# What is inappropriate?



## TheGoodWifey (Apr 14, 2014)

I am newly married. When I met my husband, he had only 2 female employees. One, is about our age, and extremely attractive. They are all great friends, and get along nicely in the office. I realized recently that my husband told all of his friends last year that he was dating the attractive one, and that he was very interested in her. Although he swears they had no physical relationship, he admits he did want to date her, but she refused him. 

They are very close, and he admits to discussing everything and anything on a personal basis. Many times, he is alone in the office with her, and she is full time. I feel this relationship is inappropriate now.

I have several problems with their relationship. I know he loves me, but his friends all think he still employs a gal he dated, and had the hots for. She is single, and dresses sexy. She has very large breasts, and quite often leans over his shoulder.

He will fire her, but reluctantly. What should I do? I don't want him to resent me, but feel their relationship is now inappropriate.


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## EasyPartner (Apr 7, 2014)

From what you posted, I cannot really tell the girl did anything wrong... apart from being attractive and having large boobs. And being friends with your husband. 

The fact that he wanted to date her, before you were a couple I imagine, but she rejected him, is not her fault either.

Stronger boundaries about personal talk may be a good idea, difficult to judge.

Truth is, we all meet attractive people every day. The cheaters among us are going to cheat, the other ones wont. If your husband belongs to the first category, fire him instead.

NB: in my country, firing this girl just over what you told, would end in a very costly lawsuit...


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

I don't see the problem.

She's already rejected him, she's actually safer than whoever might replace her.

Your husbands actions involving this woman were inappropriate but I don't see how she's been inappropriate from what you've said here.


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## tainted (Aug 16, 2013)

If there isn't a dress code then have your husband make one up.


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## EasyPartner (Apr 7, 2014)

tainted said:


> If there isn't a dress code then have your husband make one up.


Sure. If a few square inches of cloth are gonna make the difference in regards of OP feeling more secure or her husband cheating or not :rofl:


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## lovelygirl (Apr 15, 2012)

She's not the problem. Your husband is! 
The one who owes you fidelity is your husband and not this girl. 
Sounds like he married you because he couldn't marry her. 

I would say a word or two to the husband. 
The best thing would be to have no contact with her. Can he transfer her to another branch of the company?


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

When did your husband ask her out? 
Was it while you were dating? 

I would be very uncomfortable with their relationship. I would ask him for marriage counselling. He's only not with her, because she rejected him, and now he works with her all day. 

Your husband needs very firm boundaries in place. No it's not ok for him to hang out with some one he's very attracted to alone. No it's not ok for him to confide in some one he's very attracted to. 

I think you need to see if it constitutes an emotional affair on his side ( it can be one sided). You should be his confidant and your relationship problems should never be shared with her. 

I'd also have a problem with the things he's been telling his friends.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

TheGoodWifey said:


> They are very close, and he admits to discussing everything and anything on a personal basis. Many times, he is alone in the office with her, and she is full time. I feel this relationship is inappropriate now.


This ^^^ is very inappropriate.
Your husband seems to be thinking with the wrong head. Which businessman in his right mind would hire a woman whom he pursued and was rejected , to work in that capacity for him?

He's setting himself up for a sexual harassment lawsuit.
Worse yet he spends a lot of time with her in his office,
ALONE.

So lemme see.
This poor damsel is this the only person on the job market with the particular
" skill set and qualifications " that can work for your husband ?

I've seen this sort of scenario before , many times ,and it always goes south , fast.

I also own a business and during the early years we almost exclusively employed women. I never dealt personally with any employee , my wife did. I remember once , a particular new employee , probably in her twenties asked to speak to me during lunch break and we chatted. 
She just wanted to " get familiar."
Ok.
Then I noticed that every time we crossed paths , she would have something flirty to say.
I thought maybe that's how she was.
Then on one particular occasion we were working very late, till 11.00 PM ,so I organized a meal for everyone and hired transport to drop them off at their respective homes .
She decided to as me if I could personally drop her off because she needed to
" ask me something..."

Um, NO.

I told my wife what had happened and told her to give her a termination notice and pay her off.


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

OP, the problem isn't the girl its your husband. Through his behavior he is putting both his marriage and business at risk. In your husbands case it sounds as though he may be in one way emotional affair with this woman. His delusions about him dating her are a tell tale sign of this. He is caught up in a fantasy world.


