# A Question I am Seriously Struggling with



## Forever Changed

Greetings my TAM friends.

I am not sure if this is the right section but I'll go ahead and put it here anyway. I will keep it short.

I've been asking this question to myself and thinking and considering all the possibilities, the pros, the cons, and basically ... well everything.

So my question is this. I guess it has two parts.

If relationships/marriage are such *hard work*, why would you even bother?

And if you are *truly* happy with yourself, and you don't need *others* to make you happy, why would you add the stress and associated problems that come with being in a committed relationship?

Thanks for listening friends.

I look forward to reading any input.


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## terrence4159

my first marriage failed hard work, my 2nd marriage no work at all and we are both super happy. maybe argue once every 6 months. and the shocker we are both polar opposites. her loving and affectionet. me lol old man on the corner yelling at everyone syndrome.

on valentines day i told her im sorry i dont say i love you all the time or show her enough attention..she told me to stop she loves me for who i am and does not me to change at all


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## angelpixie

I'm wondering that myself. I guess for most people there is a need for companionship, if not from living with someone, then from having a close intimate friend. For most of us, I think, it's not the physical relationship we missed the most when our marriages ended, it was that other type of intimate connection: shared memories and history, similar interests, etc. I've had that with friends of the same gender, but it wasn't the same as with my ex. 

I think people want to have that type of connection, and that's why they drift towards being in relationships. Just my opinion. OTOH, taking the risk to try to find that again, especially if it didn't work out the first time (or more, depending), is pretty scary. 

Even though I miss that kind of connection to someone, I don't know if I trust that it's possible again. For me, anyway. Others seem to have found it. It's not the work. I'm willing to do the work. It's the trust.


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## Forever Changed

Hi there Angel,

Thanks for your answer, and thank you to Terrence also.

But when you reach that stage where you simply don't need anyone, are alone but not lonely, happy with who are you and what you do, you don't need anyone to 'complicate' your life. If you get what I'm trying to say.

I can honestly say that I am ok with never having a relationship again, never kissing/holding hands/being intimate ever again.

So if this is how it is - What does this make me?

A grump? A Loner? A weirdo? 

Or My Own Man?


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## Forever Changed

You see Dan here doesn't need to be validated by anyone anymore. I don't need approval from anyone.

I don't continually apologise or justify myself to anyone anymore.


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## terrence4159

yeah i was that way after my D. the life sucked out of me. but then i went to a dating site online and started emailing my now wife. we talked on the phone one day and i went in that day to see her at work (took my son) she hit it off with him right away but hey he was 3 it wasnt hard. i left and what i didnt know but she told me a few weeks later she had 2 friends with benefits (her 22 me 27) onve she got off work she called both of them and told them im done i meet the guy im going to spend the rest of my life with.

they are out there SAD you just have to find them


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## soulpotato

I guess it depends on the relationship. I would much rather work hard every day if need be on having a successful relationship with my GF (not to mention go through the agony of fixing myself) than to have an easy time with someone else. She's definitely worth it, and nobody can take her place. Life without her just...isn't right. I can't enjoy anything as much without her.


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## Forever Changed

At the risk of sounding like a bitter jaded old bastard, I'm still going to say it. 

If you already know that no one in this modern age stays married like they did in years gone by (I'm talking the older generation, 40 and 50 years) and that in the 21st century marriage is disposable.

Then WHY do it?


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## ku1980rose

I've thought about this, too. And not just because of my divorce. There are many times I've been happy and content on my own and it seems that people (and society) are always pushing me towards a relationship. 

I do see the pros of a relationship/marriage, but maybe it's not for everyone. 

As for me, I'm open to finding the right guy at some point in my life. I'm open to finding someone that I'm compatible with and want to share my life with.

But, I'm also willing to enjoy being by myself. I like being on my own with no one to answer to and no one to worry about.

Does it have to be for everyone? Sure, we all crave some kind of companionship, but do we have to get that from a marriage?


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## Forever Changed

ku1980rose said:


> Sure, we all crave some kind of companionship


Do we?


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## ku1980rose

Forever Sad said:


> Do we?


Well, maybe I shouldn't have said "all" because not everyone needs companionship. However, it does seem that the majority of human beings crave some type of companionship throughout their lives, whether that be from friends, co-workers, spouse, lover, dog.....just my thoughts.


