# Wayward men, any men (or women-your man?)would you hang around denying for 10 months?



## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

You cheated with your ex at the beginning of a new relationship. You came 'clean' 10months after you 'last fu*ked her. It was only '4 times', in month 2, 3, 4 & 9 of your new relationship. After month 9 you 'stopped pursuing her'. 10 months later you are found out and your gf (after the initial upset) talks with you, wants to find out the why's and what's, to make sure it doesn't happen again, wants this relationship to work...as do you. But you have a difficult time talking once you feel you have said it all (or said all you want to say), and indeed you are not an open person or a natural 'talker' of issues. After a month or so of long talks, you then get fed up and get angry when she wants to talk about it again. You walk out frequently, but she cannot go for long without needing to talk...so problems ensue. She brings it up, you won't talk. You fall out, back together, she brings it up...etc. Occasionally you talk over the next 7months, but mostly it is anger and defense (guilt?). Your gf then becomes hung up on there being some other occasions. She has brought this up here and there but since Christmas is now fixated on the fact that certain occurrences point to more times. She now brings it up constantly, calls you a liar, asks just about every week about some aspect of it, goes moody and stops speaking to you because she wants the 'truth' and has now got to the end of the road and finishes several times in the last several months. The last 5-6 weeks being the most intense.

Bearing in mind we are not married, we don't live together, we have only been together 2 &half years, if there was any more occurrences of infidelity that are hidden would you still be here? Would someone who is still lying be able to put up with this much pressure and still WANT to stick around? Would a liar be able to put up with this or would he just walk away (if he was much in love and didn't want to lose the girl)? If he loves me that much and is desperate to keep hold of me (which I totally believe he is) would he still keep his mouth shut and lie after all this? Or would the lie that is there cause you/him to walk away/come clean? Could there be this much pressure and no change in the 'story' and explanation if there was still hidden infidelities, and if there were more infidelities would he have walked by now if he was not going to tell them? 

I know all the 'what are you doing here you just have to ditch him he is a cheating scumbag' but I know my situation and my relationship and what is worth keeping and what is not. I would really appreciate to hear any input on the question of lying and how much difficulties would a liar put up with. And how much would an honest person put up with? Does anyone know the answers from their own experience, of either themselves or of the WS?


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## 827Aug (Apr 27, 2008)

Heck, my estranged husband denied having affairs for over two years. The lies were getting rather far fetched before he moved out. He moved out because he was running out of plausible lies. Plus, he was forgetting what all his "story lines" were. It was less stressful for him to move out so that he could continue his behavior AND not have to lie about it.


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## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

Thanks. But I don't believe he is cheating now or has done for a good while. I think the ones he couldn't tell me about were just too close to DD and so would have been much more threatening to 'us'. Also, bear in mind we are bf and gf, not married, don't have a 20yr history. Would the need to stay still be so strong?

As a side note, he has done all the right things recently, he doesn't go out drinking like he did, he does things for me all the time, is very caring and considerate, is helpful with everything I do, is being the perfect bf and has been for some time (except the not talking issue which was intense before Xmas and has been much better since, I have forced the issue and he has complied). All it is now is that he is getting it from me constantly about the other occasions I think there is and want him to come clean. Those occasions definitely are not continuing. They have ended.


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## Twofaces (Dec 5, 2011)

Ok, so the way I see it is this. You have to be honest. Do you trust him at all? Doesn't sound like it. 

Do you just want to crucify him mercilessly with no end?

What is your intent I think is the biggest question you have to ask yourself.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

Extra question to add: Would someone who was being honest put up with this much for this long?


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## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

Twofaces said:


> Ok, so the way I see it is this. You have to be honest. Do you trust him at all? Doesn't sound like it.
> 
> Do you just want to crucify him mercilessly with no end?
> 
> ...


