# Differences in thriftyness



## thrway214 (Feb 24, 2012)

My problem is quite different from many posted here, but I am sure I will get some good advice. 

W and I make plenty of money. She makes $300K, I make about $140k. We have very manageable debt and save quite a bit. This doesn't, however, mean everything in the thrway214 household. 

I grew up in a very thrifty family in the third-world. Every penny was carefully thought through before it got spent. So, I have very conservative values when it comes to money. I have a hard time spending spontaneously, and will do a good bit of research before I jump. 

Wife, while fairly thrifty too, tends to spend more freely. She enjoys the occasional spree. Never out of control or unreasonable, but a lot freer than I am. She says she enjoys the occasional indulgence for a gift. 

I just can't seem to get myself to spend more freely. It has become quite a problem between us. She says I am controlling because of this. When we got married, we agreed to discuss all expenses over $500. This worked fine for a while, but she has become very resentful of the arrangement. Last year, I relented and asked that she only inform me of anything more than $1000 - so I can plan for cash flow. 

Perhaps also relevant, we are also dealing with R after her short but devastating EA. This process is what forced us to put all issues on the table and discuss them openly. I am carefully navigating the balancing act of standing up for myself, establishing rules of the road, and being a more sensitive, caring and emotionally supportive husband. 

Do you guys have any advice to this penny-pincher on how to relax a bit, and be a little more generous with his wife? What mental tricks do you have for me?


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

Have you considered counseling to widen your views on money? There is conservative and there is obsessive and controlling. I'm not sure where on this continum you fall. Also your wife makes double what you do and I'm sure she feels resentment over having to inform you on how she spends HER money.

Yes I know you're married it's OUR money but still. I'm a homemaker and a penny pincher. My husband called me controlling because I handle the bills and turns out he was right. He's the one earning the money and I needed to learn to let go more. Took counseling to do it but I have.

And I assure you it had nothing to do with any set number that we agreed on. It was the mindset that needed to be fixed.

I'm still frugal but no longer controlling. There is a difference.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

You make enough that the individual item limits don't need to be an issue, in my opinion. Decide together how much needs to go to bills, savings (short term and long term) and investments each month from each paycheck, and just agree to stick to that, letting the rest go to spending money for each of you. She can splurge on a few big items and struggle to get by on spending money the rest of the month, or just let the unspent money accumulate for a couple of months for something really big, and it is all on her.


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## thrway214 (Feb 24, 2012)

Thanks for your responses, guys. Mavash, any particular mental tricks that help you? I react quite instinctively, and have struggled to bring that under control. 

I am not on the obsessive or controlling end of the spectrum. I did however react badly to news that she had unilaterally decided to give $800 to a distant family member for a keyboard. I didn't mind her giving the money, but felt it was an extravagant gift. Again, I understand how I am using my own lens to judge her decisions.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

you can't take it with you and you have some major income there

now if you are putting away a significant amount to cover the following, then lighten up and enjoy the fruits of your labors, maybe even donate some $ to worthy charities- retirement, unemployment (at least 3-6 months of salaries), education for the kids, car repairs ($50/mo), and Christmas and vacation funds if applicable


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

You two make close to half a million but you're in debt? I raised a family of five on a cop's pay of less than $35K. You need a home, food, utilities, transportation, insurance, medical, dental, clothes, and a little goofing around money. I don't value money for the stuff it can buy. My used pickup and my used motorcycle get me where I need to go. They both go fast enough to get speeding tickets in all 50 states. My 2000 sq ft home is more than big enough for my wife and I. Larger would just be harder to clean. A bigger or fancier car or home wouldn't add jack to my life. Money means security for me. I'd rather see a stack of bread in my investment account and no bills in my mailbox. If I became too sick or injured to work, life would still go on. For your particular situation, why not get your wife to agree to squirrel away at least 20% in a stock trading account? I'm no financial wizard but I quickly learned to average 40% return, directing my own trades. It was fun and I felt I was accomplishing something. She'd still have plenty of bread to throw around and you'd be growing a tidy sum, feeding your need to be conservative and thrifty.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

thrway214 said:


> Thanks for your responses, guys. Mavash, any particular mental tricks that help you? I react quite instinctively, and have struggled to bring that under control.


