# Can people ever really change?



## IWantLove (Jun 20, 2009)

My husband and I have been married for just over four years, and we're reaching a breaking point. I never thought this would happen to me.

He is very introverted (almost to the point of being anti-social) and concentrated on his area of study, to the neglect of most other things in his life. I think I fell for him because he seemed more serious and noble than any other guy I had met or dated. Now I see that was a mistake. What I thought was interesting and noble has really turned out to be utterly one-dimensional and a hide-out from having to form meaningful relationships. 

He already has one masters degree and now wants to go back for a Ph.D. During his masters program, which he began the year before we got married and completed just a couple years ago, we hardly saw each other. I left my friends and family and moved across the country so we could be married and live together during his program. He made absolutely no time for me, despite my sacrifices. I was miserable because I had no friends in our new place of residence, I was far away from my family (to whom I'm extremely close), and I hated my job; I think it's the loneliest I've every been. Additionally, I have supported him financially throughout our entire marriage (through the program and various internships) by taking some very crappy jobs; none of this has been appreciated. I'm told, "If we really loved each other, you wouldn't be keeping score," or "You knew what you were getting into when you married me." (I didn't keep score until I ran some numbers last week. I only asked for a little acknowledgment of my hard work.) Now he expects me to do it all over again through a Ph.D. program, and when I told him I wasn't interested in continuing my life like that (the first time I put my foot down about anything), he distanced himself from me emotionally--this has been for over half our marriage.

In addition to his obsession with school, he just plain does not know how to love or be married. His parents, recently divorced, set a terrible example of what a loving marriage is. They were at odds and distant with each other from the time he was in seventh grade on. He can't and won't tell me how he feels--it's like pulling teeth--and he doesn't make an effort to engage me in my interests. We only talk about what he's interested in. This is what he observed in his parents' awful marriage, and this is what he's replicating in his own.

We started talking about how our marriage was taking a turn for the worse almost three months ago, and things have been getting worse since then. He says he'll try to make some changes--being more emotionally open and whatnot--but learning that he's been so shut off from me for so much of our marriage and realizing that he's committed more to his studies and work (and pretty much anything else) than he is to me makes me have zero trust that any changes would be permanent. I also think the only reason he wants to keep me around is so that I'll continue to support him financially.

My husband was out of town this past week, and it was a breath of fresh air. I had time and space to think about things and just say what I'm feeling out loud. Saying everything out loud made me realize that I don't think I love him anymore and that I don't think I'd be losing much--anything, really--by ending the marriage. That makes me sad; I wish I felt like I'd be losing something. 

So, my question is: Can people every really change? How much trust should I put in him that he can become an emotionally healthy person and that he can become more committed to the marriage? Has anyone had a similar experience? Please--I'd love to hear from you.

Thanks in advance for your support. I'm so glad to have found a site like this.


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## Sandy55 (Jun 3, 2009)

Your dh sounds like me. When I am in school (been there a lot because DH has always been unavailable and I enjoy learning...) I focus to the exclusion of everything around me. 

It sounds to me like he is very into his profession, and if you think you were lonely while he was in the other degree programs, the PhD is not going to be any picnic, trust me.

I think you have sent him a pretty clear message. Maybe you two could separate and you go back home and let him "mull" it over? Just live apart for a bit, get your bearings, and relax from the stress of it, then re-address the issues later?

Is there any reason you could not approach it that way?

Personally, I don't think he is going to back off until he gets the PhD. I've been wanting mine for about 16 years now (was in a program and then DS16 arrived unexpected in 1993), and plan on getting it back on track, when DH and I separate - very soon.


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## IWantLove (Jun 20, 2009)

Sandy, thanks so much for your response. I'm not surprised to hear that life during a Ph.D. program wouldn't be any better and that he probably won't back off until he gets the degree. The thing is that I don't think he's actually that into his profession--I think he just wants to be a perma-student. He doesn't really have a clear idea of what he would do with the Ph.D., and that's part of what's so frustrating. I haven't been able to get a clear answer from him.

I understand the love of learning. I read all the time and was even accepted into a Ph.D. program myself, but I knew it wouldn't be good for our relationship (I was tired of never seeing my husband), our finances (I was tired of being in debt), and I didn't really want to be a professor. So, I declined admission.

