# Coping with all of this nonsense



## Captainjacksparrow84

Not sure if what I did was correct, but heres my story.

I found some text messages about 4 years ago, between my wife and AP, I discovered these messages a couple months before my son was born. It was probably dumb looking back on it, but I held it inside for over a year, as the information slowly ate away at me. I did this because she was in the last trimested carrying my son, and then she had post-partum depression. During this time I put myself into counseling because I couldn't hande it on my own. I eventually confronted her about a year after it occured, where she proceeded to deny it, then she was like AP kissed me. I was pissed, but I was like I have a one year old, so I ignored it. Went to counseling, because I am supposed to believe my wife right? All the while my gut and intutition was telling me I'm wrong

Fast forward a few years later, we moved cities, and she is being distant. I chalk it up to the move and stresses of a new job etc. I wind up paying for a hotel for the weekend to send her out of town, because that is what she really wanted. A week after I booked the hotel, she was like oh hey, It's going to be a girls trip. I'm like cool.

Then I see a photo of the wife and another guy. So I confront her about it, and she says oh one of my gfs invited co-workers to come, and one of the other girls brought her husband. Wife didn't tell me it turned co-ed. That it turns out AP2, took a shower in the room that I bought her, and then my wife confesses that AP2 slept in her hotel room one night on the couch. She says "nothing happened" he's like my "little brother" We are just "friends"

This triggered all sorts of I guess PTSD about AP1, because they were "just friends" about a month ago, I confront her again about AP1, she says nothing happened. Gut still didn't buy it. Confronted her again 4 days later she says "oh he fingered me in the car one time" Fast forward to this week, I'm like I just don't buy that nothing further happened. No one goes to 3rd base and stops unless you are a teenager and don't really know what you are doing. I ask her what happened, then she proceeds to tell me, she gave him oral, and a HJ in the car, and he was ontop of her, but no penetration occured. (Yeah right). So then the day after this confrontation, I get an e-mail from her, yeah I did have sex with him, the stuff in the car happened after. I'm so sorry.

I'm not stupid, and just because you admitted to AP1's stuff four years ago, doesn't account for your denial on whats going on with AP2 whether it's emotional or physical (I think it's both) I mean why else hide who you are having stay in your hotel room.

Anyway I have a kid with her, and the thought of breaking up my family kills me. But the thought of me staying with someone who straight up lied to my face multiple times over the past 5 years, makes me want to vomit. Not too mention she's doing the same crap now.

I asked her to take a lie detector test after I found out about the fingering, and she wound up booking it, and then backing out on advice of her "counselor" the real reason she backed out was because she couldn't pass the test. But the reason she told me she didn't take it was "it is inaccurate, and it's all in how the questions are asked" Nah, it's because you didn't want to tell the truth.

I should also mention that the whole reason she didn't tell me, was because she "repressed it" because she said that she was sexually assault/molested when she was 9 and if she didn't say what happened out loud, then it didn't happen. Cool, I guess I can try that in court sometime. Yes Mr. Mrs. Judge, since I didn't say it out loud, then I wasn't going 20mph over the speed limit. Shouldn't the sexual assault/molestation be something that you tell your spouse about before you get married? Like that's a pretty big thing to know.

She says she still loves me, and wants to "try" I'm like why, so you can live in a nice house, and I can send you on a vacation you desperately said you needed to relax, so you can go and have a guy who you work with spend a night in your hotel room when "nothing happened"

She went to counseling the other day, and came home in one of the best moods I've seen her in, in a long time. I'm like must be nice getting rid of all that guilt, and hiding stuff from me for the past 5 years, while I"m over here trying to hold myself together. I don't feel like she has ever really had remorse, she has said sorry, but there doesn't seem to be much meaning behind it.

At the end of the day we didn't have very good communication, and that is part my responsability as well.

I asked her, why she finally decided to tel lme after all these years. She said she finally admitted because it was "Time for me to know, so that I could stop my tailspin"

She also keeps to the story that nothing physical happened with AP2, and that ever since she did the stuff with AP1 " I have honestly tried my best to be the wife you deserve " by what, having AP2? and at least an EA? if not a PA?

So a couple updates since then. One, I went on a trip, and I caught her looking at houses for a friend on the street next to AP2. Then this past week she was at a business conference, and I asked who was going, she never metnioned AP2. Come to find out AP2 was there, but she says she didn't interact with him blah blah blah, but her timeline shows an 8 hour gap where it looks like location services was turned off.

We had conversations, we went to counseling. We got kicked out, because she wouldn't admit she slept with the guy in the hotel, and refused to take a lie detector test. She refuses to get a new job, and refuses to stop being friends with guy number #2. She said that "she doesnt want to give up her social life" I told her if she doesn't want to give up a guy she's known for 6 months who is just "a friend" for her husband and her kid, then we are done. I asked her so what is it. She said she didn't know. So I sent her divorce papers that I had been working on. Today is a tough day. Never thought I would be here.


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## Imnobodynew

Hey, it's me, (the Reddit guy) Glad you Posted these people are great. No matter what choice you make or the changes you make, these people will help.


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## BeyondRepair007

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Not sure if what I did was correct, but heres my story.
> 
> I found some text messages about 4 years ago, between my wife and AP, I discovered these messages a couple months before my son was born. It was probably dumb looking back on it, but I held it inside for over a year, as the information slowly ate away at me. I did this because she was in the last trimested carrying my son, and then she had post-partum depression. During this time I put myself into counseling because I couldn't hande it on my own. I eventually confronted her about a year after it occured, where she proceeded to deny it, then she was like AP kissed me. I was pissed, but I was like I have a one year old, so I ignored it. Went to counseling, because I am supposed to believe my wife right? All the while my gut and intutition was telling me I'm wrong
> Fast forward a few years later, we moved cities, and she is being distant. I chalk it up to the move and stresses of a new job etc. I wind up paying for a hotel for the weekend to send her out of town, because that is what she really wanted. A week after I booked the hotel, she was like oh hey, It's going to be a girls trip. I'm like cool.
> Then I see a photo of the wife and another guy. So I confront her about it, and she says oh one of my gfs invited co-workers to come, and one of the other girls brought her husband. Wife didn't tell me it turned co-ed. That it turns out AP2, took a shower in the room that I bought her, and then my wife confesses that AP2 slept in her hotel room one night on the couch. She says "nothing happened" he's like my "little brother" We are just "friends"
> This triggered all sorts of I guess PTSD about AP1, because they were "just friends" about a month ago, I confront her again about AP1, she says nothing happened. Gut still didn't buy it. Confronted her again 4 days later she says "oh he fingered me in the car one time" Fast forward to this week, I'm like I just don't buy that nothing further happened. No one goes to 3rd base and stops unless you are a teenager and don't really know what you are doing. I ask her what happened, then she proceeds to tell me, she gave him oral, and a HJ in the car, and he was ontop of her, but no penetration occured. (Yeah right). So then the day after this confrontation, I get an e-mail from her, yeah I did have sex with him, the stuff in the car happened after. I'm so sorry.
> I'm not stupid, and just because you admitted to AP1's stuff four years ago, doesn't account for your denial on whats going on with AP2 whether it's emotional or physical (I think it's both) I mean why else hide who you are having stay in your hotel room.
> Anyway I have a kid with her, and the thought of breaking up my family kills me. But the thought of me staying with someone who straight up lied to my face multiple times over the past 5 years, makes me want to vomit. Not too mention she's doing the same crap now.
> I asked her to take a lie detector test after I found out about the fingering, and she wound up booking it, and then backing out on advice of her "counselor" the real reason she backed out was because she couldn't pass the test. But the reason she told me she didn't take it was "it is inaccurate, and it's all in how the questions are asked" Nah, it's because you didn't want to tell the truth.
> I should also mention that the whole reason she didn't tell me, was because she "repressed it" because she said that she was sexually assault/molested when she was 9 and if she didn't say what happened out loud, then it didn't happen. Cool, I guess I can try that in court sometime. Yes Mr. Mrs. Judge, since I didn't say it out loud, then I wasn't going 20mph over the speed limit. Shouldn't the sexual assault/molestation be something that you tell your spouse about before you get married? Like that's a pretty big thing to know.
> She says she still loves me, and wants to "try" I'm like why, so you can live in a nice house, and I can send you on a vacation you desperately said you needed to relax, so you can go and have a guy who you work with spend a night in your hotel room when "nothing happened"
> She went to counseling the other day, and came home in one of the best moods I've seen her in, in a long time. I'm like must be nice getting rid of all that guilt, and hiding stuff from me for the past 5 years, while I"m over here trying to hold myself together. I don't feel like she has ever really had remorse, she has said sorry, but there doesn't seem to be much meaning behind it.
> At the end of the day we didn't have very good communication, and that is part my responsability as well.
> I asked her, why she finally decided to tel lme after all these years. She said she finally admitted because it was "Time for me to know, so that I could stop my tailspin"
> She also keeps to the story that nothing physical happened with AP2, and that ever since she did the stuff with AP1 " I have honestly tried my best to be the wife you deserve " by what, having AP2? and at least an EA? if not a PA?
> 
> So a couple updates since then. One, I went on a trip, and I caught her looking at houses for a friend on the street next to AP2. Then this past week she was at a business conference, and I asked who was going, she never metnioned AP2. Come to find out AP2 was there, but she says she didn't interact with him blah blah blah, but her timeline shows an 8 hour gap where it looks like location services was turned off.
> 
> We had conversations, we went to counseling. We got kicked out, because she wouldn't admit she slept with the guy in the hotel, and refused to take a lie detector test. She refuses to get a new job, and refuses to stop being friends with guy number #2. She said that "she doesnt want to give up her social life" I told her if she doesn't want to give up a guy she's known for 6 months who is just "a friend" for her husband and her kid, then we are done. I asked her so what is it. She said she didn't know. So I sent her divorce papers that I had been working on. Today is a tough day. Never thought I would be here.


Captain, wow this is a really tragic story.

Bottom line I'm a little confused about your question "If what I did was correct"? You mean giving her divorce papers?

/Harsh word alert
Because giving her divorce papers is just about the only thing I see that is done right.
She has been using, manipulating, lying, and cheating on you for your whole relationship.

This screams serial cheater.
And when you found out...or even just suspected, you let her get away with it.
That is not the way to get her to stop, as you found out.
What you did is called rugssweeping, meaning ignore it and hope it goes away.
That NEVER works.

I don't think there's a snowball's chance in <you know> that she can or even will want, to reform.

It's best that you cut this one loose and start working on yourself.
Never let this happen again to yourself.

Counseling + lots of educating yourself on being a leader in your household.


I'm really sorry you're here in this situation but the people here are really sharp.
Put the details out there and someone will have experienced before and can help, I can assure you.


How many years were you married to this...person. (for lack of an appropriate word)
How old is your son? 4ish?
Just the one child?


Best of luck to you OP.


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## BeyondRepair007

Oh, and DNA test your son. ASAP.


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## Vorpal

Hate to say it, but you need to DNA the kid. Get out as quickly as possible. In many states 10 years makes it a long term marriage and that has huge financial consequences.


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## Imnobodynew

Vorpal said:


> Hate to say it, but you need to DNA the kid. Get out as quickly as possible. In many states 10 years makes it a long term marriage and that has huge financial consequences.


Here in Florida your on spousal support for life @ the 10 year mark.


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## red oak

It’s hard when a child is involved, but the child will sense the stress in the home and it’s often better for the child to divorce. 
I would dna test as also.


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## Talker67

it is possible to give the man a handy and a bj and NOT have penetrative sex. it after all IS a car and there is limited room. but for sure both of them orgasmed. 

it is certainly possible they then went off to a hotel room for hours of pounding, so you are not in the clear at all.

wives just do not allow other men to "finger" them unless they are cheaters or have an open marriage.
is there any chance you might have given her a subconscious message that it would be ok to have sex with other men? Possibly as a result of you rug sweeping her first affair? Did she ever ask you for a "don't ask, don't tell" arrangement?

if not, it was just bold faced cheating, and yes you need to divorce her. She is not horny for you, she has to go to a different town and get some strange that way to be fully satisfied.

if you do not divorce her now, she certainly WILL take it as permission to continue life with you as her cuckold. so be careful what you say and do now with her.


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## jsmart

You’ve allowed her to lie to you for so long that you’re now used to the emotional abuse. She’s pulling a “are you going to believe me or your lying eyes”.

I also, advise that you dna the kid. The timing between the APs is enough to warrant suspicion. Also, her actions are of a woman that is completely in wuv with AP2. You are there to pay bills and help with the raising of the kid. Would be horrendous if it turns out you have been putting all of your time and resources into another man’s kid.


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## Talker67

jsmart said:


> You’ve allowed her to lie to you for so long that you’re now used to the emotional abuse. She’s pulling a “are you going to believe me or your lying eyes”.
> 
> I also, advise that you dna the kid. The timing between the APs is enough to warrant suspicion. Also, her actions are of a woman that is completely in wuv with AP2. *You are there to pay bills and help with the raising of the kid.* Would be horrendous if it turns out you have been putting all of your time and resources into another man’s kid.


indeed, a standard cuckold arrangement for the OP


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## moulinyx

Your soon to be ex wife has quite literally backed you into a corner. I do believe marriage can survive almost anything but it does require both parties to really, really want it. You gave her bare minimum requirements allow you to forgive while protecting yourself - distancing from AP2 should have been a no brainer. I also would not believe that nothing happened with AP2 while he "stayed on the couch". 


You are so strong for serving those papers. Good on your for not kicking the idea around for years and holding your boundaries.


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## Megaforce

Good. Divorce quick. You know the tip of the iceberg. Most cheating goes undetected forever. You stumbled across two. What are the odds you know everything.
Frankly, your wife sounds nuts and immoral. Not terribly bright, either. Immoral and dumb-very bad combination.


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## Lostinthought61

She is a chronic liar and truly a deceitful person, you are doing the best thing for your own sanity and in the long run for your son. Make sure she does not control the narrative of your relationship, she is the type of person to spin this six ways to sunday...good luck friend


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## Imnobodynew

This goes back to. Do you really want someone who keeps opening their legs outsiders without regard to you or your son? I couldn't put up with it.


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## BeyondRepair007

I don't know what 'divorce papers' you gave her, your language was a little fluffy about that.

Make sure you've seen a lawyer and those papers go past him.
You have a son to think about. Or someone's son anyway.

It's possible (from her lack of enthusiasm) that she won't fight a divorce or be super demanding.
But prepare for the worst. Lawyer up.


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## jsmart

You had her served with d papers? I must have missed that but it is way over due. We all know that you don’t want your kid growing up in a broken home but your WW has given you no choice. Her mouth is saying she wants to make the marriage work but her actions are saying, she doesn’t love you and is in fact in love with AP2. 

She actually brought him to a couples outing, which means all of her friends and their spouses know that she’s having an affair. Great set of friends, right? She also brought him to a work event, which means they all know she’s with another man, or she’s been telling everyone that he is her man. Which for intents and purposes, he practically is. You’re the guy she give duty sex to as payment for your household, child rearing duties and let’s not forget them bills. Her AP, gets the hot girl, who’s enthusiastically giving herself.

So don’t cave into any waterworks from her. Those are only tears for the hardship, she will have to endure as a single mom. The D process takes time. In that time get busy working on yourself, so you can stop the co-dependency you suffer from.

The best way to get her out of your system, is to implement the 180. It is not a manipulation tool. It is to help you detach. Once you dump her and go through the withdrawal, you will see that there are good loyal women out there. You will only regret not pulling the divorce trigger sooner.


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## Mr.Married

I can’t believe you ate all those lies that long. That is almost inconceivable. It’s great that you finally stood up for yourself but I will say this: If you don’t go through with the divorce you pretty much deserve what you get. The only word would be ….. coward. Don’t do that. Don’t be that guy. Get off the floor and stand up straight… chin up. Get your head right because she obviously knows how to play the game. Prepare yourself.


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## Openminded

Serial cheaters don’t change. Keep that in mind if/when she makes all those promises to keep you from divorcing her.


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## moulinyx

Mr.Married said:


> I can’t believe you ate all those lies that long. That is almost inconceivable. It’s great that you finally stood up for yourself but I will say this: If you don’t go through with the divorce you pretty much deserve what you get. The only word would be ….. coward. Don’t do that. Don’t be that guy. Get off the floor and stand up straight… chin up. Get your head right because she obviously knows how to play the game. Prepare yourself.


Agreed. Dont let short term mourning turn into a lifetime of regret and misery. You will get through it and these sad feelings are temporary. I frequently read stories on here regarding updates post divorce and the OP is thriving every time. New relationships, happiness, and finally at peace again.


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## thunderchad

Basically what you are saying is your wife is a liar and a cheater. I see no other option that to leave her immediately. NEVER STAY WITH A CHEATER.


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## GusPolinski

She’s lying.

DNA the kid.


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## sokillme

Isn't multiple sexual acts with two different guys including a vacation with one of them enough? Or is it only DIV-sex that would make you leave this awful abusive person? Does she have like a magic V or something? Every other body part is OK but that one? What are we taking about here?

By the way seems to be a rash or women saying that hotel rooms with men but nothing happened. Or maybe it's your wife posting on SI given some of the details she mentions, no one believes her either. 

Come on OP, your wife is a lying unrepentant serial cheater, with almost sociopathic tendencies. It's amazing to me that you were still thinking that marriage counseling would fix this. There is no fixing this. DNA test your kids.

I got to say, and I am really not trying to kick you when you are down, but "you thought you would never be here"?. How is this possible? She was lying to you repeatedly for months, years actually and had multiple affairs and this outcome is a surprise to you? That is a very big problem. Your wife has been a terrible wife from the point AP 1 showed up and I am willing to bet a whole lot longer then that.

From the point of AP1 on it seems like a lot of this story is about you being unwilling to confront reality. You basically let AP1 go. You need to go get some counseling about that, because if you don't you are liable to end up with someone exactly like your wife again. Cheaters and narcissists look for folks who are willing to ignore their nonsense. Better to call people like that on their bad behavior from the very beginning, because they will see you as too much trouble and move on. There was a huge amount of red flags here, she has obviously been lying to you from the beginning.

Because of all that make sure you get a very good lawyer, there is a good chance your wife will NOT be nice during your divorce there will be no need for the facade any longer so it's going to disappear and you will get to see her true nature. You are going to need to be ready to fight hard. Document everything. Make your kids a priority and document all the time you spend with them. Make sure you know their teachers, friends, things they are into. Protect your money, document all the money she has spent on her AP. You need to get strong quick and start fighting for yourself.


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## Tatsuhiko

It's also disturbing that she doesn't seem too broken up about all that's happened. Her apology is something like "Gee, sorry" as she watches her marriage fall apart. Is she even capable of empathy?


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## No Longer Lonely Husband

Tatsuhiko said:


> It's also disturbing that she doesn't seem too broken up about all that's happened. Her apology is something like "Gee, sorry" as she watches her marriage fall apart. Is she even capable of empathy?


You hit the nail on the head.she could care less about OP.


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## No Longer Lonely Husband

My advice is get a DNA test on the child, and find a good divorce lawyer to protect your assets. Cut her loose. If you think you can have a solid marriage with her you are only fooling yourself.


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## Marc878

You only had 2 choices.
Stay and get more of what you’ve gotten.
Divorce her and limit contact. 
I’m with everyone else. DNA test the child. I’d also have STD testing.
Hopefully you’ve learned all cheaters lie. A lot.


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## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> At the end of the day we didn't have very good communication, and that is part my responsability as well.


She is blame shifting


Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> So I sent her divorce papers that I had been working on. Today is a tough day. Never thought I would be here.


The divorce is exactly right. The only thing you did wrong was delaying the divorce as long as you did. Five years out of your life, followed by years to recover from the damage that she did is a significant fraction of your time on this planet. Your STBXW is an evil serial cheater. You know of two partners, she has probably had 20 since you have been married ( which you don';t mention how long that has been. ). She may have been giving coworkers BJs in the parking lot since you married her.

Today is a tough day, but the sun also rises. You have finally taken action to begin healing. No one ever thinks they will be where you are, but thanks to evil people, there are many betrayed who end up in the same place you are. 

Not that it matters, but in your shoes I would DNA the kid(s). You may be raising AP1's spawn.


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## Evinrude58

Please divorce this wretched, narcissistic b.
Today if possible.
Her lies, total lack of remorse, and the fact that she’s still banging the second dude, pretty much demands it.

You rugswept the first affair. Got more cheating as a result. Would have happened anyway, she’s a serial, but you have likely gotten free of her.

can I chime in that you should dna test your son. Like really need to!!!

I’m very sorry you have a dud. Please extricate yourself from this nightmare.


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## TexasMom1216

Everyone makes mistakes. What really matters is what you do next. Start today, stay making changes so you can have a good life too. No one deserves this.


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## ABHale

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Not sure if what I did was correct, but heres my story.
> 
> I found some text messages about 4 years ago, between my wife and AP, I discovered these messages a couple months before my son was born. It was probably dumb looking back on it, but I held it inside for over a year, as the information slowly ate away at me. I did this because she was in the last trimested carrying my son, and then she had post-partum depression. During this time I put myself into counseling because I couldn't hande it on my own. I eventually confronted her about a year after it occured, where she proceeded to deny it, then she was like AP kissed me. I was pissed, but I was like I have a one year old, so I ignored it. Went to counseling, because I am supposed to believe my wife right? All the while my gut and intutition was telling me I'm wrong
> Fast forward a few years later, we moved cities, and she is being distant. I chalk it up to the move and stresses of a new job etc. I wind up paying for a hotel for the weekend to send her out of town, because that is what she really wanted. A week after I booked the hotel, she was like oh hey, It's going to be a girls trip. I'm like cool.
> Then I see a photo of the wife and another guy. So I confront her about it, and she says oh one of my gfs invited co-workers to come, and one of the other girls brought her husband. Wife didn't tell me it turned co-ed. That it turns out AP2, took a shower in the room that I bought her, and then my wife confesses that AP2 slept in her hotel room one night on the couch. She says "nothing happened" he's like my "little brother" We are just "friends"
> This triggered all sorts of I guess PTSD about AP1, because they were "just friends" about a month ago, I confront her again about AP1, she says nothing happened. Gut still didn't buy it. Confronted her again 4 days later she says "oh he fingered me in the car one time" Fast forward to this week, I'm like I just don't buy that nothing further happened. No one goes to 3rd base and stops unless you are a teenager and don't really know what you are doing. I ask her what happened, then she proceeds to tell me, she gave him oral, and a HJ in the car, and he was ontop of her, but no penetration occured. (Yeah right). So then the day after this confrontation, I get an e-mail from her, yeah I did have sex with him, the stuff in the car happened after. I'm so sorry.
> I'm not stupid, and just because you admitted to AP1's stuff four years ago, doesn't account for your denial on whats going on with AP2 whether it's emotional or physical (I think it's both) I mean why else hide who you are having stay in your hotel room.
> Anyway I have a kid with her, and the thought of breaking up my family kills me. But the thought of me staying with someone who straight up lied to my face multiple times over the past 5 years, makes me want to vomit. Not too mention she's doing the same crap now.
> I asked her to take a lie detector test after I found out about the fingering, and she wound up booking it, and then backing out on advice of her "counselor" the real reason she backed out was because she couldn't pass the test. But the reason she told me she didn't take it was "it is inaccurate, and it's all in how the questions are asked" Nah, it's because you didn't want to tell the truth.
> I should also mention that the whole reason she didn't tell me, was because she "repressed it" because she said that she was sexually assault/molested when she was 9 and if she didn't say what happened out loud, then it didn't happen. Cool, I guess I can try that in court sometime. Yes Mr. Mrs. Judge, since I didn't say it out loud, then I wasn't going 20mph over the speed limit. Shouldn't the sexual assault/molestation be something that you tell your spouse about before you get married? Like that's a pretty big thing to know.
> She says she still loves me, and wants to "try" I'm like why, so you can live in a nice house, and I can send you on a vacation you desperately said you needed to relax, so you can go and have a guy who you work with spend a night in your hotel room when "nothing happened"
> She went to counseling the other day, and came home in one of the best moods I've seen her in, in a long time. I'm like must be nice getting rid of all that guilt, and hiding stuff from me for the past 5 years, while I"m over here trying to hold myself together. I don't feel like she has ever really had remorse, she has said sorry, but there doesn't seem to be much meaning behind it.
> At the end of the day we didn't have very good communication, and that is part my responsability as well.
> I asked her, why she finally decided to tel lme after all these years. She said she finally admitted because it was "Time for me to know, so that I could stop my tailspin"
> She also keeps to the story that nothing physical happened with AP2, and that ever since she did the stuff with AP1 " I have honestly tried my best to be the wife you deserve " by what, having AP2? and at least an EA? if not a PA?
> 
> So a couple updates since then. One, I went on a trip, and I caught her looking at houses for a friend on the street next to AP2. Then this past week she was at a business conference, and I asked who was going, she never metnioned AP2. Come to find out AP2 was there, but she says she didn't interact with him blah blah blah, but her timeline shows an 8 hour gap where it looks like location services was turned off.
> 
> We had conversations, we went to counseling. We got kicked out, because she wouldn't admit she slept with the guy in the hotel, and refused to take a lie detector test. She refuses to get a new job, and refuses to stop being friends with guy number #2. She said that "she doesnt want to give up her social life" I told her if she doesn't want to give up a guy she's known for 6 months who is just "a friend" for her husband and her kid, then we are done. I asked her so what is it. She said she didn't know. So I sent her divorce papers that I had been working on. Today is a tough day. Never thought I would be here.


Your divorce papers are 4 years to late. 

She has never been faithful. You only know of the two PA’s. Who knows how many affairs and ONS’s she had.


