# HELP! I'm losing my wife, possibly to another



## Norm (Jan 21, 2010)

I posted this in the Infidelity section, but wanted to ensure I receive lot's of thoughts and input to help me out. 

I’ll apologize now for the length of my marriage crisis. I’m hoping anyone might be able to give advice and recommendations and basically (hopefully) tell me that I’m not crazy. 

My wife and I have been together since August 2003 and this coming June will be our 6 year anniversary. She’s had two very short marriages in the past, the longest being no more than 2 years and I had been previously married for 10 years.

Our current state began (or I was told of her thoughts) in early November 2009. We had just purchased our first home and her parents came to visit for a week. Her birthday was during that time and I thought we were going to each get a small tattoo once her parents left after her birthday. Apparently I didn’t recall the conversation very well because she said that we agreed that we weren’t going to get tattoos. I made a huge mistake and didn’t even get her a birthday card. It was wrong, I know and I regret not doing so. She tells me she’s over that failure. However, after her parents left, she told me that she had looked back at our relationship and doesn’t know what the future holds for us. 

Many people ask(ed) us if we were newlyweds because of the way we acted together. We always liked hearing that and it’s true – we’re silly, playful, holding hands, wrapping our arms around each other – everything that young lovers would do. Until around her birthday.

I have never been great at communicating, especially during arguments and disagreements. I’d rather “fix” the situation and move instead of wasting time hurting each other. After reading many marital communication books and articles, I now understand that I was wrong for basically shutting down during our heated discussions. 

As she told me about the uncertainty of our future, I knew she was going to the West Coast in early December to visit her brother. She had also mentioned, almost in passing, that she was going to visit her “high school girlfriend” who was now living in Colorado. They had apparently caught up through Facebook, which my wife first logged into in September 2009.

We slowly became increasingly distant as she spent many hours on her computer and it seemed like we both were walking on egg-shells. After being told we might not be together by the end of the coming year, I was afraid of doing or saying something that might push her further away. As her trip approached, she clarified that she thought a separation was needed so she could think things through. 

I only heard from her on a few occasions during her trip. She returned and nothing seemed to have changed and she told me very little about her time in Colorado. Anything I learned was a result of me asking her several times only to receive one sentence answers. She returned on a Monday and on that Friday as we were eating out she asked me what I thought of her going back to Colorado because her girlfriend and new friends asked her to come back for a New Year’s party. I was furious and couldn’t believe it. She wasn’t really asking, she was telling me that she was going and I wasn’t invited. I told her that I didn’t think it was a good decision and I was afraid of the unknown of Colorado. Being in the Navy and stationed on a ship, I offered to stay onboard so she could figure things out here at home. She said that she wanted to be able to escape our house where I apparently was creating an unpleasant atmosphere. She wanted to have fun and to think about “us” without being here with me around and all of the reminders of our life together in the house. She also tells me that it’s the holidays and she knows how I hate being onboard the ship, so I should be home. My response was what home will I be in if she’s not here with me? She just doesn’t get it.
I’d say that we grew even further apart after telling me she was going back a second time. That night she spent at least 2+ hours on the phone with someone (she said it was her girlfriend) and has spent increasing time late at night on her computer. We talked further and she told me that a separation is indeed coming. She also told me that I’ve not been fulfilling her sexual desires; Something that I didn’t even know about and now can’t do anything about because she’s “not sexually attracted to me” anymore.

Our sex life has been a rollercoaster. Shortly after getting married, she “felt she wasn’t beautiful” and didn’t want to have sex – an issue that lasted almost 2 years. I was rejected many times during this period and it was extremely hurtful. Apart from this, there were active days and non-active weeks. She’s disturbed because I had never really initiated any activity. I explained that I was hurt from being rejected so many times in the past and that I am extremely attracted to her. She failed to accept my reasoning. She told me that she was no longer sexually attracted to me and that she loved me but wasn’t in love with me. She also revealed that she had thought of having an affair for the past year; but that she did not act on it. I was devastated! 

