# Should I be happy or is she just trying to be nice



## Zulu

*Should I be happy... the "fog" seems to be lifting*

Hi All. I am married for almost 16 years and have 2 boys, 16 and 10. My wife left 38 days ago to go live in a flat. She has the means to support herself etc and I was left in the house with the 2 boys. She told me that she does not love me, and has no feelings for me. She also said she performed oral on a guy and had a one night stand with another. We still communicate etc, and she has the boys on Sunday and Monday nights.

I am not so sure about the incidents she told me, but may be in denial that my wife would do such a thing. She is 44 and I am 43. 

Well, like I said we do still communicate and I am not ready to divorce and she has said nor is she. The boys are not happy with all that is going on around them, I have tried as much as I can to explain to them that mommy still loves them etc etc etc, but they want to know, then why did she leave and leave them behind... no disrespect to me.... but any way... Tomorrow is my birthday and she has suggested that we all go see a movie and have a lunch together... 

Either she is trying to get the message accross that she may want back in, OR, she is just trying to show the boys that she still loves them and has some lttle respect for their father on his birthday and that is why she is trying to do this.

I am pretty much 100% sure that there is no one else in her life..., well... as sure as I can be... 

To the esteemed on this board, what should I do. Have been going out etc and having friends over and BBQs at my house etc for World Cup Football games and generally having a good time. Will be going on a week long fishing trip on the 27th with my boys etc...

Should I wait around, or should I move on, is this signs from her side that maybe living on your own in a flat is not as good as it is cut out to be, and maybe the family life wasn't so bad after all, and maybe in her solitude, has discovered that maybe she does still have feelings for me.... Heaven knows, still have very strong feelings for her... and she darn well knows it...

Someone, please hit me with a stick


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## iamnottheonlyone

Take a look at Coping with Infidelity threads. That is where you will find the most help. Read my thread if you like. We are sort of in similar situations. You want her back. Love can be rekindled but you must work on you.


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## a seperated guy

Zulu
Going through a separation myself, however one child and it’s my step-son. I think one thing to remember is that your wife is the mother of your children and she will be in your life until your kids are of age to move on, make the best of it. 

If she is sending you signals that there is hope, don’t move too fast and hope that all things will be fixed when you get back together. She left for a reason, and maybe it’s not your fault but you have to get to the root cause of her behaviors and extract the reason why she left in the first place. And even though she may want to come back because she found out single life is not all that great, bars are not a great place to meet quality people or she very well could miss you more than you know. I say go to dinner, celebrate your birthday and just take it day by day. Things won’t pop right back into place if you don’t figure out why she left, why she (allegedly) was with another guy and feels that way she does. Women go through a lot of changes during their 40’s and this could be the result of some childhood issues surfacing, stay strong and take it slow…remember you deserve to be treated good also.

I feel for you brother, take care of your kids build an even stronger relationship with them during this time


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## Zulu

Ok, so I need to update a bit.. last week Wednesday, 16th of June, we did do the movie and lunch thing, and then she came home to check that all was OK, because I was having a BBQ, which she said she will not be staying for. Anyway, I went upstairs to my room and she followed and she gave me a "prezzie"... must say it was real good, because I have not had any physical in a long time and there was just not a single bone in my body that could say no.... any way, she said it was probablt wrong and she was angry with herself for doing it.

So fast forward to Sunday which was Father's day in South Africa(Yep, same place as the FIFA World Cup) she went to her sisters house where her dad, mom, sister brother and brother in law was. She did not come and collect the boys to join that, after all they are the grand children of her father.... but then she came to the house and wished me a happy father's day, and she brought some take aways for the boys.... and stayed a total of 60 minutes. That was Sunday....

Las night I asked her to come home because I wanted to talk to her and she did come home.... well wanted to know from her what her plans are etc, and she says she does not know.. what she wants to do. I actually believe she does not know what she wants to do. She did ay again that she does not want to be with me, and cannot see herself being with me for the next 20 years. We spoke for about and hour in total. Told her that WE cannot change the past, but we will be able to make a new future togeher if we just both commit to it, she says that is the thing that she cannot do, COMMIT to me and me alone... well left it at that

Today is wednesday again, one week since my birthday, and she has seen the boys a total of 3 hours in all this time.

I have a friend who is having her 50th birthday party Friday night, 25th, and invited my wife with, boy, did this only get her hair in a frizz.... she has made all kinds of conditions that need to be met if she comes with, I must make no demands etc etc etc..... she thinks I just want her for sex, but this is so far from the truth. Anyway she has agreed to come with.... so I will have to be on my best behavior and not live up to the perception that she has that I will try and get it on with her. Even if she suggests it, I will have to politely decline.... just to get her thinking, ummmm maybe the guy is changing or what ever.... must add that she is pretty good looking.... anyway, we still do communicate via sms(Text messaging) and a few e-mails at work....

My boys ae really taking it hard, she thinks I am poisoning them, but they are becoming resentful all on their own, and the more I tell them that mommy loves them and cares for them, they then chuck the 3 hours is all we have seen her in the last week into my face.... the resentment they are feeling for her is resentment she herself has created in them, by her actions of not seeing them.

On Sunday the 27th I am taking them and my mom and dad to Namibia, to a town called Henties Bay(go Google it), famous for it's fishing... you are pretty much garenteed to catch something, and hey are so excited to be going, me as well, will be our first Family Holiday only 3/4 as opposed to 4/4 when she was there, but anyway, will keep you gys updated.

I am feeling terrible but getting over it now, much better than the first day she left, so I suppose I will be becoming a better option once I have gotten to a place where I am not depressed and sad anymore, which is probably good.


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## Zulu

Well, here I am again. Nothing has really changed, she is still in her flat, and me in the house with my boys. We do communicate but never about "us". I am really reaching a point where I am saying enough is enough. I deserve to be loved and be happy and I really want it with her, but if she is not interested in me, well then I have to move on. Life is just too short. 

I am pretty certain that she is "alone" and does not have anyone else.

This Saturday the 17th of July it will be 10 weeks that she has moved out of the house.

If this is a MLC, do they ever come back... she did tell me once... "Just give me 6 months to sort my crap out". Been wondering... why should I, this is ridiculous.

Any way, with her living in the flat, she does not cook and buys all her food ready to eat. This is a huge financial burden, as well as the rent it self. She is a good earner and can pay for the stuff. I also get a decent salary.

Anyway, we are still paying what ever we used to pay before we separated, we have a joint home loan which we pay together, she pays the school fees, I pay the cable and the cell phones etc etc etc, nothing has changed in that respect, or any respect at all, just that she is now not living at home.

Anyway, with the long school holidays etc over etc etc etc, I am pretty broke, kids just suck up money and it goes like a raging torrent, she is also broke. She borrowed some money from her mom... now this is going to sound very funny to the members in the USofA... she gave me $100... Which will go a VERY long way here in South Africa? (Should come here on holiday, cheaper than Mexico).

I just do not know what to do. I really love her and would like to be re united with her, but do not want to waste time waiting and hoping. I am just in the meantime going on with my life, but the problem is that I see her when I collect the boys from her etc etc etc, and every time that I see her, my heart bleeds. Must admit that I am sad, but sort of getting better, and don't get as sad as I used to. Going out a lot more now and just generally enjoying life.

But the thing that I miss is being loved, or feeling loved, it is a huge thing, that there is no one special just doing small little special things for me. I will not lie, I also miss the intimacy terribly and just having someone to lay behind and hold when you go to sleep is something that I really miss. I miss her smell in the house, her laughter, he presence and that is things that are important to me.

