# Girlfriend's Male Friends



## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

Got a little disagreement with my girl that I could use some input on. I'll preface this by saying that I am damaged goods - I am divorced due to infidelity on my wife's part, and have been cheated on in a couple previous long term relationships as well. I would really like to never have that happen to me again, and I am trying to establish new relationship boundaries & patterns to that end. 

I have been dating a girl exclusively for about 7 mos now. She's 30 and I'm 38. We are both social, successful, fit, and attractive. She's never been married and does not want kids, and I don't want another ex-wife or any more kids. We mostly get along great, but I am concerned about a couple friendships she has with other guys that I would classify as "chummy". I'm growing more and more uncomfortable with them as I invest more into the relationship. 

1- Next Door Neighbor: She periodically goes running with this guy after work. He is her age and not a bad looking guy. She has mentioned that he has expressed interest a couple times, complimenting her looks, etc. They have also hung out at one another's house drinking a couple times, and went to a concert once with another girlfriend of hers. They will text jokes and inane stuff periodically, not daily but more than weekly. She says she would never date a next door neighbor, which is a weak argument IMO. People cheat on their spouses with next door neighbors. 

2- Ex-Boyfriend: She keeps in fairly regular contact with him, and hangs out periodically. I've never met this guy. They have mutual friends that moved away, and they hang out together when the mutual friends come to visit. She has told me that she gets the feeling that these friends try to play matchmaker, hoping to get them back together. Last week her shift was cut at work, and she didn't have anything to do in the afternoon. He called and asked her if she would go look at a house with him which he was considering submitting an offer, which she did. She also texts inane stuff with him somewhat regularly. She says he's no threat since his cheating was the cause of their split. 

Honestly, both of these guys seem pretty cool, like people that I might befriend myself. But, I'm not comfortable with her friendships with them. I know this is my baggage coming out, and I never had these boundaries with past partners, but where did that get me? I sat her down last Friday night and explained my position, but we basically left it at "we will agree to disagree". I know this probably just means she won't bother to tell me next time she hangs out with one of them. 

To be fair, I have a 4 yr old daughter with my ex, we had a pretty amicable split, and we do things together as a "family" periodically for my daughter's benefit and/or so I can see her a little more often than my custody schedule dictates. I also keep in touch with an ex-gf of mine who I was with for 6 yrs. We text / talk to catch up maybe once a month. Our kids are friends, and we do playdates maybe once a quarter or less. I have zero relationship interest in these women, but I understand my gf's distaste for them. 

Am I being unfair? I feel like it's okay to have friends of the opposite sex, but I don't like the level of closeness that I see in these two relationships that she has. Random made-up example: I don't think she should be texting with her neighbor about the weather. My ex cheated with a workout partner, so clearly I have issues with running with him. Although I asked her to on a couple occasions, she did not make time to preview the house I just bought with me, and only came over after I was completely moved in. I told her that struck a nerve and she understood. 

This bothers me enough to end the relationship if she doesn't agree to these boundaries, but maybe I just need to put on my big boy britches and get over it unless I want to be celibate? :scratchhead:


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## Hope1964 (Sep 26, 2011)

I've been cheated on by two husbands and I could never be in a relationship with someone who didn't understand what that meant. Which to me is they unfortunately would be on a very short leash. Which means I would probably be by myself.


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## tacoma (May 1, 2011)

No, you are entirely within your rights.

Especially with the ex boyfriend.
Ex lovers take but a millisecond to rekindle.
It`s not acceptable.

Drop a boundary, she stops seeing them or you`re done.

You need to stop it as well, it`s hypocritical.

if your serious about your GF stop playing house with your ex and cut off contact with the other.


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## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

Hope1964 said:


> I've been cheated on by two husbands and I could never be in a relationship with someone who didn't understand what that meant. Which to me is they unfortunately would be on a very short leash. Which means I would probably be by myself.


Hope shows a lot of insight.

Maybe the truth is, OP, that you are not healed enough to be in a relationship yet. I don't know, but maybe just think about it?


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## bkaydezz (Jul 9, 2012)

she must be enjoying the attention fro mthe neighbor if he has expressed intrest and still goes running with him. thats disrespectful. both of you shouldnt have contact with anyone you have been in an intimate relationship with. thats a no go. 
like tacoma said, drop that boundarie. but not just of rher for yourself to.


