# Am I a fool?



## Lord Ham (Oct 2, 2020)

I have been married to my wife for 10 years, we have 3 kids a mortgage the whole family setup. I will admit that our marriage has been hard and at times if not for the kids I might have wanted to end it myself but I do love and always will love my wife. My wife has always had an irrational fear that I was or was planning to cheat on her and has at times made my life HELL because she would constantly accuse me of things or be jealous of others. I lost some friends because of it, female friends and even some male friends! She is the only woman I have ever been with and she knows that, I could never cheat on her even now. On top of that we have spent close to $70,000 over our marriage on her credit card bills and it stresses me out so much but she just won't stop spending. A rocky foundation to be sure...

2 years ago I was medically discharged from the Army and was worried about our future and this was honestly one of the lowest points of my life. I got a good job, we moved in to a nice house and I even bought my wife her dream car for our 10th anniversary, I thought things were going great. Until about a year ago my wife became very withdrawn and didn't even hardly speak to me or the kids for a month. When I confronted her about it we argued but I told her bottom line, if you don't want to be with me you can leave because I was done living like that. She said she was just going through a rough time and still loved me and didn't want to leave and things got better but not the same as before. Jump to this August, she comes clean that she has been having an affair for almost a year with a coworker. On top of the fact that she for YEARS accused me of cheating on her, I have known and been friendly with this POS for years! I have had this guy in my house, I even talked to him about problems with my wife and told him I was worried she might be cheating on me. He of course lied to my face like the scum he is....

It was real bad for about 2 weeks and then I realized that even after what she has done I do still love my wife and want to give our marriage another try. She didn't want to quit her job so she was still working with this dude and texting him "for work" until mid September when she was fired for inappropriate behavior at work. Basically, someone told management that she and this guy had sex and because she was his supervisor they fired her. Honestly I was happy, no reason to ever see or talk to the guy again right? Well she has still been texting him off and on and when I confronted her she pushed back saying I was trying to control her and she still wants to be friends with him. I can't live with that and told her as much, she agreed to not contact him for at least a week and then we can go from there. Baby steps is all I want right now and we both have a lot of issues that will take time. I also said I want to do marriage counseling but she is reluctant. I think I can get her to go if I press the issue but not sure it's worth a fight right now. 

So after that long rambling story I ask, am I just an idiot? Is there even anything there left to save??? My family just wants to support me so they will go with whatever I want and my best friend says that I should just leave her. I feel like such a fool for not knowing this was going on that whole time! I do love her still and if we can I want to save things but I also don't want to live a lie any more... any and all advice is most welcome I feel so lost right now


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## Andy1001 (Jun 29, 2016)

Yes. You’re a fool.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Agreed. You are not thinking clearly.
A fool? Well, indeed acting like one.
True friends don’t CB like to advise on this kind of stuff. If your best friend says leave her, listen. Leave.
It will only get worse.


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## C.C. says ... (Aug 1, 2020)

I wouldn’t call you a fool for not being able to just cut off your love for her that easily. But I do think you should leave her. Sorry you’re going through this.


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## .339971 (Sep 12, 2019)

She cheated on you. That would be more than enough reason for me to more than want to leave. Personally, once trust has been broken, there just isn't any going back to the way things were. She's changed the whole landscape of your marriage.


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## VladDracul (Jun 17, 2016)

Lord Ham said:


> I do love her still and if we can I want to save things but I also don't want to live a lie any more... any and all advice is most welcome I feel so lost right now


If that's the case, why not just go along with it until she grows tired of this cat. I assume she cuts you in for some mercy sex every now and then even when she's banging him.. Is you marriage better when she's doing the guy or not doing him? If you still love and want to save things, does it really matter if she gets a little on the side while you try to convince her staying married to you is the right thing to do. The way you seem to feel about her, she must clean up really nice. 
The thing about it Dawg, you have no clue how she truly feels about you, who she's wishing she was waking up with, who she's thinking about when you're in the saddle, if you're ever in the saddle. I've got a clue for you my man. It ain't you.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

You may love her more than anything else on earth but that doesn’t mean your marriage will work. She needs to love you the same way and it’s obvious that she doesn’t. Could she, if she gave up her affair partner and worked really hard at repairing your marriage? Maybe. But apparently she doesn’t want to. I suggest you start making plans for a life without her.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

I'm not going to call you a fool. The last thing you need right now is to be called names or be made to feel worse. It's not your fault that your wife cheated and that you didn't know about it. Sure, there were some red flags, but hindsight is 20/20. It doesn't matter how much you sucked as a husband... that didn't force your wife to cheat for _at least_ a year. Cheaters always lie, btw. So if she just came out and told you the truth you would be wise to assume that is most definitely not the truth. 

Marriages can recover after infidelity but it's a long, hard process and you both have to want it - even then it might not be enough. Right now she doesn't want it, regardless of what she tells you. You are being far too lenient and you really need to put your foot down and stop accepting this from her. She either cuts him off, permanently, or you are done. She either gets her butt into therapy, or you are done. She will walk all over you as long as you let her and being a doormat is not attractive. 

If your marriage has always been so hard, what is worth saving to you? Why do you want to stay married ("I love her" isn't an answer)? What is it that you love about her? Do you enjoy spending time with her and together?


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## Luminous (Jan 14, 2018)

Lesson 101 in cheating: If a person is irrationally accusing YOU of something, it is generally because they are projecting their own short comings and BS, and deflecting onto YOU as a way to assuage their guilt.

Don't take her back, she has shown the highest disrespect towards you, there is no going back. Once a woman loses respect for her man it is done.


