# anger management



## nader (May 4, 2011)

It's been a bit stormy for the past day or two. I realize I have my shortcomings but I don't deserve to get bombarded with so many grievances at once. Some days it's just too much. Leaving the house and going to Wal-Mart usually helps, but then it will become ammo later ("I wish _I_ could just drive off and escape for awhile." - she can, but she just doesn't think that way.)

I made a list of things I've been hassled about today and yesterday. Some things are understandable; others not so much; other things are from weeks and months ago and I don't even know why she brings them up. One mistake and I'll hear about it forever.



> I burned some eggs over the weekend while she was at work and didn't manage to get out all the burn stains. I got a good bit of it, but left some. it's really hard to get off. So I just put it away, with a few burn marks, and forgot about it. When she found it she FLIPPED OUT and it basically ruined the rest of the evening. If I had tried to clean it, she would have been mad would have made a mess in the sink that was full of dishes, which I've been instructed not to clean up because I'll do it wrong. Yes, sometimes a single piece of tupperware ends up in the wrong cabinet or a speck of residue might get left on some fork. But it is all or nothing with her. This is a continuing battleground for us - she lets them pile up but then doesn't want me to clean it; I tell her I'll clean it if I feel like it and that it's completely my prerogative. Sometimes I clean it and sometimes i leave it to her.
> 
> no, don't clear the table, you're going to break something. just leave it.
> 
> ...


we have counseling lined up but I don't know how to proceed. She thinks it's all me, and that any woman would be just as angry/resentful about these things and that this is a perfectly normal way to talk to your husband.

I love her to pieces and we do have some great times, but I don't know how much more I can take. How do you get someone to deal with their anger issues?

I'm repeatedly told that I'm incapable of performing basic household tasks, and she's tired all the time because she "has to do everything herself."

later I told her that I would _never_ talk to her the way she talks to me, that I'm on her side and the only person who is completely on her side.. we are supposed to be friends and enjoy each other's company.

I'm sorry for the rant, I know I complain alot about my wife; but I just need to vent. And for someone to agree with me that this is NOT normal.


----------



## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

It's good to hear you're going to see someone.

It sounds exhausting. I wouldn't consider that dynamic to be healthy. Including your own mindset: _I told her that there's plenty of stuff she does that bugs me but I often keep it to myself and I certainly don't go on and on about it the way she does to me, and that maybe I should._

I am sorry you have gotten to this point. The good news is, there's a lot you can learn if you're willing - things about yourself as well as your relationship. Learning how to set boundaries, how to love and respect yourself - that you are valid in what you feel, and learning how to communicate without bottling things up.... all wonderfully healthy things to learn or rediscover within yourself. They are important for you regardless of the circumstance for discovering them.

As you know, this isn't about what you make your son for breakfast or if the light-switch is fixed. It's beyond those things.


----------



## Dollystanford (Mar 14, 2012)

my ex went to anger management

the therapist p*ssed him off so much he never went back


----------



## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

Dollystanford said:


> my ex went to anger management
> 
> the therapist p*ssed him off so much he never went back


*covering mouth while laughing*

please tell me this is good ole British humor.


----------



## Dollystanford (Mar 14, 2012)

ha ha I'm not joking!!!!


----------



## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

Dollystanford said:


> ha ha I'm not joking!!!!


I'm sorry Dolly.

You're better off out of it by the sounds.


----------



## *needaunderstand* (Jun 11, 2012)

wow, thats chaotic. she really seems to resent you. maybe you both can sit down and write down some things that bother you both and how to work on them. decide a chore list of things for you both to do around the house. she might be stressed about other things. as far as sex goes. i wouldnt halt the sex life. it could create another problem for you both. i have a lot of chaos myself and i know it can be hard. when you dont know what the other thinks, all you can do is assume they are feeling the way you would if you did those things. MC can help. but im feeling its somthing a lot deeper for her.


----------



## Dollystanford (Mar 14, 2012)

oh god yeah, I'm a lover not a fighter


----------



## nader (May 4, 2011)

oh there's no halting the sex life, at least on my end. I have to be severely miffed to not want sex. These things come and go, often it's set off by some 'event,' we'll fight for a day or two and then be happy. It is mostly _her_ mood (or possibly her cycle) that dictates this. It's like if I make these mistakes she has no choice to get angry.. it's my fault for 'making her' get upset. I always tell her she is not powerless can decide whether or not to get mad, but that seems to fall flat on its face.



