# CIA director resigns over extramarital affair



## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

So you gotta wonder about the backstory on this one. Talk about 'exposure' !!!

CIA director David Petraeus submits resignation over extramarital affair – This Just In - CNN.com Blogs


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

You think someone in the media was going to break the story and out the affair for him and that's why he's publicly acknowleding the affair as the reason for stepping down instead of the usual "I want to spend more time with my family" line.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Coffee Amore said:


> You think someone in the media was going to break the story and out the affair for him and that's why he's publicly acknowleding the affair as the reason for stepping down instead of the usual "I want to spend more time with my family" line.


Yes...I have no idea who or how he was going to be exposed, whether by his own wife, a betrayed lover, a colleague, or the media--but someone was going to do it. I can't imagine he simply resigned on principle.

There is more to this story--but how much more we will find out, I wonder, given that it involves the CIA director.


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## walkonmars (Aug 21, 2012)

Otta send a message about keeping affairs secret. 
IF the CIA honcho can't ... well


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## Kasler (Jul 20, 2012)

Well with the temperaments and actions of the Secret Service, no surprise there.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

A West Point graduate, a 4-star General, distinguished career...now he'll be remembered for this. His poor wife. I Googled her. After seeing her picture I just know Joe Public out there will say she had it coming because she's plus sized. That's just the unkind and stupid comments people make when something like this makes the news.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

When you're that high up in the intelligence community lifestyles matter. The questions on the polygraphs that you have to take to maintain your clearance get very intrusive. There is definitely a back story there. Probably something that compromises his effectiveness as a leader in that organization. Those guys can't act like the rest of us.


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## Gabriel (May 10, 2011)

I wonder if him, or is BS is someone on this board.....


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

2asdf2 said:


> Oh, but they do!!!
> 
> .


And he wasn't counseled by HR. He was asked to leave.


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## MattMatt (May 19, 2012)

Coffee Amore said:


> You think someone in the media was going to break the story and out the affair for him and that's why he's publicly acknowleding the affair as the reason for stepping down instead of the usual "I want to spend more time with my family" line.


Unless his line would be: "I want to spend more time with someone else's family?"


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Taken from her interview



> “Yes, I wear a number of hats,” said Broadwell. “But my most important title is mom and wife.”


Really ?


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

An interesting interview

Paula Broadwell, David Petraeus' Biographer, On Daily Show - Business Insider


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## Tony55 (Jun 8, 2012)

It just goes to show that you can't put two people of the opposite sex together for extended periods of time and expect nothing to happen. If one is vulnerable (a male in his 60's) and the other is highly motivated (a female in her 40's and West Point graduate) you've all but fired the blasting cap that detonates the explosion.

I'm sure there'll be more to this story, but the basic ingredients won't change, a younger woman flattering an older powerful man, or an older powerful man wooing a younger woman, either way, it all turns out the same.

It's just a shame.

T


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> An interesting interview
> 
> Paula Broadwell, David Petraeus' Biographer, On Daily Show - Business Insider


It was really interesting. Thanks for sharing.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

Camarillo Brillo said:


> Here is what I don't understand. I just watched the news update on this and they showed pics of the guy. He looks like a total dweeb. I understand he has power and all, but I still don't understand how a much younger woman would mess around with someone so far below her physically.
> 
> I have zero plans to cheat, but if I did it would be with a hot smokin babe. Not someone many steps below my wife.
> 
> I just don't get it.


According the General is very much into fitness. He supposedly runs a 6 minute mile. He isn't Brad Pitt, but he's fit, he has a lot of power and men with power attract women like her. John Edwards attracted his videographer and Petraeus his biographer. Older powerful man and younger attractive woman...that combination has been around forever. Her husband is her age, good looking and a doctor. I feel for him too.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Coffee Amore said:


> Her husband is her age, good looking and a doctor. I feel for him too.


He has to be a walking zombie right now, assuming he's been loyal and was blindsided by all this.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

Could this be the BH of Petraeus' Other Woman?
A Message From Beyond - NYTimes.com

MY WIFE’S LOVER

My wife is having an affair with a government executive. His role is to manage a project whose progress is seen worldwide as a demonstration of American leadership. (This might seem hyperbolic, but it is not an exaggeration.) I have met with him on several occasions, and he has been gracious. (I doubt if he is aware of my knowledge.) I have watched the affair intensify over the last year, and I have also benefited from his generosity. He is engaged in work that I am passionate about and is absolutely the right person for the job. I strongly feel that exposing the affair will create a major distraction that would adversely impact the success of an important effort. My issue: Should I acknowledge this affair and finally force closure? Should I suffer in silence for the next year or two for a project I feel must succeed? Should I be “true to my heart” and walk away from the entire miserable situation and put the episode behind me? NAME WITHHELD


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Lest we forget that Obama has a pretty well documented history of tossing ALL his dutiful water carriers on the fire when it suits him. Loyalty is not his long suit. Petraeus took what was a demotion to bail out Obama after he fired Stanley McChrystal. Petraeus then bailed Obama out again when Panetta moved to replace Gates. What he could have done if he was a decent human being was quietly told the FBI to back off and gently told Petraeus to retire after lining up his replacement. But instead this has Valerie Jarrett's fingerprints all over it. She who on Wednesday of this week shrieked "We won, you lost, our friends are our friends and our enemies will be punished!!! We don't forget and neither will you!" Petraeus had a less than earnest response to the White House's nonsense about Bengazi and he was terminated with extreme prejudice. 

Meanwhile Obama's friend, Kathryn Bigelow was given highly classified information in order to make her "I killed Osama" movie which aired two days before election day. This is what happens when your leader has a narcissistic personality disorder.

EDIT: THAT movie is not the one that was aired. That was the Harvey Weinstein production. Bigelow's movie is slated for release next month.


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## hurtingbadly (Sep 14, 2011)

Tony55 said:


> I'm sure there'll be more to this story, but the basic ingredients won't change, a younger woman flattering an older powerful man, or an older powerful man wooing a younger woman, either way, it all turns out the same.
> 
> It's just a shame.
> 
> T


My life!


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## Peony55555 (Nov 4, 2012)

Goes to show the power of attraction. A man this accomplished, probably one of THE most disciplined men in the world caves.....could make a person very cynical.


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## river rat (Jan 20, 2012)

This story has been played out over and over in the halls of power. The people at that level have mega egos and sense of entitlement. What the general did is deplorable. However, that said, I think that his resignation may have more to do with international politics and the blame game over the recent failures in the middle east. After all, the FBI investigating the CIA? That has secondary agenda written all over it.


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## Tony55 (Jun 8, 2012)

Camarillo Brillo said:


> Here is what I don't understand. I just watched the news update on this and they showed pics of the guy. He looks like a total dweeb. I understand he has power and all, but I still don't understand how a much younger woman would mess around with someone so far below her physically.
> 
> I have zero plans to cheat, but if I did it would be with a hot smokin babe. Not someone many steps below my wife.
> 
> I just don't get it.


She needed his story for a book she was writing about him. She got the story, the book was published, she dumped him.

T


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## Shaggy (Jul 17, 2011)

Have a look at the OM in ths case. She's ex military, military intelligence at that, as a phd, and husband is surgeon I believe, she also has two young children, who she git hubby to care for as she ran off to Afghanistan to "research" her book. She's appears to have had a relationship of some sort with him for years.

Clearly both OW and he are over achieving type As who no doubt felt confident that they were entitled to do it.

Feel bad for her kids.

Both of them hopefully will hopefully not profit nicely from this an write some crappy book about their experiences being cheating trash.


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## Tony55 (Jun 8, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> Meanwhile Obama's friend, Kathryn Bigelow was given highly classified information in order to make her "I killed Osama" movie which aired two days before election day. This is what happens when your leader has a narcissistic personality disorder.


*And this is what happens when a person is too narrow-minded to study ALL the facts about something before they spew their ideologically driven rhetoric.*

One more note: that movie you reference had so many mistakes in it that it was virtually un-watchable in my opinion. I doubt they produced it with too much "highly classified information".

T


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> He has to be a walking zombie right now, assuming he's been loyal and was blindsided by all this.


He has been humiliated nationwide.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Tony55 said:


> She needed his story for a book she was writing about him. She got the story, the book was published, she dumped him.
> 
> T


I think it was the other way... This guy used her to get more publicity and PR for his eventual presidential aspirations....This woman was nothing more than a quick fling and a good PR tool. Th

This review of the book on Rolling Stone(which happened before the affair) is very insightful

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/blogs/national-affairs/the-legend-of-david-petraeus-20120131

This part


> He reappeared as a brilliant strategist in a 2008 snoozer called Tell Me How This Ends by Linda Robinson. (Soon after publishing the book, Robinson, a reporter for U.S. News and World Report, went on to take a job working for Petraeus as an analyst at the U.S. Central Command.)



This woman is a your narcissistic over achiever who would sleep if it will get her way....(Like that Reese Witherspoon character in Election)....


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## DTO (Dec 18, 2011)

sandc said:


> When you're that high up in the intelligence community lifestyles matter. The questions on the polygraphs that you have to take to maintain your clearance get very intrusive. There is definitely a back story there. Probably something that compromises his effectiveness as a leader in that organization. Those guys can't act like the rest of us.


Agree. This seems similar to the issue with those Secret Service agents being drunk and visiting prostitutes. Screwing around like this (something needing to be kept secret and likely to bring shame) makes you vulnerable to blackmail and compromise.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

snap said:


> He has been humiliated nationwide.


He'll be fine. He'll write a book, do speaking engagements, after a year or two a 'consultant' job with CNN. Hell, in this day and age he can still run for President.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

Runs like Dog said:


> He'll be fine. He'll write a book, do speaking engagements, after a year or two a 'consultant' job with CNN. Hell, in this day and age he can still run for President.


No, that doctor husband..


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

Once again I am reminded of how awesome affairs are. Yay affairs!


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## Tony55 (Jun 8, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> I think it was the other way... This guy used her to get more publicity and PR for his eventual presidential aspirations....This woman was nothing more than a quick fling and a good PR tool.


I read the FBI went through his emails after suspecting she had access to them and saw where she dumped him and he followed with "thousands" of emails to her. I don't know how true the "thousands" description is, but the rest sounds plausible.


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## Tony55 (Jun 8, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> EDIT: THAT movie is not the one that was aired. That was the Harvey Weinstein production. Bigelow's movie is slated for release next month.


Ok, the movie you're talking about is the one called Zero Dark Thirty, which comes out in December. From what I saw on the previews that one looks highly accurate. Stealth Blackhawks, the very quiet ground game by SEALS as the breach the compound, 4 lens night vision ($65,000 a piece), separating bin Laden wife's and kids to question them, even the part where the female CIA tells them 100% that he's there.

I recently read two books, No Easy Day, written by one of the SEALS, and The Finish, written by the guy who wrote Blackhawk Down; the movie seems in line with those books (from what I can tell from the previews). I highly recommend those books by the way.

T


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## Broken at 20 (Sep 25, 2012)

I am not going to defend the guy or say that he was right, but I can't help but wonder,

What was the state of his marriage? We don't really get any hint at what it looked like. 

I also wonder...I always would've thought that being in the CIA is extremely stressful. You age twice as fast due to the stress (or so I've heard). So I thought the affair would be brought by constantly being stressed, away from you wife all the time, and wanting an outlet. Not saying that is right, but maybe, I could be more sympathetic if that was the case. 
But he was working on a biography...and I imagine that was probably happening in his office, his comfy office that he drives to everyday after waking up in his house/apartment with his wife...

Makes me wonder...


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Tony55 said:


> I read the FBI went through his emails after suspecting she had access to them and saw where she dumped him and he followed with "thousands" of emails to her. I don't know how true the "thousands" description is, but the rest sounds plausible.


Is it? I read that the affair started in May and ended in Sept 2011 just before he swore in and started the job. I was assuming that he must have ended it ..


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

I wonder how this will affect this woman's career.. I think this woman stands to lose more than the guy....This book was her Ph.D dissertation, right ?


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## dblkman (Jul 14, 2010)

Runs like Dog said:


> Lest we forget that Obama has a pretty well documented history of tossing ALL his dutiful water carriers on the fire when it suits him. Loyalty is not his long suit. Petraeus took what was a demotion to bail out Obama after he fired Stanley McChrystal. Petraeus then bailed Obama out again when Panetta moved to replace Gates. What he could have done if he was a decent human being was quietly told the FBI to back off and gently told Petraeus to retire after lining up his replacement. But instead this has Valerie Jarrett's fingerprints all over it. She who on Wednesday of this week shrieked "We won, you lost, our friends are our friends and our enemies will be punished!!! We don't forget and neither will you!" Petraeus had a less than earnest response to the White House's nonsense about Bengazi and he was terminated with extreme prejudice.
> 
> Meanwhile Obama's friend, Kathryn Bigelow was given highly classified information in order to make her "I killed Osama" movie which aired two days before election day. This is what happens when your leader has a narcissistic personality disorder.
> 
> EDIT: THAT movie is not the one that was aired. That was the Harvey Weinstein production. Bigelow's movie is slated for release next month.


So what u are saying is even though he had an affair he should get a "pass"? Ok this is a man just like any other man, he messed up now HE must face the music. As much as some preach expose why should he be given an exception? As my dad used to say "he is a man just like me and put his pants on one leg at a time just like me". What's good for the goose is good for the gander


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## Tony55 (Jun 8, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> Is it? I read that the affair started in May and ended in Sept 2011 just before he swore in and started the job. I was assuming that he must have ended it ..


Now I just read that the investigation started when a second female complained that she was getting threatening emails from Ms Broadwell.


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

Broken at 20 said:


> I am not going to defend the guy or say that he was right, but I can't help but wonder,
> 
> What was the state of his marriage? We don't really get any hint at what it looked like.
> 
> ...


Really? Sympathy for a CHEATER because his life is likely stressful? Are you kidding me? The first part of the statement in bold is the only part of it that is important, in ANY cheating case.... *IT IS NOT RIGHT* no matter HOW anyone tries to spin it. I don't care HOW bad the marriage is. If you are tempted to cheat, gtfo. NO excuse. NONE! And, I really don't give a damn about whether his wife was "smoking hot" or "plus sized" (which she is). It makes no difference. He was wrong to cheat, PERIOD. Just because some of us are overweight/plus-sized, doesn't mean we deserve to be cheated on. We deserve to be respected just as anyone else. NO ONE deserves to be treated that way... *NO ONE!!!*


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## Harken Banks (Jun 12, 2012)

Maricha is right. Let's watch this play out a bit. She went after him. He took the bait and the fall.


