# Is she asking too much too soon?



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

Hello everyone,

I have been wandering around here for a couple weeks in an effort to find solace from being cheated on by my wife, and have decided to post about my dilemma for outside opinions.

To make a long story as short as possible, my wife and I have been together for 12 years, married for five. We have two small children. I found out on June 20 that she had been having an affair with a coworker since March. After much wailing and gnashing of teeth, we agreed to reconcile. She gave me what I thought was full access to all accounts, and little resistance in answering all my questions abut the affair. 

In the beginning of July, we went on a vacation that had been planned for over a year with our children, my parents, and my two brothers and their families. We were on what seemed to be the path to reconciliation. Two days after the vacation, I find that she is still secretly emailing the OM. After more wailing and gnashing of teeth, and a NC letter, we agree to reconcile again. I have not found any evidence of contact, but they do still work together occasionally.

It has been less than one month since I found the last evidence of their efforts to maintain contact, and she is now telling me that she wants to go out with one of her good friends. Naturally, I voice my discomfort with this idea, and suggested that she have her friend over for dinner and whatnot. She insists that she and her friend cannot confide in each other in a satisfactory way unless they are out on their own. We argued. I said it is too soon. She said she feels like a prisoner. Now we are pretty much back to square one.

A common theme in our quarrels is her willingness to give up, and my fighting to keep our marriage and family together. I am greatly appreciative to any insight anyone has to offer. And please feel free to ask for any details I may have left out.

Thanks,
M_g


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Yes she is asking too much. She continued contact with the OM until very resently. You have no reason to trust her. She does not seem concerned about proving that she can be truste.

My bet is that she thinks that you will not leave her and she can continue to carry on any way she wants.


Perhaps you have been too willing to reconsile.

Does her family and yours know about the affair?

Does the OM have a wife?


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

> She said she feels like a prisoner.


And until she can re-gain your love, she should be your willing prisoner!

You have reconciled, she hasn't. You have reconciled yourself that you wife cheated on you, so your wife wants to be a cake eater. 

There need to be consequences for her bad behaviour.

You need to think about exposure of her affair, make her quit her job, etc. Good luck. Because you will need it. Your wife is in the infidelity fog.


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

Perhaps I have been too willing to reconcile. We have two small children, and I cannot bear the thought of putting them through a divorce at the moment. 

We have not exposed the affair to our families or children. I have told one of my best friends, and I think she confides in one of her best friends (not the one she wants to see).

The OM has a wife, and she and I have had extensive correspondence. In fact, I found out most of the details from her.


----------



## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/32002-welcome-tam-cwi-newbies-please-read.html

Read the newbie thread in the link above .



Take a deep breath , the following a a few of the mandatory steps to help save your marriage :-

Your wife leaves her job for your marriage to have a chance to recover, her behaviour and comments to you suggests ongoing contact . It's your marriage or her job , any money's she makes from her job will be lost when she divorces you.
Let both her parents and yours know she was having an affair and identify the OM.

Many newly betrayed spouses resists this advice and the majority end up in a world of pain and ultimately have no marriage.




_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

This is what happens when you rug sweep and your WW and the OM continue to work together. There is no chance in hell that the affair will end if they continue to work together. Her actions show she's unremorseful and wants to rug sweep and continue her affair.

She's got some nerve. She's caught repeatedly breaking NC and she wants to go on GNOs? Seriously? Your answer should not just be no, but HELL NO. Since she's broken NC quite a few times:


Expose the affair to the Other Man's Wife (OMW) or Girl Friend if he has one.
She MUST stop working with OM and find employment elsewhere. NC can NEVER be established as long as they continue to work together. This has been proven many, many times.
You MUST monitor her using computer monitoring software, VARS, and/or GPS receivers
She MUST be willingly transparent to you.
Start the 180. If you need the link, let me know.

It takes 2-5 years to recover from an affair. Your D-Day was less than 2 months ago! You are nowhere near true R. You're still in limbo and have 2 False Rs already. 










Read this too:

Betrayed Spouse Bill of Rights « betrayed but recovering


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

MattMatt said:


> And until she can re-gain your love, she should be your willing prisoner!
> 
> Pretty much my thoughts as well, And that is why I have posted here. I am so torn between making it work and saying Fk it.
> 
> ...


I have thought about this extensively. Even with what she has done, I am having a hard time with ruining my wife's reputation.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I have thought about this extensively. Even with what she has done, I am having a hard time with ruining my wife's reputation.


So her reputation is worth more than your marriage? Worth more than your two children? Seriously?

She NEEDS to experience the reality and consequences of what she's done. Stop enabling her. As long as you enable her and are in fear, she will continue to cake eat. Stop feeding her cake.


----------



## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Perhaps I have been too willing to reconcile. 

This will be your downfall. Unless she wants to reconcile and begs you for it, you have no reason to believe that you are reconciling. Kids will be fine with divorced but happier parents. She oes not have respect for you. 


What steps did you take to ensure that the affair ended?


----------



## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

A phrase I have found useful to get the point over when your wife is whining about her rights:

"You have a right to say or do what you like, but you do not have a right to me or this marriage. Your choice."


----------



## Eli-Zor (Nov 14, 2010)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I have thought about this extensively. Even with what she has done, I am having a hard time with ruining my wife's reputation.


She ruined her own reputation by having an affair , read your own words . Your lack of action is enabling her affair and destroying your marriage.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> She insists that she and her friend cannot confide in each other in a satisfactory way unless they are out on their own. We argued. I said it is too soon.


