# Dominance in the bedroom



## UMP

I see where many, if not all women want dominant men in the bedroom. That's fine. What I would like to know is EXACTLY what actions or reactions, in bed, you define as dominant?
I'm not looking for a titillating thread, although I would not mind one either. However, I don't want to overstep the forum rules.

Anyway, all you girls like "dominant men in the bedroom." What does a "dominant man in the bedroom" look like, act like, feel like, exactly??

If we men are going to learn we need very CONCRETE examples. It's just the way we gain knowledge.

Help a fellow out.
Thanks!


----------



## SARAHMCD

In my experience, this would include some or all of the following:

1) Communication - explicitly telling me what he wants me to do to him and what he wants to do to me (in person and via text earlier in the day to get primed).
2) Physically putting me into positions, throwing me on the bed, picking me up, etc. Nothing that hurts of course. Just general manhandling. 
3) Moves like pulling hair to hold my head back and kissing my neck.
4) Talking dirty during sex - encouraging me to do the same. 
5) Teasing and holding back to make me say "please do...." and beg.

There are more that cross the line into BDSM but the general idea is that as a woman, you are made to feel that he is in charge in the bedroom.


----------



## UMP

SARAHMCD said:


> In my experience, this would include some or all of the following:
> 
> 1) Communication - explicitly telling me what he wants me to do to him and what he wants to do to me (in person and via text earlier in the day to get primed).
> 2) Physically putting me into positions, throwing me on the bed, picking me up, etc. Nothing that hurts of course. Just general manhandling.
> 3) Moves like pulling hair to hold my head back and kissing my neck.
> 4) Talking dirty during sex - encouraging me to do the same.
> 5) Teasing and holding back to make me say "please do...." and beg.
> 
> There are more that cross the line into BDSM but the general idea is that as a woman, you are made to feel that he is in charge in the bedroom.


Thank you, this is good info. I have a question. Let's say I want to be dominant but I want to start off with her giving me a BJ. Is sitting down on the bed and simply saying "get down here and give me a BJ." dominant? I feel that me lying there asking her to do something to me right off the bat is NOT dominant, but maybe it is if I ask the right way?


----------



## Miss Taken

I prefer dominance most of the time but there are times that I take the lead as well. Without trying to be too graphic, I would say that he just takes control. He will move my body to where he wants it, or gesture me into a different position or tell me what to do. There are obviously some positions that are more submissive for the woman to be in. Doggy-style is one of them, missionary can be also. Depending on the mood, a little (gentle) hair pulling is welcomed, sometimes a bit of spanking, sometimes he will pin my arms or hold my legs in a certain way while we're having sex which just goes with the fantasy of being taken or ravished by him and that's a turn on for both of us. 

He's pretty good at reading my body language and signals and we know from experience what is okay. He just takes control - takes the lead most of the time. But I am also giving him that control... We're not in any way into BDSM. At any time I am free to change positions or tell him to stop or suggest something else I feel like doing if I please. There are also times where I am the dominant one and push him onto the bed or guide him into positions I feel like doing. I think the big key here is that he is just confident to go for it. He doesn't treat me like a shrinking violet or tip-toe around me, or ask permission (the permission is implied by now). Not that I think asking for permission is a bad idea (definitely make sure your partner is okay and willing). It's just that he knows enough by now whether I'd be into it or am currently enjoying what he's doing. 

Hope it makes sense.


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> Thank you, this is good info. I have a question. Let's say I want to be dominant but I want to start off with her giving me a BJ. Is sitting down on the bed and simply saying "get down here and give me a BJ." dominant? I feel that me lying there asking her to do something to me right off the bat is NOT dominant, but maybe it is if I ask the right way?


My husband just puts my head down there.


----------



## SARAHMCD

UMP said:


> Thank you, this is good info. I have a question. Let's say I want to be dominant but I want to start off with her giving me a BJ. Is sitting down on the bed and simply saying "get down here and give me a BJ." dominant? I feel that me lying there asking her to do something to me right off the bat is NOT dominant, but maybe it is if I ask the right way?


It depends on your previous history with her. I've found that the best dominant men will actually wish to please their woman first. Get her in a state of high arousal. Then she will be willing to do whatever you ask to give back. If you have a history where she knows she will be taken care of after this act, then she will likely do it off the bat, yes. Giving her compliments all along the way helps. Tell her why she is so special and good at performing this act and that's why you want one. Make her part of it - that its not all about you getting yours and bossing her around. 

If you are just giving this a try and start with "give me a BJ" as your first dominant play, you're likely to get push back.


----------



## Miss Taken

UMP said:


> Thank you, this is good info. I have a question. Let's say I want to be dominant but I want to start off with her giving me a BJ. Is sitting down on the bed and simply saying "get down here and give me a BJ." dominant? I feel that me lying there asking her to do something to me right off the bat is NOT dominant, but maybe it is if I ask the right way?


If it were me, instead of being told to, I'd prefer that he just put my head down there. Like we were kissing/cuddling/petting each other and either he flips me around into a 69 position or pushes my head (gently of course lol) down there.


----------



## jld

SARAHMCD said:


> It depends on your previous history with her. I've found that the best dominant men will actually wish to please their woman first. Get her in a state of high arousal. Then she will be willing to do whatever you ask to give back. If you have a history where she knows she will be taken care of after this act, then she will likely do it off the bat, yes. Giving her compliments all along the way helps. Tell her why she is so special and good at performing this act and that's why you want one. Make her part of it - that its not all about you getting yours and bossing her around.
> 
> If you are just giving this a try and start with "give me a BJ" as your first dominant play, you're likely to get push back.


I would expand this out to the rest of the relationship. You should be meeting her needs all the way around, not just in the bedroom. 

The more trust you earn, the more she will want to please you, if she is a sub. Focus on unselfish dominance in the relationship, and it should spread to the bedroom.


----------



## UMP

SARAHMCD said:


> It depends on your previous history with her. I've found that the best dominant men will actually wish to please their woman first. Get her in a state of high arousal. Then she will be willing to do whatever you ask to give back. If you have a history where she knows she will be taken care of after this act, then she will likely do it off the bat, yes. Giving her compliments all along the way helps. Tell her why she is so special and good at performing this act and that's why you want one. Make her part of it - that its not all about you getting yours and bossing her around.
> 
> If you are just giving this a try and start with "give me a BJ" as your first dominant play, you're likely to get push back.


I pretty much take charge in the bedroom, I think. However, I really like a bj to get me started. She ALWAYS gets what she needs, so it's not like I'm not interested in her needs, it's that sometimes I feel like I am not "dominant" when I ask for a BJ to start. Also, it's not like it takes me 10 minutes to get going, more like 1 minute or 2 of BJ and then I start "manhandling" her.

Thank you so much for you responses. It really helps getting concrete examples!!


----------



## Deejo

Here is where we get bogged down with the other facet of sexual dynamics which many of the women refer to as 'enthusiastic consent'.

Before one demonstrates dominance in the bedroom, what that looks like should be discussed outside of the bedroom. In the moment is not the time to do so.

Dominance encompasses being clear about what you want for yourself, and an awareness of what she wants ... and DOING it.

Not asking, not waiting for her to make a move.

Being able to be dominant in the bedroom already has enthusiastic consent as a prerequisite. She wants you.

She wants you to be proactive, engaged with, and completely aware of your own sexuality and hers.

Being dominant is about selfishness. Both of you getting or taking what you want. Or ... teasing, depriving your partner of what they want to further escalate sexual tension.

And to me that is what dominance in the bedroom is. It is about being aware of and influencing tension. If sex were a rubber band, it is your awareness of how far to stretch it or slacken when necessary, without snapping it and somebody ending up with a welt. Unless welts are desired ...


----------



## jld

Deejo said:


> Being dominant is about selfishness.


Totally disagree, though it may look that way on the surface. I think unselfish dominance sustains a relationship inside and outside the bedroom.


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> My husband just puts my head down there.


OK, 
So if I'm lying on the bed, she gets out of the shower, I should wait till she gets on the bed and grab her head and push it down to start BJ? I'm ok with that although I have never done this. I usually ask or simply tell her, not push her head.

I'll try tonight :grin2:


----------



## SARAHMCD

UMP said:


> OK,
> So if I'm lying on the bed, she gets out of the shower, I should wait till she gets on the bed and grab her head and push it down to start BJ? I'm ok with that although I have never done this. I usually ask or simply tell her, not push her head.
> 
> I'll try tonight :grin2:


What happens now when you ask or tell her?


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> OK,
> So if I'm lying on the bed, she gets out of the shower, I should wait till she gets on the bed and grab her head and push it down to start BJ? I'm ok with that although I have never done this. I usually ask or simply tell her, not push her head.
> 
> I'll try tonight :grin2:


Well, it's not like we follow a script or anything. And there are times when he tells me to go down, too. 

He sure would not "ask," though.


----------



## UMP

SARAHMCD said:


> What happens now when you ask or tell her?


She does it, no problem, every time. It's just that she is not the type to complain and it's hard for her to tell me what she wants or likes. Therefore, I want to try to do what I think most women like or want from the start. That's why I ask so many question here.

The "dominant" in bed seems to be an almost universal desire for women, so I want to make certain I cover all my bases.
In general, she is very submissive in all areas so I should not be off base by thinking the bedroom should be any different.
Sometimes she does ask for certain positions, but very rarely. Most of the time she just waits for me to either do or say what I want.


----------



## always_alone

UMP said:


> OK,
> So if I'm lying on the bed, she gets out of the shower, I should wait till she gets on the bed and grab her head and push it down to start BJ? I'm ok with that although I have never done this. I usually ask or simply tell her, not push her head.
> 
> I'll try tonight :grin2:


Ummm, did your wife ask you to be more dominant? And if so, did she give you any hints at all about what she in particular meant by that?

Because, quite frankly, if any guy did to me what jld describes there, I'd be more inclined to bite it off than to give him sexual pleasure.

Just sayin'


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> Well, it's not like we follow a script or anything. And there are times when he tells me to go down, too.
> 
> He sure would not "ask," though.


Got it, no "asking" like a question, just tell or do.
Done.


----------



## UMP

always_alone said:


> Ummm, did your wife ask you to be more dominant? And if so, did she give you any hints at all about what she in particular meant by that?
> 
> Because, quite frankly, if any guy did to me what jld describes there, I'd be more inclined to bite it off than to give him sexual pleasure.
> 
> Just sayin'


No, she has not asked, but she never asks for anything.
I just realize that "most" women like dominant men in the bedroom and wanted to make certain that I am that way. In general, I AM that way, however, I'm always interested in learning more "ways" or "ideas" that I can implement.


----------



## always_alone

UMP said:


> Got it, no "asking" like a question, just tell or do.
> Done.


Okay, I'm going to bow out of this thread because I am clearly not your target audience.

Just one last parting thought: Are you sure this is what your wife wants?

Because it may be more of a turn off than a turn on. And if she is submissive in other spheres, she might just put up with it rather than tell you how she really feels. Some women really hate being treated like we are just sex slaves to be ordered around the bedroom.


----------



## Deejo

jld said:


> Totally disagree, though it may look that way on the surface. I think unselfish dominance sustains a relationship inside and outside the bedroom.


Sex is selfish. We just wrap emotional dynamics around it. If we want to keep having it with the same person, and want them to enjoy the experience as well, then no, we can't be completely self-serving in the act. Else the act will go away.

You just equate the word as a negative. It isn't.

If dominance isn't selfish (yet moderated and aware of your partner) then it's a pure act.

Unselfish dominance sounds like quite the oxymoron. Unless you are indicating choosing NOT to do something that will harm or upset your partner ... and of course, their not wanting whatever that action or activity is; is selfish on their part.

I've only been with one partner that liked being spanked. I didn't make that discovery by just starting to smack asses.


----------



## Deejo

always_alone said:


> Ummm, did your wife ask you to be more dominant? And if so, did she give you any hints at all about what she in particular meant by that?
> 
> Because, quite frankly, if any guy did to me what jld describes there, I'd be more inclined to bite it off than to give him sexual pleasure.
> 
> Just sayin'


Thus my rubber band analogy, and why having a conversation prior to the event is important.

Don't say, "I'm going to be more dominant in the bedroom."

Say something like, "I'd like to try and find creative ways of making our sex life more exciting. I'm going to try some things. It's really important that you share with me what you enjoy and what you don't. After all, this is for us, not just me."


----------



## UMP

always_alone said:


> Okay, I'm going to bow out of this thread because I am clearly not your target audience.
> 
> Just one last parting thought: Are you sure this is what your wife wants?
> 
> Because it may be more of a turn off than a turn on. And if she is submissive in other spheres, she might just put up with it rather than tell you how she really feels. Some women really hate being treated like we are just sex slaves to be ordered around the bedroom.


Great question.
Honestly, she waits for me. She may suggest doing it in another room, or may suggest a position midway, but that's it. Once, mid afternoon, with kids in the house, while she was folding laundry, I locked the door and started ripping her clothes off, etc. etc. She loved it. In fact, I think she would like more of that type of behavior. It's just hard for ME to flip a switch at 53 years of age :smile2:


----------



## SARAHMCD

always_alone said:


> Okay, I'm going to bow out of this thread because I am clearly not your target audience.
> 
> Just one last parting thought: Are you sure this is what your wife wants?
> 
> Because it may be more of a turn off than a turn on. And if she is submissive in other spheres, she might just put up with it rather than tell you how she really feels. Some women really hate being treated like we are just sex slaves to be ordered around the bedroom.



It does definitely depend what turns her on (or doesn't). He should be asking her this. For example, I had a lover who was very dominant in the bedroom but checked with me right from the start if I was ok with things we were doing (before and after). This way he knew what was acceptable from the get-go. And I was always free to say "no" to anything I was uncomfortable with- he never pushed the issue. I was also always free to change positions, etc whenever I wished - he encouraged it. 

To educate, just because the man is dominant in the bedroom by no means makes the woman a demeaned "sex slave". Unless he's an "a..hole". As I stated in the beginning, a good dominant male will ensure his mate is being pleasured and pleased. Actually, in many ways the so-called "sub" has more power than the dominant. She should be turned on by him taking charge, not humiliated. If she is, then this is not for her.


----------



## WandaJ

UMP said:


> However, I really like a bj to get me started. !


Then try to build up an excitement throughout the day, with little flirting, naughty suggestions, etc. This will make her excited, and once excited, anything can happen...


