# Sex problems before/after affair



## adegirl2016 (Dec 14, 2016)

So my husband is incredibly selfish in bed. He has been from day one. I feel like this is just the way that he is. I know he watches/has watched porn, and it seems like he only wants to replicate what he sees there. Which is fine once in a while, I am flexible and down to do whatever he wants.

In my eyes, we have never "made love". He doesn't just volunteer to go down on me. In fact, it has been a LONG time since he has. He doesn't seem to take pride in making me O. But he expects that I will go down on him every time.


Recently, my husband had an affair. You can read about it in Coping with Infidelity. It was actually while I was pregnant, so sex was suffering because of that too (we weren't really having it). We are working on Reconciliation. He has made a lot of progress and is working hard to prove to me that I should stay in the marriage. BUT the sex still sucks. It's still the same. When we do have it, it seems very one sided. 

He tried to get me to go down on him a few nights ago and I told him straight up that I will no longer until he returns the favor on a consistent basis. He agreed to work on that but we will just see I guess.

Our sex life improving is on my list of things that HAS TO HAPPEN for me to stay in this marriage. I enjoy sex and did not have this problem in previous relationships, so I feel deprived.

Part of me feels like maybe he doesn't because I don't ask for it during. Although I am down for whatever in bed, I am still shy in asking for what I want. 

I thought that during sex, you should focus on pleasuring the other person. So I focus on him and he focus's on ME. But thats not how it is. Am I wrong for this?
This is extra complicated because now I feel like since he cheated, he should also be putting in more effort in the bedroom and he is not. I am the one putting in the effort. Should I just be more vocal?


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

It is up to you whether or not to forgive him for his affair, but many people would not forgive. If you have forgiven him, then I don't think that should really imply that he owes you different behavior in bed.

BUT 

He already should have been doing far more for you in bed. Even if he had never had an affair or done anything wrong, he should do his best to please you in bed because he loves you and enjoys making you happy.

I assume that there are no problems you aren't mentioning - health, morbid obesity, hygiene etc etc. 

Sadly some people are just selfish in bed, and do not seem to get anything out of pleasing their partners. I find this difficult to imagine, since I enjoy pleasing my partner, but it seems true. These selfish people will make all sorts of excuses as to why you should do everything for them, while they do little in return. My wife claims that doing oral on a man is "completely different" than doing it to a woman, which is why she will not do it for me. I suspect your husband also claims it is different, and why he won't do it for you.

I can understand someone having an aversion to one particular sex act, but if they refuse to do anything for you that requires significant effort, then they are just selfish. 


You should ask and at least see what happens.

One possible tactic - people are usually happier engaging in sexual activities when they are very aroused. If you aren't too shy, you could try giving him oral, but not to completion, then when he is all aroused, straddle his face and tell him you'll finish him after he takes care of you. If he likes "porn" sex, this may be in line. 

Getting him to "make love" rather than have sex is a different problem and also very difficult. No good suggestions there, but maybe others have some.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

adegirl2016 said:


> So my husband is incredibly selfish in bed. He has been from day one. I feel like this is just the way that he is. I know he watches/has watched porn, and it seems like he only wants to replicate what he sees there. Which is fine once in a while, I am flexible and down to do whatever he wants.
> 
> In my eyes, we have never "made love". He doesn't just volunteer to go down on me. In fact, it has been a LONG time since he has. He doesn't seem to take pride in making me O. But he expects that I will go down on him every time.
> 
> ...


You're not wrong at all. I am not going to mention the cheating because that's a different problem altogether that I am not qualified to comment on.

Being married for 25 years and being a selfish lover I CAN comment on.

I believe it's a matter of ignorance. I am 55 and my only sex education came from porn. Perhaps many men from my era are similar to me. I simply did not know how to make love to my wife. When my wife drifted away from me and no longer wanted to have sex I did everything in my power to fix it. As it turns out what I really needed was an education and a willingness to let myself go, to try and experience sex from a REAL womans perspective.

For example. My wife always wanted me to give her a back rub as part of foreplay. I refused to do it because I NEVER saw any man give a woman a back rub in porn. It never even occurred to me that this could actually get a woman in the mood for sex. NOT EVEN A CLUE.