> Including your own mindset: I told her that there's plenty of stuff she does that bugs me but I often keep it to myself and I certainly don't go on and on about it the way she does to me, and that maybe I should.


Yes.. it's sooo hard to find that balance of setting boundaries; not being walked all over and not being an ass. I do think this is something I've gotten better at; so often the trick is just staying calm and refusing to escalate. But she has to know she can't treat me this way.


----------



## heartsbeating (May 2, 2011)

nader said:


> Yes.. it's sooo hard to find that balance of setting boundaries; not being walked all over and not being an ass. I do think this is something I've gotten better at; so often the trick is just staying calm and refusing to escalate. But she has to know she can't treat me this way.


I agree about things not having to escalate - so long as you aren't suppressing your own feelings while staying calm. You still need to be heard and communicate effectively that her treatment and disrespect needs to stop. 

It sounded to me as though you ask her things.... such as why wasn't the light fixed? I was a little confused here. I can't help but wonder if you're nitpicking back but in a different way? She then seems to turn it back on you anyway, so no doubt she has resentment. It does sound like you're over due for learning how to have healthy communication. Good on you for both agreeing to see a therapist. This stuff takes time, patience, willingness, understanding and empathy. Just keep in mind, it takes time.

My 0.02 cents.


----------



## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

She’s looking right down her nose at you and has absolutely no respect for you whatsoever. And from what you’ve written that may well be justified.

Boundaries are key here. You need them to re-establish healthy levels of self-respect and self-esteem, that’s if you had them in the first place. Any man who respected himself would have been long gone from such a woman.


----------



## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

You guys have a lot of things going on. For one, you have some abusive dynamics. For another, neither of you is acknowledging how you contribute to this. You said she sees it as all your fault and that you would never talk to her the way she talks to you, but yes, you do. 

You criticize her merely by making such a judgmental statement to her even if you don't necessarily call names. The bottom line is that everything you resent her doing are things you're guilty of doing to her, too. As I often say, you can't change her, but you can change yourself and what you do if you want the relationship to change. 

You've learned to walk away sometimes. That's a good starting point. If the two of you can agree to some ground rules while you're getting along, and stick to them when you're arguing, you can start practicing fair fighting techniques. I have an article about how to do this at Fair Fighting: How to Fight Fair when Emotions are High

Some of the information I wrote about in that article is stuff I learned while going through anger management counseling with an abusive boyfriend I once had. I think you'll find it useful, though it will take a lot of practice and probably a lot of counseling to learn how to avoid such arguments, and it will only work if you're both dedicated. It's quite likely that one of you will get frustrated with the counseling process and quit, as someone already mentioned happened with her husband.


----------



## nader (May 4, 2011)

heartsbeating said:


> It sounded to me as though you ask her things.... such as why wasn't the light fixed? I was a little confused here. I can't help but wonder if you're nitpicking back but in a different way?


Yes, the timing was a bit jumbled in my op. 

I noticed one morning that the switch chain for the ceiling fan in his room had been removed; when I asked her about it she said it was because I kept turning off the fan when it needs to stay on to keep the room cool. We are having AC problems at the moment, which she is stressed about anyway. That was the only time I told her to fix the light. What this has to do with the ceiling fan beats me; that stitch is fully intact and I can still, switch the on and off at will.

Kathy: thanks for your encouragement and honesty. I look forward to reading and sharing your article. It does seem like a good time to work on ground rules.


----------



## Gaia (Apr 27, 2012)

AFEH said:


> She’s looking right down her nose at you and has absolutely no respect for you whatsoever. And from what you’ve written that may well be justified.
> 
> Boundaries are key here. You need them to re-establish healthy levels of self-respect and self-esteem, that’s if you had them in the first place. Any man who respected himself would have been long gone from such a woman.


