# Trying to be the Man she always wanted



## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

Hi everyone! I’ve been reading through this website for over a week so I figured I should share my story to see if anyone has any ideas. I’m a 32M married to a 32F (love of my life). We have a 20 month old son (other love of my life) together and we both work full time with a full time nanny. We met when we were 18, dated off and on (each had many, many, many other partners during this time….basically had separate lives from one another and would go 12 months without speaking) until 25 when we got serious. Got married at 28 and now my wife as asked for a divorce. I feel I’m a good man and a good father but I’ve been a neglectful husband for a long time. I’m dealt with deep depression my whole life which led me to be being very negative about EVERYTHING…..including my job, her friends, her family, my family, my future, etc. I’ve lost friends due to my envy and negativity. I had a huge drinking problem (was never physically abusive) which she couldn’t stand considering we have a son. We’ve had several emotional arguments/explosions over the years…even on our son’s birthday, Easter, holidays, etc. I never helped around the house. I also denied her sex all the time the past several years. I’ve tried personal therapy for several years which didn’t make anything better because I never really tried to get better….I tried anti-depressants but they didn’t work due to the large quantitiy of alcohol consumption. I never listened to her when she asked me to stop drinking, to stop being negative, to be more grateful for what I have, to go to sex counseling, to be more appreciative of her, to listen to her, etc. Basically, I was like a lot of guys on here who acted like they didn’t give a crap. That’s not to say we didn’t have good times, because we definitely did. But two months ago she approached me and told me she was no longer in love with me and wasn’t sure she wanted to be married to me. “I would prefer this would work” is the sentence I held my hat onto. She told me she was going to start her own personal therapy to work through her issues. 


I did not know about the “180” at the time, but I immediately implemented it……it was like a switch flipped in my head….I stopped drinking on the spot, became extremely positive and kind towards her and everyone, started doing everything around the house to make her life easier. I fixed relationships with my friends, mom, dad and sister. I have spoken to my mom and sister more in the past four weeks than the previous 15 years combined…..that is not an exaggeration. She attempted to make it work as well as she wanted to try having sex by buying some sexy lingerie in the beginning of all this (we were only intimate twice after she dropped the bomb), she bought a relationship book, we talked about all our problems, etc. I became super helpful around the house (I replaced a toilet seat which may sound easy….but for a guy like me….it was like showing the world I could build a rocket ship). During all this we also went to a wedding together and took a trip with her family to a lake Several times she asked me “who are you” or “who is this new person” as she really recognized the changes I had been making. 


However…..six weeks after she told me she was unhappy, she told me she wanted a divorce as the changes I made were not changing her mind towards me. I spiraled for about 36 hours but then pulled it together. We even went to the Zoo as a family the day after she told me she wanted a divorce (I was able to pull it together during that family outing). I’ve since pulled back on doing anything romantic for her and have given her complete emotional space, but have continued to be kind, caring, pleasant and a good listener. We still live in the same house together but I travel out of state for work during the week and come home on weekends where I sleep in an air mattress in my office. On weekends, I will go to the store to get her groceries for the week and also clean the house. 


We FaceTime every morning and night (about 13 minutes each time) so I can talk to my little dude. I try to focus on him, but my wife and I end up talking a little each time. Sometimes she’s positive towards me and sometimes she’s negative. 


I have not given up complete hope but am actively trying to let her go and move on. Even this morning when we FaceTimed she said to me “you have a completely new personality” when I talked about how I would get the same costume as our son for Haloween. (I have always hated Haloween and let everyone know it). 


She has told all her friends and family that she is moving forward a divroce. Her plan is to figure out a financial plan as a family, take it to a mediator, get it approved, jointly file for divorce, and wait the mandatory 6 month waiting period stipulated by California. It’s been 20 days since she said she wanted a divorce and zero progress has been made on formally moving forward. Granted, we have had “busy” weekends the past 3 weekends, but still nothing has been done. I suspect this weekend is when she’ll start but who knows. I stopped all communication with her other than to FaceTime with our son….but she still likes my Instagram posts and watches all my SnapChat stories. She came with me to my personal therapist a week ago and basically laid out her argument to my therapist as to why she wanted out of this marriage. I later talked to my therapist and he said “I don’t want to give you false hope, but I don’t think she’s as resolute as she thinks she is”. However, if you were to ask her without me in the room, she would say “Yes, I am divorcing him.”


At the moment, we are a minimum of 7 months away from being officially divorced. We don’t plan on selling our house until April (it is now mid-October) and neither of us have plans to move out. She told me I don’t have to leave the house and even mentioned I may be able to return to the bed if she truly believes I have given up trying to “win her back”. We even have plans together to go to some kid’s birthday party together this weekend. 


So…..what else can I do? She did not cheat nor has started to see someone else (I think). I have not cheated or started to see someone else. I feel like I’m finally getting all my emotions together (I feel calm, confident and strong…..no longer have mood swings….am overall happier about every aspect of my life other than my marriage….have also implemented all the “man leadership” strategies around both her and my wife) , but she said she wants out and has told all her “people”. I don’t know what else to do other than what I’m currently doing. I know I was a poor husband, but giving up alcohol and letting my anti-depressant medication do its thing has done WONDERS for me. I truly feel like a different, positive person…and I’m trying to show that to everyone (including my wife) that I’m finally reaching my potential as a man. She even said one of the reasons she married me was for my “potential” as a man. She said if I had become this person 6 months ago, then we could have saved this. She still tells me she loves me and she said she wishes this would have worked out. When I’m home, we still sometimes make dinner together and watch tv (she can’t watch American Horror Story without me….it’s too scary….this is weird season based on Trump). Every time I FaceTime with them I tell my son “make sure you tell your mom how beautiful she is”…..not because I want her to know how I feel, but to instill the idea in my son that all women (especially his mom) need to be cherished and respected. I want him to be the man I never was until age 32. 


I come to you all for guidance. I kinda ranted up there so can clarify things if anyone asks, but please, please help me come to peace with either letting my wife go or winning her back.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

Well, you were honest to us. You were very honest.

Honestly, I do not blame her for pulling the plug on your marriage.

What you have done lately is just fine.

But, sorry, it is too late for her.

She has lost trust in you.

She knows you are now panicky.
She knows you made these important changes because you had to. Not because you reached an epiphany on your own.

Let the divorce go through.

Continue with your new behavior. Maybe after a year or two she will come back.

A big maybe.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

It sounds like you were a bad husband, and you changed too late. You wore her out. Through all that you put her, she remained faithful, so it seems. However, there might be a man in the wings that you don't know about.

If your changes are real, whether she divorces you or not, the "new you" will remain.

Don't try to control her or convince her. Let her go. The two of you will have to continue interacting, because of your child. If you start dating, or revert back to the way you were, all you will do is convince her the changes were only out of desperation to get her back, and not really permanent.

If she starts dating, after your divorce, don't give her a hard time about it. IMO you should not date for a couple of years, until you permanently fix your issues. By doing so, you will prove to her that you truly are a new man, the man she used to know before you went off the deep end. However, she might not come back to you anyway, since you already did a bait and switch with her once.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

ReachingMyPotential;


You reference doing 180. Great! Have your read MW Davis Divorce Busting? You should.

Admitting your problems and making changes to your life is the most important things you have done. Well done. Congratulations.

The sad truth is that we can only change ourself. We can not change our partner nor their view of us or feelings toward us. If your changes are real and she is inspired by your changes, then you may win her back OR NOT. It is not up to you, it is up to her.

The advice you have gotten is good. Fix yourself first. You need to learn from your mistakes so that you can either win her back or be the kind of man your next wife deserves. Either way be greatful to your soon to be exwife for waking you up so you realize what needed to be changed.

You and your potentially ex wife will always be connected via your child. Make sure you are a great father to your child. There may come a time in her life where that will become very important to her. It will always be important to your child. 

Don't push your wife as it will only be counter productive.

You have 7 months or more to show her that you are a different person, a good man and a great father. You have the rest of your life to prove to yourself that you are a good man and a great father. Don't waste a minute of it. Get MW Davis book and read it carefully. 

If she finalizes the divorce, then you tried and did what you could do when you realized the problem.

Live for the future and find happiness for you and your child. If she wants she will join you or struggle to find her own happiness.

Good luck.


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## Yeswecan (Jul 25, 2014)

You are away at work all week and only home on weekends? If that is the case, this is not repairable. Absence does anything but make the heart grow fonder. You need a job that keeps you home every night. Other than that, you are a room mate on the weekends for your W. Emotional attachment and commitment is not in the cards in a work situation like yours.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> I also denied her sex all the time the past several years.


Please elaborate.
To me this statement says that you and she did not engage in sexual intimacy for several years, and during those several years she was asking, begging, initiating, or at least hinting that she wanted to have sex with you. Is that what you are saying here?


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

Mr. Nail said:


> Please elaborate.
> To me this statement says that you and she did not engage in sexual intimacy for several years, and during those several years she was asking, begging, initiating, or at least hinting that she wanted to have sex with you. Is that what you are saying here?


We engaged about 5-6 times the past year-year and a half or so.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

Araucaria said:


> It sounds like you were a bad husband, and you changed too late. You wore her out. Through all that you put her, she remained faithful, so it seems. However, there might be a man in the wings that you don't know about.
> 
> If your changes are real, whether she divorces you or not, the "new you" will remain.
> 
> ...