----------



## jld

Deejo said:


> Unselfish dominance sounds like quite the oxymoron.


I think it is totally normal. I certainly would not want to be with a _selfish_ dominant. Sounds risky.


----------



## jld

always_alone said:


> Ummm, did your wife ask you to be more dominant? And if so, did she give you any hints at all about what she in particular meant by that?
> 
> Because, quite frankly, if any guy did to me what jld describes there, I'd be more inclined to bite it off than to give him sexual pleasure.
> 
> Just sayin'


You have to look at the whole relationship. For some women, it definitely would not work. For others, it just seems totally natural and normal.


----------



## always_alone

UMP said:


> Great question.
> Honestly, she waits for me. She may suggest doing it in another room, or may suggest a position midway, but that's it. Once, mid afternoon, with kids in the house, while she was folding laundry, I locked the door and started ripping her clothes off, etc. etc. She loved it. In fact, I think she would like more of that type of behavior. It's just hard for ME to flip a switch at 53 years of age :smile2:


Well, to my mind there is miles of difference between the feeling of sexual urgency and that of dominance. I will happily enjoy some passion, but will draw the line at certain things.

Having my head pushed down for a bj is definitely one thing I wouldn't tolerate. It's a trigger move, to be sure, but to me it smacks of selfish and self-entitled lover that cares only for what he wants. Spanking is another one. For me, at least, I find no eroticism at all in being treated like a naughty child -- quite the opposite in fact.

But clearly, some women do enjoy that sort of stuff. And if so, you're golden. All I want to suggest is that you don't assume that she wants/likes it that way: be sure to get her input as to whether she actually is into it, and it makes her happier, rather than feeling pressured into going along with something because you want it that way.


----------



## always_alone

jld said:


> I think it is totally normal. I certainly would not want to be with a _selfish_ dominant. Sounds risky.


Not just risky, but downright frightening!


----------



## WandaJ

UMP said:


> OK,
> So if I'm lying on the bed, she gets out of the shower, I should wait till she gets on the bed and grab her head and push it down to start BJ? I'm ok with that although I have never done this. I usually ask or simply tell her, not push her head.
> 
> I'll try tonight :grin2:


Ok. The way you have just described does not sound sexy or dominant, more like "wtf? You need a build up to this. 

Sit on the edge of the bed, and when she comes out of the shower, just say "come here" and then just nod to her to kneel. All wiht the rigth dominant voice and eye contact. She will know what to do next.


----------



## SARAHMCD

WandaJ said:


> Ok. The way you have just described does not sound sexy or dominant, more like "wtf? You need a build up to this.
> 
> Sit on the edge of the bed, and when she comes out of the shower, just say "come here" and then just nod to her to kneel. All wiht the rigth dominant voice and eye contact. She will know what to do next.


Agreed. Just shoving her head down might not be the way to go....not sure I'd like it. But if there had been a lead up - flirty texts asking me what I'd like to do to you later. Then as Wanda describes above. This means, yes, you are the dominant, but she has a choice to take control and turn you on.


----------



## arbitrator

jld said:


> Deejo said:
> 
> 
> 
> Being dominant is about selfishness.
> 
> 
> 
> Totally disagree, though it may look that way on the surface. I think unselfish dominance sustains a relationship inside and outside the bedroom.
Click to expand...

* That's why I feel that the most desirable of all unions is the one in which both partners share the psycho-sexual dominance ~ I just don't think that I would have it any other way! It just makes so much more sense!*


----------



## WandaJ

Deejo said:


> Sex is selfish. We just wrap emotional dynamics around it. If we want to keep having it with the same person, and want them to enjoy the experience as well, then no, we can't be completely self-serving in the act. Else the act will go away.
> 
> You just equate the word as a negative. It isn't.
> 
> If dominance isn't selfish (yet moderated and aware of your partner) then it's a pure act.
> 
> Unselfish dominance sounds like quite the oxymoron. Unless you are indicating choosing NOT to do something that will harm or upset your partner ... and of course, their not wanting whatever that action or activity is; is selfish on their part.
> 
> I've only been with one partner that liked being spanked. I didn't make that discovery by just starting to smack asses.


Not more than regular sex act. Dominant has be very observant to read clues from sub on what's working what's not. His all attention is focused on making sure sub is excited, because this is what excites him.


----------



## UMP

WandaJ said:


> Ok. The way you have just described does not sound sexy or dominant, more like "wtf? You need a build up to this.
> 
> Sit on the edge of the bed, and when she comes out of the shower, just say "come here" and then just nod to her to kneel. All wiht the rigth dominant voice and eye contact. She will know what to do next.


I get this, but it's hard to "build up" for this because she hates sexting. We planned to have sex tonight because the kids will be out of the house and it's been 3 or 4 days, so I know she wants to, she told me. That's all the "build up" I get to work with.

When she gets out of the shower, she is READY to go and so am I. The part I have trouble with is the initial "move." The "move" I want is a bj. I will try your suggestion.


----------



## jld

I think we are all a little different with what turns us on, what we consider natural and normal, and what role our spouses play in that. And what may work for one man may not work for another. A lot depends on the individual relationship.

I guess I don't really understand the focus on the bedroom instead of the whole relationship. I would not want to be with a man who was only dominant in the bedroom. To me, the bedroom, the physical relationship, is an outgrowth of the emotional relationship in the rest of the house.

It would not occur to me to refuse to give a bj. I might ask if I had to do it, but I would not refuse to do it if he indicated that was the plan.

Again, different strokes for different folks. If you are happy with your sex life, then it's all good.


----------



## Runs like Dog

do her taxes


----------



## SARAHMCD

Bugged said:


> Totally agree with always_alone (as usual)>
> 
> I think this whole bsdm/submission thing has just become..'en vogue'...Total turn off for me and I'm pretty sure for my partner as well...must be very boring being a dominant...


I get that everyone is different and want different things in the bedroom. You don't have to like it of course - everyone is entitled to their opinion. I disagree with it being "en vogue" - its been around a lot longer than "50 Shades" if that's what you mean. 

But why do you think being a dominant is boring? Curious...


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> I think we are all a little different with what turns us on, what we consider natural and normal, and what role our spouses play in that. And what may work for one man may not work for another. A lot depends on the individual relationship.
> 
> I guess I don't really understand the focus on the bedroom instead of the whole relationship. I would not want to be with a man who was only dominant in the bedroom. To me, the bedroom, the physical relationship, is an outgrowth of the emotional relationship in the rest of the house.
> 
> It would not occur to me to refuse to give a bj. I might ask if I had to do it, but I would not refuse to do it if he indicated that was the plan.
> 
> Again, different strokes for different folks. If you are happy with your sex life, then it's all good.


I am naturally dominant outside the bedroom, not a ****, but dominant. The problem I have is the INITIAL part of initiating sex. It sometimes feels awkward to me. Once I get started I'm a raging beast and something inside me takes over. It's the beginning that I have problems with.


----------



## UMP

SARAHMCD said:


> I get that everyone is different and want different things in the bedroom. You don't have to like it of course - everyone is entitled to their opinion. I disagree with it being "en vogue" - its been around a lot longer than "50 Shades" if that's what you mean.
> 
> But why do you think being a dominant is boring? Curious...


For me, the more dominant I am, the more exciting it is.
One of the problems is that my wife HATES talking about sex so sometimes if I want to try something in a dominant way, I'm afraid I'm overstepping my bounds and end up not even trying.

Dominating a submissive would be VERY exciting to me.
On the flip side, being completely dominated by a women might be cool too. I guess I like extremes in all situations.


----------



## Miss Taken

I don't think dominance and BDSM are interchangeable terms. A man is "dominant" when he leads when you do the waltz. Dancing has nothing to do with BDSM. 

I for one, like a man who takes charge in the bedroom (outside of the bedroom do prefer and have an egalitarian relationship.) However I am not at all interested in BDSM or what I've heard going on the the 50 Shades of Grey (never read the book, will watch on Netflix) novel. 

Of course, it goes without saying that conversation and knowing your partner and having their consent is important. We are at a point where we don't need to discuss every aspect of our love making but others may not have the same dynamic. A lot of things go without saying. Know your partner, if you don't know well enough to safely assume like we can then ask your partner. Respect each other above all.


----------



## jld

Bugged said:


> I think to have to always be in charge, or most of the times..must be boring...not only in the bedroom..generally speaking..if i were a man I wouldn't be attracted to a submissive woman...I like people that are 'in charge' for themselves..i don't want to be 'in charge' for anyone alese..a submissive man also a turn off for me.:surprise:


That is why both people have to be themselves in a relationship, right from the get go. They will save themselves a lot of trouble that way.

I think we all define dominance and submission a little differently. A woman might have a fairly dominant personality, but with a man more dominant than herself, be submissive. Same with a man.

Again, as long as both are happy with how things are, it's all good.


----------



## SARAHMCD

Bugged said:


> I think to have to always be in charge, or most of the times..must be boring...not only in the bedroom..generally speaking..if i were a man I wouldn't be attracted to a submissive woman...I like people that are 'in charge' for themselves..i don't want to be 'in charge' for anyone alese..a submissive man also a turn off for me.:surprise:


Understand that a "submissive" does not just lie there while the dominant does everything - or tells her what to do. He draws her out and encourages her passion - her dirty girl side if you will. This leads to her coming up with her own ideas :smile2:That is a truly skilled dominant.


----------



## Deejo

WandaJ said:


> Not more than regular sex act. Dominant has be very observant to read clues from sub on what's working what's not. His all attention is focused on making sure sub is excited, because this is what excites him.


Which is exactly what I said. So we agree. People disagree with my word choice, which is acceptable. 

But nowhere did I advocate dominant = selfish pr!ck.

I suppose I would prefer the term thoughtful dominance over unselfish. 

I didn't spank my partner for my enjoyment. I did it for hers.

I'll leave the ladies to it.


----------



## arbitrator

UMP said:


> WandaJ said:
> 
> 
> 
> Ok. The way you have just described does not sound sexy or dominant, more like "wtf? You need a build up to this.
> 
> Sit on the edge of the bed, and when she comes out of the shower, just say "come here" and then just nod to her to kneel. All wiht the rigth dominant voice and eye contact. She will know what to do next.
> 
> 
> 
> I get this, but it's hard to "build up" for this because she hates sexting. We planned to have sex tonight because the kids will be out of the house and it's been 3 or 4 days, so I know she wants to, she told me. That's all the "build up" I get to work with.
> 
> When she gets out of the shower, she is READY to go and so am I. The part I have trouble with is the initial "move." *The "move" I want is a bj.* I will try your suggestion.
Click to expand...

* Excuse the graphic description, but let's just say that the most important move that I would personally be making toward her would be to fully immerse my face into her boobs and then slowly and teasingly right down into the anticipating Southerly reaches of her womanhood!

But if the BJ is of so much primary importance to you, then just manly whip her into the 69 position and see what ultimately evolves!

Either way, and with extremely rare exception, it's usually a "win-win" situation!*


----------



## Fozzy

jld said:


> I think we are all a little different with what turns us on, what we consider natural and normal, and what role our spouses play in that. And what may work for one man may not work for another. A lot depends on the individual relationship.
> 
> I guess I don't really understand the focus on the bedroom instead of the whole relationship. I would not want to be with a man who was only dominant in the bedroom. To me, the bedroom, the physical relationship, is an outgrowth of the emotional relationship in the rest of the house.
> 
> It would not occur to me to refuse to give a bj. I might ask if I had to do it, but I would not refuse to do it if he indicated that was the plan.
> 
> Again, different strokes for different folks. If you are happy with your sex life, then it's all good.


In some ways though, what you describe as a completely unselfish dominant relationship only makes me think of a parent/child relationship. If the dominant doesn't have SOME selfishness involved, then aren't they simply doing it out of obligation?


----------



## UMP

arbitrator said:


> * Excuse the graphic description, but the most important move that I would personally be making toward her would be to fully immerse my face into her boobs and then slowly and teasingly right down into the anticipating Southerly reaches of her womanhood!
> 
> But if the BJ is of so much primary importance to you, then just manly whip her into the 69 position and see what ultimately evolves!
> 
> Either way, and with extremely rare exception, it's usually a "win-win" situation!*


I'm trying exactly what wandaj suggested. I will post results tomorrow.


----------



## jld

Fozzy said:


> In some ways though, what you describe as a completely unselfish dominant relationship only makes me think of a parent/child relationship. If the dominant doesn't have SOME selfishness involved, then aren't they simply doing it out of obligation?


Again, we all speak from our own definitions. To me, an unselfish dominant is someone who looks out for his partner, and guides the relationship in a way that her needs are met, usually preferentially. And that sort of guiding fulfills a deep need in him, to be the leader and care for his submissive, as much as it fulfills her need to be guided and cared for.

I think a happy relationship is one where needs are met fairly effortlessly and complementarily. If you have to try very hard, it may not be the relationship for you. Jmo.


----------



## naiveonedave

Ironically, this is very much red pill.....


----------



## UMP

naiveonedave said:


> Ironically, this is very much red pill.....


I don't think it needs to be classified as red or blue. It's about how women like their sex. Some like dominance, some do not.
I believe my wife does and therefore am trying to learn.

That's like saying because my wife likes chocolate ice cream she has a "sweet tooth." Maybe so or maybe it's just because she likes chocolate ice cream.


----------



## naiveonedave

UMP said:


> I don't think it needs to be classified as red or blue. It's about how women like their sex. Some like dominance, some do not.
> I believe my wife does and therefore am trying to learn.
> 
> That's like saying because my wife likes chocolate ice cream she has a "sweet tooth." Maybe so or maybe it's just because she likes chocolate ice cream.


What I got out of mmsl is that most women want the dominant man in the bedroom. Just saying


----------



## UMP

naiveonedave said:


> What I got out of mmsl is that most women want the dominant man in the bedroom. Just saying


Yes, it's seems that is true, for the most part.
However, some, even on this thread do not. I respect that.
I guess the most important thing is to find out what your SO likes and go with it.


----------



## Fozzy

Oh snap, here we go.


----------



## always_alone

UMP said:


> For me, the more dominant I am, the more exciting it is.
> One of the problems is that my wife HATES talking about sex so sometimes if I want to try something in a dominant way, I'm afraid I'm overstepping my bounds and end up not even trying.
> 
> Dominating a submissive would be VERY exciting to me.