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## 4yearsnokids (Mar 26, 2014)

IMO this is not about whether he's cheated or not, although I do think that tell her everything is inappropriate. The problem here is that your husband has embarrassed you in front of every person he works with. The problem is that if you ever go to one of his work functions, this woman and everyone else will be looking at you, knowing your husband wants her. WHAT? Heck no no NOOO. I would never tolerate that. 

ALSO...although you said your husband is willing to fire her. Something tells me he's not going to do it...even if you beg him to. I say you should test him. Tell him you'd like him to pull the trigger, then, right before he does, tell him that you've changed your mind & theres not need.

This way, when you go to a work function with him, you can walk in knowing (even if everyone else doesn't) that your husband is willing to put you before this OW.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

Her husband cannot fire an employee because his wife is insecure. That is ridiculous and would most likely cost him his business in lawsuits.

The problem is not the employees, it's the OP's husband. 

He needs to start ensuring that he's NEVER alone with a female employee. EVER.


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## frusdil (Sep 5, 2013)

TheGoodWifey said:


> They are very close, and he admits to discussing everything and anything on a personal basis.


This in and of itself is extremely inappropriate for any worker, let alone a boss. Opposite sex employees should never discuss sex or relationships or any other sensitive personal matters.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

So because your husband is inappropriate and you're insecure,a woman could possibly lose her job? What portion of your mind tells you that this is ok? Don't you feel the slightest bit guilty to be considering putting a person out of a job over something like this?

It's not her fault nor her problem that your husband has/had the 'hots' for her.

If it bothers you that much,tell him to implement a dress code as others suggested.Then he needs to work on his boundaries and treat her like an employee instead of a good friend.

I have sympathy for your situation for sure but the woman doesn't deserve to be fired over this.


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno (Jan 18, 2011)

The time to find out things like this is while dating, before marriage.
Chances are she's been working for him during that time?
Or did he just hire her?
If it's a case where he just hired her, after your marriage, then you need to figure out what you can live with, or can't. But asking someone to be fired where they haven't done anything wrong at work is not going to fly. People can have all kinds of feelings for others, but it's what they do vs. what they think that matters. If you really insist that she is fired and your H goes through with it, you'll be the object of some ridicule in his work place. It will be tough, maybe even tougher than the situation now. Bottom line is that you can't control other people. You can express your own feelings to your H. Let him try to resolve things, but I wouldn't make any ultimatums.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

I'm confused about the timelines. You say you're recently married. How long ago did you get married? How long did you date before getting married?

C


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Your husband made a typical "male" error by hiring someone that is very attractive. I'm not sure why men do this sort of things (especially when married).......I know that most think "eye candy" or always have "getting her to lay" in the back of their mind......it just doesn't make sense to me.

As a married man it would be completely stupid to hire someone that I feel attracted to. It's completely inappropriate and disrespectful.

OP, take it up with HIM (not her). She should not lose her job, heck if she does you might have a lawsuit as well (for her rejecting your husband and losing her job due to rejection).

I would have a serious conversation with him and go over boundaries and rules again. This is a BAD sign.

As for her, use her to your advantage and allow your husband to make himself stronger by dealing with such person etc.

It seems like your husband is just a dog, BUT you do have to give him credit for being honest with you about this situation.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

DoF said:


> *Your husband made a typical "male" error by hiring someone that is very attractive. I'm not sure why men do this sort of things (especially when married)*.......I know that most think "eye candy" or always have "getting her to lay" in the back of their mind......it just doesn't make sense to me.
> 
> *As a married man it would be completely stupid to hire someone that I feel attracted to. *It's completely inappropriate and disrespectful.
> 
> ...



Why should this employee be penalized because OP is insecure and her husband once had the hots for her?

This is a non issue. The employee turned him down. She will eventually be in a relationship with someone else.

OP, get a grip!


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## Shoto1984 (Apr 11, 2009)

Almost always asking for trouble to date (or attempt to date) an employee. That said, I can see how the situation would make you feel uncomfortable, but I don't see where anyone has done anything wrong since the marriage. If your husband has any brains he's going to understand the dangers and steer way clear of them. That includes treating you in such a way as there shouldn't be any doubt that he loves you and that you have all of his attention.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*A committed married man should never behave in such a way. What testament does his behavior say to the marriage! IMHO, it's little more than giving him total carte blanche to pursue "having his cake and eating it to!" As a single girl, she may well be rejecting his advances and intentions right now, but if he continues to gradually wear her down with them, along with promises of wage increases and promotions, she may likely come to change! And if that ultimately happens, then where's the inherent matrimonial benefit for you as his wife?