AFEH while I do agree that it could be this... I also disagree with this... "*She’s looking right down her nose at you and has absolutely no respect for you whatsoever.*" to an extent. Now it might be true... or it might not be .. and it's looking to me like it's NOT true. Why? Because .. after reading OP's post... it really seems as if his wife REALLY needs psychiatric help. With anger like that... alot of times it is due to stress and feeling overwhelmed, overloaded, ect. Not everyone handles this the same so to say she could do this and that instead... is much easier said then done. OP.. maybe you should give this a shot... If... ok not if but when she starts up again .. try saying something like.. "Baby.. why are you being so mean to me?" She may not REALIZE she's being so cruel so perhaps an approach that points out her behavior in a way that can't be perceived as an attack by her could be best. It's good that you two are going to counseling ... and clearly she hasn't realized ... or rather.. had her eyes opened up to how much pain she is causing you. Now it may take her awhile to come to terms with how terrible she has gotten or maybe.. has always been? But she will try and make improvements after realizing how unacceptable her behavior has been. Counseling should help... so lets hope this is a good counselor your going to see. Of course she may also need IC to help her address her own problems. 


Ok AFEH I would like to say this. Your post here... "*Any man who respected himself would have been long gone from such a woman.*" is true however it is a bit selfish. Just because some men choose to stay with a "such a woman" does not mean they do not respect themselves. It just means they respect this woman as well and honestly love her.. even if she has her faults. Any man who can find it in themselves to stay with "such a woman" and work it out has .. imo... a hell of alot of strength, patience, and heart. 


OP... it seems your wife is spiteful, resentful, ect so I hope you and her can work it out. Don't let yourself be a doormat though.. as AFEH said... "*Boundaries are key here. You need them to re-establish healthy levels of self-respect and self-esteem*" He is VERY right on this point.


----------



## nader (May 4, 2011)

> AFEH while I do agree that it could be this... I also disagree with this... "She’s looking right down her nose at you and has absolutely no respect for you whatsoever." to an extent. Now it might be true... or it might not be .. and it's looking to me like it's NOT true. Why? Because .. after reading OP's post... it really seems as if his wife REALLY needs psychiatric help. With anger like that... alot of times it is due to stress and feeling overwhelmed, overloaded, ect. Not everyone handles this the same so to say she could do this and that instead... is much easier said then done.


It's absolutely true that much of this is stress related. Her job has been stressing her out lately, and because of benefits and stock sharing options it would be a very bad thing if she left. There is a position opening up that would be perfect for her; fixed hours, Sundays off and more administrative/desk work. So we're hoping that will make a difference.

The AC needs repair; her dad is certified to repair ac and he will be coming up at the end of the month, but in the meantime the house gets really hot, which sometimes keeps her up at night. When I think of all the times we've had fights, it almost always corresponds to either PMS or sleep deprivation/exhaustion.



> OP.. maybe you should give this a shot... If... ok not if but when she starts up again .. try saying something like.. "Baby.. why are you being so mean to me?" She may not REALIZE she's being so cruel so perhaps an approach that points out her behavior in a way that can't be perceived as an attack by her could be best.


Usually when I say things like (why are you being mean), I get "*Because, Nate...* and then she continues with whatever she was upset about. Like *this* is why I'm allowed to be mean, and that any sane person would react the same way. She does not read books about marriage and post on self help forums the same way I do, so I think her frame of reference is a bit skewed. 



> It's good that you two are going to counseling ... and clearly she hasn't realized ... or rather.. had her eyes opened up to how much pain she is causing you. Now it may take her awhile to come to terms with how terrible she has gotten or maybe.. has always been? But she will try and make improvements after realizing how unacceptable her behavior has been. Counseling should help... so lets hope this is a good counselor your going to see. Of course she may also need IC to help her address her own problems.


It's not always this intense, but I think the basic dynamic has been there. Ie, I'm forgetful, she gets angry. I've always known way my issues are and I've taken measurable steps to improve. I honestly can't say that she's done the same. We've seen the MC a couple times - an initial consultation and then a one-on-one for each of us. During hers she mostly complained about her job, and it didn't sound very productive. The whole process has been drawn out by our insurance, but we've finally been approved for the coverage so we'll be able to pick back up again. the MC seems to understand the things I've told her, but she is still gathering information at this point.




> Ok AFEH I would like to say this. Your post here... "Any man who respected himself would have been long gone from such a woman." is true however it is a bit selfish. Just because some men choose to stay with a "such a woman" does not mean they do not respect themselves. It just means they respect this woman as well and honestly love her.. even if she has her faults. Any man who can find it in themselves to stay with "such a woman" and work it out has .. imo... a hell of alot of strength, patience, and heart.


