that are faithful.  I haven’t met one. They all **** around. All of them


Ok. So with this worldview, you believe that you have to try and change the one you're with since all women are like this.

It is apparent to this barbarian that all the changes in your life need to be in you.

My suggestion is to drop the lizard and don't pick up another one.

Work on yourself and improve your life.

What are some details about yourself so I can have an idea about some paths you could take?

There are lots of unfaithful folks out there and of course a lot of them are women.

There are also a lot of solid grown ups who don't play around.

I've been with Mrs. C for 30 years and I have not had to worry about her fidelity.


----------



## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> She faces no repercussions, I may just kill myself. I may jump off my 47 th floor balcony or shoot myself with my .38 . Not sure yet


Hurting yourself is the wrong kind of repercussions for her.
Im hoping you said this because you’re lashing out.

Well stop it. Get your head straight.
Be a man and do the right thing.
You need distance from this poisonous woman

Every woman is not her.
At one point in my life I would have said the same thing.
But it was driven by pain, anger, fear.
It’s not the truth.


----------



## theloveofmylife (Jan 5, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> You think she’ll stop or just continue?


No, she'll just hide it better, which is much easier to do this day and age.



Jbird123 said:


> I just got this text from my fiancé 😳😳😳😳
> 
> “I can physically and sexually be with anyone without you ever knowing. If I want to, I can do it every day and every night and any time. There are so many ways to.
> 
> But I chose not to. That’s my choice. Not yours. Maybe 🤔 I’ll find someone who feels that we are compatible. And that’s okay.


RUN!


----------



## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

DownByTheRiver said:


> Swingers shouldn't get married. Swingers should stay single and have fun. We need to face that this is never going to work.


exactly !!!! I have no idea how people handle their spouse in the other room getting drilled. It is a sign of weakness to be cuckolded like that. I agree. Swingers shouldn't get married. If you can't have fidelity, then why pretend that your marriage is real ? 

If I wanted that type of lifestyle, I would just go ahead and stay single and find someone who used to be an escort or prostitute. They are probably better looking and better in the sack and when she ultimately falls for someone a lot better than you in those categories, you can wash your hands of her and not lose half of your stuff. 

Fortunately, I think that lifestyle is too disgusting that I won't ever do it but also will never talk to people that do

As Rob_1 said, you have to find some degree of self esteem or self worth. Go to counseling and read. Counseling for you, not for her. Wash your hands of her


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## Works (Apr 3, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> Because there are absolutely NO women that are faithful. I haven’t met one. They all **** around. All of them


Please don't box us in as not being faithful because of your experience with one person. Also, I saw your post threatening to hurt yourself... take it from me (who tried because he egged me on and I'm still here for some reason)... NO ONE in this world is worth doing that for!! If that person is making you feel that way, it's best to run from them.


----------



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Jbird123 said:


> I just got this text from my fiancé 😳😳😳😳
> 
> “I can physically and sexually be with anyone without you ever knowing. If I want to, I can do it every day and every night and any time. There are so many ways to.
> 
> ...


She seems to be as high on the social ladder as a goat in heat. Her parents must be proud.....


----------



## D0nnivain (Mar 13, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> I just texted the guy she was texting and told him I would literally KILL him if it continues to chat with her.





Jbird123 said:


> I may just kill myself. I may jump off my 47 th floor balcony or shoot myself with my .38 . Not sure yet


Nobody has to die here. Do not kill the other guy, her or yourself Just break up with her. When you do, most of your problems will be over & you will feel so much better in the long run.



Jbird123 said:


> I feel like I had to teach her how to be in a relationship. She wanted to get married too. Too much training for someone who use to be a SWINGER. No joke. She was a swinger and had been begging me to go . It’s just not me. I don’t want to share my woman ,


When you have to teach an adult how to behave as an adult you are already in trouble. 

You need to face the fact that she will never be satisfied with only one partner. She likes the openness of multiple partners. You aren't enough for you. That is not a crack against you. It's just how she is wired. 

If you marry you will be divorced within 2 years, if that.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> She faces no repercussions, I may just kill myself. *I may jump *off my 47 th floor balcony or shoot myself with my .38 . Not sure yet





Jbird123 said:


> Because *there are absolutely NO women that are faithful.* I haven’t met one. They all **** around. All of them





Jbird123 said:


> Absolutely! I feel like I had to teach her how to be in a relationship. She wanted to get married too. Too much training for someone who use to be a *SWINGER*. No joke. She was a swinger and had been begging me to go . It’s just not me. I don’t want to share my woman ,


You keep adding in more *red flags* to your thread!
Why is this? 

It is not only her that has problems.

It is you, that must get serious counseling.
Long term counseling.

You need to stay away from women.
Sorry, you are not ready for _prime time._

There is no shame in being single, and remaining single.

You cannot _train_ a fellow human, as one does a dog.



_Lilith-_


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> Because there are absolutely NO women that are faithful. I haven’t met one. They all **** around. All of them


Now stop that. You know that isn’t true. I know you’re hurting so I get where you are emotionally, but you know better than that. Walk away from this poison woman and take some time for yourself to figure out why you pick bad women. 

I speak from experience, sweetie. I had to do the same thing after a broken engagement. I thought all men were my father. So I started making changes in the way I met people and what questions I asked and my next serious relationship is in its 17th year, married for 14 with one child. You’re going to be fine, give yourself some time and grace to heal and start again.


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

Andy1001 said:


> This is a very simple equation.
> The op is dating a hot woman, the hottest woman who has ever given him the time of day. She is also a serial cheat and a manipulative shrew.
> He will do anything, forgive anything, past, present or future to stay with her.
> The only thing that niggles him is her sexting her other guys while he’s sitting beside her. If she would do it in private he would be happy. To him ignorance is bliss.
> ...


I totally went overboard.. I called the police on her for abuse then I filed a report. However I still want her back. I am dependent on her and it’s insane. I cannot break this dependency.


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

She doesn’t see she did anything wrong. She said she didn’t physically cheat NOR had an emotional affair. She thinks I am crazy for blaming her for something she never did. She threw my engagement ring at me and it broke my heart. All I wanted was to see her text messages because I was suspicious. This escalated to me calling the police yesterday. The cops almost arrested me because her and her daughter flipped the script on me and it’s two against one. They lied and threw me under the bus.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Asterix said:


> and
> 
> 
> 
> I suppose, a "reformed" cheater is not the same thing as a "former" cheater. A person, once a cheater will always be considered as such. They may do a significant amount of work on themselves and try to mend their ways, but it'll still be in them. It's somewhat like alcoholics. There's always the danger of a relapse.


I’m honestly not sure if that’s accurate. May be.
But thinking that a person is immune to ever cheating is likely far fetched thinking. If the right set of circumstances occurred, the temptation to cheat may be great. I think an honorable person keeps themselves out of temptation. But I do believe a person that’s truly sorry and repentant for what they did, could possibly be even more resistant to cheating than the average person who just never had any temptation.

