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post #46 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-20-2016, 10:20 PM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

I feel like I am going to be the odd one out. But should "no" be an acceptable answer? Well it's always acceptable But, at least from my point of view, I would be hurt if I made a reasonable request of someone I was in a relationship with and they said no.

Of course, if I requested my boyfriend move some chairs in a few minutes, I would do it if they were small wouldn't take much time to do and wouldn't mess up his clothes. Would I accept the "no"? Well what else can I do. But it would do damage.

Of course, it also depends on why "no" is being said. Is it because you still have your own thing to do? In my mind, that would be reasonable. That would be setting a reasonable boundary. But if you were sitting on the couch doing much of nothing and you were asked to do a small task...well saying "no" would feel mean to me. And I would think less of you. Of course I don't like door mats, but I am also not willing to be in a relationship with someone who resents going out of his way for me.

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post #47 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-21-2016, 10:34 AM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

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Originally Posted by FrenchFry View Post
Screwed up view. Have you ever experienced saying no to a woman and anger doesn't happen?
I can't even imagine getting angry just because someone said no to me ....

Maybe if that's all they ever said. But then I wouldn't be in a relationship with them.
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post #48 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-21-2016, 11:56 AM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

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Doing some reflecting on my codependency and boundaries, I'd like to bounce some stuff off some other people.



So as a people pleaser I tend to do things out of obligation. I probably went a little far on the spectrum but I tried making a conscious decision not to do anything that I really didn't want to do in my last relationship.



One time I was at my girlfriend's house and I was sitting on her couch. We were getting ready to leave in about 10-15 minutes and I was relaxed and feeling good. She said, "Hey before we go can you move these chairs upstairs?"



For whatever reason I really didn't feel like it, and so I told her, "I don't really feel like it to be honest. Maybe later?"



She got really mad about that and I saw some validity in her comments. Basically her response was that she couldn't understand why I wouldn't want to help her and that I was being selfish. That sometimes being in a relationship means doing things you don't necessarily WANT to do but you do it anyway.



Now the last part is kind of hogwash to me, because there were clearly times in the relationship before and after that where I was clearly doing something that I didn't really want to do, but did it because I wanted to please my partner (ie dishes, taking out trash, etc.). However, at this specific moment in time, my desire to not move the chairs outstripped my desire to please her.



So I ask you people of TAM, how do you feel about this? Was my refusal to move the chairs a problem? Should I have done it even though I didn't want to? Am I just immature? Was this a crossing of my personal boundary that should have been a red flag?


I don't typically do dishes or help my wife clean the house, etc to please her. And, we don't teach our boys that is the reason to pitch in. I do these things, my boys, my wife carries out such task because they have to get done. It's a tribal effort to make the mess, it's a tribal effort to clean it up.

I don't know the chair situation completely but I think you may be over thinking her motive as well as your own. It would have been better to say "ok, but if we do this together, we can get it done faster".


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post #49 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-22-2016, 08:32 AM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

If there is a trend of co-dependency in you or your relationship, I feel it's important to be careful about how you approach that trend within a relationship.
Moving the chairs may have been the straw that broke the camel's back.
Better next time to deal with that overloaded camel's back much earlier in the relationship.
Or move the chairs, and the next day start a conversation with "I am conflicted about agreeing or saying No when you ask me things like yesterday's 'move the chairs'. Let's talk about that for a few minutes."
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post #50 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-22-2016, 10:33 AM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

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Originally Posted by BlueWoman View Post
I feel like I am going to be the odd one out. But should "no" be an acceptable answer? Well it's always acceptable But, at least from my point of view, I would be hurt if I made a reasonable request of someone I was in a relationship with and they said no.

Of course, if I requested my boyfriend move some chairs in a few minutes, I would do it if they were small wouldn't take much time to do and wouldn't mess up his clothes. Would I accept the "no"? Well what else can I do. But it would do damage.

