# Am I a Jerk?



## bryantr (May 9, 2011)

Hey everybody, I'm a new guy, but been browsing here for a long time. 
I realize I will be probably get smacked around for this, but here goes: My wife is boring. I love her, I find her attractive, I think she is a wonderful mother, I think she has integrity/morals. That said, we are a complete mismatch. We spend very little time together outside the home, other than trips to Wal Mart and the occasional night out at a local restaurant that we have frequented the past eight years. If I suggest something different, or switching up our date routine, she gets annoyed or acts like she's put out. Her idea of free time activity is reading and going to church. I like just about everything: hiking,caving,camping,cooking out,day trips, museums, zoos, concerts etc. I simply love to explore and travel. My wife could care less, and I have tried to introduce new things to her. 
Sexually we mismatch. She never initiates, is comfortable with the same ole "vanilla" sex. She has a great body, but acts as if it's a sin to show the slightest bit of skin. So, her clothes make her look ten years older than she actually is. 
I know that, yes, that my wife has many qualities, but sometimes the boredom and sameness is almost suffocating. It's though I feel like I'm watching everyone else live while I sit in my little bubble with the wife while she bides sweet life away reading some stupid romance novel or watching DVR'ed episodes of Survivor.


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## Jamison (Feb 10, 2011)

Has she always been like this, even before you married her, or did things change at some point?


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

The problem is not the mismatch, it is the value judgement you are placing on it. You perceive your way as superior. It is causing you to resent her.

Would it work to try to look at it as a *difference* where both of you have equally valid desires? 

Have you discussed this with her? I might say something like hey I am bored. I would like to do X. Do you want to do it with me, or should I call Bill? Start doing the things you want to do with or without her. She might start to say hmmmm if I want to spend some time with him, maybe I ought to get out more.

wrt sex: Send her here to get a real idea of what passionate sex means to a man. Many women don't GET the import that it is key to how a man feels loved and valued. You need to speak to her, maybe again and again, until she GETS it. And/or drag her to MC.


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## Runs like Dog (Feb 25, 2011)

Sounds like my wife is committing bigamy. But seriously, for many people the most horrifying thing imaginable is change. My wife will drive in the right lane of the highway for hours because "I have to get on an exit ramp eventually.." Change is very traumatic, event the slightest deviation is rife with anxiety. Everything MUST be done rote, robotlike the same way every single time. It plays to some people's naturally hyper conservative nature.


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## bryantr (May 9, 2011)

Jamison said:


> Has she always been like this, even before you married her, or did things change at some point?


Always fairly conservative, but would occasionally go hiking or try out new restaurants, or a ball game. Thing is, when she has ventured out she has enjoyed it. 
Probably been worse the past three or four years, since the birth of our youngest child.


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## bryantr (May 9, 2011)

Mom6547 said:


> The problem is not the mismatch, it is the value judgement you are placing on it. You perceive your way as superior. It is causing you to resent her.
> 
> Would it work to try to look at it as a *difference* where both of you have equally valid desires?
> 
> ...


I have done my own thing, and she seems to care less. 
Sex? We'll talk about it, she'll get defensive and angry. Perhaps she'll wear some lingerie for a night or two to settle me down. But,inevitably, things get vanilla again-real quick. She don't get it, and probably never will. That's not being negative, just realistic. 
Another thing-she worries incessantly about money. We both do ok, very middle class, but live comfortably and within our means. Life to her is Survivor, novels, and fretting over the dang online banking account every saturday morning.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

bryantr said:


> I have done my own thing, and she seems to care less.
> Sex? We'll talk about it, she'll get defensive and angry. Perhaps she'll wear some lingerie for a night or two to settle me down. But,inevitably, things get vanilla again-real quick. She don't get it, and probably never will. That's not being negative, just realistic.


If you never make it CHRYSTAL clear HOW important it is to you, with ACTIONS what would ever motivate her to change.

Or you could just give up and live with it. 

HOW you go about this communication is important too. That is why CM seems like such a good idea.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

Honestly it sounds like you don't like her very much. Can I ask you a strange question? Why did you marry her?


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## bryantr (May 9, 2011)

Mom6547 said:


> Honestly it sounds like you don't like her very much. Can I ask you a strange question? Why did you marry her?