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## QuietRiot (Sep 10, 2020)

Sir, if her manager is willing to call her out on her lack of ethics, morals and disregard for her working relationship with her company, don’t you think you should hold her at least somewhat as accountable?
She can’t even be bothered to stop talking to her f-buddy for her HUSBAND??? Maybe I could understand it if she were promising you everything (and still lying about it)... but she is actually telling you that your feelings and hurt mean less to her than being able to keep texting this dude. Ouch. And I’m sorry how many people did you stop talking to for her, and you weren’t even f-ing them???
I don’t actually understand at all where you are coming from right now. Not in a mean way, please tell me what is going on that you want this person to keep being your crappy wife. I mean... she’s not even making the false promises all us other suckers fall for. She’s not even trying to lie. Please make me understand this.


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## Miserable71 (Oct 3, 2020)

I have to say that the length of the affair would be my no going back moment. A moment of heated passion one time would an absolute struggle to repair, but that length of time that you describe is way more than that.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

Lord Ham said:


> Jump to this August, she comes clean that she has been having an affair for almost a year with a coworker.
> 
> She didn't want to quit her job so she was still working with this dude and texting him "for work" until mid September when she was fired for inappropriate behavior at work. Basically, someone told management that she and this guy had sex and because she was his supervisor they fired her. *Honestly I was happy, no reason to ever see or talk to the guy again right?* Well she has still been texting him off and on and when I confronted her she pushed back saying I was trying to control her and she still wants to be friends with him. I can't live with that and told her as much, she agreed to not contact him for at least a week and then we can go from there. Baby steps is all I want right now ...


So your wife was having sex for about a year with this guy, lost her job because of it, and you were at least "happy" about the job loss because she'd no longer be in contact with him.

Just when I think I can't be more jaw-droppingly amazed by what I read on TAM, along comes this. Okay, you still love her. Regardless of the love you profess to have for your wife, why haven't you gone absolutely nuclear and exposed her affair? Marriage counseling? Pffftttt. Your wife is willing to concede she'll quit contacting this jerk for a whole week. Time for a sanity check here: Your wife has no respect for you. And, from what you've posted, I'd say she couldn't really care less about you or the marriage (other than the comfort it affords her).

Total transparency and nothing less. Nothing. Less. I'd suggest you reconsider the offer you proposed to her. Jeesh, get royally ANGRY about what your wife has done. I'd suggest you contact a lawyer before a marriage counselor. Seriously.


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## midatlanticdad (Jul 24, 2018)

Lord Ham said:


> I have been married to my wife for 10 years, we have 3 kids a mortgage the whole family setup. I will admit that our marriage has been hard and at times if not for the kids I might have wanted to end it myself but I do love and always will love my wife. My wife has always had an irrational fear that I was or was planning to cheat on her and has at times made my life HELL because she would constantly accuse me of things or be jealous of others. I lost some friends because of it, female friends and even some male friends! She is the only woman I have ever been with and she knows that, I could never cheat on her even now. On top of that we have spent close to $70,000 over our marriage on her credit card bills and it stresses me out so much but she just won't stop spending. A rocky foundation to be sure...
> 
> 2 years ago I was medically discharged from the Army and was worried about our future and this was honestly one of the lowest points of my life. I got a good job, we moved in to a nice house and I even bought my wife her dream car for our 10th anniversary, I thought things were going great. Until about a year ago my wife became very withdrawn and didn't even hardly speak to me or the kids for a month. When I confronted her about it we argued but I told her bottom line, if you don't want to be with me you can leave because I was done living like that. She said she was just going through a rough time and still loved me and didn't want to leave and things got better but not the same as before. Jump to this August, she comes clean that she has been having an affair for almost a year with a coworker. On top of the fact that she for YEARS accused me of cheating on her, I have known and been friendly with this POS for years! I have had this guy in my house, I even talked to him about problems with my wife and told him I was worried she might be cheating on me. He of course lied to my face like the scum he is....
> 
> ...


sorry to say time to go imo


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## No Longer Lonely Husband (Nov 3, 2015)

No you are not a fool, your are a doormat for her. She has disrespected you in the worst way and staying in touch with POSOM is her way of telling you “FU”. You deserve better than this for certain. I sense a lack of self esteem and confidence as well as perhaps Codependency .

she needs consequences and it appears you keep bailing her out trying to buy her love and affection...STOP NOW.

Get her out of your life and get yourself into counseling ASAP. Consider reading ”Grow a Pair” by Larry Winget.


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## colingrant (Nov 6, 2017)

Your temperament is perfect for your wife or any wife who has a boyfriend. She knows it. As do you. Your life. Your move.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

I advise you to start getting testesterone injections.

Testosterone is a wonderful hormone that helps you become a man.

Please start a regiment with your doctor so you can discover how amazing being a man actually is.

She still worked with him and you allowed it until she got fired for ****ing him?

Testosterone my friend. Start immediately.

Being a man is good stuff.


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## GC1234 (Apr 15, 2020)

Lord Ham said:


> I have been married to my wife for 10 years, we have 3 kids a mortgage the whole family setup. I will admit that our marriage has been hard and at times if not for the kids I might have wanted to end it myself but I do love and always will love my wife. My wife has always had an irrational fear that I was or was planning to cheat on her and has at times made my life HELL because she would constantly accuse me of things or be jealous of others. I lost some friends because of it, female friends and even some male friends! She is the only woman I have ever been with and she knows that, I could never cheat on her even now. On top of that we have spent close to $70,000 over our marriage on her credit card bills and it stresses me out so much but she just won't stop spending. A rocky foundation to be sure...
> 
> 2 years ago I was medically discharged from the Army and was worried about our future and this was honestly one of the lowest points of my life. I got a good job, we moved in to a nice house and I even bought my wife her dream car for our 10th anniversary, I thought things were going great. Until about a year ago my wife became very withdrawn and didn't even hardly speak to me or the kids for a month. When I confronted her about it we argued but I told her bottom line, if you don't want to be with me you can leave because I was done living like that. She said she was just going through a rough time and still loved me and didn't want to leave and things got better but not the same as before. Jump to this August, she comes clean that she has been having an affair for almost a year with a coworker. On top of the fact that she for YEARS accused me of cheating on her, I have known and been friendly with this POS for years! I have had this guy in my house, I even talked to him about problems with my wife and told him I was worried she might be cheating on me. He of course lied to my face like the scum he is....
> 
> ...


