# 18 years, no orgasms.



## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

Hi everyone. I've been reading here for about a week now. Nice to not feel alone in messed up sexual situations. Even though, of course, I wish there was no need for a board like this.

Married 18 years, no orgasms. 

I suppose the start of the problem was being raised in a very strict religion where even sex between married couples was under control of the church. I left that religion in my early 20's and did start having sex in my mid 20's. No orgasms then either, but as I recall I was very inexperienced and depended on my boyfriend to know what to do. We had a lot of sex but no orgasms. I don't know if he noticed or cared. He never said much about it.

Met my H. Wonderful guy. Decided I wanted to marry him before we'd ever had sex. Started having sex, it was fine, hoped it would improve. No orgasms but I figured we had time to work it out. For whatever reason I never said anything to him. He didn't ask and I just couldn't just say it. I didn't want to hurt his feelings, put it off, figured it would work itself out, what have you. 

The infertility years, those lasted 5 years. The timing of sex was of utmost importance. I don't remember even thinking about orgasm during those years. 

Then we had small children and I was completely drained at the end of the day. Sex felt like just one more thing someone needed from me. 

Then we had a rough patch where I was afraid we were going to get divorced (unemployment, financial strain.) 

When that ended life got so much better, the kids were older and I lost 20 pounds, it was a happy time. It was then that I started faking. I wanted him to feel wanted, wanted him to feel successful, didn't want to be one of those wives that was always trying to get out of sex. 

Let me add, my drive has always been higher than his. Despite no orgasms with a partner I have always loved and wanted sex. I've read a lot about it, think a lot about it, etc. I've also been getting off whenever I want by myself since forever. Since before I started having sex. So it's not like I CANT - I just honestly don't know how to with someone else.

For whatever reason 2 months ago this became unbearable and I told H. Since then things have been super awkward. He's been avoiding sex because he doesn't want to deal with this (I'm guessing.) Every day he doesn't deal with it I get more and more panicked and feel less and less wanted. 

Nothing has gone well. I had him watch me so he'd see what I was talking about. He said nothing afterwards. We watched porn together on this subject. He said nothing afterwards. We've had 4 fights about it where I've been really upset/crying, etc. 

He's really not handling it like I would or like I thought he would. I don't even know what to do at this point. And, to make things worse, it seems like every other woman in the world just gets off so easily and their H's know just what to do and it's just the simplest, stupidest thing in the world - how could there possibly be a problem? 

One of the big problems is that H is so vanilla about sex. He had a relationship with bad oral before me, so he had an aversion I hoped he would grow out of. But he did not. He has never been open to toys. To get out of the current situation he's going to have to adapt. If I could have orgasms from PiV I would have had a ton by now. Not going to happen.


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## seeking_guidance (May 22, 2013)

Well, I can appreciate you're wanting to post on the site, but it's (like all others) a unique issue. You might explain that you need him to adapt or it could breed larger problems? I'm not exactly a leading authority, see my most recent posts on my own problems, but I'd RELISH the chance to have that sort of interaction and desire from my wife. Even if she critiqued me, I'd be game for it! I'm just an under-used husband though that's fighting to keep it together after 19 years. 

I hope you get some better advice than I have, but I definitely think you've got to express your concerns more firmly with him and somehow get him to open his horizons.


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## Riverside MFT (Oct 5, 2009)

I have counseled with other couples who have experienced not having orgasms when making love. While orgasms are enjoyable for both men and women, the purpose of making love is not to have an orgasm. The purpose is to join together with the one you love and bond as husband and wife.

If you are thinking about having an orgasm every time you have sex, it could become stressful and tiring. The purpose of being with and joinging with your husband goes out the window.

The next time you are making love, don't worry about having an orgasm. Think about how good it feels to have your husband so close. Love him. Let him know that you don't need an orgasm in order to feel close to him during sex.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

Can you have an orgasm by yourself?

C


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## ginger-snap (Apr 10, 2013)

Have you ever tried to help yourself along during sex? Does he touch you at all? 

I'm guessing he's feeling insecure right now and unsure of how to proceed. I can imagine it would be a fairly big blow to find out after so many years that your wife has never orgasmed. You said you've had 4 fights...what did he say then?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## ginger-snap (Apr 10, 2013)

> The next time you are making love, don't worry about having an orgasm. Think about how good it feels to have your husband so close. Love him. Let him know that you don't need an orgasm in order to feel close to him during sex.


I think if hadn't had an orgasm during sex with my husband ever during 18 years of marriage, it would be all I could think about too.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

I would imagine that he feels deceived. For good reason. I think you need to apologize to him for pretending. 
Can you imagine being in his shoes? How hurtful it would be to know that your spouse basically lied to you in your most intimate moments? 
You need to heal that wound that you created before you figure out how to O with him.


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

Can I orgasm by myself - yes - although I have become fond of vibrators with very dependable results and going back to manual stimulation is a lot more of a challenge. I stopped using the vibrator after we had our talk 2 months ago to try and help the situation. 

Does he touch me at all - no he hadn't been. Hes now trying but thus far has not found the correct technique. Have I tried helping myself along - not yet. I'm fine with that but feel its a few steps down the line.

What does he say during the fights - hes sorry, we will work it out, he feels stupid, hes lost his confidence, he will try oral and whatever else. But then he doesn't. We are barely having sex.

On the not making it the focus - I see what you are saying and agree to a point. Now that this has been put in the open I am quickly losing my patience with it NOT being the focus. Its an emergency as far as I'm concerned.


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

You were in the wrong and you need to apologize.


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## ginger-snap (Apr 10, 2013)

> Now that this has been put in the open I am quickly losing my patience with it NOT being the focus. Its an emergency as far as I'm concerned.