I agree with all of that. I am trying very hard to come to peace with letting her go, but I guess the fact that she made her mind up two months ago, but then tried to see if she could come back to me, decided that she couldn't....but we still live together and do stuff and tell each other we love each other.....I'm just deluding myself into a false sense of hope. It's hard to just completely detach when some gray area stuff is still pushed in. 

I know in my heart that this is the man I can be.....the man she wanted me to be when she married me. I know I was a bad, bad husband and she deserves to find happiness. I will come to terms with letting her go at some point while continuing to be completely sober, healthy, stable and being the best father I can be. She still doesn't believe that I truly lover her which I understand and accept. I can only show her by my actions for the rest of our lives. If she finds happiness with another man then so be it.....she deserved it. I will find peace within myself by being a good man and father and maybe one day if I'm lucky.....someone will open their heart up to be and I can be a husband again. 

That's what I keep trying to tell myself over and over and over. Yet it's so hard to let go when we still interact so much.....and she keeps commenting on my changes. She's such a wonderful, loving person.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

Can she move out? Don't you move out, because she could say you abandoned the family, and get more custody of your child.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

Araucaria said:


> Can she move out? Don't you move out, because she could say you abandoned the family, and get more custody of your child.


Neither one of us wants to move out because we both want to be with our son and we don't hate being with one another....like I mentioned above, there's not a 0% chance (per her) that I move back into the bed with her. Things are actually somewhat normal when we're around each other in person. As long as she feels like I'm not trying to woo her and not trying to have any ulterior motive by being around her, then she is more than fine having me around. Plus, I'm able to "babysit" if she wants to go out on Fri/Sat....which doesn't happen often but is fine by my. I'm happy to help her (save money on a babysitter).

We even have a game where I try to make her laugh 5 times when we're around each other. I've told her how much I love her and want to be the best husband I can be while we're still married.....but what I'm doing now is showing her by my actions.


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## Young at Heart (Jan 6, 2015)

She is showing mixed messages. Your therapist spotted that and advised you not to confront her on it. By all means get MW Davis Book Divorce Busting and read it by this weekend. Then read it again a couple more times.

Good luck.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Thanks for answering that question. Like many here I'm worried about the viability of your marriage. There is some tendency to want to finish the divorce once you have started talking about doing it. There is even some social pressure to not try to rebuild the marriage. Your wife seems to still be a bit in the decision, but there are a lot of mixed messages.

She is telling you that you may return to the bed at some future date, but the stipulation for that return is that you aren't trying to get her back into the marriage. So she wants to be closer physically, but she also wants to divorce. Mixed message. She says that the marriage is over, but she doesn't want to live in separate houses. Mixed message. She says she likes your changes, but it is not enough. She is also not saying what enough would be.

She is not alone in sending mixed messages. You are sleeping in another room, but haven't purchased a permanent bed. Mixed message. You say you are willing to meet her needs, but you encourage her to spend time away from you. Mixed message.

With all of this confusion, All I can assume is that you two are somehow getting a good understanding of what you both want, or at least are willing to accept.

Here comes the tough part. There are 2 aspects of your life that I am unfamiliar with. One, is alcohol, and two is that you are the low drive partner. Because of my lack of experience I don't know if one of those is affecting the other. Any way, congratulations on your sobriety. That is no doubt helping her feel better about you. Living with an addict is very difficult and may be leading to her feelings about not reconciling. The Second part is your low sex drive. I'm assuming that her sex drive is significantly higher than yours. Less that 10 times per year is always considered sexless. Most people prefer more, some much more. I've never been low drive but I'm married to a person who's drive is much lower than mine. Based on that experience, I would be very surprised if you would willingly offer her, (or be confident in promising her) enthusiastic sex more often than once a month. I don't know what you have put on the bargaining table, or what she would be willing to accept. This is where the viability question comes up. Is it realistic to ask her to accept a relationship that can not meet her needs. Is it realistic to ask you to perform at a level that you have no interest in. This will lead to the same resentment you already have in her. 

Yes you like each other, you have a child to raise, but you aren't compatible. Like a fish married to a bird. 
Now there has been some comment about the long distance nature of your relationship. My wife and I work mismatched schedules so I'm a bit familiar. Yes your frequent long absence is going to make rebuilding a relationship much harder, but on the other hand it may be the only reason you have made it this long. She is willing to accept the missing sex when you are far away, but when you come home for a weekend, and leave the next Monday without relieving her desire, she feels rejected,unwanted and undesirable. She needs more than words, she needs to see the hunger in your eyes. But, for whatever reason, it just isn't there. If she had to face that every night she would have left long ago.

I know this post is not giving you a path back to marriage. All I am offering you is an understanding of where it went. Hopefully this will help give you some peace. and even more hopefully you will not make the same mistake again. Your level of desire while not unheard of is unusually low. Anyone entering into a sexual relationship with you needs to know the facts first. There will still be difficulties, but you have a better chance at compatibility.


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## Ynot (Aug 26, 2014)

I think the title of your post says it all. You shouldn't want to become "the man she always wanted", you should become the man you always wanted to be. The reality is that those may be the very same thing. All she may have wanted was for you to live up to your potential, so focus on your self and stop doing anything to please her. It doesn't matter what she thinks or what she wants, and if you do stuff for her, you will always be chasing a ghost. You have seven months, remake your self in that time (I mean really remake your self, not some short term turnaround after years of being something else. ) You might reawaken her emotions, you might not. But by that time you will be in the position to decide whether you care or not as opposed to now where you are still acting for her.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

Mr. Nail said:


> Thanks for answering that question. Like many here I'm worried about the viability of your marriage. There is some tendency to want to finish the divorce once you have started talking about doing it. There is even some social pressure to not try to rebuild the marriage. Your wife seems to still be a bit in the decision, but there are a lot of mixed messages.
> 
> She is telling you that you may return to the bed at some future date, but the stipulation for that return is that you aren't trying to get her back into the marriage. So she wants to be closer physically, but she also wants to divorce. Mixed message. She says that the marriage is over, but she doesn't want to live in separate houses. Mixed message. She says she likes your changes, but it is not enough. She is also not saying what enough would be.
> 
> ...



To clarify - I don't work on the road much at all....I'm only working on the road right now for the past 4 weeks and will continue to do so until Thanksgiving. I was home for the entire week two weeks ago and again for half of last week because it was her birthday and she said I could stay home for it and do something nice for her. My sex drive has sky rocketed since I got sober. I don't know how to biologically explain that but since I stopped drinking and my confidence level shot up, I truly feel like a different person. It's really really weird. I cannot explain it.....it's likely a combination of being sober, the pills working, and just kinda being exposed to the reality of my poor behavior. 

I love this woman. I deeply and truly love her. If she wants to move on, it will devastate me, but I will open the door for her while she walks out if it means she's happy and the best possible mother she can be for my child.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

Ynot said:


> I think the title of your post says it all. You shouldn't want to become "the man she always wanted", you should become the man you always wanted to be. The reality is that those may be the very same thing. All she may have wanted was for you to live up to your potential, so focus on your self and stop doing anything to please her. It doesn't matter what she thinks or what she wants, and if you do stuff for her, you will always be chasing a ghost. You have seven months, remake your self in that time (I mean really remake your self, not some short term turnaround after years of being something else. ) You might reawaken her emotions, you might not. But by that time you will be in the position to decide whether you care or not as opposed to now where you are still acting for her.


Thank you for those words....I truly believe that yes, the man she wanted me to be and the man I wanted to be (and I believe I am not and getting more comfortable with everyday) are one in the same. Yeah - I will continue to be the type of father I think my son deserves....the type of masculine, confident, hard working, peaceful man that any young boy needs to look up to and admire. It's impossible to not hope she sees this change.....but I'm trying really really hard to just do this for not just for myself...but also my son, my mom/dad/sister, friends, co workers, etc.


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## Satya (Jun 22, 2012)

Whether she has another man in the wings or she just wants to part because she's done, your changes are simply too little, too late. They're also probably too large and too sudden. No woman who was subjected to what she was for any length of time (years) is going to believe that in a few weeks/months you're suddenly going to turn into Mr. Wonderful.

Let her go and learn from your mistakes so you do not repeat them.


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## BobSimmons (Mar 2, 2013)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> I love this woman. I deeply and truly love her. If she wants to move on, it will devastate me, but *I will open the door for her while she walks out if it means she's happy *and the best possible mother she can be for my child.


Come on man, be honest, because you haven't really been honest through the entire marriage and even now.

You wouldn't be happy if she walked out and started seeing another man and brought said man into your child's life. Flowery language is all well and good but if you're not being genuine you will say all this stuff, she will hold you to your word (since you've apparently changed) and then where will you be? Extremely bitter and unhappy.

I say this because after years and years she says divorce and suddenly you've changed, suddenly you have a sex drive, even the title seems disingenuous "Trying to be..." as someone once said, there is no try only, only do.

Great you're taking steps in the right direction but you're doing it in hopes of winning her back because she dropped the hammer and figuratively manned up which must have come as quite a shock but that's real strength, having the courage of your convictions and moving forward with them. She's already envisaged a life without you, she will only take back the real you and that might only be after divorce, you know just in case you're b*llsh*tting.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Thanks for the followup again. That's good information. Your best bet is to keep being the best you. What I said about mixed messages is the next thing you need to face. if you wnat to save the marriage she needs to see that every day in everything you Do. make sure your message is constant. it's a manly thing.