As it turns out, a nice back rub for my wife gets her motor running. So be it. I now give her a back rub most every time before we have sex.

I had to learn that a woman (at least my wife) views sex in a completely different way than I do. Even though a lengthy back rub does absolutely nothing for me on a sexual level I know it is doing something for my wife which will EVENTUALLY trickle down to me getting what I want too. It's a matter of give and take, but some men are giving the wrong thing and have no idea they are destroying their love life in the process.


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## adegirl2016 (Dec 14, 2016)

UMP said:


> You're not wrong at all. I am not going to mention the cheating because that's a different problem altogether that I am not qualified to comment on.
> 
> Being married for 25 years and being a selfish lover I CAN comment on.
> 
> ...



Interesting... that makes perfect sense to me. This may apply to him. So how did your wife convince you to do this? Did she sit down and have a talk with you? Was it because she drifted away sexually?

How can I say this to my husband?


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

I'm really not trying to pick on you, but I have a question:

If she wanted a back rub before sex, why not? Even if it didn't match what you had seen, if it was something she enjoyed, why didn't it seem like a good thing to do? 

My wife likes me to kiss the top of her back and shoulders, so I'm happy to do it. I don't know if other people find that arousing, but if she does, then why not?


Again, I'm not asking to criticize your behavior, but to try to understand it. 





UMP said:


> You're not wrong at all. I am not going to mention the cheating because that's a different problem altogether that I am not qualified to comment on.
> 
> Being married for 25 years and being a selfish lover I CAN comment on.
> 
> ...


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## adegirl2016 (Dec 14, 2016)

^^^thats a great question! If your spouse wants/needs something from you, why wouldn't you do it?


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

adegirl2016 said:


> Interesting... that makes perfect sense to me. This may apply to him. So how did your wife convince you to do this? Did she sit down and have a talk with you? Was it because she drifted away sexually?
> 
> How can I say this to my husband?


I could tell that she got about as much enjoyment during sex as she did doing the dishes.
That was MY wake up call.

What you really want to tell him is that he SUCKS at sex. My wife did not actually say these words, but her actions spoke just as loudly. She would get me to hurry up, and I believe she was faking orgasms too. However, I do love my wife very much so I had to be honest with myself, realizing that there was something wrong. It's easy for a husband to blame his wife. What needs to be done is to look inwardly. 

Not easy for anyone to do this, especially a husband who has to come to terms with his lousy sexual abilities. Being good at sex takes work, research and application. It's a long process with ups and downs.

Some men are simply Neanderthals when it comes to sex. My only advice would be to lay it all on the table as best as you can. He will be pissed and butt hurt. Will he take that information and work on himself or ignore you? I don't know.

All you can do is try to tell him and pray. IMHO.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

uhtred said:


> I'm really not trying to pick on you, but I have a question:
> 
> If she wanted a back rub before sex, why not? Even if it didn't match what you had seen, if it was something she enjoyed, why didn't it seem like a good thing to do?
> 
> ...


Because I was an idiot!

Stupid, stubborn and uninformed. Seems simple and obvious to me now. Have there been things in your life when you look back and say to yourself, "what the f$ck was I thinking?!!?" That was me regarding sex with my wife.


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## hifromme67 (Oct 30, 2016)

Adegirl- You describe my husband to a T. We have been together since I was 17 and he was 18. We are now 49 and 50. I didn't notice the selfish sex until just a couple years ago. I also just discovered his porn addiction a year ago. I have always felt that sexually he was stuck in a teenager's body/mentality. He is very vanilla in bed, doesn't know what feels good or even has commen sense that just maybe, he should be concerned that I get turned on. There are many times we have sex (not make love) and I am not able to orgasm. He finishes and doesn't think to ask if he should make me O. A lot of our problems are because of the porn and I think the fact that he's very immature in the sex area. I don't see a solution to it if they are not mature enough to realize what they are doing or not doing. I've just given up because I don't want to insult him. I hope that you guys are able to work through it.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

adegirl2016 said:


> Interesting... that makes perfect sense to me. This may apply to him. So how did your wife convince you to do this? Did she sit down and have a talk with you? Was it because she drifted away sexually?
> 
> How can I say this to my husband?