Greatly provided that he's going to do that and just expect you to sign off on it, he just as well should not be married! To allow him to do so is only permitting him to slap both you and the marriage itself squarely in the face!*


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## MSP (Feb 9, 2012)

TheGoodWifey said:


> She has very large breasts, and quite often leans over his shoulder.


Obviously, the solution is for your husband's business to pay for the woman's breast reduction. I can't believe no one thought of this already. Although, the girls here always insist that men and women can just be friends, so there's really nothing to worry about.

Seriously, though, get rid of her. Now your husband is married, she'll want him even more. Forbidden fruit and all that. (Not that I'm calling your husband a fruit. Although, if he was, it would kind of diminish your problem. Maybe you can turn him).


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

MSP said:


> Seriously, though, get rid of her. Now your husband is married, she'll want him even more. Forbidden fruit and all that. (Not that I'm calling your husband a fruit. Although, if he was, it would kind of diminish your problem. Maybe you can turn him).


Her husband has to be nuts.

She would start thinking that she's entitled to special treatment from him because he likes her. That would create problems among the rest of the staff, they would notice and think she has an unfair advantage over them.
Even worse, is that he speaks of their marital issues with her.

In fact, that employee could file a lawsuit against him and _would_ get other on the staff to support her claims.

He is setting himself up, his business is exposed badly.
Technically, hiring her has made him a legal liability.
He's in a "catch 22" situation.


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## BradWesley (May 24, 2013)

DoF said:


> Your husband made a typical "male" error by hiring someone that is very attractive. I'm not sure why men do this sort of things (especially when married).......I know that most think "eye candy" or always have "getting her to lay" in the back of their mind......it just doesn't make sense to me.
> 
> As a married man it would be completely stupid to hire someone that I feel attracted to. It's completely inappropriate and disrespectful.
> 
> ...


According to your reasoning, I should fire off an e-mail to my VP of Human Resources, advising her to implement a hiring freeze on any attractive women or men, as they may be trouble in the work place!

Damn, are you really serious?


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## sparkyjim (Sep 22, 2012)

frusdil said:


> Her husband cannot fire an employee because his wife is insecure. That is ridiculous and would most likely cost him his business in lawsuits.



Actually this is not true. He can fire her or lay her off for no reason at all. Employment is at his discretion, but he has to be sure that if he does terminate her position it is not a racially or gender based issue.

This one sounds a little gender based and there was a recent case where a dentist laid off a dental hygenist because he felt that he was too attracted to her. The court backed him up unanimously, and although on surface it seems unfair, that is what happened. This was in Iowa, and the court ruled that the decision was based on emotions, not gender, therefore it was not discrimanatory.

The OP's husband is treading on thin ice here and what is needed is a more mature response, such as the one related by Caribbean Man.

He could possibly wind up defending his actions in court. Even though there is a precedent here that does not prevent someone from bringing a case against him. He is digging his own hole here and needs to do something about it.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

BradWesley said:


> According to your reasoning, I should fire off an e-mail to my VP of Human Resources, advising her to implement a hiring freeze on any attractive women or men, as they may be trouble in the work place!
> 
> Damn, are you really serious?


*The problem is clearly not the hiring of "attractive women," per se; it's the married supervisor's/owner's who are making the perceived overt/covert, sexual advances toward women like her! 

And IMHO, a clear majority of HR people would be in total agreement with that!*


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

sparkyjim said:


> *This one sounds a little gender based and there was a recent case where a dentist laid off a dental hygenist because he felt that he was too attracted to her. The court backed him up unanimously, and although on surface it seems unfair, that is what happened. *This was in Iowa, and the court ruled that the decision was based on emotions, not gender, therefore it was not discrimanatory.
> 
> .


I think I remember reading about that case, maybe last year on one of our local business insider websites.

I chuckled at it, [I think the dentist's wife was also behind the firing ]because I had personal knowledge of a similar story with one of my colleagues down here.

A friend of mine and his wife owns a chain of stores.
He starts paying * extra* attention to a new 20 something yr old female Colombian employee his wife hired , because she's Peruvian and wanted to help the girl.

Rumours start circulating, every morning , he purchased a specialty coffee for her, and other things.

One Sunday evening we were hanging out at a sport bar with some other guys and " suddenly" little hottie Colombian and a couple of her friends show up, unexpected , during the night.
She comes across and begins to chat with us, then him.

lol, apparently he forgot the owner of the sport bar was an acquaintance of his wife. She called his wife and told her, immediately.