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## angelpixie

I agree, rose. I don't ever see myself getting married or living with anyone again. For one thing, I still have a young son to consider, and he comes first. 

I don't rule out the idea of being in a relationship. I would like to be close to someone again, and there are times I really miss that. But I have really come to value my independence, also. Just simple things. Like the house I'll be moving into. I remember the tug of war when it came to decorating the one Ex and I bought together. I am actually having fun thinking about doing this one with DS. 

People keep telling me there's someone out there for me. Maybe, maybe not. I'm not putting my life on hold while I wait, and I'm not lowering my standards just so I can say I 'have' someone. The feelings of loneliness come, to be sure, but they do pass. I'm busy enough working on myself and making my own life with my son.


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## Forever Changed

Angel that is so very well said.

You are a true inspiration. I hear what you are saying and I totally agree.


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## soulpotato

Forever Sad said:


> At the risk of sounding like a bitter jaded old bastard, I'm still going to say it.
> 
> If you already know that no one in this modern age stays married like they did in years gone by (I'm talking the older generation, 40 and 50 years) and that in the 21st century marriage is disposable.
> 
> Then WHY do it?


Because while it has become quite disposable, it does still mean something.


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## Forever Changed

And I worry greatly for my son. With the world that we live in.

I can't let him go through the pain of such loss. I simply can't, and I won't. I will have to teach him what I have learnt. I will have to teach him that on he can make himself happy, and not to place his happiness in someone else.

I must teach about about the fear, the heartache, the sadness and basically the harsh reality of the world.

We live in this world in the year of 2013.

When he is my age, the year will be 2047. What kind of a world will it be then. I shudder to think.


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## EleGirl

Forever Sad said:


> At the risk of sounding like a bitter jaded old bastard, I'm still going to say it.
> 
> If you already know that no one in this modern age stays married like they did in years gone by (I'm talking the older generation, 40 and 50 years) and that in the 21st century marriage is disposable.
> 
> Then WHY do it?


It's not true that no one stays married these days. More stay married then divorce. And just think they choose to stay married even if they could easily get a divorce. They stay out of choice.


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## Riverside MFT

"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships were built for."

Not trying to have another relationship after a bitter divorce is the safe route. Trying the dating scene again will always be risky. Getting married will always be risky, but the possible rewards are far greater then we can imagine.


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## Forever Changed

Lord my STB Divorce is far from bitter. Everything is sorted.

Just got to sign the papers in July. I'm ready; it is but a formality. 

So. Lets say I married again tomorrow. And stayed married for 50 years.

Advantages? What are they? I guess the only thing I answer that I can come up with is companionship. But if you don't need that, then it is pointless.

Maybe some people just weren't meant to be a husband or a wife.


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## Forever Changed

Riverside MFT said:


> Getting married will always be risky, but the possible rewards are far greater then we can imagine.


I'm thinking. I'm thinking and have been deeply considering this and I fail to come up with any possible rewards.


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## Forever Changed

One more thing I would like to add.

I go shopping on my own now and I look at the husbands with their wives/children. 

They look unhappy. I can see it in their eyes (specifically the younger ones, my age - 35 or so). 

They seemed to be resigned to their fate.

And that makes me sad.


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## angelpixie

You might be projecting, FS. Or maybe not. I can assure you that not all women who are shopping with their husbands and children are happy, either. But that could be specific to shopping, not to marriage. 

You're younger than I am, so there's a possibilty of more kids in your future. The legalities involving children would be something to consider when weighing pros & cons of marriage. How does being married affect things like visitation, child support, etc.? That will be different depending on where you live, but definitely something to consider.

You might have definite legal benefits of marriage in that regard.


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## Forever Changed

Probably am projecting Angel. Probably am. 

I would not get married again, and I certainly would not have any more children. I am thinking about getting 'The Snip'.

The prospect of a second marriage and another child all mixed in with STBXW and Baby D is something I can't, and won't fathom.


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## 2ntnuf

Dan,

This is something I have been thinking about for a long time. I don't have a good answer yet for myself. It is an almost impossible decision when you are trying to sort through the 'rights' and 'wrongs', the 'good' and 'bad' of your life and marriage. I would like to tell you to let it go for now. I know you cannot. I offer this as some help to you in understanding what to do. It may or may not help. I am not promising anything. If it only consoles you until you find your path, that is great. 

