# WS feels so guilty we cant move on



## TryingToHeal (Jul 15, 2012)

He feels like he's ruined our relationship. All he wants is a time machine. which of course will never ever appear. we have a good week or two, where he is genuinely happy and we have good times together, then he gets distant, and says things like "I'm sorry. I'm not good enough" as we fall asleep, which makes me cry, because all it does is remind me that he is stuck and we are in limbo, adn i feel like i am not enough for him. 

he went to one counselor for about two months back when all this started, about 8 months ago. then realized he could not afford that one since it wasnt covered by insurance, and stopped going. finally started seeing our MC individually, but only saw her twice. had a third appt scheduled but cancelled it because he got into a car accident and was to buy his new car that same day, needed to get that done. never rescheduled the appointment, and when our MC questioned him about it, he says he feels stuck, that its not helping.

he tells me he still thinks about the OW, wonders what would have happened with her. he is being honest with me, which i need. it hurts hears, but i ask moer so i can try to understand and hear him, and he tells me he felt so relaxed around her, tells me she "got" him. tells me i dont listen to him enough. i have a problem with interuppting and putting words in his mounth. this happens because he talks slower than me, adn i get impatient, mostly when i get really upset and need reassurance, which i dont get, which makes me more upset. we fight about once every couple of months, but damage done, and last night was another time.

he lacks motivation to get help. hes basically really depressed, no sex drive, no desire to have fun, just goes to work and works on his car. not much else. any advice for riding this tough time out? i feel so so sad, i want him to get it together and comfort me already into healing, but he cant even forgive himself. i dont even think he has forgiven me all the way. this is so so hard!!! 

and im sure there are people here that will tell me to do the 180, leave, etc., im not ready to do that so it wont help to tell me this. please, anyone who has dealt with this, i could use your input...


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## survivorwife (May 15, 2012)

Is he really feeling shame for what he did, or is it grief over the loss of the OW? Therein lies the problem. Sounds to me that his problems stem from the latter, and he is taking it out on you. Once you address what he is really depressed about, then you can decide how to move forward.


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## ThreeStrikes (Aug 11, 2012)

TryingToHeal said:


> i dont even think he has forgiven me all the way. this is so so hard!!!


Why does he need to forgive you? Wasn't he the cheater?

Stop making excuses for him. He just misses his affair partner.


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## LetDownNTX (Oct 4, 2012)

It really sucks when someone you love is hurting and you cant help them. It makes you feel like you're not good enough. Going through something similar but not really the same.

You say he hasnt forgiven you? Why would he need to forgive you? He cheated, not you...or did you?


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## Kasler (Jul 20, 2012)

You need to call him out on this. Also the marriage may have issues, but it in no way justifies his affair.

However the ugly truth is his having an affair doesn't justify your prior actions either. While his are more damaging, both will have to be worked on for the marriage to have a chance at genuine success. 

For now though you're going to have to get him out of his funk, and get him into IC, no negotiations. 

If you allow this, shortly his grief and regret will turn into anger and resentment. It'll be you that drove him to this and you that caused this ruined marriage. 

You have to end this.


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## JustGrinding (Oct 26, 2012)

Let me start by saying I agree with other posters here. He has primary responsibility and has a lot of work to do if he wants to save your marriage.

I also strongly suspect, as another poster wrote, that your husband is grieving the loss of OW and hasn't yet given up on her.

Having said all of that:



TryingToHeal said:


> tells me i dont listen to him enough. i have a problem with interuppting and putting words in his mounth. this happens because he talks slower than me, adn i get impatient, mostly when i get really upset and need reassurance, which i dont get, which makes me more upset.
> QUOTE]
> 
> You absolutley must stop this. This is something my wife does. It has driven me to a point of total emotional withdrawal from her and I find it useless to try to engage her in any conversation. You're proving to your husband that his thoughts and feelings are subordinate to yours. There are ways to display deeper disrespect, contempt, and lack of care for your husband, but not many.
> ...