I never had a serious temptation in my 24 years of marriage. I had a few attractive women let me know they had interest, but as a whole, the people who knew me (that might get close enough emotionally to cause significant temptation), knew I wasn’t about to do that and would likely give a scolding over it. Or it could be that my Olympic level RBF helped.

But I don’t think I’m invulnerable. 
anotger thread where a woman fell for a gun rat… I think that’s really pathetic. She had no common sense to keep putting herself in a situation where she found that loser attractive and eventually got attention from him.
Another thread where a high drive woman banged her “old friend” whom her husband hated— again, she asked for that crap.
I think there are situations where a cheater could be truly remorseful and change for good.

However, I’m also if the opinion that once a woman cheats, her love for her spouse will never, ever return to where it should be, and the chance of a repeat cheating performance is even higher than in the first place.

rant over.


----------



## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

She is extremely hot and much younger than me. 15 years younger. I’m in an unhealthy relationship that I cannot get out of.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Jbird123 said:


> She doesn’t see she did anything wrong. She said she didn’t physically cheat NOR had an emotional affair. She thinks I am crazy for blaming her for something she never did. She threw my engagement ring at me and it broke my heart. All I wanted was to see her text messages because I was suspicious. This escalated to me calling the police yesterday. The cops almost arrested me because her and her daughter flipped the script on me and it’s two against one. They lied and threw me under the bus.


Good God. You called the cops? Are you daft?
If you stay with this chick, you deserve everything you get. Plain and simple.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> She is extremely hot and much younger than me. 15 years younger. I’m in an unhealthy relationship that I cannot get out of.


🙄 Along with that young, hot ass you have a young, immature and very entitled brain. If all you’re looking for in a relationship is a hot ass then that is what you will get. I can’t believe you’re blaming all women when you’ve very clearly made a deliberate choice. 

One time my husband said to me that the thing about dating strippers is that at 2 am they’re a sex goddess, but at 9 am they’re a hooker with a coke problem and mental issues. You’re getting what you signed up for here.


----------



## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

You don’t want out so continue on.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

You can break it, you choose not to.


----------



## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> She is extremely hot and much younger than me. 15 years younger. I’m in an unhealthy relationship that I cannot get out of.


so what, she is insane.
It never ceases to amaze me what a some guys will put up with just to be with an attractive lady.


----------



## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Openminded said:


> You don’t want out so continue on.


Yes. She's hot, so it doesn't matter if she's toxic, just stay with her, because, hot. Because that's really the only thing that matters in life. 

But stop complaining.


----------



## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> She is extremely hot and much younger than me. 15 years younger. I’m in an unhealthy relationship that I cannot get out of.


Yes you can. She's already told you she can eff whomever and whenever she wants, it is only matter of time till she does. She already threw your ring at you, so good news is money didn't get flushed. Thank your lucky stars this came out before you got married.

And stop the suicidal thoughts. If they are real, then please seek professional help asap.1-800-273-8255


----------



## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

You get what you pay for — one way or the other — so no point in complaining about it.


----------



## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

You need this bro:








guess which zone you’re in?
fyi
It’s the danger zone.


----------



## Works (Apr 3, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> She is extremely hot and much younger than me. 15 years younger. I’m in an unhealthy relationship that I cannot get out of.


Yes, you most definitely can..


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Jbird123 said:


> She doesn’t see she did anything wrong. She said she didn’t physically cheat NOR had an emotional affair. She thinks I am crazy for blaming her for something she never did. She threw my engagement ring at me and it broke my heart. All I wanted was to see her text messages because I was suspicious. This escalated to me calling the police yesterday. The cops almost arrested me because her and her daughter flipped the script on me and it’s two against one. They lied and threw me under the bus.


You NEED to get away from them. WHY would you put up with this?
If you are so dependent on her, read the book "Co-dependent no more" and/or see a counselor to get you past your co-dependency.
She is NOT compatible with you -- her idea of compatibility is a guy who lets her go bang other guys and just waits around for her to return -- do you REALLY want to be that guy? That is what you are looking forward to.

GREAT that she gave you back the engagement ring -- make sure you keep it that way, call off any/all plans for marriage, and stop talking with her.

She may look beautiful, but inside she is NOT.
Stop hanging on to the IMAGE you have of her -- she is showing you who she really is -- take off the rose-colored glasses and see how awful she is for you.


----------



## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

He’s gonna work it and she’s gonna make some changes and be a perfect wife. 

But she is already a good shot with rings, and I think I’d keep her away from knifes and guns.

side note: Some cultures aspire to marry virgins. You’ve definitely gone the other direction here.

btw, tell me her name isn’t Tiffany.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

@Jbird123, Based on what you have said here, you believe that all women are cheaters, but you want your woman to be faithful. You are trying to take a woman who is/was a known serial cheater and make her into a faithful woman. The problem is that you cannot make her into anything. She is showing all the signs of an unrepentant cheater, whether she has cheated on your or not. She is still showing the mindset of a cheater, which makes it almost 100% probable that she will cheat on you, if she hasn't already. You don't think she has, but you don't really know that. She's already showing signs of cheating.

The guy that you spoke to may be telling the truth, but that only makes this a deeper well. She can use that to further manipulate you and mess with your mind.

The problem here is within your mind. You think you cannot live without her. That is a lie. You thing you can change her. That is a lie. The problem is that you have been believing lies. In order to be healthy, you have got to start believing the truth and to act upon it.


----------



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Jbird123 said:


> She is extremely hot and much younger than me. 15 years younger. I’m in an unhealthy relationship that I cannot get out of.


There are also some very attractive, older, women who are also not crazy cheaters.

Improve yourself and you will have a better chance of meeting one.


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Jbird123 said:


> She doesn’t see she did anything wrong. She said she didn’t physically cheat NOR had an emotional affair. She thinks I am crazy for blaming her for something she never did. She threw my engagement ring at me and it broke my heart. All I wanted was to see her text messages because I was suspicious. This escalated to me calling the police yesterday. The cops almost arrested me because her and her daughter flipped the script on me and it’s two against one. They lied and threw me under the bus.


don't go through the cops. Go through the commissioner's office if you live in the US or a Family Law Court.

In most cases, police will not arrest someone over a misdemeanor not committed in their presence. However, she lied to you again and is now physically abusing you.

You are glutton for punishment by keeping her around but you still don't listen to the people here. 

So, you want us to advise you on how to eat a crap sandwich and come out smelling like Downy. It's not going to happen


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Jbird123 said:


> She is extremely hot and much younger than me. 15 years younger. I’m in an unhealthy relationship that I cannot get out of.


why can't you get out of it ??

