# Not sure where to go from here



## kville3 (Oct 17, 2009)

First and foremost I appreciate you all taking the time to read this, and advice or input will be greatly appreciated.

I'll start at the beginning. 

5 years ago my spouse and I started dating, things were great. She was very intimate, physically and mentally. We had a good time together, and were always happy to be in one anothers company. She would call me to tell me she got somewhere ok, or just to chit chat. She never went to sleep without my arm around her, we had a great emotional and physical relationship. 

We dated for about a year and a half and decided to get married. (We were friends for several years before we dated). Well things were amazing for the longest time. About a year into the relationship things started to go down hill, intercourse 3-5 times a week became once a week, then once a month and so on. 

She attributed the drop off to the birth control she was taking. She then got off that birth control and onto a different type, the intercourse however did not increase, but the emotional intimacy didn't fade to much. We then moved back to where we both grew up, near our families. At this point the intercourse was virtually non existent, maybe once every 6th months. She then told me after the last time we had intercourse (roughly 7-8 months ago) that it was extremely painful for her, though it hadn't always been. She went to the doctor and was diagnosed with endometriosis. 

This was roughly a month or two ago. About 5 months ago and it has been snowballing ever since, all forms of intimacy have been fading. She says she doesn't like to kiss me because it makes her want more and she is afraid of the pain it will cause, even though I tell her we don't have to go further. I have been waiting patiently and faithfully this entire time. 

Now it is to the point where I am starting to feel I don't know what is going on. Once in a while she will go to a gay bar with her girl friends to just dance ( she says she likes gay bars because the guys wont hit on her there ). But she doesn't always come home when the bar closes, last time she got home roughly 4:30am. She said she was at a friends house and acts like there is nothing going on. Even though I haven't directly confronted her with the question because I do not want to jump to any accusations. 

She has never given me any reason to believe she is or has been unfaithful and I honestly dont think she is. It's just that she goes out with her friends like this and it makes me feel rather left out, as we rarely do things together, I keep trying but we both work two jobs and whenever I ask her to do something she is usually to tired. Then out of the blue she will tell me she's going out with her friends. It's just hard to think that she doesn't want sex, I have a very high sex drive and am containing myself. 

On top of it all, I am becoming very emotionally unsatisfied, she doesn't make those calls to say she's ok or chit chat anymore. No more kiss before she leaves for work, if I want a hug I have to initiate it. Whenever I talk to her about it she blames it on the endometriosis and says she is broken. I just don't know what to do because I am starting to feel very insecure with myself and our relationship. 

What I don't understand even further and am probably over analysing things as I usually do, she has very sexual oriented music on cd's in her vehicle lately, things I had never heard her listen to before. 

Thanks for reading this rant... I just want things to be back to how they were at one point, and don't know how to make the change in direction.


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## dobo (Jun 30, 2009)

So you really are thinking she's being unfaithful but you don't want to admit it, right?


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## kville3 (Oct 17, 2009)

dobo said:


> So you really are thinking she's being unfaithful but you don't want to admit it, right?


I didn't mean for my writing to come off like that. I really don't think she is being unfaithful, I just don't know how to react to some of the things she does like coming home 2 1/2 hours after bars close? Maybe she was just hanging out at a friends house, but the thought of the alternative tears me apart.


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## dobo (Jun 30, 2009)

Does she think it respectful of the marriage to stay out 2.5 hours after the bars close?


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## kville3 (Oct 17, 2009)

I don't know, I don't really think she thought anything of it. She called me and I respect that she needs to have time with her friends. Of course the ideas go through my head, but I trust her, and when I do call her and speak with her all the ideas and fears churning around go away until the next time it happens.

I can deal with the current lack of physical intimacy until the endometriosis is fixed. Frankly I can't imagine being with anyone besides her. I just need some kind of emotional intimacy at minimal... I just feel very alone currently. 

Am I just being blind here? Maybe it is hard for me to deal with because these are new friends of hers and I have never met them.

All I know is, I am still young, and I am here waiting for a change, waiting for this surgery for the endometriosis to be the shining light to fix things... perhaps I am being ignorant but as I said I can't imagine being with anyone else. 

But as hard as it would be to leave, I am not willing to spend the rest of my life feeling alone like this. I really hope it doesn't come to that though.


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## cody5 (Sep 2, 2009)

Hey Kville. I can only relate to the going out and you not knowing where or with whom. That's why I'm here. I've got a thread in a couple of other sections about my wife's partying w/o me and being secretive. I realize that's not your main concern, but it's all I've got. 