I don't know if I trust him. Probably not. But then that is obvious why isn't it. I am beginning to believe a little mote in him as he seems totally genuine. On top of that, I asked him the other day "ok, if you are honest with me tell me something uncomfortable and difficult for you, that you wouldn't want to tell me". So he did. It was about the one that got away, the childhood sweetheart. I was glad he told me. 

I don't want to crucify him, never have. All I wanted to do was talk, discuss, discover where the problems lie and fix. His reaction to my wanting to talk caused me more suspicion. But then, I can also see him having that reaction purely from his personality. 

Coming on here around Christmas and reading all the stories and behaviours of cheaters made me feel much more solid in my thoughts, made me 'trust' myself instead of questioning, and so I got to a point where it was 'I know you are lying, I know you continued something and are hiding it from me, I don't need any more proof than that so it is the end'. But he keeps telling me the same, wants it to work, and he knows I do to. But I refuse to commit if I believe what I do. I am wavering again in my belief, beginning to believe him. He tells me there was nothing else, he would tell me if there was rather than go thru this crap (I just about believe him) I also think if he was guilty and still lying, would he really still be here? Considering our situation? (btw we both feel that we found the 'one' and so that is why we are both still here. That is our reason to stay) If he had found the 'one' would he still stick around if guilty even tho no marriage, no kids together, seperate houses?


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## Paladin (Oct 15, 2011)

Stop torturing yourself, and him. Go get a polygraph test done, if he beats the polygraph, get into IC and work on yourself, if he fails the polygraph, get into IC and work on yourself. If he refuses to take the polygraph, get into IC and work on yourself. Once you reach a solid point in your IC, make a decision. Give him the boot, or take him back. Staying in limbo, like you currently are, and keeping him there too, will just lead to pain and suffering for both of you. If you take him back, swallow the blue pill, move on, and work hard to build a new, healthy relationship based on trust. Reality is what you make it every single day. As far as "the one" goes, its mostly a choice, you may not be able to control the chemical reaction in your brain, but you certainly have a say in the rest, like how you relate to one another, and the relationship as a whole. A commitment to the commitment if you will. Hope you find peace soon, carrying such turmoil inside yourself must be terrible.


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## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

Twofaces: I know he didn't love or respect me for the 1st year. I stopped loving him, and I finished with him. He begged me back and I relented. It took a month to begin loving him again. Since then he has slowly become a different man. Very much loving and respectful in our day to day relationship. Has become all I have ever wanted.

827: He has become open to talking, he now gives me truth and I believe him. He is now honest. Except there is this nagging of the other occasions that I think may have happened. And he knows if he told me, of they are true that is, then that would be it for me.

I don't believe that some love is better than none, especially if it is damaging.

I have stopped getting angry a long time ago. I accept he will not tell me what I want to hear, that is why I have just finished it recently. But then he misses me, keeps texting, wants us back together. I feel against that, then start missing, then want him back etc etc. So here I am wondering whether to trust or not.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

A cake eater can go years, decades if they get away with it, without admitting or moving on for their deceptive behavior.


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## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

Paladin said:


> Stop torturing yourself, and him. Go get a polygraph test done, if he beats the polygraph, get into IC and work on yourself, if he fails the polygraph, get into IC and work on yourself. If he refuses to take the polygraph, get into IC and work on yourself. Once you reach a solid point in your IC, make a decision. Give him the boot, or take him back. Staying in limbo, like you currently are, and keeping him there too, will just lead to pain and suffering for both of you. If you take him back, swallow the blue pill, move on, and work hard to build a new, healthy relationship based on trust. Reality is what you make it every single day. As far as "the one" goes, its mostly a choice, you may not be able to control the chemical reaction in your brain, but you certainly have a say in the rest, like how you relate to one another, and the relationship as a whole. A commitment to the commitment if you will. Hope you find peace soon, carrying such turmoil inside yourself must be terrible.


Thankyou Paladin, I believe all is now as it should be. The commitment is there, the love, the healthy relationship is all there.