Then start by admitting that you are not doing this for her at all. You're doing it for you.

And that's fine. But be honest about it, and stop pretending that it's about what "most" women really want, and so she must too.


----------



## SimplyAmorous

Deejo said:


> *Being dominant is about selfishness. Both of you getting or taking what you want. Or ... teasing, depriving your partner of what they want to further escalate sexual tension*.





jld said:


> *Totally disagree, though it may look that way on the surface. I think unselfish dominance sustains a relationship inside and outside the bedroom.*


 I only got this far in the thread...

This is what he means... (one of my old posts I tried to lay it out)...as this is a *real struggle* for my husband...



> How Useful is a little SELFISHNESS IN SEX?? We were talking this morning, we've had this discussion before ....I've told him I'd like to feel some "selfishness" from him....in one of my Sex books (written by a Sex Therapist) said this is one area we WANT some selfishness......feeling our partners selfishly want gratified -just as we do - this is at the heart of LUST/ eroticism - it fuels something in us... doesn't it ??
> 
> See, he thinks being selfish is....well....just Selfish, he doesn't even like the word, feels it has no place in SEX at all ...
> 
> Trying to describe his perspective... I am the Erotic..I'm selfish - A giver too, but darn it, I WANT MINE !! He is the Unselfish sensual Lover that is all about pleasing.. and his ultimate pleasure is MY pleasure even though he cant seem to wrap his brain around why I feel as I do...even if my wanting him to be more SELFISH would make me ecstatic !!
> 
> Found this on the net to explain WHat I am trying to get across about this SELFISH element in
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *** I think a lot of people get turned on at the thought of being fiercely sexually desired and get off on their partner's pleasure. Thus they need a partner who "selfishly" desires them and takes pleasure in them rather than self-sacrificingly catering to their needs.
> 
> It's fun to see how your partner "wants" sex -- that's why you're together, right? The 'come on, please me!' look is one of the hottest parts of sex for me. It's so easy to feel good, sexy, and horny at the look of a partner who's so into it she/he doesn't even seem to notice you're there doing something -- a partner who'll say 'why did ya STOP??!' if you even dare stop.
> 
> Indeed, one of the beautiful things about sex is how much the other's pleasure triggers your own. One might imagine it was made to foster harmony.
Click to expand...


----------



## UMP

always_alone said:


> Then start by admitting that you are not doing this for her at all. You're doing it for you.
> 
> And that's fine. But be honest about it, and stop pretending that it's about what "most" women really want, and so she must too.


No, not at all. I can tell she likes it too, just unsure of what I am doing. There is obviously a limit and am unsure of that as well.
Is it for me? Hell yes it's for me AND her.

I figure it this way, when her body convulses and drops off the bed in pleasure, I figure I'm on the right track. However, as in all things in life, if you want to be good at something, you have to have knowledge, practice and dedication. Sex is no different.


----------



## Fozzy

always_alone said:


> Then start by admitting that you are not doing this for her at all. You're doing it for you.
> 
> And that's fine. But be honest about it, and stop pretending that it's about what "most" women really want, and so she must too.


What I'm gathering from Ump is that his wife doesn't really give him a lot of clues about what she really wants. In the absence of information, sometimes you need to play the odds and hope for the best.


----------



## DayOne

Fozzy said:


> What I'm gathering from Ump is that his wife doesn't really give him a lot of clues about what she really wants. In the absence of information, sometimes you need to play the odds and hope for the best.


Sometimes they're like that. waw is. As well as very shy about talking about 'it'. So I'm the one that (generally) has to be the inventive one. Gets your creative juices flowing, but also a PITA that you have to do all the imagining.


----------



## UMP

Fozzy said:


> What I'm gathering from Ump is that his wife doesn't really give him a lot of clues about what she really wants. In the absence of information, sometimes you need to play the odds and hope for the best.


Exactly, 
She basically gets all clean and ready and comes to me, in essence saying without words, "Ok, I'm ready, what do you want to do?"

It's up to me to figure it out. She does not even want to talk about it afterwards. In the past, when we talked about sex, it made it less exciting for her. She wants to be evil in bed, but only if I act as if it never happened, because if we don't talk about it, to her, it never happened, which is exactly what part of her wants to believe.

I know it's weird, but that's what I have to work with. I must adapt.


----------



## Fozzy

Is she comfortable with telling you that she doesn't like something? If so, I think you're good to go.


----------



## UMP

Fozzy said:


> Is she comfortable with telling you that she doesn't like something? If so, I think you're good to go.


Yes, she will tell me to "stop" and that's ok. The hard part is figuring out what to do and go farther without getting the "no" signal.

For example (sorry for graphic content) I like to go from PIV to mouth, but if I have not worked her into a frenzy, this will either get a "no" or a turn of the head. 
On the other hand, if I'm more dominant and MEAN it, in other words, not an act, she will go along. It's almost as if she can smell a lack of self confidence in me. If I am the least bit shy or unsure of what I am doing, she stops it. If I am a REAL raging lunatic beast, she loves it. Sometimes it's difficult to be this way when sex is never talked about.


----------



## always_alone

UMP said:


> No, not at all. I can tell she likes it too, just unsure of what I am doing. There is obviously a limit and am unsure of that as well.
> Is it for me? Hell yes it's for me AND her.
> 
> I figure it this way, when her body convulses and drops off the bed in pleasure, I figure I'm on the right track. However, as in all things in life, if you want to be good at something, you have to have knowledge, practice and dedication. Sex is no different.


I'm sorry: I promised to go and I haven't yet. Very irresponsible of me! But I just have to say one last, last thing: This whole thread is about how you are going to masterfully make her give you a bj before each sex session. Because this is what *you* want, and because being dominant is exciting to *you*. Will it be exciting to her? The fact that you're so hesitant tells me loudly and clearly that you have your doubts despite what you think "most" women want. 

Again, if this is truly what turns her on, then you're golden. The answer to your problem will be very easy and straightforward, and I'll leave it to others to inspire you with their ideas.


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> It's almost as if she can smell a lack of self confidence in me.


I'm sure this is true.


----------



## UMP

always_alone said:


> I'm sorry: I promised to go and I haven't yet. Very irresponsible of me! But I just have to say one last, last thing: This whole thread is about how you are going to masterfully make her give you a bj before each sex session. Because this is what *you* want, and because being dominant is exciting to *you*. Will it be exciting to her? The fact that you're so hesitant tells me loudly and clearly that you have your doubts despite what you think "most" women want.
> 
> Again, if this is truly what turns her on, then you're golden. The answer to your problem will be very easy and straightforward, and I'll leave it to others to inspire you with their ideas.


I have doubt simply because I am not a master sexologist and my wife never wants to talk about sex. All I have to work with are her immediate reactions. My wife seems to react best when I am dominant in bed.
However, and this is a big HOWEVER, if I do it in a way that is not clearly masculine and confident, it all falls on my face. It has to be REAL. 

My wife likes REAL passion and REAL dominance, not an act.
I believe I am clearly a dominant person in bed, except that I also respect, love and cherish the mother of my 3 children who I have known for over 26 years. It's sometimes hard to put both of these thoughts together. She wants me to take her like she is my mistress and she wants me to take the lead. It's a bunch of pressure and sometimes I don't get it right.


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> I have doubt simply because I am not a master sexologist and my wife never wants to talk about sex. All I have to work with are her immediate reactions. My wife seems to react best when I am dominant in bed.
> However, and this is a big HOWEVER, if I do it in a way that is not clearly masculine and confident, it all falls on my face. It has to be REAL.
> 
> My wife likes REAL passion and REAL dominance, not an act.
> I believe I am clearly a dominant person in bed, except that I also respect, love and cherish the mother of my 3 children who I have known for over 26 years. It's sometimes hard to put both of these thoughts together. She wants me to take her like she is my mistress and she wants me to take the lead. It's a bunch of pressure and sometimes I don't get it right.


Well, real dominance might look like telling her you two are going to have an honest and open conversation about sex. And then relax and smile and draw her out. 

If you are the dominant in the relationship, you should be able to make this happen.


----------



## Deejo

SimplyAmorous said:


> I only got this far in the thread...
> 
> This is what he means... (one of my old posts I tried to lay it out)...as this is a *real struggle* for my husband...


Perfect summary, SA. Thanks.


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> Well, real dominance might look like telling her you two are going to have an honest and open conversation about sex. And then relax and smile and draw her out.
> 
> If you are the dominant in the relationship, you should be able to make this happen.


I have tried and she simply shuts down. If I want to completely ruin a sexual experience all I need to do is start talking about sex with her.

I can certainly force a conversation, but it will only end badly. I think this would (in my situation) be me going from dominant to dominant assshole.

Let me try to make you understand my wife. If I try ANY sexting or ANY discussion about sex prior to the actual event, it COMPLETELY takes away all intrigue and excitement for her.

She wants it to be a secretive naughty act that no one knows about, not even us:surprise:


----------



## jld

Lol, UMP. You know your wife best.

It really is too bad you cannot find a way to draw her out. It probably is just the nature of how you two interact, though.

My husband does not sext me and rarely engages in suggestive conversation.  But when he puts the moves on, I get in the groove.


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> Lol, UMP. You know your wife best.
> 
> It really is too bad you cannot find a way to draw her out. It probably is just the nature of how you two interact, though.
> 
> My husband does not sext me and rarely engages in suggestive conversation. But when he puts the moves on, I get in the groove.


Yes, 
Which is why I need to learn some more moves. Dominant ones, and then gain confidence in myself so that I don't fall on my face.
Don't get me wrong, I love my wife and have gained so much ground sexually that it boggles my mind.
I believe that one of the reasons why I have gained so much ground is because I respect who she is, however weird, and work with what I have. If I stay within the boundaries of her mind, I believe the sky is the limit.


----------



## WandaJ

It might be matter of time. D/s relationship evolve in their own pace, it is new for both of you, you need to keep pace wiht her. You may be surprise what year from now may look like


----------



## UMP

WandaJ said:


> It might be matter of time. D/s relationship evolve in their own pace, it is new for both of you, you need to keep pace wiht her. You may be surprise what year from now may look like


For example, 
If I talk to her about getting a sex swing, she will get all pissed. However, if I blindfold her, put her into a swing I have not told her about and then bang the hell out of her, she will be beside herself with pleasure. 
Then walk her to another room, take down the swing asap, no discussion, it never happened.:grin2:


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> Yes,
> Which is why I need to learn some more moves. Dominant ones, and then gain confidence in myself so that I don't fall on my face.
> Don't get me wrong, I love my wife and have gained so much ground sexually that it boggles my mind.
> *I believe that one of the reasons why I have gained so much ground is because I respect who she is*, however weird, and work with what I have. If I stay within the boundaries of her mind, I believe the sky is the limit.


I'm sure the bolded is true. She needs to feel loved and respected to trust you. And letting you dominate her requires her trust.

I guess I would like to see you think more broadly than the "moves." For me, it is not any particular "move" my husband makes that makes me putty in his hands; it is the overall relationship, the trust I have in him, that allows the kind of relationship we have to work. And of course he earned that trust.

But it sounds like your wife wants very specific things from you in bed. I just want to please my guy. 

Though, if he wanted dominance from _me,_ I doubt I would care about pleasing him anymore. I probably would not even want to have sex with him anymore.


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> I'm sure the bolded is true. She needs to feel loved and respected to trust you. And letting you dominate her requires her trust.
> 
> I guess I would like to see you think more broadly than the "moves." For me, it is not any particular "move" my husband makes that makes me putty in his hands; it is the overall relationship, the trust I have in him, that allows the kind of relationship we have to work. And of course he earned that trust.
> 
> But it sounds like your wife wants very specific things from you in bed. I just want to please my guy.
> 
> Though, if he wanted dominance from _me,_ I doubt I would care about pleasing him anymore. I probably would not even want to have sex with him anymore.


The overall relationship is fantastic. The problem is I'm the one who has to figure out, WITH CONFIDENCE, how to make her putty in my hands. In other words, even with a fantastic relationship, I still need to perform where the "rubber meets the road" as it were.
That's where I get a little frightened and unsure of myself, sometimes.

It's like you've done everything right, the relationship is right, she gets out of the shower and ....without a word, I hear "Ok, show me what you got, assshole."


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> The overall relationship is fantastic. The problem is I'm the one who has to figure out, WITH CONFIDENCE, how to make her putty in my hands. In other words, even with a fantastic relationship, I still need to perform where the "rubber meets the road" as it were.
> That's where I get a little frightened and unsure of myself, sometimes.
> 
> It's like you've done everything right, the relationship is right, she gets out of the shower and ....without a word, I hear "Ok, show me what you got, assshole."


I don't really understand your last line. 

Is this all really more about pleasing _her_ than pleasing _you?_


----------



## Runs like Dog

You could probably google this right now and the first million hits would be mags like Cosmo and personal blogs by women claiming they like a dominant man. Until of course you actually read what they write and discover that they mean is 'massage my feet, do what I say, shut up and like it'. Women tell you they want to you dominate them but that's not what they mean. What they mean is they want you to hear them say it to you.


----------



## SimplyAmorous

UMP said:


> *My wife likes REAL passion and REAL dominance, not an act.
> I believe I am clearly a dominant person in bed, except that I also respect, love and cherish the mother of my 3 children who I have known for over 26 years. It's sometimes hard to put both of these thoughts together. She wants me to take her like she is my mistress and she wants me to take the lead. It's a bunch of pressure and sometimes I don't get it right*.


You can order this book *>>* Just F*ck Me! - What Women Want Men to Know About Taking Control in the Bedroom (A Guide for Couples) ... I did!... though I can't say it helped my husband much.. he is just not geared this way.. 



jld said:


> *My husband just puts my head down there.*


 Mine would NEVER do this....I know what he'd say.. he'd feel "ignorant".....I had to keep showing him how much I LOVED when he'd push my head down (I mean during the act...especially the grand ending)... like hold it there ..I LLOOOVVVVEEEE that !!!... 

I had to show like "over the top" enthusiasm about this when he'd DO these things, so he'd GET IT ...and do it again...he's gotten better ...and with pulling my hair, oh he could do harder, rougher... but he tries...

I'm naturally more dominant over him... in the bedroom, outside the bedroom... if he was married to a Lower drive Submissive -he might as well have shot himself in the head... would have never worked.. He gets turned on by feeling fiercely desired.. so long as I didn't start harping on him to throw me down on the bed ...so instead I just threw him down on the bed !! 

