# Looking for some clarity (dual post)



## InRecoveryInNC (Oct 22, 2010)

*[READ NEXT POST FOR MORE DETAILED BACKSTORY]*

So now Fast Forward to this past weekend, he made a statement that has me questioning how far have we really come. Sex is still GREAT. We spend more time together, not really doing anything, but we are together. I am working on being more affectionate toward him, being more playful. I have taken an interest in doing things with him that he normally would have been doing in the shop by himself. I try to reach out to him and offer to take him to lunch or take him out on date etc. But this weekend, something just didn't sit right and I am not sure if I am overreacting or not, let me first say, I instigated the conversation and probably should have used a little more restraint but 3 Margaritas and a Tequila shot later (I don't normally drink alcohol) this is what happened: 

We had come back from a nice dinner, he sat beside me at the restaurant instead of across from me. We talked, we were playful. 
However, when he pulled in the driveway I noticed a lottery ticket (don't agree with it, but he does not have a gambling problem and when the pot is big enough he dabbles a little bit.) I reached over picked up the ticket and asked how everything was going... 

he jokingly said, _"not too good, I didn't win_" and smiles. 
I say, "_well I kind of knew that because you are still here"_, 
his reply "_what do you mean by that_" 
my reply "_if you didn't have the financial problems, by now you would probably be gone_." 
His reply, "_you should know me well enough to know that if I had won, even if things don't work out between us, because 'WE STILL DON'T KNOW WHERE THIS IS GOING', I would still take care of you_." 

So there it is... that one statement, *'WE STILL DON'T KNOW WHERE THIS IS GOING'*, it hit my like a load of bricks. Is he still not sure he wants to be here? Is he still making plans to leave 6 - 8 months down the road? Am I now more invested in making this work than he is? and a hundred more questions and scenarios fill my head. 

So I decide I am going to broach this topic the next morning after my head has cleared and we both are sober and rested. We once again end up having an amazing night of sex. Then in the early hours of the next day, I get an urgent call from my mother that my younger sister is being rushed to ICU. I immediately leave to be there with my mom and sister. I am now gone for more than 12 hours, he checks in with me to see how everything is. Once she is stabilized I come home. He seems fine but I feel a bit of awkwardness. 

Are my insecurities keeping me from being able to move forward, am I reading too much into his statement? Would a man that was so emotionally hurt has an PA and ready to walk out of the marriage just have sex to make himself better. Can a man have an erection in the morning if he didn't have some kind of connection with the person he was lying with? 

Can anyone shed some light on this topic? I know I am still very hurt and confused and could use some clarity and some advise from those that have found themselves in a similar situation.


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## InRecoveryInNC (Oct 22, 2010)

*THIS IS LONG BUT I BELIEVE THE BACKSTORY IS IMPORTANT FOR PREVIOUS POST*

It has been 90 days since Dday. A lot has changed but I find myself regressing emotionally at times.

One of the problems that led my H to having a PA (26 years into our relationship) was definitely due to the intimacy factor. He hurt my feelings early on in our marriage re: sex, fueled my already skewed view coupled with having children and him working in a highly competitive stressful job. Over time I pulled back to where we literally went 8 - 10 months without any form of intimacy with each other. I poured myself into raising the children. He used porn, personals and literotica along w/MB to satisfy his needs for more than a decade until he couldn't handle the loneliness and eventually sought out someone that made him 'feel' again and eventually it turned into an 8 month PA. Though the physical part did not start immediately.

For most of the time we have been together (since high school) I actually was so paranoid he would cheat I would regularly have dreams that seemed so real I couldn't speak to him for a day or two. My fear that we would leave me, had me always jumping the gun when in a heated argument with a defense of the D word. Add years of hurt between the two of us and financial problems (mine at first, his as a payback and jointly within the last 5 yrs.), we found ourselves simply co-habitating, less than roommates, I literally mean we basically just share the same address.

We both have spent at least 1/2 of our married life being vengeful and I don't believe this was conscientiously done at least not in the beginning. And deep down at least on my part it was a coping mechanism.