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## dixieangel (Jun 28, 2012)

I think it takes being hurt to realize the need/importance for boundaries. I would call it not being naive anymore, not baggage.


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## Caribbean Man (Jun 3, 2012)

I think there are way too many " outside influences" , on both sides in your present relationship. What you are feeling is the effects of it.
You are probably not feeling as " close " as you want to be with her.
Both of you should decide if you want to be exclusive . If so then cut off the " excess fat."
That ex bf thing is extremely dangerous.
Whenever you all have serious disagreements he will be right there waiting for her, during her most vulnerable state.


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## ScaredandUnsure (Nov 17, 2011)

I was with you right up until you said you go on outings with your daughter AND your ex to do "family" things. So you hanging out with your ex is pretty much the same as her hanging out with hers. People can and do cheat with familiar, because it's comfortable. And you say you have an ex girlfriend that you text with once in a while and do playdates with....okay.

Not to sound rude, but if she should have to cut the ex from her life, you should do the same with yours (obviously you have a child/children with one of them, but you don't need to hang out and do "family" things with her, just do them with your daughter and GF). You say you have no interest in these women, so your GF may feel the same way about these men.

But either way, cut off the close contact with all the ex's, no more texting for either of you, no more playdates with them, no more "family" outings (I imagine THAT would make your GF feel pretty crappy, even if she doesn't voice it) with your child's mother. And she should stop all contact with her ex and running man.

The boundaries shouldn't only apply to her, you need them as well, since you're doing the same things.


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## wiigirl (Jun 14, 2012)

tacoma said:


> No, you are entirely within your rights.
> 
> Especially with the ex boyfriend.
> Ex lovers take but a millisecond to rekindle.
> ...












:iagree:

Your feelings matter, just like hers does.


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## Mavash. (Jan 26, 2012)

You have female friends so if you are planning on enforcing this boundary be prepared to do it yourself.

But to answer your original question if you aren't confortable with these friendships then they have to end.


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## WorkingOnMe (Mar 17, 2012)

Sounds like she doesn't view your relationship as that serious or 100% exclusive.


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## CLucas976 (Jun 27, 2010)

I think that if you're going to drop that boundary, you need to be certain that you, yourself are capable of it.

It just screams to me that if you're going to be in touch with one ex, and "family" visiting with the other, if she understands and drops the male friends it WILL come back to haunt you. She'll end up building resentment towards you over it (not intentionally) and one day during an argument, it will come out.

you cant say she can't because of xyz, but you can because you've never committed xyz.

just my thought.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

He's not playing house with his ex. He has a child who needs family memories. i did this with my daughter's father after we broke up. For years we'd do birthdays for her, a holiday dinner, a special day at school for her and we'd take her to lunch, etc. THAT was for OUR child...I hated those things :rofl: A night with him? :sleeping: My bfs understood MY boundary with that. My child needed good memories. End of story. My parents did the same for me when they divorced. Dinners, movies, FAMILY time...for me. It stopped as I grew older, as it did for my child, but my ex (as much as I hate to say it) was and is family. That's how I see him. Now it's different because I'm married. I wouldn't do things with him without my husband. But when I was dating, my ex was a part of my life because we were raising a child TOGETHER. That's co-parenting. And my daughter treasures those memories and pictures of us doing things together with the child we created. She didn't ask for our breakup. Sorry, but I don't agree with the fact that he needs to stop doing family things with his daughter and ex. He's not married to his gf and it's only been 7 months with his gf. A gf who doesn't really seem all that committed anyway.

Now with the ex-gf you keep in touch with....wtf for? Your kids are friends and you have playdates? What? Stop this crap. seriously. That's weird. No way in hell would I want my husband's ex and her kids over playing with mine.  :rofl: NO! :scratchhead:

Your gf now is a flirt. Period. She gets off on this. Why would she hang out with an ex who cheated on her if she didn't have another motive than "just friends". Sorry, I don't buy her story that they are just all buds.


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## tiredandout (Jun 1, 2011)

Many people on this board have been cheated on. You are likely to get a lot of "cut off all ties, and she should too" -type of advice.

I honestly cannot tell you one way of the other, because it shoudl be up to you too to agree what works for you. What I do see is that you obviously have not fully come to terms with your past. I suspect having been cheated on is still hurting you and this hurt causes you to feel very insecure about your gf's friendships.