Monday morning his wife was at the store , accosted little Ms hottie with a loud exchange of words in Spanish, wrote her a cheque and fired her. 

Ironically, little Ms hottie threatened to take it to the courts, but she didn't reach far.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

BradWesley said:


> According to your reasoning, I should fire off an e-mail to my VP of Human Resources, advising her to implement a hiring freeze on any attractive women or men, as they may be trouble in the work place!
> 
> Damn, are you really serious?


NO

I'm talking small business......IF husband has little discipline/self control ONLY.

Nothing wrong with hiring attractive people, but if one is weak, he probably shouldn't.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

I wouldn't want to be married to a man who was so out of control that he had to avoid hiring attractive females.How sad that a woman can be perfect for a job but not get it bc the employer can't manage to behave in a professional manner.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

But he hired her and they had that short dating period before OP came along!

Yes, bad business to date a direct report, but this thread isn't about HR practices. It's about OP not being able to recognize the past is the past. He moved on, met and married OP. The employee has also, no doubt, moved on. Considering it was the employee who turned him down, OP is off her rocker making a mountain out of this mole hill.


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## sparkyjim (Sep 22, 2012)

Anon Pink said:


> OP is off her rocker making a mountain out of this mole hill.


probably.... but it's her rocker and she keeps it in the house where they live... 

SO he better do something about it. I have never heard of anyone being assuaged by the argument that "You're just crazy..."


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## BradWesley (May 24, 2013)

DoF said:


> NO
> 
> I'm talking small business......IF husband has little discipline/self control ONLY.
> 
> ...


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

*I had a General Manager/President of his own firm(Sole Proprietor) years ago who was a semi-religious, old fart who set all the rules. There was no nepotism, except for his own family, and there was a strict fraterinization policy whereby you absolutely could not date anybody who worked there ~ no questions asked. 

Saw two people who got canned over that. Another guy quit so he could date a girl there! After getting canned, another guy threatened to sue the GM, but the GM let him know in no uncertain terms that he would literally bankrupt him with legal expenses in the court room if he ever tried!

All in all, however, it seemed to work out quite well because it kept our minds squarely on our business pursuits!*


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## EasyPartner (Apr 7, 2014)

No nepotism except for his own family :rofl:


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## EasyPartner (Apr 7, 2014)

BradWesley said:


> According to your reasoning, I should fire off an e-mail to my VP of Human Resources, advising her to implement a hiring freeze on any attractive women or men, as they may be trouble in the work place!
> 
> Damn, are you really serious?


Yup, and then you fire VPHR's pretty little a$$ as well :smthumbup:


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## TheGoodWifey (Apr 14, 2014)

I guess that's my biggest problem. He didn't tell me he had told all of his friends that he was dating her. They all think he is keeping his X-squeeze around as his secretary. I think that makes him look pretty bad. He asked her out before meeting me, so no problem there. But I think she now sees what a catch she missed. Just my opinion.
I am not worried about his cheating on me. Our bond is very strong. I just don't like that he didn't tell me the full extent of it, and had business to let her go a year ago after we were engaged, because of what he told all his friends. Now their relationship is closer. I just think it's inappropriate. She has called herself his "office wife". I know he wouldn't allow me to work 40 hours a week, alone in an office, with a man I was very attracted to and wanted to date, prior to meeting him!


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## TheGoodWifey (Apr 14, 2014)

Not possible. There are only two employees, and one is often out, leaving him alone with her many many hours.


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## TheGoodWifey (Apr 14, 2014)

But, once the relationship has been established, how do they revert to simply being co-workers, with no personal interaction? There are only 3 of them in the office, and one is often out on calls, leaving the two of them alone. No, it's not her fault, per se..however, he feels sorry for her, pays her way too much, and their relationship, in my opinion is too close. I don't think that can change at this point.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Ask him to put himself in your shoes.

How would he feel about the situation? 

Personally, I don't think it's appropriate based on your latest post. 

He is asking for trouble......


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## TheGoodWifey (Apr 14, 2014)

She has been in the office for 2 years. He and I met a year and a half ago.


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## TheGoodWifey (Apr 14, 2014)

1) he hired her before he knew me. 2) Neither has done anything wrong. 

I have no doubt he will be faithful. I am concerned about his friends thinking he was "doing" her, and now still has her there.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

TheGoodWifey said:


> 1) he hired her before he knew me. 2) Neither has done anything wrong.
> 
> I have no doubt he will be faithful. I am concerned about his friends thinking he was "doing" her, and now still has her there.