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## bricks

There is no more skilled liar than a cheating spouse. The feel of it all is so familiar to many on here. You have done the right thing


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

BeyondRepair007 said:


> Captain, wow this is a really tragic story.
> 
> Bottom line I'm a little confused about your question "If what I did was correct"? You mean giving her divorce papers?
> 
> /Harsh word alert
> Because giving her divorce papers is just about the only thing I see that is done right.
> She has been using, manipulating, lying, and cheating on you for your whole relationship.
> 
> This screams serial cheater.
> And when you found out...or even just suspected, you let her get away with it.
> That is not the way to get her to stop, as you found out.
> What you did is called rugssweeping, meaning ignore it and hope it goes away.
> That NEVER works.
> 
> I don't think there's a snowball's chance in <you know> that she can or even will want, to reform.
> 
> It's best that you cut this one loose and start working on yourself.
> Never let this happen again to yourself.
> 
> Counseling + lots of educating yourself on being a leader in your household.
> 
> 
> I'm really sorry you're here in this situation but the people here are really sharp.
> Put the details out there and someone will have experienced before and can help, I can assure you.
> 
> 
> How many years were you married to this...person. (for lack of an appropriate word)
> How old is your son? 4ish?
> Just the one child?
> 
> 
> Best of luck to you OP.


11 years. kid is 4.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

BeyondRepair007 said:


> I don't know what 'divorce papers' you gave her, your language was a little fluffy about that.
> 
> Make sure you've seen a lawyer and those papers go past him.
> You have a son to think about. Or someone's son anyway.
> 
> It's possible (from her lack of enthusiasm) that she won't fight a divorce or be super demanding.
> But prepare for the worst. Lawyer up.


So I had a lawyer draft up papers, and I sent them to her.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

sokillme said:


> Isn't multiple sexual acts with two different guys including a vacation with one of them enough? Or is it only DIV-sex that would make you leave this awful abusive person? Does she have like a magic V or something? Every other body part is OK but that one? What are we taking about here?
> 
> By the way seems to be a rash or women saying that hotel rooms with men but nothing happened. Or maybe it's your wife posting on SI given some of the details she mentions, no one believes her either.
> 
> Come on OP, your wife is a lying unrepentant serial cheater, with almost sociopathic tendencies. It's amazing to me that you were still thinking that marriage counseling would fix this. There is no fixing this. DNA test your kids.
> 
> I got to say, and I am really not trying to kick you when you are down, but "you thought you would never be here"?. How is this possible? She was lying to you repeatedly for months, years actually and had multiple affairs and this outcome is a surprise to you? That is a very big problem. Your wife has been a terrible wife from the point AP 1 showed up and I am willing to bet a whole lot longer then that.
> 
> From the point of AP1 on it seems like a lot of this story is about you being unwilling to confront reality. You basically let AP1 go. You need to go get some counseling about that, because if you don't you are liable to end up with someone exactly like your wife again. Cheaters and narcissists look for folks who are willing to ignore their nonsense. Better to call people like that on their bad behavior from the very beginning, because they will see you as too much trouble and move on. There was a huge amount of red flags here, she has obviously been lying to you from the beginning.
> 
> Because of all that make sure you get a very good lawyer, there is a good chance your wife will NOT be nice during your divorce there will be no need for the facade any longer so it's going to disappear and you will get to see her true nature. You are going to need to be ready to fight hard. Document everything. Make your kids a priority and document all the time you spend with them. Make sure you know their teachers, friends, things they are into. Protect your money, document all the money she has spent on her AP. You need to get strong quick and start fighting for yourself.


Yeah, so I am in counseling, and I did confront her about it after AP 1, and I let her Rug Sweep it, but I finally got that admission 4 years later, but then this AP2 came in the picture. Honestly most of my counseling sessions have been on getting me to the point to give her papers. I got a long road to go, and I know that.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Tatsuhiko said:


> It's also disturbing that she doesn't seem too broken up about all that's happened. Her apology is something like "Gee, sorry" as she watches her marriage fall apart. Is she even capable of empathy?


I really don't think she shows any kind of empathy, at least not to me anyways. Maybe at work or with her friends, but certainly not to me. You'd think if you gave some an ultimatium, it'd be an easy choice, family or ap2, but she seems to want to have her cake and eat it too. She doesn't know whats going to happen to me or the ap2 so she isn't willing to let go. Hopefully the AP realizes what they are getting into and gets out too.


----------



## Openminded

Are you 100% sure her child is actually your child?


----------



## Rus47

Openminded said:


> Are you 100% sure her child is actually your child?


Unless he DNA tested the child there is no way he could know.

Shouldn’t he get STD testing? As active as his WW has been over years it would be no surprise if she has passed on a disease to him


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> So I had a lawyer draft up papers, and I sent them to her.


Is your attorney driving the process? If not you should have the attorney take the lead. Even I can fill in form for divorce suit and have no legal training. You need competent legal representation for this complex process.

When does wayward have to respond to the lawsuit?  If she retains an attorney, which she should, you will need an attorney or you will be skinned alive and tacked to the barn door.


----------



## TexasMom1216

Rus47 said:


> you will be skinned alive and tacked to the barn door.


Quick T/j, stealing this fantastic and vivid phrase for my personal vernacular. It is glorious. 
Carry on.


----------



## SRCSRC

Stay the course and get rid of your WW. I divorced my ex-WW after discovering her "known" second affair just before the 10-year mark of the marriage. We had a three-year-old son. Good co-parenting left him with minimal scars. There was no way in hell I could stay with her after the second affair. I felt totally liberated, though horrible for my child. So, my story isn't very different than your story. Believe me, you can't stay with a non-repentant serial cheater. It will just kill you. Your son will be ok provided you try and stay amicable with the WW from this point forward. 

Try and convince the WW that it is in the interest of the three of you to have a quick, amicable, fair divorce. That should be your focus. Don't bother with blame. Concentrate on getting rid of her ASAP. You can then heal and get on with your life. She is simply horrible.


----------



## BeyondRepair007

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I really don't think she shows any kind of empathy, at least not to me anyways. Maybe at work or with her friends, but certainly not to me. You'd think if you gave some an ultimatium, it'd be an easy choice, family or ap2, but she seems to want to have her cake and eat it too. She doesn't know whats going to happen to me or the ap2 so she isn't willing to let go. Hopefully the AP realizes what they are getting into and gets out too.


You need to stop thinking about what she’s doing and where she will go. That’s her problem now as long as your son is safe. She has showed you what she thinks of you. Don’t try to make it something else.

Quit thinking of OM1 or 2 or even what your WW might or might not do. She might shack up with one or both of them afterward. She might end up with OM3,4,5 who knows. Stop caring.

Go after the divorce as fast as you can. No contact with WW except in matters pertaining to your son. Everything else can go through your lawyer. Don’t talk to her. Force email or text for all communication (for documentation purposes) and only respond to her about son-issues.

Get everything else out of your head and stop caring about what happens to her or APs. Just focus on following the legal advice and taking care of yourself and your son.


----------



## jlg07

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Yeah, so I am in counseling, and I did confront her about it after AP 1, and I let her Rug Sweep it, but I finally got that admission 4 years later, but then this AP2 came in the picture. Honestly most of my counseling sessions have been on getting me to the point to give her papers. I got a long road to go, and I know that.


You are moving in the right direction -- keep it up!


----------



## wmn1

BeyondRepair007 said:


> Captain, wow this is a really tragic story.
> 
> Bottom line I'm a little confused about your question "If what I did was correct"? You mean giving her divorce papers?
> 
> /Harsh word alert
> Because giving her divorce papers is just about the only thing I see that is done right.
> She has been using, manipulating, lying, and cheating on you for your whole relationship.
> 
> This screams serial cheater.
> And when you found out...or even just suspected, you let her get away with it.
> That is not the way to get her to stop, as you found out.
> What you did is called rugssweeping, meaning ignore it and hope it goes away.
> That NEVER works.
> 
> I don't think there's a snowball's chance in <you know> that she can or even will want, to reform.
> 
> It's best that you cut this one loose and start working on yourself.
> Never let this happen again to yourself.
> 
> Counseling + lots of educating yourself on being a leader in your household.
> 
> 
> I'm really sorry you're here in this situation but the people here are really sharp.
> Put the details out there and someone will have experienced before and can help, I can assure you.
> 
> 
> How many years were you married to this...person. (for lack of an appropriate word)
> How old is your son? 4ish?
> Just the one child?
> 
> 
> Best of luck to you OP.


amen


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I really don't think she shows any kind of empathy, at least not to me anyways. Maybe at work or with her friends, but certainly not to me. You'd think if you gave some an ultimatium, it'd be an easy choice, family or ap2, but she seems to want to have her cake and eat it too. She doesn't know whats going to happen to me or the ap2 so she isn't willing to let go. Hopefully the AP realizes what they are getting into and gets out too.


Forgot to ask, are either of the APs married? If so, have you contacted their spouse? They deserve to know. 

Once AP2 ( or 3 or 4 ) find out they are going to have your WW full time, they will dump her. If they are married they will dump her even sooner. She is only of interest to them for NSA sex

Let all of the families know what has been going on for years. Before she starts rewriting history, 

From here on you need to be 100% no contact with her, wear a VOR and only deal with her through your attorney.


----------



## wmn1

jsmart said:


> You had her served with d papers? I must have missed that but it is way over due. We all know that you don’t want your kid growing up in a broken home but your WW has given you no choice. Her mouth is saying she wants to make the marriage work but her actions are saying, she doesn’t love you and is in fact in love with AP2.
> 
> She actually brought him to a couples outing, which means all of her friends and their spouses know that she’s having an affair. Great set of friends, right? She also brought him to a work event, which means they all know she’s with another man, or she’s been telling everyone that he is her man. Which for intents and purposes, he practically is. You’re the guy she give duty sex to as payment for your household, child rearing duties and let’s not forget them bills. Her AP, gets the hot girl, who’s enthusiastically giving herself.
> 
> So don’t cave into any waterworks from her. Those are only tears for the hardship, she will have to endure as a single mom. The D process takes time. In that time get busy working on yourself, so you can stop the co-dependency you suffer from.
> 
> The best way to get her out of your system, is to implement the 180. It is not a manipulation tool. It is to help you detach. Once you dump her and go through the withdrawal, you will see that there are good loyal women out there. You will only regret not pulling the divorce trigger sooner.


yes this !!!! F her


----------



## marko polo

Divorce is the correct course.

As others have already told you DNA test your child and verify they are yours instead of AP's. 

Allow your lawyer to handle all communications between you. If you have to talk to your former wide then it should only be about the divorce or childcare. Anything else you ignore or simply do not respond to.

Voice calls if it is an emergency concerning the child. If she is having an emergency she can call her current AP.
Txt and email work best.


----------



## Imnobodynew

Yeah I also mentioned to him privately to carry a VAR if its legal in his state. Too many false DV cases in these typE of cases where the serial creator tries to control the narrative by using the law to keep the kid away from the faithful.


----------



## colingrant

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Not sure if what I did was correct, but heres my story.
> 
> I found some text messages about 4 years ago, between my wife and AP, I discovered these messages a couple months before my son was born. It was probably dumb looking back on it, but I held it inside for over a year, as the information slowly ate away at me. I did this because she was in the last trimested carrying my son, and then she had post-partum depression. During this time I put myself into counseling because I couldn't hande it on my own. I eventually confronted her about a year after it occured, where she proceeded to deny it, then she was like AP kissed me. I was pissed, but I was like I have a one year old, so I ignored it. Went to counseling, because I am supposed to believe my wife right? All the while my gut and intutition was telling me I'm wrong
> Fast forward a few years later, we moved cities, and she is being distant. I chalk it up to the move and stresses of a new job etc. I wind up paying for a hotel for the weekend to send her out of town, because that is what she really wanted. A week after I booked the hotel, she was like oh hey, It's going to be a girls trip. I'm like cool.
> Then I see a photo of the wife and another guy. So I confront her about it, and she says oh one of my gfs invited co-workers to come, and one of the other girls brought her husband. Wife didn't tell me it turned co-ed. That it turns out AP2, took a shower in the room that I bought her, and then my wife confesses that AP2 slept in her hotel room one night on the couch. She says "nothing happened" he's like my "little brother" We are just "friends"
> This triggered all sorts of I guess PTSD about AP1, because they were "just friends" about a month ago, I confront her again about AP1, she says nothing happened. Gut still didn't buy it. Confronted her again 4 days later she says "oh he fingered me in the car one time" Fast forward to this week, I'm like I just don't buy that nothing further happened. No one goes to 3rd base and stops unless you are a teenager and don't really know what you are doing. I ask her what happened, then she proceeds to tell me, she gave him oral, and a HJ in the car, and he was ontop of her, but no penetration occured. (Yeah right). So then the day after this confrontation, I get an e-mail from her, yeah I did have sex with him, the stuff in the car happened after. I'm so sorry.
> I'm not stupid, and just because you admitted to AP1's stuff four years ago, doesn't account for your denial on whats going on with AP2 whether it's emotional or physical (I think it's both) I mean why else hide who you are having stay in your hotel room.
> Anyway I have a kid with her, and the thought of breaking up my family kills me. But the thought of me staying with someone who straight up lied to my face multiple times over the past 5 years, makes me want to vomit. Not too mention she's doing the same crap now.
> I asked her to take a lie detector test after I found out about the fingering, and she wound up booking it, and then backing out on advice of her "counselor" the real reason she backed out was because she couldn't pass the test. But the reason she told me she didn't take it was "it is inaccurate, and it's all in how the questions are asked" Nah, it's because you didn't want to tell the truth.
> I should also mention that the whole reason she didn't tell me, was because she "repressed it" because she said that she was sexually assault/molested when she was 9 and if she didn't say what happened out loud, then it didn't happen. Cool, I guess I can try that in court sometime. Yes Mr. Mrs. Judge, since I didn't say it out loud, then I wasn't going 20mph over the speed limit. Shouldn't the sexual assault/molestation be something that you tell your spouse about before you get married? Like that's a pretty big thing to know.
> She says she still loves me, and wants to "try" I'm like why, so you can live in a nice house, and I can send you on a vacation you desperately said you needed to relax, so you can go and have a guy who you work with spend a night in your hotel room when "nothing happened"
> She went to counseling the other day, and came home in one of the best moods I've seen her in, in a long time. I'm like must be nice getting rid of all that guilt, and hiding stuff from me for the past 5 years, while I"m over here trying to hold myself together. I don't feel like she has ever really had remorse, she has said sorry, but there doesn't seem to be much meaning behind it.
> At the end of the day we didn't have very good communication, and that is part my responsability as well.
> I asked her, why she finally decided to tel lme after all these years. She said she finally admitted because it was "Time for me to know, so that I could stop my tailspin"
> She also keeps to the story that nothing physical happened with AP2, and that ever since she did the stuff with AP1 " I have honestly tried my best to be the wife you deserve " by what, having AP2? and at least an EA? if not a PA?
> 
> So a couple updates since then. One, I went on a trip, and I caught her looking at houses for a friend on the street next to AP2. Then this past week she was at a business conference, and I asked who was going, she never metnioned AP2. Come to find out AP2 was there, but she says she didn't interact with him blah blah blah, but her timeline shows an 8 hour gap where it looks like location services was turned off.
> 
> We had conversations, we went to counseling. We got kicked out, because she wouldn't admit she slept with the guy in the hotel, and refused to take a lie detector test. She refuses to get a new job, and refuses to stop being friends with guy number #2. She said that "she doesnt want to give up her social life" I told her if she doesn't want to give up a guy she's known for 6 months who is just "a friend" for her husband and her kid, then we are done. I asked her so what is it. She said she didn't know. So I sent her divorce papers that I had been working on. Today is a tough day. Never thought I would be here.


Yeah.......lots of refusing here. So, how about you refusing to stay married to her.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

colingrant said:


> Yeah.......lots of refusing here. So, how about you refusing to stay married to her.


Pretty much right? Like I'm not going to lay down and take this crap.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Rus47 said:


> Forgot to ask, are either of the APs married? If so, have you contacted their spouse? They deserve to know.
> 
> Once AP2 ( or 3 or 4 ) find out they are going to have your WW full time, they will dump her. If they are married they will dump her even sooner. She is only of interest to them for NSA sex
> 
> Let all of the families know what has been going on for years. Before she starts rewriting history,
> 
> From here on you need to be 100% no contact with her, wear a VOR and only deal with her through your attorney.


No, neither of the AP's are. The first one has a long term gf, with kids. The 2nd ap is a guy 10 years younger than her and single.


----------



## Evinrude58

Slores will be slores.
Make her someone else’s problem.

Build yourself a life without her.


----------



## Wolfman1968

Evinrude58 said:


> Slores will be slores.
> Make her someone else’s problem.
> 
> Build yourself a life without her.


Slores? Or Sloars?

"Then, during *the third reconciliation of the last of the Meketrex Supplicants* they chose a new form for him... that of *a Giant Sloar*! Many *Shubs and Zuuls* knew what it was to be roasted in the depths of the Sloar that day I can tell you."
-- Louis Tully


----------



## skerzoid

*No remorse, no hope. *

Do not try to nice her back at all.

Here is google for using the 180 technique. It is to help you distance yourself. Do it religiously. ..... Healing Infidelity: The 180 for Hurt Spouses

Be strong and let her remember you as the one she lost through her stupidity. 

You are young and have most of your life ahead of you.

When she sees you with your new life, new love, and family it will eat her alive.


----------



## Evinrude58

Wolfman1968 said:


> Slores? Or Sloars?
> 
> "Then, during *the third reconciliation of the last of the Meketrex Supplicants* they chose a new form for him... that of *a Giant Sloar*! Many *Shubs and Zuuls* knew what it was to be roasted in the depths of the Sloar that day I can tell you."
> -- Louis Tully


Lol
I was thinking more or a **** -ho hybrid.


----------



## sokillme

So how is it going *Captainjacksparrow84, *I see your wife stopped posting. Did she finally admit the truth?


----------



## Imnobodynew

Deleted bad qoute.


----------



## Imnobodynew

Did I miss something? His wife was posting? Lol


----------



## sokillme

Imnobodynew said:


> Did I miss something? His wife was posting? Lol


There is one post on SI that sounds like the wife. Both have gone silent.


----------



## Imnobodynew

Thanks!


----------



## Kamstel2

CaptainJack, 
Hope you are doing well. Stay strong, and do what you must to be able to look the man in the mirror in the eye.


----------



## jonty30

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Not sure if what I did was correct, but heres my story.
> 
> I found some text messages about 4 years ago, between my wife and AP, I discovered these messages a couple months before my son was born. It was probably dumb looking back on it, but I held it inside for over a year, as the information slowly ate away at me. I did this because she was in the last trimested carrying my son, and then she had post-partum depression. During this time I put myself into counseling because I couldn't hande it on my own. I eventually confronted her about a year after it occured, where she proceeded to deny it, then she was like AP kissed me. I was pissed, but I was like I have a one year old, so I ignored it. Went to counseling, because I am supposed to believe my wife right? All the while my gut and intutition was telling me I'm wrong
> Fast forward a few years later, we moved cities, and she is being distant. I chalk it up to the move and stresses of a new job etc. I wind up paying for a hotel for the weekend to send her out of town, because that is what she really wanted. A week after I booked the hotel, she was like oh hey, It's going to be a girls trip. I'm like cool.
> Then I see a photo of the wife and another guy. So I confront her about it, and she says oh one of my gfs invited co-workers to come, and one of the other girls brought her husband. Wife didn't tell me it turned co-ed. That it turns out AP2, took a shower in the room that I bought her, and then my wife confesses that AP2 slept in her hotel room one night on the couch. She says "nothing happened" he's like my "little brother" We are just "friends"
> This triggered all sorts of I guess PTSD about AP1, because they were "just friends" about a month ago, I confront her again about AP1, she says nothing happened. Gut still didn't buy it. Confronted her again 4 days later she says "oh he fingered me in the car one time" Fast forward to this week, I'm like I just don't buy that nothing further happened. No one goes to 3rd base and stops unless you are a teenager and don't really know what you are doing. I ask her what happened, then she proceeds to tell me, she gave him oral, and a HJ in the car, and he was ontop of her, but no penetration occured. (Yeah right). So then the day after this confrontation, I get an e-mail from her, yeah I did have sex with him, the stuff in the car happened after. I'm so sorry.
> I'm not stupid, and just because you admitted to AP1's stuff four years ago, doesn't account for your denial on whats going on with AP2 whether it's emotional or physical (I think it's both) I mean why else hide who you are having stay in your hotel room.
> Anyway I have a kid with her, and the thought of breaking up my family kills me. But the thought of me staying with someone who straight up lied to my face multiple times over the past 5 years, makes me want to vomit. Not too mention she's doing the same crap now.
> I asked her to take a lie detector test after I found out about the fingering, and she wound up booking it, and then backing out on advice of her "counselor" the real reason she backed out was because she couldn't pass the test. But the reason she told me she didn't take it was "it is inaccurate, and it's all in how the questions are asked" Nah, it's because you didn't want to tell the truth.
> I should also mention that the whole reason she didn't tell me, was because she "repressed it" because she said that she was sexually assault/molested when she was 9 and if she didn't say what happened out loud, then it didn't happen. Cool, I guess I can try that in court sometime. Yes Mr. Mrs. Judge, since I didn't say it out loud, then I wasn't going 20mph over the speed limit. Shouldn't the sexual assault/molestation be something that you tell your spouse about before you get married? Like that's a pretty big thing to know.
> She says she still loves me, and wants to "try" I'm like why, so you can live in a nice house, and I can send you on a vacation you desperately said you needed to relax, so you can go and have a guy who you work with spend a night in your hotel room when "nothing happened"
> She went to counseling the other day, and came home in one of the best moods I've seen her in, in a long time. I'm like must be nice getting rid of all that guilt, and hiding stuff from me for the past 5 years, while I"m over here trying to hold myself together. I don't feel like she has ever really had remorse, she has said sorry, but there doesn't seem to be much meaning behind it.
> At the end of the day we didn't have very good communication, and that is part my responsability as well.
> I asked her, why she finally decided to tel lme after all these years. She said she finally admitted because it was "Time for me to know, so that I could stop my tailspin"
> She also keeps to the story that nothing physical happened with AP2, and that ever since she did the stuff with AP1 " I have honestly tried my best to be the wife you deserve " by what, having AP2? and at least an EA? if not a PA?
> 
> So a couple updates since then. One, I went on a trip, and I caught her looking at houses for a friend on the street next to AP2. Then this past week she was at a business conference, and I asked who was going, she never metnioned AP2. Come to find out AP2 was there, but she says she didn't interact with him blah blah blah, but her timeline shows an 8 hour gap where it looks like location services was turned off.
> 
> We had conversations, we went to counseling. We got kicked out, because she wouldn't admit she slept with the guy in the hotel, and refused to take a lie detector test. She refuses to get a new job, and refuses to stop being friends with guy number #2. She said that "she doesnt want to give up her social life" I told her if she doesn't want to give up a guy she's known for 6 months who is just "a friend" for her husband and her kid, then we are done. I asked her so what is it. She said she didn't know. So I sent her divorce papers that I had been working on. Today is a tough day. Never thought I would be here.


Since she's not being honest with you on anything, whom you know as AP1 and AP2 could be AP4 and AP 5. 
She wants to keep her options open and she has no respect for youu.
If she finds a guy that will accept her and your child, she will cut you out of her life.
You're the back up, until she finds some body she thinks worthy.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

sokillme said:


> So how is it going *Captainjacksparrow84, *I see your wife stopped posting. Did she finally admit the truth?


Where did my wife post?


----------



## Beach123

Have your child dna tested. There’s no way to trust her and no way to trust that the child is yours.


----------



## sokillme

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Where did my wife post?











SurvivingInfidelity.com - General Forum


Surviving infidelity support forums for those affected by infidelity and cheating




www.survivinginfidelity.com





???

It sounds like a very similar story, even mentions being a Captain.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

sokillme said:


> SurvivingInfidelity.com - General Forum
> 
> 
> Surviving infidelity support forums for those affected by infidelity and cheating
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.survivinginfidelity.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ???
> 
> It sounds like a very similar story, even mentions being a Captain.


Do you have a better link the end after wayward side got cut off?


----------



## sokillme

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Do you have a better link the end after wayward side got cut off?


"My husband won't believe there was no sex"


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

sokillme said:


> "My husband won't believe there was no sex"


Nah, that definately isn't my wife. Thanks for looking out though.


----------



## Kamstel2

How are you doing Captain?


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Kamstel2 said:


> How are you doing Captain?


Honestly, some days are better than others. Really traumatic to be going through this. Never in a million years did I believe I'd be where I am now.


----------



## sokillme

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Honestly, some days are better than others. Really traumatic to be going through this. Never in a million years did I believe I'd be where I am now.


Well at least that post showed you that your wife is like a lot of other cheaters. I thought the Fire Captain thing seemed to make sense given your user name. 

Anyway just remember just as quickly as your wife changed to struggle, it can change to great too, though probably not if you choose to stay married. Just work on healing.


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## Captainjacksparrow84

sokillme said:


> Well at least that post showed you that your wife is like a lot of other cheaters. I thought the Fire Captain thing seemed to make sense given your user name.
> 
> Anyway just remember just as quickly as your wife changed to struggle, it can change to great too, though probably not if you choose to stay married. Just work on healing.


It's just amazing that they all use the exact same playbook. It's like a bad movie repeating itself over and over with only minor variations. I think the worst part of it all, is realizing you put your heart and soul into something, and the other person was never really in it like that with you. It's just sad really. Like I almost pity her, to be this delusional. The really sad part is, had she told me a number of years ago, hey I'm not happy, I don't want to try marriage counseling or anything, I'm just done. I would have let her go. It would have hurt me, but at the end of the day I want her to be happy. Unfortunately I don't think she ever will be happy.


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## Works

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> It's just amazing that they all use the exact same playbook. It's like a bad movie repeating itself over and over with only minor variations. I think the worst part of it all, is realizing you put your heart and soul into something, and the other person was never really in it like that with you. It's just sad really. Like I almost pity her, to be this delusional. The really sad part is, had she told me a number of years ago, hey I'm not happy, I don't want to try marriage counseling or anything, I'm just done. I would have let her go. It would have hurt me, but at the end of the day I want her to be happy. Unfortunately I don't think she ever will be happy.