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

"The beginning of the end came for CIA Director David Petraeus when Paula Broadwell, a younger married woman with whom he was having an affair, “or someone close to her had sought access to his email,” according to the Wall Street Journal’s description of an FBI probe."

Why David Petraeus’s Gmail account is a national security issue


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## Tony55 (Jun 8, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> Is it? I read that the affair started in May and ended in Sept 2011 just before he swore in and started the job. I was assuming that he must have ended it ..


"Broadwell broke off the affair with the 60-year-old Petraeus after he was sworn in as CIA director on Sept. 6, 2011, but he continued to pursue her with numerous e-mails, the Newsmax report said."​
This was from the New York Post quoting Newsmax. (I don't consider the New York Post very reliable though, so who knows).


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Tony55 said:


> Now I just read that the investigation started when a second female complained that she was getting threatening emails from Ms Broadwell.


link?


edit: found it


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

I'm sure someone will start a new thread for this, but they're dropping like flies out there

Lockheed Martin ousts CEO-to-be over relationship with employee | Nation/World | Detroit Free Press | freep.com

found that after reading this analysis comparing the two.

Knowing the US media, we're going to be subjected to several weeks' worth of analysis over whether it's okay to fire someone over adultery...

Why the Petraeus and Kubasik Affairs Are Different - Businessweek


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

I had enormous respect for David Petraeus, for many years, and it's disheartening to find out that he's just a piece of sh1t ... AND ... he was cheating with an even bigger piece of sh1t .. Paula Broadwell.


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> I wonder how this will affect this woman's career.. I think this woman stands to lose more than the guy....This book was her Ph.D dissertation, right ?


She deserves to loose everything .. if for no other reason than what this did to her husband and kids. When all the dirt comes out I'm willing to bet her husband knew all about it but was scared sh1t to say anything because of the CIA and Military ties.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

Coffee Amore said:


> Could this be the BH of Petraeus' Other Woman?
> A Message From Beyond - NYTimes.com
> 
> MY WIFE’S LOVER
> ...



That's a GREAT catch on your part. I think you very well could be right.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

dblkman said:


> So what u are saying is even though he had an affair he should get a "pass"? Ok this is a man just like any other man, he messed up now HE must face the music. As much as some preach expose why should he be given an exception? As my dad used to say "he is a man just like me and put his pants on one leg at a time just like me". What's good for the goose is good for the gander


A pass? I'm not sure what exigent circumstances there are for us to make it a national affair that requires a full on kangaroo court replete with trials and tumbrel carts unless it rises to the level of an actual national threat. 

FDR, Eisenhower, JFK had girlfriends. The one time head of the CIA's counterintelligence service, James Jesus Angleton was a full on paranoid alcoholic who locked himself in his dark office for days at a time (and largely correct about his suspicions it turns out).

The wider issue and one that's plagued intelligence services in the US for a long time is that the head or titular head of an agency is a political appointee and not generally a professional from inside the services - at least on the civilian side of the house; the DIA and NSA are structured quite differently for example.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

this is what Reuters is saying. This story is totally evolving and it will be quite a while before we know the truth.

FBI probe of Petraeus began with suspicious emails | Reuters


The FBI investigation that led to the discovery of CIA Director David Petraeus' affair with author Paula Broadwell was sparked by "suspicious emails" that initially did not contain any connection to Petraeus, U.S. law enforcement and security officials told Reuters on Saturday.

But the CIA director's name unexpectedly turned up in the course of the investigation, two officials and two other sources briefed on the matter said.

It was "an issue with two women and they stumbled across the affair with Petraeus," a U.S. government security source said.

The Washington Post reported on Saturday that the FBI probe was triggered when Broadwell sent threatening emails to an unidentified woman close to the CIA director.

The woman went to the FBI, which traced the threats to Broadwell and then uncovered explicit emails between Petraeus and Broadwell, the Post said

Attempts by Reuters and other news media to reach Broadwell, an Army reserve offer and author of a biography of Petraeus, have not been successful.

The FBI and CIA declined comment on Saturday.

Many questions in the case remain unanswered publicly, including the identity of the second woman; the precise nature of the emails that launched the FBI investigation; and whether U.S. security was compromised in any way.

Nor is it clear why the FBI waited until Election Day to tell U.S. Director of National Intelligence James Clapper, who oversees the CIA and other intelligence agencies, about its investigation involving Petraeus.

The CIA director announced his resignation suddenly on Friday, acknowledging an extramarital affair and saying he showed "extremely poor judgment.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Sorry, one more tidbit from the WSJ

Emails Led to FBI Probe in Petraeus Case - WSJ.com


Concerned that the emails Mr. Petraeus exchanged with Ms. Broadwell raised the possibility of a security breach, the FBI brought the matter up with Mr. Petraeus directly, according to the official. The FBI approached the CIA director because *his emails in the matter were in most instances sent from a personal account, not his CIA account*.*

Mr. Petraeus decided to quit, abruptly ending a high-profile career that might have culminated with a run for the presidency, a notion he was believed to be considering.



*edited to say: they've since found that they weren't sending emails, they had a joint gmail account and would write each other draft emails within that account. The account was apparently set up by Petraeus using a pseudonym.


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

Coffee Amore said:


> Could this be the BH of Petraeus' Other Woman?
> A Message From Beyond - NYTimes.com
> 
> MY WIFE’S LOVER
> ...


Did you read the stupid respose?

"..... The only motive for exposing the relationship would be to humiliate him and your wife, and that’s never a good reason for doing anything. This is between you and your spouse. You should tell her you want to separate, just as you would if she were sleeping with the mailman. ...... 

..... The fact that you’re willing to accept your wife’s infidelity for some greater political good is beyond honorable. In fact, it’s so over-the-top honorable that I’m not sure I believe your motives are real."


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

The Middleman said:


> Did you read the stupid respose?
> 
> "..... The only motive for exposing the relationship would be to humiliate him and your wife, and that’s never a good reason for doing anything. This is between you and your spouse. You should tell her you want to separate, just as you would if she were sleeping with the mailman. ......
> 
> ..... The fact that you’re willing to accept your wife’s infidelity for some greater political good is beyond honorable. In fact, it’s so over-the-top honorable that I’m not sure I believe your motives are real."


Unfortunately, par for the course, wouldn't you say?

"This between you and your spouse," yeah...until she brought someone else into the marriage. You know, that other guy.


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> Unfortunately, par for the course, wouldn't you say?
> 
> "This between you and your spouse," yeah...until she brought someone else into the marriage. You know, that other guy.


If I were her husband I'd be on TV with the kids in my lap telling the world what a sneaky, hurtful b1tch she was and how evil Petraeus is for going after a woman who is married with small children.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Another tidbit from the Boston Globe

Official: Emails from paramour led to FBI probe - News - Boston.com



> Broadwell, who is married with two young sons, has not responded to multiple emails and phone messages. Broadwell planned to celebrate her 40th birthday party in Washington this weekend, with many reporters invited. But her husband emailed guests to cancel the event late Friday.


Yes, the idea did occur to me...what if the story had broken during the party? They were only off by less than 24 hours.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

warlock07 said:


> I wonder how this will affect this woman's career.. I think this woman stands to lose more than the guy....This book was her Ph.D dissertation, right ?


I think the book was her Ph.D dissertation. She ruined what could have been a great career for herself. Now her credibility is shattered. People will wonder how much of her achievements were the result of sleeping her way to the top. 

However, I don't feel any sympathy for her. Only for Mrs. Petraeus and the two Petraeus children; Dr. Broadwell and two sons.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

You knew there had to be a facebook angle. And no, her page hasn't been taken down, although there isn't much to see beyond the poor folks who had friended her because she didn't change her settings.

Yet more security concerns emerge about Paula Broadwell’s access to Petraeus

the Post is quoting the AP, I think:



> But her access was unsettling to members of the secretive and compartmentalized intelligence agency, where husbands and wives often work in different divisions, but share nothing with each other when they come home because they don’t “need to know.”
> 
> In one incident that caught CIA staff by surprise, Broadwell posted a photograph on her Facebook page of Petraeus with actress Angelina Jolie, taken in his 7th floor office where only the official CIA photographer is permitted to take photos. Petraeus had apparently given Broadwell the photo just hours after it was taken.


That Post story is still preoccupied with the idea that Broadwell, "or someone close to her" had tried to get into Petraeus' account as I believe someone has already mentioned.


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## dblkman (Jul 14, 2010)

Runs like Dog said:


> A pass? I'm not sure what exigent circumstances there are for us to make it a national affair that requires a full on kangaroo court replete with trials and tumbrel carts unless it rises to the level of an actual national threat.
> 
> FDR, Eisenhower, JFK had girlfriends. The one time head of the CIA's counterintelligence service, James Jesus Angleton was a full on paranoid alcoholic who locked himself in his dark office for days at a time (and largely correct about his suspicions it turns out).
> 
> The wider issue and one that's plagued intelligence services in the US for a long time is that the head or titular head of an agency is a political appointee and not generally a professional from inside the services - at least on the civilian side of the house; the DIA and NSA are structured quite differently for example.


I wouldn't care if he was the prez or anyone else an affair is affair....period, he deserves no more respect than any other wayward.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Well--and I will try to shut up now--this story is clearly going to have some legs as far as government-watching / scandal following nerds go. I'm just starting to realize what a social media user Broadwell was. She had a twitter account, and I'm sure as we speak people are dissecting it--

her last tweet was to Petraeus' "leadership maxims" or something like that (talk about fawning)

and she also had a smug tweet back in August to Drudge that said



> @DRUDGE_REPORT Your speculation about @petraeus as a Romney VP pic is full of non-truths (but I guess you figured that out)!


which is downright creepy in retrospect. She left quite a paper trail, I'm sure it's all going to get hung out like the dirty laundry that it is.

Still no word on who the 'other other woman' was.


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## Peony55555 (Nov 4, 2012)

michzz said:


> This jerk's affair has nothing to do with Obama.
> 
> It has to do with his sense of entitlement and lack of personal integrity.
> 
> I'm sure that this is not his first rodeo.


I think it's his first rodeo....the ow must have vision problems


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Well they figured out who the "other other woman" was...that took all of one day. I'm sure we'll hear some more about that soon enough. [Edited to say, see my next post--apparently she isn't another OW, but her actions did lead to the exposure of the affair, it sounds like.]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...ndal-fbi-whistleblower-talked-first-to-house/



Lots more articles...NYT ran a puff piece on Broadwell

Beyond Paula Broadwell's TV Interviews, a Family-Focused Life - NYTimes.com



> There, neighbors say, Ms. Broadwell is the soccer mom, married to a radiologist, who serves her family dinner by candlelight and walks her two boys to the bus stop every morning before school. She is the nice woman in the two-story brick house who wore a costume to hand out candy on Halloween.
> 
> She is the friendly neighbor who organized an impromptu backyard barbecue to welcome newcomers to the neighborhood. She is the super-busy woman who raises money for veterans’ support groups and takes time to mentor her friends’ children — especially girls — by reading their school papers and introducing them to soldiers they might interview.
> 
> “It wasn’t uncommon to look in their dining room at night and see the candles lit as they were eating,”said Sarah Curme, a neighbor and friend. “Nobody put Paula on a pedestal; it was more about Paula the neighbor, the mom and the wife than it was about everything else she did.”


(This is partly due to the fact that the NYT had sent someone to Charlotte to stake out her house, but they, being savvy, have not been at home.)

Her friend quoted above had more to say:



> Ms. Curme, who said she was in touch with Ms. Broadwell by text message and e-mail on Saturday, said the Broadwells are “very united and will get through” the emotional turmoil of an infidelity that is playing out in public view.
> 
> “Obviously she has made a mistake,” Ms. Curme said, “but I really do believe she is probably better equipped than about anybody I know to figure her way out of this in a really positive way, without destroying anybody. That’s just not her nature. Whatever has happened, I suspect Paula will step up and take accountability, and nurture her family.”


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

So for those having a hard time keeping track--the affair was exposed because someone complained to the FBI about harrassing emails from Broadwell, the OW. That "someone" was just revealed today to be (together with that person's husband) "longtime friends of Petraeus and wife, Holly." They are also saying there was no affair between this woman and Petraeus, so she wasn't the OW's rival, more like someone highly motivated to have the affair exposed.



> A former associate of Petraeus confirmed the target of the emails . . . but said there was no affair between the two, speaking on condition of anonymity to discuss the retired general's private life. The associate . . . has been in touch with Petraeus since his resignation


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...roadwell-emails-david-petraeus_n_2114434.html

So you have to wonder, if this woman was perhaps telling Broadwell to butt out of Petraeus' marriage, and Broadwell misstepped by sending emails that were bad enough that the FBI started an investigation into the whole situation.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

It's nice to know Paula isn't the run of the mill OW. 
If she really sent those emails she sounds like the bunny boiler type OW. 

Ms Kelley and Paula have a certain superficial physical resemblance and both are married to doctors. Just noticed that random bit of information.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

> A person who knows both Mrs Kelley and Petraeus confirmed their friendship and said she saw him often.


hmm..


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## Tony55 (Jun 8, 2012)

"Kelley, based at JSOC's Tampa headquarters, was described as a close friend of Petraeus. Officials have said that Broadwell considered the woman she emailed as a rival for the retired general's affections."

LA Times


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

Coffee Amore said:


> Ms Kelley and Paula have a certain superficial physical resemblance and both are married to doctors. Just noticed that random bit of information.


Well we know Paula is married to a Cuckold, is Ms. Kelly?


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Another more thorough article. The asterisks represent huge chunks of the article I cut out (not infidelity-relevant, but interesting reading if you care about the political / national security angles).

Petraeus Affair Puts Scrutiny on FBI - WSJ.com

A State Department official's complaints about email stalking launched the monthslong criminal inquiry that led to a woman romantically linked to former Gen. David Petraeus and to his abrupt resignation Friday as Central Intelligence Agency chief.

The emails began arriving in Jill Kelley's inbox in May, U.S. officials familiar with the probe said. A State Department political adviser for a U.S. military command in Tampa, Fla., Ms. Kelley told the Federal Bureau of Investigation about the emails, which she viewed as harassing, the U.S. officials said.

That FBI investigation into who sent the emails led over a period of months to Paula Broadwell, Mr. Petraeus's biographer, with whom he was having an extramarital affair, according to the U.S. officials. 

FBI agents were pursuing what they thought was a potential cybercrime, or a breach of classified information.

*Instead, the trail led to what officials said were sexually explicit emails between two lovers,* *from an account Mr. Petraeus used a pseudonym to establish*, and to the destruction of Mr. Petraeus's painstakingly crafted image as a storied Army general.