I got my wife to stop her actions (not necessarily in a healing way), but now wondering what she did when she was out is killing me. I wish I'd spied on her. Do it if you can. If you need to hire a private investigator, do it. Get a cheap one. I'm guessing even a mediocre one can follow a car and wait outside until they leave and pick up the tail. Heck. Hire a coworker. It is surely sneaky, but you didn't start it.

Good luck.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

How come you're not invited to these nights out?

Because your wife has a female love interest, that's why.

You need to get to the bottom of this cheating.

Even if she is troubled by her transition, why does she have to include you in her shift away from your marriage and even your gender for love.

She is disrespecting you and giving you BS.


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## Is_It! (Oct 17, 2009)

Are her friends lesbians or bi-sexual? Could the medical problems that she is encountering cause her to look at female for sexual satisfaction?

I agree with Cody that you should find a way to "spy" on her. I know it crosses the line of you not possible trusting her, but she is giving you some signals that something isn't right. From your post you feel something isn't right. Your gut usually is a good indicator...

I wish on some past occassions with my wife that there was an eye in the sky watching my wife after work hours. 

Get a close friend to help you out with this one. Keep us updated.


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## kville3 (Oct 17, 2009)

michzz said:


> How come you're not invited to these nights out?
> 
> Because your wife has a female love interest, that's why.
> 
> ...


I have gone with her before to this club a few years ago, she has been going there since before we dated. She claims she likes to go there just to dance and not have to worry about getting hit on. 

I can't dance worth a lick, so I don't really have interest in going, though I have never been asked to go. I have always wondered slightly however, in high school she was in the gay straight alliance club, as her best friend was or rather... is bi-sexual, though now married to a man.

I honestly don't know if that's it or not. All I know is being shruged away when putting my arm around her at night (she claims my arm squishes her (I'm not a big guy so I think its BS)) and always having to be the one to initiate hugs or anything is getting old. 

I'm tired of being lonely and even more tired of being so confused over all of this, and as I said, hopefully this is something we can resolve... but every time I try to talk to her, she just sits and doesn't correspond back.

Heck, to get into some more details...
I have even spoken with my mother in law about this. She thinks it may have to do with her father leaving (apparently she was very attached to him) and he left when she was young. Then her first major boyfriend cheating on her at a party while she stood outside the bathroom door. My mother in law thinks she may have reservations about it. I was the first one she ever had intercourse with, and we took things very slowly. I never pushed her or anything. She has never been comfortable with oral sex and I have never held that against her or tried to push her into that. I have always just been content with her until this all started.

She says she wants to have the surgery for the endometriosis and says she needs to get counseling because she is uncomfortable with a lot of things, none of which she chooses to share with me.

I've tried to be as understanding and comforting as I can but its getting rough to hang in.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

she has huge secrets hidden from you.

Just show up one night at the club. Unannounced.

You'll find out the truth.


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## dobo (Jun 30, 2009)

Look, I'm 100% hetero. I can't imagine going to a gay club to avoid getting hit on. 

I don't want to dance with women. Or have any physical contact with them except to hug hello or goodbye. I am at the extreme in the non-sexual touch arena, so keep that in mind. 

However, I think she's full of it and you're blind. Yes.

Do some research. There is information all over your house if you'll only look.


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## cody5 (Sep 2, 2009)

kville3 said:


> I have gone with her before to this club a few years ago, she has been going there since before we dated. She claims she likes to go there just to dance and not have to worry about getting hit on.
> 
> I can't dance worth a lick, so I don't really have interest in going, though I have never been asked to go. I have always wondered slightly however, in high school she was in the gay straight alliance club, as her best friend was or rather... is bi-sexual, though now married to a man.


Friggin'-A man. I started a thread in the infidelity section called "The Lies". I'll probably change it to "Us ****in' idiots that BELIEVE those lies". And don't take this personally. I'm right there with you. How many of these threads have you all read and just said. "WHAT THE F IS THE MATTER WITH THIS IDIOT?" That includes me and my problem. I'm right there brother. We're hard-wired to not think the person we swore to love and cherish for the rest of our lives would DO THIS to us. 

But I digress. Sorry. Of course your wife is gay. (Just like OF COURSE my wife is partying with the boys at the meat markets until 3:00 in the morning when she claims she is just "going dancing" with her hot, rather loose friend twice a month. IDIOT ME). She may have put it off as bisexual to herself before she got married, but jeez dude. 