My husband has also been cheated on in his past relationships. He gets very jealous and insecure over my friendships, even girls sometimes, and I can understand why. However, I have _not_ agreed to cut all contacts with these people. Why? 
1) Because they are my friends, and most of them have been since before I met my husband. They are important to me. So is my husband, but eventhough he is the no 1 person in my life, I do not think it's healthy for him to be the _only_ one person in my life.
2) He has friends of both sexes too. He meets his female friends more regularly then I even email with my male friends. I don't have any problem with this. I know he sometimes gets much better along with women as friends. Sometimes I do so with men. To me this is natural.

I would not, however, go drinking alone with a male friend of mine. I just don't trust people on alcohol enough. My husband doesn't do this either. I am also not tight friends with my exes, nor is my husband. We have our exes as friends on facebook, but don't even talk to them. Hubby met one of his a year or so ago to catch up, I haven't met mine in years.

I have to say learning about my husband's jealousy in calm conversations about the subject has affected my behavior some. I try to watch my behavior with new people so that I don't come off as flirty. I check in with my husband if I'm out for a long time without him, and I discuss my plans with him to see how he feels about them. He has read email conversations with my male friends and learned that nothing deep or emotional goes on there, just friendly chatter and joking about.

We haven't fully conquered the issue, but he has gotten much less jealous over the 2 years we've been together. I think it will still take time for him to learn to trust me. Talking about our feelings seems to me to be the key. We both have a lot to learn on that department, how to communicate more effectively and lovingly, but it's slowly getting better.

You two haven't been together for such a long time, it's natural for you to have these jealous feelings. You're starting to feel more deeply towards her, but you don't know whether to trust her with these men or not. Talk, talk, talk about it! I advice you _not_ to walk up to her and say "Stop contacting these guys immediately!" That simply cannot end in mutual understanding. I advice you to talk about it, say your side and hear hers out. Repeat. Brainstorm for different solutions (do not shoot each other down), guidelines and limits for contacting with these people, to try out. Get together again in some time and discuss if the limits worked or if they should be adjusted. Work together on it!

Just my 2 cents.


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## jfv (May 29, 2012)

good advice. especially for the beginning of a relationship.


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## Halien (Feb 20, 2011)

In my opinion, a good indicator of compatability is found through the things that both of you do willingly, without prompting from the other. If you are not comfortable in a relationship where either of you have close friends of the opposite sex outside of your work life, it says a lot more about compatability if she begins to signal that she intends to cut these friends off as the relationship grows closer. If you present her with the new expectation, one which she would never consider on her own, it is going to be a problem at some point in the marriage, most likely, unless it is something that she would be willing to embrace enthusiastically when you bring it up. Just my opinion.

But I can't get past the continued relationship with the ex girlfriend, if I read that right. Not the ex wife, but the ex girlfriend. Not exactly fair to expect something different for her, especially considering that she never had a relationship with one of them.


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## ScaredandUnsure (Nov 17, 2011)

that_girl said:


> He's not playing house with his ex. He has a child who needs family memories. i did this with my daughter's father after we broke up. For years we'd do birthdays for her, a holiday dinner, a special day at school for her and we'd take her to lunch, etc. THAT was for OUR child...I hated those things :rofl: A night with him? :sleeping: My bfs understood MY boundary with that. My child needed good memories. End of story. My parents did the same for me when they divorced. Dinners, movies, FAMILY time...for me. It stopped as I grew older, as it did for my child, but my ex (as much as I hate to say it) was and is family. That's how I see him. Now it's different because I'm married. I wouldn't do things with him without my husband. But when I was dating, my ex was a part of my life because we were raising a child TOGETHER. That's co-parenting. And my daughter treasures those memories and pictures of us doing things together with the child we created. She didn't ask for our breakup. Sorry, but I don't agree with the fact that he needs to stop doing family things with his daughter and ex. He's not married to his gf and it's only been 7 months with his gf. A gf who doesn't really seem all that committed anyway.
> 
> Now with the ex-gf you keep in touch with....wtf for? Your kids are friends and you have playdates? What? Stop this crap. seriously. That's weird. No way in hell would I want my husband's ex and her kids over playing with mine.  :rofl: NO! :scratchhead:
> 
> Your gf now is a flirt. Period. She gets off on this. Why would she hang out with an ex who cheated on her if she didn't have another motive than "just friends". Sorry, I don't buy her story that they are just all buds.


