# 4 years and he has no intentions of marrying me!!



## SouthernBelle82 (Jun 18, 2012)

I've been with my boyfriend for 4 years. I love him immensely, and if you ask either of us, we will both tell you that we are each others best friend. My problem is this: When we were going through the courting process, I let him know upfront that I had intentions of remarrying the right person at the right time. I suffer from kidney disease and my doctor said he would be surprised if I lived past the 40-45 year old mark. I just turned 30 in April. Which means if the doctors are right, I may not live longer than the next 15 years. Since I turned 30 I have felt this sense of urgency. I want to have the chance to experience a marriage with someone I also consider my best friend. I want to do it soon before I'm too sick to enjoy the experience. I KNOW he is the right person for me. He is nothing like my ex husband. BUT, the problem is this: I was informed in the last month that he has no interest in a legal marriage due to the fact that he does not believe in god, and therefore his reasoning is why should he have to make a legal commitment when he doesn't really believe in the religious aspect of it. I have tried to explain to him that we don't have to get married in a church, and that we can customize our wedding in order to not include religious references to no avail. Is he just looking for an excuse not to be in a legally binding relationship? I know for a fact that I want to remarry, there is not a doubt in my mind. So does that mean that if I want to remarry and he has made it clear that he has no interest in a legal marriage, that I should break off the relationship and find someone who does want that lifetime commitment? The way I was raised was that it was improper to just have a live in boyfriend after a certain number of years. And please note that I am willing to wait until we have been together for 5 years before setting a date or anything. Someone please give me some direction here. My grandmother told me all my life to never settle for less. And honestly, I feel like I am settling for less by continuing to invest my time in a relationship that I don't see ever going to the next level. Am I wrong? HELP PLEASE!!


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## SoWhat (Jan 7, 2012)

I don't think you're wrong at all. This is something very important to you and I think you know you have to stick to it as a boundary.

Also, his excuse is sooooo weak if its based on his lack of religion. You're totally right in that you could do it with no reference to religion. Yes, he's just looking for an excuse. 

But, just to play Devil's Advocate:
Imagine two futures - in
(A) you stay with your current man, you never get legally married, but live and love each other with the same passion you currently have from now until y'all die, at a tender old age, holding each other as you slip into the night, and

(B) you leave him, "take it to the next level" with some other guy. That doesn't work out and you're divorced again after a while. And then another guy, etc.

In which situation is it really "taken to the next level" ? 

Again, just playing contrarian here, as I think you're totally in the right.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

I agree with SoWhat... getting married isn't about doing so in a church. There are other belief systems mind you.. but there are also places you can marry without any form of religious impact. 

I am wiccan and my own SO is agnostic. Now neither of us plan on marrying in a church and i know you certainly don't need a priest or priestess to get married. If I recall... all you need is a judge.. and you can perform the ceremony at a later date after getting the marriage license.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

my BIL married us at the beach. Totally legal. No church.


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## GetTough (Jul 18, 2010)

Marriage doesn't give you lifetime commitment. There's plenty of evidence of that on this forum for starters. If that's your motivation, it's an illusion.


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## SabrinaBlue (Apr 18, 2012)

The question here is, _why_ is he so anti-marriage? The religion excuse is nonsense; plenty of non-theists get married in civil ceremonies. There's definitely a deeper reason here, and you should be curious what it is.

Did he grow up in a home with a poor marriage model? Did divorce happen while he was there? If you feel your relationship is worth it, I'd do some investigating (and questioning).