I slowly realized that she was now keeping her cell phone within reach and she was more secretive about being on the computer, turning slightly if I approached to talk to her, closing the screen, etc. I used to kiss her goodnight every night and good morning every morning. I’ve slept in the guest bedroom since Dec 27, the night before she left for CO again. I receive no sign of emotion from her and it’s so hard for me to NOT try to hug her, hold her hand, kiss her. 

I consider the Christmas gifts I received from her to be last minute fillers so she could say she got me something. She was out of the house one day before leaving for her 2nd trip to Colorado and I was placing a card to wish her happy New Year in her luggage. I found a sex card game in her luggage and I was heartbroken. When I mentioned it to her, she said it was a gag gift for her girlfriend and accused me of snooping through her things. I then pieced something else together as I threw out some trash. She never puts the garbage in the garbage can. I always do it for her. Well on Christmas day she put something in the bin. As I threw a bag away I saw a small box that caught my interest. I quickly realized that it wasn’t from ebay because it had her shortened name, not full first name as the recipient. The sender’s info was ripped away. Light bulbs going on, I checked the bag that she threw out and found the sender. It was a guy who she was friends with on Facebook; A guy who commented on one of her pictures that she was super hot. I found the tracking number and discovered which city this guy is from - in Colorado. 

Now I’m actually shaking from fear, anger, and hurt. I asked her about him and she told me that he was her girlfriends brother. I tried looking up her girlfriend and couldn’t find anyone by that name under her high school (all girls school in Hawaii). Basic online search of this guy shows that he’s never lived outside Colorado. She told me that he sent a shirt that my wife bought and forgot there when she came home. Funny thing is that the tracking number indicated that the box was sent the night that she told me she was returning for the New Year’s party. 

After telling her about going through her friends list on Facebook, she made it so only her friends can see her Facebook page. She’s yet to make me a friend on Facebook! I explain how hurtful it is and WRONG that another man is in contact with a wife and can say things like she’s “super hot” and sends her something in the mail. I asked why he sent the supposed shirt instead of her friend and she didn’t know; she said that I send things for her all the time (ebay). She even got upset because I changed passwords on my computer (she could see EVERYTHING of mine) and she accused me of hiding something. I asked if I could see her emails and facebook page and she got defensive. Recently I asked if she wanted to be friends on Facebook and she said that I might see things that her “friends” say and take their comments out of context and she didn’t know what I would do about it (i.e respond directly to them). Again….in what world is it appropriate that somebody sends things that COULD be taken out of context to a married woman? She said a close (married) friend of both of us has written things to her that were sexually innuendo. She doesn’t understand that to me it’s different, we both know him and his wife and I trust him. I don’t know any of the these other guys (however many there are). 

During her second trip, I only heard from her via text messages. I sent her a New Years text at midnight in Colorado and received one back some 36 hours later. I more or less made a last ditch effort, upon her return from that trip by placing her favorite flowers all around her bathroom, kitchen and bedroom. I showed up at the airport with roses and the first thing I heard was, “What are you DOING?” It went downhill from there. 

She tells me that she’s not having an emotional affair and that she was only with the guy I’ve asked about when she was with her girlfriend. I want to believe her, but I just don’t. 

I’ve suggested that we go to counseling and she refuses. She tells me that I should go for myself if I feel that I need it. She indicated that I would be hurt if we were to be with someone and if she was to say that she was in love with someone else. But yet she says there’s no one else. 

We were supposed to go to Disney this month, but after making those reservations she decided to have the cosmetic surgery that she has wanted for years. She planned out the surgery months ago and she’s now recovering. Of course, I adjusted my vacation time to take care of her. Right before the surgery she told me that she’s going back to Colorado in late March for 2 weeks so she can see if she wants to move there instead of trying to stay in our current state of residence. I want to tell her that if she decide to go again (third time in months) that I don’t want her to come back. It’s so unfair that she’s just running away from US and all that we have. Days later, she also told me that she’s planning on separating and moving to CO for a few months. She’s taking many of her things and I told her that I know she’s not coming back. Her response is that she just doesn’t know. Again, she wants time to think and see if she can make it. I feel as if she’s really saying she wants to see if she can make it FINANCIALLY and possibly make it with “that guy”. Meaning (to me) that I would be financial stability for her if she could tolerate me. 

