# Wife Mid Life Crisis ???



## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

My wife began acting strange a year ago. I "snooped" and found that she had been texting an ex-boyfriend. They had exchanged over 1200 texts in less than one month. I confronted her and now, my life is spinning out of control.
She managed to place the blame for her text relationship on me for forcing her to fill a void in her life. She says that her biggest problem is that over the 15 years of our marriage, I did not initiate sex enough and that I did not make her feel sexy or desired. While I may be guilty of this to some degree, I have found that she is exaggerating things like this and other things, and even concocting things to feel better about herself. I am crushed. I am not handling this well. I am suspicious and paranoid and hyper-aware, and suspect of her every move, looking for hidden meaning or hidden motives in everything she does. I need her to help me feel better about our relationship, but she refuses. She has done nothing to make it up to me. So, I have become more and more withdrawn and depressed and probably not very fun to live with, which makes her pull away even more, which makes me more withdrawn. It is an awful downward spiral. She says that when she turned 39, she decided she was making changes in her life (she is not quite 40 now) and that a switch turned off (towards me). She now works out like a fiend and avoids me like the plague, though we live together with 2 children (12 and 10). I keep telling her that all I need is some genuine affection and caring from her and I can get past this. She cannot bring herself to do it. Sex is SO off the table. We have been to one couples counseling session. Now, she will only go if we go separately. We cannot afford to separate, but that is what she wants. I don't know what to do or how to handle this. I cannot shake the suspicion that she has some kind of relationship going with someone else. And I also wonder if this is simply mid life crisis. If that's the case, I don't think she would take it well if I suggested that to her. PLEASE HELP.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Is she still in contact with the X?


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

She says they are no longer in contact. I believe her about this person. I do think she is up to something with someone, but don't know who.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

This is unlikely a midlife crisis. If you suspect there is somebody else there probably is. What steps have you taken to find out? You need to know what you are dealing with before you take action.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

She is making you the villein so she can cheat on you because: "he made me do it."


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

What can I do? I have asked her and she says no, of course. I pay the phone bill so I see the phone records. There is nothing there. I want her to have her privacy. I know she has added a pass code to her phone. I know this because my son set it up and he told me about it.


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

I went through the pretty much identical scenario. In my case my wife announced she wasn't happy. As what she was telling me didn't seem to be adding up I went through her e-mail looking to see if she explained to one of her girlfriends what was going on. Instead of finding e-mails to girlfriends pouring her heart out I found e-mails to an old boyfriend. I hyperventilated when I read them. 

My wife did the same as yours. She spewed off a laundry list of my faults that justified her actions. I've since learned nothing I did justified her actions. Yes much of her laundry list was valid however she should have come to me first before taking up with someone else. Even if it was to tell me it was over. 

Whatever you do, don't let her make you feel responsible for her actions. You can take ownership of anything you've done poorly but she has to take ownership of what she has done poorly. 

My advice is to keep seeing the counsellor to help process your feelings and give you an objective sounding board. As far as seperation while I would expect you to hope for the best you really need to prepare for the worst. Make sure you're protected financially and get some sound legal advice. You need to know your options to make good decisions.

Best of luck


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

tbgunn said:


> I want her to have her privacy. I know she has added a pass code to her phone. I know this because my son set it up and he told me about it.


Red Flag

If you pay the bill do you not have access to the detail as to what numbers she is calling/texting??

What is her reason for not going to counseling as a couple??


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## here2learn (Aug 23, 2012)

Why don't you let her know that you don't feel it is appropriate, especially given the recent discovery, for either of you to withhold anything from each other. Demand complete transparency in the marriage (applicable to both parties). If she has nothing to hide, problem solved. If she puts up a fuss and refuses, problem identified.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

She might be using the data plan to text her ex-bf. Text over data plan might be hard to recover. What phone does she have ?


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

Amp, I do see the numbers that she calls and texts to on the phone bill. No red flags anymore. I just get the feeling there is something. 

Regarding counseling, I asked her why she wanted to go alone, and what did she have to say that she couldn't say in front of me. She says she can say things to the counselor that she is worried will hurt me.


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## Falene (Dec 31, 2011)

Oh my. I am sorry you are finding yourself in this situation.

First of all, those 1200 texts? We consider that an EA around here (emotional affair). In addition, the way you describe her behavior it appears she is still having that affair, it has escalated to a PA (physical affair) or she has started a new one.

TBG, I can't tell you how sorry I am you are here. Affair or no affair, you are hurting and being treated poorly and for that I am sorry.

What comes next is being said with love though you may not believe that...

If you don't start using the balls G-d gave you she is going to rip them all the way off. You need those, don't let them out of your sight again!

Through your love and desire for her you have presented yourself as a weak man who is willing to take any type of behavior in order to keep your marriage going. This is your fatal mistake and you must correct it immediately if you have any chance of saving your marriage.

Some would say that your next step should be finding out for sure whether she is having an affair or not. There are many ways you can do this. You can check her phone and computer. You can install keyloggers. You can even hire a private investigator. Securing your evidence first is your wisest move.

The reason it is so important to secure your evidence is that we betrayed spouses are usually so desparate for our marriages to be okay that we tend to believe almost anything at times. You must have no doubt in your own mind what is going on so she cannot turn it against you or state you are crazy. 

Either way, affair or no affair, you need to stop letting her push you around especially if you want your marriage to survive.

You pack her bag and you tell her she has treated you like crap for long enough. You boot her arse out. YES YOU DO, if you want your marriage to survive. You need to show her you are the man. In addition, you must NOT leave the home. Not only can it be considered as abandoning your children (crazy huh?) but you may just be playing into her hand and that is not good in this case.

If you find out she is having an affair you tell everyone, especially the other man's (OM) wife! YES YOU DO, if you want to be sure to end the affair and create an atmosphere where remorse and rebuilding can possibly take place.

You need to read up here. At the top of this forum there are newbie links. Read them! The wise ones will be in soon and they have much more info than I do. 

