# What a mess!



## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

I am 30 years old and have always done everything perfectly. I was a star athlete and academically successful through college. I have always had great success in my careers and I was always the perfect child, sibling, employee, friend and citizen. This was fine for me because I wanted a good life and never felt the need to go crazy or walk outside the lines. My wife and I started dating in high school and got married after college. We had kids after a year and now have five kids and we have been married for 8 years.

When I turned 30, my wife and I agreed that we wanted to not get stuck in marriages routine and we started going out more, I got two tattoos that I had always wanted and we started making some new friends. We felt we were electing to have a fun midlife crisis to head off a real one. We wanted to have even more fun together. We were on top of the world and our marriage was phenominal. We started to hang out with one married couple that had two children and we spent a lot of time together. I was best friends with the husband and she was best friends with the wife. We had a great time together and we felt VERY content with our lives, we loved our children and we both couldn't have been happier. You might think that is not true after what I'm about to tell you, but we were so happy and we were living the dream life. We were responsible, hardworking but we loved each other and had a blast together. We were not only husband and wife, we were best friends. All of this wasnt a burden to us, but a blessing.

Well, a few months back, my wife went over to our friends house to have a few drinks and hang out while I was at home with the kids. You know, girls night out at home. She came home that night and everything seemed great. Two days later, the other wife called me and said she was sorry to hear what happened and that she was there for me if I needed anything. I asked my wife what she was talking about and after a blowout fight, she told me that the she had messed around with my best friend and the husband of her best friend when the wife fell asleep. They both apologized and said it only went on for a minute and then they both realized, in their drunken stupor, that what they were doing was completely stupid and a complete mistake. I found this out on the day of our 8 month anniversary at 2 a.m. I left the house that night and sat at a diner crying for four hours. I felt like I had lost my best friend, wife and confidant. She said she didnt want anything to do with him, she wasn't even attracted to him, but that she had had way too much to drink. She said she stopped the whole incident immediately after it had started.

So I forgave her and actually took her out for our anniverssary that night. I understand that temptations can get the best of people when we drink heavily, even when we are truly happy, and that she had always been so devoted to me and she was so apologetic for losing the control, but she said she was actually blacking out and doesnt even remember it starting, she just remembers the moment when she realized it was happening and stopped it immediately. Well, come to find out over the next few days, the story actually changed. She then admitted that she had texted with him about inappropriate scenarios in the past, that she said she would have never let happen, but it was fun to text those "joking" scenarios to a friend. She also told me that he had tried to kiss her once before. She never told me any of this. I buckled, started hanging out with her best friend, as a support group of sorts, and you know what happened next......we started to have feelings for each other. We have been honorable up until this point, but we can no longer hold back our feelings.

My wife asked me to give her a decision since it has been a few months about whether or not we will stay together or seperate and I just can't make up my mind. The OW and I agreed that we would not see each other while we both tried to work on our marriages, but I am not sure how focused I can be thinking about what happened and the feelings I have for the OW. My wife is fully aware of what is going on with the OW, because I have been completely upfront and told her that I would stop the relationship with the OW if the feelings ever became more than just a friendship/support group. I love my wife to death and we are best friends. We never fight, we get along so well, we are great parents together. Even to this day we continue to go on dates and have a blast together. I'm just not in love with her anymore. Yes, it did click off like a light switch when I was so badly hurt. The problem is, when she opened that door and hurt me beyond anything I ever imagined I could feel, I emotionally shut her out almost instantly. Not by choice!! Once again, she is my best friend and I love her with all my heart, but I am not in love with her anymore. I can't kiss her, be intimate or hug her like I used to. To this day I continue to hug and kiss her hoping to feel something, but there is no feeling whatsoever. I have been struggling to find that spark again, but we are now considering seperation as a last ditch effort to save the marriage. We are hoping it will shock me back to what we had and what we can have again, but I am not sure.

I want to do the right thing and give her another chance, give our children that stability and grow old together as I have always imagined, but I don't know if it will ever come back. We could stay married for the next few years and see what happens or we could cut bait now and stay great friends and great parents to our children. I was the product of a divorce and, although my life was tough at times, I turned out great.

Thoughts?


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

What a mess.

Your wife cheats on you with the married man of your "friend couple." You are hurt beyond recognition so you... start having an affair with the married man's wife?

Did you think that was going to resolve anything? 

You can't put one fire out and start another one right next to it.

Sorry to be crass but either sh-t or get off the pot.

What do you want? Your marriage or the married woman?

Sheesh.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

I didn't have an affair! We met up many times to talk about our pains and how to fix our marriages. Once we realized that we had feelings for each other we stopped seeing eadh other. Read carefully instead of attacking me......


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> I didn't have an affair! We met up many times to talk about our pains and how to fix our marriages. Once we realized that we had feelings for each other we stopped seeing eadh other. Read carefully instead of attacking me......


I did not attack you. 

You ARE having an affair and deluding yourself if you think you aren't. 

Matter of fact, if you can't see that you're having an affair--you are an uphill battle. 

Zero accountability = no hope.


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## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

wrote something, then went back and re-read thread.

Nevermind. Maybe I'll come back to this later.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

An Emotional Affair is usually MUCH STRONGER than a Physical Affair because it's guided by feelings, not urges. Much harder to stop or give up. 

So...are you a man of honor or not?


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## Grayson (Oct 28, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> I didn't have an affair! We met up many times to talk about our pains and how to fix our marriages. Once we realized that we had feelings for each other we stopped seeing eadh other. Read carefully instead of attacking me......


Hate to be another one to break it to you, but what you've described between you and this woman is indeed an emotional affair.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Stop acting like 15 year olds and vow to work on your marriage and stop being selfish.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Ok, if you're not attacking me and pre-judging, then try to see it from my point of view and lets vet this out. Here was how it happened on my side:

1. I wanted someone to talk to and her and I were actually very close friends. I never had an attraction to her, evemn though she is very beautiful, because I was devoted to my wife. 
2. We spent the next few months meeting for dinner every now and again when one of us felt like we were going to end our marriages. The other person would help talk the other one down and it was a fnatastic support group.
3. A month ago, I stared to realize that I had feelings for her, but I chalked it up to a rebound of sorts and that they were not real feelings.
4. Then I realized that this was not the case and the next day we agreed that we couldn't see each other anymore.
5. I stopped it before anything inappropriate happened
6. My honor is intact and I will never feel guilty for having done nothing wrong.

Emotionally confiding in a friend, whether it is a girl or a guy, is not an affair. If it had been a guy that I was talking to, no one would have had a problem with it.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Wow, the insults seem to fly pretty quick around here. Calling someone a 15 yr old because they are trying to get advice on how to find that spark with their wife again.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

You wanted someone to talk to you and went to a WOMAN?


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

No, I went to the only friend I had at that point. The therapists I tried to meet with kept saying that there was something wrong with me and that is why my wife cheated. When I asked my wife that question, she said that she wouldn't change anything except that she is never drinking again because she had never blacked out like that and lost control. The therapists were convinced I was mistreating her and when I went to couples therapy, the therapist said that I was being controlling because I asked her not to go over their house anymore.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> Wow, the insults seem to fly pretty quick around here. Calling someone a 15 yr old because they are trying to get advice on how to find that spark with their wife again.


fighting, after about 10 years of giving advice to people just like you, I can tell you without a doubt that if you approach this with defensiveness, you will never get what you want. If you come at this with humility and admittance and acceptance of your weakness, you have a fair shot at reconciling with your wife and finding LOVE again with her. But it will never happen if you come here and try to justify what happened. It just won't - your psyche won't allow you to see what you need to see, that you are human and weak and fallible and you made a mistake and it's now your job as a responsible adult and father of five to MAKE IT RIGHT.

Sometimes that means not just doing what 'feels good' or what 'makes you happy.' 

Adults don't do that. Not responsible achievers like you describe yourself. They accept that they are adults and sometimes you don't get all the 'feel good' stuff but instead what God hands you. You created a life with your wife and you created a wife for five children who depend on you DEEPLY to do the right thing for them, not go seeking 'feel good.'


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fwiw, therapists are just people, too. They can make mistakes. 

BUT...if you've had more than one tell you the same thing about yourself, it's a fair bet they are probably seeing some truth that you may want to look at.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

And Turnera, I have tried everything I can think of to fix this......My heart just won't wake up! I'm trying desperately to love the woman of my dreams again, but I can't find it. Its like a lost diamond that I can't find no matter how hard I try.


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## Grayson (Oct 28, 2010)

If you're investing more of your emotional energy in someone other than you spouse - regardless of that person's gender - it's generally considered an emotional affair.

My wife has had two EA's. One was with another woman, venting her problems to her instead of to me, sharing emotional ups and downs with her instead of me, complaining of the problems we were having to her instead of trying to work them out with me, ignoring me sitting a foot away from her in favor of all-night text conversations with the other woman...basically forging an emotional bond between the two of them that was stronger and more inkstand to her at the time than ours.