Of course, it also depends on why "no" is being said. Is it because you still have your own thing to do? In my mind, that would be reasonable. That would be setting a reasonable boundary. But if you were sitting on the couch doing much of nothing and you were asked to do a small task...well saying "no" would feel mean to me. And I would think less of you. Of course I don't like door mats, but I am also not willing to be in a relationship with someone who resents going out of his way for me.
It really just depends on the overall dynamic.

For example, if EVERY time you saw your husband/BF sitting on the couch you asked him to do something and then gave him attitude if he said "no" or "not now," then there would be an issue.

Or, if it was something you were perfectly capable of doing yourself, it would be an issue.

It's really about mutual respect. If you demonstrate respect for your SO's time an individual autonomy, then it's reasonable to expect that they will do you favors from time to time.

If you're not respectful, then you shouldn't expect favors. They're called favors for a reason.
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post #51 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-22-2016, 10:36 AM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

I think an interesting thought experiment for the ladies would be to imagine if your husband/BF came home and started saying, "Hey sweetie, can you cook us dinner? Looks like you're just sitting on the couch."

The average woman would throw a fit.

And yet, the average women would probably think it's totally fine to lob a demand at her husband whenever she sees him sitting on the couch.
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post #52 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-22-2016, 10:42 AM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

I think the idea is that they are equally capable of cooking dinner. It may be easier, even much easier, for him to transport chairs.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #53 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-22-2016, 10:48 AM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

are the chairs made of lead?

is a woman incapable of lifting a chair?
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post #54 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-22-2016, 07:08 PM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

I think these are Boundary issues. I do not think they are codependency issues. Look up some threads by @SimplyAmorous. I do believe she did some on the topic. Hell, I could be mistaken. I'm thinking of how to say no. I think you feel guilty when you say no. I think this comes from something in your youth. You'll want to explore that with a good counselor. I like phd level psychologists.

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post #55 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-23-2016, 09:25 AM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

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Originally Posted by Affaircare View Post
I will agree with you that in the USA this day and age, many women act entitled and self-centered, and thus a large number would get mad if someone DARED to say "no" to them.
Part of me doesn't even blame them. Too many chivalrous guys putting them on grandiose pedestals most of their lives because they are taught that's what romance is.


“When someone shows you who they are, believe them the first time.” - Maya Angelou
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post #56 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-25-2016, 12:10 AM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

"Excuse me, sir? I'm way too short to reach these boxes on the top shelf. Would you mind getting one down for me?"
"Sure, no problem. Here you are."
"Thank you!" (She walksa away thinking... Such a gentleman and he's handsome, too. Wonder if he's single...)

Same scene, different response:

"Excuse me, sir? I'm way too short to reach these boxes on the top shelf. Would you mind getting one down for me?"
"Uh, no. Don't feel like it right now."
"Wow. Ok." (She walks off thinking... Wow. What a selfish prick!)
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post #57 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-25-2016, 09:47 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

Quote:
Originally Posted by Begin again View Post
"Excuse me, sir? I'm way too short to reach these boxes on the top shelf. Would you mind getting one down for me?"
"Sure, no problem. Here you are."
"Thank you!" (She walksa away thinking... Such a gentleman and he's handsome, too. Wonder if he's single...)

Same scene, different response:

"Excuse me, sir? I'm way too short to reach these boxes on the top shelf. Would you mind getting one down for me?"
"Uh, no. Don't feel like it right now."
"Wow. Ok." (She walks off thinking... Wow. What a selfish prick!)
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LOL what is your point with this?
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post #58 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-25-2016, 07:31 PM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

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Originally Posted by COguy View Post
LOL what is your point with this?
To make you feel guilty about not moving the stupid chairs!!
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post #59 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-25-2016, 08:14 PM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

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Originally Posted by Anon1111 View Post
are the chairs made of lead?

is a woman incapable of lifting a chair?
It is a deposit in her emotional bank account. If the economy is running properly, it should earn some interest.
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One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #60 of 89 (permalink) Old 08-25-2016, 08:18 PM
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Re: Boundaries and Codependency

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Originally Posted by COguy View Post
LOL what is your point with this?
Lol! You really need me to tell you?
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