Mr. Petraeus admitted to an affair in a letter to CIA employees announcing his resignation.

************

That Mr. Petraeus was having an affair wasn't the point of the FBI probe, according to the U.S. officials briefed on the matter.

*The FBI investigation began with five to 10 emails beginning around May and received by Ms. Kelley, according to U.S. officials.*

*The precise nature of Ms. Kelley's relationships with Ms. Broadwell and Mr. Petraeus, who ran the Tampa-based U.S. Central Command from 2008 to 2010, weren't known Sunday. *Attempts to reach Ms. Broadwell and Ms. Kelley were unsuccessful. Neither had given a public statement as of Sunday evening.

*Ms. Kelley didn't know who sent the emails. Some appeared to be accusing her of an inappropriate relationship but didn't name Mr. Petraeus.*

*Agents determined the emails were sent from an account shared by Ms. Broadwell and her husband, who live in North Carolina, the officials said.*

*But the agents spent weeks piecing together who may have sent them. They used metadata footprints left by the emails to determine what locations they were sent from. They matched the places, including hotels, where Ms. Broadwell was during the times the emails were sent.*

*FBI agents and federal prosecutors used the information as probable cause to seek a warrant to monitor Ms. Broadwell's email accounts.*

*They learned that Ms. Broadwell and Mr. Petraeus had set up private Gmail accounts to use for their communications, which included explicit details of a sexual nature, according to U.S. officials. But because Mr. Petraeus used a pseudonym, agents doing the monitoring didn't immediately uncover that he was the one communicating with Ms. Broadwell.*

By late summer, after the monitoring of Ms. Broadwell's emails uncovered the link to Mr. Petraeus, prosecutors and agents alerted senior officials at FBI and the Justice Department, including Mr. Holder, U.S. officials say. *The investigators never monitored Mr. Petraeus's email accounts, the officials say.*

In September, prosecutors and agents began a legal analysis to determine whether there were any charges that could be brought. Among the discussions: whether to interview Ms. Broadwell, who was the focus of the criminal probe, and Mr. Petraeus.

Top officials signed off on the interviews, which occurred in late September and October, just before the U.S. presidential election. *During Ms. Broadwell's first interview in September, she admitted to the affair and turned over her computer, the officials said.*

On her computer, investigators found classified documents, the U.S. officials said, a discovery that raised new concerns.

At Mr. Petraeus's interview in the week before the election, he also admitted the affair and said he hadn't provided the classified documents to Ms. Broadwell. Agents conducted a second interview with Ms. Broadwell on Nov. 2. She also said Mr.Petraeus wasn't the source of the documents.

That information helped resolve concerns that there was a national-security breach, although the source of the documents hadn't been determined.

***********

*The affair ended more than four months ago, though Mr. Petraeus continued to advise Ms. Broadwell on her research into innovation in the 101st Airborne Division in Northern Iraq in 2003, which then- Maj. Gen. Petraeus commanded.*

**********


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## Will_Kane (Feb 26, 2012)

It took the FBI four months - from May to August - to uncover the details of the affair, and they had a court order that allowed them to gather all evidence and monitor emails. That has to be discouraging for the posters on this board who are trying to find out what their spouses are up to.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

So which one is Claire Danes?


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

So now they're starting to try to figure out when the affair started. 

Someone is saying it started "two months" after he became CIA director.
Friend: Petraeus began affair after taking CIA job

The reason this matters is that he could be punished by the military if the affair occurred then.
David Petraeus Affair: Adultery Punishable in the Military - ABC News


I doubt that will happen, and this is just more media stuff to sell papers. But the infidelity angle is still interesting / relevant, as there are so many members of the military who come to the forum with a spouse who is cheating on them with another member of the military. Who knows? Maybe they will feel compelled to create some sort of example out of him, as he already did for himself at the CIA (resigning because, supposedly, lower level staff might be fired for similar activity, per news stories).


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## Chris Taylor (Jul 22, 2010)

I have a hard time believing ANYTHING that has been published so far (and I'm far from a conspiracy theorist).

FBI investigating emails? Like they have nothing better to do?

I bet someone (political or military rival) dropped a dime on Patreus and that started the investigation.

Can't wait for the movie


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Chris Taylor said:


> I have a hard time believing ANYTHING that has been published so far (and I'm far from a conspiracy theorist).
> 
> FBI investigating emails? Like they have nothing better to do?
> 
> ...


(See below--the following paragraph may not be true) The reason I believe it is that the person receiving the harrassing emails is employed by the State Department and presumably was receiving them via her work email. If I were a government employee and I received harrassing emails at work, I'd tell my superiors too, and they'd call the FBI / justice dept. because that's the federal police. There aren't any others.*

But they must have been pretty darn harrassing if indeed that's why the FBI investigated. No worries, they will turn up publicly soon enough, the way these things work nowadays.

As far as who will play who, I can say with confidence that Claire Danes will not be playing Jill Kelley. I'll leave the suggested casting for that role to someone else...


*EDITED TO SAY: it's unclear to me whether this paragraph is true, or not, because some of the articles are saying she's an honorary ambassador with an unpaid position. And as I say in a post on the top of the next page, the FBI that she contacted may have simply been a friend who works there. FURTHER UPDATE: they've confirmed she is not employed by the State Dept, that was early confusion before the media got its facts straight.


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## SweetAndSour (Feb 25, 2012)

Some high achiever people scares me.

There are some other high achievers that I love, such as my mom. My mom is a high achiever. She is a great mom, great wife, and a great daughter. At the end, her life is full of love and she is the most happy, emotionally full filled person that I know. I remember my dad hugging, kissing my mom too frequently for my early boyhood taste but now I know that they were great together, I wish I had a girl like that.

Today my mom takes care of her 90+ year old mom. My grandma has the financial means to go to a retirement home but stays with my mom. She is another great person that I am glad to know and proud to be her grandson. 

My grandma has some dirty, smelly accidents some days but it is no big deal, they two still enjoy their short time left together on this world. 

My mom also takes care of my two year old daughter, during day time. I love to see those three great women of mine together, hoping my daughter catching the "GOOD THING" from them. 

I am home when I am with them, I am HOME.

The fake general and his wh0re are the high achievers of the kind that scares me. Those are talented and narcissist people. 

Their talent makes them to have the power. Without a healthy soul that power is a bomb. Their narcissistic weakness is always there.

Fake General and the wh0re have fantastic resumes compare to my mom's. But my mom is a higher achiever for sure.

As a society, we have a wrong and cruel idea of what success is, who are the success full people ? We have the wrong role models who we impose on ourselves.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

So this is from a blog on NY Magazine's site, strongly implying that the whole investigation thing was driven by Kelley having an FBI agent friend.

Petraeus Investigation

reading this piece, the strong implication is that the underlying motive by the FBI agent was exposure of the affair (in answer to the author's rhetorical question). That's not to say that this article's premise is true, just that this is the theory being posited.

In my post above, I mentioned that she's a state dept. employee; while I had heard a number of places that she's an honorary ambassador, maybe that was confused by some of the new organizations. Edited to say: she is confirmed not to be a gov't employee


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## TCSRedhead (Oct 17, 2012)

My heart goes out to the BS' in these cases. It's painful enough to have this occur but to live it out in the public eye must take the torture to a new level.


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## daggeredheart (Feb 21, 2012)

Ok, here is a question...did Paula break into the gmail account of Petraeus to make it look like the emails were coming from his gmail? In a effort to "scare" off Jill? 

Where did Paula get the confidential documents from if not from the general? The plot thickens and reads like a novel. 

Worst part....all the comments on mainstream media blasting the looks of the wife (Holly)...it's really sad because the general is not considered "hot" in my book---


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## daggeredheart (Feb 21, 2012)

Wanted to add that it's not about looks and the fact that the commenter on article message boards are implying that because the wife is not as good look and young that the it was bound to happen...pffft. 

I really hope the betrayed spouses can find their emotional support but it sounds like it's almost "old news" to them.....maybe they are well into their healing.

Talk about careers going down in flames and what "exposure"


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

daggeredheart said:


> Ok, here is a question...did Paula break into the gmail account of Petraeus to make it look like the emails were coming from his gmail? In a effort to "scare" off Jill?


I don't think so. I think that Paula set up multiple "dummy" email accounts and typed up harrassing emails to Kelley via those accounts. Then the FBI used the metadata from those accounts to trace back who she was. Then they got permission to monitor her other "real" accounts. And that's how they found that there was a gmail account with someone emailing her sexually explicit stuff.** That gmail account had been registered under a pseudonym. That person turned out to be Petraeus. They were looking at IP data to show which computers were logged in for what, that's how they know who was doing it. For example, they could see that the harrassing emails were being sent via an Internet account that had been set up by the Broadwells. It took some more time (it's in a story I linked before, sorry, can't say which one) but they eventually were able to see that when the harrassing emails were sent, they were from a location where Paula was (which means, they were trying to sort whether it was Scott [Paula's H] sending them, or Paula).



> Where did Paula get the confidential documents from if not from the general? The plot thickens and reads like a novel.


She might have received them from someone else. But here's a story that strongly suggests he (Petraeus) was confiding in her inappropriately. And here's the thing about this story: she leaked stuff that had to come from Petraeus just a few weeks ago--when supposedly the affair (by other accounts) was ended by Petraeus 4 months ago. I wonder if 'ending the affair' is code for they stopped sleeping together. But surprise surprise (not), the emotional confidant component probably continued right up until the affair was publicly revealed.

Why did Paula Broadwell think the CIA had taken prisoners in Benghazi?*




> Worst part....all the comments on mainstream media blasting the looks of the wife (Holly)...it's really sad because the general is not considered "hot" in my book---


People can't resist plugging affairs into their standard hollywood view of how they work. From what I've read, Holly is a formidable person who can more than stand up for herself. I don't think she's to be pitied. Frankly, the stories make Petraeus out to be begging for his marriage. As he should be.



*the speech in this article--the link doesn't work because it was taken down by the U of Denver and has since been put back up, here is the working link:

http://www.politico.com/blogs/under...es-paula-broadwell-video-149317.html?hp=lh_b8

**They've since figured out (as mentioned below) that they weren't emailing one another; Broadwell has the password to Petraeus' pseudonym gmail account, and they read each other's draft emails within the account. The emails were never sent out of the account so there was no tracking of these emails.


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## daggeredheart (Feb 21, 2012)

hehe...funny comment from the linked article, 


"Man, this woman has "Astronaut in Diapers" written all over her. 

The old rule applies -- NEVER put your dck into crazy.


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## daggeredheart (Feb 21, 2012)

Boggles the mind how they never thought they would get caught.....especially at that high level????? Now the media is going over everything with a fine tooth comb and they will be dragged through the mud and back again.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

daggeredheart said:


> Boggles the mind how they never thought they would get caught.....especially at that high level????? Now the media is going over everything with a fine tooth comb and they will be dragged through the mud and back again.


I don't know. Already there is lots of stuff coming back in support of the two of them. I imagine there's a lot (because there always are) of people who think it's just "love" and that these two are being persecuted for something that is, after all, not a crime. Broadwell's dad is publicly saying "the truth will come out," sort of implying that she is some type of fall guy for other, probably political, stuff. And I've seen some comments daring to suggest that Obama should not have accepted Petraeus' resignation (after learning about Broadwell's speech that I mentioned above, he made the entirely correct call). 

But anyhow, the rehabilitiation wagon is already starting, all the news outlets are repeating the story that the affair supposedly started after he was at the CIA for 2 months. That is just ridiculously convenient for Petraeus, because it means that he can't be punished by the military if it's true.

On a lighter note, I've seen only one clever blogger describe Broadwell's book as the "unfortunately titled, _All In_." And other wags are commenting on how she was "embedded" with him for at least a year.

Cheaters aren't thinking too much about the consequences--they'd never cross the line to begin with, if they did.


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## Enginerd (May 24, 2011)

My conspiracy theory.......

Normally a senior military person would not have to resign due to an affair. It's typically handled in a nicer fashion for the top brass. This is about something else. Petraeus knows he will be called to testify about what happened in Benghazi and despite the affair he wouldn't want to lie under oath to congress. He may also know that the real Benghazi story may be damaging to Clinton and Obama so he wanted to avoid a conflict of interest since he answers to Obama. He outed himself because he was being pressured by the Obama adminstration to spin the Bengahzi facts and he didn't like it. The FBI could have done something about the affair couple of months ago but for some strange reason they didn't. Petraeus waited until after the election to resign because he was hoping that Obama would lose. He could then go to congress and tell the truth under a Republican adminstration that had nothing to lose over Benghazi. The Obama adminstration was using knowledge of the affair as leverage to shut him up. 

Ok tin foil hat off now.......


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## Maricha75 (May 8, 2012)

daggeredheart said:


> Worst part....all the comments on mainstream media blasting the looks of the wife (Holly)...it's really sad because the general is not considered "hot" in my book---


No kidding! I have read comment after comment that has, essentially, stated "well, if she wasn't fat, he wouldn't have cheated." Those people are so full of it, it's pathetic.I'd like to know how they explain away the "hot" spouses who get cheated on... they can't. They can't accept that there is no excuse to cheat... not weight gain, not weight loss, nothing.


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## daggeredheart (Feb 21, 2012)

Yeah, I mean look at hotties Jennifer Anniston, Sandra Bullock and women who cheat on famous and charismatic men ie Rod Stewart got ditched by Rachel Hunter. 

I think it's really about having the "opportunity" as opposed to anything to do much with the flaws of the spouse.


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## daggeredheart (Feb 21, 2012)

Saw this quote on Huffington-- Boylan, who says he spoke with Petraeus over the weekend, told NBC's "Today" show that Petraeus is "devastated." Boylan says "it's going to take a long time" for him to set things straight at home.

"He deeply regrets and know how much pain this causes his family," he said. He said the affair started about two months after he began as CIA director in September 2011. "This kind of evolved over time," he said. He added the relationship was a "colossal mistake."

Boylan, appearing Monday on ABC, said Petraeus' wife "is not exactly pleased right now. Furious would be an understatement."


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

HA!!! Although I'm not sure why I'm laughing.

Supposedly, these two lovebirds communicated via a shared gmail account, taking turns writing drafts that the other would read.

That is what my H did too.

So there are no emails to send to the outside world.

Hmmm, guess they didn't count on the one entity that could peer into that situation, i.e., the FBI with a warrant. (Or in my case, leaving your secret account open on the family home computer.)

I wonder if that is why it took them a while to id Petraeus. (Although the timing on when the FBI knew what seems rather slippery.)