I visited her in the evening after her surgery and I kissed her head and told her that I love her. She told me that she loved me too – the first time in months. But later she more or less blew it off when I told her about it. I joked that it must’ve been the drugs talking instead of her actual heart – I got no response.

She wasn’t home 5 hours after her surgery and she got on her computer and I peeked over and saw she was chatting with the guy I questioned her about. I saw that he had sent her emails also. We had gone to a car show and she took pics of old cars and texted them to “somebody”. I suspect it was him because I discovered through Google that he’s a mechanic of some sort. I also just discovered that her phone is not only within easy reach for her, but it now has a password so I wouldn’t be able to see text messages or call history if I could get to it. She received a text the day after her surgery and I could barely see that it was ANOTHER guy sending her something from/to Facebook and it was sent to her cellphone. That is just not right and she’s fails to see my point of view. She would go crazy if I was acting like she is right now. In fact, later that day she made reservations for a rental car/van. I’m trying not to talk about our situation so she can heal from her surgery, but I pointed out that its hard for me to be next to her and taking care of her when I suspect she’s making plans to leave me. She insisted that she was looking at rental cars but didn’t explain why. I should’ve pressed her, but again she needs to recuperate from the surgery and without her giving me direct answers I can only assume that "somebody" will be travelling to our state of residence to follow her in another car back to CO. And she doesn’t want to talk about anything because of the surgery, getting ready to depart on her second trip, returning from her second trip, blah, blah, blah. 

She said that she might as well have an affair because I already think she’s having one. I often feel as if she twists things and words to make me feel guilty – which works incredibly well. She doesn’t understand why I’m not sleeping well at night and am now getting by on an average of 4 – 5 hours of sleep a night. She has told me that when I come home from work, she feels trapped in her bedroom where she can be her normal cheerful self. I explained that I’m still thrilled to come home to her until she fails to come out of her room to see me. That’s when I start feeling depressed and get upset. 

She’s told me that I’ve never hurt her or made her feel unappreciated. She mentioned that she’d like to take how I am and put it into the body of someone with more muscles and who is a bit better looking, like the type of guys she “used to date” she said. I explained that I could work out and try to change some of my physical appearances, but that with me she knows my heart is always true and belongs to her. She’d never have to worry about me being tempted and she asked how I could possibly know that. I told her that I unconditionally and willingly gave my heart to her and that while there may be attractive women out there, other women don’t have what she has inside. I thought I had suddenly gotten through to her as she placed her hand on my shoulder, but it was very short lived. She tells me that she questions what she thinks she wants to do every day. She’ll find something and wonder why she’s considering leaving and then something will happen between us and she’ll go back. For example, we went to dinner recently and didn’t have ANYTHING to say to each other. I just don’t know what to say, when I know she’s thinking of leaving and when she seems to be somewhere else while sitting there with me. It was the first time we had nothing to say and it was extremely uncomfortable. 

She tells me to just act normal around her even with all the stress I’m going through with HER deciding our future. I tried to explain that me being myself is being playful, loving, attentive to her; not isolated, alone, with love and emotions being unreciprocated. 

I love my wife dearly and can’t believe that she gets mad and frustrated that I’m fighting to keep her and save our marriage. I told her that if I didn’t care for her or for us then I could just let things happen around me and us. But I do care and want us to be happy together. In December I told her that if she WANTS to go and doesn’t love me anymore, then I have to accept it and let her go. She then said that she just wasn’t sure about what she wanted. I translated this to mean that she was reconsidering a separation. She was also surprised that I picked up a book from the library and began making separation agreements and financial worksheets for legal use. I told her that I didn’t want to hold her back if she’s so anxious to leave me. Again, she said she needs to think things through to make sure she’s making the right decision. It’s so confusing. A few days later she clarified that she never said anything about “reconsideration”. She even asked what I would do if she called me after a few months to say that she wanted to come back. I told her that I would want her to come back, but I don’t know if I could. Would I be able to trust her, would she go to counseling (alone or with me) as I had suggested before, would she change her internet usage (i.e. Facebook), etc. I said that it would take a lot of hard work from both of us and I wasn’t sure she’d want to actually put forth the effort. 