And not only is fooling around with a person of the same sex still infidelity (you have an EA at the very least here), but you have the added crap of her marrying you under false pretenses then making her ***** off limits.

SHE IS GOING TO DENY IT! So be careful how you handle it. Have someone follow her to the lez bar (if that's what it is she will SURELY get hit on there. There's your proof), have them go in and report back on how she acts there. I wish to Christ I did that with my lying wife. ****!!!

WAKE UP PEOPLE!! I did too late.


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## cody5 (Sep 2, 2009)

Sorry Man. That came out harsher than I wanted it to. But it was late, I'd been drinking, and too much of what you said brought back my own pain. I took out may anger towards my own lying wife and MY stupidity on you. 

However, now that I'm calmer and sober (if not a LITTLE hung over), I'd say it all again (only nicer). Spy on her. My wife's actions have stopped for 2 full months now. It seems done, but that's not enough. I will NEVER have closure on what went on during those awful nights. I don't think I'll ever get past the "not knowing". She palyed me for an idiot and that sucks.

You know where the bar is. You know when she'll be there. Find someone to go in and look. Do it. A private investigator would be best, but a friend that doesn't know her will work. You'll regret it later if you don't. I almost wish my wife would start up her whoring again so I could do it. Get proof. At least she'd have to stop lying (although the persuasive talents of an accomplished liar still amaze me. To bad they can't channel that talent towards the GOOD of their marriage).

Once you prove she's gay AND unfaithful, that will go a LONG way towards explaining the other problems.


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## dobo (Jun 30, 2009)

Ask her how she'd feel if it were the other way around. Staying out until the wee hours of the morning partying is NOT compatible with marriage. Married people were meant to go to bed together, to sleep soundly knowing their love is beside them, and to wake up smiling, because their spouse goes out of their way to make them feel loved and secure in the relationship.

My guess is if she isn't having an affair and you wanted to break her of this nasty habit is that you begin to distance yourself from her and then you stay out until 3 or 4 a few times per month. Go to a hotel if you want to sleep. Just don't go home. (The hotel will drive her nuts when she finds it on the ol' Amex bill, too.) Aaah, better to stay with a same sex friend who can vouch for you when the big fight about what you were doing all night ensues.


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## larniegrl (Oct 7, 2009)

Just a little strange that she is partying with these friends and you have never met them?

And it is not "normal" to be often out at all hours of the night while your mate is home in bed...

You have to communicate with her...express how you feel, including your fears, and ask for some honest answers. Maybe you guys should go to the counseling together.


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## kville3 (Oct 17, 2009)

Well after a long in depth conversation we came to the realization that neither of us are currently happy at all in our marriage. It has been this way for both of us for quite some time. 

She had no been unfaithful and I find no reason for her to have lied about this, though it does not really matter at this point.

There are several things that took me by surprise:
1) Her pain during intercourse, made her feel "squimish" anytime we even hugged. She realizes it wasn't my fault but she said there is something subconsious or whatnot she couldn't explain about me being the one that caused her that physical pain.
2) Apparently there was a guy who she dated 6 years ago or so, before we dated that "has a piece of her heart locked away". She hasn't seen him since we started dating. (I was the first she had intercourse with) Well she claims that she hates this man logically but can't control her emotions for him. She says on a ladder, logic+emotion I would be on top but emotion to emotion I fall short. Again she hasn't even seen this guy in several years.
3) Even if she did not have pain during intercourse she would not want to be intimate with me as things are currently.
4)She has felt uncomfortable for several weeks sleeping in the same bed as me due to this.


We decided to go to counseling and see if there is any chance to salvage this relationship. But it does not look good at this point.

Looks like separate beds, separate rooms for now. I just don't see where I went wrong. 

There is a sense of relief (is this normal?)
It also seems at the same time like a bad dream.
Though maybe she hides her emotions it doesn't seem to be effecting her as much.


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## dobo (Jun 30, 2009)

She is totally grasping at straws and clearly doesn't want to tell you why she wants out.


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## brighterlight (Aug 13, 2009)

kville - there's more there. Dig deeper! Honestly:

_"surgery for the endometriosis and says she needs to get counseling because she is uncomfortable with a lot of things, none of which she chooses to share with me."_

That right there is enough to tell me there is something else going on. If I had to guess I would guess with another woman. But that is just my assumption and I could be way off.