Unfortunately, he's just learned about this issue, so I think you may really need to have some more patience since you never told him and even faked it in the past. He's going to need time to digest this and pressuring him to try new things may be ratcheting up his anxiety.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

I did apologize for faking the past few years. Of course that was a bad thing to do. Of course I'm sorry I did that. (However there are 10 years there that I did not fake.)

My feelings are also hurt, though. He has been granted everything he has wanted sexually over the past 18 years and has a wife who wants to be with him.


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

The road to h*ll is paved with good intentions. 

There is nothing more important in a relationship than communication. Lying for this long about something so dreadfully tied up in his ego is devastating. Good lord what he must be going through - feelings of betrayal, hatred, inadequacy and being played for such a fool. 

If you can do it yourself then the problem is you, not him: whatever mental issues are in the way of you directing him on how to please you. He has no trust in you now to believe what you say, and you need that trust in order for it to work.

Repairing that trust is the first order of business.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Riverside MFT said:


> I have counseled with other couples who have experienced not having orgasms when making love. While orgasms are enjoyable for both men and women, the purpose of making love is not to have an orgasm. The purpose is to join together with the one you love and bond as husband and wife.
> 
> If you are thinking about having an orgasm every time you have sex, it could become stressful and tiring. The purpose of being with and joinging with your husband goes out the window.
> 
> The next time you are making love, don't worry about having an orgasm. Think about how good it feels to have your husband so close. Love him. Let him know that you don't need an orgasm in order to feel close to him during sex.


"The purpose of making love is is not to have an orgasm, but to join together and bond..." Yeah RIGHT! Lets see YOU go 18 years providing the medium for others to climax, yet not getting one yourself?


MissScarlett, you poor poor thing, I know JUST how you feel, right down to being completely perplexed by your H's lack of response to your admission. Dont wanna scare you, and it was a while ago, but I think my H didn't approach me for over a year. He took it really bad. But looking back, like your H, my H never even asked if I had an orgasm, never made any moves to do more than turn me on so I was lubricated enough for penetration. 

Looking back, mixed signals all over the place!

You are probably going to have to give him time to lick his wounds, then make a date in which he knows ahead of time you both are going to talk this over. 

You need to take the blame for misleading him, even though it wasn't calculated and purposeful. You need to reassure him how much you love him and want great sex with him. But obviously, you both are going to have to mechanically do things very differently. 

You are on the right track with having him watch you masturbate! Good job on that!It might be helpful if he knows exactly where your clit is, how to tease it out of hiding, how you like it touched...

Then you two will be like kids on a honeymoon! Boinging like rabbits and he'll be beating his chest at the fabulous orgasms he can give his wife!


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

Acknowledging that faking is wrong. Totally. 

He has not touched my clitoris with any part of his body for 18 years. That is the problem.

True - I should have said hey, you need to touch my clitoris. Which is what I finally had to say, just many years too late. 

Believe me, Ive already been punished for this situation. You know, by being in my 40s and never having had an orgasm with someone.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Damn right you've already been punished enough!

I had a major talk with my H a few years after the big admission. I told him I WANTED a kick A$$ sex life, with him and wasn't going to take any more excuses. I told him all my insecurities and where and how I need his support and help, help to keep bringing me out of my shell sexually.

You'll get there, I just know it!


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## JustSomeGuyWho (Dec 16, 2012)

diwali123 said:


> You were in the wrong and you need to apologize.


Diwali

To clarify, what was she in the wrong about? Deceiving him or telling him. I certainly don't think she is in the wrong for telling him but I do think she was in the wrong for not being open with him all along. Just like anything else, keeping this information from him for so long just makes it all that much worse when she does tell him. 

OP,

I think as it is now, it is going to be a process. I am sure he's feeling embarrassed, ashamed, deceived and angry. He probably thinks it's all him ... he's inadequate in some way. He is going to need a lot of reassurance. Right now, it is all about your orgasm ... or inability to have one with him. I am sure he loves you and wants to be able to give that to you but it is less likely to happen if that is where both your focus is at. 

Sex is one of those things that I think it is ok to be selfish. I don't mean be a selfish lover where you don't take your partner into consideration. What I mean is that you (both of you) explore what feels good to you with your partner. That can start the process of trying new things and moving beyond vanilla sex. If he is only focused on what he thinks has worked in the past to get you to orgasm then that is all he's ever going to do ... only to find out it wasn't working at all. Talk with him about it. Talk with him about some things you would like to try that might feel good to you (being selfish). He might suddenly discover ... hey, I like those things too. You might need to take the lead on that, and that is ok to get things started down the right path. Then you can start encouraging him to think about what he might like ... what really gets him going. If the message is that you want him to get off, that he's allowed to be selfish and the focus isn't on your orgasm, he might do some things differently ... and you might discover some things you love for him to do to you. Like I said, if he's constantly worried about you and your enjoyment, he's going to stick with the same old stuff ... or he's not going to want to try at all because he doesn't believe he can give you the big O.

I think you can get there. I worry that you perceive it as an emergency because it might take some time to get there. If you had constant and open dialogue with him the entire time, you'd probably already be there.


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

Thanks Anon, I appreciate the support.

Edited to add - I do appreciate everyones input. H and I share a circle of friends and I have said nothing to them. I had never told a soul I wasn't getting off. I was planning to take it to the grave. I don't have a support system I can talk this through with so it does help to have the different viewpoints here.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

MissScarlett said:


> I did apologize for faking the past few years. Of course that was a bad thing to do. Of course I'm sorry I did that. (However there are 10 years there that I did not fake.)
> 
> My feelings are also hurt, though. He has been granted everything he has wanted sexually over the past 18 years and has a wife who wants to be with him.


Imagine that one day, your husband came up to you and said that you cooking (or something else you do for him) was awful and that you needed to learn it all over. That for the past 18 years he was faking liking it and any comments or compliments were not true? How would you react? Would you start cooking again? Would you feel hurt? Would you be over it in only a month or so?