So, yes...if you described the situation exactly the same way, only conversing with another male...I'd wager we'd be considering that an EA, as well.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

turnera said:


> You wanted someone to talk to you and went to a WOMAN?


:iagree:
The problem is that you went to a woman. A woman you even admitted to being attracted to. If you had confided in a male friend, would you have found yourself having feelings for him? You went to a female, even if subconscienciously, as means of revenge for your wife being with another man.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> Ok, if you're not attacking me and pre-judging.


I'm not attacking nor am I pre-juding. You posted the facts and I responded. You don't have to like my answer. But everything I posted was based on what you you outlined--your wife cheated on you with Dude, you got understandably upset, then you started having an affair with Dude's wife. Now you're not sure whether to stay in or leave your marriage and you're not sure how focusd you can be when you have "feelings for the OW."

My advice was to make a decision. And I called you out on your own affair now with the married OM's wife who YOU YOURSELF called *THE OTHER WOMAN.* Several times.



fightingforit said:


> Emotionally confiding in a friend, whether it is a girl or a guy, is not an affair. If it had been a guy that I was talking to, no one would have had a problem with it.


But that's the thing--you weren't talking to a guy and you're not gay (presumably). Therefore you developing feelings and blah blah fill in the blanks and now you're all ILYBINILWY. 

Emotionally confiding in a friend is one thing. An emotional affair is QUITE another. 

Your own words: _*and you know what happened next......we started to have feelings for each other*. *We have been honorable up until this point, but we can no longer hold back our feelings.*

My wife asked me to give her a decision since it has been a few months about whether or not we will stay together or seperate and I just can't make up my mind. *The OW* and I agreed that we would not see each other while we both tried to work on our marriages, but I* am not sure how focused I can be thinking about what happened and the feelings I have for the OW*_

Like I said, if you can't see this for what it is, then no dice.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

"People just like you" If that was said in any other context it would be racism or sexism or any other -ism. Treat me as a seperate case and ask questions not pose judgements. I tried to do everything the therapists told me to do, but my wife kept telling me that they were way off track. We weren't trying to fix our marriage, we were just trying to find the love again.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> 5. I stopped it before anything inappropriate happened
> 6. My honor is intact and I will never feel guilty for having done nothing wrong.
> 
> Emotionally confiding in a friend, whether it is a girl or a guy, is not an affair. If it had been a guy that I was talking to, no one would have had a problem with it.


 Didn't you say previously that you now can't decide if you want to stay with your wife when you care about said friend? THAT is clouding your judgment. 

The one advice we always give people in such situations is this:

If you want to leave your marriage because it's bad, and you have exhausted ALL RESOURCES to fix it, then do so. But forever and ever, you cannot _then_ go to that woman who was your 'friend.' Because that is lying to everyone - you had her in the back of your head the whole time as a fallback plan and you thus never gave your marriage the chance it deserved (especially with five kids). If you leave your wife, and you end up with this friend, you ARE being dishonorable.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

> Emotionally confiding in a friend, whether it is a girl or a guy, is not an affair. If it had been a guy that I was talking to, no one would have had a problem with it.




Uhhhhh.... Surely you realize that if you had talked to a guy and not a girl you wouldn't be in the midst of an emotional affair?
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Soccerfan73 (Jul 30, 2011)

Well, it really comes down to whether or not you can forgive your wife for her initial flirtations and behavior. 

Irregardless of how appropriate it is or isn't to be getting close to the other man's wife, the issue really comes down to if you can forgive the initial betrayl. 

If you can't, then you probably are better off moving on. Not only will it be unfair to you to be with someone you no longer are in love with, but it would be unfair to your wife as well. Bad behavior aside, if she is truly remorseful there is only so long you can hold onto your anger before it starts to become unfair to her as well. 

Good luck to you no matter what direction you go in.


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## John7308 (Aug 17, 2011)

Grayson said:


> Hate to be another one to break it to you, but what you've described between you and this woman is indeed an emotional affair.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


must agree...this has EA written all over it.

Amazing how quickly and easily the boundaries can be crossed isn't it?


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## PHTlump (Jun 2, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> I want to do the right thing and give her another chance, give our children that stability and grow old together as I have always imagined, but I don't know if it will ever come back. We could stay married for the next few years and see what happens or we could cut bait now and stay great friends and great parents to our children. I was the product of a divorce and, although my life was tough at times, I turned out great.
> 
> Thoughts?


You are a child of divorce. You are seriously considering divorcing your wife and making your children into children of divorce. That's not great.

I suggest marriage counseling. Stay in the house and try to recapture the spark.

As for your feelings for the other woman, they are false. You said you were never attracted to each other until you shared this betrayal. Your feelings are understandable, but not genuine.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

AppleDucklings, I had this same discussion with my first therapist who said that spending anytime with someone else sharing your feelings and emotions, no matter the reasoning or the level of emotions is considered an emotional affair. So I asked my therapist if she would consider our meetings an emotional affair? She asked said that since I pay her its different. So if I paid this other woman it would have been fine. And I only said OW because that seems to be how everyone refers to someone other than your wife.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

I said I was NOT attracted to her.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

FightingForIt,

You say that you started to have feelings for each other, and you can no longer fight the feelings. As the others have said, what you describe SOUNDS like an emotional affair. And that affair can make it difficult/impossible to fix what's wrong in your marriage. Do you keep in contact with the wife? And in fact, you use the same terminology yourself for having an affair, calling her the "Other Woman".

When you say that nobody would have a problem if this was a guy that you were talking to is nonsense, because I doubt that you would have said you started having feelings for a guy... 

Anywhooo... Have you two started counseling of any kind? What have you tried to re-kindle things? Gone on holidays without the kids? Anything? 

Personally, I don't suspect a separation will help you right now, at least not if your goal is to heal your marriage. I suspect a separation will drive you and your wife further apart, and you'll continue to think about the OW rather than your wife.

Good luck with whatever you decide!

C


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

SoccerFan73, best piece of information yet. Those are the points of clarity that I was looking for. 

As for this EA, lets say that is the case, but the "OW" and I had this discussion Monday and we ended it immediately. We realized what it was and stopped instantly. She was not a fall back plan as I had never needed a fall back plan. My plan the entire time was that I would be back with my wife. I just cannot find the love.....Soccerfan73 hit the nail on the head. Anyone have any advice as to how to address that?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> "People just like you" If that was said in any other context it would be racism or sexism or any other -ism. Treat me as a seperate case and ask questions not pose judgements. I tried to do everything the therapists told me to do, but my wife kept telling me that they were way off track.


We can say 'people like you' because there is a SCRIPT for waywards. Seriously. Look it up. The ILYBINILWY speech, the justification, the denial, even down to the exact phrases. There's a reason we say 'people like you' because people like you (having affairs) all do and say the same things. I'm sorry you don't like hearing it, but it's the truth. Google it if you don't believe me. Read one of the hundreds of books on the subject like we have. Start with Surviving An Affair so you can understand how you ended up having feelings for someone else.



> We weren't trying to fix our marriage, we were just trying to find the love again.


Ok if THAT is what you're here for, there are plenty of things we can help with.

First, read the book His Needs Her Needs - together. It is a bible of understanding how people fall in love, stay in love, fall out of love, and start affairs. It has very basic concepts, of Emotional Needs and Love Busters - you have to stop Love Busting your partner (making them unhappy) and you have to start meeting ALL their top Emotional Needs so that no one else can do it INSTEAD of you.

There it is - that's the key to a great marriage.

That, and spending 10-15 hours a week together as a COUPLE, not parents. With so many kids it will be hard, but your marriage is on the line, so find a way. If she's a SAHM, ask her to sit down and have a cup of coffee with you each morning. Set up a jigsaw puzzle somewhere so that you two can 'graze' on it together whenever you have a spare 15 minutes, for some down time. Find someone who will share kid watching (like a co-op) and start going on walks together so you can talk without the kids around. Make sure you're getting plenty of bedroom time in (no kids sleeping in your bed!). Turn the tv off for 30 minutes each night before you go to bed and just read together, or talk, or work a crossword puzzle...do something for 30 minutes each night. Get the parents to watch once a weekend and go out on a date night - WITHOUT ALCOHOL! Find a dance club if you can - amazing way to rebond. Start a garden together while the kids play in the sprinkler. Find things to do together. 

Oh, and go to marriagebuilders.com and print out their Love Buster and Emotional Needs questionnaires, and both of you fill them out and then share with each other. You each need to know how YOU LB THEM, and what ENs you are not meeting, so you can adjust and improve. (but avoid their forum - they are toxic and if you think we're being harsh on you, wait til you admit it over there!)

Do these things and I'm pretty sure your marriage will improve in leaps and bounds by this time next year.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

Well let's just cut to the chase
You need to admit that what you did has certainly clouded your judgement, while it seems like a justified response to you, listen to us when we tell you differently
(why ask for advice otherwise if you get defensive instead?)
Think about what you said about how you had a great fun and loving marriage, you can get back to it if you're both putting enough work into it

1) no contact with this couple ever again. Neither one of you should contact either person again and write them a no contact letter asking that they do not contact you
2) complete transparency with each other, allow each other all access to emails, phones, etc
3) both of you need to show true remorse of what you have done to each other
4) counseling with a mutually agreeable therapist, shop around
5) start communicating again, start respecting each other again
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> So I asked my therapist if she would consider our meetings an emotional affair? .