I wouldn't be okay with my guy spending time with his ex. I would actually dump a man for that, the "family" things with the ex would not be okay with me. Because, they're no longer family, and while not all kids would do this, but others, I know it would create false hope for the kids, thinking mom and dad are getting back together. Dad needs to create memories with daughter, and if GF and him are serious, they can include her in those memories.

That may not work for everyone, but for myself, I wouldn't be okay, nor would I ask my ex husband to spend holidays with me, go on trips, etc, that would of created false hope for HIM.


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## I'mInLoveWithMyHubby (Nov 7, 2011)

You still frequently talk with your ex gf, but she should lose hers? Nope, not fair. Should you both ditch the friends? Naw, your not engaged or close to being married.

Neither of us have casual friendships of the opposite sex once we tied the knot. It's a boundary we never cross. I've been cheated on as well by my ex h. 

We also did not ditch the casual opposite sex friendships that were not exes until we were married. I was still going out with my male friends when I was engaged to my husband. My husband trusts me and I trust him. I am not a cheater. We were mostly in group settings anyway whitewater rafting, skydiving, going out after work, ect...

If you were married, I definitely say no friendships of the opposite sex.


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## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

Thank you for all the thoughtful responses. 

I do feel that my position may be somewhat unfair, and that's part of why I am seeking input. There is a difference in the level and frequency of contact, though. I exchange one or two texts a month with my ex gf, but she is in contact with hers more often. Any time I see mine (which is seriously 3-4 times a year, tops) our children are with us - birthday parties, camping, etc. She hangs out with her ex to party. That being said, I understand her discomfort with it, and would be willing to drop this friendship in exchange. 

I respectfully disagree with those saying to ditch doing "family" things with my exw. It is for my daughter's benefit, and she loves it. Maybe it gives her false hope, but I think it also reassures her that her mom and dad work together to make her feel loved, bounded, and secure. If you disagree with this, I would be interested to know if you have children of your own. 

I agree that I'm probably not healed enough to be in a *serious* relationship (which means "headed for marriage" to me), and honestly I'm not sure I want one. Although we've agreed to be sexually exclusive, I don't consider this to be a serious relationship at this point. I enjoy the companionship, and for now I just want to keep it at that level, and I think she feels the same. Marriage and kids is not even on my radar right now, and might not ever be again. Like I said, though, she is more important to me than my minimal relationship with my exgf, and I'm willing to ditch that in exchange.


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## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

And for the record, my exw was also friends with my exgf while we were married. We all got together for playdates then too, with exgf's husband too. I dated her a long time ago (15 yrs+), so she's more like a childhood friend to me than someone I had an adult sexual relationship with.


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## ScaredandUnsure (Nov 17, 2011)

OnTheRocks said:


> Thank you for all the thoughtful responses.
> 
> I do feel that my position may be somewhat unfair, and that's part of why I am seeking input. There is a difference in the level and frequency of contact, though. I exchange one or two texts a month with my ex gf, but she is in contact with hers more often. Any time I see mine (which is seriously 3-4 times a year, tops) our children are with us - birthday parties, camping, etc. She hangs out with her ex to party. That being said, I understand her discomfort with it, and would be willing to drop this friendship in exchange.
> 
> ...


I have 4 children and I've been divorced over 3 years. If I was hanging out with their dad, doing family things, it would give them false hope that mom and dad are getting back together. Don't get me wrong, we are on good terms, co parent really well, etc, while we don't do things together, we often will go to the kids concerts at school, I'm sure there will be weddings that we'll both be at, and grandkids births/birthdays at some point in time.

Now I guess if your single, and your kid really understands the meaning of mom and dad and kid day out, that's fine, whatever. But I think if you're in a relationship, and your S/O has an issue with it, it's disrespectful to them. 

Or if your child doesn't understand that mom and dad aren't getting back together again. I don't know, my kids took our divorce really hard, to purposely flaunt in their faces "Mom and dad are getting along again!" only to tell them "No freaking way is that happening" is pretty bogus. But anyways, my ex husband is remarried now and his wife is his family, and I'm in a relationship, and I consider him as a part of my family, so therefore it would be majorly disrespectful to our S/O's.