So she abused you for years by accusing you of cheating, and then cheats herself. Projection much? Listen, it's a free country, do what you want if you want her back. But I'd do the 180.


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## Prodigal (Feb 5, 2011)

I guess what I don't understand is why the OP wants to give his marriage another try. I mean, if his wife was truly repentant and willing to move heaven and earth to save the marriage, I'd say okay. But I don't understand his train of thought.

Listen, I don't want to bash the OP, but I'd like to have some understanding as to why a man would want to save a marriage to a woman who cheated for almost an entire year.


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## Luminous (Jan 14, 2018)

Prodigal said:


> I guess what I don't understand is why the OP wants to give his marriage another try. I mean, if his wife was truly repentant and willing to move heaven and earth to save the marriage, I'd say okay. But I don't understand his train of thought.
> 
> Listen, I don't want to bash the OP, but I'd like to have some understanding as to why a man would want to save a marriage to a woman who cheated for almost an entire year.


It's called fear, lack of self worth, lack of self confidence, and societal expectations


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## jlg07 (Feb 24, 2017)

Here is the problem I see -- You COULD stay together, if SHE does the work to try and stay married. You cannot successfully Reconcile if she isn't remorseful and trying everything she can to fix it.

SHE is STILL communicating with him -- that says that she is emotionally invested in the guy and is NOT a good candidate for Reconciliation.

Is this other guy married? If so, inform his wife/gf. 

Get to a lawyer, see what divorce will look like for you financially, child custody/support, house, etc..
YOU need to make plans for both D and R. If she isn't will to stop talking with him, you really have no other choice than divorce -- you cannot have a one-sided marriage (unless of course you want to open your marriage and YOU start dating also).
One thing-- if you DO tell her you want a divorce, you have to mean it. As they say, you have to be willing to lose it to save it. Seeing the divorce papers MAY snap her out of her affair fog, but maybe not.


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## OddOne (Sep 27, 2018)

Yes, a fool. And weak and pathetic. Sorry to be blunt, but it's the truth. Your wife has a long way to go before you should even be considering reconciliation with her. Find yourself respect. Find your anger. Stop embarrassing yourself and sacrificing your dignity for your as of now PoS WW. Man the hell up!


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## skerzoid (Feb 7, 2017)

First, look up co-dependancy. 
Next, look up lawyers.


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## EveningThoughts (Jul 12, 2018)

Your wife had an irrational fear of you cheating on her. 
She possibly could have been projecting and this also might not have been her first affair.

But it could have been such a big fear that she really thought you had already cheated on her, therefore she felt less need to be loyal herself.

Did she stop accusing you whilst she was having her affair?

The over spending is another sign that your wife has problems or feels entitlement.

Here is an idea, (that might tap into or reignite her fear of you cheating) Tell her that now that she has opened the marriage on her side, you will be opening it on yours. 

You are not a fool, but you are dealing with one.


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## OddOne (Sep 27, 2018)

I highly suspect that your wife came clean because she had to. She feared someone was going to tell on her. I also think this may not be her first affair, as Evening Thoughts says above. I actually think it's likely she's had multiple affairs and one night stands. Also, the more you focus on the OM, the less you will be inclined to hold your wife accountable. You need to do everything from consulting with divorce attorneys to demanding she submit to polygraph testing, etc.


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## Livvie (Jan 20, 2014)

So, long term cheating and she won't stop spending, as well?

And you want to stay in a marriage with this person?

I just don't understand.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Whoa guys and girls, take it easy on the OP. Ever heard of shock? Jeez.

OP you are NOT a fool. Your only fault here was trusting your wife. Nothing you did or didn't do, or said or didn't say led to her choice to cheat. She CHOSE that. It didn't "just happen", and it wasn't your fault. That is 100% on her. Any problems in the marriage are on both of you, but the cheating is all on her.

Would it be foolish to decide to stay? Yes. It absolutely would. Your wife is a lying, cheating piece of crap. She lied to you over and over again for. a. year. A whole year. Every time she told you she was working late, or was unavailable because she was working through lunch, or had a business trip she was lying to you - and your children. All the energy she was investing in her pos affair partner, was energy taken from you and the children. Any money she spent while this scum, was money taken from you and the children. Think about that.

You won't be able to just turn your love off for her, you will still love her deeply, for some time probably. But that doesn't mean that you can be married to her anymore. You'll never be able to trust her again. Ever.

QFT below 👇



QuietRiot said:


> Sir, if her manager is willing to call her out on her lack of ethics, morals and disregard for her working relationship with her company, don’t you think you should hold her at least somewhat as accountable?
> She can’t even be bothered to stop talking to her f-buddy for her HUSBAND??? Maybe I could understand it if she were promising you everything (and still lying about it)... but she is actually telling you that your feelings and hurt mean less to her than being able to keep texting this dude. Ouch. And I’m sorry how many people did you stop talking to for her, and you weren’t even f-ing them???
> I don’t actually understand at all where you are coming from right now. Not in a mean way, please tell me what is going on that you want this person to keep being your crappy wife. I mean... she’s not even making the false promises all us other suckers fall for. She’s not even trying to lie. Please make me understand this.


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## SnowToArmPits (Jan 2, 2016)

Lord Ham said:


> Well she has still been texting him off and on and when I confronted her she pushed back saying I was trying to control her and she still wants to be friends with him.