They usually aren't at the end..


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## jlg07

Well since you are divorcing her, she can go be unhappy someplace ELSE so that YOU can have a happy life (without her...)
There is NO way she hasn't slept with AP2 -- she is so into him, she's not willing to give up a "friend" of 6 months for her family? Yeah, cheating with him for sure.


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## Captainjacksparrow84

jlg07 said:


> Well since you are divorcing her, she can go be unhappy someplace ELSE so that YOU can have a happy life (without her...)
> There is NO way she hasn't slept with AP2 -- she is so into him, she's not willing to give up a "friend" of 6 months for her family? Yeah, cheating with him for sure.


Yup, pretty sad. She just keeps repeating nothing happened, nothing happened, blah blah blah. I don't buy any of it.


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## sokillme

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> It's just amazing that they all use the exact same playbook. It's like a bad movie repeating itself over and over with only minor variations. I think the worst part of it all, is realizing you put your heart and soul into something, and the other person was never really in it like that with you. It's just sad really. Like I almost pity her, to be this delusional. The really sad part is, had she told me a number of years ago, hey I'm not happy, I don't want to try marriage counseling or anything, I'm just done. I would have let her go. It would have hurt me, but at the end of the day I want her to be happy. Unfortunately I don't think she ever will be happy.


Yep, seems to be there are only variations on about 6 cheating stories, that is how much of a pattern this is. Yours is of the inexperienced guy who married someone. Or as I like to say you picked a lemon. You probably just didn't have enough experience to know. This one happens all the time. In her case why leave, as long as she wasn't caught she could pool the resources she got from both you and her affair partners. You gave her the comfort and companionship, and the guys gave her the butterflies. 

All it is is greed at the end of the day, you were immaterial, like a couch or a car or something. Sorry to be blunt but once you come to accept it, it gets easier. Seriously this really isn't a reflection on you at all, but it is on her and how little worth she has to your life or anyone else's. Someone like that is just a pain trap. The good news is you can do better and the bar is set low. What lots of BS find out is that it's not just the cheating thing they were settling with. It turns out that people who are selfish and dysfunctional enough to cheat are selfish and dysfunctional in all aspects of their life and relationships. Which makes them pretty crappy partners. You probably just don't have enough context to know that yet. Meet a good one and it will be clear. 

The other thing about the patterns is if you read these boards enough you can start to spot the red flags. This is helpful in protecting yourself, how to head it off, and when to bail. I swear I have read so many stories that in a large part of them I can tell the entire story and the outcome just from the first post. It's crazy how consistent it is. It's like Warren Buffet with stocks.


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## jlg07

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Yup, pretty sad. She just keeps repeating nothing happened, nothing happened, blah blah blah. I don't buy any of it.


Nothing happened? Well, what DID happen is that she prioritized HIM over you and your family. So yeah, something happened.
Typical cheater BS


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## Sfort

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Yup, pretty sad. She just keeps repeating nothing happened, nothing happened, blah blah blah. I don't buy any of it.


The polygraph will help with this problem.


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## Captainjacksparrow84

Sfort said:


> The polygraph will help with this problem.


She refuses to take it. I served her divorce papers, up until yesterday she was all like thinking she's in the right etc, walking around essentially like nothing is wrong. Yesterday she went to see her divorce attorney, and all the sudden magically yesterday she wanted to talk. _eyeroll_ I'm leaving to go on a trip this weekend. I'm sure she will probably be hanging out with AP2 or whatever, but yesterday there were some tears in her eyes, probably because reality is starting to kick in, not because she is sorry. Then at somepoint it will probably turn to anger. Gotta buckle up for this rollercoaster ride. Idc AP1,2, 25 can have her. Good luck to them.


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## Imnobodynew

sokillme said:


> All it is is greed at the end of the day, you were immaterial, like a couch or a car or something. Sorry to be blunt but once you come to accept it, it gets easier. *Seriously this really isn't a reflection on you at all, but it is on her and how little worth she has to your life or anyone else's*. Someone like that is just a pain trap. The good news is you can do better and the bar is set low. What lots of BS find out is that it's not just the cheating thing they were settling with. It turns out that people who are selfish and dysfunctional enough to cheat are selfish and dysfunctional in all aspects of their life and relationships. Which makes them pretty crappy partners. You probably just don't have enough context to know that yet. Meet a good one and it will be clear.


Hey Captain. This shows how fragile her ego and self-esteem are. This is typical for those who struggle with narcissistic traits. These traits are developed as unhealthy coping mechanisms probably from an unresolved child identity crisis. They might have grown up disconnected, or in my case without stable adult allies to affirm them (regardless of their mess-ups). People who get to this point have a hard time loving themselves. Instead of slowing down and learning how to heal their inner-self, they seek outside validation as a bandaid. They hardly ever mature. Thus serial cheaters are created.

It's even worse when they hide behind religion. In my opinion, many people who are in religions they practice are looking for this affirmation from the divine. They thrive on feeling guilty for their actions but never do anything about it. The guilt makes them feel absolved. They should use their relationship with the divine to thrive and enjoy the gift of peaceful life, but most it seems lock themselves in a negativity and guilt loop. So they get stuck on the guilt and shame because it's familiar to them and never grow. A good example of this is Sunday (or Saturday) church-goers that live like hell during the week but pray like saints on their sabbaths. If you ask them, a lot of them cant tell you why they are stuck.


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## Captainjacksparrow84

Imnobodynew said:


> Hey Captain. This shows how fragile her ego and self-esteem are. This is typical for those who struggle with narcissistic traits. These traits are developed as unhealthy coping mechanisms probably from an unresolved child identity crisis. They might have grown up disconnected, or in my case without stable adult allies to affirm them (regardless of their mess-ups). People who get to this point have a hard time loving themselves. Instead of slowing down and learning how to heal their inner-self, they seek outside validation as a bandaid. They hardly ever mature. Thus serial cheaters are created.
> 
> It's even worse when they hide behind religion. In my opinion, many people who are in religions they practice are looking for this affirmation from the divine. They thrive on feeling guilty for their actions but never do anything about it. The guilt makes them feel absolved. They should use their relationship with the divine to thrive and enjoy the gift of peaceful life, but most it seems lock themselves in a negativity and guilt loop. So they get stuck on the guilt and shame because it's familiar to them and never grow. A good example of this is Sunday (or Saturday) church-goers that live like hell during the week but pray like saints on their sabbaths. If you ask them, a lot of them cant tell you why they are stuck.


I'll never understand her mindset, it was like one day a switch was flipped and it was all about me me me me. Honestly, I wish her the best. The reality at the end of the day, is sure was the cheating terrible, absolutely, but the bigger problem now is that I"m growing and seeing her for what she really is, which isn't a great person. I honestly believe they should call marriage counselors "divorce counselors" because in almost every person I've talked to, there has been one partner who is willing to do work, and the other one isn't. Eventually one partner grows and the other one is still stuck in the mud and boom divorce. I mean my breaking point was when I point blank asked her if she was going to prioritize the marriage and the family, over her work, social life, ap2 etc, and she was like I don't know. I don't know? Are you freaking kidding me? Family is always number one to me, and thats when I sent her the papers. Now she actually reads the divorce papers with her attorney and she realizes the grass isn't greener on the other side, and now getz sadz? Like come on. My WW wouldn't know true remorse if it hit her in the face with a bag of d*cks. Oh I've done so much, I've gone to counseling. Did you take a LDT? no. Did you give me your phone password? No. Did you get a tracking app like life 360 on your phone? no. Did you show me proof you told AP2 that stuffs done. No. But she thinks she's done sooooo much. Give me a break. Then if it's not something like that, it's playing the victim. "I can never do anything right, I can never meet your expectations, I can never do the right thing, I can't do it on your timeline" It's like shut the frack up. Take some accountability, put on your big girl panties and face the music. Try to undo some of the hurt, but nah that requires effort and being uncomfortable. After the first disclosure she was like "I'll do anything to regain your trust".....riiight, but you haven't done anything to actually help me. Girl is lost in lala land or some alternate universe where she thinks her bullcrap words are going to do anything. #sorry just venting


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## Marc878

SRCSRC said:


> Stay the course and get rid of your WW. I divorced my ex-WW after discovering her "known" second affair just before the 10-year mark of the marriage. We had a three-year-old son. Good co-parenting left him with minimal scars. There was no way in hell I could stay with her after the second affair. I felt totally liberated, though horrible for my child. So, my story isn't very different than your story. Believe me, you can't stay with a non-repentant serial cheater. It will just kill you. Your son will be ok provided you try and stay amicable with the WW from this point forward.
> 
> Try and convince the WW that it is in the interest of the three of you to have a quick, amicable, fair divorce. That should be your focus. Don't bother with blame. Concentrate on getting rid of her ASAP. You can then heal and get on with your life. She is simply horrible.


This is correct. If they cheat once there is a high capability they will do it again. Especially without any remorse.
Don’t fall into the trap of I love her so much she must love me too. Her actions say she doesn’t.


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## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I'll never understand her mindset, it was like one day a switch was flipped and it was all about me me me me. Honestly, I wish her the best. The reality at the end of the day, is sure was the cheating terrible, absolutely, but the bigger problem now is that I"m growing and seeing her for what she really is, which isn't a great person. I honestly believe they should call marriage counselors "divorce counselors" because in almost every person I've talked to, there has been one partner who is willing to do work, and the other one isn't. Eventually one partner grows and the other one is still stuck in the mud and boom divorce. I mean my breaking point was when I point blank asked her if she was going to prioritize the marriage and the family, over her work, social life, ap2 etc, and she was like I don't know. I don't know? Are you freaking kidding me? Family is always number one to me, and thats when I sent her the papers. Now she actually reads the divorce papers with her attorney and she realizes the grass isn't greener on the other side, and now getz sadz? Like come on. My WW wouldn't know true remorse if it hit her in the face with a bag of d*cks. Oh I've done so much, I've gone to counseling. Did you take a LDT? no. Did you give me your phone password? No. Did you get a tracking app like life 360 on your phone? no. Did you show me proof you told AP2 that stuffs done. No. But she thinks she's done sooooo much. Give me a break. Then if it's not something like that, it's playing the victim. "I can never do anything right, I can never meet your expectations, I can never do the right thing, I can't do it on your timeline" It's like shut the frack up. Take some accountability, put on your big girl panties and face the music. Try to undo some of the hurt, but nah that requires effort and being uncomfortable. After the first disclosure she was like "I'll do anything to regain your trust".....riiight, but you haven't done anything to actually help me. Girl is lost in lala land or some alternate universe where she thinks her bullcrap words are going to do anything. #sorry just venting


What you got was sorry I got caught. I’ll hide it better next time. Your best path is limited contact. Just because you have a child doesn’t mean you can’t. Communicate by text or email child only.
Children adjust. You can only control your end. Nothing else.
I’m sure like most you’ll get the let’s be friends game. This will be for her not you. definition of friend = loyal, honest, trustworthy.

She doesn’t give a damn about you so contact doesn’t bother her. I know 3 who’ve went through this scenario and two have younger children. They all say civil with very limited contact was the best thing they’ve done. The only on that can keep you in limbo is yourself l


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## Captainjacksparrow84

Marc878 said:


> What you got was sorry I got caught. I’ll hide it better next time. Your best path is limited contact. Just because you have a child doesn’t mean you can’t. Communicate by text or email child only.
> Children adjust. You can only control your end. Nothing else.
> I’m sure like most you’ll get the let’s be friends game. This will be for her not you. definition of friend = loyal, honest, trustworthy.
> 
> She doesn’t give a damn about you so contact doesn’t bother her. I know 3 who’ve went through this scenario and two have younger children. They all say civil with very limited contact was the best thing they’ve done. The only on that can keep you in limbo is yourself l


I got the "We can be friends and coparent, and do holidays together etc." I'm like uh no. I'll do my holidays, you do yours. After all this, she thinks I'm going to be friends with a serial cheater and liar? I don't keep those kind of friends. Maybe one day she will wake up from all these lies she tells herself, I doubt it though. So it's like go be with AP2 if he makes you happy, until he bangs some other married lady, or she bangs some other dude. Only a matter of time, so good riddance to bad rubbish.


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## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I got the "We can be friends and coparent, and do holidays together etc." I'm like uh no. I'll do my holidays, you do yours. After all this, she thinks I'm going to be friends with a serial cheater and liar? I don't keep those kind of friends. Maybe one day she will wake up from all these lies she tells herself, I doubt it though. So it's like go be with AP2 if he makes you happy, until he bangs some other married lady, or she bangs some other dude. Only a matter of time, so good riddance to bad rubbish.


Don’t count on her getting it. My sister was a wayward and she never changed her mentality.
You are correct. You have your time, she has hers. You will find as you move forward and want to date again. No one is going to want an x in the mix.
You seem to grasp what’s needed. Stay the course.
It’s ok to keep the kids xtra if there is a schedule issue as long as she does the same.


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## Imnobodynew

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I'll never understand her mindset, it was like one day a switch was flipped and it was all about me me me me. Honestly, I wish her the best. The reality at the end of the day, is sure was the cheating terrible, absolutely, but the bigger problem now is that I"m growing and seeing her for what she really is, which isn't a great person. I honestly believe they should call marriage counselors "divorce counselors" because in almost every person I've talked to, there has been one partner who is willing to do work, and the other one isn't. Eventually one partner grows and the other one is still stuck in the mud and boom divorce. I mean my breaking point was when I point blank asked her if she was going to prioritize the marriage and the family, over her work, social life, ap2 etc, and she was like I don't know. I don't know? Are you freaking kidding me? Family is always number one to me, and thats when I sent her the papers. Now she actually reads the divorce papers with her attorney and she realizes the grass isn't greener on the other side, and now getz sadz? Like come on. My WW wouldn't know true remorse if it hit her in the face with a bag of d*cks. Oh I've done so much, I've gone to counseling. Did you take a LDT? no. Did you give me your phone password? No. Did you get a tracking app like life 360 on your phone? no. Did you show me proof you told AP2 that stuffs done. No. But she thinks she's done sooooo much. Give me a break. Then if it's not something like that, it's playing the victim. "I can never do anything right, I can never meet your expectations, I can never do the right thing, I can't do it on your timeline" It's like shut the frack up. Take some accountability, put on your big girl panties and face the music. Try to undo some of the hurt, but nah that requires effort and being uncomfortable. After the first disclosure she was like "I'll do anything to regain your trust".....riiight, but you haven't done anything to actually help me. Girl is lost in lala land or some alternate universe where she thinks her bullcrap words are going to do anything. #sorry just venting


You have every right to be angry and rant. You know if you were reporting this as your friend's problem it would be not ok "but well that's that" lol But it's your problem and your handling of it is just fine. Divorce is your every right! there is no reason to be tied to this madness. I am just pointing out that it was probably always there. She just doesn't have the moral or ethical foundation, to be honest with you. And from her second strike (and handling thereof), it shows she doesn't have the maturity to grow past herself.


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## Captainjacksparrow84

Imnobodynew said:


> You have every right to be angry and rant. You know if you were reporting this as your friend's problem it would be not ok "but well that's that" lol But it's your problem and your handling of it is just fine. Divorce is your every right! there is no reason to be tied to this madness. I am just pointing out that it was probably always there. She just doesn't have the moral or ethical foundation, to be honest with you. And from her second strike (and handling thereof), it shows she doesn't have the maturity to grow past herself.


Honestly, it wasn't the cheating that killed this. It was the lies and gaslighting.


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## Openminded

When the words don’t align with the actions you know that the marriage doesn’t stand a chance. I was married to a cheater for a very long time because I hoped he’d change. Nope. If I had it to do over I would have divorced him the moment I found out the first time instead of giving him another chance. Live and learn.


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## re16

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Honestly, it wasn't the cheating that killed this. It was the lies and gaslighting.


Yep, you are seeing her for what she really is.

There is no chance this would ever get fixed into true reconciliation with her attitude.

She is your standard entitled cake eater... a run of the mill cheater. Sucks this has happened to you, but you will be so much better off after divorcing her.

Be prepared for her groveling back to you when AP2 dumps her. Do not let her try to sex her way back to your heart, because I can all but guarantee she will try, and likely pretty soon.


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## re16

Also, make sure you control the narrative with friends and family (including hers). Cheaters historically re-write the marital history to blame the betrayed spouse.


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## jlg07

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> She refuses to take it. I served her divorce papers, up until yesterday she was all like thinking she's in the right etc, walking around essentially like nothing is wrong. Yesterday she went to see her divorce attorney, and all the sudden magically yesterday she wanted to talk. _eyeroll_ I'm leaving to go on a trip this weekend. I'm sure she will probably be hanging out with AP2 or whatever, but yesterday there were some tears in her eyes, probably because reality is starting to kick in, not because she is sorry. Then at somepoint it will probably turn to anger. Gotta buckle up for this rollercoaster ride. Idc AP1,2, 25 can have her. Good luck to them.


If you could, get a PI on her for this weekend only -- that way you get the proof and shove it in her face....


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## re16

jlg07 said:


> If you could, get a PI on her for this weekend only -- that way you get the proof and shove it in her face....


Awesome idea.


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## SRCSRC

Do not give your soon-to-be ex-wife the gift of friendship. I did it and it was a big mistake. Co-parent the best you can but stay the hell out of each other's personal lives. WWs think that if the BHs grant them the gift of friendship, what they did couldn't have been so bad and all is now forgiven. The hell with that nonsense. They will be emboldened to spin the story even more so in their favor as to why the marriages ended.


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## Captainjacksparrow84

re16 said:


> Yep, you are seeing her for what she really is.
> 
> There is no chance this would ever get fixed into true reconciliation with her attitude.
> 
> She is your standard entitled cake eater... a run of the mill cheater. Sucks this has happened to you, but you will be so much better off after divorcing her.
> 
> Be prepared for her groveling back to you when AP2 dumps her. Do not let her try to sex her way back to your heart, because I can all but guarantee she will try, and likely pretty soon.


Honestly, it would be nice to see her try that, since I got laid maybe 6 times total last year if that.


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## Evinrude58

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> She refuses to take it. I served her divorce papers, up until yesterday she was all like thinking she's in the right etc, walking around essentially like nothing is wrong. Yesterday she went to see her divorce attorney, and all the sudden magically yesterday she wanted to talk. _eyeroll_ I'm leaving to go on a trip this weekend. I'm sure she will probably be hanging out with AP2 or whatever, but yesterday there were some tears in her eyes, probably because reality is starting to kick in, not because she is sorry. Then at somepoint it will probably turn to anger. Gotta buckle up for this rollercoaster ride. Idc AP1,2, 25 can have her. Good luck to them.


This betrayal stuff is hard to stomach and screws a person’s head up and puts them in a weakened state of mind. So the first reaction to getting one’s life destroyed by the very person they love, is to try to forgive them, “straighten things out”, and get one’s life back.
Of course, that has the opposite effect on a cheating spouse and the weakness and begging, emboldens the cheater and drives them away even faster. 

You have turned the corner already and gotten your strength back and even though it’s likely killing you, you’re doing what you know is logical and aligns with your morals. Bravo.

Accepting the poo sandwich she served you and choking it down would never work.
You’re doing the right thing. Great job getting a handle on it.


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## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Honestly, it would be nice to see her try that, since I got laid maybe 6 times total last year if that.


So besides efn at leat two other men, she hasn't had the decency to even to give you any to speak of? That usually means she didn't want to betray her main man (plan A) AP2? Or AP25 as you said. Really sorry for you but this latest post shows you REALLY had nothing to lose and everything to gain by divorcing her. And your mindset is now in the right place, seeing her for the skank she truly it. Whatever you do, have no sex with her ever from now on, lest she spring some pregnancy trap. An STD panel might not be a bad idea given how active she has been your entire marriage.

Others will tell you if they haven't already, to keep a VAR on you and go no contact with her as much as possible. Now that she has an attorney and realizes divorce is in process, she may try to accuse you of DV or something similar. So have as little to do with her as possible and have the VAR turned on. Read @Vaughan story, his STBXW has done a number on him since he filed.

You are angry now, you will have even less use for her by the time the divorce mill is done with you. Sorry you are here, but at least you are starting toward a much better life going forward. Try to figure out what went wrong with your picker before you get serious with any other female.


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## Captainjacksparrow84

Imnobodynew said:


> You have every right to be angry and rant. You know if you were reporting this as your friend's problem it would be not ok "but well that's that" lol But it's your problem and your handling of it is just fine. Divorce is your every right! there is no reason to be tied to this madness. I am just pointing out that it was probably always there. She just doesn't have the moral or ethical foundation, to be honest with you. And from her second strike (and handling thereof), it shows she doesn't have the maturity to grow past herself.


The worst part is she honestly truly believes she did nothing wrong with AP2, still tells me it wasn't physical etc. For giggles, lets say she is telling the truth. Your still prioritizing some other person above your spouse and family, so she can go shove it. She is still more concerned about her privacy and setting a precedent or whatever as opposed to really wanting to be open, honest and transparent. She looks at it like she is being punished, and honestly it isn't even punishment, its kinda like how a relationship should be? She thinks shes doing so much by going to counseling, and she came back from her individual counselor one day and was like I'm a 41 year old grown woman, no one should be tracking me, I'm not on parole or something. I'm like uh you committed the cardinal sin of marriage, like if this doesn't warrant some atonement I don't know what does lol


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## BeyondRepair007

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> The worst part is she honestly truly believes she did nothing wrong with AP2, still tells me it wasn't physical etc. For giggles, lets say she is telling the truth. Your still prioritizing some other person above your spouse and family, so she can go shove it. She is still more concerned about her privacy and setting a precedent or whatever as opposed to really wanting to be open, honest and transparent. She looks at it like she is being punished, and honestly it isn't even punishment, its kinda like how a relationship should be? She thinks shes doing so much by going to counseling, and she came back from her individual counselor one day and was like I'm a 41 year old grown woman, no one should be tracking me, I'm not on parole or something. I'm like uh you committed the cardinal sin of marriage, like if this doesn't warrant some atonement I don't know what does lol


Exactly right.
The details don't matter anymore and who cares if she didn't drop to her knees. She left you and treated you like garbage so she could have her fun with AP2. That alone is enough to kick her to the curb. But... as you know... she's lying through her teeth and is likely still deep in it with AP2. She's trying to salvage both worlds like every cake eater ever. All this other "work" (yea right) she's doing is just to keep up the façade in my opinion. She _should_ be doing everything under the sun, willingly, to win you back. She's not a safe partner, I wouldn't even give her the time of day. Except the day of divorce court that is.


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## Rob_1

@Captainjacksparrow84, my advice if you care to take it, Crickets, just crickets; pretend she does not longer exist and carry on with your life. Gray rock/Ghost her, that would be a truly payback from your part. If there nothing that women in general take as one of the biggest offenses that cut deep into their soul is being ghosted. It works most of the time. Trust me on this.


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## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> The worst part is she honestly truly believes she did nothing wrong with AP2, still tells me it wasn't physical etc. For giggles, lets say she is telling the truth. Your still prioritizing some other person above your spouse and family, so she can go shove it. She is still more concerned about her privacy and setting a precedent or whatever as opposed to really wanting to be open, honest and transparent. She looks at it like she is being punished, and honestly it isn't even punishment, its kinda like how a relationship should be? She thinks shes doing so much by going to counseling, and she came back from her individual counselor one day and was like I'm a 41 year old grown woman, no one should be tracking me, I'm not on parole or something. I'm like uh you committed the cardinal sin of marriage, like if this doesn't warrant some atonement I don't know what does lol


Trying to be a marriage warden is a waste of time. Why be married to someone you can’t trust?


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## Imnobodynew

Rob_1 said:


> @Captainjacksparrow84, my advice if you care to take it, Crickets, just crickets; pretend she does not longer exist and carry on with your life. Gray rock/Ghost her, that would be a truly payback from your part. If there nothing that women in general take as one of the biggest offenses that cut deep into their soul is being ghosted. It works most of the time. Trust me on this.


THIS! Very good advice.


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## Captainjacksparrow84

Imnobodynew said:


> THIS! Very good advice.


Hard to grey rock/ghost when you have a kid...


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## Evinrude58

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> The worst part is she honestly truly believes she did nothing wrong with AP2, still tells me it wasn't physical etc. For giggles, lets say she is telling the truth. Your still prioritizing some other person above your spouse and family, so she can go shove it. She is still more concerned about her privacy and setting a precedent or whatever as opposed to really wanting to be open, honest and transparent. She looks at it like she is being punished, and honestly it isn't even punishment, its kinda like how a relationship should be? She thinks shes doing so much by going to counseling, and she came back from her individual counselor one day and was like I'm a 41 year old grown woman, no one should be tracking me, I'm not on parole or something. I'm like uh you committed the cardinal sin of marriage, like if this doesn't warrant some atonement I don't know what does lol


Realize lots of these “therapists” know that if they don’t tell the client what they want to hear, they don’t keep their business. Hence, lots of these counselors are just fee collectors abd do nobody any good.
You are thinking logically about your wife’s shenanigans. 
DUMP her so she can be that 41 year old woman that isn’t on probation and can


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Evinrude58 said:


> Realize lots of these “therapists” know that if they don’t tell the client what they want to hear, they don’t keep their business. Hence, lots of these counselors are just fee collectors abd do nobody any good.
> You are thinking logically about your wife’s shenanigans.
> DUMP her so she can be that 41 year old woman that isn’t on probation and can


I feel like most therapists aren't worth their fees.


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I feel like most therapists aren't worth their fees.


Speaking of which who is paying the fees for WW therapist? Your attorney ought to be able to advise about what expenses you are liable for.


----------



## GG1061

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Hard to grey rock/ghost when you have a kid...


The advice of 180 is sound. Not to get a reaction from her but to get you to a better place mentally. Limit your contact to only things regarding your child.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

GG1061 said:


> The advice of 180 is sound. Not to get a reaction from her but to get you to a better place mentally. Limit your contact to only things regarding your child.