I am giving this example not to make you feel bad but to give you an idea about what he may be feeling. In one sense, you may have shook him hard. He thought he was doing right by you, and it turns out he was wrong because you mislead him. He does not know what works and is likely doubting any move he things about making. He may well be wondering what else he has been doing wrong and you did not tell him about. He lost a little trust, so you will need to get that back.

I do agree that having another talk is good. Talk about figuring this out together and assure him that you want him to be the guy that you want to have fun with. Because I bet right now he is unsure of that.


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## Woodchuck (Nov 1, 2012)

Scarlet, I am so sorry to hear about your problem. My wife and I are just the opposite, having enjoyed mutual orgasms since our first time when I was 18 and she was 20...47 years ago....

With you being able to orgasm alone, I am sure your problem can be fixed, it will just take a lot of work on the part of you and your husband, but there is no more enjoyable "work"...... 

Have you seen a MC with a specialty in sexual problems?

It almost seems like the issue is one of trust on your part, even though you don't feel you have a trust problem....It's not that you don't trust your husband, it's more like not being able to totally let down and relax with your husband in a sexual context....

A good counselor should be able to give you a series of couples exercises that will gradually let you open up and "trust" your partner enough to orgasm in his presence....

Here's hoping you can develop into the sexual being you truly deserve to be...

good luck
the woodchuck


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## MaritimeGuy (Jul 28, 2012)

I just finished reading Orgasms for Two by Betty Dodson. Her take on it is we've been mislead into thinking the female sexual organ is the vagina. In reality it is the clitoris. Some women can orgasm from PIV or apparently even anal however she theorizes that they are in fact getting some either direct or indirect stimulation of the clitoris in order to achieve that. 

Understandably your husband was taken aback at learning you haven't orgasmed with him all this time. At some point though for both your sakes he needs to get past it. It's in his best interest to learn how to help you orgams during your sex together. If you enjoyed it as much as you did when you weren't orgasming he could be unleashing something every man dreams of if you can figure it out together.

Somehow you need to find the fine line between being patient with him and enabling him to wallow in self pity.


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## mablenc (Feb 26, 2013)

Woodchuck said:


> Scarlet, I am so sorry to hear about your problem. My wife and I are just the opposite, having enjoyed mutual orgasms since our first time when I was 18 and she was 20...47 years ago....
> 
> With you being able to orgasm alone, I am sure your problem can be fixed, it will just take a lot of work on the part of you and your husband, but there is no more enjoyable "work"......
> 
> ...


Totally agree, you need MC at this point it will help you both sort out your feelings and get a plan together. I think this is the best way to deal with it.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## diwali123 (Feb 17, 2012)

I do think you were wrong for faking it.
He's never even tried to touch your clitoris? Were you his first? I can't remember. 
I feel for both of you. It sounds like he just doesn't know what to do! 
I think it will take time for him to get over it. I would recommend a sex therapist. 
He needs to learn to trust and he needs to rethink how a woman's body works.


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## stevehowefan (Apr 3, 2013)

I don't think she was faking it, was she? She just didn't say anything about not having them. That would suck though, to find out that your partner was not having an O.


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## Wiserforit (Dec 27, 2012)

MissScarlett said:


> Acknowledging that faking is wrong. Totally.


Very good. With him it is going to take daily acknowledgement, boundless patience and encouragement.



> He has not touched my clitoris with any part of his body for 18 years. That is the problem.
> 
> True - I should have said hey, you need to touch my clitoris. Which is what I finally had to say, just many years too late.
> 
> Believe me, Ive already been punished for this situation. You know, by being in my 40s and never having had an orgasm with someone.


I wouldn't call it punishment. It's just desserts. It is something you should never, never say to him because it is just going to make him angry to the point of rage. 

Furthermore you could satisfy yourself whenever you felt like it so this is really unjustified playing-the-victim. 

There is no joy in putting you down for this - what you have to understand is that posing yourself in any way as a victim to him is going to be an impediment to recovery. You just can't do it. The only posture you can take with him is that you failed him.


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

That's correct, he has never touched my clitoris or given me oral. He is now trying the touching thing but seems very uncomfortable so it hasn't gotten anywhere (yet). 

Despite not getting off I really love sex. I rarely turn him down, I initiate a lot, I like giving oral. I am guilty of faking the big moment but have never faked enthusiasm or desire to be with him. 

I was not his first. It was his college relationship that turned him off to oral. He says she demanded it and this put me in a position where I never felt like I could ask him to do it without being in the same category as her. 

For many years it really didn't' trouble me that much. I was getting off as much as I wanted and having sex with H. For a long time it was easy to pretend it was all the same thing. I don't know what changed so suddenly - but it became unbearable to not have this thing that everyone else talks about and I hoped to have it. I can't have it without having to tell him I've never had it.

I am seeing an individual counselor right now and she is also a MC. I am open to seeing her with H - BUT I was hoping to spare him this, he has a difficult time talking about it with just me. Not only do I now need him to do more for me and take more time for me but I also want him to discuss his feelings with a counselor? It just seems too much.

It's been two months, though, and I had stopped doing it on my own to try and make it easier for H. So yeah. He's been away on business. When he returns I'm going to apologize AGAIN and then ask if we need a break from sex (that would be his choice) to remove the pressure.


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## stevehowefan (Apr 3, 2013)

Oh, you have faked it. Damn.


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## Kari (Feb 17, 2012)

MissScarlett said:


> I don't know what changed so suddenly - but it became unbearable to not have this thing that everyone else talks about and I hoped to have it. I can't have it without having to tell him I've never had it.


You don't need to talk about the past, that will just hurt him. Just tell your H, "at this time in my life I seem to need a lot of direct touch on my clitoris." That is the truth but you don't have to mention that you would have wanted that for 18 years.