She’s told me that it feels like her only "friends" are in CO now. I said that I can only imagine what they say about me and they supposedly tell her that it's clear that I love her and that I'm hurting. But if that’s true, why doesn’t my wife do anything to make our situation better? It’s so frustrating and confusing!! 

I’m sure that there are details that I’ve forgotten so if any of you should need more info to give an honest answer, please ask me for more clarification, etc. Please give me some insight on what I should do and what your thoughts may be. Do I give her an ultimatum? If she chooses to go back to Colorado for 2 weeks, make it for good? If she moves there shortly after her next visit, is it for good (on my terms)? Am I crazy for thinking she’s having at least an emotional affair? The only two friends that I’ve been able to talk to about this has told me to end the marriage. I just don’t have the heart to do it. I’ve thought about hiring a private detective, but again I can’t find it in me to do so and what would I gain from it? A 6 month separation is required in the state we live in before a divorce will be granted. I’ve called for the lawyer referral service offered by the state but I just couldn’t ask and pay for the referral yet.


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## jessi (Feb 11, 2009)

Hi there
so sorry you are going through all this, but I think your wife is involved with someone else....sorry.....she is doing so many things to question and without any reguard for you.
if she wasn't why wouldn't she be open with her facebook and phone. she is for sure hiding something.....don't waste your $$ on a detective......
She is already gone, I at this point would make sure I look after myself, financially and anything to do with your assets......
Tell her you love her and the door is open for her to fix your marriage but tell her you are not interested in continuing this separate living arrangement she seems to be okay with.....set her free to go to CO and if she goes, she goes. Maybe she will re-think about what she is doing if she thinks you are not just sitting around waiting for her. work on being the best you you can be....
good luck


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## scarletblue (May 20, 2009)

At the bare minimun she is having an emotional affair. I'm sure you already know that. It's pretty obvious. 

I sounds to me like she wants to go sew her wild oats and expects you to be OK with that. If she wants to go out and behave like she's not married, then she needs to not be married. It is not fair to keep you waiting in the wings for back up if it's doesn't work out for her.

I really don't know if there is anything you can do about it if she's not willing to admit to it. She is trying to justify her behavior by making you the bad guy. I also think it is rather selfish of her to use you during her recovery from the surgery while she is still planning on going to CO.

It sounds to me like she is so wrapped up in the excitement of whatever it is she's go going on, that she is not looking at the big picture of her marriage.

I also think that you are making it easier for her to do this by telling her that you'll take her back when she comes back. Now, it's like she has a free pass.

If she goes to CO to rethink that she wants, then you should do the same thing. Think about what you want and need in your marriage. If you two separate, then it is a time for BOTH of you to decide if you want to save your marriage. It is not time for just her. Take the time and work on you and what you need to do to move forward in your life.


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## bestplayer (Jan 23, 2010)

scarletblue said:


> At the bare minimun she is having an emotional affair. I'm sure you already know that. It's pretty obvious.
> 
> I sounds to me like she wants to go sew her wild oats and expects you to be OK with that. If she wants to go out and behave like she's not married, then she needs to not be married. It is not fair to keep you waiting in the wings for back up if it's doesn't work out for her.
> 
> ...


I 100% agree with scarletblue , 
i think this is situation where any affection or love u show to her would drive her away so stop that as it makes u look as needy & clingly . I think its time for u to do complete opposite of what u have been doing to save ur marriage . do try counslling it works .

good luck


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## Norm (Jan 21, 2010)

It's been a rough few days trying to deal with all of this. 

Not like it matters much, but reservations were apparently NOT made for a rental car. 