I just want to know that, given our situation and history, length of relationship, would someone continue to lie? I can understand the continuing if there is a 20 year marriage.

And if he was being honest, given our history and length of relationship, would he stick around? 

I find it very difficult to see which would be most likely. Or even both. If this was the other way round, would I still be here? If I was telling the truth then would me ditching the relationship be more likely by now, or would it be more likely if I was lying? I believe that if I was lying then that would cause me to take the constant 'accusations' for longer. Bit without being in that situation it is difficult to imagine.


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## Paladin (Oct 15, 2011)

Remains said:


> Thankyou Paladin, I believe all is now as it should be. The commitment is there, the love, the healthy relationship is all there.
> 
> I just want to know...


My IC related a case where the DS did everything possible for over a year, and the BS just needed to know _WHY_. There was no real answer for _why_ and never would be. The BS drove them both to resentment and R fizzled and they parted ways.

If all of the above is true, the love, healthy relationship, commitment. If all of that is there, what difference would the answers you want possibly make?

The old relationship is dead, if you have not already done so (both of you) mourn its loss, then move on to a new healthy one. Its a blue pill kind of moment.


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## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

Paladin said:


> My IC related a case where the DS did everything possible for over a year, and the BS just needed to know _WHY_. There was no real answer for _why_ and never would be. The BS drove them both to resentment and R fizzled and they parted ways.
> 
> If all of the above is true, the love, healthy relationship, commitment. If all of that is there, what difference would the answers you want possibly make?
> 
> The old relationship is dead, if you have not already done so (both of you) mourn its loss, then move on to a new healthy one. Its a blue pill kind of moment.


Thankyou Paladin, I appreciate your reply. I must say, I did worry that that example u gave may end up happening. And now since I have become fixated on this issue I have got to the point where I am so blinded by the issue I don't even care if I drive him away. But the thing is, I think I do care. 

The difference the answers make, I realise there isn't really much of an answer to why, it is just sex isn't it. And selfishness. Blind stupidity. Hopefully it is not a habit and standard of behaviour. If what I think is true, that is the end of our chances of a future. Nothing comes after that. I would know there is no hope due to inability to be honest and truthful, and faithful. If what he says is true, he ended the damaging behaviour on his own without a discovery to end it. He made the decision to be decent and not continue in his messed up way from his previous relationship. And he is totally remorseful and completely genuine. 

If this is the case, then I don't want to throw it all away. I am glad you have brought this question, that I had buried under my intense suspicion, back to my attention again. 

I realise I am now at a crossroads. Time to believe and move on. Or just end it. I hope I can make that decision. And stick to it. I am now beginning to drive him away. Thanks Paladin.


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## star2916 (May 21, 2013)

Remains, I have been going trough a very similar scenario.The difference in your case, he appears to have told you what happened, admitted it , and now he is acting accordingly showing remorse and being loving to you. 

It takes about a year or two of constant reinforcement in his part of continuing showing his Love for you. This kind of thing it's felt. And we know it. 

How you are feeling is totally normal. Just keep your ears up, but try to focus the way he is treating you now and let it rest. Follow his actions not his words.

Hopefully you will be able to trust him again, if he continues doing the right thing and there are not other similar events happening.

Best wishes.


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## star2916 (May 21, 2013)

Trust me, I know, I know .... maybe it will be a good idea to take a time out ? I have, and let me tell you, it has made a world of difference. After a month of not seeing him, the REAL ME, the one that "KNOWS" is coming back and I see things totally differently . Not in a good way towards him. 

I invite you to look at my thread. I just don't know how to direct you to it.

Take care.


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## GusPolinski (Jan 21, 2014)

Just an FYI... Remains' last post in this thread was nearly 2 1/2 years ago.

If you'd like Remains to take a look at your thread, you could always send her a PM inviting her to do so.