I think you should experiment using a vibrator on your clit while having PIV intercourse, many women do that and need that because PIV alone isn't quite direct enough to have an O for their specific body. It is normal and common, needing some extra clit stimulation during sex doesn't mean you or your H are doing something wrong.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

MissScarlett said:


> It's been two months, though, and I had stopped doing it on my own to try and make it easier for H. So yeah. He's been away on business. When he returns I'm going to apologize AGAIN and then ask if we need a break from sex (that would be his choice) to remove the pressure.


I don't think a break from sex is needed yet, but do consider not trying to make every session about this goal. Make sure you both at least get some time to enjoy connecting. You don't want to turn sex into a job that you both start to hate.


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## livelaughlovenow (Apr 23, 2012)

PBear said:


> Can you have an orgasm by yourself?
> 
> C


This is exactly what I was going to ask, until you have had one on your own, you do not even know if you are capable (some women are not) but once you figure out how to move your own muscles and tune in.... you should be able to apply it to your relations with your husband. Also, in addition, you can make your sexual relationship not vanilla... that was one issue I had with my husband, so I had to take the lead in making things more fun not kinky but just more creative.


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## kag123 (Feb 6, 2012)

I don't have any great advice, but I feel your pain and know where you are coming from.

I have had O's with my husband, but they are not easy to come by and no amount of practice or sex we've had has changed that. Most of the time I just don't care - I can get off by myself in under five minutes and if I really need an O and can't reach it with H, it's easy enough to just get myself there at another time. But I 100% understand the frustration and exasperation you feel when it seems like this simple thing that just HAPPENS so easily for every other woman on the planet but YOU. I even have to watch myself sometimes because I actually get angry/resentful of my husband for having a penis, that apparently takes absolutely no skill to work and achieve orgasm! It's not HIS fault at all, but I am envious and always wonder what it would be like to not even have to TRY to get there, it just happens every single time. I can't even imagine how wonderful that must be.

I think 99.999999% of the population will crucify you for faking. But you know what, I fake it too. Call it a bad habit or a sin or that I'm a compulsive liar - but I made a decision and went with it. I was sexually active before I met my husband with a few other guys, and I learned quickly that sex (for me) was nothing like what you see in the movies or a porn video - I couldn't O at all with my first few partners. I was young and thought that there was something wrong with me, and that my partners might judge me if I didn't O, so I faked it. And it worked well, so I continued to fake it. 

My experience has been that with every guy I have been with, sex is inextricably linked to their ego and sense of self. It is a fragile topic - especially anything that could be construed as criticism - so to spare their feelings, make them feel good and keep things light and fun I faked my way through it. I truly believed in the saying "fake it till you make it", I really thought that if I took the pressure off the situation and just focused on him and his pleasure, that one day it would just happen for me. Buuut, guess what, it didn't work that way at all. I don't know if I happen to just pick men with fragile ego's, or if all men are typically like this - but I do not regret faking it and I still consider it the kindest thing to do in my situation. I enjoy sex, I enjoy the intimacy in my relationship and I always have, but my husband does NOT understand that I can be perfectly content and happy without an O. He feels he has failed if I don't get there every.single.time and no amount of conversation or explaining has changed that. I don't take pleasure in making him feel bad about himself - I HATE IT - and I would prefer to forgo my own pleasure than to turn our sex life into some frustrating conquest that would suck the fun and enjoyment out of it. I just choose not to go there.

In my case, I can get there some of the time. Not as frequently as I would like - maybe 1 in every 30 times we have sex - but for right now it's enough to keep things going the way they are. I haven't felt like fighting that battle, dealing with all of the bad emotions that will inevitably come out - I am hoping that I will NEVER be so dissatisfied that I have to bring it up to be honest, but I realize that one day when I am older I may feel differently (as you did) and I will have to cross that bridge when I come to it.

There is now an extra layer of complication because I suffer from anxiety/depression and 6 months ago decided it was time that I medicated myself for it - one of the side effects of the medication is difficulty achieving orgasm. Well, in a woman who already had great difficulty in that area prior to the meds, you can imagine it takes a huge toll on me now. Not enough of a toll to make it worthwhile to stop taking the meds though...at least not yet.

I just wanted to share that with you to say that I understand how you may have arrived where you are today, and that I don't think you're awful for having faked it for so long. 

In your case, yes I am sure this was quite a shock for him. He probably didn't have a lot of self esteem in that area to begin with (just guessing based on the fact that you mentioned he doesn't try to explore your body or deviate from the routine that he's familiar with) and it may take him some time to get over this. In my opinion, you can't let it go and ignore that he's hurting. He probably wants to sweep it under the rug and pretend that it didn't happen because it is so painful for him to face what you've said, and he probably feels pressured now to do something that he has no idea how to do and is worried about failing you yet again. If you think he would not react to another discussion well, perhaps consider writing him a letter and explaining to him what you hope to get across. Focus on the fact that you love him, enjoy sex, always have and that this is YOUR problem. Try to bring it back to something that you want to solve WITH him, making sure he understands the pressure is not on him to fix it without your help and you don't expect him to just have the magic answer. 

My gut would tell me this is going to be a long road to recovery. Please keep us updated because your journey is the one that I have not been brave enough to start for myself yet.

I don't know if I am qualified to give you that advice since I am in your shoes, but hope it helps you in some small way.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

kag123 said:


> I don't know if I happen to just pick men with fragile ego's, or if all men are typically like this - but I do not regret faking it and I still consider it the kindest thing to do in my situation. I enjoy sex, I enjoy the intimacy in my relationship and I always have, but my husband does NOT understand that I can be perfectly content and happy without an O. He feels he has failed if I don't get there every.single.time and no amount of conversation or explaining has changed that.


From my experience, this is because I could not imagine sex without an orgasm. Because it is so easy, and the end result for men, I have difficulty understanding having sex with no O. I have come to accept when my wife tells me that she does not need it (though I admit to not understanding it on a gut level). Interestingly enough, my acceptance coincided with her having a much easier time reaching an orgasm. I have always believed that is related.