I asked her to reconsider her leaving for CO and she continues to say that she wants to empower herself. The said she's more or less in a rut right now because neither one of us is happy. The only reason I'm unhappy is because SHE'S going to leave. I've tried everything I can do (by myself) to bring us back together. 

She insists that she's not had an EA and "this guy" is her girlfriends half-brother. I asked her to not be friends with any men I don't know and I was asked what if "this guy" lived in a different state and she still went to CO. She doesn't understand that to me, it doesn't matter...it's still another man - NOT ME - who's talking to her. They MAY be friends, but everything she's doing tells me that they are more than that: not opening up her FB to me (to even read thru with her right there), emails, chat, phone/txt. . . 

I don't feel like I can take this much more. She CANNOT leave here until mid/late-March....what do I do?? I could stay on the ship, but this is also my house. I bring home the household income. I want to give her an ultimatum....if you go, don't expect to return, but I can't help but think that there's a chance (however slight at this point) that she MIGHT realize that we do have a good relationship, I don't mistreat her, abuse her, neglect her, I unquestionably love and care for her, I find her extremely beautiful and (used to) tell her all the time, we have a nice home, secure job, sound finances, and even though I have my shortcomings - I'm working on them and I'm NOT a bad guy. She even admits that I treat her very well. 

She is so focused on CO and whatever may be there that she fails to clearly see everything she has in her life right now and that we have it pretty damn good! I don't even know if I asked a question in this posting, I'm just worn out from all of this.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Go to marriagebuilders.com and print out the Love Buster and Emotional Needs questionnaires. Ask her to fill them out. Once you know how you Love Bust her, stop doing those things! (But ignore all the comments about 'needing my freedom,' etc. - that's just fogspeak for let me keep my affair. You do NOT have to listen to that crap. The first step in getting her to fall in love with you is to stop doing things she doesn't like, that make her LOSE love for you. No matter what good things you do for her, if you're still LBing her, it pokes holes in her love bucket, and all the good things just drain away out the holes - she's still unhappy with you.

Once you fix those bad habits, start meeting her top 5 Emotional Needs. YOU be the one she can have safe conversations with. YOU be the one who helps with domestic support or recreation or honesty...whatever her top 5 are. She has to start thinking happy thoughts when she thinks of you, in order to want to be with you.

If a man has a wife who criticizes him constantly, do you think he's going to want to come home from work, to that? Or is he going to find reasons to stay at work, or go out after work?

Be the person she can't wait to come home to.


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## Gwendoline (Jan 23, 2010)

Norm, I think i might be in your wife's position. I suspect being in the Navy you must be away from home alot? My husband is away from home alot also, and as a result I have found my own independence and my own life. For a number of different reasons I have started having an affair, and probably would exert the same behaviour as your wife is, should my husband have any suspicions about my fedelity. I am involved emotionally and physically to the point where i am contemplating leaving my husband. 
I can tell you now very simply; if your wife is unwilling to make you a friend on FB, show you her page, is making excuses for current posts etc; however trivial this might seem to some; I would be suspicious. I would be hesitant to make my H a friend on FB too as I don't like him knowing about my personal life; its a subconcious way of distancing him while I try and create a new life without him; i suspect your wife is doing the same. 
Keeping her phone within reach; I do the same thing at times because I receive messages from the OM that I don't want my H reading. 
Trips away, especially to the same place repeatedly and relatively recently to visit a supposed "new" friend; very suspicious. I disguise my OM visits as work trips. I am not proud of any of this behaviour, but it is where I am at for now and i can see similarities in your wife's actions. 
So add it all together, and in combination with what she is actually telling you; needing space, wanting to empower herself, etc; it screams wanting to be with "another man". She is kidding herself if she honestly believes her feelings are just about empowering herself; and she is definately kidding you. 
As I was recently told; when you are involved with someone outside of your marriage (as I suspect she is) any decision you make is from the fog of that affair. Every feeling is altered by the affair. This makes it hard for her to even think about working on her marriage as she is more likely finding ways to justify why she thinks the marriage isn't working (thats what I'm doing for sure).
I'm telling you now, sounds like if she could be certain the affair would end in a lasting relationship she would have left you by now. The only thing holding her back is her fear of the OM relationship not working out and possibly not wanting to hurt you in the process (you are obviously trying to make it work, this makes her feel guilty and she sometimes masks the guilt by accusing you of things or blowing your actions/behavious out of proportion). If you weren't as willing as you are to work on your marriage she would have left you by now, but the guilt and incertainty are keeping her around. 
She is having an affair of some description; and this is probably largely not your fault, its her finding something outside of the relationship and thinking it will be better and more exciting than what she's got at home (with you). If she is asking you if you would take her back in time if she left you, she is hedging her bets with this OM. Trust me, from what you have described you are like my husband and in alot of ways i am like your wife (again not a proud admition). I am 99% certain from what you have described that she is involved with another man (hurts I know, but you need to get your head together).
The best thing you can do is give her the space to make a decision. First let her know your feelings, tell her you love her but if there is someone else then you wont play second fiddle (don't accept excesses). She needs to decide what she wants, stop looking at you as a back up; either commit or leave. If you smother her, either with love and attention or with anger and suspicion, she will leave eventually. If you pressure her to stay she may make the wrong decision in the long run (for you both). 

