# Stuck between a rock and a hard place



## JennaLynne (Sep 13, 2011)

Hey everyone....

Brief summary if you haven't read my prev. posts. Been seperated from my H since mid August. He wanted a divorce...said he dreaded coming home. We've been together for almost 10 years, married for (almost) 3 years. I hadn't been the greatest wife (lost my "drive", negative, and was not supportive when he was going through a rough job transition) He hasn't been the greatest to me (video games came first, lack of attention, lack of dates\companionship). 

I have learned in my time apart to fix my "drive" issue in learning to be happy with myself - I've also learned that most things just weren't worth the battles I ensued with H.

I made it clear I believe we can reconcile our marriage many times, because I do. 

We began meeting once a week to "see how things go" about 2 months ago -- they seemed to be going well, we laughed some, hung out like we used to....a few times we did the deed, and it was fun....we talked. However we never talked about our situation.

About 3 weeks ago H and I met up and I mentioned that I would like to move back home so we can work on us (side note here - his medling brother lives at our home now - he was the catalist when I left)

Well it's been 1.5 weeks since I've seen my H - last I saw him he came for and impromptu dinner at my mom's (he helped them fix their TV)...it was pleasant - we all chatted around the dinner table as if nothing was wrong. The following 4 days he was off of work playing a new video game, and just wouldn't return calls (about bills). Finally Friday he answered and he was back to his sullen self with his I really don't think we can work things out talk. 

Now the kicker --- he hasn't filed for a divorce. I check out state's courtsite weekly (not big on surprises I guess). I am in agreement with all of my support system people in that all signs point to he just doesn't want to be with me.....but then there are the times we are together, JUST US (ie: no brother in law)...he seems to sink into this things will never work attitude when we go a stretch of no seeing each other.

I have laid it out there for him - and actually emailed him and texted him that if he is trying to push me away to the point I file, it's not going to happen. I've always told him that I'd never give up on him.

However limbo land is getting too hard....my mom cries FOR me...and people keep saying I can't continue to live like this -- and they are right - though I feel if I file, I'll always wonder and live in regret, and if I don't, I'll live in limbo forever as it seems he doesn't want to file, yet doesn't want to work on things....

Suggestions...anyone? I am feling so lost right now.


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## JennaLynne (Sep 13, 2011)

some have said wait it out even though limbo is terrible....and others say I have to push....


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

"filing" is just that: paperwork. If the marriage is dead let it rest in peace, and if it's not that mean both spouses are working on it. If he is not working on it, not willing to work on it nor doesn't want to work on it then yeah, you are keeping yourself in limbo... not by not filing the paperwork, just simply that you are still emotionally investing in the relationship. If getting the paperwork done is a way for you to choose a direction then go with it, but sitting waiting indefinitely for him to make a move isn't going to make anything change, just don't get hung up on the documentation because that is all secondary it doesn't define your marriage.


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## cherrymamajb87 (Nov 9, 2011)

JennaLynne, your situation is so similar to mine. I too became negative and not supportive, and my husband ignored me for video games. I too have learned that the fights weren't worth it and that I need to be more supportive and understanding. I haven't filed yet either, I keep holding onto that sliver of hope that we can make things work. I hope things get better for you. I'm so sorry for your pain, I know the feeling.


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## JennaLynne (Sep 13, 2011)

Lon - well that is just it -- when we are together - when we would meet up he was mosre positive about us working on things...he's told his family at times he wanted to try.....it's the gaps in time where we don't talk\see each other where he reverts back.

Cherry - great minds...I just posted on yout thread that I wish I had some advice...I'm in the same boat. I will keep hoping for you too....what a mess, no? How is your son doing?


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## cherrymamajb87 (Nov 9, 2011)

I know, it's a very sticky situation. If I file he'll say it was me that made the choice, if I don't then I'm just sitting here confused. My son is doing alright, I think he's having a hard time adjusting...if the phone rings or someone knocks on the door, he says Daddy. So its hard to watch sometimes. Thank you for your words and I will hold out hope for you as well.