Please know you didn't do this. This is not your fault. You deserved more and if you put your foot down you may just find you get it. Good luck to you! *hugs*


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Could be your imagination or maybe not. The signs from her are there. Keep in mind someone else does not necessarily mean a physical affair in the traditional sense. It could be an emotional affair which is just as deadly in a marriage. 

Has she changed patterns in life. Job, friends, habits... that coincide with this or did it appear to come up about the time she began working out? Does she work out at a gym or at home?


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

She might be hiding a second phone


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

Wow.
Thank you Falene.
That is some powerful stuff.


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

Amp,
Patterns have definitely changed. Working out 3 and 4 days a week, outside of the home. I know she does it. I can see the results. She looks better than ever. The biggest change has been that she has reconnected with her life long best friend (a girl). Now, she spends at least an hour total everyday and exchanges at least 20 texts daily. This is part of my problem. Whatever she is telling her, she could be spending that energy on me.


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)

Don't discount the possibility of a pre-paid burner phone. They're cheap and easily concealed. I bought the beginning part of the story of her blameshifting stuff to you...that's right out of the handbook. What startles me is the working out and sex is "SO" off the table bit. That right there is such a huge red flag to me. 

Voice Activated Recorder (VAR) is my thought. Get one at the store and buy some heavy duty velcro to put it under her driver seat in the car. THAT is the only way I think you're gonna find out what's really going on.


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## CleanJerkSnatch (Jul 18, 2012)

She is going to seperate, while you are begging her to keep you, to stay with you, all the while she seperates for "space" or "time to think" and when she comes to the realization that she has become trash and has been dumped by OM she will ask you to come back, and she will consider it as her taking you back. 

This is horrible, have none of that, you dont fix things by running away. Stop being a nice guy, it doesnt work, its been proven over and over on these forums that you cannot nice someone out of their cheating addiction. You need to stop clinging and stop the contact. Cancel phones, expose, make it as hard as possible for her to keep acting as if she was single without commitment or consequences
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

SomedayDig said:


> Voice Activated Recorder (VAR) is my thought. Get one at the store and buy some heavy duty velcro to put it under her driver seat in the car. THAT is the only way I think you're gonna find out what's really going on.


A valid avenue, however check in to the laws in your state, jurisdiction.... Use of a VAR, cracking and monitoring her PC and other such methods may be illegal. Understand the law before you proceed.


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## Toffer (Jan 31, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> She might be hiding a second phone


Warlock is right. She could have a pay as you go phone stashed somewhere.

One other investigative tip is hide a VAR (voice activated recorder) under the seat of her car with heavy duty velcro. Cheaters feel safe talking in their cars.

Get the keylogger too. The sooner the better.

At this point, I wouldn't give a rats a$$ about her privacy. She violated any right to privacy when she stepped out of the marriage to carry on an emotional affair (at least) with her ex-BF


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## Falene (Dec 31, 2011)

tbgunn said:


> Wow.
> Thank you Falene.
> That is some powerful stuff.


TAM has helped me so much. It is nice to be able to give it back. I am sorry if I was unkind but I couldn't physically smack you so I had to use my words. 

No matter how it all turns out, it will be okay. Take care of yourself and your kids. All of you deserve so much more than this.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

tbgunn said:


> The biggest change has been that she has reconnected with her life long best friend (a girl). Now, she spends at least an hour total everyday and exchanges at least 20 texts daily.


What's your take on the GF. Is she married, party girl, negative influence...???


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

I know her well. She is married and has kids of her own. She is not even local, 400 + miles away. Don't know what kind of influence she is. However, she is in the same town as the ex-boyfriend and they are friends. Recently, my wife has been taking trips to visit her for a weekend (with the kids). Of course, I wonder what she is really up to. But, I have not caught her in any lies.


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)

The "sudden" extensive calls to her GF says one thing to me: Confidante. She has someone to talk to who will listen about what's going on with her.

Again, IMO...Lifelong GF = Confidante


EDIT: Also, ummm, take this for what it is...but the contact for my wife's (Regret214) xOM was listed as a girl who she works with. I wouldn't put it past the guy to have a "new" (read as burner phone) number and she's telling you it's the long lost bestest friend in the world.


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

400 miles for a weekend visit on a regular basis is a stretch for me to buy especially with the XBF. Assume she is in physical contact with the X. Reasonable assumption?

Your wife has upped her game with the workouts.

She regularly travels to a town where a known X is who she has already conducted a clandestine emotional relationship with.

Secrecy on her phone.

A lot of smoke there.


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

Falene,
I feel like I am being the weak man here. I am not a weak man. But, this situation is entirely new to me and I am blind-sided. I know I need to man up, but how? What do I need to do? What if I am wrong about the cheating and she genuinely just wants out of the marriage? I guess I need to find that out, huh? If she is not cheating, this seems like mid life crisis type stuff.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

The lock on the phone and no record of texts indicates she is either using an app to communicate with OM or iMessage if it's an iPhone as texts from one iPhone to another don't show up on the bill/record


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

Amp,
You are right. There is a lot of smoke there. I see it too. I confront her about it and we talk about. She makes it all seem so benign, no big deal. She says her visits with her friend are just a way to get away and breathe for a little while. I guess I just don't want to believe it.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

And if your son set up the pass code, discretely ask him for the password.


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

First, no more 400 mile weekend visit to long lost "girlfriend".

If she goes, hire a PI there to watch her. 

Does she drive the car there? If so, put a gps on the car.

And get several VAR (voice activated recorder) -- one in the car, one where she goes and talk privately.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

Also find out all you can about OM on spokeo and expose to his wife if married


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

tbgunn said:


> Amp,
> You are right. There is a lot of smoke there. I see it too. I confront her about it and we talk about. She makes it all seem so benign, no big deal. She says her visits with her friend are just a way to get away and breathe for a little while. I guess I just don't want to believe it.


Once confronted, she knows the method you're monitoring her with. She then find ways to work around it.

I suggest you stop confronting her. Put on a good front and pretend everything is okay. Start looking for evidence. Use the gps, var, hidden security camera, etc...