What I do know is this. Things will become clearer as you heal. You will figure out what you want to do and what you are capable of doing. You will find it within yourself again to live happily and with pride. Your beliefs will be convicted yet you will be flexible enough to know when you need to change yourself. You will be open to change and embrace it. You will make mistakes and learn from them without nearly as much retrospection. It takes time when you have been hurt so deeply.

I invite you and everyone to have an open mind when you read my post. Try to read it as you would the words of wise counsel. Ignore the references to any religion and think only of the basic message. Open your heart and read with a determination that there must be something worth getting out of this. Quiet your mind before you read and just let it come to you and sink in. Relax and make your judgments base upon something other than emotion.

I hope no one takes offense to this posting. I am trying to help in the only way I know how at the moment. It is not an answer to everyone's issues and I am not trying to convert anyone or make a statement about one thing being better than another. I wish I didn't have to write all of that. It's a shame that I feel I do. 

This is for you, Daniel.

1 Corinthians Chapter 7


Viewing the Standard King James Version (Pure Cambridge).


1 Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman.

2 Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband.

3 Let the husband render unto the wife due benevolence: and likewise also the wife unto the husband.

4 The wife hath not power of her own body, but the husband: and likewise also the husband hath not power of his own body, but the wife.

5 Defraud ye not one the other, except it be with consent for a time, that ye may give yourselves to fasting and prayer; and come together again, that Satan tempt you not for your incontinency.

6 But I speak this by permission, and not of commandment.

7 For I would that all men were even as I myself. But every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner, and another after that.

8 I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I.

9 But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn.

10 And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband:

11 But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried, or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife.

12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.

13 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him.

14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.

15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace.

16 For what knowest thou, O wife, whether thou shalt save thy husband? or how knowest thou, O man, whether thou shalt save thy wife?

17 But as God hath distributed to every man, as the Lord hath called every one, so let him walk. And so ordain I in all churches.

18 Is any man called being circumcised? let him not become uncircumcised. Is any called in uncircumcision? let him not be circumcised.

19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

20 Let every man abide in the same calling wherein he was called.

21 Art thou called being a servant? care not for it: but if thou mayest be made free, use it rather.

22 For he that is called in the Lord, being a servant, is the Lord's freeman: likewise also he that is called, being free, is Christ's servant.

23 Ye are bought with a price; be not ye the servants of men.

24 Brethren, let every man, wherein he is called, therein abide with God.

25 Now concerning virgins I have no commandment of the Lord: yet I give my judgment, as one that hath obtained mercy of the Lord to be faithful.

26 I suppose therefore that this is good for the present distress, I say, that it is good for a man so to be.

27 Art thou bound unto a wife? seek not to be loosed. Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife.

28 But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned; and if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned. Nevertheless such shall have trouble in the flesh: but I spare you.

29 But this I say, brethren, the time is short: it remaineth, that both they that have wives be as though they had none;

30 And they that weep, as though they wept not; and they that rejoice, as though they rejoiced not; and they that buy, as though they possessed not;

31 And they that use this world, as not abusing it: for the fashion of this world passeth away.

32 But I would have you without carefulness. He that is unmarried careth for the things that belong to the Lord, how he may please the Lord:

33 But he that is married careth for the things that are of the world, how he may please his wife.

34 There is difference also between a wife and a virgin. The unmarried woman careth for the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in body and in spirit: but she that is married careth for the things of the world, how she may please her husband.

35 And this I speak for your own profit; not that I may cast a snare upon you, but for that which is comely, and that ye may attend upon the Lord without distraction.

36 But if any man think that he behaveth himself uncomely toward his virgin, if she pass the flower of her age, and need so require, let him do what he will, he sinneth not: let them marry.

37 Nevertheless he that standeth stedfast in his heart, having no necessity, but hath power over his own will, and hath so decreed in his heart that he will keep his virgin, doeth well.

38 So then he that giveth her in marriage doeth well; but he that giveth her not in marriage doeth better.

39 The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth; but if her husband be dead, she is at liberty to be married to whom she will; only in the Lord.