HUH? She is your therapist. Not someone you have "feelings" for. Come on, now!



fightingforit said:


> And I only said OW because *that seems to be how everyone refers to someone other than your wife*.


...that they're having an affair with. 



PBear said:


> When you say that nobody would have a problem if this was a guy that you were talking to is nonsense, because I doubt that you would have said you started having feelings for a guy...


Unless he's gay


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

Seems to can't get the spark that you seek because you are indeed in a Emotional Affair. You did not need to talk to the His Wife to about what had happen you needed to talk to your Wife. What's done is done now but it is not over. You can't see past the OM's Wife because you don't want to. If what you say you had with your wife was indeed thaat special to you and I am sure it was. Then do what is needed. Work on it. From a Woman who's husband has cheated on her I understand well what how you are feeling. You are to afraid of allowing her to hurt you again. I am not inlove with my husband at this point either because of that reason. But do need to decide what it is you are doing. The feelings you are having for the other woman may just be a comfort and that is it. But you seems to be thinking of it as if it could be more and that will lead you to having a Physical Affiar with her even if you chose to stay with your wife if you don't get a grip. If you think things are a mess now you have no idea just how mess they will get with that. You said you are fighting for it. Ok, then fight and fight hard. Nothing she did was right and lieing about it made it sooo much worse. But I really don't think what you feel for the other woman is real just you wanting and needing that imtimacy.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

PBear said:


> FightingForIt,
> 
> You say that you started to have feelings for each other, and you can no longer fight the feelings. As the others have said, what you describe SOUNDS like an emotional affair. And that affair can make it difficult/impossible to fix what's wrong in your marriage. Do you keep in contact with the wife? And in fact, you use the same terminology yourself for having an affair, calling her the "Other Woman".
> 
> ...


PBear, great input. I completely ended all contact with the "OW." I DO know that it is a distraction now, but I never suspected this would occur and I do not welcome the distraction. Sorry, I have to pleade ignorance, I have a lot of "girl-friends" and this had never happened. It was completely unexpected. There was no intent that this would occur.

We have gone for a weekend together, out on dates almost two times a week and spend a lot of time trying to discuss it. We actually talk about it very well and I have asked for her help to make this work. She thinks a speration is a good idea, so I considered it. Any further insights to that?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> I said I was NOT attracted to her.


 Huh?

You said:


> we started to have feelings for each other. We have been honorable up until this point, but we can no longer hold back our feelings.
> 
> My wife asked me to give her a decision since it has been a few months about whether or not we will stay together or seperate and I just can't make up my mind. The OW and I agreed that we would not see each other while we both tried to work on our marriages, but I am not sure how focused I can be thinking about what happened and the feelings I have for the OW.


fighting, there's a psychological aspect to what you're describing. Aside from the pain and betrayal, you have added a layer of 'fog' on top of it because of OW. That fog is keeping you from seeing your wife clearly. You will have to go No Contact with OW and KNOW you will never see her again, for you to be able to psychologically even WANT to care for or love your wife again. What you got from OW is called PEA chemical; I forget what it stands for (some chemical name), but it's the same biological chemical we get when we're dating, for the lust and all. It physiologically wears out at around 2 to 3 years into a relationship - it's just what keeps our species procreating. But in the meantime, it's clouding your judgment. So do this: Do NOT make any decisions for at least 6 months. And do NOT contact OW for same 6 months. Let the PEA wear off and then reassess your marriage and your feelings. And in the meantime, consider following the other advice I just listed. See what happens.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

turnera said:


> We can say 'people like you' because there is a SCRIPT for waywards. Seriously. Look it up.


You guys are cracking me up today. :smthumbup:



fightingforit said:


> As for this EA, lets say that is the case, but the "OW" and I had this discussion Monday and we ended it immediately. *We realized what it was*


Ding ding ding.

Oh and Monday was just two days ago.

You are still in the fog, buddy.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

separation is not a good idea usually, it's usually code for "let me have my freedom (and date others) while I have the financial security of marriage and a fall back when I need to be married again"


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> We have gone for a weekend together, out on dates almost two times a week and spend a lot of time trying to discuss it. We actually talk about it very well and I have asked for her help to make this work. She thinks a speration is a good idea, so I considered it. Any further insights to that?


The only further thing you can do now regarding the other couple is to never see them again.


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## cj9947 (Jul 9, 2011)

fightingforit,
I am sorry that you and your wife are going through this pain. The people on this message board have a wealth of knowledge and experience with infidelity. I suggest you let down your guard; take a deep breath and LISTEN to what they are saying to you. My personal advice to you is;

1) Read "Not Just Friends" by Dr. Shirley Glass. The book will give you insight to both you and your wife's behavior.

2) Stop focusing on your lost "Love" feelings for your wife. There are bigger and more important things in life than the feeling of "Love". Hard to believe? Being a father to your children on a daily basis is way more important. If you get hung up on "Love" feelings and leave your wife are you ready for when she dates/remarries another man and brings them into your childrens' lives?

3) Look yourself in the mirror and think of the times your behavior was not up to your standards. Come on, think hard about it. Now forgive yourself. Next, if your wife is willing to change and save the marriage; forgive HER.

4) Keep drugs and alcohol away from your family.

5) Make no important decisions for 90 days. Take some time to let things sort out.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fighting, it sounds like you want to do the right thing, you just have to get a little better understanding of what's going on in your mind. There will BE no spark with your wife while you have not reconciled what she did and how she hurt you, as well as what you're feeling for another woman. Just accept that you can't just jump immediately into 'sparkland' right now. You just won't. You have to deal with what your wife did - and see if there was more to it than just an accident - and you have to deal with acknowledging that you're human and you got sucked in. Get past those two things, and THEN you can start to rekindle your relationship and, probably, have an even better one for having gotten all this newfound knowledge and loss of innocence. Consider yourselves blessed to have been given this opportunity to start the second phase of your marriage with wide-open eyes and a new appreciation for what you have.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

I will not accept that I had an affair. An affair is a choice to give someone something that belongs to another and after my wife cheated on me, I could not trust her with my feelings due to my pain. The therapists were of no help and even my wife dropped both of the therapists she had because all they wanted to do was blame me for not giving her enough attention. If you could have only seen the way I treated her, you would never agree to that. She believes that this may have happened, because this guy treated her like crap like her father did and that was her homeostasis. I compeltely understand that as a child of abuse, but it does not change the fact that I cannot develop feelings for her again.

And BTW, I'm not trying to be defensive, try to give my replies a tone of explanation and not defesiveness. The people giving frutiful advice and varying methods of practicality to on how to fix this are what I was looking for.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

One thing that might help to remember: If she's a SAHM and spent her entire 20s tied to a home and a house full of kids, she will have been likely experiencing INTENSE feelings of 'is that all there is?' and 'what did I give up for this.' Acknowledge that, and help her see that she can have a great life WITH you and still get to experience life to its fullest (just not single).

ETA that, just as SHE is likely having such feelings, I'd be willing to bet that, as driven as you describe yourself (perfect student, etc.), you yourself are harboring subconscious 'what else is out there' thoughts that may be guiding your emotions. As in, maybe you got a free pass to get out and experience the life you missed out on. If that's the case, you're going to need to deal with that just as she will.


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> AppleDucklings, I had this same discussion with my first therapist who said that spending anytime with someone else sharing your feelings and emotions, no matter the reasoning or the level of emotions is considered an emotional affair. So I asked my therapist if she would consider our meetings an emotional affair? She asked said that since I pay her its different. So if I paid this other woman it would have been fine. And I only said OW because that seems to be how everyone refers to someone other than your wife.


Come on now, you know the difference.


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## Jellybeans (Mar 8, 2011)

sexuallyfustrated said:


> Come on now, you know the difference.


No, he doesn't:



fightingforit said:


> I will not accept that I had an affair.


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> SoccerFan73, best piece of information yet. Those are the points of clarity that I was looking for.
> 
> As for this EA, lets say that is the case, but the "OW" and I had this discussion Monday and we ended it immediately. We realized what it was and stopped instantly. She was not a fall back plan as I had never needed a fall back plan. My plan the entire time was that I would be back with my wife. I just cannot find the love.....Soccerfan73 hit the nail on the head. Anyone have any advice as to how to address that?



Soccerfan is corrcet and only you can address this. But Fightingfor it after a few month you really think that is the end all after 10yrs. You really feel you gave it enough time. It is a process and a long one at that. The relationship has changed and your feelings along with it and rightly so. The trust factor is gone. But out of what was you can add something great but you must try (both of you ) and it will take time. Time to find that spark or time to really realize with it is over. But a few months does not seem like enough.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

It all comes down to the fact that I don't want to give her the ability to hurt me again. As a friend, she can't hurt me, but as a lover, she could destroy me again. I am too scared to trust her with that after what she did and honestly I wouldn't see this "OW" again even if I was to divource because it is too painful of a reminder.

