# Constant threats of divorce are growing old. Please help.



## ephie_anne

My husband throws out the threat of divorce literally every time we argue, which is about once every 4-6 weeks. He also tells me that he doesn't want me, can't stand to be around me, doesn't love me, etc. I recognize that he uses his words as a control tactic to put me "in my place," and I know that it constitutes textbook verbal/emotional abuse. This has been going on for years, but he never actually follows through with this threats. However, he manages to convince me each time he says it that _this time_ he really means it. I try to be strong, but it causes intense anxiety and worry...which is probably his intent. In moments of peace, he'll admit that he only says it to hurt me because he's so angry with me. 

Without fail, I fall into the pattern by always being the first to apologize and try to smooth things over. He'll continue to pout for another couple days, and then he'll grudgingly "give me one last chance." It's such a mind game, and it's grown terribly predictable. 

I don't know how to change the scenario. I know that I can't force him to recognize it as abuse, and I can't change his words or actions. I can only change my response...but HOW? I feel like pretending to encourage the notion of divorce and attempting to call his bluff makes me just as much of a game player as him, since I do not want to get divorced. If I pretend that I do, I'm just playing into it. 

It just happened again a couple days ago over a simple household chore issue, and once again, THIS TIME he means it. He's sleeping in the basement and refusing to talk to me (other than to yell when I try to talk to him). 

So, in an attempt to change the pattern, I've set up a consultation with a divorce lawyer next week. Even though I don't intend to file for divorce, I feel like I need to make a stand and learn more about my rights in case he truly means it this time. He knows about my appointment but claims that he doesn't care. 

I don't know what to do anymore. On the days when we're not arguing, I am content and happy in my marriage. It seems like he is as well. I can't help but think that if he really wanted to end it, he would've done it a long time ago. So if this is nothing more than a means of gaining control, how do I change the dynamic?

Many of you may encourage me to pack up and leave him, but I won't do that. Not only is it not a financial possibility, I refuse to put my children into the middle of this game and disrupt their stability. And, no, we don't argue in front of them, and I do understand the impact a dysfunctional marriage has on kids. I also understand the impact of divorce. I'm more than willing to seek counseling with him (again), but he refuses, claiming that the 2 counselors we briefly saw a few years ago didn't help us. 

So without actually walking out, what options do I have? I'm sure someone else out there has been through this, so I'm desperately seeking real, nonjudgmental advice. 

Thanks in advance.


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## Acorn

Next time he threatens divorce, say something like, "If you need to divorce to be happy, I'll accept that. But, you are using the threat of divorce to try to control me and it stops today. I will no longer be part of the conversation if we can't have a discussion without these threats."

Next time he does it, leave the room.

Next time he does it, leave the house.

Next time he does it, leave the house for longer, maybe even an overnight.

He'll get the picture. (Bonus points if you come back the next day and tell HIM you've decided to give him another chance.)


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## ephie_anne

Thanks for the quick reply, Acorn. Your advice makes sense and seems like something I could do without playing games.

What would you suggest I say or do right now? It's been two days, and he's still very angry and claiming that he's done with our marriage. I have made myself scarce around here (which is exactly what he wants, and makes me feel like his threats are earning positive reinforcement). I'll be out of the house this evening running errands with one of the kids, and I'll be at work the next two nights. 

Do I wait for him to approach me? Do I lay this statement on the line tonight and then just wait? 

It's this darn emotional turmoil of wondering what's the "right" thing to do that drives me nuts. Throw in the fact that he cheated a couple years ago, and my anxiety goes through the roof.

I understand the notion of needing time to cool off, but there have been instances in the past when his cooling off period has lasted weeks or even months...and I was still the one to smooth things over. 

It's such a fine line between standing my ground and feeding fuel to the fire. I feel like I'm stuck.


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## Jellybeans

ephie_anne said:


> Many of you may encourage me to pack up and leave him, but I won't do that.
> 
> So without actually walking out, what options do I have? I'm sure someone else out there has been through this, so I'm desperately seeking real, nonjudgmental advice.