First you won't let her **** him, now you won't even let her talk to her affair partner. I mean how is she supposed to be a cheating wife?

Soldier, you've put up with her nonsense for quite a while, losing your friends to her jealousy and frankly controlling behaviour, and now this. When will it be enough for you?

Time to stand up for you, might mean walking away from a wife who you've described as being terrible to you.


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## bobert (Nov 22, 2018)

Prodigal said:


> I'd like to have some understanding as to why a man would want to save a marriage to a woman who cheated for almost an entire year.


Well, my wife has been faithful for 7 of our 17 years together and I'm still here. I could start listing reasons why but I don't think it would help at all with understanding why someone might stay. In my experience, people either understand it or they don't.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

bobert said:


> Well, my wife has been faithful for 7 of our 17 years together and I'm still here. I could start listing reasons why but I don't think it would help at all with understanding why someone might stay. In my experience, people either understand it or they don't.


Your situation is totally fubar and not to be emulated.😉


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## Lord Ham (Oct 2, 2020)

Thank you to everyone who has replied. I expected this reaction for the most part and am not really surprised. As to why I would want to stay with my wife, like I said I do still love her and yes I am afraid of going on without her. Also I want my kids to have a complete family until they move out but even that is somewhat selfish... 

To everyone telling me to man up or grow a pair ect, I hear you and understand where you're coming from but this is how I look at things. I have given up a lot for my family and have missed a lot due to the military. I have a ruined shoulder, bad knees and a broken back along with some pretty bad mental issues from what I have seen. I am not bitter about it, I willingly made a sacrifice for my country AND MY FAMILY. I gave up so much to help support and take care of my family that I couldn't live with myself if I didn't at least try to save this. My family is my entire world and my whole self identity, losing that would hurt bad. 

I did have a talk with my wife. I told her that this is the tipping point and laid out some ultimatums, no lying AT ALL, no contact with him ever for any reason, we will make a budget and stick to it and marriage counseling is a must. She agreed to everything and seemed sincere but I can't be sure as of right now. I am going to give it 6 months and re evaluate things then. If my wife gives an honest effort and I can see that we will try and fix things if not then I can't continue on with her. 

Thank you all again and I wish you all the best


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

During this 6 months, please pick up some books on codependency and read them.

It will be eye opening info for you.


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## Luminous (Jan 14, 2018)

If this comes across as mean spirited, then I apologise, but staying together so the kids can have a 'complete' family..??

You don't think they are gonna pick up on the different vibes between you two? Time will tell I guess. I just hope for your sake that it doesn't start eating away at your soul bit by bit.

If you ever need a good dose of cold water, we are all here, and believe it or not, despite the harshness of our replies at times, want the best for you.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Good luck!

You sound a good and loyal man.

And, thank you for your service.


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## Hoosier (May 17, 2011)

First off, so sorry you are here. Welcome to the club nobody wants to belong to. 

I get that you love your wife and family. Unfortantetly what you want is not always what you get. In this case, you want that "seen on tv" family experience, the American Dream...fair enough.....but thats not what you have, and if you continue to rug sweep it, it will only get worse. Get it? WORSE. Worse for you, worse for your kids. You must decide what you will put up with. Give you a hint, you continue to let her run all over you, take advantage of you, IN FRONT OF YOUR CHILDREN. You will loose support here fast. Not that you cant choose that, free choice, but most here wont waste their time. Sorry so blunt.
Co-dependencey is real, you have a bad bad case of it. You can get on with your life, you can have that "seen on tv" life, probably not with this woman (anything is possible) but you need to decide, than act.

Good luck to you sir, and thank you for your service.
Hoosier


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## sokillme (Jun 10, 2016)

Lord Ham said:


> I have been married to my wife for 10 years, we have 3 kids a mortgage the whole family setup. I will admit that our marriage has been hard and at times if not for the kids I might have wanted to end it myself but I do love and always will love my wife. My wife has always had an irrational fear that I was or was planning to cheat on her and has at times made my life HELL because she would constantly accuse me of things or be jealous of others. I lost some friends because of it, female friends and even some male friends! She is the only woman I have ever been with and she knows that, I could never cheat on her even now. On top of that we have spent close to $70,000 over our marriage on her credit card bills and it stresses me out so much but she just won't stop spending. A rocky foundation to be sure...
> 
> 2 years ago I was medically discharged from the Army and was worried about our future and this was honestly one of the lowest points of my life. I got a good job, we moved in to a nice house and I even bought my wife her dream car for our 10th anniversary, I thought things were going great. Until about a year ago my wife became very withdrawn and didn't even hardly speak to me or the kids for a month. When I confronted her about it we argued but I told her bottom line, if you don't want to be with me you can leave because I was done living like that. She said she was just going through a rough time and still loved me and didn't want to leave and things got better but not the same as before. Jump to this August, she comes clean that she has been having an affair for almost a year with a coworker. On top of the fact that she for YEARS accused me of cheating on her, I have known and been friendly with this POS for years! I have had this guy in my house, I even talked to him about problems with my wife and told him I was worried she might be cheating on me. He of course lied to my face like the scum he is....
> 
> ...


I am not going to call you a fool but it's foolish to stay married so someone who abuses you just because of love. You can love lots of people. Your wife was always jealous because of who she is, she is a cheater, probably has been her whole life. She projected her character onto you. I suspect this is not her first affair. You may love your wife, but she doesn't love you like a wife should, and probably is incapable of it. 

Dude there is no cavalry coming. You are the cavalry. Right now your are the equivalent of the spouse whose partner repeatedly punches them in the face, puts them in the hospital, but when they get out says. I know they have problems but I love them. Sorry but that is foolish. Your wife is a chronically emotionally abusive spouse. 