> In your case, yes I am sure this was quite a shock for him. He probably didn't have a lot of self esteem in that area to begin with (just guessing based on the fact that you mentioned he doesn't try to explore your body or deviate from the routine that he's familiar with) and it may take him some time to get over this. In my opinion, you can't let it go and ignore that he's hurting. He probably wants to sweep it under the rug and pretend that it didn't happen because it is so painful for him to face what you've said, and he probably feels pressured now to do something that he has no idea how to do and is worried about failing you yet again. If you think he would not react to another discussion well, perhaps consider writing him a letter and explaining to him what you hope to get across. Focus on the fact that you love him, enjoy sex, always have and that this is YOUR problem. Try to bring it back to something that you want to solve WITH him, making sure he understands the pressure is not on him to fix it without your help and you don't expect him to just have the magic answer.
> 
> My gut would tell me this is going to be a long road to recovery. Please keep us updated because your journey is the one that I have not been brave enough to start for myself yet.


Well put.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Wiserforit said:


> Very good. With him it is going to take daily acknowledgement, boundless patience and encouragement.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So she ges from rescuer to persecutor to victim, back to persecutor, again? 

No! Sir! Husband plays a role in this in BIG way!

"Did you come?" 
"Do you like what I do?"
"Do you want me to touch you in a certain way?"
"Is there something particular you like that I haven't discovered yet?"

Where the hell has HE been the first 10 years or so, before she started to fake it? 

take home lesson here boys, ASK her the above questions every now and then. Dont assume!


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

Thank you kag for saying all that. That all echoes my experience. I did not start faking for 10 years - during those years he never once asked and I didn't know how to bring it up. I hoped that in time sex would evolve and it would start happening. I also wanted him to WANT to touch me and WANT to give oral. I did not want him doing it because I had asked him to. 

Someone else brought up bringing a vibrator to bed. Believe me I would love that. It would solve the problem in about 90 seconds and H would not have to touch me to do it. He is not comfortable with this at the time. He sees toys as failure on his part. 

I honestly don't know if I'm difficult to get off or not, I don't feel like anyone has ever given it a good try. I guess I am or it probably would have happened on accident by now. Its not difficult to do it myself. 

I had never told a soul about this. It was my dirty little secret that I 
wasn't getting off like everyone else seemed to. I never had any intention of telling H and just planned to live with it. It was all okay until the day it wasn't.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

Good for you for changing this dynamic!

You'll get there. Be very patient with yourself. Realize that you may not ever O from PIV, many/most women do not. When you read stories about women getting off from sex, they don't always mean that they O'd from PIV. So please don't feel like it is necessarily normal or the best way to O from PIV.

Does your H know you were using the vibe (even though you put it away for now?)

In other words, does he know you even have one? Did he know you were masturbating at all? Does he masturbate?


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

He knew I had one but didn't ask much about it. I assume he masturbates too. He travels quite a bit for work. But even if not I took it as a given that he did. Back to my growing up in a very strict religion - masturbation was a no no in marriage, in need on confession. Masturbation was a no no ever. Perhaps that is why I'm such an enthusiast now. Lol. 

I'm realizing how much we don't talk about sex really. Very open in all other areas.


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## eyuop (Apr 7, 2013)

I would suggest getting the book "Intended for Pleasure" and read it with your husband (or you could both read it separately). It has some great techniques for "starting over" and being able to get back into the groove of things again after difficulties.

My wife has never had an orgasm from PIV alone that I can remember. Seven inches just isn't enough, I guess . She needs more clitoral stimulation than any type of thrusting that I can manage. I have good control, so it isn't that I can't go long enough for her. 

What we usually do is some fairly lengthy oral foreplay. (I know your husband has issues with this, but tell him he needs to get over his issues if he wants to have a great sex life). I start with her laying on her back. After she is really feeling good I trade my tongue for my index finger and move up to her breasts (while gentling rotating my fingertip over her "fun spot"). This position is key: I start with my knees between hers and enter. In this position it is almost impossible to manually keep stimulation with my finger, so I move my one leg over hers so I'm straddling her leg (all while staying inside). This gives me a little more room to continue the stimulation with my finger and still thrust. In this position I can kiss her lips, etc., and with my one free hand I can touch her anywhere she wants.

This position was explained in the book "Intended for Pleasure", and it has been a literal blast for us for the past 17 years of our marriage. 

We have nearly simultaneous orgasms every time from this technique (I usually O slightly after her because I'm concentrating on stimulating her the way she needs it). This isn't the only way we do it, but it is the "surefire" way if we both want to O together.

Sometimes we will do several different positions for a while before settling on this one for another grand finale.

You two can work this out! He needs to learn some things, that's for sure. I'm always shocked to find out how little guys know about what a girl needs. I was all over reading everything I could get my hands on about sexual intimacy before any wedding bells ever rang in my ears. I'm so glad I did.

My wife would never let me get away with not bringing her to orgasm. She is lower drive than I am, but when she wants it she wants it.

I hope you and your husband find success and many happy returns


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## Woodchuck (Nov 1, 2012)

MissScarlett said:


> That's correct, he has never touched my clitoris or given me oral. He is now trying the touching thing but seems very uncomfortable so it hasn't gotten anywhere (yet).
> 
> Despite not getting off I really love sex. I rarely turn him down, I initiate a lot, I like giving oral. I am guilty of faking the big moment but have never faked enthusiasm or desire to be with him.
> 
> ...


In my earlier post I hesitated to put any blame on your husband, but I now think the majority of the problem is his concept of what sex should be....

He is caught up in repressive ideas about sex and sexuality that impact his lovemaking in an extremely negative way.....

What is it in his background that keeps him from participating in a free and enthusiastic manner? 

Is he comfortable being naked with you? Have you ever caressed yourself in front of him? Some guys are overwhelmed by the "V" and just don't know how to cope....I would suggest some "tame" but explicit instructional videos for him to watch alone, and then together with you....

