# one more thing I do not understand



## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

This goes back to the discussion of did she do things with that POS that she does not do with me. She was able to send photos, write sex stories, he talked with her about watching pornos and masturbating with her. If an x rated movie came up my wife would say change the channel. Tried to do sex emails back and forth she would not do that with me and any talk of masturbation from me was greeted with I do not want to talk about it. Her sex with him seems to be pretty straight forward those are her words not mine.
She has always been up tight with me about talking about sex and our sex life is pretty vanilla and sporadic but she has been free with him. I have never been a prude with her far from it. So someone that she has been married to for 30 years she cannot talk about sex, tell me her fantasies or desires but she could talk about them with that POSM.
She says while crying that she has no idea why she could be so free with him and not me. I am not sure if she is really being honest that she does not know, understand her feelings or she is afraid to tell me why.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

She is prob trying to figure out how she could get to that point to cross those boundaries and that is why she says she doesn't know why she could be "so free" with him and do all of that. 

She probably feels really ashamed at her behavior (one would hope). I would definitely let her know what is going on in your mind and that you feel confused and don't understand how/why she did that. Keep the lines of communication open.


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## FourtyPlus (Dec 18, 2011)

This is not affair related for me and in my case, but I've had a very hard time to switch of "Mommy" and replace her with "Wife". It often felt like there wasn't even a switch at all, I was just being "Mommy" all the time. I would want to do all these things to and with my husband but dang, I just couldn't do it because "Mommy" wouldn't do these things. Our daugther is almost 15 now and somewhere in recent years I have been able to actually find the "wife" switch and damn it, I'm flipping it on all the time now!!!


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## desert-rose (Aug 16, 2011)

Sometimes, intimacy can be a scary thing. She might just be so insecure and uncertain about what she wants and whether or not it's acceptable that she wasn't able to bring it up with you at all, like some kind of extreme self-consciousness gone very wrong. I'm not excusing her behavior, just considering what might have been going through her mind. Perhaps she lacks the self-awareness to understand why she did what she did. If so, it would be helpful to find ways to talk around it or get some books to help each other through the process.

I think it's really good that you guys are communicating, even though it is difficult and frustrated and fraught with mistrust. At least you're not pushing each other away with cruelty, instead, but trying to remain vulnerable enough to deal with the problems. Maybe you might be able to understand each other and how to fix the problems, at some point.

It's got to feel frustrating and insulting that she allowed herself to be free with him and not you, but it's good that you're focusing on the WHY of it....


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

My theory on this is that the AP is more of an escape - you can be someone you aren't normally with the AP because there are no strings like kids, responsibilities, etc. There is less emotional baggage to carry, so it's like, "f*ck it", let's do this! 

With a spouse, doing something out of the comfort zone may open things they are afraid to open, because they know they will have to deal with it "forever". Also, they may feel more embarrassed. With an AP, if you get really embarrassed, it's easier to just blow off the person going forward.


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

I am not sure if we can keep the lines of communication open on this. She says your issues are all about the sex. I point out to her that 80% of her messages, email, texts, and pictures were about sex with the POSM. She tells me he was a connection. Of course my response is yes and it was almost all about the sex.
As far as the Mommy switch our youngest is now 26. There is something with her that when we travel she is more interested and more into sex. So maybe it is something about being at home
But let’s get to the ego part she could tell this POSM that she wanted x and could not wait to touch his y. That hurts as much as the fact she took off her clothes and jumped into bed with him. She has never been able to do that for me.
You know I am the guy that took care of her, I am the guy that has always held the door open for her brought her flowers and she gave that intimacy that connection to someone else. Someone that was there with her through all the bad stuff life has to offer and I get the I cannot be that way with you.
I just cannot keep dealing with I do not know why?


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

Well then don't. Tell her it's a deal breaker for you, that she sends you a message you're a 2nd grade partner, and you would rather then move on. See how she responds.

It might be some insecurities of her that she has to work on hard, but at this point it shouldn't be your problem.


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## calif_hope (Feb 25, 2011)

I believe it's about duality - being able to create a second persona a character. With the other man she was a different person than your wife - she was in the character she made up, this person or persona being more comfortable and free with sex than her normal self. With you she embraces the role of wife and mother and what she and society sees for that role. With the POS, she was a *****, an escort, a mistress and behaved accordantly. Most woman have *****/rape/domence fantasies but would never act on them.

Your wife, IMO, was able to step out of her role with your family and step in to a role that comes from her fantasy life.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

snap said:


> Well then don't. Tell her it's a deal breaker for you, that she sends you a message you're a 2nd grade partner, and you would rather then move on. See how she responds.
> 
> It might be some insecurities of her that she has to work on hard, but at this point it shouldn't be your problem.


Could not agree more with this.

She needs to understand that a huge part of her heavy lifting to earn back her chance to be with you REQUIRES her to fix her problem with engaging you like this. This is one of the consequences of her chosing to cheat.

Obviously she can do ir, but she is refusing to make the effort with you.