40 But she is happier if she so abide, after my judgment: and I think also that I have the Spirit of God.


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## Freak On a Leash

Forever Sad said:


> If relationships/marriage are such *hard work*, why would you even bother?
> 
> And if you are *truly* happy with yourself, and you don't need *others* to make you happy, why would you add the stress and associated problems that come with being in a committed relationship?


Very easily answered on my part. 

No, I don't intend to bother ever again marriage or anything resembling it.

I have no intention of adding the stress and problems that come with being in a committed relationship because I don't intend to ever GET in one again. 

Problem solved. I like being single and intend to stay that way.  I don't want to work at a relationship. I don't want to have to worry about anyone else or care about what they want or if what I am doing or saying is a problem. I'm done with that. 

If someone wants to hang out with me and be my buddy with benefits that sounds good but they should leave their toothbrush at home.


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## Forever Changed

2nt2nuf.

Thankyou so very much for that my friend. I read it over and over again. It is wonderful.

It's just so weird the way STB's are. For whatever reason.

The person you fell in love with is gone. Like she has died and been replaced by someone you don't know.

But you know what?

The person that she fell for is dead. Because I killed him. He deserved to die. And he has been replaced by the man that he should have been 20 years ago.


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## 2ntnuf

You will figure out what you want and need eventually. It won't be so hard. Try to keep moving forward. You've got to heal. Then you can make the best decision for you. Whether that is married life, single life or fwb. That's up to you. It will be what you want and you will be happy with what you choose or you will change it.


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## Forever Changed

Oh I have healed. I am constantly moving forward. My God I am amazed at how much I have changed. 

And I was thinking this morning.

That if I was to go to Hell.

It would be a walk in the park compared to what I have been through. 

Thankyou 2NT. Thankyou.


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## totamm

Why a committed relationship?

Because I'm a lousy cook and a man cannot survive on Hot Pockets alone and even on a good day my hand doesn't feel nearly as good as a mouth or pu$$y.

Next question?


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## dazedguy

Forever Sad said:


> Oh I have healed. I am constantly moving forward. My God I am amazed at how much I have changed.
> 
> And I was thinking this morning.
> 
> That if I was to go to Hell.
> 
> It would be a walk in the park compared to what I have been through.
> 
> Thankyou 2NT. Thankyou.


Well I looked my demons in the eye
Laid bare my chest said do your best destroy me
See I've been to hell and back so many times
I must admit you kinda bore me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mT69zOTNa8Q

More lyrics: http://www.lyricsmania.com/empty_lyrics_ray_lamontagne.html
All about Ray Lamontagne: http://www.musictory.com/music/Ray+Lamontagne


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## EnjoliWoman

Forever Sad said:


> If relationships/marriage are such *hard work*, why would you even bother?
> 
> And if you are *truly* happy with yourself, and you don't need *others* to make you happy, why would you add the stress and associated problems that come with being in a committed relationship?


I'm not sure it's HARD work so much as constant work. And work is probably the wrong, but most oft used word. I'd say a marriage needs constant _attention_. To stay in tune with what each other needs from a relationship, as well as knowing what YOU need from a relationship and be both fulfilling and communicating needs on an ongoing basis. It requires awareness and responsiveness. 

Personally, when I am happy with ME, I don't see a relationship as stress when the proper attention is put into it because I get enjoyment from it. I enjoy the give and take. I enjoy sharing activities and moments with that person. I enjoy the 'us against the world' aspect of sharing everything with that person. 

I can be pretty happy with me while still being emotionally unfulfilled. I can only get so much from friends and family. There is a third aspect of human interaction that needs to be filled. Being happy with my career, my body, my friends, my family - none of that fills the placeholder in my life for someone special. And it's not a matter of completion so much as a matter of complimenting my life; enhancing. It's a level of intimacy that can only be filling by a lover+best friend. I can have inside jokes with my child/family; I can have a female best friend I talk to about everything and I can have just a lover. But when you roll all of those facets of various relationships into one, that's the magic that happens that makes it worth while.


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## rose petal

I look for a relationship out of loneliness. I want to share my life with someone. If something good happens to me, I want to share it with that special someone. I want to share my laughter and joy with that person. I want to share intimacy with that person and give myself fully to that person.