She shouldn't be confiding in anyone except you. This is part of the problem!



Matrimonial_gloom said:


> She said she feels like a prisoner.


And there we have it: She plays the controlling card. The problem is that you're letting her play it.

This total lack of remorse for what she's done shows that the affair is still on. Playing the controlling card is a giant red flag. Like many men in today's society, you fear to be called "controlling". Get this: Its not controlling, its called *protecting your marriage.*

Especially when she's not done a damn thing to earn back your trust.


----------



## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> Perhaps I have been too willing to reconcile. We have two small children, and I cannot bear the thought of putting them through a divorce at the moment.
> 
> We have not exposed the affair to our families or children. I have told one of my best friends, and I think she confides in one of her best friends (not the one she wants to see).
> 
> The OM has a wife, and she and I have had extensive correspondence. In fact, I found out most of the details from her.


Have you told the OM's wife that they were still in contact?


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

lordmayhem said:


> So her reputation is worth more than your marriage? Worth more than your two children? Seriously?
> 
> She NEEDS to experience the reality and consequences of what she's done. Stop enabling her. As long as you enable her and are in fear, she will continue to cake eat. Stop feeding her cake.


I feel that if I expose her, it will be the end. I know I should take that risk, but I am still scared.


----------



## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I have thought about this extensively. Even with what she has done, I am having a hard time with ruining my wife's reputation.


Wow! What reputation? If her reputation is at risk, that's all her own work. Don't take responsibility for her poor judgement and bad behaviour.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I feel that if I expose her, it will be the end. I know I should take that risk, but I am still scared.


Will you continue to be scared if she gives you an STD she caught from OM? Or how about if she gets pregnant with OM's child? You do know that affair sex is almost ALWAYS unprotected sex, right? Or how about the thought of her banging OM in your bed?

Pretty soon you're going to get the ILYBINILWY speech. Then she'll suggest separation so she can figure things out or she needs to find herself.


----------



## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I feel that if I expose her, it will be the end. I know I should take that risk, but I am still scared.


You are still treating your relationship like a marriage with all the responsibility that comes with it.

Your marriage is over. This was your wife's choice. 

Do what you have to. Any consequences are caused by what your wife did, not by you.


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> Perhaps I have been too willing to reconcile.
> 
> This will be your downfall. Unless she wants to reconcile and begs you for it, you have no reason to believe that you are reconciling. Kids will be fine with divorced but happier parents. She oes not have respect for you.
> 
> ...


I maintain contact with the OMW. He is an operating room physician's assistant, and she knows when he is scheduled to work at the same hospital as my wife. Thus she informs me when they could be working together, and I keep my guard up. My wife is taking steps to find a job at a hospital were he does not go. If there are times I cannot get a hold of her, I contact the OMW to ask if she knows where he is. We haven't been able to match any unaccounted time, other than time they are at the hospital together.

I also have what I think is access to all of her accounts. I monitor phone use, email, and balances as well as I can. And any unaccounted time she has, I demand an explanation for.


----------



## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I have thought about this extensively. Even with what she has done, I am having a hard time with ruining my wife's reputation.


So let us put it on the scales, "your wife's reputation" or "your marriage" Which do you value more?


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

EleGirl said:


> Have you told the OM's wife that they were still in contact?


I did. I found out they still were sending email to each other as late as July 15. Since a then I have found nothing. But they do occasionally work in the same building. She is working on taking a position at a hospital he does not go to.


----------



## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I feel that if I expose her, it will be the end. I know I should take that risk, but I am still scared.


And, if you don't it will most certainly be the end.


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

drerio said:


> So let us put it on the scales, "your wife's reputation" or "your marriage" Which do you value more?


My marriage of course. I still fear having neither once I expose her.


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

Who has the link on exposure protocol?


----------



## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I did. I found out they still were sending email to each other as late as July 15. Since a then I have found nothing. But they do occasionally work in the same building. She is working on taking a position at a hospital he does not go to.


Good first step, but she should not be worried about feeling like a prisoner given that she did the crime. You need to let her know that she roamed away from the barn and not you. You have every right until she can prove that she will not "drink" from (prove being the imperative word) strange troughs to keep her tethered close to home. She really needs to spend that time with you not her GF.


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

lordmayhem said:


> Will you continue to be scared if she gives you an STD she caught from OM? Or how about if she gets pregnant with OM's child? You do know that affair sex is almost ALWAYS unprotected sex, right? Or how about the thought of her banging OM in your bed?
> 
> Pretty soon you're going to get the ILYBINILWY speech. Then she'll suggest separation so she can figure things out or she needs to find herself.


You are right. I continually ask myself why the Fk I am dealing with this. It's my kids I think. I was fortunate enough to be brought up in an intact household, and can't bear the thought of putting them through a divorce. Not to mention dealing with whatever scum she decides to date and expose my kids to.


----------



## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> My marriage of course. I still fear having neither once I expose her.


And, she does not feel the sting of shame, you think your marriage will survive? Don't be duped... it is should not be that easy for her to assume you have reached R. She is taking this waaaay too casual. You need to let her know how serious this is... Don't be a doormat, she should be doing for you and not you bending over backwards to let her continue her lifestyle. 
She changed everything and she cannot just go back to doing her thing. Don't let it happen or it really will be over.


----------



## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I have thought about this extensively. Even with what she has done, I am having a hard time with ruining my wife's reputation.


You ruin her reputation? I would think logically that she ruined it herself. 