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## SunCMars (Feb 29, 2016)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> I love this woman. I deeply and truly love her. If she wants to move on, it will devastate me, but I will open the door for her while she walks out if it means she's happy and the best possible mother she can be for my child.


This is so sad.

I hope it turns around for you and her.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

Thank you everyone for commenting/responding. I accept that this is likely too little too late.....(she did just text me a link to a job as a forest ranger because one running joke we have is I've always wanted to live in nature in the pacific northwest). But what if I did change because of her but I can embrace embrace those change in spite of the marriage ending? Why can't I do this while hoping she comes back to me all while letting her go? I get many people think I'm full of s**t, but in my heart I know I'm not. I'm only 32.....thank god I had this awakening now versus 48 when my son would be 17. I love my wife and am truly trying to let her go all while attempting to inactively show her that I have become the man she has wanted for so long. She has even said "this is who I wish you were 6 months ago". I'm not saying I will win her back.....but I am saying that I have completely changed and will continue to work on myself every single day....all while hoping thing somehow turn around. 

It's a lot to do all at once, but I'm really giving it my best effort without having to drink my pain away which is what I did since i was 22. It's an incredible feeling to not have to turn to alcohol when my life is being stripped away from me. And yes....I am losing a giant piece of my life if my wife leaves independent of her (if that makes sense) but I'm happy I'm manning up and facing it head on......again all while hoping this works out somehow.


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

OP,
I have always believed that reconciliation was the most favorable outcome but it is not always advisable due to circumstances. In this instance, if your proclamations of change are truthful, then I believe that R is favored. So, since much of the neglect was yours then so also should be the effort to reunite. As one poster has already mentioned you must stop sending signals that are ambiguous and let her see, in no uncertain terms, that you are intent on saving your family.

I have a few suggestions that you may deem prudent or choose to totally ignore. Firstly, I would ask point blank if there is someone else because if there is your chances of success are greatly reduced. If not, I would inform her that it is your intent to fight harder for her and your family than you have ever fought for anything before in your life. I would ask to move back into the marital bed with the clear understanding that you will continue to woo her and that you will be persistent but not forceful. If she is receptive then so be it but if she adamantly refuses then back off until later. Also, I would ask her out on Friday and if she declines then as k for Saturday, if she still refuses then ask for the next weekend. You must prove to her that this endeavor is more important to you than anything in life.

You spent years building this wall and it is formidable. It will take serious dedication and effort on your part if you are to be successful and it will not be easy but worthwhile endeavors seldom are. I believe that you must, in the time remaining, prove to her without doubt that you are indeed a "new man" if you are to have any chance at winning her heart. Show her your resolve, your steel and do not waiver no matter the rejection. You rejected her for years, it is your turn to feel that pain and show her that you will trudge through it for your family and her.

Now understand that this will require you to fundamentally change your character and to put her ahead of all else. If you do not feel capable of this task, better to let her go and move on but if you feel up to the challenge then you must go all in. If you fail the loss will be severe but if you succeed, the rewards will be unequaled. I have a quote that I am fond of repeating which is "if someone wants to do something badly enough they will find a way, if not, they will find an excuse". It is now your time to prove how badly you want this marriage, your family and her. Good fortune.


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## aine (Feb 15, 2014)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> Hi everyone! I’ve been reading through this website for over a week so I figured I should share my story to see if anyone has any ideas. I’m a 32M married to a 32F (love of my life). We have a 20 month old son (other love of my life) together and we both work full time with a full time nanny. We met when we were 18, dated off and on (each had many, many, many other partners during this time….basically had separate lives from one another and would go 12 months without speaking) until 25 when we got serious. Got married at 28 and now my wife as asked for a divorce. I feel I’m a good man and a good father but I’ve been a neglectful husband for a long time. I’m dealt with deep depression my whole life which led me to be being very negative about EVERYTHING…..including my job, her friends, her family, my family, my future, etc. I’ve lost friends due to my envy and negativity. I had a huge drinking problem (was never physically abusive) which she couldn’t stand considering we have a son. We’ve had several emotional arguments/explosions over the years…even on our son’s birthday, Easter, holidays, etc. I never helped around the house. I also denied her sex all the time the past several years. I’ve tried personal therapy for several years which didn’t make anything better because I never really tried to get better….I tried anti-depressants but they didn’t work due to the large quantitiy of alcohol consumption. I never listened to her when she asked me to stop drinking, to stop being negative, to be more grateful for what I have, to go to sex counseling, to be more appreciative of her, to listen to her, etc. Basically, I was like a lot of guys on here who acted like they didn’t give a crap. That’s not to say we didn’t have good times, because we definitely did. But two months ago she approached me and told me she was no longer in love with me and wasn’t sure she wanted to be married to me. “I would prefer this would work” is the sentence I held my hat onto. She told me she was going to start her own personal therapy to work through her issues.
> 
> 
> I did not know about the “180” at the time, but I immediately implemented it……it was like a switch flipped in my head….I stopped drinking on the spot, became extremely positive and kind towards her and everyone, started doing everything around the house to make her life easier. I fixed relationships with my friends, mom, dad and sister. I have spoken to my mom and sister more in the past four weeks than the previous 15 years combined…..that is not an exaggeration. She attempted to make it work as well as she wanted to try having sex by buying some sexy lingerie in the beginning of all this (we were only intimate twice after she dropped the bomb), she bought a relationship book, we talked about all our problems, etc. I became super helpful around the house (I replaced a toilet seat which may sound easy….but for a guy like me….it was like showing the world I could build a rocket ship). During all this we also went to a wedding together and took a trip with her family to a lake Several times she asked me “who are you” or “who is this new person” as she really recognized the changes I had been making.
> ...



I know this is very tough, but sometimes the damage is done and it is very difficult to go back to a clean slate and start over. I know how she feels because although I am still in my marriage, my feelings for my H have changed irrevocably. We are much older though, if I was younger I would be gone by now. Yes, it is possible for people to fall in love again, build anew, but it depends on both to do it.
You both have time to make completely new lives, and based on the way you treated her and your marriage she deserves a new start.
I do not understand why many spouses think they can kick their SO's heart around like a football forever and then think they will put up with it, there are ALWAYS consequences.

I would suggest you be the best father and man you can be and let her go. Set a timeline for yourself and if she is still hesitant, move the divorce a long yourself.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

aine said:


> I know this is very tough, but sometimes the damage is done and it is very difficult to go back to a clean slate and start over. I know how she feels because although I am still in my marriage, my feelings for my H have changed irrevocably. We are much older though, if I was younger I would be gone by now. Yes, it is possible for people to fall in love again, build anew, but it depends on both to do it.
> You both have time to make completely new lives, and based on the way you treated her and your marriage she deserves a new start.
> I do not understand why many spouses think they can kick their SO's heart around like a football forever and then think they will put up with it, there are ALWAYS consequences.
> 
> I would suggest you be the best father and man you can be and let her go. Set a timeline for yourself and if she is still hesitant, move the divorce a long yourself.


But aren't we young enough where we can repair our marriage and enable our 20 month old son to grow up in a house with two parents? I believe we are and that's what I'm fighting for. But I am also trying to let her go so she can move on in the likely event that this ends.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

NoChoice said:


> OP,
> I have always believed that reconciliation was the most favorable outcome but it is not always advisable due to circumstances. In this instance, if your proclamations of change are truthful, then I believe that R is favored. So, since much of the neglect was yours then so also should be the effort to reunite. As one poster has already mentioned you must stop sending signals that are ambiguous and let her see, in no uncertain terms, that you are intent on saving your family.
> 
> I have a few suggestions that you may deem prudent or choose to totally ignore. Firstly, I would ask point blank if there is someone else because if there is your chances of success are greatly reduced. If not, I would inform her that it is your intent to fight harder for her and your family than you have ever fought for anything before in your life. I would ask to move back into the marital bed with the clear understanding that you will continue to woo her and that you will be persistent but not forceful. If she is receptive then so be it but if she adamantly refuses then back off until later. Also, I would ask her out on Friday and if she declines then as k for Saturday, if she still refuses then ask for the next weekend. You must prove to her that this endeavor is more important to you than anything in life.
> ...


Thank you for your kind words but it seems like she doesn't want me to try to be romantic right now. I think all I can do is be the best man I can for myself when I'm around her and try to make her and my son laugh as much as I can. She knows I love and her and want her to come back to me....now I'm just trying to show it to the world with my actions.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

Mr. Nail said:


> Thanks for the followup again. That's good information. Your best bet is to keep being the best you. What I said about mixed messages is the next thing you need to face. if you wnat to save the marriage she needs to see that every day in everything you Do. make sure your message is constant. it's a manly thing.


Thank you. That is what I will do everyday of my life whether I'm with her or not. With our without her, I am genuinely tired of being the sh***y person I was for so long. As a Christian I believe in redemption and forgiveness.....forgiveness of myself. The road won't be easy, but I am committed to being sober, stable, calm and confident.


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> Thank you for your kind words but it seems like she doesn't want me to try to be romantic right now. I think all I can do is be the best man I can for myself when I'm around her and try to make her and my son laugh as much as I can. She knows I love and her and want her to come back to me....now I'm just trying to show it to the world with my actions.


