# Approaching D-Day - NEED SUPPORT



## Anonny123 (Aug 11, 2010)

Some of you know my story and have offered tremendous support which I am so grateful for but I need more... 

Having a hard time dealing with D-Day. Talked to my therapist toay. She said I need to confide in a family member, my parents in particular b/c I cannot go through this alone. One major issue I am having (and forgive me if it sounds pathetic) is worrying about hurting everyone else - my family, his family, our friends. I cannot get past this and this is why my therapist feels that I need support from my family. 

I know I need to leave my husband and I know that our love is strained and tainted and that things will never be the same b/t us. Why do I worry so much about the pain I may cause to others? Am I forgetting the pain and suffering I've endured over all these years?

Need to be put back into perspective...


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## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

Are you talking about 'D' (Discovery) or 'D' (Divorce)? If so, what is it that brought you to this decision? I've followed your previous thread: this seems like a quick jump - kinda bypassing a whole lot that you could do to avoid the damage you will do to others with a divorce (that should be the LAST option, not the first or second!) I know the usual forces quickly leaped onto your threads advocating divorce - but these people advocate it at any chance. Surely you weren't convinced to divorce your husband because people with axes to grind advocated it? Divorce is a _serious_ step - of which I am positive you are aware (your worry about hurting others). It isn't frivolous, rarely solves problems, and can be expensive. 

What is your reason? I am assuming by 'the pain and suffering I've endured over the years' that you are hoping to refresh those memories to justify this step. 

What work have you done to solve those problems _within your marriage?_ None of the ones I saw on your thread are all that difficult to overcome, there are steps you can take to address every one of them. Of course, leaving the relationship can end at least some of them - but I guarantee you carry some with you - you are just as responsible for your marriage as is your husband. The marriage, not you, is at stake here - the problems are the marriage's, not yours! Killing the marriage certainly stops its troubles...but then, killing a patient also ends that person's disease troubles! Aren't there better alternatives?

I'm not saying that divorce isn't an option - and even, in the case of infidelity, a moral one. But running from troubles usually doesn't fix them. Solving them does.

JMHO.


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## Anonny123 (Aug 11, 2010)

I totaly hear you Tanelornpete and no one on here has convinced me to go this route. I know I haven't really done anything to solve these problems but if my husband doesn't want to be with me i'm not going to hang on to nothing.


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## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

Anonny123 said:


> I totaly hear you Tanelornpete and no one on here has convinced me to go this route. I know I haven't really done anything to solve these problems but if my husband doesn't want to be with me i'm not going to hang on to nothing.


I'm glad you aren't just following blindly! I worry about that!

I do want to point this out: in nearly EVERY case of infidelity I've ever encountered, the disloyal spouse doesn't want to be with the loyal spouse. That's part of the territory. That's a LARGE part of the reason for the affair. _Very few people have affairs because they want to be WITH their spouse!_

And yet marriages recover. The reason is simple: its the marriage that is in trouble, and sometimes only one of the two members is aware of the problem - they are the one hanging on 'to nothing.' Actually, they ARE hanging on to something: the marriage. Their spouse is the one hanging on to nothing. And the people who are willing to work at the marriage are the ones with the chance to recover. 

My advice is the same as always: don't divorce until you can look yourself in the mirror and say honestly "I did everything I can." Otherwise, you'll face regret, on top of the other problems you didn't work on! Try to minimize the amount of pain you will face in the future! You are worried about hurting your families, etc: consider this - if you do instead do all you can to save your marriage (rather than running away when the 'worse' of the 'better or worse' comes along) and it still turns out that you can't save it - you'll have their admiration - the hurt will be a LOT less.

Again, JMHO


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## swedish (Mar 6, 2008)

Anonny123 said:


> Having a hard time dealing with D-Day. Talked to my therapist toay. She said I need to confide in a family member, my parents in particular b/c I cannot go through this alone. One major issue I am having (and forgive me if it sounds pathetic) is worrying about hurting everyone else - my family, his family, our friends. I cannot get past this and this is why my therapist feels that I need support from my family.


In reading your posts, it seems you struggle with losing the comfortable part of your life (current group of friends, unknown future) which are all understandable, so rather than jumping into announcing a divorce, why not keep the status quo for a bit longer and confide in someone you trust, like your parents. You can voice your concerns with the questionable things you have found regarding other women, gambling, etc. but also say (if that's how you still feel) that if those issues didn't exist you still love him and wish to stay married. Yes, you should have support, but family/friends will often support whatever decision you come to so if it's saving the marriage or divorcing make sure you let them know how you ideally would like this to go.