Why do you want to be complicit in her affair? Others will see your silence as approval. Do you really think her co-workers dont know?

Maybe it not her you're trying to protect but yourself? You should not hide; you should face it head-on. Dont be afraid. The openness can set you free.


----------



## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> My marriage of course. I still fear having neither once I expose her.



If you fear having neither, that's what will happen.

She is not in the marriage now, is she? Her mind is elsewhere, and she doesnt value your marriage to try to make it work.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> You are right. I continually ask myself why the Fk I am dealing with this. It's my kids I think. I was fortunate enough to be brought up in an intact household, and can't bear the thought of putting them through a divorce. Not to mention dealing with whatever scum she decides to date and expose my kids to.


Remember, if she were truly remorseful and wanted to fix the marriage, she would be moving heaven and earth to comfort you, to make you feel safe, and would be compassionate for your feelings. She would accept the consequences because she wants to earn your trust back.

Instead she plays the controlling card and wants to resume her life as if nothing happened and confiding in her toxic friends and going on Girls Night Outs (GNOs).


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

aug said:


> If you fear having neither, that's what will happen.
> 
> She is not in the marriage now, is she? Her mind is elsewhere, and she doesnt value your marriage to try to make it work.


No, she is definitely not in the marriage as much as I am. When we have rough spells, she continually says that she doesnt know if this will work, maybe we should give up, you're never going to get over this, etc. Whereas I insist that we need to talk things out, work on our marriage/family. Holy crap, just tonight I asked her if she needed me anymore, and she said not right now! Wtf. 

Then again the non-rough spells give me a glimmer of hope. As long as I rugsweep for her she is happy, and tells me things like how she does want to work it out, how she loves me, etc. It seems like she cannot handle the shame, and guilt for what she has done, but I guess that's a tactic to get me to rugsweep.


----------



## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> No, she is definitely not in the marriage as much as I am. When we have rough spells, she continually says that she doesnt know if this will work, maybe we should give up, you're never going to get over this, etc. Whereas I insist that we need to talk things out, work on our marriage/family. Holy crap, just tonight I asked her if she needed me anymore, and she said not right now! Wtf.
> 
> Then again the non-rough spells give me a glimmer of hope. As long as I rugsweep for her she is happy, and tells me things like how she does want to work it out, how she loves me, etc. It seems like she cannot handle the shame, and guilt for what she has done, but I guess that's a tactic to get me to rugsweep.


Against my own best advice... I normally try to convince one to stick it out for the sake of the children. However, I think this one is different. She is already gone... Contact a lawyer tomorrow and serve her divorce papers as soon as you can. You might as well, because she probably will sooner than later. She has checked out of the building. Sorry, I really wish you the best. Take of care of the children and guard your finances.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

If my fWW had said she didn't need me, her sh!t would be out laying on the lawn. For real.

After I had recovered my balls from her purse, I flat out told her that if she doesn't feel she needs me, she can walk out the door and GTFO. That I'll survive. I survived before and I can survive again. 

On the other hand, you're WW has some nerve after what she's done. Dude, it wasn't even two months ago that you discovered this crap. Her nonchalant attitude toward the marriage right now shows how little you mean to her. It's time for the 180. You should probably consult a lawyer to see what your options are.


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

drerio said:


> Against my own best advice... I normally try to convince one to stick it out for the sake of the children. However, I think this one is different. She is already gone... Contact a lawyer tomorrow and serve her divorce papers as soon as you can. You might as well, because she probably will sooner than later. She has checked out of the building. Sorry, I really wish you the best. Take of care of the children and guard your finances.


I should add that her comment about not needing me at the moment was made during our argument about her planned GNO, and fueled by maybe too many drinks (If it makes any difference).


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Your chick will continue to be with her boy friend, in fact its easy, hell your not going any were so why should she stop.

Soon it just a mtter of time before she gets picked up for dates by him right in front of you. I mean she works with guy and you tolorate it, she tells you to pound sand and you except it.

Your wife has it made, she knows you won't leave , you won't expose it to any one and she can manage you any way she wants.

Do your self a favor and stop getting emotionally blackmailed by a women that has very litttle respect for you. Why do you let this emotional torture continue? Why are you showing your kids a great examble of a unhealthy marriage.

Will it take your WW and OM laying in your bed before you ask her to leave?

You can not nice your way out of this, until she sees some real consequences and start to get angry cuz you are making the affair inconvienent will this thing turn a corner.

Sorry man but your chick has your number and is using it all the way to the OM bedroom.

The tough love approach is the only way to shift the power towards her chasing you versus you chasing her.


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

lordmayhem said:


> On the other hand, you're WW has some nerve after what she's done. Dude, it wasn't even two months ago that you discovered this crap. Her nonchalant attitude toward the marriage right now shows how little you mean to her.


No kidding. Not to mention how nonchalantly she is dealing with breaking her family apart as well. Its like nothing for her to consider life changing decisions for her children. She's definitely checked out of reality. Not sure if it's bc she still loves him, or if she truly can't handle what she has done.


----------



## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I should add that her comment about not needing me at the moment was made during our argument about her planned GNO, and fueled by maybe too many drinks (If it makes any difference).


Makes no difference, she has little regard for this marriage. The fact that it was associated with an alcohol fueled argument is just a circumstance. Get a lawyer.


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

What....she is planning a GNO when her marrraige is this fragile? 

Sorry for being so blunt, but you need a slap, or something that will get you to see how beta you are.