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## TryingToHeal (Jul 15, 2012)

LetDownNTX said:


> It really sucks when someone you love is hurting and you cant help them. It makes you feel like you're not good enough. Going through something similar but not really the same.
> 
> You say he hasnt forgiven you? Why would he need to forgive you? He cheated, not you...or did you?


he hasnt forgiven me for him feeling so bad for years, because his passive agressivness lead me to go overboard emotionally and treat him as inferior. i dint treat him well, adn it caused him to emotionally withdraw, which lead to his affair. its my own battle with my emotions, i realize. but if i can forgive his affair, he needs to forgive the past. its like he expects instant change. if i mess up, i realize right away and say sorry, please continue, but that shuts him down.

we are in a bad cycle. i dont know how to get him in IC. Ive told him over and over that i think he needs it, the MC has told him this, his mother has told him this, but he seems so depressed he doesnt feel like there is anything that can help.

it does seems as if his guilt comes from both his feeling that he has ruined our relationship, and also maybe the he's not over her. he says hes over her, but thinks about whether things might have been better with her because she made him feel so good about himself.

should i take a few days away from the situation and not talk to him about it? should i apologize for acting the way i did last night and try to talk to him again?

i feel this never ending need to talk about it becasue that is what works for me when i feel bad. i realize that may not be his way, but i honestl;y dont know waht his way is, adn i dont think he does either. i also feel the distance between us adn want to close that gap. but obviously getting so upset is triggering him. im just feeling so sad adn broken and while hes dealing with this despression, im trying to be patient, but since hes not going to IC anymore I'm struggling, feeling like this is never going to end bc he cant figure out a way to get over it on his own.


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## rrrbbbttt (Apr 6, 2011)

No, the ignoring it only allows the wound to fester and morph into something bigger, uglier and different.

If you both want R, the affair occured and you both have to face it talk about it. Yes, there will be hurtful comments but you both must know that for you to R you have to deal with it and get it out on the table.

Same thing with the issues of the marriage that you speak of. Both of you need to address them but they are not an excuse or should be used as an excuse for the Affair.

If you can't do this as a couple you need the counseling to help you through it. 

Are you members of a church that offers counseling for marriage that you feel may help? Just an option for some but not all.


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## Racer (Sep 24, 2009)

Well... My WW went through this. By the time she did though, I had a ton to be angry about so it was relatively easy... I viewed it as one of those “defining moments” of her character. Would she be strong enough to face her own issues, own them, and work on herself? Or would she curl into a ball hoping I’d somehow save her? 

She curled into a ball (at first). That is where I let my rage fuel me into “inaction” to rescue her. I let her wallow in her own bowl of self-pity basically reinforcing that “I” wasn’t going to help her and if she couldn’t handle this on her own, she needed to get into counseling. She “tested” this multiple times; Days of sobbing, suicide threats, etc. Eventually though, she did schedule an IC appointment. 

What sort of sucks for you during this time is having to be rather heartless and holding their feet to the fire. It goes against your belief system and tears you up. But you can not “fix” their problems and issues for them. Be supportive of them “fixing” themselves, but do not take any responsibility for them and how they feel about themselves. At some point, they need to grow up and learn how to find that from within. A IC can help them there. 

A side benefit is he’ll learn neither you or the OW could “make him” feel a certain way. It’s all about perception shifts which is probably why he’s depressed anyway. His perception supports depression and “makes him feel” this or that. If he learns how to perceive things different, he will learn how to control the direction of his emotions. So... it’s sort of like he wants to be depressed and his thoughts just go along that path to support it. He discards what might lead him in another direction like hope. When all you seek is the worst, that will be all you’ll find (and visa-versa)


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## TryingToHeal (Jul 15, 2012)

survivorwife said:


> Is he really feeling shame for what he did, or is it grief over the loss of the OW? Therein lies the problem. Sounds to me that his problems stem from the latter, and he is taking it out on you. Once you address what he is really depressed about, then you can decide how to move forward.