You found my ex husband! 
No, but seriously. You did. This is exactly what he would do. Line for line, your post. Threaten divorce, tell me he didn't love me, ignore me, sleep in different rooms, refuse to speak, list goes on and on.

He's emotionally abusive. your husband. he doesn't see a problem with his behavio rand he never will unless he can admit he's in the wrong (unlikely to happen). It gets worse over time. 
Promise. 



ephie_anne said:


> Many of you may encourage me to pack up and leave him, but I won't do that.
> 
> So without actually walking out, what options do I have? I'm sure someone else out there has been through this, so I'm desperately seeking real, nonjudgmental advice.


Your other option is to tolerate it. Because the bottom line is, as long as he doesn't see anything worng with his behavior and has zero willingness to stop waht he's doing or empathize with you or commit to stopping what he's doing, thigns will stay the same.

The problem is his. He has already told you he won't do counselling so you can cross that off the list. You could go yourself, sure, but you going doesn't stop waht he's doing. Because he has a choice in the matter. And his choice is to constantly treat you poorly. And your choice is to stay.

I can only imagine what your children feel like in this type of environment. Sad. 

Sorry you are in this situation. It's not fun. Stop apologizing first. Talk to him about how you feel and tell him what you need. Ask what he needs from you. Either he works with you to fix it, or he doesn't.

And if he doesn't, then you can either go or continue living in an abusive relationship. 

That choice is yours.


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## Jellybeans

ephie_anne said:


> It's been two days, and he's still very angry and claiming that he's done with our marriage. I have made myself scarce around here (which is exactly what he wants, and makes me feel like his threats are earning positive reinforcement).
> 
> It's this darn emotional turmoil of wondering what's the "right" thing to do that drives me nuts. Throw in the fact that he cheated a couple years ago, and my anxiety goes through the roof.
> 
> *I understand the notion of needing time to cool off, but there have been instances in the past when his cooling off period has lasted weeks or even months...*and I was still the one to smooth things over.
> 
> It's such a fine line between standing my ground and feeding fuel to the fire. I feel like I'm stuck.


Yep. Definitely my ex husband. 

Check it: he doesn't love you. Because someone who treats you this way doesn't care about you or your feelings. So if you want, you could continue "to wait" for him to do something/say something/be something, ut the waiting game is SO very tiresome. You are letting him hold all the cards. Why? Don't you think you matter, too?

Ooh boy your thread is taking me down a deep black alley of memory lane.


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## ephie_anne

Jellybeans, thank you for your insight. I'm sorry you've gone through something similar, but it's encouraging to know that I'm not alone. 

I'll admit, in reading your posts, my first feeling was defensiveness. I started thinking I had portrayed the situation too negatively, and was momentarily offended when you said that he doesn't love me. But even while I had those feelings, the logical, intelligent part of me knew that my response to your advice was just like that of any other abused woman.

May I ask...what finally pushed you over the edge? Did your ex ever actually follow through with his threats? In what ways did his abuse worsen over time? 

I guess I'm still waiting for that "lightbulb" moment, where my heart catches up with my head. Could be that I'm in denial. Or maybe my generally optimistic personality is preventing me from seeing the facts. Or maybe I stick around because on some level I believe that it is possible to fix this. I don't know. Like I said, I feel stuck.


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## accept

I suppose once in 4/6 weeks one can live with that. If it always has to be you to smooth it over I dont think you can change that pattern. What you should do is at a time (the rest of the 4/6 weeks) when things are quiet to sit down and talk.


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## Jellybeans

I can understand you feeling defensive initially over my posts. Please understand it's not my goal to offend. Generally we want to protect those we love and sometimes, especially in abusive relationships, we don't want to admit the truth of what's going on because that truth hurts so bad. I can empathize with you 100%.



ephie_anne said:


> May I ask...what finally pushed you over the edge? Did your ex ever actually follow through with his threats? In what ways did his abuse worsen over time?


The last straw for me was when he did the silent treatment (again) for a month and a half. 

I moved out.