You can but you refuse. You have nothing to lose. 

You marry her, you are screwed. Your life will be toast


----------



## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Evinrude58 said:


> I’m honestly not sure if that’s accurate. May be.
> But thinking that a person is immune to ever cheating is likely far fetched thinking. If the right set of circumstances occurred, the temptation to cheat may be great. I think an honorable person keeps themselves out of temptation. But I do believe a person that’s truly sorry and repentant for what they did, could possibly be even more resistant to cheating than the average person who just never had any temptation.
> 
> I never had a serious temptation in my 24 years of marriage. I had a few attractive women let me know they had interest, but as a whole, the people who knew me (that might get close enough emotionally to cause significant temptation), knew I wasn’t about to do that and would likely give a scolding over it. Or it could be that my Olympic level RBF helped.
> ...



very well spoken and extremely true


----------



## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

Sometimes I think I blew this out of proportion. She was texting a few guys, old lovers a few months ago. Now she’s texting someone new. However, we live together and we work together and go everywhere together. The chances of cheating are almost impossible. I think she just likes the attention from other men. I don’t like it at all and I think of it as emotional cheating. But if it’s not physical, then is there harm?? Is it just me? Maybe I shouldn’t be hurt by this and I’m being irrational.


----------



## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> Sometimes I think I blew this out of proportion. She was texting a few guys, old lovers a few months ago. Now she’s texting someone new. However, we live together and we work together and go everywhere together. The chances of cheating are almost impossible. I think she just likes the attention from other men. I don’t like it at all and I think of it as emotional cheating. But if it’s not physical, then is there harm?? Is it just me? Maybe I shouldn’t be hurt by this and I’m being irrational.


If it makes you uncomfortable then it is wrong. It is one of your boundaries. I believe it does fall into the category of emotional affair. With the right person an EA can easily go physical and likely will. Especially when it is with a past lover. Here's the thing with boundaries though. They don't mean a thing if you don't enforce them. If it really is a hard boundary for you that she doesn't have personal conversations with other men then tell her that and leave her if she chooses not to agree with the boundary.


----------



## thunderchad (12 mo ago)

Do not marry this woman. She's already lying and emotionally cheating!


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> Sometimes I think I blew this out of proportion. She was texting a few guys, old lovers a few months ago. Now she’s texting someone new. However, we live together and we work together and go everywhere together. The chances of cheating are almost impossible. I think she just likes the attention from other men. I don’t like it at all and I think of it as emotional cheating. But if it’s not physical, then is there harm?? Is it just me? Maybe I shouldn’t be hurt by this and I’m being irrational.


Emotional cheating can be just as bad if not worse. Yes she likes the attention of other men and will carry on liking the attention. 
You are free to ignore the red flags, I mean you aren't even married yet and she can't stop texting other men, but we here all know you will regret it.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> Sometimes I think I blew this out of proportion. She was texting a few guys, old lovers a few months ago. Now she’s texting someone new. However, we live together and we work together and go everywhere together. The chances of cheating are almost impossible. I think she just likes the attention from other men. I don’t like it at all and I think of it as emotional cheating. But if it’s not physical, then is there harm?? Is it just me? Maybe I shouldn’t be hurt by this and I’m being irrational.


Now you’re talking yourself into staying because she’s hot.


----------



## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

Cynthia said:


> @Jbird123, Based on what you have said here, you believe that all women are cheaters, but you want your woman to be faithful. You are trying to take a woman who is/was a known serial cheater and make her into a faithful woman. The problem is that you cannot make her into anything. She is showing all the signs of an unrepentant cheater, whether she has cheated on your or not. She is still showing the mindset of a cheater, which makes it almost 100% probable that she will cheat on you, if she hasn't already. You don't think she has, but you don't really know that. She's already showing signs of cheating.
> 
> The guy that you spoke to may be telling the truth, but that only makes this a deeper well. She can use that to further manipulate you and mess with your mind.
> 
> The problem here is within your mind. You think you cannot live without her. That is a lie. You thing you can change her. That is a lie. The problem is that you have been believing lies. In order to be healthy, you have got to start believing the truth and to act upon it.


Now she is taking to her ex lover that still wants her back. She sublets her old place to him and he pays her rent and she’s like his landlord. Complicated. She has him on speaker and they’ve been chatting for a while now. It platonic but it hurts me. They are talking about current events, his new girlfriend, rent, etc


----------



## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Now you’re talking yourself into staying because she’s hot.


No I am just in love, I just want to know I am wrong or in the right? Am I overacting?


----------



## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

I feel like maybe I’m too sensitive, jealous and insecure. I am trying to change her into what I feel is correct relationship behavior and it’s not working. Maybe it’s me? Please tell me if I am overacting. Is it acceptable to text other men and bread crumb them but not be with them just to fill a void for her?? She keeps telling me I am overreacting. She say you NEED to trust me! Yet it’s so hard for me when I get hurt when she lies to me, texts other guys and chats with her ex a lot.


----------



## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

BigDaddyNY said:


> If it makes you uncomfortable then it is wrong. It is one of your boundaries. I believe it does fall into the category of emotional affair. With the right person an EA can easily go physical and likely will. Especially when it is with a past lover. Here's the thing with boundaries though. They don't mean a thing if you don't enforce them. If it really is a hard boundary for you that she doesn't have personal conversations with other men then tell her that and leave her if she chooses not to agree with the boundary.


I’ve told her several times my boundaries and she stops for while and then does it again. She says my boundaries are not valid.


----------



## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> I think she just likes the attention from other men


This will not getter and will eventually lead to letting another man give her all the “attention” he wants. Then you’ll be out and he will be in. Pardon the pun.



Jbird123 said:


> Is it acceptable to text other men and bread crumb them but not be with them just to fill a void for her??


It’s not acceptable, no. But you know that already.
Exactly this behavior has destroyed relationships purely because it WILL escalate to more.


----------



## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> I’ve told her several times my boundaries and she stops for while and then does it again. She says my boundaries are not valid.


So enforce your boundaries, otherwise they just ’suggestions’


----------



## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> I’ve told her several times my boundaries and she stops for while and then does it again. She says my boundaries are not valid.


Your boundaries are yours alone. They are valid because they belong to you. If she doesn’t agree then you’re not compatible. The same would be true about her boundaries.

But all this talk is just her manipulating you to get the freedom to hump whoever she wants while having you to pay the bills.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> I’ve told her several times my boundaries and she stops for while and then does it again. She says my boundaries are not valid.


Imagine if a man told a woman “your boundaries are not valid.” (Absent religious aspects, no T/Jing with that) Imagine your sister came to you and said, “I told him no, but he said my boundaries weren’t valid.” How mad would you be? Dude. She is telling you, point blank, she has no respect for your feelings or for you. When someone tells you who they are, believe them. I hate to give up on you, but I’m about there. It is not possible she is THIS hot that you’re ruining you life for her.