So we've been through many devastating and life changing events in the 27 years we've been together. So, 90 days ago, my fears and suspicions are realized. Yes, at first he denied it, but within 30 minutes he confessed. I am sure to this date I don't have the full picture. He begged me to stay, after hours and hours of convincing I did. I couldn't breathe, eat or sleep for more than a week. He stayed in the house but we slept in different rooms. I asked questions, he answered (to a degree, yet still keeping his guard up.) He apologized said he has, does and will always love me. He admitted if the situation were reverse he doesn't know that he would have the strength to forgive and still be together. For the first few weeks, he tried really hard to tell/show me he loved me and wanted to be with me. Originally he agreed to work on finding our way back to each other. His Needs/Her Needs. In the midst of all of this, his father (someone he had compassion for, but literally hated) became terminally ill. So during a time where we really needed to be working on our marriage daily, he had to take several week long trips back home (several states away.) Throw in that my youngest sister (two hours away) is also terminally ill with an elderly mother as her primary caregiver, a very active daughter in her Sr. year of HS with an equally active older daughter (collegiate athlete and also two hours away) adding in that my career is fumbling with very little hope of reviving it in the short term.

Mind you he has admitted to what has happened, he had shared that it was over months before I found out and the reason I did find out was because she wanted him back and he refused and that is why she contacted me. He said he tried the affair, and wasn't good at it and didn't want it anymore. So, I made a huge error in my judgment and did not at that time when he was so willing to work on things, ask him for full disclosure. I did not demand his passwords to his FB, his phone or his emails. The OW started harassing him on FB so he disabled it for a few months. Yet, his phone and emails were still active and still private.

While on one of his trips to visit his father, he agreed to complete the Emotional Needs questionnaire. We agreed we would work on it separately, then share ours with each other and would then each week take one of the categories and go over together until we had finished all of them.

I was working on mine and he said he was working on his. Several weeks go by and he tells me he's doing his. We set a deadline. His father passes away, he leaves for another week. We communicate some but not too much while he is gone, but things seem to be moving forward. He comes home, more than week passes by, no acknowledgment of the questionnaire. Finally, after there being radio silence I push for a conversation to take place. (Looking back on it now, bad timing, I should have waited a little longer, I think). This turns into a confrontation and he then tells me he wants out. He can't see this ever working. He doesn't like the person he has become and doesn't see how I would ever be able to get over it completely. He states that if I wanted he would look for a place immediately but due to some of our financial problems, would think that if he simply moved into our guest room, and still paid what he normally does to the household, we could spend the next 6 - 8 months getting the house ready to sell and getting our affairs in order that after our daughter's graduation we could part ways, now all this is said in a combination of emails and texts. In shock, I leave work, go to his place of business and force him to tell me this to my face. He stands by what he had written. I stand by the simple fact that I under no circumstance would allow 27 years together, be pushed off to side that simply. After hours of crying on both our parts we agree that the best thing to do is at that moment stop living and reliving the past. He will have to forgive me for my part the led us to where we are now and I would have to forgive him. That we would no longer bring up the past hurts as a defense for our reaction to what is happening in the present. That forgetting would probably never happen but consistently using those hurts to justify our behavior would have to stop. 

A few days goes by, he acts like he is making an effort. A few weeks or so goes by and out of the blue after literally 5 or more years, he gives me a kiss goodbye before he leaves for work. A few days later he asks if he come back to sleeping in our bed together, I agree. Another week or so goes by and I notice that while sleeping he starts to put his hand on my side or on my hip. Nothing sexual but just a touch. We start to snuggle nightly but again nothing sexual. Now, within the last 18 months alone, up to this point, we maybe had had sex 5X (maybe 6). We talk more but it is always safe subjects, the kids, our job etc. but nothing too intimate. I discover an exercise in sexual healing and approach him with it. He agrees and for the next 14 days we have sex. I mean mind blowing sex, everyday (except 2 days situations out of our control). We connect sometimes several times throughout the day. (that had not happened since we were newlyweds) It was amazing. I start to notice that in the morning he presses himself up against and he has an erection (something missing from our marriage for the last 3 - 4 years.)

We start talking more, but we still stay safe. Every once in awhile we will throw in something that is a little emotional but for the most part we don't really talk about the future, we are kind of just living day to day. One of things he had stated during the 'I think it's over ' speech was that he did not want to be treated like a child, he doesn't want to have to explain himself and always feel like he is under suspicion. I shared that there will be times I need reassurances and he should feel compelled to comply. (Once again, I missed an opportunity for full disclosure.) I don't believe I can now approach this without there possibly being some backlash and him pulling away from me and deciding he no longer wants to keep working on moving forward.