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

tbgunn said:


> I am crushed. I am not handling this well. I am suspicious and paranoid and hyper-aware, and suspect of her every move, looking for hidden meaning or hidden motives in everything she does. I need her to help me feel better about our relationship, but she refuses. She has done nothing to make it up to me. So, I have become more and more withdrawn and depressed and probably not very fun to live with, which makes her pull away even more, which makes me more withdrawn. It is an awful downward spiral.


Whether or not she is in an affair needs to be determined and that may take some investigation and stealth to do, so I am going to address this first. You need to get yourself in a good place and start to regain your confidence as a first priority. Do not look for her to help you in this, affair or not. She's disconnected from you. Steps

Don't dote on her, romance her, promise her change.

Spend time with your kids. Just them and you.

Spend time with your friends and support network.

If you need to lose a few pounds do it. If you don't, work on it anyway. Great stress relief

Examine your wife's "complaints" about you. Don't discuss them with her, take time for self reflection to verify if they are valid or smoke. If there are things that need improvement, make your plan privately to change them. If you discuss them with her, your words will be hollow to her anyway.

Emotionally prepare yourself that this may be an affair and if so, how will you react to it. Try and salvage the marriage or walk away from it.


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## WhoIsIt (Dec 28, 2010)

tbgunn said:


> I know her well. She is married and has kids of her own. She is not even local, 400 + miles away. Don't know what kind of influence she is. However, she is in the same town as the ex-boyfriend and they are friends. Recently, my wife has been taking trips to visit her for a weekend (with the kids). Of course, I wonder what she is really up to. But, I have not caught her in any lies.


Is there a way you can tactfully ask your kids how those visits go? The 12-year-old especially would notice if she hangs out with someone besides her BFF. Simple questions can lead to good answers.

You: "How was your weekend with Mom? Do anything fun?"
Kid: "No, we just stayed at BFF's house the whole time."
You: "Really? Sounds boring. Even Mom didn't go out or anything? Was it just you guys?"

Etc.... You hate to throw them in the middle, but if your wife is having an affair she's already done so.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Could the girlfriend be playing the cupid ?(or even conference calls)


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> Could the girlfriend be playing the cupid ?(or even conference calls)


I sure hope that is not the case. I guess that could be helping.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

VAR seems to be a good choice. Fix one in her car.


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## Headspin (May 13, 2012)

Srry you're here my friend 

Been there (similar to yours) like many others on here.

Do try and take in everything said here it could help you in so many ways.

Unfortunately I feel you are about to get a crash course, a whole education, in deceit lies and pain 

Stay here and it will in many ways ease some of that stuff


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## WasDecimated (Mar 23, 2011)

Tbgunn, I'm sorry you are here.

To me a mid life crisis is just a sugar-coated name for someone who has become super selfish. The reasons could be many but usually involve a re-evaluation of values, personal boundaries and loss of integrity...and usually involve someone else.

Your story sounds just like mine...and my STBXW was cheating. I was in denial. I did what you are doing and it was a disaster...I am now in the process of divorce. Don't do what I did...it doesn't work. You must be tough! Demand the truth from her and seek the truth for yourself. It is doubtful that she will be honest with you...mine lied continuously. If she is using a a smart phone then there are numerous ways she is communicating with him now that are undetectable...even the basic email.

She needs to know what she is losing. This may sound harsh but I wish I would have done it at the beginning...Go see a lawyer and find out your options. Don't bother to hide this from her...in fact, tell her you are going. Start doing the 180...focus on yourself and your kids. Read "Love must be tough", "No more Mr. nice guy", "Not just friends" and even "women's infidelity". 

I wasted over a year while STBXW treated me like s**t and pretended to want to save our marriage. The truth is she probably checked out of your marriage a long time ago...an just forgot to tell you.

You need to alpha up right now...you are the man. If your child was disrespecting you like that would you put up with it...of course not. Right now your wife is acting like a child. She is a spoiled brat and cake eater...wants everything, and is testing you. You must not fear divorce of losing her...she is counting on the fact that you do. She will push the boundaries until you stop her. If she doesn't stop then you have lost her anyway. Sometimes it's just better to open the gates and let them go

I believe this is your only chance and you only have a small window of opportunity.


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

I hate to make you more suspicious but go with your gut. She has just taking her A underground. The workout thing and no sex, 1200 texts, they are not friends and he is not an ex. She is having sex just not with you. You need to take some action
1 keylogger on the computer
2 VAR in the car
3 GPS in the car.
Keep going to MC, tell her you are both going at the same time. If she refuses go yourself. If she is having an A it will only take a few days to find out. She is emailing, texting and talking. This is like a drug to her and she has to do it daily.
Read up on the 180 and put into effect. Whatever you do no more nice guy. You have kids think about them and take care of yourself.
Once you get the proof expose before you confront her.


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## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

Your story sounds almost identical to mine, too. Working out, no sex, everything. I was gaslighted for months. Phone bill records are worthless. My WW knew I was checking the phone bill from an incident about 1.5 years prior to DDay. She was using the Yahoo IM app to communicate with this AP, which leaves no trace on the bill except data usage. 

I had cracked her passcode and was checking her phone regularly for a couple weeks but finding nothing. She had about 4 pages of apps, and it never occurred to me to check anything but email, phone calls, and texts. She finally made the mistake of leaving the IM app open on the screen one morning, after swapping "I love yous" with OM during a 530 am workout. LOL

This was followed by feigned remorse and false R. Meanwhile, I put a keylogger on the laptop and caught her breaking NC about 3 weeks later. We're divorced now.


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## Headspin (May 13, 2012)

Decimated said:


> Tbgunn, I'm sorry you are here.
> 
> To me a mid life crisis is just a sugar-coated name for someone who has become super selfish. The reasons could be many but usually involve a re-evaluation of values, personal boundaries and loss of integrity...and usually involve someone else.
> 
> ...


Good God you and I have lived a parallel life!