----------



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Jbird123 said:


> Sometimes I think I blew this out of proportion. She was texting a few guys, old lovers a few months ago. Now she’s texting someone new. However, we live together and we work together and go everywhere together. The chances of cheating are almost impossible. I think she just likes the attention from other men. I don’t like it at all and I think of it as emotional cheating. But if it’s not physical, then is there harm?? Is it just me? Maybe I shouldn’t be hurt by this and I’m being irrational.


Dude, her attitude sucks cheese balls.

I'm married to a grown ass woman and she has never tried to pull the juvenile crap your girlfriend has.

If she had behaved that way, she wouldn't have gotten her Mrs. Conan trophy.


----------



## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> She is extremely hot and much younger than me. 15 years younger. I’m in an unhealthy relationship that I cannot get out of.


You have now solved that hot problem of hers......

She is now going to be cold to you, in your absence.
In your absence, life plods on.

Live and learn, not, yearn and dive.

See a doctor, you must get yourself stable.

Are you presently taking any medications, or, are you self medicating on anything?
This is an important question, do not take it personal.



_KB-_


----------



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Her spirit animal...


----------



## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Now you’re talking yourself into staying because she’s hot.


Absolutely!


----------



## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> No I am just in love, I just want to know I am wrong or in the right? Am I overacting?


Love is never enough. Read back over all the replies you have had, you have been told what to do repeatedly.


----------



## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> I’ve told her several times my boundaries and she stops for while and then does it again. She says my boundaries are not valid.


You are not keeping your boundaries. She faces no consequences. 
She rides roughshod over you and disrespects you by saying your boundaries aren't valid.


----------



## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

The feelings that you have for this woman are not love. It’s lust. And it’s clouded your judgement. She’s done nothing lovable toward you. Sex is NOT love.


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Evinrude58 said:


> Good God. You called the cops? Are you daft?
> If you stay with this chick, you deserve everything you get. Plain and simple.
> View attachment 84019


OMG 
HAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA


----------



## RandomDude (Dec 18, 2010)

Jbird123 said:


> Sometimes I think I blew this out of proportion. She was texting a few guys, old lovers a few months ago. Now she’s texting someone new. However, we live together and we work together and go everywhere together. The chances of cheating are almost impossible. I think she just likes the attention from other men. I don’t like it at all and I think of it as emotional cheating. But if it’s not physical, then is there harm?? Is it just me? Maybe I shouldn’t be hurt by this and I’m being irrational.


_sigh_
What a waste of time.

Oh well, carry on.


----------



## Diceplayer (Oct 12, 2019)

RandomDude said:


> _sigh_
> What a waste of time.
> 
> Oh well, carry on.


Agree. I'm out.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

I think a picture is needed, because the level of hotness that would inspire a man to tolerate this amount of crazy……….. Helen of Troy’s face launched a thousand ships…..
This “lady” should have a face that would launch the Spanish Armada, the British navy, etc……. To be able to keep a man wanting to marry her after all this.

OP, are you paying all the bills and she lives with you for free? I was just told that some women have “stepping stone N’s”. They use them for money and stuff and all the while looking for their next man. I think you might be her stepping stone dude,


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

Evinrude58 said:


> I think a picture is needed, because the level of hotness that would inspire a man to tolerate this amount of crazy……….. Helen of Troy’s face launched a thousand ships…..
> This “lady” should have a face that would launch the Spanish Armada, the British navy, etc……. To be able to keep a man wanting to marry her after all this.
> 
> OP, are you paying all the bills and she lives with you for free? I was just told that some women have “stepping stone N’s”. They use them for money and stuff and all the while looking for their next man. I think you might be her stepping stone dude,


She makes $110k per year. She get complimented on her beauty at least 10 times a day. That’s what makes it so hard to leave her


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

Jbird123 said:


> She makes $110k per year. She get complimented on her beauty at least 10 times a day. That’s what makes it so hard to leave her


Then carry on. 

Enjoy 😆

You deserve what you get!!!


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## Trident (May 23, 2018)

In before the lock!


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Jbird123 said:


> She makes $110k per year. She get complimented on her beauty at least 10 times a day. That’s what makes it so hard to leave her


But are you happy? I’d rather have a homely woman that needed me a little and treated my well—- that I didn’t have to share.
I know a beautiful woman that you are in love with is a terribly hard spell to break. But surely you realize after her throwing that ring at you and nearly getting you thrown in jail, that it’s really not up to you. She loves herself.
She likely never will love you. She’s going to cheat on you and likely is already. You do realize she’s not going to just up and tell you she’s banging other dudes, right?


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> She makes $110k per year. She get complimented on her beauty at least 10 times a day. That’s what makes it so hard to leave her


So she has money and superficial beauty but is an absolutely horrible person. Makin’ your own bed here. Can’t help someone who doesn’t want help.


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## BigDaddyNY (May 19, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> She makes $110k per year. She get complimented on her beauty at least 10 times a day. That’s what makes it so hard to leave her


Wow! Except for the cheating thing you hit the jackpot!


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> She makes $110k per year. She get complimented on her beauty at least 10 times a day. That’s what makes it so hard to leave her


You better start skimming some of that cash though cause when she meets the next Mr Right you don’t want to be left out in the cold. Well… financially at least.

And take pictures, you’ll need them when she’s gone. If you can get on her phone grab the ones she sends to her BF, those are probably better than what you‘ll get.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

BeyondRepair007 said:


> You better start skimming some of that cash though cause when she meets the next Mr Right you don’t want to be left out in the cold. Well… financially at least.
> 
> And take pictures, you’ll need them when she’s gone. If you can get on her phone grab the ones she sends to her BF, those are probably better than what you‘ll get.


Sorry that was harsh. 

Source: I was him.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Jbird123 said:


> She makes $110k per year. She get complimented on her beauty at least 10 times a day. That’s what makes it so hard to leave her


Not to be cruel but what do you have going for you to attract a hot, much younger and financially very successful woman?

You kind of make yourself out to be some charity case and this relationship is making less sense the more you talk about it.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> She makes $110k per year. She get complimented on her beauty at least 10 times a day. That’s what makes it so hard to leave her


10 times a day? Really? Where does she go to meet all these people who compliment her? 
You are a weak and very foolish man if you stay with a person like her purely for the way she looks. To be honest it's pretty pathetic.


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> The chances of cheating are almost impossible.


The chances of what, according with the the following quote, is already happening?



Jbird123 said:


> She was texting a few guys, old lovers a few months ago. Now she’s texting someone new.






Jbird123 said:


> But if it’s not physical, then is there harm??


Yes



Jbird123 said:


> I just want to know I am wrong or in the right?