So you'd consider having her fired bc you're worried about appearances then? Does that seem reasonable? 

I'm thinking you need to just stick to being that loving supportive wife who makes her presence known at the office. Don't do it in a snooty way though bc that just makes you look like a child.Bring treats for everyone once in a while,stop by for lunch with your DH,etc.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

TheGoodWifey said:


> 1) he hired her before he knew me. 2) Neither has done anything wrong.
> 
> I have no doubt he will be faithful. I am concerned about his friends thinking he was "doing" her, and now still has her there.


Don't worry about things you can't control (that includes his friends).

You know very well that she refused and he never "did" her. That's all that matters.

If your marriage is doing well, enjoy it. Don't let assumptions bring you down.


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## TheGoodWifey (Apr 14, 2014)

Thank you. I posted a poll, with 3 options, one being that. Its running even between letting her go, and stopping by without notice. I won't push for her termination, unless there's a change in the situation...


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## ReformedHubby (Jan 9, 2013)

ScarletBegonias said:


> I'm thinking you need to just stick to being that loving supportive wife who makes her presence known at the office. Don't do it in a snooty way though bc that just makes you look like a child.Bring treats for everyone once in a while,stop by for lunch with your DH,etc.


This actually works wonders. My wife does this, heck she even brings the kids. She always looks sexy in a casual dressy kind of way when she comes by too. This does a couple of things, it shows my female employees that I'm devoted to my family. And.....it shows them that my wife is super sexy so they have no shot anyway!!!!


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## jaharthur (May 25, 2012)

sparkyjim said:


> Actually this is not true. He can fire her or lay her off for no reason at all. Employment is at his discretion, but he has to be sure that if he does terminate her position it is not a racially or gender based issue.
> 
> This one sounds a little gender based and there was a recent case where a dentist laid off a dental hygenist because he felt that he was too attracted to her. The court backed him up unanimously, and although on surface it seems unfair, that is what happened. This was in Iowa, and the court ruled that the decision was based on emotions, not gender, therefore it was not discrimanatory.
> 
> ...


I wouldn't count on it. While it's true in California, where I live, that there is a presumption that an employee is "at will"--can be terminated for no reason at all--that rule goes out the window if there is evidence of sexual harassment or the like.

A good plaintiff's employment lawyer would have a field day with these facts. The H needs to be very, very careful in how he proceeds. "I fired her because I was attracted to her" would get ripped to shreds as a defense, because it sounds too much like "I fired her because she wouldn't put out for me."

I strongly suggest that the OP and her H get an employment lawyer on board for some advice. I don't say that just because I'm a lawyer or I'm trying to drum up business for my lawyer brethren. An ounce of prevention really is worth a pound of cure.


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

Now that the entire situation is more clear, I have to go with "do Nothing and stop by the office here and there"

I don't think there is anything in appropriate with the entire situation. Originally I thought he asked her out while you 2 were together (but that was prior to your relationship).

Unless this woman changes her mind and he starts acting weird around her/gets distant in the marriage....all is good.

Swing by and even have few words with her (friendly/small talk).


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## HuggyBear (Aug 4, 2012)

Obviously, she must be a capable employee, particularly if she's been there a couple of years, and everything's been getting done.

I'll assume there have been regular raises based on performance.

If we want to talk about "appearances", there would ALWAYS be the "appearance" of "He did her, then dumped her after a while".

If the banter you speak of concerning his friends is well known among them, it is almost certainly known by others.

Sure, just have her fired... inside of a "tool's shed", an axe waiting to be ground will appear at the most inopportune moment.

Why not just get a lawyer to write up an agreement, dig up six month's salary (plus any bonus that might be standard or expected) for her, and offer her the way out?

I've got the feeling that she's just a friend to your husband, and that they are compatible in that way, even though your husband wanted something more earlier. Try to see it this way: She works WITH him, not just FOR him. You can't just replace that, as anyone in business can tell you.


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## lovelygirl (Apr 15, 2012)

HuggyBear said:


> Obviously, she must be a capable employee,


...yeah right..
It doesn't even matter at this point! 




> particularly if she's been there a couple of years, and everything's been getting done.


A better excuse to keep her around.




> *I've got the feeling that she's just a friend to your husband*, and that they are compatible in that way, even though your husband wanted something more earlier. Try to see it this way: She works WITH him, not just FOR him. You can't just replace that, as anyone in business can tell you.


Do you really believe that??