I've been her long enough and all these fine folk have been there and done that, so listen to them.

I do admit I tried "nicing" my way out of this crap years ago, it wasn't until I manned up and asked my fWW to leave....that when it changed for me.


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

the guy said:


> Why are you showing your kids a great examble of a unhealthy marriage.
> .


Great question.


----------



## tobio (Nov 30, 2010)

Although we worked past my husband's EA, the one thing I would change if I could go back would be to play hardball. By me being the one doing all the work initially and trying to persuade him, he couldn't feel the consequences of what he did at first. He knew that I would always be "there" no matter what he was doing which enabled him to dither and sit on the fence.

He made his big decisions when I was straight down the line, rational and black and white about consequences and carried through on what I said. I suggest you think about boundaries and make some decisions then communicate to her what you will do if she chooses to overstep the mark.

Do not act out of fear or on the spot: be rational and decisive. The fear can be suffocation - I know - but it is what makes things easy for her AND will enable her to carry on with her half-in-half-out attitude.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

the guy said:


> Your wife has it made, she knows you won't leave , you won't expose it to any one and she can manage you any way she wants.


Why does this sound familiar? Oh yes, we see this in just about every newly BH thread. :banghead:


----------



## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I should add that her comment about not needing me at the moment was made during our argument about her planned GNO, and fueled by maybe too many drinks (If it makes any difference).


The old saying is that a drunk man's words are a sober man's thoughts. I'm sure it applies to women as well.


----------



## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

Mg, I don't want to chase you off, I just want you to understand what I'm reading from your thread and how your fair is controlling your WW actions. 

I'm telling you waywards can smell fair, and if they smell it from the betrayed, they will walk all over us betrayed.


----------



## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

"Trapped in a Bad Marriage-Help" by wrsteele1 is active right now below yours. Same situ Hospital work. His did'nt want to expose and she wanted to leave before leaving her job. Guess how its ending after he put a VAR in her car. This after finding a throwaway phone and secret email account. And this all while she and him was monitored by OMW and OP. You got it. He listened to a recording of his wife giving a BJ in the hospital parking lot.

So you just go on and keep playing her game and getting your scum kisses, bc thats what you are getting while she works around him
I don't even have to advise on the exposure. It has been shown to be THE MOST EFFECTIVE tool in the affair busting toolbox. Thats why the VETS are telling you it works.
Right now you are in the BS fog. So your ww is using her passive aggressive threat to bully you.
Lord Mayhem laid out the charts, where does your ww fall on it??
If its the right side, then the affair is ongoing. You and his wife are not in the parking lot.

So you either take the pill and swallow, or bust this sh*t wide open
.
AND PLZZZZZZZ, DO NOT LET HER KNOW YOU ARE EXPOSING TO ALL. Just do it. Only when she is reeling from the shock of family and friends calling and chewing her out will she start to see what the hell she is doing.
Also be ready with D papers when you expose. She will be angry and looking to chop off your balls, so give her another shock, just to let her know you have taken your ballls out of her purse, and stuck them back up in YOUR sack.
It has been said and proven to be true "you have to be willing to end your marriage before you can save it "


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

So she relented on going out with her friend. Any input on how I should proceed from here?


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

OldWolf57 said:


> Lord Mayhem laid out the charts, where does your ww fall on it??
> If its the right side, then the affair is ongoing. "


Nearly all of the left side, except for when they occasionally work together (he works multiple hospitals, and when he is at the same hospital as her, they don't always work the same case). But I also get some of the right side from her. She says the affair is over, but she feels that I am controlling.


----------



## cpacan (Jan 2, 2012)

I know is is scary stuff - been there, done that. Discovery of the affair pushed you out of your comfort zone in a very brutal way.

You are reaching for straws to verify that everythin can be brought back to "normal" as soon as possible. Let me tell you something, you don't want your "normal" life back. That was the life that made it possible for your beloved wife to cheat on you, trashing your shared history and making your future uncertain. Your marriage as you know it is dead.

Now, you may want to build a new relationship with your wife. In order to do this, you need two things:


OM out of your life
Your wife to realize the damage she has done

To obtain this, you must be willing to say goodbye to your wife. And it bust be clearly communicated and backed up by actions. Prepare yourself for a life on your own, where you need to date and make yourself attractive to other women.

You don't know if your wife is filled with guild and shame, I understand that, it's a possibility and you wish for the best. At this point, it doesn't matter if she is or not, or if she is just being plain evil and against you.

You need to man up, state your boundaries, be clear, stay firm and let her decide whether to comply or not. Let her leave if not.

Consider to file for D to make a clear statement about your boundaries, I think it could be effective at this point - to snap her out of the fog and make her realize the path she is following ATM.

You can't make her work for your relationship, she must want it herself, otherwise you are done anyway.

Now get going, work out, eat healthy, take good care of your kids, start detaching yoursef from her - this would be my focus knowing what I do now.


----------



## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

MG

You have been given great advice. 

You also need to make a decision. Because you want your marriage and honestly your wife does not.

She does not respect you nor does she love you.

It takes two to have marriage. Not one or three. You went from three to one.

And until you conquer your fear, get your self esteem back you will be in this limbo until your wife cheats again. And in her selfish frame of mind she will do it again.

Here is my two cents:

-Go see an attorney. Discuss your situation so you know the S/D situation with your eyes open. I would have D papers drawn up because I personally think Separation is just a time to continue the bad behavior in a marriage with no consequences.

