Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men - Page 9 - Talk About Marriage
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post #121 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-20-2016, 01:33 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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Are they getting weaker physically & emotionally?

I would be willing to overlook physical strength but emotional & mental, I couldn't personally.
You can build muscle & strength, building confidence however is harder to do.
Totally agree.

One of the deepest feminine pleasures is when a man stands full, present, and unreactive in the midst of his woman's emotional storms. When he stays present with her, and loves her through the layers of wildness and closure, then she feels his trustability, and she can relax. -- David Deida, The Way of the Superior Man
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post #122 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-20-2016, 01:52 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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This is kinda true.. sorry to say... our sons love their video games.. I hate the da** things.. and we're guilty of not putting our foot down enough to keep them off of them..

On comparing my own husband to the article.. the whole "hand grip" thing..... although he was bullied some in early high school (for his lunch money, not sure).. he was never a BIG guy, didn't play sports...but ya know.. he grew up to be a hell of a worker.. kinda what the 2nd part of the article was talking about when it said ...

"None of my nerdiness relieved me of the responsibility of learning how to be a man — a protector, builder, and fixer.... "

So a man's manliness can't all be looked upon as in "how much can you bench press"... husband used to work with a guy who'd go on about how great he was in wrestling, he can take anyone down.. demonstrated in front of me one day- when we visited his camp..... oh he had the STRENGTH... but ya know. he whined on the job, complained all the time ...some of those guys who "worked out" were on the lazy side at work... he'd say they were as worthless as "ti*s on a bull"...

Work ethic, being responsible to whatever you put your hands to, Keeping one's WORD, faithfulness, commitment.. My husband is old fashioned in the way he still believes a man is to Protect and Provide for his wife / family, you do what you have to Do...

I greatly admire these things..


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post #123 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-20-2016, 02:54 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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This is kinda true.. sorry to say... our sons love their video games.. I hate the da** things.. and we're guilty of not putting our foot down enough to keep them off of them..

On comparing my own husband to the article.. the whole "hand grip" thing..... although he was bullied some in early high school (for his lunch money, not sure).. he was never a BIG guy, didn't play sports...but ya know.. he grew up to be a hell of a worker.. kinda what the 2nd part of the article was talking about when it said ...

"None of my nerdiness relieved me of the responsibility of learning how to be a man — a protector, builder, and fixer.... "

So a man's manliness can't all be looked upon as in "how much can you bench press"... husband used to work with a guy who'd go on about how great he was in wrestling, he can take anyone down.. demonstrated in front of me one day- when we visited his camp..... oh he had the STRENGTH... but ya know. he whined on the job, complained all the time ...some of those guys who "worked out" were on the lazy side at work... he'd say they were as worthless as "ti*s on a bull"...

Work ethic, being responsible to whatever you put your hands to, Keeping one's WORD, faithfulness, commitment.. My husband is old fashioned in the way he still believes a man is to Protect and Provide for his wife / family, you do what you have to Do...

I greatly admire these things..


We put time limits on our boys video games. Needless to say my youngest is a full on T filled jock, football, basketball and weightlifting in the offseason. Sometimes too much.

My oldest participates in Special Olympics powerlifting.

We are not trying to build muscle boys, however both activities helps with their adhd tendencies. Helps them focus mentally when it is important to do so.


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post #124 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-20-2016, 03:27 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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Originally Posted by MrsAldi View Post
Are they getting weaker physically & emotionally?

I would be willing to overlook physical strength but emotional & mental, I couldn't personally.
You can build muscle & strength, building confidence however is harder to do.








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Yes to both, weaker physically and emotionally.
First off humans in general have become much more sedentary and less active. Human labor is no longer needed to survive. In fact it is hardly needed simply to exist anymore with advances in technology. Unfortunately many today (not just the young either) are all to willing to "take it easy" and simply get by with as little effort as possible. That is why we see such an explosion in the rates of obesity and in diseases such as heart disease and diabetes.
Secondly men in particular are being immersed in a very female dominated culture. Men are not being taught or allowed to be masculine and when they are, they are often ostracized and ridiculed. Look at TV shows - most men are simply there as comic foils for the uber successful, all knowing and well rounded females that dominate the TV shows. Culture is producing a bunch of men, (I know, I was one of them) that don't know how to be masculine. This wreaks havoc on the emotional state of many men.
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post #125 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-20-2016, 03:30 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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Originally Posted by SimplyAmorous View Post
"None of my nerdiness relieved me of the responsibility of learning how to be a man — a protector, builder, and fixer.... "

So a man's manliness can't all be looked upon as in "how much can you bench press"... husband used to work with a guy who'd go on about how great he was in wrestling, he can take anyone down.. demonstrated in front of me one day- when we visited his camp..... oh he had the STRENGTH... but ya know. he whined on the job, complained all the time ...some of those guys who "worked out" were on the lazy side at work... he'd say they were as worthless as "ti*s on a bull"...