What man on Earth would see a sexy woman as 'JUST A FRIEND', especially when he thought about dating and sleeping with her?!


No matter how good she can be, she's not irreplaceable.


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## lovelygirl (Apr 15, 2012)

TheGoodWifey said:


> 1) he hired her before he knew me. 2) Neither has done anything wrong.
> 
> I have no doubt he will be faithful. I am concerned about his friends thinking he was "doing" her, and now still has her there.


ah...so you're more concerned about what others think than what could there really be between those two now? 

I thought you cared about their close friendship...not about others opinions...


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## TheGoodWifey (Apr 14, 2014)

DoF said:


> Now that the entire situation is more clear, I have to go with "do Nothing and stop by the office here and there"
> 
> I don't think there is anything in appropriate with the entire situation. Originally I thought he asked her out while you 2 were together (but that was prior to your relationship).
> 
> ...


But what about the fact that ALL his male friends think he "did " her? They must wonder how much I know! They believe he is now married, but keeps her as his office mate. What does that say? Are you all saying I should ignore it?


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## lovelygirl (Apr 15, 2012)

TheGoodWifey said:


> But what about the fact that ALL his male friends think he "did " her? They must wonder how much I know! They believe he is now married, but keeps her as his office mate. What does that say? Are you all saying I should ignore it?


Forget about what others say! They can say whatever sh*t they want. 

Don't ignore the attraction that your husband has for his girl-friend!


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## DoF (Mar 27, 2014)

TheGoodWifey said:


> But what about the fact that ALL his male friends think he "did " her? They must wonder how much I know! They believe he is now married, but keeps her as his office mate. What does that say? Are you all saying I should ignore it?


Of course.

Even if he did "do her" it was before you 2 were together. What's the problem?

Let the boys brag, trust me, his friends know him well and have an idea if what he is saying is true or not.

If it bothers you that much (which is really shouldn't) how about telling your husband to clear it with his friends?

I wouldn't go that far, don't even speak of this women.......like she never existed, it's better off that way at this point.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

TheGoodWifey said:


> But what about the fact that ALL his male friends think he "did " her? They must wonder how much I know! They believe he is now married, but keeps her as his office mate. What does that say? Are you all saying I should ignore it?


How do you know what his friends think? What makes you think they even wonder about what you know?

You are doing an awful lot of thinking for other people.

Just worry about yourself, your husband and your marriage. She is only a threat because you put her there.

Would you feel differently if it had been your husband who dumped her and not the other way around?


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## 4yearsnokids (Mar 26, 2014)

frusdil said:


> Her husband cannot fire an employee because his wife is insecure. That is ridiculous and would most likely cost him his business in lawsuits.
> 
> The problem is not the employees, it's the OP's husband.
> 
> He needs to start ensuring that he's NEVER alone with a female employee. EVER.



No, you can fire an employee for pretty much any reason you want unless it's discriminatory. So, firing someone because it gives you peace of mind (or peace at home) is a perfectly legal reason to fire someone. The employee can sue him if she wants, but her case won't have merit & will most likely be thrown out immediately. That is, if she can get a legitimate atty to even take it. I'm an atty and I know this for sure.

It's NOT ridiculous for a husband to fire an employee to protect his marriage. I think its ridiculous for an employee to wear sexy clothes to work, and I also think its ridiculous to put an employee above your family.

ALSO, the OP is NOT insecure. Instead, he marriage is being threatened, and she's responding like any person would when something important to them is in danger. The first things you want to do is try to remove the threat.


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## 4yearsnokids (Mar 26, 2014)

ScarletBegonias said:


> So because your husband is inappropriate and you're insecure,a woman could possibly lose her job? What portion of your mind tells you that this is ok? Don't you feel the slightest bit guilty to be considering putting a person out of a job over something like this?
> 
> It's not her fault nor her problem that your husband has/had the 'hots' for her.
> 
> ...




Please please OP, ignore stuff like this. There's nothing wrong with the way you feel, and anyone who attacks you like this is not worth your time responding.


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## jaharthur (May 25, 2012)

4yearsnokids said:


> No, you can fire an employee for any reason you want unless it's discriminatory. So, firing someone because it gives you peace of mind (or peace at home) is a perfectly legal reason to fire someone. The employee can sue him if she wants, but her case won't have merit & will most likely be thrown out immediately. That is, if she can get a legitimate atty to even take it. I'm an atty and I know this for sure.
> 
> It's NOT ridiculous for a husband to fire an employee to protect his marriage. I think its ridiculous for an employee to wear sexy clothes to work, and I also think its ridiculous to put an employee above your family.
> 
> ...