For anyone reading this thread.. Here is a *LOVER STYLE TEST* ...CLICK HERE ...a couple can take to figure out which is the natural Pursuer /taking the lead ..and who likes to be pursued...(Dominate/ Submissive)...seems we are geared to be attracted to our opposite.. all about the yin & the yang ..…









At the end of this test.. it will tell you what your perfect match is.. myself & H was one of those perfect matches.. even if we're a little backwards to the norm. 



> ....*These 1st 4 Lover Styles prefer their Romance & Love to be "TRADITIONAL" rather than daring or out-of-the-ordinary*...
> 
> *1*. *The Classic Lover*- you would rather be pursued than do the pursuing and, when it comes to physical love, you concentrate more on enjoying the experience rather than worrying about your performance.
> 
> *2*. *The Suave Lover*-you would rather pursue than be pursued and, when it comes to physical love, you concentrate more on enjoying the experience rather than worrying about your performance.
> 
> *3*. *The Devoted Lover *- you would rather be pursued than do the pursuing and, when it comes to physical love, your satisfaction comes more from providing a wonderful time to your partner than simply seeking your own.
> 
> *4.* *The Romantic Lover*- you would rather pursue than be pursued and, when it comes to physical love, your satisfaction comes more from providing a wonderful time to your partner than simply seeking your own.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ....*These last 4 Lover Styles prefer their Romance & Love to WILD & Daring rather than typical or boring*...
> 
> *5*. *The Exotic Lover *- you would rather be pursued than do the pursuing and, when it comes to physical love, you concentrate more on enjoying the experience rather than worrying about your performance.
> 
> *6*. *The Carnal Lover *-you would rather pursue than be pursued and, when it comes to physical love, you concentrate more on enjoying the experience rather than worrying about your performance.
> 
> *7*. *The Surprising Lover*- you would rather be pursued than do the pursuing and, when it comes to physical love, your satisfaction comes more from providing a wonderful time to your partner than simply seeking your own.
> 
> *8*. *The Liberated Lover*- you would rather pursue than be pursued and, when it comes to physical love, your satisfaction comes more from providing a wonderful time to your partner than simply seeking your own.


----------



## WandaJ

UMP said:


> The overall relationship is fantastic. The problem is I'm the one who has to figure out, WITH CONFIDENCE, how to make her putty in my hands. In other words, even with a fantastic relationship, I still need to perform where the "rubber meets the road" as it were.
> That's where I get a little frightened and unsure of myself, sometimes.
> 
> It's like you've done everything right, the relationship is right, she gets out of the shower and ....without a word, I hear "Ok, show me what you got, assshole."


That's the dominant's role, lol. You wanted it, you've got it. I always say it is much easier and convenient to be sub, all is focused on you.

there are boos on the subject, did you read any? "F..k the roses, bring me some thorns" - or something close to it is supposed to be a D/s popular guide. I haven't read it, but try it


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> I don't really understand your last line.
> 
> Is this all really more about pleasing _her_ than pleasing _you?_


What I mean is that there is a moment of truth where she stands in front of me and EVERYTHING is in my hands. She wants me to be her friggen rock star stud and make it the most wonderful moment every time. WHAT I HEAR OR SENSE from her, as she stands before me naked and glistening, without a single word spoken from her is "OK, show me what you got, assshole." 
She wants me to rock her world, every time. I love every minute of it, it's just sometimes a lot of pressure and maybe self imposed high expectations to make it the very best, every time.

It's like taking the ACT for the very last time available so that you can get into that college you always wanted to.
It's like flying solo for the very first time.
It's like giving a speech for the very first time in front of a 100 people.

It's like that, for me, most every time.
and this is after knowing her for 26 years.


----------



## Wolf1974

Bugged said:


> Totally agree with always_alone (as usual)>
> 
> I think this whole bsdm/submission thing has just become..'en vogue'...Total turn off for me and I'm pretty sure for my partner as well...*must be very boring being a dominant*...


Nothing could be further from the truth >


----------



## arbitrator

jld said:


> UMP said:
> 
> 
> 
> Yes,
> Which is why I need to learn some more moves. Dominant ones, and then gain confidence in myself so that I don't fall on my face.
> Don't get me wrong, I love my wife and have gained so much ground sexually that it boggles my mind.
> *I believe that one of the reasons why I have gained so much ground is because I respect who she is*, however weird, and work with what I have. If I stay within the boundaries of her mind, I believe the sky is the limit.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm sure the bolded is true. She needs to feel loved and respected to trust you. And letting you dominate her requires her trust.
> 
> I guess I would like to see you think more broadly than the "moves." For me, it is not any particular "move" my husband makes that makes me putty in his hands; it is the overall relationship, the trust I have in him, that allows the kind of relationship we have to work. And of course he earned that trust.
> 
> But it sounds like your wife wants very specific things from you in bed. I just want to please my guy.
> 
> *Though, if he wanted dominance from me, I doubt I would care about pleasing him anymore. I probably would not even want to have sex with him anymore.*
Click to expand...

* jld: Are you saying that you never ever occasionally "come on" to your H when you're feeling frisky?

If you do, then wouldn't that, in and of itself, be deemed as an overt, yet perhaps temporary sign of dominance of some kind over him for you to get sexually whatever it is that you desire from him?*


----------



## UMP

WandaJ said:


> That's the dominant's role, lol. You wanted it, you've got it. I always say it is much easier and convenient to be sub, all is focused on you.
> 
> there are boos on the subject, did you read any? "F..k the roses, bring me some thorns" - or something close to it is supposed to be a D/s popular guide. I haven't read it, but try it


She does not actually say this, it's what or how I feel.
It's all in my hands and I'm supposed to figure out everything.
I feel her saying this in my mind:

"here I am, do me, and do me good, the better you are the kinkier I will become, let's see what you got."


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> What I mean is that there is a moment of truth where she stands in front of me and EVERYTHING is in my hands. She wants me to be her friggen rock star stud and make it the most wonderful moment every time. WHAT I HEAR OR SENSE from her, as she stands before me naked and glistening, without a single word spoken from her is "OK, show me what you got, assshole."
> She wants me to rock her world, every time. I love every minute of it, it's just sometimes a lot of pressure and maybe self imposed high expectations to make it the very best, every time.
> 
> It's like taking the ACT for the very last time available so that you can get into that college you always wanted to.
> It's like flying solo for the very first time.
> It's like giving a speech for the very first time in front of a 100 people.
> 
> It's like that, for me, most every time.
> and this is after knowing her for 26 years.


I don't think you need to put that kind of pressure on yourself. And if she is putting it on you, then I think she is domming you. Which is still fine, as long as you both enjoy it.


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> I don't think you need to put that kind of pressure on yourself. And if she is putting it on you, then I think she is domming you. Which is still fine, as long as you both enjoy it.


Maybe I'm putting it on myself.
Remember, she WILL NOT discuss sex with me. I decide what to do and she follows. However, if I don't do it with confidence, we do not achieve nirvana.

Sorry, maybe I'm not writing my thoughts very well.


----------



## SARAHMCD

arbitrator said:


> * jld: Are you saying that you never ever occasionally "come on" to your H when you're feeling frisky?
> 
> If you do, then wouldn't that, in and of itself, be deemed as an overt, yet perhaps temporary sign of dominance of some kind over him for you to get sexually whatever it is that you desire from him?*


I'm sure JLD will answer directly, but of course the more submissive partner can initiate. This is exactly what the dominant wants; to be asked, to be desired. And then they likely take over for the most part. That is part of the passion play.


----------



## jld

arbitrator said:


> * jld: Are you saying that you never ever occasionally "come on" to your H when you're feeling frisky?
> 
> If you do, then wouldn't that, in and of itself, be deemed as an overt, yet perhaps temporary sign of dominance of some kind over him for you to get sexually whatever it is that you desire from him?*


Jumped on top of him? Yeah, I've done that. 

In our D/s group here on TAM, we've talked about something I call a "dom score." I think each person has one, though it is certainly subjective. Basically, it is where each person, on a scale of 1-100, would rate him or herself in terms of personal dominance.

For me, as long as I am with a man whose dom score is higher than my own, I will be happy and attracted to him. If for some reason his dropped below mine, I would feel very nervous. If that continued, I am sure I would no longer feel attracted.

The dominant in a relationship does not have to have a high personal dom score to be the dom in the relationship. But his or her score must be higher than their partner's, and I would say naturally so, for the relationship to be harmonious.

This can still be tricky, because there are some "subs" who are really the ones carrying the relationship. You see them propping up the egos of their "doms." You see it in women who want to keep a marriage going, when the man is weak. She knows the marriage rides on her own emotional stability, and so she figures out a way to keep him happy, and not ask too much of him, while she is actually the one doing most of the work.

The danger there is that he could end up very surprised if she decides one day that she no longer wants to carry the marriage. He could end up left all alone while she goes off with a real dominant, or becomes the official dominant in another relationship.

And this is all obviously just my opinion!


----------



## jld

SARAHMCD said:


> I'm sure JLD will answer directly, but of course the more submissive partner can initiate. *This is exactly what the dominant wants; to be asked, to be desired.* And then they likely take over for the most part. That is part of the passion play.


I think it depends on the dom, don't you, Sarah?

I would say that too much need to be desired would no longer seem "dominant" to me. Obviously, just my opinion.

And I would for sure agree that even if the sub initiates, the dom takes it from there.


----------



## Runs like Dog

If you're negotiating with yourself and taste testing your own emotional response to that, you're not a dominant.


----------



## Fozzy

UMP said:


> She does not actually say this, it's what or how I feel.
> It's all in my hands and I'm supposed to figure out everything.
> I feel her saying this in my mind:
> 
> "here I am, do me, and do me good, the better you are the kinkier I will become, let's see what you got."


Sounds like you're looking for feedback from your wife. She won't give you any outside the bedroom, and the only affirmation you're getting INSIDE the bedroom is when you knock it out of the park. This is why you're putting so much pressure on yourself. You feel like if there aren't fireworks after you're through that she didn't enjoy herself at all, and thus you failed.

Sex doesn't have to be amazing. In fact, by making sex amazing every single time, aren't you just making that the norm? Couldn't you also be putting pressure on her indirectly?


----------



## SimplyAmorous

> *UMP said: *What I mean is that there is a moment of truth where she stands in front of me and EVERYTHING is in my hands. She wants me to be her friggen rock star stud and make it the most wonderful moment every time. *WHAT I HEAR OR SENSE from her, as she stands before me naked and glistening, without a single word spoken from her is "OK, show me what you got, assshole." *
> She wants me to rock her world, every time. I love every minute of it, it's just sometimes a lot of pressure and maybe self imposed high expectations to make it the very best, every time.
> 
> It's like taking the ACT for the very last time available so that you can get into that college you always wanted to.
> It's like flying solo for the very first time.
> It's like giving a speech for the very first time in front of a 100 people.
> 
> It's like that, for me, most every time.
> and this is after knowing her for 26 years.


 so she's not calling you an A-hole here.. this is just the VIBE you are getting from her.. does sound like a lot of pressure to me. I mean jeez...if you TRY to talk about sex.. what happens.. Would she be willing to play a Board game like this >> 

Kinky World » Discover Your Lover Adult Board Game Review










I bought this when I wanted to spice our sex life up.. The cards will do the work for you.. if she'd be willing.. It could be one avenue to open things up...learn a little as you go. I can't imagine wanting certain things but not being able to verbalize them.. I guess it's a personality thing.. do you feel she is "repressed" in some day, doesn't want to come off like a "BAD GIRL" perhaps ? 



jld said:


> But it sounds like your wife wants very specific things from you in bed. I just want to please my guy.
> 
> *Though, if he wanted dominance from me, I doubt I would care about pleasing him anymore. I probably would not even want to have sex with him anymore.*


 Funny how different we are.. .. you are naturally submissive, a giver /pleaser ...you can't imagine being something you are not...(I would BET you are a "Devoted lover" on that test- that's what my H is )

And here I am .. on the other side .... I have had thoughts like this >> although I have wanted more Dominance, a rape fantasy would be GRAND !... reading here has opened my eyes to how many Dominate men THINK......the need for a little CHASE, so they can win their prey, preferring Subtle...if it's TOO EASY.. too available.. they may loose interest, or get bored !!! 

Like OMG...thank GOD my husband LIKES OVERT (aggressive - going in for the kill) from me.. cause if NOT.. if he NEEDED a little chase...I'd have to PUSH a part of myself DOWN in order to turn him on... just imagining dealing with that when I was feeling FRISKY & wanting it.. Oh NO...this would Pi$$ me off ! I really wouldn't have the patience for that , I'd feel caged !!. I need the freedom to go after him.. to express.. his loving that...it saved us... 



> *Jld said: *In our D/s group here on TAM, we've talked about something I call a "dom score." I think each person has one, though it is certainly subjective. Basically, it is where each person, on a scale of 1-100, would rate him or herself in terms of personal dominance.
> 
> *For me, as long as I am with a man whose dom score is higher than my own, I will be happy and attracted to him. If for some reason his dropped below mine, I would feel very nervous. If that continued, I am sure I would no longer feel attracted.*
> 
> The dominant in a relationship does not have to have a high personal dom score to be the dom in the relationship. But his or her score must be higher than their partner's, and I would say naturally so, for the relationship to be harmonious.


 Interesting... this makes sense though ! All about the sexual compatibility.


----------



## WandaJ

Even on D/s spectrum there are different levels people need to submit/dominate. It looks like what she wants is total domination. And every time she stands in front of you naked, she dares you to push her limits. She wants to go further. This is actually good news for you.

When you try to talk to her about sex, is this normal talk, when you try politely to see what she likes? If she needs total submission, then you asking her will be a turn off. What you can do is to make a talk part of the sexual game. Find BDSM questionnaire on the internet. Get her in the position. And request answer for each point withing five seconds. Or else. You need to be decicise, do not leave her choice to talk about it or not.After all, who is supposed to be in charge?


