# Went to IC w him



## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

To talk about sex issues. It was good. I was afraid that I would be too nervous to say anything sexual related but it was fine. We talked about how I have a higher drive, which she already knew. I told her that he gets mad if I madturbate and he said he doesn't get mad but he doesn't want to know about it. I said I never have time to myself so I can't and I shouldn't have to feel like I'm cheating on my husband. She was nice but very much understood my side and was probing him to figure out what his issue is. He got upset and started crying but he didn't know. He said he feels like he is letting me down. By the end of it she said we would do really well in sex therapy. I think we're going to go. 
I feel better getting it off my chest and hearing a professional tell him there is nothing wrong with it, and that it's good that I'm trying to fulfill my needs. I just don't know why he gets so upset.
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## keeper63 (Mar 22, 2012)

Apparently, he doesn't know why he gets so upset, either. I think ST is a really good idea, worked wonders for us.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

Sorry for the double post, my phone was acting up. What issues did you guys have to deal with?
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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

Well something had to give and it's leading me to thoughts of cheating. That sexual energy had to go somewhere, I'm not a nun.
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## Cherie (May 9, 2012)

What is IC?
How long has this been going on/his feelings of inadequecy? How often does he think he would like to have it? Perhaps he has a low sex drive due to low testosterone? This is common as men age.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

I would like to have sex three or more times a week. I guess variety and surprise would be nice. When we met two years ago our drives were similar, we were screwing like rabbits. Then we got engaged and moved in together and he started slowing way down to once a week, one and done. I am multi but I like when he has more than one too in a day. He used to. He was multiorgasmic one time but shows no interest in figuring out how to do it again. 
We've gone back and forth about this and the fact that he stopped performing oral. He also started getting headaches on a daily basis and he's been taking a preventative which is helping. We have both been really stressed lately with buying a house and moving. I know he's exhausted but at my age being tired doesn't mean my need for orgasms goes away. 
His ex didn't want sex very much and he always initiated so I think he's having trouble dealing with a woman who is so sexually aware and liberated. 
He is working on the oral part, which I appreciate but this masturbation thing is so middle ages I just can't stand it.
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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

IC is individual counseling. He started going because he was having big issues with his kids and his ex. It has helped him a lot. I know he has a lot going on but at some point we have to work on us.
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## Cherie (May 9, 2012)

3 or more times a week isn't bad. I masterbate frequently too simply b/c hubs isn't around or can't keep up. I wonder /has your hubby said why he stopped the oral?

I'm glad you were able to get it off your chest in the meeting and hope his feelings of inadequecy can change, for both your sakes.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

He said there was an odor. And I told him that the time it happened was because we'd had sex the day before and he was smelling his own cum, which is quite pungent. Then it turned into a power thing and I told him that oral is my favorite sex act and I didn't want to live without it. This was after six months without it, and him getting mad when I would ask for it. Didn't even do it on our honeymoon and I didn't ask because I didn't want to ruin the romance. 
I think he feels inadequate because of crap his ex did and said. She hardly wanted sex and he had a hard time getting her to orgasm, if he couldn't she would get mad. Then she decided to change her personality and started going out at night with other women. Long story short she was looking for a replacement and most likely cheated on him a few days before they agreed to separate. So suddenly she was out trying to get laid and screwing around. 
What gets me is that my husband is a great lover (other than the other issues lol). I can't imagine how she couldn't orgasm with him. He's an amazing kisser, you would think he's taken sex classes or something but I'm only the 2nd person he's been with.
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## Cherie (May 9, 2012)

I'm sorry to hear that. Its sad to think about that, and hoe you guys can get it back is a scary thought...

As far as the odor goes, I think that is an excuse. perhaps there are deeper reasons. Yes, odors can be an issue especially after he comes in there, but obviously that is temporary. He should know that. My husband has mentioned it once too, and it was taken care of...seems it would be as simple as that if it were the only reason.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

And if odor were the only reason he could have suggested we shower first or bought some flavored lube. But he just stopped. I orgasm easily and he doesn't get that not all o's ate created equally. Just because I have one via penetration doesn't mean it's the same awesome feeling as oral. I think he's very fixated on vaginal/penis penetration as being "real" sex and everything else is just not as good. She mentioned that is part of sex therapy, to get the focus off penis in vagina.
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## Gyme (May 15, 2012)

Love the polar irony to my situation. Will be watching...good luck.
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## Posse (Jan 30, 2012)

diwali123 said:


> He said there was an odor. And I told him that the time it happened was because we'd had sex the day before and he was smelling his own cum, which is quite pungent.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


Remove that excuse by douching after sex.