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## Calibre1212 (Aug 11, 2014)

He can always do everything right, on and on but what I see here is a lot of disrespect. Even a white lie sinks ships...He shuts down doesn't wanna talk about it?...It took you a month to love him again?...He begged you, but that my dearie, was the golden opportunity to obtain the absolute truth...You missed it. Your gut is telling you there's more to the story and it won't let you ignore it. You guys are heading down a painful path, you already have grounds for divorce and you aren't even married. You are teaching him what is "acceptable" by allowing his disrespect to you while your gut is telling you it's really not acceptable at all. Therein lies the battle. It's perfectly good to question your gut feelings but know that they are usually accurate. Trust yourself.


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## Calibre1212 (Aug 11, 2014)

You know, after the age of 40, I came to realize how I contributed to my husband's grossly adulterous disrespect of me and the marriage: I allowed it...I always took him back on "his" terms...No matter how much I told him and he said he understood what my boundaries are, the action of taking him back before the clarification negated my words. No matter how much I re-did the math, added and subtracted, this is where I am at fault...I ignored my gut feelings in favor of keeping the status quo. I taught him to disrespect me, I taught him that his behavior towards me was acceptable. 

Once I got me a healthy, strong and higher dose of self-respect, enough to get some black paint and draw a thick black line down the middle of the house and around myself, his ass could no longer cross it...He caved on many, many levels. And, rightfully so, it was long overdue. And yes I kicked him to the curb, he does not deserve the right to be within a 4-feet radius of me. Now he knows...Too late...Every change he made or tried to make, became MOOT, nullified, voided because I have now adopted a zero tolerance for disrespect.

Once you find that healthy dose of self-respect, you stop debating and deliberating with yourself about he said, she said and just take action...Because YOU KNOW what happened and you know what is a "reported" lie.


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## wmn1 (Aug 27, 2014)

Remains said:


> You cheated with your ex at the beginning of a new relationship. You came 'clean' 10months after you 'last fu*ked her. It was only '4 times', in month 2, 3, 4 & 9 of your new relationship. After month 9 you 'stopped pursuing her'. 10 months later you are found out and your gf (after the initial upset) talks with you, wants to find out the why's and what's, to make sure it doesn't happen again, wants this relationship to work...as do you. But you have a difficult time talking once you feel you have said it all (or said all you want to say), and indeed you are not an open person or a natural 'talker' of issues. After a month or so of long talks, you then get fed up and get angry when she wants to talk about it again. You walk out frequently, but she cannot go for long without needing to talk...so problems ensue. She brings it up, you won't talk. You fall out, back together, she brings it up...etc. Occasionally you talk over the next 7months, but mostly it is anger and defense (guilt?). Your gf then becomes hung up on there being some other occasions. She has brought this up here and there but since Christmas is now fixated on the fact that certain occurrences point to more times. She now brings it up constantly, calls you a liar, asks just about every week about some aspect of it, goes moody and stops speaking to you because she wants the 'truth' and has now got to the end of the road and finishes several times in the last several months. The last 5-6 weeks being the most intense.
> 
> Bearing in mind we are not married, we don't live together, we have only been together 2 &half years, if there was any more occurrences of infidelity that are hidden would you still be here? Would someone who is still lying be able to put up with this much pressure and still WANT to stick around? Would a liar be able to put up with this or would he just walk away (if he was much in love and didn't want to lose the girl)? If he loves me that much and is desperate to keep hold of me (which I totally believe he is) would he still keep his mouth shut and lie after all this? Or would the lie that is there cause you/him to walk away/come clean? Could there be this much pressure and no change in the 'story' and explanation if there was still hidden infidelities, and if there were more infidelities would he have walked by now if he was not going to tell them?
> 
> I know all the 'what are you doing here you just have to ditch him he is a cheating scumbag' but I know my situation and my relationship and what is worth keeping and what is not. I would really appreciate to hear any input on the question of lying and how much difficulties would a liar put up with. And how much would an honest person put up with? Does anyone know the answers from their own experience, of either themselves or of the WS?