I'm also an attorney, and I disagree with this advice. The employee could sue and it's very unlikely it would be thrown out of court immediately. All she has to say is that the H engaged in quid pro quo sexual harassment and it's a question of fact that would get to the jury. Once the case goes to the jury, look out.


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## 4yearsnokids (Mar 26, 2014)

jaharthur said:


> I'm also an attorney, and I disagree with this advice. The employee could sue and it's very unlikely it would be thrown out of court immediately. All she has to say is that the H engaged in quid pro quo sexual harassment and it's a question of fact that would get to the jury. Once the case goes to the jury, look out.


Yea, she can say that, but she has to have some proof backing it up. Just alleging that your boss asked you out is NOT proof. Especially since he asked her out 2 years ago and has since gotten married. If what you're saying is true, then anyone who asks out an employee is opening themselves up to a valid suit if they EVER fire the employee after. 

Please, if you're going to say such a case has merit, you should give a similar case that succeeded summary judgement.


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## jaharthur (May 25, 2012)

4yearsnokids said:


> Yea, she can say that, but she has to have some proof backing it up. Just alleging that your boss asked you out is NOT proof. Especially since he asked her out 2 years ago and has since gotten married. If what you're saying is true, then anyone who asks out an employee is opening themselves up to a valid suit if they EVER fire the employee after.
> 
> Please, if you're going to say such a case has merit, you should give a similar case that succeeded summary judgement.


Uh . . . her testimony is proof, at least in the courts I practice in. That's enough to create a question of fact.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

4yearsnokids said:


> Please please OP, ignore stuff like this. There's nothing wrong with the way you feel, and anyone who attacks you like this is not worth your time responding.




I never realized not giving the OP a comforting pat on the back and not telling her it's cool to even think of having a woman fired over something that isn't her fault was attacking. 

So if you were the woman,you'd be ok with getting fired over something like this? You would be ok being out of a job or being pushed out of a job over something like this? 

There IS something wrong with the way she feels if she's considering having a woman fired or pushed out over this. Nobody deserves to lose their job over the insecurities of others.


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## ScarletBegonias (Jun 26, 2012)

anon pink said:


> why should this employee be penalized because op is insecure and her husband once had the hots for her?
> 
> This is a non issue. The employee turned him down. She will eventually be in a relationship with someone else.
> 
> Op, get a grip!


I FULLY agree with this.


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

tacoma said:


> I don't see the problem.
> 
> She's already rejected him, she's actually safer than whoever might replace her.


I don't see it quite that way, mainly because there's still an employer/employee relationship there - an imbalance of power.

Simply because she rejected him previously does not mean she would in the future, should she possibly feel her job could be in jeopardy (or she stands to gain anything from it, ie. a promotion, raise, etc.)

This is on the assumption she would do something like that of course. I am in no way insinuating that any woman would sleep their way to the top. It is also on the assumption that HE would do something like that.

I just don't believe this makes it any safer, though...


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## Jung_admirer (Jun 26, 2013)

TheGoodWifey said:


> I am newly married. When I met my husband, he had only 2 female employees. One, is about our age, and extremely attractive. They are all great friends, and get along nicely in the office. I realized recently that my husband told all of his friends last year that he was dating the attractive one, and that he was very interested in her. Although he swears they had no physical relationship, he admits he did want to date her, but she refused him.
> 
> They are very close, and he admits to discussing everything and anything on a personal basis. Many times, he is alone in the office with her, and she is full time. I feel this relationship is inappropriate now.
> 
> ...


Make the situation a win for everyone. Have the OW promoted and transferred.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## alexm (Nov 29, 2008)

TheGoodWifey said:


> But what about the fact that ALL his male friends think he "did " her? They must wonder how much I know! They believe he is now married, but keeps her as his office mate. What does that say? Are you all saying I should ignore it?


I'm not, I think it IS important what the other people in your (and his) life think of you as a couple, and as individuals.

Primarily because friends can be influences on us, good or bad.

Personally, I would not like my wife's friends to assume the same of me as what your husbands friends do of you, whether it's correct or not.

These are people who, I assume, you both see on occasion, or even were at your wedding. If you have children with him at some point, perhaps one of them will be a godfather. I would personally hate being in a social setting with people who think I'm no more than a houseplant to their friend while he's getting some on the side from the office hottie.