I hope that helps, but I fear there will be excuse after excuse.from him.

God, what I would do to be in his position....


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## keeper63 (Mar 22, 2012)

dwali123 - We went to a marriage counselor who also has sex therapy credentials and experience. Durining counseling, my wife talked about her childhood issues (Catholic upbringing, how she was neglected because she was the youngest, some sexual abuse at the hands of a cousion, etc.). I also had some childhood issues (very strict Catholic upbringing, father was a workaholic) that we were able to work through.

My wife's upbringing told her that any kind of oral sex was sinful, that sex was for procreation, not pleasure, etc. I think the sexual abuse and neglect were very harmful to her self-esteem. She had a few more individual sessions than I did to get through this.

The sex therapy was basically us telling the counselor what sorts of things we did sexually and how we individually and collectivley felt about the current state, and what our ideal sexaul deisred states would be. Ultimately, the counseler gave us individual insight into what each of us wanted, needed, and felt about sex, and how sex should be an enjoyable, guilt-free way for us to be closer emotionally. Over time, she was able to get past her repression, which seemed to dovetail with a surge in her hormones. For about 3 months, we were having sex 5-6x per week, and 2 or 3 of those were mind-blowing, best-ever sexual expreiences for both of us. In particular, she now enjoys me giving her cunnilingus and she asks for it almost every time, allows me to use a toy on her, and she will service me orally after I pull out of her p*ssy, all things she never did before.

Now we have settled into 2-3x per week, plus she will masturbate in the morning just about every day, because it makes her feel more energized, and she can get off in about 4 or 5 minutes this way. I sometimes would like more frequency, but the quality of our lovemaking is so much better now than it was, I'm defintiely thinking that quality trumps quantity.

I think your husband may have some deep-seated issues (like his aversion to giving you cunnilingus), and I would think a good sex therapist could help. Just be prepared to lay it all on the table in very clinincal terms (our therapist wanted us to describe our sex lives in detail, including specific acts, and how they made us feel when we did or did not do them, etc.).

Good luck!


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## FormerNiceGuy (Feb 13, 2012)

diwali123 said:


> I just don't know why he gets so upset.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


He gets upset because he has an issue here that needs to be worked through. Rather than push, I would try to be supportive. There are skeletons in his closet. Once the lights get turned on and you and the therapist don't reject him when you see the skeletons, he will be able to start his healing process.

It is easy to take this stuff personally. *Remember, it doesn't have anything to do with you*. Yes, you have to deal with the repercussions, but it isn't personal.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

He was raised catholic and did precana classes before his first wedding. He denies that it is a factor but I think it might be.
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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

I don't have a lot of time but he was raised in a pretty sheltered environment. And while I was taking women's studies classes and human sexuality classes in college he was taking hard science classes. I'm actually amazed sometimes by how good he is in bed considering....
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## keeper63 (Mar 22, 2012)

I think the Catholic upbringing is almost always a huge factor. Our MC/ST was raised in a Catholic home, and she really understood the core issues. They don't call it "Catholic guilt" for nothing.

My parents were very strict, very devout Catholics (they insisted we only go to Latin Mass), and their views and behaviors had a much bigger impact on me than I would have thought before therapy. The fact that my Dad worked all the time and was never around left me with some deep-seated self-worth issues, and an almost irrational need to feel accepted by others - especially by my wife.

My wife had the double-whammy of Catholic upbringing and family sexual abuse, and she needed several more sessions than I did to work through it.

I hope your husband is able to work through his issues, and he will definitely need your understanding and support.

I do think a good therapist is critical. We ended up talking to a few of them before we made our selection, and in retrospect I think we made a really good choice.


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## keeper63 (Mar 22, 2012)

I almost forgot, but one of the issues we had with sexuality and Catholicism was the whole birth control thing. Birth control in general was a no-no, along with pre-marital sex. We loved each other before we were married, and didn't see the practical sense of abstinence. So we both harbored guilt over being sexually active before we were married.

We wanted to wait to have children, so there was another dollop of guilt over using a condom, even after we were married.