Perhaps this answers the question of just how badly you want this. The above is an excuse. Did she want you to drink? You did anyway. Did she want you to neglect her? You did anyway. She did not want any of the negativity you dished out but you did it anyway because that is what you wanted most. Now you cannot do this because she does not want you to? You do not truly want to or you would be doing it anyway. In light of this, it would likely be better if you continue on as you have been, doing what you want and allow her to move on.


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## musiclover (Apr 26, 2017)

You took your wife for granted and she's had enough. You did what you wanted and thought she would just put up. Now she's gone and you want to change. 

I've said this before here; for the life of me I cannot understand why some people can love someone so much but feel it's okay to mistreat them..

I put up with this sort of thing for a lot of years so it's a sore spot for me. I asked nicely, I begged, I threatened, until one day I just didn't care anymore. 

Unfortunately I think your wife feels the same. Live and learn. And next time around treat the ones you love the way you would want to be treated. It's that simple.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

NoChoice said:


> Perhaps this answers the question of just how badly you want this. The above is an excuse. Did she want you to drink? You did anyway. Did she want you to neglect her? You did anyway. She did not want any of the negativity you dished out but you did it anyway because that is what you wanted most. Now you cannot do this because she does not want you to? You do not truly want to or you would be doing it anyway. In light of this, it would likely be better if you continue on as you have been, doing what you want and allow her to move on.


It would likely be better if I continue on as I have been? With all due respect, that would be wrong for myself, my son, my parents, my sister, my friends, my co workers, etc. I politely decline your suggestion. 

I allowed myself to be sucked into a pit of alcohol and depression. I have pulled myself out of it and will be the best man I can be irrespective of being married or single.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

musiclover said:


> You took your wife for granted and she's had enough. You did what you wanted and thought she would just put up. Now she's gone and you want to change.
> 
> I've said this before here; for the life of me I cannot understand why some people can love someone so much but feel it's okay to mistreat them..
> 
> ...


She did say "we've had an OK marriage, but I want a great one".....so I feel like I've really highlighted some of the bad parts and completely overlooked all the good memories we've had and all the times I HAVE been there for her. I was a much better husband than a lot of people in this world, but I wasn't the best I could be. So, yes I will learn from this one way or another.....either for her or someone else if and when that time comes.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> *She did say "we've had an OK marriage, but I want a great one"*.....so I feel like I've really highlighted some of the bad parts and completely overlooked all the good memories we've had and all the times I HAVE been there for her. I was a much better husband than a lot of people in this world, but I wasn't the best I could be. So, yes I will learn from this one way or another.....either for her or someone else if and when that time comes.


I wonder what what expectations there are to accomplish this?

Do you really understand how she defines "great"?

We often set ourselves up for disappointment in this illusion.

It is easy to love when things are strong... the real test of love comes when things are weak.

Stay kind, stay respectful, stay loving, stay understanding... but one may not be able to stay through them all.

Keep growing, consider letting go of the scorecard... it will not serve you well.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

Emerging Buddhist said:


> I wonder what what expectations there are to accomplish this?
> 
> Do you really understand how she defines "great"?
> 
> ...


Thank you for your words. I have been kinda and positive through all the negative and coldness she has shown me the past 2 months....mostly because I know I deserve this. I have no problem being the husband she always dreamed of me being for the final months of our marriage irrespective of her being a good wife to me. I'm trying to mentally prep myself for the time when/if she says she has met someone. It's out of my hands, so I can only be the best man/husband I can be. 

These thoughts consume me every hour of every day....I need to chill out and let go, but it's so hard to not care and not feel horrible for how deficient of a husband I had been.


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## NoChoice (Feb 12, 2012)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> It would likely be better if I continue on as I have been? With all due respect, that would be wrong for myself, my son, my parents, my sister, my friends, my co workers, etc. I politely decline your suggestion.
> 
> I allowed myself to be sucked into a pit of alcohol and depression. I have pulled myself out of it and will be the best man I can be irrespective of being married or single.


I never considered that this would need clarifying but "continue on as you have been" as in stopping the alcohol abuse, treating your depression, etc. with the exception of trying to "win her back", since you seem less than intent on that aspect.


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## Emerging Buddhist (Apr 7, 2016)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> Thank you for your words. I have been kinda and positive through all the negative and coldness she has shown me the past 2 months....mostly because I know I deserve this. I have no problem being the husband she always dreamed of me being for the final months of our marriage irrespective of her being a good wife to me. I'm trying to mentally prep myself for the time when/if she says she has met someone. It's out of my hands, so I can only be the best man/husband I can be.
> 
> These thoughts consume me every hour of every day....I need to chill out and let go, but it's so hard to not care and not feel horrible for how deficient of a husband I had been.


I hear and understand your goals, but you may never be successful doing it to her dreams.

Change doesn't come from outside influences, but from within... and it doesn't happen based on expectations.

Just be the best you can be for yourself right now, this moment... look at the anxiety you are placing on yourself "mentally prepping" yourself for something you don't really know the outcome of.

You are stealing your peace from it, and while she may not see your reasoning behind it, she is seeing you without it and that is a flag for her to not trust the moment in the least, and her future at the most because she too is falling into the same pitfall.

I know it's hard, but you have to trust the process when all around you feels painful.

It is out of your hands for everything but you... just take a deep breath and forgive yourself for yesterday, then let go and be aware of how "great" you can be today, because today is all you can try for.

Not yesterday, not tomorrow.

Today.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

BobSimmons said:


> Come on man, be honest, because you haven't really been honest through the entire marriage and even now.
> 
> You wouldn't be happy if she walked out and started seeing another man and brought said man into your child's life. Flowery language is all well and good but if you're not being genuine you will say all this stuff, she will hold you to your word (since you've apparently changed) and then where will you be? Extremely bitter and unhappy.
> 
> ...


Do you know if that happens? A woman taking back a man AFTER a divorced is finalized if he really did make all the changes he needed to make in himself?


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> Do you know if that happens? A woman taking back a man AFTER a divorced is finalized if he really did make all the changes he needed to make in himself?


Pretty much anything you can imagine has happened at some point or another, so sure. It's happened. Some people also get repeatedly struck by lightning.

I think you are far too wrapped up in the outcome and are absolutely panicked and desperate, and that is what is motivating and driving your changes. This is an all to common response to the I Love you but am not in love with you, I want a divorce revelation. Far more common than a woman taking the man back.

You have very successfully created a textbook Walk Away Wife. You should read up on that to better understand the dynamics of what is going on here. You will be far better served if you actually start focusing on yourself and completely let go of any desired outcome. That is out of your hands now, and the desperation that comes through in your posts is setting you up for a huge fall and a whole lot of hurt.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

samyeagar said:


> Pretty much anything you can imagine has happened at some point or another, so sure. It's happened. Some people also get repeatedly struck by lightning.
> 
> I think you are far too wrapped up in the outcome and are absolutely panicked and desperate, and that is what is motivating and driving your changes. This is an all to common response to the I Love you but am not in love with you, I want a divorce revelation. Far more common than a woman taking the man back.
> 
> You have very successfully created a textbook Walk Away Wife. You should read up on that to better understand the dynamics of what is going on here. You will be far better served if you actually start focusing on yourself and completely let go of any desired outcome. That is out of your hands now, and the desperation that comes through in your posts is setting you up for a huge fall and a whole lot of hurt.


Can't argue anything you're saying based off what I've offered. I suppose I'm looking for some form of reassurance of validation here.....validation for what....I don't know. I feel in my heart I'm closer to letting her go than I let on here, but it's still extremely hard to process and accept. I looked up the WAW syndrome and took comfort from the fact that many many husbands do change. They just needed to lose their first wife to make that change. It doesn't make anything that I did right.....but at least at 32, I have hope for a much healthier, happier future. 

And I am committed to helping my current wife find her form of happiness. Tomorrow is a Saturday and we have plants to take our son to a pumpkin farm in the morning, then take him to a 1 year old birthday party in the afternoon....then the two of us will get sushi and watch a movie at home at night.

Not many of those days left in this marriage so I will cherish them while they're here.


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## musiclover (Apr 26, 2017)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> She did say "we've had an OK marriage, but I want a great one".....so I feel like I've really highlighted some of the bad parts and completely overlooked all the good memories we've had and all the times I HAVE been there for her. I was a much better husband than a lot of people in this world, but I wasn't the best I could be. So, yes I will learn from this one way or another.....either for her or someone else if and when that time comes.


I'm sure you had a lot of great times together. I hope you two can work it out. I really do. You sound like a good guy, just got complacent.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

My advice to you is to follow the modified 180.

As in do not bring up any discussions about the marriage.

She needs to bring it up.

You need to act like you don't have a care in the world. Make your self more attractive.

Needy isn't attractive. 

You appear to be playing everything right. Dress nicer. Fresh haircuts. Friendly positive yet aloof.

Keeping the marriage needs to be her idea. You can't force it but if you make yourself more fun and attractive
she may decide she wants to work on it.

If she wants to talk, don't break down and beg. Let her know that you don't want a divorce, that you know
you haven't been the best husband apologize ONCE and only once for it and then change the subject.

Do not let it turn into a bash the old you session. Walk away from those. 