Absolutely bang on the money, you've saved me having to type out every word and post it


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## The bishop (Aug 19, 2012)

I am sorry you are going through this. First off, all the signs are there. She is having an A. No doubt, I am a cheater and she is following the script of someone who has fallen out of love with you and in love with the OM.

Here is the good news (well not so good but better than the alternative) If you are willing to stop being a doormat, willing to end your marriage to save it, willing to take control and earn your respect back from her, you have a chance. 

Here is the bad news… if she isn’t having an affair (which she is) and she just wants out, you really have no hope. Once a woman decides to end it on her own accord, there is little hope of changing her mind. 

So if you want to save your marriage, her having the A means you at least have a chance. The reason being, she isn’t in her right mind and the dopamine clouding her brain is causing her to hate you and love him. It isn’t real. She is in the fog. How do you get her out of it….

Make her see reality, take the fun out of the A. She needs real consequences, like exposing, willing to file for D, packing her bag, acting like you moved on, not letting her manipulate you. 

So, are you willing to do what it takes????


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## The bishop (Aug 19, 2012)

Decimated said:


> Tbgunn, I'm sorry you are here.
> 
> To me a mid life crisis is just a sugar-coated name for someone who has become super selfish. The reasons could be many but usually involve a re-evaluation of values, personal boundaries and loss of integrity...and usually involve someone else.
> 
> ...


:iagree::iagree::iagree: DAMN WELL SAID!!


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

And get Married Man Sex Life as fast as humanly possible and read it as fast as you can. Downlaod and order it from amazon.com.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Also, I betting her bff is babysitting for her to visit her ex ex.


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## Acabado (May 13, 2012)

Go deep on snooping. Keylog the PC, VAR, spyware on the phone.
Enabler friend is in the know. Maybe you can gather info by getting into their chats.


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

What is the 180?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

The Healing Heart: The 180

Pay close attention to #13, control your emotions.

The 180 is for your healing, not a way to get your wife back though that is sometimes a side effect.

Read MMSL yet?


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

Just downloaded MMSL. Will read over the weekend. Thanks


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## Amplexor (Feb 13, 2008)

Also, I'd recommend Dobson's "Love Must be Tough".


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

If it were a real mid life crisis she would be going through it with you. As in, regularly sharing with you the thoughts she's having about reevaluating her life. 

As someone else pointed out it's important to be strong now. Eat healthy, exercise, sleep, review your finances, learn your legal options, strengthen your relationship with family and friends and if necessary see a counsellor with help deal with your emotions. You need to do these things so when it's time to make decisions you will be in the best frame of mind possible to make them.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Do you still take your wife out on date night? Have you stopped romancing her over the years?

Have the two of you read the Wayward Spouse Instructions together?


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

Chapparal, we have stopped romancing over the years, fallen into the trap of living for the kids and not devoting much energy to each other. Now the kids are getting older and more independent and she and I are finding more time together. We are not use to it and it is very awkward given what we have been through lately. We both recognize and acknowledge where we are in our marriage, but have differing theories of how we got here. I have heard her complaint and am complying the best of my ability. She is not reciprocating. She has shut me out. I cannot get close to her. She has told me that sex and affection are off the table.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

MMSL is what you need then. Why does she say sex and affection is off the table? How long has this been the case?


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

That's why I suggest working on yourself at this stage. Best case...it makes you more attractive to her and she falls for you again. Worst case...you're strong enough to survive the pain of divorce and thrive in your new life.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

What do you know about the ex? Is he married?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

tbgunn said:


> Chapparal, we have stopped romancing over the years, fallen into the trap of living for the kids and not devoting much energy to each other. Now the kids are getting older and more independent and she and I are finding more time together. We are not use to it and it is very awkward given what we have been through lately. We both recognize and acknowledge where we are in our marriage, but have differing theories of how we got here. I have heard her complaint and am complying the best of my ability. She is not reciprocating. She has shut me out. I cannot get close to her. She has told me that sex and affection are off the table.


Be preparing yourself to find out they are in a full blown physical affair. All the redflags are there.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

tbgunn said:


> I know her well. She is married and has kids of her own. She is not even local, 400 + miles away. Don't know what kind of influence she is. However, she is in the same town as the ex-boyfriend and they are friends. *Recently, my wife has been taking trips to visit her for a weekend *(with the kids). Of course, I wonder what she is really up to. But, I have not caught her in any lies.


OMG. Here it is. 

Essentially your wife told you up front she has decided to make changes in her life. Part of this was to engage with other men and previous friends. She has told you to your face you were not meeting her sexual needs and was looking for attention outside of the marriage. She has told you that she intended to be unfaithful. Because reconnecting with an ex BF is inappropriate and unfaithful. The 1200 texts indicates an emotional bond ... an EA in this case with history.

Her connecting with a friend of the OM and going to visit their area was so they could get together. Have not read the rest of the trhead but thiere is a huge chance this went physical during one of the visits. The GF is their to take care of the kids. You can be certain they did meet. There was some kind of physicallity. Full blown intercourse. You do the math.

Working out is great but it is red flag in this context. Does she have a personal trainer. Has she met friends at the GYM?

Saying you want her to have privacy is a headslap for me. You guys need transparency. Why do YOU want her to have privacy. Privacy is for single people.

There is nothing onnocent or naive sounding about her activities. They seem very caluclated and following a plan of action on her part.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Entropy3000 said:


> OMG. Here it is.
> 
> Essentially your wife told you up front she has decided to make changes in her life. Part of this was to engage with other men and previous friends. She has told you to your face you were not meeting her sexual needs and was looking for attention outside of the marriage. She has told you that she intended to be unfaithful. Because reconnecting with an ex BF is inappropriate and unfaithful. The 1200 texts indicates an emotional bond ... an EA in this case with history.
> 
> ...


Yes, this is a bad one.


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> She might be using the data plan to text her ex-bf. Text over data plan might be hard to recover. What phone does she have ?


She has a TMobile My Touch. Looking at the phone bill, I do see lots of data records. I guess I don't know what those are. How do you generate a data message?