See, I'd been telling him for about a year by then that it needed to stop because it waws seriously messing with me and having a very adverse effect on our marriage. I'd been begging him to go to MC with me and pleading with him for a long time by then, crying in front of him, exhausting any and every opportunity I had to tell him how bad I felt in our relationship. He simply did not care and told me as much. (The silent treatment & stonewalling was his favorite thing to do). There were a lot of little things that snowballed into an avalanche. He would constantly threaten me with divorce and tell me he was going to find someone else to sleep with (he did) and was online looking for sex w/ other women. It goes worse over time--the things he did. First he'd ignore me a day or two, then weeks, then that last time. He would say cruel thigns to me, but then he would start saying it in front of relatives. His temper grew more and more erratic over time and the slightest thing would set him off. To the point he'd throw things and break things and then act like ntohing happened. 

It's emotionally exhausting. Like you, I thought things could change. So I hoped. But hoping and waiting doesn't "change" things. People do. 

These are character issues, when one is abusive. If he doesn't see his behavior as WRONG, you are facing a major uphill battle. 

I am sorry for your pain and have been there. It sucks.


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## This is me

My advice is seek a Marriage Counselor. Whether he joins you or not you should look to mend rather than end.

Before spending thousands on divorce you just spend hundreds on counseling to see if it can be healed.

The marriage is sick and like any illness you would go to a professional doctor to help heal it, not a lawyer.

We all bring childish ways into a marriage and don't let his empty threats become reality. Seek help before a lawyer!

My humble 2 cents.


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## Jellybeans

This is me said:


> My advice is seek a Marriage Counselor. Whether he joins you or not you should look to mend rather than end.
> .


There is no point in "marriage counselling" if one person does not want to attend/has no desire to.

Also, abusive relationships are the same as healthy/amenable relationships. 

Everyone would like to mend a broken relationship. It takes two though. And one person cannot do it alone.


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## Acorn

ephie_anne said:


> Thanks for the quick reply, Acorn. Your advice makes sense and seems like something I could do without playing games.
> 
> What would you suggest I say or do right now? It's been two days, and he's still very angry and claiming that he's done with our marriage. I have made myself scarce around here (which is exactly what he wants, and makes me feel like his threats are earning positive reinforcement). I'll be out of the house this evening running errands with one of the kids, and I'll be at work the next two nights.
> 
> It's this darn emotional turmoil of wondering what's the "right" thing to do that drives me nuts. Throw in the fact that he cheated a couple years ago, and my anxiety goes through the roof.


Ephie_anne, my advice is based on the idea that you won't leave no matter what, as you said in the initial post. So, for now I would just say that I'd ignore his huffing and puffing until he comes around. Then put up the boundaries and leaving the room if he does it again.

That being said, these are band-aid fixes. Jellybeans' stuff is spot on. You say you want that "light bulb" moment, but when you are experiencing abuse, your ability to see that light has been slowly worn down over time. We read your posts and see the cheating and the games and to us, the light bulb is as bright as the sun. 

So, I'd give her posts a second read. And consider that you probably won't ever get a light-bulb moment one way or another and decide if this is the life you want to live. Do what is right for you - life is too short.


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## ephie_anne

In regards to marriage counseling:

We saw one counselor a few times in the fall of '09. After our first visit, he informed us that our marriage was "doomed," which of course has been thrown in my face ever since. 

Ever determined, I convinced my husband to see a different counselor beginning March 2010. A week after we began seeing this counselor, I found the naked pictures of my husband's coworker on his computer. We continued to see the counselor until we had used up our allotted insurance dollars (about 3 months), but obviously all of our time was spent talking about the affair. We never even got to the other issues.

We also attended a Retrouvaille weekend in May of last year, but then I had a baby and we only made it to one of the follow-up meetings. 

It could very well be that counseling would never "work" for us anyhow, but I have a hard time discounting the idea when all 3 of our attempts have been fairly half-as*ed. I can't help but wonder if we'd make progress by just focusing on the way we argue and trying to "fix" that part. Because like I said in my original post, I think we actually get along fine the rest of the time. 

And, Acorn, thank you for your insight once again. You're right that I may never have that lightbulb moment, no matter how long I wait. 