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## jessi (Feb 11, 2009)

Hi there,
I'm not expert but also have a long time marriage where my husband had an affair as well. Let me first say that when this happens it leaves the BS's with a lot of doubt. We try to find some real reason all this could have happened and to make some sense out of it, but you know what there aren't any answers, your husband like mine simple made a decision to have an affair and break our marriage vows..........
Sure our marriages probably had problems before the affair took place and we have to own our parts in that, you sound like me a lot on your plate, taking care of your house, children, parents, job and trying to have a life yourself..........
I guess the mistake we made is that we didn't make the time it took to keep our marriages good........and they filled their needs with someone else.........
My husband also broke things off with the OW and now regrets his decision to have gone outside the marriage......
I think the bonding you are having in the sex department is called hysterical bonding, I went through that as well, you have a need to be close in touch to feel better, so when you hear any negativity to your relationship or he seems uninterested(which men do, they don't operate on the emotional level we do).
For us it's with us every minute, for them this isn't so, they seem to go on with life, they are able to put things in places and deal with one at a time, ours all mix together and effect the other parts of our lives.........
I feel the same way, when my husband backs off or so I seem to think I feel worse, he is just living the rest of his life nothing to do with me.......
Guys work day by day...........thus the comment he doesn't know where this is going............he not thinking tomorrow or the next day he is only thinking of today.
I think it sounds like he is back in cink with you, he is falling in love with you all over again, don't let your doubts take over, live for today, enjoy today......if you worry so much about tomorrow, you will miss all the happiness today can offer you........
It was a mistake made by both of our husbands, we have to put it behind us and just make today great and then tomorrow do the same thing...........all the days together will make for a great history and a reason to look towards the future......
Slow down and don't let that mind of your wander so much......


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## chefmaster (Oct 30, 2010)

HurtingInNC said:


> I say, "well I kind of knew that because you are still here",
> his reply "what do you mean by that"
> my reply "if you didn't have the financial problems, by now you would probably be gone."
> His reply, "you should know me well enough to know that if I had won, even if things don't work out between us, because 'WE STILL DON'T KNOW WHERE THIS IS GOING', I would still take care of you."


It's possible he said this in his uncomfortableness of what he could have taken as "Why *ARE* you still here anyway?" it sounds like most of his convo was trying to reassure you.



HurtingInNC said:


> am I reading too much into his statement?


Yes, way, way too much.



HurtingInNC said:


> I come home. He seems fine but I feel a bit of awkwardness.


That's because he gave you the reassurance he thought you needed and the discussion ended.




HurtingInNC said:


> Can a man have an erection in the morning if he didn't have some kind of connection with the person he was lying with?



A man can have an erection if the sky is blue. 
In the morning though an erection is possible due to a full bladder, a dream, the touching of a blanket, scratching himself and the list goes on.


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## InRecoveryInNC (Oct 22, 2010)

Jessi,

Thank you for words of encouragement. Sometimes I find myself just getting caught up in the little things.

For instance he took me to restaurant we have never been to before, so while I am there I start to think, was this a place they used to go together.

He talks about a TV series on cable (Showtime), we don't have that channel, so then I start to think, I bet they used to watch this when they were together.

Just little random things that set me off and I immediately go into a 'funk' and have a hard time letting it go.

When I started absorbing the hurt many years ago, I redirected my attention to my children, and in the process found that I totally pushed my husband away. Of course he has a part in this too, but I know my actions contributed in a big way. We know have to get to know each other again, hard to believe that after being together for 27 years, I have to accept there is so much I don't know about him anymore.

I guess because we were so broken when we found each other and we knew early on that we loved each other warts and all, we initially felt we could get through anything together. We discussed in depth for two years before getting married that divorce was not option outside of any form of abuse and I always added and infidelity. Now I am not as secure in my thinking....

He knew the one area that I would have a very hard time recovering our relationship from would be infidelity. And that is where he chose to go. He admitted he was childish in his actions and I do believe he is regretful. He is a very compassionate man some times to a fault. In our marriage for more than 10 years he definitely put other people and their family needs/situations before ours. He helped many families during some extremely difficult times but it was at the cost of his own family.