If you won't seek counseling then work towards stopping reacting. Hit the pause button and THINK before you respond. You can control this if you want it bad enough. My issues with money go way back to my childhood as well. Once I processed that my issues with money just evaporated. I still have to hit the pause button though....sometimes. Old habits die hard. KWIM?


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

It's not about money. It's about control.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

My non earning spouse spends most waking moments grumbling about money. And yet, and yet she's neither physically nor cognitively challenged and could run right out and earn if it was truly such a horrible issue. But that's never going to happen because it's not really about money. It's about asserting absolute control over money or at the least, complaining to absolve herself of any responsibility. She's the spender but if I spend a nickel THAT'S a catastrophe. 

Again, it's about control, also it's about not being accountable.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

Runs,

I absolutely agree. Mine hasn't worked in a year, hasn't looked for work in a year. I work two jobs and all the overtime I can get. She complains about money but she's not worried enough about it to get a job. We have no kids at home. She does has some limitations so I don't push the issue. Also, I can take care of us just fine on my own. I just don't want to hear any whining about money unless someone is doing their best to either help save some or to bring some in.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

thrway214 said:


> Thanks for your responses, guys. Mavash, any particular mental tricks that help you? I react quite instinctively, and have struggled to bring that under control.
> 
> I am not on the obsessive or controlling end of the spectrum. I did however react badly to news that she had unilaterally decided to give $800 to a distant family member for a keyboard. I didn't mind her giving the money, but felt it was an extravagant gift. Again, I understand how I am using my own lens to judge her decisions.


One way is to give each of you an "allowance" for lack of a better term that you can each spend any way you like. She can spend it on clothes, give it to a relative, what ever. You can keep yours, save it away, do with it what ever gives you peace. The point is that it is money that she is not accountable to you for or you to her.

I would also sit down with her and work out a budget for yourselves as well as discuss overall goals. Figure out together where you want money to go, how bills will get paid, what you are saving for, and how much discretionary spending you each have. Work with her to get on the same page together, then trust her.


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## SimplyAmorous (Nov 25, 2009)

If she is making $3000K a year, I would think she has alot of leeway to do with it whatever she pleases. Imaging trying to support 8 on $50,000 a year ... that is what we do. 

In our case, the penny pinching would destroy if not watched carefully...in yours...Heck, so long as she is not causing you Debt or taking from your High income flow, all the bills are paid...it would seem like a living breeze to me!


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## thrway214 (Feb 24, 2012)

Dean, we do give to charity. Not quite close to the 10% mark, and we should be giving more. 

Mavash - thanks for the tip. It really helps when I stop and delay my reaction. Once the rational part of my brain reviews the situation, I am usually ok with it. It's trouble when my impulse reaction kickstarts an argument, which then snowballs. 

To make a subtle point, it isn't about controlling her. I don't control in any real sense. She has access to all bank accounts and credit cards and she can make any decision she wants. It really is about my own sense of control over finances and sense of security.

Thanks for the input, everyone.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

How much "security" do you need? For what?

Are you paying down your mortgage?
Do you pay your credit cards in full each month so you won't have to pay any interest on the balance?
Are you contributing the maximum to your 401(k)'s?
Do you have other retirement savings?
Do you have children? Have you funded their college funds?
Are your bills paid on time each month?
Do you contribute a certain amount to savings and investments each month?
Do you have a healthy balance in your emergency fund? How long can you live off that money and pay all your bills if both of you became unemployed?
Are you well insured (cars, home, property, health)?

If you have all of that covered, do you know how much MORE you need to feel secure? If you can put a number on that, and if you have that amount funded or have a plan to reach that amount through monthly contributions, then you really have no reason to fear her spending a little extra here and there. It won't actually hurt you in any way.

If there is NO amount that would make you feel secure and comfortable, then this isn't about anything rational. Irrational fears are difficult to overcome, and you likely will need therapy to help you get to the root of your insecurity.