Work ethic, being responsible to whatever you put your hands to, Keeping one's WORD, faithfulness, commitment.. My husband is old fashioned in the way he still believes a man is to Protect and Provide for his wife / family, you do what you have to Do...

I greatly admire these things..
I agree 100%; being a man isn't all about how much you can bench press or what your job is; it also has a lot to do with attitude.

I agree that just because someone is a weightlifter doesn't mean they could do a physical days work like some can. I live in a rural area where physical labor is still around a little more than some places. I've seen those muscle boys wilt within 30 minutes when you get them in the hot sun pouring concrete, putting on a roof, fencing, or hauling in hay. Although I haven't heard the word sissy used in a while, that's what it would have been called in my younger days, but I suppose those guys are all man by today's standards.

I know this is not the norm, but I personally know a man who is 86 years old, and he can work as hard physically as any 30 year old I know. His wife said he has finally gotten to the point that he usually takes a mid-day nap to keep up his energy, but when he's awake, he's a ball of fire. It's what he has always been accustomed to.

He's the type of guy who doesn't need a gym, because his everyday life is active enough, which is the way a lot of people used to be.

There is nothing more sad or glorious than generations changing hands- John Mellencamp
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post #126 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-20-2016, 03:53 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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My point was that MUSCLES arent important..healthy living and eating is..

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Healthy living and eating are what lead to muscles. Form follows function, and when your only function in life is to consume calories without physical activity, your form follows that function and you get fat, slovenly and things stop working right because they aren't being used.
Nobody says you need to be Arnold Schwartzenegger. But that doesn't change the fact that you either use it or lose it.
It makes me sick to see so many people (young and old ) choose to waste away rather than develop their bodies into the most efficient and comfortable aspects of the selves.
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post #127 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-20-2016, 04:02 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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Yes to both, weaker physically and emotionally.

First off humans in general have become much more sedentary and less active. Human labor is no longer needed to survive. In fact it is hardly needed simply to exist anymore with advances in technology. Unfortunately many today (not just the young either) are all to willing to "take it easy" and simply get by with as little effort as possible. That is why we see such an explosion in the rates of obesity and in diseases such as heart disease and diabetes.

Secondly men in particular are being immersed in a very female dominated culture. Men are not being taught or allowed to be masculine and when they are, they are often ostracized and ridiculed. Look at TV shows - most men are simply there as comic foils for the uber successful, all knowing and well rounded females that dominate the TV shows. Culture is producing a bunch of men, (I know, I was one of them) that don't know how to be masculine. This wreaks havoc on the emotional state of many men.


We are still hunter/gatherers. Many of our modern diseases can be attributed to what has been termed mismatched diseases.

All boils down to a lifestyle that is

Too sedentary
Too satiated
Too sterile

Even the chairs (with backrest) can be attributed to many of the back problems we see. Our East African ancestors sat on rocks and used tiny back muscles to keep their balance. They walked an average of 12Km/day, ate tubers, insects and apple like fruits with all the sweetness of a carrot. They drank out of streams teaming with bacteria, some beneficial some not so much. They did not experience allergies as their TH1 levels kept their TH2 levels in check.

Meat was a treat, but not a main portion of their diet. They depended heavily on living in small cooperative tribes. Individualism was not an advantageous way of life.

It really is who we are for most of our existence on earth. Not until around 10K BCE did we begin to manipulate our environment and situation in life that started us down the mismatched path. Each revolution bring more changes and exacerbating the mismatch.

It's who we are.


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post #128 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-27-2016, 08:40 AM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

I don't think it's just men getting weaker. I think that society as a whole is weaker and my take on it is too many lawyers and social workers being elected and not enough ordinary people.

I see too many parents not letting their children have fun because they may get hurt. Here's an example.