I can't emphasize enough that fixing the marriage has to be her idea and you have to put that idea in her head by
your actions and not by convincing her in conversation.


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## Evinrude58 (Jun 16, 2014)

You never know about the future. But one thing is certain, you will never find happiness if you return to drinking.

She will not ever consider coming back to you as long as you still want her. You really need to move on. Don't date if you want another chance. But if you want the truth, your hope of getting her back is the worst enemy you have in doing so.

She's letting you do fun things with her. Keep doing that until she starts dating. Once she does, forget her and move on. 
The only one who knows if she's got it in her to come back is her. I'll bet on one thing: if she comes back and you decide to drink or don't give her sex, you'll never get a third shot at her. The second you are wanting is extremely unlikely.
If you're as bad as you say for as long as you say, she'd be dumb to give you another chance. But love makes us do stupid ****. So I think you have a tiny shot:


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## Archangel2 (Sep 25, 2014)

It may be useful to look at the thread from @DayOne in the Reconciliation forum. He torpedoed his marriage but went through hell and back to reconcile with his wife.


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## Adelais (Oct 23, 2013)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> Do you know if that happens? A woman taking back a man AFTER a divorced is finalized if he really did make all the changes he needed to make in himself?


It is rare, but it happens. I know a couple who did that. Mind you, they were completely divorced, going their own ways, and married a few years later. I've heard of it a couple of other times.

Don't get your hopes up. Work on you. You will be a better man for it. Never again treat a woman you love the way you treated your wife, unless you want to hurt her and lose her.


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## Whatsright86 (Jun 24, 2017)

It's great that you've made so many improvements to your life. 

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but if I try to put myself in your wife's shoes, it sounds like you're improving yourself to reconcile the marriage.
Logically that's ok, but I know some people who would feel a lot of pressure and guilt because they feel like they're forcing you to change into someone you're really not. To them, your change is not genuine.

The main point you have to bring out is that you are doing this for YOU only. Don't get hung up on the results. Tell her, and show her that THIS IS THE NEW YOU, regardless of whether or not she decides to stay or not.

Don’t ever tell her or hint to her in any way that you’ve done all these improvements so she should stay. Don’t let her know that you’re doing any of this for her. Women can read body language better than men, so the only way to do that is truly believe it yourself. Live up to your potential FOR YOURSELF.

Open the door and let her decide. Tell her “I want you to stay, but if you choose to leave, I will respect your decision.” If she stays, it’ll be of her free will.

Good luck and stay strong!


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

Whatsright86 said:


> It's great that you've made so many improvements to your life.
> 
> Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but if I try to put myself in your wife's shoes, it sounds like you're improving yourself to reconcile the marriage.
> Logically that's ok, but I know some people who would feel a lot of pressure and guilt because they feel like they're forcing you to change into someone you're really not. To them, your change is not genuine.
> ...


I suppose you're right.....part of me is fixing myself just to save this marriage. I'm actively trying to let her go and move on. She had an hour long phone chat with my sister this past weekend and my sister told me I need to move on. The only chance I could ever have would be to completely let her go and set her free. It's just very hard go give up on......even though she hasn't been acting like my true "wife" for months. It's starting to get hard to stay in love with someone who clearly doesn't love you back in the same way. 

I'll learn from my mistakes and grow from this experience.....somehow.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

So as a divorced woman who went through TWO sh**ty husbands who sound just like you have been, what I am dying to know is... WHY? WHY all this time have you treated her so horribly, and WHY did you think this was ok to do?? Please please please stay on your path of self improvement, so that you do not end up doing this same thing to someone else in the future. As far as your wife goes, let her go. I have been that mistreated wife who got to the point of DONE, and that was it....done. She will have more respect for you going forward if you stop trying to keep her and just let her go, which leads to better co-parenting for you both. Win-win for your child.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

3Xnocharm said:


> So as a divorced woman who went through TWO sh**ty husbands who sound just like you have been, what I am dying to know is... WHY? WHY all this time have you treated her so horribly, and WHY did you think this was ok to do?? Please please please stay on your path of self improvement, so that you do not end up doing this same thing to someone else in the future. As far as your wife goes, let her go. I have been that mistreated wife who got to the point of DONE, and that was it....done. She will have more respect for you going forward if you stop trying to keep her and just let her go, which leads to better co-parenting for you both. Win-win for your child.


I've spent a lot of time thinking about that and my reasons are not good.....but they are the following: I never dealt with my personal issues in my early-mid 20s, got married to a woman who loved/accepted me for who I was in the hopes I would change/improve, continued to let my problems worsen and worsen, took out my pain on my wife.....and boom. She leaves me at 32. I have spent nearly every waking moment these past two months trying to understand why I did what I did. I want to somehow forgive myself, let go of my wife, and learn from my horrendous and unforgivable mistakes. At 32, I feel hopeful that both my wife and I can find peace one day apart from one another while co parenting our angel of a son. 

This past weekend she said "you've left permanent scars on my soul". We then went to a 1 year old bday party together the next day as a family and she did not wear her wedding rings. My friends took notice. We FaceTimed this morning so I can talk to our son as I am out of town for work, and it was a pleasant 15 minute chat where she compliment me on how well i was dressed. We chatted a bit and everything seemed ok. She then texted me/g chatted me today saying she bought a wedding gift for a friend of mine....a wedding she isn't going to....I told her she doesn't have to do things like that for me anymore as I know she and I both need to start actively detaching to move on. She understood and agreed. 

It's all just very painful. If i may ask....did your two husbands change after you left them? Did they feel true remorse? As I said before, I changed because my wife left me/is leaving me...I can admit that....but I want to actively work on myself for the rest of my life so I never make these mistakes again. I won't be married to this wonderful woman, but I can finally learn how to be a true man and be an amazing father. Maybe one day I'll be lucky enough to find true love again. I don't know. 

I still need to become the man i can be.....and I need to be that person for a few years before I can think about trying to emotionally connect with someone else.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> It's all just very painful. * If i may ask....did your two husbands change after you left them? Did they feel true remorse? * As I said before, I changed because my wife left me/is leaving me...I can admit that....but I want to actively work on myself for the rest of my life so I never make these mistakes again. I won't be married to this wonderful woman, but I can finally learn how to be a true man and be an amazing father. Maybe one day I'll be lucky enough to find true love again. I don't know.
> 
> I still need to become the man i can be.....and I need to be that person for a few years before I can think about trying to emotionally connect with someone else.


Nope. 

First husband (daughter's dad) did make some positive strides after we split. He ended up getting remarried to a really sweet woman, and I thought he finally was on the right path and was going to be happy. Well, eventually he backslid, went back to how he had been with me, and she ended up divorcing him too. 

My second husband... well he lives alone as an angry, bitter hermit. He hates everyone and everything. He has even alienated his own son and other family members. This is NOT the man I married, he changed so much that I didn't recognize him as the same man. I think this was his true self, and eventually over time, his mask fell off. Real shame too, because I sure loved him.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

3Xnocharm said:


> Nope.
> 
> First husband (daughter's dad) did make some positive strides after we split. He ended up getting remarried to a really sweet woman, and I thought he finally was on the right path and was going to be happy. Well, eventually he backslid, went back to how he had been with me, and she ended up divorcing him too.
> 
> My second husband... well he lives alone as an angry, bitter hermit. He hates everyone and everything. He has even alienated his own son and other family members. This is NOT the man I married, he changed so much that I didn't recognize him as the same man. I think this was his true self, and eventually over time, his mask fell off. Real shame too, because I sure loved him.


I don't know what to say other than I'm really sorry you had to go through that. Nobody deserves to be treated that way. I entirely understand and empathize with what your wrote in your first post to me. 

All I can say for myself is I'm taking my life day to day and trying to do the right thing while maintaining a positive attitude and being grateful for what I do have versus what I've lost or don't have. 

I hope both you and my future ex wife have found/find someone/something that bring happiness.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> I don't know what to say other than I'm really sorry you had to go through that. Nobody deserves to be treated that way. I entirely understand and empathize with what your wrote in your first post to me.
> 
> All I can say for myself is I'm taking my life day to day and trying to do the right thing while maintaining a positive attitude and being grateful for what I do have versus what I've lost or don't have.
> 
> I hope both you and my future ex wife have found/find someone/something that bring happiness.


Thank you for that. I hope you can take a little something away from my example and make sure you dont allow yourself to go back to how you were. Sadly you could end up walking this same path again some day if you did.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

Wanted to provide a brief update here. I went home this past weekend and we had some ups and downs. We started chatting on Friday night and she said "you've left permanent scars on my soul....I'm always anxious when you come home for the weekend". I feel like I handled that well (no idea how to respond to that other than being calm and understanding). She helped my set up the air mattress in the office and nearly fell asleep next to me. She even commented "yeah, you're right. This isn't comfortable." I took one of our cats into the shelter on Saturday to drop her off.....that was extremely difficult but i got through it. Wife, toddler and I then went to a 1 year old bday party and she did not wear her rings while I wore mine. That was also....difficult. She then complained on the drive home how nobody was nice to her. I did my best to be empathetic and understanding....I just tried to listen to her. We then had our formal custody talk that night about what we were going to do. I let some emotions get to me (it was a tough day) and we had a blow up.....but we reconciled the next morning and things got to a somewhat better place. When I left for the airport she came in for a huge and said "you don't have to hug me if you don't want to." I gave her a friendly hug. 