I have made some terrible mistakes and up until recently he has never forgiven for me - or at least he says he has. (Nothing immoral or illegal, and nothing regarding remaining faithful to him, but still very hurtful.)

I know we have a long road ahead of us. Some days I have so much confidence we are going to make it and others I start to question can I go through another day waiting for the other shoe to drop.

I open emails and go to my FB account with apprehension because I am fearful to find another revealing account of what he has/is doing behind my back.

I truly am trying to take this day by day, but I also need to know we are working toward the same ultimate goal.

I guess it is time for me take my own advice that I give my daughters all the time:
If you learn from it, and choose to not to do it again, consider it a mistake and a life experience to avoid the same situation again, if you don't, then it was simply a complete act of selfishness, to make you feel in good in the moment and it adds nothing to the person you are striving to become.


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## jessi (Feb 11, 2009)

Hey Hurting, 
Just come here and vent I find it helps to post to others who are in a stressful moment, they happen to all of us........
it takes a lot, I'm like that with music, I hear a song and I think is he thinking of her?.......he probably isn't men just don't do that.....but I think he might be......and the crazy nut inside me takes over for a moment of two.......
I feel weak afterwards, my therapist said you are in the drivers seat what are you afraid of, he says you can wake up tomorrow morning and ruin his whole life if you wanted to........
My therapist says you don't do this because you chose not to, you chose to work at loving your husband and making the marriage work...................
Tomorrow is my anniversary date of finding out about the affair and I have had triggers going non stop, I just keep trying to focus on the now and not the past........It's tough, but you can do this, you are strong and worth it.........Remember you do this all for you..............
Hang in there.


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## InRecoveryInNC (Oct 22, 2010)

chefmaster said:


> A man can have an erection if the sky is blue.
> In the morning though an erection is possible due to a full bladder, a dream, the touching of a blanket, scratching himself and the list goes on.


I guess I should clarify this question a bit. I have been married and sleeping with this man for more than 25 years. I know how the body works phsically, however, in the past 5 years, he has not had an erection in the morning or even during the night on a regular basis. It has been almost non-existent. Partially due to age (he's 45) and I believe partially because our relationship has been so strained that the attraction and stresses kept him from feeling anything.

So my question I suppose is that maybe his feelings are coming back and one way he is non-verbally showing me/him is with this new outcome...


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## jamesa (Oct 22, 2010)

HurtingInNC said:


> Of course he has a part in this too, but I know my actions contributed in a big way. We know have to get to know each other again, hard to believe that after being together for 27 years, I have to accept there is so much I don't know about him anymore.


To me that statement shows that you have a whole lot of emotional intelligence and self-awareness. That will go a long way to helping you repair your marriage.

Stay strong.


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## InRecoveryInNC (Oct 22, 2010)

jessi said:


> Tomorrow is my anniversary date of finding out about the affair and I have had triggers going non stop, I just keep trying to focus on the now and not the past........It's tough, but you can do this, you are strong and worth it.........Remember you do this all for you..............
> Hang in there.


Jessi,

I will definitely keep you in my thoughts as I know how triggers can totally play mind games and hopefully the anniversay date will prove to be more of a reminder of where your relationship is heading and not where it has been.

I will pass along the same advice you have shared with me.... You can do this, you are strong and worth it.

HinNC


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## chefmaster (Oct 30, 2010)

HurtingInNC said:


> So my question I suppose is that maybe his feelings are coming back and one way he is non-verbally showing me/him is with this new outcome...


I'll get back to this one in a bit, I just read the backstory you wrote.



HurtingInNC said:


> He used porn, personals and literotica along w/MB to satisfy his needs for more than a decade until he couldn't handle the loneliness


How do you know he used these things?


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## InRecoveryInNC (Oct 22, 2010)

chefmaster said:


> How do you know he used these things?


Through our recent discussions after he admitted to the PA, he opened up to me and told me what lead him to seek the physical touch after years of having to DIY sex.

He has never hidden the fact that he likes porn but it was only recently he shared with me that he never expected me to perform what he was watching he only used it as a fantasy. (Wish I had known that years ago...) He also shared with me how he enjoys literotica but again, most of what he had read is to be kept in the fantasy world.


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## chefmaster (Oct 30, 2010)

Oh okay I thought you were saying that for 5 years everything had stopped including the porn and MB.


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