You need to ask yourself this question and be truthful. What exactly are you holding on to? Sounds like your wife hasn't been in the marriage for a very long time. This is brutal to say, but you are your wife's security but that is all she wants you for. 

If this is the life you want to settle on that's on you, but then you should learn to live with it, because your chronically abusive wife isn't just going to wake up one morning and decide to become a great wife. Why should she. She has no desire to, she gets to have her affair and her husband just complains about it, but still takes care of her emotionally.

You could do a lot better but it would take courage. You were in the Army they taught you how to go forward even though there is fear. You should be able to do this. No one is coming to your rescue, and your wife doesn't care. 

Finally what exactly are you teaching your children.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

ConanHub said:


> Your situation is totally fubar and not to be emulated.😉


Truth.


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## OddOne (Sep 27, 2018)

Usual advice is to not do marriage counseling so soon after D Day, especially when the wayward has shown poor commitment in the early stages of reconciliation. IC is typically recommended at this point.


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## snerg (Apr 10, 2013)

Lord Ham said:


> *To everyone telling me to man up or grow a pair ect, I hear you and understand where you're coming from but this is how I look at things. I have given up a lot for my family and have missed a lot due to the military. I have a ruined shoulder, bad knees and a broken back along with some pretty bad mental issues from what I have seen. I am not bitter about it, I willingly made a sacrifice for my country AND MY FAMILY. I gave up so much to help support and take care of my family that I couldn't live with myself if I didn't at least try to save this. My family is my entire world and my whole self identity, losing that would hurt bad.*


You're making excuses.
You gave up so much that you have to stay no matter what abuse she puts you through?
Does this include self worth?
Does this include self respect?
Do you normally allow anyone to treat you this poorly?
We all give up so much to have a family. That's part of the deal.
We don't cheat on our spouses - that's part of the deal as well.

She gave up the marriage when she cheated.
Be sure, she has been cheating on you for years.
Be also sure that there were other men as well.
This is a person that can't stop cheating.

You need counseling - you are way too codependent. That has to get solved for your own sanity.
You need a lawyer - you need to find out how to protect your self.
YOU MUST GET TO A DOCTOR and get checked checked out - STI, STD, HIV, the whole 9 yards. You need to do this ASAP as your life may depend on it.
You need to start reading up on the 180.

I don't think you are a fool.
I think you are felling the sunk cost effect (I've put so much in I now have to stay or I've lost all my money).
It also sounds like you have quite a bit of codependency that you need to correct as well.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

Lord Ham said:


> Thank you to everyone who has replied. I expected this reaction for the most part and am not really surprised. As to why I would want to stay with my wife, like I said I do still love her and yes I am afraid of going on without her. Also I want my kids to have a complete family until they move out but even that is somewhat selfish...
> 
> To everyone telling me to man up or grow a pair ect, I hear you and understand where you're coming from but this is how I look at things. I have given up a lot for my family and have missed a lot due to the military. I have a ruined shoulder, bad knees and a broken back along with some pretty bad mental issues from what I have seen. I am not bitter about it, I willingly made a sacrifice for my country AND MY FAMILY. I gave up so much to help support and take care of my family that I couldn't live with myself if I didn't at least try to save this. My family is my entire world and my whole self identity, losing that would hurt bad.
> 
> ...


Thank you for your service. Retired Soldier here. 

The problem isn't your wife's 'honest effort', of which to this point there has been none. 

The real problem is your understanding of honest effort. 

If your wife were an alcoholic, how would you feel about her working in a liquor store? How about her just sipping a drink every now and again? 

That is effectively what you are doing by setting your standards of what you need to see from her so damn low. 

You demanded no contact; She said, "Okay", then returned to work with him while still communicating. 

You again demanded no contact after she was fired; she said, "Okay", then only agreed to a week.

W...T...F...

Her words say 'reconciliation', but her actions say 'affair'.

You believe her words.

Your words say 'improve or divorce', but your actions say 'it's okay if you cheat'.

She believes your actions.

The ONLY way this gets better is if you actually back your words with action.

Until then, nothing changes. 



Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

Nobody wants to start over. Everyone who cares about their family wants to keep it. Your excuses are irrelevant.
I would say that because she has constantly accused you of cheating, as others have suggested, it’s almost metaphysical certitude that she is a serial cheater. It won’t stop. You’ll get just enough attention that the heat will be off and she’s back at it. When a woman loses her feelings for her man, they never come back. I’m sorry, but you will never see what you’re doing to yourself until you stop doing this to yourself. Get out and find another woman. It can be done. And you’ll love the next one more.


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## ABHale (Jan 3, 2016)

Lord Ham said:


> Thank you to everyone who has replied. I expected this reaction for the most part and am not really surprised. As to why I would want to stay with my wife, like I said I do still love her and yes I am afraid of going on without her. Also I want my kids to have a complete family until they move out but even that is somewhat selfish...
> 
> To everyone telling me to man up or grow a pair ect, I hear you and understand where you're coming from but this is how I look at things. I have given up a lot for my family and have missed a lot due to the military. I have a ruined shoulder, bad knees and a broken back along with some pretty bad mental issues from what I have seen. I am not bitter about it, I willingly made a sacrifice for my country AND MY FAMILY. I gave up so much to help support and take care of my family that I couldn't live with myself if I didn't at least try to save this. My family is my entire world and my whole self identity, losing that would hurt bad.
> 
> ...


This is what is **** up about the situation.

YOU made sacrifices for country and family and this is how that so called wife of yours repaid you. You might love your wife but she sure as hell doesn’t love you.

Are you sure you want your kids growing up seeing that their mother doesn’t love their father? How do you think that will influence their lives when they get married? If you have boys, they will learn by how you are treated and think it is normal to be treated that way. If you have girls, they are learning from their self centered cheating mom how to treat their future husband. Do you really want that for your kids.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

You feel guilt - I get it. You probably feel that you partly deserve what you've gotten. You were gone a long time, away from your family, and your wife likely felt abandoned. The spending is a symptom of this as well. She had too many deficiencies with you being gone - or, perhaps she has other baggage. 