Here is my advice in a nutshell: You can only control you, so think about exactally what you want and are willing to do, lay it out for her very clearly, then step back and give her some space. Don't accept her current excusses, behaviours and actions. You dont deserve it. Trust your gut on this one...
All the best, let me know how you go


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## Norm (Jan 21, 2010)

Gwendoline,

Oddly, I'm not gone hardly at all right now. I've been at my current location for almost a year now, but my previous duty station had me travelling quite a bit. I always wanted her to come with me but for one reason or another she only came on one trip. Not the point here, right now....

I HAVE smothered her, tried to make up for every wrong I've made, tried to ignore her, I've tried EVERYTHING that I can think of. Even when I ignore her I start feeling bad, feeling mad, hurt...it's a no-win situation. 

Am I wrong to keep trying? How do I just "let go" and allow her to leave? I want to tell her to make a decision....if you go we're done, but I'm afraid that it would then be ME ending our marriage. Is if fair that the space she may need is 1,000 miles away? I don't see how WE can work anything out if she's not here and she's elsewhere she she COULD POSSIBLY be influenced by others (friends or "friends") who may not have her or our best intrerests in mind. 

I want so badly to believe her when she says she hasn't even had an EA, especially when she tells me face to face. But there are so many indicators that she still fails to acknowledge and makes excuses for that it's hard to believe her. She mentioned that I should know she wouldn't put herself in a position to have an EA or PA, but I thought I knew her well enough to know she'd never do anything to make me suspicious either. 

Had minor argument today about our dogs. She wants me to keep two here and I wanted one. My thought is that she's the one leaving, why should it be "easier" for her by leaving another one here? Am I wrong in thinking that? I'm not trying to be an a$$...I just don't want to feel TOO walked over. I agreed to keep two and now she says no that she's afraid I wouldn't treat the second dog with the same love as the first. Time for Tylenol.....


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## bestplayer (Jan 23, 2010)

Gwendoline said:


> Norm, I think i might be in your wife's position. I suspect being in the Navy you must be away from home alot? My husband is away from home alot also, and as a result I have found my own independence and my own life. For a number of different reasons I have started having an affair, and probably would exert the same behaviour as your wife is, should my husband have any suspicions about my fedelity. I am involved emotionally and physically to the point where i am contemplating leaving my husband.
> I can tell you now very simply; if your wife is unwilling to make you a friend on FB, show you her page, is making excuses for current posts etc; however trivial this might seem to some; I would be suspicious. I would be hesitant to make my H a friend on FB too as I don't like him knowing about my personal life; its a subconcious way of distancing him while I try and create a new life without him; i suspect your wife is doing the same.
> Keeping her phone within reach; I do the same thing at times because I receive messages from the OM that I don't want my H reading.
> Trips away, especially to the same place repeatedly and relatively recently to visit a supposed "new" friend; very suspicious. I disguise my OM visits as work trips. I am not proud of any of this behaviour, but it is where I am at for now and i can see similarities in your wife's actions.
> ...