so he is taking it out on me by being depressed and unmotivated? im confused, i dont think im understanding you. or maybe i am? not sure, but im interested in what you mean, can you explain more? I wonder you have something there...

if this is the case, how do we address it? Do i bring it to MC? I told him last night im not sure going to MC is worth it if he isnt going on his own, but i also feel sometimes that its all hes been willing to do, so we shouldnt stop bc it is one of the few places we ever really get to talk out how we feel bc he opens up knowing she will mediate, although he was saying yesterday hef elt the therapist dint even like him. i told him its not about liking us, its about her helping us/me/him sort through our and our own issues. liking doesnt matter. ..


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## TryingToHeal (Jul 15, 2012)

Racer said:


> Well... My WW went through this. By the time she did though, I had a ton to be angry about so it was relatively easy... I viewed it as one of those “defining moments” of her character. Would she be strong enough to face her own issues, own them, and work on herself? Or would she curl into a ball hoping I’d somehow save her?
> 
> She curled into a ball (at first). That is where I let my rage fuel me into “inaction” to rescue her. I let her wallow in her own bowl of self-pity basically reinforcing that “I” wasn’t going to help her and if she couldn’t handle this on her own, she needed to get into counseling. She “tested” this multiple times; Days of sobbing, suicide threats, etc. Eventually though, she did schedule an IC appointment.
> 
> ...



i do sometimes feel like he has played the "oh im so depressed card" too long and im getting irriated bc im depressed too. he freakin cheated on me, it feels awful. but when his first therapist told him there are many levels of suicidal, and he was mildly suicidal, like a 1 on the scale of 1 to 10. when i heard that, it just freaked me out. i was so worried about him, and at this point i asked his mother to check in on him, and my friend who i talked to about it called him without my permission and invited him to come talk to her. in hindsight, i wish id asked her to butt out. too much advice just confused him more, especially coming from someone, yes my friend, as passive agressive as him, and incapable of fixing her own issues. shes a busybody and i was weak and confused at the time, and didnt stop her. anyways...

at that point i listened during long talks about he felt so worthless. ive faced depression in my life, 10 years ago, and spent two years in therapy figuring out most of my issues. obviously i missed a few, im back now working on them. i just know what its like to feel the things he is saying he feels, so i felt i needed to just be there and help him understand his own feelings, getting him through those few rough weeks, which i figured was hard core withdraw from the OW. 

i just kept telling him people make mistakes, its about learning from them, and taking action to be a better person and work on changing the bad habits. how having hope is so important. things just go back adn forth tho betweem him being normal or even happy! and being all withdrawn and mopey and "im a loser".

it does totally go against my nature to ignore him in this state. i have been supportive of him going to IC. our mc does tell him his thoughts are leading to his beliefs that hes not good enough which is leading to his inaction in really committing to working hard on our relationship. it sinks in...at times...then just goes poof! night like last night i know are not gonna help with the motivation. but it doesnt help me feel close to him either. 

for now i apologized for losing it last night, for yelling adn crying and that i shoudl ahve taken a time out way before he finally did. he triggered me, but it was my choice to lose control. he lost control too, and didnt apologize. that kidna bugs me. he says thanks...and i bet ill get an apology ina few days. but thats too long...just not sure how to deal with the mean time between now and when he realized he need to get his butt to IC...how to treat him? how to live normally without ignoring? do i jsut call him on everything that is blaming adn not taking responsibility?

so sorry if im all over the place, thats just how my head is right now. i appreciate so much all the feedback i get here, it really helps me cope and understand things...i am certainly learning alot through all of this, and when i lose it, the rest of my life isnt suffering so much now...made it to work ontime, after very little fiful sleep, adn rocked it. thank god!!! its so true that what doesnt kill u makes u stronger.