I have sort of backed off completely from her, did tell her that I treasure our relationship and that in my opinion, a family unit is the strongest force on this earth and I really have high regard for a family, the security that it offers, the safety in a family, Home... that it is a feeling, not a place.... etc etc

So, to all the been there done that got the good marriage back members.... should I wait around or move on and find the love that I feel I deserve to have.


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## Zulu

Anybody...??


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## cmf

I can only say that I have been separated for almost 9 months now and we are just starting to reconcile, so it can take awhile . I think it may have taken less time if I had given him his space at the beginning and just focused on myself. My Husband eventually noticed the changes I had made and why he fell in love with me to begin with before he beleived that we could rekindle our feelings for each other. At the beginning of the separation he was dead set on divorce and that he would never have feelings for me- there was an affair involved too. It's a hard road and takes a lot of patience, but it is possible to reconcile when both partners are at a place where they both work at it.


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## Zulu

Now on day 76... we are still amicable with each other and do communicate, when we see each other, there is a hug and a quick kiss, but one that you would give your brother for his birthday.

She sent me this mail yesterday...


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I know that you are having trouble coping with this whole thing, and I am sorry about that.

Have to say though, that I am actually quite happy living on my own. I don't know if that will make you feel better or worse, just thought I should tell you. Obviously it is a total joy having the boys there when I do, but I enjoy the space and time on my own.

Can I just ask... please try not to involve the boys with our issues if they are not asking? I don't know if you do, but I don't want them to have more emotional stuff to cope with than is necessary. When they with me, I just enjoy the time with them, and I don't discuss our stuff. Sometimes you are mentioned, but always in a positive light.

Was thinking that maybe we should have a therapy session together at some point, to see where we are, not just us talking one on one, because I think you are struggling. Maybe after you get back from you trip??

I told Neil that we were separated, but nobody else, they don't seem to be aware...
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Now the thing is, I am just about 100% sure that she is not seeing someone else, although she may be involved in an emotional affair which I cannot confirm or deny... just an update, what do the esteemed think. I am till hopeful that we will get together again, but also realistic in my thinking. she never starts a mail with Hi or puts her name at the bottom


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## Zulu

My repone to her mail...

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Hi XXXXXX

Seeing you happy is one of the greatest sources of MY happiness. There is treaure at home. You know that. Come home and let us sort OUR issues out, that way we will at least be trying to make the life for the boys as normal as possible. It will be hard work for both of us, but the reward will GREAT.

There is work to be done from both sides.

XXXXXX


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## Zulu

Her response to my respone...

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XXXXXX

You missing the whole point completely. Being with you makes me unhappy. No work from anybody's side is going to change that. And you keep on throwing the children's happiness at me so that I can be with you to make YOU happy. NORMAL is not happy necessarily, and I am not prepared to be false to give the boys normal. I have hidden my true self for many years to give them normal.

It's you who can't face anything but 'normal'. Can we please go to therapy together so that we can deal with this????

XXXXXXXX
(ps I tried to phone you dad but his phone goes on voicemail)


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## robdedgar

I have been reading your posts and I am kind of in the same situation as you. However, at first I was the one who wanted a divorce though, and was seeing someone on the side. Now, it is me that is wanting to reconcile. I was very unhappy with her and the way she treated me like I was only there to take care of her financially while she spent more time with her "other family," Mom and Dad.

Unfortunately for me, my in-laws are pressuring my wife to divorce me and keep my 3 yr old away from me. She has had three DUI's in four years and the last two where with our son in the car, as she feel asleep with the foot on the brake and passed out over the center console. She is still in court ordered rehab and took our son from my care.

Amid all of this mess I still would like to be a family with her again. However, I am not going to say anything to her. My plan of action at this point is to move on with my life and hopefully get more custody of my son while she gets visitation. I am no longer speaking to her and not going to let her bring me down or rely on her to lift my spirits. If i was in your shoes I would be much happier if it was me spending more time with my children and just forget about her. When she comes home or to her senses due to your lack of attention, Great, if not then it is meant to be.

I wish you all the best and hope everything goes how you want it too.


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## AFEH

Zulu,
Have you tried "believing" what your wife tells you? Sounds like you are denying her her "truth". Which in turn denies the person who she is. She knows you can't "see" her. That's why she wants you to go to counselling with her in the hope she can get someone else to get you to see her.

Take a chance on the counselling, take a risk, if you don't you'll never know what may come out of it, keep an open mind.

If you do find you can believe what she tells you, then the next stage is acceptance of her truth and therefore of who she is.

If you do accept who she is you may become angry and start to dislike her. After that you'll be in the grieving process.

Bob


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## Zulu

Ok... trying to make sense of hat you have siad.... I just need to basically move on or what... that is is no longer who she was and is now a different person.... 

BTW, I liked your comment, because it got me thinking, good or bad, opinions help us to get to a solution. Thanks


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## Zulu

Bit of an update.... we were on Sunday 3 months on... she is still no further or close or what ever. on Wednesday we went to see a new councillor together, at her suggestion, although in the session she did say that it was my idea and she was just comming with, any way, the councillor did tell me that she thinks that my wife is in a place that she wants to end the marriage but also does not want to end it, because of what it is going to do to the children.

Well I decided that we really need to move along and get the divorce, so today we went to the bank and drew our savings out of our mortgage, we both have to sign because it is a joint loan. She suggested we go for coffee afterwards. While we were sitting there, she said she would like to go for a few more sessions with the councillor, because she liked her and she gets to the point, looking for a good foundation, going back in or relationship, till she finds solid ground to work on, and would I mind holding off with doing the filing for divorce for a bit.

Do not know what this means, or if it means anything at all. 

Has anyone else been in the same position... maybe she is getting 2nd thoughts now and is now leaning towards movig back, or reconciling or what ever.. maybe I am just reading too much into nothing.


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## Hopeful38

Just saw your last post which is a month ago, many things must have happened since then. Anyway, people in her position are, just as she says, very undecided and confused as to what to do next and taking a big step such as divorce. Counseling will definitely give both of you a clearer "heads-up view of what may come, and maybe thats why your wife is holding off on the divorce for now. its odd though that she told the counselor she went in because you asked, not because she asked you to, why lie about that?

I was in that situation, going to counseling with her and sometimesit seemed things would work out, other times not. It was a emotional rollercoaster for a year and a half, and ended up divorced anyway. keep faith, don't stop counseling and keep busy, hope everything gets better


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## greeneyeddolphin

I would keep going to counseling with her, if that's what she wants, but I wouldn't get your hopes up that you two will get back together. Although she occasionally seems wishy-washy, for the most part, she does generally seem to stick to a theme of being unhappy with you and wanting to be done with the relationship. 

It's hard to let go, whether you're the one doing the letting go or the one being let go. She's going to feel a lot of the same confusion and doubt that you are. I think if you really want any chance at all of getting her to come home, the best thing to do is to go to counseling and try to get to know her as she is now. Don't ask her anymore to come home, don't pressure her, don't even give her any indication you still want her to come home. A lack of attention from you, a lack of pressure, of desire to see/be with her, may be the only thing that will bring her back.


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## anonymus

I think ur wife still loves u and wants to be with you. She is hoping that u will step up tour act and be the man she fell in love with. From ur posts I note that u r just taking a laid back approach to it...as if she has to take all the necessary steps. Make her feel like number one...she needs her happiness, let her know how much she means to u rather thaa just the fact that u want a reco for the children. That's secondary. Wake up she is suggesting therapy and holding off the divorce for a reason. She doesn't have to move into the house for you to show her all this....find ways even though she is were she is.