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## dobo (Jun 30, 2009)

Are we certain she hasn't been in contact with this other guy? She hasn't seen him but has she located him online?

Anyway, ianother women isnt' somehow involved, they're the cover.


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## kville3 (Oct 17, 2009)

I am not certain she hasn't been in contact with him. I asked she said no. She went to a club where he used to go (that same gay club) he goes there for whatever reason. They had met at one of those gay straight alliance meetings in high school.

She says she thinks about him at times when driving past the house he used to live at but hasn't seen him, says she is unsure if he even still lives in the city. She said it crossed her mind if he would show up at that gay club.

Seems she is hanging onto something with him, the guy cheated on her with another girl in the bathroom at some party when they dated, while she stood outside the door. I can't even comprehend why she would still have feelings for him after that. But when I refer to him as a dirt bag or POS, she says there are things about him I don't know, that she doesn't share with me, and that all I know is that story she told me about that.

But anyhow I don't think this is anything the MC will be able to help with, I just have a feeling its done with.

I just feel like giving up, I really feel I don't deserve this, I have done nothing but give her all my love, and for her to say I fall below this guy on an emotional level infuriates me inside.


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## dobo (Jun 30, 2009)

I don't blame you for being angry.

Are you going to tell her you'd like her to move out?


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## themrs (Oct 16, 2009)

I don't understand how you both work two jobs and are too tired to go out with each other, but somehow she makes time to go out with her friends? That's backwards.


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## kville3 (Oct 17, 2009)

Had a very long conversation last night and discussed many things. She wants to "seperate" but remain in the same home, which just wont work for me. I can't heal if I'm seeing her every day. 

Basically we are most likely going to end up filing for divorce, put the house on the market and both live here until it sells. I'm not going to pay for a mortgage and rent, and she can't afford to pay the mortgage. So really no other options.


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## kville3 (Oct 17, 2009)

She now tells me she thinks its unfair to me that she has this physical problem (endometriosis) and the issues herself to not want any type of physical contact with me at this point, not even hugs etc. She says she doesn't know if she loves me, she's not sure what love is, but she thinks she loves me, if it is love that she is feeling. 

Should I try to work through this with a MC or just move out and get on with my life? 

All I know is as angry and frustrated and hurt as I am at the moment, there is still some thing, I have no idea why, that draws me back. For some reason I still feel like if I'm home near her things will be alright.


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## Lostandconfused (Jul 6, 2009)

Kville,

What IS normal at this time is to be confused, angry, lost, hurt, confused, frustrated, numb, confused ... oh and did I say confused?

Don't make any decision based upon your feelings during this time. Feelings are fickle and they change based upon the circumstance and the stimuli around them. It's hard to be clear thinking at a time like this but that is where you have to get to.

Examine your values, your life dreams, and what you can and cannot live without. 

As an example, IF you have always been a fighter and persistently dig in and go through anything to win in the end, then that's what you need to do here. Exhaust all possibilities. IF, on the other hand, you've always been one to shrug off the difficult or things that just "aren't worth the trouble" and move on, then that's what you need to do. Reminder, those are just examples but they should give you a picture of what is "right" for you based on what you've ALWAYS lived like.

You know yourself ... so be true to yourself is what I'm trying to point out.

I personally think she's confused too. She's throwing out things that she "thinks" is the cause of her unhappiness but she hasn't let herself really admit what IS causing her unhappiness. Until she figures it out and is honest with herself AND you, you're trying to make decisions in response to her bouncing from reason to reason that has nothing to do with reality.

I'm really sorry you're going through this. It sucks and it hurts and it's NOT fair but it is your life at the moment. Hang in there. Life has a way of changing in spite of us.

Give yourself time to calm down, think clearly, and remember who YOU are.

Just my $0.02.
Lost


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## dobo (Jun 30, 2009)

Is she willing to go see someone? If not, then no, you shouldn't wait. If she's the one that is confused, and if she thinks that love is just a feeling, she's got to do the work to sort it out.


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## kville3 (Oct 17, 2009)

Well many of you were right, once we "seperated" I saw text messages on her phone along the lines of "I miss you badly, when can I see you again" "Your going to be the end of me" blah blah blah....

When confronted... guess who... the mystery man that she couldn't get her mind off. The guy she dated before we dated before we were married. She claims he never showed up until she just happened to see him at the club after we were separated... right, because I'm that dumb.

Divorce it is... onward. This sucks... you trust someone with your life and this happens... I will never make this mistake again.


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