# Adult kids and equal gifts



## Cooper (Apr 18, 2008)

I know most of the topics on this forum are geared toward younger children but thought I would throw this out there.

I have a daughter who is an outstanding young woman, has worked her butt of to live independent and finish college. I pay her tuition and car insurance but other than that she is on her own and has been for four years.

My son has struggled, failed out of college and would have lived with me forever if I hadn't of thrown him out due to drinking and drug use. He is doing much better now, I gave him a job at my business and he is a hard worker, he has worked for me over a year, I am proud of the changes he has made in his life.

So here's the thing, I have had it in the back of my mind that when my daughter finishes college (this fall) I would buy her a new car as a graduation gift and a reward for working so hard these past few years. I figure it will give her one less thing to worry about when she starts her new life.

But does that send the wrong message to my son? I don't want my son to feel like I am disappointed in him or love him less. My thinking is my son is earning a good paycheck and can support himself, and I gave him that opportunity. And yes I paid for my daughters education so gave her that opportunity, but just want to give her a bit more help. 

Any thoughts?


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

That's a tough one. Without knowing each of your kids personaities, situations, and feeling of acceptance from you, I don't think anyone can really answer.

Could you give your son/employee a nice Christmas bonus for working so hard? Might that even things out with each bonus being for what they have done. 

In these type of things as parents we also have to remember that though you're daughter may have worked hard, she also may have a natural bent towards doing well in a school setting. I always did well at studies without trying while my brother tried and did poorly and I always thought it was unfair that my parents rewarded me over my brothers for it, being young though I still took the benefits.


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## SecondTime'Round (Jan 15, 2015)

I think I'd give your son something as a way of telling him you're proud of him for working hard the last few years. I like the idea of a bonus, or maybe a vacation.


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## Cooper (Apr 18, 2008)

Thanks for the input....

My son has been rewarded for his work, he has gotten bonuses and pay increases, he does get paid vacation, but that is a result of his being an employee in good standing, not because he's my son. I do tell him how good of a job he does and how I am proud of how he has turned out, but we did have a couple bad years and I was hard on him, and would do the same all over again if needed. My son was the over achiever between the kids, school was easy, top athlete, all that went to hell when he decided to start partying. My daughter has always had to work at her studies, never one of the top achievers but a solid 3.0 student, and has always had a job since she was 16 years old, now 24. 

Personality difference between the kids is one of the things that makes me question the gift. My daughter is thick skinned and confident, my son is sensitive(he would never admit that)and I am afraid rewarding my daughter would only confirm in his mind how much he screwed up. You would think "good, he should think that" but have found he turns that hurt in on himself.

Talking this thru has been helpful to me. I am realizing that I am more focused on how this will affect my son instead of being focused on my daughter and wanting to reward her hard work, and that isn't fair for her. I am leaning toward getting her the car, I believe I can talk this thru with my son so he will understand. Plus he has a standing offer to go back to college or a trade school and I will cover the cost.

Thanks


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## Blondilocks (Jul 4, 2013)

It looks like you are rewarding your daughter for being a good girl and finishing college. It also looks like you are punishing your son for being a dropout and a loser (for a while). Any way you cut it, kids compare gifts from parents. 

Perhaps you can ask you son's opinion of what would be helpful to daughter as she starts her new life. He may suggest a new car or a down payment on a condo. If he is included in the decision making, he may not be resentful. No guarantees, though. If he was a doting big brother, things would go more smoothly.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

What kind of work does your son do in your business?


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

> My son has been rewarded for his work, he has gotten bonuses and pay increases, he does get paid vacation, but that is a result of his being an employee in good standing, not because he's my son.


Those are not rewards. He is paid for doing a good job at work. He'd get those things anywhere he worked. If you hired Joe Schmoe to do the job he’s doing, Joe Schmoe would get the same payments for doing his job.
Keep in mind that when your daughter gets a job, she too will be “rewarded” in the same way. Why is it that getting paid to do his job is a “reward” for your son but it’s not enough of a reward for your daughter?

You have poured huge amounts into your daughter with the education and paying her car insurance.

Your son stayed with you for a while. You don't say how long. But what you covered in room and board is probably less than what you have spent on your daughter. (Depending on what school she's at)

Your daughter's reward for graduating is her degree. Just like your son's reward for his job is his pay, bonuses and vacation.



> I figure it will give her one less thing to worry about when she starts her new life.


You feel that your son can take care of himself now that he's working.

Your daughter will now be working full time (I assume now that she's graduated.)

So why do you think she needs the help of a new car and your son does not?

To me it sounds like you are soft on your daughter and harsh on your son.

A lot of kids struggle right out of high school. It's very common. My son did this too.. .not the drugs and stuff but he had trouble when he first started at college. So he took a couple of years off. He worked one of them and then did nothing the second year. Then he signed up for college again. Today he has a double BS in Physics and Applied Mathematics and is half way through an MS in Physics. When it comes to our children, we have to give them the right to make their own way. Sometimes they will stumble. That's ok.