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## JennaLynne (Sep 13, 2011)

I actually ended up emailing my H today...and said I am moving back home. brother has to make other arrangements and we need to either work on us, or make things worse, and why would anyone want to make things worse.....right??? I dunno - we will see. I did tell him that yes, we had problems, all relationships do....and it would sure be a shame to walk away from 10 years and a family that loves him over something that can be fixed. I haven't wanted to force his hand - but maybe it's what needs to be done...and I guess at the end of it, I'm no worse off.


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## cherrymamajb87 (Nov 9, 2011)

That's a very big step, and a good point. You're not going to get very far in the relationship apart and if you go home and it doesn't work out you're still in the same situation, but at least you know you gave it your all. I will be praying for you and hope for the best. Please let us know how this goes.


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## JennaLynne (Sep 13, 2011)

THanks Cherry - I'll do the same for you!!  Thanks for the listening ear!!


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

JennaLynne said:


> Suggestions...anyone? I am feling so lost right now.


Yes, file for divorce.

Jenna you`ve been at this for a very long time for him to still be non-commital.
He seems to have no will of his own or the ability to make a life choice.
When he`s with you things look up when he`s with his brother, it`ll never work.

Force him to **** or get off the pot.

File.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

JennaLynne said:


> I actually ended up emailing my H today...and said I am moving back home. brother has to make other arrangements and we need to either work on us,..


That will force his hand too.

Has he replied to your e-mail?


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## Freak On a Leash (Feb 19, 2010)

JennaLynne said:


> I actually ended up emailing my H today...and said I am moving back home. brother has to make other arrangements and we need to either work on us.


That's a great start. :smthumbup: His reaction/reply will tell you a lot. Then you can start making decisions. You are lucky in that you don't have any children with him to tie him to you. You CAN walk away from this and start over relatively easily. So don't be afraid to do so!

Don't be a log floating in his river. Time for you to call the shots! Good luck!


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

Freak On a Leash said:


> Don't be a log floating in his river. Time for you to call the shots! Good luck!


Freak has a point here Jenna.

You`ve been following his lead for too long now and he`s as fickle as the wind.

Make some decisions for him and get him to commit one way or the other.


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## JennaLynne (Sep 13, 2011)

Freak - to say it's easier just b\c I don't have kids is a false statement. Emotional things aside, financial issues are insane (home in a stalled market, etc).....

A divorce is not something I want. I CAN do a lot of thinngs...that doesn't mean they are all whats best for me. Though at this point something has to give - either we are going to work on getting better...or we'll work on making things worse.

Tacoma - I have not gotten a response yet - it was to work email from work email....I've always gotten a read receipt in the past....however you never know if hes opted to decline the read receipt -- in other words he may or may no have read it yet - so I am waiting....again. 

I must say I am worried though - the last thing we need is for him to listen to his brother and run out and get an apt that costs more than our mortgage....we're already barely making it .... adding (theoretically) a 2nd mortgage would completely sink us. Neither one of us has the credit (and I don't have the income though I work full time) to support the mortgage on my own - buy him out essencially. All of this stuff weighs on my mind heavily. 

Here is the actual email (with names removed)

Hey there.

Again – I apologize for the work email thing – but it is the most efficient. 

I’m gonna come home H. We can figure out how to work on things, or figure out how to make things worse than they need to be (mainly financially since we will both be on the hook for the home and destroying credit and getting sued by lenders is just silly). 

I do have quite a bit going on this week, so I was thinking Sunday or next week. Brother will need to make arrangements – which shouldn’t be too hard, as he said he had living arrangements prior to coming back to town. I know you love your brother, and I care about him too, however we need to come first right now. We are married – with problems? Of course – every relationship endures rough times, and we’ve had many. We can either resolve them, which truly can be easy…..or you can walk away and end up losing a wife who loves you more than words can say, and a family who feels the same way about you.

(all) of our parents are here to support us. No one is taking sides, or forming allies – believe me, I know where I fell short in our marriage, and I’ve been working to better myself. The all want what’s best for both of us.