In one day do the following:

-Tell your parents what she did and that you will need their support as you fight for the marriage.

-Tell her parents everything she did and do not leave out any info. They need to know their little angel is not an angel. Ask them for your support to fight for your marriage. 

-Then right after that meeting or call serve her the D papers or have her served. Hell, kill or hide her cellphone that day so that her family cannot reach her easily.

*You need to triple whammy her. You need to throw her balance off big time.*

She is going to be mad. She is going to be really pissed off.

And since your phone will be turned off when she finally comes home since you will have her served at work

Tell her this:

"I love you but I can no longer be married to a person who no longer respects me, our marriage and our family. You have not worked on our marriage nor do I feel you are capable of doing so. 

It you love me and want to be married to me then show me. I will only judge you on your actions not your words. And all I have seen from you is selfish words and behavior.

The choice to R is now yours. The choice to D you is now mine.

You have 90 days before the D is final. Show me you love me or not. That choice is yours."

And then walk away. No discussion. Do not let her engage you.

And the family will blow up her phone and she really will begin to understand what she has done.

I think you are crazy trying to R with a woman who treats you like a babysitter and doormat.

The time to act is now! And you will soon realize there is nothing to fear because you really have nothing to lose and everything to gain.

Your marriage or your freedom from a selfish, lying cheater. It is a win, win my man.

Keep posting and work on you to move forward with your life with her, or without her.

HM64


----------



## theroad (Feb 20, 2012)

You need to expose this affair to WW family and yours.

Your WW must write a NC letter to the OM.

You must expose this affair at work. Go past immediate supervisor tell CEO, board of dir, head of HR.

WW must go NC with the OM this means they can not work for the same company. Exposing at work may get OM fired.

Get the book Surviving An Affair by Dr Harley it will help you through all of this.


----------



## ShootMePlz! (Oct 5, 2008)

As far as being controlling after an affair.......ask her how she would react if the roles were reversed? Also you have to believe they have talked at work on occasion....the EA part lingers for awhile.

The exposure gun to the head can be a useful weapon. Also be on the look out for "throw away phones".


----------



## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> She says the affair is over, but she feels that I am controlling.


Next time she says you are controlling don't deny it. In fact say "Yes I am right now, very much so. It's because you chose to cheat, then lie, and continue to lie to me after you said it was done. Right now I do not trust you because you've chosen to betray my trust. I'm still here in this marriage right now looking down the road with hope that you can earn my trust back and that we will have a marriage worth being in. But right now, for the foreseeable future there is no trust and being controlling is how I can defend my marriage and my self from further betrayal."

IF you haven't done it, I would be putting a VAR in her car.

Where did they meet up to have sex? was it at work, their cars, a motel?


----------



## Kallan Pavithran (Jan 17, 2012)

Fear: Face it head on else it will kill your marriage.
If she is not committed to R 100% let her go man..........


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

Shaggy said:


> Where did they meet up to have sex? was it at work, their cars, a motel?


Between her willingness to answer questions, and the information I got from OMW, they would park his truck in deserted parts of town. I am not sure how easy it is to find a Fk spot in a hospital, but I imagine they found a way. One shtty fact is that my house is literally blocks away from the hospital, so my house could have been used for their escapades. 

Currently, I know every time the OM is at the same hospital via OMW. Thus I go on high alert and demand all time to be accounted for. Obviously there is no way for me to know the extent of their interactions whilst at work, which leads me to consider just walking into the damn surgery center on a day I know he is there.


----------



## Chris989 (Jul 3, 2012)

VAR in the car and if she has a smartphone (i.e. Android or iPhone) then you can install an app that stays hidden and records texts, phonecalls and whereabouts. AFAIK this works even if the SIM is changed - something the WW could do rather than have another phone and a SIM is much easier to hide.

Heck, if you have the $$ hire a PI. I suspect she is still having an affair and, worst case, you buy peace of mind. Best case you find out she is selling you down the river and you have no choice but to file.

Lastly, file anyway. It will shock her into action one way or another.


----------



## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

MG, controlling is cheaters speak for not letting her continue to bonk om. Tell her you can't control her, but you can what you will accept in the marriage. In fact tell her the relationship is on probation, bc she killed the old one, and only she can show if she wants to have a new one. 
When she gives the old " I don't know if we will make it ". Just tell her you will see a lawyer the next day. 
See, she is still in the fog, and as long as she see him, she is getting lil hits that keep it going.

Has the NC letter been written an delivered ?? Have you verified that there is no burner phone, secret email acc. ?? 
Undrstanding YOU are still in the BS fog, but you and she have a lot to do to pull a new marriage out of this. 
Exposure give you many more eyes and ears. But if you are more worried about her REP than your marriage, you have already lost.
I know for a fact the med field needs many, many more qualifide ppl and will continue to do so.
Hell, she could work for a staffing service. Only taking jobs where she sit with patiences in hospice from 12:am to 7:am. 
The point is if there is the will there is a way.


----------



## badbane (Jun 9, 2012)

IMO your fear of ruining her reputation (which she didn't care about when she was in the car with her boyfriend) was ruined by her. The reason for exposure serves several purposes. 1) friends will side with her version of the story because she probably told them half the bad things she did with the OM. She will then tell the all the crap you have done to make your marriage difficult. exposing to family and friends removes that false support system. It also will bring to light any toxic friends that enabled or supported this relationship. 

2) It will give you support outside of a forum where we can't give you a hug. We can't come over and give your wife the ( i know what you did you floosy eyes). 