We've been FaceTiming each morning and night so I can talk to our little man (about 30 minutes in total each day). I sent her a formal email on Monday about some divorce logistics (trying to take ownership of this process) and she replied back and ended her reply with "did you remember to RSVP for Jake's rehearsal dinner?" She is not coming to this wedding with me. An hour later she then texted/chatted me telling me she was about to buy a gift for that wedding. I told her she doesn't have to do that type of stuff anymore as I can handle it....she pushed back....I then pushed back and said "well, we're not together anymore, right". She got mad and told me I was having an emotional mood swing. I immediately called her and talked her down and explained my position. She understood and agreed. On Mondays, she drops our toddler off as her grandma's house for day care (we have a nanny the other 4 days of the week) so instead of FaceTiming that night, she always calls me on her way home so i can say hi to our little dude. He doesn't talk back much so it's usually just her and me talking.....we ended up talking for a half hour about divorce stuff (she brought it up) and how we were both processing it. I told her the blowup on Saturday would never happen again.....claimed it was a tough day and I was doing my best to process it.....talked about how I'm still learning to be comfortable being this new person, new man.....we talked about how our priority is our son and we're both committed to making this process as smooth as possible for him. She said her lawyer friend told her that "this is the smoothest and most peaceful divorce process I've ever seen". I finished the phone call talking about how wonderful of a mother she is how I'm committed to making sure our relationship going forward will be smooth and comfortable....and the last thing I want is her to ever feel anxious or uncomfortable around me. I know I probably talked too much about all this with her, but she ended it by telling me how grateful she was I said all the things I said. We then made plans to take our son to a pumpkin farm this Saturday when I'm home. 

The divorce train is still moving forward but I'm saying all the right things and (mostly) doing all the right things. I am very committed to finally being a man....the man I always envisioned I could be....the man she hoped I would become when she married me..... At times, things even feel like they are normal between us and we joke around and are playful. I just try to make her and my son laugh every time we all interact. I'm also trying to take ownership of every little task around the house and in this divorce process.....basically trying to be the masculine husband/father figure that takes care of his family. 

We're not selling our house until March/April.....will likely file for divorce in mid November....divorce will be official in mid May (6 months waiting period if California)....I'm starting to plan my life without her.....but what else can I do other what I'm doing? I still love her. She tells me she still loves me but not romantically....and she cites her anger/resentment towards me. 

While I obviously want her back....more importantly I want to wake up in 6, 12, 18 months / 30 years and feel comfortable and confident in my own skin. I feel like I'm getting there.....and each day is another opportunity to prove to myself that I can be this mature adult and be grateful for what I have versus what I don't have......not be angry at family (have all been wonderful to me), friends (every single one has stepped up for me), job (I have a prestigious and fantastic job), healthy (two months sober and very fit), son (trying to be the father figure he deserves)....I used to complained about ALL of those to my wife ALL the time. Not good. Definitely not indicative of a masculine, fatherly/husbandly leader. 

If anyone has any additional advice for me, I'm all ears (er...eyes). I know this is illogical but I still can't imagine emotionally committing to another woman.....I feel like I'll never fully fall out of love with my life and any future woman would suffer from that if our relationship progressed. I know that's ridiculous to say now, but it's how I feel. 

So yeah.....don't know what else to say. Each day is a little better than the last (9 weeks since she said she was out of love with me and 3.5 weeks since the D bomb....9 weeks sober). Hopefully, I can make peace with everything and continue to work on myself. I selfishly want her back....and I still have this weird nugget of hope.....but I am getting more comfortable with everything.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> Wanted to provide a brief update here. I went home this past weekend and we had some ups and downs. We started chatting on Friday night and she said "you've left permanent scars on my soul....I'm always anxious when you come home for the weekend". I feel like I handled that well (no idea how to respond to that other than being calm and understanding). She helped my set up the air mattress in the office and nearly fell asleep next to me. She even commented "yeah, you're right. This isn't comfortable." I took one of our cats into the shelter on Saturday to drop her off.....that was extremely difficult but i got through it. Wife, toddler and I then went to a 1 year old bday party and she did not wear her rings while I wore mine. That was also....difficult. She then complained on the drive home how nobody was nice to her. I did my best to be empathetic and understanding....I just tried to listen to her. We then had our formal custody talk that night about what we were going to do. I let some emotions get to me (it was a tough day) and we had a blow up.....but we reconciled the next morning and things got to a somewhat better place. When I left for the airport she came in for a huge and said "you don't have to hug me if you don't want to." I gave her a friendly hug.
> 
> We've been FaceTiming each morning and night so I can talk to our little man (about 30 minutes in total each day). I sent her a formal email on Monday about some divorce logistics (trying to take ownership of this process) and she replied back and ended her reply with "did you remember to RSVP for Jake's rehearsal dinner?" She is not coming to this wedding with me. An hour later she then texted/chatted me telling me she was about to buy a gift for that wedding. I told her she doesn't have to do that type of stuff anymore as I can handle it....she pushed back....I then pushed back and said "well, we're not together anymore, right". She got mad and told me I was having an emotional mood swing. I immediately called her and talked her down and explained my position. She understood and agreed. On Mondays, she drops our toddler off as her grandma's house for day care (we have a nanny the other 4 days of the week) so instead of FaceTiming that night, she always calls me on her way home so i can say hi to our little dude. He doesn't talk back much so it's usually just her and me talking.....we ended up talking for a half hour about divorce stuff (she brought it up) and how we were both processing it. I told her the blowup on Saturday would never happen again.....claimed it was a tough day and I was doing my best to process it.....talked about how I'm still learning to be comfortable being this new person, new man.....we talked about how our priority is our son and we're both committed to making this process as smooth as possible for him. She said her lawyer friend told her that "this is the smoothest and most peaceful divorce process I've ever seen". I finished the phone call talking about how wonderful of a mother she is how I'm committed to making sure our relationship going forward will be smooth and comfortable....and the last thing I want is her to ever feel anxious or uncomfortable around me. I know I probably talked too much about all this with her, but she ended it by telling me how grateful she was I said all the things I said. We then made plans to take our son to a pumpkin farm this Saturday when I'm home.
> 
> ...


We also decided that we won't sell our wedding rings until one of us remarries. We'll then use the proceeds for our son's college fund.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

It sounds like you are on the right track, for sure. It makes things so much easier when you can be cooperative with each other like you are doing. Both of my divorces were amicable, I was not out to screw anyone over and that sure seems to make things go more smoothly. I think you are doing very well. Right now you cannot imagine another relationship because you are still working your way through the loss of this one. That will come in time, there is no other way than to let things run their course. I really hope you are able to make real, permanent changes, I sure would hate for you to end up like my two ex's.


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## HerKnight (Oct 19, 2017)

Thinking about a Hail Mary, here. It's not for everyone, but it may work and be exciting in the process. Consider morphing your marriage into a Female Led Relationship. Think of her becoming your Queen, and you becoming her Knight. The Lady is in charge and you live to serve her. Look it up, it's very fun.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

HerKnight said:


> Thinking about a Hail Mary, here. It's not for everyone, but it may work and be exciting in the process. Consider morphing your marriage into a Female Led Relationship. Think of her becoming your Queen, and you becoming her Knight. The Lady is in charge and you live to serve her. Look it up, it's very fun.


Huh? I am confused.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

3Xnocharm said:


> It sounds like you are on the right track, for sure. It makes things so much easier when you can be cooperative with each other like you are doing. Both of my divorces were amicable, I was not out to screw anyone over and that sure seems to make things go more smoothly. I think you are doing very well. Right now you cannot imagine another relationship because you are still working your way through the loss of this one. That will come in time, there is no other way than to let things run their course. I really hope you are able to make real, permanent changes, I sure would hate for you to end up like my two ex's.


I appreciate your honest feedback. I know this is a selfish thing to ask, but is it possible she somehow someway comes back to me? All our interactions have been pleasant and anytime there's the slightest hint of disagreement, we immediately talk about it and each go over how we're feeling about what is happening. We agree it's the best way to process everything as we move forward. It's a complete 180 (not the "180" but just an 180) on how we've dealt with disagreements/conflict before. We FaceTimed last night.....I was in a Mexican restaurant and was drinking a Dr Pepper out of a beer glass.....she abruptly asked "what are you drinking" and examined it for about four seconds. This morning she told me she thought it was a Guinness. 

She clearly still cares or is concerned or worries about my continuing improvement.....I'm not saying that's going to alleviate her anger towards me or make her fall back in love with me.....but as a woman, what do you think is going through her mind were we're constantly interacting and she's constantly monitoring my "improvement". 

I really, really want to let her go and move on if this is done and over with.....but she doesn't doesn't seem completely detached. I feel like I have to take more active steps to move on from her and the marriage. Everything has been on her terms.....she would reply that everything was on my terms before. 

But at the same time she may be talking to another guy. Who knows.


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## HerKnight (Oct 19, 2017)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> Huh? I am confused.


Sorry about not being more clear. I know a few marriages that have been saved when the couple has agreed to a little power exchange in which the Lady becomes the complete head of household, or Loving Female Authority. It's certainly not for everyone, and will likely get a lot of counter-arguments here.