Thank you for pointing that out. It seems like alot of people here are 'divorce happy,' perhaps projecting from some of their own experiences. I've given a snapshot, not the whole picture. I am confident that i can retain my self respect and still stay married. I know we both love each other very much nd we still have a reasonably good sex life. Not amazing but good enough. She is also an *incredible* mother to our son and that's one of things I love most about her.

This is *absolutely not* a case where divorce would do anything for my self respect! If we got divorced I would not have any money to be upgrading my wardrobe and finding a trophy replacement girlfriend; I'd probably be living in some basement living off Ramen noodles and hating my life. A divorce/child support scenario would only make the bad things worse; I want to make the good things better!


----------



## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

It’s seems to me that you’re kind of taking the mick. The light doesn’t work, you wait for her to fix it. The A/C doesn’t work, you wait for her dad to come and fix it. For goodness sake fix the light and get her dad on the phone so he can walk you through how to fix the A/C!


It could be you’re quite literally loaded with passive aggression and don’t know it.


----------



## nader (May 4, 2011)

AFEH said:


> It’s seems to me that you’re kind of taking the mick. The light doesn’t work, you wait for her to fix it. The A/C doesn’t work, you wait for her dad to come and fix it. For goodness sake fix the light and get her dad on the phone so he can walk you through how to fix the A/C!
> 
> It could be you’re quite literally loaded with passive aggression and don’t know it.


possibly, but not for these reasons.

Actually, tinkering with a central AC unit is dangerous and illegal unless you are certified. If it was that simple it would be done already. We have fans and a window unit that are getting us by until her dad comes.

the light isn't a broken thing that has to be 'fixed'.. she took the chain and is holding on to it until she sees fit to replace it. It is a control thing.


----------



## Ten_year_hubby (Jun 24, 2010)

nader said:


> I'm sorry for the rant, I know I complain alot about my wife; but I just need to vent. And for someone to agree with me that this is NOT normal.


Looks like classic disrespect and blame your partner for everything. More and more of this going on these days, one could make a case for it being normal in a dysfunctional way

Your wife feels entitled and she feels especially entitled to treat you without respect. You seem to be letting her take the lead and responding to her in a like fashion.


----------



## KathyBatesel (Apr 26, 2012)

nader said:


> Usually when I say things like (why are you being mean), I get "*Because, Nate...* and then she continues with whatever she was upset about. Like *this* is why I'm allowed to be mean, and that any sane person would react the same way. She does not read books about marriage and post on self help forums the same way I do, so I think her frame of reference is a bit skewed.


I like Gaia's suggestion, but I can see how it would normally be met with defensiveness. Perhaps you can try disarming her anger at those moments by saying, "I can see you're stressed and angry. Can we talk when you feel calmer about it? I'd rather solve our disagreements respectfully than have an argument" or "Is this really about (whatever she's upset about) or about hurting me, because it sounds to me like you're striking out to hurt me." (Then, if she gets defensive, you can say, "Well, I'm feeling attacked which makes it impossible for me to feel rational about (what she's mad about). I'll talk about it when you find another way to approach me."

P.S. I agree that some people are divorce happy on here.

I also like what TenYearHubby said. I think each time you recognize a control thing, you might ask yourself what you're doing to contribute to her feeling like things are out of control. I suspect you do have a lot of passive-aggressive behaviors, as AFEH noted.


----------



## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

nader said:


> possibly, but not for these reasons.
> 
> Actually, tinkering with a central AC unit is dangerous and illegal unless you are certified. If it was that simple it would be done already. We have fans and a window unit that are getting us by until her dad comes.
> 
> the light isn't a broken thing that has to be 'fixed'.. she took the chain and is holding on to it until she sees fit to replace it. It is a control thing.


It would be perfectly normal for you to be loaded with resentment (dislike and anger at your wife) if she has more or less threatened you with eviction. And again it would be normal for you to express your anger and dislike in a passive aggressive way because if you were actively aggressive you may will be evicted from your home.

In a way your wife is treating you as her lodger. “Do as I say, obey my rules or you will be evicted”. That alone must give you an enormous sense of insecurity let alone feelings of resentment.

So I’d imagine you are both insecure and resentful. Thing is, what are you going to do about it? And you make those plans with the absolute belief that the only person you can change is yourself.


With the A/C, a man's common sense and natural ability is all it takes to fix most things.


----------



## AFEH (May 18, 2010)

Divorce happy :rofl:

I’d live in a tent before a woman ever threaten me with eviction a second time.


----------

