# Fog



## Clinging (May 14, 2011)

Maybe no one knows the answer as everyone is different but I'd like to hear opinions if nothing else.

Why when the WS is in the fog and in an outside relationship why do they feel they want to hold onto the marriage as well?

Security, comfort, what? they are not willing to give up OW but yet don't want to give up on marriage either?

I haven't been able to confirm an OW but all indicatons are there is one. My WS will respond to text messages if I initiate.

I"m trying not to contact him but it is so hard. 

I'm trying to be strong and focus on me but that is definetely easier said than done. During the week, hopefully it will get better as I will have work to occupy my time, now on the weekend I have nothing but free time.

I tried painting a bedroom this weekend but my head wasn't into it and I ended up spilling paint, breaking a mirror so just did one coat. I have to wait until my concentration is better.


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## oceansaway (May 16, 2011)

Same here but there is OW. However H still can't make up his mind what he wants. But I made it up for him with divorce papers! 

I don't think anyperson who walks out on their family and kids is in their right mind! But it is a choice they have to live with.

It will get easier for you and TRY the no contact or 180 with him. Give him space and time to miss you. Act like your going on with life without him and maybe he will come around. Time and space!

Good luck.


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

Clinging said:


> Why when the WS is in the fog and in an outside relationship why do they feel they want to hold onto the marriage as well?
> 
> Security, comfort, what? they are not willing to give up OW but yet don't want to give up on marriage either?


I don't have a concrete answer, but most of them do that. I think it is sometimes because of the material possession they stand to lose in a divorce. And therefore, they resort to "cake eating"
--having it both ways.


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## the guy (Aug 3, 2010)

In my case there was something missing, a void in the marriage that was not being fulfilled.
For the most part security and stability were there, I was a good father, I just didn't like being a husband ..a companion if you will. So she found it else were.


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## F-102 (Sep 15, 2010)

Could be any number of things.
Maybe they can't afford a divorce.
Maybe they would be in financial dire straits if they left the M.
Maybe they're too ashamed, they don't want friends and family finding out.
Maybe there's kids involved.
Maybe they like having a safe, stable home-and then having the excitement on the side.
Maybe both spouses careers would suffer.
Maybe they can't muster up the guts to leave.
Maybe they feel that they're not really doing anything wrong.
Maybe they don't want to ask for a D first-many judges look at who initiated D proceedings when making their decisions.
Maybe they see how Hollywood has glamourized affairs.
Maybe they're just plain crazy.
Maybe they're just plain stupid.


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## michelleM68 (Jan 22, 2011)

i am in the same situation. how long does the 180 go, and when to stop it.?


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Its because they inherently know the affair is wrong. In the very sense of having two relationships...especially when one is marriage. That's why they hold onto the marriage...while they sort out their next step. This is why it is so very important to remove yourself as an option immediately. It stops the cake eating deaad in its tracks and they don't get the comfort of their safety net...the spouse. Reality sucks so that's why its important to let go fast. The longer the spouse sticks around. And keeps giving out chances with zero consequences...the worst the story will end and the longer the great hell that is limbo will last while u basically give them all the power.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Luna_73 (May 5, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> Its because they inherently know the affair is wrong. In the very sense of having two relationships...especially when one is marriage. That's why they hold onto the marriage...while they sort out their next step. This is why it is so very important to remove yourself as an option immediately. It stops the cake eating deaad in its tracks and they don't get the comfort of their safety net...the spouse. Reality sucks so that's why its important to let go fast. The longer the spouse sticks around. And keeps giving out chances with zero consequences...the worst the story will end and the longer the great hell that is limbo will last while u basically give them all the power.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_



I have to say this is exactly what I am learning right now. Today I will be giving my CS the "head's up" that it's the OW or me. I can't live in limbo anymore and that the longer I allow him to have no consequences the more he feels what he's doing is okay, and he becomes closer to the OW. I've got nothing to loose but my H and the way I see it...he's not the person I have known for almost 15 years right now...the man I knew isn't there. 