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## Zulu

MMm, hear what both sides say.... I have a gut fel that she is still a bit betwixt and between.... any way on the 4th of this month, I wrote her a letter, and gave it to her... then later went to her flat and wanted to give her flowers, she was getting into a taxi, so just followed it, to a guys house where she stayed the night...

anyway, here is the letter, you guys can flame away.... we are going to a joint session next week some time, she may make her intentions clearer then.

My Dearest XXXXXXXX, beautiful wife and mother of our most awesome boys.

Mere words cannot begin to describe the time that we have not been together. The total loneliness. The emptiness of not having my friend and companion with me. It has been absolutely horrible. This home is not a home with out you. You are a big part of the treasure that makes it such a special place. The home is just not the same with out you. It is a mere shell.

Waking up everyday and not seeing you, going to sleep every night not hearing you is terrible. Hearing the tinkle of your laughter, your beautiful voice.

Xxxxxxx, we have both made mistakes, said and done things that has caused pain and tears. You have my offer of my acceptance. You will get my forgiveness. There will also be a need for forgiveness from you.

Using this letter, communicating to you that life is just not the same without you, hardly worth living. Let us be brave. Brave and strong and make the effort to put our family back in our home. Let us continue building on the treasures that we have and can still have together. 

Us being together is a treasure, more valuable than all the riches in the world, it is infinitely valuable, together we can achieve anything. Our little family will be so much stronger for us being together, to build a future together, to live that future and look back and be happy and contented. Happy that we made the choice to want a life together. 

The experience that we will have gained from these circumstances, will let us know, that overcoming this, will make us stronger, wiser. We will be able to stand together and be impervious. Together we will be able to stand and watch our two wonderful creations grow and flourish, and be able to honestly look each other in the eye one day and say, “well done, it was worth it”. Only we can overcome this. Pretty much anything will then pale into insignificance

Only we have the power to make these changes, to chart the future, to sail to new and unexplored destinations, exciting adventures, daunting challenges, plotting a brand new course into the future.

You will not regret it Xxxxxxxx, that is a promise.

All my love


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## Zulu

Well, it is 5 months now, yep, can you believe how the time has gone by. I am still sad and miss her. She seems on her own mission, but maybe one day she will realise that this was all a mistake, or maybe not. Maybe we will get back together and maybe not.

I am actually wondering how I will react if she did want to get back, I am not going to ask her, or should I.... was going to leave that up to her.


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## diane

It seems like she needs space. She misses being alone and doing things for herself. You probably don't have the same issue because you don't seem to understand how she is reasoning. any news about the therapy?


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## BlueEyedBeauty

*HAPPY BIRTHDAY​*
Okay, now about what you, were asking...​It is hard to say, but let me go with what I am feeling from this and also how your wife would be thinking on this point. She, feels bad for what she has done to you, she knows she has been in the wrong and done wrong by cheating on you. Which she has told you this as well, as just the part of her not wanting to divorce you. Which is really good for you.​
She, has also been thinking about your good times​you two have had together throughout the years... She, also feels bad for leaving the boy behind and also walking out on you on top of it. I am going to tell you, this much as well, "Do not move on- she will be back into your life" It may not be tonight but it will be within the next month. She will act odd towards you tonight as well; while you people out as a family. Just be happy you guys are all out together and it will be a good night for you... (Trust me I am right on this-)​


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## Zulu

So, blue eyed beauty, you reckon I must still hang in there a bit longer and just keep doing the "backing off" thing and see where it goes. We have a me and then her and then together with the councillor this week hopefully... see what she says, and even if she says she wants a divorce, SHE must get it going and I will still wait or what....


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## Zulu

Ok, so bit more info. On the 11th we have a joint with the councillor and so should get some more clarity there, she wants to talk about finances and the children. Also, the last few days she has been e-mailing me and making arrangements for the children etc.. picking up and dropping off etc.... 2 children that need to be in 2 different places at the same time on Saturday... she also came by the house this morning and let my youngest come in to get his cricket bat. She did call from outside, something which she never normally did. She also starts her text messages with "Hi" and ends with "S"... as in her mails... I am just wondering if this is not some kind of realisation she has had, or just her trying to be amicable, or testing the water for a recon... or if she just wants to be friends.

Those that have been in this situation before, is this a pattern or am I just hyper sensitive. I have in the last 2 months not initiated contact by either text or e-mail or calling her. We have had 2 occassions of my son's birthday that we were all together but I was cool, and not trying to get her back or what ever... just being "backed off". 

I know this is a hard one because each case on it's merits and each person is different... but don't be afraid to post your opinion.


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## Zulu

MMM, OK, so today is the 11th, and the day we are having a joint with the councillor, I am dreading it, because I was at the councillor as was she, last week and the councillor told me that she is coming to a decision. Dreading it, like someone who is innocent of a crime, but has a bad defence attorney... going back into the court room to hear the verdict of the jury....

Just some background. In Saturday, my son had a dance show. The little dance school that he attends lessons at, was showcasing the work that the students do. He had a rehersal at 12:00 which his mother said she will take him to. Then they had another rehersal at 16:30 and the show at 18:30. She also wanted to take him to the second rehersal. Anyway, so it came to show time, she had bought tickets for herself, me and my youngest son... so we watched the show and it was fantastic, was so nice to actually sit next to her, all be it with my youngest son between us. Anyway, at the interval, she went to help serve tea and coffe. I cannot tell you how nice it looked to see her there doing that... it was BEAUTIFUL. Anyway, so then the 2nd half of the show and then afterwards she had to help wash up the cups etc. 

Then my oldest announces that he wants his mom to take him home, to which I agree, no problem...(her flat is pretty much right next to the location where the show was) and so me and my youngest go home together.

She and my oldest apparently had a chat and he said some nasty things to her, about hating her and the such like, do not know exactly what, but he came in fuming and she drove away from the house like an Indy Car at the drop of the flag...

Oh boy, so dreading this afternoon, but will know then, either way... what will be what. I know I still love her dearly.. have been backed off from her for 2 months now, with Saturday being the first time in 3 weeks that I have actually seen her face to face. We only communivcate via Cell phone Texting and e-mail...

I am hoping an praying that she will make a decision FOR US, for us to be together as a family, but also know, that if she does not, and wants to get a divorce, that I have pretty much done all I could to try and make things happen. She said she wanted space, I gave her space, she said I must back off, I did, I had to keep body and soul together in a very difficult time, had to look after and manage the house of which she is a 50% owner, had to manage my oldest 100% of the time and the youngest 4 out of 7 days a week... so, I will know that by God's grace, I have done what I could in the situation and if she does decide to end it, it will be her decision. I have decided that for me there will be only one option, and that is to get together and make our situation work. Divorce for me is not an option. If she wants a divorce, she will have to do it...

Well, it is now 09:00 here in A wet and Rainy Cape Town, 8 and a half hours till I enter the "court room".. I know I have God on my side, and feel that the strength I had and needed to get me this far could not have had a source anywhere else. My friends have told me, that they cannot believe I have held out so long, with out resorting to alcohol or medication.

Well, wish me all the best.. I will post later today, after the meeting as to what transpired... I pray that God will help her make a decision to return home.


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## Zulu

It is over and done, she wants to end the marriage. So well, there you have it. She cannot bear to be in the same room as me, she does not even like being near me.


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## Zulu

Oh well, now it is the 1st of November and she has moved into her appartment, 6 months out of the house. This is her second appartment and now she wants us to sell the house, that I am living in. I cannot afford the mortgage alone and nor can she. Any way, my youngest is still going to her Sunday and Monday and Tuesday night. My oldest, who will turn 16 in December, has after much encouragement from me, decided to go to her tonight, and hope that he may want to go more. It is just him putting out his anger towards her. Trying to talk to him about it.