This is just my opinion why I wouldn't be okay with it.


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## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

Thanks for the clarification. My take on it is that "avoiding giving your kids false hope" is less important than them spending additional time with both parents, sharing important events with both parents, and seeing you working together for them as parents, especially when it comes to boundaries & discipline.

Mostly we just do "official" things together - dance recitals, xmas morning, 4th of July parade, her bday party... Sometimes we will grab lunch or ice cream after. I did meet them at a local kid pool this past weekend for a couple hours - it was my off weekend, and sometimes I need a little "baby love" fix in that week between. Bad timing because it was just a couple days after discussing my feelings with gf about these male friends.


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## dixieangel (Jun 28, 2012)

I agree when you have children, there will be times you spend together. 

My ex, and father of our 3 kids, has always lived out of state. He would fly the kids out to stay with him and his new wife and kids during the summer months. 

One day while I was at work, I got a call from my ex husband who said he was in town and needed me to leave work immediately because he needed to talk to me. He lives an 8 hour flight away. I knew this wasn't good. I left work and went to talk to him and he explained that something tragic happened to our daughter when she was staying with him the summer before. We went to pick her up from school and went to lunch, had a talk with her, then later we picked up our son and we all went to see a movie. 

My husband was upset that I spent time with my ex husband with my kids. I explained that there were extenuating circumstances and I actually felt like it was the right thing to do. And at the very least, it was a bad day, and I recieved heartbreaking news.

Sometimes, I feel grateful that my ex lives so far away and I've only had to deal with this issue once.


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## dixieangel (Jun 28, 2012)

Well, I should add, my kids will never be going back to stay the summers with their dad. He has to come here to visit. He came a few months back for our daughter's birthday and we were together for that. So, once a year, my husband will HAVE to deal with me being around my ex husband and our kids birthdays, christmas, or other occassions necessary for our kids.


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## ScaredandUnsure (Nov 17, 2011)

OnTheRocks said:


> Thanks for the clarification. My take on it is that "avoiding giving your kids false hope" is less important than them spending additional time with both parents, sharing important events with both parents, and seeing you working together for them as parents, especially when it comes to boundaries & discipline.
> 
> Mostly we just do "official" things together - dance recitals, xmas morning, 4th of July parade, her bday party... Sometimes we will grab lunch or ice cream after. I did meet them at a local kid pool this past weekend for a couple hours - it was my off weekend, and sometimes I need a little "baby love" fix in that week between. Bad timing because it was just a couple days after discussing my feelings with gf about these male friends.


Oh I understand, I totally understand wanting more than to be a weekend parent every other weekend. We've actually worked out our own visitation schedule that differs from the court appointed schedule that comes standard. He does get the kids every weekend, while we got rid of the one weekday for a couple of hours. If I have something to do with the kids on a weekend, I take them, if he can't take them for a weekend, I take them. 

Also if there are days during the week that I need him to take them, he will. We do alternate holidays, but if one of us has something special planned, then the other will work out something else. He likes to have them on Christmas Eve, so he will drop them off to me Christmas morning, so I can do Christmas with them. Things like that. 

The last week now, he's been taking one kid a week, so he gets one on one time with them. He also takes my oldest son from a previous relationship and treats him like his own (he's been dad to him since he was almost 2 yrs old and his wife and her family treat them all good). It works out well for us and our kids.

I like to give him as much time with them as he wants and they want.


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## that_girl (Jul 6, 2011)

I guess my ex and I are different. We were only living together (not married) from when she was ages 1 to 2. After that, we co-parented, so it's really all she knew. 1/2 the week at my house, 1/2 at his. BOTH of us very much involved until he went off the deepend to pursue his music career :scratchhead: But that's another story that doesn't need to be said :lol:

I think the last thing we did together for her was her 5th grade graduation. We all went to lunch. My husband, mom, her dad, her...that's how it is in this house. Same as it will be for her HS grad, college grad, wedding, babies, etc. Hell, when my 2nd daughter was born, my older daughter's father was at the hospital with our daughter because he had her that week. 

My husband knows I am not about to take my ex back. I guess it would be different if we had a long marriage, or whatever. But we just got pregnant and made the best of it. There was never any real love between us. Good lesson about birth control.