Basically it's time for her to do the work or pack her bag.

She is expecting that if she waits you out, that you'll give up and accept her back in the same old marriage that ended withher cheating.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bryanp (Aug 25, 2011)

If the roles were reversed do you think your wife have been so accepting as you have been putting with such nonsense from you? She has made it clear that you are a second rate partner to her and the door prize. If you put up with this then you are sending a message to her that she is correct. If you do not respect yourself then who will?


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

Off the top of my head, I can think of two possibilities. First, as other posters have pointed out, she may have just been able to live totally in a fantasy where she was "on vacation" and didn't have to worry about the drudgery that often kills her libido. Second, it may have to do with you. Often, men assume that their frigid wife isn't interested in sex in general. But they learn that their wives are very interested in sex with other men. So it's the husbands that just aren't inspiring the lust in their wives.

If you've always been the safe, beta provider, then a dangerous, alpha bad boy who was only interested in her body may have been very sexy to her. And her confusion over this point may be genuine. Women will often convince themselves intellectually that they want the stable paycheck hubby who buys them flowers twice a month. When their bodies get all tingly over the crude guy who texts a picture of his junk, they're legitimately surprised by how they react.


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## skip76 (Aug 30, 2011)

snap said:


> Well then don't. Tell her it's a deal breaker for you, that she sends you a message you're a 2nd grade partner, and you would rather then move on. See how she responds.
> 
> It might be some insecurities of her that she has to work on hard, but at this point it shouldn't be your problem.


i agree. she is used to you, knows all about you and what makes yo tick so it is not easy to change her perception of you. most of the responses so far have seemed pretty lame. i am telling you the hard truth, that respect is not there for her. the quickest way to get that back is to do above. show her you deserve bettre and maybe she will try to be "that" better option.


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

Jellybeans said:


> She is prob trying to figure out how she could get to that point to cross those boundaries and that is why she says she doesn't know why she could be "so free" with him and do all of that.
> 
> She probably feels really ashamed at her behavior (one would hope). I would definitely let her know what is going on in your mind and that you feel confused and don't understand how/why she did that. Keep the lines of communication open.


I told her she needs to figure it out and soon. I have heard her talking with her best friend sobbing that she does not know what or why she has done any of this.

I am not letting her off the hook she has to explain her feelings and motives before we even try to work on other issues in our marriage.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

You are the nice guy---he was the bad boy---You must know all nice guys finish last---and women are attracted to the bad boys

Your very very very major problem here is her being willing to do things with him, that she wouldn't do with you---that is going to rub your sub-conscious raw---it will trigger you and your visions are just not gonna go away

I don't know how you want this all to settle out in the end---but it really doesn't matter, why, anymore-----its down to what you can handle---for the rest of your life---cuz just looking at this woman, must be very tuff for you.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

Hey Mahike---did you keep your wife's horse over at that big equestrian center in Huntington Beach----that place is one very social situation all by itself.


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## FourtyPlus (Dec 18, 2011)

calif_hope said:


> I believe it's about duality - being able to create a second persona a character. With the other man she was a different person than your wife - she was in the character she made up, this person or persona being more comfortable and free with sex than her normal self. With you she embraces the role of wife and mother and what she and society sees for that role. With the POS, she was a *****, an escort, a mistress and behaved accordantly. Most woman have *****/rape/domence fantasies but would never act on them.
> 
> Your wife, IMO, was able to step out of her role with your family and step in to a role that comes from her fantasy life.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Exactly that (minus the rape thingy, kinda)!
There's this saying that a woman should be a lady in the living room, a mother in the nursery, a cook in the kitchen and a ***** in the bedroom - not sure if I'm quoting that right. Most women get the living room and nursery thing but they put a giant lock on the bedroom door as soon as they are done decorating the nursery.


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

We had one of those big blow ups last night that does lead to some progress. I found out he was texting my wife so I blew him up yesterday by sending an email to his boss that he was sending inappropriate emails to my wife using their email and their time and I told my wife what I had done last night. It was a major blow up and I told her to pack her bag and I would drop her at her friend’s house. An hour or so later we are talking about how she can be open and unrestricted with him and not me. She says he was a fantasy and she cannot imagine me asking her for pictures of herself to masturbate too and she cannot imagine using the type of language she used with him with me. I cannot imagine she has me held up as a Madonna, or that I would be repulsed

I told her I am not having much sex so how does she think I am getting some release? I then pushed her to tell me the things about how it started and who initiated and so on. We have MC tonight so I am sure we are going to rehash this out again. I also told her she needs to figure out how she can be that open and intimate with me.


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

jnj express said:


> Hey Mahike---did you keep your wife's horse over at that big equestrian center in Huntington Beach----that place is one very social situation all by itself.


No it was not HB but I have never been to an equestrian center that was not full of drama.


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

mahike said:


> I found out he was texting my wife ... It was a major blow up and I told her to pack her bag and I would drop her at her friend’s house. An hour or so later we are talking about how she can be open and unrestricted with him and not me. ... I also told her she needs to figure out how she can be that open and intimate with me.