3) it makes it harder to fog up rug sweep and play the game when your mother is calling you asking you WTF are you thinking.

4) I could go on but I think I have touched on everything pertinent.

She cheated not you. Your fear of losing your marriage because you simply told everyone that your wife screwed you over seems more like a pride issue to me. If your wife leaves you after you exposing her then good riddance. Why would you want to stay with someone who would ef someone else, and then when it came time to pay the piper, just ran for the hills. Exposing her PA with family and friends doesn't reflect on you she screwed up. All marriages have issues but how many of those issues were really issues from the marriage or from the fact she was cheating. You need to look up the 180 and do it commit to it and stop being wishy washy with your wife. Draw your lines in the sand and fill them with concrete and steel. You are in a fight for you marriage and it is time to start fighting.


----------



## survivorwife (May 15, 2012)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> Between her willingness to answer questions, and the information I got from OMW, they would park his truck in deserted parts of town. I am not sure how easy it is to find a Fk spot in a hospital, but I imagine they found a way. One shtty fact is that my house is literally blocks away from the hospital, *so my house could have been used for their escapades. *
> 
> Currently, I know every time the OM is at the same hospital via OMW. Thus I go on high alert and demand all time to be accounted for. *Obviously there is no way for me to know the extent of their interactions whilst at work*, which leads me to consider just walking into the damn surgery center on a day I know he is there.


I'm so sorry you are going through this. I highlighted a particular portion of your quote to make a point. Obviously your W has not disclosed the full extent of the affair. You still have questions, and that isn't fair to you.

As others have pointed out, in order to actually heal the marriage, you need her full remorse, and you aren't getting that. You won't get that either until she feels the full consequences of her actions. She won't feel the full consequences until you are prepared to shut the marriage down and that becomes a reality to her.


----------



## Matrimonial_gloom (Aug 9, 2012)

OldWolf57 said:


> MG, controlling is cheaters speak for not letting her continue to bonk om. Tell her you can't control her, but you can what you will accept in the marriage. In fact tell her the relationship is on probation, bc she killed the old one, and only she can show if she wants to have a new one.
> When she gives the old " I don't know if we will make it ". Just tell her you will see a lawyer the next day.
> See, she is still in the fog, and as long as she see him, she is getting lil hits that keep it going.
> 
> ...


Great advice, thak you. Like I said before, I laid out my intentions plain and clear, stating that if she takes this GNO she should also pack a bag. She finally relented.

There has been a NC letter. It was sent from the OM to my WW. She never sent a return letter though. 

I have verified to best of my ability that the is no secret phone, email, etc. That's not to say he hasn't bought her one, and it's kept at the hospital.

As I also said before, she is willingly taking steps to take a position at a hospital that he does not go to.

I am also on the verge of exposing her. Should I have divorce papers in hand, or just do it now?


----------



## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> So she relented on going out with her friend. Any input on how I should proceed from here?


And, by relented you mean she is still playing you? Like "Ok fine you win I will not have a GNO..." and she stomps off to another room feeling sorry for herself and still not having any remorse about her actions. She really needs to come to terms with her own issues. In the meantime... I will say it again, lawyer up on this one. It does not mean the fatal blow, but it will put the entire issue of her infidelity and how it has affected the marriage into another realm. I don't live with you and you obviously may see things differently, but your description of her actions still has her taking this too casually and it is not. 

I really think that she will eventually lawyer up and it will come to you out of left field at a time when you think your marriage is on the rebound. She just may need to find the right circumstances to make that move. Take her off her game plan.


----------



## ArmyofJuan (Dec 29, 2010)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I feel that if I expose her, it will be the end. I know I should take that risk, but I am still scared.


If you allow yourself to be motivated by fear you WILL make mistakes.



> So she relented on going out with her friend. Any input on how I should proceed from here?


Get a lawyer.

You are in a false R and things will just get worse if you maintain the status quo. It’s only a matter of “when” than “if” she will relapse back into the A. She is not afraid of you leaving because she knows you want the M more than her so she is not afraid on consequences. As long as she thinks she is in control she has no motivation to lift a finger in the M.

What she did is grounds for a D so she needs to prove to you she is worth keeping. That means you file for a D and tell her you deserve better than being married to an unremorseful cheater that clearly is just “settling” with you so you are ending things. This should wake her up to the reality of what she did and push her to stop you from leaving her. 

The only way a true R will work is if she wants it more than you and that won’t happen until you show her you will leave her a$$.


----------



## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> You are right. I continually ask myself why the Fk I am dealing with this. It's my kids I think. I was fortunate enough to be brought up in an intact household, and can't bear the thought of putting them through a divorce. Not to mention dealing with whatever scum she decides to date and expose my kids to.


Well the alternative is much worse. Their dad being cuckolded


----------



## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> I should add that her comment about not needing me at the moment was made during our argument about her planned GNO, and fueled by maybe too many drinks (If it makes any difference).


No it doesn't


----------



## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> Between her willingness to answer questions, and the information I got from OMW, they would park his truck in deserted parts of town. I am not sure how easy it is to find a Fk spot in a hospital, but I imagine they found a way. One shtty fact is that my house is literally blocks away from the hospital, so my house could have been used for their escapades.
> 
> Currently, I know every time the OM is at the same hospital via OMW. Thus I go on high alert and demand all time to be accounted for. Obviously there is no way for me to know the extent of their interactions whilst at work, which leads me to consider just walking into the damn surgery center on a day I know he is there.