And I have never done anything with regards to my behaivor that even came close to violating my vows....my wife was too special to me for something like that to get in the way.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

What exactly did she do? In YOUR mind?


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Thank you to those of you being helpful. Others I shall ignore for their comments are a bearing on their past pains and not in hopes of helping someone else.

No, she is not a SAHM. And yes sexuallyfustrated, I am at times, when I am really hurting, wondering if there is someone out there that would not hurt me like this again. but that never translated to this other woman and when I thought it might start to, I ended it.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Turnera, Great freaking question?! I would love to explore that answer. I feel like she was taken advantage of in her state, but the lies and the texts that occured while she was sober were still so very painful. Why? What do you think she did to me? That is a sincere questions, I really want to see your insight.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> It all comes down to the fact that I don't want to give her the ability to hurt me again. As a friend, she can't hurt me, but as a lover, she could destroy me again. I am too scared to trust her with that after what she did and honestly I wouldn't see this "OW" again even if I was to divource because it is too painful of a reminder.


this is, of course, a completely understandable response
It's very hard to allow trust back into the marriage and we're not saying that you will get it back instantly, if both you and your wife are willing and put in a big effort together, trust can be achieved again and a healthy and great marriage can be the end result, and yes it can take a long time



fightingforit said:


> And I have never done anything with regards to my behaivor that even came close to violating my vows....my wife was too special to me for something like that to get in the way.


not physically yes, but you have developed feelings for another person and those feelings have essentially prevented any chance of having a reconciliation with your wife. You don't wish to see it as an affiar, then fine, but you most certainly cannot deny that whatever it was that you had with this woman has essentially all but killed whatever chance you and your wife - IOW instead of relying on an appropriate mode of support you have now put yourself in a situation that makes it very hard to proceed reconciliation in earnest


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## AppleDucklings (Mar 27, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> Thank you to those of you being helpful. Others I shall ignore for their comments are a bearing on their past pains and not in hopes of helping someone else.
> 
> No, she is not a SAHM. And yes sexuallyfustrated, I am at times, when I am really hurting, wondering if there is someone out there that would not hurt me like this again. but that never translated to this other woman and when I thought it might start to, I ended it.


so, you have no contact at all with this woman now? No texting each other, no emailing each other, no facebooking, no phone calls, you have absolutely no contact at all? None at all?


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

It's hard to deal with and intruth some ppl hear can be rather harsh but listen. With all intents and purpose you will find the help that you are looking for at least the direction in which you go.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Honestly, I feel that she may have had feelings of "whats on the other side" since we have dated since High School and when she was drunk, her defenses let that oppurtunity slip through the barriers. I have oppurtunities like this when I was drunk, but I never slipped an inch......she did.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> Thank you to those of you being helpful. Others I shall ignore for their comments are a bearing on their past pains and not in hopes of helping someone else.


you can't be helped if you're not willing to recognize that your relationship with the OW (even though it started with the best intentions as you say) is something that also needs to be addressed in order for you to progress


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> Honestly, I feel that she may have had feelings of "whats on the other side" since we have dated since High School and when she was drunk, her defenses let that oppurtunity slip through the barriers. I have oppurtunities like this when I was drunk, but I never slipped an inch......she did.



and youre right to think that, she wasn't raped after all, she was a willing participant and intentionally tried cover it up or gave you trickle truth. She needs to own up to it, she needs to stop using the alcohol as a crutch for her weakness. Not to mention the fact that she carried on the cover up while she was stone cold sober.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

AppleDucklings said:


> so, you have no contact at all with this woman now? No texting each other, no emailing each other, no facebooking, no phone calls, you have absolutely no contact at all? None at all?


No contact whatsoever and I asked her not to contact me....We even unfriended each other on facebook.



Almostrecovered said:


> this is, of course, a completely understandable response
> It's very hard to allow trust back into the marriage and we're not saying that you will get it back instantly, if both you and your wife are willing and put in a big effort together, trust can be achieved again and a healthy and great marriage can be the end result, and yes it can take a long time
> 
> 
> ...


So, maybe I am rushing this too much. Yes, I have developed feelings, but it was never a choice, but a naive accident. I made appropriate changes as soon as I saw what effect this may have. Yes, it will take time to get rid of those feelings, but she was my safety net when I was looking at high bridges as a positive approach to my pain.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Almostrecovered.....I have never heard that term before, "Trickle Truth" but it is squarely placed in my dictionary. Great phrase!


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

How do you recover from a pain like that and trust someone again? The fear that it will happen again will haunt my thoughts forever, will they not?


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> Turnera, Great freaking question?! I would love to explore that answer. I feel like she was taken advantage of in her state, but the lies and the texts that occured while she was sober were still so very painful. Why? What do you think she did to me? That is a sincere questions, I really want to see your insight.


What happend was enough. Now you say you believe she was taking advantage of so I take it that part is forgivin. It sounds like you are having a problem with what she chose to do which was the texting and calls and covering it up and that is a huge deal. So yes that is what she has done and it was enough. I have a question though. Is she remorseful? Is she truthly trying to do better and be better for all of you? Is so give it time. I am NOT saying to just allow her in your heart so quick and easy but if you still have love for her I think you can fall back in love with her Fighting. When I still felt that way about my husband even though I was hurt beyond anything I had ever felt I still loved him and I slowly (and BOY do I mean slowly) started to fall again but my husband was not truthly remorsful and didn't put in the work your wife has and now I and trying not to hate because that I don't think I can come back from. You have time, give it time.


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> ...she is never drinking again because she had never blacked out like that and lost control.


This is the THIRD TIME I'm responding to this BS on 2 different forums in 2 days. You're wife DID NOT BLACK OUT!!! The only time I have ever heard of someone blacking out with drink is to avoid having to explain something unfortunate. If she wants to fix this, she needs to admit to this lie and tell you what REALLY happened. 

The crap people believe...


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> you can't be helped if you're not willing to recognize that your relationship with the OW (even though it started with the best intentions as you say) is something that also needs to be addressed in order for you to progress


Oh, I completely agree that it needs to be addressed at this point and that is why I shared all details with my wife and told her that it was never my intent to gain feelings for her. It just felt like a dear freidnship and literally in one day, that all seemed to change when I wanted to see her, but I wasn't actually in need of her advice or understanding. We are completley in agreement on that matter. I just don't like to call it an affair because I believe that places a level of forethought on my behalf that was never there.......but as all of you probably know.......the meanings of words seem to become all too important when you start having trouble like this......definitions seem so very important nowadays when we fight about, "What did you mean when you said......"


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

MrK said:


> This is the THIRD TIME I'm responding to this BS on 2 different forums in 2 days. You're wife DID NOT BLACK OUT!!! The only time I have ever heard of someone blacking out with drink is to avoid having to explain something unfortunate. If she wants to fix this, she needs to admit to this lie and tell you what REALLY happened.
> 
> The crap people believe...


You are the second person in this entire situation that agreed with me on that fact. The first was the "OW".....I like putting that in quotes as it probably pisses some people off  just jking


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> No contact whatsoever and I asked her not to contact me....We even unfriended each other on facebook.
> 
> 
> 
> So, maybe I am rushing this too much. Yes, I have developed feelings, but it was never a choice, but a naive accident. I made appropriate changes as soon as I saw what effect this may have. Yes, it will take time to get rid of those feelings, but she was my safety net when I was looking at high bridges as a positive approach to my pain.


and she is also a fantasy and not real (in terms of a real relationship)
I know she seemed helpful in a trying time
I know she is someone who was also hurt and looking for solace thus you have bonded in a such a trying time

however, you never went thru the trenches of warfare together like you have with your wife- building a relationship together, having children, buying a house, hearing each other fart and knowing what each other look like in the morning and knowing what faults each other have
There is a difference between love that has grown over years of a loving relationship and the "luv" of a brand new and exciting relationship 


really think back to how much you did love your wife and I think in many respects you'll see it's still there but just tainted by the fact she hurt you so much. (after all it wouldnt have hurt if you didnt love her)
IF your wife can truly own up to what she has done and proactively take measures to atone for it then you will eventually come to see the love that you had really never left but hid in fear of being rejected again


It takes about 3-6 months to stop feeling that constant stress buzz and overwhelming feelings of betrayal
probably about a year to feel like you're on solid ground again
and overall, It takes 2-5 years to truly heal from infidelity

it's also not a linear process, you will feel progress for a few days and then have a really bad day but if things are done correctly, healing will eventually be attained


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

sexuallyfustrated said:


> What happend was enough. Now you say you believe she was taking advantage of so I take it that part is forgivin. It sounds like you are having a problem with what she chose to do which was the texting and calls and covering it up and that is a huge deal. So yes that is what she has done and it was enough. I have a question though. Is she remorseful? Is she truthly trying to do better and be better for all of you? Is so give it time. I am NOT saying to just allow her in your heart so quick and easy but if you still have love for her I think you can fall back in love with her Fighting. When I still felt that way about my husband even though I was hurt beyond anything I had ever felt I still loved him and I slowly (and BOY do I mean slowly) started to fall again but my husband was not truthly remorsful and didn't put in the work your wife has and now I and trying not to hate because that I don't think I can come back from. You have time, give it time.