Our standard advice for ending an affair, as I'm sure you know, includes not contacting the OM and informing the loyal spouse about any attempted contact. You didn't say that she was returning his texts, or whether she told you about them. But it didn't sound like she was abiding by the standard no-contact agreement.

Also, her defending him against your anger is a bad sign that she is still emotionally invested in him.

If we add to that you telling her to leave, which she didn't do, I'm concerned that you're not enforcing your boundaries effectively. Hopefully, I'm wrong and just interpreting your post incorrectly. But it sounds like she's trying to cake eat and have a little contact with the OM. If so, you need to do more than threaten her with consequences. You've already done that. You need to be ready to impose those consequences.

Good luck.


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

She did respond and crossed the boundries. Nothing more then Hi how are you one liners but you are right. I started my divorce papers. What I did for the POSM (he is a high school teacher) is write a letter to his Principal about what he was doing on school time on school email accounts and so on. I copied the school district superindendent as well. I heard from the principal today letting me know that this would be handled and quickly.


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## JustaJerk (Dec 2, 2011)

> She did respond and crossed the boundries. Nothing more then Hi how are you one liners


NC mean exactly that-- NO [email protected]#$ING CONTACT WHATSOEVER!

What part of that does she NOT understand?


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

JustaJerk said:


> NC mean exactly that-- NO [email protected]#$ING CONTACT WHATSOEVER!
> 
> What part of that does she NOT understand?


Either she doesn't care if the OP divorces her, or she doesn't think he will.


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

She did not think I would pull the trigger with her or throw the POSM under the bus with his work either. She was wrong about him and I think me telling her to get out was a real eyeopener for her.


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## wasclueless (Jan 29, 2012)

Mahike, how long ago was the A? I'm just curious, because I was told to expose the OM right away. D-day for me was only 4 days ago but my WS is still here with me and we are in the limbo stage right now.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

I am not sure how much she really wants to R.----She is still being selfish, and not owning up to what she did, in which she treated you as a POS, and with total disrespect.

She said she couldn't see you doing the things she did with her lover---that is a total crock----Maybe you arn't into what she was doing---but what she was doing was so out of line it doesn't matter, and what she was doing, has destroyed your carefree life, wrecked your peace of mind, and destroyed your trust.

She is still being selfish, to make this work, if that is what you want she MUST become selfless-----she should be remorseful, contrite, if necessary grovel---she is none of that---in stead she says to you---I did these things with my lover, cuz I couldn't see doing them with you.

No matter how this goes down, she has ripped you apart, and you probably in all reality are not going to forget----It isn't necessarily the actual things she did with her lover---its that she did them with him, when she has never even considered doing those same things with you her H., who she took sacred vows with.

Yes you are very right about drama, at an equestrian center, some weird things go down, where there are women, and their horses.


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

wasclueless said:


> Mahike, how long ago was the A? I'm just curious, because I was told to expose the OM right away. D-day for me was only 4 days ago but my WS is still here with me and we are in the limbo stage right now.


My biggest mistake was not to blow this thing wide open with the OM's wife, family friends. I know this guy going all the way back to high school and he was a selfish prick then and he is now. 

I was concnerned for the damage this would have caused his two young daughters and I should have understood that he and my wife did not care about what happened to those girls.

I should have looked out for number one. Dumb stupid big mistake!

Do not takle the nice guy approach!!!


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## rrrbbbttt (Apr 6, 2011)

mahike said:


> My biggest mistake was not to blow this thing wide open with the OM's wife, family friends. I know this guy going all the way back to high school and he was a selfish prick then and he is now.
> 
> I was concnerned for the damage this would have caused his two young daughters and I should have understood that he and my wife did not care about what happened to those girls.
> 
> ...


:
iagree:

I have not seen any thread where the BS took the "Nice Guy" approach and wasn't thrown under the Bus. 

Unfortunately, unless the real Hard line is taken the BS always gets taken for granted that he/she will always forgive and let the WS back. 

That is probably why "the Line in the Sand" needs to be established and stuck to. Many do not want to do it because that is not the way they were raised or how they want to treat people but in situations where an affair has occured it is the effective way and people have to do it.


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## mahike (Aug 16, 2011)

rrrbbbttt said:


> :
> iagree:
> 
> I have not seen any thread where the BS took the "Nice Guy" approach and wasn't thrown under the Bus.
> ...


I have a hard time dealing with the thought of kids being hurt but the one thing I have learned is that my wife and this POSM did not care about anything else but what they wanted or thougth they needed.

My advice to anyone go through this is get your ducks in a row and then blow it wide open and as fast as you can.


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## jnj express (Mar 28, 2011)

OK so you expose---where are YOU going from there

What are you considering---you obviously should take plenty of time and think about what YOU want for YOUR future---but somewhere along the line---you need to decide if you will continue to live with this woman, or if you will cut her loose, and make your way back into the world.


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