To be completely honest, there are times I feel like I made a mistake. We just don't have anything in common. When we met, I was (and still am) attracted to her, we did have some fun together. But, looking back, I should have known better. 
All that said, I'm not sure where you came to the opinion that I don't like her. I think resentment is a better word.
And, my way being superior? That she won't at least attempt to try something new makes her appear to be coming off superior.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

bryantr said:


> To be completely honest, there are times I feel like I made a mistake. We just don't have anything in common. When we met, I was (and still am) attracted to her, we did have some fun together. But, looking back, I should have known better.
> All that said, I'm not sure where you came to the opinion that I don't like her. I think resentment is a better word.
> And, my way being superior? That she won't at least attempt to try something new makes her appear to be coming off superior.


I was not trying to be critical. 


The not liking business... I guess I see liking someone as wanting to be with them, sharing the same interests. I like my husband a lot. We hike, we both love to cook. He has some interests that I don't share and vice versa. I like my friend Jane because we share experiences like dance.

You can even love someone without liking them much. 

I am not sure why the superior comment torqued you. If you look at it from the standpoint of who is RIGHT, the one who prefers home bodiness or the one who likes more activity, you are going to get off the track of how do we SOLVE this so you both can be HAPPY.


It sounds like you have a few choices

- Choose to continue as you are going, and resign yourself to feeling unfulfilled. (I would not personally chose this.)

- Decide that this is a deal breaker. Sit her down and tell her it is a deal breaker. Tell her you would rather work WITH her to help you achieve a more satisfying life. But if she won't take it seriously, then you will do it without her.

- Tell her that it is important, no deal breaker communication, and that it is important enough to you that you want her to go to MC. If she says no, go yourself. Many people don't like the idea of their spouse talking to someone without them getting to know what is being said.

Good luck!


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## MarriedWifeInLove (May 28, 2010)

Runs like Dog said:


> Sounds like my wife is committing bigamy.


:rofl:


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## Syrum (Feb 22, 2011)

I do believe both people in the relationship should be willing to do things and try things for the other person.

Is there something limiting her to trying new things? Does she allways have to do everything with the children and feel like she can never enjoy herself? Does she allways have to arrange a babysitter? things like that may make her less enthused to try new things with you.

I would let her know that you expect her to be fair, and that you will do the things she likes if she tries some things you like too. Even if it's just one new/ different thing a month.


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## bryantr (May 9, 2011)

Mom6547 said:


> I was not trying to be critical.
> 
> 
> The not liking business... I guess I see liking someone as wanting to be with them, sharing the same interests. I like my husband a lot. We hike, we both love to cook. He has some interests that I don't share and vice versa. I like my friend Jane because we share experiences like dance.
> ...


No worries, I just took it to heart I suppose. 
I agree, Option 1 is unacceptable, I will not live my life in a cocoon. Last time I checked, life is a one chance trip, and I think reincarnation aint' happening. 
I will suggest MC, but I'm prepared and expecting to go alone for awhile. Another thought, and this goes along with what you're saying. I think it's time to do what I want. Hopefully she'll either join in or we'll live under the same roof, but going in two different directions.


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

Sometimes people need a wake up call.


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## Tempted6119 (Apr 29, 2011)

Runs like Dog said:


> Sounds like my wife is committing bigamy. But seriously, for many people the most horrifying thing imaginable is change. My wife will drive in the right lane of the highway for hours because "I have to get on an exit ramp eventually.." Change is very traumatic, event the slightest deviation is rife with anxiety. Everything MUST be done rote, robotlike the same way every single time. It plays to some people's naturally hyper conservative nature.


Laughing because my hubby will stay in the left lane until the last possible moment and then try to switch lanes when there's a bunch of traffic and wonder why he can't get over. 
Drives me CRAZY. lol


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## evian123 (May 8, 2011)

It sounds like she is maybe suffering a little bit from not wanting to rock the boat. You mentioned this really started after having a child, so a lot of her attention has naturally gone to safety and routine - which is exactly what a child actually needs. It might be helpful for you to understand her position in this instance, that she probably has changed her identity a little bit to accommodate your child. But, she is also losing her personality in the process. Perhaps some gentle encouragement would help.

Oooh, you know what would help a lot - arrange a special treat surprise for her, but ensure that your child is well looked after while you two are away. And, make her see that you have thought of all the details EVERYTHING (which is what she has to do all day every day). That will make her feel secure, and it may encourage her to let go let loose. If she feels that everything is secure with the child, she will feel like she has a partner who is equally caring for your child, so it will help her relax.

I don't have a child, but i do know what it feels like to have someone or something you are responsible for. Caution, routine, safety - these things become part of one's self.