A good book on this is Failing Forward: Turning Mistakes into Stepping Stones for Success ... "the difference between average people and achieving people is their perception of and response to failure." 

Young people take their own paths. Some take a detour but get back on track. Some never get back on track after a detour. 

Giving your daughter a car as a HUGE reward. Most young people do not get $20K-$40K rewards from parents who paid most of their way.

If you give your daughter a car, and hold on the idea that is going to most likely put a HUGE wedge between your children. It will probably put a huge wedge between you and your son. It will solidify in your son's mind that you favor your daughter. And I would agree with him. You do clearly favor her.


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## Fozzy (Jul 20, 2013)

Cooper said:


> Plus he has a standing offer to go back to college or a trade school and I will cover the cost.


This is already incredibly generous. The car is a reward for completing her education. Tell your son he can get one too when he graduates.


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Cooper, 
I'm glad you are thinking about this. My Dad sure messed it up.
MN


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## Cooper (Apr 18, 2008)

EleGirl said:


> Those are not rewards. He is paid for doing a good job at work. He'd get those things anywhere he worked. If you hired Joe Schmoe to do the job he’s doing, Joe Schmoe would get the same payments for doing his job.
> Keep in mind that when your daughter gets a job, she too will be “rewarded” in the same way. Why is it that getting paid to do his job is a “reward” for your son but it’s not enough of a reward for your daughter?
> 
> You have poured huge amounts into your daughter with the education and paying her car insurance.
> ...


Ele most of the time I agree with your sensible responses and you make some good and true points to my questions but I can't help but sense a bit of hostility (?) in your reply. Is this a sore subject with you?

My kids were raised in an equally loving house hold, they were given opportunities but not spoiled. My ex wife left when my daughter was 17 and my son was 13, the kids stayed with me. If either child received special attention it was my son once he reached his senior year of high school, that's when his partying started and he started sliding down hill. Short story is it was a tough three years but he is doing well now, and I keep offering to help him with any goal he wants to set, college, trade school, even a small business. 

While things always have come easy for my son my daughter has always had to work a bit harder, and her tenacity impresses the hell out of me, that's why I want to show her hard work and discipline can pay off. Yes yes yes she can and will survive on her own, but what's wrong with wanting to give her a head start financially by taking the car expense off the table for a few years. And yes I know all about earning what you got, been there done that and for the mast part raised the kids the same way. 

My kids get along great, always have, matter of fact they have lived together for this last year (and my daughters boyfriend) sharing an apartment and expenses. I am certain a car wouldn't drive a wedge between them, and don't believe it would affect my relationship with my son. My concern is only how it will make my son feel, as another poster said "it looks like you are rewarding your daughter but punishing your son". I want to do something for my daughter, but don't want to hurt my son by doing so. 

I am admittedly waffling back and forth on this issue. 

Sorry this became long winded, just wanted to explain some of the family dynamics.


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## Cooper (Apr 18, 2008)

Mr. Nail said:


> Cooper,
> I'm glad you are thinking about this. My Dad sure messed it up.
> MN


Care to expand on that statement?


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## Mr. Nail (Apr 26, 2011)

Cooper said:


> Care to expand on that statement?


Cooper if you weren't seriously contemplating making adjustments to your plans, I wouldn't.

Even at this point I struggle. This is quite painful for me. From the Age of 10 through the age of 40 ish, I struggled with getting approval from my father. I did not use drugs or commit crimes. I was the second Child and oldest son. All of this is important and has bearing on the situation. I was viciously abused by a gang of children about my age, around the time this all started. There was also a School teacher who was incompetent and used cruelty to inspire me, as he had no tools to address my learning difference. Over the following 8 years. I struggled through a lot of recovery issues and personality adjustments. But behind it all was this lack of approval from the one man / role model / mentor who should have had my back.

One of the issues that really stuck in my craw as an adult child was his lavish rewards to my siblings younger than me. As I would hear about those I would take an ego hit. In the back of my mind was the thought, "didn't I ever do anything that impressed you?" 

Now I'm well past the point and on the healing side but this is what it took. At around 40, even though I was working in the family business with my dad. I stopped trying to get his approval. I defended my decisions to him and didn't care if he agreed. In essence I emotionally detached. I had already (at his advice) cut way back on participation in extended family events. I stopped participating in his hobbies. I'm turning 50 later this year, Dad has been dead 2 years now. We finally reunited within a month of his succumbing to cancer. 

Don''t wait that long to fix things with your son. Patch it up. Shovel on the praise. Make sure he knows that you are happy with what he is doing, because you are. Sure he will probably make more mistakes, don't punish him in advance. 

This is a sad story, I hope it helps you. I don't know how to advise you. It is important to your Daughter to reward her. Rewarding her should not diminish your son, but it probably will, you know that. Yes, I would reward him at the same time, with something, so he can join the family in celebrating your daughters success. 

The end of the story, I was approved and rewarded in the end. What I got in the way of reward greatly overshadows what my siblings have received. That is not important to me. I would rather have had the approval and support when I needed it most. The anger and hurt are gone. I've learned a lot from dad. I've forgiven him of the mistakes that are natural to a man who is doing a difficult job for the first time with a kid who was so different from him. In essence when he died (before he died actually) he gave me everything he had. Then after he died Mom threw in the boats. 