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

SouthernBelle82 said:


> I've been with my boyfriend for 4 years. I love him immensely, and if you ask either of us, we will both tell you that we are each others best friend. My problem is this: When we were going through the courting process, I let him know upfront that I had intentions of remarrying the right person at the right time. I suffer from kidney disease and my doctor said he would be surprised if I lived past the 40-45 year old mark. I just turned 30 in April. Which means if the doctors are right, I may not live longer than the next 15 years. Since I turned 30 I have felt this sense of urgency. I want to have the chance to experience a marriage with someone I also consider my best friend. I want to do it soon before I'm too sick to enjoy the experience. I KNOW he is the right person for me. He is nothing like my ex husband. BUT, the problem is this: I was informed in the last month that he has no interest in a legal marriage due to the fact that he does not believe in god, and therefore his reasoning is why should he have to make a legal commitment when he doesn't really believe in the religious aspect of it. I have tried to explain to him that we don't have to get married in a church, and that we can customize our wedding in order to not include religious references to no avail. Is he just looking for an excuse not to be in a legally binding relationship? I know for a fact that I want to remarry, there is not a doubt in my mind. So does that mean that if I want to remarry and he has made it clear that he has no interest in a legal marriage, that I should break off the relationship and find someone who does want that lifetime commitment? The way I was raised was that it was improper to just have a live in boyfriend after a certain number of years. And please note that I am willing to wait until we have been together for 5 years before setting a date or anything. Someone please give me some direction here. *My grandmother told me all my life to never settle for less. And honestly, I feel like I am settling for less by continuing to invest my time in a relationship that I don't see ever going to the next level*. Am I wrong? HELP PLEASE!!


Your grandmother is a very smart woman. 
I'm sorry but it seems like he just doesn't want to be married, with no room for negotiation. 
Be honest, do you really want to be with someone who is so off base about marriage & what it means to you?
Please don't let the 4 years you've spent together be the reason why you stay.
You deserve to be with someone who truly wants to spend his life with you.
He's told he doesn't want to get married, more than likely he's not going to change his mind, no matter how you present marriage to him. 
Don't waste another 4 years with him & make sure to know in your next relationship what your SO's views on marriage are early in the relationship.


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## SouthernBelle82 (Jun 18, 2012)

Bradt that is not my intention at all for wanting a marriage. As I stated in my post, I suffer from kidney disease and my life expectancy is 45 years. I am 30 now. That means if all else fails, I could be dead in 15 years. May sound like a long time, but when you really think about how short of a time frame it is compared to your whole life, it puts things in perspective. I want to experience marriage, all of it. And another thing is the way I was raised. I was raised by my grandmother and mother that if you were to be in a serious living situation with your SO that you should definitely be on the marriage track because it is what is considered "ladylike" and decent, and any man who is serious about his commitment to you wouldn't hesitate to participate in a legal marriage. I really want the legal right to call him my husband.


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## SoWhat (Jan 7, 2012)

Brad does have a point, but I understand where SB82 is coming from - there's a cultural thing about marriage that's hard to shake. 

And since its something that is so very important to OP - especially with reference to her life expectancy - its something that should be important to someone who loves her too.
If not, he needs to get on with his life and give her a chance to find someone who shares that value with her.


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## Phenix70 (May 6, 2012)

SouthernBelle82 said:


> Bradt that is not my intention at all for wanting a marriage. As I stated in my post, I suffer from kidney disease and my life expectancy is 45 years. I am 30 now. That means if all else fails, I could be dead in 15 years. May sound like a long time, but when you really think about how short of a time frame it is compared to your whole life, it puts things in perspective. *I want to experience marriage, all of it.* And another thing is the way I was raised. I was raised by my grandmother and mother that if you were to be in a serious living situation with your SO that you should definitely be on the marriage track because it is what is considered "ladylike" and decent, and any man who is serious about his commitment to you wouldn't hesitate to participate in a legal marriage. I really want the legal right to call him my husband.


As well you should!
When a man wants to marry you, nothing will stop him from his goal.
If a man doesn't want to marry, nothing will get him to do so.
Which man do YOU want to spend another 4 years of your life with?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

The idea that a live-in relationship should be no more than 5 years or else it's not lady-like is arbitary. I was raised that it was not lady-like to have a live-in relationship. Nice girls/women do not co-habitate with men, they get married.

You are wanting him to marry you based on your grandmother's belief system. What matters here is that what you believe and what he believes are a world apart.

Either one of you will have to put aside your belief or you will have to leave him. 

I wonder if one of the reasons that he is balking at marrying you is that you may very well only have 15 years to live. He may not be telling you how your illness affects him. 