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## magnoliagal (Mar 30, 2011)

So she's worried about money and has a small child. These two things wouldn't inspire me to go out and do fun things. I'd want to stay at home and entertain myself frugally. Its what she values. She sounds like a homebody.

Why is she so worried about money?


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## Mom6547 (Jul 13, 2010)

I think the romantic stuff is good. But the risk here is that you cop a Nice Guy vibe. Three pronged approach
- discussions in which she is made to CLEARLY understand how important it is to you.
- read the Man Up threads in the Men's Clubhouse.
- read up on love languages and make sure you are making regular deposits into her love bank.
- discuss with her what things she would have change and really, really listen. (Most of us when asked for change naturally resist and defend as you see your wife doing. Don't be that guy. )


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## sisters359 (Apr 9, 2009)

You have a laundry list of complaints and to try to change everything at once would be daunting, to say the least. 

So, first, figure out what you want out of life and who you really are. I get the impression that you want your wife to enjoy all the stuff you do, that doing it on your own or with friends would not be enough. If that is true, maybe figure out why you are so needy in that regard (because it is pretty needy). If it is not true, and you just want some new things--1x/week, for example--in the mix, then aim for that. 

Also, some people (2 of my kids!) are extremely reluctant to "get going." It's just the way they are. They resist, resist, resist--and once you get them going, they have a blast. And yet, they'll repeat the whole routine the next time. 

The solution is, do not make saying no an option. Tell her, "Next Thursday, we are going to . . . " Then make the arrangements. Do not pay any attention to her lack of enthusiasm about going--just go. Enjoy the time together. Remember that she'll always be resistant but, if the pay off is more time doing something fun together, then it will be worth it. 

As for the sex--again, quit asking or suggesting. Just do. Introduce change slowly and gently (don't go all whips and chains suddenly on her). Add to your repetoire, so to speak. After a few months of that, tell her to take the lead next Saturday night (or whenever). Tell her you are excited to see her show you something she would like, and it does not have to be totally new. If you have introduced toys or different lighting or different positions or anything like that, and she makes an effort in one of those directions, be enthusiastic about it; she's trying. If not, just let it go and try again in a few more months. It may take her a long time to get comfortable with the idea, but with time and patience and no criticism or arguing, she may come around. Good luck. 

Oh, and don't ignore what someone else said. If you have been expecting her to be enthusiastic about doing things like hiking and camping with the kids, remember it is usually just a LOT more work for Mom in an unfamiliar environment and maybe not much fun from her point of view. That's why I suggest you make arrangements for a sitter and just go with her.


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## Affaircare (Jan 11, 2010)

Actually I think this may be a classic case of personality type differences: she's moreso an introvert--you're moreso and extrovert. Neither of you is "wrong"... just different than each other. 

Please check the Myers-Briggs Personality Test on the Quizzes page on our site, and I'll try to write more after work! .


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## AvaTara539 (Apr 10, 2011)

I agree with the concept that superiority might play a hand. That doesn't make you a bad person though, I applaud you for the honesty with which you explained your situation and frankly it could happen to anyone (anybody who says we do not judge each other in life is lying their pants off, it's human nature). If she's not open to adding any variety to your life, even in your outings, suggest going to a marriage counselor. Your needs are as important as hers.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

I wonder if entitlement also plays a role. There is so much that is positive in you existence and you want to walk away, it seems crazy to me. Are you certain that your dream woman exist and would she find you intellectually and sexually exciting? 

Suppose you are the boring one and a bad lover so you would not inspire excitement in a woman? While the focus is on your wife and what she sould do for you, what do you do for her? What role do you play in the dynamic? Maybe her anxiety about money and trying new things is because you have done things that made her lose confidence in your ability to find your way in the world. 

Just saying. she might describe your relationship quite differently. The way I see relationships is that it takes two people to generate excitement, unless you are paying for entertainment that is. If indeed you do have a role in the state of your marriage, do you think a new partner would solve your problems.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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## bryantr (May 9, 2011)

Catherine602 said:


> I wonder if entitlement also plays a role. There is so much that is positive in you existence and you want to walk away, it seems crazy to me. Are you certain that your dream woman exist and would she find you intellectually and sexually exciting?
> 
> Suppose you are the boring one and a bad lover so you would not inspire excitement in a woman? While the focus is on your wife and what she sould do for you, what do you do for her? What role do you play in the dynamic? Maybe her anxiety about money and trying new things is because you have done things that made her lose confidence in your ability to find your way in the world.
> 
> ...