Link is to a Washington Post website blog:
Here’s the e-mail trick Petraeus and Broadwell used to communicate




> They wrote their “intimate messages” as draft e-mails in a shared Gmail account, according to the AP, allowing them to see one anothers’ messages while leaving a much fainter data trail. When messages are sent and received, both accounts record the transmission as well as such metadata as the IP addresses on either end, something the two seemed to be seeking to avoid.
> 
> Petraeus and Broadwell apparently used a trick, known to terrorists and teen-agers alike, to conceal their email traffic, one of the law enforcement officials said.
> 
> Rather than transmitting emails to the other’s inbox, they composed at least some messages and instead of transmitting them, left them in a draft folder or in an electronic “dropbox,” the official said. Then the other person could log onto the same account and read the draft emails there. This avoids creating an email trail that is easier to trace.


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## daggeredheart (Feb 21, 2012)

Ouch- well hell, that certainly makes us BS have to think of yet "another" trick that WS's use to communicate. I would have never thought of such a thing.... 

Good thing many of us relied on old fashioned "gut" to figure out that we were being deceived. 

I've always joked with my spouse (prior to Dday) that I would have to cheat via smoke signals and tin can phones because he hacks for a living.... I wouldn't even make it a day before he could follow my bread crumbs.


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## Bellavista (May 29, 2012)

I think his wife should very publicly now divorce him! 

I am disgusted with the media saying his wife is fat & frumpy, poor woman not only has to deal with a very public blow to her marriage but has her image ridiculed & be blamed for her husband straying. She has to be at least late 50's in age.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> An interesting interview
> 
> Paula Broadwell, David Petraeus' Biographer, On Daily Show - Business Insider


I just watched a longer version of this video (posted on The Daily Show's website, I think) and didn't realize that at the end, she challenges Jon Stewart to a pushup contest for charity. (I read about it in our local paper and so figured it was online.) 

Stewart actually calls Scott, her H, up on stage and the 3 of them do pushups (Broadwell wins). It is so hard to see him (Scott) touch her shoulder and smile at her, knowing that the interview took place this past January, which means she was in the throes of the affair. And there he is, oblivous, almost surely entirely ignorant that something is going on.

The clip warlock linked above is about 7 minutes long, the clip below is 13 minutes long and needless to say the pushup contest occurs at the end.

Exclusive - Push-up Contest to Benefit Wounded Veterans - The Daily Show with Jon Stewart - 01/25/12 - Video Clip | Comedy Central


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

And an essay that says it wasn't Broadwell's good looks, it was Petraeus' narcissism that led to the affair.

Was David Petraeus ensnared by narcissism? - Amity Shlaes


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## larry.gray (Feb 21, 2011)

There is always narcissism involved. It involves thinking that rewarding one's own simple pleasures outweighs the damage it would do to the spouse.


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## Tony55 (Jun 8, 2012)

FBI just entered Broadwells house.


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## Clegane (Oct 29, 2012)

And the plot thickens:

Top U.S. Commander in Afghanistan Is Linked to Petraeus Scandal - NYTimes.com

Jill Kelley may also be involved in an extramarital affair.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Jill Kelley FBI Contact Who Launched Petraeus Investigation Was Reportedly Dismissed From Case Over Conflict Of Interest

WTF??



> The Wall Street Journal reports that the FBI agent who initially launched the investigation that led to the downfall of the former CIA director was removed from the case when the bureau became concerned that he was "obsessed with the matter."


Also this



> The US official, speaking on the condition of anonymity, said the FBI had uncovered between 20,000 and 30,000 pages of correspondence between Gen. Allen and Mrs Kelley.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

one more 

Jill Kelley Hires Lawyer And Crisis PR Specialist - Business Insider

there seems to be something more than just affairs...




> Kelley socialized frequently with high-ranking military officers, hosting parties at the Kelley mansion





> Kelley, an "unpaid social liaison" at MacDill Air Force Base, has hired DC superlawyer Abbe Lowell and crisis PR person Judy Smith.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> WTF??


Yes, this scandal seems to be growing more body parts...er, tentacles.

You could sense that something was off about the FBI contact (someone had pointed this out a couple pages back).

The subjects of the harrassing emails from Broadwell to Kelley seemed to concern the comings and goings of top generals, and apparently that is what concerned other FBI agents and led them to do the investigation. (But again, that type of information--how was Broadwell privvy to it?)


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## old_soldier (Jul 17, 2012)

*LEADERSHIP BY EXAMPLE!Me thinks, NOT!*


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

You couldn't put this kind of stupid horny crazy on TV if you tried.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

I see both of these modern day "camp followers" are married to docs who somehow appear to be ignorant of the natures of high testosterone males. In defense of the docs, they don't look like the type to have been in themselves, so they can sort of plead ignorant cuckold. In my case, once I knew my XLTGF was "dating" visiting USAFA dooshbags, my groundpounder sensibilities got me over my hang dog feelings right away. Kind of an instant defogging.

Back to the case at hand, both women are fairly low rank, visually. MAJ Broadwell looks like she supplements with some anabolics, which give her a rockin' body, but leave her with a somewhat manly visage. And a high sex drive no doubt.


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## arbitrator (Feb 13, 2012)

It's going to be a situation of "who knew what and when did they know it." Under the guise of possible security leaks, someone within the FBI authorized cracking personal email accounts without ever notifying the White House, the Attorney General, Congress, or the Defense Department. The FBI and the CIA are anything but friendly and cooperative with each other, and this is going to be most interesting to see how this ultimately plays out and exactly who gave the ultimate authorization to proceed.

I can see both the Senate and the House having separate investigations into exactly who it was that came to launch this investigation!


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> So you gotta wonder about the backstory on this one. Talk about 'exposure' !!!
> 
> CIA director David Petraeus submits resignation over extramarital affair – This Just In - CNN.com Blogs


I doubt this is Petraeus's first affair. 

It was stated somewhere that he was considered above having and affair because he seemed disdainful of those who did have affairs. 

Hmmmm! Seems like the typical smokescreen of someone who hates what he is doing to his wife but lacks the self control to stop doing the thing that he knows will hurt her.

I also agree with the other poster who stated that this masculine looking babe was on anabolic steroids that upped her testosterone levels to make her sexually aggressive and competitive with other women. 

I also see a K a G and a B when i look at her. And, the KGB is known to use this type of tactic, of a masculine highly sexed women to get at a high level official.


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## daggeredheart (Feb 21, 2012)

Top General Head of CIA has affair.
TOP General Commander in Afghanistan just release 20000 pages of e-mails w/ women.
FBI Agent shirtless in photo to Jill Kelley.
One mistress jealous of another...has a catty attitude and brings the house down.
FBI did not tell anyone they were involved in Mexican Soap opera.
Congress mad because they wanted to be part of it. ~ Huffington Post commenter. 

You couldn't write a lifetime movie better than this-----it is beyond soap opera.....

I'm sure Holly and the other spouses are strong but even the toughest person would want to just crawl in a hole and wait for it all to blow over......ouch. 

I would bet their cheating days are long over now......now that is what I call total exposure to the nuclear level.....


These people are involved in "Intelligence"? Coulda fooled me


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

At least the British have the good sense to 

Kill their mistresses
Mess around with Soviet spies
Molest children
Join in gay orgies

So there's that.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

arbitrator said:


> *The FBI and the CIA are anything but friendly and cooperative with each other, *and this is going to be most interesting to see how this ultimately plays out and exactly who gave the ultimate authorization to proceed.


That right there.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

warlock07 said:


> Jill Kelley FBI Contact Who Launched Petraeus Investigation Was Reportedly Dismissed From Case Over Conflict Of Interest
> 
> WTF??
> 
> Also this


The NYT has an interesting article on this as well:

F.B.I. Inquiry Into E-Mails Raises Questions on Motives - NYTimes.com

As summed up by the author:



> So basically this entire scandal both at the outset and in the denouement was driven by Freakshow FBI Agent X who both wanted to bed the victim of the alleged harassment and also decided that the FBI was covering up it’s investigation of the Tampa socialite to protect President Obama. And this because of his “worldview”. Please let us meet this awesome example of American law enforcement.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Jon Stewart skewering himself yesterday, for not picking up on Broadwell's sycophantic adoration of Petraeus back when he interviewed her in January. warlock posted the original interview on page 1, a longer version the same interview (complete with 3-way pushup contest) is at the top of page 6.


The clips are broken into two links.

Spyfall - The Daily Show with Jon Stewart - 11/12/12 - Video Clip | Comedy Central

Stewart: "the whole [interview] was innuendo after innuendo"

which is so true...

And while he didn't make fun of her James Bond girl name (Broadwell!!) he did make fun of the name of the book, "All In."


Here's another clip skewering the conspiracy angle:
Spyfall - David Petraeus Resigns - The Daily Show with Jon Stewart - 11/12/12 - Video Clip | Comedy Central


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## daggeredheart (Feb 21, 2012)

Leave it to the Daily Show and Colbert report to actually report the real news....can't wait to see what the Onion does with this story.


*People everywhere scramble to erase secret gmail love letters and naked pictures as FBI probe widens and reality sinks in that nothing is sacred on the internet"

Are All Women Nutso, Or Just The Ones I Cheat On My Wife With?

Husband Still Faithful After 42 Years Of Trying To Cheat

Affair Broken Up By Other Affair

Sources: Petraeus Knew About Affair For More Than A Year

Affair causes successful career to flame out in stereotypical cliches"


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

At some point, hopefully soon, Paula Broadwell is going to have to make some kind of public statement. I'm surprised that it's only Jill Kelley who has made a public statement, hired a crisis PR agent and a top notch attorney. I wonder if Paula is doing the same.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

Coffee Amore said:


> At some point, hopefully soon, Paula Broadwell is going to have to make some kind of public statement. I'm surprised that it's only Jill Kelley who has made a public statement, hired a crisis PR agent and a top notch attorney. I wonder if Paula is doing the same.


She is probably pretty busy finding lawyers who will be dealing with her husband's lawyers at the moment. Then she can look for the PR folks.

I wonder how much of her books sales her husband will get?


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## daggeredheart (Feb 21, 2012)

I love this 

“There is strong reason to believe that Petraeus came across explicit e-mails sent between Mrs. Broadwell and himself not long after he wrote them, and that his awareness of the romance was more or less confirmed somewhere around the time he began having a yearlong affair with her.” Additional sources concluded it was very likely Petraeus knew he was completely f**ked about 10 seconds after resigning.


*The Onion*

http://www.theonion.com/articles/sources-petraeus-knew-about-affair-for-more-than-a,30349/


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Coffee Amore said:


> At some point, hopefully soon, Paula Broadwell is going to have to make some kind of public statement. I'm surprised that it's only Jill Kelley who has made a public statement, hired a crisis PR agent and a top notch attorney. I wonder if Paula is doing the same.


oh yes, Broadwell lawyered up yesterday.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

You would think this was from the Onion, but it's not! Fine time to lose your driver's license, lol

Paula Broadwell's License Discovered in D.C. Park - US News and World Report




separately, an essay on digital transparency / privacy in the New Yorker:

Did the Surveillance State Get Hit By Friendly Fire? : The New Yorker



> But if we know that kind of subterfuge [i.e., using the gmail account and exchanging drafts] is being used by terrorists, then it’s almost axiomatically an inadequate counter-surveillance option. It’s not yet clear on precisely what legal authority the F.B.I. obtained access to Broadwell’s e-mail, but under the relevant federal statute, the Electronic Communications Privacy Act, the government need do little more than ask. Originally passed in 1986, *the law* is notoriously outdated, and *considers any e-mail that is over a hundred and eighty days old to be “abandoned,” meaning that the author of the e-mail no longer has any reasonable expectation that it would remain private.* *So to obtain access to this e-mail, the F.B.I. doesn’t need a court order; it just needs to ask your e-mail provider. (To obtain more recent e-mail, authorities do need a warrant from a judge.)* There is ample evidence that, in practice, this kind of broad authority has been abused. In a series of reports between 2007 and 2010, the F.B.I.’s inspector general has found that in seeking information from private communications providers, agents have often violated their own internal rules and guidelines, and have ensnared civilians who are only peripheral to their searches.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

What kind of lawyer? Probably an entertainment/publishing lawyer. Oh wait she's already in the PR business; right. So the TV circuit, write a book, a column on Jezebel. Some checkout line women's magazines. And of course some kind of tv show 'in development'. 

This IS America. Disgrace, shame and public humiliation are not only encouraged they're a lucrative meal ticket. 

Petraeus is IDEAL for a high priced chair at Harvard. 

At least one other party - it doesn't matter who, will make a run at Congress next time.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

Here is an interesting point of view from Dear Prudence.

Check it out and let me know what you all think???

http://http://www.slate.com/articles/life/dear_prudence/2012/11/dear_prudence_gen_david_petraeus_paula_broadwell_jill_kelley_and_gen_allen.html?wpisrc=newsletter_rubric

here is the raw link.

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/...aula_broadwell_jill_kelley_and_gen_allen.html


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

happyman64 said:


> Here is an interesting point of view from Dear Prudence.
> 
> Check it out and let me know what you all think???
> 
> http://http://www.slate.com/articles/life/dear_prudence/2012/11/dear_prudence_gen_david_petraeus_paula_broadwell_jill_kelley_and_gen_allen.html?wpisrc=newsletter_rubric


happyman64, your link is not working.


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## happyman64 (Jan 12, 2012)

I cannot figure how to fix it. When I did it from your email it works fine.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

daggeredheart said:


> Top General Head of CIA has affair.
> *TOP General Commander in Afghanistan just release 20000 pages of e-mails w/ women.*
> FBI Agent shirtless in photo to Jill Kelley.
> One mistress jealous of another...has a catty attitude and brings the house down.
> ...


How does a general, _in the middle of an assignment in Afghanistan_, have TIME to write 20-30,000 emails to Kelley? Shouldn't he be, you know, busy? Human lives at stake, and his main concern is sitting in front of his laptop emailing with some married woman constantly?

:BoomSmilie_anim:


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

happyman64 said:


> I cannot figure how to fix it. When I did it from your email it works fine.


The raw link works! No worries. I had only tried the very first link.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

happyman64 said:


> Here is an interesting point of view from Dear Prudence.
> 
> Check it out and let me know what you all think???
> 
> ...


I don't know what to think, actually. Her advice seems to be don't write stuff down, except if they didn't write stuff down, a huge number of affairs would never be discovered. Maybe what she's saying is don't send sexually explicit stuff via email?