We are "back home" now (though he resents me for it). Our week apart made me think about separating just because it was so much less stressful, but our counselor has suggested that we try doing things together so that we're less distant from each other. I don't know how much he would mull things over anyway; he's very good at compartmentalizing--and I don't mean that in a good way. I don't know how much more time I'm willing to give to it to see how things are going to turn out. Sometimes I think I'm just being impatient, but on the other hand, I think that nothing will ever change and that biding my time in the marriage just to see would be, frankly, a waste of my time. But, thanks for the suggestions; they're all things I'll keep in mind.

Was your husband supportive of your education plans?


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## IWantLove (Jun 20, 2009)

Has anyone experienced a transformation in her/his spouse? Do these things actually happen? (In other words, should I hold my breath waiting for a change, or should I just move on with my life?)


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## Blanca (Jul 25, 2008)

IWantLove said:


> Can people every really change? How much trust should I put in him that he can become an emotionally healthy person and that he can become more committed to the marriage? Has anyone had a similar experience? Please--I'd love to hear from you.


I struggle with this a lot- especially in the beginning of my relationship. 

My H was really, really emotionally immature in the beginning (and so was I, i guess). we've been together for four years and married for two. i also moved with my H. i dropped everything for him. i was so alone and isolated. and he didnt even care. he would stay out all night with his coworkers and i never knew when he was coming home. i would find notes that said, 'i love you. wish i could be with you. im out with my coworkers tonight.' it was just awful. he wouldnt answer his phone, never talked to me, never wanted to be intimate with me, talked about me behind my back to his mom, and well, i could go on and on. I never did support him financially, though. my H has always been extremely responsible when it comes to finances. 

so anyway, back to your question. My H is completely different now. sometimes i catch myself reacting to the past and forgetting how different he is. he responds to me, talks to me, and seems to honestly care about me. we got in a fight just this weekend and he wrote me apologizing (even though he wasnt entirely responsible) and even asked me how what he did made me feel. i was pretty floored. i still get shocked by how different he is, and im afraid im the one that's still trapped in the past now. 

but even in reaching this point, there's so much trauma from having endured all the abuse for so many years that its kind of bitter sweet. ya, maybe he's changed, but i cant help but ask myself for how long? he's stopped going to counseling, stopped reading any books, doesnt ask to do our boundary book together anymore, so i wonder, even though he's changed and things are better now, was it worth it? i feel i'll always have to be asking him to work on the relationship so that it stays good and always have my guard up so i dont have to go through that again.


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## Sandy55 (Jun 3, 2009)

Spouses change all the time.

I would say my dh and I have changed quite a lot over the years. He has changed, has mellowed a great deal.

He is still compulsive and does not handle change well. I've just learned to work with it now, I changed me in order to work with it.

You must always remember when considering separating or leaving a spouse for the hope of a "better" match. The match often depends on how much you are willing to change to make it work. 

Always be careful when "exchanging one relationship for another: you will have to work through adjusting no matter who you marry. I hate to even think about working another relationship, I've done so much work on this one, I am inclined to try harder to hang onto the work already accomplished rather than starting all over. It is a learning process this marriage, and the learning NEVER stops, trust me!


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## 1nurse (Jan 21, 2009)

People can change for the better or the worse. Depends on what their moral character is and circumstances in which their in. What motivates someone to change is themselves. No one else can do this for them.


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## IWantLove (Jun 20, 2009)

1nurse, I agree with you. I only wish my H were motivated to change. His parents' divorce hasn't, I haven't, our failing marriage hasn't, and counseling hasn't. I don't know what it would take for him to make our marriage a priority for him. His idea of a compromise is making me equal in importance as school/work, and I don't feel like that's good enough.

Blanca, that's my fear--that he would change for the better but that I would always wonder how long it would last. What caused your H to change?

And Sandy, I understand it depends on how much you're willing to change to make things work. I'm tired of bending over backwards and doing all the work to make the marriage last. I know--I think about what it would be like to be in another relationship too. It's scary! I wonder if this is as good as it gets, and that depresses me. The thing is that while I do want all my effort in the marriage to pay off, I'm not willing to live the rest of my life like this--I'm not willing to continue to be so unimportant to my H. To your earlier response, when you asked if I had considered a separation, I am considering it much more strongly now. I'm thinking of asking him to leave for a couple weeks but want to see what our counselor says before we take action. I guess I'm not thinking of it as a true separation, more like a brief break so I can regain my physical health. (I've been experiencing heart palpitations, extreme fatigue, headaches, nausea, etc.)


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