Does it make me weak to think that when I said my vows "for better or worse," that maybe this just falls into the second category and I shouldn't give up? I can't tell if I'm committed or just stupid.


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## Acorn

ephie_anne said:


> Does it make me weak to think that when I said my vows "for better or worse," that maybe this just falls into the second category and I shouldn't give up? I can't tell if I'm committed or just stupid.


It makes you very loyal.

When I got to a point where I was stuck, my counselor asked me a question that I'll ask you. Let's work at this backwards. What would your husband have to do to have that "light bulb" moment where you could feel justified in leaving.

If it's abuse you, he's done that.

If it's cheat on you, he's done that.

If it's ignore you, he's done that.

So, it must be something else. What could it be? Because it certainly would not be healthy for you to say you'd stay no matter what he did.


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## ephie_anne

Here's my honest answer to your question, Acorn...

I would leave if he:
* cheated again
* harmed our children 
* became physically abusive
* made me cry or feel sad more days than not

I have forgiven many of his mistakes, but he has also forgiven mine. Or maybe he hasn't, and that's why he gets so angry. 

Anyhow, I have given the question some thought, as it has been posed to me by others in the past. I never would have thought I could forgive cheating, but then it became my reality. I learned that people in happy marriages don't cheat, and I was just as much to blame for the unhappy state of our marriage as he was. I do believe that he is remorseful and regrets what he did. 

I am not willing to stay "no matter what." I may be more tolerant (or more foolish) than many wives, but there are limits to how much I can take. Every time he throws out the threats and insults, I get a little closer to reaching my limit.


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## In_The_Wind

Hi EA when my spouse and I were going thru MC a couple of years ago, I acted somewhat similar to your Husband, I learned that when I would throw out the D card I was hurting her and affecting her security so I worked on stopping that and have not said it since, Through MC we learned how to argue and not yell or threaten or any of those things we truly dont mean except at the time of anger. I would mention to your H how this affects you and what you would like to happen in the future setting boundaries with others including spouses are important in my opinon. We have been married over 12 yrs and i am so glad that we were able to work thru this issue as i truly love my wife.

Good Luck


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## ephie_anne

Thanks, ITW. I have told him precisely how his threats make me feel, and when he's calm he'll acknowledge that he needs to stop doing it. He'll admit that he doesn't know how to stop, but he won't seek help or educate himself. 

He may throw out the threat as a way to shut me up and make me go away, but he does it with full knowledge of its effects on me and my feelings of security. 

I'd love to get some outside help to learn how argue effectively. I think he's under the impression that people in "good" marriages never argue, and therefore we must be doomed for failure because we don't agree on everything 100%.

Anyhow, thanks. It's good to hear a male perspective.


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## luckycardinal

Ephie Anne - your story sounds a lot like how mine has been over my 10 year marriage. My husband used to give me the "silent treatment" and freeze me out when I made him mad, even for the least little thing. He would CONSTANTLY threaten to divorce me or to leave. Of course, like the dutiful wife and person with low self-esteem that I was, I would beg forgiveness for my defectiveness as a person and all I did to make him mad and he would eventually favor me with speaking to me again. 

NO MORE!! He doesn't threaten divorce anymore because now if he did, I'd say "OK, there's the door - hit it, Jack!" I wish he would tell me he wanted a divorce as I'd say "I think that's an excellent idea and that you, me and the kids will all be happier. When will you be moving out?" I'm not saying you have low self-esteem like I did (still do, in many ways - you don't go through 10 years of abuse and not come out with some scars), but I'm saying your husband is mentally abusing you. 

I'd call his bluff next time he threatens and say "OK, when are you leaving?" If he doesn't really want a divorce, that will wake him up and let him know you're not playing his games anymore. If he does want a divorce, best to know now, right? I would also get into individual counseling to work on yourself. Believe me, I have little kids, too and I don't want to see them torn apart in a messy divorce. But, I'd sure rather see them happy and not growing up in a home where everyone's miserable. I wish you the best and hope your husband really does realize he is messing up his marriage.