First rule of reconciliation : no trickle or half truths. Did you not read the nrwbie link? How can you reconcile without knowing the true extent of the betrayal? And where did you lose your self respect? If she cannot do the minimum, you never had a chanc anyway.

Have you considered reporting them at work? Why/why not?


----------



## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> Great advice, thak you. Like I said before, I laid out my intentions plain and clear, stating that if she takes this GNO she should also pack a bag. She finally relented.
> 
> There has been a NC letter. It was sent from the OM to my WW. She never sent a return letter though.
> 
> ...



So she never got to check out of the A. he was made to.
Threrefore she has not done the basics.
Its all process MG. Steps that BS an WW's go thru.
Exposing is as a part of it as the NC letter. I'm no expert on the stuff, but from being here an seeing the results from taking these actions I can say they work.
She is still looking at how hard it is on her without taking ownership of the pain she did to you and the marriage.
You should expose to at least the family. That brings a lil more accountability and consequence, for as of now, she is only inconvienced by seeing your hurt and having to find a new job.
Affairs are life changing disruptions, and should be treated as such. NOT as a lil miss step that can be glossed over.

Sit her down, look her in the eye, and tell her she is NOT doing enough to BUILD a new marriage from the one she destroyed.
Tell her EXACTLY what you need. If she is not ready or feel she can't, then you leave it at that and visit a lawyer for the papers. Don't tell her you are doing it, just present her with them.
Telling her it can be stopped, but its up to her to show she wants her family.


----------



## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

Expose expose expose. You need transparency here. NC means NC, no Morse code, no smoke signals, NO CONTACT! Put that big heavy iron steel toed boot down ! Track her, install tracker on her phone, install key logger, warn her you are at your last straw and don't tell her what you are up to on your own or she'll go underground if this is rug swept or this ends up being a false R She needs to change her job now, period, NC means NC, "get another job or I'm gone"


----------



## LostCPA (Apr 15, 2011)

As someone’s who lived through a false recovery, it seems very likely to me that you are headed down that same path. I worried too much about her reputation and pushing her further away and not nearly enough about ending the affair. The MOST important thing you need to do for your marriage to have any chance at all is to end the affair. She will be furious and she will swear that while you had a chance before that there is no way she can reconcile with you now after you have exposed her affair and embarrassed her. DON’T WORRY. Your marriage can survive her anger. What it can’t survive is her ongoing affair.

As hard as it may be, you need to take charge of your marriage and your recovery. You need to expose her affair to the hospital’s HR department, to her family and to your family. Affairs cannot survive the light so you have to shine a big spotlight on it. Demand the truth even to the point of requiring her to take a polygraph. She will protest, but don’t give in. The more she protests, the more likely that she’s still lying. Those with nothing to hide, hide nothing.

Finally, she has to leave that job immediately. You cannot even begin recovery as long as she has any contact with him at all. Every time she passes him in the hallway, she back at square one. By the way, don’t fool yourself into believing that there’s no way for her to be still carrying on this affair. There is plenty of opportunity for them to meet in the hospital parking lot, in an empty room at the hospital, or any number of other places. He!!, my xWW was sneaking OM into my basement after I went to sleep at night. Where there is a will, there is always a way.

Fight for your marriage. Do everything in your power to stop this affair. After that, you can begin to recover. She will only emerge from her affair fog after NC is in place and this affair is over for good. Until then, all of your efforts are in vain.


----------



## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

LostCPA said:


> As someone’s who lived through a false recovery, it seems very likely to me that you are headed down that same path. I worried too much about her reputation and pushing her further away and not nearly enough about ending the affair. The MOST important thing you need to do for your marriage to have any chance at all is to end the affair. She will be furious and she will swear that while you had a chance before that there is no way she can reconcile with you now after you have exposed her affair and embarrassed her. DON’T WORRY. Your marriage can survive her anger. What it can’t survive is her ongoing affair.
> 
> As hard as it may be, you need to take charge of your marriage and your recovery. You need to expose her affair to the hospital’s HR department, to her family and to your family. Affairs cannot survive the light so you have to shine a big spotlight on it. Demand the truth even to the point of requiring her to take a polygraph. She will protest, but don’t give in. The more she protests, the more likely that she’s still lying. Those with nothing to hide, hide nothing.
> 
> ...


:iagree:

Well said. I was hoping you're still around.


----------



## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

This is Lostcpa's thread you need to read

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/coping-infidelity/31959-false-recovery.html


----------



## Ikaika (Apr 23, 2012)

LostCPA said:


> As someone’s who lived through a false recovery, it seems very likely to me that you are headed down that same path. I worried too much about her reputation and pushing her further away and not nearly enough about ending the affair. The MOST important thing you need to do for your marriage to have any chance at all is to end the affair. She will be furious and she will swear that while you had a chance before that there is no way she can reconcile with you now after you have exposed her affair and embarrassed her. DON’T WORRY. Your marriage can survive her anger. What it can’t survive is her ongoing affair.
> 
> As hard as it may be, you need to take charge of your marriage and your recovery. You need to expose her affair to the hospital’s HR department, to her family and to your family. Affairs cannot survive the light so you have to shine a big spotlight on it. Demand the truth even to the point of requiring her to take a polygraph. She will protest, but don’t give in. The more she protests, the more likely that she’s still lying. Those with nothing to hide, hide nothing.
> 
> ...


