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Sex in Marriage Sexual problems are common in many relationships. This section is for discussions about sexuality. Please limit discussions to those asking for help with a problem and those offering advice. Any other threads may be deleted.

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post #61 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 10:06 AM
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Re: Just some thoughts

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Originally Posted by Girl_power View Post
I reread your post and I have some thoughts. At first I didnít understand why her telling you ďlet me know when you want me to wear the lingerieĒ bothered you. And now I understand. Itís like when a wife has to tell her husband The obvious things around the house that need to be done like the dishes or taking out the trash. Do you want a partner not someone you have to tell what to do all the time.

As far as the massage goes, your wife should say no I donít like the massage or yes I like it and I want it. She seems to have no opinion. Itís like the lights are on but no one is home. Like youíre living with somebody whose not a real person.
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Originally Posted by leftfield View Post
You are absolutely on the right track here.

The bolded portion is particularly applicable. Last night we talked some. She indicated that she can't answer those questions because she is not being herself. Who exactly is she trying to be? Something, something, reference that thing and tie it back to nothing, drift this way, then drift back...... nothing comprehensible came from this. I finally said; 'just stop. Nothing you said makes any sense and I am getting frustrated hearing you contradict what you said just minutes before'. Her response; 'I know, sorry, I am messed up'.


OP, it sounds like the famous scene from that Jennifer Aniston movie is what you're describing. It's not so much that you want her to do the dishes, but that you want her to want to do the dishes? I get that. But is your wife someone who can actually want to want to do the dishes (or loving, connected, sex in this case)?

You mentioned in your opening post on this thread that the two of you are in a Dom/sub relationship. But it also sounded like that's a kind of nebulous and half hearted arrangement. Is it possible that "let me know when you want me to do X" or "I am willing" types of comments are part and parcel of that Dom/sub dynamic? A dynamic that she's taking more seriously than you seem to be. Might she actually be a sub? One who needs you to be a Dom?

Another thought I've had while reading this thread is to wonder if your wife might be on the spectrum. I can generally spot a science/math/engineer guy by his writing or speech patterns. Y'all tend to be wired up to be exceptionally analytical. And, yet, you describe your wife as even less emotionally connected than yourself. Is there anything to indicate that very high functioning Autism (Aspergers) might be an issue here?

You'll find that many of the truths we cling to depend greatly upon our own point of view. - Obi Wan Kenobi
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post #62 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 10:07 AM
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Re: Just some thoughts

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So what is OPs wife doing WRT to his love languages? I think the focus is all wrong here.... manipulating her to get what you want. Guess what? She has what she wants and there is no desire to go outside that. You CANNOT negotiate desire.... period. She canít negotiate you into desiring to do more with your kids. You either desire to or not. In my marriage, my wife let it slip that for years she was having sex because she had to and then scrambled to save face. It is better now but donít be surprised if you hear that in the future. Just because she says yes doesnít mean she wants to.

1. Stop having sex and quit romancing and putting the pressure on. Youíll only get frustrated. Start loving yourself instead.

2. Read ďNo More Mr Nice GuyĒ as there are covert contacts all over this situation and you need to stop. You have a very one-sided relationship... quit handing it to her.

3. Hit the gym and work on yourself. Go to therapy and work out your stuff. I gave up trying to drag my wife to MC (sheís a therapist which is ironic) and worked on myself then she didnít want to be left out and thought I might leave her so she started her own. Making progress but still some deep hidden baggage.

4. For me, what was a game changer is looking at the relationship if you took sex out of the equation and finding out that you undervalue yourself. You can talk compromise and being 50/50 but marriage is supposed to be a ďvalue addedĒ-thing for both of you. She got a breadwinner, a father for kids and helpmate. What did you get? Someone to take care of even if she divorced you down the road? Look at how much effort youíre putting into something SHE is responsible for... her sexual excitement (itís not 100% your job).

This sounds harsh but I realized I put my wife on a pedestal and thought sex to be the ultimate validation and for what... a taker? At that point a switch flipped. Previously all I could think about was sex then changed to setting boundaries, doing things solo and improving myself. Why use a taker for validation? You hope she shows love and desire to validate yourself but doesnít and now youíre frustrated and feel disrespected.

Another thing left out when others tell you ďthatís just how she isĒ and ďyou need to accept it.Ē Yes and Yes but you donít need to find it to be an attractive quality. Partners get complacent and forget that other people are gladly willing to take your place... why do you think affairs happen?

I was scared to fight because she may not want sex. Now Iím not and I think subconsciously she respects that and has been more enthusiastic about sex. In a perfect world, she would own it and say she owes you better and get to the bottom of things (i.e. trash from previous relationships) because when kids are gone itís you two. At that point (maybe even now) her love is different from yours. In the real world, the only thing you can do is own your stuff and go from there and hope she follows.




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Iím not trying to speak for the OP but I think he is being mis understood because he is not trying to get her the do what he wants. She already does what he wants.