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## ephie_anne

Lucky Cardinal--how or why did your husband finally stop with the threats and silent treatment? What made him see that it was not OK?

The first paragraph of your post sounds awfully similar to my life. Just last night, I asked for 10 minutes of his time to talk, and when my 10 minutes were over, he basically told me "time's up." At first I started to walk away, and then I realized it was total BS that he thinks he gets to determine if, when, and how long I am allowed to even speak to him. So I kept talking a little longer, just to assert a little control of my own.

He seems quite annoyed and bewildered by my lawyer appointment next week. He can't understand why I'd seek legal counsel if my ultimate goal is to heal our marriage. Maybe it's totally backward, but I'm thinking the more educated and prepared I am for the potential eventuality of divorce, the less effective his threats will be in controlling/scaring me into submission. I'm trying to set boundaries and show him that I really do intend to stick up for myself, and I think it's throwing him for a bit of a loop. 

As far as telling him to leave the home, it's not possible and he'd never do it. Even though he literally has 5 different households containing his family members (don't even get me started on that) literally within walking distance, he maintains that our home is HIS because his parents gave us the land upon which it's built. There have been a couple times he has run away and spent the night at a hotel, but it was never because I told him to leave. 

Aside from my own refusal to leave my children, I literally have nowhere that I could go, even for a night. My family is 5 hours away, and I don't have many close friends. 

Anyhow, thanks for your advice. It's incredibly helpful to hear from people who have lived like this.


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## Jellybeans

ephie_anne said:


> The first paragraph of your post sounds awfully similar to my life. *Just last night, I asked for 10 minutes of his time to talk, and when my 10 minutes were over, he basically told me "time's up."* At first I started to walk away, and then* I realized it was total BS that he thinks he gets to determine if, when, and how long I am allowed to even speak to him*. So I kept talking a little longer, just to assert a little control of my own.


You are married to my ex H's twin. Even the part about cutting you off when you were talking. Mine would say "Are you done talking now? Why are you talking? Is this why you are bothering me? Are you finished?" Total disregard for my/your feelings.



ephie_anne said:


> *He seems quite annoyed and bewildered by my lawyer appointment next week. He can't understand why I'd seek legal counsel *if my ultimate goal is to heal our marriage.


Well honey that's because he doesn't actually thin you will DO anything. He is certain you will always go back to him and stay put. Because that's what you've always done. He has no fear of losing you AT all. That is why he does and says whatever he wants and has zero respect for you.

That's why he threatens you with something as serious as divorce all the time and then tries to act lik e he's so confused when you actually say you will grant him. Control Freak Extraordinaire.


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## ephie_anne

So, JellyBeans, do you think I'm doing the right thing by talking to a lawyer? I'm not going to file the papers next week or anything, and he knows that. I could toss out that threat, but I'd be lying just like him. I'm mostly going there to have questions answered and attempt to learn more about the process. Between the two of us, I've done much more legwork and research in terms of actually following through with divorce. 

I'm finally starting to stick up for myself, and it feels like the right thing to do. Gotta admit, it feels weird, and I guess that's why I'm seeking support and/or encouragement here.


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## This is me

Jellybeans said:


> There is no point in "marriage counselling" if one person does not want to attend/has no desire to.
> 
> Also, abusive relationships are the same as healthy/amenable relationships.
> 
> Everyone would like to mend a broken relationship. It takes two though. And one person cannot do it alone.


Some experts disagree with you. Sometimes it only takes one person to change to make the other follow suit. You can start counseling and the other can join in when ready.

Divorce should always be the last option.


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## This is me

ephie_anne said:


> In regards to marriage counseling:
> 
> We saw one counselor a few times in the fall of '09. After our first visit, he informed us that our marriage was "doomed," which of course has been thrown in my face ever since.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not all counselors are good counselors. The one choosen should be from a referral with a couple who had success not from ones who divorced, and also both H & W should agree to which counselor.
> 
> Our first one was not good. Our current one is much better. But I keep evaluating her and if I don't see noticeable improvement, I will suggest we look again.
> 
> Marriage is important and worth the extra effort to make it work IMHO.
Click to expand...