I am an optimistic person. I truly believe that if you program your mind to be successful, then you will be successful. I know there is someone out there for me. It just takes a lot of work to find him is all!


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## ku1980rose

For me? I find myself looking for a relationship because I want to be a mother, I want to have children and raise children with someone. 

But, I don't know what else I want from it anymore.

I may be happy being on my own and adopting children who need a good home and a good mother.


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## Forever Changed

I was actually going to burn our wedding photos last night, frame and all.

But then I thought that one day, my son will want to see his mummy and daddy on that very special day.

Like one of my divorced female friends told me, remember with happiness your wedding day. And I do.

The day before, it rained and rained (was an outdoor ceremony). We had alternate plans should it have rained. There was not a cloud in the sky and the sun shone beautifully on us on our wedding day. And the next day is rained again.

I thank God that He blessed us with a perfect day.


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## Freak On a Leash

I had perfect weather on my wedding day too. Then it rained for the next 24 years..:rofl:

It was an awesome party though! I will say that. :smthumbup:

Even then, my husband was pissy! There I was, having a great time on my wedding and he just wanted to leave early! We got in the limo to take us back to our honeymoon suite (where all our friends were waiting so we could party it up all night before leaving for our honeymoon after staying in the suite for two nights) and he was SULKING during the limo ride! Excuse me for wanting to ENJOY every last minute of our $30k wedding! :slap:

And so it began...

The party at the suite was good except that my husband's stupid drunk of a brother almost got us thrown out for skinny dipping in the hotel jacuzzi with his cousin. Then that a$$wipe asked my husband if he could spend the night at our suite the next evening after taking a friend of ours out on a date! And my husband said YES! 

Oh yeah, I was pissed.  He didn't actually do it but he ASKED and I never forgave him for that!

His brother is a no good drunk (an alcoholic) and guess who my husband took after? What a great family I married into. Not. :banghead:

So that was a GREAT start to a bad marriage...A marriage that will be ending in 10 days. Good riddance to bad rubbish!


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## Forever Changed

From utter devastation,
and unfathomable pain.

From the deepest of hurts,
and the breaking of my heart,
the burning of my soul.

The flowers are now growing in the garden of my life.


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## whitehawk

Forever Sad said:


> Greetings my TAM friends.
> 
> I am not sure if this is the right section but I'll go ahead and put it here anyway. I will keep it short.
> 
> I've been asking this question to myself and thinking and considering all the possibilities, the pros, the cons, and basically ... well everything.
> 
> So my question is this. I guess it has two parts.
> 
> If relationships/marriage are such *hard work*, why would you even bother?
> 
> And if you are *truly* happy with yourself, and you don't need *others* to make you happy, why would you add the stress and associated problems that come with being in a committed relationship?
> 
> Thanks for listening friends.
> 
> I look forward to reading any input.



You know what. I spent the last 3-4yrs asking myself all that.
And then when my separation came , she said you- as in me , don't even wanna be married anyway.
And then went on with a big list of some of the terrible things I;d said lately about being married.
It was a fkg [email protected] few yrs for us though and most of it was blurted out in arguments and stuff but still, I did use to wonder a lot.

So now this has happened and I still wonder , I've even said to a few people - why in the fk would I even want another women it's so much hassle.

But coming home late last night from a job , bout 11ish , the house was cold and empty. I missed my girls so much then. Usually there would've been calls and text all the way home , and x would've been waiting for me with a happy face , a coffee , and talk about our days. I would've gone in to see my daughter , she'd wake up because she's a light sleeper, hey dad v, made it home hey, cuddles.

I guess that's what it's about , the friendship , the company , your kids, sharing your life.
Came home to the dog last night , it's had me depressed again ever since.


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## whitehawk

Forever Sad said:


> At the risk of sounding like a bitter jaded old bastard, I'm still going to say it.
> 
> If you already know that no one in this modern age stays married like they did in years gone by (I'm talking the older generation, 40 and 50 years) and that in the 21st century marriage is disposable.
> 
> Then WHY do it?



Yeah , wonder the same thing now fs.
And to , if mine didn't work and if in the end I couldn't trust her to make a go of it , I couldn't trust anyone.
Reading here someone said now it takes no work. We were like that for 15yrs , so easy , so relaxed , it just happened. We use to laugh at other couples pounding their heads ah=against a brick wall. 
Add a very hard few yrs though , some really bad decisions , major cluster fk , and you still fall apart . 