I believe somewhere in your head\heart you think there is a chance for us to reconcile….otherwise you would have filed for a divorce already, but at the same time you’re unsure if things will work. I get it. I say you don’t know unless you try. And 10 years together and all of our families are pretty great reasons to give it a shot.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

JennaLynne, you are making the right move by choosing to go back to your own home. I don't think the sentiment in your email to H is going to have the effect you think it might though. You come across as oblivious to your H's choice to try moving on without you and you are looking too much into his decision to not file any paperwork - it is not a statement of his intent it just shows it is not an important matter for him.

You have to stand up for yourself, and that means not letting his choices determine where you make your home or whether or not you are happy - if he expresses doubt or dismay at your decision to live in your own home tell him it is up to him to leave since that is what he says he wants, make him go to the work of killing the marriage. Seriously you need to make this much more difficult for him no matter what he chooses, nobody has suggested the 180 yet, but that is essentially what it is going to take for you to get the kind of response from him you need, and more importantly to prepare yourself for taking care of your own needs.

My suggestion is to stop saying "we" when you should be saying "I". Whether R is an option for him or not, come up with a plan for both outcomes - if he chooses to stay and work on it make sure neither of you just sweep the issues under the rug, keep working on it, plan time for each other and go to MC... if he chooses to leave, have a financial plan in place with regards to your living arrangements and the budget, have a lawyer available to draw up a legal separation agreement. These aren't light matters nor an easy thing to have to go through, but for your own sake you shouldn't put them off or leave it in the hands of someone else, especially someone like your H who is not really very caring of your feelings right now.


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## JennaLynne (Sep 13, 2011)

Well - that is just it....there is no budget nor financial plan that would make us be ok. Our home won't sell for within $40K to break even. Our incomes will not support Apt + mortgage. 

Everything seems like a lose lose. I try to remain positive (this was one of my H's issues with me).....they say if you keep thinking good things - good things will happen. 

I cannot argue the fact that H seems to not care. They say indifference is the opposite of love. However everyone who knows him says he's not, he does care about me, he is just lazy and doesn't know what to do.

In any event this limbo stuff is wearing on me....so something needed to be done. Now I just hope I don't go back home to a completely empty house.......as that would be his brother's style.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

JennaLynne said:


> Well - that is just it....there is no budget nor financial plan that would make us be ok. Our home won't sell for within $40K to break even. Our incomes will not support Apt + mortgage.
> 
> Everything seems like a lose lose. I try to remain positive (this was one of my H's issues with me).....they say if you keep thinking good things - good things will happen.
> 
> ...


You are putting on false constraints as an excuse to keep yourself in limbo. If you need to make more income, then get another job, if you can't keep up with your debt then consider filing for bankruptcy protection, if you need shelter it seems you have a place to stay already. But you need to make YOUR OWN financial plan and stop making yourself dependent on his decisions. Untangle yourself from him or nothing will happen - you are both paralyzed from taking real action because of the false arguments you are both falling for. I don't know what else to tell you, until you can take charge of your own decisions no advice anyone gives you will make any difference. Take a leap of faith in yourself because you are more than capable, you just have doubt - when it comes down to it, doubt is completely irrelevant.


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## cherrymamajb87 (Nov 9, 2011)

While I do agree with much of what Lon is saying, you do need to PREPARE for this not working out in favor of reconcile, I also don't agree that you are using these things as excuses. The two of you made commitments and built a life together, your H should not be allowed to escape this unscathed. You should not have to get a second job nor should you have to file bankruptcy, not at least until you have given it your best effort. Bankruptcy in any event, divorce or not, should ALWAYS be a last resort. You should move back into the home you helped build and if your H decides he wants to leave then let him. Do not worry about his financial struggle if he decides that, he obviously isn't worried about your emotional struggle. However should this happen and he does leave, I would advice you file for divorce. Filing doesn't mean the divorce is the last of your relationship, if it's meant to be you can always remarry or never sign the final judgment. But filing first will give you the leverage financially. He will be required to continue the support for that mortgage seeing as he's the one that has left the marital home. I really wish you the best please keep us updated.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

cherrymamajb87 said:


> While I do agree with much of what Lon is saying, you do need to PREPARE for this not working out in favor of reconcile, I also don't agree that you are using these things as excuses. The two of you made commitments and built a life together, your H should not be allowed to escape this unscathed. You should not have to get a second job nor should you have to file bankruptcy, not at least until you have given it your best effort. Bankruptcy in any event, divorce or not, should ALWAYS be a last resort. You should move back into the home you helped build and if your H decides he wants to leave then let him. Do not worry about his financial struggle if he decides that, he obviously isn't worried about your emotional struggle. However should this happen and he does leave, I would advice you file for divorce. Filing doesn't mean the divorce is the last of your relationship, if it's meant to be you can always remarry or never sign the final judgment. But filing first will give you the leverage financially. He will be required to continue the support for that mortgage seeing as he's the one that has left the marital home. I really wish you the best please keep us updated.


I am certainly not trying to seem mean or set a harsh tone, I'm just hoping JennaLynne can get a really good grasp on her reality at the moment. There are some things that need to be done and it is clear that her H is not doing them, and nor will anyone else - taking a second job isn't about letting her H off the hook or punishing her, its about her meeting her own needs and taking care of her own responsibilities. I agree that a legal separation is looming because until you can divide up the the debts and marital property JennaLynne's hands are tied, I'm simply trying to remind her that she has the tools, and the right, to unbind herself. And that is by no means impossible. 

Someone on here had a really great quote from George Carlin I think: "Life is simple, do what is next." I can't really think of any way to argue this.


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## cherrymamajb87 (Nov 9, 2011)

No I never thought you were being mean or harsh, I agreed she needs to be prepared. But some women will take that and try to put all the weight on their own shoulders, its a womans nature. I just wanted her to also know that he has to carry some of that weight as well. And I love to hear someone quote George Carlin...he also said this 
“Here's all you have to know about men and women: women are crazy, men are stupid. And the main reason women are crazy is that men are stupid.”


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## JennaLynne (Sep 13, 2011)

In my state it doesn't matter who stays who leaves, if there are affairs....we are a 50\50 states unless you VOLUNTEER to give more to the other spouse.

Cherry you are right in saying I am not using $$ as an excuse. At the end of the day I have know my H for 10 years, and while his bahavior may seem cut and dry to outsiders - please trust me when I say it's not. Should he be putting more effort into us - absolutely - no question or arguement there.

Is a divorce a possibility - absolutely. I get that. 

As fas as a 2nd job - Lon I think you misunderstood what I was saying. I am fully capable of supporting myself. I do not depend on my H for $$. What I was saying is that our incomes will not support 2 mortgages (since our home will not sell for enough to even come close to breaking even). And in my state unless we are legally D I am on the hook for his rental contract (should he get one) without having to sign. D here takes 6 months to finanlize.

These aren't excuses, they are facts. While I respect what you are saying Lon, I'm fighting for something that is worth fighting for right now. Granted, that might change in time - however that is how it is right now.


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## cherrymamajb87 (Nov 9, 2011)

I believe his behavior sounds more like a confused man, than cut and dry, that was in no way what I was implying. You are right to fight for this, it is your marriage, your life that you spent ten years building is most certainly worth fighting for no matter how hard it gets. Hang in there and hopefully things work out for the best.


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## Lon (Jun 6, 2011)

JennaLynne said:


> In my state it doesn't matter who stays who leaves, if there are affairs....we are a 50\50 states unless you VOLUNTEER to give more to the other spouse.
> 
> Cherry you are right in saying I am not using $$ as an excuse. At the end of the day I have know my H for 10 years, and while his bahavior may seem cut and dry to outsiders - please trust me when I say it's not. Should he be putting more effort into us - absolutely - no question or arguement there.
> 
> ...


I was just trying to say it doesn't matter if your incomes don't support 2 mortgages, only matters if YOUR income can support one (or even rent, or maybe you have to get a room-mate or ... etc) As to the time to settle a divorce, that ultimately is temporary and relatively short-term... what is worth more, a lifetime of numbness or a few years of having to keep a little less of what you earn?

But more importantly, I respect your determination to do what YOU think is right, this is your thread after all, and if you want to work on it I commend you for knowing what you need to do...


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## JennaLynne (Sep 13, 2011)

Right now I'd settle for an answer. My quandry is that I know, for me, if I filed for a divorce and let it go through the motions....I'd regret it. For me, it is too soon to cut the ties. 