It probably is. I just doubt my WW will care, in fact it will probably be liberating for her. I started doing it the other day though. Today all she did was contact me once about the kid. She's probably so checked out she doesn't care. Which is alright at this point.


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> It probably is. I just doubt my WW will care, in fact it will probably be liberating for her. I started doing it the other day though. Today all she did was contact me once about the kid. She's probably so checked out she doesn't care. Which is alright at this point.


Do you think you will get full custody of the child? As in WW doesn't really care to be bothered?


----------



## Rob_1

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> It probably is. I just doubt my WW will care, in fact it will probably be liberating for her. I started doing it the other day though. Today all she did was contact me once about the kid. She's probably so checked out she doesn't care. Which is alright at this point.


LOL. Regardless, the most likely scenario is that she's just pretending. Even if she were not, your complete indifference and Grey rocking, other than just child related issues (which by the way can be handled by a third neutral party) will bother her. It always does, regardless if they don't give a crap about you. It's a matter of power over someone else and the ego kibbles that that creates.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Hard to grey rock/ghost when you have a kid...


Nope. I know two others in a similar situations with younger kids who run a very firm limited contact. Limit contact to text or email. Zero shared time. Some try to stay in contact to try and control the situation which is impossible. You can only control your end. You will either find a way to move on or stay stuck. It is your choice. Kids are gonna have to adjust to the divorce anyway so it’s the perfect time to set your boundaries.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Rus47 said:


> Do you think you will get full custody of the child? As in WW doesn't really care to be bothered?


probably 50/50, she wont give me full custody because then she'd have to pay child support.


----------



## Imnobodynew

What I've seen working with people, is that ww are very focused on themselves and what they want. You've got to spin it so they are getting the better deals . But then again Florida's peeps are kinda of "special" lol


----------



## jonty30

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Hard to grey rock/ghost when you have a kid...


When you drop the kid off, you say your goodbyes and hugs then.
When you ring the doorbell and she answers, give her the kid and do about face and leave without saying a word to her.


----------



## jonty30

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> It probably is. I just doubt my WW will care, in fact it will probably be liberating for her. I started doing it the other day though. Today all she did was contact me once about the kid. She's probably so checked out she doesn't care. Which is alright at this point.


She has her AP2, so she thinks it doesn't matter.
90% of AP's don't last, so she will be in the worst of all situations for a woman.
Alone and with a kid and 41 years old. with a history of cheating.


----------



## BeyondRepair007

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Hard to grey rock/ghost when you have a kid...


Just to repeat and call out what @Rob_1 said… use a third party for kid transfers. You never have to see this woman again unless you want too (legal proceedings notwithstanding). Use email or text only for communication and you never have to talk to her again.

The other positive here is that your detachment and healing will be easier if you do this. So it’s a win win. Drive her nuts and help you move on.


----------



## Rus47

@Captainjacksparrow84: What is the housing situation? Kinda difficult to grey rock the WW unless she voluntarily leaves, and hopefully you haven't left the house ( see @Vaughan story for how that goes, not good). Has your attorney laid out a timeline of what happens when, and what steps you should take and when? Seems dividing up the bills, especially for her 'therapist' would be a top priority.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

jonty30 said:


> She has her AP2, so she thinks it doesn't matter.
> 90% of AP's don't last, so she will be in the worst of all situations for a woman.
> Alone and with a kid and 41 years old. with a history of cheating.


I tend to think the same. The Ap2 guy is like 10 years younger than her. Then again, I don't think she'd be honest enough when she enters the dating pool to tell the next guy. Yeah I got divorced because I cheated. It took her 4 years to tell me the truth about AP1, so I doubt she is going to be dating someone and when they ask "so why didn't things with your ex-husband work out" she is going to be like oh yeah I'm a serial cheater lol. She will probably manufacture some story about all of my faults, and play the victim like she always does.(I have my faults, I"m not perfect) I don't really care what her narrative is or what she will say, good luck to whoever gets her because you are going to be lied to, and gaslit etc. 

Also the other problem with the 180 is that she is still in the house in another bedroom, so it isn't just kid transfers persay.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Rus47 said:


> @Captainjacksparrow84: What is the housing situation? Kinda difficult to grey rock the WW unless she voluntarily leaves, and hopefully you haven't left the house ( see @Vaughan story for how that goes, not good). Has your attorney laid out a timeline of what happens when, and what steps you should take and when? Seems dividing up the bills, especially for her 'therapist' would be a top priority.


I haven't left the house. I think her attorney advised her not to leave the house either.


----------



## Megaforce

No contact is for you without regard for its effect on her.
Just do not give a **** about her future dating prospects. Be glad you are rid of this miscreant.
Once you are out, with time and distance from her, you will further realize that you were dealing with a personality disordered wife. Seldom is their abuse and dysfunction confined to just infidelity.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Megaforce said:


> No contact is for you without regard for its effect on her.
> Just do not give a **** about her future dating prospects. Be glad you are rid of this miscreant.
> Once you are out, with time and distance from her, you will further realize that you were dealing with a personality disordered wife. Seldom is their abuse and dysfunction confined to just infidelity.


She messed me up no doubt.


----------



## re16

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> probably 50/50, she wont give me full custody because then she'd have to pay child support.


Offer that if you get more custody, you'll sign a release of child support to eliminate this possibility.


----------



## Kamstel2

Hopefully you are enjoying your trip


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Kamstel2 said:


> Hopefully you are enjoying your trip


Yeah. I enjoyed it. Back today though....so back into the frying pan so to speak.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

re16 said:


> Offer that if you get more custody, you'll sign a release of child support to eliminate this possibility.


I'll keep it in mind. She hasn't even responded to the papers yet officially, so who knows.


----------



## marko polo

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Hard to grey rock/ghost when you have a kid...


No it is not hard at all.

Limit topics - divorce, childcare. One word answer or even better no answer to anything else. Whether or not you choose to advise her what the allowable topics are is left to your discretion. Any boundaries you put up she will press against to try to break them. You may as well not bother to tell her and let her waste time and energy trying to figure it out. This may seem childish but if you are dealing with an extremely selfish or narcissistic person, this course if practical.

Restrict methods of communication (txt, email). You can again can flat out tell her what is acceptable but like the issue of allowable topics, she will press up against this boundary too trying to break it. Simply implement the policy and let her struggle to figure out how to attempt to assert control over you and the situation.

Cell phone - txt and email only. Voice calls go unanswered to voicemail. You can screen your calls this way. If it is an emergency regarding your child by all means return her call. If it concerns divorce or childcare use your discretion. I would answer back by txt and limit her opportunities to stir an argument.

Email txt- topics limited to divorce and childcare. Every other topic goes unanswered. If she has a problem its her problem.


----------



## Imnobodynew

Captin, are You doing ok?


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Imnobodynew said:


> Captin, are You doing ok?


She is going on a work trip next week. Working on a path forward to get her out of the house and move on. She told me the other day that since I served her papers "she doesn't know if she loves me as a partner or as a friend" and I straight up told her that's ********.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> She is going on a work trip next week. Working on a path forward to get her out of the house and move on. She told me the other day that since I served her papers "she doesn't know if she loves me as a partner or as a friend" and I straight up told her that's ******.


Told her this morning before she left, that if she doesn't know if she loves me, then here is my ring back, and you should move out, and I'm talking to my lawyer on next steps on moving the divorce forward. Told her I will not tolerate being in a relationship with someone who doesn't know if she loves me, and if she doesn't know if she loves me she can have the ring back, and get out. I won't tolerate being second best to work or her affair partners or whatever else, and she should find someplace else to go iince she can't get her head out of her ass. Happy easter everyone!


----------



## Imnobodynew

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Told her this morning before she left, that if she doesn't know if she loves me, then here is my ring back, and you should move out, and I'm talking to my lawyer on next steps on moving the divorce forward. Told her I will not tolerate being in a relationship with someone who doesn't know if she loves me, and if she doesn't know if she loves me she can have the ring back, and get out. I won't tolerate being second best to work or her affair partners or whatever else, and she should find someplace else to go iince she can't get her head out of her ass. Happy easter everyone!


What was her response?


----------



## Openminded

Sounds like you’ve given her several weeks to choose you and she’s not that interested. Time to move on.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Imnobodynew said:


> What was her response?


Some tears, and that she has been miserable for 9 years, and that I was committing emotional abuse, by doing it before her long drive. Said FU to me. She didn't really say much.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Openminded said:


> Sounds like you’ve given her several weeks to choose you and she’s not that interested. Time to move on.


Yup, changing the divorce paperwork to adultery and filing with the courts. I'm done playing around.


----------



## Openminded

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Yup, changing the divorce paperwork to adultery and filing with the courts. I'm done playing around.


You’ve been more tolerant than most men would have so I guess she thought it would continue indefinitely. Maybe she’ll discover that life’s not all about her after all. And you can move on to someone more deserving.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Openminded said:


> You’ve been more tolerant than most men would have so I guess she thought it would continue indefinitely. Maybe she’ll discover that life’s not all about her after all. And you can move on to someone more deserving.


I doubt that she will. That's ok. At this point, I honestly feel sorry for her.


----------



## Kamstel2

Great job Captain!!!

Keep your eye on the prize, which is to get away from her!

she has been living in LaLaLand, surrounded by unicorns under constant rainbows.

no man should ever have to deal with what you have been dealing with (although many here have).

tell your lawyer to put his foot to the floor and get the divorce as quickly as possible while she still is living in LaLaLand.

stay strong and good luck


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Kamstel2 said:


> Great job Captain!!!
> 
> Keep your eye on the prize, which is to get away from her!
> 
> she has been living in LaLaLand, surrounded by unicorns under constant rainbows.
> 
> no man should ever have to deal with what you have been dealing with (although many here have).
> 
> tell your lawyer to put his foot to the floor and get the divorce as quickly as possible while she still is living in LaLaLand.
> 
> stay strong and good luck


She probably is still living in lalaland. She obviously doesn't give to F*cks about me. Told her what I needed, she didn't do it. So while my heart wants to think she will, gotta use my brain and be objective. She didn't the things I wanted, because she doesn't want to do them. I think the last straw was the whole I don't know if I love you as partner or whatever. Just total disrespect and I'm not dealing with it anymore. She can go to AP2 or wherever. I don't care as long as it isn't here.


----------



## Kamstel2

if you haven’t done so already, read up on implementing 180. This will help you greatly detach from her, which is now your top objective.

she probably is still in LaLaLand, which will help you greatly. Tell your lawyer to get the divorcedone as fast as possible before she realizes her LaLaLand is actually a ****ty place. Use her beliefabout the true nature of LaLaLand to your benefit!

You are taking control of the situation. Refuse to give up that control!!!


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Kamstel2 said:


> if you haven’t done so already, read up on implementing 180. This will help you greatly detach from her, which is now your top objective.
> 
> she probably is still in LaLaLand, which will help you greatly. Tell your lawyer to get the divorcedone as fast as possible before she realizes her LaLaLand is actually a ****ty place. Use her beliefabout the true nature of LaLaLand to your benefit!
> 
> You are taking control of the situation. Refuse to give up that control!!!


Yeah, I'm not talking to her except about the kid, and that's it. Rest of the stuff can go through the lawyer. Honestly, I'm already pretty detached. Like I said the last straw was her saying she didn't know if she loved me. Like cool, don't love me then leave and never come back, I don't need that type of crap in my life.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Kamstel2 said:


> if you haven’t done so already, read up on implementing 180. This will help you greatly detach from her, which is now your top objective.
> 
> she probably is still in LaLaLand, which will help you greatly. Tell your lawyer to get the divorcedone as fast as possible before she realizes her LaLaLand is actually a ****ty place. Use her beliefabout the true nature of LaLaLand to your benefit!
> 
> You are taking control of the situation. Refuse to give up that control!!!


Filed the papers and the verification affidavit today. Need some support.


----------



## *Deidre*

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Some tears, and that she has been miserable for 9 years, and that I was committing emotional abuse, by doing it before her long drive. Said FU to me. She didn't really say much.


Sigh, get this jerk out of the house and your life as soon as you can. 😣

Classic abuser language - projecting onto you. Look up “gas lighting.”

Once she is out, go no contact. It is the only way to deal with an emotional abuser. She will forever push and pull you, if you let her. You will heal eventually, just stay strong.


----------



## Evinrude58

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Filed the papers and the verification affidavit today. Need some support.


It’s painful. What you did is the 100% correct thing to do. As said, don’t let her mess with your head by contacting you with ambivalent nonsense. Don’t let her rope you back in so she can stroke her ego or keep you as plan b or c.
Just go as no contact as humanly possible. Under no circumstances, especially when you have a moment of weakness and despair (they are almost overwhelming at first), do you give her any ego kibbles by contacting her and begging or pleading. 

just know that it has the opposite effect, and any contact will deepen your pain and send you backward.

Time to show what you’re made of. Be a man of stone, and gray rock the heck out of her.


----------



## *Deidre*

I was in an abusive relationship so men use different tactics than women. But they project, gaslight, turn from charming to hurting you in a moment’s notice. Women who abuse sound like they feign crying to lure a man back in. Interesting to see the difference in tactics, but the result is the same - you end up on this roller coaster of emotions and you start to feel crazy. 😞


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

*Deidre* said:


> I was in an abusive relationship so men use different tactics than women. But they project, gaslight, turn from charming to hurting you in a moment’s notice. Women who abuse sound like they feign crying to lure a man back in. Interesting to see the difference in tactics, but the result is the same - you end up on this roller coaster of emotions and you start to feel crazy. 😞


I'm sorry that happened to you. I just want the pain to stop. The rollercoaster of emotions is really accurate. I want off this ride, and I want her out of my life.


----------



## *Deidre*

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I'm sorry that happened to you. I just want the pain to stop. The rollercoaster of emotions is really accurate. I want off this ride, and I want her out of my life.


One day at a time. Don’t be upset with yourself if you slip at times because you’ve been in this dynamic a while and it takes like a “re-programming” to stop responding and allowing yourself to be sucked back into the drama. No contact is the only way - if you can block her and have her just use email to discuss the divorce, that would be best. And have her emails go to junk so you’re not checking it all the time. I wasn’t married to my ex bf who was abusive so I know you may have challenges ahead that I didn’t. But emotionally, you’ll get stronger the less contact you have with her.

And remove “friends” on social media who are connected with her. Literally block all roads that lead to her. You will find that some “friends” want to keep telling you about her and keep the drama going.

It’s a lot to take in but if you commit to staying true to yourself one day at a time, it will get better. One day you’ll wake up, and she will be a distant memory and you can use the experience to help others going through the same things you once did.

The real lesson you’ll actually come away with is - how did I let this happen? And once you work on ways to improve your self-esteem, no contact will become more effortless. You’ll see.😌


----------



## re16

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I'm sorry that happened to you. I just want the pain to stop. The rollercoaster of emotions is really accurate. I want off this ride, and I want her out of my life.


The more things you can get done / do will speed up the process of putting her in the rear view mirror... runs, workouts, biking, visiting friends, visiting family... literally just keep busy... all the memories of the new stuff (without her involved) will start to push her into your history. It takes time, but try not to let days go by without doing things, you stagnate the process when that happens.

And stay no contact to the greatest extent possible. If you feel an extreme need to contact her, just write it down on a letter, and then burn it when the feeling passes.


----------



## Evinrude58

You have to rebuild your life. Get a new hobby, learn a new certification or something that will build your career. Get into the gym and build a new body. Meet new people. 
take a class. Anything to start a new life minus the black cloud you’ve had hanging over yours until now. You’ve gotten accustomed to the rain. Get acquainted with some sunlight. I’m wishing you fair winds and lots of sunlight, Captain.


----------



## Openminded

How long it takes to recover is different for everyone. And unfortunately you can’t fast-forward through it. I had a journal that I put all my lists in — mostly things I wanted to do immediately, or at some point in the future, or needed to do— both frivolous and serious. Every time I crossed something off one of the lists I felt I was making progress. This very likely won’t be quick and it won’t be easy for you but it will be worth it to get your life back and then you will no longer be hanging around waiting and hoping for a miracle. Her power will be gone.


----------



## Kamstel2

CaptainJack, 
We are all different in how we heal.
Yes, it will take far too long, but the bad days will be one less and less in intensity, and the degree of pain will lessen over time. I still recall laying in bed one night and realizing that I had not actually thought about her AT ALL that day and crying out of joy.

I know it may seem crazy and impossible at this moment, but you not only will get through this, but when you come out the other side, you will be shocked at just how great the other side truly is!!!

I promise you will get there.

I highly recommend these specific the following:
1) Go as no contact as you can! No contact is your great ally, contact is your worst enemy. Even those with kids should limit discussions to ONLY topic about the kids. Also, tell her that everything should go through your lawyer. You are paying them good money, let them earn it! If she MUST communicate with you, limit it to text only, that way you have written record of what each has said.

And remember, since she has lostcontrol/power, she will try to bait you into reacting. Refuse to take her bait.Simply respond to her that her comments and concerns should go through the lawyers.

2) Exercise, Exercise, Exercise!!
join a gym and go multiple times a week. You will not only feel better about yourself getting into shape and healthier, but it also helps get rid of frustration and anger you are holding in! I also bought a 100 pound heavy bag and hung it up in my basement and punched/kicked the hell out of it when the anger/frustration level got too high st home. Also, at the gym, you will also have the opportunity to enjoy the sights (😉) and meet new people.

3). There is a great deal of wisdom to the old saying “the best way to get over someone is to get under someone.” Yes, you will be gun shy about women and relationships, but don’t fear them. I met a friend of a friend at a BBQ less than 3 months after I had her served. While we agreed that we wouldn’t start dating until after the divorce was finalized, we still hung out regularly, and man did she ever restore my self confidence!!!!

4) finally reconnect with family and friends! And don’t hesitate to lean on them, even those that you are just reconnecting with. Be up front and tell them that you need them as many friends, especially male friends, might be hesitant to lend you an ear or shoulder out of fear that they are intruding on your privacy. Think of it this way, if roles were reversed, would you be there for them if they werein your situation? If you don’t feel like you can burden the, which is 100% WRONG, thento you still have us to vent to 

You are doing well. Keep control!! Stay strong!!! Keep your eye on the prize, which is getting as far away from her as possible!! 

And finally, good luck. You got this.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Some tears, and that she has been miserable for 9 years, and that I was committing emotional abuse, by doing it before her long drive. Said FU to me. She didn't really say much.


It’s typical blame shifting.

*Blame-shifting* is when a person does something wrong or inappropriate, and then dumps the blame on someone else to avoid taking responsibility for their own behavior.

The only reason she might try and come back is if her AP dumps her. Some tend to look for a soft spot to land. *Beware*. Never accept plan B status.
She’s cheated twice that you know of. Serial cheaters never stop.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Marc878 said:


> It’s typical blame shifting.
> 
> *Blame-shifting* is when a person does something wrong or inappropriate, and then dumps the blame on someone else to avoid taking responsibility for their own behavior.
> 
> The only reason she might try and come back is if her AP dumps her. Some tend to look for a soft spot to land. *Beware*. Never accept plan B status.
> She’s cheated twice that you know of. Serial cheaters never stop.


Honestly, I don't even want her to come back. She's supposed to be coming home today. I don't even want her here. I honestly hope the AP doesn't dump her, because then she will be out of here quicker and I can move on with me and my kids lives. This is hell on earth. I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy. Honestly, I wish her well. I hope she can find happiness, mostly so she will leave me alone. I am not a plan b, and I am not an endless supply of kibbles.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Honestly, I don't even want her to come back. She's supposed to be coming home today. I don't even want her here. I honestly hope the AP doesn't dump her, because then she will be out of here quicker and I can move on with me and my kids lives. This is hell on earth. I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy. Honestly, I wish her well. I hope she can find happiness, mostly so she will leave me alone. I am not a plan b, and I am not an endless supply of kibbles.


Sorry you’re here in this situation but I think being warned is better than getting blindsided.
The quicker you get through this the better.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Marc878 said:


> Sorry you’re here in this situation but I think being warned is better than getting blindsided.
> The quicker you get through this the better.


How did you get through it? I went through your posts, and you are generally decisive, cut the cancer out and be done. No mercy, and I get why. Going through this hardens you to the b.s. that people are fed.


----------



## Marc878

Most use distraction. You can’t think of two things at once. Exercise, walking, etc. are good. Get out of the house. Take the kids places if they are available. Go with friends/family if they aren’t. Pick some things you’ve always wanted to do but never had time for. Work is a good place. Put more effort in or improve your skill set. *Fill that void. *It’s never easy but nothing worthwhile usually is.
No or limited contact is imperative. Just because you have kids doesn’t mean you can’t.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Well about an hour out of her coming home, she texted me asking about plans for the kid for this weekend. Told her I got him this weekend, since I took care of him all week, and she can start bringing him to and from school next week. She pretty much said ok. No fight, no tears, no emotions. Guess this has been dead for a long time.


----------



## Marc878

That’s all you need. Text or emails. No contact works. If you use it. It is totally up to you.
If you hear do it for the children. Was she thinking about the affect on kids as she blew up the family?
Kids have to adjust to divorce anyway. Perfect time to go all the way. You’ll find it cuts out any conflict.
Just remember definition of friend - loyal, honest, trustworthy.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Marc878 said:


> That’s all you need. Text or emails. No contact works. If you use it. It is totally up to you.
> If you hear do it for the children. Was she thinking about the affect on kids as she blew up the family?
> Kids have to adjust to divorce anyway. Perfect time to go all the way. You’ll find it cuts out any conflict.
> Just remember definition of friend - loyal, honest, trustworthy.


I have been using the NC...this feels like it is eating me alive slowly.


----------



## Evinrude58

It will for quite a while. I’m really sorry. Been there.
But it won’t last forever like it will if you keep feeding the dragon (contact with her).

just that little bit of communication left you feeling awful. Keep that in mind when you want to talk to her.


----------



## Kamstel2

I know. But it does and will get better!!

focus as much as you can on yourself, your kids, and work! Try to be so busy that you don’t have time or energy to think of her

stay strong and keep moving straight ahead


----------



## BeyondRepair007

Just keep going, day by day, step by step. You’re in da sh!t right now and there’s no shortcut to the other side. You just have to keep moving. You’ll get there…it’s feakin’ _hard_ but you’ll get there.

”If you’re going through hell, keep going” - Churchill


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

BeyondRepair007 said:


> Just keep going, day by day, step by step. You’re in da sh!t right now and there’s no shortcut to the other side. You just have to keep moving. You’ll get there…it’s feakin’ _hard_ but you’ll get there.
> 
> ”If you’re going through hell, keep going” - Churchill


Hell is a pretty accurate description of it. Logic is telling me, she hasn't done anything to help. I gave her an ultimatium and she basically said FU. Now, it's like if I don't enforce the ultimatium I won't even be able to look at myself in the mirror. Then the feelings come around and make me want to give in on the nc. It's such a MindF**ck.


----------



## Openminded

You’re dealing with the classic battle of brain vs. heart. 

Trust your brain. Your heart can mislead you.


----------



## BeyondRepair007

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Hell is a pretty accurate description of it. Logic is telling me, she hasn't done anything to help. I gave her an ultimatium and she basically said FU. Now, it's like if I don't enforce the ultimatium I won't even be able to look at myself in the mirror. Then the feelings come around and make me want to give in on the nc. It's such a MindF**ck.


Follow the logic, you know this.

If you cave on the ultimatum or nc, she is gonna make that hurt worse. Don’t give her a way to make it worse for you. it might be different if she was on her knees trying to make it all right and help you heal.

But until that happens…don’t give in to your heart. Giving in would be a good way to _stay_ in hell.


----------



## GusPolinski

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> She is going on a work trip next week. Working on a path forward to get her out of the house and move on. She told me the other day that since I served her papers "she doesn't know if she loves me as a partner or as a friend" and I straight up told her that's ******.


Wrong response. Here’s the right one:

“Your actions indicate that you don’t love me at all, so we’d both be better off if you’d just admit that and GTFO. Or just GTFO and figure out the rest of it on your own time.”


----------



## Asterix

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> She told me the other day that since I served her papers "she doesn't know if she loves me as a partner or as a friend" and I straight up told her that's ******.


Why do you care at this point after all that's happened?


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Hell is a pretty accurate description of it. Logic is telling me, she hasn't done anything to help. I gave her an ultimatium and she basically said FU. Now, it's like if I don't enforce the ultimatium I won't even be able to look at myself in the mirror. Then the feelings come around and make me want to give in on the nc. It's such a MindF**ck.


It’s your choice. Short term pain or longer term pain. There is no magic in these situations. She’s shown you who she is. You’d be wise to believe it.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> She is going on a work trip next week. Working on a path forward to get her out of the house and move on. She told me the other day that since I served her papers "she doesn't know if she loves me as a partner or as a friend" and I straight up told her that's ******.


She cheats twice that you know of and then says since you filled for divorce she doesn’t know if she loved you? 😂 I got news for you. She could care less about you. Until you wake up and fully realize this you’re gonna keep yourself stuck.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Asterix said:


> Why do you care at this point after all that's happened?


If I'm being completely honest with myself. Her love was what kept me hanging on. When she said that, I was like this is messed up. Not sure why that was the trigger to push me over the edge, but it was.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Marc878 said:


> She cheats twice that you know of and then says since you filled for divorce she doesn’t know if she loved you? 😂 I got news for you. She could care less about you. Until you wake up and fully realize this you’re gonna keep yourself stuck.


Yeah I mean, it's pretty messed up. I know if someone I loved filed on me, I wouldn't stop loving them just cuz they handed me papers. It's not that easy for me. Maybe it is for others, but not for me.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

GusPolinski said:


> Wrong response. Here’s the right one:
> 
> “Your actions indicate that you don’t love me at all, so we’d both be better off if you’d just admit that and GTFO. Or just GTFO and figure out the rest of it on your own time.”