As far as the advice on whether to stay married to someone who had a "one time" affair, I think that has to be judged on a case-by-case basis. I think a lot of people just can't live with this stuff and shouldn't be guilted into trying to hold things together if they realize that they can't.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

norajane said:


> How does a general, _in the middle of an assignment in Afghanistan_, have TIME to write 20-30,000 emails to Kelley? Shouldn't he be, you know, busy? Human lives at stake, and his main concern is sitting in front of his laptop emailing with some married woman constantly?
> 
> :BoomSmilie_anim:


A DOD official claims that the number of emails is vastly inflated, that they've been lumped together with lots of other emails that weren't exchanged between these two.

Defense official fires back, denies Afghanistan commander exchanged 'inappropriate' emails - U.S. News



> Later in the day, however, a defense official at the Pentagon told NBC News that the number of emails between Allen and Kelley was inflated.
> 
> "That is a mischaracterization," said the official, speaking on condition of anonymity. "The communications with General Allen were lumped in with a lot of other email traffic."
> 
> The official said that the Allens and Kelleys were "family friends," and the emails were written in that manner. *Many of the emails were not personal communications between the general and Jill Kelley, the official added, but included Allen's wife.* *And many were between Allen's wife and Jill Kelley, with General Allen just copied, the official said*.


One other speculation I've heard is that Kelley and Allen might have both been on some type of group listserv, so when they did a search for emails both of their emails would have come up, and they printed all those emails off too because they have to be thorough. That's just pure speculation, however, that I heard on a talk show.

I'm sure we'll hear more about this issue soon, one way or another.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> I don't know what to think, actually. Her advice seems to be don't write stuff down, except if they didn't write stuff down, a huge number of affairs would never be discovered. Maybe what she's saying is don't send sexually explicit stuff via email?
> 
> As far as the advice on whether to stay married to someone who had a "one time" affair, I think that has to be judged on a case-by-case basis. I think a lot of people just can't live with this stuff and shouldn't be guilted into trying to hold things together if they realize that they can't.


Oh, and I forgot to say, the stuff about the flirtacious emails, I think that depends on what they said, exactly. Friendly light flirtacious that you wouldn't be embarrassed to show your spouse, fine. It's all a matter of what was exchanged, and how, etc.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

happyman64 said:


> Here is an interesting point of view from Dear Prudence.
> 
> Check it out and let me know what you all think???
> 
> ...



I read Prudence all the time. She nearly always advocates keeping a ONS secret. She also doesn't understand what an emotional affair is. I've seen people write to her with red flags in the story for at least an EA and she ends up bashing them for being insecure. The core group of commentators aren't any better, but their comments can be amusing sometimes.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> A DOD official claims that the number of emails is vastly inflated, that they've been lumped together with lots of other emails that weren't exchanged between these two.
> 
> Defense official fires back, denies Afghanistan commander exchanged 'inappropriate' emails - U.S. News
> 
> ...


Well now Fox News is quoting other sources, saying the Allen / Kelley emails read like phone sex. Who to believe, who to believe.


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## Machiavelli (Feb 25, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> What kind of lawyer? Probably an entertainment/publishing lawyer.


Well, it turns out MAJ Broadwell is now LTC Broadwell USAR as of last August. Adultery charges will probably be forthcoming due to the high profile situation.


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## Kasler (Jul 20, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> Well now *Fox News* is quoting other sources, saying the Allen / Kelley emails read like phone sex. Who to believe, who to believe.


:rofl:


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Jon Stewart pointed out that Jill Kelley seems to have quite a few men on her string. Secret FBI agent "friend" who sent her a shirtless picture, Gen Allen stealing moments away from the war he's supposedly managing for America to flirt with her and to write letters of support for Kelley's sister's custody suits, and then our Gen Petreus who also found time to write custody support letters for her sister and was flirtatious enough with her that Paula got mad...

And she's not having sex with any of them, just a friendly and flirtatious married woman?

What has this Jill Kelley got that all these powerful men are willing to put themselves out for her like that?


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

How do two four-star generals (Petraeus and Allen) find the time to write to family court judge to help Jill Kelley's sister in a child custody case? You'd think they would be too busy to get involved in matters like that.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

Coffee Amore said:


> How do two four-star generals (Petraeus and Allen) find the time to write to family court judge to help Jill Kelley's sister in a child custody case? You'd think they would be too busy to get involved in matters like that.


Petreus would just tell a staffer to write a letter for him. He'd sign it and that would be that.


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Petraeus whistleblower Jill Kelley living large, but is flat broke and drowning in debt with her mansion in foreclosure - NY Daily News


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## warlock07 (Oct 28, 2011)

Petraeus, Allen sided with Jill Kelley's sister in child custody battle - CBS News

these twin sisters are sunk in debt.




> Khawam filed for bankruptcy on April 14 citing liabilities of $3.6 million including $800,000 owed to her sister, $600,000 to a Tampa businessman, and $53,000 to the IRS. In another court case, Khawam is suing a former employer for alleged sexual harassment by a colleague and other charges. The employer denied all charges and accused Khawam of perjury and bankruptcy fraud.


And her sister does not have custody of her son either



> Among the reasons given by the District of Columbia Family Court judge for denying Khawam custody of her son: "profound concerns about *Ms. Khawam's poor logical thinking and her extreme distortions" and "severe psychological deficits." Court documents state that Khawam "was terminated from at least four consecutive positions of employment within the first five years following her graduation from law school,* is a psychologically unstable person whose unsteady moral and ethical compass and apparent lack of awareness of her own shortcomings make it impossible for her successfully to navigate her surroundings in a consistent and sustainable way."


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

warlock07 said:


> Petraeus, Allen sided with Jill Kelley's sister in child custody battle - CBS News
> 
> these twin sisters are sunk in debt.
> 
> ...


All of this is no doubt true--but this is about turning the media wheel to get public sympathy for Broadwell.

Because Broadwell was ALSO sending emails to _Allen_ warning him about Kelley...because of course Kelley was just trying to get her hooks into some unsuspecting general for pecuniary reasons, while Broadwell, who was heard bragging in recent weeks about writing a second book with Petraeus was simply acting out of the purest motives of...oh, never mind.

Sources: Paula Broadwell warned Gen. Allen against "seductress" Jill Kelley - CBS News


Edited to add, you can see why Kelley desperately needs a publicist; she actually called 911 to request police protection from the media based on her "diplomatic" status (which amounts to a nice license plate on her car, unfortunately for her).
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...petraeus-diplomatic-protection-tampa/1703995/


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Also spotted this in a Politico article that summarizes why / how Broadwell and Petraeus would logically be caught with that gmail address




> The Associated Press reported Monday that Petraeus and Broadwell sometimes communicated by writing messages and storing them in the draft folder of a jointly accessed email account, rather than sending them. The idea is to avoid creating a digital trail of email transmissions, a technique reprtedly used by Al Qaeda operatives to hide traffic but *dismissed by one privacy expert as “security folklore.”*
> 
> *The technique doesn’t work because emails kept in the draft folder are sent to service providers’ servers.* [I guess DUH, because otherwise they would never be saved for later.] *In fact, they may be more vulnerable. Government may have easier access to the unsent emails, because draft communications might not meet the technical definition of “electronic storage” in ECPA. That would allow access to the communications without a full-blown warrant.*


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

for those of you who can't stop thinking about the BSs involved, here's a peek into the Broadwell marriage in the couple of days leading up to the media frenzy.

Details of Paula and Scott Broadwell’s Romantic Rappahannock County Getaway | Local News | Washingtonian


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Dear Prudence: Gen. David Petraeus, Paula Broadwell, Jill Kelley, and Gen. Allen could use some sound advice about now. - Slate Magazine


Missing a : between http and //


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## Dollystanford (Mar 14, 2012)

'honorary social liaison' = Madam


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> for those of you who can't stop thinking about the BSs involved, here's a peek into the Broadwell marriage in the couple of days leading up to the media frenzy.
> 
> Details of Paula and Scott Broadwell’s Romantic Rappahannock County Getaway | Local News | Washingtonian


"Paula reportedly spent most of her time texting."

*sigh*


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

snap said:


> "Paula reportedly spent most of her time texting."
> 
> *sigh*


Yeah, that was my takeaway too.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Dollystanford said:


> 'honorary social liaison' = Madam


I doubt it's anything as racy as that. Over and over they keep saying these high-ranking American army men lived like monks, because they can be fired just for sexting and they know it. Allen is up for NATO command and he will likely lose it if those emails turn out to be at all sexually explicit, even with zero touching involved. I seriously doubt most countries are quite so strict about this sort of thing, but the U.S. is nowadays. 

That is why Petraeus' friends have been so careful to say that his affair started after he left the army rolleyes. 

I could of course be very wrong. But I think that Kelley was more the sort who liked to throw parties in her nice house, have honorary (read: pretend) State Dept. diplomatic plates, and brag about who she knew. And attract the jealousy of Broadwell, who has for a fact slept with "her" general and apparently is missing the hypocrisy gene along with the fidelity gene.

Of course, with the relentlessness of the media these days, we will eventually know one way or another, whether Kelley was just putting on a show but didn't 'put out.' I will certainly take this back if I'm proven wrong, but that is my gut at this point.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> for those of you who can't stop thinking about the BSs involved, here's a peek into the Broadwell marriage in the couple of days leading up to the media frenzy.
> 
> Details of Paula and Scott Broadwell’s Romantic Rappahannock County Getaway | Local News | Washingtonian


Interesting that Scott Broadwell suddenly became uncommunicative late Friday around the time the story first broke. That tells me he didn't know about the affair even though back in September Paula admitted it to FBI agents when she was interviewed by them. So she admits to the FBI, but doesn't admit it to her own husband?!
David Petraeus sex scandal: FBI agent who began probing disgraced spy chief allegedly sent shirtless photos of himself to whistleblower Jill Kelley - NY Daily News


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## The Middleman (Apr 30, 2012)

This story is just getting more bizarre by the minute. If this is the best our country has to offer .... we are doomed.

I hope Mr. Broadwell goes public and embarrasses the sh1t out of his wife and Petreaus.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

sandc said:


> Petreus would just tell a staffer to write a letter for him. He'd sign it and that would be that.


I've worked in Family Court. Those kinds of letters, from people not very familiar with the parent in question other than in a social setting and not familiar their parenting, won't mean much to a judge, and in fact the judge will see right through the attempt to use a "famous" name or big credentials to influence him/her. Strange that Jill's sister who is an attorney would think that might actually work.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> One other speculation I've heard is that Kelley and Allen might have both been on some type of group listserv, so when they did a search for emails both of their emails would have come up, and they printed all those emails off too because they have to be thorough. That's just pure speculation, however, that I heard on a talk show.
> 
> I'm sure we'll hear more about this issue soon, one way or another.


Another thing to note is that the number of pages (I have been seeing reports of 20-30k *pages* of emails) can really multiply quickly if you keeping use reply. If there is a 5 page email between folks on a serious matter, then a half dozen custy replies back and forth on top just between Allen and Kelly, for example, those six emails can count for 30 pages or more. Does not excuse them, but perhaps does seem a bit more reasonable, particularly in light of the emails going back to 2010.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Coffee Amore said:


> I read Prudence all the time. She nearly always advocates keeping a ONS secret. She also doesn't understand what an emotional affair is. I've seen people write to her with red flags in the story for at least an EA and she ends up bashing them for being insecure. The core group of commentators aren't any better, but their comments can be amusing sometimes.


I agree that EA's are a huge blind spot for her, though I don't think that makes her all that different than any other advice columnist. Most seem to think that any discomfort over a significant other's relationship with some one of the opposite sex is a problem for the person with the discomfort (and that it is border-line controlling at best).

While I disagree with her stance on ONS, I can't say it is completely unreasonable.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

The Post sometimes has this annoying habit of making you register to read their stuff, so only click this link once and read it then, or else you will have to close your browser out and go back in to read it, something like that (if like me you refuse to register to read on the 'net):

Computers, the new private eyes for cheating - The Washington Post


Here are the opening paragraphs:



> Bad loving ain’t easy.
> 
> So many traps to fall into, so many mistakes to make, so many ways to flub up. Even the nation’s spy chief couldn’t get away with it, couldn’t keep a secret extramarital affair secret forever. If David Petraeus couldn’t do it, well, how could anyone else convince themselves they could pull it off?
> 
> ...


The entire article is (a little tongue in cheek) about the escalating tech war between cheaters and loyal spouses.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Coffee Amore said:


> Interesting that Scott Broadwell suddenly became uncommunicative late Friday around the time the story first broke. That tells me he didn't know about the affair even though back in September Paula admitted it to FBI agents when she was interviewed by them. So she admits to the FBI, but doesn't admit it to her own husband?!
> David Petraeus sex scandal: FBI agent who began probing disgraced spy chief allegedly sent shirtless photos of himself to whistleblower Jill Kelley - NY Daily News


That's an interesting thought. I guess I just always assumed that he DIDN'T know and learned about it like the rest of us around the same time. But maybe she only told her husband she had sent the emails to Kelley, and that was why the FBI was investigating? If her husband was never questioned, and there wouldn't be any need for it, he might have known about the investigation but not that they had uncovered the affair. I wonder if we will ever know the truth around that.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Coffee Amore said:


> Interesting that Scott Broadwell suddenly became uncommunicative late Friday around the time the story first broke. That tells me he didn't know about the affair even though back in September Paula admitted it to FBI agents when she was interviewed by them. So she admits to the FBI, but doesn't admit it to her own husband?!
> David Petraeus sex scandal: FBI agent who began probing disgraced spy chief allegedly sent shirtless photos of himself to whistleblower Jill Kelley - NY Daily News


I have to assume Broadwell thought it was not going to get out to the public. The FBI would know, but that they would keep it secret because no laws had been broken. It was not until Petraeus resigned that the affiar truly became public. I would not be surprised if Broadwell did not know he was going to resign.


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## sandc (Dec 15, 2011)

I think Mr. Broadwell knew. I think he's unhappy this went public though.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

He knew and yet he planned this super romantic anniverary for them? And the same week they celebrated Paula's 40th birthday? Seems strange. Now I wonder _what _he knew and when....


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Coffee Amore said:


> He knew and yet he planned this super romantic anniverary for them? And the same week they celebrated Paula's 40th birthday? Seems strange. Now I wonder _what _he knew and when....


Of course, we don't know for certain, and we may never know for sure; but I have these reasons for thinking why he didn't know--and that is, it seems like Broadwell was still in touch with Petraeus in recent weeks.

--she gave that speech on Oct. 26 with insider knowledge about Benghazi; maybe it came from someone else--but chances are it came from Petraeus, who actually went there to do his personal investigation.

--she had apparently been bragging about doing a second book with Petraeus. I don't know how old those statements are, but I'm pretty sure they date from after her interviews with the FBI. But I don't have firm evidence for this--so this might not be accurate. [ETA--See below--seems the book bragging did happen before the FBI interviewed her.]