As far as income - this is the issue we face. Due to the housing state we owe much more to the bank than it would ever sell for. I can afford an apt on my own (with some cutbacks). I can also get a roommate at an apt. (Our home is a 1 bd with a loft NOT 2nd bedrm if that makes sense). H would not remain there...his brother has already tried to talk him into just leaving the condo and letting it go. This is what I mean about financial issues. Again, not to say people should remain married just because the financial constraints - but it is something that causes me anxiety. 

When I look at my H - I see something, still, in his eyes. Love is still there, it is just burried. He seems lost. And while that may sound foolish it's what I see.


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## cherrymamajb87 (Nov 9, 2011)

It doesn't sound foolish to those of us who still believe in our marriages. I think if you can still see/feel the love in him somewhere it's most likely still there. People may call that naive, but they say sometimes we know our spouses better than they know themselves, so maybe we can just see something they can't yet. They have it buried under confusion/hurt/fear, we just have to give them the time to feel it too.


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## JennaLynne (Sep 13, 2011)

I wish that space would heal whatever H is going through.....I've prayed for a miracle. I've emailed the Pastor who married us. I'm just looking for some glimmer of hope


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## JennaLynne (Sep 13, 2011)

Not sure what the post above is all about.

Anyway I stumbled across some interesting information yesterday regarding adult ADD - and that described H to a tee. Freakishly dead on. ADHD runs in his family as well, and apparently often goes misdiagnosed. However it seems to be a mott point as he all but refuses to be evaluated

**side rant re: GENERAL practicioners who hand out anxiety\depression meds like tylenol**

We are suppose to meet tonight to talk....about what I don't know - but I've decided that we've got to make a plan. And that I would like him to see the pastor who married us with me - if nothing more comes out of it than getting thr truth and a plan set forth on how to move on. As clearly we go round in circles when we try to do it ourselves.....

Here is the information I found - thought some of you might be interested. (again - this COULD be it for me, or my H could simply be more a [email protected]$$ than I ever imagined).

"It could be that the "walkaways" have some type of undiagnosed condition such as depression or ADHD.

Any condition affecting the frontal lobes of the brain can impair insight, or objectivity. They don't always perceive themselves or those around them accurately -- and can often be self-centered. (This might fit what you describe as "irrational and self-serving.")

In my work over the years, providing support in the Adult ADHD community, I hear from those who say their partners with ADHD just checked out -- sometimes for days, sometimes for weeks, sometimes for months.

The advice offered is often along the lines of, "must be an affair." And maybe that's true in some cases, but not all. Some people with ADHD just get tired of failing at relationships and tired of disappointing other people and themselves. They don't know they have ADHD, don't know there are solutions, and so they just check out. It's the only way to combat the stress that they know -- and can easily pursue. Once they learn about ADHD and discover they have it, they can start piecing together the puzzle.

And those who have really low "insight" (accurate self-perception) are convinced that they aren't the problem, it's their partner. So, they feel justified in just leaving without explaining. But for the majority, I'd say, they don't know how to explain it to themselves, much less to others.



This are just some of the ones that I have come across that seem to be common with the Walkaways. 

-Selfishness, self-absorption, not concerned with other's needs 
-Non-responsive, cares not to communicate in a rational manner
-No interest in intimacy 
-Unpredictable in their responses 
-Trouble concentrating 
-Memory problems
-Difficulty in making decisions 
-Presents charming self in public and the direct opposite at home 
-Mood is often irritable 
-Seems to be ready to belittle, be critical, mean and nasty
-Cannot seem to take responsibility for own actions and reactions
as in blame and complain"
- addictions to niccatine and or video games (!!!!!!!)


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## JennaLynne (Sep 13, 2011)

Oh and if it couldn't get any better.....debit card declined -- joint account overdrawn.....this is just all a mess. I've decided that if H wants to be done, then he is taking responsibility for it, which includes seeing Pastor. He cannot just act as if I never existed, which is where his head is at "if I ignore it, it'll go away". Wish me luck tonight...I've just added $$ to the ever growing list of issues.


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