I know she is remorseful and she is working so damn hard to fix this. I give her credit for that, I thank her everyday for that and I feel horrible that I can't fix my side so easily, but she not only burned a bridge, she burned down the whole darn city......I don't know how to rebuild bridges or cities......and that scares me. What if it never comes back?


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> and she is also a fantasy and not real (in terms of a real relationship)
> I know she seemed helpful in a trying time
> I know she is someone who was also hurt and looking for solace thus you have bonded in a such a trying time
> 
> ...


That timeline scares the BLOODY PISS out of me! I'm scared I can't hold on that long......


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> How do you recover from a pain like that and trust someone again? The fear that it will happen again will haunt my thoughts forever, will they not?


well yes but they subside

do you fear getting in a car because you could have some numbnut hit you and kill you? (and you probably do have the fear but it's in the back of your head )

it takes time and its takes a partner willing to show contrition and remorse and be completely transparent


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## MrK (Sep 2, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> You are the second person in this entire situation that agreed with me on that fact. The first was the "OW



OMG!! I don't know if my head is going to explode in frustration or if I'm going to die laughing: did HE black out too?


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

MrK said:


> OMG!! I don't know if my head is going to explode in frustration or if I'm going to die laughing: did HE black out too?


Good question. I get Whiskey D*#@, but he gets Whiskey-Viagra [email protected]#*.........Good for him for blacking out, but having the fortitude to continue on his mission. He is a good soldier!


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

and when my wife told me the truth, but got defensive when I didn't forgive her immediately.....she told me his [email protected]#* was bigger than mine and she liked it.......AWESOME! That is every guys dream to hear those words.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> That timeline scares the BLOODY PISS out of me! I'm scared I can't hold on that long......




you'd surprise yourself then

it's a day at a time thing, some days will be good some will be bad and eventually the good days will outnumber the bad days and even then the bad days aren't so bad until one day you find that you are in a great place


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> Turnera, Great freaking question?! I would love to explore that answer. I feel like she was taken advantage of in her state, but the lies and the texts that occured while she was sober were still so very painful. Why? What do you think she did to me? That is a sincere questions, I really want to see your insight.


I have no idea, based on the little info given here. What's really important is what YOU think because you are basing your decisions, your level of hurt, on what you THINK she 'did to you.'

Aren't you two talking about it?


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> you'd surprise yourself then
> 
> it's a day at a time thing, some days will be good some will be bad and eventually the good days will outnumber the bad days and even then the bad days aren't so bad until one day you find that you are in a great place


Can't I just take a pill or something?! Take me out of the Matrix please.......


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> Yes, I have developed feelings, but it was never a choice, but a naive accident.


Maybe that's what happened to your wife, too.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

turnera said:


> I have no idea, based on the little info given here. What's really important is what YOU think because you are basing your decisions, your level of hurt, on what you THINK she 'did to you.'
> 
> Aren't you two talking about it?


Yeah, we seem to go in circles. The newest therapist I have been working with allows me to "feel" things and be pessimistic if I want to be and doesn't fight me, but leads me places. She helped me understand that she has hurt me like EVERYONE who has ever said they loved me has hurt me. I mean everyone! It's a sad story, let's not go there.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> How do you recover from a pain like that and trust someone again? The fear that it will happen again will haunt my thoughts forever, will they not?


 What SHOULD have been haunting your thoughts for the last 10 years is that it COULD happen, PERIOD, so you could take steps to ensure she stayed in love with you. You take your marriage for granted at your own risk. Nearly every single betrayed husband I've met on line in all the time I've been doing this has been completely blindsided...'I was completely happy, I assumed she was too...'


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

turnera said:


> Maybe that's what happened to your wife, too.


No, she is just a dirty ****.......joking.....it felt good to say!

I feel she definately cracked the door just a little and she knew who was knocking. I didn't even hear a knock at the door before it was just kicked in.......but I fought back.....she waited one full minute.....that is just as important to me as the "shot heard round the world"


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## Grayson (Oct 28, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> I will not accept that I had an affair.


Then, unfortunately, you will be stuck spinning your wheels until you reach that point of acceptance.



> An affair is a choice to give someone something that belongs to another and after my wife cheated on me, I could not trust her with my feelings due to my pain.


And you *chose* to give that closeness to someone else, instead of the one person you were trying to re-establish that closeness with. As a betrayed spouse, myself, I can understand the impulse to avoid the person who hurt you, but if you want to rebuild, it's imperative that you communicate everything that you're thinking and feeling to them.

To your credit, you say that, upon realizing how far you allowed things to proceed with the OW, you put an end to it. But, from your statements, it appears those feelings are still there. As long as they are, you'll be stuck. And, until you acknowledge that you got yourself into an EA (even if you stumbled into it, you enabled it and made the choices that made it an EA), you won't be able to put those feelings to rest.



> The therapists were of no help and even my wife dropped both of the therapists she had because all they wanted to do was blame me for not giving her enough attention. If you could have only seen the way I treated her, you would never agree to that. She believes that this may have happened, because this guy treated her like crap like her father did and that was her homeostasis. I compeltely understand that as a child of abuse, but it does not change the fact that I cannot develop feelings for her again.


And here you've already set yourself up for failure, by saying you can never develop feelings for your wife again.



> And BTW, I'm not trying to be defensive, try to give my replies a tone of explanation and not defesiveness. The people giving frutiful advice and varying methods of practicality to on how to fix this are what I was looking for.


It may no seem like it, but all of these things go hand in hand. The emotional state that you allowed yourself to get to with the OW an your ability to acknowledge it and let it go will play a major part in your ability to heal with your wife. That are not disconnected. Just as a heart patient must work to remedy any behaviors that contributed to their condition, so must you do similar in this matter of the (emotional) heart.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

turnera said:


> What SHOULD have been haunting your thoughts for the last 10 years is that it COULD happen, PERIOD, so you could take steps to ensure she stayed in love with you. You take your marriage for granted at your own risk. Nearly every single betrayed husband I've met on line in all the time I've been doing this has been completely blindsided...'I was completely happy, I assumed she was too...'


No, she was given everything she wanted and was taken care of like no one had ever taken care of her. If anything, I am to blame for making her so dependant on me to make her happy and she wanted to actually be a little unhappy. I should have seen it coming when she asked me to "make her struggle" one night out of the blue and I refused to treat her like a piece of crap. She just wanted to go back to her feelings of being used by someone else like she had as a child and as a teenager


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

MrK said:


> This is the THIRD TIME I'm responding to this BS on 2 different forums in 2 days. You're wife DID NOT BLACK OUT!!! The only time I have ever heard of someone blacking out with drink is to avoid having to explain something unfortunate. If she wants to fix this, she needs to admit to this lie and tell you what REALLY happened.
> 
> The crap people believe...


 I've actually blacked out a few times (I have to admit), and honestly not remembered what happened the night before. Dead serious. And too embarrrassed to ask.


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## Soccerfan73 (Jul 30, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> and when my wife told me the truth, but got defensive when I didn't forgive her immediately.....*she told me his [email protected]#* was bigger than mine and she liked it.......AWESOME! That is every guys dream to hear those words*.


Wow. She sure was charming in that little break down of the action!


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## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

This thread has got to own some kind of speed record for accumulating post... Fighting, it may be just as simple as this. If you really love your wife and you know that but don't feel it currently you may have to make an intellectual decision to commit to your marriage and let your emotions catch up. Based on what I've read it sounds like you're currently something of an emotional basket case - a poor state in which to make any decisions. So if you know you love your wife trust your brain for the time being. Recommit to your marriage, give it time, work on your marriage with your wife, and see if your heart comes along. You can always make the decision to split/separate/divorce, but time spent sitting on the fence is only driving a wedge further between you and making that much more trouble to work through if you reconcile.


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## PBear (Nov 16, 2010)

I'd say that many emotional affairs start off the way you describe. In your favor, you caught things early, and cut off contact. Unfortunately, emotions don't respond well to logic like cutting off contact, and it will take time for your thoughts to become your own again.

What does your therapist say about separating vs. trying to stay together? Why does your wife say she wants a separation?

C


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

well two thing have to happen here before true reconciliation can occur-

1) your wife has to own up to her transgression-
a- never contact this couple again (and the friend)
b- be completely transparent (allow you access to everything, phones, passwords, facebook, etc etc etc)
c- be truly remorseful and answer any questions you have repeatedly and truthfully

2) you need to do the same thing

I know you don't think you had an EA (emotional affair) and you are trying to justify it as an appropriate response to the pain she inflicted on you
however, to me that excuse is just as much hogwash as her blackout
it happened, it doesn't matter what intentions there were behind it in many respects because it still happened
you say that you stopped it because you didn't wish to let it go too far- well guess what? your wife is saying the same thing- she stopped having sex with two men because it went too far

bottom line is that you both should haven't have never allowed yourself to be in those situations in the first place

she had a PA, you had a EA both are hurtful, both destroy marriages

now stop trying to hurt each other and give each other the hard work you need


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> ......I don't know how to rebuild bridges or cities......and that scares me. What if it never comes back?