You both deserve a much fuller and richer sexual experience than you are getting........

You have come to the banquet, and while the wine is in the bottle and the prime rib on the platter, you allow yourself to think you are satisfied to nibble on radishes and sip spring water....It is time to throw repression to the wind and feast till the juices dribble from your chin, and you couldn't touch another morsel.... You both deserve that feast...

good luck
the woodchuck


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Woodchuck said:


> In my earlier post I hesitated to put any blame on your husband, but I now think the majority of the problem is his concept of what sex should be....
> 
> He is caught up in repressive ideas about sex and sexuality that impact his lovemaking in an extremely negative way.....
> 
> ...



Quoted for brilliance and eloquence!


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Anon Pink said:


> So she ges from rescuer to persecutor to victim, back to persecutor, again?
> 
> No! Sir! Husband plays a role in this in BIG way!
> 
> ...


Well, the questions are only as useful as the answers we get back. If a woman is going to fake an orgasm, not sure that asking will help.

She is not some awful person, but she is also no victim. Yes, he could have asked and taken initiative, but chose not to. But she also could have spoken up just as easily, but chose not to. Plenty of blame on both of them to go around.


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## Woodchuck (Nov 1, 2012)

Anon Pink said:


> Quoted for brilliance and eloquence!


Thank you for your kind words. 

As a true devote of sex and things sexual I find it a tragedy when anyone settles.....

Sex is so easy, and natural, I hate it when I see people THINKING it to death.....

Sex should be as relaxed and natural as walking into an orchard and plucking and eating a plum....No one is watching, you are not being judged, there is no scoring system, just being, and experiencing....How much simpler can it get.....

You don't need apparatus...no props, just some spare time, and a soft place to land....The best sex can be accomplished in the most mundane of situations and positions....Just let your LUST come out....Hot, sweaty, loud, moaning, grunting, back clawing ORGASMS!!!!! 

Yes I LOVE sex, and yet I am a quite civilized, cultured, well behaved, and some say charming individual. I have been totally monogamous for nearly half a century, and do not stare at attractive women in public situations....In short, you can be a totally sexual person, and still fit in to society without being noticed....So why settle for being anything LESS.......

As the sport shoe people say...."Just do it"

good luck
the woodchuck


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

Eyuop - fanning self! I can hope to be so lucky!!

I took H aside and did sincerely apologize for putting him in this situation. I had the choice to say something long ago and also the choice to never say anything. For various reasons I have made errors in judgement and this has resulted in a loss of confidence on his part. 

He changed the subject to dinner so that was that. 

Woodchuck - I did have him watch once so he could see what I was talking about. It did not turn him off but also was nothing he wanted to talk about after. That was 3 weeks ago and he's never mentioned it since. 

Since posting here Ive realized how little he is able to talk about sex. (I honestly do not know why this is.) Between that and my less than sensitive clitoris I may be in an unwinnable situation here. I hope not but will just have to see. There will not be any faking again for sure. Since I want the real thing that would be contrary to my best interests.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Hang in there MissScarlett. He needs more time. He sounds as if he is still in shut down mode. More time, it'll be okay...


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Tall Average Guy said:


> Well, the questions are only as useful as the answers we get back. If a woman is going to fake an orgasm, not sure that asking will help.
> 
> .


This true!


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Anon Pink said:


> Hang in there MissScarlett. He needs more time. He sounds as if he is still in shut down mode. More time, it'll be okay...


Remember, this has been over 18 years in the making. It will take time for both of you to learn how to deal with this and then get comfortable with things.


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

Anon Pink - I did see your other thread. The tipping point in the going from not faking to faking was when I was watching the HBO series Cathouse, a reality series about a Las Vegas brothel. The prostitutes were saying they get a lot of married men in there and the married men generally want oral because they don't get it at home. Secondly they just want to have sex with someone who (pretends) to want them. Enthusiasm. At home the wife is rolling her eyes and trying to get out of it. 

I remember thinking - they have got a point there. I resolved to be more enthusiastic. The enthusiasm led to the faking. I'd say the amount of sex we were having tripled if not more. As Ive said - I have always liked sex. I certainly wasn't pretending to want to be with H. I wanted to be with him and the whole thing took on new life (after 10 years of the same old.)

Once again I am not defending my choices - obviously they caught up to me. But that's how it happened.


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## Emerald (Aug 2, 2012)

Don't beat yourself up for faking it. I couldn't have an orgasm until I was 48 yrs. old & faked it with my husband for 22 yrs. - once you start, it's hard to stop! He was all about getting off himself so probably didn't care.

With my new & current husband, I made the freeing choice to stop faking it. I straight up told him I couldn't orgasm (or so I thought). He was not happy & confused & did not realize that some women cannot. He has issues getting off so he either didn't mind too much or kept it to himself.

I started researching vibrators. I decided to give it one last shot to see if I could orgasm. I purchased a Hitachi Magic Wand which is a power tool for the clit. Much to my surprise, I experienced a powerful squirting orgasm. 

I told my husband & he was less than thrilled that his body parts couldn't get me off but a tool could. He pouted so I put my toy away. We continued on & one day he asked me to bring it out & he was hooked. Now he "wands" me & is happy.

My point here to you is that your toy should be part of your sex life with your husband. He needs to get over himself. If a toy is needed for you to cum, then so be it.

I am so happy you don't have to fake it anymore & got honest with your husband.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Emerald said:


> D
> 
> I told my husband & he was less than thrilled that his body parts couldn't get me off but a tool could.



This is the thing so many men just don't understand about women. The easiest way to orgasm is through clitoral stimulation, yet the clit is NOT located in the vagina and typically isn't even touched during regular penetration, although it can be with a little awareness and finesse!

When designing the female body, why was the clit put so far from the vagina, if the penis is supposed to be the tool for easy orgasm?