Yeah, I mean I did say that because she said she didn't love me that she should find a new place to stay. (Can't kick her out, because she is on the house and she knows this) It is interesting that about a week of NC, 5 days of absolutely none at all, and then 1 day and change of just text message talking about the kid, and my responses to her were basically like lets implement the parenting plan I proposed, and she was like ok, I think are taking a toll on her. She is holed up in a bedroom and hasn't come out at all, and she ate dinner up there by herself. Kinda the first cracks to show. Can't tell you how good it feels to finally see her crack even just a smidge. All is not well in her lala land.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Yeah I mean, it's pretty messed up. I know if someone I loved filed on me, I wouldn't stop loving them just cuz they handed me papers. It's not that easy for me. Maybe it is for others, but not for me.


That’s your answer. She doesn’t care. Her actions tell you that. A lot just can’t seem to understand and keep themselves stuck. I love her so she must love me too. Nope.


----------



## Marc878

No contact will bring clarity if you let it. Words in these situations don’t mean squat. Concentrate on their actions. That’s where the truth is.


----------



## Marc878

I see some thinking that filing for divorce will wake them up. Attempted manipulation at best only works a short time. You can’t change who she is. She’s been down this road twice. You want to go through it again?
You can’t fix her. Only she could do that. I would doubt that’s possible. Read up on serial cheaters.
She doesn’t think or feel about you like you do her.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Marc878 said:


> I see some thinking that filing for divorce will wake them up. Attempted manipulation at best only works a short time. You can’t change who she is. She’s been down this road twice. You want to go through it again?
> You can’t fix her. Only she could do that. I would doubt that’s possible. Read up on serial cheaters.
> She doesn’t think or feel about you like you do her.


Your right. No one can fix her, or the giant hole in her heart.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Your right. No one can fix her, or the giant hole in her heart.


Nope. From what I’ve seen staying in something like this will just drag you down with her.


----------



## Diana7

How is your child coping with his mum shut up in her bedroom?


----------



## Imnobodynew

Diana7 said:


> How is your child coping with his mum shut up in her bedroom?


This effected me as a kid growing up in a broken home. Mom was distant and dad was an selfish prick. Make sure you smother your kid with affection and love. Expect them to act out too. Thats normal when thier whole little world is crashing down. <---- read up on raising and dealing with kids in divorced homes. 

You will find one way Narc get back at the other parent is manipulation of the kids. Be prepared with strategies on conversations and proper redirected attention.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Diana7 said:


> How is your child coping with his mum shut up in her bedroom?


He's doing ok with it right now. We've been playing and doing activities to keep us both occupied.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Imnobodynew said:


> This effected me as a kid growing up in a broken home. Mom was distant and dad was an selfish prick. Make sure you smother your kid with affection and love. Expect them to act out too. Thats normal when thier whole little world is crashing down. <---- read up on raising and dealing with kids in divorced homes.
> 
> You will find one way Narc get back at the other parent is manipulation of the kids. Be prepared with strategies on conversations and proper redirected attention.


Honestly, part of the reason I've stayed so long, and tried to work things out, is because I didn't want my kids world crashing down. The whole fake it till ya make it thing. I hope he doesn't see me as being selfish for my actions in this.


----------



## Evinrude58

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Honestly, part of the reason I've stayed so long, and tried to work things out, is because I didn't want my kids world crashing down. The whole fake it till ya make it thing. I hope he doesn't see me as being selfish for my actions in this.


Acting like a man in front of one’s own son is never a bad thing for a kid to see. You need to figure out a way to get her out of the house as soon as possible. Don’t stay with a cheating wife. It’s like keeping a pet rattlesnake in your house.


----------



## Kamstel2

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Hell is a pretty accurate description of it. Logic is telling me, she hasn't done anything to help. I gave her an ultimatium and she basically said FU. Now, it's like if I don't enforce the ultimatium I won't even be able to look at myself in the mirror. Then the feelings come around and make me want to give in on the nc. It's such a MindF**ck.


You are absolutely correct on this point!!!

if you don’t stick to your Ultimatum, she will believe that she can ignore everything you say to her in the future, and she will be able to do anything and everything with impunity!!!

stick to your guns, and keep walking straight out of this hell that she has thrown you into!!

head up, shoulders back. You’ve done nothing wrong


----------



## Rob_1

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Her love was what kept me hanging on.


Her love? What love? Who wants that kind of love anyway?
Moreover, what love got to do with anything in your situation? A woman that cheats, and has no respect towards you, is what should matter as far as I'm concerned. Regardless of how much I may love her, her actions and disrespect, would be more than sufficient for a person that have self respect and dignity to dump her immediately, instead of staying in hopium and because of "love".


----------



## colingrant

Captain......... The three foundational pillars REQUIRED of a relationship, much less a marriage are love, trust, and respect for each other. She doesn't love you, you can't trust her and she doesn't respect you. 

I understand how emotions can distort clear thinking, so I'm offering you something to think about that stands well above the collateral damage and devastation infidelity's remnants have left behind. In the messiness it's easy to forget these principles and easy to forego how they apply to your situation. 

Here's how they apply. Not one foundational pillar is available at the moment. As powerful as love is, it's not strong enough as a foundation to sustain a relationship on it's own. It can keep reconciliation on life support in a sense, but like a brain without oxygen, eventually it cannot sustain life itself. Focus on what you have to do, not how you feel. It's hard, but with focus and conviction, it can be done


----------



## Divinely Favored

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Hell is a pretty accurate description of it. Logic is telling me, she hasn't done anything to help. I gave her an ultimatium and she basically said FU. Now, it's like if I don't enforce the ultimatium I won't even be able to look at myself in the mirror. Then the feelings come around and make me want to give in on the nc. It's such a MindF**ck.


If you don't enforce it, it verifies to her you are weak.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Divinely Favored said:


> If you don't enforce it, it verifies to her you are weak.


Whelp, I was an idiot and got roped into talking to her. Had a productive conversation Sunday night, then had a conversation tonight, and it turned into everything being my fault. Screw it. I clearly didn't learn my lesson. Done talking to this narcissist. She tried to say that I emotionally abused her for 10 years, because I didn't hang out with her enough. I clearly wasn't a perfect husband by any means, but I never saw her complaining when we went on vacation to nice places. Then she tells me I'm playing the victim, because I brought up her infidelity. This is done. I'm done. Good luck to her AP2 or whatever. Girl wouldn't know the truth if it hit her in the face. Kind of tough to be in a relationship, when she won't admit she is wrong about a single freaking thing. I'm such an idiot for talking to her. Whelp back to NC.


----------



## Divinely Favored

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Whelp, I was an idiot and got roped into talking to her. Had a productive conversation Sunday night, then had a conversation tonight, and it turned into everything being my fault. Screw it. I clearly didn't learn my lesson. Done talking to this narcissist. She tried to say that I emotionally abused her for 10 years, because I didn't hang out with her enough. I clearly wasn't a perfect husband by any means, but I never saw her complaining when we went on vacation to nice places. Then she tells me I'm playing the victim, because I brought up her infidelity. This is done. I'm done. Good luck to her AP2 or whatever. Girl wouldn't know the truth if it hit her in the face. Kind of tough to be in a relationship, when she won't admit she is wrong about a single freaking thing. I'm such an idiot for talking to her. Whelp back to NC.


She playing the victim...then she is in no way remorseful about her infidelity.


----------



## gr8ful1

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I'm such an idiot for talking to her. Whelp back to NC.


Aways remember: no new contact = no new hurts


----------



## Openminded

Maybe that finally put paid to all those hopes and dreams you’ve been dragging around too long. You would have taken her back in a heartbeat had she only been a tiny bit inclined so look at it as worth being an idiot for talking to her to actually waking up to reality.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Divinely Favored said:


> She playing the victim...then she is in no way remorseful about her infidelity.


Funniest thing she said to me was "You are always being the victim" Uh ok, you had the affairs not me.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Openminded said:


> Maybe that finally put paid to all those hopes and dreams you’ve been dragging around too long. You would have taken her back in a heartbeat had she only been a tiny bit inclined so look at it as worth being an idiot for talking to her to actually waking up to reality.


Yup you are 100% right, and I always appreciate your perspective.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

gr8ful1 said:


> Aways remember: no new contact = no new hurts


Yeah, I guess I learned that the hard way. She is spinning. She went from honest, and vulnerable, to total jerk mode in less than 24 hours. She seems like she is bipolar, or just straight up nuts at this stage.


----------



## plastow

Imnobodynew said:


> Hey, it's me, (the Reddit guy) Glad you Posted these people are great. No matter what choice you make or the changes you make, these people will help.


DNA the child


----------



## Openminded

I’m not convinced she’s totally done so always keep your guard up where she’s concerned.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Openminded said:


> I’m not convinced she’s totally done so always keep your guard up where she’s concerned.


Totally done with her crazyness? Or the marriage? I'm pretty sure she is done with the marriage. She is off her rocker right now.


----------



## Openminded

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Totally done with her crazyness? Or the marriage? I'm pretty sure she is done with the marriage. She is off her rocker right now.


Craziness doesn’t go away. She may be done with the marriage for now but that doesn’t mean she’s done forever. She wouldn’t be the first to want a redo after checking things out. You really would be an idiot to take her back but, believe me, stranger things have happened. Don’t be tempted even for a moment if she does because, as I said, craziness doesn’t go away.


----------



## 86857

@Captainjacksparrow84
I'm saying the below based on my divorce experience with a person very similar to your wife.
Keep going, head down, one foot past the other.
Divorce might take a while? I don't live in the US, but it probably won't be quick.
Be ready, cos things might get even worse before they get better. Have a good support system in place. I didn't.

Are you still living under one roof? It's always better not to move out as you know, her attorney will have told her too.
DO NOT MOVE OUT if you are both still there. (Sorry I didn't read all the posts).
I did and it was one of the worst mistakes I ever made. Even though I had 70% custody of our three kids, he got away with it. Three years later I had 100% custody cos he moved far away. I paid the price financially for many years and I'm still paying it.

GRAY ROCK HER FOREVER. It's a must. Again I didn't.
Emails/texts only for arrangements, no phone conversations. No going into emotional territory whatsoever cos she'll likely try and draw you in, even years later. She has already done that & blamed you for everything. I just feel she's the type who will do it, especially if things aren't going well for her.
If you have to meet at school meetings etc, a polite hello only. Again no emotional territory. Say nothing if she tries it on. She can't make you talk, right? Engage with other parents around etc.

Sorry for all the unsolicited advice.
If only I had had someone to give me the same advice back then. . .
Because of all the emotional stuff when going through this, our decision-making ability isn't up to scratch.
To me it felt like someone put me into a washing machine on the hot cotton cycle for the actual break-up, then transferred me to a tumble dryer through the divorce. dunno which was worse.

Just be very careful during the next phase is all I'm trying to say.


----------



## Evinrude58

This will be one of the worst times in your life. You’ll later be thankful for it though, when you’ve moved on and see her for who she really is. She won’t even seem
Physically attractive anymore. You’ll wonder what you ever saw in her


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Evinrude58 said:


> This will be one of the worst times in your life. You’ll later be thankful for it though, when you’ve moved on and see her for who she really is. She won’t even seem
> Physically attractive anymore. You’ll wonder what you ever saw in her


I'm already wondering what I saw in her, to have this giant monster come out of her, out of nowhere. It's almost amusing everytime I hit her with consequences, she just adds to the list of things I did to upset her. Oh I gave her divorce papers, oh I gave her the ring back, and as soon as she is served, oh you served me. Like yeah, you are still having an emotional affair at least if not physical, and you are still lying through your teeth. LIke idk what happened to the girl I fell in love with, but this witch in front of me I wouldn't go on two dates with if I was meeting her for the first time. The whole bipolar thing is nuts. She definately isn't stable.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

********** said:


> @Captainjacksparrow84
> I'm saying the below based on my divorce experience with a person very similar to your wife.
> Keep going, head down, one foot past the other.
> Divorce might take a while? I don't live in the US, but it probably won't be quick.
> Be ready, cos things might get even worse before they get better. Have a good support system in place. I didn't.
> 
> Are you still living under one roof? It's always better not to move out as you know, her attorney will have told her too.
> DO NOT MOVE OUT if you are both still there. (Sorry I didn't read all the posts).
> I did and it was one of the worst mistakes I ever made. Even though I had 70% custody of our three kids, he got away with it. Three years later I had 100% custody cos he moved far away. I paid the price financially for many years and I'm still paying it.
> 
> GRAY ROCK HER FOREVER. It's a must. Again I didn't.
> Emails/texts only for arrangements, no phone conversations. No going into emotional territory whatsoever cos she'll likely try and draw you in, even years later. She has already done that & blamed you for everything. I just feel she's the type who will do it, especially if things aren't going well for her.
> If you have to meet at school meetings etc, a polite hello only. Again no emotional territory. Say nothing if she tries it on. She can't make you talk, right? Engage with other parents around etc.
> 
> Sorry for all the unsolicited advice.
> If only I had had someone to give me the same advice back then. . .
> Because of all the emotional stuff when going through this, our decision-making ability isn't up to scratch.
> To me it felt like someone put me into a washing machine on the hot cotton cycle for the actual break-up, then transferred me to a tumble dryer through the divorce. dunno which was worse.
> 
> Just be very careful for the next phase is all I'm trying to say.


Sadly we are still living under the same roof. I honestly wish she was gone. In my state, Divorce can go by quickly, it just depends on how much she wants to fight, and how much money she wants to spend. I am back to grey rocking/ No Contact. It was a mistake to break it.


----------



## re16

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I'm already wondering what I saw in her, to have this giant monster come out of her, out of nowhere. It's almost amusing everytime I hit her with consequences, she just adds to the list of things I did to upset her. Oh I gave her divorce papers, oh I gave her the ring back, and as soon as she is served, oh you served me. Like yeah, you are still having an emotional affair at least if not physical, and you are still lying through your teeth. LIke idk what happened to the girl I fell in love with, but this witch in front of me I wouldn't go on two dates with if I was meeting her for the first time. The whole bipolar thing is nuts. She definately isn't stable.


You are hitting the anger stage. This is good. Use it to spur you on to maintain no contact and follow through with the D.


----------



## Evinrude58

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I'm already wondering what I saw in her, to have this giant monster come out of her, out of nowhere. It's almost amusing everytime I hit her with consequences, she just adds to the list of things I did to upset her. Oh I gave her divorce papers, oh I gave her the ring back, and as soon as she is served, oh you served me. Like yeah, you are still having an emotional affair at least if not physical, and you are still lying through your teeth. LIke idk what happened to the girl I fell in love with, but this witch in front of me I wouldn't go on two dates with if I was meeting her for the first time. The whole bipolar thing is nuts. She definately isn't stable.


If you are wondering what you saw in her now, multiply that times 10000 and that’s what you’ll be thinking 2 years from now. You’ll be asking your best friend why he didn’t beat you with a hammer when you were dating her.


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I'm already wondering what I saw in her,


Animal attraction. When you were dating her, the witch was locked in the closet at her home.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Rus47 said:


> Animal attraction. When you were dating her, the witch was locked in the closet at her home.


She should go into the cauldron. This is ridicolous. This girl is like bi-polar, manic, narcissitic, and a sociopath.


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> She should go into the cauldron. This is ridicolous. This girl is like bi-polar, manic, narcissitic, and a sociopath.


She probably always was


----------



## GusPolinski

Just want to say —

Whenever I hear that someone is bipolar/borderline/histrionic, all I can think is that he or she has been clinically diagnosed as being a *****.

🤷🏻‍♂️


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Honestly, part of the reason I've stayed so long, and tried to work things out, is because I didn't want my kids world crashing down. The whole fake it till ya make it thing. I hope he doesn't see me as being selfish for my actions in this.


No but unfortunately you are teaching him. Kids learn most from their parent. Is this how you’d want him handling this situation? Being a martyr is a thankless task.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Totally done with her crazyness? Or the marriage? I'm pretty sure she is done with the marriage. She is off her rocker right now.


She is done with the marriage? Under the circumstances does she have an option? Why aren’t you done with this nightmare?


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Marc878 said:


> She is done with the marriage? Under the circumstances does she have an option? Why aren’t you done with this nighttime?


I am done. I don't know how she couldn't be. Unless I guess the other part of her bi-polar crazy isn't done. I'm not talking to her. No reason to. She is nuts.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I am done. I don't know how she couldn't be. Unless I guess the other part of her bi-polar crazy isn't done. I'm not talking to her. No reason to. She is nuts.


That’s a great start and your only good path. Unfortunately.


----------



## Evinrude58

They all seem crazy when you upset their Apple cart and refuse to munch on the poo sammich they’ve been feeding you. She expected you to keep taking more bites and that she was such hot stuff you’d never leave.
You’re the meal ticket, babysitter, home repairman….. it’s easy to find a man for sex, it’s quite another to find a man who will accept the full load and carry it . She’s all messed up in the head right now and angry at you for not being the pushover chump she thought you were. How dare you be upset with her cheating?????

yes, you are seeing the dark side that has always been there. She’ll stop showing that to just anyone. But it sounds pretty bad abd us only a short temper tantrum away.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Evinrude58 said:


> They all seem crazy when you upset their Apple cart and refuse to munch on the poo sammich they’ve been feeding you. She expected you to keep taking more bites and that she was such hot stuff you’d never leave.
> You’re the meal ticket, babysitter, home repairman….. it’s easy to find a man for sex, it’s quite another to find a man who will accept the full load and carry it . She’s all messed up in the head right now and angry at you for not being the pushover chump she thought you were. How dare you be upset with her cheating?????
> 
> yes, you are seeing the dark side that has always been there. She’ll stop showing that to just anyone. But it sounds pretty bad abd us only a short temper tantrum away.


What doesn't make sense to me is these violent mood swings. One minute having seemingly one of the deepest conversations in our entire marriage. 24 hours later after she goes to work, and she asked me to continue the conversation from last night, then we start talking about how to help me, and my side of stuff. Then it goes to being, I'm done, when am I getting served, blah blah blah. There is definately something going on at work, because when she comes home, it is like she is an entirely different person. Unfortuntely, It's all about her, it's always been about her. I've just been too stupid to see it, and with the mood swings and her craziness literally anyone can have her at this point, as long as she gets out of my home. I just can't take her insanity that she showed. Being NC yesterday again definately helped. I'm taking myself on a vacation this weekend, since I have no desire to be here.

The breadcrumbing, the trickle truthing, the lies, like all of it is just complete and utter bs. I feel so dumb for trying to fix this over the past couple of months. The MC, the effort, the emotions, all of it was just a joke. 

Honestly, I'm not sure what she ever got from me towards the end other than the roof over her head and helping her out with the kid. She can go find another chump. It's kind of amazing since I told her that we are implementing the 50/50 custody thing, and I don't have to entertain my son, or watch him while she does whatever after work, or cook dinner, give him a bath, read him stories, put him to bed etc. How much less stressed I am and how much more stressed she is. 

All the while though, I wasn't doing enough around the house to help her with chores, and the kid. She complained that she had to change her work schedule and she wouldn't be able to go the gym on her weeks when she had to drive him to and from school. Insert worlds smallest violin playing for her.


----------



## BeyondRepair007

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> What doesn't make sense to me is these violent mood swings. One minute having seemingly one of the deepest conversations in our entire marriage. 24 hours later after she goes to work, and she asked me to continue the conversation from last night, then we start talking about how to help me, and my side of stuff. Then it goes to being, I'm done, when am I getting served, blah blah blah. There is definately something going on at work, because when she comes home, it is like she is an entirely different person. Unfortuntely, It's all about her, it's always been about her. I've just been too stupid to see it, and with the mood swings and her craziness literally anyone can have her at this point, as long as she gets out of my home. I just can't take her insanity that she showed. Being NC yesterday again definately helped. I'm taking myself on a vacation this weekend, since I have no desire to be here.
> 
> The breadcrumbing, the trickle truthing, the lies, like all of it is just complete and utter bs. I feel so dumb for trying to fix this over the past couple of months. The MC, the effort, the emotions, all of it was just a joke.
> 
> Honestly, I'm not sure what she ever got from me towards the end other than the roof over her head and helping her out with the kid. She can go find another chump. It's kind of amazing since I told her that we are implementing the 50/50 custody thing, and I don't have to entertain my son, or watch him while she does whatever after work, or cook dinner, give him a bath, read him stories, put him to bed etc. How much less stressed I am and how much more stressed she is.
> 
> All the while though, I wasn't doing enough around the house to help her with chores, and the kid. She complained that she had to change her work schedule and she wouldn't be able to go the gym on her weeks when she had to drive him to and from school. Insert worlds smallest violin playing for her.


OP I get this is really freakin’ hard, but you really need to change your mindset on this. Stop trying to figure her out, stop worrying about all the bs in the past. She is NOT your problem anymore. She’s gone. I get you’re venting and that helps, but you have got to let this go and not obsess over it. I assure you it will drive you nuts if you let it. And then you’ll break NC again, just like before. So stop that bs now, while you’re still angry.

Refocus on yourself, the rest of your life, where you will be in 5 years, making new friends at the yacht club or wherever you like to hang out. Focus on your hobby. Start planning for a Memorial day party or July4th with the kid. _Anything_ to keep your mind busy on other things.


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> There is definately something going on at work, because when she comes home, it is like she is an entirely different person.


AP2 (or 3 or 4) is yanking her chain. Maybe not panning out for her?


----------



## Evinrude58

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> What doesn't make sense to me is these violent mood swings. One minute having seemingly one of the deepest conversations in our entire marriage. 24 hours later after she goes to work, and she asked me to continue the conversation from last night, then we start talking about how to help me, and my side of stuff. Then it goes to being, I'm done, when am I getting served, blah blah blah. There is definately something going on at work, because when she comes home, it is like she is an entirely different person. Unfortuntely, It's all about her, it's always been about her. I've just been too stupid to see it, and with the mood swings and her craziness literally anyone can have her at this point, as long as she gets out of my home. I just can't take her insanity that she showed. Being NC yesterday again definately helped. I'm taking myself on a vacation this weekend, since I have no desire to be here.
> 
> The breadcrumbing, the trickle truthing, the lies, like all of it is just complete and utter bs. I feel so dumb for trying to fix this over the past couple of months. The MC, the effort, the emotions, all of it was just a joke.
> 
> Honestly, I'm not sure what she ever got from me towards the end other than the roof over her head and helping her out with the kid. She can go find another chump. It's kind of amazing since I told her that we are implementing the 50/50 custody thing, and I don't have to entertain my son, or watch him while she does whatever after work, or cook dinner, give him a bath, read him stories, put him to bed etc. How much less stressed I am and how much more stressed she is.
> 
> All the while though, I wasn't doing enough around the house to help her with chores, and the kid. She complained that she had to change her work schedule and she wouldn't be able to go the gym on her weeks when she had to drive him to and from school. Insert worlds smallest violin playing for her.


Someone on here once coined the phrase “betrayed spouse syndrome”, which described a common reaction of a betrayed spouse believing it was all their fault, their actions pushed their spouse into someone else’s arms, etc. The betrayed spouse believes the bs the cheater was shoveling…. 

Even seemingly perfect spouses get cheated on if their spouse is a cheater. There is zero you could have done to prevent it. It’s just in some people to cheat.

As said, stop focusing on her, get a laser beam obsession with getting free of her and building your own life. When you get a new life, you won’t worry so much about the old.

I’ve been where you are. I’m now forced to date beautiful women (far more beautiful than I ever was when I was younger, more fit, had hair, etc), do my hobbies without Worrying about someone complaining about this it that and making their problems my problems.
I take care of my kids when they’re home with me and do things like I want to do, when I want to. I can save money now, which I never was before. I take trips and go where I want to go.
I’m often taking some beautiful woman with me that is fun and easygoing. It’s a rough life.
I have a mediocre job. I’m bald. Very average in every aspect. Yet there are still plenty of women that are blind and dumb enough to date me.
You are not going to be experiencing anything but a Much better life, with this anchor of a woman free from your neck. 

Your wife has given you a gift. You’ll see it that way eventually, I guarantee it. Just accept the pain right now and know that even though it seems awful right now, you WILL be happy again, and very likely more so than ever before.


----------



## Kamstel2

Just checking in on you. How are you doing?


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

BeyondRepair007 said:


> OP I get this is really freakin’ hard, but you really need to change your mindset on this. Stop trying to figure her out, stop worrying about all the bs in the past. She is NOT your problem anymore. She’s gone. I get you’re venting and that helps, but you have got to let this go and not obsess over it. I assure you it will drive you nuts if you let it. And then you’ll break NC again, just like before. So stop that bs now, while you’re still angry.
> 
> Refocus on yourself, the rest of your life, where you will be in 5 years, making new friends at the yacht club or wherever you like to hang out. Focus on your hobby. Start planning for a Memorial day party or July4th with the kid. _Anything_ to keep your mind busy on other things.


You gunna come have some drinks at the yacht club with me?


----------



## re16

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> There is definately something going on at work, because when she comes home, it is like she is an entirely different person.


It is either a toxic co-worker friend spewing pro-cheater / poor you bs at her, or she spends her day texting with an AP and feels empowered to continue to destroy you and the marriage.

Either way, she is the center of either situation (and all situations)... until you eradicate her from your life.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Evinrude58 said:


> Someone on here once coined the phrase “betrayed spouse syndrome”, which described a common reaction of a betrayed spouse believing it was all their fault, their actions pushed their spouse into someone else’s arms, etc. The betrayed spouse believes the bs the cheater was shoveling….
> 
> Even seemingly perfect spouses get cheated on if their spouse is a cheater. There is zero you could have done to prevent it. It’s just in some people to cheat.
> 
> As said, stop focusing on her, get a laser beam obsession with getting free of her and building your own life. When you get a new life, you won’t worry so much about the old.
> 
> I’ve been where you are. I’m now forced to date beautiful women (far more beautiful than I ever was when I was younger, more fit, had hair, etc), do my hobbies without Worrying about someone complaining about this it that and making their problems my problems.
> I take care of my kids when they’re home with me and do things like I want to do, when I want to. I can save money now, which I never was before. I take trips and go where I want to go.
> I’m often taking some beautiful woman with me that is fun and easygoing. It’s a rough life.
> I have a mediocre job. I’m bald. Very average in every aspect. Yet there are still plenty of women that are blind and dumb enough to date me.
> You are not going to be experiencing anything but a Much better life, with this anchor of a woman free from your neck.
> 
> Your wife has given you a gift. You’ll see it that way eventually, I guarantee it. Just accept the pain right now and know that even though it seems awful right now, you WILL be happy again, and very likely more so than ever before.