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## Homemaker_Numero_Uno

ephie_anne said:


> My husband throws out the threat of divorce literally every time we argue, which is about once every 4-6 weeks. He also tells me that he doesn't want me, can't stand to be around me, doesn't love me, etc. I recognize that he uses his words as a control tactic to put me "in my place," and I know that it constitutes textbook verbal/emotional abuse. This has been going on for years, but he never actually follows through with this threats. However, he manages to convince me each time he says it that _this time_ he really means it. I try to be strong, but it causes intense anxiety and worry...which is probably his intent. In moments of peace, he'll admit that he only says it to hurt me because he's so angry with me.
> 
> Without fail, I fall into the pattern by always being the first to apologize and try to smooth things over. He'll continue to pout for another couple days, and then he'll grudgingly "give me one last chance." It's such a mind game, and it's grown terribly predictable.
> 
> I don't know how to change the scenario. I know that I can't force him to recognize it as abuse, and I can't change his words or actions. I can only change my response...but HOW? I feel like pretending to encourage the notion of divorce and attempting to call his bluff makes me just as much of a game player as him, since I do not want to get divorced. If I pretend that I do, I'm just playing into it.
> 
> It just happened again a couple days ago over a simple household chore issue, and once again, THIS TIME he means it. He's sleeping in the basement and refusing to talk to me (other than to yell when I try to talk to him).
> 
> So, in an attempt to change the pattern, I've set up a consultation with a divorce lawyer next week. Even though I don't intend to file for divorce, I feel like I need to make a stand and learn more about my rights in case he truly means it this time. He knows about my appointment but claims that he doesn't care.
> 
> I don't know what to do anymore. On the days when we're not arguing, I am content and happy in my marriage. It seems like he is as well. I can't help but think that if he really wanted to end it, he would've done it a long time ago. So if this is nothing more than a means of gaining control, how do I change the dynamic?
> 
> Many of you may encourage me to pack up and leave him, but I won't do that. Not only is it not a financial possibility, I refuse to put my children into the middle of this game and disrupt their stability. And, no, we don't argue in front of them, and I do understand the impact a dysfunctional marriage has on kids. I also understand the impact of divorce. I'm more than willing to seek counseling with him (again), but he refuses, claiming that the 2 counselors we briefly saw a few years ago didn't help us.
> 
> So without actually walking out, what options do I have? I'm sure someone else out there has been through this, so I'm desperately seeking real, nonjudgmental advice.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


Easy peasy. Accept the offer (rather than taking it as a threat) and file for divorce. Then you don't have to live under the threats of divorce whenever you speak up for yourself. I tried it and it is a surefire method - now there are no more threats of divorce, I am giving one to myself. It has brought great and lasting peace of mind in my household. He made a threat of suicide too, and quickly changed his tune when I said I would call the post-deployment mental health counselors. VERY interesting. Apparently these threats are only meant as some kind of juvenile entertainment...I have better ways to amuse myself. 

Your attorney if he or she is a good one will take you aside and recommend IC for you. As for your children, I hardly think they feel that their life is stable, unless they're in comas.


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## Monty4321

Acorn said:


> Next time he threatens divorce, say something like, "If you need to divorce to be happy, I'll accept that. But, you are using the threat of divorce to try to control me and it stops today. I will no longer be part of the conversation if we can't have a discussion without these threats."
> 
> Next time he does it, leave the room.
> 
> Next time he does it, leave the house.
> 
> Next time he does it, leave the house for longer, maybe even an overnight.
> 
> He'll get the picture. (Bonus points if you come back the next day and tell HIM you've decided to give him another chance.)


:iagree:



Wow...that's some advice- i totally agree. You really put the icing on the cake with the bonus points.


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## Happy Again

ephie_anne said:


> In regards to marriage counseling:
> 
> We also attended a Retrouvaille weekend in May of last year, but then I had a baby and we only made it to one of the follow-up meetings.
> 
> It could very well be that counseling would never "work" for us anyhow, but I have a hard time discounting the idea when all 3 of our attempts have been fairly half-as*ed. I can't help but wonder if we'd make progress by just focusing on the way we argue and trying to "fix" that part. Because like I said in my original post, I think we actually get along fine the rest of the time.