----------



## jld

WandaJ said:


> Even on D/s spectrum there are different levels people need to submit/dominate. It looks like what she wants is total domination. And every time she stands in front of you naked, she dares you to push her limits. She wants to go further. This is actually good news for you.
> 
> When you try to talk to her about sex, is this normal talk, when you try politely to see what she likes? If she needs total submission, then you asking her will be a turn off. What you can do is to make a talk part of the sexual game. Find BDSM questionnaire on the internet. Get her in the position. And request answer for each point withing five seconds. Or else. You need to be decicise, do not leave her choice to talk about it or not.*After all, who is supposed to be in charge?*


But don't you think it is risky to counsel him to be something he is not naturally, Wanda? That is my concern, anyway.


----------



## WandaJ

jld said:


> In our D/s group here on TAM, we've talked about something I call a "dom score." I think each person has one, though it is certainly subjective.


We have D/s group here?:surprise:


----------



## WandaJ

jld said:


> But don't you think it is risky to counsel him to be something he is not naturally, Wanda? That is my concern, anyway.


It's just an idea. And of course, he has to feel comfortable wtih it. Maybe it is too early now, but few months from now, who knows?


----------



## jld

WandaJ said:


> We have D/s group here?:surprise:


Yes.


----------



## jld

WandaJ said:


> It's just an idea. And of course, he has to feel comfortable wtih it. Maybe it is too early now, but few months from now, who knows?


This is just a concern I have when either sex is pushed into a role by their partner. If someone is not naturally something, it is pretty hard to sustain. Even the level of dominance or submission is hard to sustain if it does not come naturally. 

That is why I think it is so important to be ourselves with our partners right away. The more transparency, the better.


----------



## WandaJ

jld said:


> This is just a concern I have when either sex is pushed into a role by their partner. If someone is not naturally something, it is pretty hard to sustain. Even the level of dominance or submission is hard to sustain if it does not come naturally.
> 
> That is why I think it is so important to be ourselves with our partners right away. The more transparency, the better.


But I think they both are into it naturally. In the process of discovery, together.


----------



## jld

WandaJ said:


> But I think they both are into it naturally. In the process of discovery, together.


I am just not sure he is the Dom, you know?


----------



## WandaJ

That;s for them to decide I think they are just starting and having a lot of fun with it. 

Some couples do D/s 24/7, some have it limited to bedroom only, others something between. Whatever suits them


----------



## jld

WandaJ said:


> That;s for them to decide I think they are just starting and having a lot of fun with it.
> 
> Some couples do D/s 24/7, some have it limited to bedroom only, others something between. Whatever suits them


I hear you. But if I am going to give Dom advice, I would like to make sure I am really talking to a Dom. I don't want to frustrate him.

And if she is the one to please, maybe we can better target our advice.


----------



## arbitrator

jld said:


> arbitrator said:
> 
> 
> 
> * jld: Are you saying that you never ever occasionally "come on" to your H when you're feeling frisky?
> 
> If you do, then wouldn't that, in and of itself, be deemed as an overt, yet perhaps temporary sign of dominance of some kind over him for you to get sexually whatever it is that you desire from him?*
> 
> 
> 
> Jumped on top of him? Yeah, I've done that.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In our D/s group here on TAM, we've talked about something I call a "dom score." I think each person has one, though it is certainly subjective. Basically, it is where each person, on a scale of 1-100, would rate him or herself in terms of personal dominance.
> 
> For me, as long as I am with a man whose dom score is higher than my own, I will be happy and attracted to him. If for some reason his dropped below mine, I would feel very nervous. If that continued, I am sure I would no longer feel attracted.
> 
> The dominant in a relationship does not have to have a high personal dom score to be the dom in the relationship. But his or her score must be higher than their partner's, and I would say naturally so, for the relationship to be harmonious.
> 
> This can still be tricky, because there are some "subs" who are really the ones carrying the relationship. You see them propping up the egos of their "doms." You see it in women who want to keep a marriage going, when the man is weak. She knows the marriage rides on her own emotional stability, and so she figures out a way to keep him happy, and not ask too much of him, while she is actually the one doing most of the work.
> 
> The danger there is that he could end up very surprised if she decides one day that she no longer wants to carry the marriage. He could end up left all alone while she goes off with a real dominant, or becomes the official dominant in another relationship.
> 
> And this is all obviously just my opinion!
Click to expand...

* Great answer, Sweetheart!*


----------



## Fozzy

Bugged said:


> I think my problem with it is that I look at both the need to dominate someone and to be dominated as a weakness..a need for approval from another...weakness is the ultimate turn off for me


Needs are by definition weaknesses. The trick is to find someone you trust enough not to exploit that weakness, or to ignore it.


----------



## naiveonedave

jld said:


> But don't you think it is risky to counsel him to be something he is not naturally, Wanda? That is my concern, anyway.


I see this another way, it is hard to be a leader if you don't have any feedback. Her unwillingness to provide feedback is a tough nut to crack.


----------



## jld

naiveonedave said:


> I see this another way, it is hard to be a leader if you don't have any feedback. Her unwillingness to provide feedback is a tough nut to crack.


That is a challenge of leadership. 

Guys, do you think dominance is supposed to be *easy*?


----------



## Fozzy

No, but I also don't think it absolves the other party of all responsibility either.


----------



## jld

Fozzy said:


> No, but I also don't think it absolves the other party of all responsibility either.


Well, I think how responsibility is divided up is different in every relationship. As long as you and yours are fine with it, good enough.


----------



## SimplyAmorous

jld said:


> *That is a challenge of leadership.
> 
> Guys, do you think dominance is supposed to be *easy*?*


I think when one is a natural leader .. they find enjoyment in exhausting all ways to REACH and MOVE someone.. to inspire them.. they have a fire lit to see it through.. if they get little to no-where after all of their sincere efforts... they will be hit with the realization to ACCEPT what IS... or find a way to get out with the least damage to all parties...to move along -finding their happiness...Leaders don't live in limbo.. they AIM to make things happen.


----------



## WandaJ

jld said:


> That is a challenge of leadership.
> 
> Guys, do you think dominance is supposed to be *easy*?


It comes wiht the responsibility for the person submitting. Dom is supposed to push the limits without crossing the hard limit. But he needs feedback, so he knows he is still in excitement terriotory as supposed to be an abuser. And if there is no clear feedback, that creates uncertainty, at least to the Dom that cares about his partner.


----------



## jld

WandaJ said:


> It comes wiht the responsibility for the person submitting. Dom is supposed to push the limits without crossing the hard limit. But he needs feedback, so he knows he is still in excitement terriotory as supposed to be an abuser. And if there is no clear feedback, that creates uncertainty, at least to the Dom that cares about his partner.


Well, I think different people define those roles and divide up those responsibilities differently. I do think a dom who knows his sub, who has really studied her, has some insight he can draw on even when she is not necessarily volunteering feedback.

Dominance, imo, is both a privilege and a tremendous responsibility.


----------



## WandaJ

jld said:


> Well, I think different people define those roles and divide up those responsibilities differently. I do think a dom who knows his sub, who has really studied her, has some insight he can draw on even when she is not necessarily volunteering feedback.
> 
> Dominance, imo, is both a privilege and a tremendous responsibility.


yes, but first he has to get to know her. 

there are different styles, some people are more relaxed about it than others. And communication is very important in D/s relationship. UMP and his wife will have to figure out the style that works for them. Having doubts and concerns about your partner's well being does not disqualify one from being a Dom.


----------



## jld

WandaJ said:


> yes, but first he has to get to know her.
> 
> there are different styles, some people are more relaxed about it than others. And communication is very important in D/s relationship. UMP and his wife will have to figure out the style that works for them. *Having doubrs and concerts about your partner's well being does not disqualify one from being a Dom*.


Agreed.


----------



## WandaJ

argh! sorry about typos!


----------



## ConanHub

WandaJ said:


> argh! sorry about typos!


Too much to drink?

LOL! 
_Posted via Mobile Device_


----------



## WandaJ

ConanHub said:


> Too much to drink?
> 
> LOL!
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


It's almost Friday:>


----------



## heartsbeating

UMP said:


> If we men are going to learn we need very CONCRETE examples. It's just the way we gain knowledge.
> 
> Help a fellow out.
> Thanks!


Hey UMP, sorry I don't know your story.

If you're married or in a relationship, I think you'd both gain the most from the one who's input counts the most... your spouse. Find out what makes her tick. It's sexy the way my husband is with me - his awareness and consideration to what turns me on. 



Oh, what a boring answer!


----------



## heartsbeating

Deejo said:


> She wants you to be proactive, engaged with, and completely aware of your own sexuality and hers.


oh beHAVE!


Great answer.


----------



## heartsbeating

UMP said:


> I have tried and she simply shuts down. If I want to completely ruin a sexual experience all I need to do is start talking about sex with her.
> 
> I can certainly force a conversation, but it will only end badly. I think this would (in my situation) be me going from dominant to dominant assshole.
> 
> Let me try to make you understand my wife. If I try ANY sexting or ANY discussion about sex prior to the actual event, it COMPLETELY takes away all intrigue and excitement for her.
> 
> She wants it to be a secretive naughty act that no one knows about, not even us:surprise:


That doesn't seem to be working for you though. You wrote that you feel pressure. I feel hard-pressed to think of another moment where I'm as present as I am during sexual intimacy; it's the place to let go. 

You wrote that she wants your masculinity and dominance to be REAL. I couldn't think of anything more REAL than leading a conversation outside of the bedroom (if you want to think in terms of taking the lead) around a mutually satisfying and exciting sex life. You mentioned she is submissive in other areas of your relationship, yet in this instance she seems to dominate what can and can't be expressed. Why does she shut down when you want to talk about it?

In saying that, with knowing that she finds the fantasy of 'secrecy' exciting, have you explored that further in a way to build up the excitement for her?

I love when my husband makes me a cuppa tea in the morning. It's not just the love of English Breakfast, milk and sugar, it's the way I sleepily detect he's given me a light kiss on my forehead, gotten out of bed in a way that doesn't disturb me, hearing the gentle clinking of the cups as he removes them from the cupboard, the kettle boiling, the spoon tinkering that certain amount of times, and then the way he places it on the bedside table and tells me he's made me a tea and wishes me a good morning.... of hearing him slurp his next to me hahah and the faint aroma wafting nearby before tasting that cup of goodness. There's nothing erotic about this for the purpose of your thread other than (hopefully) suggesting that there's many elements that make up an experience, especially when the various senses are engaged. Or maybe I just need a cup of tea.

Out of curiosity, how do you flirt, touch and what kind of intimacy do you share that's non-sexual?


----------



## heartsbeating

Fozzy said:


> Needs are by definition weaknesses. The trick is to find someone you trust enough not to exploit that weakness, or to ignore it.


Brilliant.


----------



## Deejo

Call me crazy ... but one of the best ways I know of to foster trust and build sexual rapport is by engaging in small sexual exercises that don't necessarily always involve sex.

She wants to put her hands on me, I gently but firmly put them by her side. "Not yet. I'll tell you when." All the while I'm revving her up with mouth, hands, oven mitts ... whatever.


What you need to be able to do is get a very good read on your wife. You have to pay attention. Especially given her avoidance to talk about it.
As well as helping you avoid, 'falling on your face'.

I suppose as I'm writing this, I'm hoping you didn't grab her head and push it into your crotch.

But hey ... if you did and everyone is happy about it, then kudos.


----------



## Faithful Wife

There's no reason as an adult she cannot talk to you about sex. This is bratty behavior which you have allowed and it is detrimental to your sex life. I don't care how whiny she gets about it, tell her you aren't going to have sex with her at all until she can talk to you about it like a couple of grown ups. This is THE most dominant move you could possibly make right now. Acting like she is a China doll who will break if she has to talk about her own sex life is a little scenario you have both created but it is completely artificial and it means your needs are not considered. Namely, the need for feedback.


----------



## Fozzy

Faithful Wife said:


> There's no reason as an adult she cannot talk to you about sex. This is bratty behavior which you have allowed and it is detrimental to your sex life. I don't care how whiny she gets about it, tell her you aren't going to have sex with her at all until she can talk to you about it like a couple of grown ups. This is THE most dominant move you could possibly make right now. Acting like she is a China doll who will break if she has to talk about her own sex life is a little scenario you have both created but it is completely artificial and it means your needs are not considered. Namely, the need for feedback.


----------



## naiveonedave

jld said:


> That is a challenge of leadership.
> 
> Guys, do you think dominance is supposed to be *easy*?


No, however, it is somewhat on the person being led to understand this as well. To make this all the man is pretty ridiculous.


----------



## jld

naiveonedave said:


> No, however, it is somewhat on the person being led to understand this as well. To make this all the man is pretty ridiculous.


What one man might find too much work, or too much responsibility, another man might find totally normal and natural. 

You know men who are fine with providing for their families all by themselves, right? And other men who feel it is too much responsibility? 

Is either way right or wrong? Doesn't it all depend on the feelings, capabilities, goals of the individuals involved?


----------



## Wolf1974

jld said:


> That is a challenge of leadership.
> 
> Guys, do you think dominance is supposed to be *easy*?


It's only easy if it comes natural. I am naturally dominate. Always have been even from my first sexual encounter. I suspect on a subconscious level I seek out submissive women and they seek me out. My dominance only exists in the bedroom. I am not a full time "need to be in charge" kinda guy but in the bedroom that is just naturally how it goes. So for me this is very easy. What would be hard is for me to try and be submissive in the bedroom. I would think guys who aren't naturally dominate would struggle to even fake it. When clothes are off and body's are slapping together it's not the time to try and be something you're not in my opinion.


----------



## UMP

So, 
Last night I'm showered and ready to go, doing what Wandaj suggested.
Everything is going great, I'm using my strength to move her around, talk more, etc. etc.
She even commented on how much more vocal I was, in a good way.
Anyway, we're reaching the end, she's on top and starts a BIG orgasm. Mid way through her orgasm at 11:30pm there is a knock on our bedroom door. She can't hear it because she's mid-orgasm. I'm not quite there and hear. Again, a knock, my wife jumps off of me like my diick is on fire and runs to the bathroom. 
My 17 year old son wants to know if he can go boating tomorrow.
All I can think of saying is "we're busy right now!" WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SHIIT!

MID ORGASM !! Talk about bad timing!!


----------



## jld

Congrats, UMP! Sounds like it was a success!

But maybe next time hang a Do Not Disturb sign on the door first?


----------



## thefam

I think that the d/S that's actually a kink is different from just wanting a man to be dominant in bed. I actually have the kink so i don't have time for all the cream puffery. Just dominate me already! We can tiptoe through the tulips in the aftercare. Having the kink doesnt rule out tendef lovemaking sessions either. We switch it up a lot and with a toddler we sometimes have to take what we can get. 