IMO, you are wrong



Jbird123 said:


> Is it acceptable to text other men and bread crumb them but not be with them just to fill a void for her??


Short answer: NO
Longer one: NO


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## Trident (May 23, 2018)

Jbird123 said:


> Is it acceptable to text other men and bread crumb them but not be with them just to fill a void for her??


That largely depends on the nature of the void being filled.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Diana7 said:


> 10 times a day? Really? Where does she go to meet all these people who compliment her?
> You are a weak and very foolish man if you stay with a person like her purely for the way she looks. To be honest it's pretty pathetic.


It's like she doesn't have time for anything else except compliments. I guess that 6 figures she's pulling down is for listening to people tell her she's pretty. 

This whole thing is just sad.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> It's like she doesn't have time for anything else except compliments. I guess that 6 figures she's pulling down is for listening to people tell her she's pretty.
> 
> This whole thing is just sad.


Or maybe her job pays 40K and…never mind.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

TexasMom1216 said:


> It's like she doesn't have time for anything else except compliments. I guess that 6 figures she's pulling down is for listening to people tell her she's pretty.
> 
> This whole thing is just sad.


I mean how many people even go up to a complete stranger and tell them they are attractive? I don't know anyone who does that. Unless they are chatting them up I suppose. The 10 times a day is a gross exaggeration I suspect.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Jbird123 said:


> She doesn’t see she did anything wrong. She said she didn’t physically cheat NOR had an emotional affair. She thinks I am crazy for blaming her for something she never did. She threw my engagement ring at me and it broke my heart. All I wanted was to see her text messages because I was suspicious. This escalated to me calling the police yesterday. The cops almost arrested me because her and her daughter flipped the script on me and it’s two against one. They lied and threw me under the bus.


 Why did you all the cops on her? It's not clear.


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## D0nnivain (Mar 13, 2021)

Hot does not outweigh crazy. 

This woman does not respect you. She's gas lightening you. Your boundaries are reasonable. Her desire to be a swinger & get attention from all sorts of other men regardless of your wishes is a Problem. You need to start thinking logically instead of with the body part not designed for thought. 

You were dead wrong to call the cops on her. Nothing she did was a crime. All of it was morally bankrupt & disrespectful but it wasn't criminal. The minute the cops are involved the relationship is over. Just get out. 

Do you really want to live your whole life like this? That is what you are in for if you don't break up. She won't change. 

You can end this madness if you chose to. You are choosing to stay & allowing yourself to be cuckolded. You have more power then you know. You can leave but you want to stay expecting her to change when that is unrealistic.


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

EleGirl said:


> Why did you all the cops on her? It's not clear.


I called the cops because her and her daughter were yelling at me and she threw her ring at me. I freaked out and did a stupid thing and called the police. Police did nothing, she denied assault by throwing the ring. I panicked


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

Diana7 said:


> I mean how many people even go up to a complete stranger and tell them they are attractive? I don't know anyone who does that. Unless they are chatting them up I suppose. The 10 times a day is a gross exaggeration I suspect.


It’s not an exaggeration. Men and and women complement her beauty about 10 times a day if she dresses up.


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Andy1001 said:


> This is a very simple equation.
> The op is dating a hot woman, the hottest woman who has ever given him the time of day. She is also a serial cheat and a manipulative shrew.
> He will do anything, forgive anything, past, present or future to stay with her.
> The only thing that niggles him is her sexting her other guys while he’s sitting beside her. If she would do it in private he would be happy. To him ignorance is bliss.
> ...


I love being proven right. This guy is going nowhere.


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## Jbird123 (10 mo ago)

D0nnivain said:


> Hot does not outweigh crazy.
> 
> This woman does not respect you. She's gas lightening you. Your boundaries are reasonable. Her desire to be a swinger & get attention from all sorts of other men regardless of your wishes is a Problem. You need to start thinking logically instead of with the body part not designed for thought.
> 
> ...


She says that it was my insecurity that led to this. She said, if I was less insecure then her talking to guys platonically should not matter. She said, your insecurities led you to call the cops on me for absolutely nothing. She said, you have a mental problem because you were cheated by your ex wife and you bring that insecurity to our relationship. I don’t know if she’s right or not? What about my boundaries if txting other men? It cannot be all due to my insecurities, or is it?


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## Angie?or… (Nov 15, 2021)

Why do you keep asking the same questions and ignoring the answers?


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Jbird123 said:


> She says that it was my insecurity that led to this. She said, if I was less insecure then her talking to guys platonically should not matter. She said, your insecurities led you to call the cops on me for absolutely nothing. She said, you have a mental problem because you were cheated by your ex wife and you bring that insecurity to our relationship. I don’t know if she’s right or not? What about my boundaries if txting other men? It cannot be all due to my insecurities, or is it?


I'm not insecure at all or jealous and I would have problems if my lady was acting like yours.

You might have an insecurity problem and I encourage you to work on yourself. That doesn't negate the very real problem your girlfriend has.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

ConanHub said:


> I'm not insecure at all or jealous and I would have problems if my lady was acting like yours.
> 
> You might have an insecurity problem and I encourage you to work on yourself. That doesn't negate the very real problem your girlfriend has.


She’s just not that into him. No one is this hot. This situation is silly.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

You two are incompatible and a total mismatch. What is she doing with someone like you? It's a mystery to me.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Your gf is incompatible with monogamy, OP.
She’s hasn’t been faithful to any of her livers in the past, and you’d be an absolute fool to think (especially seeing what she’s doing now) that she’d be faithful to you.
We hate it, but if you want a monogamous relationship when you marry, you are SOL with this woman. Yes, you’re lovestruck and it’s going to hurt for a long time. But it’s best to rip the bandaid off and move on. The only other option is to wait to be cheated on (she already is) and start trying to find more excuses for why it’s your fault she did it and hie if you do x, y, z, she will stop cheating. 

Have you thought about getting your own orbiters to call and keep hovering in case you want to break up with her? That’s what she’s doing to you.


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> I called the cops because her and her daughter were yelling at me and she threw her ring at me.


Let me ask for some additional clarity
She threw at you her ring, not with also a molotov cocktail?
And you called de cops?


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

TexasMom1216 said:


> She’s just not that into him. (...) This situation is silly.


Excludded what I don´t know for certain I fully agree with the above.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Diana7 said:


> I mean how many people even go up to a complete stranger and tell them they are attractive? I don't know anyone who does that. Unless they are chatting them up I suppose. The 10 times a day is a gross exaggeration I suspect.


It happens all the time. When people pass by on the street, at the gas station, at the grocery store, on escalators, in elevators, etc. Anywhere when out and about. Beautiful people get this a lot. Sometimes it can even be scary. This has thankfully never happened to me, but my girls have been followed. Someone I know carries partly due to this.
Unfortunately, this is all too common.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

[Edited to remove personal information.]