So I get it. You feel you did her very wrong, and this is your payback. So now you want to see if you can go forward "even".

But I call BS here. Your wife cheated and lied. She feels entitled. She plays the victim. Her behavior was so bad she got FIRED. Screwing a subordinate no less. My goodness. And this was going on for more than a year. Betting it was longer. 

You've lost her. No matter what she says going forward, it's just to bide time or placate you. You would be better off saving those 6 months of your life and cutting bait now.


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

I hope things work out for you — however it may end up.


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## colingrant (Nov 6, 2017)

Lord Ham said:


> I did have a talk with my wife. I told her that this is the tipping point and laid out some ultimatums, no lying AT ALL, no contact with him ever for any reason, we will make a budget and stick to it and marriage counseling is a must. She agreed to everything and seemed sincere but I can't be sure as of right now. I am going to give it 6 months and re evaluate things then. If my wife gives an honest effort and I can see that we will try and fix things if not then I can't continue on with her.


One's playing chess. One's playing checkers.


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## Always Learning (Oct 2, 2013)

Prodigal said:


> So your wife was having sex for about a year with this guy, lost her job because of it, and you were at least "happy" about the job loss because she'd no longer be in contact with him.
> 
> Just when I think I can't be more jaw-droppingly amazed by what I read on TAM, along comes this. Okay, you still love her. Regardless of the love you profess to have for your wife, why haven't you gone absolutely nuclear and exposed her affair? Marriage counseling? Pffftttt. Your wife is willing to concede she'll quit contacting this jerk for a whole week. Time for a sanity check here: Your wife has no respect for you. And, from what you've posted, I'd say she couldn't really care less about you or the marriage (other than the comfort it affords her).
> 
> Total transparency and nothing less. Nothing. Less. I'd suggest you reconsider the offer you proposed to her. Jeesh, get royally ANGRY about what your wife has done. I'd suggest you contact a lawyer before a marriage counselor. Seriously.


And get an STD test while your at it.


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## Broken at 20 (Sep 25, 2012)

So I'm not going to bother bashing you over the head that you're a fool. Another post on a 3 page thread won't accomplish anything. 

But, the inner accountant in me didn't see this issue raised. 

I believe you said married for 10 years? I assume you're rounding, either up or down. And you want to give this marriage that most people think is circling the drain, another 6 months. 
Well, let's say you divorce. I don't know much about the military, but I know they're excellent at garnishing your pay and benefits and giving it to an ex-spouse. I think that changes if the ex-spouse cheated with a fellow service member, but that doesn't sound like the case here. 

Without knowing what state you're in, those 6 months could be the biggest mistake of your life. 
For example, in California, marriages less than 10 years usually grant alimony for half the length of the marriage. More than 10 years, courts are given freedom to decide how long they want to give it. Might be 10 years, might be until she remarries, might be until you die. 
Or maybe you live in Texas. Where, according to google, the limit would be 5 years of alimony. 

And since she lost her job, and we're in the middle of a pandemic, I am going to guess she'll have trouble getting a similar job. And probably difficultly getting similar pay. I wonder...when you get fired for sleeping with a co-worker, can you still use that employer as a reference? Wonder what kind of reference call that would be...


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## mickybill (Nov 29, 2016)

You say that you want to try to work on it. This job a two person job. You cannot do it alone. No matter how hard you try.
She has had no consequences from you (her boss did the right thing) for cheating and making thousands of choices to continue the lies and cheating.

From what I have heard it is better to be from a broken home than to be living one. I wish you luck.


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## QuietRiot (Sep 10, 2020)

Lord Ham said:


> Thank you to everyone who has replied. I expected this reaction for the most part and am not really surprised. As to why I would want to stay with my wife, like I said I do still love her and yes I am afraid of going on without her. Also I want my kids to have a complete family until they move out but even that is somewhat selfish...
> 
> To everyone telling me to man up or grow a pair ect, I hear you and understand where you're coming from but this is how I look at things. I have given up a lot for my family and have missed a lot due to the military. I have a ruined shoulder, bad knees and a broken back along with some pretty bad mental issues from what I have seen. I am not bitter about it, I willingly made a sacrifice for my country AND MY FAMILY. I gave up so much to help support and take care of my family that I couldn't live with myself if I didn't at least try to save this. My family is my entire world and my whole self identity, losing that would hurt bad.
> 
> ...


You’re POS wife is no longer trusted to oversee the making of widgets at her workplace, and you want to continue to trust her with your kids, your family and your home as well as your heart and soul. 
That you have sacrificed SO much and that she treated you this way makes me personally insulted, because of your service to all of us. I’m not a violent person, but Id like to punch her in the baby maker. 
I wish you the best sir. Truly. I’m so sad that I have more respect for you than you or she does. 🙁


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## hinterdir (Apr 17, 2018)

Lord Ham said:


> I have been married to my wife for 10 years, we have 3 kids a mortgage the whole family setup. I will admit that our marriage has been hard and at times if not for the kids I might have wanted to end it myself but I do love and always will love my wife. My wife has always had an irrational fear that I was or was planning to cheat on her and has at times made my life HELL because she would constantly accuse me of things or be jealous of others. I lost some friends because of it, female friends and even some male friends! She is the only woman I have ever been with and she knows that, I could never cheat on her even now. On top of that we have spent close to $70,000 over our marriage on her credit card bills and it stresses me out so much but she just won't stop spending. A rocky foundation to be sure...
> 
> 2 years ago I was medically discharged from the Army and was worried about our future and this was honestly one of the lowest points of my life. I got a good job, we moved in to a nice house and I even bought my wife her dream car for our 10th anniversary, I thought things were going great. Until about a year ago my wife became very withdrawn and didn't even hardly speak to me or the kids for a month. When I confronted her about it we argued but I told her bottom line, if you don't want to be with me you can leave because I was done living like that. She said she was just going through a rough time and still loved me and didn't want to leave and things got better but not the same as before. Jump to this August, she comes clean that she has been having an affair for almost a year with a coworker. On top of the fact that she for YEARS accused me of cheating on her, I have known and been friendly with this POS for years! I have had this guy in my house, I even talked to him about problems with my wife and told him I was worried she might be cheating on me. He of course lied to my face like the scum he is....
> 
> ...