*But* I have no intentions of leaving.  A couple of things: I've worked a good paying job since the day we met, and have been frugal with spending, and nothing has changed from that course in the past eight years. Second, I I don't believe in a "dream" woman. I believe anyone you meet will inevitably come with some disappointment. yes, without question, that goes for myself.


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## Trying my best (May 2, 2010)

Bryantr,

Can your wife hold eye contact? 

I'm married to someone with PDD-NOS tendencies, so when I read about how your wife needs things and events to be the same all the time - the strict routine - it rang a bell. Hence my question.

Hoping you and your wife can find some connection.


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## 4sure (Aug 8, 2010)

bryantr;31608 we'll live under the same roof said:


> This too gets lonesome, and tiresome after awhile. It also does not solve the sex issue, in fact it goes from some sex to no sex. Then what are you prepared to do.


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## Deejo (May 20, 2008)

Syrum said:


> I do believe both people in the relationship should be willing to do things and try things for the other person.
> 
> Is there something limiting her to trying new things? Does she allways have to do everything with the children and feel like she can never enjoy herself? Does she allways have to arrange a babysitter? things like that may make her less enthused to try new things with you.
> 
> I would let her know that you expect her to be fair, and that you will do the things she likes if she tries some things you like too. Even if it's just one new/ different thing a month.


I refer to this as 'Mama Bear Syndrome'.
Kids are her ultimate and unending focus. To the point where mama bear gets angry and chases off the male bear if he attempts to inject himself into, or change her routine ... including having fun.

Ex defined herself and her life according to the kids (still does), and for all intents and purposes completely abandoned the role of 'wife' and partner - meaning fostering of the marriage was utterly off her radar.

I briefly dated a Mama Bear as well. Her son has never had a babysitter .... NEVER ... he's about to turn 9. I could have shown up with tickets to Tahaiti, and instead of being excited ... she would have become panic-stricken, or flat out said 'No'. Needless to say, that wasn't a long relationship 

If you believe that what I outlined is the case, then you most definitely need to have a conversation about the trajectory of your marriage.

A lot of the input from the ladies seems strangely familiar ... can't put my finger on it ... but I think I've heard it before.


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## Catherine602 (Oct 14, 2010)

Deejo said:


> A lot of the input from the ladies seems strangely familiar ... can't put my finger on it ... but I think I've heard it before.


It all of the responses are farmiliar not just the ones from women. 

We don't seem to be addressing the contents of post from the opposite gender. The men are explaining things from the male viewpoint and women from the female viewpoint and we both think the other is wrong or clueless. Let's say at lest one person tried to understand the viewpoint of the other gender and accepted that it is a legitimate way of thinking of the problem. It stops this merry go round and allows people who are interested to get off. 

A case on point. I acknowledged to my husband the exact mistake that you alluded to in your post. I forgot to be a wife, it was a sad error based on ignorance. Although I felt we had problem brought on by my abandonment, my husband acknowledged his role too. That is how we recovered. My error was understandable and common and his reaction was equaly understandable and common. If he he did not say he had a role we would never have moved forward. He was big enough to do so even though he was in a considerable amount of pain as I latter found out. 

We men and women go around in circles. Most of the time we do not acknowledge the reasonableness of the other gender concerns and pain. A concession seems to equate to letting the other side win. This is a big problem. You need one person to acknowledge the view of the other side if the analysis is not inflammatory. (I am guilty of comments out of anger that are less than helpful myself).

I asked the poster to consider his role in the state of the relationship and the boredom. Judging from the post he does nit seem to have considered this. Let's say that he is not connecting because each person will not concede that the interest of the other is worthwhile and interesting. Let's say one of them decided to share sn activity that the other enjoyed, just to be with tha other person. Either the person reciprocates by sharing and getting to know about their interest or they assume that making the first move means that they accept that they are were wrong. 

Again judging by the poster, who is obviously venting, there is no repect for his wife because he applys un unflatering labels to her. Respect starts with the accepting that the other persons view and interests are valid. It is also making an effort not to denigrate a spouse.. I don't know what she calls him, but I'll bet she is equally disrespectful.

Avoiding labels makes it possible to be active in solving the problem. Labeling a person means that they have a fixed disposition that can not be changed so why bother to find a solution and missing a valuable oppurtunity.
_Posted via Mobile Device_


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