Has it occurred to you that this 'inability' of yours may have something to do with your childhood? You describe yourself in such sterile, prideful terms, as though what you accomplished in life is more important than who you are. That's often a way to compensate for something lacking while growing up, that you sought to overcome by being perfect. But it's also often a way to hinder your ability to feel and think and grow like a regular person...that darned pesky wall in your way...


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> That timeline scares the BLOODY PISS out of me! I'm scared I can't hold on that long......


 Why not? Just because you're not 'feeling the love' this minute? What kind of vows did you make when you got married? I assume something along the lines of through thick and thin, good and bad...

Did you not mean it?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> and when my wife told me the truth, but got defensive when I didn't forgive her immediately.....she told me his [email protected]#* was bigger than mine and she liked it.......AWESOME! That is every guys dream to hear those words.


 Now, this is something you might have shared at the beginning, don't you think? What actually DID happen? Are they still in contact? Do you have the true timeline? Will she take a polygraph?


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

sigma1299 said:


> This thread has got to own some kind of speed record for accumulating post... Fighting, it may be just as simple as this. If you really love your wife and you know that but don't feel it currently you may have to make an intellectual decision to commit to your marriage and let your emotions catch up. Based on what I've read it sounds like you're currently something of an emotional basket case - a poor state in which to make any decisions. So if you know you love your wife trust your brain for the time being. Recommit to your marriage, give it time, work on your marriage with your wife, and see if your heart comes along. You can always make the decision to split/separate/divorce, but time spent sitting on the fence is only driving a wedge further between you and making that much more trouble to work through if you reconcile.


Sigma, I think I could end the conversation right now, because I think you summed it all up in one post. Now, to everyone else's credit, they had to lead you there in understanding my situation with their inquistive questions, but you got the first bullseye.

I hate to make it an intellectual choice!!!!!! I want to be in love again. It was my happy place and someone took a big f-ing dookie on it 

The only question I have, how to take that first step and keep walking......I don't want to fail, as I think this can work, but I don't know if I have the energy after spending 13 years putting everything into our relationship. Another 13 years could go by and then it happens again. Then, I'm a 43 yo single-divourced-shell of a person with little time left and nothing but pain in my past.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

PBear said:


> I'd say that many emotional affairs start off the way you describe. In your favor, you caught things early, and cut off contact. Unfortunately, emotions don't respond well to logic like cutting off contact, and it will take time for your thoughts to become your own again.
> 
> What does your therapist say about separating vs. trying to stay together? Why does your wife say she wants a separation?
> 
> C


We are just shooting in the dark that it will help shock me back. The therapists say its our decision. Great! Thats what I pay $500 an hour for!!!


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> EVERYONE who has ever said they loved me has hurt me. I mean everyone! It's a sad story, let's not go there.


Yes, let's.

And now, we start to get to the real truth - this isn't about you loving your wife. This is about you and your inability to deal with stress and hurt and still carry on. What are you doing to FIX that?


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

turnera said:


> Has it occurred to you that this 'inability' of yours may have something to do with your childhood? You describe yourself in such sterile, prideful terms, as though what you accomplished in life is more important than who you are. That's often a way to compensate for something lacking while growing up, that you sought to overcome by being perfect. But it's also often a way to hinder your ability to feel and think and grow like a regular person...that darned pesky wall in your way...


You hit the nail on the head too.....You get the second medal for the day! I told my wife I wouldn't make her pay for my childhood, but it is so darn hard not to bring those feelings into this.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

turnera said:


> Why not? Just because you're not 'feeling the love' this minute? What kind of vows did you make when you got married? I assume something along the lines of through thick and thin, good and bad...
> 
> Did you not mean it?


I really did, but it hurts too much at this point.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

turnera said:


> Yes, let's.
> 
> And now, we start to get to the real truth - this isn't about you loving your wife. This is about you and your inability to deal with stress and hurt and still carry on. What are you doing to FIX that?


I'm seeing a therapist to, but between her therapist, mine and our couples therapist......the bank account will not last too long.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

turnera said:


> Now, this is something you might have shared at the beginning, don't you think? What actually DID happen? Are they still in contact? Do you have the true timeline? Will she take a polygraph?


Didn't want to bring that out, but got kinda worked up there. I would love for her to take a polygraph, but she would fail it and I would lose my mind. At least I can swallow her "truth" now.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Soccerfan73 said:


> Wow. She sure was charming in that little break down of the action!


:iagree:


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## Lily_B (Jul 28, 2011)

We can all sit here and argue and tell him all sorts of things. 

It really comes down to this:

1. Do you want to make it work with your wife?
2. Are you BOTH committed to R?
3. Do not think about 13 yrs in the future, that will kill you. Think about the NOW....

Look deep into your heart and ask yourself this...Is your family worth another shot? 

Seriously, 1 year of complete transparency, and working things through with your wife, while keeping your family unit close, I think, will answer all the questions you have + really, whats 1 year's time!

Essentially you BOTH messed up. You BOTH need to work together !

Good Luck!
Lily


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> How do you recover from a pain like that and trust someone again? The fear that it will happen again will haunt my thoughts forever, will they not?


Depends on you. For me it would just because I know me. I don't trust often but I give respect always. To me it is due everyone. And when I lose respect for a person or they disrespect me I try to stay respectful yet back away. I respect myself and that person enough to do so. Because for me trust is earned I don't jump into it with boht fee, it takes time and lots of it with me. But when you have it you have it. However when you lose it it is hard as hell to get back if ever. I have known ppl that don't have a problem with it. I see ppl here who are more than willing to trust again because the love their mate and they want to grow old with them. Do they think that it may happen again and they may get hurt of course but for some it is worth trying. It is worth the one they want to grown old with. I admire that. And it gives me hope. It all depends on you and what you want. Or what you can deal with. Again don't rush anything. Take your time. You have nothing but time.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> I really did, but it hurts too much at this point.


 Your marriage can survive hurt. It's an active choice.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

turnera said:


> Your marriage can survive hurt. It's an active choice.


You are right! We can all take steps toward our destination.......the problem is choosing to do so.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Well, it's pretty obvious she had a real affair, then. The question is, if she is truly remorseful, if she's seen the grass on the other side and realizes what she was about to lose and wants to save it, then your battle is half over. The other half is you. Can you accept that she willfully cheated on you? Some can, some can't. It's not our place to tell you where you fit on that spectrum. But, if you decide you can, then we can offer a lot of advice to move forward. 

And the first bit of advice, either way, is to NOT make any decisions for at least the next 3 months.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

turnera said:


> Well, it's pretty obvious she had a real affair, then. The question is, if she is truly remorseful, if she's seen the grass on the other side and realizes what she was about to lose and wants to save it, then your battle is half over. The other half is you. Can you accept that she willfully cheated on you? Some can, some can't. It's not our place to tell you where you fit on that spectrum. But, if you decide you can, then we can offer a lot of advice to move forward.
> 
> And the first bit of advice, either way, is to NOT make any decisions for at least the next 3 months.


Ok, well it has been 2 months and she is starting to ask me what my decision is......"Will you work on this or are we calling it quits?" Is that fair of her? If not, should I tell her to back off?


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> You are right! We can all take steps toward our destination.......the problem is choosing to do so.


 Well, if I had fathered five children who depended on me to provide them a stable home to grow up in, it wouldn't even be an issue for me. THEY COME FIRST. You brought them here, they are your responsibility, personal 'happiness' be damned.

Once you have kids, you don't get to be selfish any more.

Once they're out and in college, THEN determine if you want a new life without your wife. 

That's my own personal advice.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> Ok, well it has been 2 months and she is starting to ask me what my decision is......"Will you work on this or are we calling it quits?" Is that fair of her? If not, should I tell her to back off?


Yes. She's in no position to ask anything of you right now.


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

MrK said:


> This is the THIRD TIME I'm responding to this BS on 2 different forums in 2 days. You're wife DID NOT BLACK OUT!!! The only time I have ever heard of someone blacking out with drink is to avoid having to explain something unfortunate. If she wants to fix this, she needs to admit to this lie and tell you what REALLY happened.
> 
> The crap people believe...


Don't know if she did or not but it is possiable. When I was in my early 20's and new to drinking I blacked out alot. I would wake up home and not remember driving or in bed naked with my boyfriend(now husband and not remember doing anything. But when I was out alone I never drink like that. If I did I was with him or family. Black outs do happen.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Well, those willing to help me got me farther/further in 2 hours than all my therapists combined did in three months.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> Well, those willing to help me got me farther/further in 2 hours than all my therapists combined did in three months.