One other thing. I always wanted my wife to be a wild "porn star" woman. Doing all sorts of nasty things with zest. If that did not happen, I always blamed my wife. What I now know is that if you are thoughtful and take care of her needs the way SHE needs them taken car of, the vixen WILL come out.

That's the beauty of this. It not only got her what she wanted, it got me what I wanted too.


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

Women are simply more sexually complex than men. IMO
For example, no matter what happens during the week or day, I can be ready for sex.

If my wife has had a bad week or bad day, she will have sex, but she needs more work getting her mind and body ready. In the past I would take a personal affront to this. Now, it matters not. I'll bring out the vibrators, or any other tool or method I need to get her going. What matters is not how long or how hard it takes to get my wife excited. What matters is how it ends.

When you first get married it's like skiing a great mountain with a massive, speedy, heated gondola to get you to the top. Everybody is happy.

After a few years the gondola does not work anymore and you have to take several open air ski lifts. 

A few more years after that and the outdoor lift is broken. Now you must stand on a treadmill for a bit longer even still.

What the husband does not realize is that his complaining and constant rushing will NOT get him on top of the mountain any faster. All it does is ruin the trip down for both of you.

Take your time and enjoy the ride up too, no matter how long it takes.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Another part of this is that women (men too, but less often) need to clearly communicate what they want. I still worry that after all these years my wife isn't enjoying sex as much as I would hope and just hasn't told me what she wants. (I ask). I think sometimes people assume it is "obvious", but it really isn't. Different people want different things and the same person may want different things at different times.

I don't think this is the issue with the OP, but she should make sure that she has CLEARLY communicated what she wants.


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## adegirl2016 (Dec 14, 2016)

I agree- what he doesn't realize is that the sex would be even better if he paid attention to me. It's so annoying. Cant help but fantasize past relationships in this area. Sex is important to me. So idk if I am wrong for making this part of whether I stay or go.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Sex is very important, at least to many people. There is nothing wrong with making your sex life part of your decision to stay or leave. Even if there were no other issues, I would see nothing wrong with leaving over a bad sex life. 




adegirl2016 said:


> I agree- what he doesn't realize is that the sex would be even better if he paid attention to me. It's so annoying. Cant help but fantasize past relationships in this area. Sex is important to me. So idk if I am wrong for making this part of whether I stay or go.


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## MrsHolland (Jun 18, 2016)

He had an affair and he is a dud root. Very carefully consider how much more of your life you are going to waste on him.


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## adegirl2016 (Dec 14, 2016)

MrsHolland said:


> He had an affair and he is a dud root. Very carefully consider how much more of your life you are going to waste on him.


Trust me. This goes through my head hundreds of times a day. He is making efforts but not everywhere obviously.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

I admire you for being able to stay after an affair, and also being able to have sex with him again. I am not sure I would ever be able to have sex again if that happened to me, nor trust again. It damages the marriage so much, its never the same.
As for the porn, I wouldn't be with a man who looked at porn. The thought of him wanting to act out what is there and thinking of those women and not me, would take away any desire I had for sex. I would rather be single than that.

As for what you do in bed. not everyone wants or likes giving and/or receiving oral sex. If you enjoy doing it for him that's fine, but its as if you are doing it to get it in return and maybe he doesn't like it.


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## She'sStillGotIt (Jul 30, 2016)

Was this cretin raised by wolves in the wild? He's selfish, arrogant, self-entitled, ignorant, and self-absorbed.

Not sure what possible redeeming qualities he has because to be honest, I haven't read ONE positive thing about him in this entire thread. 

You shouldn't have to negotiate YOUR pleasure with this selfish asswipe. Is he really that ignorant that he thinks his pleasure is above negotiation but yours isn't? I'd be so done with this jerk.

Unfortunately, I completely disagree with Diana. I don't admire you staying with this lying, cheating miscreant at *all*. Staying with him just means compromise after compromise after compromise - for YOU. Where's the payoff for you in that? For the love of all that's good and holy, I *don't* see it. Sorry.