You do sound like you have a rough life. I'm glad there are alot of blind and dumb women in the world to go around


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Rus47 said:


> AP2 (or 3 or 4) is yanking her chain. Maybe not panning out for her?


Probably...maybe lucky number 13.


----------



## BeyondRepair007

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> You gunna come have some drinks at the yacht club with me?


😁 in a heartbeat.


----------



## Openminded

The reason I think she’ll try to come back at some point (and sex will very likely be involved to help convince you) is because life’s about to get real for her and she won’t like it. She’s going to discover it’s not easy to replace what she had. Not many men are going to be willing to deal long-term with all her demands and craziness. So … Plan B. That’s you. If you’re not really over her when she tries that then you’re susceptible to being reeled back in (sex-bombing can do that). You wouldn’t be the first poster here to fall for that — far from it — but it would be the dumbest thing you ever did and you would soon regret it and have to start the process all over again. Keep that in mind.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Openminded said:


> The reason I think she’ll try to come back at some point (and sex will very likely be involved to help convince you) is because life’s about to get real for her and she won’t like it. She’s going to discover it’s not easy to replace what she had. Not many men are going to be willing to deal long-term with all her demands and craziness. So … Plan B. That’s you. If you’re not really over her when she tries that then you’re susceptible to being reeled back in (sex-bombing can do that). You wouldn’t be the first poster here to fall for that — far from it — but it would be the dumbest thing you ever did and you would soon regret it and have to start the process all over again. Keep that in mind.


Good news for me, she wasn't that great in bed


----------



## farsidejunky

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Funniest thing she said to me was "You are always being the victim" Uh ok, you had the affairs not me.


DARVO.

Read up on it. 

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk


----------



## Evinrude58

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> You do sound like you have a rough life. I'm glad there are alot of blind and dumb women in the world to go around


You’ll be pleasantly surprised.
A divorce is not a death sentence. It just feels that way for a while.


----------



## Openminded

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Good news for me, she wasn't that great in bed


She may have learned a few things since then. You’d be amazed at the tricks some women use to reel a man back in. They’ll cut all of that out as soon as it works but the fact is that it does work more than it should.


----------



## Rus47

Evinrude58 said:


> Even seemingly perfect spouses get cheated on if their spouse is a cheater. There is zero you could have done to prevent it. It’s just in some people to cheat.


Witness the WW with a record long thread who acknowledged her husband was best she had ever had, far better than the AP who she initiated and continued sex with while continuing to do her husband, to the point when impregnated with twins she had no idea who the father was. Cheaters cheat because THEY want to, no other reason.


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> You do sound like you have a rough life. I'm glad there are alot of blind and dumb women in the world to go around


I seriously doubt they are blind or dumb. First, self confidence, which @Evinrude58 radiates, is attractive to women. By your actions with your WW, you radiate confidence and assertiveness too. Secondly, since women generally live longer, as men age they become a smaller percentage of the population. Thirdly, when women see a man with another woman, his value automatically rises because it implies that another of their gender found him worthy. Finally, the men worth having are mostly already taken, either married or in LTR. In fact, I have told some of my female relatives that an unmated male is alone ( no GF or wife in sight ) for a reason that bears serious investigation before spending time on them.


----------



## Sfort

Rus47 said:


> Witness the WW with a record long thread who acknowledged her husband was best she had ever had, far better than the AP who she initiated and continued sex with while continuing to do her husband, to the point when impregnated with twins she had no idea who the father was. Cheaters cheat because THEY want to, no other reason.


That would be @Cici1990's thread. What a thread.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Openminded said:


> She may have learned a few things since then. You’d be amazed at the tricks some women use to reel a man back in. They’ll cut all of that out as soon as it works but the fact is that it does work more than it should.


Honestly the best thing she could ever do, would be to move out and never come back.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Rus47 said:


> I seriously doubt they are blind or dumb. First, self confidence, which @Evinrude58 radiates, is attractive to women. By your actions with your WW, you radiate confidence and assertiveness too. Secondly, since women generally live longer, as men age they become a smaller percentage of the population. Thirdly, when women see a man with another woman, his value automatically rises because it implies that another of their gender found him worthy. Finally, the men worth having are mostly already taken, either married or in LTR. In fact, I have told some of my female relatives that an unmated male is alone ( no GF or wife in sight ) for a reason that bears serious investigation before spending time on them.


I don't think they are blind or dumb at all either. I think Evinrude is a pretty good dude.


----------



## Evinrude58

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I don't think they are blind or dumb at all either. I think Evinrude is a pretty good dude.


I appreciate it, but I’m the one that jokingly called them blind and dumb. I don’t think OP meant anything other than he hoped he’s find one too. Truly there are 3 or 4 billion women on the planet. There are far too many to stay with one that brings you constant pain. There’s a lady for every man. A decent man is just as much of a searched for item as a decent woman. OP will find it easy to get a woman to spend time with if he treats people fairly, doesn’t so drugs, has a steady job— the basics. Sadly, getting betrayed by a spouse robs everyone of their self confidence and the unknown indeed sometimes is fearful.


----------



## ABHale

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> He's doing ok with it right now. We've been playing and doing activities to keep us both occupied.


Your the man! 

There are those that come here that don’t know how to function in this situation. They fall to pieces.

Focus on you and your kids.


----------



## ABHale

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> She should go into the cauldron. This is ridicolous. This girl is like bi-polar, manic, narcissitic, and a sociopath.


All good points to bring up with your lawyer.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

So update. Another week of no contact. Went away for the weekend, then this morning I get an e-mail in my e-mail box, about a confirmed marriage counseling appointment, supposidly for me and her. Have no clue why she would schedule it, after what happened last Monday. Haven't said a word to her since. Feel like this might be a trap to get me to talk to her/give her a reaction. Why in the **** would I want to go to marriage counseling, when she can't be trusted and puts everything on me. Is there any circumstance that I should show up to this clusterfuck of a MC session? I don't see any reason to, and I'm tempted to just pretend I never got the e-mail.


----------



## BeyondRepair007

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> So update. Another week of no contact. Went away for the weekend, then this morning I get an e-mail in my e-mail box, about a confirmed marriage counseling appointment, supposidly for me and her. Have no clue why she would schedule it, after what happened last Monday. Haven't said a word to her since. Feel like this might be a trap to get me to talk to her/give her a reaction. Why in the F*ck would I want to go to marriage counseling, when she can't be trusted and puts everything on me. Is there any circumstance that I should show up to this clusterf*ck of a MC session? I don't see any reason to, and I'm tempted to just pretend I never got the e-mail.


No, there’s not. Ignore it.

Who knows what’s she’s thinking but I’m pretty sure it has everything to do with treating you like a freakin’ yo-yo. The reality of what’s about to happen to her hasn’t really sank in yet I guess. She think’s she’s in control of the situation. That’ll you cave in.

Stay NC. Keep moving on D.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> So update. Another week of no contact. Went away for the weekend, then this morning I get an e-mail in my e-mail box, about a confirmed marriage counseling appointment, supposidly for me and her. Have no clue why she would schedule it, after what happened last Monday. Haven't said a word to her since. Feel like this might be a trap to get me to talk to her/give her a reaction. Why in the F*ck would I want to go to marriage counseling, when she can't be trusted and puts everything on me. Is there any circumstance that I should show up to this clusterf*ck of a MC session? I don't see any reason to, and I'm tempted to just pretend I never got the e-mail.


Delete it and act as if it never existed. Why would you want to go to MC?


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> don't see any reason to, and I'm tempted to just pretend I never got the e-mail.


That sounds like a good plan. Move to spam folder. Why should you let her schedule you for anything?


----------



## Evinrude58

She’s a serial cheater. Counseling can’t fix a character problem. A judge can. A “counselor” is the one you need to meet with. One that’s good at divorces and getting fair treatment to betrayed men from judges.

As said, she wants to yo-yo you.

why wouldn’t anyone want a person on the planet that sits around pining for them, that they can use and abuse when needed? That’s all she is interested in with you.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Evinrude58 said:


> She’s a serial cheater. Counseling can’t fix a character problem. A judge can. A “counselor” is the one you need to meet with. One that’s good at divorces and getting fair treatment to betrayed men from judges.
> 
> As said, she wants to yo-yo you.
> 
> why wouldn’t anyone want a person on the planet that sits around pining for them, that they can use and abuse when needed? That’s all she is interested in with you.


I just don't get it. I'd rather go see the dentist than go to MC again. Why would I go there? Why couldn't she just say whatever she has to say to me, and let me decide? And who TF gets to schedule me for therapy? Like you should be asking if I even want to go. Which I don't. She is F***ing nuts. Let me tell you, the Yo-Yoing just makes me want to get a one way ticket, for me and my kid to a non-extradition country and start over.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I just don't get it. I'd rather go see the dentist than go to MC again. Why would I go there? Why couldn't she just say whatever she has to say to me, and let me decide? And who TF gets to schedule me for therapy? Like you should be asking if I even want to go. Which I don't. She is F***ing nuts. Let me tell you, the Yo-Yoing just makes me want to get a one way ticket, for me and my kid to a non-extradition country and start over.


I think she is just ****ing with you and/or living in an alternate reality. Just ignore it.


----------



## Wolfman1968

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I just don't get it. I'd rather go see the dentist than go to MC again. Why would I go there? Why couldn't she just say whatever she has to say to me, and let me decide? And who TF gets to schedule me for therapy? Like you should be asking if I even want to go. Which I don't. She is F***ing nuts. Let me tell you, the Yo-Yoing just makes me want to get a one way ticket, for me and my kid to a non-extradition country and start over.


Could it be a legal tactic? 
To show that she was willing to "work" on things, and show that you are uncooperative in order to get some sort of advantage later on during some sort of court proceeding?


----------



## Evinrude58

Captain,

Are you seeing what this email us doing to you?
Any kind of contact you can avoid is imperative in order for you to get over this and heal.
You are going over the email in your mind over and over, trying to think of a way to go to this with her and somehow be able to wrap your mind around it and not feel stupid for taking her back. 

Don’t go there. It takes months to get over this kind of pain so that it isn’t so crushing. Just accept that you’re going to have to suffer, and that suffering will help your mind rewire itself to stop those feel good emotions you get when remembering the good times with her.

Don’t let her do this to you. Protect yourself. No contact unless you are forced to over the kids.


----------



## Openminded

She did it because she could. Doesn’t mean you have to get pulled into her drama and if you go you will. The answer is no.


----------



## ABHale

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> So update. Another week of no contact. Went away for the weekend, then this morning I get an e-mail in my e-mail box, about a confirmed marriage counseling appointment, supposidly for me and her. Have no clue why she would schedule it, after what happened last Monday. Haven't said a word to her since. Feel like this might be a trap to get me to talk to her/give her a reaction. Why in the F*ck would I want to go to marriage counseling, when she can't be trusted and puts everything on me. Is there any circumstance that I should show up to this clusterf*ck of a MC session? I don't see any reason to, and I'm tempted to just pretend I never got the e-mail.


Unless she believes it will help her in the divorce. “See I tried to get MC and he never showed up.”

At a loss of why she would do it otherwise.


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> *I just don't get it*. I'd rather go see the dentist than go to MC again. Why would I go there? Why couldn't she just say whatever she has to say to me, and let me decide? And who TF gets to schedule me for therapy? Like you should be asking if I even want to go. Which I don't.* She is F***ing nuts*. Let me tell you, the Yo-Yoing just makes me want to get a one way ticket, for me and my kid to a non-extradition country and start over.


Maybe you are unintentionally onto something here. Is it possible she has some type of actual mental illness? The whipsawing of things she does and says. One time calm and collected, next crazy. One minute telling you to get lost, next scheduling MC without asking. Unstable is the thought that comes to mind. Her behavior sounds bizarre, and another reason to stay away from her as much as feasible. You can't deal rationally with an irrational person.

Have you discussed this with your attorney? How to protect yourself and your child? Are you carrying a VAR with you anytime she is in your presence?


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Rus47 said:


> Maybe you are unintentionally onto something here. Is it possible she has some type of actual mental illness? The whipsawing of things she does and says. One time calm and collected, next crazy. One minute telling you to get lost, next scheduling MC without asking. Unstable is the thought that comes to mind. Her behavior sounds bizarre, and another reason to stay away from her as much as feasible. You can't deal rationally with an irrational person.
> 
> Have you discussed this with your attorney? How to protect yourself and your child? Are you carrying a VAR with you anytime she is in your presence?


Yes I have a Var that I'm carrying. Although it really hasn't picked up anything because I haven't been talking to her. I think her behavior is bizarre and it certainly isn't rationale. I mean take the day I broke NC and talked to her, and she was deep and emotional etc. Then a day later whack, I'm done with this blah blah blah. Now she is on her own for a week, having to actually be a mom for a full week and weekend, and then first thing monday morning schedules MC without even telling me? I'm not going but like wow the whipsaw.

We went to MC before, but it went nowhere. I was always being pressed on to do more things around the house etc, when she fundamentally wouldn't do anything. Wouldn't just talk to AP2 like a co-worker, she had to be friendly because thats who she is. Wouldn't put Life 360 on her phone, or give me her phone password. Like, she didn't change at all. Now all the sudden, she is going to have to be on her own, and take care of the kid by herself for a week and can't go to the gym in the mornings, and she wants to talk? She can get bent. I'm not a plan b.

The irony of the whole thing, is under the 50/50 temporary custody thing we are doing now. I have to do less around the house, because I'm not watching him right after school, and trying to cook dinner my nights, and trying to give him a bath, and reading him stories and putting him to bed. On my week off, I actually have time to go for a longer run with the dog. I get to relax in my pool/ hot tub. Don't get me wrong. I love my kid, and if my wife said you can have full custody of him, and never contact us again. I'd take that offer in a heart beat. It is kind of nice though, that she fixated on me never doing enough, and now ironically I'm going to be doing none of it for her, and now she wants to try MC. Just kind of humorous.


----------



## Imnobodynew

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Yes I have a Var that I'm carrying. Although it really hasn't picked up anything because I haven't been talking to her. I think her behavior is bizarre and it certainly isn't rationale. I mean take the day I broke NC and talked to her, and she was deep and emotional etc. Then a day later whack, I'm done with this blah blah blah. Now she is on her own for a week, having to actually be a mom for a full week and weekend, and then first thing monday morning schedules MC without even telling me? I'm not going but like wow the whipsaw.
> 
> We went to MC before, but it went nowhere. I was always being pressed on to do more things around the house etc, when she fundamentally wouldn't do anything. Wouldn't just talk to AP2 like a co-worker, she had to be friendly because thats who she is. Wouldn't put Life 360 on her phone, or give me her phone password. Like, she didn't change at all. Now all the sudden, she is going to have to be on her own, and take care of the kid by herself for a week and can't go to the gym in the mornings, and she wants to talk? She can get bent. I'm not a plan b.
> 
> The irony of the whole thing, is under the 50/50 temporary custody thing we are doing now. I have to do less around the house, because I'm not watching him right after school, and trying to cook dinner my nights, and trying to give him a bath, and reading him stories and putting him to bed. On my week off, I actually have time to go for a longer run with the dog. I get to relax in my pool/ hot tub. Don't get me wrong. I love my kid, and if my wife said you can have full custody of him, and never contact us again. I'd take that offer in a heart beat. It is kind of nice though, that she fixated on me never doing enough, and now ironically I'm going to be doing none of it for her, and now she wants to try MC. Just kind of humorous.
> [/QUOTE
> 
> *Not that it matters. As I mentioned in the DM, she might be trying to cover her bases so she can blame it on you (she did everything). I think she is just trying to relieve her guilt*


----------



## Divinely Favored

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> So update. Another week of no contact. Went away for the weekend, then this morning I get an e-mail in my e-mail box, about a confirmed marriage counseling appointment, supposidly for me and her. Have no clue why she would schedule it, after what happened last Monday. Haven't said a word to her since. Feel like this might be a trap to get me to talk to her/give her a reaction. Why in the **** would I want to go to marriage counseling, when she can't be trusted and puts everything on me. Is there any circumstance that I should show up to this clusterfuck of a MC session? I don't see any reason to, and I'm tempted to just pretend I never got the e-mail.


Reply to email to cancel it.


----------



## Divinely Favored

ABHale said:


> Unless she believes it will help her in the divorce. “See I tried to get MC and he never showed up.”
> 
> At a loss of why she would do it otherwise.


Mark unread and push to SPAM folder.


----------



## Cynthia

Was the email from your wife or the counseling office?


----------



## farsidejunky

She wants you to move; to react; to show her she still has space in your head.

It is ego kibbles for her...nothing more. 

Radio silence is your best option. 

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk


----------



## re16

Seems like my advice will be an outlier here, but since you have a 4 year old with her, I would think some communication will need to continue.

I would respond and say 'I am not attending counseling with you because we are divorcing, only contact me on matters regarding our child"


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Cynthia said:


> Was the email from your wife or the counseling office?


Yes. So when an appointment is scheduled, it goes to both parties email boxes. She hasn't discussed it with me, or said anything about it.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

re16 said:


> Seems like my advice will be an outlier here, but since you have a 4 year old with her, I would think some communication will need to continue.
> 
> I would respond and say 'I am not attending counseling with you because we are divorcing, only contact me on matters regarding our child"


After I talked to her the last time, I really don't want to say anything to her. If she wanted me to go to counseling. She could have said "I scheduled an appointment for us, I would really like you to to go" but who knows this could all just be another trap, or another ego kibbles thing to get me to acknowledge her. Right now I've been treating her as though she is a ghost. I don't say anything to her, don't look at her. Walk right by her etc.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

farsidejunky said:


> She wants you to move; to react; to show her she still has space in your head.
> 
> It is ego kibbles for her...nothing more.
> 
> Radio silence is your best option.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk


Yeah, whats messed up is that, any reaction or any confirmation that I even got the e-mail seems as though its a kibble. So I'm not going to say anything or show up.


----------



## farsidejunky

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Yeah, whats messed up is that, any reaction or any confirmation that I even got the e-mail seems as though its a kibble. So I'm not going to say anything or show up.


Good. 

One of the hardest things for sane folks to understand when dealing with cluster B people is to be still in the face of their crazy.

Every bit of attention/emotion/time/acknowledgement one provides is like adding gasoline to a fire. 

The best thing they can do is learn to be still. 

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk


----------



## Cynthia

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Yes. So when an appointment is scheduled, it goes to both parties email boxes. She hasn't discussed it with me, or said anything about it.


My only concern is that if she doesn't show up, you might get charged for the visit. It might be a good idea to call the counseling office and ask them to remove your name from the appointment. You don't need to give them an explanation.


----------



## bygone

Even your posts here are telling that you are trying to find hope instead of leaving. Lucky for you, your wife didn't give you an excuse to stay married.

Life after divorce offers more options for men, having your wife spend time with the child will be fatal to her relationships. her chances of a healthy relationship or marriage are harder than you.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> So update. Another week of no contact. Went away for the weekend, then this morning I get an e-mail in my e-mail box, about a confirmed marriage counseling appointment, supposidly for me and her. Have no clue why she would schedule it, after what happened last Monday. Haven't said a word to her since. Feel like this might be a trap to get me to talk to her/give her a reaction. Why in the **** would I want to go to marriage counseling, when she can't be trusted and puts everything on me. Is there any circumstance that I should show up to this clusterfuck of a MC session? I don't see any reason to, and I'm tempted to just pretend I never got the e-mail.


Beware! A lot of marriage counselors are rug sweepers. Waste of time and money. Under the circumstances I wouldn’t go.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> *We went to MC before, but it went nowhere. I was always being pressed on to do more things around the house etc, when she fundamentally wouldn't do anything.* Wouldn't just talk to AP2 like a co-worker, she had to be friendly because thats who she is. Wouldn't put Life 360 on her phone, or give me her phone password. Like, she didn't change at all. Now all the sudden, she is going to have to be on her own, and take care of the kid by herself for a week and can't go to the gym in the mornings, and she wants to talk? She can get bent. I'm not a plan b.
> 
> 
> The irony of the whole thing, is under the 50/50 temporary custody thing we are doing now. I have to do less around the house, because I'm not watching him right after school, and trying to cook dinner my nights, and trying to give him a bath, and reading him stories and putting him to bed. On my week off, I actually have time to go for a longer run with the dog. I get to relax in my pool/ hot tub. Don't get me wrong. I love my kid, and if my wife said you can have full custody of him, and never contact us again. I'd take that offer in a heart beat. It is kind of nice though, that she fixated on me never doing enough, and now ironically I'm going to be doing none of it for her, and now she wants to try MC. Just kind of humorous.


From what I’ve seen pretty typical. You must be friends with poor muffin. Do it for the children. I cringe every time I hear that one. She didn’t care in the least about destroying the family, kids or anything else. Until it suits here.
No contact is your best path forward. Kids have to adjust to divorce anyway so there’s no better time to set the rules. No contact is up to you. No one else gets a say in that.


----------



## *Deidre*

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I just don't get it. I'd rather go see the dentist than go to MC again. Why would I go there? Why couldn't she just say whatever she has to say to me, and let me decide? And who TF gets to schedule me for therapy? Like you should be asking if I even want to go. Which I don't. She is F***ing nuts. Let me tell you, the Yo-Yoing just makes me want to get a one way ticket, for me and my kid to a non-extradition country and start over.


It's just a ruse in my opinion to get you to react, and to respond to her. She sounds narcissistic, and they just...can't help it.  

Staying NC is the only way to stop the madness. If you respond, the games begin again, and it puts you back onto the roller coaster. That's all they want, to know that they can eff with you. Just knowing is enough for them. 

Continue being strong.


----------



## Rus47

@Captainjacksparrow84: What has your attorney said about the timeline for separating finances, separate maintenance, divorce? In your state, how long does the whole mess take? In other words, when are you free to begin living your new life without the STBXW hanging around bothering you? I am guessing you are in your very early thirties, so a lifetime awaits you to meet/date women worthy of your time. You will likely be very surprised how much fun you will have and how much less stress will be in your life. The quicker you are shed of the serial cheater the happier you will be.

You are already realizing that not doing all of the housework frees up a lot of time to do things you enjoy,


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Rus47 said:


> @Captainjacksparrow84: What has your attorney said about the timeline for separating finances, separate maintenance, divorce? In your state, how long does the whole mess take? In other words, when are you free to begin living your new life without the STBXW hanging around bothering you? I am guessing you are in your very early thirties, so a lifetime awaits you to meet/date women worthy of your time. You will likely be very surprised how much fun you will have and how much less stress will be in your life. The quicker you are shed of the serial cheater the happier you will be.
> 
> You are already realizing that not doing all of the housework frees up a lot of time to do things you enjoy,


Actually in my mid, going on late 30's. The mess according to my attorney is 6 -12 months. She's actually in her early 40's. Which apparently from what I hear is a prime time for some woman to start going a little haywire.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Well, I obviously didn't go to MC today. I walked in after she had gone to MC, and it looked as though she had been crying. Just kept maintaining NC, said nothing and pretended that she was a ghost. Woohoo to small victories.


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Actually in my mid, going on late 30's. The mess according to my attorney is *6 -12 months*. She's actually in her early 40's. Which apparently from what I* hear is a prime time for some woman to start going a little haywire.*


Evidently your state is quick with these things, which is great. 6-12 months will go by quickly. Her in her early 40s, hopefully she can move on quickly to another victim and leave you be. I suspect that her AP at work let her know he wasn't into her except as a FB. 

FWIW, both genders can "go haywire" during middle-age crazies as witness the women posting on here about their 50 something husband of decades decides to chase a 20 something hottie. But your wife has been haywire for years though, so evidently it is just who she is.

If she were to decide she didn't want any custody, so she has time to go to the gym etc, are you able to handle full custody of your child? Do you have supportive family nearby? Is your attorney in negotiation with her attorney yet?


----------



## 86857

Look at it this way. Your only other option is to stay. 
I firmly believe that if someone has cheated, even an EA, the relationship will never be the same, no matter how remorseful the cheater is. Your WW isn't exactly a poster girl for remorsefulness! 
There'll always be a doubt if the BS stays which imo is no way to live. 
No such thing as 95% trust. 100% or nothing. 
If you have a look at R threads ie reconciliation, they're pretty depressing, plus it takes years. Ask any of them.
The divorce business isn't fun for sure but everyone gets through it. 
Make sure you get the best financial outcome possible. Make that your focus, not what she did. Play hardball if you have to. It's your future. 
Keep your eye on the ball and have as minimal contact as possible for your own protection. 
Your little boy will be fine. You sound like a fantastic Dad.


----------



## Evinrude58

I agree she’s not going haywire, she’s just doing what she’s always done, which is playing people and using them. Don’t be used.
Continue to detach and steel yourself against her.
Planning and taking action toward a future without the black cloud (her) is what will heal yourself.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Rus47 said:


> Evidently your state is quick with these things, which is great. 6-12 months will go by quickly. Her in her early 40s, hopefully she can move on quickly to another victim and leave you be. I suspect that her AP at work let her know he wasn't into her except as a FB.
> 
> FWIW, both genders can "go haywire" during middle-age crazies as witness the women posting on here about their 50 something husband of decades decides to chase a 20 something hottie. But your wife has been haywire for years though, so evidently it is just who she is.
> 
> If she were to decide she didn't want any custody, so she has time to go to the gym etc, are you able to handle full custody of your child? Do you have supportive family nearby? Is your attorney in negotiation with her attorney yet?