MN


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## Cooper (Apr 18, 2008)

Mr. Nail said:


> Cooper if you weren't seriously contemplating making adjustments to your plans, I wouldn't.
> 
> Even at this point I struggle. This is quite painful for me. From the Age of 10 through the age of 40 ish, I struggled with getting approval from my father. I did not use drugs or commit crimes. I was the second Child and oldest son. All of this is important and has bearing on the situation. I was viciously abused by a gang of children about my age, around the time this all started. There was also a School teacher who was incompetent and used cruelty to inspire me, as he had no tools to address my learning difference. Over the following 8 years. I struggled through a lot of recovery issues and personality adjustments. But behind it all was this lack of approval from the one man / role model / mentor who should have had my back.
> 
> ...


Thank you for sharing Mr. Nail, that'a a powerful and thought provoking story. I know from my own childhood how hard some of those emotional memories can be. 

Long story short...my sons' self esteem and confidence took a big hit because of some of his actions the last few years, and one of the things I have been really focused on is helping him rebuild his 
self worth. Considering his feelings is what prompted my questioning the gift idea to begin with. 

Another thought I had was a nice vacation, let my daughter pick the destination as her gift and then my son can come with us. Sounds like a better option than the car gift.

Thanks again for everyones thoughts.


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

How about they vacation as a reward for all the hardwork both of them have done. Pulling yourself back together is no easy task.


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## SunnyT (Jun 22, 2011)

I vote for the family vacation.


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## Married but Happy (Aug 13, 2013)

Blondilocks said:


> Perhaps you can ask you son's opinion of what would be helpful to daughter as she starts her new life. He may suggest a new car or a down payment on a condo. If he is included in the decision making, he may not be resentful. No guarantees, though. If he was a doting big brother, things would go more smoothly.


This is a great idea. Gifts don't always have to be equal. IMO, they should depend on both need and achievement as well as love. The usual problem with unequal gifts is the perception of the recipients - or the one not receiving one. Including them in the decision making process can usually prevent this, and let them know why the decision is made.


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## firebelly1 (Jul 9, 2013)

I think the idea of a family vacation is a great compromise...and I'm really glad someone is talking about adult kids 'cause that's where I'm at. You have unleashed the Kraken. Just warning you.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

The thing about graduation gifts is that someone has to graduate to get one. People who make good choices get good things. People who make bad choices....not so much. That's the message your son should take from this. If he ever graduates from college, it would be appropriate to give him a graduation gift. You gave him a job and he's working acceptably. The proper reward for that is a paycheck. I assume he's getting one. Got nothing to do with who loves whom the most. That's childish thinking. Your son decides the rewards or punishments he gets in life. Drinking and drugging were more important than studying to him, so she's walking down the aisle and getting a diploma and he's not. That wasn't your choice. That was his. Kids under 10 might be fixated on "fair". Adults understand that word pertains to a carnival-like place where people get blue ribbons for pigs and pies. In the real world, people generally "get" according to their efforts and choices.


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## the2ofus (Jan 28, 2014)

unbelievable said:


> The thing about graduation gifts is that someone has to graduate to get one. People who make good choices get good things. People who make bad choices....not so much. That's the message your son should take from this. If he ever graduates from college, it would be appropriate to give him a graduation gift. You gave him a job and he's working acceptably. The proper reward for that is a paycheck. I assume he's getting one. Got nothing to do with who loves whom the most. That's childish thinking. Your son decides the rewards or punishments he gets in life. Drinking and drugging were more important than studying to him, so she's walking down the aisle and getting a diploma and he's not. That wasn't your choice. That was his. Kids under 10 might be fixated on "fair". Adults understand that word pertains to a carnival-like place where people get blue ribbons for pigs and pies. In the real world, people generally "get" according to their efforts and choices.


But he is putting in effort now, he is making good choices.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Cooper said:


> But does that send the wrong message to my son? I don't want my son to feel like I am disappointed in him or love him less.


IMO, it sends the exact RIGHT message to him. They both had choices and she chose the smarter path, and she earns her rewards earlier in life. He is STARTING to get his rewards by FINALLY doing a good job and earning his rewards. His will appear later in life, given his late approach to the right decisions.

That's an invaluable lesson for him to learn. And you can communicate that to him quite clearly. As long as you're not afraid to tell him the truth.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

the2ofus said:


> But he is putting in effort now, he is making good choices.


And he will START to receive benefits, NOW that he is making good choices. He has a lot of catching up to do. The best thing for him is to learn that.


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## unbelievable (Aug 20, 2010)

the2ofus said:


> But he is putting in effort now, he is making good choices.


And he is receiving the rewards one would expect from the effort he is putting forth. He's getting fairly paid for his labor. If he was graduation gifts he knows how to apply to a University. If he wants a Superbowl ring, he needs to play football. If he wants airborne wings, he needs to join the Army and jump out of planes. You aren't the captain of his ship. He is.


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