I think the Catholic sexual dogma cast a pall/wet blanket over many areas of our sexuality. It took a lot of work to get past all of that, and realize that passionate sex is a critical part of a successful marriage, and that it is OK for it to be pleasurable, and it was OK to engage in any sexual act we wanted to (as a monogamous couple) as long as it was consensual and no one got hurt.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

Posse: the grass is always greener. I envy women
whose husbands want it do much they get sick of it. One big issue for me is that when we started dating he told me that he loved doing it. Now I wonder if that was a lie or if he changed. It feels like it was a lie, and that really bothers me. Maybe he didn't think we'd be together long so he didn't think it mattered. I would ask him why he didn't like it anymore and he'd say he didn't feel like it. Really. Then there was the odor issue. It bothers me that he did this freely with his ex but stopped with me. I've tried explaining that my orgasms aren't equal and after a month without it I start to feel unfulfilled and it's like pressure is building up. There have been times I didn't want to have sex because I knew he wasn't going to do it and if I asked he would get mad and the slight hope of it happening was too much for me. 
I know he's been talking to his C about this by a couple of her reactions to things I said. I didn't even get to the oral part. The weekend before last we were fooling around and he was using his finger on me which I think he thinks feels the same as oral and that's his substitute. I was begging him to go down and he didn't respond just kept using his finger. I just got mad and got up and told him I do so much for him and he can't even go down for thirty seconds, I ended up sleeping on my daughter's bed. 
He said he was teasing me and he was going to do it but I didn't really buy it. 
Next night he just went down like he couldn't get enough, he went above and beyond what I feel I need fro
it which really surprised me. He also let me grind on his face in 69 which again really surprised me. He must have decided he needed to man up and do it. I didn't feel like he was just found it for my sake which is nice.
As for masturbation, he told her he only got mad because I was throwing it in his face one night when he turned me down and went to take a shower. He heard me open the bottle of lube and came out of the bathroom outraged that I would do that. She couldn't understand how that was throwing anything in his face and he got really sad and said he didn't either. 
She had me turn to him and tell him how I feel and untold him I feel like he's being controlling and he doesn't own my body, and when we got married I pledged monogamy but I didn't sign up for being sexually controlled.
She was good about reinforcing the normalcy of my actions and that part of a healthy relationship includes this. He just had no clue why he feels this way and he said he feels like he's letting me down. She asked if he does it and he changed the subject. I know he must. He gets home before I do most days and he takes long showers. I can't get off in the shower and even the bathtub is hard for me. I like my bed. 
He claims his ex never did it and I said I highly doubt it considering she sold sex toys. 
We have a lot to work through. She also told him that things like his attitude can destroy a marriage and I know he needed to hear that. 
Last night he was really really affectionate, I felt like he was really hugging me for the first time in a while. It was more an embrace than just random hug of mindlessness. 
I have been drinking almost every night, having two ****tails. Sometimes less and a couple times a week more. I don't like it but it started after the honeymoon. I know he doesn't like it either but I realized its because I'm blocking him out, and it takes away the extra nervous energy I have from lack of orgasms. Plus if I do hit on him and he says no it makes it easier to handle. I am glad that I figured it out, I feel like a weight has been lifted.
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## Wanting1 (Apr 26, 2012)

Posse said:


> Remove that excuse by douching after sex.
> 
> No! No! No! Douching is very bad for the vagina.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

Yes but there are ways to clean without a douche.
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## Aristotle (Apr 4, 2012)

Me and my wife do the deed daily, multiple times, but we move from anal, to vagina, to mouth. 

I cannot find the douche comment, so I am unsure what the comment meant. If it had something to do with an odor or the vagina still having old semen in it the next day, I also have this problem. I have noticed that if I orgasm inside my wife, the next night it will still be cleansing and have an odor. Otherwise, she NEVER has an odor. I'm not sure if our PH doesn't match well, but we actually finish in her vagina less than any other place. What other ways is there to clean it? She is against douching. I cum very shallow, head only, and clean it with tongue then give to her. Other than that, I do not know of any other methods. She prefers I pull out prior to an orgasm and cum in her anally. She gets very aggressive and sexual from this though, and I think its because the colon absorbs the semen and it's hormones much better than any place else. Cumming in her mouth or vagina causes no real change in her personality.


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## Aristotle (Apr 4, 2012)

Diwali, that's sad you have turned to alcohol to handle rejection and to control your sexual energy. Not good at all.


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## keeper63 (Mar 22, 2012)

If I had to guess, I would say that he has some issues around his Catholic upbringing that make him feel on some level that sex in general or certain sexual acts (like oral) are "bad". I would guess that he has issues around giving you oral that he likely has had all along, but didn't want to tell you. He has given you oral lately because he is feeling the pressure from you and from the therapist to do so.