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

So you haven’t said OP……. How’s the sex with her NOW??? Obviously it was earth shattering at one time. If rare now, you’re slowly getting relegated to a beta orbiter too. That’s why I’m curious.


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## D0nnivain (Mar 13, 2021)

Her blaming you for her bad behavior is gaslighting. 

I'm not insure & I would blow a gasket if my husband was acting like this. But I am also a realist. Faced with a person who does this you have to recognize they won't change. If you don't like the behavior you have to walk away not stand there & beg them to be different. 

Maybe your EX cheating on you did break something in you & make you more suspicious I don't know but I do see you repeating the same mistakes with this woman that you made with your EX wife. Stop.


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## Beach123 (Dec 6, 2017)

Jbird123 said:


> Other than the bad behavior of texting other men and overly flirting with men sometimes when we go out, she’s a great person and loves me a lot and I love her dearly. I just want her to change this behavior


Other than her suspicious behavior and untrustworthy ways - she’s a great person. 

You do realize this statement contradicts itself, right? 

You can’t trust her = there is no foundation for a healthy union.


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## Asterix (May 16, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> I’m
> 
> I called the cops because her and her daughter were yelling at me and she threw her ring at me. I freaked out and did a stupid thing and called the police. Police did nothing, she denied assault by throwing the ring. I panicked


Just a question. I'm really trying to understand here. Did this not clued you in that you guys just might not be compatible?

Especially because her and her daughter do not seem to have much respect towards you? If you get married, then it is likely that this is the life that you'll have to look forward to.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> It’s not an exaggeration. Men and and women complement her beauty about 10 times a day if she dresses up.


Hmmmm. I just never see people go up to complete strangers to tell them how attractive they are. Unless they are in a bar or nightclub and flirting maybe.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

S


Cynthia said:


> It happens all the time. When people pass by on the street, at the gas station, at the grocery store, on escalators, in elevators, etc. Anywhere when out and about. Beautiful people get this a lot. Sometimes it can even be scary. This has thankfully never happened to me, but my girls have been followed. Someone I know carries partly due to this.
> Unfortunately, this is all too common.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
> ...


So complete strangers, men and women, will come up to them and say how attractive they are? That many times a day? 
Maybe it's an American thing.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

The choice is yours. Stay with a cheat and be unhappy, or find a lovely, honest, faithful woman and be happy.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Diana7 said:


> S
> So complete strangers, men and women, will come up to them and say how attractive they are? That many times a day?
> Maybe it's an American thing.


No. It’s not. It’s a “putting out an available vibe” thing. They’re speaking to these people because they are clearly seeking attention and seem that they would be receptive to “invitation.” That vibe knows no nationality.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

Diana7 said:


> Hmmmm. I just never see people go up to complete strangers to tell them how attractive they are. Unless they are in a bar or nightclub and flirting maybe.


If you’re very clearly looking for attention, like you would in a bar or nightclub, even if you’re at the grocery store, creepers will try.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

TexasMom1216 said:


> No. It’s not. It’s a “putting out an available vibe” thing. They’re speaking to these people because they are clearly seeking attention and seem that they would be receptive to “invitation.” That vibe knows no nationality.





TexasMom1216 said:


> If you’re very clearly looking for attention, like you would in a bar or nightclub, even if you’re at the grocery store, creepers will try.


I'm sure that's true for some people, but it's not always the case. I know of several women, including myself, that have experienced this phenomenon. When it first started happening to me, I would look around to see who the person was talking to before realizing they were talking to me. I have one daughter who wears a shirt that says, "BACK OFF CREEP," because she gets this all the time when she's doing things like grocery shopping, with her children no less. This has had some success, but she's also had men use it to talk try to talk to her. She is definitely not putting out available vibes. Once when she was out with my husband and me, at a karaoke bar, a man came and tried to sit right in our booth to talk to her. She was obviously pregnant, wearing a ring, and not paying any attention to anyone but us. Every time this has happened to me, I've been minding my own business and not putting out any "vibes."
Basically you're saying that people this happens to are asking for it. That's not the case. My daughter has even tried trying to look less attractive, but that doesn't work either. She's a very beautiful woman. It comes with the territory and there really isn't anything you can do to get less attention. And we aren't speaking to these people. It doesn't come up in conversation. People will just walk by and say something like, "Excuse me, ma'am, you're very beautiful."


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

Cynthia said:


> I'm sure that's true for some people, but it's not always the case. I know of several women, including myself, that have experienced this phenomenon. When it first started happening to me, I would look around to see who the person was talking to before realizing they were talking to me. I have one daughter who wears a shirt that says, "BACK OFF CREEP," because she gets this all the time when she's doing things like grocery shopping, with her children no less. This has had some success, but she's also had men use it to talk try to talk to her. She is definitely not putting out available vibes. Once when she was out with my husband and me, at a karaoke bar, a man came and tried to sit right in our booth to talk to her. She was obviously pregnant, wearing a ring, and not paying any attention to anyone but us. Every time this has happened to me, I've been minding my own business and not putting out any "vibes."
> Basically you're saying that people this happens to are asking for it. That's not the case. My daughter has even tried trying to look less attractive, but that doesn't work either. She's a very beautiful woman. It comes with the territory and there really isn't anything you can do to get less attention. And we aren't speaking to these people. It doesn't come up in conversation. People will just walk by and say something like, "Excuse me, ma'am, you're very beautiful."


That's just bizarre. I know and have known some attractive people and this hasn't happened to them. Maybe the British are more reserved? There is no way I would think that was appropriate to do.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

Diana7 said:


> That's just bizarre. I know and have known some attractive people and this hasn't happened to them. Maybe the British are more reserved? There is no way I would think that was appropriate to do.


I’m in the US and haven’t seen the behavior @Cynthia and @TexasMom1216 mentioned. Not saying I doubt it, it may be completely right. But in my (m58) years it’s not a something I’ve been around or heard about.

I guess it would help if I was around more attractive people?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Jbird123 said:


> I called the cops because her and her daughter were yelling at me and she threw her ring at me. I freaked out and did a stupid thing and called the police. Police did nothing, she denied assault by throwing the ring. I panicked


You panicked because she threw a ring at you? What was the size of the stone in the ring? Was it a boulder?

Why didn't you just walk away?


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

BeyondRepair007 said:


> I guess it would help if I was around more attractive people?


Or around people who believed they were that attractive. I mean, I wasn’t always 50. I had no problem shutting that nonsense down. At some point you’re inviting it. But perhaps I was not as angelic as others. 🙄🤪


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

Diana7 said:


> Maybe the British are more reserved?


"Reserved", yes.
It is a "reserved" adjective in itself!
May be your choice of the word describe it better than a whole essay about. 
Lady, thank you for the smile.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Diana7 said:


> S
> So complete strangers, men and women, will come up to them and say how attractive they are? That many times a day?
> Maybe it's an American thing.