Having said all this I had to have the awkward conversation with my husband once I was in touch with my kinky side. It was by no means easy either! Ump it does kind of seem like youd wife has the kink. I just don' t know how you're going to find out . Don't takd this the wrong way but a true dom would know by now. But that's ok if you're nof a true dom, being dominant is enough to meet her needs. Its clear that you love and respect her so she most likely feels safe. So don't be afraid to push the envelope ever so slightly. She has already shown that she is not afraid to tell you to stop. Read some erotic stories for ideas but don't go the full on bdsm route if you can't have the conversations first. Get a safe word anyway.

ETA I posted before I saw your post from laat night.


----------



## UMP

Faithful Wife said:


> There's no reason as an adult she cannot talk to you about sex. This is bratty behavior which you have allowed and it is detrimental to your sex life. I don't care how whiny she gets about it, tell her you aren't going to have sex with her at all until she can talk to you about it like a couple of grown ups. This is THE most dominant move you could possibly make right now. Acting like she is a China doll who will break if she has to talk about her own sex life is a little scenario you have both created but it is completely artificial and it means your needs are not considered. Namely, the need for feedback.


FF, 
I understand what you are saying, but in my particular case, it does not apply. Let me explain why.
My wife likes sex, but she has a BIG hang up when talking about it. She thinks talking about sex is "dirty" even between married couples. I have tried for 26 years to get her kink on. Only since I have completely STOPPED talking about sex has she opened up.
Call it childish call it whatever, it makes no difference. The moment I discuss sex, it completely takes away her desire and excitement. The less I talk about sex, the more excited she becomes when we actually have sex.
In her mind, I am some fictional character that she is secretly having sex with. No body can know what evil stuff we do, she does not even want to know. In her mind, if we don't talk about it, it never happened, so if it never happened she does not feel guilty about it and can let her inner "bad girl" out.

I'm completely fine with who she is and I have covered much ground in the confined boundries of her mind.

It's all good. Just different.

If you think about it, it's kind of sexy.


----------



## UMP

thefam said:


> I think that the d/S that's actually a kink is different from just wanting a man to be dominant in bed. I actually have the kink so i don't have time for all the cream puffery. Just dominate me already! We can tiptoe through the tulips in the aftercare. Having the kink doesnt rule out tendef lovemaking sessions either. We switch it up a lot and with a toddler we sometimes have to take what we can get.
> 
> Having said all this I had to have the awkward conversation with my husband once I was in touch with my kinky side. It was by no means easy either! Ump it does kind of seem like youd wife has the kink. I just don' t know how you're going to find out . Don't takd this the wrong way but a true dom would know by now. But that's ok if you're nof a true dom, being dominant is enough to meet her needs. Its clear that you love and respect her so she most likely feels safe. So don't be afraid to push the envelope ever so slightly. She has already shown that she is not afraid to tell you to stop. Read some erotic stories for ideas but don't go the full on bdsm route if you can't have the conversations first. Get a safe word anyway.
> 
> ETA I posted before I saw your post from laat night.


Are we allowed to talk about D\S stuff on here?
How can I tell if I'm D and she is S?
I took that test that SA suggested, but I cannot answer one way or another. For example, they ask about your driving style. Most days I only drive the speed limit, very courteous and cautious. Other days, I drive 150mph. I used to race cars competitively. A person cannot say he or she is all one way or the other. I can be both depending on a given situation.

I am very interested in this !!


----------



## jld

Wolf1974 said:


> It's only easy if it comes natural. I am naturally dominate. Always have been even from my first sexual encounter. I suspect on a subconscious level I seek out submissive women and they seek me out. My dominance only exists in the bedroom. I am not a full time "need to be in charge" kinda guy but in the bedroom that is just naturally how it goes. So for me this is very easy. What would be hard is for me to try and be submissive in the bedroom. I would think guys who aren't naturally dominate would struggle to even fake it. When clothes are off and body's are slapping together it's not the time to try and be something you're not in my opinion.


I don't think anyone should fake anything, either. Be yourself; be honest and open.

Again, I wish people would do this right from the beginning of their relationships, just have a policy of transparency. I think it would help people get matched up properly, and help them resolve issues as constructively as possible from then on.


----------



## UMP

Another example. I've wanted to try anal sex with my wife for 20+ years. If I even mention the word, she will want to leave the room. However, if I get her hot enough, I can lick, prod, poke, and play with her anus all day long and she loves it. However, after years and years of refusal,(talking about it) I am petrified to just stick my penis inside her when the "moment" is right.
This is where I get my insecurity from.


----------



## WandaJ

UMP said:


> So,
> Last night I'm showered and ready to go, doing what Wandaj suggested.
> Everything is going great, I'm using my strength to move her around, talk more, etc. etc.
> She even commented on how much more vocal I was, in a good way.
> Anyway, we're reaching the end, she's on top and starts a BIG orgasm. Mid way through her orgasm at 11:30pm there is a knock on our bedroom door. She can't hear it because she's mid-orgasm. I'm not quite there and hear. Again, a knock, my wife jumps off of me like my diick is on fire and runs to the bathroom.
> My 17 year old son wants to know if he can go boating tomorrow.
> All I can think of saying is "we're busy right now!" WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> SHIIT!
> 
> MID ORGASM !! Talk about bad timing!!


You're welcome! 

Now ROTFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## WandaJ

UMP said:


> FF,
> I understand what you are saying, but in my particular case, it does not apply. Let me explain why.
> My wife likes sex, but she has a BIG hang up when talking about it.
> 
> If you think about it, it's kind of sexy.


Well, if nothings works you can always treat this as her hard limit


----------



## UMP

WandaJ said:


> You're welcome!
> 
> Now ROTFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Wandaj, 
From what I have posted about myself and my wife, what do you think? Do you think my wife is crazy or sub or what?
Do you think I am D or S or what?
Your advice is greatly appreciated !!


----------



## UMP

thefam said:


> I think that the d/S that's actually a kink is different from just wanting a man to be dominant in bed. I actually have the kink so i don't have time for all the cream puffery. Just dominate me already! We can tiptoe through the tulips in the aftercare. Having the kink doesnt rule out tendef lovemaking sessions either. We switch it up a lot and with a toddler we sometimes have to take what we can get.
> 
> Having said all this I had to have the awkward conversation with my husband once I was in touch with my kinky side. It was by no means easy either! Ump it does kind of seem like youd wife has the kink. I just don' t know how you're going to find out . Don't takd this the wrong way but a true dom would know by now. But that's ok if you're nof a true dom, being dominant is enough to meet her needs. Its clear that you love and respect her so she most likely feels safe. So don't be afraid to push the envelope ever so slightly. She has already shown that she is not afraid to tell you to stop. Read some erotic stories for ideas but don't go the full on bdsm route if you can't have the conversations first. Get a safe word anyway.
> 
> ETA I posted before I saw your post from laat night.


How would you know if someone has that "kink" if they never tell you or even discuss sex?
What clues can I look for that would tell me is she is or is not wanting this sort of thing?


----------



## thefam

UMP said:


> Another example. I've wanted to try anal sex with my wife for 20+ years.


Thats probably another one of those acts that you don't need to try if you can't have the conversation first.


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> Are we allowed to talk about D\S stuff on here?
> How can I tell if I'm D and she is S?
> I took that test that SA suggested, but I cannot answer one way or another. For example, they ask about your driving style. Most days I only drive the speed limit, very courteous and cautious. Other days, I drive 150mph. I used to race cars competitively. A person cannot say he or she is all one way or the other. I can be both depending on a given situation.
> 
> I am very interested in this !!


Do you find it equally pleasurable to submit as well as dominate? If so, you are probably a switch. 

Maybe think of it as being on a continuum. On one side are the dominants, and on the other side are the submissives. In the middle are the switches. In between the middle and each end you have people who lean one way or the other. 

Does that help?


----------



## thefam

UMP said:


> Are we allowed to talk about D\S stuff on here?
> How can I tell if I'm D and she is S?
> I took that test that SA suggested, but I cannot answer one way or another. For example, they ask about your driving style. Most days I only drive the speed limit, very courteous and cautious. Other days, I drive 150mph. I used to race cars competitively. A person cannot say he or she is all one way or the other. I can be both depending on a given situation.
> 
> I am very interested in this !!


The dom score test is much more direct. Maybe i can post it later or someone else can.


----------



## UMP

thefam said:


> Thats probably another one of those acts that you don't need to try if you can't have the conversation first.


Well, that's exactly what the problem is. In the past she has categorically said "no." However, now I can lick, put in a vibrator, finger, etc. all day long and all she does is moan. But won't talk about it.
What to do next?
She does not want me to ask anything, all she wants me to do is "DO" what I want to do, confidently.


----------



## UMP

thefam said:


> The dom score test is much more direct. Maybe i can post it later or someone else can.


Please post link, if possible.


----------



## thefam

UMP said:


> How would you know if someone has that "kink" if they never tell you or even discuss sex?
> What clues can I look for that would tell me is she is or is not wanting this sort of thing?


Unfortunately I don't think you can fully know. But she has already given you clues that she does. Thats why I said you could get some ideas from erotic stories and try a few things. Some light weight things to start with.


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> Do you find it equally pleasurable to submit as well as dominate? If so, you are probably a switch.
> 
> Maybe think of it as being on a continuum. On one side are the dominants, and on the other side are the submissives. In the middle are the switches. In between the middle and each end you have people who lean one way or the other.
> 
> Does that help?


I'm just not one type of person. I think I could do both, honestly.
If my wife wanted me to dress up in a monkey suit and use a banana, my first question would be "when, where and how big of a banana?" I'm just open about sex in general and want to do whatever turns my SO on, regardless.


----------



## UMP

thefam said:


> Unfortunately I don't think you can fully know. But she has already given you clues that she does. Thats why I said you could get some ideas from erotic stories and try a few things. Some light weight things to start with.


I'll re read your previous posts. Maybe I missed your suggestions.


----------



## Fozzy

UMP said:


> Well, that's exactly what the problem is. In the past she has categorically said "no." However, now I can lick, put in a vibrator, finger, etc. all day long and all she does is moan. But won't talk about it.
> What to do next?
> She does not want me to ask anything, all she wants me to do is "DO" what I want to do, confidently.


Then do it. She's already demonstrated that she's comfortable with telling you to stop something she doesn't like, and you've demonstrated you're the kind of guy that will respect that.


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> I'm just not one type of person. I think I could do both, honestly.
> If my wife wanted me to dress up in a monkey suit and use a banana, my first question would be "when, where and how big of a banana?" I'm just open about sex in general and want to do whatever turns my SO on, regardless.


I think meeting each other's needs is the bottom line, UMP. There will always be disagreement about definitions and labels.

That said, have you ever googled Dominant/submissive relationships? It can be informative to see what is out there. You could pick up lots of ideas from blogs and articles that you might find helpful.

I agree with tfam and others who have stressed the importance of open communication. I am not sure how to have a satisfying D/s relationship without that.


----------



## Fozzy

Ump, imo don't get so hung up on the labels. I think there's a lot of pressure to be the "natural dom" inherent in these discussions, and that sometimes people will choose to act the part they think they're supposed to act whether it works or not. It's kind of like the alpha/beta/whateva labels that get tossed around here.

Just do what works for you guys. Don't worry about if you're doing it up to the standards of internet people.


----------



## UMP

Fozzy said:


> Ump, imo don't get so hung up on the labels. I think there's a lot of pressure to be the "natural dom" inherent in these discussions, and that sometimes people will choose to act the part they think they're supposed to act whether it works or not. It's kind of like the alpha/beta/whateva labels that get tossed around here.
> 
> Just do what works for you guys. Don't worry about if you're doing it up to the standards of internet people.


I'm only interested in doing what turns my wife on. If she is turned on, then I am turned on. To me, that's the "bottom line."


----------



## thefam

Fozzy said:


> Ump, imo don't get so hung up on the labels. I think there's a lot of pressure to be the "natural dom" inherent in these discussions, and that sometimes people will choose to act the part they think they're supposed to act whether it works or not. It's kind of like the alpha/beta/whateva labels that get tossed around here.
> 
> Just do what works for you guys. Don't worry about if you're doing it up to the standards of internet people.



Not saying this is what you and implying Fozzy but just in case I want to make this clear. I am not advocating he has to live up to others' definitions of what a dom should be. I was just indicating my own preference. But surely he should be himself. Nothing else will work. Im just trying to give him suggestions within the parameters he has laid out.


----------



## UMP

thefam said:


> Not saying this is what you and implying Fozzy but just in case I want to make this clear. I am not advocating he has to live up to others' definitions of what a dom should be. I was just indicating my own preference. But surely he should be himself. Nothing else will work. Im just trying to give him suggestions within the parameters he has laid out.


I tried to take a bunch online tests and they pretty much say I am 80% dom. I tried to answer as if I were my wife and she came out sub. What would you suggest I read or view for more information on this. I think I'm headed in the right direction but don't want to get crazy with it. Wife might get frightened.


----------



## Fozzy

thefam said:


> Not saying this is what you and implying Fozzy but just in case I want to make this clear. I am not advocating he has to live up to others' definitions of what a dom should be. I was just indicating my own preference. But surely he should be himself. Nothing else will work. Im just trying to give him suggestions within the parameters he has laid out.


No no, not implying anything toward anyone. Just like JLD was saying earlier--it's important to not try to be something so outside your zone that you end up making things worse. Too much of a good thing and all


----------



## WandaJ

UMP said:


> Wandaj,
> From what I have posted about myself and my wife, what do you think? Do you think my wife is crazy or sub or what?
> Do you think I am D or S or what?
> Your advice is greatly appreciated !!


I am no expert on this, but I think you should stop worrying about labels, and just enjoy the ride. You are enjoying it, she is enjoying it, that's all it matters. You don't have to be card carrying member of D/s community with torture chamber in the cellars.


----------



## naiveonedave

jld said:


> What one man might find too much work, or too much responsibility, another man might find totally normal and natural.
> 
> You know men who are fine with providing for their families all by themselves, right? And other men who feel it is too much responsibility?
> 
> Is either way right or wrong? Doesn't it all depend on the feelings, capabilities, goals of the individuals involved?


No, but to abdicate ALL responsibility to the man IS wrong.