That's because we're not getting paid by you! :rofl:


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> I know she is remorseful and she is working so damn hard to fix this. I give her credit for that, I thank her everyday for that and I feel horrible that I can't fix my side so easily, but she not only burned a bridge, she burned down the whole darn city......I don't know how to rebuild bridges or cities......and that scares me. What if it never comes back?


 Then it doesn't but you have not givin it enough time. You said to Almost that the time line scars you. Well as you are well aware time goes by quite fast. What do you have to lose byt sticking it out and finding out for yourself and that of your children. Think of how painful and scary it would be if you found out later what we are all saying. That what you are feeling for this woman is nothing more mutal pain and a common bond. And you want your family back and they have moved on or you have to much pride to try and get them back and you have to start over. You may even find out that the OM's wife finds she truly wants her husband and their family.


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## Grayson (Oct 28, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> Well, those willing to help me got me farther/further in 2 hours than all my therapists combined did in three months.


I think you're making a distinction that doesn't exist. We're all willing to help...it's just that not everything said will he something that you want to hear. Which is a perfectly human reaction. It's a reaction that sometimes needs to be overcome, but it's to be expected, sometimes.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

turnera said:


> Yes. She's in no position to ask anything of you right now.


:iagree::iagree: She has no right. Her job is to do her part.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

turnera said:


> That's because we're not getting paid by you! :rofl:


One therapist I didn't like, and I was really upset at that point, and I told her that she was no better than a prostitute, paid to make me feel better. I do regret that and I left a message to that affect, but it felt good to say, because she was treating me like a moron and I was tired of being the nice guy.

Let's look at some good points.

1. I got two tattoos that i always wanted and my wife absolutely loves them when she didn't think she would. That might be the guilt talking.
2. I loved to sleep in my bed alone sometimes cuz I like to sprawl out.....well, I have had a few chances the last few months
3. I watched my first porn movie when I was really down, cuz I had always wanted to know what everyone liked about them, and I realized it was kinda boring and made me feel even more lonely!
4. I started MMA training and it is a whole lot of fun.

Actually, kinda glad she cheated on me


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

Grayson said:


> I think you're making a distinction that doesn't exist. We're all willing to help...it's just that not everything said will he something that you want to hear. Which is a perfectly human reaction. It's a reaction that sometimes needs to be overcome, but it's to be expected, sometimes.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


:iagree: Most of the ppl hear shot from the hip. Straight foward and no holds bar, I love it. But thats the kind of woman I am. Some are a little more gentle but it is all designed to help.


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## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> Actually, kinda glad she cheated on me


Dude - you're all over place emotionally. Take a deep breath - take no actions for a little while and try to get closer to center. Remember - you know you love your wife but your emotions are like scrambled eggs right now - put your faith in what you know - not what you feel right now.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

My wife just texted me and said she is not sure the seperation is a good idea after she is the one that said she thought it was a good idea. She treats her thoughts like she treats her men......can't decide which is best. The good one with the small wang or the jerk with the big wang. Woman are just as bad as guys!


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> Well, those willing to help me got me farther/further in 2 hours than all my therapists combined did in three months.



Wait til you get my bill
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

sigma1299 said:


> Dude - you're all over place emotionally. Take a deep breath - take no actions for a little while and try to get closer to center. Remember - you know you love your wife but your emotions are like scrambled eggs right now - put your faith in what you know - not what you feel right now.


That was sarcasm, but you are right that I'm all over the place. Every moment its like Jeckle (sp?) and Hyde.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Grayson said:


> I think you're making a distinction that doesn't exist. We're all willing to help...it's just that not everything said will he something that you want to hear. Which is a perfectly human reaction. It's a reaction that sometimes needs to be overcome, but it's to be expected, sometimes.
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


 Very good point, fighting. Just because you don't like what someone says to you doesn't mean it isn't helpful - if you allow it to be. It's usually the people whose messages are the most painful to hear that have the most important things to say. Because they're touching on your sore spots. And they're sore spots for a reason. Best to listen to yourself and your reactions, and ask yourself WHY they got to you so much. 

And beside, just dismissing a poster because he didn't say what you wanted to hear...isn't that the exact problem you said you had with aforementioned therapist? That she wasn't helping you? When you can lower your defenses and listen to that voice in your head, you'll be ready to grow and learn and move forward. Until then, you're just posturing.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fightingforit said:


> My wife just texted me and said she is not sure the seperation is a good idea after she is the one that said she thought it was a good idea. She treats her thoughts like she treats her men......can't decide which is best. The good one with the small wang or the jerk with the big wang. Woman are just as bad as guys!


Wait, what?

You're separated?

Why?!


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> and when my wife told me the truth, but got defensive when I didn't forgive her immediately.....she told me his [email protected]#* was bigger than mine and she liked it.......AWESOME! That is every guys dream to hear those words.


WOW how on earth did I miss this part. I thought she said she just fooled around with him. I took that as kissing and touching. Missed that one.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

and I have always dealt with pain with laughter and sometimes it works and sometimes it just makes me cry......but then I say Nay Nay and get back on my horse  Did anyone get that reference or did I lose everybody?


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

turnera said:


> Wait, what?
> 
> You're separated?
> 
> Why?!


No they were talking about it.


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## sigma1299 (May 26, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> That was sarcasm, but you are right that I'm all over the place. Every moment its like Jeckle (sp?) and Hyde.


There's an element of truth behind every line of sarcasm - that's what makes it funny...


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> and I have always dealt with pain with laughter and sometimes it works and sometimes it just makes me cry......but then I say Nay Nay and get back on my horse  Did anyone get that reference or did I lose everybody?


 got it


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

turnera said:


> Very good point, fighting. Just because you don't like what someone says to you doesn't mean it isn't helpful - if you allow it to be. It's usually the people whose messages are the most painful to hear that have the most important things to say. Because they're touching on your sore spots. And they're sore spots for a reason. Best to listen to yourself and your reactions, and ask yourself WHY they got to you so much.
> 
> And beside, just dismissing a poster because he didn't say what you wanted to hear...isn't that the exact problem you said you had with aforementioned therapist? That she wasn't helping you? When you can lower your defenses and listen to that voice in your head, you'll be ready to grow and learn and move forward. Until then, you're just posturing.


I'm posturting to keep myself up, not to be difficult. It was just that comment about maybe I was gay.......that was not helpful, just trying to make fun.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

turnera said:


> Wait, what?
> 
> You're separated?
> 
> Why?!


This morning she said she wanted to seperate in hopes of shocking me back to loving her. Now she is questioning that.....Fun stuff!


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> My wife just texted me and said she is not sure the seperation is a good idea after she is the one that said she thought it was a good idea. She treats her thoughts like she treats her men......can't decide which is best. The good one with the small wang or the jerk with the big wang. Woman are just as bad as guys!



Stop generalizing. Not all women. With what I am going through I could say the same and worse but with all the men that are here just as I that are going through the same or much worse I know it is not true.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

sexuallyfustrated said:


> WOW how on earth did I miss this part. I thought she said she just fooled around with him. I took that as kissing and touching. Missed that one.


No, they got into it alright. She just stopped him after he had been "working it" for a minute and she didn't know what was going on? The whole blackout thing.....remember.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

sexuallyfustrated said:


> got it


Woohoo......I'm not alone on this earth in humor AND love


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> No, they got into it alright. She just stopped him after he had been "working it" for a minute and she didn't know what was going on? The whole blackout thing.....remember.


I hope you got STD testing
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

sexuallyfustrated said:


> Stop generalizing. Not all women. With what I am going through I could say the same and worse but with all the men that are here just as I that are going through the same or much worse I know it is not true.


Oh, I know. No disrespect meant......I just am tired of hearing from the therapists and other people that hear this situation tell me that I was probably a dog first and that she just followed suit. It always seems to be the guys fault when his wife lets another guy screw her.......Yup, I'm the one that opened those gates?!


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Almostrecovered said:


> I hope you got STD testing
> _Posted via Mobile Device_


No


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> No


Both of you get tested ASAP
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> No, they got into it alright. She just stopped him after he had been "working it" for a minute and she didn't know what was going on? The whole blackout thing.....remember.


Yeah thats right the Black out. Gotta admit though as I said I have black out when I was in my 20's (i'm 34) but have never done anything like that. I was told by my cousin when I was with them and drank like that guys would try to appoarch me and I would just go off and say that just because they thought I was drunk (lol and I was ) didn't mean I would screw them . I always felt that you didn't do anything with alcohol that you wouldn't do sober. At least for me.


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## Soccerfan73 (Jul 30, 2011)

I like your style. You have a sense of humor about the insanity, even though it all truly sucks.

That's the only thing that kept me sane through my "adventure" with my now ex-wife.

Pure word of advice even though you didn't ask me. You might be best just chilling out for a month or two with her and just living the day to day. No promises or forgiveness to issue. Just to see if you can re-ignite your feelings for her. As long as she is also working towards making things right. If you do want to make a big change in regards to no longer being with her, it would be better to do it from a place of less raw emotion. It's just really difficult to know what to do when you are all over the place emotionally. Trust me, I've been there. 