Don't want to derail this thread but some people get a lot of unencouraged attention almost daily. It happens on your continent too but you live in a different place. I believe you when you describe your environment but it's hardly a national or worldwide environment.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Or around people who believed they were that attractive. I mean, I wasn’t always 50. I had no problem shutting that nonsense down. At some point you’re inviting it. But perhaps I was not as angelic as others. 🙄🤪


I agree with your perspective but @Cynthia is not wrong at all about unwanted attention.

OP is putting up with a ridiculous woman but people do get unasked for attention.


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## TexasMom1216 (Nov 3, 2021)

ConanHub said:


> I agree with your perspective but @Cynthia is not wrong at all about unwanted attention.
> 
> OP is putting up with a ridiculous woman but people do get unasked for attention.


Fair. Even I, back in the Stone Age when I was young, had my fair share of men who struggled with the word no. The difference with me, I suppose, was when I learned I’d been lied to throughout my formative years and women actually had value beyond just beauty, I had just a tad of rage that manifested itself in being able to scare those creepers away.


----------



## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Fair. Even I, back in the Stone Age when I was young, had my fair share of men who struggled with the word no. The difference with me, I suppose, was when I learned I’d been lied to throughout my formative years and women actually had value beyond just beauty, I had just a tad of rage that manifested itself in being able to scare those creepers away.


Yeah. A little bit of difference in the character and adult department between you and the OP's lizard girlfriend.


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## BeyondRepair007 (Nov 4, 2021)

ConanHub said:


> lizard girlfriend.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

on a positive note, she does seem to have a good arm….


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

TexasMom1216 said:


> Or around people who believed they were that attractive. I mean, I wasn’t always 50. I had no problem shutting that nonsense down. At some point you’re inviting it. But perhaps I was not as angelic as others. 🙄🤪


Some women do dress and act a certain way to get attention. We all know that.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

ConanHub said:


> Don't want to derail this thread but some people get a lot of unencouraged attention almost daily. It happens on your continent too but you live in a different place. I believe you when you describe your environment but it's hardly a national or worldwide environment.


Except that I have lived in many different places including South London. I have mixed with many different people of all sorts, some attractive.
Most people here dont seem to walk up to complete strangers and say stuff like that.


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> Except that I have lived in many different places including South London. I have mixed with many different people of all sorts, some attractive.
> Most people here dont seem to walk up to complete strangers and say stuff like that.


I haven't seen it either, unless people are drunk...


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

In Absentia said:


> I haven't seen it either, unless people are drunk...


I know! It happens in certain places like bars, pubs as we call them, night clubs etc. Discos as I used to go to in the 
70's!. 
Sorry but I can't believe it happens 10 times a day to anyone going about their normal daily life unless they are seeking it by dressing a certain way and acting a certain way. Which could be the case here as the lady seeks male attention.


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## manwithnoname (Feb 3, 2017)

Diana7 said:


> I know! It happens in certain places like bars, pubs as we call them, night clubs etc. Discos as I used to go to in the
> 70's!.
> Sorry but I can't believe it happens 10 times a day to anyone going about their normal daily life unless they are seeking it by dressing a certain way and acting a certain way. Which could be the case here as the lady seeks male attention.


Alcohol certainly is a likely factor, as is the environment they’re in.

Attractive people do get approached, propositioned etc. very often, but I don’t buy that someone, no matter how ”beautiful“ they are , would still get tons of unwanted attention if they didn’t put makeup on, didn’t fix their hair up, and wore frumpy clothes.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Diana7 said:


> Except that I have lived in many different places including South London. I have mixed with many different people of all sorts, some attractive.
> Most people here dont seem to walk up to complete strangers and say stuff like that.


And yet you have not seen or experienced what most others here have.

I'm not from your neck of the woods so I believe your personal experience but it's hardly the norm even in different parts of Europe.


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## Mr.Married (Feb 21, 2018)

Even people with absolutely no self respect can’t be this dumb. This guy is taking everyone for a ride.


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## MarmiteC (Jun 28, 2021)

In Absentia said:


> I haven't seen it either, unless people are drunk...


Or driving white vans.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

It’s ok that you don’t get 10 times a day Diana. I only get 6 or 7 a day too.😂

Who cares how many times she’s complimented? Only her. And the OP.

I had a gorgeous yellow lab puppy out of a national retriever champion and an amateur champion. It was the fastest learning and must beautiful puppy I ever had. Sit, stay, heel, come, no, knew it’s name….. 3 days…..
But had no retrieval instinct at all. Only one I’ve ever had like that. I traded it off to a professional trainer for a puppy that did do what I valued most— retrieve.

OP, your lady might be beautiful, but that’s all she’s good for. Surely you know what the smart thing to do is.

you can’t change her into what she isn’t— monogamous…. That’s kind of a real deal breaker for most men.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

ConanHub said:


> And yet you have not seen or experienced what most others here have.
> 
> I'm not from your neck of the woods so I believe your personal experience but it's hardly the norm even in different parts of Europe.


I can only speak for the UK. I dont know anyone who would go up to a total stranger and comment in their looks. It's just weird.

On the other hand, we Brits love our dogs and if you have a beautiful dog you will get loads of people commenting on him/her😊

Our last dog was a really beautiful and stunning saluki cross. We had many hundreds of people commenting on her over the years, from bikers covered in tattoos, to elderly ladies, to young couples to middle aged men. She was a real ice breaker. ❤🐕


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## In Absentia (Aug 21, 2012)

Diana7 said:


> I can only speak for the UK. I dont know anyone who would go up to a total stranger and comment in their looks. It's just weird.


it doesn't really happen in other parts of Europe either...


----------



## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Jbird123 said:


> She says that it was my insecurity that led to this. She said, if I was less insecure then her talking to guys platonically should not matter. She said, your insecurities led you to call the cops on me for absolutely nothing. She said, you have a mental problem because you were cheated by your ex wife and you bring that insecurity to our relationship. I don’t know if she’s right or not? What about my boundaries if txting other men? It cannot be all due to my insecurities, or is it?


If there is nothing inappropriate going on, then she would have no issue with a fiancee/spouse seeing the texts. Those who have nothing to hide....feel no need to hide anything.

Plain and simple! She is not a safe partner. Have more respect and value for yourself and drop the cheater!

My wife does not text other men. I have one childhood female friend in another state that we text. Wife can read them any time. I usually read them to her.