--there is speculation that Petraeus was invited to the birthday party. I imagine there are some reporters out there trying to verify this because again, it would be very strange to have this large, public birthday party (complete with reporters) and her H would just go along with that if he'd found out about the affair just months before. But no one knows for sure that Petraeus was invited (or if invited, was coming).

If any one of these statements is true, it would seem to lean toward Scott Broadwell still being in the dark about the affair until it went viral on Friday.

We have to remember that this man had chosen to work in Charlotte in order to have a stable home life for their children, and by Paula Broadwell's own account had patiently played Mr. Mom while she travelled around the world doing her book and the US on speaking engagements. In fact, recall that they traced some of her Kelley emails to locations where she was (like hotels) and Scott Broadwell was not. (They had to figure which of the two was sending the emails because they came from a family Internet account.)

I can't believe he didn't know about the FBI investigation. The question is whether the agents told him about Petraeus, or whether she fessed up out of fear he'd find out from them. So far, we don't know either way when he learned about the affair.






Edited to add: found a better timeline of events.

--Broadwell tells a CNN intelligence journalist that she plans to write a second book with Petraeus at the Aspen security forum, which was held this year in late July 2012.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1211/13/acd.01.html

--According to this article: 
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...barded-whistleblower-emails-article-1.1201051

Broadwell wasn't interviewed by the FBI until September, when she also admitted the affair and turned over her computer.

--Then Petraeus was interviewed Oct. 21, admits the affair.



While it's possible Broadwell told her husband on her own, knowing what we know about infidelity, chances are she didn't tell him before the Sept. FBI interview at the earliest; if that happened Sept. 1,* that was just weeks before ther big bday vacay & public bash. My bet is still that he did not know. 

*Edited to add, I found an online timeline that I posted below, she was interviewed for the first time in the second half of Sept., then interviewed a second time, likely in October. That gave Scott 4 or 5 weeks to make reservations at a famous 5 star restaurant plus a B&B in a small town (very hard to do for those two specific locations in that town) and then arrange a very big birthday party--seems unlikely to me.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

And now, the FBI agent gets the spotlight. As I suspected, while he was zealous and political, the whole shirtless thing was just something mean the other FBI agents told the media to make him look bad. It was sent years ago before this thing happened and was done outside and not sexual, according to the New York Times' source.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/15/us/frederick-humphries-fbi-agent-in-petraeus-case.html

sounds like he's coming back at the media, maybe via his lawyer, with his anti-terrorism / anti-crime record:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/fbi-agent-petraeus-scandal-hero-17722871


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

And Paula Broadwell has lost her security clearance over that Oct. 26 speech about Benghazi, the one where they speculate she got her intel from Petraeus. Again, sequence of events--affair supposedly ended 4 months ago; Benghazi attacks; Petraeus visits Benghazi; she gives this speech with insider details, about 3 weeks ago, less than 2.5 weeks before this all went public. 

Paula Broadwell's security clearance suspended, Army official says - U.S. News

ETA: they're also saying she had substantial classified stuff on her computer at home, which is a no-no, but I think more people do this than the gov't cares to admit.

ETA: not sure if this is true or not, but one anonymous gov't source is saying Broadwell didn't just send emails to Allen warning him about Kelley, but to other top brass as well.

http://azdailysun.com/news/national...cle_43a23ab7-e94c-5cbe-b41f-eb74180a37df.html

how on earth did she think such a thing wouldn't eventually attract attention?


And last . . . Kelley is now persona non grata on the nearby military base (lost her base pass).


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Interesting video.

Details emerge over Jill Kelley

Allen apparently sent one of Broadwell's warning emails back to Kelley, to an email account Kelley shares with her husband, because he thought it was a joke and sent to him by Kelley herself. Apparently Broadwell sent other emails to Kelley's husband somehow warning him that Kelley was getting too close to Petraeus, before she (or they) approached the FBI agent.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Of course Jill Kelly is Jill Khawam Lebanese born Maronite Christian Arabic speaker who's other role is as an informal or social liaison between the US Army and various Arabic governments at some level or another. 

We're closing in on John le Carré territory here.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> Of course Jill Kelly is Jill Khawam Lebanese born Maronite Christian Arabic speaker who's other role is as an informal or social liaison between the US Army and various Arabic governments at some level or another.
> 
> We're closing in on John le Carré territory here.


As far as I know, her main "diplomatic" activity is Honorary Consul General to South Korea, which entitled her to honorary license plates issued by the State of Florida. Apparently she really did work on some free trade stuff between South Korea and Tampa. You couldn't make this stuff up if you tried.


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## Tony55 (Jun 8, 2012)

I think the real story in the end will be whether or not someone tried to manipulate the election with the information about the affair, or more specifically, about the possibility that the CIA director was under investigation.

*Either Eric Cantor has extremely high integrity or he, and a select few, tried to use that information to their advantage; I don't know the answer to that and I have a feeling we never will.*

It just doesn't make sense to me that he was given that information on Oct 27th (a Saturday) and he didn't tell anyone else other than a staffer. _(And let's remember that this is during an extremely heated battle for the White House._) And his office did not call the FBI until Oct 31st (a Wednesday). So, the house majority leader said nothing, to anyone, for five days.

Seriously?

This was a hot potato within two weeks of the election, there had to be a discussion between Cantor and others on whether they could use that information to their advantage.

But maybe not, we'll never know, but to sit on it for five days is telling.

Another thing that's suspicious is that two days after Cantor calls the FBI, they wrap up their investigation of Petraeus.

Again, seriously? What happened there that we don't know about? Is it just a coincident that they wrapped it up 48 hours after the call?

Then on the 5th the justice department notifies the Director of National Intelligence... a day before the election.

So what the hell is going on here?

There's an underlying story, and I don't know what that story is, whether it's deceit, or integrity, or what? And that bothers me.

Wrap that whole story in a blanket of Benghazi tragedy, hyper-misinformation, and ignorance and you have a story a novelist couldn't have written better.

T


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## See_Listen_Love (Jun 28, 2012)

I'll never understand Americans in these matters. 

The CIA is probably responsible for so many killings in the world (all illegal), and the Director is brought down on an extramarital affair (which is legal). 

It seems so incredible naive to expect the head of such an organization to be a man of integrity, while per definition he is a man of betrayal....otherwise he can't do his manipulation and murdering job 'right'.....

Maybe because US citizens want to hold their authorities responsible for moral high stands in their personal life, in the believe that then their job performance will also be of high ethical standards.....

Maybe the much praised (in the rest of the world) separation between church and state has been replaced with a religious 'nation' belief, that acts as a state religion?

I think as an European I will never understand this religious believe in superior national values like the US has developed after WWII. The worst examples of that same nationalistic believes have cost millions and millions of people their lives, and left hundreds of millions of people hurt or wounded.

It feels like 'Animal Farm' married to '1984' what has become of the US the last decade.

The Patriot Act was the final passing of the demarcation from freedom and democracy to something else....


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

Coffee Amore said:


> He knew and yet he planned this super romantic anniverary for them? And the same week they celebrated Paula's 40th birthday? Seems strange. Now I wonder _what _he knew and when....


Strange? We have people trying this Plan A/better husband/winning her back every other day on this very forum!


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

It's interesting, because Petraeus is surely not the only CIA director to carry on affairs. Allen Dulles apparently got out and about so much it's a wonder he had time to spare for actual work.

When a C.I.A. Director Had Scores of Affairs - NYTimes.com

In fact (and sorry I don't have a citation for this, but it's mentioned in a number of news articles), the CIA doesn't fire people for affairs other than for sexual harrassment type situations. But apparently *a key component of keeping your job is informing your spouse of the affair*. The CIA has that policy so you can't be blackmailed, but really, that is exactly why affairs are so painful, because of the deceit--that is all loyal spouses really ask in the end--to be told the truth.




But politics is a key component of this situation--you have to get a wider perspective of what was happening as events unfolded.

September 11, 2012
Attack on Benghazi, which became politicized due partly to the upcoming presidential election.

September/October 2012 
Broadwell was interviewed twice by FBI investigators. They gained access to her computer and *discovered emails that turned out to be from Petraeus.* 

October 2012
Petraeus interviewed by FBI

House Majority Leader Eric Cantor (a Republican) was made aware of an extramarital affair involving Petraeus by an FBI employee. He contacted the FBI director.

November 6, 2012
President Obama reelected. The same day, Petraeus told Director of National Intelligence Clapper about the affair; Clapper advised Petraeus to resign, the official said.

November 9, 2012 
Petraeus, 60, steps down, admitting to an affair. The House and Senate intelligence committees were informed of the FBI investigation the same day. Petraeus’ resignation came just days before he was scheduled to testify before the Senate Intelligence Committee about the Benghazi attack.


(I put the part bolded above because I think people are under the impression that the FBI knew it was Petraeus since May; but actually, it's just been in the last 6 to 8 weeks.)


Personally I don't subscribe to the conspiracy theories. There are people who say that Obama should not have let Petraeus go, that he should have allowed the investigation to run its course. But I don't think Obama is preoccupied with Benghazi as some think. I think he has a tremendous number of other issues on his plate at Petraeus was a bad distraction at a bad time. So that, in the end, is why he was let go. Not because of American puritanism, although there's no doubt that we've become stricter in these attitudes than in the not-so-distant past.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

snap said:


> Strange? We have people trying this Plan A/better husband/winning her back every other day on this very forum!


After putting together the timeline above, I'm still thinking Scott Broadwell didn't know. I just finally pinpointed that the FBI didn't interview Broadwell until September after the Benghazi attacks. So that means latter half of September. They interviewed her twice--and why? Because after the first interview they now had her computer--and that is when they finally figured out Petraeus was emailing her. 

One timeline says the second interview might have happened as late as October. Petraeus was also interviewed for the first time in October. That puts her big birthday party and trip to a B&B complete with 5 star restaurant visit only about 4 or 5 weeks after that interview, less time than I previously thought. That is a short time to plan such a big party. Also, the 5 star restaurant is booked fast (some say make reservations 6 months in advance).

But snap, I totally agree that the opposite conclusion could be drawn. Huge, over the top plans right after disclosure of the affair could be construed the other way. It's just that it would be so hard to execute those plans that fast--during a time he would have been reeling from this discovery, which was so huge.


Edited to add, here's an article speculating on whether Holly or Scott will dump their respective spouses. They place odds on Holly staying and Scott leaving.
http://abcnews.go.com/Health/holly-...ell-silent-petraeus-scandal/story?id=17718793


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

iheartlife, I actually also tend to think he did not know. Esp. given that she still texted all the time: he must be a smart guy (she would've settled for nothing less) and he'd add two and two. Point is even if he did, taking her to a lavish retreat would be not something extraordinary.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

snap said:


> iheartlife, I actually also tend to think he did not know. Esp. given that she still texted all the time: he must be a smart guy (she would've settled for nothing less) and he'd add two and two. Point is even if he did, taking her to a lavish retreat would be not something extraordinary.


Totally agree. My only counterargument is that the reservations and arrangments would have been so hard to achieve with such little time. But as you say, we shouldn't discount the power of a betrayed spouse who is desperate to turn the clock back.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Petraeus speaking more openly about the affair to a reporter

Petraeus: I did not pass classified info - CNN.com



> Among other things, Petraeus said he has not talked with Paula Broadwell, his biographer and woman he admitted an affair with, *since the scandal broke*.


Let's see, that would be since when, Friday a week ago?

I was going to make a _very_ snide remark, but I'm too disgusted to manage that right now.


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> ETA: not sure if this is true or not, but one anonymous gov't source is saying Broadwell didn't just send emails to Allen warning him about Kelley, but to other top brass as well.
> 
> First anonymous email sent to Gen. Allen in May
> 
> ...


Maybe Broadwell wanted to attract attention. Didn't she attend a military academy, was it West Point?

These people need to be extremely intelligent to get into a good military academy and they study strategic psychological and physical warfare. 

Can we really believe that Broadwell didn't realize her emails would trigger an investigation. 

Maybe the husband is in on it. 

Broadwell looks like a man, physique wise. She competes in a man's world. She is definitely a very high testosterone competitive female.


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

remorseful strayer said:


> Maybe Broadwell wanted to attract attention.
> 
> Can we really believe that Broadwell didn't realize her emails would trigger an investigation.


If she wanted a big sales bump for her book, this would be one way to do it.


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

thunderstruck said:


> If she wanted a big sales bump for her book, this would be one way to do it.


I agree. She is clever enough to know this. The entire affair may have been engineered to boost book sales and name recognition. People love salaciousness and will buy the book now due to the affair. People who would not have otherwise been interested. 

Let's face it, Petraues is not a good looking guy. He's bent over in posture and has a comb over.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

remorseful strayer said:


> Maybe Broadwell wanted to attract attention. Didn't she attend a military academy, was it West Point?
> 
> These people need to be extremely intelligent to get into a good military academy and they study strategic psychological and physical warfare.
> 
> ...


She used multiple anonymous email accounts. She's also a military intelligence specialist. I seriously doubt she wanted to get caught--she would be the type to intensely pride herself on being a sort of spy herself. She's an army reservist as well--and now she's lost her security clearance over this.

Also, I think she's probably, judging by the cheating mentality (and not anything else like appearance or credentials), a bit of a narcissist, and narcissists tend to have an inflated idea of their own cleverness.

Part of the reason I say this is:
May:
--Paula starts sending anonymous emails to Kelley, telling her specifically to stay away from Petraeus and Allen (by name, per the media). 

--Paula also sends emails to Kelley's husband, telling him to watch out because Kelley is after Petraeus.

--Paula also sends emails to Allen, and some say to other general(s), "warning" them about Kelley the seductress.

--*Allen sends emails to Kelley and her husband, thinking the Paula warnings are a joke that Kelley made up*

June:
--Kelley goes to the FBI agent in Tampa

--FBI figures out Paula is sending the emails (based on locations where she was, and Scott was not).

--Kelley tells Petraeus, who she and her husband know personally, about the emails and that they're from Paula (I don't think she knew there was an affair, although she had to wonder once she realized who was sending the emails)

--Because Kelley told Petraeus what the FBI found out, Petraeus told Paula to stop sending emails.

July? August?
Petraeus breaks off the affair (sometimes said it was mutual, but I doubt it); this just means the sex, as far as I can tell because there's unsurprising evidence he spoke to her right up to Nov 8 or 9.