You are not married, not living together, he stepped out multiple times with an ex, stonewalled you when all you wanted to do is talk and the onus should have been on him to do the heavy lifting, instead he ran around like a spoiled brat and gaslighted. 

I had an ex-gf lie to me but her sister showed me her diary. I confronted, broke up, she begged back, I sensed more issues, I confronted , broke up then upgraded to my new wife. 

The relationship you are referencing, and I know you don't want to hear it, is not worth the effort. Move on and upgrade

and I realize this thread is over 2 years old but I thought I had something interested to add.


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## Calibre1212 (Aug 11, 2014)

THIS: "You came 'clean' 10 months after you 'last fu*ked her... 10 months later you are found out". 

** Confusing. Confession or Admission?

THIS: "It was *only* '4 times', in month 2, 3, 4 & 9 of your new relationship. After month 9 you 'stopped pursuing her'. 

**2, 3, 4, 9 = The Beginning, the Middle & the End. I sure know you ain't chopped liver. "...only" = Minimizing. He doesn't want a relationship with you? He wants a woobi...A Plan B. Months 5, 6, 7, 8 - She stopped it, he didn't...He begged you back...Now you are back in the pic, he pursues her again and she takes up the challenge. That's a hard habit to break.


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## LongWalk (Apr 4, 2013)

Yes, you never know if a zombie thread will come to life.


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## PhillyGuy13 (Nov 29, 2013)

Anyone like Romney's chances against Obama in the upcoming election?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

LongWalk said:


> Yes, you never know if a zombie thread will come to life.


So you can never be sure a zombie is dead. They can't be killed?


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## happy as a clam (Jan 5, 2014)




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## Calibre1212 (Aug 11, 2014)

It Remains to be seen...


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## Dad&Hubby (Aug 14, 2012)

Remains said:


> You cheated with your ex at the beginning of a new relationship. You came 'clean' 10months after you 'last fu*ked her. It was only '4 times', in month 2, 3, 4 & 9 of your new relationship. After month 9 you 'stopped pursuing her'. 10 months later you are found out and your gf (after the initial upset) talks with you, wants to find out the why's and what's, to make sure it doesn't happen again, wants this relationship to work...as do you. But you have a difficult time talking once you feel you have said it all (or said all you want to say), and indeed you are not an open person or a natural 'talker' of issues. After a month or so of long talks, you then get fed up and get angry when she wants to talk about it again. You walk out frequently, but she cannot go for long without needing to talk...so problems ensue. She brings it up, you won't talk. You fall out, back together, she brings it up...etc. Occasionally you talk over the next 7months, but mostly it is anger and defense (guilt?). Your gf then becomes hung up on there being some other occasions. She has brought this up here and there but since Christmas is now fixated on the fact that certain occurrences point to more times. She now brings it up constantly, calls you a liar, asks just about every week about some aspect of it, goes moody and stops speaking to you because she wants the 'truth' and has now got to the end of the road and finishes several times in the last several months. The last 5-6 weeks being the most intense.
> 
> Bearing in mind we are not married, we don't live together, we have only been together 2 &half years, if there was any more occurrences of infidelity that are hidden would you still be here? Would someone who is still lying be able to put up with this much pressure and still WANT to stick around? Would a liar be able to put up with this or would he just walk away (if he was much in love and didn't want to lose the girl)? If he loves me that much and is desperate to keep hold of me (which I totally believe he is) would he still keep his mouth shut and lie after all this? Or would the lie that is there cause you/him to walk away/come clean? Could there be this much pressure and no change in the 'story' and explanation if there was still hidden infidelities, and if there were more infidelities would he have walked by now if he was not going to tell them?
> 
> I know all the 'what are you doing here you just have to ditch him he is a cheating scumbag' but I know my situation and my relationship and what is worth keeping and what is not. I would really appreciate to hear any input on the question of lying and how much difficulties would a liar put up with. And how much would an honest person put up with? Does anyone know the answers from their own experience, of either themselves or of the WS?