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

use an app like textfree, whatsapp, yahooIM, or even a game like scrabble has a chat function


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

can your kid give you the passcode? check what apps she has and look at them if you get a chance


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

found this, but it may wipe out some data on the phone, so it should be a last resort

How to unlock mytouch pattern password - How to unlock tmobile touch after too many pattern attempts if you dont know username and password :: Ask Me Fast


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

You need to put a VAR in her car. She may even have a burner phone.

Are there no calls to the OM's city?


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

Not anymore. I know his number from the 1200 texts in February. It has not shown up since then.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

if you want you can PM me the number and I can get info on him from spokeo since I have a paid account right now


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

tbgunn said:


> Not anymore. I know his number from the 1200 texts in February. It has not shown up since then.


Look for another number if she knows you know about the texts.

Get A VAR

The reason many cheating wives drop the sex and affection for their husband is because it would make them feel like they were cheating on their affair partner. This is probably what she doesn't want you to hear at counseling.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Have you checked emails, texts, facebook, hidden, phones, all the numbers she calls. There are apps on smart phones that hide the messages.

How well do you know the friend she is visiting? How does the timeline of her visits coincide with the texts to OM?


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

I very much doubt she went from 1200 to zero. She is just using another method. My wife created a number of email accounts and kept them quite. The OM stopped using his phone and went to a pay as you go phone.

Keyloggers, VAR and GPS will tell you if anything is going on or not. Most WS get in the car and start talking with the AP right away.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

If OM picked up a burner phone, the area code might not necessarily match the city in which he lives. If your wife picked up a burner phone, you wouldn't even know they were talking.

She is talking to him while she drives. Put a VAR in her car. Up under the seat with heavy duty velcro.


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## WasDecimated (Mar 23, 2011)

> Not anymore. I know his number from the 1200 texts in February. It has not shown up since then.


My STBXW did this too after D day #1...All texting and calls between them appeared to stop. The reality was their affair didn't stop...in fact, it escalated...went deeper underground. She got a Droid and dumped her old dumb phone. They switched to instant messaging, email, and Fakebook messaging.



> I very much doubt she went from 1200 to zero. She is just using another method. My wife created a number of email accounts and kept them quite. The OM stopped using his phone and went to a pay as you go phone.
> 
> Keyloggers, VAR and GPS will tell you if anything is going on or not. Most WS get in the car and start talking with the AP right away.


I agree with this. She isn't stupid...she won't text again. With a smart phone, and all of the apps available, the sky's the limit in terms of secret and untraceable forms of communication. She could have a throwaway phone...a definite possibility but with a smart phone like a My Touch...who needs one. He could have a throwaway or got a new number. I actually made a list of all the numbers my STBXW was calling so I knew who she was talking to. If a new number popped up on our online bill, I would call it and when someone answered, I would disguise my voice, ask for "Joe" or whatever name popped into my head. The idea was to see if it was a girls number or a guys. This didn't lead to any discoveries because she changed her tactics after I discovered her texts and calls on the bill...D day #1

I caught my wife with a GPS tracker in her (my) car. Within a couple weeks of putting it in I tracked her to a hotel...busted! I would spend the money on a GPS tracker and also a VAR. Hide this in her car as well but unless she has a throw away phone, she probably not making traceable and documented phone calls. Maybe there is an app for voice calls that makes them invisible to your bill...Idk.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

there are lots of apps to make calls that dont show up on the bill- Viber, iCall, and Talkatone for example


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## WasDecimated (Mar 23, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> there are lots of apps to make calls that dont show up on the bill- Viber, iCall, and Talkatone for example


Thanks Almostrecovered. There you have it...Get a VAR!


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

it's sad but if I ever wanted to cheat I would do a good job of not getting caught. Good thing I respect myself too much to do that.


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## WasDecimated (Mar 23, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> it's sad but if I ever wanted to cheat I would do a good job of not getting caught. Good thing I respect myself too much to do that.


I hear you. 

We have learned so much about cheating it's like having a PHD. My only weakness is my conscience...I could never hide the guilt from me or anyone else.

Tbgunn is getting the accelerated course.


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

What a nightmare !!!???


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## WasDecimated (Mar 23, 2011)

tbgunn said:


> What a nightmare !!!???


Yes it is. End it now by setting her free.

I know a lot of this stuff we are telling you may seem counter-intuitive but it is the only way you will have a fighting chance.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

Sometimes in order to save your marriage you have to be willing to lose it. That's the only way she'll know you are serious.


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

TBG, data is internet. Now just think of all the ways you can contact over the internet. Then there is 3way calling.

Now, Stop the MC, thats a waste of money while she is in an affair. Aslo stop pretending. You KNOW she is screwing this guy when she visits. So just stop that now !!! That friend and her husband is his and her friends not yours. So they are helping them. Or the wife may be a cheating sl** too, and he may be clueless. I wouldn't count on that tho.

You say you are not a weak man but just blindsided. OK, look at all you have achieved in your work and personal life. No man without confidence could have done that. So take your strenght from what you have and has done. Then go on the attack. Use the advice the VETS have given and put your life and the kids life first. 

You do nothing for her. She wants separation, well OK.
Set up a budget and divide the bills equal between you. She pay her half you yours.
You do NOT pay for anything of hers. You do NOT owe her for the pass marriage. She got as much out of it as you did. So that slate is clean.

You start a NEW phase and show her you are living for the kids and you. And at the first opportunity you will dump her a**.

You need evidence, so separate the bank accounts so she can't see you paying for a PI. Close joint CC and let her get her own.
Run an ad that you will not be responsibile for her debts if you have to.
Its hardball time dude. If you are paying for her and getting nothing, while he is, then you are a weak man. AND I don't believe that. 
Just tell her we are separating all accounts and paying equal shares until we part. just say sex comes with marriage, and if I'm not getting any, then I have no marriage, so I will NOT take care of someone who is not my wife. do you see where I'm at ??

You came here clueless, but you are about to become her worst adversary.

I never knew there was so many men in this world with so lil self worth until I came here. Men that own and run successful bizs, but let someone else take all their confidence by saying I love you but I am not in love with you. ME ??? Get to stepping. Some woman will.