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## Diana7 (Apr 19, 2016)

She'sStillGotIt said:


> Was this cretin raised by wolves in the wild? He's selfish, arrogant, self-entitled, ignorant, and self-absorbed.
> 
> Not sure what possible redeeming qualities he has because to be honest, I haven't read ONE positive thing about him in this entire thread.
> 
> ...


I couldn't and wouldn't stay, nor would I be able to have sex again with the heater if this happened to me, but I think she is strong to make the decision to remain despite this. Or is the one who leaves stronger? I dont know, but I do know some marriages that worked after an affair.


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## adegirl2016 (Dec 14, 2016)

I know I sound pretty crazy. Part of me wants to see if we can work it out and part of me hates him for all the crap I have been through. 
He says I probably only tell people the negatives, so I will give you some positives ...

He has been going to counseling from day one. He has been open about everything, and answers any questions I have. He has been patient with me in the process of reconciling. 

He read His Needs Her Needs, and he hates to read. He checks in from work very often. He is in the process of a job change (Ap was a coworker). He is in the process of writing and apology letter to my dad and his mom (will do in person but practicing what he wants to say- that can't be easy to do). 

He is trying but I'm not sure if anything will ever be enough.


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

IMHO its not enough.

Those are all OK, but none of them rise above the level of what I would consider an absolute minimum. 

You deserve a lot better than this. 




adegirl2016 said:


> I know I sound pretty crazy. Part of me wants to see if we can work it out and part of me hates him for all the crap I have been through.
> He says I probably only tell people the negatives, so I will give you some positives ...
> 
> He has been going to counseling from day one. He has been open about everything, and answers any questions I have. He has been patient with me in the process of reconciling.
> ...


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## Spicy (Jun 18, 2016)

UMP said:


> Because I was an idiot!
> 
> Stupid, stubborn and uninformed. Seems simple and obvious to me now. Have there been things in your life when you look back and say to yourself, "what the f$ck was I thinking?!!?" That was me regarding sex with my wife.


Gawd how I love brutal honesty. >


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## UMP (Dec 23, 2014)

Spicy said:


> Gawd how I love brutal honesty. >


Sex with my wife was an undiscovered treasure right in front of my face.
I was too busy playing golf and doing other meaningless bullshiit to realize that true happiness was always waiting for me at home.

My only consulation is that I finally found the treasure. Better late than never, I guess.


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## adegirl2016 (Dec 14, 2016)

What would be considered enough? He says he will do anything. Is it up to him to figure out what to do? Idk


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

adegirl2016 said:


> I know I sound pretty crazy. Part of me wants to see if we can work it out and part of me hates him for all the crap I have been through.
> He says I probably only tell people the negatives, so I will give you some positives ...
> 
> He has been going to counseling from day one. He has been open about everything, and answers any questions I have. He has been patient with me in the process of reconciling.
> ...


He wouldn't have to do those things if he didn't commit adultery in the first place. So, he's basically in the process of trying to clean up his own mess. Do you think he should be praised for merely taking some responsibility for the massive betrayal he perpetrated? I don't. 

The part of this post that sticks in my craw is how you credit him for being patient with you during reconciliation. Big whoop. He has been a sh!t husband outside of the affair and then he had an affair, IMO being extremely patient with what you're going through is a small part of the _bare minimum_ he owes you for even thinking about staying in the marriage. Transparency, checking in, and leaving the job his mistress works with him are also parts of the same bare minimum.



adegirl2016 said:


> What would be considered enough? He says he will do anything. Is it up to him to figure out what to do? Idk


Apparently, he's willing to "do anything" but what he actually needs to do. If you need more of an emotional connection and somewhat decent sex, he should be making it his life's mission to give that to you, selflessly.

My mother died at 44. I learned life is short and once time has passed, you can't get it back. If you stay in this marriage, you're sacrificing happiness and the opportunity to find a compatible mate for financial reasons. Personally, I'd rather live more modestly than watch years pass, wasted. As long as everyone would have a roof over their heads and the necessities, there's no reason you can't divorce if you want out.

I had a rl friend in similar circumstances. I went over to her house and we looked at her expenses. It turned out, she could easily divorce and live decently if she made a few changes.

*Car payment? Auto insurance payment? Either pay it off or turn it in and buy a gently used car outright to save on the monthly car payment. This also typically lowers insurance payments, sometimes by more than $100 a month.