I could handle having him full time. I love my kid. Would it be tougher than 50/50? sure, but that is what parents do. It's tough, when I have taken him to amusement parks, or out to do things, it's kinda tough noticing all the "family" units that are together, but then I start looking and I'm like oh, she is hiding her phone from her hubby, or he just left his family to go to the bathroom and is instantly texting, so I'm like appearances aren't everything right?

I'm not sure if she would give up full custody to me, at least not right away because that would mess up her appearance of being an awesome mother and wife. Which is what she tries to portray to the world. I don't have any family nearby. Wish I did, but it's me on my own here, which is ok.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Evinrude58 said:


> I agree she’s not going haywire, she’s just doing what she’s always done, which is playing people and using them. Don’t be used.
> Continue to detach and steel yourself against her.
> Planning and taking action toward a future without the black cloud (her) is what will heal yourself.


I guess it's hard for me to accept she has always been like this. It didn't feel like it in the beginning when we were married or dating. Just kinda sucks to be slapped with that reality, that she just hid it for a while. Thanks for the reality check though.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

********** said:


> Look at it this way. Your only other option is to stay.
> I firmly believe that if someone has cheated, even an EA, the relationship will never be the same, no matter how remorseful the cheater is. Your WW isn't exactly a poster girl for remorsefulness!
> There'll always be a doubt if the BS stays which imo is no way to live.
> No such thing as 95% trust. 100% or nothing.
> If you have a look at R threads ie reconciliation, they're pretty depressing, plus it takes years. Ask any of them.
> The divorce business isn't fun for sure but everyone gets through it.
> Make sure you get the best financial outcome possible. Make that your focus, not what she did. Play hardball if you have to. It's your future.
> Keep your eye on the ball and have as minimal contact as possible for your own protection.
> Your little boy will be fine. You sound like a fantastic Dad.


Not gunna lie, the options kinda suck right. You stay and you never trust them again. You go and life gets better but you still have to go through hell and pain to get there right? Some argue yeah but it is only temporary, and I agree with that, but going through hell doesn't make it any easier. Thanks for the kind words. I really do try with my kid, I'm not the perfect dad, and I make mistakes, I try to learn from them. I didn't grow up with a father, so I never really had something to emulate, I just try the best I can.


----------



## 86857

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Not gunna lie, the options kinda suck right. You stay and you never trust them again. You go and life gets better but you still have to go through hell and pain to get there right? Some argue yeah but it is only temporary, and I agree with that, but going through hell doesn't make it any easier. Thanks for the kind words. I really do try with my kid, I'm not the perfect dad, and I make mistakes, I try to learn from them. I didn't grow up with a father, so I never really had something to emulate, I just try the best I can.


You're 100% correct @Captainjacksparrow84 . It is hell going through the divorce thing. 
You have a bunch of folks here barracking for you. 
I found being on here helped me so much with my drama which seems like another lifetime now. 
Best thing was, unlike my friends and family, they'd been through it and could relate to it.


----------



## re16

If you're going through hell, keep going. - Winston Churchill


----------



## Cynthia

re16 said:


> If you're going through hell, keep going. - Winston Churchill


That's one of my favorite quotes. It's so true. Do not stop in the middle. Do not go back. Go all the way through.


----------



## Rus47

Cynthia said:


> That's one of my favorite quotes. It's so true. Do not stop in the middle. Do not go back. Go all the way through.


How many under 40 even know who Churchill was, what he did, and the circumstances of the quote? (Which references say he never said)


----------



## Cynthia

Rus47 said:


> How many under 40 even know who Churchill was, what he did, and the circumstances of the quote? (Which references say he never said)


Churchill said a lot of pithy things. I love the one with Lady Astor.


----------



## Evinrude58

Yes, divorce is a hell that only a betrayed spouse understands. It’s hell from the time you wake up to the time you fall asleep, and heck, I even had nightmares of my ex with other men for a while. I took some Zoloft for about a month and it helped with the anxiety.

Exercising a lot (easy when you’re on the divorce diet and lose 30lbs in 2 months) helped.
Getting back to dating helped. 
Building a cabin on the lake from nothing helped.

Get your mind elsewhere. No contact as much as possible.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Evinrude58 said:


> Yes, divorce is a hell that only a betrayed spouse understands. It’s hell from the time you wake up to the time you fall asleep, and heck, I even had nightmares of my ex with other men for a while. I took some Zoloft for about a month and it helped with the anxiety.
> 
> Exercising a lot (easy when you’re on the divorce diet and lose 30lbs in 2 months) helped.
> Getting back to dating helped.
> Building a cabin on the lake from nothing helped.
> 
> Get your mind elsewhere. No contact as much as possible.


She went and gota new base for her bed frame and had it delivered today....kinda weird. Doesn't seem like she wants to leave if she's getting new furniture?


----------



## Evinrude58

Why should she leave? You’re paying the bills and she’s looking for a monkey branch. She has you for baby sitting while she dates.
It’s a sweet deal.

yiu need to find a way to get her gone if you can. She’s gonna set you up for a domestic violence charge and put you out. Get a restraining order, and still have her nest


----------



## Cynthia

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> She went and gota new base for her bed frame and had it delivered today....kinda weird. Doesn't seem like she wants to leave if she's getting new furniture?





Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I haven't left the house. I think her attorney advised her not to leave the house either.


Her attorney may have told her that she'll be able to keep the house. I wouldn't worry about what her plans are. Just put one foot in the front of the other and make good decisions as you go. You cannot control the outcome.


Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Whelp, I was an idiot and got roped into talking to her. Had a productive conversation Sunday night, then had a conversation tonight, and it turned into everything being my fault. Screw it. I clearly didn't learn my lesson. Done talking to this narcissist. She tried to say that I emotionally abused her for 10 years, because I didn't hang out with her enough. I clearly wasn't a perfect husband by any means, but I never saw her complaining when we went on vacation to nice places. Then she tells me I'm playing the victim, because I brought up her infidelity. This is done. I'm done. Good luck to her AP2 or whatever. Girl wouldn't know the truth if it hit her in the face. Kind of tough to be in a relationship, when she won't admit she is wrong about a single freaking thing. I'm such an idiot for talking to her. Whelp back to NC.


She has already accused you of abuse a couple of times. Watch your back. If you can have cameras installed in the house, I would recommend it. Talk to your attorney about concerns that she may try to accuse you of domestic violence, based on what she has said to you. See what his/her recommendations are to prevent that.


----------



## SunCMars

Evinrude58 said:


> Yes, divorce is a hell that only a betrayed spouse understands. It’s hell from the time you wake up to the time you fall asleep, and heck, I even had nightmares of my ex with other men for a while. I took some Zoloft for about a month and it helped with the anxiety.
> 
> Exercising a lot (easy when you’re on the divorce diet and lose 30lbs in 2 months) helped.
> Getting back to dating helped.
> Building a cabin on the lake from nothing helped.
> 
> Get your mind elsewhere. No contact as much as possible.


Ah!

Zo-lofty iz eet now.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Not gunna lie, the options kinda suck right. You stay and you never trust them again. You go and life gets better but you still have to go through hell and pain to get there right? Some argue yeah but it is only temporary, and I agree with that, but going through hell doesn't make it any easier. Thanks for the kind words. I really do try with my kid, I'm not the perfect dad, and I make mistakes, I try to learn from them. I didn't grow up with a father, so I never really had something to emulate, I just try the best I can.


Yep, there is no magic fix. Long term you will be fine. Don’t worry about making mistakes, etc. kids just like your time and attention. Short term pain versus long term gain.


----------



## Marc878

Cynthia said:


> Her attorney may have told her that she'll be able to keep the house. I wouldn't worry about what her plans are. Just put one foot in the front of the other and make good decisions as you go. You cannot control the outcome.
> 
> She has already accused you of abuse a couple of times. Watch your back. If you can have cameras installed in the house, I would recommend it. Talk to your attorney about concerns that she may try to accuse you of domestic violence, based on what she has said to you. See what his/her recommendations are to prevent that.


Keep a voice activated recorder on you at all time. False domestic violence filings happen. We just had one here a few weeks ago. Luckily the guy took the advice and his charges were dropped but not after a trip to the police department. Don’t think it can’t happen to you.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Well, I obviously didn't go to MC today. I walked in after she had gone to MC, and it looked as though she had been crying. Just kept maintaining NC, said nothing and pretended that she was a ghost. Woohoo to small victories.


She’s crying for herself. She wasn’t ready for reality yet. You’ve ruined her long term plans.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Marc878 said:


> She’s crying for herself. She wasn’t ready for reality yet. You’ve ruined her long term plans.


Half of me thinks I gave her what she wants. She doesn't have to deal with me, unless it's dealing about the kid. Meanwhile she can go and date and screw whoever. I just need to have this divorce start moving.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Sheriff finally served her yesterday. She sent me a text asking about her expired passport. I ignored, and am keeping on keeping on.


----------



## Openminded

Good for you — keeping on keeping on is the best course.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Sheriff finally served her yesterday. She sent me a text asking about her expired passport. I ignored, and am keeping on keeping on.


Good. Save yourself.


----------



## Evinrude58

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Sheriff finally served her yesterday. She sent me a text asking about her expired passport. I ignored, and am keeping on keeping on.


You are handling this like a man who intends on being happy again in life. You know what? You WILL BE. Bravo on having her served


----------



## truststone

*Deidre* said:


> One day at a time. Don’t be upset with yourself if you slip at times because you’ve been in this dynamic a while and it takes like a “re-programming” to stop responding and allowing yourself to be sucked back into the drama. No contact is the only way - if you can block her and have her just use email to discuss the divorce, that would be best. And have her emails go to junk so you’re not checking it all the time. I wasn’t married to my ex bf who was abusive so I know you may have challenges ahead that I didn’t. But emotionally, you’ll get stronger the less contact you have with her.
> 
> And remove “friends” on social media who are connected with her. Literally block all roads that lead to her. You will find that some “friends” want to keep telling you about her and keep the drama going.
> 
> It’s a lot to take in but if you commit to staying true to yourself one day at a time, it will get better. One day you’ll wake up, and she will be a distant memory and you can use the experience to help others going through the same things you once did.
> 
> The real lesson you’ll actually come away with is - how did I let this happen? And once you work on ways to improve your self-esteem, no contact will become more effortless. You’ll see.😌


well put


----------



## truststone

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> If I'm being completely honest with myself. Her love was what kept me hanging on. When she said that, I was like this is messed up. Not sure why that was the trigger to push me over the edge, but it was.


unfortunately because you trully loved her , this was something u unfortunately needed to help you move forward and realize you cannot go back. im sorry your dealing with this but one step forward is what you need to do.. when someone truelly loves they put themselves in a position where they can be hurt beyond measure and are at the mercy of the one they love especially when they have commiteed themselves to that person and loving them.. thats love and now the one person you loved has done the unspeakable countless times and now you honestly know where they stand. when in doubt just remember her actions and even though you where willing to work it through you have realized you cant change anyone especially someone that doesnt love you the way you love them... So by all means never go back , be strong and never blame yourself. you gave it your all and that is whats most important .. dont continue to sacrifice who you are for a lost cause.. im sorry but everything you have done and tried lets me know that your love was guiniue but its not for her any longer you deserve soo much better even thuogh it doesnt seem like it now but you do. i think her not answering you about loving you was a blessing its what you needed to know in your heart to cement your actions of never looking back getting her completly out of you life . soo sorry for you


----------



## truststone

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I have been using the NC...this feels like it is eating me alive slowly.


be strong dont give her the chance to destroy you again. just think if you do and you get destroyed who will be there for your kids ?? they need you !!


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

truststone said:


> be strong dont give her the chance to destroy you again. just think if you do and you get destroyed who will be there for your kids ?? they need you !!


Yeah, I'm not. I'm just surprised that she really hasn't had a reaction to getting served.


----------



## truststone

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Sheriff finally served her yesterday. She sent me a text asking about her expired passport. I ignored, and am keeping on keeping on.


good for you and why is it your problem with the passport lol good job !! continue to ghost


----------



## truststone

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Yeah, I'm not. I'm just surprised that she really hasn't had a reaction to getting served.


the things that concern you are the things that concern someone who has trully loved and devoted themselves to someone and thats what keeps you looking for clues that dont really mean aynthing but we convive ourselves they do!! , why would you expect her to have a reaction? thats your heart looking for something to see that she is hurting, but that may play several tricks on you 
1) Maybe she has realized her mistake ?? so finally she will change and yes she now sees what she had and will now miss -- that will never be and i guarantee if u see it its to get you back and continue her emotional abuse
2)makes you feel better momentarily - which is okay but continuing down that road now , looking for those signs and things that dont matter anymore is like a drug to validate what your doing and feeling and that road only leds to you being stuck and not moving forward... dont get me wrong when we have all been hurt we all want that but now is not the time to be distracted by those things .. you will get your validation when your divorced and doing better and you life has starting moving forward again.. but make sure you work on yourself change your lifestyle get in shape continue to be the dad you have been and as time goes on when she sees how happy your are and you have not let yourself go you will start seeing how much she realizes what she let go even if she doesnt atleast now you wil be at a place where you can honestly say I dont give a **** !!! ANd bevause you worked on youself for the better you will attract people like that and who knows maybe find the right women down the road

Because of your actions, because you gave it your all , because you didnt quit until you had no choice that is what you son will see and come to learn that his dad did .. he will also learn as he matures how grateful he is that you never keeped him in an abuse environment . and you left because you needed him to have the best life possible and that meant not being with his mother . 

you are a gentleman and a really good Dad , most of us would never have been able to be as pateint and even try to look past the infidelity as you where wilingl to do especially if the SO acted like yours did for soo long.. and that is why you did all you could as a human who is not perfect and there is nobody who is!! 

let that chapter of your life go its going to be extremely hard if it where easy everyone would do it , but the constant theme is time heals and helps you not regret the choice you have made and it affords you the cahnce down the road to love again but you have to work onyourself(by that i mean dont allow yourself to let this ruin you as a person) . Unfortunatlety you have walked the walk and i know your son will grow up knowing he should never accept infidelity and if it happens its okay if he leaves and not blame himself and his dad will never think he is a failure and if it does happen he will have you there for him!!!


----------



## Beach123

The person that har cares the most gets the most hurt.
By your evidence - you care more than she does.

so work on caring less.


----------



## SunCMars

Cynthia said:


> That's one of my favorite quotes. It's so true. Do not stop in the middle. Do not go back. Go all the way through.


If you stop, it ends up being that _Hotel California._
You can stay as long as you like, but you can never leave!


----------



## SunCMars

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Sheriff finally served her yesterday. She sent me a text asking about her expired passport. I ignored, and am keeping on keeping on.


She does not need a passport to go to _Hell_. 

There is no border fence, and all waywards are welcome.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

truststone said:


> the things that concern you are the things that concern someone who has trully loved and devoted themselves to someone and thats what keeps you looking for clues that dont really mean aynthing but we convive ourselves they do!! , why would you expect her to have a reaction? thats your heart looking for something to see that she is hurting, but that may play several tricks on you
> 1) Maybe she has realized her mistake ?? so finally she will change and yes she now sees what she had and will now miss -- that will never be and i guarantee if u see it its to get you back and continue her emotional abuse
> 2)makes you feel better momentarily - which is okay but continuing down that road now , looking for those signs and things that dont matter anymore is like a drug to validate what your doing and feeling and that road only leds to you being stuck and not moving forward... dont get me wrong when we have all been hurt we all want that but now is not the time to be distracted by those things .. you will get your validation when your divorced and doing better and you life has starting moving forward again.. but make sure you work on yourself change your lifestyle get in shape continue to be the dad you have been and as time goes on when she sees how happy your are and you have not let yourself go you will start seeing how much she realizes what she let go even if she doesnt atleast now you wil be at a place where you can honestly say I dont give a **** !!! ANd bevause you worked on youself for the better you will attract people like that and who knows maybe find the right women down the road
> 
> Because of your actions, because you gave it your all , because you didnt quit until you had no choice that is what you son will see and come to learn that his dad did .. he will also learn as he matures how grateful he is that you never keeped him in an abuse environment . and you left because you needed him to have the best life possible and that meant not being with his mother .
> 
> you are a gentleman and a really good Dad , most of us would never have been able to be as pateint and even try to look past the infidelity as you where wilingl to do especially if the SO acted like yours did for soo long.. and that is why you did all you could as a human who is not perfect and there is nobody who is!!
> 
> let that chapter of your life go its going to be extremely hard if it where easy everyone would do it , but the constant theme is time heals and helps you not regret the choice you have made and it affords you the cahnce down the road to love again but you have to work onyourself(by that i mean dont allow yourself to let this ruin you as a person) . Unfortunatlety you have walked the walk and i know your son will grow up knowing he should never accept infidelity and if it happens its okay if he leaves and not blame himself and his dad will never think he is a failure and if it does happen he will have you there for him!!!





truststone said:


> the things that concern you are the things that concern someone who has trully loved and devoted themselves to someone and thats what keeps you looking for clues that dont really mean aynthing but we convive ourselves they do!! , why would you expect her to have a reaction? thats your heart looking for something to see that she is hurting, but that may play several tricks on you
> 1) Maybe she has realized her mistake ?? so finally she will change and yes she now sees what she had and will now miss -- that will never be and i guarantee if u see it its to get you back and continue her emotional abuse
> 2)makes you feel better momentarily - which is okay but continuing down that road now , looking for those signs and things that dont matter anymore is like a drug to validate what your doing and feeling and that road only leds to you being stuck and not moving forward... dont get me wrong when we have all been hurt we all want that but now is not the time to be distracted by those things .. you will get your validation when your divorced and doing better and you life has starting moving forward again.. but make sure you work on yourself change your lifestyle get in shape continue to be the dad you have been and as time goes on when she sees how happy your are and you have not let yourself go you will start seeing how much she realizes what she let go even if she doesnt atleast now you wil be at a place where you can honestly say I dont give a **** !!! ANd bevause you worked on youself for the better you will attract people like that and who knows maybe find the right women down the road
> 
> Because of your actions, because you gave it your all , because you didnt quit until you had no choice that is what you son will see and come to learn that his dad did .. he will also learn as he matures how grateful he is that you never keeped him in an abuse environment . and you left because you needed him to have the best life possible and that meant not being with his mother .
> 
> you are a gentleman and a really good Dad , most of us would never have been able to be as pateint and even try to look past the infidelity as you where wilingl to do especially if the SO acted like yours did for soo long.. and that is why you did all you could as a human who is not perfect and there is nobody who is!!
> 
> let that chapter of your life go its going to be extremely hard if it where easy everyone would do it , but the constant theme is time heals and helps you not regret the choice you have made and it affords you the cahnce down the road to love again but you have to work onyourself(by that i mean dont allow yourself to let this ruin you as a person) . Unfortunatlety you have walked the walk and i know your son will grow up knowing he should never accept infidelity and if it happens its okay if he leaves and not blame himself and his dad will never think he is a failure and if it does happen he will have you there for him!!!


Thanks. I think it's about 11 years down the tube and to get no response? I mean to me it's kinda crazy. Even if I saw her breakdown it wouldn't matter, I'd still continue with the D, it'd just be nice to know that 11 years meant something/anything to her.


----------



## 86857

Who knows what's in her mind. . . 
-maybe she knows your done with her 100% & is in shock cos she wasn't expecting it,
-maybe she feels shame and is unable to say anything, I mean what can she say, 
-maybe she's with AP though I'm sensing she's not, 
-maybe she's doing gray rock.
I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that it didn't mean anything to her. 
Nobody stays in a marriage that long, & especially have a kid, if it doesn't mean anything. 

Why is she renewing her passport? An odd think to do in the midst of all this. I'd be curious. 

You're doing great. Kudos for having the courage to act so quickly on this. Most don't cos it's so difficult to see it for what it is and act quickly.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

********** said:


> Who knows what's in her mind. . .
> -maybe she knows your done with her 100% & is in shock cos she wasn't expecting it,
> -maybe she feels shame and is unable to say anything, I mean what can she say,
> -maybe she's with AP though I'm sensing she's not,
> -maybe she's doing gray rock.
> I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that it didn't mean anything to her.
> Nobody stays in a marriage that long, & especially have a kid, if it doesn't mean anything.
> 
> Why is she renewing her passport? An odd think to do in the midst of all this. I'd be curious.
> 
> You're doing great. Kudos for having the courage to act so quickly on this. Most don't cos it's so difficult to see it for what it is and act quickly.


Honestly, I was hoping she is/was with AP, so that hopefully my divorce will go quicker and smoother. As far as the passport, I have no idea. It was expired, so maybe she just wants to renew it? It expired in December. I mean when I gave her divorce papers the first time (Didn't have her served, just e-mailed them to her, and said I want out) The first thing she did was go out and got a new cell phone and plan off of mine. Now the day she get's served she wants to renew her passport. Just really odd behavior. I like the one posters suggestion, maybe she is on a work visa to hell lol


----------



## jlg07

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Honestly, I was hoping she is/was with AP, so that hopefully my divorce will go quicker and smoother. As far as the passport, I have no idea. It was expired, so maybe she just wants to renew it? It expired in December. I mean when I gave her divorce papers the first time (Didn't have her served, just e-mailed them to her, and said I want out) The first thing she did was go out and got a new cell phone and plan off of mine. Now the day she get's served she wants to renew her passport. Just really odd behavior. I like the one posters suggestion, maybe she is on a work visa to hell lol


I'd be careful -- make sure that your kid either DOESN'T have a passport, or YOU have it in your possession. Don't want her running off with your kid...


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

jlg07 said:


> I'd be careful -- make sure that your kid either DOESN'T have a passport, or YOU have it in your possession. Don't want her running off with your kid...


I have the kids passport.


----------



## Openminded

A difficult thing to accept is that what a marriage means to one is not what it means to the other. So, yes, 11 years may have meant nothing to her while meaning everything to you. But you are also very fortunate that you have lots of time to rebuild your life and be happy — and you will. I certainly wish I had gotten out in my 30’s the first time I was aware that my husband was cheating instead of wasting decades thinking things would improve.


----------



## Dictum Veritas

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I have the kids passport.


You need to find out how to alert you if a new application for a passport in their names is made. Your STBXW may want to claim their passports lost, replace them and abduct them.

Be very very careful.


----------



## SunCMars

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Honestly, I was hoping she is/was with AP, so that hopefully my divorce will go quicker and smoother. As far as the passport, I have no idea. It was expired, so maybe she just wants to renew it? It expired in December. I mean when I gave her divorce papers the first time (Didn't have her served, just e-mailed them to her, and said I want out) The first thing she did was go out and got a new cell phone and plan off of mine. Now the day she get's served she wants to renew her passport. Just really odd behavior. I like the one posters suggestion, maybe she is on a work visa to hell lol


She is going to the Bahama's or to Europe, somewhere to celebrate her new freedom.

She is not going alone to where ever it is .
Be sure of that.

Canada requires an active passport/passcard.


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Honestly, I was hoping she is/was with AP, so that hopefully my divorce will go quicker and smoother. As far as the passport, I have no idea. It was expired, so maybe she just wants to renew it? It expired in December. I mean when I gave her divorce papers the first time (Didn't have her served, just e-mailed them to her, and said I want out) The first thing she did was go out and got a new cell phone and plan off of mine. Now the day she get's served she wants to renew her passport. Just really odd behavior. I like the one posters suggestion, maybe she is on a work visa to hell lol


Maybe she plans leaving the country. Is AP from elsewhere? Maybe she going to become expat. Who cares?


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Rus47 said:


> Maybe she plans leaving the country. Is AP from elsewhere? Maybe she going to become expat. Who cares?


I mean if she plans on leaving it permanetly I guess I get 100% custody, so yay? I think she is probably just going wherever with ap 1, 10 or 200. I don't really care as long as she doesn't abduct my kid.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I mean if she plans on leaving it permanetly I guess I get 100% custody, so yay? I think she is probably just going wherever with ap 1, 10 or 200. I don't really care as long as she doesn't abduct my kid.


Why was she even asking you about the passport. Do you have position of it or something? If not, I would just continue to ignore her. Don't concern yourself with what she is doing unless it impacts the kids.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

BigDaddyNY said:


> Why was she even asking you about the passport. Do you have position of it or something? If not, I would just continue to ignore her. Don't concern yourself with what she is doing unless it impacts the kids.


I had it in a safe. She doesn't have the combination to the safe. I didn't even answer just put the expired passport on the table. Called it a day.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Alright, so this is more of a poll. How hard should I go after the whole Adultery thing in the Divorce? I have to send out some interrogatories and notices to produce, and I"m just wondering if it is even worth it at this point. Just give me my kid and I'll be out of here.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Alright, so this is more of a poll. How hard should I go after the whole Adultery thing in the Divorce? I have to send out some interrogatories and notices to produce, and I"m just wondering if it is even worth it at this point. Just give me my kid and I'll be out of here.


Ask your attorney. In some states adultery doesn’t matter. If it does it usually just reduces alimony.


----------



## Dictum Veritas

I did things the old fashioned way. I instructed my lawyer to burn her world and get whatever we can and let her sweat for any reductions. I walked away giving her a token amount. I didn't even pay spousal support even-though I earned 3 times her salary and we live in a no-fault country. I think she settled because of the ferocity of our attack and demands.

That strategy worked for me, but you need a shark lawyer and a willingness to burn her world to pull it off.


----------



## farsidejunky

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Alright, so this is more of a poll. How hard should I go after the whole Adultery thing in the Divorce? I have to send out some interrogatories and notices to produce, and I"m just wondering if it is even worth it at this point. Just give me my kid and I'll be out of here.


I agree with Marc on being pragmatic. 

That said...and obviously consult your attorney on this...but sometimes just the threat of a subpoena for the AP to testify in open court is enough for some leverage. 

Sent from my Pixel 6 using Tapatalk


----------



## marko polo

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Alright, so this is more of a poll. How hard should I go after the whole Adultery thing in the Divorce? I have to send out some interrogatories and notices to produce, and I"m just wondering if it is even worth it at this point. Just give me my kid and I'll be out of here.


Your lawyer can answer this best. At the very least it will probably cost you extra. As the jokes goes divorces are expensive because they are worth it.