I don't mean to be cruel here... but there is a good chance that as you get older you will become much more ill. Is he worried that he is going to have to take on the very hard task of being a care taker? Is he worried that he is going to lose you... bad enough to lose a girlfriend... horrific to lose a wife.

I think that there is a lot more going on here than just his explaination about relgion and marriage. Secular marriage has nothing to do with religion.


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## *LittleDeer* (Apr 19, 2012)

Marriage is very important to me for many reasons.

Lots of people make excuses about not getting married, untill they meet "the one" then suddenly their views change.

No marriages don't all ways last and there are hundred reasons why people make excuses as to why not.

But if you really love some one, why not make that extra commitment, why not show that you believe your relationship will last.

I personally wouldn't stay with someone I didn't want to marry.
I would rather be single, because it would mean something was missing.

If he doesn't feel it and isn't just as excited about the prospect of marriage and spending a life time together then I'm afraid I would move on, he obviously isn't right for me.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

marriage is nothing but a scam.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

2nd_t!me iz_best said:


> marriage is nothing but a scam.


 DISLIKE!!!!!


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

Yea, I dislike it too, 2nd! 

The OP wants something her mate won't give her. So she has 2 choices. Stay as it is now, or leave.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

that_girl said:


> Yea, I dislike it too, 2nd!
> 
> The OP wants something her mate won't give her. So she has 2 choices. Stay as it is now, or leave.


if it is something she feels like she has to have and he is not willing to give it then do what people do and leave, that simple.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

Nothing is ever "that simple" when it comes to being in love. Not imo anyway.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

Gaia said:


> Nothing is ever "that simple" when it comes to being in love. Not imo anyway.


is there really such a thing? or is it something people psych them selves up about. misguided emotions. i dont think it is a real emotion...or what ever you want to label it as.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

2nd_t!me iz_best said:


> is there really such a thing? or is it something people psych them selves up about. misguided emotions. i dont think it is a real emotion...or what ever you want to label it as.


Now now 2nd... it is what it is... no amount of picking apart and analyzing will change that. You my friend.. need to cheer up!


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

You can only control and change yourself. 

He doesn't want to marry, she does. She has choices. It is THAT simple. Maybe the choices aren't simple, but they are hers and she is in the driver's seat with this.


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## GetTough (Jul 18, 2010)

SouthernBelle82 said:


> Bradt that is not my intention at all for wanting a marriage. As I stated in my post, I suffer from kidney disease and my life expectancy is 45 years. I am 30 now. That means if all else fails, I could be dead in 15 years. May sound like a long time, but when you really think about how short of a time frame it is compared to your whole life, it puts things in perspective. I want to experience marriage, all of it. And another thing is the way I was raised. I was raised by my grandmother and mother that if you were to be in a serious living situation with your SO that you should definitely be on the marriage track because it is what is considered "ladylike" and decent, and any man who is serious about his commitment to you wouldn't hesitate to participate in a legal marriage. I really want the legal right to call him my husband.


I understand how you feel. Marriage is something you value. However you must be aware that the risk is that you throw away day-to-day happiness with the man you love (which will be *essentially the same* before and after marriage) simply due to the social conditioning which inculcated this value. Very often people forsake enjoying the journey because they are so fixated on the destination. People can often have this picture perfect ideal plan of how they want their lives to be and get too easily discontent when life doesn't always work that way. I believe this non-acceptance, not loving WHAT IS (ref: Byron Katie), i.e. being dissatisfied by wanting MORE, is a leading cause of unhappiness. According to her and speakers like her, Wayne Dyer, Joe Vitale etc. everything is in a state of perfection, period. They say it is best for us to find acceptance and gratitude within ourselves for the abundance all around us. I like Byron Katie's quote: "When you argue with reality, you lose, but only 100% of the time."