Whatever you decide, do what's best for you.


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> Woohoo......I'm not alone on this earth in humor AND love


Nah I think a bit differently myself.


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## Lily_B (Jul 28, 2011)

Soccerfan73 said:


> I like your style. You have a sense of humor about the insanity, even though it all truly sucks.
> 
> That's the only thing that kept me sane through my "adventure" with my now ex-wife.
> 
> ...


Soccerfan...Thank you!!! That is great advice...I too am in limbo as well and am doing the day to day, and just trying to think things thru. It does start clearing up once your not on that scary roller coaster of emotion.

We all need to remember to do whats best for oneself!
Great post SF

Lily


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> Oh, I know. No disrespect meant......I just am tired of hearing from the therapists and other people that hear this situation tell me that I was probably a dog first and that she just followed suit. It always seems to be the guys fault when his wife lets another guy screw her.......Yup, I'm the one that opened those gates?!


Understood. I got that from some ppl mainly men( my husband refuses MC and it has been 5yrs with this bull but my story is a bit different). Most of them say "Well what did you do wrong". or "You must not having been giving him what he needed in bed". I'm like WOOOOOOW It's my fault. And my husband has said and knows it from his heart it was not me. I did things to prevent this because I always knew women where lerking but he allowed someone else in. Someone always lays the blame.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

Soccerfan73 said:


> I like your style. You have a sense of humor about the insanity, even though it all truly sucks.
> 
> That's the only thing that kept me sane through my "adventure" with my now ex-wife.
> 
> ...


Ok, so I take all the pressure off, don't seperate and just relax for a bit? The other part, doing whats best for me, when I think about my kids it becomes impossible to do whats best for me. That is what is so stifling


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

sexuallyfustrated said:


> Understood. I got that from some ppl mainly men( my husband refuses MC and it has been 5yrs with this bull but my story is a bit different). Most of them as "Well what did you do wrong". or "You must not having being giving him what he needed in bed". I'm like WOOOOOOW It's my fault. And my husband has said and knows it from his heart it was not me. I did things to prevent this because I always knew women where lerking but he allowed someone else in. Someone always lays the blame.


Amen Sister!


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> No


I know it's embarrassing to go ask your Doctor for one. My Doctor look at me like anut ans ask WHY. He has seen me since I was 15 so he has watched me grow and after I told him he was actually pissed.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

sexuallyfustrated said:


> I know it's embarrassing to go ask your Doctor for one. My Doctor look at me like anut ans ask WHY. He has seen me since I was 15 so he has watched me grow and after I told him he was actually pissed.


I told my dog what she did and he growled at her! Mans best friend.....BOOYA!


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

I have fallen for this other woman too. Now that we have gotten past the motives and the definition of the word affair (I'm poking fun at myself) I see that this is a BIG problem thrown in the mix. Once again, it was not expected, but it is now reality.


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> I told my dog what she did and he growled at her! Mans best friend.....BOOYA!


:rofl::rofl::rofl:


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> I have fallen for this other woman too. Now that we have gotten past the motives and the definition of the word affair (I'm poking fun at myself) I see that this is a BIG problem thrown in the mix. Once again, it was not expected, but it is now reality.


Tread lightly Fighting, your still full of emotions and you maybe acting on those feeling and leave your wife to find that the other woman still wants to be with her husband. You realize that don't you. Do whats best for you but don't rush and take her and those feelings out of the equation.


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

My wife just called AGAIN and said that she doesn't know what to do to fix this and that she is so confused........Is that a symptom of Syphyllis? hahaha lolol


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## fightingforit (Aug 17, 2011)

sexuallyfustrated said:


> Tread lightly Fighting, your still full of emotions and you maybe acting on those feeling and leave your wife to find that the other woman still wants to be with her husband. You realize that don't you. Do whats best for you but don't rush and take her and those feelings out of the equation.


Oh, I know. It was not a question of whether or not I am going back to this "OW," because I have cut ties, but it is a question of how to do with those feelings.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> Oh, I know. It was not a question of whether or not I am going back to this "OW," because I have cut ties, but it is a question of how to do with those feelings.


you need to recognize that those feelings were the result of a circumstance and aren't based on real love


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> My wife just called AGAIN and said that she doesn't know what to do to fix this and that she is so confused........Is that a symptom of Syphyllis? hahaha lolol


:rofl:Your on a roll huh. But I had a older cousin that die two yrs ago he had it doorment for over 20 pluse yrs and he got sick and they found it. He was confused alot though. I'm just saying.


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## Almostrecovered (Jul 14, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> My wife just called AGAIN and said that she doesn't know what to do to fix this and that she is so confused........Is that a symptom of Syphyllis? hahaha lolol



I'm a big fan of humor myself, but I do implore you to get tested, you never know what sort of nasty thing she could have picked up


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

fightingforit said:


> Oh, I know. It was not a question of whether or not I am going back to this "OW," because I have cut ties, but it is a question of how to do with those feelings.


You will have to work on you, spend time as a family and do things with her. Take those feelings and deposit them into your marriage.


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## Soccerfan73 (Jul 30, 2011)

Lily_B said:


> Soccerfan...Thank you!!! That is great advice...I too am in limbo as well and am doing the day to day, and just trying to think things thru. It does start clearing up once your not on that scary roller coaster of emotion.
> 
> We all need to remember to do whats best for oneself!
> Great post SF
> ...


Thanks Lily. I'm glad this was of some help! I know the journey sure does suck, doesn't it? It's good to relate to people who have been through it. That's why I like this website.


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## sexuallyfustrated (Mar 24, 2011)

QUOTE=Soccerfan73;399930]Thanks Lily. I'm glad this was of some help! I know the journey sure does suck, doesn't it? It's good to relate to people who have been through it. That's why I like this website.[/QUOTE]

:iagree:
My husband does not seem to like it much but I really can careless. He is not talking about anything other than sex and how he needs it. Nothing having to do with what is going on, what he needs to do or what I ask him to do. So i come here to read, post and learn. I get a great deal from this site and the ppl here I just hope that I can help someone as much as I have been helped.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

fighting, just so you know, size isn't as important to most women as men think it is. What's more important is how you treat her. My DH never has sex with me just to get his rocks off; he ALWAYS insists on taking care of me first. I couldn't even tell you about size, because it's never even crossed my mind. Just sayin'.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

"Well, a few months back, my wife went over to our friends house to have a few drinks and hang out while I was at home with the kids. You know, girls night out at home. She came home that night and everything seemed great. Two days later, the other wife called me and said she was sorry to hear what happened and that she was there for me if I needed anything. I asked my wife what she was talking about and after a blowout fight, she told me that the she had messed around with my best friend and the husband of her best friend when the wife fell asleep. They both apologized and said it only went on for a minute and then they both realized, in their drunken stupor, that what they were doing was completely stupid and a complete mistake. I found this out on the day of our 8 month anniversary at 2 a.m. I left the house that night and sat at a diner crying for four hours. I felt like I had lost my best friend, wife and confidant. She said she didnt want anything to do with him, she wasn't even attracted to him, but that she had had way too much to drink. She said she stopped the whole incident immediately after it had started.

So I forgave her and actually took her out for our anniverssary that night. I understand that temptations can get the best of people when we drink heavily, even when we are truly happy, and that she had always been so devoted to me and she was so apologetic for losing the control, but she said she was actually blacking out and doesnt even remember it starting, she just remembers the moment when she realized it was happening and stopped it immediately. Well, come to find out over the next few days, the story actually changed. She then admitted that she had texted with him about inappropriate scenarios in the past, that she said she would have never let happen, but it was fun to text those "joking" scenarios to a friend. She also told me that he had tried to kiss her once before. She never told me any of this. I buckled, started hanging out with her best friend, as a support group of sorts, and you know what happened next......we started to have feelings for each other. We have been honorable up until this point, but we can no longer hold back our feelings."



My radar has been going off all night and it may be completely wrong, but.......... How did the other woman find out. You said she heard. How is that. Then she offers to get together to help you out......... two days later. Doesn't sound like she was too fired up and even if she was she could have been acting. 
I keep getting the feeling that you and your wife have been played by this couple. After all, she conveniently went to sleep to allow this to happen. If she didn't see it she heard it from her husband, why did he rat himself out?
Other possibilities blacked out, drugged, sleep sex (your wife may have gone to sleep and not realized where she fell asleep, woke up and realized what was happening). My wife and I have awakened many times having sex or making out, especially after drinking,. Seep sex(like sleep walking) was also a topic on a radio show.
Where was the OM when this was all taking place and what was the other mans story.
Work it out with your wife and remember the closer you are the faster your love will come flooding back. Its the hormone, pheromone, chemical bonding thing that goes on with nearness hugging and sex. LOL It sounds like you all had a super relationship and doesn't even qualify as an affair.
Work hard, be strong, man up and pray. I personally would ***** the other guy in the nose but that's just me and I don't recommend it to other people. Good luck and do not throw away such a good family. Time heals all wounds.


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