Gwendoline , I know its not ur thread but just curious that if u dont love ur husband why r u still with him ? is it because u aren't yet sure if the OM will commit ? It seems u r keeping ur husband just as a back-up in case it doesn't work out with ur OM . so how long u plan to treat ur husband as a doormat ?


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## 63Vino (Dec 23, 2009)

bestplayer said:


> so how long u plan to treat ur husband as a doormat ?


DUH... For as long as "HE" IS ONE.


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## Gwendoline (Jan 23, 2010)

Regarding your above message "best player" you are right, you should have stopped at "I know this is not your thread". I layed it out very emotionless for Norm; but things are always more complicated than you can write in a brief message; and just because I don't love my husband the way a wife should, doesn't mean i don't love him at all; so stick with helping Norm and quit trying to make me feel bad, because I already do. 

Norm, back to you. Unless you have posted things in your previous messages that are untrue, you gotta accept from a completely unbaised view point, it looks like she is investing emotions elsewhere. Quit being afraid that you will be the one to push her over the edge, she is gonna do that all by herself if you hang around waiting. If you aren't comfortable with her going to CO (which is completely reasonable btw) and she doesn't respect your feelings then you need to start thinking about doing whats right for you. Tell her what you want, then leave the ball in her court. Don't be scared to outline the results of her actions, because you are at the point where you can't lie to yourself anymore; somethings going on, she's moving out, your marriage isn't working despite your best efforts (because it takes two people to make it work). Maybe it is time to make some honest decisions. You are not the bad guy, you're the one being asked to wait while she trys out a new life without you...not acceptable; you know that. Now deal with it. I would suggest councelling; thats where I'm heading next. Even I have the scruples to get our marriage issues out in the open and discuss then honestly before calling it quits; I owe my husband that much...and your wife owes you at least that too...


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## bestplayer (Jan 23, 2010)

Gwendoline said:


> Regarding your above message "best player" you are right, you should have stopped at "I know this is not your thread". I layed it out very emotionless for Norm; but things are always more complicated than you can write in a brief message; and just because I don't love my husband the way a wife should, doesn't mean i don't love him at all; so stick with helping Norm and quit trying to make me feel bad, because I already do.
> 
> Norm, back to you. Unless you have posted things in your previous messages that are untrue, you gotta accept from a completely unbaised view point, it looks like she is investing emotions elsewhere. Quit being afraid that you will be the one to push her over the edge, she is gonna do that all by herself if you hang around waiting. If you aren't comfortable with her going to CO (which is completely reasonable btw) and she doesn't respect your feelings then you need to start thinking about doing whats right for you. Tell her what you want, then leave the ball in her court. Don't be scared to outline the results of her actions, because you are at the point where you can't lie to yourself anymore; somethings going on, she's moving out, your marriage isn't working despite your best efforts (because it takes two people to make it work). Maybe it is time to make some honest decisions. You are not the bad guy, you're the one being asked to wait while she trys out a new life without you...not acceptable; you know that. Now deal with it. I would suggest councelling; thats where I'm heading next. Even I have the scruples to get our marriage issues out in the open and discuss then honestly before calling it quits; I owe my husband that much...and your wife owes you at least that too...


Norm in this case as u r sure that there's someone else so she's is just keeping u waiting in case it doesn't work with this other guy . It seems u might have to make some hard descison for ur marriage.

Gwendoline , sorry If I was harsh & I didn't mean to make u feel bad because It is not possible. But honestly if u go to counseelling not to fix it but only to be able to say to ur partner that u tried , Its yet again a deciet.


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## Norm (Jan 21, 2010)

That's just it.....I'm NOT sure. Yes, there are several indicators and reasons to question what it happening, but I HAVE no proof that there is someone else. I AM positive that she had and EA and I've told her that I believe it happened, whether she realizes it or not. 