And thats should be how you feel.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

LISTEN to old wolf!

Wish I could give many 'likes' 

Read that post over and over and over and... act


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

TY WALKS, I just get so angry when they use the old " you never paid me any attention ".

They forget the time you just came up an hugged them, maybe even while you saw them struggle with the dishes or laundry. And just wanted to show your appreciation and love.

They forget we need a hug sometime too.

But this is the thing. If a man is just sitting there and she wants attention, why not just come sit in his lap and tell him.

We men have all tried to be touchy feely without wanting sex and got snarled at. We know they work hard too. But when you get slapped down for trying to be there, you will tend to just give up.

This woman has taken his marriage away without giving him any chance to have a say in it. But want all the other comforts until she has her ducks lined up.

My man, Pay CLOSE attention to this.

SHE KILLED you marriage, and it will never be the same. You may have NEW marriage if you can right this, but the old one is dead.
She introduced a cancer and it killed it.
So start living for you and the kids, while treating her like she wants, D/ed 
She pay her own way, or she walks.
And what ever you do, do NOT leave the house YOU worked and suffered for. She leaves and the kids stay.

You have been given all the tools from our knowledge. Its time to NUKE her fantasy. EXPOSE to everyone you guys know far and wide.
PI her a** on the next out of town trip.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

OldWolf you are on fire tonight!


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

Trying to balance my caustic side with my knowledge lately. The ban made me aware I was projecting.


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## tbgunn (Sep 27, 2012)

Oh my God. I am in such a bad place. I don't know how I am going to deal with all of this. How can I possibly crawl into bed next to her other all of this info running through my head
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## WyshIknew (Aug 18, 2012)

Tell her to sleep on the couch?


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

tbgunn said:


> Oh my God. I am in such a bad place. I don't know how I am going to deal with all of this. How can I possibly crawl into bed next to her other all of this info running through my head
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You know that if you don't follow the advice you've been given, which in your heart you know is right, you're going to face many nights like this until she decides to move someone else into your place in bed permanently. 

Isn't it a shame that strangers on a forum feel for you much more than someone that made vows with you?


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## jfv (May 29, 2012)

OP, she is withholding sex from you because she doesn't want to cheat on her boyfriend with you, her husband.... FILE FOR DIVORCE


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

tbgunn said:


> Oh my God. I am in such a bad place. I don't know how I am going to deal with all of this. How can I possibly crawl into bed next to her other all of this info running through my head
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Just go stone cold. Try to feel nothing. Empty your mind. All that vulcan and yoda crap they peddle in the movies becomes your best friend.


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## OldWolf57 (Mar 20, 2012)

You are still looking at this as a hurt hubbie. NO NO NO !!!
Look at this as a DAMN FURIOUS Hubbie !!!

You sound like a successful person, so how would you look at a client or employee that cheated and stole from you. 
You would be trying to get the proof, so you would still deal with them until you did.
KEEP YOUR ENEMIES CLOSE !!!!


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## Thinkitthrough (Sep 5, 2012)

Gunn:I put this out as a thought. There seems to be a parallysis that the BS goes into, seems like out of disbelief, the overwhelming nature and the suprize of the blindsiding by a loved and trusted WS. The BS seems to spend time unable to act and unable to formulate an effective response. They ignore advice and do their own thing until the realize it is too late. There is a short window of opportunity to gather evidence, expose and respond. They dither with ill formed questions, scrupples and poor thinking; they can't decide what they want. The longer it takes the less likely they are to save their marriages, if that is the goal. The most successful move quickly and decisively, find a position where they control the direction of the relationship and can then decide to stay, go, or kick the WS to the curb. I suck at advice, but the guys who are responding here know what to do.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

I don't remember if anyone has mentioned this but she will probably ask you to leave. DO NOT LEAVE YOUR HOME. She is no doubt cheating, you know who with and where. Tell her to pack her sh!t and get out. You can't make her leave her home, she can't make you unless she fakes a police complaint for abuse. If you think there is any possibilty she could do this carry a VAR on you whenever she is around you.

She may be hanging on because the courts will not let her take the kids 400 miles away. You need to check what s what in your state.
She can't take them out of state either.

If you talk divorce tell her you will seek primary custody. Hopefully you can get at least 50/50.

If you want to fire a shot across her bow. Download a divorce packet for your state and make sure she gets a glimpse of it.
You may have to pick a packet up from the county courthouse.

Bargain from strength.

Again, how long ago did she cut you off?


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Thinkitthrough said:


> Gunn:I put this out as a thought. There seems to be a parallysis that the BS goes into, seems like out of disbelief, the overwhelming nature and the suprize of the blindsiding by a loved and trusted WS. The BS seems to spend time unable to act and unable to formulate an effective response. They ignore advice and do their own thing until the realize it is too late. There is a short window of opportunity to gather evidence, expose and respond. They dither with ill formed questions, scrupples and poor thinking; they can't decide what they want. The longer it takes the less likely they are to save their marriages, if that is the goal. The most successful move quickly and decisively, find a position where they control the direction of the relationship and can then decide to stay, go, or kick the WS to the curb. I suck at advice, but the guys who are responding here know what to do.



Exactly, hesitating always results in a slow excruciating end to the marriage. Jump on it with both feet and it either works or it doesn't.

You have to get more info on this other guy? Kids, married, girlfriend. Ex boyfriends usually want sex and no drama.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

tbgunn said:


> *I want her to have her privacy. *












There is no privacy in a marriage. At least not one that's going to last.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

tbgunn said:


> she is in the same town as the ex-boyfriend and they are friends. Recently, my wife has been taking trips to visit her for a weekend (with the kids).


Seriously? Toxic friend (TF) is the babysitter for your wife's trysts. Next time she goes, have a PI ready in that town. Video at eleven.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Gunn,

I operate a physique studio. I train both men and women. All day, every day. I talk to clients. Women start shaping up after they have decided to dump their husbands, most men start after they've been dumped. 75% of divorces are filed by the wife. Your wife lost her attraction to you a long time ago and she's been working up to this.