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## SouthernMiss (Apr 25, 2013)

Oh please. You are not the bad guy. This man had sex with you for 10 years and never touched your clitoris?!????? And didn't realize you never...not once...had an orgasm...in 10 years *when you were NOT faking?*

He is very selfish in bed. The "sexual inexperience" excuse only goes so far. 

Imagine if you had said you'd never touched your husband's penis in 18 years and, as a result, he'd never orgasmed. People would crucify you! 

You shouldn't have faked because it only adds to the problem, but I'm not going to bash you for it. I don't even think you owe him an apology for faking it. It sounds like you were in a desperate state. You were trying *something* to make it all work.

In fact, I am in awe of your patience. 

You offer him sex pretty much whenever he wants it, initiate, oral, and you have sex with him enthusiastically and with joy?

And he can't even touch your clitoris? NOT ONCE?? 

No, you owe don't owe him an apology. He owes you one! 

I hope you're able to rectify this. It's hard to change the stripes of a selfish lover.

Don't let this go though. You deserve to be attended to properly in the bedroom. It's part of living a full, healthy life.

And don't beat yourself for faking. You didn't always do it...it didn't work...you stopped...you came clean. 

That's all you owe him.

Now he needs to get over "touching you down there" with his hands and (if there's a God) his mouth.


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## PieceOfSky (Apr 7, 2013)

MissScarlett said:


> I honestly don't know if I'm difficult to get off or not, I don't feel like anyone has ever given it a good try. I guess I am or it probably would have happened on accident by now. Its not difficult to do it myself.


Really sounds like it is ONLY because no one has given it a good try. If he has not so much as touched your clitoris, let alone failed to make understanding how your body works one of his highest priorities -- and you havent helped him learn --then it isn't going to happen. Unless you are one of those (nearly mythical?) people who spontaneously orgasms walking down the street.




> I had never told a soul about this. It was my dirty little secret that I
> wasn't getting off like everyone else seemed to. I never had any intention of telling H and just planned to live with it. It was all okay until the day it wasn't.


Not to beat you up about this at all, but the lesson here is crucial for your relationship to survive and you both to be happy: People cannot read minds. If you don't tell someone what you need and have not been given, what you hunger for, then you are probably not going to get it. Doesn't matter whether that means the other is insensitive, indifferent, selfish, or just not very observant or intelligent. Doesn't matter if you think he "should" know to provide it without being told.

Now, just because you tell someone what you need doesn't mean it's going to be given either (my wife and I would both agree with that!). But, sometimes explicitness/directness is necessary, and life is to short to waste being passive and suffering in silence alone.


I don't mean to make light of it by any means. But I am very hopeful for you and him. Or at least you. Your "equipment" works -- sounds like it works really well. His mission, should he choose to accept it, is to learn all its subtleties and rich possibilities and use it for the greater good (your pleasure, his pleasure, your relationship's survival and thriving). I don't know how you get there. But I think he is going to have to swallow his pride, you are both going to have to accept that what has happened has happened, forgive each other's contribution, and move forward to a future where you both genuinely give and receive loving pleasure.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

MissScarlett said:


> I remember thinking - they have got a point there. I resolved to be more enthusiastic. The enthusiasm led to the faking. I'd say the amount of sex we were having tripled if not more. As Ive said - I have always liked sex. I certainly wasn't pretending to want to be with H. I wanted to be with him and the whole thing took on new life (after 10 years of the same old.)


Part of what you two will need to deal with is him recognizing this. Because if you lied to him before by faking, he will be wondering about other things, including whether you liked it at all?

Not trying to beat you up, but rather help you see where there may be be issues going forward so that you can both deal with them.


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## eyuop (Apr 7, 2013)

MissScarlett said:


> Eyuop - fanning self! I can hope to be so lucky!!
> 
> I took H aside and did sincerely apologize for putting him in this situation. I had the choice to say something long ago and also the choice to never say anything. For various reasons I have made errors in judgement and this has resulted in a loss of confidence on his part.
> 
> ...


I have much hope for you. You are being very courageous, open and honest. That will go a long way in achieving what you desire. I seriously doubt you are less sensitive in your clitoris than anyone else, so I wouldn't worry about that at all. Take a deep breath and relax. It is a paradox, really -- to be highly stimulated and have great sex you have to relax. Relax from your anxiety about all of this and just know deep inside that you are okay. You really are okay. You've felt so invalidated for so long it will be very difficult for you to relax. We all make mistakes. We all do things we regret. We all screw things up, sometimes for years, before we notice what we did wrong. What we all have is this moment, right now. We can choose to relax and take the steps forward that we need to take. We can change, one day at a time. 

I haven't met you, but I can tell you have a beautiful heart that is right where it needs to be. You obviously want to enjoy life to the fullest and you are no longer satisfied with being unfulfilled. Armed with that knowledge and your heart to see both you and your husband satisfied, go into this with confidence and no fear. Forgive yourself and allow yourself to relax. Be okay with who you are and never feel ashamed to want what you are after, because it is really good!


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

"When designing the female body, why was the clit put so far from the vagina, if the penis is supposed to be the tool for easy orgasm?"


It was put in a place that should be smushed and bashed around a lot during sex, which for many women does cause orgasm. I think if young women are allowed to come into sexuality naturally the way the body is capable of, more would be able to mash their way to O through PIV sex.


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## eyuop (Apr 7, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> "When designing the female body, why was the clit put so far from the vagina, if the penis is supposed to be the tool for easy orgasm?"
> 
> 
> It was put in a place that should be smushed and bashed around a lot during sex, which for many women does cause orgasm. I think if young women are allowed to come into sexuality naturally the way the body is capable of, more would be able to mash their way to O through PIV sex.