Example, I recently dated a girl who wanted commitment from me before I was ready (not marriage, just exclusive couple). Similar kind of thing to you, just a notch or two down lol. The disparity from that whole issue led to our breakup. She felt rejected. I felt like wtf, I'm not seeing anyone else, why can't we just enjoy each other's company and live our lives, see what happens? The irony is that given a little longer I probably would have asked her to have become an exclusive couple. Her impatience and pressing for it immediately (or my unwillingness to concede that) blew the whole thing. She didn't feel that I valued her, when I did. I didn't feel that she valued me, when I wasn't sufficient for her outside of her "plan".

Trying to force a marriage is rarely a good idea. However there is probably quite a good chance that you could succeed and compel this man to marry you. Do you think your relationship quality will increase or decrease as a result? The other possibility is that he will have a change of heart and realize he wants to give you this (perhaps even sooner rather than later) if you could make it much less of a pressing issue for you. Wouldn't that be a more amazing outcome for you? A man needs to lead. Don't try to control him. Marriage has to be his decision. If you persuade him to marry you, you dis-empower him and you will lose some attraction for him.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

Gaia said:


> Now now 2nd... it is what it is... no amount of picking apart and analyzing will change that. You my friend.. need to cheer up!


jose has made me very fvckin cheery tonight, thanks.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

that_girl said:


> You can only control and change yourself.
> 
> He doesn't want to marry, she does. She has choices. It is THAT simple. Maybe the choices aren't simple, but they are hers and she is in the driver's seat with this.


the chioce is simple, she djust has to act on it.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

You're slurring.


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## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

2nd_t!me iz_best said:


> jose has made me very fvckin cheery tonight, thanks.


GRRR now I ENVY you!


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

that_girl said:


> You're slurring.


lol, not too much yet


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## aug (Aug 21, 2011)

SouthernBelle82 said:


> Bradt that is not my intention at all for wanting a marriage. As I stated in my post,* I suffer from kidney disease and my life expectancy is 45 years. I am 30 now. That means if all else fails, I could be dead in 15 years.* May sound like a long time, but when you really think about how short of a time frame it is compared to your whole life, it puts things in perspective. I want to experience marriage, all of it. And another thing is the way I was raised. I was raised by my grandmother and mother that if you were to be in a serious living situation with your SO that you should definitely be on the marriage track because it is what is considered "ladylike" and decent, and any man who is serious about his commitment to you wouldn't hesitate to participate in a legal marriage. I really want the legal right to call him my husband.




Do some research on your kidney disease. There are supplements, life style changes, diets, etc that can help prolong your kidneys. 

Look for a good naturopath who specializes in the renal area, have a broad general practice, and does not overcharge.

Also, kidney transplant is a possibility in the future.

You may squeeze out more than 15 years...

As for boyfriend, I have nothing.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

Gaia said:


> GRRR now I ENVY you!


anyone si able to join kme when ever the y liker.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

2nd_t!me iz_best said:


> anyone si able to join kme when ever the y liker.


:rofl::rofl: Now you're slurring.


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## 2nd_t!me iz_best (Feb 28, 2011)

that_girl said:


> :rofl::rofl: Now you're slurring.


dood night that_girl, and everyone


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## kuteguy (Jun 15, 2012)

I completely agree with elegirl 15p% and was about to write the exact same thing.. About all points


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## River1977 (Oct 25, 2010)

SouthernBelle82, I set standards for my dating life both for myself and for the guys I dated. One of those rules was that I wouldn't date anyone for more than two years. The reason to me was that two years was long enough to be with someone and be able to determine if we wanted to spend our lives together - if we wanted to be married to each other.

At the end of that two years was time to reassess and re-evaluate the relationship. If one or both of us did not want to marry, then perhaps we could become friends because it made no sense to me to stay together as a couple. I never told my suitors about my time limit though because I didn't want to apply any pressure on them. Only two relationships lasted that long. I broke up with one guy because he never proposed or even discussed marriage, so I took that as his way of telling me he didn't want to be married to me. The other guy proposed to me, but I knew I didn't want to be married to him, so I gave him a really good excuse.

The purpose of setting standards for dating is to place rules that guide you through relationships because a strong foundation cannot be built on emotions, and the emotions of other people can be unreliable. I didn't want my future or my feelings to be left to the capricious whims of somebody else. I wanted control of me and the power to make my own decisions.