Your wife has probably never seen women flirt with you or give you the eye. She's probably never seen you give a slow bold head to toe look to another woman, either. A woman needs to know she can be replaced in 15 minutes and if she gets the idea that no other woman is interested in you, she loses interest herself. It doesn't make sense does it? But women make these decisions in the limbic brain. It's not really rational. Once you lose that 1.4 chest to waist ratio and she obtains or retains her .7 waist to hip ratio, limbic forces are activated.

MMSL covers a lot of this stuff. If you want it unvarnished, crass, and straight, read Roissy.

Your wife is probably too far gone, but your only hope is to listen to these good folks above and follow their suggestions. Keep your cool at all times, investigate, PI her a$$ in OM's town, separate the money. Get a new haircut tomorrow. Buzz it off like the young guys do now. Got that done myself recently by accident (retarded barber) and women even older than me were going ape over it. Weird. Also update and upgrade your clothing. Start working on a six pack. Muscle mass is very important, but a 32 inch waist is the biggest physical improvement you can make. Get on it.

Start going out at night without explanation. Just look good, shaved, cologned, hair combed, and nice threads. Say, "I'm going out, see ya. Don't wait up." This will throw a knuckleball her way that she's not used to hitting. It will start unbalancing the relationship. Who knows, you might make her think.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Machiavelli said:


> Gunn,
> 
> I operate a physique studio. I train both men and women. All day, every day. I talk to clients. Women start shaping up after they have decided to dump their husbands, most men start after they've been dumped. 75% of divorces are filed by the wife. Your wife lost her attraction to you a long time ago and she's been working up to this.
> 
> ...


Read this until it sinks in and becomes your mantra. The downside is it might not work with your wife but the upside is there are a millions of women in this country looking for a good man. The really good news is there are not nearlly enough men to go around because the have decided to pass on the long term commitment thingy. Ask your friends if they would marry again if something happened to their marriages (death or divorce). I spent about three months asking guys this about 3 yrs ago and was totally shocked with the feelings put into the answers..

Studies show 80% of people that divorce over infidelity wish they had kept their families together and worked it out. Furthermore, less than 3 out of 100 couples that get together in an affair end up staying together in a long term relationship. They actually figure out they can't trust each other.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Take it easy TBGunn.

I know you are upset. You have every right to be but you need to keep it together right now.

You have been given good advice and a lot of it.

You need to look out for yourself and your kids.

What your wife is pulling is very common. Yes it is horrible to be treated this way but you need to outsmart her.

Do not confront her. She will keep lying and will convince you that you are crazy.

She probably has been mad mouthing you to her family and friends. That is normal too.

Take a look at her phone without tipping her off. Get a VAR in her car. Try to find the time to confirm she is at the gym. She most likely is there.

Stay calm. Start the 180 and work on you.

And when you are ready go see an attorney to understand your rights. Especially is she is pushing for a separation.

If she is cheaing she will want this so she can have her A in the open without you interefering.

And yes she is selfish, this is normal to.

Keep posting and vent your emotions here not to her.

HM64


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## WasDecimated (Mar 23, 2011)

Machiavelli said:


> Gunn,
> 
> I operate a physique studio. I train both men and women. All day, every day. I talk to clients. Women start shaping up after they have decided to dump their husbands, most men start after they've been dumped. 75% of divorces are filed by the wife. Your wife lost her attraction to you a long time ago and she's been working up to this.
> 
> ...


There is so much truth to this.

1) Start working out, eating good food, and sleeping. 

The positive effects on you by doing this cannot be underestimated. I don't want to toot my own horn but I have worked hard on my physique so what the hell. Maybe it will help inspire you. 

I started working out again after D day #2. I used to work out in the past but I had slacked off in recent years. I had lost a lot of weight after I found out about her betrayal from the stress, lack of exercise, no appetite, and lack of sleep. My waist size dropped to 31". Of course I lost weight everywhere else as well. None of my clothes fit and I looked gaunt and terrible. 

Today my waist is still 31" but with a 6 pack. My chest is 44" and my arms are 15 1/2". That is pretty impressive for any age let alone some one who is 49 years old. Does my STBXW notice...hell yes she does. I catch her looking all the time...and so do a lot of other women. But, the most important side effect is how it makes you feel about myself. It gives you back the confidence you need to have. I will not be alone after my D is final...if that is what I choose. 

2) Moving on with your life. Don't pretend to do this...do it.

I bought some new clothes that fit my new physique and started to go out with friends much more often. This was out of character for me because I was usually the one staying home with our kids while she went out with her friends. This felt awkward because I was still worried about further pushing her away but that should not your concern anymore. At first, she was angry when I would go out but over time that changed to her pouting. She would see how I looked, what I was wearing and my new confidence. She realized that It wouldn't be to difficult for me to hook up with other women. (I am not doing any hooking up yet but I am making friends.) I even started adding female friends on fakebook. 

I noticed a big difference in how she treated me after going out and moving on. She feels like she is missing out, left behind, and is actually jealous. Here is an example of how this 180 changed her. 

A while back I went to a wedding...without her. I returned home the next morning about 2:30 am. I had ate, had a few drinks, danced and hugged a lot of women that night...and I even had a stalker! I was amazed at the attention I was getting from women. I smelled like a perfume ****tail. The next day my STBXW initiated sex with me twice! This doesn't change my plans to D because I needed a lot more then just sex to stay with her but it does illustrate how WS's can be effected by you moving on with your life and how they can react counter intuitively. I does tend to unbalance the relationship...in your favor.

Tbgunn, you need to give this approach an honest try but remember you are doing it for you.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Outstanding work, Decimated. Living proof of what we've been saying. Well done.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

Decimated said:


> A while back I went to a wedding...without her. I returned home the next morning about 2:30 am. I had ate, had a few drinks, danced and hugged a lot of women that night...and I even had a stalker! I was amazed at the attention I was getting from women. I smelled like a perfume ****tail. The next day my STBXW initiated sex with me twice! This doesn't change my plans to D because I needed a lot more then just sex to stay with her but it does illustrate how WS's can be effected by you moving on with your life and how they can react counter intuitively. I does tend to unbalance the relationship...in your favor.
> 
> Tbgunn, you need to give this approach an honest try but remember you are doing it for you.