On the surface, no it doesn't matter, and we wish stuff like this wouldn't matter, but not all of us are from that same mould of "not giving a crap what others think of us". In this case, it's how people view not only you as an individual, but also how they view your husband and your marriage to him.


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## 4yearsnokids (Mar 26, 2014)

ScarletBegonias said:


> I never realized not giving the OP a comforting pat on the back and not telling her it's cool to even think of having a woman fired over something that isn't her fault was attacking.
> 
> So if you were the woman,you'd be ok with getting fired over something like this? You would be ok being out of a job or being pushed out of a job over something like this?
> 
> There IS something wrong with the way she feels if she's considering having a woman fired or pushed out over this. Nobody deserves to lose their job over the insecurities of others.


I would not be OK with having her fired. But, I'm also not OK with being embarrassed every time I go to the office. Generally speaking, my feeling are not more important than her job. But, when were talking about MY marriage and MY husband (2 situation I'm stuck with)...then yes, my feeling are and should be more important to my husband than her job. I'm not saying it's fair and I'm not saying any of this is her fault. BUT, my if my husband created an intolerable situation for me (with his loose tongue) then I think he should fix it. Any casualties are on him, not me. 

Also, I don't think this girl is innocent. She's calling herself his office wife. What did she *think* his real wife would feel? 

If it's me or her, when it comes to my marriage, then she's going to lose every time.


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## 4yearsnokids (Mar 26, 2014)

jaharthur said:


> Uh . . . her testimony is proof, at least in the courts I practice in. That's enough to create a question of fact.


Lolz, nooo! Just because you accuse someone of something foul doesn't mean you get a full trial to prove your case. There are presumptions in place that the Employee in this situation would have to overcome before she gets a trial. For example, she would have to present some sort of prima facie case of wrong doing to surpass summary judgement. The biggest problem I see here is that there's no causal link between her refusing to date him and her getting fired. The man GOT MARRIED between the two events!!! Surely, if he got married, he isn't still mad at her. If he is, then she's going to have to show some evidence of that to get a trial.

I'm not sure where you practice law, or how the laws are there. But here, in America, you can't just accuse people of something totally off the wall and expect your word to turn their life upside down. Not in civil law anyway.

Obviously intelligent minds can differ, but if you're going to give advice, like saying the case has merit, you should give an example of something like this turning out in the plaintiffs favor.

Also, I know testimony is evidence


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## jaharthur (May 25, 2012)

4yearsnokids said:


> Lolz, nooo! Just because you accuse someone of something foul doesn't mean you get a full trial to prove your case. There are presumptions in place that the Employee in this situation would have to overcome before she gets a trial. For example, she would have to present some sort of prima facie case of wrong doing to surpass summary judgement. The biggest problem I see here is that there's no causal link between her refusing to date him and her getting fired. The man GOT MARRIED between the two events!!! Surely, if he got married, he isn't still mad at her. If he is, then she's going to have to show some evidence of that to get a trial.
> 
> I'm not sure where you practice law, or how the laws are there. But here, in America, you can't just accuse people of something totally off the wall and expect your word to turn their life upside down. Not in civil law anyway.
> 
> ...


You better stay away from sexual harassment lawsuits. This is how it goes:

The women says he was after me and I wouldn't put out so he fired me. The others in the office confirm that he let everybody believe he had sex with her. Factual question for the jury.

I practice in California, which I realize some say is not part of "America", but that is not summary judgment material in California. On a summary judgment motion the judge is not allowed to make a credibility determination. Here, there would be conflicting evidence on whether there was quid pro quo sexual harassment. He says, she says, that's a factual issue. It goes to the jury and all bets are off there.

The Iowa case that went the other way has been roundly criticized. For example:

http://verdict.justia.com/2013/01/08/when-good-courts-go-bad

http://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=aaa7f6ce-27eb-40ed-90d3-4fc24a8439f8

http://blog.hkemploymentlaw.com/ind...ant-because-she-was-a-threat-to-his-marriage/ ("Having said that, this case does seem like a bit of an outlier. First, as mentioned above, Nelson inexplicably did not bring a sexual harassment/hostile work environment claim and the court noted that it would not opine as to the result had it been brought. Second, the relationship between Knight and Nelson was sexually charged in a somewhat consensual way, which would distinguish this from other cases where a male supervisor seemingly cannot resist an attractive female employee. Third, and perhaps most significantly, it is unlikely that other courts, faced with this same scenario, would grant summary judgment on a case where a jealous wife forces her husband to fire a female employee who he cannot resist.")


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