The 180, I learned that this HAS to be started at the right time for it to work. YOU must do it when there is hope to reconcile, your CS has shown remourse, you BOTH want to work at things. Yes, you can try it when your Spouse is still in the "fog" but it's not as effective because their not in the mind frame to care. If your CS is still in the A..what do they really care if your talking to them or not, it makes their life easier that you appear not to care. That's where I went wrong, I tried doing the 180 after my H moved out to couch surf, has been with the OW for 6 months now, has not said he wanted to R but he still controls me, snoops thru my things and searches the computer to see what I have been doing. 

I should have put my foot down, shown him the boundary that cheating is NOT acceptable, it's her or me. Let him make his choice and live with that decision. IF HE changed his mind at a later time I would impliment the 180, MC, transparency..etc.etc..

I'm telling my H that it all ends today...we will not be selling affair cake any longer.


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## Clinging (May 14, 2011)

Sorry to hear about your situation. I have been reading lots and there are a lot of people here that have good advice. After 33 years together I know my husband probably better than he knows himself. I know when he has affairs, he has low self esteem, and with someone new that doesn't know him he can pretend to be a person that he isn't. I think he suffers from low grade depression, has no coping skills and is a weak person. Do any of those things justify his actions, No they don't. Do they make me understand him a little bit more, yes. 

He is still gone and we are by no means ready to reconcile, I'm not even sure if I could again but I do know that my boundaries have been weak and he has stepped all over them and I also know that it is impossible for me to go NC, even if we divorce, I don't think I will ever be able to completely get him out of my mind.

I have put some thoughts down of paper as I have been reading posts and I might compile something and send it to him, more for me than for him. I'm not sure yet.

Sorry to hear about your situation.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Clinging said:


> I know when he has affairs, he has low self esteem, and with someone new that doesn't know him he can pretend to be a person that he isn't.


This isn't his first affair?


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## Clinging (May 14, 2011)

JB

No he had one about 7 years ago, exactly almost identical. he lost his job that he had for years, was unemployed, feeling lousy about not being able to find a job, so OW was a friend of ours who left her husband and didn't know how to prepare a budget/ do anything so my husband helped her out because he wasn't working and she validated him and made him feel smart and special and I didn't.

He denied the whole scenario but one of my friends spotted them out for lunch somewhere and told me. He was feeding her all sorts of lies about leaving me, moving in with her, blah, blah, blah. He was on anti depressents at the time as he was low grade depressed. My middle daughter found out, called this woman up and straightened her out about her father and his lies. She dropped him like a hot potato. He then stayed away for a few months, we worked things out and everything was wonderful again until this year, almost same story. this time he has run into financial/business trouble and can't cope so off he goes again.

doesn't make it right but it is what it is. Last time I did not seperate any finances etc. or go for legal seperation, this time I am.

So yes, this is # 2. Last time he didn't do any counselling on his own, this time he says he is, I'm just not sure if he is going. He can't go if he isn't here in this city.


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## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

My stbxh never had any desire to hold onto our marriage. And he left his family for a pill-popping, suicidal drunk with zero self esteem who is hung up on some other dude. He is not even with the one he left us for but he figures soon as we are divorced, she will want him then.


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## ClipClop (Apr 28, 2011)

Whoa, AD. Haven't been following lately. They hsve broken up? And he said that to you?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## 8yearscheating (Oct 14, 2010)

Can I suggest you read the thread I started a
About the 180 here in the infidelity area. Boundaries yes, cutting off contact I believe goes no where Please check it out
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Clinging (May 14, 2011)

8 Years - I have read your thread on 180 and I do beleive that every situation is different and you need to do what works best for your situation. Like I have said I have been thru this exact same scenario 7 years ago and we were seperated 8 months before I let him come home. I don't want to do that again, that I know for sure. I am older and wiser this time, I can see thru all his BS and I don't beleive a word he says, where as last time I clung to every word and crumb he threw at me. Is it going to make a difference for me this time, I don't know. I think he realizes that he had his chance and he won't be getting another one. I just think he is afraid to make it final just like me, than it is the end and we are both afraid of that, we have been with each other for 33 years.