Friends of ours from my daughter's gymnastics club would never let her do things like jump on the bed or climb trees as she may hurt herself. We on the other hand didn't overly encourage it bet let our daughter know the risks of what could happen.

Fast forward a couple of years. Our daughter is now competing at a level twice what our friend's daughter is and her parents are upset their daughter isn't at the same level.

Why? I think it is an internal conflict in the child being trained. All her life she was told by her parents not to do things because she will hurt herself. Then she goes to the gym and is told to pretty much do the things her parents told her not to do.

We let our daughter do plenty of things at 3-4years old that would make most modern parents cringe. She was using a hot glue gun at 3yrs old. At 4 years old she was making her own jigsaw puzzles with scroll saw in my workshop. She would climb and sit on top of a 6' fence with our neighbor's 12yr old daughter.

Our daughter is now 12yrs old. She is the highest level competitor in her gym. We didn't invoke unnecessary fears on her, instead we encouraged her to face her fears.

Right from the start my wife and I refused to have our girls join the protective "bubble wrap" generation where kids have to be protected against anything and everything.

The funny part of all of this is our daughters don't spend countless hours playing video games or surfing the net on their phones. They enjoy being active and my 12 yr old actually asked me to lie about her age so she could go lift weights with me.

I don't have any boys but what I have seen from our friends that do is, most are protected by bubble wrap so they won't get hurt either. I can't really blame the parents as most of them were protected the same way.

If there were some kind of apocalypse, and people had to depend on their skill taught by their parents and society in general, how would modern society hold up against that of 50-60 years ago? I don't think there is an app to take down a deer to feed a hungry family.



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post #129 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-27-2016, 11:35 AM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

Dad showed me how to cut grass, take care of auto maintenance, the names and uses of hand tools, how to grow vegetables, throw and catch a baseball, and make minor repairs at home. Education and organized sports taught the mechanical drawing, typing, wood shop, how to play baseball, and basketball.

I don't think it's society, but parents who have forgotten or were never taught how to have fun teaching skills to their sons, and oh my, I get murdered for this, and their daughters. I tried to teach my daughter many of these "manly" things. She didn't have to be ripped with muscles and callouses, but I wanted her to know the basics. I don't want her getting ripped off because her femininity makes her seem naïve and uneducated.

Sorry guys. That's how I see it. Most girls won't want to dig a ditch or change an engine anyway, but if she needs someone to do it, she will be less likely to be ripped off. If she really has to do it, at least she will have an idea of how to get started.

I also very much agree with @Coffee4me2. Each child will show you their interests. Go with them, but don't focus all their education on just those things. They all need to have well-rounded educations.

They have to know, as another member posted, that their bodies will take a beating and they will have aches and pains. Some folks love what they do so they don't care about those things as much. Pain is pushed aside like fighters do in the ring and exercise will lessen it. Don't stop them from pursuing what they love.

Most parents just want their kids happy and healthy. That doesn't always mean being wealthy.

"I'm significant!! Screamed the dust speck." - Bill Watterson
"Youth is wasted on the young". - George Bernard Shaw

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post #130 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-27-2016, 12:05 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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I don't think it's society, but parents who have forgotten or were never taught how to have fun teaching skills to their sons, and oh my, I get murdered for this, and their daughters. I tried to teach my daughter many of these "manly" things. She didn't have to be ripped with muscles and callouses, but I wanted her to know the basics. I don't want her getting ripped off because her femininity makes her seem naïve and uneducated.

Very true! I see parents passing on less knowledge to there kids as time goes on. My wife benefited tremendously from watching her dad and learning his techniques. I am trying to pass on what I know to my kids to empower them to a succeed in what ever they do. I taught my daughter how to climb outdoors and she used that skill to help land a job. Not all knowledge should come from school by a longshot.

I don't want to not live because of my fear of what could happen. - Laird Hamilton

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post #131 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-27-2016, 12:21 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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Very true! I see parents passing on less knowledge to there kids as time goes on. My wife benefited tremendously from watching her dad and learning his techniques. I am trying to pass on what I know to my kids to empower them to a succeed in what ever they do. I taught my daughter how to climb outdoors and she used that skill to help land a job. Not all knowledge should come from school by a longshot.
And we're always looking for things to do that are considered quality time with our loved ones.