It is amazing how the 180 works for both men and women. 

Since filing for Divorce my STBEH is also ACTING very remorseful and possessive. 

I have shown him that I have moved on, and I can see he does not like that. 

And, yes, he also has been attempting to become sexual, something that ain't gonna' happen now. 

To my mind, he didn't want me before and I why would I now want someone who is only interested because he is being challenged. 

I don't trust his sudden re ignited interest.

We were married a long time, I think we should be past such silly games. 

But, yes, yes, the 180 is not done to get the spouse back because that's when it backfires. 

It's done because the loyal spouse is fed up and wants to move on.


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## WasDecimated (Mar 23, 2011)

Sara8 said:


> To my mind, he didn't want me before and I why would I now want someone who is only interested because he is being challenged.
> 
> I don't trust his sudden re ignited interest.
> 
> We were married a long time, I think we should be past such silly games.


This is so true and how I feel.

Sara, you are so right...marriage is not a silly game! 

As adults, we are supposed to be past that crap. We can't live our lives always being worried that we aren't enough of a challenge to our spouses. Life is tough enough. I would much rather be there for them...not a stupid challenge for them. If marriage is that boring that they need a constant challenge to keep them interested, then they can do that without me.


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## Sara8 (May 2, 2012)

Decimated said:


> This is so true and how I feel.
> 
> Sara, you are so right...marriage is not a silly game!
> 
> As adults, we are supposed to be past that crap. We can't live our lives always being worried that we aren't enough of a challenge to our spouses. Life is tough enough. I would much rather be there for them...not a stupid challenge for them. If marriage is that boring that they need a constant challenge to keep them interested, then they can do that without me.


That is how I feel, too.

IMO, people find a suitable mate to marry in a large part to get away from the silly games dating people play. 

Intelligent people, too, realize that no marriage is going to have super hot sex forever. It always usually fizzles in two to three years. 

I sometimes wonder if the cheating spouses realize that the loyal spouses also feel that the honeymoon sex is over, but just accept it as a more mature love.

At that point, after the honeymoon phase, marriage moves into what's known as companionate love. It's normal

Sex is part of it, but not the be all and end all. It's more about trust and helping each other survive the slings and arrows of life in general. 

A spouse is suppose to be there to help you get through, not to make it so you are suspicious and distrustful of the one person in the world you were suppose to be able to trust.


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## WasDecimated (Mar 23, 2011)

Sara8 said:


> That is how I feel, too.
> 
> IMO, people find a suitable mate to marry in a large part to get away from the silly games dating people play.
> 
> ...


I honestly don't think me STBXW realized much of anything. I think she was bored. Actually she admitted that much. I feel that after 12 years she missed those feelings and instead of working on getting them back and appreciating what we did have, she simply thought that she was no longer in love and looked for it else ware. 

Apparently the "companion love" we had wasn't something she valued as much as the butterflies and unicorns. I also think that in her mind, sex and any other physical attention was only for the butterfly and unicorn relationship. 

I don't think I will ever understand her thinking. Honestly, I never lost my desire for her. Keeping the sex super hot is where the effort comes in. It is Not impossible in my mind but it takes two. 

It really boils down to being emotionally mature. Some people are, some people are not...and some never will be.


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## Tony55 (Jun 8, 2012)

@various posters:
Everything's a game, business, relationships, everything. The spouse who "doesn't want to play that game" will be the spouse asking, "what went wrong?".

You wanna kill your marriage? Get too comfortable.

@tbgunn
You can get in shape, cut your hair and slather on all the smell good in the world, but if you don't gain your wife's respect then you can kiss your marriage goodbye.

In my opinion you have one option left, nuke the relationship (your marriage), you need to become a wall of strength, you need to be a mystery to her, you need to put distance between the two of you.

Anything short of that is wasted time.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Decimated said:


> I honestly don't think me STBXW realized much of anything. I think she was bored. Actually she admitted that much. I feel that after 12 years she missed those feelings and instead of working on getting them back and appreciating what we did have, she simply thought that she was no longer in love and looked for it else ware.
> 
> Apparently the "companion love" we had wasn't something she valued as much as the butterflies and unicorns. I also think that in her mind, sex and any other physical attention was only for the butterfly and unicorn relationship.
> 
> ...


Hey Dec,

It is just not maturity. It is also selflessness. When a souse values their spouse, their marriage and their children before other desires. When a vow means something to them they are selfless.

What we mostly see on the wayward side is pure selfishness. 

Plain & simple.

HM64


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Decimated said:


> Apparently the "companion love" we had wasn't something she valued as much as the butterflies and unicorns. I also think that in her mind, sex and any other physical attention was only for the butterfly and unicorn relationship.


The Limbic system rules in reproductive matters and it wants butterflies and unicorns.


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## SomedayDig (Jul 17, 2012)

Ohhhh...sparklies!


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## livinfree (Sep 7, 2012)

Decimated said:


> There is so much truth to this.
> 
> 1) Start working out, eating good food, and sleeping.
> 
> ...


This.

After ten months of EA and d-day I lost almost 50 pounds. Was pushing a 36 waist. Now have a 29 . Do you know how hard it is finding 29x32's?


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## Cdelta02 (Sep 20, 2012)

planbnomore said:


> This.
> 
> After ten months of EA and d-day I lost almost 50 pounds. Was pushing a 36 waist. Now have a 29 . Do you know how hard it is finding 29x32's?


Ever heard of belts? . JK.


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

Sara8 said:


> Intelligent people, too, realize that no marriage is going to have super hot sex forever. It always usually fizzles in two to three years.


I respectfully disagree with that. For me sex only gets better as I get to know my partner better and learn what pleases her. Just like everything in life, with sex the more you work at it the better you get at it. Throw in a little imagination and sex with your long term partner will only keep getting better.


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