*Area with high cost of living? Move. Look for a nearby area that is still decent, but less expensive. Yes, there may be a commute. However, even the cost of gas and time is usually more than made up for in savings. For example, in my area houses rent for about $1200 a month. If you drive 20 minutes south of me, the neighborhoods are just as nice and rent is about $700 on average.

*Make your own food and beverages rather than buy. We save around $300 a month simply by making our own iced coffee, tea, and lunches to take with us. This includes my son's school lunch since our local HS charges $20 a week for lunch. I can buy bread, lunch meat, and granola bars along with fruit cups and juice for the week, total cost approx. $10.

*Lawn service? Buy a mower, weed whacker, and rake. Do the yard yourself with the kids on the weekends. My neighbor pays $160 per month for lawn service. I do mine in about 2 hours on the weekend for free.

IIRC, we figured out how she could cut expenses over $1200 per month and live comfortably divorced with just a little effort.

If there's a will, there's a way.


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## adegirl2016 (Dec 14, 2016)

MJJEAN said:


> He wouldn't have to do those things if he didn't commit adultery in the first place. So, he's basically in the process of trying to clean up his own mess. Do you think he should be praised for merely taking some responsibility for the massive betrayal he perpetrated? I don't.
> 
> The part of this post that sticks in my craw is how you credit him for being patient with you during reconciliation. Big whoop. He has been a sh!t husband outside of the affair and then he had an affair, IMO being extremely patient with what you're going through is a small part of the _bare minimum_ he owes you for even thinking about staying in the marriage. Transparency, checking in, and leaving the job his mistress works with him are also parts of the same bare minimum.
> 
> ...




You pretty much put into words what I could not figure out how to say. I told him he is basically just now being a decent HUMAN BEING to me. He has not yet worked to make anything up to me. I actually sat down and started making a list of ways for him to make it up to me. But then I stopped because HE should be the one trying to figure out how to make it up to me. He should be the one researching ways to make this better. 

I spend all day everyday trying to figure all of this out. It takes time away from our kids, from my school work, my house work. All of my energy is going to this. Yet he is sitting across from me on the couch, happily watching TV right now. IDK I guess if I had cheated on him, I would be bending over backwards trying to figure this out. Instead I am the one bending over backwards to help him help me. 

Am I right? I guess that was part of my original question as well - should I be making all the effort to make our sex life better? I told him I needed attention in bed. Shouldn't he be making every effort to keep me?


I guess you guys have be fired up again. Which I should be...


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## uhtred (Jun 22, 2016)

Enough (for me) would be actions that show that he values your happiness more than his own. That the thing he most enjoys is watching you smile.

In bed, out of bed, in general, he should *want* you to be happy and show that through actions. If he does, I assume you would do the same for him.




adegirl2016 said:


> What would be considered enough? He says he will do anything. Is it up to him to figure out what to do? Idk


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## TheTruthHurts (Oct 1, 2015)

This guy's going to start blaming TAM for his marital issues.

If you want to throw him a bone, give him a couple of websites to research. Tell him to go to the Sinclair institute, order a bunch of the DVDs on sex, and watch all of them. Then think about it and come up with a bunch of questions about what he's seen that he thinks you might be looking for. Also, if you want to be REALLY direct, have him make a list of things he's NOT doing that he saw that he thinks he SHOULD be doing.

You might go there and look at what they offer - I bought a couple of DVD bundles and my W liked what she saw so far. But they also have one on anal sex, for example, so if there are things you DON'T want, rule them out. But that's the only DVD that might be questionable (not that there's anything inherently wrong with anal sex).


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## MJJEAN (Jun 26, 2015)

adegirl2016 said:


> You pretty much put into words what I could not figure out how to say. I told him he is basically just now being a decent HUMAN BEING to me. He has not yet worked to make anything up to me. I actually sat down and started making a list of ways for him to make it up to me. But then I stopped because HE should be the one trying to figure out how to make it up to me. He should be the one researching ways to make this better.
> 
> I spend all day everyday trying to figure all of this out. It takes time away from our kids, from my school work, my house work. All of my energy is going to this. Yet he is sitting across from me on the couch, happily watching TV right now. IDK I guess if I had cheated on him, I would be bending over backwards trying to figure this out. Instead I am the one bending over backwards to help him help me.
> 
> ...


