# Is it me or has whining become the theme here?



## KanDo (Jun 15, 2011)

Not really a CWI topic; but, I feel most comfortable here. Lately it appears to me that many post have a a sense of hopelessness to them and a lack of action on the part of the poster. Excuses for the actions of wayward spouses seem more prevalent and acceptance of abhorent boundry violations appears common.:scratchhead: I find myself figuratively screaming at my computer monitor and saying "Grow a pair" several times a day and posting an admonition to man-up at least daily. Am I over the top? Do I need a TAM break?


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## Remains (Jan 24, 2012)

I think that is the nature of love and infidelity. Read my post (please?) - my man is still hiding stuff, please confirm - and tell me what u think. It is full of exactly what u describe. Reasons for suspicion, wishing for it not to be so, wanting to believe, knowing, I guess, there is no hope but still wanting a way out to a happy ending. That is love for u. And the ending of love. And eventually, it will all come out in the wash. For many I guess it doesn't, many choose to ignore and get on with life, many just end it immediately, if u end up on here it is due to confusion, hope, no hope, looking for confirmation of either facts or own paranoia, confirmation of self belief and so on. I wish I wasn't here whining about what I know to be true, but still wanting a way out due to the love I feel for this man that I have never felt for any other.


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

Your inner strength is uncommon. Please stay to model that strength for them. They need it.


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## AngryandUsed (Jun 23, 2011)

I view it differently.

Many BS have or had no idea of what was going on. They had trust. Once they wake up to the A, it is in such a state of shock, pain and disappointment that they come to post here.

Further, WSs have come down to such a low levels in morality, it is not possible for BS to even to comprehend the situation. I find this type of occurrences often here, lately.

In some cases, WS have come to post as if the A is the end result of their BSs' attitude etc. They have all been bashed here.


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## ing (Mar 26, 2011)

KanDo said:


> Not really a CWI topic; but, I feel most comfortable here. Lately it appears to me that many post have a a sense of hopelessness to them and a lack of action on the part of the poster. Excuses for the actions of wayward spouses seem more prevalent and acceptance of abhorent boundry violations appears common.:scratchhead: I find myself figuratively screaming at my computer monitor and saying "Grow a pair" several times a day and posting an admonition to man-up at least daily. Am I over the top? Do I need a TAM break?


TAM fatigue. I have not looked at a thread in a week or two. There are only so many times you can say it without screaming.


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## NotLikeYou (Aug 30, 2011)

KanDo said:


> Not really a CWI topic; but, I feel most comfortable here. Lately it appears to me that many post have a a sense of hopelessness to them and a lack of action on the part of the poster. Excuses for the actions of wayward spouses seem more prevalent and acceptance of abhorent boundary violations appears common.:scratchhead: I find myself figuratively screaming at my computer monitor and saying "Grow a pair" several times a day and posting an admonition to man-up at least daily. Am I over the top? Do I need a TAM break?


Kando, one of my absolute favorite blogs is Thelastpsychiatrist. He writes fantastic articles about all kinds of things, but he has two prevailing themes in his blog-

1) Narcissism
2) If you're watching / reading / seeing it, it's for you.

The second item there is relevant to TAM, I think. And being the slow fellow I am, it took me awhile to figure it out.

The threads on TAM that receive the most views and comments are the most dramatic and outrageous ones. In most cases, this means a thread exactly like you describe- insane behavior and boundary violations coupled with a complete absence of common sense on the part of the OP.

In several cases, this has been revealed to be deliberate trolling on the part of the OP. In a couple of other cases, I think the troll-osity of the thread simply hasn't been discovered, but you know what they say about opinions....

The point here is, that you're falling into the trap of expecting anonymous posters here to take your advice, which seems reasonable to you. They proceed to not-follow your advice, and it upsets you, as you describe above.

Every single thing you write on TAM is for one person.

YOU.

If someone happens to read what you write, and says to themselves, "Hey, that sounds like a good idea," well, that's just icing on the cake.

There are people on here who have made thousands of posts. One of them explains that he posts to help other through the horrible experience that is infidelity. If he were to describe his posting for this reason as "therapeutic," I think he might get a bit closer to the truth. (Not intended as an insult- his posts are pretty thoughtful, always articulate, and always worth reading).

I think a significant portion of the genuine posters on TAM are more interested in talking about their situation, or getting a little anonymous sympathy, than they are in figuring out the shortest, most effective path out of whatever bad situation they are in.

So when you tell them to "Proceed directly to GO, collect $200," well, that's not what they are looking for. It's what YOU are looking for, what YOU would do in that situation.