Anonny123 said:


> I know I need to leave my husband and I know that our love is strained and tainted and that things will never be the same b/t us.


Many strained and tainted marriages do recover...and yes, your husband will need to be on board at some point for that to happen...he may be going along as usual because he has no idea you are onto what he's been doing and so he has no real reason to change...laying it all on the table may be the wake-up call he needs. At least it's worth a shot.


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## Anonny123 (Aug 11, 2010)

Thanks swedish. You are right I am fearful of losing the comfortable things and I do agree I should confide in my parents but I have been keeping the status quo way too long. I honestly feel that laying it out on the table w my husband will give him a wake up call but knowing that he got away w it all this time and would now want to repent (if that's how it goes) would kill me. There's also the chance that he's waiting for me to make the first move b/c all I keep thinking and feeling is how he'd rather be single anyway.


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## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

> You are right I am fearful of losing the comfortable things and I do agree I should confide in my parents but I have been keeping the status quo way too long.


Why 'too' long? Who made up that rule? Would your parents tell you "Hey, we would have supported you, but the time for supporting our daughter in painful situations expired 4 months ago...sorry!" I really doubt that! Most likely they'd be amazed that you have been putting up with it this long. Making statements like that _seem _to be a justification to give up - without reflecting reality!



> I honestly feel that laying it out on the table w my husband will give him a wake up call but knowing that he got away w it all this time and would now want to repent (if that's how it goes) would kill me.


It may very well be a wake up call. Regardless, confronting a person about an affair (drug abuse, gambling, etc.) is a PRONOUNCEMENT that the bad behavior is 'on notice'. You are both aware of the issue, and will no longer let it slide. It may or may not bring about change in your spouse. It most certainly brings about change in you (which is the point). You are on the path to changing your life, with or without them. It's the start of your recovery.

I am more concerned with this phrase:



> but knowing that he got away w it all this time and would now want to repent (if that's how it goes) would kill me.


So...if someone admits they were wrong, apologizes and changes their behavior, you will die? Is your life dependent upon hatred, anger and resentment? I wouldn't think so! It may be that you are angry: but to arrange your life so that you can maintain that posture is...unhealthy, at best. What happens if it turns out (as is usually the case) that there are things that you have done in the past that have hurt him? Or anyone else you cared about? What would you think if they didn't want you to apologize because that would be just so darn inconvenient and irritating? What would that tell you about them, what kind of -person would the appear to be....what are they really?



> There's also the chance that he's waiting for me to make the first move b/c all I keep thinking and feeling is how he'd rather be single anyway.


I'll bet that is a HUGE possibility (it's also _very_ common). If he can get you to file the divorce, he will look all innocent and hurt by that woman who deserted him. He can place the blame for all the problems on your shoulders and skate away with you looking horrible.

On the other hand, that attitude is a blessing. This gives you PLENTY of time to make that marriage desirable, and that single life look awful and lonely. It all depends on the work you put into it.

Take him up on it. If he wants the divorce: let him do all the work. Let HIM bear responsibility for the end of his marriage!


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## Dowjones (Sep 16, 2010)

Tanelornpete said:


> I'm glad you aren't just following blindly! I worry about that!
> 
> I do want to point this out: in nearly EVERY case of infidelity I've ever encountered, the disloyal spouse doesn't want to be with the loyal spouse. That's part of the territory. That's a LARGE part of the reason for the affair. _Very few people have affairs because they want to be WITH their spouse!_
> 
> ...


While I question the first two, the last paragraph is very good advice, Anonny. Be sure that you have done all you can, before divorcing, you will feel better about yourself. Good Luck!!


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

Anonny123,
It sounds like you fear confrontation, not just with what’s going on in your life with your marriage, but confrontation in general. And because of that you’d rather walk away from your marriage than confront and solve the issues. But there will always be issues in life that need confronting and resolving. It’s a given, a fact of life.

Confrontation is quite a strong concept. It conjures up images of people arguing, raised voices and tempers and perhaps like most of us that’s what you don’t like about it.

But you don’t have to confront your husband face to face or by yourself. You can bring the issues up in a letter to him, leave it at home and go and stay with a friend or family for a week or so and just wait and see how he responds. If he wants to repair the damage he’s done then tell him you’ll only talk about the issues through MC.