Marriage has no respect now , everyone respect it at the start , but this seems to be more and more where it ends up.


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## dazedguy

Modern marriage is about getting something from somebody and when you stop getting what you want out of them you leave. Me, me, me.

I don't know when this changed or why, but marriage today does not resemble marriage in my grand-parents generation where marriage was about sacrificing for the benefit of the family.

As a guy that has seen this new self-centered marriage up close and personal, I cannot imagine getting married ever again. I know that sounds bitter, but I'm really not. I just think for a traditional guy (raised to expect to work for, sacrifice for, and share wealth with his family) modern marriage makes the whole enterprise too risky for men. Why would a man commit to a marriage and risk marrying someone who didn't believe marriage involved sacrifice or commitment, but viewed it as something that would improve her life daily? Today's gender roles make it much wiser for a man to remain uncommitted, protect himself, and sleep with the many available women. It's pretty sad I think and not what I signed up for, but it seems like where society today is at.


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## angelpixie

It's not just men for whom marriage is risky. In my case, I made more than my Ex, and I lost 1/2 my retirement to him. It's more risky for the higher wage-earner.


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## dazedguy

From a purely financial risk perspective, yes the higher earner is more at risk. Financials aside, I think expectations people have about what marriage means is changing and the risk of ending up with someone on the other end of the marriage beliefs scale is high right now so if you're in the traditional marriage camp (mutual sacrifice, value family unit and raising kids together, etc) why risk getting involved with someone that wants what they want when they want it with no compromises - a "have it all" person. The risk/reward equation doesn't work out.


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## angelpixie

Forever Sad said:


> I was actually going to burn our wedding photos last night, frame and all.
> 
> But then I thought that one day, my son will want to see his mummy and daddy on that very special day.
> 
> Like one of my divorced female friends told me, remember with happiness your wedding day. And I do.
> 
> The day before, it rained and rained (was an outdoor ceremony). We had alternate plans should it have rained. There was not a cloud in the sky and the sun shone beautifully on us on our wedding day. And the next day is rained again.
> 
> I thank God that He blessed us with a perfect day.


As someone whose parents divorced, I can tell you, Dan, that having my parents' wedding photos around did mean something to my brother and I. It does mean something to know that they loved each other at least in the beginning, even if we as the kids were too young to remember or see it. I know I'll be purging a lot more now than I did when I moved out of the marital home, and due to things Ex has done since then, it would be very easy now to get rid of it all, I am still keeping some things for DS. If nothing else, I'll have photos of happy 'us' to counteract Ex's history changing.


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## ku1980rose

Freak On a Leash said:


> I had perfect weather on my wedding day too. Then it rained for the next 24 years..:rofl:
> 
> It was an awesome party though! I will say that. :smthumbup:
> 
> Even then, my husband was pissy! There I was, having a great time on my wedding and he just wanted to leave early! We got in the limo to take us back to our honeymoon suite (where all our friends were waiting so we could party it up all night before leaving for our honeymoon after staying in the suite for two nights) and he was SULKING during the limo ride! Excuse me for wanting to ENJOY every last minute of our $30k wedding! :slap:
> 
> And so it began...
> 
> The party at the suite was good except that my husband's stupid drunk of a brother almost got us thrown out for skinny dipping in the hotel jacuzzi with his cousin. Then that a$$wipe asked my husband if he could spend the night at our suite the next evening after taking a friend of ours out on a date! And my husband said YES!
> 
> Oh yeah, I was pissed.  He didn't actually do it but he ASKED and I never forgave him for that!
> 
> His brother is a no good drunk (an alcoholic) and guess who my husband took after? What a great family I married into. Not. :banghead:
> 
> So that was a GREAT start to a bad marriage...A marriage that will be ending in 10 days. Good riddance to bad rubbish!


:iagree:

The weather wasn't too bad on my wedding day. We had an outside wedding at my parent's house. Windy before, while we were taking pictures, but then beautiful weather and the flowers were blooming.

