# Straight to 'divorce', or worth trying 'separation'?



## delupt (Dec 1, 2014)

Hi, 

Having spent a long time reacquainting myself with TAM and reading thru many threads, I notice many people heading for divorce do the 'separation' thing first (when one partner moves out). People even challenge those that go straight to serving papers without even a trial separation. 

For me, I do not see how a separation would work. With us, there have been no affairs (that I know about!), just an inability to find a working relationship. We've been struggling for well over a decade and 14 months of counselling has done nothing. I cannot see how living apart would help, so I'm finally pulling the trigger (after xmas).

Divorce takes 4-6 months and for this time we'll be sleeping in the same bed and looking after our kids' logistics (young teens). Sure, awkward, but this is how it has always been so no change in the day-to-day relationship.


How many skipped the separation and went straight to divorce? 
Do people try separation as a last-ditch attempt to save it? 
Do people feel obliged to try separation first?
I didn't want to get divorced before trying counselling, but I see nothing coming from separation apart from warming the kids up to the reality.



_P.S. I'm technically 'new here' (see pathetic post count!), but I spent 18 months on here getting fine advice back in 2012/3 while trying to fix the relationship. I just deleted my old stuff as part of a (failed) reconciliation - so technically I'm more an alumni than a noob, just sayin'._


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## Faithful123 (Oct 29, 2014)

I think it really depends on the type of separation, if you both agree to a separation agreement and agree to go away and work on yourselves and have an therapist manage it then it can work. Type of a healing separation or a constructive separation. Anything but this will just be a prelude to divorce and statistics show that around 80% of all separations end in divorce. I'm in the 80%. 

Sounds like you both need professional help and a healing separation may assist, the alternative is pretty dire. You've invested a great deal of time into your marriage what another few months of trying going to hurt. Make sure you find a good therapist.

Good Luck.


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## Mr.Fisty (Nov 4, 2014)

How is your communication skills? Usually that is the first casulty of most relationship. It is the lack of understanding, and the ability to express one's thoughts and emotions to another person, thus lack of intimacy.

When communicating frustration and anger, it is best to disengage until you gather your faculties, unless you can state it in a calm manner. Don't attack the person, as it will lead to defensiveness or counter attacks, and nothing is transferred, and the information goes nowhere. State things from your pov, and state it as ,"I feel as if......" Remember you own your emotions and issues.


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## toonaive (Dec 13, 2012)

From my experience, a failed reconciliation = divorce. why postpone divorce unless your state has a waiting period.


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## EleGirl (Dec 3, 2011)

It's very hard to fix a marriage when the couple is separated. 

It's like saying you are going to make repairs to your house. But then you go repair some other house instead of your own. Your house never gets fixed.

Most separations end in divorce because of this. Out of sight, out of mind.

The only kind of separation that really works are structured separations supervised by a counselor. These have rules and goals laid out. They are often used when things like drugs/alcohol addiction, abuse, etc are the issues.

The rules are usually things like no dating others, the amount of time the couple will spend together a week, that both will go to counseling etc.


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## C3156 (Jun 13, 2012)

delupt said:


> How many skipped the separation and went straight to divorce?
> Do people try separation as a last-ditch attempt to save it?
> Do people feel obliged to try separation first?
> I didn't want to get divorced before trying counselling, but I see nothing coming from separation apart from warming the kids up to the reality.



I was in the catagory of divorce without a real separation, but not by choice. My ex was done with our relationship, would not consider counseling, and the one year separation was just a waiting period. There was no changing her mind. We slept in the same bed and worked to break it to our kids until she could move out. 

At least you all have given it your best shot. As others have noted, most separations end in divorce anyway. Difficult to mend something when you are not around to work together.


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## ghwk152 (Jan 24, 2011)

delupt said:


> Hi,
> 
> Having spent a long time reacquainting myself with TAM and reading thru many threads, I notice many people heading for divorce do the 'separation' thing first (when one partner moves out). People even challenge those that go straight to serving papers without even a trial separation.
> 
> ...


I am exactly in your boat after 20 years of marriage and multiple attempts at MC that never really were helpful enough for us to turn the corner. Kids 15 and 11. I am waiting until May hoping for a miracle but more to initiate things so they don't have to deal with separation and school at the same time. Like you we have also been struggling for over a decade. I don't think separation will do anything useful in our case.


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## laser-monkey (Sep 7, 2012)

I chose the separation route. Not as an attempt to fix the marriage, but as a way of showing that I was serious about things not working. She is still seeking reconciliation but I've told her I don't want that. We'll sort out the practical stuff which, I suppose, will eventually include a divorce. I hadn't really thought about that - just needed to take one step at a time or I'd have been stuck in a controlling relationship forever.

I certainly wouldn't see separation as a way of working on the marriage. It's the complete opposite.


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

It does depend on the jurisdiction. Some force a 1 yr separation if there are no statutory grounds. My state is like that. 