Ephie Anne: Your story is also my story...but as horrid as the mental and verbal abuse was, God saw fit to direct us to a Retrouvaille program. That was 20 years ago. We attended the Weekend and all the Post Weekend session and it so changed our lives. My DH was so impressed with the teams who shared their stories (which matched our story to a "t") with us, that for the very first time in nearly 20 years he saw how harmful his own attitude, tone of voice, harsh words, all his negative behaviors were affecting me, us and our children. We have spent the past 20 years presenting our own story during the Weekends and Post Weekend sessions.

You say you did not follow up on completing the entire program. This program is SO POWERFUL in teaching spouses how to talk with each other in an open, honest and respectful way, that my suggestion to you is to GO BACK AND COMPLETE THE PROGRAM...even attend another Weekend if you believe it may be helpful. The only thing you have to lose is your time but you have EVERYTHING to gain!! Keep on posting.


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## Traggy

OMG,

This is my STBXW. I honestly think this is a defense mechanism.

Any time we argue and I would stand up against her is would be divorce. I was not allowed to have a differing opinion. I was only allowed to either agree or she would leave. This caused me to not have a voice... for the last three years. I no longer had any leg to stand on from fear of losing her. 

This is a really crappy way to live and you have to stop it.. I am now getting divorced.


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## Dubspub

See below


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## Dubspub

Jellybeans said:


> This is me said:
> 
> 
> 
> My advice is seek a Marriage Counselor. Whether he joins you or not you should look to mend rather than end.
> .
> 
> 
> 
> There is no point in "marriage counselling" if one person does not want to attend/has no desire to.
> 
> Also, abusive relationships are the same as healthy/amenable relationships.
> 
> Everyone would like to mend a broken relationship. It takes two though. And one person cannot do it alone.
Click to expand...



I used to agree with this, that there's no point in mc unless he's willing to go/change. But after starting marriage counseling I disagree. It's helping me so much. Even if he doesn't change, I'm getting access to tools I can use to make things better for me. And it seems to help. Also I was recommended a book I strongly suggest, as it is opening up my eyes more than I thought it could. It has challenged everything I thought I knew to bring to the table for conflict resolution. Conflict resolution doesn't fix marriages as it turns out. And I found that very hard for me to get past, but I just kept reading...
This guy knows what he's talking about.
'The Seven Principles for Making Marriage Work', by John Gottman 
With access to a mc and this book, I was given access to tools I didn't already know about that made me feel like I can fix things for me at the very least, but what's better is some of the approaches I learned do actually get the results I'm hoping for. Very helpful.
I guess for me, I too, didn't want to play his games, turns out I needed one of my own. I mean that in honestly the most sincerely innocent way.


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## musiclover

My husband used to throw the divorce word out there all the time. So stupid. I'm divorcing him now, good riddance....


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## Slow Hand

Wow, zombie thread, cool!

I used to throw the D word around when my wife and I fought too, didn't know any better and now I don't do that anymore.


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## mjgh06

@ephie_anne

I think you can tell many of us have been in similar circumstances. Here are parts of your post I wanted to address



> On the days when we're not arguing, I am content and happy in my marriage. It seems like he is as well.
> 
> Many of you may encourage me to pack up and leave him, but I won't do that. Not only is it not a financial possibility, I refuse to put my children into the middle of this game and disrupt their stability. And, no, we don't argue in front of them, and I do understand the impact a dysfunctional marriage has on kids. I also understand the impact of divorce.
> 
> Does it make me weak to think that when I said my vows "for better or worse," that maybe this just falls into the second category and I shouldn't give up? I can't tell if I'm committed or just stupid.


When you are not fighting and you both are happy in marriage together, can you together come up with a 'word' your husband agrees with for when he is throwing around the D word he knows to stop? This worked for my H when he got so angry he was no longer thinking. I would say the word and he would switch gears and start calming down.