Second half of September:
FBI interviews Paula (perhaps for the first time? unclear)
FBI impounds her computer
Explicit emails with Petraeus discovered, affair uncovered

Late Sept/Early Oct:
Paula interviewed again, this time about the affair

Oct:
Petraeus interviewed


-------------------------------------

Also, the FBI has specifically found that a number of times, the emails were sent from a location where Paula was, and Scott was not, because he was far away being a doctor and dad to the kids. While not definitive, that suggests what one would naturally assume, that Paula sent the emails out of jealousy due to her secret affair that her husband knew nothing about until, almost surely, the second half of September.

When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not zebras.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

thunderstruck said:


> If she wanted a big sales bump for her book, this would be one way to do it.


I would say so too, except for the secret affair. See above, I think she thought she was extremely clever, trained in intelligence, the exact personality type to believe they would never get caught. That's a narcissist--and it totally fits with the cheating mentality.

Also, in July, she told a CNN intelligence journalist she planned to collaborate with Petraeus on a second book. No way that is happening now. Not to say she needs it, if "All In" sales rage. But it shows her intent not to be caught at that time, which is well after the emails were sent and before her FBI interviews.

I doubt she wanted to bring an FBI investigation on herself. Lose her security clearance, when her current livelihood depends on it? Doubtful. Possibly be prosecuted under military law for an extramarital affair? She's a reservist--why would she want that to happen?

It's interesting to discuss, but just seems to implausible to me. 


I think it all boiled down to her arrogance.


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## kenmoore14217 (Apr 8, 2010)

"If she wanted a big sales bump for her book, this would be one way to do it."

Just the opposite for me, won't go near it now!


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> I would say so too, except for the secret affair. See above, I think she thought she was extremely clever, trained in intelligence, the exact personality type to believe they would never get caught. That's a narcissist--and it totally fits with the cheating mentality.
> 
> Also, in July, she told a CNN intelligence journalist she planned to collaborate with Petraeus on a second book. No way that is happening now. Not to say she needs it, if "All In" sales rage. But it shows her intent not to be caught at that time, which is well after the emails were sent and before her FBI interviews.
> 
> ...


All your points are valid, and I agree she has narcissistic traits as do all who stray, the part that doesn't fit is that people who study at military academies are typically very clever. The emails seems like such and obviously stupid choice for exposure. In the real world to any other human being emails suggesting flirtatious behavior would not be grounds for such and expensive investigation on any level, legally, criminally, civilly. The reason it was investigated was because of the people involved, not because of the emails, per se, which were not threatening enough to trigger an investigation in normal societal circles. Broadwell having studied at a military academy knew these emails as mild as they were, would trigger a major investigation. 

I can think of many reasons why she might be willing to give up a career by implicating herself.

Here are a few: Perhaps she works on the inside for our government. Perhaps she did not care about her reservist career anymore or high level clearance. Maybe she thought the publicity and subsequent interest in her would garner her more income in a different way. 

Broadwell obviously thinks she is attractive and likes to flaunt herself. Her arms look mannish to me and are a turn off to me, but she obviously thinks they look good because she wants to flaunt them. She is also exhibiting narcissistic traits and perhaps is aspiring to an acting or modeling career before she gets too old. Monica Lewinsky is doing very well financially since her dalliance with Clinton. 

You could be right though. It's possible she is a full blown NPD and is a delusional about her cleverness.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

remorseful strayer said:


> All your points are valid, and I agree she has narcissistic traits as do all who stray, the part that doesn't fit is that people who study at military academies are typically very clever. The emails seems like such and obviously stupid choice for exposure. In the real world to any other human being emails suggesting flirtatious behavior would not be grounds for such and expensive investigation on any level, legally, criminally, civilly. The reason it was investigated was because of the people involved, not because of the emails, per se, which were not threatening enough to trigger an investigation in normal societal circles. Broadwell having studied at a military academy knew these emails as mild as they were, would trigger a major investigation.
> 
> I can think of many reasons why she might be willing to give up a career by implicating herself.
> 
> ...


Maybe.

But another argument for why she wouldn't want to get caught: she didn't want Petraeus to know, either.

That's because Petraeus would be angered, and would end the affair. Which is exactly what happened, when he found out. He didn't find out from Paula, or the FBI; no, he found out from Kelley (who only found out because of the FBI).


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

remorseful strayer said:


> Can we really believe that Broadwell didn't realize her emails would trigger an investigation.


Beyond the self-absorbed mind-set of a cheater, I suspect she did not view the emails as all that bad. From what has been leaked about them, they really are not at all threatening. They are more of a stay away from my man and stay away from her she is bad news sort of thing. Not tasteful, but nothing like a threat to kill or the like. I would not expect, for example, to find a bunny boiling in my house based on these emails. 

The agent that Kelley sent them to had to convince the FBI to really look into it, so I can see why Broadwell thought they would not be a real issue.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> July? August?
> Petraeus breaks off the affair (sometimes said it was mutual, but I doubt it); this just means the sex, as far as I can tell because there's unsurprising evidence he spoke to her right up to Nov 8 or 9.


Damage control. They realized that the FBI was onto them, so they break it off so there is no further evidence. I think it was mutual in that both agreed that they needed to do it, not that they both wanted to do it.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> Damage control. They realized that the FBI was onto them, so they break it off so there is no further evidence. I think it was mutual in that both agreed that they needed to do it, not that they both wanted to do it.


I hope Scott drops her like a rock. Maybe because it's so public he might be able to get a good settlement.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> Damage control. They realized that the FBI was onto them, so they break it off so there is no further evidence. I think it was mutual in that both agreed that they needed to do it, not that they both wanted to do it.


I know it's hard to keep track of my barrage of posts, but as I said above, a Headline News (CNN cable channel) reporter came out today, someone who is close enough to Petraeus to get quotes since November 9th, and he told that reporter that he hasn't been in touch with Broadwell "since the scandal broke." Meaning, he was in touch with her before that--and there's evidence to suggest, as I've said several times now, that they were in touch since the FBI interviewed her. The FBI didn't interview him until Oct. 21--maybe he stopped talking to her then. But they didn't stop communicating after breaking it off. That makes me think, they just stopped having sex is all. The traditional, layperson's definition of "ending the affair." Not the TAM definition, which isn't surprising.


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

tom67 said:


> I hope Scott drops her like a rock.


Nah, he should play her for a while ("I forgive you, baby."), so he can get a massive chunk of the book profits. The book about the guy who was plowing his wife.
:FIREdevil:


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> I know it's hard to keep track of my barrage of posts, but as I said above, a Headline News (CNN cable channel) reporter came out today, someone who is close enough to Petraeus to get quotes since November 9th, and he told that reporter that he hasn't been in touch with Broadwell "since the scandal broke." Meaning, he was in touch with her before that--and there's evidence to suggest, as I've said several times now, that they were in touch since the FBI interviewed her. The FBI didn't interview him until Oct. 21--maybe he stopped talking to her then. But they didn't stop communicating after breaking it off. That makes me think, they just stopped having sex is all. The traditional, layperson's definition of "ending the affair." Not the TAM definition, which isn't surprising.


I don't disagree. They may have gone so far as to recognize that they could not completely break off content, as that would have been suspicuous.So they stop the sex, but continue to communicate in normal ways one would expect a biographer and her subject to talk when a second book is being worked on.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> Beyond the self-absorbed mind-set of a cheater, I suspect she did not view the emails as all that bad. From what has been leaked about them, they really are not at all threatening. They are more of a stay away from my man and stay away from her she is bad news sort of thing. Not tasteful, but nothing like a threat to kill or the like. I would not expect, for example, to find a bunny boiling in my house based on these emails.
> 
> The agent that Kelley sent them to had to convince the FBI to really look into it, so I can see why Broadwell thought they would not be a real issue.


Totally agree. The only reason, the ONLY reason that the FBI agents did look into it is that the emails showed knowledge about the whereabouts of Petraeus, the head of the CIA. They also were aware of the comings and goings of generals, not just Allen, but at least one other one. That did cause them to launch an inquiry.

In the second half of September, they intreviewed Broadwell and took her computer. That's when the affair was uncovered. By this point, first FBI agent isn't on the case any more.

In fact--the 'whistleblower' or 'rogue' FBI agent (whatever you want to call him) didn't go to Congress until AFTER Broadwell and Petraeus were interviewed. Most people think that's because he could see the FBI investigation was going too slowly, and he wanted this affair / national security / Benghazi thing (not sure which) to affect the election. Which it would not have. And the Republicans involved were careful to make sure that it didn't and went back to the FBI director to tell them what they'd learned.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> Totally agree. The only reason, the ONLY reason that the FBI agents did look into it is that the emails showed knowledge about the whereabouts of Petraeus, the head of the CIA. They also were aware of the comings and goings of generals, not just Allen, but at least one other one. That did cause them to launch an inquiry.
> 
> In the second half of September, they intreviewed Broadwell and took her computer. That's when the affair was uncovered. By this point, first FBI agent isn't on the case any more.
> 
> In fact--the 'whistleblower' or 'rogue' FBI agent (whatever you want to call him) didn't go to Congress until AFTER Broadwell and Petraeus were interviewed. Most people think that's because he could see the FBI investigation was going too slowly, and he wanted this affair / national security / Benghazi thing (not sure which) to affect the election. Which it would not have. And the Republicans involved were careful to make sure that it didn't and went back to the FBI director to tell them what they'd learned.


I agree. The emails from Broadwell don't seem threatening. Not in my opinion. They're more of the cat fight variety. And so juvenile. It's something my friends would have done in high school. Such a smart woman but so dumb too. Broadwell isn't all that different from that NASA astronaut OW who wear an adult Depends diaper to drive hundreds of miles to attack/confront her MM's new lover.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

snap said:


> Strange? We have people trying this Plan A/better husband/winning her back every other day on this very forum!


They left early saturday morning though so he found out friday night they were supposed to stay longer.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

thunderstruck said:


> Nah, he should play her for a while ("I forgive you, baby."), so he can get a massive chunk of the book profits. The book about the guy who was plowing his wife.
> :FIREdevil:


I like your thinking:lol:


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Coffee Amore said:


> I agree. The emails from Broadwell don't seem threatening. Not in my opinion. They're more of the cat fight variety. And so juvenile. It's something my friends would have done in high school. Such a smart woman but so dumb too. *Broadwell isn't all that different from that NASA astronaut OW who wear an adult Depends diaper to drive hundreds of miles to attack/confront her MM's new lover.*


And just like the diaper astronaut, Broadwell didn't like it when the cheating tables were turned on her, giving her a taste of her own medicine that she had been dishing out by betraying her husband.


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## thunderstruck (May 9, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> The only reason, the ONLY reason that the FBI agents did look into it is that the emails showed knowledge about the whereabouts of Petraeus, the head of the CIA.


I don't know...I think just the mention of his name in the emails would cause the FBI to dig more. I'm former Army enlisted, so I know a bit about clearances. Something as simple as a DUI, if not self-reported, can earn you a quick visit from security officials, and a possible loss of your clearance.

The powers that be know that if anything can be used against you (affairs, financial problems, etc.), you're a possible security risk.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

tom67 said:


> They left early saturday morning though so he found out friday night they were supposed to stay longer.


I agree with you, as I've said, that Scott didn't know before then. They did have a party in Washington later that day anyhow until it was cancelled. And they knew the media was going to find them soon. So I'm not sure this is evidence Scott didn't know before. But I still don't think he knew.

It takes as much as 6 months typically to get reservations at that 5 star restaurant they went to on Friday. I doubt he was able to swing those in just 3 to 5 weeks' time as Plan A attempt after her first FBI interview in late September--it's quite doubtful he would have known any earlier than then.

But who knows, right?


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

norajane said:


> And just like the diaper astronaut, Broadwell didn't like it when the cheating tables were turned on her, giving her a taste of her own medicine that she had been dishing out by betraying her husband.


Yes, "stay away from my affair partner, you cheating skank!"

and warning Allen to stay away from the seductress.

The "noive" of her! That smacks of narcissism to me.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

thunderstruck said:


> I don't know...I think just the mention of his name in the emails would cause the FBI to dig more. I'm former Army enlisted, so I know a bit about clearances. Something as simple as a DUI, if not self-reported, can earn you a quick visit from security officials, and a possible loss of your clearance.
> 
> The powers that be know that if anything can be used against you (affairs, financial problems, etc.), you're a possible security risk.


I think we're in complete agreement, not sure if you were quoting me for that or if you thought we didn't agree. In the emails we're talking about, they were the anonymous ones sent to Kelley. In those she's saying, I saw you touch Petraeus at dinner party X. I know you were hanging around Allen when he was in town on Y. Stuff like that.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Coffee Amore said:


> I agree. The emails from Broadwell don't seem threatening. Not in my opinion. They're more of the cat fight variety. And so juvenile. It's something my friends would have done in high school. Such a smart woman but so dumb too. Broadwell isn't all that different from that NASA astronaut OW who wear an adult Depends diaper to drive hundreds of miles to attack/confront her MM's new lover.


I showed how old I am by referring to Broadwell as a bunny boiler. He looked confused, so had to use the diaper wearing example for him to understand. Kids these days!


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Dear me someone from Belgium complaining about American overreach? We'll be burying the corpses of King Leopold's destruction of Africa for another hundred years. We're at about 10 million so far.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Broadwell's got a little bit of 'roided up man-jaw working there. I wonder if she's got some of the old rage going.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

The digging continues...NBC dug up the fact that Paula Broadwell attended a dinner that Petraeus went to, the day after her Denver speech (must've taken the red-eye!). This is weeks after her second FBI interview that we know of (there might have been more) and 5 days after Petraeus was interviewed by the FBI.

There's a photo of her at that party.

As their secret dissolved, Petraeus, Broadwell both attended awards dinner - Open Channel



> One senior U.S. intelligence official who attended the event – the annual Office of Strategic Services Society awards dinner -- tells NBC News that he saw the two speak to each other at the Oct. 27 event. The official did not know details of the conversation.


(Although these tidbits are interesting, doesn't this senior official have some more important work to do?)

the first report of them at this party says they went together, but lots of other people there disagree, which makes more sense. But they just couldn't resist talking to each other. Barf. (ETA: Although I realize now people would have thought it weird at the time if they avoided each other. They really couldn't win at that point.)


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> Maybe.
> 
> But another argument for why she wouldn't want to get caught: she didn't want Petraeus to know, either.
> 
> That's because Petraeus would be angered, and would end the affair. Which is exactly what happened, when he found out. He didn't find out from Paula, or the FBI; no, he found out from Kelley (who only found out because of the FBI).


I defer to your judgment because I haven't really followed the updates on this. It is convoluted.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

I'm sure this stuff is just going to keep on trickling in. It all boils down to what happened when in the timeline, really.