On the other hand if you have no “hope”, if hope is truly gone then you’ve just got to do what you’ve got to do.

Bob


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## Anonny123 (Aug 11, 2010)

Tanelornpete said:


> I am more concerned with this phrase:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I didn't mean that if my husband repents it will kill me b/c I want to stay angry. I would feel at a loss b/c he could have doen that the 1st time I confronted him with over stepping our boundris 3 years ago - I wouldnt be in the position I am now if he did that back then. 

Initially, I wanted him to leave me so I'd be the "victim" and he would look like the bad guy but he's not going to do it b/c he's having his cake and eating it too. I have come to the conclusionthat I can no longer live with investigating my husband, questioning his every move, not trusting him or being able to look him or any of the people I know are aware of what he's done behind my back in the eyes. That is why I think I need to take control of the situation.


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## Anonny123 (Aug 11, 2010)

Dowjones said:


> Be sure that you have done all you can, before divorcing, you will feel better about yourself. Good Luck!!


All that I can do - how can I go through marriage counseling and forgive someone who has repeatedly done such terrible things beind my back and was confronted about it 3 years ago to only get worse!! I am done!


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## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

> I didn't mean that if my husband repents it will kill me b/c I want to stay angry. I would feel at a loss b/c he could have doen that the 1st time I confronted him with over stepping our boundris 3 years ago - I wouldnt be in the position I am now if he did that back then.


Yes, he could have. However, as you point out - "...I know I haven't really done anything to solve these problems..." - he had NO REASON to do so. Basically, you just let him continue, and are mad because he didn't choose to change voluntarily. How do you know he isn't doing the same thing: wishing you would change something or other, but not saying _anything_ about it, and instead, going out and drinking, etc., to escape?

Here's a little story that illustrates something:

You're driving down the road and a wheel flies off the car. You manage to pull over, and put it back on. Driving down the road, the wheel flies off again. You put it back on and continue. The problem is that unless you take the effort to find out WHY that wheel keeps coming off, it will just keep happening - until one time it causes a major accident, and the car is destroyed.​
You say that you would feel at a loss if he repented, apologized and changed his ways. I can understand that - you would wonder why he hadn't done that earlier. But as I wrote before - he had darn little incentive: as far as he knew, you sort of got mad, but really didn't care. You said nothing, enabled him, etc.. (This is how it appears from his side, not yours.) So, yes, you might feel at a loss - but how would wanting to avoid that feeling (which passes quickly) be the grounds for divorce? 

If he does repent, apologize and change - wouldn't he then be the husband you had wanted? You might feel at a loss - but wouldn't that feeling be replaced soon enough? 



> All that I can do - how can I go through marriage counseling and forgive someone who has repeatedly done such terrible things beind my back and was confronted about it 3 years ago to only get worse!! I am done!


You go through marriage counseling (if that is an option you both choose) by going to the sessions and doing the homework. It's that simple. So far, all of your objections have come across like vapor. You object with things like 'I might feel confused' or professing to fail to understand how to open the front door of the marriage counselor's office. Or even how to forgive (it's the same regardless of the number of offenses - the number of things to forgive increases, not the mental act itself.)

You admit that you didn't work on any problem (you wanted them to maybe fix themselves?) And you are now so tired of your husband acting in ways that you find irritating (but weren't willing to address) that you are ready to divorce him. You say you are done.

So why are you here? You asked for support - if you need help figuring out the divorce papers, there's a thread series on this forum for that. It seems, though, that what you are looking for is for people to help you build up your anger so that you have fuel to act. Anger is a useful tool - it is a reminder that things are not going the way you want them to. But it is a huge mistake to act on any emotion, ever. To act wisely, to act in a way that will avoid danger, pain, and other negatives in the future means that you have to act rationally now. Instead of looking to get angry enough to file divorce, look for RATIONAL reasons to divorce. If the only reason you are divorcing your husband is because he isn't doing what you expect, remember this:

Expectations are useless unless they are understood by the focus of your expectation. You have walked through your marriage grinding your teeth because your husband isn't behaving in the manner you have assigned to him - he isn't doing what YOU want. Yet you "...haven't really done anything to solve these problems..." Basically, all he knows is that you got a little mad about him because he talked to other women. But, then you let that slide and life went back to normal. Because he didn't even realize how vitally important this was to you, he figured it was some sort of off day for you. Or, he simply isn't aware of what commitment means. Any number of reasons. None of which mean anything unless you communicate it to him, clearly, so that he understands. Unless he understands your boundaries, he will continually trample over them. And your refusal to work on them meant that he had NO idea they were there. 