Your wife will resent you if you continue freaking out when she spends money, and if you feel the need to exert tight control over her spending. She will resent that, essentially, you are preventing her from living her life and lifestyle that she can afford through her own hard work. 

SHE did not grow up with the poverty-mentality that you have. She did not develop the fears you have. Forcing her to live like you do with a fear of spending money that you do have is...less emotionally healthy...than looking into therapy to help you overcome your fears.


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

Hi thrway214,

Have you considered having separate 'personal' accounts where a set amount goes into each every month? That way, your wife would have her fun money & it would not be your concern what she does with it, and it would not interfere with the expected income in your joint account, which may in turn ease your anxiety?


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## Sanity (Mar 7, 2011)

Runs like Dog said:


> My non earning spouse spends most waking moments grumbling about money. And yet, and yet she's neither physically nor cognitively challenged and could run right out and earn if it was truly such a horrible issue. But that's never going to happen because it's not really about money. It's about asserting absolute control over money or at the least, complaining to absolve herself of any responsibility. She's the spender but if I spend a nickel THAT'S a catastrophe.
> 
> Again, it's about control, also it's about not being accountable.


I remember the would no problem with me spending over 200 hundred dollars on a single date night with food and drinks (mostly her mixed drinks) but if I spent 200 dollars on replacing my three year old cell phone I was accussed of "pissing money away" on junk. 

It all about control.


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## NewM (Apr 11, 2012)

$800 for a keyboard?

You can buy new computer for $800,I think your wife got coned by distant family member.
It would be different thing if she bought a new computer to someone in family.
Do you have kids,imagine buying them new computer with those kind of prices,it would cost 20k if you bought computer with only highest priced elements.
And how close is she to that distant family member,is he only close to her when he needs money?

Why are you researching anything before you buy it to save few $ if she is gonna give that money you save to some distant family member who probably isnt that close to her.
Who does she care more about distant family member or you?


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## NewM (Apr 11, 2012)

Maybe I am thinking about wrong keyboard,was it musical keyboard?
But still $800 seems a lot for a distant family member.

How often does she do this kind of things?
If its once or twice a month buying something like that I think its not so big deal but if she does it more frequently then it is a problem.

Its hard to tell if she is big spender or you are too controlling about money when you only posted 1 gift example,better example would be her monthly habit of spending on things that you don't feel good about.


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## effess (Nov 20, 2009)

thrway214 said:


> My problem is quite different from many posted here, but I am sure I will get some good advice.
> 
> W and I make plenty of money. She makes $300K, I make about $140k. We have very manageable debt and save quite a bit. This doesn't, however, mean everything in the thrway214 household.
> 
> ...


I think alot of couples struggle with this. Your description of yourself describes my wife. I tend to be more spontaneous. 
She used to be worse and very controlling about it. 
I think after of a ton of arguments and heart-to-heart talks, she's finally began to trust me that I'm not going to spend the family into oblivion, and that I'm not some happy-go-lucky fool. 
A great marriage relies on communication and two people making each other's needs a priority. 
You have to decide what is more important, your budget or your wife's happiness? And she has to decide if her need to splurge/indulge is more important than your need for that financial security. Find that balance *together*. Hopefully, your wife has enough $ense to understand when/how to find a deal, and you can trust her as well in that aspect of your marriage. 
There's no magic word I can or anyone can tell you to shut of that urge to manage every penny. We can only remind you of that other urge to want to please your wife.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

We make quite a bit less than you do, but suffer the same dynamic and I think it is a common one.

In our case, my husband grew up in poverty and worked to support his family and help keep food in the table, and the lights on from the age of 12. I admire him in some ways for his challenged upbringing because it has given him some perspective that I have never been exposed to before. He tells me stories of working 8 hour night shifts every night at the local 24 hr fast food joint while studying for his high school exams on his breaks and going to school during the day (despite his working he made perfect attendance in school all four years of HS!). Meanwhile I lived in a comfortable home where my biggest gripe was how my parents wouldn't shell out enough money for all the designer clothes I wanted to buy. My dad is a big tech junkie and always has to have the latest and greatest gadget...I grew up having the first flat screen TV, the first ipod, etc. My dad would drop money on those things without a care...and they had the.money to do so.