Time Magazine says that Broadwell wanted to get Lance Armstrong to ride bikes with Petraeus as a 60th birthday present. (Petraeus' bday was Nov 7, before he gave his resignation to Obama; Broadwell's two days later.)

Spyfall | TIME.com


According to Time, this plan of Broadwell's was hatched at the very end of July, start of August (I gather she went on a run with Armstrong while in Aspen for that security conference where she told a journalist she was writing a second book with Petraeus). So really, they ended their affair "four months ago" as Petraeus claims? Back in June--when Kelley told Petraeus the FBI figured out Broadwell was threatening Kelley.

So clearly Broadwell was still obsessed with Petraeus. Obviously it wasn't just about infatuation and sex, but also about collaborating on another book that would mean more fame and money for her.

This really doesn't sound like a situation where the affair was truly over in the REAL sense of the word. It makes me continue to doubt that Scott Broadwell knew anything at that point, before the late September FBI interviews of Paula.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

remorseful strayer said:


> It is convoluted.


:iagree:

That is the understatement of the year!


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## remorseful strayer (Nov 13, 2012)

Runs like Dog said:


> Broadwell's got a little bit of 'roided up man-jaw working there. I wonder if she's got some of the old rage going.


To get into the military academy and compete with the men there she is either born with a high testosterone level, or is amping it up by injection.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> the first report of them at this party says they went together, but lots of other people there disagree, which makes more sense. But they just couldn't resist talking to each other. Barf. (ETA: Although I realize now people would have thought it weird at the time if they avoided each other. They really couldn't win at that point.)


The more I read, the more I am convinced that they agreed to stop the sex and sex-talk until things died down. I don't think they intended to end the affair until it became clear it was getting out and/or getting him in trouble.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> I agree with you, as I've said, that Scott didn't know before then. They did have a party in Washington later that day anyhow until it was cancelled. And they knew the media was going to find them soon. So I'm not sure this is evidence Scott didn't know before. But I still don't think he knew.
> 
> It takes as much as 6 months typically to get reservations at that 5 star restaurant they went to on Friday. I doubt he was able to swing those in just 3 to 5 weeks' time as Plan A attempt after her first FBI interview in late September--it's quite doubtful he would have known any earlier than then.
> 
> But who knows, right?


I think had he known he would have cancelled a long time ago jmo.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

Not sure if this is has been posted before, but the pictures of the shirtless FBI agent.

Shirtless FBI agent: Photo was joke emailed to friends, reporter | Local News | The Seattle Times

Since the women in this scandel have been picked over on their appearence, here is one for the ladies to have at.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> Not sure if this is has been posted before, but the pictures of the shirtless FBI agent.
> 
> Shirtless FBI agent: Photo was joke emailed to friends, reporter | Local News | The Seattle Times
> 
> Since the women in this scandel have been picked over on their appearence, here is one for the ladies to have at.


Good find--I had not yet seen the photo, although I knew it would surface. I'm glad it's being published, because I never really believed the worst of this particular issue. Some of the news articles also say he sent the photo to Kelley's husband along with the other friends who received it. Again, it was sent years ago; the media strongly implied that it was sent this summer after the investigation started. That has turned out to be a fabrication, probably by someone whose motives were much less than pure.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Here you have to say DUH! Paula Broadwell's Husband, Scott, Might Not Be Able To Forgive Affair : Offbeat : Enstarz


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> Good find--I had not yet seen the photo, although I knew it would surface. I'm glad it's being published, because I never really believed the worst of this particular issue. Some of the news articles also say he sent the photo to Kelley's husband along with the other friends who received it. Again, it was sent years ago; the media strongly implied that it was sent this summer after the investigation started. That has turned out to be a fabrication, probably by someone whose motives were much less than pure.


I definitely want to see the context of the email that forwarded this to Kelley. It could be anything from a joke to sexually suggestive to anything in between. Definitely want to know if his email to Kelley copied anyone else.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Ouch, this is from the Washington Post about Broadwell's studies at Harvard and her (apparently) unfishished dissertation that got turned into that book. The knives are drawn, I guess.

Paula Broadwell's drive and resilience hit obstacles - The Washington Post


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> I definitely want to see the context of the email that forwarded this to Kelley. It could be anything from a joke to sexually suggestive to anything in between. Definitely want to know if his email to Kelley copied anyone else.


It says right there in the story you linked that it was sent to multiple people years ago.

They were clearly friends, the two of them, so there's little doubt of that. He was also friends with her husband, however. 

I don't think this photo is in any way suggestive that he was interested in Kelley. I don't see any evidence of that at all. Every single thing that's been said about this photo was speculation, assumptions the media lept to because the FBI colleague said, "he sent a shirtless photo to Kelley" with absolutely zero background to go with it.

I'm not defending how he handled his job--absolutely not. There are lots of questionable issues, the fact that he took a complaint from a friend and pursued it outside of regular channels, aggressively, including making it political--none of that seems good or appropriate to me personally. That is why people were willing to believe the worst about this picture. But I think this photo thing is a tempest in a teapot, stirred up by someone who's mad he went to Cantor and is getting him back--and good.


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## Tall Average Guy (Jul 26, 2011)

iheartlife said:


> It says right there in the story you linked that it was sent to multiple people years ago.
> 
> They were clearly friends, the two of them, so there's little doubt of that. He was also friends with her husband, however.


It is not really clear how it was sent. Just as others seem like attack pieces, this one seems like a defense piece. So did he send it out as a "mass email" to a bunch of friends, or did it get sent out over several emails. It could be either based on this article and I am a little surprised at the ambiguity. Poor journalism at best and an agenda at worst.



> I don't think this photo is in any way suggestive that he was interested in Kelley. I don't see any evidence of that at all. Every single thing that's been said about this photo was speculation, assumptions the media lept to because the FBI colleague said, "he sent a shirtless photo to Kelley" with absolutely zero background to go with it.


The picture it self is pretty benign, which is why I want to see the text of the email. I suspect was a joke, but don't know that.



> I'm not defending how he handled his job--absolutely not. There are lots of questionable issues, the fact that he took a complaint from a friend and pursued it outside of regular channels, aggressively, including making it political--none of that seems good or appropriate to me personally. That is why people were willing to believe the worst about this picture. But I think this photo thing is a tempest in a teapot, stirred up by someone who's mad he went to Cantor and is getting him back--and good.


If this article is close to accurate, I suspect he made some enemies at the FBI, particularly for going to Cantor and for testifying against his fellow agents.


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## norajane (Feb 7, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> Not sure if this is has been posted before, but the pictures of the shirtless FBI agent.
> 
> Shirtless FBI agent: Photo was joke emailed to friends, reporter | Local News | The Seattle Times
> 
> Since the women in this scandel have been picked over on their appearence, here is one for the ladies to have at.


:rofl:

Love that picture...that's hilarious. Which one's Fred? He should have just posted it on Facebook. It would have gotten a lot of "Likes".


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Tall Average Guy said:


> It is not really clear how it was sent. Just as others seem like attack pieces, this one seems like a defense piece. So did he send it out as a "mass email" to a bunch of friends, or did it get sent out over several emails. It could be either based on this article and I am a little surprised at the ambiguity. Poor journalism at best and an agenda at worst.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I see your points, but I'm going out on a limb (and might have to later eat my words) and guessing it was all very innocuous. Someone else blew it out of proportion for their own purposes. If this photo was the worst they could find, they certainly made a lot of hay out of it.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

I say DR.Scott should DNA the kids in front of her and what if..... omghe will get whatever in the divorce to keep quiet


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

CIA inspector general investigating whether security was breached via the affair. I'm guessing pro forma.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/16/w...uiry-into-libya-attack.html?pagewanted=1&_r=0


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

*Sigh* I hope he's in shock Arms linked in a show of solidarity Paula Broadwell and her husband step out for first time since her affair with David Petraeus made public | Mail Online


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## snap (Oct 3, 2011)

Heh.. at least looks wise it's clear affair-down. Shocking, I know.


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## daggeredheart (Feb 21, 2012)

I think Paula's husband was at the dinner with the CIA director because it's the same pink dress as the Daily Mail article where she is standing next to her spouse. 

If her husband did attend a lot of these events, did he notice the chemistry between them? I can't help but feel that he was the one who wrote the letter to the paper asking for advice.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

daggeredheart said:


> If her husband did attend a lot of these events, did he notice the chemistry between them? I can't help but feel that he was the one who wrote the letter to the paper asking for advice.


I believe them when they say it wasn't Scott Broadwell. They ask for people's email addresses and other information when the request is submitted, although they don't publish it in the answer.

What are the chances that another public official is similarly having an affair? Unfortunately, higher than her husband being the one person in this country who wrote that email.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Just so we're clear. Skank #1 gets the stinkeye from Skank #2 who may or may not have tried to contact ManHo #1. So Skank #1 sends hostile emails or facebook notes to Skank #2 who runs off to FBI F^ckbuddy #1 who then hands it off to his Bro-tard who uses the FBI to open an investigation of ManHo #1 who's also the head of the CIA. In the meantime Skank #2 is hooking up online with ManHo #2 who's running a war in West Asia but seemingly has the time to compose approximately 31 Stephen King novel's worth of porn love notes to Skank #2. And we got shirtless guys.

Desperate Housewives is now a f^cking documentary. Either that or we live in Communist East Germany now. Or it's one of Yukio Mishima's crypto homoerotic novels about sex and death.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

daggeredheart said:


> I think Paula's husband was at the dinner with the CIA director because it's the same pink dress as the Daily Mail article where she is standing next to her spouse.


He might have been at the dinner. But I don't think so, because there's no mention that he was there. All those people getting anonymously quoted about her, they would surely have mentioned it. 

If these are the photos you're thinking of, they were taken at the Patriot Gala in Charlotte:

Paula Broadwell and Gen. David Petraeus initially bonded over a brisk run through Washington, D.C. - NY Daily News

I think she just wore the dress twice...


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> Paula Broadwell and Gen. David Petraeus initially bonded over a brisk run through Washington, D.C. - NY Daily News


Also, at the end of this news article, there's a tiny video clip (not worth watching) of Paula and Scott Broadwell parking their car and then walking from the driveway to the house of her brother, where she was spotted earlier last week. CBS News says it was likely a 'show of marital solidarity.' This video was apparently taken last night (Saturday).


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

It would be an ID TV in my house. Straight up, cops would arrive on scene, crime tape, bring the van, the medical examiner the SWAT team. Crazed naked blood covered man at the door with a knife in one hand hammer in the other.


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## tom67 (Oct 2, 2012)

Paula Broadwell is Back In Charlotte | Charlotte News | Weather | Carolina Panthers | Bobcats | FOX Charlotte | Local News


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

tom67 said:


> Paula Broadwell is Back In Charlotte | Charlotte News | Weather | Carolina Panthers | Bobcats | FOX Charlotte | Local News


Thanks for posting. They say in the clip that Scott Broadwell is expected to speak to the media 'as early as tomorrow evening' which would be today.

I figure it's going to be, 'media leave us alone, we are healing as a family, we have young children' or something along those lines.

I cannot imagine going through what Scott Broadwell is experiencing while under the media glare.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

Petraeus biographer tells friends she regrets damage done by her affair with former CIA chief - The Washington Post



> Paula Broadwell, whose extramarital affair with CIA chief David Petraeus led to his resignation, is telling friends she is devastated by the fallout.
> 
> A person close to Broadwell said Sunday she deeply regrets the damage that’s been done to her family and everyone else’s, and she is trying to repair that and move forward. The friend spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak publicly.


And now they're saying the documents on her computer, despite their 'classified' labels, might no longer be classified at all (classification does expire automatically for some things) and in any event the FBI appears satisfied she didn't get those particular documents from Petraeus.



> Broadwell is still being investigated by the FBI over classified documents found on her laptop and in her home, which investigators believe the author gathered while researching her biography of Petraeus in Afghanistan. Investigators say many of the documents are old and may no longer be classified despite their labels, and say Broadwell told them she did not get them from Petraeus.



Still, I'd like to hear an explanation for her statements about Benghazi on October 26.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

SNL also predictably had a comedy skit, which showed "Paula Broadwell" reading from her book, All In. She's (the actress playing her) in a bookstore and it's being broadcasted (pretend of course) by CSPAN (an American cable tv channel that does occassionally show real book discussions / readings). She reads the book deadpan without inflection, and every page she reads describes a sexual encounter with the general. (Obviously, the book doesn't include anything of the sort, and a number of the pretend events likely didn't happen because of the times and locations specified--all of the readings are the invention of SNL.) 

Eventually the people in the "audience" get up and leave in disgust.

It's more sad than funny. Huff Post has the video clip if you care to see it.


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

iheartlife said:


> I'm sure this stuff is just going to keep on trickling in. It all boils down to what happened when in the timeline, really.
> 
> Time Magazine says that Broadwell wanted to get Lance Armstrong to ride bikes with Petraeus as a 60th birthday present. (Petraeus' bday was Nov 7, before he gave his resignation to Obama; Broadwell's two days later.)
> 
> ...


Re-reading this article--there is a lot in there. Together with the other articles, it's becoming clearer that although they interviewed Broadwell in late September, and confiscated her computer at that time, they didn't confront her with the evidence of the affair until Friday, November 2.



> Agents confronted Broadwell with their findings on Friday, Nov. 2. The agent’s interview report, on form FD-302, did not reach headquarters until late afternoon on Monday, Nov. 5. Mueller and Holder reviewed it the morning of Election Day and decided that the time was ripe for informing Clapper of the case.


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## Coffee Amore (Dec 15, 2011)

I wonder what Thanksgiving will be like this year at either the Petraeus or Broadwell families! Maybe they won't even celebrate it. Not much to be thankful for this year if you're the BS or the children...


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## iheartlife (Apr 4, 2012)

So, now the story moves from the serious media to the likes of People magazine...

David Petraeus, Paula Broadwell Scandal; She Regrets Affair: Report : People.com



> "She's been devastated by this," Paula Broadwell's brother, Stephen Kranz, tells PEOPLE in an exclusive interview. "She is filled with guilt and shame for what she's done and she's incredibly sorry for the pain she's caused her husband, her family, Petraseus's family. She accepts responsibility for her actions and knows she made a *mistake*."
> 
> "Now [she] is really focused on repairing and protecting her family and trying to really focus on her husband and her children and protect the kids from this," Kranz adds.


No, it wasn't a mistake. It was a poorly made, selfish choice.

Scott is telling various media outlets that a statement will be issued by the Broadwell family at some point. They hired a PR firm too (different from Kelley's). They are probably working on it as we speak.


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