Very salient advice... very well articulated. I simply want to add that you also need to be judicious in exposing her. While I agree that she needs light shed upon her for her deeds (possibly ongoing deeds), you need to also avoid telling those ears that only have a voyeuristic attitude toward this situation. Essentially, those who have a need to know are partners in helping not hurting your marriage. They are the extra set of eyes and hopefully healing counsel that is needed. 

It unfortunately that voyeurism make lurk even on forums such as TAM. Needless to say, I think most responders have your best interest and the interest of saving your marriage at heart. 

Again, I wish you the best of luck.


----------



## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Matrimonial_gloom said:


> ...my wife and I have been together for 12 years, married for five. We have two small children. I found out on June 20 that she had been having an affair with a coworker since March. After much wailing and gnashing of teeth, we agreed to reconcile. She gave me what I thought was full access to all accounts, and little resistance in answering all my questions abut the affair.
> 
> ...We were on what seemed to be the path to reconciliation. Two days after the vacation, I find that she is still secretly emailing the OM. After more wailing and gnashing of teeth, and a NC letter, we agree to reconcile again. I have not found any evidence of contact, but they do still work together occasionally.


Stop right there. If they "still work together occasionally," your wife is still getting a jolt of brain sex drugs like dopamine and norepinephrine. Ever heard of neuroplasticity? Her brain has been "rewired" to respond to OM sexually, pretty much on sight. The combo of the brain sex drugs released when a woman bangs a new guy, plus the brain rewiring invoked by new sexual experiences (if your wife had any forbidden sex practices with you, they were all part of the menu with OM) means your wife has pretty much lost all sexual attraction to you, even if she was still sexually attracted to you before the affair (unlikely). If the guy has "good" semen (high quantities of mood elevating substances) your wife will absorb those into her bloodstream from under her tongue or vaginally and she'll have warm fuzzy feelings for him for days after (post-coital "glow"). All this means your wife is psychologically and sexually addicted to the OM. Just like crack.

Your WW and OM can't work together or come into contact with each other at all. Your wife is hot and ready as soon as she knows she's going to be seeing OM. How long does it take to give a BJ or a quickie in a broom closet? Does your wife drive a mini-van, by chance?



Matrimonial_gloom said:


> A common theme in our quarrels is her willingness to give up, and my fighting to keep our marriage and family together.


Your wife thinks you were mistake. She probably had vague feelings she was mildly "unhaaaapy" before the affair. When she first banged OM and loved it, she had reconcile her cognitive dissonance of knowing adultery was wrong (cognitive brain) with her love for the act (limbic brain). This is where her little "rationalization hamster" begins to run overtime, closing the gap between the two. Her eventual conclusion after she goes through several stages is that she has never been "in love" (meaning powerful sexual attraction) with you, so you were not "the one" (especially so if your wife claims to be Christian) or she would not have even been attracted to any other man, much less have the best sex of her life with him/them. This is why the chemical/psychological aftermath of her adultery makes it so easy for her to walk away from her family.



Matrimonial_gloom said:


> My marriage of course. I still fear having neither once I expose her.


Earlier, you used the phrase "wailing and gnashing of teeth" from Matt 13:42. Here's another quote from the same guy with a slight alteration or two: "Whosoever shall seek to save his [w]ife shall lose [her] and whosoever shall lose his [w]ife shall preserve [her]." That's taking a big liberty with the passage, but it's completely true. You've lost her already, but showing the raw MANLINESS to kick her to the curb and move on, may or may not attract her back to you. It's a long shot, but it's the only shot you've got. 



Matrimonial_gloom said:


> Holy crap, just tonight I asked her if she needed me anymore, and she said not right now! Wtf.


She has zero sexual attraction for you. If you want to stay married to her (your choice) you have to become an Alpha/Sigma type, or at least a greater Beta. Right now, you don't rank so high. 




Matrimonial_gloom said:


> As long as I rugsweep for her she is happy, and tells me things like how she does want to work it out, how she loves me, etc. It seems like she cannot handle the shame, and guilt for what she has done, but I guess that's a tactic to get me to rugsweep.


She has you in the Beta/Delta Provider role. It's your job to bring home the bacon while she goes out for c0ck.



Matrimonial_gloom said:


> No kidding. Not to mention how nonchalantly she is dealing with breaking her family apart as well. Its like nothing for her to consider life changing decisions for her children. She's definitely checked out of reality. Not sure if it's bc she still loves him, or if she truly can't handle what she has done.


It's the brain sex drugs mentioned above. You and your kids are standing between an addict (WW) and her sex-drugs.


----------



## jay80_98 (Jul 14, 2012)

Just wondering are you or your wife indian? just feels like you might be


----------



## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

I sure hope the OP isn't just rugsweeping this whole thing. Look at the facts. Inaction. Refusal to set boundaries. Refusal to give consequences. If I had to guess I'd think she is still cheating. I mean, she's still working there, and she's still looking for excuses to get out of the house on her own. Is the OP keylogging to see if she has another email account? Is the OP voice recording to see what happens in her car?

Rug sweeping. Argh.


----------



## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

WorkingOnMe said:


> I sure hope the OP isn't just rugsweeping this whole thing. Look at the facts. Inaction. Refusal to set boundaries. Refusal to give consequences. If I had to guess I'd think she is still cheating. I mean, she's still working there, and she's still looking for excuses to get out of the house on her own. Is the OP keylogging to see if she has another email account? Is the OP voice recording to see what happens in her car?
> 
> Rug sweeping. Argh.


Well, if you ignore everything long enough and try not to think about it, it'll all fix itself.


----------