He really has bad feelings for her and well, according to the councillor, this is pretty much normal. The thing is, she is expecting me, who is still at home with him, to do the whole build up job on him.

I suppose I have not given up hope, although the chances that something may happen is slim. I actually spoke to her last night on the phone, and we spoke about all kinds of things, but as soon as I want to talk about "us" she doesn't want to talk. I did ask her if she is seeing someone at the moment but got the standard negative reply.

I just feel that I am still quite invested in her and really would like to have her back, why... well don't know what is driving me to do this, I know I still love her but just cannot move on with things. Still hoping that she will come out of her "fog"...

Is it worth it, or should I move on and get the love I deserve? I have been praying that we get back together, so, I wait.


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## Zulu

atruckersgirl said:


> Don't ask her anymore to come home, don't pressure her, don't even give her any indication you still want her to come home. A lack of attention from you, a lack of pressure, of desire to see/be with her, may be the only thing that will bring her back.


Just an up date...

Ok, things are pretty much the same, she has been in appartment 2 for almost a month now. My youngest still goes to her as normal Sun Mon and Tuesday. My oldest who did not want to go to her, now kind of uses her place as a dos house, because his girlfriend literally live accross the road. Sure this was a definite plus when she took the appartment, knowing he would not be able to resist the convenience of being close to his girl friend.

OK, so Friday night and saturday night the oldest was by her. The youngest was by me. Anyway she comes home on a Sunday afternoon to collect the youngest and she normally comes into the house to pack his bags and then they go. This Sunday(yesterday), I packed his bags, or at least helped him to pack them and he met her by the gate, I didn't even go and say hello, which I didn't do anyway... but then they left and well that was me on my own.

I still have this very strong gut feel that she is going to want to get together, still no divorce papers. The councillor says to me, "what is the difference between now, being separated and her "****ing around" to actually being divorced."

Suppose she does have a point, but I am still a bit sad and miss her and sleep lonely, but the raw pain is not there anymore, just the dull aches for her. Someone asked me what I would do if she wants to come back, and I said that will have to wait for an answer when the question comes, if it ever comes.

I am not over her and probably defintely not ready to move on... and find someone else... suppose that will eventually come but for the time being I am just "BE ING", as my councillor told me to do. Get on with your own life, go out and have fun etc.

The councillor tells me I will feel like this for a long time, like on a plateau.... but will meet someone and it will go away, like I posted in a nother thread, just for a while will feel good. 

That woman that I met was a bit of a crazy, and so let her know I am not interested. Councillor says that eventually I WILL meet someone and those "crazy" feelings will not be there and I will just feel comfortable and happy and not have those "red flag" alerts and it will go from there.... whatever... wonder if it is like that. She also told me that it will take a while, at least a year... so must not expect too much... 

Anyway, that is just an update on my situation.

(still hopeful)


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## Zulu

My take on this is strange, she said she wanted to be out of the marriage and wanted space, bust she is hooking up with guys, she does not want sex with me, and says that all I wanted was sex, but yet she has sex with strangers, or meet a guy for drinks and a few days later sleep with him. She wanted to be free, but gets into new relationships, wants to be alone. AWAY from ME, but with other guys. She wants to see the boys, but not too much...

What is going on with this woman, is this normal. Is this midlife crisis. 

Am I going to get on with things and as soon as I am settled, gonna be faced with a decision, facing a tearfull and sorry woman.

Is this a trend, has any one expirienced this, am I being a fool waiting to start the divorce?

I JUST DO NOT KNOW.... WHAT EVER.... CLEVER PEOPLE GIVE ME SOME INPUT HERE PLEASE. Those that have walked this road... I am on a rollercoaster ride.....


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## F-102

I don't advocate divorce, but here, I may. Get yourself a good lawyer and start making a battle plan.


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## Zulu

Ok, so a few days down the line and I get this e-mail from my councillor, she ould not explain more even though I asked, going to see her in 2 hours...

Hi there,

I hope that you are well. I had a session with Sxxxxxx this morning, she is Ok with me discussing it with you. She has talked about the current situation, and how and where she feels she needs to go.

There were some interesting facts that came out of the session and possibilities. I don't know if you want to see me or not, but there were a few interesting points that may be of benefit to you going forward, essentially she feels that you and she need to talk, but I can help you if you want with the ideas and proposals that she has, in fact, it may be a very good turn for you, not quite sure.

Let me know how you feel, no pressure from my side, but if you do want to see me I do have a slot at 3.30 today if you want it, just let me know.


Will post an update later... mmm, wel it can be one of 2 things, ha ha, yep... either she wants a divorce or she wants to come home.....


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## Zulu

It is divorce, she has come with an offer and wants to get things moving, oh well...


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## F-102

Sorry bud, I know you tried.


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## Zulu

So now we go ahead, at the councillor yesterday, I was there alone, the lady told me that there is someone she is seeing and well, while she is in this "stage", there is pretty much nothing I can do, the "in love" stage... so would be best for me to get on with it, not be difficult, because it will only hamper my recovery and cause me more pain than I already have.

Well, suppose this thread should now be moved to the going through divorce.


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## Zulu

Bit of a move on, we have had the realtors in and the house is now officially on the market. Time to pack and chuck all the clutter out and well, start looking for a new nest.


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## geo

hopefully a new location will be a sort of blessing for you. you have been through the ringer and deserve some peace in your life. I hope that the move will help you heal enough to find some happiness in your life, wish you good luck in your future !


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## Zulu

Thanks. It is officially or what ever, seven months, it is hard not to remember that the date she left was the 8th of the month, NOT that I am counting, but will sort of always be a date that sticks in my mind, just like the date we met and the rest of the dates that we had in our life together....


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## Zulu

Hi all you all on TAM, hope those that celebrate Christmas had a wonderful time, of peace and goodwill, and didn't over eat or overspend.

Oh well, Christmas has come and gone, my first Christmas "alone"... My boys went with her on Christmas day to her parents, sent a gift with them, just something small. My youngest gave her a coffee mug, my oldest a coffee plunger and I gave her the coffee. She never said thanks or even acknowledges the gift.. but the record will show, I gave it to her.

I am now going away for a few days to the sea, to do a spot of fishing and may just get lucky and catch one of them fish, that everyone is saying the sea is full of... yeah right. Go and google GANSBAAI, pretty much at the Southern tip of Africa, beautiful holiday place.... if you ever come to Sunny South Africa, will let you stay in our house there, kind of a very basic house, with no frills, has clean beds, warm water and well, when you walk in, you feel like you are on holiday.

I am still hurting terribly, and it really pains me to have to talk to her at all, she is so far away, with someone else and cannot even imagine that she will ever seek a reconciliation, but suppose that is how it is meant to be. 

I still pray for it, and hope that it will happen, but don't know... my oldest son who was totally against her, is now staying by her, so, well, suppose that was also meant to be. NOTHING more I can do....

Well, will try and hook into my mobile and take a look at the site now and then, and hopefully post a pic of a fish, a real one mind you, the swimmy smelly kind!!!!