It might be worth it for you to do a little research on the terms Loving Female Authority or Female Led Marriage. If you think you'd be willing, write down a few ideas and run it past your wife. She may think you're crazy, or it could become a dream marriage ... or both!


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

HerKnight said:


> Sorry about not being more clear. I know a few marriages that have been saved when the couple has agreed to a little power exchange in which the Lady becomes the complete head of household, or Loving Female Authority. It's certainly not for everyone, and will likely get a lot of counter-arguments here.
> 
> It might be worth it for you to do a little research on the terms Loving Female Authority or Female Led Marriage. If you think you'd be willing, write down a few ideas and run it past your wife. She may think you're crazy, or it could become a dream marriage ... or both!


I appreciate that, but my wife has told herself, and me, and anyone who will listen....that she is done. The only way I could "save this" would be she changed her mind on her own. It's completely out of my control. All I'm trying to do is be the best man I can be and the best husband I can be while I'm still married. I wish she would come back and she knows that.....but I'm trying to show to myself and to her that I'm ready to move on.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> I wish she would come back and she knows that.....but I'm trying to show to myself and to her that I'm ready to move on.


This dynamic needs to change.

You need to let her know in a loving manner that you will be ok without her.

She needs to see you having fun with friends.

You need to avoid forcing any emotional communication with her. 

People want what they can't have and she sees you as needy right now.

Needy isn't attractive at all.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

ButtPunch said:


> This dynamic needs to change.
> 
> You need to let her know in a loving manner that you will be ok without her.
> 
> ...


I understand that and am trying to do that but she was the one who pursued me before we dated....she pursued the engagement....she pushed the marriage through. And now I'm finally fighting for her and she says no? It's just hard to reconcile. 

But I'm actively trying to move on.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> *I appreciate that, but my wife has told herself, and me, and anyone who will listen....that she is done. *The only way I could "save this" would be she changed her mind on her own. It's completely out of my control. All I'm trying to do is be the best man I can be and the best husband I can be while I'm still married. I wish she would come back and she knows that.....but I'm trying to show to myself and to her that I'm ready to move on.


Ok so this is what she is telling you, being fully honest... so believe her. I have been there, I have been DONE. I can tell you that there was not one single thing that could have changed, been said, or done, that would have made me change my mind and stay. NOTHING. You say she is having problems detaching, it really isn't about not being able to detach. Its more like, even though you no longer want to be married to someone, you still care about them so it feels good to be able to communicate honestly, as friends/family. Even though I no longer felt that special "spouse" love at the end of my marriages, I still loved and cared about them as my family. And my first husband was my daughter's dad, so it was important to be able to communicate. My second husband stopped talking to me once I started dating, about a year into our split, but until then, we were friendly.


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## ButtPunch (Sep 17, 2014)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> I understand that and am trying to do that but she was the one who pursued me before we dated....she pursued the engagement....she pushed the marriage through. And now I'm finally fighting for her and she says no? It's just hard to reconcile.
> 
> But I'm actively trying to move on.


and She will push a reconciliation thru if she wants one.

You are doing a good job.

Don't force the issue.

If you pull away a little, she may chase.

But smothering her will not work.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

3Xnocharm said:


> Ok so this is what she is telling you, being fully honest... so believe her. I have been there, I have been DONE. I can tell you that there was not one single thing that could have changed, been said, or done, that would have made me change my mind and stay. NOTHING. You say she is having problems detaching, it really isn't about not being able to detach. Its more like, even though you no longer want to be married to someone, you still care about them so it feels good to be able to communicate honestly, as friends/family. Even though I no longer felt that special "spouse" love at the end of my marriages, I still loved and cared about them as my family. And my first husband was my daughter's dad, so it was important to be able to communicate. My second husband stopped talking to me once I started dating, about a year into our split, but until then, we were friendly.


But your two husbands did not change. I am.....that's what I'm holding my hat on.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> But your two husbands did not change. I am.....that's what I'm holding my hat on.


Your wife does not care about the change. You must change for you. To be the man you want to be. That has nothing to do with your wife.


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

samyeagar said:


> Your wife does not care about the change. You must change for you. To be the man you want to be. That has nothing to do with your wife.


She cares about the change....she wants me to change....just right now it doesn't seem to affect her decision to come back or not.


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## Whatsright86 (Jun 24, 2017)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> She cares about the change....she wants me to change....just right now it doesn't seem to affect her decision to come back or not.


Everything you say here still oozes the belief that you're changing to save this marriage. Let's hammer that thought to your brain again:

CHANGE ONLY FOR YOURSELF, NOT FOR THE MARRIAGE.

Once you TRULY believe that,
- it doesn't matter if she cares about the change or not.
- it doesn't matter if she stays or not.

I know...it's a lot easier said than done, but that is how it MUST be done. Then you will be much closer to your potential.



ReachingMyPotential said:


> I understand that and am trying to do that but she was the one who pursued me before we dated....she pursued the engagement....she pushed the marriage through. And now I'm finally fighting for her and she says no? It's just hard to reconcile.
> 
> But I'm actively trying to move on.


Try thinking logically and not emotionally, then it will all make sense.
1) She pursued you before, you two got together.
2) She pursued the engagement, you two got together.
3) She pushed the marriage through, you two got together.
4) You fighting for her, you two are breaking off.

All the past successes started with her initiation. What do you think needs to happen for another success? Do you think she should pursue or you should pursue?


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

I wanted to offer a brief update here.....we're meeting with a mediator in a few weeks to begin the formal/legal process. She met with a realtor and we plan to sell our house in Jan/Feb. She took our son to her parent's lake house for Thanksgiving and I went to my sister's house. I've had a few alcohol relapses and yelled at her during one of them. I fear I'm unable to change and become any type of strong/capable man and I feel she is 100% gone. She refuses to sleep under the same roof as me (we switch off who gets to stay in the house but I'm on the road so much for work that it doesn't matter). This past weekend I said I didn't want to sleep out of the house anymore when I was working from our home city and she lost her mind and told me how ****ty of a husband I always had been....called me selfish....said I haven't changed one bit. She seems to be right. For whatever reason, I just can't committ to being completely sober and always being calm around her. I can't control my anger/sadness when I have to interact with her and it shows. After she gave me the "****ty husband" speech I told her i would commit to her schedule of us swapping nights in the house when I'm in town for work. I went into my own little speech about how I'm trying to be better but this is all so hard bla bla bla....and she started to cry. 

Honestly....I don't feel I'm strong enough to get through this and become the man/father I want to become. I feel safe anonymously posting this to a message board...but I just don't see the light at the end of the tunnel. I know that quitting drinking is a non starter....but how do I get myself to be able to do that for the rest of my life? Step 2 is to eat healthy/workout....Step 3 is to focus on doing well at work. 

Maybe then I can be at a place of peace? I don't see her ever coming back but I just want to get to a point where I'm not an emotional roller coaster every time I see her. I also want to be an amazing father for my son....but it's so ****ing difficult. Really not trying to be a victim.....but I simply don't feel strong enough. 

I'm out of the country for work this week and can't help but feel painfully alone and depressed. I miss my wife and son so much. My actions caused the destruction of my family and I have no idea what the path forward is.

The 180 or whatever plan in moving on sounds great in theory....but how do you actually deal with the pain of losing everything? I'm 3.5 months into this journey and things just keep getting worse. 

If anyone has any advice.....please share. I'm not trying to be the man she always wanted anymore. I'm just trying to be a man period....and not a selfish scared little boy.


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## farsidejunky (Mar 19, 2014)

If you want to be a man, stop avoiding pain.

Life is filled with pain. One's ability to deal with it is what sets men apart from boys. Men do the right thing even when **** is coming apart around them. Boys hide and hope for the best.

This also ties into the other problem, which is you clearly not loving yourself. If you want to start loving yourself, take life one decision at a time. 

When you make the right decision, it builds self-love. When you make the wrong decision, it tears it away. It probably takes ten good decisions to counterbalance one poor one.

Lastly, get the book Hold On To Your N.U.T.'s. It will give you the foundation to live your life exactly as I described above.


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

Potential,

The entire thread sounds desperate.

Are you in IC?

Do you have anyone you trust to which you can tell the truth?

Life is not a torrent of emotion and dancing on pins and needles.

That's what you're doing.

STOP

Just STOP


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

One, are you in AA? If not, sign up and start going.

Two, are you seeing a counselor? You can get one that does phone counseling.

Three, what was your own father like? Was he someone to admire? Or was he a bad role model?

Four, are you religious?


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## ReachingMyPotential (Oct 12, 2017)

1. Went for two weeks when I was in my home city and it seemed to work/help.....but I started travelling for work and it all fell apart. 

2. Yes....for several years. I haven't made much progress with him. 

3. Great provider and a good man....but in the 3.5 months this has been going on, the extent of his advise has been a "keep your chin up" over a 5 minute phone call. He comes from a different generation and didn't have a father growing up. I'm overly sensitive.....so it's a bad mix. Again, he was a great provider and I don't blame him for anything....but he never taught me how to be a man. He wouldn't even let me help him fix things around the house because he assumed I would mess up and just wanted to do it himself. 