With respect to your masturbation, from a Catholic perspective, he may have a deep-seated belief that masturbation is bad (perhaps especially female masturbation). He also seems threatened by your high sex drive, and your ability to satisfy yourself sexually. This might make him feel inadequate, like you don't really need him in order to meet your sexual needs.

His feelings of inadequacy may also explain some of his controlling behavior, it might be his response to him not being in the "driver's seat" with respect to the sexual dynamic.

He does appear to be making some progress, so I would encourage him to go to sex therapy with you, I think it will help a lot.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

The more u think about it the more I think his catholic upbringing affected him. He said that he didn't believe in it all but he must have had enough belief if he was willing to have a Cathloic wedding the first time.
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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

I also think he has a Madonna/***** complex. It was ok for us to be sexy and wild when I was just someone he was dating but now I'm his wife. I'm supposed to be pure as the driven snow.
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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

diwali123 said:


> I also think he has a Madonna/***** complex. It was ok for us to be sexy and wild when I was just someone he was dating but now I'm his wife. I'm supposed to be pure as the driven snow.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


I think it's more likely that he was sure he wanted a HD woman because his ex was so LD.

Now he finds out HE isn't HD. He's more middle of the road between you too. He just didn't know it.

He does have a weird hang up about masturbation. It might be related to Catholicism. I'm sure he does masturbate. It's ok for him to do it, just not you.

Honestly, that is an issue I'd investigate in sex therapy. My H is Catholic and has zero hangups about masturbation. However, I noticed that if he did it even once, well that was it for the day. I finally was able to ask him very seriously to avoid it as much as possible so he would get satisfaction from me. To wake me up if he needed to. I wouldn't be surprised at all if that's what's happening--long shower and then none left over for you.

Glad you are seeing a sex therapist. And alcohol never solved any problems. It just puts bandaids over your issues and eventually they fall off and you'll find the wound underneath is festering.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

I just grew up in an area with a ton of Catholics and most of the guys were horny weirdos with nice fetishes. I guess that's my image of it, that people in their 40's didn't really take any of it seriously and it just made them want to do naughty things. 
Thanks everyone for your comments, you've given me a lot to think about. I appreciate it. 
I think he did think that he was HD, and it's hard for him to get over the fact that he's not. Maybe.
What I don't get is that he does have things that he likes that are not vanilla at all but then other things are off limits. It's very confusing.
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## keeper63 (Mar 22, 2012)

I think you may have hit the nail on the head. Your perception of Catholic guys is that they have fetishes, and my perception of Catholic guys (having been one) is sexual repression.

When you say that some of your H's behaviors are not at all vanilla, perhaps those behaviors are his "fetish" and the other more normal things that he thinks are off limits are a product of Catholic sexual repression.

I would nevertheless advise sex therapy, preferably from someone with experience/familiairity with the whole Catholic guilt thing. 

If your husband did pre cana, and the whole Catholic wedding process, either he or his first wife or both of them were steeped in Catholic tradtion.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

Well in this area anyone whose been in practice for at least two years probably has seen their share of repressed Catholics. 
It's so sad the fear they put into people.
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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

Generalizing about Catholic men as having strange, repressed sexuality is pretty nonuseful.

Some do, some don't.

Next week, let's go after <fill in the blank>.

Seems to me it is more useful to focus on an individual and their positives/negatives than trying to find some effed up thing attributable to religious background.


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## keeper63 (Mar 22, 2012)

The OP expressed an interest in my sex therapy experience, and we were able to draw some parallels between her H and my own exprience gowing up in a strict Catholic environment.

Since I am one of those Catholic males, I hardly see how sharing my story qualifies as a generalization about all Catholic men. I wasn't "going after" anyone.


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## michzz (Jun 6, 2008)

keeper63 said:


> *I think you may have hit the nail on the head. Your perception of Catholic guys is that they have fetishes, and my perception of Catholic guys (having been one) is sexual repression.*
> 
> When you say that some of your H's behaviors are not at all vanilla, perhaps those behaviors are his "fetish" and the other more normal things that he thinks are off limits are a product of *Catholic sexual repression.
> *
> ...





keeper63 said:


> The OP expressed an interest in my sex therapy experience, and we were able to draw some parallels between her H and my own exprience gowing up in a strict Catholic environment.
> 
> Since I am one of those Catholic males, I hardly see how sharing my story qualifies as a generalization about all Catholic men. I wasn't "going after" anyone.


I'm not on a witch hunt. However, I perceived a tone (boldfaced) of implying that it's a given that a Catholic upbringing equals warped sexuality.

I just don't see it.

There are odd birds from every religion. and they are far outweighed by normal, adjusted people.