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## MsLonely

Zulu said:


> Hi All. I am married for almost 16 years and have 2 boys, 16 and 10. My wife left 38 days ago to go live in a flat. She has the means to support herself etc and I was left in the house with the 2 boys. She told me that she does not love me, and has no feelings for me. She also said she performed oral on a guy and had a one night stand with another. We still communicate etc, and she has the boys on Sunday and Monday nights.
> 
> I am not so sure about the incidents she told me, but may be in denial that my wife would do such a thing. She is 44 and I am 43.
> 
> Well, like I said we do still communicate and I am not ready to divorce and she has said nor is she. The boys are not happy with all that is going on around them, I have tried as much as I can to explain to them that mommy still loves them etc etc etc, but they want to know, then why did she leave and leave them behind... no disrespect to me.... but any way... Tomorrow is my birthday and she has suggested that we all go see a movie and have a lunch together...
> 
> Either she is trying to get the message accross that she may want back in, OR, she is just trying to show the boys that she still loves them and has some lttle respect for their father on his birthday and that is why she is trying to do this.
> 
> I am pretty much 100% sure that there is no one else in her life..., well... as sure as I can be...
> 
> To the esteemed on this board, what should I do. Have been going out etc and having friends over and BBQs at my house etc for World Cup Football games and generally having a good time. Will be going on a week long fishing trip on the 27th with my boys etc...
> 
> Should I wait around, or should I move on, is this signs from her side that maybe living on your own in a flat is not as good as it is cut out to be, and maybe the family life wasn't so bad after all, and maybe in her solitude, has discovered that maybe she does still have feelings for me.... Heaven knows, still have very strong feelings for her... and she darn well knows it...
> 
> Someone, please hit me with a stick



Open marriage can be a solution? If I discover my husband cheats again, this is what I'm going to propose because we both love each other as a family but if the connection & chemistry can't be found back & then affair is likely to occur again. 

My next step would be an open marriage. I don't want my marriage to be bugged by affairs, either his or mine.

I love him, so he doesn't have to stay in the jail of marriage. He can still enjoy love, passion & chemistry when he needs to. 

Under this thing, the OW should be informed that it's just a discreet relationship, vice & versa.

We're married couple & we can set the rules.


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## MsLonely

I don't know how to hit you with a stick. 

You can try to work on your marriage especially the sparks & connection things with your wife & see if she would fall back in love with you. 

You need her participation as well. You can't work on marriage by yourself.

Communication is the key. She must have the same target with you. She must be informed, understood, and willing to work on the marriage with you. Only heaven knows you love her madly isn't enough. God won't tell her for you. You have to open your mouth & tell her how much she's desired and how you drool on her. Show her that you are so aroused for her only. 

Women love to feel loved & desired. You need to show her & most importantly, she needs to show you love back.


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## Zulu

Well, today was 8 months that she has left, I saw her last on Christmas day 2010. She wants to come to the house tomorrow and get the last of her stuff, including her wedding dress, which is still in the cupboard, and some paper work. She said she wants to tidy up the boys rooms, so that they start the year with nice tidy rooms, and that when the estate agents come through, the rooms are nice and tidy. I have been battling with this, weather to tell her that it is not needed for her to come in and do it, I can do it myself, BUT, have not told her that she cannot. She did say that she would like me away from the house when she does it.

Communication has been logistics only, and she has said nothing more about divorce or anything, and I have not said anything either. 

So, will see what tomorrow brings, I do not really think that she wants to come back, but whatever, it has been a long time now.

The hurt has gone away a bit but suppose after tomorrow, whaen she has taken the last of her stuff, it will hurt like mad, to know tha tshe has now finally gone. Suppose she will take her Piano and all the music ahe used to play that I always had pleasure listening to, oww, just thinking about it makes me a bit sad.

I miss her, but suppose with time, I will probably find someone new and be happy again, and once the house is sold, be able to move on. I still pray and ask God to afford me a miracle, nd let her have a change of heart, hope he is listening to me. 

No idea what I will do if she wanted to come back, a lot of water has gone under the bridge. But then, if you pray for something, and you get it, you must take it I suppose, because then what is the point of praying.


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## Zulu

Oh well, she came, took most of her stuff, including her wedding dress that was hanging in the cupboard.

I left a framed 6x9 on the dresser, of our little family, with a copy of Fireproof(The Love Dare) and our 2 wedding rings on top of it, for her, she took all the other stuff, but left my wedding ring in the drawer of the dresser, suppose I know where this is going, but yeah, a token gesture to her, but don't think she really gives a toss anymore, and just wants to get on with her life... Who knows, maybe she reads the book, maybe she has already chucked it in the trash.

Oh well, suppose I must get on with mine, just sad that I have been given the hard sharp end of the stick, having to live in the house till it is sold, and having to have to pack the house up etc while she has had her freedom, but yeah, Hope Karma is kind to her one day.


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## Zulu

So, another 2 weeks have passed... and Saturday past, my son was mugged. He walked from his Girl friend's house, which is accross the road from his mother, the 75 metres he had to walk, got held up by a guy with a knife, and demanded his phone and wallet. I have told him that in this instance, just give the dam thing, it is only a phone. Insurance will get you another on, but insurance will not get me another son. Well he gave it up.

So, small thing, but what ever, such type of things would not have been happening had he not had to walk to her.

Ok.... la di daa, seeing as she has made no indication that she is comming to her senses, have met a nice lady, and I can tell you what, it feels really nice, to get the text message etc during the day, nothing hectic, just "hey hello, how is your day going?"... so nice.


Anyway, on and on we go, stronger and stronger each day!!!


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## Zulu

Ok, this is becoming a journal, and maybe someone is reading it following my progress and pain. Meeting someone, they are great, but just can't get that"chemistry" feeling, when you meet someone you like, but just like, NO spark so to speak.... just feels like you have met someone new at work, and well you get along and can chat about anything under the sun, but just can't see myself in a relationship. That type of "no chemistry" feeling....

Is this normal, or does it indicate that I am still not over "her" and need more time...

It feels good to get the texts and so, but suppose deep down I wish they came from my "wife"(in quotation marks because I am not sure what the hell she is....)


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## Powerbane

Zulu - it's going to take some time to heal. 

Give it time and keep doing the dating thing. It will feel awkward at first but then you'll get back in the swing of it. 

With the knowledge you've gained from this experience - you definitely came out a better man for it.


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## breathe

Zulu said:


> have met a nice lady, and I can tell you what, it feels really nice, to get the text message etc during the day, nothing hectic, just "hey hello, how is your day going?"... so nice.


when a new special someone treats you good, that feels great


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## Freak On a Leash

Zulu said:


> Ok, this is becoming a journal, and maybe someone is reading it following my progress and pain. Meeting someone, they are great, but just can't get that"chemistry" feeling, when you meet someone you like, but just like, NO spark so to speak.... just feels like you have met someone new at work, and well you get along and can chat about anything under the sun, but just can't see myself in a relationship. That type of "no chemistry" feeling....
> 
> Is this normal, or does it indicate that I am still not over "her" and need more time...
> 
> It feels good to get the texts and so, but suppose deep down I wish they came from my "wife"(in quotation marks because I am not sure what the hell she is....)


This tells me you aren't ready to date someone else. IMO it's not fair to date someone else when you are still thinking and yearning for your wife. It's not fair to you OR the person you are dating. 

Have you formally divorced yet? Seems like she just moved out a few weeks ago and now you are dating?  A lot of people encourage going out and meeting someone else ASAP but I'm of the opposite mindset. I think you need to settle yourself and live your own life and REALLY get over your marriage before dating. Dating another person to get over your marriage isn't the way to go. Dating once you ARE over your marriage is the way to go. 

Just my .02. I'd hold off on the dating. Go get a hobby and have some fun on your own first.


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## Zulu

OK, so bit of an update, Nine months now.... Also, the house is now under offer, well it is already accpted, so pretty much has been sold. So things will move along from here now, we are not divorced yet, so we will just split the cash and suppose she will use it to file for divorce. I said, If you want a divorce, you do it...