That is disgusting. 
Utterly disgusting. 
Why would she have any value as a wife to you anymore at this point. 
If you stay with this adulteress....if you do not immediately flee from her as fast as you can.....then I would consider you fool. 
You were already so close to leaving a few times in the past, and now that she has been lying to you and screwing another man for a year, I cannot conceive how this isn't a slam dunk, get the hell out of there event for you. Why does she not gross you out? 
You haven't really made a decision yet so that "fool" label is still sort of up in the air for now.


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## Tatsuhiko (Jun 21, 2016)

Your wife just lied to your face. She'll lie low for a bit, then be back in touch with him via some method that will be harder to track.

I honestly can't see why you'd want to be with someone who openly disrespects you. And if you're hoping to regain her attraction to you, showing her that you're willing to put up with disrespect will accomplish the opposite.

If you feel you must give her a 2nd chance then you need to keep tabs on her. VAR and GPS tracker hidden in the car, key logger on the computer, etc. It's only a matter of weeks before she slips up, and then your 6 month agreement becomes null and void.


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## ConanHub (Aug 9, 2013)

Just wanted to thank you for your sacrifice and service. It is unfortunate that I have so much more respect for you than your wife.

I will echo posts that advise you to get help for issues for possibly being co dependant.

You could use some professional guidance because you have nothing to be ashamed of for your service and your wife has every reason to be ashamed but it seems reversed in your marriage.

I don't know how she even lifts her head from staring at the floor.

I sincerely hope you find your spine because your loose brat of a wife needs spanked and set straight.

Best wishes.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Lord Ham said:


> I did have a talk with my wife. I told her that this is the tipping point and laid out some ultimatums, no lying AT ALL, no contact with him ever for any reason...


I don't think this goes far enough OP, you need to get her to call the POSOM, in front of you, with him on speaker and tell him to never contact her again and that she will immediately be blocking him from all angles.

Of course, you also need to realise that this won't stop her making a new secret email address and getting a new phone and number that you know nothing about.

I wish you all the best, I really hope it works out for you, but please don't get your hopes up.


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## sunsetmist (Jul 12, 2018)

Lord Ham said:


> I have given up a lot for my family and have missed a lot due to the military. I have a ruined shoulder, bad knees and a broken back along with some pretty bad mental issues from what I have seen. I am not bitter about it, I willingly made a sacrifice for my country AND MY FAMILY. I gave up so much to help support and take care of my family that I couldn't live with myself if I didn't at least try to save this. My family is my entire world and my whole self identity, losing that would hurt bad.


Whether you go or stay: Your worth is greater because of your sacrifices. Work professionally on your guilt and PTSD. Her financial infidelity also has shown disrespect for the family. I'll guess there were many arguments about that. If you were gone long periods of time, she learned to function without you--this is common and adjustments always have to be made. 

Most of all work on your self identity. Some where along the line, you thought your worth came from how much you sacrifice. I disagree!! You are valuable as God's creation--a human being, not just a human doing. You cannot change the past, but you can mold your future. Act like the man you want to be; do not just react to the wife and kids. All around you will benefit and you will be proud of that person. It is hard, but worth the effort.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

*


Lord Ham said:



It was real bad for about 2 weeks and then I realized that even after what she has done I do still love my wife and want to give our marriage another try.

Click to expand...

*Seriously????

*



She didn't want to quit her job so she was still working with this dude and texting him "for work" until mid September when she was fired for inappropriate behavior at work. Basically, someone told management that she and this guy had sex and because she was his supervisor they fired her.

Click to expand...

*So you *chose* to stay with someone who has zero respect for you and she also got off on the fact that at times the 3 of you were all together as 'friends.' And don't say she didn't or you 3 wouldn't have ever gotten together during their affair. And if THAT blatant "FU" wasn't enough for you to find your pride and leave, you chose to _continue_ staying with this disrespectful witch when she lowered the bar even *more* by continuing to stay in touch with her boyfriend (and likely a whole lot more) after you found out.

And you just....accepted it because you're so desperate to cling to her no matter HOW much she repeatedly kicks you in the face..

Good God, where the *hell* is your pride and self respect?

*



Baby steps is all I want right now and we both have a lot of issues that will take time. I also said I want to do marriage counseling but she is reluctant. I think I can get her to go if I press the issue but not sure it's worth a fight right now.

Click to expand...

*I guess I'll never understand why some desperate people continue trying to hold onto something when they've been told - both by words as well as actions - that their spouse CLEARLY isn't on the same page as they are.

*So after that long rambling story I ask, am I just an idiot? *[/QUOTE]
In every possible sense of the word.

If you're looking for back-patting and tongue-clucking and virtual hugs and all that, someone else here will have to provide that for you. I only deal with hard realtiy.


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## OutofRetirement (Nov 27, 2017)

She was having sex with him at work in September AFTER she confessed and she was only supposedly for only work-related, then she was fired for sex at work.

*Was that wrong?*

Your wife had a year-long deeply emotional "in love" affair with another man. She may love you as a person, she loves him as a romantic partner, not you.