Do you want a legal record that she is a cheat? Will always be something you can hold over her head. Cheats don't like to be exposed.


----------



## Rus47

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I"m just wondering if it is even worth it at this point. Just give me my kid and I'll be out of here.


IMO it is worth nothing. Get things done as quickly as possible and move on. The revenge temptation is always strong, but we usually do ourselves the harm. The adultress knows what she is and the court doesnt care


----------



## Butforthegrace

Ask your lawyer. This varies a lot from state to state. In some states, it can significantly impact custody split, spousal support (alimony), etc.

In addition to the legal aspect, there is the aspect of airing the truth (or, if you view it this way, the dirty laundry) in public. Can you obtain a strategic advantage vs your WW in the divorce if you go very public with graphic descriptions of what she did? As much as you want it done, divorce is an adversarial proceeding.


----------



## Kamstel2

Go for it!!!!Only go for irreconcilable differences if she agrees to everything you want.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Just an update since I've gone quiet for a bit. Mediation is scheduled for September. Any advice from those that have gone through mediation?


----------



## Imnobodynew

Out of curiosity? You were sort of opposed to divorce? What brought about the change in heart? Did she do it again? Lack of real remorse?


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Imnobodynew said:


> Out of curiosity? You were sort of opposed to divorce? What brought about the change in heart? Did she do it again? Lack of real remorse?


I had my lines in the sand. She refused to do what I needed to rebuild trust, lack of remorse, lack of empathy, lack of anything really, she is a robot. Ultimately, I think what pushed me over the edge was realizing that I was more lonely with her than without her. She also gave me the whole, I love you, but I don't know how I love you line, and I'm like well if you don't know if you love me as your partner and person then wtf am I doing trying to fix this. To this day she still has done nothing to try to get me back, or even show one ounce of remorse, just reinforces that I am doing the right thing. Haven't spoken to her verbally since April.


----------



## Evinrude58

You will heal a lot faster with the direction you’ve chosen which is obviously the right one.


----------



## BoSlander

Guys/Gals, once married, there ISN’T such a thing as “Girls night out” or “Guys night out.” When married, especially if you have kids, you are ONE unit and you should move around as if you’re one unit. If your friends do not understand it then that means they’re extremely immature and you should put some space in between you and them.

I don’t really know when this sort of horse s*** ever became mainstream but it has to FREAKING stop! If your spouse wants to go out with the boys/gals (and that means NO MEN/WOMEN INCLUDED) once because Johnnie/Amber is getting married and they’re throwing him a bachelor party, that can be discussed.

BUUUUUUT, if you just got married and your spouse still wants to go out, then that means you shouldn’t have gotten married and you most definitely ought to have a conversation with your spouse and draw lines in the sand.


----------



## Divinely Favored

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I had my lines in the sand. She refused to do what I needed to rebuild trust, lack of remorse, lack of empathy, lack of anything really, she is a robot. Ultimately, I think what pushed me over the edge was realizing that I was more lonely with her than without her. She also gave me the whole, I love you, but I don't know how I love you line, and I'm like well if you don't know if you love me as your partner and person then wtf am I doing trying to fix this. To this day she still has done nothing to try to get me back, or even show one ounce of remorse, just reinforces that I am doing the right thing. Haven't spoken to her verbally since April.


She's for the streets!


----------



## Divinely Favored

JBLH said:


> Guys/Gals, once married, there ISN’T such a thing as “Girls night out” or “Guys night out.” When married, especially if you have kids, you are ONE unit and you should move around as if you’re one unit. If your friends do not understand it then that means they’re extremely immature and you should put some space in between you and them.
> 
> I don’t really know when this sort of horse s*** ever became mainstream but it has to FREAKING stop! If your spouse wants to go out with the boys/gals (and that means NO MEN/WOMEN INCLUDED) once because Johnnie/Amber is getting married and they’re throwing him a bachelor party, that can be discussed.
> 
> BUUUUUUT, if you just got married and your spouse still wants to go out, then that means you shouldn’t have gotten married and you most definitely ought to have a conversation with your spouse and draw lines in the sand.


Lines in the sand my ass! I have have concrete retaining walls. Lines in sand can be moved and re-drawn.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

JBLH said:


> Guys/Gals, once married, there ISN’T such a thing as “Girls night out” or “Guys night out.” When married, especially if you have kids, you are ONE unit and you should move around as if you’re one unit. If your friends do not understand it then that means they’re extremely immature and you should put some space in between you and them.
> 
> I don’t really know when this sort of horse s*** ever became mainstream but it has to FREAKING stop! If your spouse wants to go out with the boys/gals (and that means NO MEN/WOMEN INCLUDED) once because Johnnie/Amber is getting married and they’re throwing him a bachelor party, that can be discussed.
> 
> BUUUUUUT, if you just got married and your spouse still wants to go out, then that means you shouldn’t have gotten married and you most definitely ought to have a conversation with your spouse and draw lines in the sand.


I tried to be empathetic and understand her need for some time to recharge. I agree looking back at it though, that it was a mistake. The worst part of it all, is I got the answers to my interogatorries back, and she said that I was "narcissistic and emotionally abusive" which is her defense to her adultery. Just kind of had to laugh at it. What's even more ridicolous is she is using a letter that I wrote to her basically telling her much I loved her, and how I was sorry for my short comings, as evidence of my narcissistic and absuive behavior, because I apologized for not hanging out with her as much as I should have, and how I was overly involved in my work, and that I was sorry for ignoring her on occassions. That I wish we had spent more time as a family together, that I was sorry for not always being an effective communicator. I'm not perfect, I recognized that and wrote an apology when I was trying to work on the relationship. Now it's being thrown right back in my face. _sigh_


----------



## Evinrude58

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I tried to be empathetic and understand her need for some time to recharge. I agree looking back at it though, that it was a mistake. The worst part of it all, is I got the answers to my interogatorries back, and she said that I was "narcissistic and emotionally abusive" which is her defense to her adultery. Just kind of had to laugh at it. What's even more ridicolous is she is using a letter that I wrote to her basically telling her much I loved her, and how I was sorry for my short comings, as evidence of my narcissistic and absuive behavior, because I apologized for not hanging out with her as much as I should have, and how I was overly involved in my work, and that I was sorry for ignoring her on occassions. That I wish we had spent more time as a family together, that I was sorry for not always being an effective communicator. I'm not perfect, I recognized that and wrote an apology when I was trying to work on the relationship. Now it's being thrown right back in my face. _sigh_


CaptainJack,
I had a very similar experience as you.
The good thing is you see it for what it is now and that shows you are healing. I read what a wise TAM’er posted about “Betrayed Souse Syndrome” as the called it. When a betrayed spouse tries to accept all the blame and “fix themselves” since their spouse’s betrayal is something they can’t do anything about and they feel that fixing themselves is their golden path to control the out of control death spiral of their relationship. As you have seen, this attitude only furnishes the selfish delusions of the Judas with ammunition to use as evidence that the betrayed spouse was at fault and the reason they were “excused” from their adulterous behavior. 

It’s definitely an insult to the injury. I greatly regret giving my ex a letter outlining all my “wrongs” I felt I was guilty of, before I found out what a disgusting cheater she was.
She probably keeps it by her bed, to use aa a blanket to cover her guilt so she doesn’t have to accept what a low person she is.

I understand your pain.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I tried to be empathetic and understand her need for some time to recharge. I agree looking back at it though, that it was a mistake. The worst part of it all, is I got the answers to my interogatorries back, and she said that I was "narcissistic and emotionally abusive" which is her defense to her adultery. Just kind of had to laugh at it. What's even more ridicolous is she is using a letter that I wrote to her basically telling her much I loved her, and how I was sorry for my short comings, as evidence of my narcissistic and absuive behavior, because I apologized for not hanging out with her as much as I should have, and how I was overly involved in my work, and that I was sorry for ignoring her on occassions. That I wish we had spent more time as a family together, that I was sorry for not always being an effective communicator. I'm not perfect, I recognized that and wrote an apology when I was trying to work on the relationship. Now it's being thrown right back in my face. _sigh_


It sounds like you are keeping yourself bound up in this. Why? What’s it getting you?


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Marc878 said:


> It sounds like you are keeping yourself bound up in this. Why? What’s it getting you?


I'm not bound up in other than I want to make sure I get primary or at the very least 50/50 with my son, other than that she can go pound sand.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Going to mediation next week. Any words of advice? I guess it is my lawyer in one room with me. Her lawyer with her in another room, and the mediator goes between.


----------



## Marc878

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Going to mediation next week. Any words of advice? I guess it is my lawyer in one room with me. Her lawyer with her in another room, and the mediator goes between.


You are paying your attorney for a reason. Listen to him. I hope you got a good experienced one.
This is a business decision now. Finances matter. Emotions don’t count.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Marc878 said:


> You are paying your attorney for a reason. Listen to him. I hope you got a good experienced one.


She is pretty much the best one in the entire state. Hope she's worth it.


----------



## BeyondRepair007

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> She is pretty much the best one in the entire state. Hope she's worth it.


Take her advice. Don't let your thoughts, your heart, influence you. Do what your lawyer recommends every single time.


----------



## re16

Stand your ground. That ramifications of that day could affect you negatively for a long time.


----------



## Megaforce

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I tried to be empathetic and understand her need for some time to recharge. I agree looking back at it though, that it was a mistake. The worst part of it all, is I got the answers to my interogatorries back, and she said that I was "narcissistic and emotionally abusive" which is her defense to her adultery. Just kind of had to laugh at it. What's even more ridicolous is she is using a letter that I wrote to her basically telling her much I loved her, and how I was sorry for my short comings, as evidence of my narcissistic and absuive behavior, because I apologized for not hanging out with her as much as I should have, and how I was overly involved in my work, and that I was sorry for ignoring her on occassions. That I wish we had spent more time as a family together, that I was sorry for not always being an effective communicator. I'm not perfect, I recognized that and wrote an apology when I was trying to work on the relationship. Now it's being thrown right back in my face. _sigh_


One thing, among many I have learned about narcissists, is that any disclosure of a vulnerability or deficiency will be used against one down the road.
One of the more common justifications I have seen cheating wives use is some variation of an allegation abusiveness, narcissism or being controlling on the part of the husband. Not to say this can never be true, but it does amaze me how willing some folks are to just accept the validity of these allegations with no consideration of the fact that they are being made by a known liar highly motivated to justify cheating( both to herself and others).


----------



## BoSlander

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> I tried to be empathetic and understand her need for some time to recharge. I agree looking back at it though, that it was a mistake. The worst part of it all, is I got the answers to my interogatorries back, and she said that I was "narcissistic and emotionally abusive" which is her defense to her adultery. Just kind of had to laugh at it. What's even more ridicolous is she is using a letter that I wrote to her basically telling her much I loved her, and how I was sorry for my short comings, as evidence of my narcissistic and absuive behavior, because I apologized for not hanging out with her as much as I should have, and how I was overly involved in my work, and that I was sorry for ignoring her on occassions. That I wish we had spent more time as a family together, that I was sorry for not always being an effective communicator. I'm not perfect, I recognized that and wrote an apology when I was trying to work on the relationship. Now it's being thrown right back in my face. _sigh_


In negotiations parlance, you handed her a freebee. Never, ever, ever, ever, expose your personal shortcomings to your SO in writing. Females have the memory of an elephant and mentally store sh-t up for decades just in case they have to use it against you.


----------



## Evinrude58

I did the exact same thing as captain Jack with an idiotic letter, long before I discovered her real reason for wanting a divorce. 
Still turns my stomach that I wrote it. As said, they use that crap as justification for their disgusting, backstabbing, selfish, low behavior.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Just an updated. Mediation failed. I made two offers, and they got up and left. Off to court we go.


----------



## BigDaddyNY

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Just an updated. Mediation failed. I made two offers, and they got up and left. Off to court we go.


Wasn't a big surprise, was it?

Did they say what they objected to?


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

BigDaddyNY said:


> Wasn't a big surprise, was it?
> 
> Did they say what they objected to?


Everything pretty much. Gave them an offer they said no, gave them another offer they said no. Wasn't a big surprise, but was kinda hoping for some outline of a resolution.


----------



## Evinrude58

I really hope you get some justice


----------



## Rus47

Evinrude58 said:


> I really hope you get some justice


Wish this were possible. But remember, he being male it isnt likely. They must believe they have high likelyhood of getting much better deal in court than they were offered in mediation.

Hope @Captainjacksparrow84 isnt paying for both attorneys. If he is, that’s why mediation didnt work. Its all about billable hours.


----------



## Captainjacksparrow84

Rus47 said:


> Wish this were possible. But remember, he being male it isnt likely. They must believe they have high likelyhood of getting much better deal in court than they were offered in mediation.
> 
> Hope @Captainjacksparrow84 isnt paying for both attorneys. If he is, that’s why mediation didnt work. Its all about billable hours.


Not paying for both attorneys.


----------



## Trident

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Not paying for both attorneys.


You might ultimately be directed by a court to pay some of her legal fees, if you're the "monied" spouse.


----------



## Affaircare

@Captainjacksparrow84,

I'm not at all surprised that mediation failed. She very likely has "friends" or her own lawyer talking in her ear saying she "deserves" or should get the home, child support, and alimony...that you should move out and she gets to keep the kids and the lifestyle but essentially replace YOU with the boyfriend-accessory. You yourself said "She refuses to get a new job, and refuses to stop being friends with guy number #2" so you know that her mindset is essentially "I keep my life as is, move you out, move AP2 in." 

Of course, that's not reality. Reality is that you'll probably sell the home and split the equity, you'll probably both move to your own places, you'll probably have the kid an equal amount of time (1 week with you, 1 with her) or you'll have 50/50 "legal custody" and you'll end up with the kid more because she wants to "have a social life."  Reality is that the judge will make a list of your assets and debts and split them fairly (she gets "hers", you get "yours" and you each get half of the joint "marital" assets and debts). Reality is that the judge will go to the Child Support Calculator for your state, plug in real numbers, and come out with who owes whom (if any). If she's a SAHM but has a degree, he'll take into consideration that she's employable but refuses to work, etc. Reality is that alimony is only given in certain circumstances, and this isn't a LONG marriage...it might be that she'd get a couple years worth "to help her get trained and back on her feet" (as an example, she may get some for 3 years to help her have some time to go to trade school and finish XYZ so she can get a license in her trade).

Check with your attorney, but I'd recommend just make reasonable, fair offers and stick with them...offers that are based on the concepts of reality I mentioned. Don't go for primary custody of an infant because she likes someone else--the judge won't care and you'll look petty. Don't offer no CS and no alimony (if that's applicable) because again you look like the unreasonable party. And if you can demonstrate that you made numerous attempts with reasonable offers and she kept turning them down...the judge will see that you are the reasonable party, and she is the unreasonable one. The judges do TONS of these divorces--they know who's being realistic and who's just mucking things up...be the realistic one. 

At some point, your judge will look at your offers and her counter-offers (or just outright refusals) and essentially tell her and her lawyer, "Listen, either accept this or I'm ordering something you won't like very much" and by then the judge will be pissed enough to just go back to something MUCH less than what she's asking for. Again, I'd recommend going to a CS Calculator for your state (Child Support Calculators ), putting in real numbers, and having your offers be as close to that as possible. Make a list of your assets and split that 50/50...or if not, explain why X or Y would be considered to be in your pile or her pile. Same for debts.


----------



## Rus47

Affaircare said:


> Reality is that you'll probably sell the home and split the equity, you'll probably both move to your own places, you'll probably have the kid an equal amount of time (1 week with you, 1 with her) or you'll have 50/50 "legal custody" and you'll end up with the kid more because she wants to "have a social life."


I surely hope for OP's sake that your reality becomes his reality. I have thankfully never been pulled through the divorce knothole, but have plenty of friends and relatives who have been. In different states. And none of those men ended up with that reality. To a man they got scrued. Their cheating wives got all of the fun with their APs while the BH paid all of the price. Fair has nothing to do with it. Just follow the money.

Neither did a lot of men on this site. Only one who ended up as you describe that I can recall is @VintageRetro. How he managed to pull it off was IMO God looking out for him and OBS financing his attorney. Just read @Vaughan's story as example. Seven figures down the drain and his XW's uncle living in his house for a year rent free. Oh and throw in a fake DV charge into the mix. Nothing but H3ll and the lawyers racking up the billable hours. The longer it takes the better they like it.


----------



## Honey Badger

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> Not sure if what I did was correct, but heres my story.
> 
> I found some text messages about 4 years ago, between my wife and AP, I discovered these messages a couple months before my son was born. It was probably dumb looking back on it, but I held it inside for over a year, as the information slowly ate away at me. I did this because she was in the last trimested carrying my son, and then she had post-partum depression. During this time I put myself into counseling because I couldn't hande it on my own. I eventually confronted her about a year after it occured, where she proceeded to deny it, then she was like AP kissed me. I was pissed, but I was like I have a one year old, so I ignored it. Went to counseling, because I am supposed to believe my wife right? All the while my gut and intutition was telling me I'm wrong
> 
> Fast forward a few years later, we moved cities, and she is being distant. I chalk it up to the move and stresses of a new job etc. I wind up paying for a hotel for the weekend to send her out of town, because that is what she really wanted. A week after I booked the hotel, she was like oh hey, It's going to be a girls trip. I'm like cool.
> 
> Then I see a photo of the wife and another guy. So I confront her about it, and she says oh one of my gfs invited co-workers to come, and one of the other girls brought her husband. Wife didn't tell me it turned co-ed. That it turns out AP2, took a shower in the room that I bought her, and then my wife confesses that AP2 slept in her hotel room one night on the couch. She says "nothing happened" he's like my "little brother" We are just "friends"
> 
> This triggered all sorts of I guess PTSD about AP1, because they were "just friends" about a month ago, I confront her again about AP1, she says nothing happened. Gut still didn't buy it. Confronted her again 4 days later she says "oh he fingered me in the car one time" Fast forward to this week, I'm like I just don't buy that nothing further happened. No one goes to 3rd base and stops unless you are a teenager and don't really know what you are doing. I ask her what happened, then she proceeds to tell me, she gave him oral, and a HJ in the car, and he was ontop of her, but no penetration occured. (Yeah right). So then the day after this confrontation, I get an e-mail from her, yeah I did have sex with him, the stuff in the car happened after. I'm so sorry.
> 
> I'm not stupid, and just because you admitted to AP1's stuff four years ago, doesn't account for your denial on whats going on with AP2 whether it's emotional or physical (I think it's both) I mean why else hide who you are having stay in your hotel room.
> 
> Anyway I have a kid with her, and the thought of breaking up my family kills me. But the thought of me staying with someone who straight up lied to my face multiple times over the past 5 years, makes me want to vomit. Not too mention she's doing the same crap now.
> 
> I asked her to take a lie detector test after I found out about the fingering, and she wound up booking it, and then backing out on advice of her "counselor" the real reason she backed out was because she couldn't pass the test. But the reason she told me she didn't take it was "it is inaccurate, and it's all in how the questions are asked" Nah, it's because you didn't want to tell the truth.
> 
> I should also mention that the whole reason she didn't tell me, was because she "repressed it" because she said that she was sexually assault/molested when she was 9 and if she didn't say what happened out loud, then it didn't happen. Cool, I guess I can try that in court sometime. Yes Mr. Mrs. Judge, since I didn't say it out loud, then I wasn't going 20mph over the speed limit. Shouldn't the sexual assault/molestation be something that you tell your spouse about before you get married? Like that's a pretty big thing to know.
> 
> She says she still loves me, and wants to "try" I'm like why, so you can live in a nice house, and I can send you on a vacation you desperately said you needed to relax, so you can go and have a guy who you work with spend a night in your hotel room when "nothing happened"
> 
> She went to counseling the other day, and came home in one of the best moods I've seen her in, in a long time. I'm like must be nice getting rid of all that guilt, and hiding stuff from me for the past 5 years, while I"m over here trying to hold myself together. I don't feel like she has ever really had remorse, she has said sorry, but there doesn't seem to be much meaning behind it.
> 
> At the end of the day we didn't have very good communication, and that is part my responsability as well.
> 
> I asked her, why she finally decided to tel lme after all these years. She said she finally admitted because it was "Time for me to know, so that I could stop my tailspin"
> 
> She also keeps to the story that nothing physical happened with AP2, and that ever since she did the stuff with AP1 " I have honestly tried my best to be the wife you deserve " by what, having AP2? and at least an EA? if not a PA?
> 
> So a couple updates since then. One, I went on a trip, and I caught her looking at houses for a friend on the street next to AP2. Then this past week she was at a business conference, and I asked who was going, she never metnioned AP2. Come to find out AP2 was there, but she says she didn't interact with him blah blah blah, but her timeline shows an 8 hour gap where it looks like location services was turned off.
> 
> We had conversations, we went to counseling. We got kicked out, because she wouldn't admit she slept with the guy in the hotel, and refused to take a lie detector test. She refuses to get a new job, and refuses to stop being friends with guy number #2. She said that "she doesnt want to give up her social life" I told her if she doesn't want to give up a guy she's known for 6 months who is just "a friend" for her husband and her kid, then we are done. I asked her so what is it. She said she didn't know. So I sent her divorce papers that I had been working on. Today is a tough day. Never thought I would be here.


She treated you like **** because she understood that you were not giving her any consequences or accountability for her actions, and now that you have finally stood up to her. She would be very shocked because she had not seen this behavior from you before. She was a liar and she is a cheater and she’s a manipulator and she’s very deceitful and dishonest. She doesn’t respect you at all, so why would you want to be with somebody who doesn’t respect you. Believe me, you will be in a world of pain if you stay with her. That’s from a woman’s point of view


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## Captainjacksparrow84

Honey Badger said:


> She treated you like **** because she understood that you were not giving her any consequences or accountability for her actions, and now that you have finally stood up to her. She would be very shocked because she had not seen this behavior from you before. She was a liar and she is a cheater and she’s a manipulator and she’s very deceitful and dishonest. She doesn’t respect you at all, so why would you want to be with somebody who doesn’t respect you. Believe me, you will be in a world of pain if you stay with her. That’s from a woman’s point of view


Yeah I have no intent on staying with her, or going back with her. Court keeps getting pushed. Now I'm into next year. At some point this will all be over.


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## Captainjacksparrow84

Affaircare said:


> @Captainjacksparrow84,
> 
> I'm not at all surprised that mediation failed. She very likely has "friends" or her own lawyer talking in her ear saying she "deserves" or should get the home, child support, and alimony...that you should move out and she gets to keep the kids and the lifestyle but essentially replace YOU with the boyfriend-accessory. You yourself said "She refuses to get a new job, and refuses to stop being friends with guy number #2" so you know that her mindset is essentially "I keep my life as is, move you out, move AP2 in."
> 
> Of course, that's not reality. Reality is that you'll probably sell the home and split the equity, you'll probably both move to your own places, you'll probably have the kid an equal amount of time (1 week with you, 1 with her) or you'll have 50/50 "legal custody" and you'll end up with the kid more because she wants to "have a social life."  Reality is that the judge will make a list of your assets and debts and split them fairly (she gets "hers", you get "yours" and you each get half of the joint "marital" assets and debts). Reality is that the judge will go to the Child Support Calculator for your state, plug in real numbers, and come out with who owes whom (if any). If she's a SAHM but has a degree, he'll take into consideration that she's employable but refuses to work, etc. Reality is that alimony is only given in certain circumstances, and this isn't a LONG marriage...it might be that she'd get a couple years worth "to help her get trained and back on her feet" (as an example, she may get some for 3 years to help her have some time to go to trade school and finish XYZ so she can get a license in her trade).
> 
> Check with your attorney, but I'd recommend just make reasonable, fair offers and stick with them...offers that are based on the concepts of reality I mentioned. Don't go for primary custody of an infant because she likes someone else--the judge won't care and you'll look petty. Don't offer no CS and no alimony (if that's applicable) because again you look like the unreasonable party. And if you can demonstrate that you made numerous attempts with reasonable offers and she kept turning them down...the judge will see that you are the reasonable party, and she is the unreasonable one. The judges do TONS of these divorces--they know who's being realistic and who's just mucking things up...be the realistic one.
> 
> At some point, your judge will look at your offers and her counter-offers (or just outright refusals) and essentially tell her and her lawyer, "Listen, either accept this or I'm ordering something you won't like very much" and by then the judge will be pissed enough to just go back to something MUCH less than what she's asking for. Again, I'd recommend going to a CS Calculator for your state (Child Support Calculators ), putting in real numbers, and having your offers be as close to that as possible. Make a list of your assets and split that 50/50...or if not, explain why X or Y would be considered to be in your pile or her pile. Same for debts.


She isn't a Stay at home mom. She makes good money, a little bit less than me but not by much. I did make a 50/50 offer. She wanted tie-breakers on medical and school, and was going to give extracurriculars and religion. The most important two are medical and school, and no judge will give both to one person, so I said no. I'll take it to the judge. At this point I don't even care anymore about going in front of the scary guy with robes. Like lets get this done and over with, I'm done playing her dumb games.


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## Openminded

Captainjacksparrow84 said:


> She isn't a Stay at home mom. She makes good money, a little bit less than me but not by much. I did make a 50/50 offer. She wanted tie-breakers on medical and school, and was going to give extracurriculars and religion. The most important two are medical and school, and no judge will give both to one person, so I said no. I'll take it to the judge. At this point I don't even care anymore about going in front of the scary guy with robes. Like lets get this done and over with, I'm done playing her dumb games.


Good idea. My grandchildren’s other parent fought for the same (and was given the tie breaker on school). I had no idea at the time what a total nightmare that was going to turn out to be. Everything turned into a battle. Thankfully, they’re young adults now and beyond the control of an uncooperative parent but it was a rough decade. Now they very rarely choose to see their other parent because of what they were put through unnecessarily in those years. My child went back before the same judge a few times over that decade, thanks to actions of the uncooperative parent, and had a positive experience each time. I hope you’ll have the same (without all those extra trips).


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