As far as the dating is concerned, Oh my goodness, I think Quantum Physics will be a doddle compared to dating.... the people are complicated. Go out and meet, almost the first thing they talk about is sex, ok, so just to let you know, I do not have sex on a first date...(what they say)... um ok, that is fine, I don't think I remember asking for it, but well, now you have told me,,, good grief, these 40 something women in South Africa have serious hangups about sex.... They first want to be friends and then see where it goes... red flag red flag red flag that is cool, then be friends first, but don't tell me that...

My opinion is, ok, so now you have told me, why did you think it needed to be said, before I have even made a move on you, you are very presumptious to think that I was even thinking about sleeping with you... or is it a case of "me thinks the lady doth protest tooo much"


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## Zulu

Ok, so both buyer and sellers(us) have accepted the offer and so the house is officially sold, I need to be out by the 1st of May(ha ha.... when I was small, and Christmas trees were tall.......now I am tall and Christmas trees are small) so, got to find a new place and get packed, because 2 and a half months pass very quickly....

And obviously NO indication of that she ever wants back, so she is on her way....


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## Zulu

Ok, so update and advice request time... from the esteemed on the board here.

It has now been 10 months that she has been out of the house and 13 months that we have actually not been "husband and wife".

Yesterday was the 8th, the day she left all those months ago, any hat, I sent her a mail, first one in a long time, like months....

Hi Xxxxxxx, Please come home and let us sort our problems out. Nobody is happy and we are all going to be losers in the game. You have a treasure at Home. Xxxxxxxx"

She is going to her mother's birthday "party" on a wine estate this Sunday and she wanted to take the 2 boys with her,,, which she did ask me about, and I said it was fine.

So today, sort of out of the blue, I get this from her, I might add, nevr had a mail like this for a long time.... and it is a bit confusing....
-------------------------------------------------------------
Hi,

I think this may be a bit out of the blue, but was wondering, do you want to come with on Sunday? I have not yet asked my mother, because they have already booked, but if she agrees...
Don't want you to see this as a sign, but maybe we should talk, Maybe with Janet(MC) when/if there is money? Will you be prepared to do this?

S
-------------------------------------------------------------
Now this is the first communication of this kind that I have had in a long time, so I am naturally Bunny in the headlights..... I know she is taking strain financially, and I know that she has seen my profile on an internet dating site, because I never hid my pics and just went on like I was "getting some" and all that... I have subsequently found out that a girl I am getting to know quite well, has a friend... who is also very good friends with my wife.... now I am not sure if this is a set up, but do not think so, but you know how woman are, THEY TALK!!!!

So... give me some options here, because I am all optioned out... (I will pay airfares if you feel all that I need is a serious beating on my head till it functions properly again, or if you just want to come and slap me VERY HARD with a big stick):rofl::iagree:


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## Zulu

Ok, so had this text from my councillor, after I forwarded the mail to her, to try and make sense of it...

"I have had the most UNEXPECTED e-mail from her, can I see you tomorrow. Suggest you avoid conversation until after we meet. A lot is happening and I need to know where you stand."

So I guess that tomorrow at 2 I will know what has been happening in the back ground. Pray for me.:scratchhead:


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## rome2012

Zulu said:


> Ok, so had this text from my councillor, after I forwarded the mail to her, to try and make sense of it...
> 
> "I have had the most UNEXPECTED e-mail from her, can I see you tomorrow. Suggest you avoid conversation until after we meet. A lot is happening and I need to know where you stand."
> 
> So I guess that tomorrow at 2 I will know what has been happening in the back ground. Pray for me.:scratchhead:


Wow....that's like a crime novel.....

I don't have any advice, but I can't wait to hear more !!!!!!!!

Good luck !!!!!!


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## Powerbane

Prayer Warriors at the Ready Sir!

Prayers Locked & Loaded!!!

Fire, Fire, Fire!!!

Prayers on the way!!!


Hope all turns out better Zulu.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Zulu

The MC texted me this morning and had a 09:30 cancellation... so I went and saw her, seems wifey has had a bit of a wind blowing about her and has somehow managed to remove the "fog" and is realising that life is not so happy on the "outside" and is hoping that I will be prepared to accept her back.

Well, that is what the MC is picking up from her communications with her, the MC will be seeing her at 14:00 this afternoon, to hear exactly what she is on about.

Life "out there" is apparently not as good as the fantasy that she has been sold, and the safety of being part of a family far outweighs the randomness of being on your own.

Well, we will see.... God will give me the wisdom to make the right decision, should the question arise.... HEEEEEELP!!!!


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## F-102

This is gettin' good!


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## Zulu

Ok.... so... the MC said to me that her primary function is to help people... and she gave me some advice....

On this coming Sunday, my mother in law(I AM after all still married) is having her birthday as I posted before... the MC reckons I should go... but be just a bit "at arms length" and not pay her tooo much attention, as much as I actually want to take her in my arms(SLAP SLAP SLAP meee!!!!!)

She is not doing great, and really misses the family life, the house etc... we have a huge family and there is always something going on, someone having a birthday or this or that or a get to gether at someone's house and the rest... she never had this in her family and was apparently one of the things she really liked.

Also, went camping last year and my sister and her husband were with and took lots of pics and put them on FaceBook a week ago, and she saw them obviously, and realised that she is missing out on the life of her children and what they are doing and not being with them.

I also posted on my status updates the last few weeks that are very cryptic, and could mean that I am seeing someone, or interested in someone.....(why would anyone be interested in him, he is so boring.... or...... maybe he isn't????)

She has apparently seen me a few time, when I never saw her... Cape Town is very small.... and apparently am looking not toooo shabby at all.... so.....

Let us see how this unfolds and where it goes...


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## Zulu

F-102 said:


> This is gettin' good!


It is, isn't it.....


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## anx

> I also posted on my status updates the last few weeks that are very cryptic, and could mean that I am seeing someone, or interested in someone.


 I would not do this. Don't play mind games please.

Things seem to be looking up. Good luck.


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## Zulu

Well, today is Sunday, and well, the big day... off to church in a bit and then the big big big meeting with the whole (ex)Familyinlaw... lets us see how it goes.... I pray that I have the widom to say the right things and not the wrong things... The place we are going is called Welgelegen Wine Farm(google it), a more beautiful place to start something you cannot get. 

She has actually asked that I drop by and that we drive through together... so, she still trusts that I will drive safely and not try and wipe us all out, BUT, the thing is that I know I have moved along somewhat, and not needy as a I may have been when she left... suppose that would have been me working through my pain...

I would like a reconciliation, but actually.... you know what, if it doesn't happen, I will know in my heart, that I have done everything I could, everything that is humany possible and will be able to go in peace...

So fellow people, think of me, and know that somewhere in this world of ours, although we are on a different continent, separated by oceans, we all have similar concerns, troubles and worries ans wish for the happiness that all people wish for in this world...


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## denise1218

Wow!!! I just read all of your posts!!! Sounds exactly like what I am going thru. My husband of 17 years moved out 12/28/2010. He is the one that left. I want nothing more than to reconcile. I know everyone says to get on with your life.....but that is a bitter pilll to swallow. I cannot wait to hear how your day went yesterday.....hope it was/is everything you have been wanting. I, too refuse to give up....move on...yes....but give up.....not yet!!! Your story def. gives me inspiration.