I agree with you completely about the reasons for staying. I don't think that makes you weak at all. It makes you stronger than most, because you put up with a lot of BS and know that if 90% of the time is good, the 10% when it isn't doesn't justify eliminating all the good. My counselor when I was younger gave me that analogy.

With that said, we all have a point of no return -As long as you know that boundary and when you will call it quits. Me, I would have left with the affair. I wish I could say it will get better, but the fact is it will get worse as time progresses without some intervention. My H and I never used to argue in front of the kids and now we do. I am currently debating with myself if I stay or go, and like you have more reason to stay. I don't personally agree with going to the attorney if you really are not prepared to contemplate divorce. For me that would be a tit for tat and not a real call, you are creating your own bluff. I think your best option is to use the time when things are good to discuss how to change the things which are bad. But take my advice for what it is worth as I am facing similar dilemmas of my own.

edited to add: Think about this - I was emotionally abusive to my mom as a teen. She never divorced me. As a parent, I deal with tantrums and child manipulative actions constantly. I don't love them any less nor would I give them up. (I hear you guys yelling it's not the same thing) 
But why isn't it? We made a commitment to our spouses the day we married until death do us part - or at least I did. I made a commitment to my children the day they were conceived until even after death I would be there for them. BS is BS does it matter which one it comes from? If we love truly and openly, why should my I love you to my child have more meaning behind the words than those to my spouse? That's how I think anyways.


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## DanielleBennett

Well geez, he sounds like a tool. Next time he tries to yell or threaten divorce and "means it this time," just say okay and do the 180. Act like it doesn't bother you and he may realize that the mind game doesn't work anymore. If he really wants to leave he will. Just ignore his childish behavior. If he won't come to counseling then go yourself and find some self help. If it were financially possible, I would leave, but since it's not I can understand. You should make a plan though in case he were to be the one to leave. Try to save up as much as you can and prepare yourself for the worst. Staying with him will also wear you down more and the kids may pick up on that and notice bouts of unhappiness when these arguments happen. Kids know more than they let on.


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## *Deidre*

Walk out of the room each and every single time he says it. If he follows you and screams it at you...walk into the next room. Go outside if you have to. Honestly, you're in an emotionally/verbally abusive relationship as you know, and if you don't want to leave him, then you are resigning to accepting it. There are no other ways to view it, for abusers rarely change. Why would he change, if he knows you'll tolerate it? You know?


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## RandomThoughts

I know this is an old thread and from most of the responses, the consensus is get a divorce. And from reading a post on the a random forum—that’s easy to say. If you were in the similar situation before and that’s what you did, good for you. I hope it was for the better all around. I think there’s times when that’s appropriate. However, my take on this is different. 

From the OPs post it sounds like they’ve been married for a while and there’s children involved. A divorce takes a lot of time, money, stress and stress for the kids. I agree that if a majority percent of the time things are good and only a small percent is spent arguing and during argument the Divorce comes up, I think that’s a reason to work on the marriage rather than call it quits.

First, look at how many people have responded to this thread saying things like—“yep, that’s my husband, or my ex, or my wife, or …. ME!” To me, that says that the problem you’re having is common. Most marriage problems are common—just look at how many sitcoms and comedies are built on marriage problems! Second, think about your friends and relatives. Who has a perfect marriage? Hell, who even has a marriage slightly better than you? I think these 2 points would be a good test to see if you should work on a marriage, or repeat the same or worse in a different marriage years from now. Finally, keep in mind, all the marriage help sites talk about the rules of arguing, marriage and so on. It’s good if everyone reads those prior to marriage or has a live-in marriage counselor. The reality is, every person has his/her own issues they bring to a marriage—bad childhood, grew up in single parent household, depression, mental (maybe not necessarily illness but issues), and the ever favorite—your parent’s punished you when you were a kid by FILL IN THE BLANK when you did something bad—so that’s all you know how to do when arguing now with your spouse.) 

Disclosure—I’m a male, married for 13 years, 2 kids—currently discussing divorce with my wife (we both bring it up from time to time).


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