Some men are just thick. As @TheTruthHurts said, you could throw him a bone and give him some reading material. If you explain to him, explicitly if necessary, the issues and give him the reading material and he still doesn't get it, you know it's hopeless and time to separate.


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## Saibasu (Nov 3, 2016)

adegirl2016 said:


> So my husband is incredibly selfish in bed. He has been from day one. I feel like this is just the way that he is. I know he watches/has watched porn, and it seems like he only wants to replicate what he sees there. Which is fine once in a while, I am flexible and down to do whatever he wants.
> 
> In my eyes, we have never "made love". He doesn't just volunteer to go down on me. In fact, it has been a LONG time since he has. He doesn't seem to take pride in making me O. But he expects that I will go down on him every time.
> 
> ...


He is selfish in bed and selfish in life. He does what he wants to get what he wants and he doesn't seem to care about your needs. Both sexual and marital. This isn't just a phase or downturn, he is a selfish person. Has been and chances are always will be. He should of cared about your sexual pleasure from the beginning, just the fact that he didn't is enough to warrant some thought. Then he goes and cheats on you? And STILL doesn't up his game? He's too self absorbed. Yes be more vocal. No more Mrs Doormat. You want him to make sex good. You tell him it better be. You want him to think of you more, tell him he better do it or he's GONE. If he is really sorry for what he did and really understands the gravity of the situation he put your marriage in, then he should be graveling at your feet for forgiveness. Though it doesn't seem like he cares enough about your heart to do that. Only you can decide what you will put up with, but honey, YOU ARE WORTH MORE THAN THAT.


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

Does he even get you a card and a gift on your birthday and anniversary?

I bet he doesn't and he wouldn't even remember it if you didn't remind him.


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## adegirl2016 (Dec 14, 2016)

He does but the gifts usually suck. When we have the money, he tries. Lately, no because we haven't had much to spare. I haven't for him either.

Although the day he cheated on me, I spent all day texting my dad about Christmas. I was so upset that we could barely afford to get our 4 year old stuff. I wanted to get him something so my dad was going to help me. So much for that!


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## browser (Oct 26, 2016)

He cheated on you, won't go down on you but expects a regular BJ.

I don't like him and I never even met him.


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## katiecrna (Jan 29, 2016)

Well your right, he is selfish.

The problem with some women is that we are pleasers and we don't worry about our needs, or at least ask for it. But we need to take responsibility for our own sex life. Sex and orgasming is important to me. That is why I have sex... to orgasm. Yea that might be selfish to some, but I'm pretty sure that's the end point men want too for them-self. For the beginning of our marriage (we were virgins), I made this very clear... if I don't orgasm, you don't orgasm. Or if I don't orgasm, you owe me one before you orgasm again. Of course this isn't literal because there were times that I could t get there or didn't want to and just wanted to please him, but probably 90% of the time it did. Now it's just the way our sex life is... if I don't finish with inter course he goes down on me because it's "my turn". And trust me I make sure it happens Bc I always say hehe my turn! Because I am excited and looking forward to my orgasm, and I think he likes that I want/need it and he can satisfy me. Also, when he is satisfying me I always make it very clear that I love it/need it/ blah blah which makes me feel good. 

Some people have sex and orgasm and it's like you can't tell that they even enjoyed it. I think it people were more enthusiastic their partners would be happier to satisfy. My husband loves that I love sex and want an orgasm, being enthusiastic makes sex way better and it's good for our egos. 

Stop giving his oral sex and be a little bossy and selfish. He might think this is hot, plus it's empowering and coming off of an affair it will help you.


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## katiecrna (Jan 29, 2016)

It depends on how much you want the marriage to work. The problem is... he SHOULD be putting in more effort, he should be trying to make you happy, he should be making this his #1 priority to show you you are worth it. But he isn't. He is just a stupid guy who doesn't know what he has and probably doesn't think your going to leave him. Some men take the easy path, the path of least resistance that allows them to do the bare minimal to stay married. Some men will just never get it. But the question is, if it worth breaking up a marriage and family over? It's tough.


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