So we carry those tolerances for spending with us into adulthood.

I cut my teeth and got a dose of reality before meeting my H because I supported myself from age 18 and knew what it took to pay bills. My H is horrified when he hears about my childhood and money has been contentious with us.

In our case I have shown him over time that we make joint decisions on how money is spent and I respect some or the boundaries he's put in place. You need to make your wife understand how you grew up and where your anxiety is coning from, and be willing to meet her halfway in compromise. 

Likely you will never get rid of that knee jerk anxiety reaction. My H still has it even when its a purchase that we've talked to death and planned for. All that you can do is learn to hold your tongue at times.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## manvsmonster (May 22, 2012)

Thrwy214,
I actually understand how you feel completely! I don't see separation in the "his" money "her" money syndrome. I believe that when two people are married in union, then everything is united including money/annual salaries.

My husband and I also have the mutual agreement of spending. We talk about spending anything over $100 but we are self employed and therefore have to watch it. I don't think this is about "control." I think it is about "respect." She needs to respect the fact of communicating with you. I don't think you're being a penny pincher at asking her to let you know when she is planning on spending $500! I don't care if she makes $600k a year, it just isn't fair to you and from what it sounds like, you are very understanding, fair and yet you must control the bills.

She needs to realize that her $300k/year job could be gone tomorrow. It's happened before. She needs to hear from you that you aren't asking to be nosy or question her....but just to plan accordingly. So many people take for granted that they make a lot of money. Just recently, a friend mine's husband.....big wig of a large company raking in about $400k/year...got the hammer last week, lost his job, and at his age, is going to have a difficult time finding another position that will be comparable. Long story short....wife is a big money spender and they still owe ALOT on their house (she told me  ).

So try and get your wife to understand that it isn't about you being controlling or stingy, it's just about respect for each other. If that still doesn't work, then heck with it and go out and buy yourself a new sports car!:smthumbup: Bet that will get her attention. (sorry, I'm not trying to make light of your situtation).


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## jane_ro (Jun 1, 2012)

Don't get me wrong here. I love my husband so much. But our financial situation is also stressing us out. We make just enough for the family--enough to send the kids to school, which is, by the way, consuming 70% of our income, the rest of the 30% is divided on food, and everyday expenses with almost nothing left for savings. 

I control the financial aspect and my husband surrenders all his money to me, although I know he keeps a little for himself. Problem is, after he surrenders everything, he's off to la la land..he does not care what I do with the money AND he does not care whether I need more or has some extra left for savings. I give him a detailed accounting every pay day and he just doesn't care. 

I want him to participate so he'll know where we are financially. What should I do?


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## Chelle D (Nov 30, 2011)

Close your eyes , take a deep breath, and say...

1) Is this purchase of $xxxx (like the $800 keyboard) going to put us into financial difficulty to pay this months bills? 
2) Is this purchase of $xxxx going to be a big help to anyone or make someone happier- someone that needs a big boost? (Even if it is just for a night -say a splurge on dinner out at a restaurant)
3) Is this purchase of $xxxx going to make a difference in the year end total of investments/accounts etc - ie: Is it really going to make a difference a year from now?


Tell yourself that if the answers to the purchase is 1) no 2) yes 3) no.. then it is okay for your wife (or you) to make the purchase. & put it to rest. don't fight about it, don't bicker, don't dwell energies on it.

Obviously your financial situation is quite different from mine... but.. I am overly frugal sometimes ( a lot of times)... I have to remind myself to think in terms of above. Of course, my limit is $20 on each "splurge" purchase instead of $500-1000.. but you get my drift.

My brothers' favorite saying:
Rule 1) Don't sweat the small stuff
Rule 2) Everything is small stuff.

I forget the author of the book.. Richard something... But that's bro's philosophy. He would say your thriftyness issue is a "small stuff" issue.


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