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## Zulu

Ok, so the lunch went off with out a hitch, we did not sit next to each other, I gave a glance in her direction now and then and found her looking at me. I went and had a smoke away from the table, the tables were in a forrest, and as soon as I had stepped away, her dad came and had a chat to me and he said that she is soooo unhappy, she is lonely and misses me and the children, as well as the Family. Her father said that she feels she has made a mistake and wonders how to go about setting things right. I told him she must come and talk to me and we can go to the MC and plot a way forward, but this will need to happen, because in 13 months, I have moved along and am not the same person that she really left.

Last night I had a call from her brother(Me and him have spoken all the time, she has not spoken to him, because he told her from the beginning that what she was doing was wrong), he tells me, that my wife spoke to gher sister to talk to the brother to find out if I will take her back. He said he cannot speak for me, but it would not suprise him, if I did not take her back, but would not suprise him if I did, it is all about what she is prepared to do to let me trust her again.

She did after all say that she does not love me, she is not in love with me, she has no feeling for me, she is not a one man woman, she cannot commit herself to me, she cannot see herself spending the next 20 years with me, she does not even like me... she does not want to be married to me anymore, she does not want tobe married to anyone, she wants to be free to da as she pleases and not be in a box, of wife, mother, lover etc, she wants to be in control and not have to answer toanyone.

Well, her father called me today and said again to me that she misses me, and the family and everything that she lost, that she is very lonely and admits she has made a mistake... and may want to try and put the pieces together again.

She came and collected our youngest tonight and I went out to her by the car, and had a quick chat and asked her how she is doing and she said not good, she is very stressed at work and I said well, sorry to hear that, I did touch her on her arm between her wrist and her elbow, and said I hope it all works out for her and then went back inside....

So, well tomorrow I have an appointment with the MC at 0800(gmt +1), so most of you will still be asleep.... and suppose have to decide if this is really what I want or have I moved along to much... I really fell sorry for her, but that is so ironic, she did not feel sorry for me when she was out and about with who ever she was out and about with.

Am I asking too much of myself to be able to reconcile, am I taking on too much of a task to be able to trust her again... or must I take the chance, will it be better or will it be worse... am I stupid to even try, because she will probably do it again, she will be 45 in April.

I must say she is looking a bit the worse for wear... think she is under tremendous stress, but she has brought it upon herself, and hoping I will beg her to take her back like I stopped doing months ago, must I wait until she comes and says she wants to try again, must I stay backed off....


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## anx

I would reconcile and make it work. 

Trust does take a long time to rebuild. Say that want to take it slow.

People make stupid choices when hurt and stressed. If you are willing, take your wife back and build a great life together.

People do seriously change. I changed.

If I were you, I would call her and tell her you want to make it work, but need her to commit to MC.


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## eagleclaw

if you want to reconcile that is fine - but yes, I think you have to show strength and wait for her to come to you, and for her to convice you WHY you should put your faith in her and HOW she is going to enrich your life.

Because, if you don't do that - and you make it too easy for her you loose any respect that she has gained for you and she will realize that no matter what she does, or no matter what she says, or no matter how long she leaves you will be a doormat and take her back at a moments notice.

That is not a message you want to convey to her at his point. She needs to bring her A-game and woo you now.


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## Zulu

She wants back, must I play HTG and make her sweat a bit.... seems so much not like me, probably what got me in this mess in the 1st place.....


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## eagleclaw

I believe she needs to realize there is a consequence for these types of actions, and a very real possibility of losing her safety net. Without healthy fear of ones actions, there is no deterrent to repeating the same mistakes. I doubt you want to risk going through this again... plus I wouldn't even entertain it unless she showed REAL regret and remorse over her actions. Have you found out if she indeed DID perform oral on someone else? I think I would want to know this and her willingness to to be open and transparent regarding this.


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## Zulu

Well she has not said it to my face, that she wants to come back, her father told me. Was at the MC today and she said she believes that wife is genuine but she has always had a problem expressing herself, and that maybe she now doesn't know how to go about it, and is maybe waiting for me to make the first move, and then she will make a move.... as for having sex with someone else before she left 100% sure... am 100% certain that she has had sex with someone else, after she left... as well....

I actually do not know if I should invite her somewhere and then talk, but sure as sherlock, I want her to come clean with me, else I will not be interested in anything she has to say.


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## eagleclaw

IMO - her waiting for you to fix this is not appropriate. If she indeed wants to reconcile then it's on her to step out on the ledge. She put you guys where you are now, and I wouldn't bail her out and do the heavy lifting for her. If she can't even take that small step....... what can you expect from her going forward?

Also, part of the appeal of an affair is the newness, the challange of pursuing, the unknown. Your best move is to provide those things. Don't be predictable and a pushover. Make her work for it, be a challange and if you indeed want this, make it a challenge and a mystery how it's going to play out. And act differently then you would have in the past. Be mysterious and unpredictable. And take charge and keep it. But she needs to come after you........ it's the least she can do.

Did you also date and become intimate? She should know that she has competition now (not suggesting you need to sleep with anyone) . I know that sounds counter intuitive but she created this situation - and should realize that the possibility exists that you have other interests as well.


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## eagleclaw

I would assume her father is relaying anything you say back to her. 

I would be inclined to use this to your advantage.

As in, the next time he tells you she wants to get back together I would tell him that you have seen nothing from her that would support that and you don't get that feeling. And your not even sure, given what she has done that you want that but your not discounting the possiblity either (leaving the door open) but that if she did indeed want to reconcile then it would be on her to come out and tell you that and to make the effort to convince you that she was sure, dedicated, remorseful, committed, and willing to put in the effort required to repair this. (and anything else that is a requirment on your part).

That way you are putting the ball in her court (where it rightfully should be) , and providing her an instruction manual on what is required by you, to even entertain this.

This is your CHANCE to set the bar for what you need/require/boundries in the marriage and from this point to defend religously.


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## F-102

Just tell dad that if she wants to know if reconciliation is an option, she has to talk to YOU, that you don't take "second-hand makeups".


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## Zulu

Oh what a glorius JOKE, called her and asked her a direct question, do you want to come home/make a go of it/ try again.... well, direct question got a direct answwer.... NO. Why would she do this type of thing... was she just fishing to see if she still had power over me.... or was it to say well I really do not know...


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## Powerbane

Zulu said:


> Oh what a glorius JOKE, called her and asked her a direct question, do you want to come home/make a go of it/ try again.... well, direct question got a direct answwer.... NO. Why would she do this type of thing... was she just fishing to see if she still had power over me.... or was it to say well I really do not know...


Let's just hope it's that she really doesn't know. Phone was not the best way to ask. It would have been better in person.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## eagleclaw

Now you should push along at suggesting you make the seperation more permanent and get the divorce process moving. She will either be suprised and backpeddle or welcome it. Either way, puts you in better position.


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## eagleclaw

And to answer your original question more directly:

_Should I be happy or is she just trying to be nice_

Yes, you should be happy! - Regardless of whether she is nice or not! Don't give her the power to control you!


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## Zulu

eagleclaw said:


> Now you should push along at suggesting you make the seperation more permanent and get the divorce process moving. She will either be suprised and backpeddle or welcome it. Either way, puts you in better position.


In the call I had with her yesterday afternoon, I said to her, I want and answer from you, I have waited long enough and want to get on with my life. If you do not call me tonight to tel me otherwise, I am going ahead, I have to make a call. 

OK so I pushed her, and I know she does not react well under pressure, but this was time, I have waited long enough, and also sent her an e-mail just before I left work, and said... IT IS YOUR CALL.

Well at about 22:00 last night she called and we had a good long chat over the phone and I was alluding to the fact that I am now going to go ahead with the divorce and want to get on with my life. I told her I am on a dating site and am quite overwhelmed with the attention I have been getting and if she is not going to make a move now, I will, and also told her that once I have made my move, that will be it... there will be no turning back.