And credit where credit is due- I was entering the same mindset myself, a few weeks back. I'd like to give kudos to the resident zen master, Morituri, for gently shifting my perspective back to a less-emotionally-involved frame of reference.

So take a step back, and remember that while your journey through the fire is almost over, there are a lot of people just looking to stay warm.


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## KanDo (Jun 15, 2011)

@NotLikeYou,
Thanks for the thoughtful post. I think you are on to something. ;-)


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

I read many and ignore them. I can't believe some people can be soooo....that way.


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## keko (Mar 21, 2012)

I'm new to this site but I already gave up on trying to help people out. They're either too ignorant on advices or dont have a problem being treated like a doormat.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

keko said:


> I'm new to this site but I already gave up on trying to help people out. They're either too ignorant on advices or dont have a problem being treated like a doormat.


That was the point of this thread. It wasn't always like that. Sure, EVERYONE has their moments. Everyone has a moment of ARRGH! or whining. That's ok. But before, it was stronger almost. It used to be somewhat empowering.


But lately, many people want to argue and not listen...they come with a problem, then get irritated with advice to actually DO something other than complain.

I still give advice, but then I stop when i realize the person doesn't really want help, they just want to vent. That's ok, just don't make the title, "ADVICE PLEASE!!!!!!!!"


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## Kurosity (Dec 22, 2011)

I too have notices an increase of the ever endless hopless motionless type post on here and I am getting to thinking that some are just people in denial or looking for a quick fix.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

It's not you, HiO.

I just smell a lot of trolls lately.


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## Numb in Ohio (Oct 31, 2011)

Should have choice like FB and be able to block posts from certain users???


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

It's springtime, the psychos crawl out of their lairs.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

Numb in Ohio said:


> Should have choice like FB and be able to block posts from certain users???


Problem is you'd still get to see replies to them from other users.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

KanDo said:


> Not really a CWI topic; but, I feel most comfortable here. Lately it appears to me that many post have a a sense of hopelessness to them and a lack of action on the part of the poster. Excuses for the actions of wayward spouses seem more prevalent and acceptance of abhorent boundry violations appears common.:scratchhead: I find myself figuratively screaming at my computer monitor and saying "Grow a pair" several times a day and posting an admonition to man-up at least daily. Am I over the top? Do I need a TAM break?


I think it’s a lot to do with paradigms and frames of reference. Both consciously and subconsciously we have models in our head about how we should “work” as a person, how we go about getting what we want out of our life.

And for each of our models we have frames of references. The frames are how other people "should" respond to how we work. Both our paradigms and the frames of references in which they work are exceedingly complex. In fact they are absolutely unique and constantly variable. Our own inner worlds are exceedingly complex.



So we’ve been living within our own paradigms and frames of references with our wife/husband say for twenty years. And then we discover they’ve been in an affair for the past three years for example.


This presents us with whole new paradigms and frames of references that we didn’t even know existed! And eventually we come to realise that we’ve been totally deluded for three whole years! Now to be deluded is in some ways to be insane in that we’ve believed things that were totally not true.


It takes a while, sometimes a very long while for the BS to sort all this out in their head. Meantime they still see their partner as the person they were before they discovered their affair. And they still “deal” with that person as though they are still the person they “thought” they were. Sometimes it takes an exceptionally long time for the penny to drop!



So when a BS comes here and makes their post, in many ways they still see their DS as the person they fell in love with many years ago and the person they have shared so much of their life with. Yet you/we see the person, the DS, as the person the BS describes in the “here and now”.

Sometimes it can take a very long while for the BS to catch up with the here and now. And probably the longer they’ve been together the longer it will take them. And even then they will not want to believe their own conclusions.



So while you’re thinking/screaming “grow a pair” they still haven’t caught up with the person their spouse is today, in that they are living in the past.


Of course there are those who will never be “woken up” out of their stupor and their separation/divorce will be long and tortuous. The guy who I think is the reason for your post is for me at least living in cloud cuckoo land. But he’s been living there probably for a long time and is, at the moment at least unable to change either his paradigms or frames of references. The thing is it sounds like it’s not only some men here who reckons he should grow a pair, but his wife as well. And if he did he may well win her back full time in “mind, body and spirit” instead of just the “body crumbs” that she’s offering him!


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## golfergirl (Dec 8, 2010)

While I haven't read the posts or postings that relate to this, I do have to say that if I was a new poster, in pain, I would think twice about posting my message here with this 'whining' topic. While I wouldn't want 'there, there' pat my hand, I don't need someone calling me down for not following the path blindly. Think of your own situations in the beginning. It's a process, not a quick fix. I remember feeling the same thing about your posts in the beginning that_girl. You had to follow your own path that was right for you. This strong you wasn't you in the height of your troubles. You were scared, whining and stubborn. A little empathy goes a long way, if it's too annoying, scroll on by.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## LovesHerMan (Jul 28, 2011)

I think it is TAM fatigue. The same problems keep cropping up over and over. You know the rational answer, but the solution lies in getting our emotions to align with what we know to be true in our head. It is also much easier to give advice than to take it.