She did love you as a romantic partner, that is when she was crazy jealous. She did that because of her strong romantic/sexual feelings for you. She could still have strong romantic/sexual feelings for you without acting jealously, but that is how she is due to her past experiences, so it is unlikely. She would have to work long and hard to get past that type of behavior, and you have not indicated she did any significant time and effort to change. So assume that when she stopped her jealousy she started with the feelings for the other man.

Where I am going is that she is not going to be able to not contact the other man. She is in love with him. Over time, she may fall out of love with him and in love with you, especially if he does not respond to what she wants/needs from him (ie, leave his wife to be with your wife, or have a plan to do so). Respect is usually needed for women to be in love with a man; your wife may lose respect if you put up with too much crap from her, she has disrespected you by lying after having sex with him after she confessed, so far you are ok, but keep that in mind.

You have issues that probably make it best for you to just deal with her stay with you while you still have to deal with her issues. Probably it's best if you can blow up the other man's life; complain at work that he was not fired, write a letter to the board and CEO, you have nothing to lose. Tell his wife or girlfriend. Ask your wife to send a no contact letter to him, use an attorney if you can (understanding finances are a problem, however, this is money well spent compared to other moneys your wife wastes on). Your wife sending a no contact letter shows you where her head is at, if she plans on never contacting him anyway ever again, why would it matter if it helps you feel better, but if she does actually plan to see him again she may rail against it, even though if she were smart she could send the no contact letter and still contact him anyway. Many will fight, it doesn't prevent contact, however, it does give you her reaction (willing, unwilling, or indifferent) about it and shows where you stand, by proxy.


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## oldshirt (Apr 1, 2017)

OutofRetirement said:


> She did love you as a romantic partner, that is when she was crazy jealous. She did that because of her strong romantic/sexual feelings for you.


Not necessarily true. 

Often times when people are irrationally jealous/suspicious, it is because they themselves are the ones that are cheating or are the ones with the cheating heart. 

She may have always been disconnected from him and always had her heart and mind set on getting with other people and this was her way of projecting that onto him.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Cheaters, it seems, love first, themselves. 

Their needs, their wants come first. 

A cheaters guilt is a feature that is evidentiary noted above the shoulders, and not seen below the belt.
There are no guilty vaginas or penises.

Cheaters have insufficient guilt, more than sufficient gall.


_The Typist-_


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

SunCMars said:


> Cheaters, it seems, love first, themselves.
> 
> Their needs, their wants come first.
> 
> ...


I would argue that it's actually the opposite.

Most cheaters loathe themselves, and seek solace in affirmation with a new partner or conquest.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## Openminded (Feb 21, 2013)

farsidejunky said:


> I would argue that it's actually the opposite.
> 
> *Most cheaters loathe themselves, and seek solace in affirmation with a new partner or conquest.*
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


Absolutely true of my ex-husband. He needed the constant affirmation that he got from the new toy.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

farsidejunky said:


> I would argue that it's actually the opposite.
> 
> *Most* cheaters loathe themselves, and seek solace in affirmation with a new partner or conquest.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


I would replace _most_ with a percentage under 50 %.
My guess.

No man or woman can both *equally* loathe themselves and bathe in mud.
One side or the other dominates.

The balance (of which), is spelled out in their actions.
When the cheating happens, the spelling is done immoral.

That said, I hope you are right, and I am off base.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

It is those cheaters, that need _cheaters_ to read closely the fine print of their actions.
Which, again is my opinion.

The cheater refuses to peruse, and to reacquaint themselves in what is morally proper. 
They have no need or desire for that introspection that often leads to guilt feelings.

Cheaters almost always justify their behavior so that they don't feel the need to be guilt bound.

Such that, their spouse is abusive, is controlling, is not loving, is never around, is a SOB. 

It is those thoughts that white-wash their disloyal actions.
And, a good number use mental compartmentalization to push out-of-sight, guilt. 

They push down-and-away, _feel-bad_ guilt.

Oh yes, umm, _feel-good_, overwhelms_ feel-bad_.

I admit, some will blame their selfish lack of impulse control only on themselves, and not on any fault of their partner.

Society at large, is a bad influence when it comes to honesty and fidelity. So many examples of people doing immoral things and nothing happening to them.



_Are Dee-_


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## Buffer (Dec 17, 2019)

Brother;

So sorry to read. I am ex military as well as fully understand your sacrifices that you had to make for your family and country.

It is good to have this talk and I am sure that there will be more to follow. You will have many more questions, why him?
Why does she have to remain friends?
If it is not ok with a workplace then why is it ok in a marriage?

There has to be consequences for her willful actions. Ultimatums mean nothing without consequences. 
Remember she lied, disrespected the marriage and when caught dictated the future.
NC is a must great there.
Budgets are great to provide a focus on a end goal.
Remember she cheated for a long period so maybe hold off on the MC, get her into IC specializing in infidelity so to work out why she could do what she did to her children and you.

Remember cheaters lie and they lie a lot about everything so they can control the situation. There has to be transparency with her and her actions, location, etc.
She also needs to get a job.
Remember Assume nothing she states is truthful about her A. Reasons, everything! Believe nothing about her of the A without facts! This includes if she has undertaken STDs, STIs checks, why she did what she did etc. Confirm everything she says does or did.
You will have very angry moments even days. 
You need her to write out a timeline of her A, both PG and X rated so you fully understand her betrayal. However once you have seen this it can not be unseen.

Give it 12 months before you make a call about if you Want to remain in the marriage, not her. But don't remain just for the children, you will be a unhappy dad.

one day at a time.
Buffer


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## BarbedFenceRider (Mar 30, 2018)

Sorry you went through this, but it does get better....When you finally realize that YOU are worth more than excuses and are capable of receiving love and respecting the other partner. 
I feel it’s time to move on. Love yourself first. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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