So.... this morning I get a text message.... OK, here are my thoughts for now. I don't think divorce is the right option for us. We have to try everything before we go that route. I am just terrified of trying again. so many potential stuff ups and I am a complicated loner sort of person! Which is not easy. I also cannot just jump into your arms.So so difficult for Me!. Small small steps. Why don't we start with one small thing today?You come and have coffee at a place close to me, and we can chat a bit. I also want to see (our son) ride. Maybe we can fetch him Together? 

Ok, so my small son went for his hour horse riding session this morning and we met at the stable, they have a coffee shop/deli there and we chatted. She cried a bit and said that she is not going to get anything different from what she had with me, there are the irritations of the domestic issues at home, the grind of daily life and so on, she tried to escape all of this and realised that it is something that she actually misses. She saiys she has found that dating is a nightmare... She did say how ever that she cannot right now say that she loves me and she wants to come back home.... we spoke about so many things... and well suppose this is a possible start of a reconciliation. She did cry when she said that she does not think divorce is the right option and she thinks it is just wrong... and think she has dificulty expressing herself... 

Well suppose she did make the call that I asked her to, because I think she realised that this is it, he is going to be gone for good now and well if you really want to have something with him, you had better get your act together and do something...

I did try and flirt a bit with her, but find it so hard to do, where as with any other woman, it is easy, but managed a bit, and did get her laughing... so suppose this is the start of something....

So now the journal changes again... and well, let us see where this ends up.... seems the brakes has been put on getting divorced, which is a good thing I think.:smthumbup::scratchhead:


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## eagleclaw

Heres how I see it:

I would say it was not negative, but barely positive. You see you forced her hand which you needed to do. But she didn't really respond whole heartedly. I would appear that she realize her "safety net" might move on. And with the prospect of having you possibly date and find someone else, or proceed with the divorce she stood to lose something.

But she didn't really become remorseful or buck right up, she only said enough to try and stall you. She can't come back, can't say she loves you, not sure what she wants next, just doesn't want you to proceed or date. 

I think you want to be careful of letting her string you along. At some point you need to take charge, decide exactly what you need from her in this relationship and set your boundries. You can't continue being her safety net while allowing her the room to date others and have sex on the side. Nor do you want to be the chocie of last resort. Man up, put some pressure on her and see what she does. You can't play this soft.


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## Zulu

Thing is, I am now in this position and have NOOO idea how to proceed now.


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## Zulu

OK, update, sure there are going to be many of these updates... she has asked what we do now days on a Sunday afternoon... I said we normally go to the beach, just me and my Oldest son, because the youngest is normally with her then.... well she said if it is OK with me, she would really like to come with us to the beach, all four of us.... so.... well, it came from her... and she made the call and the effort... hope this is going somewhere.... keep up the hope and prayers...


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## F-102

She may very well want to R, but she doesn't want to be perceived as the "weak" one in this.


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## Zulu

OK, so we had a chat earlier, and she says she does not feel enough for me, she has not said she wants to come home, etc etc.... well, I told her, she has till 20:00(GMT +2) tonight to make her decision, or else it is final, I am sick of her crap. She did respond to my ultimatum on Friday night, so HOPE she responds to the one now... else I am done... I cannot just let her come and give me this sudden hope and keep me on a string etc, no, will not.

I really still love her, and want to work with her, but if this is how she is going to treat the situation, I am not interested.. I have waited so long and done so much on myself, and now she comes and just wants to fish as to what my situation is. NO.


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## Zulu

Ha, nope, she says we need to go ahead, she does not feeel enough for me to try again, all she was doing was to try and see if she feels enough to try again, HUH, whet the hell.... you don't stuff people around like that... you want to see if you feel enough, but you don't say that and you come along AS IF you want to try again, get me all happy and then stab me in the heart again....


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## eagleclaw

You need to take the intitiative now and remove her safety net. Start the process along and cool right off on her. If you don't have and Official seperation in writing get one and serve her the papers. The only way this changes direction now is if she she comes to you remoreseful and tried to convince you how she has made a terrible mistake and tries to convince you how she can enrich your life.

Additionally, you need to "appear" to be moving on and dating yourself. She needs to see a very real consequence for her actions and realize what the current path leads to. 

No guarantee it fixes your situation but it is your best shot.

She has left, she has strayed and she has stifled any reconnection. Your only hope at this point is to turn things completely around so that IF she has any burried feeling in there still that she sees you moving on and hopefully it is now her worrying about what your up to and possibly changing her mind. If she doesn't, your well on your way regardless.


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## Zulu

OK, had some communication with her sister today, just vis text message and told her I am disappointed in her family, they were prepared to help their daughter/sister but when the son-in-law cam and asked them, they did nothing, and they knew what was going on... well she had to bring the little one home tonight and so she parked out side, he needed to get stuff for a school camp he is going on, and when I arrived, I did not even greet her and just went in, why should I greet my enemies... or people that feel nothing for me, will see how it pans out, going to file and get on with it, what is the point, I will always have strong feelings for her, but what can I do... she has little to none for me, at least not enough to even contemplate trying again....

All suggestions will be appreciated.... however nothing that will get me into prison.... prisons in Africa are not pleasant places....:rofl::rofl:


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## eagleclaw

Because she says she has no feelings for you doesn't mean necessary that she doesn't. What you have now, and what she knows of you now is not attracting her or creating any desire. So the next move is to man up and act differently. Still be yourself, but set the tone, be strong, be mysterious and act just like you did when you originally attracted her so many years ago. Get your edge back. You know this current situation is not working. It wasn't working when she left and it's not going to bring her back.

So go back to how you used to be at the beginning. Before you started trying to make things work, to do endless things to make her happy, to keep the peace, to do whatever was necessary to try and get laid......

Go back to that person who would never have put up with this crap at the beginning and don't put up with it now. Don't be out for revenge, or dissing her family etc as you wouldn't have done that back then and let's face it..... blood is always thicker than wine. You can't expect much in that regard from her family.

Read some of Mem's notes on other threads. He has great advice. But you need to man-up dictate your own life, stop checking in on her and trying to reconcile. Get the paperwork done, tell her your moving on and dating, wish her well and be friendly when your around her but mysterious. Don't answer probing questions and leave things to her imagination. Act like you don't care what she is up to. Be cold, but polite.

Read through this thread - it is huge - and started from only an EA but the tactics and advice is the same. You can really see how things can play out. Look for advice from Mem, Conrad, IanIronWood and others. Great info:

http://talkaboutmarriage.com/mens-clubhouse/21806-ea-already-moving-towards-pa.html


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## Zulu

What a tough week this has been! She is definitely not coming back... she was just playing me... any way, got to be out of the house by the end of April and still have to get a divorce going.... and I am going to have to try and get as much as I possibly can, once the thing is signed, there is no turning back to rethink the agreement.... I will still pray for a miracle, my faith in God has been what has got me this far. Hell, it still hurts like the beginning though.


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## Zulu

I do not know if this is a good or bad thing, her family have no idea of the crap she has gotten up to.... I in my wisdom, illicitly recorded 2 hour long confessions of hers, and have the recordings, do you think it wise to invite a family member of hers to come hear it, that may remove from her the support of the family etc etc etc .... or is this just a totally bad idea, or should the threat of it, be used for her to be more "accepting" of the divorce agreement.... her family believes that it was just a marriage breakdown and do not believe that there was any "foul play", they may re asses their position.... good/bad idea?


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## Zulu

I think it is time to close this thread. A new thread will be started entitled The way forward to a new life


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