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## CandieGirl (Apr 27, 2011)

KanDo said:


> Not really a CWI topic; but, I feel most comfortable here. Lately it appears to me that many post have a a sense of hopelessness to them and a lack of action on the part of the poster. Excuses for the actions of wayward spouses seem more prevalent and acceptance of abhorent boundry violations appears common.:scratchhead: I find myself figuratively screaming at my computer monitor and saying "Grow a pair" several times a day and posting an admonition to man-up at least daily. Am I over the top? Do I need a TAM break?


Maybe...but keep in mind that everyone is different in the ways that they enforce their own particular boundaries. If you are figuratively screaming at your own computer because what you would do in a given situation, maybe you just need to relax a little in your own life AND here on TAM (yes, maybe take a break). Here, you sound angy and fixated on a one-size-fits-all-cure-all, (man-up).

It seems to happen a lot, to all of us on TAM; we give the same answers over and over relative to our own experiences, which is completely understandable. There's a lot of "pack your bags" advice...Yesterday, it was suggested that I pack my bags and leave my husband...I've currently got two threads going, one about his LD and trying to cope, and the other about a GF of mine who was behaving inappropriately with my husband...in either case, packing up and moving out seems rather extreme to me.

JMHO.


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## Initfortheduration (Dec 12, 2008)

I agree Kando. Here is a little clip for all the whining men with cheating wives.

Sir John Gielgud in "Arthur" (1981) - YouTube


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

I agree with ya Kando.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

golfergirl said:


> While I haven't read the posts or postings that relate to this, I do have to say that if I was a new poster, in pain, I would think twice about posting my message here with this 'whining' topic. While I wouldn't want 'there, there' pat my hand, I don't need someone calling me down for not following the path blindly. Think of your own situations in the beginning. It's a process, not a quick fix. I remember feeling the same thing about your posts in the beginning that_girl. You had to follow your own path that was right for you. This strong you wasn't you in the height of your troubles. You were scared, whining and stubborn. A little empathy goes a long way, if it's too annoying, scroll on by.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


You are right! But I didn't argue with advice or make excuses as to why I couldn't do anything.

I picked myself up quickly.

So, what is your point?

i am all for helping people, but they also need to help themselves. Like I said, if you want to vent, awesome! vent and whine and cry...that's healing. but don't come here for advice if you don't want to listen.


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## lordmayhem (Feb 7, 2011)

Most arrive here after their recent D-Day, so they are in that initial shock/denial stage. The so-called BS fog. Its frustrating at times, moreso when it seems they can't progress from that stage because of their co-dependency.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

TAM is a magnificent kaleidoscope of differing opinions, experiences, thoughts, behaviors and beliefs. For me that’s the beauty of TAM. It’s black and white and every single brilliant colour and tint in between. A real kaleidoscope of different people willing to share their problems and willing to help others with their solutions.



And sometimes, if not all times, the more waaaay out of the park the advice is the more beneficial it is. Because for sure we don’t solve our problems with the same mindset we created them with.



Sometimes if not most times we have to get out of the sandbox of our life. It’s not easy, it’s not fool proof and there’s no guarantees but unless we step out of our known world there’s no way we’ll make any useful progress.



For me it’s a real sign of character of a person if they accept advice in the faith it was given rather than the advice itself.


Ungrateful people will I believe be forever ungrateful.


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## KanDo (Jun 15, 2011)

Well,

I am glad to see that my perceptions were not solely my own. I think many of the posts above show thoughtful reflection on the TAM experience and the struggles that BS in particular face. THANKS


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## cantmove (Feb 20, 2012)

It is wonderful that some of you are so strong that you never whined or cried over your situation or maybe you did but then got advice here and immediately manned or womaned up. You rock! However some of us just got knoced off our feet or maybe some of us are just insecure or weak. Hell I don't know right now, as I'm still in a little bit of shock. I listen to the advice and somedays I'm strong enough to heed it and some days I'm not and might need a little bit of sympathy. I'm ok with that and have only been here for two weeks. Good thing I don't give a $hit what anyone thinks or I might not feel safe and secure to ask for help here. Sometimes you need to whine and since 180 and nc are so important, shouldn't this be the sort of place where you can put your armour down on occasion??


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