I've always struggled a little bit with the anatomical differences. Men can get off (generally) in about 2 minutes. It takes women (on average) well... longer than that unless maybe they are really aroused and have direct clitoral stimulation. However, I have heard it explained to me that men and women are designed for intimacy and sex (as related things). Men have to learn to spend more time learning about her needs and to gain control, and women need to learn how to make him last and feeling the pleasure of having him focus on her, too. I think you are right that after a while, naturally, the couple could discover the right "mashable" combinations -- as long as they were truly practicing seduction and intimacy, as well as learning how to move in the most pleasurable ways.

I'm still waiting for the day that my wife will orgasm solely through PIV. I need to make this a goal on my bucket list. No pun intended.


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## Faithful Wife (Oct 31, 2012)

"I need to make this a goal on my bucket list."


I don't think you can have someone else's ability to O on your own bucket list. It is up to her to figure this out, or not, as she chooses. You can't "make" her O.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Tall Average Guy said:


> Part of what you two will need to deal with is him recognizing this. Because if you lied to him before by faking, he will be wondering about other things, including whether you liked it at all?
> 
> Not trying to beat you up, but rather help you see where there may be be issues going forward so that you can both deal with them.


This is an excellent point.

If you can, direct him during sex. Either telling him here, there, harder, lighter... or directing his hand with your hand. Afterwards, cuddle up and tell him what you liked best and letting him know if he was doing something that wasn't working for you. he is trying to learn your responses and it would be much easier for him if he knew what doesn't work after you explained what did work.

So how was the long weekend? Did you two spend time together? Is he avoiding the topic and sex, or just the topic?


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## eyuop (Apr 7, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> "I need to make this a goal on my bucket list."
> 
> 
> I don't think you can have someone else's ability to O on your own bucket list. It is up to her to figure this out, or not, as she chooses. You can't "make" her O.


Okay, I'll rephrase this so it doesn't sound the way you interpreted it:

"I'm still waiting for the day that my wife will orgasm solely through PIV." edit: I will do what I can to make this more of a possibility for her (and for myself).

I've never "made her O", obviously -- she does that herself -- and I'm just thrilled to be a willing participant to share the experience with her.


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

Faithful Wife said:


> "When designing the female body, why was the clit put so far from the vagina, if the penis is supposed to be the tool for easy orgasm?"
> 
> 
> It was put in a place that should be smushed and bashed around a lot during sex, which for many women does cause orgasm. I think if young women are allowed to come into sexuality naturally the way the body is capable of, more would be able to mash their way to O through PIV sex.


Oh sure, in a perfect world. But in this country, we do more to kill the natural sexual development and exploration than we do to develop it into healthy loving free expression that it is supposed to be. 

1. Not to mention the varying degree of sensitivity that is attached to the individual clitoris in question.
2. Add in the fact that some positions work well for some women and not for others.
3. And don't overlook the basic fact that a clitoral orgasm is happening from clitoral stimulation, not from PIV sex. 

I think you just perpetuated the myth that men have that a woman is supposed to orgasm from PIV sex. Which is exactly the point I was making. If he smashing and mashing, it isn't the vaginal action that's producing an orgasm, it's the clitoral stimulation.

Unless you want to branch into G-spot stimulation during PIV sex.


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

Anon Pink said:


> This is an excellent poi
> 
> So how was the long weekend? Did you two spend time together? Is he avoiding the topic and sex, or just the topic?


We had made a date for Friday while the children were at school. A child ended up coming home sick and that seemed to be that.

I am following several peoples advice here and am giving him space and trying to be patient. We are getting along well otherwise. He does not want to talk about it. I am waiting for him to initiate. We have had sex just once in May. His choice.


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

I also wanted to say thank you to everyone for the responses, particularly from the male point of view even if it has been difficult to hear. When I came to this board I wanted to just force H to do what I wanted him to do to make it happen. Every day that went by fed my fear that he was rejecting me and was on some level repulsed by me. I'm finding it easier to give him some space and not take it personally - also trying to build his confidence on other levels. 

I am on a kindle (not a computer) so its bulky to quote and to respond to everyone individually but I am taking everything under consideration. Thank you for the support and words of encouragement.


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## CreekWalker (May 31, 2013)

Okay...so here's my advice.

Pre-prep. Use whatever gets you going but don't finish. Then get on top. Squeeze him in and push out, kegals you know... and have him stimulate your chest and grab your hips. Use your fingers or your vibrator if you want. but go at your pace on top and figure out your "angle" lol. You'll have more control. Don't discuss it all with him. Just give him the eye. He will probably know what you are up to. 

The first time I managed to have an orgasm like that I was 27 with three kids and I cried. The directions I just gave you were given to me by my sister. Who called me to tell me she had "figured it out." 

Now I have them pretty regularly. Oddly not as intensely or regularly if I have already had one. And now my favorite position for them like that is missionary. I guess I think in my head of whatever I usually think about when I use my vibrator privately.

Just don't discuss it so much and overthink it. But don't give up.


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

Guess who got some oral? This girl!!
:smthumbup:

I said - when you get back up here I'm going to punch you in the face for holding out on me so long. Because it was super awesome - yay me!


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## CEL (May 7, 2013)

Congrats.....now the question is did YOU O?


Again very happy for you.:smthumbup:


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## Anon Pink (Jan 17, 2013)

MissScarlett said:


> Guess who got some oral? This girl!!
> :smthumbup:
> 
> I said - when you get back up here I'm going to punch you in the face for holding out on me so long. Because it was super awesome - yay me!


You go girl!

Sniff sniff, we tend to them lovingly, then they grow up, spread their legs and get some cunillingus. I'm so proud!


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## MissScarlett (May 22, 2013)

CEL said:


> Congrats.....now the question is did YOU O?
> 
> 
> Again very happy for you.:smthumbup:


He was doing everything right - but I lost my nerve because it seemed to be taking a long time. In the moment.

I will do better next time! I also sent a sext later - I am learning all kinds of new things on this board.


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