Now you are angry because he keeps stepping on your grass - when you have clearly marked with an imaginary 'Keep Off The Grass Sign'. Expectations!

If you do wish to divorce - go ahead - it's your choice, and it would even be moral if he had actually been unfaithful. But do NOT do it out of anger. Do it when you are not angry. The reason: if you act out of emotions, you may do something that you will heavily regret later. The negative consequences of acting out of anger can far outweigh the pressing desire to satisfy your temper _ right now_.


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

Anonny123 said:


> I didn't mean that if my husband repents it will kill me b/c I want to stay angry. I would feel at a loss b/c he could have doen that the 1st time I confronted him with over stepping our boundris 3 years ago - I wouldnt be in the position I am now if he did that back then.
> 
> Initially, I wanted him to leave me so I'd be the "victim" and he would look like the bad guy but he's not going to do it b/c he's having his cake and eating it too. I have come to the conclusionthat I can no longer live with investigating my husband, questioning his every move, not trusting him or being able to look him or any of the people I know are aware of what he's done behind my back in the eyes. That is why I think I need to take control of the situation.


Anonny, I was somewhat where you are. I’d just had enough and I was one very angry man. I split with my wife while I was seriously hurt and angry. I don’t believe I could have done it any other way. I have some regret of my marriage of many years coming to an in the way it did. But I have not regretted in nearly a year now the fact that my marriage came to an end.

I am on my way to getting a divorce. I never ever wanted that in my life and still feel sad at times that the women I was in love with will no longer be by my side. But those feelings pass. I simply couldn’t take it anymore. If that’s where you are then I understand that feeling.

Bob


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## Anonny123 (Aug 11, 2010)

he had NO REASON to do so. Basically, you just let him continue, and are mad because he didn't choose to change voluntarily. How do you know he isn't doing the same thing: wishing you would change something or other, but not saying _anything about it, and instead, going out and drinking, etc., to escape?

I did not let him continue - I forgave him out of love and NEVER expected him to continue doing what he did. He should have realized that - him not doing so only shows me the real person he is - selfish, no remorse, narcissistic.

I don't go out drinking escape or anything else for that matter. I've just had it with being taken advantage of and taken for a fool._


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## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

> I did not let him continue - I forgave him out of love and NEVER expected him to continue doing what he did. He should have realized that - him not doing so only shows me the real person he is - selfish, no remorse, narcissistic.


Please explain how forgiving him out of love and EXPECTING him to stop is 'not letting him continue'?

You say that he 'should' have realized (in other words, you had an unspoken condition that you demanded - also unspoken - that he fulfill). 

Him not doing so shows that he did not see any reason to change. (It does NOT demonstrate that he is narcissistic - that's an entirely different story!) But I do want to point something out:

You wrote above that you "......haven't really done anything to solve these problems..." yet you expect him to. You expect him to do whatever your unspoken conditions demand of him - without revealing this to him. You mention that he 'should' do such and such (why 'should' he? I admit it would be very nice!) Your unspoken demands - the things upon which you base and create your anger - are these not selfish behavior? In a marriage, _communication_ not expectation are the keys. 

You said that you 'did not let him continue' - yet you also say you "......haven't really done anything to solve these problems..." Those two statements cancel each other. They cannot exist at the same time. 

Your 'did not let him continue' was all internal wishing, unspoken demands, unexplained conditions. Perhaps even to yourself! And now you are angry because he didn't pass your unspoken test.

Am I being harsh on you? A little - but not out of spite. I am doing this because no matter WHO you end up with - even your husband - unless you step out of the unspoken and into the actual, you will face THE SAME PROBLEMS in the future. You will NEVER find someone who magically knows your expectations and fulfills them. You MUST communicate them to spare yourself pain. 

That is, unless it is the anger and pain that you seek - and that is more common that you can imagine! Some people are addicted to the adrenaline of anger!

Again I will reiterate: 

He had NO REASON to change. Basically, you just let him continue, and are mad because he didn't choose to change voluntarily. How do you know he isn't doing the same thing about you - wishing you would change something or other, but not saying anything about it, and instead he goes out and drinking, etc., to escape? How is that different from you sitting at home, imagining all your conditions for him, and seething because he won't respond to what you haven't said to him?


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## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

"Approaching D-Day - NEED SUPPORT"

Anonny123, what sort of support is that you're in need of?