That is my point.


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## 7737 (Feb 10, 2011)

"Well something had to give and it's leading me to thoughts of cheating. That sexual energy had to go somewhere, I'm not a nun." (written by Diwali123 on first page)

Its funny - when a man who is in a sexless marriage says something like the above, he gets pounced on...gets told its adultery, wrong, he should divorce etc....
Yet when a woman in a sexless marriage says it...suddenly having thoughts like that are perfectly acceptable...
Maybe because its the mans 'fault'....


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

It's not a sexless marriage, the big thing is he doesn't like me masturbating and he doesn't have a drive like mine. At this point it would be easier for me to have an affair than to masturbate in the house while he's there. Having thoughts about something isn't saying that I want to really or that I'm going to. I don't blame anyone for having those thoughts when they are sexually frustrated. Acting on them is a different story.
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## FirstYearDown (Sep 15, 2011)

diwali123 said:


> I would like to have sex three or more times a week. I guess variety and surprise would be nice. *When we met two years ago our drives were similar, we were screwing like rabbits. Then we got engaged and moved in together and he started slowing way down to once a week, one and done.* I am multi but I like when he has more than one too in a day. He used to. He was multiorgasmic one time but shows no interest in figuring out how to do it again.
> We've gone back and forth about this and the fact that he stopped performing oral. He also started getting headaches on a daily basis and he's been taking a preventative which is helping. We have both been really stressed lately with buying a house and moving. I know he's exhausted but at my age being tired doesn't mean my need for orgasms goes away.
> His ex didn't want sex very much and he always initiated so I think he's having trouble dealing with a woman who is so sexually aware and liberated.
> He is working on the oral part, which I appreciate but this masturbation thing is so middle ages I just can't stand it.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


The bolded part spoke to me. At least you know he is capable of having more sexual interest. I'm wondering if there is a bait and switch going on as well, because as soon as you became engaged he got comfortable and stopped being a frequent lover. Have you discussed the reasons for that sudden change?

The fact that you are an HD woman and you are willing to attend therapy with your hubby, speaks volumes about the love you have for him. :smthumbup: I admire that a great deal. I am just like you in that I need frequent sex to feel loved and satisfied. I need sex at least 3 times a week and I don't know if I would be as strong as you if I was in your situation. I think the resentment would be too great for me to feel sympathy for my hubby if he rarely wanted to make love.

Thought and action are completely different. Who wouldn't think of cheating if their spouse was often reluctant to make love? Your husband is being unfair and controlling when he says you cannot masturbate. He can't have it both ways! Either your husband becomes intimate with you more often or you masturbate while he works out his issues. I have had sexual dreams about others and admired sexy men that I've seen on the street. None of that means that I would cheat on my husband-I keep those desires only in my head where they cannot destroy my marriage.

A man feeling sexually inadequate is such a vicious cycle. Your husband knows he's letting you down sexually, which contributes to the reluctance and lack of confidence in bed. 

Keep trying mama. You're on the right track.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

Thanks so much. Yes I love him so much. I know that he feels like crap about all of it. He told me that at first our relationship was very sexual but then it was time to focus on other things. You could have told me that before we moved in together. Honestly I don't think he even knows why it slowed down other than it became expected and he got scared and it became a vicious cycle. 
I think I'm going to put a moratorium on sex until we can start therapy. I just emailed a therapist who is supposedly renowned.
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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

A couple of men have PM'd me with I'm sure honest intentions but I feel in my situation having PMs with a man about this is not appropriate, because of me. I know I wouldn't want him to be talking to strange women privately online about the details of his sexuality. But I do appreciate the effort and concern. 

Last night I found out that he thinks of sex as a chore which I know a lot of LDs end of feeling. He said it takes him too long to cum admins he gets frustrated which I don't understand because we hardly ever take over a half an hour or an hour. But there are no quickies with us, ever. 
I also found out he has been wanking off. 
It's a long story but I asked him to get out, it got really ugly and that's all I will say. I know that he feels devastated about it, I told him I feel controlled and betrayed. He's trying to find a sex therapist. I am kind of numb and tired but the good news is my desire for him just disappeared so that's not an issue.
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## keeper63 (Mar 22, 2012)

Really sorry to hear about that...if both of you get some individual sex therapy, perhaps that will get you to the point where you could go together. Right now it sounds like you have a lot of resentment, and he has some significant intimacy issues that need to be worked out.

I hope you can get to a place (either with or without H) where your needs are being met.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

I'm very resentful and hurt. Thankfully my rabbit is there for me.
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