----------



## jld

naiveonedave said:


> No, but to abdicate ALL responsibility to the man IS wrong.


Okay, would you like to elaborate on that? How would you define "all responsibility?"


----------



## UMP

naiveonedave said:


> No, but to abdicate ALL responsibility to the man IS wrong.


I don't see it as "wrong" but only a preference.
You may disagree or be frustrated by a preference, but I would not call it wrong.


----------



## jld

It might be good to just mention that D/s is not the same as BDSM. I remember reading a good article on this once, but I can't seem to locate it right now.

Anyway, the gist, iirc, was that not everyone in a D/s power exchange may do the physical acts of BDSM. The D/s may just be an emotional or spiritual power exchange.

And not everyone who does BDSM has a D/s relationship anywhere outside of temporary scenes, whether in a bedroom or a club.

Again, different strokes for different folks.


----------



## Buddy400

As a guess, what percentage of women want a man to be "dominant" in bed (actual research would be a bonus)?

Let's say that I was advising a young man just entering the sexual marketplace. I know that everyone is different and you need to adapt depending on the person. But, in initial encounters, you'd have to approach it one way or another. 

Also, there must be some women who, due to cultural influences, rationally believe that they wouldn't want this but, emotionally prefer it. In an on-going relationship one would, hopefully, figure this out. But in the beginning it seems like you'd have to attract the woman enough while not giving her what she prefers in order to get to a place where you could discover what she really wants while, hopefully, wanting to give it to her that way.


----------



## jld

Buddy400 said:


> As a guess, what percentage of women want a man to be "dominant" in bed (actual research would be a bonus)?
> 
> Let's say that I was advising a young man just entering the sexual marketplace. I know that everyone is different and you need to adapt depending on the person. But, in initial encounters, you'd have to approach it one way or another.
> 
> Also, there must be some women who, due to cultural influences, rationally believe that they wouldn't want this but, emotionally prefer it. In an on-going relationship one would, hopefully, figure this out. But in the beginning it seems like you'd have to attract the woman enough while not giving her what she prefers in order to get to a place where you could discover what she really wants while, hopefully, wanting to give it to her that way.


I think he should just be himself. Ideally he is attracting a woman by who he is. 

Remember an earlier poster who said he has always been dominant and has always attracted submissive women? I think the chances of a good match increase when people are just being themselves, and not trying to psych each other out.


----------



## naiveonedave

jld said:


> Okay, would you like to elaborate on that? How would you define "all responsibility?"


Well, in this situation, the W is 'wrong' for not being able to even discuss sex. She is totally forcing all responsibility on the OP. JLD - in almost all of your posts, you pin 100%+ responsibility on the man. That is not right, fair or normal....


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> I think he should just be himself. Ideally he is attracting a woman by who he is.
> 
> Remember an earlier poster who said he has always been dominant and has always attracted submissive women? I think the chances of a good match increase when people are just being themselves, and not trying to psych each other out.


The problem is, you can live with someone for 20+ years and they can be so embarrassed about their sexuality that they never mention it. You almost have to find out by chance.
I can see where if my wife asked me to be dominant, that in and of itself is making me submissive because of her request and defeats the original purpose.
Combine that with the "I should be nice to women all the time thing" and you end up with a BIG missed opportunity.


----------



## jld

naiveonedave said:


> Well, in this situation, the W is 'wrong' for not being able to even discuss sex. *She is totally forcing all responsibility on the OP.* JLD - in almost all of your posts, you pin 100%+ responsibility on the man. That is not right, fair or normal....


He does not have to take it, Dave. It is his choice to accept that responsibility.

Ultimately how UMP and his wife run their relationship is for them to decide. It is helpful to tell him your concerns, though, as you may mention something he has not thought of that could prove problematic.


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> The problem is, you can live with someone for 20+ years and they can be so embarrassed about their sexuality that they never mention it. You almost have to find out by chance.
> *I can see where if my wife asked me to be dominant, that in and of itself is making me submissive because of her request and defeats the original purpose.*
> Combine that with the "I should be nice to women all the time thing" and you end up with a BIG missed opportunity.


Yes, I think these lines can be hard to draw, and will be seen differently by different people. Some people are fine telling their spouse what they want for a birthday present. To others, having to tell takes the joy out of it. 

Again, if you two are happy, good enough.

I stress a strong emotional connection in relationships because I think people are more apt to risk sharing their deepest feelings if they feel strongly connected emotionally. She has to feel safe with you. You have to earn her trust. I think that is the foundation of a healthy D/s relationship.


----------



## UMP

naiveonedave said:


> Well, in this situation, the W is 'wrong' for not being able to even discuss sex. She is totally forcing all responsibility on the OP. JLD - in almost all of your posts, you pin 100%+ responsibility on the man. That is not right, fair or normal....


To me it's an adventure. It's not like I have to figure out how to cure cancer, I'm just trying to have fun sex with my wife.
Sometimes in life, the pursuit is more fun than the actual prize.
I'm OK with it.
If I were not OK with it, I would be gone are arguing all the time with my wife. That would gain me nothing but heartache.
Adapt, learn, conquer.


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> Yes, I think these lines can be hard to draw, and will be seen differently by different people. Some people are fine telling their spouse what they want for a birthday present. To others, having to tell takes the joy out of it.
> 
> Again, if you two are happy, good enough.
> 
> I stress a strong emotional connection in relationships because I think people are more apt to risk sharing their deepest feelings if they feel strongly connected emotionally. She has to feel safe with you. You have to earn her trust. I think that is the foundation of a healthy D/s relationship.


I agree, it's just that sometimes you run across a person that is so embarrassed about their own sexuality that they just freeze up in a conversation. That's my wife.
If we are watching tv with our teenage kids and some soft sex scene is on tv, she runs to the remote like the tv is on fire.


----------



## naiveonedave

UMP said:


> To me it's an adventure. It's not like I have to figure out how to cure cancer, I'm just trying to have fun sex with my wife.
> Sometimes in life, the pursuit is more fun than the actual prize.
> I'm OK with it.
> If I were not OK with it, I would be gone are arguing all the time with my wife. That would gain me nothing but heartache.
> Adapt, learn, conquer.


that is the 'adult' way to handle this. I applaud you for that. JLD's posts a few pages ago set me off a bit. Sorry if I T/J'd you.


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> I agree, it's just that sometimes you run across a person that is* so embarrassed about their own sexuality that they just freeze up in a conversation*. That's my wife.
> If we are watching tv with our teenage kids and some soft sex scene is on tv, she runs to the remote like the tv is on fire.


Well, doesn't that sound interesting to explore? 

Are you only interested in sexual dominance, UMP? It's fine if you are. It might be fun to expand beyond that, though.

For us, my emotional trust in my husband developed long before we tried anything kinky. Really, my trust in him is the reason we could do any of those things.


----------



## Fozzy

Ump--you mentioned you had a teenager? I'm just curious how you guys handle birds and bees if sex is such a taboo topic? Sorry if this is off in the weeds, but it just got me thinking.


----------



## Fozzy

Just as a follow up on my last question--one of the things that opened up a lot of previously unexplored topics of conversation with my wife and I was figuring out how we were going to handle certain conversations with our daughters.

Maybe appealing to her parental instincts is a way to get her to open up tangentally on some of these things.


----------



## Anon Pink

There is no right or wrong at okay here. We all come to marriages with skills and deficits. Sometimes we don't figure out how those skills and deficits will impact our lives until much later and by then we have a choice to make. Work with the person standing in front of you or keep standing on your side and don't move until your spouse takes enough steps forward. If you want to save the marriage, you've got to work with the person standing in front of you, not the person you wish was standing in front of you.

UMP, there are ways you can slowly desensitize your wife to the anxiety she feels when discussing sex, and it looks just the way you teach a toddle to use the correct tenses.

"I eated all my carrots." Parent says, "I ATE" all my carrots. Not eated"

You notice she likes it. You say, "you like this I know you do. Say, 'I like this' ....come on say I like this... Say it... Say it.

Once she can say it, you name it, and have her name it. 

Yes, an adult woman should be able to talk about sex but many can't. Hell many men can't! 

Being in Dom mode would make drawing her out that much easier I would think.


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> Are you only interested in sexual dominance, UMP?


Yes and no.
Yes, because I think that's what she wants and what I want.
Sub, if it's what she wants, but I really don't think so.


----------



## UMP

Fozzy said:


> Ump--you mentioned you had a teenager? I'm just curious how you guys handle birds and bees if sex is such a taboo topic? Sorry if this is off in the weeds, but it just got me thinking.


My wife simply CANNOT talk to them about sex. She just can't do it. I do here and there, but nothing too formal. 

It's a running joke in our house that when something sexual comes on tv we all make this weird sound that my wife used to make to mask any conversation about sex on tv when the kids were real small.
It's that bad.


----------



## UMP

Anon Pink said:


> There is no right or wrong at okay here. We all come to marriages with skills and deficits. Sometimes we don't figure out how those skills and deficits will impact our lives until much later and by then we have a choice to make. Work with the person standing in front of you or keep standing on your side and don't move until your spouse takes enough steps forward. If you want to save the marriage, you've got to work with the person standing in front of you, not the person you wish was standing in front of you.
> 
> UMP, there are ways you can slowly desensitize your wife to the anxiety she feels when discussing sex, and it looks just the way you teach a toddle to use the correct tenses.
> 
> "I eated all my carrots." Parent says, "I ATE" all my carrots. Not eated"
> 
> You notice she likes it. You say, "you like this I know you do. Say, 'I like this' ....come on say I like this... Say it... Say it.
> 
> Once she can say it, you name it, and have her name it.
> 
> Yes, an adult woman should be able to talk about sex but many can't. Hell many men can't!
> 
> Being in Dom mode would make drawing her out that much easier I would think.


Actually, I have been doing exactly what you describe. However, once sex is over, no talking about what just happened. :surprise:


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> Yes and no.
> Yes, because I think that's what she wants and what I want.
> Sub, if it's what she wants, but I really don't think so.


Oh, I did not mean your becoming her submissive. I meant do you want to take it out of the bedroom, into the rest of the relationship. 

My thinking is that if she could come to trust you enough to explain why she is sexually shy, you could help her open up in that way, if that is something you both want. But I don't know if that can happen without her feeling very comfortable, without her willingness to extend great trust. And that of course is earned by the dominant. 

Just to be clear, I am talking about emotional dominance.


----------



## Anon Pink

UMP said:


> Actually, I have been doing exactly what you describe. However, once sex is over, no talking about what just happened. :surprise:


That's okay. She's not shushing you so it's a start. You could ask her yes or no questions and allow her to nod or shake her head. 

It's really hard to talk about sex when you grew up shushed and shamed regarding private parts. Your wife will get there with you leading the way.
@GettingIt and @MisterG this thread needs you!


----------



## Faithful Wife

Ump...I understand that you don't want to force your wife to talk since she has made it clear she is unwilling to. But the problem with this is that it is causing you to subjugate your needs in order to tip toe around her preference.

You can't ask other women, read books, take dom tests or do anything else along these lines and ever find out what your wife likes or wants. And at the same time if she is unwilling to talk at all then you don't get to tell her more of what you want (beyond just wanting feedback). 

I appreciate you are trying to be kind to her. But seriously, she will live through it you demand (kindly) that she open the verbal lines of communication.

Your reluctance to do this is the actual problem. You can and should insist on more and more actual discussion. Just consider it for now and figure out how to make it happen.

I always get worried about people asking others what their spouse might be into. It just doesn't work that way. She can remain modest and demure about it, and still give you the open communication you need and deserve.


----------



## NotEasy

UMP said:


> I'm just not one type of person. I think I could do both, honestly.
> If my wife wanted me to dress up in a monkey suit and use a banana, my first question would be "when, where and how big of a banana?" I'm just open about sex in general and want to do whatever turns my SO on, regardless.
> 
> <Fozzy likes this>


Lol. I imagined her answering "When Fozzy arrives in the bear suit."


----------



## NotEasy

Faithful Wife said:


> Ump...I understand that you don't want to force your wife to talk since she has made it clear she is unwilling to. But the problem with this is that it is causing you to subjugate your needs in order to tip toe around her preference.
> 
> You can't ask other women, read books, take dom tests or do anything else along these lines and ever find out what your wife likes or wants. And at the same time if she is unwilling to talk at all then you don't get to tell her more of what you want (beyond just wanting feedback).
> 
> I appreciate you are trying to be kind to her. But seriously, she will live through it you demand (kindly) that she open the verbal lines of communication.
> 
> Your reluctance to do this is the actual problem. You can and should insist on more and more actual discussion. Just consider it for now and figure out how to make it happen.
> 
> I always get worried about people asking others what their spouse might be into. It just doesn't work that way. She can remain modest and demure about it, and still give you the open communication you need and deserve.


Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes to all the above.

UMP, you mention you wife commenting, during the act. That is probably the only time to get her to talk.



UMP said:


> So,
> Last night I'm showered and ready to go, doing what Wandaj suggested.
> Everything is going great, I'm using my strength to move her around, talk more, etc. etc.
> She even commented on how much more vocal I was, in a good way.
> ...


So, if that is all you have to work with, then work with that. You have the advantage of being able set the script. Maybe don't push her to talk too much, just yes/no, or just nod, or type. And, I guess, don't let her think too long, or the mood may evaporate.
Someone mentioned getting her to fill out a questionairre, have you tried that? Can't see how to fit that in though, perhaps role-play naughty school girl who hasn't finished her homework?? But unless you already role-play it is out-of-character.
Given you have already been married 20+ years, I doubt you will change the dynamic quickly, but change is always possible.


----------



## Duguesclin

Wolf1974 said:


> It's only easy if it comes natural. I am naturally dominate. Always have been even from my first sexual encounter. I suspect on a subconscious level I seek out submissive women and they seek me out. My dominance only exists in the bedroom. I am not a full time *"need to be in charge" *kinda guy but in the bedroom that is just naturally how it goes. So for me this is very easy. What would be hard is for me to try and be submissive in the bedroom. I would think guys who aren't naturally dominate would struggle to even fake it. When clothes are off and body's are slapping together it's not the time to try and be something you're not in my opinion.


It is not because you are in charge in the bedroom that you are dominant in the relationship.

Dominance implies that there is someone else, the submissive. Selfishness means there is only you that counts. Dominance and selfishness are often confused.