He is having a hard time feeling a connection with her because she isnít her own person. She doesnít have any likes or dislikes. And anyone who loves anyone knows they they get enjoyment out of making the other person happy, and knowing them. There is nothing to her except whatever he wants to do. He wants more from her. Meaning, I hate getting massages honey, but I love it when you... x,y,z. Also if she knows what he likes, then she should do it spontaneously to make him happy. Hereís an example, she knows he likes lingerie. So go out buy some new lingerie and surprise him wearing it one day. Donít be a robotic and say... tell me when to wear it.

I get what the OP is getting at now. There is not much too her. There is no effort because she doesnít seem to understand or care or have motivation. She is just happy and content and go with the flow TOO much that she lost who she even is.

It made me sad when he said that itís like a dom/sub relationship just because thatís how low effort she is.
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post #63 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 10:40 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Just some thoughts

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Originally Posted by Girl_power View Post
I’m not trying to speak for the OP but I think he is being mis understood because he is not trying to get her the do what he wants. She already does what he wants.

He is having a hard time feeling a connection with her because she isn’t her own person. She doesn’t have any likes or dislikes. And anyone who loves anyone knows they they get enjoyment out of making the other person happy, and knowing them. There is nothing to her except whatever he wants to do. He wants more from her. Meaning, I hate getting massages honey, but I love it when you... x,y,z. Also if she knows what he likes, then she should do it spontaneously to make him happy. Here’s an example, she knows he likes lingerie. So go out buy some new lingerie and surprise him wearing it one day. Don’t be a robotic and say... tell me when to wear it.

I get what the OP is getting at now. There is not much too her. There is no effort because she doesn’t seem to understand or care or have motivation. She is just happy and content and go with the flow TOO much that she lost who she even is.

It made me sad when he said that it’s like a dom/sub relationship just because that’s how low effort she is.
This is spot on.

Last edited by leftfield; 01-16-2020 at 10:50 AM.
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post #64 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 10:49 AM
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Re: Just some thoughts

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Originally Posted by Girl_power View Post
I get what the OP is getting at now. There is not much too her. There is no effort because she doesnít seem to understand or care or have motivation. She is just happy and content and go with the flow TOO much that she lost who she even is.

It made me sad when he said that itís like a dom/sub relationship just because thatís how low effort she is.
@Girl_power... great analysis as always. My wife has likes and dislikes but hates to talk about them. Says sex talk is repulsive... but likes sex. IDK



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post #65 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 10:50 AM
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Re: Just some thoughts

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Originally Posted by leftfield View Post
Last night we talked some. She indicated that she can't answer those questions because she is not being herself. Who exactly is she trying to be? Something, something, reference that thing and tie it back to nothing, drift this way, then drift back...... nothing comprehensible came from this. I finally said; 'just stop. Nothing you said makes any sense and I am getting frustrated hearing you contradict what you said just minutes before'. Her response; 'I know, sorry, I am messed up'.

She doesn't want to tell you what you don't want to hear: the truth. I'm sure she is as frustrated as you are.
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post #66 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 11:01 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Just some thoughts

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She doesn't want to tell you what you don't want to hear: the truth. I'm sure she is as frustrated as you are.

This might be our problem. Because, what I want to hear is the 'truth'. I can handle the truth. Its everything else I have a problem with. If you are on the right track with this then this would be a more accurate statement: She fears the consequences of telling you what you want to hear: the truth.
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post #67 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 11:09 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Just some thoughts

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Originally Posted by Rowan View Post
OP, it sounds like the famous scene from that Jennifer Aniston movie is what you're describing. It's not so much that you want her to do the dishes, but that you want her to want to do the dishes? I get that. But is your wife someone who can actually want to want to do the dishes (or loving, connected, sex in this case)?
I have indicated in several posts that it is doubtful. All indications are that we're incompatible.

You mentioned in your opening post on this thread that the two of you are in a Dom/sub relationship. But it also sounded like that's a kind of nebulous and half hearted arrangement. Is it possible that "let me know when you want me to do X" or "I am willing" types of comments are part and parcel of that Dom/sub dynamic? A dynamic that she's taking more seriously than you seem to be. Might she actually be a sub? One who needs you to be a Dom?
No, No and No. At one time I had similar thoughts, so I educated myself about this and explored it. The answers was a resounding NO.

Another thought I've had while reading this thread is to wonder if your wife might be on the spectrum. I can generally spot a science/math/engineer guy by his writing or speech patterns. Y'all tend to be wired up to be exceptionally analytical. And, yet, you describe your wife as even less emotionally connected than yourself. Is there anything to indicate that very high functioning Autism (Aspergers) might be an issue here?
I have never had a reason to think she is on the spectrum. But it is a possibility.
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post #68 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 11:09 AM
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Re: Just some thoughts

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Originally Posted by leftfield View Post
This might be our problem. Because, what I want to hear is the 'truth'. I can handle the truth. Its everything else I have a problem with. If you are on the right track with this then this would be a more accurate statement: She fears the consequences of telling you what you want to hear: the truth.

I think it's more that she doesn't have a solution and she is frustrated too... she can't please you and, yes, probably fearing the consequences because you won't like truth: that she can't do anything about it. This what my wife told me after i gave her an ultimatum and we were in a very similar situation. At the end, she faked it. Is this what you want?
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post #69 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 11:14 AM
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Re: Just some thoughts

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Originally Posted by Girl_power View Post
Iím not trying to speak for the OP but I think he is being mis understood because he is not trying to get her the do what he wants. She already does what he wants.