Cheating in the first year.....THEN GETTING DEFENSIVE AND DISMISSIVE...yes....the wayward should be dumped. Sorry but there's nothing redeeming there.


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## Panther66 (Sep 30, 2014)

Remains said:


> I don't know if I trust him. Probably not. But then that is obvious why isn't it. I am beginning to believe a little mote in him as he seems totally genuine. On top of that, I asked him the other day "ok, if you are honest with me tell me something uncomfortable and difficult for you, that you wouldn't want to tell me". So he did. It was about the one that got away, the childhood sweetheart. I was glad he told me.
> 
> I don't want to crucify him, never have. All I wanted to do was talk, discuss, discover where the problems lie and fix. His reaction to my wanting to talk caused me more suspicion. But then, I can also see him having that reaction purely from his personality.
> 
> Coming on here around Christmas and reading all the stories and behaviours of cheaters made me feel much more solid in my thoughts, made me 'trust' myself instead of questioning, and so I got to a point where it was 'I know you are lying, I know you continued something and are hiding it from me, I don't need any more proof than that so it is the end'. But he keeps telling me the same, wants it to work, and he knows I do to. But I refuse to commit if I believe what I do. I am wavering again in my belief, beginning to believe him. He tells me there was nothing else, he would tell me if there was rather than go thru this crap (I just about believe him) I also think if he was guilty and still lying, would he really still be here? Considering our situation? (btw we both feel that we found the 'one' and so that is why we are both still here. That is our reason to stay) If he had found the 'one' would he still stick around if guilty even tho no marriage, no kids together, seperate houses?


I so know your pain. My wife and I have been married 17 years. We were in a downtime where emotionally we kind of drifted apart. She started to crush on a local bartender and then eventually they got a little physical (from everything I know and believe it was some petting and kissing). I only found out because one day I decided to read her text messages. After working through a lot of issues on both sides we decided to stay together and make things work. They were going great until she met some guy on facebook. They started messaging a lot and some of it was borderline inappropriate in my book (trust on my side was down so I kept on snooping). She says they are just friends, but when I tell you the messaging is a lot I mean a hundred plus messages a day that I actually found out about. She said they just clicked and it's just all fun and friendly. I know my wife well enough to know she is attracted to this sort of guy. Where I have my problem is that I just don't trust her after the way this summer has gone. Our time together right now is phenomenal. We are closer and more in love than ever, or at least it feels that way, on her part and mine. Sexually we are much more active than in the past. But as soon as we are apart I wonder how much she is messaging him and what the nature of the conversation is. 

I tell you all that because it really comes down to trust and desire. I want my relationship to work, so the desire is there, but at some point I have to decide what I am willing to tolerate. I am teetering on the fence between filing for divorce or not. I just can't believe in my heart that all this communication is just friendly banter. I truly don't believe it is physical at all yet, but I am worried that it may head that way. 

So the hard part is deciding do you trust or not? I've had multiple conversations with my wife and they all go the same way. We end up fighting. She doesn't want to talk about it because she says she has told me everything and there is nothing to talk about. I don't believe her because her history of late (this past summer) has been to lie. So the options are to trust or to walk away. I can't speak for you, but I am starting to have a very hard time trusting. I love our time together, but the doubts are overwhelming. You are faced with a similar situation. You can move forward and trust and let what happens happen, or you can move on. If you decide to stay then you have to give your trust. If he breaks it again, then you just need to immediately walk away. If you stay and don't trust you will just push him away or into another affair at some point.


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## thummper (Dec 19, 2013)

Be interesting for her to post an update and let us know if she was able to work things out or if she ultimately bailed. Guess we'll never know.


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