4. Mom forced my sister and I to go to Mass every Sunday....went to catholic school my whole life (including college). Dad never went to Mass other than on Christmas....so organized religion (at least Catholicism) seemed like a scam if my Mom claimed it was so important but my Dad never cared enough to go. I feel I'm agnostic. I want to believe in something....but I don't know what that is. I believe people are inherently good but I'm not sure that's driven by a higher power,


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You can find AA in every town in America. Probably all over the world. Excuses.

Then you find a different therapist, one who gives you homework and holds you accountable. Excuses.

So you didn't have a good male role model thus you have no idea how to BE one. You need to find one. Get creative.

Then you can't go to church for that role model. But you never know. My H was raised Catholic and switched to Lutheran (lazy Catholic) because, well, they're so much better, lol. You may want to try a different church, like a Lutheran one or a nondenominational one. They often offer a lot of ways to help someone in your position. And if that doesn't work, look around and reach out to someone who you think would be a good help. Some man you work with and admire, a friend, a friend's father. Find someone male who can guide you.


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## 3Xnocharm (Jun 22, 2012)

You absolutely NEED AA, that is IF you really want to stop drinking. I get the feeling you still have not hit your rock bottom that will make you truly want to quit. Doing it for your wife, or even your kids, will not work. You aren't worth a damn as a partner to ANYONE as long as you keep drinking, as well as not being your best self. 

AA has chapters in every city in the US... I would be willing to bet you can find it abroad as well. If not AA, I would bet that there are equivalents to AA pretty much anywhere you go. You stated that you will need help doing this for the long haul, and AA and a sponsor are your best bet for long term success.


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## FieryHairedLady (Mar 24, 2011)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> I've spent a lot of time thinking about that and my reasons are not good.....but they are the following: I never dealt with my personal issues in my early-mid 20s, got married to a woman who loved/accepted me for who I was in the hopes I would change/improve, continued to let my problems worsen and worsen, took out my pain on my wife.....and boom. She leaves me at 32. I have spent nearly every waking moment these past two months trying to understand why I did what I did. I want to somehow forgive myself, let go of my wife, and learn from my horrendous and unforgivable mistakes. At 32, I feel hopeful that both my wife and I can find peace one day apart from one another while co parenting our angel of a son.
> 
> This past weekend she said "you've left permanent scars on my soul". We then went to a 1 year old bday party together the next day as a family and she did not wear her wedding rings. My friends took notice. We FaceTimed this morning so I can talk to our son as I am out of town for work, and it was a pleasant 15 minute chat where she compliment me on how well i was dressed. We chatted a bit and everything seemed ok. She then texted me/g chatted me today saying she bought a wedding gift for a friend of mine....a wedding she isn't going to....I told her she doesn't have to do things like that for me anymore as I know she and I both need to start actively detaching to move on. She understood and agreed.
> 
> ...


GET OFF YOUR AZZ and fight for her! QUIT FEELING SORRY FOR YOURSELF!!

"'This past weekend she said "you've left permanent scars on my soul". ""

What was your response to this?

It should of been something along the lines of "I am very sorry, I did not realize how much I was hurting you and our marriage. I can't change our past, but I can change our future, if you'll give me a chance. I still love you and I want to save our marriage."

"She then texted me/g chatted me today saying she bought a wedding gift for a friend of mine....a wedding she isn't going to....I told her she doesn't have to do things like that for me anymore as I know she and I both need to start actively detaching to move on. She understood and agreed."

WTH are you doing? Never introduce a negative divorce promote into the conversation!! You said you want to stay together, she buys a gift, trying to be wifely, and you remind her that she wants to divorce you and that you both need to quit doing things like that for each other? And that it is time to detach and move on!??!

NO

You should of thanked her for being such a wonderful wife and so attentive to details.

She took her rings off.

You should of took her aside and let her know she is still married to you and you would like her to continue to be married to you and to please put them back on.

Don't beg.

She needs to know you give a damn!

You have made some great changes. But you need to show her you care! That you are willing to fight for this marriage! 

MAN UP!!


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## FieryHairedLady (Mar 24, 2011)

ReachingMyPotential said:


> I wanted to offer a brief update here.....we're meeting with a mediator in a few weeks to begin the formal/legal process. She met with a realtor and we plan to sell our house in Jan/Feb. She took our son to her parent's lake house for Thanksgiving and I went to my sister's house. I've had a few alcohol relapses and yelled at her during one of them. I fear I'm unable to change and become any type of strong/capable man and I feel she is 100% gone. She refuses to sleep under the same roof as me (we switch off who gets to stay in the house but I'm on the road so much for work that it doesn't matter). This past weekend I said I didn't want to sleep out of the house anymore when I was working from our home city and she lost her mind and told me how ****ty of a husband I always had been....called me selfish....said I haven't changed one bit. She seems to be right. For whatever reason, I just can't committ to being completely sober and always being calm around her. I can't control my anger/sadness when I have to interact with her and it shows. After she gave me the "****ty husband" speech I told her i would commit to her schedule of us swapping nights in the house when I'm in town for work. I went into my own little speech about how I'm trying to be better but this is all so hard bla bla bla....and she started to cry.
> 
> Honestly....I don't feel I'm strong enough to get through this and become the man/father I want to become. I feel safe anonymously posting this to a message board...but I just don't see the light at the end of the tunnel. I know that quitting drinking is a non starter....but how do I get myself to be able to do that for the rest of my life? Step 2 is to eat healthy/workout....Step 3 is to focus on doing well at work.
> 
> ...


Sorry to read this update. You really screwed up. You were doing a great job showing her the new you, then you wnet back to drinking and screaming at her and saying YOU needed the house for you?

Yeah that doesn't show her love and care. 

This is the worst thing you could of done.


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

Inloveforeverwithhubby said:


> Sorry to read this update. You really screwed up. You were doing a great job showing her the new you, then you wnet back to drinking and screaming at her and saying YOU needed the house for you?
> 
> Yeah that doesn't show her love and care.
> 
> This is the worst thing you could of done.


There was no "new you". His motivations were incorrect. He was showing his wife what he thought she wanted to see out of fear of losing her, and the marriage. That is not change. That is an act that can not be maintained for very long. Change has to come from with in, and without fear of losing.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

As far as drinking, ask your doctor if the drug is still available for drinkers that make them sick if they drink.
You also need a different counselor if he hasn’t done any better than this in eight years.

What you seem to be saying is that the old you is more important than your family and that’s what you’re wife sees to. Men have grit. Wannabes don’t.


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## Archangel2 (Sep 25, 2014)

Archangel2 said:


> It may be useful to look at the thread from @DayOne in the Reconciliation forum. He torpedoed his marriage but went through hell and back to reconcile with his wife.


OP - Did you read @DayOne's thread as I recommended?


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## Thereal853 (Nov 3, 2017)

This post reminds me of a lot of things in my life and my current separation . I’m going thru the “trying to be a better person “ phase and make amends for past mistakes. I took her for granted and didn’t realize how happy i was with her until she left . I’m devastated but doing everything I can possibly do to save my family . I wish I would have read this site years ago , it would have saved my marriage. I was too stubborn and egotistical to think I could ever fail at my marriage because we were so in love . I’ve been humbled and brought to my knees. 

I don’t understand the people that say just let her go . I married , much like the op it seems , to the woman of his dreams and only wanted to marry once . I don’t want to let go and don’t want to give up. I made a promise to myself and to a woman that i will always fight for us no matter what, for better or worse. Am I naive for still hanging onto that idea ? The op is trying to save his family , that’s extremely honorable and takes courage to change. I don’t think it’s ever too late to change , especially for your child, wife and family .


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## samyeagar (May 14, 2012)

Thereal853 said:


> This post reminds me of a lot of things in my life and my current separation . I’m going thru the “trying to be a better person “ phase and make amends for past mistakes. I took her for granted and didn’t realize how happy i was with her until she left . I’m devastated but doing everything I can possibly do to save my family . I wish I would have read this site years ago , it would have saved my marriage. I was too stubborn and egotistical to think I could ever fail at my marriage because we were so in love . I’ve been humbled and brought to my knees.
> 
> I don’t understand the people that say just let her go . I married , much like the op it seems , to the woman of his dreams and only wanted to marry once . I don’t want to let go and don’t want to give up. I made a promise to myself and to a woman that i will always fight for us no matter what, for better or worse. Am I naive for still hanging onto that idea ? The op is trying to save his family , that’s extremely honorable and takes courage to change. I don’t think it’s ever too late to change , especially for your child, wife and family .


This is not directed specifically at you personally, but in general, when I read stuff like this I have to wonder...

Do you always treat the things of your dreams like crap? Where was the dedication to the promise to fight for the marriage when it was all going to hell? Unfortunately in real life, there is such a thing as too little too late, no matter how badly one wants it to be different. There are consequences to actions, regardless of how ignorant one was to the possibility of those consequences.


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## Thereal853 (Nov 3, 2017)

I understand that and appreciate the response . I’ve been coming to grips with that idea as well, I’m sure I’m sitting on a nice throne of denial still . My wife and I always told each other no matter what we would be there for each other and it probably made me take her for granted . Some damage can’t be fixed no matter how hard we try. I’m the one that has to live with the regret and knowing I let that person down like I did . Hindsight is 20 /20 but I sure do regret a lot of things I did wrong in my marriage .


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## ReturntoZero (Aug 31, 2015)

As so often happens, the OP becomes silent.

I won't be interacting again until we hear from him.


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