I realize you feel pressed for time and are trying to beat the clock of your prognosis. But, you still have to be willing to make your own decisions. If the guy doesn't want to get married, there is no point in you offering any more of your life and your heart in hopes that he will change his mind. You want to have more control than that over this part of your life that you can control. This decision is yours once he told you his own decision. Please don't think you should give him any more time.

If I may add, the hope for being married shouldn't be treated like an assignment for the Make A Wish Foundation. It is a serious matter and if not treated as such, it can be the absolutely worst thing in the world to happen to you. Your desire to experience what you imagine to be the joy of marriage could easily turn out to be an awful disaster. It appears marriage with your boyfriend may be quite nice since you've been together for so long, but he doesn't want to get married. So, try not to rush to find someone else and make any hasty mistakes out of desperation.


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## Hicks (Jan 14, 2011)

Your grandmother is wrong.
If you want a man to marry you, the worst thing you can do is move in with him. This is because men are marriage averse, and the needs they obtain through marriage are completely satisfied in a co-habitation situation.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

When you two began dating was your diagnosis known to your man?
Did he know of your diagnosis when you discussed future marriage with him?

It seems to me you expect him to conform to your belief system about marriage.

Myself, if I believed I had a short time left on this earth I wouldn`t care about social conventions as long as I could spend my life with someone who I loved and loved me.

He may also have a problem with the fact that he knows he`ll be losing you in 15 years or so and is unable to commit to such a situation.

His beliefs clash with yours, your situation and desire puts a unique stressor on him.

This isn`t your grandmothers life, it`s yours.

Will you be happier spending those 15 years with this man who you love and who loves you or spending it bouncing from relationship to relationship looking for what you`ve just thrown away?

It`s possible you may find it again but the odds are not with you.

Then there is the fact that anyone who may fit the bill will be confronted with the same unique stressors your current man is only the stress will be even greater as he will have even less time with you.

What you have is much more secure than what you think you want, much more fulfilling.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

SabrinaBlue said:


> The question here is, _why_ is he so anti-marriage? The religion excuse is nonsense; plenty of non-theists get married in civil ceremonies. There's definitely a deeper reason here, and you should be curious what it is.
> 
> Did he grow up in a home with a poor marriage model? Did divorce happen while he was there? If you feel your relationship is worth it, I'd do some investigating (and questioning).


There need be no other reason to be anti-marriage beyond the fact that it`s a freaking coin toss.

50/50 odds aren`t something I`m comfortable betting my life on.


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## MooseAndSquirrel (Jun 7, 2012)

SouthernBelle82, you seem to have an idealized view of marriage. Marriage is a legal framework for owning property and having children, not emotional glue. If you don't need to be married for insurance reasons, then getting married is pointless. It will not improve the quality of your emotional commitment one iota.


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## SouthernBelle82 (Jun 18, 2012)

First I would like to say a big THANK YOU to those of you that posted in my thread. I don't have many close friends, so it is such a relief to reach out with such a personal dilemma and have many people respond and try to help! As for my prognosis, yes, he did know about my condition. I told him before we even started dating, while we were still in the friendship stages. I also told him in the very beginning that marriage was definitely something I was looking for, so it's not like I reeled him in first and then said, "Oh by the way, I may be dead by 45 AND I want to get married before that happens. Nothing like that at all. He knew my expectations when we started this. There is one more issue in relation to the legal marriage that I forgot to tell you guys about. I have a really disgusting family. When someone in our family dies, they are like vultures, picking over the dead persons valubles, arguing who gets what, and even trying to dictate what type of funeral to have. With that said, I must tell you all that I am a practicing Buddhist and I do NOT want a christian funeral service, nor do I want my life insurance to go to people that abused me, belittled me, and never kept regular contact with me except to call and ask for money. How typical. So, my other train of thought on the legal marriage thing is I want to protect my boyfriend legally from my family, because they ARE the type to throw in the legal card when it comes to it. I want my boyfriend to get my life insurance. My boyfriend knows exactly what type of Buddhist funeral service I desire. However, if we aren't legally married that creates room for the vultures in my family to shove him out of the way, do what they deem fit, take my money, and he has nothing. Bottom line: Yes I may have my own selfish reasons for wanting to get married, but I also have one big unselfish reason: I want to financially protect my boyfriend when the time comes. I don't think that is wrong at all!