He is having a hard time feeling a connection with her because she isnít her own person. She doesnít have any likes or dislikes. And anyone who loves anyone knows they they get enjoyment out of making the other person happy, and knowing them. There is nothing to her except whatever he wants to do. He wants more from her. Meaning, I hate getting massages honey, but I love it when you... x,y,z. Also if she knows what he likes, then she should do it spontaneously to make him happy. Hereís an example, she knows he likes lingerie. So go out buy some new lingerie and surprise him wearing it one day. Donít be a robotic and say... tell me when to wear it.

I get what the OP is getting at now. There is not much too her. There is no effort because she doesnít seem to understand or care or have motivation. She is just happy and content and go with the flow TOO much that she lost who she even is.

It made me sad when he said that itís like a dom/sub relationship just because thatís how low effort she is.
Could be.

You know what also fits the data provided? She just likes good old penetrative sex, and he keeps asking for other things. She might not want to say to him "listen husband, I know you think sex is this big emotional connectivity thing, but I just want you to take me to bone town."

There could be a whole Madonna/***** thing going on here. Or she could be depressed. Or have sexual trauma in her past. Or just LD. All kinds of things.

He, too, strikes me as remarkably passive in these conversations regarding sex. Could be wrong though.
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post #70 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 11:20 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Just some thoughts

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Originally Posted by Girl_power View Post
Oh boy. Has she always been this way and your just noticing it? It sounds like she is just a people pleaser and went through life trying to make others happy and not forming her own view and opinions and likes/dislikes.
I have never had reason to think of her as a people pleaser. She is conflict avoident (I used to be too), indecisive and relatively passive (she has gotten better in recent years). She most definitely has likes and dislikes.

I feel bad for her because she canít really help it. It you donít care about anything what can you do?
She cares about things and puts effort into them.
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post #71 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 11:25 AM
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Re: Just some thoughts

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Originally Posted by Marduk View Post
Could be.



You know what also fits the data provided? She just likes good old penetrative sex, and he keeps asking for other things. She might not want to say to him "listen husband, I know you think sex is this big emotional connectivity thing, but I just want you to take me to bone town."



There could be a whole Madonna/***** thing going on here. Or she could be depressed. Or have sexual trauma in her past. Or just LD. All kinds of things.



He, too, strikes me as remarkably passive in these conversations regarding sex. Could be wrong though.


I think that the OP is just working through the problem because he didnít exactly know what it is, all he knows is that he is feeling a disconnect and he doesnít know why. (This is the reason I come in these forums, to work through my problems with others input).

Yea maybe she just likes sex. No foreplay, no kissing, no touching. I admit that I wouldnít be able to connect emotionally to someone who just likes penetration.
I agree I think that she could be depressed or have super low confidence. Maybe the OP is too critical of her. Who knows. All I know is that I feel super empowered and confident when I can rock my significant others world. It makes me WANT to rock his world. But if itís not good enough or met with criticism that will shut me down real fast and give up putting myself out there.

I think there are so many reasons for why she is this way. For starters we need to know if she was always like this or if this is semi new.
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post #72 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 11:26 AM
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Re: Just some thoughts

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She cares about things and puts effort into them.


What does she put effort into?
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post #73 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 11:31 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Just some thoughts

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Originally Posted by In Absentia View Post
I think it's more that she doesn't have a solution and she is frustrated too... she can't please you and, yes, probably fearing the consequences because you won't like truth: that she can't do anything about it. This what my wife told me after i gave her an ultimatum and we were in a very similar situation. At the end, she faked it. Is this what you want?
There is good possibility I have been living it for the last 8 years.

I like truth, there is no truth that she can tell me that I will not like. This: "you won't like truth" is not a possibility. She may not like the truth. If so that is her issue.
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post #74 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 11:35 AM
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Re: Just some thoughts

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There is good possibility I have been living it for the last 8 years.

I like truth, there is no truth that she can tell me that I will not like. This: "you won't like truth" is not a possibility. She may not like the truth. If so that is her issue.
She may not even be able to admit it to herself, nonetheless you.
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post #75 of 94 (permalink) Old 01-16-2020, 11:41 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Just some thoughts

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Could be.

You know what also fits the data provided? She just likes good old penetrative sex, and he keeps asking for other things. She might not want to say to him "listen husband, I know you think sex is this big emotional connectivity thing, but I just want you to take me to bone town."

There could be a whole Madonna/***** thing going on here. Or she could be depressed. Or have sexual trauma in her past. Or just LD. All kinds of things.

He, too, strikes me as remarkably passive in these conversations regarding sex. Could be wrong though.
You are correct the data does make this a possibility. She has said (in the last 2 days) that she is not OK, with me screwing her and having no connection to her.

I can be passive and I can be aggressive and get things done. I try and do what the situation calls for. Right now I am feeling things out and gathering information.

@aaarghdub, your post was mostly off base, but you did share some very good insights.
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