In our case we tried MC, ex refused to go back. When he moved out he left the state and never made any effort to R, never even raised the possibility. Once he was gone he considered himself free and acted accordingly.


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## delupt (Dec 1, 2014)

Some good clarifying points being made above. Consensus seems to be that separation is a last-option long-shot with little chance of success.

Our MC mentioned 'considering separation' a few times in the last 2 sessions. I pressed her for a definition and whether she just meant divorce, but she remained vague (deliberately I guess as it has to be our decision). 

Wise words from Mr. Fisty, communication is poor and any discussion ends in my wife taking offence and escalating. Keep conversations short and to the point with no emotion for the foreseeable. 

There has to be a concerted effort by both parties (probably helped by a councillor) to make a separation into a fixer. No good for us I fear, and I doubt my wife would be willing to move out as it would not fit her good-girl-victim narrative.


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## delupt (Dec 1, 2014)

Pluto2 said:


> It does depend on the jurisdiction. Some force a 1 yr separation if there are no statutory grounds. My state is like that.


I'm in Western Europe so a 'fault-free' divorce is readily available within 6-9 months so long as I give her my current and future assets like a good white knight. Meh. I'm just dreading the (almost inevitable) parental alienation I expect to kick-in. But that may have to be another thread ...


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## Pluto2 (Aug 17, 2011)

Track down EnjoliWoman. She's an expert on surviving parental alienation.

I would add, that even with counseling, no R can work if both parties aren't dedicated. On TAM, I've seen some separations help when the couple had a cycle of arguing. The separation ended the cycle and counseling helped. But I fear that may be the exception.


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

In Ontario, you can't get a divorce unless you've been separated for 1 year. If during that time you and your estranged spouse decide you want to give it another shot, you can go for it. 

It's really depends on the situation. Sometimes things get really bad, you separate, and next thing you know the person reaches out to you, nostalgia kicks in, and you get those fuzzy feelings again. Often, those feelings go away when the person simply goes back to their old bad habits as soon as you have agreed to give it another go. This happened a number of times during my marriage, so when I had finally had enough, I realized the temporary separation wouldn't be enough.

Most people don't change over night. It takes a long time. Separation gives people the opportunity to at least attempt to change, but the changes may only be temporary for another round of "bait and switch".

Other people separate, get back together, and then have to deal with all of the crap their estranged spouse did once they were separated from you. I have often heard guys complain that they found out after they reconciled that while they were separated she banged mutual friends, gave better sex to other men, offered things to new men that she never gave to you, etc. Then the guy is expected to accept it all because "they were separated". I've heard the same thing from women, finding out that while they were separated he banged her sister, or slept with prostitutes, etc. I don't think any of that makes the possibility of reconciliation easier.

For me, the 180 was the best thing to help me cope during the breakdown of my marriage. Once I finally cut the cancer from my life, I was able to focus on my well being. The 180 is a very strong form of separation, and involves no contact with the other person. For me, it was just a formality, a "waiting game", until the year was up and we could legally divorce. I knew what she was up to during our separation, which killed any chance of possible R.


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## GotLifeBack (Sep 12, 2013)

If things are at this stage, reconciliation is pretty much a long shot. More often than people decide for R with reasons such as "stay together for the kids" or "I'll never find anyone else and I don't want to be alone".

I'll second what tulsy said and advocate the 180. I didn't stick to it strictly for a long time, despite all of the great advice I was given. 

Once I decided that actually I didn't want to R, I'd had enough, I could stick to it pretty easily. That is once I'd found a little self-esteem and realised I deserved and could achieve much better.

Not reconciling with my wife was one of the best decisions I've made.

Every case is different, though.


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## shellgames (Sep 2, 2014)

The second "dday" should be divorce not discovery


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## Abbey N (Aug 1, 2014)

Tulsy...Im assuming you are from ontario... when you separated from your spouse, where you still living in the same home or did you find separate living arrangements. I too am in the process of the one year wiating period.


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## tulsy (Nov 30, 2012)

Abbey N said:


> Tulsy...Im assuming you are from ontario... when you separated from your spouse, where you still living in the same home or did you find separate living arrangements. I too am in the process of the one year wiating period.


Ontario, yes...GTA. We were not living together while separated, but if there was a chance she would claim abandonment, I would have moved into the basement with a VAR in my pocket.

I knew she was going away with her mother for the weekend, so while she was gone I cleaned the whole house, fixed any loose ends and setup a real-estate agent to arrive the day she returned. Upon her arrival I confronted and exposed her and notified her the agent would be there in an hour. The house sold in 4 days and I quickly secured an apartment close to work. 

You have to be careful about "abandonment" claims, but I was fortunate enough to quickly pen a mutually beneficial separation agreement for my ex and myself. All email, and no contact.

Before the year was up, we both had new homes of our own. In many ways, I was "lucky", but it's only because I took charge of the situation. She would have loved to continue, leaving the door open to our relationship, but I wasn't having any of that. Plus, I monitored from a distance during our separation, and her behavior pretty much solidified things.


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