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## C123 (Jun 20, 2012)

This is still a very young relationship and you don't consider it "serious". I think that's where it stands right now. Let it develop a little further. If it gets serious for you, and you see a future, then it's time to set boundaries. If she balks then, then you know going forward it's at your own risk.

Also, talking to the ex GF outside of bday parties and kids activities is a violation of your own rule. Don't demand that of your GF until you're ready to do the same.

As for the ex W stuff, that's all been said by others better than I could say myself.

Obviously with your history of dealing with infidelity, you're on high alert a little more than most. That's good. Don't ignore any red flags, but let this relationship develop a little more first. If it gets to the point you need her to cut contact with these dudes and she won't do it, then she's not the right one for you.


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## Enginerd (May 24, 2011)

OnTheRocks said:


> Thank you for all the thoughtful responses.
> 
> I do feel that my position may be somewhat unfair, and that's part of why I am seeking input. There is a difference in the level and frequency of contact, though. I exchange one or two texts a month with my ex gf, but she is in contact with hers more often. Any time I see mine (which is seriously 3-4 times a year, tops) our children are with us - birthday parties, camping, etc. She hangs out with her ex to party. That being said, I understand her discomfort with it, and would be willing to drop this friendship in exchange.
> 
> ...


Women who are head over heals in love with someone will naturally drop their male friends without prompting from their new partner. I can see an immature self entitled 30 year old having some male friends and having a hard time dropping them for a solid guy. That's a reasonable and all too common scenario these days. Partying with an ex is a huge red flag and she's most likely still in love with him. What are the details of their breakup? How long were they together? If someone is moving on to greener pastures they wouldn't be hanging around with their ex. See my point?


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

ScaredandUnsure said:


> I wouldn't be okay with my guy spending time with his ex. I would actually dump a man for that, the "family" things with the ex would not be okay with me. Because, they're no longer family, and while not all kids would do this, but others, I know it would create false hope for the kids, thinking mom and dad are getting back together. Dad needs to create memories with daughter, and if GF and him are serious, they can include her in those memories.
> 
> That may not work for everyone, but for myself, I wouldn't be okay, nor would I ask my ex husband to spend holidays with me, go on trips, etc, that would of created false hope for HIM.


I agree. If a couple made a decision to get a divorce, then they should live it. And that means making it clear to the child that the parents are no longer a couple.

I would also think that joint visitation would make it very difficult for the child to accept the new gf or bf of either parent.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Enginerd said:


> Women who are head over heals in love with someone will naturally drop their male friends without prompting from their new partner. I can see an immature self entitled 30 year old having some male friends and having a hard time dropping them for a solid guy. That's a reasonable and all too common scenario these days. Partying with an ex is a huge red flag and she's most likely still in love with him. What are the details of their breakup? How long were they together? If someone is moving on to greener pastures they wouldn't be hanging around with their ex. See my point?


Yeah and no. But I think the trend these days is to hang onto one's ex. It's a badge of honor. that the break up was amicable. that they're both mature adults who peacefully came to the conclusion that there was nothing wrong with either of them, they just weren't right for one another.

My fiancé hung on to his ex......of 5 months even, so not even an LTR by my definition, until I told him that his keeping her around made me feel redundant.


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## tiredandout (Jun 1, 2011)

Have to still add, that I seriously disagree with the statement that hanging out as a family is always bad, because it gives kids false hope. 

I've been a daughter of divorced parents myself. My dad would stay a while at our place after he dropped us off, to chat with my mom, pet our dogs and catch up with her. Our birthday's, confirmation celebrations, high school graduations, their grandson's baptism, a couple hours every christmas eve — my dad would always be there, most always with his new partner (who happens to be the OW btw, to this day). 

This was many times awkward, I could definately feel the tensions between my mom and my dad's new partner, at least for a couple of _years_ after their divorce. It didn't stop them from trying to do what they could to let us still have both parents present for our special moments. And it did, eventually, force my parents bury the hatchet and learn to be friendly with each other. In the beginning they were obviously just doing it for us. 

Of course this has to be done with grace and determination. There cannot be any sneaking about it. Also there are limits to it. We wouldn't go on family trips anymore after the divorce. We wouldn't spend whole weekends together. But on important occasions, my dad would be there, without a question. While any new spouse is still at dating stage, they probably shouldn't get dumped into the mix to avoid confusion. However, once established, they should immediately be invited in and should consistantly take part to these family events.