But, that was the beginning of the end for me, too. We had problems with his mother, who still showed up at the wedding, even though she had made threats to me and I'd only met her once. Anyway, she tried to cause problems, then when we went to our room for that night, she sent him a text about needing him to bring something to her by 6 in the morning and he actually called her back AND went to see her at 6 the next morning in a town 40 miles away. Argh. That night, when I said, "Geez, your mom!!!" He turned around and YELLED in my face, "Leave my f***in mom out of this!"

And that was how our marriage began. It was pretty much on our wedding weekend that I started to see how he lets people walk all over him and I lost a TON of respect for him.

Over 2 years later, I finally left. I felt I had to try to make it work and I was afraid of what people would say if I "quit."

Thank God I finally got the strength to leave and am out of that marriage.


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## Freak On a Leash

The Divorce and Family course I was required to take last week specifically mentioned this. They said to have photos out and about the house of the family in happier times, doing fun things, wedding pics, etc specifically for the kid's benefit. It makes the kids feel better, more secure, gives them a sense of "place", etc.

I have to admit that I don't have any of that. I have pictures of me and the kids and the kids alone in portraits, but not of our entire family. Probably because for many years we never DID anything as a family and usually I hate how I look in pictures so I discouraged any pictures of me being taken. (Yeah, I know..it's weird!)

But I think it's a good idea in any case.


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## Freak On a Leash

ku1980rose said:


> she sent him a text about needing him to bring something to her by 6 in the morning and he actually called her back AND went to see her at 6 the next morning in a town 40 miles away. Argh. That night, when I said, "Geez, your mom!!!" He turned around and YELLED in my face, "Leave my f***in mom out of this!"
> 
> And that was how our marriage began. It was pretty much on our wedding weekend that I started to see how he lets people walk all over him and I lost a TON of respect for him.


 I Hear ya on this! THAT must've really broken the mood..kinda like having your drunken brother in law ask to stay in your honeymoon suite and then you're wondering if he'll actually show up or not. I STILL hate that guy but it was worse how my husband kissed his butt..

The year after we got married he was still in the Navy and down in Virginia. He was to be discharged 9 months after we got married so I went home, lived with my parents and got things ready for him to come home (set up the business, rented a house, etc). I went down there once a month for a week to visit him in our apartment. 

His brother was recently divorced and "depressed" (as in DRUNK) and went to visit my husband right after we were married and decided to STAY. I kept asking my husband when he was going to leave. He kept saying that he couldn't just throw him out, he can sleep on the couch, etc. 

That's when I lost it. I told my husband that if his brother was still there when it was time for me to come down then I wasn't coming..I would be filing an anulment instead. He asked his brother to leave. 

Sure wish he'd hadn't and I'd made good on my threat. It would've saved me a lot of grief. Unfortunately it didn't end there. When my husband did come home and we lived in our own place he merely replaced his brother with his FRIENDS. I actually asked my parents if I could move back in with them and my mother said "No, you are married now and your place is with your husband."

And so it began...Because I realized that my husband was not invested in our relationship or our marriage I started laying the foundation of living my OWN life, apart and separately from my husband and it grew worse and worse from that point on..Until that day 20 years later when we actually separated.

If my kids EVER asked to move back in with me to get away from a potentially bad marriage I will swing open the doors to my home and say "WELCOME HOME." No questions asked.


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## Forever Changed

Lord. Sometimes reality hits home big time. Thankfully, now, it doesn't last for long. It hits when I am walking down the halls of work, driving my car, anywhere.

There are certain things, songs and places that I simply can't do, listen to or go anymore. Are they called Triggers?

I am seeing my baby boy with my mama this coming weekend for the Easter Break, and having our usual Skype session tomorrow.

I have to admit that it seems surreal and I am very pensive. My mama said she will be there for support. I am going to get baby D some wonderful Easter treats, toys, a card and an book so I can read to him during our time together. I will also be taking as many photos and footage as I can. 

I can only surmise on how STBXW would be feeling about seeing me again. It's been 4 months since. Like I said, I killed off the person that she once knew. I note with some interest that FIL hasn't called for a long, long time. I presume that he has no idea about the trip. He is totally kept in the dark, and I think he tries to keep out of the way.

The main focus here will be of course on my baby boy. For him to spend time with his daddy and his grandmama. 