I would rather associate dominance with caring, taking responsibility. It is not a selfish act or state.

From what UMP writes about anal sex, his wife does not want to talk about it, so he does not know what she wants. He is curious about it, would like to do it, but does not feel right just charging ahead. He thinks his wife may not like it and it may not be good for her. Either way, he cares and takes ownership. This is dominance to me. Just acting on it would be called selfishness.


----------



## Wolf1974

Duguesclin said:


> It is not because you are in charge in the bedroom that you are dominant in the relationship.
> 
> Dominance implies that there is someone else, the submissive. Selfishness means there is only you that counts. Dominance and selfishness are often confused.
> 
> I would rather associate dominance with caring, taking responsibility. It is not a selfish act or state.
> 
> From what UMP writes about anal sex, his wife does not want to talk about it, so he does not know what she wants. He is curious about it, would like to do it, but does not feel right just charging ahead. He thinks his wife may not like it and it may not be good for her. Either way, he cares and takes ownership. This is dominance to me. Just acting on it would be called selfishness.


I'm not dominant in my realtionship. Not interested in that. I am in the bedroom. In life I want a partner who contributes to the relationship.

I am not a Dom in a Dom /sub relationship. I think you misread my post. I am just naturally dominate in the bedroom. That's just me being me. It has no title


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> Oh, I did not mean your becoming her submissive. I meant do you want to take it out of the bedroom, into the rest of the relationship.
> 
> My thinking is that if she could come to trust you enough to explain why she is sexually shy, you could help her open up in that way, if that is something you both want. But I don't know if that can happen without her feeling very comfortable, without her willingness to extend great trust. And that of course is earned by the dominant.
> 
> Just to be clear, I am talking about emotional dominance.


I think I am already dominant in the rest of the relationship. However, a deeper explanation of what you mean by emotional dominance would help.


----------



## Anon Pink

Wolf1974 said:


> I'm not dominant in my realtionship. Not interested in that. I am in the bedroom. *In life I want a partner who contributes to the relationship.*
> 
> I am not a Dom in a Dom /sub relationship. I think you misread my post. I am just naturally dominate in the bedroom. That's just me being me. It has no title



You say you are naturally dominant in the bedroom, which would mean your sex partner takes a submissive role. Does your submissive partner in the bedroom contribute to the quality of the sex?

A submissive partner does contribute to the relationship. A submissive partner does make decisions and does voice objections. Do not confuse submission with detached passivity.


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> I think I am already dominant in the rest of the relationship. However, a deeper explanation of what you mean by emotional dominance would help.


I distinguish between emotional and other types of dominance. I think many men are financially, physically, sexually dominant in their relationships. And so people assume they are the dominant in the relationship. But I don't think that is all there is to it.

To me, whoever is emotionally dominant is the dominant in the marriage. That is the person who holds the relationship together, who earns and inspires trust.

To see this, I look for who is more emotionally stable, more empathetic, more able to meet the needs of his partner before his own, without harboring resentment. Does he have to have things his own way, or can he be flexible? If he does want things a certain way, is it because it is in the best interest of the family, or in his own selfish interest?

Can he control his emotions, or does she have to soothe him? Is he always talking about getting his needs met, or is he focused on meeting hers first?

Can he be honest with himself, or does she have to protect his feelings and ego? How does he react to criticism? Can he hear it, and thoughtfully consider it, or does he get defensive? 

Does he blame his wife for issues in the marriage, or does he look to himself first to solve their problems? If he is divorced, how does he speak about his ex-wife? Was everything her fault, or is he upfront about what he could have done differently to have made a difference in the outcome?

How much responsibility does he take in life, and for his marriage and family? Is he willing to be the leader, especially by example? Or will he only go so far, and expect certain "compensation"?

How does he treat people around him? Is his mind open or closed? Is he aggressive and defensive, or open and respectful? Is he curious, or controlling?

Anything that says "controlling" to me is not going to speak dominance to me. I think it is when people cannot dominate naturally, by the strength and goodness of their character, that they turn to control techniques. And I think those are very unhealthy.

Again, I think there is often one person in every marriage who is key to holding things together. No matter what the other person does, that person is likely to make things work. That person, to me, is the dominant. Without them, the marriage simply will not hold together, or be nearly as functional.


----------



## jld

Thinking about this some more . . . How much emotional trust a wife has in her husband is probably the best indicator of his dominance in the relationship.

Does she tell him everything, and I mean absolutely everything, in her heart? Is she not afraid to go to him with anything? To express herself any way she needs to, because she knows his ego is secure enough to handle it? That he will respond with warmth, and empathy? Is he the first person she turns to when she is afraid, lonely, sad, because she knows she is safe with him?

If a husband has reason to believe that his wife is not reflexively 100% transparent with him, I think he has work to do, some trust to earn, in the relationship. That is, if he wants to be the dominant in the relationship.


----------



## UMP

JLD, 
Thanks for posting that. According to your statement I am dominant in the relationship EXCEPT regarding these two issues.
1. My sister is evil and causes our family (mother, father, myself) an enormous amount of grief. Sometimes I do need my wife to "talk me through" the pain and help to find out ways to deal with sisiter.
2. I have a very difficult time with a bunch of people over at our house. I can handle it to a degree. However, if it builds up, I get on edge emotionaly.
Other than those TWO items I am what you describe. Dominant.
However, maybe those two items alone are big enough that I lose "trust" with my wife, I don't know.
I do know that I am much better than I used to be and continue to work hard to overcome these issues.


----------



## jld

UMP said:


> JLD,
> Thanks for posting that. According to your statement I am dominant in the relationship EXCEPT regarding these two issues.
> 1. My sister is evil and causes our family (mother, father, myself) an enormous amount of grief. Sometimes I do need my wife to "talk me through" the pain and help to find out ways to deal with sisiter.
> 2. I have a very difficult time with a bunch of people over at our house. I can handle it to a degree. However, if it builds up, I get on edge emotionaly.
> Other than those TWO items I am what you describe. Dominant.
> However, maybe those two items alone are big enough that I lose "trust" with my wife, I don't know.
> I do know that I am much better than I used to be and continue to work hard to overcome these issues.


That's great, UMP. And remember, this is just how I view things. And my views are always evolving, so take them for what they're worth. 

I would also say that dominance is on a scale. And as long as you are more dominant than your partner, and naturally so, your marriage, imo, is likely to be fairly harmonious, especially if you are always working to achieve more healthy emotional dominance (more empathy, greater trust, etc.). That is if you both prefer a marriage where you are dominant, of course. Some couples prefer a marriage where the woman is dominant.

I worry when I see women holding themselves back in order for their man to feel dominant. I don't see how that can work long term. I think people are better off being themselves and finding a partner with whom they are more naturally compatible, if the man cannot face his insecurities and genuinely and humbly work on them.

Just curious, but what are the conflicts you have with your sister? Have you tried using Active Listening with her?


----------



## UMP

jld said:


> Just curious, but what are the conflicts you have with your sister? Have you tried using Active Listening with her?


Trust me, we do not want to get into this. It's VERY sad.
Essentially, my sister is more interested in her inheritance than my parents well being. It's enough to drive one insane.
I literally have to take an Ativan when I have to meet with her.


----------



## Wolf1974

Anon Pink said:


> You say you are naturally dominant in the bedroom, which would mean your sex partner takes a submissive role. Does your submissive partner in the bedroom contribute to the quality of the sex?
> *Yes*
> A submissive partner does contribute to the relationship. A submissive partner does make decisions and does voice objections.
> 
> *Never said they didn't. It's an area I'm well versed in
> *
> Do not confuse submission with detached passivity.


*I'm not confused At all and understand the difference *


----------



## DayOne

jld said:


> Just curious, but what are the conflicts you have with your sister? Have you tried using Active Listening with her?


Focus, jld. Focus!

:grin2:


----------



## Anon Pink

Wolf1974 said:


> I'm not dominant in my realtionship. Not interested in that. I am in the bedroom. *In life I want a partner who contributes to the relationship.*
> 
> I am not a Dom in a Dom /sub relationship. I think you misread my post. I am just naturally dominate in the bedroom. That's just me being me. It has no title





Wolf1974 said:


> *I'm not confused At all and understand the difference *


Perhaps I misunderstand your words above? 

You say you're not dominant in your relationship, except in the bedroom, and then say that you want a partner who contributes to the relationship. 

Considering your back and forth with JLD, I took your statement about wanting a contributing partner, to indicate you felt a submissive partner would not contribute to the relationship.

What did you mean, then, by your bolded statement above if it had no relation to domination or submission? The way it reads to me is that you think a submissive partner would not contribute to the relationship.


----------



## Wolf1974

Anon Pink said:


> Perhaps I misunderstand your words above?
> 
> You say you're not dominant in your relationship, except in the bedroom, and then say that you want a partner who contributes to the relationship.
> 
> Considering your back and forth with JLD, I took your statement about wanting a contributing partner, to indicate you felt a submissive partner would not contribute to the relationship.
> 
> What did you mean, then, by your bolded statement above if it had no relation to domination or submission? The way it reads to me is that you think a submissive partner would not contribute to the relationship.


You picked that one sentence but seem to have missed the other when stated I am NOT in a Dom sub relationship. I have been before but I am NOT now. Wasn't a reference to Dom sub relationships was a statement of my current meaning I don't want a Dom sub relationship. But that doesn't mean I am not naturally dominate in the bedroom

In reference to the contributions I never said submissivea don't contribute but it's different then in a vanilla relationship. Again...what I am in now


----------



## MountainRunner

UMP said:


> OK,
> So if I'm lying on the bed, she gets out of the shower, I should wait till she gets on the bed and grab her head and push it down to start BJ? I'm ok with that although I have never done this. I usually ask or simply tell her, not push her head.
> 
> I'll try tonight :grin2:


I know I'm late to this conversation, but why wait until she's out of the shower? Heck...Join her in the shower, take her and ravage her like she's the sexy "thang" that you see her for. Shower sex is great fun. Just sayin....


----------



## Faithful Wife

Bugged said:


> I wonder why some people think they can write about this stuff, saying what most women like...did they run tests or something? What data do they have to back up these assumptions?
> Like the dirty talk..most women like being called dirty *****s??? seriously???
> whatever>


I agree that not everyone likes the same things. I kind of cringed when I read some of the craigslist post, too...because of the implication that we all like the same things. However, there are quite a few women who I've known personally who have ranted in almost exactly the same way to me...they are tired of being with a guy who is just slow moving and touches them tenatively, or who is monitoring her every move and breath to try to decide what to do next, and meanwhile she's just thinking "would you please just f*ck me already!?"

However...IMO, if a woman wants this, she should either get with a man who knows how to do this, or just get happy with who she is with. It is not something you can usually change another person into. 

AND...it is still true that not every woman wants this. The ones who do who haven't been with a man who can deliver this way tend to get really grouchy about it.


----------



## WandaJ

UMP, couple months ago on similar thread someone mentioned book "My secret garden: women's sexual fantasies"

http://www.amazon.com/My-Secret-Gar...d=1433779812&sr=1-3&keywords=my+secret+garden

This is very good read for women like your wife, who are still ashamed of their fantasies becuase of the good girl complex. You may want to read it too.


----------



## RAYMOND

I am sure my wife would be shocked by that book. I have been asking what her fantasies were for 30 years. All she wants is for me to kiss her neck whilst making love.

I am the dominant one but I don't manhandle her because of her weak back. This may sound like a contradiction but I do ask her to spank me as I find it such a turn on. She is very comfortable with it. However she doesn't dominate in it, just complies to my wishes. It does nothing for her if I spank. It is left to me to instigate sex but I wish she would sometimes. If nothing else just to show that she likes it.


----------



## RAYMOND

SimplyAmorous said:


> I only got this far in the thread...
> 
> This is what he means... (one of my old posts I tried to lay it out)...as this is a *real struggle* for my husband...


I agree. A little selfishness makes it happen. I read the book she comes first and it leads to just obligation sex. There are some things I love and if I am just servicing her I am not aroused for myself. When I am aroused I feel like worshipping her and would do anything for her.


----------



## PennyCharity

UMP said:


> Anyway, all you girls like "dominant men in the bedroom." What does a "dominant man in the bedroom" look like, act like, feel like, exactly??


It is more feel and way of acting. I have had men order me to my knees, but it was done in a way that turned me off, it felt dismissive and degrading. Other men "tried" to be dominant, but failed. So maybe confidence is a key part.

For example, my husband used to tied me to the bed when we were trying to spice things up and try new things, but he was so cautious and always checking. The man I see now rarely asks, he might grab my hair and pull me to my knees. He tells me how to dress and even once spanked me in a semi public place for wearing undergarments.

It made me feel both owned and desired. It is like his need for me is barely under control, but it is focused and directed at me.

He has tied me and it hurt a bit, he could read my face and adjusted the scarves he was using, but he did not ask if I was alright. Somehow being a bit uncomfortable made me more excited. He is very take charge in the bedroom. Even my husband seems to respond when he is allowed to be there. He would firmly but quietly order my husband about, making it clear that while he is there, I am his.

All this makes me feel more feminine, but also more desired. It is not disrespectful. I have never once felt degraded, though the semi public spanking was very embarrassing, especially after we went back into the restaurant. I could not raise my eyes at all. I felt I was with him somehow more. Even when the waiter came, I asked Jack to order for me.

So when he is being sexually dominant, it is confident, but very focused passion and focused on me.

Penelope


----------



## DayOne

Am I reading that wrong, or is your husband now a cuckold, or are you in some sort of threesome?


----------



## UMP

Penny, 
I see what you mean about the dominance and how to go about it. Thanks for that information.

My situation is a bit different than yours. No one else is allowed in our bedroom when we are having sex. But, I do get what you are saying.


----------



## Maricha75

DayOne said:


> Am I reading that wrong, or is your husband now a cuckold, or are you in some sort of threesome?


You mean Penny? It says in her profile that she is in an open marriage.


----------



## DayOne

Maricha75 said:


> You mean Penny? It says in her profile that she is in an open marriage.



Ah, missed that bit. Heck of a first post though.


----------



## UMP

Hey Penny, 
Just curious, how does your husband deal with getting ordered around by another man in your bedroom?
That just blows my mind !

How can you be attracted to your husband after seeing him play second fiddle during sex?

I am NOT trying to judge you, I just can't wrap my mind around this.


----------