I would've been _extremely_ bitter if my mom kept my dad from participating to our big moments. Even more so if my dad's new girlfriend kept my dad away. I had no visions of my parents getting back together, not once. I think this is because my parents talked to us about the divorce and the reasons for it very openly and honestly, at a level suited for each of our age of course. There was no blaming or pointing fingers (or at least very little of it). Our parents told us, that they would no longer be together and dad would leave, but he wouldn't go anywhere from our lives. And he kept that promise.

Of course, this kind of model only works for couples who don't have abuse/addiction/mental health problems that took part in the divorce. But whenever both the exes and the new partners have the emotional maturity and self-control to talk about things openly and endure the discomfort this kind of arrangement is bound to cause, it seems to me to be the way to go.

Who knows, maybe my parents are the expection. But I think they worked it out great. 

So I don't know what my advice here really is. I guess what I'm saying is: your relationship to your exw seems fine to me, as long as you don't keep contact as friends, but only as *parents*. Staying in contact with ex-gf doesn't seem so essential, I would think your kids can still play together if they are very good friends and want to do so, without you having to go camping with ex-gf or otherwise hang around for it? 

You're gf's drinking with her ex seems shady, but it doesn't have to be. If they were friends for a long time, neither of them could think anything of it. I know my sister is still friends with her ex like that. The key to this working, though, is everyone in the picture talking about it very honestly and openly, and new partners hanging out with ex-partners enough that 1) new partner can be assured ex-partner is not trying any shady business 2) ex-partner will be assured to forego any traces of hope they might have had, seeing the new-partner and their ex happily together. 

So the biggest problem with your gf's guy seems to be that you don't know them, and she shoots down your suspicions without talking about them. Ask to meet the guy, for starters. As you said, you're not yet very serious with this girl, so time will tell how each of you will continue to make choices about accomodating each other's differing views.


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## costa200 (Jun 27, 2012)

Simple... Have her drop her male "friends" and be ready for her to ask that you drop yours. If you are unwilling to drop yours then this relationship isn't going anywhere. 

And you really shouldn't be doing family stuff with your ex... That gives out all kinds of wrong ideas to everyone.


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## jh52 (Apr 29, 2012)

One concern is that she has told you that the neighbor has shown interest in her and her ex's friends are trying to get them back together. Take a long hard look at your relationship because why would she want to spend time with these two guys and not you -- or at least respect how you feel about this. She sounds like a very imature 30 year old IMO.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

jh52 said:


> *One concern is that she has told you that the neighbor has shown interest in her and her ex's friends are trying to get them back together. * Take a long hard look at your relationship because why would she want to spend time with these two guys and not you -- or at least respect how you feel about this. She sounds like a very imature 30 year old IMO.


Maybe she said that because she has experienced men who become more ardent when they hear that she is in demand.


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## Kearson (Jan 18, 2012)

As someone who has had sex with the majority of my friends (male and female), if someone I was dating wanting me to cut all ties with anyone I had been involved with, or anyone that was interested in me, I'd be pretty damn lonely... I'd be pretty much left with my family and maybe three female friends.

I'm laughing just thinking about that.

If you don't trust her then you need to work on why you don't trust her. Asking her to cut herself off from social situations that you aren't comfortable with is just unattractive.

ETA: As for the 'family' outings, as long as there are clear boundaries, I think it's healthy for your child to see that you and the ex can get along. It sets a good example.


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## heartsdelight (Apr 2, 2012)

I'm going to back you up on the ex stuff. Your situation sounds very similar to mine. My parents divorced when I was 9. We were told that they were getting divorced and would not be back together. We had every other weekend and one night each week one a week day with my dad. However there were many things we all did together, including one family vacation to a theme park. We stayed in a hotel- my dad and two sisters in one, my mom and two of us with her. There was never any illusion they were getting back together. They talked a little to each other but the attention was always focused on us, not each other. When we were younger my dad used to even sleep on our couch on Christmas Eve so we could all open presents together at 7am sharp. This was very important to my relationship with both parents. 