I guess the final nail in the coffin will be seeing STBXW with another some day. No matter what people say, or how you think you feel it will be a stake to the heart. So I suppose I'd best assume that she is with another NOW so I can be ready when the day comes.


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## whitehawk

angelpixie said:


> As someone whose parents divorced, I can tell you, Dan, that having my parents' wedding photos around did mean something to my brother and I. It does mean something to know that they loved each other at least in the beginning, even if we as the kids were too young to remember or see it. I know I'll be purging a lot more now than I did when I moved out of the marital home, and due to things Ex has done since then, it would be very easy now to get rid of it all, I am still keeping some things for DS. If nothing else, I'll have photos of happy 'us' to counteract Ex's history changing.



Angel , that is soooo good to hear. For a few mths now I've almost burnt them 1/2 a dozen times . I'm glad for my D I didn't now thanks to you . I've wrestled and wrestled with this one but there ya go , there is a point and an important one.

Thanks Angel , I'll keep them.


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## whitehawk

rose petal said:


> I look for a relationship out of loneliness. I want to share my life with someone. If something good happens to me, I want to share it with that special someone. I want to share my laughter and joy with that person. I want to share intimacy with that person and give myself fully to that person.
> 
> I am an optimistic person. I truly believe that if you program your mind to be successful, then you will be successful. I know there is someone out there for me. It just takes a lot of work to find him is all!



Rose, I believe natures provided each human with at least 3 or 4 perfect matches out there just encase.

I know for me personally , I've know at least 3 or 4 girls over the years that either one would've been perfect for me, just in different ways.

So why am I worried now maybe my lucks ran out finally. 
I dunno about marriage again but yep , I would like someone around to have fun with , share life with , grow old with.


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## whitehawk

Forever Sad said:


> One more thing I would like to add.
> 
> I go shopping on my own now and I look at the husbands with their wives/children.
> 
> They look unhappy. I can see it in their eyes (specifically the younger ones, my age - 35 or so).
> 
> They seemed to be resigned to their fate.
> 
> And that makes me sad.



Now I'm really admitting to being a downer here but yep. I use to look at all the married guys and think that exact same thing. 
The strangest thing was and I never thought it would be possible with us but I was slowly becoming one of them too.
l thought about that a lot during our last 2-3 yrs.
We were always so different yet in the end , we were both becoming the very wives and husbands we despised .
We actually always use to laugh at it, no way we're ever going there.

So much for that !


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## rose petal

whitehawk said:


> Rose, I believe natures provided each human with at least 3 or 4 perfect matches out there just encase.
> 
> I know for me personally , I've know at least 3 or 4 girls over the years that either one would've been perfect for me, just in different ways.
> 
> So why am I worried now maybe my lucks ran out finally.
> I dunno about marriage again but yep , I would like someone around to have fun with , share life with , grow old with.


Thank you Whitehawk. I too believe that we can be compatible with many different people. It depends on so many different factors. Unfortunately for me, I simply haven't found a single person that I'm compatible with yet! I am somewhat impatient, but I know you can't rush things in the game of love  When it happens, I will know! :smthumbup:


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## whitehawk

rose petal said:


> Thank you Whitehawk. I too believe that we can be compatible with many different people. It depends on so many different factors. Unfortunately for me, I simply haven't found a single person that I'm compatible with yet! I am somewhat impatient, but I know you can't rush things in the game of love  When it happens, I will know! :smthumbup:



Yep don't worry Rose they're out there for you and everyone else . It doesn't matter who we are , what we look like , what we like . Just walk through any shopping center and you see 100's of couples of every kind.
Life tricks you. It wares you out with impatience and worry until you throw your arms in the air and say to your self - right fk this I've had enough.
Around then sometime . when you least expect it , there he'll be standing right in front of you.
Every serious gf , even my wife , all followed that exact pattern for me .
My ex was the most surprising. We were both in this singles club just for fun . We never in our wildest dreams expected anything out of it.
That very week we'd both decided we were quitting.


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## Chuck71

Likes the name change! Likes it a lot!!!


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## Bafuna

Remember why you got married, for basically those same reasons are people getting merried today. You'd a bad experience with your marriage but you can either choose to remain single or like some people here get up and try again, its all OK, I dont think there's wrong or right. 

When you were getting married some people were already asking that question, but you got married anyway and now here you are, life goes on.


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