Even if they seem to hate it, when they get older, they will appreciate it. As long as they aren't forced abusively. It has to be a little fun, at least.

A reward of treating them more like an adult is nice. Showing them how to pay themselves for getting something important done is a way to grow in emotional maturity for both the parent and child. Like getting a nice shower after and shaving and throwing on some nice clothes and sharing some after shave. Then, maybe getting a little ice cream cone or something nice for a reward.

The work has been done. Calories burned. Something small won't break the bank or the diet. For those who cannot eat that due to an illness, there are other rewards like purchasing a new song or a book to read. There's always something.

The trouble is, some get those things all the time and it is no longer a reward, but an entitlement.

Hell, I don't know. We all have our own way of doing things.

"I'm significant!! Screamed the dust speck." - Bill Watterson
"Youth is wasted on the young". - George Bernard Shaw

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post #132 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-27-2016, 03:04 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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Dad showed me how to cut grass, take care of auto maintenance, the names and uses of hand tools, how to grow vegetables, throw and catch a baseball, and make minor repairs at home. Education and organized sports taught the mechanical drawing, typing, wood shop, how to play baseball, and basketball.



I don't think it's society, but parents who have forgotten or were never taught how to have fun teaching skills to their sons, and oh my, I get murdered for this, and their daughters. I tried to teach my daughter many of these "manly" things. She didn't have to be ripped with muscles and callouses, but I wanted her to know the basics. I don't want her getting ripped off because her femininity makes her seem naïve and uneducated.



Sorry guys. That's how I see it. Most girls won't want to dig a ditch or change an engine anyway, but if she needs someone to do it, she will be less likely to be ripped off. If she really has to do it, at least she will have an idea of how to get started.



I also very much agree with @Coffee4me2. Each child will show you their interests. Go with them, but don't focus all their education on just those things. They all need to have well-rounded educations.



They have to know, as another member posted, that their bodies will take a beating and they will have aches and pains. Some folks love what they do so they don't care about those things as much. Pain is pushed aside like fighters do in the ring and exercise will lessen it. Don't stop them from pursuing what they love.



Most parents just want their kids happy and healthy. That doesn't always mean being wealthy.

I was in highschool just when computers were making their way into a lot of the workplaces. Back then a computer tech job came with a hefty salary. The school systems started to really push students in that direction and it was usually at the expense of the shop classes.

Now that most students are tech savvy, the computer tech jobs in a lot of places aren't as high paying as they once were due to market saturation. On the flip side, an electrician or plumber can command a very good rate of pay as a good portion of society looks on that type of work as menial even though every computer needs to be plugged in and as far as I know, everyone still needs to take a dump now and then.

I believe society has helped in turning not just men but our whole culture into weaker people.

A kid may be able to retrieve computer trouble codes from a car, but unless they have been taught how to use tools by either a parent or a teacher, they'll be SOL.

I've seen parent dote after their kids to the point the kid can barely most their own toast in the morning let alone cook a meal (something that has also gone to the wayside in the school system these days).

We have our girls (12&14), plan and cook one family dinner each per week. We don't care where they get the recipe but they have to make a list of any grocery items needed and are brought shopping and they pick out what they need.

Enforcing this routine wasn't difficult and it yielded some pretty good results. They are much more willing to try new foods, they learned to clean up not only after themselves, but a whole family meal worth of dishes and believe it or not, it helped them both with their self esteem.

Sure technology is great but if there isn't anyone willing to build the required infrastructure, it's all going to come crashing down. If that happens, what will the bubble wrap generation do?



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post #133 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-27-2016, 11:47 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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Even the chairs (with backrest) can be attributed to many of the back problems we see.

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Not disbelieving you on this at all, but do you have some data on this?

Society advances one funeral at a time. -- Max Planck
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post #134 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-27-2016, 11:52 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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Not disbelieving you on this at all, but do you have some data on this?


Lots of research references found in this book. It's a great read:

http://www.npr.org/2013/09/30/227777...n-modern-times


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post #135 of 183 (permalink) Old 08-27-2016, 11:56 PM
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Re: Men Are Getting Weaker — because We’re Not Raising Men

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Lots of research references found in this book. It's a great read:

How Our Stone Age Bodies Struggle To Stay Healthy In Modern Times : NPR


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Some of this mirrors the Paleo diet/lifestyle. What's your take on that?

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