We have a grandson (4 months) and he went swimming yesterday for the first time. My daughter sent me a picture of him in the pool so cute and I forwarded it to my husband with no comment as I know he really misses him. He sent me back an email - how cute -I really miss him. That I know is not a lie, so he is some fog but I think for some things he knows what he is doing.

I deleted all my emails/texts from him yesterday. I am going to take down our family pictures/wedding pictures and start packing up the rest of his things.

The ball is in his court but I don't think he knows how to play with it.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

He is a serial cheat. Move on with your life.


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## Clinging (May 14, 2011)

JB

I know he is a serial cheat and I am trying to move on with my life.

My question to you is do you think people cannot change with counselling? He has never done it before, never looked at any of his issues (and he obviously has lots), his cheating really boils down to lack of coping skills under stress. If he could learn to manage that do you not think he could change?

I am not saying I am not done with him. I know in my mind I am. He is still someone that I am attached too and that I still do care about so that is why I am asking.


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## morituri (Apr 1, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> *Reality sucks* so that's why its important to let go fast.


Because most affairs live inside a fantasy bubble and it only takes an injection of reality for the bubble to pop.

Unless it's an exit affair or there are some personality disorder issues present, the cheating spouse will often pursue the betrayed spouse while leaving their OP hanging out to dry.

This is the time when many betrayed spouses make the mistake of taking back the cheating spouse without making sure that the cheater is truly remorseful and is willing to bend over backwards to restore the trust of the betrayed spouse, even if it takes years for it to happen.



> The longer the spouse sticks around. And keeps giving out chances with zero consequences...the worst the story will end and the longer the great hell that is limbo will last while u basically give them all the power.


Unfortunately the betrayed spouse is often in a fog of his/her own making.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

Clinging:

Counselling only works if 1. someone wants to go to it and 2. commits to changing their behavior.

It does sound like you are trying to find excuses to justify his behavior, his serial cheating (low self-esteem, bad coping skills, he needs validadtion). Even if those things are true,those are his issues to deal with, not yours.



morituri said:


> Unfortunately the betrayed spouse is often in a fog of his/her own making.



Absolutely. The DS without a doubt is in a fog. But BS' who won't let go and try to rationalize away the truth of their situations also have their own fog.


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## 8yearscheating (Oct 14, 2010)

To each his own clinging. If you read my history my wife was at it for 20 of our 26 years and my youngest is not mine biologically though she will always be my daughter. I'm sorry that he's so self centered he can't see beyond his lower head. If my wife hadn't turned so quickly I was ready to move on
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Clinging (May 14, 2011)

It is hard to turn your heart off .

I know and realize what everyone is saying and yes, I try to rationalize his shortcomings and use it as an excuse so I don't have to face the truth. In my mind I know what the truth is, my heart not so much.

He will always be a part of my life even when we divorce and I just don't have it in me to hate him, his actions yes, him not so much.

Maybe someday I will get there.

The rejection still really hurts.


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## 8yearscheating (Oct 14, 2010)

I understand completely. I have times that I remember happy and very events like our 25th anniv trip to Hawaii only to have it spoiled by thoughts of how long before or after was my wife screwing him and was she texting him while we there. I have a very hard time looking back to any good times without the same heart wrenching thoughts. I take it day by day and only look ahead. You should do the same. Cherish the good things in your life and the future. I'm sure you'll find someone who will cherish all that you are and show you the kind of love you deserve. It's your h's loss. His future will be crap. Believe that he will wake one day and feel all of your pain and will forever regret his stupidity Take your life and move on
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Clinging (May 14, 2011)

8 Years

Thank you for that. I wanted my life to include my husband, I always have.

I do hope I find someone else to love me but I don't know how you do that. I haven't been with anyone else for a very long time.

Are you and your wife still trying to work things out or is it over for the 2 of you? How long has it been? Sorry, don't know your whole story. I hope it isn't 8 years.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

You will never move on and find someone as long as you're pining over your stbx.


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## Clinging (May 14, 2011)

JB

So true but I would be lying if I said I was there yet. I need time.

I know all the things I have to do and I will do them this time, I just don't want too and that is the honest truth.

I will do them but I don't want too.


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