Nowadays my dad is remarried and my siblings are all adults so we don't really care if he's there as soon as we wake up (and we certainly aren't raiding our stockings at 4am and waiting with bated breath til we can wake our parents up and hit the gifts under the tree). I know a lot of people thought that was definitely weird, but it's just an example. Like others have said, as long as there are clear boundaries I think it's very important for a child to see that you work together with their mom. I know a lot of kids (some who I've seen as a therapist) whose parents won't even talk to each other, they only text or email and only communicate through the child. Not surprisingly, their children feel very torn, which is unacceptable. As was said, your child did not choose this divorce and shouldn't be punished any more than already not being with both parents. If people can't do the basics like holidays, birthdays, plays, recitals, whatever, as well as a day here and there with their ex then the child will feel torn, whether animosity is expressed or not. I hate nothing more than hearing a child say they have to pick which parent to spend their birthday or holidays with (unless they live unreasonably far apart). 

That being said, I do think that if you're serious enough with your gf and your child already knows her and feels comfortable, then you should speak to your ex about including your gf sometimes so that your gf does not feel left out. Depending on your child's age, you can ask how they'd feel about it too (I definitely resented my dad's first girlfriend after my parent's divorce and would have been super pissed had she been at my mom's ever too). 

I'm going home this weekend for a visit. I only have a couple days so I will be having dinner out with my mom, sisters, dad, stepmom, and stepbrother. It does work.

Your ex? that's your business. I'm friends with an ex that I'd rather die than get back with and he feels the same, but I wouldn't hang out with him without my husband now. Bring your gf along. 

As far as her relationships, she IS a flirt. I have a couple guy friends that I keep in light contact with and hang out with still, only with my husband now. I would never dream of hanging out with a new guy friend without my husband and very hesitant to even hang out with old male friend alone now. I can't think of the last time I texted a guy I wasn't related to. I have girlfriends I chat with and occasionally will bounce something off a guy friend if I need another perspective (meaning I'm mad at my husband and want help seeing things from his way) but I get my male emotional needs (and other needs obvi) from my husband. What needs is she getting met from these guys? Why isn't she getting them from you? Is she just reminiscing about the past with her ex? That's never good. Can you run with her? Can you see if she can find a runner that's female? I just think it will probably lead to something. That's how it works. Guys shouldn't be seeking out female friends that are in a relationship and when they do I usually suspect an ulterior motive.


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## Entropy3000 (May 11, 2011)

Kearson said:


> As someone who has had sex with the majority of my friends (male and female), if someone I was dating wanting me to cut all ties with anyone I had been involved with, or anyone that was interested in me, I'd be pretty damn lonely... I'd be pretty much left with my family and maybe three female friends.
> 
> I'm laughing just thinking about that.
> 
> ...


Interesting viewpoint. But you indicate that you have sex with all your friends so this is hardly an endorsement for being ok with her male friends .. just sayin.

You are a SAHM and married. Are you saying that you still have sex with your friends? Or are you saying that you have had sex with all your friends you have now but no longer have sex with them?

I would find my wife hanging out with an EX or other men ... more the unattractive. So maybe he should weigh that risk.


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## NextTimeAround (Dec 15, 2011)

Kearson said:


> As someone who has had sex with the majority of my friends (male and female), if someone I was dating wanting me to cut all ties with anyone I had been involved with, or anyone that was interested in me, I'd be pretty damn lonely... I'd be pretty much left with my family and maybe three female friends.
> 
> I'm laughing just thinking about that.
> 
> ...



Fortunately, you are a more unusual case. And I would never knowingly date a bisexual. 

Regarding the bolded, I nowadays look to date men who only have arms length relationships with women.


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## OnTheRocks (Sep 26, 2011)

Thanks for all the thoughtful replies. 

We're not serious enough for me to feel the need to really put my foot down about this. It might also be a component of why I don't feel like we're moving in that direction. Don't get me wrong - I enjoy her company quite a bit - we have more shared interests than I did with my exW, she is quite nice to look at, great sex, good with my daughter, etc. I've asked myself a few times how I'd feel if we broke it off today, though, and I wouldn't be crushed. And, considering my history & circumstances, I see that as a good thing. 

I do run a bit, but prefer other types of exercise, plus they were running after she got off work but before I did. She joined a functional training type gym a few weeks ago, though, and hasn't been running with the neighbor at all since I started this thread. Also hasn't communicated with her ex save for a text or two, which is fine with me. Drinking and doing things alone with interested males is not acceptable to me, though, and she seems to understand / agree.


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