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## pidge70 (Jan 17, 2011)

I'm curious, what kind of kidney disease were you diagnosed with? I have kidney disease as well, diagnosed last year, and I am now 42. I wasn't given such a grim prognosis.


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## SoWhat (Jan 7, 2012)

I think tacoma and Moose make good points about what marriage actually does.

But I don't think anyone here is going to be able to convince you that marriage is just a property-owning regime - it's something you value deeply. 
He doesn't. And his reasons don't match up with the rather legitimate concerns voiced my tacoma, et al.


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## As You Wish (Jun 5, 2012)

He has no intention of marrying you. That's really all you need to know.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

> I must tell you all that I am a practicing Buddhist and I do NOT want a christian funeral service, nor do I want my life insurance to go to people that abused me, belittled me, and never kept regular contact with me except to call and ask for money. How typical. So, my other train of thought on the legal marriage thing is I want to protect my boyfriend legally from my family, because they ARE the type to throw in the legal card when it comes to it. I want my boyfriend to get my life insurance. My boyfriend knows exactly what type of Buddhist funeral service I desire. However, if we aren't legally married that creates room for the vultures in my family to shove him out of the way, do what they deem fit, take my money, and he has nothing.


You can document ALL of your wishes legally. Please see an attorney, make a will, make a living will, update your life insurance company with your beneficiaries, etc. This is not a reason to get married.

Unfortunately, I suspect your bf does not want to be married TO YOU. That's usually what's in play when someone says they don't want to be married. Could be because of your prognosis, could be because he isn't in love, could be a lot of things, but you KNOW his position, so the only thing you can do is make your choices about your life with that knowledge in mind. You can't change people's minds about marriage.

Also, marriage is often more significant for people who want children. Does he want children? If you cannot be or do not want to be a mother, that could be a reason for him not wanting to marry you as well. Even if you do want children, he might not want to have children with a woman who will not be around to raise them with him.


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## SunnyT (Jun 22, 2011)

Depending on the state that you currently live in, you could already consider yourself married thru common-law. Look it up. IF that is true, you could tell him that... and see if he would agree to some kind of "celebration of love" or "celebration of commitment". IF he still disagrees, that would make me think he isn't what you are looking for.


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## SoWhat (Jan 7, 2012)

norajane said:


> Unfortunately, I suspect your bf does not want to be married TO YOU. That's usually what's in play when someone says they don't want to be married.


I'm sure that's often the case, but not always. 

Many men legitimately do not understand what the big fuss about marriage is and have no interest in joining an institution that has a 50% failure rate, with severe financial consequences for those whose coin winds up on tails. Men often ask themselves - if I'm risking that, what am I gaining? will she treat me better or love me more for this risk? 

The disconnect between many men and women might be a result of culture - women are taught to look forward to their wedding days, are told that those women with big pretty rings on their fingers are to be envied, etc. 

Men don't get those messages. 

Men also don't usually get to look forward to being taken care of financially, and having the option of choosing a job they like while their spouse takes the less-fun job to afford keeping up with the Joneses for you. That incentive isn't there usually for us (though, realistically, it's not quite there for women anymore, either, like it may have been in past decades).

And I'd be lying if the stories that married men tell us single guys about the precipitous drop off in sex doesn't scare the crap out of many men. 


I'm probably going to propose to my GF sometime this year.
But I'm going to despite knowing the risks and not knowing what the particular reward is - other than the fact that I think she'd dump me if we didn't get married. So, I'm a man who doesn't actively care about the institution of marriage, but does actively care about staying with the woman I love.

Maybe I'm parsing hairs here with the "want to get married/want to get married to YOU" thing... I don't know. 

So I guess OP could set an ultimatum. It seems pretty darn important to her and maybe an ultimatum would open her man's eyes.


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