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## TryingToHeal (Jul 15, 2012)

ThreeStrikes said:


> Why does he need to forgive you? Wasn't he the cheater?
> 
> Stop making excuses for him. He just misses his affair partner.


as i said to another poster, i made many msitakes before his affair. it doesnt justify his affair, but just because he had an affair doesnt mean im off the hook for my own bad behavior.

so if he does just miss her, that'll pass, and in the mean time, i cant figure out how to live more peacefully with this stage of R.

i do worry he misses her, not just how she made him feel. or that he attributes how she made him feel to her, and thats why he thinks about what might have been with her. i know its all a fantasty. i think he does too. and i have told him, the MC has told him, he cant allow himself to keep thinnking these things bc it will keep us from really getting past it if he wont let it go. 

i also know i am very insecure now. so i dont know how to figure out which it is. its very hard to be the BS. i lack a confidence i used to have, especially when it comes to our relationship. i feel like my foundation has been pulled out from under me after years together thinking he could never do such a thing and that if this ever happened to me i would leave in a heartbeat. you never know till it happens to you. and now im struggling im trying to find my footing while feeling insecure, depressed, lonely, stressed and i dont always sleep well, etc.

i am reading alot, have a great new job, but def need more activities to fill my time...im pretty sure that would help distract me at least, but i really just wish i knew how to figure out what is really going on..


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## TryingToHeal (Jul 15, 2012)

Kasler said:


> You need to call him out on this. Also the marriage may have issues, but it in no way justifies his affair.
> 
> do you mean call him on missing her? im not sure what that woudl accomplish if he is admitting it, i dont think i understand. could you tel me more about what you mean here?
> 
> ...




end what? sorry i feel like i might be dissecting your post and i hope you dont take offense, its just that i am interested in what you ahve to say and want to understand it better.


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## TryingToHeal (Jul 15, 2012)

JustGrinding said:


> Let me start by saying I agree with other posters here. He has primary responsibility and has a lot of work to do if he wants to save your marriage.
> 
> what does this work look like to you? just curious, are you a BS or WS?
> 
> ...


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## TryingToHeal (Jul 15, 2012)

rrrbbbttt said:


> No, the ignoring it only allows the wound to fester and morph into something bigger, uglier and different.
> 
> what do you mean ignoring it? being patient with him? or avoiding talking about it for a few days? or how i am feeling?
> 
> ...


no, we are not, we are not very religious. sometimes i wish we were just becasue a few religion-based marraige help sites have made alot of sense to me. probably because we were both raised catholic by very religious moms, but its not really for us.


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## TryingToHeal (Jul 15, 2012)

thanks all for your input. i hope to hear more from you all, but even if not i appreciate the support, comments and advice. its certainly been theraputic to talk about this all so freely, and also good to get different perspectives. it helps me each time i feel drawn to TAM. i hope one day i can help others more, maybe once ive gotten through all this and come out on the other side, whichever side that ends up being.


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

People rise to the occasion when challenged, but often they whine and complain first too see if they can get the challenger to back off.

I think your husband is doing that here. He doesn't want to stop cheatng, and he isn't looking to do the needed and responsible heavy lifting to improve the marrage, so he falls back on the routine of being depressed, being "guilty", being overwhelmed.

All great reasons why he can do anything, but put effort into finding more reasons not to put in effort.

My advice is to set the bar high and not compromise by lowering it to accommodate his complaints and excuses. 

Giving a trophy to the fat kid who wouldn't run around the track doesn't make him a winner.it just rewards someone who didn't do anything with something worthless because it wasn't earned.


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## kevinocarro (Jan 3, 2013)

It really sucks when someone you love is hurting and you cant help them.


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## Chaparral (Jul 17, 2011)

Not letting anyone speak without interrupting them is rude behavior. Would you interrupt your boss? Your preacher, teachers, pare nuts. It is sign of disrespect not because he speaks slowly. It's bad manners and you surely do not do it with other people. If you do you are not very perceptive because people hate to be cut off.
What he's thinking is having a convo with you is pointless because you are just having a convo with yourself. I'm surprised this was never covered in any of your classes.


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