We've been married for just over 5 1/2 years and I'd like to think I know my wife and I've certainly trusted her throughout our marriage, so It's hard to think that she would lie/deceive me to my face...even though there are those glaring indicators and that painful feeling in my gut.


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## MEM2020 (Aug 23, 2009)

Right after marriage she shut you down sexually for almost 2 years for a totally lame made up excuse that she didn't feel beautiful. Sounds like she simply doesn't respect you. So she rejects you for 2 years and then complains you stopped asking for sex? What a giant head game. And now she is blatantly pursuing another man. WHY do you have so little self respect that you would allow all this? TONS of women will treat you better then this. 





Norm said:


> That's just it.....I'm NOT sure. Yes, there are several indicators and reasons to question what it happening, but I HAVE no proof that there is someone else. I AM positive that she had and EA and I've told her that I believe it happened, whether she realizes it or not.
> 
> We've been married for just over 5 1/2 years and I'd like to think I know my wife and I've certainly trusted her throughout our marriage, so It's hard to think that she would lie/deceive me to my face...even though there are those glaring indicators and that painful feeling in my gut.


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## cayest (Feb 4, 2010)

You don't have to catch her cheating in order for there to be a real problem. She may not even be cheating. But she doesn't respect you and she doesn't treat you the way you deserve to be treated (at least, based on your side of the story). Sounds like she wants to explore and keep you on the side fo convenience. Don't do it. At a minimum, she should be willing to go to counseling. If not, that is a sign she doesn't want to make things better. I know how painful this must be but the writing is truly on the wall. Godspeed!


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## Norm (Jan 21, 2010)

The dogs woke me up at around 2:30 this morning so I go downstairs and let them out. I'm heading back to my room (again, we're in separate rooms/beds) and I could swear I hear my wife talking. I pause and yes, she's talking. I knock on the door and I hear the distinct sound of her phone closing up and she "what" or "yeah" or whatever. I open the door and find her laying in bed and I ask if everything is okay. Yes, she says. Oh, I thought I heard you talking. She tells me no and I close the door. 

Knowing I heard her talk I wait a few minutes and hear her again. This time I knock and open the door up and ask her what's going on. "Nothing." Who are you talking to? "It's none of your business." 

None of my business.....I can't believe I controlled myself. I tell her that I think it probably is my business. "Just go back to bed," she tells me, "I don't want to argue about this right now." KEEP IN MIND -the other party is on the phone still!! 

I just close the door and I hear her saying that she's alright and goodbye. Unfortunately, I couldn't hear specifics. 

Go back to bed?? ...no, I'm now very much WIDE awake in so many ways.


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## turnera (Jan 22, 2010)

Cancel the phone contract.


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## doureallycare2 (Dec 10, 2012)

Norm,

I’m so sorry you’re going through this, as much as you want to believe that she is not seeing someone, you believe she is. When I shared my husband’s emails to the OW with him as proof to his denials of an affair, he said to me so you have been into "My Stuff' for a while. I actually hadn’t, he had left his email open one night and he never erased the sex chats. But when he said "my stuff" I knew more than anything it was over. He didn’t even consider that he shouldn’t have “stuff”. She should be able to show you and give you any password any access and vise a versa, lies do not belong in a marriage. I wouldn’t give her an ultimatum, but what you do need to do is get your backbone up, be ok with rejection and take some control back. If she can’t share everything she can’t share your life. You do not want to end up 20 years latter still wondering about the secrets. Tell her, "this has been all about you, so now I’m telling you what I expect, what I would like and if we can’t come to an agreement or go to counseling, then your right we do need a separation and perhaps more. If you insist on going to CO and doing this I will also be moving on with my life, I love you and will miss you but I will not miss the secrets or your disrespect." Then do just that, don’t text her, don’t call her and if she calls you don’t answer (your out). If she text you, give one word polite answers. Your busy, you’re having fun and you’re getting on with your life.


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