Bob


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## Anonny123 (Aug 11, 2010)

I don't even know anymore. All I know is that I am unhappy in this marriage and I have been looking like a fool for a long time and have just about had it. We definitely haev communication issues but this is b/c he refuses to express his feelings on anything - he'd rather sweep things under the rug or just run from his problems. he's always been like that I guess.


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## Anonny123 (Aug 11, 2010)

Tanelornpete said:


> Please explain how forgiving him out of love and EXPECTING him to stop is 'not letting him continue'?
> 
> You say that he 'should' have realized (in other words, you had an unspoken condition that you demanded - also unspoken - that he fulfill).


I told him to stop talking to the girl and that I wasnt accepting his friendship with her. In addition to saying this I forgave him. Therefore, if he had any morals and any respect for me he would have never continued this scheme.


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## Tanelornpete (Feb 2, 2010)

Dear, _please _read this with care:



> Therefore, if he had any morals and any respect for me he would have never continued this scheme.


In a perfect world, this would be true. Of course, in a perfect world this would not have been necessary. 

However, in most cases - while this _is_ a moral issue, _and_ an issue of respect - the fact that it happens is not as related to those areas as you might want to think. The reason it usually happens is because the infidelity is supplying something that is missing at home. The ideas of respect and morals take a quick backseat (they are rationalized away by what we call Disloyal Dizziness - others call it 'The Fog'.) Doesn't mean they exist. It means that something takes priority.

In a marriage a person does things that either build up or destroy that love within it. It is the responsibility of both partners to find out _exactly_ (not guessing, not assuming, but actually learning) what those things are, and then do all they can to avoid reducing the love, and do all they can to increase the it. In a marriage where that love is strong, infidelity is a moot point (much like craving another meal _right after_ you finished a very satisfying one).

However, in a marriage where the love is NOT taken care of, the danger increases that infidelity will happen. It's like starving - the hungrier you get, the more likely you are to start looking for something to eat, maybe even stealing it.

So, in your marriage, something was missing - the issues you hadn't "....really done anything to solve..." (plus any he really hadn't done anything to solve) - left something that the infidelity _seemed_ to provide (I always say 'seemed' because it is usually never even close). And your husband took off in that direction. Absolutely wrong thing to do - but he had convinced himself it would fulfill whatever he needed.

And you found out, told him to stop, and that you wouldn't accept his friendship with her. So he did. And the marriage went on....

and "...I haven't really done anything to solve these problems ..."

So the love keeps being diminished, it isn't being built (do you have ANY idea what his Emotional Needs are - or the Love Kindlers he tends to need?) In essence, there is starvation, and your rule is "you cannot steal stuff to eat." Well - that is a GOOD rule! No one would argue against that! But implied is also this: "And, I'm not going to feed you either - you just have to sit here and act like you aren't hungry"

Or - - - you stuck that wheel back on - but have NO IDEA why it fell off - nor did you do any work to fix whatever made it fall off - you simple told it to stay on. And expected it to do so.

And the wheel fell off. He got hungrier. Pick your analogy. In any event - a repeat. And you still demand that he stay home and act like his hunger (for positive attention? more sex? admiration? respect?) does not exist.

And now you find yourself in this place. He simply refuses to act like he doesn't have the needs he feels (and apparently won't reveal them to you!) and you are tired of expecting him to act like he does not feel hungry. You want out.

Like I said before: divorce is a moral option in the case of infidelity - and in today's world, morality is hardly necessary to demolish a marriage - you can divorce for whatever reason you want. 

All I'm trying to say, as clearly as possible, is that your desire to avoid confrontation (as Bob pointed out) and your use of unvoiced, and unrealistic expectations - and a lack of boundaries - is NOT the sole domain of this marriage. Those things follow you wherever you go, and running from this marriage WILL NOT SOLVE the problems.

You have three options in this area:

1) Passivity - expecting your husband to do the things you want him to because he 'should' be doing them, and grinding your teeth in pure anger because its just not happening.

2) Assertiveness: clearly stating desires, needs, and boundaries, and being willing to live by them.

3) Aggressiveness - running from mess to mess, experiencing anger every time it happens, and then moving to the next one.​
The best option is to be assertive - learn your boundaries, state them clearly TO YOURSELF (along with figuring out what you will do if those boundaries are crossed). Then state them to your partner, in a calm, rational manner.

Unless you take this step, all relationships you enter will suffer pretty much the same troubles you just experienced.


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