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> Because there are absolutely NO women that are faithful. I haven’t met one. They all **** around. All of them


Yeah, not all of us do; you've just got your lady picker pointed in the wrong direction, and you keep choosing wrong. You obviously have a certain type that you go for. Maybe try looking OUTSIDE of that type because there are some great folks out there who ARE faithful. I used to be jaded like you, and thought that all men were assholes because that's all that I could find, so I just assumed that's either what was out there, or that's what I was worth. Here's what I did: I dug deep, did a lot of work on myself, and grew some self-worth, and then I found a man who treats me like I'm worth my weight in gold. Get some space from this girl you're with, break off the engagement and do some self-work. You'll be thankful that you did in years to come when you find someone who also treats you like gold.


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

Jbird123 said:


> She is extremely hot and much younger than me. 15 years younger. I’m in an unhealthy relationship that I cannot get out of.


But you CAN get out of it, you just CHOOSE to stay. I've been scrolling a little quicker through the thread and picking up tidbits here and there. Jumping off the 47th balcony? Shooting yourself? You need to get out of this "relationship" and you need to get yourself some psychological help. This thread has now gone beyond my level of being able to help; I'm bowing out. Please see a doctor though.


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## Ursula (Dec 2, 2016)

Diana7 said:


> I can only speak for the UK. I dont know anyone who would go up to a total stranger and comment in their looks. It's just weird.
> 
> On the other hand, we Brits love our dogs and if you have a beautiful dog you will get loads of people commenting on him/her😊
> 
> Our last dog was a really beautiful and stunning saluki cross. We had many hundreds of people commenting on her over the years, from bikers covered in tattoos, to elderly ladies, to young couples to middle aged men. She was a real ice breaker. ❤🐕


Ditto for us Canadians! I will compliment someone who I know if they look nice, or I like their sweater or something, but never a complete stranger. And my doggos get WAY more compliments than I do, but they're also pretty darn cute!


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

EleGirl said:


> Why did you all the cops on her? It's not clear.


Alternatives
- It was an antitank kind of ring.
- To make it easier for her to ask for those cops phone numbers.


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## re16 (Oct 9, 2012)

You need to revise your priorities in mate selection.

HOT is only ever a bonus, once someone checks all the other boxes.

She doesn't check the other boxes, she is not marriage material.

She is running all over you.... get out and get out now.


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

re16 said:


> HOT is only ever a bonus, once someone checks all the other boxes.


Some of us find someone to be HOT _because_ they check said other boxes.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

Diana7 said:


> I can only speak for the UK. I dont know anyone who would go up to a total stranger and comment in their looks. It's just weird.
> 
> On the other hand, we Brits love our dogs and if you have a beautiful dog you will get loads of people commenting on him/her😊
> 
> Our last dog was a really beautiful and stunning saluki cross. We had many hundreds of people commenting on her over the years, from bikers covered in tattoos, to elderly ladies, to young couples to middle aged men. She was a real ice breaker. ❤🐕


It's like people commenting your dog. lol They see something or someone attractive to them and they comment. 
 It's not always a come on, in fact, it's usually not.
Originally I responded to this line of conversation because it was said that this doesn't happen at all, when it clearly does. Does it happen ten times a day? That could be an exaggeration or it could be true, if she is constantly in the public. Maybe she's a manager in the service sector. I don't know. I'm just saying that the OP should be believed that his girlfriend constantly gets complimented. What she does with that is up to her. When this happens to me, I say "thank you" without really looking at the person, then ignore any further comment and I keep walking. It's worse if you don't respond, because they think you didn't hear them and they keep at it.


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## ElOtro (Apr 4, 2021)

Cynthia said:


> It's worse if you don't respond, because they think you didn't hear them and they keep at it.


You are right


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## marko polo (Jan 26, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> She says that it was my insecurity that led to this. She said, if I was less insecure then her talking to guys platonically should not matter. She said, your insecurities led you to call the cops on me for absolutely nothing. She said, you have a mental problem because you were cheated by your ex wife and you bring that insecurity to our relationship. I don’t know if she’s right or not? What about my boundaries if txting other men? It cannot be all due to my insecurities, or is it?


Why do you continue to waste time with this woman?

She will spin any valid point you make and turn it against you. Conflict is rich fuel. You are giving her exactly what she wants whenever you have a reaction. Do a little research into narcissistic behavior. Covert narcissism in particular. I think you will find your current woman is a good fit for the documented behaviors.

You have no mental problems. Trust issues because of your former wife's betrayal, sure. Only natural. 

She is trying to convince you that you have a mental problem because you refuse to submit to her control or the reality she would like you to accept. Gaslighting, projection and manipulation are her tools.

*You have a valid point about boundaries and txting with other men. *Other men = replacements for you ready to go when she tires of you. They also serve another purpose - triangulation. Where she will play you against one or more of them. Conflict, drama, jealousy, hatred are all good fuel.

Eject her from your life. You will not be able to reason with her, ever. Block, ghost, go no contact with her.


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## marko polo (Jan 26, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> No I am not there for the conversation. However, I told her to STOP communicating with whomever man she contacts via text unless she wants to end our relationship. You think she’ll stop or just continue?


*She will continue.* Why? *Because she wants to, because she can, because she knows you are at best reluctant to leave her.* You have no power in this relationship. The person that cares the least about a relationship, the person that is willing to walk away, is the person with the power. That is not you.

You are staying with her because of her beauty. You need to expand your criteria for a suitable partner. Everybody gets old and the physical beauty you are so fixated on fades.


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## TAMAT (Jun 20, 2015)

Jbird,

Did you ask yourself why this woman is with you? I mean I get it that she's younger than you, beautiful, makes good money as your reasons, but frankly her motivation for being with you is less clear and seems to be more like he is safe dependable trustworthy and will put up with my infidelities as she feels superior to you.

You wrote earlier, *She has a history of cheating on others, I’ve had to tell her before to stop texting old lovers and old boyfriends in the last 6 months too.* 

This is enough for most people on this site to end the relationship. This state of affairs will never end. Her being a "swinger" means that it just not ex'es but whomever was at the orgies are also her ex'es in a sense. That she has tried to get you into swinging is 5 red flags by itself.

Her high income and good looks have made her seem irreplacable to you if I am correct, but I would suspect if you marry her you will find that no income is enough to keep up with her material greed. She may even have very significant debt you don't about. When people lie about infidelity they often think of financial infidelity as even less of your business or of consequence.

You didn't state if you have kids of your own or not, but if you do you need to consider your importance to them and how this woman is going to drain your life away from you, and you from your kids.


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## drencrom (Jul 1, 2021)

Jbird123 said:


> She has a history of cheating on others


This coupled with the fact she is secretive of her phone tells me you need to run as fast as you can away from her. A known cheater keeping secrets? You know what the outcome will be if you stay with her.

Dump her, or you WILL regret it.


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## Cynthia (Jan 31, 2014)

It looks like he may not have to dump her because she has dumped him. Is that what's happened, @Jbird123?


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## Divinely Favored (Apr 1, 2014)

Tell me you kept the ring when she through it!?


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